From owner-freebsd-arch Mon Dec 28 22:03:35 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA22465 for freebsd-arch-outgoing; Mon, 28 Dec 1998 22:03:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns1.yes.no (ns1.yes.no [195.204.136.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA22458 for ; Mon, 28 Dec 1998 22:03:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from eivind@bitbox.follo.net) Received: from bitbox.follo.net (bitbox.follo.net [195.204.143.218]) by ns1.yes.no (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id HAA23886 for ; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 07:03:16 +0100 (CET) Received: (from eivind@localhost) by bitbox.follo.net (8.8.8/8.8.6) id HAA71339 for freebsd-arch@freebsd.org; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 07:03:15 +0100 (MET) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA21699 for ; Mon, 28 Dec 1998 21:56:17 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from imp@village.org) Received: from harmony [10.0.0.6] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.71 #1) id 0zus8G-0006Sz-00; Mon, 28 Dec 1998 22:55:52 -0700 Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.1/8.8.3) with ESMTP id WAA23027 for ; Mon, 28 Dec 1998 22:54:02 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <199812290554.WAA23027@harmony.village.org> To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: kld and on demand device loading Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1998 22:54:02 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've been kicking around ideas for making kld even more useful than I'm currently finding it. Before getting too deeply into the kicking around, I thought I'd define the problem and see if others have thought about it as well. Once upon a time, I recall that the linux kernel had a way to dynamically load drivers and unload them on an as needed basis. Need to make a slip connection, the slip driver would load. Once it was done it would unload. In the long term, I'd love to see something like that. I believe that it dovetails well with the new-bus project nicely. In the near term, an area that it fits fairly well is the pcmica stuff. When a card is inserted, the module is loaded, and when removed it is released. I was thinking of hacking pccardd to do this, but then got to thinking better of it and thought I'd ask for people's input before jumping into that. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-arch Mon Dec 28 22:47:36 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA28286 for freebsd-arch-outgoing; Mon, 28 Dec 1998 22:47:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns1.yes.no (ns1.yes.no [195.204.136.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA28264 for ; Mon, 28 Dec 1998 22:47:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from eivind@bitbox.follo.net) Received: from bitbox.follo.net (bitbox.follo.net [195.204.143.218]) by ns1.yes.no (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id HAA24090 for ; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 07:47:14 +0100 (CET) Received: (from eivind@localhost) by bitbox.follo.net (8.8.8/8.8.6) id HAA71509 for freebsd-arch@freebsd.org; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 07:47:13 +0100 (MET) Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (spinner.netplex.com.au [202.12.86.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA27665 for ; Mon, 28 Dec 1998 22:43:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spinner.netplex.com.au (8.9.1/8.9.1/Netplex) with ESMTP id OAA71584; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 14:42:28 +0800 (WST) (envelope-from peter@spinner.netplex.com.au) Message-Id: <199812290642.OAA71584@spinner.netplex.com.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Warner Losh cc: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: kld and on demand device loading In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 28 Dec 1998 22:54:02 MST." <199812290554.WAA23027@harmony.village.org> Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 14:42:26 +0800 From: Peter Wemm Sender: owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Warner Losh wrote: > > I've been kicking around ideas for making kld even more useful than > I'm currently finding it. Before getting too deeply into the kicking > around, I thought I'd define the problem and see if others have > thought about it as well. > > Once upon a time, I recall that the linux kernel had a way to > dynamically load drivers and unload them on an as needed basis. Need > to make a slip connection, the slip driver would load. Once it was > done it would unload. > > In the long term, I'd love to see something like that. I believe that > it dovetails well with the new-bus project nicely. In the near term, > an area that it fits fairly well is the pcmica stuff. When a card is > inserted, the module is loaded, and when removed it is released. I > was thinking of hacking pccardd to do this, but then got to thinking > better of it and thought I'd ask for people's input before jumping > into that. The way I imagined this sort of thing would work, would be that there would be some sort of demand-loading shim that can be configured in place of the driver in question. Trying to configure this sort of thing with the present config(8) would be fun though :-) - unless the default is demand loading if the driver isn't present (which I think would get more than a few objections). Also worth considering.. I've seen several references to different methods of autoconfiguring modules. One is to have the loader read the bios tables and load what is known to be needed as well as any isa devices that were requested. I could imagine that drivers could aquire a loader-callable probe interface so the individual modules could probe before the kernel proper is started, but I suspect that way leads to madness. The other way is to cheat a little and use the bios tables as hints for what the loader should preload, and let the kernel itself figure out what to do later. One other point, the present inuse-count mechanism is inadequate for doing this. Apon unload, the modules are told "unload time!" and are (I think) given a veto. However, with a kld module having several internal modules (eg: coda has a vfs and a devsw module), and they could have different inuse status. The vfs may be willing to unload, but the devsw module may not.. It's too late to get the vfs module back after it's already been told to shoot itself and the cdevsw module says "no, wait...". We need to be able to reclaim the pages freed up by unloading preloaded modules, there is no mechanism for that yet. (the solution seems overly complex given the present distinct pv_entry tables and the vm_page_t tables that (mostly) shadow each other and a phys_avail[] array is used to coordinate them. What I want to try some day is to make a small md_page struct that is inserted into the tail of the vm_page_t and replaces the pv_entry shadow. This can be done in an arch neutral way. Then a vm_page_t can be quickly "found" from the md_page and vice versa without having pointers to each other or doing array offset arithmatic. phys_avail[] could mostly go away then, and (assuming there was room) new vm_page_t's could be added to the system to correspond to pages reclaimed from the preload area. This doesn't interfere with fictitious pages either (if anything, it'll simplify a fair amount of code that has to special case ficitious pages). Naturally, this is pipe dream stuff right now, but I'd like to take a shot at it in a month or two and see if I can sell DG on the idea. :-) Cheers, -Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-arch Mon Dec 28 22:52:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA28895 for freebsd-arch-outgoing; Mon, 28 Dec 1998 22:52:52 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns1.yes.no (ns1.yes.no [195.204.136.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA28887 for ; Mon, 28 Dec 1998 22:52:50 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from eivind@bitbox.follo.net) Received: from bitbox.follo.net (bitbox.follo.net [195.204.143.218]) by ns1.yes.no (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id HAA24121 for ; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 07:52:28 +0100 (CET) Received: (from eivind@localhost) by bitbox.follo.net (8.8.8/8.8.6) id HAA71540 for freebsd-arch@freebsd.org; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 07:52:28 +0100 (MET) Received: from implode.root.com (root.com [208.221.12.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA28791 for ; Mon, 28 Dec 1998 22:51:08 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from root@implode.root.com) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA20403; Mon, 28 Dec 1998 22:52:07 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199812290652.WAA20403@implode.root.com> To: Warner Losh cc: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: kld and on demand device loading In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 28 Dec 1998 22:54:02 MST." <199812290554.WAA23027@harmony.village.org> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1998 22:52:07 -0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Once upon a time, I recall that the linux kernel had a way to > dynamically load drivers and unload them on an as needed basis. Need > to make a slip connection, the slip driver would load. Once it was > done it would unload. > > In the long term, I'd love to see something like that. I believe that > it dovetails well with the new-bus project nicely. In the near term, > an area that it fits fairly well is the pcmica stuff. When a card is > inserted, the module is loaded, and when removed it is released. I > was thinking of hacking pccardd to do this, but then got to thinking > better of it and thought I'd ask for people's input before jumping > into that. The automatic on-demand driver loading has always been our goal with loadable modules. Unloading is more tricky and may be undesirable in certain circumstances. Memory is also cheap enough that unloading isn't a very high priority. ...not that I'd be anything less than enthusiastic to see it implemented, though. -DG David Greenman Co-founder/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-arch Tue Dec 29 05:11:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA28992 for freebsd-arch-outgoing; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 05:11:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns1.yes.no (ns1.yes.no [195.204.136.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id FAA28984 for ; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 05:11:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from eivind@bitbox.follo.net) Received: from bitbox.follo.net (bitbox.follo.net [195.204.143.218]) by ns1.yes.no (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA09802 for ; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 14:11:01 +0100 (CET) Received: (from eivind@localhost) by bitbox.follo.net (8.8.8/8.8.6) id OAA72582 for freebsd-arch@freebsd.org; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 14:11:01 +0100 (MET) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id XAA00230 for ; Mon, 28 Dec 1998 23:04:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from imp@village.org) Received: from harmony [10.0.0.6] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.71 #1) id 0zutCF-0006Ud-00; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 00:04:03 -0700 Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.1/8.8.3) with ESMTP id AAA24239; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 00:02:14 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <199812290702.AAA24239@harmony.village.org> To: dg@root.com Subject: Re: kld and on demand device loading Cc: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 28 Dec 1998 22:52:07 PST." <199812290652.WAA20403@implode.root.com> References: <199812290652.WAA20403@implode.root.com> Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 00:02:14 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <199812290652.WAA20403@implode.root.com> David Greenman writes: > The automatic on-demand driver loading has always been our goal with > loadable modules. Unloading is more tricky and may be undesirable in > certain circumstances. Memory is also cheap enough that unloading isn't > a very high priority. ...not that I'd be anything less than enthusiastic > to see it implemented, though. For the short term, should I hack pccardd to automatically try to load a module that it doesn't know about? Or should there be a more comprehensive plan in place before making such a quick hack? It would be nice to have a fairly stockish kernel, and have modules that I want to debug loaded and unloaded as I hack on them. It would be even nicer if they weren't part of the normal kernel, and that they were loaded automatically when I inserted the card... Warner [DG's reply to this was "I don't think waiting is going to achieve any positive results, so I'd say go for it. Your work might provide the basis for something more general." -Mod.] To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-arch Tue Dec 29 05:13:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA29102 for freebsd-arch-outgoing; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 05:13:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns1.yes.no (ns1.yes.no [195.204.136.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id FAA29097 for ; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 05:13:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from eivind@bitbox.follo.net) Received: from bitbox.follo.net (bitbox.follo.net [195.204.143.218]) by ns1.yes.no (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA09823 for ; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 14:13:02 +0100 (CET) Received: (from eivind@localhost) by bitbox.follo.net (8.8.8/8.8.6) id OAA72602 for freebsd-arch@freebsd.org; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 14:13:02 +0100 (MET) Received: from implode.root.com (root.com [208.221.12.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA02174 for ; Mon, 28 Dec 1998 23:25:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from root@implode.root.com) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA21054; Mon, 28 Dec 1998 23:26:23 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199812290726.XAA21054@implode.root.com> X-To: Peter Wemm cc: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: kld and on demand device loading In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 29 Dec 1998 14:42:26 +0800." <199812290642.OAA71584@spinner.netplex.com.au> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1998 23:26:23 -0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Naturally, this is pipe dream stuff right now, but I'd like to take > a shot at it in a month or two and see if I can sell DG on the > idea. :-) I'm keeping an open mind. Please keep in mind that, like no other data structure in the system, adding something to struct vm_page has serious memory use considerations. One longword extra would consume 1MB of RAM on wcarchive (4MB in the near future). I just went through this in email with Matt Dillon who was also adding something to vm_page. So, the bottom line is that if it results in a neutral or reduction of total memory use in the system - merging pv_entry with vm_page, for example, then I'm open to looking at it further. If not, well, you better have a REAL good reason. :-) -DG David Greenman Co-founder/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-arch Tue Dec 29 05:15:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA29307 for freebsd-arch-outgoing; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 05:15:43 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns1.yes.no (ns1.yes.no [195.204.136.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id FAA29302 for ; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 05:15:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from eivind@bitbox.follo.net) Received: from bitbox.follo.net (bitbox.follo.net [195.204.143.218]) by ns1.yes.no (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA09889 for ; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 14:15:23 +0100 (CET) Received: (from eivind@localhost) by bitbox.follo.net (8.8.8/8.8.6) id OAA72633 for freebsd-arch@freebsd.org; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 14:15:23 +0100 (MET) Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (spinner.netplex.com.au [202.12.86.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA04043 for ; Mon, 28 Dec 1998 23:49:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spinner.netplex.com.au (8.9.1/8.9.1/Netplex) with ESMTP id PAA71907; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 15:48:40 +0800 (WST) (envelope-from peter@spinner.netplex.com.au) Message-Id: <199812290748.PAA71907@spinner.netplex.com.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 X-To: dg@root.com cc: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: kld and on demand device loading In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 28 Dec 1998 23:26:23 PST." <199812290726.XAA21054@implode.root.com> Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 15:48:39 +0800 From: Peter Wemm Sender: owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [About adding fields to struct vm_page -Mod.] David Greenman wrote: > So, the bottom line is that if it results in a neutral or > reduction of total memory use in the system - merging pv_entry with > vm_page, for example, then I'm open to looking at it further. If > not, well, you better have a REAL good reason. :-) That's what I'm aiming at.. I'm pretty sure it would either be neutral overall or a reduction (ie: sizeof merged vm_page_t <= sizeof existing vm_page_t + sizeof pv_entry) since we can drop a pointer from pv_entry. I well recall your previous objection to something else that would have increased this earlier on. ;-) Cheers, -Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-arch Thu Dec 31 05:34:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA00458 for freebsd-arch-outgoing; Thu, 31 Dec 1998 05:34:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns1.yes.no (ns1.yes.no [195.204.136.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id FAA00453 for ; Thu, 31 Dec 1998 05:34:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from eivind@bitbox.follo.net) Received: from bitbox.follo.net (bitbox.follo.net [195.204.143.218]) by ns1.yes.no (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA02996 for ; Thu, 31 Dec 1998 14:33:50 +0100 (CET) Received: (from eivind@localhost) by bitbox.follo.net (8.8.8/8.8.6) id OAA82089 for freebsd-arch@freebsd.org; Thu, 31 Dec 1998 14:33:50 +0100 (MET) Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA22798 for ; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 09:44:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id KAA08904; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 10:44:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id KAA00510; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 10:44:27 -0700 Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 10:44:27 -0700 Message-Id: <199812291744.KAA00510@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Warner Losh Cc: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: kld and on demand device loading In-Reply-To: <199812290554.WAA23027@harmony.village.org> References: <199812290554.WAA23027@harmony.village.org> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > In the long term, I'd love to see something like that. I believe that > it dovetails well with the new-bus project nicely. In the near term, > an area that it fits fairly well is the pcmica stuff. When a card is > inserted, the module is loaded, and when removed it is released. I looked into doing this almost 2 years ago, but unfortunately the 'unload' capability in FreeBSD is almost non-existent. Even simply 'unloading' of IRQ's doesn't work reliably, let alone network devices, SCSI bus's, serial ports, etc.... Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-arch Thu Dec 31 05:35:25 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA00538 for freebsd-arch-outgoing; Thu, 31 Dec 1998 05:35:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns1.yes.no (ns1.yes.no [195.204.136.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id FAA00533 for ; Thu, 31 Dec 1998 05:35:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from eivind@bitbox.follo.net) Received: from bitbox.follo.net (bitbox.follo.net [195.204.143.218]) by ns1.yes.no (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA03009 for ; Thu, 31 Dec 1998 14:35:03 +0100 (CET) Received: (from eivind@localhost) by bitbox.follo.net (8.8.8/8.8.6) id OAA82104 for freebsd-arch@freebsd.org; Thu, 31 Dec 1998 14:35:03 +0100 (MET) Received: from nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id GAA03866 for ; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 06:12:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by nlsystems.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA21332; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 14:11:30 GMT Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 14:11:29 +0000 (GMT) From: Doug Rabson To: Warner Losh cc: dg@root.com, freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: kld and on demand device loading In-Reply-To: <199812290702.AAA24239@harmony.village.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 29 Dec 1998, Warner Losh wrote: > In message <199812290652.WAA20403@implode.root.com> David Greenman writes: > > The automatic on-demand driver loading has always been our goal with > > loadable modules. Unloading is more tricky and may be undesirable in > > certain circumstances. Memory is also cheap enough that unloading isn't > > a very high priority. ...not that I'd be anything less than enthusiastic > > to see it implemented, though. > > For the short term, should I hack pccardd to automatically try to load > a module that it doesn't know about? Or should there be a more > comprehensive plan in place before making such a quick hack? > > It would be nice to have a fairly stockish kernel, and have modules > that I want to debug loaded and unloaded as I hack on them. It would > be even nicer if they weren't part of the normal kernel, and that they > were loaded automatically when I inserted the card... Please go ahead and make some experiments in this area. I'm currently working on shifting PCI into the new-bus system and I've got a brand new Tecra 8000 to play with, so hopefully I can make some progress with cardbus soon too. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message