From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Jul 6 06:09:18 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA21931 for isp-outgoing; Sun, 6 Jul 1997 06:09:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jcrnet.1eagle1.com ([207.123.60.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id GAA21926 for ; Sun, 6 Jul 1997 06:09:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [207.123.60.43] by jcrnet.1eagle1.com (SMTPD32-3.04) id A96A74700B2; Sun, 06 Jul 1997 07:11:06 -0600 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970706121214.0084d4b8@207.123.60.178> X-Sender: rosteen@207.123.60.178 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 06 Jul 1997 06:12:14 -0600 To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org From: Rick Osteen Subject: Nameserver Error Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk # nslookup *** Can't find server name for address 209.12.189.2: Server failed *** Default servers are not available I have enabled the name server and it worked well until I changed networks. What can I do to fix the name server? Thanks for the help everyone has given me so far! Rick Osteen Newbie on the Loose From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Jul 6 15:53:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA09807 for isp-outgoing; Sun, 6 Jul 1997 15:53:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.8.15.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA09801 for ; Sun, 6 Jul 1997 15:53:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA19467; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 08:53:02 +1000 (EST) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 1997 08:53:01 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: Rick Osteen cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Nameserver Error In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19970706121214.0084d4b8@207.123.60.178> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Flush your routing tables route -n flush Reinstall the correct routes (see /etc/rc.conf) I really think you should by a book on TCP/IP Network administration. Cheers /* Daniel O'Callaghan */ /* HiLink Internet danny@hilink.com.au */ /* FreeBSD - works hard, plays hard... danny@freebsd.org */ On Sun, 6 Jul 1997, Rick Osteen wrote: > # nslookup > *** Can't find server name for address 209.12.189.2: Server failed > *** Default servers are not available > > I have enabled the name server and it worked well until I changed networks. > What can I do to fix the name server? > > Thanks for the help everyone has given me so far! > > Rick Osteen > Newbie on the Loose > > > From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Jul 6 19:24:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA18648 for isp-outgoing; Sun, 6 Jul 1997 19:24:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.8.15.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA18638 for ; Sun, 6 Jul 1997 19:24:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA20300; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 12:24:35 +1000 (EST) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 1997 12:24:34 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: news server behaviour Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I've just put together a news server. It is no mean beast of a machine. It is a Pentium 100, 32 MB RAM, wd0 is 540 MB IDE, sd0 is Quantum 730MB, sd1 is Quantum 1 GB. aha0 is 1542cf. sd0 and sd1 are ccd0 (/var/news) with interleave of 65536. News is coming in via a ppp link on a directly attached modem, at about 3-4kbps. It has been running for 15 hours and there is now 265 MB news on /var/news. There is no-one at all reading news. That all sounds reasonable, but I'm not so sure about the stats from top and systat -vmstat. Top shows innd (1.5.1) at 60-70% CPU (39% user, 50% system). Systat shows similar figures. I'm running kernel pppd with compression, and there seem to be about 4000 sio0 interrupts per systat refresh, but it shows 4% CPU for interrupt servicing. /var/news is mounted noatime. innd has 2 MB resident size. Is the CPU utilisation normal for situation? In a previous incarnation the box was a Linux machine doing the same job under a different admin, and CPU for innd was more like 5-20% with no readers. /* Daniel O'Callaghan */ /* HiLink Internet danny@hilink.com.au */ /* FreeBSD - works hard, plays hard... danny@freebsd.org */ From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Jul 6 21:19:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA22540 for isp-outgoing; Sun, 6 Jul 1997 21:19:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from packfish.gateway.net.hk (john@packfish.gateway.net.hk [202.76.19.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA22532 for ; Sun, 6 Jul 1997 21:19:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from john@localhost) by packfish.gateway.net.hk (8.8.3/8.7.3) id MAA13220; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 12:34:21 +0800 (HKT) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 1997 12:34:18 +0800 (HKT) From: John Beukema To: Bernard Courtney cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Apache And Virtual Hosting In-Reply-To: <33B874B7.45AF@bythehand.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk You probably have a syntax error in the httpd.conf file and apache cannot parse it so it exits. Check whether apache is running. then check the errorlogs. jbeukema On Mon, 30 Jun 1997, Bernard Courtney wrote: > Hi All, > > I am running FreeBSD 2.2.1 and attempting to set up a virtual domain in > Apache. I have already set up the domain in DNS, ifconfig'd the IP > address, and added the to the httpd.conf file. However > once I added the the Apache server stops serving web > pages, including the main domain's pages. I do not know what else to do > at this point...Please Help! > > Thanks In Advance, > Bernard Courtney > -- > Bernard J. Courtney > bc@bythehand.com > Internet Creations By The Hand > Phone: (800) 757-1903 > Fax: (201) 946-0034 > WWW: http://www.bythehand.net > From owner-freebsd-isp Mon Jul 7 08:37:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA19362 for isp-outgoing; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 08:37:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aries.bb.cc.wa.us (root@[208.8.136.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA19357 for ; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 08:37:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (chris@localhost) by aries.bb.cc.wa.us (8.8.5/8.6.9) with SMTP id IAA08737; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 08:38:03 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 1997 08:38:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Chris Coleman To: Rick Osteen cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Nameserver Error In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19970706121214.0084d4b8@207.123.60.178> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk The nameserver you specified is not in your reverse lookup tables. When you try to run 'nslookup' it tries to lookup the name for the address that you specified in /etc/resolv.conf If that name does not have a resolvable DNS entry, it will die with the error you described. Usually, it happens when your parent DNS doesn't have you as an entry in their DNS table. Check your site to make sure you have all the correct entries and reverse lookup entries, then check your parent DNS site and see if they entered you correctly. Christopher J. Coleman (chris@aries.bb.cc.wa.us) Computer Support Technician I (509)-766-8873 Big Bend Community College Internet Instructor FreeBSD Book Project: http://vinyl.quickweb.com/~chrisc/book.html Disclaimer: Even Though it has My Name on it, Doesn't mean I said it. On Sun, 6 Jul 1997, Rick Osteen wrote: > # nslookup > *** Can't find server name for address 209.12.189.2: Server failed > *** Default servers are not available > > I have enabled the name server and it worked well until I changed networks. > What can I do to fix the name server? > > Thanks for the help everyone has given me so far! > > Rick Osteen > Newbie on the Loose > > > From owner-freebsd-isp Mon Jul 7 09:18:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA21211 for isp-outgoing; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 09:18:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from yacko.netgazer.net (yacko.netgazer.net [208.12.177.63]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA21197 for ; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 09:18:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [208.12.177.224] (furball.netgazer.com [208.12.177.224]) by yacko.netgazer.net (8.8.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA29410 for ; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 11:23:36 GMT Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 7 Jul 1997 11:16:00 -0500 To: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Darrin R. Woods" Subject: Needed: dialup in Atlanta Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I will be in Atlanta for a seminar on Sunday 13 July thru Wednesday 16 July and would like to know if there is any isp in Atlanta that could provide me with a dialup connection so I can get my email while I'm there. I don't need anything fancy, just a dialup connection so that I can logon 2 maybe 3 times a day for email on my system only. I'll reciprocate and give you access here in Dallas if you ever need it. Thanks, Darrin R. Woods | "I'm so happy that I, can't stop crying." Director Operations | --- Sting Netgazer Solutions, Inc. | Dallas, Texas 972.702.9119 | work: http://www.netgazer.net My employer most whole-heartedly denies everything I say From owner-freebsd-isp Mon Jul 7 09:31:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA21692 for isp-outgoing; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 09:31:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dream.future.net (root@future.net [204.130.134.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA21680 for ; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 09:31:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dream.future.net (tomthai@future.net [204.130.134.1]) by dream.future.net (8.8.5-r-beta/8.6.10) with SMTP id LAA00179; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 11:30:52 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 1997 11:30:51 -0500 (CDT) From: "Tom T. Thai" To: listuser cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: nntp In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 5 Jul 1997, listuser wrote: > Tom, > If you would please telnet to news.journey.net on the nntp port and see > if you can run the help command... sure.. I had to disable news exchange with journey 'cause it was backed so much.. til we figure this out. > > > --Matt > > > .............. .................................... Thomas T. Thai Infomedia Interactive Communications tom@iic.net TEL 612.376.9090 * FAX 612.376.9087 From owner-freebsd-isp Mon Jul 7 16:31:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA15509 for isp-outgoing; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 16:31:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cactus.fi.uba.ar (cactus.fi.uba.ar [157.92.49.108]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA15502 for ; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 16:31:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from hpagola@localhost) by cactus.fi.uba.ar (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA10253; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 17:30:38 -0300 (ART) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 1997 17:30:38 -0300 (ART) From: Hugo Pagola To: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Wireless Services In-Reply-To: <199706251622.JAA06049@GndRsh.aac.dev.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 25 Jun 1997, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > ... > > > I was given a brochure about BreezeCom products, which *do* do frequency > > > hopping SS. . > > > 2195 Faraday Ave, Suite A > > > Carlsbad, CA 92008 > > > 1-619 431 9880 > > > > Don't have it onhand right now (I just remmember it being up there). > > > > The Breezecom stuff is nice because it > > does multi-rate (it goes to lower throughput if it can't make it at 3 > > Mbps). However, compared to the Freewave radios they are pretty deaf (fine > > for indoor use, but bad for long outdoor links). > > We are currently testing Breezecom's ``stuff'' over the same 12 mile > leg in my original message, currently waiting on the attenna climber > to crawl up the mast and deploy the 2.4GHz yagi. A quick little > test says we could here the transmitter okay. > I've an offer for solitek wireless cards that claim to be wavelan compatible. anybody test this card?. The Breezecom stuff is configured with the some driver than wavelan? Hugo Pagola hpagola@cactus.fi.uba.ar From owner-freebsd-isp Mon Jul 7 17:56:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA19125 for isp-outgoing; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 17:56:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.8.15.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA19119 for ; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 17:56:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA25655; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 10:55:59 +1000 (EST) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 1997 10:55:58 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: Hugo Pagola cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Wireless Services In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 7 Jul 1997, Hugo Pagola wrote: > > > The Breezecom stuff is nice because it > > > does multi-rate (it goes to lower throughput if it can't make it at 3 > > > Mbps). However, compared to the Freewave radios they are pretty deaf (fine > > > for indoor use, but bad for long outdoor links). > > > > We are currently testing Breezecom's ``stuff'' over the same 12 mile > > leg in my original message, currently waiting on the attenna climber > > to crawl up the mast and deploy the 2.4GHz yagi. A quick little > > test says we could here the transmitter okay. > > > > I've an offer for solitek wireless cards that claim to be wavelan > compatible. > anybody test this card?. > The Breezecom stuff is configured with the some driver than wavelan? Breezecom make standalone ethernet/radio adaptors. A station adaptor plugs into the ethernet on the FreeBSD box. Downside of breezecom is that two station adaptors can't talk to each other without going through a hub. Danny From owner-freebsd-isp Mon Jul 7 18:15:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA19705 for isp-outgoing; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 18:15:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from veda.is (veda.is [193.4.230.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA19698 for ; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 18:15:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ubiq.veda.is (ubiq.veda.is [193.4.230.60]) by veda.is (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA21107 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 01:15:42 GMT From: Adam David Received: (from adam@localhost) by ubiq.veda.is (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA03952 for freebsd-isp@freebsd.org; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 01:15:41 GMT Message-Id: <199707080115.BAA03952@ubiq.veda.is> Subject: per-user IP accounting To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 8 Jul 1997 01:15:41 +0000 (GMT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk What are people using to log IP traffic on a per-user basis? -- Adam David From owner-freebsd-isp Mon Jul 7 20:16:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA24142 for isp-outgoing; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 20:16:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.8.15.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA24133 for ; Mon, 7 Jul 1997 20:16:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA26395; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 13:16:29 +1000 (EST) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 1997 13:16:27 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: Adam David cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: per-user IP accounting In-Reply-To: <199707080115.BAA03952@ubiq.veda.is> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 8 Jul 1997, Adam David wrote: > What are people using to log IP traffic on a per-user basis? I'm not, but if I were, I would add ipfw rules using ip-up in pppd, and do the accounting in ip-down. I use ipfw for network IP accounting. Define a particular rule number for a given accounting entity. I have also written a program which does accounting based on IP addresses, by listening to bpf like tcpdump. It does not require the prior definition of the IP addresses to be watched, the way ipfw does. Danny From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 04:56:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id EAA13359 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 04:56:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rhiannon.clari.net.au (dns1.clari.net.au [203.27.85.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA13347 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 04:56:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by rhiannon.clari.net.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA11497; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 21:56:19 +1000 (EST) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 1997 21:56:19 +1000 (EST) From: Peter Hawkins Message-Id: <199707081156.VAA11497@rhiannon.clari.net.au> To: adam@veda.is, danny@panda.hilink.com.au Subject: Re: per-user IP accounting Cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk If you don't use ipfw, netstat -nr will tell you the traffic and you could invoke it from ip-down Peter From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 07:55:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA21026 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 07:55:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from GndRsh.aac.dev.com (GndRsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA21021 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 07:55:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by GndRsh.aac.dev.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) id HAA19605; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 07:55:16 -0700 (PDT) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199707081455.HAA19605@GndRsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: per-user IP accounting In-Reply-To: <199707080115.BAA03952@ubiq.veda.is> from Adam David at "Jul 8, 97 01:15:41 am" To: adam@veda.is (Adam David) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 1997 07:55:16 -0700 (PDT) Cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL25 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > What are people using to log IP traffic on a per-user basis? And to add to that, does anyone even have a decent IP traffic logger per _interface_, if not I'd better get to work cleaning up my kludge... -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation, Inc. Reliable computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 13:01:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA04957 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 13:01:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from server1.bisnet.net (bridge.bisnet.net [206.54.226.53]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA04944 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 13:01:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danf@localhost) by server1.bisnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.9) id PAA06632; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:05:33 -0500 Date: Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:05:33 -0500 (CDT) From: "Daniel C. Fifield" To: isp@freebsd.org Subject: PPPD Hanging on reconnect Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have been running Freebsd 2.1.5for a couple of years and upgraded to a 56KB line about a year ago. I just recently started to experience a hanging problem. Actually, it was happening on a much less frequent bases, until recently. Anyway about every other time I do a scheduled reboot the pppd process hangs when attempting to connect to the ISP. I simply hit cntrl-C and try it again and it works. Configuration: FreeBSD 2.1.0 connect through a standard asyncronous serial port to a DSU/CSU to the ISP's Cicso router. The line is a 56KB asyncronous line. Any help would be helpful. Sincerely, Dan From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 13:05:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA05159 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 13:05:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from server1.bisnet.net (bridge.bisnet.net [206.54.226.53]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA05121 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 13:04:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danf@localhost) by server1.bisnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.9) id PAA06705; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:08:49 -0500 Date: Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:08:49 -0500 (CDT) From: "Daniel C. Fifield" To: isp@freebsd.org Subject: T1 upgrade options? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I run an ISP in Wisconsin and we are planning an upgrade from a 56KB line to a T1 line. My ISP recommends using a CISCO router. I am looking for alternatives and experience using the CICSO router. Sincerely, Dan From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 13:48:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA07745 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 13:48:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from linus.intrastar.net (root@linus.intrastar.net [206.136.25.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA07740 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 13:48:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jake.fuck.org (pmnac1-2.inu.net [208.129.167.4]) by linus.intrastar.net (8.8.5/TerraNovaNet) with ESMTP id PAA02235; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:45:35 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <33C2A800.A7DCB0ED@linus.intrastar.net> Date: Tue, 08 Jul 1997 15:50:09 -0500 From: Jacob Suter X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Daniel C. Fifield" CC: isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Daniel C. Fifield wrote: > I run an ISP in Wisconsin and we are planning an upgrade from a 56KB > line > to a T1 line. My ISP recommends using a CISCO router. I am looking > for > alternatives and experience using the CICSO router. Ciscos are expensive and in my opinion VERY overpriced and underpowered. Unless you need the extended protocols I'd recomend the Livingston IRX routers or even the Livingston OR-HS (high speed office router). We use the OR-HS on our 56K and hear they work great on T1s too. There is always the option of a router card such as the Emerging technologies 5025 series cards. VERY fast, cheap, and work well in FreeBSD systems. Check their page out at www.etinc.com. Good luck, we're fixing to do the T1 changeover ourselves and I'm looking forward to it... Its always fun to watch the telco run around like insects... JS From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 13:52:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA08036 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 13:52:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vdp01.vailsystems.com (root@vdp01.vailsystems.com [207.152.98.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA08023 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 13:52:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from crocodile.vale.com (crocodile [192.168.128.47]) by vdp01.vailsystems.com (8.8.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA13335 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:52:19 -0500 (CDT) Received: from slave1.vale.com (slave1.vale.com [192.168.129.10]) by crocodile.vale.com (8.8.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA19961 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:52:18 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <33C2A88A.8B7A230A@vailsys.com> Date: Tue, 08 Jul 1997 15:52:26 -0500 From: Dan Riley Organization: Vail Systems, Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.0b5C (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.2-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "isp@FreeBSD.ORG" Subject: Fax and Alpha paging solutions X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Are any isp's using alpha pagers for notification of system outages or in conjunction with network monitoring utilities? If so what paging software is working for you on FreeBSD systems? Is Hylafax a suitable solution for incoming and outgoing fax pools? Which multi port serial card and modems would be a good choice? Thanks for the information. Regards, Dan Riley From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 14:46:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA10547 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 14:46:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.webspan.net (root@mail.webspan.net [206.154.70.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA10531 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 14:46:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.5]) by mail.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id RAA03805; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 17:45:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id RAA07320; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 17:45:43 -0400 (EDT) To: Dan Riley cc: "isp@FreeBSD.ORG" From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: Fax and Alpha paging solutions In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 08 Jul 1997 15:52:26 CDT." <33C2A88A.8B7A230A@vailsys.com> Date: Tue, 08 Jul 1997 17:45:43 -0400 Message-ID: <7318.868398343@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Dan Riley wrote in message ID <33C2A88A.8B7A230A@vailsys.com>: > Are any isp's using alpha pagers for notification of system outages > or in conjunction with network monitoring utilities? If so what paging > software is working for you on FreeBSD systems? We use tpage here. Thats just because it happened to fit a lot better on our small pager gateway than hylafax. It has the odd problem, but it works well enough to have gotten me out of bed at 5:30 this morning to fix a dead news server. Together with Big Brother (from ports) it makes a pretty decent, if basic, network monitor. It can't monitor the news server very well (apart from checking its reachable ... it can check for acceps on port 119, but that has a problem during renumbers, for example). Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 15:18:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA12385 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:18:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.8.15.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA12380 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:18:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA01194; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 08:18:16 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 08:18:15 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: Peter Hawkins cc: adam@veda.is, freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: per-user IP accounting In-Reply-To: <199707081156.VAA11497@rhiannon.clari.net.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 8 Jul 1997, Peter Hawkins wrote: > If you don't use ipfw, netstat -nr will tell you the traffic and you could > invoke it from ip-down netstat -nr only tells you the packets. You would want to use 'netstat -abin' to list all interfaces numerically with bytes. Danny From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 15:29:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA12972 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:29:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Wicked.eaznet.com ([206.62.254.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA12962 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:29:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from eddie@localhost) by Wicked.eaznet.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA02390 for freebsd-isp@freebsd.org; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:30:50 -0700 (MST) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:30:50 -0700 (MST) From: Eddie Fry Message-Id: <199707082230.PAA02390@Wicked.eaznet.com> To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: popper err Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hey, I have Popper v2.2 running on FreeBSD 2.1.5. I keep getting the error "-ERR Unknown command: "auth"." I can't figure out what this means. Any ideas? Thanks, Eddie From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 15:42:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA13711 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:42:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from weblock.tm.net.my (weblock.tm.net.my [202.188.0.180]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA13706 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:42:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lovebox ([202.184.153.17]) by weblock.tm.net.my (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 581-39802U50000L50000S0) with SMTP id AAA21241; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 06:42:54 +0800 Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970709063308.0097e850@mail.tm.net.my> X-Sender: sweeting@mail.tm.net.my X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) To: Eddie Fry , freebsd-isp@freebsd.org From: chas Subject: Re: popper err Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 06:42:54 +0800 Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It seems to be one of those pretty harmless console messages (another common one being "ERR POP EOF received"). I've got accustomed to it and figure it's another of those email clients using non-standard protocols. Thanks to those in the past who allayed my own fears with these console messages, chas ps. Does "unable to get canonical name of client" fall into the same 'messes up the console but otherwise harmless' genre ? >Hey, >I have Popper v2.2 running on FreeBSD 2.1.5. I keep getting the error "-ERR Unknown command: "auth"." I can't figure out what this means. Any ideas? > >Thanks, > >Eddie > From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 15:47:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA13883 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:47:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.8.15.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA13878 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:47:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA01294; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 08:45:52 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 08:45:51 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: Eddie Fry cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: popper err In-Reply-To: <199707082230.PAA02390@Wicked.eaznet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 8 Jul 1997, Eddie Fry wrote: > I have Popper v2.2 running on FreeBSD 2.1.5. I keep getting the error "-ERR Unknown command: "auth"." I can't figure out what this means. Any ideas? "auth" is an APOP command. Tell your user not to use APOP, or rebuild popper with APOP enabled. Danny From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 15:51:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA14085 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:51:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from apollo.netsonic.com (netsonic.com [207.250.84.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA14079 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 15:51:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from adam.netsonic.com (zeus.netsonic.com [207.250.84.25]) by apollo.netsonic.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA03713 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 17:49:45 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970708175611.00e9bfbc@mail.netsonic.com> X-Sender: adam@mail.netsonic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 1997 17:56:13 -0500 To: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG From: NetSonic Subject: Re: per-user IP accounting Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk If I run netstat -abin, I get a list of all ip's but they are all the same, what needs to happen to breask that down for each particular ip? Sample output: bash# netstat -abin Name Mtu Network Address Ipkts Ierrs Ibytes Opkts Oerrs Obytes Coll ed0 1500 00.40.05.1f.95.fb 98874 0 15603056 101223 0 41452333 427 1:0:5e:0:0:1 ed0 1500 207.250.84 207.250.84.2 98874 0 15603056 101223 0 41452333 427 224.0.0.1 ed0 1500 207.250.84.44 207.250.84.44 98874 0 15603056 101223 0 41452333 427 ed0 1500 207.250.84.45 207.250.84.45 98874 0 15603056 101223 0 41452333 427 ed0 1500 207.250.84.51 207.250.84.51 98874 0 15603056 101223 0 41452333 427 ed0 1500 207.250.84.53 207.250.84.53 98874 0 15603056 101223 0 41452333 427 ed0 1500 207.250.84.54 207.250.84.54 98874 0 15603056 101223 0 41452333 427 ed0 1500 207.250.84.55 207.250.84.55 98874 0 15603056 101223 0 41452333 427 ed0 1500 207.250.84.52 207.250.84.52 98874 0 15603056 101223 0 41452333 427 ed0 1500 207.250.84.56 207.250.84.56 98874 0 15603056 101223 0 41452333 427 ed0 1500 207.250.84.57 207.250.84.57 98874 0 15603056 101223 0 41452333 427 ed0 1500 207.250.84.58 207.250.84.58 98874 0 15603056 101223 0 41452333 427 Thanks, Adam At 08:18 AM 7/9/97 +1000, you wrote: > >On Tue, 8 Jul 1997, Peter Hawkins wrote: > >> If you don't use ipfw, netstat -nr will tell you the traffic and you could >> invoke it from ip-down > >netstat -nr only tells you the packets. You would want to use >'netstat -abin' to list all interfaces numerically with bytes. > >Danny > > From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 16:08:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA15023 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 16:08:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cactus.fi.uba.ar (cactus.fi.uba.ar [157.92.49.108]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA15006 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 16:08:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from hpagola@localhost) by cactus.fi.uba.ar (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA13437; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 17:07:10 -0300 (ART) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 1997 17:07:10 -0300 (ART) From: Hugo Pagola To: "Daniel O'Callaghan" cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Wireless Services In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 8 Jul 1997, Daniel O'Callaghan wrote: > > On Mon, 7 Jul 1997, Hugo Pagola wrote: > > > > > The Breezecom stuff is nice because it > > > > does multi-rate (it goes to lower throughput if it can't make it at 3 > > > > Mbps). However, compared to the Freewave radios they are pretty deaf (fine > > > > for indoor use, but bad for long outdoor links). > > > > > > We are currently testing Breezecom's ``stuff'' over the same 12 mile > > > leg in my original message, currently waiting on the attenna climber > > > to crawl up the mast and deploy the 2.4GHz yagi. A quick little > > > test says we could here the transmitter okay. > > > > > > > I've an offer for solitek wireless cards that claim to be wavelan > > compatible. > > anybody test this card?. > > The Breezecom stuff is configured with the some driver than wavelan? > > Breezecom make standalone ethernet/radio adaptors. A station adaptor > plugs into the ethernet on the FreeBSD box. Downside of breezecom is > that two station adaptors can't talk to each other without going through > a hub. > > Danny > Yes, but what driver do you use in the freebsd box for the breezecom cards? is the same than wavelan? thanks Hugo Pagola From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 16:18:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA15615 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 16:18:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.8.15.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA15609 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 16:18:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA01429; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 09:18:15 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 09:18:15 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: NetSonic cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: per-user IP accounting In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19970708175611.00e9bfbc@mail.netsonic.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 8 Jul 1997, NetSonic wrote: > If I run netstat -abin, I get a list of all ip's but they are all the same, > what needs to happen to breask that down for each particular ip? netstat -aibn shows you the stats for the *interface*, with a separate line for each IP address of the interface. If you have multiple IPs per interface, you need to use ipfw or something other than netstat. Danny > Sample output: > > bash# netstat -abin > Name Mtu Network Address Ipkts Ierrs Ibytes > Opkts Oerrs Obytes Coll > ed0 1500 00.40.05.1f.95.fb 98874 0 15603056 > 101223 0 41452333 427 > 1:0:5e:0:0:1 > ed0 1500 207.250.84 207.250.84.2 98874 0 15603056 > 101223 0 41452333 427 > 224.0.0.1 > ed0 1500 207.250.84.44 207.250.84.44 98874 0 15603056 > 101223 0 41452333 427 > ed0 1500 207.250.84.45 207.250.84.45 98874 0 15603056 > 101223 0 41452333 427 From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 16:28:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA15974 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 16:28:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.8.15.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA15968 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 16:27:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA01462; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 09:27:04 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 09:27:04 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: Hugo Pagola cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Wireless Services In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 8 Jul 1997, Hugo Pagola wrote: > On Tue, 8 Jul 1997, Daniel O'Callaghan wrote: Firstly, I reiterate. > > > The Breezecom stuff is configured with the some driver than wavelan? > > > > Breezecom make standalone ethernet/radio adaptors. A station adaptor > > plugs into the ethernet on the FreeBSD box. Downside of breezecom is > > that two station adaptors can't talk to each other without going through > > a hub. > > > > Danny > > > > Yes, but what driver do you use in the freebsd box for the breezecom cards? > is the same than wavelan? And now I say the same thing in different words. There is no breezecom "card". Think of it as a UTP-radio transceiver. You plug a UTP cable from the breezcom SA into the FreeBSD box's UTP ethernet. If you want the FreeBSD box to be a router, give it another ethernet card. There is no driver for the breezecom because it is just part of the ethernet, and you use a driver for the ethernet card. LAN-----FBSD-------SA ::::::::::: WH ------FBSD---LAN ----- is ethernet ::::: is radio SA is station adapter WH is wireless hub (also has UTP) You'll need to use a microsubnet (netmask 255.255.255.252) for the point-to-point link, or use a bigger subnet if there are more SA units talking to the WH. 1 WH can talk to many SA. From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 16:45:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA17153 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 16:45:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from uhf.wdc.net (uhf.wdc.net [198.147.74.44]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA17145 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 16:45:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (bad@localhost) by uhf.wdc.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA00972; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 19:46:12 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 1997 19:46:11 -0400 (EDT) From: Bernie Doehner X-Sender: bad@uhf.wdc.net To: Hugo Pagola cc: "Daniel O'Callaghan" , freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Wireless Services In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Yes, but what driver do you use in the freebsd box for the breezecom cards? > is the same than wavelan? > > thanks > > Hugo Pagola > No, it's not the same driver. Bernie From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 17:03:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA18004 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 17:03:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.webspan.net (root@mail.webspan.net [206.154.70.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA17992 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 17:03:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.5]) by mail.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id UAA23441; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 20:02:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id UAA21983; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 20:02:58 -0400 (EDT) To: Eddie Fry cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: popper err In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 08 Jul 1997 15:30:50 PDT." <199707082230.PAA02390@Wicked.eaznet.com> Date: Tue, 08 Jul 1997 20:02:58 -0400 Message-ID: <21981.868406578@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Eddie Fry wrote in message ID <199707082230.PAA02390@Wicked.eaznet.com>: > Hey, > I have Popper v2.2 running on FreeBSD 2.1.5. I keep getting the error "-ERR > Unknown command: "auth"." I can't figure out what this means. Any ideas? It's an optional part of the POP RFC from what I remember, that MS decided to use as the primary auth mechanism for their e-mail clients. Annoying? You bet. Its not fatal though. Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 17:08:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA18408 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 17:08:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.webspan.net (root@mail.webspan.net [206.154.70.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA18402 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 17:08:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.5]) by mail.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id UAA24354; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 20:08:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id UAA23609; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 20:08:35 -0400 (EDT) To: chas cc: Eddie Fry , freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: popper err In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 09 Jul 1997 06:42:54 +0800." <3.0.32.19970709063308.0097e850@mail.tm.net.my> Date: Tue, 08 Jul 1997 20:08:35 -0400 Message-ID: <23607.868406915@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk chas wrote in message ID <3.0.32.19970709063308.0097e850@mail.tm.net.my>: > It seems to be one of those pretty harmless console messages (another > common one being "ERR POP EOF received"). I've got accustomed to it > and figure it's another of those email clients using non-standard > protocols. I tracked that one down once. I *think* from memory some client sees there are no messages and just hangs up rather than exiting properly. What I find a LOT more annoying is that it seems Netscape 2/3 (4 too I think) can't pick up largish (>>100k or so) MIME style messages from our server ... the connection just times out eventually (I think ... never used it myself :) ), quite often frustrating the user with pop lock problems. The weird thing is it either only happens on dialup or it doesn't affect me when I try from my BSD box... Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 17:09:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA18532 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 17:09:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.webspan.net (root@mail.webspan.net [206.154.70.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA18522 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 17:09:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.5]) by mail.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id UAA24535; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 20:09:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id UAA23668; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 20:09:44 -0400 (EDT) To: "Daniel O'Callaghan" cc: Eddie Fry , freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: popper err In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 09 Jul 1997 08:45:51 +1000." Date: Tue, 08 Jul 1997 20:09:43 -0400 Message-ID: <23666.868406983@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk "Daniel O'Callaghan" wrote in message ID : > On Tue, 8 Jul 1997, Eddie Fry wrote: > > I have Popper v2.2 running on FreeBSD 2.1.5. I keep getting the error > "-ERR Unknown command: "auth"." I can't figure out what this means. Any > ideas? > "auth" is an APOP command. Tell your user not to use APOP, or rebuild > popper with APOP enabled. Or to stop using MSIE Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 21:09:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA25483 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 21:09:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.8.15.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA25478 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 21:08:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA02672; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:08:39 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:08:39 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: Robert Shady cc: support@netsonic.com, freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: per-user IP accounting In-Reply-To: <199707090334.XAA24690@server.id.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > If I run netstat -abin, I get a list of all ip's but they are all the same, > > > what needs to happen to breask that down for each particular ip? > > > > netstat -aibn shows you the stats for the *interface*, with a separate > > line for each IP address of the interface. If you have multiple IPs per > > interface, you need to use ipfw or something other than netstat. > > Not to mention, the bytes wrap at a certain point too... We've pushed True, and if you use netstat, you have to keep track of the previous value and adjust. If you use ipfw, you can simply say 'ipfw -z zero' immediately after you read the values each hour/day/week. Danny From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 21:43:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA27203 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 21:43:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from linkou.trace.com.tw (root@npis.com.tw [203.67.189.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA27194 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 21:43:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate (gate.trace.com.tw [203.67.189.10]) by linkou.trace.com.tw (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id MAA02349 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 12:43:50 +0800 Message-ID: <33C3F802.63F@trace.com.tw> Date: Wed, 09 Jul 1997 12:43:46 -0800 From: Ronald Wiplinger <"Ronald Wiplinger"@linkou.trace.com.tw> Reply-To: ronald@trace.com.tw Organization: Wang's Trace International X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (OS/2; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.org Subject: 100 MB ethernet cards Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Which 100 MB ethernet card is working under FreeBSD? Driver, experience, price compare please. From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Jul 8 23:07:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA29563 for isp-outgoing; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 23:07:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.hughes.net (mail.hughes.net [205.139.34.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA29558 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 23:07:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kevenp ([206.97.42.15]) by mail.hughes.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-13727) with SMTP id AAA4528 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 1997 23:03:25 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19970708225551.009b45c0@mail.hughes.net> X-Sender: kevenp@mail.hughes.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 1997 22:55:51 -0700 To: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG From: Kevin Peteron Subject: SCSI Card Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Anyone had an luck getting a Always IN-2000 SCSI card to work? From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 00:39:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA03229 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 00:39:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from noc.demon.net (firewall-user@server.noc.demon.net [193.195.224.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA03223; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 00:39:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: by noc.demon.net; id IAA02429; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 08:39:15 +0100 (BST) Received: from stress.noc.demon.net(195.11.55.5) by inside.noc.demon.net via smap (3.2) id xma002416; Wed, 9 Jul 97 08:39:03 +0100 Received: from hdm by stress.noc.demon.net with local (Exim 1.651 #1) id 0wlrL4-0005X2-00; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 08:39:02 +0100 To: Gary Palmer cc: Dan Riley , "isp@FreeBSD.ORG" Subject: Re: Fax and Alpha paging solutions X-Mailer: nmh v0.14, exmh 2.0gamma, gvim 4.5 X-Colour: Green In-reply-to: <7318.868398343@orion.webspan.net> Date: Wed, 09 Jul 1997 08:39:02 +0100 From: Dom Mitchell Message-Id: Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Gary Palmer wrote: > Dan Riley wrote in message ID > <33C2A88A.8B7A230A@vailsys.com>: > > Are any isp's using alpha pagers for notification of system outages > > or in conjunction with network monitoring utilities? If so what paging > > software is working for you on FreeBSD systems? > > We use tpage here. Thats just because it happened to fit a lot better > on our small pager gateway than hylafax. It has the odd problem, but > it works well enough to have gotten me out of bed at 5:30 this morning > to fix a dead news server. Together with Big Brother (from ports) it > makes a pretty decent, if basic, network monitor. It can't monitor the > news server very well (apart from checking its reachable ... it can > check for acceps on port 119, but that has a problem during renumbers, > for example). That reminds me, I must try and get nocol[1] working properly and bundled up as a port... Maybe after my break. -Dom [1] From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 06:03:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA13473 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 06:03:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA13468 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 06:03:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from buffnet11.buffnet.net (shovey@buffnet11.buffnet.net [205.246.19.55]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA17266; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 09:04:25 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 09:03:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Steve Hovey To: "Daniel C. Fifield" cc: isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 8 Jul 1997, Daniel C. Fifield wrote: > > I run an ISP in Wisconsin and we are planning an upgrade from a 56KB line > to a T1 line. My ISP recommends using a CISCO router. I am looking for > alternatives and experience using the CICSO router. I love my ciscos - its all I will use! Not too long ago, we had a cracker attack an older cisco, rendering it useless. Their tech support stayed on the phone and got me upgraded to a new operating system and crackerproofed in a very short time! From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 06:48:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA15133 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 06:48:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bagpuss.visint.co.uk (bagpuss.visint.co.uk [194.207.134.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA15128 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 06:48:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dylan.visint.co.uk (dylan.visint.co.uk [194.207.134.180]) by bagpuss.visint.co.uk (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA22414; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:46:18 +0100 (BST) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:46:18 +0100 (BST) From: Stephen Roome To: Steve Hovey cc: "Daniel C. Fifield" , isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 9 Jul 1997, Steve Hovey wrote: > On Tue, 8 Jul 1997, Daniel C. Fifield wrote: > > I run an ISP in Wisconsin and we are planning an upgrade from a 56KB line > > to a T1 line. My ISP recommends using a CISCO router. I am looking for > > alternatives and experience using the CICSO router. > > I love my ciscos - its all I will use! Not too long ago, we had a cracker > attack an older cisco, rendering it useless. Their tech support stayed on > the phone and got me upgraded to a new operating system and crackerproofed > in a very short time! CISCO's customer support might be great when one of their pieces of equipment begins to show it's age/vulnerability, I'm not sure however that it's the best advertising or reason to buy a Cisco. I still really don't understand why folks with only a T1 line insist on buying a separate router, we have E1 here and have a dual port serial card and a mux. It costs the same to add onto a pc as a Cisco, you still get tech support and the PC that runs it doesn't do anything else or fall over ever. Besides, why learn how to use a Cisco router, when you can have a *BSD box do it for you for the same price/cheaper, but with a lot less hassle if it goes wrong. Check out www.etinc.com and www.sdlcomm.com to name two. Anyway, Steve Roome - Vision Interactive Ltd. Tel:+44(0)117 9730597 Home:+44(0)976 241342 WWW: http://dylan.visint.co.uk/ From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 08:02:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA18483 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 08:02:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.denverweb.net (root@sdn-ts-001coauroP08.dialsprint.net [206.133.160.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA18476 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 08:02:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion (blaine@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.denverweb.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA00261 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 07:56:27 -0600 Message-ID: <33C3988A.1DAB8CA6@denverweb.net> Date: Wed, 09 Jul 1997 07:56:26 -0600 From: Blaine Minazzi Organization: What, me organized? X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (X11; I; Linux 2.0.27 i486) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Someone Opined: > Besides, why learn how to use a Cisco router, when you can have a *BSD box > do it for you for the same price/cheaper, but with a lot less hassle if it > goes wrong. If it is the same price, the decision could tip toword cicsco, with no moving parts. If you want a bit more flexability, check out etinc. Both have advantages, features, etc. What is right for you may be wrong for me, so aviod the dogmatic answers. That large ugly mass on our shoulders is not just a hat rack. Lookit all the possibilities, then plunk down the dineros, and enjoy. ( besides, learning to configure a cicso is itself a valuable commodity.) Blaine From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 08:04:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA18538 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 08:04:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Wicked.eaznet.com ([206.62.254.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA18533 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 08:04:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Eddie.eaznet.com ([206.62.254.175]) by Wicked.eaznet.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA04032 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 08:05:51 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <33C3A93E.4BB5@eaznet.com> Date: Wed, 09 Jul 1997 08:07:42 -0700 From: Eddie Fry Organization: Creative Solutions X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Wireless Services References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Sorry, I've kinda lost track of this thread. What is the application again? If you're looking to tie in a remote site over a long distance, you may want to check out Aironet also. We use their equipment and are VERY satisfied with it. One advantage over Breeze is that you can link at 2MB over 20 miles. http://www.aironet.com - this info is a little outdated but gives a good overview. Eddie From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 08:56:18 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA20932 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 08:56:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from virtualmarketing.com (email.virtualmarketing.com [207.7.29.253]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA20925 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 08:56:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ntserver2 (207.7.29.107) by virtualmarketing.com with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 1.2b2); Wed, 9 Jul 1997 10:56:58 -0600 Message-ID: <33C3B49D.E437E517@v-m.com> Date: Wed, 09 Jul 1997 10:56:14 -0500 From: Marcin Pasek Reply-To: m@v-m.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: FreeBSD Radius... X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I would like to run a RADIUS server on a FreeBSD. I installed the program on th ebox and I can't find any documentation on installing the server with a use of local FreeBSD's database. Please let me know where I can find such a documenation or any pointers how to do ths... Thanks Marcin From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 10:32:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA26416 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 10:32:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from DNS.Lamb.net (root@DNS.Lamb.net [207.90.181.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA26411 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 10:32:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Gatekeeper.Alameda.net (ulf@gatekeeper.Alameda.net [207.90.181.2]) by DNS.Lamb.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA04559; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 10:32:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ulf@localhost) by Gatekeeper.Alameda.net (8.8.5/8.7.6) id KAA12155; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 10:31:59 -0700 (PDT) From: Ulf Zimmermann Message-Id: <199707091731.KAA12155@Gatekeeper.Alameda.net> Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-Reply-To: from Stephen Roome at "Jul 9, 97 02:46:18 pm" To: steve@visint.co.uk (Stephen Roome) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 10:31:59 -0700 (PDT) Cc: shovey@buffnet.net, danf@JadeTech.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > On Wed, 9 Jul 1997, Steve Hovey wrote: > > > On Tue, 8 Jul 1997, Daniel C. Fifield wrote: > > > I run an ISP in Wisconsin and we are planning an upgrade from a 56KB line > > > to a T1 line. My ISP recommends using a CISCO router. I am looking for > > > alternatives and experience using the CICSO router. > > > > I love my ciscos - its all I will use! Not too long ago, we had a cracker > > attack an older cisco, rendering it useless. Their tech support stayed on > > the phone and got me upgraded to a new operating system and crackerproofed > > in a very short time! > > CISCO's customer support might be great when one of their pieces of > equipment begins to show it's age/vulnerability, I'm not sure however that > it's the best advertising or reason to buy a Cisco. > > I still really don't understand why folks with only a T1 line insist on > buying a separate router, we have E1 here and have a dual port serial card > and a mux. It costs the same to add onto a pc as a Cisco, you still get > tech support and the PC that runs it doesn't do anything else or fall over > ever. Why ? Because what ever system you run your T1 off, PC or SGI or whatever, if it is not a dedicated router, people tend to run other services off it. If you run other services off it, you tend to modify it (for example reboot). That brings down your whole T1 line. I thought long about it, as I started with just a Fractional T1 Frame Relay line for myself and decided at that point to go with a Cisco PC card. It is a complete router, it just takes power from the PC and a com port emulation for the console port. Even with this solution I power cycled the box it was in too often. If customer ask me today about a standalone router or a PC card, I often tell them to get a router like the Engage routers. a T1 with CSU version cost $995 for ISPs. It has no large option in routing protocols, but as an endpoint, they don't need much. The reason I tell them this, it is a standalone box. A black box in the corner. No one is going to touch it. > > Besides, why learn how to use a Cisco router, when you can have a *BSD box > do it for you for the same price/cheaper, but with a lot less hassle if it > goes wrong. > > Check out www.etinc.com and www.sdlcomm.com to name two. > > Anyway, > > Steve Roome - Vision Interactive Ltd. > Tel:+44(0)117 9730597 Home:+44(0)976 241342 > WWW: http://dylan.visint.co.uk/ > > Ulf. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ulf Zimmermann, 1525 Pacific Ave., Alameda, CA-94501, #: 510-769-2936 Alameda Networks, Inc. | http://www.Alameda.net | Fax#: 510-521-5073 From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 10:58:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA27841 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 10:58:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ns.systemresc.com (dave@[207.198.60.196]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA27830 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 10:58:36 -0700 (PDT) From: dave@ns.systemresc.com Received: from localhost (dave@localhost) by ns.systemresc.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA06420 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:00:00 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:00:00 -0400 (EDT) To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: DCD Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello I have been learning and running two freebsd boxes in Buffalo and Niagara Falls for dialup ppp access to the internet. I also use one BSDI box. The one in the falls is giving me alot more problem and mainly it is mgetty or the way I have it configured. The problem is if someone drops carrier. Mgetty resetts the modem but it doesn't kill the dialup scriptthat they used to log on with. I have not been able to setup pap so I use pppd in the script started by the user dialing into the system. Here are some of the files for my system I will show you a log file that I think that problem lies with DCD. The &C1 sets the modem to watch for carrier between the two modems and if dropped then mgetty resetts the modem and it does that but not the process it is running so no one else can log in on that modem and when it is the first one in the hunt group the system is virtual shutdown. The info file on mgetty said it could be the cables are too long or because we are using a flat cable. Is this why or possible, that the log shows the warning about DCD being low. The other files I'm including in this file are my ttys and my ppp.conf that I would like to get to work with pap. I tried using just getty but could not even get it to give me a login in prompt just garabage characters and I tried all sorts of things before going to mgetty. Please help me, with any infomation or where I could go for more help. David G. Hazelton dave@systemresc.com <<<>>>> 07/07 20:34:54 ac0 mgetty: official release 1.0.0 07/07 20:34:54 ac0 check for lockfiles 07/07 20:34:54 ac0 locking the line 07/07 20:34:58 ac0 send: ATS0=0Q0&C1&D3&K3[0d] 07/07 20:34:58 ac0 waiting for ``OK'' ** found ** 07/07 20:34:58 ac0 waiting... 07/07 21:34:58 ac0 checking if modem is still alive 07/07 21:34:58 ac0 mdm_send: 'AT' -> OK 07/07 21:34:59 ac0 waiting... 07/07 21:44:27 ac0 waiting for ``RING'' ** found ** 07/07 21:44:27 ac0 waiting for ``RING'' ** found ** 07/07 21:44:33 ac0 send: ATA[0d] 07/07 21:44:33 ac0 waiting for ``CONNECT'' ** found ** 07/07 21:44:44 ac0 send: 07/07 21:45:32 ac0 WARNING: starting login while DCD is low! 07/07 21:45:32 ##### data dev=cuac0, pid=566, caller=, conn='', name='', cmd='/usr/bin/login', user='jennie' <<<>>>> console none unknown off secure ttyv0 "/usr/libexec/getty Pc" cons25 on secure ttyv1 "/usr/libexec/getty Pc" cons25 on secure ttyv2 "/usr/libexec/getty Pc" cons25 off secure ttyv3 "/usr/libexec/getty Pc" cons25 off secure #ttyc0 "/usr/libexec/getty vr" dialup on insecure #ttyc1 "/usr/libexec/getty vq" dialup on insecure #ttyc1 "/usr/libexec/getty vr" dialup on insecure cuac0 "/usr/local/sbin/mgetty" unknown on insecure cuac1 "/usr/local/sbin/mgetty" unknown on insecure cuac2 "/usr/local/sbin/mgetty" unknown on insecure cuac3 "/usr/local/sbin/mgetty" unknown on insecure cuac4 "/usr/local/sbin/mgetty" unknown on insecure cuac5 "/usr/local/sbin/mgetty" unknown on insecure cuac6 "/usr/local/sbin/mgetty" unknown on insecure cuac7 "/usr/local/sbin/mgetty" unknown on insecure cuac8 "/usr/local/sbin/mgetty" unknown on insecure cuac9 "/usr/local/sbin/mgetty" unknown on insecure #ttyd1 "/usr/libexec/getty std:9600" unknown on insecure ttyp0 none network ttyp1 none network ttyp2 none network ttyp3 none network ttyp4 none network ttyp5 none network From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 11:40:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA00407 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 11:40:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA00397 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 11:40:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA27146; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 12:40:04 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 12:40:04 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199707091840.MAA27146@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Ulf Zimmermann Cc: steve@visint.co.uk (Stephen Roome), shovey@buffnet.net, danf@jadetech.com, isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-Reply-To: <199707091731.KAA12155@Gatekeeper.Alameda.net> References: <199707091731.KAA12155@Gatekeeper.Alameda.net> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I still really don't understand why folks with only a T1 line insist on > > buying a separate router... > > Why ? Because what ever system you run your T1 off, PC or SGI or whatever, > if it is not a dedicated router, people tend to run other services off it. > If you run other services off it, you tend to modify it (for example > reboot). That brings down your whole T1 line. And for many small sites, if you bring down the machine hosting critical services (DNS, email, POP services, firewall, etc....) it doesn't matter one hoot if the router is still running since the 'internet' is effectively dead anyway. A poor arguement IMHO. If you've got critical services, don't touch them unless you *HAVE* to, and treat it like dedicated equipment. For a small office (like mine), a dedicated PC works *much* better than a CISCO ever would, and total costs (including hardware, maintenance, etc..) are significantly lower. Nate From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 12:32:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA02954 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 12:32:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from relay.NL.net (relay.NL.net [193.78.240.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA02939 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 12:32:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jaknl by relay.NL.net (5.65b/NLnet-3.4) id AA22710; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 21:32:16 +0200 Received: from pp200-1 ([192.168.0.200]) by jak.nl (8.8.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id VAA00203 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 21:34:37 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <33C3E7CD.EDD524C9@jak.nl> Date: Wed, 09 Jul 1997 21:34:37 +0200 From: Jan A Knepper Reply-To: Jan@jak.nl X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (WinNT; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.org Subject: UUCP, dialup, 2 domains on 1 system. X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, We have a running an off-line e-mail server running FreeBSD. With intervals we dial to a provider to exchange e-mail with UUCP. Now we opened a second company with a different name we also registered a domain name for the second company with the same provider. We however want to use the same machine to handle both e-mail domains. Is there a clean way to make this work on FreeBSD? Where should we look for any examples? Thanks Jan From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 12:32:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA02968 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 12:32:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from relay.NL.net (relay.NL.net [193.78.240.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA02951 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 12:32:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jaknl by relay.NL.net (5.65b/NLnet-3.4) id AA22705; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 21:32:15 +0200 Received: from pp200-1 ([192.168.0.200]) by jak.nl (8.8.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id VAA00190 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 21:21:54 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <33C3E4D2.C3FCD086@jak.nl> Date: Wed, 09 Jul 1997 21:21:54 +0200 From: Jan A Knepper Reply-To: Jan@jak.nl X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (WinNT; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.org Subject: ISDN for Netherlands, Europe X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, Could anybody advice me on ISDN cards to use with FreeBSD. Location: Netherlands, Europe. Currently the off-line mail server has an Eicon DIVA Pro Adapter installed, but that one does not work with FreeBSD, so I am looking for something else/better. Jan From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 12:36:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA03296 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 12:36:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ganymede.bloomington.nsisw.com (xyplex1-1-18.kiva.net [206.97.75.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA03289 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 12:36:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ken by ganymede.bloomington.nsisw.com with local (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wm2XU-0001Ia-00; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:36:36 -0500 Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:36:36 -0500 (EST) From: Kenneth Chiu Reply-To: chiuk@cs.indiana.edu To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: FreeBSD as a router/firewall in this poorly-configured network Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I would like to use FreeBSD as a firewall between an "unsecure" physical network and a "secure" physical network. Unfortunately, there is no subnetting, and I can't change IP numbers for political reasons. Here is the configuration: | | T1 | | | ---------- | Cisco | | router | ---------- | 206.97.64.1 | | Hub ======================================= | 206.97.64.129 | 206.97.64.63 | 206.97.64.66 | | | | fxp0 | | ------------ web server mail server | FreeBSD | | firewall | ------------ | fxp1 | | 206.97.64.200 ===================== Internal network, all one physical net As I understand how routing works in FreeBSD, this configuration can work, because more specific routes are preferred. Will these commands create the correct routing table? route add default 206.97.64.1 -ifp fxp0 route add -interface 206.97.64.1 206.97.64.129 # route to router route add -interface 206.97.64.63 206.97.64.129 # route to web server route add -interface 206.97.64.66 206.97.64.129 # route to mail server route add -interface 206.97.64.0 206.97.64.200 # route to internal net Because both interfaces are on the same network, I assume I need to use -ifp or -interface, but I'm not sure I understand the distinction between the two. Hopefully, I will be able to configure the Cisco router to forward 206.97.64.0 packets to the firewall only if they are not to the web server or the mail server. If not, I was thinking that maybe having the firewall use Proxy ARP to fool the router into sending packets bound for the internal net to the firewall might work. From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 12:52:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA04248 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 12:52:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from federation.addy.com (federation.addy.com [207.239.68.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA04243 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 12:52:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (fbsdlist@localhost) by federation.addy.com (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id PAA02581; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 15:52:02 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 15:52:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Cliff Addy To: Nate Williams cc: isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-Reply-To: <199707091840.MAA27146@rocky.mt.sri.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 9 Jul 1997, Nate Williams wrote: > small office (like mine), a dedicated PC works *much* better than a > CISCO ever would, and total costs (including hardware, maintenance, > etc..) are significantly lower. I don't buy this at all. A Cisco 2501 is only ~$1700 and requires *zero* maintenance once it's set up. For a typical setup, that takes about 10 minutes. If you build a machine yourself, using reliable, quality parts, you're lucky if you save $500 under that. And then you're worrying about hard drive crashes, config changes, OS security holes, etc. From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 13:47:30 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA07557 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 13:47:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA07551 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 13:47:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA27935; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:47:09 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:47:09 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199707092047.OAA27935@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Cliff Addy Cc: Nate Williams , isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-Reply-To: References: <199707091840.MAA27146@rocky.mt.sri.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > small office (like mine), a dedicated PC works *much* better than a > > CISCO ever would, and total costs (including hardware, maintenance, > > etc..) are significantly lower. > > I don't buy this at all. A Cisco 2501 is only ~$1700 and requires *zero* > maintenance once it's set up. For a typical setup, that takes about 10 > minutes. If you build a machine yourself, using reliable, quality parts, > you're lucky if you save $500 under that. You've *got* to be kidding? I can get really nice 486/33 boxes (way overkill) with a 500MB IDE drive for < $500. > And then you're worrying about > hard drive crashes, config changes, OS security holes, etc. Cicso aren't immune to software problems either. And, read again what I said. W/out those 'critical' services, my CISCO router is useless, and those critical services aren't hostable on a router. I end up buying a CISCO router, plus a machine to do the services, so I still have all the same problems, and nothing to gain but a useless network connection if/when my services box goes down. My router box sees uptimes of 150+ regularly. It was taken down recently with 160 days to install a new multi-port serial card in it since the office is expanding and we needed more modem lines. Previous uptime was 145 days, and it was limited by a power outage. We put it on a UPS and it was up until the card install. Nate From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 14:32:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA13054 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:32:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.euronet.nl (mail.euronet.nl [194.134.0.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA13049 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:32:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from i029.asd.euronet.nl (i107.asd.euronet.nl [194.134.9.143]) by mail.euronet.nl (8.8.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA06190 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 23:32:09 +0200 (MET DST) Received: by i029.asd.euronet.nl with Microsoft Mail id <01BC8CC0.34719640@i029.asd.euronet.nl>; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 23:31:20 +0200 Message-ID: <01BC8CC0.34719640@i029.asd.euronet.nl> From: Rob van Oostveen To: "freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG" , "'Jan@jak.nl'" Subject: RE: ISDN for Netherlands, Europe Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 23:31:16 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Read : http://sunsite.unc.edu/LDP/HOWTO/mini/PPP-over-ISDN Maybe this could be of any use... I've also read something about Teles boards used on Linux boxes once.. Hi, Could anybody advice me on ISDN cards to use with FreeBSD. Location: Netherlands, Europe. Currently the off-line mail server has an Eicon DIVA Pro Adapter installed, but that one does not work with FreeBSD, so I am looking for something else/better. Jan From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 14:45:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA13718 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:45:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lincc.lincc.lib.or.us (lincc.lincc.lib.or.us [198.107.142.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA13712 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:45:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (george@localhost) by lincc.lincc.lib.or.us (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA02120 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:45:01 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:45:01 -0700 (PDT) From: George Yobst To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Help w/ natd 1.8 & ipfw Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi all, I didn't get a response on -questions, so maybe here (beg, beg)... I seem to be having problems setting up a simple firewall using natd 1.8 and ipfw. Would someone care to send me (or allow me to send them) their natd.conf, netstat -rn, ifconfig -a, and ipfw list output so I can try to determine what's wrong here. This is what I'm getting - doesn't look like it's translating the aliases. Thanks - George In [UDP] 192.168.111.23 -> 192.168.111.255 aliased to 192.168.111.23 -> 192.168.111.255 In [UDP] 192.168.111.23 -> 192.168.111.255 aliased to 192.168.111.23 -> 192.168.111.255 In [UDP] 192.168.111.23 -> 192.168.111.255 aliased to 192.168.111.23 -> 192.168.111.255 In [UDP] 192.168.111.23 -> 192.168.111.2 aliased to 192.168.111.23 -> 192.168.111.2 Out [UDP] 192.168.111.2 -> 192.168.111.23 aliased to 192.168.111.2 -> 192.168.111.23 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- George Yobst, System Manager email: george@lincc.lib.or.us LINCC phone: 503-655-8550 16239 SE McLoughlin Blvd, Suite 208 fax: 503-655-8555 Oak Grove, OR 97267-4654 webmaster: [www.]lincc.lib.or.us "...it is impossible for anyone to begin to learn what he thinks he already knows." - Epictetus From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 14:50:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA13941 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:50:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lightning.tbe.net (qmailr@lightning.tbe.net [208.208.122.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA13933 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 14:50:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 3725 invoked by uid 1010); 9 Jul 1997 21:44:28 -0000 Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 17:44:27 -0400 (EDT) From: "Gary D. Margiotta" To: Cliff Addy cc: Nate Williams , isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > small office (like mine), a dedicated PC works *much* better than a > > CISCO ever would, and total costs (including hardware, maintenance, > > etc..) are significantly lower. > > I don't buy this at all. A Cisco 2501 is only ~$1700 and requires *zero* > maintenance once it's set up. For a typical setup, that takes about 10 > minutes. If you build a machine yourself, using reliable, quality parts, > you're lucky if you save $500 under that. And then you're worrying about > hard drive crashes, config changes, OS security holes, etc. Had to put my $.02 in here... For the money we spent on our 2 Cisco's, we couldn't be happier...we paid under $1600 for each, and the investment is totally worth it. the only upgrades we have done to them was to put 4 Mb of RAM in each to enlarge the queues. We are also going to buy the Cisco AS5200 for our new dialin pools because we have had superb reliability and we already know the IOS pretty well. In Nate's position where he is in a small office and doesn't need the added functions of the Cisco, it is a great idea for hime to build his own. As was also stated in a previous e-mail, having a standalone router means that you put it in the rack, plug the cables in, and leave it there. (we've configured our own routers, and it really isn't too hard esp. if you RTFM). We were originally going to make our own router box with FreeBSD, but as someone also stated, when you do that, you also run other things on it, plus you have to worry about hard drive crashes, the higher likelihood of a processor or memory failure (not that there isn't a chance with the standalones, but it is IMHO more of a chance when building one out of a PC), and a ton of other things that are less likely to happen with a specialized box. Plus, our routers have been up for months without rebooting...the PC Router won't stay up that long without something having to be done on it (my opinion, please don't kill me for it...;) ) I'm not saying 'go out and buy the Cisco or be damned!', but I'm just saying that we haven't had to worry as much as I think we would've if we had built our own router. If you are a small office or you don't have a demanding need, then make your own. I ordered a Cyclades card (Nate should know about this one ;) ) and had a helluva time trying to configure it correctly (we also have a PM2, but we wanted to try a different way to establish a second POP). I went back to the PM2, and plugged the modems in and after 1 initstring, off they went. Specialized boxes are made for just that, convenience...although a lot of people have toruble with them and swear by building their own...hey...whatever you think will give you less hassle. If you decide to go with the Cisco and need help configuring it, lemme know. Lord knows we have had a bit of experience with ours. -Gary Margiotta TBE Internet Services http://www.tbe.net P.S. - How's the Cyclades doing Nate? ;) From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 15:01:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA14857 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 15:01:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail1.sirius.com (mail1.sirius.com [205.134.253.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA14847 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 15:01:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ds9.sirius.com (ds9.sirius.com [205.134.226.34]) by mail1.sirius.com (8.8.6/Sirius-8.8.6-97.06.26) with ESMTP id PAA09019 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 15:01:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (dlowe@localhost) by ds9.sirius.com (8.6.12/961127) with SMTP id PAA16151 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 15:01:40 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: ds9.sirius.com: dlowe owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 15:01:39 -0700 (PDT) From: David Lowe X-Sender: dlowe@ds9 Reply-To: David Lowe To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: INN on an async-mounted spool? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk People - Has anyone here tried INN on an async-mounted spool in production? Our news server (FreeBSD 2.2.2, INN 1.5.1) is running consistently a few hours behind with a synchronous spool, and we've tried it with async mounts & had it run *much* faster - able to pull in ~520 articles per minute from our single feed (a Diablo machine) (as opposed to ~380, which is not quite enough these days to ensure keeping up with a full feed.) We're not too concerned about data loss on the spool in the event of a failure - but we *are* concerned about the async option actually *causing* crashes. While we were running async, we had two mysterious crashes (which of course led to some data loss & required human intervention for fsck'ing). Since we've gone synchronous, we've not had these mystery crashes (knock wood) but we've also not been able to keep up as nicely as we'd like to. Has anyone had success with an async-mounted spool in the long term? Pros? Cons? Thanks, David Lowe From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 15:03:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA14931 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 15:03:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA14920 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 15:03:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA28649; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 16:03:02 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 16:03:02 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199707092203.QAA28649@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: "Gary D. Margiotta" Cc: Cliff Addy , Nate Williams , isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > In Nate's position where he is in a small office and doesn't need the > added functions of the Cisco, it is a great idea for hime to build his > own. Right. What I have isn't for everyone, but for small offices/ISP's who don't have a lot of $$ to throw at dedicated hardware, the PC is a great solution. (Especially when 'routing packets' isn't enough to have a working network. > specialized box. Plus, our routers have been up for months without > rebooting...the PC Router won't stay up that long without something having > to be done on it (my opinion, please don't kill me for it...;) ) 1:37PM up 168 days, 2:07, 7 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.01, 0.09 That was right after we installed a UPS after a storm knocked it out. If it wasn't for the power outage it'd been up for almost a year. > P.S. - How's the Cyclades doing Nate? ;) Working like a charm. The new guy likes his dedicated Internet connection. :) Nate From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 16:01:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA17897 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 16:01:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA17892 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 16:01:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA02739; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 16:00:28 -0700 (PDT) To: "Gary D. Margiotta" cc: Cliff Addy , Nate Williams , isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 09 Jul 1997 17:44:27 EDT." Date: Wed, 09 Jul 1997 16:00:28 -0700 Message-ID: <2735.868489228@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have to agree that Ciscos are worth the money, if only for all the little "creature comfort" features in installation and setup you get which are far more engineer-friendly than anything I've seen with Livingston. I worked exclusively with cisco equipment for some time before finally doing some work for an ISP with a Portmaster PM2r box - the difference was like night and day and, frankly, the Portmaster's admin interface is so funky that it made me less chagrined at the state of our own installation tools. If a commercial outfit can get away with that, it leaves hope that our own tools won't be judged too harshly. :-) To use a car analogy, Cisco basically produces the Cadillacs of the router world whereas Livingston makes Yugos and Ascend makes VWs. :-) Not everyone needs, wants or can afford a Cadillac, but many of those features are nice to have if you're going to drive a car at all. Similarly, the "VW" is cheap but of reasonably good quality and the Yugo, well, you buy one of those when cost is the #1 consideration and you are resigned to the fact that it'll be no fun to drive and also perhaps spend some amount of time by the side of the road, waiting for the tow-truck. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 16:23:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA18988 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 16:23:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agora.rdrop.com (root@agora.rdrop.com [199.2.210.241]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA18975 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 16:23:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from batie@localhost) by agora.rdrop.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA09249; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 16:23:08 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970709162307.38925@rdrop.com> Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 16:23:07 -0700 From: Alan Batie To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: INN on an async-mounted spool? References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-md5; boundary=yciRD1jyfeSSjG0j X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76 In-Reply-To: ; from David Lowe on Wed, Jul 09, 1997 at 03:01:39PM -0700 Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk --yciRD1jyfeSSjG0j Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii On Wed, Jul 09, 1997 at 03:01:39PM -0700, David Lowe wrote: > Has anyone here tried INN on an async-mounted spool in production? Yes, in fact I specifically upgraded the FreeBSD version in order to do so a couple of months ago. It still has its problems, but none that are attributable to async... -- Alan Batie ______ It's not my fault! It's some guy batie@agora.rdrop.com \ / named "General Protection"! +1 503 452-0960 \ / --Ratbert PGP FP: DE 3C 29 17 C0 49 \/ 7A 27 40 A5 3C 37 4A DA 52 B9 It is my policy to avoid purchase of any products from companies which use unrequested email advertisements or telephone solicitation. --yciRD1jyfeSSjG0j Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBM8QdWov4wNua7QglAQG65gQApU5Ii9GUIDwa07ni+f7IEYpss4DS6PZM OM+nUq8xjaht1wFfI8qaNd9wDHBH8KuqaNBHW6V7KToSFnVbvQJFCLTWJ6SEfUMp hZ/c3LZHx6S5UKgsyBj9Gv67IykR4cscGNuxc3cUojoWKX4Q9dsWD6VSaf4/MJR3 TyrwnL61yKE= =pXwG -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --yciRD1jyfeSSjG0j-- From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 18:19:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA27193 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 18:19:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.8.15.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA27175; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 18:19:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA07453; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 11:19:05 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 11:19:02 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org, freebsd-isp@freebsd.org, sdudley@byterunner.com Subject: Configuring Byterunner TC-800 high speed 8-port serial card In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [ I'm posting this for two reasons: to give the ByteRunner people more ] [ info to hand out, and to get some solid info into the archives. I ] [ searched the freebsd archives and came up with nothing. ] I just thought I would let people know what happened with the TC-800 high speed 8-port serial card. It turned out that there are some really weird things with my cheapy PCI m/b I was testing the card in. In an old 386 m/b it worked perfectly. In a 486 machine there was a conflict with address 0x100 and some unknown device, but shifting the port ranges to 0x180-0x1b8 fixed that. This card is definitely a cost-effective way of adding extra serial lines to a FreeBSD box, although you should bear in mind that there may be some teething problems resolving conflicts initially, and it only gives you 8 ports per ISA slot, so you'd be hard pushed to get more than 32 ports in the machine. To configure the card for FreeBSD: * Firstly, read sio(4) (man sio) so you know what's going on. The card is a Boca type, not an AST type. Also, search the Handbook at http://www.freebsd.org/handbook/handbook.html * Set the card as Unix mode 0 (or 1,2,3) using page 0 (default). Set all of the IRQ jumpers to be the same (e.g. 12) and close the "enable IRQ" jumper for IRQ 12. * You need to build a new kernel with support for the card. There is a chapter in the Handbook about building kernels. The config lines you need for the TC-800 are: options COM_MULTIPORT device sio4 at isa? port 0x100 tty flags 0xb05 device sio5 at isa? port 0x108 tty flags 0xb05 device sio6 at isa? port 0x110 tty flags 0xb05 device sio7 at isa? port 0x118 tty flags 0xb05 device sio8 at isa? port 0x120 tty flags 0xb05 device sio9 at isa? port 0x128 tty flags 0xb05 device sio10 at isa? port 0x130 tty flags 0xb05 device sio11 at isa? port 0x138 tty flags 0xb05 irq 12 vector siointr The above is exactly as described in sio(4) for Boca cards. By using the mode and page-select jumpers you can start the TC-800 starting port addresses at any of: 0x100, 0x180, 0x200, 0x240, 0x280, 0x300, x0380 0x500, 0x580, 0x600, 0x640, 0x680, 0x700, x0780 0x900, 0x980, 0xA00, 0xA40, 0xA80, 0xB00, x0B80 0xD00, 0xD80, 0xE00, 0xE40, 0xE80, 0xE00, x0E80 /* Daniel O'Callaghan */ /* HiLink Internet danny@hilink.com.au */ /* FreeBSD - works hard, plays hard... danny@freebsd.org */ From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 18:57:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA28866 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 18:57:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tahoe.cinenet.net (root@ns1.cinenet.net [198.147.76.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA28861 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 18:57:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hollywood.cinenet.net (hollywood.cinenet.net [198.147.76.75]) by tahoe.cinenet.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA13740; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 18:55:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (sraja@localhost) by hollywood.cinenet.net (8.7.3/8.6.9) with SMTP id SAA20246; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 18:55:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: hollywood.cinenet.net: sraja owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 18:55:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Suresh Rajagopalan To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: "Gary D. Margiotta" , Cliff Addy , Nate Williams , isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-Reply-To: <2735.868489228@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'll have to speak up for Livingston here -- we use them all the time for customer equipment and also dial in access, and while opinions on the admin interface are subjective, I have never seen a single box crash. > To use a car analogy, Cisco basically produces the Cadillacs of the > router world whereas Livingston makes Yugos and Ascend makes VWs. :-) > Not everyone needs, wants or can afford a Cadillac, but many of those > features are nice to have if you're going to drive a car at all. > Similarly, the "VW" is cheap but of reasonably good quality and the > Yugo, well, you buy one of those when cost is the #1 consideration and > you are resigned to the fact that it'll be no fun to drive and also > perhaps spend some amount of time by the side of the road, waiting for > the tow-truck. :-) > From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 19:07:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA29326 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 19:07:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.webspan.net (root@mail.webspan.net [206.154.70.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA29321 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 19:07:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.5]) by mail.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id WAA10697; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 22:07:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id WAA25666; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 22:07:30 -0400 (EDT) To: Cliff Addy cc: Nate Williams , isp@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 09 Jul 1997 15:52:02 EDT." Date: Wed, 09 Jul 1997 22:07:30 -0400 Message-ID: <25664.868500450@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Cliff Addy wrote in message ID : > On Wed, 9 Jul 1997, Nate Williams wrote: > > > small office (like mine), a dedicated PC works *much* better than a > > CISCO ever would, and total costs (including hardware, maintenance, > > etc..) are significantly lower. > > I don't buy this at all. A Cisco 2501 is only ~$1700 and requires *zero* > maintenance once it's set up. For a typical setup, that takes about 10 > minutes. If you build a machine yourself, using reliable, quality parts, > you're lucky if you save $500 under that. And then you're worrying about > hard drive crashes, config changes, OS security holes, etc. I have to agree The network I presently run has 10 ciscos of varying types (mostly 2501s) in it. I have seen *ONE* of them crash once in the past year. And it recovered immediately and our network paging software didn't even have time to notice anythink amiss (it only checks every 5 minutes). For a RELIABLE connection, nothing can beat a Cisco ... no hard drive to worry about, no filesystems to worry about failing a fsck on reboot, and pretty amazing stability under direct attacks. If you want reliability, go with a machine that is designed to run 24/7, not a machine that was originally designed to run Windows 9 to 5. Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 19:12:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA29592 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 19:12:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.webspan.net (root@mail.webspan.net [206.154.70.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA29584 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 19:12:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.5]) by mail.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id WAA11553; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 22:12:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id WAA27226; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 22:12:31 -0400 (EDT) To: David Lowe cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: INN on an async-mounted spool? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 09 Jul 1997 15:01:39 PDT." Date: Wed, 09 Jul 1997 22:12:31 -0400 Message-ID: <27223.868500751@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk David Lowe wrote in message ID : > Has anyone here tried INN on an async-mounted spool in production? Yep. news.webspan.net, full feed (several of them), async spool for over 10 months now. Until a panic yesterday morning at 5am (and it was sitting at the fsck prompt when I got here, so I don't even know what happened), it had been up for 145 days. > We're not too concerned about data loss on the spool in the event of a > failure - but we *are* concerned about the async option actually *causing* > crashes. While we were running async, we had two mysterious crashes > (which of course led to some data loss & required human intervention for > fsck'ing). Since we've gone synchronous, we've not had these mystery > crashes (knock wood) but we've also not been able to keep up as nicely as > we'd like to. > > Has anyone had success with an async-mounted spool in the long term? > Pros? Cons? Hrm. Interesting. I've heard from another friend about stability problems on his news box, and I bet he's got it async mounted also. I run a RELENG_2_2 kernel from late last year (around the start of November) and I mean to update it soonish, but this is giving me pause for thought. With the current situation with Hell Atlantic not kicking USENET spammers off (and that spam acocunting for 25% of all traffic I see), I can't do without async mounts ... Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 19:27:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA00340 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 19:27:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.webspan.net (root@mail.webspan.net [206.154.70.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA00335 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 19:27:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.5]) by mail.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id WAA14045; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 22:27:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id WAA02380; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 22:27:47 -0400 (EDT) To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: isp@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 09 Jul 1997 16:00:28 PDT." <2735.868489228@time.cdrom.com> Date: Wed, 09 Jul 1997 22:27:46 -0400 Message-ID: <2362.868501666@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk "Jordan K. Hubbard" wrote in message ID <2735.868489228@time.cdrom.com>: > To use a car analogy, Cisco basically produces the Cadillacs of the > router world whereas Livingston makes Yugos and Ascend makes VWs. :-) Actually, the Ascend would be better compared to that East German car ... the Trabant :-) Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 19:32:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA00694 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 19:32:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.webspan.net (root@mail.webspan.net [206.154.70.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA00689 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 19:32:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.5]) by mail.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id WAA14857; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 22:32:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id WAA03136; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 22:32:41 -0400 (EDT) To: Jacob Suter cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: popper err In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 08 Jul 1997 22:47:16 CDT." <33C309C4.554C5E0B@linus.intrastar.net> Date: Wed, 09 Jul 1997 22:32:40 -0400 Message-ID: <3133.868501960@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jacob Suter wrote in message ID <33C309C4.554C5E0B@linus.intrastar.net>: > I've had similar problems with apparent serial line overruns.. My > cyclades card is brain-dead and overruns my Cardinal modems quite > often. My PM2-E doesn't do it on the same modems and those people get > their email at lightning speed. Hrm. Interesting. However, it works fine with Eudora over here, and all our systems are dedicated terminal servers (no pc's with multiport cards). From what I understand, it's just Netscape that messes up. Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 19:54:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA01717 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 19:54:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bob.tri-lakes.net ([207.3.81.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA01704 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 19:54:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [207.3.81.149] by bob.tri-lakes.net (NTMail 3.02.13) with ESMTP id pa223771 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 21:53:38 -0500 Message-ID: <33C40887.41C67EA6@tri-lakes.net> Date: Wed, 09 Jul 1997 21:54:15 +0000 From: Chris Dillon X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Nate Williams CC: "Gary D. Margiotta" , Cliff Addy , isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? References: <199707092203.QAA28649@rocky.mt.sri.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Nate Williams wrote: > > > In Nate's position where he is in a small office and doesn't need the > > added functions of the Cisco, it is a great idea for hime to build his > > own. > > Right. What I have isn't for everyone, but for small offices/ISP's who > don't have a lot of $$ to throw at dedicated hardware, the PC is a great > solution. (Especially when 'routing packets' isn't enough to have a > working network. > > > specialized box. Plus, our routers have been up for months without > > rebooting...the PC Router won't stay up that long without something having > > to be done on it (my opinion, please don't kill me for it...;) ) > > 1:37PM up 168 days, 2:07, 7 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.01, 0.09 > > That was right after we installed a UPS after a storm knocked it out. > If it wasn't for the power outage it'd been up for almost a year. > If the boxes ONLY job were to be a router, would it be possible put everything it needed onto a floppy and build a system without a HD? Or at least set up powersaving on the HD and let it spin down after a few minutes? I imagine nothing needs to be written or read from the drive very often. From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 20:16:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA03025 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 20:16:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from netdev.comsys.com (netdev.comsys.com [192.94.236.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA03014; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 20:16:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mobile1.europa.com ([204.202.49.58]) by netdev.comsys.com (8.8.5/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA02147; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 21:14:36 GMT Message-ID: <33C4541E.D33@comsys.com> Date: Wed, 09 Jul 1997 20:16:46 -0700 From: alex huppenthal Reply-To: alex@comsys.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Gary Palmer CC: David Lowe , freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: INN on an async-mounted spool? References: <27223.868500751@orion.webspan.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Anyone distilled the recent inn, nntp release installation process for FreeBSD 2.2.1 into the simple 12 step process it really should be? :) -Alex Gary Palmer wrote: > > David Lowe wrote in message ID > : > > Has anyone here tried INN on an async-mounted spool in production? > > Yep. news.webspan.net, full feed (several of them), async spool for > over 10 months now. Until a panic yesterday morning at 5am (and it was > sitting at the fsck prompt when I got here, so I don't even know what > happened), it had been up for 145 days. > > > We're not too concerned about data loss on the spool in the event of a > > failure - but we *are* concerned about the async option actually *causing* > > crashes. While we were running async, we had two mysterious crashes > > (which of course led to some data loss & required human intervention for > > fsck'ing). Since we've gone synchronous, we've not had these mystery > > crashes (knock wood) but we've also not been able to keep up as nicely as > > we'd like to. > > > > Has anyone had success with an async-mounted spool in the long term? > > Pros? Cons? > > Hrm. Interesting. I've heard from another friend about stability > problems on his news box, and I bet he's got it async mounted also. I > run a RELENG_2_2 kernel from late last year (around the start of > November) and I mean to update it soonish, but this is giving me pause > for thought. With the current situation with Hell Atlantic not kicking > USENET spammers off (and that spam acocunting for 25% of all traffic I > see), I can't do without async mounts ... > > Gary > -- > Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member > FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 20:24:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA03359 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 20:24:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.webspan.net (root@mail.webspan.net [206.154.70.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA03343 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 20:24:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.5]) by mail.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id XAA23678; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 23:24:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id XAA20374; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 23:24:01 -0400 (EDT) To: alex@comsys.com cc: David Lowe , freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: INN on an async-mounted spool? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 09 Jul 1997 20:16:46 PDT." <33C4541E.D33@comsys.com> Date: Wed, 09 Jul 1997 23:24:00 -0400 Message-ID: <20372.868505040@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk alex huppenthal wrote in message ID <33C4541E.D33@comsys.com>: > Anyone distilled the recent inn, nntp release installation process > for FreeBSD 2.2.1 into the simple 12 step process it really should > be? :) INN is a complicated beast. Anyone who tells you that an `inn how-to install' can be either (a) simple or (b) take twelve steps is either on drugs or suffering from some severe psychosis. It's very simple to set up inn incorrectly. It's very difficult to set it up correctly and efficiently. I'll be the first to admit that my inn config is neither :-) Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 20:32:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA03769 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 20:32:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tyger.inna.net (root@tyger.inna.net [206.151.66.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA03739 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 20:32:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from caught.inna.net (caught.inna.net [206.151.66.7]) by tyger.inna.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA17363; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 23:31:49 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 23:31:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas Arnold To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-Reply-To: <2735.868489228@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 9 Jul 1997, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > To use a car analogy, Cisco basically produces the Cadillacs of the > router world whereas Livingston makes Yugos and Ascend makes VWs. :-) > Not everyone needs, wants or can afford a Cadillac, but many of those > features are nice to have if you're going to drive a car at all. > Similarly, the "VW" is cheap but of reasonably good quality and the > Yugo, well, you buy one of those when cost is the #1 consideration and > you are resigned to the fact that it'll be no fun to drive and also > perhaps spend some amount of time by the side of the road, waiting for > the tow-truck. :-) Hrm. I agree with your Cisco Assessment, but, Figure that VW made how many millions of Beetles with few or no defects ( unlike ascend ). And to say a livingston was a Yugo... Well... I think of it more as a Ford Grenada... It'll run forever with regular maintenance, they'll be a few recalls and you damn well better keep oil in it. And dont expect those fancy features ( leather interior, nice user interface ) after all, you bought the run-of-the-mill family mobile. I do have to say that once you get over the user interface they just seem to keep going and going and going... but I'd NEVER use one for my main link. +-----------------------------------------------+ : Tom Arnold - No relation to Rosanne : : SysAdmin/Pres - TBI, Ltd ( inna.net ) : : The Middle Peninsula's Internet Connection : +-----------------------------------------------+ From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Jul 9 23:28:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA09242 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 23:28:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy.ois.net.au (proxy.ois.net.au [203.17.194.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA09233 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 1997 23:28:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mikey@localhost) by proxy.ois.net.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA01360; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 14:25:16 +0800 (WST) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 14:25:16 +0800 (WST) From: Michael Slater To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: More than 64 Megs Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello, I recently built a FreeBSD box with 128 Megs of ram. I can only get it to recognize the first 64 megs. Anyone know how to solve this problem ? regards, Michael Slater From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 00:02:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA11132 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 00:02:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from uhf.wdc.net (uhf.wdc.net [198.147.74.44]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA11116 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 00:02:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (bad@localhost) by uhf.wdc.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id DAA02098; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 03:02:34 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 03:02:32 -0400 (EDT) From: Bernie Doehner X-Sender: bad@uhf.wdc.net To: Michael Slater cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: More than 64 Megs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Hello, > I recently built a FreeBSD box with 128 Megs of ram. > I can only get it to recognize the first 64 megs. > > Anyone know how to solve this problem ? > > regards, > > Michael Slater options MAXMEM=(128*1024) in your kernel config file. See /sys/i386/conf/LINT. Bernie From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 00:05:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA11281 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 00:05:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com ([140.145.230.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA11271; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 00:05:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.dk.tfs.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA06629; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 08:51:25 +0200 (CEST) To: "Daniel O'Callaghan" cc: freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG, sdudley@byterunner.com From: Poul-Henning Kamp Subject: Re: Configuring Byterunner TC-800 high speed 8-port serial card In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 10 Jul 1997 11:19:02 +1000." Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 08:51:25 +0200 Message-ID: <6627.868517485@critter.dk.tfs.com> Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message , "Danie >* You need to build a new kernel with support for the card. There is a >chapter in the Handbook about building kernels. The config lines you >need for the TC-800 are: > >options COM_MULTIPORT >device sio4 at isa? port 0x100 tty flags 0xb05 >device sio5 at isa? port 0x108 tty flags 0xb05 >device sio6 at isa? port 0x110 tty flags 0xb05 >device sio7 at isa? port 0x118 tty flags 0xb05 >device sio8 at isa? port 0x120 tty flags 0xb05 >device sio9 at isa? port 0x128 tty flags 0xb05 >device sio10 at isa? port 0x130 tty flags 0xb05 >device sio11 at isa? port 0x138 tty flags 0xb05 irq 12 vector siointr You should set the 0x10000 flag (only in current yet) as well, to avoid the case where a pending IRQ from a higher port prevents sio's test#3 from passing on a lower port. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Power and ignorance is a disgusting cocktail. From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 00:28:12 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA12277 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 00:28:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy.ois.net.au (proxy.ois.net.au [203.17.194.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA12269 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 00:28:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mikey@localhost) by proxy.ois.net.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA00859; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 15:25:15 +0800 (WST) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 15:25:14 +0800 (WST) From: Michael Slater To: Rob Secombe cc: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: More than 64 Megs In-Reply-To: <199707100647.QAA15222@wizard.teksupport.net.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Thanks, I had looked through the handbook, but not the FAQ. Next time i will do so before i send an email :) regards, Michael Slater On Thu, 10 Jul 1997, Rob Secombe wrote: > >Hello, > > I recently built a FreeBSD box with 128 Megs of ram. > >I can only get it to recognize the first 64 megs. > > > >Anyone know how to solve this problem ? > > > >regards, > > > >Michael Slater > > > > > > Hi, > > This is actually in the FAQ. You need to recompile the kernel with > 'MAXMEM=131072' > > Regards > > > > Rob Secombe > > > Teksupport Pty. Ltd. > 7 Warwick Avenue, > Springvale, E-mail robseco@wizard.teksupport.net.au > Melbourne Vic. Australia World Wide Web http://www.teksupport.net.au/ > **************************************************************************** > > From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 00:42:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA13131 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 00:42:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.1earth.net (mail.1earth.net [203.102.217.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA13126 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 00:42:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from blah (blah.1earth.net [203.102.217.55]) by mail.1earth.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA03076; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 15:42:04 GMT Message-ID: <33C49263.5A24C1D1@1earth.net> Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 17:42:27 +1000 From: brad forschinger X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; Linux 2.0.30 i486) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Michael Slater CC: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: More than 64 Megs References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Michael Slater wrote: > > Hello, > I recently built a FreeBSD box with 128 Megs of ram. > I can only get it to recognize the first 64 megs. > > Anyone know how to solve this problem ? > > regards, > > Michael Slater put this line in your kernel config options "MAXMEM=(128*1024)" -- Regards, Brad Forschinger From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 02:25:12 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA17047 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 02:25:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ccsales.ccsales.com (ccsales.ccsales.com [207.137.172.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id CAA17036; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 02:25:01 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 02:25:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Randy Katz To: Michael Slater cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: More than 64 Megs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, It's in the Handbook I believe...don't have it in front of me right now...I know it's there On Thu, 10 Jul 1997, Michael Slater wrote: > Hello, > I recently built a FreeBSD box with 128 Megs of ram. > I can only get it to recognize the first 64 megs. > > Anyone know how to solve this problem ? > > regards, > > Michael Slater > RAK ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Randy A. Katz Computer Consultation & Sales 505 S. Beverly Drive, Suite 472 Beverly Hills, CA 90212 (213) 307-9581 http://www.ccsales.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 04:32:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id EAA27112 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 04:32:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.id.net (mail.id.net [199.125.1.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA27104 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 04:32:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.id.net (shell.id.net [199.125.2.8]) by mail.id.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id HAA10136; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 07:32:24 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Shady Received: (from rls@localhost) by shell.id.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) id HAA16294; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 07:32:23 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199707101132.HAA16294@shell.id.net> Subject: T1/T3 Upgrade Options? In-Reply-To: from Thomas Arnold at "Jul 9, 97 11:31:43 pm" To: tom@inna.net (Thomas Arnold) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 07:32:23 -0400 (EDT) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Well, I wasn't going to do this, and probably shouldn't have, but here's the situation. We all know that you can use the ET-Inc card or the SDL card for T1 routing... But does FreeBSD have ANYTHING available with a HSSI interface yet? We've already bought one Cisco 7010 and the $60,000+ we've spent "configuring" it, (Ie: Base unit, 2 100 Megabit ethernets, and one HSSI port) could have been much better spent I think. I would be much more willing to "take my chances" on a $55,000 savings versus the ~$500 savings your talking between a Cisco 2501 and a FreeBSD router... -- Rob === _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ Innovative Data Services Serving South-Eastern Michigan Internet Service Provider / Hardware Sales / Consulting Services Voice: (810)855-0404 / Fax: (810)855-3268 / Web: http://www.id.net From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 04:37:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id EAA27453 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 04:37:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.id.net (mail.id.net [199.125.1.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA27444 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 04:37:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.id.net (shell.id.net [199.125.2.8]) by mail.id.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id HAA10175; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 07:37:28 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Shady Received: (from rls@localhost) by shell.id.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) id HAA16305; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 07:37:27 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199707101137.HAA16305@shell.id.net> Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-Reply-To: <33C40887.41C67EA6@tri-lakes.net> from Chris Dillon at "Jul 9, 97 09:54:15 pm" To: cdillon@tri-lakes.net (Chris Dillon) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 07:37:27 -0400 (EDT) Cc: nate@mt.sri.com, gary@tbe.net, fbsdlist@federation.addy.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > If the boxes ONLY job were to be a router, would it be possible put > everything it needed onto a floppy and build a system without a HD? Or > at least set up powersaving on the HD and let it spin down after a few > minutes? I imagine nothing needs to be written or read from the drive > very often. I don't know about the power saving mode, I've never had any luck getting that to work properly, however it is possible to put everything on floppy. On the same token, I think a hard drive is much more reliable than a floppy, plus you don't have to wait 3-4 minutes for your router to come back to life after a reboot. At least with a hard drive, all of the moving parts and magnetic material is sealed up, where-as in a floppy *everything* is exposed to the environment. We've had hard drives running 24/7 since we went online in January '94 without any problems, and hard drives have come along way in quality since then.. To make things better, I would say your best bet if you want to be sure, would be to get one of those hard-cards, where you store everything in NVRAM and it looks like a very fast hard drive to your computer system. -- Rob === _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ Innovative Data Services Serving South-Eastern Michigan Internet Service Provider / Hardware Sales / Consulting Services Voice: (810)855-0404 / Fax: (810)855-3268 / Web: http://www.id.net From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 05:49:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id FAA00419 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 05:49:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cscfx.sytex.com (rwc@cscfx.sytex.com [205.147.190.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id FAA00411 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 05:49:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from rwc@localhost) by cscfx.sytex.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id IAA02416; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 08:49:54 -0400 From: Richard Cramer Message-Id: <199707101249.IAA02416@cscfx.sytex.com> Subject: Re: T1/T3 Upgrade Options? To: rls@mail.id.net (Robert Shady) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 08:49:54 -0400 (EDT) Cc: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Reply-To: rcramer@sytex.net In-Reply-To: <199707101132.HAA16294@shell.id.net> from "Robert Shady" at Jul 10, 97 07:32:23 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Well, I wasn't going to do this, and probably shouldn't have, but here's > the situation. We all know that you can use the ET-Inc card or the > SDL card for T1 routing... But does FreeBSD have ANYTHING available with > a HSSI interface yet? We've already bought one Cisco 7010 and the $60,000+ Yes. Both SDL and DEC have cards available. If you need particulars, or are not a system integrator, you may email for more particulars. > we've spent "configuring" it, (Ie: Base unit, 2 100 Megabit ethernets, and > one HSSI port) could have been much better spent I think. I would be much > more willing to "take my chances" on a $55,000 savings versus the ~$500 > savings your talking between a Cisco 2501 and a FreeBSD router... You have the option! Dick > > -- Rob > Innovative Data Services > Serving South-Eastern Michigan > Internet Service Provider / Hardware Sales / Consulting Services > Voice: (810)855-0404 / Fax: (810)855-3268 / Web: http://www.id.net -- Richard Cramer rcramer@sytex.net Phone: 703-425-2515 President Fax: 703-425-4585 SytexNet(tm) Sytex Access Ltd. POB 2385, Fairfax, VA 22031-0385 From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 06:00:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id FAA00809 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 06:00:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA00804; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 05:59:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id WAA05329; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 22:44:01 +1000 Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 22:44:01 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707101244.WAA05329@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: danny@panda.hilink.com.au, phk@dk.tfs.com Subject: Re: Configuring Byterunner TC-800 high speed 8-port serial card Cc: freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG, sdudley@byterunner.com Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>options COM_MULTIPORT >>device sio4 at isa? port 0x100 tty flags 0xb05 >>... >>device sio11 at isa? port 0x138 tty flags 0xb05 irq 12 vector siointr > >You should set the 0x10000 flag (only in current yet) as well, to >avoid the case where a pending IRQ from a higher port prevents >sio's test#3 from passing on a lower port. No, you should keep the 0x10000 flag clear, so that a pending IRQ from a higher port causes sio's test#3 to fail on a lower port, since such IRQs "can't happen" (unless the multiport board is misconfigured or is actually a multi-infernal modem :-). Bruce From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 06:08:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA01145 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 06:08:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com ([140.145.230.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA01137; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 06:08:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.dk.tfs.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA00546; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 15:06:38 +0200 (CEST) To: Bruce Evans cc: danny@panda.hilink.com.au, phk@dk.tfs.com, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org, freebsd-isp@freebsd.org, sdudley@byterunner.com From: Poul-Henning Kamp Subject: Re: Configuring Byterunner TC-800 high speed 8-port serial card In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 10 Jul 1997 22:44:01 +1000." <199707101244.WAA05329@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 15:06:38 +0200 Message-ID: <544.868539998@critter.dk.tfs.com> Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199707101244.WAA05329@godzilla.zeta.org.au>, Bruce Evans writes: >>>options COM_MULTIPORT >>>device sio4 at isa? port 0x100 tty flags 0xb05 >>>... >>>device sio11 at isa? port 0x138 tty flags 0xb05 irq 12 vector siointr >> >>You should set the 0x10000 flag (only in current yet) as well, to >>avoid the case where a pending IRQ from a higher port prevents >>sio's test#3 from passing on a lower port. > >No, you should keep the 0x10000 flag clear, so that a pending IRQ from >a higher port causes sio's test#3 to fail on a lower port, since such >IRQs "can't happen" (unless the multiport board is misconfigured or is >actually a multi-infernal modem :-). This is not true Bruce, they can happen if the sio driver doesnt disable interrupt sources before you reboot your kernel. The 0x10000 flag is necessary if you want your sio ports after crashes. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Power and ignorance is a disgusting cocktail. From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 07:11:12 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA03654 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 07:11:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA03648; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 07:11:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id AAA08067; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 00:05:25 +1000 Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 00:05:25 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707101405.AAA08067@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, phk@dk.tfs.com Subject: Re: Configuring Byterunner TC-800 high speed 8-port serial card Cc: danny@panda.hilink.com.au, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG, sdudley@byterunner.com Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>No, you should keep the 0x10000 flag clear, so that a pending IRQ from >>a higher port causes sio's test#3 to fail on a lower port, since such >>IRQs "can't happen" (unless the multiport board is misconfigured or is >>actually a multi-infernal modem :-). > >This is not true Bruce, they can happen if the sio driver doesnt disable >interrupt sources before you reboot your kernel. The 0x10000 flag >is necessary if you want your sio ports after crashes. This can't happen (except in misconfigured and buggy cases) since the sio drivers disconnects the interrupts for all configured ports in its first probe. Of course, this can fail if not all ports are correctly configured or if there is a non-sio device using an sio irq, but then ignoring the problem won't help (except in the latter case when the non-sio device gets completely disconnected later). Bruce From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 07:13:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA03734 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 07:13:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wopr.inetu.net (wopr.inetu.net [207.18.13.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA03727 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 07:13:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (dev@localhost) by wopr.inetu.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA22832; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 10:16:09 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 10:16:08 -0400 (EDT) From: Dev Chanchani To: Michael Slater cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: More than 64 Megs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk You need to recompile the kernel with the option MAXMEM="<128 * 1024>" That should fix it. Your kernel config file should be in /sys/i386/conf/GENERIC after that, run config GENERIC then compile it and reboot. Dev On Thu, 10 Jul 1997, Michael Slater wrote: > Hello, > I recently built a FreeBSD box with 128 Megs of ram. > I can only get it to recognize the first 64 megs. > > Anyone know how to solve this problem ? > > regards, > > Michael Slater > From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 07:21:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA04115 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 07:21:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com ([140.145.230.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA04107; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 07:21:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.dk.tfs.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA00804; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 16:20:04 +0200 (CEST) To: Bruce Evans cc: phk@dk.tfs.com, danny@panda.hilink.com.au, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org, freebsd-isp@freebsd.org, sdudley@byterunner.com From: Poul-Henning Kamp Subject: Re: Configuring Byterunner TC-800 high speed 8-port serial card In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 11 Jul 1997 00:05:25 +1000." <199707101405.AAA08067@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 16:20:04 +0200 Message-ID: <802.868544404@critter.dk.tfs.com> Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199707101405.AAA08067@godzilla.zeta.org.au>, Bruce Evans writes: >>>No, you should keep the 0x10000 flag clear, so that a pending IRQ from >>>a higher port causes sio's test#3 to fail on a lower port, since such >>>IRQs "can't happen" (unless the multiport board is misconfigured or is >>>actually a multi-infernal modem :-). >> >>This is not true Bruce, they can happen if the sio driver doesnt disable >>interrupt sources before you reboot your kernel. The 0x10000 flag >>is necessary if you want your sio ports after crashes. > >This can't happen (except in misconfigured and buggy cases) since the >sio drivers disconnects the interrupts for all configured ports in its >first probe. Of course, this can fail if not all ports are correctly >configured or if there is a non-sio device using an sio irq, but then >ignoring the problem won't help (except in the latter case when the >non-sio device gets completely disconnected later). Speaking from experience: a correctly configured board fails the test#3 after a crash. Don't ask me why, but it is correctly configured, and I have verified the circuitry on the card myself, to make sure that it was possible to share the IRQs with this card. Any debugging information you may want can be produced rather easily... -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Power and ignorance is a disgusting cocktail. From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 07:24:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA04234 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 07:24:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wopr.inetu.net (wopr.inetu.net [207.18.13.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA04228 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 07:24:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (dev@localhost) by wopr.inetu.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA22954 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 10:28:02 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 10:28:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Dev Chanchani To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Nameserver QUestion Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk We have a client that registered a domain name with us. He wants to be primary for it and run his own DNS. Internic is taking way to long to process the host request and the modify. My question is, can we setup our nameserver (primary) here to pull secondary from his nameserver for that domain? I don't see what the problem would be, but I just wanted to make sure it wouldn't cause any little problems. Thanks in advance, Dev From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 07:54:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA05768 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 07:54:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from destiny.waverider.co.uk (destiny.waverider.co.uk [194.207.28.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA05762 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 07:54:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from auden (zephania.waverider.net.uk [194.207.148.99]) by destiny.waverider.co.uk (8.8.2/8.8.2) with SMTP id OAA14713; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 14:49:10 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970710153533.0090abe0@waverider.net.uk> X-Sender: andyc@waverider.net.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 15:35:35 +0100 To: Dev Chanchani , freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG From: Andy Cowan Subject: Re: Nameserver QUestion Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 10:28 AM 7/10/97 -0400, Dev Chanchani wrote: >We have a client that registered a domain name with us. He wants to be >primary for it and run his own DNS. Internic is taking way to long to >process the host request and the modify. > >My question is, can we setup our nameserver (primary) here to pull >secondary from his nameserver for that domain? > Sure, we've done that before with no problems at all. Andy Andy Cowan Tel: 01564 795888 Technical Director Fax: 01564 795177 Wave Rider Internet plc http://www.waverider.co.uk ------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 08:07:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA06491 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 08:07:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from limbo.senate.org (nathan@senate.org [204.141.125.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA06486 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 08:07:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nathan@localhost) by limbo.senate.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA08229; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 11:07:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan Dorfman Message-Id: <199707101507.LAA08229@limbo.senate.org> Subject: Re: Nameserver QUestion In-Reply-To: from Dev Chanchani at "Jul 10, 97 10:28:02 am" To: dev@wopr.inetu.net (Dev Chanchani) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 11:07:52 -0400 (EDT) Cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk You want your primary nameserver to be a secondary for one domain? Sure. Edit your /etc/named.boot file or whatever you use for named startup and add a line like: secondary newdomain.com [primary's IP] [filename] secondary xxx.xxx.in-addr.arpa [primary's IP] [filename] Unless you modify the "primary" directives, this will not impede your name- server's current operation in any way. I suggest you pick up DNS & BIND, by Paul Albitz and Cricket Liu, O'Reilly Publishing. > We have a client that registered a domain name with us. He wants to be > primary for it and run his own DNS. Internic is taking way to long to > process the host request and the modify. > > My question is, can we setup our nameserver (primary) here to pull > secondary from his nameserver for that domain? > > I don't see what the problem would be, but I just wanted to make sure it > wouldn't cause any little problems. > > Thanks in advance, > Dev > From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 08:31:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA07558 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 08:31:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bert.club-web.com (bert.club-web.com [207.176.196.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA07553 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 08:31:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ernie.club-web.com (ernie.club-web.com [207.176.196.12]) by bert.club-web.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id LAA22540 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 11:33:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <33C500DD.167EB0E7@club-web.com> Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 11:33:49 -0400 From: Mark Segal Organization: Club-Web Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nameserver QUestion Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > We have a client that registered a domain name with us. He wants to be > primary for it and run his own DNS. Internic is taking way to long to > process the host request and the modify. > > My question is, can we setup our nameserver (primary) here to pull > secondary from his nameserver for that domain? > > I don't see what the problem would be, but I just wanted to make sure it > wouldn't cause any little problems. > > Thanks in advance, > Dev No problem.. just goto your named.boot (or named.cache, ie the config file for BIND) and put the entry secondary domainname ip of primary server databasefile for example secondary club-web.com 207.176.196.2 db.club-web.com Mark -- Mark Segal mark@club-web.com System Administrator - Club-Web Inc. From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 09:04:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA08842 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 09:04:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA08832; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 09:04:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id BAA11291; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 01:55:39 +1000 Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 01:55:39 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707101555.BAA11291@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, phk@dk.tfs.com Subject: Re: Configuring Byterunner TC-800 high speed 8-port serial card Cc: danny@panda.hilink.com.au, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG, sdudley@byterunner.com Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Speaking from experience: a correctly configured board fails the test#3 >after a crash. Don't ask me why, but it is correctly configured, and >I have verified the circuitry on the card myself, to make sure that it >was possible to share the IRQs with this card. Does OUT2 (aka MCR_IENABLE) disconnect the UARTs individually, as is required for the non-AST multiport case? For the non-multiport case, I have seen some cases where test #3 fails but then succeeds when retried from ddb after a few seconds. This may have something to do with the fifo not being initialized early. I've only seen it after crashes. Bruce From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 10:12:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA12599 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 10:12:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ns.systemresc.com (dave@[207.198.60.196]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA12588 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 10:12:14 -0700 (PDT) From: dave@ns.systemresc.com Received: from localhost (dave@localhost) by ns.systemresc.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA08860; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 13:13:19 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 13:13:18 -0400 (EDT) To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org cc: ivan@cyclades.com Subject: DCD (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk ---------- Forwarded message ---------- I'm running Freebsd using cyclom Y 16 port PCI serial device the driver was downloaded from Cyclom system and compiled on my system and all goes well. Until a user drops carrier. The process usually pppd doesn't know they dropped carrier and the modem resetts but you can not dialin. A pass message I sent the log file and it has a warning that DCD is low and it is starting the login process. Having said all that...in the info file for mgetty that I use (1.0) it says that flat cables can cause DCD not found??? or cables are too long. Please Please someone have any answers, the modem sees a carrier, yet mgetty doesn't, the cyclom device seems to work yet the carrier signal is not getting back to mgetty????? Dave dave@systemresc.com From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 10:57:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA14990 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 10:57:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from linus.intrastar.net (root@linus.intrastar.net [206.136.25.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA14985 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 10:57:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jake.fuck.org (pmnac1-25.inu.net [208.129.167.27]) by linus.intrastar.net (8.8.5/TerraNovaNet) with ESMTP id MAA01863; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 12:56:29 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <33C52358.ABB9E08F@linus.intrastar.net> Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 13:00:56 -0500 From: Jacob Suter X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ulf Zimmermann CC: Stephen Roome , shovey@buffnet.net, danf@JadeTech.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <199707091731.KAA12155@Gatekeeper.Alameda.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk ISP Price for a Livingston OR-HS (T1/E1 capable office router, unlimited IP's, doesn't do BGP4 but everything else including OSPF) for $649 ISP price... Nice box based on the 386SX/25 running standard Livingston ComOS JS Ulf Zimmermann wrote: > > On Wed, 9 Jul 1997, Steve Hovey wrote: > > > > > On Tue, 8 Jul 1997, Daniel C. Fifield wrote: > > > > I run an ISP in Wisconsin and we are planning an upgrade from a > 56KB line > > > > to a T1 line. My ISP recommends using a CISCO router. I am > looking for > > > > alternatives and experience using the CICSO router. > > > > > > I love my ciscos - its all I will use! Not too long ago, we had a > cracker > > > attack an older cisco, rendering it useless. Their tech support > stayed on > > > the phone and got me upgraded to a new operating system and > crackerproofed > > > in a very short time! > > > > CISCO's customer support might be great when one of their pieces of > > equipment begins to show it's age/vulnerability, I'm not sure > however that > > it's the best advertising or reason to buy a Cisco. > > > > I still really don't understand why folks with only a T1 line insist > on > > buying a separate router, we have E1 here and have a dual port > serial card > > and a mux. It costs the same to add onto a pc as a Cisco, you still > get > > tech support and the PC that runs it doesn't do anything else or > fall over > > ever. > > Why ? Because what ever system you run your T1 off, PC or SGI or > whatever, > if it is not a dedicated router, people tend to run other services off > it. > If you run other services off it, you tend to modify it (for example > reboot). That brings down your whole T1 line. I thought long about it, > > as I started with just a Fractional T1 Frame Relay line for myself and > > decided at that point to go with a Cisco PC card. It is a complete > router, > it just takes power from the PC and a com port emulation for the > console > port. Even with this solution I power cycled the box it was in too > often. > > If customer ask me today about a standalone router or a PC card, I > often > tell them to get a router like the Engage routers. a T1 with CSU > version > cost $995 for ISPs. It has no large option in routing protocols, but > as an endpoint, they don't need much. The reason I tell them this, it > is > a standalone box. A black box in the corner. No one is going to touch > it. > > > > > Besides, why learn how to use a Cisco router, when you can have a > *BSD box > > do it for you for the same price/cheaper, but with a lot less hassle > if it > > goes wrong. > > > > Check out www.etinc.com and www.sdlcomm.com to name two. > > > > Anyway, > > > > Steve Roome - Vision Interactive Ltd. > > Tel:+44(0)117 9730597 Home:+44(0)976 241342 > > WWW: http://dylan.visint.co.uk/ > > > > > > Ulf. > > ---- > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > Ulf Zimmermann, 1525 Pacific Ave., Alameda, CA-94501, #: 510-769-2936 > Alameda Networks, Inc. | http://www.Alameda.net | Fax#: 510-521-5073 From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 14:13:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA29059 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 14:13:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from super-g.inch.com (super-g.inch.com [207.240.140.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA29054 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 14:12:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (spork@localhost) by super-g.inch.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA01986; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 17:28:34 GMT Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 17:28:34 +0000 (GMT) From: spork X-Sender: spork@super-g.inch.com To: Robert Shady cc: Chris Dillon , nate@mt.sri.com, gary@tbe.net, fbsdlist@federation.addy.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-Reply-To: <199707101137.HAA16305@shell.id.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 10 Jul 1997, Robert Shady wrote: > To make things better, I would say your best bet if you want to be sure, > would be to get one of those hard-cards, where you store everything in > NVRAM and it looks like a very fast hard drive to your computer system. > -- Rob Do you have any more info on "hard cards"? I've not heard of this, but it sounds like a perfect solution for routers/firewalls... Charles From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 14:47:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA00619 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 14:47:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etinc.com (et-gw-fr1.etinc.com [204.141.244.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA00610 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 14:47:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ntws (ntws.etinc.com [204.141.95.142]) by etinc.com (8.8.3/8.6.9) with SMTP id RAA05154; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 17:54:01 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970710174542.00b08500@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 17:45:47 -0400 To: Jacob Suter , Ulf Zimmermann From: dennis Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? Cc: Stephen Roome , shovey@buffnet.net, danf@JadeTech.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 01:00 PM 7/10/97 -0500, Jacob Suter wrote: >ISP Price for a Livingston OR-HS (T1/E1 capable office router, unlimited >IP's, doesn't do BGP4 but everything else including OSPF) for $649 ISP >price... Nice box based on the 386SX/25 running standard Livingston >ComOS A real screamer! ("capable" is the key word here). You could plop a $795. card into your freebsd box and get expandability and a lot more horsepower. Even our $530. card will blow away a Livingston. Dennis > >JS > > >Ulf Zimmermann wrote: > >> > On Wed, 9 Jul 1997, Steve Hovey wrote: >> > >> > > On Tue, 8 Jul 1997, Daniel C. Fifield wrote: >> > > > I run an ISP in Wisconsin and we are planning an upgrade from a >> 56KB line >> > > > to a T1 line. My ISP recommends using a CISCO router. I am >> looking for >> > > > alternatives and experience using the CICSO router. >> > > >> > > I love my ciscos - its all I will use! Not too long ago, we had a >> cracker >> > > attack an older cisco, rendering it useless. Their tech support >> stayed on >> > > the phone and got me upgraded to a new operating system and >> crackerproofed >> > > in a very short time! >> > >> > CISCO's customer support might be great when one of their pieces of >> > equipment begins to show it's age/vulnerability, I'm not sure >> however that >> > it's the best advertising or reason to buy a Cisco. >> > >> > I still really don't understand why folks with only a T1 line insist >> on >> > buying a separate router, we have E1 here and have a dual port >> serial card >> > and a mux. It costs the same to add onto a pc as a Cisco, you still >> get >> > tech support and the PC that runs it doesn't do anything else or >> fall over >> > ever. >> >> Why ? Because what ever system you run your T1 off, PC or SGI or >> whatever, >> if it is not a dedicated router, people tend to run other services off >> it. >> If you run other services off it, you tend to modify it (for example >> reboot). That brings down your whole T1 line. I thought long about it, >> >> as I started with just a Fractional T1 Frame Relay line for myself and >> >> decided at that point to go with a Cisco PC card. It is a complete >> router, >> it just takes power from the PC and a com port emulation for the >> console >> port. Even with this solution I power cycled the box it was in too >> often. >> >> If customer ask me today about a standalone router or a PC card, I >> often >> tell them to get a router like the Engage routers. a T1 with CSU >> version >> cost $995 for ISPs. It has no large option in routing protocols, but >> as an endpoint, they don't need much. The reason I tell them this, it >> is >> a standalone box. A black box in the corner. No one is going to touch >> it. >> >> > >> > Besides, why learn how to use a Cisco router, when you can have a >> *BSD box >> > do it for you for the same price/cheaper, but with a lot less hassle >> if it >> > goes wrong. >> > >> > Check out www.etinc.com and www.sdlcomm.com to name two. >> > >> > Anyway, >> > >> > Steve Roome - Vision Interactive Ltd. >> > Tel:+44(0)117 9730597 Home:+44(0)976 241342 >> > WWW: http://dylan.visint.co.uk/ >> > >> > >> >> Ulf. >> >> ---- >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> Ulf Zimmermann, 1525 Pacific Ave., Alameda, CA-94501, #: 510-769-2936 >> Alameda Networks, Inc. | http://www.Alameda.net | Fax#: 510-521-5073 > > > > > Emerging Technologies, Inc. Quad, Dual and Single Port ISA and PCI Router cards for BSD/OS, FreeBSD, NetBSD, OPenBSD and Linux Standalone Routers Bandwidth Allocation/Limiter Manager http://www.etinc.com sales@etinc.com (516) 271-4525 From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 15:02:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA01285 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 15:02:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agora.rdrop.com (root@agora.rdrop.com [199.2.210.241]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA01280 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 15:02:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etinc.com (et-gw-fr1.etinc.com [204.141.244.98]) by agora.rdrop.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA08224 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 15:02:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ntws (ntws.etinc.com [204.141.95.142]) by etinc.com (8.8.3/8.6.9) with SMTP id SAA05225; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 18:05:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970710175730.00b07380@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 17:57:33 -0400 To: rcramer@sytex.net From: dennis Subject: Re: T1/T3 Upgrade Options? Cc: isp@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 08:49 AM 7/10/97 -0400, you wrote: >> >> Well, I wasn't going to do this, and probably shouldn't have, but here's >> the situation. We all know that you can use the ET-Inc card or the >> SDL card for T1 routing... But does FreeBSD have ANYTHING available with >> a HSSI interface yet? We've already bought one Cisco 7010 and the $60,000+ > >Yes. Both SDL and DEC have cards available. If you need particulars, or >are not a system integrator, you may email for more particulars. > >> we've spent "configuring" it, (Ie: Base unit, 2 100 Megabit ethernets, and >> one HSSI port) could have been much better spent I think. I would be much >> more willing to "take my chances" on a $55,000 savings versus the ~$500 >> savings your talking between a Cisco 2501 and a FreeBSD router... This should depend on your traffic....a T3 router is carrying a LOT more data and you could be out of business faster also! Just to know that we can do at least 10Mbs on a clocked down T3 via V.35 (Digital link make a CSU)...if you're metered and running full T3 we can't do it (yet). A major factor to consider is that its very difficult to do 86Mbs (T3 is full duplex) with an addon card on the PCI bus because the sustained throughput rate is often pretty low. Other bus masters (ethernets, for example) will futhur reduce the burst capability. While PCI bursts to 128MB/s, very few PC products have sustained throughput rates over 100Mb/s. If you have a 100Mbs ethernet card on the same bus (you'd have to) the number is cut in half. plus bus masters can't be controlled so you have contention issues. Dennis From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 15:08:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA01628 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 15:08:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bob.tri-lakes.net ([207.3.81.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA01622 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 15:08:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [207.3.81.149] by bob.tri-lakes.net (NTMail 3.02.13) with ESMTP id ba224641 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 17:08:17 -0500 Message-ID: <33C5171E.41C67EA6@tri-lakes.net> Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 17:08:46 +0000 From: Chris Dillon X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk spork wrote: > > On Thu, 10 Jul 1997, Robert Shady wrote: > > > To make things better, I would say your best bet if you want to be sure, > > would be to get one of those hard-cards, where you store everything in > > NVRAM and it looks like a very fast hard drive to your computer system. > > > -- Rob > > Do you have any more info on "hard cards"? I've not heard of this, but it > sounds like a perfect solution for routers/firewalls... > > Charles I hadn't thought of that either... :) I have seen ISA cards that did this, but your best bet nowadays may be to buy a PCMCIA flash card and a desktop PCMCIA adapter.. This allows much greater portability and you could switch cards or add another card on the fly. Those cards are a tad expensive, though. I got a 40MB typeIII PCMCIA hard drive for about $20, though. From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 16:00:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA03454 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 16:00:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from laguna.arc.unm.edu (laguna.arc.unm.edu [198.59.173.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA03448; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 16:00:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pegasus.unm.edu (sdn-ts-058txfwoRP14.dialsprint.net [206.133.155.81]) by laguna.arc.unm.edu (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA19738; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 17:00:26 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19970710165919.006c30a4@arc.unm.edu> X-Sender: shawnhsu@arc.unm.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 16:59:19 -0600 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Xu, Xiang" Subject: FreeBSD Book Cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi: Feel that our FreeBSD society need new good books. My name is Xiang Xu. I am an editor in a publishing company by the name of Bigi International Inc. Think many people here are willing to write or are writing books for the FreeBSD society. If you are interested in writing whole or some contents of a FreeBSD book (any topic about FreeBSD will be welcomed), please contact me(shawnhsu@arc.unm.edu). Thanks. Sincerely Xiang Xu (shawnhsu@arc.unm.edu) ================================= Xu, Xiang Bigi International USA Inc. email: shawnhsu@arc.unm.edu http://www.bigiintl.com Tel:(505)830-1443(O), (505)232-8223(H) FAX:(505)830-1448 2501, San Pedro Blvd., N.E. Suite 208 Albuquerque, NM 87110, U.S.A. From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 16:04:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA03707 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 16:04:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agora.rdrop.com (root@agora.rdrop.com [199.2.210.241]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA03694 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 16:04:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lightning.tbe.net (qmailr@lightning.tbe.net [208.208.122.5]) by agora.rdrop.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA13097 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 16:04:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 20229 invoked by uid 1010); 10 Jul 1997 22:57:48 -0000 Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 18:57:48 -0400 (EDT) From: "Gary D. Margiotta" To: Jacob Suter , Ulf Zimmermann , Stephen Roome , shovey@buffnet.net, danf@JadeTech.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > ISP Price for a Livingston OR-HS (T1/E1 capable office router, unlimited > IP's, doesn't do BGP4 but everything else including OSPF) for $649 ISP > price... Nice box based on the 386SX/25 running standard Livingston > ComOS Livingston has had some really buggy code lately...The new ComOS I got for our PM2 still insn't quite right...had 3.3.3 on there for a year, then went to 3.5. Some things don't stay set, and I've heard a lot of people complaining about the beta code they release (although beta releases are called beta for that reason...). I grew unhappy with them recently, otherwise we would've gotten a new PM3. Livingston is ok, but they haven't had as much time for R&D as some others. You would honestly get better performance out of a FreeBSD-made router. -Gary Margiotta TBE Internet Services http://www.tbe.net From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 16:35:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA04804 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 16:35:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agora.rdrop.com (root@agora.rdrop.com [199.2.210.241]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA04790 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 16:35:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from super-g.inch.com (super-g.inch.com [207.240.140.161]) by agora.rdrop.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA15747 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 16:35:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (spork@localhost) by super-g.inch.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA02356; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 19:49:35 GMT Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 19:49:35 +0000 (GMT) From: spork X-Sender: spork@super-g.inch.com To: "Gary D. Margiotta" cc: Jacob Suter , Ulf Zimmermann , Stephen Roome , shovey@buffnet.net, danf@JadeTech.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: your mail In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk If cheap is the word, and the Ascend Pipe 130 makes you cringe, you might want to try a Compatible Systems router (www.compatible.com). We are starting to suggest these to T1 customers that need a cheap router. There is a model that incorporates a T1 CSU for about $1200. It's not the prettiest box, but it is all metal, and it even has an ON/OFF switch! The command line is a nice rip-off of IOS, and the thing runs nice and cool... I would guess it could easily out-perform that little Livingston Box based on a 386 (!?). They have an interesting line of stuff, and you get free support and software for life, and an overnite replacement program during the first x years... Charles On Thu, 10 Jul 1997, Gary D. Margiotta wrote: > > ISP Price for a Livingston OR-HS (T1/E1 capable office router, unlimited > > IP's, doesn't do BGP4 but everything else including OSPF) for $649 ISP > > price... Nice box based on the 386SX/25 running standard Livingston > > ComOS > > Livingston has had some really buggy code lately...The new ComOS I got for > our PM2 still insn't quite right...had 3.3.3 on there for a year, then > went to 3.5. Some things don't stay set, and I've heard a lot of people > complaining about the beta code they release (although beta releases are > called beta for that reason...). I grew unhappy with them recently, > otherwise we would've gotten a new PM3. Livingston is ok, but they > haven't had as much time for R&D as some others. You would honestly get > better performance out of a FreeBSD-made router. > > > -Gary Margiotta > TBE Internet Services > http://www.tbe.net > From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 17:46:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA07069 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 17:46:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tok.qiv.com ([204.214.141.211]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA07058 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 17:45:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by tok.qiv.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with UUCP id TAA03995; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 19:45:33 -0500 (CDT) Received: from localhost (jdn@localhost) by acp.qiv.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA00535; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 19:35:35 -0500 (CDT) X-Authentication-Warning: acp.qiv.com: jdn owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 19:35:34 -0500 (CDT) From: "Jay D. Nelson" To: dave@ns.systemresc.com cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG, ivan@cyclades.com Subject: Re: DCD (fwd) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk What does `stty -a < /dev/whatever' say? Have you tried the distributed getty? -- Jay On Thu, 10 Jul 1997 dave@ns.systemresc.com wrote: -> -> ->---------- Forwarded message ---------- -> ->I'm running Freebsd using cyclom Y 16 port PCI serial device the driver ->was downloaded from Cyclom system and compiled on my system and all ->goes well. Until a user drops carrier. The process usually pppd doesn't ->know they dropped carrier and the modem resetts but you can not dialin. A ->pass message I sent the log file and it has a warning that DCD is low and ->it is starting the login process. -> ->Having said all that...in the info file for mgetty that I use (1.0) it ->says that flat cables can cause DCD not found??? or cables are too long. -> ->Please Please someone have any answers, the modem sees a carrier, yet ->mgetty doesn't, the cyclom device seems to work yet the carrier signal is ->not getting back to mgetty????? -> ->Dave ->dave@systemresc.com -> -> -> From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 20:16:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA12320 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 20:16:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from server1.bisnet.net (bridge.bisnet.net [206.54.226.53]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA12315 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 20:16:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danf@localhost) by server1.bisnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.9) id WAA16348; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 22:20:12 -0500 Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 22:20:12 -0500 (CDT) From: "Daniel C. Fifield" To: spork cc: "Gary D. Margiotta" , Jacob Suter , Ulf Zimmermann , Stephen Roome , shovey@buffnet.net, isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: your mail In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello everyone, This is the guy that put out the original question. I think we got a little side tracked with price. I am looking for the best solution. The way I look at is: I am and ISP and want to provide the most reliable low maintenance solution to my clients. I also want to have experience with the solutions I provide. I do not feel comfortable recommending a FreeBSD box to my clients which have little or no experience administering a UNIX system. The ideal system would allow us to do remote monitoring and administration. So with that said what do you think? Sincerely, Dan On Thu, 10 Jul 1997, spork wrote: > If cheap is the word, and the Ascend Pipe 130 makes you cringe, you might > want to try a Compatible Systems router (www.compatible.com). We are > starting to suggest these to T1 customers that need a cheap router. There > is a model that incorporates a T1 CSU for about $1200. It's not the > prettiest box, but it is all metal, and it even has an ON/OFF switch! > > The command line is a nice rip-off of IOS, and the thing runs nice and > cool... I would guess it could easily out-perform that little Livingston > Box based on a 386 (!?). They have an interesting line of stuff, and you > get free support and software for life, and an overnite replacement > program during the first x years... > > Charles > > On Thu, 10 Jul 1997, Gary D. Margiotta wrote: > > > > ISP Price for a Livingston OR-HS (T1/E1 capable office router, unlimited > > > IP's, doesn't do BGP4 but everything else including OSPF) for $649 ISP > > > price... Nice box based on the 386SX/25 running standard Livingston > > > ComOS > > > > Livingston has had some really buggy code lately...The new ComOS I got for > > our PM2 still insn't quite right...had 3.3.3 on there for a year, then > > went to 3.5. Some things don't stay set, and I've heard a lot of people > > complaining about the beta code they release (although beta releases are > > called beta for that reason...). I grew unhappy with them recently, > > otherwise we would've gotten a new PM3. Livingston is ok, but they > > haven't had as much time for R&D as some others. You would honestly get > > better performance out of a FreeBSD-made router. > > > > > > -Gary Margiotta > > TBE Internet Services > > http://www.tbe.net > > > > From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 21:12:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA14232 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 21:12:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hawk.ois.net.au (mikey@hawk.ois.net.au [203.17.194.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA14224 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 21:12:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (mikey@localhost) by hawk.ois.net.au (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id MAA21527 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 12:14:23 +0800 Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 12:14:23 +0800 (WST) From: Michael Slater To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Squid on FreeBSD 2.1.7 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello, I am using the Squid proxy server, on a FreeBSD machine running version 2.1.7, and i keep getting a kernel message.. syslog squid pid xxx exiting on signal 6 after several hours of operation. And of course, i need to restart squid before things are right again. Anyone else have this sort of problem ? Regards, Michael Slater From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 21:14:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA14298 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 21:14:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lightning.tbe.net (qmailr@lightning.tbe.net [208.208.122.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA14293 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 21:13:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 23451 invoked by uid 1010); 11 Jul 1997 04:08:23 -0000 Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 00:08:23 -0400 (EDT) From: "Gary D. Margiotta" To: "Daniel C. Fifield" cc: spork , Jacob Suter , Ulf Zimmermann , Stephen Roome , shovey@buffnet.net, isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: your mail In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > This is the guy that put out the original question. I think we got a > little side tracked with price. I am looking for the best solution. > > The way I look at is: I am and ISP and want to provide the most reliable > low maintenance solution to my clients. I also want to have experience > with the solutions I provide. I do not feel comfortable recommending a > FreeBSD box to my clients which have little or no experience > administering a UNIX system. The ideal system would allow us to do > remote monitoring and administration. So with that said what do you think? > Yes, we might've gotten a bit sidetracked with it, but price is definately a factor. Price in some people's eyes is a much bigger factor than ease of use...for instance, how many do-it-yourselfers try to save a buck by attempting to do things themselves and end up blowing up the house? IMHO, if you want a reliable box that you just turn on, configure once and leave it alone for a very long time, buy a Cisco...their 1000 series has 1 T1 port, and cost somewhere around $1200-$1300 (last time I checked). We have 2 2501's and they are solid performers. If you want cheaper but very functional, put together a FreeBSD box. -Gary Margiotta TBE Internet Services http://www.tbe.net From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 21:52:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA15948 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 21:52:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.webspan.net (root@mail.webspan.net [206.154.70.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA15943 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 21:52:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.5]) by mail.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id AAA24786; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 00:52:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id AAA14854; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 00:52:19 -0400 (EDT) To: Michael Slater cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: Squid on FreeBSD 2.1.7 In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 11 Jul 1997 12:14:23 +0800." Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 00:52:19 -0400 Message-ID: <14851.868596739@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Michael Slater wrote in message ID : > Hello, > I am using the Squid proxy server, on a FreeBSD machine running > version 2.1.7, and i keep getting a kernel message.. > > syslog squid pid xxx exiting on signal 6 after several hours of > operation. Which version of squid? Some (I can't tell you off the top of my head) are known to be buggy... Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 22:13:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA16728 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 22:13:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy.ois.net.au (proxy.ois.net.au [203.17.194.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA16720; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 22:13:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mikey@localhost) by proxy.ois.net.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA00624; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 13:10:55 +0800 (WST) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 13:10:54 +0800 (WST) From: Michael Slater To: Gary Palmer cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Squid on FreeBSD 2.1.7 In-Reply-To: <14851.868596739@orion.webspan.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 11 Jul 1997, Gary Palmer wrote: > Michael Slater wrote in message ID > : > > Hello, > > I am using the Squid proxy server, on a FreeBSD machine running > > version 2.1.7, and i keep getting a kernel message.. > > > > syslog squid pid xxx exiting on signal 6 after several hours of > > operation. > > Which version of squid? Some (I can't tell you off the top of my head) > are known to be buggy... I just switched to version 1.1.13 , and this error started occuring. I switched back to version 1.1.10 this morning, and it has hasnt happend again, although it's only been a few hours :) regards, Michael Slater > > Gary > -- > Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member > FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info > From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 22:23:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA17294 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 22:23:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA17289 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 22:23:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by alpo.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA13298; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 22:02:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) via SMTP by alpo.whistle.com, id smtpd013296; Fri Jul 11 05:02:03 1997 Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 21:59:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: "Daniel C. Fifield" cc: spork , "Gary D. Margiotta" , Jacob Suter , Ulf Zimmermann , Stephen Roome , shovey@buffnet.net, isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: your mail In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 10 Jul 1997, Daniel C. Fifield wrote: > Hello everyone, > > This is the guy that put out the original question. I think we got a > little side tracked with price. I am looking for the best solution. > > The way I look at is: I am and ISP and want to provide the most reliable > low maintenance solution to my clients. I also want to have experience > with the solutions I provide. I do not feel comfortable recommending a > FreeBSD box to my clients which have little or no experience > administering a UNIX system. The ideal system would allow us to do > remote monitoring and administration. So with that said what do you think? If you like freeBSD and all, then I suggets you look at our web page www.whistle.com for a FreeBSD based turn-key box that does all you want plus more.. (but then I'm biased) julian (julian@freebsd.org) From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Jul 10 23:16:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA19653 for isp-outgoing; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 23:16:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from implode.root.com (implode.root.com [198.145.90.17]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA19648 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 23:16:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA05228; Thu, 10 Jul 1997 23:17:29 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199707110617.XAA05228@implode.root.com> To: dennis cc: rcramer@sytex.net, isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1/T3 Upgrade Options? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 10 Jul 1997 17:57:33 EDT." <3.0.32.19970710175730.00b07380@etinc.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 23:17:29 -0700 Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >A major factor to consider is that its very difficult to do 86Mbs (T3 is >full duplex) >with an addon card on the PCI bus because the sustained throughput rate >is often pretty low. Other bus masters (ethernets, for example) will futhur >reduce the burst capability. While PCI bursts to 128MB/s, very few PC >products have sustained throughput rates over 100Mb/s. If you have a >100Mbs ethernet card on the same bus (you'd have to) the number is >cut in half. plus bus masters can't be controlled so you have contention >issues. You're mixing bits and bytes, Dennis. The PCI bus is capable of 132 MBytes/sec which is 1.056 Gbits/secs. There are no problems at all with the PCI bus being fast enough to handle 2 fast ethernet cards and a few full duplex T3 interfaces. In fact most memory subsystems wouldn't be limiting factor, either. There are problems with having enough CPU power to queue small packets at full rate, however. Just one fast ethernet is capable of about 140,000 packets per second, and you can't even get a third of that rate with a PPro/200. So unless your average packet sizes are large, you won't be able to keep the wire saturated. -DG David Greenman Core-team/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 00:50:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA23956 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 00:50:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from red.jnx.com (red.jnx.com [208.197.169.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA23951 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 00:50:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from chimp.juniper.net (chimp.juniper.net [208.197.169.6]) by red.jnx.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA04727; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 00:49:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tli@localhost) by chimp.juniper.net (8.7.6/8.7.3) id AAA01789; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 00:49:05 -0700 (PDT) To: spork@super-g.com (spork) cc: isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? References: <199707101137.HAA16305@shell.id.net> From: Tony Li Date: 11 Jul 1997 00:49:05 -0700 In-Reply-To: spork@super-g.com's message of 10 Jul 97 17:28:34 GMT Message-ID: <82yb7edo5q.fsf@chimp.juniper.net> Lines: 17 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk spork@super-g.com (spork) writes: > Do you have any more info on "hard cards"? I've not heard of this, but it > sounds like a perfect solution for routers/firewalls... Indeed it is. There are several manufacturers and the double density flash disks are now coming down in price so that this is a practical alternative. Various vendors include SanDisk, M-systems, and Smart Modular. The units emulate small IDE disks. As they are flash, there is an issue about writing to them too many times, so you don't wanna swap if you do this. Mounting the filesystems RO seems like the right thing to do. And because they're small, cramming a distribution into it is interesting.... Tony From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 04:05:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id EAA01931 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 04:05:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hydrogen.nike.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA01919 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 04:05:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.nike.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id EAA18202; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 04:05:06 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970711040506.04604@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 04:05:06 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: David Lowe Cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: INN on an async-mounted spool? References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: ; from David Lowe on Wed, Jul 09, 1997 at 03:01:39PM -0700 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk David Lowe scribbled this message on Jul 9: > Has anyone here tried INN on an async-mounted spool in production? Joe Greco runs a number of news machines... if I remeber correctly he found the increase the sync interval (kern.update) to something like 300 (5 minutes) will give you near the same performance as mounting the fs's async, but give you the stability of sync mount fs... I would highly recommend anybody thinking about setting up a news server to search the mailing lists for Greco and news to read his postings on the subject... you also might want to look at using cdd to give your spools multiple disks to work on... the more spindles the better.. but make sure that the strip size is 32megs (or whatever the size of a cylinder group is) to get the best performance... hope it helps.. ttyl.. -- John-Mark Gurney Modem/FAX: +1 541 683 6954 Cu Networking Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 04:25:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id EAA02562 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 04:25:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bagpuss.visint.co.uk (bagpuss.visint.co.uk [194.207.134.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA02557 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 04:25:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dylan.visint.co.uk (dylan.visint.co.uk [194.207.134.180]) by bagpuss.visint.co.uk (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA22874; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 12:25:09 +0100 (BST) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 12:25:09 +0100 (BST) From: Stephen Roome To: Ulf Zimmermann cc: shovey@buffnet.net, danf@JadeTech.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-Reply-To: <199707091731.KAA12155@Gatekeeper.Alameda.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 9 Jul 1997, Ulf Zimmermann wrote: > > I still really don't understand why folks with only a T1 line insist on > > buying a separate router, we have E1 here and have a dual port serial card > > and a mux. It costs the same to add onto a pc as a Cisco, you still get > > tech support and the PC that runs it doesn't do anything else or fall over > > ever. > > Why ? Because what ever system you run your T1 off, PC or SGI or whatever, > if it is not a dedicated router, people tend to run other services off it. > If you run other services off it, you tend to modify it (for example > reboot). That brings down your whole T1 line. I thought long about it, > as I started with just a Fractional T1 Frame Relay line for myself and > decided at that point to go with a Cisco PC card. It is a complete router, > it just takes power from the PC and a com port emulation for the console > port. Even with this solution I power cycled the box it was in too often. Okay, valid point. =) I think it comes down to whether you chose to reboot the box or not, the only time I've had real downtime on our router is after a power cut, but then the power to the line goes down then at the main box in the street. Personally I don't reboot the PC router or run anything else on it, okay there's a secondary nameserver and that's too much as well, but in the six months since we got our E1 I've only rebooted the router once, and that was to take out the graphics card. It's just a standalone box which plodds happily along now. I suppose it's personal preference then, next time I'm doing this I'll look more carefully at using a Cisco or Livingston or something instead. > If customer ask me today about a standalone router or a PC card, I often > tell them to get a router like the Engage routers. a T1 with CSU version > cost $995 for ISPs. It has no large option in routing protocols, but > as an endpoint, they don't need much. The reason I tell them this, it is > a standalone box. A black box in the corner. No one is going to touch it. On the cost side of things you seem to have a very valid point, although I'm not sure the cost _should_ be an issue for a router for anything more than a 64k line as it's such a small fraction of the cost. Well, in the UK it is anyway. =) -- Steve Roome - Vision Interactive Ltd. Tel:+44(0)117 9730597 Home:+44(0)976 241342 WWW: http://dylan.visint.co.uk/ From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 05:27:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id FAA04454 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 05:27:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.id.net (mail.id.net [199.125.1.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA04449 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 05:27:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from server.id.net (server.id.net [199.125.2.20]) by mail.id.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id IAA20000; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 08:28:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Shady Received: (from rls@localhost) by server.id.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) id IAA18679; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 08:28:00 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199707111228.IAA18679@server.id.net> Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-Reply-To: <82yb7edo5q.fsf@chimp.juniper.net> from Tony Li at "Jul 11, 97 00:49:05 am" To: tli@jnx.com (Tony Li) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 08:28:00 -0400 (EDT) Cc: spork@super-g.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Do you have any more info on "hard cards"? I've not heard of this, but it > > sounds like a perfect solution for routers/firewalls... > > Indeed it is. There are several manufacturers and the double density flash > disks are now coming down in price so that this is a practical > alternative. Various vendors include SanDisk, M-systems, and Smart > Modular. > > The units emulate small IDE disks. As they are flash, there is an issue > about writing to them too many times, so you don't wanna swap if you do > this. Mounting the filesystems RO seems like the right thing to do. And > because they're small, cramming a distribution into it is interesting.... Yes, they are small, but even a 4MB card is plent to run routing services off of. There are several FreeBSD distributions out there that are "router floppies", where you fit everything you need onto a 1.4MB disk (except for gated, which is our problem). So you'd be in heaven with 4MB. -- Rob === _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ Innovative Data Services Serving South-Eastern Michigan Internet Service Provider / Hardware Sales / Consulting Services Voice: (810)855-0404 / Fax: (810)855-3268 / Web: http://www.id.net From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 05:59:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id FAA05571 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 05:59:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.id.net (mail.id.net [199.125.1.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA05562 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 05:58:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from server.id.net (server.id.net [199.125.2.20]) by mail.id.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id IAA20248; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 08:59:05 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Shady Received: (from rls@localhost) by server.id.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) id IAA19275; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 08:59:03 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199707111259.IAA19275@server.id.net> Subject: Re: T1/T3 Upgrade Options? In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19970710175730.00b07380@etinc.com> from dennis at "Jul 10, 97 05:57:33 pm" To: dennis@etinc.com (dennis) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 08:59:03 -0400 (EDT) Cc: rcramer@sytex.net, isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>> Well, I wasn't going to do this, and probably shouldn't have, but here's >>> the situation. We all know that you can use the ET-Inc card or the >>> SDL card for T1 routing... But does FreeBSD have ANYTHING available with >>> a HSSI interface yet? We've already bought one Cisco 7010 and the $60,000+ >> >>Yes. Both SDL and DEC have cards available. If you need particulars, or >>are not a system integrator, you may email for more particulars. Yes, I would like more information please... Does FreeBSD have drivers available for these cards already? Or would we have to code one... > Just to know that we can do at least 10Mbs on a clocked down T3 via V.35 > (Digital link make a CSU)...if you're metered and running full T3 we can't > do it (yet). This completely contradicts what you say below... If a PCI bus can't do T3, why would you make a card that could? > A major factor to consider is that its very difficult to do 86Mbs (T3 is > full duplex) with an addon card on the PCI bus because the sustained > throughput rate is often pretty low. Other bus masters (ethernets, for > example) will futhur reduce the burst capability. While PCI bursts to > 128MB/s, very few PC products have sustained throughput rates over 100Mb/s. > If you have a 100Mbs ethernet card on the same bus (you'd have to) the > number is cut in half. plus bus masters can't be controlled so you have > contention issues. Contention issues I'll agree with for the most part, however.. My calculations are (correct me if I'm wrong): T3 Card = ~12Mbytes/sec [ 45Mbits/sec (each direction), or 90Mbits/sec total] Ether = ~25Mbytes/sec [100Mbits/sec (each direction), or 200Mbits/sec total] ============= ~37Mbytes/sec 132 Mbytes/sec - PCI bus - 37 Mbytes/sec - Interfaces ================ 95 Mbytes/sec - Left to play with. The way I see it, you theoretically could have 3 100 Mbit interfaces AND a T3 card running simultaneously (specially since it's not likely you'll ever push a true 45Mbits/sec each direction on a T3). However, the real problem comes into play trying to find a CPU that can handle that many interrupts per second effeciently. -- Rob === _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ Innovative Data Services Serving South-Eastern Michigan Internet Service Provider / Hardware Sales / Consulting Services Voice: (810)855-0404 / Fax: (810)855-3268 / Web: http://www.id.net From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 08:03:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA13904 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 08:03:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etinc.com (et-gw-fr1.etinc.com [204.141.244.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA13893 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 08:03:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ntws (ntws.etinc.com [204.141.95.142]) by etinc.com (8.8.3/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA11378; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:10:35 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970711110214.00c9e520@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:02:17 -0400 To: dg@root.com From: dennis Subject: Re: T1/T3 Upgrade Options? Cc: isp@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 11:17 PM 7/10/97 -0700, you wrote: >>A major factor to consider is that its very difficult to do 86Mbs (T3 is >>full duplex) >>with an addon card on the PCI bus because the sustained throughput rate >>is often pretty low. Other bus masters (ethernets, for example) will futhur >>reduce the burst capability. While PCI bursts to 128MB/s, very few PC >>products have sustained throughput rates over 100Mb/s. If you have a >>100Mbs ethernet card on the same bus (you'd have to) the number is >>cut in half. plus bus masters can't be controlled so you have contention >>issues. > > You're mixing bits and bytes, Dennis. The PCI bus is capable of >132 MBytes/sec which is 1.056 Gbits/secs. There are no problems at all >with the PCI bus being fast enough to handle 2 fast ethernet cards and >a few full duplex T3 interfaces. In fact most memory subsystems wouldn't >be limiting factor, either. There are problems with having enough CPU >power to queue small packets at full rate, however. Just one fast >ethernet is capable of about 140,000 packets per second, and you can't >even get a third of that rate with a PPro/200. So unless your average >packet sizes are large, you won't be able to keep the wire saturated. Oh, yes, 132, not 128, but I got the Bytes right :-) What your are confusing is "sustained throughput" and "burst rate". Bursts are meaningless, the sustained rate (which you need for a sync interface to avoid transmitter underruns) is the main issue. Do some RAM tests on PCI video and see what you get. Its highly MB dependent as well. Also, note that "fast ethernet cards" are custom ASICs which are capable of single-cycle bursts (required for 132MB/s), which are not nearly possible when using external logic and external devices for the communications (as SDLs board does). Once you start adding wait states, the bus becomes MUCH slower, and with single-cycle burst 100Mb/s ethernet cards stealing the bus whenever it wants, the T3 card (which should be the priority device) becomes secondary. With external RAM on the card (which the SDL card has), the PCI interface becomes much slower, and without it the card has to have guaranteed bus access and a large fifo to keep the transmitter filled. Basically, what I'm saying is that without a single device that handles the bus interface, includes RAM and does the HDLC communications, you cant get ANYWHERE NEAR the full PCI capabiltiy....and I doubt you could get satisfactory results. The math is real easy if you just take the burst rate and divide it up...unfortunately in practice is doesnt work nearly that efficiently. Dennis > >-DG > >David Greenman >Core-team/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project > > From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 08:07:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA14113 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 08:07:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etinc.com (et-gw-fr1.etinc.com [204.141.244.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA14105 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 08:06:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ntws (ntws.etinc.com [204.141.95.142]) by etinc.com (8.8.3/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA11394; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:12:46 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970711110425.00c95ca0@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:04:29 -0400 To: Stephen Roome , Ulf Zimmermann From: dennis Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? Cc: shovey@buffnet.net, danf@JadeTech.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 12:25 PM 7/11/97 +0100, Stephen Roome wrote: >On Wed, 9 Jul 1997, Ulf Zimmermann wrote: >> > I still really don't understand why folks with only a T1 line insist on >> > buying a separate router, we have E1 here and have a dual port serial card >> > and a mux. It costs the same to add onto a pc as a Cisco, you still get >> > tech support and the PC that runs it doesn't do anything else or fall over >> > ever. >> >> Why ? Because what ever system you run your T1 off, PC or SGI or whatever, >> if it is not a dedicated router, people tend to run other services off it. >> If you run other services off it, you tend to modify it (for example >> reboot). That brings down your whole T1 line. I thought long about it, >> as I started with just a Fractional T1 Frame Relay line for myself and >> decided at that point to go with a Cisco PC card. It is a complete router, >> it just takes power from the PC and a com port emulation for the console >> port. Even with this solution I power cycled the box it was in too often. That's cause you we'ren't using the capabilities of your PCs power...the Cisco card is a slow device with its own set of bugs. PCs set up as dedicated router are much more powerful and flexible than standalone routers and typically have long uptimes.... Dennis > >Okay, valid point. =) >I think it comes down to whether you chose to reboot the box or not, the >only time I've had real downtime on our router is after a power cut, but >then the power to the line goes down then at the main box in the street. > >Personally I don't reboot the PC router or run anything else on it, okay >there's a secondary nameserver and that's too much as well, but in the six >months since we got our E1 I've only rebooted the router once, and that >was to take out the graphics card. It's just a standalone box which plodds >happily along now. > >I suppose it's personal preference then, next time I'm doing this I'll >look more carefully at using a Cisco or Livingston or something instead. > >> If customer ask me today about a standalone router or a PC card, I often >> tell them to get a router like the Engage routers. a T1 with CSU version >> cost $995 for ISPs. It has no large option in routing protocols, but >> as an endpoint, they don't need much. The reason I tell them this, it is >> a standalone box. A black box in the corner. No one is going to touch it. > >On the cost side of things you seem to have a very valid point, although >I'm not sure the cost _should_ be an issue for a router for anything more >than a 64k line as it's such a small fraction of the cost. Well, in the UK >it is anyway. =) > >-- >Steve Roome - Vision Interactive Ltd. >Tel:+44(0)117 9730597 Home:+44(0)976 241342 >WWW: http://dylan.visint.co.uk/ > > > From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 08:11:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA14457 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 08:11:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etinc.com (et-gw-fr1.etinc.com [204.141.244.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA14447 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 08:11:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ntws (ntws.etinc.com [204.141.95.142]) by etinc.com (8.8.3/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA11430; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:18:46 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970711111025.00c96100@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:10:28 -0400 To: Robert Shady From: dennis Subject: Re: T1/T3 Upgrade Options? Cc: isp@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 08:59 AM 7/11/97 -0400, you wrote: >>>> Well, I wasn't going to do this, and probably shouldn't have, but here's >>>> the situation. We all know that you can use the ET-Inc card or the >>>> SDL card for T1 routing... But does FreeBSD have ANYTHING available with >>>> a HSSI interface yet? We've already bought one Cisco 7010 and the $60,000+ >>> >>>Yes. Both SDL and DEC have cards available. If you need particulars, or >>>are not a system integrator, you may email for more particulars. > >Yes, I would like more information please... Does FreeBSD have drivers >available for these cards already? Or would we have to code one... > >> Just to know that we can do at least 10Mbs on a clocked down T3 via V.35 >> (Digital link make a CSU)...if you're metered and running full T3 we can't >> do it (yet). > >This completely contradicts what you say below... If a PCI bus can't do >T3, why would you make a card that could? 10Mb/s is a lot different than 43Mb/s.... I didnt say it can't be done, I said its difficult without special technology. Please read another message I send answering David for details.... Dennis > >> A major factor to consider is that its very difficult to do 86Mbs (T3 is >> full duplex) with an addon card on the PCI bus because the sustained >> throughput rate is often pretty low. Other bus masters (ethernets, for >> example) will futhur reduce the burst capability. While PCI bursts to >> 128MB/s, very few PC products have sustained throughput rates over 100Mb/s. >> If you have a 100Mbs ethernet card on the same bus (you'd have to) the >> number is cut in half. plus bus masters can't be controlled so you have >> contention issues. > >Contention issues I'll agree with for the most part, however.. My calculations >are (correct me if I'm wrong): > >T3 Card = ~12Mbytes/sec [ 45Mbits/sec (each direction), or 90Mbits/sec total] >Ether = ~25Mbytes/sec [100Mbits/sec (each direction), or 200Mbits/sec total] > ============= > ~37Mbytes/sec > > 132 Mbytes/sec - PCI bus >- 37 Mbytes/sec - Interfaces >================ > 95 Mbytes/sec - Left to play with. Because you have no clue how the PCI bus really works (and that burst rates are not sustainable), your Math is totally invalid. Remember that ISA is a 64Mb/s medium and if you get 30Mb/s you are lucky....the numbers are even more dramaticly worse when you add bursts to the formula as with PCI. Ah, if life was only as easy as your trivial account of the world! Dennis From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 08:37:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA15716 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 08:37:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.id.net (mail.id.net [199.125.1.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA15708 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 08:37:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from server.id.net (server.id.net [199.125.2.20]) by mail.id.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id LAA21547; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:37:31 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Shady Received: (from rls@localhost) by server.id.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) id LAA22297; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:37:26 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199707111537.LAA22297@server.id.net> Subject: Re: T1/T3 Upgrade Options? In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19970711111025.00c96100@etinc.com> from dennis at "Jul 11, 97 11:10:28 am" To: dennis@etinc.com (dennis) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:37:26 -0400 (EDT) Cc: rls@mail.id.net, isp@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>> A major factor to consider is that its very difficult to do 86Mbs (T3 is >>> full duplex) with an addon card on the PCI bus because the sustained >>> throughput rate is often pretty low. Other bus masters (ethernets, for >>> example) will futhur reduce the burst capability. While PCI bursts to >>> 128MB/s, very few PC products have sustained throughput rates over 100Mb/s. >>> If you have a 100Mbs ethernet card on the same bus (you'd have to) the >>> number is cut in half. plus bus masters can't be controlled so you have >>> contention issues. >> >> Contention issues I'll agree with for the most part, however.. My >> calculations are (correct me if I'm wrong): >> >> T3 Card = ~12Mbytes/sec [ 90Mbits/sec] >> Ether = ~25Mbytes/sec [100Mbits/sec] >> ============= >> ~37Mbytes/sec >> >> 132 Mbytes/sec - PCI bus >> - 37 Mbytes/sec - Interfaces >> ================ >> 95 Mbytes/sec - Left to play with. > > Because you have no clue how the PCI bus really works (and that burst > rates are not sustainable), your Math is totally invalid. > Remember that ISA is a 64Mb/s medium and if you get 30Mb/s you > are lucky....the numbers are even more dramaticly worse when you add > bursts to the formula as with PCI. Invalid? I doubt it... In "real-life", how often do *MOST* T3 connections "sustain" 45Mbit/sec throughput in each direction? In "real-life", how often do ethernet cards "sustain" 100Mbit/sec throughput in each direction? I think my figures are right on the money, however.. Let's assume for a minute that you can only achieve 50% throughput on the PCI bus for whatever reason.. Assuming that the ethernet and the T3 card were running full tilt (Very, very unlikely in most situations) then with 1 ethernet and 1 T3 port you still have ((132Mbytes/2)-37Mbytes) = 29 Mbytes left over just for lolly-gagging around... > Ah, if life was only as easy as your trivial account of the world! This sounds a little bit sarcastic Dennis... This would *really* encourage me to purchase your products. A "Your a dumb-ass, we're not" attitude. -- Rob === _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ Innovative Data Services Serving South-Eastern Michigan Internet Service Provider / Hardware Sales / Consulting Services Voice: (810)855-0404 / Fax: (810)855-3268 / Web: http://www.id.net From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 09:10:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA17271 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 09:10:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from linus.intrastar.net (root@linus.intrastar.net [206.136.25.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA17229 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 09:09:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jake.fuck.org (pmnac1-23.inu.net [208.129.167.25]) by linus.intrastar.net (8.8.5/TerraNovaNet) with ESMTP id LAA03588; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:06:14 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <33C65AFA.684DB59A@linus.intrastar.net> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:10:35 -0500 From: Jacob Suter X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: dennis CC: Ulf Zimmermann , Stephen Roome , shovey@buffnet.net, danf@JadeTech.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <3.0.32.19970710174542.00b08500@etinc.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Well its two seperate markets. Some people do not/will not trust a router card, or it would not be best in their situation. I was just saying its cheap and it works. Not saying that it outperformed anything else. ComOS is really idiot proof, I hear the ET cards aren't quite that easy but easy enough for people that understand FreeBSD and routing. Also, if you are recieving your support from a third party (or your upstream) they may not consider a router card a 'supportable' situation. JS dennis wrote: > At 01:00 PM 7/10/97 -0500, Jacob Suter wrote: > >ISP Price for a Livingston OR-HS (T1/E1 capable office router, > unlimited > >IP's, doesn't do BGP4 but everything else including OSPF) for $649 > ISP > >price... Nice box based on the 386SX/25 running standard Livingston > >ComOS > > A real screamer! ("capable" is the key word here). You could plop a > $795. card into your freebsd box and get expandability and a lot > more horsepower. Even our $530. card will blow away a Livingston. > > Dennis > > > >JS > > > > > >Ulf Zimmermann wrote: > > > >> > On Wed, 9 Jul 1997, Steve Hovey wrote: > >> > > >> > > On Tue, 8 Jul 1997, Daniel C. Fifield wrote: > >> > > > I run an ISP in Wisconsin and we are planning an upgrade from > a > >> 56KB line > >> > > > to a T1 line. My ISP recommends using a CISCO router. I am > >> looking for > >> > > > alternatives and experience using the CICSO router. > >> > > > >> > > I love my ciscos - its all I will use! Not too long ago, we > had a > >> cracker > >> > > attack an older cisco, rendering it useless. Their tech > support > >> stayed on > >> > > the phone and got me upgraded to a new operating system and > >> crackerproofed > >> > > in a very short time! > >> > > >> > CISCO's customer support might be great when one of their pieces > of > >> > equipment begins to show it's age/vulnerability, I'm not sure > >> however that > >> > it's the best advertising or reason to buy a Cisco. > >> > > >> > I still really don't understand why folks with only a T1 line > insist > >> on > >> > buying a separate router, we have E1 here and have a dual port > >> serial card > >> > and a mux. It costs the same to add onto a pc as a Cisco, you > still > >> get > >> > tech support and the PC that runs it doesn't do anything else or > >> fall over > >> > ever. > >> > >> Why ? Because what ever system you run your T1 off, PC or SGI or > >> whatever, > >> if it is not a dedicated router, people tend to run other services > off > >> it. > >> If you run other services off it, you tend to modify it (for > example > >> reboot). That brings down your whole T1 line. I thought long about > it, > >> > >> as I started with just a Fractional T1 Frame Relay line for myself > and > >> > >> decided at that point to go with a Cisco PC card. It is a complete > >> router, > >> it just takes power from the PC and a com port emulation for the > >> console > >> port. Even with this solution I power cycled the box it was in too > >> often. > >> > >> If customer ask me today about a standalone router or a PC card, I > >> often > >> tell them to get a router like the Engage routers. a T1 with CSU > >> version > >> cost $995 for ISPs. It has no large option in routing protocols, > but > >> as an endpoint, they don't need much. The reason I tell them this, > it > >> is > >> a standalone box. A black box in the corner. No one is going to > touch > >> it. > >> > >> > > >> > Besides, why learn how to use a Cisco router, when you can have a > > >> *BSD box > >> > do it for you for the same price/cheaper, but with a lot less > hassle > >> if it > >> > goes wrong. > >> > > >> > Check out www.etinc.com and www.sdlcomm.com to name two. > >> > > >> > Anyway, > >> > > >> > Steve Roome - Vision Interactive Ltd. > >> > Tel:+44(0)117 9730597 Home:+44(0)976 241342 > >> > WWW: http://dylan.visint.co.uk/ > >> > > >> > > >> > >> Ulf. > >> > >> ---- > >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> Ulf Zimmermann, 1525 Pacific Ave., Alameda, CA-94501, #: > 510-769-2936 > >> Alameda Networks, Inc. | http://www.Alameda.net | Fax#: > 510-521-5073 > > > > > > > > > > > Emerging Technologies, Inc. > Quad, Dual and Single Port > ISA and PCI Router cards for BSD/OS, FreeBSD, > NetBSD, OPenBSD and Linux > Standalone Routers > Bandwidth Allocation/Limiter Manager > http://www.etinc.com > sales@etinc.com > (516) 271-4525 From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 09:12:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA17530 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 09:12:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com (critter.phk.freebsd.dk [195.8.129.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA17517; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 09:12:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.dk.tfs.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA07444; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 17:26:26 +0200 (CEST) To: Bruce Evans cc: phk@dk.tfs.com, danny@panda.hilink.com.au, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG, sdudley@byterunner.com From: Poul-Henning Kamp Subject: Re: Configuring Byterunner TC-800 high speed 8-port serial card In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 11 Jul 1997 01:55:39 +1000." <199707101555.BAA11291@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 17:26:26 +0200 Message-ID: <7442.868634786@critter.dk.tfs.com> Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199707101555.BAA11291@godzilla.zeta.org.au>, Bruce Evans writes: >>Speaking from experience: a correctly configured board fails the test#3 >>after a crash. Don't ask me why, but it is correctly configured, and >>I have verified the circuitry on the card myself, to make sure that it >>was possible to share the IRQs with this card. > >Does OUT2 (aka MCR_IENABLE) disconnect the UARTs individually, as is >required for the non-AST multiport case? The card has 4 separate chips, genuine NS16550AN even, and at the irq output of each chip is an open-collector driver, the output of these are run to a forest of jumpers, where they in this case all end up on the same line, which goes to a 3-state driver and on via another jumper forest to IRQ-10 on the ISA bus. There is in other words nothing common for the chips, except the address decode & the above mentioned IRQ routing circuit. >For the non-multiport case, I have seen some cases where test #3 fails >but then succeeds when retried from ddb after a few seconds. This may >have something to do with the fifo not being initialized early. I've >only seen it after crashes. I've only seen this problem after crashes too. I have tried declaring the master on the first or the last port, and if I remember right, one of the settings is slightly less prone to fail, but right now I can't remember which. I can check this fact if it seems important to you... -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Power and ignorance is a disgusting cocktail. From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 09:15:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA17737 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 09:15:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agora.rdrop.com (root@agora.rdrop.com [199.2.210.241]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA17726 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 09:15:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from linus.intrastar.net (root@linus.intrastar.net [206.136.25.19]) by agora.rdrop.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA11472 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 09:14:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jake.fuck.org (pmnac1-23.inu.net [208.129.167.25]) by linus.intrastar.net (8.8.5/TerraNovaNet) with ESMTP id LAA03621; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:11:57 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <33C65C4F.CFCC9854@linus.intrastar.net> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:16:16 -0500 From: Jacob Suter X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Gary D. Margiotta" CC: Ulf Zimmermann , Stephen Roome , shovey@buffnet.net, danf@JadeTech.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I had some 'stupid' errors, I reset the Flash and set it back up with 3.5. Mine has been stable for nearly 4 months now. It had been up for nearly a month and it went down last week because I changed which power-strip it was on... I really really thing Livingston should have said something about flashing just to be 'safe' on the 3.3 -> 3.5 upgrade. JS Gary D. Margiotta wrote: > > ISP Price for a Livingston OR-HS (T1/E1 capable office router, > unlimited > > IP's, doesn't do BGP4 but everything else including OSPF) for $649 > ISP > > price... Nice box based on the 386SX/25 running standard Livingston > > > ComOS > > Livingston has had some really buggy code lately...The new ComOS I got > for > our PM2 still insn't quite right...had 3.3.3 on there for a year, then > > went to 3.5. Some things don't stay set, and I've heard a lot of > people > complaining about the beta code they release (although beta releases > are > called beta for that reason...). I grew unhappy with them recently, > otherwise we would've gotten a new PM3. Livingston is ok, but they > haven't had as much time for R&D as some others. You would honestly > get > better performance out of a FreeBSD-made router. > > -Gary Margiotta > TBE Internet Services > http://www.tbe.net From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 09:28:12 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA18543 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 09:28:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp1.ts.kiev.ua (viking.ts.kiev.ua [193.124.229.195]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA18509 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 09:27:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aviion.ts.kiev.ua by smtp1.ts.kiev.ua with SMTP id SAA27597; (8.8.3/zah/2.1) Fri, 11 Jul 1997 18:51:21 +0300 (EET DST) Received: from nbki.ipri.kiev.ua by aviion.ts.kiev.ua with ESMTP id PAA02799; (8.6.11/zah/2.1) Fri, 11 Jul 1997 15:56:56 GMT Received: from cki.ipri.kiev.ua by nbki.ipri.kiev.ua with ESMTP id RAA18089; (8.6.9/zah/1.1) Fri, 11 Jul 1997 17:34:14 +0100 Received: from 194.44.146.14 (mac.ipri.kiev.ua [194.44.146.14]) by cki.ipri.kiev.ua (8.7.6/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA04234; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 17:35:07 +0300 (EET DST) Message-ID: <33C636F2.3328@cki.ipri.kiev.ua> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 16:36:42 +0300 From: Ruslan Shevchenko Reply-To: rssh@cki.ipri.kiev.ua Organization: IPRI X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Macintosh; I; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Michael Slater CC: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: More than 64 Megs References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Michael Slater wrote: > > Hello, > I recently built a FreeBSD box with 128 Megs of ram. > I can only get it to recognize the first 64 megs. > > Anyone know how to solve this problem ? > kernel options MAXMEMSIZE (look at /usr/src/sys/i386/conf/LINT) for list of options, and read chapters about kernel configuring in FAQ. > regards, > > Michael Slater From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 09:43:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA19541 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 09:43:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from virtualmarketing.com (email.virtualmarketing.com [207.7.29.253]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA19535 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 09:43:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ntserver2 (207.7.29.107) by virtualmarketing.com with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 1.2b2); Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:43:47 -0600 Message-ID: <33C6629D.BD085D6@v-m.com> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:43:10 -0500 From: Marcin Pasek Reply-To: marcin@v-m.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: isp@FreeBSD.ORG, ntisp@emerald.iea.com Subject: Using NT of FreeBSD as a Communication Server. X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I was wondering if anyone is doing this or if anyone tried to setup a communication server based on NT or FreeBSD that would work like a normal communication server and used radius authentication. Thanks Marcin From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 10:13:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA21911 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 10:13:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from red.jnx.com (red.jnx.com [208.197.169.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA21896 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 10:13:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from chimp.juniper.net (chimp.juniper.net [208.197.169.6]) by red.jnx.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA29840; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 10:12:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tli@localhost) by chimp.juniper.net (8.7.6/8.7.3) id KAA02961; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 10:11:11 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 10:11:11 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199707111711.KAA02961@chimp.juniper.net> From: Tony Li To: rls@mail.id.net CC: spork@super-g.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: <199707111228.IAA18679@server.id.net> (message from Robert Shady on Fri, 11 Jul 1997 08:28:00 -0400 (EDT)) Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Yes, they are small, but even a 4MB card is plent to run routing services off of. There are several FreeBSD distributions out there that are "router floppies", where you fit everything you need onto a 1.4MB disk (except for gated, which is our problem). So you'd be in heaven with 4MB. Well, you're better than I am. ;-) In trying to get kernel, gated, basic Unix utilities, and remote access utilties (what, you wanna WALK to your router?) into a single place, I came up a wee bit bigger. In any case the flash disks run up to 190MB or so. Enough for a distribution, but not enough to have things vanilla. Tony From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 11:24:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA26247 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:24:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ns.NL.net (ns.NL.net [193.78.240.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA26242 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:24:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jaknl by ns.NL.net (5.65b/NLnet1.3) id AA13980; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 20:12:04 +0200 Received: from pp200-1 ([192.168.0.200]) by jak.nl (8.8.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id UAA00378 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 20:14:34 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <33C6780A.323C0F7B@jak.nl> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 20:14:34 +0200 From: Jan A Knepper Reply-To: Jan@jak.nl X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (WinNT; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.org Subject: Two domains with UUCP e-mail X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I've got the following problem: Right now I have one machine running FreeBSD and serving as an e-mail gateway. The 'domainname' is 'jak.nl'. Everything works just fine. The systems dials to the provider evey hour, exchanges the e-mail and users are able to handle their e-mail on NT-workstations using Netscape Mail. Now I have got a second domainname 'knp.nl'. I need to run the e-mail for this second domain at the same system as 'jak.nl'. I have resolved it so far that a symbolic link is made as '/etc/uucp' are made before 'uucico' runs. Also the 'domainname' is changed. The next step however is that I want to have a user 'john' on 'jak.nl' and a user 'john' at 'knp.nl'. These users will have to be different persons! Is there anyway to resolve this problem. Is there a different (better) way to setup a system which serves more than one uucp e-mail domain? Thanks Jan From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 12:00:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA28138 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 12:00:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from patrick.interlog.com (patrick.interlog.com [206.108.68.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA28087 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:59:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (patrick@localhost) by patrick.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA00654; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 15:01:04 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: patrick.interlog.com: patrick owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 15:01:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Patrick McConnell To: Jan A Knepper cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Two domains with UUCP e-mail In-Reply-To: <33C6780A.323C0F7B@jak.nl> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: MULTIPART/MIXED; BOUNDARY="0-1543173487-868647662=:618" Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. Send mail to mime@docserver.cac.washington.edu for more info. --0-1543173487-868647662=:618 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Jan, I've attached a file I found in the FreeBSD mailing list archives. I found it helpful in setting up mail for virtual hosts. Patrick On Fri, 11 Jul 1997, Jan A Knepper wrote: > Hi, > > > I've got the following problem: > > Right now I have one machine running FreeBSD and serving as an e-mail > gateway. The 'domainname' is 'jak.nl'. > Everything works just fine. The systems dials to the provider evey hour, > exchanges the e-mail and users are able to handle their e-mail on > NT-workstations using Netscape Mail. > > Now I have got a second domainname 'knp.nl'. > I need to run the e-mail for this second domain at the same system as > 'jak.nl'. > > I have resolved it so far that a symbolic link is made as '/etc/uucp' > are made before 'uucico' runs. > Also the 'domainname' is changed. > > The next step however is that I want to have a user 'john' on 'jak.nl' > and a user 'john' at 'knp.nl'. These users will have to be different > persons! > Is there anyway to resolve this problem. > > Is there a different (better) way to setup a system which serves more > than one uucp e-mail domain? > > Thanks > Jan > > > > -- Patrick McConnell (patrick@interlog.com) Finger info: http://www.interlog.com/~patrick/finger "640k ought to be enough for anybody." -Bill Gates, 1981 --0-1543173487-868647662=:618 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; name="sendmail-virtual.txt" Content-Transfer-Encoding: BASE64 Content-ID: Content-Description: V2hhdCB5b3Ugd2lsbCBuZWVkIHRvIGRvIGlzIGZpcnN0IG1vZGlmeQ0Kc2Vu ZG1haWwuY2YgdG8gZGVhbCB3aXRoIHR3byANCmRhdGFiYXNlcyBpbiB0aGUg L2V0YyBkaXJlY3RvcnkgdGhhdCB3aWxsIGhhbmRsZQ0KdGhlIGFsaWFzaW5n Lg0KDQphZGQgdGhlc2UgdHdvIGxpbmVzIHRvIHNlbmRtYWlsLmNmDQoNCkt2 aXJ0dWFsaG9zdHMgYnRyZWUgL2V0Yy92aXJ0dWFsaG9zdHMuZGINCkt2aXJ0 dWFsbWFzcXMgYnRyZWUgL2V0Yy92aXJ0dWFsbWFzcXMuZGINCg0KYWRkIHRo aXMgcnVsZSBzZXQgZm9yIHRoZSByZXR1cm4gbWFpbCBtYXNxDQoNClM0MA0K 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KioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioq KioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioNCg0K --0-1543173487-868647662=:618-- From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 13:07:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA01026 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 13:07:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA01017 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 13:07:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by alpo.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA06320; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:58:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) via SMTP by alpo.whistle.com, id smtpd006310; Fri Jul 11 18:58:07 1997 Message-ID: <33C681D9.19A13460@whistle.com> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 11:56:25 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Tony Li CC: rls@mail.id.net, spork@super-g.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? References: <199707111711.KAA02961@chimp.juniper.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Tony Li wrote: > > Yes, they are small, but even a 4MB card is plent to run routing services > off of. There are several FreeBSD distributions out there that are > "router floppies", where you fit everything you need onto a 1.4MB disk > (except for gated, which is our problem). So you'd be in heaven with 4MB. > > Well, you're better than I am. ;-) In trying to get kernel, gated, basic > Unix utilities, and remote access utilties (what, you wanna WALK to your > router?) into a single place, I came up a wee bit bigger. > > In any case the flash disks run up to 190MB or so. Enough for a > distribution, but not enough to have things vanilla. > > Tony Use 'crunch' like the boot floppy does. you can fit almost the whole of /bin, and /usr/bin in 4MB using that. From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 14:12:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA03739 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 14:12:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etinc.com (et-gw-fr1.etinc.com [204.141.244.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA03733 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 14:12:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ntws (ntws.etinc.com [204.141.95.142]) by etinc.com (8.8.3/8.6.9) with SMTP id RAA13873; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 17:20:02 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970711171140.00e09220@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 17:11:43 -0400 To: Robert Shady From: dennis Subject: Re: T1/T3 Upgrade Options? Cc: isp@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 11:37 AM 7/11/97 -0400, you wrote: >>>> A major factor to consider is that its very difficult to do 86Mbs (T3 is >>>> full duplex) with an addon card on the PCI bus because the sustained >>>> throughput rate is often pretty low. Other bus masters (ethernets, for >>>> example) will futhur reduce the burst capability. While PCI bursts to >>>> 128MB/s, very few PC products have sustained throughput rates over 100Mb/s. >>>> If you have a 100Mbs ethernet card on the same bus (you'd have to) the >>>> number is cut in half. plus bus masters can't be controlled so you have >>>> contention issues. >>> >>> Contention issues I'll agree with for the most part, however.. My >>> calculations are (correct me if I'm wrong): >>> >>> T3 Card = ~12Mbytes/sec [ 90Mbits/sec] >>> Ether = ~25Mbytes/sec [100Mbits/sec] >>> ============= >>> ~37Mbytes/sec >>> >>> 132 Mbytes/sec - PCI bus >>> - 37 Mbytes/sec - Interfaces >>> ================ >>> 95 Mbytes/sec - Left to play with. >> >> Because you have no clue how the PCI bus really works (and that burst >> rates are not sustainable), your Math is totally invalid. >> Remember that ISA is a 64Mb/s medium and if you get 30Mb/s you >> are lucky....the numbers are even more dramaticly worse when you add >> bursts to the formula as with PCI. > >Invalid? I doubt it... In "real-life", how often do *MOST* T3 connections >"sustain" 45Mbit/sec throughput in each direction? this depends on who your selling to. If you're building a card for little weenie ISPs who only have 4Mb/s requirements, then maybe. But I think that big ISPs have pretty busy links, and we're only talking about 2 or 3 large, consecutive packets to potentially have a problem. >In "real-life", how >often do ethernet cards "sustain" 100Mbit/sec throughput in each direction? >I think my figures are right on the money, however.. Let's assume for a >minute that you can only achieve 50% throughput on the PCI bus for whatever >reason.. Assuming that the ethernet and the T3 card were running full tilt >(Very, very unlikely in most situations) then with 1 ethernet and 1 T3 port >you still have ((132Mbytes/2)-37Mbytes) = 29 Mbytes left over just for >lolly-gagging around... "Bursts" are typically only a few words, so the rate you are using is just totally invalid for this computation. 50% is still pretty good (sustained 2 cycle accesses)...and still bursts so only a few words...... > >> Ah, if life was only as easy as your trivial account of the world! > >This sounds a little bit sarcastic Dennis... This would *really* encourage >me to purchase your products. A "Your a dumb-ass, we're not" attitude. Its very sarcastic :-) YOU'RE the one with the "you dont know what you're talking about" attitude, which is OK if you're right, but you're not. Have you designed a PCI card lately? Dennis From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 14:18:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA03956 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 14:18:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etinc.com (et-gw-fr1.etinc.com [204.141.244.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA03951 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 14:18:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ntws (ntws.etinc.com [204.141.95.142]) by etinc.com (8.8.3/8.6.9) with SMTP id RAA13922; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 17:25:35 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970711171713.00e01550@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 17:17:16 -0400 To: Julian Elischer , Tony Li From: dennis Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? Cc: rls@mail.id.net, spork@super-g.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 11:56 AM 7/11/97 -0700, Julian Elischer wrote: >Tony Li wrote: >> >> Yes, they are small, but even a 4MB card is plent to run routing services >> off of. There are several FreeBSD distributions out there that are >> "router floppies", where you fit everything you need onto a 1.4MB disk >> (except for gated, which is our problem). So you'd be in heaven with 4MB. >> >> Well, you're better than I am. ;-) In trying to get kernel, gated, basic >> Unix utilities, and remote access utilties (what, you wanna WALK to your >> router?) into a single place, I came up a wee bit bigger. >> >> In any case the flash disks run up to 190MB or so. Enough for a >> distribution, but not enough to have things vanilla. >> >> Tony > >Use 'crunch' like the boot floppy does. >you can fit almost the whole of /bin, and /usr/bin in 4MB using that. > You guys crack me up! I get more video and ethernet card failures that hard drive failures on a router........why not try to build one without a power supply....that will really increase your uptime! Most ppl can't keep freebsd up anywhere near as long as 1/10th the MTBF of an IDE drive, so what are you beating your brains out for? Dennis From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 14:26:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA04325 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 14:26:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from red.jnx.com (red.jnx.com [208.197.169.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA04320 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 14:26:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from chimp.juniper.net (chimp.juniper.net [208.197.169.6]) by red.jnx.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA07347; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 14:24:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tli@localhost) by chimp.juniper.net (8.7.6/8.7.3) id OAA03561; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 14:23:57 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 14:23:57 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199707112123.OAA03561@chimp.juniper.net> From: Tony Li To: dennis@etinc.com CC: julian@whistle.com, tli@jnx.com, rls@mail.id.net, spork@super-g.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: <3.0.32.19970711171713.00e01550@etinc.com> (message from dennis on Fri, 11 Jul 1997 17:17:16 -0400) Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Most ppl can't keep freebsd up anywhere near as long as 1/10th the MTBF of an IDE drive, so what are you beating your brains out for? We're not 'most people'. ;-) Tony From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 14:27:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA04397 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 14:27:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etinc.com (et-gw-fr1.etinc.com [204.141.244.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA04392 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 14:27:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ntws (ntws.etinc.com [204.141.95.142]) by etinc.com (8.8.3/8.6.9) with SMTP id RAA14000 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 17:34:38 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970711172616.00df5100@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 17:26:19 -0400 To: isp@freebsd.org From: dennis Subject: 4 Intel 100/Bs in a box Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Anyone doing this successfully? Dennis From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 14:52:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA05404 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 14:52:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from biggusdiskus.flyingfox.com (biggusdiskus.flyingfox.com [206.14.52.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA05399 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 14:52:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jas@localhost) by biggusdiskus.flyingfox.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA01684; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 14:51:05 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 14:51:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Shankland Message-Id: <199707112151.OAA01684@biggusdiskus.flyingfox.com> To: dennis@etinc.com Subject: Re: 4 Intel 100/Bs in a box Cc: isp@freebsd.org Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Anyone doing this successfully? Yes. Jim Shankland Flying Fox Computer Systems, Inc. From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 15:28:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA07068 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 15:28:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.webspan.net (root@mail.webspan.net [206.154.70.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA07010 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 15:28:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.5]) by mail.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id SAA16564; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 18:27:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id SAA07025; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 18:27:54 -0400 (EDT) To: dennis cc: Julian Elischer , Tony Li , rls@mail.id.net, spork@super-g.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 11 Jul 1997 17:17:16 EDT." <3.0.32.19970711171713.00e01550@etinc.com> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 18:27:54 -0400 Message-ID: <7022.868660074@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk dennis wrote in message ID <3.0.32.19970711171713.00e01550@etinc.com>: > I get more video and ethernet card failures that hard drive failures > on a router........why not try to build one without a power > supply....that will really increase your uptime! Why does a router need a video card? Seems that you aren't doing the `right thing' and reducing the number of `critical' components. Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 16:05:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA08691 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 16:05:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etinc.com (et-gw-fr1.etinc.com [204.141.244.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA08685 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 16:05:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ntws (ntws.etinc.com [204.141.95.142]) by etinc.com (8.8.3/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA14686 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 19:12:42 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970711190420.00f0d460@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 19:04:23 -0400 To: isp@freebsd.org From: dennis Subject: Re: T1/T3? - back to the subject Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Anyway, if you want to have a great router, cheap, and still solve your bandwidth requirements (if you are not Too big).... 1) find a provider that sells "clocked down" T3. This is when they run a T3 to your location but set the CSUs on both ends to a fractional rate. This effectively allows you to upgrade in (typically) 2 Meg increments, depending on the service that they provide. CRL is one of the providers, I believe, that offers this. 2) Use FreeBSD with our PCI board and you'll be set up to (at least) 10Mbs, probably 12 or 14. You'll also need a Fractional T3 CSU with a V.35 port, Digital Link makes one...probably others also. So for Under $4000 you have a fast router with up to 12Mb/s of backbone bandwidth..... Dennis From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 18:48:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA13944 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 18:48:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.denverweb.net (root@sdn-ts-005coauroP09.dialsprint.net [206.133.160.92]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA13939 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 18:48:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion (blaine@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.denverweb.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA03007 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 19:45:43 -0600 Message-ID: <33C6E1C6.4817DF24@denverweb.net> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 19:45:42 -0600 From: Blaine Minazzi Organization: What, me organized? X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (X11; I; Linux 2.0.27 i486) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: T1/T3 Upgrade Options? References: <199707111537.LAA22297@server.id.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Invalid? I doubt it... In "real-life", how often do *MOST* T3 connections > "sustain" 45Mbit/sec throughput in each direction? In "real-life", how > often do ethernet cards "sustain" 100Mbit/sec throughput in each direction? > I think my figures are right on the money, however.. Let's assume for a > minute that you can only achieve 50% throughput on the PCI bus for whatever > reason.. Assuming that the ethernet and the T3 card were running full tilt > (Very, very unlikely in most situations) then with 1 ethernet and 1 T3 port > you still have ((132Mbytes/2)-37Mbytes) = 29 Mbytes left over just for > lolly-gagging around... > > > Ah, if life was only as easy as your trivial account of the world! Even simpler. In "real-life" if you really _NEED_ a T-3, you obviously have the customer base to support it. That also implies that you business is big enough to buy the kind of equipment that can properly handle it, and your most likely _not_ going to try and save a few bucks when that much is riding on uptime. If you can afford a frigging T-3, you sure as hell can afford a cisco to handle the traffic. If you can't afford the cisco, then you are so undercapitalized chances are slim you will survive a few more months. You could also dig the panama canal with a shovel, but why would you really want to? The "sustained thoughput" argument is weak. If you pay for that kind of bandwidth, then try and save a few dollars by putting hardware on the end that cannot handle the capacity of the line, your a damn fool, IMO. There is a lot of "expensive frugality" on this thread. I see it in customers all the time. Many are so concerned with the hardware or upfront cost of a project, they never look at the big picture. Oh well, just my 60K worth. Blaine From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 19:00:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA14361 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 19:00:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from palm.bythehand.net ([208.219.234.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA14356 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 19:00:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 752 invoked from network); 12 Jul 1997 01:56:40 -0000 Received: from port4.go-pc.com (HELO bc.bythehand.net) (206.20.105.143) by palm.bythehand.net with SMTP; 12 Jul 1997 01:56:40 -0000 Message-ID: <33C6E533.43A@bythehand.net> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 22:00:19 -0400 From: Bernard Courtney Reply-To: bc@bythehand.net Organization: Internet Creations By The Hand X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: dennis CC: isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: T1/T3? - back to the subject References: <3.0.32.19970711190420.00f0d460@etinc.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk dennis wrote: > > Anyway, if you want to have a great router, cheap, and still solve your > bandwidth requirements (if you are not Too big).... > > 1) find a provider that sells "clocked down" T3. This is when they > run a T3 to your location but set the CSUs on both ends to a fractional > rate. This effectively allows you to upgrade in (typically) 2 Meg increments, > depending on the service that they provide. CRL is one of the providers, > I believe, that offers this. > > 2) Use FreeBSD with our PCI board and you'll be set up to (at least) > 10Mbs, probably 12 or 14. You'll also need a Fractional T3 CSU with a > V.35 port, Digital Link makes one...probably others also. > > So for Under $4000 you have a fast router with up to 12Mb/s of backbone > bandwidth..... > > Dennis So does UUNET (http://www.uu.net/) -- Bernard J. Courtney bc@bythehand.net Internet Creations By The Hand Phone: (800) 757-1903 Fax: (201) 946-0034 WWW: http://www.bythehand.net From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 19:57:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA15882 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 19:57:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.webspan.net (root@mail.webspan.net [206.154.70.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA15874 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 19:57:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.5]) by mail.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id WAA19943; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 22:57:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id WAA02394; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 22:57:49 -0400 (EDT) To: John-Mark Gurney cc: David Lowe , freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: INN on an async-mounted spool? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 11 Jul 1997 04:05:06 PDT." <19970711040506.04604@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 22:57:49 -0400 Message-ID: <2392.868676269@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk John-Mark Gurney wrote in message ID <19970711040506.04604@hydrogen.nike.efn.org>: > Joe Greco runs a number of news machines... if I remeber correctly he > found the increase the sync interval (kern.update) to something like > 300 (5 minutes) will give you near the same performance as mounting > the fs's async, but give you the stability of sync mount fs... Really? Thats surprising. Async mounts don't flush out file metadata until sync() is called (from memory). Increasing the kern.update time on a non-async mount just decreases the frequency that file buffers are flushed. I'd have thought the no-metadata updates would have been a big win for a news server, especially when you are writing out >>8 articles/sec. noatime is an even bigger win (for reader boxes) > I would highly recommend anybody thinking about setting up a news > server to search the mailing lists for Greco and news to read his > postings on the subject... Indeed Joe has many pearls of wisdom to impart on the subject. :) > you also might want to look at using cdd to give your spools multiple > disks to work on... the more spindles the better.. but make sure that > the strip size is 32megs (or whatever the size of a cylinder group is) > to get the best performance... Just a note here: I'm not *100%* sure that a 32Mb stripe size is right. While on the face of it Joe's arguments in support of it make sense, I have yet to see any figures to support his assertions. I agree 100% that small stripes, as used by hardware controllers (e.g. 4 or 8k) are useless in the face of a full feed (unless you happen to stripe more drives together than most people see in a year). I just think 32Mb is going a bit too far in the other direction. If you are looking for a pure feed box, striping is no longer a win. You need to go to a radically different filesystem layout than what inn uses by default these days. e.g. the cyclical filesystem, or various others I've heard of which use the system clock as a base for pathnames to increase the localization of reference. Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 20:28:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA16708 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 20:28:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from berlin.atlantic.net (root@berlin.atlantic.net [204.215.255.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA16703 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 20:28:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rio.atlantic.net (cbw@rio.atlantic.net [204.215.255.3]) by berlin.atlantic.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA14904 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 23:45:35 -0400 Received: from localhost (cbw@localhost) by rio.atlantic.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA25878 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 23:28:40 -0400 Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 23:28:40 -0400 (EDT) From: Chris Wilson To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Second SCSI controller in news server Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I just dropped a second NCR SCSI controller with one drive on it into my news reader box. The kernel probes it out OK, and sees the drive. When I try to disklabel the drive, however, I get a: disklabel: ioctl DIOCGDINFO: Invalid argument Is there anything funky I need to do to the device file since this drive is hanging off the second controller? Thanks! Chris Chris Wilson (CW40) | "What was your username again?" Internet Connect Company | You'd think they'd learn. Sales: 800-422-2936 Support: 800-921-9328 | http://www.atlantic.net From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 20:47:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA17308 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 20:47:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.id.net (mail.id.net [199.125.1.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA17303 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 20:47:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from server.id.net (server.id.net [199.125.2.20]) by mail.id.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id XAA27047; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 23:47:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Shady Received: (from rls@localhost) by server.id.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) id XAA05963; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 23:47:32 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199707120347.XAA05963@server.id.net> Subject: Re: 4 Intel 100/Bs in a box In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19970711172616.00df5100@etinc.com> from dennis at "Jul 11, 97 05:26:19 pm" To: dennis@etinc.com (dennis) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 23:47:32 -0400 (EDT) Cc: isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Anyone doing this successfully? We've got 3 Intel 100B's and 2 Western Digital Ultra-16's... Close ;) -- Rob === _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ Innovative Data Services Serving South-Eastern Michigan Internet Service Provider / Hardware Sales / Consulting Services Voice: (810)855-0404 / Fax: (810)855-3268 / Web: http://www.id.net From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 21:30:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA18748 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 21:30:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.8.15.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA18743 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 21:30:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA20954; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 14:27:58 +1000 (EST) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 14:27:58 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: Tony Li cc: Julian Elischer , rls@mail.id.net, spork@super-g.com, isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19970711171713.00e01550@etinc.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 11 Jul 1997, dennis wrote: > At 11:56 AM 7/11/97 -0700, Julian Elischer wrote: > >Tony Li wrote: > >> > >> Yes, they are small, but even a 4MB card is plent to run routing > services > >> off of. There are several FreeBSD distributions out there that are > >> "router floppies", where you fit everything you need onto a 1.4MB disk > >> (except for gated, which is our problem). So you'd be in heaven with > 4MB. > >> > >> Well, you're better than I am. ;-) In trying to get kernel, gated, basic > >> Unix utilities, and remote access utilties (what, you wanna WALK to your > >> router?) into a single place, I came up a wee bit bigger. > >> > >> In any case the flash disks run up to 190MB or so. Enough for a > >> distribution, but not enough to have things vanilla. > >> > >> Tony > > > >Use 'crunch' like the boot floppy does. > >you can fit almost the whole of /bin, and /usr/bin in 4MB using that. What I've been toying with recently is the idea of a kernel with a MFS running in 16 or 24 MB RAM, booted from a floppy. You can get a boot floppy to configure the ethernet and establish basic routes, and then use fetch to retrieve things like gated and sshd into the MFS. A machine configured as 8 MB RAM, 8 MB swap and 8 MB MFS should have enough utilities to run a router which can be remotely administered. /* Daniel O'Callaghan */ /* HiLink Internet danny@hilink.com.au */ /* FreeBSD - works hard, plays hard... danny@freebsd.org */ From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 21:42:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA19372 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 21:42:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Wicked.eaznet.com ([206.62.254.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA19366 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 21:42:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Eddie.eaznet.com ([206.62.254.174]) by Wicked.eaznet.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA10448 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 21:44:34 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <33C6CC2C.F1B@eaznet.com> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 17:13:32 -0700 From: Eddie Fry Organization: Creative Solutions X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: T1/T3 Upgrade Options? References: <3.0.32.19970711171140.00e09220@etinc.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk dennis wrote: > > At 11:37 AM 7/11/97 -0400, you wrote: > >>>> A major factor to consider is that its very difficult to do 86Mbs (T3 is > >>>> full duplex) with an addon card on the PCI bus because the sustained > >>>> throughput rate is often pretty low. Other bus masters (ethernets, for > >>>> example) will futhur reduce the burst capability. While PCI bursts to > >>>> 128MB/s, very few PC products have sustained throughput rates over > 100Mb/s. > >>>> If you have a 100Mbs ethernet card on the same bus (you'd have to) the > >>>> number is cut in half. plus bus masters can't be controlled so you have > >>>> contention issues. > >>> > >>> Contention issues I'll agree with for the most part, however.. My > >>> calculations are (correct me if I'm wrong): > >>> > >>> T3 Card = ~12Mbytes/sec [ 90Mbits/sec] > >>> Ether = ~25Mbytes/sec [100Mbits/sec] > >>> ============= > >>> ~37Mbytes/sec > >>> > >>> 132 Mbytes/sec - PCI bus > >>> - 37 Mbytes/sec - Interfaces > >>> ================ > >>> 95 Mbytes/sec - Left to play with. > >> > >> Because you have no clue how the PCI bus really works (and that burst > >> rates are not sustainable), your Math is totally invalid. > >> Remember that ISA is a 64Mb/s medium and if you get 30Mb/s you > >> are lucky....the numbers are even more dramaticly worse when you add > >> bursts to the formula as with PCI. > > > >Invalid? I doubt it... In "real-life", how often do *MOST* T3 connections > >"sustain" 45Mbit/sec throughput in each direction? > > this depends on who your selling to. If you're building a card for little > weenie ISPs who only have 4Mb/s requirements, then maybe. But I think > that big ISPs have pretty busy links, and we're only talking about 2 or > 3 large, consecutive packets to potentially have a problem. > > >In "real-life", how > >often do ethernet cards "sustain" 100Mbit/sec throughput in each direction? > >I think my figures are right on the money, however.. Let's assume for a > >minute that you can only achieve 50% throughput on the PCI bus for whatever > >reason.. Assuming that the ethernet and the T3 card were running full tilt > >(Very, very unlikely in most situations) then with 1 ethernet and 1 T3 port > >you still have ((132Mbytes/2)-37Mbytes) = 29 Mbytes left over just for > >lolly-gagging around... > > "Bursts" are typically only a few words, so the rate you are using is just > totally invalid for this computation. > > 50% is still pretty good (sustained 2 cycle accesses)...and still bursts so > only a few words...... > > > > >> Ah, if life was only as easy as your trivial account of the world! > > > >This sounds a little bit sarcastic Dennis... This would *really* encourage > >me to purchase your products. A "Your a dumb-ass, we're not" attitude. > > Its very sarcastic :-) > > YOU'RE the one with the "you dont know what you're talking about" attitude, > which is OK if you're right, but you're not. Have you designed a PCI card > lately? > > Dennis Can you guys take your personal jabs off this list? I'm not saying your discussion isn't relevant, but the personal jabs are not needed. Thanks, Eddie From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Jul 11 23:18:30 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA22177 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 23:18:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.FreeBSD.ORG [204.216.27.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA22172 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 23:18:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from berlin.atlantic.net (berlin.atlantic.net [204.215.255.12]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA20482 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 1997 23:18:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rio.atlantic.net (cbw@rio.atlantic.net [204.215.255.3]) by berlin.atlantic.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA23805 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 02:35:19 -0400 Received: from localhost (cbw@localhost) by rio.atlantic.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id CAA05925 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 02:18:22 -0400 Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 02:18:22 -0400 (EDT) From: Chris Wilson To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.com Subject: Never mind the second SCSI question... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Stupid mistake on my part, please disregard :) Chris Wilson (CW40) | "What was your username again?" Internet Connect Company | You'd think they'd learn. Sales: 800-422-2936 Support: 800-921-9328 | http://www.atlantic.net From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Jul 12 06:30:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA05143 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 06:30:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from databus.databus.com (databus.databus.com [198.186.154.34]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id GAA05138 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 06:30:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Barney Wolff To: isp@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 09:27 EDT Subject: Re: T1/T3 Upgrade Options? Content-Type: text/plain Message-ID: <33c786fb0.2195@databus.databus.com> Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 19:45:42 -0600 > From: Blaine Minazzi > > The "sustained thoughput" argument is weak. If you pay for that kind of > bandwidth, then try and save a few dollars by putting hardware on the > end that cannot handle the capacity of the line, your a damn fool, IMO. The point of a T3 card that works with FreeBSD is programability, not saving a few bucks. I can't change IOS, unless I'm REALLY prepared to pay a lot. Barney Wolff From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Jul 12 07:50:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA07716 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 07:50:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Wicked.eaznet.com ([206.62.254.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA07707 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 07:50:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Eddie.eaznet.com ([206.62.254.149]) by Wicked.eaznet.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA13501 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 07:53:00 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <33C79A99.39D9@eaznet.com> Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 07:54:17 -0700 From: Eddie Fry Organization: Creative Solutions X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: 3COM Etherlink XL 3C90x Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Ok, I know this was talked about a few months back, but, after searching the archives and trying to remember, I can't seem to come to a hard resolution. I know the 3COM 3c90x is supported with the vx driver, but it seems there was a lot of talk about it being a slow performer. Is this still true? I need to swap out a fritzy card and I have a 3com 3c90x combo 10Mbps PCI card. Should I expect sub-par performance if I use this card? Thanks, Eddie From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Jul 12 08:18:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA08447 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 08:18:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from toronto1 (cap1.net [207.245.244.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA08441 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 08:18:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from CALIFORNIA (CALIFORNIA [207.245.244.4]) by toronto1 (NTMail 3.02.13) with ESMTP id va001165 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 11:18:31 -0400 From: "Mr. Anthony Capone" To: Subject: ISP Software Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 11:17:34 -0400 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <15183180800700@cap1.net> Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi Everyone, Is there any documentation that tells me how to setup freebsd to answer ppp calls for Win 3.1, 95 clients? Also, how to setup a digi board on a freebsd system? Furthermore, is there a good billing package for FreeBSD, perferably free with instructions on how to set it up, does anyone know of any? Also, this might sound like a stupid question but how do I a.) add users? b.) delete them? c.) set permission so they only have access to there home dir? d.) set automatic home dirs? c.) run an editor to view and make changes to txt files? eg. like dos edit or notepad or something Thanks ALOT! Anthony Capone From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Jul 12 08:27:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA08829 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 08:27:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etinc.com (et-gw-fr1.etinc.com [204.141.244.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA08824 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 08:27:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ntws (ntws.etinc.com [204.141.95.142]) by etinc.com (8.8.3/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA21621; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 11:34:48 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970712112601.00e16210@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 11:26:09 -0400 To: Blaine Minazzi From: dennis Subject: Re: T1/T3 Upgrade Options? Cc: isp@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 07:45 PM 7/11/97 -0600, you wrote: >There is a lot of "expensive frugality" on this thread. I see it in >customers all the time. >Many are so concerned with the hardware or upfront cost of a project, >they never look at the big picture. > > >Oh well, just my 60K worth. The confusion of a "T3" and what many are using if for is clearly an issue here. A major issue is that there is no clean solution between T1 and T3 without co-location (and thats a scam, becaue a 10Mb/s ethernet is not really 10Mb/s in the same way that a serial line is). Many are going to fiber and using either a clocked down line, which is a great solution because you can use what you need and upgrade immediately upon notifying your provider, metered T3, which is more dangerous (unless you buy our bandwidth manager! :-) ) and also creates conflicts if there is disagreement on the rate, and others (like UUNET) provide a full T3 through a cascade FR switch with a low CIR, which is a scary service because it gives UUNET the control of whether or not your packets get thrown away by the switch...and gives them the opportunity to oversell their bandwidth in a dangerous way. It is not "penny-wise and pound foolish" to not want to spend $60,000. if your requirements are only 4, 6 or 8Mb/s, which is the case with many small and medium size ISPs. You should not need that equipment (and it shouldnt cost what it does), but there are high performance solutions at these speeds that will save you big money and not compromise your needs. Dennis > > >Blaine > > From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Jul 12 08:32:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA09032 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 08:32:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etinc.com (et-gw-fr1.etinc.com [204.141.244.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA09024; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 08:32:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ntws (ntws.etinc.com [204.141.95.142]) by etinc.com (8.8.3/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA21648; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 11:39:46 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970712113103.00c86100@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 11:31:06 -0400 To: "Gary Palmer" From: dennis Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? Cc: isp@FreeBSD.ORG Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 10:46 PM 7/11/97 -0400, Gary Palmer wrote: >dennis wrote in message ID ><3.0.32.19970711185756.00f0f100@etinc.com>: >> At 06:27 PM 7/11/97 -0400, you wrote: >> >dennis wrote in message ID >> ><3.0.32.19970711171713.00e01550@etinc.com>: >> >> I get more video and ethernet card failures that hard drive failures >> >> on a router........why not try to build one without a power >> >> supply....that will really increase your uptime! > >> >Why does a router need a video card? Seems that you aren't doing the >> >`right thing' and reducing the number of `critical' components. > >> this is the kind of silliness that Im talking about. A video card is "nice", >> and if it one fails once I year I like that trade off. It takes more of my >> time to deal with the machine without a video card then it does to >> swap one out *if* it fails.... > >It's not silliness at all. You are putting your systems up against >dedicated boxes, and I'd expect you to make them as reliable as >possible. Personally, I fail to see *ANY* use for a video card in a >BSD router apart from when you have to alter BIOS values. COMCONSOLE >works good enough for freefall and wcarchive to be remotely maintained >without physical intervention. You can even use DDB et all over serial. First of all, YOU are putting our systems up against dedicated routers, we sell cards, systems for convenience. I have a cisco router and I find it rather annoying to have to wire up a terminal to it to upgrade software or do any maintenance that requires console access. You'll be doing upgrades or maintenance much more often then your video card will fail, and if it fails it will not bring your system down anyway. THATS why, and if you dont like it take the damn thing out....I dont care. :-) Dennis > >Difference of opinion I guess. I know I'm a core team member, and that >I should probably put FreeBSD on a pedastal and worship it. However, I >also know *ANY* unix has it's limits. It's not designed with the >optimizations that IOS has, for example, to make packet >switching/routing faster. > >I'm not saying I wouldn't use FreeBSD for a router, but that if I >needed to put a router in a situation where people could use the >reliability of a non-PC based solution, I'd recommended a Cisco >without thinking. e.g. Webspan (the company I work for) has a number >of 2501s at remote sites. Most of them are not situations where I'd >put a PC (poor ventilation, limited access, or a number of other >reasons). The 2501 works fine. > >Gary >-- >Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member >FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info > > From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Jul 12 09:06:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA10127 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 09:06:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from GndRsh.aac.dev.com (GndRsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA10121; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 09:06:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by GndRsh.aac.dev.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) id JAA24600; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 09:05:41 -0700 (PDT) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199707121605.JAA24600@GndRsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: INN on an async-mounted spool? In-Reply-To: <2392.868676269@orion.webspan.net> from Gary Palmer at "Jul 11, 97 10:57:49 pm" To: gpalmer@FreeBSD.ORG (Gary Palmer) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 09:05:41 -0700 (PDT) Cc: gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu, dlowe@sirius.com, freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL25 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > you also might want to look at using cdd to give your spools multiple > > disks to work on... the more spindles the better.. but make sure that > > the strip size is 32megs (or whatever the size of a cylinder group is) > > to get the best performance... > > Just a note here: I'm not *100%* sure that a 32Mb stripe size is > right. While on the face of it Joe's arguments in support of it make > sense, I have yet to see any figures to support his assertions. I > agree 100% that small stripes, as used by hardware controllers (e.g. 4 > or 8k) are useless in the face of a full feed (unless you happen to > stripe more drives together than most people see in a year). I just > think 32Mb is going a bit too far in the other direction. I was the one who talked with Joe about the block interleave value that should optimize a ccd array for transactions. I told him to use a ``cylinder group'' as the interleave size. He ran some benchmarks and sure enough, it was much better at that size than anything smaller. The rational that this is optimal is that UFS/FFS tries to store both the meta data and the datablocks in the same cylinder group, if you are trying to optimize ``news transaction rate'' you want the whole transaction to hit one drive so that you can have a transaction occuring on each of the drives in the ccd. If you use anything smaller than a ``cylinder group'' as the interleave factor there is a very high probability that a single transaction hits 2 drives creating drive contention in the array. Then once Joe started passing this out the ``cylinder group size'' has become 32MB as a simplification of the original idea, and actually holds since the newfs -u parameter has been defaulted to 4096 blocks (yeilding a 16 cyl/group * 4096 blk/cyl = 65536blk/grp or 32MB/group. This 32MB value is _wrong_ if you change any of the default cylinder group stuff when newfs'ing. Also one could run a whole sweep of cgsize vs interleave factor and I suspect your resulting data would say that maximal transaction rate occurs for any interleave >= cgsize up to a certain maximal where it should start to fall off. Looking over the original Berkeley RAID papers will confirm my above statements. Pay attention to the part about optimizing for transaction rates, not throughput. -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation, Inc. Reliable computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Jul 12 10:08:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA11700 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 10:08:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.id.net (mail.id.net [199.125.1.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA11693 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 10:08:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.id.net (shell.id.net [199.125.2.8]) by mail.id.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id NAA02596; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 13:09:00 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Shady Received: (from rls@localhost) by shell.id.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) id NAA08604; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 13:09:00 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199707121709.NAA08604@shell.id.net> Subject: Re: T1/T3 Upgrade Options? In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19970712112601.00e16210@etinc.com> from dennis at "Jul 12, 97 11:26:09 am" To: dennis@etinc.com (dennis) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 13:09:00 -0400 (EDT) Cc: bminazzi@denverweb.net, isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >There is a lot of "expensive frugality" on this thread. I see it in > >customers all the time. > >Many are so concerned with the hardware or upfront cost of a project, > >they never look at the big picture. > > It is not "penny-wise and pound foolish" to not want to spend > $60,000. if your requirements are only 4, 6 or 8Mb/s, which is > the case with many small and medium size ISPs. You should > not need that equipment (and it shouldnt cost what it does), > but there are high performance solutions at these speeds that > will save you big money and not compromise your needs. I'm really not trying to start arguments here, or degrade anybody. All I asked was if FreeBSD had a HSSI port solution. Our existing DS3 to UUNET ran us nearly $60,000 for the equipment and we currently have it clocked down to 12Mbit/sec. Now we have the need for another location to have about the same amount of bandwidth, and I personally think that $60K is way more than it should cost for us to bring in 12Mbit, or even a single 45Mbit connection for that matter (once we upgrade). I think Dennis hit it right on the nose.. We're not a UU-Net, or an AGIS... I believe in spending the money and doing things the "right" way, however, I think that if I can put off spending the extra $55K for a few months, there will be several additional "right ways" to consider. Let's face it folks, reality is, equipment you buy today doesn't last very long anymore. For example, Cascade switches are dropping in price and becoming a much more viable solution than a high-end Cisco, who knows what new technology or price drops will happen in another 6 months or so. Granted, if we were looking to run a dozen T1's and 2-3 DS3's off this box, I would never even consider anything BUT a Cisco or a Cascade, but at this point -- We're just looking for a solution to bring a single DS3 or a fractional DS3 into our 100 Megabit switch... -- Rob === _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ Innovative Data Services Serving South-Eastern Michigan Internet Service Provider / Hardware Sales / Consulting Services Voice: (810)855-0404 / Fax: (810)855-3268 / Web: http://www.id.net From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Jul 12 10:57:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA13089 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 10:57:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lightning.tbe.net (qmailr@lightning.tbe.net [208.208.122.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA13080 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 10:57:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 18677 invoked by uid 1010); 12 Jul 1997 17:51:56 -0000 Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 13:51:56 -0400 (EDT) From: "Gary D. Margiotta" To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: NCR SCSI controllers Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello, Sorry about the cross-post, but I thought the question is appropriate to both lists... We were looking at the NCR 53C810 and -815 PCI SCSI controllers and were just wondering if anybody has experience/problems with them. Also if anyone has happened to compare them to Adaptec controllers, I would be glad to hear how they turned out. TIA! -Gary Margiotta TBE Internet Services http://www.tbe.net From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Jul 12 11:00:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA13319 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 11:00:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.denverweb.net (root@sdn-ts-001coauroP15.dialsprint.net [206.133.160.34]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA13313 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 11:00:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion (blaine@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.denverweb.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA00431; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 10:54:24 -0600 Message-ID: <33C7B6BF.65E3E3FB@denverweb.net> Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 10:54:23 -0600 From: Blaine Minazzi Organization: What, me organized? X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (X11; I; Linux 2.0.27 i486) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: dennis CC: isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: T1/T3 Upgrade Options? References: <3.0.32.19970712112601.00e16210@etinc.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk dennis wrote: > It is not "penny-wise and pound foolish" to not want to spend > $60,000. if your requirements are only 4, 6 or 8Mb/s, which is > the case with many small and medium size ISPs. You should > not need that equipment (and it shouldnt cost what it does), > but there are high performance solutions at these speeds that > will save you big money and not compromise your needs. > > Dennis I agree. I am talking about a _real_ T-3.The full thing. If you only need 4, 6, or 8 Mb/s then you dont need to spend an arm and a leg on a big honkin Cisco. Your stuff ( and the PC hardware ) is fine. Cost efective. Flexable. Cheap enough to keep a complete backup system in the closet. Buying a 60 thousand dollar peice of equipment for such a small amount of bandwidth is just as stupid as the other way around, IMHO. But, if you have a monthly overhead of of a full T-3, then the trying to save a small PERCENTAGE of you annual operating revenues at the expense of reliability, functionality, and throughput is pretty shortsighted. Some jobs _DO_ require the big iron. Trying to make do with a peice of equipment that is barely up to the task, is a recipie for failure. This is just my opinion of how to run a business, not an argument on the technical capabilities of any partiular peice of eqiupment. I try not to over spend, but I have quit trying to save a few bucks at the expense of reliability, quality, capacity, etc. From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Jul 12 11:21:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA14070 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 11:21:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.denverweb.net (root@sdn-ts-001coauroP15.dialsprint.net [206.133.160.34]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA14065 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 11:21:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion (blaine@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.denverweb.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA00466; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 11:14:55 -0600 Message-ID: <33C7BB8E.787F9EB6@denverweb.net> Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 11:14:54 -0600 From: Blaine Minazzi Organization: What, me organized? X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (X11; I; Linux 2.0.27 i486) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Robert Shady CC: isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1/T3 Upgrade Options? References: <199707121709.NAA08604@shell.id.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Robert Shady wrote: > We're not a UU-Net, or an AGIS... Thank God. We dont need another SPAM CENTRAL. :-) From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Jul 12 13:21:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA18419 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 13:21:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from h2o.journey.net (h2o.journey.net [207.227.162.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA18413 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 13:20:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (listuser@localhost) by h2o.journey.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA12937; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 16:23:35 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 16:23:34 -0400 (EDT) From: listuser To: Steve Hovey cc: "Daniel C. Fifield" , isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Cisco Routers are very easy to set up.. There is a few good resources online that can help you configure a cisco... If you need more info Let me know!.. --Matt On Wed, 9 Jul 1997, Steve Hovey wrote: > On Tue, 8 Jul 1997, Daniel C. Fifield wrote: > > > > > I run an ISP in Wisconsin and we are planning an upgrade from a 56KB line > > to a T1 line. My ISP recommends using a CISCO router. I am looking for > > alternatives and experience using the CICSO router. > > I love my ciscos - its all I will use! Not too long ago, we had a cracker > attack an older cisco, rendering it useless. Their tech support stayed on > the phone and got me upgraded to a new operating system and crackerproofed > in a very short time! > > From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Jul 12 13:31:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA18688 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 13:31:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from h2o.journey.net (h2o.journey.net [207.227.162.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA18683 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 13:31:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (listuser@localhost) by h2o.journey.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA12950; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 16:34:16 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 16:34:16 -0400 (EDT) From: listuser To: Suresh Rajagopalan cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , "Gary D. Margiotta" , Cliff Addy , Nate Williams , isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: T1 upgrade options? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Gotta respond here... :) Ihave 9 livingston PM2 and PM3 boxes and have periodic lock ups after about 30 days... We make it a point to reboot them every other sunday now... I like my Cisco 4500's and 2501's and 5200 Dial in boxes... The Ascend boxes have a ton of fetures but support is a bit less than desired.. (However they just sent me 6 K56Flex modems for each of the 13 pops where I have Ascend deployed. --Matt On Wed, 9 Jul 1997, Suresh Rajagopalan wrote: > I'll have to speak up for Livingston here -- we use them all > the time for customer equipment and also dial in access, and > while opinions on the admin interface are subjective, I have > never seen a single box crash. > > > > > To use a car analogy, Cisco basically produces the Cadillacs of the > > router world whereas Livingston makes Yugos and Ascend makes VWs. :-) > > Not everyone needs, wants or can afford a Cadillac, but many of those > > features are nice to have if you're going to drive a car at all. > > Similarly, the "VW" is cheap but of reasonably good quality and the > > Yugo, well, you buy one of those when cost is the #1 consideration and > > you are resigned to the fact that it'll be no fun to drive and also > > perhaps spend some amount of time by the side of the road, waiting for > > the tow-truck. :-) > > > > From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Jul 12 13:52:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA19472 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 13:52:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from po2.glue.umd.edu (root@po2.glue.umd.edu [129.2.128.45]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA19465; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 13:52:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from periodic.eng.umd.edu (crb@periodic.eng.umd.edu [129.2.98.127]) by po2.glue.umd.edu (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA24024; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 16:52:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (crb@localhost) by periodic.eng.umd.edu (8.8.6/8.6.4) with SMTP id QAA02395; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 16:52:42 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: periodic.eng.umd.edu: crb owned process doing -bs Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 16:52:42 -0400 (EDT) From: "Christopher R. Bowman" X-Sender: crb@periodic.eng.umd.edu To: "Gary D. Margiotta" cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NCR SCSI controllers In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 12 Jul 1997, Gary D. Margiotta wrote: > Hello, > > Sorry about the cross-post, but I thought the question is appropriate to > both lists... > > We were looking at the NCR 53C810 and -815 PCI SCSI controllers and were > just wondering if anybody has experience/problems with them. Also if > anyone has happened to compare them to Adaptec controllers, I would be > glad to hear how they turned out. TIA! > > -Gary Margiotta > TBE Internet Services > http://www.tbe.net I can't comment on 53C810 and -815 PCI SCSI controllers but my Tekram DC-390F (53c875) has served me very well, I have had no problems with it and the Asus SC-875 is now a little cheaper at $110 or so. I do have to admit, however, that I am not getting ultra-wide speeds out of my Tekram even though I have an ultra-wide capable IBM UltraStar 2es but I haven't really looked into it yet to see if this is just a configuration problem or what. --------- Christopher R. Bowman crb@Glue.umd.edu My home page From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Jul 12 14:26:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA20459 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 14:26:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (ala-ca32-05.ix.netcom.com [199.35.209.69]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA20439; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 14:26:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from asami@localhost) by silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (8.8.6/8.6.9) id OAA09547; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 14:26:25 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 14:26:25 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199707122126.OAA09547@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> To: crb@Glue.umd.edu CC: gary@tbe.net, freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org, freebsd-isp@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org In-reply-to: (crb@Glue.umd.edu) Subject: Re: NCR SCSI controllers From: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk * From: crb@Glue.umd.edu Gee, I know someone with a very similar mail address! ;) * > Sorry about the cross-post, but I thought the question is appropriate to * > both lists... Unless you are asking something about performance under a huge number of disks and heavy load or something, I don't see the relevance with -isp. And for -hardware...we have -scsi just for these kind of discussions (;), the next person to follow please chop -isp and -hardware out of the CC: list. * > We were looking at the NCR 53C810 and -815 PCI SCSI controllers and were * > just wondering if anybody has experience/problems with them. Also if * > anyone has happened to compare them to Adaptec controllers, I would be * > glad to hear how they turned out. TIA! I've had 810- and 825-based controllers, they have worked very well over the years. However, the Adaptec is very stable now too. The main difference is probably the price ($70 for 810, $120 for 875, $200+ for 2940*) and configurability. I'm not sure if the current NCR's BIOSes let you change the Adapter's ID's, sync/wide negotiations per device, etc. -- mine doesn't, in fact mine doesn't even have a boot setup menu. Also, I don't know how the NCR controllers perform under heavy load as I never had more than two disks on them -- the Adaptec generally works fine with 14 disks in 10MHz mode or 8 disks in 20MHz mode (cable length problem). * I do have to admit, however, that I am not getting ultra-wide speeds out * of my Tekram even though I have an ultra-wide capable IBM UltraStar 2es * but I haven't really looked into it yet to see if this is just a configuration * problem or what. Our NCR driver doesn't support it yet. Stefan Esser (se) is working on it. Based on past experience, my guess is that it will start working soon because se is working on it. :) Satoshi From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Jul 12 15:40:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA23202 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 15:40:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from george.lbl.gov (george.lbl.gov [128.3.196.93]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA23180; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 15:40:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: (jin@localhost) by george.lbl.gov (8.6.10/8.6.5) id PAA21522; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 15:40:21 -0700 Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 15:40:21 -0700 From: "Jin Guojun[ITG]" Message-Id: <199707122240.PAA21522@george.lbl.gov> To: asami@cs.berkeley.edu, crb@Glue.umd.edu Subject: Re: NCR SCSI controllers Cc: freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG, gary@tbe.net Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Also, I don't know how the NCR controllers perform under heavy load as >I never had more than two disks on them -- the Adaptec generally works >fine with 14 disks in 10MHz mode or 8 disks in 20MHz mode (cable >length problem). I have no problem with NCR at all. Specially under FreeBSD, It does not take CPU time. Two disks or 14 disks is not the issue for SCSI controllers. If you can saturate the SCSI bus with two disks (new tech can), then, putting 100 disks (assume ID is allowed), would not make any difference at all. See Hardware performance guide for Pentium family (new) under http://www-itg.lbl.gov/ISS/hardware (two years old and it will be updated soon :-) > * I do have to admit, however, that I am not getting ultra-wide speeds out > * of my Tekram even though I have an ultra-wide capable IBM UltraStar 2es > * but I haven't really looked into it yet to see if this is just a configuratio >n > * problem or what. > >Our NCR driver doesn't support it yet. Stefan Esser (se) is working >on it. Based on past experience, my guess is that it will start >working soon because se is working on it. :) Does some one have tested any ultra-wide SCSI controllers to have at least more than 20 MB throughput over a single controller with number of ultra-wide disks? I posted such question a few month ago, and did not hear any respond. I was wondering no one had it worked at that time. -Jin From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Jul 12 17:58:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA27217 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 17:58:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.8.15.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA27211 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 17:58:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA25264; Sun, 13 Jul 1997 10:58:34 +1000 (EST) Date: Sun, 13 Jul 1997 10:58:33 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: "Mr. Anthony Capone" cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ISP Software In-Reply-To: <15183180800700@cap1.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Look at ftp.hilink.com.au:/pub/FreeBSD/pppkit.tgz /* Daniel O'Callaghan */ /* HiLink Internet danny@hilink.com.au */ /* FreeBSD - works hard, plays hard... danny@freebsd.org */ On Sat, 12 Jul 1997, Mr. Anthony Capone wrote: > Hi Everyone, > > Is there any documentation that tells me how to setup freebsd to answer ppp > calls for Win 3.1, 95 clients? From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Jul 12 18:48:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA29229 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 18:48:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA29208; Sat, 12 Jul 1997 18:48:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id LAA00583; Sun, 13 Jul 1997 11:17:47 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707130147.LAA00583@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: NCR SCSI controllers In-Reply-To: from "Gary D. Margiotta" at "Jul 12, 97 01:51:56 pm" To: gary@tbe.net (Gary D. Margiotta) Date: Sun, 13 Jul 1997 11:17:46 +0930 (CST) Cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Gary D. Margiotta stands accused of saying: > > We were looking at the NCR 53C810 and -815 PCI SCSI controllers and were > just wondering if anybody has experience/problems with them. Also if > anyone has happened to compare them to Adaptec controllers, I would be > glad to hear how they turned out. TIA! They're excellent controllers, and compare very well to the Adaptec units. The 7880-based adaptecs (2940UW) are perhaps a little better, but it's hard to quantify this. Tha 7860-based Adaptec controllers (2940U, 2940AU) are a _lot_ worse. > -Gary Margiotta -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[