From owner-freebsd-current Sun Jul 20 09:06:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA21692 for current-outgoing; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 09:06:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ady.warp.starnets.ro (ady.warp.starnets.ro [193.226.124.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA21672; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 09:06:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (ady@localhost) by ady.warp.starnets.ro (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA09139; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 19:04:59 +0300 (EEST) Date: Sun, 20 Jul 1997 19:04:59 +0300 (EEST) From: Penisoara Adrian Reply-To: Penisoara Adrian To: freebsd-smp@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Need advice for SMP production server Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: MULTIPART/MIXED; BOUNDARY="0-65234016-869414262=:8584" Content-ID: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. Send mail to mime@docserver.cac.washington.edu for more info. --0-65234016-869414262=:8584 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-ID: Hi ! I need some advice regarding a full reinstall for an 2xP133 server (Tyan Tomcat III S1563D with AHA2940AU). Currently I have 3.0-9702090-SNAP with the pre-Lite2 kernel (and its aic7xxx SCSI problem); I plan to install a newer 3.0-current version and I have to choose between the 3.0-970618-SNAP on the official FreeBSD server and the daily snapshots from current.FreeBSD.org. The problem is that this is a production server (which sustains all our ISP services) so I need it to be as much stable as it's possible. What are your opinions ? From what I read on the -current and -smp lists I understood that there are some minor problems with the 06/18 snapshot and also that Steve is started the long awaited move from the 'giant lock' to the 'finer grained lock' kernel architecture, which means current kernels are pretty untrustable. For the situation to be clear I attached an 'mptable -verbose -dmesg' output. All your comments are welcomed and appreciated. Thank you very much; apologises for any trouble caused. 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Sun, 20 Jul 1997 09:30:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pandora.hh.kew.com (root@kendra.ne.mediaone.net [24.128.53.73]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA22741 for ; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 09:29:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sonata (sonata.hh.kew.com [192.195.203.135]) by pandora.hh.kew.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA03754; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 12:29:55 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <33D23D02.80@kew.com> Date: Sun, 20 Jul 1997 12:29:54 -0400 From: Drew Derbyshire Reply-To: ahd@kew.com Organization: Kendra Electronic Wonderworks X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01GoldC-MOENE (WinNT; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: current@FreeBSD.ORG CC: bde@zeta.org.au Subject: Re: current-digest V3 #104 References: <199707192051.NAA11743@hub.freebsd.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > From: Bruce Evans > Date: Sat, 19 Jul 1997 19:06:24 +1000 > Subject: Re: Serial console in -current > > >Understood. How would you propose to handle the case where none of the > >serial devices are marked as console but RB_SERIAL is set? The > >current behaviour is undeniably bogus, not to mention annoying. 8) > Same as if there are no serial devices configured - tell the user to > not use a silly configuration :-). While this may be desirable from purist point of view, I must disagree it for pragmatic reasons. First, the historical behavior not requiring a special flag is reasonable, understood, and consistent with other headless configurations. (At least my SPARC did the Right Thing and found the first serial port when I tried this a year or so ago.) Second, and more importantly, if I have a urgent need to switch to a serial console and I don't have time to regen or extensively reconfigure the kernel, I don't want to be blocked by the kernel refusing to use a reasonable default. (One of my systems doesn't have a normally have monitor -- blindly feeding a boot -h is doable, a kernel reconfig is _not_.) Certainly, allowing the flag to make the behavior tunable is a good thing, but don't break things given how important a console can be to fixing a system which has other boot problems. -ahd- From owner-freebsd-current Sun Jul 20 09:37:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA23137 for current-outgoing; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 09:37:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dyson.iquest.net (dyson.iquest.net [198.70.144.127]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA23132 for ; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 09:37:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by dyson.iquest.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) id LAA03801; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 11:36:53 -0500 (EST) From: "John S. Dyson" Message-Id: <199707201636.LAA03801@dyson.iquest.net> Subject: Re: Machine Locks Up After Recent VM Changes In-Reply-To: <19970720081318.23409@scsn.net> from "Donald J. Maddox" at "Jul 20, 97 08:13:18 am" To: dmaddox@scsn.net Date: Sun, 20 Jul 1997 11:36:53 -0500 (EST) Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: dyson@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Since the recent VM changes, a number of X-based programs lock > up my machine almost instantly when executed. A couple of good > examples are swriter3 from the StarOffice package, and xkobo-1.9 > from the port. > Yes, others have been seeing it. Try removing the call to pmap_addr_hint on about line 977 in /sys/vm/vm_mmap.c. Before doing that, please "cat" the contents of /proc//map and send it to me. Thanks. John From owner-freebsd-current Sun Jul 20 09:38:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA23179 for current-outgoing; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 09:38:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (Ilsa.StevesCafe.com [205.168.119.129]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA23174; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 09:38:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA00807; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 10:35:50 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199707201635.KAA00807@Ilsa.StevesCafe.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0gamma 1/27/96 From: Steve Passe To: Penisoara Adrian cc: freebsd-smp@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Need advice for SMP production server In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Jul 1997 19:04:59 +0300." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 20 Jul 1997 10:35:50 -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, > I need some advice regarding a full reinstall for an 2xP133 server (Tyan > Tomcat III S1563D with AHA2940AU). > ... > From what I read on the -current and -smp lists I understood that there > are some minor problems with the 06/18 snapshot and also that Steve is > started the long awaited move from the 'giant lock' to the 'finer grained > lock' kernel architecture, which means current kernels are pretty > untrustable. > For the situation to be clear I attached an 'mptable -verbose -dmesg' > output. your mptable shows the proper connections for the new code. I would tend to suggest the latest SNAP: 970718. Most reports are of good success. -- Steve Passe | powered by smp@csn.net | Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-current Sun Jul 20 10:06:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA24511 for current-outgoing; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 10:06:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dyson.iquest.net (dyson.iquest.net [198.70.144.127]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA24492; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 10:06:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by dyson.iquest.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) id MAA03874; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 12:05:12 -0500 (EST) From: "John S. Dyson" Message-Id: <199707201705.MAA03874@dyson.iquest.net> Subject: Re: Need advice for SMP production server In-Reply-To: <199707201635.KAA00807@Ilsa.StevesCafe.com> from Steve Passe at "Jul 20, 97 10:35:50 am" To: smp@csn.net (Steve Passe) Date: Sun, 20 Jul 1997 12:05:12 -0500 (EST) Cc: ady@warp.starnets.ro, freebsd-smp@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: dyson@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Hi, > > > I need some advice regarding a full reinstall for an 2xP133 server (Tyan > > Tomcat III S1563D with AHA2940AU). > > ... > > From what I read on the -current and -smp lists I understood that there > > are some minor problems with the 06/18 snapshot and also that Steve is > > started the long awaited move from the 'giant lock' to the 'finer grained > > lock' kernel architecture, which means current kernels are pretty > > untrustable. > > For the situation to be clear I attached an 'mptable -verbose -dmesg' > > output. > > your mptable shows the proper connections for the new code. I would tend > to suggest the latest SNAP: 970718. Most reports are of good success. > One problem -- there is an issue with my latest VM changes. You'll want to remove pmap_addr_hint call from vm_mmap.c. It (indirectly) breaks X. John From owner-freebsd-current Sun Jul 20 10:23:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA25108 for current-outgoing; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 10:23:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from news1.gtn.com (news1.gtn.com [192.109.159.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA25083; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 10:23:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by news1.gtn.com (8.7.2/8.7.2) with UUCP id TAA01514; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 19:15:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from andreas@localhost) by klemm.gtn.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) id TAA09070; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 19:01:17 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19970720190117.09549@gtn.com> Date: Sun, 20 Jul 1997 19:01:17 +0200 From: Andreas Klemm To: Penisoara Adrian Cc: freebsd-smp@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Need advice for SMP production server References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79 In-Reply-To: ; from Penisoara Adrian on Sun, Jul 20, 1997 at 07:04:59PM +0300 X-Disclaimer: A free society is one where it is safe to be unpopular X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT SMP Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, Jul 20, 1997 at 07:04:59PM +0300, Penisoara Adrian wrote: > > Hi ! > > I need some advice regarding a full reinstall for an 2xP133 server (Tyan > Tomcat III S1563D with AHA2940AU). > Currently I have 3.0-9702090-SNAP with the pre-Lite2 kernel (and its > aic7xxx SCSI problem); I plan to install a newer 3.0-current version and I > have to choose between the 3.0-970618-SNAP on the official FreeBSD server > and the daily snapshots from current.FreeBSD.org. Generally I'd want to warn you, that -current is not the typical environment for a production machine. You should use FreeBSD-2.2.2 and cvsup the 2.2-STABLE version. On the other hand -current is since a long time in a very good shape with only minor trouble from time to time. And it's the only release, that has SMP capabilities. Since I use better hardware and have a new power supply, I had no big trouble and am running a very fast 2 x 200 MHz PPro machine. Andreas /// -- Andreas Klemm | klemm.gtn.com - powered by Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/SMP.html http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/benches.html From owner-freebsd-current Sun Jul 20 10:27:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA25225 for current-outgoing; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 10:27:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA25214 for ; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 10:27:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id DAA11292; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 03:24:41 +1000 Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 03:24:41 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707201724.DAA11292@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: ahd@kew.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: current-digest V3 #104 Cc: bde@zeta.org.au Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Second, and more importantly, if I have a urgent need to switch to a >serial console and I don't have time to regen or extensively reconfigure >the kernel, I don't want to be blocked by the kernel refusing to use a >reasonable default. (One of my systems doesn't have a normally have >monitor -- blindly feeding a boot -h is doable, a kernel reconfig is >_not_.) Actually, it is: boot with -hc, then wait for userconfig to start, then type `flags sio0 0x10q' and reboot (switching of consoles in userconfig currently only works for switching between syscons and pcvt). Or if the system boots far enough for you to login from somewhere, put this in /kernel.config: printf "USERCONFIG\n"flags sio0 0x10\nq\n" >/kernel.config (or edit /kernel/config to preserve the existing configuration) and reboot. Or if you have a clue, put this in /kernel[.new].config before booting the new kernel, or configure the new kernel before using it. Bruce From owner-freebsd-current Sun Jul 20 10:37:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA25692 for current-outgoing; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 10:37:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ady.warp.starnets.ro (ady.warp.starnets.ro [193.226.124.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA25684; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 10:37:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (ady@localhost) by ady.warp.starnets.ro (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA09352; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 20:35:37 +0300 (EEST) Date: Sun, 20 Jul 1997 20:35:37 +0300 (EEST) From: Penisoara Adrian To: Andreas Klemm cc: freebsd-smp@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Need advice for SMP production server In-Reply-To: <19970720190117.09549@gtn.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, On Sun, 20 Jul 1997, Andreas Klemm wrote: [...] > Generally I'd want to warn you, that -current is not the typical > environment for a production machine. You should use FreeBSD-2.2.2 > and cvsup the 2.2-STABLE version. Hmmm, I NEED to run SMP, so it's obvious I'm talking 3.0-current... > > On the other hand -current is since a long time in a very good > shape with only minor trouble from time to time. And it's the > only release, that has SMP capabilities. Personally I had no trouble since installation, except for the buggy SCSI driver (aic7xx in 970209-SNAP) which forced me to assist to about 20-25 reboots since then :) I know, I could have tried an cvsupped kernel, but that happened right in the middle of the 4.4BSD Lite2 'upgrade', and lazy/scary me I haven't the gods to do a make world ;) > > Since I use better hardware and have a new power supply, I had no > big trouble and am running a very fast 2 x 200 MHz PPro machine. Happy SMPfying ! BTW, overclocked ? (Mine not, and not gonna happen...) > > Andreas /// > > -- > Andreas Klemm | klemm.gtn.com - powered by > Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD > http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/SMP.html > http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/benches.html > Ady (@warp.starnets.ro) From owner-freebsd-current Sun Jul 20 15:35:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA05660 for current-outgoing; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 15:35:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pandora.hh.kew.com (root@kendra.ne.mediaone.net [24.128.53.73]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA05655 for ; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 15:35:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sonata (sonata.hh.kew.com [192.195.203.135]) by pandora.hh.kew.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA04911; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 18:35:41 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <33D292BC.3FF2@kew.com> Date: Sun, 20 Jul 1997 18:35:40 -0400 From: Drew Derbyshire Reply-To: ahd@kew.com Organization: Kendra Electronic Wonderworks X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01GoldC-MOENE (WinNT; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bruce Evans CC: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: switching to seral consoles References: <199707201724.DAA11292@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Bruce Evans wrote: > >Second, and more importantly, if I have a urgent need to switch to a > >serial console and I don't have time to regen or extensively reconfigure > >the kernel, I don't want to be blocked by the kernel refusing to use a > >reasonable default. (One of my systems doesn't have a normally have > >monitor -- blindly feeding a boot -h is doable, a kernel reconfig is > >_not_.) > > Actually, it is: boot with -hc, then wait for userconfig to start, > then type `flags sio0 0x10q' and reboot (switching > of consoles in userconfig currently only works for switching between > syscons and pcvt). How do you know when to reboot? How do you know the machine didn't hang before rewriting the configuration out? ~ 18 characters plus a blind forced reboot is EXACTLY what I want to avoid when switching to a serial console under dire conditions (such as no working monitor). Odds are any but a perfect typist will blow your more complicated sequence. Why make it harder when the old way works properly? What is the real world advantage of _requiring_ the flag in place of merely _supporting_ it? (Once can also ask if can I get a working monitor? Yes. But this need, to quickly switch when previous preparation may not have been possible and switching monitors is time consuming, is a realistic one; I have been through similar issues with the machines here at the Wonderworks.) > Or if the system boots far enough for you to login > from somewhere, put this in /kernel.config: > > printf "USERCONFIG\n"flags sio0 0x10\nq\n" >/kernel.config > > (or edit /kernel/config to preserve the existing configuration) and > reboot. Or if you have a clue, put this in /kernel[.new].config > before booting the new kernel, or configure the new kernel before > using it. I don't have it in every kernel I gen for the same reason I don't put every possible device I have access to in the configuration for every machine (i.e. the machines have dissimilar hardware) -- I use the simplest configuration that works. -- Internet: ahd@kew.com Voice: 617-279-9810 Avoid overly pretentious job titles such as "Lord of the Realm, Defender of the Faith, Emperor of India" or "Director of Corporate Planning." - The Official MBA Handbook From owner-freebsd-current Sun Jul 20 15:42:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA05966 for current-outgoing; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 15:42:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from abby.skypoint.net (abby.skypoint.net [199.86.32.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA05958 for ; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 15:41:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by abby.skypoint.net (8.8.5/alexis 2.7) with UUCP id RAA06447; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 17:40:36 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from bruce@localhost) by zuhause.mn.org (8.8.6/8.8.5) id PAA01046; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 15:37:55 -0500 (CDT) Date: Sun, 20 Jul 1997 15:37:55 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199707202037.PAA01046@zuhause.mn.org> From: Bruce Albrecht To: Narvi Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... In-Reply-To: References: <199707191330.GAA18837@implode.root.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.30 under 19.15p2 XEmacs Lucid Mime-Version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 7.106) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Narvi writes: > *Most* computers don't use the second com port unless they have a modem > in which case they usually don't have an ethernet card. So nobody even > notices. What about computers that have a serial mouse? I think this is a generalization that's not even close to true. From owner-freebsd-current Sun Jul 20 16:49:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA08323 for current-outgoing; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 16:49:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA08314 for ; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 16:49:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA10089; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 16:47:10 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707202347.QAA10089@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: -current :) To: dk+@ua.net Date: Sun, 20 Jul 1997 16:47:10 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199707192222.PAA22048@dog.farm.org> from "Dmitry Kohmanyuk" at Jul 19, 97 03:22:07 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [ ... inserted NUL's ... ] > > FWIW: I have been able to repeat this with vi and files in frags. You > > have to do all of the following before updated fires. > > over NFS, right? No. To local disk. It seems related to the last series of VM changes (quite a while back, I'm afraid). I have not been able to repeat it reliably without a huge amount of work in my test case. It seems related to zero fill of partial pages when frags are in use, and the resulting change to the frag does not result in the dirty page being treated as if it were really dirty. I can't be more specific than that without a lot more work, unfortunately. > btw, which LDAP server, ldapd from UMICH? Yes. It has a number of problems, including that it does not interoperate with the 30 eval LDAP browser for Windows 95, and that by default it wants ndbm, which FreeBSD pretends to support, but doesn't. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Sun Jul 20 16:59:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA08699 for current-outgoing; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 16:59:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA08692 for ; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 16:59:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA10117; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 16:56:46 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707202356.QAA10117@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: -current :) To: dk+@ua.net Date: Sun, 20 Jul 1997 16:56:46 -0700 (MST) Cc: toor@dyson.iquest.net, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, sia@nest.org In-Reply-To: <199707192216.PAA21949@dog.farm.org> from "Dmitry Kohmanyuk" at Jul 19, 97 03:16:29 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > According to Satoshi Asami: > > > > I think they are mainly on the client side. What I've seen are a > > > > string of ^@ bytes inserted in files I save from rmail. (I now don't > > > > save mail at school. ;) > > this is in 2.2-tree also. (I just wrote mail about this to -hackers.) > > > > I t is not NFS-related but each time my INN 1.5.1 processes a newgroup > > > control message, my active file ands up with a whole page of ^@ and then > > > the new group(s) appear after it. > > > > > > Probably MMAP related as ACT_STYLE is MMAP in my config.data file. > > > > > > John, any idea ? > > > > > I have checked the code over and over and over again. I sure wish we > > had a repeatable example :-(. > > this _exactly_ (zero-filled page in active, then new newsgroups) happened > to me on our news server running 2.2.1-RELEASE. So, it should be old code. I have to say that I believe that this is not an NFS specific problem. As I said, I have been able to repeat it with an app *not* using mmap() at all, and *not* over NFS. The app was "vi". I *truly* believe that the page containing a frag is not being marked dirty, and therefore is not allocated or written. This is in the append case. Obviously, if the file size were updated, and the frag was not, a zero-fill would occur on read, just like with sparse blocks. The operation which should have "dirtied" the block is a write to a frag. One thing to note is that I am running 8k FS blocks; as a result, my frag size is 1024 bytes. This is double the block size, and it may be related to the problem. All the problems have occurred when the entire file is a frag, and is extended and remains in the same frag... ie: my file was 40 or so characters in length and was only grown by 6 characters (I changed the configuration file name for slapd). Before Nate jumps in and starts screaming "TerryBSD! TerryBSD!" at the top of his electronic lungs, as he is wont to do, the problem repeated on stock kernels. The problem did *not* repeat on a vanilla 2.2 stock kernel, however. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Sun Jul 20 17:12:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA09498 for current-outgoing; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 17:12:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA09493 for ; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 17:12:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA10173; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 17:10:42 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707210010.RAA10173@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Insertion of NUL's (was: Re: -current :) To: kew@timesink.spk.wa.us (Keith Walker) Date: Sun, 20 Jul 1997 17:10:42 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199707200240.TAA09578@phobos.walker.dom> from "Keith Walker" at Jul 19, 97 07:40:29 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [ ... NUL insertion ... ] > Oh good grief, I retired my only QIC-02 tape drive because I thought it was screwed up and inserting NUL's. Tapes made with tar (and I think dump, but I can't remember for sure) would have blocks of ^@'s inserted every once in a while, certainly enough to render a tape backup useless. > > Could this be related to the above problem? Or is my tape drive (circa 1987) actually broke? (Being's how the tape drive is so old, I don't have any DOS utilities to check the thing :-) I think the tape is probably toast. It's unlikely to interact this way, since it doesn't deal with the idea of partial pages. I believe the problem is with backing store for the FS, not devices (I could be wrong; when did it start behaving badly? Is it consistent? If so, try running it under an older -- 2.2 or earlier -- kernel to see). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Sun Jul 20 19:24:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA15897 for current-outgoing; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 19:24:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bmccane.uit.net (bmccane.uit.net [208.129.189.48]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA15885 for ; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 19:24:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bmccane.uit.net (localhost.mccane.com [127.0.0.1]) by bmccane.uit.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA12216 for ; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 21:24:34 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199707210224.VAA12216@bmccane.uit.net> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0gamma 1/27/96 To: current@FreeBSD.Org Subject: worm problems Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 20 Jul 1997 21:24:33 -0500 From: Wm Brian McCane Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.Org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I just discovered a problem with my JVC CD-R. I used to have a perl script I used to play music on the drive which used the `scsi' call to control the drive. I haven't used it in a while since I also placed a ATAPI 6x drive into the machine, so I don't know when this started, but.... Anytime I try to access the CD-R, the machine locks up. No panic or anything, just gone. I haven't put DDB in yet, because I have never used it so it might be less than useful to me. I also cannot mount a CD-ROM using the CD9660 file system type, I get the same lockup. The hardware is as follows: 100MHz Pentium ACER ACROS 2MB Diamond Stealth 2001 Video 40MB Ram 2-2.1GB Maxtor Hard drives as wd0, wd1 IRQ 14 ATAPI CD-ROM on second IDE. IRQ 15 Adaptec 2940 IRQ 11 1.08G Quantum Fireball Mustek 12000SP PS/2 Mouse IRQ 12 Adaptec 152? IRQ 9 JVC CD-R SMC8013E IRQ 10 Sound Blaster IRQ 5 Bravado 1000 Digitizer IRQ 7 The CD-R is recognized and configured as worm0 when the system boots. I have pulled all of the cards out that I didn't need. Tried to put the CD-R on the AHA-2940. Pulled out the ATAPI CD-ROM. Tried a different video card. Reduced my RAM to 16MB. Nothing has worked, so I have to assume the problem is in the kernel since the drive works perfectly from DOS, Windows-95, and Windows-NT, including creating CD's. Any ideas, or information on how to use DDB would be greatly appreciated. brian From owner-freebsd-current Sun Jul 20 23:38:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA25886 for current-outgoing; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 23:38:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA25881 for ; Sun, 20 Jul 1997 23:38:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id QAA32661; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 16:34:50 +1000 Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 16:34:50 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707210634.QAA32661@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: ahd@kew.com, bde@zeta.org.au Subject: Re: switching to seral consoles Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> Actually, it is: boot with -hc, then wait for userconfig to start, >> then type `flags sio0 0x10q' and reboot (switching >> of consoles in userconfig currently only works for switching between >> syscons and pcvt). > >How do you know when to reboot? How do you know the machine didn't hang >before rewriting the configuration out? Perhaps by watching the disk LEDs. Anyway, I lied, Switching of consoles in userconfig already works (after userconfig exits). >more complicated sequence. Why make it harder when the old way works >properly? What is the real world advantage of _requiring_ the flag in >place of merely _supporting_ it? The old way doesn't work properly. The advantage of the flags are that they let the user specify exactly which serial ports can be consoles (flag 0x10), and which serial ports are consoles (flag 0x20 together with flag 0x10). You can have no consoles if you really want that (previously, sio0 was always the console if syscons or pcvt was configured, provided at least one sio port was configured, even if sio0 was not configured). You can specify consoles on all sio ports if you really want that (but this doesn't work yet). >I don't have it in every kernel I gen for the same reason I don't put >every possible device I have access to in the configuration for every >machine (i.e. the machines have dissimilar hardware) -- I use the >simplest configuration that works. That configuration now has 0x10 in the flags for the serial port that you want to use as the console (if you want to use a console at all). Bruce From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 01:12:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA29466 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 01:12:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA29460 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 01:12:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA26410; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 01:11:18 -0700 (PDT) To: Bruce Evans cc: ahd@kew.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: current-digest V3 #104 In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Jul 1997 03:24:41 +1000." <199707201724.DAA11292@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 01:11:18 -0700 Message-ID: <26406.869472678@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > (or edit /kernel/config to preserve the existing configuration) and ^^^^^^^ Cool, is this that new kernelfs you've been talking about? ;-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 01:13:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA29522 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 01:13:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from minor.stranger.com (stranger.vip.best.com [204.156.129.250]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id BAA29515 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 01:13:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dog.farm.org (dog.farm.org [207.111.140.47]) by minor.stranger.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id BAA14586; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 01:14:07 -0700 Received: (from dk@localhost) by dog.farm.org (8.7.5/dk#3) id BAA11030; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 01:14:05 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970721011404.23066@dog.farm.org> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 01:14:04 -0700 From: Dmitry Kohmanyuk =?KOI8-R?B?5M3J1NLJyiDrz8jNwc7Ayw==?= To: Terry Lambert Cc: dk+@ua.net, toor@dyson.iquest.net, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, sia@nest.org Subject: Re: -current :) References: <199707192216.PAA21949@dog.farm.org> <199707202356.QAA10117@phaeton.artisoft.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69e In-Reply-To: <199707202356.QAA10117@phaeton.artisoft.com>; from "Terry Lambert" on Sun, Jul 20, 1997 at 04:56:46PM -0700 Reply-To: dk+@ua.net X-Class: Fast X-OS-Used: FreeBSD 2.2-960501-SNAP X-NIC-Handle: DK379 X-Pager-Email: dk@interpage.net Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, Jul 20, 1997 at 04:56:46PM -0700, Terry Lambert wrote: > > > > Probably MMAP related as ACT_STYLE is MMAP in my config.data file. > > > > > > > > John, any idea ? > > > > > > > I have checked the code over and over and over again. I sure wish we > > > had a repeatable example :-(. > > > > this _exactly_ (zero-filled page in active, then new newsgroups) happened > > to me on our news server running 2.2.1-RELEASE. So, it should be old code. > > I have to say that I believe that this is not an NFS specific problem. > > As I said, I have been able to repeat it with an app *not* using mmap() > at all, and *not* over NFS. The app was "vi". I forgot to mention: my news server is not running over NFS (should be obvious, yes? Not really - I know at least 1 article claiming performance improvement on SunOS using NFS-mounted news spool from NetApp server. Oh well.) So, we have different problem reports: zero-filled page written with mmap() without NFS (append??), zero-filled pages appended over NFS (mail client, etc.) yours case (zero-filled pages without NFS or mmap). Do you have code which reproduces this bug using shell scripts?? (please post it if so). It can be several problems. > I *truly* believe that the page containing a frag is not being marked > dirty, and therefore is not allocated or written. > > This is in the append case. > > Obviously, if the file size were updated, and the frag was not, > a zero-fill would occur on read, just like with sparse blocks. > > The operation which should have "dirtied" the block is a write to > a frag. > > One thing to note is that I am running 8k FS blocks; as a result, my > frag size is 1024 bytes. This is double the block size, and it may > be related to the problem. > > All the problems have occurred when the entire file is a frag, and > is extended and remains in the same frag... ie: my file was 40 or > so characters in length and was only grown by 6 characters (I changed > the configuration file name for slapd). And then you got 46 zero bytes, right? > Before Nate jumps in and starts screaming "TerryBSD! TerryBSD!" at > the top of his electronic lungs, as he is wont to do, the problem > repeated on stock kernels. The problem did *not* repeat on a > vanilla 2.2 stock kernel, however. As I have said, my INN mmap() active file on UFS happened under 2.2.1-R. From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 02:58:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA03854 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 02:58:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from minor.stranger.com (stranger.vip.best.com [204.156.129.250]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id CAA03847 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 02:58:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dog.farm.org (dog.farm.org [207.111.140.47]) by minor.stranger.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id CAA14939; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 02:59:10 -0700 Received: (from dk@localhost) by dog.farm.org (8.7.5/dk#3) id DAA13113; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 03:01:33 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 03:01:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Dmitry Kohmanyuk Message-Id: <199707211001.DAA13113@dog.farm.org> To: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Heads up and and a call for a show of hands. Newsgroups: cs-monolit.gated.lists.freebsd.current Organization: FARM Computing Association Reply-To: dk+@ua.net X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In article <199707121201.FAA07881@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> you wrote: > * Well, it's a nice field, yes. Editable I'm not so sure about. :-) > * We need some way of doing this from scripts and other utilities, > * and I guess that's the next step. > I thought the whole point of enforcing a strict syntax to rc.conf (one > variable per line, comments in the same line after the `var="value"' > pair, etc.) was to make it easily editable from scripts. > At least it's not much less auto-editable than the proposed > /etc/ld.so.config, considering that they need to delete lines when the > user deinstalls the package.... > One can even argue that it is just as easy because if they want to be > really lazy (i.e., don't even want to use ed/sed/awk), they can just > do something like > echo "local_startup="${local_startup} /usr/dt/lib # CDE, do not touch" \ > >> /etc/rc.conf > during installation and > mv /etc/rc.conf /etc/rc.conf.tmp > grep -v '^local_startup=${local_startup} /usr/dt/lib # CDE, do not touch$' \ > /etc/rc.conf.tmp > /etc/rc.conf > rm /etc/rc.conf.tmp > for deinstallation. [ this is a long message - sorry ] and they should do it this way - otherwise (if they patch local_startup) if then some other package patches local_startup also, how they would uninstall? I see this (rc.conf, ld.so.conf, /usr/local/etc/rc.d/*) as one big issue: how do we handle a `configuration as a associative (keyed) array' (ordered - rc.d/ or unordered - rc.conf) as a transation-capable storage (i.e. with atomic `add' and `remove' operations?) Jordan, you should remember that package talk we had on FreeBSD SFUG meeting before last one - I said that the only transaction primitive supported by filesystem is `add file' and `remove file'. Here, we have a config variable (list of shared library paths) with following operations supported: - add a path to a list - remove a path from a list - generate list of all paths in use we also have historical behaviour of /etc/rc just figuring list of paths as those which exist among the supported ones (/usr/lib, /usr/local/lib, /usr/X11R6/lib) we also have a need for an application package to install many changes in different config variables (like startup script collection, library path collection) and then we want to have some way to take our changes back. Right now the supported way is to add one file to /usr/local/etc/rc.d . What is bad about this approach is that there is no easy way to find out exactly what was done by that script; say, I want to remove all libraries added by this package by its startup script. (this is probably the reason to have `stop' scripts.) If we agree about atomic operations on file system, we can use a _directory_ as a value for some option (like set of library paths) and have each package install a _file_ for its parameters in this directory (so the list of directories is the content of all files in this directory, concantenated.) This way, once a package gets some unique name, this name can be used to add some package-specific configuration to _many_ places. Now, we know how to implement transaction properly (i.e.: package started install itself, modifying /etc/rc.conf, /usr/local/etc/rc.d/, /var/db/pkg/..., and then a system crash occured. How to recover?) - there is an `active packages' directory and keys not present in this directory are ignored when constructing option lists. This probably is best implemented using either a smart filesystem or with a set of simple tools to add and remove, atomically, a key/value to several configuration directories, and to get a concatenated list of values within given directory, sorted or unsorted. If several packages need to have ordering, they have to have their key names with a common prefix (like aaa.bb and aaa.cc), and sort on suffix. This sounds like the R word implemented properly within BSD framework. ;-) -- To steal from one person is theft. To steal from many is taxation. From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 03:12:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA04483 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 03:12:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from minor.stranger.com (stranger.vip.best.com [204.156.129.250]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id DAA04474 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 03:12:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dog.farm.org (dog.farm.org [207.111.140.47]) by minor.stranger.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id DAA14959; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 03:13:11 -0700 Received: (from dk@localhost) by dog.farm.org (8.7.5/dk#3) id DAA13176; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 03:11:56 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 03:11:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Dmitry Kohmanyuk Message-Id: <199707211011.DAA13176@dog.farm.org> To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Heads up and and a call for a show of hands. Newsgroups: cs-monolit.gated.lists.freebsd.current Organization: FARM Computing Association Reply-To: dk+@ua.net X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In article <8050.868713758@time.cdrom.com> you wrote: > > My personal take on the ldconfig situation : ldconfig should have an > > internal set of default paths (initiallt just /usr/lib), which can be > > manually inhibited on the commandline if required, it should support > > /etc/ld.so.conf by reading it if it exists, and it should take paths on > > the commandline. > > > > As for whether /etc/ld.so.conf should override the inbuilt search > > path, the obvious answer is _no_; there is a perfectly good control > > for this on the commandline. > Yeesh - then by that logic, I guess, I should just throw all of the > existing _LDC munging stuff in rc and just make an ldconfig_flags > variable which you can set to whatever you want. :-) Yes, why not? The only disadvantage is that system would not boot multi-user without rc.conf ; but it wouldn't anyway now, with networking and many other vital options there. Just try it... ( mv /etc/rc.conf /etc/rc.conf- ; reboot ) Perhaps rc scripts should have some fall-back behaviour when rc.conf is absent. -- "The Soviet Union does not exist any more in its present format." CCCP:> format CCCP: /u -- From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 03:22:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA05017 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 03:22:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (ala-ca18-12.ix.netcom.com [204.32.168.204]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA05012 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 03:22:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from asami@localhost) by silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (8.8.6/8.6.9) id DAA21887; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 03:22:02 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 03:22:02 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199707211022.DAA21887@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> To: bde@zeta.org.au CC: ahd@kew.com, bde@zeta.org.au, current@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: <199707210634.QAA32661@godzilla.zeta.org.au> (message from Bruce Evans on Mon, 21 Jul 1997 16:34:50 +1000) Subject: Re: switching to seral consoles From: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk * The old way doesn't work properly. The advantage of the flags are that * they let the user specify exactly which serial ports can be consoles * (flag 0x10), and which serial ports are consoles (flag 0x20 together with * flag 0x10). You can have no consoles if you really want that (previously, Bruce, I appreciate all the work you are doing around here recently, but do you mind (oops :) updating the man pages too? I know I'm supposed to read all the commit messages and diff all the changes, but things are changing so quickly my head is starting to spin. Satoshi From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 04:26:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id EAA07903 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 04:26:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA07898 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 04:26:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id VAA09216; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 21:10:34 +1000 Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 21:10:34 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707211110.VAA09216@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: asami@cs.berkeley.edu, bde@zeta.org.au Subject: Re: switching to seral consoles Cc: ahd@kew.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Bruce, I appreciate all the work you are doing around here recently, >but do you mind (oops :) updating the man pages too? Yes, it would be a waste of time to update the man pages for work in progress. >I know I'm supposed to read all the commit messages and diff all the >changes, but things are changing so quickly my head is starting to >spin. See LINT for examples. Bruce From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 04:38:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id EAA08501 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 04:38:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (ala-ca18-12.ix.netcom.com [204.32.168.204]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA08494 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 04:38:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from asami@localhost) by silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (8.8.6/8.6.9) id EAA22859; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 04:38:16 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 04:38:16 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199707211138.EAA22859@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> To: bde@zeta.org.au CC: bde@zeta.org.au, ahd@kew.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: <199707211110.VAA09216@godzilla.zeta.org.au> (message from Bruce Evans on Mon, 21 Jul 1997 21:10:34 +1000) Subject: Re: switching to seral consoles From: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk * Yes, it would be a waste of time to update the man pages for work in * progress. Well, if you say so. * See LINT for examples. And it's not a waste of time to upgrade LINT for work in progress? By the way, where can I find information on the "kernel.config" file syntax? Satoshi From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 05:21:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id FAA10488 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 05:21:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA10479 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 05:21:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id VAA10834; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 21:59:07 +1000 Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 21:59:07 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707211159.VAA10834@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: asami@cs.berkeley.edu, bde@zeta.org.au Subject: Re: switching to seral consoles Cc: ahd@kew.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > * Yes, it would be a waste of time to update the man pages for work in > * progress. > >Well, if you say so. > > * See LINT for examples. > >And it's not a waste of time to upgrade LINT for work in progress? No, because new options should be put in LINT and maybe in options[.i386] so that they get used (at least at compile time), so LINT is the right place to look for all new options - if they aren't there, then the code controlled by them probably doesn't even compile :-). It's convenient to document new flags there, so that there is only one place to look for new things related to kernel configuration. >By the way, where can I find information on the "kernel.config" file >syntax? It's the same as userconfig command line syntax (where is that documented? :-), except the file must begin with the keyword USERCONFIG. The file normally ends qith `q' to quit userconfig. Option USERCONFIG_BOOT and the normal USEERCONFIG option must be configured for kernel.config to work. Misfeature: USERCONFIG_BOOT together with kernel.config starting and ending as above stops booting with -c from working. The config file is preferred and there is no way to switc to interactive mode. Bruce From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 05:38:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id FAA11300 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 05:38:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from spsem02.sps.mot.com ([192.70.231.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id FAA11292; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 05:38:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mogate.sps.mot.com by spsem02.sps.mot.com (4.1/SMI-4.1/Email 2.1 10/25/93) id AA16424 for current@FreeBSD.ORG; Mon, 21 Jul 97 05:38:42 MST Received: from zfrbc.sps.mot.com by mogate.sps.mot.com (4.1/SMI-4.1/Email-2.0) id AA23721 for dg@root.com; Mon, 21 Jul 97 05:38:39 MST Received: from sissdev.sps.mot.com by zfrbc.sps.mot.com with SMTP (1.37.109.20/16.2) id AA169578714; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:38:34 -0500 Received: by sissdev.sps.mot.com (AIX 4.1/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA23156; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 14:37:29 +0200 Message-Id: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.1 [p0] on AIX Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Mime-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <21008.869326490@time.cdrom.com> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 14:35:09 +0200 (DFT) From: Dermot McNally To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, "Jordan K. Hubbard" , dg@root.com Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On 19-Jul-97 Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: >It's far more common in the 8 bit cards, yes. I would, however, >hypothesize that the 16 bit cards have now (or will very shortly) >outnumber the legacy equipment. I do know that I've certainly >received a considerable amount of negative feedback over the choice of >5 ("5?! Who uses that anymore? 10! The default value should be >10! What are you guys thinking?!") :-) > >How does the "user base" feel about this? 10, every time. Or 11 if you really want to, but not 5 and certainly not 3, for the very good reasons already pointed out. I would guess that anyone who still uses an 8-bit network card has been long enough at this game to know how to tweak the default value. Dermot ---------------------------------- Dermot McNally, Motorola EMEA CCS, Muenchen dermot@sissdev.sps.mot.com, phone +49-89-92103 648 ---------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 06:17:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA12956 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 06:17:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ady.warp.starnets.ro (ady.warp.starnets.ro [193.226.124.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA12937; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 06:17:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (ady@localhost) by ady.warp.starnets.ro (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA11141; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 16:14:52 +0300 (EEST) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 16:14:51 +0300 (EEST) From: Penisoara Adrian To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: dg@root.com, "Jordan K. Hubbard" , current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... In-Reply-To: <21008.869326490@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, On Sat, 19 Jul 1997, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > irq 5 is used because it is the standard for all 8bit Western Digital > > 8003 cards and all 3Com 3c503 boards. I think it might even be the standard > > for Novell NE1000/NE2000 cards. In other words, it's far more common than > > irq 10 which is only found on 16bit WD/SMC cards. > > It's far more common in the 8 bit cards, yes. I would, however, > hypothesize that the 16 bit cards have now (or will very shortly) > outnumber the legacy equipment. I do know that I've certainly > received a considerable amount of negative feedback over the choice of > 5 ("5?! Who uses that anymore? 10! The default value should be > 10! What are you guys thinking?!") :-) > > How does the "user base" feel about this? Well, all computers we configured had/have NE2000 clones with IRQs in the range of 9,10,11. We usually reserve IRQ 5 for soundcards and IRQ3 is considered to be 'wired' to COM2... > > Jordan > Ady (@warp.starnets.ro) From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 06:20:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA13121 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 06:20:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA13116; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 06:20:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id GAA27690; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 06:19:30 -0700 (PDT) To: bde@freebsd.org cc: current@freebsd.org Subject: /boot.foo madness Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 06:19:30 -0700 Message-ID: <27686.869491170@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Because of the introduction of these three files: /boot.config /boot.help /kernel.config New RELENG_2_2 installations now come up with a root filesystem which contains none of these files, resulting in 3 fairly ominous-looking error messages on startup and a complete lack of boot help. This is simply not an acceptable scenario, and the question I'd like to bring before you all is: "How do we want to fix it?" I can think of several ways, all kind of gross. One way would be to install these files along with the boot blocks if they don't already exist in the targetdir, the "pros" of that approach being that you could update your boot blocks and prototype boot configuration files in one place, plus it'd wind up in the bindist(s) by default. The #1 con of this idea is that it's truly gross to contemplate install rules writing into /, plus you'd have a staleness problem as things changed. Updating /etc is enough of an established no-no, now we're talking about installing things straight into the root dir? Surely the beginning of the end, that would be. Another way would be to artificially create these files in the bin dist(s) through the efforts of one of the release building rules in /usr/src/release/Makefile. This would allow us to get away with not modifying anybody's install rules at the expense of yet more confusing "magic" inside of /usr/src/release/Makefile Either approach which splats things into the bindist also runs the risk of blowing away your configuration data during an upgrade, since that would involve copying another bindist over the old, and that's why the 3rd and perhaps least offensive alternative is to put this into the "post-install fixup" procedure in sysinstall which puts the last few finishing and somewhat kludgy touches on an extracted bin dist. This could then intelligently add the files if they did not already exist. Comments? Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 06:25:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA13233 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 06:25:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA13225 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 06:24:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id GAA27714; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 06:23:53 -0700 (PDT) To: Bruce Evans cc: asami@cs.berkeley.edu, ahd@kew.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: switching to seral consoles In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Jul 1997 21:59:07 +1000." <199707211159.VAA10834@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 06:23:53 -0700 Message-ID: <27710.869491433@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Misfeature: USERCONFIG_BOOT together with kernel.config starting and > ending as above stops booting with -c from working. The config file > is preferred and there is no way to switc to interactive mode. You just need to figure out a way of bootstrapping a mini-editor, Bruce, so that they can edit out that last "q" in kernel.conf. Then it will drop into CLI mode instead. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 07:10:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA14838 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:10:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.rwth-aachen.de (mail.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.144.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA14832; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:10:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de) by mail (PMDF V5.0-6 #16313) id <01ILI5L827C68WVYJT@mail>; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:51:41 +0000 (GMT) Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.8.5/8.6.9) id PAA27761; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:49:23 +0200 (MEST) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:49:22 +0200 From: Christoph Kukulies Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... In-reply-to: from Dermot McNally To: Dermot McNally Cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , current@FreeBSD.ORG, "Jordan K. Hubbard" , dg@root.com Message-id: <19970721154922.61073@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mutt 0.75e Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: <21008.869326490@time.cdrom.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, Jul 21, 1997 at 02:35:09PM +0200, Dermot McNally wrote: > > On 19-Jul-97 Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > >It's far more common in the 8 bit cards, yes. I would, however, > >hypothesize that the 16 bit cards have now (or will very shortly) > >outnumber the legacy equipment. I do know that I've certainly > >received a considerable amount of negative feedback over the choice of > >5 ("5?! Who uses that anymore? 10! The default value should be 280/5 was one of the most common setting I was using in the past for the WD8003 8 bit cards. I adopted this setting also for those 16 bit cards (WD8013) the latter requiring to be programmed for this value pair. Another common setting was 300/10 for the 16 bit cards which is a jumper selectable option on the WD8013 (phased out) and SMC Ultra 8216 cheapo cards of these days. I vote for keeping 280/5 because this doesn't rule out 8 bit cards. > >10! What are you guys thinking?!") :-) > > > >How does the "user base" feel about this? > > 10, every time. Or 11 if you really want to, but not 5 and > certainly not 3, for the very good reasons already pointed out. I > would guess that anyone who still uses an 8-bit network card has been > long enough at this game to know how to tweak the default value. > > Dermot > > ---------------------------------- > Dermot McNally, Motorola EMEA CCS, Muenchen > dermot@sissdev.sps.mot.com, phone +49-89-92103 648 > ---------------------------------- -- Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 07:30:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA15663 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:30:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gneiss.eps.nagoya-u.ac.jp (gneiss.eps.nagoya-u.ac.jp [133.6.57.99]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA15652 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:30:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from marble.eps.nagoya-u.ac.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gneiss.eps.nagoya-u.ac.jp (8.8.6/3.5Wpl3) with ESMTP id XAA00636 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 23:30:04 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <199707211430.XAA00636@gneiss.eps.nagoya-u.ac.jp> To: current@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: vm_bounce_alloc: Unmapped page From: KATO Takenori In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 24 Jun 1997 18:13:36 +0900" References: <199706240913.SAA09289@gneiss.eps.nagoya-u.ac.jp> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.70 on Emacs 19.28.1 / Mule 2.3 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 03 72 85 36 62 46 23 03 52 B1 10 22 44 10 0D 9E Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 23:30:04 +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As I wrote: > > I got `vm_bounce_alloc: Unmapped page' panic when I compiled in > > union mounted /usr/src/usr.sbin directory. > > It seems to be a cluster write related problem. I disabled cluster > write by: I disabled bounce buffer with 16MB RAM, and tryed to compile in unionfs. All binaries can be compiled without panic. So, I think there is something wrong in bounce buffer stuff (or both cluster write and bounce buffer). Anyone has an idea? ---- KATO Takenori Dept. Earth Planet. Sci., Nagoya Univ., Nagoya, 464-01, Japan PGP public key: finger kato@eclogite.eps.nagoya-u.ac.jp ------------------- Powered by FreeBSD(98) ------------------- From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 07:32:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA15751 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:32:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nasu.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp (nasu.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp [160.12.128.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA15736; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:32:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from outmail.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp (outmail.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp [160.12.196.3]) by nasu.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp (8.8.4+2.7Wbeta4/3.5Wpl3) with ESMTP id XAA13553; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 23:31:29 +0900 (JST) Received: from zodiac.mech.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp (iP5A4E0hDM0FF63kuW23lRGW4/WDwUxX@zodiac.mech.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp [160.12.33.1]) by outmail.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp (8.8.4+2.7Wbeta4/3.5Wpl3) with ESMTP id XAA30495; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 23:31:29 +0900 (JST) Received: from zodiac.mech.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp (zodiac.mech.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp [160.12.33.1]) by zodiac.mech.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp (8.7.6+2.6Wbeta7/3.4W/zodiac-May96) with ESMTP id XAA17480; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 23:37:13 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <199707211437.XAA17480@zodiac.mech.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp> To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: bde@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org, yokota@zodiac.mech.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Jul 1997 06:19:30 MST." <27686.869491170@time.cdrom.com> References: <27686.869491170@time.cdrom.com> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 23:37:12 +0900 From: Kazutaka YOKOTA Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: >Because of the introduction of these three files: > > /boot.config > /boot.help > /kernel.config > >New RELENG_2_2 installations now come up with a root filesystem which >contains none of these files, resulting in 3 fairly ominous-looking >error messages on startup and a complete lack of boot help. This is >simply not an acceptable scenario, and the question I'd like to bring >before you all is: "How do we want to fix it?" # Am I a part of the guilty party of this madness? Maybe... Anyway, why not just suppress error messages. That's the simplest solution/kludge. None of the above three files are mandatory. If we are concerned about the lack of help messages, we should provide just one line such as: Usage: bios_drive:interface(unit,partition)kernel_name options I don't think we can cram more in the boot code. That's basically why /boot.help was created in the first place, I guess. Kazu From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 07:37:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA15994 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:37:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from plaut.de (ns.plaut.de [194.39.177.166]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id HAA15989; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:37:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from totum.plaut.de (totum.plaut.de [194.39.177.9]) by plaut.de (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA26733; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 16:37:15 +0200 Received: from localhost (afuchs@localhost) by totum.plaut.de (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA16034; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 16:37:16 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 16:37:16 +0200 (MET DST) From: alex fuchsstadt Reply-To: alex fuchsstadt To: Dermot McNally cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , current@FreeBSD.ORG, "Jordan K. Hubbard" , dg@root.com Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 21 Jul 1997, Dermot McNally wrote: > > On 19-Jul-97 Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > >It's far more common in the 8 bit cards, yes. I would, however, > >hypothesize that the 16 bit cards have now (or will very shortly) > >outnumber the legacy equipment. I do know that I've certainly > >received a considerable amount of negative feedback over the choice of > >5 ("5?! Who uses that anymore? 10! The default value should be > >10! What are you guys thinking?!") :-) > > > >How does the "user base" feel about this? > > 10, every time. Or 11 if you really want to, but not 5 and > certainly not 3, for the very good reasons already pointed out. I > would guess that anyone who still uses an 8-bit network card has been > long enough at this game to know how to tweak the default value. Exactly! The discussion about this theme becomes weird! Every network-if you can buy now, especially the cheap NE2000 compatible ones, are shiped with a soft config utility (DOS). Use interupts > 7! I think the mass of PC harware users have a sound-if built-in or an additional if-card for COM or LPT, so I have: COM1:IRQ4 (MOUSE) COM2:IRQ3 COM3:IRQ15 COM4:IRQ10 LPT1:IRQ7 LPT2:IRQ5 SND:IRQ9 ED0:IRQ11 NCR:IRQ12 Some folks will mention to use IRQ12 for SCSI is weird, cause ps/2-mouse port uses this IRQ - by the use of four serial ports, I can loose one for a mouse. > > Dermot > > ---------------------------------- > Dermot McNally, Motorola EMEA CCS, Muenchen > dermot@sissdev.sps.mot.com, phone +49-89-92103 648 > ---------------------------------- > This is how the "user base" feels about it! Alexander Fuchsstadt -------------------- R/3-Basis Plaut Software GmbH From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 07:38:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA16034 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:38:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ocean.campus.luth.se (ocean.campus.luth.se [130.240.194.116]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA16029 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:38:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from karpen@localhost) by ocean.campus.luth.se (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA09641; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 16:41:09 +0200 (CEST) From: Mikael Karpberg Message-Id: <199707211441.QAA09641@ocean.campus.luth.se> Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... In-Reply-To: <19970721154922.61073@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de> from Christoph Kukulies at "Jul 21, 97 03:49:22 pm" To: kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (Christoph Kukulies) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 16:41:09 +0200 (CEST) Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Christoph Kukulies: [...] > 280/5 was one of the most common setting I was using in the past > for the WD8003 8 bit cards. I adopted this setting also > for those 16 bit cards (WD8013) the latter requiring to be programmed > for this value pair. > > Another common setting was 300/10 for the 16 bit cards which is a jumper > selectable option on the WD8013 (phased out) and SMC Ultra 8216 cheapo > cards of these days. > > I vote for keeping 280/5 because this doesn't rule out 8 bit cards. [...] > > 10, every time. Or 11 if you really want to, but not 5 and > > certainly not 3, for the very good reasons already pointed out. I > > would guess that anyone who still uses an 8-bit network card has been > > long enough at this game to know how to tweak the default value. > > > > Dermot Ok... This just might seem like a silly question, but Jordan wanted to take away the double devices. Why? ed0 == 300 / 10 ed1 == 280 / 5 This seems to be a really great solution, since it satisfies both sides with a good default. It will make installing easier for everyone. Now what could possibly be good about removing the double entry? Ofcourse it should be completely dynamic with having no ed* if there are no cards, and have one for each detected card if there are any. But before ISA probing code is fixed so it can test and autodetect where things are, like it should, why not have a double entry? /Mikael From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 07:39:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA16088 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:39:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA16080; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:39:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id AAA23834; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 00:08:53 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707211438.AAA23834@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness In-Reply-To: <27686.869491170@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at "Jul 21, 97 06:19:30 am" To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 00:08:53 +0930 (CST) Cc: bde@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jordan K. Hubbard stands accused of saying: > > One way would be to install these files along with the boot blocks if > they don't already exist in the targetdir, the "pros" of that approach > being that you could update your boot blocks and prototype boot > configuration files in one place, plus it'd wind up in the bindist(s) > by default. The #1 con of this idea is that it's truly gross to > contemplate install rules writing into /, plus you'd have a staleness > problem as things changed. Updating /etc is enough of an established > no-no, now we're talking about installing things straight into the > root dir? Surely the beginning of the end, that would be. The files should be installed into /usr/mdec along with the prototypical bootblocks, and written to the 'a' partition of the disk being labelled by 'disklabel -B' and anything that purports to be compatible with it, if they are not already there. Possibly an override option should be supplied which will force the files to be overwritten when labelling > Another way would be to artificially create these files in the bin > dist(s) through the efforts of one of the release building rules in Yecch. > that would involve copying another bindist over the old, and that's > why the 3rd and perhaps least offensive alternative is to put this > into the "post-install fixup" procedure in sysinstall which puts the > last few finishing and somewhat kludgy touches on an extracted bin > dist. This could then intelligently add the files if they did not > already exist. That makes the files second-class citizens. If they're really meant to go along with the bootblocks, then they should be managed by the same tools. > Jordan -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 07:47:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA16542 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:47:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ocean.campus.luth.se (ocean.campus.luth.se [130.240.194.116]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA16523; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:47:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from karpen@localhost) by ocean.campus.luth.se (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA09651; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 16:49:41 +0200 (CEST) From: Mikael Karpberg Message-Id: <199707211449.QAA09651@ocean.campus.luth.se> Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness In-Reply-To: <27686.869491170@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at "Jul 21, 97 06:19:30 am" To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 16:49:40 +0200 (CEST) Cc: bde@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Jordan K. Hubbard: > Because of the introduction of these three files: > > /boot.config > /boot.help > /kernel.config > > New RELENG_2_2 installations now come up with a root filesystem which > contains none of these files, resulting in 3 fairly ominous-looking > error messages on startup and a complete lack of boot help. This is > simply not an acceptable scenario, and the question I'd like to bring > before you all is: "How do we want to fix it?" > > I can think of several ways, all kind of gross. > > One way would be to install these files along with the boot blocks if > they don't already exist in the targetdir, the "pros" of that approach > being that you could update your boot blocks and prototype boot > configuration files in one place, plus it'd wind up in the bindist(s) > by default. The #1 con of this idea is that it's truly gross to > contemplate install rules writing into /, plus you'd have a staleness > problem as things changed. Updating /etc is enough of an established > no-no, now we're talking about installing things straight into the > root dir? Surely the beginning of the end, that would be. > > Another way would be to artificially create these files in the bin > dist(s) through the efforts of one of the release building rules in > /usr/src/release/Makefile. This would allow us to get away with not > modifying anybody's install rules at the expense of yet more confusing > "magic" inside of /usr/src/release/Makefile > > Either approach which splats things into the bindist also runs the > risk of blowing away your configuration data during an upgrade, since > that would involve copying another bindist over the old, and that's > why the 3rd and perhaps least offensive alternative is to put this > into the "post-install fixup" procedure in sysinstall which puts the > last few finishing and somewhat kludgy touches on an extracted bin > dist. This could then intelligently add the files if they did not > already exist. > > Comments? I think the second alternative sounds ok, with a small change. There should be no problem with the files being in the bindist, should it? In case of an upgrade you simply save those files, if they exist, just like you save /etc, and then in the "post install fixup" you check the "save directory" for those files, and if they exist you move the new files (which might contain something the user may want to see) to /boot.foo.new, and put his old files back into position. Or am I missing something? :-) /Mikael From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 07:47:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA16568 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:47:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA16541; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:47:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA28000; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:46:16 -0700 (PDT) To: Kazutaka YOKOTA cc: bde@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Jul 1997 23:37:12 +0900." <199707211437.XAA17480@zodiac.mech.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:46:16 -0700 Message-ID: <27996.869496376@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Anyway, why not just suppress error messages. That's the simplest > solution/kludge. None of the above three files are mandatory. If we > are concerned about the lack of help messages, we should provide just > one line such as: > > Usage: bios_drive:interface(unit,partition)kernel_name options > > I don't think we can cram more in the boot code. That's basically why > /boot.help was created in the first place, I guess. When I suggested this obvious alternative the first time, Bruce was violently opposed. Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 07:50:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA16818 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:50:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA16810; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:50:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA28023; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:49:51 -0700 (PDT) To: Michael Smith cc: bde@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Jul 1997 00:08:53 +0930." <199707211438.AAA23834@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:49:51 -0700 Message-ID: <28019.869496591@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > That makes the files second-class citizens. If they're really meant > to go along with the bootblocks, then they should be managed by the > same tools. 1. I'm still not sure that it's true that they're supposed to go along with the boot blocks. 2. Even if so, I'm even less sure that adding them to the `a' filesystem at disklabel -B time is an idea which could be employed without inducing an understandable "shock! horror!" reaction from users of disklabel. Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 07:51:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA16914 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:51:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA16901; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:51:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA28042; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:50:30 -0700 (PDT) To: Mikael Karpberg cc: bde@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Jul 1997 16:49:40 +0200." <199707211449.QAA09651@ocean.campus.luth.se> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:50:30 -0700 Message-ID: <28039.869496630@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > There should be no problem with the files being in the bindist, should it? > In case of an upgrade you simply save those files, if they exist, > just like you save /etc, and then in the "post install fixup" you check Hmmmmm. OK, that's a good point. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 07:57:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA17263 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:57:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA17252; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:57:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id AAA23939; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 00:26:55 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707211456.AAA23939@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness In-Reply-To: <28019.869496591@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at "Jul 21, 97 07:49:51 am" To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 00:26:55 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, bde@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jordan K. Hubbard stands accused of saying: > > That makes the files second-class citizens. If they're really meant > > to go along with the bootblocks, then they should be managed by the > > same tools. > > 1. I'm still not sure that it's true that they're supposed to go > along with the boot blocks. The boot blocks consider their absence as an error. Unless this is fixed (and Bruce has failed to do so despite being asked, so I have to assume he believes this is correct), they form part of the runtime bootstrap toolset. > 2. Even if so, I'm even less sure that adding them to the > `a' filesystem at disklabel -B time is an idea which > could be employed without inducing an understandable > "shock! horror!" reaction from users of disklabel. *shrug* Whatever degree of qualification it takes so that someone performing a routine update of the bootblocks on their root filesystem via the standard tools gets the entire set of boot components installed. I made my position clear some time back; while the bootstrap continues to preferentially read ufs filesystems, all the boot-time components should be in a separate directory. If we assume that this is /boot, then there would be no pain at all in updating /boot/help.default etc. when /usr/mdec was updated. > Jordan -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 08:06:18 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA17630 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 08:06:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from spsem02.sps.mot.com (spsem02.sps.mot.com [192.70.231.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA17625; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 08:06:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mogate.sps.mot.com by spsem02.sps.mot.com (4.1/SMI-4.1/Email 2.1 10/25/93) id AA27966 for jkh@FreeBSD.ORG; Mon, 21 Jul 97 08:06:00 MST Received: from zfrbc.sps.mot.com by mogate.sps.mot.com (4.1/SMI-4.1/Email-2.0) id AA28258 for jkh@time.cdrom.com; Mon, 21 Jul 97 08:05:54 MST Received: from sissdev.sps.mot.com by zfrbc.sps.mot.com with SMTP (1.37.109.20/16.2) id AA296717533; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:05:33 -0500 Received: by sissdev.sps.mot.com (AIX 4.1/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA22980; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:03:42 +0200 Message-Id: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.1 [p0] on AIX Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <19970721154922.61073@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 16:58:55 +0200 (DFT) From: Dermot McNally To: Christoph Kukulies Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... Cc: dg@root.com, "Jordan K. Hubbard" , current@FreeBSD.ORG, "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On 21-Jul-97 Christoph Kukulies wrote: >280/5 was one of the most common setting I was using in the past >for the WD8003 8 bit cards. I adopted this setting also >for those 16 bit cards (WD8013) the latter requiring to be programmed >for this value pair. > >Another common setting was 300/10 for the 16 bit cards which is a jumper >selectable option on the WD8013 (phased out) and SMC Ultra 8216 cheapo >cards of these days. > >I vote for keeping 280/5 because this doesn't rule out 8 bit cards. Neither does changing it - it just means that users of 8-bit cards need to switch a non-default value. But the default should most sensibly reflect a combination of: a) Reality - 8 bit cards are rarer and rarer b) Common sense - no point encouraging people to use settings that stomp on their sound cards or serial ports. At the end of the day, I'm being selfish because, like Jordan, I'm an "IRQ 10 every time" kind of bloke who is fed up with overriding daft defaults that fewer and fewer people will ever use. Dermot From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 08:09:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA17771 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 08:09:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tau-ceti.isc-br.com (root@tau-ceti.isc-br.com [129.189.2.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA17764 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 08:09:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by tau-ceti.isc-br.com via rmail with stdio id for freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 08:09:15 -0700 (PDT) (Smail-3.2.0.93 1997-Apr-12 #12 built 1997-May-25) Received: from phobos.walker.dom (localhost.walker.dom [127.0.0.1]) by phobos.walker.dom (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA16933; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:08:02 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199707211408.HAA16933@phobos.walker.dom> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0gamma 1/27/96 To: Terry Lambert cc: freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Insertion of NUL's (was: Re: -current :) In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Jul 1997 17:10:42 PDT." <199707210010.RAA10173@phaeton.artisoft.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 07:08:02 -0700 From: Keith Walker Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > [ ... NUL insertion ... ] > > > Oh good grief, I retired my only QIC-02 tape drive because I thought it was screwed up and inserting NUL's. Tapes made with tar (and I think dump, but I can't remember for sure) would have blocks of ^@'s inserted every once in a while, certainly enough to render a tape backup useless. > > > > Could this be related to the above problem? Or is my tape drive (circa 1987) actually broke? (Being's how the tape drive is so old, I don't have any DOS utilities to check the thing :-) > > I think the tape is probably toast. It's unlikely to interact this > way, since it doesn't deal with the idea of partial pages. I believe > the problem is with backing store for the FS, not devices (I could > be wrong; when did it start behaving badly? Is it consistent? If > so, try running it under an older -- 2.2 or earlier -- kernel to see). > It started all of this under 2.2. I'm sure that the tape drive is probably screwed up; sure enough that I'm not gonna drag it out and hook it up. Its just that the symptoms seemed so similar, that just for a moment there I had hope that it might not be the drive :-/ The beast only held about 60 Meg anyway. Kinda impractical in these days of cheap 4GB drives. (Of course, that was an awesome amount back in 1987 :-) From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 08:18:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA18122 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 08:18:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ocean.campus.luth.se (ocean.campus.luth.se [130.240.194.116]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA18116; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 08:18:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from karpen@localhost) by ocean.campus.luth.se (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA09737; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:21:12 +0200 (CEST) From: Mikael Karpberg Message-Id: <199707211521.RAA09737@ocean.campus.luth.se> Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness In-Reply-To: <199707211449.QAA09651@ocean.campus.luth.se> from Mikael Karpberg at "Jul 21, 97 04:49:40 pm" To: karpen@ocean.campus.luth.se (Mikael Karpberg) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:21:12 +0200 (CEST) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, bde@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Mikael Karpberg: [... snip ...] > I think the second alternative sounds ok, with a small change. > > There should be no problem with the files being in the bindist, should it? > In case of an upgrade you simply save those files, if they exist, > just like you save /etc, and then in the "post install fixup" you check > the "save directory" for those files, and if they exist you move the new > files (which might contain something the user may want to see) to > /boot.foo.new, and put his old files back into position. Or am I missing > something? :-) I have to comment on my own suggestion here, actually. The above scheme would seem appropriate for the /boot.foo files, except that maybe the /boot.help file should be the newest, and therefor the old file should be called /boot.help.old instead of the new one being called /boot.help.new. But that's all easilly solvable in the post install fixup thingie. :-) /Mikael From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 08:49:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA19736 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 08:49:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.116.240]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA19728 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 08:49:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de (gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de [137.226.31.2]) by Campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE (RBI-Z-5/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA17065 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:49:53 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.8.5/8.6.9) id RAA28433 for freebsd-current@freefall.cdrom.com; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:52:42 +0200 (MEST) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:52:42 +0200 (MEST) From: Christoph Kukulies Message-Id: <199707211552.RAA28433@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de> To: freebsd-current@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: make world chokes on lkm/pcic Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk While observing the last lines of my 5.5MB world.log with tail -f and expecting the wholesome -------------------------------------------------------------- make world completed on Tue Jul 1 23:40:07 MEST 1997 -------------------------------------------------------------- appearing in a few seconds I got shocked and torn out of my dreams by the following dreadful message: d-externs -Wstrict-prototypes -Wmissing-prototypes -Wpointer-arith -DPSEUDO_LKM -c /home/BLUES/src/lkm/pcic/../../sys/pccard/pcic.c /home/BLUES/src/lkm/pcic/../../sys/pccard/pcic.c: In function `pcic_probe': /home/BLUES/src/lkm/pcic/../../sys/pccard/pcic.c:794: `SWI_MASK' undeclared (first use this function) /home/BLUES/src/lkm/pcic/../../sys/pccard/pcic.c:794: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only once /home/BLUES/src/lkm/pcic/../../sys/pccard/pcic.c:794: for each function it appears in.) *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. blues> Am I inmidst of two cvsups or is something broken? Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 08:56:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA20142 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 08:56:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA20110; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 08:55:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id BAA19147; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 01:52:47 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 01:52:47 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707211552.BAA19147@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: jkh@time.cdrom.com, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness Cc: bde@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >The files should be installed into /usr/mdec along with the >prototypical bootblocks, and written to the 'a' partition of the disk >being labelled by 'disklabel -B' and anything that purports to be >compatible with it, if they are not already there. Possibly an Certainly not. disklabel(8) writes boot blocks; it has no knowledge file systems. Whatever writes the files has to handle the following cases: - bare disk with no file system: optionally newfs the file system to reduce to the next case - disk with file system: optionally fsck and mount it to reduce to the next case; later unmount it. - mounted file system: just install -C the help file and write whatever is necessary to the config files (nothing by default). Bruce From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 09:07:12 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA20582 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 09:07:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA20573 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 09:07:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id BAA19264; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 01:57:18 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 01:57:18 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707211557.BAA19264@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, jkh@time.cdrom.com Subject: Re: switching to seral consoles Cc: ahd@kew.com, asami@cs.berkeley.edu, current@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> Misfeature: USERCONFIG_BOOT together with kernel.config starting and >> ending as above stops booting with -c from working. The config file >> is preferred and there is no way to switc to interactive mode. > >You just need to figure out a way of bootstrapping a mini-editor, >Bruce, so that they can edit out that last "q" in kernel.conf. Then >it will drop into CLI mode instead. :-) -c should override the config file (so that you can recover from a bad config file) and there should be a new command to source the config file image (if any). Bruce From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 09:10:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA20836 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 09:10:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA20821 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 09:10:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jkh@localhost) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) id JAA28312 for current@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 09:10:03 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 09:10:03 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Message-Id: <199707211610.JAA28312@time.cdrom.com> To: current@freebsd.org Subject: /usr/src/lib/libtelnet - why? Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Somebody came to me the other day and said "hey, you know how ppp will let you talk to a modem device, right? Wouldn't it be neat if that modem device could also be remote, like on a terminal server? At some special host/port combination, like Ciscos and Ascends do it?" Well, I agreed that it would indeed be kinda neat so I went off to figure out how telnet negotiation is done given a raw connection to some port (since all the terminal servers I have around here implement telnet semantics and don't work right with the simplistic "netcat" sorts of solutions). And here's my point: 1. There does not, it would appear, exist any reasonable API and library for handling this kind of stuff, leaving the actual UI details up a layer where you'd think they should be. That kinda sucks since anybody wanting to communicate over a socket with telnet protocol (who's not telnet) has to reimplement this all from scratch. 2. The libtelnet that we do have appears to contain almost nothing, and certainly very little which would appear to need its own library. What was the idea here - just to separate out the DES stuff? Thanks! Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 09:42:12 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA22837 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 09:42:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA22824; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 09:42:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id CAA24326; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 02:11:48 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707211641.CAA24326@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness In-Reply-To: <199707211552.BAA19147@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from Bruce Evans at "Jul 22, 97 01:52:47 am" To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 02:11:47 +0930 (CST) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, bde@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Bruce Evans stands accused of saying: > >The files should be installed into /usr/mdec along with the > >prototypical bootblocks, and written to the 'a' partition of the disk > >being labelled by 'disklabel -B' and anything that purports to be > >compatible with it, if they are not already there. Possibly an > > Certainly not. disklabel(8) writes boot blocks; it has no knowledge > file systems. Then either disklabel or the design which requires (as opposed to supports) the presence of these files is in error. > Whatever writes the files has to handle the following > cases: > > - bare disk with no file system: optionally newfs the file system to > reduce to the next case > - disk with file system: optionally fsck and mount it to reduce to > the next case; later unmount it. > - mounted file system: just install -C the help file and write whatever > is necessary to the config files (nothing by default). The first and second case render the 'correct' behaviour in this model problematic; certainly they would possess possibly undesirable side-effects at least as bad as the abomination involved in getting Sun bootblocks installed. It would appear, in this case, that anything that's meant to be a filesystem which might be taken by a bootblock to be a root filesystem candidate must have these files installed. Should this be handled by 'newfs', perhaps with a diagnostic warning when it is generating a filesystem on an 'a' partition, rather than going ahead and mounting it etc.? > Bruce -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 09:51:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA23622 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 09:51:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (Ilsa.StevesCafe.com [205.168.119.129]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA23608 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 09:51:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA05888 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:51:07 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199707211651.KAA05888@Ilsa.StevesCafe.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0gamma 1/27/96 From: Steve Passe To: current@freebsd.org Subject: CR0_EM define. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:51:06 -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, can someone tell me why machine/specialreg.h has: #ifdef notused #define CR0_EM 0x00000004 /* EMulate non-NPX coproc. (trap ESC only) */ #endif I need to use this bit but found it disabled. is there a name clash, or could I enable it without causing anyone grief? -- Steve Passe | powered by smp@csn.net | Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 10:00:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA24479 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:00:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA24473 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:00:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id CAA20845; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 02:58:09 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 02:58:09 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707211658.CAA20845@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: freebsd-current@freefall.FreeBSD.org, kuku@gilberto.physik.RWTH-Aachen.DE Subject: Re: make world chokes on lkm/pcic Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >d-externs -Wstrict-prototypes -Wmissing-prototypes -Wpointer-arith -DPSEUDO_LKM -c /home/BLUES/src/lkm/pcic/../../sys/pccard/pcic.c >/home/BLUES/src/lkm/pcic/../../sys/pccard/pcic.c: In function `pcic_probe': >/home/BLUES/src/lkm/pcic/../../sys/pccard/pcic.c:794: `SWI_MASK' undeclared (first use this function) Fixed. Bruce From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 10:14:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA25535 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:14:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA25529 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:14:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org [127.0.0.1] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wqM1v-0001il-00; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:13:51 -0600 To: Sean Eric Fagan Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... Cc: current@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 19 Jul 1997 09:49:56 PDT." <199707191649.JAA15918@kithrup.com> References: <199707191649.JAA15918@kithrup.com> <21008.869326490@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at "Jul 19, 97 08:34:50 am" Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:13:51 -0600 From: Warner Losh Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199707191649.JAA15918@kithrup.com> Sean Eric Fagan writes: : The visual config stuff is neat, and can be a lifesaver... but requiring : users to do it is going to bite, *hard*. I had to help a (very technical) : friend go through the process -- this is someone who had installed linux on : his system with no problem, he's dealt with funky PC hardware before, etc. : And yet he needed help to config the kernel before booting. : : I really think forcing more people to do it is bad. I know that the number one PITA when trying to get FreeBSD running on new systems that I build from random hardware that floats my way is finding where the @#!$#&!@*#%(* the ethernet card is, and making sure that the IRQ is the right one. I'd be a lot happier if we just dropped the irq bit completely from the config file for ethernet cards and have them be found just like the lp devices are found. At least as an option. Using the visual editor is nice, but a real pain to even the most experienced users of the system. It will be a nightmare for many novices. Warner From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 10:18:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA25825 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:18:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA25810; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:18:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org [127.0.0.1] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wqM6C-0001jA-00; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:18:16 -0600 To: Andreas Klemm Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... Cc: Michael Smith , "Jordan K. Hubbard" , current@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 19 Jul 1997 22:14:28 +0200." <19970719221428.10703@gtn.com> References: <19970719221428.10703@gtn.com> <199707191221.FAA23412@freefall.freebsd.org> <199707191434.AAA14215@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:18:16 -0600 From: Warner Losh Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <19970719221428.10703@gtn.com> Andreas Klemm writes: : Is FreeBSD turing PC's into workstations or is it only used : for lamer PC hardware ?! I have a whole pile of old PC parts that I'm using to build multiple routers. FreeBSD is making all of this possible. I don't know if I'm a typical case, but I do know what has frustrated me with this interprise to date. This pile of PC parts are free, and I'm doing this in time I'd otherwise not be billing, and I don't have a lot of cash to buy an extra ethernet card (x 5) and an extra SCSI controller (x 5) and bunch of other things that people seem to tell me are cheap enough to buy. FreeBSD works really well on these machines. My biggest complaint is the configuration of ethernet devices. It would be nice if there were some easier way to do this automatically. Warner From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 10:21:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA26036 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:21:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA26027 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:21:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org [127.0.0.1] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wqM8x-0001jT-00; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:21:07 -0600 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... Cc: Sean Eric Fagan , current@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 19 Jul 1997 18:24:11 PDT." <22424.869361851@time.cdrom.com> References: <22424.869361851@time.cdrom.com> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:21:07 -0600 From: Warner Losh Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <22424.869361851@time.cdrom.com> "Jordan K. Hubbard" writes: : The ed1 entry is also the cause of much tech support for me since : it "catches" cards at 0x300 but invariably with the wrong IRQ, so the : user is tricked into thinking that things work until the install : is well underway and the only message they're now seeing is: : "ed1: device timeout" from the bogus IRQ value. That's a different problem that should be fixed :-). Warner From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 10:34:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA26877 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:34:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA26870; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:34:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA28692; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:33:27 -0700 (PDT) To: Michael Smith cc: bde@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Jul 1997 00:26:55 +0930." <199707211456.AAA23939@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:33:27 -0700 Message-ID: <28688.869506407@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I made my position clear some time back; while the bootstrap continues > to preferentially read ufs filesystems, all the boot-time components > should be in a separate directory. If we assume that this is /boot, > then there would be no pain at all in updating /boot/help.default etc. > when /usr/mdec was updated. Hmmm. It's a slightly divergent topic, but I guess I should also say that I favor putting these new foo.config files into a /boot subdirectory here and now before they get doc'd in too many places. I think too many new files have gone into / at this point. Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 10:36:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA27051 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:36:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA27041; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:36:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id DAA22015; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 03:32:41 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 03:32:41 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707211732.DAA22015@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@FreeBSD.ORG, jkh@time.cdrom.com Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Because of the introduction of these three files: > > /boot.config > /boot.help > /kernel.config > >New RELENG_2_2 installations now come up with a root filesystem which >contains none of these files, resulting in 3 fairly ominous-looking >error messages on startup and a complete lack of boot help. This is This problem became more urgent when pst put the new boot blocks in 2.2. >One way would be to install these files along with the boot blocks if >by default. The #1 con of this idea is that it's truly gross to >contemplate install rules writing into /, plus you'd have a staleness Almost as bad as installing the kernel into / :-). I think /kernel.config should be installed at the same time as /kernel. If the old kernel is moved to /kernel.old, then the old kernel.config (if any) should be moved to /kernel.old.config and the problem is to put reasonable defaults in the new kernel.config. I think the old ones will do. BTW, the warning for a missing kernel.config is mainly to remind you when you boot from an unusual kernel that you may have forgotten to rename the config file when you renamed the kernel. /boot.help should match the boot blocks but it isn't critical for it to be up to date. /boot.config needs more support from sysinstall. sysinstall should determine the BIOS boot drive number and write it into /boot.config. Bruce From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 10:40:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA27427 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:40:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA27413 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:40:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id DAA24549; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 03:10:01 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707211740.DAA24549@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... In-Reply-To: from Warner Losh at "Jul 21, 97 11:13:51 am" To: imp@rover.village.org (Warner Losh) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 03:10:00 +0930 (CST) Cc: sef@Kithrup.COM, current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Warner Losh stands accused of saying: > > I know that the number one PITA when trying to get FreeBSD running on > new systems that I build from random hardware that floats my way is > finding where the @#!$#&!@*#%(* the ethernet card is, and making sure > that the IRQ is the right one. I'd be a lot happier if we just > dropped the irq bit completely from the config file for ethernet cards > and have them be found just like the lp devices are found. At least > as an option. Just for the 'ed' driver, which is probably the most commonly used driver, this is really quite tough. The current probe is intrusive, and will confuse some SCSI controllers, so having it scan for stuff is fairly tough. (Having said that, many of the newer 8390 clone ASICs are easier to probe for). On top of that, working out which interrupt the card is on is not easy. There isn't some convenient register that you can read for this. 8( > Warner -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 10:41:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA27492 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:41:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA27476 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:41:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id DAA22131; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 03:36:47 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 03:36:47 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707211736.DAA22131@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: current@FreeBSD.ORG, smp@csn.net Subject: Re: CR0_EM define. Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >can someone tell me why machine/specialreg.h has: > >#ifdef notused >#define CR0_EM 0x00000004 /* EMulate non-NPX coproc. (trap ESC only) */ >#endif I think it was to remind me not to set it :-). You can enable it to clear it. Bruce From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 10:45:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA27972 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:45:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA27952 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:45:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA28738; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:44:11 -0700 (PDT) To: Mikael Karpberg cc: kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (Christoph Kukulies), current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Jul 1997 16:41:09 +0200." <199707211441.QAA09641@ocean.campus.luth.se> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:44:11 -0700 Message-ID: <28734.869507051@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Ok... This just might seem like a silly question, but Jordan wanted to take > away the double devices. Why? > > ed0 == 300 / 10 > ed1 == 280 / 5 > > This seems to be a really great solution, since it satisfies both sides with > a good default. It will make installing easier for everyone. Now what could > possibly be good about removing the double entry? Because I think the basic idea we're trying to push with the whole userconfig thing (and its associated docs) are that you should always edit ed0 to match your card, whatever that might be, and if it falls to ed1 then something is _wrong_ and you should go back and edit the entry for ed0 again. Also, with the settings as they currently stand today, you rarely get fall back behavior which actually helps the user - far from it. What happens instead is that ed1's port value matches but the IRQ value is still wrong, and while the user sees a "probe" for ed1 and an entry in all the relevant selection menus (further leading them to feel that things are fine), things hang up later when they actually go out and try to use the card. Timeouts, hangs, very confused users. If, on the other hand, you didn't even show them an ethernet card as an option, nor did they see a probe message for it at boot time, it's be a strong indication to them that they need to go fix this problem first. When the ed1: timeout problems happen, by contrast, they typically write to us since it's not a failure they understand. Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 10:56:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA29073 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:56:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA28967; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:55:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id DAA22383; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 03:45:54 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 03:45:54 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707211745.DAA22383@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: jkh@time.cdrom.com, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness Cc: bde@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Hmmm. It's a slightly divergent topic, but I guess I should also say >that I favor putting these new foo.config files into a /boot >subdirectory here and now before they get doc'd in too many places. >I think too many new files have gone into / at this point. kernels have always gone in /. I want kernel*.config with kernel*, and it would be silly to have a new directory just for boot.config and boot.help. Bruce From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 10:58:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA29214 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:58:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from news1.gtn.com (news1.gtn.com [194.77.0.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA29198; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:58:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by news1.gtn.com (8.7.2/8.7.2) with UUCP id TAA14504; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 19:45:43 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from andreas@localhost) by klemm.gtn.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) id TAA04037; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 19:36:41 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19970721193640.30062@gtn.com> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 19:36:40 +0200 From: Andreas Klemm To: Warner Losh Cc: Michael Smith , "Jordan K. Hubbard" , current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... References: <19970719221428.10703@gtn.com> <199707191221.FAA23412@freefall.freebsd.org> <199707191434.AAA14215@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> <19970719221428.10703@gtn.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79 In-Reply-To: ; from Warner Losh on Mon, Jul 21, 1997 at 11:18:16AM -0600 X-Disclaimer: A free society is one where it is safe to be unpopular X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT SMP Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, Jul 21, 1997 at 11:18:16AM -0600, Warner Losh wrote: > > I have a whole pile of old PC parts that I'm using to build multiple > routers. FreeBSD is making all of this possible. I don't know if I'm > a typical case, but I do know what has frustrated me with this > interprise to date. This pile of PC parts are free, and I'm doing > this in time I'd otherwise not be billing, and I don't have a lot of > cash to buy an extra ethernet card (x 5) and an extra SCSI controller > (x 5) and bunch of other things that people seem to tell me are cheap > enough to buy. FreeBSD works really well on these machines. > > My biggest complaint is the configuration of ethernet devices. It > would be nice if there were some easier way to do this automatically. A question. The visual kernel config mode allows you to configure the IRQ's, I/O addresses and such ... even if you have older cards. All what Jordan wants to do is to choose more proper default settings. IRQ 5 for sound cards and IRQ 10 for ethernet interfaces ... But you should still be able to ,boot -c' and to reconfigure the default settings by disabling the sound driver and using IRQ 5 for the network card. This change should make it more easier to install PC's, that now typically come with a soundcard and such ... You experts, who still make routers out of 386er machines, _know_ how to use the -c option ... But the newcomers with P100 and soundcard possibly not ... -- Andreas Klemm | klemm.gtn.com - powered by Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/SMP.html http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/benches.html From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 11:20:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA00623 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:20:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA00610 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:20:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA29040; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:19:38 -0700 (PDT) To: Warner Losh cc: Sean Eric Fagan , current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:21:07 MDT." Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:19:37 -0700 Message-ID: <29037.869509177@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > In message <22424.869361851@time.cdrom.com> "Jordan K. Hubbard" writes: > : The ed1 entry is also the cause of much tech support for me since > : it "catches" cards at 0x300 but invariably with the wrong IRQ, so the > : user is tricked into thinking that things work until the install > : is well underway and the only message they're now seeing is: > : "ed1: device timeout" from the bogus IRQ value. > > That's a different problem that should be fixed :-). I agree, but after 3 years I think I can be forgiven for assuming that this particular Godot is not going to show up. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 11:21:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA00720 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:21:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA00711; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:21:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA29060; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:21:00 -0700 (PDT) To: Bruce Evans cc: bde@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Jul 1997 03:32:41 +1000." <199707211732.DAA22015@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:21:00 -0700 Message-ID: <29057.869509260@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > /boot.config needs more support from sysinstall. sysinstall should > determine the BIOS boot drive number and write it into /boot.config. Hmmmm. Heeeeeelp, Poul-Henninnnnnnng! :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 11:25:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA01056 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:25:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA01044; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:25:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA29103; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:24:44 -0700 (PDT) To: Bruce Evans cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, bde@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Jul 1997 03:45:54 +1000." <199707211745.DAA22383@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:24:44 -0700 Message-ID: <29100.869509484@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > kernels have always gone in /. I want kernel*.config with kernel*, > and it would be silly to have a new directory just for boot.config > and boot.help. Hmmmm. Welllll, OK. Just so long as we don't plan on adding anymore config files in / anytime soon. :) Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 11:31:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA01362 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:31:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kithrup.com (kithrup.com [205.179.156.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA01357 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:31:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from sef@localhost) by kithrup.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) id LAA12016 for current@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:31:53 -0700 Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:31:53 -0700 From: Sean Eric Fagan Message-Id: <199707211831.LAA12016@kithrup.com> To: current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In article <28688.869506407.kithrup.freebsd.current@time.cdrom.com> you write: >Hmmm. It's a slightly divergent topic, but I guess I should also say >that I favor putting these new foo.config files into a /boot >subdirectory here and now before they get doc'd in too many places. >I think too many new files have gone into / at this point. You know, there *is* something to be said about the SysVr4 method of having a "/boot" filesystem, with a simplified FS for it. (The simplified FS [no subdirectories, no non-file types, no indirect blocks] means that the boot program can generally be easier.) I don't know if we would be able to go this way, though, because it would require changing the partitioning, which would make doing an upgrade a lot harder. Still, it may be worth thinking about. Sean. From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 11:32:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA01450 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:32:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA01443 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:32:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org [127.0.0.1] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wqNG9-0001rg-00; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 12:32:37 -0600 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... Cc: Sean Eric Fagan , current@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:19:37 PDT." <29037.869509177@time.cdrom.com> References: <29037.869509177@time.cdrom.com> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 12:32:37 -0600 From: Warner Losh Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <29037.869509177@time.cdrom.com> "Jordan K. Hubbard" writes: : I agree, but after 3 years I think I can be forgiven for assuming that : this particular Godot is not going to show up. :-) :-). What is delaying the arrival of Gadot? :-) Heck, I'd even settle for something that I can run in configure mode that would tell me what I needed to know. Even if it did fubar other cards in the process, it is a lot easier to reboot from the config mode than from a full system. :-) Barring that, I'd even settle for something that says "I told the card to interrupt, but the IRQ you told me to use didn't come within a second (or 10 seconds), so your ethernet card is likely fubar'd." The biggest problem that I've had is forgetting that just because the kernel prints it, doesn't mean that it is the proper settings. Most of these cards come with something that tests the interrupt. If it can't make the card interrupt, then it will tell you that that test failed. Is this possible during the probing of the card? If not, it is possible just before it sends its first packet? I'd be happy if the ed driver did this... So my preferences are: 1) Have the kernel tell me where the card is config'd for. 2) Have the kernel tell me that the interrupt doesn't seem to be right at probe time. 3) Have the kernel tell me as soon as it can that the card isn't interrupting. 4) The status quo. Are my desires even close to being able to be realized (well, #4 obviously is :-). Warner P.S. Regardless, I think that jordan's changes are good. From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 11:35:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA01754 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:35:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA01748 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:35:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org [127.0.0.1] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wqNIz-0001sE-00; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 12:35:33 -0600 To: Michael Smith Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... Cc: sef@Kithrup.COM, current@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Jul 1997 03:10:00 +0930." <199707211740.DAA24549@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> References: <199707211740.DAA24549@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 12:35:33 -0600 From: Warner Losh Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199707211740.DAA24549@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Michael Smith writes: : On top of that, working out which interrupt the card is on is not : easy. There isn't some convenient register that you can read for : this. 8( I'd settle for working out that the current interrupt isn't right, even if you can't tell me which one it should be. That would at least alert me to the fact that there is a problem, which is an incremental improvement over today's world. Warner From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 11:59:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA03255 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:59:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tangelo.lal.ufl.edu (tangelo.lal.ufl.edu [204.199.163.200]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA03228; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:59:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Loche.lal.ufl.edu (204.199.163.38) by tangelo.lal.ufl.edu (EMWAC SMTPRS 0.81) with SMTP id ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 14:58:52 -0400 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:07:31 -0400 Message-ID: <01BC95E7.CFDECB40.cll@icon.lal.ufl.edu> From: Christina Loche To: "'freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org'" , "'freebsd-chat@freebsd.org'" , "'freebsd-current@freebsd.org'" , "'hackers@freebsd.org'" Subject: unsubscribe Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:07:27 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk unsubscribe Christina Loche Cll@icon.lal.ufl.edu Ext. 220 From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 12:00:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA03416 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 12:00:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pandora.hh.kew.com (ahd@kendra.ne.mediaone.net [24.128.53.73]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA03357 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:59:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ahd@localhost) by pandora.hh.kew.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA10249 for current@FreeBSD.ORG; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 14:59:50 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 14:59:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Drew Derbyshire Message-Id: <199707211859.OAA10249@pandora.hh.kew.com> To: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: 8 bit/16 bit ethernet cards Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk You know, in five years I have never even _seen_ an eight bit Ethernet Card? Some of my old Lantastic ones would run in 8 bit mode, but they were 16 bit cards. Go with ed0 at IRQ 10/port x280, that's what I've been moving my cards to. :-) (And punt ed1, it's just confusing to have the same device twice by default.) -- Drew Derbyshire Internet: ahd@kew.com Kendra Electronic Wonderworks Telephone: 617-279-9812 "The Internet Gateway is 2 VMBLOKS down and to the left, right past the . . ." From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 12:02:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA03716 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 12:02:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA03706 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 12:02:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org [127.0.0.1] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wqNiO-0001wO-00; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 13:01:48 -0600 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... Cc: Mikael Karpberg , kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (Christoph Kukulies), current@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Jul 1997 10:44:11 PDT." <28734.869507051@time.cdrom.com> References: <28734.869507051@time.cdrom.com> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 13:01:48 -0600 From: Warner Losh Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <28734.869507051@time.cdrom.com> "Jordan K. Hubbard" writes: : If, on the other hand, you didn't even show them an ethernet card as : an option, nor did they see a probe message for it at boot time, it's : be a strong indication to them that they need to go fix this problem : first. When the ed1: timeout problems happen, by contrast, they : typically write to us since it's not a failure they understand. Looking at the driver, the following chipsets seem to support auto detection of interrupts. I've some patches that I'll test tonight to see if I can add a sanity check when things aren't the same. I may have missed some in some of the other code paths. WD8003W WD8003EB WD8013W WD8013EP WD8013WC WD8013EPC WD8013EBP SMC8216T SMC8216C SMC8216BT I don't know how many cards this covers, but it does look to be a fair number. There is code in the ed driver now to autoconfig the interrupt on these cards. There is not code to detect that you've set an interrupt incorrectly (which looked like 3 lines to add in two places, add another 10 lines for tables needed for good error reporting). I think that this would be a worthwhile addition to the kernel, assuming that it proves to be correct. Warner P.S. Here's what I have right now, but it is untested as yet. I haven't compiled it even. Index: if_ed.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/imp/FreeBSD/CVS/src/sys/i386/isa/if_ed.c,v retrieving revision 1.116 diff -u -r1.116 if_ed.c --- if_ed.c 1997/03/24 11:32:39 1.116 +++ if_ed.c 1997/07/21 18:46:02 @@ -666,6 +666,9 @@ */ if (isa_dev->id_irq <= 0) isa_dev->id_irq = ed_intr_mask[iptr]; + else if (isa_dev->id_irq != ed_intr_mask[iptr]) + printf("ed%d: Warning: interrupt mismatch\n", + isa_dev->id_unit); /* * Enable the interrupt. @@ -687,6 +690,9 @@ */ if (isa_dev->id_irq <= 0) isa_dev->id_irq = ed_790_intr_mask[iptr]; + else if (isa_dev->id_irq != ed_790_intr_mask[iptr]) + printf("ed%d: Warning: interrupt mismatch\n", + isa_dev->id_unit); /* * Enable interrupts. From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 12:46:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA06602 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 12:46:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ox.ismi.net (root@ox.ismi.net [206.31.56.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA06557; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 12:46:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aerosmith.dyn.ml.org (mrr@pm2-27.ismi.net [206.31.56.67]) by ox.ismi.net (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id PAA03559; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:42:24 -0400 Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:38:53 -0400 (EDT) From: "Michael R. Rudel" To: Warner Losh cc: Andreas Klemm , Michael Smith , "Jordan K. Hubbard" , current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 21 Jul 1997, Warner Losh wrote: > In message <19970719221428.10703@gtn.com> Andreas Klemm writes: > : Is FreeBSD turing PC's into workstations or is it only used > : for lamer PC hardware ?! > > I have a whole pile of old PC parts that I'm using to build multiple > routers. FreeBSD is making all of this possible. I don't know if I'm > a typical case, but I do know what has frustrated me with this > interprise to date. This pile of PC parts are free, and I'm doing > this in time I'd otherwise not be billing, and I don't have a lot of > cash to buy an extra ethernet card (x 5) and an extra SCSI controller > (x 5) and bunch of other things that people seem to tell me are cheap > enough to buy. FreeBSD works really well on these machines. > > My biggest complaint is the configuration of ethernet devices. It > would be nice if there were some easier way to do this automatically. > > Warner > Never seen it, but I've heard one or two flavors of Linux have a graphical ifconfig... This sounds right up jkh or phk's isle, doesn't it? They could do something that will (very) niftily save it to /etc/rc.conf or some such thing.. Heck, maybe even right a graphical /etc/rc.conf editor. ;) -- Michael R. Rudel -=- FreeBSD: There are no limits -=- mrr@aerosmith.dyn.ml.org FreeBSD aerosmith.dyn.ml.org 3.0-CURRENT PGP Key Block: finger mrrpgp@aerosmith.dyn.ml.org From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 12:51:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA07019 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 12:51:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tangelo.lal.ufl.edu (tangelo.lal.ufl.edu [204.199.163.200]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA06973; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 12:50:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Loche.lal.ufl.edu (204.199.163.38) by tangelo.lal.ufl.edu (EMWAC SMTPRS 0.81) with SMTP id ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:50:52 -0400 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:59:33 -0400 Message-ID: <01BC95EF.147A1A00.cll@icon.lal.ufl.edu> From: Christina Loche To: "'Christina Loche'" , "'freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org'" , "'freebsd-chat@freebsd.org'" , "'freebsd-current@freebsd.org'" , "'hackers@freebsd.org'" Subject: RE: unsubscribe Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:59:28 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Sorry all...I pushed the wrong address. Please disregard. Christina Loche Cll@icon.lal.ufl.edu Ext. 220 -----Original Message----- From: Christina Loche [SMTP:cll@ICON.LAL.UFL.EDU] Sent: Monday, July 21, 1997 3:07 PM To: 'freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org'; 'freebsd-chat@freebsd.org'; 'freebsd-current@freebsd.org'; 'hackers@freebsd.org' Subject: unsubscribe unsubscribe Christina Loche Cll@icon.lal.ufl.edu Ext. 220 From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 13:28:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA09278 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 13:28:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ox.ismi.net (root@ox.ismi.net [206.31.56.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA09207; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 13:27:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aerosmith.dyn.ml.org (mrr@pm2-27.ismi.net [206.31.56.67]) by ox.ismi.net (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id PAA03449; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:39:43 -0400 Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:36:06 -0400 (EDT) From: "Michael R. Rudel" To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: Michael Smith , bde@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness In-Reply-To: <28688.869506407@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 21 Jul 1997, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > I made my position clear some time back; while the bootstrap continues > > to preferentially read ufs filesystems, all the boot-time components > > should be in a separate directory. If we assume that this is /boot, > > then there would be no pain at all in updating /boot/help.default etc. > > when /usr/mdec was updated. > > Hmmm. It's a slightly divergent topic, but I guess I should also say > that I favor putting these new foo.config files into a /boot > subdirectory here and now before they get doc'd in too many places. > I think too many new files have gone into / at this point. > > Jordan > Speaking of too many files in /, I don't like that when you install a new system, it puts (if you don't mail/etc/blah the survey) new-registration in /. Just seems kind of kludgy to me. ;) A better place, IMO, would be something like /usr. -- Michael R. Rudel -=- FreeBSD: There are no limits -=- mrr@aerosmith.dyn.ml.org FreeBSD aerosmith.dyn.ml.org 3.0-CURRENT PGP Key Block: finger mrrpgp@aerosmith.dyn.ml.org From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 15:00:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA14479 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:00:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ocean.campus.luth.se (ocean.campus.luth.se [130.240.194.116]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA14440 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 14:59:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from karpen@localhost) by ocean.campus.luth.se (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA10525; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 00:02:40 +0200 (CEST) From: Mikael Karpberg Message-Id: <199707212202.AAA10525@ocean.campus.luth.se> Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... In-Reply-To: from Warner Losh at "Jul 21, 97 01:01:48 pm" To: imp@rover.village.org (Warner Losh) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 00:02:40 +0200 (CEST) Cc: current@FreeBSD.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'll just take to replys in one mail and save us all some spam... According to Jordan K. Hubbard: [What's wrong with having a double entry... ed0 and ed1] > Because I think the basic idea we're trying to push with the whole > userconfig thing (and its associated docs) are that you should always > edit ed0 to match your card, whatever that might be, and if it falls > to ed1 then something is _wrong_ and you should go back and edit the > entry for ed0 again. > > Also, with the settings as they currently stand today, you rarely get > fall back behavior which actually helps the user - far from it. What > happens instead is that ed1's port value matches but the IRQ value is > still wrong, and while the user sees a "probe" for ed1 and an entry in > all the relevant selection menus (further leading them to feel that > things are fine), things hang up later when they actually go out and > try to use the card. Timeouts, hangs, very confused users. > > If, on the other hand, you didn't even show them an ethernet card as > an option, nor did they see a probe message for it at boot time, it's > be a strong indication to them that they need to go fix this problem > first. When the ed1: timeout problems happen, by contrast, they > typically write to us since it's not a failure they understand. Yeah, but there are a few things against this too: 1) We get only one guess at their ethernet card's setting. If ed0 is not correctly set to 300/10 as it should, then their ethernet wont work without configuration. 2) "a strong indication to them" is not much good, I think. The boot messages scroll by quite fast, and I'd think it looks more like annoying garbage text that you should ignore, just like you did on your DOS machine with 2000 copyrights and other garbage text from drivers loading. New users will be waiting for the machine to just boot, or possibly ask them something. That's my guess. 3) It's not that easy to do the configuration, no matter how nice the UI is. There's only one really easy way for the user. Do it for him. This means probing... See the other mail... ------------------------------------------------------------------------ According to Warner Losh: > Looking at the driver, the following chipsets seem to support auto > detection of interrupts. I've some patches that I'll test tonight to > see if I can add a sanity check when things aren't the same. I may > have missed some in some of the other code paths. > > WD8003W > WD8003EB > WD8013W > WD8013EP > WD8013WC > WD8013EPC > WD8013EBP > SMC8216T > SMC8216C > SMC8216BT > > I don't know how many cards this covers, but it does look to be a fair > number. There is code in the ed driver now to autoconfig the > interrupt on these cards. There is not code to detect that you've set > an interrupt incorrectly (which looked like 3 lines to add in two > places, add another 10 lines for tables needed for good error > reporting). I think that this would be a worthwhile addition to the > kernel, assuming that it proves to be correct. What?! There is code to autodetect it, but if it's set (and wrong) it wont run the autodetect code and see your mistake, warn that "you did wrong and will be dutifully ignored", and correct it? Why do you not set it? Also, when the card IS found (say on 300) why does the code not try and use the card (fake an ifconfig, kinda , or something... I dunno) and timeout after 2 seconds, and if that test failed, just switch interupt to some likely ones (5, 10, 11, 3 (obviouslu :\) ? Or maybe all IRQs?) and try again. When found, change the kernels default value, and the user will have a warning message saying he screwed up, but it's ok, it's been fixed for him. (Ok... I seriously don't have a clue about the interupt handling, so this may be complete garbage, but would someone tell me why, in a few words more then "you can't"? :-) Also there could be a little newbie helping thing that they could choose instead of userconfig. Something like: ----- Answer the following questions by pressing the number for the correct answer: Do you have a network card? 1. Yes. 2. No. 3. I don't know. > 2 (Turn off all ISA network card probes) Do you have a SCSI card? ... or ... Do you have a network card? 1. Yes. 2. No. 3. I don't know. > 1 What type of network card? 1. Western digital, or clone (NE1000 NE2000, etc) 2. 3com (3c509, etc) ... 6. PC-card one 7. Don't know. > 2 (Don't do probing of ed cards, etc) ---- Something like that might help us narrow down the search, and therefor be able to set up what to probe and what not to probe for, in an easier manner, and still maybe be able to go a little wilder on the probing, to try and _find_ the right addresses and IRQs for the devices. All this ofcourse, unless we can manage to probe for everything automatically, at least with an option, so new users who can't get things to work (which porbably run IDE anyway ;) can at least try and let the system find everything by itself. If it's successful, great. If no, no big loss. Think about it... Having a "This might hang your machine, but try it if not all devices were found during your first try" choise would probably help a lot of newbies get going. And if the SCSI will hang if we fiddle with it's IRQs, etc, when probe for that kind of SCSI controller first, for heavens sake, and just avoid the interupts you found that one on, if you did. What's wrong with that? Try everything with non-intrusive probes first, and avoid all known taken spots when going hay-wire with nasty probes. Or I'm missing 93% of the picture... again. :-) Comments? Preferably could someone explain how it's done today, what the problems are and what the future plans are. I've seen something about changes in this area, but I'm really at a loss at what they are. /Mikael From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 15:10:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA15148 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:10:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from spsem02.sps.mot.com (spsem02.sps.mot.com [192.70.231.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA15143 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:10:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mogate.sps.mot.com by spsem02.sps.mot.com (4.1/SMI-4.1/Email 2.1 10/25/93) id AA12802 for freebsd-current@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Jul 97 15:09:56 MST Received: from genesis4.sps.mot.com by mogate.sps.mot.com (4.1/SMI-4.1/Email-2.0) id AA17337 for freebsd-current@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Jul 97 15:09:37 MST Received: from genesis4.sps.mot.com (localhost.sps.mot.com [127.0.0.1]) by genesis4.sps.mot.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA01248 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:10:44 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <33D3DE64.41C67EA6@genesis4.sps.mot.com> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:10:44 -0700 From: hai nguyen Organization: Motorola X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.0-970618-SNAP i386) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Device not configured when mounting a CD Rom device Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello all, I have three problems that I need help on : 1) First problem I am running FBSD version 3.0-970618.SNAP with SMP enabled and having a problem mounting a SCSI CD Rom device as the system keeps saying "Device not configured". This also happened when I try to mount a worm device. I did check the FAQ and yes my kernel has the option scsi_delay = 15 and the device worm0 at scbus? 2) Second problem The system does not always boot successfully. It failed several times before successfully booting up as I had to reboot the system each time. When it failed to boot, it always failed after displaying the message Enabled INTs: 1,2,3,4,5,6,8,16,17,19 and blah ! blah ! blah, something about general protection fault. 3) Can only start X session once. If I shut down the X session and restarted it, the system will hang completely and I had to reboot the system. The X version is 3.3. My hardware is shown below : Motherboard : TYAN 3D dual processors with 2 200Mhz Pentium and 64 Mb of RAM 1 ADAPTEC 2940 1 Promise wide scsi controller STB 3D Velocity with 4Mb of RAM. Sony SCSI CD-ROM. HP CD writer 6020i. 1 ISA NE2000 clone 1 PCI NE2000 clone 3 SCSI disks ( 1 internal and 2 external ) The internal SCSI CD ROM is wired to the Adaptec controller. The CD writer is wired to the Promise card. The CD writer is an internal model but I make it external Thanks in advance for any helps. From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 16:48:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA20635 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 16:48:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from netgsi.com (grok.netgsi.com [192.55.203.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA20630 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 16:48:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: by NetGSI.com (8.7.5/-A/UX-AMR-1.0) id TAA26766; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 19:48:27 -0400 From: cjohnson@netgsi.com (Christopher T. Johnson) Message-Id: <199707212348.TAA26766@NetGSI.com> Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 19:48:27 -0400 (EDT) Cc: sef@Kithrup.COM, current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <22424.869361851@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Jul 19, 97 06:24:11 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > As I just told Jordan... I disagree. > > > > The visual config stuff is neat, and can be a lifesaver... but requiring > > users to do it is going to bite, *hard*. I had to help a (very technical) > > I agree, which is why I'd like to do something other than have to > visit it EVERY SINGLE TIME I do an install in order to change from > that obnoxious default of 5. I have probably installed several > hundred FreeBSD machines at this point, for myself and many other > people, and I have _yet_ to have a single card be at IRQ 5 by default. > > The ed1 entry is also the cause of much tech support for me since > it "catches" cards at 0x300 but invariably with the wrong IRQ, so the > user is tricked into thinking that things work until the install > is well underway and the only message they're now seeing is: > "ed1: device timeout" from the bogus IRQ value. > > Jordan Having installed FreeBSD on 7 machines in the last 2 months, the one thing that all the NICs had in common was IRQ 10, IO 0x300. Every one had to be opened up and the NIC reset to use IRQ 5, IO 0x280 to match the FreeBSD defaults. I would be perfectly happy if ed1 came up as IRQ 10, IO 0x300 which should allow both groups to be happy. Chris From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 17:19:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA22084 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:19:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.uniserve.com (tom@shell.uniserve.com [204.244.210.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA22077 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:19:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (tom@localhost) by shell.uniserve.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA13841; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:18:16 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: shell.uniserve.com: tom owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:18:16 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom To: "Christopher T. Johnson" cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , sef@Kithrup.COM, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... In-Reply-To: <199707212348.TAA26766@NetGSI.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 21 Jul 1997, Christopher T. Johnson wrote: > Having installed FreeBSD on 7 machines in the last 2 months, the one > thing that all the NICs had in common was IRQ 10, IO 0x300. > > Every one had to be opened up and the NIC reset to use IRQ 5, IO 0x280 > to match the FreeBSD defaults. It would have been easier to use the visual configuration tool on the boot floppy to change ed0, rather that tearing apart the systems. This is what I do. > I would be perfectly happy if ed1 came up as IRQ 10, IO 0x300 which should > allow both groups to be happy. > > Chris > > Tom From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 17:33:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA22810 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:33:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA22805 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:33:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA12204; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:30:05 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707220030.RAA12204@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: -current :) To: dk+@ua.net Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:30:04 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, toor@dyson.iquest.net, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, sia@nest.org In-Reply-To: <19970721011404.23066@dog.farm.org> from "Dmitry Kohmanyuk =?KOI8-R?B?5M3J1NLJyiDrz8jNwc7Ayw==?=" at Jul 21, 97 01:14:04 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > All the problems have occurred when the entire file is a frag, and > > is extended and remains in the same frag... ie: my file was 40 or > > so characters in length and was only grown by 6 characters (I changed > > the configuration file name for slapd). > > And then you got 46 zero bytes, right? No. I got the original 40 bytes, without the bytes I inserted in the middle of the text, with 6 trailing zero bytes. It was very much as if the length change was saved in the metadata, but the file data itself was not changed. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 17:36:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA23044 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:36:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA23039 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:36:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA12217; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:33:22 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707220033.RAA12217@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: /usr/src/lib/libtelnet - why? To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:33:22 -0700 (MST) Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199707211610.JAA28312@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Jul 21, 97 09:10:03 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [ ... telnet protocol ... ] > 1. There does not, it would appear, exist any reasonable API > and library for handling this kind of stuff, leaving the actual > UI details up a layer where you'd think they should be. That > kinda sucks since anybody wanting to communicate over a socket > with telnet protocol (who's not telnet) has to reimplement this > all from scratch. Look at the FTP code, specifically the control channel code, which uses telnet protocol. I did this same thing for a modem server product in 1988. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 17:38:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA23124 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:38:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA23116 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:38:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA12240; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:35:37 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707220035.RAA12240@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness To: sef@Kithrup.COM (Sean Eric Fagan) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:35:37 -0700 (MST) Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199707211831.LAA12016@kithrup.com> from "Sean Eric Fagan" at Jul 21, 97 11:31:53 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > You know, there *is* something to be said about the SysVr4 method of having > a "/boot" filesystem, with a simplified FS for it. (The simplified FS [no > subdirectories, no non-file types, no indirect blocks] means that the boot > program can generally be easier.) > > I don't know if we would be able to go this way, though, because it would > require changing the partitioning, which would make doing an upgrade a lot > harder. > > Still, it may be worth thinking about. If you think about it, think about making it a small DOS partition and not a BFS partition. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 17:39:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA23150 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:39:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA23143; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:39:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA12226; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:34:21 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707220034.RAA12226@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... To: imp@rover.village.org (Warner Losh) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:34:20 -0700 (MST) Cc: andreas@klemm.gtn.com, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, jkh@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Warner Losh" at Jul 21, 97 11:18:16 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > My biggest complaint is the configuration of ethernet devices. It > would be nice if there were some easier way to do this automatically. Apply the PnP patches and use only PnP cards. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 18:08:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA24465 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 18:08:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.monmouth.com (root@shell.monmouth.com [205.164.220.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA24458 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 18:08:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from i4got.lakewood.com (fh-ppp3.monmouth.com [205.164.221.35]) by shell.monmouth.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id VAA11177; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 21:06:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from pechter@localhost) by i4got.lakewood.com id VAA07721 (8.8.5/IDA-1.6); Mon, 21 Jul 1997 21:08:15 -0400 (EDT) From: Bill Pechter Message-ID: <199707220108.VAA07721@i4got.lakewood.com> Subject: Boot file system idea! Slick To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 21:08:14 -0400 (EDT) Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199707220035.RAA12240@phaeton.artisoft.com> from Terry Lambert at "Jul 21, 97 05:35:37 pm" Reply-to: pechter@lakewood.com X-Phone-Number: 908-389-3592 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL19 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Still, it may be worth thinking about. > > If you think about it, think about making it a small DOS partition and > not a BFS partition. > > > Terry Lambert Damn, that's slick. Great IDEA! If the kernel gets blown or corrupted a simple copy from a dos floppy and it's fixed... Slick. Anyone else like this or is it just me? Bill ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Bill Pechter | 17 Meredith Drive Tinton Falls, NJ 07724 | 908-389-3592 pechter@lakewood.com | Save computing history, give an old geek old hardware. This msg brought to you by the letters PDP and the number 11. From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 18:32:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA25672 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 18:32:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dyson.iquest.net (dyson.iquest.net [198.70.144.127]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA25634 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 18:31:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by dyson.iquest.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) id UAA09000; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 20:30:34 -0500 (EST) From: "John S. Dyson" Message-Id: <199707220130.UAA09000@dyson.iquest.net> Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness In-Reply-To: <199707220035.RAA12240@phaeton.artisoft.com> from Terry Lambert at "Jul 21, 97 05:35:37 pm" To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 20:30:33 -0500 (EST) Cc: sef@Kithrup.COM, current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > You know, there *is* something to be said about the SysVr4 method of having > > a "/boot" filesystem, with a simplified FS for it. (The simplified FS [no > > subdirectories, no non-file types, no indirect blocks] means that the boot > > program can generally be easier.) > > > > I don't know if we would be able to go this way, though, because it would > > require changing the partitioning, which would make doing an upgrade a lot > > harder. > > > > Still, it may be worth thinking about. > > If you think about it, think about making it a small DOS partition and > not a BFS partition. > Surisingly (:-)), IMO, this isn't a bad idea. John From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 18:44:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA26377 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 18:44:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA26370 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 18:44:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id LAA25905; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:13:14 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707220143.LAA25905@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick In-Reply-To: <199707220108.VAA07721@i4got.lakewood.com> from Bill Pechter at "Jul 21, 97 09:08:14 pm" To: pechter@lakewood.com Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:13:13 +0930 (CST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Bill Pechter stands accused of saying: > > > Still, it may be worth thinking about. > > > > If you think about it, think about making it a small DOS partition and > > not a BFS partition. > > Damn, that's slick. Great IDEA! If the kernel gets blown or corrupted > a simple copy from a dos floppy and it's fixed... ... this is just one small step from "boot from a kernel image on a DOS partition". > Slick. Anyone else like this or is it just me? Yeah, I've always liked it. The biggest argument you will hear against it is "backwards compatability", along with "mandatory MSDOSFS". If/when Robert Nordier ever gets his VFATFS code finished, there might be a good chance of making this happen. -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 19:16:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA28096 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 19:16:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whizzo.TransSys.COM (whizzo.TransSys.COM [144.202.42.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA28083 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 19:16:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost.transsys.com (localhost.transsys.com [127.0.0.1]) by whizzo.TransSys.COM (8.8.6/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA10202; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 22:15:58 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199707220215.WAA10202@whizzo.TransSys.COM> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0delta 6/3/97 To: Michael Smith cc: imp@rover.village.org (Warner Losh), sef@Kithrup.COM, current@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Louis A. Mamakos" Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... References: <199707211740.DAA24549@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Jul 1997 03:10:00 +0930." <199707211740.DAA24549@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 22:15:58 -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > On top of that, working out which interrupt the card is on is not > easy. There isn't some convenient register that you can read for > this. 8( Back in the days when I ran 4.[23]BSD on my VAX 11/750, the autoconfig code planted trap catchers in all the likely interrupts vectors. All you had to do was poke at the device being probed enough to cause an interrupt, any interrupt. I don't seem to recall configuring interrupt vectors in my kernel config, and the good thing about UNIBUS peripherals is that you weren't likely to run out of interrupts. Or am I just dreaming this? louie From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 19:18:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA28264 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 19:18:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA28253 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 19:18:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id LAA26051; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:47:52 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707220217.LAA26051@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... In-Reply-To: <199707220215.WAA10202@whizzo.TransSys.COM> from "Louis A. Mamakos" at "Jul 21, 97 10:15:58 pm" To: louie@TransSys.COM (Louis A. Mamakos) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:47:51 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, imp@rover.village.org, sef@Kithrup.COM, current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Louis A. Mamakos stands accused of saying: > > On top of that, working out which interrupt the card is on is not > > easy. There isn't some convenient register that you can read for > > this. 8( > > Back in the days when I ran 4.[23]BSD on my VAX 11/750, the autoconfig > code planted trap catchers in all the likely interrupts vectors. All > you had to do was poke at the device being probed enough to cause an > interrupt, any interrupt. I don't seem to recall configuring > interrupt vectors in my kernel config, and the good thing about UNIBUS > peripherals is that you weren't likely to run out of interrupts. > > Or am I just dreaming this? No, you're not dreaming it. But ISA is not Unibus. > louie -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 20:49:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA02974 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 20:49:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA02969 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 20:49:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id NAA26697; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 13:18:13 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707220348.NAA26697@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... In-Reply-To: from Warner Losh at "Jul 21, 97 01:01:48 pm" To: imp@rover.village.org (Warner Losh) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 13:18:12 +0930 (CST) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, karpen@ocean.campus.luth.se, kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de, current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Warner Losh stands accused of saying: > > Looking at the driver, the following chipsets seem to support auto > detection of interrupts. I've some patches that I'll test tonight to > see if I can add a sanity check when things aren't the same. I may > have missed some in some of the other code paths. > > WD8003W > WD8003EB > WD8013W > WD8013EP > WD8013WC > WD8013EPC > WD8013EBP > SMC8216T > SMC8216C > SMC8216BT > > I don't know how many cards this covers, but it does look to be a fair > number. There is code in the ed driver now to autoconfig the > interrupt on these cards. There is not code to detect that you've set > an interrupt incorrectly (which looked like 3 lines to add in two > places, add another 10 lines for tables needed for good error > reporting). I think that this would be a worthwhile addition to the > kernel, assuming that it proves to be correct. You are omitting the 3c503, which is also soft-set. Unfortunately, you don't cover any of the NE2000 clones above, and "real" SMC compatibles are actually fairly rare. What is needed is an interrupt probe similar to that used in the sio driver which performs a generic 8390 interrupt-generating activity (eg. a loopback operation) which can be applied to _all_ cards. Have a look at the application notes at http://www.national.com/pf/DP/DP83905.html, particulary this one : AN-937: Loopback Diagnostics Using the DP8390/901/902/905 -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 22:26:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA07064 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 22:26:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA07047; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 22:26:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org [127.0.0.1] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wqXOA-0002z9-00; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 23:21:34 -0600 To: Terry Lambert Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... Cc: andreas@klemm.gtn.com, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, jkh@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Jul 1997 17:34:20 PDT." <199707220034.RAA12226@phaeton.artisoft.com> References: <199707220034.RAA12226@phaeton.artisoft.com> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 23:21:34 -0600 From: Warner Losh Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199707220034.RAA12226@phaeton.artisoft.com> Terry Lambert writes: : Apply the PnP patches and use only PnP cards. No can do. I have a big box of old cards that I'm using in this project. The whole goal of the project is to sift through a bunch of hardware purchased for almost nothing ($15) and make 4 or 5 usable systems from it and some other MBs we have. Can't pop the extra $200 for 4-5 plug and pray cards. Warner From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 22:29:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA07214 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 22:29:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA07192 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 22:29:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org [127.0.0.1] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wqXRZ-0002zQ-00; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 23:25:05 -0600 To: Michael Smith Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick Cc: pechter@lakewood.com, terry@lambert.org, freebsd-current@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:13:13 +0930." <199707220143.LAA25905@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> References: <199707220143.LAA25905@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 23:25:04 -0600 From: Warner Losh Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199707220143.LAA25905@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Michael Smith writes: : ... this is just one small step from "boot from a kernel image on a : DOS partition". I know that the ARC BIOS MIPS boxes used exactly this approach. The bootstrap was loaded from a FAT file system. That bootstrap then loaded other things from either the FAT file system (if it was still using the BIOS code) or from some other convenient location (if it had enough of a driver to cope with the hardware). NT, I think, used the raw device and groked NTFS where it loaded its drivers before throwing away the BIOS. Trouble was, you needed to have a working FAT fs, or you couldn't copy new kernels/boot code to the partition (OpenBSD/arc has not boot loader, its kernel is in the right format). So I think it is a cool idea, so long as it isn't mandatory :-) Warner From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 22:31:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA07305 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 22:31:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA07291 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 22:31:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org [127.0.0.1] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wqXSA-0002za-00; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 23:25:42 -0600 To: Michael Smith Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, karpen@ocean.campus.luth.se, kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de, current@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Jul 1997 13:18:12 +0930." <199707220348.NAA26697@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> References: <199707220348.NAA26697@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 23:25:42 -0600 From: Warner Losh Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199707220348.NAA26697@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Michael Smith writes: : Have a look at the application notes at : http://www.national.com/pf/DP/DP83905.html, particulary this one : : : AN-937: Loopback Diagnostics Using the DP8390/901/902/905 Will have to take a look at this and the SIO code. Warner From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 22:32:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA07396 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 22:32:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA07390 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 22:32:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id PAA27322; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 15:00:21 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707220530.PAA27322@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick In-Reply-To: from Warner Losh at "Jul 21, 97 11:25:04 pm" To: imp@rover.village.org (Warner Losh) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 15:00:20 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, pechter@lakewood.com, terry@lambert.org, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Warner Losh stands accused of saying: > > I know that the ARC BIOS MIPS boxes used exactly this approach. The > bootstrap was loaded from a FAT file system. That bootstrap then > loaded other things from either the FAT file system (if it was still > using the BIOS code) or from some other convenient location (if it had > enough of a driver to cope with the hardware). NT, I think, used the > raw device and groked NTFS where it loaded its drivers before throwing > away the BIOS. Trouble was, you needed to have a working FAT fs, or > you couldn't copy new kernels/boot code to the partition (OpenBSD/arc > has not boot loader, its kernel is in the right format). > > So I think it is a cool idea, so long as it isn't mandatory :-) The problem is that if it's not mandatory, there's no point in doing it. If we support reading from ufs filesystems anyway, there's nothing really gained from having FAT support. This is why I can't understand Bruce suggesting Yet Another Filesystem just for the bootstrap. > Warner -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Mon Jul 21 23:27:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA09650 for current-outgoing; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 23:27:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sendero-ppp.i-connect.net (sendero-ppp.i-Connect.Net [206.190.143.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA09645 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 23:27:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 20758 invoked by uid 1000); 22 Jul 1997 06:27:30 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.1 [p0] on FreeBSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199707220143.LAA25905@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 22:53:36 -0700 (PDT) Organization: Atlas Telecom From: Simon Shapiro To: Michael Smith Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick Cc: freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, terry@lambert.org, pechter@lakewood.com Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi Michael Smith; On 22-Jul-97 you wrote: > Bill Pechter stands accused of saying: > > > > Still, it may be worth thinking about. > > > > > > If you think about it, think about making it a small DOS partition > and > > > not a BFS partition. > > > > Damn, that's slick. Great IDEA! If the kernel gets blown or corrupted > > a simple copy from a dos floppy and it's fixed... > > ... this is just one small step from "boot from a kernel image on a > DOS partition". > > > Slick. Anyone else like this or is it just me? > > Yeah, I've always liked it. The biggest argument you will hear > against it is "backwards compatability", along with "mandatory > MSDOSFS". If/when Robert Nordier ever gets his VFATFS code finished, > there might be a good chance of making this happen. What I like about it is that it: a. Increases the size and complexity of a minimal kernel to include another file system not necessarily needed otherwise. b. Uses a standard file system. Which standard? c. Makes FreeBSD (installation) dependant on MicroSoft. d. Allows everyone with a dos floppy (or without) to modify/destroy the O/S. On the down side of things, one has to ask: 1. What does it exactly buy? * A smaller boot image? No * A simpler boot? No. The SysV bfs has SOME merit. Except that it is very slow for some reason. The (only) advantage is in a simplified & unified boot. The files are contigious, in a very simple directory. All this is nullified when one considers that it is an option. So the 2nd, 3rd stage boot still need to know multiple file system formats. Note: The above (my portion) is only worth $0.02 or less :-) Simon From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 00:16:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA12108 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 00:16:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA12097 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 00:16:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id RAA15780; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 17:08:09 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 17:08:09 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707220708.RAA15780@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: imp@rover.village.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick Cc: freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, pechter@lakewood.com, terry@lambert.org Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> So I think it is a cool idea, so long as it isn't mandatory :-) > >The problem is that if it's not mandatory, there's no point in doing >it. If we support reading from ufs filesystems anyway, there's >nothing really gained from having FAT support. This is why I can't >understand Bruce suggesting Yet Another Filesystem just for the >bootstrap. Can you understand Terry suggesting it? %-) I even unsuggested rawboot and nextboot. It's easier to hack on raw sectors than on file systems, but the results aren't so good, and the the simplications are actually complexifications if the file system version is still supported. Bruce From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 00:40:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA13707 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 00:40:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA13687 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 00:40:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id RAA28361; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 17:10:00 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707220740.RAA28361@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick In-Reply-To: <199707220708.RAA15780@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from Bruce Evans at "Jul 22, 97 05:08:09 pm" To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 17:10:00 +0930 (CST) Cc: imp@rover.village.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, pechter@lakewood.com, terry@lambert.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Bruce Evans stands accused of saying: > > > >The problem is that if it's not mandatory, there's no point in doing > >it. If we support reading from ufs filesystems anyway, there's > >nothing really gained from having FAT support. This is why I can't > >understand Bruce suggesting Yet Another Filesystem just for the > >bootstrap. > > Can you understand Terry suggesting it? %-) Yes; Terry is quite fond of several of the more advanced compromise standards that have become popular in the suck-up-to-microsoft market. They're ugly, but pragmatic. (This isn't a value judgement.) > I even unsuggested rawboot > and nextboot. It's easier to hack on raw sectors than on file systems, > but the results aren't so good, and the the simplications are actually > complexifications if the file system version is still supported. Ok, so if I read you correctly : - there will not be a boot filesystem, ever. (Cases involving your dead body excepted) Right, now we're getting somewhere. We need /boot in this case, for : boot.config.default boot.help.default kernel.config.default as well as a secondary search path for boot.config boot.help kernel.config And later for PnP.index PCI.index and anything else that is useful to the kernel and bootstrap process. I started looking at the boot3 stuff that was going around last year; unfortunately with the -current bootblock it loads but explodes (system reboot) before it gets going. I particularly want this to be able to talk to the PnP and ESCD BIOS functions in order to suck their brains before the kernel starts. The alternative is for someone helpful (like yourself) to suggest how I would go about calling a 16-bit protected mode BIOS interface from the kernel. I can supply lots more disgusting details about the interface if you like, but basically I don't grok x86 assembler well enough to produce it from scratch. > Bruce -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 02:35:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA19138 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 02:35:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ic.net (qmailr@srv1b.ic.net [152.160.72.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id CAA19130 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 02:35:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 18207 invoked from network); 22 Jul 1997 09:34:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lurch.rickl.org) (152.160.108.36) by unknown with SMTP; 22 Jul 1997 09:34:51 -0000 Received: from lurch.rickl.org (lurch.rickl.org [192.168.255.1]) by lurch.rickl.org (8.8.6/8.7.3) with ESMTP id FAA00841; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 05:33:13 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 05:33:13 -0400 (EDT) From: Rick Lotoczky Reply-To: Rick Lotoczky Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick To: pechter@lakewood.com cc: current@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199707220108.VAA07721@i4got.lakewood.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I second that....a small DOS partition instead of the BFS is great. As one who usually blasts the kernel from time to time, I would really appreciate a "simple" fix without using a special floppy or reinstall. Rick From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 02:49:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA19731 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 02:49:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA19718 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 02:49:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id TAA29292; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 19:18:53 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707220948.TAA29292@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick In-Reply-To: from Rick Lotoczky at "Jul 22, 97 05:33:13 am" To: rickl@ic.net Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 19:18:53 +0930 (CST) Cc: pechter@lakewood.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Rick Lotoczky stands accused of saying: > I second that....a small DOS partition instead of the BFS is great. As one > who usually blasts the kernel from time to time, I would really appreciate > a "simple" fix without using a special floppy or reinstall. Uhh, what's a DOS boot disk if not a "special" floppy? And what about the backup kernels, hmm? > Rick -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 05:14:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id FAA24554 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 05:14:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from isbalham.ist.co.uk (isbalham.ist.co.uk [192.31.26.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA24549 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 05:14:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gid.co.uk (uucp@localhost) by isbalham.ist.co.uk (8.8.4/8.8.4) with UUCP id MAA20537; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 12:58:00 +0100 (BST) Received: from [194.32.164.2] by seagoon.gid.co.uk; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 13:02:00 +0100 X-Sender: rb@194.32.164.1 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <199707220108.VAA07721@i4got.lakewood.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 12:58:05 +0100 To: pechter@lakewood.com From: Bob Bishop Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Sick Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk IMHO a small DOS partition instead of the BFS is a terrible idea. Life's too short for dicking around with extra partitions; in these days of DAT, I generally don't partition drives at all. -- Bob Bishop (0118) 977 4017 international code +44 118 rb@gid.co.uk fax (0118) 989 4254 between 0800 and 1800 UK From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 05:36:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id FAA25481 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 05:36:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from extrouter.test.cdu.elektra.ru ([193.125.114.71]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA25453; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 05:36:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailhub.cdu.ru (mailhub.cdu.ru [172.16.10.50]) by extrouter.test.cdu.elektra.ru (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id QAA00334; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 16:34:59 +0400 (MSD) Received: from mailhub.cdu.ru (Win95.cdu.ru [172.16.2.10]) by mailhub.cdu.ru (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id QAA00462; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 16:35:19 +0400 (MSD) Message-Id: <199707221235.QAA00462@mailhub.cdu.ru> From: "Win95" To: "FreeBSD bugs" , "FreeBSD current" , "FreeBSD hackers" , "FreeBSD hubs" , "FreeBSD hardware" , "FreeBSD isp" , "FreeBSD questions" , "FreeBSD security" Subject: I have a problem with Ethernet adapters! Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 16:27:08 +0400 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello! I've installed the FreeBSD 2.2.2-RELEASE on three PC (Gateway2000 P5-100) to make a Firewall. But there is something strange with my Ethernet adapters :-( There is my schema: | | | | x------------x | x------------x | <------X ext_router X-----X------X int_router X----X to my x------------x | x------------x | provider | | x----------x | X-------X mail_hub | | | x----------x | | | | x----------x | X-------X client | | x----------x | | All computers have FreeBSD 2.2.2-RELEASE. ext_router and int_router have two Ethernet adapters: 3Com 3C900 and SMC 80xx. mail_hub have 3Com 3C509 Ethernet adapter. Now I try to describe my problem: When I try to download a file from ext_router to int_router via FTP, transfer rate is around 700 KBytes/sec. The same transfere rate is when I try to transfer a file from int_router to mail_hub or even from ext_router to mail_hub! But if only I try to UPLOAD a file from int_router to ext_router, then transfer rate is only around 200 KBytes/sec! ;-((((( I have only one question: WHY? There is output of command "ifconfig -a" on int_router: vx0: flags=8843 mtu 1500 inet 193.125.114.36 netmask 0xffffffe0 broadcast 193.125.114.63 ether 00:60:97:b5:f6:37 ed0: flags=8843 mtu 1500 inet 172.16.10.35 netmask 0xffff0000 broadcast 172.16.255.255 ether 00:00:c0:50:6d:c3 lo0: flags=8049 mtu 16384 inet 127.0.0.1 netmask 0xff000000 Maybe, a SIMPLEX flag is wrong? HELP ME! It's very important for me! If you answer me by email, it may be more fast! PS: I'm so sorry for my English :-( Yours sincerely, Pavel ----------------------------------------------------------- Pavel P. Zabortsev, software engineer CDO UPS of Russia Tel.: (095) 220-4513, 220-4350 E-mail: ppz@cdu.elektra.ru ppz@usa.net ----------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 07:11:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA00373 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 07:11:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA00364; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 07:11:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id AAA30817; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 00:07:13 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 00:07:13 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707221407.AAA30817@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: current@freebsd.org Subject: more WebNFS merge bugs, one serious Cc: dfr@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk The WebNFS merge broke binary compatiblity of mount_msdos for the same reason that it broke binary compatiblity of mount_cd9660. The usual symptom is bizarre modes for all files under the mount point. This is because for old mount binaries, the extra field in export_args is taken from the uid arg, the uid arg is taken from the gid arg, the mode arg is taken from stack garbage, and the corrupted args affect everything under the mount point. The WebNFS merge also broke nfs_namei() by deleting the `*retdirp = dp;' line. This usually causes nfserv_create() to panic and probably causes vnode reference leaks in other callers. nfserv_create() panics because it is sloppy about checking `dirp == 0' and usually accesses the null dirp's set by nfs_namei(). Other callers are apparently more careful. ome callers have bogus initializations of dirp to 0. nfs_namei() always initializes it, and the initializations have style bugs. I haven't fixed bugs in the callers. This diff was obtained by comparing the current, old and NetBSD versions. It also fixes a memory leak for symlinks with ndp->ni_pathlen == 1, and removes a superfluous initialization of cnp->cn_proc, and changes the style to match NetBSD's. I don't know if we still need the hash calculations. Bruce diff -c2 nfs_subs.c~ nfs_subs.c *** nfs_subs.c~ Thu Jul 17 18:46:34 1997 --- nfs_subs.c Tue Jul 22 22:32:35 1997 *************** *** 1456,1460 **** --- 1454,1461 ---- md = *mdp; rem = mtod(md, caddr_t) + md->m_len - fromcp; + #ifdef __FreeBSD__ + /* XXX why is this in FreeBSD but not in NetBSD? */ cnp->cn_hash = 0; + #endif for (i = 0; i < len; i++) { while (rem == 0) { *************** *** 1471,1475 **** --- 1472,1479 ---- goto out; } + #ifdef __FreeBSD__ + /* XXX why is this in FreeBSD but not in NetBSD? */ cnp->cn_hash += (unsigned char)*fromcp; + #endif *tocp++ = *fromcp++; rem--; *************** *** 1482,1486 **** if (rem >= len) *dposp += len; ! else if (error = nfs_adv(mdp, dposp, len, rem)) goto out; } --- 1486,1490 ---- if (rem >= len) *dposp += len; ! else if ((error = nfs_adv(mdp, dposp, len, rem)) != 0) goto out; } *************** *** 1502,1505 **** --- 1506,1511 ---- cnp->cn_flags |= RDONLY; + *retdirp = dp; + if (pubflag) { /* *************** *** 1561,1565 **** dp = rootvnode; } else { ! cnp->cn_flags |= NOCROSSMOUNT; } --- 1567,1571 ---- dp = rootvnode; } else { ! cnp->cn_flags |= NOCROSSMOUNT; } *************** *** 1567,1571 **** VREF(dp); ! for (;;) { cnp->cn_nameptr = cnp->cn_pnbuf; ndp->ni_startdir = dp; --- 1573,1577 ---- VREF(dp); ! for (;;) { cnp->cn_nameptr = cnp->cn_pnbuf; ndp->ni_startdir = dp; *************** *** 1573,1578 **** * And call lookup() to do the real work */ ! cnp->cn_proc = p; ! if (error = lookup(ndp)) break; /* --- 1579,1584 ---- * And call lookup() to do the real work */ ! error = lookup(ndp); ! if (error) break; /* *************** *** 1601,1605 **** break; } ! if (ndp->ni_pathlen > 0) MALLOC(cp, char *, MAXPATHLEN, M_NAMEI, M_WAITOK); else --- 1607,1611 ---- break; } ! if (ndp->ni_pathlen > 1) MALLOC(cp, char *, MAXPATHLEN, M_NAMEI, M_WAITOK); else *************** *** 1648,1652 **** } } ! } out: FREE(cnp->cn_pnbuf, M_NAMEI); --- 1654,1658 ---- } } ! } out: FREE(cnp->cn_pnbuf, M_NAMEI); From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 07:23:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA00993 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 07:23:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA00987; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 07:23:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id AAA31216; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 00:18:26 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 00:18:26 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707221418.AAA31216@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: current@freebsd.org Subject: more 4MB page bugs Cc: dyson@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk 4MB pages broke gdb -k, at least on panic dumps. Option DISABLE_PSE can be used to avoid 4MB pages, at least with this change. Bruce diff -c2 pmap.c~ pmap.c *** pmap.c~ Mon Jul 21 16:40:24 1997 --- pmap.c Tue Jul 22 19:53:50 1997 *************** *** 253,259 **** --- 257,265 ---- pmap_kmem_choose(vm_offset_t addr) { vm_offset_t newaddr = addr; + #ifndef DISABLE_PSE if (cpu_feature & CPUID_PSE) { newaddr = (addr + (NBPDR - 1)) & ~(NBPDR - 1); } + #endif return newaddr; } From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 08:44:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA05515 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 08:44:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA05510; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 08:44:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (herring.nlsystems.com [10.0.0.2]) by nlsystems.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA00433; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 16:44:16 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 16:44:16 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Bruce Evans cc: current@freebsd.org, dfr@freebsd.org Subject: Re: more WebNFS merge bugs, one serious In-Reply-To: <199707221407.AAA30817@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, Bruce Evans wrote: > The WebNFS merge broke binary compatiblity of mount_msdos for the same > reason that it broke binary compatiblity of mount_cd9660. The usual > symptom is bizarre modes for all files under the mount point. This is > because for old mount binaries, the extra field in export_args is taken > from the uid arg, the uid arg is taken from the gid arg, the mode arg > is taken from stack garbage, and the corrupted args affect everything > under the mount point. Sigh. How do you think I should fix this? It would be hard to cope with the old structure since the args are different for each mount. > > The WebNFS merge also broke nfs_namei() by deleting the `*retdirp = dp;' > line. This usually causes nfserv_create() to panic and probably causes > vnode reference leaks in other callers. nfserv_create() panics because > it is sloppy about checking `dirp == 0' and usually accesses the null > dirp's set by nfs_namei(). Other callers are apparently more careful. > ome callers have bogus initializations of dirp to 0. nfs_namei() always > initializes it, and the initializations have style bugs. I haven't fixed > bugs in the callers. > > This diff was obtained by comparing the current, old and NetBSD versions. > It also fixes a memory leak for symlinks with ndp->ni_pathlen == 1, > and removes a superfluous initialization of cnp->cn_proc, and changes > the style to match NetBSD's. I don't know if we still need the hash > calculations. Thanks for the fixes. Is the hash stuff still used by the name cache? I can't remember exactly what Poul did to it when he was changing the cache. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 951 1891 Fax: +44 181 381 1039 From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 08:49:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA05823 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 08:49:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ady.warp.starnets.ro (ady.warp.starnets.ro [193.226.124.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA05817 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 08:49:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (ady@localhost) by ady.warp.starnets.ro (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA14162 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 18:47:07 +0300 (EEST) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 18:47:07 +0300 (EEST) From: Penisoara Adrian Reply-To: Penisoara Adrian To: freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org Subject: Very minor bug in bootdisk's Partition Editor Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, In 3.0-970718-SNAP: By accident I found a very minor bug in the FDISK Partition Editor on the bootdisk: if you have a Linux Swap partition, then the line correspondig to this slice is wrong displayed ('linux_swap' doesn't fit in the "Desc" column, so the line will extend to the beginning of the next one). Ady (@warp.starnets.ro) From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 09:55:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA10845 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 09:55:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA10831; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 09:55:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id CAA02993; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 02:54:30 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 02:54:30 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707221654.CAA02993@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, dfr@nlsystems.com Subject: Re: more WebNFS merge bugs, one serious Cc: current@freebsd.org, dfr@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> because for old mount binaries, the extra field in export_args is taken >> from the uid arg, the uid arg is taken from the gid arg, the mode arg >Sigh. How do you think I should fix this? It would be hard to cope with >the old structure since the args are different for each mount. Perhaps there should be some version numbers or spare fields to prevent or delay it happening again. >Thanks for the fixes. Is the hash stuff still used by the name cache? I >can't remember exactly what Poul did to it when he was changing the cache. It seems to be. I think the value calculated by nfs_namei() just isn't used. lookup() always calculates it. BTW, many tsleep strings in nfs are too long or not unique. They get truncated by ps(1) and mess up the formatting in ddb. Bruce From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 10:13:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA11968 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:13:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA11959 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:13:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org [127.0.0.1] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wqiTB-0003hP-00; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:11:29 -0600 To: Simon Shapiro Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick Cc: Michael Smith , freebsd-current@freebsd.org, terry@lambert.org, pechter@lakewood.com In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Jul 1997 22:53:36 PDT." References: Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:11:29 -0600 From: Warner Losh Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message Simon Shapiro writes: : a. Increases the size and complexity of a minimal kernel to include : another file system not necessarily needed otherwise. Not necessarily. If you have a /boot/kernel that is a on FAT and a /kernel that is on a ufs partition, then you needn't have MSDOS support in your kernel. mtools would suffice. Not the most desirable or easiest way to do this, but it would suffice. I've done this on the OpenBSD/arc stuff for a while when the msdosfs stuff was not stable. : b. Uses a standard file system. Which standard? There is nothing more standard than the FAT file system :-) : c. Makes FreeBSD (installation) dependant on MicroSoft. Not necessarily. Booting off a FAT file system doesn't mean booting MS-DOS. However, that would require separate boot blocks than are standard, or to have a boot loader that is named MSDOS.SYS. : d. Allows everyone with a dos floppy (or without) to modify/destroy the : O/S. They can do that now :-) The above is just my two cents from having dealt with a system that you had to boot off of a FAT file system, but that also gave you the freedom to set env vars to tell it how to do its thing. The current BIOSes that are found in PCs may make this situation radically different than it was for me with the ARC BIOS. Warner From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 10:43:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA13909 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:43:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from micron.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA13900 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:42:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mini@localhost) by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA10612; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:42:59 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970722104258.29583@micron.efn.org> Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:42:58 -0700 From: Jonathan Mini To: Michael Smith Cc: Bruce Evans , imp@rover.village.org, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, pechter@lakewood.com, terry@lambert.org Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick Reply-To: Jonathan Mini References: <199707220708.RAA15780@godzilla.zeta.org.au> <199707220740.RAA28361@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e In-Reply-To: <199707220740.RAA28361@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au>; from Michael Smith on Tue, Jul 22, 1997 at 05:10:00PM +0930 X-files: The Truth is Out There. Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Michael Smith stands accused of saying : > I particularly want this to be able to talk to the PnP and ESCD BIOS > functions in order to suck their brains before the kernel starts. The > alternative is for someone helpful (like yourself) to suggest how I > would go about calling a 16-bit protected mode BIOS interface from the > kernel. I can supply lots more disgusting details about the interface > if you like, but basically I don't grok x86 assembler well enough to > produce it from scratch. Hmmm. Amazingly enough, we both have a few common interests here. You're working a _little_ earlier in the boot process than I am, but I also want to see some BIOS call-back abilities in the FreeBSD kernel. It seems insane, but there are a few things that I would like to see FreeBSD support that it currently can't, due to it's inability to talk to any BIOS. The solution to this is simple, and can be stolen from the old DOS-extenders. Basically, the first thing you do is make sure you don't clobber the old real-mode interrupt vector table. (actually, saving a copy somewhere would be the best solution) Once you have the interupt vector table, things become a lot easier. All the kernel needs to do is one of two things. (I'm a fan of the second solution, although it may not be advisable early in the boot phase. Don't ask me, I'm not familair with FreeBSD's boot cycle) : 1) Simply drop back into real mode and (possibly) restore the real-mode interrupt vector table. Then run your code, and when it returns, jump back into protected mode. If you keep your mappings correct, this can be only mildly slow. (This is referred to as a DOS call-back) 2) My favorite method. Take your saved interrupt vector table and put it at the begining of a v86 TSS. Also, map in the appropriate amount of memory, and the ROM address space. Effectively, you get the effect of FreeBSD being a overly complex memory manager for DOS, since this is what QEMM and a few others do. The v86 TSS can be multitasked like a doscmd process, and several other things. The only problem is that The "BIOS" task needs to be run at a fairly high priveledge level, altough I'm not a fan or running it at level 0. Possibly one of the two unused priveledge levels would be aceptable for BIOS calls. I would like to see something like this go into effect, since it would allow for things such as VESA VBE 2.0 support under FreeBSD. With VESA VBE, we would be able to solve the "how do I reset the video hardware?" problem that the syscons has for supporting graphics resolutions. I think a solution much prettier than linux's libsvga would be possible, if we were able to use VBE 2.0. -- Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) ... bleakness ... desolation ... plastic forks ... From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 10:48:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA14380 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:48:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from micron.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA14368 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:48:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mini@localhost) by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA10637; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:51:19 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970722105119.53842@micron.efn.org> Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:51:19 -0700 From: Jonathan Mini To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: [MAILER-DAEMON: Returned mail: Service unavailable] Reply-To: Jonathan Mini Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e X-files: The Truth is Out There. Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk How annoying. Bruce Evan's site is over spam-rampant and hates us poor dynamic IP folks. I'm about ready to ask my ISP for a DNS entry that points to nowhere, just so that I can send people like this mail. -----Forwarded message from Mail Delivery Subsystem ----- Received: from localhost (localhost) by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with internal id KAA10614; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:45:41 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:45:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Mail Delivery Subsystem Message-Id: <199707221745.KAA10614@micron.efn.org> To: mini MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/report; report-type=delivery-status; boundary="KAA10614.869593541/micron.efn.org" Subject: Returned mail: Service unavailable Auto-Submitted: auto-generated (failure) This is a MIME-encapsulated message --KAA10614.869593541/micron.efn.org The original message was received at Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:42:59 -0700 (PDT) from mini@localhost ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors ----- Bruce Evans ----- Transcript of session follows ----- ... while talking to godzilla.zeta.org.au.: >>> MAIL From: SIZE=3506 RET=HDRS <<< 571 ... Domain name micron.efn.org incorrect 554 Bruce Evans ... Service unavailable --KAA10614.869593541/micron.efn.org Content-Type: message/delivery-status Reporting-MTA: dns; micron.efn.org Arrival-Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:42:59 -0700 (PDT) Final-Recipient: RFC822; bde@zeta.org.au Action: failed Status: 5.0.0 Remote-MTA: DNS; godzilla.zeta.org.au Diagnostic-Code: SMTP; 571 ... Domain name micron.efn.org incorrect Last-Attempt-Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:45:41 -0700 (PDT) --KAA10614.869593541/micron.efn.org Content-Type: text/rfc822-headers Return-Path: Received: (from mini@localhost) by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA10612; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:42:59 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970722104258.29583@micron.efn.org> Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:42:58 -0700 From: Jonathan Mini To: Michael Smith Cc: Bruce Evans , imp@rover.village.org, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, pechter@lakewood.com, terry@lambert.org Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick Reply-To: Jonathan Mini References: <199707220708.RAA15780@godzilla.zeta.org.au> <199707220740.RAA28361@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e In-Reply-To: <199707220740.RAA28361@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au>; from Michael Smith on Tue, Jul 22, 1997 at 05:10:00PM +0930 X-files: The Truth is Out There. --KAA10614.869593541/micron.efn.org-- -----End of forwarded message----- -- Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) ... bleakness ... desolation ... plastic forks ... From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 11:37:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA17847 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:37:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pandora.hh.kew.com (ahd@kendra.ne.mediaone.net [24.128.53.73]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA17842 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:37:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ahd@localhost) by pandora.hh.kew.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA15935 for current@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 14:37:12 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 14:37:12 -0400 (EDT) From: Drew Derbyshire Message-Id: <199707221837.OAA15935@pandora.hh.kew.com> To: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! (Sick or Slick?) Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In terms of a DOS partition making it easier to blow up your FreeBSD installation, Norton DiskEditor will quite cheerfully work on raw disk sectors, and it's install disk is bootable at no extra charge. IMHO, the biggest downside of using FAT as a boot partition are the limited number (4) of slices on a disk -- I normally use all 4, with DOS or NT primary, OS/2 Boot Manager, FreeBSD, and an extended parition. (The splitting of the DOS primary/extended pair insures I get FreeBSD in the first 512M of the disk.) While I can punt the boot manager in favor of System Commander or another scheme, FreeBSD needing two slices is alot of partition table real estate. I doubt the usefulness of it from a recovery standpoint -- I've used DOS to rescue trashed OS/2 configurations for years, but these are usually CONFIG.SYS changes or other text edits on the main partition. A trashed FreeBSD system only has a limited chance of fixing the problem via BFS access -- more problems are fixed via a) the boot configuration editor, b) access to /etc, c) a backup kernel, or d) a kernel regen. Any distinct boot FS also has space problems for old kernels, and the like. All in all, a /boot directory in the current root FS might be better. -- Drew Derbyshire Internet: ahd@kew.com Kendra Electronic Wonderworks Telephone: 617-279-9812 "AT&T is a modem test command." From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 11:41:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA18189 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:41:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA18177 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:41:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA13737; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:35:28 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707221835.LAA13737@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:35:27 -0700 (MST) Cc: louie@TransSys.COM, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, imp@rover.village.org, sef@kithrup.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199707220217.LAA26051@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Jul 22, 97 11:47:51 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Back in the days when I ran 4.[23]BSD on my VAX 11/750, the autoconfig > > code planted trap catchers in all the likely interrupts vectors. All > > you had to do was poke at the device being probed enough to cause an > > interrupt, any interrupt. I don't seem to recall configuring > > interrupt vectors in my kernel config, and the good thing about UNIBUS > > peripherals is that you weren't likely to run out of interrupts. > > > > Or am I just dreaming this? > > No, you're not dreaming it. > > But ISA is not Unibus. Specifically: o Not all cards will be on different interrupts o Not all cards can be non-destructively "poked" o IRQ 7 is a grabage interrupt that can't be distinguished between an error and a "poke" Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 11:42:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA18288 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:42:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA18276 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:42:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA13746; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:37:23 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707221837.LAA13746@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:37:23 -0700 (MST) Cc: imp@rover.village.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, pechter@lakewood.com, terry@lambert.org, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199707220530.PAA27322@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Jul 22, 97 03:00:20 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > So I think it is a cool idea, so long as it isn't mandatory :-) > > The problem is that if it's not mandatory, there's no point in doing > it. If we support reading from ufs filesystems anyway, there's > nothing really gained from having FAT support. This is why I can't > understand Bruce suggesting Yet Another Filesystem just for the > bootstrap. Well, it would help with the MIPS, PPC, and Alpha ports, for sure. The PReP spec requires a DOS partition table, though it allows 32 bit sector offsets. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 11:43:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA18349 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:43:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.uniserve.com (tom@shell.uniserve.com [204.244.210.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA18334 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:43:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (tom@localhost) by shell.uniserve.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA20513; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:41:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: shell.uniserve.com: tom owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:41:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom To: Jonathan Mini cc: freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: [MAILER-DAEMON: Returned mail: Service unavailable] In-Reply-To: <19970722105119.53842@micron.efn.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 22 Jul 1997, Jonathan Mini wrote: > How annoying. Bruce Evan's site is over spam-rampant and hates us poor dynamic > IP folks. I'm about ready to ask my ISP for a DNS entry that points to nowhere, > just so that I can send people like this mail. Huh? It isn't over spam-rapant. "micron.efn.org" does not exist, so why should his system accept mail with a bogus sender address? If his system should need to bounce the message, it isn't going to be able to return the message either, because micron.efn.org does not exist. Since your address appears to be "j_mini@efn.org", and "efn.org" does exist, why don't you just use that? Tom > -----Forwarded message from Mail Delivery Subsystem ----- > > Received: from localhost (localhost) > by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with internal id KAA10614; > Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:45:41 -0700 (PDT) > Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:45:41 -0700 (PDT) > From: Mail Delivery Subsystem > Message-Id: <199707221745.KAA10614@micron.efn.org> > To: mini > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: multipart/report; report-type=delivery-status; > boundary="KAA10614.869593541/micron.efn.org" > Subject: Returned mail: Service unavailable > Auto-Submitted: auto-generated (failure) > > This is a MIME-encapsulated message > > --KAA10614.869593541/micron.efn.org > > The original message was received at Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:42:59 -0700 (PDT) > from mini@localhost > > ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors ----- > Bruce Evans > > ----- Transcript of session follows ----- > ... while talking to godzilla.zeta.org.au.: > >>> MAIL From: SIZE=3506 RET=HDRS > <<< 571 ... Domain name micron.efn.org incorrect > 554 Bruce Evans ... Service unavailable > > --KAA10614.869593541/micron.efn.org > Content-Type: message/delivery-status > > Reporting-MTA: dns; micron.efn.org > Arrival-Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:42:59 -0700 (PDT) > > Final-Recipient: RFC822; bde@zeta.org.au > Action: failed > Status: 5.0.0 > Remote-MTA: DNS; godzilla.zeta.org.au > Diagnostic-Code: SMTP; 571 ... Domain name micron.efn.org incorrect > Last-Attempt-Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:45:41 -0700 (PDT) > > --KAA10614.869593541/micron.efn.org > Content-Type: text/rfc822-headers > > Return-Path: > Received: (from mini@localhost) > by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA10612; > Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:42:59 -0700 (PDT) > Message-ID: <19970722104258.29583@micron.efn.org> > Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:42:58 -0700 > From: Jonathan Mini > To: Michael Smith > Cc: Bruce Evans , imp@rover.village.org, > freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, pechter@lakewood.com, terry@lambert.org > Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick > Reply-To: Jonathan Mini > References: <199707220708.RAA15780@godzilla.zeta.org.au> <199707220740.RAA28361@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> > Mime-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e > In-Reply-To: <199707220740.RAA28361@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au>; from Michael Smith on Tue, Jul 22, 1997 at 05:10:00PM +0930 > X-files: The Truth is Out There. > > --KAA10614.869593541/micron.efn.org-- > > > -----End of forwarded message----- > > -- > Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) > > ... bleakness ... desolation ... plastic forks ... > From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 12:01:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA19690 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 12:01:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA19683 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 12:01:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id EAA05909; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 04:59:55 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 04:59:55 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707221859.EAA05909@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: imp@rover.village.org, Shimon@i-Connect.Net Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick Cc: freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, pechter@lakewood.com, terry@lambert.org Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >: a. Increases the size and complexity of a minimal kernel to include >: another file system not necessarily needed otherwise. > >Not necessarily. If you have a /boot/kernel that is a on FAT and a >/kernel that is on a ufs partition, then you needn't have MSDOS >support in your kernel. mtools would suffice. Not the most desirable Yes, at a cost of only 8 times as large (for the size of the mtools package tar gunzipped vs. the size of the msdos LKM), we could avoid having msdos support in the kernel. >: c. Makes FreeBSD (installation) dependant on MicroSoft. > >Not necessarily. Booting off a FAT file system doesn't mean booting >MS-DOS. However, that would require separate boot blocks than are >standard, or to have a boot loader that is named MSDOS.SYS. DOS is required to run chkdsk or scandisk, until we have an msdosfsck. It isn't required to boot. >: d. Allows everyone with a dos floppy (or without) to modify/destroy the >: O/S. > >They can do that now :-) At least without the dos floppy :-). Bruce From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 12:48:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA22486 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 12:48:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.calweb.com (mail.calweb.com [208.131.56.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA22350 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 12:45:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail.calweb.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id MAA02116; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 12:43:55 -0700 (PDT) X-SMTP: hello devnull from jflists@pop.calweb.com server @devnull.calweb.com ip 207.173.135.51 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970722124259.00a29b40@pop.calweb.com> Warning: Unsolicited Commercial Email (UCE) will be returned to send in bulk X-Sender: jflists@pop.calweb.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 12:42:59 -0700 To: Drew Derbyshire From: "jfesler@calweb.com" Subject: DoS was Re: Boot file system idea! (Sick or Slick?) Cc: current@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199707221837.OAA15935@pandora.hh.kew.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 02:37 PM 7/22/97 -0400, you wrote: >In terms of a DOS partition making it easier to blow up your FreeBSD >installation, Norton DiskEditor will quite cheerfully work on raw >disk sectors, and it's install disk is bootable at no extra charge. Hmm, is this what we call a DoS attack? [ducking before the lart guns come out] -- Jason Fesler jfesler@calweb.com 'whois jf319' | When the chips are down Admin, CalWeb Internet Services www.calweb.com | The buffalo's empty Junk email returned in bulk; 1 cc to your postmaster | Junk mail probs? http://www.gigo.com/junkmail.htm | :-) From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 13:05:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA23728 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 13:05:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA23680 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 13:04:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA13920; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 12:59:24 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707221959.MAA13920@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 12:59:23 -0700 (MST) Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, imp@rover.village.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, pechter@lakewood.com, terry@lambert.org In-Reply-To: <199707220740.RAA28361@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Jul 22, 97 05:10:00 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Yes; Terry is quite fond of several of the more advanced compromise > standards that have become popular in the suck-up-to-microsoft market. > They're ugly, but pragmatic. (This isn't a value judgement.) I guess that's fair; I'm pragmatic. It's not necessarily so much "suck-up-to-microsoft", it's more the "you-can't-ignore-microsoft". Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 13:05:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA23736 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 13:05:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA23690 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 13:04:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA13934; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 13:00:32 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707222000.NAA13934@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 13:00:32 -0700 (MST) Cc: rickl@ic.net, pechter@lakewood.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199707220948.TAA29292@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Jul 22, 97 07:18:53 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I second that....a small DOS partition instead of the BFS is great. As one > > who usually blasts the kernel from time to time, I would really appreciate > > a "simple" fix without using a special floppy or reinstall. > > Uhh, what's a DOS boot disk if not a "special" floppy? > > And what about the backup kernels, hmm? A BSD boot disk is just as capable of wrting DOS files. There's no hard-and-fast DOS requirement simply because you use FAT. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 13:12:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA24308 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 13:12:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA24233; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 13:12:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA13956; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 13:08:42 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707222008.NAA13956@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: more WebNFS merge bugs, one serious To: dfr@nlsystems.com (Doug Rabson) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 13:08:42 -0700 (MST) Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, current@FreeBSD.ORG, dfr@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Doug Rabson" at Jul 22, 97 04:44:16 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > The WebNFS merge broke binary compatiblity of mount_msdos for the same > > reason that it broke binary compatiblity of mount_cd9660. The usual > > symptom is bizarre modes for all files under the mount point. This is > > because for old mount binaries, the extra field in export_args is taken > > from the uid arg, the uid arg is taken from the gid arg, the mode arg > > is taken from stack garbage, and the corrupted args affect everything > > under the mount point. > > Sigh. How do you think I should fix this? It would be hard to cope with > the old structure since the args are different for each mount. I think this should be delt with by passing mount options as environment which is accessed from the kernel. This provides a nice clean API for stuffing arbitrary data to the kernel, albiet without namespace overloading (which is a good thing, IMO). I'd like to see options get set in the environment, and then the environment passed down to the system call. Ideally, the kernel would access the process environment to do the deed; there are some stupid issues of envp in the ANSI and POSIX standards which dictate implementation, in this regard, however. Alternately, you could pass an envp down representing command line options. This would beat the hell out of the "sorta-canonical-but-not" method of mount call argument parsing. I believe the NFS export stuff needs to move out of the per FS mount code in any case. I'm not to worried about backward compatability, since very few programs that aren't part of the standard set of BSD programs (and therefore under BSD control) ever call the mount(2) system call, etc.. > Thanks for the fixes. Is the hash stuff still used by the name cache? I > can't remember exactly what Poul did to it when he was changing the cache. Some of the has precalculation is done to ensure that the speed of the operation is better (on a per component basis, that is). This is actually broken, since lookup is permitted to eat multiple components on a per FS basis. I think that there needs to be a flag to determine on a per FS instance basis whether or not directory name entry caching occurs. I'd like to see the cache hit occur *without* a call to VOP_LOOKUP, eventually. This would also get rid of most of the remaining SAVENAME flag bogosities from delete vs. rename. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 13:34:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA26109 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 13:34:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.monmouth.com (root@shell.monmouth.com [205.164.220.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA26100 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 13:34:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from i4got.lakewood.com (fh-ppp28.monmouth.com [205.164.221.60]) by shell.monmouth.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA02144; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 16:32:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from pechter@localhost) by i4got.lakewood.com id QAA10262 (8.8.5/IDA-1.6); Tue, 22 Jul 1997 16:34:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Bill Pechter Message-ID: <199707222034.QAA10262@i4got.lakewood.com> Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! (Sick or Slick) To: ahd@kew.com (Drew Derbyshire) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 16:34:28 -0400 (EDT) Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199707221837.OAA15935@pandora.hh.kew.com> from Drew Derbyshire at "Jul 22, 97 02:37:12 pm" Reply-to: pechter@lakewood.com X-Phone-Number: 908-389-3592 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL19 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > IMHO, the biggest downside of using FAT as a boot partition are > the limited number (4) of slices on a disk -- I normally use all 4, > with DOS or NT primary, OS/2 Boot Manager, FreeBSD, and an extended > parition. (The splitting of the DOS primary/extended pair insures > I get FreeBSD in the first 512M of the disk.) While I can punt > the boot manager in favor of System Commander or another scheme, > FreeBSD needing two slices is alot of partition table real estate. > Actually, the real fix is the ability for FreeBSD to use extended partitions the way Linux now can. > > "AT&T is a modem test command." > > Sure, remember the old days... $ 1 One Bell System -- It Works! ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Bill Pechter | 17 Meredith Drive Tinton Falls, NJ 07724 | 908-389-3592 pechter@lakewood.com | Save computing history, give an old geek old hardware. This msg brought to you by the letters PDP and the number 11. From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 14:45:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA01051 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 14:45:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hydrogen.nike.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA01043 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 14:45:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.nike.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA16250; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 14:45:04 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970722144504.48420@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 14:45:04 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: Tom Cc: Jonathan Mini , freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: [MAILER-DAEMON: Returned mail: Service unavailable] References: <19970722105119.53842@micron.efn.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: ; from Tom on Tue, Jul 22, 1997 at 11:41:44AM -0700 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Tom scribbled this message on Jul 22: > > On Tue, 22 Jul 1997, Jonathan Mini wrote: > > > How annoying. Bruce Evan's site is over spam-rampant and hates us poor dynamic > > IP folks. I'm about ready to ask my ISP for a DNS entry that points to nowhere, > > just so that I can send people like this mail. > > Huh? It isn't over spam-rapant. "micron.efn.org" does not exist, so > why should his system accept mail with a bogus sender address? If his > system should need to bounce the message, it isn't going to be able to > return the message either, because micron.efn.org does not exist. well.. i have the same problem... we fix the from in the actual header, but there isn't anything we can really do with sendmail unless we really want to become "spammers"... also, he gets a dynamic ip address from efn.. meaning that he has to change his hostname, and then restart sendmail for it to become valid... > Since your address appears to be "j_mini@efn.org", and "efn.org" does > exist, why don't you just use that? well... there is one problem... efn.org is over a 14.4k modem, to my 28.8k modem, that happens to be dialed into efn's terminal server, but goes over to a local university which we use for inet connectivity... so connecting to that host would go over the above, then back from the university to efn.org... plus, we run FreeBSD on our systems.. so it is possible, but problematic... considering that he can also dial directly into efn it would mean needing to have two completely differnt configurations... -- John-Mark Gurney Modem/FAX: +1 541 683 6954 Cu Networking Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 15:13:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA02622 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 15:13:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.uniserve.com (tom@shell.uniserve.com [204.244.210.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA02615 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 15:13:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (tom@localhost) by shell.uniserve.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA21509; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 15:12:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: shell.uniserve.com: tom owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 15:12:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom To: John-Mark Gurney cc: Jonathan Mini , freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: [MAILER-DAEMON: Returned mail: Service unavailable] In-Reply-To: <19970722144504.48420@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 22 Jul 1997, John-Mark Gurney wrote: > Tom scribbled this message on Jul 22: > > > > On Tue, 22 Jul 1997, Jonathan Mini wrote: > > > > > How annoying. Bruce Evan's site is over spam-rampant and hates us poor dynamic > > > IP folks. I'm about ready to ask my ISP for a DNS entry that points to nowhere, > > > just so that I can send people like this mail. > > > > Huh? It isn't over spam-rapant. "micron.efn.org" does not exist, so > > why should his system accept mail with a bogus sender address? If his > > system should need to bounce the message, it isn't going to be able to > > return the message either, because micron.efn.org does not exist. > > well.. i have the same problem... we fix the from in the actual header, > but there isn't anything we can really do with sendmail unless we really > want to become "spammers"... also, he gets a dynamic ip address from > efn.. meaning that he has to change his hostname, and then restart > sendmail for it to become valid... Yes, but the envelope sender is wrong. Mail servers are perfectly justified in refusing mail with an envelope sender containing a non existant domain. Also, if your envelope sender is wrong, you will lose mail. > > Since your address appears to be "j_mini@efn.org", and "efn.org" does > > exist, why don't you just use that? > > well... there is one problem... efn.org is over a 14.4k modem, to my > 28.8k modem, that happens to be dialed into efn's terminal server, but > goes over to a local university which we use for inet connectivity... > so connecting to that host would go over the above, then back from the > university to efn.org... plus, we run FreeBSD on our systems.. so it > is possible, but problematic... considering that he can also dial > directly into efn it would mean needing to have two completely differnt > configurations... Huh? What does this have to do with e-mail addresses? The connectivity is irrelevant. It also has nothing to do with dynamic addresses. Use "-f" flag to sendmail to force the proper envelope sender. > -- > John-Mark Gurney Modem/FAX: +1 541 683 6954 > Cu Networking > > Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD > Tom From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 17:56:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA12278 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 17:56:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA12273 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 17:56:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org [127.0.0.1] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wqpir-0004dK-00; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 18:56:09 -0600 To: current@freebsd.org Subject: lpr/lpd changes Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 18:56:09 -0600 From: Warner Losh Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm in the process of making a bunch of lpr/lpd security changes from OpenBSD. There have been a bunch since the last merge that I did. I'm doing this in stages to try to isolate where problems crop up. The first set is merging NetBSD/OpenBSD's seteuid() patches so that lpr/lpd runs at a minimum privs most of the time. A few buffer overflowish patches snuck in because they were close to the seteuid stuff in the diffs. I say NetBSD/OpenBSD because I can't tell for sure from the OpenBSD CVS tree where exactly they came from, but it looks like they modified them slightly from the NetBSD version (and I've not checked NetBSD to see if they have the same changes too). So no offense is intended if I have misattributed these patches, but I did my best to not do that. The next set will be a boatload of buffer overflows (some of which aren't possible, or are possible only as root, but some look dangerous). Please let me know if I've broken anything. Once these patches have been vetted in -current, I plan on merging back into 2.2. Warner From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 18:37:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA14083 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 18:37:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA14078 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 18:37:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id LAA04382; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 11:05:51 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707230135.LAA04382@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick In-Reply-To: <19970722104258.29583@micron.efn.org> from Jonathan Mini at "Jul 22, 97 10:42:58 am" To: j_mini@efn.org Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 11:05:51 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, bde@zeta.org.au, imp@rover.village.org, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, pechter@lakewood.com, terry@lambert.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jonathan Mini stands accused of saying: > Michael Smith stands accused of saying : > > > I particularly want this to be able to talk to the PnP and ESCD BIOS > > functions in order to suck their brains before the kernel starts. The > > alternative is for someone helpful (like yourself) to suggest how I > > would go about calling a 16-bit protected mode BIOS interface from the > > kernel. I can supply lots more disgusting details about the interface > > if you like, but basically I don't grok x86 assembler well enough to > > produce it from scratch. > > Hmmm. Amazingly enough, we both have a few common interests here. You're Hey, when have we ever been at odds? 8) > working a _little_ earlier in the boot process than I am, but I also want to > see some BIOS call-back abilities in the FreeBSD kernel. It seems insane, but > there are a few things that I would like to see FreeBSD support that it > currently can't, due to it's inability to talk to any BIOS. Part of the problem here is that talking to the BIOS is _dangerous_, particularly if you're talking to a real-mode BIOS. > 1) Simply drop back into real mode and (possibly) restore the real-mode > interrupt vector table. Then run your code, and when it returns, jump > back into protected mode. If you keep your mappings correct, this can > be only mildly slow. (This is referred to as a DOS call-back) I don't want to think about this approach, really. Unless there is an extreme need, going back to real mode isn't an option. > 2) My favorite method. Take your saved interrupt vector table and put > it at the begining of a v86 TSS. Also, map in the appropriate amount of > memory, and the ROM address space. Effectively, you get the effect of > FreeBSD being a overly complex memory manager for DOS, since this is > what QEMM and a few others do. The v86 TSS can be multitasked like a > doscmd process, and several other things. The only problem is that If this is your favorite method, I assume that you have code implementing it already? > I would like to see something like this go into effect, since it > would allow for things such as VESA VBE 2.0 support under > FreeBSD. With VESA VBE, we would be able to solve the "how do I > reset the video hardware?" problem that the syscons has for > supporting graphics resolutions. I think a solution much prettier > than linux's libsvga would be possible, if we were able to use VBE > 2.0. Isn't there a 32-bit interface to the VESA BIOS? > Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 18:44:30 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA14505 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 18:44:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA14483 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 18:44:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id LAA04467; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 11:13:15 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707230143.LAA04467@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick In-Reply-To: <199707221837.LAA13746@phaeton.artisoft.com> from Terry Lambert at "Jul 22, 97 11:37:23 am" To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 11:13:14 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, imp@rover.village.org, pechter@lakewood.com, terry@lambert.org, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert stands accused of saying: > > The problem is that if it's not mandatory, there's no point in doing > > it. If we support reading from ufs filesystems anyway, there's > > nothing really gained from having FAT support. This is why I can't > > understand Bruce suggesting Yet Another Filesystem just for the > > bootstrap. > > Well, it would help with the MIPS, PPC, and Alpha ports, for sure. > The PReP spec requires a DOS partition table, though it allows 32 > bit sector offsets. DOS partition table != FAT bootstrap filesystem. > Terry Lambert -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 19:02:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA15481 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 19:02:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.uniserve.com (tom@shell.uniserve.com [204.244.210.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA15476 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 19:02:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (tom@localhost) by shell.uniserve.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA22198; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 19:00:48 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: shell.uniserve.com: tom owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 19:00:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom To: Warner Losh cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: lpr/lpd changes In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 22 Jul 1997, Warner Losh wrote: > > I'm in the process of making a bunch of lpr/lpd security changes from > OpenBSD. There have been a bunch since the last merge that I did. Unrelated: why on earth is lpd started by the default rc* stuff? Seems unwise to fire up something that needs to be configured to be useful first. Tom From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 22:53:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA26257 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 22:53:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from micron.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA26249 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 22:53:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mini@localhost) by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA01164; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 22:51:28 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970722225126.52940@micron.efn.org> Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 22:51:27 -0700 From: Jonathan Mini To: Michael Smith Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, imp@rover.village.org, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, pechter@lakewood.com, terry@lambert.org Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick Reply-To: Jonathan Mini References: <19970722104258.29583@micron.efn.org> <199707230135.LAA04382@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e In-Reply-To: <199707230135.LAA04382@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au>; from Michael Smith on Wed, Jul 23, 1997 at 11:05:51AM +0930 X-files: The Truth is Out There. Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Michael Smith stands accused of saying : > Jonathan Mini stands accused of saying: > > Michael Smith stands accused of saying : > > > > > I particularly want this to be able to talk to the PnP and ESCD BIOS > > > functions in order to suck their brains before the kernel starts. The > > > alternative is for someone helpful (like yourself) to suggest how I > > > would go about calling a 16-bit protected mode BIOS interface from the > > > kernel. I can supply lots more disgusting details about the interface > > > if you like, but basically I don't grok x86 assembler well enough to > > > produce it from scratch. > > > > Hmmm. Amazingly enough, we both have a few common interests here. You're > > Hey, when have we ever been at odds? 8) Heh. Well. "Comrades in battle" comes to mind. > > > working a _little_ earlier in the boot process than I am, but I also want to > > see some BIOS call-back abilities in the FreeBSD kernel. It seems insane, but > > there are a few things that I would like to see FreeBSD support that it > > currently can't, due to it's inability to talk to any BIOS. > > Part of the problem here is that talking to the BIOS is _dangerous_, > particularly if you're talking to a real-mode BIOS. Very true. I _hate_ the way BIOS works. I hate a lot of other things about the initial IBM PC design and how we're stuck with it now. There are a few things we can do that will make it a "little" safer, such as run under a protected priveledge level and watch accesses -- i.e. restrict them to ranges, but that is not an option for a high-performance solution. > > 1) Simply drop back into real mode and (possibly) restore the real-mode > > interrupt vector table. Then run your code, and when it returns, jump > > back into protected mode. If you keep your mappings correct, this can > > be only mildly slow. (This is referred to as a DOS call-back) > > I don't want to think about this approach, really. Unless there is an > extreme need, going back to real mode isn't an option. IMHO, real mode should be used the wau Intel intended it in the i386 spec -- To set up the registers to switch into protected mode. Intel didn't even recommend using real mode during the bootstrap loading phase. I'm not certain life would be easer or not if BIOS handed us a Protected mode boot environment. IMHO, it could be very gastly bepending on how BIOS though we should run our OS. > > 2) My favorite method. Take your saved interrupt vector table and put > > it at the begining of a v86 TSS. Also, map in the appropriate amount of > > memory, and the ROM address space. Effectively, you get the effect of > > FreeBSD being a overly complex memory manager for DOS, since this is > > what QEMM and a few others do. The v86 TSS can be multitasked like a > > doscmd process, and several other things. The only problem is that > > If this is your favorite method, I assume that you have code implementing > it already? No. However, I will start writing code in the near future (less than a month) > > I would like to see something like this go into effect, since it > > would allow for things such as VESA VBE 2.0 support under > > FreeBSD. With VESA VBE, we would be able to solve the "how do I > > reset the video hardware?" problem that the syscons has for > > supporting graphics resolutions. I think a solution much prettier > > than linux's libsvga would be possible, if we were able to use VBE > > 2.0. > > Isn't there a 32-bit interface to the VESA BIOS? VBE 2.0 has a 32-bit interface, yes. However, the information requred to USE the interface has to be gotten via a standard 16-bit interrupt call. (Ugh. BIOS) Also, not all of the functions are available in the 32-bit API. You are requied to set up a set of descripters with the proper priveledges (it gives you a list of ports and memory blocks it needs access to) and you call an interrupt service with that info, then it returns with your table all filled with code to do the stuff you want. The evilness of it is that this table has to be in a real mode adressable segment. Once you do all this, you can remap (or copy) the table to anywhere you like, but you only get to access Functions 5 (Set Address Window), 7 (Set display start), and 9 (Set Primary Palette) As you can tell, the Protected mode interface is only for extra performance (a drop back into real-mode is really slow) for DOS games. Goo foresight of VESA. Within a short period, I will be looking into running stuff within v86 tasks. (My soul screams against it, it seems incredibly backwards and lame) > > > Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) > > -- > ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ > ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ > ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ > ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ > ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ -- Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) ... bleakness ... desolation ... plastic forks ... From owner-freebsd-current Tue Jul 22 23:25:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA27554 for current-outgoing; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 23:25:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from minor.stranger.com (stranger.vip.best.com [204.156.129.250]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA27546 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 23:24:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dog.farm.org (dog.farm.org [207.111.140.47]) by minor.stranger.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id XAA18953; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 23:27:08 -0700 Received: (from dk@localhost) by dog.farm.org (8.7.5/dk#3) id XAA07292; Tue, 22 Jul 1997 23:28:45 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 23:28:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Dmitry Kohmanyuk Message-Id: <199707230628.XAA07292@dog.farm.org> To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: /usr/src/lib/libtelnet - why? Newsgroups: cs-monolit.gated.lists.freebsd.current Organization: FARM Computing Association Reply-To: dk+@ua.net X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In article <199707211610.JAA28312@time.cdrom.com> you wrote: > Somebody came to me the other day and said "hey, you know how ppp > will let you talk to a modem device, right? Wouldn't it be neat if > that modem device could also be remote, like on a terminal server? > At some special host/port combination, like Ciscos and Ascends do it?" there is a program called nd which converts tcp host:port pair to a pty. I remember I have got it from cisco's ftp site some time ago, but I cannot find it there now... the archive filename is: nd.tar.Z on cisco, you can get remote devices raw using device number + 2000 (or 4000, or 6000 - I forgot). from the CHANGES file, the author is ________________________________________________________________________ Ross Rodney Cartlidge | rossc@extro.ucc.su.oz.au University Computing Service, H08 | Phone: +61 2 6923497 University of Sydney, NSW 2006, Australia | FAX: +61 2 6606557 let me quote the README file: <<< This distribution is a set of programs to connect an arbitrary process to a device. It works by attaching the process to the master side of a pty device. This makes the slave side appear to be a connection to this process. The process can do anything, however, most commonly it is a process to establish a network connection such as telnet or tcpcon , a command supplied which connects to an arbitrary tcp address and port. It is usually used to assign a device to a port on a terminal server so that the port can be used just like a real port on a machine. This enables the port to connect a printer, run a getty, slip, uucp, ACSnet, etc. FILES:- CHANGES History of distribution README This file tcpcon.mips.c works around select on pty bug on RISC/OS Makefile nd.1 nd.c tcpcon.1 tcpcon.c tcpexec.1 tcpexec.c tcpserv.1 tcpserv.c udpcon.1 udpexec.1 udpserv.1 INSTALLATION: . Edit Makefile to reflect your machine . type "make install" . Install the manual entries. . Set up an "nd" device (See manual entries and also notes below) A TEST: Try these commands to test it nd -l /dev/ptypf tcpcon localhost smtp & cat < /dev/ttypf & stty -echo < /dev/ttypf # "<" should be ">" for BSD systems cat > /dev/ttypf You should now be talking to the SMTP server of your machine. try the command help Use D to kill cat and then kill the async cat. Notes for Bridge/3COM terminal servers. . Enable the generic port 2000 service for your terminal servers. . Assign an IP address to the server port to which you wish to connect. . Make the port a host device. . Set the Physical parameters of the port ( Use CTS/RTS flow control and 8bit no parity if possible) To set up a connection to a port with address "ipaddr" set up the following line in /etc/inittab vn:respawn:/usr/local/nd /usr/local/tcpcon -l /dev/ptypf ipaddr 2000 On non sysV machines (eg SUNOS) use this command in your rc.local /usr/local/nd -& -r /usr/local/tcpcon -l /dev/ptypf ipaddr 2000 Its a good idea to use the "-d dir" and "-t tag" options of nd so that you can keep track of your network devices. This should work well for printers and other permanent connections. When setting up dial-ins better results are obtained by using tcpserv and making the terminal server request the conection. Although the tcpcon method above will still work the process on the tty end will not see the modem signals go up and, in the case of a getty, a login string will not be issued. In the tcpserv case set the "InitialMacro" of a port to, say, "connect host 2000", and put this line into your rc.local:- tcpserv -d /tmp/2000.pid -l /dev/ptypf 2000 People who connect to the terminal serv port will then get a login to /dev/ttypf (if there is a getty) The pty's should be allocated from your last pty downward to stop nd clashing with automatically allocated ptys. Notes for CMC terminal servers. . Create a server process for each port you wish to put a virtual device on, calling each process port and assigning it to TCP port 2000+n. . Attach the appropriate server to the port. . Set the Physical parameters of the port ( Use CTS/RTS flow control and 8bit no parity if possible) . Enable the server. To set up device on port 6 of a cmc server with IP name cmcip, say set up the following line in /etc/inittab after creating the directory "/etc/tcpcon.d" vn:respawn:/usr/local/nd /usr/local/tcpcon -l /dev/ptypf ipaddr 2006 On non sysV machines (eg SUNOS) put the nd command in rc.local. /usr/local/nd -& -r /usr/local/tcpcon -l /dev/ptypf cmcip 2006 Its a good idea to use the "-d dir" and "-t tag" options of nd so that you can keep track of your network devices. This should work well for printers and other permanent connections. When setting up dial-ins better results are obtained by using tcpserv and making the terminal server request the conection. Although the tcpcon method above will still work the process on the tty end will not see the modem signals go up and, in the case of a getty, a login string will not be issued. In the tcpserv case put this line into your rc.local:- tcpserv -d /tmp/2000.pid -l /dev/ptypf 2000 and when you get the CMC prompt type the command:- open host 2000 and you will get a getty to /dev/ttypf (if a getty has been enabled) The pty's should be allocated from your last pty downward to stop nd clashing with automatically allocated ptys. Caveats Some systems (RISC/OS 4.5 eg) don't make a select return on a pty when the corresponding tty is closed. This makes the process (eg the tcp connection) continue, when the tty is closed, this is annoying if you wish to cause a modem drop at the other end. tcpcon.mips.c gets around this by using a process for each direction. From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 00:05:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA00142 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 00:05:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.116.240]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA00132 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 00:05:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de (gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de [137.226.31.2]) by Campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE (RBI-Z-5/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA21281 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 09:06:05 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.8.5/8.6.9) id JAA04150 for freebsd-current@freefall.cdrom.com; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 09:07:53 +0200 (MEST) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 09:07:53 +0200 (MEST) From: Christoph Kukulies Message-Id: <199707230707.JAA04150@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de> To: freebsd-current@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: name resolution doesn't work always in the first place Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I noticed (since I'm running all kinds of -current during the past months) on one machine that e.g. # ftp ftp.freebsd.org ftp: ftp.freebsd.org: Unknown host ftp> quit fails in the first place. Invoking it a second time right after this, it works: # ftp ftp.freebsd.org Connected to wcarchive.cdrom.com. 220 wcarchive.cdrom.com FTP server (Version DG-2.0.39 Sun May 4 19:21:05 PDT 1997) ready. Name (ftp.freebsd.org:kuku): Now I wonder if this is a problem with the nameservers upstream or if it's a FreeBSD problem. /etc/host.conf: # $Id: host.conf,v 1.2 1993/11/07 01:02:57 wollman Exp $ # Default is to use the nameserver first # If that doesn't work, then try the /etc/hosts file bind hosts # If you have YP/NIS configured, uncomment the next line nis (yes, I had that nis line enabled but actually don't run NIS on that machine, I will disable the nis line again to see it the problem persists). -- Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 03:16:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA08359 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 03:16:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA08353 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 03:16:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA03347; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 03:14:53 -0700 (PDT) To: dk+@ua.net cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: /usr/src/lib/libtelnet - why? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Jul 1997 23:28:45 PDT." <199707230628.XAA07292@dog.farm.org> Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 03:14:53 -0700 Message-ID: <3343.869652893@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > there is a program called nd which converts tcp host:port pair to a pty. Yeah, I'm familiar with the nd/tcpcon/tcpserv family of commands - this is what they're currently using at Ascend on their Suns to pull off this exact trick. The question is - where do I find the sources to these things? :-) I've netsearched around and not had much luck. Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 03:26:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA08807 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 03:26:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com (msx-03-1-21.1033.cybercity.dk [195.8.138.22]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA08795; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 03:26:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.dk.tfs.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA29133; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 12:23:53 +0200 (CEST) To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: Bruce Evans , bde@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG From: Poul-Henning Kamp Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Jul 1997 11:21:00 PDT." <29057.869509260@time.cdrom.com> Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 12:23:53 +0200 Message-ID: <29131.869653433@critter.dk.tfs.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <29057.869509260@time.cdrom.com>, "Jordan K. Hubbard" writes: >> /boot.config needs more support from sysinstall. sysinstall should >> determine the BIOS boot drive number and write it into /boot.config. > >Hmmmm. Heeeeeelp, Poul-Henninnnnnnng! :-) Hmmmm. Argh! Jordan!!! :-( This is the age old problem which we have no solution for that seems to fit inside the time&space permitted :-( -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Power and ignorance is a disgusting cocktail. From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 03:32:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA09104 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 03:32:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA09093; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 03:32:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA03475; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 03:31:00 -0700 (PDT) To: Poul-Henning Kamp cc: Bruce Evans , bde@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: /boot.foo madness In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Jul 1997 12:23:53 +0200." <29131.869653433@critter.dk.tfs.com> Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 03:31:00 -0700 Message-ID: <3469.869653860@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Hmmmm. Argh! Jordan!!! :-( > > This is the age old problem which we have no solution for that seems to > fit inside the time&space permitted :-( Yeah, I figured if it were easy we'd have probably done it already. :) Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 04:22:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id EAA10870 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 04:22:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail11.digital.com (mail11.digital.com [192.208.46.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA10863 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 04:22:18 -0700 (PDT) From: garyj@frt.dec.com Received: from cssmuc.frt.dec.com (cssmuc.frt.dec.com [16.186.96.161]) by mail11.digital.com (8.7.5/UNX 1.5/1.0/WV) with SMTP id HAA16803; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 07:06:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost by cssmuc.frt.dec.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/14Nov95-0232PM) id AA14986; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 13:06:17 +0200 Message-Id: <9707231106.AA14986@cssmuc.frt.dec.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.4 10/10/95 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: current@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: Message from "Jordan K. Hubbard" of Wed, 23 Jul 97 03:14:53 PDT. Reply-To: gjennejohn@frt.dec.com Subject: Re: /usr/src/lib/libtelnet - why? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 23 Jul 97 13:06:16 +0200 X-Mts: smtp Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk jkh@time.cdrom.com writes: > > there is a program called nd which converts tcp host:port pair to a pty. > > Yeah, I'm familiar with the nd/tcpcon/tcpserv family of commands - > this is what they're currently using at Ascend on their Suns to > pull off this exact trick. The question is - where do I find the > sources to these things? :-) I've netsearched around and not > had much luck. > > Jordan http://ftpsearch.ntnu.no/ftpsearch/ found lots of hits for nd.tar.Z --- Gary Jennejohn (work) gjennejohn@frt.dec.com (home) Gary.Jennejohn@munich.netsurf.de (play) gj@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 04:46:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id EAA11823 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 04:46:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA11816 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 04:46:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA03766; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 04:43:21 -0700 (PDT) To: gjennejohn@frt.dec.com cc: current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: /usr/src/lib/libtelnet - why? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Jul 1997 13:06:16 +0200." <9707231106.AA14986@cssmuc.frt.dec.com> Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 04:43:21 -0700 Message-ID: <3763.869658201@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > http://ftpsearch.ntnu.no/ftpsearch/ found lots of hits for nd.tar.Z Doh! I totally forgot about this service (and it's a FreeBSD box too, I have no excuse :-). Thanks, that did indeed turn it up in short order. Bookmarked. :) Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 07:25:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA20157 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 07:25:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA20141 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 07:25:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id XAA09434; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 23:55:28 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707231425.XAA09434@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick In-Reply-To: <19970722225126.52940@micron.efn.org> from Jonathan Mini at "Jul 22, 97 10:51:27 pm" To: j_mini@efn.org Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 23:55:28 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, bde@zeta.org.au, imp@rover.village.org, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, pechter@lakewood.com, terry@lambert.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jonathan Mini stands accused of saying: > Very true. I _hate_ the way BIOS works. I hate a lot of other > things about the initial IBM PC design and how we're stuck with it > now. There are a few things we can do that will make it a "little" > safer, such as run under a protected priveledge level and watch > accesses -- i.e. restrict them to ranges, but that is not an option > for a high-performance solution. I can see people screaming about latency already. > > > 2) My favorite method. Take your saved interrupt vector table and put > > > it at the begining of a v86 TSS. Also, map in the appropriate amount of > > > memory, and the ROM address space. Effectively, you get the effect of > > > FreeBSD being a overly complex memory manager for DOS, since this is > > > what QEMM and a few others do. The v86 TSS can be multitasked like a > > > doscmd process, and several other things. The only problem is that > > > > If this is your favorite method, I assume that you have code implementing > > it already? > > No. However, I will start writing code in the near future (less than a month) That'd be invaluable; there is a plethora of data that can be obtained from the BIOS, and it is senseless to try to reinvent the weel _if_ it's possible to do it that way. > > Isn't there a 32-bit interface to the VESA BIOS? > > VBE 2.0 has a 32-bit interface, yes. However, the information > requred to USE the interface has to be gotten via a standard 16-bit > interrupt call. (Ugh. ... > Once you do all this, you can remap (or copy) the table to > anywhere you like, but you only get to access Functions 5 (Set > Address Window), 7 (Set display start), and 9 (Set Primary Palette) ie. it's completely worthless. Good one, guys. > Within a short period, I will be looking into running stuff within v86 > tasks. (My soul screams against it, it seems incredibly backwards and lame) Well, the alternative is just as horrible. > ... bleakness ... desolation ... plastic forks ... -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 09:17:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA27547 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 09:17:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sos.freebsd.dk (sos.freebsd.dk [195.8.129.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA27539 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 09:17:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from sos@localhost) by sos.freebsd.dk (8.8.6/8.7.3) id SAA24245; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 18:17:34 +0200 (MEST) From: SЬren Schmidt Message-Id: <199707231617.SAA24245@sos.freebsd.dk> Subject: who broke libedit ?? To: current@freebsd.org (FreeBSD current), committers@sos.freebsd.dk Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 18:17:34 +0200 (MEST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL30 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk current of today yields: cc -O -pipe -I. -I/u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit -c editline.c -o editline.o In file included from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/chared.h:130, from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/el.h:96, from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/chared.c:47, from editline.c:4: common.h:2: warning: garbage at end of `#ifndef' argument common.h:3: warning: missing white space after `#define _h_src' In file included from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/chared.h:131, from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/el.h:96, from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/chared.c:47, from editline.c:4: vi.h:2: warning: garbage at end of `#ifndef' argument In file included from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/chared.h:132, from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/el.h:96, from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/chared.c:47, from editline.c:4: emacs.h:2: warning: garbage at end of `#ifndef' argument In file included from editline.c:8: fcns.c:32: `vi_add' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:32: initializer element for `el_func[54]' is not constant fcns.c:32: `vi_add_at_eol' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:32: initializer element for `el_func[55]' is not constant fcns.c:33: `vi_change_case' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:33: initializer element for `el_func[56]' is not constant fcns.c:33: `vi_change_meta' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:33: initializer element for `el_func[57]' is not constant fcns.c:34: `vi_change_to_eol' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:34: initializer element for `el_func[58]' is not constant fcns.c:34: `vi_command_mode' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:34: initializer element for `el_func[59]' is not constant fcns.c:35: `vi_delete_meta' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:35: initializer element for `el_func[60]' is not constant fcns.c:35: `vi_delete_prev_char' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:35: initializer element for `el_func[61]' is not constant fcns.c:36: `vi_end_word' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:36: initializer element for `el_func[62]' is not constant fcns.c:36: `vi_insert' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:36: initializer element for `el_func[63]' is not constant fcns.c:37: `vi_insert_at_bol' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:37: initializer element for `el_func[64]' is not constant fcns.c:37: `vi_kill_line_prev' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:37: initializer element for `el_func[65]' is not constant fcns.c:38: `vi_list_or_eof' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:38: initializer element for `el_func[66]' is not constant fcns.c:38: `vi_next_char' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:38: initializer element for `el_func[67]' is not constant fcns.c:39: `vi_next_space_word' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:39: initializer element for `el_func[68]' is not constant fcns.c:39: `vi_next_word' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:39: initializer element for `el_func[69]' is not constant fcns.c:40: `vi_paste_next' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:40: initializer element for `el_func[70]' is not constant fcns.c:40: `vi_paste_prev' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:40: initializer element for `el_func[71]' is not constant fcns.c:41: `vi_prev_char' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:41: initializer element for `el_func[72]' is not constant fcns.c:41: `vi_prev_space_word' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:41: initializer element for `el_func[73]' is not constant fcns.c:42: `vi_prev_word' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:42: initializer element for `el_func[74]' is not constant fcns.c:42: `vi_repeat_next_char' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:42: initializer element for `el_func[75]' is not constant fcns.c:43: `vi_repeat_prev_char' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:43: initializer element for `el_func[76]' is not constant fcns.c:43: `vi_repeat_search_next' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:43: initializer element for `el_func[77]' is not constant fcns.c:44: `vi_repeat_search_prev' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:44: initializer element for `el_func[78]' is not constant fcns.c:44: `vi_replace_char' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:44: initializer element for `el_func[79]' is not constant fcns.c:45: `vi_replace_mode' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:45: initializer element for `el_func[80]' is not constant fcns.c:45: `vi_search_next' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:45: initializer element for `el_func[81]' is not constant fcns.c:46: `vi_search_prev' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:46: initializer element for `el_func[82]' is not constant fcns.c:46: `vi_substitute_char' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:46: initializer element for `el_func[83]' is not constant fcns.c:47: `vi_substitute_line' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:47: initializer element for `el_func[84]' is not constant fcns.c:47: `vi_to_end_word' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:47: initializer element for `el_func[85]' is not constant fcns.c:48: `vi_to_next_char' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:48: initializer element for `el_func[86]' is not constant fcns.c:48: `vi_to_prev_char' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:48: initializer element for `el_func[87]' is not constant fcns.c:49: `vi_undo' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:49: initializer element for `el_func[88]' is not constant fcns.c:49: `vi_zero' undeclared here (not in a function) fcns.c:49: initializer element for `el_func[89]' is not constant In file included from editline.c:21: /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/vi.c:674: warning: type mismatch with previous implicit declaration /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/common.c:114: warning: previous implicit declaration of `vi_command_mode' /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/vi.c:674: warning: `vi_command_mode' was previously implicitly declared to return `int' /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/vi.c:674: warning: `vi_command_mode' was declared implicitly `extern' and later `static' *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- SЬren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team Even more code to hack -- will it ever end .. From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 09:52:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA29390 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 09:52:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA29346 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 09:51:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id CAA10320; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 02:21:41 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707231651.CAA10320@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: who broke libedit ?? In-Reply-To: <199707231617.SAA24245@sos.freebsd.dk> from =?ISO-8859-1?Q?S=F8ren_Schmidt?= at "Jul 23, 97 06:17:34 pm" To: sos@sos.freebsd.dk (SЬren Schmidt) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 02:21:40 +0930 (CST) Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, committers@sos.freebsd.dk X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk SЬren Schmidt stands accused of saying: > > current of today yields: Simon Shapiro has been seeing this one for some days now. It is symptomatic of a shell problem. Check /usr/obj/.../lib/libedit/common.h : the first few lines should read : /* Automatically generated file, do not edit */ #ifndef _h_common_c #define _h_common_c The file is generated by this code in src/lib/libedit/makelist : FLAG="$1" shift FILES="$@" case $FLAG in -h) OIFS="$IFS" IFS=".$IFS" set - $FILES IFS="$OIFS" hdr="_h_`basename $1`_$2" cat $FILES | $AWK ' BEGIN { printf("/* Automatically generated file, do not edit */\n"); printf("#ifndef %s\n#define %s\n", "'$hdr'", "'$hdr'"); } which is invoked as : sh ${.CURDIR}/makelist -h ${.CURDIR}/common.c > ${.TARGET} On my system here, with SHELL=/usr/local/bin/tcsh it works fine. Are you using bash as your login shell? Simon promised me a login on his system to pursue this; it's not quite happening yet. I'm about to run out of steam, and he's not in the office. 8( -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 10:33:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA01823 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 10:33:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from karon.dynas.se (karon.dynas.se [192.71.43.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA01810 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 10:33:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 18012 invoked from network); 23 Jul 1997 17:32:49 -0000 Received: from spirit.dynas.se (HELO host.domain) (172.16.1.10) by karon.dynas.se with SMTP; 23 Jul 1997 17:32:49 -0000 Received: by spirit (Smail3.1.28.1 #32) id m0wr5HM-000JehC; Wed, 23 Jul 97 19:32:48 +0200 Message-Id: Date: Wed, 23 Jul 97 19:32:48 +0200 From: micke@dynas.se (Mikael Hybsch) To: sos@sos.freebsd.dk, freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: who broke libedit ?? Newsgroups: local.freebsd-current References: <199707231617.SAA24245@sos.freebsd.dk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from Quoted-Printable to 8bit by hub.freebsd.org id KAA01815 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I had the same problem some says ago. The real problem is some odd code in the shell-script makeline. When used with -h, it tries to extract the basename of the file without extention by first splitting the full path filename on '.' and then calling `basename $1` instead of the reverse. My /usr/src was a symbolic link to /spare/3.0-src. The workaround I used was to rename it to /spare/3_0-src. In local.freebsd-current you write: >current of today yields: >cc -O -pipe -I. -I/u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit -c editline.c -o editline.o >In file included from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/chared.h:130, > from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/el.h:96, > from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/chared.c:47, > from editline.c:4: >common.h:2: warning: garbage at end of `#ifndef' argument >common.h:3: warning: missing white space after `#define _h_src' >In file included from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/chared.h:131, > from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/el.h:96, > from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/chared.c:47, > from editline.c:4: >vi.h:2: warning: garbage at end of `#ifndef' argument >In file included from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/chared.h:132, > from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/el.h:96, > from /u1/src-3.0-CURRENT/lib/libedit/chared.c:47, > from editline.c:4: > > ... > >-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- >SЬren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team > Even more code to hack -- will it ever end >.. -- -- Mikael Hybsch Email: micke@dynas.se DynaSoft, Dynamic Software AB Phone: +46-8-7250900 Box 10704 Fax: +46-8-6494970 S-121 29 STOCKHOLM, SWEDEN From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 10:37:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA02105 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 10:37:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sos.freebsd.dk (sos.freebsd.dk [195.8.129.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA02085 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 10:37:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from sos@localhost) by sos.freebsd.dk (8.8.6/8.7.3) id TAA24434; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 19:37:21 +0200 (MEST) From: SЬren Schmidt Message-Id: <199707231737.TAA24434@sos.freebsd.dk> Subject: Re: who broke libedit ?? In-Reply-To: <199707231651.CAA10320@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from Michael Smith at "Jul 24, 97 02:21:40 am" To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 19:37:20 +0200 (MEST) Cc: current@freebsd.org (FreeBSD current) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL30 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Michael Smith who wrote: > SЬren Schmidt stands accused of saying: > > > > current of today yields: > > Simon Shapiro has been seeing this one for some days now. It is > symptomatic of a shell problem. > > Check /usr/obj/.../lib/libedit/common.h : the first few lines should read : > /* Automatically generated file, do not edit */ > #ifndef _h_common_c > #define _h_common_c > > The file is generated by this code in src/lib/libedit/makelist : > > FLAG="$1" > shift > > FILES="$@" > > case $FLAG in > -h) > OIFS="$IFS" > IFS=".$IFS" > set - $FILES > IFS="$OIFS" > hdr="_h_`basename $1`_$2" > cat $FILES | $AWK ' > BEGIN { > printf("/* Automatically generated file, do not edit */\n"); > printf("#ifndef %s\n#define %s\n", "'$hdr'", "'$hdr'"); > } > > which is invoked as : > > sh ${.CURDIR}/makelist -h ${.CURDIR}/common.c > ${.TARGET} Well, my file doesn't look remotely like that :( > On my system here, with SHELL=/usr/local/bin/tcsh it works fine. Are > you using bash as your login shell? no, /bin/csh... > Simon promised me a login on his system to pursue this; it's not quite > happening yet. I'm about to run out of steam, and he's not in the > office. 8( Well, you can have one on mine if you need .... Send me a passwd line (MD5 crypt), and you'll be in... -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- SЬren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team Even more code to hack -- will it ever end .. From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 11:02:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA03455 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 11:02:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA03439 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 11:02:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id DAA10803; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 03:32:18 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707231802.DAA10803@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: who broke libedit ?? In-Reply-To: from Mikael Hybsch at "Jul 23, 97 07:32:48 pm" To: micke@dynas.se (Mikael Hybsch) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 03:32:17 +0930 (CST) Cc: sos@sos.freebsd.dk, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Mikael Hybsch stands accused of saying: > I had the same problem some says ago. > > The real problem is some odd code in the shell-script makeline. > When used with -h, it tries to extract the basename of the file without > extention by first splitting the full path filename on '.' and then calling > `basename $1` instead of the reverse. Yay! Shimon has the same problem too. How does the follwing alternate logic look : FILES="$@" case $FLAG in -h) fn=`basename $FILES` OIFS="$IFS" IFS=".$IFS" set - $fn IFS="$OIFS" hdr="_h_$1_$2" cat $FILES | $AWK ' BEGIN { printf("/* Automatically generated file, do not edit */\n"); printf("#ifndef %s\n#define %s\n", "'$hdr'", "'$hdr'"); } Any complaints? I give you time to make a coffee and I commit. -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 11:06:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA03786 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 11:06:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA03777; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 11:06:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by mail.cdsnet.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id LAA26238; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 11:06:33 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 11:06:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Jaye Mathisen To: hackers@freebsd.org cc: current@freebsd.org Subject: -current report. :) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Well, I took the plunge, and upgraded my crash-ridden 2.2.2 INN newsserver to 3.0-current as of 7/19, and it's been solid as the proverbial rock for a few days now. Operations that would crash it instantly (or within a couple minutes), now work just yippee-skippee. Not actually suggesting that anybody do it, but for my purposes, it fixed a lot of problems. One other thing I noticed: My de0 interface would report a few errors/hour connected to my LinkSwitch 3000 100MB switch. Under 3.0, 0. SO it's either not reporting them, or whatever was wrong is fixed. Either way, a big old fat zero in the error column gives me a nice false sense of security. :) From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 11:13:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA04269 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 11:13:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA04263 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 11:13:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA15921; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 11:07:25 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707231807.LAA15921@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... To: louie@TransSys.COM (Louis A. Mamakos) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 11:07:25 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, imp@rover.village.org, sef@kithrup.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199707230244.WAA24038@whizzo.TransSys.COM> from "Louis A. Mamakos" at Jul 22, 97 10:44:38 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Specifically: > > > > o Not all cards will be on different interrupts > > The ones on an ISA bus ought to be. Certainly I understand how > PCI cards share interrupts. On the other hand, the current PCI > seem to discover the interrupts used already. I was referring to the fact that there is no hardware-based keying that kept the IRQ's from being set the same on cards. Or memory address ranges. Basically, it's a pain in the ass. > Ok, not a 100% solution. > > I was just suggesting that an approach whereby all the ISA interrupts > are preset during autoconfig time to a routine which could note if it > was invoked as a result of a driver's probe activity. Yes, having one > driver poke an unrelated card during probe is a problem, but this > situation really isn't any different than the UNIBUS situation. There's > at least the possibility of a sanity check. Yeah; this is at least moderately useful; it would make the LANCE probes less ambiguous, at least (LANCE chips must be made to squawk to detect them). I'm sure there is some other hardware it might help as well. It's just nowhere near the Unibus soloution; it's unfortunate. 8-(. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 12:29:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA08878 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 12:29:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hobbes.saturn-tech.com (drussell@drussell.internode.net [198.161.228.154]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA08871 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 12:29:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (drussell@localhost) by hobbes.saturn-tech.com (8.8.4/8.8.2) with SMTP id NAA11784; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 13:28:46 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 13:28:46 -0600 (MDT) From: Doug Russell To: Sean Eric Fagan cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... In-Reply-To: <199707191649.JAA15918@kithrup.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 19 Jul 1997, Sean Eric Fagan wrote: > The visual config stuff is neat, and can be a lifesaver... but requiring > users to do it is going to bite, *hard*. I had to help a (very technical) > friend go through the process -- this is someone who had installed linux on > his system with no problem, he's dealt with funky PC hardware before, etc. > And yet he needed help to config the kernel before booting. > > I really think forcing more people to do it is bad. Then it all depends on your perspective. Personally, every time I do an install on one of my machines that still has an NE2000 (quite a few) I have to go into the editor and change it to 300/10. Regardless of how we set the default, *SOME* users are going to have to change the setting. That's life. The question is what do MOST people use, so that the fewest people possible have to change the config when they install. It really isn't that hard to change in the visual editor, (IMHO), and it is sure nicer now that the installed kernel gets the values selected on the initial boot saved to it, so you only have to edit it once (usually.) That was a bit of a pain way back when. :) Later...... From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 12:36:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA09375 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 12:36:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pandora.hh.kew.com (ahd@kendra.ne.mediaone.net [24.128.53.73]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA09365 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 12:36:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ahd@localhost) by pandora.hh.kew.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA20690 for current@freebsd.org; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 15:36:08 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 15:36:08 -0400 (EDT) From: Drew Derbyshire Message-Id: <199707231936.PAA20690@pandora.hh.kew.com> To: current@freebsd.org Subject: (over)zealous mail bouncing Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > well.. i have the same problem... we fix the from in the actual header, > > but there isn't anything we can really do with sendmail unless we really > > want to become "spammers"... SPAMming is sending unsolicited junk mail; configuring your mail to have a valid reply address which gets errors back to you in a reasonable fashion is merely good system admin. Lying like hell in order to be a good system admin is being a _creative_ system admin. :-) > > also, he gets a dynamic ip address from > > efn.. meaning that he has to change his hostname, and then restart > > sendmail for it to become valid... The sender address does not have to match any known IP address; for it to be a valid address, there need only be a valid MX record. Consider, for example, kew.com (my humble e-mail home) and sonata.uucp.kew.com (my NT UUCP only box); each only have MX records, both are valid sender addresses. If the remote doing the bouncing is checking IP addresses, he better stop -- I can easily send legitmate mail for which the originating IP address will not exist in DNS by the time he can check. > Yes, but the envelope sender is wrong. Mail servers are perfectly > justified in refusing mail with an envelope sender containing a non > existant domain. This correct, but the safest method is to perform a transient rejection (4xx series reply, not 5xx) to allow for true name server problems. This is important, since for example about two weeks ago DNS "lost" freebsd.org, and last Thursday the NIC trashed most of the root servers on the net. In the first incident (running a hard bounce response), I lost at least one FreeBSD digest, but in the second incident (having returned to using transient bounces) mail was merely delayed. For a truly bogus domain, you can either let the mail timeout or add it to your banned domain list for faster flushing. > > well... there is one problem... efn.org is over a 14.4k modem, to my > > 28.8k modem, that happens to be dialed into efn's terminal server, but > > goes over to a local university which we use for inet connectivity... > > so connecting to that host would go over the above, then back from the > > university to efn.org... plus, we run FreeBSD on our systems.. so it > > is possible, but problematic... considering that he can also dial > > directly into efn it would mean needing to have two completely differnt > > configurations... > > Huh? What does this have to do with e-mail addresses? The connectivity > is irrelevant. It also has nothing to do with dynamic addresses. Use > "-f" flag to sendmail to force the proper envelope sender. The standard mail user agents do not present this flag, and sendmail must be told which users are to be trusted to use it. This makes it a poor choice for a production system. For reasonably sized site, a better method is to explicitly define the canonical host name of each unique dial-in host (use the confDOMAIN_NAME macro) and provide valid MX records for each one. You could, in a pinch, use a wild-carded sub-domain (*.dymanic.efn.org) to cut down on the number of records, but according to the sendmail.org experts, wildcard records should be avoided if possible. You can also tell sendmail to masquerade the envelope as well, this is does cut down on the audit trail slightly and so I personally try to avoid it. -- Drew Derbyshire Internet: ahd@kew.com Kendra Electronic Wonderworks Telephone: 617-279-9812 "I remember being a sophomore; it was the best three years of my life." - "Animal House" From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 12:44:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA09701 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 12:44:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hobbes.saturn-tech.com (drussell@drussell.internode.net [198.161.228.154]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA09694 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 12:44:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (drussell@localhost) by hobbes.saturn-tech.com (8.8.4/8.8.2) with SMTP id NAA11802; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 13:42:24 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 13:42:23 -0600 (MDT) From: Doug Russell To: Andreas Klemm cc: Wolfgang Helbig , dg@root.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... In-Reply-To: <19970719221048.19170@gtn.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 19 Jul 1997, Andreas Klemm wrote: > Well, I think in most cases people do have only one machine at home. > This machine is used for everyything (Work, games, ...). > > I think this configuration is a typical one: > > IRQ 3 - COM2 - modem > IRQ 4 - COM1 - mouse or something else > IRQ 5 - Soundblaster > IRQ 7 - LPT1: - printer > IRQ 9 - Teles 16 Bit ISDN card > IRQ 10 - Network Card <- cheapo 10 MBit ISA > IRQ 11 - free for PCI > IRQ 12 - PS/2 mouse > IRQ 14 - free for PCI > IRQ 15 - IDE crap 14 is the primary IDE, 15 is usually used for the second IDE channel. Just one question, though. If you only had one machine at home, why would you need the ethernet card? :) Later...... From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 13:20:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA11758 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 13:20:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mpress.com (mpress.com [208.138.29.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA11743 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 13:20:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 1667 invoked by uid 100); 23 Jul 1997 20:20:18 -0000 Message-ID: <19970723132014.47636@mpress.com> Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 13:20:14 -0700 From: Brian Litzinger To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: cannot fork, resource temporarily unavailable Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I run qmail 1.01 on my -current system with 32MBs. I have a .qmail file which says | /var/qmail/bin/preline /usr/local/bin/procmail I often get error messages such as: Jul 23 13:02:12 mpress qmail: 869688132.490708 delivery 40: deferral: preline:_fatal:_temporary_problem/ Jul 23 13:01:40 mpress qmail: 869688100.100646 delivery 37: deferral: Unable_to_fork._(#4.3.0)/ And messages from procmail about cannot fork. my kernel is compiled with maxusers 20 Most of the time its just me and X logged in. I'm running afterstep and usually have 4 rxvt windows. I don't get these errors in any other context, so I'm guessing that something is limiting qmail or my account. Any ideas? -- Brian Litzinger brian@mpress.com From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 13:20:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA11787 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 13:20:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lsd.relcom.eu.net (lsd.relcom.eu.net [193.124.23.23]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA11756 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 13:20:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ache@localhost) by lsd.relcom.eu.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) id AAA02863; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:20:21 +0400 (MSD) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:20:20 +0400 (MSD) From: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= X-Sender: ache@lsd.relcom.eu.net To: FreeBSD-current Subject: 'fetch' error with http, fix wanted Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk This command fetch http://www.lothlorien.net/~squirrel/giger/art/Necronomicon_I.jpg always says "connection reset by peer" in the middle of file transfer, meanwhile, new -current ftp or lynx do it sucessfully! Does anybody knows sockets enough to fix it? -- Andrey A. Chernov http://www.nagual.pp.ru/~ache/ From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 13:36:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA12646 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 13:36:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.webspan.net (root@mail.webspan.net [206.154.70.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA12625; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 13:36:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.5]) by mail.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id QAA06158; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:36:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id QAA11299; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:36:39 -0400 (EDT) To: Jaye Mathisen cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: -current report. :) In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Jul 1997 11:06:30 PDT." Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:36:39 -0400 Message-ID: <11297.869690199@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jaye Mathisen wrote in message ID : > Well, I took the plunge, and upgraded my crash-ridden 2.2.2 INN newsserver > to 3.0-current as of 7/19, and it's been solid as the proverbial rock > for a few days now. > Operations that would crash it instantly (or within a couple minutes), now > work just yippee-skippee. (sorry if this has been asked before, but I don't remember) what operations would they be? newgroup/rmgroup? Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 14:05:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA14431 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 14:05:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu [18.24.4.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA14426 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 14:05:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from wollman@localhost) by khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA26899; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:05:38 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:05:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <199707232105.RAA26899@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> To: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= Cc: FreeBSD-current Subject: 'fetch' error with http, fix wanted In-Reply-To: References: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < said: > This command > fetch http://www.lothlorien.net/~squirrel/giger/art/Necronomicon_I.jpg > always says "connection reset by peer" in the middle of file transfer, > meanwhile, new -current ftp or lynx do it sucessfully! > Does anybody knows sockets enough to fix it? I would make a wild guess and suggest that it's likely a TCP bug on their end, but without being able to get a tcpdump trace of it I can't be certain. (It could, of course, also be a TCP bug on our end.) -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame MIT, LCS, CRS, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 14:21:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA15239 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 14:21:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from relay.linkdesign.com (nserv1.hlink.com.cy [194.42.131.14]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA15231 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 14:21:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bsd.linkdesign.com (simon.bofh.com.cy [194.42.135.70]) by relay.linkdesign.com (8.8.5/8.8.2) with ESMTP id AAA04022 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:22:35 +0300 (EET DST) Received: (from michael.bielicki@localhost) by bsd.linkdesign.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) id AAA03395; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:21:47 +0300 (EEST) Message-ID: <19970724002146.28020@linkdesign.com> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:21:46 +0300 From: Michael Bielicki To: current@freebsd.org Subject: JDK-1.1.X anybody on CURRENT ??? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by hub.freebsd.org id OAA15234 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have to implement Servlets on a apache server running todays current. Setup: Ibm ServlettExpress Module for Apache Apache 1.2.1 SSL-0.8.0 I tried to use both, the canadian JDK-1.1 (which allways dump core) and Kaffe 0.9.1 which gives the following message: root@boss# ./servlet_eng_runner.sh java.lang.InternalError: java.lang.Runtime:runFinalizersOnExit0 unimplemented at java/lang/Runtime.runFinalizersOnExit(line unknown, pc 0xf6af9) at com/ibm/ServletExpress/outofproc/OutOfProcessEng.main(line unknown, pc 0xf6463) any solution to that ? Is there a official port of JDK-1.1.X for FreeBSD ??? cheers Michael -- Michael Bielicki Link Design International Ltd. Buisnetco Telecommunications Ltd. 65 Cliff Road, Tramore, Office 23, 13, Iras Street Co. Waterford, Ireland Nicosia 1061, Rep. of Cyprus Tel: +353-51-390880 We use FreeBSD Tel: +357 2 362 421 Fax: +353 51 386921 http://www.linkdesign.com Fax: +357 2 362 429 From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 14:27:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA15702 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 14:27:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lsd.relcom.eu.net (lsd.relcom.eu.net [193.124.23.23]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA15693 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 14:27:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ache@localhost) by lsd.relcom.eu.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) id BAA04047; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 01:27:39 +0400 (MSD) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 01:27:39 +0400 (MSD) From: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= X-Sender: ache@lsd.relcom.eu.net To: Garrett Wollman cc: FreeBSD-current Subject: Re: 'fetch' error with http, fix wanted In-Reply-To: <199707232105.RAA26899@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, Garrett Wollman wrote: > < said: > > > This command > > fetch http://www.lothlorien.net/~squirrel/giger/art/Necronomicon_I.jpg > > > always says "connection reset by peer" in the middle of file transfer, > > meanwhile, new -current ftp or lynx do it sucessfully! > > Does anybody knows sockets enough to fix it? > > I would make a wild guess and suggest that it's likely a TCP bug on > their end, but without being able to get a tcpdump trace of it I can't > be certain. (It could, of course, also be a TCP bug on our end.) > But why ftp or lynx always works, if it is TCP bug? They show -stalled- state sometimes and I think fetch treat -stalled- as resetting by peer... I see the same behaviour already 4 times in the past, but forget other URLs. -- Andrey A. Chernov http://www.nagual.pp.ru/~ache/ From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 14:37:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA16369 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 14:37:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from austin.polstra.com (austin.polstra.com [206.213.73.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA16364 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 14:37:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from austin.polstra.com (jdp@localhost) by austin.polstra.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA16798; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 14:37:15 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199707232137.OAA16798@austin.polstra.com> To: brian@mpress.com Subject: Re: cannot fork, resource temporarily unavailable In-Reply-To: <19970723132014.47636@mpress.com> References: <19970723132014.47636@mpress.com> Organization: Polstra & Co., Seattle, WA Cc: current@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 14:37:15 -0700 From: John Polstra Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In article <19970723132014.47636@mpress.com>, Brian Litzinger wrote: > > I often get error messages such as: > > Jul 23 13:02:12 mpress qmail: 869688132.490708 delivery 40: deferral: preline:_fatal:_temporary_problem/ > > Jul 23 13:01:40 mpress qmail: 869688100.100646 delivery 37: deferral: Unable_to_fork._(#4.3.0)/ > > And messages from procmail about cannot fork. > > my kernel is compiled with > > maxusers 20 > > Most of the time its just me and X logged in. I'm running afterstep > and usually have 4 rxvt windows. > > I don't get these errors in any other context, so I'm guessing that > something is limiting qmail or my account. Any ideas? man login.conf :-) John -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-knowledge is always bad news." -- John Barth From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 15:17:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA18955 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 15:17:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA18938 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 15:17:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA15794; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:16:48 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:16:48 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199707232216.QAA15794@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Michael Bielicki Cc: current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: JDK-1.1.X anybody on CURRENT ??? In-Reply-To: <19970724002146.28020@linkdesign.com> References: <19970724002146.28020@linkdesign.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I have to implement Servlets on a apache server running todays current. > Setup: > Ibm ServlettExpress Module for Apache > Apache 1.2.1 > SSL-0.8.0 > > I tried to use both, the canadian JDK-1.1 (which allways dump core) It works for me, but it didn't work for a friend also running 2.2. This is the candadien version. Note, that version gives me grief with some 3rd party stuff that uses, but I've been so busy doing continued development (on Solaris and NT) that I haven't had time to track down the problem. However, simple socket stuff seems to work. > Is there a official port of JDK-1.1.X for FreeBSD ??? The canadian stuff is about as official as it gets. Nate From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 15:42:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA20280 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 15:42:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from scanner.worldgate.com (scanner.worldgate.com [198.161.84.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA20274 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 15:42:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from znep.com (uucp@localhost) by scanner.worldgate.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with UUCP id QAA16961; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:42:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (marcs@localhost) by alive.znep.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA29827; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:43:41 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:43:41 -0600 (MDT) From: Marc Slemko To: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= cc: Garrett Wollman , FreeBSD-current Subject: Re: 'fetch' error with http, fix wanted In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by hub.freebsd.org id PAA20275 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It will happen at times if you try to talk to certain boxes with T/TCP like SunOS 4.x boxes. Disable net.inet.tcp.rfc1644 and it should work. You probably only see it with fetch because it appears to be more efficient with the way it sends the headers, so the request goes in a single packet with the SYN. Haven't looked into it further to see who is at fault yet. Oh yes, on a completely unrelated note... fetch is also broken in that it makes HTTP/1.1 requests but doesn't properly deal with the results. This gains it absolutely nothing but hurts a lot in some case. eg. fetch http://www.apache.org/index.html doesn't give the proper output because fetch doesn't know about chunked encoding. It is bogus, both in theory and practice, for fetch to claim to be HTTP/1.1 if it can't handle chunked encodings. On Thu, 24 Jul 1997, [KOI8-R] Андрей Чернов wrote: > On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, Garrett Wollman wrote: > > > < said: > > > > > This command > > > fetch http://www.lothlorien.net/~squirrel/giger/art/Necronomicon_I.jpg > > > > > always says "connection reset by peer" in the middle of file transfer, > > > meanwhile, new -current ftp or lynx do it sucessfully! > > > Does anybody knows sockets enough to fix it? > > > > I would make a wild guess and suggest that it's likely a TCP bug on > > their end, but without being able to get a tcpdump trace of it I can't > > be certain. (It could, of course, also be a TCP bug on our end.) > > > > But why ftp or lynx always works, if it is TCP bug? They show -stalled- > state sometimes and I think fetch treat -stalled- as resetting by peer... > > I see the same behaviour already 4 times in the past, but forget other > URLs. > > -- > Andrey A. Chernov > > http://www.nagual.pp.ru/~ache/ > From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 15:56:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA20921 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 15:56:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lsd.relcom.eu.net (lsd.relcom.eu.net [193.124.23.23]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA20915 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 15:56:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ache@localhost) by lsd.relcom.eu.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) id CAA05508; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 02:55:54 +0400 (MSD) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 02:55:53 +0400 (MSD) From: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= X-Sender: ache@lsd.relcom.eu.net To: Marc Slemko cc: Garrett Wollman , FreeBSD-current Subject: Re: 'fetch' error with http, fix wanted In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, Marc Slemko wrote: > It will happen at times if you try to talk to certain boxes with T/TCP > like SunOS 4.x boxes. Disable net.inet.tcp.rfc1644 and it should work. > You probably only see it with fetch because it appears to be more > efficient with the way it sends the headers, so the request goes in a > single packet with the SYN. Haven't looked into it further to see who is > at fault yet. I disable both rfc1323 and rfc1644 and it still not work (is it work for you?) > Oh yes, on a completely unrelated note... fetch is also broken in that it > makes HTTP/1.1 requests but doesn't properly deal with the results. This > gains it absolutely nothing but hurts a lot in some case. eg. fetch > http://www.apache.org/index.html doesn't give the proper output because > fetch doesn't know about chunked encoding. It is bogus, both in theory > and practice, for fetch to claim to be HTTP/1.1 if it can't handle chunked > encodings. I agree. Any objection to revert it to HTTP/1.0? > > > > fetch http://www.lothlorien.net/~squirrel/giger/art/Necronomicon_I.jpg > > > > > > > always says "connection reset by peer" in the middle of file transfer, -- Andrey A. Chernov http://www.nagual.pp.ru/~ache/ From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 16:04:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA21341 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:04:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu [18.24.4.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA21327 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:04:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from wollman@localhost) by khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA27199; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 19:04:06 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 19:04:06 -0400 (EDT) From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <199707232304.TAA27199@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> To: Marc Slemko Cc: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= , Garrett Wollman , FreeBSD-current Subject: Re: 'fetch' error with http, fix wanted In-Reply-To: References: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < said: > Oh yes, on a completely unrelated note... fetch is also broken in that it > makes HTTP/1.1 requests but doesn't properly deal with the results. This > gains it absolutely nothing but hurts a lot in some case. eg. fetch > http://www.apache.org/index.html doesn't give the proper output because > fetch doesn't know about chunked encoding. It is bogus, both in theory > and practice, for fetch to claim to be HTTP/1.1 if it can't handle chunked > encodings. See the comments in the source. We don't fully implement the specification, and the part of the specification about who can claim to be ``HTTP/1.1'' is one of the unimplemented parts. We do implement some of the other, more important parts of the specification, including ``Host:'' and ``Connection: close''. I'm also not sure how much of the mirror functionality is present in HTTP 1.0. I coded fetch's HTTP implementation solely with reference to the HTTP 1.1 specification. You are certainly welcome to contribute an implementation of ``chunked''; see the comments in the source. At the time I wrote the code, I didn't have any servers which generated that encoding. -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame MIT, LCS, CRS, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 16:15:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA21887 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:15:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from news.quick.net (donegan@news.quick.net [207.212.170.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA21876 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:15:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from donegan@localhost) by news.quick.net (8.8.5/8.6.9) id QAA06572; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:15:11 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:15:10 -0700 (PDT) From: "Steven P. Donegan" To: current@freebsd.org Subject: cvsup current-supfile Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I keep getting "connection refused" from current.freebsd.org when trying to cvsup the current-supfile items - and using the README's hints and trying -h sup2.freebsd.org etc results in host not found. Is current.freebsd.org the correct site or not? Thanks From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 16:22:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA22418 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:22:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lsd.relcom.eu.net (lsd.relcom.eu.net [193.124.23.23]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA22406 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:22:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ache@localhost) by lsd.relcom.eu.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) id DAA06401; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 03:22:33 +0400 (MSD) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 03:22:33 +0400 (MSD) From: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= X-Sender: ache@lsd.relcom.eu.net To: Garrett Wollman cc: Marc Slemko , FreeBSD-current Subject: Re: 'fetch' error with http, fix wanted In-Reply-To: <199707232304.TAA27199@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, Garrett Wollman wrote: > We do implement some of the other, more important parts of the > specification, including ``Host:'' and ``Connection: close''. I'm > also not sure how much of the mirror functionality is present in HTTP > 1.0. I coded fetch's HTTP implementation solely with reference to the > HTTP 1.1 specification. Host: and Connection: close not require HTTP/1.1 request, Apache f.e. pass Connection: close to HTTP/1.0 requests too. > You are certainly welcome to contribute an implementation of > ``chunked''; see the comments in the source. At the time I wrote the > code, I didn't have any servers which generated that encoding. Lets revert it to 1.0 for now and bring it back to 1.1 again when chunked will be implemented. I think mirror functionality should work with 1.0 requests too. Is it wrong assumption? -- Andrey A. Chernov http://www.nagual.pp.ru/~ache/ From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 16:48:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA23676 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:48:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lsd.relcom.eu.net (lsd.relcom.eu.net [193.124.23.23]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA23665 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:48:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ache@localhost) by lsd.relcom.eu.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) id DAA06721; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 03:48:42 +0400 (MSD) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 03:48:42 +0400 (MSD) From: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= X-Sender: ache@lsd.relcom.eu.net To: Garrett Wollman cc: Marc Slemko , FreeBSD-current Subject: Re: 'fetch' error with http, fix wanted In-Reply-To: <199707232304.TAA27199@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, Garrett Wollman wrote: > You are certainly welcome to contribute an implementation of > ``chunked''; see the comments in the source. At the time I wrote the > code, I didn't have any servers which generated that encoding. Forget to mention that the server on other side (from my bug report) is Apache 1.2.0 which is 1.1-conformant and send this 'chunked' output which fetch can't handle (it cause 'connection reset by peer' for it). Since Apache 1.2.x is standard now, fetch will not handle more and more servers in pretty near future. So we need to revert to 1.0 or implement chunked ASAP. I suggest revert to 1.0 right now until somebody will implement chunked. Even if mirroring will be broken by this step (I doubt), normal behaviour remains non-broken, it is more valuable! -- Andrey A. Chernov http://www.nagual.pp.ru/~ache/ From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 16:54:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA23995 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:54:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu [18.24.4.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA23990 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:53:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from wollman@localhost) by khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA27367; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 19:53:55 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 19:53:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <199707232353.TAA27367@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> To: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= Cc: FreeBSD-current Subject: Re: 'fetch' error with http, fix wanted In-Reply-To: References: <199707232304.TAA27199@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < said: > Forget to mention that the server on other side (from my bug report) > is Apache 1.2.0 which is 1.1-conformant and send this 'chunked' output > which fetch can't handle (it cause 'connection reset by peer' for it). No, it has nothing whatsoever to do with your problem. If it did, `fetch' would be outputting a warning message saying so. UTSL. > Since Apache 1.2.x is standard now, fetch will not handle more and more > servers in pretty near future. So we need to revert to 1.0 or implement > chunked ASAP. I suggest revert to 1.0 right now until somebody will > implement chunked. I suggest you sit down and implement `chunked' if you think it's important. I'll be happy to review the results. -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame MIT, LCS, CRS, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 17:00:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA24411 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:00:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lsd.relcom.eu.net (lsd.relcom.eu.net [193.124.23.23]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA24401 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:00:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ache@localhost) by lsd.relcom.eu.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) id EAA07000; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 04:00:34 +0400 (MSD) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 04:00:33 +0400 (MSD) From: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= X-Sender: ache@lsd.relcom.eu.net To: Garrett Wollman cc: FreeBSD-current Subject: Re: 'fetch' error with http, fix wanted In-Reply-To: <199707232353.TAA27367@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, Garrett Wollman wrote: > > Forget to mention that the server on other side (from my bug report) > > is Apache 1.2.0 which is 1.1-conformant and send this 'chunked' output > > which fetch can't handle (it cause 'connection reset by peer' for it). > > No, it has nothing whatsoever to do with your problem. If it did, > `fetch' would be outputting a warning message saying so. UTSL. You are right, nothing changed (I still got error in the middle), if I replace 1.1 with 1.0... So, it is not TCP extensions bug and not 1.1 bug... Any ideas? -- Andrey A. Chernov http://www.nagual.pp.ru/~ache/ From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 17:07:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA24738 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:07:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu [18.24.4.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA24731 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:07:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from wollman@localhost) by khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA27406; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 20:07:44 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 20:07:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <199707240007.UAA27406@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> To: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= Cc: Garrett Wollman , FreeBSD-current Subject: Re: 'fetch' error with http, fix wanted In-Reply-To: References: <199707232353.TAA27367@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < said: > You are right, nothing changed (I still got error in the middle), if I > replace 1.1 with 1.0... So, it is not TCP extensions bug and not 1.1 > bug... Any ideas? My guess is still that it's some sort of TCP bug (not necessarily related to T/TCP), and in that case it's still necessary to get a tcpdump trace demonstrating the problem. Please do: # tcpdump -p -S -t -t ip host whatever.that.host.is and tcp port 80 >log and send me the log, and I'll take a look at it. (I would do so myself but I need to rebuild the kernel on my machine to add more BPF ports and that's a difficult proposition at the moment.) -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame MIT, LCS, CRS, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 17:17:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA25532 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:17:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.calweb.com (mail.calweb.com [208.131.56.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA25514 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:17:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail.calweb.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id QAA15068; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:31:21 -0700 (PDT) X-SMTP: hello devnull from jflists@pop.calweb.com server @devnull.calweb.com ip 207.173.135.51 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970723162206.00923100@pop.calweb.com> Warning: Unsolicited Commercial Email (UCE) will be returned to send in bulk X-Sender: jflists@pop.calweb.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 16:22:06 -0700 To: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= , Marc Slemko From: "jfesler@calweb.com" Subject: Re: 'fetch' error with http, fix wanted Cc: Garrett Wollman , FreeBSD-current In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 02:55 AM 7/24/97 +0400, =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= wrote: >> Oh yes, on a completely unrelated note... fetch is also broken in that it >> makes HTTP/1.1 requests but doesn't properly deal with the results. This .. >I agree. Any objection to revert it to HTTP/1.0? None here. You can still send the "Host:" header, as HTTP/1.1 does, in order to help select the proper virtual host from servers where the virtual hosts are not IP based; by saying HTTP/1.0, you should get a 1.0 style response, and the file you were expecting.. I believe this is what Netscape 2.0 does. -- Jason Fesler jfesler@calweb.com 'whois jf319' | When the chips are down Admin, CalWeb Internet Services www.calweb.com | The buffalo's empty Junk email returned in bulk; 1 cc to your postmaster | Junk mail probs? http://www.gigo.com/junkmail.htm | :-) From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 17:20:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA25769 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:20:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pahtoh.cwu.edu (root@pahtoh.cwu.edu [198.104.65.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA25762 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:20:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from opus.cts.cwu.edu (skynyrd@opus.cts.cwu.edu [198.104.92.71]) by pahtoh.cwu.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA13927; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:20:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (skynyrd@localhost) by opus.cts.cwu.edu (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA13623; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:15:56 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:15:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Chris Timmons To: "Steven P. Donegan" cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cvsup current-supfile In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Try cvsup.freebsd.org instead. I think current.freebsd.org is a release building machine (from which you could install a 'snapshot of the day'. -Chris On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, Steven P. Donegan wrote: > I keep getting "connection refused" from current.freebsd.org when trying > to cvsup the current-supfile items - and using the README's hints and > trying -h sup2.freebsd.org etc results in host not found. Is > current.freebsd.org the correct site or not? > > Thanks > From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 17:43:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA26844 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:43:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA26838 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:43:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org [127.0.0.1] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wrBzr-0006Ed-00; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 18:43:11 -0600 To: Tom Subject: Re: lpr/lpd changes Cc: current@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Jul 1997 19:00:48 PDT." References: Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 18:43:10 -0600 From: Warner Losh Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message Tom writes: : Unrelated: why on earth is lpd started by the default rc* stuff? Seems : unwise to fire up something that needs to be configured to be useful : first. That's a good question. would it make sense to have a grep for ^lp in /etc/printcap before starting it? Or at least for lines not being blank and not starting with #. Warner From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 17:44:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA26917 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:44:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA26912 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:44:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org [127.0.0.1] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wrC1B-0006Em-00; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 18:44:33 -0600 To: Doug Russell Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... Cc: current@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Jul 1997 13:42:23 MDT." References: Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 18:44:33 -0600 From: Warner Losh Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message Doug Russell writes: : 14 is the primary IDE, 15 is usually used for the second IDE channel. : Just one question, though. If you only had one machine at home, why would : you need the ethernet card? :) So it can talk to the other 8 machines in my house :-) Warner From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 17:46:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA26978 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:46:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.uniserve.com (tom@shell.uniserve.com [204.244.210.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA26969 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:46:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (tom@localhost) by shell.uniserve.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA25338; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:44:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: shell.uniserve.com: tom owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:44:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom To: Warner Losh cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: lpr/lpd changes In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, Warner Losh wrote: > In message Tom writes: > : Unrelated: why on earth is lpd started by the default rc* stuff? Seems > : unwise to fire up something that needs to be configured to be useful > : first. > > That's a good question. would it make sense to have a grep for ^lp in > /etc/printcap before starting it? Or at least for lines not being > blank and not starting with #. It might not be worth the effort. Configuring lpd can be complex, and make require additional packages (ex. ghostscript, and apsfilter) to be useful. Anyone who gets through the process should have much trouble turning the NO to YES in rc.conf (or is is ON and OFF now?). > Warner > Tom From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 17:48:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA27139 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:48:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA27133 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:48:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org [127.0.0.1] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wrC58-0006GJ-00; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 18:48:38 -0600 To: Tom Subject: Re: lpr/lpd changes Cc: current@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Jul 1997 17:44:55 PDT." References: Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 18:48:38 -0600 From: Warner Losh Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message Tom writes: : It might not be worth the effort. Configuring lpd can be complex, and : make require additional packages (ex. ghostscript, and apsfilter) to be : useful. Anyone who gets through the process should have much trouble : turning the NO to YES in rc.conf (or is is ON and OFF now?). You have a point. OK. Can we turn this off by default and then have people turn it on by default? Does anybody object? Warner From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 18:36:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA28971 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 18:36:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from scanner.worldgate.com (scanner.worldgate.com [198.161.84.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA28942 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 18:35:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from znep.com (uucp@localhost) by scanner.worldgate.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with UUCP id TAA27136; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 19:35:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (marcs@localhost) by alive.znep.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA00589; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 19:37:09 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 19:37:08 -0600 (MDT) From: Marc Slemko To: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= , "jfesler@calweb.com" , Garrett Wollman cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 'fetch' error with http, fix wanted In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by hub.freebsd.org id SAA28943 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Jul 1997, [KOI8-R] Андрей Чернов wrote: > Since Apache 1.2.x is standard now, fetch will not handle more and more > servers in pretty near future. So we need to revert to 1.0 or implement > chunked ASAP. I suggest revert to 1.0 right now until somebody will > implement chunked. Note that Apache 1.2 only gives chunked responses to 1.1 requests in certain cases. In particular, when it doesn't have a content-length to send at the start of the request (eg. CGIs, SSIs), it uses chunked encoding to allow persistent connections to work. On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, jfesler@calweb.com wrote: > None here. You can still send the "Host:" header, as HTTP/1.1 does, in > order to help select the proper virtual host from servers where the virtual > hosts are not IP based; by saying HTTP/1.0, you should get a 1.0 style > response, and the file you were expecting.. I believe this is what > Netscape 2.0 does. Exactly. The standard is somewhat weak in this area, but the basic idea is that all 1.x clients and servers should be able to talk to one another. If there are extra headers that one doesn't know about, they should be ignored. The spirit of the spec is followed by sending a HTTP/1.0 request because it doesn't properly implement HTTP/1.1 but still sending a Host: header, although it may not follow the letter of the standard. In any case, that is what a vast majority of the clients out there (Navigator 2.x-4.x, MSIE 3.x) do. On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, Garrett Wollman wrote: > See the comments in the source. We don't fully implement the > specification, and the part of the specification about who can claim > to be ``HTTP/1.1'' is one of the unimplemented parts. That's a bad attitude, especially when it results in needless garbage output. > We do implement some of the other, more important parts of the > specification, including ``Host:'' and ``Connection: close''. I'm > also not sure how much of the mirror functionality is present in HTTP > 1.0.. I coded fetch's HTTP implementation solely with reference to the > HTTP 1.1 specification. Fact is, that a majority of your get responses from HTTP/1.0 servers anyway, so what works now should work just fine if you make a HTTP/1.0 request instead, and you avoid claiming to be things you aren't. > You are certainly welcome to contribute an implementation of > ``chunked''; see the comments in the source. At the time I wrote the > code, I didn't have any servers which generated that encoding. That is on my todo list, but I have a few other things a touch higher than that. The implementation should be quite easy; good project for someone with time... If you want a really good test, look at IBM's IICS... I have seen it outputting 10k files where the chunks were only around 4 or 5 chars long. Sheesh. On Thu, 24 Jul 1997, [KOI8-R] Андрей Чернов wrote: > On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, Marc Slemko wrote: > > > It will happen at times if you try to talk to certain boxes with T/TCP > > like SunOS 4.x boxes. Disable net.inet.tcp.rfc1644 and it should work. > > You probably only see it with fetch because it appears to be more > > efficient with the way it sends the headers, so the request goes in a > > single packet with the SYN. Haven't looked into it further to see who is > > at fault yet. > > I disable both rfc1323 and rfc1644 and it still not work (is it work for > you?) Hmm, no this one doesn't. Must be a different problem in this case. No obvious problems, I'll take a closer look when I get home. On Thu, 24 Jul 1997, [KOI8-R] Андрей Чернов wrote: > I think mirror functionality should work with 1.0 requests too. > Is it wrong assumption? I would have to know exactly what parts of the spec you are talking about, but if it works with a HTTP/1.0 server today when we claim to be HTTP/1.1, it should work with a HTTP/1.0 server when we claim to be HTTP/1.0. From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 19:17:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA00903 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 19:17:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ppp6564.on.sympatico.ca (ppp6443.on.sympatico.ca [206.172.208.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA00893 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 19:17:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (tim@localhost) by ppp6564.on.sympatico.ca (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA18643; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 22:16:26 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 22:16:23 -0400 (EDT) From: Tim Vanderhoek Reply-To: ac199@hwcn.org To: Warner Losh cc: Tom , current@FreeBSD.ORG, andreas@klemm.gtn.com Subject: Re: lpr/lpd changes In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, Warner Losh wrote: > In message Tom writes: > : It might not be worth the effort. Configuring lpd can be complex, and > : make require additional packages (ex. ghostscript, and apsfilter) to be > : useful. Anyone who gets through the process should have much trouble > : turning the NO to YES in rc.conf (or is is ON and OFF now?). > > You have a point. > > OK. Can we turn this off by default and then have people turn it on While configuring lpd may be complex, one still only has to install apsfilter and, if one answers all the questions right, one's set. This is not an objection to having lpd off by default, but a suggestion that apsfilter be feeped a little bit more to ask "lpd is currently disabled in /etc/rc.conf. Do you want to enable it? [Y/N]" -- tIM...HOEk OPTIMIZATION: the process of using many one-letter variables names hoping that the resultant code will run faster. From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 20:35:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA04910 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 20:35:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA04905 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 20:35:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id NAA13866; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 13:04:08 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707240334.NAA13866@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: lpr/lpd changes In-Reply-To: from Warner Losh at "Jul 23, 97 06:43:10 pm" To: imp@rover.village.org (Warner Losh) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 13:04:08 +0930 (CST) Cc: tom@uniserve.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Warner Losh stands accused of saying: > In message Tom writes: > : Unrelated: why on earth is lpd started by the default rc* stuff? Seems > : unwise to fire up something that needs to be configured to be useful > : first. > > That's a good question. would it make sense to have a grep for ^lp in > /etc/printcap before starting it? Or at least for lines not being > blank and not starting with #. No. The only behaviour that makes any sense is for lpd itself to exit with a diagnostic if no printers are defined; there is no point in trying to teach something else about a private configuration file. > Warner -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 21:09:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA06109 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 21:09:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.uniserve.com (tom@shell.uniserve.com [204.244.210.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA06101 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 21:09:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (tom@localhost) by shell.uniserve.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA25820; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 21:07:24 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: shell.uniserve.com: tom owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 21:07:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom To: ac199@hwcn.org cc: Warner Losh , current@FreeBSD.ORG, andreas@klemm.gtn.com Subject: Re: lpr/lpd changes In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, Tim Vanderhoek wrote: > suggestion that apsfilter be feeped a little bit more to ask "lpd is > currently disabled in /etc/rc.conf. Do you want to enable it? [Y/N]" But can't the user do that manually? Isn't rc.conf supposed to easy to use? Is it supposed to be designed so that you can easily flip things on and off? Then maybe should let it do its job. > -- > tIM...HOEk > OPTIMIZATION: the process of using many one-letter variables names > hoping that the resultant code will run faster. > > From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 21:09:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA06127 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 21:09:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mole.mole.org (marmot.mole.org [204.216.57.191]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA06117 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 21:09:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mail@localhost) by mole.mole.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) id EAA07178; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 04:09:38 GMT Received: from meerkat.mole.org(206.197.192.110) by mole.mole.org via smap (V1.3) id sma007176; Thu Jul 24 04:09:21 1997 Received: (from mrm@localhost) by meerkat.mole.org (8.6.11/8.6.9) id VAA20696; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 21:08:07 -0700 Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 21:08:07 -0700 From: "M.R.Murphy" Message-Id: <199707240408.VAA20696@meerkat.mole.org> To: imp@rover.village.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Subject: Re: lpr/lpd changes Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, tom@uniserve.com Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > No. The only behaviour that makes any sense is for lpd itself to exit > with a diagnostic if no printers are defined; there is no point in > trying to teach something else about a private configuration file. > Is this a good idea given the current defined behavior of lpc (say WRT start). I think it's not broke, and don't fix it :-) If somebody doesn't want to start lpd, let 'em decide not to do so and change their configuration files appropriately. -- Mike Murphy mrm@Mole.ORG +1 619 598 5874 Better is the enemy of Good From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 21:15:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA06432 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 21:15:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA06405 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 21:14:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id NAA14130; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 13:42:50 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707240412.NAA14130@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: lpr/lpd changes In-Reply-To: <199707240408.VAA20696@meerkat.mole.org> from "M.R.Murphy" at "Jul 23, 97 09:08:07 pm" To: mrm@Mole.ORG (M.R.Murphy) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 13:42:49 +0930 (CST) Cc: imp@rover.village.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, current@FreeBSD.ORG, tom@uniserve.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk M.R.Murphy stands accused of saying: > > > > No. The only behaviour that makes any sense is for lpd itself to exit > > with a diagnostic if no printers are defined; there is no point in > > trying to teach something else about a private configuration file. > > > > Is this a good idea given the current defined behavior of lpc (say > WRT start). Um. I'm tempted to suggest that 'lpr' should know how to start the daemon too, but in reality this is likely to upset someone that's used to killing the daemon to temporarily prevent printing. > I think it's not broke, and don't fix it :-) If somebody doesn't > want to start lpd, let 'em decide not to do so and change their > configuration files appropriately. That's fair enough too. -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Wed Jul 23 23:44:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA12731 for current-outgoing; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 23:44:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gidora.kralizec.net.au (gidora.kralizec.net.au [203.15.68.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA12710 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 1997 23:44:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from support@localhost) by gidora.kralizec.net.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA12379; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:40:57 +1000 From: Support user Message-Id: <199707240640.QAA12379@gidora.kralizec.net.au> Subject: Re: spam filter blocks legitimate sender To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:40:52 +1000 (EST) Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, j_mini@efn.org In-Reply-To: <199707221907.FAA06096@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Jul 23, 97 05:07:02 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk G'day Bruce, > Zeta is said to be "over spam-rampant and hates us poor dynamic IP folks" :-). The fix, for the person trying to send the mail, is very easy ... simply use your real E-mail address in the "From" envelope header. My host doesn't care whether he uses a dynamic IP address. It cares only that a resolvable domain name is in the "From" envelope header. I make no apology for fighting spam. And I make no apology to people who inject E-mail containing bogus domain names onto the Net. Nick. > From: Jonathan Mini > To: freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG > Subject: [MAILER-DAEMON: Returned mail: Service unavailable] > Reply-To: Jonathan Mini > Mime-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e > X-files: The Truth is Out There. > Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG > X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > Precedence: bulk > Status: R > > How annoying. Bruce Evan's site is over spam-rampant and hates us poor dynamic > IP folks. I'm about ready to ask my ISP for a DNS entry that points to nowhere, > just so that I can send people like this mail. > > -----Forwarded message from Mail Delivery Subsystem ----- > > Received: from localhost (localhost) > by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with internal id KAA10614; > Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:45:41 -0700 (PDT) > Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:45:41 -0700 (PDT) > From: Mail Delivery Subsystem > Message-Id: <199707221745.KAA10614@micron.efn.org> > To: mini > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: multipart/report; report-type=delivery-status; > boundary="KAA10614.869593541/micron.efn.org" > Subject: Returned mail: Service unavailable > Auto-Submitted: auto-generated (failure) > > This is a MIME-encapsulated message > > --KAA10614.869593541/micron.efn.org > > The original message was received at Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:42:59 -0700 (PDT) > from mini@localhost > > ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors ----- > Bruce Evans > > ----- Transcript of session follows ----- > ... while talking to godzilla.zeta.org.au.: > >>> MAIL From: SIZE=3506 RET=HDRS > <<< 571 ... Domain name micron.efn.org incorrect > 554 Bruce Evans ... Service unavailable Nick. From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 00:24:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA14843 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:24:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from micron.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA14836 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:24:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mini@localhost) by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA00584; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:24:47 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970724002446.59369@micron.efn.org> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:24:46 -0700 From: Jonathan Mini To: Drew Derbyshire Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing Reply-To: Jonathan Mini References: <199707231936.PAA20690@pandora.hh.kew.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e In-Reply-To: <199707231936.PAA20690@pandora.hh.kew.com>; from Drew Derbyshire on Wed, Jul 23, 1997 at 03:36:08PM -0400 X-files: The Truth is Out There. Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk What I'm saying is that my hostname doesn't have a DNS entry in the "outside world" and therefore sending a message from my machine is automatically an invalid host. THe only real option I have is to spoof the information that sendmail sends out, ask my ISP for a addressless DNS entry (make a DNS entry that has no A entry) or change my hostname to something valid. Although pictures of naming myself cyberpromo.com for a week come to mind, I don't think "stealing" someone else's host name is a very valid solution. I would persue getting a DNS entry from my ISP, except that I have more than one ISP. (makes life harder, although still theoretially possible. All I need is one valid hostname I can pretend I am) I'd do that -- except that I am going to be moving into student housing in about a month or so, and will actually have a public IP address and DNS entry for my machine on that network, and (knowing my ISP's) it would probably take a month to get that DNS entry, it's kinda of pointless. I'm just a little annoyed at people who insist of having the sending machine call itself a valid hostname, just to cut down on spam. Drew Derbyshire stands accused of saying : > > > well.. i have the same problem... we fix the from in the actual header, > > > but there isn't anything we can really do with sendmail unless we really > > > want to become "spammers"... > > SPAMming is sending unsolicited junk mail; configuring your mail > to have a valid reply address which gets errors back to you in a > reasonable fashion is merely good system admin. Lying like hell > in order to be a good system admin is being a _creative_ system > admin. :-) > > > > also, he gets a dynamic ip address from > > > efn.. meaning that he has to change his hostname, and then restart > > > sendmail for it to become valid... > > The sender address does not have to match any known IP address; > for it to be a valid address, there need only be a valid MX record. > Consider, for example, kew.com (my humble e-mail home) and > sonata.uucp.kew.com (my NT UUCP only box); each only have MX records, > both are valid sender addresses. > > If the remote doing the bouncing is checking IP addresses, he better > stop -- I can easily send legitmate mail for which the originating > IP address will not exist in DNS by the time he can check. > > > Yes, but the envelope sender is wrong. Mail servers are perfectly > > justified in refusing mail with an envelope sender containing a non > > existant domain. > > This correct, but the safest method is to perform a transient > rejection (4xx series reply, not 5xx) to allow for true name server > problems. This is important, since for example about two weeks > ago DNS "lost" freebsd.org, and last Thursday the NIC trashed most > of the root servers on the net. In the first incident (running a > hard bounce response), I lost at least one FreeBSD digest, but in > the second incident (having returned to using transient bounces) > mail was merely delayed. > > For a truly bogus domain, you can either let the mail timeout or add > it to your banned domain list for faster flushing. > > > > well... there is one problem... efn.org is over a 14.4k modem, to my > > > 28.8k modem, that happens to be dialed into efn's terminal server, but > > > goes over to a local university which we use for inet connectivity... > > > so connecting to that host would go over the above, then back from the > > > university to efn.org... plus, we run FreeBSD on our systems.. so it > > > is possible, but problematic... considering that he can also dial > > > directly into efn it would mean needing to have two completely differnt > > > configurations... > > > > Huh? What does this have to do with e-mail addresses? The connectivity > > is irrelevant. It also has nothing to do with dynamic addresses. Use > > "-f" flag to sendmail to force the proper envelope sender. > > The standard mail user agents do not present this flag, and sendmail > must be told which users are to be trusted to use it. This makes > it a poor choice for a production system. > > For reasonably sized site, a better method is to explicitly define > the canonical host name of each unique dial-in host (use the > confDOMAIN_NAME macro) and provide valid MX records for each one. > You could, in a pinch, use a wild-carded sub-domain (*.dymanic.efn.org) > to cut down on the number of records, but according to the sendmail.org > experts, wildcard records should be avoided if possible. > > You can also tell sendmail to masquerade the envelope as well, this is > does cut down on the audit trail slightly and so I personally try to > avoid it. > -- > Drew Derbyshire Internet: ahd@kew.com > Kendra Electronic Wonderworks Telephone: 617-279-9812 > > "I remember being a sophomore; it was the best three years of my life." > - "Animal House" -- Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) ... bleakness ... desolation ... plastic forks ... From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 00:33:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA15277 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:33:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from micron.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA15268 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:33:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mini@localhost) by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA00611; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:33:33 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970724003332.04757@micron.efn.org> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:33:32 -0700 From: Jonathan Mini To: Support user Cc: Bruce Evans , freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: spam filter blocks legitimate sender Reply-To: Jonathan Mini References: <199707221907.FAA06096@godzilla.zeta.org.au> <199707240640.QAA12379@gidora.kralizec.net.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e In-Reply-To: <199707240640.QAA12379@gidora.kralizec.net.au>; from Support user on Thu, Jul 24, 1997 at 04:40:52PM +1000 X-files: The Truth is Out There. Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Support user stands accused of saying : > G'day Bruce, > > > Zeta is said to be "over spam-rampant and hates us poor dynamic IP folks" :-). > > The fix, for the person trying to send the mail, is very easy ... simply > use your real E-mail address in the "From" envelope header. Ahhh. But I do. The problem is that my hostname "micron.efn.org" doesn't exist, even though my headers all refer to "j_mini@efn.org" (which is my real email address). This one's been beaten to death already, so I won't repeat what I said before. Read the other message, or delete this one as well. I'm sure probably 90% of us don't really care anymore. > My host doesn't care whether he uses a dynamic IP address. It cares only > that a resolvable domain name is in the "From" envelope header. > > I make no apology for fighting spam. And I make no apology to people who > inject E-mail containing bogus domain names onto the Net. > > Nick. > > > From: Jonathan Mini > > To: freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG > > Subject: [MAILER-DAEMON: Returned mail: Service unavailable] > > Reply-To: Jonathan Mini > > Mime-Version: 1.0 > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e > > X-files: The Truth is Out There. > > Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG > > X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > > Precedence: bulk > > Status: R > > > > How annoying. Bruce Evan's site is over spam-rampant and hates us poor dynamic > > IP folks. I'm about ready to ask my ISP for a DNS entry that points to nowhere, > > just so that I can send people like this mail. > > > > -----Forwarded message from Mail Delivery Subsystem ----- > > > > Received: from localhost (localhost) > > by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with internal id KAA10614; > > Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:45:41 -0700 (PDT) > > Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:45:41 -0700 (PDT) > > From: Mail Delivery Subsystem > > Message-Id: <199707221745.KAA10614@micron.efn.org> > > To: mini > > MIME-Version: 1.0 > > Content-Type: multipart/report; report-type=delivery-status; > > boundary="KAA10614.869593541/micron.efn.org" > > Subject: Returned mail: Service unavailable > > Auto-Submitted: auto-generated (failure) > > > > This is a MIME-encapsulated message > > > > --KAA10614.869593541/micron.efn.org > > > > The original message was received at Tue, 22 Jul 1997 10:42:59 -0700 (PDT) > > from mini@localhost > > > > ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors ----- > > Bruce Evans > > > > ----- Transcript of session follows ----- > > ... while talking to godzilla.zeta.org.au.: > > >>> MAIL From: SIZE=3506 RET=HDRS > > <<< 571 ... Domain name micron.efn.org incorrect > > 554 Bruce Evans ... Service unavailable > > Nick. -- Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) ... bleakness ... desolation ... plastic forks ... From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 00:46:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA15703 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:46:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from micron.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA15651 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:44:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mini@localhost) by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA00637; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:42:17 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970724004216.19551@micron.efn.org> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:42:16 -0700 From: Jonathan Mini To: Michael Smith Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, imp@rover.village.org, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, pechter@lakewood.com, terry@lambert.org Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick Reply-To: Jonathan Mini References: <19970722225126.52940@micron.efn.org> <199707231425.XAA09434@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e In-Reply-To: <199707231425.XAA09434@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au>; from Michael Smith on Wed, Jul 23, 1997 at 11:55:28PM +0930 X-files: The Truth is Out There. Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Michael Smith stands accused of saying : > Jonathan Mini stands accused of saying: > > > Very true. I _hate_ the way BIOS works. I hate a lot of other > > things about the initial IBM PC design and how we're stuck with it > > now. There are a few things we can do that will make it a "little" > > safer, such as run under a protected priveledge level and watch > > accesses -- i.e. restrict them to ranges, but that is not an option > > for a high-performance solution. > > I can see people screaming about latency already. Well. My field is usally more sound and video and less netowrk performance. Every loss means less fps, and high timeouts for streaming devices can cause ruined output. So, for me, the latency isn't a big deal, more the amount of CPU cylces it takes. (thought latency hurts often too) > > > > 2) My favorite method. Take your saved interrupt vector table and put > > > > it at the begining of a v86 TSS. Also, map in the appropriate amount of > > > > memory, and the ROM address space. Effectively, you get the effect of > > > > FreeBSD being a overly complex memory manager for DOS, since this is > > > > what QEMM and a few others do. The v86 TSS can be multitasked like a > > > > doscmd process, and several other things. The only problem is that > > > > > > If this is your favorite method, I assume that you have code implementing > > > it already? > > > > No. However, I will start writing code in the near future (less than a month) > That'd be invaluable; there is a plethora of data that can be obtained > from the BIOS, and it is senseless to try to reinvent the weel _if_ > it's possible to do it that way. Well, then. I will make sure I send my modifications into the FreeBSD core team to be commited. I agree abotu BIOS having lots of useful info, I jsut don't like its API. > > > Isn't there a 32-bit interface to the VESA BIOS? > > > > VBE 2.0 has a 32-bit interface, yes. However, the information > > requred to USE the interface has to be gotten via a standard 16-bit > > interrupt call. (Ugh. > ... > > Once you do all this, you can remap (or copy) the table to > > anywhere you like, but you only get to access Functions 5 (Set > > Address Window), 7 (Set display start), and 9 (Set Primary Palette) > > ie. it's completely worthless. Good one, guys. Basically, yeah. However, it is the solution to things like requiring a large library to interface with a video card. For me, it has uses. Mostly on development time. It takes less time (or money, measured in time) to write an interface for the BIOS than it does to either write a library to interface with all those cards, or buy one from someone else. As of yet, I haven't seen a lib that provides as good a coverage as VESA VBE does. It's slow on some things, but at least it works. > > Within a short period, I will be looking into running stuff within v86 > > tasks. (My soul screams against it, it seems incredibly backwards and lame) > > Well, the alternative is just as horrible. Yeah. Well, It's kinda like the doscmd people. The concept seems a step back, but it really is a step forward. -- Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) ... bleakness ... desolation ... plastic forks ... From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 01:18:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA17031 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 01:18:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA16991 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 01:17:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id RAA15276; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 17:45:33 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707240815.RAA15276@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick In-Reply-To: <19970724004216.19551@micron.efn.org> from Jonathan Mini at "Jul 24, 97 00:42:16 am" To: j_mini@efn.org Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 17:45:32 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, bde@zeta.org.au, imp@rover.village.org, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, pechter@lakewood.com, terry@lambert.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jonathan Mini stands accused of saying: > > > > I can see people screaming about latency already. > > Well. My field is usally more sound and video and less netowrk > performance. Every loss means less fps, and high timeouts for > streaming devices can cause ruined output. So, for me, the latency > isn't a big deal, more the amount of CPU cylces it takes. (thought > latency hurts often too) Latency is just CPU cycles wasted on someone else's work 8) > > That'd be invaluable; there is a plethora of data that can be obtained > > from the BIOS, and it is senseless to try to reinvent the weel _if_ > > it's possible to do it that way. > > Well, then. I will make sure I send my modifications into the FreeBSD core > team to be commited. I agree abotu BIOS having lots of useful info, I jsut > don't like its API. As long as I get a copy too 8) -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 01:32:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA17450 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 01:32:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com (critter.phk.freebsd.dk [195.8.133.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA17445 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 01:32:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.dk.tfs.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA01827 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:31:08 +0200 (CEST) To: current@freebsd.org Subject: "Pentium Pro Bios Update API" ??? From: Poul-Henning Kamp Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:31:08 +0200 Message-ID: <1825.869733068@critter.dk.tfs.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Anyone heard of this API before ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 02:25:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA19260 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 02:25:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA19255 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 02:25:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA11428; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 02:23:48 -0700 (PDT) To: Jonathan Mini cc: Drew Derbyshire , current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:24:46 PDT." <19970724002446.59369@micron.efn.org> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 02:23:48 -0700 Message-ID: <11424.869736228@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > What I'm saying is that my hostname doesn't have a DNS entry in the "outside > world" and therefore sending a message from my machine is automatically an Which you simply need to fix. If you are in a situation where your hostname is entirely ficticious then set some other machine as your mail relay and do what most BigCorps do when they have legions of machines they'd rather not expose directly and 2 or 3 mail servers which collect and send out mail on their behalf. This problem _has_ been solved, and most ISPs also have a mail host for their customers which allows this kind of relaying. :-) > I'm just a little annoyed at people who insist of having the sending machine > call itself a valid hostname, just to cut down on spam. Better get used to it - it's one of the single best ways of filtering out The Bogus Ones who would flood our mailboxes with adverts for teen sex and tax evasion kits, and I've been discussing the idea of turning this on for freebsd.org with our postmaster for some time now. To sum it up: The problem of spammers using bogus names to hide behind is a far, far greater problem than not being able to send mail to those comparatively few individuals without valid hostnames, so using the "99.9% vs .1%" value rule, you simply lose. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 02:27:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA19391 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 02:27:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA19381 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 02:27:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA11456; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 02:25:32 -0700 (PDT) To: Jonathan Mini cc: Support user , Bruce Evans , freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: spam filter blocks legitimate sender In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Jul 1997 00:33:32 PDT." <19970724003332.04757@micron.efn.org> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 02:25:32 -0700 Message-ID: <11453.869736332@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Ahhh. But I do. The problem is that my hostname "micron.efn.org" doesn't > exist Doctor says: "So don't do that." :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 03:34:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA21543 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 03:34:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bagpuss.visint.co.uk (bagpuss.visint.co.uk [194.207.134.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA21531 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 03:34:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dylan.visint.co.uk (dylan.visint.co.uk [194.207.134.180]) by bagpuss.visint.co.uk (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA14222; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 11:33:57 +0100 (BST) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 11:33:57 +0100 (BST) From: Stephen Roome To: Jonathan Mini cc: Drew Derbyshire , current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing In-Reply-To: <19970724002446.59369@micron.efn.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Jul 1997, Jonathan Mini wrote: > What I'm saying is that my hostname doesn't have a DNS entry in the "outside > world" and therefore sending a message from my machine is automatically an > invalid host. THe only real option I have is to spoof the information that > sendmail sends out, ask my ISP for a addressless DNS entry (make a DNS entry > that has no A entry) or change my hostname to something valid. Two other _REAL_ options: a) Find anyone on the net who is willing to let you have an email account on their machine. That's how it always used to be done. b)Get hold of someone who's willing to act as your mail relay, and then change your email From: & Reply-To: addresses' to that host. Then if you only have an IP number or whatever then the relay can just forward it, or if you have nothing more than a dynamic IP then you can set up sendmail to collect it for you from their machine. c)Move to a reasonable ISP. Personally I'd go with c. -- Steve Roome - Vision Interactive Ltd. Tel:+44(0)117 9730597 Home:+44(0)976 241342 WWW: http://dylan.visint.co.uk/ From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 06:22:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA27385 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 06:22:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com (critter.phk.freebsd.dk [195.8.133.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA27374 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 06:21:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.dk.tfs.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA07658 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:20:44 +0200 (CEST) To: current@freebsd.org Subject: kernel make error ? From: Poul-Henning Kamp Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:20:43 +0200 Message-ID: <7656.869750443@critter.dk.tfs.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk is this just my problem ? critter# make cc -c -O2 -pipe -Wreturn-type -Wcomment -Wredundant-decls -Wimplicit -Wnested-externs -Wstrict-prototypes -Wmissing-prototypes -Wpointer-arith -nostdinc -I- -I. -I../.. -I../../../include -DDIAGNOSTIC -DCOMPAT_43 -DFFS -DINET -DKERNEL -include opt_global.h ../../i386/isa/isa.c ../../i386/isa/isa.c:906: conflicting types for `isa_dmastatus' ../../i386/isa/isa_device.h:120: previous declaration of `isa_dmastatus' *** Error code 1 -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 07:22:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA00948 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 07:22:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu [18.24.4.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA00943 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 07:22:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from wollman@localhost) by khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA29714; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:22:13 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:22:13 -0400 (EDT) From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <199707241422.KAA29714@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> To: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= Cc: current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 'fetch' error with http, fix wanted In-Reply-To: References: <199707240007.UAA27406@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < said: Something is broken on their end. Note: > 869740951.001002 lothlorien.net.http > lsd.relcom.eu.net.relief: . 1049447366:1049448826(1460) ack 2045965091 win 31744 Here they sent us a data packet. > 869740951.001285 lsd.relcom.eu.net.relief > lothlorien.net.http: . ack 1049448826 win 16060 (DF) We ack it. > 869740951.611809 lothlorien.net.http > lsd.relcom.eu.net.relief: . 1049448826:1049450286(1460) ack 2045965091 win 31744 They send us another full packet of data. > 869740951.611882 lothlorien.net.http > lsd.relcom.eu.net.relief: R 1049447366:1049447366(0) win 0 Oops. All of a sudden, they send us a reset. Near as I can tell from the rest of the trace, we have done nothing to provoke this reset; they have already acked our FIN (and, of course, all of the data we sent before) and are in a half-closed state, and we simply keep on acking their data packets. > 869740951.612068 lsd.relcom.eu.net.relief > lothlorien.net.http: . ack 1049450286 win 16060 (DF) We send an ack to that last data packet (TCP hasn't, at this point, seen the RST yet). > 869740951.618377 lothlorien.net.http > lsd.relcom.eu.net.relief: R 1049448826:1049448826(0) win 0 They send another reset in response to one of our acks which was in transit (which was an ack to their sequence number 1049445906). > 869740952.144714 lothlorien.net.http > lsd.relcom.eu.net.relief: R 1049450286:1049450286(0) win 0 And again. > 869740953.716743 lothlorien.net.http > lsd.relcom.eu.net.relief: . 1049445906:1049447366(1460) ack 2045965091 win 31744 Somehow, this old segment has floated out of the network. We acked it, but that ack is one of the ones they replied to with a reset. > 869740953.716975 lsd.relcom.eu.net.relief > lothlorien.net.http: R 2045965091:2045965091(0) win 0 Finally, they reply with a reset to our last ack. I would say that either their TCP or their Web server is busted. This is actually not terribly surprising: ;; ANSWERS: lothlorien.net. 85459 HINFO "Custom Cyrix 686-166+" "Linux" The specific problem seems to be that their system (or their Web server, but that's unlikely) does not implement half-closed states correctly. You can verify this by replacing the references to MSG_EOF in fetch with zeros; the file then transfers correctly. Here is a patch which adds a `-b' (for ``bug-compatible'') flag to fetch: Index: fetch.1 =================================================================== RCS file: /homes/cvs/src/usr.bin/fetch/fetch.1,v retrieving revision 1.17 diff -u -r1.17 fetch.1 --- fetch.1 1997/03/05 18:57:15 1.17 +++ fetch.1 1997/07/24 14:20:47 @@ -7,7 +7,7 @@ .Nd retrieve a file by Uniform Resource Locator .Sh SYNOPSIS .Nm fetch -.Op Fl MPamnpqr +.Op Fl MPabmnpqr .Op Fl o Ar file .Ar URL .Op Ar ... @@ -48,6 +48,12 @@ .Bl -tag -width Fl .It Fl a Automatically retry the transfer upon soft failures. +.It Fl b +Work around a bug in some +.Tn HTTP +servers which fail to correctly implement the +.Tn TCP +protocol. .It Fl c Ar dir The file to retrieve is in directory .Ar dir @@ -301,3 +307,7 @@ authentication mode is implemented for .Tn HTTP . This should be replaced by digest authentication. +.Pp +The +.Fl b +flag should not be necessary. Index: fetch.h =================================================================== RCS file: /homes/cvs/src/usr.bin/fetch/fetch.h,v retrieving revision 1.3 diff -u -r1.3 fetch.h --- fetch.h 1997/02/05 19:59:10 1.3 +++ fetch.h 1997/07/24 14:10:43 @@ -49,6 +49,7 @@ int fs_linkfile; /* -l option */ int fs_precious; /* -R option */ int fs_auto_retry; /* -a option */ + int fs_linux_bug; /* -b option */ time_t fs_modtime; void *fs_proto; int (*fs_retrieve)(struct fetch_state *); Index: http.c =================================================================== RCS file: /homes/cvs/src/usr.bin/fetch/http.c,v retrieving revision 1.6 diff -u -r1.6 http.c --- http.c 1997/03/06 20:01:32 1.6 +++ http.c 1997/07/24 14:12:28 @@ -483,7 +483,7 @@ n = 0; msg.msg_control = 0; msg.msg_controllen = 0; - msg.msg_flags = MSG_EOF; + msg.msg_flags = fs->fs_linux_bug ? 0 : MSG_EOF; #define addstr(Iov, N, Str) \ do { \ @@ -575,7 +575,7 @@ fs->fs_status = "sending request message"; setup_sigalrm(); alarm(timo); - if (sendmsg(s, &msg, MSG_EOF) < 0) { + if (sendmsg(s, &msg, fs->fs_linux_bug ? 0 : MSG_EOF) < 0) { warn("sendmsg: %s", https->http_hostname); fclose(remote); return EX_OSERR; Index: main.c =================================================================== RCS file: /homes/cvs/src/usr.bin/fetch/main.c,v retrieving revision 1.40 diff -u -r1.40 main.c --- main.c 1997/07/02 06:28:32 1.40 +++ main.c 1997/07/24 14:15:36 @@ -73,7 +73,7 @@ fs.fs_verbose = 1; change_to_dir = file_to_get = hostname = 0; - while ((c = getopt(argc, argv, "ac:D:f:h:HilLmMnNo:pPqRrT:vV:")) != -1) { + while ((c = getopt(argc, argv, "abc:D:f:h:HilLmMnNo:pPqRrT:vV:")) != -1) { switch (c) { case 'D': case 'H': case 'I': case 'N': case 'L': case 'V': break; /* ncftp compatibility */ @@ -81,10 +81,15 @@ case 'a': fs.fs_auto_retry = 1; break; + + case 'b': + fs.fs_linux_bug = 1; + break; + case 'c': change_to_dir = optarg; break; - + case 'f': file_to_get = optarg; break; -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame MIT, LCS, CRS, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 07:43:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA02069 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 07:43:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from plains.NoDak.edu (tinguely@plains.NoDak.edu [134.129.111.64]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA02062 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 07:43:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tinguely@localhost) by plains.NoDak.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA28676; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 09:43:46 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 09:43:46 -0500 (CDT) From: Mark Tinguely Message-Id: <199707241443.JAA28676@plains.NoDak.edu> To: michael.bielicki@linkdesign.com, nate@mt.sri.com Subject: Re: JDK-1.1.X anybody on CURRENT ??? Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I tried to use both, the canadian JDK-1.1 (which allways dump core) > > It works for me, but it didn't work for a friend also running 2.2. This > is the candadien version. for the people that are having core dumps of the jdk 1.1.x, have you COPIED /usr/lib/compat/libcrypt.so.2.0 into /usr/lib/libcrypt.so.2.0. the program explicted tries to open this shared library. If the library is not there, it loops trying to open it and then eventually crashes. --mark. From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 07:50:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA02529 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 07:50:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cais.cais.com (root@cais.com [199.0.216.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA02521; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 07:50:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from earth.mat.net (root@[206.246.122.2]) by cais.cais.com (8.8.5/CJKv1.99-CAIS) with SMTP id KAA11830; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:50:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Journey2.mat.net (journey2.mat.net [206.246.122.116]) by earth.mat.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA20999; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:50:14 -0400 Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:50:21 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey X-Sender: chuckr@Journey2.mat.net To: Poul-Henning Kamp cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, msmith@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: kernel make error ? In-Reply-To: <7656.869750443@critter.dk.tfs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Jul 1997, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > > is this just my problem ? > > critter# make > cc -c -O2 -pipe -Wreturn-type -Wcomment -Wredundant-decls -Wimplicit -Wnested-externs -Wstrict-prototypes -Wmissing-prototypes -Wpointer-arith -nostdinc -I- -I. -I../.. -I../../../include -DDIAGNOSTIC -DCOMPAT_43 -DFFS -DINET -DKERNEL -include opt_global.h ../../i386/isa/isa.c > ../../i386/isa/isa.c:906: conflicting types for `isa_dmastatus' > ../../i386/isa/isa_device.h:120: previous declaration of `isa_dmastatus' > *** Error code 1 I was just about to send "nope, it compiles fine for me" when another ctm update came in and saved me that embarrassment. The problem seems to have come in from Mike Smith's recent commit of a fix from Luigi Rizzo (probably from all the sound stuff he's working on). The new function isa_dmastart has been defined as a int in isa.c, but as a void in isa_dmastart.h. I don't know which is right, so I'm reposting here. I'd think the int would be right from the code, tho, because it seems to be returning something with some intelligence in it. ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@eng.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run Journey2 and picnic, both FreeBSD (301) 220-2114 | version 3.0 current -- and great FUN! ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 08:31:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA04832 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 08:31:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zeus.gel.usherb.ca (zeus.gel.usherb.ca [132.210.70.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA04825 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 08:31:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from castor.gel.usherb.ca by zeus.gel.usherb.ca (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA05657; Thu, 24 Jul 97 11:31:00 EDT Received: by castor.gel.usherb.ca (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id LAA23465; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 11:30:59 -0400 Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 11:30:59 -0400 (EDT) From: "Alex.Boisvert" To: Mark Tinguely Cc: michael.bielicki@linkdesign.com, nate@mt.sri.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: JDK-1.1.X anybody on CURRENT ??? In-Reply-To: <199707241443.JAA28676@plains.NoDak.edu> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > for the people that are having core dumps of the jdk 1.1.x, have you > COPIED /usr/lib/compat/libcrypt.so.2.0 into /usr/lib/libcrypt.so.2.0. > the program explicted tries to open this shared library. If the library > is not there, it loops trying to open it and then eventually crashes. The explicit dlopen is performed on "/usr/lib/libc.so.2.2" not "libcrypt.so.x.x". Regards, Alex. From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 08:39:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA05502 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 08:39:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gdi.uoregon.edu (cisco-ts14-line1.uoregon.edu [128.223.150.167]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA05495; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 08:39:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (dwhite@localhost) by gdi.uoregon.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA01303; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 08:39:07 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 08:39:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Doug White X-Sender: dwhite@localhost Reply-To: Doug White To: Brian Litzinger cc: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cannot fork, resource temporarily unavailable In-Reply-To: <19970723132014.47636@mpress.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, Brian Litzinger wrote: > I run qmail 1.01 on my -current system with 32MBs. I have a .qmail > file which says > > | /var/qmail/bin/preline /usr/local/bin/procmail > > I often get error messages such as: > > Jul 23 13:01:40 mpress qmail: 869688100.100646 delivery 37: deferral: > Unable_to_fork._(#4.3.0)/ > > And messages from procmail about cannot fork. > I don't get these errors in any other context, so I'm guessing that > something is limiting qmail or my account. Any ideas? You might check your login.conf and make sure you have the appropriate users have enough processes available. You might try sending mail to yourself and watch 'top' and make sure you don't have any runaway processes either. Doug White | University of Oregon Internet: dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu | Residence Networking Assistant http://gladstone.uoregon.edu/~dwhite | Computer Science Major Spam routed to /dev/null by Procmail | Death to Cyberpromo From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 09:02:30 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA07030 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 09:02:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mercury.Sun.COM (mercury.Sun.COM [192.9.25.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA07025 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 09:02:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from East.Sun.COM ([129.148.1.241]) by mercury.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/mail.byaddr) with SMTP id JAA19002 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 09:01:52 -0700 Received: from suneast.East.Sun.COM by East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-5.3) id MAA28703; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 12:01:51 -0400 Received: from compound.east.sun.com by suneast.East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id MAA25868; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 12:01:51 -0400 Received: (from alk@localhost) by compound.east.sun.com (8.8.6/8.7.3) id LAA03086; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 11:01:48 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 11:01:48 -0500 (CDT) Reply-To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Message-Id: <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> From: Tony Kimball MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing References: <199707241422.HAA00957@hub.freebsd.org> X-Face: O9M"E%K;(f-Go/XDxL+pCxI5*gr[=FN@Y`cl1.Tn Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Quoth "Jordan K. Hubbard" : : To sum it up: The problem of spammers using bogus names to hide behind : is a far, far greater problem than not being able to send mail to : those comparatively few individuals without valid hostnames, so using : the "99.9% vs .1%" value rule, you simply lose. :-) I beg to differ. Most machines which may validly receive email do *not* have valid hostnames. Using the majority-minority rule, *you* lose. That's reality. Please do not intentionally damage global email. The system can only take so much damage before it will no longer be able to route around it. It's kinda like freon and the ozone that way, only more catastrophic. From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 09:03:30 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA07089 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 09:03:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from GndRsh.aac.dev.com (GndRsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA07082 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 09:03:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by GndRsh.aac.dev.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) id JAA01147; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 09:03:08 -0700 (PDT) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199707241603.JAA01147@GndRsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: "Pentium Pro Bios Update API" ??? In-Reply-To: <1825.869733068@critter.dk.tfs.com> from Poul-Henning Kamp at "Jul 24, 97 10:31:08 am" To: phk@dk.tfs.com (Poul-Henning Kamp) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 09:03:08 -0700 (PDT) Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL25 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Anyone heard of this API before ? Yes, I think it is the API for updating the firmware inside the Pentium Pro chip, it should be documented by Intel someplace. If you look in most Award Pentium Pro BIOS's you'll see a setting for ``CPU update enable'' or some such name. The BIOS will complain about a CPUID that it does not know about, for example sticking a 0x619 into early revision ASUS P6NP5 boards will give you a nice warning during POST about not being able to update the CPU, fixed by flashing to the latest BIOS. -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation, Inc. Reliable computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 09:46:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA10211 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 09:46:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hobbes.saturn-tech.com (drussell@drussell.internode.net [198.161.228.154]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA10203 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 09:46:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (drussell@localhost) by hobbes.saturn-tech.com (8.8.4/8.8.2) with SMTP id KAA13908; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:46:16 -0600 (MDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:46:15 -0600 (MDT) From: Doug Russell To: Warner Losh cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: I am contemplating the following change... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, Warner Losh wrote: > In message Doug Russell writes: > : 14 is the primary IDE, 15 is usually used for the second IDE channel. > : Just one question, though. If you only had one machine at home, why would > : you need the ethernet card? :) > > So it can talk to the other 8 machines in my house :-) I said if you only had ONE machine, why would you need it? :) I have the same (problem? :) ) in my house. There are 6 workstation machines and two servers. (One NT (icky) and one FreeBSD.) :) Later...... From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 09:49:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA10492 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 09:49:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from verdi.nethelp.no (verdi.nethelp.no [195.1.171.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA10487 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 09:49:12 -0700 (PDT) From: sthaug@nethelp.no Received: (qmail 3016 invoked by uid 1001); 24 Jul 1997 16:49:00 +0000 (GMT) To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 24 Jul 1997 11:01:48 -0500 (CDT)" References: <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.05+ on Emacs 19.28.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 18:49:00 +0200 Message-ID: <3014.869762940@verdi.nethelp.no> Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > : To sum it up: The problem of spammers using bogus names to hide behind > : is a far, far greater problem than not being able to send mail to > : those comparatively few individuals without valid hostnames, so using > : the "99.9% vs .1%" value rule, you simply lose. :-) > > I beg to differ. Most machines which may validly receive email do *not* > have valid hostnames. Using the majority-minority rule, *you* lose. > That's reality. Nope. Let's reformulate it a little bit: Most machines which may validly receive email through a direct SMTP transaction across the Internet, have valid hostnames. This *includes* dialup users, for which the ISP needs to have the dialup addresses in his DNS (both forward and reverse). This *excludes* users which receive email through some sort of relay - in this that case it's the job of the relay to perform necessary rewriting. Checking for bogus names as a way to exclude spam is only going to get more popular. Better get used to it. Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 09:57:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA11002 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 09:57:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA10997 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 09:57:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA20055; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:57:10 -0600 (MDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:57:10 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199707241657.KAA20055@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Cc: current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing In-Reply-To: <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> References: <199707241422.HAA00957@hub.freebsd.org> <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > : To sum it up: The problem of spammers using bogus names to hide behind > : is a far, far greater problem than not being able to send mail to > : those comparatively few individuals without valid hostnames, so using > : the "99.9% vs .1%" value rule, you simply lose. :-) > > I beg to differ. Most machines which may validly receive email do *not* > have valid hostnames. That's irrelevant. Most machines which send mail send via a machine that *DOES* have valid hostnames, and the envelope uses that address. That's the way email has always worked. Nate From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 10:01:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA11394 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:01:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA11389 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:01:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA13068; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 09:59:39 -0700 (PDT) To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Jul 1997 11:01:48 CDT." <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 09:59:39 -0700 Message-ID: <13063.869763579@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I beg to differ. Most machines which may validly receive email do *not* > have valid hostnames. Using the majority-minority rule, *you* lose. > That's reality. That's sure news to me - every machine I've dealt with over the last couple of years, absolutely without exception, has had a perfectly valid hostname. What twisted kind of reality do you live in? ;-) And it's also beside the point - I'm not against such machines receiving mail, simply generating it. If they want to generate mail then is it so much to ask to have them relay it through a legit host? I don't think so. > Please do not intentionally damage global email. The system can only global email is already irretrievably damaged and quite possibly on its last legs. What we're talking about here are strategies for surviving in a post-spammer era and simply ignoring the problem and leaving things wide open is not the answer we're looking for here. Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 10:14:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA12239 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:14:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.uniserve.com (tom@shell.uniserve.com [204.244.210.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA12231 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:14:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (tom@localhost) by shell.uniserve.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA27383; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:11:31 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: shell.uniserve.com: tom owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:11:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom To: Jonathan Mini cc: Drew Derbyshire , current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing In-Reply-To: <19970724002446.59369@micron.efn.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Jul 1997, Jonathan Mini wrote: > What I'm saying is that my hostname doesn't have a DNS entry in the "outside > world" and therefore sending a message from my machine is automatically an > invalid host. THe only real option I have is to spoof the information that > sendmail sends out, ask my ISP for a addressless DNS entry (make a DNS entry > that has no A entry) or change my hostname to something valid. You are missing the point. It has nothing to do with your hostname, but the sender address you are using. Sendmail can send e-mail with any sender address you'd like. You should be using a valid sender address. Also, you are also losing mail. Mail servers bounce mail back to the envelope sender. This mail disappears. > I'm just a little annoyed at people who insist of having the sending machine > call itself a valid hostname, just to cut down on spam. NOOOO, not the hostname, the envelope sender address. They are different. You are missing the point. This problem is completely solvable, with what you have now. You just need to make a config change to your mail system. Tom From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 10:15:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA12298 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:15:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA12292 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:15:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA13131; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:13:53 -0700 (PDT) To: hosokawa@jp.FreeBSD.org cc: current@freebsd.org Subject: Well, I finally bought a test laptop and decided to jump in... Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:13:52 -0700 Message-ID: <13127.869764432@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Nothing special, just a little "Compaq Armada" which was on sale for $1100, but I also got a small selection of PCCARD periphs for it and intend to use it for testing and debugging the pccard support. Some initial impressions: When I first got it, I did what everybody else probably does and grabbed the 2.2.2 PAO floppy for installation (this laptop deliberately does not have a CDROM, so I need to do installs the hard way :-). It dutifully found my LINKSYS ethernet device and before long I was doing an NFS install from my mounted 2.2.2 CD. So far, so good. Now I'm up with 2.2.2 and the pccard support has, of course, disappeared so I'm patching in the PAO-970616 stuff and I'm noticing that some of the "patch it and make it work" Makefile stuff is a bit out of date (e.g. for a different version of the PAO stuff), but things are still reasonably straight-forward and I soon have a pccard enabled kernel of my own. Then comes the hassling with the contents of /etc/*pccard* and getting them updated, but after a few false starts and the insertion of a 10 second sleep into the file which starts pccardd so that it can have my ethernet device configured _before_ the other ifconfig stuff is run, it's working. Yay. Conclusions: This is harder than it needs to be and it really should be better integrated with the system - I understand that some of this stuff is "experimental", but where better to test and develop it than in FreeBSD's CVS repository? The same also goes for the PAO floppy installation hacks - it would be nice to bring this back into the mainstream install so that a boot-pao.flp image could be built automatically along with the 3.0 SNAPs which are currently rolling out of current.freebsd.org on those days when -current is buildable. ;-). I'm not sure if one generic boot.flp can be built with a "are you on a laptop?" question at the very beginning, but we should at least be able to build the floppy as an extra image. To all these ends, I'm willing to help test, integrate and import this stuff into -current but I need to know if the 2.2.2 stuff is a good starting place. Some things appear to no longer be quite in sync there, such as the shutdown mods which don't appear to use the fancier callout list that was introduced in 3.0, and I'm also fairly sure that a little editing will have to take place with the /etc files to bring them up to date. I'm also not sure about the current state of integration with the APM code - the patches there would not apply at all, leading me to believe that the APM bits in the 2.2.2 PAO kit are already in -current. Shall we get this stuff into 3.0? It's light-years better than what we have now, and had it not been for the PAO kit I would not have had an easy time of installing this machine at all. By not integrating the PAO stuff in all this time, we've denied laptop users the ability to install the 3.0 SNAPs and that's an unfortunate situation which should be fixed. Comments? Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 10:16:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA12374 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:16:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.uniserve.com (tom@shell.uniserve.com [204.244.210.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA12368 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:16:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (tom@localhost) by shell.uniserve.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA27389; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:13:27 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: shell.uniserve.com: tom owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:13:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom To: Jonathan Mini cc: Support user , Bruce Evans , freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: spam filter blocks legitimate sender In-Reply-To: <19970724003332.04757@micron.efn.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Jul 1997, Jonathan Mini wrote: > Support user stands accused of saying : > > G'day Bruce, > > > > > Zeta is said to be "over spam-rampant and hates us poor dynamic IP folks" :-). > > > > The fix, for the person trying to send the mail, is very easy ... simply > > use your real E-mail address in the "From" envelope header. > > Ahhh. But I do. The problem is that my hostname "micron.efn.org" doesn't > exist, even though my headers all refer to "j_mini@efn.org" (which is my real > email address). No. Envelope sender != header sender. Your headers are correct, but the envelope is not. The envelope information travels outside the message (via SMTP). You simply need to tell your mail system to use the correct envelope sender address, and it will work fine. Your hostname of micron.efn.org has NOTHING to do with it. Tom From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 10:20:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA12699 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:20:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.uniserve.com (tom@shell.uniserve.com [204.244.210.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA12692 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:20:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (tom@localhost) by shell.uniserve.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA27399; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:17:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: shell.uniserve.com: tom owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:17:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: Jonathan Mini , Drew Derbyshire , current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing In-Reply-To: <11424.869736228@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Jul 1997, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > What I'm saying is that my hostname doesn't have a DNS entry in the "outside > > world" and therefore sending a message from my machine is automatically an > > Which you simply need to fix. If you are in a situation where your In this case, it has nothing to do with the hostname. It the envelope sender that the mail server is rejecting. Simple mail config fix, and Jonathon will be able to send his mail. Tom From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 10:24:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA12941 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:24:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from biggusdiskus.flyingfox.com (biggusdiskus.flyingfox.com [206.14.52.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA12936 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:24:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jas@localhost) by biggusdiskus.flyingfox.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA11931; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:23:00 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:23:00 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Shankland Message-Id: <199707241723.KAA11931@biggusdiskus.flyingfox.com> To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing Cc: current@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Tony Kimball writes: > I beg to differ. Most machines which may validly receive email do *not* > have valid hostnames. Using the majority-minority rule, *you* lose. > That's reality. You've missed the point. You need to put a valid return address in the envelope sender, or else (among other things) you'll never get bounced mail back: mailers won't know how to return mail to you if there's a delivery problem. It's not hard, and it has nothing to do with dynamic IP addressing, or with whether your machine has a valid hostname. Do people send you email at all? What address do they use? Use that address as the envelope sender. Jim Shankland Flying Fox Computer Systems, Inc. From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 10:41:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA14177 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:41:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.calweb.com (mail.calweb.com [208.131.56.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA14172 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:41:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail.calweb.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id KAA17592; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:40:59 -0700 (PDT) X-SMTP: hello devnull from jflists@pop.calweb.com server @devnull.calweb.com ip 207.173.135.51 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970724103920.0094c100@pop.calweb.com> Warning: Unsolicited Commercial Email (UCE) will be returned to send in bulk X-Sender: jflists@pop.calweb.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:39:20 -0700 To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM, current@FreeBSD.ORG From: "jfesler@calweb.com" Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing In-Reply-To: <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> References: <199707241422.HAA00957@hub.freebsd.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 11:01 AM 7/24/97 -0500, Tony Kimball wrote: >I beg to differ. Most machines which may validly receive email do *not* >have valid hostnames. Using the majority-minority rule, *you* lose. >That's reality. Um - MX records. The host names in the email addresses, should have valid MX records, and as a fallback, a valid A record (preferably MX records though). Otherwise, the email address in question is non-replyable. And if it's non-replyable, it's not acceptable either. We actively block any SMTP session where the MAIL FROM: command lacks a valid DNS entry. If it takes >3 seconds to resolve, we assume it's slow/unreachable DNS. If it takes <3 seconds to resolve, we fail it immediately with no retrys, as in every case it's either a bad hostname, fake domain name, or a typo on someone's host portion of an email address. In every case, the error message says to contact postmaster@calweb.com for assistance, which is immune to the filter. Even UUCP sites are safe from our filter - they have MX records pointing to valid MX receivers that will take mail for their domain names.. -- Jason Fesler jfesler@calweb.com 'whois jf319' | When the chips are down Admin, CalWeb Internet Services www.calweb.com | The buffalo's empty Junk email returned in bulk; 1 cc to your postmaster | Junk mail probs? http://www.gigo.com/junkmail.htm | :-) From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 10:43:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA14362 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:43:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (fallout.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA14352 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:43:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jfieber@localhost) by fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA09634; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 12:42:24 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 12:42:24 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber To: Tony Kimball cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing In-Reply-To: <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Jul 1997, Tony Kimball wrote: > I beg to differ. Most machines which may validly receive email do *not* > have valid hostnames. Using the majority-minority rule, *you* lose. > That's reality. Maybe I missed something here, but there is a big difference between having a valid name for the posting machine and having a valid name in the return address. Rejecting mail for the latter case seems perfectly acceptable to me. Bouncing because of the former is a bit more problematic. -john From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 11:37:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA17204 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 11:37:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA17198 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 11:37:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA20779; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 12:37:35 -0600 (MDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 12:37:35 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199707241837.MAA20779@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: hosokawa@jp.freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Well, I finally bought a test laptop and decided to jump in... In-Reply-To: <13127.869764432@time.cdrom.com> References: <13127.869764432@time.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > $1100, but I also got a small selection of PCCARD periphs for it and > intend to use it for testing and debugging the pccard support. > > Some initial impressions: > > When I first got it, I did what everybody else probably does and > grabbed the 2.2.2 PAO floppy for installation (this laptop > deliberately does not have a CDROM, so I need to do installs the hard > way :-). It dutifully found my LINKSYS ethernet device and before > long I was doing an NFS install from my mounted 2.2.2 CD. So far, > so good. > > Now I'm up with 2.2.2 and the pccard support has, of course, > disappeared Huh? 2.2 has had pccard support since it's inception. Did you try using it? > of /etc/*pccard* and getting them updated, but after a few false > starts and the insertion of a 10 second sleep into the file which > starts pccardd so that it can have my ethernet device configured > _before_ the other ifconfig stuff is run, it's working. Yay. Huh? This shouldn't be necessary. > Conclusions: This is harder than it needs to be and it really should > be better integrated with the system - I understand that some of this > stuff is "experimental", but where better to test and develop it than > in FreeBSD's CVS repository? Certainly *NOT* in the repository. Read old email, or give me or Poul a call and we can discuss things. Nate (406) 457 9000 From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 11:52:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA17732 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 11:52:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hwcn.org (main.hwcn.org [199.212.94.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA17726 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 11:52:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from james.freenet.hamilton.on.ca (ac199@james.hwcn.org [199.212.94.66]) by hwcn.org (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id OAA28928; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:46:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (ac199@localhost) by james.freenet.hamilton.on.ca (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id OAA29061; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:46:32 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: james.freenet.hamilton.on.ca: ac199 owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:46:31 -0400 (EDT) From: Tim Vanderhoek X-Sender: ac199@james.freenet.hamilton.on.ca Reply-To: hoek@hwcn.org To: Tom cc: Warner Losh , current@FreeBSD.ORG, andreas@klemm.gtn.com Subject: Re: lpr/lpd changes In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, Tom wrote: > On Wed, 23 Jul 1997, Tim Vanderhoek wrote: > > > suggestion that apsfilter be feeped a little bit more to ask "lpd is > > currently disabled in /etc/rc.conf. Do you want to enable it? [Y/N]" > > But can't the user do that manually? Well, it could simply print up a warning "lpd is disabled in /etc/rc.conf -- you must turn it on before this package is of any use to you", but if it's going to do that it might as well go the rest of the way and offer to turn it on for the user. -- Outnumbered? Maybe. Outspoken? Never! tIM...HOEk From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 12:12:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA18422 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 12:12:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mercury.Sun.COM (mercury.Sun.COM [192.9.25.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA18410 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 12:12:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from East.Sun.COM ([129.148.1.241]) by mercury.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/mail.byaddr) with SMTP id MAA01783; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 12:12:08 -0700 Received: from suneast.East.Sun.COM by East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-5.3) id PAA18249; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:12:08 -0400 Received: from compound.east.sun.com by suneast.East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id PAA02098; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:12:06 -0400 Received: (from alk@localhost) by compound.east.sun.com (8.8.6/8.7.3) id OAA03585; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:12:05 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:12:05 -0500 (CDT) Reply-To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Message-Id: <199707241912.OAA03585@compound.east.sun.com> From: Tony Kimball MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: jfieber@indiana.edu Cc: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing References: <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> X-Face: O9M"E%K;(f-Go/XDxL+pCxI5*gr[=FN@Y`cl1.Tn Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Quoth John Fieber on Thu, 24 July: : : Maybe I missed something here, but there is a big difference : between having a valid name for the posting machine and having a : valid name in the return address. Rejecting mail for the latter : case seems perfectly acceptable to me. Bouncing because of the : former is a bit more problematic. Nah, I was the one missing something. I had not realized that the issue was limited to refusing a port connection from an unidentifiable peer. If that is the case, my point, while still valid and correct, is entirely mooted. (Unfortunately the spam countermeasure is almost entirely 'mooted' as well.) From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 12:59:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA20608 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 12:59:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.webspan.net (root@mail.webspan.net [206.154.70.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA20601 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 12:59:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.5]) by mail.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id PAA10105; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:59:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id PAA16490; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:59:16 -0400 (EDT) To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: chat@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Jul 1997 11:01:48 CDT." <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:59:16 -0400 Message-ID: <16488.869774356@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [ reply-to set to chat ] Tony Kimball wrote in message ID <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com>: > I beg to differ. Most machines which may validly receive email do *not* > have valid hostnames. Using the majority-minority rule, *you* lose. > That's reality. > > Please do not intentionally damage global email. The system can only > take so much damage before it will no longer be able to route around > it. It's kinda like freon and the ozone that way, only more catastrophic. Stop cyberpromo, nancynet, iemmc, etc from sending out so many CFC's then. Then ISPs wont have to take action to defend their systems. Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 13:07:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA21110 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 13:07:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.116.240]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA21105 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 13:07:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de (gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de [137.226.31.2]) by Campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE (RBI-Z-5/8.6.12) with ESMTP id WAA24836 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 22:07:43 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.8.5/8.6.9) id WAA14797 for freebsd-current@freefall.cdrom.com; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 22:07:29 +0200 (MEST) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 22:07:29 +0200 (MEST) From: Christoph Kukulies Message-Id: <199707242007.WAA14797@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de> To: freebsd-current@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: killall -9 tcsh panics Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On some of my May 26 -current machines users found out to panic the system using killall -9 tcsh. Does anyone see this in newer -currents? I'm about to rebuild the world and kernels right now on these systems. Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 14:05:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA24034 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:05:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA24029 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:05:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by mail.cdsnet.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id OAA11535; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:05:25 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:05:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Jaye Mathisen To: Poul-Henning Kamp cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: "Pentium Pro Bios Update API" ??? In-Reply-To: <1825.869733068@critter.dk.tfs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk There was some discussion of this in a major mag recently, I just can't remember which one. IIRC, there is some encryption stuff in there, and they're only releasing it to select people, in order to avoid problems with virii and such messing up the BIOS/microcode on the chip... Maybe it was on cnews.com, that sounds more like it. On Thu, 24 Jul 1997, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > > Anyone heard of this API before ? > > -- > Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. > http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. > whois: [PHK] | phk@tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. > Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. > From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 14:37:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA25506 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:37:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA25443 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:35:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA18195; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:26:12 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707242126.OAA18195@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:26:12 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, imp@rover.village.org, pechter@lakewood.com, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199707230143.LAA04467@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Jul 23, 97 11:13:14 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Well, it would help with the MIPS, PPC, and Alpha ports, for sure. > > The PReP spec requires a DOS partition table, though it allows 32 > > bit sector offsets. > > DOS partition table != FAT bootstrap filesystem. Motorolla PowerStak PPC 603/604, pre OpenFirmware == FAT. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 14:50:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA26402 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:50:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA26397 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:50:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA18268; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:46:27 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707242146.OAA18268@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:46:26 -0700 (MST) Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> from "Tony Kimball" at Jul 24, 97 11:01:48 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > : To sum it up: The problem of spammers using bogus names to hide behind > : is a far, far greater problem than not being able to send mail to > : those comparatively few individuals without valid hostnames, so using > : the "99.9% vs .1%" value rule, you simply lose. :-) > > I beg to differ. Most machines which may validly receive email do *not* > have valid hostnames. Using the majority-minority rule, *you* lose. > That's reality. Heh. But the filtering currently in place does not affect the ability of your bogus box to validly *receive* email. 8-). > Please do not intentionally damage global email. The system can only > take so much damage before it will no longer be able to route around > it. It's kinda like freon and the ozone that way, only more catastrophic. Please read the FAQ on www.sendmail.org. You should be claiming a return address of "name@domain" for the terminal (not necessarily externally visibile) mail exchanger. I have to warn you that several mail server products of which I'm aware actualy verify via getpeername/gethostbyaddr (RARP), and will reject your host anyway. To get around this problem, you need to specify your ISP's mail hast as a "smarter host" and your ISP must allow mail relay from you, as his customer. You will need to do this when (not if) you run into this type of filtering at some other site. In the current situation, you are only being rejected based on your claimed domain (either in your "HELO domain" argument or your "MAIL FROM:" argument, so correctly configuring your sendmail to claim that outbound mail from the inbound address which serves your maildrop is the correct thing to do. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 14:55:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA26643 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:55:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA26629 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:55:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA18282; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:50:16 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707242150.OAA18282@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing To: tom@uniserve.com (Tom) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:50:16 -0700 (MST) Cc: j_mini@efn.org, ahd@kew.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Tom" at Jul 24, 97 10:11:31 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > NOOOO, not the hostname, the envelope sender address. They are > different. You are missing the point. > > This problem is completely solvable, with what you have now. You just > need to make a config change to your mail system. Specifically, if you hand-hack your sendmail.cf like I do, add the lines: Cwlocalhost efn.org DMefn.org At the appropriate places, and life will be beautiful for you until someone starts checking your source IP address, if you are not connecting through a "smarter host". Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 15:17:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA27854 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:17:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA27846 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:17:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA14288; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:15:32 -0700 (PDT) To: Nate Williams cc: hosokawa@jp.freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Well, I finally bought a test laptop and decided to jump in... In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Jul 1997 12:37:35 MDT." <199707241837.MAA20779@rocky.mt.sri.com> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:15:32 -0700 Message-ID: <14284.869782532@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Now I'm up with 2.2.2 and the pccard support has, of course, > > disappeared > > Huh? 2.2 has had pccard support since it's inception. Did you try > using it? I should have been more explicit: The 2.2.2 support which is added by the PAO distribution disappeared when I left the boot-pao floppy, and the pccard support currently in 2.2.2 does _not_ support my ethernet card. > > of /etc/*pccard* and getting them updated, but after a few false > > starts and the insertion of a 10 second sleep into the file which > > starts pccardd so that it can have my ethernet device configured > > _before_ the other ifconfig stuff is run, it's working. Yay. > > Huh? This shouldn't be necessary. Like it or not, it is. rc.pccard runs pccardd in the background, and the rest of the startup *races* pccardd in its configuration of the cards. Before I added the sleep, my system would not come up properly on the net using my pre-existing ifconfig_ed0 entries (and I see no reason whatsoever why it shouldn't be able to do so - even if you expected the "insertion" behavior to bring up the interface later, it wouldn't be soon enough for things like ntpdate which run out of /etc/rc.netstart). > > Conclusions: This is harder than it needs to be and it really should > > be better integrated with the system - I understand that some of this > > stuff is "experimental", but where better to test and develop it than > > in FreeBSD's CVS repository? > > Certainly *NOT* in the repository. Read old email, or give me or Poul a > call and we can discuss things. I'll be happy to. Doing so now. :) Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 15:40:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA29131 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:40:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from biggusdiskus.flyingfox.com (biggusdiskus.flyingfox.com [206.14.52.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA29126 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:40:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jas@localhost) by biggusdiskus.flyingfox.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA14165; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:38:46 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:38:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Shankland Message-Id: <199707242238.PAA14165@biggusdiskus.flyingfox.com> To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM, terry@lambert.org Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I have to warn you that several mail server products of which I'm > aware actualy verify via getpeername/gethostbyaddr (RARP), and > will reject your host anyway. RARP? Or was that just a belch in mid-sentence :-)? Seems like it would be nice for those implementing such a policy to allow chopping of subdomain prefixes; e.g., if getpeername/gethostbyaddr return foo.bar.acme.com, and the envelope sender is joebob@acme.com, then it's OK. Or is that too loose? Hmm; pretty far afield for -current. I'll shut up now. Jim Shankland Flying Fox Computer Systems, Inc. From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 15:43:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA29217 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:43:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from byako.lovett.com (root@byako.lovett.com [193.195.45.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA29205 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:43:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ade by byako.lovett.com with esmtp (Exim 1.62 #1) id 0wrWab-0003Ik-00; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 23:42:29 +0100 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Well, I finally bought a test laptop and decided to jump in... Organization: Demon Internet Ltd. Reply-To: ade@demon.net In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Jul 1997 10:13:52 PDT." <13127.869764432@time.cdrom.com> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 23:42:29 +0100 From: Ade Lovett Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk "Jordan K. Hubbard" writes: > >Shall we get this stuff into 3.0? It's light-years better than what >we have now, and had it not been for the PAO kit I would not have had >an easy time of installing this machine at all. By not integrating >the PAO stuff in all this time, we've denied laptop users the ability >to install the 3.0 SNAPs and that's an unfortunate situation which >should be fixed. Yes yes yes yes yes :) I'm willing to commit some time and effort to this -- my own laptop is running 2.2.2-release + PAO patches, and there seems to be no way for me to move to 3.0-current -- I really don't want to have to go and buy a smallish uni-processor 'normal' PC in order to test uni-processor 3.0-current systems against their SMP big brothers. Should I wish to run -current on my laptop, I'm faced with the rather daunting prospect of applying/patching the current PAO every time my -current kernel tree gets updated.. this would seem to be a major waste of time and effort. Given that there appears to be a reasonable level of PAO support in 2.2.2-release, even without the extra PAO stuff, surely it makes sense to merge the PAO project into -current? -aDe -- Ade Lovett, Demon Internet Ltd. From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 15:58:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA29721 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:58:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mercury.Sun.COM (mercury.Sun.COM [192.9.25.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA29716 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:58:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from East.Sun.COM ([129.148.1.241]) by mercury.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/mail.byaddr) with SMTP id PAA13428; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 15:54:02 -0700 Received: from suneast.East.Sun.COM by East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-5.3) id SAA10082; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 18:53:59 -0400 Received: from compound.east.sun.com by suneast.East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id SAA08787; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 18:53:59 -0400 Received: (from alk@localhost) by compound.east.sun.com (8.8.6/8.7.3) id RAA01999; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 17:53:44 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 17:53:44 -0500 (CDT) Reply-To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Message-Id: <199707242253.RAA01999@compound.east.sun.com> From: Tony Kimball MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: jas@flyingfox.com Cc: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM, terry@lambert.org, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing References: <199707242238.PAA14165@biggusdiskus.flyingfox.com> X-Face: O9M"E%K;(f-Go/XDxL+pCxI5*gr[=FN@Y`cl1.Tn Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Quoth Jim Shankland on Thu, 24 July: : > I have to warn you that several mail server products of which I'm : > aware actualy verify via getpeername/gethostbyaddr (RARP), and : > will reject your host anyway. : : RARP? Or was that just a belch in mid-sentence :-)? : : Seems like it would be nice for those implementing such a policy to : allow chopping of subdomain prefixes; e.g., if getpeername/gethostbyaddr : return foo.bar.acme.com, and the envelope sender is joebob@acme.com, : then it's OK. Or is that too loose? And multiple names. MAIL FROM: jimbob@client.domain.com will often come from isp.domain.net. And non-Internet paths. What about networks that do not use symbolic host names? From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 16:23:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA01063 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:23:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA01051; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:22:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id IAA17838; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:52:35 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707242322.IAA17838@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: kernel make error ? In-Reply-To: from Chuck Robey at "Jul 24, 97 10:50:21 am" To: chuckr@glue.umd.edu (Chuck Robey) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:52:34 +0930 (CST) Cc: phk@dk.tfs.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, msmith@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Chuck Robey stands accused of saying: > On Thu, 24 Jul 1997, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > > > > > is this just my problem ? > > > > critter# make > > cc -c -O2 -pipe -Wreturn-type -Wcomment -Wredundant-decls -Wimplicit -Wnested-externs -Wstrict-prototypes -Wmissing-prototypes -Wpointer-arith -nostdinc -I- -I. -I../.. -I../../../include -DDIAGNOSTIC -DCOMPAT_43 -DFFS -DINET -DKERNEL -include opt_global.h ../../i386/isa/isa.c > > ../../i386/isa/isa.c:906: conflicting types for `isa_dmastatus' > > ../../i386/isa/isa_device.h:120: previous declaration of `isa_dmastatus' > > *** Error code 1 > > I was just about to send "nope, it compiles fine for me" when another ctm > update came in and saved me that embarrassment. The problem seems to have > come in from Mike Smith's recent commit of a fix from Luigi Rizzo > (probably from all the sound stuff he's working on). The new function Yeah, that one slipped past, which is surprising in that I tested that the kernel built and _then_ diffed it. *mumble* The prototype in isa_device.h should be int, not void. I'm at least an hour away from anywhere I could fix it. -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 16:25:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA01227 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:25:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA01218 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:25:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA18495; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:21:00 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707242321.QAA18495@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing To: jas@flyingfox.com (Jim Shankland) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:21:00 -0700 (MST) Cc: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM, terry@lambert.org, current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199707242238.PAA14165@biggusdiskus.flyingfox.com> from "Jim Shankland" at Jul 24, 97 03:38:46 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I have to warn you that several mail server products of which I'm > > aware actualy verify via getpeername/gethostbyaddr (RARP), and > > will reject your host anyway. > > RARP? Or was that just a belch in mid-sentence :-)? Reverse Address Resoloution Protocol. When someone connects to me, I can always geet the IP address they are connecting from. Using RARP, I can turn the address into a machine name, and compare it with what you tell me on the "HELO" and "MAIL FROM:" lines. The newest spammer hack for this is "configure your DNS to lie, too". The good thing about this particular hack is that hacking your DNS this way is prosecutable under interstate wire fraud statues. You can also get the name, and look it up again to see if you get the same address. This screws up the ability to use DNS rotors on heavily loaded mail servers, though, so it's a pain. A partial fix is to ensure that the servers are in the same address group, and apply the appropriate subnet mask before comparing them. This has the unfortunate side effect of not letting you put the servers at different sites. To combat that, you need to designate very low priority mail exchangers in the net, and compare the machine net with the mail exchanger listings (after masking the address). Alternately, your machine must have an MX record in DNS per IP alias or address from which it might originate traffic (or prefer a particular IP alias or source address). Given all these contortions in combination, and you have an effective anti-SPAM net, where it's possible to block access by particular source hosts without interrupting normal, desirable communications. This assumes that the DNS for a machine originating a mail connection is reachable -- an easy thing to ensure if each originating ("smarter") host is itself a secondary. Ideally, SPAM would be covered under "Junk FAX" laws, and none of this would be necessary because it would be uneconomical to send it to anyone who didn't want it. > Seems like it would be nice for those implementing such a policy to > allow chopping of subdomain prefixes; e.g., if getpeername/gethostbyaddr > return foo.bar.acme.com, and the envelope sender is joebob@acme.com, > then it's OK. Or is that too loose? That's too loose, for a large number of reasons. The primary one is the program "mailbomber" sold by Cyber Promotions, Inc.. And actually, since Jordan brought up the idea of anti-SPAMming the lists, it's not very off topic at all. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 16:32:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA01632 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:32:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA01624 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:32:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <52183(4)>; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:32:05 PDT Received: from localhost by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177512>; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:31:53 -0700 To: Garrett Wollman cc: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= , current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 'fetch' error with http, fix wanted In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Jul 97 07:22:13 PDT." <199707241422.KAA29714@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:31:40 PDT From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <97Jul24.163153pdt.177512@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Garrett Wollman wrote: >I would say that either their TCP or their Web server is busted. I wouldn't be surprised if it were the web server. It's common to want to try to detect clients that have disappeared, and there's a common (T/TCP-breaking) assumption that if you get a read EOF then the connection is gone and you should tear it down at the application level. The squid cache did this for a while, which is where I first noticed that T/TCP requests failed. Bill From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 16:35:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA01767 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:35:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA01762 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:35:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA18538; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:31:16 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707242331.QAA18538@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:31:16 -0700 (MST) Cc: jas@flyingfox.com, terry@lambert.org, current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199707242253.RAA01999@compound.east.sun.com> from "Tony Kimball" at Jul 24, 97 05:53:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > : Seems like it would be nice for those implementing such a policy to > : allow chopping of subdomain prefixes; e.g., if getpeername/gethostbyaddr > : return foo.bar.acme.com, and the envelope sender is joebob@acme.com, > : then it's OK. Or is that too loose? > > And multiple names. MAIL FROM: jimbob@client.domain.com will often > come from isp.domain.net. And non-Internet paths. > > What about networks that do not use symbolic host names? In both these cases, you must use a "smarter host" that explicitly allows your mail. There are two types of filtering wich occur at a smarter host: 1) Relay filtering Given your getpeername/gethostbyaddr[/gethostbyname] on initial connection to validate you are not a SPAMmer, and filtering on "HELO domain" and "MAIL FROM:" for the same reason, the "RCPT TO:" is checked to see if it is a local address, or one which must be forwarded. If it must be forwarded, only allowed source hosts are permitted to forward. For ISP's, this boils down to an IP address in the range of IP addresses that the ISP dynamically or statically assigns to their customers who pay for relay services. The intent is to prevent the relay of SPAM by a SPAMmer through your machine, making you the target of mailbombs, etc., by upset users (also denial of service for your legitimate customers, etc.). 2) Local address filtering Given the same verified source and address information, you determine if you want to accept the mail for a local user. This allows you to comply with court orders against ISP participation in ISP client harrasment by an outside person or agent. You may not want to prevent the outside agent from sending mail *through* your system, only *to* it. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 16:57:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA03091 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:57:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (Ilsa.StevesCafe.com [205.168.119.129]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA03032; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:56:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA23612; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 17:53:50 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199707242353.RAA23612@Ilsa.StevesCafe.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0gamma 1/27/96 From: Steve Passe To: Michael Smith cc: chuckr@Glue.umd.edu (Chuck Robey), phk@dk.tfs.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, msmith@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: kernel make error ? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:52:34 +0930." <199707242322.IAA17838@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 17:53:50 -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, > Yeah, that one slipped past, which is surprising in that I tested that > the kernel built and _then_ diffed it. *mumble* > > The prototype in isa_device.h should be int, not void. I'm at least > an hour away from anywhere I could fix it. I fixed it several hours ago, I was doing some other commits there anyways... -- Steve Passe | powered by smp@csn.net | Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 17:01:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA03386 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 17:01:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu [18.24.4.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA03378 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 17:01:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from wollman@localhost) by khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA13578; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 20:01:19 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 20:01:19 -0400 (EDT) From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <199707250001.UAA13578@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> To: Bill Fenner Cc: Garrett Wollman , =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= , current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 'fetch' error with http, fix wanted In-Reply-To: <97Jul24.163153pdt.177512@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> References: <199707241422.KAA29714@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> <97Jul24.163153pdt.177512@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < said: > want to try to detect clients that have disappeared, and there's a > common (T/TCP-breaking) assumption that if you get a read EOF then > the connection is gone and you should tear it down at the application > level. Not just Transaction TCP.... That's a pretty clear failure on their part in terms of the TCP spec as a whole. There's nothing preventing any Web browser from doing a shutdown() on the socket after it transmits its request. (Of course, a lot of TCPs don't do anything on shutdown(), but that's another story altogether.) -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame MIT, LCS, CRS, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 18:15:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA06467 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 18:15:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from terror.hungry.com (fn@terror.hungry.com [169.131.1.215]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA06460 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 18:15:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from fn@localhost) by terror.hungry.com (8.8.6/8.8.4) id SAA00768; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 18:15:19 -0700 (PDT) To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Reply-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing References: <199707242238.PAA14165@biggusdiskus.flyingfox.com> <199707242321.QAA18495@phaeton.artisoft.com> From: Faried Nawaz Date: 24 Jul 1997 18:15:18 -0700 In-Reply-To: terry@lambert.org's message of 24 Jul 1997 16:56:30 -0700 Message-ID: Lines: 18 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) writes: > > I have to warn you that several mail server products of which I'm > > aware actualy verify via getpeername/gethostbyaddr (RARP), and > > will reject your host anyway. > > RARP? Or was that just a belch in mid-sentence :-)? Reverse Address Resoloution Protocol. When someone connects to me, I can always geet the IP address they are connecting from. Using RARP, I can turn the address into a machine name, and compare it with what you tell me on the "HELO" and "MAIL FROM:" lines. RARP does hardware address/IP address translation. Redirected to chat. From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 18:18:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA06565 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 18:18:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from scanner.worldgate.com (scanner.worldgate.com [198.161.84.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA06560 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 18:18:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from znep.com (uucp@localhost) by scanner.worldgate.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with UUCP id TAA21396; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 19:18:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (marcs@localhost) by alive.znep.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA07496; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 19:17:53 -0600 (MDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 19:17:53 -0600 (MDT) From: Marc Slemko To: Bill Fenner cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 'fetch' error with http, fix wanted In-Reply-To: <97Jul24.163153pdt.177512@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Jul 1997, Bill Fenner wrote: > Garrett Wollman wrote: > >I would say that either their TCP or their Web server is busted. > > I wouldn't be surprised if it were the web server. It's common to I would considering that the server in question is Apache and I don't recall the code doing that at all. Not impossible, just unlikely. From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 18:29:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA06909 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 18:29:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA06904 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 18:29:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by mail.cdsnet.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id SAA25879 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 18:29:12 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 18:29:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Jaye Mathisen To: current@freebsd.org Subject: make world failure Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I supped 3.0-current at 7/24 at around 1400, and after a make includes; make world: sh /usr/src/lib/libedit/makelist -fc vi.h emacs.h common.h > fcns.c sh /usr/src/lib/libedit/makelist -bc /usr/src/lib/libedit/vi.c /usr/src/lib/libedit/emacs.c /usr/src/lib/libedit/common.c > help.c sh /usr/src/lib/libedit/makelist -e chared.c common.c el.c emacs.c fcns.c help.c hist.c key.c map.c parse.c prompt.c read.c refresh.c search.c sig.c term.c tty.c vi.c > editline.c cc -O -I. -I/usr/src/lib/libedit -c editline.c -o editline.o In file included from /usr/src/lib/libedit/chared.c:47, from editline.c:4: /usr/src/lib/libedit/el.h:103: help.h: No such file or directory *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 18:56:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA07836 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 18:56:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cs.iastate.edu (cs.iastate.edu [129.186.3.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA07831 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 18:56:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from popeye.cs.iastate.edu (popeye.cs.iastate.edu [129.186.3.4]) by cs.iastate.edu (8.8.5/8.7.1) with ESMTP id UAA05333 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 20:55:39 -0500 (CDT) Received: from localhost (ghelmer@localhost) by popeye.cs.iastate.edu (8.8.5/8.7.1) with SMTP id UAA00878 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 20:55:39 -0500 (CDT) X-Authentication-Warning: popeye.cs.iastate.edu: ghelmer owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 20:55:38 -0500 (CDT) From: Guy Helmer To: current@freebsd.org Subject: bsd.man.mk 1.23 breaks my "make world"? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk cvsupped as of 8:00pm CDT, make anywhere fails with errors: "/usr/share/mk/bsd.man.mk", line 10: Malformed conditional (!empty(MANBUILDCAT)) "/usr/share/mk/bsd.man.mk", line 21: Malformed conditional (!empty(MANBUILDCAT)) Dropping back to 1.22 bsd.man.mk make things work again... Guy Helmer, Computer Science Graduate Student - ghelmer@cs.iastate.edu Iowa State University http://www.cs.iastate.edu/~ghelmer From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 19:19:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA08574 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 19:19:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sumatra.americantv.com (sumatra.americantv.com [207.170.17.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA08569 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 19:19:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from right.PCS (right.PCS [148.105.10.31]) by sumatra.americantv.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA29261; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 21:19:07 -0500 (CDT) Received: (jlemon@localhost) by right.PCS (8.6.13/8.6.4) id VAA02839; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 21:19:51 -0500 Message-ID: <19970724211950.22892@right.PCS> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 21:19:50 -0500 From: Jonathan Lemon To: Terry Lambert Cc: Jim Shankland , Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing References: <199707242238.PAA14165@biggusdiskus.flyingfox.com> <199707242321.QAA18495@phaeton.artisoft.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.61.1 In-Reply-To: <199707242321.QAA18495@phaeton.artisoft.com>; from Terry Lambert on Jul 07, 1997 at 04:21:00PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Jul 07, 1997 at 04:21:00PM -0700, Terry Lambert wrote: > > > I have to warn you that several mail server products of which I'm > > > aware actualy verify via getpeername/gethostbyaddr (RARP), and > > > will reject your host anyway. > > > > RARP? Or was that just a belch in mid-sentence :-)? > > Reverse Address Resoloution Protocol. When someone connects to me, > I can always geet the IP address they are connecting from. Using > RARP, I can turn the address into a machine name, and compare it > with what you tell me on the "HELO" and "MAIL FROM:" lines. Uh, I think that was a brain fart. RARP deals with the hardware address, eg: the Ethernet address. You must have meant BIND. -- Jonathan From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 20:46:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA11685 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 20:46:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from micron.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA11598 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 20:45:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mini@localhost) by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA01769; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 20:43:00 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970724204300.14760@micron.efn.org> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 20:43:00 -0700 From: Jonathan Mini To: Michael Smith Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, imp@rover.village.org, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, pechter@lakewood.com, terry@lambert.org Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick Reply-To: Jonathan Mini References: <19970724004216.19551@micron.efn.org> <199707240815.RAA15276@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e In-Reply-To: <199707240815.RAA15276@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au>; from Michael Smith on Thu, Jul 24, 1997 at 05:45:32PM +0930 X-files: The Truth is Out There. Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Michael Smith stands accused of saying : > Jonathan Mini stands accused of saying: > > > > > > I can see people screaming about latency already. > > > > Well. My field is usally more sound and video and less netowrk > > performance. Every loss means less fps, and high timeouts for > > streaming devices can cause ruined output. So, for me, the latency > > isn't a big deal, more the amount of CPU cylces it takes. (thought > > latency hurts often too) > > Latency is just CPU cycles wasted on someone else's work 8) Too true. > > > That'd be invaluable; there is a plethora of data that can be obtained > > > from the BIOS, and it is senseless to try to reinvent the weel _if_ > > > it's possible to do it that way. > > > > Well, then. I will make sure I send my modifications into the FreeBSD core > > team to be commited. I agree abotu BIOS having lots of useful info, I jsut > > don't like its API. > > As long as I get a copy too 8) Heh. =) > > -- > ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ > ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ > ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ > ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ > ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ -- Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) ... bleakness ... desolation ... plastic forks ... From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 20:47:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA11709 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 20:47:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from micron.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA11704 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 20:47:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mini@localhost) by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA01782; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 20:47:53 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970724204753.18863@micron.efn.org> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 20:47:53 -0700 From: Jonathan Mini To: Stephen Roome Cc: Drew Derbyshire , current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing Reply-To: Jonathan Mini References: <19970724002446.59369@micron.efn.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e In-Reply-To: ; from Stephen Roome on Thu, Jul 24, 1997 at 11:33:57AM +0100 X-files: The Truth is Out There. Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Stephen Roome stands accused of saying : > On Thu, 24 Jul 1997, Jonathan Mini wrote: > > > What I'm saying is that my hostname doesn't have a DNS entry in the "outside > > world" and therefore sending a message from my machine is automatically an > > invalid host. THe only real option I have is to spoof the information that > > sendmail sends out, ask my ISP for a addressless DNS entry (make a DNS entry > > that has no A entry) or change my hostname to something valid. > > Two other _REAL_ options: > a) Find anyone on the net who is willing to let you have an email account > on their machine. That's how it always used to be done. Done a) doesn't help. Sending machine from me still hurts. > b)Get hold of someone who's willing to act as your mail relay, and > then change your email From: & Reply-To: addresses' to that host. > Then if you only have an IP number or whatever then the relay can just > forward it, or if you have nothing more than a dynamic IP then you can set > up sendmail to collect it for you from their machine. Did b) Doesn't help, (check my From: and Reply-To: headers -- they're valid) > c)Move to a reasonable ISP. > > Personally I'd go with c. Doing c), I will get a serious bandwidth upgrade (10T fiber to a "fiber netowrk that is all thatm uch powerful than poor me" to a T3. Off of said connection I reguarly have seen 400k/s from cdrom.com and such. As opposed to my poor 14.4k modem. (I _had_ a 28.8k, it broke. And I'm not upgrading for the same reason I'm just waiting on the whole DNS isssue) > > -- > Steve Roome - Vision Interactive Ltd. > Tel:+44(0)117 9730597 Home:+44(0)976 241342 > WWW: http://dylan.visint.co.uk/ -- Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) ... bleakness ... desolation ... plastic forks ... From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 21:17:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA12793 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 21:17:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA12788 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 21:17:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id NAA19413; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 13:47:06 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707250417.NAA19413@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: make world failure In-Reply-To: from Jaye Mathisen at "Jul 24, 97 06:29:11 pm" To: mrcpu@cdsnet.net (Jaye Mathisen) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 13:47:05 +0930 (CST) Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jaye Mathisen stands accused of saying: > > > I supped 3.0-current at 7/24 at around 1400, and after a make includes; > make world: > > sh /usr/src/lib/libedit/makelist -fc vi.h emacs.h common.h > fcns.c > sh /usr/src/lib/libedit/makelist -bc /usr/src/lib/libedit/vi.c > /usr/src/lib/libedit/emacs.c /usr/src/lib/libedit/common.c > help.c > sh /usr/src/lib/libedit/makelist -e chared.c common.c el.c emacs.c fcns.c > help.c hist.c key.c map.c parse.c prompt.c read.c refresh.c search.c sig.c > term.c tty.c vi.c > editline.c > cc -O -I. -I/usr/src/lib/libedit -c editline.c -o editline.o > In file included from /usr/src/lib/libedit/chared.c:47, > from editline.c:4: > /usr/src/lib/libedit/el.h:103: help.h: No such file or directory help.c is generated earlier in the build process (during the 'depend' phase). Go back through your log and see what went wrong. -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 22:30:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA15260 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 22:30:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from helmholtz.salk.edu (helmholtz.salk.edu [198.202.70.34]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA15255 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 22:30:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from helmholtz (helmholtz [198.202.70.34]) by helmholtz.salk.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA26744 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 22:30:22 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 22:30:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom Bartol X-Sender: bartol@helmholtz To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: make world failure Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi all, I just got the following error at the very beginning of make world: -------------------------------------------------------------- make world started on Thu Jul 24 22:16:32 PDT 1997 -------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------------------- Making hierarchy -------------------------------------------------------------- cd /usr/src && make hierarchy cd /usr/src/etc && make distrib-dirs "Makefile", line 149: 1 open conditional Fatal errors encountered -- cannot continue *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. I had just done a make update using cvsup moments before the time indicated above. Line 149 of /usr/src/etc/Makefile is: .include my /usr/share/mk/bsd.prog.mk is version: v 1.52 1997/06/28 08:14:10 pst I can't really tell what's wrong with the Makefiles but apparently my machine is telling me "Hey, Don't do that!" My most recent make world on the evening of July 21 worked just fine. Thanks, Tom From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 22:31:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA15304 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 22:31:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA15299 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 22:31:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id OAA20122; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 14:59:37 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707250529.OAA20122@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Well, I finally bought a test laptop and decided to jump in... In-Reply-To: <13127.869764432@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at "Jul 24, 97 10:13:52 am" To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 14:59:35 +0930 (CST) Cc: hosokawa@jp.FreeBSD.org, current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jordan K. Hubbard stands accused of saying: > > Now I'm up with 2.2.2 and the pccard support has, of course, > disappeared so I'm patching in the PAO-970616 stuff and I'm noticing I would have suggested _not_ taking this step initially. The LINKSYS card is, IIRC, an NE2000 clone which works just fine with the stock code. > enabled kernel of my own. Then comes the hassling with the contents > of /etc/*pccard* and getting them updated, but after a few false > starts and the insertion of a 10 second sleep into the file which > starts pccardd so that it can have my ethernet device configured > _before_ the other ifconfig stuff is run, it's working. Yay. Why is this an issue? There are hooks specifically in place for doing interface configuration on the fly as cards arrive and depart. Aren't they well-enough advertised? > Conclusions: This is harder than it needs to be and it really should > be better integrated with the system - I understand that some of this > stuff is "experimental", but where better to test and develop it than > in FreeBSD's CVS repository? Because, no insult to the Nomads intended, Nate didn't (and I agree with him) feel that bringing in a great deal of cruft was a good trade for the resultant functionality. I'm inclined to think that real PnP support is going to have somewhat of a drastic effect on the shape of PCCARD support and implementation too. > To all these ends, I'm willing to help test, integrate and import this > stuff into -current but I need to know if the 2.2.2 stuff is a good > starting place. Some things appear to no longer be quite in sync > there, such as the shutdown mods which don't appear to use the fancier > callout list that was introduced in 3.0, and I'm also fairly sure that > a little editing will have to take place with the /etc files to bring > them up to date. I'm also not sure about the current state of > integration with the APM code - the patches there would not apply at > all, leading me to believe that the APM bits in the 2.2.2 PAO kit are > already in -current. There were some fixes to the APM code done a little while back (by Garret?) which may be interfering here. You're spot-on the money wrt. the need to clean things up though. > Shall we get this stuff into 3.0? It's light-years better than what > we have now, and had it not been for the PAO kit I would not have had > an easy time of installing this machine at all. By not integrating > the PAO stuff in all this time, we've denied laptop users the ability > to install the 3.0 SNAPs and that's an unfortunate situation which > should be fixed. Ideally, I think no. Pragmatically, I suspect that you're right, and that until the code is right there in front of people, annoying them, nothing is going to happen. > Jordan -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 22:56:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA15990 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 22:56:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA15924 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 22:54:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id PAA20340; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 15:22:18 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707250552.PAA20340@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Boot file system idea! Slick In-Reply-To: <199707242126.OAA18195@phaeton.artisoft.com> from Terry Lambert at "Jul 24, 97 02:26:12 pm" To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 15:22:18 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, terry@lambert.org, imp@rover.village.org, pechter@lakewood.com, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert stands accused of saying: > > > Well, it would help with the MIPS, PPC, and Alpha ports, for sure. > > > The PReP spec requires a DOS partition table, though it allows 32 > > > bit sector offsets. > > > > DOS partition table != FAT bootstrap filesystem. > > Motorolla PowerStak PPC 603/604, pre OpenFirmware == FAT. On a good day, Terry, I can just discard your mail when you start to become annoying and irrelevant. Perhaps today isn't the best. This is the second message from you, in succession, in which you have discarded enough original context to sound resonable, whilst actually not being helpful at all. _Please_ refrain from trying to look smart to the detriment of the purpose of the discussion. In the first instance, very few device drivers require user account details. In the above instance, the trivial response is that the FAT filesystem requirement simply requires a slightly larger bootstrap, with a FAT tacked on the front. > Terry Lambert -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 23:28:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA17082 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 23:28:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.116.240]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA17075 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 23:28:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de (gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de [137.226.31.2]) by Campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE (RBI-Z-5/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA00449 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:28:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.8.5/8.6.9) id IAA17305; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:28:51 +0200 (MEST) Message-ID: <19970725082850.55882@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:28:50 +0200 From: Christoph Kukulies To: Christoph Kukulies Cc: freebsd-current@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: killall -9 tcsh panics References: <199707242007.WAA14797@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.75e In-Reply-To: <199707242007.WAA14797@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de>; from Christoph Kukulies on Thu, Jul 24, 1997 at 10:07:29PM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, Jul 24, 1997 at 10:07:29PM +0200, Christoph Kukulies wrote: > > On some of my May 26 -current machines users found out to > panic the system using killall -9 tcsh. > > Does anyone see this in newer -currents? > I'm about to rebuild the world and kernels right now on these > systems. > > Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de ...but it seems to be gone in -current of today. Well, these system were containing a vm patch which Doug Rabson sent me at that time to cure a weird NFS problem with core dumping of large images on NFS mounted directories. -- Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-current Thu Jul 24 23:29:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA17113 for current-outgoing; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 23:29:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mantar.slip.netcom.com (mantar.slip.netcom.com [192.187.167.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA17107 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 23:29:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dual (DUAL [192.187.167.136]) by mantar.slip.netcom.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id XAA03385; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 23:28:09 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970724232800.00e53d20@mantar.slip.netcom.com> X-Sender: guest@mantar.slip.netcom.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 23:28:00 -0700 To: Tom Bartol , freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG From: Manfred Antar Subject: Re: make world failure In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 10:30 PM 7/24/97 -0700, Tom Bartol wrote: > >Hi all, > >I just got the following error at the very beginning of make world: > >-------------------------------------------------------------- >make world started on Thu Jul 24 22:16:32 PDT 1997 >-------------------------------------------------------------- >-------------------------------------------------------------- > Making hierarchy >-------------------------------------------------------------- >cd /usr/src && make hierarchy >cd /usr/src/etc && make distrib-dirs >"Makefile", line 149: 1 open conditional >Fatal errors encountered -- cannot continue >*** Error code 1 > >Stop. >*** Error code 1 > >Stop. > > > >I had just done a make update using cvsup moments before the time >indicated above. Line 149 of /usr/src/etc/Makefile is: > >.include > > >my /usr/share/mk/bsd.prog.mk is version: v 1.52 1997/06/28 08:14:10 pst > >I can't really tell what's wrong with the Makefiles but apparently my >machine is telling me "Hey, Don't do that!" > >My most recent make world on the evening of July 21 worked just fine. > New bsd.man.mk is broken :( Manfed |==============================| | mantar@netcom.com | | Ph. (415) 681-6235 | |==============================| From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 00:12:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA18776 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 00:12:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mercury.Sun.COM (mercury.Sun.COM [192.9.25.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA18766 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 00:12:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from East.Sun.COM ([129.148.1.241]) by mercury.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/mail.byaddr) with SMTP id AAA27770; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 00:11:38 -0700 Received: from suneast.East.Sun.COM by East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-5.3) id DAA27417; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 03:11:35 -0400 Received: from compound.east.sun.com by suneast.East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id DAA15745; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 03:11:35 -0400 Received: (from alk@localhost) by pobox.com (8.8.6/8.7.3) id OAA03718; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:40:22 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:40:22 -0500 (CDT) Reply-To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Message-Id: <199707241940.OAA03718@pobox.com> From: Tony Kimball MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: nate@mt.sri.com Cc: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM, current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing References: <199707241422.HAA00957@hub.freebsd.org> <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> <199707241657.KAA20055@rocky.mt.sri.com> X-Face: O9M"E%K;(f-Go/XDxL+pCxI5*gr[=FN@Y`cl1.Tn Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Quoth Nate Williams on Thu, 24 July: : That's irrelevant. Most machines which send mail send via a machine : that *DOES* have valid hostnames, and the envelope uses that address. : That's the way email has always worked. Quite so. I had not correctly understood that the 'valid hostname' criterion was being limited to the MAIL FROM: field. I suppose (not having messed with sendmail.cf extensively for quite some time and not being familiar with the practices of those who do this filtering) that the checking can be easily deferred until after suitable extraction of the address have been performed, so that the DNS resolvable part is used. From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 00:12:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA18789 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 00:12:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mercury.Sun.COM (mercury.Sun.COM [192.9.25.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA18771 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 00:12:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from East.Sun.COM ([129.148.1.241]) by mercury.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/mail.byaddr) with SMTP id AAA27777; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 00:11:41 -0700 Received: from suneast.East.Sun.COM by East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-5.3) id DAA27423; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 03:11:38 -0400 Received: from compound.east.sun.com by suneast.East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id DAA15747; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 03:11:38 -0400 Received: (from alk@localhost) by pobox.com (8.8.6/8.7.3) id OAA03693; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:36:19 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:36:19 -0500 (CDT) Reply-To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Message-Id: <199707241936.OAA03693@pobox.com> From: Tony Kimball MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: sthaug@nethelp.no Cc: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing References: <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> <3014.869762940@verdi.nethelp.no> X-Face: O9M"E%K;(f-Go/XDxL+pCxI5*gr[=FN@Y`cl1.Tn Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Quoth sthaug@nethelp.no on Thu, 24 July: : Checking for bogus names as a way to exclude spam is only going to get : more popular. Better get used to it. Perhaps. It seems to have little purpose, however, so one may reasonably suspect that the practice will not prove desirable enough to recieve the support necessary for it to become widespread. From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 00:12:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA18809 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 00:12:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mercury.Sun.COM (mercury.Sun.COM [192.9.25.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA18777 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 00:12:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from East.Sun.COM ([129.148.1.241]) by mercury.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/mail.byaddr) with SMTP id AAA27783; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 00:11:43 -0700 Received: from suneast.East.Sun.COM by East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-5.3) id DAA27426; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 03:11:41 -0400 Received: from compound.east.sun.com by suneast.East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id DAA15749; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 03:11:41 -0400 Received: (from alk@localhost) by pobox.com (8.8.6/8.7.3) id OAA03669; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:34:55 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:34:55 -0500 (CDT) Reply-To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Message-Id: <199707241934.OAA03669@pobox.com> From: Tony Kimball MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: jkh@time.cdrom.com Cc: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing References: <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> <13063.869763579@time.cdrom.com> X-Face: O9M"E%K;(f-Go/XDxL+pCxI5*gr[=FN@Y`cl1.Tn Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Quoth Jordan K. Hubbard on Thu, 24 July: : > I beg to differ. Most machines which may validly receive email do *not* : > have valid hostnames. Using the majority-minority rule, *you* lose. : > That's reality. : : That's sure news to me - every machine I've dealt with over the last : couple of years, absolutely without exception, has had a perfectly : valid hostname. What twisted kind of reality do you live in? ;-) I was using 'valid hostname' to mean a physically connected numeric IP home, since that appeared to be the significance of the context. Large numbers of mail nodes on bitnet or profs or uucp or fidonet or vines or netware or exchange or what-have-you don't have that. Admittedly the numbers are decreasing, but if you don't count PC's and Mac's using occasional dialup-IP as having valid hostnames (as in many cases they do not by even the most forgiving of definitions, and in the remainder do not by some more rigorous definition) I do believe that the majority of email nodes are without 'valid hostnames'. From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 00:12:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA18826 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 00:12:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mercury.Sun.COM (mercury.Sun.COM [192.9.25.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA18788 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 00:12:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from East.Sun.COM ([129.148.1.241]) by mercury.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/mail.byaddr) with SMTP id AAA27791; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 00:11:47 -0700 Received: from suneast.East.Sun.COM by East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-5.3) id DAA27433; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 03:11:44 -0400 Received: from compound.east.sun.com by suneast.East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id DAA15751; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 03:11:44 -0400 Received: (from alk@localhost) by pobox.com (8.8.6/8.7.3) id OAA03645; Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:28:32 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 14:28:32 -0500 (CDT) Reply-To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Message-Id: <199707241928.OAA03645@pobox.com> From: Tony Kimball MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: jflists@calweb.com Cc: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing References: <199707241422.HAA00957@hub.freebsd.org> <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> <3.0.3.32.19970724103920.0094c100@pop.calweb.com> X-Face: O9M"E%K;(f-Go/XDxL+pCxI5*gr[=FN@Y`cl1.Tn Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Quoth jfesler@calweb.com on Thu, 24 July: : : We actively block any SMTP session where the MAIL FROM: command lacks a : valid DNS entry. Okay, this is another issue entirely. You are requiring that every piece of mail have a return path out to the Internet leaf node, yes? (Coming to an understanding with one correspondent evidently does not mean that one has come to understand all correspondents!) That does not guarantee a return path, because there may be further transports beyond the edge of the Internet, but probably gets you one in the vast majority of cases. As I understand it, you are only bouncing mail which cannot be replied *through* a valid MX or A. I'm guessing that you could probably construct a valid address from the various "Received:" headers in many such cases, though. I suppose this will help to reject casual spam, but it seems to me a misdirected effort, since most spam, particularly the large-volume stuff from the pros, will not get filtered in this way. The only way I can see to do that is to maintain a large kill list. From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 00:32:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA19649 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 00:32:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA19643 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 00:32:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id RAA27276; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 17:30:26 +1000 Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 17:30:26 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707250730.RAA27276@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: mrcpu@cdsnet.net, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Subject: Re: make world failure Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> /usr/src/lib/libedit/el.h:103: help.h: No such file or directory > >help.c is generated earlier in the build process (during the 'depend' >phase). Go back through your log and see what went wrong. The depend phase shouldn't be necessary. Many makefiles have complications to support this. See e.g. sh/Makefile for a verbose way of handling the problem of generated headers. Several object files really do depend on the generated headers, and there seems to be no better way of expression this than giving the dependencies explicity (making everything depend on .depend is no good, since everything would get rebuilt when .depend changes). Bruce From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 00:39:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA19953 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 00:39:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA19948 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 00:39:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id RAA21474; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 17:09:37 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707250739.RAA21474@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: make world failure In-Reply-To: <199707250730.RAA27276@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from Bruce Evans at "Jul 25, 97 05:30:26 pm" To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 17:09:36 +0930 (CST) Cc: mrcpu@cdsnet.net, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Bruce Evans stands accused of saying: > >> /usr/src/lib/libedit/el.h:103: help.h: No such file or directory > > > >help.c is generated earlier in the build process (during the 'depend' > >phase). Go back through your log and see what went wrong. > > The depend phase shouldn't be necessary. Many makefiles have > complications to support this. See e.g. sh/Makefile for a verbose way > of handling the problem of generated headers. Several object files > really do depend on the generated headers, and there seems to be no > better way of expression this than giving the dependencies explicity > (making everything depend on .depend is no good, since everything would > get rebuilt when .depend changes). I'm not sure I follow you here. It is not possible to run 'make depend' without generating the headers, as the depend will fail when the headers aren't found. Given that .depend is written into the object directory, I can't see anything wrong with the method that libedit uses. It's certainly a sight less disgusting than the way that sh/Makefile does it. > Bruce -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 01:24:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA21771 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 01:24:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA21766 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 01:24:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id SAA29154; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 18:21:05 +1000 Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 18:21:05 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707250821.SAA29154@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Subject: Re: make world failure Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, mrcpu@cdsnet.net Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >I'm not sure I follow you here. It is not possible to run 'make >depend' without generating the headers, as the depend will fail when >the headers aren't found. Running `make depend' is not a requirement for building sources, at least for the first build. Makefiles that require it are broken. Another bugfeature in libedit/Makefile is that `.depend' instead of `beforedepend' depends on the generated headers. .depend is a private target in bsd.dep.mk (if the default `depend' target is used), so it should not be used. OTOH, the default .depend target: depend: beforedepend .depend afterdepend _SUBDIR does not enforce the beforeness of `beforedepend' - it does not prevent `make -j2' from attempting to build beforedepend and .depend concurrently. Things work correctly when .depend depends on the generated headers. (I don't know how to enforce the required ordering. I tried to use a `beforeall' target in sh/Makefile to generate the headers before `all', but this failed for `make -j2'. `make' probably just needs a way to force building of a list of targets in list order.) >Given that .depend is written into the object directory, I can't see >anything wrong with the method that libedit uses. It's certainly a >sight less disgusting than the way that sh/Makefile does it. The method in sh/Makefile has the advantage of actually working. Bruce From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 02:15:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA23942 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 02:15:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cenotaph.snafu.de (gw-deadnet.snafu.de [194.121.229.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id CAA23930 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 02:14:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: by cenotaph.snafu.de from deadline.snafu.de using smtp id m0wrgSL-000KAgC; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 11:14:37 +0200 (CEST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #1) Received: by deadline.snafu.de id m0wrgSL-00046oC; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 11:14:37 +0200 (CEST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #1) Message-Id: From: root@deadline.snafu.de (Andreas S. Wetzel) Subject: COMPAT_LINUX broken in -current? To: current@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 11:14:37 +0200 (CEST) Organization: A world stranger than you have ever imagined. X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL13] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi! --- I recently had some problems running Linux binaries on top of my 3.0-current-SMP machine. My first thaught has been that this would be an SMP specific issue, but now that I have also tried it on a normal uniprocessor kernel which doesn't work either, I'm somewhat certain that it isn't only SMP specific. The background for this is the following: FreeBSD 3.0-current as of 07/19/97. Uniprocessor kernel with statically compiled in COMPAT_LINUX. The following Linux binaries: 1) xquake 2) xf86quake 3) qwsv All of the above binaries are ELF-32 bit LSB executables, Intel 80386, version 1, dynamically linked, stripped. None of them works, neither on a UP kernel, nor on a SMP kernel. All that happens after starting one of the above mentioned binaries is that the machine hangs up completely. Mouse in X11R6 doesn't move anymore, system does not react to ctrl-alt-del or debugger break (ctrl-prtscr) and no chance to login via serial terminal. The binary "xquake" used to run on FreeBSD SMP as of 02/09/97, "xf86quake" was reported to run on a friends FreeBSD 2.2-RELEASE machine and "qwsv" runs just at this moment on a 486DX box using FreeBSD 3.0-current as of 02/09/97 with LINUX lkm. Any help appreciated. Regards, Mickey -- (__) (@@) Andreas S. Wetzel Mail: mickey@deadline.snafu.de /-------\/ Utrechter Strasse 41 Web: http://cenotaph.snafu.de/ / | || 13347 Berlin Fon: <+4930> 456 066 90 * ||----|| Germany Fax: <+4930> 456 066 91/92 ~~ ~~ From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 03:01:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA25399 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 03:01:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bagpuss.visint.co.uk (bagpuss.visint.co.uk [194.207.134.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA25393 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 03:01:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dylan.visint.co.uk (dylan.visint.co.uk [194.207.134.180]) by bagpuss.visint.co.uk (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA00983; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 11:01:35 +0100 (BST) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 11:01:35 +0100 (BST) From: Stephen Roome Reply-To: Stephen Roome To: Jonathan Mini cc: Drew Derbyshire , current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing In-Reply-To: <19970724204753.18863@micron.efn.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Jul 1997, Jonathan Mini wrote: > Stephen Roome stands accused of saying : > > b)Get hold of someone who's willing to act as your mail relay, and > > then change your email From: & Reply-To: addresses' to that host. > > Then if you only have an IP number or whatever then the relay can just > > forward it, or if you have nothing more than a dynamic IP then you can set > > up sendmail to collect it for you from their machine. > > Did b) Doesn't help, (check my From: and Reply-To: headers -- they're valid) I'm not sure you follow me then, what I'm saying is that if you send mail from your machine via a relay that you have set up specifically to frob your mail envelopes into something that is reasonable and accepted by the rest of the world without problem then outgoing mail will work. You can use the domaintable feature to make returning mail come back to you properly from that box. It does require one box on the internet capable of managing your email for you correctly, however I know it works because I have quite a few clients using my dodgy hacks to sendmail in exactly this way. The machine they are coming from have Private IP addresses (usually in the 10./24 range) and absolutely ridiculous domain names set up internally, like .intranet.zone. . Works a treat, but you do need to carefully read the sendmail docs. > > c)Move to a reasonable ISP. > > Personally I'd go with c. > Doing c), I will get a serious bandwidth upgrade (10T fiber to a "fiber > netowrk that is all thatm uch powerful than poor me" to a T3. Off of said > connection I reguarly have seen 400k/s from cdrom.com and such. As opposed to > my poor 14.4k modem. (I _had_ a 28.8k, it broke. And I'm not upgrading for the > same reason I'm just waiting on the whole DNS isssue) Sensible choice. =) Although I missed the fourth option which is to get someone else to come in and set the relaying mail configuration I'm suggesting =) -- Steve Roome - Vision Interactive Ltd. Tel:+44(0)117 9730597 Home:+44(0)976 241342 WWW: http://dylan.visint.co.uk/ From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 03:31:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA26492 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 03:31:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hydrogen.nike.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA26487 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 03:31:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.nike.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA00785; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 03:31:09 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970725033109.17747@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 03:31:09 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Cc: jflists@calweb.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing References: <199707241422.HAA00957@hub.freebsd.org> <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> <3.0.3.32.19970724103920.0094c100@pop.calweb.com> <199707241928.OAA03645@pobox.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199707241928.OAA03645@pobox.com>; from Tony Kimball on Thu, Jul 24, 1997 at 02:28:32PM -0500 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Tony Kimball scribbled this message on Jul 24: > Quoth jfesler@calweb.com on Thu, 24 July: > : > : We actively block any SMTP session where the MAIL FROM: command lacks a > : valid DNS entry. > > Okay, this is another issue entirely. You are requiring that every > piece of mail have a return path out to the Internet leaf node, yes? > (Coming to an understanding with one correspondent evidently does > not mean that one has come to understand all correspondents!) > That does not guarantee a return path, because there may be further > transports beyond the edge of the Internet, but probably gets you one > in the vast majority of cases. ok... well... I was starting to read up on the RFC's and all you anti-spammers needed to do was quote rfc821 which talks about the specification for the MAIL FROM: line... it reads as follows: The first step in the procedure is the MAIL command. The contains the source mailbox. MAIL FROM: This command tells the SMTP-receiver that a new mail transaction is starting and to reset all its state tables and buffers, including any recipients or mail data. It gives the reverse-path which can be used to report errors. If accepted, the receiver-SMTP returns a 250 OK reply. as you can see, you have EVER right to reject the mail when the reverse-path is invalid... had someone quoted this long ago, I would of shut up... but I was ignorant of the rfc, so I was thinking it was valid... > As I understand it, you are only bouncing mail which cannot be replied > *through* a valid MX or A. I'm guessing that you could probably > construct a valid address from the various "Received:" headers in many > such cases, though. no, they are bouncing mail which doesn't have a valid return-path... and actualy, you are required to specify this... > I suppose this will help to reject casual spam, but it seems to me a > misdirected effort, since most spam, particularly the large-volume > stuff from the pros, will not get filtered in this way. The only > way I can see to do that is to maintain a large kill list. I agree... but I'm going to look at better ways of handling this.. like possibly teaching a machine about our "subdomains" so that we can have addresses like: "jmg@hydrogen.nike.efn.org@resnet.uoregon.edu" which is perfectly valid from the mail stand point... as it is parsed as " @ domain"... plus I have tested this with godzilla.zeta.org.au, and it was successful in accepting the connection... either that or I'll implement uucp from a host... which might be in the long run better... I'll just have to do research and decide... guess I need to remeber to RTFRFC... :) happy emailing to all... -- John-Mark Gurney Modem/FAX: +1 541 683 6954 Cu Networking Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 05:23:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id FAA00175 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 05:23:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from veda.is (root@spiral.veda.is [193.4.230.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA00164 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 05:23:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ubiq.veda.is (adam@ubiq.veda.is [193.4.230.60]) by veda.is (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA03762; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:23:03 GMT From: Adam David Received: (from adam@localhost) by ubiq.veda.is (8.8.6/8.8.5) id MAA15101; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:23:01 GMT Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:23:01 GMT Message-Id: <199707251223.MAA15101@ubiq.veda.is> To: mrcpu@cdsnet.NET (Jaye Mathisen) Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Would you trust -current now? Newsgroups: list.freebsd.current References: X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 #2 (NOV) Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >I can't wait any longer for 2.2.2 to get fixed, I either gotta switch to >what I hope is a fixed 3.0 kernel, or move to a different OS. >Would you trust -current on a moderately highvolume news server >with NFS? I'd trust it except I'm not sure about INN on any platform, and watch out for NFS irregularities. -- Adam David From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 05:31:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id FAA00668 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 05:31:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from veda.is (root@spiral.veda.is [193.4.230.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA00661 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 05:31:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ubiq.veda.is (adam@ubiq.veda.is [193.4.230.60]) by veda.is (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA03801; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:31:00 GMT From: Adam David Received: (from adam@localhost) by ubiq.veda.is (8.8.6/8.8.5) id MAA15139; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:30:58 GMT Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:30:58 GMT Message-Id: <199707251230.MAA15139@ubiq.veda.is> To: ahd@kew.COM (Drew Derbyshire) Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 8 bit/16 bit ethernet cards References: <199707211859.OAA10249@pandora.hh.kew.com> X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 #2 (NOV) Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Go with ed0 at IRQ 10/port x280, that's what I've been moving my >cards to. :-) (And punt ed1, it's just confusing to have the same >device twice by default.) 10/0x300 is available as a jumper setting. -- Adam David From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 05:38:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id FAA00955 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 05:38:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from icicle.winternet.com (adm@icicle.winternet.com [198.174.169.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA00949 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 05:38:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from adm@localhost) by icicle.winternet.com (8.7.5/8.7.5) id HAA13466; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 07:38:38 -0500 (CDT) Posted-Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 07:38:38 -0500 (CDT) Received: from tundra.winternet.com(198.174.169.11) by icicle.winternet.com via smap (V2.0) id xma013443; Fri, 25 Jul 97 07:38:13 -0500 Received: from localhost (mestery@localhost) by tundra.winternet.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id HAA17446; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 07:38:13 -0500 (CDT) X-Authentication-Warning: tundra.winternet.com: mestery owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 07:38:13 -0500 (CDT) From: Kyle Mestery To: "Andreas S. Wetzel" cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: COMPAT_LINUX broken in -current? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 25 Jul 1997, Andreas S. Wetzel wrote: > > I recently had some problems running Linux binaries on top of my > 3.0-current-SMP machine. My first thaught has been that this would > be an SMP specific issue, but now that I have also tried it on a > normal uniprocessor kernel which doesn't work either, I'm somewhat > certain that it isn't only SMP specific. The background for this is > the following: > > FreeBSD 3.0-current as of 07/19/97. > Uniprocessor kernel with statically compiled in COMPAT_LINUX. > The following Linux binaries: > I am having similar problems, and I have tried both uniprocessor and smp kernels, and have the same result with both. My machine is FreeBSD 3.0-current SMP as of 7/23/97. SMP Kernel with the Linux LKM module, not static. And I am using the i386-ELF-xquake-1.06 binary: hope.winternet.com$ file i386-ELF-xquake-1.06 i386-ELF-xquake-1.06: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, Intel 80386, version 1, dynamically linked, stripped > 1) xquake > 2) xf86quake > 3) qwsv > > All of the above binaries are ELF-32 bit LSB executables, Intel 80386, > version 1, dynamically linked, stripped. None of them works, neither on > a UP kernel, nor on a SMP kernel. All that happens after starting > one of the above mentioned binaries is that the machine hangs up completely. > Mouse in X11R6 doesn't move anymore, system does not react to ctrl-alt-del > or debugger break (ctrl-prtscr) and no chance to login via serial terminal. > My machine has a somewhat similar problem. After starting the quake binary, it locks up tight and then 2 seconds later reboots. Might the difference here be the fact that I am using the LKM? I have not tried to break into the debugger yet, but will tonite. > The binary "xquake" used to run on FreeBSD SMP as of 02/09/97, "xf86quake" > was reported to run on a friends FreeBSD 2.2-RELEASE machine and "qwsv" > runs just at this moment on a 486DX box using FreeBSD 3.0-current as of > 02/09/97 with LINUX lkm. > Not sure when mine last ran. I know the binaries that Andreas mentioned ran on my 2.2-stable machine when I had that one running, nad that was less than one month ago. Does anyone have a clue on this? Kyle Mestery StorageTek's Network Systems Group 7600 Boone Ave. N., Brooklyn Park, MN 55428 mesteka@anubis.network.com, mestery@winternet.com From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 07:43:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA05864 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 07:43:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id HAA05855 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 07:43:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org [127.0.0.1] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wrlaD-0000ZL-00; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:43:05 -0600 To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing Cc: current@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Jul 1997 11:01:48 CDT." <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> References: <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> <199707241422.HAA00957@hub.freebsd.org> Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:43:04 -0600 From: Warner Losh Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> Tony Kimball writes: : I beg to differ. Most machines which may validly receive email do *not* : have valid hostnames. Using the majority-minority rule, *you* lose. : That's reality. Excuse me? I've *NEVER* seen that statisic in the 10 years that I've been on the net. Do you have some study that would back up this claim? At best I think that many machines might not have globally valid names, but they send their mail messages using globally valid names. Many large companies will have hundreds of internal machines, but they all go through one smart host that handles all the mail for them. They have been doing this for years, otherwise a majority of email on this list and others would not have a valid reply address, which is only the case in << 1% of the mail I reply to. Warner From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 07:50:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA06183 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 07:50:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id HAA06154 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 07:49:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org [127.0.0.1] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wrlfj-0000Zf-00; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:48:47 -0600 To: Terry Lambert Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing Cc: jas@flyingfox.com (Jim Shankland), Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM, current@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Jul 1997 16:21:00 PDT." <199707242321.QAA18495@phaeton.artisoft.com> References: <199707242321.QAA18495@phaeton.artisoft.com> Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:48:47 -0600 From: Warner Losh Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199707242321.QAA18495@phaeton.artisoft.com> Terry Lambert writes: : Reverse Address Resoloution Protocol. When someone connects to me, : I can always geet the IP address they are connecting from. Using : RARP, I can turn the address into a machine name, and compare it : with what you tell me on the "HELO" and "MAIL FROM:" lines. Terry, that's complete bullshit. RARP is a protocol used on the ethernet for booting workstations ask for their IP address. Much like ARP. Turning IP -> DNS name is just a DNS lookup. Warner From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 08:02:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA06876 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:02:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mercury.Sun.COM (mercury.Sun.COM [192.9.25.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA06871; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:02:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from East.Sun.COM ([129.148.1.241]) by mercury.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/mail.byaddr) with SMTP id IAA07710; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:02:16 -0700 Received: from suneast.East.Sun.COM by East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-5.3) id LAA24082; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 11:02:16 -0400 Received: from compound.east.sun.com by suneast.East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id LAA24175; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 11:02:15 -0400 Received: (from alk@localhost) by compound.east.sun.com (8.8.6/8.7.3) id KAA04543; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 10:02:14 -0500 (CDT) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 10:02:14 -0500 (CDT) Reply-To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Message-Id: <199707251502.KAA04543@compound.east.sun.com> From: Tony Kimball MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: imp@rover.village.org Cc: chat@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing References: <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> <199707241422.HAA00957@hub.freebsd.org> X-Face: O9M"E%K;(f-Go/XDxL+pCxI5*gr[=FN@Y`cl1.Tn Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Quoth Warner Losh on Fri, 25 July: : Excuse me? I've *NEVER* seen that statisic in the 10 years that I've : been on the net. Do you have some study that would back up this : claim? At best I think that many machines might not have globally : valid names, but they send their mail messages using globally valid : names. Many large companies will have hundreds of internal machines, : but they all go through one smart host that handles all the mail for : email on this list and others would not have a valid reply address, : which is only the case in << 1% of the mail I reply to. [Note: Moving to chat...] Um, I would point out that one wouldn't be on an Internet mailing list unless one were on the Internet. Most computers have nothing to do with the Internet. There are a large number of email facilities on mvs, vm, vines, netware, fidonet, uucp, appletalk, or what-have-you. My 'majority' figure may become a 'minority' in the not-to-distant future, but the I'm *guessing* that the majority of email-capable systems are still not Internetworked. Of course this depends on your definition of Internetworked, and of email-capable. I'm trying to use colloquial meanings here. From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 08:06:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA07098 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:06:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shale.csir.co.za (shale.csir.co.za [146.64.46.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA07093 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:06:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from reg@localhost) by shale.csir.co.za (8.8.6/8.8.5) id QAA00816; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 16:31:40 +0200 (SAT) Message-ID: <19970725163137.37967@shale.csir.co.za> Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 16:31:37 +0200 From: Jeremy Lea To: Bruce Evans Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, current@FreeBSD.ORG, mrcpu@cdsnet.net Subject: Re: make world failure References: <199707250821.SAA29154@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76 In-Reply-To: <199707250821.SAA29154@godzilla.zeta.org.au>; from Bruce Evans on Fri, Jul 25, 1997 at 06:21:05PM +1000 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi... On Fri, Jul 25, 1997 at 06:21:05PM +1000, Bruce Evans wrote: > Michael Smith wrote: > >I'm not sure I follow you here. It is not possible to run 'make > >depend' without generating the headers, as the depend will fail when > >the headers aren't found. > > Running `make depend' is not a requirement for building sources, at > least for the first build. Makefiles that require it are broken. The only two places where make depend doesn't work are: *** ./lib/libedit/Makefile.orig Mon Jun 30 17:10:47 1997 --- ./lib/libedit/Makefile Fri Jul 25 11:21:52 1997 *************** *** 55,62 **** help.h: ${ASRC} makelist sh ${.CURDIR}/makelist -bh ${ASRC} > ${.TARGET} ! editline.c: ${OSRCS} ! sh ${.CURDIR}/makelist -e ${.ALLSRC:T} > ${.TARGET} .depend: vi.h emacs.h common.h fcns.h help.h help.c --- 55,62 ---- help.h: ${ASRC} makelist sh ${.CURDIR}/makelist -bh ${ASRC} > ${.TARGET} ! editline.c: ${OSRCS} help.h ! sh ${.CURDIR}/makelist -e ${OSRCS} > ${.TARGET} .depend: vi.h emacs.h common.h fcns.h help.h help.c (You could change the .depend > beforedepend) and... *** ./eBones/usr.sbin/kadmind/Makefile.orig Thu Jul 3 16:44:25 1997 --- ./eBones/usr.sbin/kadmind/Makefile Fri Jul 25 11:22:06 1997 *************** *** 1,7 **** # $Id: Makefile,v 1.7 1996/07/30 21:13:17 markm Exp $ PROG= kadmind ! SRCS= admin_server.c kadm_funcs.c kadm_ser_wrap.c kadm_server.c CFLAGS+=-DPOSIX -I${.CURDIR}/../../lib/libkadm -I${KADMOBJDIR} -I${KRBOBJDIR} -DKERBEROS DPADD= ${LIBKDB} ${LIBKRB} ${LIBDES} LDADD+= -L${KADMOBJDIR} -lkadm -L${KDBOBJDIR} -lkdb -L${KRBOBJDIR} -lkrb \ --- 1,8 ---- # $Id: Makefile,v 1.7 1996/07/30 21:13:17 markm Exp $ PROG= kadmind ! SRCS= admin_server.c kadm_funcs.c kadm_ser_wrap.c kadm_server.c \ ! ${KADMOBJDIR}/kadm_err.h ${KRBOBJDIR}/krb_err.h CFLAGS+=-DPOSIX -I${.CURDIR}/../../lib/libkadm -I${KADMOBJDIR} -I${KRBOBJDIR} -DKERBEROS DPADD= ${LIBKDB} ${LIBKRB} ${LIBDES} LDADD+= -L${KADMOBJDIR} -lkadm -L${KDBOBJDIR} -lkdb -L${KRBOBJDIR} -lkrb \ I'm not sure if this second fix is right, since it looks like there are rules to make the dependencies in this file work, but they dont seem to have any effect. usr.bin/tn3270 is also broken, but I cant think of a clean fix for it... it most likely needs a beforeall target of some sort, or a bootstrap target or something... There's also a bunch of other bogons that I've found, but I haven't finished that job yet. -Jeremy -- .sig.gz From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 08:37:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA08659 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:37:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ns.tar.com (ns.tar.com [204.95.187.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA08653 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:37:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ppro.tar.com (ppro.tar.com [204.95.187.9]) by ns.tar.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA28194 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 10:37:30 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199707251537.KAA28194@ns.tar.com> From: "Richard Seaman, Jr." To: "freebsd-current@freebsd.org" Date: Fri, 25 Jul 97 10:37:27 -0500 Reply-To: "Richard Seaman, Jr." Priority: Normal X-Mailer: PMMail 1.92 For OS/2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Whats happened to ping? Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It seems that there have recently been changes to the sematics of "ping -c N". Unless I'm mistaken, the old behavior was that "ping -c N" meant try to send N packets. Now it means keep trying until N packets are actually sent. The practical effect of this is that "ping -c N" might loop endlessly, if, for example, the network is down and the sendto fails. An actual example: # ping -c 1 -n -q 204.95.160.35 PING 204.95.160.35 (204.95.160.35): 56 data bytes ping: sendto: Network is down ping: sendto: Network is down ping: sendto: Network is down ping: sendto: Network is down ping: sendto: Network is down ping: sendto: Network is down ping: sendto: Network is down ping: sendto: Network is down ping: sendto: Network is down ping: sendto: Network is down ping: sendto: Network is down ping: sendto: Network is down ping: sendto: Network is down ping: sendto: Network is down ping: sendto: Network is down ping: sendto: Network is down ping: sendto: Network is down ping: sendto: Network is down ^C --- 204.95.160.35 ping statistics --- 0 packets transmitted, 0 packets received, The problem with this is that if you put "ping -c N" in a script, expecting it to return at some point, you can now effectively have your script hang. Which, of course, is what happened to me. While I'm sure there are good reasons for the change, I wonder: a) If it wouldn't be a good idea to leave the "-c" option with the old meaning, and have a new option for the new behaviour b) If you don't restore the old meaning, a lot of people who depend on ping to return when using the "-c" option will get burned when they upgrade to current. Now, if I'm the only one affected, I can certainly work around this new behaviour. But, I wonder if there aren't others in the same boat. From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 08:54:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA09493 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:54:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA09485 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 08:53:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id BAA10315; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 01:49:38 +1000 Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 01:49:38 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707251549.BAA10315@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, reg@shale.csir.co.za Subject: Re: make world failure Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, mrcpu@cdsnet.net, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> Running `make depend' is not a requirement for building sources, at >> least for the first build. Makefiles that require it are broken. > >The only two places where make depend doesn't work are: Thanks, I started to test this, but got context-switched after `make obj'. >*** ./lib/libedit/Makefile.orig Mon Jun 30 17:10:47 1997 >--- ./lib/libedit/Makefile Fri Jul 25 11:21:52 1997 >*************** >*** 55,62 **** > help.h: ${ASRC} makelist > sh ${.CURDIR}/makelist -bh ${ASRC} > ${.TARGET} > >! editline.c: ${OSRCS} >! sh ${.CURDIR}/makelist -e ${.ALLSRC:T} > ${.TARGET} > > .depend: vi.h emacs.h common.h fcns.h help.h help.c > >--- 55,62 ---- > help.h: ${ASRC} makelist > sh ${.CURDIR}/makelist -bh ${ASRC} > ${.TARGET} > >! editline.c: ${OSRCS} help.h >! sh ${.CURDIR}/makelist -e ${OSRCS} > ${.TARGET} > > .depend: vi.h emacs.h common.h fcns.h help.h help.c > >(You could change the .depend > beforedepend) and... Hmm, this only takes a line or two to fix because the build process is disgusting (editline.c includes most of the other .c file, so only editline.o depends on the generated headers). Your fix isn't quite right. It's editline.o, not editline.c, that depends on the generated headers, and it depends on all of them, so the fix should be to add a line: --- editline.o: vi.h emacs.h common.h fcns.h help.h --- The headers here are in the same order as in the .depend line. It is the same as the build order for `make -j1', but the first 3 generated headers are independent so it would be more natural to put them in alphabetical order. Bruce From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 09:36:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA11606 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 09:36:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from austin.polstra.com (austin.polstra.com [206.213.73.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA11597 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 09:36:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from austin.polstra.com (jdp@localhost) by austin.polstra.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA00656 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 09:36:27 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199707251636.JAA00656@austin.polstra.com> To: current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Whats happened to ping? In-Reply-To: <199707251537.KAA28194@ns.tar.com> References: <199707251537.KAA28194@ns.tar.com> Organization: Polstra & Co., Seattle, WA Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 09:36:27 -0700 From: John Polstra Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > It seems that there have recently been changes to the sematics of > "ping -c N". Unless I'm mistaken, the old behavior was that "ping -c N" > meant try to send N packets. Now it means keep trying until N packets > are actually sent. > > The practical effect of this is that "ping -c N" might loop endlessly, > if, for example, the network is down and the sendto fails. Also, if ping isn't receiving any replies, it's impossible to kill it with a simple keyboard interrupt (SIGINT). I don't think that was the case before. -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-knowledge is always bad news." -- John Barth From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 09:58:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA12844 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 09:58:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pahtoh.cwu.edu (root@pahtoh.cwu.edu [198.104.65.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA12839 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 09:57:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from opus.cts.cwu.edu (skynyrd@opus.cts.cwu.edu [198.104.92.71]) by pahtoh.cwu.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA00141; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 09:57:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (skynyrd@localhost) by opus.cts.cwu.edu (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA21210; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 09:57:57 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 09:57:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Chris Timmons To: Kyle Mestery cc: "Andreas S. Wetzel" , current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: COMPAT_LINUX broken in -current? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Although you're using the lkm, do you still have COMPAT_LINUX in your config file? It might be interesting to see if removing that helps. acroread seems to run OK here on my uniprocessor P90 -current using the lkm. I don't have sound available on that machine at the moment to try multimedia stuff like you're running, which might make all the difference in the world. -Chris From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 10:30:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA14569 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 10:30:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from icicle.winternet.com (adm@icicle.winternet.com [198.174.169.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA14555 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 10:30:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from adm@localhost) by icicle.winternet.com (8.7.5/8.7.5) id MAA15388; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:26:45 -0500 (CDT) Posted-Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:26:45 -0500 (CDT) Received: from tundra.winternet.com(198.174.169.11) by icicle.winternet.com via smap (V2.0) id xma015341; Fri, 25 Jul 97 12:26:21 -0500 Received: from localhost (mestery@localhost) by tundra.winternet.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id MAA20675; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:26:20 -0500 (CDT) X-Authentication-Warning: tundra.winternet.com: mestery owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:26:20 -0500 (CDT) From: Kyle Mestery To: Chris Timmons cc: "Andreas S. Wetzel" , current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: COMPAT_LINUX broken in -current? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 25 Jul 1997, Chris Timmons wrote: > Although you're using the lkm, do you still have COMPAT_LINUX in your > config file? It might be interesting to see if removing that helps. > acroread seems to run OK here on my uniprocessor P90 -current using the > lkm. I don't have sound available on that machine at the moment to try > multimedia stuff like you're running, which might make all the difference > in the world. > Actually, I did not have the COMPAT_LINUX in my kernel, simply using the linux lkm. Also, sound never worked on the quake binary. Strange, but I am also running the linux version port of netscape4 and that runs just fine. Kyle Mestery StorageTek's Network Systems Group 7600 Boone Ave. N., Brooklyn Park, MN 55428 mesteka@anubis.network.com, mestery@winternet.com From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 10:43:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA15123 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 10:43:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from austin.polstra.com (austin.polstra.com [206.213.73.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA15118 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 10:43:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from austin.polstra.com (jdp@localhost) by austin.polstra.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA01182 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 10:43:23 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199707251743.KAA01182@austin.polstra.com> To: current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Whats happened to ping? In-Reply-To: <199707251636.JAA00656@austin.polstra.com> References: <199707251537.KAA28194@ns.tar.com> <199707251636.JAA00656@austin.polstra.com> Organization: Polstra & Co., Seattle, WA Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 10:43:23 -0700 From: John Polstra Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I wrote this, but it's wrong: > Also, if ping isn't receiving any replies, it's impossible to kill > it with a simple keyboard interrupt (SIGINT). I don't think that > was the case before. It fails like that under 2.2-stable, but not under -current. Thanks to sef for pointing out the mistake. Sorry for the bad information. John -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-knowledge is always bad news." -- John Barth From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 12:21:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA19440 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:21:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA19430 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:21:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by alpo.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA07993; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 11:59:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) via SMTP by alpo.whistle.com, id smtpd007988; Fri Jul 25 18:59:12 1997 Message-ID: <33D8F70D.63DABEB6@whistle.com> Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 11:57:17 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: John Polstra CC: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Whats happened to ping? References: <199707251537.KAA28194@ns.tar.com> <199707251636.JAA00656@austin.polstra.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk John Polstra wrote: > > > It seems that there have recently been changes to the sematics of > > "ping -c N". Unless I'm mistaken, the old behavior was that "ping -c N" > > meant try to send N packets. Now it means keep trying until N packets > > are actually sent. > > > > The practical effect of this is that "ping -c N" might loop endlessly, > > if, for example, the network is down and the sendto fails. > > Also, if ping isn't receiving any replies, it's impossible to kill > it with a simple keyboard interrupt (SIGINT). I don't think that > was the case before. > -- > John Polstra jdp@polstra.com > John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA > "Self-knowledge is always bad news." -- John Barth this was a case we tested.. sean? bruce? I think we need to re-open the patient... From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 12:21:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA19490 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:21:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA19480 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:21:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by alpo.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA07780; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 11:53:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) via SMTP by alpo.whistle.com, id smtpd007775; Fri Jul 25 18:53:50 1997 Message-ID: <33D8F5CB.5E652F78@whistle.com> Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 11:51:55 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Richard Seaman, Jr." CC: "freebsd-current@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: Whats happened to ping? References: <199707251537.KAA28194@ns.tar.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Richard Seaman, Jr. wrote: I'm to blame.. this is a side effect of something I did I also noticed another yesterday.. I must have coded this wromg because I thought I told it to only not count errors that were ENOBUFS (while in flood mode).. I'll check and fix if needed julian > > It seems that there have recently been changes to the sematics of > "ping -c N". Unless I'm mistaken, the old behavior was that "ping -c N" > meant try to send N packets. Now it means keep trying until N packets > are actually sent. > > The practical effect of this is that "ping -c N" might loop endlessly, > if, for example, the network is down and the sendto fails. An actual > example: > > # ping -c 1 -n -q 204.95.160.35 > PING 204.95.160.35 (204.95.160.35): 56 data bytes > ping: sendto: Network is down > ping: sendto: Network is down > ping: sendto: Network is down > ping: sendto: Network is down > ping: sendto: Network is down > ping: sendto: Network is down > ping: sendto: Network is down > ping: sendto: Network is down > ping: sendto: Network is down > ping: sendto: Network is down > ping: sendto: Network is down > ping: sendto: Network is down > ping: sendto: Network is down > ping: sendto: Network is down > ping: sendto: Network is down > ping: sendto: Network is down > ping: sendto: Network is down > ping: sendto: Network is down > ^C > --- 204.95.160.35 ping statistics --- > 0 packets transmitted, 0 packets received, > > The problem with this is that if you put "ping -c N" in a script, > expecting it to return at some point, you can now effectively have > your script hang. Which, of course, is what happened to me. > > While I'm sure there are good reasons for the change, I wonder: > > a) If it wouldn't be a good idea to leave the "-c" option with > the old meaning, and have a new option for the new behaviour > > b) If you don't restore the old meaning, a lot of people who > depend on ping to return when using the "-c" option will > get burned when they upgrade to current. > > Now, if I'm the only one affected, I can certainly work around > this new behaviour. But, I wonder if there aren't others in the > same boat. From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 12:58:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA21313 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:58:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from trifork.gu.net (trifork.gu.net [194.93.190.194]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA21304 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:58:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.gu.kiev.ua [127.0.0.1]) by trifork.gu.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA01303; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:57:49 +0300 (EEST) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:57:49 +0300 (EEST) From: Andrew Stesin Reply-To: stesin@gu.net To: Julian Elischer cc: "Richard Seaman, Jr." , "freebsd-current@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: Whats happened to ping? In-Reply-To: <33D8F5CB.5E652F78@whistle.com> Message-ID: X-NCC-RegID: ua.gu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Dear Julian, On Fri, 25 Jul 1997, Julian Elischer wrote: > I'll check and fix if needed > Please, would you mind doing so. Thanks. > julian > Best regards, Andrew Stesin nic-hdl: ST73-RIPE From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 13:03:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA21577 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 13:03:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA21567 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 13:03:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA19948; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:58:07 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707251958.MAA19948@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing To: jlemon@americantv.com (Jonathan Lemon) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 12:58:06 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, jas@flyingfox.com, Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM, current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970724211950.22892@right.PCS> from "Jonathan Lemon" at Jul 24, 97 09:19:50 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > RARP? Or was that just a belch in mid-sentence :-)? > > > > Reverse Address Resoloution Protocol. When someone connects to me, > > I can always geet the IP address they are connecting from. Using > > RARP, I can turn the address into a machine name, and compare it > > with what you tell me on the "HELO" and "MAIL FROM:" lines. > > Uh, I think that was a brain fart. RARP deals with the hardware address, > eg: the Ethernet address. You must have meant BIND. Yes, yes, it was a brain fart. 8-(. I mean reverse mapping, not RARP. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 13:11:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA22036 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 13:11:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA22030 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 13:11:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA19967; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 13:06:10 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707252006.NAA19967@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing To: gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 13:06:09 -0700 (MST) Cc: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM, jflists@calweb.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970725033109.17747@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> from "John-Mark Gurney" at Jul 25, 97 03:31:09 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > no, they are bouncing mail which doesn't have a valid return-path... > and actualy, you are required to specify this... An SMTP server must accept a return path of "<>", indicating an administrative message which should not be replied to under any circumstances. Much SPAM is now coming in from "<>" specifically because of this, which is why you use the "HELO domain" and the connection infromation. See RFC 1985. > I agree... but I'm going to look at better ways of handling this.. > like possibly teaching a machine about our "subdomains" so that we > can have addresses like: "jmg@hydrogen.nike.efn.org@resnet.uoregon.edu" > which is perfectly valid from the mail stand point... as it is parsed > as " @ domain"... plus I have tested this with > godzilla.zeta.org.au, and it was successful in accepting the > connection... This is not valind. "foo@fee.com;@fum.com" is valid, since it designates a route. RFC821 (SMTP) servers must accept address routes (for parsing; the can 521 refuse them, or "user not local" them, etc.), but are not required to perform forwarding. What happens with multiple "@XXX@YYY@ZZZ..." depends on the actual parser, but the forma semantic definition does not specify that it must operate that way. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 15:26:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA28378 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 15:26:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from helmholtz.salk.edu (helmholtz.salk.edu [198.202.70.34]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA28373 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 15:26:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pauling.salk.edu (pauling [198.202.70.108]) by helmholtz.salk.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA12152; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 15:19:57 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 15:19:54 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom Bartol To: Kyle Mestery cc: "Andreas S. Wetzel" , current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: COMPAT_LINUX broken in -current? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I too am seeing some anomalous behaviour in the linux emulator. I used to be able (with 970209-SNAP I believe) to cross compile and then run linux binaries on FreeBSD using gcc and friends from a linux slackware-3.0 machine (but libs from linux_lib-2.x). We needed to do this to compile matlab .mex files (using linux matlab-4.2c). I was actually amazed that it worked but very glad too because it meant that we could trade in our linux machines for new and improved FreeBSD machines (FreeBSD performed 3.5x faster than linux 2.0.28 and 2.5x faster than NT 4.0 running the same matlab job under conditions of large memory usage and swapping, but I digress). I could also cross compile ordinary C programs for linux and run them perfectly under FreeBSD. The binaries generated would be dynamically linked 32bit ELFs. However, that was then and this is now ;-) The emulator now has the following behaviour: I have a large C program which used to cross compile under the emulator and run fine. It now cross compiles without errors but file says the binary generated is statically linked. It seg faults and dumps core immediately. I have a small C program which behaved the same way as above but in my efforts to solve the problem I replaced the /compat/linux tree with libs, binaries, and includes obtained directly from a linux machine running Debian Linux 1.2.7. This small C program now cross compiles to what file says is a dynamically linked ELF and runs correctly. When I add the -static flag to the cross compile I then get a statically linked binary (which I had to `brandelf -t Linux` to run) and this binary seg faults and dumps core. The large C program above would still only produce a statically linked binary (according to file) even after my replacement for the /compat/linux tree was installed. When I compile both the large and small C programs either dynamically or statically on a real Linux machine, they run just fine under FreeBSD. I would really like for this to work again. I'm not a kernel hacker but if I can be of assistance in tracking this down I would only be too grateful... I've used ktrace to try to look at what's going on but I didn't find the output very illuminating -- the seg fault occurs very quickly: 23482 ktrace RET ktrace 0 23482 ktrace CALL execve(0xefbfd247,0xefbfd16c,0xefbfd174) 23482 ktrace NAMI "./l_calc" 23482 l_calc RET execve 0 23482 l_calc PSIG SIGSEGV SIG_DFL 23482 l_calc NAMI "l_calc.core" The ktrace of the static binary compiled on a linux machine but run under FreeBSD looks like: 23466 ktrace RET ktrace 0 23466 ktrace CALL execve(0xefbfd247,0xefbfd16c,0xefbfd174) 23466 ktrace NAMI "./l_calc" 23466 l_calc RET execve 0 23466 l_calc CALL mkdir(0) 23466 l_calc RET mkdir 0 23466 l_calc CALL old.sigvec(0x1,0xefbfcaf4) 23466 l_calc RET old.sigvec 0 23466 l_calc CALL dup2(0xefbfcab0) 23466 l_calc RET dup2 470196224/0x1c06a000 23466 l_calc CALL ioctl(0x1,0x5401 ,0xefbfcab8) 23466 l_calc RET ioctl 0 23466 l_calc CALL write(0x1,0x1c06a000,0x18) 23466 l_calc GIO fd 1 wrote 24 bytes "Usage: l_calc ip_number " 23466 l_calc RET write 24/0x18 23466 l_calc CALL exit(0x1) Hope this helps a little, Tom From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 16:39:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA02151 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 16:39:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from parkplace.cet.co.jp (parkplace.cet.co.jp [202.32.64.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA02146 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 16:39:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (michaelh@localhost) by parkplace.cet.co.jp (8.8.5/CET-v2.1) with SMTP id XAA09871; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 23:39:35 GMT Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 08:39:34 +0900 (JST) From: Michael Hancock To: Terry Lambert cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing In-Reply-To: <199707251958.MAA19948@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 25 Jul 1997, Terry Lambert wrote: > > > I can always geet the IP address they are connecting from. Using That's if they properly setup and maintain their reverse mappings. From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 18:10:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA05909 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 18:10:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA05902 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 18:10:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA00213; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 17:10:14 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707260010.RAA00213@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing To: michaelh@cet.co.jp (Michael Hancock) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 17:10:14 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Michael Hancock" at Jul 26, 97 08:39:34 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > I can always geet the IP address they are connecting from. Using > > That's if they properly setup and maintain their reverse mappings. Well, if they don't, then I'll refuse to talk to them. Many FTP sites put this in long ago, and it's one of the standard things that the US West sendmail hacks did as well. 8-). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 18:20:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA06491 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 18:20:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA06473 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 18:20:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA20229; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 18:19:21 -0700 (PDT) To: hosokawa@jp.freebsd.org cc: current@freebsd.org Subject: pccard and -current; a long way to go. :-( Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 18:19:21 -0700 Message-ID: <20225.869879961@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Well, I've been poking at this on and off for the last 2 days now and I can say without too much fear of contradiction that getting pccard support up in -current is no easy job. At least my pccardd no longer bitches on startup, but it also fails to do anything. :-) I also have to seriously question Nate & Mike's assertions that all is hunky-dory in 2.2.2 land. First off, my LINKSYS and AT&T modem cards are _not_ supported with the stock 2.2.2 stuff, I've tried that nine ways to Sunday, and even though upgrading to the latest and greatest 2.2.2 bits gets me past the card recognition phase, there is still the pccardd/ifconfig startup race which Nate claimed was not an issue. Trust me - it's an issue! :-) So now I'm left somewhat befuddled as to the best approach to take here. Normally, this stuff would be developed in -current and all the new stuff tested there, but we don't _have_ working versions (at least not that I could test with my available hardware) in -current, so that's kind of a washout from my perspective. The state of the art appears to have advanced to relative usability for me in 2.2.2+PAO, on the other hand, but we don't check new stuff directly into RELENG_2_2 so that route's kind of out too - I can get a working 2.2+ system out of this, but it won't be much good from the perspective of advancing development. I'm not sure how closely the Nomads want to work with the FreeBSD Project on this, but if the answer is "not closely enough to support -current" then I can see no other alternative but to pursue another, totally new effort for solving the pccard issues in FreeBSD. Any answers? Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 19:12:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA09166 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 19:12:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (Ilsa.StevesCafe.com [205.168.119.129]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA09158 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 19:12:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA28940 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 20:11:48 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199707260211.UAA28940@Ilsa.StevesCafe.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0gamma 1/27/96 From: Steve Passe To: current@freebsd.org Subject: make kernel fails Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 20:11:47 -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, attempting to build a new kernel: --- kernel --- loading kernel syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment *** Error code 1 1 error is there a simple solution to this? what should I grab? -- Steve Passe | powered by smp@csn.net | Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 19:27:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA09623 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 19:27:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA09618 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 19:26:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA27372; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 20:26:50 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 20:26:50 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199707260226.UAA27372@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: hosokawa@jp.freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: pccard and -current; a long way to go. :-( In-Reply-To: <20225.869879961@time.cdrom.com> References: <20225.869879961@time.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > 2.2.2 bits gets me past the card recognition phase, there is still the > pccardd/ifconfig startup race which Nate claimed was not an issue. > Trust me - it's an issue! :-) No it's not, you don't understand the startup code. You're trying to use the 'stock' if_ed0 lines to configure thing, and it doesn't work that way. You're supposed to use 'pccard_ifconfig' lines instead. It was *much* more obvious with /etc/sysconfig than it is now. In any case, I'll bring my laptop with me to the dinner we're having in a week and half and we can argue about it then. :) :) :) Nate From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 19:36:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA09995 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 19:36:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (Ilsa.StevesCafe.com [205.168.119.129]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA09990 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 19:36:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA29097 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 20:36:10 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199707260236.UAA29097@Ilsa.StevesCafe.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0gamma 1/27/96 From: Steve Passe To: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: make kernel fails In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 25 Jul 1997 20:11:47 MDT." <199707260211.UAA28940@Ilsa.StevesCafe.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 20:36:10 -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, seems that this works: -------------------- cut -------------------------- *** syscons.c.orig 1997/07/26 02:21:57 1.1 --- syscons.c 1997/07/26 02:22:13 *************** *** 127,133 **** char font_8[256*8]; char font_14[256*14]; ! extern unsigned char font_16[256*16]; char palette[256*3]; static char vgaregs[64]; static char *cut_buffer; --- 127,133 ---- char font_8[256*8]; char font_14[256*14]; ! unsigned char font_16[256*16]; char palette[256*3]; static char vgaregs[64]; static char *cut_buffer; -------------------- cut -------------------------- not sure its what's intended so I'll leave it to the author to fix. But it allowed me to build and boot a kernel, so I'm happy. -- Steve Passe | powered by smp@csn.net | Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 21:52:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA13998 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 21:52:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA13993 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 21:52:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA20697; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 21:52:14 -0700 (PDT) To: Nate Williams cc: hosokawa@jp.freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: pccard and -current; a long way to go. :-( In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 25 Jul 1997 20:26:50 MDT." <199707260226.UAA27372@rocky.mt.sri.com> Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 21:52:14 -0700 Message-ID: <20692.869892734@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > 2.2.2 bits gets me past the card recognition phase, there is still the > > pccardd/ifconfig startup race which Nate claimed was not an issue. > > Trust me - it's an issue! :-) > > No it's not, you don't understand the startup code. You're trying to > use the 'stock' if_ed0 lines to configure thing, and it doesn't work > that way. But.. I've already argued that this shouldn't be necessary when pccardd's ultimate aim is to make ed0 *exist* on my system; why in the heck would I want to increase the number of places where this is done from one to two? Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 22:05:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA14316 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:05:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from intrepid.leaky.com (shaffer-s.nosc.mil [128.49.236.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA14299 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:05:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from admin@localhost) by intrepid.leaky.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) id WAA09466; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:00:09 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199707260500.WAA09466@intrepid.leaky.com> X-Authentication-Warning: intrepid.leaky.com: admin set sender to using -f Received: from localhost(127.0.0.1) by intrepid.leaky.com via smap (V1.3) id sma009463; Fri Jul 25 22:00:06 1997 X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0gamma 1/27/96 To: current@freebsd.org cc: gshaffer@intrepid.leaky.com Subject: Minor nit Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:00:05 -0700 From: Greg Shaffer Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk The following output from 'w' shows that I have a process that has been idle for 5 days, but the system has only been up for just under 2 days. {intrepid}/home/gshaffer>> w 9:51PM up 1 day, 23:37, 4 users, load averages: 0.80, 1.23, 1.38 USER TTY FROM LOGIN@ IDLE WHAT gshaffer v0 - Wed10PM 1day xinit /home/gshaffer/.xinitrc -bpp 15 -- gshaffer p0 :0.0 Wed10PM 1day -sh (csh) gshaffer p1 :0.0 Wed10PM 5days sleep 60 gshaffer p2 :0.0 Wed10PM - w System is -current (about 14 days old). Greg Shaffer From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 22:20:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA14834 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:20:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from watcher.isl.net (ppp-16.isl.net [199.3.25.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA14829 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:20:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ortmann@localhost) by watcher.isl.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) id WAA00408; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:53:27 -0500 (CDT) From: Daniel Ortmann Message-Id: <199707260353.WAA00408@watcher.isl.net> Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:53:26 -0500 (CDT) Cc: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM, current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <13063.869763579@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at "Jul 24, 97 09:59:39 am" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I beg to differ. Most machines which may validly receive email do *not* > > have valid hostnames. Using the majority-minority rule, *you* lose. > > That's reality. > That's sure news to me - every machine I've dealt with over the last > couple of years, absolutely without exception, has had a perfectly > valid hostname. What twisted kind of reality do you live in? ;-) Sir, try to ping my machine. You can't. The dns name isn't real. Or am I misunderstanding? > And it's also beside the point - I'm not against such machines > receiving mail, simply generating it. If they want to generate mail > then is it so much to ask to have them relay it through a legit host? > I don't think so. My .mc file causes sendmail to directly send out the mail, but munges the mail so that it appears to be coming from the domain where I can receive my mail. Upon connection my system uses POP3 to retrieve the mail. > > Please do not intentionally damage global email. The system can only > global email is already irretrievably damaged and quite possibly on > its last legs. What we're talking about here are strategies for > surviving in a post-spammer era and simply ignoring the problem and > leaving things wide open is not the answer we're looking for here. Thanks for your comments. -- Daniel Ortmann 507.288.7732 (h) ortmann@isl.net 2414 30 av NW, #D 507.253.6795 (w) ortmann@vnet.ibm.com Rochester, MN 55901 "PERL: The Swiss Army Chainsaw" From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 22:21:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA14854 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:21:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from watcher.isl.net (ppp-16.isl.net [199.3.25.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA14849 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:21:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ortmann@localhost) by watcher.isl.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) id WAA00390; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:45:05 -0500 (CDT) From: Daniel Ortmann Message-Id: <199707260345.WAA00390@watcher.isl.net> Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing To: j_mini@efn.org Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:45:04 -0500 (CDT) Cc: ahd@kew.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970724002446.59369@micron.efn.org> from Jonathan Mini at "Jul 24, 97 00:24:46 am" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > What I'm saying is that my hostname doesn't have a DNS entry in > the "outside world" and therefore sending a message from my machine > is automatically an invalid host. THe only real option I have is > to spoof the information that sendmail sends out, ask my ISP for > a addressless DNS entry (make a DNS entry that has no A entry) or > change my hostname to something valid. > Although pictures of naming myself cyberpromo.com for a week come > to mind, I don't think "stealing" someone else's host name is a > very valid solution. I would persue getting a DNS entry from my > ISP, except that I have more than one ISP. (makes life harder, > although still theoretially possible. All I need is one valid > hostname I can pretend I am) I'd do that -- except that I am going > to be moving into student housing in about a month or so, and will > actually have a public IP address and DNS entry for my machine on > that network, and (knowing my ISP's) it would probably take a month > to get that DNS entry, it's kinda of pointless. > I'm just a little annoyed at people who insist of having the sending > machine call itself a valid hostname, just to cut down on spam. I have no real domain, but the following is enough to get my mail through ... and allow people to respond to me. I really don't exactly understand what everyone is talking about ... but I hope it doesn't break my mailing capabilities. :-) VERSIONID(`$Id: watcher.mc,v 1.4 1997/04/11 09:26:43 root Exp $') OSTYPE(bsd4.4)dnl DOMAIN(watcher.isl.net)dnl FEATURE(redirect)dnl FEATURE(allmasquerade)dnl FEATURE(masquerade_envelope)dnl FEATURE(nodns)dnl LOCAL_USER(ortmann)dnl LOCAL_USER(root)dnl MAILER(local)dnl MAILER(smtp)dnl -- Daniel Ortmann 507.288.7732 (h) ortmann@isl.net 2414 30 av NW, #D 507.253.6795 (w) ortmann@vnet.ibm.com Rochester, MN 55901 "PERL: The Swiss Army Chainsaw" From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 22:25:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA15061 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:25:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA15056 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:25:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA20883; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:24:59 -0700 (PDT) To: Daniel Ortmann cc: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:53:26 CDT." <199707260353.WAA00408@watcher.isl.net> Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:24:59 -0700 Message-ID: <20878.869894699@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Sir, try to ping my machine. Irrelevant - see below. > My .mc file causes sendmail to directly send out the mail, but > munges the mail so that it appears to be coming from the domain > where I can receive my mail. So you patch around the problem at the last minute, rendering this no longer an issue for your mail. No problem then, because it was mail delivery we were talking about - whether I can actually send packets directly to your machine is of little interest to me since the odds of my actually ever needing to do so are extremely small. Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 22:44:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA15762 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:44:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pandora.hh.kew.com (root@kendra.ne.mediaone.net [24.128.53.73]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA15757 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:44:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by pandora.hh.kew.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA02854; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 01:44:15 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 01:44:15 -0400 (EDT) From: Drew Derbyshire Message-Id: <199707260544.BAA02854@pandora.hh.kew.com> To: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: bouncing mail from sites without a valid MX/A record Cc: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > From: Tony Kimball > As I understand it, you are only bouncing mail which cannot be replied > *through* a valid MX or A. I'm guessing that you could probably > construct a valid address from the various "Received:" headers in many > such cases, though. > > I suppose this will help to reject casual spam, but it seems to me a > misdirected effort, since most spam, particularly the large-volume > stuff from the pros, will not get filtered in this way. The only > way I can see to do that is to maintain a large kill list. Actually, this nukes about ~ 20 - 60 % of the SPAM off the top. Sites don't like their good name used by spammers, so many SPAM generators just generate random all number domains in .COM. So yes, it works, and get used to it. From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 23:50:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA17760 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 23:50:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hutcs.cs.hut.fi (apl@hutcs.cs.hut.fi [130.233.192.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA17754 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 23:50:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from apl@localhost) by hutcs.cs.hut.fi (8.8.5/8.7.3) id JAA04086; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 09:50:33 +0300 (EET DST) Message-ID: <19970726095032.34024@hutcs.cs.hut.fi> Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 09:50:32 +0300 From: Antti-Pekka Liedes To: current@freebsd.org Subject: -current kernel hangs Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=HnE3ZwKMSgU+yNb1 X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk --HnE3ZwKMSgU+yNb1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I haven't been able to boot -current kernel for about 7-10 days now. Right after telling me my available memory it hangs and nothing but cold reset works. I have included my configuration file, -current kernel has failed with the same configuration, but without the FONTS- and Adaptec-stuff too. I have a Tyan Tomcat IIID motherboard with one 100MHz Pentium, 64MB RAM, Matrox Millenium, SMC 9334BDT, and NCR and AHA-3940U controllers, if any of them have signifficance. -- Antti-Pekka Liedes * apl@IRC * In two hells there's JMT 6 B 406 * apl@iki.fi * one hell too many 02150 ESPOO * apl@apocalypse.tky.hut.fi * - Lucifer +358 - 9 - 468 3121 * +358 - 40 - 5873 593 * (in God's Army) --HnE3ZwKMSgU+yNb1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=APOCALYPSE # # GENERIC -- Generic machine with WD/AHx/NCR/BTx family disks # # $Id: GENERIC,v 1.74 1996/07/11 11:18:45 jkh Exp $ # machine "i386" #cpu "I386_CPU" #cpu "I486_CPU" cpu "I586_CPU" #cpu "I686_CPU" ident APOCALYPSE maxusers 30 options SMP options APIC_IO options NCPU=2 options NBUS=2 options NAPIC=1 options NINTR=24 #options SMP_TIMER_NC #options MATH_EMULATE #Support for x87 emulation options INET #InterNETworking options FFS #Berkeley Fast Filesystem options NFS #Network Filesystem options FDESC options MSDOSFS #MSDOS Filesystem options "CD9660" #ISO 9660 Filesystem options MFS options PROCFS #Process filesystem #options DEVFS options "COMPAT_43" #Compatible with BSD 4.3 [KEEP THIS!] options SCSI_DELAY=15 #Be pessimistic about Joe SCSI device options BOUNCE_BUFFERS #include support for DMA bounce buffers options UCONSOLE #Allow users to grab the console options FAILSAFE #Be conservative options "EXT2FS" options LINUX options COMPAT_LINUX options SYSVSHM options SYSVSEM options SYSVMSG options "MAXMEM=(128*1024)" options USERCONFIG options VISUAL_USERCONFIG options "I586_FAST_BCOPY" options "I586_OPTIMIZED_BZERO" options "I586_OPTIMIZED_BCOPY" options "CPU_FASTER_5X86_FPU" options PERFMON config kernel root on sd1a controller isa0 #controller eisa0 controller pci0 controller snd0 device sb0 at isa? port 0x220 irq 5 conflicts drq 1 vector sbintr device sbxvi0 at isa? port? irq? drq 5 conflicts device sbmidi0 at isa? port 0x330 irq? conflicts controller fdc0 at isa? port "IO_FD1" bio irq 6 drq 2 vector fdintr disk fd0 at fdc0 drive 0 #disk fd1 at fdc0 drive 1 #tape ft0 at fdc0 drive 2 controller wdc0 at isa? port "IO_WD1" bio irq 14 vector wdintr #disk wd0 at wdc0 drive 0 #disk wd1 at wdc0 drive 1 #controller wdc1 at isa? port "IO_WD2" bio irq 15 vector wdintr #disk wd2 at wdc1 drive 0 #disk wd3 at wdc1 drive 1 #controller wdc1 at isa? port 0x1e8 bio irq 11 vector wdintr options ATAPI #Enable ATAPI support for IDE bus options ATAPI_STATIC #Don't do it as an LKM device wcd0 #IDE CD-ROM # A single entry for any of these controllers (ncr, ahb, ahc) is sufficient # for any number of installed devices. controller ncr0 #controller ahb0 controller ahc0 options AHC_SCBPAGING_ENABLE options AHC_TAGENABLE options AHC_ALLOW_MEMIO #controller bt0 at isa? port "IO_BT0" bio irq ? vector bt_isa_intr #controller uha0 at isa? port "IO_UHA0" bio irq ? drq 5 vector uhaintr #controller aha0 at isa? port "IO_AHA0" bio irq ? drq 5 vector ahaintr #controller aic0 at isa? port 0x340 bio irq 11 vector aicintr #controller nca0 at isa? port 0x1f88 bio irq 10 vector ncaintr #controller nca1 at isa? port 0x350 bio irq 5 vector ncaintr #controller sea0 at isa? bio irq 5 iomem 0xc8000 iosiz 0x2000 vector seaintr controller scbus0 device sd0 #disk sd0 at scbus0 target 5 #device od0 #See LINT for possible `od' options. #device st0 #device cd0 #Only need one of these, the code dynamically grows #device wt0 at isa? port 0x300 bio irq 5 drq 1 vector wtintr #device mcd0 at isa? port 0x300 bio irq 10 vector mcdintr #controller matcd0 at isa? port 0x230 bio #device scd0 at isa? port 0x230 bio # syscons is the default console driver, resembling an SCO console device sc0 at isa? port "IO_KBD" tty irq 1 vector scintr # Enable this and PCVT_FREEBSD for pcvt vt220 compatible console driver #device vt0 at isa? port "IO_KBD" tty irq 1 vector pcrint #options PCVT_FREEBSD=210 # pcvt running on FreeBSD >= 2.0.5 options XSERVER # include code for XFree86 #options FAT_CURSOR # start with block cursor # If you have a ThinkPAD, uncomment this along with the rest of the PCVT lines #options PCVT_SCANSET=2 # IBM keyboards are non-std options "STD8X16FONT" makeoptions "STD8X16FONT"="cp850" # Mandatory, don't remove device npx0 at isa? port "IO_NPX" irq 13 vector npxintr # # Laptop support (see LINT for more options) # #device apm0 at isa? disable # Advanced Power Management #options APM_BROKEN_STATCLOCK # Workaround some buggy APM BIOS # PCCARD (PCMCIA) support #controller crd0 #device pcic0 at crd? #device pcic1 at crd? device sio0 at isa? port "IO_COM1" tty irq 4 vector siointr device sio1 at isa? port "IO_COM2" tty irq 3 vector siointr #device sio2 at isa? disable port "IO_COM3" tty irq 5 vector siointr #device sio3 at isa? disable port "IO_COM4" tty irq 9 vector siointr device lpt0 at isa? port? tty irq 7 vector lptintr #device lpt1 at isa? port? tty #device mse0 at isa? port 0x23c tty irq 5 vector mseintr device psm0 at isa? port "IO_KBD" conflicts tty irq 12 vector psmintr # Order is important here due to intrusive probes, do *not* alphabetize # this list of network interfaces until the probes have been fixed. # Right now it appears that the ie0 must be probed before ep0. See # revision 1.20 of this file. device de0 #device fxp0 #device vx0 #device ed0 at isa? port 0x280 net irq 5 iomem 0xd8000 vector edintr #device ed1 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 5 iomem 0xd8000 vector edintr #device ie0 at isa? port 0x360 net irq 7 iomem 0xd0000 vector ieintr #device ep0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 10 vector epintr #device fe0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq ? vector feintr #device ix0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 10 iomem 0xd0000 iosiz 32768 vector ixintr #device le0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 5 iomem 0xd0000 vector le_intr #device lnc0 at isa? port 0x280 net irq 10 drq 0 vector lncintr #device ze0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 5 iomem 0xd8000 vector zeintr #device zp0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 10 iomem 0xd8000 vector zpintr pseudo-device loop pseudo-device ether pseudo-device log pseudo-device sl 1 # ijppp uses tun instead of ppp device #pseudo-device ppp 1 pseudo-device tun 1 pseudo-device pty 64 pseudo-device gzip # Exec gzipped a.out's pseudo-device bpfilter 2 pseudo-device ccd 4 # KTRACE enables the system-call tracing facility ktrace(2). # This adds 4 KB bloat to your kernel, and slightly increases # the costs of each syscall. options KTRACE #kernel tracing --HnE3ZwKMSgU+yNb1-- From owner-freebsd-current Fri Jul 25 23:55:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA17880 for current-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 23:55:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hutcs.cs.hut.fi (apl@hutcs.cs.hut.fi [130.233.192.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA17874 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 23:55:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from apl@localhost) by hutcs.cs.hut.fi (8.8.5/8.7.3) id JAA04102; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 09:55:43 +0300 (EET DST) Message-ID: <19970726095543.07930@hutcs.cs.hut.fi> Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 09:55:43 +0300 From: Antti-Pekka Liedes To: current@freebsd.org Subject: oops Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Damned, my configuration files were messed up, sorry about the last mail. -- Antti-Pekka Liedes * apl@IRC * In two hells there's JMT 6 B 406 * apl@iki.fi * one hell too many 02150 ESPOO * apl@apocalypse.tky.hut.fi * - Lucifer +358 - 9 - 468 3121 * +358 - 40 - 5873 593 * (in God's Army) From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 00:18:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA18549 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 00:18:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA18543 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 00:17:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id RAA01058; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 17:16:01 +1000 Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 17:16:01 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199707260716.RAA01058@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: current@FreeBSD.ORG, jdp@polstra.com Subject: Re: Whats happened to ping? Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >I wrote this, but it's wrong: > >> Also, if ping isn't receiving any replies, it's impossible to kill >> it with a simple keyboard interrupt (SIGINT). I don't think that >> was the case before. > >It fails like that under 2.2-stable, but not under -current. Thanks >to sef for pointing out the mistake. Sorry for the bad information. This is wrong too :-). SIGINT handling was broken for a short time in both 2.2-"stable" and -current. The diffs between 2.2 and -current are large because merging of fixes and bugs into 2.2 is very disorganized. Bruce From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 00:45:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA19395 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 00:45:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com (critter.phk.freebsd.dk [195.8.129.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA19379 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 00:44:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.dk.tfs.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA06021; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 09:44:31 +0200 (CEST) To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: hosokawa@jp.freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org From: Poul-Henning Kamp Subject: Re: pccard and -current; a long way to go. :-( In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 25 Jul 1997 18:19:21 PDT." <20225.869879961@time.cdrom.com> Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 09:44:31 +0200 Message-ID: <6019.869903071@critter.dk.tfs.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <20225.869879961@time.cdrom.com>, "Jordan K. Hubbard" writes: >Well, I've been poking at this on and off for the last 2 days now and >I can say without too much fear of contradiction that getting pccard >support up in -current is no easy job. At least my pccardd no longer >bitches on startup, but it also fails to do anything. :-) > >I'm not sure how closely the Nomads want to work with the FreeBSD >Project on this, but if the answer is "not closely enough to support >-current" then I can see no other alternative but to pursue another, >totally new effort for solving the pccard issues in FreeBSD. > >Any answers? As the guy who have been secretly architecting the current stuff from right back then, I can confidently say that to get our "removable device" support into a decent shape will take some work. The Nomads work are pretty focused on pccards, but in the same framework we should look at CardBus, docking stations, hot-plug PCI and goddamnit: PlugAndPray since this is the mechanism that is supposed to make support for all these things managable. As usual, if you start to fiddle this stuff, you hit your head on the usual suspects: 1. Improved support for loadable devices. 2. Real mode BIOS calls. 3. A Registry. 4. (optional:) pageable kernel modules. So the current state of the Nomads code is understandable and I belive pretty unavoidable, considering the lack of a concerted effort on the above necessary technologies... I think the best path is to leave the Nomads in charge of the actual drivers for the devices, and try to find some person and some means for working on the above 4 issues. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Power and ignorance is a disgusting cocktail. From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 00:59:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA19654 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 00:59:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com (critter.phk.freebsd.dk [195.8.129.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA19646 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 00:59:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.dk.tfs.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA06047; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 09:58:56 +0200 (CEST) To: Steve Passe cc: current@FreeBSD.org From: Poul-Henning Kamp Subject: Re: make kernel fails In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 25 Jul 1997 20:11:47 MDT." <199707260211.UAA28940@Ilsa.StevesCafe.com> Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 09:58:55 +0200 Message-ID: <6045.869903935@critter.dk.tfs.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk fixed. In message <199707260211.UAA28940@Ilsa.StevesCafe.com>, Steve Passe writes: >Hi, > >attempting to build a new kernel: > >--- kernel --- >loading kernel >syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment >syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment >syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment >syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment >syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment >syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment >syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment >syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment >syscons.o: Undefined symbol `_font_16' referenced from text segment >*** Error code 1 >1 error > >is there a simple solution to this? what should I grab? >-- >Steve Passe | powered by >smp@csn.net | Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD > > -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Power and ignorance is a disgusting cocktail. From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 02:44:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA22708 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 02:44:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.fr [193.56.58.253]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA22698 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 02:44:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.fr [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.8.4/8.8.4) with ESMTP id LAA05452 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 11:44:39 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.8.4/8.6.12) with UUCP id LAA24632 for current@FreeBSD.ORG; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 11:44:09 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.6/keltia-uucp-2.9) id LAA24342; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 11:14:48 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19970726111448.53657@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 11:14:48 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (over)zealous mail bouncing References: <199707241601.LAA03086@compound.east.sun.com> <13063.869763579@time.cdrom.com> <199707241934.OAA03669@pobox.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76 In-Reply-To: <199707241934.OAA03669@pobox.com>; from Tony Kimball on Thu, Jul 24, 1997 at 02:34:55PM -0500 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT ctm#3481 AMD-K6 MMX @ 208 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Tony Kimball: > Large numbers of mail nodes on bitnet or profs or uucp or fidonet or > vines or netware or exchange or what-have-you don't have that. UUCP is not a problem. My hostname is "keltia.freenix.fr", my envelope address is the same and it is a perfectly correct address. It has a MX so I can receive e-mail. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: There are no limits -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 3.0-CURRENT #23: Sun Jul 20 18:10:34 CEST 1997 From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 04:51:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id EAA27363 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 04:51:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lenlen.ntc.keio.ac.jp (ppp07.mc.st.keio.ac.jp [131.113.28.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA27357 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 04:51:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from hosokawa@localhost) by lenlen.ntc.keio.ac.jp (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA15043; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 20:48:26 +0900 (JST) Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 20:48:26 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <199707261148.UAA15043@lenlen.ntc.keio.ac.jp> To: jkh@time.cdrom.com Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, hosokawa@ntc.keio.ac.jp Subject: Re: pccard and -current; a long way to go. :-( In-Reply-To: Your message of Fri, 25 Jul 1997 18:19:21 -0700. <20225.869879961@time.cdrom.com> From: hosokawa@ntc.keio.ac.jp (HOSOKAWA Tatsumi) X-Mailer: mnews [version 1.19PL2] 1996-01/26(Fri) Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In article <20225.869879961@time.cdrom.com> jkh@time.cdrom.com writes: >> I'm not sure how closely the Nomads want to work with the FreeBSD >> Project on this, but if the answer is "not closely enough to support >> -current" then I can see no other alternative but to pursue another, >> totally new effort for solving the pccard issues in FreeBSD. I personally think that: o I want to incorporate PAO package into -currnet gradually. For example, I think "shutdown -x" hack, sn driver, etc. are easily incorporated into -current. o pccard stuff is very premature when I started working on it, but currently, it evolved and it should be developed in open fashion. (and I want to concentrate upon more premature stuff like I18N sysinstall, new config system, CardBus support, etc.) o Of course I'm planning to move to 3.0-current. I'm working on 2.2 because I want to advertise FreeBSD to Japanese market (about half of PC's in Japan is laptop), and I have only one laptop for develpment. I got a new laptop (Toshiba Libretto 50 CT US version) last week and I'm planning to install 3.0 to the old one. I have ten days vacation from next week (sorry, I'll be away from net for a week because of it), and I want to work on incorporating part of PAO stuff to 3.0-current in this vacation. -- HOSOKAWA, Tatsumi [Network Technology Center, Keio University] hosokawa@ntc.keio.ac.jp hosokawa@jp.FreeBSD.org From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 08:20:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA03634 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 08:20:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA03628 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 08:20:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id AAA28064; Sun, 27 Jul 1997 00:49:54 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707261519.AAA28064@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: pccard and -current; a long way to go. :-( In-Reply-To: <20692.869892734@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at "Jul 25, 97 09:52:14 pm" To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 1997 00:49:54 +0930 (CST) Cc: nate@mt.sri.com, hosokawa@jp.freebsd.org, current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jordan K. Hubbard stands accused of saying: > > > 2.2.2 bits gets me past the card recognition phase, there is still the > > > pccardd/ifconfig startup race which Nate claimed was not an issue. > > > Trust me - it's an issue! :-) > > > > No it's not, you don't understand the startup code. You're trying to > > use the 'stock' if_ed0 lines to configure thing, and it doesn't work > > that way. > > But.. I've already argued that this shouldn't be necessary when > pccardd's ultimate aim is to make ed0 *exist* on my system; why in the > heck would I want to increase the number of places where this is done > from one to two? Because the current startup code is _too_stupid_ to deal with transient interfaces. This was hashed out ages ago. If we accept your model where the system can't start until a network card is inserted to match the ifconfig_foo lines, I'd be screwed if I decided to boot without my 'net card to save power. Waiting for pccardd to start is not the right way to deal with this. Better would be to have the ifconfig/routing data consumed by a script started as a result of the arrival of an interface, as is the case with the pccard stuff right now. This may cause problems with code that expects to be able to do network-related setup early in the boot phase. > Jordan -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 08:28:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA03911 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 08:28:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA03906 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 08:28:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id AAA28100; Sun, 27 Jul 1997 00:57:42 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199707261527.AAA28100@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: pccard and -current; a long way to go. :-( In-Reply-To: <6019.869903071@critter.dk.tfs.com> from Poul-Henning Kamp at "Jul 26, 97 09:44:31 am" To: phk@dk.tfs.com (Poul-Henning Kamp) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 1997 00:57:42 +0930 (CST) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, hosokawa@jp.freebsd.org, current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Poul-Henning Kamp stands accused of saying: > > As usual, if you start to fiddle this stuff, you hit your head on the > usual suspects: > > 1. Improved support for loadable devices. 'kn oath. Where is the ELF toolset at these days? What's the current feeling on linker set technology as it applies to loadable modules? What happened to Doug R's work on this too? > 2. Real mode BIOS calls. Well, we have someone claiming to be starting work on this. I've been pursuing an alternative, but I haven't had much luck getting standalone binaries running (yet). > 3. A Registry. You were talking about a method-based registry a while back; is this still the current "best-of' mechanism? -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 09:23:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA06062 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 09:23:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from veda.is (root@veda.is [193.4.230.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA06057 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 09:23:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ubiq.veda.is (adam@ubiq.veda.is [193.4.230.60]) by veda.is (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA03904 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 16:23:01 GMT From: Adam David Received: (from adam@localhost) by ubiq.veda.is (8.8.6/8.8.5) id QAA00289 for freebsd-current@freebsd.org; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 16:22:57 GMT Message-Id: <199707261622.QAA00289@ubiq.veda.is> Subject: panic To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 16:22:56 +0000 (GMT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've not seen this one before. Jul 26 15:10:06 u /kernel: swap_pager: out of swap space Jul 26 15:10:08 u /kernel: pid 17139 (sh), uid 0, was killed: out of swap space Jul 26 16:04:49 u /kernel: swap_pager: out of swap space Jul 26 16:05:05 u /kernel: pid 17207 (sh), uid 0, was killed: out of swap space Jul 26 16:13:58 u /kernel: panic: getnewbuf: cannot get buffer, infinite recursion failure Jul 26 16:13:58 u /kernel: Jul 26 16:13:58 u /kernel: syncing disks... 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 giving up -- Adam David From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 10:09:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA07678 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 10:09:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA07673 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 10:09:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA25983; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 10:07:25 -0700 (PDT) To: Michael Smith cc: nate@mt.sri.com, hosokawa@jp.freebsd.org, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: pccard and -current; a long way to go. :-( In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 27 Jul 1997 00:49:54 +0930." <199707261519.AAA28064@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 10:07:25 -0700 Message-ID: <25979.869936845@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Because the current startup code is _too_stupid_ to deal with > transient interfaces. This was hashed out ages ago. > > If we accept your model where the system can't start until a network > card is inserted to match the ifconfig_foo lines, I'd be screwed if I > decided to boot without my 'net card to save power. Well, then we have a problem which really needs resolution since it's not going to work well the way it is with the current installation code. Consider: When I do a net install, using either the PAO floppy or some hypothetical pccard-enabled boot.flp image, I fill in all the host/IP/... details in the TCP/IP setup screen and, as is the generic action for all types of installs, sysinstall writes this information into rc.conf, e.g. I now have ifconfig_ed0="..." lines for your PCCARD ethernet device in my particular case. Now I finish the install and come up for the first time off the hard disk. The network is, of course, misconfigured now and we're not going to come up on the net again as configured. The user is confused. FreeBSD's install has left them high and dry. I've also no objection to changing things so that, somehow, a pccard device is somehow recognised and the behavior of adding ifconfig_foo lines is skipped in favor of adding more specialized configuration, but I think that we need to seriously think about our configuration mechanisms and how "dynamism" in your device picture is going to be handled. For a device which may enter and leave the picture at any time, you obviously may wish to treat its configuration data differently. The question is: How exactly? :) Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 10:15:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA08120 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 10:15:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA08113 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 10:15:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA26047; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 10:15:30 -0700 (PDT) To: hosokawa@ntc.keio.ac.jp (HOSOKAWA Tatsumi) cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: pccard and -current; a long way to go. :-( In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 26 Jul 1997 20:48:26 +0900." <199707261148.UAA15043@lenlen.ntc.keio.ac.jp> Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 10:15:29 -0700 Message-ID: <26043.869937329@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > o Of course I'm planning to move to 3.0-current. I'm working on 2.2 > because I want to advertise FreeBSD to Japanese market (about half > of PC's in Japan is laptop), and I have only one laptop for > develpment. I got a new laptop (Toshiba Libretto 50 CT US version) > last week and I'm planning to install 3.0 to the old one. That's very promising news, thanks. We also have some issues to work out with the startup and installation code before it's going to work as seamlessly as I think we'd all like it to (ref my other comments about sysinstall's writing of config data to rc.conf for the general case not playing well with the pccard case). Perhaps when I come to Japan this fall (date not set yet, but it's looking like some time in September) we can have dinner someplace and talk about it? :) Jordan From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 10:24:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA08644 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 10:24:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from byako.lovett.com (root@byako.lovett.com [193.195.45.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA08629 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 10:23:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ade by byako.lovett.com with esmtp (Exim 1.62 #1) id 0wsAYx-0004mt-00; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 18:23:27 +0100 To: Nate Williams cc: current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: pccard and -current; a long way to go. :-( Organization: Demon Internet Ltd. Reply-To: ade@demon.net In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 25 Jul 1997 20:26:50 MDT." <199707260226.UAA27372@rocky.mt.sri.com> Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 18:23:27 +0100 From: Ade Lovett Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Nate Williams writes: > >No it's not, you don't understand the startup code. You're trying to >use the 'stock' if_ed0 lines to configure thing, and it doesn't work >that way. Not quite. For instance, I'm using the 'proper' pccard_ifconfig lines to bring up my GCS2220 ethernet card, yet by the time pccardd has fired up the interface, the rest opf /etc/rc* has brought up exim, my local caching-only nameserver, amd, xntpd etc.., some of which will occasionally fail to 'do the right thing', since at the time they're started up, I only have a loopback interface defined, with ed0 still nowhere in the land of the living (since pccardd hasn't finished doing its thing). I would imagine that most of these problems could be sorted out with an optional flag to pccardd saying "I already have my card in the laptop, it's an ethernet card, and I don't want the rest of /etc/rc* to bring up network-related daemons until pccard-ed0 (or whatever) is up and running". -aDe -- Ade Lovett, Demon Internet Ltd. From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 10:40:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA09546 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 10:40:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from scf-fs.usc.edu (scf-fs.usc.edu [128.125.253.183]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA09540 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 10:40:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [128.125.224.118] (comserv-i-46.usc.edu [128.125.224.118]) by scf-fs.usc.edu (8.8.4/8.8.4/usc) with ESMTP id KAA29445 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 10:40:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Sender: larse@scf.usc.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199707261622.QAA00289@ubiq.veda.is> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 09:39:02 -0800 To: freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG From: Lars Eggert Subject: Who is working on the TCP stack? Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, and sorry if this not the right place to ask. I will be implementing some changes to TCP as part of a research project during the fall (if you are interested, see RFC 2140, "TCP Control Block Interdependence." J. Touch. April 1997.) I was wondering, if anybody else is working on the TCP stack at this time. Would -current be the right place to implement those changes, or should I stick with -stable? Is there anything else I should be aware of? Thanks, Lars PS: If this is off-topic for the list (sorry), please respond by personal mail. __________________________________________________________________________ Lars Eggert larse@usc.edu Information Sciences Institute http://www-scf.usc.edu/~larse/ University of Southern California Finger or email for PGP public key. From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 11:58:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA13346 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 11:58:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from news1.gtn.com (news1.gtn.com [194.77.0.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA13332 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 11:58:23 -0700 (PDT) From: andreas@klemm.gtn.com Received: (from root@localhost) by news1.gtn.com (8.7.2/8.7.2) id TAA11138; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 19:58:08 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 19:58:08 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199707261758.TAA11138@news1.gtn.com> To: undisclosed-recipients:; Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >From andreas@klemm.gtn.com Fri Jul 25 05:52:13 1997 Received: (from andreas@localhost) by klemm.gtn.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) id FAA01019; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 05:52:13 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19970725055213.21358@gtn.com> Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 05:52:13 +0200 From: Andreas Klemm To: ac199@hwcn.org Cc: Warner Losh , Tom , current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: lpr/lpd changes References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79 In-Reply-To: ; from Tim Vanderhoek on Wed, Jul 23, 1997 at 10:16:23PM -0400 X-Disclaimer: A free society is one where it is safe to be unpopular X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT SMP On Wed, Jul 23, 1997 at 10:16:23PM -0400, Tim Vanderhoek wrote: > > This is not an objection to having lpd off by default, but a > suggestion that apsfilter be feeped a little bit more to ask "lpd is > currently disabled in /etc/rc.conf. Do you want to enable it? [Y/N]" Could be done. But I dislike fiddeling around in _the_ central config file. Would people really want that ? -- Andreas Klemm | klemm.gtn.com - powered by Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/SMP.html http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/benches.html From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 12:16:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA14355 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 12:16:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu [18.24.4.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA14348 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 12:16:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from wollman@localhost) by khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA23440; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 15:16:30 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 15:16:30 -0400 (EDT) From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <199707261916.PAA23440@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> To: Lars Eggert Cc: freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Who is working on the TCP stack? In-Reply-To: References: <199707261622.QAA00289@ubiq.veda.is> Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < said: > and sorry if this not the right place to ask. I will be implementing some > changes to TCP as part of a research project during the fall (if you are > interested, see RFC 2140, "TCP Control Block Interdependence." J. Touch. > April 1997.) > I was wondering, if anybody else is working on the TCP stack at this time. > Would -current be the right place to implement those changes, or should I > stick with -stable? Is there anything else I should be aware of? There are a group of people who have been working on and off on various network issues, of which I am a member. The people in the CAIRN consortium have been doing a lot of work as well, but since they don't talk much to me I don't know what they are up to. I don't think that anyone is working on TCP in particular at this point (I could be wrong); certainly if I had the time I would like to, but I haven't had any time to spare for the past couple of months, and when I have had the time, -current has been broken (sigh). Certainly current is the right platform to target; there have been and will continue to be substantial ongoing changes in the basic substructure of the networking code which make it unlikely that any efforts based on 2.2 will easily carry into the main line of development. If you're up for a major re-working of the TCP implementation, let me know and I'll give you a few notions of the way we're headed. -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame MIT, LCS, CRS, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 12:18:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA14458 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 12:18:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu [18.24.4.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA14453 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 12:18:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from wollman@localhost) by khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA23445; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 15:18:16 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 15:18:16 -0400 (EDT) From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <199707261918.PAA23445@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> To: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= Cc: current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/usr.bin/fetch fetch.1 fetch.h http.c main.c In-Reply-To: References: <199707251935.MAA00400@freefall.freebsd.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < said: > Thanx, it works now. BTW, why not make '-b' as default case? Is it will Because it's a work-around for a BUG. The only way to recognize broken servers is to exercise this behavior. We should try to find out which systems are broken so that we can embarrass them in public, and hopefully get those bugs fixed. -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame MIT, LCS, CRS, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 13:25:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA18823 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 13:25:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lsd.relcom.eu.net (lsd.relcom.eu.net [193.124.23.23]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA18818 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 13:25:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ache@localhost) by lsd.relcom.eu.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) id AAA01547; Sun, 27 Jul 1997 00:25:08 +0400 (MSD) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 1997 00:25:07 +0400 (MSD) From: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= X-Sender: ache@lsd.relcom.eu.net To: Garrett Wollman cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/usr.bin/fetch fetch.1 fetch.h http.c main.c In-Reply-To: <199707261918.PAA23445@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 26 Jul 1997, Garrett Wollman wrote: > < said: > > > Thanx, it works now. BTW, why not make '-b' as default case? Is it will > > Because it's a work-around for a BUG. The only way to recognize > broken servers is to exercise this behavior. We should try to find > out which systems are broken so that we can embarrass them in > public, and hopefully get those bugs fixed. Ok. BTW, could you please make -b description in manpage more clear for end-user, i.e. point exactly to "Connection reset by peer" error instead of "a bug". Maybe even suggest to use -b inside fetch when reset by peer happen... I can't do it by myself due to lack of correct english. -- Andrey A. Chernov http://www.nagual.pp.ru/~ache/ From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 13:32:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA19331 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 13:32:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA19326 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 13:32:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA03024; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 13:32:03 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199707262032.NAA03024@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Whats happened to ping? To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 13:32:03 -0700 (MST) Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, jdp@polstra.com In-Reply-To: <199707260716.RAA01058@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Jul 26, 97 05:16:01 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > This is wrong too :-). SIGINT handling was broken for a short time in > both 2.2-"stable" and -current. The diffs between 2.2 and -current are > large because merging of fixes and bugs into 2.2 is very disorganized. Heh. So what can be done to make the merging of bugs more organized? 8-) 8-) 8-). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 16:01:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA24438 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 16:01:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lsd.relcom.eu.net (lsd.relcom.eu.net [193.124.23.23]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA24429; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 16:01:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ache@localhost) by lsd.relcom.eu.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) id DAA03224; Sun, 27 Jul 1997 03:01:31 +0400 (MSD) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 1997 03:01:31 +0400 (MSD) From: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= X-Sender: ache@lsd.relcom.eu.net To: wollman@freebsd.org, FreeBSD-current Subject: Another 'fetch' reset by peer: -b NOT work for this site... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk fetch http://www.geocities.com/Tokyo/Temple/2761/menu1.gif fetch: reading reply from www.geocities.com: Connection reset by peer adding -b option gives _the_same_ result. BTW, new ftp and lynx work nice for this one too. Please fix (another -b-like option?) -- Andrey A. Chernov http://www.nagual.pp.ru/~ache/ From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 16:54:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA26010 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 16:54:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from seera.hn.pl.cp (usr2-dialup58.LosAngeles.mci.net [204.189.209.122]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA26005 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 16:54:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from seera.hn.pl.cp (localhost.hn.pl.cp [127.0.0.1]) by seera.hn.pl.cp (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id QAA02568 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 16:54:18 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <33DA8E28.E16EA8BA@mci2000.com> Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 23:54:16 +0000 From: Minsung Kim X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01b6C [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: FreeBSD-CURRENT Usergroup Subject: 3.0-CURRENT kernel anomaly with X X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've upgraded my kernel to -current recently, and seeing these weird things during X is running. (The symptom goes worse if Netscape 4.01b6[en] for Linux 2.0 is running.) o Many instances of of shell scripts die screaming "out of swap space." That's seen on the console like this: Jul 25 00:01:34 x /kernel: swap_pager: out of swap space Jul 25 00:01:37 x /kernel: pid 2553 (bash), uid 0, was killed: out of swap space o Compilation of program fails occasionally with apparently absurd errors -- I can't catch any errors in the source code -- when a simple retry succeeds. o Outputs of compiled code varies from time to time. (I noticed it building my kernel -- I usually builds the kernel twice and compares object files to each other, except for vers.o.) o The 1st characters of items on my TWM menu are garbled. (For instance, "File Runner" sometimes looks "Nile Runner", etc. :-&) Does any of these ring a bell? TIA. -- Stair =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Minsung Kim (Stair in Cyberland) From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 17:02:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA26278 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 17:02:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from scanner.worldgate.com (scanner.worldgate.com [198.161.84.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA26259; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 17:02:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from znep.com (uucp@localhost) by scanner.worldgate.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with UUCP id SAA21647; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 18:02:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (marcs@localhost) by alive.znep.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA21946; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 18:04:02 -0600 (MDT) Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 18:04:01 -0600 (MDT) From: Marc Slemko To: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= cc: wollman@FreeBSD.ORG, FreeBSD-current Subject: Re: Another 'fetch' reset by peer: -b NOT work for this site... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by hub.freebsd.org id RAA26261 Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 27 Jul 1997, [KOI8-R] Андрей Чернов wrote: > fetch http://www.geocities.com/Tokyo/Temple/2761/menu1.gif > fetch: reading reply from www.geocities.com: Connection reset by peer > > adding -b option gives _the_same_ result. > > BTW, new ftp and lynx work nice for this one too. > Please fix (another -b-like option?) marcs@valis:~$ fetch http://www.geocities.com/Tokyo/Temple/2761/menu1.gif fetch: reading reply from www.geocities.com: Connection reset by peer marcs@valis:~$ sudo sysctl -w net.inet.tcp.rfc1644=0 net.inet.tcp.rfc1644: 1 -> 0 marcs@valis:~$ fetch http://www.geocities.com/Tokyo/Temple/2761/menu1.gif Receiving menu1.gif (15874 bytes): 100% 15874 bytes transfered in 0.2 seconds (81.36 kB/s) You would need an option to change the way the fetch code handles the connect so FreeBSD doesn't try to use T/TCP. You may want to ask Geocities what OS their server is running on to see if it one with known braindead T/TCP activity or not. 18:00:43.330713 valis.worldgate.com.tr-rsrb-p2 > 205.180.58.12.http: SP 1382936415:1382936515(100) win 16464 (DF) 18:00:43.382215 205.180.58.12.http > valis.worldgate.com.tr-rsrb-p2: S 1234567:1234567(0) ack 1382936416 win 2048 18:00:43.382867 valis.worldgate.com.tr-rsrb-p2 > 205.180.58.12.http: FP 101:155(54) ack 1 win 16464 (DF) 18:00:43.433453 205.180.58.12.http > valis.worldgate.com.tr-rsrb-p2: R 1:1(0) ack 102 win 2048 My guess would be that the other side isn't expecting to see a FIN in the packet in response to its SYN, but it could be a bogon in FreeBSD's code... From owner-freebsd-current Sat Jul 26 19:33:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA02703 for current-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 19:33:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu [18.24.4.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA02698; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 19:33:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from wollman@localhost) by khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA24701; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 22:33:16 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 22:33:16 -0400 (EDT) From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <199707270233.WAA24701@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> To: Marc Slemko Cc: =?KOI8-R?B?4c7E0sXKIP7F0s7P1w==?= , wollman@FreeBSD.ORG, FreeBSD-current Subject: Re: Another 'fetch' reset by peer: -b NOT work for this site... In-Reply-To: References: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < said: > 18:00:43.330713 valis.worldgate.com.tr-rsrb-p2 > 205.180.58.12.http: SP 1382936415:1382936515(100) win 16464 (DF) > 18:00:43.382215 205.180.58.12.http > valis.worldgate.com.tr-rsrb-p2: S 1234567:1234567(0) ack 1382936416 win 2048 > 18:00:43.382867 valis.worldgate.com.tr-rsrb-p2 > 205.180.58.12.http: FP 101:155(54) ack 1 win 16464 (DF) > 18:00:43.433453 205.180.58.12.http > valis.worldgate.com.tr-rsrb-p2: R 1:1(0) ack 102 win 2048 This is pretty clearly brain-damaged behavior. -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame MIT, LCS, CRS, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick