From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Aug 27 0:50:36 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from sanson.reyes.somos.net (freyes.static.inch.com [216.223.199.224]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90A8237B43C for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2000 00:50:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tomasa (tomasa.reyes.somos.net [10.0.0.11]) by sanson.reyes.somos.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id DAA44352 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2000 03:42:08 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from fran@reyes.somos.net) Message-Id: <200008270742.DAA44352@sanson.reyes.somos.net> From: "Francisco Reyes" To: "FreeBSd Chat list" Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2000 02:43:54 -0400 Reply-To: "Francisco Reyes" X-Mailer: PMMail 2000 Professional (2.10.2010) For Windows 98 (4.10.2222) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Future of NFS? Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On my search for ipx/netware support on FreeBSD I bumped onto the smbfs(SMB filesystem) client at freebsd.org/~bp. Basically a way for a FreeBSD machine to access a CIFS (previously know as SMB) volume. This got me thinking about how this would affect NFS long term. In particular I am interested in performance. At work I did some mini-benchmarks comparing netware, NFS on sun with a NFS client on NT and a FreeBSD box running samba. In order of fastest to lowest I got Netware, NFS, Samba. I am a newbie on Samba so I don't know what settings I need to change yet.. I know FOR SURE that I must have something wrong. I don't recall exact details, but I tested both writing to and reading from all these servers.. the samba test was 12 seconds one way and 3 minutes the other way. Obviously I must have something very wrong.. The tests on the readme of the smbfs client imply that a samba/smbfs combo is faster than a win95 server, but that is almost to be expected. What would be interesting is to see how this client compares to NFS and an NT server, specially with Samba properly configured. francisco Moderator of the Corporate BSD list http://www.egroups.com/group/BSD_Corporate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Mon Aug 28 9:25: 9 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from relay2.inwind.it (relay2.inwind.it [212.141.53.73]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23B4537B424 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2000 09:24:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (212.141.78.173) by relay2.inwind.it (5.1.039) id 399BF830000BE419; Mon, 28 Aug 2000 18:24:37 +0200 From: Salvo Bartolotta Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2000 15:24:35 GMT Message-ID: <20000828.15243500@mis.configured.host> Subject: Re: What are the proper new names for following devices To: Odhiambo Washington Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <20000828181642.E3223@siafu.iconnect.co.ke> References: <20000828.6470200@mis.configured.host> <20000828181642.E3223@siafu.iconnect.co.ke> X-Mailer: SuperCalifragilis X-Priority: 3 (Normal) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org [ redirected from -questions to -chat ] >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Original Message <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< On 8/28/00, 4:16:42 PM, Odhiambo Washington =20 wrote regarding Re: What are the proper new names for following devices:= > I have a feeling you did not satisfy this guy!!! >>> Quoting Salvo Bartolotta : >>> [000828 10:46]: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Original Message <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< >> >> On 8/28/00, 8:13:35 AM, Ariel Burbaickij >> wrote regarding What are the=20 proper >> new names for following devices : >> >> wd0s1b swap >> wd0s1a / >> wd0s1e /usr >> wd1s1e /home ? >> >> After doing sh MAKEDEV all n /dev directory the best matches I could >> find were: >> ad0s1 >> ad1s1 >> >> Should the slices be added manually or how is it supposed to go ? >> >> Regards > Hello Ariel, >=20 > you have to generate the slice entries (or "partitions", in FreeBSD > parlance). Try the following command: >=20 > sh MAKEDEV ad0s1a ad1s1a >=20 > Please have a look at the mail archives and at the docs before > posting. >=20 > Best regards & best of luck > Salvo >>> -- >>> Odhiambo Washington >>> Systems Administrator >>> Inter-Connect Ltd. >>> 3rd Flr The Chancery >>> Valley Rd >>> PO Box 39519 Nairobi >>> Tel: 254 2 711140 >>> Fax: 254 2 718418 Dear Odhiambo Washington, AFAICS, today Ariel was trying to create the slice entries in /dev for=20 his source-updated (or to be updated) OS. I recreate my slice entries in that way -- mutatis mutandis -- when I=20 remake my world; BTW, I remade it just yesterday, with no problems=20 whatsoever. References to the slice entries are found in the docs (e.g. in=20 /usr/src/UPDATING); also, the question has been asked a few times in=20 the past few months, and, wait for it, **I** have already answered=20 *this* question at least another couple of times... :-) Am I missing anything else ? Best regards, Salvo To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Mon Aug 28 14:59:35 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from smtp-ham-1.netsurf.de (smtp-ham-1.netsurf.de [194.195.64.97]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7F2337B43C for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2000 14:59:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ham-1.netsurf.de ([192.168.10.65]) by smtp-ham-1.netsurf.de (Netscape Messaging Server 4.1) with ESMTP id G00UZB01.8V6 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2000 23:42:47 +0200 Received: from fbwi.fh-wilhelmshaven.de ([195.179.179.206]) by mail-ham-1.netsurf.de (Netscape Messaging Server 4.1) with ESMTP id G00VQP00.486; Mon, 28 Aug 2000 23:59:13 +0200 Message-ID: <39AAE1D4.2E8B05AD@fbwi.fh-wilhelmshaven.de> Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 00:04:04 +0200 From: Olaf Hoyer X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW0322q (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Francisco Reyes Cc: FreeBSd Chat list Subject: Re: Future of Applixware on FreeBSD? References: <200008270619.CAA44177@sanson.reyes.somos.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Francisco Reyes schrieb: > > Anyone cares to share thoughts on the future of Applix on > FreeBSD? > I am waiting for a machine which am going to dedicate as my > primary desktop running FreeBSD. > I like what I read on the Applix site about functionality, > however I am a little concerned after reading the description of > Applix's rebirth as VistaSource. They talk about "Linux and > Unix". They could have said "Unix like" operating systems or > Unix derived systems..but instead they chose to have "Linux and > Unix" Hi! I'm also (here in germany) watching Applix. I talked to the german guys, and for presentation on some "Linuxtag" ( a fair about open-source OS, mostly Linux) at the BSD booth, they agreed to sponsor some copy of the current 5.0/Linux (later FreeBSD, when available) version. Support was very kind, as I mentioned some problems in the install process on the international FreeBSD lists, they contacted me a day later and offered some help. Currently I am in the progress to catch up on some needed libraries from Linux, and when I have some spare time left (job is killing me with about 6 1/2 days a week) I can report more. > Anyway, I just want any random thoughts of what people think is > the future of Applix for FreeBSD before I fork the $99. > > Moreover, any rumors when version 5 will make it to FreeBSD? > FreeBSDMall says september, but the first release was > re-schedule numerous times. The FreeBSD port is underway, and (at least they told me) I will be one of the first people in germany that will get hold of one native version. They expect in the next weeks, but no fixed date yet. > How come FreeBSD Inc, or now BSDI, have not talked to Metrolink > and Applixare to have a FreeBSD Office distribution? Perhaps too much work for too few people for too few (proven) demand? BTW, the 4.4 release was no official one from Applix. As I told the support guy (german support folks) that there was a native port for FreeBSD, they were, um, surprised. Also a NetBSD version of 4.4.2 exists, designed for the IBM Network station 2200/2800. On meetings/discussions etc I also try to tell them : Not: FreeBSD-the power to serve instead: FreeBSD-turning PCs into workstations Its some kind of image that still clings to us. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Mon Aug 28 15:12: 0 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from pike.osd.bsdi.com (pike.osd.bsdi.com [204.216.28.222]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03E5D37B42C for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2000 15:11:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jhb@localhost) by pike.osd.bsdi.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA87647; Mon, 28 Aug 2000 15:11:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jhb) From: John Baldwin Message-Id: <200008282211.PAA87647@pike.osd.bsdi.com> Subject: Re: Future of Applixware on FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: <39AAE1D4.2E8B05AD@fbwi.fh-wilhelmshaven.de> from Olaf Hoyer at "Aug 29, 2000 00:04:04 am" To: Olaf Hoyer Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2000 15:11:24 -0700 (PDT) Cc: chat@FreeBSD.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL68 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Olaf Hoyer wrote: > Francisco Reyes schrieb: > > > > Anyone cares to share thoughts on the future of Applix on > > FreeBSD? > > I am waiting for a machine which am going to dedicate as my > > primary desktop running FreeBSD. > > I like what I read on the Applix site about functionality, > > however I am a little concerned after reading the description of > > Applix's rebirth as VistaSource. They talk about "Linux and > > Unix". They could have said "Unix like" operating systems or > > Unix derived systems..but instead they chose to have "Linux and > > Unix" > > Hi! > > I'm also (here in germany) watching Applix. > > I talked to the german guys, and for presentation on some "Linuxtag" ( a > fair about open-source OS, mostly Linux) at the BSD booth, they agreed > to sponsor some copy of the current 5.0/Linux (later FreeBSD, when > available) version. > > Support was very kind, as I mentioned some problems in the install > process on the international FreeBSD lists, they contacted me a day > later and offered some help. > > Currently I am in the progress to catch up on some needed libraries from > Linux, and when I have some spare time left (job is killing me with > about 6 1/2 days a week) I can report more. > > > Anyway, I just want any random thoughts of what people think is > > the future of Applix for FreeBSD before I fork the $99. > > > > Moreover, any rumors when version 5 will make it to FreeBSD? > > FreeBSDMall says september, but the first release was > > re-schedule numerous times. Actually, the Applix 5 test CD's have already arrived here at BSDi, and the final version is supposed to start shipping in a couple of weeks. > BTW, the 4.4 release was no official one from Applix. > As I told the support guy (german support folks) that there was a native > port for FreeBSD, they were, um, surprised. Heh, point them to FreeBSDMall.com then. :) -- John Baldwin -- http://www.FreeBSD.org/~jhb/ PGP Key: http://www.cslab.vt.edu/~jobaldwi/pgpkey.asc "Power Users Use the Power to Serve!" - http://www.FreeBSD.org/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Mon Aug 28 16:46:58 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from math.berkeley.edu (gold-slow.Math.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.183.94]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CAD1C37B423 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2000 16:46:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dan@localhost) by math.berkeley.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA15961; Mon, 28 Aug 2000 16:46:56 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2000 16:46:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Dan Strick Message-Id: <200008282346.QAA15961@math.berkeley.edu> To: freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: If only ... Cc: dan@math.berkeley.edu Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org http://metalab.unc.edu/Dave/Dr-Fun/df9403/df940322.jpg To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Mon Aug 28 22:23:20 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from sanson.reyes.somos.net (freyes.static.inch.com [216.223.199.224]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4472B37B446 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2000 22:23:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tomasa (tomasa.reyes.somos.net [10.0.0.11]) by sanson.reyes.somos.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id BAA50031; Tue, 29 Aug 2000 01:14:52 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from fran@reyes.somos.net) Message-Id: <200008290514.BAA50031@sanson.reyes.somos.net> From: "Francisco Reyes" To: "Olaf Hoyer" Cc: "FreeBSd Chat list" Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2000 23:18:55 -0400 Reply-To: "Francisco Reyes" X-Mailer: PMMail 2000 Professional (2.10.2010) For Windows 98 (4.10.2222) In-Reply-To: <39AAE1D4.2E8B05AD@fbwi.fh-wilhelmshaven.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: Future of Applixware on FreeBSD? Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Tue, 29 Aug 2000 00:04:04 +0200, Olaf Hoyer wrote: >The FreeBSD port is underway, I got an email that it was completed and handed to BSDI for distribution. >> How come FreeBSD Inc, or now BSDI, have not talked to Metrolink >> and Applixare to have a FreeBSD Office distribution? > >Perhaps too much work for too few people for too few (proven) demand? Why should this be too much work? I didn't ask for integration. :-) Just bundle them up price-wise and keep the products intact. >BTW, the 4.4 release was no official one from Applix. So who did it? francisco Moderator of the Corporate BSD list http://www.egroups.com/group/BSD_Corporate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Aug 29 2: 4:46 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk [193.237.89.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 422F137B423 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2000 02:04:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nik@localhost) by nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (8.11.0/8.11.0) id e7T8Lj628270 for chat@freebsd.org; Tue, 29 Aug 2000 09:21:45 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from nik) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 09:21:43 +0100 From: Nik Clayton To: chat@freebsd.org Subject: Paging Charles Henrich Message-ID: <20000829092141.A28051@canyon.nothing-going-on.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i Organization: FreeBSD Project Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Hi guys, If you're Charles Henrich, or you've got an up to date way of getting in touch with him, could you drop me a line? [ Charles is/was the SA at Manex, the guys that did the SFX for _The Matrix_ ] N -- Internet connection, $19.95 a month. Computer, $799.95. Modem, $149.95. Telephone line, $24.95 a month. Software, free. USENET transmission, hundreds if not thousands of dollars. Thinking before posting, priceless. Somethings in life you can't buy. For everything else, there's MasterCard. -- Graham Reed, in the Scary Devil Monastery To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Aug 29 8:22:36 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A4F037B422 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2000 08:22:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA26497; Tue, 29 Aug 2000 17:21:09 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) To: "Francisco Reyes" Cc: "Olaf Hoyer" , "FreeBSd Chat list" Subject: Re: Future of Applixware on FreeBSD? References: <200008290514.BAA50031@sanson.reyes.somos.net> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 29 Aug 2000 17:21:08 +0200 In-Reply-To: "Francisco Reyes"'s message of "Mon, 28 Aug 2000 23:18:55 -0400" Message-ID: Lines: 10 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0802 (Gnus v5.8.2) Emacs/20.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org "Francisco Reyes" writes: > On Tue, 29 Aug 2000 00:04:04 +0200, Olaf Hoyer wrote: > > BTW, the 4.4 release was no official one from Applix. > So who did it? Walnut Creek CDROM. The actual porting was done by Mike Smith. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Aug 29 13:15: 2 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from news.IAEhv.nl (news.IAE.nl [194.151.64.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A706137B43E for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2000 13:14:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by news.IAEhv.nl (8.9.1/8.9.1) with IAEhv.nl id WAA07032; Tue, 29 Aug 2000 22:14:53 +0200 (MET DST) Received: by adv.devet.org (Postfix, from userid 100) id 161923E0D; Tue, 29 Aug 2000 22:14:41 +0200 (CEST) To: oolberg@eenet.ee Subject: Re: IP Filter 3.4.9 and FreeBSD r. 4.0 X-Newsgroups: list.freebsd.chat In-Reply-To: Organization: Eindhoven, the Netherlands Cc: chat@freebsd.org Message-Id: <20000829201441.161923E0D@adv.devet.org> Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 22:14:41 +0200 (CEST) From: Arjan.deVet@adv.iae.nl (Arjan de Vet) Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org In article you write: >Hallo, That's Dutch for 'hello' b.t.w. ;-). >i am having problem with . The logging gives apparently random >numbers, like this: > >bash# ipmon >26/08/2000 19:31:21.921566 ed0 @0:0 L 254.1.50.235 -> 192.168.1.10 PR >ipencap len 0 (0) frag 0@672 >26/08/2000 19:31:22.931046 ed0 @0:0 L 255.1.52.207 -> 192.168.2.10 PR igmp >len 0 (49203) frag 49203@672 >26/08/2000 19:31:22.931082 vx0 @0:0 L 254.1.52.207 -> 192.168.2.10 PR igmp >len 0 (0) frag 0@672 >26/08/2000 19:31:22.931526 vx0 @0:0 L 255.1.50.234 -> 192.168.1.10 P > >espesially the L 254.1.50.235 column. Such things can happen when the userland utilities are not in-sync with the kernel. Did you update only one of those? >In fact, the filtering itselt seems to work, just the little filtering >thing. > >Can someone confirm, the mentioned versions of software work together >seamlessly. Well, probably you can .... >Or better to use last 3.x version of FreeBSD? I noticed, the 4.1 is >unsupported by IP Filter's make. IP filter is included with FreeBSD. FreeBSD 4.1 will give you ipfilter 3.4.8. Just add this to your kernel configuration file: # IPFILTER enables Darren Reed's ipfilter package. # IPFILTER_LOG enables ipfilter's logging. options IPFILTER #kernel ipfilter support options IPFILTER_LOG #ipfilter logging options IPFILTER_DEFAULT_BLOCK #block all packets by default Arjan -- Arjan de Vet, Eindhoven, The Netherlands URL: http://www.iae.nl/users/devet/ for PGP key: finger devet@iae.nl To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Aug 29 13:32:56 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from smtp05.primenet.com (smtp05.primenet.com [206.165.6.135]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 726E137B43C for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2000 13:32:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp05.primenet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA19927; Tue, 29 Aug 2000 13:32:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from usr02.primenet.com(206.165.6.202) via SMTP by smtp05.primenet.com, id smtpdAAA8daOWM; Tue Aug 29 13:32:44 2000 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr02.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA18978; Tue, 29 Aug 2000 13:32:30 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <200008292032.NAA18978@usr02.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Gimme FreeBSD anyday! To: jcm@freebsd-uk.eu.org (j mckitrick) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 20:32:20 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com (Terry Lambert), res03db2@gte.net (The Clark Family), chat@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <20000825020341.A59386@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> from "j mckitrick" at Aug 25, 2000 02:03:41 AM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > | > Not all UNIX is open source or GPL. I would expect to find that > | > fancier debugging tools are available, in commercial toolsets on UNIX. > | BattleMap cost us $50,000 per workstation back in the early 90's. > | > | I have also seen a commercial network management and configuration > | design tool. That tool cost $250,000 for a 1 year license for one > | machine. You paid for the graph theory and the patents on the code. > | > | So yes, such tools exist. > > 1. What software companies have the resources for such a tool? Any company that does life-support software can not be without such tools, from a legal liability standpoint. This includes gene sequencers, blood gas monitors, gamma knives, and many thing that you wouldn't immediately think of as "life support", such as avionics systems, transit control for Amtrack or other public transit, automotive computers, people who write the code that validates wing designs or airbag sensors, commercial process control in chemical factories that process chemicals into food additives. Oh yeah: and people who want their code to work, guaranteed to 6 sigmas. 8-). > 2. What kind of progs do they write? Oil and gas? Everything. > 3. Why doesn't M$ use such a tool to improve code quality? They of all > people have the funds. The tools won't run on Windows platforms; they require big iron. The smallest systems you'll find them on are UNIX engineering workstations with a lot of RAM and a lot of disk. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Aug 29 15:16:48 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from serenity.mcc.ac.uk (serenity.mcc.ac.uk [130.88.200.93]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3020737B7B7 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2000 15:16:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org ([130.88.200.97]) by serenity.mcc.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 2.05 #4) id 13TtgP-000B0L-00; Tue, 29 Aug 2000 23:16:41 +0100 Received: (from jcm@localhost) by dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA13876; Tue, 29 Aug 2000 23:16:40 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from jcm) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 23:16:40 +0100 From: j mckitrick To: Terry Lambert Cc: chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Gimme FreeBSD anyday! Message-ID: <20000829231640.A13724@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> References: <20000825020341.A59386@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> <200008292032.NAA18978@usr02.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <200008292032.NAA18978@usr02.primenet.com>; from tlambert@primenet.com on Tue, Aug 29, 2000 at 08:32:20PM +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Tue, Aug 29, 2000 at 08:32:20PM +0000, Terry Lambert wrote: | The tools won't run on Windows platforms; they require big iron. | The smallest systems you'll find them on are UNIX engineering | workstations with a lot of RAM and a lot of disk. stupid question: do they at least look nice? :) seriously, are they X-type apps, or console apps? jcm -- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Aug 29 19:27: 6 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8804837B422; Tue, 29 Aug 2000 19:27:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (kris@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id TAA12629; Tue, 29 Aug 2000 19:27:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kris@FreeBSD.org) X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: kris owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 19:27:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Kris Kennaway To: thomas r stromberg Cc: chat@Freebsd.org Subject: Re: Restricting ftpd commands (fwd) In-Reply-To: <20000829120058.A5419@rtci.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Tue, 29 Aug 2000, thomas r stromberg wrote: > BTW, anyone ever notice that ftp.openbsd.org is (more then likely it > just claims to be) SunOS 4.1? Yeah, they get free hosting from a sunos machine. It's a FAQ.. Kris -- In God we Trust -- all others must submit an X.509 certificate. -- Charles Forsythe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Aug 29 22: 4:17 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from postal.linkfast.net (postal.linkfast.net [208.160.105.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C73C337B42C for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2000 22:04:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: by postal.linkfast.net (Postfix, from userid 103) id 0E3C09B35; Wed, 30 Aug 2000 00:04:15 -0500 (CDT) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 00:04:15 -0500 From: GH To: Terry Lambert Cc: j mckitrick , chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: OSS, Sun, GPL, random ramblings Message-ID: <20000830000414.A56358@linkfast.net> References: <20000821140419.B13975@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> <200008242057.NAA15423@usr06.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2i In-Reply-To: <200008242057.NAA15423@usr06.primenet.com>; from tlambert@primenet.com on Thu, Aug 24, 2000 at 08:57:23PM +0000 X-OS: FreeBSD Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org *snip snippity snip snip* > Crossing that barrier, we have documentation. One of the most > intriguing, yet piss-poorly documented OSS projects is ZOPE. I > would really have liked to use it for a project, but of course > I had to go with PHP instead; much less interesting, much higher > overhead (it's going to cost me ~$36,000 in extra hardware), but Why would PHP rather than ZOPE cost ~$36,000 in *extra* hardware? That sounds like a lot of equipment even just for performance(?), storage(?) differences... gh > rather well documented (so it's possible for people to document > their code well -- just don't expect it from any but the HTML > geeks, who mostly write text or a close relative for their living. > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org > --- > Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present > or previous employers. > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Aug 30 4: 5:21 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A60537B43C; Wed, 30 Aug 2000 04:05:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA30393; Wed, 30 Aug 2000 13:05:12 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) To: Mark Murray Cc: freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/contrib/perl5 patchlevel.h perl.c References: <200008132005.NAA37786@freefall.freebsd.org> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 30 Aug 2000 13:05:12 +0200 In-Reply-To: Mark Murray's message of "Sun, 13 Aug 2000 13:05:59 -0700 (PDT)" Message-ID: Lines: 11 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0802 (Gnus v5.8.2) Emacs/20.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Mark Murray writes: > 2) Make the "Can't do setuid" message a bit clearer; when our userbase > bumps into our suidperl-with-no-commit-bit, give them a good clue as > to what is going on. Suidperl had a commit bit? That might explain some of the weirder stuff that has been going around here lately... DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Aug 30 5:33:30 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5ED2C37B424 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2000 05:33:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA30636; Wed, 30 Aug 2000 14:32:33 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) To: Wilko Bulte Cc: chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: THE POLLS ARE CLOSED: Preliminary results leaked to committers References: <200008221914.MAA78440@winston.osd.bsdi.com> <20000822212720.A73076@lucifer.bart.nl> <20000822225646.D616@freebie.demon.nl> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 30 Aug 2000 14:32:33 +0200 In-Reply-To: Wilko Bulte's message of "Tue, 22 Aug 2000 22:56:46 +0200" Message-ID: Lines: 18 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0802 (Gnus v5.8.2) Emacs/20.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Wilko Bulte writes: > On Tue, Aug 22, 2000 at 09:27:20PM +0200, Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven wrote: > > -On [20000822 21:15], Jordan Hubbard (jkh@winston.osd.bsdi.com) wrote: > > > Now all we need are some interns... > > [Images of jkh, cigars and interns fill the scene] > Cigars generally are THC-free so I have some problems putting this on my > retina ;-) Mmf. I have a couple of 10 ml syringes of white heat transfer paste, labeled HTC (heat transfer compound). I actually went through customs with one of them in my pocket once, by accident (a friend had borrowed it, and I hadn't taken it out of my pocket since getting it back from him). I can imagine trying to explain to the "we do not have a sense of humor" guys what it really was, and why I had it on me. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Aug 30 8: 5: 9 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C71D37B423; Wed, 30 Aug 2000 08:05:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from newsguy.com (p57-dn02kiryunisiki.gunma.ocn.ne.jp [211.0.245.122]) by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN/) with ESMTP id AAA10958; Thu, 31 Aug 2000 00:04:56 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <39AD21A4.24F67ABC@newsguy.com> Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 00:00:52 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en,pt-BR MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: Mark Murray , freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/contrib/perl5 patchlevel.h perl.c References: <200008132005.NAA37786@freefall.freebsd.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > Mark Murray writes: > > 2) Make the "Can't do setuid" message a bit clearer; when our userbase > > bumps into our suidperl-with-no-commit-bit, give them a good clue as > > to what is going on. > > Suidperl had a commit bit? That might explain some of the weirder > stuff that has been going around here lately... Well, *THAT* explains why perl remains in the tree! :-) -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org capo@white.bunnies.bsdconspiracy.net OK, so the solar flares are my fault.. I am sorry, ok?!?! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Aug 30 12:52:48 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from serenity.mcc.ac.uk (serenity.mcc.ac.uk [130.88.200.93]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD4DD37B43C for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2000 12:52:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org ([130.88.200.97]) by serenity.mcc.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 2.05 #4) id 13UDue-000Obj-00; Wed, 30 Aug 2000 20:52:44 +0100 Received: (from jcm@localhost) by dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA23851; Wed, 30 Aug 2000 20:52:43 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from jcm) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 20:52:43 +0100 From: j mckitrick To: Terry Lambert Cc: The Clark Family , chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Gimme FreeBSD anyday! Message-ID: <20000830205243.A23746@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> References: <20000825020341.A59386@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> <200008292032.NAA18978@usr02.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <200008292032.NAA18978@usr02.primenet.com>; from tlambert@primenet.com on Tue, Aug 29, 2000 at 08:32:20PM +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Tue, Aug 29, 2000 at 08:32:20PM +0000, Terry Lambert wrote: | > 3. Why doesn't M$ use such a tool to improve code quality? They of all | > people have the funds. | | The tools won't run on Windows platforms; they require big iron. | The smallest systems you'll find them on are UNIX engineering | workstations with a lot of RAM and a lot of disk. I mean why not use these tools during the development process, on non-windows machines, of course? jcm -- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Aug 30 14: 1:59 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from germanium.xtalwind.net (germanium.xtalwind.net [205.160.242.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DCF737B422 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2000 14:01:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.xtalwind.net [127.0.0.1]) by germanium.xtalwind.net (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id e7UL0Rt37033; Wed, 30 Aug 2000 17:00:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 17:00:25 -0400 (EDT) From: jack To: j mckitrick Cc: chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Gimme FreeBSD anyday! In-Reply-To: <20000830205243.A23746@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Today j mckitrick wrote: > On Tue, Aug 29, 2000 at 08:32:20PM +0000, Terry Lambert wrote: > | > 3. Why doesn't M$ use such a tool to improve code quality? They of all > | > people have the funds. > | > | The tools won't run on Windows platforms; they require big iron. > | The smallest systems you'll find them on are UNIX engineering > | workstations with a lot of RAM and a lot of disk. > > I mean why not use these tools during the development process, on > non-windows machines, of course? Why would they bother? M$ is a marketing company not a technology company. As long as the masses continue to pay for their crap in a box they have no incentive to fix or improve it. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Jack O'Neill Systems Administrator / Systems Analyst jack@germanium.xtalwind.net Crystal Wind Communications, Inc. Finger jack@germanium.xtalwind.net for my PGP key. PGP Key fingerprint = F6 C4 E6 D4 2F 15 A7 67 FD 09 E9 3C 5F CC EB CD enriched, vcard, HTML messages > /dev/null -------------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Aug 30 19:22: 7 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mail.hiwaay.net (fly.HiWAAY.net [208.147.154.56]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C110B37B42C for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2000 19:22:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nospam.hiwaay.net (tnt8-216-180-72-52.dialup.hiwaay.net [216.180.72.52]) by mail.hiwaay.net (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id e7V2Lp724693 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2000 21:22:00 -0500 (CDT) Received: from nospam.hiwaay.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nospam.hiwaay.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA21647 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2000 20:43:21 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dkelly@nospam.hiwaay.net) Message-Id: <200008310143.UAA21647@nospam.hiwaay.net> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.1 10/15/1999 To: chat@FreeBSD.ORG From: David Kelly Subject: Re: Gimme FreeBSD anyday! In-reply-to: Message from jack of "Wed, 30 Aug 2000 17:00:25 EDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 20:43:21 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org jack writes: > Today j mckitrick wrote: > > > I mean why not use these tools during the development process, on > > non-windows machines, of course? > > Why would they bother? M$ is a marketing company not a > technology company. As long as the masses continue to pay for > their crap in a box they have no incentive to fix or improve it. Some would claim MS *does* use the tools. In this way they control the quality of their bugs to ensure no matter what they do in the next version, it looks like an improvement. Its the old (lack-of) Quality As A Revenue Enhancer ploy. The same thing happens in other professions. For example a weatherman once told me the profession really did know what the weather was going to be one year ahead. But one year is a long time to be out of work. Public school teachers don't dare do as good as they could else see their demands for more money and smaller classes be dismissed. It goes on and on. -- David Kelly N4HHE, dkelly@hiwaay.net ===================================================================== The human mind ordinarily operates at only ten percent of its capacity -- the rest is overhead for the operating system. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Aug 31 2:46:49 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from postfix2.free.fr (postfix2.free.fr [212.27.32.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27CB537B424; Thu, 31 Aug 2000 02:46:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from free.fr (paris11-nas4-47-92.dial.proxad.net [212.27.47.92]) by postfix2.free.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id AABB7740E5; Thu, 31 Aug 2000 11:46:42 +0200 (MEST) Message-ID: <39AE45E4.E7C7B60D@free.fr> Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 11:47:48 +0000 From: Nicolas Souchu Organization: Home Sweet Home X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 4.1-STABLE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org, BOISSEAU Jean-Philippe Subject: Mach4 BSD working group? Lites? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Hi hackers and others, Has anybody heard about some *BSD work on the Mach4 microkernel recently? I mean, something that would look like Hurd (from GNU) but with a complete BSD approach. How hard would it be to upgrade Lites1.1 server to support FBSD 4.0 binaries? Thanks in advance. Nicholas (I'm not subscribed to the lists) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Aug 31 8:42:12 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from smtp04.primenet.com (smtp04.primenet.com [206.165.6.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3DF7037B422 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2000 08:42:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp04.primenet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA15423; Thu, 31 Aug 2000 08:40:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from usr06.primenet.com(206.165.6.206) via SMTP by smtp04.primenet.com, id smtpdAAA7caO6D; Thu Aug 31 08:39:53 2000 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr06.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA01995; Thu, 31 Aug 2000 08:41:51 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <200008311541.IAA01995@usr06.primenet.com> Subject: Re: OSS, Sun, GPL, random ramblings To: grasshacker@linkfast.net (GH) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 15:41:50 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com (Terry Lambert), jcm@FreeBSD-uk.eu.org (j mckitrick), chat@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <20000830000414.A56358@linkfast.net> from "GH" at Aug 30, 2000 12:04:15 AM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > > Crossing that barrier, we have documentation. One of the most > > intriguing, yet piss-poorly documented OSS projects is ZOPE. I > > would really have liked to use it for a project, but of course > > I had to go with PHP instead; much less interesting, much higher > > overhead (it's going to cost me ~$36,000 in extra hardware), but > > > Why would PHP rather than ZOPE cost ~$36,000 in *extra* hardware? > That sounds like a lot of equipment even just for performance(?), > storage(?) differences... It will cost me another machine, since I will have to use network seperation to establish an artificial protection perimeter so that a compromise of my interface services doesn't compromise any other security. If I had the ZOPE security model available, which is a capabilities based model, I would not have to worry about a UI-based compromise. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Aug 31 8:43:36 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from probity.mcc.ac.uk (probity.mcc.ac.uk [130.88.200.94]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E02DD37B422 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2000 08:43:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org ([130.88.200.97]) by probity.mcc.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 2.05 #4) id 13UWV4-000Le2-00; Thu, 31 Aug 2000 16:43:34 +0100 Received: (from jcm@localhost) by dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA33952; Thu, 31 Aug 2000 16:43:33 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from jcm) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 16:43:33 +0100 From: j mckitrick To: Terry Lambert Cc: chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Gimme FreeBSD anyday! Message-ID: <20000831164333.B33795@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> References: <20000829231640.A13724@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> <200008311537.IAA01913@usr06.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <200008311537.IAA01913@usr06.primenet.com>; from tlambert@primenet.com on Thu, Aug 31, 2000 at 03:37:27PM +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org | They are X apps. Most use Motif. You can't use a text cursor | to rubber-band call-graph nodes to examine cyclomatic complexity | in ASCII art. 8-). where can i find info on these on the web? jcm -- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Aug 31 8:57:49 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from smtp04.primenet.com (smtp04.primenet.com [206.165.6.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2123037B440 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2000 08:57:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp04.primenet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22107; Thu, 31 Aug 2000 08:55:45 -0700 (MST) Received: from usr06.primenet.com(206.165.6.206) via SMTP by smtp04.primenet.com, id smtpdAAAmyaa0Q; Thu Aug 31 08:55:25 2000 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr06.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA02245; Thu, 31 Aug 2000 08:57:20 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <200008311557.IAA02245@usr06.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Gimme FreeBSD anyday! To: jcm@freebsd-uk.eu.org (j mckitrick) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 15:57:20 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com (Terry Lambert), chat@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <20000831164333.B33795@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> from "j mckitrick" at Aug 31, 2000 04:43:33 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > | They are X apps. Most use Motif. You can't use a text cursor > | to rubber-band call-graph nodes to examine cyclomatic complexity > | in ASCII art. 8-). > > where can i find info on these on the web? McCabe built BattleMap., You might want to look at: http://www.research.ibm.com/journal/sj/364/finnigan.html This gives an overview of many tools. Or: http://www.mccabe.com/main.htm It looks like the program has been renamed and is part of their IQ2 product suite. It looks like it also may now be on Windows (NT), with some reduced functionality. You might also try typing (with quotes intact) "branch path analysis" into the altavista search engine. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Aug 31 9: 3: 9 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from smtp05.primenet.com (smtp05.primenet.com [206.165.6.135]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B51FC37B42C for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2000 09:03:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp05.primenet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA17572; Thu, 31 Aug 2000 09:03:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from usr06.primenet.com(206.165.6.206) via SMTP by smtp05.primenet.com, id smtpdAAAAxaOhI; Thu Aug 31 09:03:03 2000 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr06.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA02396; Thu, 31 Aug 2000 09:02:50 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <200008311602.JAA02396@usr06.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Gimme FreeBSD anyday! To: jcm@freebsd-uk.eu.org (j mckitrick) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 16:02:49 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com (Terry Lambert), res03db2@gte.net (The Clark Family), chat@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <20000830205243.A23746@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> from "j mckitrick" at Aug 30, 2000 08:52:43 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > On Tue, Aug 29, 2000 at 08:32:20PM +0000, Terry Lambert wrote: > | > 3. Why doesn't M$ use such a tool to improve code quality? They of all > | > people have the funds. > | > | The tools won't run on Windows platforms; they require big iron. > | The smallest systems you'll find them on are UNIX engineering > | workstations with a lot of RAM and a lot of disk. > > I mean why not use these tools during the development process, on > non-windows machines, of course? Most programmers do not have the discipline to program for several platforms simultaneously, or there would be no need for crocks like GNU configure. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Aug 31 14: 2:40 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from postal.linkfast.net (postal.linkfast.net [208.160.105.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A6E1037B424 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2000 14:02:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: by postal.linkfast.net (Postfix, from userid 103) id D83299B59; Thu, 31 Aug 2000 16:02:37 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 16:02:37 -0500 From: GH To: Terry Lambert Cc: j mckitrick , chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: OSS, Sun, GPL, random ramblings Message-ID: <20000831160237.B79955@linkfast.net> References: <20000830000414.A56358@linkfast.net> <200008311541.IAA01995@usr06.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2i In-Reply-To: <200008311541.IAA01995@usr06.primenet.com>; from tlambert@primenet.com on Thu, Aug 31, 2000 at 03:41:50PM +0000 X-OS: FreeBSD Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Thu, Aug 31, 2000 at 03:41:50PM +0000, some SMTP stream spewed forth: > > > Crossing that barrier, we have documentation. One of the most > > > intriguing, yet piss-poorly documented OSS projects is ZOPE. I > > > would really have liked to use it for a project, but of course > > > I had to go with PHP instead; much less interesting, much higher > > > overhead (it's going to cost me ~$36,000 in extra hardware), but > > > > > > Why would PHP rather than ZOPE cost ~$36,000 in *extra* hardware? > > That sounds like a lot of equipment even just for performance(?), > > storage(?) differences... > > It will cost me another machine, since I will have to use network > seperation to establish an artificial protection perimeter so > that a compromise of my interface services doesn't compromise > any other security. If I had the ZOPE security model available, > which is a capabilities based model, I would not have to worry > about a UI-based compromise. > I see. I thank you for the clarification. I have tried looking into Zope, and I see what you mean about (lack of) documentation. It took far too long just to find out what the heck it is supposed to do. Zope sounds interesting; hopefully I can learn enough about it just by playing. Dan > > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org > --- > Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present > or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Fri Sep 1 5:19: 4 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from serenity.mcc.ac.uk (serenity.mcc.ac.uk [130.88.200.93]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A10937B422 for ; Fri, 1 Sep 2000 05:18:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org ([130.88.200.97]) by serenity.mcc.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 2.05 #4) id 13Upmb-0002N5-00; Fri, 1 Sep 2000 13:18:57 +0100 Received: (from jcm@localhost) by dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA48005; Fri, 1 Sep 2000 13:18:56 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from jcm) Date: Fri, 1 Sep 2000 13:18:56 +0100 From: j mckitrick To: Terry Lambert Cc: chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Gimme FreeBSD anyday! Message-ID: <20000901131856.A47895@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> References: <20000831164333.B33795@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> <200008311557.IAA02245@usr06.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <200008311557.IAA02245@usr06.primenet.com>; from tlambert@primenet.com on Thu, Aug 31, 2000 at 03:57:20PM +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Thu, Aug 31, 2000 at 03:57:20PM +0000, Terry Lambert wrote: | McCabe built BattleMap., | It looks like the program has been renamed and is part of their | IQ2 product suite. | | It looks like it also may now be on Windows (NT), with some | reduced functionality. | | You might also try typing (with quotes intact) "branch path analysis" | into the altavista search engine. i found another product called 'panorama'. This one also runs on *nix and M$. I guess what I am getting at, Terry (and everyone), is that *nix seems to be losing ground in the workstation arena. I might be totally unaware of some or many vertical market apps or other niche apps, but with the growth of the cheap Intel hardware market, it seems there is very little *nix can do that Win cannot do. Is this just the evolution of the hardware and software markets? Can/should anything be done about it, or is this shift both permanent and inevitable at this point? If the jobs that only *nix could do are now accessible on M$ platforms, that does not bode well for the *nix workstation future. (1) Is *nix destined to become just a server and otherwise behind the scenes OS (albeit the best)? (2) What, if anything, can be done besides requesting and then buying BSD native apps from developers? And learning to write our own :) jcm -- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Fri Sep 1 7:15:59 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mail2.aracnet.com (mail2.aracnet.com [216.99.193.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40E3337B43E for ; Fri, 1 Sep 2000 07:15:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell1.aracnet.com (shell1.aracnet.com [216.99.193.21]) by mail2.aracnet.com (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id e81EG1S03486; Fri, 1 Sep 2000 07:16:01 -0700 Received: by shell1.aracnet.com (8.9.3) id HAA16257; Fri, 1 Sep 2000 07:15:55 -0700 Date: Fri, 1 Sep 2000 07:15:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Rick Hamell To: j mckitrick Cc: chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Gimme FreeBSD anyday! In-Reply-To: <20000901131856.A47895@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > Is this just the evolution of the hardware and > software markets? Can/should anything be done about it, or is this shift > both permanent and inevitable at this point? If the jobs that only *nix > could do are now accessible on M$ platforms, that does not bode well for the > *nix workstation future. > > (1) Is *nix destined to become just a server and otherwise > behind the scenes OS (albeit the best)? Not if I can help it... I'll fight tooth and nail to keep that from happening. :) > (2) What, if anything, can be done besides requesting and then buying BSD > native apps from developers? And learning to write our own :) Awareness of FreeBSD and Unix systems. If people don't know they're there... they're not going to use it. Remeber most people are victims of Microsoft's Propaganda/Advertising.... :( Rick To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Fri Sep 1 21:56: 6 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from picknowl.com.au (firewall.picknowl.com.au [203.24.77.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 99E0737B43E for ; Fri, 1 Sep 2000 21:56:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailserver1.picknowl.com.au (mailserver1.picknowl.com.au [10.1.1.4]) by mailserver2.picknowl.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA30231 for ; Sat, 2 Sep 2000 15:25:57 +1030 Received: from [203.58.174.188] by mailserver1.picknowl.com.au (NTMail 5.03.0001/NU2410.00.38109bdc) with ESMTP id rvcvyaaa for freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG; Sat, 2 Sep 2000 14:22:41 +0930 Message-ID: <000701c01499$50f291c0$bcae3acb@bruce> Reply-To: "Bruce" From: "Bruce" To: Subject: RE-HAYES ACCURA 56K SPEAKERPHONE MODEM Date: Sat, 2 Sep 2000 14:20:21 +0930 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org I have a ACCURA HAYES 56K Speakerphone modem Model Number: 5670AU, I would like to know if this model modem BIOS can be flashed upgraded to V.90????? The modem was purchased during the period of 1997. If one can flash the bios, where can I go on the web to get it??? Thank you for your consideration. My E-Mail address is emmab@picknowl.com.au and you can also E-Mail the other E-Mail address: sgtgarth@chariot.net.au To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sat Sep 2 9:49:18 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from radon.gryphonsoft.com (mcut-b-167.resnet.purdue.edu [128.211.209.167]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D97637B422; Sat, 2 Sep 2000 09:49:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: by radon.gryphonsoft.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 5462C198A; Sat, 2 Sep 2000 11:46:34 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 2 Sep 2000 11:46:34 -0500 From: Will Andrews To: Kris Kennaway Cc: FreeBSD Chat Subject: Re: cvs commit: ports/games Makefile ports/games/cowsay Makefile ports/games/cowsay/files md5 ports/games/cowsay/pkg COMMENT DESCR PLIST Message-ID: <20000902114634.E589@radon.gryphonsoft.com> Reply-To: Will Andrews References: <200009021004.DAA23642@freefall.freebsd.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200009021004.DAA23642@freefall.freebsd.org>; from kris@FreeBSD.org on Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 03:04:59AM -0700 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.1-STABLE i386 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 03:04:59AM -0700, Kris Kennaway wrote: > Log: > ______________________________________ > / This is cowsay 3.03, a program which \ > | generates ASCII art of various | > \ characters saying text. / > -------------------------------------- > \ , , > \ /( )` > \ \ \___ / | > /- _ `-/ ' > (/\/ \ \ /\ > / / | ` \ > O O ) / | > `-^--'`< ' > (_.) _ ) / > `.___/` / > `-----' / > <----. __ / __ \ > <----|====O)))==) \) /==== > <----' `--' `.__,' \ > | | > \ / > ______( (_ / \______ > ,' ,-----' | \ > `--{__________) \/ That's gotta be the worst repo-bloat in awhile. :-P -- Will Andrews GCS/E/S @d- s+:+ a--- C++ UB++++$ P+ L- E--- W+ N-- !o ?K w--- O- M+ V- PS+ PE++ Y+ PGP+>+++ t++ 5 X+ R+ tv+ b++ DI+++ D+ G++ e>++++ h! r- y? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sat Sep 2 14:46:11 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F169E37B424; Sat, 2 Sep 2000 14:46:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (kris@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id OAA79189; Sat, 2 Sep 2000 14:46:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kris@FreeBSD.org) X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: kris owned process doing -bs Date: Sat, 2 Sep 2000 14:46:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Kris Kennaway To: Will Andrews Cc: FreeBSD Chat Subject: Re: cvs commit: ports/games Makefile ports/games/cowsay Makefile ports/games/cowsay/files md5 ports/games/cowsay/pkg COMMENT DESCR PLIST In-Reply-To: <20000902114634.E589@radon.gryphonsoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sat, 2 Sep 2000, Will Andrews wrote: > On Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 03:04:59AM -0700, Kris Kennaway wrote: > > Log: > > ______________________________________ > > / This is cowsay 3.03, a program which \ > > | generates ASCII art of various | > > \ characters saying text. / > > -------------------------------------- > > \ , , > > \ /( )` > > \ \ \___ / | > > /- _ `-/ ' > > (/\/ \ \ /\ > > / / | ` \ > > O O ) / | > > `-^--'`< ' > > (_.) _ ) / > > `.___/` / > > `-----' / > > <----. __ / __ \ > > <----|====O)))==) \) /==== > > <----' `--' `.__,' \ > > | | > > \ / > > ______( (_ / \______ > > ,' ,-----' | \ > > `--{__________) \/ > > That's gotta be the worst repo-bloat in awhile. :-P _______________________________________ / Oh come now, this is much better than \ \ some stupid changelog! / --------------------------------------- \ ^__^ \ (oo)\_______ (__)\ )\/\ ||----w | || || Kris -- In God we Trust -- all others must submit an X.509 certificate. -- Charles Forsythe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message