From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 2:37:57 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.evpatoria.net (evpatoria.so-com.net [212.110.134.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F7B937B401 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 02:37:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from goa@ecc.crimea.ua) Received: from l-0.ecc.crimea.ua ([192.168.130.136]) by mail.evpatoria.net with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #2) id 1591fC-000Hi7-00 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 12:37:42 +0300 Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 12:38:13 +0400 From: RUL X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.48d) Personal Reply-To: RUL X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <581340976.20010610123813@ecc.crimea.ua> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG %HELP %LIST mailto:goa@ecc.crimea.ua To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 2:59: 4 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from finch-post-11.mail.demon.net (finch-post-11.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.39]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74F9237B407; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 02:59:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from [62.49.251.130] (helo=herring.nlsystems.com) by finch-post-11.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 1591zn-000BtA-0B; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 09:58:59 +0000 Received: from herring (herring [10.0.0.2]) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f5A9vi703479; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 10:57:44 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 10:57:43 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Sergey Babkin Cc: j mckitrick , "Matthew N. Dodd" , Warner Losh , Mike Smith , Subject: Re: newbussifying drivers In-Reply-To: <3B2164B3.84284526@bellatlantic.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 8 Jun 2001, Sergey Babkin wrote: > j mckitrick wrote: > > > > Okay, there is something i'm not understanding here. In the ed driver, > > there are many possible cards, which each have different i/o ports, correct? > > The driver has a lot of probe routines, and it looks like they are just > > using different macros with hard-coded (#defined) port addresses. > > > > So, how do you CORRECTLY use the newbus calls to probe these ports? I am > > not running -current, so i do not have 'hints'. > > As Doug Rabson said, write an 'identify' routine. Look at the > ep driver for an example. And my artile in DaemonNews > (www.daemonnews.org) from I think August 2000 or somewhere around > that time gives some description of the newbussified ISA drivers. > It should also be included into the Handbook by now. Actually, the ex driver does have an identify method. The issue is that the identify method uses 'unallocated' ports to do its search. It ought to allocate them, do its tests and release them for the real probe but it gets messy due to the fact that a device instance doesn't exist yet. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Phone: +44 20 8348 6160 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 5: 5:31 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from Awfulhak.org (gw.Awfulhak.org [217.204.245.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3616E37B405; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 05:05:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brian@Awfulhak.org) Received: from hak.lan.Awfulhak.org (root@hak.lan.Awfulhak.org [172.16.0.12]) by Awfulhak.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5AC5Et93303; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 13:05:14 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from brian@lan.Awfulhak.org) Received: from hak.lan.Awfulhak.org (brian@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hak.lan.Awfulhak.org (8.11.4/8.11.4) with ESMTP id f5AC5DA31455; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 13:05:13 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from brian@hak.lan.Awfulhak.org) Message-Id: <200106101205.f5AC5DA31455@hak.lan.Awfulhak.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.3.1 01/18/2001 with nmh-1.0.4 To: Brooks Davis Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, Brian Somers , Poul-Henning Kamp , freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: cloning network interfaces In-Reply-To: Message from Brooks Davis of "Sat, 09 Jun 2001 21:16:15 PDT." <20010609211615.A17310@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 13:05:12 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I went ahead and nuked the auto-creation and -D flag in favor of plumb > and unplumb in the patch at: > > http://www.one-eyed-alien.net/~brooks/FreeBSD/gif.diff > > This version includes a change to rc.network to plumb gif interfaces > before calling gifcreate. This will still trip up users who build > static gif tunnels from hosts with dynamic addresses since they can't > run gifconfig yet, but we don't really have any means of supporting that > in the rc files yet anyway. > > -- Brooks This looks good to me. I've cc'd freebsd-arch to see if anyone else wants to comment. If there are no objections, I'll test & commit it in about a week. -- Brian Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour ! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 5:56:54 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dove.cc.ncu.edu.tw (dove.cc.ncu.edu.tw [140.115.17.111]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1DDEE37B401 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 05:56:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mihs@wmlab.csie.ncu.edu.tw) Received: from mihs (mihs.wmlab.csie.ncu.edu.tw [140.115.156.42]) by dove.cc.ncu.edu.tw (8.11.2/8.11.2/dove/0.0.4) with SMTP id f5ACxwn27999 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 20:59:59 +0800 (CST) Message-ID: <001901c0f1ac$cb716890$2a9c738c@mihs> From: "Ming-I Hsieh" To: Subject: a bug in ipfstream under FreeBSD 4.3-RELEASE? Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 20:56:39 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2462.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2462.0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In one case, I need to analyse the data flow of FreeBSD box. Therefore, I uses ipfstream to get report from 'ipfw show'. After program runs several days, I notes some odd number in kern.openfiles. I uses fstat to find out what thing is happened. Then I find my program does *not* release the fd after the ipfstream has droped. Now I uses popen and pclose to replace ipfstream. It works fine. Anyone know what thing happens? Is it a bug for pfstream? Or just my fault. The testing program is below. Thanks. //-------------------------------------------------------------------------- - // pfstream bug? //-------------------------------------------------------------------------- - #include #include #include #include #include #include //-------------------------------------------------------------------------- - int main(int argc, char ** argv) { if (argc < 3) { cerr.form("Usage: %s trynum sleep_time\n", argv[0]); return EX_USAGE; } register int i = 0, iend = atoi(argv[1]); for (i = 0; i < iend; i++) { ipfstream pfin("|/bin/ls /bin", ios::in); char buffer[1024]; // Read data from pfin while (pfin.getline(buffer, 1024)) { // Do nothing. } } cout.form("Try \"fstat -p %d\"\n", getpid()); cout.form("Ok! Go to Sleep. [%d sec]\n", atoi(argv[2])); sleep(atoi(argv[2])); return EX_OK; } //-------------------------------------------------------------------------- - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 5:59:37 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from segfault.kiev.ua (segfault.kiev.ua [193.193.193.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 863DF37B401 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 05:59:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from netch@iv.nn.kiev.ua) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by segfault.kiev.ua (8) with UUCP id PWT09150; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 15:59:06 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from netch@iv.nn.kiev.ua) Received: (from netch@localhost) by iv.nn.kiev.ua (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5ACv9q01705; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 15:57:09 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from netch) Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 15:57:09 +0300 From: Valentin Nechayev To: Graham Barr Cc: Alfred Perlstein , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: read(2) and ETIMEDOUT Message-ID: <20010610155709.A1179@iv.nn.kiev.ua> References: <20010607171501.S50444@pobox.com> <20010607150917.U1832@superconductor.rush.net> <20010607201846.E50444@pobox.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20010607201846.E50444@pobox.com>; from gbarr@pobox.com on Thu, Jun 07, 2001 at 08:18:46PM +0100 X-42: On Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Thu, Jun 07, 2001 at 20:18:46, gbarr (Graham Barr) wrote about "Re: read(2) and ETIMEDOUT": > > I'm quite sure ETIMEDOUT is a result of hitting the setsockopt > > SO_RCVTIMEO value when doing a read. > I had been thinking along those lines too. But immediately before calling > read, select said there was data to read, So it should not block, but > read what data is there and return. This is ideological error from you: select does _not_ say "there is data to read", it only says "read() will not block". EOF (when read() returns 0) and any situation where read() returns -1-and-errno also are such. But, this error does not (I think) influe to produce ETIMEDOUTs. > Also why does this happen only every few hours ? There is a lot of > data going through these connections maybe the timer for SO_RCVTIMEO > is not being reset. You should determine exact cases where ETIMEDOUT occurs. netch@iv:/usr/REL4/src/sys/netinet>fgrep ETIMEDOUT *.c tcp_input.c: tcp_drop(sototcpcb(so2), ETIMEDOUT); tcp_subr.c: if (errno == ETIMEDOUT && tp->t_softerror) tcp_timer.c: tp = tcp_drop(tp, ETIMEDOUT); tcp_timer.c: tp = tcp_drop(tp, ETIMEDOUT); tcp_timer.c: tp->t_softerror : ETIMEDOUT); Add debug printf()s with __LINE__, __FILE__, variables used by stack to make solution to drop connection. Collect statistics. /netch To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 7:29:49 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peace.mahoroba.org (peace.calm.imasy.or.jp [202.227.26.34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FC1D37B405 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 07:29:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ume@mahoroba.org) Received: from localhost (IDENT:bBL5ROO7g3BVXEyDfhfiyC9omGE/qsZ5fdfNEK1FcjgkV6v0O2u+XgP+tn3HzNf/@localhost [::1]) (authenticated as ume with CRAM-MD5) by peace.mahoroba.org (8.11.4/8.11.4/peace) with ESMTP/inet6 id f5AETAZ66076; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 23:29:10 +0900 (JST) (envelope-from ume@mahoroba.org) Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 23:29:07 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <20010610.232907.74740159.ume@mahoroba.org> To: brooks@one-eyed-alien.net Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, brian@Awfulhak.org, phk@critter.freebsd.dk Subject: Re: cloning network interfaces From: Hajimu UMEMOTO In-Reply-To: <20010608191904.A18847@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> References: <200106071119.f57BJr766008@hak.lan.Awfulhak.org> <20010607164812.A32379@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> <20010608191904.A18847@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> X-Mailer: xcite1.38> Mew version 1.95b119 on Emacs 20.7 / Mule 4.0 =?iso-2022-jp?B?KBskQjJWMWMbKEIp?= X-PGP-Public-Key: http://www.imasy.org/~ume/publickey.asc X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 0C 53 FC 5D D0 37 91 05 D0 B3 EF 36 9B 6A BC X-URL: http://www.imasy.org/~ume/ X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 5.0-CURRENT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, >>>>> On Fri, 8 Jun 2001 19:19:04 -0700 >>>>> Brooks Davis said: brooks> Following Brian's suggestion, I've modified gif to create a /dev/if_gif brooks> device with is controlled by the IOCIFMANAGE ioctl which allows creation brooks> and deletion of specific devices and creation of wildcard devices. I've brooks> hacked ifconfig to support this in a general manner. If you know which brooks> one you want to use you can do something like I think it is not BSD network way. Recent NetBSD has network interface cloning. It uses SIOCIFCREATE and SIOCIFDESTROY. It may good to port it to FreeBSD. brooks> ifconfig gif783 10.0.0.1 10.0.0.2 brooks> # gifconfig has to come second because I didn't add creation support to brooks> # it because I want to kill it off in favor of ifconfig "tsrc" and brooks> # "tdst" parameters like Solaris uses. brooks> gifconfig gif783 blah brooks> or if you don't care which one you use you can do brooks> newgif=`ifconfig gif#` brooks> gifconfig ${newgif} blah brooks> ifconfig ${newgif} 10.0.0.1 10.0.0.2 brooks> You can also delete interfaces: brooks> ifconfig -D gif783 NetBSD's ifconfig has `create' and `destroy' keyword for it. You can create gif interface by ifconfig gif0 create or ifconfig gif0 create tunnel 10.0.0.1 10.0.2.2 To destroy gif interface: ifconfig gif0 destroy BTW, gifconfig will be obsoleted soon as KAME and other BSDs did. -- Hajimu UMEMOTO @ Internet Mutual Aid Society Yokohama, Japan ume@mahoroba.org ume@bisd.hitachi.co.jp ume@{,jp.}FreeBSD.org http://www.imasy.org/~ume/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 8:47: 1 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [204.156.12.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C5BB37B414; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 08:46:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (robert@fledge.pr.watson.org [192.0.2.3]) by fledge.watson.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f5AFcff29397; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 11:38:41 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 11:38:40 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Watson X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org To: developers@FreeBSD.org, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Submissions Request: FreeBSD Monthly Development Status Report Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hey there again developers/contributors, This is a resend of my original post, since we're getting close to my specified deadline, which I've actually decided needs to slip a couple of days because it took me longer than I expected to move to Maryland due to problems with U-Haul. As such, I'm extending the deadline for submissions to the 12th, with a release sometime over the course of the week (probably Thursday). Just for reference, I've received reports on the following projects, and would love to see reports from others too: FreeBSD SMPng mbuf allocator PPP implementation, if_tun imeplementation digi driver PowerPC port Oldcard RELNOTESng KGI port FreeBSD Java Port TrustedBSD ACLs TrustedBSD MAC and Object Labeling devfs mount(2) API diskcheckd "Close a PR drive" Please send submissions to robert+freebsd.monthly@cyrus.watson.org; a complete description of the idea and required information is below. Robert N M Watson FreeBSD Core Team, TrustedBSD Project robert@fledge.watson.org NAI Labs, Safeport Network Services ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 30 May 2001 17:53:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Watson To: developers@FreeBSD.org, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Submissions Request: FreeBSD Monthly Development Status Report FreeBSD Developers and Contributors, One of the observations made occasionally about the FreeBSD community is that although it has many of the benefits of a centralized development organization, it's hard to get a sense of the architectural direction the project as a whole is taking, as well as learn about the set of projects under development. To try and address this problem, I'm interested in experimenting with an idea that was kicked around among some of the developers a few months ago: a monthly status report for the project. This report would include a brief status statement from developers interested in sharing information about their progress, both as part of larger project components (SMPng, TrustedBSD, ...), and at an individual level and related to personal projects. As such, this is a solicitation for text to be added to a first experimental edition, to be published on June 11th. I'd like for all submissions to be in by June 9th, to allow them to be chewed through and prettily formatted. Submissions after the 9th will be ignored, or bumped to a future month if appropriate. What I'd like to see for each entry is a project title ("SMPng", "SMPng VM Lock Pushdown", "KSE Design Work", "TrustedBSD", "TrustedBSD Capabilities Implementation", "Alpha Port", ...), followed by two to five sentences describing recent work on the project, perhaps in the last month or two. Also, the name of the committer submitting the report (or in the event the primary work is being done by a non-committer, then the non-committer's name and e-mail address). If there is a web page for the work, then a URL would also be useful. As the names above suggest, there's nothing wrong with submitting paragraphs for both a larger project, and smaller components of the project; while developers in multiple projects should feel free to contribute multiple reports, having ten TrustedBSD status reports makes no sense, so some coordination would be useful. While you can imagine a fancy web-based submission interface, for the purposes of this experimental pass, I'd like to see the text sent to robert+freebsd.monthly@cyrus.watson.org. The goal of this is simply to attempt to improve communication in the project by providing a vehicle for brief but useful summaries of on-going work. This would be in addition to (and maybe eventually submitted via) a dynamic projects web page. I don't promise to do it in future months, but if the results are useful to a moderate number of people, and there are enough submissions, I will. If there are comments, please send them to my privately at rwatson@FreeBSD.org rather than take them to the list, and I will attempt to summarize. Thanks, Robert N M Watson FreeBSD Core Team, TrustedBSD Project robert@fledge.watson.org NAI Labs, Safeport Network Services To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 9:15: 9 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from salmon.maths.tcd.ie (salmon.maths.tcd.ie [134.226.81.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 6E3A937B405 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 09:14:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from iedowse@maths.tcd.ie) Received: from walton.maths.tcd.ie by salmon.maths.tcd.ie with SMTP id ; 10 Jun 2001 17:14:57 +0100 (BST) To: Warner Losh Cc: Mark Hittinger , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Strange request: Reading RX-50 (aka DEC Rainbow 100) disks In-Reply-To: Your message of "Sat, 09 Jun 2001 21:08:40 MDT." <200106100308.f5A38el17955@billy-club.village.org> Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 17:14:56 +0100 From: Ian Dowse Message-ID: <200106101714.aa32440@salmon.maths.tcd.ie> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <200106100308.f5A38el17955@billy-club.village.org>, Warner Losh writ es: >I do have the options of connection the hardware up to the floppy >controller in my desktop too :-). I have both the RX-50 drives, as >well as a pair of TEAC FD55 drives (that do the same data rate as the >RX-50's, with the same heads, but with only one drive per spindle and >two read heads instead of one). Trouble is, it looks like our floppy >driver doesn't grok single sided 400k disks :-(. That's what I'm >looking to hack and advise on how to hack. The fdcontrol program allows most of the paramaters to be set to match the disks, but unfortunately it cannot set the sector offset. MSDOS disks sectors are numbered starting at 1 (the sector offset is 1), but it was common practice with old 8-bit CP/M-type systems to choose sector numbers starting at 0x41, 0x81 or other values. I was attempting something similar last summer, but with disks from an Amstrad CPC computer. I used the following patch to the fd driver and fdcontrol to allow the sector offset to be specified along with the other parameters. It also allows a head offset to be specified, which is useful for reading the second side of double-sided disks that were written as single-sided disks with a hardware switch on the side-select line (i.e the head number written to disk does not match the hardware head number). The patch below is against RELENG_4 around Jan 2000, so it will need updating. I'm also not sure what sector offset the DEC Rainbow used - I think I have a Rainbow boot disk here, but I'd have to dig out a 5.25 floppy drive to check :-) Once you get the settings right, you can just dd the disk to an image file. Ian Index: sys/i386/include/ioctl_fd.h =================================================================== RCS file: /dump/FreeBSD-CVS/src/sys/i386/include/Attic/ioctl_fd.h,v retrieving revision 1.13 diff -u -r1.13 ioctl_fd.h --- sys/i386/include/ioctl_fd.h 1999/12/29 04:33:02 1.13 +++ sys/i386/include/ioctl_fd.h 2001/06/10 15:36:24 @@ -86,6 +86,7 @@ struct fd_type { int sectrac; /* sectors per track */ int secsize; /* size code for sectors */ + int secoff; /* starting sector number */ int datalen; /* data len when secsize = 0 */ int gap; /* gap len between sectors */ int tracks; /* total num of tracks */ @@ -95,6 +96,7 @@ int heads; /* number of heads */ int f_gap; /* format gap len */ int f_inter; /* format interleave factor */ + int headoff; }; #define FD_FORM _IOW('F', 61, struct fd_formb) /* format a track */ Index: sys/isa/fd.c =================================================================== RCS file: /dump/FreeBSD-CVS/src/sys/isa/fd.c,v retrieving revision 1.176 diff -u -r1.176 fd.c --- sys/isa/fd.c 2000/01/08 09:33:06 1.176 +++ sys/isa/fd.c 2001/06/10 15:52:19 @@ -125,24 +125,24 @@ static struct fd_type fd_types[NUMTYPES] = { -{ 21,2,0xFF,0x04,82,3444,1,FDC_500KBPS,2,0x0C,2 }, /* 1.72M in HD 3.5in */ -{ 18,2,0xFF,0x1B,82,2952,1,FDC_500KBPS,2,0x6C,1 }, /* 1.48M in HD 3.5in */ -{ 18,2,0xFF,0x1B,80,2880,1,FDC_500KBPS,2,0x6C,1 }, /* 1.44M in HD 3.5in */ -{ 15,2,0xFF,0x1B,80,2400,1,FDC_500KBPS,2,0x54,1 }, /* 1.2M in HD 5.25/3.5 */ -{ 10,2,0xFF,0x10,82,1640,1,FDC_250KBPS,2,0x2E,1 }, /* 820K in HD 3.5in */ -{ 10,2,0xFF,0x10,80,1600,1,FDC_250KBPS,2,0x2E,1 }, /* 800K in HD 3.5in */ -{ 9,2,0xFF,0x20,80,1440,1,FDC_250KBPS,2,0x50,1 }, /* 720K in HD 3.5in */ -{ 9,2,0xFF,0x2A,40, 720,1,FDC_250KBPS,2,0x50,1 }, /* 360K in DD 5.25in */ -{ 8,2,0xFF,0x2A,80,1280,1,FDC_250KBPS,2,0x50,1 }, /* 640K in DD 5.25in */ -{ 8,3,0xFF,0x35,77,1232,1,FDC_500KBPS,2,0x74,1 }, /* 1.23M in HD 5.25in */ - -{ 18,2,0xFF,0x02,82,2952,1,FDC_500KBPS,2,0x02,2 }, /* 1.48M in HD 5.25in */ -{ 18,2,0xFF,0x02,80,2880,1,FDC_500KBPS,2,0x02,2 }, /* 1.44M in HD 5.25in */ -{ 10,2,0xFF,0x10,82,1640,1,FDC_300KBPS,2,0x2E,1 }, /* 820K in HD 5.25in */ -{ 10,2,0xFF,0x10,80,1600,1,FDC_300KBPS,2,0x2E,1 }, /* 800K in HD 5.25in */ -{ 9,2,0xFF,0x20,80,1440,1,FDC_300KBPS,2,0x50,1 }, /* 720K in HD 5.25in */ -{ 9,2,0xFF,0x23,40, 720,2,FDC_300KBPS,2,0x50,1 }, /* 360K in HD 5.25in */ -{ 8,2,0xFF,0x2A,80,1280,1,FDC_300KBPS,2,0x50,1 }, /* 640K in HD 5.25in */ +{ 21,2,1,0xFF,0x04,82,3444,1,FDC_500KBPS,2,0x0C,2 }, /* 1.72M in HD 3.5in */ +{ 18,2,1,0xFF,0x1B,82,2952,1,FDC_500KBPS,2,0x6C,1 }, /* 1.48M in HD 3.5in */ +{ 18,2,1,0xFF,0x1B,80,2880,1,FDC_500KBPS,2,0x6C,1 }, /* 1.44M in HD 3.5in */ +{ 15,2,1,0xFF,0x1B,80,2400,1,FDC_500KBPS,2,0x54,1 }, /* 1.2M in HD 5.25/3.5 */ +{ 10,2,1,0xFF,0x10,82,1640,1,FDC_250KBPS,2,0x2E,1 }, /* 820K in HD 3.5in */ +{ 10,2,1,0xFF,0x10,80,1600,1,FDC_250KBPS,2,0x2E,1 }, /* 800K in HD 3.5in */ +{ 9,2,1,0xFF,0x20,80,1440,1,FDC_250KBPS,2,0x50,1 }, /* 720K in HD 3.5in */ +{ 9,2,1,0xFF,0x2A,40, 720,1,FDC_250KBPS,2,0x50,1 }, /* 360K in DD 5.25in */ +{ 8,2,1,0xFF,0x2A,80,1280,1,FDC_250KBPS,2,0x50,1 }, /* 640K in DD 5.25in */ +{ 8,3,1,0xFF,0x35,77,1232,1,FDC_500KBPS,2,0x74,1 }, /* 1.23M in HD 5.25in */ + +{ 18,2,1,0xFF,0x02,82,2952,1,FDC_500KBPS,2,0x02,2 }, /* 1.48M in HD 5.25in */ +{ 18,2,1,0xFF,0x02,80,2880,1,FDC_500KBPS,2,0x02,2 }, /* 1.44M in HD 5.25in */ +{ 10,2,1,0xFF,0x10,82,1640,1,FDC_300KBPS,2,0x2E,1 }, /* 820K in HD 5.25in */ +{ 10,2,1,0xFF,0x10,80,1600,1,FDC_300KBPS,2,0x2E,1 }, /* 800K in HD 5.25in */ +{ 9,2,1,0xFF,0x20,80,1440,1,FDC_300KBPS,2,0x50,1 }, /* 720K in HD 5.25in */ +{ 9,2,1,0xFF,0x23,40, 720,2,FDC_300KBPS,2,0x50,1 }, /* 360K in HD 5.25in */ +{ 8,2,1,0xFF,0x2A,80,1280,1,FDC_300KBPS,2,0x50,1 }, /* 640K in HD 5.25in */ }; #define DRVS_PER_CTLR 2 /* 2 floppies */ @@ -1858,7 +1858,7 @@ sectrac = fd->ft->sectrac; sec = blknum % (sectrac * fd->ft->heads); head = sec / sectrac; - sec = sec % sectrac + 1; + sec = sec % sectrac + fd->ft->secoff; fd->hddrv = ((head&1)<<2)+fdu; if(format || !read) @@ -1931,7 +1931,7 @@ } if (fd_cmd(fdc, 9, (read ? NE7CMD_READ : NE7CMD_WRITE), - head << 2 | fdu, /* head & unit */ + (head + fd->ft->headoff) << 2 | fdu, /* head & unit */ fd->track, /* track */ head, sec, /* sector + 1 */ Index: usr.sbin/fdcontrol/fdcontrol.c =================================================================== RCS file: /dump/FreeBSD-CVS/src/usr.sbin/fdcontrol/fdcontrol.c,v retrieving revision 1.6 diff -u -r1.6 fdcontrol.c --- usr.sbin/fdcontrol/fdcontrol.c 1999/08/28 01:16:13 1.6 +++ usr.sbin/fdcontrol/fdcontrol.c 2001/06/10 15:36:13 @@ -119,6 +119,7 @@ ask(sectrac, "%d"); ask(secsize, "%d"); + ask(secoff, "%d"); ask(datalen, "0x%x"); ask(gap, "0x%x"); ask(tracks, "%d"); @@ -128,6 +129,7 @@ ask(heads, "%d"); ask(f_gap, "0x%x"); ask(f_inter, "%d"); + ask(headoff, "%d"); if(ioctl(fd, FD_STYPE, &ft) < 0) { To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 9:25: 4 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from szit.bme.hu (fourier.szit.bme.hu [152.66.84.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 886C337B401 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 09:24:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gyori@szit.bme.hu) Received: (qmail 83973 invoked by uid 8452); 10 Jun 2001 16:24:58 -0000 Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 18:24:58 +0200 (CEST) From: Gyori Sandor To: Cc: Subject: Re: nsswitch dynamically loadable modules In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20010610175233.J83779-100000@fourier.szit.bme.hu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 9 Jun 2001 scanner@jurai.net wrote: > > There are patches to solve this problem at > > http://www.nectar.com/freebsd/nsswitch > > but only a part of them was built in to -CURRENT (the statical part). > > If it's such a deficiency where are you're patches to fix the missing > bits? I fail to see them attached to this mail. Maybe my mailer dropped > them on the floor. Please resend them! thanks! You can see the patches on http://www.nectar.com/freebsd/nsswitch site (they're huge, more than 200K, so I don't want to attach them). I have no own ones, I only applied these. > > Is there anybody who use _properly working_ nsswitch and nss_ldap on > > FreeBSD? > > Many of us are waiting on nectars code. He is very busy working on other > things. And last time I checked he hoped to be picking it back up in June. > He is doing the best he can. You can help by finishing his work and > submitting the changes back so we get complete support sooner. I await > you're contribution. I've done the following to get authentication via LDAP (but there is no success): 1. I don't understand exactly why, but even into -CURRENT there was implemented only the statical part of nsswitch. By following the link above everybody could reach the code of the dynamically loadable modules part of nsswitch too (the patch contains it too). Statical part of nsswitch understands only some predefined strings such files, nis, nisplus and dns. The dynamical part understands any string and tries to load the appropriate library ("nss_"+string+".so"). I would like to use LDAP, so I need the dynamical part of nsswitch, therefore I patched a 4.3-STABLE system. It seems to be working properly. 2. I need nss_ldap too, because I would like the system to ask LDAP server about the question: "Is this user exists?". The current version of nss_ldap (at padl.com) is 153, but I couldn't compile it, because it needs some header files which are only on Solaris. I've been working to correct this problem hardly, but I couldn't do that. So, I downloaded the FreeBSD patch to 122 from nectar.com, compiled and installed it. I think it doesn't work properly, because system doesn't want to know users who are exist on LDAP server. 3. I installed pam_ldap from Ports. It works properly, because if I write manually a user's name who exists on LDAP into /etc/passwd, I can log in with this user, get uid from LDAP, and so on. The new nsswitch part of my system seems to be correct, because if I put the following line into nsswitch.conf: passwd: files ldap nsdispatch is looking for nss_ldap.so (if I remove nss_ldap.so, I get error message). I've tested the statical part of nsswitch too. I've deleted the line "+:::..." from passwd file, and put the following line into nsswitch.conf: passwd: files nis and NIS/YP authentication worked properly, so nsswitch can process its config file. I've read somewhere that FreeBSD support nsswitch only via BIND IRS interface. Is it true?? I don't see any connection between BIND and nsswitch... README.IRS from nss_ldap tarball says that I should patch my bind by irs-nss.diff file, but I've found nowhere this patch file. Is this a really existing thing or just a myth? So what do you think, what should I do? I readily test any piece of code which may solve my problem, but now I have nothing other than the above referred ones. Best wishes, Sandor Gyori To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 9:36:54 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from boco.fee.vutbr.cz (boco.fee.vutbr.cz [147.229.9.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A281B37B409 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 09:36:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cejkar@dcse.fee.vutbr.cz) Received: from kazi.dcse.fee.vutbr.cz (kazi.dcse.fee.vutbr.cz [147.229.8.12]) by boco.fee.vutbr.cz (8.11.4/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5AGacD67540 (using TLSv1/SSLv3 with cipher EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA (168 bits) verified OK); Sun, 10 Jun 2001 18:36:39 +0200 (CEST) Received: (from cejkar@localhost) by kazi.dcse.fee.vutbr.cz (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5AGab873925; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 18:36:37 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 18:36:37 +0200 From: Cejka Rudolf To: Terry Lambert Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: [Patch?] signal(SIGCHLD, SIG_IGN) is against SUSv2 Message-ID: <20010610183637.A73238@dcse.fee.vutbr.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from tlambert2@mindspring.com on Fri, Jun 08, 2001 at 01:54:01AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Terry Lambert wrote (2001/06/08): > > However, if I use "signal(SIGCHLD, SIG_IGN)", zombies are still > > created in FreeBSD, which is against SUSv2. I'm sorry that I used this shortening: I know that signal() is implemented via sigaction() in FreeBSD's libc so I used signal() in my description. However, just sigaction() interface is used in my test program. Ok, I repeat it once again - in the full: If I use sigemptyset(&sa.sa_mask); sa.sa_flags = 0; sa.sa_handler = SIG_IGN; sigaction(SIGCHLD, &sa, NULL); zombies are still created in FreeBSD, which is against SUSv2. My citation was quoted directly from sigaction() page and not from signal() page. Unfortunately, I do not have access to POSIX, so I do not know if it is specified in SUSv2 only or if it is specified in both SUSv2 and in POSIX. I'm afraid that it is in both. However I think, that FreeBSD wants to be SUSv2 compliant too, or not? > Look at the sigaction() man page. There is a POSIX way > to do what you want, using the sa_flags bits. I know about SA_NOCLDWAIT too, but SIG_IGN is the second way how to set up SIGCHLD handler and do not create zombies. Both ways are directly specified in SUSv2. What all says POSIX? Is it so much different from SUSv2? > If you hack up signal() to do this, it should be done > by noting the SIG_IGN and the fact you are using the > historical compatability signal() wrapper to the POSIX > interface, and just set the sa_flags bit to do the job. And why not to use the second way of the two in SUSv2 specification? It is not about (im)possibility. It is about FreeBSD's conformance to SUSv2 specification (and maybe POSIX?). -- Rudolf Cejka (cejkar@dcse.fee.vutbr.cz; http://www.fee.vutbr.cz/~cejkar) Brno University of Technology, Faculty of El. Engineering and Comp. Science Bozetechova 2, 612 66 Brno, Czech Republic To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 10:50:51 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gw.nectar.com (gw.nectar.com [208.42.49.153]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E88D737B403 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 10:50:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nectar@nectar.com) Received: by gw.nectar.com (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 71EEDAF600; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 12:50:44 -0500 (CDT) Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 12:50:44 -0500 From: "Jacques A. Vidrine" To: Gyori Sandor Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: nsswitch dynamically loadable modules Message-ID: <20010610125044.A60711@hellblazer.nectar.com> Mail-Followup-To: "Jacques A. Vidrine" , Gyori Sandor , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <20010610175233.J83779-100000@fourier.szit.bme.hu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010610175233.J83779-100000@fourier.szit.bme.hu>; from gyori@szit.bme.hu on Sun, Jun 10, 2001 at 06:24:58PM +0200 X-Url: http://www.nectar.com/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Jun 10, 2001 at 06:24:58PM +0200, Gyori Sandor wrote: > 1. I don't understand exactly why, but even into -CURRENT there was > implemented only the statical part of nsswitch. Please search the archives for full information. Here is the history in summary: = I ported NetBSD's nsswitch implementation to FreeBSD-CURRENT. It only implements files, NIS, and Hesiod. It does not support dynamically loaded sources. = I extended the implementation to support dynamically loaded sources, and ported nss_ldap to use the invented interface. These are the patches you referred to. This was a prototype to help me understand the issues. They will never be committed, and should not be used in production. = I re-did the implementation using a design that I am happy with, and interfaces which are agreed-upon-in-principal with the NetBSD nsswitch author. In addition to new interfaces, this new implementation is reentrant (although YP and our resolver is not). A major design goal was to enable the creation of modules that are stubs which talk to a long-running daemon that does the hard work. PADL.COM's nss_ldap is (IMHO) completely unsuitable for a production environment, particularly if you use SSL. = Eventually I will finish the implementation just described. Left to do is updating some resolver-oriented stuff like getaddrinfo, and (importantly) creating an nsswitch-ldap daemon. If someone wants to work on this stuff, I would be happy to hand it off after we had sufficient discussion so that I was confident the design was understood. Otherwise, please wait. I wish I had finished it sooner, but that's how it goes. Cheers, -- Jacques Vidrine / n@nectar.com / jvidrine@verio.net / nectar@FreeBSD.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 11:15:14 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from szit.bme.hu (fourier.szit.bme.hu [152.66.84.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 602BE37B407 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 11:14:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gyori@szit.bme.hu) Received: (qmail 89320 invoked by uid 8452); 10 Jun 2001 18:14:57 -0000 Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 20:14:57 +0200 (CEST) From: Gyori Sandor To: "Jacques A. Vidrine" Cc: Subject: Re: nsswitch dynamically loadable modules In-Reply-To: <20010610125044.A60711@hellblazer.nectar.com> Message-ID: <20010610200113.T89118-100000@fourier.szit.bme.hu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello, Thank you for your detailed explanation, I'm sure it will be great. I have some short questions: On Sun, 10 Jun 2001, Jacques A. Vidrine wrote: > = I extended the implementation to support dynamically loaded > sources, and ported nss_ldap to use the invented interface. These > are the patches you referred to. This was a prototype to help me > understand the issues. They will never be committed, and should > not be used in production. By applying these patches (nsswitch & nss_ldap) did you get a proper working authentication via LDAP? I applied them, but system doesn't know LDAP's user names. This is my fault or I should even not try this way? > = I re-did the implementation using a design that I am happy > with, and interfaces which are agreed-upon-in-principal with the > NetBSD nsswitch author. In addition to new interfaces, this new > implementation is reentrant (although YP and our resolver is not). > A major design goal was to enable the creation of modules that are > stubs which talk to a long-running daemon that does the hard > work. PADL.COM's nss_ldap is (IMHO) completely unsuitable for a > production environment, particularly if you use SSL. May I see this code anywhere? I can't find info about above way on your homepage. > = Eventually I will finish the implementation just described. Left > to do is updating some resolver-oriented stuff like getaddrinfo, > and (importantly) creating an nsswitch-ldap daemon. > > If someone wants to work on this stuff, I would be happy to hand it > off after we had sufficient discussion so that I was confident the > design was understood. Otherwise, please wait. I wish I had finished > it sooner, but that's how it goes. No, I'm not able to do this work, but if you need some help (e.g. testing), I am ready. Do you have any idea approximately when will you finish it? I think it's very important. Best wishes, Sandor Gyori To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 11:22: 1 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 242AF37B401 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 11:21:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@billy-club.village.org) Received: from billy-club.village.org (billy-club.village.org [10.0.0.3]) by rover.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5AILo649322; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 12:21:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@billy-club.village.org) Received: from billy-club.village.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by billy-club.village.org (8.11.2/8.8.3) with ESMTP id f5AIP4l20899; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 12:25:05 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <200106101825.f5AIP4l20899@billy-club.village.org> To: Ian Dowse Subject: Re: Strange request: Reading RX-50 (aka DEC Rainbow 100) disks Cc: Mark Hittinger , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 10 Jun 2001 17:14:56 BST." <200106101714.aa32440@salmon.maths.tcd.ie> References: <200106101714.aa32440@salmon.maths.tcd.ie> Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 12:25:04 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [[ Lots of details on how to do this deed, or at least the format of the Rainbow disk, follow. Hit 'n' or 'd' if you don't care ]] In message <200106101714.aa32440@salmon.maths.tcd.ie> Ian Dowse writes: : The fdcontrol program allows most of the paramaters to be set to : match the disks, but unfortunately it cannot set the sector offset. : MSDOS disks sectors are numbered starting at 1 (the sector offset : is 1), but it was common practice with old 8-bit CP/M-type systems : to choose sector numbers starting at 0x41, 0x81 or other values. That's OK. The Rainbow disks have sectors numbered 1 through 10, for both CP/M disks and MS-DOS disks. This makes things easier to cope with. : The patch below is against RELENG_4 around Jan 2000, so it will : need updating. I'm also not sure what sector offset the DEC Rainbow : used - I think I have a Rainbow boot disk here, but I'd have to : dig out a 5.25 floppy drive to check :-) Once you get the settings : right, you can just dd the disk to an image file. Well, here's the technical data I could find on the rainbow's disks (boy, I'm glad I got the technical docs set with the unit, it was over my head for the most part when I was 16, but it is perfectly readable to me now). I'm not sure what to put for the "gap" "trans" or "f_gap" parameters, so I'll include a little more info than most people would generally want. However, it may prove useful to other people trying to read different formats in the future. so here goes: -------------- 1 head (although I have drives with 2 heads) 10 sectors per track 80 tracks 250kB/s transfer rate 300rpm Track Format: Description No Bytes Contents Pre ID Gap 47 0x4e ID Fields Sync 8 0 Mark 3 0xa1 Header IDAM 1 FE Track Address 1 Track number (0-0x4f) Side Number 1 0 Sector Address 1 Sector (1-10) Bytes/sector code 1 0x2 CRC 1 Calc CRC [See note 1] Pose ID Gap 22 0x4e Data Fields Sync 12 0 Mark 3 0xa1 Data DAM 1 0xfb Data 512 CRC 2 CRC over data Post Amble 1 0 Pre_index gap 70 [2] 0x4e Note 1: I think the length here should be 2 rather than 1 based on other text Note 2: "This field is written once per track until an index field is encoutered" Whatever that means. -------------- Finally, I have the actual disk drives (both the RX-50 and the TEAC FD-55 which is a two sided version of the RX-50) that I could connect for this project. Any thumbnail about how to add a new type of drive to fd.c? What parameters do I need for it? Finally, I have a few minor cleanups of my own for the floppy driver. Mostly removing the last gasping vestiges of the ft driver that lived in fd.c. I'd also like to move isa/fd.c into dev/fd/fd{,_isa,_pccard}.c so we can eliminate one of the last remaining NCARD variable useages. Anybody special I should talk to before doing this? My guess is Joerg. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 11:46: 9 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F287937B401 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 11:45:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5AIje014790; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 11:45:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 11:45:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106101845.f5AIje014790@earth.backplane.com> To: Cejka Rudolf Cc: David Malone , Terry Lambert , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: signal(SIGCHLD, SIG_IGN) patch solving SUSv2 compatibility issue References: <20010610183637.A73238@dcse.fee.vutbr.cz> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :... : :sigemptyset(&sa.sa_mask); :sa.sa_flags = 0; :sa.sa_handler = SIG_IGN; :sigaction(SIGCHLD, &sa, NULL); : :zombies are still created in FreeBSD, which is against SUSv2. : :My citation was quoted directly from sigaction() page and not :from signal() page. Unfortunately, I do not have access to POSIX, :so I do not know if it is specified in SUSv2 only or if it is :specified in both SUSv2 and in POSIX. I'm afraid that it is in both. :However I think, that FreeBSD wants to be SUSv2 compliant too, or not? :... I did some research and while I couldn't find the official POSIX spec, I did read the SUSv2 spec carefully and I looked at a lot of manual pages. I believe your change is correct. We should disable zombie reaping if SIGCHLD is set to SIG_IGN. This is, in fact, how most systems do it. BSD is like the sickly child in some respects :-) Your (revised) patch, which I have reproduced below along with a little cleanup, looks correct. I compiled up a kernel with the revised patch and tested it, and it seems to work as advertised. I would say this should go into -current now. I would be happy to do this, or David Malone can since he provided the fix to the original patch. I would also recommend that we MFC the patch to -stable after a few days. It is highly unlikely to break anything. I suppose I could take the heat for that :-) Every major forking program I've ever written has had to set the sigaction flag *AND* set the signal handle to SIG_IGN to be portable, and while I probably won't stop, it would be nice to know that FreeBSD works both ways. -Matt Index: kern_sig.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/sys/kern/kern_sig.c,v retrieving revision 1.72.2.6 diff -u -r1.72.2.6 kern_sig.c --- kern_sig.c 2001/05/10 17:54:16 1.72.2.6 +++ kern_sig.c 2001/06/10 18:30:42 @@ -268,7 +268,9 @@ p->p_procsig->ps_flag |= PS_NOCLDSTOP; else p->p_procsig->ps_flag &= ~PS_NOCLDSTOP; - if (act->sa_flags & SA_NOCLDWAIT) { + if ((act->sa_flags & SA_NOCLDWAIT) || + ps->ps_sigact[_SIG_IDX(SIGCHLD)] == SIG_IGN + ) { /* * Paranoia: since SA_NOCLDWAIT is implemented * by reparenting the dying child to PID 1 (and @@ -279,8 +281,9 @@ p->p_procsig->ps_flag &= ~PS_NOCLDWAIT; else p->p_procsig->ps_flag |= PS_NOCLDWAIT; - } else + } else { p->p_procsig->ps_flag &= ~PS_NOCLDWAIT; + } } /* * Set bit in p_sigignore for signals that are set to SIG_IGN, @@ -438,6 +441,8 @@ * Reset no zombies if child dies flag as Solaris does. */ p->p_procsig->ps_flag &= ~PS_NOCLDWAIT; + if (ps->ps_sigact[_SIG_IDX(SIGCHLD)] == SIG_IGN) + ps->ps_sigact[_SIG_IDX(SIGCHLD)] = SIG_DFL; } /* To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 11:47: 2 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9339D37B40A; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 11:46:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@billy-club.village.org) Received: from billy-club.village.org (billy-club.village.org [10.0.0.3]) by rover.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5AIkq649455; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 12:46:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@billy-club.village.org) Received: from billy-club.village.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by billy-club.village.org (8.11.2/8.8.3) with ESMTP id f5AIo3l21071; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 12:50:07 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <200106101850.f5AIo3l21071@billy-club.village.org> To: Doug Rabson Subject: Re: newbussifying drivers Cc: Sergey Babkin , j mckitrick , "Matthew N. Dodd" , Mike Smith , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 10 Jun 2001 10:57:43 BST." References: Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 12:50:03 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message Doug Rabson writes: : Actually, the ex driver does have an identify method. The issue is that : the identify method uses 'unallocated' ports to do its search. It ought to : allocate them, do its tests and release them for the real probe but it : gets messy due to the fact that a device instance doesn't exist yet. This is ugly. Obviously you don't want to tresspass into another device's address space. The other problem is that the other device might not exist yet and hasn't snagged its resources. You could use the isa bus itself at the resource holder for these temporary resources. One big area we need to clean up is PNPBIOS devices. They should be probed *FIRST* before anything else (which is hard because the isa bus gets attached late on pci systems). We'd need to update our drivers in the tree, plus there's the "hints vs pnp" issue where some people want to specify hints to wire a device unit (eg, the sio that's at address 0xXXXX should be sio9). This is one rats nest that's still around that is going to be hard to solve. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 12:47:46 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hotmail.com (oe14.law10.hotmail.com [64.4.14.118]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 695FB37B401 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 12:47:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from esotericamit@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 12:47:44 -0700 X-Originating-IP: [202.60.136.19] From: "a" To: Subject: subscription Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 03:50:35 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01C0F229.AB9C6BF0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Jun 2001 19:47:44.0319 (UTC) FILETIME=[378DDCF0:01C0F1E6] Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C0F229.AB9C6BF0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable subscription of newsletter ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C0F229.AB9C6BF0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
subscription of=20 newsletter
------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C0F229.AB9C6BF0-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 12:55: 6 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from salmon.maths.tcd.ie (salmon.maths.tcd.ie [134.226.81.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id A218437B401 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 12:54:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from iedowse@maths.tcd.ie) Received: from walton.maths.tcd.ie by salmon.maths.tcd.ie with SMTP id ; 10 Jun 2001 20:54:58 +0100 (BST) To: Warner Losh Cc: Mark Hittinger , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Strange request: Reading RX-50 (aka DEC Rainbow 100) disks In-Reply-To: Your message of "Sun, 10 Jun 2001 12:25:04 MDT." <200106101825.f5AIP4l20899@billy-club.village.org> Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 20:54:58 +0100 From: Ian Dowse Message-ID: <200106102054.aa51838@salmon.maths.tcd.ie> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <200106101825.f5AIP4l20899@billy-club.village.org>, Warner Losh writ es: > >That's OK. The Rainbow disks have sectors numbered 1 through 10, for >both CP/M disks and MS-DOS disks. This makes things easier to cope >with. Great, then no driver changes are required. I've just tried it; I found a normal PC 5.25" drive, and I was able to read the DEC Rainbow boot disk I have here by doing # fdcontrol /dev/fd1 sectrac? []: 10 secsize? [2]: datalen? [0xff]: gap? [0x1b]: tracks? [80]: size? []: 800 steptrac? [1]: trans? []: 1 heads? []: 1 f_gap? [0x54]: f_inter? [1]: # hd /dev/fd1 |less Note: The `trans' values come from the 'FDC_???KBPS' #defines in fdreg.h. A value of 1 is 'FDC_300KBPS' which is different to the specs you quoted, but I think the PC standard 5.25" drive runs at 360rpm rather than 300. For a 300rpm drive you probably want a trans value of 2 (250kbps). I just left the `gap' and `f_gap' values at their defaults; I don't know the exact details of these fields, but I seem to remember that they are only used during writing and formatting, so you can ignore them for reading. >for this project. Any thumbnail about how to add a new type of drive >to fd.c? What parameters do I need for it? You could add an entry to the fd_types array in fd.c, but that requires linking the entry into a device node, so it's probably easier to just use fdcontrol. Ian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 17: 2: 2 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mass.dis.org (mass.dis.org [216.240.45.41]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECF1137B401 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 17:01:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from msmith@mass.dis.org) Received: from mass.dis.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mass.dis.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5B0CH202578; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 17:12:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from msmith@mass.dis.org) Message-Id: <200106110012.f5B0CH202578@mass.dis.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.1 10/15/1999 To: Warner Losh Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: newbussifying drivers In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 10 Jun 2001 12:50:03 MDT." <200106101850.f5AIo3l21071@billy-club.village.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 17:12:17 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > One big area we need to clean up is PNPBIOS devices. They should be > probed *FIRST* before anything else (which is hard because the isa bus > gets attached late on pci systems). This isn't actually such a problem; the space in which PNPBIOS devices tend to have their resources allocated is protected from abuse by other drivers (PCI won't allocate space in the 'ISA preferred' space). > We'd need to update our drivers > in the tree, plus there's the "hints vs pnp" issue where some people > want to specify hints to wire a device unit (eg, the sio that's at > address 0xXXXX should be sio9). This is one rats nest that's still > around that is going to be hard to solve. Wiring stuff sensibly seems to just be a few millimetres beyond reach, forever. 8( -- ... every activity meets with opposition, everyone who acts has his rivals and unfortunately opponents also. But not because people want to be opponents, rather because the tasks and relationships force people to take different points of view. [Dr. Fritz Todt] V I C T O R Y N O T V E N G E A N C E To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 17:17:37 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peter3.wemm.org (c1315225-a.plstn1.sfba.home.com [65.0.135.147]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2949B37B40B for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 17:17:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@wemm.org) Received: from overcee.netplex.com.au (overcee.wemm.org [10.0.0.3]) by peter3.wemm.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f5B0HNM70445 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 17:17:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@wemm.org) Received: from wemm.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by overcee.netplex.com.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9A7F380E; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 17:17:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@wemm.org) X-Mailer: exmh version 2.3.1 01/18/2001 with nmh-1.0.4 To: Gyori Sandor Cc: "Jacques A. Vidrine" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: nsswitch dynamically loadable modules In-Reply-To: <20010610200113.T89118-100000@fourier.szit.bme.hu> Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 17:17:23 -0700 From: Peter Wemm Message-Id: <20010611001723.C9A7F380E@overcee.netplex.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Gyori Sandor wrote: > Hello, > > Thank you for your detailed explanation, I'm sure it will be great. > > I have some short questions: > > On Sun, 10 Jun 2001, Jacques A. Vidrine wrote: > > > = I extended the implementation to support dynamically loaded > > sources, and ported nss_ldap to use the invented interface. These > > are the patches you referred to. This was a prototype to help me > > understand the issues. They will never be committed, and should > > not be used in production. > > By applying these patches (nsswitch & nss_ldap) did you get a proper > working authentication via LDAP? I applied them, but system doesn't know > LDAP's user names. This is my fault or I should even not try this way? This is probably why it wont be committed. If it uses dlopen() then it cannot work for the statically linked /bin/ls, /bin/sh, etc. Anything in / sbin or /bin will never be able to see the usernames. If you built the entire system with NOSHARED=NO, then /bin/ls, /bin/sh etc will be dynamically linked and the patches will probably work. However, you had better have /usr on your root (/) file system or you wont be able to boot. Linux's solution is to put the ld.so and libc.so onto the / partition in /lib. Cheers, -Peter -- Peter Wemm - peter@FreeBSD.org; peter@yahoo-inc.com; peter@netplex.com.au "All of this is for nothing if we don't go to the stars" - JMS/B5 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 17:20:56 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peter3.wemm.org (c1315225-a.plstn1.sfba.home.com [65.0.135.147]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69BED37B401 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 17:20:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@wemm.org) Received: from overcee.netplex.com.au (overcee.wemm.org [10.0.0.3]) by peter3.wemm.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f5B0KoM70474 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 17:20:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@wemm.org) Received: from wemm.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by overcee.netplex.com.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id 362CE380E; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 17:20:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@wemm.org) X-Mailer: exmh version 2.3.1 01/18/2001 with nmh-1.0.4 To: Matt Dillon Cc: Cejka Rudolf , David Malone , Terry Lambert , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: signal(SIGCHLD, SIG_IGN) patch solving SUSv2 compatibility issue In-Reply-To: <200106101845.f5AIje014790@earth.backplane.com> Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 17:20:50 -0700 From: Peter Wemm Message-Id: <20010611002050.362CE380E@overcee.netplex.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matt Dillon wrote: > > :... > : > :sigemptyset(&sa.sa_mask); > :sa.sa_flags = 0; > :sa.sa_handler = SIG_IGN; > :sigaction(SIGCHLD, &sa, NULL); > : > :zombies are still created in FreeBSD, which is against SUSv2. > : > :My citation was quoted directly from sigaction() page and not > :from signal() page. Unfortunately, I do not have access to POSIX, > :so I do not know if it is specified in SUSv2 only or if it is > :specified in both SUSv2 and in POSIX. I'm afraid that it is in both. > :However I think, that FreeBSD wants to be SUSv2 compliant too, or not? > :... > > I did some research and while I couldn't find the official POSIX > spec, I did read the SUSv2 spec carefully and I looked at a lot of > manual pages. > > I believe your change is correct. We should disable zombie reaping > if SIGCHLD is set to SIG_IGN. This is, in fact, how most systems do > it. BSD is like the sickly child in some respects :-) > > Your (revised) patch, which I have reproduced below along with a > little cleanup, looks correct. I compiled up a kernel with the > revised patch and tested it, and it seems to work as advertised. > > I would say this should go into -current now. I would be happy to > do this, or David Malone can since he provided the fix to the original > patch. I agree totally. This should have been done ages ago, I've been burned on it a few times, but never badly enough to go fix it. > I would also recommend that we MFC the patch to -stable after a few days. > It is highly unlikely to break anything. I suppose I could take the > heat for that :-) Every major forking program I've ever written has had > to set the sigaction flag *AND* set the signal handle to SIG_IGN to be > portable, and while I probably won't stop, it would be nice to know that > FreeBSD works both ways. Yes. > -Matt Cheers, -Peter -- Peter Wemm - peter@FreeBSD.org; peter@yahoo-inc.com; peter@netplex.com.au "All of this is for nothing if we don't go to the stars" - JMS/B5 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 17:52: 7 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64D0C37B403; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 17:52:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@billy-club.village.org) Received: from billy-club.village.org (billy-club.village.org [10.0.0.3]) by rover.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5B0q3650609; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 18:52:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@billy-club.village.org) Received: from billy-club.village.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by billy-club.village.org (8.11.2/8.8.3) with ESMTP id f5B0tLl22229; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 18:55:21 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <200106110055.f5B0tLl22229@billy-club.village.org> To: Mike Smith Subject: Re: newbussifying drivers Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 10 Jun 2001 17:12:17 PDT." <200106110012.f5B0CH202578@mass.dis.org> References: <200106110012.f5B0CH202578@mass.dis.org> Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 18:55:21 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <200106110012.f5B0CH202578@mass.dis.org> Mike Smith writes: : > One big area we need to clean up is PNPBIOS devices. They should be : > probed *FIRST* before anything else (which is hard because the isa bus : > gets attached late on pci systems). : : This isn't actually such a problem; the space in which PNPBIOS devices : tend to have their resources allocated is protected from abuse by other : drivers (PCI won't allocate space in the 'ISA preferred' space). Interrupts are the only thing that really matters. pccard might want to allocate low memory, but come to think of it, it usually doesn't have to do that. : > We'd need to update our drivers : > in the tree, plus there's the "hints vs pnp" issue where some people : > want to specify hints to wire a device unit (eg, the sio that's at : > address 0xXXXX should be sio9). This is one rats nest that's still : > around that is going to be hard to solve. : : Wiring stuff sensibly seems to just be a few millimetres beyond reach, : forever. 8( heh. I had an idea today while squirrel proofing my shed. What if we looked at the hints for a device that's plug and play and if they match the hints, use that device (assuming it accepts the PnP Id). That is, give preferencial treatment to the wired devices. But that might get ugly. I'd have to think about it more. Of course, there is still the "sio on pci" problem that we'd need to overcome too. Since PCI is probed before isa, the pci sio devices wind up as sio0 (or would if I didn't kludge them like I do). Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 17:53:42 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B50037B40C for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 17:53:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@billy-club.village.org) Received: from billy-club.village.org (billy-club.village.org [10.0.0.3]) by rover.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5B0rU650617; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 18:53:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@billy-club.village.org) Received: from billy-club.village.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by billy-club.village.org (8.11.2/8.8.3) with ESMTP id f5B0uml22242; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 18:56:48 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <200106110056.f5B0uml22242@billy-club.village.org> To: Peter Wemm Subject: Re: nsswitch dynamically loadable modules Cc: Gyori Sandor , "Jacques A. Vidrine" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 10 Jun 2001 17:17:23 PDT." <20010611001723.C9A7F380E@overcee.netplex.com.au> References: <20010611001723.C9A7F380E@overcee.netplex.com.au> Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 18:56:48 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <20010611001723.C9A7F380E@overcee.netplex.com.au> Peter Wemm writes: : If you built the : entire system with NOSHARED=NO, then /bin/ls, /bin/sh etc will be dynamically : linked and the patches will probably work. However, you had better have : /usr on your root (/) file system or you wont be able to boot. Linux's : solution is to put the ld.so and libc.so onto the / partition in /lib. I've built a full world NOSHARED=NO and it works great on single partition systems. I strongly suspect that a dynamic nsswitch would work in that case too. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 18: 3:34 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from whizzo.transsys.com (whizzo.TransSys.COM [144.202.42.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A60E437B40C; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 18:03:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from louie@whizzo.transsys.com) Received: from whizzo.transsys.com (#6@localhost.transsys.com [127.0.0.1]) by whizzo.transsys.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5B13HI87819; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 21:03:17 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from louie@whizzo.transsys.com) Message-Id: <200106110103.f5B13HI87819@whizzo.transsys.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.3.1 01/18/2001 with nmh-1.0.4 To: Mike Smith Cc: tlambert2@mindspring.com, Bsdguru@aol.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Image-URL: http://www.transsys.com/louie/images/louie-mail.jpg From: "Louis A. Mamakos" Subject: Re: How to disable software TCP checksumming? References: <200106092135.f59LZW701229@mass.dis.org> In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 09 Jun 2001 14:35:32 PDT." <200106092135.f59LZW701229@mass.dis.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 21:03:17 -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Setting aside the degree to which you choose to be paranoid about where data can be corrupted, and the likelyhood thereof-- there is an architectural issue here, which is that the CRC provided by your friendly neighborhood Ethernet NIC card only protects the data over one Ethernet subnetwork. The TCP checksum, and TCP in general, provides end-to-end semantics, independent of the concatenation of physical links the TCP segments might transit from the source to the destination. If you have an end-to-end protocol, with end-to-end semantics, then you need and end-to-end mechanism. Remember years ago when Sun by default shipped their OS with UDP checksums disabled for UDP-based NFS traffic. The position was that you had this strong 32 bit CRC protecting your NFS traffic between the client and server (on the same LAN, of course) and the UDP checksum was wasteful and degrading performance. And people had mysterious things happen to their files when running UDP/NFS over WAN links and other interesting media and circumstances. Everything old is new again. louie To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jun 10 19:51:50 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from odin.ac.hmc.edu (Odin.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.75]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5989A37B401 for ; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 19:51:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brdavis@odin.ac.hmc.edu) Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by odin.ac.hmc.edu (8.11.0/8.11.0) id f5B2pZd20240; Sun, 10 Jun 2001 19:51:35 -0700 Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 19:51:35 -0700 From: Brooks Davis To: Hajimu UMEMOTO Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, brian@Awfulhak.org, phk@critter.freebsd.dk Subject: Re: cloning network interfaces Message-ID: <20010610195135.A19608@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> References: <200106071119.f57BJr766008@hak.lan.Awfulhak.org> <20010607164812.A32379@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> <20010608191904.A18847@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> <20010610.232907.74740159.ume@mahoroba.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="/9DWx/yDrRhgMJTb" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010610.232907.74740159.ume@mahoroba.org>; from ume@mahoroba.org on Sun, Jun 10, 2001 at 11:29:07PM +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --/9DWx/yDrRhgMJTb Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Jun 10, 2001 at 11:29:07PM +0900, Hajimu UMEMOTO wrote: > I think it is not BSD network way. Recent NetBSD has network > interface cloning. It uses SIOCIFCREATE and SIOCIFDESTROY. It may > good to port it to FreeBSD. I'll take a look at it. I'm not convinced the /dev/if_gif way is wrong. Creation and destruction is an out of band operation and using socket interface IOCTLS seems to change their semantics significantly. Without devfs, I'd probably agree because you'd have to add and remove the /dev/if_gif device manualy, but with it, device creation is basicaly free (ok, for now it takes a major, but not for long.) Anyway, I'll consider it, but I don't promise to adopt it. > NetBSD's ifconfig has `create' and `destroy' keyword for it. >=20 > You can create gif interface by > ifconfig gif0 create > or > ifconfig gif0 create tunnel 10.0.0.1 10.0.2.2 > To destroy gif interface: > ifconfig gif0 destroy I've moved to `plumb' and `umplumb' like solaris. I'll definatly add `create' and `destroy'. > BTW, gifconfig will be obsoleted soon as KAME and other BSDs did. Good, it doesn't make much sense. -- Brooks --=20 Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. PGP fingerprint 655D 519C 26A7 82E7 2529 9BF0 5D8E 8BE9 F238 1AD4 --/9DWx/yDrRhgMJTb Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE7JDI2XY6L6fI4GtQRAoI2AKCmhOmlkRPAzqQZ7I/pcY3HTkY+/ACgyCRV p+/qPpy+vAkxa6vSo5sm/lc= =j6TJ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --/9DWx/yDrRhgMJTb-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 0:38:17 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.viasoft.com.cn (unknown [61.153.1.177]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2064D37B405 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 00:38:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bsddiy@163.net) Received: from William ([192.168.1.98]) by mail.viasoft.com.cn (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA12672 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:38:36 +0800 Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:49:30 +0800 From: David Xu X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.48f) Personal Reply-To: bsddiy@163.net Organization: Viasoft X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: import NetBSD rc system Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello, Is there any plan to import NetBSD rc system, I am willing to see it appears in FreeBSD 5.0. -- David Xu To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 1:44:57 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dt051n37.san.rr.com (dt051n37.san.rr.com [204.210.32.55]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2577D37B407 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 01:44:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DougB@DougBarton.net) Received: from DougBarton.net (master [10.0.0.2]) by dt051n37.san.rr.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA71282; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 01:44:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DougB@DougBarton.net) Message-ID: <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 01:44:26 -0700 From: Doug Barton Organization: Triborough Bridge & Tunnel Authority X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.12 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bsddiy@163.net Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG David Xu wrote: > > Hello, > > Is there any plan to import NetBSD rc system, > I am willing to see it appears in FreeBSD 5.0. Yes. Several of us have started work on it. Personally, the last two times I carved time out to work on it I got bombed by unstable -current. Doug -- If you're never wrong, you're not trying hard enough. Do YOU Yahoo!? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 2:29:22 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4AB3537B405 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 02:29:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from m.seaman@plasm.demon.co.uk) Received: from plasm.demon.co.uk ([194.222.58.229]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 159O0X-000Oq9-0K for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 09:29:14 +0000 Received: (from matthew@localhost) by plasm.demon.co.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5B9SwQ26245 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 10:28:58 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from matthew) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 10:28:30 +0100 From: Matthew Seaman To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Perl module for periodic scripts Message-ID: <20010611102830.A26191@plasm.demon.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Dear all, I've slung together a tiny little perl module to enable periodic(8) scripts to access periodic.conf(5) settings without having to use sh(1). I thought it might be useful to some, so I tidied it up and made it available for download at: http://www.plasm.demon.co.uk/FreeBSD-Periodic-0.1.tar.gz This all came about when I foolishly started porting some of the periodic scripts over to a Solaris8 box. Particularly 470.status-named. Solaris `date' doesn't support the `-v' flag, so: date -v-1d '+%b %d' | sed 's/0\(.\)$/ \1/' becomes perl -MPOSIX "print strftime "%b %e", localtime (time - 24 * 60 * 60);" and then Solaris `uniq' doesn't support the `-i' flag so: sort -f | uniq -ic | becomes: perl -ne '$s{lc $_}++; \ END { for (sort { $s{$a} cmp $s{$b} } keys %s) { \ printf "%4d $_", $s{$_} } }' by which time the script might just as well be pure perl anyhow... Cheers, Matthew -- Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil. 26 The Paddocks Savill Way Marlow Tel: +44 1628 476614 Bucks., SL7 1TH UK To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 3: 4:56 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ringworld.nanolink.com (ringworld.nanolink.com [195.24.48.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 47FF737B403 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 03:04:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roam@orbitel.bg) Received: (qmail 7158 invoked by uid 1000); 11 Jun 2001 10:03:32 -0000 Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 13:03:32 +0300 From: Peter Pentchev To: reichert@numachi.com Cc: perlbug@perl.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: oct() doesn't handle binary strings Message-ID: <20010611130332.B564@ringworld.oblivion.bg> Mail-Followup-To: reichert@numachi.com, perlbug@perl.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org References: <20010609201248.58417.qmail@natto.numachi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010609201248.58417.qmail@natto.numachi.com>; from reichert@natto.numachi.com on Sat, Jun 09, 2001 at 08:12:48PM -0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, Jun 09, 2001 at 08:12:48PM -0000, reichert@natto.numachi.com wrote: > > This is a bug report for perl from reichert@numachi.com, > generated with the help of perlbug 1.26 running under perl 5.00503. > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > [Please enter your report here] > > From perlfunc(1): > > oct EXPR ... > (If EXPR happens to start off with 0x, interprets > it as a hex string. If EXPR starts off with 0b, > it is interpreted as a binary string.) > > But the binary string conversion doesn't seem to work: > > natto% perl -e 'print oct("0b11000110")."\n"' > 0 > > This is otherwise a valid binary string: > > natto% perl -e 'print unpack('C', (pack("B8", "11000110")))."\n"' > 198 > > The hex string conversion function does work: > > natto% perl -e 'print oct("0xC6")."\n"' > 198 The following comments pertain to the version of Perl used in FreeBSD, since this was cited as a FreeBSD 4.0 problem. This is still true for Perl 5.005_03 in -stable, but it seems to have been fixed in Perl 5.6.0 in -current. I believe this will be fixed when Perl 5.6 is MFC'd (btw, FreeBSD developers, FreeBSD Perl gurus, when/if shall Perl 5.6 be MFC'd? :) Thus, I believe this is not (anymore) a Perl problem per se, since it is fixed in the newer versions. G'luck, Peter -- If I had finished this sentence, To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 3:58:22 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from salmon.maths.tcd.ie (salmon.maths.tcd.ie [134.226.81.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 8134937B40C for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 03:58:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dwmalone@maths.tcd.ie) Received: from walton.maths.tcd.ie by salmon.maths.tcd.ie with SMTP id ; 11 Jun 2001 11:58:10 +0100 (BST) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:58:06 +0100 From: David Malone To: Peter Wemm Cc: Matt Dillon , Cejka Rudolf , Terry Lambert , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: signal(SIGCHLD, SIG_IGN) patch solving SUSv2 compatibility issue Message-ID: <20010611115806.A53216@walton.maths.tcd.ie> References: <200106101845.f5AIje014790@earth.backplane.com> <20010611002050.362CE380E@overcee.netplex.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010611002050.362CE380E@overcee.netplex.com.au>; from peter@wemm.org on Sun, Jun 10, 2001 at 05:20:50PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Jun 10, 2001 at 05:20:50PM -0700, Peter Wemm wrote: > I agree totally. This should have been done ages ago, I've been burned on > it a few times, but never badly enough to go fix it. I've committed this - I'll let Matt do the MFC when he feels ready. David. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 7:16:27 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gw.nectar.com (gw.nectar.com [208.42.49.153]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1B5137B403 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 07:16:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nectar@nectar.com) Received: from shade.nectar.com (shade.nectar.com [10.0.1.110]) by gw.nectar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D46BAF61E for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 09:16:24 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from nectar@localhost) by shade.nectar.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5BEGEK17397; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 09:16:14 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from nectar) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 09:16:14 -0500 From: "Jacques A. Vidrine" To: Gyori Sandor Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: nsswitch dynamically loadable modules Message-ID: <20010611091614.B17336@shade.nectar.com> Mail-Followup-To: "Jacques A. Vidrine" , Gyori Sandor , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <20010610125044.A60711@hellblazer.nectar.com> <20010610200113.T89118-100000@fourier.szit.bme.hu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010610200113.T89118-100000@fourier.szit.bme.hu>; from gyori@szit.bme.hu on Sun, Jun 10, 2001 at 08:14:57PM +0200 X-Url: http://www.nectar.com/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Jun 10, 2001 at 08:14:57PM +0200, Gyori Sandor wrote: [snip] > By applying these patches (nsswitch & nss_ldap) did you get a proper > working authentication via LDAP? I applied them, but system doesn't know > LDAP's user names. This is my fault or I should even not try this way? I didn't `apply' these patches -- I generated the patches. And yes, it worked for me at the time. However, as I already stated, that was a throw-away implementation and I did not keep them in sync with FreeBSD. So perhaps they are broken with regards to -STABLE today, or perhaps you have something misconfigured in LDAP. > May I see this code anywhere? I can't find info about above way on your > homepage. I have not made it publicly available. It would not do you any good anyway, as it is not complete. Cheers, -- Jacques Vidrine / n@nectar.com / jvidrine@verio.net / nectar@FreeBSD.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 7:31:49 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gw.nectar.com (gw.nectar.com [208.42.49.153]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D575E37B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 07:31:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nectar@nectar.com) Received: from shade.nectar.com (shade.nectar.com [10.0.1.110]) by gw.nectar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 542AAAF61E for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 09:31:46 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from nectar@localhost) by shade.nectar.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5BEVV617438; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 09:31:31 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from nectar) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 09:31:31 -0500 From: "Jacques A. Vidrine" To: Peter Wemm Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: nsswitch dynamically loadable modules Message-ID: <20010611093131.A17422@shade.nectar.com> Mail-Followup-To: "Jacques A. Vidrine" , Peter Wemm , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <20010610200113.T89118-100000@fourier.szit.bme.hu> <20010611001723.C9A7F380E@overcee.netplex.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010611001723.C9A7F380E@overcee.netplex.com.au>; from peter@wemm.org on Sun, Jun 10, 2001 at 05:17:23PM -0700 X-Url: http://www.nectar.com/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Jun 10, 2001 at 05:17:23PM -0700, Peter Wemm wrote: > This is probably why it wont be committed. If it uses dlopen() then it > cannot work for the statically linked /bin/ls, /bin/sh, etc. Anything in / > sbin or /bin will never be able to see the usernames. If you built the > entire system with NOSHARED=NO, then /bin/ls, /bin/sh etc will be dynamically > linked and the patches will probably work. However, you had better have > /usr on your root (/) file system or you wont be able to boot. Linux's > solution is to put the ld.so and libc.so onto the / partition in /lib. This is the evolution I have in mind: nsswitch static only (FreeBSD-CURRENT today) | V nsswitch w/static support for files, dns, nis; modules can be added for other sources; these modules may be compiled statically as part of libc, but would generally be loaded dynamically (this is roughly the stage the prototype was at) | V `module' implementing stubs to communicate with an external process; the external process itself can dynamically load other modules (this is my target before my next commit to -CURRENT) | V (finished) the stub/external process module is a standard way of providing additional sources, giving three ways to `link' in modules: static, dynamic, stub The static & stub cases would support all executables; the dynamic case of course would only be available for dynamically-linked executables. Supporting the `stub' case was the primary cause for designing a new nsdispatch() API. Cheers, -- Jacques Vidrine / n@nectar.com / jvidrine@verio.net / nectar@FreeBSD.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 8:27:57 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peter3.wemm.org (c1315225-a.plstn1.sfba.home.com [65.0.135.147]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1662037B401; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 08:27:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@wemm.org) Received: from overcee.netplex.com.au (overcee.wemm.org [10.0.0.3]) by peter3.wemm.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f5BFRcM73129; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 08:27:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@wemm.org) Received: from wemm.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by overcee.netplex.com.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8709B390F; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 08:27:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@wemm.org) X-Mailer: exmh version 2.3.1 01/18/2001 with nmh-1.0.4 To: Brian Somers Cc: Brooks Davis , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Poul-Henning Kamp , freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cloning network interfaces In-Reply-To: <200106101205.f5AC5DA31455@hak.lan.Awfulhak.org> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 08:27:37 -0700 From: Peter Wemm Message-Id: <20010611152737.8709B390F@overcee.netplex.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Brian Somers wrote: > > I went ahead and nuked the auto-creation and -D flag in favor of plumb > > and unplumb in the patch at: > > > > http://www.one-eyed-alien.net/~brooks/FreeBSD/gif.diff > > > > This version includes a change to rc.network to plumb gif interfaces > > before calling gifcreate. This will still trip up users who build > > static gif tunnels from hosts with dynamic addresses since they can't > > run gifconfig yet, but we don't really have any means of supporting that > > in the rc files yet anyway. > > > > -- Brooks > > This looks good to me. I've cc'd freebsd-arch to see if anyone else > wants to comment. If there are no objections, I'll test & commit it > in about a week. Personally, I'd prefer create/destroy instead of plumb/unplumb. The Solaris plumb command is for doing 'STREAMS plumbing' - ie: connecting all the streams pipes and modules together. Creating/deleting interfaces on BSD systems IMHO has nothing in common with that concept. We are creating/destroying interfaces, not connecting/disconnecting streams nodes (plumbing). Cheers, -Peter -- Peter Wemm - peter@FreeBSD.org; peter@yahoo-inc.com; peter@netplex.com.au "All of this is for nothing if we don't go to the stars" - JMS/B5 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 9:19:55 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dt051n37.san.rr.com (dt051n37.san.rr.com [204.210.32.55]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06C6437B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 09:19:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DougB@DougBarton.net) Received: from DougBarton.net (master [10.0.0.2]) by dt051n37.san.rr.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA74296; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 09:19:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DougB@DougBarton.net) Message-ID: <3B24EFA0.E46604CA@DougBarton.net> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 09:19:44 -0700 From: Doug Barton Organization: Triborough Bridge & Tunnel Authority X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.12 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Peter Pentchev Cc: reichert@numachi.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: oct() doesn't handle binary strings References: <20010609201248.58417.qmail@natto.numachi.com> <20010611130332.B564@ringworld.oblivion.bg> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Peter Pentchev wrote: > (btw, FreeBSD developers, FreeBSD Perl gurus, > when/if shall Perl 5.6 be MFC'd? :) First perl 5.6.1 has to be imported to -current, then shaken out, then _possibly_ it will be MFC'ed, but it's also quite possible that it won't be MFC'ed at all. Doug -- If you're never wrong, you're not trying hard enough. Do YOU Yahoo!? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 9:22: 0 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from odin.ac.hmc.edu (Odin.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.75]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D17037B405; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 09:21:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brdavis@odin.ac.hmc.edu) Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by odin.ac.hmc.edu (8.11.0/8.11.0) id f5BGLll09719; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 09:21:47 -0700 Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 09:21:47 -0700 From: Brooks Davis To: Peter Wemm Cc: Brian Somers , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Poul-Henning Kamp , freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cloning network interfaces Message-ID: <20010611092147.A7059@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> References: <200106101205.f5AC5DA31455@hak.lan.Awfulhak.org> <20010611152737.8709B390F@overcee.netplex.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="MGYHOYXEY6WxJCY8" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010611152737.8709B390F@overcee.netplex.com.au>; from peter@wemm.org on Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 08:27:37AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --MGYHOYXEY6WxJCY8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 08:27:37AM -0700, Peter Wemm wrote: > Personally, I'd prefer create/destroy instead of plumb/unplumb. The Solaris > plumb command is for doing 'STREAMS plumbing' - ie: connecting all the > streams pipes and modules together. Creating/deleting interfaces on > BSD systems IMHO has nothing in common with that concept. We are > creating/destroying interfaces, not connecting/disconnecting streams > nodes (plumbing). I've made create/destory the default names with plumb and unplumb standing in as SysV compatability parameters because that seems to be the ifconfig way. The diff at: http://www.one-eyed-alien.net/~brooks/FreeBSD/gif.diff has been updated. I'm still thinking about adopting the NetBSD SIOIF{CREATE,DESTORY} interface. -- Brooks Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. PGP fingerprint 655D 519C 26A7 82E7 2529 9BF0 5D8E 8BE9 F238 1AD4 --MGYHOYXEY6WxJCY8 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE7JPAaXY6L6fI4GtQRAhasAKCU65ze+2o18Kyyp1ieEYqxrYQsqQCgtwGi /CiT3DIk6wip9LM7PyVRB1U= =H8x3 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --MGYHOYXEY6WxJCY8-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 10:38:10 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from birch.ripe.net (birch.ripe.net [193.0.1.96]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1025F37B407 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 10:37:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ms@laptop.6bone.nl) Received: from laptop.6bone.nl (kantoor.ripe.net [193.0.1.98]) by birch.ripe.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id TAA01936; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 19:37:40 +0200 (CEST) Received: (nullmailer pid 78050 invoked by uid 1000); Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:47:18 -0000 Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 17:47:17 +0200 From: Mark Santcroos To: Doug Barton Cc: bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> References: <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net>; from DougB@DougBarton.net on Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 01:44:26AM -0700 X-Handles: MS6-6BONE, MS32260-NIC, MS18417-RIPE Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG What is the difference between the present rc scheme and the NetBSD one? Mark On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 01:44:26AM -0700, Doug Barton wrote: > David Xu wrote: > > > > Hello, > > > > Is there any plan to import NetBSD rc system, > > I am willing to see it appears in FreeBSD 5.0. > > Yes. Several of us have started work on it. Personally, the last two times > I carved time out to work on it I got bombed by unstable -current. > > Doug > -- > If you're never wrong, you're not trying hard enough. > > Do YOU Yahoo!? > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- Mark Santcroos RIPE Network Coordination Centre http://www.ripe.net/home/mark/ New Projects Group/TTM To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 10:57:27 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E219137B429 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 10:57:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@billy-club.village.org) Received: from billy-club.village.org (billy-club.village.org [10.0.0.3]) by rover.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5BHvI654012; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:57:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@billy-club.village.org) Received: from billy-club.village.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by billy-club.village.org (8.11.2/8.8.3) with ESMTP id f5BI0il25446; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 12:00:44 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> To: Mark Santcroos Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Cc: Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 11 Jun 2001 17:47:17 +0200." <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> References: <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 12:00:43 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> Mark Santcroos writes: : What is the difference between the present rc scheme and the NetBSD one? The NetBSD rc scheme, in a nutshell, put each thing into its own file and does order dependencies automatically. Ours is one big monolithic beast that kinda can do extra things, but only if their order can be coerced into being right. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 11:13:14 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from birch.ripe.net (birch.ripe.net [193.0.1.96]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC52E37B407 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:13:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ms@laptop.6bone.nl) Received: from laptop.6bone.nl (kantoor.ripe.net [193.0.1.98]) by birch.ripe.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id UAA06881; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:12:45 +0200 (CEST) Received: (nullmailer pid 15794 invoked by uid 1000); Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:12:44 -0000 Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:12:44 +0200 From: Mark Santcroos To: Warner Losh Cc: Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010611201243.B77956@laptop.6bone.nl> References: <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org>; from imp@village.org on Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 12:00:43PM -0600 X-Handles: MS6-6BONE, MS32260-NIC, MS18417-RIPE Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Can it be called SysV style? Or not seperated in that way? (I must say, the big ugly rc thing is the only thing I don't like about FreeBSD, I'm very much in favor of the SysV style init. But thats another war ;) Mark On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 12:00:43PM -0600, Warner Losh wrote: > In message <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> Mark Santcroos writes: > : What is the difference between the present rc scheme and the NetBSD one? > > The NetBSD rc scheme, in a nutshell, put each thing into its own file > and does order dependencies automatically. Ours is one big monolithic > beast that kinda can do extra things, but only if their order can be > coerced into being right. > > Warner -- Mark Santcroos RIPE Network Coordination Centre http://www.ripe.net/home/mark/ New Projects Group/TTM To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 11:20: 6 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dt051n37.san.rr.com (dt051n37.san.rr.com [204.210.32.55]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA4EB37B407 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:19:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DougB@DougBarton.net) Received: from slave (Studded@slave [10.0.0.1]) by dt051n37.san.rr.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA75292; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:19:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DougB@DougBarton.net) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:19:37 -0700 (PDT) From: Doug Barton X-X-Sender: To: Mark Santcroos Cc: Warner Losh , , Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: <20010611201243.B77956@laptop.6bone.nl> Message-ID: <20010611111756.R75275-100000@dt051n37.san.rr.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 11 Jun 2001, Mark Santcroos wrote: > Can it be called SysV style? No, for two reasons. First, System V style rc structure relies on transitions between run levels to do its work. FreeBSD does not plan to implement run levels, and NetBSD's code does not depend on this. The other reason is that when you say "System V" anything, people have immediate negative reactions that are based purely on emotion. Doug -- If you're never wrong, you're not trying hard enough. Do YOU Yahoo!? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 11:27:30 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from harmony.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D3EF37B405 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:27:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5BIR2V38517; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 12:27:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Message-Id: <200106111827.f5BIR2V38517@harmony.village.org> To: Mark Santcroos Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Cc: Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:12:44 +0200." <20010611201243.B77956@laptop.6bone.nl> References: <20010611201243.B77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 12:27:02 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <20010611201243.B77956@laptop.6bone.nl> Mark Santcroos writes: : Can it be called SysV style? Or not seperated in that way? : (I must say, the big ugly rc thing is the only thing I don't like about : FreeBSD, I'm very much in favor of the SysV style init. But thats another : war ;) It specifically isn't SysV style. It works. SysV style encodes the startup order in the file NAMES. The NetBSD rc system encodes it in the files themselves. A big improvement. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 11:29:50 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from harmony.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E68D37B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:29:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5BITaV39331; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 12:29:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Message-Id: <200106111829.f5BITaV39331@harmony.village.org> To: Doug Barton Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Cc: Mark Santcroos , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:19:37 PDT." <20010611111756.R75275-100000@dt051n37.san.rr.com> References: <20010611111756.R75275-100000@dt051n37.san.rr.com> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 12:29:35 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <20010611111756.R75275-100000@dt051n37.san.rr.com> Doug Barton writes: : reason is that when you say "System V" anything, people have immediate : negative reactions that are based purely on emotion. S01My S02reactions S03to S04system S05V S06is S07not S08based S09purely S10on S11a S12pruely S13emotional S14reaction. S99Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 11:42:53 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [204.156.12.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 409DF37B401; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:42:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (robert@fledge.pr.watson.org [192.0.2.3]) by fledge.watson.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f5BIetf53922; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 14:41:00 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 14:40:54 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Watson X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org To: Brooks Davis Cc: Peter Wemm , Brian Somers , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Poul-Henning Kamp , freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cloning network interfaces In-Reply-To: <20010611092147.A7059@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 11 Jun 2001, Brooks Davis wrote: > On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 08:27:37AM -0700, Peter Wemm wrote: > > Personally, I'd prefer create/destroy instead of plumb/unplumb. The Solaris > > plumb command is for doing 'STREAMS plumbing' - ie: connecting all the > > streams pipes and modules together. Creating/deleting interfaces on > > BSD systems IMHO has nothing in common with that concept. We are > > creating/destroying interfaces, not connecting/disconnecting streams > > nodes (plumbing). > > I've made create/destory the default names with plumb and unplumb > standing in as SysV compatability parameters because that seems to be > the ifconfig way. The diff at: > > http://www.one-eyed-alien.net/~brooks/FreeBSD/gif.diff > > has been updated. I'm still thinking about adopting the NetBSD > SIOIF{CREATE,DESTORY} interface. An advantage to also supporting the ioctl interface is that it permits interface cloning to be used on systems where devfs is not used, or where there are parts of the system where devfs is unavailable (i.e., various forms of chroots). I think devfs is cool and all, but given the existance of fairly sensical non-devfs ways to do things, I'm tempted suggest supporting them also. Robert N M Watson FreeBSD Core Team, TrustedBSD Project robert@fledge.watson.org NAI Labs, Safeport Network Services To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 11:43: 4 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sasami.jurai.net (sasami.jurai.net [64.0.106.45]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CDD0237B409 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:42:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from scanner@jurai.net) Received: from localhost (scanner@localhost) by sasami.jurai.net (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA76421; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 14:42:18 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 14:42:18 -0400 (EDT) From: To: Warner Losh Cc: Doug Barton , Mark Santcroos , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: <200106111829.f5BITaV39331@harmony.village.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 11 Jun 2001, Warner Losh wrote: > In message <20010611111756.R75275-100000@dt051n37.san.rr.com> Doug Barton writes: > : reason is that when you say "System V" anything, people have immediate > : negative reactions that are based purely on emotion. > > S01My S02reactions S03to S04system S05V S06is S07not S08based > S09purely S10on S11a S12pruely S13emotional S14reaction. > > S99Warner S100Amen! ============================================================================= -Chris Watson (316) 326-3862 | Sr. Unix Administrator Work: chris.watson@twa.com | Trans World Airlines, Kansas City, MO Home: scanner@jurai.net | http://www.twa.com ============================================================================= WINDOWS: "Where do you want to go today?" LINUX: "Where do you want to go tomorrow?" BSD: "Are you guys coming or what?" ============================================================================= irc.openprojects.net #FreeBSD -Join the revolution! ICQ: 20016186 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 11:48:45 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from odin.ac.hmc.edu (Odin.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.75]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08C8C37B405; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:48:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brdavis@odin.ac.hmc.edu) Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by odin.ac.hmc.edu (8.11.0/8.11.0) id f5BIma229454; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:48:36 -0700 Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:48:36 -0700 From: Brooks Davis To: Robert Watson Cc: Peter Wemm , Brian Somers , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Poul-Henning Kamp , freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cloning network interfaces Message-ID: <20010611114836.A29046@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> References: <20010611092147.A7059@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="vtzGhvizbBRQ85DL" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from rwatson@FreeBSD.ORG on Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 02:40:54PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --vtzGhvizbBRQ85DL Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 02:40:54PM -0400, Robert Watson wrote: > An advantage to also supporting the ioctl interface is that it permits > interface cloning to be used on systems where devfs is not used, or where > there are parts of the system where devfs is unavailable (i.e., various > forms of chroots). I think devfs is cool and all, but given the existance > of fairly sensical non-devfs ways to do things, I'm tempted suggest > supporting them also. Actually, the currently implemented method doesn't required devfs. It's just somewhat easier to use in the devfs case because it doesn't require a mknod then. I think there are enough good reasons for following the NetBSD example that's I'll probalby do it. I'm currently trying to figure out how they implemented it. -- Brooks --=20 Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. PGP fingerprint 655D 519C 26A7 82E7 2529 9BF0 5D8E 8BE9 F238 1AD4 --vtzGhvizbBRQ85DL Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE7JRKDXY6L6fI4GtQRAoTmAJ9kSVYezDgFtmbPj8J814SGIbSCxQCg5FGE f5QcMjJu3uwqpa/5oqZpw6o= =eDb9 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --vtzGhvizbBRQ85DL-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 11:49:12 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from critter.freebsd.dk (critter.freebsd.dk [212.242.86.163]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 038BB37B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:49:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) Received: from critter (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.freebsd.dk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5BImJr23783; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:48:19 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) To: scanner@jurai.net Cc: Warner Losh , Doug Barton , Mark Santcroos , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 11 Jun 2001 14:42:18 EDT." Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:48:19 +0200 Message-ID: <23781.992285299@critter> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message , scanner @jurai.net writes: >On Mon, 11 Jun 2001, Warner Losh wrote: > >> In message <20010611111756.R75275-100000@dt051n37.san.rr.com> Doug Barton writes: >> : reason is that when you say "System V" anything, people have immediate >> : negative reactions that are based purely on emotion. >> >> S01My S02reactions S03to S04system S05V S06is S07not S08based >> S09purely S10on S11a S12pruely S13emotional S14reaction. >> >> S99Warner > >S100Amen! Which, maybe not by design, shows how butt-ugly the SVID /etc/rc system is... SVID /etc/rc, from the people who brought you the 32 bit namespace of SVID IPC... -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 phk@FreeBSD.ORG | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 11:50:10 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from critter.freebsd.dk (critter.freebsd.dk [212.242.86.163]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED8AA37B407; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:50:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) Received: from critter (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.freebsd.dk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5BInpr23808; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:49:51 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) To: Robert Watson Cc: Brooks Davis , Peter Wemm , Brian Somers , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cloning network interfaces In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 11 Jun 2001 14:40:54 EDT." Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:49:51 +0200 Message-ID: <23806.992285391@critter> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message , Robe rt Watson writes: >> http://www.one-eyed-alien.net/~brooks/FreeBSD/gif.diff >> >> has been updated. I'm still thinking about adopting the NetBSD >> SIOIF{CREATE,DESTORY} interface. > >An advantage to also supporting the ioctl interface is that it permits >interface cloning to be used on systems where devfs is not used, or where >there are parts of the system where devfs is unavailable (i.e., various >forms of chroots). I think devfs is cool and all, but given the existance >of fairly sensical non-devfs ways to do things, I'm tempted suggest >supporting them also. As I already said: a device with no other precense in /dev has only "quick&dirty" reasons for using DEVFS cloning. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 phk@FreeBSD.ORG | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 11:54:43 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5208137B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:54:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5BIsX728995; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:54:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:54:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> To: Warner Losh Cc: Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :In message <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> Mark Santcroos writes: :: What is the difference between the present rc scheme and the NetBSD one? : :The NetBSD rc scheme, in a nutshell, put each thing into its own file :and does order dependencies automatically. Ours is one big monolithic :beast that kinda can do extra things, but only if their order can be :coerced into being right. : :Warner I kinda like our scheme... at least I like the single monolithic /etc/rc.conf file. It makes maintaining and installing machines utterly trivial whereas having a billion little files each with one or two options in them makes maintaining and installing machines rather difficult. I sure hope nobody is advocating doing away with the monolithic capabilities of /etc/rc.conf! -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 11:56:32 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from harmony.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 078B637B405 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:56:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5BIu8V39651; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 12:56:08 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Message-Id: <200106111856.f5BIu8V39651@harmony.village.org> To: Matt Dillon Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Cc: Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:54:33 PDT." <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> References: <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 12:56:08 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> Matt Dillon writes: : I kinda like our scheme... at least I like the single monolithic : /etc/rc.conf file. It makes maintaining and installing machines : utterly trivial whereas having a billion little files each with : one or two options in them makes maintaining and installing machines : rather difficult. I sure hope nobody is advocating doing away with : the monolithic capabilities of /etc/rc.conf! While it has been a few months since I looked at the NetBSD stuff, it too has a single rc.conf-like file to control things. Its main feature is that you can add new "modules" easily. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 11:57:53 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from icicle.winternet.com (icicle.winternet.com [198.174.169.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF80737B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:57:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nrahlstr@mail.winternet.com) Received: from tundra.winternet.com (nrahlstr@tundra.winternet.com [198.174.169.11]) by icicle.winternet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3mc) with ESMTP id NAA26201; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 13:57:46 -0500 (CDT) SMTP "HELO" (ESMTP) greeting from tundra.winternet.com But _really_ from :: nrahlstr@tundra.winternet.com [198.174.169.11] SMTP "MAIL From" = nrahlstr@mail.winternet.com (Nathan Ahlstrom) SMTP "RCPT To" = Received: (from nrahlstr@localhost) by tundra.winternet.com (8.8.7/8.8.4) id NAA01697; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 13:57:45 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 13:57:45 -0500 From: Nathan Ahlstrom To: Matt Dillon Cc: Warner Losh , Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010611135745.D433@winternet.com> Mail-Followup-To: Matt Dillon , Warner Losh , Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com>; from dillon@earth.backplane.com on Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 11:54:33AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I kinda like our scheme... at least I like the single monolithic > /etc/rc.conf file. It makes maintaining and installing machines > utterly trivial whereas having a billion little files each with > one or two options in them makes maintaining and installing machines > rather difficult. I sure hope nobody is advocating doing away with > the monolithic capabilities of /etc/rc.conf! NetBSD has /etc/rc.conf and /etc/defaults/rc.conf too. -- Nathan Ahlstrom / nra@pair.com / nra@FreeBSD.org / GPG: 0x67BC9D19 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 14:20:53 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from odin.ac.hmc.edu (Odin.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.75]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 602DF37B401; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 14:20:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brdavis@odin.ac.hmc.edu) Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by odin.ac.hmc.edu (8.11.0/8.11.0) id f5BLKVM17579; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 14:20:31 -0700 Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 14:20:31 -0700 From: Brooks Davis To: Hajimu UMEMOTO Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, brian@Awfulhak.org, phk@critter.freebsd.dk, arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cloning network interfaces Message-ID: <20010611142030.A15283@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> References: <200106071119.f57BJr766008@hak.lan.Awfulhak.org> <20010607164812.A32379@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> <20010608191904.A18847@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> <20010610.232907.74740159.ume@mahoroba.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="BOKacYhQ+x31HxR3" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010610.232907.74740159.ume@mahoroba.org>; from ume@mahoroba.org on Sun, Jun 10, 2001 at 11:29:07PM +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --BOKacYhQ+x31HxR3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Jun 10, 2001 at 11:29:07PM +0900, Hajimu UMEMOTO wrote: > I think it is not BSD network way. Recent NetBSD has network > interface cloning. It uses SIOCIFCREATE and SIOCIFDESTROY. It may > good to port it to FreeBSD. I've looked it over and I generally like it. There is one problem though. That's the requirement that you use static units. The problem with this is that it forces you to implement free unit scanning in userland if you just want to create a unit and don't care what it is. If you have to do this, and things are being changed at any kind of significant rate, you have race condition between scanning the interface list for a free unit and trying to allocate it. This race can theoreticaly lead to starvation. My proposed solution is threefold. First, change the ifc_create pointer's type to: int (*ifc_create)(struct if_clone *, int *); so you can return a unit if the caller requests a wildcard unit (by passing -1). Second, move unit management in to the driver rather then just using ifunit in if_clone_create. Drivers could choose to implement wildcarding or not and if not could simply use ifunit for their test. Third, make if_clone_lookup treat names like "gif#" as a wildcard request and set unit to -1 as appropriate. These changes break compatability with NetBSD slightly, but it's just a few lines to convert an existing NetBSD clone_create handler to this style and it could easily be handled with #ifdef's. Thoughts, comments, objections? -- Brooks --=20 Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. PGP fingerprint 655D 519C 26A7 82E7 2529 9BF0 5D8E 8BE9 F238 1AD4 --BOKacYhQ+x31HxR3 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE7JTYdXY6L6fI4GtQRAjwhAKCgP7XmJFS0ccQ16Dm4OLdrnXI0DwCeKb3p qJxw/Rk9OAT8cAiWx7hI3uQ= =5RL0 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --BOKacYhQ+x31HxR3-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 15:15:49 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dayspring.firedrake.org (dayspring.firedrake.org [195.82.105.251]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B8E837B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:15:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from float@firedrake.org) Received: from float by dayspring.firedrake.org with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 159Zy8-0000d0-00; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 23:15:32 +0100 Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 23:15:32 +0100 To: Matt Dillon Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010611231532.A2348@firedrake.org> References: <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com>; from dillon@earth.backplane.com on Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 11:54:33AM -0700 From: void Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 11:54:33AM -0700, Matt Dillon wrote: > > I kinda like our scheme... at least I like the single monolithic > /etc/rc.conf file. It makes maintaining and installing machines > utterly trivial whereas having a billion little files each with > one or two options in them makes maintaining and installing machines > rather difficult. I sure hope nobody is advocating doing away with > the monolithic capabilities of /etc/rc.conf! The NetBSD scheme puts code, not configuration, into separate files. It uses rc.conf. -- Ben "An art scene of delight I created this to be ..." -- Sun Ra To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 15:27: 7 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz [195.113.31.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA2B637B403 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:27:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mikulas@artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz) Received: from localhost (mikulas@localhost) by artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id AAA14326 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:27:06 +0200 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:27:06 +0200 (CEST) From: Mikulas Patocka To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi Go to http://www.uspto.gov/patft/, search for patent number 5873127, and you will find the description of mapping page table entries into virtual memory via one page directory entry pointing to the page directory itself - exactly what FreeBSD does with PTDPTDI and APTDPTDI entries on i386. (including using alternate space as in get_ptbase() in i386/pmap.c to access page table entries of different processes). Mikulas To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 15:37:37 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mass.dis.org (mass.dis.org [216.240.45.41]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E90637B403 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:37:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from msmith@mass.dis.org) Received: from mass.dis.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mass.dis.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5BMllP03936; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:47:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from msmith@mass.dis.org) Message-Id: <200106112247.f5BMllP03936@mass.dis.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.1 10/15/1999 To: Mikulas Patocka Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:27:06 +0200." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:47:47 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Hi > > Go to http://www.uspto.gov/patft/, search for patent number 5873127, and > you will find the description of mapping page table entries into virtual > memory via one page directory entry pointing to the page directory itself > - exactly what FreeBSD does with PTDPTDI and APTDPTDI entries on i386. > (including using alternate space as in get_ptbase() in i386/pmap.c to > access page table entries of different processes). It'd be hard to build a case on this patent, though; since it was granted in 1996, and the technique is as old as the hills, proving prior art would probably be relatively straightforward. -- ... every activity meets with opposition, everyone who acts has his rivals and unfortunately opponents also. But not because people want to be opponents, rather because the tasks and relationships force people to take different points of view. [Dr. Fritz Todt] V I C T O R Y N O T V E N G E A N C E To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 15:39:19 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from prism.flugsvamp.com (cb58709-a.mdsn1.wi.home.com [24.17.241.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB36137B409 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:39:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jlemon@flugsvamp.com) Received: (from jlemon@localhost) by prism.flugsvamp.com (8.11.0/8.11.0) id f5BMbuh06004; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 17:37:56 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from jlemon) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 17:37:56 -0500 (CDT) From: Jonathan Lemon Message-Id: <200106112237.f5BMbuh06004@prism.flugsvamp.com> To: mikulas@artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD X-Newsgroups: local.mail.freebsd-hackers In-Reply-To: Organization: Cc: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article you write: >Hi > >Go to http://www.uspto.gov/patft/, search for patent number 5873127, and >you will find the description of mapping page table entries into virtual >memory via one page directory entry pointing to the page directory itself >- exactly what FreeBSD does with PTDPTDI and APTDPTDI entries on i386. >(including using alternate space as in get_ptbase() in i386/pmap.c to >access page table entries of different processes). Hmm, let's see: Assignee: Digital Equipment Corporation (Maynard, MA) Appl. No.: 646734 Filed: May 3, 1996 Versus: * Derived from hp300 version by Mike Hibler, this version by William * Jolitz uses a recursive map [a pde points to the page directory] to * map the page tables using the pagetables themselves. This is done to * reduce the impact on kernel virtual memory for lots of sparse address * space, and to reduce the cost of memory to each process. * * from: hp300: @(#)pmap.h 7.2 (Berkeley) 12/16/90 * from: @(#)pmap.h 7.4 (Berkeley) 5/12/91 So it looks like we have prior art by around 6 years, which would invalidate the patent iff it was the same thing. (Not that I've read the patent, but typically the invention must meet *ALL* the claims being described; one small deviation and it is considered to be different.) -- Jonathan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 15:46:50 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1D5E37B403 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:46:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5BMkdt33729; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:46:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:46:39 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106112246.f5BMkdt33729@earth.backplane.com> To: Mikulas Patocka Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Hi : :Go to http://www.uspto.gov/patft/, search for patent number 5873127, and :you will find the description of mapping page table entries into virtual :memory via one page directory entry pointing to the page directory itself :- exactly what FreeBSD does with PTDPTDI and APTDPTDI entries on i386. :(including using alternate space as in get_ptbase() in i386/pmap.c to :access page table entries of different processes). : :Mikulas hahahahahahaa....The patent was filed in 1996. In the 90's the patent office starting granting patents for everything under the sun without doing real prior art searches. I'm sure even just going to the candy store these days is patented by someone... it's meaningless unless someone decides to challenge and in this case there is so much prior art (just in our own CVS tree, not to mention other sources) that they would lose fairly quickly. I wouldn't worry about it too much. It isn't a problem unless it becomes one. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 15:53:44 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz [195.113.31.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC28137B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:53:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mikulas@artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz) Received: from localhost (mikulas@localhost) by artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id AAA15453; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:53:33 +0200 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:53:33 +0200 (CEST) From: Mikulas Patocka To: Jonathan Lemon Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <200106112237.f5BMbuh06004@prism.flugsvamp.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > So it looks like we have prior art by around 6 years, which would > invalidate the patent iff it was the same thing. Does it mean that the algorithm is free to use by everyone or free to use only in freebsd? I would like to implemet these page table back pointers too and I'm scared by the patent... I don't know how US patent system works. Mikulas To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 15:54:14 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90D3E37B40D for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:54:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5BMs1b33854; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:54:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:54:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106112254.f5BMs1b33854@earth.backplane.com> To: Jonathan Lemon Cc: mikulas@artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD References: <200106112237.f5BMbuh06004@prism.flugsvamp.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Hmm, let's see: : : Assignee: Digital Equipment Corporation (Maynard, MA) : Appl. No.: 646734 : Filed: May 3, 1996 : :Versus: : : * Derived from hp300 version by Mike Hibler, this version by William : * Jolitz uses a recursive map [a pde points to the page directory] to : * map the page tables using the pagetables themselves. This is done to : * reduce the impact on kernel virtual memory for lots of sparse address : * space, and to reduce the cost of memory to each process. : * : * from: hp300: @(#)pmap.h 7.2 (Berkeley) 12/16/90 : * from: @(#)pmap.h 7.4 (Berkeley) 5/12/91 : : :So it looks like we have prior art by around 6 years, which would :invalidate the patent iff it was the same thing. : :(Not that I've read the patent, but typically the invention must meet : *ALL* the claims being described; one small deviation and it is : considered to be different.) :-- :Jonathan I read it. It's chock full of the normal patent garbage. The abstract basically is exactly what's been done in BSD from the early 90's (and maybe even earlier, but I wasn't into VM in the CSRG kernels so I don't know for sure, maybe Bruce does?). Some of the claims match up fairly well. The patent also has all sorts of other crap in it, most of it pretty basic. The patent examiner obviously had no clue as to what he was examining but that's pretty much SOP these days. Remember the idiot who patented the +/-50 2-digit year rule? Again, nothing to worry about here. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 15:54:28 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mass.dis.org (mass.dis.org [216.240.45.41]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B67C937B403 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:54:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from msmith@mass.dis.org) Received: from mass.dis.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mass.dis.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5BN4gP04158; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:04:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from msmith@mass.dis.org) Message-Id: <200106112304.f5BN4gP04158@mass.dis.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.1 10/15/1999 To: Matt Dillon Cc: Mikulas Patocka , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:46:39 PDT." <200106112246.f5BMkdt33729@earth.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:04:42 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > hahahahahahaa....The patent was filed in 1996. In the 90's the patent > office starting granting patents for everything under the sun without > doing real prior art searches. I'm sure even just going to the candy > store these days is patented by someone... Every time I tease my housemate's cat with a laser pointer, I am violating a US patent. (No, really.) -- ... every activity meets with opposition, everyone who acts has his rivals and unfortunately opponents also. But not because people want to be opponents, rather because the tasks and relationships force people to take different points of view. [Dr. Fritz Todt] V I C T O R Y N O T V E N G E A N C E To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 16: 1:57 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mass.dis.org (mass.dis.org [216.240.45.41]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 34E1A37B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:01:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from msmith@mass.dis.org) Received: from mass.dis.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mass.dis.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5BNCBP04289; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:12:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from msmith@mass.dis.org) Message-Id: <200106112312.f5BNCBP04289@mass.dis.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.1 10/15/1999 To: Mikulas Patocka Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:53:33 +0200." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:12:11 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > So it looks like we have prior art by around 6 years, which would > > invalidate the patent iff it was the same thing. > > Does it mean that the algorithm is free to use by everyone or free to use > only in freebsd? I would like to implemet these page table back pointers > too and I'm scared by the patent... I don't know how US patent system > works. The existence of prior art invalidates the patent entirely, not just in the case of prior art. If that wasn't the case, it would be possible to patent an existing technique and prevent anyone new from starting to use it, which would be even more absurd than the current situation. So, you are very safe in using this technique, for a variety of reasons: - The patent is almost certainly invalid, and proving this in court would be straightforward. - Compaq (owner of the Digital patents now) is not in the business of patent litigation, nor do they typically sell their patents to other companies that are, so the chances of you being forced to defend your use of a similar algorithm in court in the first place are very small. The usual disclaimers (eg. I am Not a Lawyer) apply, of course. Good luck with your project! -- ... every activity meets with opposition, everyone who acts has his rivals and unfortunately opponents also. But not because people want to be opponents, rather because the tasks and relationships force people to take different points of view. [Dr. Fritz Todt] V I C T O R Y N O T V E N G E A N C E To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 16: 2:28 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D1EE37B403 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:02:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5BN2Mx34109; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:02:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:02:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106112302.f5BN2Mx34109@earth.backplane.com> To: Mikulas Patocka Cc: Jonathan Lemon , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> So it looks like we have prior art by around 6 years, which would :> invalidate the patent iff it was the same thing. : :Does it mean that the algorithm is free to use by everyone or free to use :only in freebsd? I would like to implemet these page table back pointers :too and I'm scared by the patent... I don't know how US patent system :works. : :Mikulas It is free for use by anyone. You always have to worry about auxilary claims, though... for example, if there are 20 claims and 10 of them have prior art, then anyone can use the algorithms that have prior art but *might* *not* be able to modify them if the modifications match a claim that does not have prior art. On the whole, however, if the primary claims in a patent have prior art, the whole patent has a good chance of being invalidated if the patent holders challenge. The key thing with patents is that they are meaningless until the patent holder decides to protect them in court by challenging the people who are supposedly in violation of the patent. If a patent holder decides to go after you, it can be costly even if you win. On the flip side, patent holders have to be careful who they go after because if they lose, their entire patent goes down the drain. Patent holders usually go after larger companies that they think might fold rather then go to court. In this case I would judge that the patent holder would be utterly stupid to go after anyone in regards to this particular patent, because the prior art is so obvious. But, then again, this guy patented something that had prior art for years before his patent so maybe he's just that stupid :-( -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 16: 7:14 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from prism.flugsvamp.com (cb58709-a.mdsn1.wi.home.com [24.17.241.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 798A537B403 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:07:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jlemon@flugsvamp.com) Received: (from jlemon@localhost) by prism.flugsvamp.com (8.11.0/8.11.0) id f5BN5sP07086; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:05:54 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from jlemon) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:05:53 -0500 From: Jonathan Lemon To: Mikulas Patocka Cc: Jonathan Lemon , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD Message-ID: <20010611180553.N82158@prism.flugsvamp.com> References: <200106112237.f5BMbuh06004@prism.flugsvamp.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre2i In-Reply-To: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 12:53:33AM +0200, Mikulas Patocka wrote: > > So it looks like we have prior art by around 6 years, which would > > invalidate the patent iff it was the same thing. > > Does it mean that the algorithm is free to use by everyone or free to use > only in freebsd? I would like to implemet these page table back pointers > too and I'm scared by the patent... I don't know how US patent system > works. The patent system works.... badly. In general, prior art will invalidate an existing patent. So if you find examples of non-patented prior art, the patent is essentially worthless. HOWEVER, the patent will stand until someone challenges it (which basically involves dragging things into court, and proving the prior art claims). The latter may be an expensive proposition, so some companies will try to use bogus patents like this one to extort money from other people on the theory that its cheaper for them to pay up than go to court. If I were you, I'd ignore it. If you actually had enough money to be a worthwhile target of the company, you'd also have enough money to hire a decent lawyer. -- Jonathan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 16:15: 4 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 906E637B409 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:15:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5BNEwE34320; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:14:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:14:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106112314.f5BNEwE34320@earth.backplane.com> To: Mikulas Patocka Cc: Jonathan Lemon , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> So it looks like we have prior art by around 6 years, which would :> invalidate the patent iff it was the same thing. : :Does it mean that the algorithm is free to use by everyone or free to use :only in freebsd? I would like to implemet these page table back pointers :too and I'm scared by the patent... I don't know how US patent system :works. : :Mikulas Oh, I meant to give a few examples. Take the RAMBUS memory case. RAMBUS got a bunch of patents on ram processes then staked their entire company on the patent. They challenged a number of companies and even got a few to buckle under. Unfortunately a few companies didn't buckle under and RAMBUS now looks to be on the losing side... they are likely to see their entire patent obliterated. Then there's the case of the Dickens 2000 patent. This guy 'invented' a windowing technique for 2 digit years. Here's some references: http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1009-200-1504369.html http://www.itaa.org/year2000/dickens.htm (slow site) This is an example of a patent that should obviously be thrown out (I mean, give me a break!), but look how long it's taking and the amount of effort required to make it happen? Expensive. The problem is that the patent office is not really all that technically savvy. It's unfortunate, but I think one of the biggest things open-source gives to the world is a huge library of prior-art to help us fight these idiots. Go open source! -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 16:16:36 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 54FBA37B401; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:16:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@ofug.org) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA13428; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 01:16:30 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des@ofug.org) X-URL: http://www.ofug.org/~des/ X-Disclaimer: The views expressed in this message do not necessarily coincide with those of any organisation or company with which I am or have been affiliated. To: Mike Smith Cc: Matt Dillon , Mikulas Patocka , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD References: <200106112304.f5BN4gP04158@mass.dis.org> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 12 Jun 2001 01:16:29 +0200 In-Reply-To: <200106112304.f5BN4gP04158@mass.dis.org> Message-ID: Lines: 9 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) Emacs/20.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Mike Smith writes: > Every time I tease my housemate's cat with a laser pointer, I am > violating a US patent. (No, really.) I need to get a laser pointer... DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@ofug.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 16:24:46 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp7ve.mailsrvcs.net (smtp7vepub.gte.net [206.46.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3EC9B37B403 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:24:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from babkin@bellatlantic.net) Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-198-117-230.nnj.dialup.bellatlantic.net [151.198.117.230]) by smtp7ve.mailsrvcs.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id XAA31458361; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 23:24:14 GMT Message-ID: <3B25531D.501B0B05@bellatlantic.net> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 19:24:13 -0400 From: Sergey Babkin X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 4.0-19990626-CURRENT i386) X-Accept-Language: en, ru MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Warner Losh Cc: Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: <20010611201243.B77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> <200106111827.f5BIR2V38517@harmony.village.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Warner Losh wrote: > > In message <20010611201243.B77956@laptop.6bone.nl> Mark Santcroos writes: > : Can it be called SysV style? Or not seperated in that way? > : (I must say, the big ugly rc thing is the only thing I don't like about > : FreeBSD, I'm very much in favor of the SysV style init. But thats another > : war ;) > > It specifically isn't SysV style. It works. SysV style encodes the > startup order in the file NAMES. The NetBSD rc system encodes it in > the files themselves. A big improvement. Or a drawback. Encoding the order in the names makes changing the order or disabling some files easy, without any neccessity to edit the contents of the files. Though I haven't seen the NetBSD approach, maybe it actually is better. -SB To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 16:27:19 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E204137B401; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:27:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5BNRCH34594; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:27:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:27:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106112327.f5BNRCH34594@earth.backplane.com> To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: Mike Smith , Mikulas Patocka , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD References: <200106112304.f5BN4gP04158@mass.dis.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : :Mike Smith writes: :> Every time I tease my housemate's cat with a laser pointer, I am :> violating a US patent. (No, really.) : :I need to get a laser pointer... : :DES :-- :Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@ofug.org You need to get two. Start with both pointing at the same point, let the cat follow it around a bit, then split them into two different dots going opposite directions. If you have two cats get one following each dot, then collide the dots. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 16:57: 7 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from harmony.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ACBB337B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:56:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5BNujV42614; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 17:56:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Message-Id: <200106112356.f5BNujV42614@harmony.village.org> To: Sergey Babkin Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Cc: Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 11 Jun 2001 19:24:13 EDT." <3B25531D.501B0B05@bellatlantic.net> References: <3B25531D.501B0B05@bellatlantic.net> <20010611201243.B77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> <200106111827.f5BIR2V38517@harmony.village.org> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 17:56:45 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <3B25531D.501B0B05@bellatlantic.net> Sergey Babkin writes: : Or a drawback. Encoding the order in the names makes changing : the order or disabling some files easy, without any neccessity to : edit the contents of the files. : : Though I haven't seen the NetBSD approach, maybe it actually is better. With the netbsd approach, you remove the file, and all things taht depend on it fail. as it should be :-) Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 17:42:42 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apocalypse.cdsnet.net (apocalypse.cdsnet.net [63.163.68.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 5353937B403 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 17:42:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mrcpu@apocalypse.cdsnet.net) Received: (qmail 64937 invoked by uid 29999); 12 Jun 2001 00:42:29 -0000 Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 17:42:27 -0700 From: Jaye Mathisen To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: 3dm utility? Message-ID: <20010611174227.I51977@apocalypse.cdsnet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG A search of the Freebsd hackers mailing list has a mail message from Mike Smith saying that the 3DM utility was available from 3ware, and to go to their site to get it. Their PDF file for 3ware lists FreeBSD as supported. however, when you go to the download section, only Linux and Windows. Does somebody have this in a form I could get at? Perhaps an older one or somesuch? Thanks. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 17:57:54 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.noos.fr (camus.noos.net [212.198.2.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA5A337B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 17:57:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from clefevre@redirect.to) Received: (qmail 487415 invoked by uid 0); 12 Jun 2001 00:57:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gits.dyndns.org) ([212.198.228.81]) (envelope-sender ) by 212.198.2.70 (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 12 Jun 2001 00:57:48 -0000 Received: (from root@localhost) by gits.dyndns.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5C0vlq47298; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 02:57:47 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from clefevre@redirect.to) To: Matthew Seaman Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Perl module for periodic scripts References: <20010611102830.A26191@plasm.demon.co.uk> X-Face: V|+c;4!|B?E%BE^{E6);aI.[<97Zd*>^#%Y5Cxv;%Y[PT-LW3;A:fRrJ8+^k"e7@+30g0YD0*^^3jgyShN7o?a]C la*Zv'5NA,=963bM%J^o]C Reply-To: Cyrille Lefevre In-Reply-To: <20010611102830.A26191@plasm.demon.co.uk> Mail-Copies-To: never From: Cyrille Lefevre Date: 12 Jun 2001 02:57:46 +0200 Message-ID: Lines: 22 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matthew Seaman writes: [snip] > by which time the script might just as well be pure perl anyhow... and the perl polution continue... while some people claims perl should goes off whenever possible, you're claiming it should goes on. FYI, the date stuff can be written in pure shell. don't know yet about the uniq -i but should be possible w/o perl. see the following url on a portable (awk and ksh) replacement for date -v-1d : http://groups.google.com/groups?as_q=date2julian&as_ugroup=fr.comp.os.unix&as_uauthors=cyrille%20lefevre Cyrille. -- home: mailto:clefevre@redirect.to UNIX is user-friendly; it's just particular work: mailto:Cyrille.Lefevre@edf.fr about who it chooses to be friends with. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 18: 5:37 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.viasoft.com.cn (unknown [61.153.1.177]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E170A37B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:05:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bsddiy@163.net) Received: from William ([192.168.1.98]) by mail.viasoft.com.cn (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA16717; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:05:40 +0800 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:16:40 +0800 From: David Xu X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.48f) Personal Reply-To: bsddiy@163.net Organization: Viasoft X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1911008720.20010612091640@163.net> To: Sergey Babkin Cc: Warner Losh , Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , Subject: Re[2]: import NetBSD rc system In-reply-To: <3B25531D.501B0B05@bellatlantic.net> References: <20010611201243.B77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> <200106111827.f5BIR2V38517@harmony.village.org> <3B25531D.501B0B05@bellatlantic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello Sergey, Tuesday, June 12, 2001, 7:24:13 AM, you wrote: SB> Warner Losh wrote: >> >> In message <20010611201243.B77956@laptop.6bone.nl> Mark Santcroos writes: >> : Can it be called SysV style? Or not seperated in that way? >> : (I must say, the big ugly rc thing is the only thing I don't like about >> : FreeBSD, I'm very much in favor of the SysV style init. But thats another >> : war ;) >> >> It specifically isn't SysV style. It works. SysV style encodes the >> startup order in the file NAMES. The NetBSD rc system encodes it in >> the files themselves. A big improvement. SB> Or a drawback. Encoding the order in the names makes changing SB> the order or disabling some files easy, without any neccessity to SB> edit the contents of the files. SB> Though I haven't seen the NetBSD approach, maybe it actually is better. SB> -SB It is based a concept: dependence, it's a more advance idea than SysV, for example: NFS relies on network, if network is not started, and if you start NFS, it will automatic start network, if network starts failure, NFS start is aborted. of course it has SysV capability, you can start and stop individual daemon or subsystem : for example: $/etc/rc.d/nfs stop $/etc/rc.d/nfs start -- David Xu To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 18:11:42 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (hokkshideh.jetcafe.org [205.147.43.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23EA137B405; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:11:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dave@jetcafe.org) Received: from hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA10458; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:11:22 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200106120111.SAA10458@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with version: MH 6.8.4 #1[UCI] To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-small@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Why does fsck try to fsck a CDROM? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:11:22 -0700 From: Dave Hayes Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Julian Stacey writes: > Maybe it comes from the /etc/fstab that is unpacked into ram disc, > that is extracted from the 2.88M boot floppy, that is part of a > bootable CD ? I checked this, boot.flp contains the stuff under /boot and kernel.gz and that's it. Interestingly enough, this doesn't happen on every machine. *shrug* > ( BTW if you'r going to get into questions around bootable cdroms > etc, it's a frequent area of interest on freebsd-small@freebsd.org ) Some of this is boot time RC file stuff as well, which affects all FreeBSDs, which is -hackers as well I'd think. I'll CC it. ------ Dave Hayes - Consultant - Altadena CA, USA - dave@jetcafe.org >>> The opinions expressed above are entirely my own <<< "I'll have you hanged, if you don't prove that you are a mystic." said a cruel and ignorant king who had heard of Nasrudin's powers. "I see strange things," said Nasrudin at once. "A golden bird in the sky, demons under the earth." The king asked "But how can you see through solid objects? How can you see far into the sky?" Nasrudin replied, "Fear is all you need." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 18:17:18 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (hokkshideh.jetcafe.org [205.147.43.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7087137B403 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:17:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dave@jetcafe.org) Received: from hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA10614 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:17:16 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200106120117.SAA10614@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with version: MH 6.8.4 #1[UCI] To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:17:15 -0700 From: Dave Hayes Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matt Dillon writes: > I kinda like our scheme... at least I like the single monolithic > /etc/rc.conf file. It makes maintaining and installing machines > utterly trivial whereas having a billion little files each with > one or two options in them makes maintaining and installing machines > rather difficult. I sure hope nobody is advocating doing away with > the monolithic capabilities of /etc/rc.conf! I agree completely. One of the points that should be kept in mind (IMO) is that the SysV RC style dominates Linux...a fact I've used to convince people that FreeBSD administration is easier, faster, better...etc. ------ Dave Hayes - Consultant - Altadena CA, USA - dave@jetcafe.org >>> The opinions expressed above are entirely my own <<< There is enough for all in this world but not enough to meet one man's greed. - Mahatma Gandhi To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 18:39:23 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from core.usrlib.org (CC2-861.charter-stl.com [24.217.115.99]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A82E737B405 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:39:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ajh3@core.usrlib.org) Received: by core.usrlib.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 88220A875; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:37:49 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:37:49 -0500 From: Andrew Hesford To: Warner Losh Cc: Matt Dillon , Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010611203749.D24399@core.usrlib.org> References: <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> <200106111856.f5BIu8V39651@harmony.village.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200106111856.f5BIu8V39651@harmony.village.org>; from imp@harmony.village.org on Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 12:56:08PM -0600 X-Loop: Andrew Hesford Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 12:56:08PM -0600, Warner Losh wrote: > In message <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> Matt Dillon writes: > : I kinda like our scheme... at least I like the single monolithic > : /etc/rc.conf file. It makes maintaining and installing machines > : utterly trivial whereas having a billion little files each with > : one or two options in them makes maintaining and installing machines > : rather difficult. I sure hope nobody is advocating doing away with > : the monolithic capabilities of /etc/rc.conf! > > While it has been a few months since I looked at the NetBSD stuff, it > too has a single rc.conf-like file to control things. Its main > feature is that you can add new "modules" easily. > > Warner New "modules"? Isn't that just the same as /usr/local/etc/rc.d/ ? I side with Mr. Dillon, I hope things stay the way they are. -- Andrew Hesford ajh3@usrlib.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 18:52:14 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from london.physics.purdue.edu (london.physics.purdue.edu [128.210.67.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AED237B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:52:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from will@physics.purdue.edu) Received: from bohr.physics.purdue.edu (bohr.physics.purdue.edu [128.210.67.12]) by london.physics.purdue.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA17783; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:51:59 -0500 (EST) Received: by bohr.physics.purdue.edu (Postfix, from userid 12409) id 4F3EC5BA9; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:51:58 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:51:58 -0500 From: Will Andrews To: Andrew Hesford Cc: Warner Losh , Matt Dillon , Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010611205158.J23562@bohr.physics.purdue.edu> Reply-To: Will Andrews References: <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> <200106111856.f5BIu8V39651@harmony.village.org> <20010611203749.D24399@core.usrlib.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.17i In-Reply-To: <20010611203749.D24399@core.usrlib.org>; from ajh3@usrlib.org on Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 08:37:49PM -0500 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.3-STABLE i386 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 08:37:49PM -0500, Andrew Hesford (ajh3@usrlib.org) wrote: > New "modules"? Isn't that just the same as /usr/local/etc/rc.d/ ? I side > with Mr. Dillon, I hope things stay the way they are. You acted rashly. It's like /usr/local/etc/rc.d, only it becomes extended to the base system, so that we can have /etc/rc.d/* {stop,start,restart,*} for all the daemons. It makes taking care of our base system daemons easier. -- wca To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 19:29:15 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dayspring.firedrake.org (dayspring.firedrake.org [195.82.105.251]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3110D37B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 19:29:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from float@firedrake.org) Received: from float by dayspring.firedrake.org with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 159duy-00037Z-00; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 03:28:32 +0100 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 03:28:32 +0100 To: Warner Losh Cc: Sergey Babkin , Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010612032831.A11986@firedrake.org> References: <3B25531D.501B0B05@bellatlantic.net> <20010611201243.B77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> <200106111827.f5BIR2V38517@harmony.village.org> <3B25531D.501B0B05@bellatlantic.net> <200106112356.f5BNujV42614@harmony.village.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200106112356.f5BNujV42614@harmony.village.org>; from imp@harmony.village.org on Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 05:56:45PM -0600 From: void Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 05:56:45PM -0600, Warner Losh wrote: > > With the netbsd approach, you remove the file, and all things taht > depend on it fail. as it should be :-) I'm pretty sure you turn it off in rc.conf, rather than removing it. -- Ben "An art scene of delight I created this to be ..." -- Sun Ra To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 19:32:47 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from harmony.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A82B37B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 19:32:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5C2WLV43391; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:32:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Message-Id: <200106120232.f5C2WLV43391@harmony.village.org> To: void Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Cc: Sergey Babkin , Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 12 Jun 2001 03:28:32 BST." <20010612032831.A11986@firedrake.org> References: <20010612032831.A11986@firedrake.org> <3B25531D.501B0B05@bellatlantic.net> <20010611201243.B77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> <200106111827.f5BIR2V38517@harmony.village.org> <3B25531D.501B0B05@bellatlantic.net> <200106112356.f5BNujV42614@harmony.village.org> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:32:21 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <20010612032831.A11986@firedrake.org> void writes: : On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 05:56:45PM -0600, Warner Losh wrote: : > : > With the netbsd approach, you remove the file, and all things taht : > depend on it fail. as it should be :-) : : I'm pretty sure you turn it off in rc.conf, rather than removing it. Let me clarify. If I were to add a few extra "modules" to the system. A, B, and C. If B needed A and C to start before it, then if I were to remove module A, B wouldn't start because its prereqs aren't there. These modules would be added, for example, in a package. Btw, for those that were asking, each file has lines like the following: # PROVIDE: ipmon # REQUIRE: syslogd which allows one to give a good dependency graph. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 19:34:57 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dayspring.firedrake.org (dayspring.firedrake.org [195.82.105.251]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A2FB37B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 19:34:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from float@firedrake.org) Received: from float by dayspring.firedrake.org with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 159e14-00039d-00; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 03:34:50 +0100 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 03:34:50 +0100 To: Matt Dillon Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD Message-ID: <20010612033450.B11986@firedrake.org> Reply-To: chat@freebsd.org References: <200106112304.f5BN4gP04158@mass.dis.org> <200106112327.f5BNRCH34594@earth.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200106112327.f5BNRCH34594@earth.backplane.com>; from dillon@earth.backplane.com on Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 04:27:12PM -0700 From: void Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 04:27:12PM -0700, Matt Dillon wrote: > > You need to get two. Start with both pointing at the same point, > let the cat follow it around a bit, then split them into two different > dots going opposite directions. > > If you have two cats get one following each dot, then collide the > dots. Don't do it! It's a trick! He's probably patented those ideas. -- Ben "An art scene of delight I created this to be ..." -- Sun Ra To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 19:35:23 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from harmony.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3CF5337B415 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 19:35:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5C2Z7V43436; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:35:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Message-Id: <200106120235.f5C2Z7V43436@harmony.village.org> To: Dave Hayes Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:17:15 PDT." <200106120117.SAA10614@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> References: <200106120117.SAA10614@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:35:07 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <200106120117.SAA10614@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> Dave Hayes writes: : I agree completely. One of the points that should be kept in mind : (IMO) is that the SysV RC style dominates Linux...a fact I've used to : convince people that FreeBSD administration is easier, faster, : better...etc. But the NetBSD style is exactly as easy to administer as the FreeBSD style. It is more modular and easy to expand after the boot. How do I start nfs on FreeBSD after it boots? Well, you grep it out of /etc/rc*. With the NetBSD style, it is as simple as '/etc/rc.d/nfsd start' It isn't SysV RC style. It is BSD style taken to its logical next step. All the knobs for this are still in a central location, so you don't have to make sure you get the hardlinks right. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 19:36:45 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from harmony.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97F2B37B403 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 19:36:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5C2aZV43462; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:36:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Message-Id: <200106120236.f5C2aZV43462@harmony.village.org> To: Andrew Hesford Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:37:49 CDT." <20010611203749.D24399@core.usrlib.org> References: <20010611203749.D24399@core.usrlib.org> <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> <200106111856.f5BIu8V39651@harmony.village.org> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:36:35 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <20010611203749.D24399@core.usrlib.org> Andrew Hesford writes: : New "modules"? Isn't that just the same as /usr/local/etc/rc.d/ ? I side : with Mr. Dillon, I hope things stay the way they are. No. It isn't. Our current /usr/local/etc/rc.d is a *SUBSET* of what the NetBSD system provides. Right now it is a crap shoot if modules you depend on get started before you or not. The NetBSD system formalizes dependencies and uses them everywhere, not just in the "add on" part of the system. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 19:48:44 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from public.guangzhou.gd.cn (mail1-smtp.guangzhou.gd.cn [202.105.65.221]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 7CB8F37B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 19:48:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn) Received: from fatcow.home([203.93.59.244]) by public.guangzhou.gd.cn(JetMail 2.5.3.0) with SMTP id jm1a3b25b790; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 02:46:36 -0000 Received: (from jyliu@localhost) by fatcow.home (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5C2mcr00360; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:48:38 +0800 (CST) (envelope-from gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:48:38 +0800 (CST) From: gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn Message-Id: <200106120248.f5C2mcr00360@fatcow.home> X-Authentication-Warning: fatcow.home: jyliu set sender to gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn using -f To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: [PATCH] Limited BPF to the specified program Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG <#/part> From: Jiangyi Liu Date: 12 Jun 2001 10:48:38 +0800 Message-ID: <87ae3epg55.fsf@fatcow.home> Lines: 35 User-Agent: Gnus/5.090001 (Oort Gnus v0.01) Emacs/20.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi, Seems I can't contact the coordinator(eivind@FreeBSD.org) of this task. So I think maybe I should send the patch to this list. Here is the patch for limiting bpf access to the specified program. For example, if I wanna specify only /sbin/dhclient can use bpf, I can: $ ls -i /sbin/dhclient 439 /sbin/dhclient $ df Filesystem 1K-blocks Used Avail Capacity Mounted on /dev/ad0s3a 63503 37795 20628 65% / /dev/ad0s3f 5834156 2997583 2369841 56% /usr /dev/ad0s3e 63503 9866 48557 17% /var procfs 4 4 0 100% /proc $ ls -al /dev/ad0s3a crw-r----- 2 root operator 116, 0x00040000 Dec 17 01:40 /dev/ad0s3a So I can add the follow lines to my kernel config file: options BPF_LIMITED options BPF_ALLOWED_DEVID=29696 options BPF_ALLOWED_FILEID=439 The 0~7 bits of BPF_ALLOWED_DEVID is the minor number of the device, while the 8~15 bits is the major number of the device. Probably I should make the options like BPF_ALLOWED_DEV_MAJOR and BPF_ALLOWED_DEV_MINOR. Anyone interested? Best wishes, Jiangyi Liu To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 19:50:42 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from public.guangzhou.gd.cn (mail2-smtp.guangzhou.gd.cn [202.105.65.222]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 52F8037B403 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 19:50:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn) Received: from fatcow.home([203.93.59.244]) by public.guangzhou.gd.cn(JetMail 2.5.3.0) with SMTP id jm403b25f5ec; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 02:48:24 -0000 Received: (from jyliu@localhost) by fatcow.home (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5C2oTW00368; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:50:29 +0800 (CST) (envelope-from gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn) X-Authentication-Warning: fatcow.home: jyliu set sender to gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn using -f To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: [PATCH] Limited BPF to specified program From: Jiangyi Liu Date: 12 Jun 2001 10:50:29 +0800 Message-ID: <8766e2pg22.fsf@fatcow.home> Lines: 37 User-Agent: Gnus/5.090001 (Oort Gnus v0.01) Emacs/20.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=-=-=" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --=-=-= Content-Type: text/x-patch Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=bpf.diff *** i386/conf/LINT.orig Sat Jun 2 12:32:27 2001 --- i386/conf/LINT Mon Jun 11 15:04:23 2001 *************** *** 494,499 **** --- 494,508 ---- pseudo-device sppp #Generic Synchronous PPP pseudo-device loop #Network loopback device pseudo-device bpf #Berkeley packet filter + + # The BPF_LIMITED options limits only the specified program can + # use bpf, BPF_ALLOWED_DEVID is the deviceid [major|minor] of the + # device where specified program resides, BPF_ALLOWED_FILEID is the + # inode of the specified program. + options BPF_LIMITED + options BPF_ALLOWED_DEVID + options BPF_ALLOWED_FILEID + pseudo-device disc #Discard device (ds0, ds1, etc) pseudo-device tun #Tunnel driver (ppp(8), nos-tun(8)) pseudo-device sl 2 #Serial Line IP *** net/bpf.c.orig Tue Jun 5 19:54:01 2001 --- net/bpf.c Mon Jun 11 14:47:11 2001 *************** *** 41,46 **** --- 41,47 ---- */ #include "bpf.h" + #include "opt_bpf.h" #ifndef __GNUC__ #define inline *************** *** 60,65 **** --- 61,67 ---- #include #include #include + #include #if defined(sparc) && BSD < 199103 #include *************** *** 346,353 **** struct proc *p; { register struct bpf_d *d; ! ! if (p->p_prison) return (EPERM); d = dev->si_drv1; --- 348,373 ---- struct proc *p; { register struct bpf_d *d; ! struct vattr attr; ! ! #ifdef BPF_LIMITED ! int error; ! ! /* Get file attributes */ ! error = VOP_GETATTR(p->p_textvp, &attr, p->p_ucred, p); ! if (error) ! return (error); ! ! if (BPF_ALLOWED_DEVID != (attr.va_fsid & 0xffff) || ! BPF_ALLOWED_FILEID != attr.va_fileid) { ! log(LOG_ERR, "Attempt to use BPF: device %d,%d fileid %ld\n", ! (int)((attr.va_fsid>>8) & 0xff), (int)(attr.va_fsid & 0xff), ! (long)attr.va_fileid); ! return (EPERM); ! } ! #endif ! ! if (p->p_prison) return (EPERM); d = dev->si_drv1; *** conf/options.i386.orig Sat Jun 2 12:32:08 2001 --- conf/options.i386 Mon Jun 11 14:17:17 2001 *************** *** 203,208 **** --- 203,213 ---- # SMB/CIFS filesystem SMBFS + # Limited BPF options + BPF_LIMITED opt_bpf.h + BPF_ALLOWED_DEVID opt_bpf.h + BPF_ALLOWED_FILEID opt_bpf.h + # ------------------------------- # EOF # ------------------------------- --=-=-= Hi, Seems I can't contact the coordinator(eivind@FreeBSD.org) of this task. So I think maybe I should send the patch to this list. Here is the patch for limiting bpf access to the specified program. For example, if I wanna specify only /sbin/dhclient can use bpf, I can: $ ls -i /sbin/dhclient 439 /sbin/dhclient $ df Filesystem 1K-blocks Used Avail Capacity Mounted on /dev/ad0s3a 63503 37795 20628 65% / /dev/ad0s3f 5834156 2997583 2369841 56% /usr /dev/ad0s3e 63503 9866 48557 17% /var procfs 4 4 0 100% /proc $ ls -al /dev/ad0s3a crw-r----- 2 root operator 116, 0x00040000 Dec 17 01:40 /dev/ad0s3a So I can add the follow lines to my kernel config file: options BPF_LIMITED options BPF_ALLOWED_DEVID=29696 options BPF_ALLOWED_FILEID=439 The 0~7 bits of BPF_ALLOWED_DEVID is the minor number of the device, while the 8~15 bits is the major number of the device. Probably I should make the options like BPF_ALLOWED_DEV_MAJOR and BPF_ALLOWED_DEV_MINOR. Anyone interested? Best wishes, Jiangyi Liu --=-=-=-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 20: 5:37 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DBC237B403 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:05:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5C35Ri37415; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:05:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:05:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106120305.f5C35Ri37415@earth.backplane.com> To: Will Andrews Cc: Andrew Hesford , Warner Losh , Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> <200106111856.f5BIu8V39651@harmony.village.org> <20010611203749.D24399@core.usrlib.org> <20010611205158.J23562@bohr.physics.purdue.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : :On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 08:37:49PM -0500, Andrew Hesford (ajh3@usrlib.org) wrote: :> New "modules"? Isn't that just the same as /usr/local/etc/rc.d/ ? I side :> with Mr. Dillon, I hope things stay the way they are. : :You acted rashly. It's like /usr/local/etc/rc.d, only it becomes :extended to the base system, so that we can have /etc/rc.d/* :{stop,start,restart,*} for all the daemons. It makes taking care :of our base system daemons easier. : :-- :wca All I care about is /etc/rc.conf ... I like the idea of splitting the various other rc files into pieces as long as I can control them all from /etc/rc.conf. If it's extensible that's even better! What I really hate is the SysV/Linux/Solaris style of rc.d configuration directories where you create/maintain softlinks in specially named directories (named after the run level) to a master set of startup files. Blech. Yuch. Ptooey! -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 20:13:42 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from harmony.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1475937B40A for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:13:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5C3DYV43842; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 21:13:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Message-Id: <200106120313.f5C3DYV43842@harmony.village.org> To: Matt Dillon Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:05:27 PDT." <200106120305.f5C35Ri37415@earth.backplane.com> References: <200106120305.f5C35Ri37415@earth.backplane.com> <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> <200106111856.f5BIu8V39651@harmony.village.org> <20010611203749.D24399@core.usrlib.org> <20010611205158.J23562@bohr.physics.purdue.edu> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 21:13:34 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <200106120305.f5C35Ri37415@earth.backplane.com> Matt Dillon writes: : What I really hate is the SysV/Linux/Solaris style of rc.d configuration : directories where you create/maintain softlinks in specially named : directories (named after the run level) to a master set of : startup files. Blech. Yuch. Ptooey! S01Yes. S02The S03collection S04of S05symbolic S06links S07is S08what S09I S10hate. S99Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 20:13:39 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.viasoft.com.cn (unknown [61.153.1.177]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5194337B409 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:13:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bsddiy@163.net) Received: from William ([192.168.1.98]) by mail.viasoft.com.cn (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA17563; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:13:14 +0800 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:24:20 +0800 From: David Xu X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.48f) Personal Reply-To: bsddiy@163.net Organization: Viasoft X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1138668054.20010612112420@163.net> To: Matt Dillon Cc: Will Andrews , Andrew Hesford , Warner Losh , Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , Subject: Re[2]: import NetBSD rc system In-reply-To: <200106120305.f5C35Ri37415@earth.backplane.com> References: <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> <200106111856.f5BIu8V39651@harmony.village.org> <20010611203749.D24399@core.usrlib.org> <20010611205158.J23562@bohr.physics.purdue.edu> <200106120305.f5C35Ri37415@earth.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello Matt, Tuesday, June 12, 2001, 11:05:27 AM, you wrote: MD> : MD> :On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 08:37:49PM -0500, Andrew Hesford (ajh3@usrlib.org) wrote: :>> New "modules"? Isn't that just the same as /usr/local/etc/rc.d/ ? I side :>> with Mr. Dillon, I hope things stay the way they are. MD> : MD> :You acted rashly. It's like /usr/local/etc/rc.d, only it becomes MD> :extended to the base system, so that we can have /etc/rc.d/* MD> :{stop,start,restart,*} for all the daemons. It makes taking care MD> :of our base system daemons easier. MD> : MD> :-- MD> :wca MD> All I care about is /etc/rc.conf ... I like the idea of splitting MD> the various other rc files into pieces as long as I can control them MD> all from /etc/rc.conf. If it's extensible that's even better! MD> What I really hate is the SysV/Linux/Solaris style of rc.d configuration MD> directories where you create/maintain softlinks in specially named MD> directories (named after the run level) to a master set of MD> startup files. Blech. Yuch. Ptooey! MD> -Matt It seems it fits your need, it has a rc.conf file to control whole rc system and has a rc.d directory but havn't to maintain symbol links. SysV has several run levels, it has to have many symbol links, BSD hasn't. -- David Xu To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 20:24:11 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ambrisko.com (adsl-64-174-51-42.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [64.174.51.42]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08A6537B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:24:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ambrisko@ambrisko.com) Received: (from ambrisko@localhost) by ambrisko.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5C3NsD42170 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:23:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ambrisko) From: Doug Ambrisko Message-Id: <200106120323.f5C3NsD42170@ambrisko.com> Subject: 802.11 sniffing with Cisco/Aironet card To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:23:54 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL82 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In my latest set of patches for -stable the Aironet driver with a few patches to FreeBSD's bpf & libpcap to support 802.11 packets permits sniffing of raw 802.11 packets. The patches are at: http://www.ambrisko.com/doug/an/ The latest version is an.patch.cisco.rfmon2+ifconfig3 Several bug fixes have been applied and some of the ifconfig patches that Brooks did since if_an.c depends on some of the 802.11 headers that he did. Some of the 802.11 monitor code is from Javier work on the Aironet driver for Linux. This patch also includes the Cisco driver emulation (that needs my Linux emulator patch). I also unified the .h files in /sys/dev/an so that there are only one definition for things except in the case where I'm trying to keep the Linux definitions for things so we can just compile Linux apps. such as the firmware upgrade utility. There is a sysctl to support tracing and dumping RIDs. To sniff packets you seem to need version 17a of Ethereal or relatively recent version from the Ethereal CVS server. I have a version of 17a Ethereal on my web site in the "an" directory. Thanks to the people that helped my test this out on -stable. Doug A. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 20:34:47 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mcp.csh.rit.edu (mcp.csh.rit.edu [129.21.60.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6DE637B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:34:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jon@csh.rit.edu) Received: from fury.csh.rit.edu (fury.csh.rit.edu [129.21.60.5]) by mcp.csh.rit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 528291304; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 23:34:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: by fury.csh.rit.edu (Postfix, from userid 37404) id 179902E3EC; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 23:34:20 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 23:34:20 -0400 From: Jon Parise To: Matt Dillon Cc: Will Andrews , Andrew Hesford , Warner Losh , Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010611233420.I26841@csh.rit.edu> Mail-Followup-To: Matt Dillon , Will Andrews , Andrew Hesford , Warner Losh , Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> <200106111856.f5BIu8V39651@harmony.village.org> <20010611203749.D24399@core.usrlib.org> <20010611205158.J23562@bohr.physics.purdue.edu> <200106120305.f5C35Ri37415@earth.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.12i In-Reply-To: <200106120305.f5C35Ri37415@earth.backplane.com>; from dillon@earth.backplane.com on Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 08:05:27PM -0700 X-Operating-System: SunOS 5.8 (sun4u) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 08:05:27PM -0700, Matt Dillon wrote: Just a note that further (negative) commentors should really do a little investigating before jumping to conclusions. This thread has gone on long enough with people making uninformed guesses and assumptions. > All I care about is /etc/rc.conf ... I like the idea of splitting > the various other rc files into pieces as long as I can control them > all from /etc/rc.conf. If it's extensible that's even better! Exactly. All of the configuration knobs remain in /etc/rc.conf (so everything works the way it does know, including sysinstall(8)-generated configuration values. /etc/defaults is there with all of our old friends, too. With the proposed NetBSD-derived system, individual services are isolated in their very own scripts, making starting / stopping them very convenient (the only advantage I see to the SysV layout). In addition, the integrity of dependency graph is also maintained, while retaining extra flexibility. > What I really hate is the SysV/Linux/Solaris style of rc.d configuration > directories where you create/maintain softlinks in specially named > directories (named after the run level) to a master set of > startup files. Blech. Yuch. Ptooey! Agreed. It's not that I have a difficult time grokking the layout; there's just too much work involved (both in the fingers and in the head) working with a SysV-like setup (IHO, no need to try changing my mind). -- Jon Parise (jon@csh.rit.edu) . Rochester Inst. of Technology http://www.csh.rit.edu/~jon/ : Computer Science House Member To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 21:19:21 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from odin.ac.hmc.edu (Odin.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.75]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD2B437B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 21:19:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brdavis@odin.ac.hmc.edu) Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by odin.ac.hmc.edu (8.11.0/8.11.0) id f5C4J4i02364; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 21:19:04 -0700 Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 21:19:04 -0700 From: Brooks Davis To: Warner Losh Cc: Dave Hayes , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010611211904.A1820@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> References: <200106120117.SAA10614@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> <200106120235.f5C2Z7V43436@harmony.village.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="Qxx1br4bt0+wmkIi" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200106120235.f5C2Z7V43436@harmony.village.org>; from imp@harmony.village.org on Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 08:35:07PM -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --Qxx1br4bt0+wmkIi Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 08:35:07PM -0600, Warner Losh wrote: > But the NetBSD style is exactly as easy to administer as the FreeBSD > style. It is more modular and easy to expand after the boot. How do > I start nfs on FreeBSD after it boots? Well, you grep it out of > /etc/rc*. With the NetBSD style, it is as simple as '/etc/rc.d/nfsd > start' Better yet, a dependency system can allow you to design things so inserting a NIC causes the network interface config script to restart (adding the interface) and to inteligently restart network services to bind to that interface. The fact that you should be able to re-enter the configruation process at just about any level should fix any number of places where (for example) PC Card nics aren't equal to non-removable nics. Personaly, I can't wait to see this in action. -- Brooks --=20 Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. PGP fingerprint 655D 519C 26A7 82E7 2529 9BF0 5D8E 8BE9 F238 1AD4 --Qxx1br4bt0+wmkIi Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE7JZg4XY6L6fI4GtQRAt/UAKCBqYikeEx1+d8WZOaiuaJqwlqWWQCg2/og jDhlwFT+DH3BCYms46NiTNA= =QfCL -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Qxx1br4bt0+wmkIi-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 21:26:24 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from winston.osd.bsdi.com (adsl-64-173-15-98.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net [64.173.15.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD8A437B403 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 21:26:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) Received: from localhost (jkh@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by winston.osd.bsdi.com (8.11.4/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5C4PSt27072; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 21:25:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) To: jon@csh.rit.edu Cc: dillon@earth.backplane.com, will@physics.purdue.edu, ajh3@usrlib.org, imp@harmony.village.org, marks@ripe.net, DougB@DougBarton.net, bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: <20010611233420.I26841@csh.rit.edu> References: <20010611205158.J23562@bohr.physics.purdue.edu> <200106120305.f5C35Ri37415@earth.backplane.com> <20010611233420.I26841@csh.rit.edu> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.94.1 on Emacs 20.7 / Mule 4.0 (HANANOEN) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20010611212528U.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 21:25:28 -0700 From: Jordan Hubbard X-Dispatcher: imput version 20000228(IM140) Lines: 6 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Guys, guys. The NetBSD /etc/rc system is good. We should stop arguing about it and just focus on figuring out who's going to integrate it or the whole conversation concerns a moot point anyway. :) - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 21:27:12 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from silby.com (cb34181-a.mdsn1.wi.home.com [24.14.173.39]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD56D37B407 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 21:27:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from silby@silby.com) Received: (qmail 3430 invoked by uid 1000); 12 Jun 2001 04:27:02 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 12 Jun 2001 04:27:02 -0000 Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 23:27:02 -0500 (CDT) From: Mike Silbersack To: Cc: Subject: Re: [PATCH] Limited BPF to the specified program In-Reply-To: <200106120248.f5C2mcr00360@fatcow.home> Message-ID: <20010611232418.V3383-100000@achilles.silby.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 12 Jun 2001 gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn wrote: > Hi, > > Seems I can't contact the coordinator(eivind@FreeBSD.org) of this > task. So I think maybe I should send the patch to this list. Here is > the patch for limiting bpf access to the specified program. > > For example, if I wanna specify only /sbin/dhclient can use bpf, I > can: The idea sounds neat, especially for computer labs and the like. Unfortunately, I think this implementation is far too difficult to be used effectively. Could you instead cause bpf to only return packets dhclient would use? That would allow bpf to be used by any process, but only be useful to dhclient. Mike "Silby" Silbersack To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 21:34:42 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from odin.ac.hmc.edu (Odin.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.75]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8280F37B401 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 21:34:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brdavis@odin.ac.hmc.edu) Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by odin.ac.hmc.edu (8.11.0/8.11.0) id f5C4X1r04080; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 21:33:01 -0700 Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 21:33:01 -0700 From: Brooks Davis To: Mike Silbersack Cc: gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: [PATCH] Limited BPF to the specified program Message-ID: <20010611213301.A3636@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> References: <200106120248.f5C2mcr00360@fatcow.home> <20010611232418.V3383-100000@achilles.silby.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="3V7upXqbjpZ4EhLz" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010611232418.V3383-100000@achilles.silby.com>; from silby@silby.com on Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 11:27:02PM -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --3V7upXqbjpZ4EhLz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 11:27:02PM -0500, Mike Silbersack wrote: > The idea sounds neat, especially for computer labs and the like. > Unfortunately, I think this implementation is far too difficult to be used > effectively. Could you instead cause bpf to only return packets dhclient > would use? That would allow bpf to be used by any process, but only be > useful to dhclient. I believe the proposal in the distant past was to install a non-revocable bpf filter which did this. Actually, the scheme listed has pretty much no hope of working in a devfs world because the majors file is going to be shot eventualy and thus you may well not be able to count on your disks being at the same device number. -- Brooks --=20 Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. PGP fingerprint 655D 519C 26A7 82E7 2529 9BF0 5D8E 8BE9 F238 1AD4 --3V7upXqbjpZ4EhLz Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE7JZt8XY6L6fI4GtQRApYiAJ4+7FXO098jjx9kg15OXl5nR2lxwgCfb+Hb dJTQtItyoroVqsQNsKWNW5A= =an1Q -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --3V7upXqbjpZ4EhLz-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 21:36: 5 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gate.soum.co.jp (gate.soum.co.jp [202.221.40.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6DD1237B40A for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 21:35:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from uebayasi@soum.co.jp) Received: from force.soum.co.jp (force.soum.co.jp [3ffe:501:80a:1:a00:20ff:fef0:4c9c]) by gate.soum.co.jp (8.11.4/8.11.4) with ESMTP id f5C4ZjH43974; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:35:45 +0900 (JST) (envelope-from uebayasi@soum.co.jp) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by force.soum.co.jp (8.11.3/3.7W-2001031912) with ESMTP id f5C4Zj124568; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:35:45 +0900 (JST) To: jkh@osd.bsdi.com Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system From: Masao Uebayashi In-Reply-To: <20010611212528U.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> References: <200106120305.f5C35Ri37415@earth.backplane.com> <20010611233420.I26841@csh.rit.edu> <20010611212528U.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.94.2 on Emacs 20.7 / Mule 4.0 (HANANOEN) Organisation: SOUM Corporation, Tokyo, Japan Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20010612133545Y.uebayasi@soum.co.jp> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:35:45 +0900 X-Dispatcher: imput version 20000228(IM140) Lines: 20 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Guys, guys. The NetBSD /etc/rc system is good. We should stop > arguing about it and just focus on figuring out who's going to > integrate it or the whole conversation concerns a moot point > anyway. :) > > - Jordan How progressive you FreeBSD guys are! Can you imagine how much discussion NetBSD people had for the topic? ;-) And now most people have been convinced and using it comfotably. The next step is whether it (rcorder) should be also applied to Pkgsrc. I'm longing for this relized ASAP... Regards, Masao --- ____________ |_ -|--|- |_NO_SMOKING_| _|__ /|\/|\ | | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jun 11 23:45: 7 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.92]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E9BC437B408 for ; Mon, 11 Jun 2001 23:44:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from m.seaman@plasm.demon.co.uk) Received: from plasm.demon.co.uk ([194.222.58.229]) by anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 159hv2-000D1R-0Y; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 07:44:53 +0100 Received: (from matthew@localhost) by plasm.demon.co.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5C6iW127754; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 07:44:32 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from matthew) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 07:44:08 +0100 From: Matthew Seaman To: Cyrille Lefevre Cc: Matthew Seaman , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Perl module for periodic scripts Message-ID: <20010612074408.A27697@plasm.demon.co.uk> References: <20010611102830.A26191@plasm.demon.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from clefevre-lists@noos.fr on Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 02:57:46AM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 02:57:46AM +0200, Cyrille Lefevre wrote: > To: Matthew Seaman > Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org > Subject: Re: Perl module for periodic scripts > Reply-To: Cyrille Lefevre > Mail-Copies-To: never > From: Cyrille Lefevre > Date: 12 Jun 2001 02:57:46 +0200 > User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley) > > Matthew Seaman writes: > > [snip] > > by which time the script might just as well be pure perl anyhow... > > and the perl polution continue... > > while some people claims perl should goes off whenever possible, > you're claiming it should goes on. No. I'm not out to re-write the world in Perl. If you like sh/sed/awk, then great, write code in sh/sed/awk. Me, I prefer perl, but it's not a religious thing. > FYI, the date stuff can be written in pure shell. don't know yet > about the uniq -i but should be possible w/o perl. I don't doubt that it's possible, but for me, it's a lot easier to do it in Perl. > see the following url on a portable (awk and ksh) replacement for > date -v-1d : > > http://groups.google.com/groups?as_q=date2julian&as_ugroup=fr.comp.os.unix&as_uauthors=cyrille%20lefevre Impressively complicated stuff. Matthew -- Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil. 26 The Paddocks Savill Way Marlow Tel: +44 1628 476614 Bucks., SL7 1TH UK To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 0:12:30 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from x20.i.nabechan.org (lab129.kddlabs.co.jp [202.255.45.129]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB6EA37B408 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:12:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nabe@nabechan.org) Received: from x20.i.nabechan.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by x20.i.nabechan.org (8.11.3/3.7W-01010411) with ESMTP id f5C79Og02738; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 16:09:24 +0900 (JST) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 16:09:23 +0900 Message-ID: <87y9qyrx7g.wl@nabechan.org> From: Shingo WATANABE / =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCRU9KVRsoQiAbJEI/LThjGyhC?= To: mrcpu@internetcds.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 3dm utility? In-Reply-To: <20010611174227.I51977@apocalypse.cdsnet.net> References: <20010611174227.I51977@apocalypse.cdsnet.net> User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.5.5 (Smooth) XEmacs/21.1 (Channel Islands) Organization: nabechan.org X-Callsign: JG8OOM/1 X-OS: NetBSD 1.5V X-ICQ-UIN: 30482441 X-Weather: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCTEBGfCROQFA8bTZ1Q044ZTtWQ09KfSRPRl4bKEI=?= =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCOGVAMiRHJDkbKEI=?= MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by NISEMI 1.14.0 - =?ISO-2022-JP?B?Ig==?= =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCMGY4fUA/GyhCIg==?=) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > A search of the Freebsd hackers mailing list has a mail message > from Mike Smith saying that the 3DM utility was available > from 3ware, and to go to their site to get it. I don't know whether you can download it from 3ware's site or not. But there is a 3DM utility for FreeBSD at following url. http://people.freebsd.org/~msmith/RAID/3ware/3dm-bsd.1.09.00.002.tar.gz I'm using it for some weeks, it works well. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 0:27:58 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from critter.freebsd.dk (critter.freebsd.dk [212.242.86.163]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40FF137B405; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:27:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) Received: from critter (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.freebsd.dk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5C7RUr30673; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:27:30 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) To: Mike Smith Cc: Mikulas Patocka , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:47:47 PDT." <200106112247.f5BMllP03936@mass.dis.org> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:27:30 +0200 Message-ID: <30671.992330850@critter> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <200106112247.f5BMllP03936@mass.dis.org>, Mike Smith writes: >> Hi >> >> Go to http://www.uspto.gov/patft/, search for patent number 5873127, and >> you will find the description of mapping page table entries into virtual >> memory via one page directory entry pointing to the page directory itself >> - exactly what FreeBSD does with PTDPTDI and APTDPTDI entries on i386. >> (including using alternate space as in get_ptbase() in i386/pmap.c to >> access page table entries of different processes). > >It'd be hard to build a case on this patent, though; since it was granted >in 1996, and the technique is as old as the hills, proving prior art >would probably be relatively straightforward. Well, the application date is what counts, and that's mar1992, but I'm pretty sure that Bill Jolitz had them beat to that date already... -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 phk@FreeBSD.ORG | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 0:32:55 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alacran.it.uc3m.es (alacran.it.uc3m.es [163.117.139.44]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB75037B403 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:32:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jrh@it.uc3m.es) Received: from it.uc3m.es (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by alacran.it.uc3m.es (8.10.2/8.10.2/SuSE Linux 8.10.0-0.3) with ESMTP id f5C7Xxp02556 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:33:59 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: alacran.it.uc3m.es: Host localhost [127.0.0.1] claimed to be it.uc3m.es Message-ID: <3B25C5E7.39FEC964@it.uc3m.es> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:33:59 +0200 From: Juan Fco Rodriguez Hervella X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.74 [es] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.3 i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Lista Subject: New c file under netinet6/ is not compiled, help Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi: I am trying to create a new option into the KERNEL, but I dont have experience on it, and when the "make" try to link the *.o files, it is showed an undefined reference to a function that is implemented in a .c that is not compiled. I have included the "opt_xxx.h" in this c file, What does I need to do to force this new .c under /netinet6 to compile ? Thanks in advance. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 0:40:36 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bazooka.unixfreak.org (bazooka.unixfreak.org [63.198.170.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD09237B405; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:39:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dima@unixfreak.org) Received: from hornet.unixfreak.org (hornet [63.198.170.140]) by bazooka.unixfreak.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51AD73E28; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:39:47 -0700 (PDT) To: hackers@freebsd.org Cc: dougb@freebsd.org Subject: mount_mfs-like program for md Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:39:47 -0700 From: Dima Dorfman Message-Id: <20010612073947.51AD73E28@bazooka.unixfreak.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi folks, Would anybody have a tantrum if a program with a mount_mfs-like interface to create an md disk and put a UFS filesystem on it was imported into the base system? This has been suggested in the past, and the only real objection was that it shouldn't be named mount_*. At this time, I am *not* proposing to name it mount_*. More specifically, the program exec's mdconfig, disklabel, newfs, and mount, in that order, to set up the disk and filesystem. It supports all the options mount_mfs did, passing them to the correct program(s). It can theoretically be renamed to mount_ to handle corresponding /etc/fstab entries; however, I would like to make it clear that I am *not* proposing that. Furthermore, dougb@ says that something similar would have to be used in /etc/rc to make filesystems on md disks for, e.g., /tmp, anyway, and this just factors out the code into something that can be used separately. So, is there any reason not to do this? I've attached a sharball of the sources. Regards, Dima Dorfman dima@unixfreak.org # This is a shell archive. Save it in a file, remove anything before # this line, and then unpack it by entering "sh file". Note, it may # create directories; files and directories will be owned by you and # have default permissions. # # This archive contains: # # mdmfs # mdmfs/Makefile # mdmfs/pathnames.h # mdmfs/mdmfs.c # mdmfs/mdmfs.8 # echo c - mdmfs mkdir -p mdmfs > /dev/null 2>&1 echo x - mdmfs/Makefile sed 's/^X//' >mdmfs/Makefile << 'END-of-mdmfs/Makefile' X# $FreeBSD$ X XPROG= mdmfs XMAN= mdmfs.8 XWARNS?= 2 X X.include END-of-mdmfs/Makefile echo x - mdmfs/pathnames.h sed 's/^X//' >mdmfs/pathnames.h << 'END-of-mdmfs/pathnames.h' X/* $FreeBSD$ */ X#ifndef MDMFS_PATHNAMES_H X#define MDMFS_PATHNAMES_H X X#define PATH_MDCONFIG "/sbin/mdconfig" X#define PATH_DISKLABEL "/sbin/disklabel" X#define PATH_NEWFS "/sbin/newfs" X#define PATH_MOUNT "/sbin/mount" X X#endif /* !MDMFS_PATHNAMES_H */ END-of-mdmfs/pathnames.h echo x - mdmfs/mdmfs.c sed 's/^X//' >mdmfs/mdmfs.c << 'END-of-mdmfs/mdmfs.c' X/* X * Copyright (c) 2001 Dima Dorfman . X * All rights reserved. X * X * Redistribution and use in source and binary forms, with or without X * modification, are permitted provided that the following conditions X * are met: X * 1. Redistributions of source code must retain the above copyright X * notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer. X * 2. Redistributions in binary form must reproduce the above copyright X * notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer in the X * documentation and/or other materials provided with the distribution. X * X * THIS SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED BY THE AUTHOR AND CONTRIBUTORS ``AS IS'' AND X * ANY EXPRESS OR IMPLIED WARRANTIES, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE X * IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE X * ARE DISCLAIMED. IN NO EVENT SHALL THE AUTHOR OR CONTRIBUTORS BE LIABLE X * FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, EXEMPLARY, OR CONSEQUENTIAL X * DAMAGES (INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, PROCUREMENT OF SUBSTITUTE GOODS X * OR SERVICES; LOSS OF USE, DATA, OR PROFITS; OR BUSINESS INTERRUPTION) X * HOWEVER CAUSED AND ON ANY THEORY OF LIABILITY, WHETHER IN CONTRACT, STRICT X * LIABILITY, OR TORT (INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE OR OTHERWISE) ARISING IN ANY WAY X * OUT OF THE USE OF THIS SOFTWARE, EVEN IF ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF X * SUCH DAMAGE. X */ X X/* X * mdmfs (md/MFS) is a wrapper around mdconfig(8), disklabel(8), X * newfs(8), and mount(8) that mimics the command line option set of X * the deprecated mount_mfs(8). As the name suggests, it creates an X * md(4) disk, labels it, newfs's it, and mounts it. X */ X X#ifndef lint Xstatic const char rcsid[] = X "$FreeBSD$"; X#endif /* not lint */ X X#include X#include X#include X#include X X#include X#include X#include X#include X#include X#include X#include X#include X#include X#include X#include X X#include "pathnames.h" X X/* XXX variable args in macros is a GCCism! */ X#define ARGAPPEND(d, s...) (argappend(d, sizeof(d), " " ##s)) X#define debugprintf(s...) if (debug) (void)fprintf(stderr, "DEBUG: " ##s) X Xtypedef enum { false, true } bool; X Xstruct mtpt_info { X uid_t mi_uid; X bool mi_have_uid; X gid_t mi_gid; X bool mi_have_gid; X mode_t mi_mode; X bool mi_have_mode; X}; X Xbool debug, loudsubs, norun; /* Global options. */ Xint unit; /* The unit we're working with. */ Xconst char *mdname; /* Name of memory disk device (e.g., "md"). */ Xsize_t mdnamelen; /* Length of mdname. */ X Xint main(int, char **); Xvoid argappend(char *, size_t, const char *, ...); Xvoid do_disklabel(void); Xvoid do_mdconfig_attach(const char *, const enum md_types); Xvoid do_mdconfig_attach_au(const char *, const enum md_types); Xvoid do_mdconfig_detach(void); Xvoid do_mount(const char *, const char *); Xvoid do_mtptsetup(const char *, struct mtpt_info *); Xvoid do_newfs(const char *); Xvoid extract_ugid(const char *, struct mtpt_info *); Xint run(int *, const char *, ...); Xvoid usage(void); X Xint Xmain(int ac, char **av) X{ X char mdconfig_arg[MAXPATHLEN], newfs_arg[MAXPATHLEN], X mount_arg[MAXPATHLEN]; X char ch, *mtpoint, *unitstr; X struct mtpt_info mi; X bool nodetach = false, softdep = true, autounit = false; X bool have_mdtype = false; X enum md_types mdtype; X X (void)memset(&mi, '\0', sizeof(mi)); X (void)memset(mdconfig_arg, '\0', sizeof(mdconfig_arg)); X (void)memset(newfs_arg, '\0', sizeof(newfs_arg)); X (void)memset(mount_arg, '\0', sizeof(mount_arg)); X mdname = MD_NAME; X mdnamelen = strlen(MD_NAME); X X while ((ch = getopt(ac, av, X "a:b:c:Dd:e:F:f:hi:LMm:Nn:O:o:p:Ss:t:w:X")) != -1) X switch (ch) { X case 'a': X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-a %s", optarg); X break; X case 'b': X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-b %s", optarg); X break; X case 'c': X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-c %s", optarg); X break; X case 'D': X nodetach = true; X break; X case 'd': X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-d %s", optarg); X break; X case 'e': X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-e %s", optarg); X break; X case 'F': X if (have_mdtype) X usage(); X mdtype = MD_VNODE; X have_mdtype = true; X ARGAPPEND(mdconfig_arg, "-f %s", optarg); X break; X case 'f': X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-f %s", optarg); X break; X case 'h': X usage(); X break; X case 'i': X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-i %s", optarg); X break; X case 'L': X loudsubs = true; X break; X case 'M': X if (have_mdtype) X usage(); X mdtype = MD_MALLOC; X have_mdtype = true; X break; X case 'm': X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-m %s", optarg); X break; X case 'N': X norun = true; X break; X case 'n': X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-n %s", optarg); X break; X case 'O': X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-o %s", optarg); X break; X case 'o': X ARGAPPEND(mount_arg, "-o %s", optarg); X break; X case 'p': X if (*optarg >= '0' && *optarg <= '7') X mi.mi_mode = strtol(optarg, NULL, 8); X if ((mi.mi_mode & ~07777) != 0) X usage(); X mi.mi_have_mode = true; X break; X case 'S': X softdep = false; X break; X case 's': X ARGAPPEND(mdconfig_arg, "-s %s", optarg); X break; X case 't': X ARGAPPEND(mount_arg, "-t %s", optarg); X break; X case 'w': X extract_ugid(optarg, &mi); X break; X case 'X': X debug = true; X break; X default: X usage(); X } X ac -= optind; X av += optind; X if (ac < 2) X usage(); X unitstr = av[0]; X if (strncmp(unitstr, "/dev/", 5) == 0) X unitstr += 5; X if (strncmp(unitstr, mdname, mdnamelen) == 0) X unitstr += mdnamelen; X if (*unitstr == '\0') { X autounit = true; X unit = -1; X } else { X unit = strtoul(unitstr, NULL, 10); X if ((unsigned)unit == ULONG_MAX) X errx(1, "bad device unit: %s", unitstr); X } X mtpoint = av[1]; X if (!have_mdtype) X mdtype = MD_SWAP; X X if (softdep) X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-U"); X X if (!nodetach && !autounit) X do_mdconfig_detach(); X if (autounit) X do_mdconfig_attach_au(mdconfig_arg, mdtype); X else X do_mdconfig_attach(mdconfig_arg, mdtype); X do_disklabel(); X do_newfs(newfs_arg); X do_mount(mount_arg, mtpoint); X do_mtptsetup(mtpoint, &mi); X X return (0); X} X X/* X * Append the formatted string pointed to by 'fmt' to 'dst'. X */ Xvoid Xargappend(char *dst, size_t dstlen, const char *fmt, ...) X{ X va_list ap; X char tb[256]; X size_t rv; X X va_start(ap, fmt); X rv = vsnprintf(tb, sizeof(tb), fmt, ap); X va_end(ap); X assert(rv < sizeof(tb)); X rv = strlcat(dst, tb, dstlen); X assert(rv < dstlen); X} X Xvoid Xdo_disklabel(void) X{ X int rv; X X rv = run(NULL, "%s -r -w %s%d auto", PATH_DISKLABEL, mdname, unit); X if (rv) X errx(1, "disklabel exited with error code %d", rv); X} X Xvoid Xdo_mdconfig_attach(const char *args, const enum md_types mdtype) X{ X int rv; X const char *ta; /* Type arg. */ X X switch (mdtype) { X case MD_SWAP: X ta = "-t swap"; X break; X case MD_VNODE: X ta = "-t vnode"; X break; X case MD_MALLOC: X ta = "-t malloc"; X break; X default: X abort(); X } X rv = run(NULL, "%s -a %s%s -u %s%d", PATH_MDCONFIG, ta, args, X mdname, unit); X if (rv) X errx(1, "mdconfig (attach) exited with error code %d", rv); X} X Xvoid Xdo_mdconfig_attach_au(const char *args, const enum md_types mdtype) X{ X int rv, fd; X const char *ta; /* Type arg. */ X char tb[10]; X char *linep; X size_t linelen; X FILE *sfd; /* FILE version of fd. */ X X switch (mdtype) { X case MD_SWAP: X ta = "-t swap"; X break; X case MD_VNODE: X ta = "-t vnode"; X break; X case MD_MALLOC: X ta = "-t malloc"; X break; X default: X abort(); X } X rv = run(&fd, "%s -a %s%s", PATH_MDCONFIG, ta, args); X if (rv) X errx(1, "mdconfig (attach) exited with error code %d", rv); X if (norun) { /* Since we didn't run, we can't read. Fake it. */ X unit = -1; X return; X } X sfd = fdopen(fd, "r"); X if (sfd == NULL) X err(1, "fdopen"); X linep = fgetln(sfd, &linelen); X if (linep == NULL && linelen < mdnamelen + 1) X errx(1, "unexpected output from mdconfig (attach)"); X if (strncmp(linep, mdname, mdnamelen) == 0) X linep += mdnamelen; X assert(linelen + mdnamelen < sizeof(tb)); X strncpy(tb, linep, linelen); X tb[linelen] = '\0'; X unit = strtoul(tb, NULL, 10); X if ((unsigned)unit == ULONG_MAX) X errx(1, "unexpected output from mdconfig (attach)"); X X fclose(sfd); X close(fd); X} X Xvoid Xdo_mdconfig_detach(void) X{ X int rv; X X rv = run(NULL, "%s -d -u %s%d", PATH_MDCONFIG, mdname, unit); X if (rv && debug) /* This is allowed to fail. */ X warnx("mdconfig (detach) exited with error code %d (ignored)", X rv); X} X Xvoid Xdo_mount(const char *args, const char *mtpoint) X{ X int rv; X X rv = run(NULL, "%s%s /dev/%s%dc %s", PATH_MOUNT, args, X mdname, unit, mtpoint); X if (rv) X errx(1, "mount exited with error code %d", rv); X} X Xvoid Xdo_mtptsetup(const char *mtpoint, struct mtpt_info *mip) X{ X X if (mip->mi_have_mode) { X debugprintf("changing mode of %s to %o.\n", mtpoint, X mip->mi_mode); X if (!norun) X if (chmod(mtpoint, mip->mi_mode) == -1) X err(1, "chmod: %s", mtpoint); X } X if (mip->mi_have_uid) { X debugprintf("changing owner (user) or %s to %u.\n", mtpoint, X mip->mi_uid); X if (!norun) X if (chown(mtpoint, mip->mi_uid, -1) == -1) X err(1, "chown %s to %u (user)", mtpoint, X mip->mi_uid); X } X if (mip->mi_have_gid) { X debugprintf("changing owner (group) or %s to %u.\n", mtpoint, X mip->mi_gid); X if (!norun) X if (chown(mtpoint, -1, mip->mi_gid) == -1) X err(1, "chown %s to %u (group)", mtpoint, X mip->mi_gid); X } X} X Xvoid Xdo_newfs(const char *args) X{ X int rv; X X rv = run(NULL, "%s%s /dev/%s%dc", PATH_NEWFS, args, mdname, unit); X if (rv) X errx(1, "newfs exited with error code %d", rv); X} X X/* X * 'str' should be a user and group name similar to the last argument X * to chown(1); i.e., a user, followed by a colon or period, followed X * by a group. The user and group in 'str' may be either a [ug]id or X * a name. Upon return, the uid and gid fields in 'mip' will contain X * the uid and gid of the user and group name in 'str', respectively. X * X * In other words, this derives a user and group id from a string X * formatted like the last argument to chown(1). X */ Xvoid Xextract_ugid(const char *str, struct mtpt_info *mip) X{ X struct passwd *pw; X struct group *gr; X char ug[MAXLOGNAME * 2 + 2]; X char *user, *group; X char *p; X uid_t *uid; X gid_t *gid; X X uid = &mip->mi_uid; X gid = &mip->mi_gid; X mip->mi_have_uid = mip->mi_have_gid = false; X X (void)strlcpy(ug, str, sizeof(ug)); X group = ug; X user = strsep(&group, ":."); X if (user == NULL || group == NULL || *user == '\0' || *group == '\0') X usage(); X X *uid = strtoul(user, &p, 10); X if ((unsigned)*uid == ULONG_MAX) X usage(); X if (*p != '\0') { X pw = getpwnam(user); X if (pw == NULL) X errx(1, "invalid user: %s", user); X *uid = pw->pw_uid; X mip->mi_have_uid = true; X } X *gid = strtoul(group, &p, 10); X if ((unsigned)*gid == ULONG_MAX) X usage(); X if (*p != '\0') { X gr = getgrnam(group); X if (gr == NULL) X errx(1, "invalid group: %s", group); X *gid = gr->gr_gid; X mip->mi_have_gid = true; X } X X assert(mip->mi_have_uid); X assert(mip->mi_have_gid); X} X X/* X * Run a process with command name and arguments pointed to by the X * formatted string 'cmdline'. Since system(3) is not used, the first X * space-delimited token of 'cmdline' must be the full pathname of the X * program to run. The return value is the return code of the process X * spawned. If 'ofd' is non-NULL, it is set to the standard output of X * the program spawned (i.e., you can read from ofd and get the output X * of the program). X */ Xint Xrun(int *ofd, const char *cmdline, ...) X{ X va_list ap; X char cmd[MAXPATHLEN], **av, **avp, *p; X int i, pid, status, ac, pfd[2], nfd; X bool dup2dn = true; /* Dup /dev/null to stdout? */ X X va_start(ap, cmdline); X (void)vsnprintf(cmd, sizeof(cmd), cmdline, ap); X va_end(ap); X X for (ac = 1, p = cmd; (p = strchr(p, ' ')) != NULL; p++) X ac++; /* 'ac' generation loop. */ X av = (char **)malloc(sizeof(*av) * (ac + 1)); X if (av == NULL) X err(1, "malloc"); X for (p = cmd, avp = av; (*avp = strsep(&p, " ")) != NULL;) X if (**av != '\0') X if (++avp >= &av[ac]) { X *avp = NULL; X break; X } X assert(*av); X if (debug) { X (void)fprintf(stderr, "DEBUG: running:"); X /* Should be equivilent to 'cmd' (before strsep, of course). */ X for (i = 0; av[i] != NULL; i++) X (void)fprintf(stderr, " %s", av[i]); X (void)fprintf(stderr, "\n"); X } X if (ofd != NULL) { X if (pipe(&pfd[0]) == -1) X err(1, "pipe"); X *ofd = pfd[0]; X dup2dn = false; X } X pid = fork(); X switch (pid) { X case 0: X if (norun) X _exit(0); X if (ofd != NULL) X if (dup2(pfd[1], STDOUT_FILENO) < 0) X err(1, "dup2"); X if (!loudsubs) { X nfd = open(_PATH_DEVNULL, O_RDWR); X if (nfd < 0) X err(1, "open: %s", _PATH_DEVNULL); X if (dup2(nfd, STDIN_FILENO) < 0) X err(1, "dup2"); X if (dup2dn) X if (dup2(nfd, STDOUT_FILENO) < 0) X err(1, "dup2"); X if (dup2(nfd, STDERR_FILENO) < 0) X err(1, "dup2"); X } X X (void)execv(av[0], av); X warn("exec: %s", av[0]); X _exit(-1); X case -1: X err(1, "fork"); X } X while (waitpid(pid, &status, 0) != pid) X ; X free(av); X return (WEXITSTATUS(status)); X} X Xvoid Xusage(void) X{ X X fprintf(stderr, X"usage: %s [-DLMNSX] [-a maxcontig] [-b block-size] [-c cylinders]\n" X"\t[-d rotdelay] [-e maxbpg] [-F file] [-f frag-size] [-i bytes]\n" X"\t[-m percent-free] [-n rotational-positions] [-O optimization]\n" X"\t[-o mount-options] [-p permissions] [-s size] [-w user:group]\n" X"\tmd-device mount-point\n", getprogname()); X exit(1); X} END-of-mdmfs/mdmfs.c echo x - mdmfs/mdmfs.8 sed 's/^X//' >mdmfs/mdmfs.8 << 'END-of-mdmfs/mdmfs.8' X.\" X.\" Copyright (c) 2001 Dima Dorfman X.\" All rights reserved. X.\" X.\" Redistribution and use in source and binary forms, with or without X.\" modification, are permitted provided that the following conditions X.\" are met: X.\" 1. Redistributions of source code must retain the above copyright X.\" notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer. X.\" 2. Redistributions in binary form must reproduce the above copyright X.\" notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer in the X.\" documentation and/or other materials provided with the distribution. X.\" X.\" THIS SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED BY THE AUTHOR AND CONTRIBUTORS ``AS IS'' AND X.\" ANY EXPRESS OR IMPLIED WARRANTIES, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE X.\" IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE X.\" ARE DISCLAIMED. IN NO EVENT SHALL THE AUTHOR OR CONTRIBUTORS BE LIABLE X.\" FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, EXEMPLARY, OR CONSEQUENTIAL X.\" DAMAGES (INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, PROCUREMENT OF SUBSTITUTE GOODS X.\" OR SERVICES; LOSS OF USE, DATA, OR PROFITS; OR BUSINESS INTERRUPTION) X.\" HOWEVER CAUSED AND ON ANY THEORY OF LIABILITY, WHETHER IN CONTRACT, STRICT X.\" LIABILITY, OR TORT (INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE OR OTHERWISE) ARISING IN ANY WAY X.\" OUT OF THE USE OF THIS SOFTWARE, EVEN IF ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF X.\" SUCH DAMAGE. X.\" X.\" $FreeBSD$ X.\" X.Dd May 26, 2001 X.Dt MDMFS 8 X.Os X.Sh NAME X.Nm mdmfs X.Nd configure and mount an in-memory filesystem using the X.Xr md 4 Xdriver X.Sh SYNOPSIS X.Nm X.Op Fl DLMNSX X.Op Fl a Ar maxcontig X.Op Fl b Ar block-size X.Op Fl c Ar cylinders X.Op Fl d Ar rotdelay X.Op Fl e Ar maxbpg X.Op Fl F Ar file X.Op Fl f Ar frag-size X.Op Fl i Ar bytes X.Op Fl m Ar percent-free X.Op Fl n Ar rotational-positions X.Op Fl O Ar optimization X.Op Fl o Ar mount-options X.Op Fl p Ar permissions X.Op Fl s Ar size X.Op Fl w Ar user Ns | Ns Ar group X.Ar md-device X.Ar mount-point X.Sh DESCRIPTION XThe X.Nm Xprogram is designed to be a work-alike and look-alike of the deprecated X.Xr mount_mfs 8 . XThe end result is essentially the same, Xbut is accomplished in a completely different way. X.Nm Xconfigures an X.Xr md 4 Xdisk using X.Xr mdconfig 8 , Xlabels it using X.Xr disklabel 8 , Xputs a UFS filesystem on it using X.Xr newfs 8 , Xand mounts it using X.Xr mount 8 . XAll the command line options are passed to the appropriate program Xat the appropriate stage in order to achieve the desired effect. X.Pp XBy default, X.Nm Xcreates a swap-based X.Pq Dv MD_SWAP Xdisk with soft-updates enabled Xand mounts it on X.Ar mount-point . XIt uses the X.Xr md 4 Xdevice specified by X.Ar md-device . XIf X.Ar md-device Xis X.Ql md X(no unit number), Xit will use X.Xr md 4 Ns 's Xauto-unit feature to automatically select an unused device. XUnless otherwise specified with one of the options below, Xit uses the default arguments to all the helper programs. X.Pp XThe following options are available. XWhere possible, Xthe option letter matches the one used by X.Xr mount_mfs 8 Xfor the same thing. X.Bl -tag -width Ds X.It Fl a Ar maxcontig XSpecify the maximum number of contiguous blocks that will be laid Xout before forcing a rotational delay X(see the X.Fl d Xoption). X.It Fl b Ar block-size XThe block size of the filesystem, in bytes. X.It Fl c Ar cylinders XThe number of cylinders per cylinder group in the filesystem. X.It Fl D XIf not using auto-unit, Xdon't run X.Xr mdconfig 8 Xto try to detach the unit before attaching it. X.It Fl d Ar rotdelay XSpecify the mininum time in milliseconds required to initiate another Xdisk transfer on the same cylinder. XModern disks with read/write-behind achieve higher performance without Xthis feature, Xso it is best to leave it at 0 milliseconds. X.It Fl e Ar maxbpg XIndicate the maximum number of blocks any single file can allocate Xout of a cylinder group before it is forced to begin allocating Xblocks from another cylinder group. X.It Fl F Ar file XCreate a vnode-backed X.Pq Dv MD_VNODE Xmemory disk backed by X.Ar file . X.It Fl f Ar frag-size XThe fragment size of the filesystem in bytes. X.It Fl i Ar bytes XNumber of bytes per inode. X.It Fl L XShow the output of the helper programs. XBy default, Xit is sent to X.Pa /dev/null . X.It Fl M XCreate a X.Xr malloc 9 Xbacked disk X.Pq Dv MD_MALLOC Xinstead of a swap-backed disk. X.It Fl m Ar percent-free XThe percentage of space reserved for the superuser. X.It Fl N XDon't actually run the helper programs. XThis is most useful in conjunction with X.Fl X . X.It Fl n Ar rotational-positions XThe default number of rotational positions to distinguish. X.It Fl O Ar optimization XSelect the optimization preference; Xvalid choices are X.Ar space Xand X.Ar time , Xwhich will optimize for minimum space fragmentation and Xminimum time spent allocating blocks, Xrespectively. X.It Fl o Ar mount-options XSpecify the mount options with which to mount the filesystem. XSee X.Xr mount 8 Xfor more information. X.It Fl p Ar permissions XSet the file (directory) permissions of the mount point X.Ar mount-point Xto X.Ar permissions . X.It Fl S XDon't enable soft-updates on the filesystem. X.It Fl s Ar size XSpecify the size of the disk to create. XThis only makes sense if X.Fl F Xis X.Em not Xspecified. XThat is, Xthis will work for the default swap-backed X.Pq Dv MD_SWAP Xdisks, Xand the optional X.Pq Fl M X.Xr malloc 9 Xbacked disks X.Pq Dv MD_MALLOC . X.It Fl w Ar user Ns | Ns Ar group XSet the owner user and group to X.Ar user Xand X.Ar group , Xrespectively. XThe arguments have the same semantics as with X.Xr chown 8 , Xbut specifying just a user or just a group is not supported. X.El X.Pp XThe X.Fl F Xand X.Fl s Xoptions are passed to X.Xr mdconfig 8 Xas X.Fl f Xand X.Fl s , Xrespectively. XThe X.Fl a , X.Fl b , X.Fl c , X.Fl d , X.Fl e , X.Fl f , X.Fl i , X.FL m Xand X.Fl n Xoptions are passed to X.Xr newfs 8 Xwith the same letter; Xthe X.Fl O Xoption is passed to X.Xr newfs 8 Xas X.Fl o . XThe X.Fl o Xand X.Fl t Xoptions are passed to X.Xr mount 8 Xwith the same letter. XSee the programs that the options are passed to for more information Xon their semantics. X.Sh EXAMPLES XCreate and mount a 32 megabyte swap-backed filesystem on X.Pa /tmp : X.Pp X.Dl mdmfs -s 32m md /tmp X.Pp XCreate and mount a 16 megabyte malloc-backed filesystem on X.Pa /tmp Xusing the X.Pa /dev/md1 Xdevice; Xfurthermore, Xdon't use soft-updates it and mount it X.Cm async : X.Pp X.Dl mdmfs -M -S -o async -s 16m md1 /tmp X.Sh AUTHORS X.An Dima Dorfman X.Aq dima@unixfreak.org END-of-mdmfs/mdmfs.8 exit To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 0:53:41 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from boco.fee.vutbr.cz (boco.fee.vutbr.cz [147.229.9.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6492237B405 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:53:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cejkar@dcse.fee.vutbr.cz) Received: from kazi.dcse.fee.vutbr.cz (kazi.dcse.fee.vutbr.cz [147.229.8.12]) by boco.fee.vutbr.cz (8.11.4/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5C7rTD47995 (using TLSv1/SSLv3 with cipher EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA (168 bits) verified OK); Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:53:29 +0200 (CEST) Received: (from cejkar@localhost) by kazi.dcse.fee.vutbr.cz (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5C7rNw79853; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:53:23 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:53:23 +0200 From: Cejka Rudolf To: David Malone Cc: Peter Wemm , Matt Dillon , Terry Lambert , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: signal(SIGCHLD, SIG_IGN) patch solving SUSv2 compatibility issue Message-ID: <20010612095323.A72009@dcse.fee.vutbr.cz> References: <200106101845.f5AIje014790@earth.backplane.com> <20010611002050.362CE380E@overcee.netplex.com.au> <20010611115806.A53216@walton.maths.tcd.ie> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010611115806.A53216@walton.maths.tcd.ie>; from dwmalone@maths.tcd.ie on Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 11:58:06AM +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG David Malone wrote (2001/06/11): > On Sun, Jun 10, 2001 at 05:20:50PM -0700, Peter Wemm wrote: > > I agree totally. This should have been done ages ago, I've been burned on > > it a few times, but never badly enough to go fix it. > > I've committed this - I'll let Matt do the MFC when he feels ready. Thanks for this commit, but it works exactly in the way, which I wanted to avoid. It is something like "partially submitted and not approved by me". Please, could you look once again on it? Please please please... Thanks. ;-) - Hunk #1 from commit adds PS_NOCLDWAIT when SIG_IGN is used for SIGCHLD, so if I use sigemptyset(&sa.sa_mask); sa.sa_flags = 0; sa.sa_handler = SIG_IGN; sigaction(SIGCHLD, &sa, NULL); sigaction(SIGCHLD, NULL, &so); I get additional flag SA_NOCLDWAIT in so.sa_flags. None of tested systems (Solaris, Unixware, Irix, Linux, Aix) works in this way. - If hunk #1 is applied, I see hunk #2 (resetting SIG_IGN to SIG_DFL for SIGCHLD) as almost unnecessary, because it is just cosmetic change now and behavior in exec() is very different among various systems. - (And I have found another bug in my original patch. Three code lines and two bad bugs... :-( :-) Here are patches for current -current (... which I had to do in the first posting). These should change the behavior as is in Solaris, where flags are not added and SIGCHLD is resetted to SIG_DFL after an exec(). I'm testing these patches on my -stable production backup server running amanda and up to now without any problem. # Back out hunk #1 from applied commit --- sys/kern/kern_sig.c.orig Mon Jun 11 21:47:29 2001 +++ sys/kern/kern_sig.c Tue Jun 12 07:42:42 2001 @@ -293,8 +293,7 @@ p->p_procsig->ps_flag |= PS_NOCLDSTOP; else p->p_procsig->ps_flag &= ~PS_NOCLDSTOP; - if ((act->sa_flags & SA_NOCLDWAIT) || - ps->ps_sigact[_SIG_IDX(SIGCHLD)] == SIG_IGN) { + if (act->sa_flags & SA_NOCLDWAIT) { /* * Paranoia: since SA_NOCLDWAIT is implemented * by reparenting the dying child to PID 1 (and # Add test for SIG_IGN to exit1() --- sys/kern/kern_exit.c.orig Mon Jun 11 21:47:35 2001 +++ sys/kern/kern_exit.c Tue Jun 12 07:41:22 2001 @@ -341,7 +341,8 @@ * flag set, notify process 1 instead (and hope it will handle * this situation). */ - if (p->p_pptr->p_procsig->ps_flag & PS_NOCLDWAIT) { + if ((p->p_pptr->p_procsig->ps_flag & PS_NOCLDWAIT) + || p->p_pptr->p_sigacts->ps_sigact[_SIG_IDX(SIGCHLD)] == SIG_IGN) { struct proc *pp = p->p_pptr; proc_reparent(p, initproc); /* # And this is patch for question from my first posting: ... Why? I know # that sa_handler and sa_sigaction are the same pointer in an union, # but I think that "act->sa_handler" should be exchanged with # "(__sighandler_t *)act->sa_sigaction" for clarification purposes. --- sys/kern/kern_sig.c Tue Jun 12 07:42:42 2001 +++ sys/kern/kern_sig.c.new Tue Jun 12 08:16:12 2001 @@ -259,11 +259,11 @@ ps->ps_catchmask[_SIG_IDX(sig)] = act->sa_mask; SIG_CANTMASK(ps->ps_catchmask[_SIG_IDX(sig)]); if (act->sa_flags & SA_SIGINFO) { - ps->ps_sigact[_SIG_IDX(sig)] = act->sa_handler; - SIGADDSET(ps->ps_siginfo, sig); - } else { ps->ps_sigact[_SIG_IDX(sig)] = (__sighandler_t *)act->sa_sigaction; + SIGADDSET(ps->ps_siginfo, sig); + } else { + ps->ps_sigact[_SIG_IDX(sig)] = act->sa_handler; SIGDELSET(ps->ps_siginfo, sig); } if (!(act->sa_flags & SA_RESTART)) Thanks. -- Rudolf Cejka (cejkar@dcse.fee.vutbr.cz; http://www.fee.vutbr.cz/~cejkar) Brno University of Technology, Faculty of El. Engineering and Comp. Science Bozetechova 2, 612 66 Brno, Czech Republic To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 0:56:32 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from segfault.kiev.ua (segfault.kiev.ua [193.193.193.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ACC7437B405 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:56:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from netch@iv.nn.kiev.ua) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by segfault.kiev.ua (8) with UUCP id KVA96388; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:54:40 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from netch@iv.nn.kiev.ua) Received: (from netch@localhost) by iv.nn.kiev.ua (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5C7rIw01230; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:53:18 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from netch) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:53:18 +0300 From: Valentin Nechayev To: Cyrille Lefevre Cc: Matthew Seaman , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Perl module for periodic scripts Message-ID: <20010612105318.B923@iv.nn.kiev.ua> References: <20010611102830.A26191@plasm.demon.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: ; from clefevre-lists@noos.fr on Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 02:57:46AM +0200 X-42: On Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 02:57:46, clefevre-lists (Cyrille Lefevre) wrote about "Re: Perl module for periodic scripts": > FYI, the date stuff can be written in pure shell. don't know yet > about the uniq -i but should be possible w/o perl. tr '[A-Z]' '[a-z]' | uniq (does this uniquing requires to preserve case of at least one variant? I suppose no) > see the following url on a portable (awk and ksh) replacement for > date -v-1d : Then the program will contain perl, ksh and awk code? There are too many languages used, aren't there? Also realize please that base system does not contain ksh. Monolithic perl code, without awk & ksh, will be better because perl is in base system already... /netch To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 1: 4:18 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from segfault.kiev.ua (segfault.kiev.ua [193.193.193.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC0EF37B405 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 01:04:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from netch@iv.nn.kiev.ua) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by segfault.kiev.ua (8) with UUCP id LBO96662; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:04:00 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from netch@iv.nn.kiev.ua) Received: (from netch@localhost) by iv.nn.kiev.ua (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5C82LB01333; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:02:21 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from netch) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:02:21 +0300 From: Valentin Nechayev To: gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: [PATCH] Limited BPF to the specified program Message-ID: <20010612110221.C923@iv.nn.kiev.ua> References: <200106120248.f5C2mcr00360@fatcow.home> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200106120248.f5C2mcr00360@fatcow.home>; from gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn on Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 10:48:38AM +0800 X-42: On Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 10:48:38, gzjyliu (gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn) wrote about "[PATCH] Limited BPF to the specified program": > So I can add the follow lines to my kernel config file: > options BPF_LIMITED > options BPF_ALLOWED_DEVID=29696 > options BPF_ALLOWED_FILEID=439 Another proposition: (an example) sysctl -w net.bpf.allowed_users=0,29,133 sysctl -w net.bpf.allowed_groups=0,215,216 sysctl -w net.bpf.per_interface.fxp2.allowed_users=0,222 But the best variant IMHO is not to produce strange hacks against mainstream development, but implement (via devfs) interface stream devices and interface control devices. If anyone wants to set access rights to interface, he will set ACL to /dev/fxp0.stream or similar. > The 0~7 bits of BPF_ALLOWED_DEVID is the minor number of the device, > while the 8~15 bits is the major number of the device. Probably I > should make the options like BPF_ALLOWED_DEV_MAJOR and > BPF_ALLOWED_DEV_MINOR. > > Anyone interested? Post URL to a page where anyone can find it and list keywords for it. If anyone try to search for it, he will go to google or freebsd.org->mailing_lists->search and enter proper keywords. "Manuscripts cannot burn" ([M. Bulgakov]) /netch To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 1:37:45 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kawoserv.kawo2.rwth-aachen.de (kawoserv.kawo2.RWTH-Aachen.DE [134.130.180.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78FAD37B401 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 01:37:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from alex@big.endian.de) Received: from zerogravity.kawo2.rwth-aachen.de (zerogravity.kawo2.rwth-aachen.de [134.130.181.28]) by kawoserv.kawo2.rwth-aachen.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA14228; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:37:41 +0200 Received: by zerogravity.kawo2.rwth-aachen.de (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 4F59714AAA; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:37:41 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:37:40 +0200 From: Alexander Langer To: gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: [PATCH] Limited BPF to the specified program Message-ID: <20010612103740.C2569@zerogravity.kawo2.rwth-aachen.d> References: <200106120248.f5C2mcr00360@fatcow.home> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200106120248.f5C2mcr00360@fatcow.home>; from gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn on Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 10:48:38AM +0800 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 44 28 CA 4C 46 5B D3 A8 A8 E3 BA F3 4E 60 7D 7F X-PGP-at: finger alex@big.endian.de X-Verwirrung: Dieser Header dient der allgemeinen Verwirrung. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The options should be a sysctl, since dhclient might move from inode to inode and I don't want to recompile a kernel everytime. Also, that should be a list of filesystem:inode pairs, imho, for multiple programs. OTOH, I don't know if that makes sense, since superuser still can compile a new kernel or set the sysctl. Sounds like a neat idea if it actually works, though. Alex To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 2: 8:47 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from public.guangzhou.gd.cn (mail2-smtp.guangzhou.gd.cn [202.105.65.222]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 98B2E37B401 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 02:08:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn) Received: from fatcow.home([203.93.59.244]) by public.guangzhou.gd.cn(JetMail 2.5.3.0) with SMTP id jm3c3b2614b1; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:06:42 -0000 Received: (from jyliu@localhost) by fatcow.home (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5C98cQ71884; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 17:08:38 +0800 (CST) (envelope-from gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn) X-Authentication-Warning: fatcow.home: jyliu set sender to gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn using -f To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: [PATCH] Limited BPF to the specified program References: <200106120248.f5C2mcr00360@fatcow.home> <20010612110221.C923@iv.nn.kiev.ua> From: Jiangyi Liu Date: 12 Jun 2001 17:08:38 +0800 In-Reply-To: <20010612110221.C923@iv.nn.kiev.ua> Message-ID: <87k82ioyjt.fsf@fatcow.home> Lines: 28 User-Agent: Gnus/5.090001 (Oort Gnus v0.01) Emacs/20.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Alexander Langer writes: > The options should be a sysctl, since dhclient might move from inode to > inode and I don't want to recompile a kernel everytime. Had to wait till I figure out how to add a new sysctl. :-) > Also, that should be a list of filesystem:inode pairs, imho, for > multiple programs. > Oh, this one should be easy. If anyone wants this feature, I think I can implement it. However, I'm told by Valentin Nechayev that I should follow the mainstream development, so I think maybe I should cvsup to -current and reimplement. > OTOH, I don't know if that makes sense, since superuser still can > compile a new kernel or set the sysctl. > Nothing can be saved if one can recompile the new kernel and reboot with the new kernel. I think the point is the secure level. Once the secure level is promoted, sysctl is disabled so that nobody can change the program list, of course except rebooting. Jiangyi To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 2:36:41 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz [195.113.31.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 22DE737B408 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 02:36:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mikulas@artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz) Received: from localhost (mikulas@localhost) by artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id LAA11195; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:36:30 +0200 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:36:30 +0200 (CEST) From: Mikulas Patocka To: Matt Dillon Cc: Jonathan Lemon , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <200106112302.f5BN2Mx34109@earth.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > The key thing with patents is that they are meaningless until the > patent holder decides to protect them in court by challenging the > people who are supposedly in violation of the patent. If a patent > holder decides to go after you, it can be costly even if you win. They can't go after me because I don't live in America. However they can go after users ... even if the patent is bogus. What does exactly patent forbid? distribution of sources, distribution of binaries or use of binaries? - if I make compile time switch to turn patented feature off (for paranoid US users who don't have money for lawsuit), would it be possible to distribute the sources in US? Mikulas To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 2:47:11 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cyclone.tornadogroup.com (cyclone.tornadogroup.com [212.172.155.83]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF2A237B401 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 02:47:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from matthew.seaman@tornadogroup.com) Received: from claudette.e1.tornadogroup.com (root@claudette.e1.tornadogroup.com [192.168.0.77]) by cyclone.tornadogroup.com (8.10.0.Beta10/8.10.0.Beta10) with ESMTP id f5C9l5101447; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:47:05 +0100 (BST) Received: from tornadogroup.com (matthew@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by claudette.e1.tornadogroup.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5C9l5o18987; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:47:06 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from matthew.seaman@tornadogroup.com) Message-ID: <3B25E519.ED3BE981@tornadogroup.com> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:47:05 +0100 From: Matthew Seaman X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 4.3-STABLE i386) X-Accept-Language: en-GB, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Valentin Nechayev Cc: Cyrille Lefevre , Matthew Seaman , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Perl module for periodic scripts References: <20010611102830.A26191@plasm.demon.co.uk> <20010612105318.B923@iv.nn.kiev.ua> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Valentin Nechayev wrote: > > Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 02:57:46, clefevre-lists (Cyrille Lefevre) wrote about "Re: Perl module for periodic scripts": > > > FYI, the date stuff can be written in pure shell. don't know yet > > about the uniq -i but should be possible w/o perl. > > tr '[A-Z]' '[a-z]' | uniq > (does this uniquing requires to preserve case of at least one variant? > I suppose no) Hmmm... claudette:/tmp:% cat /tmp/foo aaa aaa aaa AAB aab aab AAB AAC aac AAC aac aac aac aac aad AAD AAD aad aad claudette:/tmp:% cat /tmp/foo | sort -f | uniq -ic 3 aaa 4 AAB 7 AAC 5 AAD claudette:/tmp:% cat /tmp/foo | tr '[A-Z]' '[a-z]' | sort | uniq -c 3 aaa 4 aab 7 aac 5 aad claudette:/tmp:% cat /tmp/foo | perl -ne '$s{lc $_}++; END { for (sort keys %s) { printf "%4d $_", $s{$_}; }}' 3 aaa 4 aab 7 aac 5 aad It's not quite the same, but probably good enough. > > see the following url on a portable (awk and ksh) replacement for > > date -v-1d : > > Then the program will contain perl, ksh and awk code? There are too many > languages used, aren't there? Also realize please that base system does not > contain ksh. Monolithic perl code, without awk & ksh, will be better because > perl is in base system already... Quite so. The current admixture of sh and perl in 470.status-named seems unaesthetic to me. On the other hand, FreeBSD /bin/sh is a lot more like Solaris /bin/ksh than it is like Solaris /bin/sh. Cyrille's ksh code should port fairly readily to FreeBSD /bin/sh. Matthew -- Matthew Seaman Tel: 01628 498661 Certe, Toto, sentio nos in Kansate non iam adesse. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 2:53:53 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ip.eth.net (mail.ip.eth.net [202.9.128.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 211BE37B401 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 02:53:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from anjali@indranetworks.com) Received: (apparently) from anjali ([202.9.130.19]) by ip.eth.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.467.46); Tue, 12 Jun 2001 15:03:57 +0530 Message-ID: <03e201c0f322$e52e2c60$0a64a8c0@indranetworks.com> From: "Anjali Kulkarni" To: Subject: User-Level upcalls Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 15:04:34 +0530 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_03DF_01C0F350.FD63E710" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_03DF_01C0F350.FD63E710 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable hi, Does any one know how to perform user-level upcalls from kernel TCP/IP = stack? If I wanted to get an upcall every time a data packet arrived on = a socket, how can it be done? Can I use signal handlers for this? Thanks, Anjali ------=_NextPart_000_03DF_01C0F350.FD63E710 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
hi,
 
Does any one know how to perform = user-level upcalls=20 from kernel TCP/IP stack? If I wanted to get an upcall every time a data = packet=20 arrived on a socket, how can it be done? Can I use signal handlers for=20 this?
 
Thanks,
Anjali
------=_NextPart_000_03DF_01C0F350.FD63E710-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 3: 2:18 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from revolt.poohsticks.org (revolt.poohsticks.org [63.227.60.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA08337B407 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 03:02:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from drew@revolt.poohsticks.org) Received: from revolt.poohsticks.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by revolt.poohsticks.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5CA1TV46096; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 04:01:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from drew@revolt.poohsticks.org) Message-Id: <200106121001.f5CA1TV46096@revolt.poohsticks.org> To: Juan Fco Rodriguez Hervella Cc: Lista Subject: Re: New c file under netinet6/ is not compiled, help In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:33:59 +0200." <3B25C5E7.39FEC964@it.uc3m.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <46093.992340088.1@revolt.poohsticks.org> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 04:01:29 -0600 From: Drew Eckhardt Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <3B25C5E7.39FEC964@it.uc3m.es>, jrh@it.uc3m.es writes: >I have included the "opt_xxx.h" in this c file, >What does I need to do to force this new .c under /netinet6 >to compile ? Add an appropriate entry to /usr/src/sys/conf/files To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 4: 1: 4 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.noos.fr (descartes.noos.net [212.198.2.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6485337B403 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 04:01:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@gits.dyndns.org) Received: (qmail 965234 invoked by uid 0); 12 Jun 2001 11:00:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gits.dyndns.org) ([212.198.228.81]) (envelope-sender ) by 212.198.2.74 (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 12 Jun 2001 11:00:58 -0000 Received: (from root@localhost) by gits.dyndns.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5CB0uo70876; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:00:56 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from root) Message-Id: <200106121100.f5CB0uo70876@gits.dyndns.org> Subject: Re: Perl module for periodic scripts In-Reply-To: <3B25E519.ED3BE981@tornadogroup.com> To: Matthew Seaman Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:00:56 +0200 (CEST) Cc: Valentin Nechayev , Matthew Seaman , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: clefevre@redirect.to From: Cyrille Lefevre Organization: ACME X-Face: V|+c;4!|B?E%BE^{E6);aI.[<97Zd*>^#%Y5Cxv;%Y[PT-LW3;A:fRrJ8+^k"e7@+30g0YD0*^^3jgyShN7o?a]C la*Zv'5NA,=963bM%J^o]C X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL92 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matthew Seaman wrote: [snip] > > > see the following url on a portable (awk and ksh) replacement for > > > date -v-1d : > > > > Then the program will contain perl, ksh and awk code? There are too many > > languages used, aren't there? Also realize please that base system does not welcome in the portable unix shell programming world ;^) > > contain ksh. Monolithic perl code, without awk & ksh, will be better because > > perl is in base system already... not everybody known perl, while everybody known sh/sed/awk. > Quite so. The current admixture of sh and perl in 470.status-named seems > unaesthetic to me. I'll see if it's possible to rewrite this perl script. > On the other hand, FreeBSD /bin/sh is a lot more like Solaris /bin/ksh than it is like Solaris /bin/sh. Cyrille's ksh code should > port fairly readily to FreeBSD /bin/sh. first of all, it's not my code, but the code is free. here is an ash (POSIX?) port of date2julian and julian2date. please, left the (c)opytight where it is. thanks. # Date calculations using POSIX shell # Gregorian calendar only. # Tapani Tarvainen July 1998, May 2000 # This code is in the public domain. # Julian Day Number from calendar date date2julian () # day month year { local day month year tmpmonth tmpyear day=$1; month=$2; year=$3 tmpmonth=$(( (12 * $year) + $month - 3 )) tmpyear=$(( $tmpmonth / 12 )) echo $(( (((734 * $tmpmonth) + 15) / 24) - (2 * $tmpyear) + \ ($tmpyear / 4) - ($tmpyear / 100) + ($tmpyear / 400) + \ $day + 1721119 )) } # Calendar date from Julian Day Number julian2date () # julianday { local day month year tmpday centuries tmpday=$(( $1 - 1721119 )) centuries=$(( ((4 * $tmpday) - 1) / 146097 )) tmpday=$(( $tmpday + $centuries - ($centuries / 4) )) year=$(( ((4 * $tmpday) - 1) / 1461 )) tmpday=$(( $tmpday - ((1461 * $year) / 4) )) month=$(( ((10 * $tmpday) - 5) / 306 )) day=$(( $tmpday - (((306 * $month) + 5) / 10) )) month=$(( $month + 2 )) year=$(( $year + ($month / 12) )) month=$(( ($month % 12) + 1 )) echo $day $month $year } now=$(date "+%d %m %Y") julian=$(date2julian $now) julian=$(( $julian - 1 )) yesterday=$(julian2date $julian) echo $now : $yesterday Cyrille. -- home: mailto:clefevre@redirect.to UNIX is user-friendly; it's just particular work: mailto:Cyrille.Lefevre@edf.fr about who it chooses to be friends with. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 4:27:39 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from serenity.mcc.ac.uk (serenity.mcc.ac.uk [130.88.200.93]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0486637B405; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 04:27:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jcm@freebsd-uk.eu.org) Received: from dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org ([130.88.200.97] ident=root) by serenity.mcc.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 2.05 #6) id 159mKa-000JqI-00; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:27:32 +0100 Received: (from jcm@localhost) by dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org (8.11.3/8.11.1) id f5CBRWh81496; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:27:32 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from jcm) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:27:32 +0100 From: j mckitrick To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Subject: disconnecting from detached zip drive Message-ID: <20010612122731.A81226@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hi all, i'm working on turning the zip driver and all the ppbus devices into modules. So far, i have the vpo (zip driver) detaching, but i have problems when i reattach. In the initial attach() call, we allocate a tiny bit of memory for a device controlling microsequence, and we call cam_sim_alloc(), xpt_bus_register(), and then rescan the bus. If we fail, we call cam_simq_free() if the xxx_alloc call failed, and we call cam_sim_free() if xxx_register() fails. In detach(), i am experimenting (!) and right now i free() the microsequence (unrelated to cam) and call cam_sim_free(). Here is the problem: when i detach, everything looks fine. I attach() when i reload the module, and the log message says it is now allocating device vpo0 and vpo1. There is only supposed to be vpo0, of course. It also assigns these as da1 and da2, instead of da0. Now, when i try to mount the drive, i get a page fault in cam and/or mount, depending on what i did in detach(). What needs to be done to completely disconnect the zip drive from cam, so that the new attachment looks like it is starting over from scratch? Jonathon -- Tech support: Try this. Arrange the parts in neat piles. Stand on your chair until you can see over your cubicle walls. Now shout "Does anybody know how to read a manual?" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 5:26:57 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ringworld.nanolink.com (ringworld.nanolink.com [195.24.48.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id A462337B405 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 05:26:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roam@orbitel.bg) Received: (qmail 10816 invoked by uid 1000); 12 Jun 2001 09:34:57 -0000 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:34:57 +0300 From: Peter Pentchev To: Juan Fco Rodriguez Hervella Cc: Lista Subject: Re: New c file under netinet6/ is not compiled, help Message-ID: <20010612123456.B819@ringworld.oblivion.bg> Mail-Followup-To: Juan Fco Rodriguez Hervella , Lista References: <3B25C5E7.39FEC964@it.uc3m.es> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <3B25C5E7.39FEC964@it.uc3m.es>; from jrh@it.uc3m.es on Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 09:33:59AM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 09:33:59AM +0200, Juan Fco Rodriguez Hervella wrote: > Hi: > > I am trying to create a new option into the KERNEL, but > I dont have experience on it, and when the "make" try to link > the *.o files, it is showed an undefined reference to > a function that is implemented in a .c that is not compiled. > > I have included the "opt_xxx.h" in this c file, > What does I need to do to force this new .c under /netinet6 > to compile ? I believe you need to add a line for your source file in the sys/conf/files, or sys/conf/files.{arch} if it is platform-specific. I'm not sure of the exact syntax for sys/conf/files entries, although it seems pretty straightforward for .c/.h files that do not require any specific compiler options. G'luck, Peter -- "yields falsehood, when appended to its quotation." yields falsehood, when appended to its quotation. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 6: 8:47 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ip.eth.net (mail.ip.eth.net [202.9.128.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DADE137B403 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 06:08:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from anjali@indranetworks.com) Received: (apparently) from anjali ([202.9.130.19]) by ip.eth.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.117.11); Tue, 12 Jun 2001 18:38:27 +0530 Message-ID: <043f01c0f340$dbf95160$0a64a8c0@indranetworks.com> From: "Anjali Kulkarni" To: "Josh Osborne" Cc: References: <200106121221.FAA16567@smtpout.mac.com> Subject: Re: User-Level upcalls Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 18:39:03 +0530 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_043A_01C0F36E.F3F648D0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_043A_01C0F36E.F3F648D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, Thanks a lot for the info. But how can I use poll and select to make the = kernel call the user-upcall? Poll and select will run in user-mode and = will take processor cycles in busy waiting. I want an event-driven = mechanism in which kernel will automatically call the upcall(like an = interrupt) when it receives a data packet at the TCP layer, to avoid = polling in user code to check if data has arrived at the socket.=20 I will read about kqueues, and fcntl which I dont know much about:) Thanks, Anjali ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Josh Osborne=20 To: Anjali Kulkarni=20 Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 5:50 PM Subject: Re: User-Level upcalls On Tuesday, June 12, 2001, at 05:34 AM, Anjali Kulkarni wrote: hi, =20 Does any one know how to perform user-level upcalls from kernel = TCP/IP stack? If I wanted to get an upcall every time a data packet = arrived on a socket, how can it be done? Can I use signal handlers for = this? =20 Thanks, Anjali kqueue is the nicest interface, but new and not as portable as others. poll and select are more traditional, and popular. you can also try fcntl's O_ASYNC flag, but I have never used it. ------=_NextPart_000_043A_01C0F36E.F3F648D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,
 
Thanks a lot for the info. But how can = I use poll=20 and select to make the kernel call the user-upcall? Poll and select will = run in=20 user-mode and will take processor cycles in busy waiting. I want an = event-driven=20 mechanism in which kernel will automatically call the upcall(like an = interrupt)=20 when it receives a data packet at the TCP layer, to avoid polling in = user code=20 to check if data has arrived at the socket.
I will read about kqueues, and fcntl = which I dont=20 know much about:)
 
Thanks,
Anjali
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Josh = Osborne
To: Anjali=20 Kulkarni
Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 = 5:50=20 PM
Subject: Re: User-Level = upcalls

On Tuesday, June 12, 2001, at 05:34 AM, Anjali Kulkarni = wrote:

hi,
 
Does=20 any one know how to perform user-level upcalls from kernel TCP/IP = stack? If=20 I wanted to get an upcall every time a data packet arrived on a = socket, how=20 can it be done? Can I use signal handlers for=20 this?
 
Thanks,
Anjali


k= queue=20 is the nicest interface, but new and not as portable as = others.
poll and=20 select are more traditional, and popular.
you can also try fcntl's = O_ASYNC=20 flag, but I have never used it. ------=_NextPart_000_043A_01C0F36E.F3F648D0-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 6:51:48 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns1.in.yahoo.com (ns1.in.yahoo.com [203.199.70.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95A6B37B405 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 06:51:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from manas@yahoo-inc.com) Received: from yahoo-inc.com (bangalore.in.yahoo.com [203.200.52.16]) by ns1.in.yahoo.com (8.11.1/8.11.1/smtp.in) with ESMTP id f5CDp1F29874; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 19:21:01 +0530 (IST) Message-ID: <3B26286F.E5E6F327@yahoo-inc.com> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 19:34:24 +0500 From: manas X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 4.0-YAHOO-20000510 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Anjali Kulkarni Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: User-Level upcalls References: <200106121221.FAA16567@smtpout.mac.com> <043f01c0f340$dbf95160$0a64a8c0@indranetworks.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------F4838F767407969251B21021" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --------------F4838F767407969251B21021 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit try signal based i/o. basically you have set a signal handler (SIG_IO) and then handle read/write when the signal gets generated. i don't exactly remember the command. it the function call is aio_read/aio_write. check the man thanks manas Anjali Kulkarni wrote: > Hi, Thanks a lot for the info. But how can I use poll and select to > make the kernel call the user-upcall? Poll and select will run in > user-mode and will take processor cycles in busy waiting. I want an > event-driven mechanism in which kernel will automatically call the > upcall(like an interrupt) when it receives a data packet at the TCP > layer, to avoid polling in user code to check if data has arrived at > the socket.I will read about kqueues, and fcntl which I dont know much > about:) Thanks,Anjali > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Josh Osborne > To: Anjali Kulkarni > Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 5:50 PM > Subject: Re: User-Level upcalls > On Tuesday, June 12, 2001, at 05:34 AM, Anjali Kulkarni > wrote: > > > Arial>hi, > > Does any one > know how to perform user-level upcalls from kernel > TCP/IP stack? If I wanted to get an upcall every > time a data packet arrived on a socket, how can it > be done? Can I use signal handlers for > this? > > Arial>Thanks, > Arial>Anjali > > kqueue is the nicest interface, but new and not as portable > as others. > poll and select are more traditional, and popular. > you can also try fcntl's O_ASYNC flag, but I have never used > it. > --------------F4838F767407969251B21021 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit try signal based i/o. basically you have set a signal handler (SIG_IO) and then handle read/write when the signal gets generated. i don't exactly remember the command. it the function call is aio_read/aio_write. check the man
thanks
manas

Anjali Kulkarni wrote:

Hi, Thanks a lot for the info. But how can I use poll and select to make the kernel call the user-upcall? Poll and select will run in user-mode and will take processor cycles in busy waiting. I want an event-driven mechanism in which kernel will automatically call the upcall(like an interrupt) when it receives a data packet at the TCP layer, to avoid polling in user code to check if data has arrived at the socket.I will read about kqueues, and fcntl which I dont know much about:) Thanks,Anjali
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 5:50 PM
Subject: Re: User-Level upcalls
 On Tuesday, June 12, 2001, at 05:34 AM, Anjali Kulkarni wrote:
 
<?fontfamily><?param Arial><?smaller>hi,<?/smaller><?/fontfamily>

<?fontfamily><?param Arial><?smaller>Does any one know how to perform user-level upcalls from kernel TCP/IP stack? If I wanted to get an upcall every time a data packet arrived on a socket, how can it be done? Can I use signal handlers for this?<?/smaller><?/fontfamily>

<?fontfamily><?param Arial><?smaller>Thanks,<?/smaller><?/fontfamily>
<?fontfamily><?param Arial><?smaller>Anjali<?/smaller><?/fontfamily>

kqueue is the nicest interface, but new and not as portable as others.
poll and select are more traditional, and popular.
you can also try fcntl's O_ASYNC flag, but I have never used it.

--------------F4838F767407969251B21021-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 7:39: 0 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from carbon.btinternet.com (carbon.btinternet.com [194.73.73.92]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F26CF37B408 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 07:38:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from daverufino@btinternet.com) Received: from [213.122.49.180] (helo=213.122.37.230) by carbon.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.03 #83) id 159pJj-0002py-00 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 15:38:51 +0100 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 16:40:40 +0100 From: David Rufino To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: nvidia drivers Message-ID: <20010612164040.A2393@btinternet.com> Mail-Followup-To: David Rufino , hackers@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, I've uploaded the nvidia driver code I've been working on to the CVS repository at http://sourceforge.net/projects/nv-bsd, if anyone wants to take a look. It is still work in progress, but has come a long way. In particular you can see the dmesg output when X is started at: http://cvs.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/nv-bsd/nv-bsd/my.log?rev=1.1&content-type=text/vnd.viewcvs-markup Thanks, David Rufino To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 7:50:35 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dzerzhinsky.rem.cs.cmu.edu (DZERZHINSKY.REM.CS.CMU.EDU [128.2.80.192]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08D2137B407 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 07:50:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nlanza@dzerzhinsky.rem.cs.cmu.edu) Received: (from nlanza@localhost) by dzerzhinsky.rem.cs.cmu.edu (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5CEnDb48573; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:49:13 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from nlanza) To: clefevre@redirect.to Cc: Matthew Seaman , Valentin Nechayev , Matthew Seaman , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Perl module for periodic scripts References: <200106121100.f5CB0uo70876@gits.dyndns.org> From: Nat Lanza Date: 12 Jun 2001 10:49:12 -0400 In-Reply-To: <200106121100.f5CB0uo70876@gits.dyndns.org> Message-ID: Lines: 19 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Cyrille Lefevre writes: > not everybody known perl, while everybody known sh/sed/awk. I don't think this is true anymore. I certainly know many people who are familiar with perl but only vaguely familiar with sh and ignorant of sed/awk. I honestly don't understand the anti-perl reactions some people have. Maybe it's not your favorite language, but it's not going away. It's time to accept that. --nat -- nat lanza ----------------------------------- there are no whole truths; magus@cs.cmu.edu ---------------------------- all truths are half-truths http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~magus/ --------------- -- alfred north whitehead To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 8:16: 8 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.webmonster.de (datasink.webmonster.de [194.162.162.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id ADD9737B401 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:15:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from karsten@rohrbach.de) Received: (qmail 64409 invoked by uid 1000); 12 Jun 2001 15:16:13 -0000 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 17:16:13 +0200 From: "Karsten W. Rohrbach" To: Warner Losh Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010612171613.D63565@mail.webmonster.de> Mail-Followup-To: "Karsten W. Rohrbach" , Warner Losh , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> <200106111827.f5BIR2V38517@harmony.village.org> <3B25531D.501B0B05@bellatlantic.net> <200106112356.f5BNujV42614@harmony.village.org> <20010612032831.A11986@firedrake.org> <200106120232.f5C2WLV43391@harmony.village.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="vni90+aGYgRvsTuO" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200106120232.f5C2WLV43391@harmony.village.org>; from imp@harmony.village.org on Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 08:32:21PM -0600 X-Arbitrary-Number-Of-The-Day: 42 X-URL: http://www.webmonster.de/ X-Disclaimer: My opinions do not necessarily represent those of my employer Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --vni90+aGYgRvsTuO Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Warner Losh(imp@harmony.village.org)@2001.06.11 20:32:21 +0000: > Let me clarify. >=20 > If I were to add a few extra "modules" to the system. A, B, and C. > If B needed A and C to start before it, then if I were to remove > module A, B wouldn't start because its prereqs aren't there. These > modules would be added, for example, in a package. >=20 > Btw, for those that were asking, each file has lines like the > following: >=20 > # PROVIDE: ipmon > # REQUIRE: syslogd >=20 > which allows one to give a good dependency graph. =2E..if you are on a stock outofthebox distribution. if you do not use syslogd but a (better) replacement, these startup mimics start to suck=20 bad ass as well. i think the mostly statically wired rc system on freebsd is one of the good points people actually use it. to add something yourself, it's not a problem. don't get me wrong, but the point is: a) it's a good thing[tm] for stabilizing the distribution's starup behaviour b) it will break most of the custom rc stuff other people do of course, the migration path is to move it to /usr/local/etc/rc.d or to /etc/rc.local, but what if i want to run my logger from rc? i write a patch, apply it to the new dist and that's pretty it. if the rc stuff gets too complicated it will become more difficult to find bugs, and for lazy idiots like me it will be a PITA kinda thing to get all the "old" script patches to work on a "new" rc system. on the other hand it sounds reasonable when it will be easy to add customized "modules" and to deactivate the standard ones. i am thinking about something like # PROVIDE: syslogd # REQUIRE: daemontools ;-) /k --=20 > If it ain't broke, overclock it! KR433/KR11-RIPE -- WebMonster Community Founder -- nGENn GmbH Senior Techie http://www.webmonster.de/ -- ftp://ftp.webmonster.de/ -- http://www.ngenn.n= et/ karsten&rohrbach.de -- alpha&ngenn.net -- alpha&scene.org -- catch@spam.de GnuPG 0x2964BF46 2001-03-15 42F9 9FFF 50D4 2F38 DBEE DF22 3340 4F4E 2964 B= F46 --vni90+aGYgRvsTuO Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (FreeBSD) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE7JjI8M0BPTilkv0YRAjN/AJ9fmJFieg0mtbSaRXw7LGmWnq21LwCgoOso 3PcW/jxJcJUy8WPVBcw5QmA= =jUfF -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --vni90+aGYgRvsTuO-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 8:31:31 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from winston.osd.bsdi.com (adsl-64-173-15-98.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net [64.173.15.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 22E2D37B40A; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:31:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) Received: from localhost (jkh@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by winston.osd.bsdi.com (8.11.4/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5CFV0t29222; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:31:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) To: dima@unixfreak.org Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, dougb@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: mount_mfs-like program for md In-Reply-To: <20010612073947.51AD73E28@bazooka.unixfreak.org> References: <20010612073947.51AD73E28@bazooka.unixfreak.org> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.94.1 on Emacs 20.7 / Mule 4.0 (HANANOEN) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20010612083100F.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:31:00 -0700 From: Jordan Hubbard X-Dispatcher: imput version 20000228(IM140) Lines: 13 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG From: Dima Dorfman Subject: mount_mfs-like program for md Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:39:47 -0700 > Hi folks, > > Would anybody have a tantrum if a program with a mount_mfs-like > interface to create an md disk and put a UFS filesystem on it was I think it's a fine idea! It would address something that's becoming a FAQ. - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 8:36:36 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from winston.osd.bsdi.com (adsl-64-173-15-98.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net [64.173.15.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C776E37B403 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:36:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) Received: from localhost (jkh@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by winston.osd.bsdi.com (8.11.4/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5CFaBt29250; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:36:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) To: mikulas@artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz Cc: dillon@earth.backplane.com, jlemon@flugsvamp.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: References: <200106112302.f5BN2Mx34109@earth.backplane.com> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.94.1 on Emacs 20.7 / Mule 4.0 (HANANOEN) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20010612083611K.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:36:11 -0700 From: Jordan Hubbard X-Dispatcher: imput version 20000228(IM140) Lines: 15 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This whole thread is kind of silly. Don't people realize the sheer number of "patent infringments" there are in FreeBSD (or, indeed, Linux?) Sure, you could add a flag to turn each and every instance of such patent infringment off but the end-result would be something that didn't even resemble an operating system. Oh, and do you like to use Emacs? Better remove it - it violates the natural order recalc patent that Lotus (now IBM) holds. You like the cursor on your screen? Turn it off - it violates the XOR patent from CADRAC. The patent system is broken and we need to focus our energies on reforming it, not on trying to bend ourselves into impossible shapes to conform to the damage it's done. - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 8:53:36 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net (falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B69437B403 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:53:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kway@overtone.org) Received: from bean.overtone.org (2Cust94.tnt14.phl1.da.uu.net [63.46.183.222]) by falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net (EL-8_9_3_3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA09434; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:53:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: by bean.overtone.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id F3051326D; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:53:26 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:53:26 -0400 From: Kevin Way To: Jordan Hubbard Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010612115326.A83911@bean.overtone.org> References: <20010611205158.J23562@bohr.physics.purdue.edu> <200106120305.f5C35Ri37415@earth.backplane.com> <20010611233420.I26841@csh.rit.edu> <20010611212528U.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010611212528U.jkh@osd.bsdi.com>; from jkh@osd.bsdi.com on Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 09:25:28PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 09:25:28PM -0700, Jordan Hubbard wrote: > Guys, guys. The NetBSD /etc/rc system is good. We should stop > arguing about it and just focus on figuring out who's going to > integrate it or the whole conversation concerns a moot point > anyway.:) I'll do it, if nobody has any objections to that. I just ordered a spare machine a few days ago. I'll install=20 -CURRENT on it, and start the integration. I've been needing something to keep myself out of trouble. -Kevin Way --=20 Obscenity is the crutch of inarticulate motherfuckers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 9:23:55 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from axl.seasidesoftware.co.za (axl.seasidesoftware.co.za [196.31.7.201]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85E6837B403 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:23:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sheldonh@starjuice.net) Received: from sheldonh (helo=axl.seasidesoftware.co.za) by axl.seasidesoftware.co.za with local-esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 159qxN-000DOH-00 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 18:23:53 +0200 From: Sheldon Hearn To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Plan to import NetBSD rc system Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 18:23:53 +0200 Message-ID: <51476.992363033@axl.seasidesoftware.co.za> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi folks, Here's an update on the plan to import the NetBSD rc system into FreeBSD. I've contacted Luke Mewburn (the guy behind the new NetBSD rc system) and he's keen to chat to FreeBSD-heads after his talk at USENIX (FREENIX track). I can't make it, but I'd encourage interested parties from the FreeBSD community to chat to him. In fact, interested parties are encouraged to attend his talk. :-) After USENIX, the plan is that I'll get a hold of his slides and notes and will post a plan of action to freebsd-hackers, making sure that folks get a chance to see exactly how the new system is going to work. I'm not too interested in hearing a lot of whining from people who haven't given the NetBSD rc system a good look, because it's clear from the last couple of threads that many people are more than willing to post comments on something they haven't seen and such posts have contributed nothing. In short, the NetBSD rc system scores us startup depdendency management while preserving the monolithic rc.conf principle. This adds something to FreeBSD that's been missing too long, without taking away something that's widely acknowledged as a very good thing. Ciao, Sheldon. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 9:34: 0 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from harmony.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 673D037B401; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:33:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5CGXjV94720; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:33:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Message-Id: <200106121633.f5CGXjV94720@harmony.village.org> To: Poul-Henning Kamp Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD Cc: Mike Smith , Mikulas Patocka , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:27:30 +0200." <30671.992330850@critter> References: <30671.992330850@critter> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:33:45 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <30671.992330850@critter> Poul-Henning Kamp writes: : Well, the application date is what counts, and that's mar1992, but I'm : pretty sure that Bill Jolitz had them beat to that date already... I'm pretty sure that VMS 3.x used a similar technique. I have my old VMS internals docs from that time frame (maybe they are from 4.x). We're talking pre 1990 for sure. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 9:38:39 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1236937B418 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:38:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5CGcOo42940; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:38:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:38:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106121638.f5CGcOo42940@earth.backplane.com> To: Cejka Rudolf Cc: David Malone , Peter Wemm , Terry Lambert , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: signal(SIGCHLD, SIG_IGN) patch solving SUSv2 compatibility issue References: <200106101845.f5AIje014790@earth.backplane.com> <20010611002050.362CE380E@overcee.netplex.com.au> <20010611115806.A53216@walton.maths.tcd.ie> <20010612095323.A72009@dcse.fee.vutbr.cz> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : :David Malone wrote (2001/06/11): :> On Sun, Jun 10, 2001 at 05:20:50PM -0700, Peter Wemm wrote: :> > I agree totally. This should have been done ages ago, I've been burned on :> > it a few times, but never badly enough to go fix it. :> :> I've committed this - I'll let Matt do the MFC when he feels ready. : :Thanks for this commit, but it works exactly in the way, which :I wanted to avoid. It is something like "partially submitted and :not approved by me". Please, could you look once again on it? :Please please please... Thanks. ;-) : :- Hunk #1 from commit adds PS_NOCLDWAIT when SIG_IGN is used for : SIGCHLD, so if I use : sigemptyset(&sa.sa_mask); : sa.sa_flags = 0; : sa.sa_handler = SIG_IGN; : sigaction(SIGCHLD, &sa, NULL); : sigaction(SIGCHLD, NULL, &so); : I get additional flag SA_NOCLDWAIT in so.sa_flags. None of tested : systems (Solaris, Unixware, Irix, Linux, Aix) works in this way. :- If hunk #1 is applied, I see hunk #2 (resetting SIG_IGN to SIG_DFL : for SIGCHLD) as almost unnecessary, because it is just cosmetic : change now and behavior in exec() is very different among various : systems. You have to remain consistent, otherwise the exec'd program might set a signal handler and then restore the original and suddenly it works differently. :- (And I have found another bug in my original patch. Three code lines : and two bad bugs... :-( :-) : :Here are patches for current -current (... which I had to do in the :first posting). These should change the behavior as is in Solaris, :where flags are not added and SIGCHLD is resetted to SIG_DFL after an :exec(). I'm testing these patches on my -stable production backup :server running amanda and up to now without any problem. : Your patches look pretty good. Personally I don't think having the SA_NOCLDWAIT flag show up is a big deal since programs which use SIG_IGN do not generally know the flag even exists, but I do agree that we might as well make the interface as compatible as possible. I'll take a look at them tonight and (unless Dave wants to) I'll commit an update to -current and hold off the -stable MFC another few days. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 9:40: 8 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from harmony.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A52137B40B for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:40:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5CGdiV94801; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:39:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Message-Id: <200106121639.f5CGdiV94801@harmony.village.org> To: Jordan Hubbard Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD Cc: mikulas@artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz, dillon@earth.backplane.com, jlemon@flugsvamp.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:36:11 PDT." <20010612083611K.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> References: <20010612083611K.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> <200106112302.f5BN2Mx34109@earth.backplane.com> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:39:44 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <20010612083611K.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Jordan Hubbard writes: : The patent system is broken and we need to focus our energies on : reforming it, not on trying to bend ourselves into impossible shapes : to conform to the damage it's done. Exactly. My thoughts are to hell with them. The patent sighted is silly and we should make no efforts to do anything about it in the absense of any direct threat. In addition, I'm not a patent lawyer, so I don't know if our kernel actually violates the patent or not since what we do is slightly different than the patent in question. Is that enough? I don't know. We have more important things to worry about. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 9:42:35 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from harmony.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B08337B401 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:42:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5CGgQV94837; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:42:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Message-Id: <200106121642.f5CGgQV94837@harmony.village.org> To: Sheldon Hearn Subject: Re: Plan to import NetBSD rc system Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 12 Jun 2001 18:23:53 +0200." <51476.992363033@axl.seasidesoftware.co.za> References: <51476.992363033@axl.seasidesoftware.co.za> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:42:26 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <51476.992363033@axl.seasidesoftware.co.za> Sheldon Hearn writes: : I've contacted Luke Mewburn (the guy behind the new NetBSD rc system) : and he's keen to chat to FreeBSD-heads after his talk at USENIX (FREENIX : track). I can't make it, but I'd encourage interested parties from the : FreeBSD community to chat to him. In fact, interested parties are : encouraged to attend his talk. :-) Cool. I'll have to track him down while in Boston. His talk is going to be a little hard for me to attend since I'm not arriving until after it is over :-) : After USENIX, the plan is that I'll get a hold of his slides and notes : and will post a plan of action to freebsd-hackers, making sure that : folks get a chance to see exactly how the new system is going to work. I'd be more interested in just seeing patches posted with a summary of how/why you deviated from the base NetBSD scripts. That is because I think at this point the conversations about this stuff are more light than heat and produce little value add. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 9:50:54 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from imo-r08.mx.aol.com (imo-r08.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.104]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C76D37B408 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:50:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Bsdguru@aol.com) Received: from Bsdguru@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v30.22.) id n.a4.1558c4fa (16789) for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:50:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Bsdguru@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:50:46 EDT Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 139 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In a message dated 06/11/2001 7:02:30 PM Eastern Daylight Time, msmith@freebsd.org writes: > So, you are very safe in using this technique, for a variety of reasons: > > - The patent is almost certainly invalid, and proving this in court > would be straightforward. > - Compaq (owner of the Digital patents now) is not in the business of > patent litigation, nor do they typically sell their patents to other > companies that are, so the chances of you being forced to defend your > use of a similar algorithm in court in the first place are very small. > Worthy of note, however, it that IF they decided to try to enforce it, it would most likely cost you much more than you are worth to defend yourself, no matter how bogus the patent it. Welcome to the US Legal System. Bryan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 10:57: 9 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz [195.113.31.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 15AD137B401; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:56:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mikulas@artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz) Received: from localhost (mikulas@localhost) by artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id TAA02799; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 19:56:53 +0200 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 19:56:53 +0200 (CEST) From: Mikulas Patocka Reply-To: Mikulas Patocka To: Warner Losh Cc: Poul-Henning Kamp , Mike Smith , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <200106121633.f5CGXjV94720@harmony.village.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > : Well, the application date is what counts, and that's mar1992, but I'm > : pretty sure that Bill Jolitz had them beat to that date already... > > I'm pretty sure that VMS 3.x used a similar technique. I have my old > VMS internals docs from that time frame (maybe they are from 4.x). > We're talking pre 1990 for sure. Afaik VAX had one-level (pageable) page tables, so they were contignuous by definition - no need to build special window. Recent versions of VMS on Alpha use this trick - I've read about it in some paper and that's how I've found the patent. Mikulas To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 11:47:42 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [204.156.12.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFB0137B408 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:47:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (robert@fledge.pr.watson.org [192.0.2.3]) by fledge.watson.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f5CIkuf76095; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 14:46:58 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 14:46:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Watson X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org To: Mike Silbersack Cc: gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: [PATCH] Limited BPF to the specified program In-Reply-To: <20010611232418.V3383-100000@achilles.silby.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 11 Jun 2001, Mike Silbersack wrote: > On Tue, 12 Jun 2001 gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn wrote: > > > > Seems I can't contact the coordinator(eivind@FreeBSD.org) of this > > task. So I think maybe I should send the patch to this list. Here is > > the patch for limiting bpf access to the specified program. > > > > For example, if I wanna specify only /sbin/dhclient can use bpf, I > > can: > > The idea sounds neat, especially for computer labs and the like. > Unfortunately, I think this implementation is far too difficult to be > used effectively. Could you instead cause bpf to only return packets > dhclient would use? That would allow bpf to be used by any process, but > only be useful to dhclient. One of the things I actually played with implementing in the past was in effect an "ACL" of allowed BPF programs by-uid. When a BPF program was bound to an interface, the bpfilter code would hash by uid, then do a rather expensive walk down a list of "acceptable filters" and see if the program matched. This meant that you could, for example, allow specific users to monitor specific types of packets (such as a specific port). Since there isn't really a canonical form other than the de facto form libpcap generates bpf code in, there are some limits to this, but it worked fairly well. I didn't attempt to deal with the "which interfaces can they bind" issue, however. I can see if I can dig up the code, or it's fairly easy to replicate if not. For it to work right in jail, I had to strip an extra access control check in the bpf code, I think. I suspect a recent jail commit of mine (probably the ucred commit) removed the extra check, causing bpf to rely only on the device node file permissions rather than arbitrary suser stuff to limit access. Robert N M Watson FreeBSD Core Team, TrustedBSD Project robert@fledge.watson.org NAI Labs, Safeport Network Services To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 11:49:37 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [204.156.12.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E009A37B405 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:49:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (robert@fledge.pr.watson.org [192.0.2.3]) by fledge.watson.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f5CImgf76114; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 14:48:47 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 14:48:42 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Watson X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org To: Valentin Nechayev Cc: gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: [PATCH] Limited BPF to the specified program In-Reply-To: <20010612110221.C923@iv.nn.kiev.ua> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 12 Jun 2001, Valentin Nechayev wrote: > Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 10:48:38, gzjyliu (gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn) wrote about "[PATCH] Limited BPF to the specified program": > > > So I can add the follow lines to my kernel config file: > > options BPF_LIMITED > > options BPF_ALLOWED_DEVID=29696 > > options BPF_ALLOWED_FILEID=439 > > Another proposition: > > (an example) > sysctl -w net.bpf.allowed_users=0,29,133 > sysctl -w net.bpf.allowed_groups=0,215,216 > sysctl -w net.bpf.per_interface.fxp2.allowed_users=0,222 > > But the best variant IMHO is not to produce strange hacks against > mainstream development, but implement (via devfs) interface stream > devices and interface control devices. If anyone wants to set access > rights to interface, he will set ACL to /dev/fxp0.stream or similar. Or we just add ACL support to devfs, and solve the devd/initial ACL problem :-). (Ooo, don't I make that sound simple? :-) Robert N M Watson FreeBSD Core Team, TrustedBSD Project robert@fledge.watson.org NAI Labs, Safeport Network Services To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 12: 7:56 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peace.mahoroba.org (peace.calm.imasy.or.jp [202.227.26.34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AFA3537B405; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:07:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ume@mahoroba.org) Received: from localhost (IDENT:pEJFMaVQrDHE+c3cetChVyrKhLrBCZZZhBr2ajjhCSD4ohFgKyS/C98p/nLxaVXp@localhost [::1]) (authenticated as ume with CRAM-MD5) by peace.mahoroba.org (8.11.4/8.11.4/peace) with ESMTP/inet6 id f5CJ7Gq66978; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 04:07:16 +0900 (JST) (envelope-from ume@mahoroba.org) Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 04:07:16 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <20010613.040716.115941864.ume@mahoroba.org> To: brooks@one-eyed-alien.net Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, brian@Awfulhak.org, phk@critter.freebsd.dk, arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cloning network interfaces From: Hajimu UMEMOTO In-Reply-To: <20010611142030.A15283@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> References: <20010608191904.A18847@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> <20010610.232907.74740159.ume@mahoroba.org> <20010611142030.A15283@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> X-Mailer: xcite1.38> Mew version 1.95b119 on Emacs 20.7 / Mule 4.0 =?iso-2022-jp?B?KBskQjJWMWMbKEIp?= X-PGP-Public-Key: http://www.imasy.org/~ume/publickey.asc X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 0C 53 FC 5D D0 37 91 05 D0 B3 EF 36 9B 6A BC X-URL: http://www.imasy.org/~ume/ X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 5.0-CURRENT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >>>>> On Mon, 11 Jun 2001 14:20:31 -0700 >>>>> Brooks Davis said: brooks> On Sun, Jun 10, 2001 at 11:29:07PM +0900, Hajimu UMEMOTO wrote: > I think it is not BSD network way. Recent NetBSD has network > interface cloning. It uses SIOCIFCREATE and SIOCIFDESTROY. It may > good to port it to FreeBSD. brooks> I've looked it over and I generally like it. There is one problem brooks> though. That's the requirement that you use static units. The problem brooks> with this is that it forces you to implement free unit scanning in brooks> userland if you just want to create a unit and don't care what it is. brooks> If you have to do this, and things are being changed at any kind of brooks> significant rate, you have race condition between scanning the brooks> interface list for a free unit and trying to allocate it. This race can brooks> theoreticaly lead to starvation. I see. brooks> My proposed solution is threefold. First, change the ifc_create pointer's brooks> type to: brooks> int (*ifc_create)(struct if_clone *, int *); brooks> so you can return a unit if the caller requests a wildcard unit (by brooks> passing -1). Second, move unit management in to the driver rather then brooks> just using ifunit in if_clone_create. Drivers could choose to implement brooks> wildcarding or not and if not could simply use ifunit for their test. brooks> Third, make if_clone_lookup treat names like "gif#" as a wildcard brooks> request and set unit to -1 as appropriate. These changes break brooks> compatability with NetBSD slightly, but it's just a few lines to convert brooks> an existing NetBSD clone_create handler to this style and it could brooks> easily be handled with #ifdef's. brooks> Thoughts, comments, objections? I like your idea. I'm serving tunnel broker using DTCP (Dynamic Tunnel Configuration Protocol) in our ISP. So, I'm grad if we have dynamic gif creation, too. -- Hajimu UMEMOTO @ Internet Mutual Aid Society Yokohama, Japan ume@mahoroba.org ume@bisd.hitachi.co.jp ume@{,jp.}FreeBSD.org http://www.imasy.org/~ume/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 12:11:45 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (hokkshideh.jetcafe.org [205.147.43.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5FC3237B405 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:11:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dave@jetcafe.org) Received: from hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA00887; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:11:25 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200106121911.MAA00887@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with version: MH 6.8.4 #1[UCI] To: Warner Losh Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:11:24 -0700 From: Dave Hayes Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Warner Losh writes: > It is more modular and easy to expand after the boot. How do > I start nfs on FreeBSD after it boots? Well, you grep it out of > /etc/rc*. Actually, er, I know to start portmapper, mountd, nfsd, etc. This is probably a clue as to why I don't need: /etc/rc.d/d start ;) > It isn't SysV RC style. It is BSD style taken to its logical next > step. All the knobs for this are still in a central location, so you > don't have to make sure you get the hardlinks right. Correct me if I am wrong (as I am quite sure you will). The NetBSD style is shell code to start or stop daemons, sprinkled in lots of little files, which have to exist in at least one (if not several) directories. How is this all in a central location? You'll have to excuse my kneejerk here if I am clueless, more than a hundred times have I seen someone wondering why a service didn't start on linux/solaris/hpux and it turned out that someone put a regular file in a directory that was supposed to have links in it. Being burned by this repeatedly (especially when it's not my originating mistake) is not something I am wanting to see happen with FreeBSD. ------ Dave Hayes - Consultant - Altadena CA, USA - dave@jetcafe.org >>> The opinions expressed above are entirely my own <<< There's only one corner of the universe you can be certain of improving and that's your own self. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 12:14:44 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from superconductor.rush.net (superconductor.rush.net [208.9.155.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5D7137B401 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:14:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@superconductor.rush.net) Received: (from bright@localhost) by superconductor.rush.net (8.11.2/8.11.2) id f5CJEHm04842; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 15:14:17 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 15:14:17 -0400 From: Alfred Perlstein To: Anjali Kulkarni Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: User-Level upcalls Message-ID: <20010612151416.Q1832@superconductor.rush.net> References: <03e201c0f322$e52e2c60$0a64a8c0@indranetworks.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0us In-Reply-To: <03e201c0f322$e52e2c60$0a64a8c0@indranetworks.com>; from anjali@indranetworks.com on Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 03:04:34PM +0530 X-all-your-base: are belong to us. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG * Anjali Kulkarni [010612 05:54] wrote: > hi, > > Does any one know how to perform user-level upcalls from kernel > TCP/IP stack? If I wanted to get an upcall every time a data packet > arrived on a socket, how can it be done? Can I use signal handlers > for this? Please wrap lines at 70 characters. Yes, you can erquest that a signal (SIGIO) be sent to you each time an event occurs, take a look at fcntl(2) manpage. -- -Alfred Perlstein [alfred@freebsd.org] Instead of asking why a piece of software is using "1970s technology," start asking why software is ignoring 30 years of accumulated wisdom. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 12:18: 2 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (hokkshideh.jetcafe.org [205.147.43.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 534AA37B405 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:17:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dave@jetcafe.org) Received: from hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA01028; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:17:49 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200106121917.MAA01028@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with version: MH 6.8.4 #1[UCI] To: Sheldon Hearn Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Plan to import NetBSD rc system Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:17:49 -0700 From: Dave Hayes Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Sheldon Hearn writes: > I'm not too interested in hearing a lot of whining from people who > haven't given the NetBSD rc system a good look, because it's clear from > the last couple of threads that many people are more than willing to > post comments on something they haven't seen and such posts have > contributed nothing. Alternatively speaking, perhaps topics that advocate additions to the operating system with well known religious implications should be presented in a clearer fashion, with links pointed to the relevant documentation? ------ Dave Hayes - Consultant - Altadena CA, USA - dave@jetcafe.org >>> The opinions expressed above are entirely my own <<< Two men were fighting outside Nasrudin's window at dead of night. Nasrudin got up, wrapped his only blanket around himself, and ran outside. As he tried to reason with the drunks, one snatched his blanket and both ran away. "What were they arguing about?" asked his wife when he went in. "It must have been the blanket. When they got that, the fight broke up." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 12:21:42 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from axl.seasidesoftware.co.za (axl.seasidesoftware.co.za [196.31.7.201]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3902137B401 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:21:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sheldonh@starjuice.net) Received: from sheldonh (helo=axl.seasidesoftware.co.za) by axl.seasidesoftware.co.za with local-esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 159tj7-000GSr-00; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 21:21:21 +0200 From: Sheldon Hearn To: Dave Hayes Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Plan to import NetBSD rc system In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:17:49 MST." <200106121917.MAA01028@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 21:21:21 +0200 Message-ID: <63292.992373681@axl.seasidesoftware.co.za> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:17:49 MST, Dave Hayes wrote: > Alternatively speaking, perhaps topics that advocate additions to the > operating system with well known religious implications should be > presented in a clearer fashion, with links pointed to the relevant > documentation? Did you miss the part of my email that mentioned Luke's slides and notes? Did it not occur to you that they're not ready yet? Are you just sending mail for the sake of sending mail, or do you have something you'd like to contribute? Ciao, Sheldon. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 12:27:20 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from imo-r04.mx.aol.com (imo-r04.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6EAA437B40A for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:27:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DarkSun83@aol.com) Received: from DarkSun83@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v30.22.) id n.5f.1666c3cc (3939) for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 15:27:08 -0400 (EDT) From: DarkSun83@aol.com Message-ID: <5f.1666c3cc.2857c70c@aol.com> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 15:27:08 EDT Subject: Larry To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_5f.1666c3cc.2857c70c_boundary" X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 353 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --part1_5f.1666c3cc.2857c70c_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit High I read you articles on Free BSD and it got me intrested in trying it out and Id like to know if You have a copy of this operating system that you could send me I could download it on the net but Im stuck with a slow connection. If you can E- mail me about this Ill send you you my mailing address. p.s. Id be verry greatfull if u can THANK YOU! --part1_5f.1666c3cc.2857c70c_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit      High I read you articles on Free BSD and it got me intrested in trying
it out and Id like to know if You have a copy of this operating system that
you could send me I could download it on the net but Im stuck with a slow
connection. If you can E- mail me about this Ill send you you my mailing
address.


p.s. Id be verry greatfull if u can   THANK YOU! --part1_5f.1666c3cc.2857c70c_boundary-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 12:27:36 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sabre.velocet.net (sabre.velocet.net [198.96.118.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CED3E37B409 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:27:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dgilbert@office.tor.velocet.net) Received: from office.tor.velocet.net (trooper.velocet.net [204.138.45.2]) by sabre.velocet.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D82BA138074 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 15:27:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dgilbert@localhost) by office.tor.velocet.net (8.11.2/8.9.3) id f5CJROs74812; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 15:27:24 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from dgilbert) From: David Gilbert MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <15142.27932.205227.738099@trooper.velocet.net> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 15:27:24 -0400 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: NFS swap? X-Mailer: VM 6.92 under 20.4 "Emerald" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I used to include 'option option-128 "/path/to/swap"' in my dhcpd.conf file to get nfs swap mounted properly. I'm now using a 4.3 kernel and dhcpd 3.0rc4 from ISC. It won't allow me to put in option-128. Is there any other way to specify nfs based swap? Dave. -- ============================================================================ |David Gilbert, Velocet Communications. | Two things can only be | |Mail: dgilbert@velocet.net | equal if and only if they | |http://www.velocet.net/~dgilbert | are precisely opposite. | =========================================================GLO================ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 12:53:26 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (hokkshideh.jetcafe.org [205.147.43.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52AEF37B40C for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:53:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dave@jetcafe.org) Received: from hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA01771; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:53:08 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200106121953.MAA01771@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with version: MH 6.8.4 #1[UCI] To: Sheldon Hearn Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Plan to import NetBSD rc system Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:53:08 -0700 From: Dave Hayes Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Sheldon Hearn writes: > On Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:17:49 MST, Dave Hayes wrote: >> Alternatively speaking, perhaps topics that advocate additions to the >> operating system with well known religious implications should be >> presented in a clearer fashion, with links pointed to the relevant >> documentation? > Did you miss the part of my email that mentioned Luke's slides and > notes? Go read the start of the thread. None of that was mentioned at all. > Did it not occur to you that they're not ready yet? So you admit there's no real explanation of what this system is, or at least something that would stave off a religious debate? Cool. > Are you just sending mail for the sake of sending mail, or do you > have something you'd like to contribute? I am hopefully contributing to your willingness to communicate accurately and precisely, with the intent of preventing a topic from digressing into a religious debate. If not, your loss. ------ Dave Hayes - Consultant - Altadena CA, USA - dave@jetcafe.org >>> The opinions expressed above are entirely my own <<< Due to circumstances beyond your control, you are master of your fate and captain of your soul. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 13:42:35 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ambrisko.com (adsl-64-174-51-42.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [64.174.51.42]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A85DE37B409 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:42:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ambrisko@ambrisko.com) Received: (from ambrisko@localhost) by ambrisko.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5CKfKb49136; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:41:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ambrisko) From: Doug Ambrisko Message-Id: <200106122041.f5CKfKb49136@ambrisko.com> Subject: Re: NFS swap? In-Reply-To: <15142.27932.205227.738099@trooper.velocet.net> "from David Gilbert at Jun 12, 2001 03:27:24 pm" To: David Gilbert Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:41:20 -0700 (PDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL82 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG David Gilbert writes: | I used to include 'option option-128 "/path/to/swap"' in my dhcpd.conf | file to get nfs swap mounted properly. I'm now using a 4.3 kernel and | dhcpd 3.0rc4 from ISC. It won't allow me to put in option-128. Is | there any other way to specify nfs based swap? Try this first define the option near the top: option swap-path code 128 = string; then use it as: option swap-path "/path/to/swap"; It's actually kind of nice to bad it doesn't totally work for dhclient when you want to request and option that is not standard. Doug A. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 14:11:49 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mcp.csh.rit.edu (mcp.csh.rit.edu [129.21.60.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A2B5137B401 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 14:11:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jon@csh.rit.edu) Received: from fury.csh.rit.edu (fury.csh.rit.edu [129.21.60.5]) by mcp.csh.rit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD73B1304; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 17:11:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: by fury.csh.rit.edu (Postfix, from userid 37404) id AEF8D2E3EC; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 17:11:37 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 17:11:37 -0400 From: Jon Parise To: Dave Hayes Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010612171137.H16850@csh.rit.edu> Mail-Followup-To: Dave Hayes , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <200106121911.MAA00887@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.12i In-Reply-To: <200106121911.MAA00887@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org>; from dave@jetcafe.org on Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 12:11:24PM -0700 X-Operating-System: SunOS 5.8 (sun4u) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 12:11:24PM -0700, Dave Hayes wrote: > > It isn't SysV RC style. It is BSD style taken to its logical next > > step. All the knobs for this are still in a central location, so you > > don't have to make sure you get the hardlinks right. > > Correct me if I am wrong (as I am quite sure you will). The NetBSD > style is shell code to start or stop daemons, sprinkled in lots of > little files, which have to exist in at least one (if not several) > directories. > > How is this all in a central location? The scripts only exist in one location: /etc/rc.d There are no links involved with this system (unless of course you feel like putting them there yourself, but that's a separate matter). -- Jon Parise (jon@csh.rit.edu) . Rochester Inst. of Technology http://www.csh.rit.edu/~jon/ : Computer Science House Member To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 14:27:42 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from guru.mired.org (okc-65-26-235-186.mmcable.com [65.26.235.186]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 6801737B403 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 14:27:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mwm@mired.org) Received: (qmail 36524 invoked by uid 100); 12 Jun 2001 21:27:35 -0000 From: Mike Meyer MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <15142.35143.555612.997592@guru.mired.org> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 16:27:35 -0500 To: Dave Hayes Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: <200106121911.MAA00887@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> References: <200106121911.MAA00887@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> X-Mailer: VM 6.90 under 21.1 (patch 14) "Cuyahoga Valley" XEmacs Lucid X-face: "5Mnwy%?j>IIV\)A=):rjWL~NB2aH[}Yq8Z=u~vJ`"(,&SiLvbbz2W`;h9L,Yg`+vb1>RG% *h+%X^n0EZd>TM8_IB;a8F?(Fb"lw'IgCoyM.[Lg#r\ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Dave Hayes types: > Warner Losh writes: > > It isn't SysV RC style. It is BSD style taken to its logical next > > step. All the knobs for this are still in a central location, so you > > don't have to make sure you get the hardlinks right. > Correct me if I am wrong (as I am quite sure you will). The NetBSD > style is shell code to start or stop daemons, sprinkled in lots of > little files, which have to exist in at least one (if not several) > directories. > > How is this all in a central location? The *knobs* are all in a central location - /etc/rc.conf. There shouldn't be any problem importing the NetBSD rc system so that the current rc.conf can be used. It's not clear that's the way you want to do things, as the NetBSD rc system may make more rational options available in some cases. > You'll have to excuse my kneejerk here if I am clueless, more than a > hundred times have I seen someone wondering why a service didn't start > on linux/solaris/hpux and it turned out that someone put a regular > file in a directory that was supposed to have links in it. The only thing that the NetBSD system has in common with the SysV one those system use is the ability to start/stop a daemon via a script, ala our current $(LOCALBASE)/etc/rc.d. You asked for a URL to get information about the system. Try . Install -current, and have a look at it. Not only is it easier to use than the monolithic scripts that date from v7, it's more modular, will be easier to maintain, and easier to add local extensions to. Last time this thread came up, I volunteered to do with, then someone with the commit bit said *they* would do it. I'm still willing to do this, or help anyone else who's working on it. http://www.mired.org/home/mwm/ Independent WWW/Perforce/FreeBSD/Unix consultant, email for more information. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 14:39:56 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mcp.csh.rit.edu (mcp.csh.rit.edu [129.21.60.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C2B637B418 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 14:39:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jon@csh.rit.edu) Received: from fury.csh.rit.edu (fury.csh.rit.edu [129.21.60.5]) by mcp.csh.rit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB0C0114A; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 17:39:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: by fury.csh.rit.edu (Postfix, from userid 37404) id 21E482E3EC; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 17:39:47 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 17:39:47 -0400 From: Jon Parise To: Mike Meyer Cc: Dave Hayes , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010612173947.J16850@csh.rit.edu> Mail-Followup-To: Mike Meyer , Dave Hayes , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <200106121911.MAA00887@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> <15142.35143.555612.997592@guru.mired.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.12i In-Reply-To: <15142.35143.555612.997592@guru.mired.org>; from mwm@mired.org on Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 04:27:35PM -0500 X-Operating-System: SunOS 5.8 (sun4u) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 04:27:35PM -0500, Mike Meyer wrote: > The only thing that the NetBSD system has in common with the SysV one > those system use is the ability to start/stop a daemon via a script, > ala our current $(LOCALBASE)/etc/rc.d. > > You asked for a URL to get information about the system. Try http://www.netbsd.org/ >. Install -current, and have a look at it. Not > only is it easier to use than the monolithic scripts that date from > v7, it's more modular, will be easier to maintain, and easier to add > local extensions to. And for a more direct web-based reference: http://cvsweb.netbsd.org/bsdweb.cgi/basesrc/etc/rc.d/ -- Jon Parise (jon@csh.rit.edu) . Rochester Inst. of Technology http://www.csh.rit.edu/~jon/ : Computer Science House Member To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 14:57:16 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (hokkshideh.jetcafe.org [205.147.43.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA73337B403 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 14:57:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dave@jetcafe.org) Received: from hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA04259; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 14:57:11 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200106122157.OAA04259@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with version: MH 6.8.4 #1[UCI] To: Jon Parise Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 14:57:11 -0700 From: Dave Hayes Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jon Parise writes: > And for a more direct web-based reference: > http://cvsweb.netbsd.org/bsdweb.cgi/basesrc/etc/rc.d/ Thank you, this is far more useful than downloading -current. What would be even better than this is some overview document which explains the interactions between rc scripts. For those who feel this is still too obscure, have a look at: http://cvsweb.netbsd.org/bsdweb.cgi/basesrc/etc/rc.subr and pay attention to the run_rc_* subroutines. It's not much, but it's a start. ------ Dave Hayes - Consultant - Altadena CA, USA - dave@jetcafe.org >>> The opinions expressed above are entirely my own <<< Do not look at my outward shape, but take what is in my hand. -Rumi To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 15: 4:14 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (hokkshideh.jetcafe.org [205.147.43.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3A5637B401 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 15:04:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dave@jetcafe.org) Received: from hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA04457 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 15:04:10 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200106122204.PAA04457@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with version: MH 6.8.4 #1[UCI] To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: The real answer to Re: Why does fsck try to fsck a CDROM? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 15:04:10 -0700 From: Dave Hayes Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Well I found the problem. It's related to this routine I found in /usr/src/lib/libc/gen/fstab.c: static void fixfsfile() { static char buf[sizeof(_PATH_DEV) + MNAMELEN]; struct stat sb; struct statfs sf; if (strcmp(_fs_fstab.fs_file, "/") != 0) return; if (statfs("/", &sf) != 0) return; if (sf.f_mntfromname[0] == '/') buf[0] = '\0'; else strcpy(buf, _PATH_DEV); strcat(buf, sf.f_mntfromname); if (stat(buf, &sb) != 0 || (!S_ISBLK(sb.st_mode) && !S_ISCHR(sb.st_mode))) return; _fs_fstab.fs_spec = buf; } This apparently tries to make sure that whatever is mounted on "/" loads the actual device it is mounted on in the fs_spec section of the struct. The bottom line to all this is that if there is any line in an /etc/fstab that mounts on "/", fsck will use the device actually mounted as root, and not the one in the file. Back to the drawing board. ------ Dave Hayes - Consultant - Altadena CA, USA - dave@jetcafe.org >>> The opinions expressed above are entirely my own <<< Nasrudin was driving a friend in his car at a spanking pace. Suddenly, glimpsing a signpost, the friend called out "Mulla, we're going in the wrong direction!" "Why don't you ever think of something good?" came the reply. "Just look, for instance, at the speed we are going at." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 15:28:42 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dayspring.firedrake.org (dayspring.firedrake.org [195.82.105.251]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 76D4337B401 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 15:28:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from float@firedrake.org) Received: from float by dayspring.firedrake.org with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 159we6-00063d-00; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 23:28:22 +0100 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 23:28:21 +0100 To: Dave Hayes Cc: Sheldon Hearn , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Plan to import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010612232821.A22251@firedrake.org> References: <200106121953.MAA01771@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200106121953.MAA01771@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org>; from dave@jetcafe.org on Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 12:53:08PM -0700 From: void Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 12:53:08PM -0700, Dave Hayes wrote: > > So you admit there's no real explanation of what this system is, or at > least something that would stave off a religious debate? Cool. The NetBSD man pages are not hard to find. This one looks particularly relevant: http://www.tac.eu.org/cgi-bin/man-cgi?rcorder+8 > I am hopefully contributing to your willingness to communicate > accurately and precisely, with the intent of preventing a topic from > digressing into a religious debate. Why not blame the people who appear to be unable to think before posting? It's not like they read documentation anyway. -- Ben "An art scene of delight I created this to be ..." -- Sun Ra To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 16:28:42 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailout4-0.nyroc.rr.com (mailout4-1.nyroc.rr.com [24.92.226.166]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB45737B401 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 16:28:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from James_Bond_79@yahoo.com) Received: from Halstead007 (roc-24-169-196-57.rochester.rr.com [24.169.196.57]) by mailout4-0.nyroc.rr.com (8.11.2/RoadRunner 1.03) with SMTP id f5CNRD811842 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 19:27:13 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: James To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 19:35:27 -0400 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] References: <200106122157.OAA04259@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> In-Reply-To: <200106122157.OAA04259@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <01061219352700.00417@Halstead007> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I have one comment for whoever brings this in: One thing I have always liked about our system is that the rc.conf file is completely out of the source tree and under the users control. It looked to me like the netbsd system has /etc/rc.conf file source the /etc/defaults/rc.conf, and thus is part of source tree. I just don't want to have to deal with mergemaster asking me to install the new version of rc.conf for whatever reason. and just out of curiosity, I didn't think our mergemaster program had a way of handling the removal of files from the live /etc, I assume that for a upgrade of the rc system this would be necessary... just my $.0.02 James To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 16:38: 9 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C1CA37B407; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 16:38:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@ofug.org) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA19369; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 01:37:58 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des@ofug.org) X-URL: http://www.ofug.org/~des/ X-Disclaimer: The views expressed in this message do not necessarily coincide with those of any organisation or company with which I am or have been affiliated. To: Kevin Way Cc: chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: <20010611205158.J23562@bohr.physics.purdue.edu> <200106120305.f5C35Ri37415@earth.backplane.com> <20010611233420.I26841@csh.rit.edu> <20010611212528U.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> <20010612115326.A83911@bean.overtone.org> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 13 Jun 2001 01:37:57 +0200 In-Reply-To: <20010612115326.A83911@bean.overtone.org> Message-ID: Lines: 10 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) Emacs/20.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Kevin Way writes: > I just ordered a spare machine a few days ago. I'll install > -CURRENT on it, and start the integration. I've been > needing something to keep myself out of trouble. That's our new slogan: "FreeBSD - keeping kids off the street" DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@ofug.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 16:42:35 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com (sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com [209.247.77.155]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B2C937B401 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 16:42:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gordont@bluemtn.net) Received: from localhost (gordont@localhost) by sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com (8.11.3/8.11.2/BMA1.1) with ESMTP id f5CNcub83547; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 16:38:56 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 16:38:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Gordon Tetlow X-X-Sender: To: Kevin Way Cc: Jordan Hubbard , Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: <20010612115326.A83911@bean.overtone.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 12 Jun 2001, Kevin Way wrote: > On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 09:25:28PM -0700, Jordan Hubbard wrote: > > Guys, guys. The NetBSD /etc/rc system is good. We should stop > > arguing about it and just focus on figuring out who's going to > > integrate it or the whole conversation concerns a moot point > > anyway.:) > > I'll do it, if nobody has any objections to that. > > I just ordered a spare machine a few days ago. I'll install > -CURRENT on it, and start the integration. I've been > needing something to keep myself out of trouble. I'd be interested in working on it as well. I love working in shell script (my best computer language =). I'll start hacking on it tonight and see what I come up with. -gordon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 17:29:57 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp6ve.mailsrvcs.net (smtp6vepub.gte.net [206.46.170.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C22D37B401 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 17:29:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from babkin@bellatlantic.net) Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-198-117-237.nnj.dialup.bellatlantic.net [151.198.117.237]) by smtp6ve.mailsrvcs.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id AAA31627884; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 00:27:43 GMT Message-ID: <3B26B37B.848C78EE@bellatlantic.net> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 20:27:39 -0400 From: Sergey Babkin X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 4.0-19990626-CURRENT i386) X-Accept-Language: en, ru MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Warner Losh Cc: void , Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: <20010612032831.A11986@firedrake.org> <3B25531D.501B0B05@bellatlantic.net> <20010611201243.B77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> <200106111827.f5BIR2V38517@harmony.village.org> <3B25531D.501B0B05@bellatlantic.net> <200106112356.f5BNujV42614@harmony.village.org> <200106120232.f5C2WLV43391@harmony.village.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Warner Losh wrote: > > In message <20010612032831.A11986@firedrake.org> void writes: > : On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 05:56:45PM -0600, Warner Losh wrote: > : > > : > With the netbsd approach, you remove the file, and all things taht > : > depend on it fail. as it should be :-) > : > : I'm pretty sure you turn it off in rc.conf, rather than removing it. > > Let me clarify. > > If I were to add a few extra "modules" to the system. A, B, and C. > If B needed A and C to start before it, then if I were to remove > module A, B wouldn't start because its prereqs aren't there. These > modules would be added, for example, in a package. That looks much better indeed. -SB To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 18:55:52 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from silby.com (cb34181-a.mdsn1.wi.home.com [24.14.173.39]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 70E0E37B403 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 18:55:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from silby@silby.com) Received: (qmail 18251 invoked by uid 1000); 13 Jun 2001 01:55:48 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 13 Jun 2001 01:55:48 -0000 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 20:55:48 -0500 (CDT) From: Mike Silbersack To: Robert Watson Cc: , Subject: Re: [PATCH] Limited BPF to the specified program In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20010612204504.S18144-100000@achilles.silby.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 12 Jun 2001, Robert Watson wrote: > One of the things I actually played with implementing in the past was in > effect an "ACL" of allowed BPF programs by-uid. When a BPF program was > bound to an interface, the bpfilter code would hash by uid, then do a > rather expensive walk down a list of "acceptable filters" and see if the > program matched. This meant that you could, for example, allow specific > users to monitor specific types of packets (such as a specific port). > Since there isn't really a canonical form other than the de facto form > libpcap generates bpf code in, there are some limits to this, but it > worked fairly well. I didn't attempt to deal with the "which interfaces > can they bind" issue, however. I can see if I can dig up the code, or > it's fairly easy to replicate if not. That'd be an excellent feature, perhaps it could be used to make dhclient / others non-root in the future. It's probably overkill for the issue at hand, though. I get the impression that the patch in question was meant to insure that a rooted box couldn't be used for sniffing (without a new kernel.) Of course, if you have the appropriate filter already sitting around, maybe you could wrap it in an #ifdef and put out the patch for testing. :) Mike "Silby" Silbersack To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 19: 3:17 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net (falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1AD0737B405 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 19:03:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kway@overtone.org) Received: from bean.overtone.org (2Cust94.tnt14.phl1.da.uu.net [63.46.183.222]) by falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net (EL-8_9_3_3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA02696; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 19:01:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: by bean.overtone.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 8815D326D; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 22:01:49 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 22:01:49 -0400 From: Kevin Way To: David Xu Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, mwm@mired.org, dougb@dougbarton.net, gordont@bluemtn.net, jkh@osd.bsdi.com Subject: import NetBSD rc system [summary] Message-ID: <20010612220149.A75828@bean.overtone.org> References: <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="r5Pyd7+fXNt84Ff3" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net>; from bsddiy@163.net on Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 03:49:30PM +0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --r5Pyd7+fXNt84Ff3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline > Is there any plan to import NetBSD rc system, > I am willing to see it appears in FreeBSD 5.0. Here's the status of this project at the moment as I see. Please let me know if I've misunderstood anything, or if anybody has had a change of heart. Both Gordon Tetlow and myself have volunteered to start the work seperately (which I'm assuming isn't entirely a bad thing). Doug Barton started work on this before, but got sidetracked by unrelated -CURRENT troubles. Any chance you have anything helpful for us, from your previous efforts, Doug? Mike Meyer has volunteered to assist, (and those of you who have CueCat's should check out his nifty little CueCat utility) and last but certainly not least, Jordan Hubbard just wants somebody to stop talking and code. :-) James_Bond_79@yahoo.com mentioned the first of the many adjustments to be made, this one regarding mergemaster. I've started a project homepage at http://overtone.org/rc.d/ as I get code together, and released, I'll keep it updated, unless it turns out that Gordon Tetlow is a machine, and integrates the whole thing before I can get NetBSD -current and FreeBSD -current installed. -Kevin Way --r5Pyd7+fXNt84Ff3 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (FreeBSD) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE7JsmMKxA01iDoLN4RAhwLAKCRzwAyJEueKvqYf9zvQnqVnRy1egCeMj/b 8xM/OZY3Emf2mgKMAB+g6rA= =1tJQ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --r5Pyd7+fXNt84Ff3-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 19: 9:59 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [204.156.12.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A88237B401 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 19:09:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (robert@fledge.pr.watson.org [192.0.2.3]) by fledge.watson.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f5D24xf84317; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 22:04:59 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 22:04:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Watson X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org To: Mike Silbersack Cc: gzjyliu@public.guangzhou.gd.cn, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: [PATCH] Limited BPF to the specified program In-Reply-To: <20010612204504.S18144-100000@achilles.silby.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 12 Jun 2001, Mike Silbersack wrote: > On Tue, 12 Jun 2001, Robert Watson wrote: > > > One of the things I actually played with implementing in the past was in > > effect an "ACL" of allowed BPF programs by-uid. When a BPF program was > > bound to an interface, the bpfilter code would hash by uid, then do a > > rather expensive walk down a list of "acceptable filters" and see if the > > program matched. This meant that you could, for example, allow specific > > users to monitor specific types of packets (such as a specific port). > > Since there isn't really a canonical form other than the de facto form > > libpcap generates bpf code in, there are some limits to this, but it > > worked fairly well. I didn't attempt to deal with the "which interfaces > > can they bind" issue, however. I can see if I can dig up the code, or > > it's fairly easy to replicate if not. > > That'd be an excellent feature, perhaps it could be used to make > dhclient / others non-root in the future. It's probably overkill for > the issue at hand, though. I get the impression that the patch in > question was meant to insure that a rooted box couldn't be used for > sniffing (without a new kernel.) Actually, it was so that I could allow non-root uid's to perform certain kinds of packet sniffing operations, but not others. It occurs to me, in retrospect, that I didn't need to perform a program comparison, all I really needed to do was determine that for every packet matched by a uid's bpf filter, it was also accepted by the ACL filter. This gets around the canonical representation issue by intersecting the two acceptance sets. Go figure. > Of course, if you have the appropriate filter already sitting around, > maybe you could wrap it in an #ifdef and put out the patch for testing. > :) This was against a fairly old tree (maybe 3.0-CURRENT?), but I'll see if I can dig it up this weekend. Robert N M Watson FreeBSD Core Team, TrustedBSD Project robert@fledge.watson.org NAI Labs, Safeport Network Services To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 19:18: 6 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nwcst315.netaddress.usa.net (nwcst315.netaddress.usa.net [204.68.23.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 6D25237B407 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 19:18:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nitinnahata@usa.net) Received: (qmail 3896 invoked by uid 60001); 13 Jun 2001 02:18:01 -0000 Message-ID: <20010613021801.3895.qmail@nwcst315.netaddress.usa.net> Received: from 204.68.23.60 by nwcst315 for [128.125.5.25] via web-mailer(34FM.0700.17C.01) on Wed Jun 13 02:18:01 GMT 2001 Date: 12 Jun 2001 19:18:01 PDT From: Nitin Nahata To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: NFS calls data flow X-Mailer: USANET web-mailer (34FM.0700.17C.01) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This might seem to be a stupid question but I really need help on this on= e: I need to follow how exactly data flows when an NFS request/reponse is ma= de. Any advice on how and where I should start will be really helpful. Thanks, Nitin Nahata = ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=3D= 1 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 19:33:18 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from superconductor.rush.net (superconductor.rush.net [208.9.155.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7F5437B418 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 19:33:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@superconductor.rush.net) Received: (from bright@localhost) by superconductor.rush.net (8.11.2/8.11.2) id f5D2X6713460; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 22:33:06 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 22:33:06 -0400 From: Alfred Perlstein To: Nitin Nahata Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NFS calls data flow Message-ID: <20010612223305.V1832@superconductor.rush.net> References: <20010613021801.3895.qmail@nwcst315.netaddress.usa.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0us In-Reply-To: <20010613021801.3895.qmail@nwcst315.netaddress.usa.net>; from nitinnahata@usa.net on Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 07:18:01PM -0700 X-all-your-base: are belong to us. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG * Nitin Nahata [010612 22:18] wrote: > This might seem to be a stupid question but I really need help on this one: > > I need to follow how exactly data flows when an NFS request/reponse is made. > Any advice on how and where I should start will be really helpful. There's a lot of info that one would have to type to answer such a vague question. Perhaps you can narrow the question down some? Do you mean.. how does NFS get the request? send the data out? get the filesystem data? ? -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 20:25:17 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nwcst292.netaddress.usa.net (nwcst292.netaddress.usa.net [204.68.23.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 78BBA37B40A for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 20:25:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nitinnahata@usa.net) Received: (qmail 5633 invoked by uid 60001); 13 Jun 2001 03:25:04 -0000 Message-ID: <20010613032504.5632.qmail@nwcst292.netaddress.usa.net> Received: from 204.68.23.37 by nwcst292 for [128.125.5.25] via web-mailer(34FM.0700.17C.01) on Wed Jun 13 03:25:04 GMT 2001 Date: 12 Jun 2001 20:25:04 PDT From: Nitin Nahata To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: NFS : nfsiod scheduling X-Mailer: USANET web-mailer (34FM.0700.17C.01) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Actually I want to know when a client is running a couple of nfsiod daemo= ns,is there a way of scheduling the requests sent by these = daemons ? -Nitin Nahata ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=3D= 1 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jun 12 21:30:55 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA08837B411 for ; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 21:30:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5D4UkP00541; Tue, 12 Jun 2001 21:30:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 21:30:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106130430.f5D4UkP00541@earth.backplane.com> To: Nitin Nahata Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NFS : nfsiod scheduling References: <20010613032504.5632.qmail@nwcst292.netaddress.usa.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Actually I want to know when a client is running a couple of nfsiod daemons,is :there a way of scheduling the requests sent by these :daemons ? : :-Nitin Nahata No, it's random. nfsiods handle mainly read-ahead requests to try to decouple the RPC latency from other processes. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 1:20:22 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.huji.ac.il (cs.huji.ac.il [132.65.16.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1E4837B40D for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 01:20:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from danny@cs.huji.ac.il) Received: from sexta.cs.huji.ac.il ([132.65.16.13] ident=exim) by cs.huji.ac.il with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15A5si-0000sS-00; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 11:20:04 +0300 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=sexta.cs.huji.ac.il ident=danny) by sexta.cs.huji.ac.il with esmtp (Exim 3.15 #1) id 15A5sh-000517-00; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 11:20:03 +0300 X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with nmh-0.24 To: Warner Losh Cc: Sheldon Hearn , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Plan to import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: Message from Warner Losh of "Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:42:26 MDT." <200106121642.f5CGgQV94837@harmony.village.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 11:20:03 +0300 From: Danny Braniss Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG few points to add/concider: I share the /usr/local among many machines, so /usr/local/etc/rc.d is becoming 'problematic', rc.conf should be involved in the decission to run xxx.sh start/stop on other platforms, i've modified rc to run rc.`hostname` if such file exists. this little trick saved the day many times - i would dump|restore the root partition onto another host, and reboot. having to manage many hosts, it's becoming important to centralize some of the configuration data (Nis/Hesiod based info). I configure amd that is heavely used here, via hesiod. having experienced rc since V6, i have seen some nice ideas and 01some 22horrible 99ones, FreeBSD's so far looks the best! true, i haven't seen NetBSD, and i will asap. my 5cents, danny To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 2:10: 7 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from salmon.maths.tcd.ie (salmon.maths.tcd.ie [134.226.81.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 4640637B401 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 02:09:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dwmalone@maths.tcd.ie) Received: from walton.maths.tcd.ie by salmon.maths.tcd.ie with SMTP id ; 13 Jun 2001 10:09:54 +0100 (BST) To: Matt Dillon Cc: Cejka Rudolf , David Malone , Peter Wemm , Terry Lambert , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: signal(SIGCHLD, SIG_IGN) patch solving SUSv2 compatibility issue In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:38:24 PDT." <200106121638.f5CGcOo42940@earth.backplane.com> X-Request-Do: Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 10:09:48 +0100 From: David Malone Message-ID: <200106131009.aa95596@salmon.maths.tcd.ie> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I'll take a look at them tonight and (unless Dave wants to) I'll > commit an update to -current and hold off the -stable MFC another > few days. I recieved some mail from Garrett on the standards side of the thing, so I'll read and digest that. I should be able to look after the -current side of the patch, I'll just wait and see if anyone else has anything to add. David. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 2:16:55 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ringworld.nanolink.com (ringworld.nanolink.com [195.24.48.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 926F837B405 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 02:16:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roam@orbitel.bg) Received: (qmail 27088 invoked by uid 1000); 13 Jun 2001 09:15:25 -0000 Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 12:15:25 +0300 From: Peter Pentchev To: Danny Braniss Cc: Warner Losh , Sheldon Hearn , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Plan to import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010613121525.D22123@ringworld.oblivion.bg> Mail-Followup-To: Danny Braniss , Warner Losh , Sheldon Hearn , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from danny@cs.huji.ac.il on Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 11:20:03AM +0300 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 11:20:03AM +0300, Danny Braniss wrote: > few points to add/concider: > > I share the /usr/local among many machines, so /usr/local/etc/rc.d is becoming > 'problematic', rc.conf should be involved in the decission to run xxx.sh > start/stop > > on other platforms, i've modified rc to run rc.`hostname` if such file exists. > this little trick saved the day many times - i would dump|restore the root > partition onto another host, and reboot. > > having to manage many hosts, it's becoming important to centralize some of > the configuration data (Nis/Hesiod based info). I configure amd that is > heavely used here, via hesiod. > > having experienced rc since V6, i have seen some nice ideas and 01some > 22horrible > 99ones, FreeBSD's so far looks the best! true, i haven't seen NetBSD, and i > will > asap. I've asked -ports before whether it is suitable to let ports startup scripts honor /etc/rc.conf{,.local} settings by sourcing /etc/defaults/rc.conf and then running a source_rc_confs (or whatever is appropriate). This could be a solution to your problem - modify the ports' startup scripts to honor rc.conf options, then put appropriate enable/disable options in each machine's /etc/rc.conf or /etc/rc.conf.local. Attached is an example - a modification of the databases/mysql323-server port's startup script to honor a couple of mysqld_* variables from the RC script scheme. This approach has the disadvantage that the ports' startup scripts will have to be modified if the base system startup mechanism changes, or at least when the base system /etc/{defaults}/rc.conf{.local} parsing mechanism changes. G'luck, Peter -- Do you think anybody has ever had *precisely this thought* before? Index: ports/databases/mysql323-server/files/mysql-server.sh =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/ports/databases/mysql323-server/files/mysql-server.sh,v retrieving revision 1.2 diff -u -r1.2 mysql-server.sh --- ports/databases/mysql323-server/files/mysql-server.sh 2000/07/05 12:36:21 1.2 +++ ports/databases/mysql323-server/files/mysql-server.sh 2001/03/19 09:25:38 @@ -1,13 +1,39 @@ #!/bin/sh +. /etc/defaults/rc.conf +if type source_rc_confs | fgrep 'shell function' > /dev/null; then + source_rc_confs +else + rc_conf_files=${rc_conf_files-"/etc/rc.conf /etc/rc.conf.local"} + for i in ${rc_conf_files}; do + if [ -r "$i" ]; then + . $i + fi + done +fi + +# The following variables may be overridden in /etc/rc.conf or +# /etc/rc.conf.local + +# The base directory (prefix) for the MySQL installation +mysqld_prefix=${mysqld_prefix-"%%PREFIX%%"} +# The MySQL server executable +mysqld_program=${mysqld_program-"${mysqld_prefix}/bin/safe_mysqld"} +# The MySQL server process, passed to 'killall' to stop the server +mysqld_process=${mysqld_process-"mysqld"} +# The user that the MySQL server runs as +mysqld_user=${mysqld_user-"mysql"} +# Any additional flags for the MySQL server +mysqld_flags=${mysqld_flags-""} + case "$1" in start) - if [ -x %%PREFIX%%/bin/safe_mysqld ]; then - %%PREFIX%%/bin/safe_mysqld --user=mysql > /dev/null & && echo -n ' mysqld' + if [ -x "${mysqld_program}" ]; then + ${mysqld_program} --user=${mysqld_user} ${mysqld_flags} > /dev/null & && echo -n ' mysqld' fi ;; stop) - /usr/bin/killall mysqld > /dev/null 2>&1 && echo -n ' mysqld' + /usr/bin/killall "${mysqld_process}" > /dev/null 2>&1 && echo -n ' mysqld' ;; *) echo "" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 2:26:48 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.huji.ac.il (cs.huji.ac.il [132.65.16.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51AFF37B401 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 02:26:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from danny@cs.huji.ac.il) Received: from sexta.cs.huji.ac.il ([132.65.16.13] ident=exim) by cs.huji.ac.il with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15A6vA-0003CO-00; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 12:26:40 +0300 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=sexta.cs.huji.ac.il ident=danny) by sexta.cs.huji.ac.il with esmtp (Exim 3.15 #1) id 15A6v9-00054E-00; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 12:26:39 +0300 X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with nmh-0.24 To: Danny Braniss , Warner Losh , Sheldon Hearn , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Plan to import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: Message from Peter Pentchev of "Wed, 13 Jun 2001 12:15:25 +0300." <20010613121525.D22123@ringworld.oblivion.bg> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 12:26:39 +0300 From: Danny Braniss Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I've asked -ports before whether it is suitable to let ports startup scripts > honor /etc/rc.conf{,.local} settings by sourcing /etc/defaults/rc.conf and > then running a source_rc_confs (or whatever is appropriate). > > This could be a solution to your problem - modify the ports' startup scripts > to honor rc.conf options, then put appropriate enable/disable options > in each machine's /etc/rc.conf or /etc/rc.conf.local. > > Attached is an example - a modification of the databases/mysql323-server > port's startup script to honor a couple of mysqld_* variables from > the RC script scheme. > > This approach has the disadvantage that the ports' startup scripts will > have to be modified if the base system startup mechanism changes, or > at least when the base system /etc/{defaults}/rc.conf{.local} parsing > mechanism changes. > > G'luck, > Peter > > -- > Do you think anybody has ever had *precisely this thought* before? > heh, it's called don't re-invent the wheel :-) i actually was thinking more in fixing rc, when it goes through the rc.d/*.sh it should check some rc.conf variable before running the script. danny To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 4:11:10 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lille.debolaz.com (c224s39h16.upc.chello.no [213.46.204.224]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECC2437B407 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 04:11:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from debolaz@debolaz.com) Received: from lille. (unknown [213.46.204.224]) by lille.debolaz.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 12A1BE098; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 13:22:17 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 13:22:17 +0200 (CEST) From: Anders Nor Berle To: David Rufino Cc: Subject: Re: nvidia drivers In-Reply-To: <20010612164040.A2393@btinternet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This day is something I've been looking forward to, nvidia hardware acceleration for XFree86 4.x. The kernel module loads, but the nvidia_drv.o bails out complaining about failed to allocate dma fb.. I dont think that's your code causing it of course, but do you have any idea what might? > Hi, > > I've uploaded the nvidia driver code I've been working on to the CVS repository > at http://sourceforge.net/projects/nv-bsd, if anyone wants to take a look. > It is still work in progress, but has come a long way. In particular you > can see the dmesg output when X is started at: > > http://cvs.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/nv-bsd/nv-bsd/my.log?rev=1.1&content-type=text/vnd.viewcvs-markup > > Thanks, > David Rufino > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 5:46:58 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from critter.freebsd.dk (critter.freebsd.dk [212.242.86.163]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A2FD37B408; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 05:46:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) Received: from critter (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.freebsd.dk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5DCkfr46750; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 14:46:41 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) To: current@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: close a PR !! From: Poul-Henning Kamp Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 14:46:41 +0200 Message-ID: <46748.992436401@critter> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Guys, We've been doing pretty well on the PR/Gnats front since we started our little "Close a PR" drive, but now is not the time to loose steam. http://phk.freebsd.dk/Gnats/ We're at the same level of unclosed PR's as we were half a year ago, down 500 from when we began the drive, but still 2653 to go... So please, everybody (committers and non-committers alike!) take a peek at the PR list here and close a couple of stale PR's for us: http://www.FreeBSD.org/cgi/query-pr-summary.cgi Committers close PR's with "edit-pr" on freefall. Non-committers by submitting a followup which contains an explanation and the grep(1)'able line: This PR can be closed Remember: Each open PR is a pissed off contributor... -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 phk@FreeBSD.ORG | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 6:46: 0 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bilver.wjv.com (dhcp-1-20.n01.orldfl01.us.ra.verio.net [157.238.210.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E433937B408 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 06:45:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bill@bilver.wjv.com) Received: (from bill@localhost) by bilver.wjv.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) id f5DDjmM80377 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 09:45:48 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from bill) Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 09:45:46 -0400 From: Bill Vermillion To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD Message-ID: <20010613094546.F79593@wjv.com> Reply-To: bv@wjv.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i Organization: W.J.Vermillion / Orlando - Winter Park Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Patents don't always require licensing. Ever Unix system extant has a patented piece in it [or perhaps HAD is more appropriate] as the patents had expired. I saw the copy of it years ago and I looked for it recently but can't figure out where it is. The permissions - the old -rwx- etc we are so familiar with was patented, Ritchie or Thompson, and was patented and permitted to be used by anyone. This was so no one could monopolize it. Jordan pointed out the XOR routing for curosor hiding, and 15 years ago there was big hub-bub and a lot of net-posting on that fearing that someone might try to enforce that. It was a well-know useage but someone did patent it. This goes to the era of the suits on 'look and feel'. We just need to hide all the code from the lawyers. -- Bill Vermillion - bv @ wjv . com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 9:40:52 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.rpi.edu (mail.rpi.edu [128.113.22.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B649237B418 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 09:40:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from drosih@rpi.edu) Received: from [128.113.24.47] (gilead.acs.rpi.edu [128.113.24.47]) by mail.rpi.edu (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5DGde531494; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 12:39:40 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: drosih@mail.rpi.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20010612220149.A75828@bean.overtone.org> References: <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <20010612220149.A75828@bean.overtone.org> Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 12:39:36 -0400 To: Kevin Way , David Xu From: Garance A Drosihn Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system [summary] Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, mwm@mired.org, dougb@dougbarton.net, gordont@bluemtn.net, jkh@osd.bsdi.com, sheldonh@starjuice.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 10:01 PM -0400 6/12/01, Kevin Way wrote: >David Xu wrote: > > Is there any plan to import NetBSD rc system, > > I am willing to see it appears in FreeBSD 5.0. > >Here's the status of this project at the moment as I see. Please >let me know if I've misunderstood anything, or if anybody has had >a change of heart. > >Both Gordon Tetlow and myself have volunteered to start the work >seperately (which I'm assuming isn't entirely a bad thing). > >Doug Barton [...] > >Mike Meyer [...] > >James_Bond_79@yahoo.com mentioned [...] I see no reference to the thread "Plan to import NetBSD rc system" from Sheldon Hearn, where he said: Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 18:23:53 +0200 From: Sheldon Hearn Hi folks, Here's an update on the plan to import the NetBSD rc system into FreeBSD. I've contacted Luke Mewburn (the guy behind the new NetBSD rc system) and he's keen to chat to FreeBSD-heads after his talk at USENIX (FREENIX track). I can't make it, but I'd encourage interested parties from the FreeBSD community to chat to him. In fact, interested parties are encouraged to attend his talk. :-) After USENIX, the plan is that I'll get a hold of his slides and notes and will post a plan of action to freebsd-hackers, making sure that folks get a chance to see exactly how the new system is going to work. I believe that in some other thread Sheldon had made the point that we wanted to end up as close to Netbsd's implementation as possible, which is why he wanted to work directly with Luke. ("Use the source, Luke"...) If we do have some good extensions to the Netbsd-rc work, then it'd be best if those extensions ended up in both netbsd and freebsd implementations. I believe I've represented Sheldon correctly, except for the "Use the source, Luke" line, which was a lame joke that I added on my own. Note that I don't want anyone to stop any work they're doing on this project, I just wanted to be sure everyone is aware of what everyone else has said on the topic. -- Garance Alistair Drosehn = gad@eclipse.acs.rpi.edu Senior Systems Programmer or gad@freebsd.org Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute or drosih@rpi.edu To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 10:35:43 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from winston.osd.bsdi.com (adsl-64-173-15-98.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net [64.173.15.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43C5937B403 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 10:35:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) Received: from localhost (jkh@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by winston.osd.bsdi.com (8.11.4/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5DHZ9t34638; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 10:35:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) To: bv@wjv.com, bill@wjv.com Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <20010613094546.F79593@wjv.com> References: <20010613094546.F79593@wjv.com> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.94.1 on Emacs 20.7 / Mule 4.0 (HANANOEN) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20010613103509Z.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 10:35:09 -0700 From: Jordan Hubbard X-Dispatcher: imput version 20000228(IM140) Lines: 10 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG From: Bill Vermillion Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 09:45:46 -0400 > We just need to hide all the code from the lawyers. Why? They wouldn't understand it anyway. What we really need to do is stop HIRING them. :) - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 10:38:15 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from critter.freebsd.dk (critter.freebsd.dk [212.242.86.163]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DBE137B403 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 10:38:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) Received: from critter (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.freebsd.dk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5DHbbr49355; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 19:37:37 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) To: Jordan Hubbard Cc: bv@wjv.com, bill@wjv.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 13 Jun 2001 10:35:09 PDT." <20010613103509Z.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 19:37:37 +0200 Message-ID: <49353.992453857@critter> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <20010613103509Z.jkh@osd.bsdi.com>, Jordan Hubbard writes: >From: Bill Vermillion >Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD >Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 09:45:46 -0400 > >> We just need to hide all the code from the lawyers. > >Why? They wouldn't understand it anyway. What we really need to do >is stop HIRING them. :) You know, there is almost a fortune in that... -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 phk@FreeBSD.ORG | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 10:56:20 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from post.webmailer.de (natpost.webmailer.de [192.67.198.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 812A237B401 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 10:55:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from koester@x-itec.de) Received: from localhost (pD904950F.dip.t-dialin.net [217.4.149.15]) by post.webmailer.de (8.9.3/8.8.7) with SMTP id TAA19618 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 19:55:54 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 5441 invoked from network); 13 Jun 2001 19:55:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO computer.winclient.x-itec2.de) (192.168.0.1) by 192.168.0.99 with SMTP; 13 Jun 2001 19:55:29 -0000 Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 19:55:27 +0200 From: Boris X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.51) Personal Reply-To: Boris X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <5213963478.20010613195527@x-itec.de> To: Jordan Hubbard Cc: bv@wjv.com, bill@wjv.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re[2]: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <20010613103509Z.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> References: <20010613094546.F79593@wjv.com> <20010613103509Z.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello , Wednesday, June 13, 2001, 7:35:09 PM, you wrote: is there a real problem in the US because of patented algos in FreeBSD? I think its a very bad situation for the US people, a big company can patent a lot of routines to stop other projects like freebsd, or not? I hope to get some interesting answers about this topic. I am happy that in our country is not the problem at the moment. Patents are the death for all of us developers -((((((((( -- Boris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 10:56:31 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from germanium.xtalwind.net (germanium.xtalwind.net [205.160.242.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4893637B405 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 10:56:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jack@germanium.xtalwind.net) Received: from localhost (localhost.xtalwind.net [127.0.0.1]) by germanium.xtalwind.net (8.11.3/8.11.4) with ESMTP id f5DHuF795752; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 13:56:15 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 13:56:15 -0400 (EDT) From: jack To: Jordan Hubbard Cc: Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <20010613103509Z.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Message-ID: <20010613135440.J95631-100000@germanium.xtalwind.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Today Jordan Hubbard wrote: > From: Bill Vermillion > Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD > Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 09:45:46 -0400 > > > We just need to hide all the code from the lawyers. > > Why? They wouldn't understand it anyway. What we really need to do > is stop HIRING them. :) The only reason we have lawyers is to protect us from other lawyers. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Jack O'Neill Systems Administrator / Systems Analyst jack@germanium.xtalwind.net Crystal Wind Communications, Inc. Finger jack@germanium.xtalwind.net for my PGP key. PGP Key fingerprint = F6 C4 E6 D4 2F 15 A7 67 FD 09 E9 3C 5F CC EB CD enriched, vcard, HTML messages > /dev/null -------------------------------------------------------------------------- A Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer is to computing what a McDonalds Certified Food Specialist is to fine cuisine. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 11:46:26 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from odin.ac.hmc.edu (Odin.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.75]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DBFBC37B403 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 11:46:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brdavis@odin.ac.hmc.edu) Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by odin.ac.hmc.edu (8.11.0/8.11.0) id f5DIk8o17620 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 11:46:08 -0700 Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 11:46:08 -0700 From: Brooks Davis To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: PRs seek committer Message-ID: <20010613114608.A15445@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="IS0zKkzwUGydFO0o" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --IS0zKkzwUGydFO0o Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Here's a set of pretty easy PRs I recently updated. They just need a little review an someone to commit them. bin/21803: [PATCH] wicontrol's -a option mis-documented and not implemented Fixes a minor bug in wicontrol. The updated patch is again a 6/30 current. bin/25470: ancontrol doesn't output TX rate This one is pretty much a no brainer. kern/27826: [PATCH] correct minor bugs in an(4) ifconfig support This patch is pretty simple, but needs to be reviews and comitted before ifconfig support for wireless cards should be MFC'd. kern/25006: cannot ignore arp (ifconfig -arp doesn't work) I tested the patch and updated it slightly. A version without MIME corruption is at: http://www.one-eyed-alien.net/~brooks/FreeBSD/arp.diff A review by -net would be appropriate. -- Brooks --=20 Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. PGP fingerprint 655D 519C 26A7 82E7 2529 9BF0 5D8E 8BE9 F238 1AD4 --IS0zKkzwUGydFO0o Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE7J7TvXY6L6fI4GtQRAiQCAKDYRrEJco8PXDzfdXUXW1KGzp9fCwCglSK9 MeKPwoI3qTWTOxVRJJAO7ZE= =UBRk -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --IS0zKkzwUGydFO0o-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 13:23:27 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.numachi.com (numachi.numachi.com [198.175.254.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 92B1D37B405 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 13:23:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from reichert@natto.numachi.com) Received: (qmail 2027 invoked by uid 3001); 13 Jun 2001 20:23:15 -0000 Received: from natto.numachi.com (198.175.254.216) by numachi.numachi.com with SMTP; 13 Jun 2001 20:23:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 10553 invoked by uid 1001); 13 Jun 2001 20:23:15 -0000 Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 16:23:15 -0400 From: Brian Reichert To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: panic in ata_intr() in 4.3-RELEASE Message-ID: <20010613162315.O13634@numachi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG So - I'm having a bad day. :) I'm messing with cdda2wav ( from cdrecord-0.92 ) under FreeBSD 4.3-RELEASE. I have this very body of software working on my laptop, but on another PC that I just installed from CD last night, I consistently get a panic whenver I try to get an audio CD's TOC, or try to rip a track: Fatal trap 12: page fault while in kernel mode fault virtual address = 0x3a fault code = supervisor write, page not present instruction pointer = 0x8:0xc02a7b03 stack pointer = 0x10:0xc038af9c frame pointer = 0x10:0xc038b03c I have a crash dump here: I have an quickie 'gdb' session here: I can provide other info, if people have suggestions... -- Brian 'you Bastard' Reichert 37 Crystal Ave. #303 Daytime number: (603) 434-6842 Derry NH 03038-1713 USA Intel architecture: the left-hand path To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 14:31:49 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailsrv.otenet.gr (mailsrv.otenet.gr [195.170.0.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83A8737B409 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 14:31:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from keramida@ceid.upatras.gr) Received: from hades.hell.gr (patr530-b109.otenet.gr [195.167.121.237]) by mailsrv.otenet.gr (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5DLVUM25625 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 00:31:30 +0300 (EEST) Received: (from charon@localhost) by hades.hell.gr (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5DJvoW70807 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 22:57:50 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from keramida@ceid.upatras.gr) Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 22:57:49 +0300 From: Giorgos Keramidas To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: strangeness in web interface of send-pr Message-ID: <20010613225749.F69527@hades.hell.gr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i X-PGP-Fingerprint: 3A 75 52 EB F1 58 56 0D - C5 B8 21 B6 1B 5E 4A C2 X-URL: http://students.ceid.upatras.gr/~keramida/index.html Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I have a few hours to spare tonight, and I was using the query-pr-summary.cgi script to view the open PRs. The query URL was (wrapped to avoid terminal silliness): 1 http://www.FreeBSD.org/cgi/query-pr-summary.cgi?\ 2 category=&severity=critical&priority=&class=\ 3 &state=open&sort=category&text=&responsible=\ 4 &multitext=&originator= You can clearly see that (in line 3), I have chosen to view only PRs whose state is `open' AND (line 2) severity is `critical', in an effort to help closing first those PRs that are more important. Well, guess what, I am getting a summary of PRs in my Netscape window, which includes such PRs as i386/28002. The summary line for this PR looks like: o [2001/06/09] i386/28002 make world fails (ref. to ipf) Knowing that this issue has been hashed in the mailing lists, I opened the PR to see what state it is in, and what its trail is so far. When I open the PR in a new window, only then I see that it's state is not `open', but `closed'. Yet, somehow, it has managed to sneak through my query-pr filter, despite the `state=open' rule I use. Does this strike anyone else as a problem of the problem reporting tool? (Nice recursion i got myself in.) -giorgos To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 14:50:22 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.numachi.com (numachi.numachi.com [198.175.254.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id EF8DD37B409 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 14:50:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from reichert@natto.numachi.com) Received: (qmail 2977 invoked by uid 3001); 13 Jun 2001 21:50:10 -0000 Received: from natto.numachi.com (198.175.254.216) by numachi.numachi.com with SMTP; 13 Jun 2001 21:50:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 11333 invoked by uid 1001); 13 Jun 2001 21:50:10 -0000 Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 17:50:10 -0400 From: Brian Reichert To: hackers@freebsd.org Cc: multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: Re: panic in ata_intr() in 4.3-RELEASE Message-ID: <20010613175010.S13634@numachi.com> References: <20010613162315.O13634@numachi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010613162315.O13634@numachi.com>; from reichert@numachi.com on Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 04:23:15PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 04:23:15PM -0400, Brian Reichert wrote: > So - I'm having a bad day. :) > > I'm messing with cdda2wav ( from cdrecord-0.92 ) under FreeBSD > 4.3-RELEASE. > > I have this very body of software working on my laptop, but on > another PC that I just installed from CD last night, I consistently > get a panic whenver I try to get an audio CD's TOC, or try to rip > a track: Update! (and cc-ing -multimedia). Is seems that the first CD I tried (_Americana_ by the Offspring) is a multimedia CD. The CD can be read/played under 4.1-RELEASE (my desktop, where I sit.) When I try to mount this under 4.3-RELEASE, I get: bookpc# mount /dev/acd0c cd9660: /dev/acd0c: Invalid argument But I can mount this on my older desktop. (I need to try on my laptop; that'll be for later.) I _can_ use cdda2wav under 4.3-RELEASE, with apparent impunity, on a strictly audio CD. (Trying on a regualr CD-ROM does safely yield 'This disk has no audio tracks'.) > Fatal trap 12: page fault while in kernel mode > fault virtual address = 0x3a > fault code = supervisor write, page not present > instruction pointer = 0x8:0xc02a7b03 > stack pointer = 0x10:0xc038af9c > frame pointer = 0x10:0xc038b03c > > I have a crash dump here: > > > > I have an quickie 'gdb' session here: > > > > I can provide other info, if people have suggestions... -- Brian 'you Bastard' Reichert 37 Crystal Ave. #303 Daytime number: (603) 434-6842 Derry NH 03038-1713 USA Intel architecture: the left-hand path To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 16:23:55 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [204.156.12.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E99B37B401; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 16:23:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (robert@fledge.pr.watson.org [192.0.2.3]) by fledge.watson.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f5DNNBf10692; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 19:23:11 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 19:23:11 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Watson X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org Reply-To: hackers@FreeBSD.org To: hackers@FreeBSD.org, developers@FreeBSD.org Subject: FreeBSD Monthly Development Status Report, June 2001 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Monthly Development Status Report June 2001 - Introduction One of the benefits of the FreeBSD development model is a focus on centralized design and implementation, in which the operating system is maintained in a central repository, and discussed on centrally maintained lists. This allows for a high level of coordination between authors of various components of the system, and allows policies to be enforced over the entire system, covering issues ranging from architecture to style. However, as the FreeSBD developer community has grown, and the rate of both mailing list traffic and tree modifications has increased, making it difficult even for the most dedicated developer to remain on top of all the work going on in the tree. The FreeBSD Monthly Development Status Report attempts to address this problem by providing a vehicle that allows developers to make the broader community aware of their on-going work on FreeBSD, both in and out of the central source repository. This is the first issue, and as such is an experiment. For each project and sub-project, a one paragraph summary is included, indicating progress since the last summary (in this case, simply recent progress, as there have been no prior summaries). This status report may be reproduced in whole or in part, as long as the source is clearly identified and appropriate credit given. - Future Editions Assuming there is some positive feedback on this idea, and that future submissions get made such that there is content for future issues, the goal is to release a development status report once a month. As such, the next deadline will be July 31, 2001, with a scheduled publication date in the first week of August. This will put the status report on a schedule in line with the calendar, as well as providing a little over a month until the next deadline, which will include a number of pertinent events, including the Annual USENIX Technical Conference in Boston, MA. Submissions should be e-mailed to: robert+freebsd.monthly@cyrus.watson.org Many submitters will want to wait until the last week of July so as to provide the most up-to-date status report; however, submissions will be accepted at any time prior to that date. - Projects The following projects submitted summaries for the June 2001 report: Binary Updater Project "Close a PR drive" CVSROOT script rewrite/tidy DEVFS digi driver Diskcheckd if_fxp driver Java Project Kernel Graphics Interface port libh Mount(2) API OLDCARD pccard implemenation PowerPC port pseudofs PPP RELNOTESng SMPng Project SMPng mbuf allocator Sparc64 Port TrustedBSD ACLs TrustedBSD Capabilities TrustedBSD MAC and Object Labeling - Status Reports Binary Updater Project Contacts: Eric Melville , Murray Stokely URL: http://people.freebsd.org/~murray/updater.html The FreeBSD Binary Updater Project aims to provide a secure mechanism for the distribution of binary updates for FreeBSD. This project is complementary to the Open Packages and libh efforts and there should be very little overlap with those projects. The system uses a client / server mechanism that allows clients to install any known "profile" or release of FreeBSD over the network. Where a specific profile might contain a specific set of FreeBSD software to install, additional packages, and configuration actions that make it more ideal for a specific environment (ie FreeBSD 4.3 Secure Web Server Profile) The system can currently be used to install a FreeBSD system or perform the most simple of upgrades but many features are absent. In particular, the client is in its infancy and much work remains to be done. We need additional developers so please get in touch with us at updater@osd.bsdi.com if you are interested in spending some cycles on this. -- "Close a PR drive" Contact: Poul-Henning Kamp URL: http://phk.freebsd.dk/Gnats/ Poul-Henning Kamp kicked off a drive to get our GNATS PR database cleaned up so the wheat can be sorted from the chaff. Progress is good, but there is still a lot of work to do. Give a hand if you can. Remember: every unhandled PR is a pissed off contributor or user. -- CVSROOT script rewrite/tidy Contact: Josef Karthauser I'm in the process of rewriting the CVSROOT/scripts to make them more clean and configurable. A lot of other projects also use these and so it makes sense to make them as easy to use in other environments as possible. Status: work in progress. There is now a configuration file, but not all the scripts use it yet. -- DEVFS Contact: Poul-Henning Kamp Work is progressing on implementing true cloning devices in DEVFS. Brian Somers and Poul-Henning Kamp are working to make if_tun the first truly cloning driver in the system. Next will be the pty driver and the bpf driver. From july 1st DEVFS will be standard in -current. -- digi driver Contact: Brian Somers Added the digi driver. Initial work was done by John Prince , but all the modular stuff was done by me and initial work on supporting Xe and Xi cards (ala dgb) was done by me. I'm now awaiting an Xe card being sent from joerg@ (almost a donation) so that I can get that side of things working properly. -- Diskcheckd Contact: Poul-Henning Kamp URL: http://phantom.cris.net/freebsd/projects/viewproj.php?p_id=15 Ben Smithurst has written a "diskcheckd" daemon which will read all sectors on the disks over a configured period. With recent increases in disksizes it is by no means a given that disk read errors will be discovered before they are fatal. This daemon will hopefully result in the drive firmware being able to relocate bad sectors before they become unreadable. This code is now committed to 5.0-CURRENT. -- if_fxp driver Contact: Jonathan Lemon In the last month (May-June), the new fxp driver was brought into -stable. This new driver uses the common MII code, so support for new PHYs is easy to add. Support for the new Intel 82562 chips was added. The driver was updated to add VLAN support and a workaround for a bug affecting Intel 815-based boards. -- Java Project Contact: Greg Lewis The FreeBSD Java Project has continued its "behind the scenes" work over the last month. Progress was made both technically, with the help of Bill Huey (of Wind River), on a port of JDK 1.3.1 and legally, with Nate Williams continuing negotiations with Sun on a mutually acceptable license to release a binary Java 2 SDK under. The JDK 1.2.2 port has also seen some development, with a new patchset likely to be released soon which includes JPDA and NetBSD support (the latter courtesy of Scott Bartram). -- Kernel Graphics Interface port Contact: Nicolas Souchu URL: http://kgi.sourceforge.net/ The Kernel Graphics Interface project has worked for several years to provide a framework for graphic drivers under Linux receiving input from other groups like the UDI project. Currently the KGI core implementation is quite settled, as is the driver coding model as a whole. Work is being done to newbussify KGI and produce a kld, as part of a future redesign of the graphics subsystem in FreeBSD. KGI will be an alternative for graphic card producers that don't accept the XFree86 model of userland graphic adapters and will also provide accelerated support for any other graphic alternative. -- libh Project Contacts: Alexander Langer , Nathan Ahlstrom URL: http://people.freebsd.org/~alex/libh/ The libh project is a next generation sysinstall. It is written in C++ using QT for its graphical frontend and tvision for its console support. The menus are scriptable via an embedded tcl interpreter. It has been growing functionality quite a bit lately, including a new disklabel editor. Current work is on installation scripts for CDROM, FTP, ... installs as well as a fully functional standalone disk-partition and label editor. The GUI API was extended a little and many bugs were fixed. There seems to be some interest in i18n work. -- Mount(2) API Contact: Poul-Henning Kamp Maxime Henrion is working on implementing a new and more extensible mount(2) systemcall, mainly to overcome the 32 bits for mountoptions limit, secondary goal to make it possible to mount filesystems from inside the kernel. -- OLDCARD pccard implementation Contact: Warner Losh In the last two months, the OLDCARD pccard implemenation was rototilled to within an inch of its life. Many new pci cardbus bridges were added. Power handling was improved. PCI Card cardbus bridges are nearly supported and should be committed in early June to the tree. This will likely be the last major work done on OLDCARD. After pci cards are supported, work will shift to improving NEWCARD. -- PowerPC Port Contact: Benno Rice The PowerPC port is proceeding well. All seems to be working in pmap.c after a number of problems encountered where FreeBSD passes a vm_page_t to a NetBSD-derived function that expects a vm_offset_t. Then after debugging the atomic operations code, I'm now at the point where VM appears to be initialised and it's now hanging while in sys/kern/kern_malloc.c:kmeminit(). Progress continues. =) -- PPP Contact: Brian Somers Developing full MPPE support for Andre Opperman @ Monzoon in Switzerland. Work is now complete and will eventually be brought into -current, but no dates are yet known. -- pseudofs Contact: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Pseudofs is a framework for pseudo-filesystems, like procfs and linprocfs. The goal of pseudofs is twofold: - eliminate code duplication between (and within) procfs and linprocfs - isolate procfs and linprocfs from the complexities of the vfs system to simplify maintenance and further development. Pseudofs has reached the point where it is sufficiently functional and stable that linprocfs has been almost fully reimplemented on top of it; the only bit that's missing is the proc//mem file. The primary to-do item for pseudofs right now is to add support for writeable files (which are required for procfs, and are quite a bit less trivial to handle than read-only files). In addition, pseudofs needs either generic support for raw (non-sbuf'ed, possibly mmap'able) files, or failing that, special-case code to handle proc//mem. -- RELNOTESng Contact: Bruce A. May URL: http://people.freebsd.org/~bmah/relnotes/ RELNOTESng is the name I've given to the rewrite of the *.TXT files that typically accompany a FreeBSD release. The information from these files (which include, among other things, the release notes and the supported hardware list) have been reorganized and converted to SGML. This helps us produce the documentation in various formats, as well as facilitating the maintainence of documentation for multiple architectures. This work was recently committed to -CURRENT, and I intend to MFC it to 4-STABLE before 4.4-RELEASE. -- SMPng Project Contacts: John Baldwin , Jake Burkholder , SMP Mailing list URL: http://www.freebsd.org/~jasone/smp/ The SMPng project aims to provide multithreaded support for the FreeBSD kernel. Currently the kernel still runs almost exclusively under the Giant kernel lock. Recently, progress has been made in locking the process group and session structures as well as file descriptors by Seigo Tanimura-san. Alfred Perlstein has also added in a giant lock around the entire virtual memory (VM) subsystem which will eventually be split up into several smaller locks. The locking of the VM subsystem has proved tricky, and some of the current effort is focused on finding and fixing a few remaining bugs in on the alpha architecture. -- SMPng mbuf allocator Contact: Bosko Milekic URL: http://people.freebsd.org/~bmilekic/code/mb_slab/ mb_alloc is a new specialized allocator for mbufs and mbuf clusters. Presently, it offers various important advantages over the old (status quo) mbuf allocator, particularily for MP machines. Additionally, it is designed with the possibility of future enchancements in mind. Presently in initial review & testing stages, most of the code is already written. -- Sparc64 Port Contact: Jake Burkholder Work has (re)started on a port of FreeBSD to the UltraSPARC architecture, specifically targeting PCI based workstations. Jake Burkholder will be porting the kernel, and Ade Lovett has expressed an interest in working on userland. Recent work on the project includes: - built a gnu cross toolchain targeting sparc64 - obtained remote access to an ultra 5 development machine (thanks to emmy) - developed a minimal set of headers and source files to allow the kernel to be compiled and linked - implemented a mini-loader which relocates the kernel, maps it into the tlbs and calls it - nabbed Benno Rice's openfirmware console driver which allows printf and panic to work At this point the kernel can be net-booted and prints the FreeBSD copyright before calling code that is not yet implemented. I am currently working on a design for the pmap module and plan to begin implementation in the next few days. -- TrustedBSD Contact: Robert Watson URL: http://www.TrustedBSD.org/ The TrustedBSD Project seeks to improve the security of the FreeBSD operating system by adding new security features, many derived from common trusted operating system requirements. This includes Access Control Lists (ACLs), Fine-grained Event Logging (Audit), Fine-grained Privileges (Capabilities), Mandatory Access Control (MAC), and other architecture features, including file system extended attributes, and improved object labeling. Individual feature status reports are documented seperately below; in general, basic features (such as EAs, ACLs, and kernel support for Capabilities) will be initially available in 5.0-RELEASE, conditional on specific kernel options. A performance-enhanced version of EAs is currently being targetted at 6.0-RELEASE, along with an integrated capability-aware userland, and MAC support. -- TrustedBSD: ACLs Contact: Chris D. Faulhaber Patches are now available to add ACL support to cp(1) and mv(1) along with preliminary support for install(1). Ilmar's i18n patches for getfacl(1) and setfacl(1) need to be updated for the last set of changes and committed. Some other functional improvements are also in the pipeline. -- TrustedBSD Capabilities Contact: Thomas Moestl The kernel part of the capability implementation is mostly finished; all uses of suser() and suser_xxx() and nearly all comparisons of uid's with 0 have been converted to use the newly introduced cap_check() call. Some details still need clarification. More documentation for this needs to be done. POSIX.2c-compatible getfcap and setfcap programs have been written. Experimental capability support in su(1), login(1), install(1) and bsd.prog.mk is being tested. Support for capabilities, ACL's, capabilities and MAC labels in tar(1) is being developed; only the capability part is tested right now. Generic support for extended attributes is planned, this will require extensions to the current EA interface, which are written and will probably be committed to -CURRENT in a few weeks. A port of these features to pax(1) is planned. -- TrustedBSD MAC and Object Labeling Contact: Robert Watson URL: http://www.TrustedBSD.org/ An initial prototype of a Mandatory Access Control implementation was completed earlier this year, supporting Multi-Level Security, Bibe Integrity protection, and a more general jail-based access control model. Based on that implementation, I'm now in the process of improving the FreeBSD security abstractions to simplify both the implementation and integration of MAC support, as well as increase the number of kernel objects protected by both discretionary and mandatory protection schemes. Generic object labeling introduces a structure not dissimilar in properties to the kernel ucred structure, only it is intended to be associated with kernel objects, rather than kernel subjects, permitting the creation of generic security protection routines for objects. This would allow the easy extension of procfs and devfs to support ACLs and MAC, for example. A prototype is underway, with compiling and running code and simple protections now associated with sysctl's. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 17:35:50 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.noos.fr (lafontaine.noos.net [212.198.2.72]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F05337B401 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 17:35:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from clefevre@redirect.to) Received: (qmail 1900179 invoked by uid 0); 14 Jun 2001 00:35:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gits.dyndns.org) ([212.198.228.81]) (envelope-sender ) by 212.198.2.72 (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 14 Jun 2001 00:35:42 -0000 Received: (from root@localhost) by gits.dyndns.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5E0ZbF52515; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 02:35:38 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from clefevre@redirect.to) To: Jon Parise Cc: Matt Dillon , Will Andrews , Andrew Hesford , Warner Losh , Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> <20010611174717.A77956@laptop.6bone.nl> <1795096378.20010611154930@163.net> <3B2484EA.B1F04812@DougBarton.net> <200106111800.f5BI0il25446@billy-club.village.org> <200106111854.f5BIsX728995@earth.backplane.com> <200106111856.f5BIu8V39651@harmony.village.org> <20010611203749.D24399@core.usrlib.org> <20010611205158.J23562@bohr.physics.purdue.edu> <200106120305.f5C35Ri37415@earth.backplane.com> <20010611233420.I26841@csh.rit.edu> X-Face: V|+c;4!|B?E%BE^{E6);aI.[<97Zd*>^#%Y5Cxv;%Y[PT-LW3;A:fRrJ8+^k"e7@+30g0YD0*^^3jgyShN7o?a]C la*Zv'5NA,=963bM%J^o]C Reply-To: Cyrille Lefevre In-Reply-To: <20010611233420.I26841@csh.rit.edu> Mail-Copies-To: never From: Cyrille Lefevre Date: 14 Jun 2001 02:35:36 +0200 Message-ID: Lines: 76 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jon Parise writes: [snip] > With the proposed NetBSD-derived system, individual services are > isolated in their very own scripts, making starting / stopping > them very convenient (the only advantage I see to the SysV > layout). In addition, the integrity of dependency graph is also > maintained, while retaining extra flexibility. not always. the dependency graph works fine if you start/stop all services at once, but not individually such as : starting nfsd should required mountd but actually, it don't start it. let's try : (for testing purpose, all rc files have been modified to use relative references instead of absolute ones) $ cat rc.conf rc_configured=YES rc1=YES rc2=YES $ cat rc.d/rc1 # PROVIDE: rc1 # REQUIRE: rc2 _etc=${_etc:-${0%/*}/..} . $_etc/rc.subr name="rc1" rcvar="rc1" command="/bin/echo" command_args="rc1" required_vars="rc2" load_rc_config $name run_rc_command "$1" $ cat rc.d/rc2 # PROVIDE: rc2 _etc=${_etc:-${0%/*}/..} . $_etc/rc.subr name="rc2" rcvar="rc2" command="/bin/echo" command_args="rc2" required_vars="rc1" load_rc_config $name run_rc_command "$1" $ ./rc Thu Jun 14 02:33:23 CEST 2001 Starting rc2. rc2 Starting rc1. rc1 Thu Jun 14 02:33:24 CEST 2001 ok, rc1 depends on rc2, so rc2 is started before rc1. now, just start rc1 : $ rc.d/rc1 start Starting rc1. rc1 oops, rc2 isn't started. too bad. Cyrille. -- home: mailto:clefevre@redirect.to UNIX is user-friendly; it's just particular work: mailto:Cyrille.Lefevre@edf.fr about who it chooses to be friends with. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 18:10:40 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com (sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com [209.247.77.155]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C58D37B401 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 18:10:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gordont@bluemtn.net) Received: from localhost (gordont@localhost) by sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com (8.11.3/8.11.2/BMA1.1) with ESMTP id f5E14N538712; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 18:04:23 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 18:04:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Gordon Tetlow X-X-Sender: To: Cyrille Lefevre Cc: Jon Parise , Matt Dillon , Will Andrews , Andrew Hesford , Warner Losh , Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , , Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 14 Jun 2001, Cyrille Lefevre wrote: > not always. the dependency graph works fine if you start/stop all > services at once, but not individually such as : > > starting nfsd should required mountd but actually, it don't start it. [snip] Yup, I have an idea or two as to how to get around it, but I'm need to finish getting the framework up and running. I plan to extend a couple of things. Anyway, here's my status: rcorder ported (one line code change) /etc/rc ported /etc/rc.shutdown ported /etc/rc.subr ported I'm currently porting over the /etc/rc.d module scripts. I'm almost up to the network initialization (which is going to be ugly). It's not hard, just time consuming (lots of cut and paste). I hope to have something useful tomorrow, maybe the next day. Heck, I might even post it =) -gordon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 18:25:37 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from core.usrlib.org (CC2-861.charter-stl.com [24.217.115.99]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 47E4437B405 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 18:25:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ajh3@core.usrlib.org) Received: by core.usrlib.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 795EFA875; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 20:24:15 -0500 (CDT) Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 20:24:15 -0500 From: Andrew Hesford To: Gordon Tetlow Cc: Cyrille Lefevre , Jon Parise , Matt Dillon , Will Andrews , Warner Losh , Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010613202415.A3689@core.usrlib.org> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from gordont@bluemtn.net on Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 06:04:23PM -0700 X-Loop: Andrew Hesford Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 06:04:23PM -0700, Gordon Tetlow wrote: > On 14 Jun 2001, Cyrille Lefevre wrote: > > > not always. the dependency graph works fine if you start/stop all > > services at once, but not individually such as : > > > > starting nfsd should required mountd but actually, it don't start it. > [snip] > > Yup, I have an idea or two as to how to get around it, but I'm need to > finish getting the framework up and running. I plan to extend a couple of > things. > > Anyway, here's my status: > rcorder ported (one line code change) > /etc/rc ported > /etc/rc.shutdown ported > /etc/rc.subr ported > > I'm currently porting over the /etc/rc.d module scripts. I'm almost up to > the network initialization (which is going to be ugly). It's not hard, > just time consuming (lots of cut and paste). > > I hope to have something useful tomorrow, maybe the next day. Heck, I > might even post it =) > > -gordon What about a script whose sole purpose is to satisfy dependencies? Call it dep_check or something. Any script, e.g., nfsd.sh, that had dependencies to be met could make a call to dep_check. dep_check would scan the calling script (nfsd.sh) and make sure all dependencies were met. This could continue recursively until everything were satisfied. Of course, certain details need to be worked out (like how to tell dep_check what script is calling it). Alternatively, give up the handy feature of being able to start services from their own scripts, and have a wrapper script that starts the specified service and satisfies dependencies. This has the distinct advantage of not having to call dep_check in each dependent script. Furthermore, it allows us to start, say, nfsd.sh, knowing full well that mountd is running, without worrying about some dependency checker trying to start a new mountd. This is a relatively minor issue, and I am sure there are a million equally valid (or more so) solutions to the problem. This is why I leave it to those who are going to implement the system. :) -- Andrew Hesford ajh3@usrlib.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 19:40:47 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bazooka.unixfreak.org (bazooka.unixfreak.org [63.198.170.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF9AC37B407; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 19:40:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dima@unixfreak.org) Received: from hornet.unixfreak.org (hornet [63.198.170.140]) by bazooka.unixfreak.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B39F3E28; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 19:40:36 -0700 (PDT) To: rwatson@freebsd.org, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD Monthly Development Status Report, June 2001 In-Reply-To: ; from rwatson@FreeBSD.org on "Wed, 13 Jun 2001 19:23:11 -0400 (EDT)" Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 19:40:36 -0700 From: Dima Dorfman Message-Id: <20010614024036.2B39F3E28@bazooka.unixfreak.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Robert Watson writes: > - Future Editions > > Assuming there is some positive feedback on this idea, and that future > submissions get made such that there is content for future issues, the > goal is to release a development status report once a month. [...] If this ends up being the case (i.e., there's an issue approx. once a month), how about archiving them on the web site? We used to have a "newsletter", but it quickly grew stale. This sounds like something developers actually might be interested in (there's no glory in writing something if nobody knows about it ;-) ), so it has a much better chance of succeeding. I don't know if it's worth putting the first issue up not knowing if there will be more; anybody else have an opinion on this? Dima Dorfman dima@unixfreak.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 19:48: 2 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mta5.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta5.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 655C037B405; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 19:47:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chris@holly.calldei.com) Received: from holly.calldei.com ([208.191.149.190]) by mta5.rcsntx.swbell.net (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.2000.03.23.18.03.p10) with ESMTP id <0GEW00M7AFMS86@mta5.rcsntx.swbell.net>; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 21:44:53 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from chris@localhost) by holly.calldei.com (8.11.1/8.9.3) id f5E2lrZ09502; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 21:47:53 -0500 (CDT envelope-from chris) Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 21:47:52 -0500 From: Chris Costello Subject: Re: FreeBSD Monthly Development Status Report, June 2001 In-reply-to: <20010614024036.2B39F3E28@bazooka.unixfreak.org>; from dima@unixfreak.org on Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 07:40:36PM -0700 To: Dima Dorfman Cc: rwatson@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, doc@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: chris@calldei.com Message-id: <20010613214752.C5865@holly.calldei.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i References: <20010614024036.2B39F3E28@bazooka.unixfreak.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [Adding -doc because this applies to the doc project now] On Wednesday, June 13, 2001, Dima Dorfman wrote: > If this ends up being the case (i.e., there's an issue approx. once a > month), how about archiving them on the web site? We used to have a > "newsletter", but it quickly grew stale. This sounds like something > developers actually might be interested in (there's no glory in > writing something if nobody knows about it ;-) ), so it has a much > better chance of succeeding. > > I don't know if it's worth putting the first issue up not knowing if > there will be more; anybody else have an opinion on this? I'm thinking perhaps it should be made into part of the doc project. I'm in the middle of converting it into a DocBook article and will post a URL to it soon. -- +-------------------+------------------------------------+ | Chris Costello | Where the system is concerned, | | chris@calldei.com | you are not allowed to ask "Why?". | +-------------------+------------------------------------+ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 20: 8:28 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailout1.nyroc.rr.com (mailout1-1.nyroc.rr.com [24.92.226.146]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9605A37B40D; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 20:08:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from James_Bond_79@yahoo.com) Received: from Halstead007 (roc-24-169-196-57.rochester.rr.com [24.169.196.57]) by mailout1.nyroc.rr.com (8.11.2/RoadRunner 1.03) with SMTP id f5E36tf24159; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 23:06:56 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: James To: dougb@freebsd.org Subject: mergmaster bug Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 23:14:58 -0400 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <01061323145802.00417@Halstead007> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Just noticed a small bug in mergemaster: When using specifying the destdir with -D and in verbose mode, mergemaster will not properly display the list of files that are only in ${DESTDIR}/etc, because the diff has /etc hardcoded. See the diff below. While on the mergemaster topic, I have seen discussion in the past about using md5 to see if the live /etc files have been modified since installed the last time mergemaster was run, and just installing new versions if the local have not been modified. Has anything been done with this? James --- mergemaster.sh.orig Wed Jun 13 20:08:01 2001 +++ mergemaster.sh Wed Jun 13 21:09:54 2001 @@ -471,7 +471,7 @@ echo ' *** Press [Enter] or [Return] key to continue' read ANY_KEY unset ANY_KEY - diff -qr ${DESTDIR}/etc ${TEMPROOT}/etc | grep "^Only in /etc" | ${PAGER} + diff -qr ${DESTDIR}/etc ${TEMPROOT}/etc | grep "^Only in ${DESTDIR}/etc" | ${PAGER} echo '' echo ' *** Press [Enter] or [Return] key to continue' read ANY_KEY To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 20:15:50 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailout3.nyroc.rr.com (mailout3-0.nyroc.rr.com [24.92.226.118]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8C8337B403; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 20:15:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from James_Bond_79@yahoo.com) Received: from Halstead007 (roc-24-169-196-57.rochester.rr.com [24.169.196.57]) by mailout3.nyroc.rr.com (8.11.2/RoadRunner 1.03) with SMTP id f5E3EHh02170; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 23:14:17 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; charset="iso-8859-1"; boundary="------------Boundary-00=_EAHW7K4XG1OCLQK6MI1F" From: James To: dougb@freebsd.org Subject: Re: mergmaster bug Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 23:20:38 -0400 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <01061323145802.00417@Halstead007> In-Reply-To: <01061323145802.00417@Halstead007> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <01061323203803.00417@Halstead007> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --------------Boundary-00=_EAHW7K4XG1OCLQK6MI1F Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Sorry, line wrapped attached diff file as attachement this time. James --------------Boundary-00=_EAHW7K4XG1OCLQK6MI1F Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; name="mergmaster.sh.diff" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="mergmaster.sh.diff" LS0tIG1lcmdlbWFzdGVyLnNoLm9yaWcJV2VkIEp1biAxMyAyMDowODowMSAyMDAxCisrKyBtZXJn ZW1hc3Rlci5zaAlXZWQgSnVuIDEzIDIxOjA5OjU0IDIwMDEKQEAgLTQ3MSw3ICs0NzEsNyBAQAog ICAgIGVjaG8gJyAqKiogUHJlc3MgW0VudGVyXSBvciBbUmV0dXJuXSBrZXkgdG8gY29udGludWUn CiAgICAgcmVhZCBBTllfS0VZCiAgICAgdW5zZXQgQU5ZX0tFWQotICAgIGRpZmYgLXFyICR7REVT VERJUn0vZXRjICR7VEVNUFJPT1R9L2V0YyB8IGdyZXAgIl5Pbmx5IGluIC9ldGMiIHwgJHtQQUdF Un0KKyAgICBkaWZmIC1xciAke0RFU1RESVJ9L2V0YyAke1RFTVBST09UfS9ldGMgfCBncmVwICJe T25seSBpbiAke0RFU1RESVJ9L2V0YyIgfCAke1BBR0VSfQogICAgIGVjaG8gJycKICAgICBlY2hv ICcgKioqIFByZXNzIFtFbnRlcl0gb3IgW1JldHVybl0ga2V5IHRvIGNvbnRpbnVlJwogICAgIHJl YWQgQU5ZX0tFWQo= --------------Boundary-00=_EAHW7K4XG1OCLQK6MI1F-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 22: 6:51 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bazooka.unixfreak.org (bazooka.unixfreak.org [63.198.170.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFA6437B401 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 22:06:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dima@unixfreak.org) Received: from hornet.unixfreak.org (hornet [63.198.170.140]) by bazooka.unixfreak.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F009B3E0B; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 22:06:47 -0700 (PDT) To: Giorgos Keramidas Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: strangeness in web interface of send-pr In-Reply-To: <20010613225749.F69527@hades.hell.gr>; from keramida@ceid.upatras.gr on "Wed, 13 Jun 2001 22:57:49 +0300" Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 22:06:47 -0700 From: Dima Dorfman Message-Id: <20010614050648.F009B3E0B@bazooka.unixfreak.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Giorgos Keramidas writes: > I have a few hours to spare tonight, and I was using the > query-pr-summary.cgi script to view the open PRs. > > The query URL was (wrapped to avoid terminal silliness): > > 1 http://www.FreeBSD.org/cgi/query-pr-summary.cgi?\ > 2 category=&severity=critical&priority=&class=\ > 3 &state=open&sort=category&text=&responsible=\ > 4 &multitext=&originator= > > You can clearly see that (in line 3), I have chosen to view only PRs > whose state is `open' AND (line 2) severity is `critical', in an > effort to help closing first those PRs that are more important. > > Well, guess what, I am getting a summary of PRs in my Netscape window, > which includes such PRs as i386/28002. The summary line for this PR > looks like: > > o [2001/06/09] i386/28002 make world fails (ref. to ipf) > > Knowing that this issue has been hashed in the mailing lists, I opened > the PR to see what state it is in, and what its trail is so far. > > When I open the PR in a new window, only then I see that it's state is > not `open', but `closed'. Yet, somehow, it has managed to sneak > through my query-pr filter, despite the `state=open' rule I use. > > Does this strike anyone else as a problem of the problem reporting > tool? (Nice recursion i got myself in.) Is it possible that the PR was closed between the time when you requested the summary and the time when you requested full information on the PR? > > -giorgos > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 22:28:43 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailsrv.otenet.gr (mailsrv.otenet.gr [195.170.0.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3171737B403 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 22:28:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from keramida@ceid.upatras.gr) Received: from hades.hell.gr (patr530-b071.otenet.gr [195.167.121.199]) by mailsrv.otenet.gr (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5E5SYM25660; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 08:28:34 +0300 (EEST) Received: (from charon@localhost) by hades.hell.gr (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5E5SWB78603; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 08:28:32 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from keramida@ceid.upatras.gr) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 08:28:31 +0300 From: Giorgos Keramidas To: Dima Dorfman Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: strangeness in web interface of send-pr Message-ID: <20010614082831.A76945@hades.hell.gr> References: <20010613225749.F69527@hades.hell.gr> <20010614050648.F009B3E0B@bazooka.unixfreak.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010614050648.F009B3E0B@bazooka.unixfreak.org>; from dima@unixfreak.org on Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 10:06:47PM -0700 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 3A 75 52 EB F1 58 56 0D - C5 B8 21 B6 1B 5E 4A C2 X-URL: http://students.ceid.upatras.gr/~keramida/index.html Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 10:06:47PM -0700, Dima Dorfman wrote: > Is it possible that the PR was closed between the time when you > requested the summary and the time when you requested full information > on the PR? No, it was my silliness. While I was viewing the PR summary, pr=28002 changed state from open->closed. The specific pr page showed it as closed, and later ru@freebsd.org opened it again. Viewing the same PR again shows that I should have checked again with the database before posting the message I wrote in Monday. Nothing funny with query-pr*.cgi , just with my sleepy brain :/ -giorgos To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 22:39: 0 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp6.mindspring.com (smtp6.mindspring.com [207.69.200.110]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6DE437B405 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 22:38:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from mindspring.com (dialup-209.247.142.175.Dial1.SanJose1.Level3.net [209.247.142.175]) by smtp6.mindspring.com (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA25518; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 01:38:53 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3B284E0B.AB077DCB@mindspring.com> Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 22:39:23 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Reply-To: tlambert2@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Warner Losh Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Strange request: Reading RX-50 (aka DEC Rainbow 100) disks References: <200106100032.f5A0WtV34285@harmony.village.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Warner Losh wrote: > > I have the need to read a whole pile of DEC Rainbow 100 floppies. I > can do it on the DEC Rainbow, but that's a huge pita since it isn't > networked. I'd like to either connect a RX-50 drive to my machine, or > use a 1.2M 5.25" floppy drive that I can scrounge easily enough to do > the deed. > > 80 tracks, 10 spt, 1 side. 400k in size. I think it uses either > 250kb/s or 300kb/s for the data transfer rate (same as the 3.5" low > density drives, if my memory isn't going south). > > Has anybody done this before? Any pointers? I did this all the time on Xenix, using "dd" and the single sided device node. See fdcontrol. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 23: 4:38 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from johnson.mail.mindspring.net (johnson.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.177]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6350437B407 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 23:04:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from mindspring.com (dialup-209.247.142.175.Dial1.SanJose1.Level3.net [209.247.142.175]) by johnson.mail.mindspring.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA09333; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 02:04:19 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3B285400.69B9F60@mindspring.com> Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 23:04:48 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Reply-To: tlambert2@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Cejka Rudolf Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: [Patch?] signal(SIGCHLD, SIG_IGN) is against SUSv2 References: <20010610183637.A73238@dcse.fee.vutbr.cz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Cejka Rudolf wrote: > Ok, I repeat it once again - in the full: If I use > > sigemptyset(&sa.sa_mask); > sa.sa_flags = 0; > sa.sa_handler = SIG_IGN; > sigaction(SIGCHLD, &sa, NULL); > > zombies are still created in FreeBSD, which is against SUSv2. You are correct: --- SIG_IGN If the action for the SIGCHLD signal is set to SIG_IGN, child processes of the calling processes will not be transformed into zombie processes when they terminate. If the calling process subsequently waits for its children, and the process has no unwaited for children that were transformed into zombie processes, it will block until all of its children terminate, and wait(), wait3(), waitid() and waitpid() will fail and set errno to [ECHILD]. --- It seems signal() in SUS2 has the same issue: --- If the action for the SIGCHLD signal is set to SIG_IGN, child processes of the calling processes will not be transformed into zombie processes when they terminate. If the calling process subsequently waits for its children, and the process has no unwaited for children that were transformed into zombie processes, it will block until all of its children terminate, and wait(), wait3(), waitid() and waitpid() will fail and set errno to [ECHILD]. --- So it appears that SA_NOCLDWAIT is implied in the flags for both cases. Historical BSD behaviour was to zombie the process on ignore; I'm pretty sure that POSIX left the definition unspecified. According to my reading of my Go Solo 2 book, the SUS2 also leaves it indeterminate whether SA_NOCLDSTOP is implied as well, or if SA_NOCLDSTOP applies to both CONT and STOP of child processes, or just to stop. Very annoying. I think that we will need someone with a copy of POSIX to settle the issue. I'm pretty sure that, given a choice between POSIX and SUS2, POSIX will win any arguments. > > If you hack up signal() to do this, it should be done > > by noting the SIG_IGN and the fact you are using the > > historical compatability signal() wrapper to the POSIX > > interface, and just set the sa_flags bit to do the job. > > And why not to use the second way of the two in SUSv2 specification? > > It is not about (im)possibility. It is about FreeBSD's > conformance to SUSv2 specification (and maybe POSIX?). As I said, someone like Julian E., with a copy of the spec. in hand, will need to weigh in. I believe for POSIX, however, that sigaction() can work as you specify, but signal() can not, since it must retain its historical behaviour... we need a judgement to be sure, since it may have evolved since the last time I had access to a copy. In general, zombie processes in FreeBSD take up only 64 bytes of resource usage holder struct (see the code in exit with regard to rusage), so it's not that big a deal, even if it make "ps" output fairly ugly. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 23:10:53 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from johnson.mail.mindspring.net (johnson.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.177]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 096EF37B40C; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 23:10:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from mindspring.com (dialup-209.247.142.175.Dial1.SanJose1.Level3.net [209.247.142.175]) by johnson.mail.mindspring.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA18652; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 02:10:42 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3B285581.4CFBBEF3@mindspring.com> Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 23:11:13 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Reply-To: tlambert2@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Louis A. Mamakos" Cc: Mike Smith , Bsdguru@aol.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How to disable software TCP checksumming? References: <200106092135.f59LZW701229@mass.dis.org> <200106110103.f5B13HI87819@whizzo.transsys.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Louis A. Mamakos" wrote: > > Setting aside the degree to which you choose to be paranoid about > where data can be corrupted, and the likelyhood thereof-- there > is an architectural issue here, which is that the CRC provided > by your friendly neighborhood Ethernet NIC card only protects the > data over one Ethernet subnetwork. The TCP checksum, and TCP in > general, provides end-to-end semantics, independent of the > concatenation of physical links the TCP segments might transit from > the source to the destination. If you have an end-to-end protocol, > with end-to-end semantics, then you need and end-to-end mechanism. I think you need to read the Tigon II driver in the /sys/pci directory, and come back when you realize that it supports offloading the TCP checksum. FWIW: The Intel Gigabit, Tigon III, and several other Gigabit cards support this, as well. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 23:24:40 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns1.ecoutez.net (ns1.ecoutez.net [64.36.74.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B20237B403 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 23:24:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kevin.way@overtone.org) Received: from localhost (owl.ecoutez.net [64.36.74.6]) by ns1.ecoutez.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id CAA16520; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 02:25:12 -0400 Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 02:25:12 -0400 Message-Id: <200106140625.CAA16520@ns1.ecoutez.net> To: drosih@rpi.edu From: Kevin Way Cc: hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailer: Perl Mail::Sender Version 0.6.7 Jan Krynicky Czech Republic Subject: Re: Re: import NetBSD rc system [summary] Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG  drosih@rpi.edu wrote: > At 10:01 PM -0400 6/12/01, Kevin Way wrote: > >David Xu wrote: > > > Is there any plan to import NetBSD rc system, > > > I am willing to see it appears in FreeBSD 5.0. > > > >Here's the status of this project at the moment as I see. Please > >let me know if I've misunderstood anything, or if anybody has had > >a change of heart. > I see no reference to the thread "Plan to import NetBSD rc system" > from Sheldon Hearn, where he said: Thanks Garance, that's exactly why I posted the summary. My current status is: -setup dedicated net & freebsd -CURRENT boxes -made sure rcorder worked on fbsd -ported rc, rc.subr, and started with the individual rc.d scripts Seeing as there are a few of us who are working on independant implementations of this port, perhaps we should follow Sheldon's original advice, and after USENIX, let Sheldon decide what changes each of us made were good/bad, and go from there? I apologize if the formatting of this message is botched, I'm using an awful web-mail client, as the machine i read e-mail on bit the dust this morning. Kevin Way To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 23:40:12 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from johnson.mail.mindspring.net (johnson.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.177]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A77F37B403 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 23:39:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from mindspring.com (dialup-209.247.142.175.Dial1.SanJose1.Level3.net [209.247.142.175]) by johnson.mail.mindspring.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA14344; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 02:39:30 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3B285C40.6500519C@mindspring.com> Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 23:40:00 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Reply-To: tlambert2@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Matt Dillon Cc: Cejka Rudolf , David Malone , Peter Wemm , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: signal(SIGCHLD, SIG_IGN) patch solving SUSv2 compatibility issue References: <200106101845.f5AIje014790@earth.backplane.com> <20010611002050.362CE380E@overcee.netplex.com.au> <20010611115806.A53216@walton.maths.tcd.ie> <20010612095323.A72009@dcse.fee.vutbr.cz> <200106121638.f5CGcOo42940@earth.backplane.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matt Dillon wrote: > :Thanks for this commit, but it works exactly in the way, which > :I wanted to avoid. It is something like "partially submitted and > :not approved by me". Please, could you look once again on it? > :Please please please... Thanks. ;-) > : > :- Hunk #1 from commit adds PS_NOCLDWAIT when SIG_IGN is used for > : SIGCHLD, so if I use > : sigemptyset(&sa.sa_mask); > : sa.sa_flags = 0; > : sa.sa_handler = SIG_IGN; > : sigaction(SIGCHLD, &sa, NULL); > : sigaction(SIGCHLD, NULL, &so); > : I get additional flag SA_NOCLDWAIT in so.sa_flags. None of tested > : systems (Solaris, Unixware, Irix, Linux, Aix) works in this way. > :- If hunk #1 is applied, I see hunk #2 (resetting SIG_IGN to SIG_DFL > : for SIGCHLD) as almost unnecessary, because it is just cosmetic > : change now and behavior in exec() is very different among various > : systems. > > You have to remain consistent, otherwise the exec'd program > might set a signal handler and then restore the original > and suddenly it works differently. I agree. [ ... ] > Your patches look pretty good. Personally I don't think having > the SA_NOCLDWAIT flag show up is a big deal since programs which > use SIG_IGN do not generally know the flag even exists, but I > do agree that we might as well make the interface as compatible > as possible. I really, really object to not setting the SA_NOCLDWAIT flag. At the very least, you need to add a SA_CLDWAIT flag, if you want to not have it show up in this case, and make it show up in the other case. I think doing this would be a mistake, since the intent of the flags is to have (predominantly) OS specific behaviour switches, and a negative switch makes no sense, since you will often set the flags to 0 to avoid getting OS specific behaviours, or accidently setting "whatever's on the stack". Why is the original poster objecting to the flags being set? What if the flag being set was SA_POSIX or SA_SUS2? I don't think it's reasonable to unset the flag, and I don't think it's reasonable to omit _any_ flag in both cases, since there _MUST_ be a way to get historical behaviour. Further, I think that this patch should be limited to the non-compatability code. I don't think that anyone should be nosing around or changing flags values that they dpn't unserstand. The sa_flags = 0 case is a special initialization case, and I view it as being akin to pthreads mutex initializers. While we are at it, no, we should not make sockaddr_in with any old stack garbage in the so-called "unimportant" fields work, just so we can run badly written Linux networking programs. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jun 13 23:57:12 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23F2F37B403 for ; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 23:57:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5E6v7i20197; Wed, 13 Jun 2001 23:57:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 23:57:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106140657.f5E6v7i20197@earth.backplane.com> To: Terry Lambert Cc: Cejka Rudolf , David Malone , Peter Wemm , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: signal(SIGCHLD, SIG_IGN) patch solving SUSv2 compatibility issue References: <200106101845.f5AIje014790@earth.backplane.com> <20010611002050.362CE380E@overcee.netplex.com.au> <20010611115806.A53216@walton.maths.tcd.ie> <20010612095323.A72009@dcse.fee.vutbr.cz> <200106121638.f5CGcOo42940@earth.backplane.com> <3B285C40.6500519C@mindspring.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :I really, really object to not setting the SA_NOCLDWAIT :flag. : :At the very least, you need to add a SA_CLDWAIT flag, if you :want to not have it show up in this case, and make it show :up in the other case. : :I think doing this would be a mistake, since the intent of :the flags is to have (predominantly) OS specific behaviour :switches, and a negative switch makes no sense, since you :will often set the flags to 0 to avoid getting OS specific :behaviours, or accidently setting "whatever's on the stack". : :Why is the original poster objecting to the flags being :set? What if the flag being set was SA_POSIX or SA_SUS2? : :I don't think it's reasonable to unset the flag, and I :don't think it's reasonable to omit _any_ flag in both :cases, since there _MUST_ be a way to get historical :behaviour. : :Further, I think that this patch should be limited to :the non-compatability code. : :I don't think that anyone should be nosing around or :changing flags values that they dpn't unserstand. The :sa_flags = 0 case is a special initialization case, :and I view it as being akin to pthreads mutex initializers. : :-- Terry The issue here is first: since we are fixing a bug we might as well be as compatible as possible with other platforms and, second: on general principles it does make sense to keep SIG_IGN operation independant from the newer SA_NOCLDWAIT stuff. A program using SIG_IGN has absolutely no expectation that that use will effect the sigaction flags, so us modifying the sigaction flags accomplish absolutely nothing and could in fact be detrimental of some poor sod of a programmer writing code on a FreeBSD box actually started depending on the side effect. So I agree with Cejka - the first patch was pretty good but didn't quite hit the mark and now we have a new candidate patch that seems to cover all the bases, which David Malone is reviewing and will probably commit to -current (and me to stable afterwords). -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 0:49:29 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.huji.ac.il (cs.huji.ac.il [132.65.16.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 120B937B409 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 00:49:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from danny@cs.huji.ac.il) Received: from sexta.cs.huji.ac.il ([132.65.16.13] ident=exim) by cs.huji.ac.il with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15ARsO-00020L-00; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 10:49:12 +0300 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=sexta.cs.huji.ac.il ident=danny) by sexta.cs.huji.ac.il with esmtp (Exim 3.15 #1) id 15ARsN-00062o-00; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 10:49:11 +0300 X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with nmh-0.24 To: Peter Pentchev Cc: Warner Losh , Sheldon Hearn , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: rc, was: Re: Plan to import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: Message from Peter Pentchev of "Wed, 13 Jun 2001 12:15:25 +0300." <20010613121525.D22123@ringworld.oblivion.bg> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 10:49:11 +0300 From: Danny Braniss Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I've asked -ports before whether it is suitable to let ports startup scripts > honor /etc/rc.conf{,.local} settings by sourcing /etc/defaults/rc.conf and > then running a source_rc_confs (or whatever is appropriate). my suggestion: this is the 'modified' loop for the ${local_startup} in /etc/rc: case ${local_startup} in [Nn][Oo] | '') ;; *) echo -n 'Local package initialization:' for dir in ${local_startup}; do if [ -d "${dir}" ]; then for script in ${dir}/*.sh; do s=`basename ${script} .sh` v=`eval echo '$'${s}_enable|dd conv=ucase` if [ -x "${script}" -a ${v} = YES ]; then (set -T trap 'exit 1' 2 ${script} start) fi done fi done echo '.' ;; esac you just add: mysql_enable="YeS" danny To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 1: 7:30 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from columbus.cris.net (ns.cris.net [212.110.128.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 98AF637B409; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 01:07:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from phantom@ark.cris.net) Received: from ark.cris.net (root@ns2.cris.net [212.110.128.68]) by columbus.cris.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA86804; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:07:04 +0300 (EEST) Received: (from phantom@localhost) by ark.cris.net (8.11.1/8.11.1) id f5E873W94562; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:07:03 +0300 (EEST) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:07:03 +0300 From: Alexey Zelkin To: Chris Costello Cc: Dima Dorfman , rwatson@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, doc@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD Monthly Development Status Report, June 2001 Message-ID: <20010614110703.A91909@ark.cris.net> References: <20010614024036.2B39F3E28@bazooka.unixfreak.org> <20010613214752.C5865@holly.calldei.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0i In-Reply-To: <20010613214752.C5865@holly.calldei.com>; from chris@calldei.com on Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 09:47:52PM -0500 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.5-STABLE i386 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hi, On Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 09:47:52PM -0500, Chris Costello wrote: > > If this ends up being the case (i.e., there's an issue approx. once a > > month), how about archiving them on the web site? We used to have a > > "newsletter", but it quickly grew stale. This sounds like something > > developers actually might be interested in (there's no glory in > > writing something if nobody knows about it ;-) ), so it has a much > > better chance of succeeding. > > > > I don't know if it's worth putting the first issue up not knowing if > > there will be more; anybody else have an opinion on this? > > I'm thinking perhaps it should be made into part of the doc > project. I'm in the middle of converting it into a DocBook > article and will post a URL to it soon. Why ? We already have http://www.freebsd.org/projects/index.html. May be it's better to go with formalizing this page rather than adding new one ? ps: But I think it can be good idea to put sgml'ified copy of this report (and others) to web site, like we had Really Quick Newsletter for some time. Any takers ? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 1:43:57 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from critter.freebsd.dk (fxp0.halvsten.ip.cybercity.dk [212.242.40.114]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E23037B403; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 01:42:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) Received: from critter (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.freebsd.dk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5E78Dr56541; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 09:08:13 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) To: Dima Dorfman Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, dougb@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: mount_mfs-like program for md In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:39:47 PDT." <20010612073947.51AD73E28@bazooka.unixfreak.org> Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 09:08:13 +0200 Message-ID: <56539.992502493@critter> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Go for it. In message <20010612073947.51AD73E28@bazooka.unixfreak.org>, Dima Dorfman write s: >Hi folks, > >Would anybody have a tantrum if a program with a mount_mfs-like >interface to create an md disk and put a UFS filesystem on it was >imported into the base system? This has been suggested in the past, >and the only real objection was that it shouldn't be named mount_*. >At this time, I am *not* proposing to name it mount_*. > >More specifically, the program exec's mdconfig, disklabel, newfs, and >mount, in that order, to set up the disk and filesystem. It supports >all the options mount_mfs did, passing them to the correct program(s). >It can theoretically be renamed to mount_ to handle >corresponding /etc/fstab entries; however, I would like to make it >clear that I am *not* proposing that. > >Furthermore, dougb@ says that something similar would have to be used >in /etc/rc to make filesystems on md disks for, e.g., /tmp, anyway, >and this just factors out the code into something that can be used >separately. So, is there any reason not to do this? I've attached a >sharball of the sources. > >Regards, > > Dima Dorfman > dima@unixfreak.org > ># This is a shell archive. Save it in a file, remove anything before ># this line, and then unpack it by entering "sh file". Note, it may ># create directories; files and directories will be owned by you and ># have default permissions. ># ># This archive contains: ># ># mdmfs ># mdmfs/Makefile ># mdmfs/pathnames.h ># mdmfs/mdmfs.c ># mdmfs/mdmfs.8 ># >echo c - mdmfs >mkdir -p mdmfs > /dev/null 2>&1 >echo x - mdmfs/Makefile >sed 's/^X//' >mdmfs/Makefile << 'END-of-mdmfs/Makefile' >X# $FreeBSD$ >X >XPROG= mdmfs >XMAN= mdmfs.8 >XWARNS?= 2 >X >X.include >END-of-mdmfs/Makefile >echo x - mdmfs/pathnames.h >sed 's/^X//' >mdmfs/pathnames.h << 'END-of-mdmfs/pathnames.h' >X/* $FreeBSD$ */ >X#ifndef MDMFS_PATHNAMES_H >X#define MDMFS_PATHNAMES_H >X >X#define PATH_MDCONFIG "/sbin/mdconfig" >X#define PATH_DISKLABEL "/sbin/disklabel" >X#define PATH_NEWFS "/sbin/newfs" >X#define PATH_MOUNT "/sbin/mount" >X >X#endif /* !MDMFS_PATHNAMES_H */ >END-of-mdmfs/pathnames.h >echo x - mdmfs/mdmfs.c >sed 's/^X//' >mdmfs/mdmfs.c << 'END-of-mdmfs/mdmfs.c' >X/* >X * Copyright (c) 2001 Dima Dorfman . >X * All rights reserved. >X * >X * Redistribution and use in source and binary forms, with or without >X * modification, are permitted provided that the following conditions >X * are met: >X * 1. Redistributions of source code must retain the above copyright >X * notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer. >X * 2. Redistributions in binary form must reproduce the above copyright >X * notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer in the >X * documentation and/or other materials provided with the distribution. >X * >X * THIS SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED BY THE AUTHOR AND CONTRIBUTORS ``AS IS'' AND >X * ANY EXPRESS OR IMPLIED WARRANTIES, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE >X * IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE >X * ARE DISCLAIMED. IN NO EVENT SHALL THE AUTHOR OR CONTRIBUTORS BE LIABLE >X * FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, EXEMPLARY, OR CONSEQUENTIAL >X * DAMAGES (INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, PROCUREMENT OF SUBSTITUTE GOODS >X * OR SERVICES; LOSS OF USE, DATA, OR PROFITS; OR BUSINESS INTERRUPTION) >X * HOWEVER CAUSED AND ON ANY THEORY OF LIABILITY, WHETHER IN CONTRACT, STRICT >X * LIABILITY, OR TORT (INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE OR OTHERWISE) ARISING IN ANY WAY >X * OUT OF THE USE OF THIS SOFTWARE, EVEN IF ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF >X * SUCH DAMAGE. >X */ >X >X/* >X * mdmfs (md/MFS) is a wrapper around mdconfig(8), disklabel(8), >X * newfs(8), and mount(8) that mimics the command line option set of >X * the deprecated mount_mfs(8). As the name suggests, it creates an >X * md(4) disk, labels it, newfs's it, and mounts it. >X */ >X >X#ifndef lint >Xstatic const char rcsid[] = >X "$FreeBSD$"; >X#endif /* not lint */ >X >X#include >X#include >X#include >X#include >X >X#include >X#include >X#include >X#include >X#include >X#include >X#include >X#include >X#include >X#include >X#include >X >X#include "pathnames.h" >X >X/* XXX variable args in macros is a GCCism! */ >X#define ARGAPPEND(d, s...) (argappend(d, sizeof(d), " " ##s)) >X#define debugprintf(s...) if (debug) (void)fprintf(stderr, "DEBUG: " ##s) >X >Xtypedef enum { false, true } bool; >X >Xstruct mtpt_info { >X uid_t mi_uid; >X bool mi_have_uid; >X gid_t mi_gid; >X bool mi_have_gid; >X mode_t mi_mode; >X bool mi_have_mode; >X}; >X >Xbool debug, loudsubs, norun; /* Global options. */ >Xint unit; /* The unit we're working with. */ >Xconst char *mdname; /* Name of memory disk device (e.g., "md"). */ >Xsize_t mdnamelen; /* Length of mdname. */ >X >Xint main(int, char **); >Xvoid argappend(char *, size_t, const char *, ...); >Xvoid do_disklabel(void); >Xvoid do_mdconfig_attach(const char *, const enum md_types); >Xvoid do_mdconfig_attach_au(const char *, const enum md_types); >Xvoid do_mdconfig_detach(void); >Xvoid do_mount(const char *, const char *); >Xvoid do_mtptsetup(const char *, struct mtpt_info *); >Xvoid do_newfs(const char *); >Xvoid extract_ugid(const char *, struct mtpt_info *); >Xint run(int *, const char *, ...); >Xvoid usage(void); >X >Xint >Xmain(int ac, char **av) >X{ >X char mdconfig_arg[MAXPATHLEN], newfs_arg[MAXPATHLEN], >X mount_arg[MAXPATHLEN]; >X char ch, *mtpoint, *unitstr; >X struct mtpt_info mi; >X bool nodetach = false, softdep = true, autounit = false; >X bool have_mdtype = false; >X enum md_types mdtype; >X >X (void)memset(&mi, '\0', sizeof(mi)); >X (void)memset(mdconfig_arg, '\0', sizeof(mdconfig_arg)); >X (void)memset(newfs_arg, '\0', sizeof(newfs_arg)); >X (void)memset(mount_arg, '\0', sizeof(mount_arg)); >X mdname = MD_NAME; >X mdnamelen = strlen(MD_NAME); >X >X while ((ch = getopt(ac, av, >X "a:b:c:Dd:e:F:f:hi:LMm:Nn:O:o:p:Ss:t:w:X")) != -1) >X switch (ch) { >X case 'a': >X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-a %s", optarg); >X break; >X case 'b': >X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-b %s", optarg); >X break; >X case 'c': >X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-c %s", optarg); >X break; >X case 'D': >X nodetach = true; >X break; >X case 'd': >X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-d %s", optarg); >X break; >X case 'e': >X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-e %s", optarg); >X break; >X case 'F': >X if (have_mdtype) >X usage(); >X mdtype = MD_VNODE; >X have_mdtype = true; >X ARGAPPEND(mdconfig_arg, "-f %s", optarg); >X break; >X case 'f': >X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-f %s", optarg); >X break; >X case 'h': >X usage(); >X break; >X case 'i': >X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-i %s", optarg); >X break; >X case 'L': >X loudsubs = true; >X break; >X case 'M': >X if (have_mdtype) >X usage(); >X mdtype = MD_MALLOC; >X have_mdtype = true; >X break; >X case 'm': >X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-m %s", optarg); >X break; >X case 'N': >X norun = true; >X break; >X case 'n': >X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-n %s", optarg); >X break; >X case 'O': >X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-o %s", optarg); >X break; >X case 'o': >X ARGAPPEND(mount_arg, "-o %s", optarg); >X break; >X case 'p': >X if (*optarg >= '0' && *optarg <= '7') >X mi.mi_mode = strtol(optarg, NULL, 8); >X if ((mi.mi_mode & ~07777) != 0) >X usage(); >X mi.mi_have_mode = true; >X break; >X case 'S': >X softdep = false; >X break; >X case 's': >X ARGAPPEND(mdconfig_arg, "-s %s", optarg); >X break; >X case 't': >X ARGAPPEND(mount_arg, "-t %s", optarg); >X break; >X case 'w': >X extract_ugid(optarg, &mi); >X break; >X case 'X': >X debug = true; >X break; >X default: >X usage(); >X } >X ac -= optind; >X av += optind; >X if (ac < 2) >X usage(); >X unitstr = av[0]; >X if (strncmp(unitstr, "/dev/", 5) == 0) >X unitstr += 5; >X if (strncmp(unitstr, mdname, mdnamelen) == 0) >X unitstr += mdnamelen; >X if (*unitstr == '\0') { >X autounit = true; >X unit = -1; >X } else { >X unit = strtoul(unitstr, NULL, 10); >X if ((unsigned)unit == ULONG_MAX) >X errx(1, "bad device unit: %s", unitstr); >X } >X mtpoint = av[1]; >X if (!have_mdtype) >X mdtype = MD_SWAP; >X >X if (softdep) >X ARGAPPEND(newfs_arg, "-U"); >X >X if (!nodetach && !autounit) >X do_mdconfig_detach(); >X if (autounit) >X do_mdconfig_attach_au(mdconfig_arg, mdtype); >X else >X do_mdconfig_attach(mdconfig_arg, mdtype); >X do_disklabel(); >X do_newfs(newfs_arg); >X do_mount(mount_arg, mtpoint); >X do_mtptsetup(mtpoint, &mi); >X >X return (0); >X} >X >X/* >X * Append the formatted string pointed to by 'fmt' to 'dst'. >X */ >Xvoid >Xargappend(char *dst, size_t dstlen, const char *fmt, ...) >X{ >X va_list ap; >X char tb[256]; >X size_t rv; >X >X va_start(ap, fmt); >X rv = vsnprintf(tb, sizeof(tb), fmt, ap); >X va_end(ap); >X assert(rv < sizeof(tb)); >X rv = strlcat(dst, tb, dstlen); >X assert(rv < dstlen); >X} >X >Xvoid >Xdo_disklabel(void) >X{ >X int rv; >X >X rv = run(NULL, "%s -r -w %s%d auto", PATH_DISKLABEL, mdname, unit); >X if (rv) >X errx(1, "disklabel exited with error code %d", rv); >X} >X >Xvoid >Xdo_mdconfig_attach(const char *args, const enum md_types mdtype) >X{ >X int rv; >X const char *ta; /* Type arg. */ >X >X switch (mdtype) { >X case MD_SWAP: >X ta = "-t swap"; >X break; >X case MD_VNODE: >X ta = "-t vnode"; >X break; >X case MD_MALLOC: >X ta = "-t malloc"; >X break; >X default: >X abort(); >X } >X rv = run(NULL, "%s -a %s%s -u %s%d", PATH_MDCONFIG, ta, args, >X mdname, unit); >X if (rv) >X errx(1, "mdconfig (attach) exited with error code %d", rv); >X} >X >Xvoid >Xdo_mdconfig_attach_au(const char *args, const enum md_types mdtype) >X{ >X int rv, fd; >X const char *ta; /* Type arg. */ >X char tb[10]; >X char *linep; >X size_t linelen; >X FILE *sfd; /* FILE version of fd. */ >X >X switch (mdtype) { >X case MD_SWAP: >X ta = "-t swap"; >X break; >X case MD_VNODE: >X ta = "-t vnode"; >X break; >X case MD_MALLOC: >X ta = "-t malloc"; >X break; >X default: >X abort(); >X } >X rv = run(&fd, "%s -a %s%s", PATH_MDCONFIG, ta, args); >X if (rv) >X errx(1, "mdconfig (attach) exited with error code %d", rv); >X if (norun) { /* Since we didn't run, we can't read. Fake it. */ >X unit = -1; >X return; >X } >X sfd = fdopen(fd, "r"); >X if (sfd == NULL) >X err(1, "fdopen"); >X linep = fgetln(sfd, &linelen); >X if (linep == NULL && linelen < mdnamelen + 1) >X errx(1, "unexpected output from mdconfig (attach)"); >X if (strncmp(linep, mdname, mdnamelen) == 0) >X linep += mdnamelen; >X assert(linelen + mdnamelen < sizeof(tb)); >X strncpy(tb, linep, linelen); >X tb[linelen] = '\0'; >X unit = strtoul(tb, NULL, 10); >X if ((unsigned)unit == ULONG_MAX) >X errx(1, "unexpected output from mdconfig (attach)"); >X >X fclose(sfd); >X close(fd); >X} >X >Xvoid >Xdo_mdconfig_detach(void) >X{ >X int rv; >X >X rv = run(NULL, "%s -d -u %s%d", PATH_MDCONFIG, mdname, unit); >X if (rv && debug) /* This is allowed to fail. */ >X warnx("mdconfig (detach) exited with error code %d (ignored)", >X rv); >X} >X >Xvoid >Xdo_mount(const char *args, const char *mtpoint) >X{ >X int rv; >X >X rv = run(NULL, "%s%s /dev/%s%dc %s", PATH_MOUNT, args, >X mdname, unit, mtpoint); >X if (rv) >X errx(1, "mount exited with error code %d", rv); >X} >X >Xvoid >Xdo_mtptsetup(const char *mtpoint, struct mtpt_info *mip) >X{ >X >X if (mip->mi_have_mode) { >X debugprintf("changing mode of %s to %o.\n", mtpoint, >X mip->mi_mode); >X if (!norun) >X if (chmod(mtpoint, mip->mi_mode) == -1) >X err(1, "chmod: %s", mtpoint); >X } >X if (mip->mi_have_uid) { >X debugprintf("changing owner (user) or %s to %u.\n", mtpoint, >X mip->mi_uid); >X if (!norun) >X if (chown(mtpoint, mip->mi_uid, -1) == -1) >X err(1, "chown %s to %u (user)", mtpoint, >X mip->mi_uid); >X } >X if (mip->mi_have_gid) { >X debugprintf("changing owner (group) or %s to %u.\n", mtpoint, >X mip->mi_gid); >X if (!norun) >X if (chown(mtpoint, -1, mip->mi_gid) == -1) >X err(1, "chown %s to %u (group)", mtpoint, >X mip->mi_gid); >X } >X} >X >Xvoid >Xdo_newfs(const char *args) >X{ >X int rv; >X >X rv = run(NULL, "%s%s /dev/%s%dc", PATH_NEWFS, args, mdname, unit); >X if (rv) >X errx(1, "newfs exited with error code %d", rv); >X} >X >X/* >X * 'str' should be a user and group name similar to the last argument >X * to chown(1); i.e., a user, followed by a colon or period, followed >X * by a group. The user and group in 'str' may be either a [ug]id or >X * a name. Upon return, the uid and gid fields in 'mip' will contain >X * the uid and gid of the user and group name in 'str', respectively. >X * >X * In other words, this derives a user and group id from a string >X * formatted like the last argument to chown(1). >X */ >Xvoid >Xextract_ugid(const char *str, struct mtpt_info *mip) >X{ >X struct passwd *pw; >X struct group *gr; >X char ug[MAXLOGNAME * 2 + 2]; >X char *user, *group; >X char *p; >X uid_t *uid; >X gid_t *gid; >X >X uid = &mip->mi_uid; >X gid = &mip->mi_gid; >X mip->mi_have_uid = mip->mi_have_gid = false; >X >X (void)strlcpy(ug, str, sizeof(ug)); >X group = ug; >X user = strsep(&group, ":."); >X if (user == NULL || group == NULL || *user == '\0' || *group == '\0') >X usage(); >X >X *uid = strtoul(user, &p, 10); >X if ((unsigned)*uid == ULONG_MAX) >X usage(); >X if (*p != '\0') { >X pw = getpwnam(user); >X if (pw == NULL) >X errx(1, "invalid user: %s", user); >X *uid = pw->pw_uid; >X mip->mi_have_uid = true; >X } >X *gid = strtoul(group, &p, 10); >X if ((unsigned)*gid == ULONG_MAX) >X usage(); >X if (*p != '\0') { >X gr = getgrnam(group); >X if (gr == NULL) >X errx(1, "invalid group: %s", group); >X *gid = gr->gr_gid; >X mip->mi_have_gid = true; >X } >X >X assert(mip->mi_have_uid); >X assert(mip->mi_have_gid); >X} >X >X/* >X * Run a process with command name and arguments pointed to by the >X * formatted string 'cmdline'. Since system(3) is not used, the first >X * space-delimited token of 'cmdline' must be the full pathname of the >X * program to run. The return value is the return code of the process >X * spawned. If 'ofd' is non-NULL, it is set to the standard output of >X * the program spawned (i.e., you can read from ofd and get the output >X * of the program). >X */ >Xint >Xrun(int *ofd, const char *cmdline, ...) >X{ >X va_list ap; >X char cmd[MAXPATHLEN], **av, **avp, *p; >X int i, pid, status, ac, pfd[2], nfd; >X bool dup2dn = true; /* Dup /dev/null to stdout? */ >X >X va_start(ap, cmdline); >X (void)vsnprintf(cmd, sizeof(cmd), cmdline, ap); >X va_end(ap); >X >X for (ac = 1, p = cmd; (p = strchr(p, ' ')) != NULL; p++) >X ac++; /* 'ac' generation loop. */ >X av = (char **)malloc(sizeof(*av) * (ac + 1)); >X if (av == NULL) >X err(1, "malloc"); >X for (p = cmd, avp = av; (*avp = strsep(&p, " ")) != NULL;) >X if (**av != '\0') >X if (++avp >= &av[ac]) { >X *avp = NULL; >X break; >X } >X assert(*av); >X if (debug) { >X (void)fprintf(stderr, "DEBUG: running:"); >X /* Should be equivilent to 'cmd' (before strsep, of course). */ >X for (i = 0; av[i] != NULL; i++) >X (void)fprintf(stderr, " %s", av[i]); >X (void)fprintf(stderr, "\n"); >X } >X if (ofd != NULL) { >X if (pipe(&pfd[0]) == -1) >X err(1, "pipe"); >X *ofd = pfd[0]; >X dup2dn = false; >X } >X pid = fork(); >X switch (pid) { >X case 0: >X if (norun) >X _exit(0); >X if (ofd != NULL) >X if (dup2(pfd[1], STDOUT_FILENO) < 0) >X err(1, "dup2"); >X if (!loudsubs) { >X nfd = open(_PATH_DEVNULL, O_RDWR); >X if (nfd < 0) >X err(1, "open: %s", _PATH_DEVNULL); >X if (dup2(nfd, STDIN_FILENO) < 0) >X err(1, "dup2"); >X if (dup2dn) >X if (dup2(nfd, STDOUT_FILENO) < 0) >X err(1, "dup2"); >X if (dup2(nfd, STDERR_FILENO) < 0) >X err(1, "dup2"); >X } >X >X (void)execv(av[0], av); >X warn("exec: %s", av[0]); >X _exit(-1); >X case -1: >X err(1, "fork"); >X } >X while (waitpid(pid, &status, 0) != pid) >X ; >X free(av); >X return (WEXITSTATUS(status)); >X} >X >Xvoid >Xusage(void) >X{ >X >X fprintf(stderr, >X"usage: %s [-DLMNSX] [-a maxcontig] [-b block-size] [-c cylinders]\n" >X"\t[-d rotdelay] [-e maxbpg] [-F file] [-f frag-size] [-i bytes]\n" >X"\t[-m percent-free] [-n rotational-positions] [-O optimization]\n" >X"\t[-o mount-options] [-p permissions] [-s size] [-w user:group]\n" >X"\tmd-device mount-point\n", getprogname()); >X exit(1); >X} >END-of-mdmfs/mdmfs.c >echo x - mdmfs/mdmfs.8 >sed 's/^X//' >mdmfs/mdmfs.8 << 'END-of-mdmfs/mdmfs.8' >X.\" >X.\" Copyright (c) 2001 Dima Dorfman >X.\" All rights reserved. >X.\" >X.\" Redistribution and use in source and binary forms, with or without >X.\" modification, are permitted provided that the following conditions >X.\" are met: >X.\" 1. Redistributions of source code must retain the above copyright >X.\" notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer. >X.\" 2. Redistributions in binary form must reproduce the above copyright >X.\" notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer in the >X.\" documentation and/or other materials provided with the distribution. >X.\" >X.\" THIS SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED BY THE AUTHOR AND CONTRIBUTORS ``AS IS'' AND >X.\" ANY EXPRESS OR IMPLIED WARRANTIES, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE >X.\" IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE >X.\" ARE DISCLAIMED. IN NO EVENT SHALL THE AUTHOR OR CONTRIBUTORS BE LIABLE >X.\" FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, EXEMPLARY, OR CONSEQUENTIAL >X.\" DAMAGES (INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, PROCUREMENT OF SUBSTITUTE GOODS >X.\" OR SERVICES; LOSS OF USE, DATA, OR PROFITS; OR BUSINESS INTERRUPTION) >X.\" HOWEVER CAUSED AND ON ANY THEORY OF LIABILITY, WHETHER IN CONTRACT, STRICT >X.\" LIABILITY, OR TORT (INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE OR OTHERWISE) ARISING IN ANY WAY >X.\" OUT OF THE USE OF THIS SOFTWARE, EVEN IF ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF >X.\" SUCH DAMAGE. >X.\" >X.\" $FreeBSD$ >X.\" >X.Dd May 26, 2001 >X.Dt MDMFS 8 >X.Os >X.Sh NAME >X.Nm mdmfs >X.Nd configure and mount an in-memory filesystem using the >X.Xr md 4 >Xdriver >X.Sh SYNOPSIS >X.Nm >X.Op Fl DLMNSX >X.Op Fl a Ar maxcontig >X.Op Fl b Ar block-size >X.Op Fl c Ar cylinders >X.Op Fl d Ar rotdelay >X.Op Fl e Ar maxbpg >X.Op Fl F Ar file >X.Op Fl f Ar frag-size >X.Op Fl i Ar bytes >X.Op Fl m Ar percent-free >X.Op Fl n Ar rotational-positions >X.Op Fl O Ar optimization >X.Op Fl o Ar mount-options >X.Op Fl p Ar permissions >X.Op Fl s Ar size >X.Op Fl w Ar user Ns | Ns Ar group >X.Ar md-device >X.Ar mount-point >X.Sh DESCRIPTION >XThe >X.Nm >Xprogram is designed to be a work-alike and look-alike of the deprecated >X.Xr mount_mfs 8 . >XThe end result is essentially the same, >Xbut is accomplished in a completely different way. >X.Nm >Xconfigures an >X.Xr md 4 >Xdisk using >X.Xr mdconfig 8 , >Xlabels it using >X.Xr disklabel 8 , >Xputs a UFS filesystem on it using >X.Xr newfs 8 , >Xand mounts it using >X.Xr mount 8 . >XAll the command line options are passed to the appropriate program >Xat the appropriate stage in order to achieve the desired effect. >X.Pp >XBy default, >X.Nm >Xcreates a swap-based >X.Pq Dv MD_SWAP >Xdisk with soft-updates enabled >Xand mounts it on >X.Ar mount-point . >XIt uses the >X.Xr md 4 >Xdevice specified by >X.Ar md-device . >XIf >X.Ar md-device >Xis >X.Ql md >X(no unit number), >Xit will use >X.Xr md 4 Ns 's >Xauto-unit feature to automatically select an unused device. >XUnless otherwise specified with one of the options below, >Xit uses the default arguments to all the helper programs. >X.Pp >XThe following options are available. >XWhere possible, >Xthe option letter matches the one used by >X.Xr mount_mfs 8 >Xfor the same thing. >X.Bl -tag -width Ds >X.It Fl a Ar maxcontig >XSpecify the maximum number of contiguous blocks that will be laid >Xout before forcing a rotational delay >X(see the >X.Fl d >Xoption). >X.It Fl b Ar block-size >XThe block size of the filesystem, in bytes. >X.It Fl c Ar cylinders >XThe number of cylinders per cylinder group in the filesystem. >X.It Fl D >XIf not using auto-unit, >Xdon't run >X.Xr mdconfig 8 >Xto try to detach the unit before attaching it. >X.It Fl d Ar rotdelay >XSpecify the mininum time in milliseconds required to initiate another >Xdisk transfer on the same cylinder. >XModern disks with read/write-behind achieve higher performance without >Xthis feature, >Xso it is best to leave it at 0 milliseconds. >X.It Fl e Ar maxbpg >XIndicate the maximum number of blocks any single file can allocate >Xout of a cylinder group before it is forced to begin allocating >Xblocks from another cylinder group. >X.It Fl F Ar file >XCreate a vnode-backed >X.Pq Dv MD_VNODE >Xmemory disk backed by >X.Ar file . >X.It Fl f Ar frag-size >XThe fragment size of the filesystem in bytes. >X.It Fl i Ar bytes >XNumber of bytes per inode. >X.It Fl L >XShow the output of the helper programs. >XBy default, >Xit is sent to >X.Pa /dev/null . >X.It Fl M >XCreate a >X.Xr malloc 9 >Xbacked disk >X.Pq Dv MD_MALLOC >Xinstead of a swap-backed disk. >X.It Fl m Ar percent-free >XThe percentage of space reserved for the superuser. >X.It Fl N >XDon't actually run the helper programs. >XThis is most useful in conjunction with >X.Fl X . >X.It Fl n Ar rotational-positions >XThe default number of rotational positions to distinguish. >X.It Fl O Ar optimization >XSelect the optimization preference; >Xvalid choices are >X.Ar space >Xand >X.Ar time , >Xwhich will optimize for minimum space fragmentation and >Xminimum time spent allocating blocks, >Xrespectively. >X.It Fl o Ar mount-options >XSpecify the mount options with which to mount the filesystem. >XSee >X.Xr mount 8 >Xfor more information. >X.It Fl p Ar permissions >XSet the file (directory) permissions of the mount point >X.Ar mount-point >Xto >X.Ar permissions . >X.It Fl S >XDon't enable soft-updates on the filesystem. >X.It Fl s Ar size >XSpecify the size of the disk to create. >XThis only makes sense if >X.Fl F >Xis >X.Em not >Xspecified. >XThat is, >Xthis will work for the default swap-backed >X.Pq Dv MD_SWAP >Xdisks, >Xand the optional >X.Pq Fl M >X.Xr malloc 9 >Xbacked disks >X.Pq Dv MD_MALLOC . >X.It Fl w Ar user Ns | Ns Ar group >XSet the owner user and group to >X.Ar user >Xand >X.Ar group , >Xrespectively. >XThe arguments have the same semantics as with >X.Xr chown 8 , >Xbut specifying just a user or just a group is not supported. >X.El >X.Pp >XThe >X.Fl F >Xand >X.Fl s >Xoptions are passed to >X.Xr mdconfig 8 >Xas >X.Fl f >Xand >X.Fl s , >Xrespectively. >XThe >X.Fl a , >X.Fl b , >X.Fl c , >X.Fl d , >X.Fl e , >X.Fl f , >X.Fl i , >X.FL m >Xand >X.Fl n >Xoptions are passed to >X.Xr newfs 8 >Xwith the same letter; >Xthe >X.Fl O >Xoption is passed to >X.Xr newfs 8 >Xas >X.Fl o . >XThe >X.Fl o >Xand >X.Fl t >Xoptions are passed to >X.Xr mount 8 >Xwith the same letter. >XSee the programs that the options are passed to for more information >Xon their semantics. >X.Sh EXAMPLES >XCreate and mount a 32 megabyte swap-backed filesystem on >X.Pa /tmp : >X.Pp >X.Dl mdmfs -s 32m md /tmp >X.Pp >XCreate and mount a 16 megabyte malloc-backed filesystem on >X.Pa /tmp >Xusing the >X.Pa /dev/md1 >Xdevice; >Xfurthermore, >Xdon't use soft-updates it and mount it >X.Cm async : >X.Pp >X.Dl mdmfs -M -S -o async -s 16m md1 /tmp >X.Sh AUTHORS >X.An Dima Dorfman >X.Aq dima@unixfreak.org >END-of-mdmfs/mdmfs.8 >exit > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 phk@FreeBSD.ORG | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 2:11:10 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gnome01.sovam.com (gnome01.sovam.com [194.67.1.179]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 527A237B403; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 02:11:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from avn@any.ru) Received: from ts11-a245.dial.sovam.com ([195.239.68.245]:1796 "EHLO srv2.any" ident: "TIMEDOUT" whoson: "-unregistered-" smtp-auth: TLS-CIPHER: TLS-PEER: ) by gnome01.sovam.com with ESMTP id ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:02:39 +0400 Received: from localhost (avn@localhost) by srv2.any (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5E93JJ00773; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:03:19 +0400 (MSD) (envelope-from avn@any.ru) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:03:19 +0400 (MSD) From: "Alexey V. Neyman" X-X-Sender: To: =?koi8-r?Q?S=F8ren_Schmidt?= Cc: , Subject: Re: Supported ATAPI cdr/cdrw drives In-Reply-To: <200105281403.f4SE34Q26818@freebsd.dk> Message-ID: <20010614121619.H570-100000@srv2.any> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Good day! On Mon, 28 May 2001, Søren Schmidt wrote: >As promised I've made up a list of reports I've received so far go to >http://freebsd.dk/ and follow the link. > >I also have a patch for the Yamaha's (yamaha-cdr.p1) which also >can be found via the above URL. Let me know if that make things >work... yamaha-cdr.p1 is mode 0600, there is yamaha-cdr.p2, but it does not apply cleanly (FreeBSD srv2.any 4.3-STABLE, cvsupped about 7-8 Jun). I tried to apply it manually, and everything was ok. The disk was written and closed successfully. Thank you. When MFC'ing, close my PR 25960 :) -- -----------------------------------------------+--------------------------- Is that not what living is for? | Regards, Alexey V. Neyman | mailto: avn@any.ru --------------------------------( Pkunk, SC2 )-+--------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 2:33: 5 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from maynard.mail.mindspring.net (maynard.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.243]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C797737B407 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 02:32:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from mindspring.com (dialup-209.247.142.175.Dial1.SanJose1.Level3.net [209.247.142.175]) by maynard.mail.mindspring.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA07442; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 05:32:18 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3B2884C1.A938821A@mindspring.com> Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 02:32:49 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Reply-To: tlambert2@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Matt Dillon Cc: Cejka Rudolf , David Malone , Peter Wemm , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: signal(SIGCHLD, SIG_IGN) patch solving SUSv2 compatibility issue References: <200106101845.f5AIje014790@earth.backplane.com> <20010611002050.362CE380E@overcee.netplex.com.au> <20010611115806.A53216@walton.maths.tcd.ie> <20010612095323.A72009@dcse.fee.vutbr.cz> <200106121638.f5CGcOo42940@earth.backplane.com> <3B285C40.6500519C@mindspring.com> <200106140657.f5E6v7i20197@earth.backplane.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matt Dillon wrote: > The issue here is first: since we are fixing a bug we might > as well be as compatible as possible with other platforms and, > second: on general principles it does make sense to keep SIG_IGN > operation independant from the newer SA_NOCLDWAIT stuff. A program > using SIG_IGN has absolutely no expectation that that use will > effect the sigaction flags, so us modifying the sigaction flags > accomplish absolutely nothing and could in fact be detrimental of > some poor sod of a programmer writing code on a FreeBSD box actually > started depending on the side effect. You made the point earlier about SIG_IGN vs. SIG_DFL, and avoiding a side effect there. The side effect here is similar: I set SIG_IGN sith signal(), then get the flags (which show a zero), and then set them with sigaction() -- clearing the bit that results in the implied side effect behaviour with SIG_IGN. Further, if I have historically depended upon being able to seperately deal with SA_NOCLDWAIT so as to be able to reap childgren whose STOP/CONT I wanted to ignore, then I am now screwed, and have to handle all or none of them, and there is nothing I can do to my source code to fix it, short of adding STOP/CONT handlers and explicitly "handling" the job control crap. > So I agree with Cejka - the first patch was pretty good but didn't > quite hit the mark and now we have a new candidate patch that seems to > cover all the bases, which David Malone is reviewing and will > probably commit to -current (and me to stable afterwords). This breaks software which depends on the historical behaviour, since there is no way to recover the historical behaviour, and no way to know that you aren't recovering the historical behaviour. At least with a SA_CLDWAIT flag, you could do the ignore and you would get a compilation warning on half your programs (the ones that used the now useless SA_NOCLDWAIT). The ones that didn't and expected to be able to reap with SIG_IGN are now, of course, screwed even after a recompile, since there is no missing negative flag to alert them. 8-(. So how do I get the historical behaviour? PS: "we might as well be as compatible as possible with other platforms" ... I await your patches to make Linux code that doesn't bzero() sockaddr_in work on FreeBSD, since Linux and Solaris work without the bzero(), but FreeBSD does not... PPS: I guess you've finally changed your mind on the SVR4 init and run level stuff? -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 4:43: 3 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.noos.fr (camus.noos.net [212.198.2.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E86A37B40B for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 04:42:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from clefevre@redirect.to) Received: (qmail 2867300 invoked by uid 0); 14 Jun 2001 11:42:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gits.dyndns.org) ([212.198.228.81]) (envelope-sender ) by 212.198.2.70 (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 14 Jun 2001 11:42:39 -0000 Received: (from root@localhost) by gits.dyndns.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5EBgb377502; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:42:37 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from clefevre@redirect.to) To: Andrew Hesford Cc: Gordon Tetlow , Cyrille Lefevre , Jon Parise , Matt Dillon , Will Andrews , Warner Losh , Mark Santcroos , Doug Barton , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: <20010613202415.A3689@core.usrlib.org> X-Face: V|+c;4!|B?E%BE^{E6);aI.[<97Zd*>^#%Y5Cxv;%Y[PT-LW3;A:fRrJ8+^k"e7@+30g0YD0*^^3jgyShN7o?a]C la*Zv'5NA,=963bM%J^o]C Reply-To: Cyrille Lefevre In-Reply-To: <20010613202415.A3689@core.usrlib.org> Mail-Copies-To: never From: Cyrille Lefevre Date: 14 Jun 2001 13:42:36 +0200 Message-ID: <4rtjnv83.fsf@gits.dyndns.org> Lines: 98 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Andrew Hesford writes: > On Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 06:04:23PM -0700, Gordon Tetlow wrote: [snip] > > > > Anyway, here's my status: > > rcorder ported (one line code change) CPPFLAGS -> CFLAGS in Makefile I suppose ? > Alternatively, give up the handy feature of being able to start services > from their own scripts, and have a wrapper script that starts the > specified service and satisfies dependencies. This has the distinct > advantage of not having to call dep_check in each dependent script. > Furthermore, it allows us to start, say, nfsd.sh, knowing full well that > mountd is running, without worrying about some dependency checker trying > to start a new mountd. in fact, the require keyword isn't sufficient in it's own. there should be pre_require and post_require keywords since nfsd needs to start mountd before to start nfsd then rpc.statd and rpc.lockd have to be started after nfsd. so, you should have something like this : in nfsd : provide=nfsd pre_require="portmap mountd" post_require="statd lockd" in mountd : provide=nfsd pre_require=portmap post_require=nfsd in statd : provide=statd pre_require=nfsd post_require= in lockd : provide=lockd pre_require=nfsd post_require= this should work sell when starting services but may cause a little problem when stopping them. what should happen when doing nfsd stop ? should mountd, statd and lockd stopped as well. how about portmap which isn't only used by nfs services. so the pre_require have to be splitted to handle this case. do you understand what I mean ? I'm currently watching how to do this using the NetBSD rc framework. something like this : in rc, add this before files=`rcorder ...` rcorder () { local _rc_elem _rc_provide _rc_require local _rc_fast_and_loose _rc_fast_run _rc_fast_and_loose=yes _rc_fast_run=yes shift 2 for _rc_elem; do [ -f $_rc_elem ] || continue _rc_provide=$(run_rc_script $_rc_elem provide) for _rc_require in $(run_rc_script $_rc_elem require); do echo $_etc/rc.d/$_rc_require $_etc/rc.d/$_rc_provide done done | tsort } in rc.subr, add the following lines in the case "$_arg" in run_rc_command provide) echo $provide return 0 ;; require) echo $require return 0 ;; in every scripts, change # PROVIDE: and # REQUIRE: lines to variable assignment. for instance, this isn't sufficient since all scripts have to do the equivalent tinhgs done in the top level rc startup script to be complete. well, I'm working on this. Cyrille. -- home: mailto:clefevre@redirect.to UNIX is user-friendly; it's just particular work: mailto:Cyrille.Lefevre@edf.fr about who it chooses to be friends with. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 5:46: 8 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [204.156.12.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 745B237B403 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 05:46:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (robert@fledge.pr.watson.org [192.0.2.3]) by fledge.watson.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f5ECjcf24237; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 08:45:38 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 08:45:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Watson X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org To: Dima Dorfman Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD Monthly Development Status Report, June 2001 In-Reply-To: <20010614024036.2B39F3E28@bazooka.unixfreak.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 13 Jun 2001, Dima Dorfman wrote: > Robert Watson writes: > > - Future Editions > > > > Assuming there is some positive feedback on this idea, and that future > > submissions get made such that there is content for future issues, the > > goal is to release a development status report once a month. [...] > > If this ends up being the case (i.e., there's an issue approx. once a > month), how about archiving them on the web site? We used to have a > "newsletter", but it quickly grew stale. This sounds like something > developers actually might be interested in (there's no glory in writing > something if nobody knows about it ;-) ), so it has a much better chance > of succeeding. > > I don't know if it's worth putting the first issue up not knowing if > there will be more; anybody else have an opinion on this? Well, at this point I've received a lot of positive feedback indicating that people like the report (I'd be happy to keep receiving it however :-), so it's my plan to do it for at least another month. Given that people seem to find it useful, the primary factor in continuing it will therefore be the degree to which I'm successful in extracting status reports from the develops :-). I'd be happy to see integration into the web site, either (as Alexey Zelkin suggests) as part of an existing projects page, or some other mechanism. I know that Alexey's projects.freebsd.org project is a little stalled right now as we need developers to do some final tweaks on its scripting/etc and figure out how to integrate it into the FreeBSD.org cluster, but in the future I'm also interested in providing easy web submission for reports, if people would find that useful. That said, I think there's a lot of value to a push-format e-mail newsletter--as a developer, I'm much more likely to catch everything if the information is pushed to me (although an online archive and reference is useful also). I have to admit that my knowledge of various mark-up languages (beyond a dirty knowledge of nroff and HTML) is pretty... abysmal, so I'd very much appreciate assistance in getting it converted to an appropriate format. It sounds like Chris Costello has an SGML-ification underway already, so now it's a question of figuring out placement. If someone can provide me with a decent template in SGML, I can just paste everything in to it, and generate the plain text from it when I release (well, as long as someone also provides me with a Makefile :-). Or, I can mail it to someone after I've assembled the data and have them do the markup. Thanks for everyone's feedback--as I said above, all that is needed to make this a success is for everyone to remember to submit reports at the end of each month to the submission address I provided. I've had a couple of requests for more pointed reminders (perhaps in the style of the GNATS status e-mail for current committers, in addition to broadcasts to hackers@ for non-committers), and I will probably follow up on that. In my mind, the real definition of success here involves two factors: having content for people to read, and having people who read the content. Robert N M Watson FreeBSD Core Team, TrustedBSD Project robert@fledge.watson.org NAI Labs, Safeport Network Services To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 7: 0:51 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from southpass.baynetworks.com (ns2.BayNetworks.COM [134.177.3.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 239B237B403 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 07:00:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bwithrow@BayNetworks.COM) Received: from mailhost.BayNetworks.COM (ns4.baynetworks.com [132.245.135.84]) by southpass.baynetworks.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id GAA25651; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 06:46:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pobox.engeast.BayNetworks.COM (pobox.engeast.baynetworks.com [192.32.61.6]) by mailhost.BayNetworks.COM (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA09785; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 09:57:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from baynetworks.com (tuva [192.32.150.102]) by pobox.engeast.BayNetworks.COM (SMI-8.6/BNET-97/04/24-S) with ESMTP id JAA27316; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 09:57:17 -0400 for Message-Id: <200106141357.JAA27316@pobox.engeast.BayNetworks.COM> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.3.1 01/18/2001 with nmh-1.0.4 To: Cyrille Lefevre Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: Message from Cyrille Lefevre of "14 Jun 2001 02:35:36 +0200." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 09:57:17 -0400 From: Robert Withrow Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG clefevre-lists@noos.fr said: :- oops, rc2 isn't started. too bad. I think that is exactly the desired design. The RC *system* starts things correctly, but the manager, *bypassing* the RC *system* can start and stop things exactly as he wished. For debugging or whatever. I'd argue that if you want to start/stop a *subtree*, you should ask the RC *system* to do that somehow. -- Robert Withrow -- (+1 978 288 8256, ESN 248) BWithrow@NortelNetworks.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 7:39:40 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [204.156.12.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D39FB37B407 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 07:39:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (robert@fledge.pr.watson.org [192.0.2.3]) by fledge.watson.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f5EEYlf26283; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 10:34:47 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 10:34:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Watson X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org To: Robert Withrow Cc: Cyrille Lefevre , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: <200106141357.JAA27316@pobox.engeast.BayNetworks.COM> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG To do some of the hierarchal start/stop at runtime stuff, you really need a stateful rc system that stores its start/stop state in /var/run/rc.d or the like. In this way, the system could track various activities and know which dependencies were already started. However, this has a number of limitations, including differentiating the start/stop status of the daemon vs. its script, behavior in an environment under development, etc. Transarc's AFS product has a notion of a "boss server" that starts and stops services associated with AFS. It has the added benefit of detecting service failures, logging them, and performing specified restart behavior (such as: oh, it failed. log that. try starting it. oh, it failed again, and within five minutes, so send a louder log message. Damn, it failed again! And within five minutes! Screw that, page the admin and stop trying). A powerful tool, although a lot more complex, and maps poorly into the breadth of services (and their management models) that we ship. Robert N M Watson FreeBSD Core Team, TrustedBSD Project robert@fledge.watson.org NAI Labs, Safeport Network Services On Thu, 14 Jun 2001, Robert Withrow wrote: > > clefevre-lists@noos.fr said: > :- oops, rc2 isn't started. too bad. > > I think that is exactly the desired design. The > RC *system* starts things correctly, but the manager, > *bypassing* the RC *system* can start and stop things > exactly as he wished. For debugging or whatever. > > I'd argue that if you want to start/stop a *subtree*, you > should ask the RC *system* to do that somehow. > > -- > Robert Withrow -- (+1 978 288 8256, ESN 248) > BWithrow@NortelNetworks.com > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 7:52:21 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from l04.research.kpn.com (l04.research.kpn.com [139.63.192.204]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2AA3637B408; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 07:52:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from K.J.Koster@kpn.com) Received: by l04.research.kpn.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:52:12 +0100 Message-ID: <59063B5B4D98D311BC0D0001FA7E452205FD9CAE@l04.research.kpn.com> From: "Koster, K.J." To: 'Robert Watson' , Robert Withrow Cc: Cyrille Lefevre , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: import NetBSD rc system Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:52:08 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Dear All, > > To do some of the hierarchal start/stop at runtime stuff, you > really need > a stateful rc system that stores its start/stop state in > /var/run/rc.d or > the like. In this way, the system could track various > activities and know > which dependencies were already started. > How about /var/run/{$deamon}.pid? Kees Jan ================================================ You are only young once, but you can stay immature all your life. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 8:46:13 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [204.156.12.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA72D37B407 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 08:45:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (robert@fledge.pr.watson.org [192.0.2.3]) by fledge.watson.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f5EFdbf27656; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:39:37 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:39:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Watson X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org To: "Koster, K.J." Cc: Robert Withrow , Cyrille Lefevre , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: <59063B5B4D98D311BC0D0001FA7E452205FD9CAE@l04.research.kpn.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 14 Jun 2001, Koster, K.J. wrote: > > To do some of the hierarchal start/stop at runtime stuff, you > > really need > > a stateful rc system that stores its start/stop state in > > /var/run/rc.d or > > the like. In this way, the system could track various > > activities and know > > which dependencies were already started. > > How about /var/run/{$deamon}.pid? So, one of the things I've always hated (and loved) about UNIX is the pid system. One of the problems I have with (foo).pid is that pid's are rapidly recycled, so if a daemon dies, there's no way to track that unless you're a parent process (wherein you can reliably get the exiting information via SIGCHLD and wait()). The same goes for using killall as the superuser to find and kill processes such as inetd by name: you can easily kill other things if there are user processes with the same name, etc. In my view, the only really reliable way to manage daemon processes is as the parent of the process. Unfortunately, changing to that model would be a time-consuming, compatibility-limiting process which will probably not prove feasible. Just as an example of some potential suffering: suppose your system creates and destroyes about 200 processes a second, as it's a fairly heavily loaded user and web server. Such as system takes about five and a half minutes to recycle the pid space. If your sendmail daemon has pid 238 (or some other low pid), and dies, it takes about five minutes for some other process to adopt pid 238. However, /var/run/sendmail.pid will still contain 238, as it wasn't cleaned up due to untimely death. Sending a HUP signal to 238 could do a number of nasty things, including logging you out if it's your SSH daemon :-). Using IPC to manage the daemon, in the style of newer named versions, works well as long as you know the daemon is still functional--certainly much better than signals, with the exception of forceful termination. Robert N M Watson FreeBSD Core Team, TrustedBSD Project robert@fledge.watson.org NAI Labs, Safeport Network Services To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 10: 8:46 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF92637B401 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 10:08:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5EH8Re24543; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 10:08:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 10:08:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106141708.f5EH8Re24543@earth.backplane.com> To: Terry Lambert Cc: Cejka Rudolf , David Malone , Peter Wemm , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: signal(SIGCHLD, SIG_IGN) patch solving SUSv2 compatibility issue References: <200106101845.f5AIje014790@earth.backplane.com> <20010611002050.362CE380E@overcee.netplex.com.au> <20010611115806.A53216@walton.maths.tcd.ie> <20010612095323.A72009@dcse.fee.vutbr.cz> <200106121638.f5CGcOo42940@earth.backplane.com> <3B285C40.6500519C@mindspring.com> <200106140657.f5E6v7i20197@earth.backplane.com> <3B2884C1.A938821A@mindspring.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Matt Dillon wrote: :> The issue here is first: since we are fixing a bug we might :> as well be as compatible as possible with other platforms and, :> second: on general principles it does make sense to keep SIG_IGN :> operation independant from the newer SA_NOCLDWAIT stuff. A program :> using SIG_IGN has absolutely no expectation that that use will :> effect the sigaction flags, so us modifying the sigaction flags :> accomplish absolutely nothing and could in fact be detrimental of :> some poor sod of a programmer writing code on a FreeBSD box actually :> started depending on the side effect. : :You made the point earlier about SIG_IGN vs. SIG_DFL, and :avoiding a side effect there. : : :The side effect here is similar: : :I set SIG_IGN sith signal(), then get the flags (which show a :zero), and then set them with sigaction() -- clearing the bit :that results in the implied side effect behaviour with SIG_IGN. : :Further, if I have historically depended upon being able to :seperately deal with SA_NOCLDWAIT so as to be able to reap :childgren whose STOP/CONT I wanted to ignore, then I am :now screwed, and have to handle all or none of them, and :there is nothing I can do to my source code to fix it, short :of adding STOP/CONT handlers and explicitly "handling" the :job control crap. Umm. Terry, I really have no idea what you are talking about. :> So I agree with Cejka - the first patch was pretty good but didn't :> quite hit the mark and now we have a new candidate patch that seems to :> cover all the bases, which David Malone is reviewing and will :> probably commit to -current (and me to stable afterwords). : :This breaks software which depends on the historical behaviour, :since there is no way to recover the historical behaviour, and :no way to know that you aren't recovering the historical :behaviour. What historical behavior? That FreeBSD was not properly dealing with SIG_IGN when every other UNIX does? So you are saying that your interest is in writing software that only works under FreeBSD? I'm sorry, I don't buy it. :At least with a SA_CLDWAIT flag, you could do the ignore and :you would get a compilation warning on half your programs (the :ones that used the now useless SA_NOCLDWAIT). Again, I have no idea what you are talking about here. Why would we want to introduce a non-standard flag? -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 10:20:54 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ringworld.nanolink.com (ringworld.nanolink.com [195.24.48.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 3306A37B407 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 10:20:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roam@orbitel.bg) Received: (qmail 53018 invoked by uid 1000); 14 Jun 2001 17:19:27 -0000 Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 20:19:27 +0300 From: Peter Pentchev To: Danny Braniss Cc: Warner Losh , Sheldon Hearn , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: rc, was: Re: Plan to import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010614201927.D729@ringworld.oblivion.bg> Mail-Followup-To: Danny Braniss , Warner Losh , Sheldon Hearn , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from danny@cs.huji.ac.il on Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 10:49:11AM +0300 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 10:49:11AM +0300, Danny Braniss wrote: > > > I've asked -ports before whether it is suitable to let ports startup scripts > > honor /etc/rc.conf{,.local} settings by sourcing /etc/defaults/rc.conf and > > then running a source_rc_confs (or whatever is appropriate). > > my suggestion: > > this is the 'modified' loop for the ${local_startup} in /etc/rc: > > case ${local_startup} in > [Nn][Oo] | '') > ;; > *) > echo -n 'Local package initialization:' > for dir in ${local_startup}; do > if [ -d "${dir}" ]; then > for script in ${dir}/*.sh; do > s=`basename ${script} .sh` > v=`eval echo '$'${s}_enable|dd conv=ucase` > if [ -x "${script}" -a ${v} = YES ]; then > (set -T > trap 'exit 1' 2 > ${script} start) > fi > done > fi > done > echo '.' > ;; > esac > > you just add: mysql_enable="YeS" OK, and what do I do if I want to manually start/stop the service later, and it needs variables defined in /etc/rc.conf{,local} ? G'luck, Peter -- This sentence would be seven words long if it were six words shorter. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 10:50:32 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from winston.osd.bsdi.com (adsl-64-173-15-98.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net [64.173.15.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA23937B408 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 10:50:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) Received: from localhost (jkh@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by winston.osd.bsdi.com (8.11.4/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5EHmnt39680; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 10:48:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) To: kevin.way@overtone.org Cc: drosih@rpi.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Re: import NetBSD rc system [summary] In-Reply-To: <200106140625.CAA16520@ns1.ecoutez.net> References: <200106140625.CAA16520@ns1.ecoutez.net> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.94.1 on Emacs 20.7 / Mule 4.0 (HANANOEN) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20010614104849C.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 10:48:49 -0700 From: Jordan Hubbard X-Dispatcher: imput version 20000228(IM140) Lines: 12 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I think that since we use CVS around here, we should simply import the first semi-working model and let the other committers dive in and commit their refinements as we go along. Up to now, this whole NetBSD rc thing has looked more like one of those baseball scenes were 5 people all yell "I got it!" and then either slam together in mid-field or all stand still looking stupid as the ball hits the ground in front of them. I've seen a lot of hands go up but I STILL haven't seen anything committed or even just a URL to some prototype bits to test. :( - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 11: 2:38 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns1.ecoutez.net (ns1.ecoutez.net [64.36.74.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3CAEE37B40B for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:02:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mosch@ns1.ecoutez.net) Received: (from mosch@localhost) by ns1.ecoutez.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA02246; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 14:02:08 -0400 Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 14:02:08 -0400 From: Kevin Way To: Cyrille Lefevre Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010614140208.A32012@ns1.ecoutez.net> References: <20010613202415.A3689@core.usrlib.org> <4rtjnv83.fsf@gits.dyndns.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <4rtjnv83.fsf@gits.dyndns.org>; from clefevre-lists@noos.fr on Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 01:42:36PM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > in fact, the require keyword isn't sufficient in it's own. there > should be pre_require and post_require keywords since nfsd needs to > start mountd before to start nfsd then rpc.statd and rpc.lockd have to > be started after nfsd. My answer to this, in the reasoning that NetBSD compatibility is important, so I'd rather not change anything unneccessarily, was to create a meta script... i don't have the code in front of me, but basically it went like this nfs: PROVIDE: nfs REQUIRE: nfsd statd lockd nfsd: PROVIDE nfsd REQUIRED portmap mountd statd: PROVIDE statd REQUIRE nfsd and so on, and so forth. If I understood your concern correctly, then this should take care of things nicely. My apologies for the typos, i'm typing on a freshly broken finger and haven't gotten quite used to it yet. Kevin Way To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 11:10:53 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dt051n37.san.rr.com (dt051n37.san.rr.com [204.210.32.55]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A41D937B403; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:10:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DougB@DougBarton.net) Received: from DougBarton.net (master [10.0.0.2]) by dt051n37.san.rr.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA98957; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:03:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DougB@DougBarton.net) Message-ID: <3B28FC70.1FC1F18B@DougBarton.net> Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:03:28 -0700 From: Doug Barton Organization: Triborough Bridge & Tunnel Authority X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.12 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Cyrille Lefevre Cc: Andrew Hesford , Gordon Tetlow , Jon Parise , Matt Dillon , Will Andrews , Warner Losh , Mark Santcroos , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, eivind@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: <20010613202415.A3689@core.usrlib.org> <4rtjnv83.fsf@gits.dyndns.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Cyrille Lefevre wrote: > in fact, the require keyword isn't sufficient in it's own. there > should be pre_require and post_require keywords since nfsd needs to > start mountd before to start nfsd then rpc.statd and rpc.lockd have to > be started after nfsd. Cyrille has already made two excellent points, gold stars for him. :) Before anyone gets too far down the road of making a direct port of the netbsd rc system please be advised that there have already been some discussions about exactly how we want to proceed. There are three factors that need to be addressed. First, there are some weaknesses in netbsd's system that we don't want to replicate. Second, Eivind has already done some excellent work in this area. Take a look at http://people.freebsd.org/~eivind/newrc.html for more info. Third, we want to gather the people who are interested in working on this project on a mailing list and have some conversations with the netbsd developers about what they would do differently if given the chance. We've already got Luke Mewburn on board for this, but his time is limited until after his presentation at USENIX on this topic is done. So, I'm glad that you're enthusiastic about this, and we definitely want to harness that enthusiasm. What I'd hate to see is you (pl.) putting a lot of work into something that we ultimately do not use. We have a really neat opportunity here to synergize something that will take advantage both of the hard work and experience of the netbsd team, and our own unique abilities and experience. I would hate to see that opportunity wasted. Doug -- If you're never wrong, you're not trying hard enough. Do YOU Yahoo!? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 11:17: 8 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wilma.widomaker.com (wilma.widomaker.com [204.17.220.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16B1A37B401 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:17:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from shannon@daydream.shannon.net) Received: from [206.246.249.178] (helo=escape.shannon.net) by wilma.widomaker.com with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #2) id 15Abfv-000BXe-00 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 14:16:59 -0400 Received: from daydream (daydream.shannon.net [192.168.1.10]) by escape.shannon.net (8.11.0/8.8.8) with ESMTP id f5EHtBe20241 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:55:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from shannon by daydream with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 15AbKj-00047H-00 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:55:05 -0400 Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:55:05 -0400 From: Shannon Hendrix To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010614135504.B13502@widomaker.com> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <200106141357.JAA27316@pobox.engeast.BayNetworks.COM> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200106141357.JAA27316@pobox.engeast.BayNetworks.COM> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.18i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 09:57:17AM -0400, Robert Withrow wrote: > > clefevre-lists@noos.fr said: > :- oops, rc2 isn't started. too bad. > > I think that is exactly the desired design. The > RC *system* starts things correctly, but the manager, > *bypassing* the RC *system* can start and stop things > exactly as he wished. For debugging or whatever. > > I'd argue that if you want to start/stop a *subtree*, you > should ask the RC *system* to do that somehow. I think also, that you want to be careful about forcing dependencies. There are times when I start one service even though it has a dependency. It might be the prerequisite is only needed for a certain function you can do without. I'm sure you can think of other examples. So, how about an option to the rc.d scripts to ignore the dependencies for those times when you don't want them? Also, NetBSD doesn't seem to formalize chaining to /usr/pkg/etc/rc.d or /usr/local/etc/rc.d, unless I missed that. -- "We have nothing to prove" -- Alan Dawkins ______________________________________________________________________ Charles Shannon Hendrix s h a n n o n @ w i d o m a k e r . c o m To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 11:21:12 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from harmony.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FF5D37B401; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:21:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5EIEOV15979; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 12:14:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Message-Id: <200106141814.f5EIEOV15979@harmony.village.org> To: Doug Barton Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Cc: Cyrille Lefevre , Andrew Hesford , Gordon Tetlow , Jon Parise , Matt Dillon , Will Andrews , Mark Santcroos , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, eivind@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:03:28 PDT." <3B28FC70.1FC1F18B@DougBarton.net> References: <3B28FC70.1FC1F18B@DougBarton.net> <20010613202415.A3689@core.usrlib.org> <4rtjnv83.fsf@gits.dyndns.org> Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 12:14:24 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <3B28FC70.1FC1F18B@DougBarton.net> Doug Barton writes: : > in fact, the require keyword isn't sufficient in it's own. there : > should be pre_require and post_require keywords since nfsd needs to : > start mountd before to start nfsd then rpc.statd and rpc.lockd have to : > be started after nfsd. : : Cyrille has already made two excellent points, gold stars for him. :) But Cyrille's point isn't very good. nfsd doesn't need rpc.statd to start. To get the "thing" known as "nfs server" you have to start things, but that's different than just nfsd. There's now *NEED* to do that. It is a kludge that breaks the symetry of the NetBSD system for little gain other than being different. and that's a big lose. Also, the whole idea of adding "requires" and "provides" code is really bad. The whole reason that NetBSD has these listed as keywords in comments is so that you can grep them out without having to start 2 sheels per shell script to find these things otu. They had an eary verison of this that was so slow they shit canned that part of the it (or maybe it was just back of the envelope calcs that killed the idea before it was implemented). This means that we can make it work on the low end systems, and NetBSD's boot won't take forever on small systems. : First, there are some weaknesses in netbsd's : system that we don't want to replicate. Speficially, what are these? : Second, Eivind has already done : some excellent work in this area. Take a look at : http://people.freebsd.org/~eivind/newrc.html for more info. With all due respect to Eivind, he's reinventing the wheel. I'd like to see NetBSD's brought in with an absolute minimum of change. : Third, we want : to gather the people who are interested in working on this project on a : mailing list and have some conversations with the netbsd developers about : what they would do differently if given the chance. We've already got Luke : Mewburn on board for this, but his time is limited until after his : presentation at USENIX on this topic is done. I'd be happy to spend up to 20 hours working on this project. However, I don't want to spend 20 hours sniping and carping about how bad NetBSD's system is before it even gets ported. I'd do the port, to the point it is ready to import and provide diffs for people to try. But I don't want to get in the middle of a pissing match to tweak the thing to the point that we can't reimport later work by NetBSD or produces soemthing that Luke will hate. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 11:59:17 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.webmonster.de (datasink.webmonster.de [194.162.162.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 204BC37B401 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:58:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from karsten@rohrbach.de) Received: (qmail 51615 invoked by uid 1000); 14 Jun 2001 18:59:16 -0000 Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 20:59:16 +0200 From: "Karsten W. Rohrbach" To: Peter Pentchev Cc: Danny Braniss , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: rc, was: Re: Plan to import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010614205916.D49807@mail.webmonster.de> Mail-Followup-To: "Karsten W. Rohrbach" , Peter Pentchev , Danny Braniss , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <20010614201927.D729@ringworld.oblivion.bg> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="6e7ZaeXHKrTJCxdu" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010614201927.D729@ringworld.oblivion.bg>; from roam@orbitel.bg on Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 08:19:27PM +0300 X-Arbitrary-Number-Of-The-Day: 42 X-URL: http://www.webmonster.de/ X-Disclaimer: My opinions do not necessarily represent those of my employer Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --6e7ZaeXHKrTJCxdu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Peter Pentchev(roam@orbitel.bg)@2001.06.14 20:19:27 +0000: > OK, and what do I do if I want to manually start/stop the service later, > and it needs variables defined in /etc/rc.conf{,local} ? if [ x${_RC_CONF} !=3D x1 ]; then . /etc/rc.conf; fi in the beginning of the local startup script? if it really requires it, it could plainly source it in the beginning, or selectively using the above if statement when /etc/defaults/rc.conf would do _RC_CONF=3D1; export _RC_CONF that's not a very good idea, but it would - at least - fix the behaviour to be the right way. please read on... what i dislike most of the complex local invocation method described in the mail referred, is the amount of subprocesses spawned by backticks. i see that there are not many people on very small or even embedded systems but a lot of subprocesses tend to be a real pain in the ass on slow boxes. imagine a local_startup dir with let's say 10 .sh files. with basename, echo in a backticked subshell and dd invocations you will catch execution overhead of 30(!) processes you do not really need. i think that this is a specific thing about freebsd, being able to run on really pathologic (speak: badly outdated) hardware and start up into multiuser mode in under 30 seconds. try it... start up an out of the box redhat linux on a pentium-60 with 32mb ram. although this box is capable of being a very efficient isdn router/firewall/application proxy, it won't start up very fast (eg. over 2 minutes for a reboot) sorry danny, these are just my EUR0.02 /k --=20 > What do you want to re-install today? KR433/KR11-RIPE -- WebMonster Community Founder -- nGENn GmbH Senior Techie http://www.webmonster.de/ -- ftp://ftp.webmonster.de/ -- http://www.ngenn.n= et/ karsten&rohrbach.de -- alpha&ngenn.net -- alpha&scene.org -- catch@spam.de GnuPG 0x2964BF46 2001-03-15 42F9 9FFF 50D4 2F38 DBEE DF22 3340 4F4E 2964 B= F46 --6e7ZaeXHKrTJCxdu Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (FreeBSD) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE7KQmEM0BPTilkv0YRAq9FAJ43hR7cZ9SugP5LTKxZg5Jsw+5+4gCcDiy9 tDDA9vwmav+qLXZBWj1pjeQ= =VXed -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --6e7ZaeXHKrTJCxdu-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 12: 1:17 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com (sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com [209.247.77.155]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0D7B137B401; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 12:01:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gordont@bluemtn.net) Received: from localhost (gordont@localhost) by sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com (8.11.3/8.11.2/BMA1.1) with ESMTP id f5EIvIx43952; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:57:18 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:57:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Gordon Tetlow X-X-Sender: To: Warner Losh Cc: Doug Barton , Cyrille Lefevre , Andrew Hesford , Jon Parise , Matt Dillon , Will Andrews , Mark Santcroos , , , Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: <200106141814.f5EIEOV15979@harmony.village.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 14 Jun 2001, Warner Losh wrote: > With all due respect to Eivind, he's reinventing the wheel. I'd like > to see NetBSD's brought in with an absolute minimum of change. Along those lines, I'm typing on my laptop that is using the scripts that I have ported over... I've only gotten it up to network initialization. From diving through it all, there will be a fair amount of departure from the NetBSD stuff at least up through network init. This is just due to the inherent differences in the OSs. Where there was departure, I took the current FreeBSD boot scripts and turned them into modules so as to make it very similar to the current system. I've also made some (slight) changes to the boot order. Mostly just formalizing the lock step nature of things. I did make one change that I think will be helpful, I moved pccard initialization to before the mounting of /usr (but after mounting /var). This way people can use pccard for mounting filesystems from /etc/fstab which I don't think you can do now. Anyone have any objections to this move? it would require moving pccardd and pccardc to /sbin, but that should be it. Other than that, I made the (rash) assumption that /var is local storage, which simplifies things greatly. That makes it diskless un-friendly, but we've always been unfriendly to diskless anyway.... I'll see about porting the rest of the scripts to get it as close to a fully working system as possible, I think it should go rather quickly. I hope to have patches up tomorrow for people to play with. -gordon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 12: 3: 5 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix, from userid 664) id A0DC237B405; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 12:03:02 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 12:03:02 -0700 From: David O'Brien To: kevin.way@overtone.org, drosih@rpi.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Re: import NetBSD rc system [summary] Message-ID: <20010614120302.A2925@hub.freebsd.org> Reply-To: obrien@freebsd.org References: <200106140625.CAA16520@ns1.ecoutez.net> <20010614104849C.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010614104849C.jkh@osd.bsdi.com>; from jkh@osd.bsdi.com on Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 10:48:49AM -0700 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.3-STABLE Organization: The NUXI BSD group X-Pgp-Rsa-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Rsa-Keyid: 1024/34F9F9D5 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 10:48:49AM -0700, Jordan Hubbard wrote: > I think that since we use CVS around here, we should simply import the Some time tonight I will be vendor importing the NetBSD rc system. (no it will not be functional at that time). I am doing this to help the various efforts that are working on this so they can pass round patches vs. entire files. Doing the vendor import will also help remind us the goal here is to adopt the NetBSD RC system -- not go off and have a second syndrome party, or other results of NIH. Once the vendor import is done, we can coordinate with the NetBSD folks the minor changes that FreeBSD will require to use their system. There may be places where the NetBSD RC system could doing things better, but the ongoing relationship we can create with NetBSD is something far more valuable than a few efficiency/functionality tweaks. If we do find short comings we should resolve them by working with the NetBSD guys. With any hope, maybe BSD/OS could pick up this RC system also. ** ** I ask that no one commit to NetBSD RC files until diffs have been ** posted on arch@freebsd.org for review and we have agreement ** ** that the change is necessary. ** -- -- David (obrien@FreeBSD.org) Disclaimer: Not speaking for Wind River systems. I am making no claims or promises about BSD/OS. I am speaking purely with a FreeBSD hat on, stating a "wouldn't it be nice" prase. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 12: 5: 1 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ringworld.nanolink.com (ringworld.nanolink.com [195.24.48.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 288C037B406 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 12:04:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roam@orbitel.bg) Received: (qmail 71773 invoked by uid 1000); 14 Jun 2001 19:03:32 -0000 Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:03:32 +0300 From: Peter Pentchev To: "Karsten W. Rohrbach" , Danny Braniss , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: rc, was: Re: Plan to import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010614220332.A71730@ringworld.oblivion.bg> Mail-Followup-To: "Karsten W. Rohrbach" , Danny Braniss , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <20010614201927.D729@ringworld.oblivion.bg> <20010614205916.D49807@mail.webmonster.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010614205916.D49807@mail.webmonster.de>; from karsten@rohrbach.de on Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 08:59:16PM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 08:59:16PM +0200, Karsten W. Rohrbach wrote: > Peter Pentchev(roam@orbitel.bg)@2001.06.14 20:19:27 +0000: > > OK, and what do I do if I want to manually start/stop the service later, > > and it needs variables defined in /etc/rc.conf{,local} ? > > if [ x${_RC_CONF} != x1 ]; then . /etc/rc.conf; fi > > in the beginning of the local startup script? > if it really requires it, it could plainly source it in the beginning, > or selectively using the above if statement when /etc/defaults/rc.conf > would do _RC_CONF=1; export _RC_CONF > > that's not a very good idea, but it would - at least - fix the behaviour > to be the right way. please read on... Not really; it's a great start, but something like.. if [ -z "$_RC_CONF" ]; then . /etc/defaults/rc.conf if type source_rc_confs | fgrep "shell function" > /dev/null; then source_rc_confs else rc_conf_files=${rc_conf_files-'/etc/rc.conf /etc/rc.conf.local'} for i in $rc_conf_files; do if [ -r "$i" ]; then . "$i" fi done fi _RC_CONF=1 # just in case.. fi ..would do the trick better :) G'luck, Peter -- I am not the subject of this sentence. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 12:10:31 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ringworld.nanolink.com (ringworld.nanolink.com [195.24.48.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 3EDA837B406 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 12:10:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roam@orbitel.bg) Received: (qmail 71960 invoked by uid 1000); 14 Jun 2001 19:08:48 -0000 Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:08:48 +0300 From: Peter Pentchev To: David O'Brien Cc: kevin.way@overtone.org, drosih@rpi.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Re: import NetBSD rc system [summary] Message-ID: <20010614220848.B71730@ringworld.oblivion.bg> Mail-Followup-To: David O'Brien , kevin.way@overtone.org, drosih@rpi.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <200106140625.CAA16520@ns1.ecoutez.net> <20010614104849C.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> <20010614120302.A2925@hub.freebsd.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010614120302.A2925@hub.freebsd.org>; from obrien@FreeBSD.ORG on Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 12:03:02PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 12:03:02PM -0700, David O'Brien wrote: > On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 10:48:49AM -0700, Jordan Hubbard wrote: > > I think that since we use CVS around here, we should simply import the > > Some time tonight I will be vendor importing the NetBSD rc system. > (no it will not be functional at that time). > > I am doing this to help the various efforts that are working on this so > they can pass round patches vs. entire files. Erm.. Sheldon Hearn has expressed a desire to discuss things with Luke Mewburn in the hope of coming to some mutual agreement as to directions and improvements. Have you discussed this vendor import of the current NetBSD RC system with him? Wouldn't it be better to wait until Luke himself says something about the possible future directions the common RC system might want to take? G'luck, Peter -- What would this sentence be like if it weren't self-referential? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 12:35: 5 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.huji.ac.il (cs.huji.ac.il [132.65.16.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 34E4437B407 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 12:34:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from danny@cs.huji.ac.il) Received: from sexta.cs.huji.ac.il ([132.65.16.13] ident=exim) by cs.huji.ac.il with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15ActF-0006Lh-00; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:34:49 +0300 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=sexta.cs.huji.ac.il ident=danny) by sexta.cs.huji.ac.il with esmtp (Exim 3.15 #1) id 15ActE-0006Vf-00; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:34:48 +0300 X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with nmh-0.24 To: "Karsten W. Rohrbach" , Peter Pentchev , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: rc, was: Re: Plan to import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: Message from Peter Pentchev of "Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:03:32 +0300." <20010614220332.A71730@ringworld.oblivion.bg> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:34:48 +0300 From: Danny Braniss Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG the idea is to modify /etc/rc to not start stuff in /usr/local/etc/rc.d blindly, and just 'extrapolate' rc.conf. you can still start/stop the /usr/local/etc/rc.d/*.sh to your heart content, i didn't propose changing them, though modifying mysql-server.sh to mysql_server.sh would make things easier :-) i agree, there is nothing more boring than waiting for linux to come up, or windows, but there is a real problem to solve if one has several boxes sharing /usr/local and you don't (i certainly don't want) all of them starting as mysql servers or whatever happens to be there. btw, the check for xxx_enable can also enable/disable by say, ${local_enable_check} or something, so that the default/old behaviour is kept. one of the things that i liked most about unix, was that it didn't have to be backward compatible (heh, i've been around that long?) danny To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 12:38:48 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dragon.nuxi.com (trang.nuxi.com [206.40.252.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E16BA37B40C for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 12:38:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: (from obrien@localhost) by dragon.nuxi.com (8.11.3/8.11.1) id f5EJbrC76557; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 12:37:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 12:37:53 -0700 From: "David O'Brien" To: kevin.way@overtone.org, drosih@rpi.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Re: import NetBSD rc system [summary] Message-ID: <20010614123753.I75022@dragon.nuxi.com> Reply-To: obrien@FreeBSD.ORG References: <200106140625.CAA16520@ns1.ecoutez.net> <20010614104849C.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> <20010614120302.A2925@hub.freebsd.org> <20010614220848.B71730@ringworld.oblivion.bg> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010614220848.B71730@ringworld.oblivion.bg>; from roam@orbitel.bg on Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 10:08:48PM +0300 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 5.0-CURRENT Organization: The NUXI BSD group X-Pgp-Rsa-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Rsa-Keyid: 1024/34F9F9D5 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 10:08:48PM +0300, Peter Pentchev wrote: > > Some time tonight I will be vendor importing the NetBSD rc system. > > (no it will not be functional at that time). > > Erm.. Sheldon Hearn has expressed a desire to discuss things with Luke > Mewburn in the hope of coming to some mutual agreement as to directions > and improvements. My actions in no way changes Sheldon's efforts. In fact it helps them. We will have a way to see proposed changes in the form of a diff. This makes it easy to see where we are deviating from the NetBSD RC system. It also gives Sheldon the diff to send to Luke for discussion. If Luke agrees and makes a change in the NetBSD RC sources, we will get the fruits of Sheldon's effort on the next vendor import. -- -- David (obrien@FreeBSD.org) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 12:44:30 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from core.usrlib.org (CC2-861.charter-stl.com [24.217.115.99]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7C9D37B406; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 12:44:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ajh3@core.usrlib.org) Received: by core.usrlib.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id C7880A875; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 14:42:45 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 14:42:45 -0500 From: Andrew Hesford To: Gordon Tetlow Cc: Warner Losh , Doug Barton , Cyrille Lefevre , Jon Parise , Matt Dillon , Will Andrews , Mark Santcroos , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, eivind@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010614144245.A7853@core.usrlib.org> References: <200106141814.f5EIEOV15979@harmony.village.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from gordont@bluemtn.net on Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 11:57:18AM -0700 X-Loop: Andrew Hesford Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 11:57:18AM -0700, Gordon Tetlow wrote: > On Thu, 14 Jun 2001, Warner Losh wrote: > > > With all due respect to Eivind, he's reinventing the wheel. I'd like > > to see NetBSD's brought in with an absolute minimum of change. > > Along those lines, I'm typing on my laptop that is using the scripts that > I have ported over... I've only gotten it up to network initialization. > > >From diving through it all, there will be a fair amount of departure from > the NetBSD stuff at least up through network init. This is just due to the > inherent differences in the OSs. Where there was departure, I took the > current FreeBSD boot scripts and turned them into modules so as to make it > very similar to the current system. > > I've also made some (slight) changes to the boot order. Mostly just > formalizing the lock step nature of things. I did make one change that I > think will be helpful, I moved pccard initialization to before the > mounting of /usr (but after mounting /var). This way people can use pccard > for mounting filesystems from /etc/fstab which I don't think you can do > now. Anyone have any objections to this move? it would require moving > pccardd and pccardc to /sbin, but that should be it. Other than that, I > made the (rash) assumption that /var is local storage, which simplifies > things greatly. That makes it diskless un-friendly, but we've always been > unfriendly to diskless anyway.... > > I'll see about porting the rest of the scripts to get it as close to a > fully working system as possible, I think it should go rather quickly. I > hope to have patches up tomorrow for people to play with. > > -gordon Wow, this is the thread that won't die. I take objection to the moving of pccard before mounting /usr. It works just fine for those who place /var on the same partition as /, but for guys like me, it means you are mounting /var at a different time than other filesystems. I think that, for cohesiveness and sanity, all filesystems should be mounted at the same time, with the mount script simply calling `mount -a`. Otherwise, we have to wory about mount-var.sh and mount-rest.sh. If we want to mount pccard stuff from fstab, we should do something like the smbfs script does. Then we can have a mount-local.sh and mount-pccard.sh script, which is a bit more sane. -- Andrew Hesford ajh3@usrlib.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 13: 1: 8 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns1.ecoutez.net (ns1.ecoutez.net [64.36.74.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A7B137B407 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:01:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mosch@ns1.ecoutez.net) Received: (from mosch@localhost) by ns1.ecoutez.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA17019; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:01:51 -0400 Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:01:51 -0400 From: Kevin Way To: Shannon Hendrix Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010614160151.A16836@ns1.ecoutez.net> References: <200106141357.JAA27316@pobox.engeast.BayNetworks.COM> <20010614135504.B13502@widomaker.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <20010614135504.B13502@widomaker.com>; from shannon@widomaker.com on Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 01:55:05PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Also, NetBSD doesn't seem to formalize chaining to /usr/pkg/etc/rc.d or > /usr/local/etc/rc.d, unless I missed that. packages are given startup space in /etc/rc.conf.d/$command, where $command is setby the first argument to load_rc_config. -Kevin Way To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 13: 4:37 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com (sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com [209.247.77.155]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4AD7C37B401; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:04:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gordont@bluemtn.net) Received: from localhost (gordont@localhost) by sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com (8.11.3/8.11.2/BMA1.1) with ESMTP id f5EK0Mq53609; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:00:22 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:00:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Gordon Tetlow X-X-Sender: To: Andrew Hesford Cc: Warner Losh , Doug Barton , Cyrille Lefevre , Jon Parise , Matt Dillon , Will Andrews , Mark Santcroos , , , Subject: Boot Order (was Re: import NetBSD rc system) In-Reply-To: <20010614144245.A7853@core.usrlib.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 14 Jun 2001, Andrew Hesford wrote: > On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 11:57:18AM -0700, Gordon Tetlow wrote: > > > > I've also made some (slight) changes to the boot order. Mostly just > > formalizing the lock step nature of things. I did make one change that I > > think will be helpful, I moved pccard initialization to before the > > mounting of /usr (but after mounting /var). This way people can use pccard > > for mounting filesystems from /etc/fstab which I don't think you can do > > now. Anyone have any objections to this move? it would require moving > > pccardd and pccardc to /sbin, but that should be it. Other than that, I > > made the (rash) assumption that /var is local storage, which simplifies > > things greatly. That makes it diskless un-friendly, but we've always been > > unfriendly to diskless anyway.... > > Wow, this is the thread that won't die. > > I take objection to the moving of pccard before mounting /usr. It works > just fine for those who place /var on the same partition as /, but for > guys like me, it means you are mounting /var at a different time than > other filesystems. I think that, for cohesiveness and sanity, all > filesystems should be mounted at the same time, with the mount script > simply calling `mount -a`. Otherwise, we have to wory about mount-var.sh > and mount-rest.sh. That's fine, it was just an idea. So... should it go: mount root mount local (which will have to include /var) network init (things like dhclient which need /var) remote filesystems A little bit of a chicken and an egg problem. I'm trying to design these scripts with the notion of being as versatile as possible, I don't want the diskless folks to have to jump through lots of hops to get their stuff working, and if one set of people are going to be using dhclient, it's probably going to be them. > If we want to mount pccard stuff from fstab, we should do something like > the smbfs script does. Then we can have a mount-local.sh and > mount-pccard.sh script, which is a bit more sane. Not really as it's not a particular filesystem type that can't be mounted (like smbfs) but a block device that's just missing. I suppose with DEVFS, you could do some magic in mount, but if a filesystem is missing (and mount doesn't know why), you are going to get an error on boot and drop to single user. I could see a new field in /etc/fstab (like noauto) called discon which will mount a drive if it is there and not complain (maybe just a warning "/zip/drive isn't connected") if it isn't. Any other thoughts? -gordon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 13:30: 6 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns1.ecoutez.net (ns1.ecoutez.net [64.36.74.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EA4837B406 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:29:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mosch@ns1.ecoutez.net) Received: (from mosch@localhost) by ns1.ecoutez.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA20189; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:30:40 -0400 Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:30:39 -0400 From: Kevin Way To: Doug Barton Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010614163039.B16836@ns1.ecoutez.net> References: <20010613202415.A3689@core.usrlib.org> <4rtjnv83.fsf@gits.dyndns.org> <3B28FC70.1FC1F18B@DougBarton.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <3B28FC70.1FC1F18B@DougBarton.net>; from DougB@DougBarton.net on Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 11:03:28AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > First, there are some weaknesses in netbsd's system that we don't want > to replicate. Are these identified yet? > Second, Eivind has already done some excellent work in this area. I'm guessing this code dates to before the new NetBSD startup system. It almost looks like this could've been proof-of-concept code for the NetBSD startup code that I've been staring at for the past few hours. It lacks some of the refinement and flexibility of the NetBSD code though. He does have an excellent requirements doc though, which is definitely a keeper. > Third, we want to gather the people who are interested in working on this > project on a mailing list... If you're heading up the mailing list, please put me on it. I'm interested in helping with the initial port and future maintainance of this, as may be evidenced by an extreme overabundance of posts by me on this subject. (my apologies to the innocents who don't care at all about this thread) For the moment, I'm continuing with my own local port, with the full knowledge that my code may end up being an intellectual exercise. I'll post code as soon as I can verify that it's at least to the 'works for me' stage. Kevin Way To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 13:35:28 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com (sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com [209.247.77.155]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2565137B405 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:35:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gordont@bluemtn.net) Received: from localhost (gordont@localhost) by sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com (8.11.3/8.11.2/BMA1.1) with ESMTP id f5EKWCU58107; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:32:12 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:32:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Gordon Tetlow X-X-Sender: To: Kevin Way Cc: Shannon Hendrix , Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: <20010614160151.A16836@ns1.ecoutez.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 14 Jun 2001, Kevin Way wrote: > > Also, NetBSD doesn't seem to formalize chaining to /usr/pkg/etc/rc.d or > > /usr/local/etc/rc.d, unless I missed that. > > packages are given startup space in /etc/rc.conf.d/$command, where > $command is setby the first argument to load_rc_config. I like the notion that everything in /usr/local is self-contained in /usr/local and as such, all the startup stuff should only rely on the /etc/rc.subr at most. I just had a good notion that maybe there should be a /usr/local/etc/rc.d/rc.conf (or something similar). Packages (with the notable exception of X) should avoid putting stuff into /etc, it makes people that nfs mount /usr/local a real PITA. -gordon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 13:49:15 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.noos.fr (descartes.noos.net [212.198.2.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F03137B403 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:49:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from clefevre@redirect.to) Received: (qmail 3156516 invoked by uid 0); 14 Jun 2001 20:49:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gits.dyndns.org) ([212.198.228.81]) (envelope-sender ) by 212.198.2.74 (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 14 Jun 2001 20:49:08 -0000 Received: (from root@localhost) by gits.dyndns.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5EKn0M97731; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:49:01 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from clefevre@redirect.to) To: Warner Losh Cc: Doug Barton , Cyrille Lefevre , Andrew Hesford , Gordon Tetlow , Jon Parise , Matt Dillon , Will Andrews , Mark Santcroos , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, eivind@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: <3B28FC70.1FC1F18B@DougBarton.net> <20010613202415.A3689@core.usrlib.org> <4rtjnv83.fsf@gits.dyndns.org> <200106141814.f5EIEOV15979@harmony.village.org> X-Face: V|+c;4!|B?E%BE^{E6);aI.[<97Zd*>^#%Y5Cxv;%Y[PT-LW3;A:fRrJ8+^k"e7@+30g0YD0*^^3jgyShN7o?a]C la*Zv'5NA,=963bM%J^o]C Reply-To: Cyrille Lefevre In-Reply-To: <200106141814.f5EIEOV15979@harmony.village.org> Mail-Copies-To: never From: Cyrille Lefevre Date: 14 Jun 2001 22:48:59 +0200 Message-ID: Lines: 68 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Warner Losh writes: > In message <3B28FC70.1FC1F18B@DougBarton.net> Doug Barton writes: > : > in fact, the require keyword isn't sufficient in it's own. there > : > should be pre_require and post_require keywords since nfsd needs to > : > start mountd before to start nfsd then rpc.statd and rpc.lockd have to > : > be started after nfsd. > : > : Cyrille has already made two excellent points, gold stars for him. :) > > But Cyrille's point isn't very good. nfsd doesn't need rpc.statd to > start. To get the "thing" known as "nfs server" you have to start of course, this was just an example. this assertion could be true for every service you want to stop/start automagically our manually. consider a machine w/ nfs started manually. it's pretty cool to just say /etc/rc.d/nfsd (or whatever is it's named) start whether or not rpbbind is started and see rpcbind started and so on. > things, but that's different than just nfsd. There's now *NEED* to do > that. It is a kludge that breaks the symetry of the NetBSD system for if there's no NEED to do that, there's almost no NEED to switch from a monolitic rc framework to something else if the life is not easier. > little gain other than being different. and that's a big lose. > > Also, the whole idea of adding "requires" and "provides" code is > really bad. The whole reason that NetBSD has these listed as keywords > in comments is so that you can grep them out without having to start 2 > sheels per shell script to find these things otu. They had an eary this is implementation detail. ok, in this quick and dirty example, I use $() (aka `) but it's easy to get rid of them. I'm also pretty sure than forking a subshell has no more cost than forking rcorder. it one word, this is a bad argument :) > version of this that was so slow they shit canned that part of the it > (or maybe it was just back of the envelope calcs that killed the idea > before it was implemented). This means that we can make it work on > the low end systems, and NetBSD's boot won't take forever on small > systems. > > : First, there are some weaknesses in netbsd's > : system that we don't want to replicate. > > Speficially, what are these? at least, the inability to start a subsystem and it's dependencies. > I'd be happy to spend up to 20 hours working on this project. > However, I don't want to spend 20 hours sniping and carping about how > bad NetBSD's system is before it even gets ported. I'd do the port, I'm not waying NetBSD rc framework is bad, I'm just saying it is incomplete. I'm almost sure NetBSD guys would be interrested by such enhancement to their framework. as you know, every BSD systems are getting the bast of other BSD systems :P > to the point it is ready to import and provide diffs for people to > try. But I don't want to get in the middle of a pissing match to > tweak the thing to the point that we can't reimport later work by > NetBSD or produces soemthing that Luke will hate. Cyrille. -- home: mailto:clefevre@redirect.to UNIX is user-friendly; it's just particular work: mailto:Cyrille.Lefevre@edf.fr about who it chooses to be friends with. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 14: 0:24 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.noos.fr (claudel.noos.net [212.198.2.83]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5ED3537B406 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 14:00:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from clefevre@redirect.to) Received: (qmail 3376640 invoked by uid 0); 14 Jun 2001 21:00:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gits.dyndns.org) ([212.198.228.81]) (envelope-sender ) by 212.198.2.83 (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 14 Jun 2001 21:00:17 -0000 Received: (from root@localhost) by gits.dyndns.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5EL0DF98033; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 23:00:13 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from clefevre@redirect.to) To: Robert Watson Cc: "Koster, K.J." , Robert Withrow , Cyrille Lefevre , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: X-Face: V|+c;4!|B?E%BE^{E6);aI.[<97Zd*>^#%Y5Cxv;%Y[PT-LW3;A:fRrJ8+^k"e7@+30g0YD0*^^3jgyShN7o?a]C la*Zv'5NA,=963bM%J^o]C Reply-To: Cyrille Lefevre In-Reply-To: Mail-Copies-To: never From: Cyrille Lefevre Date: 14 Jun 2001 23:00:12 +0200 Message-ID: Lines: 53 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Robert Watson writes: > On Thu, 14 Jun 2001, Koster, K.J. wrote: > [snip] > > How about /var/run/{$deamon}.pid? > > So, one of the things I've always hated (and loved) about UNIX is the pid > system. One of the problems I have with (foo).pid is that pid's are > rapidly recycled, so if a daemon dies, there's no way to track that unless > you're a parent process (wherein you can reliably get the exiting > information via SIGCHLD and wait()). The same goes for using killall as > the superuser to find and kill processes such as inetd by name: you can > easily kill other things if there are user processes with the same name, > etc. In my view, the only really reliable way to manage daemon processes > is as the parent of the process. Unfortunately, changing to that model > would be a time-consuming, compatibility-limiting process which will > probably not prove feasible. I'm currently enhancing the ps command to SUSV2 specifications and more. this will allow you to find a process by both matching on it's name and pid such as : # SUSV2=1 ./ps -C getty PID TT TIME COMMAND 1814 v1 00:00:00 getty 1815 v2 00:00:00 getty 1816 v3 00:00:00 getty # SUSV2=1 ./ps -C getty -p 1814 PID TT TIME COMMAND 1814 v1 00:00:00 getty # SUSV2=1 ./ps -C getty -p 1818 PID TT TIME COMMAND hope this could be usefull is such case. it's also possible to enhance killall to work the same way for safety reason. > you out if it's your SSH daemon :-). Using IPC to manage the daemon, in > the style of newer named versions, works well as long as you know the > daemon is still functional--certainly much better than signals, with the > exception of forceful termination. also, there is the way AIX is going for a long time now using the srcmstr daemon to manage (start, stop, list, etc.) other daemons. http://www.rs6000.ibm.com/doc_link/en_US/a_doc_lib/aixbman/admnconc/sys_res_overview.htm#A2729f9 Cyrille. -- home: mailto:clefevre@redirect.to UNIX is user-friendly; it's just particular work: mailto:Cyrille.Lefevre@edf.fr about who it chooses to be friends with. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 14:11:10 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.noos.fr (racine.noos.net [212.198.2.71]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D67437B40B for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 14:10:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from clefevre@redirect.to) Received: (qmail 3086533 invoked by uid 0); 14 Jun 2001 21:10:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gits.dyndns.org) ([212.198.228.81]) (envelope-sender ) by 212.198.2.71 (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 14 Jun 2001 21:10:52 -0000 Received: (from root@localhost) by gits.dyndns.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5ELAMu98323; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 23:10:22 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from clefevre@redirect.to) To: Jordan Hubbard Cc: kevin.way@overtone.org, drosih@rpi.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system [summary] References: <200106140625.CAA16520@ns1.ecoutez.net> <20010614104849C.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> X-Face: V|+c;4!|B?E%BE^{E6);aI.[<97Zd*>^#%Y5Cxv;%Y[PT-LW3;A:fRrJ8+^k"e7@+30g0YD0*^^3jgyShN7o?a]C la*Zv'5NA,=963bM%J^o]C Reply-To: Cyrille Lefevre In-Reply-To: <20010614104849C.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Mail-Copies-To: never From: Cyrille Lefevre Date: 14 Jun 2001 23:10:22 +0200 Message-ID: Lines: 17 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jordan Hubbard writes: > ground in front of them. I've seen a lot of hands go up but I STILL > haven't seen anything committed or even just a URL to some prototype > bits to test. :( before coding anything, it's a common usage to know the way to go. for instance, I'm not sure there is a consensus about the way to follow. except if the consensus is just : ok, grab the NetBSD framework, cut and past things from FreeBSD files to NetBSD files, and go. this could be done in a few hours by almost anybody, but, IMHO, is a waste of time until a good way is defined. Cyrille. -- home: mailto:clefevre@redirect.to UNIX is user-friendly; it's just particular work: mailto:Cyrille.Lefevre@edf.fr about who it chooses to be friends with. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 14:39:11 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from stlaurent.mindstep.com (stlaurent.mindstep.com [216.18.127.174]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F64037B403 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 14:39:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from patrick@netzuno.com) Received: from grouch (grouch.local.mindstep.com [192.168.0.10]) by zunobox.local.mindstep.com (Postfix) with SMTP id D3A129913 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 17:39:07 -0400 (EDT) From: "Patrick Bihan-Faou" To: Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 17:38:36 -0400 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ""Koster, K.J."" wrote in message news:<59063B5B4D98D311BC0D0001FA7E452205FD9CAE@l04.research.kpn.com>... > Dear All, > > > > > To do some of the hierarchal start/stop at runtime stuff, you > > really need > > a stateful rc system that stores its start/stop state in > > /var/run/rc.d or > > the like. In this way, the system could track various > > activities and know > > which dependencies were already started. > > > How about /var/run/{$deamon}.pid? > Or better yet, leave each independent script the responsibility of knowing its own state. I am assuming that the various rc.d scripts must have well defined entry points (i.e. start|stop|restart), adding a "status" entry point would solve this issue. I implemented something more or less similar to the netbsd rc system once (I did it in perl however). This system tracked the dependencies and the states of each services. And the state tracking proved to be the worst part. This is why I would suggest to leave the service state tracking to the service scripts themselves. This is far easier to implement at that level than at a global level. Of course the "status" (or whatever name is suitable) call must have well defined return values; 0 -> running and happy 1 -> not started ... Patrick. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 15:15:11 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com (sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com [209.247.77.155]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1EE237B407; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 15:15:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gordont@bluemtn.net) Received: from localhost (gordont@localhost) by sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com (8.11.3/8.11.2/BMA1.1) with ESMTP id f5EM9vw71190; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 15:09:57 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 15:09:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Gordon Tetlow X-X-Sender: To: Andrew Hesford Cc: Warner Losh , Doug Barton , Cyrille Lefevre , Jon Parise , Matt Dillon , Will Andrews , Mark Santcroos , , , Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: <20010614144245.A7853@core.usrlib.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 14 Jun 2001, Andrew Hesford wrote: > Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 14:42:45 -0500 > On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 11:57:18AM -0700, Gordon Tetlow wrote: > > I take objection to the moving of pccard before mounting /usr. It works > just fine for those who place /var on the same partition as /, but for > guys like me, it means you are mounting /var at a different time than > other filesystems. I think that, for cohesiveness and sanity, all > filesystems should be mounted at the same time, with the mount script > simply calling `mount -a`. Otherwise, we have to wory about mount-var.sh > and mount-rest.sh. Well, the reason I thought of this was because /var is kind of special, and NetBSD does break out the mounts to a critlocal (/var) a critremote (/usr), which is a misnomer, and finally a mountall (mount -a). I was just trying to keep it as similar to NetBSD as possible. Anyway, I have no problems with moving pccard back to after /usr (and by implication /var) have been mounted. It was just a thought. Although, it makes it impossible to use a pccard ethernet to get your /usr (which I can think of a couple ways this would happen (desktop pc with a only a wireless interface to connect it to the rest of the network)). But this should all be moot as NEWCARD is going to stomp all over OLDCARD by the time this makes it's way to a -RELEASE. Sorry, I get kinda rambly on this, but I'm just trying to consider as many aspects of the boot system as possible. -gordon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 16:20:36 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dt051n37.san.rr.com (dt051n37.san.rr.com [204.210.32.55]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D4B137B403; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:20:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DougB@DougBarton.net) Received: from slave (Studded@slave [10.0.0.1]) by dt051n37.san.rr.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA00841; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:18:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DougB@DougBarton.net) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:18:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Doug Barton X-X-Sender: To: Warner Losh Cc: Cyrille Lefevre , Andrew Hesford , Gordon Tetlow , Jon Parise , Matt Dillon , Will Andrews , Mark Santcroos , , , Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: <200106141814.f5EIEOV15979@harmony.village.org> Message-ID: <20010614160808.L810-100000@dt051n37.san.rr.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 14 Jun 2001, Warner Losh wrote: > With all due respect to Eivind, he's reinventing the wheel. I'd like > to see NetBSD's brought in with an absolute minimum of change. If the project decides that this is the direction we want to take, so be it. The point I don't want to get lost in right now is that given that we have to make a fair amount of changes to port the thing anyway, does it make more sense to try and do a "straight port," or does it make more sense to try to learn from what's been done and improve on it? Luke already agrees that there are some things that he'd like to improve, and is eager to work with us. It would be foolish to waste that opportunity. My plan at this point is to get a good general feeling about what "we" want to do with this project, and then have the people who are actually willing to do the work buckle down and do it. It's not really helpful for people who aren't willing to put the work into this to tell the people that are how it should be done. My hope is that when we're done we can have a product that does the right things, is as fast or faster than what we have now, and is less platform-specific than NetBSD's current code, precisely because I'm committed to the idea of minimizing needless platform-specific items whenever we can. Take a look at some of the changes mergemaster has gone through over the past year as a result of my work with Naddy on making it OpenBSD friendly as an example. Doug -- If you're never wrong, you're not trying hard enough. Do YOU Yahoo!? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 16:22:15 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46FD237B405; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:22:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5ENM8934652; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:22:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:22:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106142322.f5ENM8934652@earth.backplane.com> To: Doug Barton Cc: Warner Losh , Cyrille Lefevre , Andrew Hesford , Gordon Tetlow , Jon Parise , Will Andrews , Mark Santcroos , , , Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: <20010614160808.L810-100000@dt051n37.san.rr.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG My advise: First make it work. THEN make it work better. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 16:25: 2 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dt051n37.san.rr.com (dt051n37.san.rr.com [204.210.32.55]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C60137B403; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:24:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DougB@DougBarton.net) Received: from slave (Studded@slave [10.0.0.1]) by dt051n37.san.rr.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA00915; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:24:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DougB@DougBarton.net) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:24:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Doug Barton X-X-Sender: To: Matt Dillon Cc: Warner Losh , Cyrille Lefevre , Andrew Hesford , Gordon Tetlow , Jon Parise , Will Andrews , Mark Santcroos , , , Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: <200106142322.f5ENM8934652@earth.backplane.com> Message-ID: <20010614162333.V810-100000@dt051n37.san.rr.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 14 Jun 2001, Matt Dillon wrote: > My advise: First make it work. THEN make it work better. Excellent advice, as long as you don't skip the steps of appropriately defining the problem domain and evaluating all of the possible solutions for it. -- If you're never wrong, you're not trying hard enough. Do YOU Yahoo!? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 16:36: 6 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 346C537B403; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:36:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5ENa2r34926; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:36:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:36:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106142336.f5ENa2r34926@earth.backplane.com> To: Doug Barton Cc: Warner Losh , Cyrille Lefevre , Andrew Hesford , Gordon Tetlow , Jon Parise , Will Andrews , Mark Santcroos , , , Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: <20010614162333.V810-100000@dt051n37.san.rr.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : :On Thu, 14 Jun 2001, Matt Dillon wrote: : :> My advise: First make it work. THEN make it work better. : : Excellent advice, as long as you don't skip the steps of :appropriately defining the problem domain and evaluating all of the :possible solutions for it. Well, now mind you I am not arguing with you specifically, but I will point out that you might garner a great deal more input into the project if someone does a good first-run port of the NetBSD stuff and actually gets it into the tree as an alternative, even if it isn't 100% perfect. Then people can actually start using the thing and generate much more focused bug reports, fixes, and comments. If you try to make the thing 'perfect' in the first release you could end up dragging development out many more weeks or months then otherwise. I was thinking of something along the lines of an rc.conf variable that causes /etc/rc to use the new system rather then the old. That way someone (like me) can simply set a single variable in /etc/rc.conf, keep all the other rc.conf that was there intact, reboot, and magically be using the new system. If it doesn't work right, I can comment out the variable, reboot again, and be back to my old system, and then generate a bug report. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 17: 7:57 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from maxim.gbch.net (gw.gbch.net [203.24.22.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 20DEF37B401 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 17:07:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gjb@gbch.net) Received: (qmail 87142 invoked by uid 1001); 15 Jun 2001 10:07:36 +1000 Message-ID: X-Posted-By: GJB-Post 2.19 02-May-2001 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.2-RELEASE i386 X-Location: Brisbane, Australia; 27.49841S 152.98439E X-URL: http://www.gbch.net/gjb.html X-Image-URL: http://www.gbch.net/gjb/gjb-auug048.gif X-GPG-Fingerprint: EBB2 2A92 A79D 1533 AC00 3C46 5D83 B6FB 4B04 B7D6 X-PGP-Public-Keys: http://www.gbch.net/keys.html Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 10:07:35 +1000 From: Greg Black To: Matt Dillon Cc: Doug Barton , Warner Losh , Cyrille Lefevre , Andrew Hesford , Gordon Tetlow , Jon Parise , Will Andrews , Mark Santcroos , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, eivind@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: <20010614162333.V810-100000@dt051n37.san.rr.com> <200106142336.f5ENa2r34926@earth.backplane.com> In-reply-to: <200106142336.f5ENa2r34926@earth.backplane.com> of Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:36:02 MST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matt Dillon wrote: | If you try to make the thing 'perfect' in the first release you could | end up dragging development out many more weeks or months then otherwise. Indeed. | I was thinking of something along the lines of an rc.conf variable that | causes /etc/rc to use the new system rather then the old. That way someone | (like me) can simply set a single variable in /etc/rc.conf, keep all | the other rc.conf that was there intact, reboot, and magically be using | the new system. If it doesn't work right, I can comment out the variable, | reboot again, and be back to my old system, and then generate a bug | report. This is an excellent suggestion and will make it easier for those of us who don't have the to contribute code to at least test it and provide useful feedback. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 17:11:47 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dt051n37.san.rr.com (dt051n37.san.rr.com [204.210.32.55]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A90C637B403; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 17:11:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DougB@DougBarton.net) Received: from slave (Studded@slave [10.0.0.1]) by dt051n37.san.rr.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA01192; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 17:11:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DougB@DougBarton.net) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 17:11:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Doug Barton X-X-Sender: To: Matt Dillon Cc: Warner Losh , Cyrille Lefevre , Andrew Hesford , Gordon Tetlow , Jon Parise , Will Andrews , Mark Santcroos , , , Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: <200106142336.f5ENa2r34926@earth.backplane.com> Message-ID: <20010614170631.X1144-100000@dt051n37.san.rr.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 14 Jun 2001, Matt Dillon wrote: > > : > :On Thu, 14 Jun 2001, Matt Dillon wrote: > : > :> My advise: First make it work. THEN make it work better. > : > : Excellent advice, as long as you don't skip the steps of > :appropriately defining the problem domain and evaluating all of the > :possible solutions for it. > > Well, now mind you I am not arguing with you specifically, It's ok, I have a thick skin. :) > but I will > point out that you might garner a great deal more input into the project > if someone does a good first-run port of the NetBSD stuff and actually > gets it into the tree as an alternative, even if it isn't 100% perfect. This is exactly the approach I want to avoid. The reason being that we saw in the /dev/random development cycle how much intertia, and just plain BS has to be overcome to make any kind of major architectural change, and this is a change far exceeding that one in depth and scope. I am resolved to live through N amount of whining when the changes happen, I don't think it's healthy to ask either the project at large or the people doing the new rc system to live through N x 2, or more. I agree that it doesn't have to be perfect before the first commit, but I'd like to see the big questions answered before real work starts, and a fairly solid framework in place before we ask people to gamma test on a live -current. Think first, code second, think some more is my motto. > I was thinking of something along the lines of an rc.conf variable that > causes /etc/rc to use the new system rather then the old. This is a truly excellent suggestion, thank you. -- If you're never wrong, you're not trying hard enough. Do YOU Yahoo!? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 18: 5:50 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.viasoft.com.cn (unknown [61.153.1.177]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0D64237B401; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 18:05:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bsddiy@163.net) Received: from William ([192.168.1.98]) by mail.viasoft.com.cn (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA04273; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:06:06 +0800 Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:17:38 +0800 From: David Xu X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.48f) Personal Reply-To: bsddiy@163.net Organization: Viasoft X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1252069305.20010615091738@163.net> To: Robert Watson Cc: "Koster, K.J." , Robert Withrow , Cyrille Lefevre , Subject: Re[2]: import NetBSD rc system In-reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello Robert, Thursday, June 14, 2001, 11:39:37 PM, you wrote: RW> On Thu, 14 Jun 2001, Koster, K.J. wrote: >> > To do some of the hierarchal start/stop at runtime stuff, you >> > really need >> > a stateful rc system that stores its start/stop state in >> > /var/run/rc.d or >> > the like. In this way, the system could track various >> > activities and know >> > which dependencies were already started. >> >> How about /var/run/{$deamon}.pid? RW> So, one of the things I've always hated (and loved) about UNIX is the pid RW> system. One of the problems I have with (foo).pid is that pid's are RW> rapidly recycled, so if a daemon dies, there's no way to track that unless RW> you're a parent process (wherein you can reliably get the exiting RW> information via SIGCHLD and wait()). The same goes for using killall as RW> the superuser to find and kill processes such as inetd by name: you can RW> easily kill other things if there are user processes with the same name, RW> etc. In my view, the only really reliable way to manage daemon processes RW> is as the parent of the process. Unfortunately, changing to that model RW> would be a time-consuming, compatibility-limiting process which will RW> probably not prove feasible. RW> Just as an example of some potential suffering: suppose your system RW> creates and destroyes about 200 processes a second, as it's a fairly RW> heavily loaded user and web server. Such as system takes about five and a RW> half minutes to recycle the pid space. If your sendmail daemon has pid RW> 238 (or some other low pid), and dies, it takes about five minutes for RW> some other process to adopt pid 238. However, /var/run/sendmail.pid will RW> still contain 238, as it wasn't cleaned up due to untimely death. Sending RW> a HUP signal to 238 could do a number of nasty things, including logging RW> you out if it's your SSH daemon :-). Using IPC to manage the daemon, in RW> the style of newer named versions, works well as long as you know the RW> daemon is still functional--certainly much better than signals, with the RW> exception of forceful termination. RW> Robert N M Watson FreeBSD Core Team, TrustedBSD Project RW> robert@fledge.watson.org NAI Labs, Safeport Network Services My advice is: Every scripts in rc.d has a status check function, for example: "nfsd.sh status", if this command exits status 0 then it is runing otherwise it is not running. let every script implements its own method to detect if its daemon is up or down. rudely detect a /var/run/${daemon}.pid file is just a typical way. now every scripts should contains 3 functions: start stop status -- David Xu To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 19:23:29 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail3.panix.com (mail3.panix.com [166.84.0.167]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C006A37B401 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 19:23:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rsi@panix.com) Received: from panix1.panix.com (panix1.panix.com [166.84.0.226]) by mail3.panix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 963BC98215 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:23:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rsi@localhost) by panix1.panix.com (8.11.0/8.7.1/PanixN1.0) id f5F2NLW08368; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:23:21 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <200106150223.f5F2NLW08368@panix1.panix.com> X-Authentication-Warning: panix1.panix.com: rsi set sender to rsi@panix.com using -f To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Sysadmin article From: Rajappa Iyer Date: 14 Jun 2001 22:23:21 -0400 Reply-To: rsi@panix.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG http://www.sysadminmag.com/articles/2001/0107/0107a/0107a.htm Any obvious reasons why FreeBSD performed so poorly for these people? rsi -- a.k.a. Rajappa Iyer. They also surf who stand in the waves. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 20:20:51 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from virtual-voodoo.com (virtual-voodoo.com [204.120.165.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 609BE37B405 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 20:20:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from steve@virtual-voodoo.com) Received: (from steve@localhost) by virtual-voodoo.com (8.11.4/8.11.3) id f5F3KkH47522; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:20:46 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from steve) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:20:46 -0500 From: Steve Ames To: Rajappa Iyer Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Message-ID: <20010614222046.A75265@virtual-voodoo.com> References: <200106150223.f5F2NLW08368@panix1.panix.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200106150223.f5F2NLW08368@panix1.panix.com>; from rsi@panix.com on Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 10:23:21PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 10:23:21PM -0400, Rajappa Iyer wrote: > http://www.sysadminmag.com/articles/2001/0107/0107a/0107a.htm > > Any obvious reasons why FreeBSD performed so poorly for these people? Hrm... the filesystem test, I think, is fairly obvious. The default filesystem configuration doesn't have softupdates. Linux always outperforms FreeBSD on filesystem tests using "out of the box" configurations. The others I'm iffy on. There was still a file system element in the other tests as well (delivering e-mail) and depending on the way they layout their email the new dirpref code may help out a bit? -Steve > > rsi > -- > a.k.a. Rajappa Iyer. > They also surf who stand in the waves. > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 21:13:27 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from superconductor.rush.net (superconductor.rush.net [208.9.155.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71F8C37B406 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 21:13:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@superconductor.rush.net) Received: (from bright@localhost) by superconductor.rush.net (8.11.2/8.11.2) id f5F4DIJ02571; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 00:13:18 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 00:13:18 -0400 From: Alfred Perlstein To: Rajappa Iyer Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Message-ID: <20010615001318.F1832@superconductor.rush.net> References: <200106150223.f5F2NLW08368@panix1.panix.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0us In-Reply-To: <200106150223.f5F2NLW08368@panix1.panix.com>; from rsi@panix.com on Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 10:23:21PM -0400 X-all-your-base: are belong to us. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG * Rajappa Iyer [010614 22:23] wrote: > http://www.sysadminmag.com/articles/2001/0107/0107a/0107a.htm > > Any obvious reasons why FreeBSD performed so poorly for these people? Because they did benchmarks on systems without tuning. A simple email to the lists asking for help would have probably done a world of difference. -- -Alfred Perlstein [alfred@freebsd.org] Instead of asking why a piece of software is using "1970s technology," start asking why software is ignoring 30 years of accumulated wisdom. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 21:24:14 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [204.156.12.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E0D9837B407 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 21:24:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (robert@fledge.pr.watson.org [192.0.2.3]) by fledge.watson.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f5F4NYf39746; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 00:23:35 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 00:23:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Watson X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org To: Alfred Perlstein Cc: Rajappa Iyer , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article In-Reply-To: <20010615001318.F1832@superconductor.rush.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Alfred Perlstein wrote: > * Rajappa Iyer [010614 22:23] wrote: > > http://www.sysadminmag.com/articles/2001/0107/0107a/0107a.htm > > > > Any obvious reasons why FreeBSD performed so poorly for these people? > > Because they did benchmarks on systems without tuning. > > A simple email to the lists asking for help would have probably done a > world of difference. There was some discussion of this on freebsd-advocacy yesterday and today, and it sounded like it came down to poor tuning (not enabling soft updates, et al) in combination with a heavy reliance on threading, where we currently don't do so well. A question I posed on -advocacy was when, if ever, we should consider simply enabling soft updates by default on non-root file systems. We claim that soft updates improves both performance and reliability (at the cost of increased kernel complexity), making it a prime candidate for the limelight. Would people be opposed to a change to sysinstall so that (once we're clear that soft updates has stabilized in -CURRENT) such that selecting the default partitioning enables soft updates on any file system not mounted as "/" unless specifically toggled off? How about other tuning: we've previously discussed increasing the default max socket buffer sizes, for example, to allow better tuning for faster network segments. The point has been made that on FreeBSD, we select somewhat conservative (safe) settings by default, and give admins the option to trade off safety and performance as they see fit. On the other hand, there may be further changes we can make that stay well within the realm of safe, yet improve default performance helping us out on Joe Blow's Untuned Performance Test (as you know, many performance tests in popular media don't involve consulting the authors of the code first for tuning help). Likewise, we've gradually been shifting in stance from a "we want to run well on tiny systems" to "we recognize that memory is cheap, and performance is important, let the little guys do more tuning than the medium guys". Robert N M Watson FreeBSD Core Team, TrustedBSD Project robert@fledge.watson.org NAI Labs, Safeport Network Services To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 21:59:46 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from db.wireless.net (adsl-gte-la-216-86-194-70.mminternet.com [216.86.194.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6708837B401 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 21:59:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dbutter@wireless.net) Received: from dbm.wireless.net (dbm.wireless.net [192.168.0.2]) by db.wireless.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id WAA50637; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:00:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dbutter@wireless.net) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Devin Butterfield To: Alfred Perlstein , Rajappa Iyer Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:02:10 -0700 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <200106150223.f5F2NLW08368@panix1.panix.com> <20010615001318.F1832@superconductor.rush.net> In-Reply-To: <20010615001318.F1832@superconductor.rush.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <01061422021000.39234@dbm.wireless.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday 14 June 2001 9:13, Alfred Perlstein wrote: > * Rajappa Iyer [010614 22:23] wrote: > > http://www.sysadminmag.com/articles/2001/0107/0107a/0107a.htm > > > > Any obvious reasons why FreeBSD performed so poorly for these people? > > Because they did benchmarks on systems without tuning. So why doesn't FreeBSD ship with a "tuned" configuration? Just curious... -- Regards, Devin. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 22:21:47 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from silby.com (cb34181-a.mdsn1.wi.home.com [24.14.173.39]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F045537B401 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:21:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from silby@silby.com) Received: (qmail 23827 invoked by uid 1000); 15 Jun 2001 05:21:39 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 15 Jun 2001 05:21:39 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 00:21:39 -0500 (CDT) From: Mike Silbersack To: Devin Butterfield Cc: Alfred Perlstein , Rajappa Iyer , Subject: Re: Sysadmin article In-Reply-To: <01061422021000.39234@dbm.wireless.net> Message-ID: <20010615001400.L23791-100000@achilles.silby.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 14 Jun 2001, Devin Butterfield wrote: > So why doesn't FreeBSD ship with a "tuned" configuration? Just curious... > -- > Regards, Devin. Why? Because you haven't sent in the changes which would implement it yet. :) Rather than a tuned configuration, what would be useful is a script that would evaluate a system and give tuning hints. This might be simple for someone familiar with shell scripting or perl. It could do something like: "You could increase filesystem performance greatly by enabling softupdates. See the tunefs manpage." "Your system seems to be using a large number of mbufs; you should increase the maximum allowed. See the mbuf manpage." "Are you using a UPS?" Yes "You may wish to enable ide write caching to increase performance. See the ata manpage for the tradeoffs involved." "How many connections will this server experience at one time?" 5000 "MAXUSERS is set too low for 5000, please change to X and recompile" "How many connections per process?" 2000 "Maxfiles is too low, please change X to Y." The list could go on and on. While these are all sysctls and kernel options known all to well to some of us, they could take a long time to track down for people new to FreeBSD. Matt's performance manpage covers a lot of this, but is probably not as easy to digest as an interactive script. Anyone have some free time? :) Mike "Silby" Silbersack To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 22:38:58 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from femail11.sdc1.sfba.home.com (femail11.sdc1.sfba.home.com [24.0.95.107]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2E9337B406 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:38:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from stephen@math.missouri.edu) Received: from math.missouri.edu ([24.12.197.197]) by femail11.sdc1.sfba.home.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.20 201-229-121-120-20010223) with ESMTP id <20010615053848.IFZJ16372.femail11.sdc1.sfba.home.com@math.missouri.edu> for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:38:48 -0700 Message-ID: <3B299F67.81A5B421@math.missouri.edu> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 00:38:47 -0500 From: Stephen Montgomery-Smith X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.12 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article References: <20010615001400.L23791-100000@achilles.silby.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Mike Silbersack wrote: > > > Matt's performance manpage covers a lot of this, but is probably not as > easy to digest as an interactive script. > What do I type to read this man page? -- Stephen Montgomery-Smith stephen@math.missouri.edu http://www.math.missouri.edu/~stephen To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 22:42:55 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from habanero.hesketh.net (habanero.hesketh.net [66.45.6.196]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0707637B403 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:42:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brent@mutt.rcfile.org) Received: from mutt.rcfile.org (rdu57-26-120.nc.rr.com [66.57.26.120]) by habanero.hesketh.net (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5F5ghH10909; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 01:42:44 -0400 X-Received-From: brent@mutt.rcfile.org X-Delivered-To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Received: (from brent@localhost) by mutt.rcfile.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5F5hAZ08073; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 01:43:10 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from brent) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 01:43:10 -0400 From: Brent Verner To: Stephen Montgomery-Smith Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Message-ID: <20010615014310.A8053@rcfile.org> References: <20010615001400.L23791-100000@achilles.silby.com> <3B299F67.81A5B421@math.missouri.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <3B299F67.81A5B421@math.missouri.edu> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.19i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 15 Jun 2001 at 00:38 (-0500), Stephen Montgomery-Smith wrote: | Mike Silbersack wrote: | > | > | > Matt's performance manpage covers a lot of this, but is probably not as | > easy to digest as an interactive script. | > | | What do I type to read this man page? $ man tuning To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jun 14 23:46:52 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from xyzzy.intranet.snsonline.net (dhcp.looksmart.com.au [202.53.47.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4DB637B405 for ; Thu, 14 Jun 2001 23:46:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from msergeant@snsonline.net) Received: from xyzzy.intranet.snsonline.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by xyzzy.intranet.snsonline.net (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f5F6jw800749; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 16:46:01 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from msergeant@snsonline.net) Message-Id: <200106150646.f5F6jw800749@xyzzy.intranet.snsonline.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Mark Sergeant" To: Brent Verner , Stephen Montgomery-Smith Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article X-Mailer: Pronto v2.2.5 On freebsd/mysql Date: 15 Jun 2001 01:45:57 EST Reply-To: "Mark Sergeant" In-Reply-To: <20010615014310.A8053@rcfile.org> References: <20010615001400.L23791-100000@achilles.silby.com> <3B299F67.81A5B421@math.missouri.edu> <20010615014310.A8053@rcfile.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG And this is where ? I just tried it and received the error message of no manual entry for tuning. Cheers, Mark On Fri, 15 Jun 2001 01:43:10 -0400, Brent Verner said: > On 15 Jun 2001 at 00:38 (-0500), Stephen Montgomery-Smith wrote: > | Mike Silbersack wrote: > | > > | > > | > Matt's performance manpage covers a lot of this, but is probably not as > | > easy to digest as an interactive script. > | > > | > | What do I type to read this man page? > > $ man tuning > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > -- Mark Sergeant Unix Systems Administrator Fortune follows... Sodd's Second Law: Sooner or later, the worst possible set of circumstances is bound to occur. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 0:15:37 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailc.telia.com (mailc.telia.com [194.22.190.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC7E437B406 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 00:15:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ertr1013@student.uu.se) Received: from d1o913.telia.com (d1o913.telia.com [195.252.44.241]) by mailc.telia.com (8.11.2/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f5F7FMZ16343 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:15:22 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ertr1013.student.uu.se (h185n2fls20o913.telia.com [212.181.163.185]) by d1o913.telia.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA28356 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:15:21 +0200 (CEST) Received: (qmail 558 invoked by uid 1001); 15 Jun 2001 07:14:57 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:14:57 +0200 From: Erik Trulsson To: Mark Sergeant Cc: Brent Verner , Stephen Montgomery-Smith , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Message-ID: <20010615091457.A505@student.uu.se> Mail-Followup-To: Mark Sergeant , Brent Verner , Stephen Montgomery-Smith , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <20010615001400.L23791-100000@achilles.silby.com> <3B299F67.81A5B421@math.missouri.edu> <20010615014310.A8053@rcfile.org> <200106150646.f5F6jw800749@xyzzy.intranet.snsonline.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200106150646.f5F6jw800749@xyzzy.intranet.snsonline.net>; from msergeant@snsonline.net on Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 01:45:57AM -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 01:45:57AM -0500, Mark Sergeant wrote: > And this is where ? I just tried it and received the error message of no manual > entry for tuning. It was added to the system on 2001-05-27 so if your system is older than that you won't have it. > > Cheers, > > Mark > > On Fri, 15 Jun 2001 01:43:10 -0400, Brent Verner said: > > > On 15 Jun 2001 at 00:38 (-0500), Stephen Montgomery-Smith wrote: > > | Mike Silbersack wrote: > > | > > > | > > > | > Matt's performance manpage covers a lot of this, but is probably not as > > | > easy to digest as an interactive script. > > | > > > | > > | What do I type to read this man page? > > > > $ man tuning > > -- Erik Trulsson ertr1013@student.uu.se To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 0:17:26 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from xyzzy.intranet.snsonline.net (dhcp.looksmart.com.au [202.53.47.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7DF537B405 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 00:17:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from msergeant@snsonline.net) Received: from xyzzy.intranet.snsonline.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by xyzzy.intranet.snsonline.net (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f5F7Gs800814; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:16:55 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from msergeant@snsonline.net) Message-Id: <200106150716.f5F7Gs800814@xyzzy.intranet.snsonline.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Mark Sergeant" To: Erik Trulsson Cc: Brent Verner , Stephen Montgomery-Smith , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article X-Mailer: Pronto v2.2.5 On freebsd/mysql Date: 15 Jun 2001 02:16:53 EST Reply-To: "Mark Sergeant" In-Reply-To: <20010615091457.A505@student.uu.se> References: <20010615001400.L23791-100000@achilles.silby.com> <3B299F67.81A5B421@math.missouri.edu> <20010615014310.A8053@rcfile.org> <200106150646.f5F6jw800749@xyzzy.intranet.snsonline.net> <20010615091457.A505@student.uu.se> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ahh ok, Well I am going to wait a little while before make worlding as it seems a few too many things I use are broken for now. Cheers, Mark On Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:14:57 +0200, Erik Trulsson said: > On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 01:45:57AM -0500, Mark Sergeant wrote: > > And this is where ? I just tried it and received the error message of no manual > > entry for tuning. > > It was added to the system on 2001-05-27 so if your system is older > than that you won't have it. > > > > > > Cheers, > > > > Mark > > > > On Fri, 15 Jun 2001 01:43:10 -0400, Brent Verner said: > > > > > On 15 Jun 2001 at 00:38 (-0500), Stephen Montgomery-Smith wrote: > > > | Mike Silbersack wrote: > > > | > > > > | > > > > | > Matt's performance manpage covers a lot of this, but is probably not as > > > | > easy to digest as an interactive script. > > > | > > > > | > > > | What do I type to read this man page? > > > > > > $ man tuning > > > > -- Mark Sergeant Unix Systems Administrator Fortune follows... "That boy's about as sharp as a pound of wet liver" -- Foghorn Leghorn To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 0:30:31 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tisch.mail.mindspring.net (tisch.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.157]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D6EB37B406 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 00:30:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from mindspring.com (dialup-209.245.138.115.Dial1.SanJose1.Level3.net [209.245.138.115]) by tisch.mail.mindspring.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA07805; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 03:29:51 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3B29B98E.DAF2ABE4@mindspring.com> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 00:30:22 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Reply-To: tlambert2@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Robert Withrow Cc: Cyrille Lefevre , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: <200106141357.JAA27316@pobox.engeast.BayNetworks.COM> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Robert Withrow wrote: > > clefevre-lists@noos.fr said: > :- oops, rc2 isn't started. too bad. > > I think that is exactly the desired design. The > RC *system* starts things correctly, but the manager, > *bypassing* the RC *system* can start and stop things > exactly as he wished. For debugging or whatever. > > I'd argue that if you want to start/stop a *subtree*, you > should ask the RC *system* to do that somehow. Run levels or run states? It would be damned useful, for every embedded system I've ever used FreeBSD for (four now, but who's counting?) to be able to say: o Start _all_ the standard FreeBSD stuff, I'm using this thing as my developement workstation. o Start _only_ the FreeBSD stuff I'm going to be shipping, so that I know what will and won't be in the target environment actually works. o Start the FreeBSD stuff I'm going to be shipping, _and_ start the locally developemed stuff I'm going to be shipping, since I'm either shipping or doing a full regression test. Right now, this is about as impossible as building a distribution which can install correctly from a CDROM, but is built from a kernel config other than GENERIC. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 0:37:26 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tisch.mail.mindspring.net (tisch.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.157]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65D6F37B43C; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 00:37:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from mindspring.com (dialup-209.245.138.115.Dial1.SanJose1.Level3.net [209.245.138.115]) by tisch.mail.mindspring.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA26497; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 03:37:04 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3B29BB3F.2044B314@mindspring.com> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 00:37:35 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Reply-To: tlambert2@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Robert Watson Cc: "Koster, K.J." , Robert Withrow , Cyrille Lefevre , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Robert Watson wrote: > > How about /var/run/{$deamon}.pid? > > So, one of the things I've always hated (and loved) about UNIX > is the pid system. One of the problems I have with (foo).pid > is that pid's are rapidly recycled, so if a daemon dies, there's > no way to track that unless you're a parent process (wherein > you can reliably get the exiting information via SIGCHLD and > wait()). The thing that pisses me off most about the use of pid files is that on any border device, you are generally going to run at least two DNS servers (interior, exterior), and will probably run two SMTP servers, and even two HTTP servers and two inetd's. Putting everything in /var/run under the name of the program gets to be dirt stupid real fast... Of course, we could use jails (flash disk space is free, right?), unless we had to use the loopback device to prevent exterior or interior machines from denying POP3 or SMTP service to internally dependent programs, like a web mail server or fetchmail... -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 1:39:10 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from johnson.mail.mindspring.net (johnson.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.177]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11A5C37B409 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 01:38:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from mindspring.com (dialup-209.245.138.115.Dial1.SanJose1.Level3.net [209.245.138.115]) by johnson.mail.mindspring.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA01260; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 04:38:20 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3B29C99A.FD84D3B4@mindspring.com> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 01:38:50 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Reply-To: tlambert2@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Matt Dillon Cc: Cejka Rudolf , David Malone , Peter Wemm , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: signal(SIGCHLD, SIG_IGN) patch solving SUSv2 compatibility issue References: <200106101845.f5AIje014790@earth.backplane.com> <20010611002050.362CE380E@overcee.netplex.com.au> <20010611115806.A53216@walton.maths.tcd.ie> <20010612095323.A72009@dcse.fee.vutbr.cz> <200106121638.f5CGcOo42940@earth.backplane.com> <3B285C40.6500519C@mindspring.com> <200106140657.f5E6v7i20197@earth.backplane.com> <3B2884C1.A938821A@mindspring.com> <200106141708.f5EH8Re24543@earth.backplane.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matt Dillon wrote: > Umm. Terry, I really have no idea what you are talking about. I am talking about being able to get the previous behaviour. > What historical behavior? That FreeBSD was not properly > dealing with SIG_IGN when every other UNIX does? > So you are saying that your interest is in writing software > that only works under FreeBSD? I'm sorry, I don't buy it. If FreeBSD is not properly dealing with SIGCHLD (a premise which I disagree with) , which is capable of being worked around in the unmodified API, when is FreeBSD going to correct it's assinine handling of SIGHUP delivery to group leaders not resulting in it being sent to all processes in the group because of incorrect order of revocation? I don't have to check "read" return values on SVR4 or Solaris to handle this case for things like "vi": these systems do the _right_ thing, and send SIGHUP to all processes in the group, and _then_ revoke the tty, instead of revoking the tty, making all the children of the group leader group leaders in their own right, and only delivering the signal to the group leader itself, since the tty has been revoked, so it's not the controlling tty with a HUP condition on it for all the newly elected group leaders. This _can't_ be worked around, without adding stupid checks into all the code for things like tty's, which are never supposed to generate EOF unless you ignore SIGHUP on purpose, or are in cooked mode and type ^D. > :At least with a SA_CLDWAIT flag, you could do the ignore and > :you would get a compilation warning on half your programs (the > :ones that used the now useless SA_NOCLDWAIT). > > Again, I have no idea what you are talking about here. Why > would we want to introduce a non-standard flag? I'm talking about obtaining pre-modification behaviour. And if you will read the SUS2, you will see that you can introduce any flag you please, and the programs are not supposed to do anything with the flags they don't understand, since they involve implementation defined behaviour. This whole thing is about as stupid as supporting POSIX file locking semantics "to be standard". -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 1:43:48 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from maynard.mail.mindspring.net (maynard.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.243]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11AAD37B403 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 01:43:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from mindspring.com (dialup-209.245.138.115.Dial1.SanJose1.Level3.net [209.245.138.115]) by maynard.mail.mindspring.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA22738; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 04:43:12 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3B29CABE.E8852EC3@mindspring.com> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 01:43:42 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Reply-To: tlambert2@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Kevin Way Cc: Cyrille Lefevre , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: <20010613202415.A3689@core.usrlib.org> <4rtjnv83.fsf@gits.dyndns.org> <20010614140208.A32012@ns1.ecoutez.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Kevin Way wrote: > i don't have the code in front of me, but basically it went like this > > nfs: PROVIDE: nfs REQUIRE: nfsd statd lockd > nfsd: PROVIDE nfsd REQUIRED portmap mountd > statd: PROVIDE statd REQUIRE nfsd FWIW: sendmail does not _require_ DNS, but it operates better in the presence of DNS, even though it can provide degraded service without it. The same goes for sendmail's need for syslogd. Thus there are both hard and soft requirements. Lack of soft requirements means degraded, but functional service (e.g. lack of NIS does not mean you should not start getty on the console to permit root logins). -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 1:56:54 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from blount.mail.mindspring.net (blount.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C30337B405 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 01:56:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from mindspring.com (dialup-209.245.138.115.Dial1.SanJose1.Level3.net [209.245.138.115]) by blount.mail.mindspring.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA13799; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 04:55:55 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3B29CDB9.FF517D3B@mindspring.com> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 01:56:25 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Reply-To: tlambert2@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Devin Butterfield Cc: Alfred Perlstein , Rajappa Iyer , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article References: <200106150223.f5F2NLW08368@panix1.panix.com> <20010615001318.F1832@superconductor.rush.net> <01061422021000.39234@dbm.wireless.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Devin Butterfield wrote: > On Thursday 14 June 2001 9:13, Alfred Perlstein wrote: > > * Rajappa Iyer [010614 22:23] wrote: > > > http://www.sysadminmag.com/articles/2001/0107/0107a/0107a.htm > > > > > > Any obvious reasons why FreeBSD performed so poorly > > > for these people? > > > > Because they did benchmarks on systems without tuning. > > So why doesn't FreeBSD ship with a "tuned" configuration? > Just curious... Tuning trades performance for reliability. By default, FreeBSD is reliable for any general purpose application, and does not overcommit resources which will never end up being used in the majority of applications. They have a special purpose application written to a particular architecture with a particular implementation model. Tuning FreeBSD for this use would de-tune it for other uses. See my other posting. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 2: 1:23 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from blount.mail.mindspring.net (blount.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1315237B405 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 02:01:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from mindspring.com (dialup-209.245.138.115.Dial1.SanJose1.Level3.net [209.245.138.115]) by blount.mail.mindspring.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA21778; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 05:01:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3B29CEF8.D6C525B@mindspring.com> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 02:01:44 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Reply-To: tlambert2@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsi@panix.com Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article References: <200106150223.f5F2NLW08368@panix1.panix.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Rajappa Iyer wrote: > > http://www.sysadminmag.com/articles/2001/0107/0107a/0107a.htm > > Any obvious reasons why FreeBSD performed so poorly for these people? Here is a repeat of my post to -advocacy: -- Terry ---- The article is meaningless. Too bad they titled it "Which OS is Fastest for High- Performance Network Applications?" instead of "Which OS is Fastest for MailEngine?". The only implied caveat is the statement "Our customers frequently ask us which operating system is best for running our software" in paragraph 3 of the "Background" section. This should have been in bold type in the first paragraph. -- It makes a number of very large blunders, which are really inexcusable, given that it tries to represent itself as a fair and unbiased comparison. These blunders are in the tuning of FreeBSD, the best architecture for FreeBSD applications (one shich they did not even try to consider), in their choice of which items they could micro-benchmark would really be indicative of real-world performance, and, finally, in their experimental methodology. Here is a short list, off the top of my head: 1) The mail server they were using doesn't come with any of these systems "out of the box". 2) Threaded processes are vastly inferior to finite state automatons, when it comes to CPU utilization on single CPU systems, and even on multiple CPU systems, if there is async I/O that can be scheduled on multiple CPUs. 3) FreeBSD turns of write caching on IDE drives, by default, in FreeBSD 4.3 and above; you can set it to be like Linux, Solaris, and Windows, if you don't care about your data. On FreeBSD 4.2 and below, Soft Updates are not enabled by default. Either way, without tuning, you lose. 4) IDE drives do not support tagged command queueing, except IBM DTLA drives, which are known to fail due to overheating and due to their electronics being too slow for their radial track density for interior tracks. 5) Real servers with storage and I/O requirements use SCSI drives so they can benefit from tagged command queues, which allow I/O to be interleaved instead of serialized. 6) No well designed mail server keeps all queue files in the same directory, unless it has been designed to run on a particular system where that is not a problem; this is a design portability issue, not a performance issue. 7) Sendmail can handle 400,000 8k emails in a 24 hour period on a < 500MHz box, if it is properly set up and queue dispersal is optimally configured (e.g. with the patches from ftp://ftp.whistle.com/ ). 8) "The most efficient asynchornous architecture" for an application is OS-dependent. 9) There are more than 3 ways to skin a cat, or to architect a task. 10) Sending an RSET instead of data measures only the connection setup and teardown speeds, and does not measure real throughput, and is not representative of real world behaviour, in which mail messages, when sent, contain data, and not just trivial addressing information. 11) Mail servers which support the ESMTP PIPELINE ability have significantly higher throughput, even when just doing addressing. 12) You can not "tweak" FreeBSD's network connection limits at run time; socket structurse, inpcb's, and tcpcb's are allocated via a zone allocator, prior to the system actually being started. This zone can not be resized. Without the patch I posted to make maxfiles boot-time tunable, FreeBSD can not increase the number of sockets and files that it can simultaneously handle, without a kernel recompile. Thus the "tweaking" used was useless. 13) For each connection, there is a tcptmpl structure, which is used for keepalives. This structure will consume one mbuf per connection; in addition, the average TCP window size will be 16k; so you will need 16k/2k (8) mbufs for custer pointers plus 16k/256 (64) mbufs for the window data, plus one mbuf per connection, pplus one mbuf per connection, if you are setting options. This means that you will potentially need 74 mbufs per connection you intend to support; without patching, this also is not tunable except at compile time, and the value was not tuned. 14) The "average througput per network architecture" is extremely misleading, both because of the limited and inefficient architectures used in the test, and in using an average to "determine" which was "the best architecture for use on all OSs". Per OS numbers would have been much more meaningful, since the final architecture was chosen based on the average, and not based on what was best for the OS being tested. 15) Creation and deletion of large numbers of files in a single directory is rather meaningless; witness the moronic 'postmark' "benchmark", and the resulting discussion on several FreeBSD lists. The "benchmark" was clearly designed to put forth a political agenda (in the context of the list discussion, this agenda was the pro-ReiserFS position, despite Reiser's use of several USL/Novell patents on Delayed Ordered Writes, without the permission of the patent holders, which render a pro-ResierFS argument as meaningless as arguing about the number of angels which can dance on the head of a pin). 16) When you have an answer you want, all the evidence you gather will tend to support the conclusion you have already drawn, unless you are very, very careful to eliminate your assumed biases in your experimental design. This is very hard to do, even when trained scientists are involved. Feel free to pass this on to the magazine editors, the author, or both; at the very least, it may teach them a little bit about how to actually tune FreeBSD to get good numbers out of it, instead of frobbing meaningless knobs and merely _believing_ they are tuning the system for higher performance. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 2: 9:30 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from blount.mail.mindspring.net (blount.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EFF2B37B406 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 02:09:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from mindspring.com (dialup-209.245.138.115.Dial1.SanJose1.Level3.net [209.245.138.115]) by blount.mail.mindspring.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA27646; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 05:08:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3B29D0BF.5D6BE93E@mindspring.com> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 02:09:19 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Reply-To: tlambert2@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Mike Silbersack Cc: Devin Butterfield , Alfred Perlstein , Rajappa Iyer , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article References: <20010615001400.L23791-100000@achilles.silby.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Mike Silbersack wrote: > Rather than a tuned configuration, what would be useful is > a script that would evaluate a system and give tuning hints. > This might be simple for someone familiar with shell scripting > or perl. It could do something like: [ ... Eliza program for FreeBSD ... ] Doing this is non-trivial. Many of the things they should have tuned can not be tuned except at compile time. Any object allocated out of a zone before the VM is started, such as inpcb's and tcpcb's, in order to render the objects pageable, are allocated from a zone which is not growable, and takes a static amount of kernel virtual address space. This is not obvious, unless you look very carefully at the code. Similarly, allocations wich must be able to occur at interrupt time, such as replacement mbuf's for ring buffer contents in ethernet drivers, similarly, must come from a static pre-allocation. By definition, you can not resize these things at runtime. Things in zones are type-stable, as well, which means that even if you don't use all of them, they are deducted from your total available memory, which might instead be better spent in buffer cache, directory lookup cache, or any of hundreds of other resources. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 2:43:55 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from malmo.trab.se (malmo.trab.se [131.115.48.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF07037B405 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 02:43:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Urban.E.Olsson@telia.se) Received: from trab-hermes.haninge.trab.se (trab-hermes.haninge.trab.se [131.115.158.15]) by malmo.trab.se (8.10.1/TRAB-primary-2) with ESMTP id f5F9g3k23557 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 11:42:03 +0200 (MEST) Received: by TRAB-HERMES with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 11:43:42 +0200 Message-ID: <778DFE9B4E3BD111A74E08002BA3DC0D03DA52BC@TRAB-HERMES> From: Urban Olsson To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: modified natd again Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 11:43:41 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi again, I=B4m still working on my modified natd and have encountered a problem = again. What I have done so far is to exchange the alias module with my own = aliasing module. The problem this time is that when I send a packet (ping) from = the internal machine to the external network the aliasing performs fine but = when the answer comes back the packet disappears after the de-aliasing. I = run the natd in verbose mode and see that the aliasing works fine both ways but = the packet is only transmitted on its way out, not on the way in. My ipfw = conf looks exactly as in the man pages for natd. It looks like the packet is diverted on the inner NIC and not received but the ipfw rules says that = only the external interface should do divert. I first thought that it is some problem with checksums but as far as I = can see the checksums are reset properly. I have seen that the original = aliasing module messes with some kind of ICMP ID. could this have something to = do with this? Another strange thing is that when I try to use tcpdump it doesn=B4t = show all packets. No packets are "dropped by kernel" but tcpdump have received packets but don=B4t show them. Could this in some way be related. I would appreciate some answers from people with greater wisdom than my = own ;-) regards Urban Olsson To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 3:11:59 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alacran.it.uc3m.es (alacran.it.uc3m.es [163.117.139.44]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A161F37B401 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 03:11:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jrh@it.uc3m.es) Received: from it.uc3m.es (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by alacran.it.uc3m.es (8.10.2/8.10.2/SuSE Linux 8.10.0-0.3) with ESMTP id f5FAAfi06171 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 12:10:41 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: alacran.it.uc3m.es: Host localhost [127.0.0.1] claimed to be it.uc3m.es Message-ID: <3B29DF21.2B4B7BA3@it.uc3m.es> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 12:10:41 +0200 From: Juan Fco Rodriguez Hervella X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.74 [es] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.3 i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Lista Subject: reset the target machine with remote gdb. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi: I am debugging a kernel with remote gdb, using a serial line. I do the following: 1. boot -d, gdb, step (in target machine) 2. gdb -k kernel.debug Some time later, I get a "SIGSEV segmentation fault". This is normal, because I am doing very changes to the kernel. My question is the following. I would like to reboot the target machine without press the reset button, but I dont know if it is possible from the debugging machine to do this. I am afraid that if I reboot with the reset-button of the box, I would lost data dont save on the disk. Sorry for my bad english. Best Regards. -- ********************************* Juan F. Rodriguez Hervella Universidad Carlos III de Madrid ******************************** To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 4:21:39 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (pc-62-31-42-140-hy.blueyonder.co.uk [62.31.42.140]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EAF3137B407 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 04:21:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nik@nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk) Received: from clan.nothing-going-on.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f5FAvu843033; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 11:57:56 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from nik@nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Nik Clayton To: Giorgos Keramidas , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: strangeness in web interface of send-pr Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 11:57:56 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] References: <20010613225749.F69527@hades.hell.gr> In-Reply-To: <20010613225749.F69527@hades.hell.gr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <01061511575602.42966@clan.nothing-going-on.org> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Wednesday 13 June 2001 8:57 pm, Giorgos Keramidas wrote: > I have a few hours to spare tonight, and I was using the > query-pr-summary.cgi script to view the open PRs. [snip] Looks like this has been resolved. However, if this is something you want to do on a regular basis, you might want to take a look at http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/articles/committers-guide/gnats.html which explains how to keep a local copy of the GNATS repo up to date using CVSup -- then you can use local tools to query it. N - -- Internet connection, $19.95 a month. Computer, $799.95. Modem, $149.95. Telephone line, $24.95 a month. Software, free. USENET transmission, hundreds if not thousands of dollars. Thinking before posting, priceless. Somethings in life you can't buy. For everything else, there's MasterCard. -- Graham Reed, in the Scary Devil Monastery -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (FreeBSD) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iEYEARECAAYFAjsp6jQACgkQk6gHZCw343VcbwCfcHsJKGqhiFehoE9udjmwQ3+a YssAn2jTa6fEBL4xsCDuwR+ZgeK5q/Uj =iqb1 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 4:42:54 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ringworld.nanolink.com (ringworld.nanolink.com [195.24.48.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 1CE3237B407 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 04:42:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roam@orbitel.bg) Received: (qmail 32979 invoked by uid 1000); 15 Jun 2001 11:41:22 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:41:22 +0300 From: Peter Pentchev To: Terry Lambert Cc: Mike Silbersack , Devin Butterfield , Alfred Perlstein , Rajappa Iyer , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Message-ID: <20010615144121.B94445@ringworld.oblivion.bg> Mail-Followup-To: Terry Lambert , Mike Silbersack , Devin Butterfield , Alfred Perlstein , Rajappa Iyer , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <20010615001400.L23791-100000@achilles.silby.com> <3B29D0BF.5D6BE93E@mindspring.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <3B29D0BF.5D6BE93E@mindspring.com>; from tlambert2@mindspring.com on Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 02:09:19AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 02:09:19AM -0700, Terry Lambert wrote: > Mike Silbersack wrote: > > Rather than a tuned configuration, what would be useful is > > a script that would evaluate a system and give tuning hints. > > This might be simple for someone familiar with shell scripting > > or perl. It could do something like: > > [ ... Eliza program for FreeBSD ... ] > > Doing this is non-trivial. Many of the things they should > have tuned can not be tuned except at compile time. And Mike did not imply this tuning could be done without recompiling. As a matter of fact, one of the suggestions in his example involved the words 'change to X and recompile'. G'luck, Peter -- I've heard that this sentence is a rumor. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 5:32:14 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.wgate.com (mail.wgate.com [38.219.83.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6AC6937B405 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 05:32:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from msinz@wgate.com) Received: from sinz.eng.tvol.net ([10.32.2.99]) by mail.wgate.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id MRV3NTAM; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 08:31:56 -0400 Received: from wgate.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sinz.eng.tvol.net (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5FCW4w92361; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 08:32:05 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from msinz@wgate.com) Message-ID: <3B2A0044.31D3FF3E@wgate.com> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 08:32:04 -0400 From: Michael Sinz Organization: WorldGate Communications Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 4.3-STABLE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tlambert2@mindspring.com Cc: rsi@panix.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article References: <200106150223.f5F2NLW08368@panix1.panix.com> <3B29CEF8.D6C525B@mindspring.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Terry Lambert wrote: > > Rajappa Iyer wrote: > > > > http://www.sysadminmag.com/articles/2001/0107/0107a/0107a.htm > > > > Any obvious reasons why FreeBSD performed so poorly for these people? > > Here is a repeat of my post to -advocacy: > > -- Terry > > ---- > > The article is meaningless. > > Too bad they titled it "Which OS is Fastest for High- > Performance Network Applications?" instead of "Which OS is > Fastest for MailEngine?". > > The only implied caveat is the statement "Our customers > frequently ask us which operating system is best for > running our software" in paragraph 3 of the "Background" > section. This should have been in bold type in the first > paragraph. > > -- > > It makes a number of very large blunders, which are really > inexcusable, given that it tries to represent itself as a > fair and unbiased comparison. Becareful before you state some of these - while I agree that the article and testing methods were not perfect, it is not what you think: > 2) Threaded processes are vastly inferior to > finite state automatons, when it comes to CPU > utilization on single CPU systems, and even on > multiple CPU systems, if there is async I/O > that can be scheduled on multiple CPUs. That is both a true-ism and a false-ism, depending on the way it is coded, the coder, and the architecture of the OS and hardware... > 3) FreeBSD turns of write caching on IDE drives, by > default, in FreeBSD 4.3 and above; you can set > it to be like Linux, Solaris, and Windows, if > you don't care about your data. On FreeBSD 4.2 > and below, Soft Updates are not enabled by > default. Either way, without tuning, you lose. And if you read the article, you may find the following text: We installed all operating systems on identical 4-GB SCSI-3 drives (IBM model DCAS-34330), and ran the tests on the same machine (ASUS P3B motherboard, Intel Pentium III 550-MHz processor, 384-MB SDRAM, Adaptec 2940UW SCSI controller, ATI Rage Pro 3D video card, Intel EtherExpress Pro 10/100 Ethernet card). So, IDE drive issue (they just suck) is not an issue here. Yes, IDE has problems, but if they did not use it, don't claim that it was an issue. > 4) IDE drives do not support tagged command queueing, > except IBM DTLA drives, which are known to fail > due to overheating and due to their electronics > being too slow for their radial track density for > interior tracks. Again, don't claim it as a problem when they specifically stated that SCSI was used and which specific SCSI drive and hardware setup. > 5) Real servers with storage and I/O requirements > use SCSI drives so they can benefit from tagged > command queues, which allow I/O to be interleaved > instead of serialized. I agree. And, it seems, so did the testers. [...] > 13) For each connection, there is a tcptmpl structure, > which is used for keepalives. This structure will > consume one mbuf per connection; in addition, the > average TCP window size will be 16k; so you will > need 16k/2k (8) mbufs for custer pointers plus > 16k/256 (64) mbufs for the window data, plus one > mbuf per connection, pplus one mbuf per connection, > if you are setting options. This means that you > will potentially need 74 mbufs per connection you > intend to support; without patching, this also is > not tunable except at compile time, and the value > was not tuned. Is this not a potential issue with the OS? > 14) The "average througput per network architecture" is > extremely misleading, both because of the limited > and inefficient architectures used in the test, and > in using an average to "determine" which was "the > best architecture for use on all OSs". Per OS numbers > would have been much more meaningful, since the final > architecture was chosen based on the average, and not > based on what was best for the OS being tested. I fully agree. That part of the test/description was completely wrong just because it assumed too many things and did not give a reasonable example of each implementation (and how each did on each OS). It is obvious that in the current stable FreeBSD that anything that is heavily threaded will not do as well as on other operating systems that have better threading support. But this can also be seen as a reasonable complaint against FreeBSD. And we know that and the next major FreeBSD release will have addressed it. -- Michael Sinz ---- Worldgate Communications ---- msinz@wgate.com A master's secrets are only as good as the master's ability to explain them to others. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 5:47:50 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from vega.dmnshq.net (vega.dmnshq.net [194.19.34.94]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 6391637B409 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 05:47:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eivind@vega.dmnshq.net) Received: (from eivind@localhost) by vega.dmnshq.net (8.11.4/8.9.3) id f5FCgKm63023; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:42:20 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from eivind) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:42:20 +0200 From: Eivind Eklund To: Warner Losh Cc: Doug Barton , Cyrille Lefevre , Andrew Hesford , Gordon Tetlow , Jon Parise , Matt Dillon , Will Andrews , Mark Santcroos , bsddiy@163.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010615144220.A62749@FreeBSD.org> References: <3B28FC70.1FC1F18B@DougBarton.net> <20010613202415.A3689@core.usrlib.org> <4rtjnv83.fsf@gits.dyndns.org> <3B28FC70.1FC1F18B@DougBarton.net> <200106141814.f5EIEOV15979@harmony.village.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200106141814.f5EIEOV15979@harmony.village.org>; from imp@harmony.village.org on Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 12:14:24PM -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 12:14:24PM -0600, Warner Losh wrote: > : Second, Eivind has already done > : some excellent work in this area. Take a look at > : http://people.freebsd.org/~eivind/newrc.html for more info. > > With all due respect to Eivind, he's reinventing the wheel. This is a misunderstanding. That document predates the NetBSD rc system. The document was unchanged from 1999 until I changed approximate 10 lines in it yesterday, due to getting user feedback. The document in question is a requirements document, not a design for a replacement system. What I've always seen as its chief use is as a tool for evaluating proposed rc-system replacement, and being able to avoid long discussions about what is good and bad about a hypothetical replacement each time somebody propose to replace the rc system. I do NOT intend to implement an alternate rc system apart from NetBSD (though if the community as a whole decided that was necessary I would probably contribute to such an effort.) > I'd like to see NetBSD's brought in with an absolute minimum of change. I have not looked deeply at the NetBSD rc system, but agree that this is probably the best move. The system should be evaluated carefully using all available resources (including newrc.html) by the people wanting to do the change before importing it, though. Eivind. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 6:20:34 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from torb.pix.net (sdsl-216-36-104-218.dsl.iad.megapath.net [216.36.104.218]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB02337B403 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 06:20:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from stripes@torb.pix.net) Received: (from stripes@localhost) by torb.pix.net (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5FDOeT15457 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:24:40 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from stripes) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:24:39 -0400 From: jmo To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Message-ID: <20010615092439.A15449@torb.pix.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Friday, June 15, 2001, at 03:14 AM, Erik Trulsson wrote: >On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 01:45:57AM -0500, Mark Sergeant wrote: >>And this is where ? I just tried it and received the error message of no manual >>entry for tuning. > >It was added to the system on 2001-05-27 so if your system is older >than that you won't have it. One can find it at http://www.FreeBSD.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/src/share/man/man7/tuning.7 But, why doesn't the http://www.FreeBSD.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=tuning&apropos=0&sektion=0&manpath=FreeBSD+4.3-RELEASE&format=html web page have man pages for the 5.0 tree? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 8:13: 8 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from guru.mired.org (okc-65-26-235-186.mmcable.com [65.26.235.186]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id E1A7437B408 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 08:12:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mwm@mired.org) Received: (qmail 19268 invoked by uid 100); 15 Jun 2001 15:12:39 -0000 From: Mike Meyer MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <15146.9703.87903.833445@guru.mired.org> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 10:12:39 -0500 To: tlambert2@mindspring.com Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Run states (Was: import NetBSD rc system) In-Reply-To: <3B29B98E.DAF2ABE4@mindspring.com> References: <200106141357.JAA27316@pobox.engeast.BayNetworks.COM> <3B29B98E.DAF2ABE4@mindspring.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.90 under 21.1 (patch 14) "Cuyahoga Valley" XEmacs Lucid X-face: "5Mnwy%?j>IIV\)A=):rjWL~NB2aH[}Yq8Z=u~vJ`"(,&SiLvbbz2W`;h9L,Yg`+vb1>RG% *h+%X^n0EZd>TM8_IB;a8F?(Fb"lw'IgCoyM.[Lg#r\ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Terry Lambert types: > Run levels or run states? > > It would be damned useful, for every embedded system I've > ever used FreeBSD for (four now, but who's counting?) to > be able to say: > > o Start _all_ the standard FreeBSD stuff, I'm using > this thing as my developement workstation. > > o Start _only_ the FreeBSD stuff I'm going to be > shipping, so that I know what will and won't be > in the target environment actually works. > > o Start the FreeBSD stuff I'm going to be shipping, > _and_ start the locally developemed stuff I'm > going to be shipping, since I'm either shipping > or doing a full regression test. The ability to specify a different boot configuration isn't quite the same as the question of using a NetBSD rc system or not. To use a SysV-like system to specify boot configuration requires that subsystems startup/shutdown be in different files, which means you have to have something like the NetBSD rc system. I get the impression nobody likes the SysV configuration specification methods. Since modern BSD-like systems use /etc/rc.conf extending that would probably be more acceptable. As a user, I'd like to have multiple rc.conf files. For Terry's example, something like /etc/rc.conf, /etc/rc.conf.ship, and /etc/rc.conf.test would be nice. Having to use SysV-like characters might be either better, or required by the boot system. Tweaking source_rc_confs to support either one looks trivial. That just leaves figuring out how the user specifies the run-state, and how that information gets somewhere that it can be used by source_rc_confs. But that's just a SMOP. http://www.mired.org/home/mwm/ Independent WWW/Perforce/FreeBSD/Unix consultant, email for more information. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 8:34:11 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bdr-xcon.matchlogic.com (mail.matchlogic.com [205.216.147.127]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D232037B40A; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 08:34:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crandall@matchlogic.com) Received: by mail.matchlogic.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:34:02 -0600 Message-ID: <5FE9B713CCCDD311A03400508B8B30130828EFAA@bdr-xcln.corp.matchlogic.com> From: Charles Randall To: 'Robert Watson' , Alfred Perlstein Cc: Rajappa Iyer , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: Sysadmin article Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:33:04 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG From: Robert Watson [mailto:rwatson@FreeBSD.ORG] >There was some discussion of this on freebsd-advocacy yesterday >and today, and it sounded like it came down to poor tuning (not >enabling soft updates, et al) in combination with a heavy reliance >on threading, where we currently don't do so well. Did anyone offer to contact Lyris directly to identify a configuration which would have fared better in their tests? Since their application is available for FreeBSD, it is in our best interests for to help them out. -Charles To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 8:51: 2 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sasami.jurai.net (sasami.jurai.net [64.0.106.45]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 938E137B417; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 08:50:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from scanner@jurai.net) Received: from localhost (scanner@localhost) by sasami.jurai.net (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA14069; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 11:50:48 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 11:50:48 -0400 (EDT) From: To: Charles Randall Cc: "'Robert Watson'" , Alfred Perlstein , Rajappa Iyer , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: Sysadmin article In-Reply-To: <5FE9B713CCCDD311A03400508B8B30130828EFAA@bdr-xcln.corp.matchlogic.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Charles Randall wrote: > Did anyone offer to contact Lyris directly to identify a configuration which > would have fared better in their tests? Since their application is available > for FreeBSD, it is in our best interests for to help them out. On a side note, I did contact them about 2 days before this article appeared since TWA uses Lyris (now on FreeBSD :-) it was running on linux) and asked them if they planned on supporting kqueue in the FreeBSD version. The tech rep said they had no plans but she would forward it to the developers since I made a feature request. The software itself is a bit goofy. It keeps defered mail around for *way* to long. We have 1.2 million subscribers to mail on monday. It sends out about 98% in 4 hours of the list subscribers. And has ~4500 defered mails because of down mail hosts, undeliverable mails, etc.. And it keeps them around for DAYS instead of flushing the queue periodically. Which it should since that is what this is app's main goal is for is a mailing list/spam sender. I have yet to find a way to manually force the queue to flush on it either. It uses a FoxPro DB to store members in AFAIK. Why it's not a berkeley db is beyond me. On a 1-10 I give the app a 7 for its purpose. I still think a properly tuned Postfix box would destroy this software but they claim otherwise. Naturally. ============================================================================= -Chris Watson (316) 326-3862 | Sr. Unix Administrator Work: chris.watson@twa.com | Trans World Airlines, Kansas City, MO Home: scanner@jurai.net | http://www.twa.com ============================================================================= WINDOWS: "Where do you want to go today?" LINUX: "Where do you want to go tomorrow?" BSD: "Are you guys coming or what?" ============================================================================= irc.openprojects.net #FreeBSD -Join the revolution! ICQ: 20016186 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 9: 2:45 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from srv1.cosmo-project.de (srv1.cosmo-project.de [213.83.6.106]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE5AF37B405 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:02:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ticso@mail.cicely.de) Received: from mail.cicely.de (cicely20 [10.1.1.22]) by srv1.cosmo-project.de (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f5FG2c635263; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 18:02:38 +0200 (CEST) Received: (from ticso@localhost) by mail.cicely.de (8.11.0/8.11.0) id f5FG3GV26273; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 18:03:16 +0200 (CEST) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 18:02:59 +0200 From: Bernd Walter To: Juan Fco Rodriguez Hervella Cc: Lista Subject: Re: reset the target machine with remote gdb. Message-ID: <20010615180259.B25917@cicely20.cicely.de> References: <3B29DF21.2B4B7BA3@it.uc3m.es> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <3B29DF21.2B4B7BA3@it.uc3m.es>; from jrh@it.uc3m.es on Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 12:10:41PM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 12:10:41PM +0200, Juan Fco Rodriguez Hervella wrote: > Hi: > > I am debugging a kernel with remote gdb, using > a serial line. I do the following: > > 1. boot -d, gdb, step (in target machine) > 2. gdb -k kernel.debug > > Some time later, I get a "SIGSEV segmentation fault". > This is normal, because I am doing very changes to > the kernel. > > My question is the following. I would like to reboot > the target machine without press the reset button, > but I dont know if it is possible from the debugging > machine to do this. > > I am afraid that if I reboot with the reset-button > of the box, I would lost data dont save on the disk. > > Sorry for my bad english. From DDB I usally call cpu_reset, it should also work with gdb. -- B.Walter COSMO-Project http://www.cosmo-project.de ticso@cicely.de Usergroup info@cosmo-project.de To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 9:28: 9 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from boreas.isi.edu (boreas.isi.edu [128.9.160.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A990237B408 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:28:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from faber@ISI.EDU) Received: from ted.isi.edu (ted.isi.edu [128.9.160.104]) by boreas.isi.edu (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f5FGRuG01002; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:27:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from faber@localhost) by ted.isi.edu (8.11.4/8.11.4) id f5FGRt406248; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:27:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from faber) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:27:55 -0700 From: Ted Faber To: Brent Verner Cc: Stephen Montgomery-Smith , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Message-ID: <20010615092755.B6017@ted.isi.edu> References: <20010615001400.L23791-100000@achilles.silby.com> <3B299F67.81A5B421@math.missouri.edu> <20010615014310.A8053@rcfile.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=php-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="WhfpMioaduB5tiZL" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010615014310.A8053@rcfile.org>; from brent@rcfile.org on Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 01:43:10AM -0400 X-url: http://www.isi.edu/~faber Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --WhfpMioaduB5tiZL Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 01:43:10AM -0400, Brent Verner wrote: > On 15 Jun 2001 at 00:38 (-0500), Stephen Montgomery-Smith wrote: > | Mike Silbersack wrote: > | > Matt's performance manpage covers a lot of this, but is probably not as > | > easy to digest as an interactive script. > | What do I type to read this man page? > > $ man tuning This is a cool thing. I suggest mentioning it in /etc/motd along with the bug reporting stuff and pointer to heir(7). --WhfpMioaduB5tiZL Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.5 (FreeBSD) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE7KjeLaUz3f+Zf+XsRAp4uAKDFOpcEZWyDXPb0n9h08+y3VdLYkQCg3fWl 9CumIQt8q5t6Xk/neFCs63c= =/wmL -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --WhfpMioaduB5tiZL-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 9:32:22 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ringworld.nanolink.com (ringworld.nanolink.com [195.24.48.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 5372B37B405 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:32:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roam@orbitel.bg) Received: (qmail 40649 invoked by uid 1000); 15 Jun 2001 16:30:48 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 19:30:48 +0300 From: Peter Pentchev To: Ted Faber Cc: Brent Verner , Stephen Montgomery-Smith , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Message-ID: <20010615193048.N94445@ringworld.oblivion.bg> Mail-Followup-To: Ted Faber , Brent Verner , Stephen Montgomery-Smith , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <20010615001400.L23791-100000@achilles.silby.com> <3B299F67.81A5B421@math.missouri.edu> <20010615014310.A8053@rcfile.org> <20010615092755.B6017@ted.isi.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010615092755.B6017@ted.isi.edu>; from faber@ISI.EDU on Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 09:27:55AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 09:27:55AM -0700, Ted Faber wrote: > On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 01:43:10AM -0400, Brent Verner wrote: > > On 15 Jun 2001 at 00:38 (-0500), Stephen Montgomery-Smith wrote: > > | Mike Silbersack wrote: > > | > Matt's performance manpage covers a lot of this, but is probably not as > > | > easy to digest as an interactive script. > > | What do I type to read this man page? > > > > $ man tuning > > This is a cool thing. I suggest mentioning it in /etc/motd along > with the bug reporting stuff and pointer to heir(7). heir(7).. mmm.. is that like a Seventh Son of a Seventh Son?.. or merely a Seventh Son?.. :P G'luck, Peter -- This sentence claims to be an Epimenides paradox, but it is lying. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 9:33:11 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.kyx.net (s216-232-31-82.bc.hsia.telus.net [216.232.31.82]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56CDF37B408; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:32:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dr@kyx.net) Received: from zyx (unknown [216.232.31.79]) by mail.kyx.net (Postfix) with SMTP id ADC161DC03; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:38:08 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Dragos Ruiu Organization: dragostech.com inc. To: Robert Watson , Alfred Perlstein Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:34:14 +0000 X-Mailer: KYX-CP/M [core01-v01-02a] Cc: Rajappa Iyer , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <01061509341402.30671@zyx> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I would heartily endorse having the out of the box FreeBSD install be tuned better... Sysadmin can't be knocked for not doing the tuning as running an out of the box config is what a vast majority of users do, imho, so their performance tests and the poor results from FreeBSD are perfectly valid indication of what can be expected without tuning. Softupdates on by default sounds great to me, as I can't think of any common situations that would be hurt by it. But I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong on this. Now if we could only speed up SMP too... cheers, --dr On Friday 15 June 2001 04:23, Robert Watson wrote: > On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Alfred Perlstein wrote: > > * Rajappa Iyer [010614 22:23] wrote: > > > http://www.sysadminmag.com/articles/2001/0107/0107a/0107a.htm > > > > > > Any obvious reasons why FreeBSD performed so poorly for these people? > > > > Because they did benchmarks on systems without tuning. > > > > A simple email to the lists asking for help would have probably done a > > world of difference. > > There was some discussion of this on freebsd-advocacy yesterday and today, > and it sounded like it came down to poor tuning (not enabling soft > updates, et al) in combination with a heavy reliance on threading, where > we currently don't do so well. > > A question I posed on -advocacy was when, if ever, we should consider > simply enabling soft updates by default on non-root file systems. We > claim that soft updates improves both performance and reliability (at the > cost of increased kernel complexity), making it a prime candidate for the > limelight. Would people be opposed to a change to sysinstall so that > (once we're clear that soft updates has stabilized in -CURRENT) such that > selecting the default partitioning enables soft updates on any file system > not mounted as "/" unless specifically toggled off? How about other > tuning: we've previously discussed increasing the default max socket > buffer sizes, for example, to allow better tuning for faster network > segments. > > The point has been made that on FreeBSD, we select somewhat conservative > (safe) settings by default, and give admins the option to trade off safety > and performance as they see fit. On the other hand, there may be further > changes we can make that stay well within the realm of safe, yet improve > default performance helping us out on Joe Blow's Untuned Performance Test > (as you know, many performance tests in popular media don't involve > consulting the authors of the code first for tuning help). Likewise, > we've gradually been shifting in stance from a "we want to run well on > tiny systems" to "we recognize that memory is cheap, and performance is > important, let the little guys do more tuning than the medium guys". > > Robert N M Watson FreeBSD Core Team, TrustedBSD Project > robert@fledge.watson.org NAI Labs, Safeport Network Services > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 10:46:40 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [204.156.12.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9AC9E37B40A for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 10:46:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (robert@fledge.pr.watson.org [192.0.2.3]) by fledge.watson.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f5FHk0f50280; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:46:01 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:46:00 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Watson X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org To: Dragos Ruiu Cc: Alfred Perlstein , Rajappa Iyer , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article In-Reply-To: <01061509341402.30671@zyx> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Dragos Ruiu wrote: > I would heartily endorse having the out of the box FreeBSD install be > tuned better... > > Sysadmin can't be knocked for not doing the tuning as running an out of > the box config is what a vast majority of users do, imho, so their > performance tests and the poor results from FreeBSD are perfectly valid > indication of what can be expected without tuning. > > Softupdates on by default sounds great to me, as I can't think of any > common situations that would be hurt by it. But I'm sure someone will > correct me if I'm wrong on this. Now if we could only speed up SMP > too... Well, I think this is especially true in light of the recent decision to turn WCE back on by default for IDE. Robert N M Watson FreeBSD Core Team, TrustedBSD Project robert@fledge.watson.org NAI Labs, Safeport Network Services To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 12:18:48 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns1.ecoutez.net (ns1.ecoutez.net [64.36.74.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E470A37B401 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 12:18:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mosch@ns1.ecoutez.net) Received: (from mosch@localhost) by ns1.ecoutez.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA12769; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 15:19:31 -0400 Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 15:19:31 -0400 From: Kevin Way To: Terry Lambert Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010615151931.B12090@ns1.ecoutez.net> References: <20010613202415.A3689@core.usrlib.org> <4rtjnv83.fsf@gits.dyndns.org> <20010614140208.A32012@ns1.ecoutez.net> <3B29CABE.E8852EC3@mindspring.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <3B29CABE.E8852EC3@mindspring.com>; from tlambert2@mindspring.com on Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 01:43:42AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > FWIW: sendmail does not _require_ DNS, but it operates better > in the presence of DNS, even though it can provide degraded > service without it. The same goes for sendmail's need for > syslogd. > > Thus there are both hard and soft requirements. Lack of soft > requirements means degraded, but functional service (e.g. > lack of NIS does not mean you should not start getty on the > console to permit root logins). Eivend noted this in his handy requirements list, as well. It would be a divergence from the original NetBSD code, but this could be implemented by adding 'WANTS' in addition to 'REQUIRES', and calling warn if a want isn't fulfilled. An excellent point. Kevin Way To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 13:38: 5 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from perninha.conectiva.com.br (perninha.conectiva.com.br [200.250.58.156]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69A8337B408 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:37:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from riel@conectiva.com.br) Received: from burns.conectiva (burns.conectiva [10.0.0.4]) by perninha.conectiva.com.br (Postfix) with SMTP id 22AFD38DE1 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:37:45 -0300 (EST) Received: (qmail 4248 invoked by uid 0); 15 Jun 2001 20:36:21 -0000 Received: from duckman.distro.conectiva (HELO duckman.conectiva.com.br) (root@10.0.17.2) by burns.conectiva with SMTP; 15 Jun 2001 20:36:21 -0000 Received: from localhost (riel@localhost) by duckman.conectiva.com.br (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5FKbgj25051; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:37:42 -0300 X-Authentication-Warning: duckman.distro.conectiva: riel owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:37:41 -0300 (BRST) From: Rik van Riel X-X-Sender: To: Terry Lambert Cc: Mike Silbersack , Devin Butterfield , Alfred Perlstein , Rajappa Iyer , Subject: Re: Sysadmin article In-Reply-To: <3B29D0BF.5D6BE93E@mindspring.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Terry Lambert wrote: > [ ... Eliza program for FreeBSD ... ] > > Doing this is non-trivial. Many of the things they should > have tuned can not be tuned except at compile time. I think you just hit the nail on the head and managed to identify the problem... regards, Rik -- Executive summary of a recent Microsoft press release: "we are concerned about the GNU General Public License (GPL)" http://www.surriel.com/ http://www.conectiva.com/ http://distro.conectiva.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 13:49:36 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B38737B403; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:49:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5FKnOK51754; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:49:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:49:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106152049.f5FKnOK51754@earth.backplane.com> To: Robert Watson Cc: Dragos Ruiu , Alfred Perlstein , Rajappa Iyer , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Dragos Ruiu wrote: : :> I would heartily endorse having the out of the box FreeBSD install be :> tuned better... :> :> Sysadmin can't be knocked for not doing the tuning as running an out of :> the box config is what a vast majority of users do, imho, so their :> performance tests and the poor results from FreeBSD are perfectly valid :> indication of what can be expected without tuning. :> :> Softupdates on by default sounds great to me, as I can't think of any :> common situations that would be hurt by it. But I'm sure someone will :> correct me if I'm wrong on this. Now if we could only speed up SMP :> too... : :Well, I think this is especially true in light of the recent decision to :turn WCE back on by default for IDE. : :Robert N M Watson FreeBSD Core Team, TrustedBSD Project :robert@fledge.watson.org NAI Labs, Safeport Network Services On the otherhand, what these people were testing was a 'high performance' system. If you intend to push a system to its limits, you damn well better be prepared to tune it properly or you are just wasting your time. On any operating system. You will never find joe-user running his system into the ground with thousands of simultanious connections and ten thousand files in a mail directory, so it's silly to configure the system from a joe-user perspective. Slashdot respondants did a pretty good job identifying the problems - network mbufs, softupdates, Robert here just brought up the possibility of IDE write caching being turned off, etc etc etc. The fact that the bozos doing the 'benchmark' knew about sysctl but only tuned the file descriptor limit is a pretty good indication of how biased they were. I'll bet they didn't even bother compiling up a kernel... something that is utterly trivial in a FreeBSD system, and if they did they certainly didn't bother tuning it. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 13:57:30 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from winston.osd.bsdi.com (adsl-64-173-15-98.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net [64.173.15.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C82BC37B409 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:57:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) Received: from localhost (jkh@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by winston.osd.bsdi.com (8.11.4/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5FKvDt58845 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:57:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? X-Mailer: Mew version 1.94.1 on Emacs 20.7 / Mule 4.0 (HANANOEN) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20010615135713Y.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:57:13 -0700 From: Jordan Hubbard X-Dispatcher: imput version 20000228(IM140) Lines: 13 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the community that they were, when I set about to "prove" it I found it to be less easy than I'd thought. I've strings'd various binaries and DLLs in my copy of Windows 98 but have yet to find anything resembling proof. Does anyone out there have any details or discovery techniques for confirming or disproving this assertion either way? It would be very useful (for us) from a PR standpoint to know. Thanks! - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 14: 1: 8 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net (gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.121.85]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D55C37B403 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:00:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from steveb99@earthlink.net) Received: from DROID (dhcp206.mis.earthlink.net [207.217.66.246]) by gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net (EL-8_9_3_3/8.9.3) with SMTP id OAA13207; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:00:33 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <002201c0f5de$1f3844a0$f642d9cf@DROID> From: "Steve B." To: , "Jordan Hubbard" References: <20010615135713Y.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:59:51 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG What I read awhile back was MS licensed from BSDi their TCP/IP stack for use in W2K. Steve B. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jordan Hubbard" To: Sent: Friday, June 15, 2001 1:57 PM Subject: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? > I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as > to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user > utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the > community that they were, when I set about to "prove" it I found it to > be less easy than I'd thought. I've strings'd various binaries and > DLLs in my copy of Windows 98 but have yet to find anything resembling > proof. Does anyone out there have any details or discovery techniques > for confirming or disproving this assertion either way? It would be > very useful (for us) from a PR standpoint to know. > > Thanks! > > - Jordan > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 14: 1:42 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from winston.osd.bsdi.com (adsl-64-173-15-98.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net [64.173.15.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBC4137B408 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:01:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) Received: from localhost (jkh@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by winston.osd.bsdi.com (8.11.4/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5FL1Ht58896; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:01:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) To: steveb99@earthlink.net Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? In-Reply-To: <002201c0f5de$1f3844a0$f642d9cf@DROID> References: <20010615135713Y.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> <002201c0f5de$1f3844a0$f642d9cf@DROID> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.94.1 on Emacs 20.7 / Mule 4.0 (HANANOEN) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20010615140117A.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:01:17 -0700 From: Jordan Hubbard X-Dispatcher: imput version 20000228(IM140) Lines: 40 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Do you have a pointer to what you read? I really need HARD evidence here, not just anecdotal stuff. Thanks! - Jordan From: "Steve B." Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:59:51 -0700 > What I read awhile back was MS licensed from BSDi their TCP/IP stack for use > in W2K. > > Steve B. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jordan Hubbard" > To: > Sent: Friday, June 15, 2001 1:57 PM > Subject: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? > > > > I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as > > to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user > > utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the > > community that they were, when I set about to "prove" it I found it to > > be less easy than I'd thought. I've strings'd various binaries and > > DLLs in my copy of Windows 98 but have yet to find anything resembling > > proof. Does anyone out there have any details or discovery techniques > > for confirming or disproving this assertion either way? It would be > > very useful (for us) from a PR standpoint to know. > > > > Thanks! > > > > - Jordan > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 14: 5: 7 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from newgold.net (newgold.net [209.42.222.44]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D972E37B401 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:04:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jmallett@newgold.net) Received: (qmail 11866 invoked by uid 1000); 15 Jun 2001 21:01:16 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:01:16 -0400 (EDT) From: "Joseph A. Mallett" X-X-Sender: To: Jordan Hubbard Cc: Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? In-Reply-To: <20010615135713Y.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Do you happen to have any of their Winsock propoganda handy (specifically developer materials or winsock.h header file)? I know for a fact that they have said repetedly that some of it was taken directly from Berkely. I'm just not sure where... I'm going to start digging through my stuff to see if I can find anything. -- [ Joseph Mallett ] [ http://srcsys.org ] [ xMach Core Team xMach: Proactively Unbloated Microkernel BSD ] [ FreeBSD, NetBSD, & xMach User; (Obj)C(++) Coder ] [ http://xMach.org ] On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Jordan Hubbard wrote: > I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as > to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user > utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the > community that they were, when I set about to "prove" it I found it to > be less easy than I'd thought. I've strings'd various binaries and > DLLs in my copy of Windows 98 but have yet to find anything resembling > proof. Does anyone out there have any details or discovery techniques > for confirming or disproving this assertion either way? It would be > very useful (for us) from a PR standpoint to know. > > Thanks! > > - Jordan > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 14: 5:22 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.yogotech.com (ns.yogotech.com [206.127.123.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A45737B401 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:05:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nate@yogotech.com) Received: from nomad.yogotech.com (nomad.yogotech.com [206.127.123.131]) by ns.yogotech.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA19443; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 15:05:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from nate@nomad.yogotech.com) Received: (from nate@localhost) by nomad.yogotech.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA25061; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 15:05:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from nate) From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <15146.30861.669216.436091@nomad.yogotech.com> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 15:05:17 -0600 (MDT) To: Jordan Hubbard Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? In-Reply-To: <20010615135713Y.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> References: <20010615135713Y.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.75 under 21.1 (patch 12) "Channel Islands" XEmacs Lucid Reply-To: nate@yogotech.com (Nate Williams) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as > to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user > utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the > community that they were, when I set about to "prove" it I found it to > be less easy than I'd thought. I've strings'd various binaries and > DLLs in my copy of Windows 98 but have yet to find anything resembling > proof. Does anyone out there have any details or discovery techniques > for confirming or disproving this assertion either way? It would be > very useful (for us) from a PR standpoint to know. I think the nmap folks noticed that the stack in Win98 (I don't remember if it was in Win2K as wll) behaved almost exactly like the BSD stack in ways that weren't mandatory. Their conclusion was that it had to be based on the BSD code to get such similar behavior, since no other stack behaved in this manner. Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 14:10:14 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from newgold.net (newgold.net [209.42.222.44]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 105AE37B403 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:09:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jmallett@newgold.net) Received: (qmail 20516 invoked by uid 1000); 15 Jun 2001 21:06:23 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:06:23 -0400 (EDT) From: "Joseph A. Mallett" X-X-Sender: To: Jordan Hubbard Cc: Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/psdk/winsock/apistart_9g1e.htm mentions BSD, not sure if is direct enough. I'm downloading the SDK right now so I can grepmonkey through the latest and greatest headers, etc. HTH -- [ Joseph Mallett ] [ http://srcsys.org ] [ xMach Core Team xMach: Proactively Unbloated Microkernel BSD ] [ FreeBSD, NetBSD, & xMach User; (Obj)C(++) Coder ] [ http://xMach.org ] On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Joseph A. Mallett wrote: > Do you happen to have any of their Winsock propoganda handy (specifically > developer materials or winsock.h header file)? I know for a fact that they > have said repetedly that some of it was taken directly from Berkely. I'm > just not sure where... I'm going to start digging through my stuff to see > if I can find anything. > > -- > [ Joseph Mallett ] [ http://srcsys.org ] > [ xMach Core Team xMach: Proactively Unbloated Microkernel BSD ] > [ FreeBSD, NetBSD, & xMach User; (Obj)C(++) Coder ] [ http://xMach.org ] > > On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Jordan Hubbard wrote: > > > I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as > > to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user > > utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the > > community that they were, when I set about to "prove" it I found it to > > be less easy than I'd thought. I've strings'd various binaries and > > DLLs in my copy of Windows 98 but have yet to find anything resembling > > proof. Does anyone out there have any details or discovery techniques > > for confirming or disproving this assertion either way? It would be > > very useful (for us) from a PR standpoint to know. > > > > Thanks! > > > > - Jordan > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 14:10:14 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ringworld.nanolink.com (diskworld.nanolink.com [195.24.48.189]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 283FE37B405 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:09:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roam@orbitel.bg) Received: (qmail 1229 invoked by uid 1000); 15 Jun 2001 21:08:22 -0000 Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 00:08:22 +0300 From: Peter Pentchev To: Jordan Hubbard Cc: steveb99@earthlink.net, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? Message-ID: <20010616000822.B731@ringworld.oblivion.bg> Mail-Followup-To: Jordan Hubbard , steveb99@earthlink.net, hackers@freebsd.org References: <20010615135713Y.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> <002201c0f5de$1f3844a0$f642d9cf@DROID> <20010615140117A.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010615140117A.jkh@osd.bsdi.com>; from jkh@osd.bsdi.com on Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 02:01:17PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG With the full knowledge that what I'm saying will probably be of no use, I have a personal friend who is a Microsoft certified developer, with full access to the source code of most Windows versions and other well-known Microsoft apps. He has told me more than once that, yes, the NT TCP/IP stack is somewhat BSD-derived, but from other conversations I gather that he has had to change things on his personal machines (things that never made it, and probably never will, in any MS official distribution), to make it *more* BSD-like. I'll ask him for details, and for any links, but you shouldn't really expect an answer before Monday.. G'luck, Peter -- When you are not looking at it, this sentence is in Spanish. On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 02:01:17PM -0700, Jordan Hubbard wrote: > Do you have a pointer to what you read? I really need HARD evidence > here, not just anecdotal stuff. Thanks! > > - Jordan > > From: "Steve B." > Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? > Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:59:51 -0700 > > > What I read awhile back was MS licensed from BSDi their TCP/IP stack for use > > in W2K. > > > > Steve B. > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Jordan Hubbard" > > To: > > Sent: Friday, June 15, 2001 1:57 PM > > Subject: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? > > > > > > > I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as > > > to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user > > > utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the > > > community that they were, when I set about to "prove" it I found it to > > > be less easy than I'd thought. I've strings'd various binaries and > > > DLLs in my copy of Windows 98 but have yet to find anything resembling > > > proof. Does anyone out there have any details or discovery techniques > > > for confirming or disproving this assertion either way? It would be > > > very useful (for us) from a PR standpoint to know. > > > > > > Thanks! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 14:23: 7 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailsrv.otenet.gr (mailsrv.otenet.gr [195.170.0.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4495F37B403 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:21:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from keramida@ceid.upatras.gr) Received: from hades.hell.gr (patr530-a011.otenet.gr [212.205.215.11]) by mailsrv.otenet.gr (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5FLLYp13934; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 00:21:35 +0300 (EEST) Received: (from charon@localhost) by hades.hell.gr (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5FIbdT12777; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 21:37:39 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from keramida@ceid.upatras.gr) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 21:37:39 +0300 From: Giorgos Keramidas To: Rajappa Iyer Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Message-ID: <20010615213739.B12591@hades.hell.gr> References: <200106150223.f5F2NLW08368@panix1.panix.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200106150223.f5F2NLW08368@panix1.panix.com>; from rsi@panix.com on Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 10:23:21PM -0400 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 3A 75 52 EB F1 58 56 0D - C5 B8 21 B6 1B 5E 4A C2 X-URL: http://students.ceid.upatras.gr/~keramida/index.html Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 10:23:21PM -0400, Rajappa Iyer wrote: > http://www.sysadminmag.com/articles/2001/0107/0107a/0107a.htm > > Any obvious reasons why FreeBSD performed so poorly for these people? Yes, it's not very difficult to guess why. If you read the tuning(7) manpage in recent 4.x FreeBSD systems you will notice that even the order in which you lay out the partitions on the disks ruding installation time can play a significant role in filesystem speed. Softupdates are disabled by default, and for a good reason too (reliability is more important than raw speed to the people who install FreeBSD for the first time; if it isn't they can always enable softupdates later on). Write-back caching is disabled in the disks, even if they support it. This is yet another step towards making the default installation of FreeBSD as reliable a system as it can be. Installing an operating system (be it FreeBSD, linux, Windows or what else) and failing to tune the system to perform as good as possible for the application, is no decent way of doing a benchmark. And when is comes to benchmarks, you have to tune ALL the systems that are involved. You have to perform the test on identical hardware (if such a thing is ever possible[1]). When doing benchmarks, you have to present a lot more data than a simple bar or line graph with the results, for the benchmarks to be of any practical value to somebody else. An exact description of the hardware involved, details about the installation of the software, tuning decisions and tweaks performed during installation that will make the software perform better for a given application, what application you are interested in and testing with this benchmark, post installation tuning, what software you used for doing the benchmark, was it compiled by you or somebody else? what compiler and tools you used to generate the software of the benchmark, what special options you gave if any, and finally what the benchmark was, how long it took, did it finish successfully or fail, and those infamous charts with the results. You see, there's more to a benchmark than just a few charts, and we have not been given account about any of that by the authors of the articles in question. -giorgos [1] Even disks os the same manufacturer, and the same declared size, speed, characteristics, etc. do have slight differences some times. [-- Sorry about this long rant, but the whole story about this article is starting to get on my nerves :P --] To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 14:30:33 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tara.freenix.org (keltia.freenix.org [62.4.20.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1412337B406 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:30:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roberto@tara.freenix.org) Received: by tara.freenix.org (Postfix/TLS, from userid 101) id 6F95A233; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 23:30:13 +0200 (CEST) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 23:30:13 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? Message-ID: <20010615233013.A26606@tara.freenix.org> Mail-Followup-To: hackers@freebsd.org References: <20010615135713Y.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> <002201c0f5de$1f3844a0$f642d9cf@DROID> <20010615140117A.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010615140117A.jkh@osd.bsdi.com>; from jkh@osd.bsdi.com on Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 02:01:17PM -0700 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 5.0-CURRENT K6-3D/266 & 2x PPro/200 SMP Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG According to Jordan Hubbard: > Do you have a pointer to what you read? I really need HARD evidence > here, not just anecdotal stuff. Thanks! If you do a strings on ftp.exe (at least in win95), you should find some BSD copyright strings. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 5.0-CURRENT #80: Sun Jun 4 22:44:19 CEST 2000 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 14:34:19 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC4AA37B403 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:34:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5FLXll52567; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:33:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:33:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106152133.f5FLXll52567@earth.backplane.com> To: Giorgos Keramidas Cc: Rajappa Iyer , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article References: <200106150223.f5F2NLW08368@panix1.panix.com> <20010615213739.B12591@hades.hell.gr> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :softupdates later on). Write-back caching is disabled in the disks, :even if they support it. This is yet another step towards making the :default installation of FreeBSD as reliable a system as it can be. Well, not any more... we caved in on that one because the performance loss was insane. But for 4.2 it was turned off. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 14:42:49 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from harmony.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1964337B406 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:42:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.11.3/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5FLgKV25076; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 15:42:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Message-Id: <200106152142.f5FLgKV25076@harmony.village.org> To: Jordan Hubbard Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system [summary] Cc: kevin.way@overtone.org, drosih@rpi.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 14 Jun 2001 10:48:49 PDT." <20010614104849C.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> References: <20010614104849C.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> <200106140625.CAA16520@ns1.ecoutez.net> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 15:42:20 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <20010614104849C.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Jordan Hubbard writes: : I think that since we use CVS around here, we should simply import the I agree. Let's just cvs import the NetBSD stuff verbatim and unmodified on a vendor branch, but allow for limited commits to those files by folks that have really been working on it. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 14:43:11 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from winston.osd.bsdi.com (adsl-64-173-15-98.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net [64.173.15.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 955DA37B406 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:42:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) Received: from localhost (jkh@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by winston.osd.bsdi.com (8.11.4/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5FLgZt59109; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:42:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) To: jmallett@xMach.org Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: Mew version 1.94.1 on Emacs 20.7 / Mule 4.0 (HANANOEN) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20010615144235I.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:42:35 -0700 From: Jordan Hubbard X-Dispatcher: imput version 20000228(IM140) Lines: 71 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This is a good reference, but sadly it only really refers to "the sockets paradigm as first popularized by BSD", which means they could have followed the API without touching a single line of BSD code. To reiterate: What I'm looking for is some true, hard evidence that Microsoft has used BSD code in any of their operating systems. A number of people have sent me anecdotal evidence and "I heard from a friend" type stories, but sadly I cannot use any of that. What I need is tangible proof - the people working on this story have already heard all the stories and now what they're looking for is the kind of confirmation that can be cited and independently verified. I can't name names, but suffice it to say that it will be a small (and very visible) coup for us if we can help them prove this. Thanks. - Jordan From: "Joseph A. Mallett" Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:06:23 -0400 (EDT) > http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/psdk/winsock/apistart_9g1e.htm mentions > BSD, not sure if is direct enough. > > I'm downloading the SDK right now so I can grepmonkey through the latest > and greatest headers, etc. > > HTH > > -- > [ Joseph Mallett ] [ http://srcsys.org ] > [ xMach Core Team xMach: Proactively Unbloated Microkernel BSD ] > [ FreeBSD, NetBSD, & xMach User; (Obj)C(++) Coder ] [ http://xMach.org ] > > On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Joseph A. Mallett wrote: > > > Do you happen to have any of their Winsock propoganda handy (specifically > > developer materials or winsock.h header file)? I know for a fact that they > > have said repetedly that some of it was taken directly from Berkely. I'm > > just not sure where... I'm going to start digging through my stuff to see > > if I can find anything. > > > > -- > > [ Joseph Mallett ] [ http://srcsys.org ] > > [ xMach Core Team xMach: Proactively Unbloated Microkernel BSD ] > > [ FreeBSD, NetBSD, & xMach User; (Obj)C(++) Coder ] [ http://xMach.org ] > > > > On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Jordan Hubbard wrote: > > > > > I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as > > > to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user > > > utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the > > > community that they were, when I set about to "prove" it I found it to > > > be less easy than I'd thought. I've strings'd various binaries and > > > DLLs in my copy of Windows 98 but have yet to find anything resembling > > > proof. Does anyone out there have any details or discovery techniques > > > for confirming or disproving this assertion either way? It would be > > > very useful (for us) from a PR standpoint to know. > > > > > > Thanks! > > > > > > - Jordan > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 14:48:13 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from winston.osd.bsdi.com (adsl-64-173-15-98.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net [64.173.15.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8753737B40D for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:48:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) Received: from localhost (jkh@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by winston.osd.bsdi.com (8.11.4/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5FLlLt59168; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:47:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? In-Reply-To: <20010615233013.A26606@tara.freenix.org> References: <002201c0f5de$1f3844a0$f642d9cf@DROID> <20010615140117A.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> <20010615233013.A26606@tara.freenix.org> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.94.1 on Emacs 20.7 / Mule 4.0 (HANANOEN) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20010615144721D.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:47:21 -0700 From: Jordan Hubbard X-Dispatcher: imput version 20000228(IM140) Lines: 26 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Thanks, that represents the first "hard hit" I've seen yet: root@winston-> strings FTP.EXE |grep "University of California" @(#) Copyright (c) 1983 The Regents of the University of California. Now if we can just locate something in the kernel or a well-used DLL.. - Jordan From: Ollivier Robert Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 23:30:13 +0200 > According to Jordan Hubbard: > > Do you have a pointer to what you read? I really need HARD evidence > > here, not just anecdotal stuff. Thanks! > > If you do a strings on ftp.exe (at least in win95), you should find some BSD > copyright strings. > -- > Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr > FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 5.0-CURRENT #80: Sun Jun 4 22:44:19 CEST 2000 > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 14:51:16 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dalek.xmach.org (xMach.org [209.42.222.42]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 54B1C37B401 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:51:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jmallett@xMach.org) Received: (qmail 99265 invoked by uid 1000); 15 Jun 2001 21:50:00 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 15 Jun 2001 21:50:00 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:50:00 -0400 (EDT) From: Joseph Mallett To: Jordan Hubbard Cc: Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? In-Reply-To: <20010615144235I.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Message-ID: <20010615174835.N99254-100000@Dalek.xMach.ORG> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Well, looking through headers, a lot of stuff says "taken from the BSD file...", namely winsock.h and winsock2.h, at the very least it appears they have designed it with some goal of being backwards compatible with BSD sockets by using BSD structures, functions, whatever, but the actual winsock code may or may not be taken from BSD. Is there anyone at Microsoft you could ask? -- Joseph Mallett, jmallett@xMach.org xMach Core Team, http://xMach.org/ http://people.xMach.org/~jmallett/ On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Jordan Hubbard wrote: > This is a good reference, but sadly it only really refers to "the > sockets paradigm as first popularized by BSD", which means they could > have followed the API without touching a single line of BSD code. > > To reiterate: What I'm looking for is some true, hard evidence that > Microsoft has used BSD code in any of their operating systems. A > number of people have sent me anecdotal evidence and "I heard from a > friend" type stories, but sadly I cannot use any of that. What I need > is tangible proof - the people working on this story have already > heard all the stories and now what they're looking for is the kind of > confirmation that can be cited and independently verified. I can't > name names, but suffice it to say that it will be a small (and very > visible) coup for us if we can help them prove this. Thanks. > > - Jordan > > From: "Joseph A. Mallett" > Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? > Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:06:23 -0400 (EDT) > > > http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/psdk/winsock/apistart_9g1e.htm mentions > > BSD, not sure if is direct enough. > > > > I'm downloading the SDK right now so I can grepmonkey through the latest > > and greatest headers, etc. > > > > HTH > > > > -- > > [ Joseph Mallett ] [ http://srcsys.org ] > > [ xMach Core Team xMach: Proactively Unbloated Microkernel BSD ] > > [ FreeBSD, NetBSD, & xMach User; (Obj)C(++) Coder ] [ http://xMach.org ] > > > > On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Joseph A. Mallett wrote: > > > > > Do you happen to have any of their Winsock propoganda handy (specifically > > > developer materials or winsock.h header file)? I know for a fact that they > > > have said repetedly that some of it was taken directly from Berkely. I'm > > > just not sure where... I'm going to start digging through my stuff to see > > > if I can find anything. > > > > > > -- > > > [ Joseph Mallett ] [ http://srcsys.org ] > > > [ xMach Core Team xMach: Proactively Unbloated Microkernel BSD ] > > > [ FreeBSD, NetBSD, & xMach User; (Obj)C(++) Coder ] [ http://xMach.org ] > > > > > > On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Jordan Hubbard wrote: > > > > > > > I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as > > > > to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user > > > > utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the > > > > community that they were, when I set about to "prove" it I found it to > > > > be less easy than I'd thought. I've strings'd various binaries and > > > > DLLs in my copy of Windows 98 but have yet to find anything resembling > > > > proof. Does anyone out there have any details or discovery techniques > > > > for confirming or disproving this assertion either way? It would be > > > > very useful (for us) from a PR standpoint to know. > > > > > > > > Thanks! > > > > > > > > - Jordan > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > > > > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 14:52:53 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obsecurity.dyndns.org (adsl-63-207-60-13.dsl.lsan03.pacbell.net [63.207.60.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82CE237B401 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:52:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kris@obsecurity.org) Received: by obsecurity.dyndns.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id E358466D15; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:52:47 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:52:47 -0700 From: Kris Kennaway To: Nate Williams Cc: Jordan Hubbard , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? Message-ID: <20010615145247.A79042@xor.obsecurity.org> References: <20010615135713Y.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> <15146.30861.669216.436091@nomad.yogotech.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <15146.30861.669216.436091@nomad.yogotech.com>; from nate@yogotech.com on Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 03:05:17PM -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 03:05:17PM -0600, Nate Williams wrote: > > I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as > > to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user > > utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the > > community that they were, when I set about to "prove" it I found it to > > be less easy than I'd thought. I've strings'd various binaries and > > DLLs in my copy of Windows 98 but have yet to find anything resembling > > proof. Does anyone out there have any details or discovery techniques > > for confirming or disproving this assertion either way? It would be > > very useful (for us) from a PR standpoint to know. > > I think the nmap folks noticed that the stack in Win98 (I don't remember > if it was in Win2K as wll) behaved almost exactly like the BSD stack in > ways that weren't mandatory. Their conclusion was that it had to be > based on the BSD code to get such similar behavior, since no other stack > behaved in this manner. One signature of this might be vulnerability history: there have been a number of corner-case IP stack vulnerabilities over the years which were also shared by Windows and may indicate a common code heritage. Of course, it's still not conclusive. Kris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 14:57:50 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from winston.osd.bsdi.com (adsl-64-173-15-98.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net [64.173.15.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDDFA37B405 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:57:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) Received: from localhost (jkh@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by winston.osd.bsdi.com (8.11.4/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5FLvNt59231; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:57:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) To: jmallett@xMach.org Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? In-Reply-To: <20010615174835.N99254-100000@Dalek.xMach.ORG> References: <20010615144235I.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> <20010615174835.N99254-100000@Dalek.xMach.ORG> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.94.1 on Emacs 20.7 / Mule 4.0 (HANANOEN) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20010615145723I.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:57:23 -0700 From: Jordan Hubbard X-Dispatcher: imput version 20000228(IM140) Lines: 16 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG From: Joseph Mallett Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:50:00 -0400 (EDT) > Well, looking through headers, a lot of stuff says "taken from the BSD > file...", namely winsock.h and winsock2.h, at the very least it appears > they have designed it with some goal of being backwards compatible with > BSD sockets by using BSD structures, functions, whatever, but the actual > winsock code may or may not be taken from BSD. > > Is there anyone at Microsoft you could ask? Not really, I don't have any contacts there. Sigh. I didn't think proving this would be quite so hard. :( - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 14:58:42 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from swan.mail.pas.earthlink.net (swan.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.123]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B23337B401 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:58:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from steveb99@earthlink.net) Received: from DROID (dhcp206.mis.earthlink.net [207.217.66.246]) by swan.mail.pas.earthlink.net (EL-8_9_3_3/8.9.3) with SMTP id OAA06802; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:58:31 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <000e01c0f5e6$3a469000$f642d9cf@DROID> From: "Steve B." To: "Jordan Hubbard" Cc: References: <20010615135713Y.jkh@osd.bsdi.com><002201c0f5de$1f3844a0$f642d9cf@DROID> <20010615140117A.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:57:52 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'll see if I can dig it up it was awhile back in one of the trade magazines or their ezine. Steve B. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jordan Hubbard" To: Cc: Sent: Friday, June 15, 2001 2:01 PM Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? > Do you have a pointer to what you read? I really need HARD evidence > here, not just anecdotal stuff. Thanks! > > - Jordan > > From: "Steve B." > Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? > Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:59:51 -0700 > > > What I read awhile back was MS licensed from BSDi their TCP/IP stack for use > > in W2K. > > > > Steve B. > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Jordan Hubbard" > > To: > > Sent: Friday, June 15, 2001 1:57 PM > > Subject: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? > > > > > > > I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as > > > to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user > > > utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the > > > community that they were, when I set about to "prove" it I found it to > > > be less easy than I'd thought. I've strings'd various binaries and > > > DLLs in my copy of Windows 98 but have yet to find anything resembling > > > proof. Does anyone out there have any details or discovery techniques > > > for confirming or disproving this assertion either way? It would be > > > very useful (for us) from a PR standpoint to know. > > > > > > Thanks! > > > > > > - Jordan > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 15: 2:58 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mcp.csh.rit.edu (mcp.csh.rit.edu [129.21.60.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 199EB37B403 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 15:02:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jon@csh.rit.edu) Received: from fury.csh.rit.edu (fury.csh.rit.edu [129.21.60.5]) by mcp.csh.rit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D716100B; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 18:02:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: by fury.csh.rit.edu (Postfix, from userid 37404) id 4CDE92E3EE; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 18:02:44 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 18:02:44 -0400 From: Jon Parise To: Jordan Hubbard Cc: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? Message-ID: <20010615180243.H28367@csh.rit.edu> Mail-Followup-To: Jordan Hubbard , roberto@keltia.freenix.fr, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <002201c0f5de$1f3844a0$f642d9cf@DROID> <20010615140117A.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> <20010615233013.A26606@tara.freenix.org> <20010615144721D.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.12i In-Reply-To: <20010615144721D.jkh@osd.bsdi.com>; from jkh@osd.bsdi.com on Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 02:47:21PM -0700 X-Operating-System: SunOS 5.8 (sun4u) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 02:47:21PM -0700, Jordan Hubbard wrote: > Thanks, that represents the first "hard hit" I've seen yet: > > root@winston-> strings FTP.EXE |grep "University of California" > @(#) Copyright (c) 1983 The Regents of the University of California. Here's one more: (echo) [system32]$ strings NSLOOKUP.EXE | grep -i copyright @(#) Copyright (c) 1985,1989 Regents of the University of California. > Now if we can just locate something in the kernel or a well-used > DLL.. No similar luck with any of the DLL's on my Windows 2000 file system. -- Jon Parise (jon@csh.rit.edu) . Rochester Inst. of Technology http://www.csh.rit.edu/~jon/ : Computer Science House Member To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 15:33: 2 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtpout.mac.com (smtpout.mac.com [204.179.120.89]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C3EB37B409 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 15:33:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from stripes@mac.com) Received: by smtpout.mac.com; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 15:32:13 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200106152232.PAA02958@smtpout.mac.com> Received: from asmtp02.mac.com ([10.13.10.66]) by smtp-relay02.mac.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.15) with ESMTP id GEZT9O00.BVB for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 15:32:12 -0700 Received: from localhost ([216.36.86.60]) by asmtp02.mac.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.15 asmtp02 Jun 6 2001 13:16:42) with ESMTP id GEZT9O00.G0N; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 15:32:12 -0700 Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 18:31:12 -0400 From: Josh Osborne Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG To: Giorgos Keramidas X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.388) In-Reply-To: <20010615213739.B12591@hades.hell.gr> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v388) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Friday, June 15, 2001, at 02:37 PM, Giorgos Keramidas wrote: > On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 10:23:21PM -0400, Rajappa Iyer wrote: >> http://www.sysadminmag.com/articles/2001/0107/0107a/0107a.htm >> >> Any obvious reasons why FreeBSD performed so poorly for these people? > > Yes, it's not very difficult to guess why. If you read the tuning(7) > manpage in recent 4.x FreeBSD systems you will notice that even the > order in which you lay out the partitions on the disks ruding > installation time can play a significant role in filesystem speed. > Softupdates are disabled by default, and for a good reason too > (reliability is more important than raw speed to the people who > install FreeBSD for the first time; if it isn't they can always enable > softupdates later on). [...] Is softupdates known to be unreliable, or is it merely a distrust of new code? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 16: 7:20 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from silby.com (cb34181-a.mdsn1.wi.home.com [24.14.173.39]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D33E637B401 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 16:07:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from silby@silby.com) Received: (qmail 26297 invoked by uid 1000); 15 Jun 2001 23:07:16 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 15 Jun 2001 23:07:16 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 18:07:16 -0500 (CDT) From: Mike Silbersack To: Matt Dillon Cc: Giorgos Keramidas , Rajappa Iyer , Subject: Re: Sysadmin article In-Reply-To: <200106152133.f5FLXll52567@earth.backplane.com> Message-ID: <20010615180408.T26286-100000@achilles.silby.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Matt Dillon wrote: > > :softupdates later on). Write-back caching is disabled in the disks, > :even if they support it. This is yet another step towards making the > :default installation of FreeBSD as reliable a system as it can be. > > Well, not any more... we caved in on that one because the performance > loss was insane. But for 4.2 it was turned off. > > -Matt Actually, I think write caching was on for 4.2. I'd hate to see what their benchmark would've shown with write caching and softupdates off. Of course, assuming dirpref and Ian's new directory cache have been MFC'd by the time 4.4 comes out, it will scream on that same benchmark. Mike "Silby" Silbersack To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 16:10:31 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0912C37B401 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 16:10:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5FNARK54338; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 16:10:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 16:10:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106152310.f5FNARK54338@earth.backplane.com> To: Mike Silbersack Cc: Giorgos Keramidas , Rajappa Iyer , Subject: Re: Sysadmin article References: <20010615180408.T26286-100000@achilles.silby.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Of course, assuming dirpref and Ian's new directory cache have been MFC'd :by the time 4.4 comes out, it will scream on that same benchmark. : :Mike "Silby" Silbersack Yup! Even without dirpref. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 16:22:43 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailsrv.otenet.gr (mailsrv.otenet.gr [195.170.0.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49AD137B406 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 16:22:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from keramida@ceid.upatras.gr) Received: from hades.hell.gr (patr530-a011.otenet.gr [212.205.215.11]) by mailsrv.otenet.gr (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5FNMap23759; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 02:22:36 +0300 (EEST) Received: (from charon@localhost) by hades.hell.gr (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5FNMdq56696; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 02:22:39 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from keramida@ceid.upatras.gr) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 02:22:39 +0300 From: Giorgos Keramidas To: Josh Osborne Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Message-ID: <20010616022239.A54416@hades.hell.gr> References: <20010615213739.B12591@hades.hell.gr> <200106152232.PAA02957@smtpout.mac.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200106152232.PAA02957@smtpout.mac.com>; from stripes@mac.com on Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 06:31:12PM -0400 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 3A 75 52 EB F1 58 56 0D - C5 B8 21 B6 1B 5E 4A C2 X-URL: http://students.ceid.upatras.gr/~keramida/index.html Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 06:31:12PM -0400, Josh Osborne wrote: > > On Friday, June 15, 2001, at 02:37 PM, Giorgos Keramidas wrote: > >> On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 10:23:21PM -0400, Rajappa Iyer wrote: >>> http://www.sysadminmag.com/articles/2001/0107/0107a/0107a.htm >>> >>> Any obvious reasons why FreeBSD performed so poorly for these people? >> >> Yes, it's not very difficult to guess why. If you read the tuning(7) >> manpage in recent 4.x FreeBSD systems you will notice that even the >> order in which you lay out the partitions on the disks ruding >> installation time can play a significant role in filesystem speed. >> Softupdates are disabled by default, and for a good reason too >> (reliability is more important than raw speed to the people who >> install FreeBSD for the first time; if it isn't they can always enable >> softupdates later on). [...] > > Is softupdates known to be unreliable, or is it merely a distrust of > new code? Matt has explained this better than I could ever do, in his tuning(7) manpage -- a recent, but very valuable addition to our manpages. To quote the manpage: First, softupdates guarentees filesystem consistency in the case of a crash but could very easily be several seconds (even a minute!) behind updating the physical disk. If you crash you may lose more work then otherwise. Secondly, softupdates delays the freeing of filesystem blocks. If you have a filesystem (such as the root filesystem) which is close to full, doing a major update of it, e.g. make installworld, can run it out of space and cause the update to fail. -giorgos To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 16:51:11 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp7ve.mailsrvcs.net (smtp7vepub.gte.net [206.46.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7372837B403 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 16:51:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from babkin@bellatlantic.net) Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-198-117-21.nnj.dialup.bellatlantic.net [151.198.117.21]) by smtp7ve.mailsrvcs.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id XAA33407613; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 23:50:57 GMT Message-ID: <3B2A9F60.A12AB917@bellatlantic.net> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 19:50:56 -0400 From: Sergey Babkin X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 4.0-19990626-CURRENT i386) X-Accept-Language: en, ru MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tlambert2@mindspring.com Cc: Robert Withrow , Cyrille Lefevre , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: <200106141357.JAA27316@pobox.engeast.BayNetworks.COM> <3B29B98E.DAF2ABE4@mindspring.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Terry Lambert wrote: > > Robert Withrow wrote: > > > > clefevre-lists@noos.fr said: > > :- oops, rc2 isn't started. too bad. > > > > I think that is exactly the desired design. The > > RC *system* starts things correctly, but the manager, > > *bypassing* the RC *system* can start and stop things > > exactly as he wished. For debugging or whatever. > > > > I'd argue that if you want to start/stop a *subtree*, you > > should ask the RC *system* to do that somehow. > > Run levels or run states? > > It would be damned useful, for every embedded system I've > ever used FreeBSD for (four now, but who's counting?) to > be able to say: How about keeping the state of the system as empty files in a subdirectory, say, /etc/rcstate.d. This directory would be cleaned up at boot time and then as each of the service startup script is run (and completed successfully), an empty file with the same name would be created in this directory. Reversely, when a service shutdown script is completed (or started ?), the state file is removed. This will allow to define the run states easily as empty rc scripts containing only dependency information in them. Of course, an interesting question is what to do if a shutdown script fails: this may leave the service running or leave it only partially running and thus non-functional. This can be solved by introducing the states "startup or shutdown in progress" and "unknown, possibly broken". -SB To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 17: 0:45 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp4ve.mailsrvcs.net (smtp4vepub.gte.net [206.46.170.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D3ED37B401 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:00:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from babkin@bellatlantic.net) Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-198-117-21.nnj.dialup.bellatlantic.net [151.198.117.21]) by smtp4ve.mailsrvcs.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id AAA41680058; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 00:00:35 GMT Message-ID: <3B2AA1A2.B8261530@bellatlantic.net> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 20:00:34 -0400 From: Sergey Babkin X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 4.0-19990626-CURRENT i386) X-Accept-Language: en, ru MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jordan Hubbard Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? References: <20010615135713Y.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jordan Hubbard wrote: > > I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as > to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user > utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the > community that they were, when I set about to "prove" it I found it to > be less easy than I'd thought. I've strings'd various binaries and > DLLs in my copy of Windows 98 but have yet to find anything resembling > proof. Does anyone out there have any details or discovery techniques > for confirming or disproving this assertion either way? It would be > very useful (for us) from a PR standpoint to know. I know one way but it's a hard one: disassemble and manually decomiple the code and compare it with the BSD code. I've once done such a research on the HP-UX pty code (for other reasons) and it matched the BSD code practically exactly except for the added spin locks. -SB To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 17: 9:22 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dan.emsphone.com (dan.emsphone.com [199.67.51.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13C9937B406 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:09:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dan@dan.emsphone.com) Received: (from dan@localhost) by dan.emsphone.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5G098208897; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 19:09:08 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dan) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 19:09:07 -0500 From: Dan Nelson To: Jordan Hubbard Cc: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? Message-ID: <20010615190907.A3511@dan.emsphone.com> References: <002201c0f5de$1f3844a0$f642d9cf@DROID> <20010615140117A.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> <20010615233013.A26606@tara.freenix.org> <20010615144721D.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20010615144721D.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.19i X-OS: FreeBSD 5.0-CURRENT Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In the last episode (Jun 15), Jordan Hubbard said: > Thanks, that represents the first "hard hit" I've seen yet: > > root@winston-> strings FTP.EXE |grep "University of California" > @(#) Copyright (c) 1983 The Regents of the University of California. But this probably just means that FTP.EXE is based off the BSD ftp source; you're looking for evidence that the kernel itself has BSD stack code in it, right? -- Dan Nelson dnelson@emsphone.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 17:55:44 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gandalf.vi.bravenet.com (gandalf.bravenet.com [139.142.105.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 7F08037B406 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:55:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dphoenix@bravenet.com) Received: (qmail 27693 invoked by uid 1000); 16 Jun 2001 00:55:41 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 16 Jun 2001 00:55:41 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:55:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Dan Phoenix To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: high cpu spikes Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG nfs_getpages: error 70 vm_fault: pager read error, pid 72424 (httpd) I get occasional cpu spikes for like 10-20 sec occasionally wondering what this is from.....i am thinking nfs timeout maybe.... i am ready got maxusers set to 500. -- Dan +------------------------------------------------------+ | BRAVENET WEB SERVICES | | dan@bravenet.com | | screen;cd /usr/src;make buildworld;cd ~ | | cp MYKERNEL /sys/i386/conf;cd /usr/src | | make buildkernel KERNCONF=MYKERNEL | |make installkernel KERNCONF=MYKERNEL;make installworld| +______________________________________________________+ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 18:21:20 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from saturn.cs.uml.edu (saturn.cs.uml.edu [129.63.8.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB82F37B401 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 18:21:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from acahalan@saturn.cs.uml.edu) Received: (from acahalan@localhost) by saturn.cs.uml.edu (8.11.0/8.11.2) id f5G1LGo03119; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 21:21:16 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 21:21:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <200106160121.f5G1LGo03119@saturn.cs.uml.edu> From: "Albert D. Cahalan" To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: keramida@ceid.upatras.gr, rsi@panix.com Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Giorgos Keramidas writes: > Installing an operating system (be it FreeBSD, linux, Windows or what > else) and failing to tune the system to perform as good as possible > for the application, is no decent way of doing a benchmark. And when > is comes to benchmarks, you have to tune ALL the systems that are > involved. You have to perform the test on identical hardware (if such > a thing is ever possible[1]). No, no, no. You have to tune the systems EQUALLY. Um, how? :-) What if some random admin was picked to tune the systems? Maybe he is a Solaris admin, but he honestly tries to tune the other systems. Sure you wouldn't complain that he did a bad job if FreeBSD lost? Driver quality varies too, so hardware choice matters. It is not OK to test on identical hardware, unless the purchaser selects random off-the-shelf hardware to avoid any bias. There are 2 sane ways to benchmark: 1. Use an out-of-the box config on randomly selected hardware. This is what a typical low-paid admin will throw together, so it certainly is a valid test. It is best to run this test many times, since an OS may get unlucky with hardware selection. (tuning is equal: none at all) 2. Run an open bring-your-own hardware competition like SPECweb99. Every OS gets tuned by fanatical experts, and every OS gets the hardware it runs best on. Hardware selection can only be limited by purchase date and monetary value -- it isn't fair to specify how the money is spent. (tuning is equal: maximum possible) In the Sysadmin article, the biggest error was that the admin crudely tuned the FreeBSD and Linux boxes. He should have left both with out-of-the-box limits to be fair to NT and Solaris. It is absurd to suggest that he should have been hacking away at compile-time constants. Every OS had a default kernel. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 19: 0:37 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 761D937B403 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 19:00:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@ofug.org) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA38580; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 04:00:29 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des@ofug.org) X-URL: http://www.ofug.org/~des/ X-Disclaimer: The views expressed in this message do not necessarily coincide with those of any organisation or company with which I am or have been affiliated. To: Urban Olsson Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: modified natd again References: <778DFE9B4E3BD111A74E08002BA3DC0D03DA52BC@TRAB-HERMES> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 16 Jun 2001 04:00:28 +0200 In-Reply-To: <778DFE9B4E3BD111A74E08002BA3DC0D03DA52BC@TRAB-HERMES> Message-ID: Lines: 10 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) Emacs/20.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Urban Olsson writes: > Another strange thing is that when I try to use tcpdump it doesn=B4t show= all > packets. No packets are "dropped by kernel" but tcpdump have received > packets but don=B4t show them. Could this in some way be related. Use the -n option. DES --=20 Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@ofug.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 19: 8:34 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0938237B406 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 19:08:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@ofug.org) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA38599; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 04:08:25 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des@ofug.org) X-URL: http://www.ofug.org/~des/ X-Disclaimer: The views expressed in this message do not necessarily coincide with those of any organisation or company with which I am or have been affiliated. To: Giorgos Keramidas Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: strangeness in web interface of send-pr References: <20010613225749.F69527@hades.hell.gr> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 16 Jun 2001 04:08:24 +0200 In-Reply-To: <20010613225749.F69527@hades.hell.gr> Message-ID: Lines: 13 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) Emacs/20.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Giorgos Keramidas writes: > You can clearly see that (in line 3), I have chosen to view only PRs > whose state is `open' AND (line 2) severity is `critical', in an > effort to help closing first those PRs that are more important. Just ignore the severity and priority. They are set by the submitter and rarely if ever changed by committers, and are usually far more indicative of the submitter's state of mind than of the PR's importance. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@ofug.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 19:16:15 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailout2-0.nyroc.rr.com (mailout2-0.nyroc.rr.com [24.92.226.121]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2106B37B403 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 19:15:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from James_Bond_79@yahoo.com) Received: from Halstead007 (roc-24-169-196-57.rochester.rr.com [24.169.196.57]) by mailout2-0.nyroc.rr.com (8.11.2/RoadRunner 1.03) with SMTP id f5G2EKW10585 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 22:14:20 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; charset="iso-8859-1"; boundary="------------Boundary-00=_TW30PZ692KW4N44Q4M9R" From: James To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Mergemaster bug + new feature [patch] Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 22:22:05 -0400 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <01061522220501.06764@Halstead007> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --------------Boundary-00=_TW30PZ692KW4N44Q4M9R Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit It seems I have found a couple bugs, I noticed that mergemaster was always saying that the "install failed, the file has to be merged manually" even thought the install was successful. It would seem that the recent commit is using "install && test && rm" but the install program will already have removed the files without the "-c" option. Patch attached (including another bug I found) I have also attached a diff file adding a form of md5 checking to mergemaster. Basically what I did is add use a file "/var/db/mmsums.md5" containing the checksum of any cleanly installed files. Here is what it does/doesn't do: 1) every time mm_install is called it removes the checksum for the file being installed from the database. 2) After the call to mm_install, if the install returned as successful, mergemaster will generate the checksum for the newly installed file and put it in the database. This is only done for clean files, not files that were merged. 3) When doing the comparison, if it is found that the installed file was unchanged, mergemaster says so and offers the options without showing the diff, you can still see the diff by pressing v. 4) When the "-I" (capital i) option is specified mergemaster will automatically install any file where the installed version was unchanged. 5) I take advantage of the code that detects the cvs tag by adding the md5 of the file in the temproot directory (after "fixing" the output to have the correct path), this will speed up getting the md5's of clean files into the database. Those who felt the need could fairly easily create the initial database, however after the first mergemaster run any file that has the same $FreeBSD$ or is cleanly installed will be added. That should cover just about all the files. it would not be hard to add options to choose a different md5 database, or to disable the entire thing. As it is now you can specify the database or to use the new feature by setting 'CHECKSUMFILE' to be the file holding the checksum database, or unset'ing 'USE_CHECKSUMS' to disable the whole thing in the ~/.mergemasterrc. The attached files are cumulative. the "mergemaster.sh.diff" is the two bugfixes I have noticed, and the "mergemastermd5.sh.diff" is my new version of mergemaster (patch against the bugfixed version) I just ran my new mergemaster with a hand generated database and it properly detected unchanged files, I also ran it with no database and just about every file was regenerated from the tree versions. Tell me what you think! sorry, but i have not updated the man pages... James. --------------Boundary-00=_TW30PZ692KW4N44Q4M9R Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; name="mergemastermd5.sh.diff" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="mergemastermd5.sh.diff" LS0tIG1lcmdlbWFzdGVyLnNoCUZyaSBKdW4gMTUgMDE6MTg6MDUgMjAwMQorKysgbWVyZ2VtYXN0 ZXJtZDUuc2gJU2F0IEp1biAxNiAwMjoxMDoxNiAyMDAxCkBAIC0xNSw3ICsxNSw3IEBACiBkaXNw bGF5X3VzYWdlICgpIHsKICAgVkVSU0lPTl9OVU1CRVI9YGdyZXAgIlskXUZyZWVCU0Q6IiAkMCB8 IGN1dCAtZCAnICcgLWYgNGAKICAgZWNobyAibWVyZ2VtYXN0ZXIgdmVyc2lvbiAke1ZFUlNJT05f TlVNQkVSfSIKLSAgZWNobyAnVXNhZ2U6IG1lcmdlbWFzdGVyIFstc2NydmFoaV0gWy1tIC9wYXRo XScKKyAgZWNobyAnVXNhZ2U6IG1lcmdlbWFzdGVyIFstc2NydmFoaUldIFstbSAvcGF0aF0nCiAg IGVjaG8gJyAgICAgICAgIFstdCAvcGF0aF0gWy1kXSBbLXUgTl0gWy13IE5dIFstRCAvcGF0aF0n CiAgIGVjaG8gIk9wdGlvbnM6IgogICBlY2hvICIgIC1zICBTdHJpY3QgY29tcGFyaXNvbiAoZGlm ZiBldmVyeSBwYWlyIG9mIGZpbGVzKSIKQEAgLTI1LDYgKzI1LDcgQEAKICAgZWNobyAiICAtYSAg TGVhdmUgYWxsIGZpbGVzIHRoYXQgZGlmZmVyIHRvIG1lcmdlIGJ5IGhhbmQiCiAgIGVjaG8gIiAg LWggIERpc3BsYXkgbW9yZSBjb21wbGV0ZSBoZWxwIgogICBlY2hvICcgIC1pICBBdXRvbWF0aWNh bGx5IGluc3RhbGwgZmlsZXMgdGhhdCBkbyBub3QgZXhpc3QgaW4gZGVzdGluYXRpb24gZGlyZWN0 b3J5JworICBlY2hvICcgIC1JICBBdXRvbWF0aWNhbGx5IGluc3RhbGwgd2hlbiB0aGUgZGVzdGlu YXRpb24gZmlsZSAgaGFzIG5vdCBiZWVuIG1vZGlmaWVkJwogICBlY2hvICIgIC1tIC9wYXRoL2Rp cmVjdG9yeSAgU3BlY2lmeSBsb2NhdGlvbiBvZiBzb3VyY2UgdG8gZG8gdGhlIG1ha2UgaW4iCiAg IGVjaG8gIiAgLXQgL3BhdGgvZGlyZWN0b3J5ICBTcGVjaWZ5IHRlbXAgcm9vdCBkaXJlY3Rvcnki CiAgIGVjaG8gIiAgLWQgIEFkZCBkYXRlIGFuZCB0aW1lIHRvIGRpcmVjdG9yeSBuYW1lIChlLmcu LCAvdmFyL3RtcC90ZW1wcm9vdC5gZGF0ZSArJW0lZC4lSC4lTWApIgpAQCAtNDAsNiArNDEsOCBA QAogICBlY2hvICIqIFRoZSAtdyBvcHRpb24gdGFrZXMgYSBudW1iZXIgYXMgYW4gYXJndW1lbnQg Zm9yIHRoZSBjb2x1bW4gd2lkdGgiCiAgIGVjaG8gIiAgb2YgdGhlIHNjcmVlbi4gIFRoZSBkZWZh dWx0IGlzIDgwLiIKICAgZWNobyAnKiBUaGUgLWEgb3B0aW9uIGNhdXNlcyBtZXJnZW1hc3RlciB0 byBydW4gd2l0aG91dCBwcm9tcHRpbmcuJworICBlY2hvICcqIFRoZSAtSSBvcHRpb24gdXNlcyBt ZDUgY2hlY2tzdW1zIGdlbmVyYXRlZCB0aGUgbGFzdCB0aW1lIGEgZmlsZScKKyAgZWNobyAnICB3 YXMgaW5zdGFsbGVkIHRvIGRldGVjdCBjaGFuZ2VzLicKIH0KIAogIyBMb29wIGFsbG93aW5nIHRo ZSB1c2VyIHRvIHVzZSBzZGlmZiB0byBtZXJnZSBmaWxlcyBhbmQgZGlzcGxheSB0aGUgbWVyZ2Vk CkBAIC0xMDUsNiArMTA4LDMyIEBACiAKICAgSEFORExFX0NPTVBGSUxFPXYKIAorICAjIElmIHdl IGFyZSB1c2luZyBjaGVja3N1bXMsIHRoZW4gY2hlY2sgdG8gc2VlIGlmIHRoZSBsb2NhbCB2ZXJz aW9uIGhhcyBiZWVuIG1vZGlmaWVkCisgIGlmIFsgLWYgIiR7REVTVERJUn0ke0NPTVBGSUxFIy59 IiAtYSAtZiAiJHtDT01QRklMRX0iIF07IHRoZW4KKyAgICBjYXNlICIke1VTRV9DSEVDS1NVTVN9 IiBpbgorICAgIFtZeV1bRWVdW1NzXSkKKyAgICAgIGlmIFsgImBncmVwIFwoJHtERVNURElSfSR7 Q09NUEZJTEUjLn1cKSAke0NIRUNLU1VNRklMRX1gIiA9ICJgL3NiaW4vbWQ1ICR7REVTVERJUn0k e0NPTVBGSUxFIy59YCIgXTsgdGhlbgorICAgICAgICBlY2hvICIgICoqKiBUaGUgaW5zdGFsbGVk IHZlcnNpb24gb2YgJHtDT01QRklMRX0gaGFzIG5vdCBiZWVuIG1vZGlmaWVkIgorCSNEb24ndCBk aXNwbGF5IGRpZmYgdGhlIGZpcnN0IHRpbWUgd2hlbiBmaWxlIGlzIG5vdCBtb2RpZmllZC4KKyAg ICAgICAgSEFORExFX0NPTVBGSUxFPSJOT1QgViIKKyAgICAgICAgY2FzZSAiJHtBVVRPX0lOU1RB TExfVU5DSEFOR0VEfSIgaW4KKyAgICAgICAgW1l5XVtFZV1bU3NdKQorICAgICAgICAgIGlmIG1t X2luc3RhbGwgIiR7Q09NUEZJTEV9IjsgdGhlbgorICAgICAgICAgICAgZWNobyAiICAgKioqICR7 Q09NUEZJTEV9IGluc3RhbGxlZCBzdWNjZXNzZnVsbHkiCisgICAgICAgICAgICBBVVRPX0lOU1RB TExFRF9GSUxFU19NRDU9IiR7QVVUT19JTlNUQUxMRURfRklMRVNfTUQ1fSAgICAgICR7REVTVERJ Un0ke0NPTVBGSUxFIy59CisiCisgICAgICAgICAgICAvc2Jpbi9tZDUgJHtERVNURElSfSR7Q09N UEZJTEUjLn0gPj4gJHtDSEVDS1NVTUZJTEV9IDI+L2Rldi9udWxsCisgICAgICAgICAgZWxzZQor ICAgICAgICAgICAgZWNobyAiICAgKioqIFByb2JsZW0gaW5zdGFsbGluZyAke0NPTVBGSUxFfSwg aXQgd2lsbCByZW1haW4gdG8gbWVyZ2UgYnkgaGFuZCIKKyAgICAgICAgICBmaQorICAgICAgICAg IHJldHVybgorICAJICA7OworICAgICAgICBlc2FjCisgICAgICBmaQorICAgICAgOzsKKyAgICBl c2FjCisgIGZpCisgICAgICAgIAogICB3aGlsZSBbICIke0hBTkRMRV9DT01QRklMRX0iID0gInYi IC1vICIke0hBTkRMRV9DT01QRklMRX0iID0gIlYiIC1vIFwKICAgICAiJHtIQU5ETEVfQ09NUEZJ TEV9IiA9ICJOT1QgViIgXTsgZG8KICAgICBpZiBbIC1mICIke0RFU1RESVJ9JHtDT01QRklMRSMu fSIgLWEgLWYgIiR7Q09NUEZJTEV9IiBdOyB0aGVuCkBAIC0xMjksNiArMTU4LDEyIEBACiAgICAg ICAgICAgIyBNYWtlIHRoZSBsaXN0IHByaW50IG9uZSBmaWxlIHBlciBsaW5lCiAgICAgICAgICAg QVVUT19JTlNUQUxMRURfRklMRVM9IiR7QVVUT19JTlNUQUxMRURfRklMRVN9ICAgICAgJHtERVNU RElSfSR7Q09NUEZJTEUjLn0KICIKKwkgIGNhc2UgIiR7VVNFX0NIRUNLU1VNU30iIGluCisJICBb WXldW0VlXVtTc10pCisJICAgICMgSW5zdGFsbGVkIGEgY2xlYW4gZmlsZSwgdXBkYXRlIGNoZWNr dW0gZGF0YS4KKwkgICAgL3NiaW4vbWQ1ICR7REVTVERJUn0ke0NPTVBGSUxFIy59ID4+ICR7Q0hF Q0tTVU1GSUxFfSAyPi9kZXYvbnVsbAorCSAgICA7OworCSAgZXNhYwogICAgICAgICBlbHNlCiAg ICAgICAgICAgZWNobyAiICAgKioqIFByb2JsZW0gaW5zdGFsbGluZyAke0NPTVBGSUxFfSwgaXQg d2lsbCByZW1haW4gdG8gbWVyZ2UgYnkgaGFuZCIKICAgICAgICAgZmkKQEAgLTE2NCw2ICsxOTks MTIgQEAKICAgICAgIGVjaG8gJycKICAgICAgIGlmIG1tX2luc3RhbGwgIiR7Q09NUEZJTEV9Ijsg dGhlbgogICAgICAgICBlY2hvICIgICAqKiogJHtDT01QRklMRX0gaW5zdGFsbGVkIHN1Y2Nlc3Nm dWxseSIKKwljYXNlICIke1VTRV9DSEVDS1NVTVN9IiBpbgorCVtZeV1bRWVdW1NzXSkKKwkgICMg SW5zdGFsbGVkIGEgY2xlYW4gZmlsZSwgdXBkYXRlIGNoZWNrdW0gZGF0YS4KKwkgIC9zYmluL21k NSAke0RFU1RESVJ9JHtDT01QRklMRSMufSA+PiAke0NIRUNLU1VNRklMRX0gMj4vZGV2L251bGwK KwkgIDs7CisJZXNhYwogICAgICAgZWxzZQogICAgICAgICBlY2hvICIgICAqKiogUHJvYmxlbSBp bnN0YWxsaW5nICR7Q09NUEZJTEV9LCBpdCB3aWxsIHJlbWFpbiB0byBtZXJnZSBieSBoYW5kIgog ICAgICAgZmkKQEAgLTIxMiw2ICsyNTMsMTAgQEAKICMKIFRFTVBST09UPScvdmFyL3RtcC90ZW1w cm9vdCcKIAorIyBTZXR1cCB3aGF0IHdlIG5lZWQgdG8gdXNlIG1kNSBjaGVja3N1bXMuCitDSEVD S1NVTUZJTEU9L3Zhci9kYi9tbXN1bXMubWQ1CitVU0VfQ0hFQ0tTVU1TPXllcworCiAjIFJlYWQg L2V0Yy9tZXJnZW1hc3Rlci5yYyBmaXJzdCBzbyB0aGUgb25lIGluICRIT01FIGNhbiBvdmVycmlk ZQogIwogaWYgWyAtciAvZXRjL21lcmdlbWFzdGVyLnJjIF07IHRoZW4KQEAgLTIyNiw3ICsyNzEs NyBAQAogCiAjIENoZWNrIHRoZSBjb21tYW5kIGxpbmUgb3B0aW9ucwogIwotd2hpbGUgZ2V0b3B0 cyAiOmFzY3J2aGltOnQ6ZHU6dzpEOiIgQ09NTUFORF9MSU5FX0FSR1VNRU5UIDsgZG8KK3doaWxl IGdldG9wdHMgIjphc2NydmhpSW06dDpkdTp3OkQ6IiBDT01NQU5EX0xJTkVfQVJHVU1FTlQgOyBk bwogICBjYXNlICIke0NPTU1BTkRfTElORV9BUkdVTUVOVH0iIGluCiAgIHMpCiAgICAgU1RSSUNU PXllcwpAQCAtMjU0LDYgKzI5OSw5IEBACiAgIGkpCiAgICAgQVVUT19JTlNUQUxMPXllcwogICAg IDs7CisgIEkpCisgICAgQVVUT19JTlNUQUxMX1VOQ0hBTkdFRD15ZXMKKyAgICA7OwogICBtKQog ICAgIFNPVVJDRURJUj0ke09QVEFSR30KICAgICA7OwpAQCAtMjgxLDYgKzMyOSwxNyBAQAogCiBl Y2hvICcnCiAKKyMgQ2hlY2sgaWYgdGhlIGNoZWNrc3VtcyBmaWxlIGV4aXN0cyBhbmQgZm9yY2Ug aXQncyBtb2RlIHRvIDYwMC4KK2lmIFsgISAtZSAke0NIRUNLU1VNRklMRX0gXTsgdGhlbgorIHRv dWNoICR7Q0hFQ0tTVU1GSUxFfQorZmkKKworaWYgWyAtZiAke0NIRUNLU1VNRklMRX0gXTsgdGhl bgorIGNobW9kIDYwMCAke0NIRUNLU1VNRklMRX0KK2Vsc2UKKyB1bnNldCBVU0VfQ0hFQ0tTVU1T CitmaQorICAKICMgSWYgdGhlIHVzZXIgaGFzIGEgcGFnZXIgZGVmaW5lZCwgbWFrZSBzdXJlIHdl IGNhbiBydW4gaXQKICMKIGNhc2UgIiR7RE9OVF9DSEVDS19QQUdFUn0iIGluCkBAIC01NzQsNiAr NjMzLDE1IEBACiAgICAgOzsKICAgZXNhYwogCisgIGNhc2UgIiR7VVNFX0NIRUNLU1VNU30iIGlu CisgIFtZeV1bRWVdW1NzXSkKKyAgICAjIFJlbW92ZSB0aGUgbWQ1IGVudHJ5IGZvciB0aGlzIGZp bGUsIGRvbid0IGFkZCBuZXcgb25lIHNpbmNlIHRoaXMgbWF5IGJlIGEKKyAgICAjIG1lcmdlZCBm aWxlLgorICAgIGdyZXAgLXYgXCgke0RFU1RESVJ9JHtJTlNUQUxMX0RJUn1cKSAke0NIRUNLU1VN RklMRX0gPiAke0NIRUNLU1VNRklMRX0ubmV3CisgICAgbXYgJHtDSEVDS1NVTUZJTEV9Lm5ldyAk e0NIRUNLU1VNRklMRX0KKyAgICA7OworICBlc2FjCisKICAgaWYgWyAtbiAiJHtERVNURElSfSR7 SU5TVEFMTF9ESVJ9IiAtYSAhIC1kICIke0RFU1RESVJ9JHtJTlNUQUxMX0RJUn0iIF07IHRoZW4K ICAgICBESVJfTU9ERT1gcGVybCAtZSAncHJpbnRmICIlMDRvXG4iLCAoKChzdGF0KCIkQVJHVlsw XSIpKVsyXSAmIDA3Nzc3KSAmfiBcCiAgICAgICBvY3QoIiRBUkdWWzFdIikpJyAiJHtURU1QUk9P VH0vJHtJTlNUQUxMX0RJUn0iICIke0NPTkZJUk1FRF9VTUFTS30iYApAQCAtNjY2LDcgKzczNCw2 IEBACiAgICAgZXNhYwogICAgIGluc3RhbGwgLWMgLW0gIiR7RklMRV9NT0RFfSIgIiR7MX0iICIk e0RFU1RESVJ9JHtJTlNUQUxMX0RJUn0iICYmCiAgICAgICBbIC1mICIkezF9IiBdICYmIHJtICIk ezF9IgotI2VjaG8gImZvdXJ0aCBpbnN0YWxsLCByZXR1cm4gJD8iCiAgIGZpCiAgIHJldHVybiAk PwogfQpAQCAtNzIzLDYgKzc5MCwyMCBAQAogICAgIGNhc2UgIiR7Q1ZTSUQyfSIgaW4KICAgICAi JHtDVlNJRDF9IikKICAgICAgIGVjaG8gIiAqKiogVGVtcCAke0NPTVBGSUxFfSBhbmQgaW5zdGFs bGVkIGhhdmUgdGhlIHNhbWUgQ1ZTIElkLCBkZWxldGluZyIKKyAgICAgICMgU2luY2Ugd2Uga25v dyB0aGUgdGVtcHJvb3QgdmVyc2lvbiBpcyBjbGVhbiwgbGV0cyBnZW5lcmF0ZSBhIGNoZWNrc3Vt CisgICAgICAjIGZyb20gaXQsIHRoaXMgd2lsbCBoZWxwIHRoZSBjaGVja3N1bXMgZmlsZSB0byBi ZSBwb3B1bGF0ZWQgbW9yZSBxdWlja2x5LgorICAgICAgY2FzZSAiJHtVU0VfQ0hFQ0tTVU1TfSIg aW4KKyAgICAgIFtZeV1bRWVdW1NzXSkKKyAgICAgICAgIyBSZW1vdmUgdGhlIG1kNSBlbnRyeSBm b3IgdGhpcyBmaWxlIGZpcnN0LCBpZiBpdCBleGlzdHMuCisgICAgICAgIGdyZXAgLXYgXCgke0RF U1RESVJ9JHtDT01QRklMRSMufVwpICR7Q0hFQ0tTVU1GSUxFfSA+ICR7Q0hFQ0tTVU1GSUxFfS5u ZXcKKyAgICAgICAgbXYgJHtDSEVDS1NVTUZJTEV9Lm5ldyAke0NIRUNLU1VNRklMRX0KKwkjIElu c3RhbGxlZCBhIGNsZWFuIGZpbGUsIHVwZGF0ZSBjaGVja3VtIGRhdGEuCisJeyAKKwkgIGVjaG8g LW4gIk1ENSAoJHtERVNURElSfSR7Q09NUEZJTEUjLn0pID0gIiAKKwkgIC9zYmluL21kNSAtcSAk e0NPTVBGSUxFfSAKKwl9ID4+ICR7Q0hFQ0tTVU1GSUxFfSAyPi9kZXYvbnVsbAorCTs7CisgICAg ICBlc2FjCiAgICAgICBybSAiJHtDT01QRklMRX0iCiAgICAgICA7OwogICAgIGVzYWMKQEAgLTgw OSw2ICs4OTAsMjggQEAKICAgICBlY2hvICcqKiogWW91IGNob3NlIHRoZSBhdXRvbWF0aWMgaW5z dGFsbCBvcHRpb24gZm9yIGZpbGVzIHRoYXQgZGlkIG5vdCcKICAgICBlY2hvICcgICAgZXhpc3Qg b24geW91ciBzeXN0ZW0uICBUaGUgZm9sbG93aW5nIHdlcmUgaW5zdGFsbGVkIGZvciB5b3U6Jwog ICAgIGVjaG8gIiR7QVVUT19JTlNUQUxMRURfRklMRVN9IgorICAgIDs7CisgIGVzYWMKKyAgOzsK K2VzYWMKKworY2FzZSAiJHtBVVRPX0lOU1RBTExFRF9GSUxFU19NRDV9IiBpbgorJycpIDs7Cisq KQorICBjYXNlICIke0FVVE9fUlVOfSIgaW4KKyAgJycpCisgICAgKAorICAgICAgZWNobyAnJwor ICAgICAgZWNobyAnKioqIFlvdSBjaG9zZSB0aGUgYXV0b21hdGljIGluc3RhbGwgb3B0aW9uIGZv ciBmaWxlcyB0aGF0IHdlcmUgbm90JworICAgICAgZWNobyAnICAgIGNoYW5nZWQgb24geW91ciBz eXN0ZW0uICBUaGUgZm9sbG93aW5nIHdlcmUgaW5zdGFsbGVkIGZvciB5b3U6JworICAgICAgZWNo byAiJHtBVVRPX0lOU1RBTExFRF9GSUxFU19NRDV9IgorICAgICkgfCAke1BBR0VSfQorICAgIDs7 CisgICopCisgICAgZWNobyAnJworICAgIGVjaG8gJyoqKiBZb3UgY2hvc2UgdGhlIGF1dG9tYXRp YyBpbnN0YWxsIG9wdGlvbiBmb3IgZmlsZXMgdGhhdCB3ZXJlIG5vdCcKKyAgICBlY2hvICcgICAg Y2hhbWdlZCBvbiB5b3VyIHN5c3RlbS4gIFRoZSBmb2xsb3dpbmcgd2VyZSBpbnN0YWxsZWQgZm9y IHlvdTonCisgICAgZWNobyAiJHtBVVRPX0lOU1RBTExFRF9GSUxFU19NRDV9IgogICAgIDs7CiAg IGVzYWMKICAgOzsK --------------Boundary-00=_TW30PZ692KW4N44Q4M9R Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; name="mergemaster.sh.diff" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="mergemaster.sh.diff" LS0tIG1lcmdlbWFzdGVyLnNoLm9yaWcJRnJpIEp1biAxNSAwMDo0MTo0NSAyMDAxCisrKyBtZXJn ZW1hc3Rlci5zaAlGcmkgSnVuIDE1IDAxOjE4OjA1IDIwMDEKQEAgLTQ3MSw3ICs0NzEsNyBAQAog ICAgIGVjaG8gJyAqKiogUHJlc3MgW0VudGVyXSBvciBbUmV0dXJuXSBrZXkgdG8gY29udGludWUn CiAgICAgcmVhZCBBTllfS0VZCiAgICAgdW5zZXQgQU5ZX0tFWQotICAgIGRpZmYgLXFyICR7REVT VERJUn0vZXRjICR7VEVNUFJPT1R9L2V0YyB8IGdyZXAgIl5Pbmx5IGluIC9ldGMiIHwgJHtQQUdF Un0KKyAgICBkaWZmIC1xciAke0RFU1RESVJ9L2V0YyAke1RFTVBST09UfS9ldGMgfCBncmVwICJe T25seSBpbiAke0RFU1RESVJ9L2V0YyIgfCAke1BBR0VSfQogICAgIGVjaG8gJycKICAgICBlY2hv ICcgKioqIFByZXNzIFtFbnRlcl0gb3IgW1JldHVybl0ga2V5IHRvIGNvbnRpbnVlJwogICAgIHJl YWQgQU5ZX0tFWQpAQCAtNTkyLDcgKzU5Miw3IEBACiAgICAgICBORUVEX0NBUF9NS0RCPXllcwog ICAgICAgOzsKICAgICAvZXRjL21hc3Rlci5wYXNzd2QpCi0gICAgICBpbnN0YWxsIC1tIDYwMCAi JHsxfSIgIiR7REVTVERJUn0ke0lOU1RBTExfRElSfSIgJiYKKyAgICAgIGluc3RhbGwgLWMgLW0g NjAwICIkezF9IiAiJHtERVNURElSfSR7SU5TVEFMTF9ESVJ9IiAmJgogICAgICAgICBbIC1mICIk ezF9IiBdICYmIHJtICIkezF9IgogICAgICAgTkVFRF9QV0RfTUtEQj15ZXMKICAgICAgIERPTlRf SU5TVEFMTD15ZXMKQEAgLTY1MSw3ICs2NTEsNyBAQAogCiAgICAgY2FzZSAiJHtET05UX0lOU1RB TEx9IiBpbgogICAgICcnKQotICAgICAgaW5zdGFsbCAtbSAiJHtGSUxFX01PREV9IiAiJHsxfSIg IiR7REVTVERJUn0ke0lOU1RBTExfRElSfSIgJiYKKyAgICAgIGluc3RhbGwgLWMgLW0gIiR7RklM RV9NT0RFfSIgIiR7MX0iICIke0RFU1RESVJ9JHtJTlNUQUxMX0RJUn0iICYmCiAgICAgICAgIFsg LWYgIiR7MX0iIF0gJiYgcm0gIiR7MX0iCiAgICAgICA7OwogICAgICopCkBAIC02NjQsOCArNjY0 LDkgQEAKICAgICAgIE5FRURfTUFLRURFVj15ZXMKICAgICAgIDs7CiAgICAgZXNhYwotICAgIGlu c3RhbGwgLW0gIiR7RklMRV9NT0RFfSIgIiR7MX0iICIke0RFU1RESVJ9JHtJTlNUQUxMX0RJUn0i ICYmCisgICAgaW5zdGFsbCAtYyAtbSAiJHtGSUxFX01PREV9IiAiJHsxfSIgIiR7REVTVERJUn0k e0lOU1RBTExfRElSfSIgJiYKICAgICAgIFsgLWYgIiR7MX0iIF0gJiYgcm0gIiR7MX0iCisjZWNo byAiZm91cnRoIGluc3RhbGwsIHJldHVybiAkPyIKICAgZmkKICAgcmV0dXJuICQ/CiB9Cg== --------------Boundary-00=_TW30PZ692KW4N44Q4M9R-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 19:47:33 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from whizkidtech.net (rh28.bfm.org [216.127.220.221]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9F5C37B408 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 19:47:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adam@whizkidtech.net) Received: (from adam@localhost) by whizkidtech.net (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5G2kZ500325; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 21:46:35 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from adam) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 21:45:53 -0500 From: "G. Adam Stanislav" To: Giorgos Keramidas Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Message-ID: <20010615214553.A313@whizkidtech.net> References: <20010615213739.B12591@hades.hell.gr> <200106152232.PAA02957@smtpout.mac.com> <20010616022239.A54416@hades.hell.gr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <20010616022239.A54416@hades.hell.gr>; from keramida@ceid.upatras.gr on Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 02:22:39AM +0300 Organization: Whiz Kid Technomagic X-Assembly-Language: http://int80h.org/ X-Web-Search: http://phonecowboy.master.com/ X-Operating-System: FreeBSD whizkidtech.net 4.3-20010525-STABLE FreeBSD 4.3-20010525-STABLE Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 02:22:39AM +0300, Giorgos Keramidas wrote: >Matt has explained this better than I could ever do, in his tuning(7) >manpage -- a recent, but very valuable addition to our manpages. It, indeed, must be very recent: I have upgraded my system just last month, but I have no tuning man page. Where can I get it from? Adam -- Apply standard disk lamer To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 19:55:45 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ruminary.org (153-246-44-207.ip.sirius.com [207.44.246.153]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A501737B407 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 19:55:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from clark@ruminary.org) Received: by ruminary.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 18ECE15293; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 19:55:36 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 19:55:35 -0700 From: clark shishido To: "G. Adam Stanislav" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Message-ID: <20010615195535.A27563@ruminary.org> References: <20010615213739.B12591@hades.hell.gr> <200106152232.PAA02957@smtpout.mac.com> <20010616022239.A54416@hades.hell.gr> <20010615214553.A313@whizkidtech.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010615214553.A313@whizkidtech.net>; from adam@whizkidtech.net on Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 09:45:53PM -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 09:45:53PM -0500, G. Adam Stanislav wrote: > On Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 02:22:39AM +0300, Giorgos Keramidas wrote: > >Matt has explained this better than I could ever do, in his tuning(7) > >manpage -- a recent, but very valuable addition to our manpages. > > It, indeed, must be very recent: I have upgraded my system just > last month, but I have no tuning man page. > > Where can I get it from? > http://www.FreeBSD.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/src/share/man/man7/tuning.7?rev=1.2&content-type=text/x-cvsweb-markup --clark To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 21:54: 9 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E975437B403 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 21:53:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5G4rtl57912; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 21:53:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 21:53:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106160453.f5G4rtl57912@earth.backplane.com> To: Dan Phoenix Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: high cpu spikes References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : : :nfs_getpages: error 70 :vm_fault: pager read error, pid 72424 (httpd) : : :I get occasional cpu spikes for like 10-20 sec occasionally :wondering what this is from.....i am thinking nfs timeout maybe.... :i am ready got maxusers set to 500. : :-- :Dan error 70 is 'stale NFS file handle', which means that the web server running on the NFS client tried to access a page from a file that has been ripped out from under it (probably by the NFS server itself since client deletions usually use the NFS rename hack). The only safe solution is to figure out what is deleting or overwriting the file and make it rename the file to something else instead, then have a cron job that goes in every so often and deletes the renamed files over X amount of time old. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 22:30:17 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sharmas.dhs.org (cpe-66-1-147-119.ca.sprintbbd.net [66.1.147.119]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0FE5537B403 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 22:30:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adsharma@sharmas.dhs.org) Received: by sharmas.dhs.org (Postfix, from userid 500) id C8F5D5E105; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 22:30:04 -0700 (PDT) To: jkh@osd.bsdi.com Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? In-Reply-To: <20010615144721D.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> References: <20010615233013.A26606@tara.freenix.org> <20010615144721D.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Message-Id: <20010616053004.C8F5D5E105@sharmas.dhs.org> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 22:30:04 -0700 (PDT) From: adsharma@sharmas.dhs.org (Arun Sharma) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 15 Jun 2001 23:48:22 +0200, Jordan Hubbard wrote: > Thanks, that represents the first "hard hit" I've seen yet: > > root@winston-> strings FTP.EXE |grep "University of California" > @(#) Copyright (c) 1983 The Regents of the University of California. > > Now if we can just locate something in the kernel or a well-used > DLL.. On Win2k: c:\WinNT\system32, I have hits in: 1. finger.exe 2. ftp.exe 3. nslookup.exe 4. rcp.exe 5. rsh.exe No hits in DLLs. I wonder if there is some usable evidence collected during the Microsoft anti-trust trial. -Arun To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 22:35: 2 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.bfm.org (mail.bfm.org [216.127.218.26]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57D7B37B405 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 22:34:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adam@whizkidtech.net) Received: from WhizKid (r12.bfm.org [216.127.220.108]) by mail.bfm.org (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-52399U2500L250S0V35) with SMTP id org; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 00:38:28 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20010616003438.00f87c00@mail85.pair.com> X-Sender: whizkid@mail85.pair.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 00:34:38 -0500 To: clark shishido From: "G. Adam Stanislav" Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <20010615195535.A27563@ruminary.org> References: <20010615214553.A313@whizkidtech.net> <20010615213739.B12591@hades.hell.gr> <200106152232.PAA02957@smtpout.mac.com> <20010616022239.A54416@hades.hell.gr> <20010615214553.A313@whizkidtech.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 19:55 2001-06-15 -0700, clark shishido wrote: >> Where can I get it from? >> > >http://www.FreeBSD.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/src/share/man/man7/tuning.7?rev=1.2&c ontent-type=text/x-cvsweb-markup Thanks. :) Adam --- http://phonecowboy.com/registrar/twist/ finds a good domain for you and checks for its existence. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 22:44:50 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sublime.efs.org (dt022ne1.san.rr.com [204.210.11.225]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4012237B406 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 22:44:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from matt@efs.org) Received: from localhost (matt@localhost) by sublime.efs.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5G5ewS89271; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 22:40:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from matt@efs.org) X-Authentication-Warning: sublime.efs.org: matt owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 22:40:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Wilbur To: Jordan Hubbard Cc: , Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? In-Reply-To: <20010615144721D.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Message-ID: <20010615222037.M89207-100000@sublime.efs.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG How about winsock.dll.. sort of (from Visual studio 97's header files..) from \devstudio\vc\include: /* Winsock2.h -- definitions to be used with the WinSock 2 DLL and * WinSock 2 applications. * * This header file corresponds to version 2.2.x of the WinSock API * specification. * * This file includes parts which are Copyright (c) 1982-1986 Regents * of the University of California. All rights reserved. The * Berkeley Software License Agreement specifies the terms and * conditions for redistribution. */ Some other snippets from the file: /* * Structures returned by network data base library, taken from the * BSD file netdb.h. All addresses are supplied in host order, and * returned in network order (suitable for use in system calls). */ struct hostent { char FAR * h_name; /* official name of host */ char FAR * FAR * h_aliases; /* alias list */ short h_addrtype; /* host address type */ short h_length; /* length of address */ char FAR * FAR * h_addr_list; /* list of addresses */ #define h_addr h_addr_list[0] /* address, for backward compat */ }; /* * Structures returned by network data base library, taken from the * BSD file netdb.h. All addresses are supplied in host order, and * returned in network order (suitable for use in system calls). */ struct hostent { char FAR * h_name; /* official name of host */ char FAR * FAR * h_aliases; /* alias list */ short h_addrtype; /* host address type */ short h_length; /* length of address */ char FAR * FAR * h_addr_list; /* list of addresses */ #define h_addr h_addr_list[0] /* address, for backward compat */ }; /* * Structures returned by network data base library, taken from the * BSD file netdb.h. All addresses are supplied in host order, and * returned in network order (suitable for use in system calls). */ struct hostent { char FAR * h_name; /* official name of host */ char FAR * FAR * h_aliases; /* alias list */ short h_addrtype; /* host address type */ short h_length; /* length of address */ char FAR * FAR * h_addr_list; /* list of addresses */ #define h_addr h_addr_list[0] /* address, for backward compat */ }; . . . and so on. This is hardly conclusive though.. Without OS source code (or disassembly, as someone else suggested), it's hard to really pin it down. I'd be really amazed if Microsoft left easy to find comments in binaries/libraries documenting code mooching :) in digging through wsock32.dll and winsock.dll (from win2k) there are references to "BSD Socket API for Windows", but as Jordan said, that doesn't mean they used BSD code.. Is any of this any help at all ? -Matt On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Jordan Hubbard wrote: > Thanks, that represents the first "hard hit" I've seen yet: > > root@winston-> strings FTP.EXE |grep "University of California" > @(#) Copyright (c) 1983 The Regents of the University of California. > > Now if we can just locate something in the kernel or a well-used > DLL.. > > - Jordan > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jun 15 23:48:14 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dragon.nuxi.com (trang.nuxi.com [206.40.252.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B083637B403 for ; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 23:48:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: (from obrien@localhost) by dragon.nuxi.com (8.11.3/8.11.1) id f5G6lG338479; Fri, 15 Jun 2001 23:47:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 23:47:15 -0700 From: "David O'Brien" To: Jordan Hubbard Cc: jmallett@xMach.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? Message-ID: <20010615234715.D38334@dragon.nuxi.com> Reply-To: obrien@freebsd.org References: <20010615144235I.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010615144235I.jkh@osd.bsdi.com>; from jkh@osd.bsdi.com on Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 02:42:35PM -0700 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 5.0-CURRENT Organization: The NUXI BSD group X-Pgp-Rsa-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Rsa-Keyid: 1024/34F9F9D5 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Doesn't any one remember Netiquette these days and trim what they are replying to?? [ thread left below to see how bad this is getting.. ] On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 02:42:35PM -0700, Jordan Hubbard wrote: > This is a good reference, but sadly it only really refers to "the > sockets paradigm as first popularized by BSD", which means they could > have followed the API without touching a single line of BSD code. > > To reiterate: What I'm looking for is some true, hard evidence that > Microsoft has used BSD code in any of their operating systems. A > number of people have sent me anecdotal evidence and "I heard from a > friend" type stories, but sadly I cannot use any of that. What I need > is tangible proof - the people working on this story have already > heard all the stories and now what they're looking for is the kind of > confirmation that can be cited and independently verified. I can't > name names, but suffice it to say that it will be a small (and very > visible) coup for us if we can help them prove this. Thanks. > > - Jordan > > From: "Joseph A. Mallett" > Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? > Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:06:23 -0400 (EDT) > > > http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/psdk/winsock/apistart_9g1e.htm mentions > > BSD, not sure if is direct enough. > > > > I'm downloading the SDK right now so I can grepmonkey through the latest > > and greatest headers, etc. > > > > HTH > > > > -- > > [ Joseph Mallett ] [ http://srcsys.org ] > > [ xMach Core Team xMach: Proactively Unbloated Microkernel BSD ] > > [ FreeBSD, NetBSD, & xMach User; (Obj)C(++) Coder ] [ http://xMach.org ] > > > > On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Joseph A. Mallett wrote: > > > > > Do you happen to have any of their Winsock propoganda handy (specifically > > > developer materials or winsock.h header file)? I know for a fact that they > > > have said repetedly that some of it was taken directly from Berkely. I'm > > > just not sure where... I'm going to start digging through my stuff to see > > > if I can find anything. > > > > > > -- > > > [ Joseph Mallett ] [ http://srcsys.org ] > > > [ xMach Core Team xMach: Proactively Unbloated Microkernel BSD ] > > > [ FreeBSD, NetBSD, & xMach User; (Obj)C(++) Coder ] [ http://xMach.org ] > > > > > > On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Jordan Hubbard wrote: > > > > > > > I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as > > > > to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user > > > > utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the > > > > community that they were, when I set about to "prove" it I found it to > > > > be less easy than I'd thought. I've strings'd various binaries and > > > > DLLs in my copy of Windows 98 but have yet to find anything resembling > > > > proof. Does anyone out there have any details or discovery techniques > > > > for confirming or disproving this assertion either way? It would be > > > > very useful (for us) from a PR standpoint to know. > > > > > > > > Thanks! > > > > > > > > - Jordan > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > > > > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 0:51:38 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cx587235-a.chnd1.az.home.com (cx587235-a.chnd1.az.home.com [24.1.255.253]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46E3A37B401 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 00:51:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jjreynold@home.com) Received: from whale.home-net (whale [192.168.1.2]) by cx587235-a.chnd1.az.home.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5G7pQp79161 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 00:51:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from jjreynold@home.com) Received: (from jjreynold@localhost) by whale.home-net (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5G7pQc28963; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 00:51:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from jjreynold@home.com) From: John Reynolds MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <15147.4094.335357.112450@whale.home-net> Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 00:51:26 -0700 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: does this affect FreeBSD too? X-Mailer: VM 6.88 under Emacs 20.7.1 Cc: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Just saw this on slashdot http://www.guninski.com/openbsdrace.html looking over the Open/NetBSD patches, does this apply to us as well? -- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= John Reynolds Chandler Capabilities Engineering, CDS, Intel Corporation jreynold@sedona.ch.intel.com My opinions are mine, not Intel's. Running jjreynold@home.com FreeBSD 4.3-STABLE. FreeBSD: The Power to Serve. http://www.reynoldsnet.org/ Come join us!!! @ http://www.FreeBSD.org/ =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 1:17:58 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from saturn.cs.uml.edu (saturn.cs.uml.edu [129.63.8.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6392237B401 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 01:17:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from acahalan@saturn.cs.uml.edu) Received: (from acahalan@localhost) by saturn.cs.uml.edu (8.11.0/8.11.2) id f5G8HYd35924; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 04:17:34 -0400 (EDT) From: "Albert D. Cahalan" Message-Id: <200106160817.f5G8HYd35924@saturn.cs.uml.edu> Subject: Re: Sysadmin article To: wes@softweyr.com (Wes Peters) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 04:17:34 -0400 (EDT) Cc: acahalan@cs.uml.edu (Albert D. Cahalan), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, keramida@ceid.upatras.gr, rsi@panix.com In-Reply-To: <3B2AFB46.9B216A65@softweyr.com> from "Wes Peters" at Jun 16, 2001 12:23:02 AM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Wes Peters writes: > "Albert D. Cahalan" wrote: >> No, no, no. You have to tune the systems EQUALLY. Um, how? :-) >> >> What if some random admin was picked to tune the systems? >> Maybe he is a Solaris admin, but he honestly tries to tune >> the other systems. Sure you wouldn't complain that he did a >> bad job if FreeBSD lost? >> >> Driver quality varies too, so hardware choice matters. It is >> not OK to test on identical hardware, unless the purchaser >> selects random off-the-shelf hardware to avoid any bias. >> >> There are 2 sane ways to benchmark: >> >> 1. Use an out-of-the box config on randomly selected hardware. >> This is what a typical low-paid admin will throw together, >> so it certainly is a valid test. It is best to run this test >> many times, since an OS may get unlucky with hardware selection. >> (tuning is equal: none at all) > > But this is not a valid test. I certainly wouldn't hire someone > who knows NOTHING about the platform to run a critical service on > it, why would I accept a benchmark run in such a manner? This is > a completely ludicrous statement. Not. Lots of places don't have the time, money, or judgement to hire an expert. Even if they do, they often don't want to be stuck relying on that expert too much. Maybe he quits one day, and soon after that his manager gets stuck rebuilding the system. It's nice to have an OS doesn't require serious hacking and careful hardware selection to operate with reasonable performance. > The other problem is the impossibility of any such benchmark to > discover the underlying reasons behind the default configuration. > Re-run the same test, pulling the power cord once an hour (pretend > you're in California here) and see which spends most of it's time > in fsck. I don't have a problem with that test, even if I may dislike the results. It is a perfectly reasonable test to run. >> In the Sysadmin article, the biggest error was that the admin >> crudely tuned the FreeBSD and Linux boxes. > > No, he crudely tuned the FreeBSD and Solaris boxes, while proving his > foregone conclusion that Linux was the cat's ass. Gee, that was a > surprise. Oh sorry, Linux got the same treatment as FreeBSD and Solaris. Only the NT box was untuned, and it beat FreeBSD BTW. He did "ulimit -n 8192" on all three UNIX-like systems, and... Linux: echo 65536 > /proc/sys/fs/file-max FreeBSD: kern.maxfiles=65536 kern.maxfilesperproc=32768 Solaris: set rlim_fd_max=0x8000 set rlim_fd_cur=0x8000 Hey, no fair! FreeBSD and Solaris got twice as much tuning as the Linux box, and NT got none. But you don't like the results, so you say this was somehow unfair. I'd say the real winner was NT. It mostly kept up with Linux, trashed FreeBSD and Solaris, and didn't need any tuning to do it. >> He should have left >> both with out-of-the-box limits to be fair to NT and Solaris. > > No, he should have configured all of them as close to equally as > possible. That is pretty much what he did. Oh, you mean he should fairly tune them for performance? Let's see you tune an NT box as well as your FreeBSD box. Except for an open competition, benchmarking on tuned boxes is crap. There just isn't any way to be fair. >> It is absurd to suggest that he should have been hacking away >> at compile-time constants. Every OS had a default kernel. > > And nobody on the planet, other than you, would use it for this > or any other application. I'd rather not, but I might if I was pressed for time. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 1:19:33 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dragon.nuxi.com (trang.nuxi.com [206.40.252.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A2EB337B408 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 01:19:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: (from obrien@localhost) by dragon.nuxi.com (8.11.3/8.11.1) id f5G8JNM40211; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 01:19:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 01:19:23 -0700 From: "David O'Brien -Hackers" To: Gordon Tetlow Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010616011923.A39762@dragon.nuxi.com> Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from gordont@bluemtn.net on Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 06:04:23PM -0700 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 5.0-CURRENT Organization: The NUXI BSD group X-Pgp-Rsa-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Rsa-Keyid: 1024/34F9F9D5 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 06:04:23PM -0700, Gordon Tetlow wrote: > Anyway, here's my status: > rcorder ported (one line code change) I have already sent a patch to a NetBSD contact, so this one is done. I'll hook `rcorder' up in sbin/Makefile once NetBSD either accepts the patch or rejects it and I know if I need to pull the files off the vendor branch or not. > /etc/rc ported > /etc/rc.shutdown ported These are problematic as I could not just vendor import them as we already have files of these names. Can you make these two available for discussion some where? > /etc/rc.subr ported What changes were needed here? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 1:24:55 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dragon.nuxi.com (trang.nuxi.com [206.40.252.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A61E37B403; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 01:24:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: (from obrien@localhost) by dragon.nuxi.com (8.11.3/8.11.1) id f5G8OUd40279; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 01:24:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 01:24:30 -0700 From: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG To: Gordon Tetlow Cc: Warner Losh , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, eivind@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010616012430.B39762@dragon.nuxi.com> Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <200106141814.f5EIEOV15979@harmony.village.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from gordont@bluemtn.net on Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 11:57:18AM -0700 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 5.0-CURRENT Organization: The NUXI BSD group X-Pgp-Rsa-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Rsa-Keyid: 1024/34F9F9D5 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 11:57:18AM -0700, Gordon Tetlow wrote: > >From diving through it all, there will be a fair amount of departure from > the NetBSD stuff at least up through network init. This is just due to the > inherent differences in the OSs. Where there was departure, I took the > current FreeBSD boot scripts and turned them into modules so as to make it > very similar to the current system. What about adding the typical "test foo" logic to the NetBSD files to handle both OS's? > I did make one change that I > think will be helpful, I moved pccard initialization to before the > mounting of /usr (but after mounting /var). This way people can use pccard > for mounting filesystems from /etc/fstab which I don't think you can do > now. Anyone have any objections to this move? Yes, it departs from the NetBSD scripts. Please see if LukeM will agree with this change. If not, I would like to see consensus we need/want this change at this point in time. > it would require moving > pccardd and pccardc to /sbin, but that should be it. pccardd is dying in 5.0-R according to Warner. RCng will never be MFCed to RELENG_4, so this is a mute point. -- -- David (obrien@FreeBSD.org) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 1:51:15 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from revolt.poohsticks.org (revolt.poohsticks.org [63.227.60.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD74437B405; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 01:51:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from drew@revolt.poohsticks.org) Received: from revolt.poohsticks.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by revolt.poohsticks.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5G8pBV64472; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 02:51:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from drew@revolt.poohsticks.org) Message-Id: <200106160851.f5G8pBV64472@revolt.poohsticks.org> To: obrien@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: Jordan Hubbard , jmallett@xMach.org, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 15 Jun 2001 23:47:15 PDT." <20010615234715.D38334@dragon.nuxi.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <64469.992681471.1@revolt.poohsticks.org> Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 02:51:11 -0600 From: Drew Eckhardt Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <20010615234715.D38334@dragon.nuxi.com>, obrien@FreeBSD.ORG writes: >Doesn't any one remember Netiquette these days and trim what they are >replying to?? No. Every month is September. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 2:16:36 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from yellow.csi.cam.ac.uk (yellow.csi.cam.ac.uk [131.111.8.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E3D637B40A for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 02:16:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jmi25@cam.ac.uk) Received: from fennec.chu.cam.ac.uk ([131.111.250.98]) by yellow.csi.cam.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15BCBj-0005s5-00; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 10:16:15 +0100 Received: from jmi by fennec.chu.cam.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.22 #2) id 15BCKU-0000AM-00; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 10:25:18 +0100 Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 10:25:18 +0100 From: Jonathan Irwin To: "Albert D. Cahalan" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Sysadmin article Message-ID: <20010616102518.A555@cam.ac.uk> References: <3B2AFB46.9B216A65@softweyr.com> <200106160817.f5G8HYd35924@saturn.cs.uml.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200106160817.f5G8HYd35924@saturn.cs.uml.edu>; from acahalan@cs.uml.edu on Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 04:17:34AM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG (cc trimmed) Albert D. Cahalan wrote: > > No, he crudely tuned the FreeBSD and Solaris boxes, while proving his > > foregone conclusion that Linux was the cat's ass. Gee, that was a > > surprise. > > Oh sorry, Linux got the same treatment as FreeBSD and Solaris. > Only the NT box was untuned, and it beat FreeBSD BTW. > He did "ulimit -n 8192" on all three UNIX-like systems, and... (details snipped) > Hey, no fair! FreeBSD and Solaris got twice as much tuning as > the Linux box, and NT got none. But you don't like the results, > so you say this was somehow unfair. > > I'd say the real winner was NT. It mostly kept up with Linux, > trashed FreeBSD and Solaris, and didn't need any tuning to do it. All he was doing was increasing the maximum files per process. Without this the test wouldn't even run properly, so I certainly wouldn't call it 'performance tuning'. (...) > Oh, you mean he should fairly tune them for performance? > Let's see you tune an NT box as well as your FreeBSD box. > Except for an open competition, benchmarking on tuned > boxes is crap. There just isn't any way to be fair. Agreed. However the operating systems tested all take a different approach to what gets included or tuned in a default install. FreeBSD (and Solaris AFAIK) both ship with rather conservative defaults. Linux on the other hand tends to need relatively little tuning 'out of the box', for example ext2fs can only really be compared to UFS with softupdates (or mounted async). I just hope nobody does any of these types of benchmarks on FreeBSD 4.3-RELEASE with IDE disks... AFAIK all the others leave IDE write-caching turned on (not sure about Solaris there though). This thread has probably been going on long enough... Jonathan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 3:18:55 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sivka.carrier.kiev.ua (sivka.carrier.kiev.ua [193.193.193.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F147037B407 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 03:18:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from diman@asd-g.com) Received: from core.is.kiev.ua (p187.is.kiev.ua [62.244.5.187] (may be forged)) by sivka.carrier.kiev.ua (8/Kilkenny_is_better) with ESMTP id NHD94339; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 13:18:34 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from diman@asd-g.com) Received: from [10.203.1.10] ([10.203.1.10]) by core.is.kiev.ua (8.11.1/ASDG-2.3-NR) with ESMTP id f5GAI4O20485; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 13:18:32 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from diman@asd-g.com) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 10:11:59 +0000 (GMT) From: diman X-Sender: diman@portal.none.ua To: Jordan Hubbard Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? In-Reply-To: <20010615135713Y.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, I agree with Serger Babkin - strings(1) wouldn't help. Main keywords are: ndis.vxd , vip.386 , vtcp.386 . Any DLL's has nothing common with TCP/IP stack - at least on md 9x. Sergey Babkin wrote: > I know one way but it's a hard one: disassemble and manually decomiple > the code and compare it with the BSD code. I've once done such > a research on the HP-UX pty code (for other reasons) and it matched > the BSD code practically exactly except for the added spin locks. > > -SB To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 4: 4:59 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from phaidor.thuvia.org (thuvia.demon.co.uk [193.237.34.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7E9C37B409 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 04:04:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mark@thuvia.demon.co.uk) Received: from dotar-sojat.thuvia.org (dotar-sojat.thuvia.org [10.0.0.4]) by phaidor.thuvia.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5GB4lS03257; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 12:04:47 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from mark@dotar-sojat.thuvia.org) Received: (from mark@localhost) by dotar-sojat.thuvia.org (8.11.4/8.11.4) id f5GB4lT18763; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 12:04:47 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from mark) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 12:04:47 +0100 (BST) From: Mark Valentine Message-Id: <200106161104.f5GB4lT18763@dotar-sojat.thuvia.org> In-Reply-To: Jordan Hubbard's message of Jun 15, 10:34pm X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 beta(5) 10/07/98) To: jkh@osd.bsdi.com (Jordan Hubbard), roberto@keltia.freenix.fr Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > From: jkh@osd.bsdi.com (Jordan Hubbard) > Date: Fri 15 Jun, 2001 > Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? > root@winston-> strings FTP.EXE |grep "University of California" > @(#) Copyright (c) 1983 The Regents of the University of California. You can't tell much from the utilities, there are still too many obvious traces of the proprietary product they originally licensed (much of which was not BSD-derived, and the stuff that was ended up less BSD-like - try looking at a few of lines of context around the above grep to see inexplicable traces of TLI interface code). I suspect that not much if anything is left of the kernel code they initially deployed, though (which was definitely very un-BSD in origin --you can see from old NT documentation that it was a STREAMS implementation, but you really don't want to know what form it took prior to that!-- though it gained some BSD code later on - can't recall whether any of that was prior to MS getting it). Microsoft should, however, definitely have been acknowledging BSD code in their documentation right from the start, until that clause was repealed (the documentation they bought did). This includes the Wolverine stuff they gave out as an add-on to Windows for Workgroups, which had a similar FTP.EXE and so on (Wolverine was released after the original NT TCP/IP implementation). However, I can't offer any concrete proof as to whether their core TCP/IP implementation migrated to BSD code (though I would certainly expect it to be so, as there wasn't much else to choose from back then if I remember), and I no longer work alongside folks who might have tracked that stuff better. Cheers, Mark. -- Mark Valentine, Thuvia Labs "Tigers will do ANYTHING for a tuna fish sandwich." Mark Valentine uses "We're kind of stupid that way." *munch* *munch* and endorses FreeBSD -- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 6:21:52 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.noos.fr (aragon.noos.net [212.198.2.75]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9253437B401 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 06:21:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from clefevre@redirect.to) Received: (qmail 4721972 invoked by uid 0); 16 Jun 2001 13:21:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gits.dyndns.org) ([212.198.228.81]) (envelope-sender ) by 212.198.2.75 (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 16 Jun 2001 13:21:44 -0000 Received: (from root@localhost) by gits.dyndns.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5GDLgM97151; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 15:21:42 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from clefevre@redirect.to) To: Sergey Babkin Cc: tlambert2@mindspring.com, Robert Withrow , Cyrille Lefevre , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system References: <200106141357.JAA27316@pobox.engeast.BayNetworks.COM> <3B29B98E.DAF2ABE4@mindspring.com> <3B2A9F60.A12AB917@bellatlantic.net> X-Face: V|+c;4!|B?E%BE^{E6);aI.[<97Zd*>^#%Y5Cxv;%Y[PT-LW3;A:fRrJ8+^k"e7@+30g0YD0*^^3jgyShN7o?a]C la*Zv'5NA,=963bM%J^o]C Reply-To: Cyrille Lefevre In-Reply-To: <3B2A9F60.A12AB917@bellatlantic.net> Mail-Copies-To: never From: Cyrille Lefevre Date: 16 Jun 2001 15:21:40 +0200 Message-ID: Lines: 17 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Sergey Babkin writes: [snip] > How about keeping the state of the system as empty files in > a subdirectory, say, /etc/rcstate.d. This directory would be > cleaned up at boot time and then as each of the service startup > script is run (and completed successfully), an empty file with the > same name would be created in this directory. Reversely, when a > service shutdown script is completed (or started ?), the state > file is removed. This will allow to define the run states easily > as empty rc scripts containing only dependency information in them. how about if a service die or started w/o the rc subsystem ? Cyrille. -- home: mailto:clefevre@redirect.to UNIX is user-friendly; it's just particular work: mailto:Cyrille.Lefevre@edf.fr about who it chooses to be friends with. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 8: 0:59 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com (sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com [209.247.77.155]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F3CB37B406 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 08:00:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gordont@bluemtn.net) Received: from localhost (gordont@localhost) by sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com (8.11.3/8.11.2/BMA1.1) with ESMTP id f5GEw6Z06771 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 07:58:06 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 07:58:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Gordon Tetlow X-X-Sender: To: "David O'Brien -Hackers" Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: <20010616011923.A39762@dragon.nuxi.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 16 Jun 2001, David O'Brien -Hackers wrote: > On Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 06:04:23PM -0700, Gordon Tetlow wrote: > > Anyway, here's my status: > > rcorder ported (one line code change) > > I have already sent a patch to a NetBSD contact, so this one is done. > I'll hook `rcorder' up in sbin/Makefile once NetBSD either accepts the > patch or rejects it and I know if I need to pull the files off the vendor > branch or not. I'll submit the patches I have for this that make it work in both FreeBSD and NetBSD. BTW, why do we use libutil.h and they use util.h? > > /etc/rc ported > > /etc/rc.shutdown ported > > These are problematic as I could not just vendor import them as we > already have files of these names. Can you make these two available for > discussion some where? > I like Matt's idea (I think it was Matt) to have a new_rc switch. I'll look at adding the code for it and submitting a patch, it'll be kinda dicey this week since I'm on vacation and I'm not sure how much I'll be online (I'm sitting in the Albany airport atm =) Also, next week is my last week at my current job before switching jobs (at least I'm not moving). So it'll be kinda hectic. > > /etc/rc.subr ported > > What changes were needed here? I basically added a function called checkwildno() that is similar to checkyesno that returns 1 for NO (plus variants) or '' and returns 0 for anything else. This gets rid of alot of case statements in the modules, making them simple if's. -gordon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 8: 7:43 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com (sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com [209.247.77.155]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 411F837B408; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 08:07:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gordont@bluemtn.net) Received: from localhost (gordont@localhost) by sdmail0.sd.bmarts.com (8.11.3/8.11.2/BMA1.1) with ESMTP id f5GF4gq07506; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 08:04:42 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 08:04:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Gordon Tetlow X-X-Sender: To: Cc: Warner Losh , Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system In-Reply-To: <20010616012430.B39762@dragon.nuxi.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 16 Jun 2001 freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG wrote: > On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 11:57:18AM -0700, Gordon Tetlow wrote: > > >From diving through it all, there will be a fair amount of departure from > > the NetBSD stuff at least up through network init. This is just due to the > > inherent differences in the OSs. Where there was departure, I took the > > current FreeBSD boot scripts and turned them into modules so as to make it > > very similar to the current system. > > What about adding the typical "test foo" logic to the NetBSD files to > handle both OS's? I suppose we could do this, but the departures are more like rewrites. Again, this is all before the network init stage where things are *very* different (swap comes to mind immediately). I've written in the gaps for things we have that they don't (entropy stuff). Again, since my connectivity is dicey, it may be a week. > > I did make one change that I > > think will be helpful, I moved pccard initialization to before the > > mounting of /usr (but after mounting /var). This way people can use pccard > > for mounting filesystems from /etc/fstab which I don't think you can do > > now. Anyone have any objections to this move? > > Yes, it departs from the NetBSD scripts. Please see if LukeM will agree > with this change. If not, I would like to see consensus we need/want > this change at this point in time. This was just an idea (and a bad one at that) due to the death of pccard in 5.0-R it would be silly to mess with it now. > > it would require moving > > pccardd and pccardc to /sbin, but that should be it. > > pccardd is dying in 5.0-R according to Warner. RCng will never be MFCed > to RELENG_4, so this is a mute point. Yup, I put in my request for devd to be in /sbin (although it still may not need to be). I also had an idea to break out the network init into several different pieces falling under 2 headings LINK (ether, atm) and NETWORK (ipx, ipv4, ipv6, atalk). I've started work on breaking everything out and was wondering if I should continue with it or if it just too much of a change. -gordon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 9:17:43 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dragon.nuxi.com (trang.nuxi.com [206.40.252.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F67C37B405 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 09:17:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: (from obrien@localhost) by dragon.nuxi.com (8.11.3/8.11.1) id f5GGHVb81106; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 09:17:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 09:17:31 -0700 From: "David O'Brien" To: Gordon Tetlow Cc: "David O'Brien -Hackers" Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010616091731.A81063@dragon.nuxi.com> Reply-To: obrien@FreeBSD.ORG References: <20010616011923.A39762@dragon.nuxi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from gordont@bluemtn.net on Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 07:58:06AM -0700 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 5.0-CURRENT Organization: The NUXI BSD group X-Pgp-Rsa-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Rsa-Keyid: 1024/34F9F9D5 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 07:58:06AM -0700, Gordon Tetlow wrote: > I'll submit the patches I have for this that make it work in both FreeBSD > and NetBSD. BTW, why do we use libutil.h and they use util.h? Just the way things are. > I like Matt's idea (I think it was Matt) to have a new_rc switch. I'll > look at adding the code for it and submitting a patch, You are going off on a tangent. You are worried about the flag day before we even have a flag to run up the poll. > > > /etc/rc.subr ported > > > > What changes were needed here? > > I basically added a function called checkwildno() that is similar to > checkyesno that returns 1 for NO (plus variants) or '' and returns 0 for > anything else. This gets rid of alot of case statements in the modules, > making them simple if's. Again, why don't we just concentrate on porting the NetBSD scripts and not the second system enhancements? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 9:19:52 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dragon.nuxi.com (trang.nuxi.com [206.40.252.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE91437B401; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 09:19:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: (from obrien@localhost) by dragon.nuxi.com (8.11.3/8.11.1) id f5GGJlX81120; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 09:19:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 09:19:47 -0700 From: "David O'Brien" To: Gordon Tetlow Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Warner Losh , eivind@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010616091947.B81063@dragon.nuxi.com> Reply-To: obrien@FreeBSD.ORG References: <20010616012430.B39762@dragon.nuxi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from gordont@bluemtn.net on Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 08:04:42AM -0700 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 5.0-CURRENT Organization: The NUXI BSD group X-Pgp-Rsa-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Rsa-Keyid: 1024/34F9F9D5 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 08:04:42AM -0700, Gordon Tetlow wrote: > I also had an idea to break out the network init into several different > pieces falling under 2 headings LINK (ether, atm) and NETWORK (ipx, ipv4, > ipv6, atalk). I've started work on breaking everything out and was > wondering if I should continue with it or if it just too much of a change. Yes it is too much of a change. Let me restate again that the idea right now is to just *minimally* port the NetBSD RC scripts. Once we have a system booting with RCng, we can see where it blows and discuss changes. -- -- David (obrien@FreeBSD.org) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 10:16:44 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from imo-m02.mx.aol.com (imo-m02.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6727F37B407 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 10:16:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Bsdguru@aol.com) Received: from Bsdguru@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v30.22.) id n.125.668727 (16784) for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 13:16:28 -0400 (EDT) From: Bsdguru@aol.com Message-ID: <125.668727.285cee6c@aol.com> Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 13:16:28 EDT Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? To: hackers@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 139 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG is BSDI's stack so superior to any of the other BSDs that MS would pay BSDI for it, particularly at a time when BSDI was trying to compete with MS in the server market? Seems like something that a bunch of BSD fanatics conjured up after a few beers. Bryan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 10:35: 8 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from newman.cs.purdue.edu (newman.cs.purdue.edu [128.10.2.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 44C0037B40C for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 10:34:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dk@cs.purdue.edu) Received: from lore.cs.purdue.edu (IDENT:1301@lore.cs.purdue.edu [128.10.2.16]) by newman.cs.purdue.edu (8.11.3/8.11.3/PURDUE_CS-2.0) with ESMTP id f5GHYj529614; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 12:34:50 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 12:34:45 -0500 (EST) From: Daniel Kim To: Jordan Hubbard Cc: Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code? In-Reply-To: <20010615145723I.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Message-ID: X-PGP-Public-Key: finger dk@cs.purdue.edu X-PGP-Fingerprint: E3 D6 3B 3E 34 E6 0D F9 51 CF 32 5F B0 7E 6B A6 25 8C AB 53 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In the previous episode, Jordan Hubbard said: > Not really, I don't have any contacts there. Sigh. I didn't think > proving this would be quite so hard. :( If you issue the following command on hub: % grep "microsoft.com" freebsd-* 2>/dev/null you may be able to find some contacts there. Any Microsoft employee should be able to find an appropriate contact through their Enterprise Directory or Exchange Global Address List, so locating the group/division should not be a problem. But the question is, are they willing to respond? --dk To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 11:37: 4 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail1.mx.voyager.net (mail1.mx.voyager.net [216.93.66.200]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1238437B403 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 11:37:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mhagerty@voyager.net) Received: from thunderbird.voyager.net (net-216-93-124-123.hcv.com [216.93.124.123]) by mail1.mx.voyager.net (8.10.2/8.10.2) with ESMTP id f5GIb4A21279 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 14:37:04 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.2.20010616142444.03952e48@pop.voyager.net> X-Sender: mhagerty@pop.voyager.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 14:42:09 -0400 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org From: Matthew Hagerty Subject: Article: Network performance by OS Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greetings, Here is a surprisingly unbiased article comparing OSes running hard core network apps. The results are kind of disturbing, with FreeBSD (4.2) coming in last against Linux (RH), Win2k, and Solaris (Intel). http://www.sysadminmag.com/articles/2001/0107/0107a/0107a.htm The tests were performed against the TCP/IP implementation on these platforms with different system calls. File systems tests (EXT2 for Linux, UFS for FreeBSD and Solaris, and NTFS for Windows 2000) were performed by creating writing, and reading 10,000 files in the same directory, increasing the file size from 4K to 128K. Tests of various network applications based on number of simultaneous connections, process-based vs. thread-based, and sync vs. async connection handling were also performed. Hope it might be helpful to you... Matthew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 11:56:54 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDCD437B401 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 11:56:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5GIujt01283; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 11:56:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 11:56:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106161856.f5GIujt01283@earth.backplane.com> To: Matthew Hagerty Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS References: <5.0.2.1.2.20010616142444.03952e48@pop.voyager.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : :Greetings, : :Here is a surprisingly unbiased article comparing OSes running hard core :network apps. The results are kind of disturbing, with FreeBSD (4.2) :coming in last against Linux (RH), Win2k, and Solaris (Intel). This is old. The guys running the tests blew it in so many ways that you might as well have just rolled some dice. There's a slashdot article on it too, and quite a few of the reader comments on these bozos are correct. I especially like comment #41. Don't worry, FreeBSD stacks up just fine in real environments. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 11:59:19 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from beppo.feral.com (beppo.feral.com [192.67.166.79]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C1A737B403 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 11:59:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mjacob@feral.com) Received: from wonky.feral.com (wonky.feral.com [192.67.166.7]) by beppo.feral.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5GIx4g54410 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 11:59:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mjacob@feral.com) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 11:59:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Jacob Reply-To: To: Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS In-Reply-To: <200106161856.f5GIujt01283@earth.backplane.com> Message-ID: <20010616115849.O4483-100000@wonky.feral.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 16 Jun 2001, Matt Dillon wrote: > > : > :Greetings, > : > :Here is a surprisingly unbiased article comparing OSes running hard core > :network apps. The results are kind of disturbing, with FreeBSD (4.2) > :coming in last against Linux (RH), Win2k, and Solaris (Intel). > > This is old. The guys running the tests blew it in so many ways > that you might as well have just rolled some dice. There's a slashdot > article on it too, and quite a few of the reader comments on these > bozos are correct. I especially like comment #41. Don't worry, > FreeBSD stacks up just fine in real environments. Disagree wrt NFS services. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 12:59:45 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from la.palnet.com (la.palnet.com [192.116.19.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AAE3E37B405 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 12:59:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nobody@la.palnet.com) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by la.palnet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA74256; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 22:05:01 GMT (envelope-from nobody) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 22:05:01 GMT Message-Id: <200106162205.WAA74256@la.palnet.com> To: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=4d=61=74=74=20=44=69=6c=6c=6f=6e?=" , "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=20=4d=61=74=74=68=65=77=20=48=61=67=65=72=74=79?=" , Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS From: Reply-To: Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS X-Originating-Ip: [217.66.224.15] X-Mailer: Palnet Webmail Content-Type: text/plain; Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I didn't believe my eyes windows is better than FreeBSD.. can't be true - Original Message -- From: Matt Dillon To: Matthew Hagerty Send: 06:56 PM Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS : :Greetings, : :Here is a surprisingly unbiased article comparing OSes running hard core :network apps. The results are kind of disturbing, with FreeBSD (4.2) :coming in last against Linux (RH), Win2k, and Solaris (Intel). This is old. The guys running the tests blew it in so many ways that you might as well have just rolled some dice. There's a slashdot article on it too, and quite a few of the reader comments on these bozos are correct. I especially like comment #41. Don't worry, FreeBSD stacks up just fine in real environments. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message ___________________________________ Palnet Webmail, http://www.palnet.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 13: 2:48 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from a.mx.everquick.net (a.mx.everquick.net [216.89.137.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECF6937B401 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 13:02:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eddy+public+spam@noc.everquick.net) Received: from localhost (eddy@localhost) by a.mx.everquick.net (8.10.2/8.10.2) with ESMTP id f5GK2Ix04893; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 20:02:18 GMT X-EverQuick-No-Abuse: Report any e-mail abuse to Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 20:02:17 +0000 (GMT) From: "E.B. Dreger" To: Matt Dillon Cc: Matthew Hagerty , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS In-Reply-To: <200106161856.f5GIujt01283@earth.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 11:56:45 -0700 (PDT) > From: Matt Dillon > This is old. The guys running the tests blew it in so many ways > that you might as well have just rolled some dice. There's a slashdot > article on it too, and quite a few of the reader comments on these > bozos are correct. I especially like comment #41. Don't worry, > FreeBSD stacks up just fine in real environments. If the programmers who wrote that software used poll() on FreeBSD 4.2, then I'd say that they need to RTFM and learn about kernel queues and accept filters. Not to mention that anyone using a kernel "out of the box" needs to be larted. Personally, I think that article casts more doubt on the authors than on FreeBSD... Eddy --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Brotsman & Dreger, Inc. EverQuick Internet Division Phone: +1 (316) 794-8922 Wichita/(Inter)national Phone: +1 (785) 865-5885 Lawrence --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 11:23:58 +0000 (GMT) From: A Trap To: blacklist@brics.com Subject: Please ignore this portion of my mail signature. These last few lines are a trap for address-harvesting spambots. Do NOT send mail to , or you are likely to be blocked. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 13:26: 3 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from netbank.com.br (garrincha.netbank.com.br [200.203.199.88]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 151FB37B40E for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 13:25:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from riel@conectiva.com.br) Received: from surriel.ddts.net (1-042.ctame701-1.telepar.net.br [200.181.137.42]) by netbank.com.br (Postfix) with ESMTP id C872E46804; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 17:23:54 -0300 (BRST) Received: from localhost (jggues@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by surriel.ddts.net (8.11.3/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f5GKPUn26651; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 17:25:30 -0300 Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 17:25:30 -0300 (BRST) From: Rik van Riel X-Sender: riel@imladris.rielhome.conectiva To: Matt Dillon Cc: Matthew Hagerty , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS In-Reply-To: <200106161856.f5GIujt01283@earth.backplane.com> Message-ID: X-spambait: aardvark@kernelnewbies.org X-spammeplease: aardvark@nl.linux.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 16 Jun 2001, Matt Dillon wrote: > This is old. The guys running the tests blew it in so many ways > that you might as well have just rolled some dice. There's a slashdot > article on it too, and quite a few of the reader comments on these > bozos are correct. I especially like comment #41. Don't worry, > FreeBSD stacks up just fine in real environments. The only thing that worries me a bit is that both FreeBSD and Linux needed to be tuned at all to run these things, even if it was just the maximum file descriptor setting. A lot of this tuning could easily be done dynamically (and is done dynamically on linux 2.4), but lots of it still has static maximums which have to be tuned by hand. Compile-time tuning for stuff which can be dynamically allocated (and freed) is IMHO a big sillyness in the OS. Yes, this report was completely useless as a benchmark, but it DID highlight a point where Linux and BSD can be improved: dynamic allocation (and freeing) of things like file descriptors and socket structures. regards, Rik -- Virtual memory is like a game you can't win; However, without VM there's truly nothing to lose... http://www.surriel.com/ http://distro.conectiva.com/ Send all your spam to aardvark@nl.linux.org (spam digging piggy) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 13:32: 9 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from saturn.cs.uml.edu (saturn.cs.uml.edu [129.63.8.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3901637B417 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 13:31:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from acahalan@saturn.cs.uml.edu) Received: (from acahalan@localhost) by saturn.cs.uml.edu (8.11.0/8.11.2) id f5GKVfm16209; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 16:31:41 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 16:31:41 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <200106162031.f5GKVfm16209@saturn.cs.uml.edu> From: "Albert D. Cahalan" To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: dillon@earth.backplane.com, mhagerty@voyager.net Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG With gratuitously non-standard quoting which I fixed, Matt Dillon writes: > [Matthew Hagerty] >> Here is a surprisingly unbiased article comparing OSes running >> hard core network apps. The results are kind of disturbing, >> with FreeBSD (4.2) coming in last against Linux (RH), Win2k, >> and Solaris (Intel). > > This is old. The guys running the tests blew it in so many ways > that you might as well have just rolled some dice. There's a > slashdot article on it too, and quite a few of the reader comments > on these bozos are correct. I especially like comment #41. > Don't worry, FreeBSD stacks up just fine in real environments. Feel free to post a benchmarking procedure that would let one person produce fair results. Results ought to be reproducable: you, I, and an NT kernel developer all get the same answers. From another post where you tried to list the ways they blew it: > If you intend to push a system to its limits, you damn well better > be prepared to tune it properly or you are just wasting your time. > On any operating system. You will never find joe-user running his > system into the ground with thousands of simultanious connections > and ten thousand files in a mail directory, so it's silly to > configure the system from a joe-user perspective. So every FreeBSD server requires an expensive admin to tune it? That Win2K solution is looking good now. :-) These admins now... they never quit their job at just the wrong moment, people always have a hot-spare admin, or you think one can find and hire a really good admin as soon as needed? Nobody would ever have an unplanned demand that would run the "system into the ground with thousands of simultanious connections and ten thousand files in a mail directory" of course, especially when the admin isn't available. After all, the OS couldn't cope. Wait, wasn't this where FreeBSD was supposed to be really good while Linux and Win2K sucked? Hmmm, interesting. I guess it's fair to shove Linux deep into swap (as pro-FreeBSD benchmarkers always do), but not fair to make FreeBSD handle a large directory? > Slashdot respondants did a pretty good job identifying the problems > - network mbufs, softupdates, Robert here just brought up the > possibility of IDE write caching being turned off, etc etc etc. The It was SCSI. Read the article. > fact that the bozos doing the 'benchmark' knew about sysctl but only > tuned the file descriptor limit is a pretty good indication of how > biased they were. Biased against Win2K maybe, which beat FreeBSD without any tuning at all. FreeBSD got the same treatment as Solaris and Linux did. > I'll bet they didn't even bother compiling up a > kernel... something that is utterly trivial in a FreeBSD system, and > if they did they certainly didn't bother tuning it. Lots of places would not allow this. Heavy tweaking requires heavy documentation to be reproducable by a future admin. It adds cost. There is a "don't break anything" concern. Every other system was in the same boat, so stop complaining. Linux got stuck with 2.2.16-22, even though it comes with friendly interactive kernel config editors. Go on, admit it. The benchmark was fair to FreeBSD, and you just don't like to see the results. BTW I'm serious about seeing your procedure for fair benchmarking. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 13:48:30 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from iguana.internexo.co.cr (iguana.internexo.co.cr [196.40.17.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A5EE37B40A; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 13:48:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from freebsd@iguana.internexo.co.cr) Received: (from freebsd@localhost) by iguana.internexo.co.cr (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA02283; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 14:46:55 -0600 (CST) From: Theodore Hope Message-Id: <200106162046.OAA02283@iguana.internexo.co.cr> Subject: trouble with Liveice+LAME To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 14:46:55 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'm trying to get Liveice + LAME working on a 4.3-Release box (to stream to another 4.3-R box running Icecast). I've configured Liveice to use /dev/dsp (also tried with /dev/dspW), SOUND_DEVICE, HALF_DUPLEX (also tried FULL_*), and various combinations of SAMPLE_RATE (trying to get 8000 on both to stream to slow modem users). The idea is to plug a cd player into the "line in" of the sound card and stream it out. Something that caught my eye is when I bring up Liveice (on std curses interface) it says "Input ... 16 bit, ... Hz", the "16 bit" stays unchanged regardless of what I change in the Liveice cfg file. Recompiled kernel recognizes the sound card just fine, and /dev/sndstat shows "pcm0: ESS Solo-1E at io .... (1p/1r channels)" The sound card is fine, because when I plug a portable cd player into the "line in" of the sound card, I can listen to it on the speaker output of the same sound card. This is with LAME 3.88b (not from ports) and the latest Liveice (not from ports). On the surfaace, things seem to work both locally, on the remote machine running Icecast, and on the windoze pc client running Winamp. However, only static garbage comes out on the windoze Winamp. After lots of fiddling, I decided to enable Liveice's "SAVE_FILE"; I ran it for a while and then took the *.mp3 file it saved and opened it with Winamp, and it's just static garbage. So, this suggests that something's wrong at the very outset (possibly with the way LAME is working, or the way Liveice is calling LAME, etc). When I "ps" and see how LAME is being called, things look ok, and "lsof" shows that Liveice is indeed reading /dev/dsp (not /dev/dspW). I know this stuff (Liveice+LAME) works under Linux, but of course I want to use fbsd 4.3-R :-) Thanks in advance for any tips or pointers. -T.H. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 13:57:19 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from saturn.cs.uml.edu (saturn.cs.uml.edu [129.63.8.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E25DB37B403 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 13:57:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from acahalan@saturn.cs.uml.edu) Received: (from acahalan@localhost) by saturn.cs.uml.edu (8.11.0/8.11.2) id f5GKv4X11560; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 16:57:04 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 16:57:04 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <200106162057.f5GKv4X11560@saturn.cs.uml.edu> From: "Albert D. Cahalan" To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: eddy+public+spam@noc.everquick.net Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG E.B. Dreger writes: > If the programmers who wrote that software used poll() on FreeBSD 4.2, > then I'd say that they need to RTFM and learn about kernel queues and > accept filters. You mean they should just optimize for FreeBSD, or should they also use completion ports on Win2K, /dev/poll on Solaris, and RT signals on Linux? What is wrong with using the portable API on every OS? In an open competition where each team writes the code, sure, it is fine to use fancy FreeBSD features. Otherwise no, it isn't OK. FreeBSD shouldn't need nonportable hacks to keep up with Win2K and Linux. You're sounding like a Microsoftie, demanding that code be written to the latest OS-specific API to get decent performance. > Not to mention that anyone using a kernel "out of the > box" needs to be larted. If you run Google or Yahoo, sure. If the admin is really the guy hired to make web pages selling potted plants, no way. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 14: 4:49 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56E6637B403 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 14:04:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5GL4dX02015; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 14:04:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 14:04:39 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106162104.f5GL4dX02015@earth.backplane.com> To: "Albert D. Cahalan" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, mhagerty@voyager.net Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS References: <200106162031.f5GKVfm16209@saturn.cs.uml.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> If you intend to push a system to its limits, you damn well better :> be prepared to tune it properly or you are just wasting your time. :> On any operating system. You will never find joe-user running his :> system into the ground with thousands of simultanious connections :> and ten thousand files in a mail directory, so it's silly to :> configure the system from a joe-user perspective. : :So every FreeBSD server requires an expensive admin to tune it? :That Win2K solution is looking good now. :-) : :These admins now... they never quit their job at just the wrong Huh? I'm talking about a reasonably smart 16 year old kid who bothers to spend a little time learning how a platform works. I don't know what you are talking about. Expensive sysadmin? Where did that come from? Any bozo with half a brain who has spent more then a week playing with FreeBSD in a serious way can tune it better then the idiots who ran the benchmark. A person who depends on the ability to run an out-of-the-box solution into the ground and actually expects it to perform well without having to know the first thing about the platform he is running his software on is a complete and utter idiot and the company that employs such a person has a hellofalot more to worry about then the performance of an untuned machine. The reality in the world is that most of these so-called benchmarks are meaningless. This one happens to be worse then normal, especially when the less informed masses start quoting them. People like me, who have actually HAD real unplanned loads smash into their FreeBSD boxes, know exactly how good FreeBSD is in handling those loads. No contrived benchmark can match real world results. I mean, give me a break, create and delete 10,000 files in a directory with softupdates turned off? The only time I ever had more then 10,000 queue files in a directory was running BEST, supporting 30,000+ users and some insanely huge mailing lists. Anyone actually running that kind of load had better be able to afford (or be) a sysop who at least knows his ass from a hot rock! -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 14:11:38 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from guru.mired.org (okc-65-26-235-186.mmcable.com [65.26.235.186]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 104B437B405 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 14:11:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mwm@mired.org) Received: (qmail 12820 invoked by uid 100); 16 Jun 2001 21:11:15 -0000 From: Mike Meyer MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <15147.52083.851230.896203@guru.mired.org> Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 16:11:15 -0500 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS In-Reply-To: <200106162031.f5GKVfm16209@saturn.cs.uml.edu> References: <200106162031.f5GKVfm16209@saturn.cs.uml.edu> X-Mailer: VM 6.90 under 21.1 (patch 14) "Cuyahoga Valley" XEmacs Lucid X-face: "5Mnwy%?j>IIV\)A=):rjWL~NB2aH[}Yq8Z=u~vJ`"(,&SiLvbbz2W`;h9L,Yg`+vb1>RG% *h+%X^n0EZd>TM8_IB;a8F?(Fb"lw'IgCoyM.[Lg#r\ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Albert D. Cahalan types: > > I'll bet they didn't even bother compiling up a > > kernel... something that is utterly trivial in a FreeBSD system, and > > if they did they certainly didn't bother tuning it. > Lots of places would not allow this. Heavy tweaking requires heavy > documentation to be reproducable by a future admin. It adds cost. > There is a "don't break anything" concern. Building a custom kernel on BSD isn't heavy tweaking, it's SOP. If you follow recommended practices, no documentation is required to make the results reproduceable on that system. If you have good admin procedures, then no documentation is required to reproduce the system on new hardware after the other is destroyed in a fire. > Go on, admit it. The benchmark was fair to FreeBSD, and you just > don't like to see the results. Ok, the bechmark was fair. To complete the trio(*), the Pope is a pagan and bears hold it until they're out of the woods. They didn't run all the systems in truly out of the box state, and didn't say *how* the selected what tuning they did. They didn't discuss the design goals of the systems, which are different and will influence the effect of measurements. This was a puff piece masquerading as a benchmark. http://www.mired.org/home/mwm/ Independent WWW/Perforce/FreeBSD/Unix consultant, email for more information. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 14:14:49 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06A0037B403 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 14:14:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5GLEEg02073; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 14:14:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 14:14:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106162114.f5GLEEg02073@earth.backplane.com> To: Rik van Riel Cc: Matthew Hagerty , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :The only thing that worries me a bit is that both FreeBSD :and Linux needed to be tuned at all to run these things, :even if it was just the maximum file descriptor setting. : :A lot of this tuning could easily be done dynamically :(and is done dynamically on linux 2.4), but lots of it :still has static maximums which have to be tuned by hand. :Compile-time tuning for stuff which can be dynamically :allocated (and freed) is IMHO a big sillyness in the OS. : : :Yes, this report was completely useless as a benchmark, :but it DID highlight a point where Linux and BSD can be :improved: dynamic allocation (and freeing) of things :like file descriptors and socket structures. : :regards, : :Rik It's certainly true that a greater degree of dynamic tuning could be done, but all this benchmark proves (in regards to the TCP results) is that FreeBSD puts its foot down earlier then other OS's in regards to how much it is willing to dedicate to the network. In a real life situation where you may be running a multi-user load or a large database, the very last thing you want to do is shift every last bit of your resources away from the users or the database and to the network when an 'unexpected load' comes in (unexpected meaning something that is a factor of 100 or 1000x what the machine normally handles). The truth of the matter is that no amount of dynamic tuning can handle every situation... at some point you have to manually tune the box. FreeBSD does exactly the right thing on an untuned box by capping the network resources. If the authors want to run the machine into the ground with a benchmark, they have to tune the machine properly to handle the load because FreeBSD anyway is more interested in keeping the integrity of the machine as a whole together then it is tuning itself to match some idiot who thinks he is gods own gift to humanity running a benchmark. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 14:26:45 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from technokratis.com (modemcable052.174-202-24.mtl.mc.videotron.ca [24.202.174.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EB8A37B401 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 14:26:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bmilekic@technokratis.com) Received: (from bmilekic@localhost) by technokratis.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5GLQPp08694; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 17:26:25 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from bmilekic) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 17:26:25 -0400 From: Bosko Milekic To: Matt Dillon Cc: Rik van Riel , Matthew Hagerty , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS Message-ID: <20010616172625.A8631@technokratis.com> References: <200106162114.f5GLEEg02073@earth.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200106162114.f5GLEEg02073@earth.backplane.com>; from dillon@earth.backplane.com on Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 02:14:14PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 02:14:14PM -0700, Matt Dillon wrote: > It's certainly true that a greater degree of dynamic tuning could be > done, but all this benchmark proves (in regards to the TCP results) > is that FreeBSD puts its foot down earlier then other OS's in regards > to how much it is willing to dedicate to the network. In a real life > situation where you may be running a multi-user load or a large database, > the very last thing you want to do is shift every last bit of your > resources away from the users or the database and to the network when > an 'unexpected load' comes in (unexpected meaning something that is a > factor of 100 or 1000x what the machine normally handles). The > truth of the matter is that no amount of dynamic tuning can handle > every situation... at some point you have to manually tune the box. > FreeBSD does exactly the right thing on an untuned box by capping the > network resources. If the authors want to run the machine into the > ground with a benchmark, they have to tune the machine properly to handle > the load because FreeBSD anyway is more interested in keeping the > integrity of the machine as a whole together then it is tuning itself > to match some idiot who thinks he is gods own gift to humanity running > a benchmark. This is the best written paragraph on the issue in this entire thread. This is exactly my philosophy toward the whole thing. And I can tell you from previous dealings with companies that use FreeBSD as their main platform that this is one of the main reasons why. > -Matt Regards, -- Bosko Milekic bmilekic@technokratis.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 14:40: 7 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.rpi.edu (mail.rpi.edu [128.113.22.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B892D37B406 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 14:39:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from drosih@rpi.edu) Received: from [128.113.24.47] (gilead.acs.rpi.edu [128.113.24.47]) by mail.rpi.edu (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5GLdrB54394; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 17:39:53 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: drosih@mail.rpi.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200106162031.f5GKVfm16209@saturn.cs.uml.edu> References: <200106162031.f5GKVfm16209@saturn.cs.uml.edu> Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 17:39:49 -0400 To: "Albert D. Cahalan" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: Garance A Drosihn Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS Cc: dillon@earth.backplane.com, mhagerty@voyager.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 4:31 PM -0400 6/16/01, Albert D. Cahalan wrote: >Feel free to post a benchmarking procedure that would let one >person produce fair results. Results ought to be reproducable: >you, I, and an NT kernel developer all get the same answers. Nice ideal. Hard to imagine it happening any time soon. All of these OS's have their tricks when installing, and the person who "knows" the OS thinks nothing of those "simple" tuning issues. The person who doesn't "know" the OS wouldn't have a clue about the tuning. I have the feeling that this thread isn't going to generate much useful info, if the debate is going to include quasi- trolls like that. Mind you, I do agree that it would be very nice if we ["the industry"] could figure out benchmarking tactics which did not depend on the knowledge level of the person doing the benchmark. It would also be really nice to see lasting peace in every corner of the globe, but that also isn't going to happen without divine intervention. Getting back to benchmarks, the problem is that as soon as someone designs a benchmark, some members of the competition (the "competition" in whatever field is being benchmarked) sits down and figures out how to "look good on that benchmark". >So every FreeBSD server requires an expensive admin to tune it? >That Win2K solution is looking good now. :-) We have windows servers here at RPI. They require expensive admins too. We're putting up an exchange server right now, and it's requiring more time, effort and resources to set up correctly than just about anything we've ever put up in Unix-land - even though some of our recent hires include good people who have a lot of experience with Windows (and almost none with Unix...). I am sure that for SOME companies in SOME environments, Win2K is setup "right for them" right out of the box. However, that does not hold true for all companies, all environments, or all usage-patterns. It just does not universally apply. Again, this seems more like a troll than any serious or even realistic discussion of the issues. My guess is that nothing much good is going to come from this thread, at the rate it's going. -- Garance Alistair Drosehn = gad@eclipse.acs.rpi.edu Senior Systems Programmer or gad@freebsd.org Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute or drosih@rpi.edu To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 14:41:36 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.rpi.edu (mail.rpi.edu [128.113.22.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5831237B40A for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 14:41:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from drosih@rpi.edu) Received: from [128.113.24.47] (gilead.acs.rpi.edu [128.113.24.47]) by mail.rpi.edu (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5GLfRB39562; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 17:41:27 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: drosih@mail.rpi.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200106162104.f5GL4dX02015@earth.backplane.com> References: <200106162031.f5GKVfm16209@saturn.cs.uml.edu> <200106162104.f5GL4dX02015@earth.backplane.com> Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 17:41:25 -0400 To: Matt Dillon , "Albert D. Cahalan" From: Garance A Drosihn Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, mhagerty@voyager.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 2:04 PM -0700 6/16/01, Matt Dillon wrote: >:So every FreeBSD server requires an expensive admin to tune it? >:That Win2K solution is looking good now. :-) >: >:These admins now... they never quit their job at just the wrong > > Huh? I'm talking about a reasonably smart 16 year old kid who > bothers to spend a little time learning how a platform works. > I don't know what you are talking about. I think he's talking about some of the characters in the upcoming "Lord of the Rings" movie trilogy, namely, 'the trolls'. -- Garance Alistair Drosehn = gad@eclipse.acs.rpi.edu Senior Systems Programmer or gad@freebsd.org Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute or drosih@rpi.edu To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 14:45:25 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bandicoot.atlanta-bsd.org (firewall.atlanta-bsd.org [216.231.59.186]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D82B37B40B for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 14:45:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brian@bandicoot.atlanta-bsd.org) Received: (from brian@localhost) by bandicoot.atlanta-bsd.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5GLjBs09216 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 17:45:11 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from brian) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Brian Mitchell To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Fwd: Re: i386/26994: AMD Athlon Thunderbird not known to identcpu.c Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 17:45:10 -0400 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <01061617451003.00289@bandicoot.atlanta-bsd.org> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG curses, sent it to a nonexistant mail address before. Anyways, does anyone have any time to look at this, and tell me why it's a bad idea? ---------- Forwarded Message ---------- Subject: Re: i386/26994: AMD Athlon Thunderbird not known to identcpu.c Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 17:32:06 -0400 From: Brian Mitchell To: freebsd-gnats-submit@FreeBSD.org, venglin@freebsd.lublin.pl I don't have a thundrbird, but has far as I know, k6-2+ supports the extended cpuid functions, so something like the following may be appropriate. This worked on my k6-2 and didnt break on any of my other machines (without the #if defined guards, in my case), but I don't know if there are some oddball 686es that either dont support cpuid or dont support service 0x80000000 AND do bad things when recieving it. *** identcpu.c.old Sat Jun 16 16:39:34 2001 --- identcpu.c Sat Jun 16 17:19:16 2001 *************** *** 75,80 **** --- 75,81 ---- static void print_AMD_info(u_int amd_maxregs); static void print_AMD_assoc(int i); static void do_cpuid(u_int ax, u_int *p); + static int do_ExtendedCPUID(char *buff); u_int cyrix_did; /* Device ID of Cyrix CPU */ int cpu_class = CPUCLASS_386; /* least common denominator */ *************** *** 214,220 **** cpu = CPU_PIII; break; default: ! strcat(cpu_model, "Unknown 80686"); break; } break; --- 215,222 ---- cpu = CPU_PIII; break; default: ! if(do_ExtendedCPUID(cpu_model) < 0) ! strcat(cpu_model, "Unknown 80686"); break; } break; *************** *** 223,229 **** cpu = CPU_P4; break; default: ! strcat(cpu_model, "unknown"); break; } --- 225,232 ---- cpu = CPU_P4; break; default: ! if(do_ExtendedCPUID(cpu_model) < 0) ! strcat(cpu_model, "unknown"); break; } *************** *** 303,309 **** strcat(cpu_model, "K6-III"); break; default: ! strcat(cpu_model, "Unknown"); break; } #if defined(I586_CPU) && defined(CPU_WT_ALLOC) --- 306,313 ---- strcat(cpu_model, "K6-III"); break; default: ! if(do_ExtendedCPUID(cpu_model) < 0) ! strcat(cpu_model, "Unknown"); break; } #if defined(I586_CPU) && defined(CPU_WT_ALLOC) *************** *** 1001,1003 **** --- 1005,1078 ---- "\0403DNow!" ); } + + /* + * Get the model of the cpu if it is supported by the processor. This + * is probably the ideal way to determine the name of the cpu, if it + * is supported. + * + * Documentation on this can be found at: + * http://developer.intel.com/design/processor/future/manuals/Cpuid_supplement.p df + */ + static int + do_ExtendedCPUID(char *buff) + { + #if defined(I686_CPU) + char cpustring[128]; + unsigned int extCpuidFunc=0; + + /* get the highest cpuid extended func supported */ + __asm (" + movl $0x80000000, %%eax + cpuid + movl %%eax, %0" + : "=g" (extCpuidFunc) + : + : "eax"); + + /* + * if 0x80000002 - 0x80000004 are not supported, than this processor + * will not supply us the information we need. We should gracefully + * exit in that case. + */ + if(extCpuidFunc < 0x80000004) + #endif + return -1; + #if defined(I686_CPU) + + /* + * we can now use cpuid services 0x80000002-0x80000004 in order to + * fill our buffer 16 bytes at a time (total buffer provided can + * be up to 48 bytes). + */ + __asm (" + cld + lea (%0), %%edi + movl $0x80000002, %%eax + cpuid + movl %%eax, (%%edi) + movl %%ebx, 4(%%edi) + movl %%ecx, 8(%%edi) + movl %%edx, 12(%%edi) + addl $16, %%edi + movl $0x80000003, %%edi + cpuid + movl %%eax, (%%edi) + movl %%ebx, 4(%%edi) + movl %%ecx, 8(%%edi) + movl %%edx, 12(%%edi) + addl $16, %%edi + movl $0x80000004, %%eax + cpuid + movl %%eax, (%%edi) + movl %%ebx, 4(%%edi) + movl %%ecx, 8(%%edi) + movl %%edx, 12(%%edi)" + : + : "g" (cpustring) + : "eax", "ebx", "ecx", "edx", "esp"); + strcat(buff, cpustring); + return 0; + #endif + } + ------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 15:15: 0 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (mta7.pltn13.pbi.net [64.164.98.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DECE37B407 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 15:14:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jazepeda@pacbell.net) Received: from zippy.mybox.zip ([207.214.149.211]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.2000.03.23.18.03.p10) with ESMTP id <0GF100J9VN4HGP@mta7.pltn13.pbi.net> for hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 15:14:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: by zippy.mybox.zip (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 53FEF180B; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 15:14:40 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 15:14:39 -0700 From: Alex Zepeda Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS In-reply-to: <200106162031.f5GKVfm16209@saturn.cs.uml.edu>; from acahalan@cs.uml.edu on Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 04:31:41PM -0400 To: "Albert D. Cahalan" Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Message-id: <20010616151439.A712@zippy.mybox.zip> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i References: <200106162031.f5GKVfm16209@saturn.cs.uml.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 04:31:41PM -0400, Albert D. Cahalan wrote: > I guess it's fair to shove Linux deep into swap (as pro-FreeBSD > benchmarkers always do), but not fair to make FreeBSD handle a > large directory? Well... no. This test did stress FreeBSD's ability to handle large directories, and that's fine. Especially since they didn't even bother to compare it to ReiserFS, which should be much better. However, they could have / should have leveled the playing field with one very simple tweak: *Mount all filesystems async* The tests merely tested the effect of the disk's ability to handle tagged queuing and the disk's ability to cache stuff. - alex To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 15:19:27 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from winston.osd.bsdi.com (adsl-64-173-15-98.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net [64.173.15.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 350CD37B406 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 15:19:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) Received: from localhost (jkh@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by winston.osd.bsdi.com (8.11.4/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5GMImt80220; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 15:18:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@osd.bsdi.com) To: acahalan@cs.uml.edu Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, dillon@earth.backplane.com, mhagerty@voyager.net Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS In-Reply-To: <200106162031.f5GKVfm16209@saturn.cs.uml.edu> References: <200106162031.f5GKVfm16209@saturn.cs.uml.edu> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.94.1 on Emacs 20.7 / Mule 4.0 (HANANOEN) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20010616151848A.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 15:18:48 -0700 From: Jordan Hubbard X-Dispatcher: imput version 20000228(IM140) Lines: 41 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG From: "Albert D. Cahalan" Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 16:31:41 -0400 (EDT) > So every FreeBSD server requires an expensive admin to tune it? > That Win2K solution is looking good now. :-) That says a lot about your selection criteria. > I guess it's fair to shove Linux deep into swap (as pro-FreeBSD > benchmarkers always do), but not fair to make FreeBSD handle a > large directory? This is a foolish comparison. It's not all that rare to have a system suffer temporary (or even continuous) spikes in demand which cause it to go "deep into swap" whereas anyone stuffing tens of thousands of files into directory is simply an idiot who doesn't understand what databases are for. It's a serious apples-and-oranges comparison. > Biased against Win2K maybe, which beat FreeBSD without any tuning at all. For this particular benchmark, yes. If you want a rather less contrived benchmark, why not compare Apache running under both Windows NT and FreeBSD/Linux/Solaris? It's available for all those platforms and given that you're running the same application, it would be a fair assumption that any difference in performance will be due to the OS itself and you'll also be able to stand by your benchmark as indicative of something people actually CARE about, namely web server performance. All this trolling merely reminds me of the benchmark paper presented a few USENIXes ago which showed Solaris to be almost a factor of 10 slower than Linux when calling getpid() 50,000 times in a row. Of course the comparison was also blatantly unfair since Solaris had extra lock overhead imposed by the fact that it was fully SMP capable whereas (at the time) Linux was not. Lies, damn lies, and statistics. You want fair benchmarking, there it is. Go put your money where your mouth all too frequently is, Albert. - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 15:34: 6 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mta03-svc.ntlworld.com (mta03-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.43]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABDDE37B407; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 15:33:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dmlb@dmlb.org) Received: from dmlb.org ([62.253.135.228]) by mta03-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with ESMTP id <20010616223343.KXCQ298.mta03-svc.ntlworld.com@dmlb.org>; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 23:33:43 +0100 Received: from dmlb by dmlb.org with local (Exim 3.03 #1) id 15BOdU-0002cj-00; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 23:33:44 +0100 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <200106162104.f5GL4dX02015@earth.backplane.com> Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 23:33:44 +0100 (BST) From: Duncan Barclay To: Matt Dillon , freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS Cc: mhagerty@voyager.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Albert D.Cahalan Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi Matt, On 16-Jun-01 Matt Dillon wrote: > >:> If you intend to push a system to its limits, you damn well better >:> be prepared to tune it properly or you are just wasting your time. >:> On any operating system. You will never find joe-user running his >:> system into the ground with thousands of simultanious connections >:> and ten thousand files in a mail directory, so it's silly to >:> configure the system from a joe-user perspective. >: >:So every FreeBSD server requires an expensive admin to tune it? >:That Win2K solution is looking good now. :-) >: >:These admins now... they never quit their job at just the wrong > > Huh? I'm talking about a reasonably smart 16 year old kid who bothers > to spend a little time learning how a platform works. I don't > know what you are talking about. Expensive sysadmin? Where did that > come from? Any bozo with half a brain who has spent more then a week > playing with FreeBSD in a serious way can tune it better then the idiots > who ran the benchmark. Whilst I agree with your sentiment I would like to bring in the spectre of the "real world". There are many diverse usage models in the world. The "benchmark" under discussion aims to rate various platforms running a package for ISPs. But, I wonder where the majority of FreeBSD/Unix boxes actually live? To take an example - where I work. We are an electronic engineering design consultancy and have a wide mix of projects. The basic IT infrastructure is Windows, a mix of W98, NT4 and W2k with a few Suns for IC design. We have about 200 people on site. The majority of IT support is NOT tuning the machines for best performance (whether it be W2k cross compiling for an embedded system or the Suns for IC design), but just keeping up with people needing a pool machine for a project or customer visit, fixing the switches when they blow up after a power cut, or restoring the Exhange databases...They don't even manage to find the time to recompile a Solaris kernel! Dynamic tuning would be ideal to help our IT get best performance out of NFS and Samba serving project data whilst also running Verilog/VDHL sims on the same box. I guess that this may never get to "best performance" for a given app, and, as such would not want to remove the possibility of tuning. > A person who depends on the ability to run an out-of-the-box solution > into the ground and actually expects it to perform well without having > to know the first thing about the platform he is running his software > on is a complete and utter idiot and the company that employs such a > person has a hellofalot more to worry about then the performance of an > untuned machine. I agree iff the business depends on the solution as its value prop. (e.g. ISP) but, I am sure that there are many more businesses that just use a box as tool to create their value prop. (e.g. an IC vendor). What do we do in those cases? They do not have the staff expertise to tune, to get the best out of the tens of applications that must be run to achieve the overall business goals. As a genuine question, does anyone have an idea of what the split of Suns/HPs /SGIs etc. is between "internet/intranet server" vs. "work station on a desk" is? > -Matt Duncan --- ________________________________________________________________________ Duncan Barclay | God smiles upon the little children, dmlb@dmlb.org | the alcoholics, and the permanently stoned. dmlb@freebsd.org| Steven King To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 15:38:37 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bandicoot.atlanta-bsd.org (firewall.atlanta-bsd.org [216.231.59.186]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7189A37B406 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 15:38:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brian@bandicoot.atlanta-bsd.org) Received: (from brian@localhost) by bandicoot.atlanta-bsd.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5GMbQp00314; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 18:37:26 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from brian) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Brian Mitchell To: Jordan Hubbard , acahalan@cs.uml.edu Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 18:37:25 -0400 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, dillon@earth.backplane.com, mhagerty@voyager.net References: <200106162031.f5GKVfm16209@saturn.cs.uml.edu> <20010616151848A.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> In-Reply-To: <20010616151848A.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <01061618372500.00258@bandicoot.atlanta-bsd.org> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > For this particular benchmark, yes. If you want a rather less > contrived benchmark, why not compare Apache running under both Windows > NT and FreeBSD/Linux/Solaris? It's available for all those platforms > and given that you're running the same application, it would be a fair > assumption that any difference in performance will be due to the OS > itself and you'll also be able to stand by your benchmark as > indicative of something people actually CARE about, namely web server > performance. I'm not convinced this is a fair test either, particularly unix vs windows, for 2 main reasons: 1) The Apache port has not recieved as much attention as the unix ports, in terms of development effort/time 2) Implementations of identical features may take radically different code paths, not all of which are equivilant in performance. There may indeed be better ways of implementing feature X on windows than on unix, but because it's a port, those implementations may not have been used. I'm not convinced there is any such thing as a fair benchmark, nor am I convinced that benchmarks are valuable. Clearly the benchmark cited is flawed, but what benchmark is not? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 16: 3:25 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sockratte.schell.de (polz.de [195.20.238.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 80D8837B406 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 16:03:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sascha@schumann.cx) Received: (qmail 1300 invoked from network); 16 Jun 2001 23:03:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rossini.schumann.cx) (217.81.230.124) by polz.de with SMTP; 16 Jun 2001 23:03:13 -0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rossini.schumann.cx (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CE625E007 for ; Sun, 17 Jun 2001 00:30:47 +0200 (MEST) Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 00:30:47 +0200 (MEST) From: Sascha Schumann X-X-Sender: To: Subject: poll(2)'s arbitrary limit Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, one of my applications uses the SGI State Threads Library (I/O multiplexing scheduler). At its heart is a function which concatenates the pollfd arrays of all threads and calls poll(2). As sockets are shared between threads, the size of the final pollfd array can easily be greater than RLIMIT_NOFILE. Unfortunately, it is impossible to poll more than RLIMIT_NOFILE descriptors with one system call. This is caused by a check in sys/sys_generic.c which was introduced three months ago: /* * This is kinda bogus. We have fd limits, but that is not * really related to the size of the pollfd array. Make sure * we let the process use at least FD_SETSIZE entries and at * least enough for the current limits. We want to be reasonably * safe, but not overly restrictive. */ if (nfds > p->p_rlimit[RLIMIT_NOFILE].rlim_cur && nfds > FD_SETSIZE) return (EINVAL); What is the chance of getting this changed? Or, at least documented? [EINVAL] The specified time limit is negative. Thanks, - Sascha Experience IRCG http://schumann.cx/ http://schumann.cx/ircg To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 16:13:35 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.akalink.com (akalink.com [64.23.81.14]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 4F99437B40C for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 16:13:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jfortin@akalink.com) Received: (qmail 75347 invoked from network); 16 Jun 2001 23:10:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO alink) (64.23.81.14) by akalink.com with SMTP; 16 Jun 2001 23:10:41 -0000 Message-ID: <006701c0f6b9$dd6d89e0$3fac6395@alink> From: "Jonathan Fortin" To: Cc: Subject: Article Network performance by OS Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 19:12:49 -0400 Organization: Akalink Communications MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello, In order to perform a valid benchmark for stricly performance issues and let aside stability trade offs, A fair benchmark would be to purchase 3 exact systems, update BIOS, then deploy Linux, FreeBSD, and Windows2k. Tune them to the max, each perspective that could be modified to increase performance, then run silly write/read test, connect() test whatever. And in your test, show all the performance options you used and whatnot, and this benchmark should be redone periodly with new advices to show people what OS is the fastest when it's leg is pulled. As for the benchmark briefly, It's biased because whoever did it knew fuck nothing about Unix and Linux doesnt need tuning so Linux won period. Linux is tuned out of the box, where the others are tuned for stability. Thank you. Jonathan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 16:42:16 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from superconductor.rush.net (superconductor.rush.net [208.9.155.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21A3137B411 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 16:42:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@superconductor.rush.net) Received: (from bright@localhost) by superconductor.rush.net (8.11.2/8.11.2) id f5GNfu603288; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 19:41:56 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 19:41:55 -0400 From: Alfred Perlstein To: Sascha Schumann Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: poll(2)'s arbitrary limit Message-ID: <20010616194155.L1832@superconductor.rush.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0us In-Reply-To: ; from sascha@schumann.cx on Sun, Jun 17, 2001 at 12:30:47AM +0200 X-all-your-base: are belong to us. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG * Sascha Schumann [010616 19:03] wrote: > Hi, > > one of my applications uses the SGI State Threads Library > (I/O multiplexing scheduler). At its heart is a function > which concatenates the pollfd arrays of all threads and calls > poll(2). As sockets are shared between threads, the size of > the final pollfd array can easily be greater than > RLIMIT_NOFILE. Are you sure? #define RLIMIT_NOFILE 8 /* number of open files */ That would mean that the pollfd array is larger than the amount of open files you're allowed. I think it may be a good idea to actually allow double RLIMIT_NOFILE and FD_SETSIZE for flexibility. Anyone object? -- -Alfred Perlstein [alfred@freebsd.org] Instead of asking why a piece of software is using "1970s technology," start asking why software is ignoring 30 years of accumulated wisdom. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 16:42:21 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from witch.iiclub.co.il (shells.help-me.co.il [212.25.125.64]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8715E37B407 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 16:42:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from vadik@vygo.net) Received: from vadik by witch.iiclub.co.il with local (Exim 3.22 #27) id 15BOgQ-0003f0-00 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 17 Jun 2001 01:36:46 +0300 Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 01:36:46 +0300 From: Vadim Vygonets To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Patented algorithm in FreeBSD Message-ID: <20010617013646.D11285@vygo.net> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <20010613103509Z.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> <49353.992453857@critter> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <49353.992453857@critter>; from phk@critter.freebsd.dk on Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 07:37:37PM +0200 X-Operating-System: yes Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Quoth Poul-Henning Kamp on Wed, Jun 13, 2001: > In message <20010613103509Z.jkh@osd.bsdi.com>, Jordan Hubbard writes: > >From: Bill Vermillion > >> We just need to hide all the code from the lawyers. > > > >Why? They wouldn't understand it anyway. What we really need to do > >is stop HIRING them. :) > > You know, there is almost a fortune in that... Indeed, Jordan, I would patent this idea if I were you. Vadik. -- Any language that involves exposing private parts to friends is a tad suspect... -- Geoff Lane in the Monastery, about C++ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 16:46:14 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from superconductor.rush.net (superconductor.rush.net [208.9.155.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5703D37B406; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 16:45:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@superconductor.rush.net) Received: (from bright@localhost) by superconductor.rush.net (8.11.2/8.11.2) id f5GNjrx25830; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 19:45:53 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 19:45:49 -0400 From: Alfred Perlstein To: Jonathan Fortin Cc: freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Article Network performance by OS Message-ID: <20010616194549.M1832@superconductor.rush.net> References: <006701c0f6b9$dd6d89e0$3fac6395@alink> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0us In-Reply-To: <006701c0f6b9$dd6d89e0$3fac6395@alink>; from jfortin@akalink.com on Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 07:12:49PM -0400 X-all-your-base: are belong to us. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG * Jonathan Fortin [010616 19:13] wrote: > Hello, > > In order to perform a valid benchmark for stricly performance issues and let > aside stability trade offs, > A fair benchmark would be to purchase 3 exact systems, update BIOS, then > deploy Linux, FreeBSD, and Windows2k. > Tune them to the max, each perspective that could be modified to increase > performance, then run silly write/read test, connect() test whatever. > > And in your test, show all the performance options you used and whatnot, and > this benchmark should be redone periodly with new advices to show people > what OS is the fastest when it's leg is pulled. > > As for the benchmark briefly, It's biased because whoever did it knew fuck > nothing about Unix and Linux doesnt need tuning so Linux won period. > Linux is tuned out of the box, where the others are tuned for stability. Linux is not "tuned out of the box", Linux just allows for just about any subsystem to monopolize the kernel resources. Basically when you start to stress multiple subsystems on a Linux box that isn't tuned properly it all goes to hell. This is because for example your network buffers might eat up too much memory for you to be able to do a reasonable job at caching files. Also, I really hate it when people say Linux's disk IO is fast compared to FreeBSD, sure it's fast, but at the expense of possible massive corruption on a crash. Oh wait, Linux doesn't crash, does it? :) -- -Alfred Perlstein [alfred@freebsd.org] Instead of asking why a piece of software is using "1970s technology," start asking why software is ignoring 30 years of accumulated wisdom. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 16:55:14 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.rpi.edu (mail.rpi.edu [128.113.22.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2B5F37B403 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 16:54:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from drosih@rpi.edu) Received: from [128.113.24.47] (gilead.acs.rpi.edu [128.113.24.47]) by mail.rpi.edu (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5GNsgB76962; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 19:54:42 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: drosih@mail.rpi.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <01061618372500.00258@bandicoot.atlanta-bsd.org> References: <200106162031.f5GKVfm16209@saturn.cs.uml.edu> <20010616151848A.jkh@osd.bsdi.com> <01061618372500.00258@bandicoot.atlanta-bsd.org> Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 19:54:40 -0400 To: Brian Mitchell From: Garance A Drosihn Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 6:37 PM -0400 6/16/01, Brian Mitchell wrote: >I'm not convinced there is any such thing as a fair benchmark, >nor am I convinced that benchmarks are valuable. Clearly the >benchmark cited is flawed, but what benchmark is not? I must admit I (personally) have a major ambivalence towards benchmarks. I want to see them, I'm always interested in reading them, and yet at the end of the day I almost never really believe anything they say... Well, some ones I believe, if there are very few significant variables between the things being benchmarked. Comparing PowerPC 603's to PowerPC 603e's, for instance. Once you get to anything where you're changing cpu's AND os's AND compilers AND hardware AND hw configurations AND OS configuration experience, AND AND AND... well, it's just hopeless. At best they give you some ideas of what should be done differently in "a follow-up benchmark", to maybe perhaps get a more valid comparison on that one. Not that I'll believe that one either, but I might at least think "it's a better comparison". -- Garance Alistair Drosehn = gad@eclipse.acs.rpi.edu Senior Systems Programmer or gad@freebsd.org Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute or drosih@rpi.edu To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 17:49: 6 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from earth.backplane.com (earth-nat-cw.backplane.com [208.161.114.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73FF737B408; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 17:48:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@earth.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by earth.backplane.com (8.11.3/8.11.2) id f5H0mlG03029; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 17:48:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 17:48:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Dillon Message-Id: <200106170048.f5H0mlG03029@earth.backplane.com> To: Duncan Barclay Cc: freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG, mhagerty@voyager.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, "Albert D.Cahalan" Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :a pool machine for a project or customer visit, fixing the switches when they :blow up after a power cut, or restoring the Exhange databases...They :don't even manage to find the time to recompile a Solaris kernel! : :Dynamic tuning would be ideal to help our IT get best performance out of NFS :and Samba serving project data whilst also running Verilog/VDHL sims on the :same box. I guess that this may never get to "best performance" for a given app, :and, as such would not want to remove the possibility of tuning. Why are you assuming that tuning takes a lot of effort? One good sysop is all you need. One man-week and then you are done. That's it. We aren't talking about having an entire department working 24x7 for a year tuning machines. We are talking about *ONE* person who tunes the machines on the side. The amount of effort required is zero... That is how it works on UNIX systems... Linux, FreeBSD, Solaris, whatever. Tuning a UNIX box is extremely easy to do and extremely easy to replicate. It doesn't matter whether you have one machine or a hundred. Not taking the time to tune your machines is roughly equivalent to running a 6 cylinder engine on 4 cylinders. This is true whether you are a small shop or a big shop, whether you are a startup or a fortune-500 company, whether your UNIX machines are servers or workstations. There is no 'if'. Anyone who depends on the default configuration of their systems and anyone who isn't willing to maintain them after they've been installed is throwing away money. Lots of money. It's that simple. If your IT department isn't up to the task then maybe you should consider firing them. -Matt :Duncan : :--- :________________________________________________________________________ :Duncan Barclay | God smiles upon the little children, To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 18:53:49 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sockratte.schell.de (polz.de [195.20.238.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 8642F37B401 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 18:53:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sascha@schumann.cx) Received: (qmail 9899 invoked from network); 17 Jun 2001 01:53:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rossini.schumann.cx) (217.225.216.12) by polz.de with SMTP; 17 Jun 2001 01:53:42 -0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rossini.schumann.cx (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9ED525E007; Sun, 17 Jun 2001 03:52:58 +0200 (MEST) Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 03:52:58 +0200 (MEST) From: Sascha Schumann X-X-Sender: To: Alfred Perlstein Cc: Subject: Re: poll(2)'s arbitrary limit In-Reply-To: <20010616194155.L1832@superconductor.rush.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Are you sure? The code references the per-process limit (p->p_rlimit[RLIMIT_NOFILE].rlim_cur). > That would mean that the pollfd array is larger than the amount > of open files you're allowed. Right, the concatenation of multiple pollfd arrays does not eliminate multiple occurences of fds in userland. So, we might end up with n * p_rlimit[RLIMIT_NOFILE] entries where n is any number >= 1. I have not evaluated yet the feasibility of eliminating multiple occurences as that would involve adding complexity for a special case to quite generic code. > I think it may be a good idea to actually allow double > RLIMIT_NOFILE and FD_SETSIZE for flexibility. Yes. What do you think about adding a sysctl which defines the maximum size (e.g. kern.maxpollfds)? That could be initialized to kern.maxfilesperproc to maintain the current behaviour. - Sascha Experience IRCG http://schumann.cx/ http://schumann.cx/ircg To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 19:24:43 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from po3.wam.umd.edu (po3.wam.umd.edu [128.8.10.165]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8913137B401 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 19:24:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from culverk@wam.umd.edu) Received: from rac1.wam.umd.edu (IDENT:root@rac1.wam.umd.edu [128.8.10.141]) by po3.wam.umd.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA16581; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 22:24:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from rac1.wam.umd.edu (IDENT:sendmail@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rac1.wam.umd.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id WAA17070; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 22:24:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (culverk@localhost) by rac1.wam.umd.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA17066; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 22:24:34 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: rac1.wam.umd.edu: culverk owned process doing -bs Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 22:24:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Kenneth Wayne Culver To: Matthew Hagerty Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.2.20010616142444.03952e48@pop.voyager.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This is not really a "hardcore networking app" but a custom app written by the person who did the benchmark. The main reason that FreeBSD came in last was mostly because the guy didn't mount his filesystem correctly. On Sat, 16 Jun 2001, Matthew Hagerty wrote: > Greetings, > > Here is a surprisingly unbiased article comparing OSes running hard core > network apps. The results are kind of disturbing, with FreeBSD (4.2) > coming in last against Linux (RH), Win2k, and Solaris (Intel). > > http://www.sysadminmag.com/articles/2001/0107/0107a/0107a.htm > > The tests were performed against the TCP/IP implementation on these > platforms with different system calls. File systems tests (EXT2 for Linux, > UFS for FreeBSD and Solaris, and NTFS for Windows 2000) were performed by > creating writing, and reading 10,000 files in the same directory, > increasing the file size from 4K to 128K. Tests of various network > applications based on number of simultaneous connections, process-based vs. > thread-based, and sync vs. async connection handling were also performed. > > Hope it might be helpful to you... > > Matthew > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 19:47:16 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from netbank.com.br (garrincha.netbank.com.br [200.203.199.88]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2CD937B407; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 19:47:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from riel@conectiva.com.br) Received: from surriel.ddts.net (1-100.ctame701-1.telepar.net.br [200.181.137.100]) by netbank.com.br (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4B8346806; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 23:45:19 -0300 (BRST) Received: from localhost (yxxwvs@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by surriel.ddts.net (8.11.3/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f5H2kwn19053; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 23:46:58 -0300 Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 23:46:58 -0300 (BRST) From: Rik van Riel X-Sender: riel@imladris.rielhome.conectiva To: Jonathan Fortin Cc: freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Article Network performance by OS In-Reply-To: <006701c0f6b9$dd6d89e0$3fac6395@alink> Message-ID: X-spambait: aardvark@kernelnewbies.org X-spammeplease: aardvark@nl.linux.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 16 Jun 2001, Jonathan Fortin wrote: > Linux is tuned out of the box, where the others are tuned for > stability. Not quite. Linux distributions tend to be extremely conservative in the IDE options (DMA, interrupt unmasking, write caching, etc. all disabled) while FreeBSD seems to have write caching and DMA on by default... Both systems have tuning out of the box in different ways. regards, Rik -- Virtual memory is like a game you can't win; However, without VM there's truly nothing to lose... http://www.surriel.com/ http://distro.conectiva.com/ Send all your spam to aardvark@nl.linux.org (spam digging piggy) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 21:20:45 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wilma.widomaker.com (wilma.widomaker.com [204.17.220.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F2B2937B401 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 21:20:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from shannon@widomaker.com) Received: from [206.246.249.178] (helo=escape.shannon.net) by wilma.widomaker.com with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #2) id 15BU3E-000CRJ-00 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 17 Jun 2001 00:20:41 -0400 Received: (from shannon@localhost) by escape.shannon.net (8.11.0/8.8.8) id f5H3xAY15081 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 23:59:10 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 23:59:10 -0400 From: Shannon To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system Message-ID: <20010616235910.B14839@widomaker.com> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <3B29BB3F.2044B314@mindspring.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <3B29BB3F.2044B314@mindspring.com>; from tlambert2@mindspring.com on Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 12:37:35AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 12:37:35AM -0700, Terry Lambert wrote: > The thing that pisses me off most about the use of pid > files is that on any border device, you are generally > going to run at least two DNS servers (interior, exterior), > and will probably run two SMTP servers, and even two HTTP > servers and two inetd's. > > Putting everything in /var/run under the name of the > program gets to be dirt stupid real fast... As currently done, sure. But I don't see any huge obstacles in the way of extending the rc.d scripts to handle multiple invocations of a daemon, and keep track of them. Something similar to how multiple interfaces are configured would work, and a simple extension of ${DAEMIN}.pid would suffice for tracking them. If that gets too messy for you, then you probably have a custom setup anyway, and will be rolling your own. -- shannon@widomaker.com _________________________________________________ ______________________/ armchairrocketscientistgraffitiexenstentialist "And in billows of might swell the Saxons before her,-- Unite, oh unite! Or the billows burst o'er her!" -- Downfall of the Gael To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 21:39:28 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail2.mx.voyager.net (mail2.mx.voyager.net [216.93.66.201]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EBE537B406 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 21:39:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mhagerty@voyager.net) Received: from thunderbird.voyager.net (net-216-93-124-123.hcv.com [216.93.124.123]) by mail2.mx.voyager.net (8.10.2/8.10.2) with ESMTP id f5H4iHB98844 for ; Sun, 17 Jun 2001 00:44:17 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.2.20010617003548.018431f0@pop.voyager.net> X-Sender: mhagerty@pop.voyager.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 00:44:22 -0400 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: Matthew Hagerty Subject: Re: Article: Network performance by OS In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.2.20010616142444.03952e48@pop.voyager.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greetings All, I just wanted to thank everyone for the responses! I did not mean to start such a debated thread. I'm glad to have the information about why FreeBSD place so poorly in these "idiot's" tests. I'll have to write SysAdmin a letter now and ask them why the hell they would publish such an article. I hope I'm not wasting my money subscribing to the magazine... Again, thank you all for the information! I have been using FreeBSD since Release-1.1 (I downloaded the binary install disks via AOL!!) and have used every version since. I have also tried Solaris, Linux, BSDI, Windows, and NetBSD, but I keep coming back to FreeBSD. One day I hope to be able to contribute my share as well. Thanks, Matthew At 02:42 PM 6/16/2001 -0400, Matthew Hagerty wrote: >Greetings, > >Here is a surprisingly unbiased article comparing OSes running hard core >network apps. The results are kind of disturbing, with FreeBSD (4.2) >coming in last against Linux (RH), Win2k, and Solaris (Intel). > >http://www.sysadminmag.com/articles/2001/0107/0107a/0107a.htm > >The tests were performed against the TCP/IP implementation on these >platforms with different system calls. File systems tests (EXT2 for >Linux, UFS for FreeBSD and Solaris, and NTFS for Windows 2000) were >performed by creating writing, and reading 10,000 files in the same >directory, increasing the file size from 4K to 128K. Tests of various >network applications based on number of simultaneous connections, >process-based vs. thread-based, and sync vs. async connection handling >were also performed. > >Hope it might be helpful to you... > >Matthew > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 22:48:50 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 737CA37B403; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 22:48:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@ofug.org) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA43767; Sun, 17 Jun 2001 07:48:27 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des@ofug.org) X-URL: http://www.ofug.org/~des/ X-Disclaimer: The views expressed in this message do not necessarily coincide with those of any organisation or company with which I am or have been affiliated. To: Rik van Riel Cc: Jonathan Fortin , freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Article Network performance by OS References: From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 17 Jun 2001 07:48:27 +0200 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Lines: 26 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) Emacs/20.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Rik van Riel writes: > Not quite. Linux distributions tend to be extremely > conservative in the IDE options (DMA, interrupt unmasking, > write caching, etc. all disabled) while FreeBSD seems to > have write caching and DMA on by default... Ahem. First of all, Linux' file system (ext2fs) is more or less equivalent, in terms of performance and integrity, to async ffs. This gives Linux a big performance edge out of the box, and FreeBSD a big reliability edge - but benchmark authors rarely care about fs integrity, as shutting off the power during heavy disk I/O isn't generally part of their benchmark. Second, we tried turning write caching on ATA drives off by default, and boy were you (the user community) pissed. Yes, turning wc off shows you just how crappy those non-tagged-queueing 4000 RPM ATA drives you picked up at Fry's for some pocket change are. So we turned it back on. If you're not happy with that, put 'hw.ata.wc="0"' in your /boot/loader.conf and they'll be off after the next reboot. Or get real disks. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@ofug.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jun 16 23: 9:31 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gateway.hireindex.com (adsl-216-102-90-59.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [216.102.90.59]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A331137B407 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 23:09:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from landers@hireindex.com) Received: (from smapd@localhost) by gateway.hireindex.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA70686 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 23:09:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from landers@hireindex.com) Received: from services.hireindex.com(192.168.138.5) by gateway.hireindex.com via smap (V2.1) id xma070684; Sat, 16 Jun 01 23:09:11 -0700 Received: from kidserver (kidserver.hireindex.com [192.168.138.22]) by services.hireindex.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id XAA06586 for ; Sat, 16 Jun 2001 23:09:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from landers@hireindex.com) Message-ID: <00d501c0f6f3$a2fc3f60$168aa8c0@hireindex.com> From: "Joe Landers" To: References: <3B29BB3F.2044B314@mindspring.com> <20010616235910.B14839@widomaker.com> Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system (multiple DNS servers) Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 23:06:23 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Bind DNS already has this capability: the "options" section has a directive "pid-file" that you can set to whatever you desire. For example, on the external server's configuration you might add: options { pid-file "/var/run/named.external.pid"; ... }; And, you'll probably also want use a "controls" section as well with something like: controls { unix "/var/run/ndc-external" perm 0600 owner 0 group 0; }; Joe Landers ----- Original Message ----- From: Shannon To: Sent: Saturday, June 16, 2001 8:59 PM Subject: Re: import NetBSD rc system > On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 12:37:35AM -0700, Terry Lambert wrote: > > > The thing that pisses me off most about the use of pid > > files is that on any border device, you are generally > > going to run at least two DNS servers (interior, exterior), > > and will probably run two SMTP servers, and even two HTTP > > servers and two inetd's. > > > > Putting everything in /var/run under the name of the > > program gets to be dirt stupid real fast... > > As currently done, sure. But I don't see any huge obstacles in the > way of extending the rc.d scripts to handle multiple invocations of > a daemon, and keep track of them. Something similar to how multiple > interfaces are configured would work, and a simple extension of > ${DAEMIN}.pid would suffice for tracking them. If that gets too > messy for you, then you probably have a custom setup anyway, and > will be rolling your own. > > -- > shannon@widomaker.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message