From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 00:56:57 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA22736 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 00:56:57 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id AAA22722 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 00:56:50 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Sun, 26 Nov 95 08:56 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id JAA13099; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 09:52:41 +0100 Message-Id: <199511260852.JAA13099@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Re: any eprom guru out there ? To: graichen@julia.physik.fu-berlin.de (Thomas Graichen) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 09:52:41 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) In-Reply-To: <199511251452.PAA04145@julia.physik.fu-berlin.de> from "Thomas Graichen" at Nov 25, 95 03:52:53 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1189 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Thomas Graichen writes: > > has anybody some deeper experience with boot-eproms and the netboot > FreeBSD-code ? - my problem is that i want to make a boot prom for a > smc-elite 16 plus card - the docs say: the chip is 27512 and the rom > window size is 16k - but the 27512 is a 64k chip - now my question - > is it possible to burn the standard FreeBSD boot-rom code (which is > 16k by default and will fail with ROMSIZE set to 64k - due to a .word > ROMSITE in start2.S) into the 64k eprom or can i use 16k eproms > (27128) in the smc-elite 16 plus card ? I'm not too sure I understand the question. Obviously, you can fit the bootstrap into your PROM, and it will run from a larger PROM, just like adding another 64 MB of main memory to your machine won't stop it from running FreeBSD. I've had a look at the code, and it only refers to ROMSIZE once, in order to move the contents to RAM--apparently it executes it as a .COM file. I don't see why this should fail just because there's another 48 kB of empty space behind it. Or have you tried and failed? Beware of setting ROMSIZE to 65536 in the Makefile, however. This is 16 bit code, and your .words are 16 bits too. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 04:56:47 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA05858 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 04:56:47 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA05853 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 04:56:42 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Sun, 26 Nov 95 12:56 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id NAA13345; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 13:52:15 +0100 Message-Id: <199511261252.NAA13345@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Re: How long is long? To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 13:52:15 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) In-Reply-To: <199511241905.MAA10078@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Nov 24, 95 12:05:45 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 2758 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert writes: > > > Terry Lambert wrote: > > >That's a bug in the standard in not having mechanisms for obtaining > > >sized types. For a 64 bit int (requiring a 64 bit long), short is > > ^^-- 128 > ^^^-- 64 > The size of long shall be greater than or equal to the sizeof int. Your > 128 says "greater than" and ignores "equal to". > > > >either 16 or 32 bits (undefined) and we lose access to either 32 or > > >16 bit types (respectively). > > > > What architecture requires a 64 bit (int)? > > Any architecture where 64 bits is the bus transfer size and the registers > are 64 bits or larger. It's defined as the "natural type" for the machine. > > But I was assuming a 64 bit int, and it was the int requiring the 64 > bit long, not anything requiring a 64 bit int. > > My complaint is about the long >= int requirement on longs. > > > IMHO, DEC did exactly the right thing making int 32 bits and long 64 bits, > > given the history of the language, but IMHO the original BSD port to the > > VAX should have done the same thing, rather than keeping it 32 bits for > > easier porting of PDP-11 code. > > > > Long doesn't and shouldn't mean "32 bits". > > Maybe not. But *something* should mean "32 bits". > > The problem is that with a 64 bit int (which, despite your opinion of > DEC and grandfathering old software, is correct for the Alpha): > > int == 64 :== long == 64 > short == 32 || short == 16 > char == 8 > > You lose access to either 32 bit or 16 bit sized types. > > Period. You're looking at this from the wrong perspective. Even if you say: > ANSI doesn't allow "long long" or "quad". That means that ANSI is wrong. If a language doesn't allow you to access to the primitive data types of your machine, then it's broken. In the case of C, the answer is obvious enough. ANSI doesn't allow long long, but that doesn't mean you can't use it. And how about short short? I tend to agree with Peter that it's a good idea to keep data sizes roughly the same. It may have been a mistake to increase an int from 16 to 32 bits when moving to the Vax, but that's history. Modern computers have int lengths which are a power of 2, and that power lies between 3 and 7 in all cases. Is it really that difficult to find 5 different descriptions? For example: short short 8 bits short 16 int 32 long 64 long long 128 I don't think that this should be carved in stone; I'd prefer int8, int16 etc. for things which really *must* be that length (like data shared with other architectures), but it would make life a lot easier if people would adhere to the lengths anyway. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 04:57:22 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA05879 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 04:57:22 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA05874 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 04:57:18 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Sun, 26 Nov 95 12:56 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id NAA13319; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 13:29:33 +0100 Message-Id: <199511261229.NAA13319@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Re: diskless X server using FreeBSD 2.0.5R To: Jerry.Kendall@vmicls.com (Jerry Kendall) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 13:29:32 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) In-Reply-To: <9511241827.AA04883.gonzo@vmicls.com> from "Jerry Kendall" at Nov 24, 95 01:27:54 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 603 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Jerry Kendall writes: > > I would like to setup my old 486-33 machine to run as a > diskless FreeBSD/Xserver. > > Can this be done by first starting it as a diskless system and running X ???? > > OR is there a better way of doing this ????? I can't see any other way of running a FreeBSD machine as a diskless FreeBSD/X Server than by starting it as a diskless system and running X. Or wasn't that really your question? If the question was "can I do this", then the answer is "yes, if you have a supported graphics card". You'll have to decide for yourself whether performance is adequate. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 05:14:28 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA06360 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 05:14:28 -0800 Received: from brainaid.oche.de (brainaid.oche.de [193.174.14.162]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id FAA06353 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 05:14:17 -0800 Received: by brainaid.oche.de (Smail3.1.29.1 #1) id m0tJgph-000978C; Sun, 26 Nov 95 14:09 MET Message-Id: From: gvw@brainaid.oche.de (Guido von Walter) Subject: 210R Install Feedback To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:09:24 +0100 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME5a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2383 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hi there! I've just installed 2.1.0R and I'm quite happy with it (as expected). But there are a few quirks in the installation process I'd like to mention: 1. I boot my 2.0.5R system and OS/2 from the OS/2 Bootmanager. I installed 210R to sd2 and told sysinstall not to touch the bootblock. Afterwards the bootmanager was deactivated, and the system booted the old 205R partition by default. Hmm. 2. The sd devices: The installation made the /dev entries for the new sd2 devices (sd2s1e ...) and for the old partitions on sd0 (sd0s3e from the 205r), but did not notice another FreeBSD partition on sd1. I made these entries with MAKEDEV later, no big deal, but possibly a problem for others. 3. Package installation. Selecting packages from a menu and having sysinstall fetching and installing applications is a great feature. But there is a major drawback: Dependencies are not handled by the tool. An example: select ghostscript and ghostview from the menu, usually you will mark ghostscript first. This means that ghostview will be installed first for some reason or other. pkg_add for ghostview will report an error because of the dependeny on ghostscript. sysinstall displays an error message. Press Enter. Proceed with ghostscript. This is especially annoying when installing from ftp over a slow line (V34 leased line). I had the basic installation run one night, selected packages in the morning, went to work, came back in the evening and had had about three packages done: Press Enter! Two more pkgs: Press Enter! This can take ages over a slow line! If I can't do anything about an error, why do I have to acknowledge it? I would be quite happy with a summary of errors at the end of installation. There is not even a 'Cancel' option to quit the package installation! So I think there should be something like an automatic addition of the required packages. A new user will not know he has to include the xpm package for every other X app for example. To sum it up: Some little problems, a bit of frustration, but a great system with a very good installation. Good work! Guido `~^'-.,.-'^~`~^'-.,.-'^~`~^'-.,.-'^~`~^'-.,.-'^~`~^'-.,.-'^~` Guido von Walter mailto:gvw@brainaid.oche.de http://brainaid.oche.de/~gvw Press any key to continue, any other key to exit From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 05:56:42 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA08154 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 05:56:42 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id FAA08149 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 05:56:38 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Sun, 26 Nov 95 13:56 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id OAA13704; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:55:29 +0100 Message-Id: <199511261355.OAA13704@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:55:28 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) In-Reply-To: <199511241913.MAA10123@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Nov 24, 95 12:13:31 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 2431 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert writes: > >>> Installation is in the man page. >> >> I think I need to reformulate my question: >> >> What is the name of the man page for ibcs2? > > There isn't one. There doesn't need to be one. I strongly disagree. BSDI has found the need to write two separate man pages (ibcs2(5) and sco(1)), and the information contained there is very useful. At the very least, you need to tell people how to enable it (yes, I did know about the entry in /etc/sysconfig; that's where I came in), and how to run a COFF executable, even if it's trivial. > I think I need to > rephrase my answer: > > You use "modload", whose man page is "modload(8)" to load it. You > don't have any other options regarding IBCS2: you only have the option > of loading it or not loading it. Options aren't the only think to document. How about limitations and bugs? How do I know how to enable the emulation? How do I run the program? Just start it by name? Do I need to say "ibcs2 vi", or will it be enough just to write "vi"? I tried vi with the SCO version and got: === root@freebie (/dev/ttyp0) /allegro/usr/sco/usr/bin 16 -> ./vi Abort trap === root@freebie (/dev/ttyp0) /allegro/usr/sco/usr/bin 17 -> ibcs2 vi modload: error initializing module: File exists Well, it appears that I need to run it as "ibcs2 vi". But what's this modload problem? I have enabled Or have I done it wrong after all? I'm an experienced computer person, and quite honestly the lack of documentation (coupled, admittedly, with a lack of interest in SCO software) is enough that I'm prepared to give up. Who is going to use this stuff if they run into trouble and can't even be certain they've started it properly. How does it work? How do I go about finding out what's wrong here? > Typically, you don't document things that don't have parameters, options, > or other controls. Speak for yourself. From my point of view, this is completely wrong. > Things like IBCS2 are binary: they either are or > are not loaded. > > If you don't want to load it as a module (why not? It's an easy thing > to do), then you can statically compile it. Look at /sys/i386/conf/LINT, > at the bottom of the file: I can't see any reason not to load the module either. > # More undocumented options for linting. ^^^^^^^^^^^^ > options COMPAT_LINUX > options "IBCS2" Oh well. I had already documented these ones. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 05:59:33 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA08198 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 05:59:33 -0800 Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [199.98.84.132]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA08193 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 05:59:30 -0800 Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id HAA01124 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 07:59:32 -0600 From: Bob Willcox Message-Id: <199511261359.HAA01124@luke.pmr.com> Subject: How can I remove hard links between directories? To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (freebsd-hackers) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 07:59:32 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 435 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Help! An apparently buggy version of afio that I was running has created some hard links between a couple of directories on my system (2.1-STABLE) and I need to get rid of them. Unfortunately rmdir simply complains that the directory is not empty (use counts on these two directries is 4 rather than 2). Can someone please tell me a way to fix this? Thanks, -- Bob Willcox bob@luke.pmr.com (or obiwan%bob@uunet.uu.net) Austin, TX From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 06:32:18 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id GAA10056 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 06:32:18 -0800 Received: from ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (ki1.Chemie.FU-Berlin.DE [160.45.24.21]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id GAA09904 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 06:31:57 -0800 Received: by ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (Smail3.1.28.1) from mail.hanse.de (134.100.239.2) with smtp id ; Sun, 26 Nov 95 15:31 MET Received: from wavehh.UUCP by mail.hanse.de with UUCP for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org id ; Fri, 24 Nov 95 18:12 MET Received: by wavehh.hanse.de (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA06758; Fri, 24 Nov 95 15:54:37 +0100 Date: Fri, 24 Nov 95 15:54:37 +0100 From: cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de (Martin Cracauer) Message-Id: <9511241454.AA06758@wavehh.hanse.de> To: alexis@harley.ios.COM Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: rlogin is blocked for quite a long time Newsgroups: hanse-ml.freebsd.hackers References: <199511230917.KAA26203@uriah.heep.sax.de> <199511231828.NAA07075@harley.ios.com> Reply-To: cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> > I almost always >> > have to wait about 40-60 seconds to connect to the host again after >> > I've closed connection. >> >> If you've got this problem _always_, it's likely a DNS lookup problem. >I've got it not always but very often. And it occures only if I >try to connect right after I closed connection, otherwise it works >perfectly. >This IS NOT DNS problem. I'm responsible for DNS here, I guarantee :) I sometimes have a similar problem with SunOS-4.1.3. When I close a rlogin session and then want to reopen it, this particular attempt stalls for about a minute. My problem seems to be based on ptys. When one such attempt stalls and I open another connection (from the same machine), which will result in a different pty, it connects without problems, while the other (the reconnect attempt) still stalls. In a word, it looks like the pty needs some time to reset. Could you try whether *all* connections are delayed or only one at a time, that one that would use the pty just freed?? Martin -- %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Martin Cracauer - BSD User Group Hamburg, Germany "As far as I'm concerned, if something is so complicated that you can't ex-" "plain it in 10 seconds, then it's probably not worth knowing anyway"- Calvin From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 07:55:44 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA14891 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 07:55:44 -0800 Received: from apollo.hq.nasa.gov (apollo.hq.nasa.gov [131.182.121.87]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA14886 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 07:55:42 -0800 Received: from wirehead.hq.nasa.gov (wirehead.hq.nasa.gov [131.182.121.88]) by apollo.hq.nasa.gov (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id PAA29016; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:57:01 GMT Received: from localhost (cshenton@localhost) by wirehead.hq.nasa.gov (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id PAA10995; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:57:01 GMT Message-Id: <199511261557.PAA10995@wirehead.hq.nasa.gov> X-Authentication-Warning: wirehead.hq.nasa.gov: cshenton owned process doing -bs X-Authentication-Warning: wirehead.hq.nasa.gov: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 25 Nov 1995 12:18:45 PST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:57:00 -0500 From: Chris Shenton Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 25 Nov 1995 12:18:45 -0800, "Jordan K. Hubbard" said: Jordan> Nonetheless, I was favorably impressed by the sheer depth of their Jordan> coverage and I was asked enough questions to bring me all the way up Jordan> into X on the first try, the installer even giving me the chance to ID Jordan> everything from my board's clock chip to the monitor specs. Yup, this Jordan> is how to do it! A Mac-friend and I just spend about 16 hours trying to install Caldera (RH Linux, plus Visix desktop, plus Novell, plus ...). What a nightmare. The usual Linux root+boot disk (plus two, for Caldera), but I can live with that (tho I certainly prefer *one* disk with FreeBSD). Main problem was that if you didn't know exactly what hardware you had, you were hosed. Only after you selected and wrote a boot disk, then got through the entire network config dialog, did it discover it didn't recognize your card (eg: maybe you selected a boot with ed* drivers rather than le*). Same for the CDROM: very late in the install, when you're about ready to slurp it all onto the hard disk does it discover that it can't see the CDROM. Major waste of time. Jordan> My primary goal Jordan> is that we get some *robust* tools, with plenty of safety netting, and Jordan> an easy-to-use interface for them that looks halfway like something Jordan> you might expect to see on a commercial product. IMHO, it ought to do a *lot* of probing up front -- looking for every kind of device which can be stuffed onto a boot disk, and identifying all configs. A "commercial" user isn't gonna know what kind of ether or CD or SVGA clock chip or... he has on his/her Gateway, Dell, or other store-bought box. And they shouldn't have too. A simple design goal: don't let the user get down the road fail because of something that could have been determined earlier. Jordan> Once in X, the root login had a reasonable set of defaults (I made a Jordan> note: give root some reasonable .dotfiles!! :-) for bringing up fvwm Jordan> and a small desktop, Good. You certainly want to reassure them by giving them something they can recognize and immediately *use*. I'm sure we all had our problems getting our very first .cshrc/.login/.Xdefaults right! Jordan> 3. We should start looking at what we need to do to get the user into Jordan> X in as fool-proof a fashion as possible, working with the folks Jordan> doing #1 for the various GUI elements required. I'd suggest aggressive probing, then confirmation with the user, with an "out" if the user doesn't know. Failing good information on HW config, default to something most likely to work (eg: VGA X11, rather than nothing; WD8003, if that's the most prevalent ether clone, etc). Jordan> Only half, however, and their continued use of libdialog has cramped Jordan> their style outside of X (where one still spends considerable amounts Jordan> of time during the RedHat install), forcing some information to be Jordan> presented in a somewhat constrained fashion. A good example of this Jordan> are their TCP/IP setup dialogs, and some of the early X stuff. Yeah, I prefer FreeBSD's here: you can see it all at once. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 07:57:23 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA15137 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 07:57:23 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA15128 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 07:57:12 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id HAA12512; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 07:52:32 -0800 To: gvw@brainaid.oche.de (Guido von Walter) cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 210R Install Feedback In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:09:24 +0100." Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 07:52:32 -0800 Message-ID: <12510.817401152@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > 1. I boot my 2.0.5R system and OS/2 from the OS/2 Bootmanager. I installed > 210R to sd2 and told sysinstall not to touch the bootblock. > Afterwards the bootmanager was deactivated, and the system booted the > old 205R partition by default. Hmm. This seems to be a problem, but neither Poul-Henning and I can figure out why. I literally don't write to a disk that's not selected, yet people are telling me the boot blocks are getting touched for their first drive anyway. I can't figure it out. > 2. The sd devices: The installation made the /dev entries for the new sd2 > devices (sd2s1e ...) and for the old partitions on sd0 (sd0s3e from the > 205r), but did not notice another FreeBSD partition on sd1. I made these > entries with MAKEDEV later, no big deal, but possibly a problem for others Hmmmm. If this is easy to fix, I will. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 08:09:06 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id IAA15993 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 08:09:06 -0800 Received: from apollo.hq.nasa.gov (apollo.hq.nasa.gov [131.182.121.87]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA15985 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 08:08:47 -0800 Received: from wirehead.hq.nasa.gov (wirehead.hq.nasa.gov [131.182.121.88]) by apollo.hq.nasa.gov (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA29027; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 16:10:04 GMT Received: from localhost (cshenton@localhost) by wirehead.hq.nasa.gov (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id QAA11025; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 16:10:04 GMT Message-Id: <199511261610.QAA11025@wirehead.hq.nasa.gov> X-Authentication-Warning: wirehead.hq.nasa.gov: cshenton owned process doing -bs X-Authentication-Warning: wirehead.hq.nasa.gov: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: peter@taronga.com (Peter da Silva) cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: machine reboot & kernel maxusers option In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 25 Nov 1995 19:14:40 CST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 11:10:04 -0500 From: Chris Shenton Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 25 Nov 1995 19:14:40 -0600, peter@taronga.com (Peter da Silva) said: J Wunsch wrote: >> I really don't like the two dozen ``foo: not found at address ...'' >> messages for the installation kernel. Peter> I like it. A lot. I hate systems that don't tell me what the Peter> hell they're doing on boot-up (see also, Windows NT, SCO, Peter> Unixware). How about at least an "options BOOTVERBOSE" for us Peter> belt-and-suspenders types? Agreed. I used to hate computers with lots of blinking lights. Until I had to work with one whose only diagnostics were the lights -- until the console came up, which many times it didn't :-( A BOOTVERBOSE would be fine by me, as long as it's not the default. For someone bringing up a machine the first time (or a new kernel) it is crucial to see this. How 'bout a kernel var or some such like BOOTQUIET? Or put the boot messages on an aux console (ALT-F4?) and point at 'em from the now-quiet main boot console window? In either case, I'd really like to have the addition of backward scrolling added to those boot messages: many time's I've been rebuilding the kernel, or reconfiging jumpers on cards and they are the first things probed and fly off the screen. Doh! Can you use the scroll-lock page-up/down feature here? Thanks. PS: think about new users trying to bring up FreeBSD on unknown HW. How many are going to know to check `dmesg' and /var/log/messages? From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 08:24:24 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id IAA16884 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 08:24:24 -0800 Received: from metal.ops.neosoft.com (root@metal.ops.neosoft.com [206.109.5.25]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA16846 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 08:23:42 -0800 Received: (from smace@localhost) by metal.ops.neosoft.com (8.6.12/8.6.10) id KAA08479 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:23:27 -0600 From: Scott Mace Message-Id: <199511261623.KAA08479@metal.ops.neosoft.com> Subject: interesting tidbit from 2.1.0-RELEASE make world To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:23:27 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 446 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk crash # make ===> lp ===> lpc ===> lpd cc -O -m486 -pipe -I/usr/src/usr.sbin/lpr/lpd/../common_source -static -o lpd lpd.o printjob.o recvjob.o displayq.o rmjob.o startdaemon.o lpdchar.o common.o displayq.o: Definition of symbol `_warn' (multiply defined) /usr/lib/libc.a(err.o): Definition of symbol `_warn' (multiply defined) *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. Just for grins I set usr.sbin to link statically... :-) Scott From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 09:31:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA20972 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 09:31:40 -0800 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.Atinc.COM [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA20951 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 09:31:23 -0800 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id MAA20011; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 12:18:57 -0500 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 12:18:53 -0500 (EST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: Re: machine reboot & kernel maxusers option To: Chris Shenton cc: Peter da Silva , hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511261610.QAA11025@wirehead.hq.nasa.gov> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 26 Nov 1995, Chris Shenton wrote: > In either case, I'd really like to have the addition of backward > scrolling added to those boot messages: many time's I've been > rebuilding the kernel, or reconfiging jumpers on cards and they are > the first things probed and fly off the screen. Doh! Can you use the > scroll-lock page-up/down feature here? yes. scroll-lock page-up/down can be a real god send. Jonathan M. Bresler FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.ORG play go. ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life i am moving to a new job. PLEASE USE: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 10:50:38 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA24764 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:50:38 -0800 Received: from ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (ki1.Chemie.FU-Berlin.DE [160.45.24.21]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA24759 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:50:28 -0800 Received: by ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (Smail3.1.28.1) from prospero (130.133.3.126) with smtp id ; Sun, 26 Nov 95 19:47 MET Received: (from graichen@localhost) by prospero (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA01254 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 19:30:35 +0100 From: Thomas Graichen Message-Id: <199511261830.TAA01254@prospero> Subject: Re: machine reboot & kernel maxusers option To: peter@taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 19:30:06 +0100 (MET) In-Reply-To: <199511260114.TAA28159@bonkers.taronga.com> from "Peter da Silva" at Nov 25, 95 07:14:40 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1237 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > J Wunsch wrote: > >I really don't like the two dozen ``foo: not found at address ...'' > >messages for the installation kernel. > > I like it. A lot. I hate systems that don't tell me what the hell they're > doing on boot-up (see also, Windows NT, SCO, Unixware). > > How about at least an "options BOOTVERBOSE" for us belt-and-suspenders types? > yes - why not that way: * options BOOTVERBOSE - does the same like: if (boothowto & RB_VERBOSE) bootverbose++; in /sys/i386/i386/machdep.c * boot -v too * and if verbose boot is set in either way's all is printed and else only successfull probes ? t _______________________________________________________||___________________ __|| Perfection is reached, not when there is no __|| thomas graichen longer anything to add, but when there __|| freie universitaet berlin is no longer anything to take away __|| fachbereich physik __|| - Antoine de Saint-Exupery - __|| graichen@mail.physik.fu-berlin.de ___________________________||__________________graichen@FreeBSD.org_________ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 10:59:41 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA25085 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:59:41 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA25080 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:59:39 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA15164; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 11:53:55 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511261853.LAA15164@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 11:53:55 -0700 (MST) Cc: jfieber@indiana.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <9417.817366166@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 25, 95 10:09:26 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1319 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Just to keep focus on the ultimate purpose of the installation software, > > making installation painless, or even fun, I offer this less technical > > description of what is in order for the next great installation. I think > > developing a slick new X install program is nifty, but meaningless if some > > more basic installation issues are not addressed first. > > Hmmmmm. This sounds suspiciously like "design before implementation" > or one of those other socialist granola-eating philosophies from the > 60's at places like Berkeley & CWI. Jeeze, he'll start quoting Wirth > next if we don't stop him! :-) > > Seriously, this sounds like a reasonable attempt to bring the techies > back down to earth. Any human interface people care to jump in at > this point and start suggesting how John's 16 step program might be > implemented? I'm good at thinking up the implementation details, but > not so good at the "story boarding" that John seems to be suggesting > for this stage. Or you could go to the X/Open standards, since they cover exactly this, and then you'd not only have "design before code", you'd have "compliance with standards". I know, silly. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 11:18:32 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA25947 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 11:18:32 -0800 Received: from localhost.lightside.com (user54.lightside.com [198.81.209.54]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA25942 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 11:18:25 -0800 Received: (from jehamby@localhost) by localhost.lightside.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id LAA00337; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 11:20:32 -0800 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 11:20:31 -0800 (PST) From: Jake Hamby X-Sender: jehamby@localhost To: Kai.Vorma@hut.fi cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Java.. In-Reply-To: <199511242205.AAA05810@freud.hut.fi> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 25 Nov 1995, Kai Vorma wrote: > Netscape 2.0B3 is now out (ftp://ftp.netscape.com/2.0b3/unix) and Java > Applet support is now available for Linux (but not for BSDI). The > linux version seems to be working under emulation (-current) so check > it out if you are interested! > > To get it working you have to delete /etc/host.conf because linux uses > different syntax than FreeBSD. > > ..vode I just downloaded 2.0b3 for Linux to check out the Java support. It seems to be running at a decent speed, so that's good. But since I've been using FreeBSD for all my Internet applications, since the PPP speed in Linux is basically crap (2.8Kbps vs. 3.2Kbps for FreeBSD!), I also D/Led the BSD version, and even though there is no Java, it did fix ALL of the bugs I reported (non-blinking cursor, and problems with my dial-on-demand PPP setup) so I am one happy camper. Why can't more companies create such high-quality software? But then again, the scary thing is that you don't have to create stable, robust software to be wildly successful, look at Microsoft... :-) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Jake Hamby | E-Mail: jehamby@lightside.com Student, Cal Poly University, Pomona | System Administrator, JPL ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 11:26:36 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA26362 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 11:26:36 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA26357 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 11:26:32 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA15217; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 12:22:44 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511261922.MAA15217@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: How long is long? To: grog@lemis.de Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 12:22:44 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511261252.NAA13345@allegro.lemis.de> from "Greg Lehey" at Nov 26, 95 01:52:15 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 4122 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I thought Peter and I took this offline. It was such an old post he was responding to in the first place. > > > Long doesn't and shouldn't mean "32 bits". > > > > Maybe not. But *something* should mean "32 bits". > > > > The problem is that with a 64 bit int (which, despite your opinion of > > DEC and grandfathering old software, is correct for the Alpha): > > > > int == 64 :== long == 64 > > short == 32 || short == 16 > > char == 8 > > > > You lose access to either 32 bit or 16 bit sized types. > > > > Period. > > You're looking at this from the wrong perspective. Even if you say: > > > ANSI doesn't allow "long long" or "quad". > > That means that ANSI is wrong. If a language doesn't allow you to > access to the primitive data types of your machine, then it's broken. > In the case of C, the answer is obvious enough. ANSI doesn't allow > long long, but that doesn't mean you can't use it. And how about > short short? > > I tend to agree with Peter that it's a good idea to keep data sizes > roughly the same. It may have been a mistake to increase an int from > 16 to 32 bits when moving to the Vax, but that's history. Modern > computers have int lengths which are a power of 2, and that power lies > between 3 and 7 in all cases. Is it really that difficult to find 5 > different descriptions? For example: > > short short 8 bits Uh, some of us call this one "char". 8-). > short 16 > int 32 > long 64 > long long 128 > > I don't think that this should be carved in stone; I'd prefer int8, > int16 etc. for things which really *must* be that length (like data > shared with other architectures), but it would make life a lot easier > if people would adhere to the lengths anyway. Let's clarify my perspective: If there is a type that is treated as atomic (ie: it may be used as the underlying type for off_t according to ANSI and POSIX), then the type promotion has to promote to the largest one allowable. The target promoted type is, in fact, the stack alignment size. This only makes sense, since the stack alignment size and single cycle bus fetch and register sizes dictate the efficiency of the fetch process. This is why Aztec on the Mac and Amiga 68k was correct in setting sizeof(int) == 2 and Lattice (SAS) C was wrong in setting sizeof(int) == 4. An "int" is supposed to be the "natural" type for the machine and take a single bus cycle to load. This satisfies the ANSI C standard, which does not require prototyping of functions, and further specifically allows me to use functions without a prototype in scope. Consider, specifically, "lseek". It is [!>*BOGUS*; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 11:52:26 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA15284; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 12:48:38 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511261948.MAA15284@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? To: grog@lemis.de Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 12:48:38 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511261355.OAA13704@allegro.lemis.de> from "Greg Lehey" at Nov 26, 95 02:55:28 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 5357 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >> What is the name of the man page for ibcs2? > > > > There isn't one. There doesn't need to be one. > > I strongly disagree. BSDI has found the need to write two separate > man pages (ibcs2(5) and sco(1)), and the information contained there > is very useful. At the very least, you need to tell people how to > enable it (yes, I did know about the entry in /etc/sysconfig; that's > where I came in), and how to run a COFF executable, even if it's > trivial. BSDI needs one because they have to enable it explicitly. FreeBSD can set the value in the /etc/sysconfig to "YES" at install time because FreeBSD supports LKMs. > > I think I need to > > rephrase my answer: > > > > You use "modload", whose man page is "modload(8)" to load it. You > > don't have any other options regarding IBCS2: you only have the option > > of loading it or not loading it. > > Options aren't the only think to document. How about limitations and > bugs? What are the limitations and bugs in FreeBSD itself? Not very documented, and more important that similar documents for IBCS2. > How do I know how to enable the emulation? At install time, when it asks you about it. > How do I run the program? Just start it by name? Yes. > Do I need to say "ibcs2 vi", or will it be enough just to write "vi"? Do I need to type "run foo" or just "foo"? >I tried vi with the SCO version and got: > > === root@freebie (/dev/ttyp0) /allegro/usr/sco/usr/bin 16 -> ./vi > Abort trap It apparently won't run. > === root@freebie (/dev/ttyp0) /allegro/usr/sco/usr/bin 17 -> ibcs2 vi > modload: error initializing module: File exists You are now typing things at random. A bad idea for root (you must have been root to get that particular error message). > Well, it appears that I need to run it as "ibcs2 vi". But what's this > modload problem? I have enabled Or have I done it wrong after all? Tell me: what must you do to enamle running of FreeBSD binaries? You must install. What must you do to run FreeBSD binaries? You type their name. The questions are divisible. What makes you believe (incorrectly) that you would need to type "ibcs2 " to run a binary? > I'm an experienced computer person, and quite honestly the lack of > documentation (coupled, admittedly, with a lack of interest in SCO > software) is enough that I'm prepared to give up. Who is going to use > this stuff if they run into trouble and can't even be certain they've > started it properly. How does it work? I agree that there is a lot of missing "theory of operation" documentation for lots of the kernel. Execution classes are one such beastie. The VM is another. But if you expect Joe Schmoe to be able to make it work without asking questions on -questions at this point if Joe Schmoe didn't have things handled for him in the install, then you are barking up the wrong tree. Perhaps the right tree is http://www.freebsd.org. Or the source code, which is provided free of charge. Or the installation software that should have created the missing devices for you. Or the fact that to use an SCO shared binary, you must first own a copy of SCO to get the shared libraries. And you must know enough about how SCO uses shared libraries to get them moved over. And you must know general theory of operation of execution classes. And let me tell you, a simple (or even a complex) man page will sure as hell not cover it, especially without doing what Linux did and supplying our own IBCS2 shared libraries, etc. So who will use it? People who have this information already, people willing to dig it out of the sources, or people willing to ask questions of people who already know these things. > How do I go about finding out what's wrong here? Ask. > > Typically, you don't document things that don't have parameters, options, > > or other controls. > > Speak for yourself. From my point of view, this is completely wrong. Are we talking "typically" (like I thought) or "ideally"? If "typically", then feel free to write man pages to make yourself right. "Typically" means in the common case, and if we pick a case at random (oh, say, IBCS2?) and examine it, we find the documentation unwritten except as source code. > > Things like IBCS2 are binary: they either are or > > are not loaded. > > > > If you don't want to load it as a module (why not? It's an easy thing > > to do), then you can statically compile it. Look at /sys/i386/conf/LINT, > > at the bottom of the file: > > I can't see any reason not to load the module either. Memory. You should be asked on install. One problem is that the install configuration is not very reentrant. So fix it, you have the sources. Tell me, how is your hypothetical IBCS2 user, who will be using IBCS2 based apps, not system components like "vi" going to *load* his software without IBCS2 install tools? I know the answer to this one: they will do it by playing computer and running the install script by hand. Try Lotus 1-2-3 this way some day: I have. The software is incomplete. You are incorrectly equating the kernel components (which are to be optioned at install time, if done correctly) with a full IBCS2 environment. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 11:56:01 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA28014 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 11:56:01 -0800 Received: from brainaid.oche.de (brainaid.oche.de [193.174.14.162]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA27979 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 11:55:01 -0800 Received: by brainaid.oche.de (Smail3.1.29.1 #1) id m0tJn6D-000978C; Sun, 26 Nov 95 20:50 MET Message-Id: From: gvw@brainaid.oche.de (Guido von Walter) Subject: Re: 210R Install Feedback To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 20:50:52 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <12510.817401152@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 26, 95 07:52:32 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME5a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 897 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > fetching and installing applications is a great feature. But there is a > > major drawback: Dependencies are not handled by the tool. An example: > > Actually, they are, but only if you install something like ghostview > before ghostscript (then it'll yank in ghostscript - try it!). It Well, I did try it. Maybe ghostview wasn't a good example, it is in fact installed... But xv and imagemagick, for example aren't. Maybe the problem is not as simple as I thought. I'll test this again. > > > I would be quite happy with a summary of errors at the end of installation > > Select "no confirm" from the Options menu.. :-) My apologies. Didn't read enough... Guido `~^'-.,.-'^~`~^'-.,.-'^~`~^'-.,.-'^~`~^'-.,.-'^~`~^'-.,.-'^~` Guido von Walter mailto:gvw@brainaid.oche.de http://brainaid.oche.de/~gvw Press any key to continue, any other key to exit From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 13:16:38 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA02028 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 13:16:38 -0800 Received: from linux4nn.iaf.nl (root@linux4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA02022 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 13:16:16 -0800 Received: from uni4nn.iaf.nl (root@uni4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.33]) by linux4nn.iaf.nl (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id WAA02740 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 22:17:06 +0100 Received: by uni4nn.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA01252 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org); Sun, 26 Nov 1995 22:16:22 +0100 Received: by iafnl.es.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA10193 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4); Sun, 26 Nov 1995 19:18:19 +0100 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA00212 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 19:12:19 +0100 From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199511261812.TAA00212@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Translation Adaptec 1542 versus NCR810 To: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers list) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 19:12:18 +0100 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 545 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi there Quick question: is the translation mode used by a Adaptec 1542A (32 hd, 64 sect or the other way around (I always forget)) the same as the one used by a NCR810 ? No docs with the latter.. BTW all of this houses in an Asus P55TP4XE Wilko _ __________________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 13:17:08 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA02045 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 13:17:08 -0800 Received: from terra.Sarnoff.COM (terra.sarnoff.com [130.33.11.203]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA02023 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 13:16:23 -0800 Received: (from rminnich@localhost) by terra.Sarnoff.COM (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA02727; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 16:13:50 -0500 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 16:13:49 -0500 (EST) From: "Ron G. Minnich" To: Joe Diehl cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Intel EtherExpress PRO/100 In-Reply-To: <199511240653.AAA28015@gandalf.me.ksu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I just received a promotional thing in the mail from Intel > on their Etherexpress PRO/100 PCIs and am thinking about buying. I wouldn't recommend it, because intel wants you to sign a 5-year nda to use it. you can't distribute .c or .h files when you get done. They are most unhelpful when it comes to providing info. I had a simple driver working which never got to the point of sending a packet out, due to missing info/errors in the manuals (and probably lack of competence on my part :(). Just get the dec cards, which we have a driver for ... From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 13:31:19 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA02878 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 13:31:19 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA02865 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 13:30:54 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id WAA29584 ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 22:30:45 +0100 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id WAA06055 ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 22:30:44 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.7.1/keltia-uucp-2.6) id SAA11698; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 18:30:59 +0100 (MET) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199511261730.SAA11698@keltia.freenix.fr> Subject: Re: How can I remove hard links between directories? To: bob@luke.pmr.com (Bob Willcox) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 18:30:59 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511261359.HAA01124@luke.pmr.com> from "Bob Willcox" at Nov 26, 95 07:59:32 am X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1378 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8b] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk It seems that Bob Willcox said: > created some hard links between a couple of directories on my system > (2.1-STABLE) and I need to get rid of them. Unfortunately rmdir > simply complains that the directory is not empty (use counts on > these two directries is 4 rather than 2). Can someone please tell > me a way to fix this? Try to get a binary of fsdb from a -CURRENT system. You'll be able to do anything you want even trashing your disk completely :-) FSDB(8) UNIX System Manager's Manual FSDB(8) NAME fsdb - FFS debugging/editing tool SYNOPSIS fsdb [-d] -f fsname DESCRIPTION fsdb opens fsname (usually a raw disk partition) and runs a command loop allowing manipulation of the file system's inode data. You are prompted to enter a command with fsdb (inum X)> where X is the currently selected i-number. The initial selected inode is the root of the filesystem (i- number 2). The command processor uses the libedit(3) library, so you can use command line editing to reduce typing if desired. When you exit the command loop, the file system superblock is marked dirty and any buffered blocks are written to the file system. The -d option enables additional debugging output (which comes primarily from fsck(8)-derived code). COMMANDS Besides the built-in libedit(3) commands, fsdb supports these commands: [...] uplink Increment the active inode's link count. downlink Decrement the active inode's link count. linkcount number Set the active inode's link count to number. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #7: Mon Nov 6 21:08:06 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 13:20:20 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA02258 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 13:20:20 -0800 Received: from terra.Sarnoff.COM (terra.sarnoff.com [130.33.11.203]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA02115 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 13:19:58 -0800 Received: (from rminnich@localhost) by terra.Sarnoff.COM (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA02733; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 16:17:11 -0500 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 16:17:10 -0500 (EST) From: "Ron G. Minnich" To: David Greenman cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Intel EtherExpress PRO/100 In-Reply-To: <199511241816.KAA00169@corbin.Root.COM> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk yay david. You got much further than i ever did! nice work! I called lots of people last january trying to sell them on a freebsd driver but got nothing but stonewall. ron Ron Minnich |Like a knife through Daddy's heart: rminnich@sarnoff.com |"Don't make fun of Windows, daddy! It takes care (609)-734-3120 | of all my files and it's reliable and I like it". From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 14:15:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA06219 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:15:40 -0800 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA06212 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:15:36 -0800 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.50]) by Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id OAA08151; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:15:39 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with SMTP id OAA00156; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:15:19 -0800 Message-Id: <199511262215.OAA00156@corbin.Root.COM> To: "Ron G. Minnich" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Intel EtherExpress PRO/100 In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 26 Nov 95 16:17:10 EST." From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:15:19 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >yay david. You got much further than i ever did! nice work! I called lots >of people last january trying to sell them on a freebsd driver but got >nothing but stonewall. ...and I didn't even have to call them - they called me. :-) -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 14:23:25 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA06806 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:23:25 -0800 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA06787 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:23:16 -0800 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.50]) by Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id OAA08165; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:23:19 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with SMTP id OAA00172; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:22:58 -0800 Message-Id: <199511262222.OAA00172@corbin.Root.COM> To: "Ron G. Minnich" cc: Joe Diehl , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Intel EtherExpress PRO/100 In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 26 Nov 95 16:13:49 EST." From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:22:57 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> I just received a promotional thing in the mail from Intel >> on their Etherexpress PRO/100 PCIs and am thinking about buying. >I wouldn't recommend it, because intel wants you to sign a 5-year nda to >use it. you can't distribute .c or .h files when you get done. They are >most unhelpful when it comes to providing info. I had a simple driver working >which never got to the point of sending a packet out, due to missing >info/errors in the manuals (and probably lack of competence on my part :(). > >Just get the dec cards, which we have a driver for ... In case people missed my first followup, Intel is interested enough in having support in FreeBSD that they've waved the NDA requirement and given me all the materials to develop the driver. I have the code about 2/3rds finished...but don't ask me when it will be done. -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 14:46:25 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA08227 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:46:25 -0800 Received: from localhost.lightside.com (user42.lightside.com [198.81.209.42]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA08217 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:46:17 -0800 Received: (from jehamby@localhost) by localhost.lightside.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id OAA00218; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:48:15 -0800 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:47:50 -0800 (PST) From: Jake Hamby X-Sender: jehamby@localhost To: Terry Lambert cc: grog@lemis.de, terry@lambert.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: How long is long? In-Reply-To: <199511261922.MAA15217@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 26 Nov 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > > Let's clarify my perspective: > > If there is a type that is treated as atomic (ie: it may be used as > the underlying type for off_t according to ANSI and POSIX), then the > type promotion has to promote to the largest one allowable. The > target promoted type is, in fact, the stack alignment size. This > only makes sense, since the stack alignment size and single cycle > bus fetch and register sizes dictate the efficiency of the fetch > process. This is why Aztec on the Mac and Amiga 68k was correct > in setting sizeof(int) == 2 and Lattice (SAS) C was wrong in > setting sizeof(int) == 4. An "int" is supposed to be the "natural" > type for the machine and take a single bus cycle to load. I'd have to disagree with this particular statement. On the 680x0 series, it is correct to have sizeof(int) == 4, because these machines are fully 32-bit internally. Of course the 68000 and 68010 have a 16-bit data bus, but the 68020 and above have a 32-bit data bus. By saying that "int" should be the "natural" type for the machine, you are implying that, for example, "int" should be 16-bits on an 80386SX running FreeBSD (because it has a 16-bit bus) and 32-bits on 386DX and above!! Not that many people actually run FreeBSD on a 386SX :-) but you get the idea.. P.S. There is a compiler flag in SAS C on Amiga to set the default "int" size to 16 bits, if you so desire. How does that affect your philosophy? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Jake Hamby | E-Mail: jehamby@lightside.com Student, Cal Poly University, Pomona | System Administrator, JPL ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 14:57:17 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA08829 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:57:17 -0800 Received: from werple.net.au (0@werple.mira.net.au [203.9.190.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA08810 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:57:07 -0800 Received: from cimaxp1.UUCP (Ucimlogi@localhost) by werple.net.au (8.7/8.7.1) with UUCP id JAA15497 for hackers@FreeBSD.org; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:28:39 +1100 (EST) Message-Id: <199511262228.JAA15497@werple.net.au> X-Authentication-Warning: werple.net.au: Ucimlogi set sender to cimaxp1!jb using -f Received: by cimaxp1.cimlogic.com.au; (5.65/1.1.8.2/10Sep95-0953AM) id AA07469; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:31:58 +1100 From: John Birrell Subject: Where is the prototype for __syscall? To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:31:52 +1100 (EST) Cc: jb@cimlogic.com.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm trying to get a clean compile of libc with gcc -Wall and I can't find a function prototype for __syscall. Where should it be? -- John Birrell CIMlogic Pty Ltd jb@cimlogic.com.au 119 Cecil Street Ph +61 3 9690 9600 South Melbourne Vic 3205 Fax +61 3 9690 6650 Australia Mob +61 18 353 137 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 15:10:14 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA09795 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:10:14 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA09787 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:10:11 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id PAA19387; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:09:44 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511262309.PAA19387@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: Translation Adaptec 1542 versus NCR810 To: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl (Wilko Bulte) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:09:44 -0800 (PST) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511261812.TAA00212@yedi.iaf.nl> from "Wilko Bulte" at Nov 26, 95 07:12:18 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 669 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Hi there > > Quick question: is the translation mode used by a Adaptec 1542A (32 hd, 64 sect > or the other way around (I always forget)) the same as the one used by a > NCR810 ? it's 64 heads 32 sectors.. just remember that it's the most unlikely.... (64 heads?) :) > > No docs with the latter.. BTW all of this houses in an Asus P55TP4XE > > Wilko > _ __________________________________________________________________________ > | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl > |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 15:12:06 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA09946 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:12:06 -0800 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.Atinc.COM [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA09864 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:12:01 -0800 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id RAA28525; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:59:32 -0500 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:59:31 -0500 (EST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: Re: How long is long? To: Jake Hamby cc: Terry Lambert , grog@lemis.de, terry@lambert.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 26 Nov 1995, Jake Hamby wrote: > I'd have to disagree with this particular statement. On the 680x0 series, > it is correct to have sizeof(int) == 4, because these machines are fully > 32-bit internally. Of course the 68000 and 68010 have a 16-bit data bus, > but the 68020 and above have a 32-bit data bus. By saying that "int" > should be the "natural" type for the machine, you are implying that, for > example, "int" should be 16-bits on an 80386SX running FreeBSD (because it > has a 16-bit bus) and 32-bits on 386DX and above!! Not that many people > actually run FreeBSD on a 386SX :-) but you get the idea.. the SX are bastardization chips, plain and simple. an int should be 32 bits on any 80[345]86. even if intel did halve the number of data lines going off chip. (and yes i have run FreeBSD on a 386sx25, only it was call 386BSDplXX back then ;) Jonathan M. Bresler FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.ORG play go. ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life i am moving to a new job. PLEASE USE: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 15:18:03 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA10407 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:18:03 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA10399 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:17:58 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id PAA13400; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:13:18 -0800 To: Chris Shenton cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:57:00 EST." <199511261557.PAA10995@wirehead.hq.nasa.gov> Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:13:18 -0800 Message-ID: <13398.817427598@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > A Mac-friend and I just spend about 16 hours trying to install Caldera > (RH Linux, plus Visix desktop, plus Novell, plus ...). What a > nightmare. The usual Linux root+boot disk (plus two, for Caldera), but > I can live with that (tho I certainly prefer *one* disk with FreeBSD). It definitely makes it a lot less confusing to deal with. The emergence of the ATAPI floppy was something I felt less than happy about. Every time I've looked at distributions from Slackware to RH, I've always been struck with the thought: "which of these 97 different images am I supposed to friggin' *use*?!" It's a bad first impression to make on any user who'd rather remain unconcerned with such minutia. > A simple design goal: don't let the user get down the road fail > because of something that could have been determined earlier. I agree. In fact, I'm coming around to a very different way of thinking about how "media devices" are chosen. It should be something that you can specify as a "chain", so that there are successive types of fallback. This would help make for a successful CD/FTP installation combo with full DES in the non-U.S. scenario (something I've always wanted to have work). > I'd suggest aggressive probing, then confirmation with the user, with > an "out" if the user doesn't know. Failing good information on HW > config, default to something most likely to work (eg: VGA X11, rather > than nothing; WD8003, if that's the most prevalent ether clone, etc). Anyone keen to reactivate the subject of a 2-stage boot? I also feel that I and whomever else does sysinstall/setup the next time around will only be able to do so much, then it's going to come down to how much BIOS information we can squirrel away. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 15:25:26 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA10878 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:25:26 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA10871 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:25:21 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id PAA13441; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:20:47 -0800 To: Scott Mace cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: interesting tidbit from 2.1.0-RELEASE make world In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:23:27 CST." <199511261623.KAA08479@metal.ops.neosoft.com> Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:20:47 -0800 Message-ID: <13439.817428047@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Actually, a *lot* of stuff will fall over if you try to link -static. I noticed this recently in the ports collection (trying to build stand-alone versions of some ports) and was not pleased at what it implied, namely that we've lost the ability to transition from -static to dynamic without stuff falling over. I would expect something that used dl*() calls to die when linked static, but that's about it! Jordan > crash # make > ===> lp > ===> lpc > ===> lpd > cc -O -m486 -pipe -I/usr/src/usr.sbin/lpr/lpd/../common_source -static -o lpd lpd.o printjob.o recvjob.o displayq.o rmjob.o startdaemon.o lpdchar.o commo n.o > displayq.o: Definition of symbol `_warn' (multiply defined) > /usr/lib/libc.a(err.o): Definition of symbol `_warn' (multiply defined) > *** Error code 1 > > Stop. > *** Error code 1 > > Stop. > > Just for grins I set usr.sbin to link statically... :-) > > Scott From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 15:35:58 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA11761 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:35:58 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA11741 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:35:52 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA17633; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 16:32:02 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511262332.QAA17633@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: How long is long? To: jehamby@lightside.com (Jake Hamby) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 16:32:02 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, grog@lemis.de, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Jake Hamby" at Nov 26, 95 02:47:50 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2987 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > If there is a type that is treated as atomic (ie: it may be used as > > the underlying type for off_t according to ANSI and POSIX), then the > > type promotion has to promote to the largest one allowable. The > > target promoted type is, in fact, the stack alignment size. This > > only makes sense, since the stack alignment size and single cycle > > bus fetch and register sizes dictate the efficiency of the fetch > > process. This is why Aztec on the Mac and Amiga 68k was correct > > in setting sizeof(int) == 2 and Lattice (SAS) C was wrong in > > setting sizeof(int) == 4. An "int" is supposed to be the "natural" > > type for the machine and take a single bus cycle to load. > > I'd have to disagree with this particular statement. On the 680x0 series, > it is correct to have sizeof(int) == 4, because these machines are fully > 32-bit internally. Of course the 68000 and 68010 have a 16-bit data bus, > but the 68020 and above have a 32-bit data bus. By saying that "int" > should be the "natural" type for the machine, you are implying that, for > example, "int" should be 16-bits on an 80386SX running FreeBSD (because it > has a 16-bit bus) and 32-bits on 386DX and above!! Not that many people > actually run FreeBSD on a 386SX :-) but you get the idea.. > > P.S. There is a compiler flag in SAS C on Amiga to set the default "int" > size to 16 bits, if you so desire. How does that affect your philosophy? There's a flag on Aztec to set it to 32. But it wasn't the default. Aztec code ran faster because it took a single bus cycle to fetch an Aztec int, but two to fetch a Lattice (SAS) int. Faster is better. <-- AXIOM It boils down to if you think the registers dictate sizeof(int) or the bus width dictates it. Personally I think it should be dictated by min(sizeof(REG),sizeof(BUS)) so that it is *always* a single cycle fetch. Hardware engineers (who are the fiends who cause such problems for programmers in the first place) would probably disagree. The 32 bit int became a defacto standard on the Amiga because of the code base and the pushing from Commodore itself. BTW: I agree with your examples, although I wouldn't have said '"int" should be 16-bits on an 80386SX', I would have said 'Intel should never have produces a 386SX, the PC manufactures should have had to update their 286 board designs instead of adapting them'. The natural consequence of this is that "int" is 32 bits and 80386SX purchasers suffer for their bad taste. Of course, that doesn't mean that I don't believe that FreeBSD shouldn't be compilable/runnable with 16 bit ints. It should. Peter rightly points out that portable code that requires sized types should use typedef'ed sizes. I disagree with taking that all the way to a "short short" to fix the 16/32 bit orphaning in a 64 bit long, 64 bit int environment. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 15:37:36 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA12058 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:37:36 -0800 Received: from multivac.orthanc.com (root@multivac.orthanc.com [204.244.20.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA12041 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:37:26 -0800 Received: from localhost (lyndon@localhost) by multivac.orthanc.com (8.7/8.7) with SMTP id PAA13606; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:37:11 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199511262337.PAA13606@multivac.orthanc.com> X-Authentication-Warning: multivac.orthanc.com: Host lyndon@localhost didn't use HELO protocol From: Lyndon Nerenberg (VE7TCP) To: peter@taronga.com (Peter da Silva) cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: More nits In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 25 Nov 1995 19:27:50 CST." <199511260127.TAA28662@bonkers.taronga.com> Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:37:10 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Peter" == Peter da Silva writes: Peter> a "gnu bonus pack" with all the "standard" gnu tools would Peter> be good. How do you handle namespace collisions? I would agree with this iff the utilities were installed somewhere outside of the standard PATH (i.e. in /usr/gnu/bin). Peter> a "tcl/tk bonus pack" is of course required, tcl, tk, Peter> tcldp, expect, ... TCL and TK are useful enough that they should be part of the base distribution (as is perl). Peter> a "gnu developer" pack, with gmake and so on... Well, just about everything developer related already *is* GNU. Make is one of the few that isn't there by default. I'm not a big fan of GNU make (the 4.4BSD make is much more elegant) and would prefer not to encourage its use. Peter> a "gnu X" pack, ghostview, ghostscript, ... This should probably be a generic "Postscript" package. Peter> a "mh" pack, with mh, vmail, xmh, ... As long as xmh will be ignored properly on systems that don't have X installed. My biggest complaint with the ports stuff right now is the way it scribbles all over /usr/local. Even worse, it isn't consistent (e.g. binaries installed in /usr/bin and support stuff under /usr/local/lib). /usr/local should be HANDS OFF to the vendor-supplied software, something I consider "ports" to be. The ports software should be configured to install into either the standard directory tree, or into a seperate /usr/ports hierarchy. --lyndon From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 15:49:04 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA13789 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:49:04 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA13782 ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:48:57 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id PAA19462; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:48:20 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511262348.PAA19462@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: FreeBSD WWW survey To: jfieber@indiana.edu (John Fieber) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:48:20 -0800 (PST) Cc: questions@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "John Fieber" at Nov 25, 95 03:41:08 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 3756 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Greetings! > > In an ongoing effort to improve the usefulness of the FreeBSD WWW > pages, I am conducting a survey. If you have used the FreeBSD > WWW pages, a few moments of your time to answer the questions > below will be greatly appreciated. If you have not visited the > FreeBSD WWW pages, you may visit http://www.freebsd.org/ for a > quick tour and then answer the survey questions. > > There are two types of questions: > > A. Multiple choice - either place a mark by the appropriate > answer, or delete the inappropriate answers. > > B. Short answer - just type in your response below the > question. > > Please address all responses to jfieber@freebsd.org or > jfieber@indiana.edu. No mail headers from your answer will be kept with > the survey data. (or kept at all for that matter...) > > Thank you for your time, > > John Fieber > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > > A. Familiarity: > > 1. How would you rate your familiarity with Unix? > > A. Never heard of it > B. Know what it is > C. A new user > D. A casual user > E. Experienced > F. System Administrator > G. Kernel hacker G > > 2. How would you rate your experience with the Web? > > A. Never heard of it > B. Know what it is > C. A new user > D. A casual user > E. Experienced > F. Webmaster D > > 3. How would you rate your experience with Internet? > > A. Never heard of it > B. Know what it is > C. A new user > D. A casual user > E. Experienced > F. Service Provider D > 4. How did you learn about FreeBSD? from 386BSD from CGD at the UCB BSD 4.4 course > > > 5. How did you find the FreeBSD homepage? saw it being committed > > > 6. Do you think FreeBSD is adequately publicized? > no > > > B. Useability/Ease of use: > > 1. Do you find this "homepage" easy to use? > > A. Excellent > B. Good B > C. Satisfactory > D. Difficult > > 2. Do you find the organization of this page easy to grasp? > > A. Excellent > B. Good B > C. Satisfactory > D. Difficult > > 3. Are you able navigate through the pages easily? > > A. Yes > B. No > C. Yes except... (comment) ok and getting better > > 4. What is your opinion of the efficiency of the organization of > this data? could be better but I can't quite say how.. > > > 5. If you were explaining this Web site to a new user, how would > you: > > A. warn them tell then it's all there, but that they may have to search to find what they want... (also that it's still being written) > B. reassure them > > 6. Do you feel like this is wasteful of your time or an efficient > use of time? what the questionare? web site is useful needs MAN-PAGES for -current and latest release.. also links to entire CURRENT source tree. so people can see if a particular bug has been fixed, etc... > > > 7. Was it as difficult as you would expect, considering your > experience level? > ok > > > C. Satisfaction > > 1. Do you feel that you've learned enough about FreeBSD from this > Web site? > > > 2. For which level of users is this Web site most appropriate? > > A. A new user > B. A casual user > C. Experienced > D. System Administrator > E. Kernel hacker > > 3. If you were to change these Web pages, where would you > start? > > > 5. Do you feel encouraged to contribute to these Web pages and the > FreeBSD project? > > > 6. Do you have any other comments? > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 16:10:34 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA15360 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 16:10:34 -0800 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (root@UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id QAA15349 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 16:10:23 -0800 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA15466 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:52:27 -0600 Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA27087; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:51:08 -0600 From: peter@taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Message-Id: <199511262351.RAA27087@bonkers.taronga.com> Subject: Re: More nits To: lyndon@orthanc.com (Lyndon Nerenberg) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:51:07 -0600 (CST) Cc: peter@taronga.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511262337.PAA13606@multivac.orthanc.com> from "Lyndon Nerenberg" at Nov 26, 95 03:37:10 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1278 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Peter> a "gnu bonus pack" with all the "standard" gnu tools would > Peter> be good. > How do you handle namespace collisions? I would agree with this > iff the utilities were installed somewhere outside of the standard > PATH (i.e. in /usr/gnu/bin). If they're installed from packages they'd be in /usr/local/bin. I personally like having a /usr/gnu/bin myself. > Peter> a "tcl/tk bonus pack" is of course required, tcl, tk, > Peter> tcldp, expect, ... > TCL and TK are useful enough that they should be part of the base > distribution (as is perl). Been there, done that, they decided that they didn't want it. Got a bmaked tcl rotting on freefall. > My biggest complaint with the ports stuff right now is the way it > scribbles all over /usr/local. Even worse, it isn't consistent (e.g. > binaries installed in /usr/bin and support stuff under /usr/local/lib). > /usr/local should be HANDS OFF to the vendor-supplied software, something > I consider "ports" to be. Ah, but the "vendor" doesn't. > The ports software should be configured to install into either the > standard directory tree, or into a seperate /usr/ports hierarchy. I'd buy that. I like organizing things that way myself. But it's certainly not what I'd call a super-high priority. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 16:12:56 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA15582 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 16:12:56 -0800 Received: from python.bostic.com (python.BSDI.COM [205.230.230.130]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA15577 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 16:12:42 -0800 Received: by python.bostic.com (8.6.9.Beta4/2.6) id SAA05797; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 18:30:18 -0500 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 18:30:18 -0500 From: bostic@bsdi.com (Keith Bostic) Message-Id: <199511262330.SAA05797@python.bostic.com> To: /tmp/vilist@python.bostic.com Subject: Nex/Nvi version 1.56 now available for anonymous ftp. Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Alpha version 1.56 of nex/nvi is now available for anonymous ftp from ftp.cs.berkeley.edu:ucb/4bsd/nvi.ALPHA.1.56.tar.gz. The code changes in version 1.56 are extensive, although the base nvi functionality has changed only in minor ways. This version includes the long-threatened reorganization to support new screen types, including X11 screens. The screen code is now completely isolated, and is about 2000 lines of C for the curses screen. There are a few new features: + File name completion is now available on the colon command line. Setting the editor option "filec", and then entering will complete the current pathname and/or display possible pathname completions. + The secure edit option disallows access to other applications from within vi. While this greatly enhances security, it also means that file name expansion (e.g., ":edit $variable"), will no longer work. + Timeouts for the key are now separately configurable, using the "escapetime" edit option. + There's a new directory, "tk". The tk directory contains support to use Tk text widget as the vi screen, instead of using the curses terminal interface. This still needs a lot of work, but the basic vi functionality is in place. This work is based on work by Wolfgang Fischer (Wolfgang.Fischer@stm.mchp.sni.de), in particular the Tk screen to change options is almost entirely his work. If you'd like to try it, do "make tknvi" in the PORT directory. I don't suggest it for real use, for two reasons. First, it's only lightly tested, and second, it appears that the Tk text widget is too slow to be used in this fashion. I'm trying to find someone to help me turn this into a true Tk text widget instead of driving the standard Tk text widget -- if you could help me with this, please let me know! + There's a new directory, "tclapi". The tclapi directory contains preliminary support, written by George Neville-Neal (gnn@abekas.com), to support a Tcl interpreter inside nvi. See below for more information on the Tcl interpreter. Some of the more recent new features of which you may not be aware: + The :split command has been replaced with capital letter forms of the :next, :edit, :ex, :visual, :tag and :previous commands, e.g. ":Next *.c" splits the screen and edits the new file list in a new screen. + Single line screens are now supported. + Ex now runs in tty canonical mode. + All ex commands are now supported in the EXINIT variable or in the .exrc files. + There's a new edit option "wraplen", which offsets from the left margin, instead of the right, as done by "wrapmargin". + Two new edit options, "print" and "noprint", allow you to specify if specific character values are printable. + Nvi now has message catalogs for Dutch, German, Swedish and Russian. The German and Russian are a bit out of date at the moment, hopefully they'll be fixed soon. Some configuration changes: + The PORT directory has been completely reworked so that the modifications necessary for each individual port are as small as possible. In particular, the local "Makefile" is now named "M.local", and all of the local Makefile changes should go there. + Nvi has been converted to use the System V interface to curses instead of the 4BSD one. Ports to systems with BSD curses implementations must compile with BSD_CURSES_INTERFACE defined (see the M.local file in your PORT directory for more information.) Nvi 1.56 always uses the native curses implementation, and this distribution of nvi does not include an implementation of curses. A change log (in docs/changelog) is included in the distribution if you'd like to review other changes which have been made. I intend to begin making more frequent releases of nvi again. Most of my vi time over the past six months has gone into working on the POSIX 1003.2 ex/vi standard. As that is mostly done, I'm going to try to finish up the last major ex/vi conformance issues, open mode and the lisp edit option. I also want to replace 1.34 as the "stable" version as soon as possible. Once a new version is known to be reasonably stable and portable, I will replace 1.34 with it. As always, thank you for running nvi, and please let me know if you have any problems! Keith Bostic bostic@cs.berkeley.edu uunet!bostic =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= If you'd like to take the Tcl interpreter out for a spin: + Modify your PORT//M.local file (the M.local file has the information as to what should be changed). + Rebuild nvi from scratch. This adds the ex :tcl command, which has the usage: :[line [,line]] tcl [command] For example, the command: :tcl source ../../tclapi/wc.tcl loads the file wc.tcl, which defines the Tcl proc wc, which counts the words in a set of lines. Then: :tcl wc will display the number of words in the entire file, and :3,5 tcl wc will display the number of words in lines 3, 4 and 5. See the file nvi/tclapi/tcl_tcl.c for a list of the vi interfaces currently available for Tcl. Once George Neville-Neal and I have finalized how this is all going to fit together, we'll be writing up something more informative/official. For now, if you want to do something and it's not obvious how, ping one of us. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 16:59:12 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA17892 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 16:59:12 -0800 Received: from localhost.lightside.com (user58.lightside.com [198.81.209.58]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA17884 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 16:58:59 -0800 Received: (from jehamby@localhost) by localhost.lightside.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id RAA00448; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:01:03 -0800 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:00:38 -0800 (PST) From: Jake Hamby X-Sender: jehamby@localhost To: Terry Lambert cc: terry@lambert.org, grog@lemis.de, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: How long is long? In-Reply-To: <199511262332.QAA17633@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 26 Nov 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > There's a flag on Aztec to set it to 32. But it wasn't the default. > > Aztec code ran faster because it took a single bus cycle to fetch an > Aztec int, but two to fetch a Lattice (SAS) int. > > Faster is better. <-- AXIOM > > It boils down to if you think the registers dictate sizeof(int) or the > bus width dictates it. > > Personally I think it should be dictated by min(sizeof(REG),sizeof(BUS)) > so that it is *always* a single cycle fetch. Hardware engineers (who > are the fiends who cause such problems for programmers in the first > place) would probably disagree. > > The 32 bit int became a defacto standard on the Amiga because of the > code base and the pushing from Commodore itself. Hmmm, I think I agree with you here. It's just that I've become so used to the Windoze brainwashing of "Our program is better because it's '32-bit'"! Of course, there they are confusing the fact that the speed increase is not from 32-bit integer size, but from getting rid of DOS brain-damage and segmented memory (and using 32-bit registers instead of 16-bit for "long" manipulation). In general, then, I suppose 16-bit code would be faster than 32-bit code if the bus width was 16 bits... > BTW: I agree with your examples, although I wouldn't have said '"int" > should be 16-bits on an 80386SX', I would have said 'Intel should never > have produces a 386SX, the PC manufactures should have had to update > their 286 board designs instead of adapting them'. > > The natural consequence of this is that "int" is 32 bits and 80386SX > purchasers suffer for their bad taste. Yup. I almost forgot to mention that Motorola also made the "68008" which was a 68000 with an 8-bit data bus, so people could adapt their 8 bit designs to the 68000-series! Explain that bit of brain damage! :-) > Of course, that doesn't mean that I don't believe that FreeBSD shouldn't > be compilable/runnable with 16 bit ints. It should. I suppose.. It's just that too many people make bad assumptions about the size of 'int' in their code. Did you ever notice all the compiler warnings when compiling X11R6 about "casting pointer to integer", "casting integer to pointer", etc? Scary... ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Jake Hamby | E-Mail: jehamby@lightside.com Student, Cal Poly University, Pomona | System Administrator, JPL ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 17:23:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA18734 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:23:40 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA18729 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:23:38 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id RAA19621; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:23:00 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511270123.RAA19621@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: How long is long? To: jehamby@lightside.com (Jake Hamby) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:22:59 -0800 (PST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, grog@lemis.de, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Jake Hamby" at Nov 26, 95 05:00:38 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 802 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Yup. I almost forgot to mention that Motorola also made the "68008" > which was a 68000 with an 8-bit data bus, so people could adapt their 8 > bit designs to the 68000-series! Explain that bit of brain damage! :-) > We use dthe 68008 because it was easier to program the 68000 family than the 8 bit processors.. the speed of the processor or whether the device was 10% slower here or there didn't matter... having a single ram and rom chip(each) rather than two of each for the board, simplified the board layout considerably.. and yet we got to use the real nice (more-or-less) orthogonal 68000 intruction set rather than the 6800 or z80 set.. it wasn't to allow people to adapt their existing designs.. the timing was sufficiently differnt but it was GREAT for small embedded apps.. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 17:30:37 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA18975 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:30:37 -0800 Received: from crh.cl.msu.edu (crh.cl.msu.edu [35.8.1.24]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA18970 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:30:33 -0800 Received: (from henrich@localhost) by crh.cl.msu.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) id UAA01244 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 20:30:25 -0500 From: Charles Henrich Message-Id: <199511270130.UAA01244@crh.cl.msu.edu> Subject: Security bug? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 20:30:19 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 3685 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I am attempting to track down this bug, and Its driving me crazy. I have modified the NCSA web server to change its uid to whomever is authenticating to it. If the person authenticating is root, I force a change ownership to a different uid via setuid() seteuid() setgid() and setegid() calls. The problem, is after all the set[ug]* calls, I am still able to execute programs that I shouldnt even be able to read! The players: >From /etc/group adminweb:*:50: admin:*:200:Rcrh >From /etc/passwd Rcrh:*:0:0:Charles Henrich (root):/root:/usr/local/bin/tcsh adminweb:*:50:50:Admin Web:/usr/local/adminweb:/usr/local/bin/tcsh The test code: -rwxr-x--- 1 root admin 8808 Nov 26 20:00 test The web fallback code looks like (this is executing all the way through, user_id and group_id are both 50). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- log_error("Im still root, changing to user/group in cfg file\n"); if (setgid(group_id) == -1) die(CONF_ERROR,"unable to change gid", stdout); if (setegid(group_id) == -1) die(CONF_ERROR,"unable to change egid", stdout); if (setuid(user_id) == -1) die(CONF_ERROR,"unable to change uid", stdout); if (seteuid(user_id) == -1) die(CONF_ERROR,"unable to change euid", stdout); ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The test program does nothing more than two printf() calls, one a web header, the other the uid:euid gid:egid pairs. The results look like so: ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Content-type: text/html 50:50 50:50 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I also had placed some printf() calls before the execle() call in the web server, and it too reported the current gid,egid,uid,euid were all set to 50. Given this, how was the exec ablt to run the test code that is only executable by root or folks in the admin group, which the adminweb ID clearly isnt? The web server code is as follows: >From http_include.c: ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- int p[2],x; FILE *f; char errstr[MAX_STRING_LEN]; if(pipe(p) == -1) die(SERVER_ERROR,"httpd: could not create IPC pipe",out); if((ipid = fork()) == -1) die(SERVER_ERROR,"httpd: could not fork new process",out); if(!ipid) { char *argv0; ------- [SNIP] ------- (Some environment setup code) close(p[0]); if(p[1] != STDOUT_FILENO) { dup2(p[1],STDOUT_FILENO); close(p[1]); } error_log2stderr(); if(!(argv0 = strrchr(SHELL_PATH,'/'))) argv0=SHELL_PATH; ---> At this point we are at 50:50 50:50 if(execle(SHELL_PATH,argv0,"-c",s,(char *)0,in_headers_env) == -1) { fprintf(stderr,"httpd: exec of %s failed, errno is %d\n", SHELL_PATH,errno); exit(1); } } close(p[1]); if(!(f=fdopen(p[0],"r"))) { waitpid(ipid,NULL,0); return -1; } send_fd(f,out,kill_include_child); fclose(f); waitpid(ipid,NULL,0); return 0; } ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I should also note that the process starts off initially with the uid:euid gid:egid combo of 0:0 50:0 (possibly 0:50, I cant recall at the moment). In any case, if any of you have made it this far, any ideas? -Crh Charles Henrich Michigan State University henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu http://rs560.msu.edu/~henrich/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 17:30:43 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA18989 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:30:43 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA18966 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:30:20 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id BAA02417; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:22:47 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511270122.BAA02417@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Help! I got a bad block.... To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:22:46 +0000 () Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, terry@lambert.org, hasty@rah.star-gate.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199511241815.LAA09932@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Nov 24, 95 11:15:13 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2277 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert stands accused of saying: > > > > If the replacement sectors are otherwise exposed as usable data sectors, > > > turning it on would be Bad(tm) if you have already stored data on the > > > drive. > > > > I don't _think_ anyone would be that stupid. > > I see you've never owned a WD1007 ESDI controller. 8-). Yes, actually. I stopped using them and went with the Adaptec 232x controllers after I got sick of the wdformat program. > I don't buy the "on a bad day argument". I can't see how a good sector > could be incorrectly marked bad, unless you have the driver cooperate in > the marking and blow the driver programming. If the drive has forwarding enabled, and for one reason or another (thermal, LF vibrations, wrong phase of the moon) has problems writing a sector, it'll forward it, and you'll lose the original. > I believe you can clear the sectors that have been remapped in any case > by issuing SCSI commands. If nothing else, you can re low-level format > the drive. As previously observed, some drives let you do this, some don't. > I think that the device ought to have an "implied" media perfection > layer that causes the remapping to be turned on by default when FreeBSD > is installed. Hell, I think it ought to be turned on when Win95 is > installed (it isn't, in case you were wondering). Forwarding doesn't do all the job, as far as media perfection is concerned - once you run out of spare sectors, you're screwed. I've met a few drives that appear to have lost their marbles when they ran out, and others that just start to report errors, despite the fact that forwarding is enabled. Unless you can positively identify the drive, determine the number of _free_ spare sectors, and make a judgement call on how many you're likely to use in a given uptime period, you still need a higher layer to catch the failure case. > Terry Lambert -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 17:55:52 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA19907 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:55:52 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA19900 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:55:45 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id BAA02573; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:48:25 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511270148.BAA02573@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:48:25 +0000 () Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <16288.817330725@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 25, 95 12:18:45 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 3908 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Jordan K. Hubbard stands accused of saying: > I have to say that some of the debate that just went on in ports > concerning the new install structure should probably have waited until > all the principals had done some more checking into existing > technologies. :-) There is a wealth of valuable examples to study in > RHL, both good and bad. If I had a spare machine to do it on, I would have 8) > I don't think I like their RPMS very much, but many of the ideas > behind them are good. I especially liked their X based package > browser - though the interface was seriously clunky and needed a > face-lift, it could at least be said to be working NOW. I give them > full marks for having done a lot more of the ground work than we have. I had a good look at the code inside it, and tried to bring it up under FreeBSD. Needless to say, it's _very_ dependant on their peculiar (read obscene) directory structure, and breaks dismally if anything is awry. > Nonetheless, I was favorably impressed by the sheer depth of their > coverage and I was asked enough questions to bring me all the way up > into X on the first try, the installer even giving me the chance to ID > everything from my board's clock chip to the monitor specs. Yup, this > is how to do it! Hmm. Two days ago you were saying "it can't be done!" (or for the australians here, "we'll all be rooned!"), wrt. leap to X. Has this changed your mind? (I'm being optomistic here 8) > Can we re-open the traditional (heh heh) dialog on this topic? > piece out from under the GPL. We might want to also go for a more > forms based approach to Marc's objects since having to do the object > traversal yourself in the application gets tedious - it would be better > to allow a forms shell to handle the traversal along pre-configured > paths, calling any callback functions registered to various objects > along the way. Do we want the forms shell to go so far as to do traversal, or to just run a given form? (I see traversal as being a bit tougher, and I'm not sure what we gain from it, other than yet another interpretive language 8( ) > Then we should add back all the primitive objects necessary to > re-implement menus, gauges, text boxes and whatever else we're using > from libdialog. We can have some *real* radio button menus that call > individual callbacks when you toggle the items - whoopie! :) Ah drat. I was looking to the forms interpreter as a seperate shell on the end of a pipe, reading forms and returning the result. We can still do callbacks like this, it's just a little more work. (note, with care, we can have forms interpreters that will run the same form under almost any interface, size permitting) > 2. I think we need to sit down and devise a list of tcl commands, > in their own little library and name space, for doing all the sorts > of things that one might want to do to files on the system in the > process of "installing packages." Maybe we'll find that existing > TCL or TCLX primitives require just a few more additions to make > for a completely robust package building environment, I dunno. > We'll just have to look and see. Ok, I'm sold on TCL. I know it's not perfect, but it's a _common_ language, so the available programmer-base is much larger. Can we win the war to get tcl into the base distribution? 8) This "devision" should go well with John's recent post wrt. the 16-step plan to a tighter installation. > Comments? Yay! > Jordan -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 17:58:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA20059 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:58:40 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA20046 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 17:58:22 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id BAA02603; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:50:52 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511270150.BAA02603@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: 16 ports Boca - anyone using it? To: hsu@clinet.fi (Heikki Suonsivu) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:50:51 +0000 () Cc: rich@spirit.com.au, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511252241.AAA09651@katiska.clinet.fi> from "Heikki Suonsivu" at Nov 26, 95 00:41:51 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1366 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Heikki Suonsivu stands accused of saying: > > > My first card had bad probe problems, with the odd 1 or more ports > simply not probing-on-boot.. Actually, this has stabilised greatly since I > re-org'd the "guts" of that Server ;) > > We see lots of this after panics (usually a reboot cures it), on several > machines. I tried adding multiple sio lines in kernel config and it > helps considerably. If the first probe does not see, often next or third > one sees, but it still misses some ports sometimes (I have tried up to 8 > probes). Check what the state of DCD on the ports is when your probes fail. I've seen probes on multiport cards reliably fail when DCD is set. (I never checked the probe code to see whether it was barfing on strangeness in the LSR) > it (NE2000 clones explain a lot of things :-). We had a local politician attempting to blame ozone depletion on NE2000's. (just kidding 8) > Heikki Suonsivu, T{ysikuu 10 C 83/02210 Espoo/FINLAND, -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 18:13:42 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA20710 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 18:13:42 -0800 Received: from skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (skynet.ctr.columbia.edu [128.59.64.70]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA20702 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 18:13:29 -0800 Received: (from wpaul@localhost) by skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id VAA23308; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 21:13:26 -0500 From: A boy and his worm gear Message-Id: <199511270213.VAA23308@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> Subject: Re: How can I remove hard links between directories? To: bob@luke.pmr.com (Bob Willcox) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 21:13:25 -0500 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511261359.HAA01124@luke.pmr.com> from "Bob Willcox" at Nov 26, 95 07:59:32 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1624 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Of all the gin joints in all the world, Bob Willcox had to walk into mine and say: > > Help! An apparently buggy version of afio that I was running has > created some hard links between a couple of directories on my system > (2.1-STABLE) and I need to get rid of them. Unfortunately rmdir > simply complains that the directory is not empty (use counts on > these two directries is 4 rather than 2). Can someone please tell > me a way to fix this? > > Thanks, > -- > Bob Willcox > bob@luke.pmr.com (or obiwan%bob@uunet.uu.net) > Austin, TX I can think of one admittedly ugly way to fix this: use clri to zap the inode associated with this troublesome directory, then run fsck to pick up the pieces afterwards. You should probably use ls -i to find the right inode number, then unmount the filesystem and use clri to blow the offending inode away. Then you can use fsck to fix the resulting mess and remount the filesystem. Make sure you get the right inode number or you'll make a bigger mess then you'll fix. :) -Bill -- ============================================================================= -Bill Paul (212) 854-6020 | System Manager Work: wpaul@ctr.columbia.edu | Center for Telecommunications Research Home: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu | Columbia University, New York City ============================================================================= License error: The license for this .sig file has expired. You must obtain a new license key before any more witty phrases will appear in this space. ============================================================================= From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 18:39:41 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA21684 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 18:39:41 -0800 Received: from hauki.clinet.fi (root@hauki.clinet.fi [194.100.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA21679 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 18:39:38 -0800 Received: from katiska.clinet.fi (root@katiska.clinet.fi [194.100.0.4]) by hauki.clinet.fi (8.6.12/8.6.4) with ESMTP id EAA17857; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 04:39:08 +0200 Received: (hsu@localhost) by katiska.clinet.fi (8.6.12/8.6.4) id EAA24909; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 04:39:16 +0200 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 04:39:16 +0200 Message-Id: <199511270239.EAA24909@katiska.clinet.fi> From: Heikki Suonsivu To: Michael Smith Cc: hsu@clinet.fi (Heikki Suonsivu), rich@spirit.com.au, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: 16 ports Boca - anyone using it? In-Reply-To: <199511270150.BAA02603@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> References: <199511252241.AAA09651@katiska.clinet.fi> <199511270150.BAA02603@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Organization: Clinet Ltd, Espoo, Finland Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Michael Smith writes: > > My first card had bad probe problems, with the odd 1 or more ports > > simply not probing-on-boot.. Actually, this has stabilised greatly since I ... > > We see lots of this after panics (usually a reboot cures it), on several > > machines. I tried adding multiple sio lines in kernel config and it ... > Check what the state of DCD on the ports is when your probes fail. I've > seen probes on multiport cards reliably fail when DCD is set. (I never > checked the probe code to see whether it was barfing on strangeness in > the LSR) Usually the ports which fail have DCD set, I haven't verified it but they probably are as they are either leased lines, or in some cases modems which were connected when crash happens. -- Heikki Suonsivu, T{ysikuu 10 C 83/02210 Espoo/FINLAND, hsu@clinet.fi work +358-0-4375209 fax -4555276 home -8031121 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 19:22:12 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA23481 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 19:22:12 -0800 Received: from hq.icb.chel.su (icb-rich-gw.icb.chel.su [193.125.10.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA23474 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 19:21:58 -0800 Received: from localhost (babkin@localhost) by hq.icb.chel.su (8.6.5/8.6.5) id IAA27832; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 08:19:25 +0500 From: "Serge A. Babkin" Message-Id: <199511270319.IAA27832@hq.icb.chel.su> Subject: Re: Ethernet cards for FreeBsd To: gibbs@freefall.freebsd.org (Justin T. Gibbs) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 08:19:25 +0500 (GMT+0500) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, andyh@compnews.co.uk, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511241811.KAA10768@freefall.freebsd.org> from "Justin T. Gibbs" at Nov 24, 95 10:11:33 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 628 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > >> 2.1 (and -current) still do not contain the multicast support, Plug-n-Play > >> support and the common probing scheme for all 3COM cards support although > >> the patches for them exist. > > > >I also detect a faint implicit "grrrrr!" buried in this paragraph. :-) Nope. :-) I understand that you need some testing time. I just said about its current state. But it was an implicit way to know more about its current state. :-) > > > >What's the deal with these patches and us? > > I have them, and will be testing/committing them this coming week along > with some eisaconf changes for the driver. Thank you! -SB From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 19:51:45 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA24889 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 19:51:45 -0800 Received: from anacreon.sol.net (anacreon.sol.net [206.55.64.116]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA24884 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 19:51:41 -0800 Received: from solaria.sol.net (solaria.sol.net [206.55.65.75]) by anacreon.sol.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id VAA02822; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 21:51:23 -0600 Received: from localhost by solaria.sol.net (8.5/8.5) id VAA21120; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 21:52:12 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199511270352.VAA21120@solaria.sol.net> Subject: Re: Argh, lost console :-( To: dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (David Dawes) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 95 21:52:09 CST Cc: maral@webnet.com.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511260530.QAA12774@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> from "David Dawes" at Nov 26, 95 04:30:56 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL65] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1026 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I always start it from /etc/rc.local (and haven't had any problems > as a consequence). I have the following in /etc/rc.local: > > if [ -f /usr/X11R6/bin/xdm -a -f /usr/local/etc/xdm/xdm-config ]; then > echo -n ' xdm' > # Delay to allow the fontserver to come up > (sleep 5; /usr/X11R6/bin/xdm -config /usr/local/etc/xdm/xdm-config)& > fi Same here.... so this was an unexpected treat :-) > Perhaps running 'kbd_mode -u' will put it into the correct mode for X, > and 'kbd_mode -a' for text mode? I've never needed to use this though. And here I thought that was a Sun-ism! Okay, I will try that next time I get a chance. But it seems to be something deeper in syscons and/or my hardware setup, because the keyboard actually stops responding until poked and prodded to death... ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 19:53:52 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA25086 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 19:53:52 -0800 Received: from anacreon.sol.net (anacreon.sol.net [206.55.64.116]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA25081 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 19:53:48 -0800 Received: from solaria.sol.net (solaria.sol.net [206.55.65.75]) by anacreon.sol.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id VAA02826; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 21:53:45 -0600 Received: from localhost by solaria.sol.net (8.5/8.5) id VAA21150; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 21:54:40 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199511270354.VAA21150@solaria.sol.net> Subject: Re: Argh, lost console :-( To: maral@webnet.com.au (Peter Marelas) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 95 21:54:38 CST Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Peter Marelas" at Nov 25, 95 05:06:10 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL65] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text Content-Length: 721 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > The README in XF86312 says to start xdm from a tty in /etc/ttys > > The easiest way to automatically start the display manager on boot is > to add a line in /etc/ttys to start it on one of the unoccupied > virtual terminals: Yeah, yeah, we know :-) and that might be a cure for the symptom. However, it would be nice to have a cure for the problem.... I have seen consoles get into interesting states every once in a while, and it is really NOT ideal to have to reboot the machine to clear it up. ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 20:09:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id UAA26231 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 20:09:40 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA26223 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 20:09:35 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id UAA19883; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 20:09:08 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511270409.UAA19883@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 20:09:08 -0800 (PST) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511270148.BAA02573@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Nov 27, 95 01:48:25 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1365 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > Hmm. Two days ago you were saying "it can't be done!" (or for the > australians here, "we'll all be rooned!"), wrt. leap to X. Has this > changed your mind? (I'm being optomistic here 8) ok Hanrahan, don't get too excited.. > > > Can we re-open the traditional (heh heh) dialog on this topic? there was movement at the station for the word had got around..... > > > > 2. I think we need to sit down and devise a list of tcl commands, I think that an install disk with a single executable linked with tclX, should be able to do all the installation :) have builtin tcl scripts for all the usual commands.. (add tk when a server is found :) > > in their own little library and name space, for doing all the sorts > > of things that one might want to do to files on the system in the > > process of "installing packages." Maybe we'll find that existing > > TCL or TCLX primitives require just a few more additions to make > > for a completely robust package building environment, I dunno. > > We'll just have to look and see. > > Ok, I'm sold on TCL. I know it's not perfect, but it's a _common_ language, > so the available programmer-base is much larger. Can we win the war to get > tcl into the base distribution? 8) This "devision" should go well with > John's recent post wrt. the 16-step plan to a tighter installation. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 21:11:38 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA02367 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 21:11:38 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA02328 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 21:11:29 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id FAA03576; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 05:04:32 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511270504.FAA03576@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 05:04:32 +0000 () Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511270409.UAA19883@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Nov 26, 95 08:09:08 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1184 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Julian Elischer stands accused of saying: > > > Can we re-open the traditional (heh heh) dialog on this topic? > there was movement at the station for the word had got around..... Old Regret? Now that's just too prophetic 8) > > > 2. I think we need to sit down and devise a list of tcl commands, > I think that an install disk with a single executable > linked with tclX, should be able to do all the installation :) I think that Jordan's looking at a bigger picture here; particularly with reference to the "toolchest" concept. > have builtin tcl scripts for all the usual commands.. > (add tk when a server is found :) Or, more accurately, start with formint_tty or formint_ncurses, and then swap to formint_tk if/when X is started. (Am I beginning to sound like a scratchy record? sorry 8( ) -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 21:42:50 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA04667 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 21:42:50 -0800 Received: from pod.spirit.com.au (root@pod.spirit.com.au [203.8.218.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA04661 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 21:42:30 -0800 Received: by pod.spirit.com.au (8.6.12/1.01SP) id QAA16483; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:41:22 +1100 From: rich@spirit.com.au (Rich Siggs) Message-Id: <199511270541.QAA16483@pod.spirit.com.au> Subject: Re: 16 ports Boca - anyone using it? To: hsu@clinet.fi (Heikki Suonsivu) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:41:20 +1100 (EST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511270239.EAA24909@katiska.clinet.fi> from "Heikki Suonsivu" at Nov 27, 95 04:39:16 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1792 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hello Heikki, Michael & the 'Hacking Hordes', ;) > Michael Smith writes: .. I wrote: > > > My first card had bad probe problems, with the odd 1 or more ports > > > simply not probing-on-boot.. Actually, this has stabilised greatly since I > ... > > > We see lots of this after panics (usually a reboot cures it), on several > > > machines. I tried adding multiple sio lines in kernel config and it Yup -- I've got all the sio's configured too.. > ... > > Check what the state of DCD on the ports is when your probes fail. I've > > seen probes on multiport cards reliably fail when DCD is set. (I never > > checked the probe code to see whether it was barfing on strangeness in > > the LSR) > Usually the ports which fail have DCD set, I haven't verified it but they > probably are as they are either leased lines, or in some cases modems which > were connected when crash happens. I've done testing of this port-no-probe behaviour on both my AST/4 cards & the BOCA. Both of them have the _potential_ to fail a port's probe if DCD is set, but not all DCD-active ports fail a crash-reboot probe.. However, a port that has DCD _&_ either TX or RX at the crash is bound to fail the probe (ain't 100%, but certainly 75% probable ;) *Hmm* Could this be related to the 16550A's, or (as suggested) some code in the boot probe? > -- > Heikki Suonsivu, T{ysikuu 10 C 83/02210 Espoo/FINLAND, > hsu@clinet.fi work +358-0-4375209 fax -4555276 home -8031121 Rich. -- Richard Siggs admin@spirit.com.au Spirit Networks Pty Ltd http://www.spirit.net.au P.O. Box 486 +61 6 281 3552 Curtin. ACT. Australia 2605 +61 15 486 708 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 22:02:07 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id WAA05228 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 22:02:07 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA05223 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 22:02:04 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id FAA03687; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 05:54:48 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511270554.FAA03687@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: 16 ports Boca - anyone using it? To: rich@spirit.com.au (Rich Siggs) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 05:54:47 +0000 () Cc: hsu@clinet.fi, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511270541.QAA16483@pod.spirit.com.au> from "Rich Siggs" at Nov 27, 95 04:41:20 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1489 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Rich Siggs stands accused of saying: > > Usually the ports which fail have DCD set, I haven't verified it but they > > probably are as they are either leased lines, or in some cases modems which > > were connected when crash happens. > I've done testing of this port-no-probe behaviour on both my > AST/4 cards & the BOCA. Both of them have the _potential_ to fail a > port's probe if DCD is set, but not all DCD-active ports fail a > crash-reboot probe.. However, a port that has DCD _&_ either TX or > RX at the crash is bound to fail the probe (ain't 100%, but > certainly 75% probable ;) *Hmm* It's hard for a port to TX during probe 8) Can you enable the verbose probe error reporting (flags & 0x80) and let us know which test(s) fail? > Could this be related to the 16550A's, or (as suggested) some code in the > boot probe? It's possible that received data during a probe could cause the probe to fail. Some tests are done with loopback enabled, it's possible that a bad (or nonexistent) loopback implementation may also cause a probe to fail in strange circumstances. > Rich. More input! -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Nov 26 22:26:03 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id WAA06089 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 22:26:03 -0800 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA06084 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 22:25:59 -0800 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id AAA10644; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 00:23:17 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199511270623.AAA10644@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: 16 ports Boca - anyone using it? To: rich@spirit.com.au (Rich Siggs) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 00:23:17 -0600 (CST) Cc: hsu@clinet.fi, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511270541.QAA16483@pod.spirit.com.au> from "Rich Siggs" at Nov 27, 95 04:41:20 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > I've done testing of this port-no-probe behaviour on both my AST/4 > cards & the BOCA. Both of them have the _potential_ to fail a port's probe if > DCD is set, but not all DCD-active ports fail a crash-reboot probe.. > However, a port that has DCD _&_ either TX or RX at the crash is bound to fail > the probe (ain't 100%, but certainly 75% probable ;) *Hmm* > > Could this be related to the 16550A's, or (as suggested) some code in the > boot probe? Hmmmm... that could be what I saw the other day :-) As a related topic: I've been having very occasional problems with a BB2016 (very occasional ~== every week or two). All the ports just "up and die". They come back after a reboot. Having caught an incident in progress, I did some "debugging" and ran cu on a port. I typed "AT" and saw my echo, but no response from the modem - until I hit another key. Hmmm, having some familiarity with that particular symptom from past lives, I poke around further, run systat and notice that there are ZERO interrupts coming in from the board. (explanation: the only way that input arrives is when it checks as the output is sent). Um. "Fascinating", I say. I didn't have any diagnostic tools handy so I rebooted the box and wrote a little program that would page me if the board died again. The next day I went and hooked up my trusty logic probe, and the wait began. :-) A week later (last nite, actually!), I got a page, and fortunately somebody was at the office to observe the logic probe. The interrupt line is being held ACTIVE....???!!! (solid red on the probe, normally green). Do any sio-shared-interrupt-geniuses have any ideas? I can picture all sorts of plausible race conditions and I have no idea what the code is doing. My next "well lets try this" idea is to try opening and read/writing all the ports the next time my BB2016 gets in this state, to see if that un-wedges the interrupt. Haven't written the code to do this yet, however... Comments, etc.,? ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 00:36:29 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA14300 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 00:36:29 -0800 Received: from ra.dkuug.dk (ra.dkuug.dk [193.88.44.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA14295 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 00:36:23 -0800 Received: (from sos@localhost) by ra.dkuug.dk (8.6.12/8.6.12) id JAA16295; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:33:46 +0100 Message-Id: <199511270833.JAA16295@ra.dkuug.dk> Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:33:46 +0100 (MET) Cc: cshenton@apollo.hq.nasa.gov, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <13398.817427598@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 26, 95 03:13:18 pm From: sos@FreeBSD.org Reply-to: sos@FreeBSD.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1801 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Jordan K. Hubbard who wrote: [much deleted] Earth calling hackers, hackers come in..... It might be "fancy looking" to have an install process running in X, BUT, gentlemen, keep in mind all the hassle we had when we said that 4M wasn't enough to boot the install disk !! My experience here tells me that the first thing many new users are going to do, is trying to install on the old 386 box over in the corner, and if we won't run resonably on that, forget it.... Also all the more "proffessional" users that uses FreeBSD on servers, gateways etc typically has an old (if existent) video system, so they would be shouting at us too... I've had a little pet project for some time now that would allow us to run a graphical program on videohardware ranging from old CGA to modern VGA (admitted no graphics on a true monochrome card, only on hercules), that has most of the controls etc that Visual Basic (I know BWADR!) has, but with an interface to "pure" C code instead. As Poul-Henning suggested I could even use VB as the design tool (not a bad idea at all). This VB thing might actually be THE point, as I miss the easy design that VB allows, I've seen no tool for X (for a "human" amount of money that is) that gives that kind of freedom. Lets face it, we will only get graphical utils if they are easy to generate. So when will Wine run VB ? :) :) I'm working on this for something entirely different, but I think it would do fine here, as well as for all those "sysadm" utils we can imagine to do. Much of the system can still be changed, so I'm open to suggestions.. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team So much code to hack -- so little time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 00:38:29 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA14505 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 00:38:29 -0800 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA14497 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 00:38:26 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id QAA00537; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 16:37:28 -0800 Message-Id: <199511270037.QAA00537@rah.star-gate.com> X-Authentication-Warning: rah.star-gate.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: Julian Elischer cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith), jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 26 Nov 1995 20:09:08 PST." <199511270409.UAA19883@ref.tfs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 16:37:28 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Gosh, we are moving forward 8) BTW: exmh has a cool installation procedure someone can take a look. Yes, I know that it is probably not a one to one match to an OS installation however the overall general procedure is cool. Amancio >>> Julian Elischer said: > > > > Hmm. Two days ago you were saying "it can't be done!" (or for the > > australians here, "we'll all be rooned!"), wrt. leap to X. Has this > > changed your mind? (I'm being optomistic here 8) > ok Hanrahan, don't get too excited.. > > > > > Can we re-open the traditional (heh heh) dialog on this topic? > there was movement at the station for the word had got around..... > > > > > > > 2. I think we need to sit down and devise a list of tcl commands, > I think that an install disk with a single executable > linked with tclX, should be able to do all the installation :) > > have builtin tcl scripts for all the usual commands.. > (add tk when a server is found :) > > > > > in their own little library and name space, for doing all the sorts > > > of things that one might want to do to files on the system in the > > > process of "installing packages." Maybe we'll find that existing > > > TCL or TCLX primitives require just a few more additions to make > > > for a completely robust package building environment, I dunno. > > > We'll just have to look and see. > > > > Ok, I'm sold on TCL. I know it's not perfect, but it's a _common_ languag e, > > so the available programmer-base is much larger. Can we win the war to ge t > > tcl into the base distribution? 8) This "devision" should go well with > > John's recent post wrt. the 16-step plan to a tighter installation. > > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 00:38:42 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA14572 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 00:38:42 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA14480 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 00:38:07 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id JAA07365; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:36:06 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id JAA03695; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:36:22 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id JAA03924; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:22:06 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511270822.JAA03924@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: How can I remove hard links between directories? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:22:05 +0100 (MET) Cc: bob@luke.pmr.com Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511270213.VAA23308@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> from "A boy and his worm gear" at Nov 26, 95 09:13:25 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 3870 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As A boy and his worm gear wrote: > > > Help! An apparently buggy version of afio that I was running has > > created some hard links between a couple of directories on my system David? Didn't we nuke the ability to hard-link directories some day in 1.1.5.1? Should we nuke this again? > > (2.1-STABLE) and I need to get rid of them. Unfortunately rmdir > > simply complains that the directory is not empty (use counts on > > these two directries is 4 rather than 2). Can someone please tell > > me a way to fix this? > I can think of one admittedly ugly way to fix this: use clri to zap > the inode associated with this troublesome directory, then run fsck > to pick up the pieces afterwards. It's rather ugly. Better, use this: #include #include int main(int argc, char **argv) { int status = 0; if(argc < 2) { fprintf(stderr, "usage: unlink name [...]\n"); return 1; } while( ++argv, --argc) { if(unlink(*argv) == -1) { perror("unlink()"); status++; } } return status? 1: 0; } This used to be availabe as /etc/unlink in ancient systems. In case you've botched your system to a degree where you cannot run your C compiler, here's a binary for it: begin 755 unlink.gz M'XL("(9TN3```W5N;&EN:P#M5GUL$V48?Z_MH(RQ+RP,6.1`5!9Q8R88G!D. M9D64P=:NJ#%XE/6V]NS:IKT;^,'L1TU-T!A#C$3\3Q/_,''$10N;@DK\ M0&(,SF1!C(>Z>DVX!_=-_[DG>>][GZ_<^[_-^W0FVMX^5,V8T MHJ:"OG?+^@V;O8*_?;VO/=`J;-[:O'ZS]ZJ9!=(_J>==V_P9Q95YS)79YE9[ M74PNSFH.]:AK(*?\<=?\74[UZ%3:,[&,,?5N)B_3G&\>XAGK6\MD3[9O;9TR M)W,_EYZ'NB90*N>/>:<8")IW:B`G%^GG8)@P#SGIWY0!Q`C`RF7A.T$A,7W0 M4+D/(GJK7YO5JO<604]_%?19H#HEE:R+1G:*N\6.NFBH-A5GS7$E&HK=*O/Q MA!CC66TQNR\8B2I)D4^*P5`DUL4;?L5L0S#$=P>[(AT-EJ8Y&(O%95`F3`V_ M4A9WRS77,H2"]9=:1%J*^BX%?21&73,.Y8'*GL_,(1!C,FK#^,D/\!/_^0) M^,HK9R(O/,Q;+N-SLX=Q8QJ"OTUB1M(.J4@+Y'Q0GH]!K?N=6)Q1=60%%J=: MJ@K76OFLM?*I,_,I>]\[U&CD4=-H#+Y\YN`5TQ0GF")H+;F"_)NNFW7FI:60 MZ?C-V>F4>2D/.W&\M$!>"G,_PR[F\_6?CJ^#F9@9W9+^VLSIIIG0E>H1?GR> M%?\"%B3]17T^?2G]9YN/:E(I.;7`""SJJ!-*8Q:FP8&3_J$=%N27'$%^PM'" MZ\8)-@Y].@`G^N*QX5I,P%I\6E`?_P=CN&2- M8\:LX*1I3G48"@J/C3*A;9^:M@#HKWG.8L!D7EE*RJ_A'.9X&^0X8P"COH.(J)0=*\(.SE(? ML%85'APVG[%5/<"ATJMZ@2\"OA`OP5X*7`7P<^#_AYWGBB]W'& MDC#FAK806@6-"X\>@VR8DV3LXS,.F,;;XJ"86=#F$@8C6PGI2JD_CYJ%74:V MQ=2O).P;J#^?FH=T"ZB_B/I5E"NC/B/;$L)DU+?(R(V_FE\1)+_:8\HXWFPH MP@C95Y`]0?;;H7$@/T?V-62_2/9U)./Z(;51K4;)?P?)9TF.6_'D_RR-?XCL M+Y+=^F?:3^/O(_L!D@^0_!;)^TE^A_#>(_G#@CJX<9[,7-OGJ$"?4WYXL2*= M(KPHQ8^2_3+9?R2[3/9SE&\[S><"R6]0?7YG9OU/D?\5BG^:Y`K.Q)\B_`6< M&=]*"RP(]SZR97W+IF8FA*+X@P4:<7=$%D)*=_<30DCLB**E(QI/B4SH$F4Q MUH,*,9F,)\%7",6%KFA\9S`JA.1X,H6J>]NW^H3-F_SM@H!B\W3Q:D"'%9!( MQKOP:F(I.9B4F9`@],Y$,A*3.YE@WE734TN*G1B;NH\)(O[5`8OU1))QF$%0 M1C]0)).Q.!-,H3L8B6'FJ2>Z086_>Q!N#*@DA)0H1^,=0;AV`26$N(8[_/7" M.A[A\#PZC'IU,)MLLLFF_X?PGZ"<9VPE_]^^"7J#=H!O"%H"[OQWH67I4<=W MHQ4>=!Y_4N`];$(E^&7/3<+O#W#]$O%?@'/`SP!W`#\-W`G\)'`7\,^`%P$_ H"GP6^VY&;B,S9)MLLLDFFVRRR2:;;++))IMLLNG?Z6_T.MT"`"```,^` ` end -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 00:58:30 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA15459 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 00:58:30 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id AAA15454 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 00:58:25 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Mon, 27 Nov 95 08:58 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id JAA04164; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:55:23 +0100 Message-Id: <199511270855.JAA04164@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:55:23 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) In-Reply-To: <199511261948.MAA15284@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Nov 26, 95 12:48:38 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 7905 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert writes: > >>>> What is the name of the man page for ibcs2? >>> >>> There isn't one. There doesn't need to be one. >> >> I strongly disagree. BSDI has found the need to write two separate >> man pages (ibcs2(5) and sco(1)), and the information contained there >> is very useful. At the very least, you need to tell people how to >> enable it (yes, I did know about the entry in /etc/sysconfig; that's >> where I came in), and how to run a COFF executable, even if it's >> trivial. > > BSDI needs one because they have to enable it explicitly. Wrong. That's the case for FreeBSD, as you say: > FreeBSD can set the value in the /etc/sysconfig to "YES" at install > time because FreeBSD supports LKMs. >>> I think I need to >>> rephrase my answer: >>> >>> You use "modload", whose man page is "modload(8)" to load it. You >>> don't have any other options regarding IBCS2: you only have the option >>> of loading it or not loading it. >> >> Options aren't the only think to document. How about limitations and >> bugs? > > What are the limitations and bugs in FreeBSD itself? Not very documented, > and more important that similar documents for IBCS2. Well, people are addressing this problem, and not just claiming "There isn't one. There doesn't need to be one." >> How do I know how to enable the emulation? > > At install time, when it asks you about it. I didn't want it then. I want it now. How do I know how to enable the emulation? >> How do I run the program? Just start it by name? > > Yes. Aha. Where can I read that? >> Do I need to say "ibcs2 vi", or will it be enough just to write "vi"? > > Do I need to type "run foo" or just "foo"? I don't know. What's foo? >> I tried vi with the SCO version and got: >> >> === root@freebie (/dev/ttyp0) /allegro/usr/sco/usr/bin 16 -> ./vi >> Abort trap > > It apparently won't run. Why not? >> === root@freebie (/dev/ttyp0) /allegro/usr/sco/usr/bin 17 -> ibcs2 vi >> modload: error initializing module: File exists > > You are now typing things at random. People tend to do that if they can't find the documentation. > A bad idea for root (you must have > been root to get that particular error message). Give me a better suggestion. >> Well, it appears that I need to run it as "ibcs2 vi". But what's this >> modload problem? I have enabled Or have I done it wrong after all? > > Tell me: what must you do to enamle running of FreeBSD binaries? You > must install. Must I? I thought it was sufficient to copy the data. If I run them across the net, I don't even need to do that? > What must you do to run FreeBSD binaries? You type their name. The > questions are divisible. What makes you believe (incorrectly) that > you would need to type "ibcs2 " to run a binary? The fact that the first attempt failed. This wasn't a belief, it was a desperate hope. >> I'm an experienced computer person, and quite honestly the lack of >> documentation (coupled, admittedly, with a lack of interest in SCO >> software) is enough that I'm prepared to give up. Who is going to use >> this stuff if they run into trouble and can't even be certain they've >> started it properly. How does it work? > > I agree that there is a lot of missing "theory of operation" documentation > for lots of the kernel. Execution classes are one such beastie. The > VM is another. > > But if you expect Joe Schmoe to be able to make it work without asking > questions on -questions at this point if Joe Schmoe didn't have things > handled for him in the install, then you are barking up the wrong tree. Assuming that this abort trap is not typical, yes, I do expect Joe Schmoe to be able to make it work without asking questions on -questions at this point. Joe and his brother Bill are working for one of my customers, who are doing just this with a System V application running on BSD/OS in Munich. It would be nice if they could use them on FreeBSD as well. They have FreeBSD, but for various minor, silly reasons they don't use it. > Perhaps the right tree is http://www.freebsd.org. It should be the FM. Anyway, I've looked through the handbook. I can't find anything there, either. > Or the source code, > which is provided free of charge. I looked there too. The program is called /usr/bin/ibcs2, but there's no source directory /usr/src/usr.sbin/ibcs2. There's a directory /usr/src/sys/i386/ibcs2, but it doesn't have a Makefile. There's a directory /usr/src/lkm/ibcs2, but the program there does nothing more than load an lkm. Anyway, what do you think Joe would say? > Or the installation software that > should have created the missing devices for you. No it shouldn't. I didn't want one then. But that's interesting--this is the first I have heard of missing devices. Maybe that's why it doesn't work. Where's this documented? > Or the fact that to > use an SCO shared binary, you must first own a copy of SCO to get the > shared libraries. And you must know enough about how SCO uses shared > libraries to get them moved over. And you must know general theory of > operation of execution classes. Indeed. Where's the man page? > And let me tell you, a simple (or even a complex) man page will sure > as hell not cover it, especially without doing what Linux did and > supplying our own IBCS2 shared libraries, etc. Why not? Because of a dislike of man pages on the part of the person who should be writing them? > So who will use it? People who have this information already, people > willing to dig it out of the sources, or people willing to ask questions > of people who already know these things. > >> How do I go about finding out what's wrong here? > > Ask. RTFM. >>> Typically, you don't document things that don't have parameters, options, >>> or other controls. >> >> Speak for yourself. From my point of view, this is completely wrong. > > Are we talking "typically" (like I thought) or "ideally"? If "typically", > then feel free to write man pages to make yourself right. "Typically" > means in the common case, and if we pick a case at random (oh, say, IBCS2?) > and examine it, we find the documentation unwritten except as source code. As I said, speak for yourself. If I release software, I document it. >>> Things like IBCS2 are binary: they either are or >>> are not loaded. >>> >>> If you don't want to load it as a module (why not? It's an easy thing >>> to do), then you can statically compile it. Look at /sys/i386/conf/LINT, >>> at the bottom of the file: >> >> I can't see any reason not to load the module either. > > Memory. You should be asked on install. One problem is that the install > configuration is not very reentrant. So fix it, you have the sources. First I need to know what the problem is. If I run into problems, the first thing I do is read the man page. That's what I've been trying to do, but I've come across this claim "There isn't one. There doesn't need to be one." > Tell me, how is your hypothetical IBCS2 user, who will be using IBCS2 based > apps, not system components like "vi" going to *load* his software without > IBCS2 install tools? I know the answer to this one: they will do it by > playing computer and running the install script by hand. Try Lotus 1-2-3 > this way some day: I have. I don't know. I don't have the documentation. But I would guess that he will run his install tools in the same environment that he would use to run them. > The software is incomplete. You are incorrectly equating the kernel > components (which are to be optioned at install time, if done correctly) > with a full IBCS2 environment. Now here's the first statement with which I can agree. Fine, except that I didn't know that (it didn't say that in the man page). Still, a minimum of documentation would help even at this stage. So, what remains to be done? Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 01:32:31 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA17296 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:32:31 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA17291 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:32:29 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id BAA20456 for hackers@freeBSD.org; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:32:13 -0800 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:32:13 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511270932.BAA20456@ref.tfs.com> To: hackers@freeBSD.org Subject: Wine and FreeBSD Sender: owner-hackers@freeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Doesn anyone have it going? I've bennplaying with it.. there are several things that I "Don't Get".. has anyone seen teh following work? type wine 'C:\WINDOWS\PBRUSH.EXE' notice that you get a very nice and colourful paintbrush window.. it paints great.. BUT you can'r access any files.... any attempt to access a file leaves the little hourglass on the screen From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 01:33:46 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA17351 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:33:46 -0800 Received: from schizo.cdsnet.net (schizo.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.32]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA17345 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:33:44 -0800 Received: (from mrcpu@localhost) by schizo.cdsnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.9) id BAA05580; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:33:42 -0800 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:33:42 -0800 (PST) From: Jaye Mathisen To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Why doesn't wc -c < /dev/mem work? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I realize the info can be gotten by sysctl, but as I recall, the above is a time-honored technique for sizing RAM... Frankly, I don't really care if it works, I'm just curious as to why it seems to have an infinite source of data. Or maybe /dev/mem doesn't mean what it used to... From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 01:47:19 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA17973 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:47:19 -0800 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA17966 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:47:15 -0800 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.50]) by Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id BAA08856; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:45:53 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with SMTP id BAA00128; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:45:52 -0800 Message-Id: <199511270945.BAA00128@corbin.Root.COM> To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers), bob@luke.pmr.com Subject: Re: How can I remove hard links between directories? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 95 09:22:05 +0100." <199511270822.JAA03924@uriah.heep.sax.de> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:45:51 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >As A boy and his worm gear wrote: >> >> > Help! An apparently buggy version of afio that I was running has >> > created some hard links between a couple of directories on my system > >David? Didn't we nuke the ability to hard-link directories some day >in 1.1.5.1? Should we nuke this again? I endured a significant amount of pain from all of the criticism of that change. While I think it's bogus to allow hard directory links in FFS, some other people disagree. ...but I think the other people are wrong, so yes, I think we should "nuke" them again. :-) -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 02:23:33 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id CAA19946 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 02:23:33 -0800 Received: from ra.dkuug.dk (ra.dkuug.dk [193.88.44.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA19940 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 02:23:28 -0800 Received: (from sos@localhost) by ra.dkuug.dk (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA16400; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:21:00 +0100 Message-Id: <199511271021.LAA16400@ra.dkuug.dk> Subject: Re: Wine and FreeBSD To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:21:00 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511270932.BAA20456@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Nov 27, 95 01:32:13 am From: sos@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-to: sos@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1117 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk In reply to Julian Elischer who wrote: > > > Doesn anyone have it going? Depends on what you mean by going :) :) > > I've bennplaying with it.. > there are several things that I "Don't Get".. > > has anyone seen teh following work? > > type > wine 'C:\WINDOWS\PBRUSH.EXE' > notice that you get a very nice and colourful paintbrush window.. > it paints great.. > > BUT > > you can'r access any files.... > any attempt to access a file leaves the little hourglass on the screen Erhm, I think the only prg that run semi reliable is solitare :( I have tried other bits and pieces, but most of the time I get semilar results like you do, or cascades of some "unknown" API function called :( But who's to bother, the old 16bit winapi is dying, and is dying real fast, now it's win32 that counts (and it is smaller and easier to emulate), so Wine has sort of "outlived" itself even before it got born :) -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team So much code to hack -- so little time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 02:45:32 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id CAA21298 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 02:45:32 -0800 Received: from iis (iis.webnet.com.au [203.8.105.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA21291 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 02:45:27 -0800 Received: from jazzy.phase-one.com.au (gw.phase-one.com.au [203.21.35.254]) by iis (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA18721 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:49:36 +1100 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:46:56 +1100 (EST) From: Peter Marelas X-Sender: maral@jazzy.phase-one.com.au To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Documentation.. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Due to all the argueing about the lack of documentation, why dont we all stop bitching, and do ourselves a favour by writing docs, on what we have experience in, when using freebsd, lets get the handbook growing. Where do we put docs in for review by others? Come on guys, attention to detail. Peter PS: Im writing one on PPP Servers, using pppd, as I feel the current docs in the handbook are inadequate. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 02:49:49 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id CAA21513 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 02:49:49 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA21508 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 02:49:44 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id KAA04477; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:41:39 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511271041.KAA04477@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? To: grog@lemis.de Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:41:38 +0000 () Cc: terry@lambert.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511270855.JAA04164@allegro.lemis.de> from "Greg Lehey" at Nov 27, 95 09:55:23 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 4313 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Greg Lehey stands accused of saying: > >> How do I know how to enable the emulation? > > > > At install time, when it asks you about it. > > I didn't want it then. I want it now. How do I know how to enable > the emulation? Well. Let's establish some grounds for this bickering. Are you a competent user, with an ability to learn for yourself, and perhaps a little background with Unix? If No, then exit here, go to your nearest Klone retailer with your computer, and get them to install W95 on it. And go away. If Yes, then open your mind, and try putting a constructive lean on your criticism. > >> How do I run the program? Just start it by name? > > > > Yes. > > Aha. Where can I read that? "which ibcs2" is something that immediately comes to mind. For those that have spent a little time with the system, "locate ibcs2" tells you a lot more. > >> Do I need to say "ibcs2 vi", or will it be enough just to write "vi"? > > > > Do I need to type "run foo" or just "foo"? > > I don't know. What's foo? In context, an executable. Being childish doesn't help - see "No" above. > >> I tried vi with the SCO version and got: > >> > >> === root@freebie (/dev/ttyp0) /allegro/usr/sco/usr/bin 16 -> ./vi > >> Abort trap > > > > It apparently won't run. > > Why not? Because "abort trap". Followed by mail to hackers@freebsd.org with some salient details (which SCO vi, etc etc), and possibly a response with some helpful advice. Or at least an improvement in your understanding of the problem. I'd guess, in context, that it's looking for shared libraries, and not having much luck. What does "file vi" have to say? > > You are now typing things at random. > > People tend to do that if they can't find the documentation. This is akin to "people eat things at random because they don't know what they are". Go to "No" above, and make an appointment with your local casualty ward. > /usr/src/sys/i386/ibcs2, but it doesn't have a Makefile. There's a > directory /usr/src/lkm/ibcs2, but the program there does nothing more > than load an lkm. Anyway, what do you think Joe would say? He would say "what's the number for tech support"? And any one of us that have iBCS2 stuff working would have an answer for him im minutes. > > And let me tell you, a simple (or even a complex) man page will sure > > as hell not cover it, especially without doing what Linux did and > > supplying our own IBCS2 shared libraries, etc. > > Why not? Because of a dislike of man pages on the part of the person > who should be writing them? How about "what do you expect for what you paid for it"? or "do you want to be a part of the solution, or an unrelated problem"? > As I said, speak for yourself. If I release software, I document it. That's nice. Writing manual pages for an experimental moving target comes under the heading of "makework", as far as I can see. > Now here's the first statement with which I can agree. Fine, except > that I didn't know that (it didn't say that in the man page). Still, > a minimum of documentation would help even at this stage. So, what > remains to be done? 8) I think that counts as a "Yes". First thing to do is to talk to Steven Wallace, current keeper of the iBCS2 code, about his current stage of development. Then, I'd hit the mailing list archives for -hackers and -current (at least) and pull out everything relevant to iBCS2, and see whether there's enough material for a FAQ addition, so that people who're in your situation can get past the initial stumbling blocks. Then, if you're in the enviable position of having access to useful SCO binaries, installing and testing them, and possibly commenting on the installation process would be handy, and muchly appreciated. Steven is swallace@freebsd.org. The code in -current is _significantly_ better than the code in -stable, but obviously still not there. I can _almost_ run dBase 8( > Greg -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 03:01:09 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA22313 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 03:01:09 -0800 Received: from haywire.DIALix.COM (news@haywire.DIALix.COM [192.203.228.65]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA22302 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 03:01:00 -0800 Received: (from news@localhost) by haywire.DIALix.COM (sendmail) id TAA12916 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:00:34 +0800 (WST) Received: from GATEWAY by haywire.DIALix.COM with netnews for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (problems to: usenet@haywire.dialix.com) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: 27 Nov 1995 19:00:24 +0800 From: peter@haywire.dialix.com (Peter Wemm) Message-ID: <49c5o8$cjc$1@haywire.DIALix.COM> Organization: DIALix Services, Perth, Australia. References: <199511270822.JAA03924@uriah.heep.sax.de>, <199511270945.BAA00128@corbin.Root.COM> Subject: Re: How can I remove hard links between directories? Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk davidg@Root.COM (David Greenman) writes: >>As A boy and his worm gear wrote: >>> >>> > Help! An apparently buggy version of afio that I was running has >>> > created some hard links between a couple of directories on my system >> >>David? Didn't we nuke the ability to hard-link directories some day >>in 1.1.5.1? Should we nuke this again? > I endured a significant amount of pain from all of the criticism of that >change. While I think it's bogus to allow hard directory links in FFS, some >other people disagree. ...but I think the other people are wrong, so yes, I >think we should "nuke" them again. :-) I personally think we should "nuke" all directory link/unlink ability and rename of "." or ".." ability within the kernel. Otherwise, we get bogons like netscape2 doing 'rename(".netscape/", ".netscape.bak");' or something bogus like that, and the namei() lookup is or was converting ".netscape/" to mean ".netscape/." and was pulling "." out of the .netscape directory in root's home (assuming somebody was insane enough to run netscape as root.. :-) or some bogon inside "rdistd" running as root, renaming the "." files if you gave it a bogus distfile.. or things like inn's fastrm program that have to test if the euid == 0, and if so, it has to stat() every single file it's processing to make sure it's not about to unlink a directory and running much slower from the extra overhead.. (side note, always expire news as uid "news" for this very reason). It's traditional unix behavior to support the old setuid mkdir executables doing a mknod to create a directory "node" and all the link/unlinks, and to support emulated rename() in really old binaries... ugh... We dont have binary compatability that far back to try and support... (thank god!) -Peter >-DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 03:13:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA23300 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 03:13:40 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA23290 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 03:13:36 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id DAA20707; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 03:13:19 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511271113.DAA20707@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: Wine and FreeBSD To: sos@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 03:13:19 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511271021.LAA16400@ra.dkuug.dk> from "sos@FreeBSD.ORG" at Nov 27, 95 11:21:00 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 370 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > > But who's to bother, the old 16bit winapi is dying, and is dying > real fast, now it's win32 that counts (and it is smaller and > easier to emulate), so Wine has sort of "outlived" itself even > before it got born :) they have a lot of new Win32 stuff being put into Wine now.. (It seems to have got a new burst of energy..) it's pretty dammed close! julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 03:14:57 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA23371 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 03:14:57 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA23366 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 03:14:51 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id LAA04542; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:08:21 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511271108.LAA04542@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. To: sos@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:08:20 +0000 () Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, cshenton@apollo.hq.nasa.gov, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511270833.JAA16295@ra.dkuug.dk> from "sos@FreeBSD.ORG" at Nov 27, 95 09:33:46 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1755 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk sos@FreeBSD.ORG stands accused of saying: > It might be "fancy looking" to have an install process running in X, > BUT, gentlemen, keep in mind all the hassle we had when we said > that 4M wasn't enough to boot the install disk !! Nobody's suggesting an X-only install. The talk has been around the _desirability_ of tools that would allow utilities such as the installer (and maybe other things) to use an X display, if it's available. This leads, obviously, to mutterings about what _could_ be achieved with an X-aware installer. > My experience here tells me that the first thing many new users are > going to do, is trying to install on the old 386 box over in the > corner, and if we won't run resonably on that, forget it.... Experience here tells me that people who still have 'the old 386 in the corner' are generally at least vaguely cluey, but people with a "configuration #3" system from the local dealer will probably have 8M and a monitor. > I'm working on this for something entirely different, but I > think it would do fine here, as well as for all those > "sysadm" utils we can imagine to do. If it's light and portable and works, it may well be a Good Thing. Is there a demo we can play with somewhere, so that it's possible to decide, and preferably sometime soonish? > Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 03:37:44 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA24653 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 03:37:44 -0800 Received: from tfs.com (tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id DAA24648 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 03:37:40 -0800 Received: from critter.tfs.com by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) with SMTP id m0tK1sK-0003w2C; Mon, 27 Nov 95 03:37 PST Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id MAA02003; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:37:28 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: "Amancio Hasty Jr." cc: Luigi Rizzo , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2.1 release sysinstall In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 25 Nov 1995 09:20:24 PST." <199511251720.JAA00645@rah.star-gate.com> Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:37:28 +0100 Message-ID: <2001.817472248@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Howdy, > > We have the cmu snmp stuff it should be in the xperiment ports section and > we also got Pohl-Koening who wrote the original tcl snmp package which the > cmu people borrow to implement their tcl interface. So track down Pohl pull > him by his arm and ask for his snmp package 8) > > BTW: a side note --- at Cisco I used Pohl's snmp package to flush out bugs > in cisco snmp implementation . Actually we went hog wild with his package and > implemented a mini network management platform 8) > Yeah, thought I havn't touched SNMP lately, I havn't quite changed my name as much as Amancio seems to think to distance myself from it :-) Querying foreign hosts with SNMP is considered bad style, and is very unlikely to yield responses anyway. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 03:51:01 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA25046 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 03:51:01 -0800 Received: from tfs.com (tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id DAA25041 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 03:50:58 -0800 Received: from critter.tfs.com by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) with SMTP id m0tK25F-0003wxC; Mon, 27 Nov 95 03:50 PST Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id MAA02084; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:50:45 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: sos@FreeBSD.ORG cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard), cshenton@apollo.hq.nasa.gov, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:33:46 +0100." <199511270833.JAA16295@ra.dkuug.dk> Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:50:45 +0100 Message-ID: <2082.817473045@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Considering the problems, I belive that an X11-based installation is >not< the thing we should do before we can do a !X11-based installation to some level of satisfaction. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 04:02:37 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA25463 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 04:02:37 -0800 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA25458 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 04:02:35 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA00415; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 20:00:43 -0800 Message-Id: <199511270400.UAA00415@rah.star-gate.com> X-Authentication-Warning: rah.star-gate.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: Poul-Henning Kamp cc: Luigi Rizzo , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2.1 release sysinstall In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:37:28 +0100." <2001.817472248@critter.tfs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 20:00:42 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>> Poul-Henning Kamp said: > > Howdy, > > > > We have the cmu snmp stuff it should be in the xperiment ports section and > > we also got Pohl-Koening who wrote the original tcl snmp package which the > > cmu people borrow to implement their tcl interface. So track down Pohl pul l > > him by his arm and ask for his snmp package 8) > > > > BTW: a side note --- at Cisco I used Pohl's snmp package to flush out bugs > > in cisco snmp implementation . Actually we went hog wild with his package and > > implemented a mini network management platform 8) > > > > Querying foreign hosts with SNMP is considered bad style, and is very > unlikely to yield responses anyway. Hi, "bad style" and "foreign hosts" not sure what to make out of that if the hosts are freebsd hosts or are hosting freebsd. At any rate for sure we can use snmp to query hosts which are running snmp daemons. Hmm... If querying hosts with snmp is considered bad style, what is an acceptable protocol to query a host? You can query my "foreign host " in style 8) rah# snmpwalk -v 1 rah.star-gate.com public system system.sysDescr.0 = "Unix FreeBSD 2.0." system.sysObjectID.0 = OID: enterprises.cmu.1.1 system.sysUpTime.0 = Timeticks: (86509) 0:14:25 system.sysContact.0 = "Amancio Hasty , Tel. (415) 495 3046." system.sysName.0 = "rah.star-gate.com." system.sysLocation.0 = "San Francisco, California." system.sysServices.0 = 76 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 04:18:31 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA26276 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 04:18:31 -0800 Received: from tfs.com (tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA26271 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 04:18:28 -0800 Received: from critter.tfs.com by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) with SMTP id m0tK2Vk-0003vkC; Mon, 27 Nov 95 04:18 PST Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA02241; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:18:10 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: "Amancio Hasty Jr." cc: Luigi Rizzo , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2.1 release sysinstall In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 26 Nov 1995 20:00:42 PST." <199511270400.UAA00415@rah.star-gate.com> Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:18:09 +0100 Message-ID: <2239.817474689@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Querying foreign hosts with SNMP is considered bad style, and is very > > unlikely to yield responses anyway. > Hi, > > "bad style" and "foreign hosts" not sure what to make out of that if > the hosts are freebsd hosts or are hosting freebsd. At any rate for sure > we can use snmp to query hosts which are running snmp daemons. ... if we have the owners permission. Even if we did query with SNMP, what would you ask for ? I guess that the best thing so far would be to send a single ping to all the servers, order by return TTL and turn-around, and take the best. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 04:22:12 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA26494 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 04:22:12 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA26474 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 04:21:45 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id NAA18106; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:21:08 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id NAA05591; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:21:24 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id JAA04879; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:54:48 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511270854.JAA04879@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Argh, lost console :-( To: maral@webnet.com.au (Peter Marelas) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:54:47 +0100 (MET) Cc: jgreco@solaria.sol.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from "Peter Marelas" at Nov 25, 95 05:06:10 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 930 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk As Peter Marelas wrote: > > > What happened: I put xdm as the last entry in /etc/rc.local on a 486DX/33 > > with 32MB RAM, Fahrenheit 1280 VGA card, running 2.0.5R. Put a "sleep 2" (or some other activity) behind, in order to allow xdm to properly daemonize itself. Otherwise, the rc shell will exit before xdm changed its session, and consequently kill xdm halfways while launching the Xserver. > The README in XF86312 says to start xdm from a tty in /etc/ttys > > The easiest way to automatically start the display manager on boot is > to add a line in /etc/ttys to start it on one of the unoccupied > virtual terminals: > > > ttyv4 "/usr/X11R6/bin/xdm -nodaemon" xterm on secure I wholeheartedly disagree with this method. It's a crock. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 04:38:59 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA27201 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 04:38:59 -0800 Received: from Sysiphos (Sysiphos.MI.Uni-Koeln.DE [134.95.212.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA27190 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 04:38:38 -0800 Received: by Sysiphos id AA20805 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for hackers@freebsd.org); Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:35:39 +0100 Message-Id: <199511271235.AA20805@Sysiphos> From: se@zpr.uni-koeln.de (Stefan Esser) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:35:39 +0100 In-Reply-To: Kai Vorma "Java.." (Nov 25, 0:05) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(2) 7/9/95) To: Kai.Vorma@hut.fi Subject: Re: Java.. Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Nov 25, 0:05, Kai Vorma wrote: } Subject: Java.. } Netscape 2.0B3 is now out (ftp://ftp.netscape.com/2.0b3/unix) and Java } Applet support is now available for Linux (but not for BSDI). The } linux version seems to be working under emulation (-current) so check } it out if you are interested! } } To get it working you have to delete /etc/host.conf because linux uses } different syntax than FreeBSD. No, you don't have to delete /etc/host.conf ! Just set the environment variable RESOLV_HOST_CONF to /compat/linux/etc/host.conf and put an empty file there, or one containing the following single line: order bind,hosts Regards, STefan -- Stefan Esser, Zentrum fuer Paralleles Rechnen Tel: +49 221 4706021 Universitaet zu Koeln, Weyertal 80, 50931 Koeln FAX: +49 221 4705160 ============================================================================== http://www.zpr.uni-koeln.de/~se From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 04:57:11 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA28073 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 04:57:11 -0800 Received: from sovcom.kiae.su (sovcom.kiae.su [144.206.136.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA28066 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 04:56:59 -0800 Received: by sovcom.kiae.su id AA29176 (5.65.kiae-1 ); Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:43:46 +0300 Received: by sovcom.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Mon, 27 Nov 95 15:43:46 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by ache.dialup.demos.ru (8.6.12/8.6.12) id BAA02015; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:22:20 +0300 To: hackers@freebsd.org, Scott Mace Cc: nate@freebsd.org References: <199511261623.KAA08479@metal.ops.neosoft.com> In-Reply-To: <199511261623.KAA08479@metal.ops.neosoft.com>; from Scott Mace at Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:23:27 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:22:19 +0300 (MSK) X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.41 FreeBSD] From: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: interesting tidbit from 2.1.0-RELEASE make world Lines: 21 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 910 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199511261623.KAA08479@metal.ops.neosoft.com> Scott Mace writes: >crash # make >===> lp >===> lpc >===> lpd >cc -O -m486 -pipe -I/usr/src/usr.sbin/lpr/lpd/../common_source -static -o lpd lpd.o printjob.o recvjob.o displayq.o rmjob.o startdaemon.o lpdchar.o common.o >displayq.o: Definition of symbol `_warn' (multiply defined) >/usr/lib/libc.a(err.o): Definition of symbol `_warn' (multiply defined) >*** Error code 1 Yes, static building hits again. Linking order of functions with same name is unpredictable with current ld when static used. It is long-standing bug without any progress. :-( -- Andrey A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - http://dt.demos.su/~ache : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 05:19:57 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA29139 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 05:19:57 -0800 Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA29134 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 05:19:35 -0800 Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id IAA01488; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 08:33:57 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199511270733.IAA01488@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Java.. To: jehamby@lightside.com (Jake Hamby) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 08:33:57 +0100 (MET) Cc: Kai.Vorma@hut.fi, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Jake Hamby" at Nov 26, 95 11:20:12 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1196 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I just downloaded 2.0b3 for Linux to check out the Java support. It seems > to be running at a decent speed, so that's good. But since I've been > using FreeBSD for all my Internet applications, since the PPP speed in > Linux is basically crap (2.8Kbps vs. 3.2Kbps for FreeBSD!), I also D/Led define something crap because of such a small (in absolute terms, not relative ones) difference in speed seems a bit too much! > the BSD version, and even though there is no Java, it did fix ALL of the > bugs I reported (non-blinking cursor, and problems with my dial-on-demand the non-blinking cursor was a more general problem with timer events which were not listened to when waiting for X events. This also affected dynamic pages using the client-pull mechanism, and possibly other features. Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 05:32:17 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA29709 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 05:32:17 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA29704 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 05:32:13 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id FAA20926 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 05:31:51 -0800 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 05:31:51 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511271331.FAA20926@ref.tfs.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: that's odd ;) Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I installed the latest -current today.. over one a month or so old.. it got smaller.. I ended up with 5000 blocks free and I started with about 1500 ? I was sure I was going to over-flow.. I mean, since when was a newer release of ANYTHING smaller than it;s predecessor? julian (happy) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 05:43:46 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA00441 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 05:43:46 -0800 Received: from fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (Fieber-John.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA00436 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 05:43:43 -0800 Received: (from jfieber@localhost) by fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA07824; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 08:43:01 -0500 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 08:43:01 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber X-Sender: jfieber@fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu To: Peter Marelas cc: hackers@freebsd.org, doc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Documentation.. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 27 Nov 1995, Peter Marelas wrote: > Due to all the argueing about the lack of documentation, why dont > we all stop bitching, and do ourselves a favour by writing docs, on > what we have experience in, when using freebsd, lets get the handbook > growing. YES! The new handbook section: X. Compatibility with other systems X.1 BSDI (no-brainer, except I gather 2.0 binaries don't work?) X.2 SCO X.3 Linux > Where do we put docs in for review by others? Send stuff in to doc@freebsd.org. In a couple weeks I'll be diving headfirst into a handbook upgrade so if there are some new compat docs in my mailbox, they will find their way in. > PS: Im writing one on PPP Servers, using pppd, as I feel the current docs > in the handbook are inadequate. Super! I think the most common failing found in the handbook (including the ppp docs) are explicit step-by-step instructions *without* sufficient commentary text. Step-by-step procedures are exteremely fragile and fall apart in the face of varaiation among installations. With the rapid development of freebsd, variation is *guaranteed*. The process should be explained by the text, and illustrated by some examples, not the reverse! -john == jfieber@indiana.edu =========================================== == http://fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu/~jfieber ============ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 05:47:18 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA00733 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 05:47:18 -0800 Received: from fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (Fieber-John.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA00723 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 05:47:14 -0800 Received: (from jfieber@localhost) by fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA07839; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 08:47:12 -0500 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 08:47:12 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber X-Sender: jfieber@fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu To: Poul-Henning Kamp cc: sos@FreeBSD.ORG, "Jordan K. Hubbard" , cshenton@apollo.hq.nasa.gov, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. In-Reply-To: <2082.817473045@critter.tfs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Mon, 27 Nov 1995, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > Considering the problems, I belive that an X11-based installation is > >not< the thing we should do before we can do a !X11-based installation > to some level of satisfaction. Yes! Listen to the man! (This is not to say that we shouldn't keep an X based install in the back of our minds though. We don't want to make design decisions that eliminate future options.) -john == jfieber@indiana.edu =========================================== == http://fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu/~jfieber ============ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 06:17:59 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id GAA01873 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 06:17:59 -0800 Received: from fang.cs.sunyit.edu (fang.cs.sunyit.edu [192.52.220.66]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA01868 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 06:17:56 -0800 Received: (from chuck@localhost) by fang.cs.sunyit.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) id JAA16135 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:17:54 -0500 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:17:54 -0500 Message-Id: <199511271417.JAA16135@fang.cs.sunyit.edu> from: chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: MsDoss FileSystem Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I've heard a lot about msdos filesystem support and that there are limitations (bugs?). What exactly are the limitations of the the msdos support? Does BSD/OS, NetBSD, Lites suffer from the same problems? If there is a problem, is there anyone working on it? (Yes, I might be able to help). -- Charles Green UN*X System Administration 22 Powell Ave. Apt. B UN*X Security & Whitesboro, NY 13492 Programming From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 06:39:42 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id GAA03518 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 06:39:42 -0800 Received: from bigbird.vmicls.com (bigbird.vmicls.com [198.17.96.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA03510 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 06:39:36 -0800 Received: from gonzo by bigbird.vmicls.com (8.6.9/SMI-4.1-vmicls-master-host-1) id JAA18191; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:42:05 -0500 From: Jerry.Kendall@vmicls.com (Jerry Kendall) Organization: VMI Communications and Learning Systems Received: by gonzo (5.0/vmi-client-host-1) id AA28929; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:42:03 +0500 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:42:03 +0500 Message-Id: <9511271442.AA28929.gonzo@vmicls.com> To: martin@victor.innovus.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: diskless X server using FreeBSD 2.0.5R X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII content-length: 1449 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > I would like to setup my old 486-33 machine to run as a > > diskless FreeBSD/Xserver. > > > > Can this be done by first starting it as a diskless system and running X ???? > > > > OR is there a better way of doing this ????? > > Yes. You can run FreeBSD diskless and then start the X server. If all you > want is an X terminal type of setup you can strip down the /etc/rc files > and just have them start X. > > The last company I worked for did this. I would recommend 8MB for X Terminal > type use, more if you're going to do UNIX type things as well. > > Martin > OK. Got it. ------- Now then, you mentioned stripping down things. Do you(or maybe someone in the group) have the ability to generate a 'ls -lR' of a system that is running as an X terminal. I have just aquired some small disk, 80 Meg, that I can dedicate to FreeBSD. This will allow me to put a minimal FreeBSD system on it. I would still only use it as an X terminal. I have no intent on running any FreeBSD apps on it, other than system maintenance stuff. I will generate the required kernel on another system. So then, what I need is 'Minimal Freebsd' and just enough of X to get it to run as an X terminal. Questions: 1) Some X terminals(ie: NCD) will load their fonts from a font server. Should I do this ??? 2) If someone does this on a pseudo regular basis, can they provide me with some pre-install info and tips ???? Jerry From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 06:40:50 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id GAA03757 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 06:40:50 -0800 Received: from bigbird.vmicls.com (bigbird.vmicls.com [198.17.96.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA03747 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 06:40:45 -0800 Received: from gonzo by bigbird.vmicls.com (8.6.9/SMI-4.1-vmicls-master-host-1) id JAA18243; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:43:15 -0500 From: Jerry.Kendall@vmicls.com (Jerry Kendall) Organization: VMI Communications and Learning Systems Received: by gonzo (5.0/vmi-client-host-1) id AA28992; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:43:13 +0500 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:43:13 +0500 Message-Id: <9511271443.AA28992.gonzo@vmicls.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Quotas? X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII content-length: 2637 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > From owner-freebsd-bugs@freefall.freebsd.org Sat Nov 25 22:06:43 1995 > Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 18:56:24 -0800 (PST) > From: Donald Burr > X-Sender: d_burr@ncc-1701-d > To: Alan Batie > cc: freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org > Subject: Re: Quotas? > MIME-Version: 1.0 > > On Sat, 25 Nov 1995, Alan Batie wrote: > > > I'm building a new 2.1.0 system, and it appears that quotas are not > > functional. I do have "options QUOTA" in the config file, but I have > > imposed quotas on a filesystem, and can go in and create files exceeding > > the quota. "quota -v" shows nothing until I run quotacheck, at which > > point "quota -v" shows the correct values, but I can still use additional > > space, and the values are not updated until the next "quotacheck". > > Ok, well, in the /etc/rc file, look for lines that look like this: > > -----CUT HERE > # Check the quotas > if [ "X${check_quotas}" = X"YES" ]; then > echo -n 'checking quotas:' > quotacheck -a > echo ' done.' > quotaon -a > fi > -----CUT HERE > > They MAY or MAY NOT be commented-out; if they are, then remove the comments. > > This code runs the quota checker at startup, and turns quota's on -- from > there, the system (kernel) keeps track of quotas by itself. But, you now > have to tell it which FILESYSTEMS to enable quotas for. > > Look in /etc/fstab. For each filesystem you want to enable quotas for, > add a "userquota" and/or "groupquota" entry to the 4th field of the > fstab. Note the example below, this comes from my freebsd box... I have > quota's on only ONE filesystem, that is /dev/sd0s2b (which is mounted > under /home). > > -----CUT HERE > /dev/sd0a / ufs rw 1 1 > /dev/sd0s2e /usr ufs rw 1 1 > /dev/sd0s1 /dos msdos rw 0 0 > /dev/cd0a /cdrom cd9660 ro 0 0 > /dev/wd0s1a /news ufs rw 1 1 > /dev/sd0s2f /news/in.coming ufs rw 1 1 > /dev/sd0s2b /home ufs rw,userquota,groupquota 1 1 > proc /proc procfs ro 0 0 > /dev/wd0s1b none swap sw 0 0 > -----CUT HERE > > Then just REBOOT, run 'edquota ' for each on your system, set > some reassonable quotas, log in as one of the 's and try being a disk > hog. You'll quickly find out that this is not very possible. > > Donald Burr [d_burr@ix.netcom.com], PO Box 91212, Santa Barbara CA 93190-1212 > TEL (805)564-1871 / FAX 564-2315 / WWW http://www.geopages.com/WallStreet/2072 > PGP Public Key available by request (send e-mail) or on Public Key Servers. > ** Uphold your right to privacy - Use PGP. ** > Is this info in a FAQ somewhere. I looked for it and found very little info. Jerry From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 06:49:58 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id GAA04504 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 06:49:58 -0800 Received: from fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov (fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov [137.75.131.171]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id GAA04496 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 06:49:52 -0800 Received: by fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov (5.57/Ultrix3.0-C) id AA10197; Mon, 27 Nov 95 08:49:51 -0600 Received: by emu.fsl.noaa.gov (1.38.193.4/SMI-4.1 (1.38.193.4)) id AA16349; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:49:49 -0700 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:49:49 -0700 From: kelly@fsl.noaa.gov (Sean Kelly) Message-Id: <9511271449.AA16349@emu.fsl.noaa.gov> To: phk@critter.tfs.com Cc: sos@freebsd.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com, cshenton@apollo.hq.nasa.gov, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <2082.817473045@critter.tfs.com> (message from Poul-Henning Kamp on Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:50:45 +0100) Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Poul-Henning" == Poul-Henning Kamp writes: Poul-Henning> Considering the problems, I belive that an X11-based Poul-Henning> installation is >>not<< the thing we should do Poul-Henning> before we can do a !X11-based installation to some Poul-Henning> level of satisfaction. We could at least provide reasonable skeleton dot files that would set up an attractive X11 interface, after the install's complete ... perhaps to continue the installation of packages, set up user accounts, install printer stuff, etc. I know some users who are shallow enough to prefer a particular Linux distribution over another because it includes a .xinitrc that starts up an fvwm with a .fvwmrc with a pretty color scheme over another distribution that uses good ol' twm. Look at Walnut Creek's CD-ROM catalog: Slackware's screen shot is sexier than FreeBSD's. Sure, we've got technologically superior solutions, and that works for part of the market. But sex sells, too! -- Sean Kelly NOAA Forecast Systems Laboratory, Boulder Colorado USA I don't guess I've ever been as scared as when I was waiting in the principal's office. Finally he came in and sat down. He didn't say anything, he just looked at me. Then he pulled a copy of Playboy out. "Is this yours?" he said. "No," I said, "is this yours?" And I pulled out my penis. I guess I wasn't as scared as I thought. -- Jack Handey From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 07:02:12 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA05455 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:02:12 -0800 Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [199.98.84.132]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA05450 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:02:05 -0800 Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id JAA00582; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:00:43 -0600 From: Bob Willcox Message-Id: <199511271500.JAA00582@luke.pmr.com> Subject: Re: How can I remove hard links between directories? To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:00:43 -0600 (CST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511270822.JAA03924@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Nov 27, 95 09:22:05 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1086 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk J Wunsch wrote: > > As A boy and his worm gear wrote: > > > > > Help! An apparently buggy version of afio that I was running has > > > created some hard links between a couple of directories on my system > > David? Didn't we nuke the ability to hard-link directories some day > in 1.1.5.1? Should we nuke this again? > > > > (2.1-STABLE) and I need to get rid of them. Unfortunately rmdir > > > simply complains that the directory is not empty (use counts on > > > these two directries is 4 rather than 2). Can someone please tell > > > me a way to fix this? > > > I can think of one admittedly ugly way to fix this: use clri to zap > > the inode associated with this troublesome directory, then run fsck > > to pick up the pieces afterwards. > > It's rather ugly. Better, use this: Thanks, though I had already written a similar program per a suggestion from Julian Elischer. Seems that SysV and AIX both have this program and I was (wrongly) thinking that something like it existed in FreeBSD. -- Bob Willcox bob@luke.pmr.com (or obiwan%bob@uunet.uu.net) Austin, TX From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 07:10:00 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA05800 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:10:00 -0800 Received: from anacreon.sol.net (anacreon.sol.net [206.55.64.116]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA05795 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:09:56 -0800 Received: from solaria.sol.net (solaria.sol.net [206.55.65.75]) by anacreon.sol.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA04333; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:09:53 -0600 Received: from localhost by solaria.sol.net (8.5/8.5) id JAA28202; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:10:48 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199511271510.JAA28202@solaria.sol.net> Subject: Re: Argh, lost console :-( To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Mon, 27 Nov 95 9:10:46 CST Cc: maral@webnet.com.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511270854.JAA04879@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Nov 27, 95 09:54:47 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL65] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1470 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > As Peter Marelas wrote: > > > > > What happened: I put xdm as the last entry in /etc/rc.local on a 486DX/33 > > > with 32MB RAM, Fahrenheit 1280 VGA card, running 2.0.5R. > > Put a "sleep 2" (or some other activity) behind, in order to allow xdm > to properly daemonize itself. Otherwise, the rc shell will exit > before xdm changed its session, and consequently kill xdm halfways > while launching the Xserver. That's not the problem (I actually do an "fsck -y /dev/homepartition" after launching xdm which takes longer than a few seconds)... xdm is running just dandy and X comes up "fine" - but the kbd isn't there. Now if only there was a way to do the equivalent of "fsck -p /dev/somepartition" :-) > > The README in XF86312 says to start xdm from a tty in /etc/ttys > > > > The easiest way to automatically start the display manager on boot is > > to add a line in /etc/ttys to start it on one of the unoccupied > > virtual terminals: > > > > > > ttyv4 "/usr/X11R6/bin/xdm -nodaemon" xterm on secure > > I wholeheartedly disagree with this method. It's a crock. Ditto. I don't like being forced to launch it and hate having to edit a file and send signals to init rather than just kill the little pig to disable it. ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 07:17:47 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA06215 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:17:47 -0800 Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA05994 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:13:44 -0800 Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id OAA02066; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:12:45 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199511271312.OAA02066@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: 2.1 release sysinstall To: phk@critter.tfs.com (Poul-Henning Kamp) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:12:44 +0100 (MET) Cc: hasty@rah.star-gate.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <2001.817472248@critter.tfs.com> from "Poul-Henning Kamp" at Nov 27, 95 12:37:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 913 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Querying foreign hosts with SNMP is considered bad style, and is very > unlikely to yield responses anyway. Personally I would like to use it to extract routing info from routers on the path between my node and some destinations. I assume these info are already communicated to nearby nodes via routed or some other protocol, so I don't believe there is much "sensitive" information. Any ideas on whether this is considered bad style or if there is an alternate/polite way of getting the same info ? Thanks Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 07:20:32 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA06386 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:20:32 -0800 Received: from ra.dkuug.dk (ra.dkuug.dk [193.88.44.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA06377 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:20:21 -0800 Received: (from sos@localhost) by ra.dkuug.dk (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA16649; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:16:50 +0100 Message-Id: <199511271516.QAA16649@ra.dkuug.dk> Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. To: jfieber@indiana.edu (John Fieber) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:16:49 +0100 (MET) Cc: phk@critter.tfs.com, sos@freebsd.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com, cshenton@apollo.hq.nasa.gov, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "John Fieber" at Nov 27, 95 08:47:12 am From: sos@freebsd.org Reply-to: sos@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1607 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In reply to John Fieber who wrote: > > On Mon, 27 Nov 1995, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > > > Considering the problems, I belive that an X11-based installation is > > >not< the thing we should do before we can do a !X11-based installation > > to some level of satisfaction. > > Yes! Listen to the man! Exactly my words... What I propose is a "modern" version of curses/dialog that uses a simple graphic interface with a simple designer interface... It doesn't require all the space/setup/whatever that X does, but could easily be made to run under X later... What I was after was that it should be damnd easy to design/implement the user interface, if thats not the case we won't get any graphical utilities (how many do we have now ????) I do see we have a problem with text only machinery, for that we propbly stilll should use curses/dialog. If we can get a definition done on the function interface, then I'm ready to change it, if we get real serious we would design it so that curses/dialog <> "my baby" would have the same interface on the functioncall level, then we could have both textonly/graphical solutions... I'll stop dreaming now.... > (This is not to say that we shouldn't keep an X based install in the back > of our minds though. We don't want to make design decisions that > eliminate future options.) Sure, that was why I was ready to do a X backend to my baby project... -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team So much code to hack -- so little time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 07:53:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA08306 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:53:40 -0800 Received: from wiley.muc.ditec.de (wiley.muc.ditec.de [194.120.126.9]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA08296 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:53:28 -0800 Received: from vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (ns047.munich.netsurf.de [194.64.166.47]) by wiley.muc.ditec.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA02012; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:52:47 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA01031; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:32:59 +0100 Message-Id: <199511271032.LAA01031@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> X-Authentication-Warning: vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: me@gw.muc.ditec.de cc: terry@lambert.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2.1.0-RELEASE now available! Reply-To: "Julian H. Stacey" X-mailer: EXMH version 1.6.4 10/10/95 In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 23 Nov 1995 17:48:00 +0700." Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:32:58 +0100 From: "Julian H. Stacey" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, Responding to: > From: me@tartufo.muc.ditec.de (Michael Elbel) > Reply-to: me@gw.muc.ditec.de > Subject: Re: 2.1.0-RELEASE now available! > Date: Thu, 23 Nov 95 17:48 MET > Message-id: > > Say, does this look like news or not? Maybe we should actually consider > using news as the "backbone transport" between the various exploders? > Locally they then can be sent out to the end users via mail or be kept > as newsgroups at larger sites (ok, I'm using newsgroups here locally, > so I'm biased, but then, its so much easier to look through the lists > if they are a) in separate newsgroups b) subjects are threaded). I've just not got both - separate directories for each freebsd mail list - threading working using /usr/ports/mail/mh, exmh, & procmail. So xmh & other mh based mail readers should be able to doi similar. PS this is neither to counter nor supplement your suggestion, (you (Michael) know much more about news systems than me), I just offer it as additional info :-) > Michael Elbel, DITEC, Muenchen, Germany - me@muc.ditec.de > Fermentation fault (coors dumped) > Julian --- Julian H. Stacey jhs@freebsd.org http://www.freebsd.org/~jhs/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 07:59:45 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA08607 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:59:45 -0800 Received: from fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (Fieber-John.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA08601 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:59:32 -0800 Received: (from jfieber@localhost) by fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA08153; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:59:20 -0500 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:59:19 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber X-Sender: jfieber@fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, install@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. In-Reply-To: <9417.817366166@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk (BTW, there is a mailing list just for the discussion of installation issues. I might suggest moving this out of hackers.) On Sat, 25 Nov 1995, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > Hmmmmm. This sounds suspiciously like "design before implementation" > or one of those other socialist granola-eating philosophies from the > 60's at places like Berkeley & CWI. Jeeze, he'll start quoting Wirth > next if we don't stop him! :-) Er, I'm in Indiana. You know, the midwest? Not well known for radical politics. ;-) > Seriously, this sounds like a reasonable attempt to bring the techies > back down to earth. Any human interface people care to jump in at > this point and start suggesting how John's 16 step program might be > implemented? I'm good at thinking up the implementation details, but > not so good at the "story boarding" that John seems to be suggesting > for this stage. It is really not hard. To condense everything, the essential point is that sysinstall must know lots of things about its environment to work correctly. Some things can be determined automagically while other information must come from the user. It is the latter that drives the interface design. If you don't have a clear map of what information the user has to provide, it will be pure luck if you get a good installation program out of it. I think the current install is far from a disaster, but there is a lot of room for improvement. In particular, the sequence for a lot of things is wrong. Just one of many example: while the disks must be partitioned and formatted be for installing distributions, the user could make much more informed partitioning decisions if the distributions were selected first. In fact, sysinstall could even provide intelligent defaults if the it knew what distributions were being installed and how much space each required. Next to having a clear map of *what* the information the user needs to supply, we have to determine *where* they will get that information. This information drives the help screens and highlights potential problem areas. Currently we have a couple large, general help files. We could do much better with single screen, context sensitive help that *directly* answers the question of where to find the needed information. EG: selecting active versus passive ftp modes. Exactly how does one determine which is appropriate? This should be answered. The list of information the user must supply is also a list of candidates for automagic discovery. For example, what about trying bootp to determine IP numbers? It will fail in many cases, but it would be a BIG win in some settings. Only on failure would the user have to fill in the numbers. (However, it may be wise to have the results returned by bootp displayed for confirmation.) There are many others that should provide plenty of clever programming work for those not too interested in that fuzzy thing called user psychology. I'm sure people will argue "but any serious unix admin should know all about disk geometry and geometry translation in PC's". True, BUT, every serious unix admin is a novice at one point and for a lot of our users, that point is installation. The more esoteric details we can spare them, the better off they will be, and consequently, the better off FreeBSD will be. Keep in mind that for numerous practical reason, FreeBSD, NetBSD, and Linux are rapidly becoming THE training ground for budding unixheads. If the entry barriers for FreeBSD are lower than the rest, then these people will use it, stick with it, and promote it. As for storyboards and prototype dialog screen? I'll just say that doing them will save a lot of time in implementation. You don't need fancy tools. Pencil and paper works amazingly well. I'll probably be chased off the list for saying this, but Hypercard is a killer app for interface prototyping. -john == jfieber@indiana.edu =========================================== == http://fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu/~jfieber ============ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 08:13:08 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id IAA09480 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 08:13:08 -0800 Received: from fang.cs.sunyit.edu (fang.cs.sunyit.edu [192.52.220.66]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA09470 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 08:12:59 -0800 Received: (from chuck@localhost) by fang.cs.sunyit.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) id LAA16745 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:12:53 -0500 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:12:53 -0500 Message-Id: <199511271612.LAA16745@fang.cs.sunyit.edu> from: chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Netscape 2.0b3 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Anyone try to use the mail window of the new netscape? It searches for the mail spool directory in /usr/spool/mail. Any ideas on how we can get get around this? -- Charles Green UN*X System Administration 22 Powell Ave. Apt. B UN*X Security & Whitesboro, NY 13492 Programming From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 08:29:09 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id IAA10539 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 08:29:09 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA10521 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 08:28:49 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Mon, 27 Nov 95 16:28 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id RAA05014; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 17:16:49 +0100 Message-Id: <199511271616.RAA05014@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 17:16:48 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) In-Reply-To: <199511271041.KAA04477@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Nov 27, 95 10:41:38 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 7626 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Michael Smith writes: > > Greg Lehey stands accused of saying: > >>>> How do I know how to enable the emulation? >>> >>> At install time, when it asks you about it. >> >> I didn't want it then. I want it now. How do I know how to enable >> the emulation? > > Well. Let's establish some grounds for this bickering. Are you a competent > user, with an ability to learn for yourself, and perhaps a little background > with Unix? > > If No, then exit here, go to your nearest Klone retailer with your > computer, and get them to install W95 on it. And go away. > > If Yes, then open your mind, and try putting a constructive lean on your > criticism. Before saying things like that, it's a good idea to read and understand what I'm saying. I don't think you did. First, I consider myself somewhat more than a competent user, even if in this particular case I'm putting the position of a slightly less than competent user. But you don't understand why. >>>> How do I run the program? Just start it by name? >>> >>> Yes. >> >> Aha. Where can I read that? > > "which ibcs2" is something that immediately comes to mind. > For those that have spent a little time with the system, "locate ibcs2" > tells you a lot more. That won't tell you how to run vi. The point Terry was making was that you *don't* need to mention ibcs2. And all that which and locate will tell you is where files are, not what they do. BTW, 'which' is broken. It doesn't pay any attention to the PATH environment variable, so it can't tell you which one you'll run, just the one it thinks most likeley. This can be *very* confusing for a newbie. >>>> Do I need to say "ibcs2 vi", or will it be enough just to write "vi"? >>> >>> Do I need to type "run foo" or just "foo"? >> >> I don't know. What's foo? > > In context, an executable. What kind of executable? A shell script, a FreeBSD binary executable, a Linux executable, a BSD/OS executable, a NetBSD executable, an ibcs2 COFF executable, or something else? That's a serious question. If you don't know what it is, you can't (in a general case) tell how to execute it. > Being childish doesn't help - see "No" above. Missing the point doesn't help either. >>>> I tried vi with the SCO version and got: >>>> >>>> === root@freebie (/dev/ttyp0) /allegro/usr/sco/usr/bin 16 -> ./vi >>>> Abort trap >>> >>> It apparently won't run. >> >> Why not? > > Because "abort trap". Followed by mail to hackers@freebsd.org with some > salient details (which SCO vi, etc etc), and possibly a response with > some helpful advice. Or at least an improvement in your understanding of the > problem. The correct thing to do here would be to follow it up, of course. Which raises another question: how do you debug a COFF program? With a COFF debugger? With a kernel debugger? I think I'm getting there. At the time when I wrote this, I genuinely didn't know whether this abort trap was the result of starting the program wrongly, or whether it was a bug (which I am perfectly capable of following up myself). > I'd guess, in context, that it's looking for shared libraries, and not having > much luck. What does "file vi" have to say? === root@freebie (/dev/ttyp0) /allegro/usr/sco/usr/bin 7 -> file vi vi: sticky 80386 COFF executable I think that this is probably a shlib problem too. Of course, a more obvious error message wouldn't do any harm. >>> You are now typing things at random. >> >> People tend to do that if they can't find the documentation. > > This is akin to "people eat things at random because they don't know what > they are". Go to "No" above, and make an appointment with your local > casualty ward. Uh-uh. If you don't know which of the two possibilities works, you'll try both, too. You didn't shout at me for typing in ./vi. Why not? I didn't try it at random--I tried vi first, and when that didn't work, I tried the alternative, because I thought it might work. According to your logic, I shouldn't have tried either. >> /usr/src/sys/i386/ibcs2, but it doesn't have a Makefile. There's a >> directory /usr/src/lkm/ibcs2, but the program there does nothing more >> than load an lkm. Anyway, what do you think Joe would say? > > He would say "what's the number for tech support"? And any one of us > that have iBCS2 stuff working would have an answer for him im minutes. I asked my original question several days ago, and got few replies, but none which really answered my question. So far, the cause of my complaint is Terry's claim "There isn't one. There doesn't need to be one.", which is blatant nonsense. >>> And let me tell you, a simple (or even a complex) man page will sure >>> as hell not cover it, especially without doing what Linux did and >>> supplying our own IBCS2 shared libraries, etc. >> >> Why not? Because of a dislike of man pages on the part of the person >> who should be writing them? > > How about "what do you expect for what you paid for it"? or "do you want > to be a part of the solution, or an unrelated problem"? Are you saying that writing free software is a justification for doing it badly? I don't think that's the tenor of this group. >> As I said, speak for yourself. If I release software, I document it. > > That's nice. Writing manual pages for an experimental moving target comes > under the heading of "makework", as far as I can see. No. A certain level of documentation helps you keep track of where you are. Admittedly, they won't be as polished, and as I said at the end of my last message, being experimental *is* an excuse for less-than-adequate documentatioon. It's not an excuse for claiming that no documentation is necessary, or that "you gets what you pays for". *That*'s what I'm bitching about, not the lack of documentation per se. >> Now here's the first statement with which I can agree. Fine, except >> that I didn't know that (it didn't say that in the man page). Still, >> a minimum of documentation would help even at this stage. So, what >> remains to be done? > > 8) I think that counts as a "Yes". First thing to do is to talk to > Steven Wallace, current keeper of the iBCS2 code, about his current > stage of development. Then, I'd hit the mailing list archives for > -hackers and -current (at least) and pull out everything relevant to > iBCS2, and see whether there's enough material for a FAQ addition, so > that people who're in your situation can get past the initial stumbling > blocks. Maybe I should remind you of where I'm coming from. I'm not really very interested in running the thing myself, but I'm writing a book on installing FreeBSD, and I'm trying to explain this from Joe Schmoe's viewpoint. So yes, I *do* intend to document the stuff. Again, I'm not bitching about the quality of the stuff, nor particularly about the missing documentation. I'm bitching about the attitude "don't need docs". > Then, if you're in the enviable position of having access to useful SCO > binaries, installing and testing them, and possibly commenting on the > installation process would be handy, and muchly appreciated. Enviable? You've obviously never worked much with SCO stuff :-) Yes, I do have some COFF stuff which I could try out, and I probably will. I don't understand the question of installation. If you can run COFF binaries, you should be able to run the installation programs too. Or am I missing something? > Steven is swallace@freebsd.org. The code in -current is _significantly_ > better than the code in -stable, but obviously still not there. Oh well, I'll keep trying. A couple of questions: Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 08:35:41 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id IAA10990 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 08:35:41 -0800 Received: from rocky.sri.MT.net (rocky.sri.MT.net [204.182.243.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA10979 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 08:35:32 -0800 Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.sri.MT.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id JAA14042; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:37:30 -0700 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:37:30 -0700 From: Nate Williams Message-Id: <199511271637.JAA14042@rocky.sri.MT.net> To: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, Scott Mace , nate@freebsd.org Subject: Re: interesting tidbit from 2.1.0-RELEASE make world In-Reply-To: References: <199511261623.KAA08479@metal.ops.neosoft.com> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk [ Static link build ] > Linking order of functions with same name is unpredictable with current ld > when static used. It is long-standing bug without any progress. :-( There *has* been progress on this bug, but not by me and the person doing the work has been having technical difficulties with his net connection. Have patience. :) Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 09:05:32 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA13277 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:05:32 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA13272 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:05:28 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id JAA02163; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:03:01 -0800 To: Michael Smith cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:48:25 GMT." <199511270148.BAA02573@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:03:01 -0800 Message-ID: <2161.817491781@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Hmm. Two days ago you were saying "it can't be done!" (or for the > australians here, "we'll all be rooned!"), wrt. leap to X. Has this > changed your mind? (I'm being optomistic here 8) Well, let's just say that I'm more open to the possibility. It's kinda moot until we get the proof-of-concept implementation out there and get some feedback on it anyway.. :-) I didn't get any feedback about my suggestings surrounding the re-architecting of xf86config, however. Both Rich Murphy and David Dawes have "signed on" at least in principle to the idea of us spearheading a new cross-platform X setup utility. If it depends on a GUI library we also ship, I don't see that as a real significant hardship. I'm already planning to fly out and see Patrick Volkerding (of Slackware) pretty soon to talk about the very subject of more work-sharing between the two groups. Out in user land, we've very few excuses to re-invent the wheel. > Do we want the forms shell to go so far as to do traversal, or to just run > a given form? (I see traversal as being a bit tougher, and I'm not sure > what we gain from it, other than yet another interpretive language 8( ) I think you may have misunderstood me. Go take a look at /usr/src/release/sysinstall/tcpip.c and see the fairly gross application-side buggery that's required to deal with the various text entry fields on that "form". If you look at any of the classic forms interface languages out there, they basically have a way of saying "I have these fields, on this form, and if the user is tabbing through them then visit the fields in theis order." The really simple forms IDLs just provide you with a canned set of fairly opaque objects and an API for reading forms that contain them from files. The slightly more complicated ones give you objects with more advanced capabilities, like field masks (###.##) and input validation, user defined input/entry/exit check routines, etc. The really really advanced ones just spit out code from a schema and let you imbed your own stuff into the resulting template, but I'm not sure I've ever liked that approach very much. > Ah drat. I was looking to the forms interpreter as a seperate shell on > the end of a pipe, reading forms and returning the result. We can still > do callbacks like this, it's just a little more work. Erm. I think you're over-complicating it - next you'll suggest a full XDR/RPC mechanism for communicating with the forms task, even if it's running on another machine.. :-) I think just a plain 'ol C library will do the job just fine, running in the same process. As long as you can read a form, tie callbacks to its members (id'd by name so it's at least decoupled somewhat - e.g. you can change the underlying forms object just so long as you keep the name the same) and then say "go get me the values from this form" in one easy call, with the forms code calling you back as necessary, well that would certainly do it for me. The existing libforms has/had many of those abilities. Perhaps we should visit it again? I know that Paul R. put a fair amount of work into it. > Ok, I'm sold on TCL. I know it's not perfect, but it's a _common_ language, > so the available programmer-base is much larger. Can we win the war to get > tcl into the base distribution? 8) This "devision" should go well with > John's recent post wrt. the 16-step plan to a tighter installation. Well, Peter has been fighting the war as a rear-guard action for months now. The only question usually is: Which versions? 3.6/7.3? 4.0/7.4? 4.1/7.5? Once we can settle this question, we can start thinking about finding a bmake'd version. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 09:15:27 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA13971 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:15:27 -0800 Received: from crh.cl.msu.edu (crh.cl.msu.edu [35.8.1.24]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA13963 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:15:23 -0800 Received: (from henrich@localhost) by crh.cl.msu.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA04833; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:15:19 -0500 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:15:19 -0500 From: Charles Henrich Message-Id: <199511271715.MAA04833@crh.cl.msu.edu> To: sos@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. Newsgroups: lists.freebsd.hackers References: <49c3i8$mml@msunews.cl.msu.edu> X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 #3 (NOV) Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk In lists.freebsd.hackers you write: >In reply to Jordan K. Hubbard who wrote: >[much deleted] >Earth calling hackers, hackers come in..... >It might be "fancy looking" to have an install process running in X, >BUT, gentlemen, keep in mind all the hassle we had when we said >that 4M wasn't enough to boot the install disk !! Bravo Bravo, my thougnts exactly. The idea of booting into X for an install is the silliest thing I have ever heard. most of my machines have the crappiest video system one can find, they are servers and dont need anything else. Not to mention that the dialog interface is FAST FAST FAST, and to the point. X sucks up tons of memory, is slow as nails, and is rediculus overkill for an install! Just MHO. -Crh -- Charles Henrich Michigan State University henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu http://rs560.msu.edu/~henrich/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 09:40:55 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA16206 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:40:55 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA16196 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:40:48 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id JAA02282; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:38:20 -0800 To: sos@FreeBSD.ORG cc: cshenton@apollo.hq.nasa.gov, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:33:46 +0100." <199511270833.JAA16295@ra.dkuug.dk> Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:38:20 -0800 Message-ID: <2280.817493900@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > It might be "fancy looking" to have an install process running in X, > BUT, gentlemen, keep in mind all the hassle we had when we said > that 4M wasn't enough to boot the install disk !! I don't think that anyone is talking about *just* having things work under X. Consider also that it takes a fair number of setup menus and dialogs and such to even *get* to where X is set up, I still see implementing this as a GUI toolchest that works under both environments. Yes, some of the early toolkits that attempted to do this looked pretty klunky and gave the whole idea of "UI transparency" something of a bad name. However, this has not been the case with second generation tkits like C++/Views, zApp or Galaxy. It never looks quite as out-and-out *rich* as a balls-to-the-wall Tk app, mind you, but good enough definitely. I could also see not doing the entire install using the toolkit. You might, in fact, have one path through it where you're in the ncurses based interface all the time and don't ever see an X server (it might be impractical - what if you have a next generation video card that's not even supported? Soren had this exact experience with the Viper Pro Video board I gave him for some time! :-). Another path might lead straight through the X config dialogs to X and then into a much *richer* environment. There are a lot of things we can do as "frills" once we've established our base minimum for install functionality, and such frills don't necessarily even have to be part of sysinstall. It can always run other programs, you know.. :-) In fact, and I know I'm getting terribly off-topic now but it's as good a time as any to make the point, I think sysinstall is actually too monolithic. Totally violates the UNIX philosophy, in fact! Rather than a number of useful libraries and programs like `disklabel' or `fdisk' tarted up to use them, we have almost no libraries (except for libdisk) and fdisk/disklabel left in their old and klunky state. sysinstall would do better to become a wrapper & launcher for each piece as a separate program, or at the very least some sort of dynamically loadable module! We could write a very small little module loader/launcher as well and implement "fdisk" and "disklabel" as simple mains which load the fdisk and disklabel modules and run them stand-alone. But I digress. :-) Anyway, as to Soren's little libvga library is concerned, well, I merely remind him that he and I have been talking about this *in theory* for months now.. I wouldn't mind seeing the proof-of-concept implmementation. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 09:54:17 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA16691 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:54:17 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA16686 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:54:13 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id JAA02310; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:51:24 -0800 To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) cc: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert), hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:55:23 +0100." <199511270855.JAA04164@allegro.lemis.de> Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:51:24 -0800 Message-ID: <2308.817494684@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > BSDI needs one because they have to enable it explicitly. > > Wrong. That's the case for FreeBSD, as you say: [jkh very unwisely jumps in] Aren't you guys having, like, multiple arguments here? I think we can simplify this considerably. For one, any command that appears in /usr/bin should have a man page. It's not just a good idea, it's the law. So there's no point at all in debating that. Just make it a very *small* man page if you have to. :) Second, BSDI's iBCS2 emulator does a lot more than ours does. For one thing, their "ibcs2" command chroots someplace and does lots of things to pre-load the process's view of the world so that all the weird path assumptions it might have hardcoded into it will still work. Our (undocumented) hackery in /dev is not much to compare to that, even if it doesn't meet everyone's standards for purity of implementation. So that's an apples-and-oranges argument and of little value in debating also. Finally, if this is confusing you, you should probably doc it on the grounds that it may confuse someone else. However, you might also count the words you had to type in having this silly argument and wonder what kind of "emulation guide" you could have written with the same characters. :-) And to Terry, I don't think it's an unreasonable point to make that our current ibcs2/linux setup documentation sucks. It does, believe me. Why not read all the verbiage I had to stick into the doom/executor READMEs in the commerce distribution if you don't believe me? I don't go to the effort to doc something (a process I hate) unless I've been seriously hassled about it in questions. There are kernel options that need to be reenabled, the module loaded (also note that there may be an ibcs2=FOO line in sysconfig, but none for Linux). It's not immediately obvious, and immediately obvious is what it should be. This can be solved through a little more engineering and probably a lot more documentation. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 10:04:18 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA17178 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:04:18 -0800 Received: from tcsi.tcs.com (tcsi.tcs.com [137.134.41.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA17171 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:04:08 -0800 Received: from phact.tcs.com (phact.tcs.com [137.134.41.99]) by tcsi.tcs.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with ESMTP id KAA10024; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:02:43 -0800 Received: from cozumel.tcs.com (cozumel.tcs.com [137.134.104.12]) by phact.tcs.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with ESMTP id KAA19072; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:02:41 -0800 From: Douglas Ambrisko Received: (ambrisko@localhost) by cozumel.tcs.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) id KAA27054; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:02:25 -0800 Message-Id: <199511271802.KAA27054@cozumel.tcs.com> Subject: Re: Anyone keen to help me get a Phillips CDD 521 Recorder working? To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:02:24 -0800 (PST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, ambrisko@tcs.com In-Reply-To: <199511230844.JAA25813@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Nov 23, 95 09:44:57 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1335 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk J Wunsch writes: | | As Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: | > | > We have the YMI gear ourselves, and have multiple burner boxes | > scattered across different platforms, but that's no reason not to try | > to push the envelope a little.. :-) We've been wanting to see if this | > was even *possible* for awhile now. Now at least one of us has | > something that we can try a few proof-of-concept pokes at. | | I would use rtprio, btw. Given the fact that even the fastest CD | readers do not feed much more than 500 KB/s, and under the assumption | that a burner is way slower, the probability of success ain't that | bad. | | Of course, one should not run a "make world" in background... :-) I'll checkout rtprio, and I'm sorry I don't have all the specifics right now (you can probably find them at http://www.cdarchives.com) but the Yamaha is a 4X writer with only 512k buffer. This drive tends to have under run problems unless you do burns at single-user level. The issue is that is takes 20mins to do the burn and someone might not think and do parallel make worlds! Also Kodak has a 6X writer and people may have multiple writers. I would think it would be way cool to produce reliable CD-R's on FreeBSD by just plugging in a CD-R on the SCSI bus, but right now I'm a bit nervous and wouldn't bet my day job on it. Doug A. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 10:14:36 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA17656 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:14:36 -0800 Received: from alpha.dsu.edu (ghelmer@alpha.dsu.edu [138.247.32.12]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA17651 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:14:34 -0800 Received: (from ghelmer@localhost) by alpha.dsu.edu (8.7.1/8.7.1) id MAA03082; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:14:20 -0600 (CST) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:14:19 -0600 (CST) From: Guy Helmer To: Charles Henrich cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Security bug? In-Reply-To: <199511270130.UAA01244@crh.cl.msu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 26 Nov 1995, Charles Henrich wrote: > I am attempting to track down this bug, and Its driving me crazy. I have > modified the NCSA web server to change its uid to whomever is authenticating to > it. If the person authenticating is root, I force a change ownership to a > different uid via setuid() seteuid() setgid() and setegid() calls. The > problem, is after all the set[ug]* calls, I am still able to execute programs > that I shouldnt even be able to read! Have you looked at setgroups(2)? Your program probably still has the wrong group(s) in the group access list. > [...] > In any case, if any of you have made it this far, any ideas? > > -Crh > Charles Henrich Michigan State University henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu Hope this helps, Guy Helmer Guy Helmer, Dakota State University Computing Services - ghelmer@alpha.dsu.edu From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 10:29:12 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA18275 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:29:12 -0800 Received: from frya.zgik.zaporizhzhe.ua (ZGIK-1-ELIS-14.4K.zgik.zaporizhzhe.ua [193.124.62.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA18268 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:28:59 -0800 Received: from zgik.UUCP by frya.zgik.zaporizhzhe.ua with UUCP id UAA13701; (8.6.11/vak/1.8e) Mon, 27 Nov 1995 20:23:10 +0200 Received: by relay1.bcs.zaporizhzhe.ua (uumail v1.5/ache) id AA00391; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 20:13:53 +0200 Received: from bcs1.bcs.zaporizhzhe.ua (bcs1.bcs.zaporizhzhe.ua [193.124.62.29]) by bcs.zaporizhzhe.ua (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id UAA00388; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 20:13:52 +0200 Received: by bcs1.bcs.zaporizhzhe.ua id AA03130 (5.65c8/IDA-1.4.4 for mango@communique.net); Mon, 27 Nov 1995 20:21:08 +0200 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 20:21:08 +0200 From: Sergey Shkonda Message-Id: <199511271821.AA03130@bcs1.bcs.zaporizhzhe.ua> To: mango@communique.net, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: xmodem on a kermit session ? Organization: Business Computer Service, Zaporozhye, Ukraine X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In article you wrote: > Is there a terminal emulator for FreeBSD that would support xmodem file > transfer ? Or , is it possible to download a file using xmodem on kermitt's > terminal window ? Try ECU. X-, Y- modem, Auto Z-modem receive. (in ports/ecu* or packages/ecu*) > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Raul Zighelboim e-mail: mango@communique.net > Communique Inc. Tel: 504.527.6200 > Technical Specialist Fax: 504.527.6030 -- Serg | Relcom: (Sergey Shkonda) | serg@bcs1.bcs.zaporizhzhe.ua From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 10:30:58 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA18375 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:30:58 -0800 Received: from fang.cs.sunyit.edu (fang.cs.sunyit.edu [192.52.220.66]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA18366 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:30:55 -0800 Received: (from chuck@localhost) by fang.cs.sunyit.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) id NAA17467; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:30:36 -0500 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:30:36 -0500 Message-Id: <199511271830.NAA17467@fang.cs.sunyit.edu> In-Reply-To: Bill/Carolyn Pechter "Re: Netscape 2.0b3" (Nov 27, 1:16pm) from: chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: Bill/Carolyn Pechter Subject: Re: Netscape 2.0b3 Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Nov 27, 1:16pm, Bill/Carolyn Pechter wrote: } Subject: Re: Netscape 2.0b3 } > } > Anyone try to use the mail window of the new netscape? It searches } > for the mail spool directory in /usr/spool/mail. Any ideas on how we } > can get get around this? } } Symlink the correct mail spool with /usr/spool/mail. } } Bill } ---- } Bill Pechter/Carolyn Pechter | The postmaster always pings twice. } Lakewood MicroSystems | 17 Meredith Drive, } 908-389-3592 | Tinton Falls, NJ 07724 } pechter@shell.monmouth.com | }-- End of excerpt from Bill/Carolyn Pechter I prefer not to polute /usr if it can be avoided. -- Charles Green UN*X System Administration 22 Powell Ave. Apt. B UN*X Security & Whitesboro, NY 13492 Programming From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 10:32:32 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA18501 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:32:32 -0800 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA18489 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:32:28 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id CAA01710; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 02:31:43 -0800 Message-Id: <199511271031.CAA01710@rah.star-gate.com> X-Authentication-Warning: rah.star-gate.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: Poul-Henning Kamp cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2.1 release sysinstall In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:18:09 +0100." <2239.817474689@critter.tfs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 02:31:42 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>> Poul-Henning Kamp said: > > > Querying foreign hosts with SNMP is considered bad style, and is very > > > unlikely to yield responses anyway. > > Hi, > > > > "bad style" and "foreign hosts" not sure what to make out of that if > > the hosts are freebsd hosts or are hosting freebsd. At any rate for sure > > we can use snmp to query hosts which are running snmp daemons. > ... if we have the owners permission. Like requesting snmp service from a freebsd box is a big deal. > Even if we did query with SNMP, what would you ask for ? > > I guess that the best thing so far would be to send a single ping > to all the servers, order by return TTL and turn-around, and take > the best. Gosh, Additionally, I would query for system load and ftp users . If the snmp variable is not implemented in the kernel then a bit of minor hacking will fix the problem. Oh, while on the subject of snmp it would also be nice to be able to query such things as available freebsd sup and ftp servers. Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 10:35:32 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA18643 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:35:32 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA18637 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:35:26 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id FAA20667; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:30:08 +1100 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:30:08 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511271830.FAA20667@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, peter@haywire.dialix.com Subject: Re: How can I remove hard links between directories? Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Otherwise, we get bogons like netscape2 doing 'rename(".netscape/", >".netscape.bak");' or something bogus like that, and the namei() >lookup is or was converting ".netscape/" to mean ".netscape/." and was Lookup now converts "foo/" to "foo" if foo is a directory and fails otherwise. >pulling "." out of the .netscape directory in root's home (assuming >somebody was insane enough to run netscape as root.. :-) >or some bogon inside "rdistd" running as root, renaming the "." files >if you gave it a bogus distfile.. Renaming of "." and ".." has always been disallowed in FreeBSD. It isn't possible to create a damaged tree using rename() (modulo bugs). Renaming directories "by hand" using link() and unlink() is of course dangerous. >or things like inn's fastrm program that have to test if the euid == >0, and if so, it has to stat() every single file it's processing to >make sure it's not about to unlink a directory and running much slower >from the extra overhead.. (side note, always expire news as uid >"news" for this very reason). Why would it be much slower? unlink() is very slow if writes are synchronous. Here repeated stats of the same file take 81 usec while creat+close+unlink of the same file takes 5000 usec. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 10:36:15 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA18764 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:36:15 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA18752 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:36:05 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA19200; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:30:15 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511271830.LAA19200@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Help! I got a bad block.... To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:30:15 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, hasty@rah.star-gate.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199511270122.BAA02417@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Nov 27, 95 01:22:46 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1937 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I don't buy the "on a bad day argument". I can't see how a good sector > > could be incorrectly marked bad, unless you have the driver cooperate in > > the marking and blow the driver programming. > > If the drive has forwarding enabled, and for one reason or another (thermal, > LF vibrations, wrong phase of the moon) has problems writing a sector, it'll > forward it, and you'll lose the original. Uh, how do you propose to force the moon phase to change do you can recover the original??? > Forwarding doesn't do all the job, as far as media perfection is concerned - > once you run out of spare sectors, you're screwed. I've met a few drives > that appear to have lost their marbles when they ran out, and others that > just start to report errors, despite the fact that forwarding is enabled. They are telling you "replace me, replace me". Typically this is a rephrase of the subliminal message "never buy this type of drive again, never buy this type of drive again". > Unless you can positively identify the drive, determine the number of _free_ > spare sectors, and make a judgement call on how many you're likely to use > in a given uptime period, you still need a higher layer to catch the failure > case. I think that having an adaptive layer that's SCSI specific for the three important cases (just turn it on, turn it on and cooperate, and don't turn it on, use commands to let the driver force the forwarding) is the way to go. I know that if I had a striping setup, I would *never* want the drive to remap the sectors. On the other hand, the default behaviour you can install doesn't include striping and doesn't include cooperative remapping by the SCSI driver layer. So turning it on is a win until such time as the changes the in kernel code occur. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 10:38:39 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA18866 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:38:39 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA18859 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:38:30 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id SAA15983 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:41:46 +0100 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id SAA08998 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:41:46 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.7.1/keltia-uucp-2.6) id IAA21813; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 08:50:54 +0100 (MET) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199511270750.IAA21813@keltia.freenix.fr> Subject: Re: Translation Adaptec 1542 versus NCR810 To: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl (Wilko Bulte) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 08:50:53 +0100 (MET) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511261812.TAA00212@yedi.iaf.nl> from "Wilko Bulte" at Nov 26, 95 07:12:18 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1378 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8b] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk It seems that Wilko Bulte said: > Quick question: is the translation mode used by a Adaptec 1542A (32 hd, > 64 sect or the other way around (I always forget)) the same as the one > used by a NCR810 ? I'm afraid not... Last time I installed a disk in a friend's machine with a NCR, it used something like 33hd/63sect or 63hd/33 sect :-( -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #7: Mon Nov 6 21:08:06 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 10:40:23 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA19153 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:40:23 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA19066 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:40:12 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA19215; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:34:53 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511271834.LAA19215@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: How can I remove hard links between directories? To: davidg@root.com Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:34:53 -0700 (MST) Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, bob@luke.pmr.com In-Reply-To: <199511270945.BAA00128@corbin.Root.COM> from "David Greenman" at Nov 27, 95 01:45:51 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1059 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > >> > Help! An apparently buggy version of afio that I was running has > >> > created some hard links between a couple of directories on my system > > > >David? Didn't we nuke the ability to hard-link directories some day > >in 1.1.5.1? Should we nuke this again? > > I endured a significant amount of pain from all of the criticism of that > change. While I think it's bogus to allow hard directory links in FFS, some > other people disagree. ...but I think the other people are wrong, so yes, I > think we should "nuke" them again. :-) I definitely agree with this. If you nuke directory hard links, it's possible to maintain parent pointers and quickly reverse traverse the directory hierarchy. And doing that is useful to no end. 8-). I personnally used this technique with the justification that directories aren't files to implement a directed revers graph traversal for trustee support in a UNIX FS. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 10:50:57 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA19709 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:50:57 -0800 Received: from FIMP01.fim.uni-linz.ac.at (fimp01.fim.uni-linz.ac.at [140.78.100.24]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA19685 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:50:44 -0800 Received: by FIMP01.fim.uni-linz.ac.at (5.57/Ultrix3.0-C) id AA21372; Mon, 27 Nov 95 19:59:58 +0100 Received: from scotty (scotty [192.168.1.1]) by uhura (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA00154 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:44:59 +0100 Received: (from cg@localhost) by scotty (8.6.12/8.6.9) id TAA00173; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:47:33 +0100 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:47:33 +0100 (MET) From: Christian Gusenbauer Reply-To: cg@www.ati.khs-linz.ac.at To: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: To all fbsdboot and winboot users ... Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi! I'd like to know, if fbsdboot and winboot work with Win95?! Is there anybody out there with some experience? I'm planning a new release of fbsdboot/winboot during my Xmas holidays, which should support booting from various harddisk/controller combinations. Are there nice guys out there willing to help testing :)? Thanks, Christian. -- Christian Gusenbauer Please note my new email address: cg@www.ati.khs-linz.ac.at From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 11:28:48 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA21837 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:28:48 -0800 Received: from bacchus.eng.umd.edu (bacchus.eng.umd.edu [129.2.94.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA21830 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:28:45 -0800 Received: from cappuccino.eng.umd.edu (cappuccino.eng.umd.edu [129.2.98.14]) by bacchus.eng.umd.edu (8.7/8.7) with ESMTP id OAA09408; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:26:11 -0500 (EST) Received: (chuckr@localhost) by cappuccino.eng.umd.edu (8.7.2/8.6.4) id OAA08180; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:26:11 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:26:10 -0500 (EST) From: Chuck Robey X-Sender: chuckr@cappuccino.eng.umd.edu To: Joe Greco cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, maral@webnet.com.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Argh, lost console :-( In-Reply-To: <199511271510.JAA28202@solaria.sol.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Mon, 27 Nov 1995, Joe Greco wrote: > > As Peter Marelas wrote: > > > > > > > What happened: I put xdm as the last entry in /etc/rc.local on a 486DX/33 > > > > with 32MB RAM, Fahrenheit 1280 VGA card, running 2.0.5R. > > > > Put a "sleep 2" (or some other activity) behind, in order to allow xdm > > to properly daemonize itself. Otherwise, the rc shell will exit > > before xdm changed its session, and consequently kill xdm halfways > > while launching the Xserver. > > That's not the problem (I actually do an "fsck -y /dev/homepartition" after > launching xdm which takes longer than a few seconds)... xdm is running just > dandy and X comes up "fine" - but the kbd isn't there. > > Now if only there was a way to do the equivalent of "fsck -p > /dev/somepartition" :-) > > > > The README in XF86312 says to start xdm from a tty in /etc/ttys > > > > > > The easiest way to automatically start the display manager on boot is > > > to add a line in /etc/ttys to start it on one of the unoccupied > > > virtual terminals: > > > > > > > > > ttyv4 "/usr/X11R6/bin/xdm -nodaemon" xterm on secure > > > > I wholeheartedly disagree with this method. It's a crock. > > Ditto. I don't like being forced to launch it and hate having to edit a > file and send signals to init rather than just kill the little pig to disable > it. If it's such a crock, would you mind expounding on the _right_ method? I would use xdm if I trusted it... > > ... Joe > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net > Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 > ============================================================================ Chuck Robey chuckr@eng.umd.edu -- I run FreeBSD on n3lxx and Journey2 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Dilbert Zone is Dilbert's new WWW home! The area features never-before-seen original sketches of Dilbert, a photo tour of Scott Adams' studio, Dilbert Trivia and memorabilia, high school photos and much more!: From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 11:39:43 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA22410 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:39:43 -0800 Received: from netcom22.netcom.com (bakul@netcom22.netcom.com [192.100.81.136]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA22405 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:39:41 -0800 Received: from localhost by netcom22.netcom.com (8.6.12/Netcom) id LAA05263; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:37:22 -0800 Message-Id: <199511271937.LAA05263@netcom22.netcom.com> To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 95 09:03:01 PST." <2161.817491781@time.cdrom.com> Date: Mon, 27 Nov 95 11:37:18 -0800 From: Bakul Shah Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Have you considered using one of the free http clients & servers to implement the user interface and call cgi scripts with user specified input? Recently we put together a bunch of pretty simple Perl cgi scripts to submit bugs and query GNATS database via an HTTP client like Netscape. This was really very easy and it neatly decoupled user interface issues from the guts of the action routines. It also allowed us to benefit from the very rich functionality built into Netscape/Mosaic etc. *and* gave us multi-platform GNATS capability. I think I suggested this once before to you but after this experience I am convinced that this is the way to do a lot of configuration, system administration etc. You can use an ASCII based client when X is not available and use X based client when it is. If you can get unix upto the point where httpd can run and networking is up you can even do remote installation. I realise that much groundwork remains to be done and even if we did this, actual installation problems still need to be solved, but at least as a model this should be considered. For instance, rather than defining your own forms language just use HTML. HTML will also allow you to put in links for help files etc. I really should put together a prototype.... anyway, if anyone is interested we can explore this idea further. --bakul From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 11:58:21 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA23583 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:58:21 -0800 Received: from tellab5.lisle.tellabs.com (tellab5.lisle.tellabs.com [138.111.243.28]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA23578 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:58:13 -0800 From: mikebo@tellabs.com Received: from sunc210.hq.tellabs.com by tellab5.lisle.tellabs.com with smtp (Smail3.1.29.1 #4) id m0tK9Gx-000jDsC; Mon, 27 Nov 95 13:31 CST Received: by sunc210.hq.tellabs.com (SMI-8.6/1.9) id NAA03249; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:31:16 -0600 Message-Id: <199511271931.NAA03249@sunc210.hq.tellabs.com> Subject: 2.0.5R: SCSI hang and panic... HELP To: bugs@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:31:15 -0600 (CST) Cc: mikebo (Mike Borowiec), hackers@freebsd.org, questions@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I'm having tape drive problems... I'm trying to back-up my 2.0.5R machine to 8mm Exabyte, but every time I get close to finishing my tar backup, this happens: ahc0: target 0, lun 0 (sd0) timed out ahc0: target 0, lun 0 (sd0) timed out ...[repeats]... SCSI bus hangs, and I'm forced to reboot system... Rarely, the above messages are followed by: ahc_scsi_cmd0: more than 256 DMA segs sd0: oops not queued biodone: buffer already done Once, this even happened: /: bad dir ino 2 at offset 0: mangled entry panic: bad dir dumping to dev 40, offset 32768 ahc0: not responding The machine is a 486DX50 EISA/VESA w/16MB, with an Adaptec 2742AT EISA SCSI card. Please find dmesg output below... The system kernel is all generic 2.0.5R EXCEPT it has an updated st.c: ($Id: st.c,v 1.38 1995/07/16 09:13:14 gibbs Exp $). Anyone see this before... know of a solution? Any suggestions would be most appreciated... Thanks! - Mike -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Included dmesg output: FreeBSD 2.0.5-RELEASE #0: Fri Sep 1 00:16:43 CDT 1995 kroot@timesink:/usr/src/sys/compile/TIMESINK CPU: i486DX (486-class CPU) real memory = 16384000 (4000 pages) avail memory = 14749696 (3601 pages) Probing for devices on the ISA bus: sc0 at 0x60-0x6f irq 1 on motherboard sc0: VGA color <16 virtual consoles, flags=0x0> ed0 at 0x280-0x29f irq 9 maddr 0xd4000 msize 16384 on isa ed0: address 00:00:c0:d1:09:2d, type WD8013EP (16 bit) bpf: ed0 attached sio0 at 0x3f8-0x3ff irq 4 on isa sio0: type 16550A lpt0 at 0x378-0x37f irq 7 on isa lpt0: Interrupt-driven port lp0: TCP/IP capable interface mse0 at 0x23c irq 3 on isa pca0 on motherboard pca0: PC speaker audio driver fdc0 at 0x3f0-0x3f7 irq 6 drq 2 on isa fdc0: NEC 72065B fd0: 1.44MB 3.5in fd1: 1.2MB 5.25in ahc0: reading board settings ahc0: 274x Twin Channel, A SCSI Id=7, B SCSI Id=7, aic7770 >= Rev E, 4 SCBs ahc0: Using Level Sensitive Interrupts ahc0: Downloading Sequencer Program...Done ahc0 at 0x5000-0x50ff irq 11 on eisa slot 5 ahc0: Probing channel A ahc0 waiting for scsi devices to settle ahc0: target 0 synchronous at 4.4MB/s, offset = 0xf (ahc0:0:0): "IMPRIMIS 94601-15 1250" type 0 fixed SCSI 1 sd0(ahc0:0:0): Direct-Access 989MB (2026965 512 byte sectors) ahc0: target 1 synchronous at 10.0MB/s, offset = 0xf (ahc0:1:0): "MAXTOR XT-4380S B5A" type 0 fixed SCSI 1 sd1(ahc0:1:0): Direct-Access 318MB (651630 512 byte sectors) (ahc0:2:0): "ARCHIVE VIPER 150 20000 -000" type 1 removable SCSI 1 st0(ahc0:2:0): Sequential-Access st0: Archive Viper 150 is a known rogue density code 0x0, drive empty (ahc0:5:0): "EXABYTE EXB-8200 4.25" type 1 removable SCSI 1 st1(ahc0:5:0): Sequential-Access density code 0x0, drive empty (ahc0:6:0): "NEC CD-ROM DRIVE:501 2.2" type 5 removable SCSI 2 cd0(ahc0:6:0): CD-ROM cd present.[313218 x 2048 byte records] ahc0: Probing Channel B ahc0 waiting for scsi devices to settle ahb0 not found aha0 not found at 0x330 npx0 on motherboard npx0: INT 16 interface sb0 at 0x220 irq 5 drq 1 on isa sb0: opl0 at 0x388 on isa opl0: bpf: lo0 attached bpf: ppp0 attached bpf: sl0 attached -- -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Michael Borowiec - mikebo@tellabs.com - Tellabs Operations Inc. Senior Member of Technical Staff 4951 Indiana Avenue, MS 63 708-512-8211 FAX: 708-512-7099 Lisle, IL 60532 USA -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 12:08:27 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id MAA24267 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:08:27 -0800 Received: from cps201.cps.cmich.edu (cps201.cps.cmich.edu [141.209.20.201]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA24262 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:08:24 -0800 Received: from cps201 (cps201.cps.cmich.edu [141.209.20.201]) by cps201.cps.cmich.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id PAA07251 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:08:21 -0500 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:08:19 -0500 (EST) From: Mail Archive X-Sender: archive@cps201 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: 3940? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Can I use both channels of a 3940 adaptec or can I only use one side of the card? If I can use both, then would someone please give me an example of the kernel config file and wiring down the drives.... Thanks Matt From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 12:10:07 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id MAA24357 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:10:07 -0800 Received: from crh.cl.msu.edu (crh.cl.msu.edu [35.8.1.24]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA24313 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:09:58 -0800 Received: (from henrich@localhost) by crh.cl.msu.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) id PAA05694; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:09:49 -0500 From: Charles Henrich Message-Id: <199511272009.PAA05694@crh.cl.msu.edu> Subject: Re: Security bug? To: ghelmer@alpha.dsu.edu (Guy Helmer) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:09:48 -0500 (EST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Guy Helmer" at Nov 27, 95 12:14:19 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 410 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > that I shouldnt even be able to read! > > Have you looked at setgroups(2)? Your program probably still has the > wrong group(s) in the group access list. Agh! Im a marooon! I knew that... Thank you verra much, that solved it. I'll just go put on my dunce hat now. -Crh Charles Henrich Michigan State University henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu http://rs560.msu.edu/~henrich/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 12:12:00 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id MAA24439 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:12:00 -0800 Received: from ra.dkuug.dk (ra.dkuug.dk [193.88.44.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA24431 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:11:52 -0800 Received: (from sos@localhost) by ra.dkuug.dk (8.6.12/8.6.12) id VAA16874; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:05:10 +0100 Message-Id: <199511272005.VAA16874@ra.dkuug.dk> Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:05:10 +0100 (MET) Cc: sos@freebsd.org, cshenton@apollo.hq.nasa.gov, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <2280.817493900@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 27, 95 09:38:20 am From: sos@freebsd.org Reply-to: sos@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1144 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Jordan K. Hubbard who wrote: > > Anyway, as to Soren's little libvga library is concerned, well, I > merely remind him that he and I have been talking about this *in > theory* for months now.. I wouldn't mind seeing the proof-of-concept > implmementation. :-) Erhm, there I had this nice little theory :) Well, actually I'm getting pretty close to having something usefull (The Visual Basic idea is still theory though, just inventef a few days ago), its only graphic at the time, but syscons has all the hacks to generate a "real" mousepointer in text mode etc, so its merely writing the nessesary wrappers for taht one. Anyhow the project I'm on at work "should" be finished on thursday (or we'll get beaten up quite badly), so that should free up my nights for hacking..... If this is the way we want to go, I'm sure I can find the time to get it running.... (also I would LOVE to contribute some "real matter" again.. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team So much code to hack -- so little time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 12:46:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id MAA26460 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:46:40 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA26143 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:42:46 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA19427; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:38:02 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511272038.NAA19427@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? To: grog@lemis.de Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:38:02 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511270855.JAA04164@allegro.lemis.de> from "Greg Lehey" at Nov 27, 95 09:55:23 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 13652 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > BSDI needs one because they have to enable it explicitly. > > Wrong. That's the case for FreeBSD, as you say: Option it in and rebuild a kernel instead of "flicking a switch" is what I meant by "explicitly". > >> How do I know how to enable the emulation? > > > > At install time, when it asks you about it. > > I didn't want it then. I want it now. How do I know how to enable > the emulation? Rewrite the installation/configuration tool so it is reentrant to allow you to dynamically reconfigure the system at runtime. > >> How do I run the program? Just start it by name? > > > > Yes. > > Aha. Where can I read that? In the documentation that came with the program that tell you how to start it. 8-). Why are you assuming that there would be a gratuitous change in the way you start programs? Your assumptions are bad -- and you want written documentation to correct them? > >> Do I need to say "ibcs2 vi", or will it be enough just to write "vi"? > > > > Do I need to type "run foo" or just "foo"? > > I don't know. What's foo? The generic class of executable programs of which a FreeBSD native binary, a Linux binary, and an IBCS2 binary are all members. Like I said, it's a problem in the infrastructure documentation, not the instance documentation. You are confused about the instance (IBCS2) because you don't understand the infrastructure (and because you insist on understanding it instead of just using it). > > It apparently won't run. > > Why not? Probably because IBCS2 emulation is not totally complete and you didn't supply the missing pieces from your SCO system (the share libraries) when you took the shared vi binary (which implies a certain level of understanding above and beyond that implied by your "how do I..." questions). You are generating a situation that could not have occurred without sufficient knowledge to get you out of the situation in the first place. Then you are feigning ignorance. Bad syllogism, bad logical progression in support of your argument. 8-(. > >> === root@freebie (/dev/ttyp0) /allegro/usr/sco/usr/bin 17 -> ibcs2 vi > >> modload: error initializing module: File exists > > > > You are now typing things at random. > > People tend to do that if they can't find the documentation. I should have said "pseudo random". A typical user would not understand IBCS2 was necessary. They would have typed: % sco vi sco: Command not found. Or something similar, if it were really random. > > A bad idea for root (you must have > > been root to get that particular error message). > > Give me a better suggestion. How about: Don't login as root, login as yourself an use the 'su' command 8-). Or: Don't try to use SCO binary compatability until it's finished unless you are willing to look at the source code and understand what is going on. > >> Well, it appears that I need to run it as "ibcs2 vi". But what's this > >> modload problem? I have enabled Or have I done it wrong after all? > > > > Tell me: what must you do to enamle running of FreeBSD binaries? You > > must install. > > Must I? I thought it was sufficient to copy the data. If I run them > across the net, I don't even need to do that? Where did the binaries environment come from? It came from an install. > >> I'm an experienced computer person, and quite honestly the lack of > >> documentation (coupled, admittedly, with a lack of interest in SCO > >> software) is enough that I'm prepared to give up. Who is going to use > >> this stuff if they run into trouble and can't even be certain they've > >> started it properly. How does it work? > > > > I agree that there is a lot of missing "theory of operation" documentation > > for lots of the kernel. Execution classes are one such beastie. The > > VM is another. > > > > But if you expect Joe Schmoe to be able to make it work without asking > > questions on -questions at this point if Joe Schmoe didn't have things > > handled for him in the install, then you are barking up the wrong tree. > > Assuming that this abort trap is not typical, yes, I do expect Joe > Schmoe to be able to make it work without asking questions on > -questions at this point. Joe and his brother Bill are working for > one of my customers, who are doing just this with a System V > application running on BSD/OS in Munich. It would be nice if they > could use them on FreeBSD as well. They have FreeBSD, but for various > minor, silly reasons they don't use it. I think you will need to write (or steal) SCO shared libraries for this to be practical. Once you have them, it would be reasonable to write a man page: maybe. More likely, it would be reasonable to build ABI compliant install tools so that they can install the binaries in the normal fashion so that they can use them. If your customer is installing Lotus 1-2-3, the machine licensing uses the uname command and a binary file concatentatin that requires either reverse engineering their copy protection or the ability to run their install script to get it installed. Or you could rename a System V/SCO box, install it there, and move the files over to your FreeBSD box. That's how I installed Lotus and Word the first few times, until I got fed up and simply reverse engineered the copy protection. If you can "turn it on" with a tool AND all the pieces are there (some must come from SCO licensed materials right now) AND you can install IBCS2 binaries without detailed knowledge of the install process, there's really very little point to explaining what is happening *underneath* the install tool that does the work of "turning it on". And no reason for the question to be asked, since it "just works". > > Perhaps the right tree is http://www.freebsd.org. > > It should be the FM. Anyway, I've looked through the handbook. I > can't find anything there, either. http://www.freebsd.org *is* the FM. > > Or the source code, which is provided free of charge. > > I looked there too. The program is called /usr/bin/ibcs2, but there's > no source directory /usr/src/usr.sbin/ibcs2. There's a directory > /usr/src/sys/i386/ibcs2, but it doesn't have a Makefile. There's a > directory /usr/src/lkm/ibcs2, but the program there does nothing more > than load an lkm. Anyway, what do you think Joe would say? Well, I think that it's a mistake to put the module loading code in /usr/bin. And I think Joe would say "What's IBCS2?". > > Or the installation software that should have created the missing > > devices for you. > > No it shouldn't. I didn't want one then. But that's > interesting--this is the first I have heard of missing devices. Maybe > that's why it doesn't work. Where's this documented? In the null device alias handling in the source code in /sys/i386/ibcs2, since the devices are controlled via ioctl(), and /dev/null is as convenient a mechanism for implementing an open descriptor as any other. And in the iABI documentation from UNIPress, in section 8. > > Or the fact that to > > use an SCO shared binary, you must first own a copy of SCO to get the > > shared libraries. And you must know enough about how SCO uses shared > > libraries to get them moved over. And you must know general theory of > > operation of execution classes. > > Indeed. Where's the man page? There isn't one. Remember what I said before: 'I agree that there is a lot of missing "theory of operation" documentation'. This is still a hell of a lot different from an IBCS2 man page. > > And let me tell you, a simple (or even a complex) man page will sure > > as hell not cover it, especially without doing what Linux did and > > supplying our own IBCS2 shared libraries, etc. > > Why not? Because of a dislike of man pages on the part of the person > who should be writing them? Well, because: o that person is busy writing code o the code isn't done o you are asking them to document what the code will look like when it is done, and they don't know any more than you do because volunteer efforts code to code, not to spec, since it's not like you have the ability to fire them to bludgeon them into limiting themselves to a spec o once the code is done, the documentation you want would be about as useful to the average user as documentation for the "tbhresdecode" routine (a static routine in the kernel in tty_tb.c which is also not well documented) > > So who will use it? People who have this information already, people > > willing to dig it out of the sources, or people willing to ask questions > > of people who already know these things. > > > >> How do I go about finding out what's wrong here? > > > > Ask. > > RTFM. "Read The Fine Manual" is a great blow-off aphorism for not answering questions. If you ask, the annoyancy counter is incremented, and the documentation gets written to combat the annoyance. > >>> Typically, you don't document things that don't have parameters, options, > >>> or other controls. > >> > >> Speak for yourself. From my point of view, this is completely wrong. > > > > Are we talking "typically" (like I thought) or "ideally"? If "typically", > > then feel free to write man pages to make yourself right. "Typically" > > means in the common case, and if we pick a case at random (oh, say, IBCS2?) > > and examine it, we find the documentation unwritten except as source code. > > As I said, speak for yourself. If I release software, I document it. Even incomplete software? Full IBCS2 emulation is a hell of a lot more than simply supporting the execution class in the kernel. It's a full environment, including install tools, compatability shared libraries so that you don't have to have a licensed system whose libraries you can use by taking the licensed system offline, etc.. > > One problem is that the install > > configuration is not very reentrant. So fix it, you have the sources. > > First I need to know what the problem is. If I run into problems, the > first thing I do is read the man page. That's what I've been trying > to do, but I've come across this claim "There isn't one. There > doesn't need to be one." Look. If you want to work on the (incomplete) IBCS2 emulation, then you should know as much about it as the author -- or close to as much. If you aren't interested in doing that, then you aren't really interested in working on it. An that information is not something that can be contained in a man page, unless it's a 200+ page man page. Like the Intel document. Like all the related documents. > > Tell me, how is your hypothetical IBCS2 user, who will be using IBCS2 based > > apps, not system components like "vi" going to *load* his software without > > IBCS2 install tools? I know the answer to this one: they will do it by > > playing computer and running the install script by hand. Try Lotus 1-2-3 > > this way some day: I have. > > I don't know. I don't have the documentation. But I would guess that > he will run his install tools in the same environment that he would > use to run them. BZZZZT. This assumes that IBCS2 is completely functional. What's there right now is the ability to load the binaries, which is a far cry from an IBCS2 environment. An IBCS2 man page would document something that was only 10-20% there: an IBCS2 environment. You don't document what you don't have. > > The software is incomplete. You are incorrectly equating the kernel > > components (which are to be optioned at install time, if done correctly) > > with a full IBCS2 environment. > > Now here's the first statement with which I can agree. Fine, except > that I didn't know that (it didn't say that in the man page). Still, > a minimum of documentation would help even at this stage. So, what > remains to be done? o Shared libraries. o Install tools for IBCS2. o Install tools for SCO's package install system. o User documentation. o VM86() support; Lotus 1-2-3 already needs a kludged piece of VM86() code to make it not fail when it tries to determine the existance of a math coprocessor o Kernel compatability environment for drivers. o Streams for drivers (some packages include Streams components). o Implementation of install/packaging for FreeBSD based tools to get the environment in and out of the machine cleanly. o Demand loading of LKM's (and a new LKM system to do it with) so that when you attempt to run a binary, it loads the apropriate execution class module and any required support modules. o Modifications on VM layout based on object persistance to keep demand loading/unloading from fragmenting the kernel memory space. Specifically, a distinction between short (probe), medium (loadable module for non-system-critical components), and long (system critical and long service duration) persistance object code/data objects. The first four of these are bare minimum before an existing IBCS2 system would not be needed, along with explicit knowledge, to be able to use the emulation environment. The user doc is last intentionally: that's the order I would choose. The remaining five items are long term projects. I'm sure Soren and Sean, et al, could add to this list considerably, since I'm not even directly involved in the IBCS2 project (I'm more interested in revamping the execution class infrastructure to allow the use non-native instruction sets -- a big project itself). At some point, someone needs to beg/buy the Intel IBCS2 validation suite and run it agains the thing and pronounce it golden. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 12:52:56 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id MAA26868 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:52:56 -0800 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA26863 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:52:53 -0800 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id OAA11607; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:51:48 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199511272051.OAA11607@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: 3940? To: archive@cps.cmich.edu (Mail Archive) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:51:48 -0600 (CST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Mail Archive" at Nov 27, 95 03:08:19 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Can I use both channels of a 3940 adaptec or can I only use one side of > the card? Both work for me :-) > If I can use both, then would someone please give me an example of the > kernel config file and wiring down the drives.... Here's mine. AHA-3940 as secondary controller, on-board NCR PCI SCSI as primary controller: controller ncr0 controller ahc0 controller ahc1 at isa? bio irq ? vector ahcintr controller scbus0 at ncr0 disk sd0 at scbus0 target 0 unit 0 disk sd1 at scbus0 target 1 unit 0 disk sd2 at scbus0 target 2 unit 0 disk sd3 at scbus0 target 3 unit 0 disk sd4 at scbus0 target 4 unit 0 disk sd5 at scbus0 target 5 unit 0 disk sd6 at scbus0 target 6 unit 0 controller scbus1 at ahc0 disk sd10 at scbus1 target 0 unit 0 disk sd11 at scbus1 target 1 unit 0 disk sd12 at scbus1 target 2 unit 0 disk sd13 at scbus1 target 3 unit 0 disk sd14 at scbus1 target 4 unit 0 disk sd15 at scbus1 target 5 unit 0 disk sd16 at scbus1 target 6 unit 0 controller scbus2 at ahc1 disk sd20 at scbus2 target 0 unit 0 disk sd21 at scbus2 target 1 unit 0 disk sd22 at scbus2 target 2 unit 0 disk sd23 at scbus2 target 3 unit 0 disk sd24 at scbus2 target 4 unit 0 disk sd25 at scbus2 target 5 unit 0 disk sd26 at scbus2 target 6 unit 0 Ok ok ok so I got disks on the brain. Anyways. Note that I use "octal" type notation to make locating drives easier, "sd23" is unit 3 on bus 2... it certainly is not REQUIRED you name your devices in this fashion however!! Very arbitrary on my part. This box flies by the way ;-) ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 13:01:29 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA27547 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:01:29 -0800 Received: from iis (iis.webnet.com.au [203.8.105.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA27523 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:01:02 -0800 Received: from jazzy.phase-one.com.au (gw.phase-one.com.au [203.21.35.254]) by iis (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id IAA23844; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:04:35 +1100 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:01:44 +1100 (EST) From: Peter Marelas X-Sender: maral@jazzy.phase-one.com.au To: Luigi Rizzo cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2.1 release sysinstall In-Reply-To: <199511271312.OAA02066@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 27 Nov 1995, Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > Querying foreign hosts with SNMP is considered bad style, and is very > > unlikely to yield responses anyway. > > Personally I would like to use it to extract routing info from routers > on the path between my node and some destinations. > > I assume these info are already communicated to nearby nodes via > routed or some other protocol, so I don't believe there is much > "sensitive" information. Any ideas on whether this is considered > bad style or if there is an alternate/polite way of getting the same info ? > Run routed with -s to advertise its routes, that includes on all nodes. Btw, this is the default.. Gateways which can not be learn't, should be added in /etc/gateways and marked as passive (the route does not change due to any routing information received). ie. net foo.bar.com gateway gw.foo.bar.com metric X passive where X is the hop count (metric) But then, im not sure if additional routing information is what your after from these routers. Peter From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 13:09:04 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA28028 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:09:04 -0800 Received: from Sysiphos (Sysiphos.MI.Uni-Koeln.DE [134.95.212.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id NAA28019 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:08:43 -0800 Received: by Sysiphos id AA03114 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org); Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:08:02 +0100 Message-Id: <199511272108.AA03114@Sysiphos> From: se@zpr.uni-koeln.de (Stefan Esser) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:08:01 +0100 In-Reply-To: Ollivier Robert "Re: Translation Adaptec 1542 versus NCR810" (Nov 27, 8:50) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(2) 7/9/95) To: Ollivier Robert Subject: Re: Translation Adaptec 1542 versus NCR810 Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Nov 27, 8:50, Ollivier Robert wrote: } Subject: Re: Translation Adaptec 1542 versus NCR810 } It seems that Wilko Bulte said: } } > Quick question: is the translation mode used by a Adaptec 1542A (32 hd, } > 64 sect or the other way around (I always forget)) the same as the one } > used by a NCR810 ? } } I'm afraid not... Last time I installed a disk in a friend's machine with a } NCR, it used something like 33hd/63sect or 63hd/33 sect :-( The NCR bios ought to use the values the drive has been initialised with, if it has been used with an Adaptec before. If its a clean install, then the default geometry choosen by the NCR is in fact: near 1024 cylinders, upto 64 heads and upto 32 sectors per track, depending on the drive's capacity. If you want to move a drive between an Adaptec and an NCR, then be sure to initialise it on the Adaptec, the NCR will know how to deal with it. Regards, STefan -- Stefan Esser, Zentrum fuer Paralleles Rechnen Tel: +49 221 4706021 Universitaet zu Koeln, Weyertal 80, 50931 Koeln FAX: +49 221 4705160 ============================================================================== http://www.zpr.uni-koeln.de/~se From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 13:09:52 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA28098 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:09:52 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA28078 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:09:41 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA19524; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:04:54 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511272104.OAA19524@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? To: grog@lemis.de Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:04:54 -0700 (MST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199511271616.RAA05014@allegro.lemis.de> from "Greg Lehey" at Nov 27, 95 05:16:48 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 4191 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > In context, an executable. > > What kind of executable? A shell script, a FreeBSD binary executable, > a Linux executable, a BSD/OS executable, a NetBSD executable, an ibcs2 > COFF executable, or something else? That's a serious question. If > you don't know what it is, you can't (in a general case) tell how to > execute it. Actually, this is false. It is the problem of /sys/kern/kern_exec.c to figure this out on your behalf. It will either have an "image activator" (I prefer the term "execution class", since shell scripts are images, but whatever), or it won't. If the "magic number" doesn't match one of the intrinsic (compiled in) or extrinsic (loaded or scripted) binary types, you'll get a "Command not found" or an "Exec format error", depending on the permissions and your shell's handling of an ENOEXEC error return. So what kind of binary it is and whether or not it will run is pretty much independent of context. It's context free, with the exception of installing the option (treated as an opaque object by the install tools in an ideal world) needed to get the execution environment into the emulation directories and the execution class into the list in the kernel. > The correct thing to do here would be to follow it up, of course. > Which raises another question: how do you debug a COFF program? Easy question. > With a COFF debugger? Yes. > With a kernel debugger? No. Ask yourself "what is a debugging session?". The answer involves knowing how an executable in core image is treated by the system... binaries are treated as virtual address domains, and it doesn't matter the loader format that originated the binary in the first place. You use a COFF debugger because a debugger has to understand the symbol space for the program it's debugging. > Are you saying that writing free software is a justification for doing > it badly? I don't think that's the tenor of this group. The process is different. Not inferior, just different. > Maybe I should remind you of where I'm coming from. I'm not really > very interested in running the thing myself, but I'm writing a book on > installing FreeBSD, and I'm trying to explain this from Joe Schmoe's > viewpoint. So yes, I *do* intend to document the stuff. Again, I'm > not bitching about the quality of the stuff, nor particularly about > the missing documentation. I'm bitching about the attitude "don't > need docs". It would have helped us to know that you were intentionally adopting an obtuse viewpoint up front. Then we could have had a nice, quiet meta-discussion on the merits of the most recent release in that lights, where it falls down, and the fact that there is a huge difference in process in a volunteer effort. And that that is unlikely to change, and that maybe you need to label a bit more of the release code as "experimental" when you write about it, and then go into more detail on it. That would be the logical approach, unless you want to just omit "experimental" stuff as "out of the scope of this document" (a perfectly valid thing to do, though probably not as fun). Notifying us up front rather than adopting proof by exemplar would have put us all on your side in trying to put ourselves in Joe Schmoe's shoes instead of putting us in the position of dealing with "Joe Schmoe, professional adversary". > Enviable? You've obviously never worked much with SCO stuff :-) Yes, > I do have some COFF stuff which I could try out, and I probably will. > I don't understand the question of installation. If you can run COFF > binaries, you should be able to run the installation programs too. Or > am I missing something? The installation programs are part of the IBCS2 environment. They are shell scripts and binaries taken together (at least in the SCO case) and they do a lot more than simply putting programs in the spot they belong. Like key activation, serial number stamping, machine stamping to prevent the installed binary from being easily transportable, other copy protection issues, etc., etc.. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 13:12:53 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA28405 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:12:53 -0800 Received: from sovcom.kiae.su (sovcom.kiae.su [144.206.136.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id NAA28397 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:12:49 -0800 Received: by sovcom.kiae.su id AA13463 (5.65.kiae-1 ); Tue, 28 Nov 1995 00:01:13 +0300 Received: by sovcom.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Tue, 28 Nov 95 00:01:13 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by ache.dialup.demos.ru (8.6.12/8.6.12) id XAA01977; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:50:39 +0300 To: Nate Williams Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, nate@freebsd.org, Scott Mace References: <199511261623.KAA08479@metal.ops.neosoft.com> <199511271637.JAA14042@rocky.sri.MT.net> In-Reply-To: <199511271637.JAA14042@rocky.sri.MT.net>; from Nate Williams at Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:37:30 -0700 Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:50:38 +0300 (MSK) X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.41 FreeBSD] From: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: interesting tidbit from 2.1.0-RELEASE make world Lines: 18 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 754 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199511271637.JAA14042@rocky.sri.MT.net> Nate Williams writes: >[ Static link build ] >> Linking order of functions with same name is unpredictable with current ld >> when static used. It is long-standing bug without any progress. :-( >There *has* been progress on this bug, but not by me and the person >doing the work has been having technical difficulties with his net >connection. Have patience. :) Thank for good news. I await in hope. -- Andrey A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - http://dt.demos.su/~ache : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 13:13:33 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA28490 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:13:33 -0800 Received: from spot.lodgenet.com (lodgenet.iw.net [204.157.148.88]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA28344 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:12:06 -0800 Received: from jake.lodgenet.com (jake.lodgenet.com [204.124.120.30]) by spot.lodgenet.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id PAA19120; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:11:28 -0600 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jake.lodgenet.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id PAA06875; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:20:48 -0600 Message-Id: <199511272120.PAA06875@jake.lodgenet.com> X-Authentication-Warning: jake.lodgenet.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu cc: Bill/Carolyn Pechter , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape 2.0b3 In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:30:36 EST." <199511271830.NAA17467@fang.cs.sunyit.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:20:48 -0600 From: "Eric L. Hernes" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu writes: >} >} Symlink the correct mail spool with /usr/spool/mail. >} >} Bill >} ---- > > I prefer not to polute /usr if it can be avoided. > I agree, a quick persual through `strings -a netscape |less' reveals 5X>3 MAIL /usr/spool/mail/ USER %s%s =p-3 u:h_ <...more stuff deleted> I'd try setting my environment variable MAIL to /var/spool/mail > >-- >Charles Green UN*X System Administration >22 Powell Ave. Apt. B UN*X Security & >Whitesboro, NY 13492 Programming > eric. -- erich@lodgenet.com erich@rrnet.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 13:25:00 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA29517 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:25:00 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA29505 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:24:54 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA19564; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:20:05 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511272120.OAA19564@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Documentation.. To: maral@webnet.com.au (Peter Marelas) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:20:05 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Peter Marelas" at Nov 27, 95 09:46:56 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 452 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Due to all the argueing about the lack of documentation, why dont > we all stop bitching, and do ourselves a favour by writing docs, on > what we have experience in, when using freebsd, lets get the handbook > growing. For things like IBCS2, this would be makework. For others, this would be a good idea. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 13:29:33 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA29866 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:29:33 -0800 Received: from mail.barrnet.net (mail.barrnet.net [131.119.246.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA29858 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:29:27 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com ([198.17.250.211]) by mail.barrnet.net (8.7.1/MAIL-RELAY-LEN) with SMTP id NAA27044 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:27:52 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA19550; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:16:05 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511272116.OAA19550@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:16:05 -0700 (MST) Cc: grog@lemis.de, terry@lambert.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <2308.817494684@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 27, 95 09:51:24 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Aren't you guys having, like, multiple arguments here? I think we can > simplify this considerably. For one, any command that appears in > /usr/bin should have a man page. It's not just a good idea, it's the > law. The ibcs2 command belongs in /usr/sbin. If not /lkm or /usr/lkm. It's a command runnable only by root to load a kernel module. So yes, all things in /usr/bin should have a man page. But ibcs2 doesn't belong there (unless someone cleverly stuck it there in an attempt to get a man page written). It's a violation of the source/binary tree organization. > And to Terry, I don't think it's an unreasonable point to make that > our current ibcs2/linux setup documentation sucks. It does, believe > me. Why not read all the verbiage I had to stick into the > doom/executor READMEs in the commerce distribution if you don't > believe me? It is a work in progress. When it reached the level of completeness of "cvs" or even "ls", then it will deserve a [very small] man page hidden away in section 8. > There are kernel options that need to be reenabled, the module loaded > (also note that there may be an ibcs2=FOO line in sysconfig, but none > for Linux). It's not immediately obvious, and immediately obvious is > what it should be. This can be solved through a little more engineering > and probably a lot more documentation. Right now it's purely an install and completeness problem. You need to talk to the guy who builds the releases. 8-) 8-). Seriously, I don't think a new kernel should be necessary, and I don't think the sysconfig lines should be undocumented, and I *do* think the install should allow you to turn it on or off at will and be reentrant so the tools is always there to let you do it. If it's a documentation problem at all, it's on the order of WINE, which is a similar capability at only a slightly inferior stage of completion. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 13:30:32 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA29969 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:30:32 -0800 Received: from multivac.orthanc.com (root@multivac.orthanc.com [204.244.20.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA29956 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:30:26 -0800 Received: from localhost (lyndon@localhost) by multivac.orthanc.com (8.7/8.7) with SMTP id NAA21361; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:29:42 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199511272129.NAA21361@multivac.orthanc.com> X-Authentication-Warning: multivac.orthanc.com: Host lyndon@localhost didn't use HELO protocol From: Lyndon Nerenberg (VE7TCP) To: "Amancio Hasty Jr." cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 26 Nov 1995 16:37:28 PST." <199511270037.QAA00537@rah.star-gate.com> Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:29:40 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Amancio" == Amancio Hasty writes: Amancio> BTW: exmh has a cool installation procedure someone can Amancio> take a look. Yes, I know that it is probably not a one Amancio> to one match to an OS installation however the overall Amancio> general procedure is cool. Exmh has a rediculous installation interface that makes it impossible to install using make. Why oh why do people insist on reinventing make? Which is not to say that a tk script isn't a good way to build a GUI install front end, let's just not generalize this to everything else on the system, okay? The proper way to do this is with a C library to manipulate the config files, and curses and GUI (tk or whatever) frontends that do their real work by calling into the install library API. I've been investigating this approach as a way of automating the configuration of the firewall systems I sell. What I have scratched out on paper is a /config directory that contains the system configuration information in a form easily parsed by software, a library to access the info, hooks for the GUI (curses, command line, tk, whatever you like) to call the library, and a set of scripts to take /config/* and generate the actual system files. This is still in the pen-on-paper design stage. Working code is a couple of months away yet. --lyndon From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 14:05:29 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA03027 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:05:29 -0800 Received: from ix9.ix.netcom.com (ix9.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.9]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA03020 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:05:24 -0800 Received: from by ix9.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id OAA12892; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:04:49 -0800 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:04:49 -0800 Message-Id: <199511272204.OAA12892@ix9.ix.netcom.com> From: wilson15@ix.netcom.com (Charles R. Wilson ) Subject: joining development of FreeBSD To: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 14:20:12 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA04402 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:20:12 -0800 Received: from multivac.orthanc.com (root@multivac.orthanc.com [204.244.20.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA04311 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:19:59 -0800 Received: from localhost (lyndon@localhost) by multivac.orthanc.com (8.7/8.7) with SMTP id OAA22303; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:19:44 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199511272219.OAA22303@multivac.orthanc.com> X-Authentication-Warning: multivac.orthanc.com: Host lyndon@localhost didn't use HELO protocol From: Lyndon Nerenberg (VE7TCP) To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey), hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 17:16:48 +0100." <199511271616.RAA05014@allegro.lemis.de> Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:19:43 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk If you guys expended 1% of the effort you've invested in bitching about the missing man page into just writing a bloody man page this thread just might dry up and blow away. --lyndon From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 14:25:26 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA04848 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:25:26 -0800 Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [192.216.222.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA04833 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:25:20 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by who.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.11) with ESMTP id OAA08068 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:25:09 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id XAA11939 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:22:32 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA13963 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:22:31 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id WAA06773 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:46:43 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511272146.WAA06773@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Ethernet cards for FreeBsd To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:46:43 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511241811.KAA10768@freefall.freebsd.org> from "Justin T. Gibbs" at Nov 24, 95 10:11:33 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 537 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Justin T. Gibbs wrote: > > >What's the deal with these patches and us? > > I have them, and will be testing/committing them this coming week along > with some eisaconf changes for the driver. This is just to let'ya know that i've got a positive response that the "ep" driver is also actually working with 3c579 (EISA) cards. Perhpas this should be recorded somewhere. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 14:25:27 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA04855 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:25:27 -0800 Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [192.216.222.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA04842 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:25:21 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by who.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.11) with ESMTP id OAA08070 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:25:14 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id XAA11878 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:21:04 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA13932 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:21:03 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id WAA06836 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:58:28 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511272158.WAA06836@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: machine reboot & kernel maxusers option To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:58:28 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511260114.TAA28159@bonkers.taronga.com> from "Peter da Silva" at Nov 25, 95 07:14:40 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 666 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Peter da Silva wrote: > > J Wunsch wrote: > >I really don't like the two dozen ``foo: not found at address ...'' > >messages for the installation kernel. > > I like it. A lot. Mea culpa. I didn't like the two dozens of "Disabled. Not probed." messages (since they used to scroll off important messages too quickly, and i had to disable all the devices manually, so i do already know what's disabled and what not). Of course, the "not found..." ones are much more useful. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 14:25:59 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA04940 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:25:59 -0800 Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [192.216.222.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA04909 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:25:46 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by who.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.11) with ESMTP id OAA08026 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:24:24 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id XAA11874; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:21:01 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA13931; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:21:01 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id WAA06661; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:29:45 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511272129.WAA06661@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Argh, lost console :-( To: jgreco@solaria.sol.net (Joe Greco) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:29:45 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511271510.JAA28202@solaria.sol.net> from "Joe Greco" at Nov 27, 95 09:10:46 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 667 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Joe Greco wrote: > > > Put a "sleep 2" (or some other activity) behind, in order to allow xdm > > to properly daemonize itself. > > That's not the problem (I actually do an "fsck -y /dev/homepartition" after > launching xdm which takes longer than a few seconds)... xdm is running just > dandy and X comes up "fine" - but the kbd isn't there. A console driver bug? At least, the above works for me. (With either syscons or pcvt, this is on some #9 graphics card, some of the newer S3 764 chips.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 14:27:11 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA05045 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:27:11 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA05028 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:26:55 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id XAA11893; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:21:11 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA13936; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:21:10 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id XAA06957; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:08:42 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511272208.XAA06957@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Probing KBD. To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:08:42 +0100 (MET) Cc: stesin@elvisti.kiev.ua Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511251901.GAA30226@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Nov 26, 95 06:01:55 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 547 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Bruce Evans wrote: > > syscons is supposed to print "scprobe: keyboard won't accept reset > command" and continue, but because of the bug it rarely prints this > (never if there is a keyboard attached). Btw., i've been bugging Hellmuth Michaelis long enough to fix it for pcvt. :-) I think the syscons fix is known to Søren, at least for the hang-while-probing-at-init-time bug. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 14:45:12 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA06184 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:45:12 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA06173 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:45:04 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id OAA21796; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:43:21 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511272243.OAA21796@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: that's odd ;) To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:43:20 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <22025.817504933@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 27, 95 12:42:13 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 441 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Do you still have a /usr/share/doc? > yes, though some docs didn't make very well.. > > > > I installed the latest -current today.. over one a month or so old.. > > it got smaller.. > > I ended up with 5000 blocks free and I started with about 1500 > > > > ? > > I was sure I was going to over-flow.. > > I mean, since when was a newer release of ANYTHING smaller than it;s > > predecessor? > > > > julian > > > > (happy) > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 15:27:11 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA09374 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:27:11 -0800 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA09365 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:27:05 -0800 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.50]) by Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id PAA11057; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:27:02 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with SMTP id PAA00141; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:27:01 -0800 Message-Id: <199511272327.PAA00141@corbin.Root.COM> To: Joe Greco cc: archive@cps.cmich.edu (Mail Archive), freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 3940? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 95 14:51:48 CST." <199511272051.OAA11607@brasil.moneng.mei.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:26:56 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Anyways. Note that I use "octal" type notation to make locating drives >easier, "sd23" is unit 3 on bus 2... it certainly is not REQUIRED you name >your devices in this fashion however!! Very arbitrary on my part. That's what I do on wcarchive, too. -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 15:47:47 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA10784 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:47:47 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA10779 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:47:39 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id MAA22034; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:42:13 -0800 To: Julian Elischer cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: that's odd ;) In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 05:31:51 PST." <199511271331.FAA20926@ref.tfs.com> Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:42:13 -0800 Message-ID: <22025.817504933@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Do you still have a /usr/share/doc? > > I installed the latest -current today.. over one a month or so old.. > it got smaller.. > I ended up with 5000 blocks free and I started with about 1500 > > ? > I was sure I was going to over-flow.. > I mean, since when was a newer release of ANYTHING smaller than it;s > predecessor? > > julian > > (happy) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 15:47:53 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA10800 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:47:53 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA10786 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:47:47 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id MAA23357; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:43:14 -0800 To: kelly@fsl.noaa.gov (Sean Kelly) cc: phk@critter.tfs.com, sos@freebsd.org, cshenton@apollo.hq.nasa.gov, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:49:49 MST." <9511271449.AA16349@emu.fsl.noaa.gov> Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:43:13 -0800 Message-ID: <23348.817504993@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > We could at least provide reasonable skeleton dot files that would set > up an attractive X11 interface, after the install's complete > ... perhaps to continue the installation of packages, set up user > accounts, install printer stuff, etc. Yes yes yes. So, is it going to be my .fvwmrc going into ~root or does someone want to attack this in a more structured fashion from the ground up? :) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 15:52:59 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA11446 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:52:59 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA11435 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:52:27 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA19930; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:47:30 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511272347.QAA19930@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? To: lyndon@orthanc.com (Lyndon Nerenberg) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:47:30 -0700 (MST) Cc: grog@lemis.de, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199511272219.OAA22303@multivac.orthanc.com> from "Lyndon Nerenberg" at Nov 27, 95 02:19:43 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2652 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > If you guys expended 1% of the effort you've invested in bitching about > the missing man page into just writing a bloody man page this thread just > might dry up and blow away. That'd probably be true, IF this were a problem that a man page could fix. It's NOT. What would you suggest for content? You have to know that you want IBCS2 to run SCO binaries... did you know that before the discussion started? "Intel Binary Compatability Standard, Version 2" hardly leaps to mind when someone says "SCO". Personally, I think of SCO. There isn't a "FreeBSD" man page yet. You have to have an existing SCO system to get the shared libraries from. The audience is now limited to people who are aware that COFF format IBCS2 binaries are what SCO runs, and who already own SCO systems. You have to manually install the libraries once you have them, since they can't be legally distributed. Now we're limited to people who used to run SCO, but now don't, but they've kept their SCO binaries. You can't get the libraries off the SCO install disk without a lot of work that varies from SVO minor version to minor version. We're now limited to people who are aware that COFF format IBCS2 binaries are what SCO runs, already own SCO systems, and have SCO on a hard drive somewhere so that they can pull the libraries of an existing system. So lets all spend weeks writing stuff up for this limited audience, right? You have to have certain kernel options for binary compatability. This is an integration problem, not a documentation problem. Once it's handled, it won't need doc, and handling it is less work. Why hasn't it been handled? The code isn't to the "package it for end users stage" yet. It's still being changed, it's still fluid. You have to understand the whole concept of an emulation environment better than a man page could explain it to install any binaries that would be useful in the environment once you had it. Somone needs to document that first -- only that's probably going to be changing because of some of the non-Intel architecture work and some of the system call interface changes that have been proposed. So any doc written now is going to be outdated before it is published. At the current state of developement, you are suggesting something as large as, or larger than, the WINE FAQ. Where is the "wine man page"? The usability problems are currently a big hulking behemoth. You can't fix them using a man page as a bandaid. Now do you understand? Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 15:53:46 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA11487 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:53:46 -0800 Received: from nwnexus.wa.com (nwnexus.wa.com [192.135.191.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id PAA11479 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:53:42 -0800 Received: by nwnexus.wa.com id AA15589 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org); Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:53:34 -0800 Received: (from gfm@localhost) by angel.readybox.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) id PAA00293 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:42:46 -0800 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:42:46 -0800 From: Frank McCormick Message-Id: <199511272342.PAA00293@angel.readybox.com> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2.0.5R: SCSI hang and panic... HELP Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Mike Borowiec wrote > > I'm having tape drive problems... > I'm trying to back-up my 2.0.5R machine to 8mm Exabyte, but every time > I get close to finishing my tar backup, this happens: > > ahc0: target 0, lun 0 (sd0) timed out > ahc0: target 0, lun 0 (sd0) timed out > ...[repeats]... > > SCSI bus hangs, and I'm forced to reboot system... > > [...] > > The machine is a 486DX50 EISA/VESA w/16MB, with an Adaptec 2742AT EISA > SCSI card. > Responses that just say, "Me, too," aren't particularly useful, I know. However, at the risk of uselessness, I'd like to say, "Me, too." I have similar symptoms under an aging 1.1R box. Similarities include having an EISA/VESA motherboard, an Adaptec host adapter and an Exabyte tape drive. The differences include having a 1542B, rather than Mike's 2742AT, and a 4mm Exabyte. (Exabyte's 4mm products are rebadged from some corporate acquisition. The name of the actual manufacturer of what is now the Exabyte 4mm line escapes me.) The part that strikes me as even weirder is that my box makes it through a full backup about three times out of four. The symptoms described above arise for me about a quarter of the time. When it does fall over, I get a lot of spooky console messages about the 1542 debugger being called. As far as I know, I've never lost any data, but it's an unpleasant phenomenon. Anyone with solutions gets free beer in heaven. Frank McCormick From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 15:56:10 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA11769 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:56:10 -0800 Received: from fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov (fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov [137.75.131.171]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id PAA11689 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 15:56:06 -0800 Received: by fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov (5.57/Ultrix3.0-C) id AA17063; Mon, 27 Nov 95 17:56:05 -0600 Received: by emu.fsl.noaa.gov (1.38.193.4/SMI-4.1 (1.38.193.4)) id AA19496; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:56:04 -0700 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:56:04 -0700 From: kelly@fsl.noaa.gov (Sean Kelly) Message-Id: <9511272356.AA19496@emu.fsl.noaa.gov> To: henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu Cc: sos@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511271715.MAA04833@crh.cl.msu.edu> (message from Charles Henrich on Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:15:19 -0500) Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Jordan" == Jordan K. Hubbard jkh@time.cdrom.com> writes: >>>>> "Charles" == Charles Henrich writes: Jordan> [much deleted] Charles> Bravo Bravo, my thougnts exactly. The idea of booting Charles> into X for an install is the silliest thing I have ever Charles> heard. Maybe you guys ought to reread the [much deleted] part. There's NOTHING in there that says we ought to boot into X for an install! -- Sean Kelly NOAA Forecast Systems Laboratory, Boulder Colorado USA I was in the first submarine. Instead of a periscope, they had a kaleidoscope. "We're surrounded." -- Steven Wright From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 16:13:21 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA13294 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:13:21 -0800 Received: from multivac.orthanc.com (root@multivac.orthanc.com [204.244.20.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA13277 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:13:11 -0800 Received: from localhost (lyndon@localhost) by multivac.orthanc.com (8.7/8.7) with SMTP id QAA23175; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:11:51 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199511280011.QAA23175@multivac.orthanc.com> X-Authentication-Warning: multivac.orthanc.com: Host lyndon@localhost didn't use HELO protocol From: Lyndon Nerenberg (VE7TCP) To: Terry Lambert cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:47:30 MST." <199511272347.QAA19930@phaeton.artisoft.com> Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:11:49 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Well, going by your argument the man page for cc(1) should also document the programming language and libraries, n'est ce pas? Should we also incorporate a copy of Stevens in tcp(4)? The man page should document the fact the iBCS2 support exists, give three short examples of how to enable the support (compile into kernel, invoke from sysconfig, load from command line), refer the reader to the non-existent handbook section describing all the ugly details of the implementation, and include a warning that the code is preliminary and shouldn't be used unless you're willing to do some digging into the source code. Call the manpage ibcs2(8) and create a link called sco(4) (or maybe sco(5)?). This makes the two obvious targets for apropos work, and let's people discover fairly easily that SCO support does exist, while making no bones about the fact that its use is not for the timid. --lyndon From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 16:21:08 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA13978 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:21:08 -0800 Received: from bacchus.eng.umd.edu (bacchus.eng.umd.edu [129.2.94.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA13973 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:21:01 -0800 Received: from latte.eng.umd.edu (latte.eng.umd.edu [129.2.98.15]) by bacchus.eng.umd.edu (8.7/8.7) with ESMTP id TAA16266; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:20:36 -0500 (EST) Received: (chuckr@localhost) by latte.eng.umd.edu (8.7.2/8.6.4) id TAA18143; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:20:35 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:20:35 -0500 (EST) From: Chuck Robey X-Sender: chuckr@latte.eng.umd.edu To: Greg Lehey cc: Michael Smith , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? In-Reply-To: <199511271616.RAA05014@allegro.lemis.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 27 Nov 1995, Greg Lehey wrote: > > BTW, 'which' is broken. It doesn't pay any attention to the PATH > environment variable, so it can't tell you which one you'll run, just > the one it thinks most likeley. This can be *very* confusing for a > newbie. > > Greg, I hope I haven't taken your remark above too out of context, but I'd like to contest your assertion of 'which' being broken, seeing as it works quite well for me. I know it certainly does take MY path into account. Could you explain why you think it's broken? ============================================================================ Chuck Robey chuckr@eng.umd.edu -- I run FreeBSD on n3lxx and Journey2 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Dilbert Zone is Dilbert's new WWW home! The area features never-before-seen original sketches of Dilbert, a photo tour of Scott Adams' studio, Dilbert Trivia and memorabilia, high school photos and much more!: From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 16:26:37 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA14242 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:26:37 -0800 Received: from linux4nn.iaf.nl (root@linux4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA14234 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:26:28 -0800 Received: from uni4nn.iaf.nl (root@uni4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.33]) by linux4nn.iaf.nl (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id BAA01679; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 01:27:02 +0100 Received: by uni4nn.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA06000 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Tue, 28 Nov 1995 01:26:47 +0100 Received: by iafnl.es.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA01969 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4); Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:42:41 +0100 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA00540; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 00:21:27 +0100 From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199511272321.AAA00540@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: Translation Adaptec 1542 versus NCR810 To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 00:21:26 +0100 (MET) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511270750.IAA21813@keltia.freenix.fr> from "Ollivier Robert" at Nov 27, 95 08:50:53 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 933 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > It seems that Wilko Bulte said: > > > Quick question: is the translation mode used by a Adaptec 1542A (32 hd, > > 64 sect or the other way around (I always forget)) the same as the one > > used by a NCR810 ? > > I'm afraid not... Last time I installed a disk in a friend's machine with a > NCR, it used something like 33hd/63sect or 63hd/33 sect :-( > -- > Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net Hmmm, _very_ strange. I just crossed my fingers and tried moving the disk from the Adaptec to the NCR. Worked right away. So, it seems my translation is identical for NCR and Adaptec Wilko _ __________________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 16:27:01 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA14284 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:27:01 -0800 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA14276 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:26:59 -0800 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id SAA11815; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:25:19 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199511280025.SAA11815@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: 3940? To: davidg@root.com Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:25:18 -0600 (CST) Cc: archive@cps.cmich.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511272327.PAA00141@corbin.Root.COM> from "David Greenman" at Nov 27, 95 03:26:56 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >Anyways. Note that I use "octal" type notation to make locating drives > >easier, "sd23" is unit 3 on bus 2... it certainly is not REQUIRED you name > >your devices in this fashion however!! Very arbitrary on my part. > > That's what I do on wcarchive, too. Related, but not really: pet peeve of the day: DK_NDRIVE is set to 8 in sys/dkstat.h. This effectively limits the number of drives I can get statistics on - statistics that would tend to be more useful the more drives I have. Is there any harm in increasing this? My news box has a dozen disks. (I also noticed: extern int dk_busy; /* bit field of busy drives */ which is sorta scary :-) wonder how many other places there are hidden limits built in?) ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 16:36:16 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA15006 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:36:16 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA14996 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:36:13 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA00855; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:34:41 -0800 To: Bakul Shah cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:37:18 PST." <199511271937.LAA05263@netcom22.netcom.com> Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:34:41 -0800 Message-ID: <853.817518881@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > put in links for help files etc. I really should put > together a prototype.... anyway, if anyone is interested we > can explore this idea further. I'd like to see the prototype.. :-) Believe me, this idea has crossed my mind more than once. In another mailing list, I was talking with some folks for awhile about the idea of implementing "http server" capability for existing applications. Instead of going for a full httpd and CGI interface, you implement a library that allows pretty much any event driven application to "grow an HTTP port". You write your "forms" in a higher level pastiche of HTML and some sort of imbeded tags that let you specify which callback routines to call when a given HTML object is manipulated in some way. The viewer would see HTML, your legacy app would see a different sort of command interpreter. Would you be interested in exploring an option like that, as well as the option of using existing server technology and CGI? Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 16:38:16 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA15097 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:38:16 -0800 Received: from haywire.DIALix.COM (peter@haywire.DIALix.COM [192.203.228.65]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA15083 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:38:06 -0800 Received: (from peter@localhost) by haywire.DIALix.COM (sendmail) id IAA03256; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:37:49 +0800 (WST) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:37:48 +0800 (WST) From: Peter Wemm To: Bruce Evans cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: How can I remove hard links between directories? In-Reply-To: <199511271830.FAA20667@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 28 Nov 1995, Bruce Evans wrote: > >or things like inn's fastrm program that have to test if the euid == > >0, and if so, it has to stat() every single file it's processing to > >make sure it's not about to unlink a directory and running much slower > >from the extra overhead.. (side note, always expire news as uid > >"news" for this very reason). > > Why would it be much slower? unlink() is very slow if writes are > synchronous. Here repeated stats of the same file take 81 usec while > creat+close+unlink of the same file takes 5000 usec. Because if it's running as root, it has to stat() the filenames first to make sure it's not going to accidently unlink a directory (recent example: the newsgroup alt.2600.441 was created in the alt.2600 article stream). Actually, my use of "much" is probably wrong as long as some of the work to do the stat() call is cached and reused for the unlink(). I have not used fastrm as root on FreeBSD, but I remember some pretty damning comments from Rich Salz/Robert Elz on the subject for SunOS. -Peter > Bruce > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 16:38:18 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA15104 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:38:18 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA15086 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:38:10 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA00875; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:36:08 -0800 To: cg@www.ati.khs-linz.ac.at cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: To all fbsdboot and winboot users ... In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:47:33 +0100." Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:36:07 -0800 Message-ID: <872.817518967@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I'd like to know, if fbsdboot and winboot work with Win95?! Is there > anybody out there with some experience? I tried it. It died. Dies under NT too, but I expect you knew that.. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 16:40:12 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA15338 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:40:12 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA15271 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:40:07 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA00886; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:39:30 -0800 To: sos@freebsd.org cc: cshenton@apollo.hq.nasa.gov, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:05:10 +0100." <199511272005.VAA16874@ra.dkuug.dk> Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:39:30 -0800 Message-ID: <884.817519170@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > If this is the way we want to go, I'm sure I can find the > time to get it running.... Well, I'd certainly take the mouse abilities! I played with Linux's "gmp" a little bit and have to say - it's pretty useful. If you're not an X person but like to use VTYs, it's the only way to do it reasonably painlessly. :) A libvga would also be interesting, of course! Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 16:43:20 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA15597 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:43:20 -0800 Received: from expo.x.org (expo.x.org [198.112.45.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA15590 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:43:15 -0800 Received: from exalt.x.org by expo.x.org id AA22065; Mon, 27 Nov 95 19:42:40 -0500 Received: from localhost by exalt.x.org id AAA12602; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 00:42:39 GMT Message-Id: <199511280042.AAA12602@exalt.x.org> To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: gcc-2.7.1 compiled kernel Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:42:38 EDT From: "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk FYI, 2.1.0R is running fine so far on a 2.7.1 compiled kernel. The kernel is negligibly smaller (~4k) -- Kaleb KEITHLEY From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 17:06:44 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA16855 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 17:06:44 -0800 Received: from gateway.bose.com (root@gateway.bose.com [139.68.136.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA16849 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 17:06:38 -0800 Received: from mingus.bose.com by gateway.bose.com (8.6.12/BoseFirewall.1.0) id UAA07850; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 20:06:35 -0500 Received: from calloway.bose.com (blackhole) by mingus.bose.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA07686; Mon, 27 Nov 95 20:06:33 EST Message-Id: <9511280106.AA07686@mingus.bose.com> X-Sender: mercierm@mailhost X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.1.1 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 20:06:36 -0500 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: "Marc A. Mercier" Subject: Better scsi and e-net support... Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Sorry to be a jerk, but I find it hard to believe that there are more people out in the US that have a Compaq DeskPro XL or an HP Vectra XU that use the AMD PCI PCnet / PCscsi controller, other than myself. (since it is integrated into the motherboard) Is there someplace or someone that has a patch so I can at least install the damn OS? :| I have been trying to install FreeBSD v2.0 off and on since I bought it in March, to only get as far as the install screen from the boot floppy. Is there some sort of generic PCI SCSI driver I might use? Bitch, bitch, look-in-wallet-that-has-lost-forty-bucks, Marc A. Mercier ----- Marc A. Mercier PC Service / Support Engineer Bose Corporation The Mountain Framingham, MA 01701 (508) 879-1916 x66564 mercierm@bose.com -=*OR*=- Doctor_PC@msn.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 17:31:15 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA18594 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 17:31:15 -0800 Received: from multivac.orthanc.com (root@multivac.orthanc.com [204.244.20.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA18588 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 17:31:09 -0800 Received: from localhost (lyndon@localhost) by multivac.orthanc.com (8.7/8.7) with SMTP id RAA23749 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 17:31:04 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199511280131.RAA23749@multivac.orthanc.com> X-Authentication-Warning: multivac.orthanc.com: Host lyndon@localhost didn't use HELO protocol From: Lyndon Nerenberg VE7TCP To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: ibcs2(8) X-Attribution: VE7TCP Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 17:31:01 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk What's wrong with something like this? It documents the fact that iBCS2 support exists, and that it's not for the timid (yet). .Dd November 27, 1995 .Dt IBCS2 8 .Os FreeBSD-Experimental .Sh NAME .Nm ibcs2 .Nd load iBCS2 runtime support for SCO and ISC binaries .Sh SYNOPSIS .Nm ibcs2 .Sh DESCRIPTION The .Nm utility loads kernel runtime support for iBCS2 compliant programs. This runtime support is limited to emulation of the iBCS2 system call interface, and is far from complete. COFF binaries and shared libraries are supported, however no shared libraries are provided with the FreeBSD distribution. .Sh FILES .Bl -tag -width /lkm/ibcs2_coff.o -compact .It Pa /lkm/ibcs2_mod.o .It Pa /lkm/ibcs2_coff.o iBCS2 loadable kernel modules .Sh "SEE ALSO" .Pa /sys/i386/ibcs2/README.iBCS2 , .Xr modload 8 , .Xr lkm 4 .Sh BUGS The emulation is very incomplete. .Pp Running dynamically linked binaries requires access to an existing SCO system from which you can grab the shared libraries. .Pp You can't really use this without reading the source code. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 18:14:59 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA21124 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:14:59 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA21119 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:14:55 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id SAA22317; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:14:30 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511280214.SAA22317@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: Better scsi and e-net support... To: mercierm@bose.com (Marc A. Mercier) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:14:30 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <9511280106.AA07686@mingus.bose.com> from "Marc A. Mercier" at Nov 27, 95 08:06:36 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1235 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Sorry to be a jerk, but I find it hard to believe that there are more people > out in the US that have a Compaq DeskPro XL or an HP Vectra XU that use the > AMD PCI PCnet / PCscsi controller, other than myself. (since it is > integrated into the motherboard) never heard of it... What drivers we have is dependent on what hardware is owned by people who write drivers.. It appears that none of these people have the AMD mumble chips :| what can I say? > Is there someplace or someone that has a patch so I can at least install the > damn OS? :| > I have been trying to install FreeBSD v2.0 off and on since I bought it in > March, to only get as far as the install screen from the boot floppy. > Is there some sort of generic PCI SCSI driver I might use? Why not contact AMD and ask them for programming specs.. and write the driver(s)? then You'd KNOW it was supported.. did you mention before that there's aLinux driver? a good place to start. > > Bitch, bitch, look-in-wallet-that-has-lost-forty-bucks, > > Marc A. Mercier > ----- > Marc A. Mercier > PC Service / Support Engineer > Bose Corporation > The Mountain > Framingham, MA 01701 > (508) 879-1916 x66564 > mercierm@bose.com -=*OR*=- Doctor_PC@msn.com > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 18:15:13 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA21157 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:15:13 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA21130 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:14:59 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id CAA06653; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 02:08:12 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511280208.CAA06653@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. To: bakul@netcom.com (Bakul Shah) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 02:08:11 +0000 () Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511271937.LAA05263@netcom22.netcom.com> from "Bakul Shah" at Nov 27, 95 11:37:18 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2254 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Bakul Shah stands accused of saying: > > Have you considered using one of the free http clients & > servers to implement the user interface and call cgi scripts > with user specified input? Hmm. So, for ram<8M, we do text, for 8M I think I suggested this once before to you but after this > experience I am convinced that this is the way to do a lot > of configuration, system administration etc. You can use an > ASCII based client when X is not available and use X based > client when it is. If you can get unix upto the point where > httpd can run and networking is up you can even do remote > installation. This really isn't a silly idea for administration, but AFAIK (not being an expert on these things), there isn't a _small_ http server around, that can run on minimal configuration (read: almost none) > I realise that much groundwork remains to be done and even > if we did this, actual installation problems still need to > be solved, but at least as a model this should be > considered. For instance, rather than defining your own > forms language just use HTML. HTML will also allow you to > put in links for help files etc. I really should put > together a prototype.... anyway, if anyone is interested we > can explore this idea further. It certainly beats the hell out of inventing another forms language. The possibilities for managing most of the install from a seperate node are also attractive. I've always felt that the best way of managing an installation on a headless router would be to point the console stuff somewhere else; this would be one way of doing it. (A "click here" link that brings up a telnet session to the 'install-debug" port 8) So many ideas 8) > --bakul (note followups, as suggested by Jordan, to install@freebsd.org) -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 18:21:29 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA21782 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:21:29 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA21777 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:21:26 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id TAA20283; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:16:14 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511280216.TAA20283@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? To: lyndon@orthanc.com (Lyndon Nerenberg) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:16:14 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511280011.QAA23175@multivac.orthanc.com> from "Lyndon Nerenberg" at Nov 27, 95 04:11:49 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1572 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Well, going by your argument the man page for cc(1) should also document > the programming language and libraries, n'est ce pas? Should we also > incorporate a copy of Stevens in tcp(4)? Hardly. My argument doesn't affect tcp(4), which documents socket(). If IBCS2 added a function, I'd agree. It doesn't. It adds nothing visibile to the user. > The man page should document the fact the iBCS2 support exists, > give three short examples of how to enable the support (compile into > kernel, invoke from sysconfig, load from command line), refer the > reader to the non-existent handbook section describing all the ugly > details of the implementation, and include a warning that the code > is preliminary and shouldn't be used unless you're willing to do some > digging into the source code. By this argument, tcp(4) should document how to take TCP out of the kernel. It doesn't. 8-). > Call the manpage ibcs2(8) and create a link called sco(4) (or maybe sco(5)?). > This makes the two obvious targets for apropos work, and let's people > discover fairly easily that SCO support does exist, while making no > bones about the fact that its use is not for the timid. Feel free to implement this if you think it's a worthwhile effort. I personally think that given the amount of traffic on this lowly topic, the next install will handle optioning it in and out as modules and it will be documented there. Problem solved. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 18:41:51 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA23524 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:41:51 -0800 Received: from cory.EECS.Berkeley.EDU (cory-138.EECS.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.138.81]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA23519 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:41:49 -0800 Received: (jmacd@localhost) by cory.EECS.Berkeley.EDU (8.6.11/8.6.4) id SAA12560 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:41:36 -0800 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:41:36 -0800 From: Josh MacDonald Message-Id: <199511280241.SAA12560@cory.EECS.Berkeley.EDU> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: gcc 2.1.7 (and libg++) Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I haven't seen anything on this list about this, so I'll ask: gcc 2.7.1 was recently release, and it seems things compile this time around, whereas 2.7.0's libg++ was totally broken. I'm kind of tired of gcc 2.6.3 and all its bugs, I want some new bugs to play with. Unfortunatly I don't know enough about freebsd's linker and assemlber to get things going. I tried compiling things out of the box, it configured and built fine, but the assembly it produced had some '.weak' macro that /usr/bin/as didn't understand. I tried GNU's binutils version 2.6 to get it working but my problems only grew. I figured that the assembler should be producing code that would link okay, but it wasn't. I tried building the GNU linker too, and it liked the stuff the assembler was producing but not the old libraries(crt0.o). I don't know object formats, can someone help? Is the core team planning on moving to the new version sometime? I'm working on a project for school in C++ and its a pain having to deal with different versions of gcc, and gcc-2.6.3's c++ has more bugs than 2.7.x I'm pretty sure. -josh From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 18:47:53 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA23944 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:47:53 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA23936 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:47:47 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id DAA21798 ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 03:47:43 +0100 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id DAA10019 ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 03:47:42 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.7.1/keltia-uucp-2.6) id DAA26416; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 03:37:36 +0100 (MET) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199511280237.DAA26416@keltia.freenix.fr> Subject: Re: Netscape 2.0b3 To: chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 03:37:36 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199511271612.LAA16745@fang.cs.sunyit.edu> from "chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu" at Nov 27, 95 11:12:53 am X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1378 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8b] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It seems that chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu said: > Anyone try to use the mail window of the new netscape? It searches > for the mail spool directory in /usr/spool/mail. Any ideas on how we > can get get around this? I will probably have to duck under the table to avoid several pieces of furniture (sp?) by saying the following but anytime I see people raving about Netscape (I don't speak about you, it is a general feeling) I want to say this: Use a real mail programs to read mail. Use a real newsreader to read News. Don't use netscape. It is a pretty decent WWW browser (if you forget some stupid proprietary extentions) and *it should stay a WWW browser*. Netscape reminds me of all the integrated program like Synphony, Jazz and Framework that tried to do everything but the coffee and failed everywhere at some point. Netscape is big, bloated and come without sources. They forgot the Unix philosophy of KISS. I use it sometime when I need to see some graphical page and Lynx the rest of the time. I should recompiled Mosaic 2.7 to avoid Netscape but I'm lazy and it will be almost as big as Netscape due to Motif. Fire away... -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #7: Mon Nov 6 21:08:06 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 18:48:37 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA24151 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:48:37 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA24065 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:48:15 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id DAA21790 ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 03:47:41 +0100 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id DAA10013 ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 03:47:41 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.7.1/keltia-uucp-2.6) id DAA26264; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 03:16:22 +0100 (MET) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199511280216.DAA26264@keltia.freenix.fr> Subject: Re: Translation Adaptec 1542 versus NCR810 To: se@zpr.uni-koeln.de (Stefan Esser) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 03:16:21 +0100 (MET) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511272108.AA03114@Sysiphos> from "Stefan Esser" at Nov 27, 95 10:08:01 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1378 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8b] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk It seems that Stefan Esser said: > The NCR bios ought to use the values the drive > has been initialised with, if it has been used > with an Adaptec before. If its a clean install, In that case, the drive was out of the box, first configured with the geometry displayed by the drive and it didn't boot. I then took the total number of sectors, divided by the values of sect/trk and heads displayed by "boot -v" and calculated the # of cylinders. It booted like a charm. The boot problem may have been caused by the 2.0.5 MBR manager though. Without any boot MGR at all, no problem to boot. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #7: Mon Nov 6 21:08:06 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 19:05:17 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA25154 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:05:17 -0800 Received: from cwbone.bsi.com.br ([200.250.250.14]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA25141 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:05:05 -0800 Received: from cwbtwo.bsi.com.br (cwbtwo [200.250.250.2]) by cwbone.bsi.com.br (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA23730; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 01:05:18 GMT Received: (from lenzi@localhost) by cwbtwo.bsi.com.br (8.6.11/8.6.9) id BAA05126; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 01:03:31 GMT Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 01:03:30 +0000 () From: Sergio Lenzi To: hackers@freebsd.org cc: ports@freegsd.org Subject: INGRES 8.9 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi all. Finaly the Ingres version 8.9 bugless (I hope) is in a USA site (freefall.cdrom.com) file names: ingresbin.tar.gz and ingressrc.tar.gz they are in package format.. Any questions, please mail me. Sergio de Almeida Lenzi. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 19:12:36 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA25493 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:12:36 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA25483 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:12:28 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id TAA22415; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:11:26 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511280311.TAA22415@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: ibcs2(8) To: lyndon@orthanc.com (Lyndon Nerenberg VE7TCP) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:11:25 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511280131.RAA23749@multivac.orthanc.com> from "Lyndon Nerenberg VE7TCP" at Nov 27, 95 05:31:01 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 80 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk ship it > > What's wrong with something like this? It documents the fact that From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 19:15:42 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA25621 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:15:42 -0800 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA25615 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:15:37 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA23136; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:14:45 -0800 Message-Id: <199511271914.LAA23136@rah.star-gate.com> X-Authentication-Warning: rah.star-gate.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: Lyndon Nerenberg (VE7TCP) cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:29:40 PST." <199511272129.NAA21361@multivac.orthanc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:14:44 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>> Lyndon Nerenberg said: > >>>>> "Amancio" == Amancio Hasty writes: > > Amancio> BTW: exmh has a cool installation procedure someone can > Amancio> take a look. Yes, I know that it is probably not a one > Amancio> to one match to an OS installation however the overall > Amancio> general procedure is cool. > > Exmh has a rediculous installation interface that makes it impossible > to install using make. Why oh why do people insist on reinventing make? Cool , if you think using make for installing exmh is such a great idea why don't you post on exmh-workers@Sun.COM. Besides you missed the whole point --- to install an interactive package or relevant to the thread an operating system.... Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 19:23:46 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA25988 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:23:46 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA25981 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:23:41 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA01480; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:22:30 -0800 To: "Marc A. Mercier" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Better scsi and e-net support... In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 20:06:36 EST." <9511280106.AA07686@mingus.bose.com> Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:22:30 -0800 Message-ID: <1477.817528950@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk You're saying that you bought the CD from Walnut Creek CDROM? Please give me your postal address info and I will arrange a refund for you. Unless you're willing to write such drivers yourself, I don't see them as being immediately forthcoming. Jordan > Sorry to be a jerk, but I find it hard to believe that there are more people > out in the US that have a Compaq DeskPro XL or an HP Vectra XU that use the > AMD PCI PCnet / PCscsi controller, other than myself. (since it is > integrated into the motherboard) > Is there someplace or someone that has a patch so I can at least install the > damn OS? :| > I have been trying to install FreeBSD v2.0 off and on since I bought it in > March, to only get as far as the install screen from the boot floppy. > Is there some sort of generic PCI SCSI driver I might use? > > Bitch, bitch, look-in-wallet-that-has-lost-forty-bucks, > > Marc A. Mercier > ----- > Marc A. Mercier > PC Service / Support Engineer > Bose Corporation > The Mountain > Framingham, MA 01701 > (508) 879-1916 x66564 > mercierm@bose.com -=*OR*=- Doctor_PC@msn.com > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 21:15:43 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA02590 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:15:43 -0800 Received: (from hsu@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA02579 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:15:40 -0800 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:15:40 -0800 From: Jeffrey Hsu Message-Id: <199511280515.VAA02579@freefall.freebsd.org> To: kaleb@x.org Subject: Re: gcc-2.7.1 compiled kernel Cc: hackers Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Is the -O2 -fno-strength-reduce bug fixed? From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 21:21:26 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA03061 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:21:26 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA03040 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:21:19 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id GAA23591 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 06:21:10 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id GAA18520 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 06:21:09 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id XAA07429 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:35:58 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511272235.XAA07429@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Argh, lost console :-( To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:35:57 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from "Chuck Robey" at Nov 27, 95 02:26:10 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 496 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Chuck Robey wrote: > > If it's such a crock, would you mind expounding on the _right_ method? I > would use xdm if I trusted it... Runnig xdm (as a daemon) e.g. from rc.local _is_ the right method. If it fails for some reason, we should attack the reasons, not the symptoms. (As i wrote in a previous mail, it works for me.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 21:21:27 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA03066 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:21:27 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA03042 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:21:20 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id GAA23595 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 06:21:12 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id GAA18521 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 06:21:12 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id XAA07448 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:40:06 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511272240.XAA07448@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Anyone keen to help me get a Phillips CDD 521 Recorder working? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:40:05 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511271802.KAA27054@cozumel.tcs.com> from "Douglas Ambrisko" at Nov 27, 95 10:02:24 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 624 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Douglas Ambrisko wrote: > > I'll checkout rtprio, and I'm sorry I don't have all the specifics > right now (you can probably find them at http://www.cdarchives.com) but > the Yamaha is a 4X writer with only 512k buffer. 4times, 6times -- what's the base for the comparision? The SCSI bus itself can transfer about 8 MBytes/s continuously (on a "standard" 8-bit controller, like the AHA-2940 or NCR 53c810). How close do these burners come to that value? -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 21:29:41 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA03496 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:29:41 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA03491 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:29:38 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id FAA07269; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:19:54 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511280519.FAA07269@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: 210R Install Feedback To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:19:53 +0000 () Cc: gvw@brainaid.oche.de, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <12510.817401152@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 26, 95 07:52:32 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1133 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Jordan K. Hubbard stands accused of saying: > > > 1. I boot my 2.0.5R system and OS/2 from the OS/2 Bootmanager. I installed > > 210R to sd2 and told sysinstall not to touch the bootblock. > > Afterwards the bootmanager was deactivated, and the system booted the > > old 205R partition by default. Hmm. > > This seems to be a problem, but neither Poul-Henning and I can figure > out why. I literally don't write to a disk that's not selected, > yet people are telling me the boot blocks are getting touched for their > first drive anyway. I can't figure it out. The OS/2 bootmangler lives in a partition all to itself; I would guess you're changing the active partition to point to the FreeBSD partition (or the user is in the installer) -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 21:43:28 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA04208 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:43:28 -0800 Received: from ast.com (irvine.ast.com [165.164.128.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA04201 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:43:25 -0800 Received: from fw.ast.com by ast.com with SMTP id AA24602 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for ); Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:44:52 -0800 Received: from nemesis by fw.ast.com with uucp (Smail3.1.29.1 #4) id m0tKIh7-00008UC; Mon, 27 Nov 95 23:35 CST Received: by nemesis.lonestar.org (Smail3.1.27.1 #20) id m0tKIfj-000FLjC; Mon, 27 Nov 95 23:33 WET Message-Id: Date: Mon, 27 Nov 95 23:33 WET To: hackers@freebsd.org From: uhclem%nemesis@fw.ast.com (Frank Durda IV) Sent: Mon Nov 27 1995, 23:33:39 CST Subject: Bill Gates on Letterman Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk If you are on the West Coast (or further West), you still have time to see Bill Gates vs The Quiz Machine and other nonsense on the November 27th edition Late Show (CBS). I hope somebody is able to tape the first part. I came in where Gates was just left standing behind the Quiz Machine while a different guest was being interviewed. Apparently the machine did not behave well in his presence. Yeah, this is off-topic, but watching Gates do a talk-show is a unique event. Frank Durda IV |"If the idea for The Quiz Machine or uhclem%nemesis@fw.ast.com (Fastest Route)| came across your desk, what ...letni!rwsys!nemesis!uhclem | would you do?" "I'd recall it." ...decvax!fw.ast.com!nemesis!uhclem |"Wouldn't you fire a bunch of people?" "No." Letterman & Gates From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 22:07:48 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id WAA05789 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:07:48 -0800 Received: from fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov (fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov [137.75.131.171]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id WAA05782 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:07:44 -0800 Received: by fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov (5.57/Ultrix3.0-C) id AA21204; Tue, 28 Nov 95 00:07:43 -0600 Received: by emu.fsl.noaa.gov (1.38.193.4/SMI-4.1 (1.38.193.4)) id AA20231; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:07:42 -0700 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:07:42 -0700 From: kelly@fsl.noaa.gov (Sean Kelly) Message-Id: <9511280607.AA20231@emu.fsl.noaa.gov> To: jmacd@cory.eecs.berkeley.edu Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511280241.SAA12560@cory.EECS.Berkeley.EDU> (message from Josh MacDonald on Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:41:36 -0800) Subject: Re: gcc 2.1.7 (and libg++) Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Josh" == Josh MacDonald writes: Josh> I haven't seen anything on this list about this, so I'll Josh> ask: Josh> [ trying gcc 2.7, which produced .weak macros, which Josh> required gnu as, which didn't work with current ld, which Josh> required gnu ld, which didn't work with crt0.o, which ... ] Whoa! Now *that's* a familiar story. I went through the exact same thing trying to get Fresco (a real pain in the sphincter) working on FreeBSD. I had to give up. (Linux users have a working, if threadless, Fresco.) Josh> Is the core team planning on moving to the new version Josh> sometime? I hope someone does ... I lack the knowledge/patience to try to get all that stuff working properly. I got as far as you did before I threw in the towel. I have a feeling I need to make the whole world over again with a bmake'd gcc before it'll work right. You know, a new gcc might also fix problem report bin/230 (constructors for global objects in shared libraries not called). You guys wanna close that pr, right? Right? :-) -- Sean Kelly NOAA Forecast Systems Laboratory, Boulder Colorado USA It's fascinating to think that all around us there's an invisible world we can't even see. I'm speaking, of course, of the World of the Invisible Scary Skeletons. -- Jack Handey From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 22:11:39 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id WAA06087 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:11:39 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA06081 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:11:37 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id GAA07379; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 06:05:14 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511280605.GAA07379@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Better scsi and e-net support... To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 06:05:14 +0000 () Cc: mercierm@bose.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511280214.SAA22317@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Nov 27, 95 06:14:30 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1939 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Julian Elischer stands accused of saying:> > >> >> Sorry to be a jerk, but I find it hard to believe that there are more people >> out in the US that have a Compaq DeskPro XL or an HP Vectra XU that use the >> AMD PCI PCnet / PCscsi controller, other than myself. (since it is >> integrated into the motherboard) > never heard of it... > What drivers we have is dependent on what hardware is owned by > people who write drivers.. It appears that none of these people > have the AMD mumble chips :| The PCnet chip is a LANCE, and should be supported by the lnc driver. There was some talk a while ago about the Compaq PCI chipset - something about "fundamental brokenness", but I'm also led to believe that a solution was finally reached. (Check with the PCI gurus on that one) >> Is there someplace or someone that has a patch so I can at least install the >> damn OS? :| >> I have been trying to install FreeBSD v2.0 off and on since I bought it in IIRC, Walnut Creek will upgrade you to the latest version (2.1) free of charge, especially given the circumstances. You may also need a custom boot floppy and kernel to deal with the PCI unhappiness if you're on a Compaq. As for the SCSI side of things; I'd suggest investing another $40 or so on an NCR-based PCI SCSI controller. I can't see the AMD part being supported until someone comes up with a card with it on, and someone esle gives such a card to the PCI driver developers. >> Bitch, bitch, look-in-wallet-that-has-lost-forty-bucks, If you bought from WC, there's no need to bitch. -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 22:31:29 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id WAA07595 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:31:29 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA07583 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:31:10 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id RAA14266; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 17:27:01 +1100 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 17:27:01 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511280627.RAA14266@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr, wilko@yedi.iaf.nl Subject: Re: Translation Adaptec 1542 versus NCR810 Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@FreeBSD.org Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> Quick question: is the translation mode used by a Adaptec 1542A (32 hd, >> 64 sect or the other way around (I always forget)) the same as the one >> used by a NCR810 ? >I'm afraid not... Last time I installed a disk in a friend's machine with a >NCR, it used something like 33hd/63sect or 63hd/33 sect :-( I tried modifying the geometry for one of my (installed) drives on a BT445C the other day. It was easy to set up the following geometries without affecting the FreeBSD partitions (sd1s2-sd1s4). Even the DOS partition (sd1s1) worked according to chkdsk, but since it didn't have any files on it and the DOS BPB has the geometry in it, I wouldn't trust it. Method: run FreeBSD fdisk (fdisk -u /dev/rsd1) and change the "parameters to be used for the BIOS calculations", then answer `y' to all questions about changing the partitions, but hit return to accept the defaults. Reboot and the BT445C will report the changed geometry if the change is valid. I tried the following: 64 heads 32 sectors original 128 heads 32 sectors worked 256 heads 32 sectors BT445C thought it was 255 heads 32 sectors (?) 256 heads 63 sectors BT445C thought it was 255 heads 63 sectors 255 heads 63 sectors worked I'm now using 255 heads 63 sectors but I wouldn't expect all controllers to agree on this. The BT445C apparently uses similar guesses (based on the partition table) to FreeBSD to decide the geometry but it may have a better default (64/32?) when the partition table is empty. The geometry for IDE drives is almost as flexible. The following works for my 1993 AMI BIOS: Enter a physically and BIOSically possible geometry in setup (physical: H <= 16; BIOS: S <= 63). The BIOS is too old to support H> 16. Update the partition table as above to match the geometry. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 22:40:04 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id WAA08240 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:40:04 -0800 Received: from dtr.com (dtr.rain.com [204.119.8.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA08214 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:39:51 -0800 From: bmk@dtr.com Received: (from bmk@localhost) by dtr.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id WAA00452; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:34:21 -0800 Message-Id: <199511280634.WAA00452@dtr.com> Subject: Re: Netscape 2.0b3 To: chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:34:21 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199511271612.LAA16745@fang.cs.sunyit.edu> from "chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu" at Nov 27, 95 11:12:53 am Reply-To: bmk@dtr.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 326 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Anyone try to use the mail window of the new netscape? It searches > for the mail spool directory in /usr/spool/mail. Any ideas on how we > can get get around this? Naturally, you could fix it if you had the source. Since that's not an option, best thing I can think of is a symbolic link pointing at /var/mail. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 22:40:08 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id WAA08283 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:40:08 -0800 Received: from ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (ki1.Chemie.FU-Berlin.DE [160.45.24.21]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id WAA08236 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:40:02 -0800 Received: by ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (Smail3.1.28.1) from prospero (130.133.3.126) with smtp id ; Tue, 28 Nov 95 07:39 MET Received: (from graichen@localhost) by prospero (8.6.12/8.6.12) id HAA00669 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 07:39:57 +0100 From: Thomas Graichen Message-Id: <199511280639.HAA00669@prospero> Subject: Re: MsDoss filesystem To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 07:39:56 +0100 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1064 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > I've heard a lot about msdos filesystem support and that there are > limitations (bugs?). What exactly are the limitations of the the msdos > support? Does BSD/OS, NetBSD, Lites suffer from the same problems? > If there is a problem, is there anyone working on it? (Yes, I might be able > to help). > you _may_ get big problems (corrupted ufs partitions etc.) if you mount it rw - as far as i remeber it's also broken in NetBSD t p.s.: would be nice if may do something for it _______________________________________________________||___________________ __|| Perfection is reached, not when there is no __|| thomas graichen longer anything to add, but when there __|| freie universitaet berlin is no longer anything to take away __|| fachbereich physik __|| - Antoine de Saint-Exupery - __|| graichen@mail.physik.fu-berlin.de ___________________________||__________________graichen@FreeBSD.org_________ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 22:40:56 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id WAA08503 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:40:56 -0800 Received: from dtr.com (dtr.rain.com [204.119.8.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA08498 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:40:51 -0800 From: bmk@dtr.com Received: (from bmk@localhost) by dtr.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id WAA00603; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:40:22 -0800 Message-Id: <199511280640.WAA00603@dtr.com> Subject: Re: Translation Adaptec 1542 versus NCR810 To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:40:22 -0800 (PST) Cc: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl, FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511270750.IAA21813@keltia.freenix.fr> from "Ollivier Robert" at Nov 27, 95 08:50:53 am Reply-To: bmk@dtr.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 561 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > It seems that Wilko Bulte said: > > Quick question: is the translation mode used by a Adaptec 1542A (32 hd, > > 64 sect or the other way around (I always forget)) the same as the one > > used by a NCR810 ? > I'm afraid not... Last time I installed a disk in a friend's machine with a > NCR, it used something like 33hd/63sect or 63hd/33 sect :-( I suppose that it's dependant on physical drive size or phase of the moon. It worked here when I upgraded from a Buslogic 445 (which uses the same translation as Adaptec 1542) to an NCR810. Go figure. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 22:59:32 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id WAA09526 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:59:32 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA09511 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 22:59:19 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id RAA15565; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 17:57:47 +1100 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 17:57:47 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511280657.RAA15565@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr, se@zpr.uni-koeln.de Subject: Re: Translation Adaptec 1542 versus NCR810 Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> The NCR bios ought to use the values the drive >> has been initialised with, if it has been used >> with an Adaptec before. If its a clean install, Is it as flexible as the BT445C? I.e., does it guess a geometry from whatever _valid_ values you put in the partition table? >In that case, the drive was out of the box, first configured with the >geometry displayed by the drive and it didn't boot. I then took the total Big drives are likely to have >= 64 sectors/track. Don't even think about using such a geometry. It won't fit in the partition table and neither BIOSes nor fdisks should allow you to specify it. >number of sectors, divided by the values of sect/trk and heads displayed by >"boot -v" and calculated the # of cylinders. This should always work (except in 2.0.5 which displayed the wrong number of heads and cylinders (off by one error)). Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 23:25:46 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id XAA11924 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:25:46 -0800 Received: from haywire.DIALix.COM (news@haywire.DIALix.COM [192.203.228.65]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA11917 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:25:38 -0800 Received: (from news@localhost) by haywire.DIALix.COM (sendmail) id PAA25897 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:25:12 +0800 (WST) Received: from GATEWAY by haywire.DIALix.COM with netnews for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (problems to: usenet@haywire.dialix.com) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: 28 Nov 1995 15:24:55 +0800 From: peter@haywire.dialix.com (Peter Wemm) Message-ID: <49edg7$p8s$1@haywire.DIALix.COM> Organization: DIALix Services, Perth, Australia. References: , <199511270733.IAA01488@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Java.. Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) writes: >> I just downloaded 2.0b3 for Linux to check out the Java support. It seems >> to be running at a decent speed, so that's good. But since I've been >> using FreeBSD for all my Internet applications, since the PPP speed in >> Linux is basically crap (2.8Kbps vs. 3.2Kbps for FreeBSD!), I also D/Led >define something crap because of such a small (in absolute terms, not >relative ones) difference in speed seems a bit too much! >> the BSD version, and even though there is no Java, it did fix ALL of the >> bugs I reported (non-blinking cursor, and problems with my dial-on-demand >the non-blinking cursor was a more general problem with timer events >which were not listened to when waiting for X events. This also >affected dynamic pages using the client-pull mechanism, and possibly >other features. No, it wasn't that.. The bsdi 2.0b2 binary *wasn't even calling* any of the timer system calls, or setting a SIGALRM handler, etc. It was a downright programming botchup on Netscape's part, not the fault of the *BSD kernels. I suspect they screwed up their #ifdef's. -Peter > Luigi >==================================================================== >Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione >email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa >tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) >fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ >==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 23:42:25 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id XAA13622 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:42:25 -0800 Received: from ra.dkuug.dk (ra.dkuug.dk [193.88.44.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA13612 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:42:12 -0800 Received: (from sos@localhost) by ra.dkuug.dk (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA17464; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:37:42 +0100 Message-Id: <199511280737.IAA17464@ra.dkuug.dk> Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:37:42 +0100 (MET) Cc: sos@freebsd.org, cshenton@apollo.hq.nasa.gov, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <884.817519170@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 27, 95 04:39:30 pm From: sos@freebsd.org Reply-to: sos@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1053 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Jordan K. Hubbard who wrote: > > > If this is the way we want to go, I'm sure I can find the > > time to get it running.... > > Well, I'd certainly take the mouse abilities! I played with Linux's > "gmp" a little bit and have to say - it's pretty useful. If you're > not an X person but like to use VTYs, it's the only way to do it > reasonably painlessly. :) A libvga would also be interesting, of > course! Hmm, I allready sent you a "technology demo" of the mouse stuff half a year ago or something, forgot ?? :) :) The mouse stuff (ie pointer drawing etc) is allready in syscons, and work in all text modes. What needs to be done is that we design/implement a generic mouse interface, so that programs doesn't have to know about devices and different mouse protocols... That last part will also help the graphics library.... -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team So much code to hack -- so little time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 23:52:54 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id XAA14332 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:52:54 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA14326 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:52:41 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id IAA27265; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:50:50 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA19041; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:50:49 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id IAA09319; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:36:08 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511280736.IAA09319@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Netscape 2.0b3 To: chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:36:08 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511271612.LAA16745@fang.cs.sunyit.edu> from "chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu" at Nov 27, 95 11:12:53 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 471 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu wrote: > > Anyone try to use the mail window of the new netscape? It searches > for the mail spool directory in /usr/spool/mail. Any ideas on how we > can get get around this? The obvious solution: mv netscape /dev/null But that's very likely not what you want... :-) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Nov 27 23:56:07 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id XAA14529 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:56:07 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA14138 ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:51:29 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id IAA27257; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:50:46 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA19039; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:50:46 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id IAA09229; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:26:17 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511280726.IAA09229@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: 2.0.5R: SCSI hang and panic... HELP To: mikebo@tellabs.com Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:26:16 +0100 (MET) Cc: bugs@freebsd.org, mikebo@freefall.freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org, questions@freebsd.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511271931.NAA03249@sunc210.hq.tellabs.com> from "mikebo@tellabs.com" at Nov 27, 95 01:31:15 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 743 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As mikebo@tellabs.com wrote: > > ahc0: target 0, lun 0 (sd0) timed out > ahc0: target 0, lun 0 (sd0) timed out > ...[repeats]... > > SCSI bus hangs, and I'm forced to reboot system... This is probably for Justin... perhaps it's already fixed in 2.1 however. > Once, this even happened: > /: bad dir ino 2 at offset 0: mangled entry > panic: bad dir Boot the installation floppy, select "Fixit", insert the fixit floppy, and fsck /dev/rsd0a manually. This assumes the 2.1 boot/fixit floppy pair, you can also use them for 2.0.5 (except for actually running an installation). -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 00:40:41 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA17133 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 00:40:41 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA17112 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 00:40:35 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id TAA19625; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:37:39 +1100 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:37:39 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511280837.TAA19625@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bmk@dtr.com, chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu Subject: Re: Netscape 2.0b3 Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >> Anyone try to use the mail window of the new netscape? It searches >> for the mail spool directory in /usr/spool/mail. Any ideas on how we >> can get get around this? >Naturally, you could fix it if you had the source. You could fix it by editing the binary if the binary isn't doesn't build the string in a complicated way. E.g., echo '/usr/s/usr/var/ w netscape.bin.test' | ed netscape.bin correctly replaces the first `usr' by `var'. vi is almost as 8-bit clean. It appends a newline. There are several binary editors in ports which might be able to handle this better (a binary editor should be able to edit /dev/mem and /dev/rsd0...). Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 00:48:28 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA17331 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 00:48:28 -0800 Received: from tfs.com (tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id AAA17326 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 00:48:25 -0800 Received: from critter.tfs.com by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) with SMTP id m0tKLhu-0003w5C; Tue, 28 Nov 95 00:48 PST Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id JAA00226; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:48:03 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Josh MacDonald cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: gcc 2.1.7 (and libg++) In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:41:36 PST." <199511280241.SAA12560@cory.EECS.Berkeley.EDU> Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:48:02 +0100 Message-ID: <224.817548482@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I haven't seen anything on this list about this, so I'll ask: > > gcc 2.7.1 was recently release, and it seems things compile this > time around, whereas 2.7.0's libg++ was totally broken. I'm I have started playing with 2.7.1 too and it does seem to make no difference apart from bugs fixed. This is good. It will probably be at least 4 to 6 months until we jump the band- wagon though. I guess we will want to get all of as/ld/cc upgraded this time. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 01:05:04 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA18030 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 01:05:04 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA18017 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 01:04:56 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id IAA07993; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:56:16 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511280856.IAA07993@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: 16 ports Boca - anyone using it? To: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com (Joe Greco) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:56:16 +0000 () Cc: rich@spirit.com.au, hsu@clinet.fi, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511270623.AAA10644@brasil.moneng.mei.com> from "Joe Greco" at Nov 27, 95 00:23:17 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2216 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Joe Greco stands accused of saying: > > Um. "Fascinating", I say. I didn't have any diagnostic tools handy so I > rebooted the box and wrote a little program that would page me if the board > died again. The next day I went and hooked up my trusty logic probe, and > the wait began. :-) A week later (last nite, actually!), I got a page, > and fortunately somebody was at the office to observe the logic probe. > The interrupt line is being held ACTIVE....???!!! (solid red on the probe, > normally green). Yecch. > Do any sio-shared-interrupt-geniuses have any ideas? I can picture all > sorts of plausible race conditions and I have no idea what the code is > doing. ISA interrupts are edge-triggered, so something happened to lose you one. As far as I can tell, siopoll() doesn't check for pending interrupts on ports as it cycles around (I can imagine a possible race if it did...) You could possibly add some code to siopoll() to check the interrupt status of open ports, and spew a console printf if it found a port with pending interrupt status. Something like : if (incc <= 0 || !(tp->t_state & TS_ISOPEN)) continue; + disable_intr(); + iir = inb(com->int_id_port) & 0x07; + enable_intr(); + if (iir) + printf("sio%d: interrupt pending (%d) in poll\n", + com->unit,iir); /* * Avoid the grotesquely inefficient lineswitch routine * (ttyinput) in "raw" mode. It usually takes about 450 (Bruce is probably laughing himself silly over some obvious mistake I'm making here, but that's what I'd start with). If this "works" (it may fill your log partition pretty quickly 8), then we could find a way to call siointr to handle the missed interrupt. > Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 01:14:39 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA18485 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 01:14:39 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA18478 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 01:14:27 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id UAA20911; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:11:23 +1100 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:11:23 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511280911.UAA20911@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: davidg@Root.COM, jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com Subject: Re: 3940? Cc: archive@cps.cmich.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Related, but not really: pet peeve of the day: DK_NDRIVE is set to 8 in >sys/dkstat.h. This effectively limits the number of drives I can get >statistics on - statistics that would tend to be more useful the more drives >I have. Is there any harm in increasing this? My news box has a dozen >disks. I think you're supposed to increase it if you have a lot of disks. Don't forget to recompile all utilities that depend on it. >(I also noticed: extern int dk_busy; /* bit field of busy drives */ >which is sorta scary :-) wonder how many other places there are hidden >limits built in?) dk_busy is only supported by the wd driver. I guess that's why the msps field in systat only sort of works for wd drives. DK_NDRIVE must be less than the number of bits in an int for dk_busy to work right. I think most of the limits are explicit (like DK_NDRIVE). Of course, this is the wrong way to do things. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 01:37:46 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA20154 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 01:37:46 -0800 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA20146 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 01:37:41 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA00693; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 17:36:34 -0800 Message-Id: <199511280136.RAA00693@rah.star-gate.com> X-Authentication-Warning: rah.star-gate.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: Bruce Evans cc: bmk@dtr.com, chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape 2.0b3 In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:37:39 +1100." <199511280837.TAA19625@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 17:36:32 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >>> Bruce Evans said: > >> Anyone try to use the mail window of the new netscape? It searche s > >> for the mail spool directory in /usr/spool/mail. Any ideas on how we > >> can get get around this? > > >Naturally, you could fix it if you had the source. > > You could fix it by editing the binary if the binary isn't doesn't build > the string in a complicated way. E.g., > > echo '/usr/s/usr/var/ > w netscape.bin.test' | ed netscape.bin > > correctly replaces the first `usr' by `var'. vi is almost as 8-bit clean. > It appends a newline. There are several binary editors in ports which > might be able to handle this better (a binary editor should be able to > edit /dev/mem and /dev/rsd0...). > Odd, I just did an emacs on the linux netscape and replace /usr/spool by /var and then after the null added six spaces 8) Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 02:13:53 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id CAA22606 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 02:13:53 -0800 Received: from rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au [129.78.129.109]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA22594 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 02:13:38 -0800 Received: (from dawes@localhost) by rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (8.6.11/8.6.9) id VAA17585 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:13:32 +1100 From: David Dawes Message-Id: <199511281013.VAA17585@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> Subject: Problem with sio probe and Mach64 PCI video card To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:13:32 +1100 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1831 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I've just installed an ASUS PCI-AV264CT video card, based on the Mach64 "CT" chipset, into an ASUS PCI/I-P54TP4 motherboard with 90MHz Pentium CPU. I'm planning to do some work on getting Mach64 CT support into XFree86. When I booted FreeBSD 2.1, the screen went blank fairly early in the boot probe sequence. When connected to a DPMS monitor, it went into "OFF" mode indicating no sync present. After a bit of experimentation I found that this problem could be avoided by disabling the two sio devices I had configures (sio0 and sio1). Enabling either one separately still resulted in the problem. I've previously seen the video go blank for a fraction of a second when booting on a similar machine with an S3 964 card installed. I wondered why this happened, but since it didn't cause any problems I thought nothing more of it. My guess is that the sio probe is writing to a Mach64 register. In the S3 case it is possilbly successfully restoring it too. I haven't had a chance to look into the sio probe yet though, and would appreciate any suggestions as to what might be the cause of this, and how to avoid it (other than disabling the serial ports -- a mouse is kind of useful when working on an X server). The registers listed in the manual for the video card are: 102, 1ce, 1cf, 2e8, 2ec, 2ed, 2ee, 2ef, 3x4, 3x5, 3x8, 3x9, 3xa, 3xb, 3c?, 3dc, and 46e8. (x=b for mono, x=d for colour). The other hardware I have in this machine is: SMC EtherEZ (16 bit), which PnP sets to: port 0x240 irq 11 iomem 0xc8000 SoundBlaster Pro: port 0x220 irq 7 drq 1 As a side note, I tried PCVT (At first I wondered if syscons was causing a problem since that was the last message I initally saw flash up before the screen disappeared), and noticed that the arrow keys don't work in the visual mode of "/kernel -c". David From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 02:22:45 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id CAA23149 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 02:22:45 -0800 Received: from Sysiphos (Sysiphos.MI.Uni-Koeln.DE [134.95.212.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id CAA23135 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 02:22:32 -0800 Received: by Sysiphos id AA14947 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for hackers@freebsd.org); Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:21:48 +0100 Message-Id: <199511281021.AA14947@Sysiphos> From: se@zpr.uni-koeln.de (Stefan Esser) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:21:47 +0100 In-Reply-To: Michael Smith "Re: Better scsi and e-net support..." (Nov 28, 6:05) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(2) 7/9/95) To: "Marc A. Mercier" Subject: Re: Better scsi and e-net support... Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Nov 28, 6:05, Michael Smith wrote: } Subject: Re: Better scsi and e-net support... } Julian Elischer stands accused of saying:> } The PCnet chip is a LANCE, and should be supported by the lnc driver. There } was some talk a while ago about the Compaq PCI chipset - something about } "fundamental brokenness", but I'm also led to believe that a solution } was finally reached. (Check with the PCI gurus on that one) Booting with "-v" will let you see the Ethernet chip's I/O address. It is 0x7000, if I remeber right. If you boot with "-c", enter the port address for "lnc0" and assign the correct IRQ, then you should be able to use the Lance part of the Combo chip. } IIRC, Walnut Creek will upgrade you to the latest version (2.1) free of } charge, especially given the circumstances. You may also need a custom } boot floppy and kernel to deal with the PCI unhappiness if you're on a } Compaq. The boot probe got more and more pedantic over time, to make sure that non-PCI boards are dealt with correctly (i.e. that PCI probes are not performed on non-PCI motherboards, since they might become upset :). But then the Compaq's PCI bus was not detected anymore, since they violate certain rules of the PCI spec, which are supposed to let a system, probe for PCI and configuration details. The current code contains special cases for the COmpaq chip sets, and you should be able to access the PCI bus from both 2.1R and FreeBSD-current. } As for the SCSI side of things; I'd suggest investing another $40 or so } on an NCR-based PCI SCSI controller. I can't see the AMD part being } supported until someone comes up with a card with it on, and someone esle } gives such a card to the PCI driver developers. Wolfgang Stanglmeier had the AMD Combo Chip data book, and considered writing a driver for it at some time. But when he found, that the AMD requires a host interrupt handler to deal with disconnect, we decided to not put any effort into this. The AMD offers far inferior performance at much higher CPU load than the NCR, and it would have been silly to invest hundreds of hours of work into support of that controller chip, which could be replaced by a superior solution at $50 at that time ... BTW: AMD themselves tell you not to use that Combo chip in new designs ... Regards, STefan -- Stefan Esser, Zentrum fuer Paralleles Rechnen Tel: +49 221 4706021 Universitaet zu Koeln, Weyertal 80, 50931 Koeln FAX: +49 221 4705160 ============================================================================== http://www.zpr.uni-koeln.de/~se From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 02:28:24 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id CAA23541 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 02:28:24 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id CAA23535 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 02:28:11 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Tue, 28 Nov 95 10:28 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id LAA25489; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:10:15 +0100 Message-Id: <199511281010.LAA25489@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Re: Documentation.. To: jfieber@indiana.edu (John Fieber) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:10:15 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) In-Reply-To: from "John Fieber" at Nov 27, 95 08:43:01 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1920 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk John Fieber writes: > > On Mon, 27 Nov 1995, Peter Marelas wrote: > > > Due to all the argueing about the lack of documentation, why dont > > we all stop bitching, and do ourselves a favour by writing docs, on > > what we have experience in, when using freebsd, lets get the handbook > > growing. > > YES! The new handbook section: > > X. Compatibility with other systems > > X.1 BSDI > > (no-brainer, except I gather 2.0 binaries don't work?) I haven't had any problems with 2.0 binaries--what problems are there? The only problems I have seen were the different behaviour of fcntl locking as the result of the change of struct flock. The binary I had (elm) was compiled on BSD/386 1.1, and it didn't run on BSD/OS 2.0 either. > X.2 SCO > > X.3 Linux > > > Where do we put docs in for review by others? > > Send stuff in to doc@freebsd.org. In a couple weeks I'll be diving > headfirst into a handbook upgrade so if there are some new compat docs in > my mailbox, they will find their way in. > > > > PS: Im writing one on PPP Servers, using pppd, as I feel the current docs > > in the handbook are inadequate. > > Super! I think the most common failing found in the handbook (including > the ppp docs) are explicit step-by-step instructions *without* sufficient > commentary text. Step-by-step procedures are exteremely fragile and fall > apart in the face of varaiation among installations. With the rapid > development of freebsd, variation is *guaranteed*. The process should be > explained by the text, and illustrated by some examples, not the reverse! Agreed. I've been meaning to do something here too, but so far I only have some preliminary stuff for installing the system and reconfiguring the kernel. If anybody's interested, they're welcome to review it, but I'm afraid (sorry, guys) it's all in troff, because I couldn't figure out how to do my tricks in SGML. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 03:12:58 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA26962 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 03:12:58 -0800 Received: from expo.x.org (expo.x.org [198.112.45.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA26957 ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 03:12:47 -0800 Received: from exalt.x.org by expo.x.org id AA05629; Tue, 28 Nov 95 06:12:12 -0500 Received: from localhost by exalt.x.org id LAA12943; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:12:11 GMT Message-Id: <199511281112.LAA12943@exalt.x.org> To: Jeffrey Hsu Cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: gcc-2.7.1 compiled kernel In-Reply-To: Your message of Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:15:40 EDT. <199511280515.VAA02579@freefall.freebsd.org> Organization: X Consortium Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 06:12:10 EDT From: "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Is the -O2 -fno-strength-reduce bug fixed? I was told it would be fixed in 2.7.1. The ChangeLog for changes made after 2.7.0 has words about strength-reduce. My feeble brain can't remember the simple test program that demonstrates the bug, if someone will send it to me I'll run it for confirmation. -- Kaleb From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 03:44:05 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA28978 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 03:44:05 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA28935 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 03:43:56 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id WAA26568; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:41:08 +1100 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:41:08 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511281141.WAA26568@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: jmacd@cory.EECS.Berkeley.EDU, phk@critter.tfs.com Subject: Re: gcc 2.1.7 (and libg++) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >It will probably be at least 4 to 6 months until we jump the band- I think that's too long. It would collide with the next release... I think 2.7 has some important improvements for C++, but 2.7.1 breaks something big. >wagon though. I guess we will want to get all of as/ld/cc upgraded >this time. Updating ld will be difficult. cc only requires `.weak' support in as. Perhaps ASM_WEAKEN_LABEL() could emit a stab instead of a `.weak' statement. I just deleted ASM_WEAKEN_LABEL() for 2.7.0. This may have broken the C++ feature that depends on weak symbols. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 04:04:50 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA00958 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 04:04:50 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA00944 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 04:04:38 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Tue, 28 Nov 95 12:04 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id MAA25890; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 12:43:18 +0100 Message-Id: <199511281143.MAA25890@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Enough already! (Was: Where is the documentation for ibcs2?) To: lyndon@orthanc.com (Lyndon Nerenberg) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 12:43:17 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) In-Reply-To: <199511280011.QAA23175@multivac.orthanc.com> from "Lyndon Nerenberg" at Nov 27, 95 04:11:49 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 2295 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Lyndon Nerenberg writes: > > Well, going by your argument the man page for cc(1) should also document > the programming language and libraries, n'est ce pas? Should we also > incorporate a copy of Stevens in tcp(4)? > > The man page should document the fact the iBCS2 support exists, > give three short examples of how to enable the support (compile into > kernel, invoke from sysconfig, load from command line), refer the > reader to the non-existent handbook section describing all the ugly > details of the implementation, and include a warning that the code > is preliminary and shouldn't be used unless you're willing to do some > digging into the source code. > > Call the manpage ibcs2(8) and create a link called sco(4) (or maybe sco(5)?). > This makes the two obvious targets for apropos work, and let's people > discover fairly easily that SCO support does exist, while making no > bones about the fact that its use is not for the timid. Boy, that really turned into an all-out battle. Can we stop now, guys, and get back to some real work? I'm replying to Lyndon's message because I think he put it the best. In the meantime, I think we can all agree on these points: 1. ibcs2 support does require some documentation. I think Lyndon states it best above. 2. ibcs2 is currently not complete. We should understand that the documentation is one part which has hardly even been started. 3. the program /usr/bin/ibcs2 really belongs in /usr/sbin, as Terry says. I don't agree that that absolves it from needing documentation. Beyond that, I think we need to accept the fact that nobody has really explained how it works. As Terry suspects, my vi that crapped out the other day was trying to find a shared library. It's not clear from his mail whether it would have worked if it had found one. In any case, debugging it with gdb doesn't work: it doesn't get as far as being executed. On the other hand, If anybody's interested, I have an almost complete set of GNU SVR3 binaries, including GNU libc, which I developed on an SCO system and which work there. I've tried out a statically linked bash, and it works, sort of. It does some strange things from time to time, such as deciding to receive an exit command, but it doesn't do that if I ktrace it. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 04:34:53 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA02681 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 04:34:53 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA02674 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 04:34:40 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id XAA28803; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 23:31:18 +1100 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 23:31:18 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511281231.XAA28803@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Problem with sio probe and Mach64 PCI video card Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >I've just installed an ASUS PCI-AV264CT video card, based on the >Mach64 "CT" chipset, into an ASUS PCI/I-P54TP4 motherboard with 90MHz >Pentium CPU. I'm planning to do some work on getting Mach64 CT support >into XFree86. When I booted FreeBSD 2.1, the screen went blank fairly >early in the boot probe sequence. When connected to a DPMS monitor, >it went into "OFF" mode indicating no sync present. After a bit of >experimentation I found that this problem could be avoided by disabling >the two sio devices I had configures (sio0 and sio1). Enabling either >one separately still resulted in the problem. >I've previously seen the video go blank for a fraction of a second when >booting on a similar machine with an S3 964 card installed. I wondered >why this happened, but since it didn't cause any problems I thought nothing >more of it. >My guess is that the sio probe is writing to a Mach64 register. In the >S3 case it is possilbly successfully restoring it too. I haven't had sio always writes 0 to port 0x2E8+4 (the modem control reg for the usual sio3 address) if >= 1 sio device is configured. It doesn't attempt to restore the original value; however, if sio3 is enabled at port IO_COM4, as it is in GENERIC, then other values will be written to 0x2EC and nearby. The change at the end replaces bogus internal array of ports by the ones specified in the config. This requires the config to specify sio2 and sio3 if the ports exist even if they are unusable under FreeBSD due to a conflict, and S3 owners to boot with -c and disable sio3 before the monitor blows up :-). sio3 shouldn't be in GENERIC. If you don't want to recompile, edit the kernel binary: find the address of _likely_com_ports and replace the 0x2E8 entry by something harmless, e.g., 0x3F8. Bruce *** sio.c~ Wed Nov 22 02:53:12 1995 --- sio.c Tue Nov 28 23:08:38 1995 *************** *** 332,338 **** }; - /* XXX - configure this list */ - static Port_t likely_com_ports[] = { 0x3f8, 0x2f8, 0x3e8, 0x2e8, }; - static struct kern_devconf kdc_sio[NSIO] = { { 0, 0, 0, /* filled in by dev_attach */ --- 332,335 ---- *************** *** 495,499 **** { static bool_t already_init; - Port_t *com_ptr; bool_t failures[10]; int fn; --- 492,495 ---- *************** *** 502,505 **** --- 498,502 ---- u_char mcr_image; int result; + struct isa_device *xdev; sioregisterdev(dev); *************** *** 512,520 **** * XXX the gate enable is elsewhere for some multiports. */ ! for (com_ptr = likely_com_ports; ! com_ptr < &likely_com_ports[sizeof likely_com_ports ! / sizeof likely_com_ports[0]]; ! ++com_ptr) ! outb(*com_ptr + com_mcr, 0); #if NCRD > 0 /* --- 509,515 ---- * XXX the gate enable is elsewhere for some multiports. */ ! for (xdev = isa_devtab_tty; xdev->id_driver != NULL; xdev++) ! if (xdev->id_driver == &siodriver && xdev->id_enabled) ! outb(xdev->id_iobase + com_mcr, 0); #if NCRD > 0 /* From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 04:39:11 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA02959 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 04:39:11 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA02954 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 04:39:02 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id XAA29063; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 23:38:01 +1100 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 23:38:01 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511281238.XAA29063@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: cimaxp1!jb@werple.net.au, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Where is the prototype for __syscall? Cc: jb@cimlogic.com.au Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >I'm trying to get a clean compile of libc with gcc -Wall and I can't find >a function prototype for __syscall. Where should it be? Next to the one for syscall() in unistd.h. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 04:50:16 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA03411 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 04:50:16 -0800 Received: from rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au [129.78.129.109]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA03406 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 04:50:11 -0800 Received: (from dawes@localhost) by rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (8.6.11/8.6.9) id XAA17851; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 23:49:24 +1100 From: David Dawes Message-Id: <199511281249.XAA17851@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> Subject: Re: Problem with sio probe and Mach64 PCI video card To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 23:49:24 +1100 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511281231.XAA28803@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Nov 28, 95 11:31:18 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1930 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >>I've just installed an ASUS PCI-AV264CT video card, based on the >>Mach64 "CT" chipset, into an ASUS PCI/I-P54TP4 motherboard with 90MHz >>Pentium CPU. I'm planning to do some work on getting Mach64 CT support >>into XFree86. When I booted FreeBSD 2.1, the screen went blank fairly >>early in the boot probe sequence. When connected to a DPMS monitor, >>it went into "OFF" mode indicating no sync present. After a bit of >>experimentation I found that this problem could be avoided by disabling >>the two sio devices I had configures (sio0 and sio1). Enabling either >>one separately still resulted in the problem. > >>I've previously seen the video go blank for a fraction of a second when >>booting on a similar machine with an S3 964 card installed. I wondered >>why this happened, but since it didn't cause any problems I thought nothing >>more of it. > >>My guess is that the sio probe is writing to a Mach64 register. In the >>S3 case it is possilbly successfully restoring it too. I haven't had > >sio always writes 0 to port 0x2E8+4 (the modem control reg for the usual >sio3 address) if >= 1 sio device is configured. It doesn't attempt to >restore the original value; however, if sio3 is enabled at port IO_COM4, >as it is in GENERIC, then other values will be written to 0x2EC and nearby. > >The change at the end replaces bogus internal array of ports by the ones >specified in the config. This requires the config to specify sio2 and >sio3 if the ports exist even if they are unusable under FreeBSD due to >a conflict, and S3 owners to boot with -c and disable sio3 before the >monitor blows up :-). sio3 shouldn't be in GENERIC. The patch fixes the problem -- thanks! I don't understand why this means that the config must specify ports that are not usable under FreeBSD. I think "S3 owners" should be replaced by "IBM8514/A, S3, Mach{8,32,64} and any chipset with an 8514/A ancestory owners". David From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 04:53:23 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA03546 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 04:53:23 -0800 Received: from hda.com (hda.com [199.232.40.182]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA03540 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 04:53:19 -0800 Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id HAA08317; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 07:52:39 -0500 From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199511281252.HAA08317@hda.com> Subject: Re: Anyone keen to help me get a Phillips CDD 521 Recorder working? To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 07:52:38 -0500 (EST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511272240.XAA07448@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Nov 27, 95 11:40:05 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 971 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > > > I'll checkout rtprio, and I'm sorry I don't have all the specifics > > right now (you can probably find them at http://www.cdarchives.com) but > > the Yamaha is a 4X writer with only 512k buffer. > > 4times, 6times -- what's the base for the comparision? The unit is a single speed CDROM at 150K/s. So this 4X driver is 600K/s, so you have under a seconds data in the FIFO. (This makes more sense than the frame grabbers that I've seen advertised that operate at "twice real time".) > The SCSI bus itself can transfer about 8 MBytes/s continuously (on a > "standard" 8-bit controller, like the AHA-2940 or NCR 53c810). How > close do these burners come to that value? They hopefully burst into their RAM buffers at this speed to give you the latency you need to go read another chunk. -- Peter Dufault Real Time Machine Control and Simulation HD Associates, Inc. Voice: 508 433 6936 dufault@hda.com Fax: 508 433 5267 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 04:56:25 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA03690 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 04:56:25 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA03685 ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 04:56:18 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id XAA29508; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 23:53:01 +1100 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 23:53:01 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511281253.XAA29508@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: hsu@freefall.freebsd.org, kaleb@x.org Subject: Re: gcc-2.7.1 compiled kernel Cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >Is the -O2 -fno-strength-reduce bug fixed? No, according to this. Bruce Article 4048 of gnu.gcc.bug: Path: gidora.kralizec.net.au!warrane.connect.com.au!news.syd.connect.com.au!news.mel.connect.com.au!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!simtel!lll-winken.llnl.gov!uwm.edu!math.ohio-state.edu!cis.ohio-state.edu!crunch.ikp.physik.th-darmstadt.de!anlauf From: anlauf@crunch.ikp.physik.th-darmstadt.de (Harald Anlauf) Newsgroups: gnu.gcc.bug Subject: Bug on i386/Linux with unsigned and -fstrength-reduce Date: 22 Nov 1995 17:42:17 -0500 Organization: GNUs Not Usenet Lines: 60 Sender: daemon@cis.ohio-state.edu Approved: bug-gcc@prep.ai.mit.edu Distribution: gnu Message-ID: <9511222241.AA19094@crunch> Hi, I found an interesting bug in gcc versions 2.5.8, 2.7.0, and 2.7.1, compiled as i486-*-linuxoldld and running under Linux. Compiling the program given below with options: -O2, -O[123] -fstrength-reduce -O[123] -fstrength-reduce -fno-unroll-loops produces the (wrong) output: A[0] = -3 A[1] = 0 A[2] = 0 whereas it gives the correct result with -O[123] -fno-strength-reduce -O[123] -fstrength-reduce -funroll-loops produces the (correct) result: A[0] = -3 A[1] = -2 A[2] = -1 The funny thing is that changing the unsigned integer B to a signed integer fixes the problem. The problem persists with "unsigned long", but goes away for "unsigned short", "unsigned char", or "unsigned long long". Anybody knows what's going on? Ciao, Harald [I am not the original author of this little demo program. Somebody posted it to gnu.gcc.bug some time ago, but unfortunately I didn't keep the reference. So please don't flame me.] ------------------------------> cut here <------------------------------ #include int A[3]; unsigned int B = 3; void printit(void) { int i; for(i = 0; i < B; i++) fprintf(stdout, "A[%d] = %d\n", i, A[i]); } int main() { int i; for(i = 0; i < B; i++) A[i] = i - 3; printit(); return 0; } ------------------------------> cut here <------------------------------ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 05:09:59 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA04342 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:09:59 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA04333 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:09:53 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id AAA30172; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:06:57 +1100 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:06:57 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511281306.AAA30172@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au Subject: Re: Problem with sio probe and Mach64 PCI video card Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >>The change at the end replaces bogus internal array of ports by the ones >>specified in the config. This requires the config to specify sio2 and >>sio3 if the ports exist even if they are unusable under FreeBSD due to >>a conflict, and S3 owners to boot with -c and disable sio3 before the >>monitor blows up :-). sio3 shouldn't be in GENERIC. >The patch fixes the problem -- thanks! I don't understand why this means >that the config must specify ports that are not usable under FreeBSD. >I think "S3 owners" should be replaced by "IBM8514/A, S3, Mach{8,32,64} >and any chipset with an 8514/A ancestory owners". Com ports can get in each others way if they share an interrupt. There is only a problem after soft boots when the previous OS had interrupts enabled, but this problem is very confusing to debug and easy to fix if the ports are known - just initialize them all before attempting to use any. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 05:13:59 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA04557 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:13:59 -0800 Received: from expo.x.org (expo.x.org [198.112.45.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA04552 ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:13:55 -0800 Received: from exalt.x.org by expo.x.org id AA06946; Tue, 28 Nov 95 08:13:24 -0500 Received: from localhost by exalt.x.org id NAA13814; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:13:23 GMT Message-Id: <199511281313.NAA13814@exalt.x.org> To: Jeffrey Hsu Cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: gcc-2.7.1 compiled kernel In-Reply-To: Your message of Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:15:40 EDT. <199511280515.VAA02579@freefall.freebsd.org> Organization: X Consortium Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:13:22 EDT From: "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Is the -O2 -fno-strength-reduce bug fixed? (I think you meant the -fstrength-reduce bug) To confirm, no it's not fixed. Since 2.6.3 is equally broken though I wonder (semi-tongue-in-cheek) if this matters to -hackers. -- Kaleb KEITHLEY From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 05:23:56 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA05274 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:23:56 -0800 Received: from shell.monmouth.com (pechter@shell.monmouth.com [205.164.220.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA05269 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:23:53 -0800 Received: (from pechter@localhost) by shell.monmouth.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA24814 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:23:09 -0500 From: Bill/Carolyn Pechter Message-Id: <199511281323.IAA24814@shell.monmouth.com> Subject: Boot manager To: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD-hackers) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:23:09 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1413 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Jordan K. Hubbard stands accused of saying: > > > > > 1. I boot my 2.0.5R system and OS/2 from the OS/2 Bootmanager. I installed > > > 210R to sd2 and told sysinstall not to touch the bootblock. > > > Afterwards the bootmanager was deactivated, and the system booted the > > > old 205R partition by default. Hmm. > > > > This seems to be a problem, but neither Poul-Henning and I can figure > > out why. I literally don't write to a disk that's not selected, > > yet people are telling me the boot blocks are getting touched for their > > first drive anyway. I can't figure it out. > > The OS/2 bootmangler lives in a partition all to itself; I would guess > you're changing the active partition to point to the FreeBSD partition > (or the user is in the installer) > The 2.05 install made the FreeBSD partition the active one here. A quick boot of a dos floppy restored the normal functionality. The OS/2 Bootmanager was not harmed. I've used the OS/2 bootmanager along with OS-BS (both release and beta) and found they both worked flawlessly with FreeBSD 2.0.5. Bill ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bill Pechter/Carolyn Pechter | The postmaster always pings twice. Lakewood MicroSystems | 17 Meredith Drive, 908-389-3592 | Tinton Falls, NJ 07724 pechter@shell.monmouth.com | From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 05:28:09 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA05718 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:28:09 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id FAA05678 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:28:05 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Tue, 28 Nov 95 13:28 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id OAA26089; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:18:37 +0100 Message-Id: <199511281318.OAA26089@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Why is 'which' broken? (was: Where is the documentation for ibcs2?) To: chuckr@glue.umd.edu (Chuck Robey) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:12:41 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) In-Reply-To: from "Chuck Robey" at Nov 27, 95 07:20:35 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1007 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Chuck Robey writes: > > On Mon, 27 Nov 1995, Greg Lehey wrote: > > > BTW, 'which' is broken. It doesn't pay any attention to the PATH > > environment variable, so it can't tell you which one you'll run, just > > the one it thinks most likeley. This can be *very* confusing for a > > newbie. > > Greg, I hope I haven't taken your remark above too out of context, but > I'd like to contest your assertion of 'which' being broken, seeing as it > works quite well for me. I know it certainly does take MY path into > account. Could you explain why you think it's broken? Well, the reason why I *thought* it was broken was 1. It used to be broken in BSD/386. 2. When I tried it here, I created a file ls in my home directory, which is at the front of my path. which ls didn't find it. The problem was that I hadn't set ls to be executable, so this was correct behaviour. After setting it executable (and looking at the source), I see that it does, in fact, work correctly. Mea culpa Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 05:47:01 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA06375 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:47:01 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA06370 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:46:57 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id AAA31258; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:39:16 +1100 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:39:16 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511281339.AAA31258@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: davidg@Root.COM, terry@lambert.org Subject: Re: How can I remove hard links between directories? Cc: bob@luke.pmr.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> >David? Didn't we nuke the ability to hard-link directories some day >> >in 1.1.5.1? Should we nuke this again? >> >> I endured a significant amount of pain from all of the criticism of that >> change. While I think it's bogus to allow hard directory links in FFS, some >> other people disagree. ...but I think the other people are wrong, so yes, I >> think we should "nuke" them again. :-) I don't think you really want to remove the ".." links. That would be a lot of work. >I definitely agree with this. If you nuke directory hard links, it's >possible to maintain parent pointers and quickly reverse traverse the >directory hierarchy. There's nothing to stop you doing that anyway. Directory links other than to the parent only occur in damaged file systems. File systems without ".." links are inconvenient to traverse in user code. The hack for determining leaf directories doesn't work, so everything must be stat()ed to determine if it is a directory. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 06:28:20 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id GAA08110 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 06:28:20 -0800 Received: from ra.dkuug.dk (ra.dkuug.dk [193.88.44.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA08016 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 06:27:22 -0800 Received: (from sos@localhost) by ra.dkuug.dk (8.6.12/8.6.12) id PAA00302; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:24:52 +0100 Message-Id: <199511281424.PAA00302@ra.dkuug.dk> Subject: Re: Enough already! (Was: Where is the documentation for ibcs2?) To: grog@lemis.de Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:24:51 +0100 (MET) Cc: lyndon@orthanc.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199511281143.MAA25890@allegro.lemis.de> from "Greg Lehey" at Nov 28, 95 12:43:17 pm From: sos@FreeBSD.org Reply-to: sos@FreeBSD.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 2372 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Greg Lehey who wrote: > > Beyond that, I think we need to accept the fact that nobody has really > explained how it works. As Terry suspects, my vi that crapped out the > other day was trying to find a shared library. It's not clear from > his mail whether it would have worked if it had found one. In any > case, debugging it with gdb doesn't work: it doesn't get as far as > being executed. You need a COFF debugger, preferably compile FreeBSD native... > On the other hand, If anybody's interested, I have an almost complete > set of GNU SVR3 binaries, including GNU libc, which I developed on an > SCO system and which work there. I've tried out a statically linked > bash, and it works, sort of. It does some strange things from time to > time, such as deciding to receive an exit command, but it doesn't do > that if I ktrace it. Hmm, at the time I & Sean "invented" the iBCS2 (kernel)support I had a complete SCO system (3.2.2) running chrooted on my machine, including all the gnu stuff, so it can be done. I have NO idea if it works on the current iBCS2 system as it has only the COFF loader (and shlib support) in common with our original implementaion, the rest is stole^H^H^H^H^Htaken from NetBSD and differs from what I have on my boxes... It is funny though that now of a sudden iBCS2 support is "discovered" but nobody cared back in 1994 when it crept into the tree, so I (and I think Sean too) lost momentum on this rather big project. As Terry said there is MUCH MUCH more to iBCS2 emulation than the kernel support, and we doesn't even have a start on that yet... In my opinion we will at most get a 80% emulation, and that allready would cost ALOT of work on the whole source tree, plus "reinventing" lots & lots of SCO/svr3 utils etc etc... By the time such a major undertaking could be done, nobody would give a dime for that anymore as the world has moved meanwhile. When one comes to that conclusion it is fair to say that one has a pretty good understanding of the whole complex that is involved in making iBCS2 emulation a "real thing". Other that that doing the iBCS2 & the Linux emul was ALOT of fun.. take care.... -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team So much code to hack -- so little time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 06:32:21 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id GAA08322 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 06:32:21 -0800 Received: from fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov (fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov [137.75.131.171]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id GAA08314 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 06:32:18 -0800 Received: by fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov (5.57/Ultrix3.0-C) id AA24739; Tue, 28 Nov 95 08:32:12 -0600 Received: by emu.fsl.noaa.gov (1.38.193.4/SMI-4.1 (1.38.193.4)) id AA20459; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 07:32:11 -0700 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 07:32:11 -0700 From: kelly@fsl.noaa.gov (Sean Kelly) Message-Id: <9511281432.AA20459@emu.fsl.noaa.gov> To: bde@zeta.org.au Cc: jmacd@cory.eecs.berkeley.edu, phk@critter.tfs.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511281141.WAA26568@godzilla.zeta.org.au> (message from Bruce Evans on Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:41:08 +1100) Subject: Re: gcc 2.1.7 (and libg++) Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Bruce" == Bruce Evans writes: Bruce> I just deleted ASM_WEAKEN_LABEL() for 2.7.0. This may have Bruce> broken the C++ feature that depends on weak symbols. My compiler implementation days are long gone ... what the heck is a weak symbol? -- Sean Kelly NOAA Forecast Systems Laboratory, Boulder Colorado USA I think man invented the car by instinct. -- Jack Handey From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 07:09:55 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA10506 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 07:09:55 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA10500 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 07:09:46 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id CAA01593; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 02:05:01 +1100 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 02:05:01 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511281505.CAA01593@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: MsDoss FileSystem Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I've heard a lot about msdos filesystem support and that there are >limitations (bugs?). What exactly are the limitations of the the msdos See the open and analyzed Problem Reports about msdosfs. There are several locking problems. The main one is msdosfs_lookup() can deadlock because the buffer containing the directory entry is not released until too late. For ufs, IIRC the buffer containing the directory entry is released early and the required locking is provided by the buffer containing the inode is released late. This method doesn't work for msdosfs because the inode isn't separate. rename() is quite broken. The lock on the target directory must be given up before calling doscheckpath() to avoid deadlock. The resulting races are not handled properly. ufs has the same problem, but IIRC the consequences of races are less severe for ufs. Renaming to an empty directory with the same parent does the wrong thing: mkdir a b a/a1 rename("a", "b"); renames b to a/b instead of renaming a to b (atomically deleting b). There are several races. Races can't be fixed easily by locking everything because deadlock is close. Writing is slow and buggy. `dd if=/dev/zero of=/mnt/foo', where fd0 is mounted on /mnt, gets a throughput of less than 1K/sec. `dd if=/dev/zero of=/mnt/z bs=1m; ls' hangs in getblk(). This is probably related to other hangs in getblk() that have been reported recently. The msdosfs block size is 512 bytes, so 2048 buffers are required to cache the write effectively. FreeBSD can't supply that many buffers, so its buffer cache is even less effective than usual, and there are apparently problems when the buffer cache is stressed. >support? Does BSD/OS, NetBSD, Lites suffer from the same problems? NetBSD has kept it up to date better. E.g., in 4.4lite introduced waiting on VXLOCK in ufs_lock(). This change has propagated to msdosfs_lock() in NetBSD and not in FreeBSD. I don't know about Lites. Linux has better msdosfs support in half as much code. >If there is a problem, is there anyone working on it? (Yes, I might be able >to help). No one seems to be working on the FreeBSD version. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 07:29:53 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA11916 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 07:29:53 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA11911 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 07:29:46 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id CAA02383; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 02:28:15 +1100 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 02:28:15 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511281528.CAA02383@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, kelly@fsl.noaa.gov Subject: Re: gcc 2.1.7 (and libg++) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, jmacd@cory.eecs.berkeley.edu, phk@critter.tfs.com Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Bruce> I just deleted ASM_WEAKEN_LABEL() for 2.7.0. This may have > Bruce> broken the C++ feature that depends on weak symbols. >My compiler implementation days are long gone ... what the heck is a >weak symbol? It has something to do with allowing user functions to replace library functions. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 07:44:21 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA13142 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 07:44:21 -0800 Received: from sivka.carrier.kiev.ua (sivka.carrier.kiev.ua [193.125.68.130]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA12873 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 07:41:09 -0800 Received: from elvisti.kiev.ua (uucp@localhost) by sivka.carrier.kiev.ua (Sendmail 8.who.cares/5) with UUCP id QAA14255 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:31:16 +0200 Received: from office.elvisti.kiev.ua (office.elvisti.kiev.ua [193.125.28.33]) by spider2.elvisti.kiev.ua (8.6.12/8.ElVisti) with ESMTP id PAA06892 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:02:29 +0200 Received: (from stesin@localhost) by office.elvisti.kiev.ua (8.6.12/8.ElVisti) id PAA09617; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:02:28 +0200 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:02:28 +0200 From: "Andrew V. Stesin" Message-Id: <199511281302.PAA09617@office.elvisti.kiev.ua> To: hackers@freebsd.org Cc: ports@freebsd.org Subject: Thoughts on ports&packages policies and FS layout (was: Re: More nits) Organization: Electronni Visti InformAgency (ElVisti) X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2+] Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hello Peter da Silva, : > How do you handle namespace collisions? I would agree with this : > iff the utilities were installed somewhere outside of the standard : > PATH (i.e. in /usr/gnu/bin). : If they're installed from packages they'd be in /usr/local/bin. : I personally like having a /usr/gnu/bin myself. I vote for "/usr/gnu/bin" for the stuff from FSF which didn't come in a base distribution, too. : > My biggest complaint with the ports stuff right now is the way it : > scribbles all over /usr/local. Even worse, it isn't consistent (e.g. : > binaries installed in /usr/bin and support stuff under /usr/local/lib). : > /usr/local should be HANDS OFF to the vendor-supplied software, something : > I consider "ports" to be. Seems to be a reasonable observation. It really may be annoying. Suppose a (very realistic!) scenario: I'm installing a binary package, it sits itself down in /usr/local/*. But I'm _not_ satisfied with it and want to do some research and more experiments myself; I go get a "port" stuff (I mean the Makefile + patch-* things) as a starting point, and do some mine own experimental changes. Then what? `make install`, and the original binary package gets crippled. Bad. Or shall I create /usr/_My_local,really!/* to distinguish between what bits came from FreeBSD porters team and what are from me myself? :-) : > The ports software should be configured to install into either the : > standard directory tree, or into a seperate /usr/ports hierarchy. : I'd buy that. I like organizing things that way myself. But it's certainly : not what I'd call a super-high priority. a) It seems to me that this "two-faced" approach will fail totally due to a bunch of hard-compiled pathnames in many tools. b) I disagree with your last point about priorities -- the change itself is simple, it's a good time for it ('cause a release just went out recently, there's plenty of time to do it), and it will _really_ make life simplier for me, mr. Andrew Avg. User -- I'll be able to switch between mine and ported bits more easily and the default location of my local stuff will be mine back. Wouldn't Mr. Asami mind considering a change of a default port subtree $PREFIX, leaving /usr/local back to me? :-) -- With best regards -- Andrew Stesin. +380 (44) 2760188 +380 (44) 2713457 +380 (44) 2713560 An undocumented feature is a coding error. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 08:18:59 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id IAA15653 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:18:59 -0800 Received: from rocky.sri.MT.net (rocky.sri.MT.net [204.182.243.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA15645 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:18:52 -0800 Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.sri.MT.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id JAA16942; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:20:26 -0700 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:20:26 -0700 From: Nate Williams Message-Id: <199511281620.JAA16942@rocky.sri.MT.net> To: kelly@fsl.noaa.gov (Sean Kelly) Cc: jmacd@cory.eecs.berkeley.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: gcc 2.1.7 (and libg++) In-Reply-To: <9511280607.AA20231@emu.fsl.noaa.gov> References: <199511280241.SAA12560@cory.EECS.Berkeley.EDU> <9511280607.AA20231@emu.fsl.noaa.gov> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > You know, a new gcc might also fix problem report bin/230 > (constructors for global objects in shared libraries not called). You > guys wanna close that pr, right? Right? :-) Actually, I'm *pretty sure* that some patches I'm testing from John Polstra to the run-time linker will fix that problem. :) Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 08:48:57 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id IAA18075 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:48:57 -0800 Received: from expo.x.org (expo.x.org [198.112.45.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA18070 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:48:53 -0800 Received: from exalt.x.org by expo.x.org id AA13035; Tue, 28 Nov 95 11:48:21 -0500 Received: from localhost by exalt.x.org id QAA15023; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:48:20 GMT Message-Id: <199511281648.QAA15023@exalt.x.org> To: Bruce Evans Cc: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: gcc 2.1.7 (and libg++) In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 29 Nov 1995 02:28:15 EDT. <199511281528.CAA02383@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Organization: X Consortium Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:48:19 EDT From: "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > Bruce> I just deleted ASM_WEAKEN_LABEL() for 2.7.0. This may have > > Bruce> broken the C++ feature that depends on weak symbols. > > >My compiler implementation days are long gone ... what the heck is a > >weak symbol? > > It has something to do with allowing user functions to replace library > functions. > It's really for library developers. A programmer has always been able to replace library functions with his or her own functions, which may or may not be a good thing. One use of weak symbols for example, is if you build X on a platform with threads libX11 and libXt will reference thread functions. But a non-threaded program usually doesn't want to link with the thread library for performance (threads in a non-threaded program does add overhead) and other reasons. Stub routines in libc (with #pragma weak) allow the references in libX11 and libXt to be resolved without linking the threads library. But a real threaded program will link with the thread library and the semantics of weak will allow the symbols in the threads library to take precedence over the weak symbols in libc. (It took Sun a couple revs of Solaris to get this right, and Unixware 2.x didn't learn from Sun's mistakes.) -- Kaleb KEITHLEY From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 09:14:46 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA19434 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:14:46 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA19427 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:14:40 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id EAA05675; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 04:10:10 +1100 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 04:10:10 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511281710.EAA05675@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Subject: Re: 16 ports Boca - anyone using it? Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, hsu@clinet.fi, rich@spirit.com.au Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >> and fortunately somebody was at the office to observe the logic probe. >> The interrupt line is being held ACTIVE....???!!! (solid red on the probe, >> normally green). >Yecch. >> Do any sio-shared-interrupt-geniuses have any ideas? I can picture all >> sorts of plausible race conditions and I have no idea what the code is >> doing. The outer loop in siointr() is mainly for handling this problem. It is supposed to do enough to handle all relevant races. >ISA interrupts are edge-triggered, so something happened to lose you one. The edge of one. >You could possibly add some code to siopoll() to check the interrupt status >of open ports, and spew a console printf if it found a port with pending >interrupt status. Something like : > if (incc <= 0 || !(tp->t_state & TS_ISOPEN)) > continue; >+ disable_intr(); >+ iir = inb(com->int_id_port) & 0x07; >+ enable_intr(); >+ if (iir) >+ printf("sio%d: interrupt pending (%d) in poll\n", >+ com->unit,iir); > /* > * Avoid the grotesquely inefficient lineswitch routine > * (ttyinput) in "raw" mode. It usually takes about 450 >(Bruce is probably laughing himself silly over some obvious mistake I'm > making here, but that's what I'd start with). Heh heh :-). The test should be `if ((iir & 1) == 0)' and it might be better not to disable interrupts - you will see too many normal interrupts as it is. I would arrange to run the test when the device has wedged. It would be interesting to know which ports hang. >If this "works" (it may fill your log partition pretty quickly 8), then >we could find a way to call siointr to handle the missed interrupt. Just calling siointr() might work. It loops sufficiently. Writing to all affected devices has a small chance of working. sio's "smart" handling of this problem results in in only calling siointr1() for each device and separate calls to siointr1() probably wouldn't be atomic enough to clear the interrupt (modulo races, new output interrupts might keep the interrupt on). Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 09:20:09 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA19770 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:20:09 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA19624 ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:19:56 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Tue, 28 Nov 95 17:18 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id SAA26555; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 18:00:38 +0100 Message-Id: <199511281700.SAA26555@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Re: Enough already! (Was: Where is the documentation for ibcs2?) To: sos@FreeBSD.org Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 18:00:37 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD Hackers) In-Reply-To: <199511281424.PAA00302@ra.dkuug.dk> from "sos@FreeBSD.org" at Nov 28, 95 03:24:51 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 3185 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk sos@FreeBSD.org writes: > > In reply to Greg Lehey who wrote: > > > > Beyond that, I think we need to accept the fact that nobody has really > > explained how it works. As Terry suspects, my vi that crapped out the > > other day was trying to find a shared library. It's not clear from > > his mail whether it would have worked if it had found one. In any > > case, debugging it with gdb doesn't work: it doesn't get as far as > > being executed. > > You need a COFF debugger, preferably compile FreeBSD native... You don't understand. Watch my fingers: "it doesn't get as far as being executed." I have a gdb compiled under SCO 3.2.2 (by chance), though it still doesn't like the "user area" of the emulator: ptrace() bombs out looking for the eip value. To be more specific, you can't debug the vi problem because it bombs out of execve (look at the end of the function source: if things go wrong, it sends a SIGABRT). This is reasonable, since COFF effectively specifies multiple text segments in the header, and the file for one of them was missing. Possibly, though, we should consider a message stating the name of the missing file if it wasn't the executable itself. > > On the other hand, If anybody's interested, I have an almost complete > > set of GNU SVR3 binaries, including GNU libc, which I developed on an > > SCO system and which work there. I've tried out a statically linked > > bash, and it works, sort of. It does some strange things from time to > > time, such as deciding to receive an exit command, but it doesn't do > > that if I ktrace it. > > Hmm, at the time I & Sean "invented" the iBCS2 (kernel)support I had > a complete SCO system (3.2.2) running chrooted on my machine, including > all the gnu stuff, so it can be done. I have NO idea if it works on > the current iBCS2 system as it has only the COFF loader (and shlib > support) in common with our original implementaion, the rest is > stole^H^H^H^H^Htaken from NetBSD and differs from what I have on > my boxes... Well, I have had things run, anyway. I suppose I should try and fire up the SCO version of XFree86 :-) > It is funny though that now of a sudden iBCS2 support is "discovered" > but nobody cared back in 1994 when it crept into the tree, so I (and > I think Sean too) lost momentum on this rather big project. It's funny how a flame war can draw people's attention to things :-) > As Terry said there is MUCH MUCH more to iBCS2 emulation than the > kernel support, and we doesn't even have a start on that yet... > In my opinion we will at most get a 80% emulation, and that allready > would cost ALOT of work on the whole source tree, plus "reinventing" > lots & lots of SCO/svr3 utils etc etc... I don't think the idea should be to reinvent SCO. It should be to execute SCO executables. As you say: > By the time such a major undertaking could be done, nobody would > give a dime for that anymore as the world has moved meanwhile. > When one comes to that conclusion it is fair to say that one has > a pretty good understanding of the whole complex that is involved > in making iBCS2 emulation a "real thing". So when are we going for SVR4.2 emulation? Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 09:26:55 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA20109 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:26:55 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA20098 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:26:47 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id JAA01014; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:26:01 -0800 To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) cc: jfieber@indiana.edu (John Fieber), hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) Subject: Re: Documentation.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:10:15 +0100." <199511281010.LAA25489@allegro.lemis.de> Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:26:00 -0800 Message-ID: <1011.817579560@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > locking as the result of the change of struct flock. The binary I had > (elm) was compiled on BSD/386 1.1, and it didn't run on BSD/OS 2.0 > either. Now try compiling elm on BSD/OS 2.0 and running that under FreeBSD. That was what was referred to. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 09:36:29 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA20987 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:36:29 -0800 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA20982 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:36:26 -0800 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id LAA12747; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:35:48 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199511281735.LAA12747@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: 3940? To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:35:47 -0600 (CST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199511280911.UAA20911@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Nov 28, 95 08:11:23 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >Related, but not really: pet peeve of the day: DK_NDRIVE is set to 8 in > >sys/dkstat.h. This effectively limits the number of drives I can get > >statistics on - statistics that would tend to be more useful the more drives > >I have. Is there any harm in increasing this? My news box has a dozen > >disks. > > I think you're supposed to increase it if you have a lot of disks. Don't > forget to recompile all utilities that depend on it. Okay, thanks, I suppose I can bust my news server trying this out :-) I started looking into this when I noticed some brokenness w.r.t. systat and other utilities, there are other deficiencies as well out in userland (systat/etc try to display device names as "sd" and a single digit, doesn't work at large sites :-) ) which I had been intending to patch and submit, but it wasn't really worth my time if it wasn't able to display "interesting" disks!! > >(I also noticed: extern int dk_busy; /* bit field of busy drives */ > >which is sorta scary :-) wonder how many other places there are hidden > >limits built in?) > > dk_busy is only supported by the wd driver. I guess that's why the msps > field in systat only sort of works for wd drives. DK_NDRIVE must be > less than the number of bits in an int for dk_busy to work right. I > think most of the limits are explicit (like DK_NDRIVE). Of course, > this is the wrong way to do things. Ecccch. :-) Thank you for the background and information... very helpful. ;-) ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 09:37:38 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA21090 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:37:38 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA21079 ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:37:33 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id JAA01158; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:37:20 -0800 To: sos@freebsd.org cc: cshenton@apollo.hq.nasa.gov, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:37:42 +0100." <199511280737.IAA17464@ra.dkuug.dk> Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:37:20 -0800 Message-ID: <1156.817580240@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Hmm, I allready sent you a "technology demo" of the mouse stuff > half a year ago or something, forgot ?? :) :) No, I remember it quite well. You sent it to me, I tried it, it didn't work, I told you it didn't work, you went: "Hmmm!" :-) I think you just forgot to follow up.. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 09:57:07 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA22415 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:57:07 -0800 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA22410 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:57:02 -0800 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id LAA12778; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:54:20 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199511281754.LAA12778@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: 16 ports Boca - anyone using it? To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:54:20 -0600 (CST) Cc: rich@spirit.com.au, hsu@clinet.fi, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511280856.IAA07993@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Nov 28, 95 08:56:16 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Joe Greco stands accused of saying: > Yecch. I've used that word a lot lately, myself :-) > You could possibly add some code to siopoll() to check the interrupt status > of open ports, and spew a console printf if it found a port with pending > interrupt status. Something like : Ok, I am installing: wye# diff -c sio.c{.fcs,} *** sio.c.fcs Tue May 30 03:03:06 1995 --- sio.c Tue Nov 28 11:50:18 1995 *************** *** 1570,1575 **** --- 1570,1581 ---- } if (incc <= 0 || !(tp->t_state & TS_ISOPEN)) continue; + + /* Bruce Evans / Michael Smith debug patch.. */ + iir = inb(com->int_id_port) & 0x07; + if ((iir & 1) == 0) + log(LOG_DEBUG, "sio%d: IRQ pending (%d) in poll\n", com->unit, iir); + /* * XXX only do this when we bypass ttyinput. */ and I will report what happens when it happens. Thanks guys, I appreciate the help from people who know what the code is doing... ;-) ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 10:05:54 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA23003 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 10:05:54 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA22994 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 10:05:39 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Tue, 28 Nov 95 18:05 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id TAA27256; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:05:02 +0100 Message-Id: <199511281805.TAA27256@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Re: Documentation.. To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:05:02 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) In-Reply-To: <1011.817579560@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 28, 95 09:26:00 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 375 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Jordan K. Hubbard writes: > > > locking as the result of the change of struct flock. The binary I had > > (elm) was compiled on BSD/386 1.1, and it didn't run on BSD/OS 2.0 > > either. > > Now try compiling elm on BSD/OS 2.0 and running that under FreeBSD. That > was what was referred to. Aha. How about that--it SIGSEGVs out of start. Is this known behaviour? Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 10:09:12 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA23173 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 10:09:12 -0800 Received: from austin.polstra.com (austin.polstra.com [198.211.214.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA23166 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 10:09:04 -0800 Received: from austin.polstra.com (jdp@localhost) by austin.polstra.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA14642; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 10:08:35 -0800 Message-Id: <199511281808.KAA14642@austin.polstra.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.4 10/10/95 To: kelly@fsl.noaa.gov Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: gcc 2.1.7 (and libg++) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 10:08:35 -0800 From: John Polstra Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In <9511280607.AA20231@emu.fsl.noaa.gov>, kelly@fsl.noaa.gov (Sean Kelly) wrote: > You know, a new gcc might also fix problem report bin/230 (constructors > for global objects in shared libraries not called). You guys wanna > close that pr, right? Right? :-) Are you sure that one's not already fixed? I believe that problem should have been fixed as of at least the October or November snaps of FreeBSD. If you have a test case that fails, please send it to me. I'm working on both ld.so and ld, and want to make sure that stuff like this works absolutely correctly. -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-knowledge is always bad news." -- John Barth From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 11:01:22 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA26681 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:01:22 -0800 Received: from apollo.hq.nasa.gov (apollo.hq.nasa.gov [131.182.121.87]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA26665 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:00:55 -0800 Received: from wirehead.hq.nasa.gov (wirehead.hq.nasa.gov [131.182.121.88]) by apollo.hq.nasa.gov (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id TAA05627; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:02:03 GMT Received: from localhost (cshenton@localhost) by wirehead.hq.nasa.gov (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA15292; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:02:02 GMT Message-Id: <199511281902.TAA15292@wirehead.hq.nasa.gov> X-Authentication-Warning: wirehead.hq.nasa.gov: cshenton owned process doing -bs X-Authentication-Warning: wirehead.hq.nasa.gov: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: hackers@freebsd.org cc: Bruce Evans Subject: Re: MsDoss FileSystem In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 29 Nov 1995 02:05:01 +1100." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:01:57 -0500 From: Chris Shenton Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Along these lines, is there any facility to mount an WinDozeNT filesystem? Thanks. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 11:15:32 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA27355 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:15:32 -0800 Received: from ufrmsa1.Olivetti.za (root@ufrmsa1.Olivetti.za [160.124.2.20]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA27349 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:15:21 -0800 Received: from neptune by ufrmsa1.Olivetti.za with uucp (Smail3.1.29.1 #3) id m0tKVOx-000IaNC; Tue, 28 Nov 95 21:09 GMT+0200 Received: by neptune.ru.ac.za (Smail3.1.28.1 #10) id m0tKUx9-00000HC; Tue, 28 Nov 95 20:40 SAT Message-Id: Subject: System locks during disk activity To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:40:26 +0200 (SAT) From: geoff%neptune@ufrmsa1.Olivetti.za Reply-To: geoff%neptune@ufrmsa1.Olivetti.za X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 680 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I have been having hassles with recent kernels (the most recent one is from 26/11/95), with my system (i386/Dx33 2 IDE drives) locking up during disk activity -- normally killing it during bootup. Fortunately, I still have a kernel from 18/11, which still works. (Anything after that locks the system.) My first reaction is that this might be due to a change in wd.c - but putting back the older wd.c (with wd_externalise() rewritten) didn't help. Any thoughts? Geoff. (PS: I am not on this list at the moment.) -- Geoff Rehmet | ____ _ o /\ geoff%neptune@ufrmsa1.olivetti.za |___ _-\_<, / /\/\ PGP key available on request | (*)/'(*) /\/ / \ \ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 11:26:26 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA27835 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:26:26 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA27825 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:26:21 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA01588; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:25:28 -0800 To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) cc: hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) Subject: Re: Documentation.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:05:02 +0100." <199511281805.TAA27256@allegro.lemis.de> Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:25:28 -0800 Message-ID: <1586.817586728@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Jordan K. Hubbard writes: > > > > > locking as the result of the change of struct flock. The binary I had > > > (elm) was compiled on BSD/386 1.1, and it didn't run on BSD/OS 2.0 > > > either. > > > > Now try compiling elm on BSD/OS 2.0 and running that under FreeBSD. That > > was what was referred to. > > Aha. How about that--it SIGSEGVs out of start. Is this known behaviour? > > Greg Uh. Greg, you really should read your mail more thoroughly. This is the issue you've been discussing WRT "BSDI compatibility" the whole time.. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 11:48:23 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA29188 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:48:23 -0800 Received: from netcom22.netcom.com (bakul@netcom22.netcom.com [192.100.81.136]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA29183 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:48:22 -0800 Received: from localhost by netcom22.netcom.com (8.6.12/Netcom) id LAA09621; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:46:39 -0800 Message-Id: <199511281946.LAA09621@netcom22.netcom.com> To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 95 16:34:41 PST." <853.817518881@time.cdrom.com> Date: Tue, 28 Nov 95 11:46:38 -0800 From: Bakul Shah Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Instead of going for a full httpd and CGI interface, you implement a > library that allows pretty much any event driven application to "grow > an HTTP port". You write your "forms" in a higher level pastiche of > HTML and some sort of imbeded tags that let you specify which callback > routines to call when a given HTML object is manipulated in some way. Bingo! That is exactly it! > The viewer would see HTML, your legacy app would see a different sort > of command interpreter. Yup! > Would you be interested in exploring an option like that, as well as > the option of using existing server technology and CGI? Sure. Let us take this offline though. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 12:17:02 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id MAA01581 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 12:17:02 -0800 Received: from vegemite.Stanford.EDU (2842@vegemite.Stanford.EDU [36.159.0.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA01575 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 12:16:59 -0800 Received: (hlew@localhost) by vegemite.Stanford.EDU (8.7.1/8.6.4) id MAA18270; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 12:15:35 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 12:15:35 -0800 (PST) From: Howard Lew To: cg@www.ati.khs-linz.ac.at cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: To all fbsdboot and winboot users ... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 27 Nov 1995, Christian Gusenbauer wrote: > > Hi! > > I'd like to know, if fbsdboot and winboot work with Win95?! Is there > anybody out there with some experience? > Yes! fbsdboot.exe works great! That's how I got the DTC2278EB controller with LBA to run FreeBSD and Win 95 even though the controller seems to be incompatible with FreeBSD at first. As for the winboot thing? I'm not sure what that is.... But all I need to do is drop to a DOS prompt. > I'm planning a new release of fbsdboot/winboot during my Xmas holidays, > which should support booting from various harddisk/controller > combinations. Are there nice guys out there willing to help testing :)? > > Thanks, > Christian. > > -- > Christian Gusenbauer > > Please note my new email address: > cg@www.ati.khs-linz.ac.at > /--------------------------------------\ / Howard Lew \ < Email: hlew@genome.stanford.edu > \ http://www.shoppersnet.com / \--------------------------------------/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 12:37:19 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id MAA03207 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 12:37:19 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA03198 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 12:37:06 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA21979; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:31:26 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511282031.NAA21979@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Better scsi and e-net support... To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:31:25 -0700 (MST) Cc: mercierm@bose.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511280214.SAA22317@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Nov 27, 95 06:14:30 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1187 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > Sorry to be a jerk, but I find it hard to believe that there are more people > > out in the US that have a Compaq DeskPro XL or an HP Vectra XU that use the > > AMD PCI PCnet / PCscsi controller, other than myself. (since it is > > integrated into the motherboard) > > never heard of it... > What drivers we have is dependent on what hardware is owned by > people who write drivers.. It appears that none of these people > have the AMD mumble chips :| It's a $35 part (qty 1000) that has both an ethernet and SCSI controller in it. If it hadn't been so hyped and preannounced and delayed, it might have even been the IDE killer it claimed to be. I'm not sure without his part number, but the one I saw press on had direct interface via PCI. Supposedly, both parts, as long as you know the IRQ, BASE, and DMA, will work with existing drivers for other AMD chips (which we already have in FreeBSD). The trick is knowing what to tell the drivers, and which drivers to use when you boot "kernel -c". Finding that out is really his problem. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 13:05:06 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA05294 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:05:06 -0800 Received: from rocky.sri.MT.net (rocky.sri.MT.net [204.182.243.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA05282 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:04:56 -0800 Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.sri.MT.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id OAA17869; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:07:22 -0700 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:07:22 -0700 From: Nate Williams Message-Id: <199511282107.OAA17869@rocky.sri.MT.net> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Unix-Review achievement awards Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Thought this was funny. Whiner's Aware (Given each year to the OS whose users can't understand why the whole world doesn't embrace it's obvious superiority): LINUX (Previous winners: NeXT, OS/2) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 13:16:59 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA06235 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:16:59 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA06187 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:16:12 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id WAA07069 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:14:53 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA26358 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:14:53 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id WAA11437 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:13:42 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511282113.WAA11437@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Anyone keen to help me get a Phillips CDD 521 Recorder working? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:13:42 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511281252.HAA08317@hda.com> from "Peter Dufault" at Nov 28, 95 07:52:38 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 500 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Peter Dufault wrote: > > > 4times, 6times -- what's the base for the comparision? > > The unit is a single speed CDROM at 150K/s. So this 4X driver is 600K/s, > so you have under a seconds data in the FIFO. Aha. > (This makes more sense than the frame grabbers that I've seen advertised that > operate at "twice real time".) :-) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 13:22:15 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA06479 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:22:15 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA06463 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:22:05 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA22060; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:17:10 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511282117.OAA22060@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Enough already! (Was: Where is the documentation for ibcs2?) To: grog@lemis.de Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:17:10 -0700 (MST) Cc: lyndon@orthanc.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199511281143.MAA25890@allegro.lemis.de> from "Greg Lehey" at Nov 28, 95 12:43:17 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 3011 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > 3. the program /usr/bin/ibcs2 really belongs in /usr/sbin, as Terry > says. I don't agree that that absolves it from needing > documentation. Actually, the module should be in the non-existant directory that isn't referenced in FILES as a default path prefix for relative paths if the module isn't located relative to the current working directory. Maybe something like "/usr/lkm" or "/lkm" or whatever. Said "FILES" line being in the "modload(8)" man page, after modload is modified to have a "default relative path prefix" so that the addition to the "modload(8)" documentation would be correct. That is, the shell script "ibcs2" shouldn't exist at all... And not existing, it should not have a man page. Then for future directions: /etc/sysconfig, taking on a SNMP/.Xconfig flavor, needs several lines like: lkm.eclass.ibcs2.magic: lkm.eclass.ibsc2.desc: "SCO/SVR3 ABI Support" lkm.eclass.ibcs2.load: NO lkm.eclass.ibcs2.kmods: ibcs2_coff_mod,socksys_mod The module loader needs to be moved into the kernel, both to allow demand loading of modules, and to get rid of the kernel symbol stacking order requirements (gee, you could even SNMP manage something like this, assuing you used IBM's multiple agent registration model for SNMP II (suprise! IBM's source code for this is available for free as a streams module!). Then when you try to run something (which God only knows how you installed without install tools unless you already read and understood the source code), it will say: You must load the following option using the system configuration and installation tool before you can run this program: SCO/SVR3 ABI Support On the console, or even to the user, if you have a clever shell that recognizes exec error returns, or we ever get around to implementing a decent broadcast mechanism that knows the terminal emulation is in the base state before sending it's data (you need one of these for transparent printing using printers attached to terminals AUX ports anyway). If lkm demand loading is present, then we can assume that ".load" won't be "YES" or "DEMAND" unless the libraries and other crap are present. If it's "DEMAND", then the ".magic" lines are used to recognize the set of modules needed, and they are loaded transparently and the binary is run as if "YES" had been specified. Even without "DEMAND" as an option (simple "YES/NO" option), the error message is sufficient documentation, assuming the other pieces are there. The remaining documentation can be installed as part of the ABI package mechanism, since you will need it installed to be able to get reasonable (non-random) responses from attempting to install non-native binaries without working IBCS2 installation tools. Obviously, the remaining documentation must wait until the remaining pieces are written. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 13:25:39 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA06641 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:25:39 -0800 Received: from linux4nn.iaf.nl (root@linux4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA06624 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:25:22 -0800 Received: from uni4nn.iaf.nl (root@uni4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.33]) by linux4nn.iaf.nl (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id WAA04018 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:26:46 +0100 Received: by uni4nn.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA26006 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org); Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:25:41 +0100 Received: by iafnl.es.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA21797 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4); Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:46:10 +0100 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA01951 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:30:44 +0100 From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199511281930.UAA01951@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: strange console behaviour on 205R /S3 VGA To: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers list) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:30:44 +0100 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 783 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Gents (ladies???) After switching my machine to an Asus P55TP4XE with a Digital S3 928-based VGA card I have strange phenomena on my console: - in text mode e.g. with elm or when switching virtual screens there remain characters from the 'previous' screen on the 'new' screen. Pressing eg ^L when in vi or elm cures the picture. - when in X some random bits in the root window seem to be flipped. System is on 205R BTW and works like a charm otherwise. Any suggestions on this one? _ __________________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 13:27:11 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA06695 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:27:11 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA06689 ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:27:00 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA22080; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:22:39 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511282122.OAA22080@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Enough already! (Was: Where is the documentation for ibcs2?) To: grog@lemis.de Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:22:39 -0700 (MST) Cc: sos@FreeBSD.org, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199511281700.SAA26555@allegro.lemis.de> from "Greg Lehey" at Nov 28, 95 06:00:37 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 605 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > So when are we going for SVR4.2 emulation? SVR4.2 has kernel threads, file system ACLs and attribution, SMP support, and user provided priority classes, like "fixed", that it uses to work around the buffer cache trashing of the X server from ld mmap'ing all the object modules in. Probably some time after the infrastructure necessary to support SVR4.2 applications has made its way into BSD. BSD has a bit of a way to go and is now the one playing "catch up". Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 13:29:41 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA06922 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:29:41 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA06915 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:29:36 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id VAA11326 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:50:22 +0100 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id VAA13252 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:50:21 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.7.1/keltia-uucp-2.6) id UAA29572 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:27:06 +0100 (MET) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199511281927.UAA29572@keltia.freenix.fr> Subject: Executor To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers' list) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:27:06 +0100 (MET) X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1378 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8b] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Has anyone tried to run the Linux binary of Executor under -CURRENT ? I've tried and the only thing I get is a SEGV... I haven't the binary right now but I'll test it further. It is only 40$ and I'm willing to pay if I can run the Linux binary. I asked for a BSD binary but they're waiting for the 2.0 to go out before trying to port it. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #7: Mon Nov 6 21:08:06 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 13:36:51 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA07587 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:36:51 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA07581 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:36:46 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA22102; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:30:12 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511282130.OAA22102@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: MsDoss FileSystem To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:30:12 -0700 (MST) Cc: chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511281505.CAA01593@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Nov 29, 95 02:05:01 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1204 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >support? Does BSD/OS, NetBSD, Lites suffer from the same problems? > > NetBSD has kept it up to date better. E.g., in 4.4lite introduced waiting > on VXLOCK in ufs_lock(). This change has propagated to msdosfs_lock() in > NetBSD and not in FreeBSD. I don't know about Lites. Linux has better > msdosfs support in half as much code. This is actually broken. The underlying FS locking, as I said in a previous message, should be moved to the vncalls layer (vfs_syscalls.c in kern in BSD parlance). The problem is in the use of vnode/inode disassociation, which is broken anyway: the buffer chain for a vnode will not be reclaimed even though it is in core if only a partial chain exists. The clustering code (unhappily) does not order the buffers in a cluster in the LRU to be adjacent and in reverse order. The Linux code uses non-vmio, so integration would require a lot of work or using non-vmio. The non-vmio in FreeBSD has not really been kept up to date with the vmio code, so some integration from NetBSD should be done if you choose this path. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 13:39:23 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA07720 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:39:23 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA07712 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:39:16 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA22114; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:34:25 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511282134.OAA22114@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: MsDoss FileSystem To: cshenton@apollo.hq.nasa.gov (Chris Shenton) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:34:25 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, bde@zeta.org.au In-Reply-To: <199511281902.TAA15292@wirehead.hq.nasa.gov> from "Chris Shenton" at Nov 28, 95 02:01:57 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 382 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > Along these lines, is there any facility to mount an WinDozeNT > filesystem? Read only, using code from Linux. The read/write requires a full on logging implementation, and the VFS interface as it currently sits is not up to the task. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 13:52:39 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA08713 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:52:39 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA08706 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:52:23 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id WAA08096; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:52:15 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA26715; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:52:14 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id WAA11884; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:36:25 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511282136.WAA11884@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Problem with sio probe and Mach64 PCI video card To: dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (David Dawes) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:36:25 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511281013.VAA17585@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> from "David Dawes" at Nov 28, 95 09:13:32 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 635 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As David Dawes wrote: > > As a side note, I tried PCVT (At first I wondered if syscons was causing > a problem since that was the last message I initally saw flash up before > the screen disappeared), and noticed that the arrow keys don't work in > the visual mode of "/kernel -c". I think this is a known problem. pcvt defaults to the OA etc. arrow key sequences. (I believe it should default to [A etc., and only switch to "application mode" if requested.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 13:53:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA08779 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:53:40 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA08765 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:53:30 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id WAA08092 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:52:13 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA26714 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:52:13 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id WAA11847 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:33:18 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511282133.WAA11847@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:33:17 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from "Chuck Robey" at Nov 27, 95 07:20:35 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 594 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Chuck Robey wrote: > > > BTW, 'which' is broken. It doesn't pay any attention to the PATH > > environment variable, so it can't tell you which one you'll run, just > > the one it thinks most likeley. This can be *very* confusing for a > > newbie. Because he's confusing it with the useless 4.4BSD whereis(1)? I used to have a replacement for whereis somewhere around. I have to dig it up. It resembles the 4.3BSD whereis. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 14:32:17 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA11853 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:32:17 -0800 Received: from shell.monmouth.com (pechter@shell.monmouth.com [205.164.220.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA11767 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:32:11 -0800 Received: (from pechter@localhost) by shell.monmouth.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id RAA21155; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 17:31:16 -0500 From: Bill/Carolyn Pechter Message-Id: <199511282231.RAA21155@shell.monmouth.com> Subject: Re: Executor To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 17:31:15 -0500 (EST) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD-hackers) In-Reply-To: <199511281927.UAA29572@keltia.freenix.fr> from "Ollivier Robert" at Nov 28, 95 08:27:06 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 768 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Has anyone tried to run the Linux binary of Executor under -CURRENT ? > > I've tried and the only thing I get is a SEGV... I haven't the binary right > now but I'll test it further. It is only 40$ and I'm willing to pay if I > can run the Linux binary. > > I asked for a BSD binary but they're waiting for the 2.0 to go out before > trying to port it. Boy I'm glad to hear they're considering a port. I asked them a year ago. Bill ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bill Pechter/Carolyn Pechter | The postmaster always pings twice. Lakewood MicroSystems | 17 Meredith Drive, 908-389-3592 | Tinton Falls, NJ 07724 pechter@shell.monmouth.com | From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 14:47:39 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA13095 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:47:39 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA13090 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:47:35 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id OAA24442; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:46:57 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511282246.OAA24442@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: Documentation.. To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:46:57 -0800 (PST) Cc: grog@lemis.de, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <1586.817586728@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 28, 95 11:25:28 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 724 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > Jordan K. Hubbard writes: > > > > > > > locking as the result of the change of struct flock. The binary I had > > > > (elm) was compiled on BSD/386 1.1, and it didn't run on BSD/OS 2.0 > > > > either. > > > > > > Now try compiling elm on BSD/OS 2.0 and running that under FreeBSD. That > > > was what was referred to. > > > > Aha. How about that--it SIGSEGVs out of start. Is this known behaviour? > > > > Greg > > Uh. Greg, you really should read your mail more thoroughly. This is > the issue you've been discussing WRT "BSDI compatibility" the whole > time.. :-) > > Jordan > It'd be interesting to see what they were trying to achieve.... anyone know WHY it SEGV's? what does ktrace say? gdb? From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 14:48:08 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA13212 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:48:08 -0800 Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA13204 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:48:06 -0800 Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.6.12/8.6.9.1) id PAA18363 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:48:04 -0700 From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199511282248.PAA18363@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Thumbs up? Or down?? (disk recommend) To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:48:04 -0700 (MST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 140 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Greetings! I was planning on picking up some MC3243 drives (4.3G, 8.?mS) and wondered if any have comments pro or con? Thanx! --don From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 14:57:42 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA13680 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:57:42 -0800 Received: from chrome.jdl.com (chrome.onramp.net [199.1.166.202]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA13666 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:57:30 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chrome.jdl.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA13681 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:56:25 -0600 Message-Id: <199511282256.QAA13681@chrome.jdl.com> X-Authentication-Warning: chrome.jdl.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: 2.1.0 Install went smoothly! Clarity-Index: null Threat-Level: none Software-Engineering-Dead-Seriousness: There's no excuse for unreadable code. Net-thought: If you meet the Buddha on the net, put him in your Kill file. Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:56:24 -0600 From: Jon Loeliger Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi folks, I just wanted to let you *all* know that my installation of the 2.1.0-RELEASE went quite smoothly on the spare machine! I'll give it a couple days of shake out while I backup the Real Machine, and convert over. A good job! A special thanks to Jordan for a fine installation process too. Minor notes were: - During boot's "-c" config, leaving "visual" screen, I expected to go back to the normal "-c" screen. No problem, just unexpected. Dunno. - I wasn't sure what a "normal partition" was to be compatible with other OSes on a disk after I hit "A" for a total disk layout. What was I doing before when I selected "A"? [Did that English right? :-] - Why does the default FreeBSD file system layout place /var in its own filesystem? Is this one of those subtle sysadmin issues I've zoned? - Any chance of keeping a running total of the sizes while checking off the "I want [this] and [this]" items? - I pondered some of the "Do you wnat option enabled?" screens. Was it going to do more than just set the right sysconfig option? Hmm... Like, at some point (in the future), I'd like to enable and use Samba. Should I say yes now? I'm currently NOT prepared to answer more questions about it, or actually install/config it. Can I answer "Yes"? Will it also do *other* config things? Dunno. Better "No" it for now... - Nit: "Congradulations" is spelled "Congratulations". Sigh. Congratulations on a fine install! jdl From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 15:01:17 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA14024 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:01:17 -0800 Received: from nomad.osmre.gov (nomad.osmre.gov [192.243.129.244]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA14004 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:01:04 -0800 Received: (from gfoster@localhost) by nomad.osmre.gov (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA14720; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 18:00:31 -0500 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 18:00:31 -0500 From: Glen Foster Message-Id: <199511282300.SAA14720@nomad.osmre.gov> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: posessed by daemons? Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I am having very weird problems with a machine that I am trying to bring from 1026-SNAP to 2.1.0-RELEASE through the make world/build kernel/make world process. The src seemed to extract OK but I found a couple of bit flips in various files that killed the compile. When checking this out I found that md5's on the src tgzs were not consistent, and inconsistent in a weird way. If I do 'md5 *' in the src directory, three or four of the 131 files don't match the md5's on the same files generated on another machine. Different files exhibit this from run to run! However, I can do 'repeat 10000 md5 sgnu.aa | sort | uniq' and not get any mismatches (no matter what value of sgnu.aa I select :-). I am seriously mistrusting this machine at this point! It is a P90, SiS, L2 cache disabled, 2940, 4GB Barracuda, as slow as the CMOS will let me on the memory accesses. I don't know whether to blame the memory or disk sub-systems. Of course, no errors are ever reported on either and for user stuff it runs like a champ, although it is very lightly loaded. There may be some incremental bit rot going on but I haven't seen any in the three weeks or so it has been up. WTF is going on? I can, of course, get more info. on the motherboard if it will help. Thanks, Glen Foster From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 15:07:04 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA14447 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:07:04 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA14439 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:07:01 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA24594; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:01:24 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511282301.QAA24594@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Executor To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:01:24 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199511281927.UAA29572@keltia.freenix.fr> from "Ollivier Robert" at Nov 28, 95 08:27:06 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 486 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Has anyone tried to run the Linux binary of Executor under -CURRENT ? I believe Amancio reported it running after installing shared libraries and so on. > I asked for a BSD binary but they're waiting for the 2.0 to go out before > trying to port it. 2.1 has shipped. Ask again. Jordan will probably send them a 2.1 CD if they wanted it. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 15:19:42 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA15222 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:19:42 -0800 Received: from ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (ki1.Chemie.FU-Berlin.DE [160.45.24.21]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id PAA15211 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:19:33 -0800 Received: by ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (Smail3.1.28.1) from prospero (130.133.3.126) with smtp id ; Wed, 29 Nov 95 00:14 MET Received: (from graichen@localhost) by prospero (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA01125; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 12:34:44 +0100 From: Thomas Graichen Message-Id: <199511281134.MAA01125@prospero> Subject: Re: gcc-2.7.1 compiled kernel To: hsu@freefall.freebsd.org (Jeffrey Hsu) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 12:34:43 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511280515.VAA02579@freefall.freebsd.org> from "Jeffrey Hsu" at Nov 27, 95 09:15:40 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 679 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Is the -O2 -fno-strength-reduce bug fixed? > i haven't tested it - but from the changelog - no t _______________________________________________________||___________________ __|| Perfection is reached, not when there is no __|| thomas graichen longer anything to add, but when there __|| freie universitaet berlin is no longer anything to take away __|| fachbereich physik __|| - Antoine de Saint-Exupery - __|| graichen@mail.physik.fu-berlin.de ___________________________||__________________graichen@FreeBSD.org_________ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 15:20:05 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA15310 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:20:05 -0800 Received: from ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (ki1.Chemie.FU-Berlin.DE [160.45.24.21]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id PAA15251 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:19:56 -0800 Received: by ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (Smail3.1.28.1) from prospero (130.133.3.126) with smtp id ; Wed, 29 Nov 95 00:14 MET Received: (from graichen@localhost) by prospero (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA01104; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 12:33:11 +0100 From: Thomas Graichen Message-Id: <199511281133.MAA01104@prospero> Subject: Re: Anyone keen to help me get a Phillips CDD 521 Recorder working? To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 12:33:10 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511272240.XAA07448@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Nov 27, 95 11:40:05 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1121 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > As Douglas Ambrisko wrote: > > > > I'll checkout rtprio, and I'm sorry I don't have all the specifics > > right now (you can probably find them at http://www.cdarchives.com) but > > the Yamaha is a 4X writer with only 512k buffer. > > 4times, 6times -- what's the base for the comparision? > > The SCSI bus itself can transfer about 8 MBytes/s continuously (on a > "standard" 8-bit controller, like the AHA-2940 or NCR 53c810). How > close do these burners come to that value? > i think the base is single speed cd - ~150 k per sec t _______________________________________________________||___________________ __|| Perfection is reached, not when there is no __|| thomas graichen longer anything to add, but when there __|| freie universitaet berlin is no longer anything to take away __|| fachbereich physik __|| - Antoine de Saint-Exupery - __|| graichen@mail.physik.fu-berlin.de ___________________________||__________________graichen@FreeBSD.org_________ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 15:49:05 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA17561 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:49:05 -0800 Received: from tcsi.tcs.com (tcsi.tcs.com [137.134.41.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA17553 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:48:58 -0800 Received: from phact.tcs.com (phact.tcs.com [137.134.41.99]) by tcsi.tcs.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with ESMTP id PAA06132; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:45:33 -0800 Received: from cozumel.tcs.com (cozumel.tcs.com [137.134.104.12]) by phact.tcs.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with ESMTP id PAA11017; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:45:32 -0800 From: Douglas Ambrisko Received: (ambrisko@localhost) by cozumel.tcs.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) id PAA09388; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:45:17 -0800 Message-Id: <199511282345.PAA09388@cozumel.tcs.com> Subject: Re: Anyone keen to help me get a Phillips CDD 521 Recorder working? To: dufault@hda.com (Peter Dufault) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:45:16 -0800 (PST) Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199511281252.HAA08317@hda.com> from "Peter Dufault" at Nov 28, 95 07:52:38 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 2214 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Peter Dufault writes: | | > > | > > I'll checkout rtprio, and I'm sorry I don't have all the specifics | > > right now (you can probably find them at http://www.cdarchives.com) but | > > the Yamaha is a 4X writer with only 512k buffer. | > | > 4times, 6times -- what's the base for the comparision? | | The unit is a single speed CDROM at 150K/s. So this 4X driver is 600K/s, | so you have under a seconds data in the FIFO. Exactly why some people don't use this CD-R and others have troubles with it (but it is fast and cheap!). | (This makes more sense than the frame grabbers that I've seen advertised that | operate at "twice real time".) | | > The SCSI bus itself can transfer about 8 MBytes/s continuously (on a | > "standard" 8-bit controller, like the AHA-2940 or NCR 53c810). How | > close do these burners come to that value? | | They hopefully burst into their RAM buffers at this speed to give you the | latency you need to go read another chunk. Also where is the data coming from, I don't have 680MB free memory to cache the CD-R image to do the burn. So the data has to come from a hard drive attached to the SCSI bus. A lot of burners use a separate SCSI bus for the CD-R so it's doesn't have to worry about any other device holding the bus. Also people use AV disks to eliminate the problem of thermal recalibration. What about people with an ISA bus with X? In the future this shouldn't be as much of a problem since most CD-R's now, support large caches of atleast 2MB. In the MS-DOS/Windows world you can grab the CPU to just work on the burn. The CD-Studio caches the entire image on the units internally disk and then does the burn (which is nice because then you can down-load an image over a busy net). Doing a CD-R burn is possible (look at Linux, all the code has been done for some CD-R's) but ensuring a successful burn is not easy. All the caveats must be identified or there will be frustrated people trying to make CD's. Something that might be useful would be a test program to verify enough system throughput to do a reliable burn (and let's hope they are not doing make world and spinning 10 teapots under X waiting for their CD to burn). Doug A. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 15:49:37 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA17626 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:49:37 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA17606 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:49:30 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id PAA24646; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:49:08 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511282349.PAA24646@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: Executor To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:49:08 -0800 (PST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199511281927.UAA29572@keltia.freenix.fr> from "Ollivier Robert" at Nov 28, 95 08:27:06 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 545 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Has anyone tried to run the Linux binary of Executor under -CURRENT ? > > I've tried and the only thing I get is a SEGV... I haven't the binary right > now but I'll test it further. It is only 40$ and I'm willing to pay if I > can run the Linux binary. > > I asked for a BSD binary but they're waiting for the 2.0 to go out before > trying to port it. 2.1 maybe? > > -- > Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net > FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #7: Mon Nov 6 21:08:06 MET 1995 > From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 15:51:29 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA17757 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:51:29 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA17748 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:51:21 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id PAA24664; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:50:32 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511282350.PAA24664@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: Anyone keen to help me get a Phillips CDD 521 Recorder working? To: graichen@omega.physik.fu-berlin.de (Thomas Graichen) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:50:31 -0800 (PST) Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511281133.MAA01104@prospero> from "Thomas Graichen" at Nov 28, 95 12:33:10 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1304 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > > > As Douglas Ambrisko wrote: > > > > > > I'll checkout rtprio, and I'm sorry I don't have all the specifics > > > right now (you can probably find them at http://www.cdarchives.com) but > > > the Yamaha is a 4X writer with only 512k buffer. > > > > 4times, 6times -- what's the base for the comparision? > > > > The SCSI bus itself can transfer about 8 MBytes/s continuously (on a > > "standard" 8-bit controller, like the AHA-2940 or NCR 53c810). How > > close do these burners come to that value? > > > i think the base is single speed cd - ~150 k per sec The base is hte data rate of a normal AUDIO CD player, when running in data mode.. 2X would therefore be a chipmunks emulator.. > > t > _______________________________________________________||___________________ > __|| > Perfection is reached, not when there is no __|| thomas graichen > longer anything to add, but when there __|| freie universitaet berlin > is no longer anything to take away __|| fachbereich physik > __|| > - Antoine de Saint-Exupery - __|| graichen@mail.physik.fu-berlin.de > ___________________________||__________________graichen@FreeBSD.org_________ > From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 16:37:58 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA22892 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:37:58 -0800 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA22881 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:37:54 -0800 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id SAA13437; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 18:36:31 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199511290036.SAA13437@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Thumbs up? Or down?? (disk recommend) To: dgy@rtd.com (Don Yuniskis) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 18:36:31 -0600 (CST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511282248.PAA18363@seagull.rtd.com> from "Don Yuniskis" at Nov 28, 95 03:48:04 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Greetings! > I was planning on picking up some MC3243 drives (4.3G, 8.?mS) > and wondered if any have comments pro or con? > Thanx! Exec-PC just returned a boatload of these to the manufacturer. Tooo many failures under moderate to heavy use. Buy a Barracuda instead and put a big fan on it. ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 16:38:01 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA22899 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:38:01 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA22882 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:37:54 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA02737; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:33:58 -0800 To: Jon Loeliger cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2.1.0 Install went smoothly! In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:56:24 CST." <199511282256.QAA13681@chrome.jdl.com> Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:33:58 -0800 Message-ID: <2735.817605238@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > - During boot's "-c" config, leaving "visual" screen, I expected to go > back to the normal "-c" screen. No problem, just unexpected. Dunno. I agree, it's unexpected. Perhaps we should change that. There are several bits of interoperability bogosity between the two, actually, and probably a result of the bad splice job I did. > - Why does the default FreeBSD file system layout place /var in its own > filesystem? Is this one of those subtle sysadmin issues I've zoned? Read the F1 help screen! :) > - Any chance of keeping a running total of the sizes while checking > off the "I want [this] and [this]" items? That information isn't associated with the distributions anywhere. I was hoping that this might come out of the package/distribution unification and more powerful package toolset. > - I pondered some of the "Do you wnat option enabled?" screens. > Was it going to do more than just set the right sysconfig option? Hmm... Basically, yeah. These little "configlettes" need to be beaten on some more and made more robust. The samba one, for example, doesn't edit the requisite things into /etc/inetd.conf, nor did it even add the Samba package until I whapped that in as a last-minute bonus. The gated configuration is hollow, the web server needs some sample pages, I could go on. Yes, these all need fixing. > Congratulations on a fine install! Double sigh.. Maybe that was my "gratuliere" showing through.. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 16:41:15 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA23315 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:41:15 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA23297 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:41:09 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id AAA09696; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:35:14 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511290035.AAA09696@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Problem with sio probe and Mach64 PCI video card To: dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (David Dawes) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:35:13 +0000 () Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511281013.VAA17585@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> from "David Dawes" at Nov 28, 95 09:13:32 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2363 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk David Dawes stands accused of saying: > > I've just installed an ASUS PCI-AV264CT video card, based on the > Mach64 "CT" chipset, into an ASUS PCI/I-P54TP4 motherboard with 90MHz > Pentium CPU. I'm planning to do some work on getting Mach64 CT support > into XFree86. When I booted FreeBSD 2.1, the screen went blank fairly > early in the boot probe sequence. When connected to a DPMS monitor, This is a known conflict between the sio driver and the Mach64. It's due to the fact that, in the presence of four serial ports in the "standard" PC fashion (sharing IRQ 3&4), it's necessary to write to write to the fourth port's MCR in order to successfully test interrupts on the second. With the fourth port at 0x2e8, its MCR is at 0x2ed. > My guess is that the sio probe is writing to a Mach64 register. In the > S3 case it is possilbly successfully restoring it too. I haven't had > a chance to look into the sio probe yet though, and would appreciate any > suggestions as to what might be the cause of this, and how to avoid it > (other than disabling the serial ports -- a mouse is kind of useful > when working on an X server). You can avoid the problem in your case by editing the list of likely port addresses in the sio driver : static Port_t likely_com_ports[] = { 0x3f8, 0x2f8, 0x3e8, 0x2e8, }; Remove the entry for 0x2e8. > The registers listed in the manual for the video card are: > > 102, 1ce, 1cf, 2e8, 2ec, 2ed, 2ee, 2ef, 3x4, 3x5, 3x8, 3x9, 3xa, 3xb, > 3c?, 3dc, and 46e8. (x=b for mono, x=d for colour). What a spectacular stuffup on their part 8( Is there a _reliable_ and safe way to probe for this card? > As a side note, I tried PCVT (At first I wondered if syscons was causing > a problem since that was the last message I initally saw flash up before > the screen disappeared), and noticed that the arrow keys don't work in > the visual mode of "/kernel -c". That's because PCVT doesn't support arrow keys in 'dumb console' mode 8( > David -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 17:18:23 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA26795 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 17:18:23 -0800 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA26790 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 17:18:15 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA00986; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 17:17:13 -0800 Message-Id: <199511290117.RAA00986@rah.star-gate.com> X-Authentication-Warning: rah.star-gate.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: Terry Lambert cc: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert), freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Executor In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:01:24 MST." <199511282301.QAA24594@phaeton.artisoft.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 17:17:11 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Howdy, Just donwloaded executor again and it seems to run okay. You have to have floppy install don't ask me why 8) This is the only error that I got... /executor LINUX: 'ioctl' fd=4, typ=0x53(S), num=0xb not implemented As to how well it runs or how good it is I don' know . I tried the lemmings demo and it seems to run smooth on my P100. At any rate, I quickly got bored with the Mac stuff and went back to FreeBSD 8) Enjoy, Amancio >>> Terry Lambert said: > > Has anyone tried to run the Linux binary of Executor under -CURRENT ? > > I believe Amancio reported it running after installing shared libraries > and so on. > > > I asked for a BSD binary but they're waiting for the 2.0 to go out befor e > > trying to port it. > > 2.1 has shipped. Ask again. Jordan will probably send them a 2.1 CD > if they wanted it. > > > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org > --- > Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present > or previous employers. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 17:40:29 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA28393 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 17:40:29 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA28388 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 17:40:21 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id BAA09808 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 01:34:52 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511290134.BAA09808@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: uio question... To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 01:34:51 +0000 () MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 745 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Okay, my entry for the lame-device-driver-question of the month 8) Given a device read function passed a uio struct, what's the correct way to determine the total size of the read request? I have two possibles here : walk the array of iovec structures, or contemplate the uio_resid field, which appears to be used by a number of other drivers... Experience? -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 17:49:55 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA28733 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 17:49:55 -0800 Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [192.216.222.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA28728 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 17:49:51 -0800 Received: from cicerone.uunet.ca (cicerone.uunet.ca [142.77.1.11]) by who.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.11) with ESMTP id RAA00782 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 17:49:48 -0800 Received: from why ([142.77.242.18]) by cicerone.uunet.ca with SMTP id <212201-2>; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:47:24 -0500 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:48:09 -0500 From: Andrew Herdman X-Sender: andrew@why To: Terry Lambert cc: Ollivier Robert , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Executor In-Reply-To: <199511282301.QAA24594@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Tue, 28 Nov 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > > Has anyone tried to run the Linux binary of Executor under -CURRENT ? > > I believe Amancio reported it running after installing shared libraries > and so on. > > > I asked for a BSD binary but they're waiting for the 2.0 to go out before > > trying to port it. > > 2.1 has shipped. Ask again. Jordan will probably send them a 2.1 CD > if they wanted it. > Wonder if we can throw a 2.1 CD at the Andrew Consortium (http://www.cs.cmu.edu/afs/cs.cmu.edu/project/atk-ftp/web/andrew-home.html). Perhaps we can get them to make auis compile on FreeBSD without pulling out every hair on my head. Andrew From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 18:07:13 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA29656 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 18:07:13 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA29644 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 18:07:03 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id TAA26562; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:01:53 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511290201.TAA26562@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Executor To: andrew@whine.com (Andrew Herdman) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:01:53 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, roberto@keltia.freenix.fr, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Andrew Herdman" at Nov 28, 95 08:48:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 457 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Wonder if we can throw a 2.1 CD at the Andrew Consortium > (http://www.cs.cmu.edu/afs/cs.cmu.edu/project/atk-ftp/web/andrew-home.html). > Perhaps we can get them to make auis compile on FreeBSD without pulling > out every hair on my head. > > Andrew Don't you already have a big advantage, being a member? 8-). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 18:54:02 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA02601 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 18:54:02 -0800 Received: from nudge.io.org (nudge.io.org [198.133.36.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA02592 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 18:53:55 -0800 Received: from flinch (flinch.io.org [198.133.36.153]) by nudge.io.org (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA05322 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:53:47 -0500 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:53:04 -0500 (EST) From: Brian Tao X-Sender: taob@flinch To: FREEBSD-HACKERS-L Subject: Increasing size of shared memory segment Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In the course of playing with the gimp image editor (see the freebsd-ports list if you don't know what this is), I keep bumping into the 4-megabyte shared memory segment limit. What is the best way to increase this size? Define SHMMAX in the kernel config file? Or SHMALL or SHMMAXPGS? The gimp documentation suggests a 32-megabyte segment size. -- Brian Tao (BT300, taob@io.org) Systems Administrator, Internex Online Inc. "Though this be madness, yet there is method in't" From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 19:56:26 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA06043 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:56:26 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA06029 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:56:10 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id DAA10336 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 03:50:43 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511290350.DAA10336@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: more device driver question 8) To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 03:50:42 +0000 () MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1042 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Ok, and another one 8) Driver read routine sets up buffers, etc. Driver enables interrupts on peripheral. Peripheral immediately interrupts, may satisfy whole read request. Driver goes to sleep waiting for read request to be satsified. ... I can't see how to avoid this race; I'm sure it must be possible, but browsing other drivers yields no immediate inspiration. Some sleep at raised interrupt level: spltty() tsleep(...) splx() Does this imply that tsleep() restores the base interrupt level while it's running? Because the peripheral's data rate is entirely dependant on an external source, it's impossible to know how fast or slow it will be 8( -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 19:57:16 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA06098 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:57:16 -0800 Received: from Glock.COM (root@glock.com [198.82.228.165]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA06093 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:57:05 -0800 Received: (from mmead@localhost) by Glock.COM (8.7.1/8.7.1) id WAA08739 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:56:50 -0500 (EST) From: "matthew c. mead" Message-Id: <199511290356.WAA08739@Glock.COM> Subject: SMC EtherEZ 8416 To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:56:50 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I've got an SMC EtherEZ 8416 that I'd like to use with FreeBSD, and it shows up properly under the ed0 driver, but anytime I try to use the card I get an error message that looks like this: ed0: NIC memory corrupt - Invalid packet length 4648. Anyone have any ideas? It works fine under *cringe* Win95 on someone else's machine... -matt -- Matthew C. Mead mmead@Glock.COM | Network Administration and Software Development http://www.Glock.COM/~mmead/ | Consulting: BizNet Technologies -> mmead@bnt.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 20:24:22 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id UAA07473 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:24:22 -0800 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA07414 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:24:09 -0800 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.50]) by Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id UAA00170; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:23:59 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with SMTP id UAA00438; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:23:24 -0800 Message-Id: <199511290423.UAA00438@corbin.Root.COM> To: "matthew c. mead" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: SMC EtherEZ 8416 In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 28 Nov 95 22:56:50 EST." <199511290356.WAA08739@Glock.COM> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:22:56 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I've got an SMC EtherEZ 8416 that I'd like to use with FreeBSD, and it >shows up properly under the ed0 driver, but anytime I try to use the card I get >an error message that looks like this: > >ed0: NIC memory corrupt - Invalid packet length 4648. > > > Anyone have any ideas? It works fine under *cringe* Win95 on someone >else's machine... What version of FreeBSD is this with? -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 20:38:33 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id UAA08334 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:38:33 -0800 Received: from anacreon.sol.net (anacreon.sol.net [206.55.64.116]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA08329 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:38:23 -0800 Received: from solaria.sol.net (solaria.sol.net [206.55.65.75]) by anacreon.sol.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id WAA11783 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:38:19 -0600 Received: from localhost by solaria.sol.net (8.5/8.5) id WAA18278; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:39:14 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199511290439.WAA18278@solaria.sol.net> Subject: Changes to systat(1) To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 28 Nov 95 22:39:11 CST X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL65] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text Content-Length: 4961 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk The following patches fix systat to support four-character drive names (i.e. "sd20") by displaying all four characters and makes a small documentation change in the manual. A bug in iostat:numeric is also rolled in. These changes should not really affect anyone unless you happen to have a large number of disks. It's been tested on a system with a dozen disks and appears to work flawlessly. Could/would somebody please examine and commit these, and send me an "ack" or "nak"... thank you very much! ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 *** iostat.c.fcs Sat Dec 3 04:06:26 1994 --- iostat.c Tue Nov 28 12:47:20 1995 *************** *** 199,209 **** */ if (linesperregion < 3) linesperregion = 3; ! col = 0; for (i = 0; i < dk_ndrive; i++) if (dk_select[i] && dk_mspw[i] != 0.0) { if (col + COLWIDTH >= wnd->maxx - INSET) { ! col = 0, row += linesperregion + 1; if (row > wnd->maxy - (linesperregion + 1)) break; } --- 199,209 ---- */ if (linesperregion < 3) linesperregion = 3; ! col = INSET; for (i = 0; i < dk_ndrive; i++) if (dk_select[i] && dk_mspw[i] != 0.0) { if (col + COLWIDTH >= wnd->maxx - INSET) { ! col = INSET, row += linesperregion + 1; if (row > wnd->maxy - (linesperregion + 1)) break; } *************** *** 229,235 **** if (dk_select[i] && dk_mspw[i] != 0.0) { if (row > wnd->maxy - linesperregion) break; ! mvwprintw(wnd, row++, 0, "%3.3s bps|", dr_name[i]); mvwaddstr(wnd, row++, 0, " tps|"); if (msps) mvwaddstr(wnd, row++, 0, " msps|"); --- 229,235 ---- if (dk_select[i] && dk_mspw[i] != 0.0) { if (row > wnd->maxy - linesperregion) break; ! mvwprintw(wnd, row++, 0, "%-4.4s bps|", dr_name[i]); mvwaddstr(wnd, row++, 0, " tps|"); if (msps) mvwaddstr(wnd, row++, 0, " msps|"); *************** *** 271,285 **** } return; } ! col = 0; wmove(wnd, row + linesperregion, 0); wdeleteln(wnd); wmove(wnd, row + 3, 0); winsertln(wnd); for (i = 0; i < dk_ndrive; i++) if (dk_select[i] && dk_mspw[i] != 0.0) { ! if (col + COLWIDTH >= wnd->maxx) { ! col = 0, row += linesperregion + 1; if (row > wnd->maxy - (linesperregion + 1)) break; wmove(wnd, row + linesperregion, 0); --- 271,285 ---- } return; } ! col = INSET; wmove(wnd, row + linesperregion, 0); wdeleteln(wnd); wmove(wnd, row + 3, 0); winsertln(wnd); for (i = 0; i < dk_ndrive; i++) if (dk_select[i] && dk_mspw[i] != 0.0) { ! if (col + COLWIDTH >= wnd->maxx - INSET) { ! col = INSET, row += linesperregion + 1; if (row > wnd->maxy - (linesperregion + 1)) break; wmove(wnd, row + linesperregion, 0); *** vmstat.c.fcs Sat Aug 26 05:10:23 1995 --- vmstat.c Tue Nov 28 20:25:21 1995 *************** *** 325,331 **** for (i = 0; i < dk_ndrive && j < MAXDRIVES; i++) if (dk_select[i]) { mvprintw(DISKROW, DISKCOL + 5 + 5 * j, ! " %3.3s", dr_name[j]); j++; } for (i = 0; i < nintr; i++) { --- 325,331 ---- for (i = 0; i < dk_ndrive && j < MAXDRIVES; i++) if (dk_select[i]) { mvprintw(DISKROW, DISKCOL + 5 + 5 * j, ! " %4.4s", dr_name[j]); j++; } for (i = 0; i < nintr; i++) { *************** *** 471,477 **** for (i = 0, c = 0; i < dk_ndrive && c < MAXDRIVES; i++) if (dk_select[i]) { mvprintw(DISKROW, DISKCOL + 5 + 5 * c, ! " %3.3s", dr_name[i]); dinfo(i, ++c); } putint(s.nchcount, NAMEIROW + 2, NAMEICOL, 9); --- 471,477 ---- for (i = 0, c = 0; i < dk_ndrive && c < MAXDRIVES; i++) if (dk_select[i]) { mvprintw(DISKROW, DISKCOL + 5 + 5 * c, ! " %4.4s", dr_name[i]); dinfo(i, ++c); } putint(s.nchcount, NAMEIROW + 2, NAMEICOL, 9); *** systat.1.fcs Sat Dec 3 04:06:37 1994 --- systat.1 Tue Nov 28 20:34:38 1995 *************** *** 229,235 **** of kilobyte blocks transferred per second averaged over the refresh period of the display (by default, five seconds). For some disks it also reports the average milliseconds per seek. ! Note that the system only keeps statistics on at most four disks. .Pp Below the disk display is a list of the average number of processes (over the last refresh interval) --- 229,237 ---- of kilobyte blocks transferred per second averaged over the refresh period of the display (by default, five seconds). For some disks it also reports the average milliseconds per seek. ! Note that the system only keeps statistics on at most eight disks ! (this is controlled by the constant DK_NDRIVE in /sys/dkstat.h as ! a kernel compile-time constant). .Pp Below the disk display is a list of the average number of processes (over the last refresh interval) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 21:11:02 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA10525 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:11:02 -0800 Received: from suphys.physics.usyd.edu.au (dawes@suphys.physics.usyd.edu.au [129.78.129.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA10516 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:10:40 -0800 Received: (from dawes@localhost) by suphys.physics.usyd.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA03876; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:10:09 +1100 From: David Dawes Message-Id: <199511290510.QAA03876@suphys.physics.usyd.edu.au> Subject: Re: Problem with sio probe and Mach64 PCI video card To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:10:08 +1100 (EST) Cc: dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511290035.AAA09696@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Nov 29, 95 00:35:13 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 600 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >Remove the entry for 0x2e8. > >> The registers listed in the manual for the video card are: >> >> 102, 1ce, 1cf, 2e8, 2ec, 2ed, 2ee, 2ef, 3x4, 3x5, 3x8, 3x9, 3xa, 3xb, >> 3c?, 3dc, and 46e8. (x=b for mono, x=d for colour). > >What a spectacular stuffup on their part 8( Is there a _reliable_ >and safe way to probe for this card? The register choice is historical -- IBM chose the 0x2e? addresses for the 8514/A. It affects all similar cards, but apparently to different extents. A serial port using the usual COM4 address simply can't coexist with these type of cards (S3, ATI, etc). David From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 21:17:23 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA11032 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:17:23 -0800 Received: from crh.cl.msu.edu (crh.cl.msu.edu [35.8.1.24]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA11020 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:17:17 -0800 Received: (from henrich@localhost) by crh.cl.msu.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) id AAA02331; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:17:11 -0500 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:17:11 -0500 From: Charles Henrich Message-Id: <199511290517.AAA02331@crh.cl.msu.edu> To: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Thumbs up? Or down?? (disk recommend) Newsgroups: lists.freebsd.hackers References: <49glj1$14f7@msunews.cl.msu.edu> X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 #3 (NOV) Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In lists.freebsd.hackers you write: >> Greetings! >> I was planning on picking up some MC3243 drives (4.3G, 8.?mS) >> and wondered if any have comments pro or con? >> Thanx! >Exec-PC just returned a boatload of these to the manufacturer. Tooo many >failures under moderate to heavy use. Buy a Barracuda instead and put a big >fan on it. Screw that, we have about 80% failure on Barracuda's we have so far. Shoot for the Connor 4207S, runs cold, 7200RPM, fast as snot, works perfect so far. -Crh -- Charles Henrich Michigan State University henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu http://rs560.msu.edu/~henrich/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 21:38:53 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA12818 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:38:53 -0800 Received: from emout05.mail.aol.com (emout05.mail.aol.com [198.81.10.37]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA12810 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:38:49 -0800 From: StevenR362@aol.com Received: by emout05.mail.aol.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id AAA20187 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:38:10 -0500 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:38:10 -0500 Message-ID: <951129003806_119456143@emout05.mail.aol.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Heideman Thesis Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I need a ftp pointer for John Heideman's Masters thesis for some research that I am doing. Thanks Steve From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 21:43:33 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA13129 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:43:33 -0800 Received: (from jkh@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA13120 for hackers; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:43:31 -0800 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:43:31 -0800 From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Message-Id: <199511290543.VAA13120@freefall.freebsd.org> To: hackers Subject: Bug in stable/-current perl? Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk jkh@freefall-> date Tue Nov 28 21:42:48 PST 1995 jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[3]);' 28 jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[4]);' 10 jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[5]);' 95 10? Am I misunderstanding something fundamental about perl's localtime() call, or should this be an "11"? Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Nov 28 22:41:59 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id WAA15908 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:41:59 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA15897 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:41:53 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id HAA15266 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 07:41:48 +0100 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id HAA14551 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 07:41:48 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.7.1/keltia-uucp-2.6) id AAA00390; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:42:27 +0100 (MET) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199511282342.AAA00390@keltia.freenix.fr> Subject: Re: Executor To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:42:26 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199511282301.QAA24594@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Nov 28, 95 04:01:24 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1378 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8b] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It seems that Terry Lambert said: > > I asked for a BSD binary but they're waiting for the 2.0 to go out before > > trying to port it. > > 2.1 has shipped. Ask again. Jordan will probably send them a 2.1 CD > if they wanted it. Erm, I wasn't clear. They want to get the 2.0 version of Executor out, not the 2.0 of FreeBSD :-) -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #7: Mon Nov 6 21:08:06 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 00:21:23 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA20204 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:21:23 -0800 Received: from iis (iis.webnet.com.au [203.8.105.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA20196 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:21:16 -0800 Received: from jazzy.phase-one.com.au (gw.phase-one.com.au [203.21.35.254]) by iis (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA19409; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 19:25:29 +1100 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 19:22:48 +1100 (EST) From: Peter Marelas X-Sender: maral@jazzy.phase-one.com.au To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Bug in stable/-current perl? In-Reply-To: <199511290543.VAA13120@freefall.freebsd.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 28 Nov 1995, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > jkh@freefall-> date > Tue Nov 28 21:42:48 PST 1995 > > jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[3]);' > 28 > jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[4]);' > 10 > jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[5]);' > 95 > > 10? Am I misunderstanding something fundamental about perl's > localtime() call, or should this be an "11"? 10 is correct.. yeah i thought it was irish , when i came across it as well...but.. localtime EXPR Converts a time as returned by the time function to a 9-element array with the time analyzed for the local timezone. Typically used as follows: ($sec,$min,$hour,$mday,$mon,$year,$wday,$yday,$isdst) = localtime(time); All array elements are numeric, and come straight out of a struct tm. In particular this means that $mon has the range 0..11 and $wday has the range ^^^^^ 0..6. If EXPR is omitted, does localtime(time). Peter From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 00:27:46 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA20456 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:27:46 -0800 Received: from ra.dkuug.dk (ra.dkuug.dk [193.88.44.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA20450 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:27:42 -0800 Received: (from sos@localhost) by ra.dkuug.dk (8.6.12/8.6.12) id JAA01180; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:26:04 +0100 Message-Id: <199511290826.JAA01180@ra.dkuug.dk> Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:26:04 +0100 (MET) Cc: sos@freebsd.org, cshenton@apollo.hq.nasa.gov, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <1156.817580240@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 28, 95 09:37:20 am From: sos@freebsd.org Reply-to: sos@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 881 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Jordan K. Hubbard who wrote: > > > Hmm, I allready sent you a "technology demo" of the mouse stuff > > half a year ago or something, forgot ?? :) :) > > No, I remember it quite well. You sent it to me, I tried it, it > didn't work, I told you it didn't work, you went: "Hmmm!" :-) You had a strange mouse, didn't you, I think that was the problem. > I think you just forgot to follow up.. :-) Well, I'm about to cure that together with Mike Smith(sp?), we'll think a bit more, then we (hopefully) come up with a little piece of goddies on the mouse/pointer/cut-n-paste/whatever problem... (this also fits into the graphics thingie I'v been mumbeling about) -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team So much code to hack -- so little time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 00:27:58 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA20484 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:27:58 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id AAA20477 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:27:56 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Wed, 29 Nov 95 08:28 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id JAA16544; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:12:11 +0100 Message-Id: <199511290812.JAA16544@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Re: Documentation.. To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:12:11 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) In-Reply-To: <1586.817586728@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 28, 95 11:25:28 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 749 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Jordan K. Hubbard writes: > >> Jordan K. Hubbard writes: >>> >>>> locking as the result of the change of struct flock. The binary I had >>>> (elm) was compiled on BSD/386 1.1, and it didn't run on BSD/OS 2.0 >>>> either. >>> >>> Now try compiling elm on BSD/OS 2.0 and running that under FreeBSD. That >>> was what was referred to. >> >> Aha. How about that--it SIGSEGVs out of start. Is this known behaviour? >> >> Greg > > Uh. Greg, you really should read your mail more thoroughly. This is > the issue you've been discussing WRT "BSDI compatibility" the whole > time.. :-) Well, mea culpa, maybe, but I've just checked all my saved mail, and I can't find anything. I suspect that this was discussed before I joined the group. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 00:28:21 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA20683 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:28:21 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id AAA20660 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:28:18 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Wed, 29 Nov 95 08:28 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id JAA16566 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:17:06 +0100 Message-Id: <199511290817.JAA16566@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Re: Documentation.. To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:16:27 +0100 (MET) In-Reply-To: <199511282246.OAA24442@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Nov 28, 95 02:46:57 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1156 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Julian Elischer writes: > >> >>> Jordan K. Hubbard writes: >>> > >>> > > locking as the result of the change of struct flock. The binary I had >>> > > (elm) was compiled on BSD/386 1.1, and it didn't run on BSD/OS 2.0 >>> > > either. >>> > >>> > Now try compiling elm on BSD/OS 2.0 and running that under FreeBSD. That >>> > was what was referred to. >>> >>> Aha. How about that--it SIGSEGVs out of start. Is this known behaviour? >>> >>> Greg >> >> Uh. Greg, you really should read your mail more thoroughly. This is >> the issue you've been discussing WRT "BSDI compatibility" the whole >> time.. :-) >> >> Jordan >> > It'd be interesting to see what they were trying to achieve.... > anyone know WHY it SEGV's? > what does ktrace say? > gdb? gdb's the right tool. It's blowing up trying to set up a pointer to the environs, which BSDI keeps above the stack. FreeBSD doesn't have anything there, so it picks up a NULL pointer and bombs out. Any ideas about what the right way to handle this is? I have a number of pages of documentation (in ?roff or PostScript) which explain what's going on here, if anybody wants them. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 00:39:18 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA21217 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:39:18 -0800 Received: from ra.dkuug.dk (ra.dkuug.dk [193.88.44.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA21208 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:38:39 -0800 Received: (from sos@localhost) by ra.dkuug.dk (8.6.12/8.6.12) id JAA01196; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:37:44 +0100 Message-Id: <199511290837.JAA01196@ra.dkuug.dk> Subject: Re: Enough already! (Was: Where is the documentation for ibcs2?) To: grog@lemis.de Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:37:44 +0100 (MET) Cc: sos@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511281700.SAA26555@allegro.lemis.de> from "Greg Lehey" at Nov 28, 95 06:00:37 pm From: sos@freebsd.org Reply-to: sos@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 2908 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Greg Lehey who wrote: > > > You need a COFF debugger, preferably compile FreeBSD native... > > You don't understand. Watch my fingers: "it doesn't get as far as > being executed." I have a gdb compiled under SCO 3.2.2 (by chance), > though it still doesn't like the "user area" of the emulator: ptrace() > bombs out looking for the eip value. Hmm, I'm not sure who it is that don't understand here... > To be more specific, you can't debug the vi problem because it bombs > out of execve (look at the end of the function source: if things go > wrong, it sends a SIGABRT). This is reasonable, since COFF > effectively specifies multiple text segments in the header, and the > file for one of them was missing. Possibly, though, we should > consider a message stating the name of the missing file if it wasn't > the executable itself. Look at how our execution classes works, and you will now why this is so. If you miss a shared lib it should say so though (at least in the old iBCS2 code). > > As Terry said there is MUCH MUCH more to iBCS2 emulation than the > > kernel support, and we doesn't even have a start on that yet... > > In my opinion we will at most get a 80% emulation, and that allready > > would cost ALOT of work on the whole source tree, plus "reinventing" > > lots & lots of SCO/svr3 utils etc etc... > > I don't think the idea should be to reinvent SCO. It should be to > execute SCO executables. As you say: I was not talking about reinventing SCO, but if we go after letting "Joe Smoe" install & run his iBCS2/SCO apps, we better have all the pieces to the puzzle before letting him loose, otherwise he'll just conclude that our iBCS2 emulation doesn't work.. I'll repeat again : The kernel part of the iBCS2 emulation is only say 10% of what is needed to run iBCS2/SCO apps, we must have a compatibel shell, ed sed, echo, awk, and and and, or its just going to break one way or another. We must have our own legal shared libs (plus an environment to make these in case things change). Then we also must have a "custom" util to install the stuff, plus whatever config files, setups, filestructure etc etc etc that the SCO apps expects from the system. You se there is allmost no end to the list of things that must be in place for this to be only remotely functional to the random user. > > So when are we going for SVR4.2 emulation? Ha!, I've had my system run NCR svr4 binaries for almost a year now, but there are even more things to make SVR4 run that running iBCS2 (and besides my code for this doesn't work with the iBCS2 stuff we now have from NetBSD, it is nicely integrated into the "original" iBCS2 emulator). Enough said on this topic.... -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team So much code to hack -- so little time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 00:52:30 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA22004 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:52:30 -0800 Received: from iris ([193.170.98.66]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA21991 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:52:25 -0800 Received: by iris (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI.AUTO) id JAA04058; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:51:54 +0100 From: "Christian Gusenbauer" Message-Id: <9511290951.ZM4056@IRIS> Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:51:48 +0100 In-Reply-To: Howard Lew "Re: To all fbsdboot and winboot users ..." (Nov 28, 12:15pm) References: Reply-To: cg@www.ati.khs-linz.ac.at X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.2 10apr95 MediaMail) To: Howard Lew Subject: Re: To all fbsdboot and winboot users ... Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Nov 28, 12:15pm, Howard Lew wrote: > Subject: Re: To all fbsdboot and winboot users ... > On Mon, 27 Nov 1995, Christian Gusenbauer wrote: > > > > > Hi! > > > > I'd like to know, if fbsdboot and winboot work with Win95?! Is there > > anybody out there with some experience? > > > > Yes! fbsdboot.exe works great! That's how I got the DTC2278EB > controller with LBA to run FreeBSD and Win 95 even though the > controller seems to be incompatible with FreeBSD at first. That's great, because I don't want to install Win95 right now or then :)! > > As for the winboot thing? I'm not sure what that is.... But all I need to > do is drop to a DOS prompt. Winboot is a nice little utility, which allows you to boot FreeBSD out of a running Windows 3.1. I don't know if it runs with Win95. You may find it on the 2.0.5 CD in the experimental directory. You can find it on fimp01.fim.uni-linz.ac.at in the /pub/soft/unix directory, too. Christian. -- Christian Gusenbauer cg@www.ati.khs-linz.ac.at From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 00:59:39 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA22365 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:59:39 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA22358 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:59:27 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id JAA10586 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:56:06 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id JAA02676 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:56:06 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id IAA14169 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:55:45 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511290755.IAA14169@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Anyone keen to help me get a Phillips CDD 521 Recorder working? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:55:44 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511282345.PAA09388@cozumel.tcs.com> from "Douglas Ambrisko" at Nov 28, 95 03:45:16 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1293 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Douglas Ambrisko wrote: > > So the data has to come from a hard drive > attached to the SCSI bus. A lot of burners use a separate SCSI bus for the > CD-R so it's doesn't have to worry about any other device holding the > bus. Also people use AV disks to eliminate the problem of thermal > recalibration. I think the problem with thermal recalibration is the biggest one. On the other hand, with something like `team' doing the data shuffling, you could use the RAM as an additional cache. One process in constantly reading the input file, and this one will choke when the disk performs a thermal recalib. Since the output process reads buffered data, it will not starve immediately. The only requirement is that the average CD burn rate is much slower than the average disk read rate, but with 600 KB/s for the burner, this doesn't seem to be a problem. Nevertheless, the driving process should run at rtprio, so its getting the highest probability of grabbing the CPU whenever it needs it (which is seldom anyway, since both of its sub-processes are i/o- bound). As always, crappy hardware will make you unhappy. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 01:01:48 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA22678 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 01:01:48 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA22352 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:58:51 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id JAA10605; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:56:13 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id JAA02681; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:56:12 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id JAA14509; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:41:52 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511290841.JAA14509@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Netscape 2.0b3 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:41:52 +0100 (MET) Cc: chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511280237.DAA26416@keltia.freenix.fr> from "Ollivier Robert" at Nov 28, 95 03:37:36 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 643 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Ollivier Robert wrote: > > Use a real mail programs to read mail. Use a real newsreader to read > News. Don't use netscape. It is a pretty decent WWW browser (if you forget > some stupid proprietary extentions) and *it should stay a WWW browser*. FreeBSD BOOT @ 0x100000: 640/32128 k of memory Use hd(1,a)/kernel to boot sd0 when wd0 is also installed. Usage: [[sd(0,a)]/kernel][-abcCdhrsv] Use ? for file list or press Enter for defaults Boot: sd(0,a)/netscape :-] -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 01:02:31 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA22754 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 01:02:31 -0800 Received: from ra.dkuug.dk (ra.dkuug.dk [193.88.44.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA22746 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 01:02:21 -0800 Received: (from sos@localhost) by ra.dkuug.dk (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA01221; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:00:32 +0100 Message-Id: <199511290900.KAA01221@ra.dkuug.dk> Subject: Re: Documentation.. To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:00:32 +0100 (MET) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, grog@lemis.de, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511282246.OAA24442@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Nov 28, 95 02:46:57 pm From: sos@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-to: sos@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 418 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk In reply to Julian Elischer who wrote: > It'd be interesting to see what they were trying to achieve.... > anyone know WHY it SEGV's? > what does ktrace say? > gdb? They are probably loading their shared libs.... -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team So much code to hack -- so little time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 01:22:51 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA24061 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 01:22:51 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA24055 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 01:22:44 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id BAA01693; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 01:22:15 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511290922.BAA01693@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: more device driver question 8) To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 01:22:14 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511290350.DAA10336@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Nov 29, 95 03:50:42 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1229 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > Ok, and another one 8) > > Driver read routine sets up buffers, etc. > Driver enables interrupts on peripheral. > Peripheral immediately interrupts, may satisfy whole read request. > Driver goes to sleep waiting for read request to be satsified. > ... > > I can't see how to avoid this race; I'm sure it must be possible, but > browsing other drivers yields no immediate inspiration. > Some sleep at raised interrupt level: > > spltty() > tsleep(...) > splx() > > Does this imply that tsleep() restores the base interrupt level while > it's running? exactly, It schedules another process, which will be at some OTHER interrupt priority level, it does it 'atomicly' too.. > > Because the peripheral's data rate is entirely dependant on an external > source, it's impossible to know how fast or slow it will be 8( > > -- > ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ > ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ > ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ > ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ > ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 01:33:26 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA24655 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 01:33:26 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA24647 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 01:33:20 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id JAA11541; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:27:22 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511290927.JAA11541@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: more device driver question 8) To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:27:22 +0000 () Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511290922.BAA01693@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Nov 29, 95 01:22:14 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1165 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Julian Elischer stands accused of saying: > > I can't see how to avoid this race; I'm sure it must be possible, but > > browsing other drivers yields no immediate inspiration. > > Some sleep at raised interrupt level: > > > > spltty() > > tsleep(...) > > splx() > > > > Does this imply that tsleep() restores the base interrupt level while > > it's running? > exactly, > It schedules another process, which will be at some OTHER > interrupt priority level, it does it 'atomicly' too.. Ah. This implies that interrupt priorities are kept on a per-process basis, correct? So for a 'tty' device driver, I could safely say spltty() enable_interrupt() tsleep() splx() and be sure that interrupts from the device won't be enabled until after the current process sleeps? Thanks. -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 01:48:59 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA25560 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 01:48:59 -0800 Received: from athena.compulink.gr (mmdf@athena.compulink.gr [193.92.197.99]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA25534 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 01:48:44 -0800 Received: from athena.compulink.gr by athena.compulink.gr id ab12464; 29 Nov 95 11:43 EET Received: by electh.compulink.gr with Microsoft Mail id <01BABE4F.2ACD4760@electh.compulink.gr>; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:38:13 +-200 Message-ID: <01BABE4F.2ACD4760@electh.compulink.gr> From: PANOS KORTSARIDIS To: "'hackers@FreeBSD.org'" Subject: ATAPI support Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:22:19 +-200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Are ATAPI CD-ROMs supported in version 2.1 ? Can I install a 2.1 system off an ATAPI CD-ROM ? Thank you From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 01:58:02 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA26296 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 01:58:02 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA26288 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 01:57:54 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Wed, 29 Nov 95 09:58 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id KAA16680; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:37:52 +0100 Message-Id: <199511290937.KAA16680@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Re: Documentation.. To: sos@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:37:51 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers) In-Reply-To: <199511290900.KAA01221@ra.dkuug.dk> from "sos@FreeBSD.ORG" at Nov 29, 95 10:00:32 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1775 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk sos@FreeBSD.ORG writes: > > In reply to Julian Elischer who wrote: > > It'd be interesting to see what they were trying to achieve.... > > anyone know WHY it SEGV's? > > what does ktrace say? > > gdb? > > They are probably loading their shared libs.... No, it's definitely looking in the psp structure. After more careful analysis, it's not psp->ps_envp, it's *psp->ps_argv. psp is struct ps_strings { char **ps_argv; int ps_argc; char **ps_envp; int ps_nenv; }; Here's the code: 0x1020: movl %ebx,0x67094 0x1026: jmp 0x102c 0x1028: addb %al,(%eax) 0x102a: addb %al,(%eax) 0x102c : pushl %ebp 0x102d : movl %esp,%ebp 0x102f : pushl %esi 0x1030 : pushl %ebx 0x1031 : cmpl $0x0,0x67094 is __ps_strings initialized? 0x1038 : jne 0x1044 yes, OK 0x103a : movl $0xefbfdff0,0x67094 no, set to BSD/386 1.1 offset 0x1044 : movl 0x67094,%esi set %esi to __ps_strings 0x104a : movl 0x8(%esi),%edx get offset 8 (ps_envp) 0x104d : movl %edx,0x6a548 store in environ 0x1053 : movl (%esi),%eax address of psp->ps_argv 0x1055 : movl (%eax),%ebx <- bombs out here (gdb) i reg eax 0x0 0 <- understandable ecx 0x0 0 edx 0x0 0 ebx 0x0 0 esp 0xefbfd578 0xefbfd578 ebp 0xefbfd580 0xefbfd580 esi 0xefbfdff0 -272637968 edi 0x0 0 eip 0x1055 0x1055 ps 0x246 582 cs 0x1f 31 ss 0x27 39 ds 0x27 39 es 0x27 39 Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 01:59:14 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA26431 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 01:59:14 -0800 Received: from pcpsj.pfcs.com (RKFvq3wkey+8bwC8FlqIX5n0Nr1WgGPa@harlan.clark.net [168.143.10.179]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA26426 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 01:59:09 -0800 Received: from mumps.pfcs.com (mumps.pfcs.com [192.52.69.11]) by pcpsj.pfcs.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id EAA00249 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 04:46:18 -0500 Received: from localhost by mumps.pfcs.com with SMTP id AA05550 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for ); Wed, 29 Nov 1995 04:46:16 -0500 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Patches for lib/libskey/ Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 04:46:15 -0400 Message-Id: <5548.817638375@mumps.pfcs.com> From: Harlan Stenn Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk The following patch for skey.h is because recstart is used by fseek. The patch for skeysubr.c comes from logdaemon-5.0, and fixes the problem I had with -lskey and the skey patches for wu-ftpd. There are other patches with logdaemon-5.0, but I haven't really looked further. H --- skey.h- Wed Nov 29 04:36:15 1995 +++ skey.h Fri Nov 17 03:45:54 1995 @@ -11,7 +11,7 @@ int n; char *seed; char *val; - long recstart; /*needed so reread of buffer is efficient*/ + off_t recstart; /*needed so reread of buffer is efficient*/ }; /* Client-side structure for scanning data stream for challenge */ --- skeysubr.c- Sun Jun 11 15:29:19 1995 +++ skeysubr.c Fri Nov 17 07:15:34 1995 @@ -67,7 +67,10 @@ rip(buf) char *buf; { - buf[strcspn(buf, "\r\n")] = 0; + buf += strcspn(buf, "\r\n"); + + if (*buf) + *buf = 0; } static struct termios saved_ttymode; From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 02:04:32 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id CAA26957 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 02:04:32 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id CAA26938 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 02:04:24 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Wed, 29 Nov 95 10:04 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id LAA16724; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:04:35 +0100 Message-Id: <199511291004.LAA16724@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Re: Enough already! (Was: Where is the documentation for ibcs2?) To: sos@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:04:35 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) In-Reply-To: <199511290837.JAA01196@ra.dkuug.dk> from "sos@freebsd.org" at Nov 29, 95 09:37:44 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 3796 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk sos@freebsd.org writes: > > In reply to Greg Lehey who wrote: >> >>> You need a COFF debugger, preferably compile FreeBSD native... >> >> You don't understand. Watch my fingers: "it doesn't get as far as >> being executed." I have a gdb compiled under SCO 3.2.2 (by chance), >> though it still doesn't like the "user area" of the emulator: ptrace() >> bombs out looking for the eip value. > > Hmm, I'm not sure who it is that don't understand here... Here's the gdb code to fetch registers from the u area, somewhat simplified (BTW, Terry suggested that this should be done with /proc, not with ptrace(). This won't work, because this is a COFF executable, and I shudder at the consequences of trying to tell an SVR3 executable about FreeBSD): fetch_register (regno) int regno; { /* This isn't really an address. But ptrace thinks of it as one. */ CORE_ADDR regaddr; char buf[MAX_REGISTER_RAW_SIZE]; char mess[128]; /* For messages */ register int i; /* Offset of registers within the u area. */ unsigned int offset; offset = U_REGS_OFFSET; regaddr = register_addr (regno, offset); *(PTRACE_XFER_TYPE *) &buf[i] = ptrace (PT_READ_U, inferior_pid, (PTRACE_ARG3_TYPE) regaddr, 0); supply_register (regno, buf); } I don't have an SCO machine up and running at the moment, but I've seen this problem before: register_addr itself calls ptrace() to find the address of the saved register block, and it's wrong (typically contains 0). If you *really*, *really* find this important, I'll drag out the disk and fire her up. >> To be more specific, you can't debug the vi problem because it bombs >> out of execve (look at the end of the function source: if things go >> wrong, it sends a SIGABRT). This is reasonable, since COFF >> effectively specifies multiple text segments in the header, and the >> file for one of them was missing. Possibly, though, we should >> consider a message stating the name of the missing file if it wasn't >> the executable itself. > > Look at how our execution classes works, and you will now why this is > so. If you miss a shared lib it should say so though (at least in > the old iBCS2 code). Hmmm. Certainly in this case we're not getting a message, though we are missing a shared library. And we are getting a SIGABRT, and that's what execve does if it can't get the process to run. Possibly the causes are more complex than that, but I can't be bothered to go through the code. Your turn now :-) > I'll repeat again : > The kernel part of the iBCS2 emulation is only say 10% of what is > needed to run iBCS2/SCO apps, we must have a compatibel shell, ed > sed, echo, awk, and and and, or its just going to break one > way or another. We must have our own legal shared libs (plus an > environment to make these in case things change). Then we also > must have a "custom" util to install the stuff, plus whatever > config files, setups, filestructure etc etc etc that the SCO > apps expects from the system. Well, I think I have to disagree about the value of 10%, but I agree that there's still a lot to be done. As I said in a previous message, I have a number of pieces there for the taking, including the complete GNU C library for SCO (and it works!). It's not in shared library format at the moment, but it shouldn't be that much of a problem if somebody's interested. >> So when are we going for SVR4.2 emulation? > > Ha!, I've had my system run NCR svr4 binaries for almost a year > now, but there are even more things to make SVR4 run that > running iBCS2 (and besides my code for this doesn't work > with the iBCS2 stuff we now have from NetBSD, it is nicely > integrated into the "original" iBCS2 emulator). Well, it's a start. What was wrong with the "original" emulator? Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 02:09:55 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id CAA27210 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 02:09:55 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA27204 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 02:09:47 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id CAA03474; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 02:09:18 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511291009.CAA03474@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: more device driver question 8) To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 02:09:17 -0800 (PST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511290927.JAA11541@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Nov 29, 95 09:27:22 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 383 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk that's the way I understand it but now you've got ME worried.. :) > > Ah. This implies that interrupt priorities are kept on a per-process basis, > correct? > > So for a 'tty' device driver, I could safely say > > spltty() > enable_interrupt() > tsleep() > splx() > > and be sure that interrupts from the device won't be enabled until after > the current process sleeps? > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 03:05:46 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA01880 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 03:05:46 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA01792 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 03:04:50 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id VAA17247; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:58:02 +1100 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:58:02 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511291058.VAA17247@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: hackers@freebsd.org, uhclem%nemesis@fw.ast.com Subject: Re: misc/848: Inst gripes about geometry but won't accept true values FDIV040 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >During the installation, the SCSI drive was partitioned. >The partition software complains that the geometry is not correct >and that it should be corrected or terrible things will happen. >Using the "G" command, the correct values are entered, ie 2707 cylinders, >19 heads, 81 sectors (per manufacturers data sheet for a Seagate ST12550N). >After the data is entered, the partition software again says that the >geometry is not correct and the same values that were there before >reappear (2039/64/32), along with messages warning of woe and disaster These are not correct values. You're supposed to enter the values used by the BIOS, not the physical values. The BIOS requires the geometry to satisfy the following constraints: 1 <= sectors <= 63 1 <= heads <= 256 1 <= cylinders <= 1024 sysinstall apparently enforces this, unlike fdisk which silently screws up. There may be additional constraints. E.g., for wd drives and old BIOSes: heads <= 16 For BT445C and perhaps other SCSI BIOSes: heads >= 255 More importantly: ****************************************************************** if the BIOS was previously configured to use S sectors and H heads for the drive, and sysinstall gets the defaults for these wrong (whether or not it warns you), then you must tell sysinstall that the drive has precisely S sectors and H heads (whether or not the manufacturers data sheet agrees or sysinstall warned you). ****************************************************************** Modern drives usually have (an average of) more than 63 sectors/track so copying the number of sectors from (the wrong section of?) the manufacturers data sheet is unlikely to work. >somewhere down the road should you not use the "G"eometry command to set >the correct values. Trying again gets you the same result and the data >you enter is discarded. Perhaps the original 64/32 geometry was correct. sysinstall should allow you to use it. More than 63 sectors is certainly incorrect, so sysinstall doesn't allow it under any circumstances. >Interestingly, the internally computed values 2039x64x32 equal 4,175,872 >blocks, which is greater than 2707x19x81==4,166,073. This looks (on >the surface) like a really bad thing, as we may have computed a block count >greater than the true size of the media, and then later the system will >attempt to write who-knows-what out there. In the case of this particular >drive, the 81 sectors per track is the average rounded-down (according to >the data sheet), so there is some slop and the true user sector count was >4,177,781 so even the "bogus" numbers still work. The driver knows the exact number of sectors. After it determines the translated BIOS geometry of 64 heads and 32 sectors, it divides the total number of sectors by 64*32 and rounds down to obtain the translated number of cylinders. Note that about 2000 sectors are still wasted if you restrict yourself to the rounded-down number of cylinders. You avoid this wastage if the software permits. Just enter sector counts and ignore the bogus C/H/S values wherever possible. I'm not sure if sysinstall allows this. fdisk, disklabel, newfs and drivers do. >In reality, I suspect the drive returns the true block count and >it is divided against the hardwired 64 and 32, yielding 2039 as the >closest number that fits. It would be nice if the user could give the >system the vendor recommended numbers, particularly when the software >currently encourages the user to do this. On some types of drives, the >user could end up with less usable space on the drive because of these >hardwired values. I got lucky. It would be nice if the vendor could recommend non-bogus non-wasteful values. This is a hard problem for vendors because C/H/S values are inherently bogus and some BIOSes may not support all values. Note that the manufacturers data sheet suggests wasting considerably more space than for the bogus 64x32 geometry (all of cylinders 2707-2713 (4177781/19/81 = 2714)). This is a consequence of rounding the average number of sectors down to 81. Sector counts are low relative to cylinder counts so the wastage may be high (up to 1 in 82 compared with up to 1 in 2048 for your drive). >Choose: > 1. Fix the partition software (also disklabel utility) to accept > the real values for that drive. Perhaps there should be a separate option to specify and use the "real" values for the drive. However, hackers should have no problems running disklabel to specify the values and `newfs -u 0' to use them, not to mention knowing when this makes a difference. >or 2. Change the warnings to say the system is substituting these values > and they are close and might give you a bit more space or might > give you less, and everything will be fine, rather than implying > that something bad will happen if you can't cram the real settings > into the software (which apparently you can't). It would > also be nice if the system explained what magical hat these various > numbers (64 & 32) were being pulled from as well. They are determined by looking at the partition table: 64 = 1 + (max ending head number in a partition table entry) 32 = max ending sector number in a partition table entry If there are no partition table entries, then they are as reported by the drive (e.g., 2707/19/81). They are rarely right in this case. At least, disklabel would report these numbers. Perhaps sysinstall does some conversions since it knows that 81 sectors can't work. Some SCSI BIOSes also determine the numbers by peeking at the partition table. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 03:16:19 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA02623 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 03:16:19 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA02589 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 03:16:07 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id WAA18017; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 22:11:08 +1100 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 22:11:08 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511291111.WAA18017@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Subject: Re: more device driver question 8) Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >Driver read routine sets up buffers, etc. >Driver enables interrupts on peripheral. > Peripheral immediately interrupts, may satisfy whole read request. >Driver goes to sleep waiting for read request to be satsified. >... >I can't see how to avoid this race; I'm sure it must be possible, but >browsing other drivers yields no immediate inspiration. >Some sleep at raised interrupt level: >spltty() > tsleep(...) >splx() >Does this imply that tsleep() restores the base interrupt level while >it's running? Of course. Other process may run while the driver is sleeping. They may run in user mode. The sleep may be arbitarily long. It is not good to block interrupts for aritrarily long :-). After the tsleep(), the driver state may have changed in ways that are limited only by the exclusivity of access to the driver and/or how the driver handles i/o's and ioctls for other processes. If it blocks in _all_ cases then then state can't change (except for interrupts). Otherwise it has to check for state changes after each sleep. See tty.c for both good and bad examples. i/o's for separate processes are allowed to interleave... Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 03:28:20 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA04324 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 03:28:20 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id DAA04288 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 03:28:15 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Wed, 29 Nov 95 11:27 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id MAA16884; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 12:01:28 +0100 Message-Id: <199511291101.MAA16884@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Re: ibcs2(8) To: lyndon@orthanc.com (Lyndon Nerenberg VE7TCP) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 12:01:28 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) In-Reply-To: <199511280131.RAA23749@multivac.orthanc.com> from "Lyndon Nerenberg VE7TCP" at Nov 27, 95 05:31:01 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1514 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Lyndon Nerenberg VE7TCP writes: > > What's wrong with something like this? It documents the fact that > iBCS2 support exists, and that it's not for the timid (yet). > > .Dd November 27, 1995 > .Dt IBCS2 8 > .Os FreeBSD-Experimental > .Sh NAME > .Nm ibcs2 > .Nd load iBCS2 runtime support for SCO and ISC binaries > .Sh SYNOPSIS > .Nm ibcs2 > .Sh DESCRIPTION > The > .Nm > utility loads kernel runtime support for iBCS2 compliant programs. > This runtime support is limited to emulation of the iBCS2 > system call interface, and is far from complete. COFF binaries > and shared libraries are supported, however no shared libraries > are provided with the FreeBSD distribution. > .Sh FILES > .Bl -tag -width /lkm/ibcs2_coff.o -compact > .It Pa /lkm/ibcs2_mod.o > .It Pa /lkm/ibcs2_coff.o > iBCS2 loadable kernel modules > .Sh "SEE ALSO" > .Pa /sys/i386/ibcs2/README.iBCS2 , AHA! This is the documentation that I was looking for. It's not in -current: that's the real problem. > .Xr modload 8 , > .Xr lkm 4 > .Sh BUGS > The emulation is very incomplete. > .Pp > Running dynamically linked binaries requires access to an existing > SCO system from which you can grab the shared libraries. The term "dynamically linked binaries" suggests dynamically linked shared libraries. It might be better to say "shared libraries". It's probably also a good idea to mention that the emulator looks for them in /compat/ibcs2 before looking in /. > .Pp > You can't really use this without reading the source code. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 03:41:31 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA05501 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 03:41:31 -0800 Received: from ra.dkuug.dk (ra.dkuug.dk [193.88.44.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA05496 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 03:41:23 -0800 Received: (from sos@localhost) by ra.dkuug.dk (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA01389; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 12:40:32 +0100 Message-Id: <199511291140.MAA01389@ra.dkuug.dk> Subject: Re: Enough already! (Was: Where is the documentation for ibcs2?) To: grog@lemis.de Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 12:40:32 +0100 (MET) Cc: sos@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511291004.LAA16724@allegro.lemis.de> from "Greg Lehey" at Nov 29, 95 11:04:35 am From: sos@freebsd.org Reply-to: sos@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 2779 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Greg Lehey who wrote: > > sos@freebsd.org writes: > > I don't have an SCO machine up and running at the moment, but I've > seen this problem before: register_addr itself calls ptrace() to find > the address of the saved register block, and it's wrong (typically > contains 0). If you *really*, *really* find this important, I'll drag > out the disk and fire her up. Dont bother, I have nothing to do with the iBCS2 stuff anymore... > > I'll repeat again : > > The kernel part of the iBCS2 emulation is only say 10% of what is > > needed to run iBCS2/SCO apps, we must have a compatibel shell, ed > > sed, echo, awk, and and and, or its just going to break one > > way or another. We must have our own legal shared libs (plus an > > environment to make these in case things change). Then we also > > must have a "custom" util to install the stuff, plus whatever > > config files, setups, filestructure etc etc etc that the SCO > > apps expects from the system. > > Well, I think I have to disagree about the value of 10%, but I agree > that there's still a lot to be done. As I said in a previous message, > I have a number of pieces there for the taking, including the complete > GNU C library for SCO (and it works!). It's not in shared library > format at the moment, but it shouldn't be that much of a problem if > somebody's interested. You still don't get it, try go out and buy some fairly fancy SCO app in a shrink wrpped box, and the try to install it. Then you write down ALL the things that went wrong, how to fix them, and then come back here and tell me how much is missing before we have "resonable" iBCS2/SCO emulation, fair ?? > > Ha!, I've had my system run NCR svr4 binaries for almost a year > > now, but there are even more things to make SVR4 run that > > running iBCS2 (and besides my code for this doesn't work > > with the iBCS2 stuff we now have from NetBSD, it is nicely > > integrated into the "original" iBCS2 emulator). > > Well, it's a start. What was wrong with the "original" emulator? It had a problem in its socksys emulation which on of my "helpers" ported from Linux. It should have been done differently, but well it was a first shot. Besides this minimal bugfixes would have done it. Due to me (& Sean) not having time to fix it, swallace decided to take the NetBSD code and put that in instead of fixing our own :( I guess one could take NetBSD's SVR4 code and munge that into our tree as well (given the prober amount of kernel bashing that would be nessesary). Enough, this is starting to get rediculous... -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team So much code to hack -- so little time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 04:00:47 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA06912 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 04:00:47 -0800 Received: from Sysiphos (Sysiphos.MI.Uni-Koeln.DE [134.95.212.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA06893 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 04:00:30 -0800 Received: by Sysiphos id AA06154 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for hackers@freebsd.org); Wed, 29 Nov 1995 12:59:55 +0100 Message-Id: <199511291159.AA06154@Sysiphos> From: se@zpr.uni-koeln.de (Stefan Esser) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 12:59:54 +0100 In-Reply-To: J Wunsch "Re: Anyone keen to help me get a Phillips CDD 521 Recorder working?" (Nov 29, 8:55) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(2) 7/9/95) To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) Subject: Re: Anyone keen to help me get a Phillips CDD 521 Recorder working? Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Nov 29, 8:55, J Wunsch wrote: } Subject: Re: Anyone keen to help me get a Phillips CDD 521 Recorder workin } As Douglas Ambrisko wrote: } > } > So the data has to come from a hard drive } > attached to the SCSI bus. A lot of burners use a separate SCSI bus for the } > CD-R so it's doesn't have to worry about any other device holding the } > bus. Also people use AV disks to eliminate the problem of thermal } > recalibration. } } I think the problem with thermal recalibration is the biggest one. Not a problem anymore with embedded servo drives (e.g. a Quantum Fireball or any other of the current low cost SCSI drives ...) } On the other hand, with something like `team' doing the data } shuffling, you could use the RAM as an additional cache. One process } in constantly reading the input file, and this one will choke when the } disk performs a thermal recalib. Since the output process reads } buffered data, it will not starve immediately. The only requirement } is that the average CD burn rate is much slower than the average disk } read rate, but with 600 KB/s for the burner, this doesn't seem to be a } problem. } } Nevertheless, the driving process should run at rtprio, so its getting } the highest probability of grabbing the CPU whenever it needs it } (which is seldom anyway, since both of its sub-processes are i/o- } bound). Well, how about a configuration with a dedicated 1GB SCSI drive ($250) connected to a SCSI host adapter ($40) that it shares only with the CDROM writer, and using a SCSI Copy command for the actual transfer ... Seems like a low cost solution, that only requires a command similar to scsi_format to initiate the copy ... Regards, STefan -- Stefan Esser, Zentrum fuer Paralleles Rechnen Tel: +49 221 4706021 Universitaet zu Koeln, Weyertal 80, 50931 Koeln FAX: +49 221 4705160 ============================================================================== http://www.zpr.uni-koeln.de/~se From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 04:20:12 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA08273 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 04:20:12 -0800 Received: from Glock.COM (root@glock.com [198.82.228.165]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA08268 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 04:20:10 -0800 Received: (from mmead@localhost) by Glock.COM (8.7.1/8.7.1) id HAA10311; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 07:19:54 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 07:19:54 -0500 (EST) From: "matthew c. mead" Message-Id: <199511291219.HAA10311@Glock.COM> To: davidg@Root.COM Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: SMC EtherEZ 8416 In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, November 28, 1995 20:22:56 -0800 References: <199511290356.WAA08739@Glock.COM> <199511290423.UAA00438@corbin.Root.COM> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, November 28, 1995 at 20:22:56 (-0800), David Greenman wrote: > > I've got an SMC EtherEZ 8416 that I'd like to use with FreeBSD, and it > >shows up properly under the ed0 driver, but anytime I try to use the card I get > >an error message that looks like this: > >ed0: NIC memory corrupt - Invalid packet length 4648. > > Anyone have any ideas? It works fine under *cringe* Win95 on someone > >else's machine... > What version of FreeBSD is this with? 2.1.0R. I had recommended the purchase of this card due to response from the list that it worked properly under the ed0 drive, but apparently it doesn't. I can pop it back in my machine for testing if you'd like to hammer this out... -matt -- Matthew C. Mead mmead@Glock.COM | Network Administration and Software Development http://www.Glock.COM/~mmead/ | Consulting: BizNet Technologies -> mmead@bnt.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 04:27:47 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA08498 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 04:27:47 -0800 Received: from feephi.phofarm.com (root@feephi.phofarm.com [204.242.60.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA08493 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 04:27:45 -0800 Received: (from dzerkel@localhost) by feephi.phofarm.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id HAA01482; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 07:29:39 -0500 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 07:29:39 -0500 From: "Danny J. Zerkel" Message-Id: <199511291229.HAA01482@feephi.phofarm.com> To: gfoster@gfoster.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: posessed by daemons? Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > When checking this out I found that md5's on the src tgzs were not > consistent, and inconsistent in a weird way. If I do 'md5 *' in the > src directory, three or four of the 131 files don't match the md5's on > the same files generated on another machine. Different files exhibit > this from run to run! However, I can do 'repeat 10000 md5 sgnu.aa | > sort | uniq' and not get any mismatches (no matter what value of > sgnu.aa I select :-). I saw this exact behavior way back in May. Turned out my L2 cache was broken. Motherboard replacement (under warranty) fixed it. > I am seriously mistrusting this machine at this point! It is a P90, > SiS, L2 cache disabled, 2940, 4GB Barracuda, as slow as the CMOS will > let me on the memory accesses. I don't know whether to blame the > memory or disk sub-systems. Of course, no errors are ever reported on > either and for user stuff it runs like a champ, although it is very > lightly loaded. There may be some incremental bit rot going on but I > haven't seen any in the three weeks or so it has been up. I'd say memory. Mine ran okay, too. Just things like md5 and gunzip failed. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Danny J. Zerkel Photon Farmers http://www.phofarm.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 05:06:27 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA13402 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 05:06:27 -0800 Received: from shell.monmouth.com (pechter@shell.monmouth.com [205.164.220.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA13396 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 05:06:25 -0800 Received: (from pechter@localhost) by shell.monmouth.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA18968; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:05:26 -0500 From: Bill/Carolyn Pechter Message-Id: <199511291305.IAA18968@shell.monmouth.com> Subject: Re: FreeBSD custom bootfloppies To: Seppo.Ruuskanen@axis.se (Seppo Ruuskanen) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:05:25 -0500 (EST) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD-hackers) In-Reply-To: <199511290903.KAA13459@entii.axis.se> from "Seppo Ruuskanen" at Nov 29, 95 10:03:15 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 920 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I never got any answers to my questions. My problem was (and is IBM Thinkpad > 370C). I never got any further than You, my homemade bootfloppy behaved just > like Yours. BOOTMFS cant be the whole answer! > > So if You or anybody else have the answer I would also want to know!!! > > Bye / Seppo Ruuskanen > I've ordered a 365CSD -- when it comes in I'll give it a try. (Interesting that there's a number of Linux users inside IBM -- I'm trying to get some folks hooked on FreeBSD). (So far I've found two of us in my office who are running it -- both started FreeBSDing before IBM). Bill ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bill Pechter/Carolyn Pechter | The postmaster always pings twice. Lakewood MicroSystems | 17 Meredith Drive, 908-389-3592 | Tinton Falls, NJ 07724 pechter@shell.monmouth.com | From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 05:31:18 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA14935 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 05:31:18 -0800 Received: from public.wintek.com (public.wintek.com [199.233.104.88]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA14927 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 05:31:16 -0800 Received: from watson.grauel.com (watson.grauel.com [199.233.104.36]) by public.wintek.com (8.6.12/1.07wintek(3.6davy)) with ESMTP id IAA04363; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:30:44 -0500 Received: from sparcmill.grauel.com (sparcmill [199.233.104.34]) by watson.grauel.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id IAA14963; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:42:55 -0500 Received: by sparcmill.grauel.com (5.0/SMI-SVR4) id AA05867; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:25:29 +0500 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:25:29 +0500 Message-Id: <9511291325.AA05867@sparcmill.grauel.com> From: Richard J Kuhns To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Bug in stable/-current perl? In-Reply-To: <199511290543.VAA13120@freefall.freebsd.org> References: <199511290543.VAA13120@freefall.freebsd.org> content-length: 914 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Jordan K. Hubbard writes: > jkh@freefall-> date > Tue Nov 28 21:42:48 PST 1995 > > jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[3]);' > 28 > jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[4]);' > 10 > jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[5]);' > 95 > > 10? Am I misunderstanding something fundamental about perl's > localtime() call, or should this be an "11"? > > Jordan > >From `Programming Perl', page 157, referring to the return value of localtime(): "All array elements are numeric, and come straight out of a struct tm. [...] In particular this means that [the month value] has the range 0..11". I think the idea is that you can use month value as a zero-based array subscript to go from number to name. Day of week is done the same way. -- Rich Kuhns rjk@grauel.com PO Box 6249 100 Sawmill Road Lafayette, IN 47903 (317)477-6000 x319 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 05:45:21 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA15750 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 05:45:21 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA15736 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 05:44:51 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id AAA24528; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:40:14 +1100 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:40:14 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511291340.AAA24528@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: julian@ref.tfs.com, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Subject: Re: more device driver question 8) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> > spltty() >> > tsleep(...) >> > splx() >> > >> > Does this imply that tsleep() restores the base interrupt level while >> > it's running? >> exactly, >> It schedules another process, which will be at some OTHER >> interrupt priority level, it does it 'atomicly' too.. >Ah. This implies that interrupt priorities are kept on a per-process basis, >correct? They are kept in local variables. Except above :-). >So for a 'tty' device driver, I could safely say >spltty() >enable_interrupt() >tsleep() >splx() >and be sure that interrupts from the device won't be enabled until after >the current process sleeps? The spltty() would do that. I don't know what enable_interrupt() is. Perhaps you meant disable_intr(). That would probably disable interrupts forever. Don't use disable_intr() except in short (< 10 usec) critical regions. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 06:13:53 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id GAA17195 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 06:13:53 -0800 Received: from zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za (zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za [146.64.24.58]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA17187 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 06:13:41 -0800 Received: (from rbezuide@localhost) by zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za (8.6.12/8.6.9) id QAA07363; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:12:50 +0200 From: R Bezuidenhout Message-Id: <199511291412.QAA07363@zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za> Subject: Re: Bug in stable/-current perl? To: jkh@freefall.freebsd.org (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:12:50 +0200 (SAT) Cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511290543.VAA13120@freefall.freebsd.org> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 28, 95 09:43:31 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1681 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > jkh@freefall-> date > Tue Nov 28 21:42:48 PST 1995 > > jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[3]);' > 28 > jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[4]);' > 10 In perl localtime is used in the following format: ($sec,$min,$hour,$mday,$mon,$year,$wday,$yday,$isdat) = localtime(time); but I guess you know that :) What you missed is that both $mon and $wday is zero based. So ... $mon = 0..11 $wday = 0..6 The reason for this is that $mon and $wday is used as subscripts into 0-based arrays containing month and day names. Isn't this the same as with "struct tm" in C ? :) (This you you know too, I am sure :) ) So, if perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[4]);' that returns a 10 in November is a feature ... not a bug :) Regards -- ######################################################################## # # # Reinier Bezuidenhout Company: Mikomtek CSIR, ZA # # # # Network Engineer - NetSec development team # # # # Current Projects: NetSec - Secure Platform firewall system # # http://www.mikom.csir.co.za # # # # E-mail: rbezuide@mikom.csir.co.za # # # ######################################################################## From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 06:25:08 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id GAA18964 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 06:25:08 -0800 Received: from bigbird.vmicls.com (bigbird.vmicls.com [198.17.96.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA18959 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 06:25:06 -0800 Received: from gonzo by bigbird.vmicls.com (8.6.9/SMI-4.1-vmicls-master-host-1) id JAA01735; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:27:36 -0500 From: Jerry.Kendall@vmicls.com (Jerry Kendall) Organization: VMI Communications and Learning Systems Received: by gonzo (5.0/vmi-client-host-1) id AA00809; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:27:34 +0500 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:27:34 +0500 Message-Id: <9511291427.AA00809.gonzo@vmicls.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Becoming a mirror site for FreeBSD X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII content-length: 111 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk What is the best way to do this? How much disk space is required? Any docs/example setups avail ??? Jerry From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 06:26:33 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id GAA19009 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 06:26:33 -0800 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA19003 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 06:26:31 -0800 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id IAA14156; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:25:29 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199511291425.IAA14156@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Thumbs up? Or down?? (disk recommend) To: henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu (Charles Henrich) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:25:28 -0600 (CST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511290517.AAA02331@crh.cl.msu.edu> from "Charles Henrich" at Nov 29, 95 00:17:11 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > In lists.freebsd.hackers you write: > > >> Greetings! > >> I was planning on picking up some MC3243 drives (4.3G, 8.?mS) > >> and wondered if any have comments pro or con? > >> Thanx! > > >Exec-PC just returned a boatload of these to the manufacturer. Tooo many > >failures under moderate to heavy use. Buy a Barracuda instead and put a big > >fan on it. > > Screw that, we have about 80% failure on Barracuda's we have so far. Shoot for > the Connor 4207S, runs cold, 7200RPM, fast as snot, works perfect so far. I get about a 1 in 30 failure (1 yr period) on the Barracudas (32550 class) and haven't seen a 15150 fail yet, although the sample size is small for those. The 12550's are bad iff you don't keep them cool - which most people fail to do. This isn't a bad set of statistics, in my experience. As for the Conner drives, are you serious? Sun Microsystems recently learned a hard lesson about getting what you pay for - they dumped their "traditional" vendor, Seagate, in favor of Conner - burning some bridges as they did so - and when they discovered the incredibly high failure rate of the Conner drives under moderate to heavy use, they actually _stopped_ shipping the Conner drives and quickly depleted their surplus of Seagates. I can just imagine that Seagate is now making a little more money off of Sun's smaller discounts. :-) I'm not saying all Conner drives are bad or all Seagates are good, I can pose many counterexamples for both. But there's one vendor's experiences. When it comes right down to it, disk technology just isn't incredibly reliable. :-/ ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 06:35:26 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id GAA19484 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 06:35:26 -0800 Received: from kitten.mcs.com (Kitten.mcs.com [192.160.127.90]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA19477 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 06:35:12 -0800 Received: from venus.mcs.com (root@Venus.mcs.com [192.160.127.92]) by kitten.mcs.com (8.6.10/8.6.9) with SMTP id IAA02531; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:33:52 -0600 Received: by venus.mcs.com (/\==/\ Smail3.1.28.1 #28.5) id ; Wed, 29 Nov 95 08:33 CST Message-Id: Subject: Re: Thumbs up? Or down?? (disk recommend) To: henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu (Charles Henrich) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:33:51 -0600 (CST) From: "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" Cc: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511290517.AAA02331@crh.cl.msu.edu> from "Charles Henrich" at Nov 29, 95 00:17:11 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1120 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > In lists.freebsd.hackers you write: > > >> Greetings! > >> I was planning on picking up some MC3243 drives (4.3G, 8.?mS) > >> and wondered if any have comments pro or con? > >> Thanx! > > >Exec-PC just returned a boatload of these to the manufacturer. Tooo many > >failures under moderate to heavy use. Buy a Barracuda instead and put a big > >fan on it. > > Screw that, we have about 80% failure on Barracuda's we have so far. Shoot for > the Connor 4207S, runs cold, 7200RPM, fast as snot, works perfect so far. > > -Crh We have a zero failure rate on the Seagate Hawks; not quite as fast (5400rpm) but very stable and great seek times (sub 10ms). The 4.2G drives are relatively inexpensive to boot. We like 'em here. -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity Modem: [+1 312 248-0900] | (shell, PPP, SLIP, leased) in Chicagoland Voice: [+1 312 803-MCS1] | 10 Chicagoland POPs, ISDN, 28.8, much more Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Email to "info@mcs.net" WWW: http://www.mcs.net ISDN - Get it here TODAY! | Home of Chicago's only FULL Clarinet feed! From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 07:11:46 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA21952 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 07:11:46 -0800 Received: from io.org (io.org [142.77.70.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA21938 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 07:11:40 -0800 Received: from trepan.io.org (andrew@trepan.io.org [198.133.36.8]) by io.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA05722; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:11:28 -0500 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:11:28 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Herdman To: "matthew c. mead" cc: davidg@Root.COM, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: SMC EtherEZ 8416 In-Reply-To: <199511291219.HAA10311@Glock.COM> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 29 Nov 1995, matthew c. mead wrote: > On Tue, November 28, 1995 at 20:22:56 (-0800), David Greenman wrote: > > > > I've got an SMC EtherEZ 8416 that I'd like to use with FreeBSD, and it > > >shows up properly under the ed0 driver, but anytime I try to use the card I get > > >an error message that looks like this: > > > >ed0: NIC memory corrupt - Invalid packet length 4648. > > > > Anyone have any ideas? It works fine under *cringe* Win95 on someone > > >else's machine... > > > What version of FreeBSD is this with? > > 2.1.0R. I had recommended the purchase of this card due to > response from the list that it worked properly under the ed0 drive, but > apparently it doesn't. I can pop it back in my machine for testing if > you'd like to hammer this out... Thats ok, this card has the same problem with bsdi 2.0.1 and 2.0. It's a crappy card. Andrew Use the SMC Ultra 16 instead From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 07:55:49 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA25644 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 07:55:49 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA25639 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 07:55:42 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id HAA08047; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 07:51:36 -0800 To: sos@FreeBSD.org cc: cshenton@apollo.hq.nasa.gov, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Thoughts on the install and on Red Hat Linux. In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:26:04 +0100." <199511290826.JAA01180@ra.dkuug.dk> Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 07:51:36 -0800 Message-ID: <8045.817660296@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > In reply to Jordan K. Hubbard who wrote: > > > > > Hmm, I allready sent you a "technology demo" of the mouse stuff > > > half a year ago or something, forgot ?? :) :) > > > > No, I remember it quite well. You sent it to me, I tried it, it > > didn't work, I told you it didn't work, you went: "Hmmm!" :-) > > You had a strange mouse, didn't you, I think that was the > problem. Logitech mouseman serial mouse. Don't think so! :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 08:30:50 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id IAA28591 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:30:50 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA28569 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:30:45 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id IAA08279; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:26:33 -0800 To: sos@freebsd.org cc: grog@lemis.de, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Enough already! (Was: Where is the documentation for ibcs2?) In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 29 Nov 1995 12:40:32 +0100." <199511291140.MAA01389@ra.dkuug.dk> Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:26:33 -0800 Message-ID: <8277.817662393@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > You still don't get it, try go out and buy some fairly fancy SCO app in > a shrink wrpped box, and the try to install it. Then you write down > ALL the things that went wrong, how to fix them, and then come > back here and tell me how much is missing before we have > "resonable" iBCS2/SCO emulation, fair ?? I think that sums the situation up pretty good. Until anything else is possible, iBCS2 is just a geek toy. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 08:34:49 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id IAA28998 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:34:49 -0800 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA28991 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:34:43 -0800 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id KAA14410; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:33:30 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199511291633.KAA14410@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Becoming a mirror site for FreeBSD To: Jerry.Kendall@vmicls.com (Jerry Kendall) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:33:29 -0600 (CST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <9511291427.AA00809.gonzo@vmicls.com> from "Jerry Kendall" at Nov 29, 95 09:27:34 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > What is the best way to do this? Set up your ftp server. FTP to wcarchive. Do a bunch of ' get dir.tar "|tar xf - ' commands. > How much disk space is required? >From ftp.freebsd.sol.net: # du -s -k /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE 482729 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE # du -s -k /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/* 334 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/FAQ 17 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/HARDWARE 20 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/INSTALL 4 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/MIRROR.SITES 8 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/README.TXT 28 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/RELNOTES 1210 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/UPDATES 54156 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/XF86311 14645 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/bin 11468 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/commerce 1086 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/compat1x 777 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/compat20 1236 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/des 1393 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/dict 188685 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/distfiles 1570 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/floppies 2849 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/games 1247 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/info 2881 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/manpages 101848 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/packages 11739 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/ports 937 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/proflibs 29265 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/src 55325 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE/xperimnt # du -s -k /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE 213475 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE # du -s -k /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/* 92055 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/XF86312 16640 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/bin 14938 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/commerce 538 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/compat1x 778 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/compat20 1442 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/des 1394 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/dict 4041 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/floppies 2850 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/games 1078 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/info 2962 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/manpages 0 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/packages 0 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/ports 930 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/proflibs 29568 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/src 44186 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/xperimnt # du -s -k /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/FreeBSD-current/* 119374 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/FreeBSD-current/src # du -s -k /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/FreeBSD-stable/* 116664 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/FreeBSD-stable/src # du -s -k /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/distfiles 317238 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/distfiles # du -s -k /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/packages-2.1 159454 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/packages-2.1 # du -s -k /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/ports-2.1 8628 /ftp/.0/systems/unix/FreeBSD/ports-2.1 Sum total under FreeBSD on my ftp server is 99% of a 2GB drive. /dev/sd1s1e 1896783 1733178 11862 99% /ftp/.0 Of course you might choose to knock off 2.0.5R, the current and stable trees, etc. I have chosen not to mirror 2.0R due to the impressive space requirements. > Any docs/example setups avail ??? Not that I know of. I just went to wcarchive and started doing gets of tarred directories. I don't like the current generation of mirror software (not that I've given it much chance, I suppose). ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 08:39:05 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id IAA29370 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:39:05 -0800 Received: from Glock.COM (root@glock.com [198.82.228.165]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA29362 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:39:01 -0800 Received: (from mmead@localhost) by Glock.COM (8.7.1/8.7.1) id LAA11112; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:38:42 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:38:42 -0500 (EST) From: "matthew c. mead" Message-Id: <199511291638.LAA11112@Glock.COM> To: Andrew Herdman Cc: davidg@Root.COM, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: SMC EtherEZ 8416 In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, November 29, 1995 10:11:28 -0500 References: <199511291219.HAA10311@Glock.COM> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, November 29, 1995 at 10:11:28 (-0500), Andrew Herdman wrote: > > > >ed0: NIC memory corrupt - Invalid packet length 4648. > > > > Anyone have any ideas? It works fine under *cringe* Win95 on someone > > > >else's machine... > > > What version of FreeBSD is this with? > > 2.1.0R. I had recommended the purchase of this card due to > > response from the list that it worked properly under the ed0 drive, but > > apparently it doesn't. I can pop it back in my machine for testing if > > you'd like to hammer this out... > Thats ok, this card has the same problem with bsdi 2.0.1 and 2.0. It's a > crappy card. > Use the SMC Ultra 16 instead Ack! What happened to SMC making great cards? *sigh* I was told SMC no longer made the Ultras and Elite Ultras. David, do you know if there's much chance of getting this card working soon? -matt -- Matthew C. Mead mmead@Glock.COM | Network Administration and Software Development http://www.Glock.COM/~mmead/ | Consulting: BizNet Technologies -> mmead@bnt.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 08:50:54 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id IAA00629 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:50:54 -0800 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA00624 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:50:51 -0800 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id KAA14448; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:49:48 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199511291649.KAA14448@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Thumbs up? Or down?? (disk recommend) To: karl@mcs.com (Karl Denninger MCSNet) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:49:47 -0600 (CST) Cc: henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" at Nov 29, 95 08:33:51 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > We have a zero failure rate on the Seagate Hawks; not quite as fast > (5400rpm) but very stable and great seek times (sub 10ms). > > The 4.2G drives are relatively inexpensive to boot. We like 'em here. I would generally agree that these are reliable workhorse drives, and the prices currently appear to be substantially cheaper than the Barracudas. NOTE: Check the mailing list archives for mention of these drives. They are red flagged in my memory for some controller compatibility issue, I believe, so you will want to watch out for some particular combination of controller and drive.. However, the units that I've seen and/or used have been solid disks. It's just that most of the things I do are news related and so I'm a performance freak... :-) I'd rather have an 8ms drive than a 9ms drive. ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 09:02:53 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA01362 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:02:53 -0800 Received: from gdwest.gd.com ([134.120.3.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA01345 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:02:38 -0800 Received: (from eyfarris@localhost) by gdwest.gd.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) id JAA24116; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:02:16 -0800 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:02:16 -0800 From: Eblan Y Farris Message-Id: <199511291702.JAA24116@gdwest.gd.com> To: Jerry.Kendall@vmicls.com, dennis@etinc.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Pentium Motherboards Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Any recommendations or known FreeBSD problems with the following > MBs/Chipsets with a 100Mhz Pentium: > > AP5CS SIS Chipset > AP5C TRITON chipset > P130 TRITON with Pipeline Cache > > > Thanks > > Dennis Acer was never known to produce the best motherboards when it came down to design innovation and compatability. 3 Acer employees who formed ASUS on the otherhand are known for those traits. efarris@surfusa.com http://www.surfusa.com/ visit the website for more mb info! From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 09:56:32 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA06004 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:56:32 -0800 Received: from etinc.com (et-gw.etinc.com [165.254.13.209]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA05850 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 09:55:37 -0800 Received: from trumpet.etnet.com (trumpet.etnet.com [129.45.17.35]) by etinc.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA15030; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:02:54 -0500 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:02:54 -0500 Message-Id: <199511291802.NAA15030@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Eblan Y Farris From: dennis@etinc.com (dennis) Subject: Re: Pentium Motherboards Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> >> Any recommendations or known FreeBSD problems with the following >> MBs/Chipsets with a 100Mhz Pentium: >> >> AP5CS SIS Chipset >> AP5C TRITON chipset >> P130 TRITON with Pipeline Cache >> >> >> Thanks >> >> Dennis > >Acer was never known to produce the best motherboards >when it came down to design innovation and compatability. > >3 Acer employees who formed ASUS on the otherhand are >known for those traits. > We ended up buying the AP5C (100MHZ) and find that it is excellent. The PCI and ISA bus performance is excellent (many PCI/ISA MBs have severly reduced bus performance on the ISA bus), and have had no compatibility problems. Every new motherboard is an experience...but this has been a good one.. Dennis ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Emerging Technologies, Inc. http://www.etinc.com Synchronous Communications Cards and Routers For Discriminating Tastes. 56k to T1 and beyond. Frame Relay, PPP, HDLC, and X.25 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 10:01:05 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA06406 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:01:05 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA06383 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:00:32 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Wed, 29 Nov 95 17:57 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id SAA20625; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:37:14 +0100 Message-Id: <199511291737.SAA20625@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Re: Thumbs up? Or down?? (disk recommend) To: henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu (Charles Henrich) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:37:14 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) In-Reply-To: <199511290517.AAA02331@crh.cl.msu.edu> from "Charles Henrich" at Nov 29, 95 00:17:11 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 873 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Charles Henrich writes: > > In lists.freebsd.hackers you write: > >>> Greetings! >>> I was planning on picking up some MC3243 drives (4.3G, 8.?mS) >>> and wondered if any have comments pro or con? >>> Thanx! > >> Exec-PC just returned a boatload of these to the manufacturer. Tooo many >> failures under moderate to heavy use. Buy a Barracuda instead and put a big >> fan on it. > > Screw that, we have about 80% failure on Barracuda's we have so far. Shoot for > the Connor 4207S, runs cold, 7200RPM, fast as snot, works perfect so far. Well, I haven't had any trouble with Barracudas yet, though I sold them on my client's express wish after having vowed never to use Seagate again. I'm using a 4207S myself. It's in a cabinet, so I can't say how warm it's getting, but it *does* make a hell of a noise when it's working. Not a machine for your bedroom. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 10:33:20 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA08598 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:33:20 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA08593 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:33:16 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA00286 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:33:06 -0800 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Anyone having 2.1 install trouble with funky IDE hardware? Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:33:06 -0800 Message-ID: <284.817669986@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I've received two reports now of wdc installation malfuntion with hardware that used to work under 2.0.5. This is disturbing. In both cases, the hardware was some old and funky 386/25 with IDE controller and disk hardware of similar vintage. Have any folks out there installed 2.1 on old-n-mouldy 386 equipment without incident? I have no such hardware here myself to test. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 10:44:12 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA09358 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:44:12 -0800 Received: from sequent.kiae.su (sequent.kiae.su [144.206.136.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA09223 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:43:54 -0800 Received: by sequent.kiae.su id AA13553 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:39:05 +0300 Received: by sequent.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Wed, 29 Nov 95 21:39:04 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by ache.dialup.demos.ru (8.6.12/8.6.12) id VAA00970; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:38:40 +0300 To: Harlan Stenn , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <5548.817638375@mumps.pfcs.com> In-Reply-To: <5548.817638375@mumps.pfcs.com>; from Harlan Stenn at Wed, 29 Nov 1995 04:46:15 -0400 Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:38:40 +0300 (MSK) X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.41 FreeBSD] From: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: Patches for lib/libskey/ Lines: 24 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 754 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <5548.817638375@mumps.pfcs.com> Harlan Stenn writes: >The following patch for skey.h is because recstart is used by fseek. >- long recstart; /*needed so reread of buffer is efficient*/ >+ off_t recstart; /*needed so reread of buffer is efficient*/ > }; DON'T APPLY IT! Fseek argument is long. >- buf[strcspn(buf, "\r\n")] = 0; >+ buf += strcspn(buf, "\r\n"); >+ >+ if (*buf) >+ *buf = 0; > } This one looks good. -- Andrey A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - http://dt.demos.su/~ache : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 10:59:23 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA10344 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:59:23 -0800 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.Atinc.COM [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA10333 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 10:59:11 -0800 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id NAA07798; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:49:46 -0500 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:49:45 -0500 (EST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: Re: Becoming a mirror site for FreeBSD To: Joe Greco cc: Jerry Kendall , hackers@freebsd.org, hubs@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511291633.KAA14410@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > What is the best way to do this? the easiest way is to use the mirror perl script (its a port mirror-2.3). i have included the packages file that i use at the end run mirror out of cron 11 5 * * * /mirror packages jmb Jonathan M. Bresler FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.ORG play go. ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life i am moving to a new job. PLEASE USE: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG # # PACKAGES # # This is the default mirror settings used by my site: # kryten.atinc.com # # adapted from mirror.defaults by Lee McLoughlin # You should be able to use this at other sites. You should only have # to change bits that reference this site so look for doc.ic below. package=defaults # The LOCAL hostname - if not the same as `hostname` # hostname=src.doc.ic.ac.uk # Keep all local_dirs relative to here local_dir=/spare/anon-ftp/pub/ remote_password=jmb@kryten.atinc.com mail_to=jmb@kryten.atinc.com # Don't mirror file modes. Set all dirs/files to these dir_mode=0755 file_mode=0444 # By defaults files are owned by root.zero user=jmb group=staff # # Keep a log file in each updated directory # update_log=.mirror update_log=/home/jmb/bin/mirror.log # Don't overwrite my mirror log with the remote one. # Don't pull back any of their mirror temporary files. # Don't touch anything whose name begins with a space! # nor any FSP or gopher files... exclude_patt=(^|/)(\.mirror$|core$|\.cap|\.in\..*\.$|MIRROR.LOG|#.*#|\.FSP|\.cache|\.zipped|\.notar|\.message|lost+found/|\ ) # Try to compress everything compress_patt=. compress_prog=compress # Don't compress information files, files that don't benifit from # being compressed, files that tell ftpd, gopher, wais... to do things, # the sources for compression programs... # (Note this is the only regexp that is case insensitive.) # z matches compress/pack/gzip, gz for gzip. (built into perl) # taz/tgz is compressed or gzipped tar files # arc, arj, lzh, zip and zoo are pc and/or amiga archives. # sea are mac archives. # vms used -z instead of .z. stupid vms. # shk is multimedia? used on apple2s. compress_excl+|-z(\d+)?$|\.tgz|_tgz|\.tar\.Z|\.tar\.gz|\.taz$|\.arc$|\.zip$|\.lzh$|\.zoo$|\.exe$|\.lha$|\.zom$|\.gif$|\.jpeg$|\.jpg$|\.mpeg$|\.au$|\.shk$|read.*me|index|info|faq|gzip|compress|(^|/)\.\.?$ # Don't delete own mirror log, .notar or .cache files (incl in subdirs) # delete_excl=(^|/)\.(mirror|notar|cache)$ # Ignore any local readme and .mirror files # jmb 9411201 added .message files local_ignore=README.doc.ic|(^|/)\.(mirror|notar|message)$ # Automatically delete local copies of files that the # remote site has zapped do_deletes=true max_delete_files=50% max_delete_dirs=50% #package=FreeBSD.2.0-RELEASE # comment=FreeBSD 2.0-RELEASE distribution # site=ftp.cdrom.com # remote_dir=/pub/FreeBSD/2.0-RELEASE/ # local_dir+FreeBSD/2.0-RELEASE/ # compress_patt= # local_ignore=packages-2.0|(^|/)\.(mirror|notar|message)$ # #package=FreeBSD.2.0-packages # comment=FreeBSD 2.0 packages # site=ftp.cdrom.com # remote_dir=/pub/FreeBSD/packages-2.0 # local_dir+FreeBSD/2.0-RELEASE/packages-2.0 # compress_patt= # # package=FreeBSD.2.0.5-ALPHA # comment=FreeBSD 2.0.5 ALPHA # site=ftp.freebsd.org # remote_dir=/pub/FreeBSD/2.0.5-ALPHA # local_dir+FreeBSD/2.0.5-ALPHA # compress_patt= # exclude_patt=(^|/)(XF86-co.tgz|XF86-xc.tgz|\.mirror$|core$|\.cap|\.in\..*\.$|MIRROR.LOG|#.*#|\.FSP|\.cache|\.zipped|\.notar|\.message|lost+found/|\ ) package=FreeBSD.2.0.5-RELEASE comment=FreeBSD 2.0.5 RELEASE site=ftp.cdrom.com remote_dir=/pub/FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE local_dir+FreeBSD/2.0.5-RELEASE compress_patt= exclude_patt=(^|/)(XF86-co.tgz|XF86-xc.tgz|distfiles|\.mirror$|core$|\.cap|\.in\..*\.$|MIRROR.LOG|#.*#|\.FSP|\.cache|\.zipped|\.notar|\.message|lost+found/|\ ) package=FreeBSD.2.1.0-RELEASE comment=FreeBSD 2.1.0-RELEASE distribution site=ftp.cdrom.com remote_dir=/pub/FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/ local_dir+FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/ compress_patt= local_ignore=packages|ports|(^|/)\.(mirror|notar|message)$ package=FreeBSD.2.1-packages comment=FreeBSD 2.1 packages site=ftp.cdrom.com remote_dir=/pub/FreeBSD/packages-2.1 local_dir+FreeBSD/2.1.0-RELEASE/packages compress_patt= exclude_patt=(^|/)(XF86-co.tgz|XF86-xc.tgz|distfiles|\.mirror$|core$|\.cap|\.in\..*\.$|MIRROR.LOG|#.*#|\.FSP|\.cache|\.zipped|\.notar|\.message|lost+found/|\ ) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 11:29:39 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA12175 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:29:39 -0800 Received: from vegemite.Stanford.EDU (2842@vegemite.Stanford.EDU [36.159.0.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA12166 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:29:34 -0800 Received: (hlew@localhost) by vegemite.Stanford.EDU (8.7.1/8.6.4) id LAA23964; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:28:04 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:28:03 -0800 (PST) From: Howard Lew To: cg@www.ati.khs-linz.ac.at cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: To all fbsdboot and winboot users ... In-Reply-To: <9511290951.ZM4056@IRIS> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 29 Nov 1995, Christian Gusenbauer wrote: > On Nov 28, 12:15pm, Howard Lew wrote: > > Subject: Re: To all fbsdboot and winboot users ... > > On Mon, 27 Nov 1995, Christian Gusenbauer wrote: > > > > > > > > Hi! > > > > > > I'd like to know, if fbsdboot and winboot work with Win95?! Is there > > > anybody out there with some experience? > > > > > > > Yes! fbsdboot.exe works great! That's how I got the DTC2278EB > > controller with LBA to run FreeBSD and Win 95 even though the > > controller seems to be incompatible with FreeBSD at first. > > That's great, because I don't want to install Win95 right now or then :)! > > > > > As for the winboot thing? I'm not sure what that is.... But all I need to > > do is drop to a DOS prompt. > > Winboot is a nice little utility, which allows you to boot FreeBSD out of > a running Windows 3.1. I don't know if it runs with Win95. You may find it > on the 2.0.5 CD in the experimental directory. You can find it on > fimp01.fim.uni-linz.ac.at in the /pub/soft/unix directory, too. > So is winboot the same as fbsdboot except that it's a windows version? Or here's a hopeful thought... You don't mean I can boot up FreeBSD and run it as a task in Windows right? From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 11:44:13 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA13816 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:44:13 -0800 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA13787 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:44:10 -0800 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.50]) by Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id LAA01466; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:44:07 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with SMTP id LAA02174; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:42:22 -0800 Message-Id: <199511291942.LAA02174@corbin.Root.COM> To: "matthew c. mead" cc: Andrew Herdman , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: SMC EtherEZ 8416 In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 29 Nov 95 11:38:42 EST." <199511291638.LAA11112@Glock.COM> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:42:13 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > apparently it doesn't. I can pop it back in my machine for testing if > > > you'd like to hammer this out... > > > Thats ok, this card has the same problem with bsdi 2.0.1 and 2.0. It's a > > crappy card. > > > Use the SMC Ultra 16 instead > > Ack! What happened to SMC making great cards? *sigh* I was told >SMC no longer made the Ultras and Elite Ultras. David, do you know if >there's much chance of getting this card working soon? The EtherEZ *should* work. It was working for some people...I have one here and I'll try to test it out soon. In the mean time, I'd try changing the shared memory address to something different and possible look at your ISA bus timing and make sure it isn't too fast. -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 12:05:49 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id MAA15611 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 12:05:49 -0800 Received: from bacchus.eng.umd.edu (bacchus.eng.umd.edu [129.2.94.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA15605 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 12:05:46 -0800 Received: from espresso.eng.umd.edu (espresso.eng.umd.edu [129.2.98.13]) by bacchus.eng.umd.edu (8.7/8.7) with ESMTP id PAA24567; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 15:05:39 -0500 (EST) Received: (chuckr@localhost) by espresso.eng.umd.edu (8.7.2/8.6.4) id PAA07989; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 15:05:39 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 15:05:38 -0500 (EST) From: Chuck Robey X-Sender: chuckr@espresso.eng.umd.edu To: StevenR362@aol.com cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Heideman Thesis In-Reply-To: <951129003806_119456143@emout05.mail.aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 29 Nov 1995 StevenR362@aol.com wrote: > > I need a ftp pointer for John Heideman's Masters thesis for some > research > that I am doing. look at ftp.cs.ucla.edu, I think the directory is /pub/ficus, and I think the tesis name is obvious, like 'heidemann'.something. > > Thanks > > Steve > ============================================================================ Chuck Robey chuckr@eng.umd.edu -- I run FreeBSD on n3lxx and Journey2 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Dilbert Zone is Dilbert's new WWW home! The area features never-before-seen original sketches of Dilbert, a photo tour of Scott Adams' studio, Dilbert Trivia and memorabilia, high school photos and much more!: From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 13:11:21 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA20725 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:11:21 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA20715 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:11:13 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA28617; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 14:05:44 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511292105.OAA28617@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: uio question... To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 14:05:44 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511290134.BAA09808@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Nov 29, 95 01:34:51 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1203 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Okay, my entry for the lame-device-driver-question of the month 8) > > Given a device read function passed a uio struct, what's the correct way > to determine the total size of the read request? > > I have two possibles here : walk the array of iovec structures, or > contemplate the uio_resid field, which appears to be used by a number of > other drivers... > > Experience? The "resid" is used to determine residual read remaining. Typically, a uio struct will have an iovec count of one, or the alternate iovec's will be non-contiguous. In either case , for a non-one iovec count in the uio, you *must* walk the iovec list to return any information. The question is whether your driver does scatter/gather itself, or whether it will be handling I/O one iovec at a time. You should look at the tty, generic (controller independent) scsi code, one of the SCSI controller dependendt code pieces (the 1540/1740? I recommend against the NCR/AHA2xxx code because of the additional complexity) and the readv/writev system call code in /usr/src/sys/kern. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 13:11:57 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA20761 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:11:57 -0800 Received: from pcpsj.pfcs.com (Odsa8q1e3O7zaveJKb9hQItx1qwsHtXD@harlan.clark.net [168.143.10.179]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA20749 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:11:41 -0800 Received: from mumps.pfcs.com (mumps.pfcs.com [192.52.69.11]) by pcpsj.pfcs.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA01279; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:11:36 -0500 Received: from localhost by mumps.pfcs.com with SMTP id AA07150 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:11:34 -0500 To: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) Cc: Harlan Stenn , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Patches for lib/libskey/ In-Reply-To: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?='s (ache@astral.msk.su) message dated Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:38:40. Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:11:33 -0400 Message-Id: <7148.817679493@mumps.pfcs.com> From: Harlan Stenn Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Thanks, and sorry about the patch for skey.h . I saw the "seek" part and remembered how I got bitten elsewhere when lseek was given a long argument... H From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 13:14:55 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA20971 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:14:55 -0800 Received: from sovcom.kiae.su (sovcom.kiae.su [144.206.136.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id NAA20953 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:14:33 -0800 Received: by sovcom.kiae.su id AA08570 (5.65.kiae-1 ); Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:11:52 +0300 Received: by sovcom.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Thu, 30 Nov 95 00:11:52 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by ache.dialup.demos.ru (8.6.12/8.6.12) id AAA01373; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:07:40 +0300 To: Harlan Stenn , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <5548.817638375@mumps.pfcs.com> In-Reply-To: ; from =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= at Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:38:40 +0300 (MSK) Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:07:40 +0300 (MSK) X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.41 FreeBSD] From: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: Patches for lib/libskey/ Lines: 20 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 644 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= writes: >>- buf[strcspn(buf, "\r\n")] = 0; >>+ buf += strcspn(buf, "\r\n"); >>+ >>+ if (*buf) >>+ *buf = 0; >> } >This one looks good. But only looks so... I don't understand why it ever needed and what it changes... -- Andrey A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - http://dt.demos.su/~ache : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 13:17:12 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA21148 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:17:12 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA21128 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:16:21 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA28629; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 14:10:48 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511292110.OAA28629@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Increasing size of shared memory segmenty To: taob@io.org (Brian Tao) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 14:10:47 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Brian Tao" at Nov 28, 95 09:53:04 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1228 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > In the course of playing with the gimp image editor (see the > freebsd-ports list if you don't know what this is), I keep bumping > into the 4-megabyte shared memory segment limit. What is the best way > to increase this size? Define SHMMAX in the kernel config file? Or > SHMALL or SHMMAXPGS? The gimp documentation suggests a 32-megabyte > segment size. You can bump the max pages in a segment. Be aware that the kernel address space is limited, and is further restricted above and beyond what you'd expect by the vm/buffer cache unification. There is not a mechanism for windowed access to large files. Typically, you'd want to have windowed access to large files to overcome the mmap limit instead of using a direct map, coupled with the use of a real vode with a single reference count (the mapping) to implement the shared memory segments. This would allow them to be arbitrary sized and fault referenced. 32M is smaller than the overall limit, (36 bits? 39 bits?) so you should be safe, though if you have several of these, you will probably start having problems. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 13:20:41 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA21436 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:20:41 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA21429 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:20:32 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA28658; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 14:15:27 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511292115.OAA28658@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Heideman Thesis To: StevenR362@aol.com Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 14:15:27 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <951129003806_119456143@emout05.mail.aol.com> from "StevenR362@aol.com" at Nov 29, 95 00:38:10 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 267 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > I need a ftp pointer for John Heideman's Masters thesis for some > research > that I am doing. ftp.cs.ucla.edu Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 13:28:28 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA21875 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:28:28 -0800 Received: from bigbird.vmicls.com (bigbird.vmicls.com [198.17.96.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA21867 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:28:16 -0800 Received: from gonzo by bigbird.vmicls.com (8.6.9/SMI-4.1-vmicls-master-host-1) id QAA03963; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:30:08 -0500 From: Jerry.Kendall@vmicls.com (Jerry Kendall) Organization: VMI Communications and Learning Systems Received: by gonzo (5.0/vmi-client-host-1) id AA13220; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:30:06 +0500 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:30:06 +0500 Message-Id: <9511292130.AA13220.gonzo@vmicls.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Becoming a mirror site for FreeBSD X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII content-length: 4032 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > From jmb@kryten.Atinc.COM Wed Nov 29 14:02:48 1995 > Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:49:45 -0500 (EST) > From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" > Subject: Re: Becoming a mirror site for FreeBSD > To: Joe Greco > cc: Jerry Kendall , hackers@freebsd.org, > hubs@freebsd.org > MIME-Version: 1.0 > > > > > What is the best way to do this? > > the easiest way is to use the mirror perl script (its a port > mirror-2.3). i have included the packages file that i use at the end > > run mirror out of cron > > 11 5 * * * /mirror packages > > jmb > > Jonathan M. Bresler FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.ORG > play go. ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life > i am moving to a new job. PLEASE USE: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG > > > You said to use MIRROR. Ok. toyed with the idea, got mirror of the CD and installed it. All went well. Ran mirror with modified config file. ------- config ----- # # PACKAGES # # This is the default mirror settings used by my site: # kryten.atinc.com # # adapted from mirror.defaults by Lee McLoughlin # You should be able to use this at other sites. You should only have # to change bits that reference this site so look for doc.ic below. package=defaults # The LOCAL hostname - if not the same as `hostname` # hostname=antares.vmicls.com # Keep all local_dirs relative to here local_dir=/mirror/FreeBSD/ remote_password=jkendall@vmicls.com mail_to=jkendall@vmicls.com # Don't mirror file modes. Set all dirs/files to these dir_mode=0755 file_mode=0444 # By defaults files are owned by root.zero user=jkendall group=staff # Keep a log file in each updated directory update_log=/mirror/mirror.log # Don't overwrite my mirror log with the remote one. # Don't pull back any of their mirror temporary files. # Don't touch anything whose name begins with a space! # nor any FSP or gopher files... exclude_patt=(^|/)(\.mirror$|core$|\.cap|\.in\..*\.$|MIRROR.LOG|#.*#|\.FSP|\.cache|\.zipped|\.notar|\.message|lost+found/|\ ) # Try to compress everything compress_patt=. compress_prog=compress # Don't compress information files, files that don't benifit from # being compressed, files that tell ftpd, gopher, wais... to do things, # the sources for compression programs... # (Note this is the only regexp that is case insensitive.) # z matches compress/pack/gzip, gz for gzip. (built into perl) # taz/tgz is compressed or gzipped tar files # arc, arj, lzh, zip and zoo are pc and/or amiga archives. # sea are mac archives. # vms used -z instead of .z. stupid vms. # shk is multimedia? used on apple2s. compress_excl+|-z(\d+)?$|\.tgz|_tgz|\.tar\.Z|\.tar\.gz|\.taz$|\.arc$|\.zip$|\.lzh$|\.zoo$|\.exe$|\.lha$|\.zom$|\.gif$|\.jpeg$|\.jpg$|\.mpeg$|\.au$|\.shk$|read.*me|index|info|faq|gzip|compress|(^|/)\.\.?$ # Don't delete own mirror log, .notar or .cache files (incl in subdirs) #delete_excl=(^|/)\.(mirror|notar|cache)$ # Ignore any local readme and .mirror files # jmb 9411201 added .message files local_ignore=README.doc.ic|(^|/)\.(mirror|notar|message)$ # Automatically delete local copies of files that the # remote site has zapped do_deletes=true max_delete_files=50% max_delete_dirs=50% package=FreeBSD-current comment=FreeBSD Current distribution site=ftp.cdrom.com remote_dir=/pub/FreeBSD/FreeBSD-current/ local_dir+FreeBSD-current compress_patt= local_ignore=packages|ports|(^|/)\.(mirror|notar|message)$ -------------------- The ouput is : ---------- jerry@antares: mirror mirror.freebsd package=FreeBSD-current ftp.cdrom.com:/pub/FreeBSD/FreeBSD-current/ -> /mirror/FreeBSD/FreeBSD-current Connecting to ftp.cdrom.com Failed to connect Pausing between retries Cannot connect, skipping package All done, Exiting ------------- That's it. It does not seem to connect correctly. I can ping/ftp to ftp.cdrom.com but, mirror does not seem to connect. Any ideas would be helpfull. Jerry From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 13:34:15 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA22182 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:34:15 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA22005 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:31:10 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA28672; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 14:24:59 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511292124.OAA28672@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Enough already! (Was: Where is the documentation for ibcs2?) To: grog@lemis.de Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 14:24:59 -0700 (MST) Cc: sos@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511291004.LAA16724@allegro.lemis.de> from "Greg Lehey" at Nov 29, 95 11:04:35 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1547 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Here's the gdb code to fetch registers from the u area, somewhat > simplified (BTW, Terry suggested that this should be done with /proc, > not with ptrace(). This won't work, because this is a COFF > executable, and I shudder at the consequences of trying to tell an > SVR3 executable about FreeBSD): Wrong /dev/proc. Use an "IBCS2" specific /dev/proc. Yeah, you'd have to write one. > Well, I think I have to disagree about the value of 10%, but I agree > that there's still a lot to be done. As I said in a previous message, > I have a number of pieces there for the taking, including the complete > GNU C library for SCO (and it works!). It's not in shared library > format at the moment, but it shouldn't be that much of a problem if > somebody's interested. A shared library replacement for SCO has to map at the expected addresses and act quite differently. The mapping has to be established elsewhere than ctr0.o. Making an SCO compatible shared library will be a task. It will be compiler dependent, and it will have to have a sorted index facility to implement object order (that order derived from an executable linked with the shared lib *or* from an SCO system. I don't know whether or not that data is considered proprietary. I know that 'nm' data is in fact considered proprietary, as I expect the Lesstif project to discover once they've completed Lesstif and release it. 8-(. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 13:42:42 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA22967 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:42:42 -0800 Received: from aries.isf.rl.af.mil (aries.ISF.RL.AF.MIL [128.132.64.38]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA22955 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:42:37 -0800 Received: (from green@localhost) by aries.isf.rl.af.mil (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA16073 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:43:22 -0500 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:43:22 -0500 From: Charles Kenneth Green - PRC Message-Id: <199511292143.QAA16073@aries.isf.rl.af.mil> X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: xanim Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Call me stupid, but every time I try to use xanim with AVI (or any otheanimation with sound) I get an error "Can't Open Linux Audio device". I have SB16 sound card and it's compiled into the kernel. Applications like xcd, workman, and xcdplayer all work fine. I'm recompiling the kernel to see if I hosed something. Any suggestions? From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 13:45:22 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA23201 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:45:22 -0800 Received: from bigbird.vmicls.com (bigbird.vmicls.com [198.17.96.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA23196 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:45:18 -0800 Received: from gonzo by bigbird.vmicls.com (8.6.9/SMI-4.1-vmicls-master-host-1) id QAA05447; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:47:48 -0500 From: Jerry.Kendall@vmicls.com (Jerry Kendall) Organization: VMI Communications and Learning Systems Received: by gonzo (5.0/vmi-client-host-1) id AA14482; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:47:46 +0500 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:47:46 +0500 Message-Id: <9511292147.AA14482.gonzo@vmicls.com> To: jmb@kryten.atinc.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Becoming a mirror site for FreeBSD X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII content-length: 1322 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > From jmb@kryten.Atinc.COM Wed Nov 29 16:45:49 1995 > Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:35:44 -0500 (EST) > From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" > Subject: Re: Becoming a mirror site for FreeBSD > To: Jerry Kendall > MIME-Version: 1.0 > > > ftp.freebsd.org is always busy....especially after a new > release. i expect that is the source of your problem > > On Wed, 29 Nov 1995, Jerry Kendall wrote: > > > > The ouput is : > > ---------- > > jerry@antares: mirror mirror.freebsd > > > > package=FreeBSD-current ftp.cdrom.com:/pub/FreeBSD/FreeBSD-current/ -> /mirror/FreeBSD/FreeBSD-current > > Connecting to ftp.cdrom.com > > Failed to connect > > Pausing between retries > > Cannot connect, skipping package > > > > All done, Exiting > > ------------- > > > > That's it. It does not seem to connect correctly. > > > > I can ping/ftp to ftp.cdrom.com but, mirror does not seem to connect. > > > > Any ideas would be helpfull. > > > > Jerry > > > > > > Jonathan M. Bresler FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.ORG > play go. ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life > i am moving to a new job. PLEASE USE: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG > I also tried 'ftp.freebsd.sol.net', again with the same results even though PING/FTP seem to be able to connect. Jerry From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 13:53:39 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA23667 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:53:39 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA23540 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:50:17 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA28707; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 14:42:31 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511292142.OAA28707@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: SMC EtherEZ 8416 To: mmead@Glock.COM (matthew c. mead) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 14:42:31 -0700 (MST) Cc: andrew@io.org, davidg@root.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511291638.LAA11112@Glock.COM> from "matthew c. mead" at Nov 29, 95 11:38:42 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1336 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Ack! What happened to SMC making great cards? *sigh* I was told > SMC no longer made the Ultras and Elite Ultras. David, do you know if > there's much chance of getting this card working soon? "The liquidators are in control"? === begin useless trivia not necessarily related to the topic at hand === For non-US people: When a company in the US is going out of business, they sell their business and remaining inventory to a liquidator at a discount. A "scam" has erupted around this: once in control, a liquidator sells the inventory plus as much additional crap product as he can shove out the door until his margin drops and he can no longer trade on the formerly good name of the company to shovel crap product out the door at a terrific markup under pretense of selling the same quality product the business used to sell at "bargain prices". In Utah (origin of Ponzi, patron saint of pyramid schemes), one such company was "going out of business" for 14 months. Now there is a law that if you say you are going out of business, you have to go out of business in a set period of time (90 days, I think). === end useless trivia not necessarily related to the topic at hand ===== Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 13:55:38 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA23810 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:55:38 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA23793 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:55:21 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA28719; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 14:48:03 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511292148.OAA28719@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: SMC EtherEZ 8416 To: davidg@root.com Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 14:48:03 -0700 (MST) Cc: mmead@Glock.COM, andrew@io.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511291942.LAA02174@corbin.Root.COM> from "David Greenman" at Nov 29, 95 11:42:13 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 783 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > The EtherEZ *should* work. It was working for some people...I have one here > and I'll try to test it out soon. In the mean time, I'd try changing the > shared memory address to something different and possible look at your ISA bus > timing and make sure it isn't too fast. There is no such thing as "bus is too fast". There is only "component is too slow". I have an EISA I've been clocking fast for years without problems. I admit to *carefully* checking component specs before buying them. It has an older SMC card, an AHA 1742, and S3 928 (Ultra plus), and nothing else not on the motherboard or the other size of the ISA bridge. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 14:21:32 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA25936 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 14:21:32 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA25909 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 14:21:22 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id XAA05114 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 23:21:08 +0100 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id XAA17135 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 23:21:07 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.7.1/keltia-uucp-2.6) id WAA03724; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 22:28:02 +0100 (MET) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199511292128.WAA03724@keltia.freenix.fr> Subject: Re: Bug in stable/-current perl? To: jkh@freefall.freebsd.org (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 22:28:02 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511290543.VAA13120@freefall.freebsd.org> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 28, 95 09:43:31 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1378 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8b] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk It seems that Jordan K. Hubbard said: > jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[4]);' > 10 > jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[5]);' > 95 > > 10? Am I misunderstanding something fundamental about perl's > localtime() call, or should this be an "11"? You're missing the fact that $mon (the fifth parameter) is 0-based per the man page: the local timezone. Typically used as follows: ($sec,$min,$hour,$mday,$mon,$year,$wday,$yday,$isdst) = localtime(time); All array elements are numeric, and come straight out of a struct tm. In particular this means that $mon has the range 0..11 and $wday has the range So 10 == 11 :-) -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #7: Mon Nov 6 21:08:06 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 14:23:21 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA26046 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 14:23:21 -0800 Received: from Sysiphos (Sysiphos.MI.Uni-Koeln.DE [134.95.212.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA26022 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 14:23:03 -0800 Received: by Sysiphos id AA18436 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for hackers@freebsd.org); Wed, 29 Nov 1995 23:18:51 +0100 Message-Id: <199511292218.AA18436@Sysiphos> From: se@zpr.uni-koeln.de (Stefan Esser) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 23:18:50 +0100 In-Reply-To: iain@nwpeople.demon.co.uk (Iain Baird) "Re: NCR815 problem" (Nov 29, 19:17) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(2) 7/9/95) To: iain@nwpeople.demon.co.uk Subject: Re: NCR815 problem Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Nov 29, 19:17, Iain Baird wrote: } Subject: Re: NCR815 problem } > Your system uses much lower addresses: 0xc0000 is an } > address below 1MB, i.e. in the ISA peripheral address } > space. } } What causes this? Is it my motherboard/BIOS, or the NCR 815 card? } I have been thinking about replacing the motherboard. The PCI BIOS seems to have choosen that address. But it is valid. You just have to make sure that BIOS shadowing is OFF for that memory region ... } I've turned caching and shadowing off. } I haven't seen any cache test failures since. That is a strong indication, that there really was a coherency problem :) } I have experimented with this, using other IRQs makes no difference. } I have only one IDE controller, it uses IRQ 14. } } > } pci0:5: vendor=0x1c1c, device=0x0001, class=old (misc) [no driver assigned] } > ^^^^^^ } > any idea, what kind of device that is ? } } Yes: it's a DTC PCI IDE Controller card. My motherboard has no } on-board IDE controller, the system came with the DTC card. Ok. Thanks ... } Well, I got a little further, but I have been unable to get sd0 } to work under FreeBSD. It works fine under DOS. I have attempted to } disklabel the sd0 manually, but I think I'm tripping over the new } slice support. I consulted the FAQ, it didn't help - the FAQ was } clear enough, but nothing it suggested actually worked. } } Finally I used the installation floppy to create a FreeBSD } partition on sd0. I had previously created a DOS partition so } that the correct BIOS geometries would be picked up (1021/31/63). Hmm, I'm not sure that is right. I believe, I once tried a similar geometry, and found 1021/63/31 made things work ... Anyway, I just started a DOS install, and stopped it when it got to "formatting C:". I kept the geometry that had been put into the MBR by DOS. } I chose "Dedicate whole disk to FreeBSD" and "Don't cooperate } with other OS's". I forced a write from the partition menu. } } I then booted off IDE, verbose boot messages follow below. } Note the last message: } } sd0s1: C/H/S end 1021/0/24 (24527) != end 1994036: invalid ^^^ The "head" field comes out as "0", and that is obviously wrong ... } Attempts to disklabel the partition failed with the same error. } I don't know whether I'm doing something wrong, or hitting a hardware } problem or a bug. Something seems to be trashing the geometry. } I'll be grateful for any further assistance you can give. You most probably have only this geometry problem left. I'd guess you should just start a DOS install, and then use the geometry the FreeBSD sysinstall offers as default. This is not a NCR driver problem anymore, you got beyond that :) } The following boot messages were obtained with: } External cache disabled It surely should work with external cache enabled! } Caching of C800-CBFF,CC00-CFFF disabled } (Should this make any difference, if external cache is disabled? } What about internal L1 cache?) This memory region is generally only accessed by the BIOS during the first two boot stages. But since the NCR seems to have been mapped into that memory region, you should make sure that caching and shadowing is off. The L1 cache is write-through on the i486DX2, so there are no coherency problems. In fact, you should have L2 enabled and set to write-through, too, for performance reasons. } Shadowing of C800-CBFF,CC00-CFFF disabled } IRQ 15 the only IRQ left free for PCI Ok. } FreeBSD 2.1.0-951026-SNAP #0: Mon Nov 27 02:28:15 GMT 1995 } root@nomad:/usr/src/sys/compile/NOMAD.NCR } CPU: i486 DX2 (486-class CPU) } Origin = "GenuineIntel" Id = 0x435 Stepping=5 } Features=0x3 } chip0 rev 4 on pci0:0 } CPU: 486DX2 or 486DX4, bus=33MHz, CPU->Memory posting ON } Warning: NO DRAM parity! } Cache: None } DRAM: page mode code fetch, read and write, memory clocks=X-1-2-1 } CPU->PCI: posting ON, burst mode ON } PCI->Memory: posting ON Ok. The cache could be ON, and the PCI performance features should all work reliably with that revision of the Saturn chip set. } ncr0 rev 3 int a irq 15 on pci0:3 } mapreg[10] type=1 addr=0000ff00 size=0100. } mapreg[14] type=0 addr=000cc000 size=0100. } pci_map_mem failed: device's memrange 0xcc000-0xcc0ff is incompatible with its bridge's memrange 0x4000000-0xffffffff The warning just indicates that the PCI code is surprised anybody maps PCI devices into the ISA address space. Be surprised, too, but ignore it otherwise :) } reg20: virtual=0xf2a4f000 physical=0xcc000 size=0x100 Ok. } ncr0 scanning for targets 0..6 (V2 pl23 95/09/07) } ncr0 waiting for scsi devices to settle You can remove the 'options "SCSI_DELAY=15"' line from the kernel config file, this will make your system boot much faster. } (ncr0:0:0): "SEAGATE ST31250N 0006" type 0 fixed SCSI 2 } sd0(ncr0:0:0): Direct-Access } sd0(ncr0:0:0): FAST SCSI-2 100ns (10 Mb/sec) offset 8. } 973MB (1994037 512 byte sectors) } sd0(ncr0:0:0): with 3712 cyls, 5 heads, and an average 107 sectors/track The drive is correctly identified and synchronous transfers at a rate of 10MHz are negotiated. There have been a number of SCSI transactions already, proof that the NCR driver works on your system. } BIOS Geometries: } 0:03fe0f3f 0..1022=1023 cylinders, 0..15=16 heads, 1..63=63 sectors } 1:03fc1e3f 0..1020=1021 cylinders, 0..30=31 heads, 1..63=63 sectors } 0 accounted for } wd0s1: type 0x6, start 63, end = 409247, size 409185 : OK } wd0s2: type 0xa5, start 409248, end = 1056383, size 647136 : OK } sd0s1: type 0xa5, start 0, end = 1994036, size 1994037 } sd0s1: C/H/S end 1021/0/24 (24527) != end 1994036: invalid If you get the number of heads right, then you are ready to install FreeBSD ... Regards, STefan -- Stefan Esser, Zentrum fuer Paralleles Rechnen Tel: +49 221 4706021 Universitaet zu Koeln, Weyertal 80, 50931 Koeln FAX: +49 221 4705160 ============================================================================== http://www.zpr.uni-koeln.de/~se From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 15:07:29 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA29851 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 15:07:29 -0800 Received: from hub.org (hub.org [199.166.238.138]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA29824 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 15:06:56 -0800 Received: (from scrappy@localhost) by hub.org (8.7.1/8.7.1) id SAA08683; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:04:49 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:04:44 -0500 (EST) From: "Marc G. Fournier" To: current@freebsd.org cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Concatenated Drives ... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi... I've seen some discussions go by dealing with the ability to make multiple drives look like one big drive, and I'm curious as to what is involved in doing so? Mainly, isn't that what the swap devices are doing already? Or is there something extra that needs to be added when combining several drives into one virtual drive? This is purely out of curiosity... Marc G. Fournier | POP Mail Telnet Acct DNS Hosting scrappy@hub.org | WWW Services Database Services | Knowledge, soon to be: | | Information and scrappy@ki.net | WWW: http://hub.org | Communications, Inc From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 15:44:33 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA03433 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 15:44:33 -0800 Received: from vulture.dmem.strath.ac.uk (vulture.dmem.strath.ac.uk [130.159.232.158]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA03212 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 15:41:41 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vulture.dmem.strath.ac.uk (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id XAA04653; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 23:41:14 GMT Message-Id: <199511292341.XAA04653@vulture.dmem.strath.ac.uk> X-Authentication-Warning: vulture.dmem.strath.ac.uk: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: PANOS KORTSARIDIS cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATAPI support In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:22:19." <01BABE4F.2ACD4760@electh.compulink.gr> Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 23:41:13 +0000 From: Neil Brendan Clark Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk In message <01BABE4F.2ACD4760@electh.compulink.gr>you write: >Are ATAPI CD-ROMs supported in version 2.1 ? Yes. I have just got mine working, a Toshiba 5302TB, although the driver seems a bit flaky. I'll get a full bug report back when I've evaluated it properly. If you need any help, give me a mail - I found it a bit tricky to set up. >Can I install a 2.1 system off an ATAPI CD-ROM ? No idea. Presumably this is possible with the atapi.flp boot image? Neil From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 16:05:56 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA04836 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:05:56 -0800 Received: from Glock.COM (root@glock.com [198.82.228.165]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA04828 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:05:51 -0800 Received: (from mmead@localhost) by Glock.COM (8.7.1/8.7.1) id TAA00272; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 19:05:33 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 19:05:33 -0500 (EST) From: "matthew c. mead" Message-Id: <199511300005.TAA00272@Glock.COM> To: davidg@Root.COM Cc: Andrew Herdman , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: SMC EtherEZ 8416 In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, November 29, 1995 11:42:13 -0800 References: <199511291638.LAA11112@Glock.COM> <199511291942.LAA02174@corbin.Root.COM> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, November 29, 1995 at 11:42:13 (-0800), David Greenman wrote: > > > > apparently it doesn't. I can pop it back in my machine for testing if > > > > you'd like to hammer this out... > > > Thats ok, this card has the same problem with bsdi 2.0.1 and 2.0. It's a > > > crappy card. > > > Use the SMC Ultra 16 instead > > Ack! What happened to SMC making great cards? *sigh* I was told > >SMC no longer made the Ultras and Elite Ultras. David, do you know if > >there's much chance of getting this card working soon? > The EtherEZ *should* work. It was working for some people...I have one here > and I'll try to test it out soon. In the mean time, I'd try changing the > shared memory address to something different and possible look at your ISA bus > timing and make sure it isn't too fast. Well, I spent about 3 hours with it this evening and couldn't get it working. A few times it would sort of work and hang on the route add default, but once I broke it no network applications would work. tcpdump would output about one 25 line page and then not output anymore. When I broke it, it would report that the kernel dropped a lot of packets. Anyhow, other times it does the NIC memory corrupt - invalid packet length 4864. Any ideas? I really need to get this card working... Thanks again! -matt -- Matthew C. Mead mmead@Glock.COM | Network Administration and Software Development http://www.Glock.COM/~mmead/ | Consulting: BizNet Technologies -> mmead@bnt.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 16:22:54 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA06067 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:22:54 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA06045 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:22:40 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id BAA16060; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:22:26 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id BAA11747; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:22:25 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id BAA16347; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:15:16 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511300015.BAA16347@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Bug in stable/-current perl? To: jkh@freefall.freebsd.org (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:15:16 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511290543.VAA13120@freefall.freebsd.org> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 28, 95 09:43:31 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1627 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk As Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > jkh@freefall-> date > Tue Nov 28 21:42:48 PST 1995 > > jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[3]);' > 28 > jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[4]);' > 10 > jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[5]);' > 95 > > 10? Am I misunderstanding something fundamental about perl's > localtime() call, or should this be an "11"? j@uriah 199% man 3 localtime CTIME(3) UNIX Programmer's Manual CTIME(3) NAME asctime, ctime, difftime, gmtime, localtime, mktime - transform binary date and time value to ASCII ... External declarations as well as the tm structure definition are in the include file. The tm structure includes at least the following fields: int tm_sec; /* seconds (0 - 60) */ int tm_min; /* minutes (0 - 59) */ int tm_hour; /* hours (0 - 23) */ int tm_mday; /* day of month (1 - 31) */ int tm_mon; /* month of year (0 - 11) */ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ int tm_year; /* year - 1900 */ int tm_wday; /* day of week (Sunday = 0) */ int tm_yday; /* day of year (0 - 365) */ int tm_isdst; /* is summer time in effect? */ char *tm_zone; /* abbreviation of timezone name */ long tm_gmtoff; /* offset from UTC in seconds */ -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 16:26:18 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA06470 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:26:18 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA06283 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:24:06 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id BAA16050 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:22:19 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id BAA11745 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:22:19 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id BAA16326 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:13:26 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511300013.BAA16326@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Anyone keen to help me get a Phillips CDD 521 Recorder working? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:13:26 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511291159.AA06154@Sysiphos> from "Stefan Esser" at Nov 29, 95 12:59:54 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 624 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Stefan Esser wrote: > > Well, how about a configuration with a dedicated 1GB SCSI drive ($250) > connected to a SCSI host adapter ($40) that it shares only with the CDROM > writer, and using a SCSI Copy command for the actual transfer ... Not sure, i think the handling of a CD burner is more complicated. You have to use something like "WRITE TRACK" or such to burn a CD track. I don't know if this could also be done as a direct target copy operation. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 16:57:15 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA08680 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:57:15 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA08589 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 16:54:29 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id BAA16865; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:52:22 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id BAA11938; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:52:16 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id BAA17117; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:43:03 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511300043.BAA17117@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Problem with sio probe and Mach64 PCI video card To: dawes@Physics.usyd.edu.au (David Dawes) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:43:02 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511290510.QAA03876@suphys.physics.usyd.edu.au> from "David Dawes" at Nov 29, 95 04:10:08 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 676 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As David Dawes wrote: > > extents. A serial port using the usual COM4 address simply can't > coexist with these type of cards (S3, ATI, etc). Funny that either COM4 as 8514 are IBM kids. :-) S3 can coexist with traditional COM4, since it's possible to remap their IO registers (they only default to the 8514-compatible mode). XFree86 didn't implement this however (and i doubt somebody is bothered enough to do it -- i would rather scratch a pad on my serial card and reconnect the port to 0x268 or 0x368 :-). -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 17:11:02 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA09648 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 17:11:02 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA09607 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 17:10:47 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA29251; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:04:53 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511300104.SAA29251@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Concatenated Drives ... To: scrappy@hub.org (Marc G. Fournier) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:04:52 -0700 (MST) Cc: current@FreeBSD.org, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Marc G. Fournier" at Nov 29, 95 06:04:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 4300 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I've seen some discussions go by dealing with the > ability to make multiple drives look like one big drive, and I'm > curious as to what is involved in doing so? > > Mainly, isn't that what the swap devices are doing already? > Or is there something extra that needs to be added when combining > several drives into one virtual drive? Ideally (not-so-ideally follows), using devfs: 1) Allow a block device driver to specify offset + size relative to another driver. 2) Allow drivers to be stacked so that one logical drive can be a fragment of another. 3) Support creation of logical devices exported to the user via the devfs /dev name space. 4) Create a driver that exports a device given a tag mechanism on a drive for recognition. So you have: PHY: wdc0 target 0 start = 0 | size = | pdev = /dev/dsk/wdc0 | name = /dev/dsk/wdc0/d0 v LOG: OnTrack 6.x start =64 | size = - 64 | pdev = /dev/dsk/wdc0/d0 | name = /dev/dsk/wdc0/d0 v LOG: DOS partitioning start = 64 + | size = | pdev = /dev/dsk/wdc0/d0 | name = /dev/dsk/wdc0/d0/p1 | start = 64 + | size = | pdev = /dev/dsk/wdc0/d0 | name = /dev/dsk/wdc0/d0/p2 | start = 64 + | size = | pdev = /dev/dsk/wdc0/d0 | name = /dev/dsk/wdc0/d0/p3 | start = 64 + | size = | pdev = /dev/dsk/wdc0/d0 | name = /dev/dsk/wdc0/d0/p4 V LOG: Extended partitoning, if any | V LOG: Concatentation driver start = 0 size = pdev = /dev/dsk/ccd name = /dev/dsk/ccd/d0 Concatenation driver, operation: = - = - = + if > [fail operation] if < = + 64 + else = + 64 + :== Obviously, you can stick in media perfection at any layer, just like you put in OnTrack management. Also Obviously, DOS partitioning, OpenFirmware partitioning, DOS extended partitioning, BSD disk slices, OSF disk slices, and Sun disk slices, etc., are all memebrs of the same class of driver and can be layered freely. A device that overlays a device that does not change sector ordering (ie: does not do bad sector replacement, etc.) can be collapsed to a single start/offset reference, making the code no more overhead than the current partition handling, and less overhead than the disk-slice-on-DOS-partition handling. Graphs containing removable media are not collapsed down, only up. The full theory of operation is: You register all physical devices. For each unclaimed logical or physical device in the system, you ask each logical driver to claim the device. A CCD (really, a "volume spanning driver") will only claim logical devices when the full set is present. You repeat this until no more logical devices are added, and no more are claimed (this last is because you might have a volume spanning driver layered on another, such as two or more stripe sets, which would delay the claiming of the final device by N+1 for each logical device that consisted of multiple logical or phsical devices). For each file system is asked to claim each logical device. Claimed devices are considered "mounted". Not-so-ideally: For the current code set, which can't support this, you can write a CCD driver (or port NetBSD's) with little effort. It operates by making a block major/minor dev that refers to multiple physical volume vnodes, and referencing the device vnodes (which it vn_open's internally). It does not protect against access to the underlying file systems. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 17:20:32 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA10448 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 17:20:32 -0800 Received: from server.id.net (root@kilroy.id.net [199.125.1.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA10430 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 17:20:24 -0800 Received: (from rls@localhost) by server.id.net (8.7.1/8.7.1) id UAA00797 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:20:20 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Shady Message-Id: <199511300120.UAA00797@server.id.net> Subject: *** HELP! ifconfig aliases!? *** To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:20:20 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Sh*t, SH*T, SH*T... I just went and upgraded our servers to 2.1.0-RELEASE. As you probably guess, one of them was a virtual web server that ran ~10 virtual web sites on it. Doing the standard "ifconfig ed0 alias a.b.c.d" didn't work, and neither did "ifconfig ed0 alias a.b.c.d netmask 255.255.255.0" which is what I used to use before... Someone *PLEASE* respond to this message ASAP with any hints, tips, or ideas.. I have several very upset customers right now.. ;( -- Rob === _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ Innovative Data Services Serving South-Eastern Michigan Internet Service Provider / Hardware Sales / Consulting Services Voice: (810)855-0404 / Fax: (810)855-3268 / Web: http://www.id.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 17:30:49 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA11147 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 17:30:49 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA11142 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 17:30:44 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id LAA13395; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:47:13 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511301147.LAA13395@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: more device driver question 8) To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:47:12 +0000 () Cc: julian@ref.tfs.com, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199511291340.AAA24528@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Nov 30, 95 00:40:14 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1319 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Bruce Evans stands accused of saying: > >So for a 'tty' device driver, I could safely say > > >spltty() > >enable_interrupt() > >tsleep() > >splx() > > >and be sure that interrupts from the device won't be enabled until after > >the current process sleeps? > > The spltty() would do that. I don't know what enable_interrupt() is. > Perhaps you meant disable_intr(). That would probably disable interrupts > forever. Don't use disable_intr() except in short (< 10 usec) critical > regions. In the context of my original message, enable_interrupt() enables interrupt generation on the card. I was looking for a means whereby I could avoid the race that would occur between enabling interrupts on the card and subsequently sleeping, as it's possible that if the operation were small, there'd be no more interrupts after the first, and the sleep would either never return, or at least take the full timeout before it did. > Bruce -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 17:36:32 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA11588 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 17:36:32 -0800 Received: from escape.com (escape.com [198.6.71.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA11582 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 17:36:26 -0800 Received: (from dima@localhost) by escape.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id UAA03581; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:35:40 -0500 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:35:39 -0500 (EST) From: "Dima (ELO)" To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: libtcl.so.7.3, libtcl74.so.1.0 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hello, I downloaded tk editor, but they don't have those libraries libtcl.so.7.3, libtcl74.so.1.0. Where can I get those ? Dima From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 17:37:09 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA11633 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 17:37:09 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA11623 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 17:37:03 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id MAA13515; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 12:05:29 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511301205.MAA13515@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: uio question... To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 12:05:28 +0000 () Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511292105.OAA28617@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Nov 29, 95 02:05:44 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1507 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert stands accused of saying: > > Given a device read function passed a uio struct, what's the correct way > > to determine the total size of the read request? > > The "resid" is used to determine residual read remaining. Typically, > a uio struct will have an iovec count of one, or the alternate iovec's > will be non-contiguous. > > In either case , for a non-one iovec count in the uio, you *must* walk > the iovec list to return any information. I presume resid is computed elsewhere? In this case, the 'asc' driver is broken, as it uses resid to determine the read size, at the very least. > The question is whether your driver does scatter/gather itself, or whether > it will be handling I/O one iovec at a time. I'm quite happy to do scatter/gather myself, but my impressions from uiomove() are that I'd still need a local buffer and then copyout(), so it would appear to be more efficient overall to collect the entire read in a single local buffer, and the uiomove it out. > You should look at the tty, generic (controller independent) scsi code, Thanks for the pointers. > Terry Lambert -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 17:50:50 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA12308 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 17:50:50 -0800 Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id RAA12288 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 17:50:42 -0800 Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA15061; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:50:07 -0500 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:50 EST Received: (rivers@localhost) by ponds.UUCP (8.6.11/8.6.5) id MAA00373; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 12:31:02 -0500 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 12:31:02 -0500 From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199511291731.MAA00373@ponds.UUCP> To: freebsd-bugs@freefall.FreeBSD.org, freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org, rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com Subject: Strangeness in /usr/include/runetype.h? Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1474 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk I've found an interesting situation, try compiling the following file with -D_POSIX_SOURCE defined: ------------ start ------------- #include #include #include ------------ end ------------- You'll get: In file included from /usr/include/ctype.h:51, from t.c:4: /usr/include/runetype.h:58: parse error before `rune_t' /usr/include/runetype.h:58: warning: no semicolon at end of struct or union /usr/include/runetype.h:59: warning: data definition has no type or storage class ... indicating 'rune_t' wasn't defined. There is a note in /usr/include/machine/ansi.h: * Note that _WCHAR_T_ and _RUNE_T_ must be of the same type. When wchar_t * and rune_t are typedef'd, _WCHAR_T_ will be undef'd, but _RUNE_T remains * defined for ctype.h. */ #define _BSD_WCHAR_T_ int /* wchar_t */ #define _BSD_RUNE_T_ int /* rune_t */ And, finally, in /usr/include/runetype.h we have: #ifdef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ typedef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ rune_t; typedef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ wchar_t; #undef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ #endif my suggestion is that this becomes: #ifdef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ typedef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ rune_t; typedef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ wchar_t; #undef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ #else typedef _BSD_RUNE_T_ rune_t; #endif I discovered this on a 2.0.5 system, but I looked on freefall.cdrom.com (which claims to be running 2.1-STABLE) and discovered this hasn't changed there. - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 17:50:56 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA12323 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 17:50:56 -0800 Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id RAA12291 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 17:50:46 -0800 Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA15125; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:50:11 -0500 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:50 EST Received: (rivers@localhost) by ponds.UUCP (8.6.11/8.6.5) id MAA01025; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 12:58:56 -0500 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 12:58:56 -0500 From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199511291758.MAA01025@ponds.UUCP> To: freebsd-bugs@freefall.FreeBSD.org, freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org, rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com Subject: More on runetype.h issues. Content-Type: text Content-Length: 568 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Well - My previous suggestion appears to not be correct; as I just got a error message: In file included from /usr/include/ctype.h:51, from host/unix/host.h:45, from /tmp/parser.y:34: /usr/include/runetype.h:50: redefinition of `rune_t' /usr/include/stddef.h:50: `rune_t' previously declared here shape - error during execution; retcode: 1 when I had changed /usr/include/runetype.h as I previously mentioned, and *not* compiled with _POSIX_SOURCE defined. There's obviously more thinking to be done here. - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 17:55:00 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA12612 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 17:55:00 -0800 Received: from spooky.rwwa.com (rwwa.com [198.115.177.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA12607 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 17:54:55 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spooky.rwwa.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA26997 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:00:16 -0500 Message-Id: <199511300200.VAA26997@spooky.rwwa.com> X-Authentication-Warning: spooky.rwwa.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.5.3 12/28/94 To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Wanted: Examples of ``good practice'' device drivers. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:00:15 -0500 From: Robert Withrow Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk I've been writing device drivers and kernel code for the last 20 years or so, on lots of OS's including several versions of SYSV. I'm now faced with converting some SVR4 drivers I wrote a few years ago to FreeBSD, a version of OS I know essentially nothing about the internals of. So, while I don't need to learn *how* to write a ``unix device driver'', I do need to learn how to write a *FreeBSD* device driver. Since it seems like this is a mostly ``documentation free environment'' (;-), what are the *best* examples of ``good practice'' in FreeBSD isa bus drivers for devices that are neither if-like nor disk-like? Also, Is there anything more current than the (to my way of thinking) hoplessly out-of-date devil-book for documenting the nitty details of the various kernel interfaces, including the FreeBSD/kernel, FreeBSD/boot, FreeBSD/config, and FreeBSD/isa ones? Is there ever likely to be something like DDI/DDK for FreeBSD? ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Robert Withrow, Tel: +1 617 598 4480, Fax: +1 617 598 4430 Net: witr@rwwa.COM R.W. Withrow Associates, 319 Lynnway Suite 201, Lynn MA 01901 USA From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 18:19:08 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA13903 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:19:08 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA13896 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:19:03 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id SAA09518; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:18:20 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511300218.SAA09518@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: *** HELP! ifconfig aliases!? *** To: rls@kilroy.id.net (Robert Shady) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:18:20 -0800 (PST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511300120.UAA00797@server.id.net> from "Robert Shady" at Nov 29, 95 08:20:20 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1062 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > Sh*t, SH*T, SH*T... > > I just went and upgraded our servers to 2.1.0-RELEASE. As you probably > guess, one of them was a virtual web server that ran ~10 virtual web > sites on it. Doing the standard "ifconfig ed0 alias a.b.c.d" didn't > work, and neither did "ifconfig ed0 alias a.b.c.d netmask 255.255.255.0" I think you want 255.255.255.255 not 255.255.255.0 > which is what I used to use before... Someone *PLEASE* respond to this > message ASAP with any hints, tips, or ideas.. I have several very upset > customers right now.. ;( > > -- Rob > === > _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/ > _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ > _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ > > Innovative Data Services > Serving South-Eastern Michigan > Internet Service Provider / Hardware Sales / Consulting Services > Voice: (810)855-0404 / Fax: (810)855-3268 / Web: http://www.id.net > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 18:26:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA14456 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:26:40 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA14447 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:26:29 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id MAA13838; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 12:55:57 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199511301255.MAA13838@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Problem with sio probe and Mach64 PCI video card To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 12:55:57 +0000 () Cc: dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511282136.WAA11884@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Nov 28, 95 10:36:25 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1584 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk J Wunsch stands accused of saying: > > As David Dawes wrote: > > > > As a side note, I tried PCVT (At first I wondered if syscons was causing > > a problem since that was the last message I initally saw flash up before > > the screen disappeared), and noticed that the arrow keys don't work in > > the visual mode of "/kernel -c". > > I think this is a known problem. pcvt defaults to the OA etc. > arrow key sequences. (I believe it should default to [A etc., > and only switch to "application mode" if requested.) As the author of visuserconfig(), let me lay this one totally to rest. At the stage in the system startup where userconfig() runs, none of the console drivers have been initialised. Each console driver provides a minimalist set of routines for use at that stage. Syscons gives weird numbers (possibly scancode-related) for cursor keys, serial consoles just pass through codes from the terminal, but pcvt doesn't actually recognise (or at lease, doesn't return anything for) the cursor keys. Hellmuth and I have spoken about this; at some stage, he expects to be able to do something about it. Until then, don't use visuserconfig() under pcvt 8) > cheers, J"org -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 18:41:45 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA15632 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:41:45 -0800 Received: from rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au [129.78.129.109]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA15625 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:41:32 -0800 Received: (from dawes@localhost) by rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA21779; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 13:40:21 +1100 From: David Dawes Message-Id: <199511300240.NAA21779@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> Subject: Re: Problem with sio probe and Mach64 PCI video card To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 13:40:20 +1100 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511300043.BAA17117@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Nov 30, 95 01:43:02 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 693 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >As David Dawes wrote: >> >> extents. A serial port using the usual COM4 address simply can't >> coexist with these type of cards (S3, ATI, etc). > >Funny that either COM4 as 8514 are IBM kids. :-) > >S3 can coexist with traditional COM4, since it's possible to remap >their IO registers (they only default to the 8514-compatible mode). >XFree86 didn't implement this however (and i doubt somebody is >bothered enough to do it -- i would rather scratch a pad on my serial >card and reconnect the port to 0x268 or 0x368 :-). We did make an attempt at implementing it, but found that there were problems using it with some of the S3 chips :-( (grep for COM4 in the XFree86 CHANGELOG). David From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 18:41:50 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA15654 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:41:50 -0800 Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [192.216.222.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA15647 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:41:48 -0800 Received: from rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au [129.78.129.109]) by who.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.11) with ESMTP id SAA11478 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:41:42 -0800 Received: (from dawes@localhost) by rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA21748; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 13:36:52 +1100 From: David Dawes Message-Id: <199511300236.NAA21748@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> Subject: Re: SMC EtherEZ 8416 To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 13:36:52 +1100 (EST) Cc: mmead@Glock.COM, andrew@io.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511291942.LAA02174@corbin.Root.COM> from "David Greenman" at Nov 29, 95 11:42:13 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1132 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> > > apparently it doesn't. I can pop it back in my machine for testing if >> > > you'd like to hammer this out... >> >> > Thats ok, this card has the same problem with bsdi 2.0.1 and 2.0. It's a >> > crappy card. >> >> > Use the SMC Ultra 16 instead >> >> Ack! What happened to SMC making great cards? *sigh* I was told >>SMC no longer made the Ultras and Elite Ultras. David, do you know if >>there's much chance of getting this card working soon? > > The EtherEZ *should* work. It was working for some people...I have one here >and I'll try to test it out soon. In the mean time, I'd try changing the >shared memory address to something different and possible look at your ISA bus >timing and make sure it isn't too fast. I have one here that works OK (tested with 2.0.5 and 2.1). It'd be nice though if the PnP settings could be read by the driver. The only problem I've found is that disabling PnP with the DOS utility that comes with the card doesn't seem to work properly. This might be a problem with the PnP code in the BIOS on the ASUS boards I've tried it in though (one was a recent P/I-P55TP4XE). David From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 19:11:45 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA17228 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 19:11:45 -0800 Received: from bacchus.eng.umd.edu (bacchus.eng.umd.edu [129.2.94.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA17223 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 19:11:37 -0800 Received: from cappuccino.eng.umd.edu (cappuccino.eng.umd.edu [129.2.98.14]) by bacchus.eng.umd.edu (8.7/8.7) with ESMTP id WAA04090; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 22:11:34 -0500 (EST) Received: (chuckr@localhost) by cappuccino.eng.umd.edu (8.7.2/8.6.4) id WAA16600; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 22:11:34 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 22:11:33 -0500 (EST) From: Chuck Robey X-Sender: chuckr@cappuccino.eng.umd.edu To: Greg Lehey cc: sos@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Enough already! (Was: Where is the documentation for ibcs2?) In-Reply-To: <199511281700.SAA26555@allegro.lemis.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I've been watching all this, and it suddenly occurred to me that I have a paid for copy of SVR4.0.4 (an old ESIX implementation) that I happily gave up on to run FreeBSD. It's based on ELF, and is a complete 'unlimited' version with the full set of development tools. I don't want to run it, would it be of use to anyone from FreeBSD, maybe in research for ELF stuff? It runs SCO binaries, too, and if anyone can use it (for FreeBSD development purposes) I'd be happy to send it off. ============================================================================ Chuck Robey chuckr@eng.umd.edu -- I run FreeBSD on n3lxx and Journey2 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Dilbert Zone is Dilbert's new WWW home! The area features never-before-seen original sketches of Dilbert, a photo tour of Scott Adams' studio, Dilbert Trivia and memorabilia, high school photos and much more!: From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 20:00:31 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id UAA19700 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:00:31 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA19683 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:00:19 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id UAA29604; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:54:09 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511300354.UAA29604@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Wanted: Examples of ``good practice'' device drivers. To: witr@rwwa.com (Robert Withrow) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:54:08 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511300200.VAA26997@spooky.rwwa.com> from "Robert Withrow" at Nov 29, 95 09:00:15 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 294 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Is there ever likely to be something like DDI/DDK for > FreeBSD? There is a "device driver writer's guide" via someone else's site via www.freebsd.org. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 20:07:21 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id UAA19886 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:07:21 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA19881 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:07:08 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id VAA29629; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:01:30 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511300401.VAA29629@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: uio question... To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:01:30 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511301205.MAA13515@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Nov 30, 95 12:05:28 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1617 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I presume resid is computed elsewhere? In this case, the 'asc' driver is > broken, as it uses resid to determine the read size, at the very least. It's set to the count. It's the bytes remaining to be read, and it starts out set to "all of 'em". It's decremented as the user buffer(s) are filled out by uiomove. So it may seem odd that it doesn't count up, but it's not broken. > > The question is whether your driver does scatter/gather itself, or whether > > it will be handling I/O one iovec at a time. > > I'm quite happy to do scatter/gather myself, but my impressions from > uiomove() are that I'd still need a local buffer and then copyout(), so it > would appear to be more efficient overall to collect the entire read in > a single local buffer, and the uiomove it out. uiomove will bcopy in SYSSPACE or copyout if the target is in USERSPACE; so as long as it's a user buffer and you specify it's in USERSPACE, there isn't a problem: you don't need another buffer. Typically, the FS code will copy to a buffer off the vnode. This is the cache. Then it copies out (look in /sys/ufs/ufs/ufs_readwrite.c). For a device you won't be caching. Depending on the need for ISA bounce, you can avoid the other buffer. If you need an ISA bounce, then you have to check the physical address and if it's over (or spans) the 16M boundry, you will need to bounce it. The 1542 driver is a good example for how to bounce a scatter/gather operation for an ISA device. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 20:23:23 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id UAA20979 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:23:23 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA20961 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:22:40 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id UAA09781; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:20:38 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511300420.UAA09781@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: Wanted: Examples of ``good practice'' device drivers. To: witr@rwwa.com (Robert Withrow) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 20:20:37 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511300200.VAA26997@spooky.rwwa.com> from "Robert Withrow" at Nov 29, 95 09:00:15 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1441 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > I've been writing device drivers and kernel code for the > last 20 years or so, on lots of OS's including several > versions of SYSV. I'm now faced with converting some > SVR4 drivers I wrote a few years ago to FreeBSD, a > version of OS I know essentially nothing about the > internals of. So, while I don't need to learn *how* > to write a ``unix device driver'', I do need to learn > how to write a *FreeBSD* device driver. > > Since it seems like this is a mostly ``documentation free > environment'' (;-), what are the *best* examples of > ``good practice'' in FreeBSD isa bus drivers for devices > that are neither if-like nor disk-like? > > Also, Is there anything more current than the (to my > way of thinking) hoplessly out-of-date devil-book for > documenting the nitty details of the various kernel > interfaces, including the FreeBSD/kernel, FreeBSD/boot, > FreeBSD/config, and FreeBSD/isa ones? Well if you hinted as to what you wanted these devices to do I could probably point you at good drivers... I'm in the middle of a driver cleanup at the moment, so the interfaces are a'changin as we speak. > > Is there ever likely to be something like DDI/DDK for > FreeBSD? > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Robert Withrow, Tel: +1 617 598 4480, Fax: +1 617 598 4430 Net: witr@rwwa.COM > R.W. Withrow Associates, 319 Lynnway Suite 201, Lynn MA 01901 USA > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 21:03:17 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA23076 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:03:17 -0800 Received: from main.gbdata.com (dial4.phoenix.net [199.3.234.35]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA23054 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:01:33 -0800 Received: (from gclarkii@localhost) by main.gbdata.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id XAA04408 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 23:01:19 -0600 From: Gary Clark II Message-Id: <199511300501.XAA04408@main.gbdata.com> Subject: Using a SUN monitor To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 23:01:18 -0600 (CST) Reply-To: gclarkii@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 361 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hello, I've got a SUN 19 inch monitor I would LOVE to use under X. The only problem is that I'm not sure how to hook it up... The monitor is in the XFree monitor DataBase so that is covered. Does anyone around have a diagram or discription of how to do this? I have no problem firing up a soldering iron (I spent 6 years in the Navy as an ET..:)). Gary From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 21:09:26 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA23358 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:09:26 -0800 Received: from skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (skynet.ctr.columbia.edu [128.59.64.70]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA23351 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:09:01 -0800 Received: (from wpaul@localhost) by skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id AAA02778; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:08:41 -0500 From: A boy and his worm gear Message-Id: <199511300508.AAA02778@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> Subject: Re: SMC EtherEZ 8416 To: mmead@Glock.COM (matthew c. mead) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:08:36 -0500 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511300005.TAA00272@Glock.COM> from "matthew c. mead" at Nov 29, 95 07:05:33 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 3014 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Of all the gin joints in all the world, matthew c. mead had to walk into mine and say: > On Wed, November 29, 1995 at 11:42:13 (-0800), David Greenman wrote: [chop] > > The EtherEZ *should* work. It was working for some people...I have one here > > and I'll try to test it out soon. In the mean time, I'd try changing the > > shared memory address to something different and possible look at your ISA bus > > timing and make sure it isn't too fast. > > Well, I spent about 3 hours with it this evening and couldn't get > it working. A few times it would sort of work and hang on the route add > default, but once I broke it no network applications would work. tcpdump > would output about one 25 line page and then not output anymore. When I > broke it, it would report that the kernel dropped a lot of packets. > Anyhow, other times it does the NIC memory corrupt - invalid packet length > 4864. Any ideas? I really need to get this card working... Thanks again! > -matt Just another data point: I happen to have one of these cards (though I should point out that SMC gave it to me for free in exchange for participating in a phone survey :) and I haven't had any problems with it with 2.0.5 (I used it to do an FTP install of 2.0.5, in fact). However, I'm using it with a dead slow machine (386sx/16). How much bearing this has on things I'm not really sure. FreeBSD 2.0.5-RELEASE #0: Tue Oct 3 18:44:48 EDT 1995 wpaul@skynet:/usr/src/sys/compile/SKYNET CPU: i386DX (386-class CPU) real memory = 4194304 (1024 pages) avail memory = 3354624 (819 pages) Probing for devices on the ISA bus: sc0 at 0x60-0x6f irq 1 on motherboard sc0: VGA color <16 virtual consoles, flags=0x0> ed0 at 0x340-0x35f irq 10 maddr 0xe8000 msize 8192 on isa ed0: address 00:00:c0:12:ce:b2, type SMC8416C/SMC8416BT (16 bit) bpf: ed0 attached [...] When I installed this board, I specifically disabled the plug & pray option with the SMC EZSTART.EXE program (this machine can't take advantage of it anyway) and chose some deliberately off the wall settings to help prevent any conflicts with existing hardware. Shared memory is enabled. Right now the system is attached to only one other machine (my second home computer, also running 2.0.5) via coax. This isn't exactly a heavy traffic environment, however I am using this machine as an NFS server and so far I haven't had any problems with the card. -Bill -- ============================================================================= -Bill Paul (212) 854-6020 | System Manager Work: wpaul@ctr.columbia.edu | Center for Telecommunications Research Home: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu | Columbia University, New York City ============================================================================= License error: The license for this .sig file has expired. You must obtain a new license key before any more witty phrases will appear in this space. ============================================================================= From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 21:12:50 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA23627 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:12:50 -0800 Received: from dyson.iquest.net (dyson.iquest.net [198.70.144.127]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA23617 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:12:38 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by dyson.iquest.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) id AAA04609; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:10:31 GMT From: "John S. Dyson" Message-Id: <199511300010.AAA04609@dyson.iquest.net> Subject: Re: Increasing size of shared memory segmenty To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:10:31 +0000 () Cc: taob@io.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511292110.OAA28629@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Nov 29, 95 02:10:47 pm Reply-To: dyson@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1621 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > In the course of playing with the gimp image editor (see the > > freebsd-ports list if you don't know what this is), I keep bumping > > into the 4-megabyte shared memory segment limit. What is the best way > > to increase this size? Define SHMMAX in the kernel config file? Or > > SHMALL or SHMMAXPGS? The gimp documentation suggests a 32-megabyte > > segment size. > > You can bump the max pages in a segment. Be aware that the kernel > address space is limited, and is further restricted above and beyond > what you'd expect by the vm/buffer cache unification. There is not > a mechanism for windowed access to large files. > On FreeBSD, not all of the cached pages (both VFS created, and VM created) are mapped into the kernel. This keeps the size of the kvm down. However you are essentially correct given the question -- the Sys5 shared memory scheme has a major limitation that it actually maps the pages into the kernel?!!?@!?@ That is kind of nonsense, but that was the implementation. I have started off/on to rewrite it "sysv_shm" to work properly, but other things have been more pressing. > > 32M is smaller than the overall limit, (36 bits? 39 bits?) so you should > be safe, though if you have several of these, you will probably start > having problems. > The limit today is 31 Bits :-(. But the code that I am running today is 39 Bits with perhaps 40 Bits in the offing. It is unlikely that we will need to use more than a 31 Bit window on a Pentium :-), but now at least we will be able to have at least 1Tb files with the merged VM buffer cache scheme. John dyson@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 21:26:17 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA24864 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:26:17 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA24823 ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:25:57 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id QAA28894; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 16:21:10 +1100 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 16:21:10 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511300521.QAA28894@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: freebsd-bugs@freefall.freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com, rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com Subject: Re: Strangeness in /usr/include/runetype.h? Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >I've found an interesting situation, try compiling the following >file with -D_POSIX_SOURCE defined: >------------ start ------------- >#include >#include >#include >------------ end ------------- >You'll get: >In file included from /usr/include/ctype.h:51, > from t.c:4: >/usr/include/runetype.h:58: parse error before `rune_t' >/usr/include/runetype.h:58: warning: no semicolon at end of struct or union >/usr/include/runetype.h:59: warning: data definition has no type or storage class >... > my suggestion is that this becomes: >#ifdef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ >typedef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ rune_t; >typedef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ wchar_t; >#undef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ >#else >typedef _BSD_RUNE_T_ rune_t; >#endif This will result in rune_t sometimes being redefined. Typedefs can't be redefined. and should have something like #ifdef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ typedef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ wchar_t; #undef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ #endif and they should not pollute the namespace by defining rune_t. should have something like #ifdef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ typedef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ wchar_t; #undef _BSD_WCHAR_T_ #endif typedef _BSD_RUNE_T_ rune_t; should not pollute the namespace by including ... Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 22:31:39 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id WAA29635 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 22:31:39 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA29628 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 22:31:31 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id RAA31812; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 17:24:53 +1100 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 17:24:53 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199511300624.RAA31812@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, witr@rwwa.com Subject: Re: Wanted: Examples of ``good practice'' device drivers. Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >Since it seems like this is a mostly ``documentation free >environment'' (;-), what are the *best* examples of >``good practice'' in FreeBSD isa bus drivers for devices >that are neither if-like nor disk-like? Are there any? :-) Take any driver and ignore the 10%-50% of things done wrong in it. Old drivers for recalcitrant timing-dependent hardware (fd.c, lpt.c, syscons.c (keyboard part), wd.c) are the worst. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Nov 29 22:41:00 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id WAA00512 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 22:41:00 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA00507 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 22:40:53 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id HAA08381 ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:40:46 +0100 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id HAA18009 ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:40:45 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.7.1/keltia-uucp-2.6) id HAA05091; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:07:52 +0100 (MET) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199511300607.HAA05091@keltia.freenix.fr> Subject: Re: *** HELP! ifconfig aliases!? *** To: rls@kilroy.id.net (Robert Shady) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:07:52 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511300120.UAA00797@server.id.net> from "Robert Shady" at Nov 29, 95 08:20:20 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1378 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8b] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk It seems that Robert Shady said: > sites on it. Doing the standard "ifconfig ed0 alias a.b.c.d" didn't > work, and neither did "ifconfig ed0 alias a.b.c.d netmask 255.255.255.0" Use netmask 0xffffffff for aliases. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #7: Mon Nov 6 21:08:06 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 00:06:46 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA05954 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:06:46 -0800 Received: from wiley.muc.ditec.de (wiley.muc.ditec.de [194.120.126.9]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA05944 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:06:41 -0800 Received: from vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (ns055.munich.netsurf.de [194.64.166.55]) by wiley.muc.ditec.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA07778; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:06:20 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA16362; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 19:20:14 +0100 Message-Id: <199511291820.TAA16362@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> X-Authentication-Warning: vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Jerry.Kendall@vmicls.com (Jerry Kendall) cc: martin@victor.innovus.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: diskless X server using FreeBSD 2.0.5R Reply-To: "Julian H. Stacey" X-mailer: EXMH version 1.6.4 10/10/95 In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:42:03 +0500." <9511271442.AA28929.gonzo@vmicls.com> Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 19:20:14 +0100 From: "Julian H. Stacey" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, Responding to: > From: Jerry.Kendall@vmicls.com (Jerry Kendall) > ------- > Now then, you mentioned stripping down things. > > Do you(or maybe someone in the group) have the ability to > generate a 'ls -lR' of a system that is running as an X terminal. > > I have just aquired some small disk, 80 Meg, that I can dedicate > to FreeBSD. This will allow me to put a minimal FreeBSD system on > it. I would still only use it as an X terminal. 80M is the same size as my emergency boot disk. So I'm mailing you my script that I use to copy my { 3 Gig system with every port installed } that strips & tears away at a reduced copy, rather like a `Raptor' until there's just sufficient left to fit on an 80M boot disc, so it can be used as an X capable FreeBSD box. The script is not good enough to be published, feel free to generalise & publish it :-) Julian --- Julian H. Stacey jhs@freebsd.org http://www.freebsd.org/~jhs/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 00:07:03 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA05990 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:07:03 -0800 Received: from wiley.muc.ditec.de (wiley.muc.ditec.de [194.120.126.9]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA05976 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:06:57 -0800 Received: from vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (ns055.munich.netsurf.de [194.64.166.55]) by wiley.muc.ditec.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA07781; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:06:42 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA16306; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 19:06:19 +0100 Message-Id: <199511291806.TAA16306@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> X-Authentication-Warning: vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: "Marc A. Mercier" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Better scsi and e-net support... Reply-To: "Julian H. Stacey" X-mailer: EXMH version 1.6.4 10/10/95 In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 20:06:36 EST." <9511280106.AA07686@mingus.bose.com> Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 19:06:18 +0100 From: "Julian H. Stacey" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, Responding to: > From: "Marc A. Mercier" > Subject: Re: Better scsi and e-net support... > Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 20:06:36 -0500 > Message-id: <9511280106.AA07686@mingus.bose.com> > > Sorry to be a jerk, but I find it hard to believe that there are more people > out in the US that have a Compaq DeskPro XL or an HP Vectra XU that use the This is a World list :-) Julian --- Julian H. Stacey jhs@freebsd.org http://www.freebsd.org/~jhs/ Tel +49.89.268616 Fax .2608126 Holz Strasse 27d, 80469 Munich, Germany From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 00:07:30 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA06031 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:07:30 -0800 Received: from wiley.muc.ditec.de (wiley.muc.ditec.de [194.120.126.9]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA06023 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:07:26 -0800 Received: from vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (ns055.munich.netsurf.de [194.64.166.55]) by wiley.muc.ditec.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA07784; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:06:56 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA15950; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 19:01:24 +0100 Message-Id: <199511291801.TAA15950@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> X-Authentication-Warning: vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Douglas Ambrisko cc: dufault@hda.com (Peter Dufault), joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Anyone keen to help me get a Phillips CDD 521 Recorder working? Reply-To: "Julian H. Stacey" X-mailer: EXMH version 1.6.4 10/10/95 In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:45:16 PST." <199511282345.PAA09388@cozumel.tcs.com> Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 19:01:24 +0100 From: "Julian H. Stacey" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, Responding to: > From: Douglas Ambrisko > > In the MS-DOS/Windows world you can grab the CPU to just work on the burn. ...> > Doing a CD-R burn is possible (look at Linux, all the code has been done IMHO ( & I'm speculating here ) MS-DOS based burning is done 'cos it's a single task, & avoids delays, so run FreeBSD single tasking, no daemons etc, & I suppose you'd succeed ? Julian --- Julian H. Stacey jhs@freebsd.org http://www.freebsd.org/~jhs/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 00:07:50 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA06076 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:07:50 -0800 Received: from wiley.muc.ditec.de (wiley.muc.ditec.de [194.120.126.9]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA06067 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:07:46 -0800 Received: from vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (ns055.munich.netsurf.de [194.64.166.55]) by wiley.muc.ditec.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA07790; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:07:26 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id SAA15870; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:36:57 +0100 Message-Id: <199511291736.SAA15870@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> X-Authentication-Warning: vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol cc: me@gw.muc.ditec.de, terry@lambert.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2.1.0-RELEASE now available! Reply-To: "Julian H. Stacey" X-mailer: EXMH version 1.6.4 10/10/95 In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:32:58 +0100." <199511271032.LAA01031@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:36:56 +0100 From: "Julian H. Stacey" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, Correcting my own: > From: "Julian H. Stacey" > Reply-to: "Julian H. Stacey" > Subject: Re: 2.1.0-RELEASE now available! > Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:32:58 +0100 > Message-id: <199511271032.LAA01031@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> > > I've just not got both > - separate directories for each freebsd mail list > - threading > working using /usr/ports/mail/mh, exmh, & procmail. > So xmh & other mh based mail readers should be able to doi similar. Bad editing, sorry, of course I meant: I've just got both - separate directories for each freebsd mail list - threading working using /usr/ports/mail/mh, exmh, & procmail. So xmh & other mh based mail readers should be able to do similar. Julian --- Julian H. Stacey jhs@freebsd.org http://www.freebsd.org/~jhs/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 00:10:43 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA06446 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:10:43 -0800 Received: from wiley.muc.ditec.de (wiley.muc.ditec.de [194.120.126.9]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA06420 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:10:28 -0800 Received: from vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (ns055.munich.netsurf.de [194.64.166.55]) by wiley.muc.ditec.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA07802; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:08:54 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA16400; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 19:23:15 +0100 Message-Id: <199511291823.TAA16400@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> X-Authentication-Warning: vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Sergio Lenzi cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, ports@freegsd.org Subject: Re: INGRES 8.9 Reply-To: "Julian H. Stacey" X-mailer: EXMH version 1.6.4 10/10/95 In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 28 Nov 1995 01:03:30 GMT." Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 19:23:14 +0100 From: "Julian H. Stacey" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, Responding to: > From: Sergio Lenzi > > Finaly the Ingres version 8.9 bugless (I hope) > is in a USA site (freefall.cdrom.com) > file names: ingresbin.tar.gz and ingressrc.tar.gz > > Any questions, please mail me. URL for ftp please ? Julian --- Julian H. Stacey jhs@freebsd.org http://www.freebsd.org/~jhs/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 00:22:22 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA07155 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:22:22 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA07138 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:21:57 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id JAA28536; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:21:22 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id JAA14409; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:21:22 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id JAA18885; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:13:14 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511300813.JAA18885@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Problem with sio probe and Mach64 PCI video card To: dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (David Dawes) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:13:14 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511300240.NAA21779@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> from "David Dawes" at Nov 30, 95 01:40:20 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 752 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As David Dawes wrote: > > >As David Dawes wrote: > >S3 can coexist with traditional COM4, since it's possible to remap > >their IO registers (they only default to the 8514-compatible mode). > >XFree86 didn't implement this however [...] > > We did make an attempt at implementing it, but found that there were > problems using it with some of the S3 chips :-( (grep for COM4 in the > XFree86 CHANGELOG). Hmm, perhaps it would be worth another try, assuming that all the newer chips are no longer broken with this respect? (I seem to remember that the broken chips were some 86C805's.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 00:30:28 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA07743 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:30:28 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA07737 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:30:19 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id JAA28512; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:21:09 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id JAA14405; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:21:09 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id IAA18779; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 08:59:35 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511300759.IAA18779@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: posessed by daemons? To: gfoster@gfoster.com (Glen Foster) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 08:59:35 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511282300.SAA14720@nomad.osmre.gov> from "Glen Foster" at Nov 28, 95 06:00:31 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 336 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Glen Foster wrote: > > The src seemed to extract OK but I found a couple of bit flips in > various files that killed the compile. Flipped during transport? (Ethernet?) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 00:31:58 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA07804 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:31:58 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA07499 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:27:11 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id JAA28486; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:20:51 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id JAA14401; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:20:50 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id IAA18756; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 08:57:37 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199511300757.IAA18756@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: 2.1.0 Install went smoothly! To: jdl@jdl.com (Jon Loeliger) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 08:57:37 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511282256.QAA13681@chrome.jdl.com> from "Jon Loeliger" at Nov 28, 95 04:56:24 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1265 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jon Loeliger wrote: > > - I wasn't sure what a "normal partition" was to be compatible with > other OSes on a disk after I hit "A" for a total disk layout. What > was I doing before when I selected "A"? [Did that English right? :-] Provide us with a better wording. :-) My first text was even more disleading, this is Jordan's version. The point is, that people who are selecting the ``dangerously dedicated'' option (assign the entire disk from 0 to the very last sector to FreeBSD) are likely to shoot in their foot if they are going to install a BIOS-int13-using system (like MezzDos) after installing FreeBSD. (My colleague did it these days, installed DOS on a machine that has been used as a FreeBSD demo at a fair -- it didn't boot. fdisk /mbr did the trick then.) OTOH, people who are really sure that the machine is not about to see anything else than FreeBSD in this life should be encouraged to use the non-default option, in particular all those with SCSI disks. They get in return to never ever worry again about the term ``geometry''. Geometry, geometry, what's this? :-) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 00:42:56 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA08370 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:42:56 -0800 Received: from gvr.win.tue.nl (root@gvr.win.tue.nl [131.155.210.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA08364 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:42:51 -0800 Received: by gvr.win.tue.nl (8.6.10/1.53) id JAA09380; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:42:28 +0100 From: guido@gvr.win.tue.nl (Guido van Rooij) Message-Id: <199511300842.JAA09380@gvr.win.tue.nl> Subject: Re: Anyone keen to help me get a Phillips CDD 521 Recorder working? To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:42:28 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511220145.BAA24214@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Nov 22, 95 01:45:21 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 735 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Jordan K. Hubbard stands accused of saying: > > > > Not LUNs. Unknowns. > > > > > Jordan K. Hubbard stands accused of saying: > > > > (ahc0:3:0): "IMS CDD521/10 " type 4 removable SCSI 1 > > > > uk0(ahc0:3:0): Unknown > > > ... > > > > (ahc0:3:7): "IMS CDD521/10 " type 4 removable SCSI 1 > > > > uk7(ahc0:3:7): Unknown > > LUNs. The device is on ahc0, ID3, and it responds on LUN0 through LUN7. > The SCSI code sees seven seperate devices, all the same, and assigns seven > uk* devices to them. > > This augers poorly for the device's general compliance with any other part > of the spec 8( If it's a philips, please take the time to fill in a feedabck form on www.philips.com -Guido Yep...also working for Philips.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 01:02:38 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA09494 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:02:38 -0800 Received: from dtr.com (dtr.rain.com [204.119.8.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA09483 ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:02:32 -0800 From: bmk@dtr.com Received: (from bmk@localhost) by dtr.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id BAA01148; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:02:27 -0800 Message-Id: <199511300902.BAA01148@dtr.com> Subject: Re: Using a SUN monitor To: gclarkii@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:02:27 -0800 (PST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511300501.XAA04408@main.gbdata.com> from "Gary Clark II" at Nov 29, 95 11:01:18 pm Reply-To: bmk@dtr.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1274 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > I've got a SUN 19 inch monitor I would LOVE to use under X. The only problem > is that I'm not sure how to hook it up... The monitor is in the XFree > monitor DataBase so that is covered. > Does anyone around have a diagram or discription of how to do this? I > have no problem firing up a soldering iron (I spent 6 years in the Navy > as an ET..:)). I'd like to be able to do this as well - used Sun monitors can be had dirt cheap. >From what I understand, if you have a fixed-frequency monitor, you'll need a video card that can handle fixed frequencies. If your monitor does multi-frequency, that should be a lot easier. I've seen VGA to 5 BNC video cables at DataComm Warehouse for $59.00 that should work on multi-frequency monitors that have separate sync signals (no sync on green). If you have a 13W3 cable on your Sun monitor, you should be able to make an adapter. I have one that goes the other way, from a Sun (13W3) to a SVGA (15 pin) monitor. It's a simple adapter cable, no electronics whatsoever. Mine is used to hook an Opus workstation to a Sony 15" multifreq monitor. One should only have to reverse the sex of the cable to make it work the other way. If there's any interest at all, I'd be happy to bust it open and post the pinout. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 01:16:11 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA10398 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:16:11 -0800 Received: from bunyip.cc.uq.oz.au (pp@bunyip.cc.uq.oz.au [130.102.2.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA10273 ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:15:56 -0800 Received: from cc.uq.oz.au by bunyip.cc.uq.oz.au id <28670-0@bunyip.cc.uq.oz.au>; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:15:01 +1000 Received: from saturn.mincom.oz.au by minbne.mincom.oz.au with SMTP id AA27299 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for jkh@freefall.freebsd.org); Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:33:30 +1000 Received: by saturn.mincom.oz.au id AA15733 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for hackers@freefall.freebsd.org); Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:38:23 +1000 From: Ian Holland Message-Id: <199511300038.AA15733@saturn.mincom.oz.au> Subject: Re: Bug in stable/-current perl? To: jkh@freefall.freebsd.org (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:38:23 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511290543.VAA13120@freefall.freebsd.org> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 28, 95 09:43:31 pm Reply-To: ianh@mincom.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 875 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk As Jordan K. Hubbard enscribed: > > jkh@freefall-> date > Tue Nov 28 21:42:48 PST 1995 > > jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[4]);' > 10 > > 10? Am I misunderstanding something fundamental about perl's > localtime() call, or should this be an "11"? > >From the man page (some deleted): localtime EXPR All array elements are numeric, and come straight out of a struct tm. In particular this means that $mon has the range 0..11 and $wday has the range 0..6. ^^^^^ [I admit this is from the perl 5 man page, but it was the same for perl 4 - trust me ;-) ] I think the rationale is that you can then easily use the month value as an index into an array of real months names. Ditto for the week day. -- Ian Holland DOS - a case study in Mincom Pty Ltd cerebral ischaemia. ianh@mincom.oz.au From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 01:27:44 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA11067 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:27:44 -0800 Received: from cls.net (freeside.cls.de [192.129.50.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA11062 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:27:38 -0800 Received: by mail.cls.net (Smail3.1.29.1) from allegro.lemis.de (192.109.197.134) with smtp id ; Thu, 30 Nov 95 09:27 GMT From: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Organisation: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, 36325 Feldatal, Germany Phone: +49-6637-919123 Fax: +49-6637-919122 Reply-To: grog@lemis.de (Greg Lehey) Received: (grog@localhost) by allegro.lemis.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id KAA10733; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:26:37 +0100 Message-Id: <199511300926.KAA10733@allegro.lemis.de> Subject: Re: Enough already! (Was: Where is the documentation for ibcs2?) To: chuckr@glue.umd.edu (Chuck Robey) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:26:36 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers) In-Reply-To: from "Chuck Robey" at Nov 29, 95 10:11:33 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 692 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Chuck Robey writes: > > I've been watching all this, and it suddenly occurred to me that I have a > paid for copy of SVR4.0.4 (an old ESIX implementation) that I happily > gave up on to run FreeBSD. It's based on ELF, and is a complete > 'unlimited' version with the full set of development tools. I don't want > to run it, would it be of use to anyone from FreeBSD, maybe in research > for ELF stuff? It runs SCO binaries, too, and if anyone can use it (for > FreeBSD development purposes) I'd be happy to send it off. Thanks for the offer, but I personally don't need it--I have at least 3 SVR4s here, none of which I find worth using :-) Maybe somebody else can use it. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 01:42:08 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA11842 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:42:08 -0800 Received: from pcpsj.pfcs.com (ISQOyF0zGXWkBpWpZlmDWWAniujKMqRn@harlan.clark.net [168.143.10.179]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA11836 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:41:49 -0800 Received: from mumps.pfcs.com (mumps.pfcs.com [192.52.69.11]) by pcpsj.pfcs.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id EAA02522; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 04:22:00 -0500 Received: from localhost by mumps.pfcs.com with SMTP id AA08998 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Thu, 30 Nov 1995 04:21:59 -0500 To: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) Cc: Harlan Stenn , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Patches for lib/libskey/ In-Reply-To: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?='s (ache@astral.msk.su) message dated Thu, 30 Nov 1995 00:07:40. Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 04:21:58 -0400 Message-Id: <8996.817723318@mumps.pfcs.com> From: Harlan Stenn Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I wondered too. What I came up with was: - Without the patch, wu-ftpd with skey-patches doesn't work - Therefore, I suspect a compiler problem. Hey, it's slim, but I suspect Wietse had *some* good reason for changing the code! H From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 02:16:50 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id CAA14484 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 02:16:50 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA14469 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 02:16:46 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id CAA11729 for hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 02:16:25 -0800 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 02:16:25 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511301016.CAA11729@ref.tfs.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: broken readdir? Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk we seem to have broken readdir in libc.. the man page says: The readdir() function returns a pointer to the next directory entry. It returns NULL upon reaching the end of the directory or detecting an in- valid seekdir() operation. but the following code in WINE breaks, and I can see it breaking in gdb.. 03 struct dosdirent *DOS_readdir(struct dosdirent *de) 904 { 905 char temp[WINE_PATH_LENGTH]; (gdb) 906 struct dirent *d; 907 struct stat st; 908 DIR *ds; 909 910 if (!de->inuse) 911 return NULL; 912 if (!(ds=opendir(de->unixpath))) return NULL; 913 seekdir(ds,de->telldirnum); /* returns no error value. strange */ [..] code skipped over.. 929 do { 930 if ((d = readdir(ds)) == NULL) { 931 de->telldirnum=telldir(ds); 932 closedir(ds); 933 return NULL; 934 } 935 (gdb) 936 de->entnum++; /* Increment the directory entry number */ 937 strcpy(de->filename, d->d_name); 938 if (d->d_reclen > 12) 939 de->filename[12] = '\0'; 940 941 ToDos(de->filename); 942 } while ( !match(de->filename, de->filemask) ); (gdb) print de->telldirnum $3 = 16432 (gdb) print *ds $4 = {dd_fd = 12, dd_loc = 12, dd_size = 1536, dd_buf = 0x21c000 "p@", dd_len = 4096, dd_seek = 0, dd_rewind = 16433} the directory is 1536 bytes long, so a seek to 16k SHOULD result in the next readdir() returning NULL, no? however the readdir on line 931 DOES NOT return null, but rather returns the ADDRESS OF THE FIRST ENTRY '.' Wine is looping forever, as it doesn't realise it's reached the end of the dir, and looks at '.', '.', '.', '.' (stat, stat, stat etc) the code in wine LOOKS RIGHT to me, but BY GUM the code in readdir/seekdir is horrid. if anyone can see a bug in either the WINE code or seekdir/readdir I'd really be obliged... (I'm SURE the bug is in readdir..) julian +----------------------------------+ ______ _ __ | __--_|\ Julian Elischer | \ U \/ / On assignment | / \ julian@ref.tfs.com +------>x USA \ in a very strange | ( OZ ) 300 lakeside Dr. oakland CA. \___ ___ | country ! +- X_.---._/ USA+(510) 645-3137(wk) \_/ \\ v From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 03:11:27 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA18245 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 03:11:27 -0800 Received: from cwbtwo.bsi.com.br ([200.250.250.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA18240 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 03:11:16 -0800 Received: (from lenzi@localhost) by cwbtwo.bsi.com.br (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA22676; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:05:49 GMT Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:05:47 +0000 () From: Sergio Lenzi To: Bruce Evans cc: bmk@dtr.com, chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape 2.0b3 In-Reply-To: <199511280837.TAA19625@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 28 Nov 1995, Bruce Evans wrote: > >> Anyone try to use the mail window of the new netscape? It searches > >> for the mail spool directory in /usr/spool/mail. Any ideas on how we > >> can get get around this? > > >Naturally, you could fix it if you had the source. > Excuse me, Why just do a simbolic link of the directories ln -s /var/mail /usr/spool??? Sergio de Almeida Lenzi. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 03:22:26 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA18689 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 03:22:26 -0800 Received: from cwbtwo.bsi.com.br ([200.250.250.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA18680 ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 03:21:56 -0800 Received: (from lenzi@localhost) by cwbtwo.bsi.com.br (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA23897; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:20:34 GMT Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:20:32 +0000 () From: Sergio Lenzi To: "Julian H. Stacey" cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, ports@freegsd.org Subject: Re: INGRES 8.9 In-Reply-To: <199511291823.TAA16400@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 29 Nov 1995, Julian H. Stacey wrote: > > Finaly the Ingres version 8.9 bugless (I hope) > > is in a USA site (freefall.cdrom.com) > > file names: ingresbin.tar.gz and ingressrc.tar.gz > > > > Any questions, please mail me. > > URL for ftp please ? The ingres can be dowloaded from freefall.cdrom.com ftp://freefall.cdrom.com/incoming the bin package install on /usr/ingres the source install on /usr/ingre/src To compile the sources, you need gnu make ... Thanks for the interest... Sergio de Almeida Lenzi. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 03:49:47 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA19987 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 03:49:47 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA19980 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 03:49:45 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id DAA11852 for hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 03:49:24 -0800 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 03:49:24 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199511301149.DAA11852@ref.tfs.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: seekdir broken.. Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk The following code attempts to read a directory, in small gulps.. it seems silly, but there is a reason for doing this in WINE. The code THINKS it;s stepping through the directory.. but in fact as we can see, the seekdir is having NO effect at all, so we just keep getting the first two entries over and over.. any ideas? this breaks WINE big-time.. I'm AMAZED nothing else breaks.. the readdir code is SHIT! you can't read two directories at once because it uses static elements! ---------------------------------- #include #include DIR *dir; /* * Loop through a directory, looking for something */ main() { int num = 0; while(1) { /* * Look for something that might match */ num = readd(num, "*.c"); printf("-%d-\n",num ); /* * Nope that aint it, keep trying */ } } /* * scan through a directory looking for something that matches a pattern p */ int readd(int tell,char *pat) { int i; struct dirent *ent; dir = opendir("."); /* * Start where we left off, of where we are asked to */ seekdir(dir, tell); /* * pretend we hit on every 2nd item */ for ( i = 1; i< 3;i++) { printf("[%d] ", tell = telldir(dir)); if ( ! (ent = readdir(dir))) { printf("[%d] ",telldir(dir)); printf("exiting\n"); exit(1); } printf("<%s>",ent->d_name); } closedir(dir); return(tell); } ------------------end of test program----------- under OSF1 the output in /tmp (2 files) is: [0] <.>[12] <..>-12- [12] <..>[24] -24- [24] [120] -120- [120] [512] [512] exiting under freeBSD the output is: [1] <.>[2] <..>-2- [4] <.>[5] <..>-5- [7] <.>[8] <..>-8- [10] <.>[11] <..>-11- [13] <.>[14] <..>-14- [16] <.>[17] <..>-17- [19] <.>[20] <..>-20- [22] <.>[23] <..>-23- [25] <.>[26] <..>-26- [28] <.>[29] <..>-29- (etc. forever..) I think I'm going over to see what NetBSD have done about this.. julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 06:54:54 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id GAA11161 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 06:54:54 -0800 Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA11092 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 06:54:23 -0800 Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id PAA07944; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:41:22 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199511301441.PAA07944@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Netscape 2.0b3 To: lenzi@cwbtwo.bsi.com.br (Sergio Lenzi) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:41:22 +0100 (MET) Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, bmk@dtr.com, chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Sergio Lenzi" at Nov 30, 95 09:05:28 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1137 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > On Tue, 28 Nov 1995, Bruce Evans wrote: > > > >> Anyone try to use the mail window of the new netscape? It searches > > >> for the mail spool directory in /usr/spool/mail. Any ideas on how we > > >> can get get around this? > > > > >Naturally, you could fix it if you had the source. > > > > Excuse me, > > > Why just do a simbolic link of the directories > ln -s /var/mail /usr/spool??? > Sergio de Almeida Lenzi. polluting directories with hard links to fix programs with hardcoded pathnames is A Bad Thing, IMHO, and always causes confusion when, after a few {days|weeks|months} one forgets about the existence of the link. Especially if there is a different solution using environment variables or program options Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 07:01:10 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA12843 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:01:10 -0800 Received: from bigbird.vmicls.com (bigbird.vmicls.com [198.17.96.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA12816 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:01:06 -0800 Received: from gonzo by bigbird.vmicls.com (8.6.9/SMI-4.1-vmicls-master-host-1) id KAA22502; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:03:34 -0500 From: Jerry.Kendall@vmicls.com (Jerry Kendall) Organization: VMI Communications and Learning Systems Received: by gonzo (5.0/vmi-client-host-1) id AA09403; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:03:32 +0500 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:03:32 +0500 Message-Id: <9511301503.AA09403.gonzo@vmicls.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Umm.. X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII content-length: 676 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > As Quanah Mount wrote: > > > > is there anyway you could set up Mosaic so that it doesn't need Motif, > > which you don't provide, nor can I find on the net? > > You have to buy Motif. Or find somebody who's bought it, and compiles > you a Mosaic with a statically linked Motif lib. > > -- > cheers, J"org > > joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE > Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) I was at the University of Toronto Bookstore yesterday and say something call 'MOO-TIFF'. It claimed it was a MOTIF compatible library for Linux. Is this true????? Is it available for FreeBSD ???? Jerry From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 07:22:36 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA17643 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:22:36 -0800 Received: from bigbird.vmicls.com (bigbird.vmicls.com [198.17.96.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA17623 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:22:32 -0800 Received: from gonzo by bigbird.vmicls.com (8.6.9/SMI-4.1-vmicls-master-host-1) id KAA23951; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:25:02 -0500 From: Jerry.Kendall@vmicls.com (Jerry Kendall) Organization: VMI Communications and Learning Systems Received: by gonzo (5.0/vmi-client-host-1) id AA09975; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:25:00 +0500 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:25:00 +0500 Message-Id: <9511301525.AA09975.gonzo@vmicls.com> To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Seting up a mirror for FreeBSD X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII content-length: 590 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Still unable to setup a mirror for freebsd.... Still unable to get 'mirror' version 2.3 to connect to ftp.cdrom.com or ftp.freebsd.sol.net It say's 'Connecting to ...' then fails. in /usr/local/lib/mirror/ftp.pl at line ~170 it calls open_port in the chat module and that call fails .. in /usr/share/perl/chat2.pl at line ~42 it calls 'connect()' and that fails. I don't know a great deal about the perl language, will learn soon, but I do 'C" and have done 'C' for more than 10 years, I feel that the problem may be with the call to connect(). Can someone help please. Jerry From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 07:40:06 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA20965 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:40:06 -0800 Received: from victor.innovus.com (victor.innovus.com [192.75.186.54]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA20860 ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:40:01 -0800 Received: (from martin@localhost) by victor.innovus.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA05856; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:15:58 -0500 From: Martin Renters Message-Id: <199511301615.LAA05856@victor.innovus.com> Subject: Re: Using a SUN monitor To: gclarkii@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:15:57 -0500 (EST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511300501.XAA04408@main.gbdata.com> from "Gary Clark II" at Nov 29, 95 11:01:18 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1024 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I've got a SUN 19 inch monitor I would LOVE to use under X. The only problem > is that I'm not sure how to hook it up... The monitor is in the XFree > monitor DataBase so that is covered. > > Does anyone around have a diagram or discription of how to do this? I > have no problem firing up a soldering iron (I spent 6 years in the Navy > as an ET..:)). I have done this with an old HP workstation monitor. The monitor originally had 3 BNC connectors on the back (RGB), but you could order a sync board for the monitor which would give you H-Sync and V-Sync inputs (this board was about $39). I then purchased a VGA->5 BNC cable ($40) to hook it up. The major problem with this setup is that many (all?) of the older workstation monitors are fixed frequency monitors. This means they can only be used at the resolution they were designed for (1024x768 in my case). They work well if you're running Xfree86 in graphics mode, but they are unable to do 80x25 text mode (you just get garbage on the screen). Martin From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 08:04:55 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id IAA26425 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 08:04:55 -0800 Received: from spot.lodgenet.com (lodgenet.iw.net [204.157.148.88]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA25949 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 08:03:27 -0800 Received: from jake.lodgenet.com (jake.lodgenet.com [204.124.120.30]) by spot.lodgenet.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA06665; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:04:03 -0600 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jake.lodgenet.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA01227; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:22:01 -0600 Message-Id: <199511301622.KAA01227@jake.lodgenet.com> X-Authentication-Warning: jake.lodgenet.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: Robert Withrow cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Wanted: Examples of ``good practice'' device drivers. In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:00:15 EST." <199511300200.VAA26997@spooky.rwwa.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:22:00 -0600 From: "Eric L. Hernes" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Robert Withrow writes: >I've been writing device drivers and kernel code for the >last 20 years or so, on lots of OS's including several >versions of SYSV. I'm now faced with converting some >SVR4 drivers I wrote a few years ago to FreeBSD, a >version of OS I know essentially nothing about the >internals of. So, while I don't need to learn *how* >to write a ``unix device driver'', I do need to learn >how to write a *FreeBSD* device driver. > I've started on a drivers writers guide. I'd say you've got quite a bit more experience than I though... My doc just covers bolting a driver into the kernel, and mentions the entry points. The doc is at http://www.freebsd.org/~erich/ddwg/ddwg.html, or I can mail a postscript version. As it sits now it is applicable to 2.0 2.0.5 and 2.1, but is about to become dated w.r.t -current ;( eric. -- erich@lodgenet.com erich@rrnet.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 08:05:44 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id IAA26628 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 08:05:44 -0800 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de [137.226.31.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA26610 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 08:05:36 -0800 Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA25500; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 17:02:13 +0100 Message-Id: <199511301602.RAA25500@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Subject: Re: Netscape 2.0b3 To: lenzi@cwbtwo.bsi.com.br (Sergio Lenzi) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 17:02:12 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (user alias) In-Reply-To: from "Sergio Lenzi" at Nov 30, 95 09:05:47 am From: Christoph Kukulies Reply-To: Christoph Kukulies X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 589 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > On Tue, 28 Nov 1995, Bruce Evans wrote: > > > >> Anyone try to use the mail window of the new netscape? It searches > > >> for the mail spool directory in /usr/spool/mail. Any ideas on how we > > >> can get get around this? > > > > >Naturally, you could fix it if you had the source. > > > > Excuse me, > > > Why just do a simbolic link of the directories > ln -s /var/mail /usr/spool??? > Sergio de Almeida Lenzi. Or setenv MAIL_DIR /usr/spool/mail Just guessing from doing a strings netscape. > > --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 08:29:08 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id IAA01051 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 08:29:08 -0800 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.Atinc.COM [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA01015 ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 08:28:27 -0800 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id LAA07158; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:20:46 -0500 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:20:45 -0500 (EST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: Re: Majordomo coredumping To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-hubs@freebsd.org, freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 30 Nov 1995, Basket Case wrote: > Ive been trying to setup majordomo with little or no avail. When Majordomo > is running -- when I send it asking for help, it replies just fine. But when > I ask to be subscribed to any list or do anything with Majordomo, it decides > to take a core for some odd reason. Here are is the bug that appears > when I run Majordomo (v 1.9.3 with fbsd) couple of options: --verify that the perl scripts are using /usr/sbin/sendmail not /usr/lib/sendmail --make sure that wrapper is compiled with the correct flags --use majordomo 1.92 available from kryten.atinc.com. --wait for the majordomo port. what happened to the majordomo port that was due monday???!!! well. i installed 2.1.0R onto the second disk, the first disk WAS 1.1.5.1 now its non-bootable . a&t lost internet connectivity for 2 days. and i am running late on the port. i will get the port out. my apologies to everyone that is waiting on the port. jmb Jonathan M. Bresler FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.ORG play go. ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life i am moving to a new job. PLEASE USE: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 09:01:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA03076 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:01:40 -0800 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.Atinc.COM [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA03062 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:01:32 -0800 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id LAA07425; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:53:01 -0500 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:52:59 -0500 (EST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: Re: Seting up a mirror for FreeBSD To: Jerry Kendall cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <9511301525.AA09975.gonzo@vmicls.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Thu, 30 Nov 1995, Jerry Kendall wrote: > Still unable to setup a mirror for freebsd.... > you may have a bad version of chat2.pl. *** /usr/local/lib/perl/chat2.pl.orig Mon Jan 24 18:28:30 1994 --- /usr/local/lib/perl/chat2.pl Thu Nov 17 19:30:38 1994 *************** *** 1,12 **** ! ## chat.pl: chat with a server ! ## V2.01.alpha.7 91/06/16 ! ## Randal L. Schwartz package chat; $sockaddr = 'S n a4 x8'; ! chop($thishost = `hostname`); $thisaddr = (gethostbyname($thishost))[4]; ! $thisproc = pack($sockaddr, 2, 0, $thisaddr); # *S = symbol for current I/O, gets assigned *chatsymbol.... $next = "chatsymbol000000"; # next one --- 1,43 ---- ! # chat.pl: chat with a server ! # Based on: V2.01.alpha.7 91/06/16 ! # Randal L. Schwartz (was ) ! # multihome additions by A.Macpherson@bnr.co.uk ! # allow for /dev/pts based systems by Joe Doupnik ! # $Id: chat2.pl,v 2.2 1993/12/14 11:09:03 lmjm Exp lmjm $ ! # $Log: chat2.pl,v $ ! # Revision 2.2 1993/12/14 11:09:03 lmjm ! # Only include sys/socket.ph if not already there. ! # Allow for system 5. ! # ! # Revision 2.1 1993/06/28 15:11:07 lmjm ! # Full 2.1 release ! # package chat; + unless( defined &'PF_INET ){ + eval "sub ATT { 0; } sub INTEL { 0; }"; + do 'sys/socket.ph'; + } + + + if( defined( &main'PF_INET ) ){ + $pf_inet = &main'PF_INET; + $sock_stream = &main'SOCK_STREAM; + local($name, $aliases, $proto) = getprotobyname( 'tcp' ); + $tcp_proto = $proto; + } + else { + # XXX hardwired $PF_INET, $SOCK_STREAM, 'tcp' + # but who the heck would change these anyway? (:-) + $pf_inet = 2; + $sock_stream = 1; + $tcp_proto = 6; + } + + $sockaddr = 'S n a4 x8'; ! chop( $thishost = `(hostname || uname -n || uuname -l) 2>/dev/null` ); # *S = symbol for current I/O, gets assigned *chatsymbol.... $next = "chatsymbol000000"; # next one *************** *** 21,26 **** --- 52,61 ---- local($serveraddr,$serverproc); + # We may be multi-homed, start with 0, fixup once connexion is made + $thisaddr = "\0\0\0\0" ; + $thisproc = pack($sockaddr, 2, 0, $thisaddr); + *S = ++$next; if ($server =~ /^(\d+)+\.(\d+)\.(\d+)\.(\d+)$/) { $serveraddr = pack('C4', $1, $2, $3, $4); *************** *** 30,38 **** $serveraddr = $x[4]; } $serverproc = pack($sockaddr, 2, $port, $serveraddr); ! unless (socket(S, 2, 1, 6)) { ! # XXX hardwired $AF_SOCKET, $SOCK_STREAM, 'tcp' ! # but who the heck would change these anyway? (:-) ($!) = ($!, close(S)); # close S while saving $! return undef; } --- 65,71 ---- $serveraddr = $x[4]; } $serverproc = pack($sockaddr, 2, $port, $serveraddr); ! unless (socket(S, $pf_inet, $sock_stream, $tcp_proto)) { ($!) = ($!, close(S)); # close S while saving $! return undef; } *************** *** 44,49 **** --- 77,89 ---- ($!) = ($!, close(S)); # close S while saving $! return undef; } + # We opened with the local address set to ANY, at this stage we know + # which interface we are using. This is critical if our machine is + # multi-homed, with IP forwarding off, so fix-up. + local($fam,$lport); + ($fam,$lport,$thisaddr) = unpack($sockaddr, getsockname(S)); + $thisproc = pack($sockaddr, 2, 0, $thisaddr); + # end of post-connect fixup select((select(S), $| = 1)[0]); $next; # return symbol for switcharound } *************** *** 59,67 **** local($thisport) = shift || 0; local($thisproc_local) = pack($sockaddr, 2, $thisport, $thisaddr); local(*NS) = "__" . time; ! unless (socket(NS, 2, 1, 6)) { ! # XXX hardwired $AF_SOCKET, $SOCK_STREAM, 'tcp' ! # but who the heck would change these anyway? (:-) ($!) = ($!, close(NS)); return undef; } --- 99,105 ---- local($thisport) = shift || 0; local($thisproc_local) = pack($sockaddr, 2, $thisport, $thisaddr); local(*NS) = "__" . time; ! unless (socket(NS, $pf_inet, $sock_stream, $tcp_proto)) { ($!) = ($!, close(NS)); return undef; } *************** *** 90,96 **** local(*TTY) = "__TTY" . time; local($pty,$tty) = &_getpty(S,TTY); die "Cannot find a new pty" unless defined $pty; ! local($pid) = fork; die "Cannot fork: $!" unless defined $pid; unless ($pid) { close STDIN; close STDOUT; close STDERR; --- 128,134 ---- local(*TTY) = "__TTY" . time; local($pty,$tty) = &_getpty(S,TTY); die "Cannot find a new pty" unless defined $pty; ! $pid = fork; die "Cannot fork: $!" unless defined $pid; unless ($pid) { close STDIN; close STDOUT; close STDERR; *************** *** 108,117 **** die "Cannot exec @cmd: $!"; } close(TTY); - $PID{$next} = $pid; $next; # return symbol for switcharound } # $S is the read-ahead buffer ## $return = &chat'expect([$handle,] $timeout_time, --- 146,179 ---- die "Cannot exec @cmd: $!"; } close(TTY); $next; # return symbol for switcharound } + # &chat'read([$handle,] $buf, $ntoread ) + # blocking read. returns no. of bytes read and puts data in $buf. + # If called with ntoread < 0 then just do the accept and return 0. + sub read { ## public + if ($_[0] =~ /$nextpat/) { + *S = shift; + } + *chatreadbuf = shift; + $chatreadn = shift; + + if (defined $S{"needs_accept"}) { # is it a listen socket? + local(*NS) = $S{"needs_accept"}; + delete $S{"needs_accept"}; + $S{"needs_close"} = *NS; + unless(accept(S,NS)) { + ($!) = ($!, close(S), close(NS)); + return undef; + } + select((select(S), $| = 1)[0]); + } + if( $chatreadn > 0 ){ + return sysread(S, $chatreadbuf, $chatreadn ); + } + } + # $S is the read-ahead buffer ## $return = &chat'expect([$handle,] $timeout_time, *************** *** 224,229 **** --- 286,295 ---- select($rmask, undef, undef, $endtime - time); if ($nfound) { $nread = sysread(S, $thisbuf, 1024); + if( $chat'debug ){ + print STDERR "sysread $nread "; + print STDERR ">>$thisbuf<<\n"; + } if ($nread > 0) { $S .= $thisbuf; } else { *************** *** 252,257 **** --- 318,327 ---- *S = shift; } print S @_; + if( $chat'debug ){ + print STDERR "printed:"; + print STDERR @_; + } } ## &chat'close([$handle,]) *************** *** 259,273 **** ## like close $handle sub close { ## public - local($pid); if ($_[0] =~ /$nextpat/) { - $pid = $PID{$_[0]}; *S = shift; - } else { - $pid = $PID{$next}; } close(S); - waitpid($pid,0); if (defined $S{"needs_close"}) { # is it a listen socket? local(*NS) = $S{"needs_close"}; delete $S{"needs_close"}; --- 329,338 ---- *************** *** 314,329 **** # internal procedure to get the next available pty. # opens pty on handle PTY, and matching tty on handle TTY. # returns undef if can't find a pty. sub _getpty { ## private local($_PTY,$_TTY) = @_; $_PTY =~ s/^([^']+)$/(caller)[$[]."'".$1/e; $_TTY =~ s/^([^']+)$/(caller)[$[]."'".$1/e; ! local($pty,$tty); for $bank (112..127) { ! next unless -e sprintf("/dev/pty%c0", $bank); for $unit (48..57) { ! $pty = sprintf("/dev/pty%c%c", $bank, $unit); open($_PTY,"+>$pty") || next; select((select($_PTY), $| = 1)[0]); ($tty = $pty) =~ s/pty/tty/; --- 379,400 ---- # internal procedure to get the next available pty. # opens pty on handle PTY, and matching tty on handle TTY. # returns undef if can't find a pty. + # Modify "/dev/pty" to "/dev/pts" for Dell Unix v2.2 (aka SVR4.04). Joe Doupnik. sub _getpty { ## private local($_PTY,$_TTY) = @_; $_PTY =~ s/^([^']+)$/(caller)[$[]."'".$1/e; $_TTY =~ s/^([^']+)$/(caller)[$[]."'".$1/e; ! local($pty, $tty, $kind); ! if( -e "/dev/pts000" ){ ## mods by Joe Doupnik Dec 1992 ! $kind = "pts"; ## SVR4 Streams ! } else { ! $kind = "pty"; ## BSD Clist stuff ! } for $bank (112..127) { ! next unless -e sprintf("/dev/$kind%c0", $bank); for $unit (48..57) { ! $pty = sprintf("/dev/$kind%c%c", $bank, $unit); open($_PTY,"+>$pty") || next; select((select($_PTY), $| = 1)[0]); ($tty = $pty) =~ s/pty/tty/; Jonathan M. Bresler FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.ORG play go. ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life i am moving to a new job. PLEASE USE: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 09:27:26 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA04451 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:27:26 -0800 Received: from arl-img-5.compuserve.com (arl-img-5.compuserve.com [198.4.7.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA04436 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:27:21 -0800 Received: by arl-img-5.compuserve.com (8.6.10/5.950515) id MAA29137; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 12:26:46 -0500 Date: 30 Nov 95 12:25:02 EST From: Jean-Pol Tamenne <100341.3315@compuserve.com> To: FreeBSD development grp Subject: How to join ? Message-ID: <951130172501_100341.3315_EHQ94-1@CompuServe.COM> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I am developing software currently for OS/2 in a small company in Belgium. I read a paper from the december Byte magazine about FreeBSD. I would like to receive more information about your development projects for FreeBSD. I haven't developed anything under Unix. I know a bit Unix as any people having been in an university for some years. My new FreeBSD CDROM's from Walnut Creek has been sleeping in a drawer for 2 months ..but I think that I will finally find the time and give it a try after that Byte paper. I like the idea of free software. Depending on your projects and on my own development planning, I could possibly join you in some projects as developer and/or (beta-)tester. My two main development fields for the last years have been communication (from null-modem to LAN and WAN) and multimedia ..but I gathered a broad experience in a lot of fields with several years of development in C and C++ for miscellaneous h/w & s/w platforms after a university degree here in Belgium. A message to subscribe to your mailing list was sent at the same time as this message. Please, keep me inform thru my CompuServe account. BTW do you know any person in Belgium (or in the area) already participating in some of your projects ? JP ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Jean-Pol Tamenne [Computer Video Flight, Belgium] CIS: 100341,3315 Internet: 100341.3315@compuserve.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 09:33:19 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA04943 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:33:19 -0800 Received: from covina.lightside.com (covina.lightside.com [198.81.209.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA04936 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:33:16 -0800 Received: by covina.lightside.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0tLCrB-0009b2C; Thu, 30 Nov 95 09:33 PST Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:33:13 -0800 (PST) From: Jake Hamby To: Jerry Kendall cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Umm.. In-Reply-To: <9511301503.AA09403.gonzo@vmicls.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 30 Nov 1995, Jerry Kendall wrote: > I was at the University of Toronto Bookstore yesterday and > say something call 'MOO-TIFF'. It claimed it was a MOTIF compatible library > for Linux. > > > > Is this true????? > > Is it available for FreeBSD ???? > > Jerry > MOO-TIFF isn't Motif-compatible, it IS actual OSF/Motif (2.0 I believe). The low cost comes from the fact that you don't get much (if any?) technical support for it. You're basically just paying for the Motif licensing fee, the cost of the CD, and the cost of the Linux port. And no, I don't think it's available for FreeBSD, but SWiM, another Motif 2.0 port, is, for about $149. I saw it at the ACC Bookstore for Linux and FreeBSD: http://www.acc-corp.com/ ---Jake From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 09:49:45 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA05916 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:49:45 -0800 Received: from spot.lodgenet.com (lodgenet.iw.net [204.157.148.88]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA05872 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:48:28 -0800 Received: from jake.lodgenet.com (jake.lodgenet.com [204.124.120.30]) by spot.lodgenet.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA07684; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:47:47 -0600 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jake.lodgenet.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id MAA02298; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 12:04:38 -0600 Message-Id: <199511301804.MAA02298@jake.lodgenet.com> X-Authentication-Warning: jake.lodgenet.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: Jerry.Kendall@vmicls.com (Jerry Kendall) cc: martin@victor.innovus.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: diskless X server using FreeBSD 2.0.5R In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:42:03 +0500." <9511271442.AA28929.gonzo@vmicls.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 12:04:37 -0600 From: "Eric L. Hernes" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Last april we needed to replace a Wyse-60 terminal with something that could display kanji for a property we were installing in Japan. After fighting with a Wyse X-Terminal for a week or so last april, I striped down a system and built a diskless X-Terminal based on old hardware we had laying around. It wasn't going to be a high-performace thing, it just needed to display kanji. The basic config was: 386DX-40 4MB ram (was later upgraded to 8M for performance) 3c509 et3000 (8-bit!) I used the bootrom out of /usr/src/sys/i386/boot/netboot to boot from an SCO host. I made provisions to have multiple X-Terminals booting from a single host. I had separate root and /usr partitions, the root would be on a `per-X-Terminal' basis, with a shared /usr. The only binaries on the root partition are the kernel and the crunched binary from /stand. /usr has some stuff from /usr/bin and from /usr/sbin, plus the X-Server, and whatever is necessary to use kanji (kterm, kinput2, and the canna server I think). I think that the biggest problems I had were 1) The num-lock thing stumped me for a day or so. I initially `solved' this by taking the mouse away, because our machine is only going to run one `kterm' and switching focus with the mouse could be confusing to the users. I just told the X-server to use an unused pty for the mouse device. I later figured out that you simply need to turn off num-lock, but not having a mouse was a better solution for our situation. 2) SCO's implementation of NFS doesn't allow making named sockets, so local X-clients either have to use an inet-domain socket, or you have to use an mfs partition for /tmp/.X11-unix, or alternatively you can make a small ufs image and mount it via the vnode driver. 3) once the SCO host was backed up and restored onto a new machine, and the X-Terminal mysteriously wouldn't boot. The machine was backed up with tar, so the /dev entries weren't preserved and init couldn't open its proper file descriptors. And the machine just hung after the kernel booted. I had gone so far as to create crunchgen(1) config files for the root and /usr binaries, so that only the X specific binaries weren't crunched, but I haven't had time to finish that. If you'd like my file lists of what I'm using, I'd be happy to help. eric. Jerry Kendall writes: > >Now then, you mentioned stripping down things. > >Do you(or maybe someone in the group) have the ability to >generate a 'ls -lR' of a system that is running as an X terminal. > >I have just aquired some small disk, 80 Meg, that I can dedicate >to FreeBSD. This will allow me to put a minimal FreeBSD system on >it. I would still only use it as an X terminal. > >I have no intent on running any FreeBSD apps on it, other than system >maintenance stuff. I will generate the required kernel on another >system. > >So then, what I need is 'Minimal Freebsd' and just enough of X to get >it to run as an X terminal. > >Questions: > > 1) Some X terminals(ie: NCD) will load their fonts from > a font server. Should I do this ??? > > 2) If someone does this on a pseudo regular basis, can they > provide me with some pre-install info and tips ???? > > >Jerry -- erich@lodgenet.com erich@rrnet.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 10:19:11 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA07984 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:19:11 -0800 Received: from snoopy.cogentlink.com (root@ns.cogentlink.com [206.3.51.14]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA07965 ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:19:06 -0800 Received: from [206.3.51.17] ([206.3.51.17]) by snoopy.cogentlink.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA04251; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 13:57:31 -0500 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 13:57:31 -0500 X-Sender: dstraub@cogentlink.com (Unverified) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: hackers@freeBSD.org, bugs@freeBSD.org From: dstraub@cogentlink.com (David Straub) Subject: Install Problem Sender: owner-hackers@freeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Two possibly unrelated issues are preventing my installation from floppy disks. First, the Boot floppy disk often hangs a half-dozen times when it comes to Uncompressing kernel... It finally loads the install program using the same floppy and I've tried re-rawriting other floppies with no help. Second, I get a problem that says "panic: page fault syncing disks" which I attribute to the labels portion of install. The newfs is set up as "-b 8192 -f 2048 -u 4096" for all partitions. Does this mean my IDE hard drive is incompatible with this bytes per sector scheme? Also, I haven't seen any specs for what the configuration means. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. ds. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 10:26:42 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA08535 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:26:42 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA08530 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:26:40 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA04877; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:20:10 -0800 To: "Eric L. Hernes" cc: Robert Withrow , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Wanted: Examples of ``good practice'' device drivers. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:22:00 CST." <199511301622.KAA01227@jake.lodgenet.com> Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:20:10 -0800 Message-ID: <4875.817755610@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > As it sits now it is applicable to 2.0 2.0.5 and 2.1, but is > about to become dated w.r.t -current ;( I wouldn't sweat that.. We should only really have a mandate to document the current *released* version, not something we're probably not going to unveil until next summer. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 10:28:36 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA08824 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:28:36 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA08817 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:28:33 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA04888; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:22:17 -0800 To: "Eric L. Hernes" cc: Robert Withrow , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Wanted: Examples of ``good practice'' device drivers. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:22:00 CST." <199511301622.KAA01227@jake.lodgenet.com> Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:22:17 -0800 Message-ID: <4886.817755737@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > The doc is at http://www.freebsd.org/~erich/ddwg/ddwg.html, or > I can mail a postscript version. Have you got the SGML lying around as well? I see a whole bunch of edits here, but it'd be easier for me to send them to you as diffs to the original source.. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 10:47:50 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA10319 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:47:50 -0800 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA10310 ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:47:47 -0800 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id MAA02173; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 12:46:37 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199511301846.MAA02173@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Concatenated Drives ... To: scrappy@hub.org (Marc G. Fournier) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 12:46:36 -0600 (CST) Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Marc G. Fournier" at Nov 29, 95 06:04:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Hi... > > I've seen some discussions go by dealing with the > ability to make multiple drives look like one big drive, and I'm > curious as to what is involved in doing so? > > Mainly, isn't that what the swap devices are doing already? > Or is there something extra that needs to be added when combining > several drives into one virtual drive? > > This is purely out of curiosity... An issue at which I am once again looking... I have several "perfect applications" for this but I really don't know a lot about kernel device drivers, so anyone else interested and willing to help - please do! ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 10:50:55 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA10697 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:50:55 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA10692 ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:50:52 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA01126; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:45:48 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511301845.LAA01126@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Increasing size of shared memory segmenty To: dyson@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:45:48 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, taob@io.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511300010.AAA04609@dyson.iquest.net> from "John S. Dyson" at Nov 30, 95 00:10:31 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1526 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > 32M is smaller than the overall limit, (36 bits? 39 bits?) so you should > > be safe, though if you have several of these, you will probably start > > having problems. > > The limit today is 31 Bits :-(. But the code that I am running today > is 39 Bits with perhaps 40 Bits in the offing. It is unlikely that we > will need to use more than a 31 Bit window on a Pentium :-), but now > at least we will be able to have at least 1Tb files with the merged > VM buffer cache scheme. Any chance for windowed access? I'd like to have a 2^63 sized file. The problem is apparently that the mappings are cached based on the virtual address space, when indirecting them through an offset+range mapping would solve the problem nicely. I realize this means adding a range chain at the top level of the buffer cache in the vnode, but this could be reduced to a single compare and only hit the performance if a bit was set saying that the cache data was indirected, and then only if the file size was greater than the mapping limit (it would let you leave it at 31 bits if you wanted). You'd need to steal a bit in the vnode for this, and set it either on open (put it in the in-core vnode) or steal an inode bit and put it on disk. Obviously, I'd prefer an in-core implementation (I'd like to hang the file locks off the vnode instead of the inode as well, so I have ulterior motives). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 11:03:55 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA11960 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:03:55 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA11918 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:03:31 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA01153; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:55:26 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511301855.LAA01153@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Netscape 2.0b3 To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:55:26 -0700 (MST) Cc: lenzi@cwbtwo.bsi.com.br, bde@zeta.org.au, bmk@dtr.com, chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199511301441.PAA07944@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Nov 30, 95 03:41:22 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 929 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > >> Anyone try to use the mail window of the new netscape? It searches > > > >> for the mail spool directory in /usr/spool/mail. Any ideas on how we > > > >> can get get around this? > > > > > > >Naturally, you could fix it if you had the source. > > > > > > > Excuse me, > > > > > > Why just do a simbolic link of the directories > > ln -s /var/mail /usr/spool??? > > Sergio de Almeida Lenzi. > > polluting directories with hard links to fix programs with hardcoded > pathnames is A Bad Thing, IMHO, and always causes confusion when, > after a few {days|weeks|months} one forgets about the existence of > the link. Especially if there is a different solution using > environment variables or program options more like ln -s /var/mail /usr/compat/bsdi/usr/spool 8-). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 11:07:56 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA12302 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:07:56 -0800 Received: from fang.cs.sunyit.edu (fang.cs.sunyit.edu [192.52.220.66]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA12293 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:07:52 -0800 Received: (from chuck@localhost) by fang.cs.sunyit.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) id OAA09623; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:07:37 -0500 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:07:37 -0500 Message-Id: <199511301907.OAA09623@fang.cs.sunyit.edu> In-Reply-To: Terry Lambert "Re: Netscape 2.0b3" (Nov 30, 11:55am) from: chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: Terry Lambert Subject: Re: Netscape 2.0b3 Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Nov 30, 11:55am, Terry Lambert wrote: } Subject: Re: Netscape 2.0b3 } > > > >> Anyone try to use the mail window of the new netscape? It searches } > > > >> for the mail spool directory in /usr/spool/mail. Any ideas on how we } > > > >> can get get around this? } > > > } > > > >Naturally, you could fix it if you had the source. } > > > } > > } > > Excuse me, } > > } > > } > > Why just do a simbolic link of the directories } > > ln -s /var/mail /usr/spool??? } > > Sergio de Almeida Lenzi. } > } > polluting directories with hard links to fix programs with hardcoded } > pathnames is A Bad Thing, IMHO, and always causes confusion when, } > after a few {days|weeks|months} one forgets about the existence of } > the link. Especially if there is a different solution using } > environment variables or program options } } more like ln -s /var/mail /usr/compat/bsdi/usr/spool } } 8-). } The nearest I can figure is that netscape does a uname call and matches it to the operating system...And the default is /usr/spool/mail. Because bsd/os has mail in the same location as FreeBSD. Personally I think netscape should make the mailbox location configurable in the "preferences" section. I guess that'd be too simple. } } Terry Lambert } terry@lambert.org } --- } Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present } or previous employers. }-- End of excerpt from Terry Lambert -- Charles Green UN*X System Administration 22 Powell Ave. Apt. B UN*X Security & Whitesboro, NY 13492 Programming From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 11:45:35 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA15743 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:45:35 -0800 Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [192.216.222.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA15738 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:45:33 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by who.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.11) with ESMTP id LAA18676 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:45:14 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA01261; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 12:38:18 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511301938.MAA01261@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: seekdir broken.. To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 12:38:18 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511301149.DAA11852@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Nov 30, 95 03:49:24 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 5003 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > The following code attempts to read a directory, in small gulps.. > > it seems silly, but there is a reason for doing this in WINE. > The code THINKS it;s stepping through the directory.. > but in fact as we can see, the seekdir is having NO effect at all, > so we just keep getting the first two entries over and over.. > > any ideas? > this breaks WINE big-time.. > I'm AMAZED nothing else breaks.. > the readdir code is SHIT! > you can't read two directories at once because it uses static > elements! Man page says: ========================================================================== The readdir() function returns a pointer to the next directory entry. It returns NULL upon reaching the end of the directory or detecting an in- valid seekdir() operation. The telldir() function returns the current location associated with the named directory stream. The seekdir() function sets the position of the next readdir() operation on the directory stream. The new position reverts to the one associated with the directory stream when the telldir() operation was performed. Values returned by telldir() are good only for the lifetime of the DIR pointer, dirp, from which they are derived. If the directory is closed and then reopened, the telldir() value may be invalidated due to unde- tected directory compaction. It is safe to use a previous telldir() val- ue immediately after a call to opendir() and before any calls to readdir(). ========================================================================== It is bogus to open and close the directory and expect the token to live past the life of the open. It is bogus to do the telldir() before the readdir() and expect a readdir() following a seekdir() to do anything other than return the current location. The telldir() return is a *token*. Assuming the directory has not changed, doing a telldir() *after* the readdir() would work on BSD. The real problem is that for WINE, it wants to have a search context that is a 32 bit value and a drive ID, but the "search context" for a UNIX system is the dir inode number (32 bits) the offset into the dir (32 bits) and the mounted device the inode is on (dev_t -- 32 bits). By converting the findfirst/findnext ot use getdirentries (bletch: see POSIX section on file times updates to understand the "bletch"), you can get directories a block (512 bytes) at a time. By realizing the size of a directory block that is translated to get the entry, you can traverse the entries in a single block at a time. Since a block will contain a minimum of 12 bytes (long + short + short + 4 byte aligned name of 1-3 bytes), this give you a maximum of 512/12 entries in a block, worst case (you need 6 bits for this number). So you steal 8 bits, and the other 24 are the offset of the 512 byte block in the directory. The 8 bits are the offset into the directory of the entry: the lexical offset, not the 12 adjusted offset. A "findnext" consists of getting block # (off & 0x00ffffff) by seeking and calling getdents with a 512 byte buffer, then linearly traversing the entries in the particular buffer to get the ((off >> 24) & 0x000000ff)th entry. This will work portably on any POSIX system, since the directory block read system call is a mandated POSIX system call. The "correct" mechanism for handling this is to rewrite the WINE interface and the VOP_READDIR interface to get rid of the stupid cookies necessitated by rewriting the dricetory entry layout into the user buffer prematurely. The VOP_READDIR topic has been discussed to death on this list before; the majority don't want to provide an export interface for it for system call and NFS interface consumers, so the problem remains. > I think I'm going over to see what NetBSD have done about this.. They handle their "cookies" differently, so they luck out. This doesn't mean their handling is correct: in point of fact, there should be *no* cookies whatsoever. The NFS client "file at a time" requests that they are provided for could be handled cleanly in the NFS export layer without a great deal of difficulty, if one existed. The additional expense is a directory entry "VOP_PARSEDIR", which for UFS would be a NULL OP. The object would be to convert the block, which would be a buffer pointer to the block buffer in the vnode, to the interface expected by the consumer. Since no VOP_READDIR consumers actually have a smaller structure than (struct dirent), there is no failure mode in doing this. It *will* cause a reduction in the number of entries returned per getdireentries call, but since an EOF is signalled by 0 entries returned, this will not effect typical operation for anything other than NFS. And on NFS, the limiting factor is wire time, not computation, in any case. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 11:56:54 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA17112 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:56:54 -0800 Received: from bigbird.vmicls.com (bigbird.vmicls.com [198.17.96.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA17101 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:56:52 -0800 Received: from gonzo by bigbird.vmicls.com (8.6.9/SMI-4.1-vmicls-master-host-1) id OAA14518; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:59:24 -0500 From: Jerry.Kendall@vmicls.com (Jerry Kendall) Organization: VMI Communications and Learning Systems Received: by gonzo (5.0/vmi-client-host-1) id AA16438; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:59:22 +0500 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:59:22 +0500 Message-Id: <9511301959.AA16438.gonzo@vmicls.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: netboot - Diskless X server with 2.0.5R X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII content-length: 544 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Ok..... Got ALL the info I need to setup a diskless server and have it run X. Thanks to all those who replied with some info. However. Now it comes down to booting the 386DX40 from the Pentium over the network. I have a NE2000 compatible ether on the 386 and have no luck getting it to boot over the ether. The port address is 0x300, IRQ is 5. - I have modified the Makefile in the netboot src dir as the comments say. ----- When I run 'netboot.com' on the 386, the machine just goes beep, beep, beep,...... until I reset it. Jerry From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 12:35:36 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id MAA21260 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 12:35:36 -0800 Received: from spot.lodgenet.com (lodgenet.iw.net [204.157.148.88]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA21246 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 12:35:20 -0800 Received: from jake.lodgenet.com (jake.lodgenet.com [204.124.120.30]) by spot.lodgenet.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id OAA09039 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:35:36 -0600 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jake.lodgenet.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id OAA11866 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:54:02 -0600 Message-Id: <199511302054.OAA11866@jake.lodgenet.com> X-Authentication-Warning: jake.lodgenet.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: ethernet card configuration programs Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:54:01 -0600 From: "Eric L. Hernes" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk this is a linux web page with sources for ethernet card configuration. I've compiled the 3c509, but I haven't tested it yet. http://cesdis.gsfc.nasa.gov/linux/diag/diagnostic.html eric. -- erich@lodgenet.com erich@rrnet.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 12:58:39 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id MAA23226 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 12:58:39 -0800 Received: from iris ([193.170.98.66]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA23220 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 12:58:31 -0800 Received: by iris (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI.AUTO) id VAA06621; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 21:52:00 +0100 From: "Christian Gusenbauer" Message-Id: <9511302150.ZM6619@IRIS> Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 21:50:44 +0100 In-Reply-To: Howard Lew "Re: To all fbsdboot and winboot users ..." (Nov 29, 11:28am) References: Reply-To: cg@www.ati.khs-linz.ac.at X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.2 10apr95 MediaMail) To: Howard Lew Subject: Re: To all fbsdboot and winboot users ... Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Nov 29, 11:28am, Howard Lew wrote: > So is winboot the same as fbsdboot except that it's a windows version? > Or here's a hopeful thought... You don't mean I can boot up FreeBSD and > run it as a task in Windows right? No, winboot exits from Windows and then calls fbsdboot with the right parameters. Christian. -- Christian Gusenbauer cg@www.ati.khs-linz.ac.at From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 13:41:58 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA25434 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 13:41:58 -0800 Received: from server.id.net (root@kilroy.id.net [199.125.1.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA25411 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 13:41:53 -0800 Received: (from rls@localhost) by server.id.net (8.7.1/8.7.1) id QAA00607 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 16:41:48 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Shady Message-Id: <199511302141.QAA00607@server.id.net> Subject: Ifconfig fixed/Now MOUNTD! ;) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 16:41:48 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Okay, the 'ifconfig' alias problem is now taken care of. Turns out, you *MUST* include a netmask of all 255's in the alias statement or it will not work... Needless to say, this leads me to another problem. I'm trying to get this new server running 2.1.0-RELEASE to allow me to export the directories I need to export. Funny thing is, it works *FINE* for *SOME* directories, but others I get this damn error: Nov 30 16:31:29 server mountd[102]: Can't change attributes for /usr/local. Nov 30 16:31:29 server mountd[102]: Bad exports list line /usr/local -maproot Here is my /etc/exports file: ============================= /home -maproot=0 zeus hades /archives -maproot=0 zeus hades /archives/.1 -maproot=0 zeus hades /archives/.2 -maproot=0 zeus hades /virtual -maproot=0 zeus hades /usr/local -maproot=0 zeus hades /var/mail -maproot=0 zeus hades /var/log -maproot=0 zeus hades And here is my disk layout... ============================= Filesystem 1K-blocks Used Avail Capacity Mounted on /dev/wd0a 756078 601380 94210 86% / /dev/wd1a 243931 18832 205584 8% /var/log /dev/wd1e 243931 38063 186353 17% /var/mail /dev/wd1f 319387 66088 227748 22% /virtual /dev/wd2a 787022 0 724060 0% /archives/.1 /dev/wd3a 787022 514318 209742 71% /archives/.2 /dev/sd0a 1629440 1322173 176911 88% /samba /dev/sd1a 1629440 965255 533829 64% /home procfs 4 4 0 100% /proc And last but not least, the "ls -al" of /usr/local. =================================================== drwxr-xr-x 13 root wheel 512 Nov 30 09:42 ./ The only "funny" thing I notice, is that typing "mount" shows that the "/" partition is NFS exported... Output of "mount" ================= /dev/wd0a on / (NFS exported, local) /dev/wd1a on /var/log (NFS exported, local) /dev/wd1e on /var/mail (NFS exported, local) /dev/wd1f on /virtual (NFS exported, local) /dev/wd2a on /archives/.1 (NFS exported, local) /dev/wd3a on /archives/.2 (NFS exported, local) /dev/sd0a on /samba (local) /dev/sd1a on /home (NFS exported, local) procfs on /proc (local) Does anybody have any idea what's going on here? -- Rob === _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ Innovative Data Services Serving South-Eastern Michigan Internet Service Provider / Hardware Sales / Consulting Services Voice: (810)855-0404 / Fax: (810)855-3268 / Web: http://www.id.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 14:00:59 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA26551 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:00:59 -0800 Received: from colin.muc.de (colin.muc.de [193.174.4.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA26542 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:00:46 -0800 Received: from [193.174.4.22] ([193.174.4.22]) by colin.muc.de with SMTP id <86030-2>; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:32:17 +0100 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:33:28 +0100 To: jkh@freefall.freebsd.org From: lutz@muc.de (Lutz Albers) Subject: Re: Bug in stable/-current perl? Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk In article <199511290543.VAA13120@freefall.freebsd.org>, Jordan K. Hubbard writes: - -jkh@freefall-> date -Tue Nov 28 21:42:48 PST 1995 - -jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[3]);' -28 -jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[4]);' -10 -jkh@freefall-> perl -e 'printf("%02.2d\n", (localtime())[5]);' -95 - -10? Am I misunderstanding something fundamental about perl's -localtime() call, or should this be an "11"? 10 is correct. Both monthnames and daynames are zero-based (0..11,0..6) in perl. They can be used as offsets in a arry holding month/daynames that way (well, that's th excuse from the camel book). ciao lutz --------------------------------------------------------------------- Lutz Albers | What's good ? Luederitzstr. 14, 81929-Muenchen, Germany | Life's good - email:lutz@muc.de ph: +49-89-93940364 | But not fair at all http://www.muc.de/~lutz fax:+49-89-93940365 | (Lou Reed) Do not take life too seriously, you will never get out of it alive. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 14:11:45 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA27233 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:11:45 -0800 Received: from mail.infinet.com (ns.infinet.com [198.30.154.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA27228 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:11:39 -0800 Received: from p930 by mail.infinet.com with smtp (Smail3.1.28.1 #9) id m0tLH7O-000JviC; Thu, 30 Nov 95 17:06 EST Message-ID: <30BE2BD8.7CAE@cylatech.com> Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 17:10:32 -0500 From: Wilson MacGyver Organization: CylaTech Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0b3 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jake Hamby CC: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Umm.. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Jake Hamby wrote: > MOO-TIFF isn't Motif-compatible, it IS actual OSF/Motif (2.0 I believe). > The low cost comes from the fact that you don't get much (if any?) > technical support for it. You're basically just paying for the Motif > licensing fee, the cost of the CD, and the cost of the Linux port. > > And no, I don't think it's available for FreeBSD, but SWiM, another Motif > 2.0 port, is, for about $149. I saw it at the ACC Bookstore for Linux > and FreeBSD: http://www.acc-corp.com/ And I think X Inside is working on a Motif 2.0 product for FreeBSD. It's suppose to be available soon. http://www.xinside.com They are also working on a OpenGL product for FreeBSD. Pretty neat. (Since work won't let me take the SGI home... :( ) -- Wilson MacGyver macgyver@cylatech.com -------------------------------------- Veni, Vidi, Concidi. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 14:37:10 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA00409 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:37:10 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA00393 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:36:51 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA00199; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:34:46 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199511302234.PAA00199@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Ifconfig fixed/Now MOUNTD! ;) To: rls@kilroy.id.net (Robert Shady) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:34:46 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511302141.QAA00607@server.id.net> from "Robert Shady" at Nov 30, 95 04:41:48 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1425 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Okay, the 'ifconfig' alias problem is now taken care of. Turns out, you > *MUST* include a netmask of all 255's in the alias statement or it will > not work... > > Needless to say, this leads me to another problem. I'm trying to get this > new server running 2.1.0-RELEASE to allow me to export the directories I > need to export. Funny thing is, it works *FINE* for *SOME* directories, > but others I get this damn error: > > Nov 30 16:31:29 server mountd[102]: Can't change attributes for /usr/local. > Nov 30 16:31:29 server mountd[102]: Bad exports list line /usr/local -maproot > > Here is my /etc/exports file: [ ... ] > /usr/local -maproot=0 zeus hades > > And here is my disk layout... [ ... ] > /dev/wd0a 756078 601380 94210 86% / > > And last but not least, the "ls -al" of /usr/local. > drwxr-xr-x 13 root wheel 512 Nov 30 09:42 ./ > > The only "funny" thing I notice, is that typing "mount" shows that the "/" > partition is NFS exported... > > Output of "mount" > /dev/wd0a on / (NFS exported, local) [ ... ] The "/" partition *is* NFS exported. At least a subdir of the thing is:. /usr/local. The attribute can't be changed because it's the FS attributes it's trying to change and the exported FS isn't a mountpoutn, it's a subdir. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 14:44:28 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA00821 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:44:28 -0800 Received: from firepower.com (freespeech.firepower.com [198.4.104.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA00813 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:44:21 -0800 Received: from freedom.firepower.com (freedom.firepower.com [198.4.104.3]) by firepower.com (8.7.1/8.7.1) with ESMTP id HAA11902 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:46:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from wank.FirePower.COM (wank.firepower.com [198.4.104.123]) by freedom.firepower.com (8.7.1/8.7.1) with SMTP id OAA27498 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:43:55 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199511302243.OAA27498@freedom.firepower.com> Received: by wank.FirePower.COM (NX5.67e/NX3.0X) id AA10052; Thu, 30 Nov 95 14:43:57 -0800 Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3 v118.2) X-Nextstep-Mailer: Mail 3.3 (Enhance 1.0) Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.118.2) From: Harold Barker Date: Thu, 30 Nov 95 14:43:50 -0800 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Ifconfig fixed/Now MOUNTD Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk --> -->Needless to say, this leads me to another problem. I'm trying to get this -->new server running 2.1.0-RELEASE to allow me to export the directories I -->need to export. Funny thing is, it works *FINE* for *SOME* directories, -->but others I get this damn error: --> -->Nov 30 16:31:29 server mountd[102]: Can't change attributes for /usr/local. -->Nov 30 16:31:29 server mountd[102]: Bad exports list line /usr/local -maproot --> I had something similar happen to me last night. I am running 2.1.0-R export /var/mail -maproot=0 /d1a -maproot=0 /d2a -maproot=0 /d2a -maproot=0 Then use amd(yuk!) -a /private host /Net *i can not remember the whole command line* This all worked just fine under 2.1.0-SNAP* and 2.1.0-R till yesterday. I changed something but can not remember what. The problem is that amd can not talk to mountd. If i kill mountd and restart it, it helps, but all the local file systems do not get mounted with amd in /Net. Yes i could make it a link on the file server. but i did not. For shits and giggles i added -network=199.89.215 -mask=255.255.255.0, at that point amd was not running and i got something like Nov 30 16:31:29 server mountd[102]: Can't change attributes for /var/mail --- Work MIME/NeXT Mail accepted | Home MIME/NeXT Mail accepted hbarker@firepower.com | hbarker@dsms.com voice 415.462.3013 fax 415.462.3051 | Do or do not, there is no try, Yoda From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 14:48:45 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA01039 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:48:45 -0800 Received: from fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov (fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov [137.75.131.171]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA01032 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 14:48:36 -0800 Received: by fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov (5.57/Ultrix3.0-C) id AA02105; Thu, 30 Nov 95 16:45:23 -0600 Received: by emu.fsl.noaa.gov (1.38.193.4/SMI-4.1 (1.38.193.4)) id AA26118; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:45:21 -0700 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:45:21 -0700 From: kelly@fsl.noaa.gov (Sean Kelly) Message-Id: <9511302245.AA26118@emu.fsl.noaa.gov> To: terry@lambert.org Cc: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, lenzi@cwbtwo.bsi.com.br, bde@zeta.org.au, bmk@dtr.com, chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511301855.LAA01153@phaeton.artisoft.com> (message from Terry Lambert on Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:55:26 -0700 (MST)) Subject: Re: Netscape 2.0b3 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Terry" == Terry Lambert writes: Terry> more like ln -s /var/mail /usr/compat/bsdi/usr/spool Ugh. There goes my immutable, read-only /usr. I guess I better just make a /usr/compat filesystem. -- Sean Kelly NOAA Forecast Systems Laboratory, Boulder Colorado USA When I was a baby, I kept a diary. Recently, I was rereading it. It said, "Day 1 -- Still tired from the move. Day 2 -- Everybody talks to me like I'm an idiot." I was upset because on my second birthday, I went from being one to being two, and my age doubled in a year. I figured at this rate, by the time I'm six, I'll be ninety. -- Steven Wright From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 15:19:17 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA03230 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:19:17 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA03222 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:19:12 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id PAA01053; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:13:56 -0800 To: Robert Shady cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Ifconfig fixed/Now MOUNTD! ;) In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 30 Nov 1995 16:41:48 EST." <199511302141.QAA00607@server.id.net> Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:13:55 -0800 Message-ID: <1051.817773235@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > /archives/.1 -maproot=0 zeus hades > /archives/.2 -maproot=0 zeus hades Why is the indentation on these different? Different use of tabs or spaces in the other lines that work, perhaps? Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 16:24:05 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA07600 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 16:24:05 -0800 Received: from linux4nn.iaf.nl (root@linux4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA07543 ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 16:23:58 -0800 Received: from uni4nn.iaf.nl (root@uni4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.33]) by linux4nn.iaf.nl (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id BAA05898; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 01:26:08 +0100 Received: by uni4nn.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA19224 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Fri, 1 Dec 1995 01:24:20 +0100 Received: by iafnl.es.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA31971 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4); Thu, 30 Nov 1995 23:08:32 +0100 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA01173; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 21:20:56 +0100 From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199511302020.VAA01173@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: Using a SUN monitor To: gclarkii@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 21:20:55 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511300501.XAA04408@main.gbdata.com> from "Gary Clark II" at Nov 29, 95 11:01:18 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 695 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > monitor DataBase so that is covered. > > Does anyone around have a diagram or discription of how to do this? I I have a Sun fieldengineer handbook here, so I can probably help you to the connector pinouts etc. Pse send the Sun part# of the monitor, helps me in searching. > have no problem firing up a soldering iron (I spent 6 years in the Navy > as an ET..:)). Please phone home ;-) Wilko _ __________________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 16:38:28 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA08557 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 16:38:28 -0800 Received: from rocky.sri.MT.net (rocky.sri.MT.net [204.182.243.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA08552 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 16:38:20 -0800 Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.sri.MT.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id RAA24163; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 17:40:47 -0700 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 17:40:47 -0700 From: Nate Williams Message-Id: <199512010040.RAA24163@rocky.sri.MT.net> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Darn Sprint folks Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk If you had email bounce to me in the last 24 hours (it shouldn't have in that short of time, but this is the Internet) and it was important, can you re-send it. Sprint got wiped out in the NorthWest and took out our ISP and most of the outgoing long-distance in the state, and we just got back on-line about 20 minutes ago. Thanks! Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 17:46:18 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA12298 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 17:46:18 -0800 Received: from main.gbdata.com (dial99.phoenix.net [199.3.234.134]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA12255 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 17:44:51 -0800 Received: (from gclarkii@localhost) by main.gbdata.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id TAA00512 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:44:50 -0600 From: Gary Clark II Message-Id: <199512010144.TAA00512@main.gbdata.com> Subject: Thanks on the SUN monitor To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:44:49 -3000 (CST) Reply-To: gclarkii@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 623 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hello, Thanks for the replies on using a SUN monitor under X. I now have my HM-4119 running in 1152x900 with no problems. Here is what I had to do. 1. Get a 5 BNC to VGA cable. 2. Remove the cover and turn the switch to seperate Vsync and Hsync. 3. Use Warner Loshs' config line (The one in the ModeDB.txt does NOT work). 4. Enjoy! Thanks again, Gary -- Gary Clark II (N5VMF) | FreeBSD support and service gclarkii@FreeBSD.ORG | mail info@gbdata.com for information FreeBSD FAQ at ftp.FreeBSD.ORG in ~pub/FreeBSD/docs/freebsd-faq.ascii From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 18:04:35 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA13027 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 18:04:35 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA13022 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 18:04:24 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id SAA13348; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 18:03:39 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199512010203.SAA13348@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: seekdir broken.. To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 18:03:38 -3200 (PST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511301938.MAA01261@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Nov 30, 95 12:38:18 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 3397 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Terry, look at what you just quoted.... > > Man page says: > ========================================================================== > > The seekdir() function sets the position of the next readdir() operation > on the directory stream. The new position reverts to the one associated > with the directory stream when the telldir() operation was performed. > Values returned by telldir() are good only for the lifetime of the DIR > pointer, dirp, from which they are derived. If the directory is closed > and then reopened, the telldir() value may be invalidated due to unde- > tected directory compaction. It is safe to use a previous telldir() val- ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > ue immediately after a call to opendir() and before any calls to ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > readdir(). ^^^^^^^^^ > ========================================================================== This is exactly what is failing..... Note: the only way to "use a previous telldir value" is to do a seekdir(), so opendir(), readdir(), telldir(), closedir(), opendir, seekdir(), readdir() is, according to this, a valid (though dangerous if the dir changes) sequence. in FreeBSD this is not the case on everything else it IS the case.. who's right? > > It is bogus to open and close the directory and expect the token to > live past the life of the open. In some ways I agree, exept that it is known to work on all other systems and it seems to be commonly done > > It is bogus to do the telldir() before the readdir() and expect a > readdir() following a seekdir() to do anything other than return > the current location. but is it bogus to do a seekdir() before the readdir() and expect to get at least SOME effect? it appears that we have totally crippled seekdir.. (why would it be of any use?) all I want it to do is skip past the first two items in the dir I KNOW the token for the dir entry I want is (3), why can't I seekdir to (3)? it just ignores me.. and the next readdir() returns "." (token 1) . telldir() however will return 4 assimng that the read was for item 3 (which it wasn't) > > The telldir() return is a *token*. ok, but it's invariant in this case If you can't use seekdir, to get to a particular point in the directory then what hte F*ck good is it? That's why it's called SEEKdir. if SEEKdir doesn't SEEK then it's BROKEN, RIGHT? > > Assuming the directory has not changed, doing a telldir() *after* > the readdir() would work on BSD. No, telldir after readdir() is quite valid.. it should return the address of the NEXT TOKEN.. > > > The real problem is that for WINE, it wants to have a search context > that is a 32 bit value and a drive ID, but the "search context" for a > UNIX system is the dir inode number (32 bits) the offset into the dir > (32 bits) and the mounted device the inode is on (dev_t -- 32 bits). > you've lost me, sorry, brain in low gear today. > [...] julian +----------------------------------+ ______ _ __ | __--_|\ Julian Elischer | \ U \/ / On assignment | / \ julian@ref.tfs.com +------>x USA \ in a very strange | ( OZ ) 300 lakeside Dr. oakland CA. \___ ___ | country ! +- X_.---._/ USA+(510) 645-3137(wk) \_/ \\ v From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 18:46:46 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA16647 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 18:46:46 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA16618 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 18:46:18 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id TAA00566; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:44:15 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199512010244.TAA00566@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: seekdir broken.. To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:44:14 -3100 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199512010203.SAA13348@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Nov 30, 95 06:03:38 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 3818 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > It is bogus to open and close the directory and expect the token to > > live past the life of the open. > > In some ways I agree, exept that it is known to work on all other > systems and it seems to be commonly done > > > It is bogus to do the telldir() before the readdir() and expect a > > readdir() following a seekdir() to do anything other than return > > the current location. > > but is it bogus to do a seekdir() before the readdir() and > expect to get at least SOME effect? it appears that we have totally crippled > seekdir.. (why would it be of any use?) all I want it to do is skip past > the first two items in the dir I KNOW the token for the dir entry I want > is (3), > why can't I seekdir to (3)? it just ignores me.. and the next readdir() > returns "." (token 1) . telldir() however will return 4 assimng that > the read was for item 3 (which it wasn't) Well, the telldir returns the pointer to get to the *current* position, not the next postion. Seems to me the telldir() is at the wrong place in your sample code. It should *follow* the readdir(). A readdir() after the seekdir() will then return the *next* entry. The problem is that the getdirentries() is a snapshot of a single block. You are guaranteed (only because of the way UFS doesn't cross directory bounds when compressing in a directory block) only the atomicity of blocks, not the atomicity of offsets into blocks. > If you can't use seekdir, to get to a particular point in the directory > then what hte F*ck good is it? That's why it's called SEEKdir. > if SEEKdir doesn't SEEK then it's BROKEN, RIGHT? Well, you are calling telldir *before* you readdir(), then coming back in and doing a seekdir() to the place *it was at before your readdir()*, then doing a telldir(), and then doing a readdir(). Seems to me that the usage is broken. > > Assuming the directory has not changed, doing a telldir() *after* > > the readdir() would work on BSD. > > No, telldir after readdir() is quite valid.. it should return the address > of the NEXT TOKEN.. Then why are you doing it *before*? 8-). > > The real problem is that for WINE, it wants to have a search context > > that is a 32 bit value and a drive ID, but the "search context" for a > > UNIX system is the dir inode number (32 bits) the offset into the dir > > (32 bits) and the mounted device the inode is on (dev_t -- 32 bits). > > you've lost me, sorry, brain in low gear today. DOS can continue a search at any time. Like 30 days from now. Since entries are monotonically increasing in the absense of a free space, entries are never relocated. It is the relocation of entries that makes it impossible to continue the search. In the NetWare file system, once a block is used as a dirblock, it is *never* reused as a data block. Thus NetWare's 32 bit value is the directory entry address itself, on the given drive. Crossing mount points adds a dev_t to the context in UNIX. If each device was only exported once, then a drive letter would map to a single device and there wouldn't be a problem. UNIX has too much context overhead for a DOS search context to sufficiently identify the the next directory entry by its 32 bit value. WINE does what it does because it doesn't understand how to deal with the mapping correctly. Fix the way the mapping is dealt with in WINE and you fix the problem. Closing the directory isn't the way to do it. It seems they are trying to conserve file descriptors. If you used getdirentries, you could make up the required 32 bit ID, no problem. Look at how the SAMBA code creates a DOS search context in the server code in response to a DOS FindFirst from a client machine. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 19:23:59 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA20742 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:23:59 -0800 Received: from clem.systemsix.com (clem.systemsix.com [198.99.86.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA20705 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:23:43 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by clem.systemsix.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id UAA22872; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 20:23:08 -0700 Message-Id: <199512010323.UAA22872@clem.systemsix.com> X-Authentication-Warning: clem.systemsix.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 From: Steve Passe To: Jerry.Kendall@vmicls.com Cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: netboot - Diskless X server with 2.0.5R Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 20:23:06 -0700 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hi, > When I run 'netboot.com' on the 386, the machine just goes > beep, beep, beep,...... until I reset it. I haven't looked at this program lately, but it used to be broken for NE2000 support. The problem was that the probe for the wd card prevented the ne probe from occuring. The solution is to remove wd and 3com support from the boot program. (although I would expect you to get a "card not found" error from this). Another problem I saw someone have once was their believing that netboot.com was a standalone (ie, 'bootable') program. It must be on a DOS SYS diskette and either manually invoked from the DOS command line or invoked from your autoexec.bat file. Try changing the Makefile from: NS8390= -DINCLUDE_WD -DWD_DEFAULT_MEM=0xD0000 NS8390+= -DINCLUDE_NE -DNE_BASE=0x320 NS8390+= -DINCLUDE_3COM -D_3COM_BASE=0x300 to: NS8390= -DINCLUDE_NE -DNE_BASE=0x300 -- Steve Passe | powered by smp@csn.net | FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 19:23:59 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA20740 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:23:59 -0800 Received: from fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (Fieber-John.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA20725 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:23:52 -0800 Received: (from jfieber@localhost) by fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA05831; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 22:23:28 -0500 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 22:23:23 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber X-Sender: jfieber@fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu To: Terry Lambert cc: Peter Marelas , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Documentation.. In-Reply-To: <199511272120.OAA19564@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 27 Nov 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > > Due to all the argueing about the lack of documentation, why dont > > we all stop bitching, and do ourselves a favour by writing docs, on > > what we have experience in, when using freebsd, lets get the handbook > > growing. > > For things like IBCS2, this would be makework. For others, this would Ahem, it certainly would not be makework. Of course, it only needs to be a paragraph or so, but there should be *some* clear statement that FreeBSD offers SCO compatibility, and the (known) extent/limitations of that compatibility. Oh, and by the way you have to turn it on. You can turn it on manually by typing "ibcs2", or to have it loaded automatically at boot, edit /etc/sysconfig appropriately. I can't think of a better place to put this than in a handbook chapter on compatibilty with other systems. If we advertise SCO compatibilty, but the user has to do something to enable it, what the user has to do darn well better be documented. I don't buy the "it has no options, it needs no man page" argument. Besides, some threads on these mailing lists are a testament to the fact that SCO compatibility is *not* as straight-forward as typing ibcs2 and going merrily along your way. (hopefully it will one day be like that...) -john == jfieber@indiana.edu =========================================== == http://fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu/~jfieber ============ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 19:40:20 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA22873 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:40:20 -0800 Received: from fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (Fieber-John.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA22776 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:40:07 -0800 Received: (from jfieber@localhost) by fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA05865; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 22:39:31 -0500 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 22:39:30 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber X-Sender: jfieber@fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu To: Terry Lambert cc: Lyndon Nerenberg , grog@lemis.de, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? In-Reply-To: <199511272347.QAA19930@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 27 Nov 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > You can't get the libraries off the SCO install disk without a lot of > work that varies from SVO minor version to minor version. We're now > limited to people who are aware that COFF format IBCS2 binaries are > what SCO runs, already own SCO systems, and have SCO on a hard drive > somewhere so that they can pull the libraries of an existing system. > > So lets all spend weeks writing stuff up for this limited audience, right? The SCO WordPerfect 6.0 I got the other day has both dynamic and *static* version. I suspect that the audience may be wider than you make it out to be. -john == jfieber@indiana.edu =========================================== == http://fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu/~jfieber ============ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 19:40:51 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA23025 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:40:51 -0800 Received: from crh.cl.msu.edu (crh.cl.msu.edu [35.8.1.24]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA23008 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:40:45 -0800 Received: (from henrich@localhost) by crh.cl.msu.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA03191 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 22:40:42 -0500 From: Charles Henrich Message-Id: <199512010340.WAA03191@crh.cl.msu.edu> Subject: Weird routing errors during boto To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 22:40:42 -2900 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 331 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Anyone have any idea on how to cure this? add net 224.0.0.0: gateway serv1.scnc.k12.mi.us writing to routing socket: File exists add host serv1.scnc.k12.mi.us: gateway localhost: File exists -Crh Charles Henrich Michigan State University henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu http://rs560.msu.edu/~henrich/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 19:44:42 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA23648 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:44:42 -0800 Received: from fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (Fieber-John.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA23632 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:44:37 -0800 Received: (from jfieber@localhost) by fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA05875; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 22:44:10 -0500 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 22:44:10 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber X-Sender: jfieber@fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu To: Sergio Lenzi cc: hackers@freebsd.org, ports@freegsd.org Subject: Re: INGRES 8.9 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 28 Nov 1995, Sergio Lenzi wrote: > Finaly the Ingres version 8.9 bugless (I hope) > is in a USA site (freefall.cdrom.com) > file names: ingresbin.tar.gz and ingressrc.tar.gz I picked up ingressrc.tar.gz a while ago from the original site you put it up on and was rather disappointed that it had no documentation. I fetched the real ingres distribution from Berekley and found all the documentation there. I think it would be best to supply patches that can be applied to the berkely distribution. -john == jfieber@indiana.edu =========================================== == http://fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu/~jfieber ============ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 21:37:17 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA09734 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 21:37:17 -0800 Received: from main.gbdata.com (dial99.phoenix.net [199.3.234.134]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA09439 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 21:35:50 -0800 Received: (from gclarkii@localhost) by main.gbdata.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id XAA01880 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 23:35:50 -0600 From: Gary Clark II Message-Id: <199512010535.XAA01880@main.gbdata.com> Subject: Two monitors (VGA and mono) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 23:35:48 -3000 (CST) Reply-To: gclarkii@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 543 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, Ok, next question:) Anyone know how to have both a monochrome card and a VGA card in the same system? I have a small (7") mono monitor that I would like to use for my text display so I don't have to worry about the SUN monitor blowing on me. Thanks for any help, Gary -- Gary Clark II (N5VMF) | FreeBSD support and service gclarkii@FreeBSD.ORG | mail info@gbdata.com for information FreeBSD FAQ at ftp.FreeBSD.ORG in ~pub/FreeBSD/docs/freebsd-faq.ascii From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 22:05:31 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id WAA14048 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 22:05:31 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA14019 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 22:05:21 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id WAA08412; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 22:04:09 -0800 To: John Fieber cc: Terry Lambert , Lyndon Nerenberg , grog@lemis.de, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 30 Nov 1995 22:39:30 EST." Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 22:04:09 -0800 Message-ID: <8410.817797849@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > The SCO WordPerfect 6.0 I got the other day has both dynamic and *static* > version. I suspect that the audience may be wider than you make it out to > be. Indeed, and speaking from my experience as an ISV who was actively part of SCO's developer program (doing ports of 1-2-3 and NOTES to SCO) I can tell you that SCO's official party line for *years* was "don't use our shared libraries - please link all commercial apps static." There are a lot of static apps out there. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Nov 30 22:05:53 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id WAA14104 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 22:05:53 -0800 Received: from skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (skynet.ctr.columbia.edu [128.59.64.70]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA14039 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 22:05:26 -0800 Received: (from wpaul@localhost) by skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id BAA04309; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 01:05:15 -0500 From: A boy and his worm gear Message-Id: <199512010605.BAA04309@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> Subject: Re: Ifconfig fixed/Now MOUNTD! ;) To: rls@kilroy.id.net (Robert Shady) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 01:05:13 -0500 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199511302141.QAA00607@server.id.net> from "Robert Shady" at Nov 30, 95 04:41:48 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 4546 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Of all the gin joints in all the towns in all the world, Robert Shady had to walk into mine and say: > > Okay, the 'ifconfig' alias problem is now taken care of. Turns out, you > *MUST* include a netmask of all 255's in the alias statement or it will > not work... No mystery there. At least, not to me. :) > Needless to say, this leads me to another problem. I'm trying to get this > new server running 2.1.0-RELEASE to allow me to export the directories I > need to export. Funny thing is, it works *FINE* for *SOME* directories, > but others I get this damn error: > > Nov 30 16:31:29 server mountd[102]: Can't change attributes for /usr/local. > Nov 30 16:31:29 server mountd[102]: Bad exports list line /usr/local -maproot Okay, I think I know the problem here. Note that in your exports file you're exporting /usr/local: > Here is my /etc/exports file: > ============================= > /home -maproot=0 zeus hades > /archives -maproot=0 zeus hades > /archives/.1 -maproot=0 zeus hades > /archives/.2 -maproot=0 zeus hades > /virtual -maproot=0 zeus hades > /usr/local -maproot=0 zeus hades > /var/mail -maproot=0 zeus hades > /var/log -maproot=0 zeus hades But according to 'df' you don't have a seperate /usr/local filesystem: > And here is my disk layout... > ============================= > Filesystem 1K-blocks Used Avail Capacity Mounted on > /dev/wd0a 756078 601380 94210 86% / > /dev/wd1a 243931 18832 205584 8% /var/log > /dev/wd1e 243931 38063 186353 17% /var/mail > /dev/wd1f 319387 66088 227748 22% /virtual > /dev/wd2a 787022 0 724060 0% /archives/.1 > /dev/wd3a 787022 514318 209742 71% /archives/.2 > /dev/sd0a 1629440 1322173 176911 88% /samba > /dev/sd1a 1629440 965255 533829 64% /home > procfs 4 4 0 100% /proc I also looks like you have virtually all of the OS installed directly in /, which is not a complete no-no, but it's a little unusual. The problem is that our NFS does not behave quite like Sun's NFS, which is what you may be used to. I was bamboozled by the same thing until it was explained to me... > And last but not least, the "ls -al" of /usr/local. > =================================================== > drwxr-xr-x 13 root wheel 512 Nov 30 09:42 ./ > > The only "funny" thing I notice, is that typing "mount" shows that the "/" > partition is NFS exported... Yes it does, and do you know why? Because you've exported /archives, and /archives lives on /. With FreeBSD (and 4.4BSD in general, I believe), the kernel stores export information on a per-filesystem basis rather than on a per-directory basis. On other systems, you can have /home/foo and /home/bar as directories on a single filesystem /home and export each directory with different access rights. Not so here: if you export /home/foo, then the kernel associates the export info with the /home filesystem itself. If you then try to export /home/bar, mountd will complain because it will again try to set the export info for /home, which it can't do without mucking up the access rights for the export of /home/foo. By listing /usr/local in your /etc/exports file after /archives, you are actually telling mountd to export the rootfs (/) twice, which it doesn't want to do for you. Unfortunately, the error message it uses to communicate this fact to the user is more than a little opaque. [chop] > Does anybody have any idea what's going on here? > > -- Rob A-yep. :) If you're hell bent on exporting /usr/local and /archives seperately, you're going to have to make one of them a seperate filesystem. Otherwise, you'll have to export all of / if you want to get rid of the error. It would be nice if we could eliminate this limitation, but to do so would require major kernel surgery, which no one seems eager to perform. -Bill -- ============================================================================= -Bill Paul (212) 854-6020 | System Manager Work: wpaul@ctr.columbia.edu | Center for Telecommunications Research Home: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu | Columbia University, New York City ============================================================================= License error: The license for this .sig file has expired. You must obtain a new license key before any more witty phrases will appear in this space. ============================================================================= From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 00:06:22 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA04409 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 00:06:22 -0800 Received: from ra.dkuug.dk (ra.dkuug.dk [193.88.44.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA04370 ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 00:06:14 -0800 Received: (from sos@localhost) by ra.dkuug.dk (8.6.12/8.6.12) id JAA03562; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 09:04:41 +0100 Message-Id: <199512010804.JAA03562@ra.dkuug.dk> Subject: Re: Two monitors (VGA and mono) To: gclarkii@FreeBSD.org Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 09:04:41 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199512010535.XAA01880@main.gbdata.com> from "Gary Clark II" at Nov 30, 95 11:35:48 pm From: sos@FreeBSD.org Reply-to: sos@FreeBSD.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 702 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Gary Clark II who wrote: > > Hi, > > Ok, next question:) > > Anyone know how to have both a monochrome card and a VGA card in the > same system? I have a small (7") mono monitor that I would like to use for > my text display so I don't have to worry about the SUN monitor blowing on me. Once upon a time I had a patch to syscons that allowed exactly this, I don't know if I can find it anymore though, at would require soem serious rewriting anyways. It is pretty simple though.. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team So much code to hack -- so little time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 00:27:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA10824 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 00:27:40 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA10410 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 00:26:27 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id JAA09645; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 09:26:07 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id JAA25436; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 09:26:05 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id JAA22455; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 09:06:10 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199512010806.JAA22455@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: diskless X server using FreeBSD 2.0.5R To: erich@lodgenet.com (Eric L. Hernes) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 09:06:09 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511301804.MAA02298@jake.lodgenet.com> from "Eric L. Hernes" at Nov 30, 95 12:04:37 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 729 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Eric L. Hernes wrote: Just a side-note: > 1) The num-lock thing stumped me for a day or so. > I initially `solved' this by taking the mouse > away, because our machine is only going to > run one `kterm' and switching focus with the > mouse could be confusing to the users. I just > told the X-server to use an unused pty for the > mouse device. I later figured out that you > simply need to turn off num-lock, but not > having a mouse was a better solution for our > situation. It's valid to use /dev/null as ``mouse device''. :-) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 00:30:58 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA11961 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 00:30:58 -0800 Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [192.216.222.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA11952 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 00:30:54 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by who.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.11) with ESMTP id AAA24033 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 00:28:27 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id JAA09641; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 09:26:04 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id JAA25435; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 09:26:03 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id JAA22495; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 09:12:29 +0100 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199512010812.JAA22495@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Ifconfig fixed/Now MOUNTD! ;) To: rls@kilroy.id.net (Robert Shady) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 09:12:29 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199511302141.QAA00607@server.id.net> from "Robert Shady" at Nov 30, 95 04:41:48 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1167 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Robert Shady wrote: > > Okay, the 'ifconfig' alias problem is now taken care of. Turns out, you > *MUST* include a netmask of all 255's in the alias statement or it will > not work... Only if your aliases are in the same network mask as the primary address. (This seems to be the most (ab)used case now.) > Nov 30 16:31:29 server mountd[102]: Can't change attributes for /usr/local. > Nov 30 16:31:29 server mountd[102]: Bad exports list line /usr/local -maproot > Here is my /etc/exports file: > ============================= ... > /archives -maproot=0 zeus hades ... > /usr/local -maproot=0 zeus hades > /dev/wd0a 756078 601380 94210 86% / RTFM exports(5): BUGS The export options are tied to the local mount points in the kernel and must be non-contradictory for any exported subdirectory of the local server mount point. [...] Your /archives and /usr/local are both part of the / file system. So write it as /archives /usr/local -maproot=0 zeus hades -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 01:12:35 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA23155 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 01:12:35 -0800 Received: from mail.infinet.com (ns.infinet.com [198.30.154.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA23143 ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 01:12:29 -0800 Received: by mail.infinet.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #9) id m0tLMeQ-000JsbC; Thu, 30 Nov 95 23:00 EST Message-Id: From: macgyver@infinet.com (Wilson Liaw) Subject: Re: OpenGL and the motif product (fwd) To: freebsd-announce@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 23:00:41 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1508 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Something some of you might be interested. > To: Wilson MacGyver > Subject: Re: OpenGL and the motif product > References: <30B8D764.2EDE@cylatech.com> <30B9F751.794BDF32@xinside.com> <30BA53E6.16C3@cylatech.com> <30BB5083.41C67EA6@xinside.com> <30BC9D7F.187F@cylatech.com> <30BDCD01.2781E494@xinside.com> <30BDF73F.399@cylatech.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > Wilson, > Allow me to bring some clarification. We are currently shipping > OpenGL for FreeBSD. SGI's OpenGL licensing agreement stipulates > that any OpenGL products we ship must be labeled as beta until > they have had a chance to rubber stamp the results of the product > verification test suite. We have run those and passed with flying > colors. We've forwarded our results to SGI and are awaiting their > rubber stamp. In the meantime, we are shipping diskettes labeled > 'beta' and will ship final diskettes to everyone who orders between > now and 'rubber stamp' date. I hope this clears things up for you. > Don't hesitate to email me if you need more information. > Lee > > Wilson MacGyver wrote: > > > > Lee Roder wrote: > > > > > > Wilson, > > > OpenGL is actually available now on Linux and BSD. Were > > > you intending to run it on another OS? > > > > hmm? I thought OpenGL for FreeBSD is still in beta testing? > > -- > > Wilson MacGyver macgyver@cylatech.com > > -------------------------------------- > > Veni, Vidi, Concidi. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 02:50:23 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id CAA11742 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 02:50:23 -0800 Received: from server.id.net (root@server.id.net [199.125.1.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA11735 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 02:50:19 -0800 Received: (from rls@localhost) by server.id.net (8.7.1/8.7.1) id FAA11304; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 05:50:14 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Shady Message-Id: <199512011050.FAA11304@server.id.net> Subject: Re: Ifconfig fixed/Now MOUNTD! ;) To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 05:50:13 -0500 (EST) Cc: rls@kilroy.id.net, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <1051.817773235@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 30, 95 03:13:55 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > /archives/.1 -maproot=0 zeus hades > > /archives/.2 -maproot=0 zeus hades > > Why is the indentation on these different? Different use of > tabs or spaces in the other lines that work, perhaps? Yes, I probably have tabstops set differently, but those two entries are exported just fine. As it turns out, it seems that it may be a bug in mountd. I don't have a problem until I export 'two' different directories from the same file system (the ROOT file system). The first one always goes through okay, but the second one fails with the error message I provided you. When I swapped /archives & /usr/local around, it worked fine for /usr/local, but died on /archives... -- Rob === _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ Innovative Data Services Serving South-Eastern Michigan Internet Service Provider / Hardware Sales / Consulting Services Voice: (810)855-0404 / Fax: (810)855-3268 / Web: http://www.id.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 03:05:24 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA13601 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 03:05:24 -0800 Received: from cwbtwo.bsi.com.br ([200.250.250.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA13570 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 03:04:28 -0800 Received: (from lenzi@localhost) by cwbtwo.bsi.com.br (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA10740; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 09:03:06 GMT Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 09:03:05 +0000 () From: Sergio Lenzi To: John Fieber cc: hackers@freebsd.org, ports@freegsd.org Subject: Re: INGRES 8.9 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Ref documentation. The process I use to "trace bugs" in the source code leads to "rewrite" all the code so an "patch" from the original, will result in a file greater than the sources I offer. It was done as: 1) using an "indent" from unixware it rewrote all the source code in a way it becomes K&R c. 2) use of debug that can trace tasks (again in unixware). 3) use of lint in the all the source code. 4) Changed the structure that define tasks from structure to pointer to typedefs. Of course after that nothing worked at all. (That is the idea). 5) With the help from the debugger and "cscope" (program that makes references within c procedures and calls), I started to make it running. After 2 weeks the references to all procedures wrere fixed. 6) Traced and removed references to a 16bit machine and it's 16 bit integers. 7) Implement of a program that calculates the offset in the pages based in constans from the specific machine "sparc,hpux,intel..." 8) Almost rewritten the equel processor. It only let you define a name say "STUDENT". When later in the program you need to define "A.STUDENT" the scanner reports dupplicate name. So I changed the scanner from tree to list logic, working in the yacc also. After that I wrote a program (system) to control video-shops and with the same code compiled in Unixware, linux or BSD, I installed in 3 video shops from a friend of mine. The system is running by 6 months or so, without ANY problems. In the shops it uses 386DX with 8Mb of memory and 500MB of disk, with a multi serial of 4 ports running a console and 2 dumb terminals. Now there is only Unixware and BSD (linux file systems was week, as sometimes the power goes down and it losts some of the open files). If you're intereste, I can send you a program as an example on how I've done a real application (C written). Very Thanks, Sergio de Almeida Lenzi. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 03:29:14 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA16402 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 03:29:14 -0800 Received: from cwbtwo.bsi.com.br ([200.250.250.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA16372 ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 03:28:58 -0800 Received: (from lenzi@localhost) by cwbtwo.bsi.com.br (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA11724; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 09:27:56 GMT Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 09:27:55 +0000 () From: Sergio Lenzi To: "Julian H. Stacey" cc: ports@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: INGRES 8.9 In-Reply-To: <199511302228.XAA20319@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 30 Nov 1995, Julian H. Stacey wrote: > > > > Well I ftp'd them & had a v. quick look, > For it to be considered a `FreeBSD ported package' > it needs a top Makefile that is > bsd make, not gnu make > (you can have gnus in the work/ subdir) > /usr/ingre/src is unacceptable, > it must reside in /usr/ports/databases/ingres > > /usr/ingres is ... well .. debatable > usr/local & such normally ... oh well. > > anyway I'm out of time, > but it doesnt qualify as a FreeBSD package ... yet, > > Would you like to look at a few of the 400 /usr/ports/*/*/Makefile, > grab the syntax out of a few, & write a makefile & DESC & pkg/ stuff, > > then when you've done that i'll test it & if OK commit it. > > Forgive me if I was misundestood, This is not suposed to be a "port", just an answer to the people that want a "try" in ingres. As I see, the interest is growing, I'll promiss to make a real "PORT", thanks to your assistance. My job in bsi.com.br (an internet provider is taking me almost all of my time). May be in 1 week or later a "port" will be in "place". I am not trying to do just an ingres database that works, it is almost ready, a set of examples on how to work with it using the equel language (building a customer system that manages and prints customer information) stored in a ingres database with the help of a curses/panel library. Sergio de Almeida Lenzi. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 03:58:43 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA18125 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 03:58:43 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA18120 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 03:58:40 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id DAA15970 for hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 03:58:17 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199512011158.DAA15970@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Wine patch submitted to ports@freebsd.org To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 03:58:16 -0800 (PST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 260 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I've submitted a ptch for WINE to both the WINE people and our ports people for a bad bug in WINE that was brought out by out BSD 4.4 readdir() code.. send me mail if you wnat a copy, or hopefully the port people will make a revised port using it.. julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 04:38:52 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA21128 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 04:38:52 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA21120 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 04:38:39 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id XAA16391; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 23:29:53 +1100 Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 23:29:53 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199512011229.XAA16391@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: julian@ref.tfs.com, terry@lambert.org Subject: Re: seekdir broken.. Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Terry, look at what you just quoted.... >> >> Man page says: >> ========================================================================== >>... >> pointer, dirp, from which they are derived. If the directory is closed >> and then reopened, the telldir() value may be invalidated due to unde- >> tected directory compaction. It is safe to use a previous telldir() val- > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >> ue immediately after a call to opendir() and before any calls to > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >> readdir(). > ^^^^^^^^^ >> ========================================================================== >This is exactly what is failing..... Do you have cvs access? :-) The log for telldir says: revision 1.2 date: 1995/01/27 13:51:18; author: dfr; state: Exp; lines: +29 -0 Reclaim memory used for telldir cookies on closedir. I.e., extra work is done to break the underlined documentation. >> It is bogus to open and close the directory and expect the token to >> live past the life of the open. >In some ways I agree, exept that it is known to work on all other >systems and it seems to be commonly done It wastes a lot of memory. Consider a recursive traversal of "/". The original code allocates a telldir cookie for each telldir() call and frees it only for the corresponding seekdir() call. After closedir() there is unlikely to be a matching seekdir() call (unless the application is depending on the cookies living across closedir() and/or knows about the undocumented (#ifdef SINGLEUSE) way of freeing the cookies). Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 05:02:11 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA22700 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 05:02:11 -0800 Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA22691 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 05:01:36 -0800 Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id OAA09790 for hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:02:04 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199512011302.OAA09790@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: A proposal for selective acks To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:02:03 +0100 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 4318 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I posted this recently on comp.protocols.tcp.ip I believe this is something that could be implemented without much difficulty in FreeBSD (possibly in -current), and almost without side effects to the rest of the kernel. I would appreciate receiving opinions from you guys. It appears that selective acks (SACKs) were a popular subject 5-10 years ago, to the point that NETBLT [RFC998] included them, and there was even a proposal for TCP [RFC1072]. I have a proposal for an efficient encoding of the SACK option described in RFC1072. In the following I assume that the reader has read the section of RFC1072 dealing with selective ACKS (which is a nice reading, as most papers from Van Jacobson). Comments are solicited and welcome. Luigi ----------- The proposal for SACKs by Van Jacobson [RFC1072] is very clear and detailed about a possible implementation, to the point that one wonders why they haven't been actually included in RFC1323 and implemented. A possible explaination is that the SACK option, as specified in RFC1072, might suffer from the limited amount of space available for TCP options. This only enables to selectively ack a limited number of out-of-sequence segments, thus reducing the effectiveness of the mechanism. The problem comes from the need of passing both the relative origin and the size of each segment, totalling 4 bytes per segment. However, consider the typical case in which SACKs would be useful, i.e. the transfer of large blocks of data. In these conditions, the sender should mostly send maximum-sized segments. Now look at the reassembly queue at the receiving station: starting from the first unacked byte, we have a sequence of holes (H) and segments (S), starting with a hole and ending with a segment, as below. HHH SSSS HH SS HH SS HHHH SSSS HH SSS What I expect to see (have not verified, though) is a sequence of Holes-Segments whose size is generally a multiple of the MSS in use for the connection. The only exceptions could possibly be first hole (because of some odd-length communication before the large block of data begins), and the last segment (which may contain less than an MSS because no more data are available). If the above is true, a SACK option could comprise the following fields: h1 the size of the first hole. The hole starts at the point indicated by the ACK field in the header. s1 the size of the last segment ss the GCD of all the remaining segments/holes. This should usually represent the MSS in use. b[] a bitmap indicating which segments (of size ss) are present or not after the first hole lb the number of elements in the bitmap b[]. Actually, only 3 bits are needed for lb because the option length could be used to derive the size of b[] in bytes. Following the description of the SACK option in RFC1072, we could represent h1, s1, ss as 16-bit integers, and use 2 bytes for option kind+len. This would leave up to (44-8)=36 bytes for b[]+lb, i.e. room for over 250 segments. Even if some room is taken by other options (e.g. timestamps), there is still sufficient room to deal with large windows. Note that only ones in b[] are meaningful, so the receiver can deal with the following situations by sending several SACK with different values for h1: * the send window is very large, and the bitmap is not large enough; * for some reason (the sender changes to a new MSS which is prime wrt the previous one; or the sender is sending very small segments, etc.) ss becomes very small. As a matter of fact, h1 could be thought of as a "skip" field, thus it might be necessary to encode it with a larger number of bits. Maybe the data in b[] can be compressed further, especially if the losses are not very large (in this case runs of '1' could be encoded efficiently, as in FAX documenta). If the losses become large, though, I suspect that there is little chance for compression. --------- ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 05:20:46 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA23642 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 05:20:46 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA23335 ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 05:15:59 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id OAA11048 ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:14:45 +0100 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id OAA22729 ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:14:44 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.7.1/keltia-uucp-2.6) id NAA13293; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:37:52 +0100 (MET) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199512011237.NAA13293@keltia.freenix.fr> Subject: Re: Becoming a mirror site for FreeBSD To: jmb@kryten.Atinc.COM (Jonathan M. Bresler) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:37:52 +0100 (MET) Cc: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, Jerry.Kendall@vmicls.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, hubs@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Jonathan M. Bresler" at Nov 29, 95 01:49:45 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1393 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8b] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk It seems that Jonathan M. Bresler said: > the easiest way is to use the mirror perl script (its a port > mirror-2.3). i have included the packages file that i use at the end Virgin mirror 2.3 has some serious memory problem, you should get either the patches for 2.3 or switch to 2.8. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #7: Mon Nov 6 21:08:06 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 05:41:12 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id FAA25652 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 05:41:12 -0800 Received: from spot.lodgenet.com (lodgenet.iw.net [204.157.148.88]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA25642 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 05:41:05 -0800 Received: from jake.lodgenet.com (jake.lodgenet.com [204.124.120.30]) by spot.lodgenet.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id HAA12122; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 07:41:39 -0600 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jake.lodgenet.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA24724; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 08:02:27 -0600 Message-Id: <199512011402.IAA24724@jake.lodgenet.com> X-Authentication-Warning: jake.lodgenet.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) cc: erich@lodgenet.com (Eric L. Hernes), freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Subject: Re: diskless X server using FreeBSD 2.0.5R In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 01 Dec 1995 09:06:09 +0100." <199512010806.JAA22455@uriah.heep.sax.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 01 Dec 1995 08:02:27 -0600 From: "Eric L. Hernes" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk J Wunsch writes: >As Eric L. Hernes wrote: > >Just a side-note: > >> 1) The num-lock thing stumped me for a day or so. >> I initially `solved' this by taking the mouse >> away, because our machine is only going to >> run one `kterm' and switching focus with the >> mouse could be confusing to the users. I just >> told the X-server to use an unused pty for the >> mouse device. I later figured out that you >> simply need to turn off num-lock, but not >> having a mouse was a better solution for our >> situation. > >It's valid to use /dev/null as ``mouse device''. :-) Yea, but I found that using /dev/null, the X-server would always chew cpu time. I figured that it was due to /dev/null always being ready to be read, whereas an unused pty would block on read. > >-- >cheers, J"org > >joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE >Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) eric. -- erich@lodgenet.com erich@rrnet.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 06:00:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id GAA26655 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 06:00:40 -0800 Received: from kitten.mcs.com (Kitten.mcs.com [192.160.127.90]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA26649 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 06:00:36 -0800 Received: from mailbox.mcs.com (Mailbox.mcs.com [192.160.127.87]) by kitten.mcs.com (8.6.10/8.6.9) with SMTP id IAA28363 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 08:00:28 -0600 Received: by mailbox.mcs.com (/\==/\ Smail3.1.28.1 #28.5) id ; Fri, 1 Dec 95 08:00 CST Received: by mars.mcs.com (/\==/\ Smail3.1.28.1 #28.5) id ; Fri, 1 Dec 95 08:00 CST Message-Id: Subject: Bootable ATAPI CDROM To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 08:00:27 -0600 (CST) From: "Lars Jonas Olsson" Cc: jonas@mcs.net X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 522 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, An interesting detail I noticed in the manual for a new Pentium board. The BIOS (Phoenix) has as a CD option (together with types 1-39, user, and auto). It says the CD option is used for bootable IDE CDROM. Selects CD option for booting from bootable ATAPI IDE CDROM. I knew that this was posssible (Our Compaq can boot from SCSI CDROM), but didn't know that this BIOS option was available in general clones. Is there any SCSI controller that has bootable CDROM support? Any plans for bootable FreeBSD CD? Jonas From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 07:19:31 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA01251 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 07:19:31 -0800 Received: from sunny.bog.msu.su (dima@sunny.bog.msu.su [158.250.20.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA01244 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 07:19:23 -0800 Received: (from dima@localhost) by sunny.bog.msu.su (8.6.12/8.6.12) id SAA16214; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 18:18:03 +0300 Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 18:18:02 +0300 (????) From: Dmitry Khrustalev To: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Wine patch submitted to ports@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199512011158.DAA18134@freefall.freebsd.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > I've submitted a ptch for WINE to both the WINE people and our ports > people for a bad bug in WINE that was brought out by out BSD 4.4 > readdir() code.. > > send me mail if you wnat a copy, or hopefully the port people > will make a revised port using it.. > > julian > BTW, if someone is porting/considering to port linware, it has the same problem. -Dima From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 08:31:16 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id IAA07487 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 08:31:16 -0800 Received: from dub-img-6.compuserve.com (dub-img-6.compuserve.com [198.4.9.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA07476 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 08:31:10 -0800 Received: by dub-img-6.compuserve.com (8.6.10/5.950515) id LAA07671; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 11:30:39 -0500 Date: 01 Dec 95 11:26:27 EST From: Michael Driver <100304.1120@compuserve.com> To: FreeBSD Subject: Interest in FreeBSD Message-ID: <951201162626_100304.1120_EHV32-2@CompuServe.COM> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I've just read an article in Byte (Dec 95) by Jordan Hubbard regarding FreeBSD. I find this very interesting and would like to keep tabs on the development of future versions. I am a C programmer and interested in expanding my horizons and skills, shortly I will be purchasing a new PC and have been thinking about installing a unix OS on my old 486 25Mhz. I have a 240Mb IDE HDD with 4Mb RAM. Is this sufficient to install FreeBSD; what is the disk space requirements of it. Also how does Linux compare with FreeBSD. I would be interested in finding out about your future development plans and if there are any projects that I may be able to get involved with. I would be grateful for any information you can send to me. Thanks Mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 10:38:34 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA16124 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 10:38:34 -0800 Received: from technix.org (root@pcca71.gallaudet.edu [134.231.56.107]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA16097 ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 10:38:23 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by technix.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA03363; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:44:53 -0500 Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:44:53 -0500 From: Basket Case Message-Id: <199512011844.NAA03363@technix.org> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: mkisofs coredumping when attempting to write to HP SureStore 4020i Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi -- Im trying to get mkisofs to work, but with no luck. When I do: mkisofs -o /dev/cd0a /mnt (where mnt is a dos partition, 650 megs) -- I get the error message of: assertion "omit_version_number" failed: file "mkisofs.c", line 344 Im using mkisofs 1.4 -- the one from ftp.freebsd.com... Am I missing something? Im running 2.1.0-950928-SNAP on a p5/100, 3940W card, etc... Jon From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 10:51:22 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA16940 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 10:51:22 -0800 Received: from gandalf.me.ksu.edu (joed@gandalf.me.ksu.edu [129.130.41.86]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA16931 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 10:51:20 -0800 Received: (from joed@localhost) by gandalf.me.ksu.edu (8.6.10/8.6.9) id MAA02012 for hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:50:48 -0600 From: Joe Diehl Message-Id: <199512011850.MAA02012@gandalf.me.ksu.edu> Subject: re: xconsole problems To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:50:47 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1079 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk There have been a couple of question posted resently regarding problems with xconsole not being able to open the console... Regretfully, I no longer have the orginal messages anywhere, so I am unable to simply reply to it... I also had this problem, but located the problem in my .xsession file... My problem was that I was loading an xterm with a switch to capture console messages ('xterm -C'). As soon as I removed the '-C' switch, xconsole was able to run just fine. Check your .xsession (or .xinitrc, as the case may be) for any programs besides xconsole who wants the console messages. BTW- As a side note, I also had to add 'chown root /dev/console' to my rc file... I would login as standard user (causing /dev/console to be owned by that user), suing to root, and rebooting. When XDM came up, after the reboot, I had no keyboard (I waited about 5 days once)... The cause was that root didn't own /dev/console. I am running a brand new install of FreeBSD 2.1.0-RELEASE... --- Joe Diehl Engineering Computing Center Kansas State University From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 11:24:34 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA18802 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 11:24:34 -0800 Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA18791 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 11:24:30 -0800 Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.6.12/8.6.9.1) id MAA04815 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:24:29 -0700 From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199512011924.MAA04815@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:24:29 -0700 (MST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 718 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Greetings! Well, as "expected", no clear concensus regarding 4G drives! :-/ I've been chasing down specs in the hopes of predicting how hot these guys run. Unfortunately, there seems to be little correlation between Pd and reported case temperatures (and I note that the 3243 I was chasing seems to be one of the nastiest wrt Pd!). Are these things comfortable in an external enclosure (e.g., two drives in a dual drive enclosure with a single fan)? Just how "hot" is "hot"? Likewise, is Icc(startup) going to require sequencing the spindles on the drives? Or, is this of such a transient nature that it is inconsequential (me thinks the supplies are 60W)? Again, thanx for any advice/pointers! --don From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 11:40:13 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA19817 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 11:40:13 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA19812 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 11:40:05 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA02118; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:36:05 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199512011936.MAA02118@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? To: jfieber@indiana.edu (John Fieber) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:36:04 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, lyndon@orthanc.com, grog@lemis.de, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "John Fieber" at Nov 30, 95 10:39:30 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1053 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > You can't get the libraries off the SCO install disk without a lot of > > work that varies from SVO minor version to minor version. We're now > > limited to people who are aware that COFF format IBCS2 binaries are > > what SCO runs, already own SCO systems, and have SCO on a hard drive > > somewhere so that they can pull the libraries of an existing system. > > > > So lets all spend weeks writing stuff up for this limited audience, right? > > The SCO WordPerfect 6.0 I got the other day has both dynamic and *static* > version. I suspect that the audience may be wider than you make it out to > be. Install process for WP, please? Note that with IBCS2 installed at all, static binaries "just work". For installing IBCS2 for use by static binaries, the procedure is saying "yes" when it asks if you want it to run be default when you install FreeBSD, or andswering "no" and reading the source code. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 11:41:44 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA19868 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 11:41:44 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA19857 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 11:41:40 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA02101; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:33:23 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199512011933.MAA02101@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Documentation.. To: jfieber@indiana.edu (John Fieber) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:33:23 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, maral@webnet.com.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "John Fieber" at Nov 30, 95 10:23:23 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1549 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > Due to all the argueing about the lack of documentation, why dont > > > we all stop bitching, and do ourselves a favour by writing docs, on > > > what we have experience in, when using freebsd, lets get the handbook > > > growing. > > > > For things like IBCS2, this would be makework. For others, this would > > Ahem, it certainly would not be makework. Of course, it only needs to be > a paragraph or so, but there should be *some* clear statement that FreeBSD > offers SCO compatibility, and the (known) extent/limitations of that > compatibility. Oh, and by the way you have to turn it on. You can turn > it on manually by typing "ibcs2", or to have it loaded automatically at > boot, edit /etc/sysconfig appropriately. I can't think of a better place > to put this than in a handbook chapter on compatibilty with other systems. Documenting processes which are on the block to be intentionally obsoleted is a waste of time. Like how to manually set up IBCS2, when the document will quickly become useless when install/config does it all for you. > Besides, some threads on these mailing lists are a testament to the fact > that SCO compatibility is *not* as straight-forward as typing ibcs2 and > going merrily along your way. (hopefully it will one day be like > that...) I think the assumption that it was was a bad assumption on your part. Read the terms of your SCO License. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 11:48:11 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA20275 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 11:48:11 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA20163 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 11:47:51 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA02176; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:46:00 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199512011946.MAA02176@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Wine patch submitted to ports@freebsd.org To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:46:00 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199512011158.DAA15970@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Dec 1, 95 03:58:16 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 427 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > I've submitted a ptch for WINE to both the WINE people and our ports > people for a bad bug in WINE that was brought out by out BSD 4.4 > readdir() code.. > > send me mail if you wnat a copy, or hopefully the port people > will make a revised port using it.. I'd like a patch. 8-). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 11:48:22 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA20292 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 11:48:22 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA20147 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 11:47:02 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA02146; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:42:47 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199512011942.MAA02146@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:42:47 -0700 (MST) Cc: jfieber@indiana.edu, terry@lambert.org, lyndon@orthanc.com, grog@lemis.de, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <8410.817797849@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Nov 30, 95 10:04:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1482 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Indeed, and speaking from my experience as an ISV who was actively > part of SCO's developer program (doing ports of 1-2-3 and NOTES to > SCO) I can tell you that SCO's official party line for *years* was > "don't use our shared libraries - please link all commercial apps > static." > > There are a lot of static apps out there. You have the SCO compatible "install" script written yet so you can actually "install as a third party app"? I also happen to know that Lotus 1-2-3's SVR3 port uses the return of the uname as "copy protection" during the install when putting together a binary file that the installed program then references when the application is run. So install is a three-toed bitch, unless you take an SVR3 box, snapshot the whole system, install the package (after changing the system name to match the FreeBSD box name), snapshot the tree again and use the diffs to identify an "install image", tar up an "install image", deinstall the binaries on the SVR3 system, and change the name of the SVR3 system back. Then you take the tar image and put it on the BSD box. Installing Sybase, Word, MS BASIC, and FoxBase are all similarly involved. Without IBCS2 install tools all you are doing is taking a person with an uloaded gun, loading it for them, and saying "aim for your foot". Better that you not load the gun. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 12:30:17 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id MAA22770 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:30:17 -0800 Received: from bang.rain.com (bang.rain.com [199.2.100.61]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA22764 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:30:13 -0800 Received: (from john@localhost) by bang.rain.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA06452 for hackers@FreeBSD.org; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:30:04 -0800 From: John Cavanaugh Message-Id: <199512012030.MAA06452@bang.rain.com> Subject: Upgrading to 2.1.0-RELEASE from 2.1-STABLE To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:30:04 -0800 (PST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 475 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I have a: FreeBSD bang.rain.com 2.1-STABLE FreeBSD 2.1-STABLE #0: Sat Jul 29 05:58:29 1995 root@burn3.aac.dev.com:/usr/src/sys/compile/BANG i386 system that I want to upgrade to 2.1-RELEASE. Can I just got the boot.flp and do the upgrade option? I know the docs talk about the upgrade option working for 2.0.5->2.1 but I didn't know if I could do it from stable to release. Thanks. -- John Cavanaugh "There can be only one." From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 12:34:12 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id MAA23146 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:34:12 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA23140 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:34:09 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id MAA01910; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:33:40 -0800 To: "Lars Jonas Olsson" cc: hackers@freebsd.org, jonas@mcs.net Subject: Re: Bootable ATAPI CDROM In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 01 Dec 1995 08:00:27 CST." Date: Fri, 01 Dec 1995 12:33:40 -0800 Message-ID: <1908.817850020@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk If I can do it in a fairly unobtrusive way then I certainly might consider it, but I'd have to know the nitty-gritty details behind genning a bootable CD image! :-( Jordan > Hi, > An interesting detail I noticed in the manual for a new Pentium board. > The BIOS (Phoenix) has as a CD option (together with types 1-39, user, > and auto). It says the CD option is used for bootable IDE CDROM. Selects > CD option for booting from bootable ATAPI IDE CDROM. > I knew that this was posssible (Our Compaq can boot from SCSI CDROM), > but didn't know that this BIOS option was available in general clones. > Is there any SCSI controller that has bootable CDROM support? > Any plans for bootable FreeBSD CD? > > Jonas From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 12:40:03 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id MAA23498 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:40:03 -0800 Received: from Sysiphos (Sysiphos.MI.Uni-Koeln.DE [134.95.212.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA23449 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:39:54 -0800 Received: by Sysiphos id AA15693 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for hackers@freebsd.org); Fri, 1 Dec 1995 21:24:58 +0100 Message-Id: <199512012024.AA15693@Sysiphos> From: se@zpr.uni-koeln.de (Stefan Esser) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 21:24:58 +0100 In-Reply-To: Terry Lambert "Re: Wine patch submitted to ports@freebsd.org" (Dec 1, 12:46) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(2) 7/9/95) To: Terry Lambert Subject: Re: Wine patch submitted to ports@freebsd.org Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Dec 1, 12:46, Terry Lambert wrote: } Subject: Re: Wine patch submitted to ports@freebsd.org } > I've submitted a ptch for WINE to both the WINE people and our ports } > people for a bad bug in WINE that was brought out by out BSD 4.4 } > readdir() code.. } > } > send me mail if you wnat a copy, or hopefully the port people } > will make a revised port using it.. } } I'd like a patch. 8-). Julian posted it to a news group, and I'm in the process of doing the CVS commit (which already took more than a minute to draw the first half of the commit form in VI). I'm currently suffereing from 90% packet loss on the connection to Freefall ... :( STefan -- Stefan Esser, Zentrum fuer Paralleles Rechnen Tel: +49 221 4706021 Universitaet zu Koeln, Weyertal 80, 50931 Koeln FAX: +49 221 4705160 ============================================================================== http://www.zpr.uni-koeln.de/~se From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 12:48:13 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id MAA24036 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:48:13 -0800 Received: from news1.gtn.com (news1.gtn.com [192.109.159.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA23906 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:48:01 -0800 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by news1.gtn.com (8.7.2/8.7.2) id VAA06480; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 21:30:09 +0100 (MET) >Received: from knobel.gun.de (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by knobel.gun.de (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA01613; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 20:18:16 +0100 Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 20:18:15 +0100 (MET) From: Andreas Klemm To: Lyndon Nerenberg cc: Peter da Silva , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: More nits In-Reply-To: <199511262337.PAA13606@multivac.orthanc.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 26 Nov 1995, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote: > My biggest complaint with the ports stuff right now is the way it > scribbles all over /usr/local. Even worse, it isn't consistent (e.g. > binaries installed in /usr/bin and support stuff under /usr/local/lib). > /usr/local should be HANDS OFF to the vendor-supplied software, something > I consider "ports" to be. > > The ports software should be configured to install into either the > standard directory tree, or into a seperate /usr/ports hierarchy. What about /usr/ports/NameOfPackage/{bin,man,lib,include,info,doc} And - to have only one path in $PATH and $MANPATH - symlinks of every package in: /usr/ports/{bin,man,lib,include,info} Makes it easier to see, what belongs to a port. I generally dislike a /usr/local/bin directory with about 327 utilities ... -- andreas@knobel.gun.de /\/\___ Wiechers & Partner Datentechnik GmbH Andreas Klemm ___/\/\/ - Support Unix - aklemm@wup.de - \/ ftp://sunsite.unc.edu/pub/Linux/system/Printing/aps-491.tgz apsfilter - magic print filter 4lpd >>> knobel is powered by FreeBSD <<< From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 13:30:49 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA25835 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:30:49 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA25830 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:30:44 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA02073; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:30:43 -0800 To: Michael Driver <100304.1120@compuserve.com> cc: FreeBSD Subject: Re: Interest in FreeBSD In-reply-to: Your message of "01 Dec 1995 11:26:27 EST." <951201162626_100304.1120_EHV32-2@CompuServe.COM> Date: Fri, 01 Dec 1995 13:30:43 -0800 Message-ID: <2071.817853443@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Michael, Thank you for writing to us. There are many things you could do, and I'm currently working on a document for people interested in contributing to FreeBSD. I will be releasing this in the next couple of days. For now, I would recommend subscribing to one of our mailing lists - send mail to majordomo@freebsd.org and say `subscribe hackers'. Jordan > Hi, > I've just read an article in Byte (Dec 95) by Jordan Hubbard regarding FreeBS D. > I find this very interesting and would like to keep tabs on the development o f > future versions. I am a C programmer and interested in expanding my horizons and > skills, shortly I will be purchasing a new PC and have been thinking about > installing a unix OS on my old 486 25Mhz. > I have a 240Mb IDE HDD with 4Mb RAM. Is this sufficient to install FreeBSD; w hat > is the disk space requirements of it. > Also how does Linux compare with FreeBSD. > > I would be interested in finding out about your future development plans and if > there are any projects that I may be able to get involved with. > I would be grateful for any information you can send to me. > Thanks > Mike > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 13:33:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA25945 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:33:40 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA25917 ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:33:25 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA02459; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:31:29 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199512012131.OAA02459@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: mkisofs coredumping when attempting to write to HP SureStore 4020i To: jon@technix.org (Basket Case) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:31:29 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199512011844.NAA03363@technix.org> from "Basket Case" at Dec 1, 95 01:44:53 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 633 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Im trying to get mkisofs to work, but with no luck. When I do: > mkisofs -o /dev/cd0a /mnt > > (where mnt is a dos partition, 650 megs) -- I get the error message of: > assertion "omit_version_number" failed: file "mkisofs.c", line 344 You have to use a *lot* options. See the man page for examples. The command line you gave looks like you are tyying to mount a CDROM. You *do* know that mkisofs is for use on magnetic media to make images that can be *later* burned into CDROM, right? Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 13:40:17 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA26457 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:40:17 -0800 Received: from technix.org (root@pcca71.gallaudet.edu [134.231.56.107]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA26377 ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:40:04 -0800 Received: (from jon@localhost) by technix.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA04242; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:46:24 -0500 Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:46:24 -0500 (EST) From: Basket Case To: Terry Lambert cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: mkisofs coredumping when attempting to write to HP SureStore 4020i In-Reply-To: <199512012131.OAA02459@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 1 Dec 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > > Im trying to get mkisofs to work, but with no luck. When I do: > > mkisofs -o /dev/cd0a /mnt > > > > (where mnt is a dos partition, 650 megs) -- I get the error message of: > > assertion "omit_version_number" failed: file "mkisofs.c", line 344 > > You have to use a *lot* options. See the man page for examples. > > The command line you gave looks like you are tyying to mount a CDROM. > You *do* know that mkisofs is for use on magnetic media to make images > that can be *later* burned into CDROM, right? > > > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org > --- > Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present > or previous employers. > Yes, as stated in the subject, I am using a HP SureStore 4020i, which is a CD-R. Ive tried variety of command line parameters to no avail. In fact, one of the emails said that all command line parameters don't really work, except -o, which is output. I'm trying to copy everything in /mnt to the cdrom. When using the linux mkisofs, it works fine -- sends things to the data bus, and so forth, but the cd doesnt even write. The one for fbsd (ported for fbsd) doesn't work... So where am I going wrong? Regards, Jon =--------------------------------Basket Case----------------------------------= = E-Mail: jon@technix.org - Computer Science - C/C++/Pascal/Basic/ASM = = WWW: http://www.technix.org - Systems Administrator - FreeBSD 2.1.0 SNAP = =-----------------------------------------------------------------------------= From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 13:54:07 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA27319 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:54:07 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA27311 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:54:02 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA02168; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:53:02 -0800 To: Terry Lambert cc: jfieber@indiana.edu, lyndon@orthanc.com, grog@lemis.de, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 01 Dec 1995 12:42:47 MST." <199512011942.MAA02146@phaeton.artisoft.com> Date: Fri, 01 Dec 1995 13:53:02 -0800 Message-ID: <2166.817854782@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I also happen to know that Lotus 1-2-3's SVR3 port uses the return of > the uname as "copy protection" during the install when putting together > a binary file that the installed program then references when the > application is run. I know. I know the programmer who was responsible for that hack personally, in fact. :-) Fortunately, nobody in their right mind would run the old UN*X version of 1-2-3 so it's kinda moot. I still think that it's possible to derive benefit from the sea of SCO apps out there, even without a working install. Yes, it's harder, but it may also prove in many instances to make the difference between letting a developer keep FreeBSD on his work PC or having his boss demand he load SCO so that he can run some commercial app of import to the company. [insert picture of a sad eyed programmer sitting at a PC running SCO, looking dolefully at the camera] "For little Timmy's sake - isn't it worth it?" Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 13:55:58 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA27403 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:55:58 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA27398 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:55:55 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA02215; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:55:57 -0800 To: Joe Diehl cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: xconsole problems In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 01 Dec 1995 12:50:47 CST." <199512011850.MAA02012@gandalf.me.ksu.edu> Date: Fri, 01 Dec 1995 13:55:56 -0800 Message-ID: <2213.817854956@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > BTW- As a side note, I also had to add 'chown root /dev/console' to > my rc file... I would login as standard user (causing /dev/console "man fbtab" :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 13:58:46 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA27567 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:58:46 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA27556 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:58:38 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA02253; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:58:40 -0800 To: Don Yuniskis cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 01 Dec 1995 12:24:29 MST." <199512011924.MAA04815@seagull.rtd.com> Date: Fri, 01 Dec 1995 13:58:40 -0800 Message-ID: <2251.817855120@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > I've been chasing down specs in the hopes of predicting how hot these > guys run. Unfortunately, there seems to be little correlation between > Pd and reported case temperatures (and I note that the 3243 I was chasing > seems to be one of the nastiest wrt Pd!). Well, you could always try the Quantum Grand Prix drives - I've heard that the newest generation are considerably more reliable, and not quite so hot as the 'cudas. > Are these things comfortable in an external enclosure (e.g., two > drives in a dual drive enclosure with a single fan)? Just how "hot" > is "hot"? Hotter than that! :-) I wouldn't recommend it. One drive in a box maybe. Two, well, maybe you could put a hot plate on top and cook your breakfast in the morning.. :-) > Likewise, is Icc(startup) going to require sequencing the spindles on > the drives? Or, is this of such a transient nature that it is No. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 14:03:33 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA27951 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:03:33 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA27946 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:03:26 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id OAA17076 for hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:02:58 -0800 Received: from narkis.wisdom.weizmann.ac.il (narkis.wisdom.weizmann.ac.il [132.76.80.32]) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA16995 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 13:45:30 -0800 Received: from golem.wisdom.weizmann.ac.il (golem.wisdom.weizmann.ac.il [132.76.80.121]) by narkis.wisdom.weizmann.ac.il (8.6.5/mail.byaddr) with ESMTP id XAA10273; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 23:46:06 +0200 From: Greenstein Jacob Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by golem.wisdom.weizmann.ac.il (8.6.5/8.6.5) id XAA21804; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 23:46:03 +0200 Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 23:46:03 +0200 Message-Id: <199512012146.XAA21804@golem.wisdom.weizmann.ac.il> To: green@wisdom.weizmann.ac.il, julian@ref.tfs.com Subject: Re: Problems, 2.1.0-RELEASE/networking/SLIP Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Dear Sir, I have tried slattach from 2.1 with kernel from 2.0.5, and it works. I have also tried slattach from 2.0.5 and kernel from 2.1, and it does not work. Yours sincerely, Jacob From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 14:10:23 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA28408 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:10:23 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA28388 ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:10:09 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id OAA02339; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:10:10 -0800 To: Basket Case cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: mkisofs coredumping when attempting to write to HP SureStore 4020i In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 01 Dec 1995 13:44:53 EST." <199512011844.NAA03363@technix.org> Date: Fri, 01 Dec 1995 14:10:10 -0800 Message-ID: <2337.817855810@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Hi -- > > Im trying to get mkisofs to work, but with no luck. When I do: > mkisofs -o /dev/cd0a /mnt Like I told you in private email - don't do that! :-) Go to a disk file first, then help us get the WORM driver working so you can actually burn the CDs.. :) Also, the "omit version number" is mkisofs's way of saying "give me a version number, dammit!" It's not very robust, I know, but mkisofs needs a make-over. Here's the command line I use to make the FreeBSD CD: mkisofs -a -d -N -D -R -T -V "FREEBSD210A" -P "Walnut Creek CDROM 1-510-674-078 3 FAX 1-510-674-0821" -o /mnt/a/cd0 /usr/tmp/freebsd-2.1/disc1 Where /usr/tmp/freebsd-2.1/disc1 is the tree and /mnt/a/cd0 is the disk image I burn afterwards. Jordan > > (where mnt is a dos partition, 650 megs) -- I get the error message of: > assertion "omit_version_number" failed: file "mkisofs.c", line 344 > > Im using mkisofs 1.4 -- the one from ftp.freebsd.com... Am I missing somethi ng? > Im running 2.1.0-950928-SNAP on a p5/100, 3940W card, etc... > > Jon From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 14:11:12 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA28460 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:11:12 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA28451 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:11:07 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id OAA02350; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:10:50 -0800 To: John Cavanaugh cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Upgrading to 2.1.0-RELEASE from 2.1-STABLE In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 01 Dec 1995 12:30:04 PST." <199512012030.MAA06452@bang.rain.com> Date: Fri, 01 Dec 1995 14:10:49 -0800 Message-ID: <2348.817855849@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Erm. Why? You basically have it already! :-) > Hi, I have a: > > FreeBSD bang.rain.com 2.1-STABLE FreeBSD 2.1-STABLE #0: Sat Jul 29 05:58:29 1995 root@burn3.aac.dev.com:/usr/src/sys/compile/BANG i386 > > system that I want to upgrade to 2.1-RELEASE. Can I just got the boot.flp > and do the upgrade option? I know the docs talk about the upgrade > option working for 2.0.5->2.1 but I didn't know if I could do it > from stable to release. Thanks. > -- > John Cavanaugh "There can be only one." From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 14:13:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA28643 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:13:40 -0800 Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA28633 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:13:35 -0800 Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.6.12/8.6.9.1) id PAA11086; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:13:26 -0700 From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199512012213.PAA11086@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:13:26 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <2251.817855120@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Dec 1, 95 01:58:40 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 590 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > Are these things comfortable in an external enclosure (e.g., two > > drives in a dual drive enclosure with a single fan)? Just how "hot" > > is "hot"? > > Hotter than that! :-) I wouldn't recommend it. One drive in a box > maybe. Two, well, maybe you could put a hot plate on top and cook > your breakfast in the morning.. :-) Yikes! It seems that the drives tend to run 10 to 15W (typical). My tape drive is in the same case (single full height 5") and it doesn't seem to complain or get too hot -- in fact, the case barely gets warm! Am I missing something here?? Thx, don From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 14:22:03 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA29073 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:22:03 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA29063 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:21:56 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id OAA02452; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:21:53 -0800 To: Don Yuniskis cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 01 Dec 1995 15:13:26 MST." <199512012213.PAA11086@seagull.rtd.com> Date: Fri, 01 Dec 1995 14:21:53 -0800 Message-ID: <2449.817856513@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Yikes! It seems that the drives tend to run 10 to 15W (typical). My > tape drive is in the same case (single full height 5") and it doesn't > seem to complain or get too hot -- in fact, the case barely gets warm! > Am I missing something here?? Yeah, tape drives != disk drives. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 14:36:29 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA29944 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:36:29 -0800 Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA29936 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:36:20 -0800 Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.6.12/8.6.9.1) id PAA11910; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:36:09 -0700 From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199512012236.PAA11910@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:36:09 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <2449.817856513@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Dec 1, 95 02:21:53 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 476 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > Yikes! It seems that the drives tend to run 10 to 15W (typical). My > > tape drive is in the same case (single full height 5") and it doesn't > > seem to complain or get too hot -- in fact, the case barely gets warm! > > Am I missing something here?? > > Yeah, tape drives != disk drives. :-) Yeah but power is power. If you dissipate 10 - 15W, it doesn't matter *what* is dissipating the power! So, 2X would be in the 20 - 30W range (comparable to the tape drive). From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 14:56:04 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA01125 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:56:04 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA01080 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:55:59 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id OAA17244; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:55:22 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199512012255.OAA17244@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) To: dgy@rtd.com (Don Yuniskis) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:55:22 -0800 (PST) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199512012213.PAA11086@seagull.rtd.com> from "Don Yuniskis" at Dec 1, 95 03:13:26 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1556 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > > > Are these things comfortable in an external enclosure (e.g., two > > > drives in a dual drive enclosure with a single fan)? Just how "hot" > > > is "hot"? > > > > Hotter than that! :-) I wouldn't recommend it. One drive in a box > > maybe. Two, well, maybe you could put a hot plate on top and cook > > your breakfast in the morning.. :-) he's not kidding.. I have a 3GB Hitachio drive here that's cooked itself because it was put in a normal PC cabinet.. when it failed, I openned the cabinet and touched the drive to see if it was mounted solidly.. Literally I burned myself It didn't QUITE blister, but I had a red mark on my finger for four days.. since then I've started looking at this, and found several instances where the drive was too hot to touch.. remember it's not the wattage, it's how fst you can DISIPATE that wattage. a soldering Iron is often only 15 Watts, but it gets to, what, 300+ degrees F? > > Yikes! It seems that the drives tend to run 10 to 15W (typical). My > tape drive is in the same case (single full height 5") and it doesn't > seem to complain or get too hot -- in fact, the case barely gets warm! > Am I missing something here?? > > Thx, > don +----------------------------------+ ______ _ __ | __--_|\ Julian Elischer | \ U \/ / On assignment | / \ julian@ref.tfs.com +------>x USA \ in a very strange | ( OZ ) 300 lakeside Dr. oakland CA. \___ ___ | country ! +- X_.---._/ USA+(510) 645-3137(wk) \_/ \\ v > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 14:58:04 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA01247 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:58:04 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA01237 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:57:59 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id OAA03596; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 14:57:58 -0800 To: Don Yuniskis cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 01 Dec 1995 15:36:09 MST." <199512012236.PAA11910@seagull.rtd.com> Date: Fri, 01 Dec 1995 14:57:57 -0800 Message-ID: <3594.817858677@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Yeah but power is power. If you dissipate 10 - 15W, it doesn't matter > *what* is dissipating the power! So, 2X would be in the 20 - 30W range > (comparable to the tape drive). Actually, you and I both know that's not true because we know that power dissipation is only part of the equation. There's also the question of *where* the power is turning most fully into heat and how effective your air conditioning (or other heat transfering metal-to-metal contact) is at that point. You're also assuming that the power dissipation specs for hard drives can always be believed, something I actually have strong reason to doubt in at least several cases. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 15:04:38 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA01763 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:04:38 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA01753 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:04:30 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id PAA17277; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:03:43 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199512012303.PAA17277@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) To: dgy@rtd.com (Don Yuniskis) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:03:42 -0800 (PST) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199512012236.PAA11910@seagull.rtd.com> from "Don Yuniskis" at Dec 1, 95 03:36:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 414 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk I doubt your tape drive is disipating 15 Watts! that's 3 AMPS at 5V lot bloody likely.. actually some of these drives seem to run quite a bit mor ethan 15 watts. believe me these drives get HOT as in *touch* "OUCH!" julian > > Yeah but power is power. If you dissipate 10 - 15W, it doesn't matter > *what* is dissipating the power! So, 2X would be in the 20 - 30W range > (comparable to the tape drive). > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 15:11:27 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA02225 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:11:27 -0800 Received: from odin.INS.CWRU.Edu (odin.INS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.8.102]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA01894 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:07:30 -0800 Received: (chet@localhost) by odin.INS.CWRU.Edu (8.6.12+cwru/CWRU-2.1-ins) id RAA24765; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 17:16:14 -0500 (from chet) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 17:13:46 -0500 From: Chet Ramey To: arnold@skeeve.atl.ga.us, composer@beyond.dreams.org, friedman@gnu.ai.mit.edu, joshua5@cs.bu.edu, dob@inel.gov, mjo@msen.com, jason@servio.slc.com, timbo@ig.co.uk, trost@cse.ogi.edu, zoo@armadillo.com, lubkin@cs.rochester.edu, james@bigtex.cactus.org, Greg.Onufer@Eng.Sun.COM, kre@munnari.oz.au, tmwalden@saturn.sys.acc.com, torvalds@cc.helsinki.fi, i.watson@lilly.com, glenn@mathcs.emory.edu, penningt@reason.psc.edu, devet@adv.iaehv.nl, grog@lemis.de, djm@eng.umd.edu, wieting@tweety.llnl.gov, geoffc@research.att.com, de5@ornl.gov, kayvan@satyr.sylvan.com, smd@uunet.ca, asjl@connect.com.au, mark@comp.vuw.ac.nz, david@cs.dal.ca, jwe@che.utexas.edu, quinlan@best.com, Karl.Kleinpaste@GODIVA.NECTAR.CS.CMU.EDU, bammi@cadence.com, sanders@bsdi.com, tramey@boi.hp.com Subject: Bash-1.14.6 beta 3 now available Cc: sandro@elf.com, drich@sgi.com, carson@cs.columbia.edu, Doug.Becker@Eng.Sun.COM, deven@asylum.sf.ca.us, remy@ccs.neu.edu, freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org, dtm@nsd.3com.com, kjetilho@ifi.uio.no, cam@iinet.com.au, wbader@EECS.Lehigh.Edu, hniksic@neumijko.srce.hr, mwette@csi.jpl.nasa.gov, jsh@canary.com, gjb@gba.oz.au, andreas@MPA-Garching.MPG.DE, pgf@foxharp.boston.ma.us, peterc@suite.sw.oz.au, brown@eff.org, bothner@cygnus.com, tudor@cs.pub.ro, fox@cac.washington.edu, hag@gnu.ai.mit.edu, root@candle.pha.pa.us, neal@ctd.comsat.com, grw@tamu.edu, schwab@issan.informatik.uni-dortmund.de, haible@ma2s2.mathematik.uni-karlsruhe.de, gildea@x.org, rfg@monkeys.com, haahr@netcom.com, eggert@twinsun.com, chet@odin.INS.CWRU.Edu Reply-To: chet@po.CWRU.Edu Message-ID: <9512012213.AA24532.SM@odin.INS.CWRU.Edu> Read-Receipt-To: chet@po.CWRU.Edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk I fixed a couple of minor problems with the second beta release and updated the tar file. A few people asked me to change the tar file name to reflect the beta version, so I have done so. The new version is available with the URL ftp://slc2.ins.cwru.edu/pub/hidden/bash-1.14.6.beta3.tar.gz y.tab.[ch] are now in the archive, and completion and $FIGNORE should play much more nicely together. A couple of machine descriptions were also updated. As always, thanks for your help. Chet -- ``The lyf so short, the craft so long to lerne.'' - Chaucer Chet Ramey, Case Western Reserve University Internet: chet@po.CWRU.Edu From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 15:12:14 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA02342 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:12:14 -0800 Received: from icecream.cs.kiev.ua (icecream.cs.kiev.ua [193.124.54.90]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA02244 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:11:45 -0800 Received: by icecream.cs.kiev.ua (8.6.12/8.6.9) id BAA12151 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 01:10:21 +0200 Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 01:10:21 +0200 Message-Id: <199512012310.BAA12151@icecream.cs.kiev.ua> From: alexis@ww.net Apparently-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 15:25:31 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA03494 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:25:31 -0800 Received: from cwbtr01.bsi.com.br ([200.250.250.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA03438 ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:25:02 -0800 Received: (from lenzi@localhost) by cwbtr01.bsi.com.br (8.6.11/8.6.9) id VAA07420; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 21:28:17 GMT Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 21:28:16 +0000 () From: Sergio Lenzi To: hackers@freebsd.org cc: questions@freebsd.org Subject: mb_map full. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hello all, I have a machine running FreeBSD with 8MB of memory serving as a bridge between 2 suns and an machine that monitors an telephone company central. The BSD machine receives messages via rs232, decodes it and updates an ORACLE database running in a sparc 20 processor. The updates is via rsh command. There are 10 rs232 ports in the BSD machine. The sistem is running and some time, 30min to 3 hours a message appears in the console "mb_map full". I looked at the code and see that comes from the vm logic in the kernel. Can someone please tell me a way to increase that table or a way to solve the problem, Please ??? Sergio de Almeida Lenzi. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 15:29:00 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA03858 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:29:00 -0800 Received: from icecream.cs.kiev.ua (root@icecream.cs.kiev.ua [193.124.54.90]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA03382 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:24:28 -0800 Received: by icecream.cs.kiev.ua (8.6.12/8.6.9) id BAA12207; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 01:23:18 +0200 Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 01:23:18 +0200 Message-Id: <199512012323.BAA12207@icecream.cs.kiev.ua> From: alexis@ww.net (Alexis Yushin) Reply-To: alexis@ww.net Cc: john@starfire.skypoint.net, babkin@icb.chel.su Subject: DigiBoard and FreeBSD To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Salut, I am really going to establish terminal server with DigiBoard 8xe and FreeBSD-2.1-RELEASE. I've got teh card and some drivers in alpha but that didn't satisfy me. I am going to gather and integrate everything concerning FreeBSD vs DigiBoard and perhaps improve driver code to get my terminal server stable. So, please mail me everything you have concerning this topic to alexis@ww.net That may be driver sources, digi reverse engeneering, readmes and blurbs, documentation and patches etc etc Everything will be greately appreciated. I'll post the resume and perhaps some driver sources back to ftp server and my www site. alexis From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 15:35:38 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA04439 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:35:38 -0800 Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA04419 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:35:29 -0800 Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.6.12/8.6.9.1) id QAA14245; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:34:49 -0700 From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199512012334.QAA14245@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:34:49 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <199512012303.PAA17277@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Dec 1, 95 03:03:42 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 777 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > I doubt your tape drive is disipating 15 Watts! Your right! It *claims* to dissipate: 22W steady state 33W maximum :> > that's 3 AMPS at 5V Actually: 2.5A @ 5VDC (steady state) 0.8A @ 12VDC (steady state) And: 3.0A @ 5VDC (max) 1.5A @ 12VDC (max) > lot bloody likely.. Wanna rephrase that? :> > actually some of these drives seem to run quite a bit mor ethan 15 watts. > > believe me these drives get HOT as in > > *touch* "OUCH!" I'm not disagreeing. Rather, I'm just noting published specs on drives and trying to infer their thermal characteristics in a manner comparable to other equipment I have in similar enclosures. 'Cuda claims to be about 13W. Some of the Hawks appear to be ~9W. The MC1991 claims to be 30W! (comparing apples and orangatans!) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 15:43:26 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA05062 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:43:26 -0800 Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA05055 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:43:19 -0800 Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.6.12/8.6.9.1) id QAA14472 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:43:14 -0700 From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199512012343.QAA14472@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:43:13 -0700 (MST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1722 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk It seems that Julian Elischer said: > > > > Are these things comfortable in an external enclosure (e.g., two > > > > drives in a dual drive enclosure with a single fan)? Just how "hot" > > > > is "hot"? > > > > > > Hotter than that! :-) I wouldn't recommend it. One drive in a box > > > maybe. Two, well, maybe you could put a hot plate on top and cook > > > your breakfast in the morning.. :-) > > he's not kidding.. > I have a 3GB Hitachio drive here that's cooked itself > because it was put in a normal PC cabinet.. Ah, I'm not claiming to go down *that* road! This is a single, FH 5" external enclosure (PS on the *side*) with a single fan at the rear. > when it failed, I openned the cabinet and touched the drive > to see if it was mounted solidly.. Literally I burned myself > It didn't QUITE blister, but I had a red mark on my finger for four days.. > > since then I've started looking at this, and found several instances where > the drive was too hot to touch.. > > remember it's not the wattage, it's how fst you can DISIPATE that wattage. Granted. Given that I'm "holding the enclosure and Pd constant" and only allowing the *source* of the heat to vary (i.e. tape vs. disk), this is probably the best approximation I can make without having a real drive in the enclosure! Hence the reason I'm asking these questions! :> > a soldering Iron is often only 15 Watts, but it gets to, what, 300+ degrees F? Actually, more like 700F. > > Yikes! It seems that the drives tend to run 10 to 15W (typical). My > > tape drive is in the same case (single full height 5") and it doesn't > > seem to complain or get too hot -- in fact, the case barely gets warm! > > Am I missing something here?? From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 15:47:04 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA05316 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:47:04 -0800 Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA05309 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:46:59 -0800 Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.6.12/8.6.9.1) id QAA14585; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:46:52 -0700 From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199512012346.QAA14585@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:46:52 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <3594.817858677@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Dec 1, 95 02:57:57 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1010 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk It seems that Jordan K. Hubbard said: > > > Yeah but power is power. If you dissipate 10 - 15W, it doesn't matter > > *what* is dissipating the power! So, 2X would be in the 20 - 30W range > > (comparable to the tape drive). > > Actually, you and I both know that's not true because we know that > power dissipation is only part of the equation. There's also the > question of *where* the power is turning most fully into heat and how > effective your air conditioning (or other heat transfering > metal-to-metal contact) is at that point. Understood. I imagine the smaller surface area of the drive is a hindrance there. > You're also assuming that the power dissipation specs for hard drives > can always be believed, something I actually have strong reason to > doubt in at least several cases. *That* is most disconcerting! I guess I could always grab a multimeter (*after* the fact). So, how are people mounting 1991's (etc.)? In file server cases?? Seems like a bit of overkill... thx, don From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 15:49:49 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA05561 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:49:49 -0800 Received: from rocky.sri.MT.net (rocky.sri.MT.net [204.182.243.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA05544 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 15:49:37 -0800 Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.sri.MT.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA27447; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:51:56 -0700 Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:51:56 -0700 From: Nate Williams Message-Id: <199512012351.QAA27447@rocky.sri.MT.net> To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: Terry Lambert , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? In-Reply-To: <2166.817854782@time.cdrom.com> References: <199512011942.MAA02146@phaeton.artisoft.com> <2166.817854782@time.cdrom.com> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I still think that it's possible to derive benefit from the sea of SCO > apps out there, even without a working install. Yes, it's harder, but > it may also prove in many instances to make the difference between > letting a developer keep FreeBSD on his work PC or having his boss > demand he load SCO so that he can run some commercial app of import to > the company. FWIW, we (SRI) are currently to the stage where we are in the beginning stages of selling software that uses FreeBSD as the base OS. However, our software was developed on SCO boxes running SCO-Informix. Using the emulator in -current, we now have a complete running environment of our sofware w/out *any* SCO shlibs. It took alot of phone calls to Informix sales staff plus some calls to their technical staff, but we finally got a static version of Informix. SCO emulation on FreeBSD is a *huge* winner for us, as we couldn't go to market without it. > [insert picture of a sad eyed programmer sitting at a PC running SCO, > looking dolefully at the camera] Heck, we've got pictures of me staring sadly at a SCO box if you'd like to use them. *grin* Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 16:25:30 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA07240 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:25:30 -0800 Received: from linux4nn.iaf.nl (root@linux4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA07235 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:25:21 -0800 Received: from uni4nn.iaf.nl (root@uni4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.33]) by linux4nn.iaf.nl (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id BAA08757; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 01:28:37 +0100 Received: by uni4nn.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA04345 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Sat, 2 Dec 1995 01:25:25 +0100 Received: by iafnl.es.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA17539 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4); Fri, 1 Dec 1995 23:53:12 +0100 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA01100; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 19:02:19 +0100 From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199512011802.TAA01100@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: Anyone keen to help me get a Phillips CDD 521 Recorder working? To: guido@gvr.win.tue.nl (Guido van Rooij) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 19:02:19 +0100 (MET) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199511300842.JAA09380@gvr.win.tue.nl> from "Guido van Rooij" at Nov 30, 95 09:42:28 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1020 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > > (ahc0:3:7): "IMS CDD521/10 " type 4 removable SCSI 1 > > > > > uk7(ahc0:3:7): Unknown > > > > LUNs. The device is on ahc0, ID3, and it responds on LUN0 through LUN7. > > The SCSI code sees seven seperate devices, all the same, and assigns seven > > uk* devices to them. > > > > This augers poorly for the device's general compliance with any other part > > of the spec 8( > > If it's a philips, please take the time to fill in a feedabck form on www.philips.com > > -Guido > > Yep...also working for Philips.... Another datapoint: we just got a Yamaha CDwriter (in exchange for a Philips CDD522 (i think) which would not work on our DEC AXP machine) and that Yamaha also responds to all LUNs .... Wilko _ __________________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 16:42:55 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA08414 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:42:55 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA08393 ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:42:45 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA02937; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 17:40:36 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199512020040.RAA02937@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: mkisofs coredumping when attempting to write to HP SureStore 4020i To: jon@technix.org (Basket Case) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 17:40:36 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Basket Case" at Dec 1, 95 04:46:24 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1587 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > Im trying to get mkisofs to work, but with no luck. When I do: > > > mkisofs -o /dev/cd0a /mnt > > > > > > (where mnt is a dos partition, 650 megs) -- I get the error message of: > > > assertion "omit_version_number" failed: file "mkisofs.c", line 344 > > > > You have to use a *lot* options. See the man page for examples. > > > > The command line you gave looks like you are tyying to mount a CDROM. > > You *do* know that mkisofs is for use on magnetic media to make images > > that can be *later* burned into CDROM, right? > > Yes, as stated in the subject, I am using a HP SureStore 4020i, which is > a CD-R. Ive tried variety of command line parameters to no avail. In fact, > one of the emails said that all command line parameters don't really work, > except -o, which is output. I'm trying to copy everything in /mnt to the > cdrom. When using the linux mkisofs, it works fine -- sends things to the > data bus, and so forth, but the cd doesnt even write. The one for fbsd > (ported for fbsd) doesn't work... So where am I going wrong? You *never* run mkisofs against a writer device. Ever. You run mkisofs against a disk file. Then after vnconfiging it, mounting it up, and writing files to it, when you are happy with it, you *dd* the image onto the writer. As far as I know, that writer is not considered a writable device by the WORM driver yet. When it is, you can follow the above process to "burn" CDROMs. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 16:47:59 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA08714 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:47:59 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA08707 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:47:38 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA02956; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 17:43:32 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199512020043.RAA02956@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 17:43:32 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, jfieber@indiana.edu, lyndon@orthanc.com, grog@lemis.de, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <2166.817854782@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Dec 1, 95 01:53:02 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1070 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I still think that it's possible to derive benefit from the sea of SCO > apps out there, even without a working install. Yes, it's harder, but > it may also prove in many instances to make the difference between > letting a developer keep FreeBSD on his work PC or having his boss > demand he load SCO so that he can run some commercial app of import to > the company. > > [insert picture of a sad eyed programmer sitting at a PC running SCO, > looking dolefully at the camera] > > "For little Timmy's sake - isn't it worth it?" Well, you own the BSD install, so: are you going to offer a "binary compatability" menu option and hack /etc/sysconfig and /etc/rc so as to make the binaries "just run" if the option is chosen? Then they won't need doc, except on the install, and they will have to make that up for themselves on a per application basis inany case until the full IBCS2 environment is supported (if it ever is). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 16:59:45 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA09407 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:59:45 -0800 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA09402 ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:59:42 -0800 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.50]) by Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id QAA00319; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:59:40 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with SMTP id QAA00244; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 16:59:21 -0800 Message-Id: <199512020059.QAA00244@corbin.Root.COM> To: Sergio Lenzi cc: hackers@freebsd.org, questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: mb_map full. In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 01 Dec 95 21:28:16 GMT." From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Fri, 01 Dec 1995 16:59:20 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >I have a machine running FreeBSD with 8MB of memory ... >The BSD machine receives messages via rs232, decodes it >and updates an ORACLE database running in a sparc 20 processor. > >The updates is via rsh command. > >There are 10 rs232 ports in the BSD machine. > >The sistem is running and some time, 30min to 3 hours a message >appears in the console "mb_map full". > >I looked at the code and see that comes from the vm logic in the kernel. > >Can someone please tell me a way to increase that table or a way to >solve the problem, Please ??? You need to increase the number of mbuf clusters. You didn't specify which version of FreeBSD you're using, and the default numbers of clusters is different with each version...but nonetheless, you can increase the number by adding: options "NMBCLUSTERS=" ...to your kernel config file, where is a value of 512 or larger (I suggest trying 1024). Don't use a value much larger than 2048 without adding more memory (2048 will require 4MB of RAM just for the buffers). -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 18:15:18 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA12633 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 18:15:18 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA12628 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 18:15:12 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id SAA05013; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 18:14:34 -0800 To: Terry Lambert cc: jfieber@indiana.edu, lyndon@orthanc.com, grog@lemis.de, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Where is the documentation for ibcs2? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 01 Dec 1995 17:43:32 MST." <199512020043.RAA02956@phaeton.artisoft.com> Date: Fri, 01 Dec 1995 18:14:34 -0800 Message-ID: <5004.817870474@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Well, you own the BSD install, so: are you going to offer a "binary > compatability" menu option and hack /etc/sysconfig and /etc/rc so as > to make the binaries "just run" if the option is chosen? Maybe. Depends on how much work it turns out to be. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 19:41:38 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA16263 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 19:41:38 -0800 Received: from clem.systemsix.com (clem.systemsix.com [198.99.86.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA16243 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 19:41:09 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by clem.systemsix.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id UAA00866 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 20:40:41 -0700 Message-Id: <199512020340.UAA00866@clem.systemsix.com> X-Authentication-Warning: clem.systemsix.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 From: Steve Passe To: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 01 Dec 1995 20:40:39 -0700 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hi, > So, how are people mounting 1991's (etc.)? In file server cases?? > Seems like a bit of overkill... I use single height enclosures with the front panel removed (ie the blockout used for things like tape drives). In its place I put a foam filter to catch dust. This allows airflow directly across the top of the drive. I also get a GOOD fan from someplace like Digikey. Panasonic makes a line of ball-beaing fans with much higher rated air-flows that the ones typically found in disk cabinents. The oem fans also usually die in short order, which will fry a disk quite quickly. You do pay for it with increased fan noise! I am running a MC3243W (4GB 7200rpm) in one of these and the temp of the outlet air is little warmer than that from the older MC2217s I have (in same type cabinents). The top of the cabinet is no warmer than room temp. Check out: http://www.freebsd.org/~faulkner/multimedia/HomeAuto/Therm.html I might actually get back to finish this soon. -- Steve Passe | powered by smp@csn.net | FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 20:16:46 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id UAA18230 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 20:16:46 -0800 Received: from bang.rain.com (bang.rain.com [199.2.100.61]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA18223 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 20:16:34 -0800 Received: (from john@localhost) by bang.rain.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id UAA07209; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 20:15:15 -0800 From: John Cavanaugh Message-Id: <199512020415.UAA07209@bang.rain.com> Subject: Re: Upgrading to 2.1.0-RELEASE from 2.1-STABLE To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 20:15:15 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <2348.817855849@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Dec 1, 95 02:10:49 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 965 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Erm. Why? You basically have it already! :-) > > > Hi, I have a: > > > > FreeBSD bang.rain.com 2.1-STABLE FreeBSD 2.1-STABLE #0: Sat Jul 29 05:58:29 > 1995 root@burn3.aac.dev.com:/usr/src/sys/compile/BANG i386 > > > > system that I want to upgrade to 2.1-RELEASE. Can I just got the boot.flp > > and do the upgrade option? I know the docs talk about the upgrade > > option working for 2.0.5->2.1 but I didn't know if I could do it > > from stable to release. Thanks. Well, 'cause I figured you guys had made some changes between the end of July and when 2.1 was actually released. Also, I noticed that your upgrade util with 2.1 works with 2.0.5, so I am figuring that subsequent versions of the upgrade option will only be able to upgrade from 2.1. I'm guessing at this point but I figured it would be better to be in sync than not. Correct me if i'm wrong...;-) -- John Cavanaugh "There can be only one." From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 21:51:26 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA22745 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 21:51:26 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA22714 ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 21:51:10 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id VAA00807; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 21:50:48 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199512020550.VAA00807@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Slightly better patch for FreeBSD readdir() fix To: wine-new@amscons.com Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 21:50:48 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, ports@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 5016 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Here is a slightly better patch to dos_fs.c in WINE. the last one was basically the same but had a couple of unreferenced variables in certain cases.. I've also cleaned it up a bit #-------cut here------------- *** dos_fs.c.orig Fri Nov 24 04:59:40 1995 --- dos_fs.c Fri Dec 1 18:47:21 1995 *************** *** 858,901 **** strncpy(dirname, unixdirname, len); dirname[len] = 0; unixdirname = strrchr(unixdirname, '/') + 1; - if ((ds = opendir(dirname)) == NULL) - return NULL; dp = DosDirs; while (dp) { ! if (dp->inuse) break; if (strcmp(dp->unixpath, dirname) == 0) break; dp = dp->next; } if (!dp) { dp = xmalloc(sizeof(struct dosdirent)); dp->next = DosDirs; DosDirs = dp; } strncpy(dp->filemask, unixdirname, 12); dp->filemask[12] = 0; dprintf_dosfs(stddeb,"DOS_opendir: %s / %s\n", unixdirname, dirname); - dp->inuse = 1; strcpy(dp->unixpath, dirname); dp->entnum = 0; - if ((dp->telldirnum=telldir(ds)) == -1) - { - dp->inuse = 0; - closedir(ds); - return NULL; - } - if (closedir(ds) == -1) - { - dp->inuse = 0; - return NULL; - } return dp; } --- 858,916 ---- strncpy(dirname, unixdirname, len); dirname[len] = 0; unixdirname = strrchr(unixdirname, '/') + 1; dp = DosDirs; + /* try reuse it if we have already done this directory.. odd */ while (dp) { ! if (!dp->inuse) /* I think this test was reversed before */ ! { ! dp->inuse = 1; ! dp->ds == NULL; break; + } if (strcmp(dp->unixpath, dirname) == 0) + { break; + } dp = dp->next; } if (!dp) { dp = xmalloc(sizeof(struct dosdirent)); + dp->ds = NULL; + dp->inuse = 1; dp->next = DosDirs; DosDirs = dp; } + if (! dp->ds) + { + if ((dp->ds = ds = opendir(dirname)) == NULL) + { + dp->inuse = 0; + return NULL; + } + } + else + { + ds = dp->ds; + rewinddir(dp->ds); + } + #ifdef NEEDSEEK + if ((dp->telldirnum=telldir(ds)) == -1) + { + DOS_closedir(dp); + return NULL; + } + #endif strncpy(dp->filemask, unixdirname, 12); dp->filemask[12] = 0; dprintf_dosfs(stddeb,"DOS_opendir: %s / %s\n", unixdirname, dirname); strcpy(dp->unixpath, dirname); dp->entnum = 0; return dp; } *************** *** 908,921 **** DIR *ds; if (!de->inuse) return NULL; ! if (!(ds=opendir(de->unixpath))) return NULL; seekdir(ds,de->telldirnum); /* returns no error value. strange */ ! if (de->search_attribute & FA_LABEL) { int drive; de->search_attribute &= ~FA_LABEL; /* don't find it again */ ! for(drive = 0; drive < MAX_DOS_DRIVES; drive++) { if (DosDrives[drive].rootdir != NULL && strcmp(DosDrives[drive].rootdir, de->unixpath) == 0) { --- 923,952 ---- DIR *ds; if (!de->inuse) + { + printf("DOS_readdir(): something closed the dir early (1)\n"); return NULL; ! } ! if ( ! de->ds ) ! { ! printf("DOS_readdir(): something closed the dir badly (1)\n"); ! if (!(de->ds = ds =opendir(de->unixpath))) return NULL; ! } ! else ! { ! ds = de->ds; ! } ! #ifdef NEEDSEEK seekdir(ds,de->telldirnum); /* returns no error value. strange */ + #endif ! /* Special case for when asked to get a label */ ! if (de->search_attribute & FA_LABEL) ! { int drive; de->search_attribute &= ~FA_LABEL; /* don't find it again */ ! for(drive = 0; drive < MAX_DOS_DRIVES; drive++) ! { if (DosDrives[drive].rootdir != NULL && strcmp(DosDrives[drive].rootdir, de->unixpath) == 0) { *************** *** 926,935 **** } } do { if ((d = readdir(ds)) == NULL) { de->telldirnum=telldir(ds); ! closedir(ds); return NULL; } --- 957,968 ---- } } + /* Keep looking at directory entries till we find what we want */ do { if ((d = readdir(ds)) == NULL) { + #ifdef NEEDSEEK de->telldirnum=telldir(ds); ! #endif return NULL; } *************** *** 954,966 **** de->filesize = st.st_size; de->filetime = st.st_mtime; de->telldirnum = telldir(ds); ! closedir(ds); return de; } void DOS_closedir(struct dosdirent *de) { if (de && de->inuse) de->inuse = 0; } --- 987,1006 ---- de->filesize = st.st_size; de->filetime = st.st_mtime; + #ifdef NEEDSEEK de->telldirnum = telldir(ds); ! #endif return de; } void DOS_closedir(struct dosdirent *de) { + + if ( de->ds ) + { + closedir (de->ds); + de->ds = NULL; + } if (de && de->inuse) de->inuse = 0; } #------------------end of patch---------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 22:02:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id WAA23393 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 22:02:40 -0800 Received: from generic.gnsnet.com (generic.dialup.inch.com [204.253.24.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA23384 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 22:02:35 -0800 Received: from flatline.gnsnet.com (flatline.gnsnet.com [193.195.19.35]) by generic.gnsnet.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA21352 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 00:57:41 GMT Received: (from trangmar@localhost) by flatline.gnsnet.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id AAA06841; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 00:59:16 -0500 Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 00:59:15 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Trangmar To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: ft (Qic 40/80) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Does anyone know why this this wasn't written as a *complete* tape driver? It would be really useful for me to have this as a device i could use dump and tar on and i am considering looking further into it with a view to enhancing it to do just that. Just thought i'd cast around to see if anyone had any input before i expended/wasted valuable time. Thanks in advance, RobT -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Rob Trangmar trangmar@gnsnet.com NeXT Mail/Mime O.K Tel: (212) 7600225 Fax: (212) 6294314 -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 22:07:25 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id WAA23714 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 22:07:25 -0800 Received: from bubba.tribe.com ([205.184.207.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA23701 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 22:07:14 -0800 Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.tribe.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA07343; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 22:06:00 -0800 From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199512020606.WAA07343@bubba.tribe.com> Subject: Re: ethernet card configuration programs To: erich@lodgenet.com (Eric L. Hernes) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 22:05:59 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199511302054.OAA11866@jake.lodgenet.com> from "Eric L. Hernes" at Nov 30, 95 02:54:01 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 864 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > this is a linux web page with sources for ethernet > card configuration. I've compiled the 3c509, but > I haven't tested it yet. > > http://cesdis.gsfc.nasa.gov/linux/diag/diagnostic.html > > eric. > -- > erich@lodgenet.com > erich@rrnet.com Would it be possible for someone to port these to FreeBSD? This would be great because I always have to boot DOS to run the stupid config program for NE2000 compatible cards... for some reason the default card configuration and the default FreeBSD "ed1" configuration don't agree. I don't know what the equivalent/substitute for #include would be... but it looks like it shouldn't be too difficult since the programs are very short. -Archie _______________________________________________________________________________ Archie L. Cobbs, archie@tribe.com * Tribe Computer Works http://www.tribe.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 22:43:32 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id WAA26469 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 22:43:32 -0800 Received: from pinch.io.org (root@pinch.io.org [198.133.36.9]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA26459 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 22:43:17 -0800 Received: from flinch (flinch.io.org [198.133.36.153]) by pinch.io.org (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id BAA04260; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 01:41:23 -0500 Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 01:40:55 -0500 (EST) From: Brian Tao X-Sender: taob@flinch To: Terry Lambert cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Increasing size of shared memory segmenty In-Reply-To: <199511292110.OAA28629@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Wed, 29 Nov 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > > 32M is smaller than the overall limit, (36 bits? 39 bits?) so you should > be safe, though if you have several of these, you will probably start > having problems. Okay... I gather I need to bump up SHMMAX (max. segment size) as well as SHMALL (max. total size of all segments?). I'm running a 2.1.0-RELEASE kernel with these settings: shminfo: shmmax: 16777216 (max shared memory segment size) shmmin: 1 (min shared memory segment size) shmmni: 32 (max number of shared memory identifiers) shmseg: 8 (max shared memory segments per process) shmall: 4096 (max amount of shared memory in pages) Seems to be working okay so far, although I still can't load those nice 1536x1024 (or larger) PhotoCD pictures into gimp... :( -- Brian Tao (BT300, taob@io.org) Systems Administrator, Internex Online Inc. "Though this be madness, yet there is method in't" From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 23:16:17 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id XAA29169 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 23:16:17 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA29161 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 23:16:13 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id XAA01029; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 23:15:33 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199512020715.XAA01029@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: ethernet card configuration programs To: archie@tribe.com (Archie Cobbs) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 23:15:32 -0800 (PST) Cc: erich@lodgenet.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199512020606.WAA07343@bubba.tribe.com> from "Archie Cobbs" at Dec 1, 95 10:05:59 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1081 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > > > this is a linux web page with sources for ethernet > > card configuration. I've compiled the 3c509, but > > I haven't tested it yet. > > > > http://cesdis.gsfc.nasa.gov/linux/diag/diagnostic.html > > > > eric. > > -- > > erich@lodgenet.com > > erich@rrnet.com > > Would it be possible for someone to port these to FreeBSD? This > would be great because I always have to boot DOS to run the stupid > config program for NE2000 compatible cards... for some reason the > default card configuration and the default FreeBSD "ed1" configuration > don't agree. > > I don't know what the equivalent/substitute for #include > would be... but it looks like it shouldn't be too difficult > since the programs are very short. #include you have to open /dev/io to get permissions to do inb() and outb() instructions.. otherwise it should just about compile... > > -Archie > > _______________________________________________________________________________ > Archie L. Cobbs, archie@tribe.com * Tribe Computer Works http://www.tribe.com > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Dec 1 23:57:14 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id XAA02633 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 23:57:14 -0800 Received: from werple.net.au (0@werple.mira.net.au [203.9.190.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA02620 for ; Fri, 1 Dec 1995 23:57:07 -0800 Received: from cimaxp1.UUCP (Ucimlogi@localhost) by werple.net.au (8.7/8.7.1) with UUCP id SAA27501 for hackers@FreeBSD.org; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 18:55:58 +1100 (EST) Message-Id: <199512020755.SAA27501@werple.net.au> X-Authentication-Warning: werple.net.au: Ucimlogi set sender to cimaxp1!jb using -f Received: by cimaxp1.cimlogic.com.au; (5.65/1.1.8.2/10Sep95-0953AM) id AA32480; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 19:00:08 +1100 From: John Birrell Subject: Hyperactive time To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 19:00:07 +1100 (EST) Cc: jb@cimlogic.com.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk G'day, I've got a _real_ special 2.0.5R system here. The more I compile, the faster the time goes. Good grief! Is the system trying to tell me something? No, I'm _not_ joking. I heard of real time, but this is crazy. Any idea what I could've done to the thing to cause this? I tried deleting the /etc/wall_clock_thingy, then I commented adjkerntz out of /etc/rc, but nothing seems affect it. When I boot the system, it starts at the bios time. It's OK for a while then whooooosh...... Could it be seeing the xntpd packets that OSF/1 puts out? -- John Birrell CIMlogic Pty Ltd jb@cimlogic.com.au 119 Cecil Street Ph +61 3 9690 9600 South Melbourne Vic 3205 Fax +61 3 9690 6650 Australia Mob +61 18 353 137 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 00:22:02 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA04648 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 00:22:02 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA04643 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 00:21:58 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id SAA21270; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 18:53:52 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199512021853.SAA21270@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 18:53:52 +0000 () Cc: dgy@rtd.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <3594.817858677@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Dec 1, 95 02:57:57 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1410 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Jordan K. Hubbard stands accused of saying: > > > Yeah but power is power. If you dissipate 10 - 15W, it doesn't matter > > *what* is dissipating the power! So, 2X would be in the 20 - 30W range > > (comparable to the tape drive). > > Actually, you and I both know that's not true because we know that > power dissipation is only part of the equation. There's also the > question of *where* the power is turning most fully into heat and how > effective your air conditioning (or other heat transfering > metal-to-metal contact) is at that point. And you're not considering duty cycle either, nor average vs. peak power consumption, or thermal mass for that matter. It's not that disks produce lots of heat, more that they _dispose_ of it poorly, so over time they become quite hot. A tape drive, on the other hand, produces most of its heat in the various motors involved, which are open to the air and thus dissipate their heat more easily. > Jordan Jordan was right on the money with disk drives != tape drives. -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 00:22:33 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA04685 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 00:22:33 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA04677 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 00:22:26 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id AAA01205; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 00:22:13 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199512020822.AAA01205@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: Hyperactive time To: cimaxp1!jb@werple.net.au (John Birrell) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 00:22:12 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, jb@cimlogic.com.au In-Reply-To: <199512020755.SAA27501@werple.net.au> from "John Birrell" at Dec 2, 95 07:00:07 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1413 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I just realised I'm seeing this as well, I noticed that xearth is showing daylight here, bat my eyes say differnt if I look outside.. A kernel compiled on Nov 26 is ok, but one compiled Wednesday seems to have fun with time.. "aha! I'll call it tardis!.. tardis.tfs.com.. has a certain ring to it.. and I can go home earlier too!" julian.. > > G'day, > > I've got a _real_ special 2.0.5R system here. The more I compile, the faster > the time goes. Good grief! Is the system trying to tell me something? No, > I'm _not_ joking. I heard of real time, but this is crazy. > > Any idea what I could've done to the thing to cause this? > > I tried deleting the /etc/wall_clock_thingy, then I commented adjkerntz out > of /etc/rc, but nothing seems affect it. > > When I boot the system, it starts at the bios time. It's OK for a while > then whooooosh...... > > Could it be seeing the xntpd packets that OSF/1 puts out? not unless you're running xntpd on the BSD box.. you could have a cron job htat does ntpdate osfbox every 5 minutes :) does the dmesg show your CPU (if it's a pentium) as being the right speed? > > > -- > John Birrell CIMlogic Pty Ltd > jb@cimlogic.com.au 119 Cecil Street > Ph +61 3 9690 9600 South Melbourne Vic 3205 > Fax +61 3 9690 6650 Australia > Mob +61 18 353 137 > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 00:24:18 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA04786 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 00:24:18 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA04781 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 00:24:08 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id SAA21283; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 18:55:45 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199512021855.SAA21283@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 18:55:44 +0000 () Cc: dgy@rtd.com, jkh@time.cdrom.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199512012303.PAA17277@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Dec 1, 95 03:03:42 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 570 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Julian Elischer stands accused of saying: > > I doubt your tape drive is disipating 15 Watts! > that's 3 AMPS at 5V It's more likely to be ~500mA@5V and ~1A@12V while rewinding. > julian -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 00:44:48 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id AAA06042 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 00:44:48 -0800 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA06030 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 00:44:37 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id TAA21342; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 19:16:26 GMT From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199512021916.TAA21342@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: ethernet card configuration programs To: archie@tribe.com (Archie Cobbs) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 19:16:26 +0000 () Cc: erich@lodgenet.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199512020606.WAA07343@bubba.tribe.com> from "Archie Cobbs" at Dec 1, 95 10:05:59 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1052 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Archie Cobbs stands accused of saying: > Would it be possible for someone to port these to FreeBSD? This > would be great because I always have to boot DOS to run the stupid > config program for NE2000 compatible cards... for some reason the > default card configuration and the default FreeBSD "ed1" configuration > don't agree. userconfig (boot: -c) helps there. > I don't know what the equivalent/substitute for #include > would be... but it looks like it shouldn't be too difficult > since the programs are very short. #include is the most likely candidate. Remeber to open /dev/io first, or your program will be killed. > -Archie -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 041-122-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "Who does BSD?" "We do Chucky, we do." [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 03:57:41 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA07685 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 03:57:41 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id DAA07652 ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 03:57:23 -0800 Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 03:57:23 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199512021157.DAA07652@freefall.freebsd.org> To: hackers Subject: OK EVERYONE, LISTEN UP.. Cc: current Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk I've been testing my cdevsw and bdevsw changes and I have two machines here that have been doing heavy work with them and nothing's broken.. I'm going to make the changes to make it THE DEFAULT within 48 hours so if you are a -current user, and haven't tried to see what happens when you add options JREMOD to your kernel, then you'd better check it now while it's still just an option.. and yes, poul, with sources from this-evenning, I was unable to duplicate your problem so I think it's something else.. :) It's running reliably here and elsewhere so it shouldn't be too much of a risk.. If you have problems and want this to not go ahead, then get back to me in the next day or so.. because I'll be committing the next round, sunday night.. BTW if JREMOD fails. DO check if a kernel compiled out of the same tree withut it also fails? I've chased 3 of those so far.. julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 04:28:13 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA10520 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 04:28:13 -0800 Received: from hq.icb.chel.su (icb-rich-gw.icb.chel.su [193.125.10.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA10477 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 04:27:42 -0800 Received: from localhost (babkin@localhost) by hq.icb.chel.su (8.6.5/8.6.5) id RAA10164; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 17:09:02 +0500 From: "Serge A. Babkin" Message-Id: <199512021209.RAA10164@hq.icb.chel.su> Subject: Re: DigiBoard and FreeBSD To: alexis@ww.net Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 17:09:01 +0500 (GMT+0500) Cc: john@starfire.skypoint.net, babkin@icb.chel.su, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199512012323.BAA12207@icecream.cs.kiev.ua> from "Alexis Yushin" at Dec 2, 95 01:23:18 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 832 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > Salut, > > I am really going to establish terminal server with DigiBoard > 8xe and FreeBSD-2.1-RELEASE. I've got teh card and some drivers in alpha > but that didn't satisfy me. I am going to gather and integrate everything 2.1 must contain my latest version in /sys/gnu/i386/isa. Try it. It is enough stable. The main problem with it is that it sometimes resends the output buffer. > concerning FreeBSD vs DigiBoard and perhaps improve driver code to get > my terminal server stable. So, please mail me everything you have > concerning this topic to alexis@ww.net That may be driver sources, digi > reverse engeneering, readmes and blurbs, documentation and patches etc etc I can give you the Linux driver sources (I took them from ftp.digibd.com). I know that paster@peak.urc.ac.ru have made some changes to it. -SB From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 04:28:46 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id EAA10569 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 04:28:46 -0800 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (root@UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA10552 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 04:28:36 -0800 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA27949 (5.67a/IDA-1.5 for hackers@freebsd.org); Sat, 2 Dec 1995 05:37:46 -0600 Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id FAA16053 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 05:25:55 -0600 Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 05:25:55 -0600 From: peter@taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Message-Id: <199512021125.FAA16053@bonkers.taronga.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Anyone got FreeBSD working a P6? Organization: Taronga Park BBS References: <199511041934.LAA05470@rah.star-gate.com> <199511042149.WAA21203@allegro.lemis.de> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In article <199511042149.WAA21203@allegro.lemis.de>, Greg Lehey wrote: >Amancio Hasty Jr. writes: >> I was just reading comp.sys.intel and the 200Mhz P6's performance looks >> really cool 8) >Don't believe it. The magazines over here are full of the fact that >it's a flop, since it takes forever to change from 32 to 16 bit mode >and back again. Why on earth would we want to change from 32 to 16 bit mode? From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 06:10:22 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id GAA23407 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 06:10:22 -0800 Received: from spot.lodgenet.com (lodgenet.iw.net [204.157.148.88]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA23377 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 06:10:11 -0800 Received: from jake.lodgenet.com (jake.lodgenet.com [204.124.120.30]) by spot.lodgenet.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA20865; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 08:10:32 -0600 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jake.lodgenet.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA28918; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 08:34:28 -0600 Message-Id: <199512021434.IAA28918@jake.lodgenet.com> X-Authentication-Warning: jake.lodgenet.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Archie Cobbs cc: erich@lodgenet.com (Eric L. Hernes), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, erich@lodgenet.com Subject: Re: ethernet card configuration programs In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 01 Dec 1995 22:05:59 PST." <199512020606.WAA07343@bubba.tribe.com> Date: Sat, 02 Dec 1995 08:34:27 -0600 From: "Eric L. Hernes" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Archie Cobbs writes: > >Would it be possible for someone to port these to FreeBSD? This >would be great because I always have to boot DOS to run the stupid >config program for NE2000 compatible cards... for some reason the >default card configuration and the default FreeBSD "ed1" configuration >don't agree. I'm planning to when I get a chance. > >I don't know what the equivalent/substitute for #include >would be... but it looks like it shouldn't be too difficult >since the programs are very short. I believe tha asm/io.h under linux sets up the use of inb() and outb(), undef freebsd, you include machine/cpu_func.h. To get permissions to do the outb's under linux you have to jump through some hoops, but in freebsd, you just open /dev/io (but you've gotta be root or suid root) > >-Archie > >______________________________________________________________________________ >_ >Archie L. Cobbs, archie@tribe.com * Tribe Computer Works http://www.tribe.co >m eric. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 06:45:39 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id GAA27470 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 06:45:39 -0800 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (root@UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id GAA27447 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 06:45:25 -0800 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA29283 (5.67a/IDA-1.5 for hackers@freebsd.org); Sat, 2 Dec 1995 08:31:49 -0600 Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id IAA02500; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 08:18:10 -0600 Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 08:18:10 -0600 From: peter@taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Message-Id: <199512021418.IAA02500@bonkers.taronga.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ideas from netbsd Newsgroups: taronga.freebsd.hackers In-Reply-To: <199511081749.KAA20366@phaeton.artisoft.com> References: <199511080735.SAA22789@werple.net.au> Organization: Taronga Park BBS Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert wrote: >But what it has to "gain" by not doing it is gratuitous incompatability. I don't understand why "being compatible with NetBSD" and "having a COMPAT_NETBSD hack that can be turned on and off" are equivalent statements. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 08:20:49 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id IAA08030 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 08:20:49 -0800 Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA08019 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 08:20:46 -0800 Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.6.12/8.6.9.1) id JAA05853; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 09:19:08 -0700 From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199512021619.JAA05853@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) To: smp@csn.net (Steve Passe) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 09:19:07 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <199512020340.UAA00866@clem.systemsix.com> from "Steve Passe" at Dec 1, 95 08:40:39 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1972 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk It seems that Steve Passe said: > > So, how are people mounting 1991's (etc.)? In file server cases?? > > Seems like a bit of overkill... > > I use single height enclosures with the front panel removed (ie the blockout single *half* height or single *full* height? > used for things like tape drives). In its place I put a foam filter to catch > dust. This allows airflow directly across the top of the drive. I also Hmmm... that's a good idea (tho' not quite as visually appealing! :>) > get a GOOD fan from someplace like Digikey. Panasonic makes a line of > ball-beaing fans with much higher rated air-flows that the ones typically > found in disk cabinents. The oem fans also usually die in short order, which And *another* good idea! I'll have to examine the fans on these cabinets a bit more closely... > will fry a disk quite quickly. You do pay for it with increased fan noise! Yeah, well, my office isn't very quiet as it is so a few more dB of fan noise won't matter... > I am running a MC3243W (4GB 7200rpm) in one of these and the temp of the > outlet > air is little warmer than that from the older MC2217s I have (in same type > cabinents). The top of the cabinet is no warmer than room temp. I was looking to put *two* 3243's in a fullheight external enclosure. Or, a single 1991. But, same problems (I imagine) would plague each... How warm does the 3243 case get (use *top* side of finger to test). > Check out: > > http://www.freebsd.org/~faulkner/multimedia/HomeAuto/Therm.html Cute. I designed a similar product for remote equipment monitoring. It would pick up the phone and call voice/data to report temperature errors, etc. I imagine you had monitoring the disk temperature as your intended application? :> Maybe just put a warning light and then hardwire a circuit to (unceremoniously) remove power from the drive at hi-temp. > I might actually get back to finish this soon. I've got a *list* of _those_! :> From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 09:07:05 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA12363 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 09:07:05 -0800 Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA12348 ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 09:07:01 -0800 Message-Id: <199512021707.JAA12348@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com didn't use HELO protocol To: peter@taronga.com (Peter da Silva) cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Anyone got FreeBSD working a P6? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 02 Dec 1995 05:25:55 CST." <199512021125.FAA16053@bonkers.taronga.com> Date: Sat, 02 Dec 1995 09:07:00 -0800 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >In article <199511042149.WAA21203@allegro.lemis.de>, >Greg Lehey wrote: >>Amancio Hasty Jr. writes: >>> I was just reading comp.sys.intel and the 200Mhz P6's performance looks >>> really cool 8) > >>Don't believe it. The magazines over here are full of the fact that >>it's a flop, since it takes forever to change from 32 to 16 bit mode >>and back again. > >Why on earth would we want to change from 32 to 16 bit mode? To run your DOS emulator. -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 09:14:20 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA13371 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 09:14:20 -0800 Received: from clem.systemsix.com (clem.systemsix.com [198.99.86.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA13355 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 09:14:09 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by clem.systemsix.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA04430; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 10:13:37 -0700 Message-Id: <199512021713.KAA04430@clem.systemsix.com> X-Authentication-Warning: clem.systemsix.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 From: Steve Passe To: Don Yuniskis cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 02 Dec 1995 09:19:07 MST." <199512021619.JAA05853@seagull.rtd.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 02 Dec 1995 10:13:36 -0700 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hi, >single *half* height or single *full* height? single, specifically I like the JDR Microdevices's ED-150 for 3.5" apps. It is well made mechanically, all metal except for the faceplate. The fan in this box is crap, unfortunately. >> used for things like tape drives). In its place I put a foam filter to catch >> dust. This allows airflow directly across the top of the drive. I also > >Hmmm... that's a good idea (tho' not quite as visually appealing! :>) Actually it looks like factory made if you take your time. With the above mentioned box I remove the top-third faceplate blockout and cut a piece of open-cell black foam slightly larger, which pops right in place from the back. Looks like what nature intended from the front. >> get a GOOD fan from someplace like Digikey. Panasonic makes a line of >> ball-beaing fans with much higher rated air-flows that the ones typically >> found in disk cabinents. The oem fans also usually die in short order, which > >And *another* good idea! I'll have to examine the fans on these cabinets >a bit more closely... I don't recall ever seeing a quality fan in such boxes. The specs on the panasonic fan I usually use: ball-bearing, 2.40 watts, 6.7 cfm, 32.0 db-A (digikey part# P9703-ND) >... >I was looking to put *two* 3243's in a fullheight external enclosure. >Or, a single 1991. But, same problems (I imagine) would plague each... I recommend 2 3243's in 2 half-height boxes. They stack in about the same space as a double height box and give you alot more flexibility. Put a root partition on both, you get some crash recover benefits. You also can do some load balancing and get better scsi thruput. Get a couple scsi-I ribbon cable connectors and build a 3" connector to attach the 2 boxes, no bulky 3 foot cable dangling between the two. One thing to consider, I have seen combinations of external boxes that became unhappy with mixed flat and round cables. Something to do with impedance mis-match. Remember that each box has approx. 8-12" of flat cable inside, so if you string together 3 or 4 boxes with round cables there are a lot of impedance changes happening. I like to build flat cables to connect all the boxes in a chain, including the link between computer and 1st box. >... >your intended application? :> Maybe just put a warning light and then >hardwire a circuit to (unceremoniously) remove power from the drive at hi-temp. I have wondered about this. At what temperature is it better to clobber the file system and spare the drive a few minutes more of over-temp condition? I suspect most modern drives will shut down when they get TOO hot. The problem is a drive that runs borderline for long periods of time, degrading its lifetime. I guess that reaching the warning (yellow) temp means orderly shutdown, if red is reached while program is still running just cut the power. >How warm does the 3243 case get (use *top* side of finger to test). If you mean the cabinent it is in, top of finger, wrist, big toe, it feels maybe 5 deg above room temp to me. If I can find an appropriate thermometer around here I will get an actual measurement. If you mean the 3243 drive itself, I don't know offhand, not eager to open up a cabinent to find out right now... -- Steve Passe | powered by smp@csn.net | FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 09:43:38 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA17657 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 09:43:38 -0800 Received: from expo.x.org (expo.x.org [198.112.45.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA17641 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 09:43:29 -0800 Received: from exalt.x.org by expo.x.org id AA29297; Sat, 2 Dec 95 12:42:53 -0500 Received: from localhost by exalt.x.org id RAA14346; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 17:42:53 GMT Message-Id: <199512021742.RAA14346@exalt.x.org> To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Minor change to make Date: Sat, 02 Dec 1995 12:42:52 EDT From: "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Who's Mr. /usr/bin/make? I want make to silently ignore a failure to find a .include file. The reason I want this is because in the next release of X imake will generate Makefiles that can use include files for dependencies if the system's make supports it. N.B. ClearMake, SGI, and Digital, makes all have include directives that silently ignore a failure to find the include file, so this isn't a new idea. And if you think about it, it's really a necessity to ignore the failure otherwise you have a chick-or-the-egg problem when you try to do a `make depend` to generate the include file. I've appended a trivial patch to the end that gives me what I want. If this isn't acceptable for some reason I would consider an alternative directive, e.g. `.sinclude' (documented of course, and I'd do the work) that does what I want. Comments? -- Kaleb KEITHLEY X Consortium (note that this patch intentionally does not change the behavior in the undocumented traditional SYSV include directive processing, although maybe it should.) diff -c usr.bin/make/parse.c.orig usr.bin/make/parse.c *** usr.bin/make/parse.c.orig Sat Dec 2 07:35:46 1995 --- usr.bin/make/parse.c Sat Dec 2 08:08:34 1995 *************** *** 37,43 **** */ #ifndef lint ! static char sccsid[] = "@(#)parse.c 8.3 (Berkeley) 3/19/94"; #endif /* not lint */ /*- --- 37,43 ---- */ #ifndef lint ! static char sccsid[] = "@(#)parse.c 8.3 (Berkeley) 3/19/94 frob"; #endif /* not lint */ /*- *************** *** 1685,1691 **** --- 1685,1693 ---- if (fullname == (char *) NULL) { *cp = endc; + #if WANT_FATAL_INCLUDE_FAILURE Parse_Error (PARSE_FATAL, "Could not find %s", file); + #endif return; } From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 09:52:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA18471 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 09:52:40 -0800 Received: from jau.csc.fi (root@jau.csc.fi [193.166.1.196]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA18463 ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 09:52:35 -0800 Received: (from jau@localhost) by jau.csc.fi (8.6.12/8.6.12+CSC-2.1) id TAA22091; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 19:50:57 +0200 From: Jukka Ukkonen Message-Id: <199512021750.TAA22091@jau.csc.fi> Subject: msleep(2) & mwakeup(2) ??? To: questions@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 19:50:57 +0200 (EET) Latin-Date: Simbata II Decembrie a.d. MCMXCV Organization: Private person Phone: +358-0-6215280 (home) Content-Conversion: prohibited X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1804 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi all! Does anyone know whatever happened to those synchronization primitives that are mentioned in 4.4BSD Architecture Manual (see PSD:5-11)? After writing initial versions of POSIX.4 shm_open() and shm_unlink() I thought about implementing POSIX.4 counting semaphores using mmap()'ed shared memory and msleep(), mwakeup(), mset(), and mclear(), but when I checked none of these synchronization routines were present in source files. Or maybe I just did not look for them in the correct place. At least they were not in the source trees of FreeBSD-2.0.5 or 4.4BSD-Lite, which I have on CD at home. I did not check FreeBSD-2.1.0 yet. Does anybody have a better idea where to look? At the bottom of the manual page that I mentioned above there is a note "All currently unimplemented, no entry points exist." Is this still true or has someone already tried adding them? Supposedly it would not be terribly difficult to add these binary semaphores though. At the first glance it looked to me that only msleep() and mwakeup() would really need to be supported by the kernel unless one wants also something like mtimedsleep() to be a single system call instead of two calls, the first one to set a timer and then msleep(). Mset() and mclear() could (when efficiency is concerned they presumably even should) be plain wrappers to bus-interlocked machine instructions in the style of test-and-clear. Cheers, // jau ------ / Jukka A. Ukkonen, FUNET / Centre for Scientific Computing /__ M.Sc. (sw-eng & cs) Tel: (Home) +358-0-6215280 / Internet: ukkonen@csc.fi (Work) +358-0-4573208 / Internet: jau@funet.fi (Mobile) +358-400-606671 v X.400: c=fi, admd=fumail, no prmd, org=csc, pn=jukka.ukkonen From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 11:48:04 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id LAA04836 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 11:48:04 -0800 Received: from sovcom.kiae.su (sovcom.kiae.su [144.206.136.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA04788 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 11:47:58 -0800 Received: by sovcom.kiae.su id AA09311 (5.65.kiae-1 ); Sat, 2 Dec 1995 22:39:52 +0300 Received: by sovcom.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Sat, 2 Dec 95 22:39:52 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by ache.dialup.ru (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA01234; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 22:38:40 +0300 To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org, "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" References: <199512021742.RAA14346@exalt.x.org> In-Reply-To: <199512021742.RAA14346@exalt.x.org>; from "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" at Sat, 02 Dec 1995 12:42:52 EDT Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 22:38:40 +0300 (MSK) X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.41 FreeBSD] From: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: Minor change to make Lines: 22 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 862 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk In message <199512021742.RAA14346@exalt.x.org> Kaleb S. KEITHLEY writes: >I want make to silently ignore a failure to find a .include file. The >reason I want this is because in the next release of X imake will generate >Makefiles that can use include files for dependencies if the system's make >supports it. >+ #if WANT_FATAL_INCLUDE_FAILURE > Parse_Error (PARSE_FATAL, "Could not find %s", file); >+ #endif Why not simple change PARSE_FATAL to PARSE_WARNING? I.e. this diagnostic prints (to help detect wrong includes), but it will be non-fatal. -- Andrey A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - http://dt.demos.su/~ache : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 12:25:52 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id MAA11971 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 12:25:52 -0800 Received: from expo.x.org (expo.x.org [198.112.45.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA11925 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 12:25:42 -0800 Received: from exalt.x.org by expo.x.org id AA00943; Sat, 2 Dec 95 15:25:09 -0500 Received: from localhost by exalt.x.org id UAA14567; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 20:25:08 GMT Message-Id: <199512022025.UAA14567@exalt.x.org> To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Minor change to make In-Reply-To: Your message of Sat, 02 Dec 1995 22:38:40 EDT. Organization: X Consortium Date: Sat, 02 Dec 1995 15:25:08 EDT From: "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > In message <199512021742.RAA14346@exalt.x.org> Kaleb S. KEITHLEY > writes: > > >I want make to silently ignore a failure to find a .include file. The > >reason I want this is because in the next release of X imake will generate > >Makefiles that can use include files for dependencies if the system's make > >supports it. > > >+ #if WANT_FATAL_INCLUDE_FAILURE > > Parse_Error (PARSE_FATAL, "Could not find %s", file); > >+ #endif > > Why not simple change PARSE_FATAL to PARSE_WARNING? > I.e. this diagnostic prints (to help detect wrong includes), > but it will be non-fatal. Humbug. I don't want a build log filled with (more) nonsense warnings; I've already got enough of those as it is. It could emit a warning if make is run with "-d i" or something. Would that make everyone happy? -- Kaleb KEITHLEY From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 12:42:32 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id MAA15698 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 12:42:32 -0800 Received: from werple.net.au (0@werple.mira.net.au [203.9.190.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA15685 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 12:42:29 -0800 Received: from cimaxp1.UUCP (Ucimlogi@localhost) by werple.net.au (8.7/8.7.1) with UUCP id HAA16702 for hackers@FreeBSD.org; Sun, 3 Dec 1995 07:17:53 +1100 (EST) Message-Id: <199512022017.HAA16702@werple.net.au> X-Authentication-Warning: werple.net.au: Ucimlogi set sender to cimaxp1!jb using -f Received: by cimaxp1.cimlogic.com.au; (5.65/1.1.8.2/10Sep95-0953AM) id AA00771; Sun, 3 Dec 1995 07:16:16 +1100 From: John Birrell Subject: Re: Hyperactive time To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Sun, 3 Dec 1995 07:16:15 +1100 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, jb@cimlogic.com.au In-Reply-To: <199512020822.AAA01205@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Dec 2, 95 00:22:12 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I just realised I'm seeing this as well, > I noticed that xearth is showing daylight here, bat my eyes say differnt > if I look outside.. > A kernel compiled on Nov 26 is ok, > but one compiled Wednesday seems to have fun with time.. > "aha! I'll call it tardis!.. tardis.tfs.com.. has a certain ring to it.. Only if you can get inside the box. Now, I'd liiike to seeee that! > and I can go home earlier too!" Depends if the machine jumps the day your ticket is for. Overnight the machine skipped more than a day (doing nothing). > > julian.. > > > Could it be seeing the xntpd packets that OSF/1 puts out? > not unless you're running xntpd on the BSD box.. I'm not. > you could have a cron job htat does > ntpdate osfbox every 5 minutes :) Our build process requires timestamps to be accurate. Things don't get updated even if I use a 5 minute update for time. > does the dmesg show your CPU (if it's a pentium) > as being the right speed? Its a 486. dmesg says this... FreeBSD 2.0.5-RELEASE #0: Thu Nov 30 18:32:49 EST 1995 jb@freebsd1.cimlogic.com.au:/usr/src/sys/compile/FREEBSD1 CPU: i486DX (486-class CPU) real memory = 16384000 (4000 pages) avail memory = 14983168 (3658 pages) Probing for devices on the ISA bus: sc0 at 0x60-0x6f irq 1 on motherboard sc0: VGA color <16 virtual consoles, flags=0x0> sio0 at 0x3f8-0x3ff irq 4 on isa sio0: type 16550A sio1 at 0x2f8-0x2ff irq 3 on isa sio1: type 16550A lpt0 at 0x378-0x37f irq 5 on isa lpt0: Interrupt-driven port lp0: TCP/IP capable interface fdc0 at 0x3f0-0x3f7 irq 6 drq 2 on isa fdc0: NEC 765 fd0: 1.44MB 3.5in wdc0 at 0x1f0-0x1f7 irq 14 on isa wdc0: unit 0 (wd0): wd0: 696MB (1427328 sectors), 1416 cyls, 16 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S wdc0: unit 1 (wd1): wd1: 696MB (1427328 sectors), 1416 cyls, 16 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S aha0: AHA-154x[AB]-V0.5, enabling residuals, target ops aha0: reading board settings, dma=5 int=11 (bus speed defaulted) aha0 at 0x330-0x333 irq 11 drq 5 on isa aha0 waiting for scsi devices to settle (aha0:0:0): "FUJITSU M2266S-512 0020" type 0 fixed SCSI 2 sd0(aha0:0:0): Direct-Access 1029MB (2107704 512 byte sectors) (aha0:2:0): "ARCHIVE VIPER 2525 25462 -905" type 1 removable SCSI 1 st0(aha0:2:0): Sequential-Access density code 0x0, drive empty scd0 not found at 0x230 ie0 at 0x360-0x36f irq 7 maddr 0xd0000 msize 65536 on isa <3C507 R1> ethernet address 00:60:8c:5b:06:4a npx0 on motherboard npx0: INT 16 interface Although it was built on Nov 30, the source was off the 2.0.5R CD. -- John Birrell CIMlogic Pty Ltd jb@cimlogic.com.au 119 Cecil Street Ph +61 3 9690 9600 South Melbourne Vic 3205 Fax +61 3 9690 6650 Australia Mob +61 18 353 137 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 13:04:41 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA21080 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 13:04:41 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA21066 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 13:04:38 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA04025 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 13:04:32 -0800 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: A German version of Walnut Creek's FreeBSD 2.1 CD Date: Sat, 02 Dec 1995 13:04:32 -0800 Message-ID: <4023.817938272@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Well, for a variety of reasons, we've decided to do versions of the CD specific to various local markets. My first goal is a German version, with german liner notes and german docs (where practical) and no "DOOM" in the commerce distribution! :-) [those who understand Germany's violence-in-games ban will understand why our doom-containing FreeBSD has encountered considerable resistance in German distributor channels]. The only issue is, we have to first decide on how we're going to do it! The help files the 2.1 installer uses live in the /usr/src/release/sysinstall/help directory (if you installed from 2.1 media, you'll also see them in your /stand/help directory). They're easy to translate, and certainly represent the path of least resistance for any translator. The only problem with this is that they're also sort of throw-away docs, just as FreeBSD 2.0.5's docs were. Everything in our documentation system is moving *away* from putting things in custom docfiles and we're trying to preserve our investment across releases instead by putting things in the Handbook. John (our docmaster) also put in some "conditional compilation" stuff so that a "BOOTHELP" subset of the handbook can be generated at any time. There are also some drawbacks to this. The Handbook's favorite output format is HTML, for which we have no stand-alone reader that I could easily integrate into sysinstall (lynx is huge and definitely doesn't match that description). So this means we'll have to generate the ASCII version and hand-edit it back into some sort of presentable format, that is without page breaks and such. All of the index information will, of course, be also lost. However, it'd also make me pretty sad if we ended up doing the 2.0.5 thing again, which was basically me getting a whole bunch of translations together and then realizing that several aspects of the approach were unworkable in the long-term and that the translation work wouldn't carry over easily into 2.1. The translators need easier access to their work, and ways of making it more generally useful than it was in 2.0.5. I think that the Handbook approach, despite the teething troubles we're almost certainly going to have with it, is the right way to go. It will let the translations be used both on the boot floppy (one version for each language this time) and on the regional WWW servers that are starting to pop up. So here's the decision: Do we want to work like bunnies to make the whole "subset of handbook on boot floppy" idea work correctly and then start working on translated versions of the handbook (with emphasis on BOOTHELP sections), or do we want to be honest with ourselves and conclude that it might simply be a whole lot more expedient to just translate the existing help files (and sysinstall's menus.c + dialogs) into German, get the german CD out on the market sometime before 1996 is over, and think about this problem as a longer-term goal? Oh yeah, one more thing. Having the translators work for free last time was most sincerely appreciated, and I was pretty floored at the response I got from people willing to do all that *work*, but I'd also like to see the principal translator(s) just a little better compensated this time. I don't think I can squeeze anything too extravagant out of WC, so don't get your hopes up too high, but reasonably meaningful gestures of appreciation can be made here! :-) We can work out the details as we go along, but start thinking about whether you'd prefer money or hardware.. :) I also see this translation work as a joint WC/FreeBSD Project venture (given that we also want the regional WWW pages) more than just a simple WC job. If it were just a WC job, I'd simply use the translators that WC already has on retainer and spare you all the work. That would also result in non-FreeBSD people doing the FreeBSD translations, however, and I think that this is a more important goal than just getting a localized version of the FreeBSD CD to market! Therefore, I'd like to try this "hybrid" approach and see how it works. Two goals, then, that we need to begin thinking about if we want to do this: 1. Re-form the translation team. I liked the model we had in 2.0.5, where there was one "lead" translator and a couple of backup translators. A momentary glitch in communications before that had 2 people working on a parallel translation for one of the languages and it was a mess trying to smash them back together. One translator and one translation style per language seems to work best, with the other translators making suggestions or small improvements. I've done a few things to make this easier. First, I've created another mailing list: translators@freebsd.org. Those interested in being part of the next translation project should send mail to majordomo@freebsd.org in the usual way and join this list, please. I've packed up the 2.1 install docs (the *ascii* versions) from sysinstall and left them in: ftp://freefall.freebsd.org/pub/incoming/2.1-install-help.tar.gz These are only for reference purposes if you don't have them already on your system somewhere. They shouldn't be something we'll need unless we decide to go the 'quick and dirty' route. 2. Think about what needs to happen in the handbook for translation to really become as a viable option there. Thanks! Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 13:07:49 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA21472 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 13:07:49 -0800 Received: from casparc.ppp.net (casparc.ppp.net [194.64.12.35]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id NAA21458 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 13:07:39 -0800 Received: from ernie by casparc.ppp.net with uucp (Smail3.1.28.1 #1) id m0tLz4M-000I5hC; Sat, 2 Dec 95 22:02 MET Received: by ernie.altona.hamburg.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #3) id m0tLy5E-00001dC; Sat, 2 Dec 95 20:58 MET Message-Id: From: hm@altona.hamburg.com (Hellmuth Michaelis) Subject: APM resume not rx'd with 3Com589C in PCMCIA slot To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 20:58:52 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: hm@altona.hamburg.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 769 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On a DEC HiNote 433 notebook APM functions fine as long as i don't plug a 3Com 3C589C into the PCMCIA slot - if i do, and want to APM-resume after a APM-suspend, the display is switched on but nothing more happenes. (compiling with APM_DEBUG defined: without the card i get the suspend and the resume message, with the card i just get the suspend message but no resume message; compiling with APM_SLOWSTART=5 makes no difference if that matters. Ah, and yes, this is still under 2.0.5, but as far as i see its the same code for 2.1). Am i doing something obviously wrong or is it a bug ? hellmuth -- Hellmuth Michaelis hm@altona.hamburg.com Hamburg, Europe (A)bort, (R)etry, (I)nstall BSD ? From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 13:41:20 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA25566 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 13:41:20 -0800 Received: from bubba.tribe.com ([205.184.207.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA25542 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 13:41:08 -0800 Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.tribe.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA02289; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 13:40:11 -0800 From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199512022140.NAA02289@bubba.tribe.com> Subject: Re: Minor change to make To: kaleb@x.org (Kaleb S. KEITHLEY) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 13:40:11 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199512021742.RAA14346@exalt.x.org> from "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" at Dec 2, 95 12:42:52 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 692 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > I want make to silently ignore a failure to find a .include file. The > reason I want this is because in the next release of X imake will generate > Makefiles that can use include files for dependencies if the system's make > supports it. > > N.B. ClearMake, SGI, and Digital, makes all have include directives that > silently ignore a failure to find the include file, so this isn't a new ...as does gmake (which is available as a package), so you could use it if you wanted to avoid rebuilding /usr/bin/make... -Archie _______________________________________________________________________________ Archie L. Cobbs, archie@tribe.com * Tribe Computer Works http://www.tribe.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 13:42:29 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA25726 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 13:42:29 -0800 Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA25693 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 13:42:18 -0800 Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.6.12/8.6.9.1) id OAA13833; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 14:40:50 -0700 From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199512022140.OAA13833@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) To: smp@csn.net (Steve Passe) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 14:40:49 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <199512021713.KAA04430@clem.systemsix.com> from "Steve Passe" at Dec 2, 95 10:13:36 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 4931 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Hi, Diddo. > >single *half* height or single *full* height? > > single, specifically I like the JDR Microdevices's ED-150 for 3.5" apps. It I assume "single *half* height"? :> > is well made mechanically, all metal except for the faceplate. The fan Ditto. Though the "knockout" is a full height -- I'll have to see if they have half-height blanks (or third height) available... > in this box is crap, unfortunately. > > >> used for things like tape drives). In its place I put a foam filter to > catch > >> dust. This allows airflow directly across the top of the drive. I also > > > >Hmmm... that's a good idea (tho' not quite as visually appealing! :>) > > Actually it looks like factory made if you take your time. With the above > mentioned box I remove the top-third faceplate blockout and cut a piece of "third"? is this a full height case with three third-height knockouts? > open-cell black foam slightly larger, which pops right in place from the back. > Looks like what nature intended from the front. I'll have to see if I can get half or third height knockouts with vent holes (the full height panel only has one set of holes along the *bottom* (tho' I could flip it over...) > >> get a GOOD fan from someplace like Digikey. Panasonic makes a line of > >> ball-beaing fans with much higher rated air-flows that the ones typically > >> found in disk cabinents. The oem fans also usually die in short order, > which > > > >And *another* good idea! I'll have to examine the fans on these cabinets > >a bit more closely... > > I don't recall ever seeing a quality fan in such boxes. The specs on the > panasonic fan I usually use: > > ball-bearing, 2.40 watts, 6.7 cfm, 32.0 db-A (digikey part# P9703-ND) Hmmm... the fan in this box is 25x80mm. Claims to be 250mA (i.e. 3W). Just gauging from size, similar fans (ball or sleeve bearing) in DigiKey catalog seem to be 25 - 40 CFM. Of course, it's thermostatically controlled so I'll have to hot-wire that... > >I was looking to put *two* 3243's in a fullheight external enclosure. > >Or, a single 1991. But, same problems (I imagine) would plague each... > > I recommend 2 3243's in 2 half-height boxes. They stack in about the same > space > as a double height box and give you alot more flexibility. Put a root > partition on both, you get some crash recover benefits. You also can do some > load balancing and get better scsi thruput. Get a couple scsi-I ribbon cable So far, my only disagreement is 2 drives in a *single* full height enclosure. :-/ > connectors and build a 3" connector to attach the 2 boxes, no bulky 3 foot > cable dangling between the two. One thing to consider, I have seen > combinations > of external boxes that became unhappy with mixed flat and round cables. Yes, I've seen/heard similar horror stories. > Something to do with impedance mis-match. Remember that each box has approx. > 8-12" of flat cable inside, so if you string together 3 or 4 boxes with > round cables there are a lot of impedance changes happening. I like to build > flat cables to connect all the boxes in a chain, including the link between > computer and 1st box. Ah, well, I'll hopefully buy good enough cables ;-) > >your intended application? :> Maybe just put a warning light and then > >hardwire a circuit to (unceremoniously) remove power from the drive at > hi-temp. > > I have wondered about this. At what temperature is it better to clobber the > file system and spare the drive a few minutes more of over-temp condition? > I suspect most modern drives will shut down when they get TOO hot. The > problem > is a drive that runs borderline for long periods of time, degrading its > lifetime. I guess that reaching the warning (yellow) temp means orderly > shutdown, if red is reached while program is still running just cut the power. Right. My point was that if the yellow is ignored, don't count on someone "observing" (i.e. reacting to) the red, either! I feel that yellow (to use your example) should only occur when things are becoming exceptional (i.e. you shouldn't be running yellow all the time!). Expect someone to fix the problem that is causing the yellow. If they don't and "red" happens, just go to a brute force solution. This can all be implemented with a few comparators, etc. > >How warm does the 3243 case get (use *top* side of finger to test). > > If you mean the cabinent it is in, top of finger, wrist, big toe, > it feels maybe 5 deg above room temp to me. If I can find an appropriate > thermometer around here I will get an actual measurement. > > If you mean the 3243 drive itself, I don't know offhand, not eager to open up > a cabinent to find out right now... Well, actually, *that's* what I was looking for... :-) How long has this been in service and what kind of (ab)use does it see? I'd like to order 4 of them next week (or comparable). From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 13:49:14 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id NAA26723 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 13:49:14 -0800 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (root@UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id NAA26677 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 13:48:56 -0800 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA28943 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Sat, 2 Dec 1995 07:49:16 -0600 Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id HAA02084; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 07:47:00 -0600 Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 07:47:00 -0600 From: peter@taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Message-Id: <199512021347.HAA02084@bonkers.taronga.com> To: markd@grizzly.com Subject: Re: NPX still broken in 2.1.0-951104-SNAP... Newsgroups: taronga.freebsd.hackers In-Reply-To: <199511060224.SAA06030@grizzly.com> References: <199511052310.KAA18574@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Organization: Taronga Park BBS Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Mark Diekhans wrote: >Its incompatible with every Unix system I have access to. See enclosed table. >No system core dumps! I don't have any standards handy, but SCO, which >is X/Open, ANSI, and POSIX compatible sets errno and returns NaN. I agree, this is the best default behaviour. >Most portable software checks errno, although the best approach is to check >both errno and NaN. Doubled. You shouldn't check errno unless you have an error status. Too much stuff sets errno as a side effect (:-p). From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 14:28:29 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA03961 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 14:28:29 -0800 Received: from expo.x.org (expo.x.org [198.112.45.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA03951 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 14:28:21 -0800 Received: from exalt.x.org by expo.x.org id AA02183; Sat, 2 Dec 95 17:27:47 -0500 Received: from localhost by exalt.x.org id WAA14667; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 22:27:41 GMT Message-Id: <199512022227.WAA14667@exalt.x.org> To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Minor change to make In-Reply-To: Your message of Sat, 02 Dec 1995 13:40:11 EDT. <199512022140.NAA02289@bubba.tribe.com> Organization: X Consortium Date: Sat, 02 Dec 1995 17:27:40 EDT From: "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > > I want make to silently ignore a failure to find a .include file. The > > reason I want this is because in the next release of X imake will generate > > Makefiles that can use include files for dependencies if the system's make > > supports it. > > > > N.B. ClearMake, SGI, and Digital, makes all have include directives that > > silently ignore a failure to find the include file, so this isn't a new > > ...as does gmake (which is available as a package), so you could use it > if you wanted to avoid rebuilding /usr/bin/make... > Humbug again. Since it's 99&44/100ths of the way there already, why should I have to tell people to go get gmake? Why can't the make that comes with the (next release of the) system "just do it"? I've had a fair number of bug-reports submitted by people who insist on using 100% gnu. gnu make, gnu ld, gnu as; even when the tools that came with their system are more than adequate. They tell me that gmake had an error, gnu ld won't link their shared libs on SunOS; doctor, it hurts when I go like this. I don't want to be in the business of telling people to get and use gmake, because then when it doesn't work, they'll expect me to make it work. I'd rather tell them to use the one that came with the system because it's known to work. -- Kaleb KEITHLEY X Consortium From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 14:28:30 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA03962 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 14:28:30 -0800 Received: from parody.tecc.co.uk (parody.tecc.co.uk [193.128.6.83]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA03866 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 14:28:10 -0800 Received: (from james@localhost) by parody.tecc.co.uk (8.6.12/8.6.12) id VAA00454; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 21:12:06 GMT Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 21:12:06 GMT From: James Raynard Message-Id: <199512022112.VAA00454@parody.tecc.co.uk> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Bug in TCP's urgent data mechanism (fwd) Organization: A FreeBSD box Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk This was posted to comp.protocols.tcp-ip a few days ago and I thought I'd forward it here as 2.1.0-RELEASE contains the (alleged) bug. Any comments? James ------- start of forwarded message ------- Path: parody.tecc.co.uk!handbag.tecc.co.uk!plug.news.pipex.net!pipex!tube.news.pipex.net!pipex!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!news-feed-1.peachnet.edu!pirates!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!swrinde!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in1.uu.net!news.biu.ac.il!news.huji.ac.il!shum.cc.huji.ac.il!pretzel.cs.huji.ac.il!pita.cs.huji.ac.il!orenl Newsgroups: comp.protocols.tcp-ip Subject: Bug in TCP's urgent data mechanism Message-ID: <49bpdr$d41@pretzel.cs.huji.ac.il> From: orenl@pita.cs.huji.ac.il (Oren Laden) Date: 27 Nov 1995 07:30:03 GMT Distribution: world Organization: The Hebrew U. of Jerusalem, Computer Science Dept. NNTP-Posting-Host: pita.cs.huji.ac.il Lines: 118 Description: ----------- Under certain circumstances (see below) TCP's output code does not set the URG flag on an outgoing packet holding urgent data. As a consequence this data becomes available to the consumer process as part of the regular stream. Consider the following scenario (with two processes, A and B): (assume at side A: snd_nxt == snd_una == snd_up == 573) A issues a write() syscall for 28 bytes. Before TCP actually delivers this data (OR the packet with the data got lost), A sends one OOB to B (seq#601). Now TCP's output function (tcp_output()) sends this urgent byte to the receiving side. At the other side, tcp_input() detects the urgent data and pulls it out. It also sends ACK for 573 (because the next packet was lost). tcp_output() (on A) retransmits 573-602 (the 28 bytes + the OOB). However, at the point where the code decides to set (or unset) the URG flag on the outgoing packet, the test compares snd_up to snd_nxt (which has advanced since !), resulting in a packet holding urgent data, without the URG flag set !This byte propagates later to process B's input stream, leading to unexpected behaviour. For example, watch the following TCP trace (filtered output of tcpdump): 1. A > b: P 557:573(16) ack 705 win 18980 2. b > A: P 705:737(32) ack 573 win 18432 3. A > b: P 601:602(1) ack 737 win 18980 urg 1 4. b > A: . ack 573 win 18432 5. A > b: . ack 737 win 18980 6. b > A: P 737:745(8) ack 573 win 18432 7. A > b: . ack 745 win 18980 8. A > b: P 573:602(29) ack 745 win 18980 9. b > A: . ack 602 win 18403 10. b > A: P 745:769(24) ack 602 win 18431 11. A > b: P 602:618(16) ack 769 win 18980 Note lines 3 (OOB delivering), 4 (ACK stays behind) and 8 (urgent data without URG flag). Release: ------- BSD/OS 1.0, 1.1, 2.0, 2.0.1 as well as: 4.4BSD networking code (and derivatives). Repeat-By: --------- It isn't simple to make the bug show itself... especially at the user level. Here is the proposed method (not deterministic, of course): Creat process A and B on different machines. Use INET sockets (TCP) to connect A and B, and then fork() A into two processes. Use the parent to write data to B, and the child to write OOB data (one byte) from time to time. If the network is congested enough, and you are lucky - process B will receive one extra byte of data. Fix: --- The fix is very simple - a small patch to netinet/tcp_output.c : Replace the lines surrounded by ifdef's (in tcp_output() subroutine...): tcp_output(tp) register struct tcpcb *tp; { ... ... ... /* * Calculate receive window. Don't shrink window, * but avoid silly window syndrome. */ if (win < (long)(so->so_rcv.sb_hiwat / 4) && win < (long)tp->t_maxseg) win = 0; if (win > (long)TCP_MAXWIN << tp->rcv_scale) win = (long)TCP_MAXWIN << tp->rcv_scale; if (win < (long)(tp->rcv_adv - tp->rcv_nxt)) win = (long)(tp->rcv_adv - tp->rcv_nxt); ti->ti_win = htons((u_short) (win>>tp->rcv_scale)); #ifdef FIX_OOB_BUG if (SEQ_GT(tp->snd_up, tp->snd_una)) { ti->ti_urp = htons((u_short)(tp->snd_up - ntohl(ti->ti_seq))); #else /* THE CODE BELOW IS WRONG ! */ if (SEQ_GT(tp->snd_up, tp->snd_nxt)) { ti->ti_urp = htons((u_short)(tp->snd_up - tp->snd_nxt)); #endif /* BUG SHOULD BE FIXED :-) */ ti->ti_flags |= TH_URG; } else /* * If no urgent pointer to send, then we pull * the urgent pointer to the left edge of the send window * so that it doesn't drift into the send window on sequence * number wraparound. */ ... ... ... } That's it folks. Oren. ___ **************************************** |\/\/\/|| \ ** Oren Laden (orenl@cs.huji.ac.il) ** | | |___/ /\ ___ ** ---------------------------------- ** | | | \ / \ | \ _____ ** Distributed Operating Systems lab. ** | (0)(0)|___/ /----\ |___/ | ** Computer Science Institute ** c _) / \ | \ | ** The Hebrew University of Jerusalem **| ,___| | \ | ** Jerusalem, Israel 91904 ** | / | **************************************** /____\ S I M P S O N " Ouch .... Quit It ! " / \ ------- end of forwarded message ------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 14:36:07 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA05337 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 14:36:07 -0800 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA05297 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 14:35:54 -0800 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id QAA04763; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 16:34:39 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199512022234.QAA04763@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 16:34:38 -0600 (CST) Cc: dgy@rtd.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <2251.817855120@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Dec 1, 95 01:58:40 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > I've been chasing down specs in the hopes of predicting how hot these > > guys run. Unfortunately, there seems to be little correlation between > > Pd and reported case temperatures (and I note that the 3243 I was chasing > > seems to be one of the nastiest wrt Pd!). > > Well, you could always try the Quantum Grand Prix drives - I've heard > that the newest generation are considerably more reliable, and not > quite so hot as the 'cudas. That may be, but I'm still leery of Quantum given their past history of reliability ("NOT"). The Barracudas run great IFF you put a fan on them. That means, even when mounted in a PC case, I leave space above and below, try to make an airflow path: (side view) -------------------------------------------------------------------------- case-^ | floppy drive | | o o | H |----------------------------------| PanaFlo fan-> H | a i r f l o w - - - \ | \H\ | | | XX\ \XX|XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX | | XXXX\ \|XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX | | XXXXXX\|oXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXoXXXX \|/ | XXXXXXX|XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX | | | | | | |----------------------------------| | | You can always drill extra holes in the mounting hdwr. Basically I try to ensure airflow around the drive, and mounting a fan with a piece of metal like this will cause the air to be forced over the top of the drive and then generally around the front and back out along the bottom. It doesn't have to be a "major" air flow but it never hurts. The fans I typically use are like an inch and a half.. quite small yet sufficient. This is good to do for ANY hi-cap drive and I always do something similar for any drive 1GB or larger... Don't even ask what I do when I build disk arrays!! :-) > > Are these things comfortable in an external enclosure (e.g., two > > drives in a dual drive enclosure with a single fan)? Just how "hot" > > is "hot"? > > Hotter than that! :-) I wouldn't recommend it. One drive in a box > maybe. Two, well, maybe you could put a hot plate on top and cook > your breakfast in the morning.. :-) In a well ventilated two-hi case (well ventilated defined as a case with straight through airflow) that is designed for two full height 3 1/2" devices, I would feel comfortable mounting two 1" high 3 1/2" devices, but probably nothing else unless the drives have airflow completely around them. Time and time again this point is lost on people. You can run a drive alongside a slice of toast in your toaster as long as it has cool air flowing over it. ;-) > > Likewise, is Icc(startup) going to require sequencing the spindles on > > the drives? Or, is this of such a transient nature that it is > > No. Jordan, so quick to say no. The answer is dependent on the drives, how close you are running to the capacity of the supply, etc. Most enclosures have wimpy power supplies, this is a problem :-( I have an array of older Wren class drives. These fellas take something like 4.5A at 12V to spin up and run at about 1.5A at 12V. Six of them. :-) Including 5VDC that's probably about 350W to spin them up (4.5 x 12 x 6 + 1 x 5 x 6) but only about 120W to run them. I use standard 230W PC power supplies because they are inexpensive, but remember that a fair percentage of the power available on a PC supply is +5V, so that means you have to be very careful or you will see a smoke display followed by a shutdown. I saw that once, by the way. Once. Not my drives thank God. Fellow put 7 similar drives on a PC power supply and switched it on. The whine followed by the (POP) was quite memorable so I don't think I will try it any time soon :-) So I drive the pile with a pair of 230W supplies (maybe they are 250W's). Sequencing the spindles obviously provides some protection. Better protection is to buy a large enough power supply (or several) so that the spin up is right around the rated capacity of the supplies. Today's drives take somewhat less current (Barracudas spin up on 2.2A @ 12V, the Barra LP's are more like 1.3A @ 12V) but you're still asking a hell of a lot out of many power supplies. Basically drive manufacturers and enclosure manufacturers are both doing their own things. Drive mfrs make hot drives. Enclosure mfrs make enclosures that are sucky at keeping drives cool. Vendors are stupid (mine tried to tell me that the Barracudas run fine without airflow when I asked him what he did to handle airflow issues, I showed him the manual and asked him how hot they typically ran, he said too hot to touch... I wonder how many of his customers will be needing warranty replacements in the near future!) It is up to you to do your own drives right ;-) ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 14:43:43 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA06584 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 14:43:43 -0800 Received: from sequent.kiae.su (sequent.kiae.su [144.206.136.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA06550 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 14:43:22 -0800 Received: by sequent.kiae.su id AA00271 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Sun, 3 Dec 1995 01:32:40 +0300 Received: by sequent.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Sun, 3 Dec 95 01:32:39 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by ache.dialup.ru (8.6.12/8.6.12) id BAA01940; Sun, 3 Dec 1995 01:31:28 +0300 To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org, "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" References: <199512022025.UAA14567@exalt.x.org> In-Reply-To: <199512022025.UAA14567@exalt.x.org>; from "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" at Sat, 02 Dec 1995 15:25:08 EDT Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Sun, 3 Dec 1995 01:31:28 +0300 (MSK) X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.41 FreeBSD] From: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: Minor change to make Lines: 40 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1558 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk In message <199512022025.UAA14567@exalt.x.org> Kaleb S. KEITHLEY writes: >> In message <199512021742.RAA14346@exalt.x.org> Kaleb S. KEITHLEY >> writes: >> >> >I want make to silently ignore a failure to find a .include file. The >> >reason I want this is because in the next release of X imake will generate >> >Makefiles that can use include files for dependencies if the system's make >> >supports it. >> >> >+ #if WANT_FATAL_INCLUDE_FAILURE >> > Parse_Error (PARSE_FATAL, "Could not find %s", file); >> >+ #endif >> >> Why not simple change PARSE_FATAL to PARSE_WARNING? >> I.e. this diagnostic prints (to help detect wrong includes), >> but it will be non-fatal. >Humbug. I don't want a build log filled with (more) nonsense warnings; >I've already got enough of those as it is. >It could emit a warning if make is run with "-d i" or something. Would >that make everyone happy? Default case must produce diagnostic. Our system Makefiles very depends on .included parts and can acts undetectable different when some parts are missing by typing error f.e. I have nothing against adding commandline option to _disable_ error or .sinclude as you originally suggest or something like .IGNORE_INCLUDES: target (I prefer this solution). -- Andrey A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - http://dt.demos.su/~ache : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 14:59:35 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id OAA09593 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 14:59:35 -0800 Received: from fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (Fieber-John.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA09567 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 14:59:29 -0800 Received: (from jfieber@localhost) by fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) id RAA13877; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 17:59:11 -0500 Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 17:59:08 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber X-Sender: jfieber@fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu To: Andrew Herdman cc: "matthew c. mead" , davidg@Root.COM, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: SMC EtherEZ 8416 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 29 Nov 1995, Andrew Herdman wrote: > On Wed, 29 Nov 1995, matthew c. mead wrote: > > > On Tue, November 28, 1995 at 20:22:56 (-0800), David Greenman wrote: > > > > > > I've got an SMC EtherEZ 8416 that I'd like to use with FreeBSD, and it > > > >shows up properly under the ed0 driver, but anytime I try to use the card I get > > > >an error message that looks like this: > > > > > >ed0: NIC memory corrupt - Invalid packet length 4648. [snip] > Thats ok, this card has the same problem with bsdi 2.0.1 and 2.0. It's a > crappy card. > > Andrew > > Use the SMC Ultra 16 instead For the record, I have an ultra 16 combo card and: Nov 19 13:35:33 fieber-john /kernel: ed0: NIC memory corrupt - invalid packet length 2307 Nov 27 19:17:26 fieber-john /kernel: ed0: NIC memory corrupt - invalid packet length 2112 It has only happened twice, and I have not noticed any ill effects. The system is about 1 or 2 snapshots before 2.1. -john == jfieber@indiana.edu =========================================== == http://fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu/~jfieber ============ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 15:04:59 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA10756 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:04:59 -0800 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA10723 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:04:52 -0800 Received: (from hasty@localhost) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id PAA12690 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:04:35 -0800 Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:04:35 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Message-Id: <199512022304.PAA12690@rah.star-gate.com> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Okay all you mbone hounds Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk If you got a bone to the mbone connection check out the the concert being broadcasted from Dublin, Ireland. Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 15:08:01 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA11409 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:08:01 -0800 Received: from w8hd.w8hd.org (w8hd.w8hd.org [198.252.159.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA11392 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:07:53 -0800 Received: (from kimc@localhost) by w8hd.w8hd.org (8.6.12/8.6.9) id SAA09887; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 18:07:49 -0500 Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 18:07:48 -0500 (EST) From: Kim Culhan To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) In-Reply-To: <199512022140.OAA13833@seagull.rtd.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Sat, 2 Dec 1995, Don Yuniskis wrote: > I'll have to see if I can get half or third height knockouts with vent holes > (the full height panel only has one set of holes along the *bottom* (tho' > I could flip it over...) If you find a source for those half-height knockouts I'd like to know about it. Recently a client bought a pair of Seagate ST32550 'cuda drives from 'Falcon' which is a drive-in-a-box reseller. They mount these in a somewhat cheezy box which is full-height with a fan in the back wall and those half-height 'knockouts' in the front (they look just like the plastic front on a half-height drive, including the green led.) With the drives mounted on individual brackets a couple of inches behind the front panel the temperature of the actual drives is only slightly warm. One of these drives mounted in the space below the floppy mtg. in a modern- style case will be super hot OTOH. > So far, my only disagreement is 2 drives in a *single* full height > enclosure. :-/ Setup as above, 2x 'cudas are good to go. regards kim -- kimc@w8hd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 15:13:13 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA12511 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:13:13 -0800 Received: from clem.systemsix.com (clem.systemsix.com [198.99.86.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA12426 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:12:29 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by clem.systemsix.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id QAA05944; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 16:10:42 -0700 Message-Id: <199512022310.QAA05944@clem.systemsix.com> X-Authentication-Warning: clem.systemsix.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 From: Steve Passe To: Don Yuniskis cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 02 Dec 1995 16:10:41 -0700 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hi, >"third"? is this a full height case with three third-height knockouts? yes, I guess I misspoke b4, it's a "full height 3.5 inch" formfactor which means one MC3243 will fit in it. It comes with a 2/3 knockout (snapout, actually) and a 1/3 knockout panel. I leave the 2/3 in, replace the 1/3. The resulting open area is immediately in front of and aligned with the top of the disk drive top surface. >I'll have to see if I can get half or third height knockouts with vent holes >(the full height panel only has one set of holes along the *bottom* (tho' >I could flip it over...) unless it looks like swiss cheese something like that will only allow a fraction of the airflow of a removed panel with foam insert. >Hmmm... the fan in this box is 25x80mm. Claims to be 250mA (i.e. 3W). >Just gauging from size, similar fans (ball or sleeve bearing) in DigiKey >catalog seem to be 25 - 40 CFM. Of course, it's thermostatically controlled >so I'll have to hot-wire that... thats a step up in size from the ones used in the box I mentioned. They are 40mm square by 20mm thick. The thermostatic variety fan is another potential for trouble. I replaced a powersupply with one of these in a cabinet where the supply sat in the bottom of a tower cabinet. The thermistor never saw the heat generated by the cards, which rose to the top of the cabinet. I happened to notice one day that the cabinet top was almost too hot to touch, yet the fan was barely moving. Needless to say, I never use these anymore. >> I recommend 2 3243's in 2 half-height boxes. > ... >So far, my only disagreement is 2 drives in a *single* full height >enclosure. :-/ as I said above, I misspoke, I meant to say: I recommend 2 3243's in 2 full-height 3.5" boxes. (as oppossed to one double height box) >> combinations >> of external boxes that became unhappy with mixed flat and round cables. >... >> ... there are a lot of impedance changes happening. ... >... >Ah, well, I'll hopefully buy good enough cables ;-) cable quality is not the problem, its the different impedance characteristics of ribbon vs. shielded round cables. The ANSI SCSI-I spec says: " ... characteristic impedance of 100 ohms +- 10% is recommended for unshieled flat or twisted pair ribbon cable. ... greater than 90 ohms is preferred for shielded cables; however, most available cables have a somewhat lower characteristic impedance. To minimize discontinuities and signal reflections, cables of different impedances should not be used in the same bus." >... >Right. My point was that if the yellow is ignored, don't count on >someone "observing" (i.e. reacting to) the red, either! I feel that yellow my widget doesn't count on anyone observing either condition. there is a separate hook for a user provided callback for each condition. I expect the user to put code in place to 'do the good thing' without human intervention. The visuals are there to make it look pretty. I suppose they would also be useful while one was 'tuning the airflow' of a cabinet, etc. I also expect to add a stripchart widget once I actually build the hardware. One could then get a history of temp. changes over time. With this you could compare the occurance of transient system errors (parity, core dumps, etc.) with the temp. of the machine at the point they occurred. >How long has this been in service and what kind of (ab)use does it see? >I'd like to order 4 of them next week (or comparable). I've been using it since installing the 2.1.0-092295-SNAP, so about 2+ months now. It sees moderate usage as a personnal workstation. never seen a disk related error yet. There has been alot of mail lately about the quality of the micropolis drives going downhill, which bothers me a bit. My own experience with micropolis has been such that I have used nothing else for 4-5 years now. I have to admit that I have always seen a high 'infant mortality rate' with them, maybe 1 in 10 in the last 5 years, but have never had any problem getting a replacement. And when they make it past that first week, I have never had one die in the last five years. Since I run mostly unix, that means 5 years of round the clock usage for the older ones (330 Mb SCSI I). My advice would be to buy them from a reputable dealer, then burn them in well, perhaps run 'locate' every half hour from cron the first few weeks. If that doesn't kill them they should last for awhile. Also let me qualify everything I have said above as to being based on my own limited personnel experience as an end user. I buy maybe 2 drives a year, so my statistics are fairly narrow. -- Steve Passe | powered by smp@csn.net | FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 15:24:48 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA14396 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:24:48 -0800 Received: from expo.x.org (expo.x.org [198.112.45.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA14374 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:24:36 -0800 Received: from exalt.x.org by expo.x.org id AA02711; Sat, 2 Dec 95 18:24:02 -0500 Received: from localhost by exalt.x.org id XAA14699; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 23:24:02 GMT Message-Id: <199512022324.XAA14699@exalt.x.org> To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Minor change to make In-Reply-To: Your message of Sat, 02 Dec 1995 13:53:19 EDT. <199512022153.NAA18484@multivac.orthanc.com> Organization: X Consortium Date: Sat, 02 Dec 1995 18:24:01 EDT From: "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Is is possible for you to use the ".if !exists(...)" construct > instead? As long as you know the path (relative or absolute) to > the include this should solve the problem without introducing > an incompatible change to make. It happens to work, but I don't see it as equivalent. According to the man page `.if exists(file)' has different file search semantics than `.include "file"'. How do I know someone won't put 'depend.mk' in /usr/share/mk some day? I just don't feel that lucky. :-) Nor do I agree that this is an incompatible change, and that not withstanding I did say that I was willing to do the work to add this functionality as a new feature that would preserve the legacy behavior. I know hacking make isn't as sexy as writing file systems, schedulers, MS-DOS emulators, and linux binary compat; but I don't understand the resistance to adding this? For as many times as I build X, it would save a bunch of time for me if I didn't have to rebuild the dependencies every time I remake the Makefile because I am able to preserve them in an include file. If it's useful to me I'm sure it'd be useful to someone else too. -- Kaleb KEITHLEY X Consortium From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 15:28:11 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA14816 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:28:11 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA14684 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:28:02 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA06602; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 16:25:00 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199512022325.QAA06602@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: ft (Qic 40/80) To: trangmar@gnsnet.com (Robert Trangmar) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 16:25:00 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Robert Trangmar" at Dec 2, 95 00:59:15 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1051 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Does anyone know why this this wasn't written as a *complete* tape driver? > It would be really useful for me to have this as a device i could use > dump and tar on and i am considering looking further into it with a view > to enhancing it to do just that. > Just thought i'd cast around to see if anyone had any input before i > expended/wasted valuable time. Yeah. Even with double buffering to allow non-streaming access to resync correctly, you have only a 200uS window in which to respond. Process quantum @ 100HZ is 10mS, 50 times to large to guarantee the thing will operate correctly on a loaded system without some higher resoloution kernel timers and scheduling mechanisms in the kernel itself. Then either the timer has to be handled at interrupt level, or it has to add a preeemption point for involuntary preemption of the process that happens to be running when it needs to do its thing. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 15:29:50 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA14858 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:29:50 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA14848 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:29:37 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA06620; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 16:27:01 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199512022327.QAA06620@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Increasing size of shared memory segmenty To: taob@io.org (Brian Tao) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 16:27:01 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Brian Tao" at Dec 2, 95 01:40:55 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 978 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Okay... I gather I need to bump up SHMMAX (max. segment size) as > well as SHMALL (max. total size of all segments?). I'm running a > 2.1.0-RELEASE kernel with these settings: > > shminfo: > shmmax: 16777216 (max shared memory segment size) > shmmin: 1 (min shared memory segment size) > shmmni: 32 (max number of shared memory identifiers) > shmseg: 8 (max shared memory segments per process) > shmall: 4096 (max amount of shared memory in pages) > > Seems to be working okay so far, although I still can't load those > nice 1536x1024 (or larger) PhotoCD pictures into gimp... :( Check your soft limits. % limit cputime unlimited filesize unlimited datasize 65536 kbytes stacksize 8192 kbytes coredumpsize unlimited memoryuse 7284 kbytes memorylocked 4858 kbytes maxproc 40 openfiles 64 Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 15:32:21 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA15145 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:32:21 -0800 Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA15137 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:32:13 -0800 Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA06650; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 16:30:15 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199512022330.QAA06650@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: ideas from netbsd To: peter@taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 16:30:15 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199512021418.IAA02500@bonkers.taronga.com> from "Peter da Silva" at Dec 2, 95 08:18:10 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 563 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Man, you *do* pull these messages out of a time capsule, or something. > Terry Lambert wrote: > >But what it has to "gain" by not doing it is gratuitous incompatability. > > I don't understand why "being compatible with NetBSD" and "having a > COMPAT_NETBSD hack that can be turned on and off" are equivalent > statements. Because FreeBSD and NetBSD are not compatible by choice in the first place. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 15:33:09 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA15191 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:33:09 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA15180 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:33:01 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id PAA07587; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:32:51 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199512022332.PAA07587@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: Hyperactive time To: cimaxp1!jb@werple.net.au (John Birrell) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:32:51 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jb@cimlogic.com.au In-Reply-To: <199512022017.HAA16702@werple.net.au> from "John Birrell" at Dec 3, 95 07:16:15 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 610 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > > > > I just realised I'm seeing this as well, > > I noticed that xearth is showing daylight here, bat my eyes say differnt > > if I look outside.. > > A kernel compiled on Nov 26 is ok, > > but one compiled Wednesday seems to have fun with time.. NOPE, the present current (a new compile) wirks fine.. maybe it was a transient thing? (my box has lost 5 minutes in 24 hours, not good but no hyperactive......) > > "aha! I'll call it tardis!.. tardis.tfs.com.. has a certain ring to it.. > > Only if you can get inside the box. Now, I'd liiike to seeee that! out of ideas.. bde is your best hope.. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 15:34:38 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA15332 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:34:38 -0800 Received: from lisa.rur.com (G338.257.InterLink.NET [199.202.234.53]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA15313 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:34:27 -0800 Received: (from leo@localhost) by lisa.rur.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA18162; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 18:34:39 -0500 Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 18:34:39 -0500 (EST) From: Leo Papandreou To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) In-Reply-To: <199512022234.QAA04763@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Sat, 2 Dec 1995, Joe Greco wrote: > > > I've been chasing down specs in the hopes of predicting how hot these > > > guys run. Unfortunately, there seems to be little correlation between > > > Pd and reported case temperatures (and I note that the 3243 I was chasing > > > seems to be one of the nastiest wrt Pd!). > > > > Well, you could always try the Quantum Grand Prix drives - I've heard > > that the newest generation are considerably more reliable, and not > > quite so hot as the 'cudas. > > That may be, but I'm still leery of Quantum given their past history of > reliability ("NOT"). The Barracudas run great IFF you put a fan on them. > That means, even when mounted in a PC case, I leave space above and below, > try to make an airflow path: > I did that. I went to the trouble of buying a very heavy duty server case with all sorts of fans and airflow and a humongous 400W power supply. I mounted the Barracuda vertically, directly in front of one of the fans. Barely warm to the touch. It went south on me. I'm getting it checked out because I never backed it up and because I have reason to believe that the heads are intact, that the failure was electronic. Still, where there's smoke, there's fire. It seems to me that these drives have been the subject of too much negative noise to warrant consideration. The Quantum Atlas II's look very nice. /Leo From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 15:44:56 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA16262 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:44:56 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA16237 ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:44:40 -0800 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id PAA07627; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:44:30 -0800 Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:44:30 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199512022344.PAA07627@ref.tfs.com> To: current@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Nothing heard about JREMOD.. Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I assume this means no-one's having any problems? julian s From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 15:53:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA16955 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:53:40 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA16950 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:53:37 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id PAA04618; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:51:58 -0800 To: Joe Greco cc: dgy@rtd.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 02 Dec 1995 16:34:38 CST." <199512022234.QAA04763@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Date: Sat, 02 Dec 1995 15:51:57 -0800 Message-ID: <4616.817948317@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Jordan, so quick to say no. The answer is dependent on the drives, how > close you are running to the capacity of the supply, etc. Most enclosures > have wimpy power supplies, this is a problem :-( Yes, but I never use enclosures with wimpy power supplies (you should see the one in wcarchive!) so such power sequencing isn't necessary. Yes, you could argue that people jamming multiple drives into PC enclosures with wimpy power supplies will suffer, but then I'd never suggest that people do so, either! If you're going to start using lots of drives, get them their own home and their own nice little PS! Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 15:54:40 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA16994 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:54:40 -0800 Received: from bacchus.eng.umd.edu (bacchus.eng.umd.edu [129.2.94.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA16985 ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 15:54:29 -0800 Received: from latte.eng.umd.edu (latte.eng.umd.edu [129.2.98.15]) by bacchus.eng.umd.edu (8.7/8.7) with ESMTP id SAA01643; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 18:54:26 -0500 (EST) Received: (chuckr@localhost) by latte.eng.umd.edu (8.7.2/8.6.4) id SAA09453; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 18:54:24 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 18:54:21 -0500 (EST) From: Chuck Robey X-Sender: chuckr@latte.eng.umd.edu To: Sergio Lenzi cc: "Julian H. Stacey" , ports@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: INGRES 8.9 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Fri, 1 Dec 1995, Sergio Lenzi wrote: > On Thu, 30 Nov 1995, Julian H. Stacey wrote: > > > > > > > > Well I ftp'd them & had a v. quick look, > > For it to be considered a `FreeBSD ported package' > > it needs a top Makefile that is > > bsd make, not gnu make > > (you can have gnus in the work/ subdir) > > /usr/ingre/src is unacceptable, > > it must reside in /usr/ports/databases/ingres You know, Julian, there is such a thing as a package, it's not a port, and it already is built. I didn't think he claimed he had a port, I thought he said it was a package. The bin part of it surely is, anyways. I think it might be right to urge him to put it in as a port, but completely unfair to tell him he did it wrong. As a package, it isn't wrong. I like ports, you like ports, but there IS that alternative, and I think asking him to go that extra step is more friendly than telling him he's wrong because he didn't. > > > > /usr/ingres is ... well .. debatable > > usr/local & such normally ... oh well. > > > > anyway I'm out of time, > > but it doesnt qualify as a FreeBSD package ... yet, > > > > Would you like to look at a few of the 400 /usr/ports/*/*/Makefile, > > grab the syntax out of a few, & write a makefile & DESC & pkg/ stuff, > > > > then when you've done that i'll test it & if OK commit it. > > > > > Forgive me if I was misundestood, > > This is not suposed to be a "port", just an answer to > the people that want a "try" in ingres. > > As I see, the interest is growing, I'll promiss to make a > real "PORT", thanks to your assistance. My job in bsi.com.br (an internet > provider is taking me almost all of my time). > May be in 1 week or later a "port" will be in "place". > I am not trying to do just an ingres database that works, > it is almost ready, a set of examples on how to work with it > using the equel language (building a customer system that manages and > prints customer information) stored in a ingres database with the > help of a curses/panel library. > > > Sergio de Almeida Lenzi. > > ============================================================================ Chuck Robey chuckr@eng.umd.edu -- I run FreeBSD on n3lxx and Journey2 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Dilbert Zone is Dilbert's new WWW home! The area features never-before-seen original sketches of Dilbert, a photo tour of Scott Adams' studio, Dilbert Trivia and memorabilia, high school photos and much more!: From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 16:08:53 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA19210 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 16:08:53 -0800 Received: from bubba.tribe.com ([205.184.207.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA19164 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 16:08:46 -0800 Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.tribe.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA02784; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 16:06:41 -0800 From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199512030006.QAA02784@bubba.tribe.com> Subject: Re: ethernet card configuration programs To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 16:06:41 -0800 (PST) Cc: archie@tribe.com, erich@lodgenet.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199512020715.XAA01029@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Dec 1, 95 11:15:32 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1457 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > > this is a linux web page with sources for ethernet > > > card configuration. I've compiled the 3c509, but > > > I haven't tested it yet. > > > > > > http://cesdis.gsfc.nasa.gov/linux/diag/diagnostic.html > > > > > > eric. > > > -- > > > erich@lodgenet.com > > > erich@rrnet.com > > > > Would it be possible for someone to port these to FreeBSD? This > > would be great because I always have to boot DOS to run the stupid > > config program for NE2000 compatible cards... for some reason the > > default card configuration and the default FreeBSD "ed1" configuration > > don't agree. > > > > I don't know what the equivalent/substitute for #include > > would be... but it looks like it shouldn't be too difficult > > since the programs are very short. > > #include > > you have to open /dev/io to get permissions to do inb() and outb() > instructions.. > otherwise it should just about compile... Well, I tried this and... it seems to work! That is, it works with "atlantic.c" but not with "ne2k.c", because ne2k.c also uses "outb_p" and "inb_p", which this command has something to do with, I think: /* The following is needed for SLOW_DOWN_IO. */ if (ioperm(0x80, 1, 1)) { perror("io-perm"); return 1; } Thanks for the help! -Archie _______________________________________________________________________________ Archie L. Cobbs, archie@tribe.com * Tribe Computer Works http://www.tribe.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 16:54:04 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id QAA26119 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 16:54:04 -0800 Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA26090 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 16:53:55 -0800 Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.6.12/8.6.9.1) id RAA18605; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 17:39:08 -0700 From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199512030039.RAA18605@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 17:39:07 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <4616.817948317@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Dec 2, 95 03:51:57 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 917 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > Jordan, so quick to say no. The answer is dependent on the drives, how > > close you are running to the capacity of the supply, etc. Most enclosures > > have wimpy power supplies, this is a problem :-( > > Yes, but I never use enclosures with wimpy power supplies (you should > see the one in wcarchive!) so such power sequencing isn't necessary. > > Yes, you could argue that people jamming multiple drives into PC > enclosures with wimpy power supplies will suffer, but then I'd never > suggest that people do so, either! If you're going to start using > lots of drives, get them their own home and their own nice little PS! Ack! So, given they have their own little home (a full height 5" external enclosure), is the "typical" 60W supply going to cut the mustard? Guess I don't know how long the powerup transients are and how much extra reserve these little supplies have up their sleeves. Thx, don From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 17:13:42 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA29007 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 17:13:42 -0800 Received: from sequent.kiae.su (sequent.kiae.su [144.206.136.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id RAA28986 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 17:13:27 -0800 Received: by sequent.kiae.su id AA18844 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Sun, 3 Dec 1995 04:09:07 +0300 Received: by sequent.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Sun, 3 Dec 95 04:09:07 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by ache.dialup.ru (8.6.12/8.6.12) id EAA02915; Sun, 3 Dec 1995 04:08:30 +0300 To: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" References: <199512022324.XAA14699@exalt.x.org> In-Reply-To: <199512022324.XAA14699@exalt.x.org>; from "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" at Sat, 02 Dec 1995 18:24:01 EDT Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Sun, 3 Dec 1995 04:08:29 +0300 (MSK) X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.41 FreeBSD] From: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: Minor change to make Lines: 22 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 935 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk In message <199512022324.XAA14699@exalt.x.org> Kaleb S. KEITHLEY writes: >I know hacking make isn't as sexy as writing file systems, schedulers, >MS-DOS emulators, and linux binary compat; but I don't understand the >resistance to adding this? For as many times as I build X, it would save Resistance is very simple: removing this warning you lost ability to detect wrongly typed include file names. It is vital for most of system Makefiles in FreeBSD and can cause unpredictable things. Whats wrong with my proposal? (make this change controlled by special .IGNORE_INCLUDES: target?) Lost of things already controlled in such way. -- Andrey A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - http://dt.demos.su/~ache : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 17:44:05 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id RAA03697 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 17:44:05 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA03666 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 17:43:52 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id RAA05035; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 17:43:35 -0800 To: Don Yuniskis cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 02 Dec 1995 17:39:07 MST." <199512030039.RAA18605@seagull.rtd.com> Date: Sat, 02 Dec 1995 17:43:35 -0800 Message-ID: <5032.817955015@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Ack! So, given they have their own little home (a full height 5" > external enclosure), is the "typical" 60W supply going to cut the mustard? > Guess I don't know how long the powerup transients are and how much extra > reserve these little supplies have up their sleeves. Here's the rule of thumb: If dropping the transformer for the PS on your foot from waist height would break your foot, then the PS is big enough. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 18:30:31 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id SAA08365 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 18:30:31 -0800 Received: from spooky.rwwa.com (rwwa.com [198.115.177.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA08357 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 18:30:24 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spooky.rwwa.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA11976 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 21:36:33 -0500 Message-Id: <199512030236.VAA11976@spooky.rwwa.com> X-Authentication-Warning: spooky.rwwa.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.5.3 12/28/94 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Proper way to determine non-blocking status... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 02 Dec 1995 21:36:30 -0500 From: Robert Withrow Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Even though it seems like it is almost never done by existing driver code, would I be correct in assuming that the *right* way to determine if a device read is allowed to sleep or not is the following? int xxread(dev_t dev, struct uio *uio, int ioflag) { if (ioflag & IO_NDELAY) { /* Can't block here */ return EWOULDBLOCK; } else { /* Otherwise try again */ /* Can sleep here */ ... } } ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Robert Withrow, Tel: +1 617 598 4480, Fax: +1 617 598 4430 Net: witr@rwwa.COM R.W. Withrow Associates, 319 Lynnway Suite 201, Lynn MA 01901 USA From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 19:12:48 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA12164 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 19:12:48 -0800 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA12153 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 19:12:40 -0800 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id SAA04982; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 18:13:13 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199512030013.SAA04982@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: No Thumbs??? (lack of concensus) To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 18:13:13 -0600 (CST) Cc: dgy@rtd.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <4616.817948317@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Dec 2, 95 03:51:57 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > Jordan, so quick to say no. The answer is dependent on the drives, how > > close you are running to the capacity of the supply, etc. Most enclosures > > have wimpy power supplies, this is a problem :-( > > Yes, but I never use enclosures with wimpy power supplies (you should > see the one in wcarchive!) so such power sequencing isn't necessary. Yes, but people who don't know what we know don't know better. And it's HARD to find good enclosures. When I wanted a 3.5" drive array that could hold a dozen 1" disks on three SCSI busses in a space-efficient yet well-cooled manner, I went and built one in the shop, out of a bunch of angle irons :-) Cool design, and fits in 15"x8"x18".... dual 230W power supplies and a bunch of SCSI cable, and it's a very workable solution to the "cool storage problem". Much cheaper than a commercial solution that wouldn't provide adequate cooling or power ;-) > Yes, you could argue that people jamming multiple drives into PC > enclosures with wimpy power supplies will suffer, but then I'd never > suggest that people do so, either! If you're going to start using > lots of drives, get them their own home and their own nice little PS! I couldn't agree more. I have four power supplies powering two drive arrays on news.sol.net, and another one running the box itself. Much prefer overkill than underkill. A PC supply is only $40 for a decent one! ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 19:40:43 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA14157 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 19:40:43 -0800 Received: from relay5.UU.NET (relay5.UU.NET [192.48.96.15]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA14083 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 19:40:20 -0800 Received: from uucp6.UU.NET by relay5.UU.NET with SMTP id QQzslq19221; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 22:40:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from uanet.UUCP by uucp6.UU.NET with UUCP/RMAIL ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 22:40:04 -0500 Received: by crocodil.monolit.kiev.ua; Sun, 3 Dec 95 05:36:40 +0200 Received: (from alexis@localhost) by unicorn.ww.net (8.6.11/alexis 2.5) id XAA12796; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 23:53:51 +0300 Message-Id: <199512022053.XAA12796@unicorn.ww.net> Subject: Re: DigiBoard and FreeBSD To: babkin@hq.icb.chel.su (Serge A. Babkin) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 23:53:51 +0300 (MSK) From: "Alexis Yushin" Cc: alexis@ww.net, john@starfire.skypoint.net, babkin@icb.chel.su, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199512021209.RAA10164@hq.icb.chel.su> from "Serge A. Babkin" at Dec 2, 95 05:09:01 pm Reply-To: alexis@ww.net (Alexis Yushin) X-Office-Phone: +380 65 2 26.1410 X-Home-Phone: +380 65 2 27.0747 X-NIC-Handle: AY23 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8b] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Once Serge A. Babkin wrote: >2.1 must contain my latest version in /sys/gnu/i386/isa. Try it. It is >enough stable. The main problem with it is that it sometimes resends >the output buffer. I'll look into it tonight. >> concerning FreeBSD vs DigiBoard and perhaps improve driver code to get >> my terminal server stable. So, please mail me everything you have >> concerning this topic to alexis@ww.net That may be driver sources, digi >> reverse engeneering, readmes and blurbs, documentation and patches etc etc > >I can give you the Linux driver sources (I took them from ftp.digibd.com). >I know that paster@peak.urc.ac.ru have made some changes to it. Thanks. I think if something else still to be done we could cooperate, because FreeBSD is our primary line of software choice and DigiBoard is what we have in fact. alexis -- The more experienced you are the less people you can get an advise from. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 20:01:53 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id UAA15661 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 20:01:53 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA15645 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 20:01:39 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id OAA07217; Sun, 3 Dec 1995 14:58:40 +1100 Date: Sun, 3 Dec 1995 14:58:40 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199512030358.OAA07217@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, witr@rwwa.com Subject: Re: Proper way to determine non-blocking status... Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Even though it seems like it is almost never done by >existing driver code, would I be correct in assuming that >the *right* way to determine if a device read is allowed to >sleep or not is the following? >int xxread(dev_t dev, struct uio *uio, int ioflag) >{ > if (ioflag & IO_NDELAY) { > /* Can't block here */ > return EWOULDBLOCK; > } else { /* Otherwise try again */ > /* Can sleep here */ > ... > } >} Yes. See tty.c for examples. In open/ioctl/close you have to check O_NONBLOCK (aka FNONBLOCK) instead of IO_NDELAY. The ugl^H^H^Hrightly formatted way is: int xxread(dev, uio, ioflag) dev_t dev; struct uio *uio; int ioflag; { /* Return early for nonblocking reads. */ if (ioflag & IO_NDELAY) return (EWOULDBLOCK); /* Can sleep here. */ ... } Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 20:24:00 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id UAA17321 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 20:24:00 -0800 Received: from bubba.tribe.com ([205.184.207.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA17314 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 20:23:54 -0800 Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.tribe.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id UAA04607 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 20:23:13 -0800 From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199512030423.UAA04607@bubba.tribe.com> Subject: Strange crash To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 20:23:12 -0800 (PST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2687 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I've been testing a 486DX2-66 Texas Intstruments chip, and it has been working fine except for a strange crash on bootup that happened once: FreeBSD 2.1.0-951104-SNAP #0: Thu Nov 30 15:11:59 PST 1995 root@bubba:/a/bubba/home/archie/ia/src/sys/compile/TIA CPU: Cy486DLC (486-class CPU) Origin = "Cyrix" real memory = 4194304 (4096K bytes) avail memory = 2707456 (2644K bytes) Probing for devices on the ISA bus: ed1 at 0x300-0x31f irq 5 on isa ed1: address 00:00:e8:cd:1e:08, type NE2000 (16 bit) eth0 not found at 0x240 vt0 at 0x60-0x6f irq 1 on motherboard vt0: generic, 80 col, color, 8 scr, mf2-kbd, [R3.20-b24] sio0 at 0x3f8-0x3ff irq 4 on isa sio0: type 16550A sio1 at 0x2f8-0x2ff irq 3 on isa sio1: type 16550A fdc0: direction bit not set fdc0: cmd 3 failed at out byte 1 of 3 fdc0 not found at 0x3f0 wdc0 at 0x1f0-0x1f7 irq 14 on isa wdc0: unit 0 (wd0): wd0: 257MB (528192 sectors), 917 cyls, 12 heads, 48 S/T, 512 B/S npx0 on motherboard npx0: INT 16 interface swapon: adding /dev/wd0b as swap device Automatic reboot in progress... /dev/rwd0a: clean, 3176 free (0 frags, 794 blocks, 0.0% fragmentation) /dev/rwd0e: clean, 14924 free (12 frags, 3728 blocks, 0.1% fragmentation) /dev/rwd0f: clean, 53066 free (106 frags, 13240 blocks, 0.2% fragmentation) /dev/rwd0g: clean, 26060 free (4 frags, 6514 blocks, 0.0% fragmentation) Fatal trap 12: page fault while in kernel mode fault virtual address = 0x1249b4 fault code = supervisor read, page not present instruction pointer = 0x8:0x1249b4 code segment = base 0x0, limit 0xfffff, type 0x1b = DPL 0, pres 1, def32 1, gran 1 processor eflags = interrupt enabled, resume, IOPL = 0 current process = 13 (mount) interrupt mask = panic: page fault syncing disks... done Automatic reboot in 15 seconds - press a key on the console to abort Rebooting... Keyboard reset did not work, attempting CPU shutdown (The "eth0 not found" line is from the the ET frame relay card driver.) I did a "nm kernel | sort" on the kernel image and found this: f01248e8 T _chdir f012493c T _chroot f01249b4 t _change_dir <-- f0124a4c T _open f0124ce8 T _ocreat f0124d14 T _mknod On the next reboot, it booted up fine as it has before many times. Can we assume with high probability that this is some kind of hardware bug? Is this chip bogus? Any insights would be greatly appreciated!! Thanks, -Archie _______________________________________________________________________________ Archie L. Cobbs, archie@tribe.com * Tribe Computer Works http://www.tribe.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Dec 2 20:51:41 1995 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id UAA19081 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 20:51:41 -0800 Received: from bubba.tribe.com ([205.184.207.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA19074 for ; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 20:51:21 -0800 Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.tribe.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id UAA04684; Sat, 2 Dec 1995 20:50:29 -0800 From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199512030450.UAA04684@bubba.tribe.com> Subject: Re: Minor change to make To: kaleb@x.org (Kaleb S. KEITHLEY) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 20:50:28 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199512022227.WAA14667@exalt.x.org> from "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" at Dec 2, 95 05:27:40 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 891 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > > N.B. ClearMake, SGI, and Digital, makes all have include directives that > > > silently ignore a failure to find the include file, so this isn't a new > > > > ...as does gmake (which is available as a package), so you could use it > > if you wanted to avoid rebuilding /usr/bin/make... > > Humbug again. > > Since it's 99&44/100ths of the way there already, why should I have to > tell people to go get gmake? Why can't the make that comes with the (next > release of the) system "just do it"? Hey, wait a minute, I agree with you! The FreeBSD make ought to have this feature; in fact, I definately would argue for it as well. I didn't mean to imply that you *should* use gmake, just that you *could*. :-) -Archie _______________________________________________________________________________ Archie L. Cobbs, archie@tribe.com * Tribe Computer Works http://www.tribe.com