From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 0: 2:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from www.dci.co.ir (unknown [195.146.32.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 5468414D0E for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 00:02:40 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Ramin@www.dci.co.ir) From: Ramin@www.dci.co.ir To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: 28 Mar 1999 11:30:52 EDT Subject: Hacking World Group! ;) Message-Id: <19990328080242.5468414D0E@hub.freebsd.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Is there any one 2 explain 2 me about HACKING of WorldGroup BBS's? Please TELL 2 ME !!! thanx To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 0: 5:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91FEB152EA for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 00:05:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from s204m82.isp.whistle.com (s204m82.isp.whistle.com [207.76.204.82] (may be forged)) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id AAA36068; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 00:04:14 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 00:03:58 -0800 (PST) From: Julian Elischer X-Sender: julian@s204m82.isp.whistle.com To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: Alfred Perlstein , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: serial consol AND remote gdb possible? In-Reply-To: <34263.922583796@zippy.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Well that's true for now, but kirk and I have been thinking about being able to specify a separate port for gdb.. in fact I think he may be working on it this weekend.. if not I may do it next week. julian On Sat, 27 Mar 1999, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > I've been trying several combinations of flags to get > > one serial port to be my DDB/system console and > > the other to be my remote GDB port. > > ddb/gdb go on the same port - you can't split functionalty along those > lines. > > - Jordan > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 2: 9:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from phobos.illtel.denver.co.us (dsl-206.169.4.82.wenet.com [206.169.4.82]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 63F5B14CB3 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 02:09:50 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from abelits@phobos.illtel.denver.co.us) Received: from localhost (abelits@localhost) by phobos.illtel.denver.co.us (8.9.1a/8.6.9) with SMTP id CAA30345 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 02:11:49 -0800 Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 02:11:47 -0800 (PST) From: Alex Belits To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Lamers... (was "Hacking World Group! ;)") In-Reply-To: <19990328080242.5468414D0E@hub.freebsd.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 28 Mar 1999 Ramin@www.dci.co.ir wrote: > Subject: Hacking World Group! ;) > > Is there any one 2 explain 2 me about HACKING of WorldGroup BBS's? > Please TELL 2 ME !!! > thanx Lamer from Iran, whose ISP runs something DOS/Windoze-based, called "Worldgroup" asking about "hacking Worldgroup" on freebsd-hackers. Is this a new world record in lameness? -- Alex ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Excellent.. now give users the option to cut your hair you hippie! -- Anonymous Coward To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 3:28:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77D9515307 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 03:28:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id VAA13990 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 21:28:17 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199903281128.VAA13990@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: mangled directory panic. To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 21:28:16 +1000 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG doing a dump from wd0d to sd2d runs smoothly until restore is doing the final touches (after responding with a "n" to set owner of ".") when it causes a kernel panic due to a mangled directory entry. this has happened twice now on a system running 2.2.8. Is this a known problem ? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 4:27:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpha.netvision.net.il (alpha.netvision.net.il [194.90.1.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B55914FCA; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 04:26:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from noor@NetVision.net.il) Received: from nvt (nvt.netvision.net.il [194.90.6.14]) by alpha.netvision.net.il (8.9.3/8.8.6) with ESMTP id OAA03292; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 14:25:47 +0200 (IST) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 14:23:57 +0200 (IST) From: Noor Dawod To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: ipfw behavior, is it normal? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi.. Like many others have done before me, this is my first message to this mailing list and I hope not the last. I've been dealing with FreeBSD for quite some time now, and I cannot still understand why few ipfw rules don't work for me. I would like to share it with you and maybe get some help on it. My current ipfw rules are: ----------------------------------------------------------------- 00100 allow ip from any to any via lo0 00200 allow ip from [machine-a-ip] to [server-ip] via xl0 00300 allow ip from [machine-b-ip] to [server-ip] via xl0 00400 allow ip from any to [server-ip] 80 in via xl0 00500 allow ip from any to [server-ip] 21 in via xl0 65000 allow ip from any to any 65535 deny ip from any to any ----------------------------------------------------------------- 00200 and 00300 seem redundant because of rule 65000. But this is where all the problem lies. If I understand right the ipfw rules, if I remove line 65000 from the rules table, then I can still do all ip-related actions from [machine-a] and [machine-b], which their ip numbers are listed in 00200 and 00300. But, once I remove line 65000, I cannot do any ip-related actions on the [server], and even WWW/FTP services are not served as well. What am I missing here, and why the 65000 line MUST be there so that I could access [server] from [machine-a] and [machine-b] ? I apologize if this is not the place to ask such questions, and would like to be told where to send it instead. Thanks for your time and efforts. Noor To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 4:31:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rt2.synx.com (tech.boostworks.com [194.167.81.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B5241507C for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 04:31:17 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from root@synx.com) Received: from synx.com (rn.synx.com [192.1.1.241]) by rt2.synx.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA21541; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 14:38:25 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <199903281238.OAA21541@rt2.synx.com> Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 14:30:03 +0200 (CEST) From: Remy Nonnenmacher Reply-To: remy@synx.com Subject: Re: Hacking World Group! ;) To: Ramin@www.dci.co.ir Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19990328080242.5468414D0E@hub.freebsd.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 28 Mar, Ramin@www.dci.co.ir wrote: > Is there any one 2 explain 2 me about HACKING of WorldGroup BBS's? > Please TELL 2 ME !!! Easy: - Take a screw driver - Remove all metallic parts and covers that hide the secrets inside the box behind you - The real secret is in the little box showing 'power supply' - Remove all covers from it until you see every magic components - be sure to have it switched on (the magic fan must turn. Check plugs) - Put you head in it and lick everything until you see the light of the suckers'^h^h^h^h^h^hhackers' masters...... At this time, you will be....hum.....not Mr 100,000 volts, but yet at a quiet high level. (PS: to become Mr 100,000 volts, redo the process with the 'monitor', the box usualy on top of the previous, initiating, box). > thanx De rien. It's always a pleasure to bring candidates to the 'darwin' prize. RN. IhM To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 4:38: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 44AB815272 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 04:37:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id HAA19162; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 07:46:05 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 07:46:04 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Julian Elischer Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: serial consol AND remote gdb possible? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 28 Mar 1999, Julian Elischer wrote: > On Sat, 27 Mar 1999, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > > > I've been trying several combinations of flags to get > > > one serial port to be my DDB/system console and > > > the other to be my remote GDB port. > > > > ddb/gdb go on the same port - you can't split functionalty along those > > lines. > > > > - Jordan > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Well that's true for now, but kirk and I have been thinking about being > able to specify a separate port for gdb.. > > in fact I think he may be working on it this weekend.. > if not I may do it next week. Please just give me a spec on how you want to specify which port, what i'm going to try is setting the port via flags, and perhaps a variable passed in for the bootloeader. Should have this done by tonight. -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 4:50:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6E2415637 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 04:49:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA10569; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 13:49:21 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 13:49:21 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Andrew Gallatin Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: kld questions In-Reply-To: <14077.30470.231888.128618@grasshopper.cs.duke.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 27 Mar 1999, Andrew Gallatin wrote: > > I'm interested in transforming our Trapeze/Myrinet device driver into > a KLD, and I've got two specific questions about KLDs. > > o How do I attach a PCI device after boot time? Is this even > supported? Can anybody point me at any sample code? > > o How do I make the KLD unload procedure wait until the module is > ready to be unloaded? Is it legal to sleep? > > The motivation behind this question is that the driver allocates its > own memory for receives, and wraps external mbufs around that memory. > That means it has its own mbuf reference & free routines. It would be > a bad thing if an mbuf the driver allocated was still floating around > in the upper layers of the IP stack after the driver was unloaded -- > eventually, M_FREE would call the no-longer existent ext_free() > function. The current pci code has some remnants of old LKM support but I don't think it includes anything functional. The new pci code which I am slowly working on will support loadable drivers (that is the whole point really). This nearly works now with one missing piece (the system needs to re-probe unrecognised devices after a new driver is loaded). -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 5:49:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from relay.ucb.crimea.ua (relay.ucb.crimea.ua [212.110.138.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7119E153EA for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 05:49:28 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ru@ucb.crimea.ua) Received: (from ru@localhost) by relay.ucb.crimea.ua (8.9.2/8.9.2/UCB) id QAA51400; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 16:47:54 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from ru) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 16:47:53 +0300 From: Ruslan Ermilov To: Noor Dawod Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw behavior, is it normal? Message-ID: <19990328164753.A50307@relay.ucb.crimea.ua> Mail-Followup-To: Noor Dawod , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: ; from Noor Dawod on Sun, Mar 28, 1999 at 02:23:57PM +0200 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi! You've screwed your rules up ;-) Rules 400 and 500 are `allow tcp', I suppose. Send us your _real_ rules first. On Sun, Mar 28, 1999 at 02:23:57PM +0200, Noor Dawod wrote: > > Hi.. > > Like many others have done before me, this is my first message to this > mailing list and I hope not the last. I've been dealing with FreeBSD for > quite some time now, and I cannot still understand why few ipfw rules > don't work for me. I would like to share it with you and maybe get some > help on it. > > My current ipfw rules are: > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > 00100 allow ip from any to any via lo0 > 00200 allow ip from [machine-a-ip] to [server-ip] via xl0 > 00300 allow ip from [machine-b-ip] to [server-ip] via xl0 > 00400 allow ip from any to [server-ip] 80 in via xl0 > 00500 allow ip from any to [server-ip] 21 in via xl0 > 65000 allow ip from any to any > 65535 deny ip from any to any > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > 00200 and 00300 seem redundant because of rule 65000. But this is where > all the problem lies. If I understand right the ipfw rules, if I remove > line 65000 from the rules table, then I can still do all ip-related > actions from [machine-a] and [machine-b], which their ip numbers are > listed in 00200 and 00300. But, once I remove line 65000, I cannot do any > ip-related actions on the [server], and even WWW/FTP services are not > served as well. > > What am I missing here, and why the 65000 line MUST be there so that I > could access [server] from [machine-a] and [machine-b] ? > > I apologize if this is not the place to ask such questions, and would > like to be told where to send it instead. > > Thanks for your time and efforts. > > Noor -- Ruslan Ermilov Sysadmin and DBA of the ru@ucb.crimea.ua United Commercial Bank +380.652.247.647 Simferopol, Ukraine http://www.FreeBSD.org The Power To Serve http://www.oracle.com Enabling The Information Age To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 6: 3:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rt2.synx.com (tech.boostworks.com [194.167.81.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C42D156A7 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 06:02:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from root@synx.com) Received: from synx.com (rn.synx.com [192.1.1.241]) by rt2.synx.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA22122; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 16:09:20 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <199903281409.QAA22122@rt2.synx.com> Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 16:00:58 +0200 (CEST) From: Remy Nonnenmacher Reply-To: remy@synx.com Subject: Re: ipfw behavior, is it normal? To: ru@ucb.crimea.ua Cc: noor@NetVision.net.il, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19990328164753.A50307@relay.ucb.crimea.ua> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 28 Mar, Ruslan Ermilov wrote: > Hi! > > You've screwed your rules up ;-) > Rules 400 and 500 are `allow tcp', I suppose. > Send us your _real_ rules first. > I think these *ARE* the real rules. Anyway, 'IP' matches all packets.. [check...check....] Yes. Noor, What is the FBSD version used ? Doing routing ? bridging ? Is the filtering machine the [server] ? > > On Sun, Mar 28, 1999 at 02:23:57PM +0200, Noor Dawod wrote: >> >> Hi.. >> >> Like many others have done before me, this is my first message to this >> mailing list and I hope not the last. I've been dealing with FreeBSD for >> quite some time now, and I cannot still understand why few ipfw rules >> don't work for me. I would like to share it with you and maybe get some >> help on it. >> >> My current ipfw rules are: >> >> ----------------------------------------------------------------- >> 00100 allow ip from any to any via lo0 >> 00200 allow ip from [machine-a-ip] to [server-ip] via xl0 >> 00300 allow ip from [machine-b-ip] to [server-ip] via xl0 >> 00400 allow ip from any to [server-ip] 80 in via xl0 >> 00500 allow ip from any to [server-ip] 21 in via xl0 >> 65000 allow ip from any to any >> 65535 deny ip from any to any >> ----------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> 00200 and 00300 seem redundant because of rule 65000. But this is where >> all the problem lies. If I understand right the ipfw rules, if I remove >> line 65000 from the rules table, then I can still do all ip-related >> actions from [machine-a] and [machine-b], which their ip numbers are >> listed in 00200 and 00300. But, once I remove line 65000, I cannot do any >> ip-related actions on the [server], and even WWW/FTP services are not >> served as well. >> >> What am I missing here, and why the 65000 line MUST be there so that I >> could access [server] from [machine-a] and [machine-b] ? >> >> I apologize if this is not the place to ask such questions, and would >> like to be told where to send it instead. >> >> Thanks for your time and efforts. >> >> Noor > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 6:13:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au (adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.36.247]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C0F01547F for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 06:13:04 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kkennawa@physics.adelaide.edu.au) Received: from bragg (bragg [129.127.36.34]) by adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8/UofA-1.5) with SMTP id AAA23412; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:43:55 +0930 (CST) Received: from localhost by bragg; (5.65/1.1.8.2/05Aug95-0227PM) id AA12506; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:42:48 +0930 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:42:48 +0930 (CST) From: Kris Kennaway X-Sender: kkennawa@bragg To: Julian Elischer Cc: Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: RE: amazing packages I just tripped over.. In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 27 Mar 1999, Julian Elischer wrote: > I got it to compile without much pain at all How about making up a port - sounds like it shouldn't be too difficult. Kris ----- The Feynman problem-solving algorithm: 1. Write down the problem 2. Think real hard 3. Write down the solution To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 6:13:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from relay.ucb.crimea.ua (relay.ucb.crimea.ua [212.110.138.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7E36154EF for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 06:13:04 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ru@ucb.crimea.ua) Received: (from ru@localhost) by relay.ucb.crimea.ua (8.9.2/8.9.2/UCB) id RAA56390; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 17:12:10 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from ru) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 17:12:10 +0300 From: Ruslan Ermilov To: Remy Nonnenmacher Cc: noor@NetVision.net.il, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw behavior, is it normal? Message-ID: <19990328171210.A55135@relay.ucb.crimea.ua> Mail-Followup-To: Remy Nonnenmacher , noor@NetVision.net.il, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <19990328164753.A50307@relay.ucb.crimea.ua> <199903281409.QAA22122@rt2.synx.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <199903281409.QAA22122@rt2.synx.com>; from Remy Nonnenmacher on Sun, Mar 28, 1999 at 04:00:58PM +0200 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Mar 28, 1999 at 04:00:58PM +0200, Remy Nonnenmacher wrote: > On 28 Mar, Ruslan Ermilov wrote: > > Hi! > > > > You've screwed your rules up ;-) > > Rules 400 and 500 are `allow tcp', I suppose. > > Send us your _real_ rules first. > > > > I think these *ARE* the real rules. Anyway, 'IP' matches all packets.. > You think wrong. I mean: # ipfw add 00500 allow ip from any to 1.2.3.4 21 in via xl0 ipfw: error: only TCP and UDP protocols are valid with port specifications -- Ruslan Ermilov Sysadmin and DBA of the ru@ucb.crimea.ua United Commercial Bank +380.652.247.647 Simferopol, Ukraine http://www.FreeBSD.org The Power To Serve http://www.oracle.com Enabling The Information Age To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 6:13:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.Technion.AC.IL (csa.cs.technion.ac.il [132.68.32.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EDD715690 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 06:13:40 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nadav@cs.technion.ac.il) Received: from csd.csa (csd.cs.technion.ac.il [132.68.32.8]) by cs.Technion.AC.IL (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id QAA26044; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 16:15:00 +0200 (IST) Received: from localhost by csd.csa (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id QAA28826; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 16:14:56 +0200 Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 16:14:56 +0200 (IST) From: Nadav Eiron X-Sender: nadav@csd To: Remy Nonnenmacher Cc: ru@ucb.crimea.ua, noor@NetVision.net.il, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw behavior, is it normal? In-Reply-To: <199903281409.QAA22122@rt2.synx.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 28 Mar 1999, Remy Nonnenmacher wrote: > On 28 Mar, Ruslan Ermilov wrote: > > Hi! > > > > You've screwed your rules up ;-) > > Rules 400 and 500 are `allow tcp', I suppose. > > Send us your _real_ rules first. > > > > I think these *ARE* the real rules. Anyway, 'IP' matches all packets.. > > [check...check....] > > Yes. > > Noor, First, this type of questions should go to questions@freebsd.org. Second, your rules allow only unidirectional traffic: without 65000, server cannot send its replies to whoever is trying to access it. Furthermore, if rule 500 is designed to allow ftp traffic, it's not enough. ftp uses two ports, and unless it's in passive mode, is practicaly impossible to let it through a packet filter without leaving it completely open (as your rule 65000 does). I think you have to do some reading on how to set up a packet filter... > > What is the FBSD version used ? > Doing routing ? bridging ? > Is the filtering machine the [server] ? > > > > > > On Sun, Mar 28, 1999 at 02:23:57PM +0200, Noor Dawod wrote: > >> > >> Hi.. > >> > >> Like many others have done before me, this is my first message to this > >> mailing list and I hope not the last. I've been dealing with FreeBSD for > >> quite some time now, and I cannot still understand why few ipfw rules > >> don't work for me. I would like to share it with youand maybe get some > >> help on it. > >> > >> My current ipfw rules are: > >> > >> ----------------------------------------------------------------- > >> 00100 allow ip from any to any via lo0 > >> 00200 allow ip from [machine-a-ip] to [server-ip] via xl0 > >> 00300 allow ip from [machine-b-ip] to [server-ip] via xl0 > >> 00400 allow ip from any to [server-ip] 80 in via xl0 > >> 00500 allow ip from any to [server-ip] 21 in via xl0 > >> 65000 allow ip from any to any > >> 65535 deny ip from any to any > >> ----------------------------------------------------------------- > >> > >> 00200 and 00300 seem redundant because of rule 65000. But this is where > >> all the problem lies. If I understand right the ipfw rules, if I remove > >> line 65000 from the rules table, then I can still do all ip-related > >> actions from [machine-a] and [machine-b], which their ip numbers are > >> listed in 00200 and 00300. But, once I remove line 65000, I cannot do any > >> ip-related actions on the [server], and even WWW/FTP services arenot > >> served as well. > >> > >> What am I missing here, and why the 65000 line MUST be there so that I > >> could access [server] from [machine-a] and [machine-b] ? > >> > >> I apologize if this is not the place to ask such questions, and would > >> like to be told where to send it instead. > >> > >> Thanks for your time and efforts. > >> > >> Noor > > > > Nadav To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 6:17: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rt2.synx.com (tech.boostworks.com [194.167.81.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D398315690 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 06:16:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from root@synx.com) Received: from synx.com (rn.synx.com [192.1.1.241]) by rt2.synx.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA22223; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 16:22:40 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <199903281422.QAA22223@rt2.synx.com> Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 16:14:17 +0200 (CEST) From: Remy Nonnenmacher Reply-To: remy@synx.com Subject: Re: ipfw behavior, is it normal? To: ru@ucb.crimea.ua Cc: noor@NetVision.net.il, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19990328171210.A55135@relay.ucb.crimea.ua> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 28 Mar, Ruslan Ermilov wrote: > On Sun, Mar 28, 1999 at 04:00:58PM +0200, Remy Nonnenmacher wrote: >> On 28 Mar, Ruslan Ermilov wrote: >> > Hi! >> > >> > You've screwed your rules up ;-) >> > Rules 400 and 500 are `allow tcp', I suppose. >> > Send us your _real_ rules first. >> > >> >> I think these *ARE* the real rules. Anyway, 'IP' matches all packets.. >> > > You think wrong. I mean: > > # ipfw add 00500 allow ip from any to 1.2.3.4 21 in via xl0 > ipfw: error: only TCP and UDP protocols are valid with port specifications > > Bingo !! [Poor checking...Baf...Baf...] ;). Thanks Ruslan. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 6:19:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from chmls05.mediaone.net (ne.mediaone.net [24.128.1.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2A8515735 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 06:19:51 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from housley@frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net) Received: from frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net (frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net [24.128.74.10]) by chmls05.mediaone.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA26474; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 09:19:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net (housley@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net (8.9.2/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA50433; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 09:19:32 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from housley@frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net) Message-ID: <36FE3A73.645CDE1A@frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net> Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 09:19:31 -0500 From: "James E. Housley" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Noor Dawod Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw behavior, is it normal? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Noor Dawod wrote: > > Hi.. > > Like many others have done before me, this is my first message to this > mailing list and I hope not the last. I've been dealing with FreeBSD for > quite some time now, and I cannot still understand why few ipfw rules > don't work for me. I would like to share it with you and maybe get some > help on it. > > My current ipfw rules are: > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > 00100 allow ip from any to any via lo0 > 00200 allow ip from [machine-a-ip] to [server-ip] via xl0 > 00300 allow ip from [machine-b-ip] to [server-ip] via xl0 > 00400 allow ip from any to [server-ip] 80 in via xl0 > 00500 allow ip from any to [server-ip] 21 in via xl0 > 65000 allow ip from any to any > 65535 deny ip from any to any > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > 00200 and 00300 seem redundant because of rule 65000. But this is where > all the problem lies. If I understand right the ipfw rules, if I remove > line 65000 from the rules table, then I can still do all ip-related > actions from [machine-a] and [machine-b], which their ip numbers are > listed in 00200 and 00300. But, once I remove line 65000, I cannot do any > ip-related actions on the [server], and even WWW/FTP services are not > served as well. > 65000 is needed to allow packets from YOUR machine BACK to the originator of the WWW/FTP requests. The other option is 00450 allow tcp from [server-ip] 80 to any out via xl0 For FTP you need ports 20 and 21. 21 is for FTP connecitons and 20 is actually used for the data connection. Jim -- James E. Housley PGP: 1024/03983B4D System Supply, Inc. 2C 3F 3A 0D A8 D8 C3 13 Pager: pagejim@notepage.com 7C F0 B5 BF 27 8B 92 FE To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 6:21:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D465156F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 06:21:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id AAA18161 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:20:57 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199903281420.AAA18161@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: another ufs panic.. To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:20:57 +1000 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I never realised ufs was so bad on freebsd...I experienced another panic whilst using pax to copy one fs to another (was already 90% there on the destination due to the crash from dump/restore). ...there have been substantial ufs improvements in 3.x, yes ? darren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 6:29:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au (adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.36.247]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FE9815830 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 06:27:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kkennawa@physics.adelaide.edu.au) Received: from bragg (bragg [129.127.36.34]) by adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8/UofA-1.5) with SMTP id AAA23578; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:58:00 +0930 (CST) Received: from localhost by bragg; (5.65/1.1.8.2/05Aug95-0227PM) id AA30689; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:56:54 +0930 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:56:54 +0930 (CST) From: Kris Kennaway X-Sender: kkennawa@bragg To: Darren Reed Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-Reply-To: <199903281420.AAA18161@cheops.anu.edu.au> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 29 Mar 1999, Darren Reed wrote: > I never realised ufs was so bad on freebsd...I experienced another > panic whilst using pax to copy one fs to another (was already 90% there > on the destination due to the crash from dump/restore). > > ...there have been substantial ufs improvements in 3.x, yes ? I'm not someone who is able to track this down, but without posting a kernel backtrace these posts are content-free. Kris ----- The Feynman problem-solving algorithm: 1. Write down the problem 2. Think real hard 3. Write down the solution To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 6:30:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lily.ezo.net (lily.ezo.net [206.102.130.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE61E1500B for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 06:30:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jflowers@ezo.net) Received: from crocus (c3-1d196.neo.rr.com [24.93.233.196]) by lily.ezo.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA13599; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 09:30:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00c401be7927$838e5060$23b197ce@ezo.net> From: "Jim Flowers" To: , "Terry Glanfield" References: <9903091652.AA04146@ppsl.demon.co.uk> <36E57226.15FB7483@whistle.com> Subject: Re: Tunnel loopback Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 09:30:21 -0500 Organization: EZNets, Inc. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Terry I'm still trying to figure out what you are doing and how you are doing it. It looks as if you have a fbsd box with an nic interface with SKIP attached to it. All outbound packets are routed (static/dynamic) first to the tun0 interface which is in turn diverted by an ipfw rule to natd where source address substitution is (possibly) performed before returning to ipfw and thence to SKIP where, if an ACL entry is matched, the packet is encrypted/authenticated/encapsulated and sent out the nic interface to a (perhaps) modified destination. Returning packets are deSKIPped and, due to the destination address now being the tun0 interface are processed by the same ipfw divert rule to restore the destination address to that of the connection originator. My interpretation sounds weak and incomplete. I am hoping that you will shed some light on the process or even provide a more complete example. Thanks. ----- Original Message ----- From: Terry Glanfield To: Julian Elischer ; Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 1999 5:11 PM Subject: Re: Tunnel loopback > > Terry Glanfield wrote: > > > I've been trying to use a FreeBSD (3.0-RELEASE and 3.1-RELEASE) tunnel > > > device (/dev/tunN) to push packets back onto the IP stack[1] with some > > > success. > > > > You might find that using ipfw and divert sockets is a much more natural > > fit to this problem. > > Indeed it was. I now have outbound packets pushed into tun0 then > diverted out and inbound SKIP packets diverted and shoved into tun0. > Works a treat - cheers Julian. > > Regards, > Terry. > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 6:34:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp1.vnet.net (smtp1.vnet.net [166.82.1.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 155C914A0B for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 06:34:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp1.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA26205; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 09:35:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA40383; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 09:33:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id JAA02354; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 09:33:38 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 09:33:38 -0500 (EST) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199903281433.JAA02354@lakes.dignus.com> To: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-Reply-To: <199903281420.AAA18161@cheops.anu.edu.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > I never realised ufs was so bad on freebsd...I experienced another > panic whilst using pax to copy one fs to another (was already 90% there > on the destination due to the crash from dump/restore). > > ...there have been substantial ufs improvements in 3.x, yes ? > > darren > I wasn't aware ufs is "so bad" on freebsd... perhaps you are experiencing hardware problems? If you'd provide more details - machine specifics, type of panic, traceback, etc... we can likely narrow this down. - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 6:53:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix, from userid 608) id C71D514D61; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 06:53:15 -0800 (PST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" To: housley@frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net Cc: noor@NetVision.net.il, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: <36FE3A73.645CDE1A@frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net> (housley@frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net) Subject: Re: ipfw behavior, is it normal? References: <36FE3A73.645CDE1A@frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net> Message-Id: <19990328145315.C71D514D61@hub.freebsd.org> Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 06:53:15 -0800 (PST) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > > My current ipfw rules are: > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > 00100 allow ip from any to any via lo0 > > 00200 allow ip from [machine-a-ip] to [server-ip] via xl0 > > 00300 allow ip from [machine-b-ip] to [server-ip] via xl0 > > 00400 allow ip from any to [server-ip] 80 in via xl0 > > 00500 allow ip from any to [server-ip] 21 in via xl0 > > 65000 allow ip from any to any > > 65535 deny ip from any to any > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > 65000 is needed to allow packets from YOUR machine BACK to the > originator of the WWW/FTP requests. The other option is > > 00450 allow tcp from [server-ip] 80 to any out via xl0 > > For FTP you need ports 20 and 21. 21 is for FTP connecitons and 20 is > actually used for the data connection. add a rule "allow tcp from any to any established". that will take care of return packets for any tcp connection you have created. this rule leaves a hole for people scanning you with specially crafted packets, those that have the ACK bit set. nmap can do this i believe. cant get to their web site at the moment, seems to be down. jmb To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 7: 5:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7A5814C14 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 07:05:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id BAA19216; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 01:04:43 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199903281504.BAA19216@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. To: rivers@dignus.com (Thomas David Rivers) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 01:04:43 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199903281433.JAA02354@lakes.dignus.com> from "Thomas David Rivers" at Mar 28, 99 09:33:38 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In some mail from Thomas David Rivers, sie said: > > > > > > > I never realised ufs was so bad on freebsd...I experienced another > > panic whilst using pax to copy one fs to another (was already 90% there > > on the destination due to the crash from dump/restore). > > > > ...there have been substantial ufs improvements in 3.x, yes ? > > > > darren > > > > I wasn't aware ufs is "so bad" on freebsd... perhaps you are > experiencing hardware problems? > > If you'd provide more details - machine specifics, type of panic, > traceback, etc... we can likely narrow this down. Well, unfortunately I don't keep partitions with 128MB free* in them so savecore has a problem when it comes to creating something from which I can get a backtrace from (I hadn't configured the kernel for ddb yet as it is still pretty much just GENERIC 2.2.8). FWIW, details: 2*200MMX, 128MB RAM, 2940UW, sd0=2GB, sd1=ZIP, sd2=9.1GB (Freebsd is going here in a smaller partition), wd0=6.4GB (where freebsd is coming from). Problems occured copying from wd0 to sd2. The disklabel for sd2 appears fine. In both cases freebsd is just a partition amongst others. the most recent panic was: panic: blkfree: freeing free frag If panic messages were logged by syslogd I'd have the previous ones too. Darren * - dumping all of memory is silly. SunOS4/5 have always been diskspace friendly when dumping including now dumping in a compressed format. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 7: 6:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id C936D1521A; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 07:06:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id OAA03534; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 14:44:48 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199903281244.OAA03534@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: ipfw behavior, is it normal? To: jmb@hub.freebsd.org (Jonathan M. Bresler) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 14:44:47 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: housley@frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net, noor@NetVision.net.il, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19990328145315.C71D514D61@hub.freebsd.org> from "Jonathan M. Bresler" at Mar 28, 99 06:52:56 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1016 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Re. the problem with ipfw configurations... should we add another instruction to ipfw between A and B ... to ease life in configuring firewalls ? Performance of a ruleset will be only marginally improved, but having simpler rules will indirectly make configurations more secure by reducing mistakes. From the implementation point of view i think it is just one more flag and replicating the four "if (...) continue" which check addresses and ports. Performancewise, there is almost no saving because the only checks that we save (those on interfaces) almost never apply for bidirectional case. cheers luigi -----------------------------------+------------------------------------- Luigi RIZZO . EMAIL: luigi@iet.unipi.it . Dip. di Ing. dell'Informazione HTTP://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ . Universita` di Pisa TEL/FAX: +39-050-568.533/522 . via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) -----------------------------------+------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 7:23:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D582514BEF for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 07:23:29 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id AAA00138; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:23:21 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <36FE4857.14E19467@newsguy.com> Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:18:47 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Darren Reed , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. References: <199903281420.AAA18161@cheops.anu.edu.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Darren Reed wrote: > > I never realised ufs was so bad on freebsd...I experienced another > panic whilst using pax to copy one fs to another (was already 90% there > on the destination due to the crash from dump/restore). Neither did anyone else, since nobody seems to have the problem you describe. Or, if they do, they are so screwed up that they can't even open a PR. So... how about opening a PR? > ...there have been substantial ufs improvements in 3.x, yes ? No. Nobody has been complaining about ufs. Hell, that's the fs we all use. We wouldn't be *able* to do anything if it was so buggy. -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "What kind of psychologist laughs at her patients?" "I don't laugh at all of them." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 7:28:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix, from userid 608) id B065314C14; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 07:28:46 -0800 (PST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it Cc: housley@frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net, noor@NetVision.net.il, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: <199903281244.OAA03534@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> (message from Luigi Rizzo on Sun, 28 Mar 1999 14:44:47 +0200 (MET DST)) Subject: Re: ipfw behavior, is it normal? References: <199903281244.OAA03534@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Message-Id: <19990328152846.B065314C14@hub.freebsd.org> Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 07:28:46 -0800 (PST) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > From: Luigi Rizzo > Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 14:44:47 +0200 (MET DST) > Cc: housley@frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net, noor@NetVision.net.il, > freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG > Content-Type: text > Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG > X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Precedence: bulk > > Re. the problem with ipfw configurations... > > should we add another instruction to ipfw > > between A and B ... > > to ease life in configuring firewalls ? Performance of a ruleset > will be only marginally improved, but having simpler rules will > indirectly make configurations more secure by reducing mistakes. i understand between to be a short cut that replaces "from A to B" and "from B to A". i prefer the present syntax, it allows me to control who originates the connection. seems to me that the new syntax would not be used very frequently. most of my rules (27 of 30) have "any" as one endpoint. dont think that i want to use a "between" in cominbation with "any". seems to me that its better to have people understand what they are configuratin rather than make the configuration syntax hide the asymmetric nature of tcp. jmb To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 7:34:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp2.vnet.net (smtp2.vnet.net [166.82.1.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8D4E14BEF for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 07:34:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp2.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id KAA08008; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:35:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA40506; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:34:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id KAA02722; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:34:05 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:34:05 -0500 (EST) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199903281534.KAA02722@lakes.dignus.com> To: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, dcs@newsguy.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-Reply-To: <36FE4857.14E19467@newsguy.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Darren Reed wrote: > > > > I never realised ufs was so bad on freebsd...I experienced another > > panic whilst using pax to copy one fs to another (was already 90% there > > on the destination due to the crash from dump/restore). > > Neither did anyone else, since nobody seems to have the problem you > describe. Or, if they do, they are so screwed up that they can't > even open a PR. So... how about opening a PR? Now that we've seen at least one panic message; I believe there already is a PR in the data base for this. I entered a PR for it many months ago... It is a problem which is difficult to reproduce. Several discussions about this particular problem have been had for about two years now... under various heading; the most humorous was the "Dave Rivers memorial panic" :-) You can find such discussions in the mail archive. If you have a reliable reproduction of it; we'd sure be interested in the details. Just for what its worth - I don't believe the problem to be in the UFS code, but at a lower level. That's just my opinion... Also - some people reported that moving to 3.x improved the situation greatly. You may consider upgrading... And, several people who reported this particular eventually determined it was a hardware issue... usually questionable disk controllers. (I have never seen the problem on a 2940UW as you have; just aha1542 and IDE.) And... lastly, with a possibly SCSI-related problem - be sure termination is right. Don't trust the 2940UW auto-termination, do it yourself. - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 7:47:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB81815272 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 07:47:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id BAA20216; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 01:46:43 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199903281546.BAA20216@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. To: rivers@dignus.com (Thomas David Rivers) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 01:46:42 +1000 (EST) Cc: dcs@newsguy.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199903281534.KAA02722@lakes.dignus.com> from "Thomas David Rivers" at Mar 28, 99 10:34:05 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In some mail from Thomas David Rivers, sie said: > > > Darren Reed wrote: > > > > > > I never realised ufs was so bad on freebsd...I experienced another > > > panic whilst using pax to copy one fs to another (was already 90% there > > > on the destination due to the crash from dump/restore). > > > > Neither did anyone else, since nobody seems to have the problem you > > describe. Or, if they do, they are so screwed up that they can't > > even open a PR. So... how about opening a PR? [...] > It is a problem which is difficult to reproduce. > > Several discussions about this particular problem have been had > for about two years now... under various heading; the most humorous > was the "Dave Rivers memorial panic" :-) You can find such > discussions in the mail archive. > > If you have a reliable reproduction of it; we'd sure be > interested in the details. Maybe later I'll try it again...right now I'm looking for a good way to quickly copy files from disk to disk... pax seems to interfere a lot with file modes, etc trying rsync now but maybe I have to go back to tar! > Just for what its worth - I don't believe the problem to be in the UFS code, > but at a lower level. That's just my opinion... Hmmm. [...] > And... lastly, with a possibly SCSI-related problem - be sure termination > is right. Don't trust the 2940UW auto-termination, do it yourself. FWIW, I had a lot of trouble getting termination "right" - I've internal 8bit, external 8bit and internal 16bit SCSI devices (which I'm not sure is actually supported...). But anyway, NT installed ok, as did BSDi (but both onto the 2GB disk - BSDi 4.0 doesn't seem to know about targets > 7 on their boot diskette...sigh). darren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 8: 4:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from detlev.UUCP (31-sweet.camalott.com [208.239.153.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18BE01521A; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 08:04:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from joelh@gnu.org) Received: (from joelh@localhost) by detlev.UUCP (8.9.3/8.9.1) id KAA02464; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:03:28 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from joelh) To: Greg Lehey Cc: Andrzej Bialecki , Jesse , "Daniel C. Sobral" , freebsd-net@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Followups-to: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default? (was: Taking panic dumps (was: 3.1-STABLE dies on 40+ connects (resolved))) References: <19990327174738.B425@lemis.com> <19990328114410.U53452@lemis.com> From: Joel Ray Holveck Date: 28 Mar 1999 10:03:28 -0600 In-Reply-To: Greg Lehey's message of "Sun, 28 Mar 1999 11:44:10 +0930" Message-ID: <86677l38kv.fsf@detlev.UUCP> Lines: 23 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 20.3 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Followups set to -hackers, this isn't -net material. > In that connection, any comments about changing the default way of > building a kernel to create a debug kernel and a stripped copy, and > install the stripped copy? It would require about 10 MB more storage > and a little more time to build the kernel, but since kgdb is useless > without the debug symbols, and disk space is cheap, it seems to me > that it would be worthwhile. I would personally lean a little closer to either making it configurable. This could be a flag in make.conf, or the new behaviour of config -g, or (least desirable) even an option in the kernel config file. Still, somehow or another, make it disablable; that's easy enough to do. Cheers, joelh -- Joel Ray Holveck - joelh@gnu.org Fourth law of programming: Anything that can go wrong wi sendmail: segmentation violation - core dumped To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 8: 9:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nomad.dataplex.net (nomad.dataplex.net [216.140.184.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BCDF15679 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 08:09:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rkw@dataplex.net) Received: from localhost (rkw@localhost) by nomad.dataplex.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id KAA53629; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:09:05 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rkw@dataplex.net) X-Authentication-Warning: nomad.dataplex.net: rkw owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:09:05 -0600 (CST) From: Richard Wackerbarth Reply-To: rkw@dataplex.net To: Darren Reed Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-Reply-To: <199903281546.BAA20216@cheops.anu.edu.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 29 Mar 1999, Darren Reed wrote: > > And... lastly, with a possibly SCSI-related problem - be sure termination > > is right. Don't trust the 2940UW auto-termination, do it yourself. > > FWIW, I had a lot of trouble getting termination "right" - I've internal > 8bit, external 8bit and internal 16bit SCSI devices I believe that you still don't have it "right" if you are attempting to use all three cables at the same time. You are allowed only TWO terminators and there MUST be one at the END of EACH cable. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 8:18:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from skraldespand.demos.su (skraldespand.demos.su [194.87.5.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 196B51537C for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 08:18:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mishania@skraldespand.demos.su) Received: (from mishania@localhost) by skraldespand.demos.su (8.9.3/8.9.2) id UAA14834; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 20:13:40 +0400 (MSD) (envelope-from mishania) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 20:13:39 +0400 From: "Mikhail A. Sokolov" To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Cc: Darren Reed , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. Message-ID: <19990328201339.A14768@demos.su> References: <199903281420.AAA18161@cheops.anu.edu.au> <36FE4857.14E19467@newsguy.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii In-Reply-To: <36FE4857.14E19467@newsguy.com>; from "Daniel C. Sobral" on Mon, Mar 29, 1999 at 12:18:47AM +0900 X-Useless-Header: Look ma! It's a # sign! X-Point-of-View: Gravity is myth, - the earth sucks. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Mar 29, 1999 at 12:18:47AM +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: # > ...there have been substantial ufs improvements in 3.x, yes ? # No. Nobody has been complaining about ufs. Hell, that's the fs we # all use. We wouldn't be *able* to do anything if it was so buggy. You didn't look into at least 2 month old archives, did you? Pardon to comment in such a useless way, but it sometimes hurt people wouldn't read before answering. Darren, people who moved from 2.x to 3.x-stable are reporting nicely about their systems, might be you should as well. Again, why did you use pax but cpio and such? # Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) # dcs@freebsd.org -- -mishania P.S. isn't this a -stable matter? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 8:18:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EBDFB156A0 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 08:18:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA10958; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 17:14:57 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 17:14:57 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Darren Reed Cc: Thomas David Rivers , dcs@newsguy.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-Reply-To: <199903281546.BAA20216@cheops.anu.edu.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 29 Mar 1999, Darren Reed wrote: > In some mail from Thomas David Rivers, sie said: > > > > > Darren Reed wrote: > > > > > > > > I never realised ufs was so bad on freebsd...I experienced another > > > > panic whilst using pax to copy one fs to another (was already 90% there > > > > on the destination due to the crash from dump/restore). > > > > > > Neither did anyone else, since nobody seems to have the problem you > > > describe. Or, if they do, they are so screwed up that they can't > > > even open a PR. So... how about opening a PR? > [...] > > It is a problem which is difficult to reproduce. > > > > Several discussions about this particular problem have been had > > for about two years now... under various heading; the most humorous > > was the "Dave Rivers memorial panic" :-) You can find such > > discussions in the mail archive. > > > > If you have a reliable reproduction of it; we'd sure be > > interested in the details. > > Maybe later I'll try it again...right now I'm looking for a good way to > quickly copy files from disk to disk... pax seems to interfere a lot with > file modes, etc trying rsync now but maybe I have to go back to tar! > > > Just for what its worth - I don't believe the problem to be in the UFS code, > > but at a lower level. That's just my opinion... > > Hmmm. > > [...] > > And... lastly, with a possibly SCSI-related problem - be sure termination > > is right. Don't trust the 2940UW auto-termination, do it yourself. > > FWIW, I had a lot of trouble getting termination "right" - I've internal > 8bit, external 8bit and internal 16bit SCSI devices (which I'm not sure is > actually supported...). But anyway, NT installed ok, as did BSDi (but both > onto the 2GB disk - BSDi 4.0 doesn't seem to know about targets > 7 on their > boot diskette...sigh). If this is an aha2940 or similar controller, then it doesn't support using all three connectors at the same time. Using both internal connectors at the same time as the external one is just asking for trouble. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 8:19: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from netshell.com.br (gabriel.netshell.com.br [200.236.148.170]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 4D9C4156FB for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 08:18:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grios@netshell.com.br) Received: (qmail 16213 invoked by uid 1070); 28 Mar 1999 16:19:29 -0000 Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 13:19:29 -0300 (EST) From: Gustavo Vieira Goncalves Coelho Rios To: Noor Dawod Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ipfw behavior, is it normal? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG You have to include a second rule for ftp access: allow tcp from 20 to any Cause, your ftp daemon retunrs data via port 20! You should have some thing related do NAMED, that i believe it should be: allow udp from any 53 to If there is any error here, correct me please! Adios! --- Gustavo Rios - UIN 27456973 ----- On Sun, 28 Mar 1999, Noor Dawod wrote: > > Hi.. > > Like many others have done before me, this is my first message to this > mailing list and I hope not the last. I've been dealing with FreeBSD for > quite some time now, and I cannot still understand why few ipfw rules > don't work for me. I would like to share it with you and maybe get some > help on it. > > My current ipfw rules are: > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > 00100 allow ip from any to any via lo0 > 00200 allow ip from [machine-a-ip] to [server-ip] via xl0 > 00300 allow ip from [machine-b-ip] to [server-ip] via xl0 > 00400 allow ip from any to [server-ip] 80 in via xl0 > 00500 allow ip from any to [server-ip] 21 in via xl0 > 65000 allow ip from any to any > 65535 deny ip from any to any > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > 00200 and 00300 seem redundant because of rule 65000. But this is where > all the problem lies. If I understand right the ipfw rules, if I remove > line 65000 from the rules table, then I can still do all ip-related > actions from [machine-a] and [machine-b], which their ip numbers are > listed in 00200 and 00300. But, once I remove line 65000, I cannot do any > ip-related actions on the [server], and even WWW/FTP services are not > served as well. > > What am I missing here, and why the 65000 line MUST be there so that I > could access [server] from [machine-a] and [machine-b] ? > > I apologize if this is not the place to ask such questions, and would > like to be told where to send it instead. > > Thanks for your time and efforts. > > Noor > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-security" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 8:28:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6DB7F14DE7 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 08:28:27 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id BAA08265; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 01:28:17 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <36FE580C.59CB6C08@newsguy.com> Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 01:25:48 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Mikhail A. Sokolov" Cc: Darren Reed , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. References: <199903281420.AAA18161@cheops.anu.edu.au> <36FE4857.14E19467@newsguy.com> <19990328201339.A14768@demos.su> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Mikhail A. Sokolov" wrote: > > You didn't look into at least 2 month old archives, did you? No, I have been reading it for longer. I don't recall any ufs-related problem. I recall problems related to vm, nfs, and a number of things *not* related to ufs. (And now it seems the problem happens when copying between different mounts, which does not point to an ufs bug.) -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "What kind of psychologist laughs at her patients?" "I don't laugh at all of them." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 8:30:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 6C05D155C8; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 08:30:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id PAA03730; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 15:48:36 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199903281348.PAA03730@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: ipfw behavior, is it normal? To: jmb@hub.freebsd.org (Jonathan M. Bresler) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 15:48:36 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: housley@frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net, noor@NetVision.net.il, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19990328152846.B065314C14@hub.freebsd.org> from "Jonathan M. Bresler" at Mar 28, 99 07:28:27 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1440 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > should we add another instruction to ipfw > > > > between A and B ... > > > > to ease life in configuring firewalls ? Performance of a ruleset > > will be only marginally improved, but having simpler rules will > > indirectly make configurations more secure by reducing mistakes. > > i understand between to be a short cut that replaces "from A to B" > and "from B to A". functionally, yes. but it would map (and you would see) only a single ipfw rule. > i prefer the present syntax, it allows me to control who originates > the connection. "add" does not mean "replace"! the old syntax would still be valid. > seems to me that the new syntax would not be used very frequently. > most of my rules (27 of 30) have "any" as one endpoint. dont think > that i want to use a "between" in cominbation with "any". i guess this is just a matter of preference (or use!). eg you (?) said to use accept tcp from any to any estab as a catchall for the reverse path, (possibly because you want to allow connection opens only from within your net ?) whereas i more frequently use bridge-based firewalls to control some internal labs and paths are much more symmetric. > seems to me that its better to have people understand what they are > configuratin rather than make the configuration syntax hide the > asymmetric nature of tcp. it just makes life easier to the average user. cheers luigi To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 8:36: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F20814CE9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 08:35:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id CAA21317; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 02:35:15 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199903281635.CAA21317@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. To: dcs@newsguy.com (Daniel C. Sobral) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 02:35:14 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <36FE580C.59CB6C08@newsguy.com> from "Daniel C. Sobral" at Mar 29, 99 01:25:48 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG whilst I was sitting here, doing a copy using rsync: /mnt/usr: bad dir ino 69912 at offset 88: mangled entry panic: bad dir darren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 8:37:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9497214C87 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 08:37:40 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id CAA21375; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 02:37:12 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199903281637.CAA21375@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. To: mishania@demos.net (Mikhail A. Sokolov) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 02:37:12 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <19990328201339.A14768@demos.su> from "Mikhail A. Sokolov" at Mar 28, 99 08:13:39 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In some mail from Mikhail A. Sokolov, sie said: > > On Mon, Mar 29, 1999 at 12:18:47AM +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > # > ...there have been substantial ufs improvements in 3.x, yes ? > # No. Nobody has been complaining about ufs. Hell, that's the fs we > # all use. We wouldn't be *able* to do anything if it was so buggy. > > You didn't look into at least 2 month old archives, did you? > Pardon to comment in such a useless way, but it sometimes hurt people wouldn't > read before answering. > > Darren, people who moved from 2.x to 3.x-stable are reporting nicely about > their systems, might be you should as well. Again, why did you use pax but > cpio and such? Because dump/restore weren't performing well with "cp /usr /mnt/usr" darren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 8:41:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix, from userid 608) id 5460B14D2F; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 08:41:22 -0800 (PST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it Cc: housley@frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net, noor@NetVision.net.il, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: <199903281348.PAA03730@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> (message from Luigi Rizzo on Sun, 28 Mar 1999 15:48:36 +0200 (MET DST)) Subject: Re: ipfw behavior, is it normal? References: <199903281348.PAA03730@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Message-Id: <19990328164122.5460B14D2F@hub.freebsd.org> Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 08:41:22 -0800 (PST) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > From: Luigi Rizzo > Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 15:48:36 +0200 (MET DST) > Cc: housley@frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net, noor@NetVision.net.il, > freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG > Content-Type: text > Content-Length: 1440 > > "add" does not mean "replace"! the old syntax would still be valid. agreed! ;) > > seems to me that the new syntax would not be used very frequently. > > most of my rules (27 of 30) have "any" as one endpoint. dont think > > that i want to use a "between" in cominbation with "any". > > i guess this is just a matter of preference (or use!). eg you (?) > said to use it certainly is more a matter of preference than substance, i agree unreservedly. when it comes to security issues, i tend to want things to be less automatic and more explicit, so that people have to realize what they are about, rather than having it just work our for them while not understanding what they are leaving open. but my objection is not a firmly held belief. jmb To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 8:42: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 70EF814C87 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 08:42:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id CAA21476; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 02:41:32 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199903281641.CAA21476@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. To: rkw@dataplex.net Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 02:41:32 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Richard Wackerbarth" at Mar 28, 99 10:09:05 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In some mail from Richard Wackerbarth, sie said: > > On Mon, 29 Mar 1999, Darren Reed wrote: > > > And... lastly, with a possibly SCSI-related problem - be sure termination > > > is right. Don't trust the 2940UW auto-termination, do it yourself. > > > > FWIW, I had a lot of trouble getting termination "right" - I've internal > > 8bit, external 8bit and internal 16bit SCSI devices > > I believe that you still don't have it "right" if you are attempting to > use all three cables at the same time. > > You are allowed only TWO terminators and there MUST be one at the END of > EACH cable. well, that's just it, it's only "two" cables. the internal cable connects the external connector with internal devices. or is that what you're referring to here as not being supported ? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 8:45:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA826152EE for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 08:45:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA15762; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 11:53:25 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 11:53:24 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Darren Reed Cc: "Daniel C. Sobral" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-Reply-To: <199903281635.CAA21317@cheops.anu.edu.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 29 Mar 1999, Darren Reed wrote: > > whilst I was sitting here, doing a copy using rsync: > > /mnt/usr: bad dir ino 69912 at offset 88: mangled entry > panic: bad dir I think you have enough explanations now to fix the problem: 1) your scsi setup is bad 2) you have an _still_ undetermined old version of freebsd what version are you even using? #1 commonly causes the baddir panic, i've seen it before on bogus scsi setups. violating a spec and then stressing the system is a good way to generate a panic. If i ran 100bT for several hundred feet over the spec and then complained about freebsd dropping packets..... #2 there's prolly an update out there -Alfred > > darren > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 8:55:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from relay.ucb.crimea.ua (relay.ucb.crimea.ua [212.110.138.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65B7D14CE9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 08:55:04 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ru@ucb.crimea.ua) Received: (from ru@localhost) by relay.ucb.crimea.ua (8.9.2/8.9.2/UCB) id TAA84819; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 19:53:22 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from ru) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 19:53:21 +0300 From: Ruslan Ermilov To: Luigi Rizzo Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw behavior, is it normal? Message-ID: <19990328195321.A83154@relay.ucb.crimea.ua> Mail-Followup-To: Luigi Rizzo , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <19990328152846.B065314C14@hub.freebsd.org> <199903281348.PAA03730@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <199903281348.PAA03730@labinfo.iet.unipi.it>; from Luigi Rizzo on Sun, Mar 28, 1999 at 03:48:36PM +0200 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Mar 28, 1999 at 03:48:36PM +0200, Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > > should we add another instruction to ipfw > > > > > > between A and B ... > > > > > > to ease life in configuring firewalls ? Performance of a ruleset > > > will be only marginally improved, but having simpler rules will > > > indirectly make configurations more secure by reducing mistakes. > > > > i understand between to be a short cut that replaces "from A to B" > > and "from B to A". > > functionally, yes. but it would map (and you would see) only a single > ipfw rule. > allow ip between any and any ;-) -- Ruslan Ermilov Sysadmin and DBA of the ru@ucb.crimea.ua United Commercial Bank +380.652.247.647 Simferopol, Ukraine http://www.FreeBSD.org The Power To Serve http://www.oracle.com Enabling The Information Age To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 9:12:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nomad.dataplex.net (nomad.dataplex.net [216.140.184.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EF3014CE9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 09:12:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rkw@dataplex.net) Received: from localhost (rkw@localhost) by nomad.dataplex.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id LAA53859; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 11:11:58 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rkw@dataplex.net) X-Authentication-Warning: nomad.dataplex.net: rkw owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 11:11:58 -0600 (CST) From: Richard Wackerbarth Reply-To: rkw@dataplex.net To: Darren Reed Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-Reply-To: <199903281641.CAA21476@cheops.anu.edu.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 29 Mar 1999, Darren Reed wrote: > In some mail from Richard Wackerbarth, sie said: > > > > On Mon, 29 Mar 1999, Darren Reed wrote: > > > > And... lastly, with a possibly SCSI-related problem - be sure termination > > > > is right. Don't trust the 2940UW auto-termination, do it yourself. > > > > > > FWIW, I had a lot of trouble getting termination "right" - I've internal > > > 8bit, external 8bit and internal 16bit SCSI devices > > > > I believe that you still don't have it "right" if you are attempting to > > use all three cables at the same time. > > > > You are allowed only TWO terminators and there MUST be one at the END of > > EACH cable. > > well, that's just it, it's only "two" cables. the internal cable connects > the external connector with internal devices. or is that what you're > referring to here as not being supported ? Where it connects is important. If the internal cable goes from the controller past the internal devices and the end of it is extented through the case to the external cable, that is OK. However, I think that you have a "three legged star". The controller sits at the center and the cables extend out in three directions. The key is how many ENDS of cables are there. The external cable will clearly be one. The 16 bit cable is another. And the internal 8bit is a third. The only LEGAL configuration is to leave at least one of them unused. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 9:41:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from k6n1.znh.org (unknown [207.109.235.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F25A14CAC for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 09:40:58 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from zach@uffdaonline.net) Received: (from zach@localhost) by k6n1.znh.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) id RAA25637; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 17:27:35 GMT (envelope-from zach) Message-ID: <19990328112734.A25624@znh.org> Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 11:27:34 -0600 From: Zach Heilig To: Darren Reed , rkw@dataplex.net Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. References: <199903281641.CAA21476@cheops.anu.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199903281641.CAA21476@cheops.anu.edu.au>; from Darren Reed on Mon, Mar 29, 1999 at 02:41:32AM +1000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Mar 29, 1999 at 02:41:32AM +1000, Darren Reed wrote: > well, that's just it, it's only "two" cables. the internal cable connects > the external connector with internal devices. or is that what you're > referring to here as not being supported ? Ok, There are three connectors (usually): one internal 50 pin connector -> is there a cable attached to this one? one internal 68 pin connector -> is there a cable attached to this one? one external connector (either 50 or 68 pin, I've seen both) -> cable? You can use any two, but not all three. -- Zach Heilig To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 9:56: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from duke.cs.duke.edu (duke.cs.duke.edu [152.3.140.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7481B14C48 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 09:55:56 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gallatin@cs.duke.edu) Received: from grasshopper.cs.duke.edu (grasshopper.cs.duke.edu [152.3.145.30]) by duke.cs.duke.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id MAA14621; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 12:55:31 -0500 (EST) Received: (from gallatin@localhost) by grasshopper.cs.duke.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) id MAA56973; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 12:55:27 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from gallatin@cs.duke.edu) From: Andrew Gallatin MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 12:55:26 -0500 (EST) To: Doug Rabson Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: kld questions In-Reply-To: References: <14077.30470.231888.128618@grasshopper.cs.duke.edu> X-Mailer: VM 6.43 under 20.4 "Emerald" XEmacs Lucid Message-ID: <14078.27843.489740.844029@grasshopper.cs.duke.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Doug Rabson writes: > > The current pci code has some remnants of old LKM support but I don't > think it includes anything functional. The new pci code which I am slowly > working on will support loadable drivers (that is the whole point really). > This nearly works now with one missing piece (the system needs to re-probe > unrecognised devices after a new driver is loaded). Now I have a reason other than esthetics to look forward to the new PCI code. ;-) Thanks, Drew ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Andrew Gallatin, Sr Systems Programmer http://www.cs.duke.edu/~gallatin Duke University Email: gallatin@cs.duke.edu Department of Computer Science Phone: (919) 660-6590 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 10:14:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1AAFC156FB for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:13:06 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id KAA26477; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:12:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:12:41 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199903281812.KAA26477@apollo.backplane.com> To: Darren Reed Cc: rivers@dignus.com (Thomas David Rivers), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. References: <199903281504.BAA19216@cheops.anu.edu.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Well, unfortunately I don't keep partitions with 128MB free* in them :so savecore has a problem when it comes to creating something from :which I can get a backtrace from (I hadn't configured the kernel for :ddb yet as it is still pretty much just GENERIC 2.2.8). : :FWIW, details: :2*200MMX, 128MB RAM, 2940UW, sd0=2GB, sd1=ZIP, sd2=9.1GB (Freebsd is :going here in a smaller partition), wd0=6.4GB (where freebsd is coming from). :Problems occured copying from wd0 to sd2. The disklabel for sd2 appears :fine. In both cases freebsd is just a partition amongst others. : :the most recent panic was: :panic: blkfree: freeing free frag : :If panic messages were logged by syslogd I'd have the previous ones too. : :Darren A bug was fixed about a month ago, -r1.200 kern/vfs_bio.c, that should solve the problem. It is in all branches including 2_2, but it missed the 2.2.8 release. I suggest getting the pain over with and upgrading to -stable ( 3.x ). -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 10:30:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from vespucci.advicom.net (vespucci.advicom.net [199.170.120.42]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 34B4B1576E for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:30:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@vespucci.advicom.net) Received: from localhost (avalon@localhost) by vespucci.advicom.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA13620; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 12:29:59 -0600 (CST) X-Envelope-Recipient: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 12:29:59 -0600 (CST) From: Avalon Books To: Alex Belits Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Lamers... (was "Hacking World Group! ;)") In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 28 Mar 1999, Alex Belits wrote: > On 28 Mar 1999 Ramin@www.dci.co.ir wrote: > > > Subject: Hacking World Group! ;) > > > > Is there any one 2 explain 2 me about HACKING of WorldGroup BBS's? > > Please TELL 2 ME !!! > > Lamer from Iran, whose ISP runs something DOS/Windoze-based, called > "Worldgroup" asking about "hacking Worldgroup" on freebsd-hackers. Is this > a new world record in lameness? > -- > Alex Indeed. This guy (Ramin) sounds like a nominee for this year's "Lamer Of The Year" Award. Anyone care to second this motion? --R. Pelletier Sys Admin, House Galiagante We are a Micro$oft-free site To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 10:54:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (castles504.castles.com [208.214.165.68]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B3CF1531B for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:53:43 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (LOCALHOST [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA06574; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:47:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199903281847.KAA06574@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Darren Reed Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:20:57 +1000." <199903281420.AAA18161@cheops.anu.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:47:19 -0800 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > I never realised ufs was so bad on freebsd...I experienced another > panic whilst using pax to copy one fs to another (was already 90% there > on the destination due to the crash from dump/restore). UFS is fine, but you may have a corrupted disk. No filesystem works well under those circumstances. > ...there have been substantial ufs improvements in 3.x, yes ? Mostly in the realm of soft updates. UFS hasn't been broken, so it doesn't seem to need fixing. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 10:54:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B97AB1578D for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:54:06 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id KAA26838; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:53:45 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:53:45 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199903281853.KAA26838@apollo.backplane.com> To: Avalon Books Cc: Alex Belits , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Lamers... (was "Hacking World Group! ;)") References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : :> > Please TELL 2 ME !!! :> :> Lamer from Iran, whose ISP runs something DOS/Windoze-based, called :> "Worldgroup" asking about "hacking Worldgroup" on freebsd-hackers. Is this :> a new world record in lameness? :> -- :... : : Indeed. This guy (Ramin) sounds like a nominee for this year's "Lamer :Of The Year" Award. Anyone care to second this motion? This character smashing does not belong on -hackers, guys. Please let the thread die. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 11:19:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from yoshi.iq.org (yoshy.iq.org [203.4.184.224]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 603EC14C29; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 11:19:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from proff@yoshi.iq.org) Received: (from proff@localhost) by yoshi.iq.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA18547; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 05:19:20 +1000 (EST) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 05:19:20 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199903281919.FAA18547@yoshi.iq.org> From: Julian Assange To: freebsd-ports@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: festival package from NetBSD Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Festival is a general multi-lingual speech synthesis system developed at CSTR. It offers a full text to speech system with various APIs, as well an environment for development and research of speech synthesis techniques. It is written in C++ with a Scheme-based command interpreter for general control. This package was quite a bit of work to create (27 sub-packages, 10 diphone databases, 4 pronounciation dictionaries, lexicons etc). It should be trivial to port from the NetBSD pkg system to the FreeBSD port system. ftp://suburbia.net/pub/proff/festival.tgz Cheers, Julian. Current version Version 1.3.1 (January 1999) is now available for research, educational and individual use for free. It has the following features * English (British and American), Spanish (mexican) and Welsh text to speech * Externally configurable language independent modules + phonesets, lexicons, letter-to-sound rules, tokenizing, part of speech tagging, intonation and duration. * Waveform synthesizers: + diphone based: residual excited LPC (and PSOLA not for distribution) + MBROLA database support. * Portable (Unix) distribution. * On-line documentation. * SABLE markup, Emacs, client/server (including Java), scripting interfaces. -- Julian Assange http://iq.org/~proff The trouble with acting according to your conscience is that once you start doing it, nobody can trust you any more. Alexis A. Gilliland To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 11:57: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wall.polstra.com (rtrwan160.accessone.com [206.213.115.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 272AE14CD4 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 11:56:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Received: from vashon.polstra.com (vashon.polstra.com [206.213.73.13]) by wall.polstra.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA21134; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 11:56:40 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) From: John Polstra Received: (from jdp@localhost) by vashon.polstra.com (8.9.2/8.9.1) id LAA13947; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 11:56:40 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 11:56:40 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199903281956.LAA13947@vashon.polstra.com> To: fjoe@iclub.nsu.ru Subject: Re: samba+PAM (again) In-Reply-To: Organization: Polstra & Co., Seattle, WA Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article , Max Khon wrote: > > Are there any plans on implementing account management in PAM modules > (at least pam_unix)? Feel free to do it and submit it to us! John -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-interest is the aphrodisiac of belief." -- James V. DeLong To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 13:34:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bubba.whistle.com (s205m7.whistle.com [207.76.205.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6867C14E8E; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 13:34:45 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from archie@whistle.com) Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.whistle.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id NAA72802; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 13:33:44 -0800 (PST) From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199903282133.NAA72802@bubba.whistle.com> Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default? (was: Taking panic dumps (was: 3.1-STABLE dies on 40+ connects (resolved))) In-Reply-To: <19990328114410.U53452@lemis.com> from Greg Lehey at "Mar 28, 99 11:44:10 am" To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 13:33:44 -0800 (PST) Cc: freebsd-net@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL38 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey writes: > In that connection, any comments about changing the default way of > building a kernel to create a debug kernel and a stripped copy, and > install the stripped copy? It would require about 10 MB more storage > and a little more time to build the kernel, but since kgdb is useless > without the debug symbols, and disk space is cheap, it seems to me > that it would be worthwhile. Building debug kernels takes up a lot more space, which some people may not have. How about simply fixing 'config -g' to generate a Makefile that does the extra step of copying and stripping the kernel and installing the stripped version kernel.strip instead of kernel? Then we can modify the handbook et.al. to say "You should build a debug kernel with 'config -g' if at all possible..". All other steps remain the same. Eventually, when/if it's determined that 'config -g' should be the default, we can make it so easily. But that should be a separate step.. -Archie ___________________________________________________________________________ Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 14: 0:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E718156FD for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 13:59:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA37211; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 13:59:03 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Darren Reed Cc: dcs@newsguy.com (Daniel C. Sobral), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 29 Mar 1999 02:35:14 +1000." <199903281635.CAA21317@cheops.anu.edu.au> Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 13:59:03 -0800 Message-ID: <37209.922658343@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Shoot this machine through the head. > > whilst I was sitting here, doing a copy using rsync: > > /mnt/usr: bad dir ino 69912 at offset 88: mangled entry > panic: bad dir > > darren > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 14: 0:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1AF2E1569A for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 13:59:21 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA37200; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 13:58:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Darren Reed Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:20:57 +1000." <199903281420.AAA18161@cheops.anu.edu.au> Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 13:58:38 -0800 Message-ID: <37198.922658318@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I never realised ufs was so bad on freebsd...I experienced another It's not - I'd have to wonder about your hardware, to be honest. I copy filesystems around all the time, with pax and other utilities, and I haven't had a ufs related crash for what must be several years now. The only rocky point for awhile was soft updates, but those haven't bitten me for several months either. - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 14: 5:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C82CD14E55 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 14:05:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA37233; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 14:04:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Doug Rabson Cc: Darren Reed , Thomas David Rivers , dcs@newsguy.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 28 Mar 1999 17:14:57 +0100." Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 14:04:11 -0800 Message-ID: <37231.922658651@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > If this is an aha2940 or similar controller, then it doesn't support using > all three connectors at the same time. Using both internal connectors at > the same time as the external one is just asking for trouble. Let me just echo this claim. Back when I was somewhat younger and less experienced in the ways of SCSI, I tried to do this for the simple reason that it's the obvious thing to try when you have both wide and narrow peripherals in the box (like a wide drive and narrow cdrom), an external device like a scanner and absolutely no conception of how the internal busses are actually wired. What happens then is that you create a "Y" in your SCSI chain, with two terminators on one end, and the fact that it worked for me at all for 5 months until I got another drive for the wide chain and totally pushed things past their limits is, frankly, pure amazing luck. - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 14:42:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9B4214C2A for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 14:42:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id IAA00135; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 08:41:57 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199903282241.IAA00135@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. To: jkh@zippy.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 08:41:57 +1000 (EST) Cc: dfr@nlsystems.com, avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, rivers@dignus.com, dcs@newsguy.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <37231.922658651@zippy.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Mar 28, 99 02:04:11 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In some mail from Jordan K. Hubbard, sie said: > > > If this is an aha2940 or similar controller, then it doesn't support using > > all three connectors at the same time. Using both internal connectors at > > the same time as the external one is just asking for trouble. > > Let me just echo this claim. Back when I was somewhat younger and > less experienced in the ways of SCSI, I tried to do this for the > simple reason that it's the obvious thing to try when you have both > wide and narrow peripherals in the box (like a wide drive and narrow > cdrom), an external device like a scanner and absolutely no conception > of how the internal busses are actually wired. What happens then is > that you create a "Y" in your SCSI chain, with two terminators on one > end, and the fact that it worked for me at all for 5 months until I > got another drive for the wide chain and totally pushed things past > their limits is, frankly, pure amazing luck. Sigh :-( It was all working so lovely too...which did you get a new one for, narrow or wide controller ? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 14:57: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from octopus.originative (originat.demon.co.uk [158.152.220.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D8B814EA3; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 14:56:28 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from paul@originative.co.uk) Received: by octopus with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) id ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 23:54:28 +0100 Message-ID: From: paul@originative.co.uk To: archie@whistle.com, grog@lemis.com Cc: freebsd-net@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: Debug kernel by default? (was: Taking panic dumps (was: 3.1-S TABLE dies on 40+ connects (resolved))) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 23:54:27 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > -----Original Message----- > From: Archie Cobbs [mailto:archie@whistle.com] > Sent: 28 March 1999 22:34 > To: grog@lemis.com > Cc: freebsd-net@FreeBSD.ORG; freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG > Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default? (was: Taking panic dumps (was: > 3.1-STABLE dies on 40+ connects (resolved))) > > > Greg Lehey writes: > > In that connection, any comments about changing the default way of > > building a kernel to create a debug kernel and a stripped copy, and > > install the stripped copy? It would require about 10 MB > more storage > > and a little more time to build the kernel, but since kgdb > is useless > > without the debug symbols, and disk space is cheap, it seems to me > > that it would be worthwhile. > > Building debug kernels takes up a lot more space, which some people > may not have. > > How about simply fixing 'config -g' to generate a Makefile that > does the extra step of copying and stripping the kernel and installing > the stripped version kernel.strip instead of kernel? > Unless I misunderstood Greg I think the intention is to always build a debug kernel without the user really realising that is happening so that when they have a panic they've got the infrastructure there to let the "support team" track down the problem. I think that's a good idea, switch the options around so that by default a debug kernel is built and provide an option to build a "production" kernel. I don't think a kernel built with -g is going to be significantly slower or bigger than a standard kernel once stripped and those after maximum performance should know how to go about getting it. The extra disk space for the build would be only problem but given the size of the code base these days most people who have source will have enough spare disk to build a debug kernel. Paul. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 15: 0:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A38A715285 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 15:00:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA37410; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 14:59:50 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Darren Reed Cc: dfr@nlsystems.com, rivers@dignus.com, dcs@newsguy.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 29 Mar 1999 08:41:57 +1000." <199903282241.IAA00135@cheops.anu.edu.au> Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 14:59:50 -0800 Message-ID: <37408.922661990@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Sigh :-( It was all working so lovely too...which did you get a new one > for, narrow or wide controller ? I got an old narrow controller out of a box and used that, I think it was an Adaptec 1542CF - old narrow SCSI controllers are no problem to find in my various junk boxes. :-) If I hadn't had one available, I'd have gone out and gotten the cheapest NCR or AdvanSys controller I could find and used that, I guess. Since it's typically just for your CDROM or an external device (depending on which of the 3 connections you want to "offload" from your primary controller), you don't even need a BIOS on the card and that tends to make 'em pretty cheap. - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 15:15:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from baerenklau.de.freebsd.org (baerenklau.de.freebsd.org [195.185.195.14]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 888F6153CF for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 15:15:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from w@panke.de.freebsd.org) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by baerenklau.de.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with UUCP id BAA19345; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 01:14:50 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from w@panke.de.freebsd.org) Received: (from w@localhost) by paula.panke.de.freebsd.org (8.9.3/8.8.8) id AAA01323; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:45:18 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from w) Message-ID: <19990329004518.29518@panke.de.freebsd.org> Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:45:18 +0200 From: Wolfram Schneider To: Sheldon Hearn , Michael Mercer , mmercer@ipass.net Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: I have some spare time. References: <36ED51F8.92075F22@nortelnetworks.com> <5095.921524003@axl.noc.iafrica.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.89i In-Reply-To: <5095.921524003@axl.noc.iafrica.com>; from Sheldon Hearn on Mon, Mar 15, 1999 at 08:53:23PM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 1999-03-15 20:53:23 +0200, Sheldon Hearn wrote: > On Mon, 15 Mar 1999 13:31:20 EST, "Michael Mercer" wrote: > > I have some spare time and would like to work on a relatively > > small project. Any ideas???? > > Yep, do some reading. :-) > > Specifically, have a look at chapter 19 of the FreeBSD handbook, > entitled "Contributing to FreeBSD". Or read the current projects of the FreeBSD Documentation Project http://www.freebsd.org/docproj/current.html -- Wolfram Schneider http://wolfram.schneider.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 15:21:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bubba.whistle.com (s205m7.whistle.com [207.76.205.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A15A152D9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 15:21:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from archie@whistle.com) Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.whistle.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id PAA14589; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 15:21:11 -0800 (PST) From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199903282321.PAA14589@bubba.whistle.com> Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default? (was: Taking panic dumps (was: 3.1-S TABLE dies on 40+ connects (resolved))) In-Reply-To: from "paul@originative.co.uk" at "Mar 28, 99 11:54:27 pm" To: paul@originative.co.uk Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 15:21:11 -0800 (PST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, grog@lemis.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL38 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG paul@originative.co.uk writes: > > Greg Lehey writes: > > > In that connection, any comments about changing the default way of > > > building a kernel to create a debug kernel and a stripped copy, and > > > install the stripped copy? It would require about 10 MB more storage > > > and a little more time to build the kernel, but since kgdb is useless > > > without the debug symbols, and disk space is cheap, it seems to me > > > that it would be worthwhile. > > > > Building debug kernels takes up a lot more space, which some people > > may not have. > > > > How about simply fixing 'config -g' to generate a Makefile that > > does the extra step of copying and stripping the kernel and installing > > the stripped version kernel.strip instead of kernel? > > Unless I misunderstood Greg I think the intention is to always build a debug > kernel without the user really realising that is happening so that when they > have a panic they've got the infrastructure there to let the "support team" > track down the problem. [ trimmimg freebsd-net ] Right.. I'm just worried that certain people may object to changing the behavior to do this automatically (not me by the way). > I think that's a good idea, switch the options around so that by default a > debug kernel is built and provide an option to build a "production" kernel. > I don't think a kernel built with -g is going to be significantly slower or > bigger than a standard kernel once stripped and those after maximum > performance should know how to go about getting it. This is just doing my steps #1 and #2 at the same time, ie: Step #1: Fix config -g makefile Step #2: Make config assume -g by default My point was just that doing these steps one at a time would be more digestable to the world. Just trying to take the conservative approach (maybe I've been conditioned :-) > The extra disk space for the build would be only problem but given the size > of the code base these days most people who have source will have enough > spare disk to build a debug kernel. Yes, that's your assumption isn't it... :-) -Archie ___________________________________________________________________________ Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 16:18:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F665156E5 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 16:17:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bob@luke.pmr.com) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id SAA08932 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 18:17:39 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from bob) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 18:17:39 -0600 From: Bob Willcox To: hackers list Subject: Panic in 3.1-stable running amanda, need help debugging Message-ID: <19990328181739.A8801@luke.pmr.com> Reply-To: Bob Willcox Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I have just recently started getting the below (very repeatable) panic on my backup system when it runs amanda. This same configuration had been running for weeks w/o problems and now it consistently fails. Note that this is under very heavy network traffic conditions. I am backing up 9 systems and have the dump max (or whatever its called) set to 5. Also, most of the systems are on my full-duplex switching 100TX hub (a few are on a 10BaseT segment, one is across an ISDN link). I upgraded the backup system to yesterday's level of 3.1-stable and added the kernel debugger (and built with symbols). It still fails (not sure whether I should be happy about that or not :-). The hardware is a PPro 200 w/64MB of memory. As I am not very familiar with FreeBSD internals I thought someone out there could give me some tips on how to go about further debugging this problem. I thank you for any help you can provide. Bob Gdb trace: (kgdb) where #0 boot (howto=260) at ../../kern/kern_shutdown.c:285 #1 0xf014e705 in panic (fmt=0xf0233f4c "from debugger") at ../../kern/kern_shutdown.c:446 #2 0xf012aab1 in db_panic (addr=-266261713, have_addr=0, count=-1, modif=0xf4812d5c "") at ../../ddb/db_command.c:432 #3 0xf012aa51 in db_command (last_cmdp=0xf0251e64, cmd_table=0xf0251cc4, aux_cmd_tablep=0xf0267acc) at ../../ddb/db_command.c:332 #4 0xf012ab16 in db_command_loop () at ../../ddb/db_command.c:454 #5 0xf012ce67 in db_trap (type=3, code=0) at ../../ddb/db_trap.c:71 #6 0xf021290a in kdb_trap (type=3, code=0, regs=0xf4812e4c) at ../../i386/i386/db_interface.c:157 #7 0xf021c0b4 in trap (frame={tf_es = 16, tf_ds = 16, tf_edi = -196231424, tf_esi = 256, tf_ebp = -192860528, tf_isp = -192860556, tf_ebx = -266105266, tf_edx = -266043248, tf_ecx = -267680992, tf_eax = 18, tf_trapno = 3, tf_err = 0, tf_eip = -266261713, tf_cs = 8, tf_eflags = 598, tf_esp = -266043264, tf_ss = -266111117}) at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:548 #8 0xf0212b2f in Debugger (msg=0xf0237773 "panic") at ../../i386/i386/db_interface.c:317 #9 0xf014e6fc in panic (fmt=0xf0238e4e "receive 1") at ../../kern/kern_shutdown.c:444 #10 0xf01667d3 in soreceive (so=0xf44dbf00, psa=0x0, uio=0xf4812f40, mp0=0x0, controlp=0x0, flagsp=0x0) at ../../kern/uipc_socket.c:659 #11 0xf015c6d4 in soo_read (fp=0xf0c54e40, uio=0xf4812f40, cred=0xf0c60000) at ../../kern/sys_socket.c:69 #12 0xf01591ed in read (p=0xf4763ce0, uap=0xf4812f94) at ../../kern/sys_generic.c:121 #13 0xf021c8c3 in syscall (frame={tf_es = -272695257, tf_ds = -272695257, tf_edi = -272638492, tf_esi = 64, tf_ebp = -272638364, tf_isp = -192860188, tf_ebx = 0, tf_edx = 82768, tf_ecx = 6, tf_eax = 3, tf_trapno = 7, tf_err = 7, tf_eip = 537674705, tf_cs = 31, tf_eflags = 514, tf_esp = -272638820, tf_ss = 39}) at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:1100 #14 0x200c43d1 in ?? () #15 0x1f64 in ?? () #16 0x1099 in ?? () Dmesg output: Copyright (c) 1992-1999 FreeBSD Inc. Copyright (c) 1982, 1986, 1989, 1991, 1993 The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE #1: Sun Mar 28 09:35:01 CST 1999 bob@deathstar.pmr.com:/usr/src/sys/compile/DEATHSTAR Timecounter "i8254" frequency 1193182 Hz Timecounter "TSC" frequency 199310420 Hz CPU: Pentium Pro (199.31-MHz 686-class CPU) Origin = "GenuineIntel" Id = 0x616 Stepping=6 Features=0xf9ff real memory = 33554432 (32768K bytes) avail memory = 29814784 (29116K bytes) Preloaded elf kernel "kernel" at 0xf02cd000. Probing for devices on PCI bus 0: chip0: rev 0x02 on pci0.0.0 chip1: rev 0x01 on pci0.1.0 ahc0: rev 0x00 int a irq 12 on pci0.10.0 ahc0: aic7870 Single Channel A, SCSI Id=7, 16/255 SCBs fxp0: rev 0x01 int a irq 10 on pci0.11.0 fxp0: Ethernet address 00:a0:c9:31:e6:21 ncr0: rev 0x01 int a irq 11 on pci0.12.0 ncr1: rev 0x03 int a irq 9 on pci0.13.0 Probing for devices on the ISA bus: sc0 on isa sc0: VGA color <16 virtual consoles, flags=0x0> atkbdc0 at 0x60-0x6f on motherboard atkbd0 irq 1 on isa psm0 not found sio0 at 0x3f8-0x3ff irq 4 flags 0x10 on isa sio0: type 16550A sio1 at 0x2f8-0x2ff irq 3 on isa sio1: type 16550A fdc0 at 0x3f0-0x3f7 irq 6 drq 2 on isa fdc0: FIFO enabled, 8 bytes threshold fd0: 1.44MB 3.5in ppc0 at 0x378 irq 7 on isa ppc0: W83877F chipset (ECP/EPP/PS2/NIBBLE) in COMPATIBLE mode ppc0: FIFO with 16/16/16 bytes threshold nlpt0: on ppbus 0 nlpt0: Interrupt-driven port ppi0: on ppbus 0 plip0: on ppbus 0 vga0 at 0x3b0-0x3df maddr 0xa0000 msize 131072 on isa npx0 on motherboard npx0: INT 16 interface Waiting 10 seconds for SCSI devices to settle sa0 at ahc0 bus 0 target 1 lun 0 sa0: Removable Sequential Access SCSI-2 device sa0: 10.000MB/s transfers (10.000MHz, offset 15) sa1 at ncr0 bus 0 target 5 lun 0 sa1: Removable Sequential Access SCSI-2 device sa1: 4.807MB/s transfers (4.807MHz, offset 8) changing root device to da0s1a cd0 at ncr0 bus 0 target 4 lun 0 cd0: Removable CD-ROM SCSI-2 device cd0: 4.237MB/s transfers (4.237MHz, offset 8) cd0: Attempt to query device size failed: NOT READY, Medium not present da1 at ncr1 bus 0 target 1 lun 0 da1: Fixed Direct Access SCSI-2 device da1: 40.000MB/s transfers (20.000MHz, offset 15, 16bit) da1: 4134MB (8467200 512 byte sectors: 255H 63S/T 527C) da2 at ncr1 bus 0 target 2 lun 0 da2: Fixed Direct Access SCSI-2 device da2: 40.000MB/s transfers (20.000MHz, offset 15, 16bit), Tagged Queueing Enabled da2: 8715MB (17850000 512 byte sectors: 255H 63S/T 1111C) ch0 at ahc0 bus 0 target 0 lun 0 ch0: Removable Changer SCSI-2 device ch0: 3.300MB/s transfers ch0: 11 slots, 1 drive, 1 picker, 0 portals da0 at ncr1 bus 0 target 0 lun 0 da0: < DFRSS2W 4B4B> Fixed Direct Access SCSI-2 device da0: 20.000MB/s transfers (10.000MHz, offset 15, 16bit), Tagged Queueing Enabled da0: 2150MB (4404489 512 byte sectors: 255H 63S/T 274C) WARNING: / was not properly dismounted ffs_mountfs: superblock updated for soft updates ffs_mountfs: superblock updated for soft updates ffs_mountfs: superblock updated for soft updates ffs_mountfs: superblock updated for soft updates ffs_mountfs: superblock updated for soft updates ffs_mountfs: superblock updated for soft updates ffs_mountfs: superblock updated for soft updates link_elf: symbol splash_register undefined Kernel config file: # # DEATHSTAR -- Configure file of the DEATHSTAR system # # For more information read the handbook part System Administration -> # Configuring the FreeBSD Kernel -> The Configuration File. # The handbook is available in /usr/share/doc/handbook or online as # latest version from the FreeBSD World Wide Web server # # # An exhaustive list of options and more detailed explanations of the # device lines is present in the ./LINT configuration file. If you are # in doubt as to the purpose or necessity of a line, check first in LINT. # # $Id$ machine "i386" cpu "I686_CPU" ident DEATHSTAR maxusers 128 options INET #InterNETworking options FFS #Berkeley Fast Filesystem options FFS_ROOT #FFS usable as root device [keep this!] options MFS #Memory Filesystem options NFS #Network Filesystem options MSDOSFS #MSDOS Filesystem options "CD9660" #ISO 9660 Filesystem options "CD9660_ROOT" #CD-ROM usable as root. "CD9660" req'ed options PROCFS #Process filesystem options "COMPAT_43" #Compatible with BSD 4.3 [KEEP THIS!] options SCSI_DELAY=10000 #Be pessimistic about Joe SCSI device options UCONSOLE #Allow users to grab the console options FAILSAFE #Be conservative options USERCONFIG #boot -c editor options VISUAL_USERCONFIG #visual boot -c editor options SOFTUPDATES #enable soft updates support config kernel root on da0 controller isa0 controller pci0 controller fdc0 at isa? port "IO_FD1" bio irq 6 drq 2 disk fd0 at fdc0 drive 0 # A single entry for any of these controllers (ncr, ahb, ahc) is # sufficient for any number of installed devices. controller ncr0 controller ahc0 controller scbus0 device da0 device sa0 device pass0 device cd0 device ch0 # atkbdc0 controlls both the keyboard and the PS/2 mouse controller atkbdc0 at isa? port IO_KBD tty device atkbd0 at isa? tty irq 1 device psm0 at isa? tty irq 12 device vga0 at isa? port ? conflicts # splash screen/screen saver #pseudo-device splash # syscons is the default console driver, resembling an SCO console device sc0 at isa? tty device npx0 at isa? port IO_NPX irq 13 # Serial ports device sio0 at isa? port "IO_COM1" flags 0x10 tty irq 4 device sio1 at isa? port "IO_COM2" tty irq 3 # Parallel port device ppc0 at isa? port? net irq 7 controller ppbus0 device nlpt0 at ppbus? device plip0 at ppbus? device ppi0 at ppbus? #controller vpo0 at ppbus? # Order is important here due to intrusive probes, do *not* alphabetize # this list of network interfaces until the probes have been fixed. # Right now it appears that the ie0 must be probed before ep0. See # revision 1.20 of this file. device de0 device fxp0 pseudo-device loop pseudo-device ether pseudo-device sl 2 pseudo-device ppp 2 pseudo-device tun 2 pseudo-device pty 64 pseudo-device gzip # Exec gzipped a.out's # # Enable debug support # options KTRACE #kernel tracing options DDB #kernel debugger options INVARIANTS #extra sanity checks options INVARIANT_SUPPORT #needed for INVARIANTS # # These three options provide support for System V Interface # Definition-style interprocess communication, in the form of shared # memory, semaphores, and message queues, respectively. # options SYSVSHM options SYSVSEM options SYSVMSG # The `bpfilter' pseudo-device enables the Berkeley Packet Filter. Be # aware of the legal and administrative consequences of enabling this # option. The number of devices determines the maximum number of # simultaneous BPF clients programs runnable. pseudo-device bpfilter 4 #Berkeley packet filter -- Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 17:32: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 518B514CE8 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 17:31:56 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id UAA10988; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 20:31:26 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199903290131.UAA10988@cs.rpi.edu> To: Bob Willcox Cc: hackers list , crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: Panic in 3.1-stable running amanda, need help debugging In-Reply-To: Message from Bob Willcox of "Sun, 28 Mar 1999 18:17:39 CST." <19990328181739.A8801@luke.pmr.com> Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 20:31:25 -0500 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I recently went through a series of panics with a 3.1 system as well. It appears you have suffered the same fate, maxusers. With maxusers > 64, or on systems with alot of RAM, a kernel table can overflow causing weird errors. Try bumping your maxusers down to 64. Or you can apply a patch that was mentioned in this list in the past month or so (you can do a search on the archives for pmap.h) -- David Cross To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 17:45:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2CC0714ED4 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 17:45:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from s204m82.isp.whistle.com (s204m82.isp.whistle.com [207.76.204.82] (may be forged)) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA50628; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 17:44:02 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 17:43:45 -0800 (PST) From: Julian Elischer X-Sender: julian@s204m82.isp.whistle.com To: Alfred Perlstein Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, mckusick@mckusick.com Subject: Re: serial console AND remote gdb possible? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: MULTIPART/MIXED; BOUNDARY="0-1692368948-922671825=:254" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. Send mail to mime@docserver.cac.washington.edu for more info. --0-1692368948-922671825=:254 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Here's a patch that compiles cleanly, but that I can't check here (no 2nd machine at home). It purports to add support for running gdb out a different sio port from the one the console is running out. Select the port by adding 0x80 to the flags for that port. If no port is so selected it will default to the serial console. The gdb speed can be set with the definition of GDB_BAUD or after booting, with sysctl machdep.gdbspeed let me know how this works as I'm flying blind on this one.. :-) julian On Sun, 28 Mar 1999, Alfred Perlstein wrote: > On Sun, 28 Mar 1999, Julian Elischer wrote: > > > On Sat, 27 Mar 1999, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > > > > > I've been trying several combinations of flags to get > > > > one serial port to be my DDB/system console and > > > > the other to be my remote GDB port. > > > > > > ddb/gdb go on the same port - you can't split functionalty along those > > > lines. > > > > > > - Jordan > > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > Well that's true for now, but kirk and I have been thinking about being > > able to specify a separate port for gdb.. > > > > in fact I think he may be working on it this weekend.. > > if not I may do it next week. > > Please just give me a spec on how you want to specify which port, > what i'm going to try is setting the port via flags, and perhaps > a variable passed in for the bootloeader. > > Should have this done by tonight. > > -Alfred > > > --0-1692368948-922671825=:254 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; name="sio_gdb.diff" 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obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7ED4715818 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 18:14:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (wes@zaphod.softweyr.com [204.68.178.35]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA04791; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 19:13:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <36FEE1CE.C0249D2D@softweyr.com> Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 19:13:34 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr llc X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Doug Rabson Cc: "David O'Brien" , Chuck Robey , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: gdb 4.17 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Doug Rabson wrote: > > On Sat, 27 Mar 1999, David O'Brien wrote: > > > > > I also haven't trimmed out the archs we wont support and other misc files > > > > we don't need yet. > > > > > > You know what you're doing, but I want to suggest that perhaps you want > > > to run that archs part past Warner, who recently (boy, I hope it was > > > Warner, I think it was) added the MIPS stuff into the tree, and is > > > pretty strongly in favor of making cross-compilation possible. > > > > Yes, it is due to his request of not cutting out the MIPS bits that I > > have yet to trim anything. I had the disk space, so was putting the > > trimming off until import time. I guess we keep i386, Alpha, MIPS, Sparc > > bits and trim the rest. > > I think we should keep the ARM bits too. And SPARC-64, if that's still separate from, or an add-on to, the SPARC support. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 19:12:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quark.ChrisBowman.com (crbowman.erols.com [209.122.47.155]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3AE114ECD for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 19:12:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from crb@ChrisBowman.com) Received: from fermion (fermion.ChrisBowman.com [10.0.1.2]) by quark.ChrisBowman.com (8.9.2/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA13485; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 22:19:04 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from crb@ChrisBowman.com) Message-Id: <199903290319.WAA13485@quark.ChrisBowman.com> X-Sender: crb@quark X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 22:10:08 -0500 To: Darren Reed From: "Christopher R. Bowman" Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199903282241.IAA00135@cheops.anu.edu.au> References: <37231.922658651@zippy.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 08:41 AM 3/29/99 +1000, Darren Reed wrote: >In some mail from Jordan K. Hubbard, sie said: >> >> > If this is an aha2940 or similar controller, then it doesn't support using >> > all three connectors at the same time. Using both internal connectors at >> > the same time as the external one is just asking for trouble. >> >> Let me just echo this claim. Back when I was somewhat younger and >> less experienced in the ways of SCSI, I tried to do this for the >> simple reason that it's the obvious thing to try when you have both >> wide and narrow peripherals in the box (like a wide drive and narrow >> cdrom), an external device like a scanner and absolutely no conception >> of how the internal busses are actually wired. What happens then is >> that you create a "Y" in your SCSI chain, with two terminators on one >> end, and the fact that it worked for me at all for 5 months until I >> got another drive for the wide chain and totally pushed things past >> their limits is, frankly, pure amazing luck. > >Sigh :-( It was all working so lovely too...which did you get a new one >for, narrow or wide controller ? Darren, while it is true that you can only use 2 of the 3 connectors on your card, you ought to be able to mix wide and narrow devices on the internal and external cables. However, you must, as always, be sure that both ends of your chain are terminated properly. Since, electrically, all the connectors are on the same bus, if you have a wide drive on either of the 2 connectors that you choose to use, you must have wide terminators at both ends of the bus. Lets assume that you have a wide device somewhere on your bus and for the purpose of this discussion when I say a device with it's terminators turned on I really mean a device that has built in terminators and has them turned on (usually done by adding or removing the resistor pack or moving a jumper) or has 2 connectors on it, and has a terminator plugged into one of the connectors. Then there are basically 4 case: 1) you have a wide cable that has a terminator physically built into one end of the cable. Into this cable you can plug wide and narrow devices(narrow ones will require a little plastic wide to narrow connector converter) none of which may have their on board terminator turned on, because, of course, the cable provides the termination. (NOTE: the end of the cable farthest from the terminator must be plugged into the SCSI card) I have only seen this on internal ribbon connectors, but this is how my Toshiba Equium 6200M came and I have a narrow CDROM and 2 wide drives on the cable. 2) you have a wide cable that does not have a terminator physically built into the cable. Again you can mix wide and narrow devices on this cable as above with their terminators turned off, but in this case you should either plug a wide terminator into the last connector on the cable or place a wide drive with its terminator on into the last connector on the cable. This will terminate both the upper and lower byte of this end of the bus. If you have a narrow terminator or a narrow device with it's terminators on in this last connector you will not be terminating both the upper and lower byte of the bus. 3) you have a narrow cable (which of course can only have narrow devices on it). Again the last connector must either contain a terminator or a device with it terminators turned on. But since we assume a wide device somewhere on the bus (it can't be on this cable so it is on the other one) we must terminate the upper byte since the termination at the end of the narrow cable only terminates the lower byte. In this case we must also turn on the SCSI card's own on board terminator for the upper half of the bus on the connector using the narrow cable. This is done either via a jumper on the board, or via a bios option. 4) either the external or BOTH internal connectors are not being used in which case since we again are assuming a wide device on the bus, we must turn on the upper and lower terminators on board the SCSI card. If the one cable is an internal connector we turn on both the upper and lower external terminators and vice versa if instead the external connector is in use. as a special case if no wide device are in use externally or internally then you need not terminate the high byte of the bus on any connector. If you just remember that the SCSI bus cannot be a Y (thus only 2 out of 3 connectors) and that the SCSI card actually, electrically, sits in the middle of the bus and not the end, even when only one connector is in use, and that both ends must be terminated, you should come up with the right way to set up the termination. -------- Christopher R. Bowman crb@ChrisBowman.com http://www.ChrisBowman.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 21:24:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lion.butya.kz (butya-gw.butya.kz [194.87.112.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AAEF315424 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 21:24:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bp@butya.kz) Received: from bp (helo=localhost) by lion.butya.kz with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10RUVk-0002v3-00; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 12:22:56 +0700 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 12:22:56 +0700 (ALMST) From: Boris Popov To: Doug Rabson Cc: Andrew Gallatin , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: kld questions In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 28 Mar 1999, Doug Rabson wrote: > On Sat, 27 Mar 1999, Andrew Gallatin wrote: > > > The motivation behind this question is that the driver allocates its > > own memory for receives, and wraps external mbufs around that memory. [skip] > > The current pci code has some remnants of old LKM support but I don't > think it includes anything functional. The new pci code which I am slowly > working on will support loadable drivers (that is the whole point really). Andrew also ask about 'unload' functionality, if this will be implemented how the problem with interface detach will be solved ? Having ability to detach any interface should greatly simplify development for both hardware and software interfaces. -- Boris Popov To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 21:31:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from evl.uic.edu (evl.evl.uic.edu [131.193.48.80]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id BE68C156A0 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 21:31:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nikita@evl.uic.edu) Received: from whitted.evl.uic.edu (whitted.evl.uic.edu [131.193.48.200]) by evl.uic.edu (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via ESMTP id XAA03192 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 23:35:11 -0600 Received: from localhost (nikita@localhost) by whitted.evl.uic.edu (8.8.7/8.6.4) with SMTP id XAA04818 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 23:32:40 -0600 (CST) X-Authentication-Warning: whitted.evl.uic.edu: nikita owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 23:32:40 -0600 (CST) From: Nikita Sawant To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Makefiles in FreeBSD Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, I am a novice to the FreeBSD OS. I need to use FreeBSD extensively for my project. I need to port my work from SGI Worstations that use the Irix 6.5 OS to FreeBSD. I am having problem swith configuring the makefile. I don't know how to build the .o files. Anyone who can give me a few tips on this or simple sample makefile format ?? Thanks, Nikita --- o --- o --- o --- o --- o --- o --- o --- o --- o --- o --- o --- Nikita Sawant Electronic Visualization Lab (M/C 154) EVL phone (312) 996-3002 University of Illinois at Chicago EVL Fax (312) 413-7585 851 S. Morgan St. Room 1120 SEO Email : nikita@evl.uic.edu Chicago, IL 60607-7053 --- o --- o --- o --- o --- o --- o --- o --- o --- o --- o --- o --- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Mar 28 21:35:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1434814C8B for ; Sun, 28 Mar 1999 21:35:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id AAA13296; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:35:24 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199903290535.AAA13296@cs.rpi.edu> To: Nikita Sawant Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: Makefiles in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: Message from Nikita Sawant of "Sun, 28 Mar 1999 23:32:40 CST." Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:35:23 -0500 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Please, in the future send this to -questions. (I cc: this to -hackers in the hopes that only one reply be sent) Please send me you Makefile in private and I will try to get it BSD Make friendly. Alternately you ca install gmake from ports or packages and see if taht handles the Makefile correctly (it is like a GNUMakefilethat you have now.) -- David Cross To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 0:19:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from www.dci.co.ir (unknown [195.146.32.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id ECC8614E47 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:19:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Ramin@www.dci.co.ir) From: Ramin@www.dci.co.ir To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: 29 Mar 1999 11:47:28 EDT Subject: Hacking And Basic LEsson's Message-Id: <19990329081937.ECC8614E47@hub.freebsd.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi I m new in this LIST & like to know about HACKING ;) Please Guide me about GOOD Site's (www,ftp,...) thanx To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 0:23:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from caladan.tdx.co.uk (caladan.tdx.co.uk [195.188.177.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B31F3157DB for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:23:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kpielorz@tdx.co.uk) Received: from tdx.co.uk (lorca-tx.tdx.co.uk [195.188.177.242]) by caladan.tdx.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Kp) with ESMTP id JAA50918; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:22:51 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <36FF385B.6597591B@tdx.co.uk> Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:22:51 +0100 From: Karl Pielorz Organization: TDX - The Digital eXchange X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ramin@www.dci.co.ir Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Hacking And Basic LEsson's References: <19990329081937.ECC8614E47@hub.freebsd.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ramin@www.dci.co.ir wrote: > > Hi > I m new in this LIST > & like to know about HACKING ;) > Please Guide me about GOOD Site's (www,ftp,...) > thanx This list is for people interesting in 'hacking' the FreeBSD kernel/sources, and not for people who are interested in 'cracking' (as in attacking/exploiting and gaining access to other remote sites)... If it's the former you want have a look at http://www.freebsd.org and ftp://ftp.freebsd.org... If it's the latter, I don't think we can help you :( -Kp To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 0:27: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 35A8114E47 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:27:01 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA12405; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:18:55 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:18:55 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Boris Popov Cc: Andrew Gallatin , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: kld questions In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 29 Mar 1999, Boris Popov wrote: > On Sun, 28 Mar 1999, Doug Rabson wrote: > > > On Sat, 27 Mar 1999, Andrew Gallatin wrote: > > > > > The motivation behind this question is that the driver allocates its > > > own memory for receives, and wraps external mbufs around that memory. > [skip] > > > > The current pci code has some remnants of old LKM support but I don't > > think it includes anything functional. The new pci code which I am slowly > > working on will support loadable drivers (that is the whole point really). > > Andrew also ask about 'unload' functionality, if this will be > implemented how the problem with interface detach will be solved ? Having > ability to detach any interface should greatly simplify development for > both hardware and software interfaces. The module being unloaded gets notified at unload and has a chance to veto the unload. The current interface for this is a bit inadequate but I expect to make some changes in this area soon. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 0:39:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (mail.palmerharvey.co.uk [62.172.109.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 999EC157D7 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 00:38:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Dom.Mitchell@palmerharvey.co.uk) Received: from ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk (unverified) by mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:37:48 +0100 Received: from voodoo.pandhm.co.uk ([10.100.35.12]) by ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) id GZL8K1R5; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:31:10 +0100 Received: from dom by voodoo.pandhm.co.uk with local (Exim 2.10 #1) id 10RXb9-000MC4-00; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:40:43 +0100 To: Greg Lehey Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default? (was: Taking panic dumps (was: 3.1-STABLE dies on 40+ connects (resolved))) X-Mailer: nmh-1.0 X-Colour: Green Organization: Palmer & Harvey McLane In-Reply-To: Greg Lehey's message of "Sun, 28 Mar 1999 11:44:10 +0930" <19990328114410.U53452@lemis.com> Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:40:42 +0100 From: Dom Mitchell Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 28 March 1999, Greg Lehey proclaimed: > Well, there's a threshold difference between the handbook and the FAQ. > In addition, the description in the handbook is rather confusing. I > intend to overhaul it once the handbook comes out of its freeze > (hopefully soon). > > In that connection, any comments about changing the default way of > building a kernel to create a debug kernel and a stripped copy, and > install the stripped copy? It would require about 10 MB more storage > and a little more time to build the kernel, but since kgdb is useless > without the debug symbols, and disk space is cheap, it seems to me > that it would be worthwhile. If we do this, it would be worthwhile seeing if we can also create some kind of script to go over it and pull out as much information as possible for posting to the mailing list. It would certainly be easier than asking the average user to navigate through kgdb (even though it's fairly simple). Sun do something similiar with their iscda.sh (Initial System Crash Dump Analysis) script. -- Dom Mitchell -- Palmer & Harvey McLane -- Unix Systems Administrator "Value of 2 may go down as well as up" -- FORTRAN programmers manual -- ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. ********************************************************************** To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 5:56:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailgate.program-products.co.uk (samson.program-products.co.uk [212.240.242.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF9E614F4D for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 05:56:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from terry@program-products.co.uk) Received: by mailgate.program-products.co.uk via smap (V2.1) id xma029635; Mon, 29 Mar 99 14:55:39 +0100 To: Jim Flowers , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Tunnel loopback References: <9903091652.AA04146@ppsl.demon.co.uk> <36E57226.15FB7483@whistle.com> <00c401be7927$838e5060$23b197ce@ezo.net> From: Terry Glanfield Date: 29 Mar 1999 14:55:36 +0100 In-Reply-To: Jim Flowers's message of "Sun, 28 Mar 1999 09:30:21 -0500" Message-Id: Lines: 131 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.6.44/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jim Flowers writes: > I'm still trying to figure out what you are doing and how you are > doing it. Let me give you a run through. Firstly I used IPFilter on the internal interface to redirect all packets (except those destined for the local host) to the tunnel device. pass in quick from any to 10.10.10.10 pass in quick from any to 10.10.10.255 pass in quick from any to 240.0.0.1 etc pass in quick on ed0 to tun0 all SKIP is installed on /dev/tun0 where it encrypts any packets that match its rules. All these packets are then read from the tunnel by the program below and "direct"ed to a IPFW rule on the external interface: ipfw add 100 divert 100 57 from any to any in via ed1 ipfw add 100 divert 100 udp from any 1640 to any in via ed1 ipfw add 100 divert 100 udp from any to any 1640 in via ed1 SKIP packets arriving on the external interface are "divert"ed back to the program and written into the tunnel where SKIP can decodes them. It runs fine for small packets but stops when they near the MTU of the external interface. I've also experiences several kernel panics in rtfree() but have yet to track them down. I probably won't have time to look at this further until next week but I will get back to it. Best of luck. Cheers, Terry. #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include int main (int argc, char** argv) { int fdtun,fdsock,nds,count; int port = 100; struct sockaddr_in addr; char packetBuf[IP_MAXPACKET]; struct sockaddr_in packetAddr; int addrSize; int bytes; fd_set readfds; fdsock = socket (PF_INET, SOCK_RAW, IPPROTO_DIVERT); if (fdsock < 0) { perror("divert"); exit(1); } fdtun = open("/dev/tun0",O_RDWR,0600); if (fdtun <= 0) { perror("/dev/tun0"); exit(1); } addr.sin_family = AF_INET; addr.sin_addr.s_addr = INADDR_ANY; addr.sin_port = htons(port); if (bind (fdsock, (struct sockaddr*) &addr, sizeof addr) == -1) exit(2); nds = getdtablesize(); while (1) { FD_ZERO(&readfds); FD_SET(fdsock, &readfds); FD_SET(fdtun, &readfds); count = select(nds,&readfds,0,0,0); if (count > 0) { if (FD_ISSET(fdsock,&readfds)) { bytes = recvfrom (fdsock, packetBuf, sizeof packetBuf, 0, (struct sockaddr*) &packetAddr, &addrSize); if (bytes > 0) write(fdtun,packetBuf,bytes); } if (FD_ISSET(fdtun,&readfds)) { bytes = read(fdtun,packetBuf,sizeof packetBuf); if (bytes > 0) sendto (fdsock, packetBuf, bytes, 0, (struct sockaddr*) &packetAddr, sizeof packetAddr); } } } } To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 6: 4:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2207E157C6 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 06:02:03 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id AAA25942; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:01:20 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199903291401.AAA25942@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. To: jkh@zippy.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:01:20 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <37408.922661990@zippy.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Mar 28, 99 02:59:50 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hmmm, my scsi chain now looks like this: 1 6 0 blank CD-ROM ZIP CD-RW (TE) | | | | 2 +-----+--------+------+-----+ (50 PIN 9 | 4 | 10 3 0 | HDD: 9.1GB HDD: 2GB (TE) U | | | W +-------+----------+ (68 PIN) 46 minutes after booting up below it panic'd: ffs_valloc: dup alloc Darren p.s. I'm not real keen on trying 3.1 unless dual-cpu is *stable* (this box is a GA-586DX w/ 2x200MMX) kernel messages: Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: Copyright (c) 1992-1998 FreeBSD Inc. Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: Copyright (c) 1982, 1986, 1989, 1991, 1993 Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: The Regents of the University of California. A ll rights reserved. Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE #0: Mon Nov 30 06:34:08 G MT 1998 Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: jkh@time.cdrom.com:/usr/src/sys/compile/GENERIC Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: CPU: Pentium/P55C (200.46-MHz 586-class CPU) Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: Origin = "GenuineIntel" Id = 0x543 Stepping=3 Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: Features=0x8003bf Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: real memory = 134217728 (131072K bytes) Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: avail memory = 128860160 (125840K bytes) Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: Probing for devices on PCI bus 0: Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: chip0 rev 3 on pci0:0:0 Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: chip1 rev 1 on p ci0:7:0 Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: chip2 rev 0 on pc i0:7:1 Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: vga0 rev 1 int a irq 11 on pci0:9:0 Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: xl0 <3Com 3c900 Etherlink XL 10BaseT Combo> rev 0 int a irq 10 on pci0:10:0 Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: xl0: Ethernet address: 00:60:97:d1:d4:51 Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: xl0: selecting 10baseT transceiver, half duplex Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: ahc0 rev 0 int a irq 9 on pci0:12:0 Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: ahc0: Using left over BIOS settings Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: a Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: hc0: aic7880 Wide Channel, SCSI Id=7, 16 SCBs Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: ahc0 waiting for scsi devices to settle Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: (ahc0:0:0): "YAMAHA CRW4260 1.0f" type 5 remova ble SCSI 2 Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: cd0(ahc0:0:0): CD-ROM can't get the size Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: (ahc0:3:0): "IBM DCAS-32160W S61A" type 0 fixed SCSI 2 Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: sd0(ahc0:3:0): Direct-Access 2063MB (4226725 51 2 byte sectors) Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: (ahc0:6:0): "IOMEGA ZIP 100 E.08" type 0 remova ble SCSI 2 Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: sd1(ahc0:6:0): Direct-Access Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: sd1(ahc0:6:0): NOT READY asc:3a,0 Medium not pr esent Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: sd1: could not get size Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: sd1(ahc0:6:0): ILLEGAL REQUEST asc:24,0 Invalid field in CDB Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: sd1 could not mode sense (4). Using fictitious geometry Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: 0MB (0 512 byte sectors) Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: (ahc0:10:0): "IBM DDRS-39130W S97B" type 0 fixe d SCSI 2 Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: sd2(ahc0:10:0): Direct-Access 8715MB (17850000 512 byte sectors) Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: Probing for devices on the ISA bus: Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: sc0 at 0x60-0x6f irq 1 on motherboard Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: sc0: VGA color <16 virtual consoles, flags=0x0> Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: ed0 at 0x280-0x29f irq 5 maddr 0xd0000 msize 16 384 on isa Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: ed0: address 00:00:c0:a4:03:97, type SMC8216/SM C8216C (16 bit) Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: sio0 at 0x3f8-0x3ff irq 4 on isa Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: sio0: type 165 Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: 50A Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: sio1 at 0x2f8-0x2ff irq 3 on isa Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: sio1: type 16550A Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: fdc0 at 0x3f0-0x3f7 irq 6 drq 2 on isa Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: fdc0: FIFO enabled, 8 bytes threshold Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: fd0: 1.44MB 3.5in Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: wdc0 at 0x1f0-0x1f7 irq 14 on isa Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: wdc0: unit 0 (wd0): Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: wd0: 6149MB (12594960 sectors), 13328 cyls, 15 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: wdc1 not found at 0x170 Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: npx0 flags 0x1 on motherboard Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: npx0: INT 16 interface Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: stray irq 7 Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: Intel Pentium F00F detected, installing workaro Mar 29 10:01:36 freebsd /kernel: WARNING: / was not properly dismounted. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 6: 8:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C6E2157C6 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 06:08:15 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id GAA40287; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 06:07:27 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Darren Reed Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:01:20 +1000." <199903291401.AAA25942@cheops.anu.edu.au> Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 06:07:26 -0800 Message-ID: <40285.922716446@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > hmmm, my scsi chain now looks like this: > > 1 6 0 > blank CD-ROM ZIP CD-RW (TE) > | | | | > 2 +-----+--------+------+-----+ (50 PIN > 9 | > 4 | 10 3 > 0 | HDD: 9.1GB HDD: 2GB (TE) > U | | | > W +-------+----------+ (68 PIN) > > 46 minutes after booting up below it panic'd: ffs_valloc: dup alloc Sorry, still one bit of missing information here. What is the controller's termination setting in its BIOS setup? If it's set to Automatic, turn that off - there are widespread reports of the Automatic feature "automatically getting it wrong" so I don't trust it. If you're using both internal connectors then the setting should be set explicitly to high on/low off. - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 6:39: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B07A14E92 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 06:38:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gram@cdsec.com) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.8.8/8.6.9) id QAA10989 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 16:38:21 +0200 (SAST) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 10987; Mon Mar 29 16:37:52 1999 Message-ID: <36FF9053.30685AD7@cdsec.com> Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 16:38:11 +0200 From: Graham Wheeler X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Changing param.c for different environments Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi all I am currently using 2.2.7, but I imagine that this will apply to 3.x as well). The param.c file in /usr/src/sys/conf specifies a few linear dependencies between the configured MAXUSERS and the amount of mbuf space, timer callout table sizes, etc. It seems to me that this may be fine in many cases, but not necessarily appropriate when one is (for example) putting together a big machine dedicated to being a web server (say). How about having a config file variable specifying the type of use that the machine is intended for - e.g. dedicated web/file server, multi-user machine for software development, multi-user machine for mail serving, etc, and using this variable to adjust the values in param.c? Also, wouldn't it be better to make some of the values dependent on the amount of RAM, rather than fixed? Is this possible by tweaking param.c in an elementary fashion? -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 7:50:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A4DA14E76 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 07:50:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id BAA28981; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 01:50:01 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199903291550.BAA28981@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. To: jkh@zippy.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 01:50:00 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <40322.922716596@zippy.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Mar 29, 99 06:09:56 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Well, I toggled the internal BIOS termination setting and it still crashes. when tar got to the end of the run and went back to change access/modification times of files in ports/x11-fonts/getbdf it crashed. I think I'll go down to just the two devices involved (wd0 and that scsi drive), trip the chains and see what happens. any suggestions (other than upgrade) if it still panics ? the job at hand is to copy /usr, /usr/local, /usr/src from wd0 to the scsi disk. 736952k, 101133 files. Darren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 7:58:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailgate.program-products.co.uk (samson.program-products.co.uk [212.240.242.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBBB5154C9 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 07:58:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from terry@program-products.co.uk) Received: by mailgate.program-products.co.uk via smap (V2.1) id xma030442; Mon, 29 Mar 99 16:57:58 +0100 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 99 16:57:57 BST Message-Id: <9903291557.AA21054@program-products.co.uk> From: Terry Glanfield To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: FIN not sent on socket close() Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, I'm having trouble getting an FTP proxy working on 3.1-STABLE. The proxy is a PASV aware version of the FTWK ftp-gw. When trying to STOR a file through the proxy the receiving end hangs waiting for a FIN packet that is never sent. The ktrace output below shows the socket being closed. I've also included some short packet traces - sorry about the line length - and dumps of a pftp session for comparison. The only difference I can see is that the proxy is being launched from inetd. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Source code available on request. Cheers, Terry. Fristly the traces from the proxy version. Receiver: 6952 ftpd CALL read(0x8,0xefbfcfbc,0x400) 6952 ftpd GIO fd 8 read 5 bytes "test " 6952 ftpd RET read 5 6952 ftpd CALL write(0x7,0xefbfcfbc,0x5) 6952 ftpd GIO fd 7 wrote 5 bytes "test " 6952 ftpd RET write 5 6952 ftpd CALL read(0x8,0xefbfcfbc,0x400) >>read never returns... Sender: 8543 ftp-gw CALL read(0x8,0xefbfce5c,0x800) 8543 ftp-gw GIO fd 8 read 5 bytes "test " 8543 ftp-gw RET read 5 8543 ftp-gw CALL write(0x7,0xefbfce5c,0x5) 8543 ftp-gw GIO fd 7 wrote 5 bytes "test " 8543 ftp-gw RET write 5 8543 ftp-gw CALL select(0x400,0xefbfdcb0,0,0,0xefbfdd30) 8543 ftp-gw RET select 1 8543 ftp-gw CALL read(0x8,0xefbfce5c,0x800) 8543 ftp-gw GIO fd 8 read 0 bytes "" 8543 ftp-gw RET read 0 8543 ftp-gw CALL close(0x8) 8543 ftp-gw RET close 0 8543 ftp-gw CALL close(0x7) 8543 ftp-gw RET close 0 >>... but the socket is closed Here are the traces from the pftp version. Receiver: 6966 ftpd CALL read(0x8,0xefbfcfbc,0x400) 6966 ftpd GIO fd 8 read 5 bytes "test " 6966 ftpd RET read 5 6966 ftpd CALL write(0x7,0xefbfcfbc,0x5) 6966 ftpd GIO fd 7 wrote 5 bytes "test " 6966 ftpd RET write 5 6966 ftpd CALL read(0x8,0xefbfcfbc,0x400) 6966 ftpd GIO fd 8 read 0 bytes "" 6966 ftpd RET read 0 >>read returns cleanly... 6966 ftpd CALL write(0x1,0x8059000,0x18) 6966 ftpd GIO fd 1 wrote 24 bytes "226 Transfer complete.\r " Sender: 8595 pftp CALL read(0x4,0xefbfd3e4,0x400) 8595 pftp GIO fd 4 read 5 bytes "test " 8595 pftp RET read 5 8595 pftp CALL write(0x5,0xefbfd3e4,0x5) 8595 pftp GIO fd 5 wrote 5 bytes "test " 8595 pftp RET write 5 8595 pftp CALL read(0x4,0xefbfd3e4,0x400) 8595 pftp GIO fd 4 read 0 bytes "" 8595 pftp RET read 0 8595 pftp CALL gettimeofday(0xefbfd290,0) 8595 pftp RET gettimeofday 0 8595 pftp CALL write(0x1,0xefbfd298,0x1c) 8595 pftp GIO fd 1 wrote 28 bytes "\r100% 5 00:00 ETA" 8595 pftp RET write 28/0x1c 8595 pftp CALL setitimer(0,0xefbfd234,0) 8595 pftp RET setitimer 0 8595 pftp CALL write(0x1,0x8069000,0x1) 8595 pftp GIO fd 1 wrote 1 byte " " 8595 pftp RET write 1 8595 pftp CALL close(0x4) 8595 pftp RET close 0 8595 pftp CALL close(0x5) 8595 pftp RET close 0 8595 pftp CALL sigaction(0x2,0xefbfcf50,0xefbfcf44) 8595 pftp RET sigaction 0 8595 pftp CALL read(0x3,0x8079000,0x4356) 8595 pftp GIO fd 3 read 24 bytes "226 Transfer complete.\r " Finally the packet traces. Proxy version: 19:29:48.050523 212.240.242.226.2990 > 10.3.1.251.21: P 1748251412:1748251418(6) ack 1627790365 win 17238 (DF) 19:29:48.054606 10.3.1.251.21 > 212.240.242.226.2990: P 1:47(46) ack 6 win 17238 (DF) [tos 0x10] 19:29:48.055582 212.240.242.226.2992 > 10.3.1.251.49157: S 1754860719:1754860719(0) win 16384 (DF) 19:29:48.056321 10.3.1.251.49157 > 212.240.242.226.2992: S 1634641441:1634641441(0) ack 1754860720 win 17238 (DF) 19:29:48.056656 212.240.242.226.2992 > 10.3.1.251.49157: . ack 1 win 17238 (DF) 19:29:48.066298 212.240.242.226.2990 > 10.3.1.251.21: P 6:14(8) ack 47 win 17238 (DF) 19:29:48.072126 10.3.1.251.21 > 212.240.242.226.2990: P 47:97(50) ack 14 win 17238 (DF) [tos 0x10] 19:29:48.075895 212.240.242.226.2992 > 10.3.1.251.49157: P 1:6(5) ack 1 win 17238 (DF) 19:29:48.116205 212.240.242.226.2990 > 10.3.1.251.21: . ack 97 win 17238 (DF) 19:29:48.275329 10.3.1.251.49157 > 212.240.242.226.2992: . ack 6 win 17238 (DF) [tos 0x8] pftp version: 19:35:11.579785 212.240.242.226.2998 > 10.3.1.251.21: P 1809781922:1809781928(6) ack 1688388446 win 17238 (DF) [tos 0x10] To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 8:10:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6368A14FCC for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 08:10:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id CAA29431; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 02:09:48 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199903291609.CAA29431@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. To: jkh@zippy.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 02:09:47 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <40322.922716596@zippy.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Mar 29, 99 06:09:56 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG FWIW, stack trace: IdlePTD 278000 current pcb at 2581d4 panic: bad dir #0 0xf0113fa3 in boot () (kgdb) where #0 0xf0113fa3 in boot () #1 0xf0114272 in panic () #2 0xf01bdd13 in ufs_dirbad () #3 0xf01bd571 in ufs_lookup () #4 0xf012fc79 in lookup () #5 0xf012f7bb in namei () #6 0xf01341d7 in utimes () #7 0xf01e9f73 in syscall () #8 0x1a7b5 in ?? () #9 0x7542 in ?? () #10 0xb56e in ?? () #11 0xdedf in ?? () #12 0x107e in ?? () btw, do you or anyone else have any further suggestions to make about SCSI settings ? We'll see how this current setup goes (one UW SCSI disk, one EIDE disk,) but I'm tipping it'll get screwed up in ports (again) since I recall seeing that before too. Cheers, Darren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 8:44:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51C3D14E0C for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 08:44:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id IAA32933; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 08:43:43 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 08:43:43 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199903291643.IAA32933@apollo.backplane.com> To: Darren Reed Cc: jkh@zippy.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. References: <199903291401.AAA25942@cheops.anu.edu.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I will repeat: please upgrade to the latest 2.2.x or upgrade to the latest -stable ( 3.x ), known bugs related to these sorts of error messages have been fixed since 2.2.8. : 1 6 0 : blank CD-ROM ZIP CD-RW (TE) : | | | | :2 +-----+--------+------+-----+ (50 PIN :9 | :4 | 10 3 :0 | HDD: 9.1GB HDD: 2GB (TE) :U | | | :W +-------+----------+ (68 PIN) : :46 minutes after booting up below it panic'd: ffs_valloc: dup alloc : :Darren Personally speaking, I never trust ZIP or CDROM drives on the same SCSI bus as my hard disks. However, unless you are getting SCSI error messages before the panic, the SCSI system is probably not the cause of your problems. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 9: 5:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wall.polstra.com (rtrwan160.accessone.com [206.213.115.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CC7B14DB2 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:05:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Received: from vashon.polstra.com (vashon.polstra.com [206.213.73.13]) by wall.polstra.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA25513; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:05:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) From: John Polstra Received: (from jdp@localhost) by vashon.polstra.com (8.9.2/8.9.1) id JAA15371; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:05:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:05:13 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199903291705.JAA15371@vashon.polstra.com> To: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-Reply-To: <199903291550.BAA28981@cheops.anu.edu.au> Organization: Polstra & Co., Seattle, WA Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article <199903291550.BAA28981@cheops.anu.edu.au>, Darren Reed wrote: > Well, I toggled the internal BIOS termination setting and > it still crashes. Don't be insulted if this is too obvious, but ... have you run fsck on all your filesystems since you fixed the termination and cabling? There could be a lot of residual damage in your filesystems from earlier errors. John -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-interest is the aphrodisiac of belief." -- James V. DeLong To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 9:20:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from feral.com (feral.com [192.67.166.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9189815830 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:20:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mjacob@feral.com) Received: from localhost (mjacob@localhost) by feral.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA25912; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:19:23 -0800 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:19:22 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Jacob X-Sender: mjacob@feral-gw Reply-To: mjacob@feral.com To: John Polstra Cc: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-Reply-To: <199903291705.JAA15371@vashon.polstra.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > In article <199903291550.BAA28981@cheops.anu.edu.au>, > Darren Reed wrote: > > Well, I toggled the internal BIOS termination setting and > > it still crashes. > > Don't be insulted if this is too obvious, but ... have you run fsck > on all your filesystems since you fixed the termination and cabling? > There could be a lot of residual damage in your filesystems from > earlier errors. > And don't believe the 'clean' bit if you've had I/O errors. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 9:23: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 172A41502B for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:22:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id DAA01239; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 03:22:16 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199903291722.DAA01239@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: reproducable filesystem corruption in 2.2.8 To: jdp@polstra.com (John Polstra) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 03:22:15 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199903291705.JAA15371@vashon.polstra.com> from "John Polstra" at Mar 29, 99 09:05:13 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In some mail from John Polstra, sie said: > > In article <199903291550.BAA28981@cheops.anu.edu.au>, > Darren Reed wrote: > > Well, I toggled the internal BIOS termination setting and > > it still crashes. > > Don't be insulted if this is too obvious, but ... have you run fsck > on all your filesystems since you fixed the termination and cabling? > There could be a lot of residual damage in your filesystems from > earlier errors. Yes. And having changing the termination (yet again), the problem is again aparent but the box hasn't yet panic'd. Now that the tar is complete, I'm seeing these messages: tar: couldn't change access and modification times of ports/x11/dxpc/pkg/CVS : No such file or directory tar: cannot change mode of file ports/x11/dxpc/pkg/CVS to 0755 : No such file or directory tar: couldn't change access and modification times of ports/x11/dxpc/pkg : No such file or directory tar: cannot change mode of file ports/x11/dxpc/pkg to 0755 : No such file or directory tar: couldn't change access and modification times of ports/x11/dxpc/files/CVS : No such file or directory tar: cannot change mode of file ports/x11/dxpc/files/CVS to 0755 : No such file or directory tar: couldn't change access and modification times of ports/x11/dxpc/files : No such file or directory tar: cannot change mode of file ports/x11/dxpc/files to 0755 : No such file or directory tar: couldn't change access and modification times of ports/x11/dxpc/CVS : No such file or directory tar: cannot change mode of file ports/x11/dxpc/CVS to 0755 : No such file or directory tar: couldn't change access and modification times of ports/www/web500gw/files/CVS : No such file or directory tar: cannot change mode of file ports/www/web500gw/files/CVS to 0755 : No such file or directory ^Z which is usually just prior to a panic. Further examination: # ll. /mnt/usr/ports/www/web500gw total 9 drwxr-xr-x 6 root wheel 512 Jan 7 10:28 ./ drwxr-xr-x 92 root wheel 2048 Mar 30 03:04 ../ drwxr-xr-x 2 root wheel 512 Jan 7 10:28 CVS/ -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 946 Oct 26 15:53 Makefile -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 754 Nov 30 13:44 README.html drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 512 Jan 7 10:28 files/ drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 512 Jan 7 10:28 patches/ drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 512 Jan 7 10:28 pkg/ # ls -al /mnt/usr/ports/www/web500gw/files # that's right, no "." or ".." in that directory. Doing a "cat" of that directory shows junk - nothing even vaguely resembling a directory. FWIW, this problem has (in the recent trials) always manifested itself in the "ports" directory on /usr where there is a *large* number of files/inodes compared to size. If anyone cares, I'd say that I now have a reproducable problem with UFS on FreeBSD 2.2.8 (I've never used the 68pin SCSI cable before last Saturday and haven't swapped that yet). My next step is to boot off a 3.1 floppy and see if that's any better. The only devices as wd0, sd0, fd0 and all other cables disconnected. Darren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 9:24:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A05D159A9 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:24:08 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id DAA01298; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 03:23:40 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199903291723.DAA01298@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. To: mjacob@feral.com Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 03:23:39 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Matthew Jacob" at Mar 29, 99 09:19:22 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In some mail from Matthew Jacob, sie said: > > > In article <199903291550.BAA28981@cheops.anu.edu.au>, > > Darren Reed wrote: > > > Well, I toggled the internal BIOS termination setting and > > > it still crashes. > > > > Don't be insulted if this is too obvious, but ... have you run fsck > > on all your filesystems since you fixed the termination and cabling? > > There could be a lot of residual damage in your filesystems from > > earlier errors. > > > > And don't believe the 'clean' bit if you've had I/O errors. well, I've been newfs'ing the destination partitions each time, if that answers that question, which is where the trouble is showing up. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 9:26: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from feral.com (feral.com [192.67.166.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79EA114FA0 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:26:05 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mjacob@feral.com) Received: from localhost (mjacob@localhost) by feral.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA25953; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:25:34 -0800 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:25:34 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Jacob X-Sender: mjacob@feral-gw Reply-To: mjacob@feral.com To: Darren Reed Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-Reply-To: <199903291723.DAA01298@cheops.anu.edu.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > > And don't believe the 'clean' bit if you've had I/O errors. > > well, I've been newfs'ing the destination partitions each time, if that > answers that question, which is where the trouble is showing up. Ah, my favorite kind of fsck! :-) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 9:26:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C211315891 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:26:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id DAA01363; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 03:26:02 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199903291726.DAA01363@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. To: dillon@apollo.backplane.com (Matthew Dillon) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 03:26:01 +1000 (EST) Cc: jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199903291643.IAA32933@apollo.backplane.com> from "Matthew Dillon" at Mar 29, 99 08:43:43 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In some mail from Matthew Dillon, sie said: > > I will repeat: please upgrade to the latest 2.2.x or upgrade > to the latest -stable ( 3.x ), known bugs related to these sorts > of error messages have been fixed since 2.2.8. What's the easiest way to upgrade to the latest set of 2.2.8 srcs ? Just grab the latest kernel src tarballs and compile a new kernel ? > Personally speaking, I never trust ZIP or CDROM drives on the same > SCSI bus as my hard disks. However, unless you are getting SCSI > error messages before the panic, the SCSI system is probably not the > cause of your problems. There have been *NO* SCSI error messages. Darren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 9:31: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp2.vnet.net (smtp2.vnet.net [166.82.1.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92C5614FA0 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:30:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp2.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id MAA14614; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 12:32:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA00896; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 12:30:25 -0500 (EST) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id MAA11166; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 12:30:25 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 12:30:25 -0500 (EST) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199903291730.MAA11166@lakes.dignus.com> To: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, mjacob@feral.com Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199903291723.DAA01298@cheops.anu.edu.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > In some mail from Matthew Jacob, sie said: > > > > > In article <199903291550.BAA28981@cheops.anu.edu.au>, > > > Darren Reed wrote: > > > > Well, I toggled the internal BIOS termination setting and > > > > it still crashes. > > > > > > Don't be insulted if this is too obvious, but ... have you run fsck > > > on all your filesystems since you fixed the termination and cabling? > > > There could be a lot of residual damage in your filesystems from > > > earlier errors. > > > > > > > And don't believe the 'clean' bit if you've had I/O errors. > > well, I've been newfs'ing the destination partitions each time, if that > answers that question, which is where the trouble is showing up. > Well - you're not going to like this, but at one time the reproduction I had with 2.2.5 took the following steps: 1) Write 0xff all over the disk partition 2) newfs the partition 3) Do an fsck to find that 0x00 wasn't properly written, some inodes had 0xff in them... (that is, fsck of a newfs'd partition reported errors) So - if this is the same problem I had, doing a newfs doesn't reliably clean things up. (I actually got it narrowed down to writing a single 0xff in one spot on the disk.) But - I did find that fsck was able to repair things. I believe because it did things in a different order than newfs did. I suppose the moral is - if you're having these kind of problems, don't trust newfs either... :-( - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 9:41:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E24714F1E for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:41:39 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id JAA33324; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:41:15 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:41:15 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199903291741.JAA33324@apollo.backplane.com> To: Darren Reed Cc: jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. References: <199903291726.DAA01363@cheops.anu.edu.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :In some mail from Matthew Dillon, sie said: :> :> I will repeat: please upgrade to the latest 2.2.x or upgrade :> to the latest -stable ( 3.x ), known bugs related to these sorts :> of error messages have been fixed since 2.2.8. : :What's the easiest way to upgrade to the latest set of 2.2.8 srcs ? :Just grab the latest kernel src tarballs and compile a new kernel ? You can use cvsup to get the RELENG_2_2 release, which tracks 2.2.x. I've included a cvsup control file that should work for you. If you have never used cvsup before, it may take a day of messing around to get it running smoothly. cvsup assumes you start out with an empty /usr/src and will populate it with the source distribution. You need around 330MB of space to hold the sources, and another 300MB of freespace for /usr/obj in order for make buildworld to store object object files. If you already have sources in /usr/src, back them up and start with an empty directory. If all you are trying to do is to remake the kernel, I still suggest downloading the entire source tree but you don't need to build the world in that case, just a new kernel. If you have your own custom kernel configs in /usr/src/sys/i386/conf, remember to copy them somewhere before wiping /usr/src and cvsup'ing. Then copy your custom kernel configs back afterwords. For 2.2.x I think you also need to softlink /sys to /usr/src/sys. Once you've setup the space, you can run cvsup with: cvsup -g -L 2 -h cvsup2.freebsd.org the_supfile_I_gave_you >>> Please access http://www.freebsd.org/ for more information. <<< Once you have a working source tree, you should be able to config and compile up a new 2.2.x kernel. In regards to running 3.x -- you should try to get your problems fixed with 2.2.x first rather then potentially compound them by trying to fix them *and* trying to upgrade to a major new release at the same time. But once you get these problems fixed, you should work on a plan to move to 3.x in the next few months since 2.2.x is not really supported any more. Some bug fixes are being backported to 2.2.x, but generally only on request or by interested parties. :> Personally speaking, I never trust ZIP or CDROM drives on the same :> SCSI bus as my hard disks. However, unless you are getting SCSI :> error messages before the panic, the SCSI system is probably not the :> cause of your problems. : :There have been *NO* SCSI error messages. : :Darren -Matt Matthew Dillon # to keep your CVS tree up-to-date: # # cvsup stable-supfile # # If not running X, or invoking cvsup from a non-interactive script, then # run it as follows: # # cvsup -g -L 2 stable-supfile # # host=CHANGE_THIS.FreeBSD.org # This specifies the server host which will supply the # file updates. You must change it to one of the CVSup # mirror sites listed in the FreeBSD Handbook at # http://www.freebsd.org/handbook/mirrors.html. # You can override this setting on the command line # with cvsup's "-h host" option. # # base=/usr # This specifies the root where CVSup will store information # about the collections you have transferred to your system. # A setting of "/usr" will generate this information in # /usr/sup. Even if you are CVSupping a large number of # collections, you will be hard pressed to generate more than # ~1MB of data in this directory. You can override the # "base" setting on the command line with cvsup's "-b base" # option. This directory must exist in order to run CVSup. # # prefix=/usr # This specifies where to place the requested files. A # setting of "/usr" will place all of the files requested # in "/usr/src" (e.g., "/usr/src/bin", "/usr/src/lib"). # The prefix directory must exist in order to run CVSup. # Defaults that apply to all the collections # # IMPORTANT: Change the next line to use one of the CVSup mirror sites # listed at http://www.freebsd.org/handbook/mirrors.html. *default host=CHANGE_THIS.FreeBSD.org *default base=/usr *default prefix=/usr # The following line is for 3-stable. If you want 2.2-stable, change # "RELENG_3" to "RELENG_2_2". *default release=cvs tag=RELENG_2_2 *default delete use-rel-suffix # If your network link is a T1 or faster, comment out the following line. *default compress src-all src-crypto src-eBones src-secure To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 9:50:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wall.polstra.com (rtrwan160.accessone.com [206.213.115.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 939D514DF2 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:50:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Received: from vashon.polstra.com (vashon.polstra.com [206.213.73.13]) by wall.polstra.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA25700 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:50:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) From: John Polstra Received: (from jdp@localhost) by vashon.polstra.com (8.9.2/8.9.1) id JAA15560; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:50:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:50:16 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199903291750.JAA15560@vashon.polstra.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-Reply-To: <199903291741.JAA33324@apollo.backplane.com> References: <199903291726.DAA01363@cheops.anu.edu.au> Organization: Polstra & Co., Seattle, WA Cc: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article <199903291741.JAA33324@apollo.backplane.com>, Matthew Dillon wrote: > > cvsup assumes you start out with an empty /usr/src and will populate > it with the source distribution. No, it will happily update an existing source tree. Basically it "just works", but there some in-depth info about it in the CVSup FAQ at . John -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-interest is the aphrodisiac of belief." -- James V. DeLong To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 10:51:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from arnold.neland.dk (mail.neland.dk [194.255.12.232]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E37E15403 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 10:50:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by arnold.neland.dk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA04891; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 20:48:49 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from leifn@swimsuit.internet.dk) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 20:48:42 +0200 (CEST) From: Leif Neland X-Sender: leifn@arnold.neland.dk To: Darren Reed Cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , dfr@nlsystems.com, rivers@dignus.com, dcs@newsguy.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-Reply-To: <199903282241.IAA00135@cheops.anu.edu.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 29 Mar 1999, Darren Reed wrote: > In some mail from Jordan K. Hubbard, sie said: > > > > > If this is an aha2940 or similar controller, then it doesn't support using > > > all three connectors at the same time. Using both internal connectors at > > > the same time as the external one is just asking for trouble. > > > > Let me just echo this claim. Back when I was somewhat younger and > > less experienced in the ways of SCSI, I tried to do this for the > > simple reason that it's the obvious thing to try when you have both > > wide and narrow peripherals in the box (like a wide drive and narrow > > cdrom), an external device like a scanner and absolutely no conception > > of how the internal busses are actually wired. What happens then is > > that you create a "Y" in your SCSI chain, with two terminators on one > > end, and the fact that it worked for me at all for 5 months until I > > got another drive for the wide chain and totally pushed things past > > their limits is, frankly, pure amazing luck. > > Sigh :-( It was all working so lovely too...which did you get a new one > for, narrow or wide controller ? > > If you can get a narrow cable to connect in one end to the connector on the controller, the drives in the middle, and to a connector at the back at the machine in the other end, it should work. But this requires the internal drives not to be terminated, and you always have to terminate the bus either at the back og the machine, or at whatever you plug into the back. Leif To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 11: 7:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3834C155DF for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 11:07:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA00197; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 12:07:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id MAA12026; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 12:06:59 -0700 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 12:06:59 -0700 Message-Id: <199903291906.MAA12026@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Darren Reed Cc: jkh@zippy.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-Reply-To: <199903291550.BAA28981@cheops.anu.edu.au> References: <40322.922716596@zippy.cdrom.com> <199903291550.BAA28981@cheops.anu.edu.au> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Well, I toggled the internal BIOS termination setting and > it still crashes. Is it possible this disk corrupted so badly that it won't work until you newfs it and restore from scratch? This happened to me when I had some bad L2 cache, and over time the disk became so corrupted that even fsck could not repair the disk. Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 11:10:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C03E415877 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 11:10:10 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bob@luke.pmr.com) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id NAA18614; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 13:09:42 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from bob) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 13:09:42 -0600 From: Bob Willcox To: "David E. Cross" Cc: Bob Willcox , hackers list Subject: Re: Panic in 3.1-stable running amanda, need help debugging Message-ID: <19990329130942.A18457@luke.pmr.com> Reply-To: Bob Willcox References: <199903290131.UAA10988@cs.rpi.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <199903290131.UAA10988@cs.rpi.edu>; from David E. Cross on Sun, Mar 28, 1999 at 08:31:25PM -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Mar 28, 1999 at 08:31:25PM -0500, David E. Cross wrote: > I recently went through a series of panics with a 3.1 system as well. It > appears you have suffered the same fate, maxusers. With maxusers > 64, or > on systems with alot of RAM, a kernel table can overflow causing weird errors. > Try bumping your maxusers down to 64. Or you can apply a patch that was > mentioned in this list in the past month or so (you can do a search on the > archives for pmap.h) Unfortunately, reducing maxusers to 64 did not fix the problem. I'm still getting the panic. It appears that the code in soreceive() is panicing at line 659 because the mbuf pointer loaded from so->so_rcv.sb_mb is NULL, as you can see: (kgdb) print *so $4 = {so_zone = 0xf0f0ef00, so_type = 1, so_options = 0, so_linger = 0, so_state = 2, so_pcb = 0xf400aa20 "", so_proto = 0xf0259294, so_head = 0x0, so_incomp = {tqh_first = 0x0, tqh_last = 0xf3f0b0b8}, so_comp = { tqh_first = 0x0, tqh_last = 0xf3f0b0c0}, so_list = {tqe_next = 0x0, tqe_prev = 0x0}, so_qlen = 0, so_incqlen = 0, so_qlimit = 0, so_timeo = 0, so_error = 0, so_sigio = 0x0, so_oobmark = 0, so_rcv = {sb_cc = 1460, sb_hiwat = 17520, sb_mbcnt = 2176, sb_mbmax = 140160, sb_lowat = 1, sb_mb = 0x0, sb_sel = {si_pid = 0, si_flags = 0}, sb_flags = 1, sb_timeo = 0}, so_snd = {sb_cc = 0, sb_hiwat = 17520, sb_mbcnt = 0, sb_mbmax = 140160, sb_lowat = 2048, sb_mb = 0x0, sb_sel = {si_pid = 0, si_flags = 0}, sb_flags = 0, sb_timeo = 0}, so_upcall = 0, so_upcallarg = 0x0, so_uid = 90, so_gencnt = 5448} Bob -- Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 11:27:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hp9000.chc-chimes.com (hp9000.chc-chimes.com [206.67.97.84]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C72D514BD5 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 11:27:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from billf@chc-chimes.com) Received: from localhost by hp9000.chc-chimes.com with SMTP (1.39.111.2/16.2) id AA255003597; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 13:53:17 -0500 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 13:53:17 -0500 (EST) From: Bill Fumerola To: Nikita Sawant Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Makefiles in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 28 Mar 1999, Nikita Sawant wrote: > I am a novice to the FreeBSD OS. I need to use FreeBSD extensively for my > project. I need to port my work from SGI Worstations that use the Irix 6.5 > OS to FreeBSD. I am having problem swith configuring the makefile. I don't > know how to build the .o files. > > Anyone who can give me a few tips on this or simple sample makefile format > ?? Check out /usr/src/*/Makefile, and /usr/share/mk/bsd.*.mk - bill fumerola - billf@chc-chimes.com - BF1560 - computer horizons corp - - ph:(800) 252-2421 - bfumerol@computerhorizons.com - billf@FreeBSD.org - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 11:44:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from implode.root.com (root.com [209.102.106.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2BBDC15232 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 11:44:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from root@implode.root.com) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA09469; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 11:41:36 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199903291941.LAA09469@implode.root.com> To: Darren Reed Cc: jkh@zippy.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 30 Mar 1999 01:50:00 +1000." <199903291550.BAA28981@cheops.anu.edu.au> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 11:41:36 -0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >Well, I toggled the internal BIOS termination setting and >it still crashes. > >when tar got to the end of the run and went back to change >access/modification times of files in ports/x11-fonts/getbdf >it crashed. > >I think I'll go down to just the two devices involved (wd0 >and that scsi drive), trip the chains and see what happens. > >any suggestions (other than upgrade) if it still panics ? > >the job at hand is to copy /usr, /usr/local, /usr/src from >wd0 to the scsi disk. 736952k, 101133 files. I had a machine here that behaved the same way (consistently crashed during heavy filesystem usage). It turned out to be a memory problem, specifically too much electrical load for the motherboard it was plugged in to. -DG David Greenman Co-founder/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 11:49:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from implode.root.com (root.com [209.102.106.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 70AB714C19 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 11:49:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from root@implode.root.com) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA09496; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 11:45:55 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199903291945.LAA09496@implode.root.com> To: Thomas David Rivers Cc: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, mjacob@feral.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 29 Mar 1999 12:30:25 EST." <199903291730.MAA11166@lakes.dignus.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 11:45:55 -0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >> well, I've been newfs'ing the destination partitions each time, if that >> answers that question, which is where the trouble is showing up. >> > > Well - you're not going to like this, but at one time the >reproduction I had with 2.2.5 took the following steps: > > 1) Write 0xff all over the disk partition > 2) newfs the partition > 3) Do an fsck to find that 0x00 wasn't properly > written, some inodes had 0xff in them... > (that is, fsck of a newfs'd partition reported errors) > > So - if this is the same problem I had, doing a newfs doesn't >reliably clean things up. (I actually got it narrowed down to >writing a single 0xff in one spot on the disk.) > > But - I did find that fsck was able to repair things. I believe >because it did things in a different order than newfs did. > > I suppose the moral is - if you're having these kind of problems, >don't trust newfs either... :-( My recollection is that this problem was caused by large raw writes being truncated in the kernel. I also seem to remember that this only happend for floppies. -DG David Greenman Co-founder/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 11:59:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB21014C19 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 11:59:45 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA00452; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 11:53:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199903291953.LAA00452@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Graham Wheeler Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Changing param.c for different environments In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 29 Mar 1999 16:38:11 +0200." <36FF9053.30685AD7@cdsec.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 11:53:19 -0800 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG FWIW, I am slowly pulling the items specified in param.c into such a shape that they can be individually tuned (from the bootloader). This is, unfortunately, going to be a 3+ -ism only. > I am currently using 2.2.7, but I imagine that this will apply to 3.x > as well). > > The param.c file in /usr/src/sys/conf specifies a few linear > dependencies between the configured MAXUSERS and the amount > of mbuf space, timer callout table sizes, etc. It seems to me > that this may be fine in many cases, but not necessarily > appropriate when one is (for example) putting together a > big machine dedicated to being a web server (say). > > How about having a config file variable specifying the type of use > that the machine is intended for - e.g. dedicated web/file server, > multi-user machine for software development, multi-user machine > for mail serving, etc, and using this variable to adjust the > values in param.c? Also, wouldn't it be better to make some of the > values dependent on the amount of RAM, rather than fixed? Is this > possible by tweaking param.c in an elementary fashion? > > -- > Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com > Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 > Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 > Internet/Intranet Network Specialists > Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 12: 8: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp02.wxs.nl (smtp02.wxs.nl [195.121.6.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81AB814C19 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 12:07:56 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from asmodai@wxs.nl) Received: from daemon.ninth-circle.org ([195.121.57.79]) by smtp02.wxs.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 3.61) with ESMTP id AAA41DE for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 22:07:36 +0200 Received: from daemon.ninth-circle.org (abaddon@daemon [192.168.0.1]) by daemon.ninth-circle.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA93186 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 22:07:50 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from asmodai@wxs.nl) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 22:07:49 +0100 (CEST) Organization: Ninth Circle Enterprises From: Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai To: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Question about some include files Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, just want to know something about a few include files because I need the information for some documentation: /usr/src/include/arpa/nameser.h is for the DNS protocol or for BIND only? In which sense do we need nameser.h and namser_compat.h, and how do they differ in what they provide? and the include/elf.h includes the machine/elf.h, but what part of the elf loadable format does it define? Thanks in advance, --- Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven asmodai(at)wxs.nl The idea does not replace the work... Network/Security Specialist *BSD: Powered by Knowledge & Know-how To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 12: 8:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from implode.root.com (root.com [209.102.106.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6C3214C19 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 12:08:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from root@implode.root.com) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA09583; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 12:06:11 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199903292006.MAA09583@implode.root.com> To: Terry Glanfield Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FIN not sent on socket close() In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 29 Mar 1999 16:57:57 -0000." <9903291557.AA21054@program-products.co.uk> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 12:06:11 -0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >I'm having trouble getting an FTP proxy working on 3.1-STABLE. The >proxy is a PASV aware version of the FTWK ftp-gw. When trying to STOR >a file through the proxy the receiving end hangs waiting for a FIN >packet that is never sent. The ktrace output below shows the socket >being closed. I've also included some short packet traces - sorry >about the line length - and dumps of a pftp session for comparison. > >The only difference I can see is that the proxy is being launched from >inetd. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Source code available >on request. Hmmm, inetd opens the network connection on stdin/stdout/stderr (descriptors 0, 1, and 2) for the server that it execs. If this is the same socket that your application is using, then those would have to be closed, too. -DG David Greenman Co-founder/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 13:35:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pak.texar.com (pak.texar.com [207.112.49.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DA2114D65 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 13:35:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dseg@pak.texar.com) Received: (from dseg@localhost) by pak.texar.com (8.8.8/8.8.3) id QAA16977; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 16:36:17 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 16:36:17 -0500 (EST) From: Dan Seguin To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Where, oh where? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Can somebody PLEASE tell me where _thread_sys_socket() is defined? I can't seem to grep it anyhwere. Thanks! Dan Seguin To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 13:44:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cimlogic.com.au (cimlog.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.51.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 992B714CF4 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 13:44:52 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jb@cimlogic.com.au) Received: (from jb@localhost) by cimlogic.com.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id HAA16842; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 07:46:51 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jb) From: John Birrell Message-Id: <199903292146.HAA16842@cimlogic.com.au> Subject: Re: Where, oh where? In-Reply-To: from Dan Seguin at "Mar 29, 1999 4:36:17 pm" To: dseg@texar.com (Dan Seguin) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 07:46:50 +1000 (EST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Dan Seguin wrote: > > > Can somebody PLEASE tell me where _thread_sys_socket() is defined? I > can't seem to grep it anyhwere. It's the socket(2) syscall. It uses the default asm syscall code mostly defined in headers. Look in /usr/src/lib/libc/sys/Makefile.inc -- John Birrell - jb@cimlogic.com.au; jb@freebsd.org http://www.cimlogic.com.au/ CIMlogic Pty Ltd, GPO Box 117A, Melbourne Vic 3001, Australia +61 418 353 137 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 14:20:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailgate.program-products.co.uk (samson.program-products.co.uk [212.240.242.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49D4315922 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 14:20:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from terry@program-products.co.uk) Received: by mailgate.program-products.co.uk via smap (V2.1) id xma033081; Mon, 29 Mar 99 23:20:15 +0100 To: dg@root.com Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FIN not sent on socket close() References: <199903292006.MAA09583@implode.root.com> From: Terry Glanfield Date: 29 Mar 1999 23:20:13 +0100 In-Reply-To: David Greenman's message of "Mon, 29 Mar 1999 12:06:11 -0800" Message-Id: Lines: 15 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.6.44/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG David Greenman writes: > >The only difference I can see is that the proxy is being launched from > >inetd. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Source code available > >on request. > > Hmmm, inetd opens the network connection on stdin/stdout/stderr (descriptors > 0, 1, and 2) for the server that it execs. If this is the same socket that > your application is using, then those would have to be closed, too. Sorry, I think inetd was a wild goose chase. I've launched the proxy as a daemon rather then from inetd with the same problem. Terry. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 15: 8: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (osmium.gn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D13681598D for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 15:07:56 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wilko@yedi.iaf.nl) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (8.9.2/8.9.2) with UUCP id AAA19483; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:39:42 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.8.8/8.6.12) id AAA03490; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:18:55 +0200 (CEST) From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199903292218.AAA03490@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: reproducable filesystem corruption in 2.2.8 In-Reply-To: <199903291722.DAA01239@cheops.anu.edu.au> from Darren Reed at "Mar 30, 1999 3:22:15 am" To: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au (Darren Reed) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:18:55 +0200 (CEST) Cc: jdp@polstra.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem, The Netherlands X-pgp-info: PGP public key at 'finger wilko@freefall.freebsd.org' X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As Darren Reed wrote ... > In some mail from John Polstra, sie said: > > > > In article <199903291550.BAA28981@cheops.anu.edu.au>, > > Darren Reed wrote: > > > Well, I toggled the internal BIOS termination setting and > > > it still crashes. > > > > Don't be insulted if this is too obvious, but ... have you run fsck > > on all your filesystems since you fixed the termination and cabling? > > There could be a lot of residual damage in your filesystems from > > earlier errors. > > Yes. > > And having changing the termination (yet again), the problem is > again aparent but the box hasn't yet panic'd. Another guess: You do have termination power on your bus ? No blown fuses etc? Most are self-restoring these days but.. Groeten / Cheers, Wilko _ ______________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Arnhem, The Netherlands |/|/ / / /( (_) Bulte WWW : http://www.tcja.nl _______________________ Powered by FreeBSD ___ http://www.freebsd.org _____ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 15: 8:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (osmium.gn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 288A714D2E for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 15:07:56 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wilko@yedi.iaf.nl) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (8.9.2/8.9.2) with UUCP id AAA19482; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:39:40 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.8.8/8.6.12) id AAA03483; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:17:04 +0200 (CEST) From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199903292217.AAA03483@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-Reply-To: <199903291726.DAA01363@cheops.anu.edu.au> from Darren Reed at "Mar 30, 1999 3:26: 1 am" To: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au (Darren Reed) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:17:04 +0200 (CEST) Cc: dillon@apollo.backplane.com, jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem, The Netherlands X-pgp-info: PGP public key at 'finger wilko@freefall.freebsd.org' X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As Darren Reed wrote ... > In some mail from Matthew Dillon, sie said: > > > > I will repeat: please upgrade to the latest 2.2.x or upgrade > > to the latest -stable ( 3.x ), known bugs related to these sorts > > of error messages have been fixed since 2.2.8. > > What's the easiest way to upgrade to the latest set of 2.2.8 srcs ? > Just grab the latest kernel src tarballs and compile a new kernel ? > > > Personally speaking, I never trust ZIP or CDROM drives on the same > > SCSI bus as my hard disks. However, unless you are getting SCSI > > error messages before the panic, the SCSI system is probably not the > > cause of your problems. > > There have been *NO* SCSI error messages. Which does not *have* to mean anything. Glitches on the control lines on the SCSI bus can cause devices to latch wrong data from that same bus. Guess what ufs thinks of this ;-) But admittedly, this is rare. So, it is probably safe to assume there is another cause for your grief. Groeten / Cheers, Wilko _ ______________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Arnhem, The Netherlands |/|/ / / /( (_) Bulte WWW : http://www.tcja.nl _______________________ Powered by FreeBSD ___ http://www.freebsd.org _____ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 16:21:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from PacHell.TelcoSucks.org (PacHell.TelcoSucks.org [207.90.181.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B29014D7D for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 16:21:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ulf@PacHell.TelcoSucks.org) Received: (from ulf@localhost) by PacHell.TelcoSucks.org (8.9.2/8.9.1) id QAA71402; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 16:21:47 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ulf) Message-ID: <19990329162147.D45807@TelcoSucks.org> Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 16:21:47 -0800 From: Ulf Zimmermann To: David Scheidt , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: fxp driver causing lockup Reply-To: ulf@Alameda.net References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: ; from David Scheidt on Thu, Mar 18, 1999 at 10:29:35PM -0600 Organization: Alameda Networks, Inc. X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Mar 18, 1999 at 10:29:35PM -0600, David Scheidt wrote: > On 19 Mar 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > : > :Wes Peters writes: > :> I haven't seen any freezes while *probing* the fxp, but they may not > :> really know the difference. The hang happened in the *attach*, when > :> the user (or system) ifconfig's the interface up. Do you have any > :> details, or a contact I can email? > : > :No, I've never had trouble with the fxp driver. It's something I saw > :mentioned on one of the lists - either -advocacy or -chat. > > The machine on my desk at work had this problem trying to install 3.0-RELEASE > via NFS. The hang occurred at ifconfig up time, not boot time. I was > worried that I wouldn't be able to use FreeBSD because of it. Not getting > my constant unix fix would be a bad thing. The machine is a Compaq EN PII-350. > Interestingly, it happened with my machine, but not with a cow-orkers which > is exactly the same. (By actual inspection, not by model.) Had the same problem just now on a Compaq EN, I went into the Bios and enabled under Advance Options the "PCI Bus Mastering" and that fixed the problem with the fxp card. > > David Scheidt > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- Regards, Ulf. --------------------------------------------------------------------- Ulf Zimmermann, 1525 Pacific Ave., Alameda, CA-94501, #: 510-769-2936 Alameda Networks, Inc. | http://www.Alameda.net | Fax#: 510-521-5073 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 17:21:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from axl.noc.iafrica.com (axl.noc.iafrica.com [196.31.1.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E948514A2F for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 17:21:15 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sheldonh@axl.noc.iafrica.com) Received: from sheldonh (helo=axl.noc.iafrica.com) by axl.noc.iafrica.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10RnD5-0000dA-00 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 03:20:55 +0200 From: Sheldon Hearn To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: misc/3237: SCRIPTS addition to bsd.prog.mk Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 03:20:55 +0200 Message-ID: <2427.922756855@axl.noc.iafrica.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi folks, Is the suggestion in misc/3237 (about providing a useful SCRIPTS variable that gets hammered out into a convenient poor-man's install) frowned upon, or is it simply something nobody's really interested in? Ciao, Sheldon. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 17:53:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96B5C14CEF for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 17:53:40 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id RAA36139; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 17:53:17 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 17:53:17 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199903300153.RAA36139@apollo.backplane.com> To: Wilko Bulte Cc: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au (Darren Reed), jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. References: <199903292217.AAA03483@yedi.iaf.nl> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Which does not *have* to mean anything. Glitches on the control lines on the :SCSI bus can cause devices to latch wrong data from that same bus. :Guess what ufs thinks of this ;-) : :But admittedly, this is rare. So, it is probably safe to assume :there is another cause for your grief. : :Groeten / Cheers, :Wilko Generally speaking, glitches will cause SCSI bus parity errors. Maybe not all glitches, but a high enough percentage that you usually get some sort of indication that there is a problem. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 18:29:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from proxy1-bsb.gns.com.br (srv1-bsb.GNS.com.br [200.239.56.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id F0F7015A39 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 18:29:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from lioux@gns.com.br) Received: (qmail 10057 invoked by uid 1002); 30 Mar 1999 02:37:03 -0000 Received: from srv1-bsb.gns.com.br (200.239.56.1) by proxy-bsb.gns.com.br with SMTP; 30 Mar 1999 02:37:03 -0000 Received: (from lioux@localhost) by srv1-bsb.gns.com.br (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA10048 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 23:37:00 -0300 (EST) From: Mario Sergio Fujikawa Ferreira Message-Id: <199903300237.XAA10048@srv1-bsb.gns.com.br> Subject: Stunnel + Xinetd To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 23:37:00 -0300 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, I hope you guys can help or, at least, shed some light over this. I was beta-testing an installation with stunnel but I've been unable to get it working side by side with xinetd. I know that stunnel is working because I have a standalone test running. (Yes, I installed a .pem file accordingly as I noticed later on) Here is the scenario: - Standalone Server (Works) /usr/local/sbin/stunnel 127.0.0.1:995 @other.host.com:pop3 - Xinetd Installation (Doesn't) spop3 995/tcp service spop3 { socket_type = stream protocol = tcp wait = no user = root server = /usr/local/sbin/stunnel server_args = @other.host.com:pop3 instances = 1 interface = other.host.com nice = 20 } My best educate guess would be that it has something to do with the way xinetd handles the port transaction between itself and the underlying daemon. Unfortunaly, I cannot go around xinetd. Furthermore, I'd rather not as this really should be working. Any suggestions? Anyone more experienced? Please... Regards, Mario Ferreira ps: Please reply directly to me at lioux@linf.unb.br. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 18:34:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67D8414D17 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 18:33:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id MAA16408; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 12:32:52 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199903300232.MAA16408@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. To: dillon@apollo.backplane.com (Matthew Dillon) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 12:32:52 +1000 (EST) Cc: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199903291741.JAA33324@apollo.backplane.com> from "Matthew Dillon" at Mar 29, 99 09:41:15 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG where does one get "cvsup" from ? it doesn't appear as a package nor a system binary ? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 18:50:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp.enteract.com (thor.enteract.com [207.229.143.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 5112814F64 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 18:50:49 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dscheidt@enteract.com) Received: (qmail 533 invoked from network); 30 Mar 1999 02:50:29 -0000 Received: from nathan.enteract.com (dscheidt@207.229.143.6) by thor.enteract.com with SMTP; 30 Mar 1999 02:50:29 -0000 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 20:50:29 -0600 (CST) From: David Scheidt To: Darren Reed Cc: Matthew Dillon , jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-Reply-To: <199903300232.MAA16408@cheops.anu.edu.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 30 Mar 1999, Darren Reed wrote: :where does one get "cvsup" from ? : :it doesn't appear as a package nor a system binary ? Try /usr/ports/net/cvsup-bin, which is the staticly linked binary version. The other ports require Modula-3, and maybe something else, and are not really worth the time and effort. David Scheidt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 19: 2: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 869F014F64 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 19:01:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id MAA28655; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 12:31:38 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id MAA25699; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 12:31:37 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990330123136.H413@lemis.com> Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 12:31:36 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Archie Cobbs , paul@originative.co.uk Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default? (was: Taking panic dumps (was: 3.1-S TABLE dies on 40+ connects (resolved))) References: <199903282321.PAA14589@bubba.whistle.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199903282321.PAA14589@bubba.whistle.com>; from Archie Cobbs on Sun, Mar 28, 1999 at 03:21:11PM -0800 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sunday, 28 March 1999 at 15:21:11 -0800, Archie Cobbs wrote: > paul@originative.co.uk writes: >>> Greg Lehey writes: >>>> In that connection, any comments about changing the default way of >>>> building a kernel to create a debug kernel and a stripped copy, and >>>> install the stripped copy? It would require about 10 MB more storage >>>> and a little more time to build the kernel, but since kgdb is useless >>>> without the debug symbols, and disk space is cheap, it seems to me >>>> that it would be worthwhile. >>> >>> Building debug kernels takes up a lot more space, which some people >>> may not have. >>> >>> How about simply fixing 'config -g' to generate a Makefile that >>> does the extra step of copying and stripping the kernel and installing >>> the stripped version kernel.strip instead of kernel? >> >> Unless I misunderstood Greg I think the intention is to always build a debug >> kernel without the user really realising that is happening so that when they >> have a panic they've got the infrastructure there to let the "support team" >> track down the problem. > > [ trimmimg freebsd-net ] Oops, sorry. > Right.. I'm just worried that certain people may object to changing the > behavior to do this automatically (not me by the way). Certain people will object to any change :-) There's a valid point that it uses more memory here, though. >> I think that's a good idea, switch the options around so that by default a >> debug kernel is built and provide an option to build a "production" kernel. >> I don't think a kernel built with -g is going to be significantly slower or >> bigger than a standard kernel once stripped and those after maximum >> performance should know how to go about getting it. > > This is just doing my steps #1 and #2 at the same time, ie: > > Step #1: Fix config -g makefile > Step #2: Make config assume -g by default I think we can do both of these at the same time, as long as we leave a solution for people who really don't have the extra 20 MB (you need space for larger .o files as well). How about this: - make config assume the -g option by default. - add a new option (-s) to config to generate stripped objects. - add a target install.gdb to the Makefile. This target will install the unstripped kernel for people who want to use ddb. - modifiy the existing install target to make a stripped copy of the kernel and to install it. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 19:35:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from whizzo.transsys.com (whizzo.TransSys.COM [144.202.42.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9946B14D07 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 19:35:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from louie@whizzo.transsys.com) Received: from whizzo.transsys.com (localhost.transsys.com [127.0.0.1]) by whizzo.transsys.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id WAA04070; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 22:34:49 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from louie@whizzo.transsys.com) Message-Id: <199903300334.WAA04070@whizzo.transsys.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Greg Lehey Cc: Archie Cobbs , paul@originative.co.uk, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Louis A. Mamakos" Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default? (was: Taking panic dumps (was: 3.1-S TABLE dies on 40+ connects (resolved))) References: <199903282321.PAA14589@bubba.whistle.com> <19990330123136.H413@lemis.com> In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 30 Mar 1999 12:31:36 +0930." <19990330123136.H413@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 22:34:48 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I think we can do both of these at the same time, as long as we leave > a solution for people who really don't have the extra 20 MB (you need > space for larger .o files as well). > > How about this: > > - make config assume the -g option by default. > - add a new option (-s) to config to generate stripped objects. > - add a target install.gdb to the Makefile. This target will install > the unstripped kernel for people who want to use ddb. > - modifiy the existing install target to make a stripped copy of the > kernel and to install it. > How about changing sysinstall to use a somewhat larger default size for the root file system? With disks as cheap as they are these days, why not size it at 100MB or so? Then you'll have a bit more room for debugging kernels. I've always found the default size sysinstall chooses too small for comfort, even when putting /tmp on a different file system. louie To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 20:19: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B676115792 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 20:18:29 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id OAA20043; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 14:10:23 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199903300410.OAA20043@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. To: dscheidt@enteract.com (David Scheidt) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 14:10:22 +1000 (EST) Cc: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, dillon@apollo.backplane.com, jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "David Scheidt" at Mar 29, 99 08:50:29 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In some mail from David Scheidt, sie said: > > On Tue, 30 Mar 1999, Darren Reed wrote: > > :where does one get "cvsup" from ? > : > :it doesn't appear as a package nor a system binary ? > > Try /usr/ports/net/cvsup-bin, which is the staticly linked binary version. Is there src for cvsup anywhere ? I tried cvsup bins but they were slow-as (if it worked even). To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 21:19: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bubba.whistle.com (s205m7.whistle.com [207.76.205.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 870C414D7B for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 21:19:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from archie@whistle.com) Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.whistle.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id VAA32313; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 21:17:59 -0800 (PST) From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199903300517.VAA32313@bubba.whistle.com> Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default? (was: Taking panic dumps (was: 3.1-S TABLE dies on 40+ connects (resolved))) In-Reply-To: <19990330123136.H413@lemis.com> from Greg Lehey at "Mar 30, 99 12:31:36 pm" To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 21:17:59 -0800 (PST) Cc: paul@originative.co.uk, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL38 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey writes: > How about this: > > - make config assume the -g option by default. > - add a new option (-s) to config to generate stripped objects. > - add a target install.gdb to the Makefile. This target will install > the unstripped kernel for people who want to use ddb. > - modifiy the existing install target to make a stripped copy of the > kernel and to install it. Sounds good to me. One thing we do at Whistle is install both kernel (stripped version) and kernel.debug (unstripped version) in the root partition.. it's handy when you don't still have the original debug kernel for getting symboled and line numbered stack traces. Just a thought. -Archie ___________________________________________________________________________ Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 22: 7:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4ECC14DE1 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 22:07:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA43460; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 22:06:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Darren Reed Cc: dscheidt@enteract.com (David Scheidt), dillon@apollo.backplane.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 30 Mar 1999 14:10:22 +1000." <199903300410.OAA20043@cheops.anu.edu.au> Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 22:06:41 -0800 Message-ID: <43458.922774001@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Is there src for cvsup anywhere ? I tried cvsup bins but they were slow-as > (if it worked even). Uh yeah, /usr/ports/net/cvsup. Darren, are you just really sleepy these days or have you suddenly forgotten how to check obvious sources before posting your latest series of questions to -hackers? :-) - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 23:17:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7BD0214D16 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 23:17:28 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA07806 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 07:17:08 GMT Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id AAA00534 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:17:07 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <199903300717.AAA00534@harmony.village.org> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Odd install problem with the latest 4.0-current snap Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:17:07 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'm trying to install the 4.0-19990324 snapshot on a new machine. I'm finding that two things are going odd. First is that the ex driver isn't working at all (I can literally take the EtherPro card that is in this machine and put it in the machine I'm typing on now and the kernel will find it in the latter case, but not the former). I can't seem to get the boot blocks to allow me to say -v to get more information from the install kernel. Second, I have a UltraStor 14F which is jumpered to look like a UltraStor 12F (which is WD1003 compatible). The number of sectors that is reported by the kernel is way off (it says I have a 3.76G disk when in fact it is a 2G disk). Is there any way to force the kernel to change its mind about a disk? From the install program? Thanks for any help that you can provide... Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 23:32:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gidgate.gid.co.uk (gidgate.gid.co.uk [193.123.140.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DBB9F151C0 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 23:32:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: (from rb@localhost) by gidgate.gid.co.uk (8.8.8/8.8.7) id IAA18820; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 08:32:02 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from rb) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19990330083127.007bf2f0@192.168.255.1> X-Sender: rbmail@192.168.255.1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 08:31:27 +0100 To: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au (Darren Reed) From: Bob Bishop Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. Cc: Wilko Bulte , Matthew Dillon , jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199903300153.RAA36139@apollo.backplane.com> References: <199903292217.AAA03483@yedi.iaf.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 17:53 29/03/99 -0800, Matthew Dillon wrote: > Generally speaking, glitches will cause SCSI bus parity errors. Maybe > not all glitches, but a high enough percentage that you usually get > some sort of indication that there is a problem. ...always assuming, of course, that you don't have parity checking turned off in the controller config :-) -- Bob Bishop +44 118 977 4017 rb@gid.co.uk fax +44 118 989 4254 (0800-1800 UK) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 23:33:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from regret.globalserve.net (regret.globalserve.net [209.90.144.72]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7989714D00 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 23:33:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dm@regret.globalserve.net) Received: (from dm@localhost) by regret.globalserve.net (8.9.3/8.9.1) id DAA95548 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 03:46:44 GMT (envelope-from dm) Message-ID: <19990330034644.A95438@globalserve.net> Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 03:46:44 +0000 From: Dan Moschuk To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: pthread_cancel() Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greetings all, Does anyone know off the top of their head what happened to pthread_cancel()? I notice that libc_r does not include this function. Was it never implemented, or is not specified in whatever POSIX draft FreeBSD decides to conform to? Regards, -- Dan Moschuk (TFreak!dm@globalserve.net) Senior Systems/Network Administrator Globalserve Communications Inc., a Primus Canada Company "If at first you don't succeed, redefine success" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Mar 29 23:58:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 591AF14D99 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 23:58:17 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id XAA37830; Mon, 29 Mar 1999 23:57:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 23:57:48 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199903300757.XAA37830@apollo.backplane.com> To: Bob Bishop Cc: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au (Darren Reed), Wilko Bulte , jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. References: <199903292217.AAA03483@yedi.iaf.nl> <3.0.6.32.19990330083127.007bf2f0@192.168.255.1> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : :At 17:53 29/03/99 -0800, Matthew Dillon wrote: :> Generally speaking, glitches will cause SCSI bus parity errors. Maybe :> not all glitches, but a high enough percentage that you usually get :> some sort of indication that there is a problem. : :...always assuming, of course, that you don't have parity checking turned :off in the controller config :-) : :-- :Bob Bishop +44 118 977 4017 :rb@gid.co.uk fax +44 118 989 4254 (0800-1800 UK) Nobody in their right mind turns off parity checking on a SCSI bus. ( At least, anyone who does is beyond any help that hackers can give them ). This line of debate is becoming pointless. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 0: 2:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 09CC8159E3 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:01:58 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA08150 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 08:01:39 GMT Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id BAA01029 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 01:01:38 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <199903300801.BAA01029@harmony.village.org> Subject: Re: Odd install problem with the latest 4.0-current snap Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:17:07 MST." <199903300717.AAA00534@harmony.village.org> References: <199903300717.AAA00534@harmony.village.org> Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 01:01:38 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <199903300717.AAA00534@harmony.village.org> Warner Losh writes: : I'm trying to install the 4.0-19990324 snapshot on a new machine. I'm : finding that two things are going odd. First is that the ex driver : isn't working at all (I can literally take the EtherPro card that is : in this machine and put it in the machine I'm typing on now and the : kernel will find it in the latter case, but not the former). I can't : seem to get the boot blocks to allow me to say -v to get more : information from the install kernel. OK. I removed *ALL* of the devices that I wasn't using. Seems like any read/write of port 300 messes things up (or some other port that something was messing with). Once I killed all the SCSI devices (in addition to the network ones that I had killed before), I was able to get this card to probe. Yippie Skippie! Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 0:32:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2D09159EF for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:32:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gram@cdsec.com) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.8.8/8.6.9) id KAA09329; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 10:31:37 +0200 (SAST) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 9273; Tue Mar 30 10:31:07 1999 Message-ID: <37008BE3.C4AC882B@cdsec.com> Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 10:31:31 +0200 From: Graham Wheeler X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Mike Smith Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Changing param.c for different environments References: <199903291953.LAA00452@dingo.cdrom.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Mike Smith wrote: > > FWIW, I am slowly pulling the items specified in param.c into such a > shape that they can be individually tuned (from the bootloader). > > This is, unfortunately, going to be a 3+ -ism only. Still, that's good news (we won't use 2.2.7 for ever). It would still be useful to have some real world examples from big sites. For example, the Walnut Creek FTP server itself... And does anyone know how these parameters are tuned in NetBSD and OpenBSD? Are they also statically predefined before kernel compilation, or tuneable at boot? And are they a function of MAXUSERS, or a more complex function of MAXUSERS, available RAM, etc? > > The param.c file in /usr/src/sys/conf specifies a few linear > > dependencies between the configured MAXUSERS and the amount > > of mbuf space, timer callout table sizes, etc. It seems to me > > that this may be fine in many cases, but not necessarily > > appropriate when one is (for example) putting together a > > big machine dedicated to being a web server (say). > > > > How about having a config file variable specifying the type of use > > that the machine is intended for - e.g. dedicated web/file server, > > multi-user machine for software development, multi-user machine > > for mail serving, etc, and using this variable to adjust the > > values in param.c? Also, wouldn't it be better to make some of the > > values dependent on the amount of RAM, rather than fixed? Is this > > possible by tweaking param.c in an elementary fashion? -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 0:37:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ewok.creative.net.au (ewok.creative.net.au [203.30.44.41]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 2AD4614E7E for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:37:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from adrian@freebsd.org) Received: (qmail 28565 invoked by uid 1008); 30 Mar 1999 08:22:08 -0000 Message-ID: <19990330082208.28563.qmail@ewok.creative.net.au> From: adrian@freebsd.org To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: fxp driver causing lockup In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 29 Mar 1999 16:21:47 PST." <19990329162147.D45807@TelcoSucks.org> Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 16:22:07 +0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ulf Zimmermann writes: >On Thu, Mar 18, 1999 at 10:29:35PM -0600, David Scheidt wrote: >> On 19 Mar 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: >> >> : >> :Wes Peters writes: >> :> I haven't seen any freezes while *probing* the fxp, but they may not >> :> really know the difference. The hang happened in the *attach*, when >> :> the user (or system) ifconfig's the interface up. Do you have any >> :> details, or a contact I can email? >> : >> :No, I've never had trouble with the fxp driver. It's something I saw >> :mentioned on one of the lists - either -advocacy or -chat. >> >> The machine on my desk at work had this problem trying to install 3.0-RELEAS >E >> via NFS. The hang occurred at ifconfig up time, not boot time. I was >> worried that I wouldn't be able to use FreeBSD because of it. Not getting >> my constant unix fix would be a bad thing. The machine is a Compaq EN PII-3 >50. >> Interestingly, it happened with my machine, but not with a cow-orkers which >> is exactly the same. (By actual inspection, not by model.) > >Had the same problem just now on a Compaq EN, I went into the Bios and >enabled under Advance Options the "PCI Bus Mastering" and that fixed >the problem with the fxp card. > Ditto here. I found the loop, then found DG had commited a patch to the if_fxp.c driver to fix it. The problem exists in 3.1-RELEASE too - apply the patch, and it will work fine. Adrian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 0:43: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from PacHell.TelcoSucks.org (PacHell.TelcoSucks.org [207.90.181.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3712B15426; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:43:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ulf@PacHell.TelcoSucks.org) Received: (from ulf@localhost) by PacHell.TelcoSucks.org (8.9.2/8.9.1) id AAA99234; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:42:56 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ulf) Message-ID: <19990330004256.A52430@TelcoSucks.org> Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:42:56 -0800 From: Ulf Zimmermann To: adrian@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: fxp driver causing lockup Reply-To: ulf@Alameda.net References: <19990329162147.D45807@TelcoSucks.org> <19990330082208.28563.qmail@ewok.creative.net.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990330082208.28563.qmail@ewok.creative.net.au>; from adrian@FreeBSD.ORG on Tue, Mar 30, 1999 at 04:22:07PM +0800 Organization: Alameda Networks, Inc. X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Mar 30, 1999 at 04:22:07PM +0800, adrian@FreeBSD.ORG wrote: > Ulf Zimmermann writes: > >On Thu, Mar 18, 1999 at 10:29:35PM -0600, David Scheidt wrote: > >> On 19 Mar 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > >> > >> : > >> :Wes Peters writes: > >> :> I haven't seen any freezes while *probing* the fxp, but they may not > >> :> really know the difference. The hang happened in the *attach*, when > >> :> the user (or system) ifconfig's the interface up. Do you have any > >> :> details, or a contact I can email? > >> : > >> :No, I've never had trouble with the fxp driver. It's something I saw > >> :mentioned on one of the lists - either -advocacy or -chat. > >> > >> The machine on my desk at work had this problem trying to install 3.0-RELEAS > >E > >> via NFS. The hang occurred at ifconfig up time, not boot time. I was > >> worried that I wouldn't be able to use FreeBSD because of it. Not getting > >> my constant unix fix would be a bad thing. The machine is a Compaq EN PII-3 > >50. > >> Interestingly, it happened with my machine, but not with a cow-orkers which > >> is exactly the same. (By actual inspection, not by model.) > > > >Had the same problem just now on a Compaq EN, I went into the Bios and > >enabled under Advance Options the "PCI Bus Mastering" and that fixed > >the problem with the fxp card. > > > > Ditto here. > I found the loop, then found DG had commited a patch to the if_fxp.c > driver to fix it. > > The problem exists in 3.1-RELEASE too - apply the patch, and it will work > fine. It is not in the SNAP from yesterday yet, so I looked around. Found the BIOS setting, worked like a charm then. > > > > Adrian > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- Regards, Ulf. --------------------------------------------------------------------- Ulf Zimmermann, 1525 Pacific Ave., Alameda, CA-94501, #: 510-769-2936 Alameda Networks, Inc. | http://www.Alameda.net | Fax#: 510-521-5073 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 0:44:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au (adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.36.247]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 096B01550F; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:43:56 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kkennawa@physics.adelaide.edu.au) Received: from bragg (bragg [129.127.36.34]) by adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8/UofA-1.5) with SMTP id SAA10417; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 18:13:47 +0930 (CST) Received: from localhost by bragg; (5.65/1.1.8.2/05Aug95-0227PM) id AA02758; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 18:13:40 +0930 Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 18:13:40 +0930 (CST) From: Kris Kennaway X-Sender: kkennawa@bragg To: Julian Assange Cc: freebsd-ports@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: festival package from NetBSD In-Reply-To: <199903281919.FAA18547@yoshi.iq.org> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 29 Mar 1999, Julian Assange wrote: > This package was quite a bit of work to create (27 sub-packages, > 10 diphone databases, 4 pronounciation dictionaries, lexicons > etc). It should be trivial to port from the NetBSD pkg system > to the FreeBSD port system. Cool, I've been idly poking at this for a while now, this will help. Thanks! Kris ----- The Feynman problem-solving algorithm: 1. Write down the problem 2. Think real hard 3. Write down the solution To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 0:49: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from titan.metropolitan.at (unknown [195.212.98.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD756159F8 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:48:51 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mladavac@metropolitan.at) Received: by TITAN with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 10:50:59 +0200 Message-ID: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D097576@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at> From: Ladavac Marino To: 'Matthew Dillon' , Bob Bishop Cc: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, Wilko Bulte , jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: another ufs panic.. Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 10:45:32 +0200 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > -----Original Message----- > From: Matthew Dillon [SMTP:dillon@apollo.backplane.com] > Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 1999 9:58 AM > To: Bob Bishop > Cc: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au; Wilko Bulte; jkh@zippy.cdrom.com; > hackers@FreeBSD.ORG > Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. > > > Nobody in their right mind turns off parity checking on a SCSI > bus. > ( At least, anyone who does is beyond any help that hackers can > give > them ). This line of debate is becoming pointless. > [ML] Another point in case (okay, it is a bit wild goose) but years ago I have had problems with my SCSI disk which not even parity could detect (in fact, raw device writes and reads displayed bit errors). Eventually I have discovered that an IDE disc was probably generating a lot of electrical noise on the bus (even when not spoken to). As soon as I have removed the IDE disc, the bit errors simply disappeared (and haven't reappeared ever since). This is a venue worth of research. Funny enough, I did not have any problems when accessing that particular IDE disk. On the second thought, I think that the noise propagated through the power supply, because the bit errors were there even when the IDE disc was disconnected from the "controller" but still attached to the power. I guess the errors were actually generated somewhere in the analog part of the SCSI disc (but I could not tell where since the parity and ECC control in the disc should have detected that, but I am not altogether sure if I have had the proper mode page bits turned on--it was the L-thing--yes, that long ago--and they did not have scsi(8)/camcontrol(8) at that time): Darren, this could possibly be your problem as well since you seem to have a lot of hardware hanging off the same power supply--prehaps it just cannot regulate any more. You could test that by writing a known pattern to the raw device and then reading it back--just make sure that the tar runs on EIDE drive writing into the bit-bucket so that the EIDE does not spin down and that it keeps seeking--both actions take a lot of power. /Marino > -Matt > Matthew Dillon > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 3: 7:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pcnet1.pcnet.com (pcnet1.pcnet.com [204.213.232.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41C9A15AAB for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 03:07:54 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from eischen@vigrid.com) Received: (from eischen@localhost) by pcnet1.pcnet.com (8.8.7/PCNet) id GAA18567; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 06:07:01 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 06:07:01 -0500 (EST) From: Daniel Eischen Message-Id: <199903301107.GAA18567@pcnet1.pcnet.com> To: dm@globalserve.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: pthread_cancel() Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Does anyone know off the top of their head what happened to pthread_cancel()? > I notice that libc_r does not include this function. Was it never implemented, > or is not specified in whatever POSIX draft FreeBSD decides to conform to? It's not implemented yet. Dan Eischen eischen@vigrid.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 4:49: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from europa.salford.ac.uk (europa.salford.ac.uk [146.87.3.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 6C1DC15A7A for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 04:48:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from M.S.Powell@ais.salford.ac.uk) Received: (qmail 27878 invoked by alias); 30 Mar 1999 12:48:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 27854 invoked from network); 30 Mar 1999 12:48:05 -0000 Received: from plato.salford.ac.uk (146.87.255.76) by europa.salford.ac.uk with SMTP; 30 Mar 1999 12:48:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 1154 invoked by alias); 30 Mar 1999 12:48:04 -0000 Delivered-To: catchall-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: (qmail 1145 invoked by uid 141); 30 Mar 1999 12:48:04 -0000 Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 15:57:06 +0000 (GMT) From: Mark Powell To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: NTP problems. This hardware related? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, Running xntpd on a new server in just the same was as I do on every other. However, I noticed this machines clock was way out after a few days. The machine does an "ntpdate -b" at bootup, but can't sync the time. From ntp log: Mar 4 11:32:33 mimas xntpd[111]: offset 0.000000 freq 11.708 poll 6 Mar 4 12:32:33 mimas xntpd[111]: offset 0.000000 freq 11.708 poll 6 Mar 4 13:32:33 mimas xntpd[111]: offset 0.000000 freq 11.708 poll 6 Mar 4 14:32:33 mimas xntpd[111]: offset 0.000000 freq 11.708 poll 6 Mar 4 15:32:33 mimas xntpd[111]: offset 0.000000 freq 11.708 poll 6 The offsets are always o and the 11.708, from /etc/ntp.drift never changes. I changed to having "ntpdate

..." run from cron. Again from ntp log: ntpdate[6478]: step time server 146.87.255.63 offset -2.495694 ntpdate[6481]: step time server 146.87.255.63 offset -2.495796 ntpdate[6489]: step time server 146.87.255.63 offset -2.498253 This machine is gaining ~2.5s every minute! No wonder xntpd can't sync the time. Am I right here? Is that why it's failing? Looking at the clocks at boot up, it would appear that over 40 reboots, the TSC clock has varied from 126668897 to 132002659, a variance of almost 5%. Is this normal? Could this be causing the time problems, and if so is there anyway I can fiddle with tickadj or something to let xntpd work on this machine? Cheers. Mark Powell - System Administrator (UNIX) - Clifford Whitworth Building A.I.S., University of Salford, Salford, Manchester, UK. Tel: +44 161 295 5936 Fax: +44 161 295 5888 www.pgp.com for PGP key M.S.Powell@ais.salfrd.ac.uk (spell salford correctly to reply to me) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 7:17:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D88F151E9; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 07:17:17 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (wes@zaphod.softweyr.com [204.68.178.35]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA01431; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 08:16:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <3700EAE6.8AAFD8F9@softweyr.com> Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 08:16:54 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr llc X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ulf@Alameda.net Cc: adrian@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: fxp driver causing lockup References: <19990329162147.D45807@TelcoSucks.org> <19990330082208.28563.qmail@ewok.creative.net.au> <19990330004256.A52430@TelcoSucks.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ulf Zimmermann wrote: > > On Tue, Mar 30, 1999 at 04:22:07PM +0800, adrian@FreeBSD.ORG wrote: > > > > Ditto here. > > I found the loop, then found DG had commited a patch to the if_fxp.c > > driver to fix it. > > > > The problem exists in 3.1-RELEASE too - apply the patch, and it will work > > fine. > > It is not in the SNAP from yesterday yet, so I looked around. Found > the BIOS setting, worked like a charm then. Actually, I commited the patch to -CURRENT a week ago last Friday. David said wait a week before committing it to -STABLE, and I got busy over the weekend. I committed it to -STABLE last night, so it'll be in your next update. All the feedback I've gotten in the last 10 days has been positive, so now I'm just waiting for the kvetching to start pouring in... ;^) -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 7:36:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tornado.cisco.com (tornado.cisco.com [171.69.104.22]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5A9214E86; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 07:36:03 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bmcgover@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com) Received: from bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (bmcgover-pc.cisco.com [171.69.104.147]) by tornado.cisco.com (8.8.5-Cisco.1/8.6.5) with ESMTP id KAA06727; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 10:35:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (localhost.pa.dtd.cisco.com [127.0.0.1]) by bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id KAA00331; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 10:35:42 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from bmcgover@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com) Message-Id: <199903301535.KAA00331@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-smp@freebsd.org Subject: Compaq Presario 800... No Joy? Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 10:35:42 -0500 From: Brian McGovern Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG After having used a Compaq Presario 400 for a few months with FreeBSD in SMP mode (dual PII/450), I decied I'd try to get a beefier box by getting an 800 with some Ultra-2-Wide SCSI drives, a GB of RAM, and the whole deal. Unfortunately, it appears not to work with both processors installed and trying to run an SMP kernel. Basically, when I boot up (either verbose or not), it gets through the memory checks ok, and then displays: panic: assign_apic_irq: inconsistent table mp_lock = 00000001; cpuid=0; lapic_id = ffffffff Followed by the standard "Rebooting in 15 seconds..." message of the panic/reboot. The listing from mptable is below. I'm suspecting since the extended table is "HOSED" that the motherboard is not Intel MP compliant (from the mptable man page), and I'm screwed. But, I thought I'd ask in case anyone has some ideas, or maybe a fix I'm not aware of, to get the machine up and running. Make world's and make release's scream with the 768MB of MFS... Its too bad I can't get the second processor going. Anyhow, comments welcome. -Brian =============================================================================== MPTable, version 2.0.15 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MP Floating Pointer Structure: location: BIOS physical address: 0x000f4ff0 signature: '_MP_' length: 16 bytes version: 1.4 checksum: 0x00 mode: Virtual Wire ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MP Config Table Header: physical address: 0x000f25dc signature: 'PCMP' base table length: 484 version: 1.4 checksum: 0x9a OEM ID: 'COMPAQ ' Product ID: 'PROLIANT ' OEM table pointer: 0x00000000 OEM table size: 0 entry count: 52 local APIC address: 0xfee00000 extended table length: 76 extended table checksum: 86 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MP Config Base Table Entries: -- Processors: APIC ID Version State Family Model Step Flags 0 0x10 BSP, usable 6 2 1 0x0381 0 0x10 AP, usable 6 5 2 0x183fbff -- Bus: Bus ID Type 0 PCI 1 PCI 9 ISA -- I/O APICs: APIC ID Version State Address 8 0x11 usable 0xfec00000 -- I/O Ints: Type Polarity Trigger Bus ID IRQ APIC ID PIN# INT active-lo level 1 10:A 8 17 INT active-lo level 1 10:B 8 16 INT active-lo level 1 10:C 8 17 INT active-lo level 1 10:D 8 16 INT active-lo level 1 9:A 8 19 INT active-lo level 1 9:B 8 18 INT active-lo level 1 9:C 8 19 INT active-lo level 1 9:D 8 18 INT active-lo level 1 8:A 8 21 INT active-lo level 1 8:B 8 20 INT active-lo level 1 8:C 8 21 INT active-lo level 1 8:D 8 20 INT active-lo level 1 7:A 8 23 INT active-lo level 1 7:B 8 22 INT active-lo level 1 7:C 8 23 INT active-lo level 1 7:D 8 22 INT active-lo level 0 15:A 8 25 INT active-lo level 0 15:B 8 24 INT active-lo level 0 15:C 8 25 INT active-lo level 0 15:D 8 24 INT active-lo level 0 13:A 8 27 INT active-lo level 0 13:B 8 26 INT active-lo level 0 13:C 8 27 INT active-lo level 0 13:D 8 26 INT active-lo level 0 6:A 8 31 INT active-lo level 0 6:B 8 30 INT active-lo level 0 7:A 8 29 INT active-lo level 0 8:A 8 28 INT active-hi edge 9 1 8 1 INT active-hi edge 9 0 8 2 INT active-hi edge 9 3 8 3 INT active-hi edge 9 4 8 4 INT active-hi edge 9 5 8 5 INT active-hi edge 9 6 8 6 INT active-hi edge 9 7 8 7 INT active-hi edge 9 8 8 8 INT active-hi edge 9 9 8 9 INT active-hi edge 9 10 8 10 INT active-hi edge 9 11 8 11 INT active-hi edge 9 12 8 12 INT active-lo edge 9 13 8 13 INT active-hi edge 9 14 8 14 INT active-hi edge 9 15 8 15 -- Local Ints: Type Polarity Trigger Bus ID IRQ APIC ID PIN# ExtINT conforms conforms 9 0 255 0 NMI conforms conforms 9 0 255 1 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MP Config Extended Table Entries: Extended Table HOSED! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 8:27:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from verdi.nethelp.no (verdi.nethelp.no [158.36.41.162]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 4709A15B27 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 08:27:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sthaug@nethelp.no) Received: (qmail 10691 invoked by uid 1001); 30 Mar 1999 16:27:22 +0000 (GMT) To: bmcgover@cisco.com Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-smp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Compaq Presario 800... No Joy? From: sthaug@nethelp.no In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 30 Mar 1999 10:35:42 -0500" References: <199903301535.KAA00331@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.05+ on Emacs 19.34.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 18:27:21 +0200 Message-ID: <10689.922811241@verdi.nethelp.no> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > After having used a Compaq Presario 400 for a few months with FreeBSD in SMP > mode (dual PII/450), I decied I'd try to get a beefier box by getting an 800 > with some Ultra-2-Wide SCSI drives, a GB of RAM, and the whole deal. > > Unfortunately, it appears not to work with both processors installed and trying > to run an SMP kernel. > > Basically, when I boot up (either verbose or not), it gets through the memory > checks ok, and then displays: > > panic: assign_apic_irq: inconsistent table > mp_lock = 00000001; cpuid=0; lapic_id = ffffffff > > Followed by the standard "Rebooting in 15 seconds..." message of the > panic/reboot. 1. Have you recompiled your kernel with a higher number of NINTR? 2. How recent is your kernel? Spefically, does it include Tor Egge's patch shown below? Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no ---------------------------------------------------------------------- To: sigpet@islandia.is Cc: freebsd-smp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Problem - Compaq Proliant 2500 and SMP From: Tor.Egge@fast.no Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 03:45:29 +0100 > Hi. > I've bean scrolling throug the archives and I cant find any solution to my > problem. > > I have Compaq Proliant 2500 with 2x200 Mhz Pentium Pro CPUs. 128 Mb RAM > I have configured the APIC option in System Configuration ( BIOS ) to FULL > TABLE but still it crashes on boot up with this: > > assign_apic_irq:inconsistent table > MP_LOCK=0000001 ; CPUID=0 ; lapic=01000000 Try this patch: Index: mp_machdep.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/sys/i386/i386/mp_machdep.c,v retrieving revision 1.89 diff -u -r1.89 mp_machdep.c --- mp_machdep.c 1999/01/28 01:59:50 1.89 +++ mp_machdep.c 1999/02/26 02:43:04 @@ -1090,7 +1090,7 @@ int_to_apicintpin[x].redirindex = 0; } for (x = 0; x < nintrs; x++) { - if (io_apic_ints[x].dst_apic_int <= APIC_INTMAPSIZE && + if (io_apic_ints[x].dst_apic_int < APIC_INTMAPSIZE && io_apic_ints[x].dst_apic_id == IO_TO_ID(0) && io_apic_ints[x].int_vector == 0xff && (io_apic_ints[x].int_type == 0 || - Tor Egge To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-smp" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 8:38:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns1.yes.no (ns1.yes.no [195.204.136.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EE1114CFD for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 08:38:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from eivind@bitbox.follo.net) Received: from bitbox.follo.net (bitbox.follo.net [195.204.143.218]) by ns1.yes.no (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id SAA18297; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 18:37:52 +0200 (CEST) Received: (from eivind@localhost) by bitbox.follo.net (8.8.8/8.8.6) id SAA64776; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 18:37:50 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 18:37:50 +0200 From: Eivind Eklund To: Karl Pielorz Cc: Ramin@www.dci.co.ir, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, abuse@www.dci.co.ir, abuse@dci.iran.com Subject: Re: Hacking And Basic LEsson's Message-ID: <19990330183749.A7110@bitbox.follo.net> References: <19990329081937.ECC8614E47@hub.freebsd.org> <36FF385B.6597591B@tdx.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <36FF385B.6597591B@tdx.co.uk>; from Karl Pielorz on Mon, Mar 29, 1999 at 09:22:51AM +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Mar 29, 1999 at 09:22:51AM +0100, Karl Pielorz wrote: > Ramin@www.dci.co.ir wrote: > > > > Hi > > I m new in this LIST > > & like to know about HACKING ;) > > Please Guide me about GOOD Site's (www,ftp,...) > > thanx > > This list is for people interesting in 'hacking' the FreeBSD kernel/sources, > and not for people who are interested in 'cracking' (as in > attacking/exploiting and gaining access to other remote sites)... If it's the > former you want have a look at http://www.freebsd.org and > ftp://ftp.freebsd.org... > > If it's the latter, I don't think we can help you :( Of course we can. We can, for instance, reply with a Cc to the relevant parties at his original location. This should result in him being Taught The Error Of His Ways. Eivind. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 8:52:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tornado.cisco.com (tornado.cisco.com [171.69.104.22]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 655EA15A6C; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 08:52:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bmcgover@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com) Received: from bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (bmcgover-pc.cisco.com [171.69.104.147]) by tornado.cisco.com (8.8.5-Cisco.1/8.6.5) with ESMTP id LAA09266; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 11:52:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (localhost.pa.dtd.cisco.com [127.0.0.1]) by bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id LAA00482; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 11:52:35 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from bmcgover@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com) Message-Id: <199903301652.LAA00482@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com> To: sthaug@nethelp.no Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-smp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Compaq Presario 800... No Joy? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 30 Mar 1999 18:27:21 +0200." <10689.922811241@verdi.nethelp.no> Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 11:52:35 -0500 From: Brian McGovern Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Well, tried the patch provided. It still doesn't work, but it changed the symptoms a bit. Now, rather than the panic, I get (note: the first line might be bogus... my notes aren't perfect): Programming 34 pins on IOAPIC #0: IOAPIC #0 intpin 24 -> irq -1 IOAPIC #0 intpin 25 -> irq -1 IOAPIC #0 intpin 26 -> irq -1 IOAPIC #0 intpin 27 -> irq -1 IOAPIC #0 intpin 28 -> irq -1 IOAPIC #0 intpin 29 -> irq -1 IOAPIC #0 intpin 30 -> irq -1 IOAPIC #0 intpin 31 -> irq -1 Then the machine hangs. -Brian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 11: 8:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (osmium.gn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC6B51551A for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 11:08:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wilko@yedi.iaf.nl) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (8.9.2/8.9.2) with UUCP id UAA10926; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 20:40:45 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.8.8/8.6.12) id UAA01034; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 20:40:20 +0200 (CEST) From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199903301840.UAA01034@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.19990330083127.007bf2f0@192.168.255.1> from Bob Bishop at "Mar 30, 1999 8:31:27 am" To: rb@gid.co.uk (Bob Bishop) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 20:40:20 +0200 (CEST) Cc: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, dillon@apollo.backplane.com, jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem, The Netherlands X-pgp-info: PGP public key at 'finger wilko@freefall.freebsd.org' X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As Bob Bishop wrote ... > At 17:53 29/03/99 -0800, Matthew Dillon wrote: > > Generally speaking, glitches will cause SCSI bus parity errors. Maybe "Generally" that is true... ;-) I'm just playing the devil's advocate a bit here. > > not all glitches, but a high enough percentage that you usually get > > some sort of indication that there is a problem. True. But I've heard stories about PCI bridge chips in combination with specific adapter firmware revs corrupting data. In general, everything in the datapath can cause you grief. With the crappy PC hardware out there (and/or overclocked crappy PC h/w to make it worse) anything is possible. Even without SCSI. > ...always assuming, of course, that you don't have parity checking turned > off in the controller config :-) There is single word to describe that idea: "stupid" Groeten / Cheers, Wilko _ ______________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Arnhem, The Netherlands |/|/ / / /( (_) Bulte WWW : http://www.tcja.nl _______________________ Powered by FreeBSD ___ http://www.freebsd.org _____ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 11:14:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tabby.kudra.com (gw.kudra.com [199.6.32.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B1A3215B54 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 11:14:08 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from robert@kudra.com) Received: (from robert@localhost) by tabby.kudra.com (8.9.2/8.6.12) id OAA22157; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 14:13:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <19990330141345.A22153@kudra.com> Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 14:13:45 -0500 From: Robert Sexton To: Wilko Bulte Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. References: <3.0.6.32.19990330083127.007bf2f0@192.168.255.1> <199903301840.UAA01034@yedi.iaf.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199903301840.UAA01034@yedi.iaf.nl>; from Wilko Bulte on Tue, Mar 30, 1999 at 08:40:20PM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Mar 30, 1999 at 08:40:20PM +0200, Wilko Bulte wrote: > As Bob Bishop wrote ... > > At 17:53 29/03/99 -0800, Matthew Dillon wrote: > > > Generally speaking, glitches will cause SCSI bus parity errors. Maybe > > "Generally" that is true... ;-) I'm just playing the devil's advocate > a bit here. > > > > not all glitches, but a high enough percentage that you usually get > > > some sort of indication that there is a problem. > > True. But I've heard stories about PCI bridge chips in combination > with specific adapter firmware revs corrupting data. In general, everything in > the datapath can cause you grief. With the crappy PC hardware out there > (and/or overclocked crappy PC h/w to make it worse) anything is possible. > Even without SCSI. I saw an actual example of this last month. SymBIOS controller, FIC motherboard. The supplier had flashed the wrong bios onto the machine, and hard drive data was quickly scrambled without any SCSI errors at all. Linux died quickly. FreeBSD lasted longer, but eventually threw in the towel due to all of the data corruption. -- Robert Sexton, robert@kudra.com "No one told me that it could not be done, and so I did it." - Jack Kloepfer Read the Newton FAQ! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 14:29:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from localhost (00-60-67-24-29-83.bconnected.net [209.53.17.55]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4218214C3A for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 14:29:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jwalther@localhost) Received: from jwalther by localhost with local-smtp (Exim 2.11 #1 (Debian)) id 10S6yA-0007yK-00; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 14:26:50 -0800 Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 14:26:50 -0800 (PST) From: Jonathan Walther X-Sender: jwalther@localhost To: "Niels Chr. Bank-Pedersen" Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Your system is too old to use this bsd.port.mk..... In-Reply-To: <19990331002149.A29506@bank-pedersen.dk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Niels Chr. Bank-Pedersen wrote: > > ===> windowmaker-0.51.2 : Your system is too old to use this bsd.port.mk. > > You need a fresh make world or an upgrade kit. Please go to > > http://www.freebsd.org/ports/ or a mirror site and follow the > > instructions. > > I think my system is too YOUNG, not TOO OLD: > > 4.0-CURRENT FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT #0: Tue Mar 30 02:52:13 MSD 1999 Same problem here, and I am on 3.1-STABLE. Thanks for the solution, but why isn't this a part of make world? > "cd /usr/src/share/mk && make install" Jonathan Walther DVBS To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 14:34:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from finch-post-12.mail.demon.net (finch-post-12.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.41]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C12914C25 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 14:34:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dmlb@ragnet.demon.co.uk) Received: from [158.152.46.40] (helo=ragnet.demon.co.uk) by finch-post-12.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10S75J-0007hM-0C for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 22:34:14 +0000 Received: from dmlb by ragnet.demon.co.uk with local (Exim 1.82 #1) id 10S68Y-0000K6-00; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 22:33:30 +0100 Content-Length: 1629 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 22:33:30 +0100 (BST) From: Duncan Barclay To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Problem with bin/sh in 3.1 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi all Before I go on a what is likely to be a long bug hunt I wondered if anyone can point me in the right direction. I've just upgraded from 2.2.6 to 3.1. In my .env file for bin/sh I have if [ x$TERM = xxterm -o x$TERM = xxterm-color ]; then _WSIZE=$(stty -a | sed -n -e '1s/.*; \([0-9]*\) rows; \([0-9]*\).*/\2x\1/p') _winch(){ _WSIZE=$(stty -a | sed -n -e '1s/.*; \([0-9]*\) rows; \([0-9]*\).*/\2x\1/p') _statusline } trap _winch 28 ... fi _statusline is a shell function to change the xterm's title bar which includes the window size in the title. Under 2.2.6 this works fine. Under 3.1 the shell process gets stuck in an infinte loop somewhere when it rus the _winch function. I have reduced the above to the failing test case if [ x$TERM = xxterm -o x$TERM = xxterm-color ]; then _TTY=$(tty) trap "stty -a -f $_TTY" 28 fi This only appears to happen when stty is used in the trap action and it occurs AFTER stty has been run, i.e. I see the output of stty -a in the xterm. Also it is the shell looping, ps(1) says that it is in waiting on "wait". I pulled the 2.2.6 shell out from the CVS tree and compiled it under 3.1. It worked fine. stty hasn't been touched. There have been significant changes in 3.1's usr/src/bin/sh/trap.c. Would this be the best place to start tracking this down in? Duncan --- ________________________________________________________________________ Duncan Barclay | God smiles upon the little children, dmlb@ragnet.demon.co.uk | the alcoholics, and the permanently stoned. ________________________________________________________________________ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 16:56:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from relay.veriguard.com (relay.veriguard.com [207.5.63.61]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A53C1506D for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 16:56:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tomb@heliox.com) Received: by relay.veriguard.com; id IAA21974; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 08:57:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from unknown(10.5.63.100) by relay.veriguard.com via smap (4.1) id xma021972; Tue, 30 Mar 99 08:57:18 -0800 Message-ID: <37017313.6981CEE4@heliox.com> Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 16:57:55 -0800 From: Tom Brown X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: How do I write to the /dev/bpf0 interface? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi I'm busy trying to simulate spanning tree protocol on a collection of BSD machines (2.2.8). I have configured the bpf0 interface and can noe read from it with no problems. What I need to do now is write my pre formated ethernet frame. I have tried in perl to open the device and write to it via a filehandle. I have also tried to write to it on the command line. Can anyone please tell me how to post a packet onto my LAN via this interface. Thanks in advance, Tom Brown To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 17: 8:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F22D214C47; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 17:08:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA26974; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 17:05:56 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199903310105.RAA26974@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Julian Assange Cc: freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: festival package from NetBSD In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 29 Mar 1999 05:19:20 +1000." <199903281919.FAA18547@yoshi.iq.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 17:05:55 -0800 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG If I am not mistaken Festival was originally developed on FreeBSD so perhaps the developing team may be interested in making a ports / package. Amancio To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 18: 2:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alcanet.com.au (border.alcanet.com.au [203.62.196.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A08C15544 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 18:02:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au) Received: by border.alcanet.com.au id <40597>; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 11:48:07 +1000 Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:14:15 +1000 From: Peter Jeremy Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Message-Id: <99Mar31.114807est.40597@border.alcanet.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matthew Dillon wrote: > Nobody in their right mind turns off parity checking on a SCSI bus. Sounds like it would be useful for the kernel to warn if a SCSI target (including the controller) has parity disabled. How easy is it to detect this? I can't quickly see it in the device-independent parts of of a drive spec. Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 18: 6:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alcanet.com.au (border.alcanet.com.au [203.62.196.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 709DE1512B for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 18:06:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au) Received: by border.alcanet.com.au id <40553>; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 11:53:10 +1000 Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:07:11 +1000 From: Peter Jeremy Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default? To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Message-Id: <99Mar31.115310est.40553@border.alcanet.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey wrote: >Certain people will object to any change :-) There's a valid point >that it uses more memory here, though. The VM usage by the ld step goes up substantially. For systems with small physical memory, this means lots of paging. (I have been caught a couple of times trying to re-build kernels in single user mode and the ld just hangs if I forget to manually add the swap partitions). >How about this: > > - make config assume the -g option by default. > - add a new option (-s) to config to generate stripped objects. > - add a target install.gdb to the Makefile. This target will install > the unstripped kernel for people who want to use ddb. > - modifiy the existing install target to make a stripped copy of the > kernel and to install it. Sounds good. I've already got a modified makefile, but only for aout kernels (ie 2.x and 3.0-RELEASE). I'd suggest `kernel.debug', rather than `kernel.gdb' since 1) that's what the handbook uses and 2) it avoids reference to a specific debugger. One comment on booting from unstripped kernels: Section 22.1 of the Handbook (at least in 3.1-RELEASE and up till the recent freeze in -CURRENT) states: When the kernel has been built make a copy of it, say kernel.debug, and then run strip -d on the original. Install the original as normal. You may also install the unstripped kernel, but symbol table lookup time for some programs will drastically increase, and since the whole kernel is loaded entirely at boot time and cannot be swapped out later, several megabytes of physical memory will be wasted. Is this still correct? I know that `strip -d' should be `strip -g' for ELF. Does the ELF loader still load the entire physical kernel (leaving ~6.4MB of symbol table clogging up physical memory)? I though that even the later aout kernels cleaned up the resident symbol table (though I'm not sure what they did with the freed memory). There's also a reference to using `strip -x' to just leave global symbols. Last time I tried this (probably 2.2.6), this caused some commands to fail because they were doing nlist() lookups on kernel local symbols. Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 18:35:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from feral.com (feral.com [192.67.166.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 130A214DC8 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 18:35:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mjacob@feral.com) Received: from localhost (mjacob@localhost) by feral.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA00445; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 18:34:41 -0800 Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 18:34:41 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Jacob X-Sender: mjacob@feral-gw Reply-To: mjacob@feral.com To: Peter Jeremy Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. In-Reply-To: <99Mar31.114807est.40597@border.alcanet.com.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Peter Jeremy wrote: > Matthew Dillon wrote: > > Nobody in their right mind turns off parity checking on a SCSI bus. > > Sounds like it would be useful for the kernel to warn if a SCSI target > (including the controller) has parity disabled. How easy is it to > detect this? I can't quickly see it in the device-independent parts > of of a drive spec. > Can't tell. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 20:22:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pluto.plutotech.com (mail.plutotech.com [206.168.67.137]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8276A155A6 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 20:22:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from drew@plutotech.com) Received: from pluto.plutotech.com (drew@pluto.l206.plutotech.com [206.168.67.1]) by pluto.plutotech.com (8.9.2/8.9.1) with ESMTP id VAA94479 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 21:22:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drew@plutotech.com) Message-Id: <199903310422.VAA94479@pluto.plutotech.com> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. X-Newsgroups: pluto.freebsd.hackers In-Reply-To: Organization: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 21:22:11 -0700 From: Drew Eckhardt Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article you write: >On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Peter Jeremy wrote: >> Sounds like it would be useful for the kernel to warn if a SCSI target >> (including the controller) has parity disabled. How easy is it to >> detect this? I can't quickly see it in the device-independent parts >> of of a drive spec. > >Can't tell. Some chips (Symbios) allow one to tweak parity for testing purposes. One could take advantage of this by executing some command guaranteed to be supported (test unit ready) with bad parity and watching what happened. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 21:59: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5FB314E88 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 21:58:57 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id AAA29634; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 00:58:27 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199903310558.AAA29634@cs.rpi.edu> To: Matthew Dillon Cc: "David E. Cross" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, schimken@cs.rpi.edu, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: More death to nfsiod In-Reply-To: Message from Matthew Dillon of "Sat, 27 Mar 1999 16:53:57 PST." <199903280053.QAA20231@apollo.backplane.com> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 00:58:26 -0500 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :This bug was tickeled by performig the folowing tasks on the NFS mounted :directory (NFSv2/UDP from a server of the eaxact same build). :First I did a "mkisofs112 -J -o netscape.iso .netscape" .netscape contains about 70M of data, 12209 files, and 38 directories. I tickeled the bug before by :using mkisofs112 to create an iso image of ie5.0 (arround 60M, 50 files, no directoreis). None of the mkisofs's have ever finished while nfsiod is running. That caused the symptoms, but resolved after a short time. then I issued a :... :inc: [install-mh aborted] :sh-2.02$ pwd :/amd/stagger/home1/a/crossd :sh-2.02$ ls -la /amd/stagger/home1/a/crossd :ls: /amd/stagger/home1/a/crossd: Not a directory If any of your NFS mounts are running over AMD, please try running mkisofs using direct NFS mounts ( non-amd ) and see if that fixes your problem. I've so far been able to run mkisofs over NFS V3 mounts without any trouble, but I'll run my test script overnight and also try it with NFS V2 mounts. It would be helpful if you d escribed what the bug was... all I know is that the mkisofs's don't finish. Ok... is the rest of the system still operable? Does it lock up? Crash? What does 'ps axl' say? etc. Ok, this appears to have done the trick. At least I have not been able to reproduce it useing a hand-mounted path. This raises an interesting question as to why it matters. My understanding is that AMD sits on the local host as a virtual NFS server and hands out mount(2) commands when it is needed. Thus when I enter the "/amd" hierarchy, amd is not involved at all. In fact I can "kill -9 amd" and still access /amd without any problems, where the virtual root directories created by AMD are now a recipe for DiskWait. I have tried a hand mount with all the options that I believe AMD uses to mount the partitions (us there a way to query the OS for the options from a mounted partition?). Is it the periodic umount() attempts that amd makes the cause of these problems? As an aside we had problems with amd on SGI late last year, everything seemed to point to amd, yet when we hand mounted the partition with the exact same options we received the same error. So I am a bit skeptical that AMD, by its nature, is causing this; if I/we can find the options that tickle this I think we will have nailed a real bug. -- David Cross To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 22:25:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1456114EC6 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 22:25:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id WAA45232; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 22:24:45 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 22:24:45 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199903310624.WAA45232@apollo.backplane.com> To: "David E. Cross" Cc: "David E. Cross" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, schimken@cs.rpi.edu, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: More death to nfsiod References: <199903310558.AAA29634@cs.rpi.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ::This bug was tickeled by performig the folowing tasks on the NFS mounted ::directory (NFSv2/UDP from a server of the eaxact same build). ::First I did a "mkisofs112 -J -o netscape.iso .netscape" .netscape contains about 70M of data, 12209 files, and 38 directories. I tickeled the bug before by ::using mkisofs112 to create an iso image of ie5.0 (arround 60M, 50 files, no directoreis). None of the mkisofs's have ever finished while nfsiod is running. That caused the symptoms, but resolved after a short time. then I issued a :... : etc. : :Ok, this appears to have done the trick. At least I have not been able to :reproduce it useing a hand-mounted path. This raises an interesting question :... :partitions (us there a way to query the OS for the options from a mounted :partition?). Is it the periodic umount() attempts that amd makes the cause :of these problems? : :As an aside we had problems with amd on SGI late last year, everything seemed :to point to amd, yet when we hand mounted the partition with the exact same :options we received the same error. So I am a bit skeptical that AMD, by its :nature, is causing this; if I/we can find the options that tickle this I think :we will have nailed a real bug. : :-- :David Cross AMD is a rather complex piece of software. It's creating a situation that the kernel isn't happy with but I really don't have time to delve into it ( anyone else care to take a shot at it? ) on top of everything else I'm doing. If there is any way you can avoid using AMD, I would avoid using AMD. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 22:34: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lab321.ru (anonymous1.omsk.net.ru [62.76.128.34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48CDD14BE1 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 22:33:57 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kev@lab321.ru) Received: from www.lab321.ru (www.lab321.ru [62.76.129.65]) by lab321.ru (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id NAA03457 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 13:33:36 +0700 (OSS) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 13:33:36 +0700 (OSS) From: Eugeny Kuzakov To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: latest 228-stable trap Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, All! There is trap... GDB is free software and you are welcome to distribute copies of it under certain conditions; type "show copying" to see the conditions. There is absolutely no warranty for GDB; type "show warranty" for details. GDB 4.16 (i386-unknown-freebsd), Copyright 1996 Free Software Foundation, Inc... IdlePTD 26e000 current pcb at 23a360 panic: page fault #0 boot (howto=256) at ../../kern/kern_shutdown.c:266 266 dumppcb.pcb_cr3 = rcr3(); #0 boot (howto=256) at ../../kern/kern_shutdown.c:266 #1 0xf01138e2 in panic (fmt=0xf01ebfef "page fault") at ../../kern/kern_shutdown.c:400 #2 0xf01ecbda in trap_fatal (frame=0xefbffe04) at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:772 #3 0xf01ec69c in trap_pfault (frame=0xefbffe04, usermode=0) at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:681 #4 0xf01ec327 in trap (frame={tf_es = 16, tf_ds = 16, tf_edi = 0, tf_esi = -225239040, tf_ebp = -272630196, tf_isp = -272630228, tf_ebx = -224572928, tf_edx = 262144, tf_ecx = 17280, tf_eax = 0, tf_trapno = 12, tf_err = 2, tf_eip = -267216308, tf_cs = 8, tf_eflags = 66118, tf_esp = -225253888, tf_ss = -225253888}) at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:324 #5 0xf0129a4c in sonewconn1 (head=0xf2932000, connstatus=0) at ../../kern/uipc_socket2.c:230 #6 0xf01673b2 in tcp_input (m=0xf1a7c900, iphlen=20) at ../../netinet/tcp_input.c:421 #7 0xf0163c50 in ip_input (m=0xf1a7c900) at ../../netinet/ip_input.c:630 #8 0xf0163cc8 in ipintr () at ../../netinet/ip_input.c:651 #9 0xf01e4c59 in swi_net_next () #10 0xf012acf7 in connect (p=0xf2b17200, uap=0xefbfff94, retval=0xefbfff84) at ../../kern/uipc_syscalls.c:315 #11 0xf01ece17 in syscall (frame={tf_es = 39, tf_ds = 39, tf_edi = 482606, tf_esi = 483776, tf_ebp = -272643092, tf_isp = -272629788, tf_ebx = 537749752, tf_edx = -272643616, tf_ecx = 13, tf_eax = 98, tf_trapno = 22, tf_err = 7, tf_eip = 537560001, tf_cs = 31, tf_eflags = 642, tf_esp = -272643564, tf_ss = 39}) at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:920 #12 0x200a83c1 in ?? () #13 0x1a277 in ?? () #14 0x1095 in ?? () (kgdb) p *(struct socket*) 0xf2932000 $2 = {so_type = 1, so_options = 6, so_linger = 0, so_state = 130, so_pcb = 0xf2bc2080 "", so_proto = 0xf022e358, so_head = 0x0, so_incomp = { tqh_first = 0x0, tqh_last = 0x0}, so_comp = {tqh_first = 0x0, tqh_last = 0x0}, so_list = {tqe_next = 0x0, tqe_prev = 0xf27da51c}, so_qlen = 0, so_incqlen = 0, so_qlimit = 3, so_timeo = 0, so_error = 0, so_pgid = 0, so_oobmark = 0, so_rcv = {sb_cc = 13, sb_hiwat = 17280, sb_mbcnt = 128, sb_mbmax = 138240, sb_lowat = 1, sb_mb = 0xf1a54d80, sb_sel = {si_pid = 0, si_flags = 0}, sb_flags = 0, sb_timeo = 0}, so_snd = {sb_cc = 0, sb_hiwat = 17280, sb_mbcnt = 0, sb_mbmax = 138240, sb_lowat = 2048, sb_mb = 0x0, sb_sel = {si_pid = 0, si_flags = 0}, sb_flags = 0, sb_timeo = 0}, so_tpcb = 0x0, so_upcall = 0, so_upcallarg = 0x0, so_uid = 0} (kgdb)q I am use ipfilter 3.2.9 compiled in kernel. But problem is in inserting current entry `so_list' in `so' at uipc_socket2.c:230: TAILQ_INSERT_TAIL(&head->so_incomp, so, so_list); this is in queue.h:343 #define TAILQ_INSERT_TAIL(head, elm, field) do { \ (elm)->field.tqe_next = NULL; \ (elm)->field.tqe_prev = (head)->tqh_last; \ *(head)->tqh_last = (elm); \ (head)->tqh_last = &(elm)->field.tqe_next; \ } while (0) Can anyone help me? -- Best wishes, Eugeny Kuzakov Laboratory 321 ( Omsk, Russia ) kev@lab321.ru ICQ#: 5885106 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 23:22: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 674DD14BD2; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 23:22:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id QAA05586; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 16:51:40 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id QAA82496; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 16:51:39 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 16:51:39 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: "Matthew D. Fuller" , questions@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) References: <19990331003535.E17547@futuresouth.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990331003535.E17547@futuresouth.com>; from Matthew D. Fuller on Wed, Mar 31, 1999 at 12:35:35AM -0600 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wednesday, 31 March 1999 at 0:35:35 -0600, Matthew D. Fuller wrote: > I know this is what most people will think of as a Very Bad Idea From The > Get-Go, but I'm curious in any event. > What sort of impact on size(disk)/size(memory)/startup time/etc would > compiling the entire system with debugging symbols be? (i.e., put -g in > CFLAGS in make.conf) Double the size of the base system? Quintuple? Interestingly enough, we are currently discussing this in -hackers. We're thinking about changing the way the kernel is built so that a debug kernel will be the default. To answer your question: a typical (partially) stripped kernel is about 1.8 MB in size. The corresponding debug kernel is about 9 MB (since ELF; a.out debug kernels are about 3 MB larger). This space is *in memory at all times*, so you don't normally want to load it, but it's good to have for dump analysis. Here are some comparative figures for building a kernel on my main machine (AMD K6-2/333, 160 MB memory): normal debug Make all 4:30 5:0 Kernel size 1.8 MB 9 MB Directory size 5.5 MB 24 MB The directory is so much larger because not only the kernel, but also all the object files contain debug symbols. The difference in compilation time assumes lots of RAM; otherwise you could end up with a lot of paging and a corresponding increase in compilation time. The way we're talking now, it looks like we could end up with: 1. The -g option for config(8) no longer has any meaning. With or without it, you end up configuring a debug kernel. 2. 'make install' make a copy of the kernel, called kernel.debug, and strips the original kernel before installing it. 3. 'make install.debug' would install the debug version of the kernel. This can be useful for people who use ddb or another in-kernel debugger. It's not needed for people who use a serial debugger like gdb -k. 4. For people for whom the additional memory requirements are a problem, config will have a -s (or similar) option to say 'build a kernel without debugging symbols'. Any comments? This is by no means set in stone, and we'll discuss it a while before we do anything. Greg -- When replying to this message, please copy the original recipients. For more information, see http://www.lemis.com/questions.html See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 23:24:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from shell.futuresouth.com (shell.futuresouth.com [198.78.58.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1265F14DBF; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 23:24:43 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from fullermd@futuresouth.com) Received: (from fullermd@localhost) by shell.futuresouth.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA27628; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 01:24:14 -0600 (CST) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 01:24:14 -0600 From: "Matthew D. Fuller" To: Greg Lehey Cc: questions@FreeBSD.ORG, FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) Message-ID: <19990331012414.F17547@futuresouth.com> References: <19990331003535.E17547@futuresouth.com> <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Wed, Mar 31, 1999 at 04:51:39PM +0930 X-OS: FreeBSD Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Mar 31, 1999 at 04:51:39PM +0930, a little birdie told me that Greg Lehey remarked > On Wednesday, 31 March 1999 at 0:35:35 -0600, Matthew D. Fuller wrote: > > I know this is what most people will think of as a Very Bad Idea From The > > Get-Go, but I'm curious in any event. > > What sort of impact on size(disk)/size(memory)/startup time/etc would > > compiling the entire system with debugging symbols be? (i.e., put -g in > > CFLAGS in make.conf) Double the size of the base system? Quintuple? > > Interestingly enough, we are currently discussing this in -hackers. > We're thinking about changing the way the kernel is built so that a > debug kernel will be the default. I've been following the discussion in -hackers, but I'm asking about the WHOLE system, not just the kernel. Trying to decide whether I need to allocate a 2 gig / partition to handle this ;) No, I'm not thinking this is a good idea, but I'm wondering about just how big it would be, so I can plan ahead on partition sizes if I ever feel the urge. --- *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* | Matthew Fuller http://www.over-yonder.net/ | * fullermd@futuresouth.com fullermd@over-yonder.net * | UNIX Systems Administrator Specializing in FreeBSD | * FutureSouth Communications ISPHelp ISP Consulting * | "The only reason I'm burning my candle at both ends, | * is because I haven't figured out how to light the * | middle yet" | *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 23:27:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gidgate.gid.co.uk (gidgate.gid.co.uk [193.123.140.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 88BC014DBF for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 23:27:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: (from rb@localhost) by gidgate.gid.co.uk (8.8.8/8.8.7) id IAA21575; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:25:58 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from rb) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19990331082524.007ad810@192.168.255.1> X-Sender: rbmail@192.168.255.1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:25:24 +0100 To: Matthew Dillon , Peter Jeremy From: Bob Bishop Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <99Mar31.114807est.40597@border.alcanet.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matthew Dillon wrote: > Nobody in their right mind turns off parity checking on a SCSI bus. Correct; but plenty of people have gone temporarily insane trying to diagnose SCSI cabling problems. It's the easiest thing in the world in extremis to dick around with the controller settings and fail to restore them afterwards. Peter Jeremy >Sounds like it would be useful for the kernel to warn if a SCSI target >(including the controller) has parity disabled. Also correct; but I don't see any device-independent way to find out in the SCSI specs. Few people are going to go poking around in device code pages, it's the controller settings that are at risk. Maybe the best you can hope for is to read the controller settings on the host interface in some controller-dependent way. -- Bob Bishop +44 118 977 4017 rb@gid.co.uk fax +44 118 989 4254 (0800-1800 UK) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Mar 30 23:54:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C01714F91 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 1999 23:54:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gram@cdsec.com) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.8.8/8.6.9) id JAA26095; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:53:45 +0200 (SAST) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 26093; Wed Mar 31 09:53:29 1999 Message-ID: <3701D495.1857BF9D@cdsec.com> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:53:57 +0200 From: Graham Wheeler X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Tom Brown , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: How do I write to the /dev/bpf0 interface? References: <37017313.6981CEE4@heliox.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Tom Brown wrote: > Can anyone please tell me how to post a packet onto my LAN via this > interface. You should just be able to write the frame. Make sure everything is in network-byte order. You needn't put in a source Ethernet address as that will get filled in, but you do need to put in a destination. -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 0:17:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from titan.metropolitan.at (unknown [195.212.98.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1FF5414BE1 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 00:17:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mladavac@metropolitan.at) Received: by TITAN with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 10:19:57 +0200 Message-ID: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D09757D@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at> From: Ladavac Marino To: 'hackers' Subject: AIX going BSD Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 10:14:28 +0200 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi all, yesterday I was compiling a program which uses sys/queue.h macros and the compilation did not fail even though I have forgotten to install the header file (the program was originally developed on my FreeBSD box at home). Saying "neat, they have a compatible queue.h" I went to look at it: $ uname -a AIX lmh0109 3 4 000770344C00 $ grep rgrimes /usr/include/sys/queue.h * queue.h,v 1.3 1995/05/30 08:14:30 rgrimes Exp It gets better: $ grep BSD /usr/include/netinet/* icmp6_var.h:/* $NetBSD: icmp_var.h,v 1.8 1995/03/26 20:32:19 jtc Exp $ */ if_ether6.h:/* $NetBSD: if_ether.h,v 1.12 1995/03/06 19:06:11 glass Exp $ */ in6_var.h:/* $NetBSD: in_var.h,v 1.8 1994/06/29 06:38:13 cgd Exp $ */ ip6_icmp.h:/* $NetBSD: ip_icmp.h,v 1.6 1994/06/29 06:38:18 cgd Exp $ */ ip6_var.h:/* $NetBSD: ip_var.h,v 1.10 1994/06/29 06:38:29 cgd Exp $ */ udp6_var.h:/* $NetBSD: udp_var.h,v 1.7 1994/06/29 06:38:58 cgd Exp $ */ Do you think it would be possible to use that? BTW, all Berkeley licenses are intact (neat, IBM). /Marino -- Marino Ladavac, Dipl.-Ing. Metropolitan Datenserviceges.m.b.H e-mail: mladavac@metropolitan.at GSM: +43 676 309 79 67 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 0:27:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64A8114BE1 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 00:27:12 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id RAA05811; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 17:56:52 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id RAA87277; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 17:56:50 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990331175650.Y413@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 17:56:50 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Ladavac Marino , hackers Subject: Re: AIX going BSD References: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D09757D@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D09757D@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at>; from Ladavac Marino on Wed, Mar 31, 1999 at 10:14:28AM +0200 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wednesday, 31 March 1999 at 10:14:28 +0200, Ladavac Marino wrote: > Hi all, > > yesterday I was compiling a program which uses sys/queue.h macros and > the compilation did not fail even though I have forgotten to install the > header file (the program was originally developed on my FreeBSD box at > home). > > Saying "neat, they have a compatible queue.h" I went to look at it: > > $ uname -a > AIX lmh0109 3 4 000770344C00 > $ grep rgrimes /usr/include/sys/queue.h > * queue.h,v 1.3 1995/05/30 08:14:30 rgrimes Exp > > It gets better: > > $ grep BSD /usr/include/netinet/* > icmp6_var.h:/* $NetBSD: icmp_var.h,v 1.8 1995/03/26 20:32:19 jtc Exp $ > */ > if_ether6.h:/* $NetBSD: if_ether.h,v 1.12 1995/03/06 19:06:11 glass Exp > $ */ > in6_var.h:/* $NetBSD: in_var.h,v 1.8 1994/06/29 06:38:13 cgd Exp $ > */ > ip6_icmp.h:/* $NetBSD: ip_icmp.h,v 1.6 1994/06/29 06:38:18 cgd Exp $ > */ > ip6_var.h:/* $NetBSD: ip_var.h,v 1.10 1994/06/29 06:38:29 cgd Exp $ > */ > udp6_var.h:/* $NetBSD: udp_var.h,v 1.7 1994/06/29 06:38:58 cgd Exp $ > */ > > Do you think it would be possible to use that? You mean, to redistribute it? As long as there are no other licenses there, sure. > BTW, all Berkeley licenses are intact (neat, IBM). That's a difference. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 0:35: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from titan.metropolitan.at (unknown [195.212.98.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 47BB214BE1 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 00:34:57 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mladavac@metropolitan.at) Received: by TITAN with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 10:37:08 +0200 Message-ID: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D09757E@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at> From: Ladavac Marino To: 'Greg Lehey' , Ladavac Marino , hackers Subject: RE: AIX going BSD Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 10:31:40 +0200 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > -----Original Message----- > From: Greg Lehey [SMTP:grog@lemis.com] > Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 1999 10:27 AM > To: Ladavac Marino; hackers > Subject: Re: AIX going BSD > > > You mean, to redistribute it? As long as there are no other licenses > there, sure. > > [ML] I did not express myself clearly. What I meant is to use the fact that AIX uses {Free,Net}BSD code for our own PR purposes :) /Marino To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 1:34:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quark.ChrisBowman.com (crbowman.erols.com [209.122.47.155]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26FDB15C57; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 01:34:39 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from crb@ChrisBowman.com) Received: from fermion (fermion.ChrisBowman.com [10.0.1.2]) by quark.ChrisBowman.com (8.9.2/8.8.8) with SMTP id EAA19329; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 04:48:58 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from crb@ChrisBowman.com) Message-Id: <199903310948.EAA19329@quark.ChrisBowman.com> X-Sender: crb@quark X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 04:32:58 -0500 To: Greg Lehey From: "Christopher R. Bowman" Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) Cc: "Matthew D. Fuller" , questions@FreeBSD.ORG, FreeBSD Hackers In-Reply-To: <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com> References: <19990331003535.E17547@futuresouth.com> <19990331003535.E17547@futuresouth.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 04:51 PM 3/31/99 +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: >On Wednesday, 31 March 1999 at 0:35:35 -0600, Matthew D. Fuller wrote: >> I know this is what most people will think of as a Very Bad Idea From The >> Get-Go, but I'm curious in any event. >> What sort of impact on size(disk)/size(memory)/startup time/etc would >> compiling the entire system with debugging symbols be? (i.e., put -g in >> CFLAGS in make.conf) Double the size of the base system? Quintuple? > >Interestingly enough, we are currently discussing this in -hackers. >We're thinking about changing the way the kernel is built so that a >debug kernel will be the default. > >To answer your question: a typical (partially) stripped kernel is >about 1.8 MB in size. The corresponding debug kernel is about 9 MB >(since ELF; a.out debug kernels are about 3 MB larger). This space is >*in memory at all times*, so you don't normally want to load it, but >it's good to have for dump analysis. > >Here are some comparative figures for building a kernel on my main >machine (AMD K6-2/333, 160 MB memory): > > normal debug >Make all 4:30 5:0 >Kernel size 1.8 MB 9 MB >Directory size 5.5 MB 24 MB > >The directory is so much larger because not only the kernel, but also >all the object files contain debug symbols. The difference in >compilation time assumes lots of RAM; otherwise you could end up with >a lot of paging and a corresponding increase in compilation time. > >The way we're talking now, it looks like we could end up with: > >1. The -g option for config(8) no longer has any meaning. With or > without it, you end up configuring a debug kernel. >2. 'make install' make a copy of the kernel, called kernel.debug, and > strips the original kernel before installing it. >3. 'make install.debug' would install the debug version of the > kernel. This can be useful for people who use ddb or another > in-kernel debugger. It's not needed for people who use a serial > debugger like gdb -k. >4. For people for whom the additional memory requirements are a > problem, config will have a -s (or similar) option to say 'build a > kernel without debugging symbols'. > >Any comments? This is by no means set in stone, and we'll discuss it >a while before we do anything. > >Greg Could(are the) debugging symbols be placed in a separate ELF section and the boot loader (or what ever it is that loads the kernel) be taught to not load that section depending on a command line option. Would this be at all useful? -------- Christopher R. Bowman crb@ChrisBowman.com http://www.ChrisBowman.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 2: 9:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C6B214BF9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 02:09:29 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gram@cdsec.com) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.8.8/8.6.9) id MAA04453 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 12:08:47 +0200 (SAST) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 4451; Wed Mar 31 12:08:44 1999 Message-ID: <3701F44B.88A0B92B@cdsec.com> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 12:09:15 +0200 From: Graham Wheeler X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: select() on UDP socket returns ECONNREFUSED Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi all Does anyone know what this means? The source code for select is buried in some non-obvious place so I haven't been able to check it directly. TIA gram -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 3:12: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from titan.metropolitan.at (unknown [195.212.98.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE1801546B for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 03:12:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mladavac@metropolitan.at) Received: by TITAN with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 13:14:01 +0200 Message-ID: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D097583@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at> From: Ladavac Marino To: 'Graham Wheeler' , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: RE: select() on UDP socket returns ECONNREFUSED Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 13:08:33 +0200 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > -----Original Message----- > From: Graham Wheeler [SMTP:gram@cdsec.com] > Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 1999 12:09 PM > To: hackers@freebsd.org > Subject: select() on UDP socket returns ECONNREFUSED > > Hi all > > Does anyone know what this means? The source code for select is buried > in some non-obvious place so I haven't been able to check it directly. [ML] I don't parse this. Do you mean, select returns -1 and sets errno to ECONNREFUSED? You know that you should not evaluate errno unless the last operation failed (a successful operation does not clear errno). BTW, the behavior might be correct if you have had a non-blocking connect and it failed. Select then marked the file descriptor readable (select for write on a non blocking connect does not seem to work as advertised in the manpage) and the subsequent read fails with ECONNREFUSED. Please note that failure of a non blocking connect can be reported only on the first use of the descriptor after the state of the descriptor is no longer EINPROGRESS. /Marino > TIA > gram > -- > Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com > Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 > Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 > Internet/Intranet Network Specialists > Data Security Products WWW: > http://www.cdsec.com/ > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 3:33:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gw.start.nl (gw.start.nl [193.67.139.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7278E1557E for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 03:33:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from RuigrJer@start.nl) Received: from start.nl (mail.start.nl [172.16.0.32]) by gw.start.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA22330 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 13:33:29 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from RuigrJer@start.nl) Received: from HOOFDKANTOOR_START-Message_Server by start.nl with Novell_GroupWise; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 13:35:50 +0200 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise 5.2 Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 13:34:48 +0200 From: "Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven" To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: error in sys/aio.h ? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi guys, can someone verify a thought I had? Using CURRENT I was looking through the sources and was reading aio.h and noticed a possible mishap/typo in it. It defines the function aio_error() twice in that file, which in my eyes is unnecessary. If it's indeed a mishap then I'll do a send-pr of the problem. [ NOTE: could you CC: asmodai@wxs.nl on this? I cannot set a=20 reply-to field with this stinking mailer ] Thanks, Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven Infrastructure & Networks Start Holding B.V. tel: +31 - (0) 182 - 695 895 email: jeroen.ruigrok@start.nl To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 3:37:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F0DD15C97 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 03:36:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id VAA10193; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 21:33:59 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199903311133.VAA10193@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. To: mladavac@metropolitan.at (Ladavac Marino) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 21:33:59 +1000 (EST) Cc: dillon@apollo.backplane.com, rb@gid.co.uk, avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, wilko@yedi.iaf.nl, jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D097576@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at> from "Ladavac Marino" at Mar 30, 99 10:45:32 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In some mail from Ladavac Marino, sie said: [...] > Darren, this could possibly be your problem as well since you > seem to have a lot of hardware hanging off the same power > supply--prehaps it just cannot regulate any more. You could test that > by writing a known pattern to the raw device and then reading it > back--just make sure that the tar runs on EIDE drive writing into the > bit-bucket so that the EIDE does not spin down and that it keeps > seeking--both actions take a lot of power. Well.... first run, no tar on EIDE drive (just two drives now, EIDE & SCSI, nothing else powered, which has ended up with corrupt dirs): gawaine /usr# dd if=/dev/zero bs=16384k of=/dev/rsd0s4 dd: /dev/rsd0s4: short write on character device dd: /dev/rsd0s4: end of device 125+0 records in 124+1 records out 2089221120 bytes transferred in 248.516462 secs (8406772 bytes/sec) Now the interesting part! I wrote my own program to read it back and check that all that was read was indeed null bytes...however! From 874627584 (0x3421c200 - 0x3421cfff) was non-null (actually garbage, not just 0x01 or 0x02 or 0xf0, etc). About 3572 bytes worth. Wanting to confirm the location, I ran it again...this time 95573 bytes. To check disk contents I adapted the program I used to read back to seek to the above position. No problem. A run after that again, 85212 and 33157. Try again with 2.2.8-STABLE (built from GENERIC): # dd if=/dev/zero bs=16384k of=/dev/rsd0s4 dd: /dev/rsd0s4: short write on character device dd: /dev/rsd0s4: end of device 125+0 records in 124+1 records out 2089221120 bytes transferred in 244.473397 secs (8545801 bytes/sec) No non-zero bytes were read back using the program I wrote. And with: # dd if=/dev/rsd0s4 bs=16384k | hexdump -x -n 2089221120 0000000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 * 124+1 records in 124+1 records out 2089221120 bytes transferred in 433.489148 secs (4819547 bytes/sec) 7c86fc00 (repeated twice) At no time during this was the hardware changed (though it's in a somewhat state of advaced disarray). Darren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 3:56: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from titan.metropolitan.at (unknown [195.212.98.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 407A114D96 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 03:55:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mladavac@metropolitan.at) Received: by TITAN with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 13:58:03 +0200 Message-ID: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D097584@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at> From: Ladavac Marino To: 'Darren Reed' , Ladavac Marino Cc: dillon@apollo.backplane.com, rb@gid.co.uk, wilko@yedi.iaf.nl, jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: another ufs panic.. Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 13:52:32 +0200 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > -----Original Message----- > From: Darren Reed [SMTP:avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au] > Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 1999 1:34 PM > To: mladavac@metropolitan.at > Cc: dillon@apollo.backplane.com; rb@gid.co.uk; > avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au; wilko@yedi.iaf.nl; jkh@zippy.cdrom.com; > hackers@FreeBSD.ORG > Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. > > In some mail from Ladavac Marino, sie said: > [...] > > Darren, this could possibly be your problem as well since you > > seem to have a lot of hardware hanging off the same power > > supply--prehaps it just cannot regulate any more. You could test > that > > by writing a known pattern to the raw device and then reading it > > back--just make sure that the tar runs on EIDE drive writing into > the > > bit-bucket so that the EIDE does not spin down and that it keeps > > seeking--both actions take a lot of power. > > Well.... > first run, no tar on EIDE drive (just two drives now, EIDE & SCSI, > nothing else powered, which has ended up with corrupt dirs): > > gawaine /usr# dd if=/dev/zero bs=16384k of=/dev/rsd0s4 > dd: /dev/rsd0s4: short write on character device > dd: /dev/rsd0s4: end of device > 125+0 records in > 124+1 records out > 2089221120 bytes transferred in 248.516462 secs (8406772 bytes/sec) > > Now the interesting part! > > I wrote my own program to read it back and check that all that was > read > was indeed null bytes...however! > > From 874627584 (0x3421c200 - 0x3421cfff) was non-null (actually > garbage, > not just 0x01 or 0x02 or 0xf0, etc). About 3572 bytes worth. > > Wanting to confirm the location, I ran it again...this time 95573 > bytes. > > To check disk contents I adapted the program I used to read back to > seek > to the above position. No problem. A run after that again, 85212 and > 33157. > [ML] Okay, one is certain: it is not UFS. It might be hardware, however. In fact, I would tip on hardware especially since the amount of garbage varies. I have had exactly the same symptoms. It might as well be the particular hardware/software combination aggravated by marginal SIMMs, CPU, or motherboard in light of the fact that 2.2.8 does not show problems. It could also be a HAM radio operator in the vicinity coupled with insufficient shielding. But, it's very unlikely that it's UFS. If it is the hardware or environment, I cannot really offer any useful help--you know the rites, as well as anyone else :) /Marino > Try again with 2.2.8-STABLE (built from GENERIC): > > # dd if=/dev/zero bs=16384k of=/dev/rsd0s4 > dd: /dev/rsd0s4: short write on character device > dd: /dev/rsd0s4: end of device > 125+0 records in > 124+1 records out > 2089221120 bytes transferred in 244.473397 secs (8545801 bytes/sec) > > No non-zero bytes were read back using the program I wrote. > > And with: # dd if=/dev/rsd0s4 bs=16384k | hexdump -x -n 2089221120 > 0000000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 > 0000 > * > 124+1 records in > 124+1 records out > 2089221120 bytes transferred in 433.489148 secs (4819547 bytes/sec) > 7c86fc00 > (repeated twice) > > At no time during this was the hardware changed (though it's in a > somewhat state of advaced disarray). > > Darren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 3:57: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D305714D96 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 03:54:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gram@cdsec.com) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.8.8/8.6.9) id NAA10215; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 13:54:10 +0200 (SAST) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 10212; Wed Mar 31 13:53:43 1999 Message-ID: <37020CE5.477F888D@cdsec.com> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 13:54:13 +0200 From: Graham Wheeler X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ladavac Marino , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: select() on UDP socket returns ECONNREFUSED References: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D097583@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ladavac Marino wrote: > > Subject: select() on UDP socket returns ECONNREFUSED > > > > Hi all > > > > Does anyone know what this means? The source code for select is buried > > in some non-obvious place so I haven't been able to check it directly. > [ML] I don't parse this. > > Do you mean, select returns -1 and sets errno to ECONNREFUSED? Oops (hides head in embarassment). I just checked the code (which wasn't mine) and saw that the error gets logged if the select returns something other than 1 and errno isn't EINTR. Which means that this is happening when the select times out and returns zero. Turns out the person who wrote the code erroneously assumed that select() would return errno==EINTR if it timed out. -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 7:24:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailer.syr.edu (mailer.syr.edu [128.230.18.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1053D15C17 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 07:24:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from cmsedore@mailbox.syr.edu) Received: from rodan.syr.edu by mailer.syr.edu (LSMTP for Windows NT v1.1a) with SMTP id <0.972FC640@mailer.syr.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 10:23:59 -0500 Received: from localhost (cmsedore@localhost) by rodan.syr.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA00910; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 10:23:47 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: rodan.syr.edu: cmsedore owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 10:23:46 -0500 (EST) From: Christopher Sedore X-Sender: cmsedore@rodan.syr.edu To: Graham Wheeler Cc: Tom Brown , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How do I write to the /dev/bpf0 interface? In-Reply-To: <3701D495.1857BF9D@cdsec.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Graham Wheeler wrote: > Tom Brown wrote: > > > Can anyone please tell me how to post a packet onto my LAN via this > > interface. > > You should just be able to write the frame. Make sure everything is in > network-byte order. You needn't put in a source Ethernet address as that > will get filled in, but you do need to put in a destination. Note that this is probably a bug in the bpf implementation. BPF/the kernel shouldn't be messing with the packet on a write to a bpf descriptor. I've filed a bug report (with patch) that addresses this. -Chris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 7:32:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C44D015C31 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 07:32:43 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gram@cdsec.com) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.8.8/8.6.9) id RAA22858; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 17:32:00 +0200 (SAST) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 22856; Wed Mar 31 17:31:54 1999 Message-ID: <3702400A.9D62AB77@cdsec.com> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 17:32:26 +0200 From: Graham Wheeler X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Christopher Sedore Cc: Tom Brown , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How do I write to the /dev/bpf0 interface? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Christopher Sedore wrote: > > On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Graham Wheeler wrote: > > > Tom Brown wrote: > > > > > Can anyone please tell me how to post a packet onto my LAN via this > > > interface. > > > > You should just be able to write the frame. Make sure everything is in > > network-byte order. You needn't put in a source Ethernet address as that > > will get filled in, but you do need to put in a destination. > > Note that this is probably a bug in the bpf implementation. BPF/the > kernel shouldn't be messing with the packet on a write to a bpf > descriptor. I've filed a bug report (with patch) that addresses this. > It probably isn't the bpf code that is doing this, but the NIC driver code... -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 8: 0: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gatewaya.anheuser-busch.com (gatewaya.anheuser-busch.com [151.145.250.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id E04351545B for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:00:04 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Matthew.Alton@anheuser-busch.com) Received: by gatewaya.anheuser-busch.com; id JAA03685; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:52:03 -0600 Received: from stlabcexg006.anheuser-busch.com(unknown 151.145.101.161) by gatewaya via smap (V2.1) id xma003603; Wed, 31 Mar 99 09:51:54 -0600 Received: by STLABCEXG006 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:55:20 -0600 Message-ID: From: "Alton, Matthew" To: DL-ADM Cc: "'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG'" Subject: RE: AIX going BSD Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:54:24 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This lends credence to my lond-held hypothesis that all commercial UNICES are secretly floating on 4.4BSD UNIX - The OS that God runs on his PDP/11 up in Heaven. No wonder they won't free up their source code. It'd be too embarassing. > -----Original Message----- > From: Ladavac Marino [SMTP:mladavac@metropolitan.at] > Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 1999 2:14 AM > To: 'hackers' > Subject: AIX going BSD > > Hi all, > > yesterday I was compiling a program which uses sys/queue.h macros and > the compilation did not fail even though I have forgotten to install the > header file (the program was originally developed on my FreeBSD box at > home). > > Saying "neat, they have a compatible queue.h" I went to look at it: > > $ uname -a > AIX lmh0109 3 4 000770344C00 > $ grep rgrimes /usr/include/sys/queue.h > * queue.h,v 1.3 1995/05/30 08:14:30 rgrimes Exp > > It gets better: > > $ grep BSD /usr/include/netinet/* > icmp6_var.h:/* $NetBSD: icmp_var.h,v 1.8 1995/03/26 20:32:19 jtc Exp $ > */ > if_ether6.h:/* $NetBSD: if_ether.h,v 1.12 1995/03/06 19:06:11 glass Exp > $ */ > in6_var.h:/* $NetBSD: in_var.h,v 1.8 1994/06/29 06:38:13 cgd Exp $ > */ > ip6_icmp.h:/* $NetBSD: ip_icmp.h,v 1.6 1994/06/29 06:38:18 cgd Exp $ > */ > ip6_var.h:/* $NetBSD: ip_var.h,v 1.10 1994/06/29 06:38:29 cgd Exp $ > */ > udp6_var.h:/* $NetBSD: udp_var.h,v 1.7 1994/06/29 06:38:58 cgd Exp $ > */ > > Do you think it would be possible to use that? > > BTW, all Berkeley licenses are intact (neat, IBM). > > /Marino > -- > Marino Ladavac, Dipl.-Ing. Metropolitan Datenserviceges.m.b.H > e-mail: mladavac@metropolitan.at > GSM: +43 676 309 79 67 > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 8:21:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailer.syr.edu (mailer.syr.edu [128.230.18.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0ED1C150E4 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:21:10 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from cmsedore@mailbox.syr.edu) Received: from rodan.syr.edu by mailer.syr.edu (LSMTP for Windows NT v1.1a) with SMTP id <0.86DD5520@mailer.syr.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 11:20:48 -0500 Received: from localhost (cmsedore@localhost) by rodan.syr.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA25250; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 11:20:46 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: rodan.syr.edu: cmsedore owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 11:20:46 -0500 (EST) From: Christopher Sedore X-Sender: cmsedore@rodan.syr.edu To: Graham Wheeler Cc: Tom Brown , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How do I write to the /dev/bpf0 interface? In-Reply-To: <3702400A.9D62AB77@cdsec.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Graham Wheeler wrote: > Christopher Sedore wrote: > > > > On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Graham Wheeler wrote: > > > > > Tom Brown wrote: > > > > > > > Can anyone please tell me how to post a packet onto my LAN via this > > > > interface. > > > > > > You should just be able to write the frame. Make sure everything is in > > > network-byte order. You needn't put in a source Ethernet address as that > > > will get filled in, but you do need to put in a destination. > > > > Note that this is probably a bug in the bpf implementation. BPF/the > > kernel shouldn't be messing with the packet on a write to a bpf > > descriptor. I've filed a bug report (with patch) that addresses this. > > > > It probably isn't the bpf code that is doing this, but the NIC driver > code... Actually, its a cooperative effort by bpfwrite() and ether_output(). -Chris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 8:24: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from geek.grf.ov.com (geek.grf.ov.com [192.251.86.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 024061545B for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:24:05 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ksmm@threespace.com) Received: from pebbles (pebbles.cam.veritas.com [166.98.49.16]) by geek.grf.ov.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id LAA27893; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 11:23:36 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199903311623.LAA27893@geek.grf.ov.com> X-Sender: ksmm@mail.cybercom.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 11:03:18 -0500 To: Greg Lehey From: The Classiest Man Alive Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) Cc: FreeBSD Hackers In-Reply-To: <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com> References: <19990331003535.E17547@futuresouth.com> <19990331003535.E17547@futuresouth.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Has anybody looked at this from a performance perspective? In other words, does the system become any more sluggish or less responsive as a result of this? K.S. At 02:21 AM 3/31/99 , Greg Lehey wrote: >On Wednesday, 31 March 1999 at 0:35:35 -0600, Matthew D. Fuller wrote: >> I know this is what most people will think of as a Very Bad Idea From The >> Get-Go, but I'm curious in any event. >> What sort of impact on size(disk)/size(memory)/startup time/etc would >> compiling the entire system with debugging symbols be? (i.e., put -g in >> CFLAGS in make.conf) Double the size of the base system? Quintuple? > >Interestingly enough, we are currently discussing this in -hackers. >We're thinking about changing the way the kernel is built so that a >debug kernel will be the default. > >To answer your question: a typical (partially) stripped kernel is >about 1.8 MB in size. The corresponding debug kernel is about 9 MB >(since ELF; a.out debug kernels are about 3 MB larger). This space is >*in memory at all times*, so you don't normally want to load it, but >it's good to have for dump analysis. > >Here are some comparative figures for building a kernel on my main >machine (AMD K6-2/333, 160 MB memory): > > normal debug >Make all 4:30 5:0 >Kernel size 1.8 MB 9 MB >Directory size 5.5 MB 24 MB > >The directory is so much larger because not only the kernel, but also >all the object files contain debug symbols. The difference in >compilation time assumes lots of RAM; otherwise you could end up with >a lot of paging and a corresponding increase in compilation time. > >The way we're talking now, it looks like we could end up with: > >1. The -g option for config(8) no longer has any meaning. With or > without it, you end up configuring a debug kernel. >2. 'make install' make a copy of the kernel, called kernel.debug, and > strips the original kernel before installing it. >3. 'make install.debug' would install the debug version of the > kernel. This can be useful for people who use ddb or another > in-kernel debugger. It's not needed for people who use a serial > debugger like gdb -k. >4. For people for whom the additional memory requirements are a > problem, config will have a -s (or similar) option to say 'build a > kernel without debugging symbols'. > >Any comments? This is by no means set in stone, and we'll discuss it >a while before we do anything. > >Greg >-- >When replying to this message, please copy the original recipients. >For more information, see http://www.lemis.com/questions.html >See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers >finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 8:39:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tornado.cisco.com (tornado.cisco.com [171.69.104.22]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E025F151C3; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:39:51 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bmcgover@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com) Received: from bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (bmcgover-pc.cisco.com [171.69.104.147]) by tornado.cisco.com (8.8.5-Cisco.1/8.6.5) with ESMTP id LAA05504; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 11:39:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (localhost.pa.dtd.cisco.com [127.0.0.1]) by bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id LAA02330; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 11:39:31 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from bmcgover@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com) Message-Id: <199903311639.LAA02330@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com> To: thierry.herbelot@alcatel.fr Cc: bmcgover@cisco.com, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MFS Sizes over 470MB? Can't seem to do it... In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 31 Mar 1999 17:03:46 +0200." <37023952.28B139D7@telspace.alcatel.fr> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 11:39:31 -0500 From: Brian McGovern Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [For anyone tuning in late, I'm having a problem specifying MFS file systems in excess of ~500MB without using -F, and I'm trying to understand why. The one comment I have received so far is that max MFS size is a function of total swap space. I'm now disagreeing...] Actually, it appears swap size is not an apparent function of MFS file systems. Even at a 2GB of swap, MFSs over 507MB (+/-) won't work unless the -F option is also given (although I'm not sure of the impact). Therefore, I don't know if this qualifies as a bug or not... Device 1K-blocks Used Avail Capacity Type /dev/da0s1b 1048576 8552 1039896 1% Interleaved /dev/da1s1b 1048576 8260 1040188 1% Interleaved Total 2096896 16812 2080084 1% (This should provide 768MB of MFS) > mount_mfs -s 1572864 /dev/da0s1b /mnt Filesystem 1K-blocks Used Avail Capacity Mounted on /dev/da0s1a 127023 18253 98609 16% / /dev/da0s1f 7085237 195641 6322778 3% /usr /dev/da1s1e 7593397 1 6985925 0% /usr2 /dev/da0s1e 381103 1719 348896 0% /var procfs 4 4 0 100% /proc mfs:232 507771 1 467149 0% /mnt (Obviously, it doesn't, at 507) > umount /mnt (This should provide ~ 1.5GB of MFS) > mount_mfs -s 3145728 /dev/da0s1b /mnt Filesystem 1K-blocks Used Avail Capacity Mounted on /dev/da0s1a 127023 18253 98609 16% / /dev/da0s1f 7085237 195641 6322778 3% /usr /dev/da1s1e 7593397 1 6985925 0% /usr2 /dev/da0s1e 381103 1727 348888 0% /var procfs 4 4 0 100% /proc mfs:249 507771 1 467149 0% /mnt (Again, the 507MB cap) > umount /mnt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 8:44: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-out2.apple.com (mail-out2.apple.com [17.254.0.51]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CFDCE151C3 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:44:01 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from justin@walker3.apple.com) Received: from mailgate1.apple.com (A17-128-100-225.apple.com [17.128.100.225]) by mail-out2.apple.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA49068 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:32:22 -0800 Received: from scv1.apple.com (scv1.apple.com) by mailgate1.apple.com (mailgate1.apple.com- SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:32:09 -0800 Received: from walker3.apple.com (walker3.apple.com [17.219.24.201]) by scv1.apple.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA17852 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:32:08 -0800 Received: by walker3.apple.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) id IAA00613 for "'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG'" ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:32:08 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199903311632.IAA00613@walker3.apple.com> To: "'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG'" Subject: Re: RE: AIX going BSD Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:32:06 -0800 From: "Justin C. Walker" Reply-To: justin@apple.com X-Mailer: by Apple MailViewer (2.105.dev) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > From: "Alton, Matthew" > Date: 1999-03-31 08:00:22 -0800 > > This lends credence to my lond-held hypothesis that all > commercial UNICES are secretly floating on 4.4BSD UNIX - > The OS that God runs on his PDP/11 up in Heaven. No > wonder they won't free up their source code. It'd be too > embarassing. AIX has always had strong BSD support, from Version 1 on. They've never hidden it, and in fact, the documentation generally points out where compatibility is is good or bad. Certainly the header files from BSD have always been there, particularly for networking... Can't speak for all commercial unices, but I'd hazzard a guess that Solaris and SCO aren't exactly 4.4 BSD. Regards, Justin > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Ladavac Marino [SMTP:mladavac@metropolitan.at] > > Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 1999 2:14 AM > > To: 'hackers' > > Subject: AIX going BSD > > > > Hi all, > > > > yesterday I was compiling a program which uses sys/queue.h macros and > > the compilation did not fail even though I have forgotten to install the > > header file (the program was originally developed on my FreeBSD box at > > home). > > > > Saying "neat, they have a compatible queue.h" I went to look at it: > > > > $ uname -a > > AIX lmh0109 3 4 000770344C00 > > $ grep rgrimes /usr/include/sys/queue.h > > * queue.h,v 1.3 1995/05/30 08:14:30 rgrimes Exp > > > > It gets better: > > > > $ grep BSD /usr/include/netinet/* > > icmp6_var.h:/* $NetBSD: icmp_var.h,v 1.8 1995/03/26 20:32:19 jtc Exp $ > > */ > > if_ether6.h:/* $NetBSD: if_ether.h,v 1.12 1995/03/06 19:06:11 glass Exp > > $ */ > > in6_var.h:/* $NetBSD: in_var.h,v 1.8 1994/06/29 06:38:13 cgd Exp $ > > */ > > ip6_icmp.h:/* $NetBSD: ip_icmp.h,v 1.6 1994/06/29 06:38:18 cgd Exp $ > > */ > > ip6_var.h:/* $NetBSD: ip_var.h,v 1.10 1994/06/29 06:38:29 cgd Exp $ > > */ > > udp6_var.h:/* $NetBSD: udp_var.h,v 1.7 1994/06/29 06:38:58 cgd Exp $ > > */ > > > > Do you think it would be possible to use that? > > > > BTW, all Berkeley licenses are intact (neat, IBM). > > > > /Marino > > -- > > Marino Ladavac, Dipl.-Ing. Metropolitan Datenserviceges.m.b.H > > e-mail: mladavac@metropolitan.at > > GSM: +43 676 309 79 67 > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > Justin C. Walker, Curmudgeon-At-Large * Institute for General Semantics | Manager, CoreOS Networking | Men are from Earth. Apple Computer, Inc. | Women are from Earth. 2 Infinite Loop | Deal with it. Cupertino, CA 95014 | *-------------------------------------*-------------------------------* To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 8:46:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from feral.com (feral.com [192.67.166.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B06B615C4F for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:46:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mjacob@feral.com) Received: from localhost (mjacob@localhost) by feral.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA03452; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:46:15 -0800 Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:46:15 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Jacob X-Sender: mjacob@feral-gw Reply-To: mjacob@feral.com To: "Justin C. Walker" Cc: "'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG'" Subject: Re: RE: AIX going BSD In-Reply-To: <199903311632.IAA00613@walker3.apple.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > commercial UNICES are secretly floating on 4.4BSD UNIX - > > The OS that God runs on his PDP/11 up in Heaven. No > > wonder they won't free up their source code. It'd be too > > embarassing. > AIX has always had strong BSD support, from Version 1 on. > They've never hidden it, and in fact, the documentation generally > points out where compatibility is is good or bad. Certainly the > header files from BSD have always been there, particularly for > networking... > Can't speak for all commercial unices, but I'd hazzard a > guess that Solaris and SCO aren't exactly 4.4 BSD. > Actually, it's the other way around... 4.4 BSD swiped a tremendous amount from SunOS 4.X... including the specfs bugs which I fixed in 4.0.3c which I then saw show up again in OSF/1 (which derived it's BSD impl from early 4.4). To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 9: 4:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-out1.apple.com (mail-out1.apple.com [17.254.0.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E25A15AA2 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:04:54 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from justin@walker3.apple.com) Received: from mailgate2.apple.com ([17.129.100.225]) by mail-out1.apple.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA46876 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:58:07 -0800 Received: from scv3.apple.com (scv3.apple.com) by mailgate2.apple.com (mailgate2.apple.com- SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:57:58 -0800 Received: from walker3.apple.com (walker3.apple.com [17.219.24.201]) by scv3.apple.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA36868 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:57:57 -0800 Received: by walker3.apple.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) id IAA00627 for "'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG'" ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:57:57 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199903311657.IAA00627@walker3.apple.com> To: "'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG'" Subject: Re: RE: AIX going BSD In-Reply-To: <199903311632.IAA00613@walker3.apple.com> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:57:55 -0800 From: "Justin C. Walker" Reply-To: justin@apple.com X-Mailer: by Apple MailViewer (2.105.dev) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > From: Matthew Jacob > Date: 1999-03-31 08:46:37 -0800 >. .... > > > commercial UNICES are secretly floating on 4.4BSD UNIX - > > > The OS that God runs on his PDP/11 up in Heaven. No > > > wonder they won't free up their source code. It'd be too > > > embarassing. > > AIX has always had strong BSD support, from Version 1 on. > > They've never hidden it, and in fact, the documentation generally > > points out where compatibility is is good or bad. Certainly the > > header files from BSD have always been there, particularly for > > networking... > > Can't speak for all commercial unices, but I'd hazzard a > > guess that Solaris and SCO aren't exactly 4.4 BSD. > > > Actually, it's the other way around... 4.4 BSD swiped a tremendous amount > from SunOS 4.X... including the specfs bugs which I fixed in 4.0.3c which > I then saw show up again in OSF/1 (which derived it's BSD impl from > early 4.4). Do you mean SunOS 5.x? I think Solaris 2 == SunOS 5 (not counting Solaris 7, of course :-}). Also, I wouldn't be surprised that OSF/1 incorporated some 4.4 stuff, but it really does predate 4.4BSD. Cheers, Justin Justin C. Walker, Curmudgeon-At-Large * Institute for General Semantics | Manager, CoreOS Networking | Men are from Earth. Apple Computer, Inc. | Women are from Earth. 2 Infinite Loop | Deal with it. Cupertino, CA 95014 | *-------------------------------------*-------------------------------* To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 9: 7:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4349E14D3E; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:07:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id JAA49603; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:07:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:07:13 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199903311707.JAA49603@apollo.backplane.com> To: Brian McGovern Cc: thierry.herbelot@alcatel.fr, bmcgover@cisco.com, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MFS Sizes over 470MB? Can't seem to do it... References: <199903311639.LAA02330@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :[For anyone tuning in late, I'm having a problem specifying MFS file systems :in excess of ~500MB without using -F, and I'm trying to understand why. The :one comment I have received so far is that max MFS size is a function of :total swap space. I'm now disagreeing...] : :Actually, it appears swap size is not an apparent function of MFS file systems. :Even at a 2GB of swap, MFSs over 507MB (+/-) won't work unless the -F option :is also given (although I'm not sure of the impact). Therefore, I don't know :if this qualifies as a bug or not... Type 'limit'. What is the datasize limit set to? If you specify a straight size, mfs uses malloc() to reserve the memory, which is subject to the datasize limit. If you specify a file, mfs mmap()'s the file, which is not subject to the datasize limit. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 9:10:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E41C1511B for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:10:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id JAA49644; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:10:26 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:10:26 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199903311710.JAA49644@apollo.backplane.com> To: Darren Reed Cc: mladavac@metropolitan.at (Ladavac Marino), rb@gid.co.uk, avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, wilko@yedi.iaf.nl, jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. References: <199903311133.VAA10193@cheops.anu.edu.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Well.... :first run, no tar on EIDE drive (just two drives now, EIDE & SCSI, :nothing else powered, which has ended up with corrupt dirs): : :gawaine /usr# dd if=/dev/zero bs=16384k of=/dev/rsd0s4 :dd: /dev/rsd0s4: short write on character device :dd: /dev/rsd0s4: end of device :125+0 records in :124+1 records out :2089221120 bytes transferred in 248.516462 secs (8406772 bytes/sec) : :Now the interesting part! : :I wrote my own program to read it back and check that all that was read :was indeed null bytes...however! : :>From 874627584 (0x3421c200 - 0x3421cfff) was non-null (actually garbage, :not just 0x01 or 0x02 or 0xf0, etc). About 3572 bytes worth. : :Wanting to confirm the location, I ran it again...this time 95573 bytes. What release of the os ? :To check disk contents I adapted the program I used to read back to seek :to the above position. No problem. A run after that again, 85212 and :33157. :.. :Try again with 2.2.8-STABLE (built from GENERIC): : :# dd if=/dev/zero bs=16384k of=/dev/rsd0s4 :dd: /dev/rsd0s4: short write on character device :dd: /dev/rsd0s4: end of device :125+0 records in :124+1 records out :2089221120 bytes transferred in 244.473397 secs (8545801 bytes/sec) : :No non-zero bytes were read back using the program I wrote. : :Darren -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 9:14:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from feral.com (feral.com [192.67.166.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92BC714E2E for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:14:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mjacob@feral.com) Received: from localhost (mjacob@localhost) by feral.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA03641; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:13:53 -0800 Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:13:52 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Jacob X-Sender: mjacob@feral-gw Reply-To: mjacob@feral.com To: "Justin C. Walker" Cc: "'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG'" Subject: Re: RE: AIX going BSD In-Reply-To: <199903311657.IAA00627@walker3.apple.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Do you mean SunOS 5.x? I think Solaris 2 == SunOS 5 (not > counting Solaris 7, of course :-}). Also, I wouldn't be surprised > that OSF/1 incorporated some 4.4 stuff, but it really does predate > 4.4BSD. No, I mean SunOS 4.X which was BSD derived. Here's the history as I remember it- which could be totally wrong... (late) BSD 4.1 -> SunOS 1 (?) ...... BSD 4.3 -> SunOS 4.0 SunOS 4.X stuff (vnode/specfs) -> BSD 4.4 SunOS 4.X stuff -> AT&T SVr4 merges in (VM and Specfs stuff) SVr4 -> (incoming! Aiee!) -> Solaris (SunOS 5.X).... And like the culture of that time, all without condoms... To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 9:15:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from frmug.org (frmug-gw.frmug.org [193.56.58.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2988D14E1C for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:15:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by frmug.org (8.9.1/frmug-2.3/nospam) with UUCP id TAA16924 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 19:15:18 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: by keltia.freenix.fr (Postfix, from userid 101) id E926E8844; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 07:10:12 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 07:10:12 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: How do I write to the /dev/bpf0 interface? Message-ID: <19990331071012.A53744@keltia.freenix.fr> Mail-Followup-To: hackers@freebsd.org References: <37017313.6981CEE4@heliox.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <37017313.6981CEE4@heliox.com>; from Tom Brown on Tue, Mar 30, 1999 at 04:57:55PM -0800 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT/ELF ctm#5173 AMD-K6 MMX @ 200 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG According to Tom Brown: > Can anyone please tell me how to post a packet onto my LAN via this > interface. Have you tried the Net::RawIP package in Perl ? -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 4.0-CURRENT #70: Sat Feb 27 09:43:08 CET 1999 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 9:17:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9008214D32 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:17:49 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id JAA49728; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:17:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:17:07 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199903311717.JAA49728@apollo.backplane.com> To: Graham Wheeler Cc: Ladavac Marino , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: select() on UDP socket returns ECONNREFUSED References: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D097583@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at> <37020CE5.477F888D@cdsec.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> Do you mean, select returns -1 and sets errno to ECONNREFUSED? : :Oops (hides head in embarassment). I just checked the code (which :wasn't mine) and saw that the error gets logged if the select returns :something other than 1 and errno isn't EINTR. Which means that this is :happening when the select times out and returns zero. : :Turns out the person who wrote the code erroneously assumed that :select() would return errno==EINTR if it timed out. : :-- :Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com :Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 :Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 :Internet/Intranet Network Specialists :Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ People should remember that system calls do *NOT* clear errno. If errno is set from a previous error, it stays set even if the system call succeeds. Also, system and library routines do not reliably overwrite errno if errno is non-zero prior to making the call. If you intend to check errno after a library or system call returns < 0, you have clear errno prior to making the call or you may get stale data. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 9:37:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-out2.apple.com (mail-out2.apple.com [17.254.0.51]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 018F914D45 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:37:52 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from justin@walker3.apple.com) Received: from mailgate1.apple.com (A17-128-100-225.apple.com [17.128.100.225]) by mail-out2.apple.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA56222 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:25:41 -0800 Received: from scv1.apple.com (scv1.apple.com) by mailgate1.apple.com (mailgate1.apple.com- SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:25:39 -0800 Received: from walker3.apple.com (walker3.apple.com [17.219.24.201]) by scv1.apple.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA03290 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:25:38 -0800 Received: by walker3.apple.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) id JAA00748 for "'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG'" ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:25:38 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199903311725.JAA00748@walker3.apple.com> To: "'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG'" Subject: Re: RE: AIX going BSD In-Reply-To: <199903311657.IAA00627@walker3.apple.com> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:25:36 -0800 From: "Justin C. Walker" Reply-To: justin@apple.com X-Mailer: by Apple MailViewer (2.105.dev) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > From: Matthew Jacob > Date: 1999-03-31 09:15:36 -0800 > > > Do you mean SunOS 5.x? I think Solaris 2 == SunOS 5 (not > > counting Solaris 7, of course :-}). Also, I wouldn't be surprised > > that OSF/1 incorporated some 4.4 stuff, but it really does predate > > 4.4BSD. > > > No, I mean SunOS 4.X which was BSD derived. Here's the history as I > remember it- which could be totally wrong... This is what makes horse races :-} I don't recall the 'merge' state, but I've never claimed infalibility (except when I'm speaking Ex Cathedra :-}). Regards, Justin > (late) BSD 4.1 > > -> SunOS 1 (?) > > ...... > > > BSD 4.3 -> SunOS 4.0 > > > SunOS 4.X stuff (vnode/specfs) -> BSD 4.4 > > > SunOS 4.X stuff -> AT&T SVr4 merges in (VM and Specfs stuff) > > > SVr4 -> (incoming! Aiee!) -> Solaris (SunOS 5.X).... > > > And like the culture of that time, all without condoms... > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > Justin C. Walker, Curmudgeon-At-Large * Institute for General Semantics | Manager, CoreOS Networking | Men are from Earth. Apple Computer, Inc. | Women are from Earth. 2 Infinite Loop | Deal with it. Cupertino, CA 95014 | *-------------------------------------*-------------------------------* To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 9:45:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from eltex.ru (ELTEX-2-SPIIRAS.nw.ru [195.19.204.46]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7F9714D32; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:45:30 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ark@eltex.ru) Received: from border.eltex.spb.ru (root@border.eltex.ru [195.19.198.2]) by eltex.ru (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA02115; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 21:45:11 +0400 (MSD) Received: by border.eltex.spb.ru (ssmtp TIS-0.5alpha, 19 Oct 1998); Wed, 31 Mar 1999 21:45:10 +0400 Received: from undisclosed-intranet-sender id xma000362; Wed, 31 Mar 99 21:44:58 +0400 Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 21:44:57 +0400 Message-Id: <199903311744.VAA00469@paranoid.eltex.spb.ru> From: ark@eltex.ru Organization: "Klingon Imperial Intelligence Service" Subject: TX and BX chipsets, 2.1.7.1 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- nuqneH, Does anybody know how to force 2.1.7.1 to work on newer machines (Celeron with BX chipset or P5 with TX and SDRAM/PC100 memory)? I get kernel panics (the same kernel works ok on similar HX machine with EDO RAM) Motherboard is Asus TXP4, T2P4X works OK. What did Intel change inside? P.S. Upgrade is NOT acceptable, no flames please. _ _ _ _ _ _ _ {::} {::} {::} CU in Hell _| o |_ | | _|| | / _||_| |_ |_ |_ (##) (##) (##) /Arkan#iD |_ o _||_| _||_| / _| | o |_||_||_| [||] [||] [||] Do i believe in Bible? Hell,man,i've seen one! -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3i Charset: noconv iQCVAwUBNwJfGKH/mIJW9LeBAQGOewQAjwQIyus98V5jA7Sh6msh0mFPL7h6cVyD FsgexRkhe1HKf91ZYCLRzcd/RoNMIim71cTy61oO2Iu2TgjrRgIcaYfN4uM50vl4 K+OA6uI/T7B0lbf+crLSS84PMTYy8Y3GeDcVQybSzCs+xRosm/fVEXHaftTOIoOV nNJB/YN6r+U= =CWcC -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 10:26:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from relay.veriguard.com (relay.veriguard.com [207.5.63.61]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4686C15432 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 10:26:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tomb@heliox.com) Received: by relay.veriguard.com; id CAA02082; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 02:26:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from unknown(10.5.63.100) by relay.veriguard.com via smap (4.1) id xma002065; Wed, 31 Mar 99 02:25:53 -0800 Message-ID: <370268D7.68012311@heliox.com> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 10:26:31 -0800 From: Tom Brown X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Christopher Sedore Cc: Graham Wheeler , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How do I write to the /dev/bpf0 interface? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG So my supposition that I could write to it like any other file handle was correct ? So I can just write the following to the interface for example: ddddddddddddXXXXXXXXXXXXiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii..... d=destination address X=don't care i=information Bash# ethergenerator.pl>/dev/bpf0 Is that correct? What happens if I want to put in a source MAC address? You also mentioned that it might be a bug with 2.2.8, which combination's of card / operating systems might work? Thanks again for your time. Tom Brown Christopher Sedore wrote: > > On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Graham Wheeler wrote: > > > Christopher Sedore wrote: > > > > > > On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Graham Wheeler wrote: > > > > > > > Tom Brown wrote: > > > > > > > > > Can anyone please tell me how to post a packet onto my LAN via this > > > > > interface. > > > > > > > > You should just be able to write the frame. Make sure everything is in > > > > network-byte order. You needn't put in a source Ethernet address as that > > > > will get filled in, but you do need to put in a destination. > > > > > > Note that this is probably a bug in the bpf implementation. BPF/the > > > kernel shouldn't be messing with the packet on a write to a bpf > > > descriptor. I've filed a bug report (with patch) that addresses this. > > > > > > > It probably isn't the bpf code that is doing this, but the NIC driver > > code... > > Actually, its a cooperative effort by bpfwrite() and ether_output(). > > -Chris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 10:36: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55C2014C27; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 10:35:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id KAA44489; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 10:34:39 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 10:34:38 -0800 (PST) From: Julian Elischer To: Greg Lehey Cc: "Matthew D. Fuller" , questions@FreeBSD.ORG, FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) In-Reply-To: <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Greg Lehey wrote: > 4. For people for whom the additional memory requirements are a > problem, config will have a -s (or similar) option to say 'build a > kernel without debugging symbols'. for tthe debug kernel to be 'feasible to make' you need to have at least 32 MB of ram. making one with only 16MB (while running X) can take upwards of 20 minutes extra. (the linker pages itself into a coma). > > Any comments? This is by no means set in stone, and we'll discuss it > a while before we do anything. At least the distributed GENERIC kernels should have a debug version so that people can get traces.. (and the default installed system should try dump core if it panics.) 'savecore' should say that it is saving the core to disk ** And give detailed instructions as to where and how this information should be sent** julian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 10:41:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1557915652 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 10:41:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id KAA44598; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 10:36:22 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 10:36:22 -0800 (PST) From: Julian Elischer To: The Classiest Man Alive Cc: Greg Lehey , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) In-Reply-To: <199903311623.LAA27893@geek.grf.ov.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, The Classiest Man Alive wrote: > Has anybody looked at this from a performance perspective? In other words, > does the system become any more sluggish or less responsive as a result of > this? > > K.S. > > You don't load the debug kernel, you load the stripped one. you keep the debug one around to use against a corefile with gdb if you need it later. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 11:27:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailer.syr.edu (mailer.syr.edu [128.230.18.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ACC10155E8 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 11:27:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from cmsedore@mailbox.syr.edu) Received: from rodan.syr.edu by mailer.syr.edu (LSMTP for Windows NT v1.1a) with SMTP id <0.87643990@mailer.syr.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 14:26:57 -0500 Received: from localhost (cmsedore@localhost) by rodan.syr.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA29423; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 14:26:47 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: rodan.syr.edu: cmsedore owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 14:26:47 -0500 (EST) From: Christopher Sedore X-Sender: cmsedore@rodan.syr.edu To: Tom Brown Cc: Graham Wheeler , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How do I write to the /dev/bpf0 interface? In-Reply-To: <370268D7.68012311@heliox.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Tom Brown wrote: > So my supposition that I could write to it like any other file handle > was correct ? > > > So I can just write the following to the interface for example: > > > ddddddddddddXXXXXXXXXXXXiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii..... > d=destination address > X=don't care > i=information > > Bash# ethergenerator.pl>/dev/bpf0 > > Is that correct? Yes, though worth note is that most ethernet packets we care about (IP for instance) have the following wire format [dest, 6 bytes][src, 6 bytes][type, 2 bytes][data, up to 1500 bytes] Depending on who you're talking to, you might want to make sure that the two type bytes are not used by another protocol (0800 for IP, 0806 for ARP, 8137 for IPX, etc) so you don't bother any existing protocol stacks. > > What happens if I want to put in a source MAC address? It is silently overwritten, at least in 3.1. I haven't checked what happens in 2.x.x. > You also mentioned that it might be a bug with 2.2.8, which > combination's of card / operating systems might work? If you look on the FreeBSD Gnats page, you'll see (toward the very bottom of the page in the non-critical catagory) a bug report from me on this problem. Included in that bug report is a patch which fixed the problem for me (and should fix it in general). After applying that patch, you must put the source address in the packet (the way it should be IMHO). -Chris > > Christopher Sedore wrote: > > > > On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Graham Wheeler wrote: > > > > > Christopher Sedore wrote: > > > > > > > > On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Graham Wheeler wrote: > > > > > > > > > Tom Brown wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Can anyone please tell me how to post a packet onto my LAN via this > > > > > > interface. > > > > > > > > > > You should just be able to write the frame. Make sure everything is in > > > > > network-byte order. You needn't put in a source Ethernet address as that > > > > > will get filled in, but you do need to put in a destination. > > > > > > > > Note that this is probably a bug in the bpf implementation. BPF/the > > > > kernel shouldn't be messing with the packet on a write to a bpf > > > > descriptor. I've filed a bug report (with patch) that addresses this. > > > > > > > > > > It probably isn't the bpf code that is doing this, but the NIC driver > > > code... > > > > Actually, its a cooperative effort by bpfwrite() and ether_output(). > > > > -Chris > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 12:11:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-out1.apple.com (mail-out1.apple.com [17.254.0.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1506015CAE for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 12:11:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from justin@rhapture.apple.com) Received: from mailgate1.apple.com (A17-128-100-225.apple.com [17.128.100.225]) by mail-out1.apple.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA52796 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 12:02:31 -0800 Received: from scv2.apple.com (scv2.apple.com) by mailgate1.apple.com (mailgate1.apple.com- SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 12:02:11 -0800 Received: from rhapture.apple.com (rhapture.apple.com [17.202.40.59]) by scv2.apple.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA19188; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 12:02:09 -0800 Received: (from justin@localhost) by rhapture.apple.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) id MAA00975; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 12:02:09 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199903312002.MAA00975@rhapture.apple.com> To: Christopher Sedore Subject: Re: How do I write to the /dev/bpf0 interface? Cc: Tom Brown , Graham Wheeler , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <370268D7.68012311@heliox.com> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 12:02:08 -0800 From: "Justin C. Walker" Reply-To: justin@apple.com X-Mailer: by Apple MailViewer (2.105.dev) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > From: Christopher Sedore > Date: 1999-03-31 11:28:17 -0800 > > On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Tom Brown wrote: > > > So my supposition that I could write to it like any other file handle > > was correct ? > > > > > > So I can just write the following to the interface for example: > > > > > > ddddddddddddXXXXXXXXXXXXiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii..... > > d=destination address > > X=don't care > > i=information > > > > Bash# ethergenerator.pl>/dev/bpf0 > > > > Is that correct? > > Yes, though worth note is that most ethernet packets we care about (IP for > instance) have the following wire format > > [dest, 6 bytes][src, 6 bytes][type, 2 bytes][data, up to 1500 bytes] To be even more "politically correct on the wire", the "[type, 2 bytes]" chunk of the packet is actually "type or length", with the packet being interpreted as 802.2 if that two bytes has an integer value smaller than the MTU of ethernet (1514 bytes). AppleTalk, IPX, and a few others use this framing instead of the "type" framing. Oh, and remember that all good networks are "big endian" :-}. Regards, Justin > Depending on who you're talking to, you might want to make sure that the > two type bytes are not used by another protocol (0800 for IP, 0806 for > ARP, 8137 for IPX, etc) so you don't bother any existing protocol stacks. > > > > > What happens if I want to put in a source MAC address? > > It is silently overwritten, at least in 3.1. I haven't checked what > happens in 2.x.x. > > > You also mentioned that it might be a bug with 2.2.8, which > > combination's of card / operating systems might work? > > If you look on the FreeBSD Gnats page, you'll see (toward the very bottom > of the page in the non-critical catagory) a bug report from me on this > problem. Included in that bug report is a patch which fixed the problem > for me (and should fix it in general). After applying that patch, you > must put the source address in the packet (the way it should be IMHO). > > -Chris > > > > > Christopher Sedore wrote: > > > > > > On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Graham Wheeler wrote: > > > > > > > Christopher Sedore wrote: > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Graham Wheeler wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Tom Brown wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can anyone please tell me how to post a packet onto my LAN via this > > > > > > > interface. > > > > > > > > > > > > You should just be able to write the frame. Make sure everything is in > > > > > > network-byte order. You needn't put in a source Ethernet address as that > > > > > > will get filled in, but you do need to put in a destination. > > > > > > > > > > Note that this is probably a bug in the bpf implementation. BPF/the > > > > > kernel shouldn't be messing with the packet on a write to a bpf > > > > > descriptor. I've filed a bug report (with patch) that addresses this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > It probably isn't the bpf code that is doing this, but the NIC driver > > > > code... > > > > > > Actually, its a cooperative effort by bpfwrite() and ether_output(). > > > > > > -Chris > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > Justin C. Walker, Curmudgeon-At-Large * Institute for General Semantics | Manager, CoreOS Networking | Men are from Earth. Apple Computer, Inc. | Women are from Earth. 2 Infinite Loop | Deal with it. Cupertino, CA 95014 | *-------------------------------------*-------------------------------* To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 12:18:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0627815CDA for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 12:18:26 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id MAA48472; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 12:12:12 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 12:12:11 -0800 (PST) From: Julian Elischer To: Eugeny Kuzakov Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: latest 228-stable trap In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG print *head as well? (and the next item in that list if there is one.) (and the LAST item in that list (as it's trying to insert at thte tail)) julian On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Eugeny Kuzakov wrote: > > Hi, All! > > There is trap... > > GDB is free software and you are welcome to distribute copies of it > under certain conditions; type "show copying" to see the conditions. > There is absolutely no warranty for GDB; type "show warranty" for details. > GDB 4.16 (i386-unknown-freebsd), > Copyright 1996 Free Software Foundation, Inc... > IdlePTD 26e000 > current pcb at 23a360 > panic: page fault > #0 boot (howto=256) at ../../kern/kern_shutdown.c:266 > 266 dumppcb.pcb_cr3 = rcr3(); > #0 boot (howto=256) at ../../kern/kern_shutdown.c:266 > #1 0xf01138e2 in panic (fmt=0xf01ebfef "page fault") > at ../../kern/kern_shutdown.c:400 > #2 0xf01ecbda in trap_fatal (frame=0xefbffe04) at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:772 > #3 0xf01ec69c in trap_pfault (frame=0xefbffe04, usermode=0) > at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:681 > #4 0xf01ec327 in trap (frame={tf_es = 16, tf_ds = 16, tf_edi = 0, > tf_esi = -225239040, tf_ebp = -272630196, tf_isp = -272630228, > tf_ebx = -224572928, tf_edx = 262144, tf_ecx = 17280, tf_eax = 0, > tf_trapno = 12, tf_err = 2, tf_eip = -267216308, tf_cs = 8, > tf_eflags = 66118, tf_esp = -225253888, tf_ss = -225253888}) > at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:324 > #5 0xf0129a4c in sonewconn1 (head=0xf2932000, connstatus=0) > at ../../kern/uipc_socket2.c:230 > #6 0xf01673b2 in tcp_input (m=0xf1a7c900, iphlen=20) > at ../../netinet/tcp_input.c:421 > #7 0xf0163c50 in ip_input (m=0xf1a7c900) at ../../netinet/ip_input.c:630 > #8 0xf0163cc8 in ipintr () at ../../netinet/ip_input.c:651 > #9 0xf01e4c59 in swi_net_next () > #10 0xf012acf7 in connect (p=0xf2b17200, uap=0xefbfff94, retval=0xefbfff84) > at ../../kern/uipc_syscalls.c:315 > #11 0xf01ece17 in syscall (frame={tf_es = 39, tf_ds = 39, tf_edi = 482606, > tf_esi = 483776, tf_ebp = -272643092, tf_isp = -272629788, > tf_ebx = 537749752, tf_edx = -272643616, tf_ecx = 13, tf_eax = 98, > tf_trapno = 22, tf_err = 7, tf_eip = 537560001, tf_cs = 31, > tf_eflags = 642, tf_esp = -272643564, tf_ss = 39}) > at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:920 > #12 0x200a83c1 in ?? () > #13 0x1a277 in ?? () > #14 0x1095 in ?? () > (kgdb) p *(struct socket*) 0xf2932000 > $2 = {so_type = 1, so_options = 6, so_linger = 0, so_state = 130, > so_pcb = 0xf2bc2080 "", so_proto = 0xf022e358, so_head = 0x0, so_incomp = { > tqh_first = 0x0, tqh_last = 0x0}, so_comp = {tqh_first = 0x0, > tqh_last = 0x0}, so_list = {tqe_next = 0x0, tqe_prev = 0xf27da51c}, > so_qlen = 0, so_incqlen = 0, so_qlimit = 3, so_timeo = 0, so_error = 0, > so_pgid = 0, so_oobmark = 0, so_rcv = {sb_cc = 13, sb_hiwat = 17280, > sb_mbcnt = 128, sb_mbmax = 138240, sb_lowat = 1, sb_mb = 0xf1a54d80, > sb_sel = {si_pid = 0, si_flags = 0}, sb_flags = 0, sb_timeo = 0}, > so_snd = {sb_cc = 0, sb_hiwat = 17280, sb_mbcnt = 0, sb_mbmax = 138240, > sb_lowat = 2048, sb_mb = 0x0, sb_sel = {si_pid = 0, si_flags = 0}, > sb_flags = 0, sb_timeo = 0}, so_tpcb = 0x0, so_upcall = 0, > so_upcallarg = 0x0, so_uid = 0} > (kgdb)q > > I am use ipfilter 3.2.9 compiled in kernel. > But problem is in inserting current entry `so_list' in `so' at > uipc_socket2.c:230: > TAILQ_INSERT_TAIL(&head->so_incomp, so, so_list); > > this is in queue.h:343 > > #define TAILQ_INSERT_TAIL(head, elm, field) do { \ > (elm)->field.tqe_next = NULL; \ > (elm)->field.tqe_prev = (head)->tqh_last; \ > *(head)->tqh_last = (elm); \ > (head)->tqh_last = &(elm)->field.tqe_next; \ > } while (0) > > Can anyone help me? > > -- > Best wishes, Eugeny Kuzakov > Laboratory 321 ( Omsk, Russia ) > kev@lab321.ru > ICQ#: 5885106 > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 12:23:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from noc.demon.net (server.noc.demon.net [193.195.224.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E603915CC6 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 12:23:57 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from fanf@demon.net) Received: by noc.demon.net; id VAA07678; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 21:23:38 +0100 (BST) Received: from fanf.noc.demon.net(195.11.55.83) by inside.noc.demon.net via smap (3.2) id xma007660; Wed, 31 Mar 99 21:23:35 +0100 Received: from fanf by fanf.noc.demon.net with local (Exim 1.73 #2) id 10SRWR-0000PJ-00; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 21:23:35 +0100 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: Tony Finch Subject: Re: AIX going BSD In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 21:23:35 +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Alton, Matthew" wrote: > >This lends credence to my lond-held hypothesis that all >commercial UNICES are secretly floating on 4.4BSD UNIX - >The OS that God runs on his PDP/11 up in Heaven. Nono, that's 2BSD. Tony. -- f.a.n.finch dot@dotat.at fanf@demon.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 13: 5:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nero.cybersites.com (nero.cybersites.com [207.92.123.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5327C14E2E for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 13:05:28 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from cyouse@cybersites.com) Received: from ns1.cybersites.com (ns1.cybersites.com [207.92.123.2]) by nero.cybersites.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA20786 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 16:09:16 -0500 From: Chuck Youse To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: NFS and file locking Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 15:37:40 -0500 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.17] Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <99033116022602.00374@ns1.cybersites.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-KMail-Mark: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I work at a company that is currently using Linux, with some recent patches, to access IRIX filesystems over NFS. They utilize NFS locking (rpc.lockd/etc) fairly heavily. [I didn't say the design was great ;)] I'd like to move toward using FreeBSD instead of Linux, but unfortunately NFS locking is not supported. I did some digging around and noticed that Terry Lambert had created some patches (against the 2.x trees) to support locking, but that we still lack an implementation of rpc.lockd to complete the project. I also noticed some comments elsewhere to the effect that it's nearly impossible to implement NFS locking within the current kernels properly. What's the status of this stuff? To my knowledge, Terry's patches were never accepted into the tree -- why was that? What ever happened to the rpc.lockd project? -- Chuck Youse Director of Systems cyouse@cybersites.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 13:26:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 70FCB14C25 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 13:26:12 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA01544; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 16:24:24 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 16:24:24 -0500 (EST) From: Chuck Robey To: "Alton, Matthew" Cc: DL-ADM , "'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG'" Subject: RE: AIX going BSD In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Alton, Matthew wrote: > This lends credence to my lond-held hypothesis that all > commercial UNICES are secretly floating on 4.4BSD UNIX - > The OS that God runs on his PDP/11 up in Heaven. No > wonder they won't free up their source code. It'd be too > embarassing. You guys are showing snobbery, just as surely as the commercial world. You forget that BSD was proprietary software for years (only available if you had AT&T licenses) and it would be very difficult to find any Unix version at all (outside of that bought directly from AT&T) that didn't have some BSD code in it. That's been the situation for 15 years, and now you want to discover it? AIX is *not* doing anything at all outside the usual, and it would, in fact, be remarkable (and outside the expected norm) if you *didn't* find some BSD code in it. Why don't you go look at, oh, Hewlett Packard, or some other mainstream vendor? ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@glue.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 15:15:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F46A1500C; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 15:15:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id IAA09181; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 08:44:46 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id IAA89575; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 08:44:45 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990401084444.I413@lemis.com> Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 08:44:44 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Brian McGovern , thierry.herbelot@alcatel.fr Cc: questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MFS Sizes over 470MB? Can't seem to do it... References: <37023952.28B139D7@telspace.alcatel.fr> <199903311639.LAA02330@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199903311639.LAA02330@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com>; from Brian McGovern on Wed, Mar 31, 1999 at 11:39:31AM -0500 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wednesday, 31 March 1999 at 11:39:31 -0500, Brian McGovern wrote: > [For anyone tuning in late, I'm having a problem specifying MFS file systems > in excess of ~500MB without using -F, and I'm trying to understand why. The > one comment I have received so far is that max MFS size is a function of > total swap space. I'm now disagreeing...] > > Actually, it appears swap size is not an apparent function of MFS file systems. > Even at a 2GB of swap, MFSs over 507MB (+/-) won't work unless the -F option > is also given (although I'm not sure of the impact). Therefore, I don't know > if this qualifies as a bug or not... > > Device 1K-blocks Used Avail Capacity Type > /dev/da0s1b 1048576 8552 1039896 1% Interleaved > /dev/da1s1b 1048576 8260 1040188 1% Interleaved > Total 2096896 16812 2080084 1% I think it's a bug. I've reported similar behaviour before. I'm running /tmp on mfs. Here's what I have: $ df /tmp Filesystem 1048576-blocks Used Avail Capacity Mounted on mfs:272 30 0 28 0% /tmp $ pstat -s Device 1048576-blocks Used Avail Capacity Type /dev/wd0s1b 49 45 4 91% Interleaved /dev/sd0b 399 72 326 18% Interleaved Total 449 118 331 26% Note that all the values are in MB. I mount /tmp from /etc/rc.local, and specify /dev/sd0b as the swap partition, so it *should* give me 449 MB. Instead it gives me 30, with no explanation. If I umount it and mount it again, I get the full 449 MB (or I did last time I tried; that means stopping X, and I don't want to do that). I haven't been complaining about this, because I know that people will, with justification, ask me what I'm doing to fix it. But I'm sure it's a bug. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 15:42:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55EFB14F96; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 15:42:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from marko@uk.radan.com) Received: from [158.152.75.22] (helo=uk.radan.com) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10SUcQ-0002mb-0A; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 23:41:59 +0000 Organisation: Radan Computational Ltd., Bath, UK. Phone: +44-1225-320320 Fax: +44-1225-320311 Received: from marder-1. (rasnt-1 [193.114.228.211]) by uk.radan.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with ESMTP id AAA00448; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 00:41:28 +0100 Received: (from marko@localhost) by marder-1. (8.9.2/8.8.8) id AAA02878; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 00:38:31 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from marko) Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 00:38:31 +0100 From: Mark Ovens To: Greg Lehey Cc: "Matthew D. Fuller" , questions@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) Message-ID: <19990401003831.A2788@marder-1.localhost> References: <19990331003535.E17547@futuresouth.com> <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Wed, Mar 31, 1999 at 04:51:39PM +0930 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Mar 31, 1999 at 04:51:39PM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: > > To answer your question: a typical (partially) stripped kernel is > about 1.8 MB in size. The corresponding debug kernel is about 9 MB > (since ELF; a.out debug kernels are about 3 MB larger). This space is > *in memory at all times*, so you don't normally want to load it, but > it's good to have for dump analysis. > > Here are some comparative figures for building a kernel on my main > machine (AMD K6-2/333, 160 MB memory): > > normal debug > Make all 4:30 5:0 > Kernel size 1.8 MB 9 MB > Directory size 5.5 MB 24 MB > Out of interest I did a ``make all'' on the 3.1-R GENERIC kernel and these are my figures. My machine is an AMD K6/233 (an original K6, not a -2), 64MB memory, 128MB swap, U/W SCSI HD: normal Make all 4:25 Kernel size 2.2 MB Directory size 6.3 MB Are the clock and clock multiplier jumpers set correctly on your m/b ;-). -- FreeBSD - The Power To Serve http://www.freebsd.org My Webpage http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~markov _______________________________________________________________ Mark Ovens, CNC Apps Engineer, Radan Computational Ltd. Bath UK CAD/CAM solutions for Sheetmetal Working Industry mailto:marko@uk.radan.com http://www.radan.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 15:46:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 828BD150E1; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 15:46:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id JAA09313; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 09:16:18 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id JAA89696; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 09:16:16 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990401091616.M413@lemis.com> Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 09:16:16 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Mark Ovens Cc: "Matthew D. Fuller" , questions@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) References: <19990331003535.E17547@futuresouth.com> <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com> <19990401003831.A2788@marder-1.localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990401003831.A2788@marder-1.localhost>; from Mark Ovens on Thu, Apr 01, 1999 at 12:38:31AM +0100 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday, 1 April 1999 at 0:38:31 +0100, Mark Ovens wrote: > On Wed, Mar 31, 1999 at 04:51:39PM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: >> >> To answer your question: a typical (partially) stripped kernel is >> about 1.8 MB in size. The corresponding debug kernel is about 9 MB >> (since ELF; a.out debug kernels are about 3 MB larger). This space is >> *in memory at all times*, so you don't normally want to load it, but >> it's good to have for dump analysis. >> >> Here are some comparative figures for building a kernel on my main >> machine (AMD K6-2/333, 160 MB memory): >> >> normal debug >> Make all 4:30 5:0 >> Kernel size 1.8 MB 9 MB >> Directory size 5.5 MB 24 MB >> > > Out of interest I did a ``make all'' on the 3.1-R GENERIC kernel and > these are my figures. My machine is an AMD K6/233 (an original K6, > not a -2), 64MB memory, 128MB swap, U/W SCSI HD: > > normal > Make all 4:25 > Kernel size 2.2 MB > Directory size 6.3 MB > > Are the clock and clock multiplier jumpers set correctly on your > m/b ;-). I'm wondering about that, too. I just replaced a K6/233 with a K6-2/333 and got almost no performance increase. But the speed is reported correctly on bootup. I'm using a really old Conner drive, and I suspect that's the bottleneck. Greg -- When replying to this message, please copy the original recipients. For more information, see http://www.lemis.com/questions.html See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 15:58:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com (gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com [207.113.159.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 034341565F for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 15:58:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gdonl@tsc.tdk.com) Received: from sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com (root@sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com [192.168.241.191]) by gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA26143; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 15:57:51 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gdonl@tsc.tdk.com) Received: from salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com (salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com [192.168.241.194]) by sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA10016; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 15:57:50 -0800 (PST) Received: (from gdonl@localhost) by salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA22770; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 15:57:48 -0800 (PST) From: Don Lewis Message-Id: <199903312357.PAA22770@salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 15:57:48 -0800 In-Reply-To: Doug Rabson "Re: Panic in FFS/4.0 as of yesterday" (Feb 23, 8:54am) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(3) 7/19/95) To: Doug Rabson , Don Lewis Subject: Re: Panic in FFS/4.0 as of yesterday Cc: Terry Lambert , dillon@apollo.backplane.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Feb 23, 8:54am, Doug Rabson wrote: } Subject: Re: Panic in FFS/4.0 as of yesterday } On Mon, 22 Feb 1999, Don Lewis wrote: } } > On Feb 20, 10:52pm, Terry Lambert wrote: } > } Subject: Re: Panic in FFS/4.0 as of yesterday } > } > } > If it works, then changing lookup to not require locks on both vnodes at } > } > the same time would be a good thing. One of the reasons that NFS doesn't } > } > have proper node locks is that a dead NFS server can lead to a hung } > } > machine though a lock cascade from the NFS mount point. } > } > I suggested doing something like this, but only at mount points, which } > should be sufficient to fix the NFS problem. The only race conditions } > that would open would be for things you probably don't want to do } > at mountpoints anyway. } } It sounds as if it might work. Are you interested in coding this? ROFL. Look at how long it's taken me to just respond to this question. The only real downside of making this change that I am aware of is that you won't be able to rename mount points. That might be a feature, though, since renaming mount points causes the mount table to become out of sync with reality. Something else that would greatly help the lock cascade problem and likely help performance under normal circumstances would be to implement shared locks, and only use exclusive locks when something needs to be changed. When doing a pathname lookup, only the final vnode (if it was found) and it's parent directory (if LOCKPARENT was set) would be exclusively locked. The lookup would only use shared locks on the other directories that were traversed. In most cases this would prevent the lock cascade, but the cascade could still happen, probably under artificial circumstances. This change would also allow concurrent lookups in the same directory, which should help performance when multiple processes are active. I suspect this change would not be trivial to implement ... To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 16:22:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-01.cdsnet.net (mail-01.cdsnet.net [206.107.16.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 8834214C1D for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 16:22:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mrcpu@internetcds.com) Received: (qmail 20704 invoked from network); 1 Apr 1999 00:22:17 -0000 Received: from schizo.cdsnet.net (204.118.244.32) by mail.cdsnet.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 1999 00:22:17 -0000 Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 16:21:30 -0800 (PST) From: Jaye Mathisen X-Sender: mrcpu@schizo.cdsnet.net To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Weird psychotic bizarro routing problem... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'm running 3.1, supped from appx 3/9/99. I installed the gated from ports. I have some network gear at a remote POP, where router B is. My gated.conf is trivial: ospf yes { backbone { interface eth0 cost 99; interface eth1 cost 99; interface ethz0 cost 1; interface xl0; }; }; export proto ospfase { proto direct; proto kernel; proto static; }; Basically I have 2 T1's muxed via an ETINC card. eth0, eth1 are the individual T1's, ethz0 is the bundled/muxed pair. I have the following routes added statically, and they get propogated via OSPF just fine: route add -net 208.26.133.224 -netmask 255.255.255.224 204.238.16.89 route add -net 208.26.133.128 -netmask 255.255.255.192 204.238.16.73 route add -net 208.26.133.0 -netmask 255.255.255.128 204.238.16.71 route add -net 208.26.132.128 -netmask 255.255.255.128 204.238.16.69 route add -net 208.26.132.0 -netmask 255.255.255.128 204.238.16.67 Everything works fine. Traceroutes to 133.1, etc work just as expected. So now I moved in some more gear, and added another route: route add -net 208.26.136.192 -netmask 255.255.255.192 204.238.16.87 route add -net 208.26.136.128 -netmask 255.255.255.192 204.238.16.85 route add -net 208.26.136.64 -netmask 255.255.255.192 204.238.16.83 route add -net 208.26.136.0 -netmask 255.255.255.192 204.238.16.81 The routes are propagated just fine, but traceroutes *stop* at router B. I do not see any packets generated out xl0 towards any of these hosts. If I logon to routerB and try the traceroute, a tcpdump on another box doesn't see them going out either. But pings to the 204.238.16.* addresses go out, and telnet and other TCP/IP things work. It's weird. It's only happening at the one site, and only with a few blocks of IP's. I have shut off gated and restarted, and it doesn't work with just a plain static route. But it gets weirder... if I delete the above routes, then re-add them, but point them at an IP that has a route to it already, (like the 132.0 net points to), then I get the expected results of the host being unreachable... It's like FreeBSD is just sucking in the packets, and eating them. I have no firewall rules configured, and quite frankly, not a single thing I can think of... If anybody has any ideas, I'd love to here them. If anybody has any gated experience, I'd love to chat briefly about maybe you doing some consulting... To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 16:25:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 248A814DAF for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 16:25:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id KAA28528; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 10:23:39 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199904010023.KAA28528@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. To: dillon@apollo.backplane.com (Matthew Dillon) Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 10:23:38 +1000 (EST) Cc: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, mladavac@metropolitan.at, rb@gid.co.uk, wilko@yedi.iaf.nl, jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199903311710.JAA49644@apollo.backplane.com> from "Matthew Dillon" at Mar 31, 99 09:10:26 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In some mail from Matthew Dillon, sie said: > > :Well.... > :first run, no tar on EIDE drive (just two drives now, EIDE & SCSI, > :nothing else powered, which has ended up with corrupt dirs): > : > :gawaine /usr# dd if=/dev/zero bs=16384k of=/dev/rsd0s4 > :dd: /dev/rsd0s4: short write on character device > :dd: /dev/rsd0s4: end of device > :125+0 records in > :124+1 records out > :2089221120 bytes transferred in 248.516462 secs (8406772 bytes/sec) > : > :Now the interesting part! > : > :I wrote my own program to read it back and check that all that was read > :was indeed null bytes...however! > : > :>From 874627584 (0x3421c200 - 0x3421cfff) was non-null (actually garbage, > :not just 0x01 or 0x02 or 0xf0, etc). About 3572 bytes worth. > : > :Wanting to confirm the location, I ran it again...this time 95573 bytes. > > What release of the os ? > This was 2.2.8-RELEASE. However, I duplicated the above problem with Solaris7. Disabling "Ultra" speed in the BIOS controller has done a lot to resolve this, however. Darren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 16:28:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net (smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net [199.45.39.156]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96B4614DAF for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 16:28:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from babkin@bellatlantic.net) Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-117-238.bellatlantic.net [151.198.117.238]) by smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id TAA26508 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 19:27:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3702BF79.EE5801AE@bellatlantic.net> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 19:36:09 -0500 From: Sergey Babkin X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.0-980222-SNAP i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Y2K issue Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi! I do some Y2K testing for my employer, so I have run some of the Y2K tests on FreeBSD too. In particular, this one: ftp://ftp.rdg.opengroup.org/pub/unsupported/stdtools/y2k/ This directory contains two small tests for the data conversion functions, getdate() and strptime(). Getdate() seems to not be supported in FreeBSD at all, so it's not a Y2K issue although probably a POSIX conformance issue. But strptime() fails. It is supposed to understand the 2-digit year from 0 to 38 as years 2000 to 2038. But in fact in FreeBSD 3.0 snapshot from the May 1998 it sees all the years as belonging to the 20th century. If it's fixed in the latest release then sorry for false alarm. I'm not subscribed to the list now so if you want to reply include please my address as CC:. -SB To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 17: 0:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from homer.talcom.net (unknown [209.5.1.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5FCC914DB1 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 17:00:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from leo@homer.talcom.net) Received: (from leo@localhost) by homer.talcom.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) id UAA11344 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 20:03:15 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 20:03:14 -0500 From: Leo Papandreou To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Hacking And Basic LEsson's Message-ID: <19990331200314.A29893@homer.talcom.net> References: <19990329081937.ECC8614E47@hub.freebsd.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <19990329081937.ECC8614E47@hub.freebsd.org>; from Ramin@www.dci.co.ir on Mon, Mar 29, 1999 at 11:47:28AM -0400 X-No-Archive: Yes X-Organization: Not very, no. X-Wife: Forgotten but not gone. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Mar 29, 1999 at 11:47:28AM -0400, Ramin@www.dci.co.ir wrote: > Hi > I m new in this LIST > & like to know about HACKING ;) > Please Guide me about GOOD Site's (www,ftp,...) I find heavy smoking works. > thanx n0 pr0bl3m. > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 18:26:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EFAD0151A3 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 18:26:08 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id SAA52536; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 18:25:40 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 18:25:40 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904010225.SAA52536@apollo.backplane.com> To: Darren Reed Cc: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, mladavac@metropolitan.at, rb@gid.co.uk, wilko@yedi.iaf.nl, jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. References: <199904010023.KAA28528@cheops.anu.edu.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :This was 2.2.8-RELEASE. : :However, I duplicated the above problem with Solaris7. : :Disabling "Ultra" speed in the BIOS controller has done a lot to :resolve this, however. : :Darren Maybe you should consider taking an Axe to that equipment. With it powered on. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 18:33:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from frmug.org (frmug-gw.frmug.org [193.56.58.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F93C151A3 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 18:33:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by frmug.org (8.9.1/frmug-2.3/nospam) with UUCP id EAA14340 for Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 04:33:18 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: by keltia.freenix.fr (Postfix, from userid 101) id 1DD8B8844; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 00:38:27 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 00:38:27 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: "'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG'" Subject: Re: RE: AIX going BSD Message-ID: <19990401003827.B58251@keltia.freenix.fr> Reply-To: FreeBSD Chat Mailing List Mail-Followup-To: "'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG'" References: <199903311657.IAA00627@walker3.apple.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/0.95.3i In-Reply-To: ; from Matthew Jacob on Wed, Mar 31, 1999 at 09:13:52AM -0800 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT/ELF ctm#5173 AMD-K6 MMX @ 200 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [ reply-to chat ] According to Matthew Jacob: > BSD 4.3 -> SunOS 4.0 Nope, 4.2BSD (as seen in the default broadcast addr is .0) with some 4.3 stuff. > SunOS 4.X stuff (vnode/specfs) -> BSD 4.4 Not really IMO. They got a unified VM & some stacking FS stuff but it wasn't from 4.4. > SunOS 4.X stuff -> AT&T SVr4 merges in (VM and Specfs stuff) Not really, just incorporating some SVR3 features in SunOS. SRV4.0 is SunOS (mostly VM stuff & UFS) + Xenix + SVR3. > SVr4 -> (incoming! Aiee!) -> Solaris (SunOS 5.X).... Sun brought (not licensed !) SVR4.0 code from AT&T (probably Univel or Novell at the time) and derived Solaris from it. That's why it never used any SVR4.2 (like Unixware) features and they "rediscovered" old 4.2BSD and 4.3BSD bugs in Solaris in addition to their own ones (remember the big gethostbyname(3) brokenness in Solaris 2.2 & 2.3 ?). -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 4.0-CURRENT #70: Sat Feb 27 09:43:08 CET 1999 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 18:59:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3838114D25; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 18:59:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id MAA10046; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 12:29:24 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id MAA90659; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 12:29:23 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990401122922.Q413@lemis.com> Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 12:29:22 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: FreeBSD Hackers , FreeBSD SCSI Mailing List Subject: CCD and Vinum compared with new performance measuring tool Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In the past few weeks, I've been bitching about the fact that bonnie doesn't do what I want in measuring storage device performance. I've now solved the problem: I've written another program. You can pick it up at ftp://ftp.lemis.com/pub/rawio.tar.gz. From the man page: DESCRIPTION rawio tests the speed of the low-level character I/O device special in a concurrent environment. It is intended for comparisons of storage de- vices on a single system, and is not suited for cross-platform perfor- mance testing. By default, rawio spawns eight processes, each of which performs the same test. Four tests are available: Random Read The random read test reads varying length records from the speci- fied device special, starting at random positions within the file. Sequential Read The sequential read test reads constant length records from the specified device special, starting at the beginning of the file. Random Write The random read test writes varying length records to the speci- fied device special, starting at random positions within the file. Sequential Write The sequential read test writes constant length records to the specified device special, starting at the beginning of the file. Here is some sample output measuring vinum volumes and straight disks (remember, these are ancient hand-me-down pre-SCSI-1 CDC drives; only the comparison counts). da2 is the raw disk, ccd0 is a striped ccd, and s128k is a striped vinum volume with the same geometry (128 kB stripes): Test ID K/sec %User %Sys %Total I/Os RR da2 576759 0.0 0.7 0.7 800 RR ccd0 1224133 0.1 2.0 2.1 800 RR s128k 1220979 0.4 2.2 2.6 800 Test ID K/sec %User %Sys %Total I/Os SR da2 899264 0.0 0.4 0.4 800 SR ccd0 1903052 0.0 1.5 1.5 800 SR s128k 1925672 0.1 1.8 1.9 800 Test ID K/sec %User %Sys %Total I/Os RW da2 589874 0.0 0.8 0.8 800 RW ccd0 1380529 0.1 2.2 2.3 800 RW s128k 1370186 0.3 2.6 2.9 800 Test ID K/sec %User %Sys %Total I/Os SW da2 901745 0.0 0.5 0.5 800 SW ccd0 2114599 0.1 1.6 1.7 800 SW s128k 2116235 0.0 2.1 2.1 800 Not surprisingly, the performance figures for vinum are pretty much the same as for ccd; the somewhat higher CPU time is probably due to the debug aids I still have in vinum. Compared to bonnie, the results are pretty reproducible. Comments welcome Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 22:45:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E18415C23 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 22:45:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (wes@zaphod.softweyr.com [204.68.178.35]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA05153; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 23:43:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <37031575.F7A2399D@softweyr.com> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 23:43:01 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr llc X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Sergey Babkin Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Y2K issue References: <3702BF79.EE5801AE@bellatlantic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Sergey Babkin wrote: > > Hi! > > I do some Y2K testing for my employer, so I have run some of the Y2K > tests on FreeBSD too. In particular, this one: > > ftp://ftp.rdg.opengroup.org/pub/unsupported/stdtools/y2k/ > > This directory contains two small tests for the data conversion functions, > getdate() and strptime(). Getdate() seems to not be supported in FreeBSD > at all, so it's not a Y2K issue although probably a POSIX conformance > issue. But strptime() fails. It is supposed to understand the 2-digit > year from 0 to 38 as years 2000 to 2038. Sez who? strptime behaves exactly as the man page says: %G is replaced by a year as a decimal number with century. This year is the one that contains the greater part of the week (Monday as the first day of the week). %g is replaced by the same year as in ``%G'', but as a decimal number without century (00-99). [...] %Y is replaced by the year with century as a decimal number. %y is replaced by the year without century as a decimal number (00-99). I don't see what could be much more explicit than that. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 22:51:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.149.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 146E115C39 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 22:51:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id QAA09525; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 16:48:54 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199904010648.QAA09525@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. To: dillon@apollo.backplane.com (Matthew Dillon) Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 16:48:54 +1000 (EST) Cc: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, mladavac@metropolitan.at, rb@gid.co.uk, wilko@yedi.iaf.nl, jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199904010225.SAA52536@apollo.backplane.com> from "Matthew Dillon" at Mar 31, 99 06:25:40 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In some mail from Matthew Dillon, sie said: > > :This was 2.2.8-RELEASE. > : > :However, I duplicated the above problem with Solaris7. > : > :Disabling "Ultra" speed in the BIOS controller has done a lot to > :resolve this, however. > : > :Darren > > Maybe you should consider taking an Axe to that equipment. With it > powered on. Funny, NOT. Makes me wonder more about the integrity, in general, of running "high performance" h/w on pc's. I'm sure we all just *love* how power cables and disk cables are almost always close together. oh, I get it now, it's an APril fools day thing. Darren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 23: 8:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 551D21516C for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 23:08:10 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id XAA53697; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 23:07:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 23:07:46 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904010707.XAA53697@apollo.backplane.com> To: Darren Reed Cc: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, mladavac@metropolitan.at, rb@gid.co.uk, wilko@yedi.iaf.nl, jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. References: <199904010648.QAA09525@cheops.anu.edu.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> :> Maybe you should consider taking an Axe to that equipment. With it :> powered on. : :Funny, NOT. Makes me wonder more about the integrity, in general, of :running "high performance" h/w on pc's. I'm sure we all just *love* :how power cables and disk cables are almost always close together. : :oh, I get it now, it's an APril fools day thing. : :Darren *plus* be sure to feed it. A nice glob of boiling salted molasses poured on the motherboard while at the same time smashing it with the aformentioned axe. While powered on. Be sure to use rubber gloves and remember, you always get better results when you jumper your breaker box to avoid untimely shutdowns during this phase of debugging. Next week: The best ways to smoke a computer with an Arc Welder. Matt's top 5 picks! And, as a bonus from the archives and old reader favorite, Matt's 1986 article entitled "how to build a highly directional medium-range wave-guided EMP generator for less then five hundred thousand dollars". -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 23:17:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E34E41516C; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 23:17:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id XAA53772; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 23:17:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 23:17:02 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904010717.XAA53772@apollo.backplane.com> To: Greg Lehey Cc: FreeBSD Hackers , FreeBSD SCSI Mailing List Subject: Re: CCD and Vinum compared with new performance measuring tool References: <19990401122922.Q413@lemis.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : :In the past few weeks, I've been bitching about the fact that bonnie :doesn't do what I want in measuring storage device performance. I've :now solved the problem: I've written another program. You can pick it :up at ftp://ftp.lemis.com/pub/rawio.tar.gz. From the man page: : :DESCRIPTION : rawio tests the speed of the low-level character I/O device special in a : concurrent environment. It is intended for comparisons of storage de- :.. Just a quick side note: There are known performance problems with the new getnewbuf() in -4.x. These problems have been solved, but not yet committed. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 23:20: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A4D91516C; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 23:19:56 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id QAA11084; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 16:49:36 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id QAA91354; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 16:49:35 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990401164935.Z413@lemis.com> Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 16:49:35 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Matthew Dillon Cc: FreeBSD Hackers , FreeBSD SCSI Mailing List Subject: Re: CCD and Vinum compared with new performance measuring tool References: <19990401122922.Q413@lemis.com> <199904010717.XAA53772@apollo.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904010717.XAA53772@apollo.backplane.com>; from Matthew Dillon on Wed, Mar 31, 1999 at 11:17:02PM -0800 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wednesday, 31 March 1999 at 23:17:02 -0800, Matthew Dillon wrote: >> >> In the past few weeks, I've been bitching about the fact that bonnie >> doesn't do what I want in measuring storage device performance. I've >> now solved the problem: I've written another program. You can pick it >> up at ftp://ftp.lemis.com/pub/rawio.tar.gz. From the man page: >> >> DESCRIPTION >> rawio tests the speed of the low-level character I/O device special in a >> concurrent environment. It is intended for comparisons of storage de- >> .. > > Just a quick side note: There are known performance problems with the > new getnewbuf() in -4.x. These problems have been solved, but not yet > committed. Thanks for the info. I've noticed that the individual subprocesses tend to run at very different speeds. Does it have anything to do with that? Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 31 23:24:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from titan.metropolitan.at (unknown [195.212.98.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1924015243 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 1999 23:24:57 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mladavac@metropolitan.at) Received: by TITAN with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id <2AY772YB>; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 09:27:02 +0200 Message-ID: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D097585@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at> From: Ladavac Marino To: 'Darren Reed' , dillon@apollo.backplane.com Cc: Ladavac Marino , rb@gid.co.uk, wilko@yedi.iaf.nl, jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: another ufs panic.. Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 09:21:33 +0200 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > -----Original Message----- > From: Darren Reed [SMTP:avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au] > Sent: Thursday, April 01, 1999 8:49 AM > To: dillon@apollo.backplane.com > Cc: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au; mladavac@metropolitan.at; > rb@gid.co.uk; wilko@yedi.iaf.nl; jkh@zippy.cdrom.com; > hackers@FreeBSD.ORG > Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. > > In some mail from Matthew Dillon, sie said: > > > > :This was 2.2.8-RELEASE. > > : > > :However, I duplicated the above problem with Solaris7. > > : > > :Disabling "Ultra" speed in the BIOS controller has done a lot to > > :resolve this, however. > > : > > :Darren [ML] So I guess we can consider this matter resolved. > > > > Maybe you should consider taking an Axe to that equipment. With > it > > powered on. [ML] Another thing you can try is to see how far can you throw the power supply. > Funny, NOT. Makes me wonder more about the integrity, in general, of > running "high performance" h/w on pc's. I'm sure we all just *love* > how power cables and disk cables are almost always close together. [ML] Don't forget the $10 power supplies--they are really not worth the money. Not to mention noisy busses. And $20 cases which provide practically no shielding at all (when they do not function as a tuned microwave cavity :) > oh, I get it now, it's an APril fools day thing. [ML] Sadly, it wasn't. Not in the States when Matt mailed that :) But, seriously, do consider returning that equipment if it's still under warranty. /Marino > Darren > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 0:48:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from finch-post-11.mail.demon.net (finch-post-11.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.39]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0AFE315D04; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 00:48:21 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from marko@uk.radan.com) Received: from [158.152.75.22] (helo=uk.radan.com) by finch-post-11.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10Sd8l-0000N8-0B; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 08:47:56 +0000 Organisation: Radan Computational Ltd., Bath, UK. Phone: +44-1225-320320 Fax: +44-1225-320311 Received: from support-3.uk.radan.com (support-3 [193.114.228.220]) by uk.radan.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with ESMTP id JAA00940; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 09:46:57 +0100 Received: from uk.radan.com by support-3.uk.radan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id JAA02797; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 09:46:56 +0100 Message-ID: <3703325A.445E99E4@uk.radan.com> Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 09:46:18 +0100 From: Mark Ovens Organization: Radan Computational Ltd X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 4.1.3_U1 sun4m) X-Accept-Language: en-GB MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Greg Lehey Cc: "Matthew D. Fuller" , questions@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) References: <19990331003535.E17547@futuresouth.com> <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com> <19990401003831.A2788@marder-1.localhost> <19990401091616.M413@lemis.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey wrote: > > On Thursday, 1 April 1999 at 0:38:31 +0100, Mark Ovens wrote: > > On Wed, Mar 31, 1999 at 04:51:39PM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: > >> > >> Here are some comparative figures for building a kernel on my main > >> machine (AMD K6-2/333, 160 MB memory): > >> > >> normal debug > >> Make all 4:30 5:0 > >> Kernel size 1.8 MB 9 MB > >> Directory size 5.5 MB 24 MB > >> > > > > Out of interest I did a ``make all'' on the 3.1-R GENERIC kernel and > > these are my figures. My machine is an AMD K6/233 (an original K6, > > not a -2), 64MB memory, 128MB swap, U/W SCSI HD: > > > > normal > > Make all 4:25 > > Kernel size 2.2 MB > > Directory size 6.3 MB > > > > Are the clock and clock multiplier jumpers set correctly on your > > m/b ;-). > > I'm wondering about that, too. I just replaced a K6/233 with a > K6-2/333 and got almost no performance increase. But the speed is > reported correctly on bootup. I'm using a really old Conner drive, > and I suspect that's the bottleneck. > Hmm, what m/b are you using (a K6-2/333 requires 100MHz doesn't it?). I've noticed several m/b manufacturers announcing that their m/bs for the original K6's will run K6-2s with just a BIOS u/g. I'm a bit suspicious of that, AFAIK there are some significant architecture differences between the K6 and K6-2. Shouldn't that require a new/modified chipset to support properly?. Have you'd looked at http://www.amd.com ? They have lists of m/bs that they have tested (and approved) for each of their chips. I used that to decide which m/b to buy (Gigabyte GA586-TX3). Incidentally, I did this test to see how much faster a K6-2 is as I'm debating whether to u/g to a K6-2 or wait for the K7. Guess I should wait for the K7 :-) > Greg > -- > When replying to this message, please copy the original recipients. > For more information, see http://www.lemis.com/questions.html > See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers > finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key -- FreeBSD - The Power To Serve http://www.freebsd.org My Webpage http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~markov _______________________________________________________________ Mark Ovens, CNC Apps Engineer, Radan Computational Ltd. Bath UK CAD/CAM solutions for Sheetmetal Working Industry mailto:marko@uk.radan.com http://www.radan.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 0:58:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from titan.metropolitan.at (unknown [195.212.98.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EC20150E3 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 00:57:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mladavac@metropolitan.at) Received: by TITAN with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id <2AY77290>; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 10:59:34 +0200 Message-ID: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D097586@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at> From: Ladavac Marino To: 'Chuck Robey' , "Alton, Matthew" Cc: DL-ADM , "'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG'" Subject: RE: AIX going BSD Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 10:54:03 +0200 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > -----Original Message----- > From: Chuck Robey [SMTP:chuckr@mat.net] > Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 1999 11:24 PM > To: Alton, Matthew > Cc: DL-ADM; 'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG' > Subject: RE: AIX going BSD > > AIX is *not* doing anything at all outside the usual, and it would, in > fact, be remarkable (and outside the expected norm) if you *didn't* > find > some BSD code in it. Why don't you go look at, oh, Hewlett Packard, > or > some other mainstream vendor? > [ML] I'm afraid you are not getting it. I was actually commending IBM/AIX on its good taste in choice of source bits (i.e. ours and NetBSD's) and actually acknowledging that (by not removing the RCS id lines). If it weren't for the funky executable/shared-library format and toolchain, I'd actually like it a lot (where did it get that from? OS/2--AFAIR OS/2 had DLL's before AIX got them). /Marino > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------- > ------ > Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or > data > chuckr@glue.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and > Unix. > 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | > Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) > (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------- > ------ > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 1:33:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from guard.polynet.lviv.ua (Guard.PolyNet.Lviv.UA [194.44.138.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id BB0D714C11 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 01:33:30 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from pam@postoffice.polynet.lviv.ua) Received: (qmail 18626 invoked from network); 1 Apr 1999 09:33:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO postoffice.polynet.lviv.ua) (unknown) by unknown with SMTP; 1 Apr 1999 09:33:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 62561 invoked by uid 1001); 1 Apr 1999 09:33:08 -0000 Date: 1 Apr 1999 12:33:08 +0300 Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 12:33:08 +0300 (EEST) From: Adrian Pavlykevych X-Sender: pam@NetSurfer.lp.lviv.ua To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: [Q]: Piping from syslogd to program Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello everybody! Are there any special tricks to be done to have program which is run by syslogd and piping logs through it? I have pipe program which works perfectly while run in shell pipeline like: zcat /var/log/messages.0.gz | my-program >> result.log But it causes message "exec my-program >> result.log: Resource temporarily unavailable" to be logged by syslogd when run from syslog.conf: *.* | exec my-program >> result.log program is perl script in the form of: open(LOG, "/dev/stdin") open(OUT, "| another-program"); while() { print OUT "Some info"; print "Errors"; } Any suggestions would be appreciated. Regards, Adrian Pavlykevych email: System Administrator phone/fax: +380 (322) 742041 State University "Lvivska Polytechnica" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 1:38: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from shell.futuresouth.com (shell.futuresouth.com [198.78.58.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DF1C14C11 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 01:37:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from fullermd@futuresouth.com) Received: (from fullermd@localhost) by shell.futuresouth.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA14972; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 03:37:24 -0600 (CST) Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 03:37:24 -0600 From: "Matthew D. Fuller" To: Adrian Pavlykevych Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: [Q]: Piping from syslogd to program Message-ID: <19990401033724.B11572@futuresouth.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: ; from Adrian Pavlykevych on Thu, Apr 01, 1999 at 12:33:08PM +0300 X-OS: FreeBSD Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 01, 1999 at 12:33:08PM +0300, a little birdie told me that Adrian Pavlykevych remarked > Hello everybody! > > Are there any special tricks to be done to have program which is run by > syslogd and piping logs through it? I don't think I have anything to touch on this precise problem, but... > program is perl script in the form of: > > open(LOG, "/dev/stdin") > while() { Why? What's wrong with just while() { --- *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* | Matthew Fuller http://www.over-yonder.net/ | * fullermd@futuresouth.com fullermd@over-yonder.net * | UNIX Systems Administrator Specializing in FreeBSD | * FutureSouth Communications ISPHelp ISP Consulting * | "The only reason I'm burning my candle at both ends, | * is because I haven't figured out how to light the * | middle yet" | *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 2:28:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gw.start.nl (gw.start.nl [193.67.139.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CEFCC151C7; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 02:28:51 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from RuigrJer@start.nl) Received: from start.nl (mail.start.nl [172.16.0.32]) by gw.start.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA09384; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 12:28:31 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from RuigrJer@start.nl) Received: from HOOFDKANTOOR_START-Message_Server by start.nl with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 01 Apr 1999 12:30:53 +0200 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise 5.2 Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 12:29:35 +0200 From: "Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven" To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: adrian@freebsd.org, eagle@phc.igs.net, asmodai@wxs.nl Subject: Re: Programmers Documentation Project Request for HELP Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [ Sorry for the crosspost, but I think this is as well hackers material as advocacy. I subscribe to both lists so please, if the content becomes overly technical, restrict it to hackers, else advocacy in order not to mess the lists up to much after this initial post. Thanks ] For those who are interested in the Project and would like to review and/or add to it, please see the following URL: http://home.wxs.nl/~asmodai It has a link to the document when one follows the PDP link. I will make the link a seperate HTML page ASAP in order to allow other sub-projects such as the new DDWG for which I am gathering information. If possible, please diff -u against documents. Things to do: get appropriate manpages in CURRENT based on the documentation, perhaps a database, and everything else we think of. Suggestions/comments appreciated and wanted. Thanks for your time. Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven Infrastructure & Networks Start Holding B.V. tel: +31 - (0) 182 - 695 895 email: jeroen.ruigrok@start.nl To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 2:54:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ewok.creative.net.au (ewok.creative.net.au [203.30.44.41]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 29609150B3 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 02:54:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from adrian@freebsd.org) Received: (qmail 6290 invoked by uid 1008); 1 Apr 1999 10:38:32 -0000 Message-ID: <19990401103832.6288.qmail@ewok.creative.net.au> From: adrian@freebsd.org To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Programmers Documentation Project Request for HELP In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 01 Apr 1999 12:29:35 +0200." Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 18:38:32 +0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven" writes: >[ Sorry for the crosspost, but I think this is as well hackers material > as advocacy. I subscribe to both lists so please, if the content > becomes overly technical, restrict it to hackers, else advocacy in > order not to mess the lists up to much after this initial post. Thanks ] > .. and just to add right now, I'm compiling a list of sysctl descriptions so we can actually have descriptions of what sysctl variables do (rather than the helpful 'read the source' the man page has). The current list is from my 3.1-REL box, I'll update the list when I get a -current box online and I've fgrepped the sources totally. Its located at http://www.freebsd.org/~adrian/sysctl.descriptions If people can please send me diff -u's against what is there, I'll update the list, and start sending in diffs to -current tonight or tomorrow. Adrian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 3:23: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ren.detir.qld.gov.au (ns.detir.qld.gov.au [203.46.81.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60924150DA for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 03:23:01 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from syssgm@detir.qld.gov.au) Received: by ren.detir.qld.gov.au; id VAA17365; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 21:24:36 +1000 (EST) Received: from ogre.detir.qld.gov.au(167.123.8.3) by ren.detir.qld.gov.au via smap (4.1) id xma017363; Thu, 1 Apr 99 21:24:32 +1000 Received: from atlas.detir.qld.gov.au (atlas.detir.qld.gov.au [167.123.8.9]) by ogre.detir.qld.gov.au (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA11038; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 21:22:14 +1000 (EST) Received: from nymph.detir.qld.gov.au (nymph.detir.qld.gov.au [167.123.10.10]) by atlas.detir.qld.gov.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA00272; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 21:22:13 +1000 (EST) Received: from nymph.detir.qld.gov.au (localhost.detir.qld.gov.au [127.0.0.1]) by nymph.detir.qld.gov.au (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA19831; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 21:22:11 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from syssgm@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au) Message-Id: <199904011122.VAA19831@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au> To: Greg Lehey Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, syssgm@detir.qld.gov.au Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) References: <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com> In-Reply-To: <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com> from Greg Lehey at "Wed, 31 Mar 1999 16:51:39 +0930" Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 21:22:11 +1000 From: Stephen McKay Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wednesday, 31st March 1999, Greg Lehey wrote: >To answer your question: a typical (partially) stripped kernel is >about 1.8 MB in size. The corresponding debug kernel is about 9 MB >(since ELF; a.out debug kernels are about 3 MB larger). This space is >*in memory at all times*, so you don't normally want to load it, but >it's good to have for dump analysis. I think you are slightly out of date. As a test, I just built a debugging kernel and booted my 4.0 box *without* the normal 'strip -g kernel' bit. The old kernel and the new: (Yes, only up to #32 on this box!) -rwxr-xr-x 2 root wheel 8138961 Apr 1 19:05 /kernel -rwxr-xr-x 1 root wheel 1625374 Mar 18 20:09 /kernel.31 -rwxr-xr-x 2 root wheel 8138961 Apr 1 19:05 /kernel.32 The old kernel boot messages (from kernel.31): ... Mar 19 19:12:19 twoflower /kernel: CPU: i486 DX2 (486-class CPU) Mar 19 19:12:19 twoflower /kernel: Origin = "GenuineIntel" Id = 0x435 Stepping =5 Mar 19 19:12:19 twoflower /kernel: Features=0x3 Mar 19 19:12:19 twoflower /kernel: real memory = 16777216 (16384K bytes) Mar 19 19:12:19 twoflower /kernel: avail memory = 13926400 (13600K bytes) Mar 19 19:12:19 twoflower /kernel: Preloaded elf kernel "kernel" at 0xc02a9000. ... The new kernel boot messages (from kernel.32): ... Apr 1 20:31:48 twoflower /kernel: CPU: i486 DX2 (486-class CPU) Apr 1 20:31:48 twoflower /kernel: Origin = "GenuineIntel" Id = 0x435 Stepping =5 Apr 1 20:31:48 twoflower /kernel: Features=0x3 Apr 1 20:31:48 twoflower /kernel: real memory = 16777216 (16384K bytes) Apr 1 20:31:48 twoflower /kernel: avail memory = 13914112 (13588K bytes) Apr 1 20:31:48 twoflower /kernel: Preloaded elf kernel "kernel" at 0xc02ac000. ... So it's 13600KB vs 13588K, which is pretty much the same. So, I think that ELF doesn't load the symbol table. From now on I'm going to build a bigger root partition and keep monster debugging kernels. Stephen. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 6: 1: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from silver.teardrop.net (silver.teardrop.net [216.155.28.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 44F2A14D12 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 06:00:58 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sno@teardrop.net) Received: from localhost (sno@localhost) by silver.teardrop.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id JAA36872 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 09:03:32 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from sno@teardrop.net) Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 09:03:32 -0500 (EST) From: James Snow To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Curiosity Killed the Array Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In working on a C program recently, I ran into some bugs, resolved them, and then in resolving them realized that there isn't any run-time checking of array boundaries. I thought this was kind of interesting and wondered about whether or not it could be a problem somehow. So I wrote a little C program that looks like this: void main( void ) { int array[10]; int i = 0; while ( 1 == 1) { array[i] = i; print("%d\n", i); i++; } } to see what would happen. Much to my suprise, it increments all the way to 400 or 500 or so and then cores. (Bus error, I think.) I thought about this for a while and came to the conclusion that the kernel allocates me a bit of space to work within and as long as I don't step outside that space, it doesn't care what I'm doing. OK, that makes sense. (To me anyway.) So then I wondered what would happen if I changed i++; to i--; When I ran it, it spews negative numbers as you would expect, but it just keeps going. Watching the process in top, it started sucking up swap and everything. It filled up the swap space on my box before the kernel jumped in and said 'Bad!' and killed it. So, I'm just curious as to the technical reasons behind this. (If anyone is bored and cares to explain this to someone who's recently gotten curious as to how the kernel does stuff.) TIA, -sno o - - - - - - - - - - - - - o - - - - - - - - - - - - o | We live in the short term | sno at teardrop dot org | | and hope for the best. | I am Geek. Hear me ^G | o - - - - - - - - - - - - - o - - - - - - - - - - - - o To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 7:25:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dorifer.heim3.tu-clausthal.de (dorifer.heim3.tu-clausthal.de [139.174.243.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4813214BD8 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 07:25:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from olli@dorifer.heim3.tu-clausthal.de) Received: (from olli@localhost) by dorifer.heim3.tu-clausthal.de (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA10899 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:24:48 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from olli) Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:24:48 +0200 (CEST) From: Oliver Fromme Message-Id: <199904011524.RAA10899@dorifer.heim3.tu-clausthal.de> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MFS Sizes over 470MB? Can't seem to do it... Newsgroups: list.freebsd-hackers Organization: Administration Heim 3 Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 RZTUC(3) PL2] Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey wrote in list.freebsd-hackers: > [...] > I mount /tmp from /etc/rc.local, and specify /dev/sd0b as the swap > partition, so it *should* give me 449 MB. Instead it gives me 30, > with no explanation. If I umount it and mount it again, I get the > full 449 MB (or I did last time I tried; that means stopping X, and I > don't want to do that). I had the same problem (on an older 3.0-current box). The datasize limit for "daemon" in /etc/login.conf turned out to be the problem; it was set to 32 Mb (daemons that were started from /etc/rc* ran with class "daemon"). I increased the limit, and everything worked fine. Regards Oliver -- Oliver Fromme, Leibnizstr. 18/61, 38678 Clausthal, Germany (Info: finger userinfo:olli@dorifer.heim3.tu-clausthal.de) "In jedem Stück Kohle wartet ein Diamant auf seine Geburt" (Terry Pratchett) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 7:25:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.43.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 034FA14FEF for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 07:25:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jwm@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU) Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (8.8.8/) via ESMTP id HAA14511 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 07:25:34 -0800 (PST) env-from (jwm@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU) Message-Id: <199904011525.HAA14511@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU> Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 07:25:33 -0800 From: John Milford Subject: Re: Curiosity Killed the Array Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ------- Blind-Carbon-Copy To: James Snow Cc: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Curiosity Killed the Array In-reply-to: Message from James Snow of "Thu, 01 Apr 1999 09:03:32 EST." Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 07:25:33 -0800 From: John Milford This is probably the wrong mailing list for this question, but I'll try to answer it anyway. I'm moving it to freebsd-questions as that seems to be the appropriate forum. This is because your array is on the stac and kernel automatcally grows the stack for you (up to the max stack size). If you move the array onto the heap you will get different behavior. --JOhn void main( void ) { int *array; int i = 0; array = (int *)malloc(10 * sizeof int); while ( 1 == 1) { array[i] = i; print("%d\n", i); i--; } } James Snow wrote: > > In working on a C program recently, I ran into some bugs, resolved them, > and then in resolving them realized that there isn't any run-time checking > of array boundaries. > > I thought this was kind of interesting and wondered about whether or not > it could be a problem somehow. So I wrote a little C program that looks > like this: > > void main( void ) { > int array[10]; > int i = 0; > while ( 1 == 1) { > array[i] = i; > print("%d\n", i); > i++; > } > } > > to see what would happen. Much to my suprise, it increments all the way to > 400 or 500 or so and then cores. (Bus error, I think.) > > I thought about this for a while and came to the conclusion that the > kernel allocates me a bit of space to work within and as long as I don't > step outside that space, it doesn't care what I'm doing. OK, that makes > sense. (To me anyway.) > > So then I wondered what would happen if I changed i++; to i--; > > When I ran it, it spews negative numbers as you would expect, but it just > keeps going. Watching the process in top, it started sucking up swap and > everything. It filled up the swap space on my box before the kernel jumped > in and said 'Bad!' and killed it. > > So, I'm just curious as to the technical reasons behind this. (If anyone > is bored and cares to explain this to someone who's recently gotten > curious as to how the kernel does stuff.) > > > TIA, > -sno > o - - - - - - - - - - - - - o - - - - - - - - - - - - o > | We live in the short term | sno at teardrop dot org | > | and hope for the best. | I am Geek. Hear me ^G | > o - - - - - - - - - - - - - o - - - - - - - - - - - - o > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message ------- End of Blind-Carbon-Copy To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 7:54:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E0F714E13 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 07:54:50 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id HAA58192; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 07:54:29 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 07:54:29 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904011554.HAA58192@apollo.backplane.com> To: James Snow Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Curiosity Killed the Array References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :In working on a C program recently, I ran into some bugs, resolved them, :and then in resolving them realized that there isn't any run-time checking :of array boundaries. C does not do run time checking on array boundries. :void main( void ) { : int array[10]; : int i = 0; : while ( 1 == 1) { : array[i] = i; : print("%d\n", i); : i++; : } :} C will happily allow you to overflow the array. What is happening is that the array is allocated on the stack. You are overwriting portions of the stack outside the array. If you forward index the array, you are wiping out pieces of the stack used by the function and by callers of main. This will work until you hit the top of the stack. Of course, by that time you've pretty much corrupted the program's stack so you are dead meat anyway. If you reverse index the array, you are wiping out pieces of the stack used by the function and then delving down into empty space ... essentially writing new data into unused portions of the stack. This will work until you hit the maximum stack size the system allows (see 'limit'). The system will not allow your program to go outside its own private address space, but the system will of course allow the program to overwrite most portions of its own private address space. The system has no idea whether an access to a valid memory location within the program is on purpose or due to a bug in the program :-) :So, I'm just curious as to the technical reasons behind this. (If anyone :is bored and cares to explain this to someone who's recently gotten :curious as to how the kernel does stuff.) : :TIA, :-sno -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 8:10:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua (ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua [212.42.68.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0DB114E65 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 08:10:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sobomax@altavista.net) Received: from vega. (async3-07.iptelecom.net.ua [212.42.68.207]) by ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA07690 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 19:10:22 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from sobomax@altavista.net) Received: from altavista.net (big_brother [192.168.1.1]) by vega. (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id TAA18315 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 19:03:21 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from sobomax@altavista.net) Message-ID: <370398F4.70041325@altavista.net> Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 19:04:04 +0300 From: Maxim Sobolev Reply-To: sobomax@altavista.net Organization: Vega International Capital X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: ru,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: PPPCTL for Win32 available! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, If anyone interested in integrating FreeBSD into Windows network here is my port of pppctl program on ftp://ftp.iptelecom.net.ua/incoming/pppctl-0_1.zip. Now it must be qualified as alpha level software, however it works well for me. It was ported using GNU Readline library and Cygwin32 toolchain. If anyone will found better location for it please drop me a line (my free homepage unfortunately doesn't working on uploading now). Any suggestions highly appreciated as well. Sincerely, Maxim Sobolev To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 9:37:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from atlrel2.hp.com (atlrel2.hp.com [156.153.255.202]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20D0B1561C; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 09:36:54 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from darrylo@sr.hp.com) Received: from srmail.sr.hp.com (srmail.sr.hp.com [15.4.45.14]) by atlrel2.hp.com (8.9.3/8.8.5tis) with ESMTP id MAA03099; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 12:35:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mina.sr.hp.com by srmail.sr.hp.com with ESMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA010518097; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 09:34:57 -0800 Received: from localhost (darrylo@mina.sr.hp.com [15.4.42.247]) by mina.sr.hp.com with ESMTP (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.7.3 TIS 5.0) id JAA27068; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 09:34:57 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199904011734.JAA27068@mina.sr.hp.com> To: Greg Lehey Cc: FreeBSD Hackers , FreeBSD SCSI Mailing List Subject: Re: CCD and Vinum compared with new performance measuring tool Reply-To: Darryl Okahata In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 01 Apr 1999 12:29:22 +0930." <19990401122922.Q413@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 1.1.1.1) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 09:34:56 -0800 From: Darryl Okahata Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey wrote: > In the past few weeks, I've been bitching about the fact that bonnie > doesn't do what I want in measuring storage device performance. I've > now solved the problem: I've written another program. You can pick it > up at ftp://ftp.lemis.com/pub/rawio.tar.gz. From the man page: I hope I'm wrong, but it appears that doing any of the write tests will destroy/corrupt any existing filesystem (and the write tests are enabled if no tests are specified). If so, you may want to make this very clear, as both bonnie and iozone will work file with existing filesystems. -- Darryl Okahata darrylo@sr.hp.com DISCLAIMER: this message is the author's personal opinion and does not constitute the support, opinion, or policy of Hewlett-Packard, or of the little green men that have been following him all day. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 10:25:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from poynting.physics.purdue.edu (poynting.physics.purdue.edu [128.210.146.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1797A14D03 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 10:25:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ajk@physics.purdue.edu) Received: from physics.purdue.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by poynting.physics.purdue.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA28557 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 13:24:42 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from ajk@physics.purdue.edu) Message-Id: <199904011824.NAA28557@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: [PATCH] Auto-login support for getty From: "Andrew J. Korty" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----- =_aaaaaaaaaa0" Content-ID: <28550.922991081.0@physics.purdue.edu> Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 13:24:41 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ------- =_aaaaaaaaaa0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <28550.922991081.1@physics.purdue.edu> We run a localism called "autologin" that does nothing more than keep a shell up on the console. It runs on all our servers, whose consoles are connected to our console server. Autologin is run from /etc/ttys, so when the shell exits, another one pops up. This way, we're almost guaranteed to have a root shell. (Physical and network access to the console server is controlled, of course.) When porting autologin to FreeBSD, we noticed that it has to replicate much code that already exists in getty. My colleague remarked that we ought to just add an option to getty to do what we want. So I did, and I'm presenting the results here because I think it would be a worthwhile commit. (I don't have privs.) This patch adds a string capability ("al") to getty. Setting it to a username gives you a persistent shell without prompting for login or password. The code is very simple; it just passes the -f option to the login program. These are against 3.1-RELEASE; if newer diffs are needed, I can do that. One more upshot: if you have an operations staff, they can be root on console without having to know the root password. When a crisis occurs, you can call the op center and talk them through. Andrew J. Korty, Director http://www.physics.purdue.edu/~ajk/ Physics Computer Network 85 73 1F 04 63 D9 9D 65 Purdue University 65 2E 7A A8 81 8C 45 75 ------- =_aaaaaaaaaa0 Content-Type: application/x-patch Content-ID: <28550.922991081.2@physics.purdue.edu> Content-Description: Auto-login support for getty ? autologin.diff Index: gettytab.5 =================================================================== RCS file: /project/cvs/PCN/freebsd/src/libexec/getty/gettytab.5,v retrieving revision 1.1.1.1 retrieving revision 1.2 diff -u -r1.1.1.1 -r1.2 --- gettytab.5 1998/12/03 15:38:11 1.1.1.1 +++ gettytab.5 1999/04/01 13:18:50 1.2 @@ -79,6 +79,7 @@ .Bl -column Namexx /usr/bin/login Default .It Sy Name Type Default Description .It "ac str unused expect-send chat script for modem answer" +.It "al str unused user to auto-login instead of prompting" .It "ap bool false terminal uses any parity" .It "bk str 0377 alternate end of line character (input break)" .It "c0 num unused tty control flags to write messages" Index: gettytab.h =================================================================== RCS file: /project/cvs/PCN/freebsd/src/libexec/getty/gettytab.h,v retrieving revision 1.1.1.1 retrieving revision 1.2 diff -u -r1.1.1.1 -r1.2 --- gettytab.h 1998/12/03 15:38:11 1.1.1.1 +++ gettytab.h 1999/04/01 13:18:50 1.2 @@ -90,6 +90,7 @@ #define IF gettystrs[26].value #define IC gettystrs[27].value #define AC gettystrs[28].value +#define AL gettystrs[29].value /* * Numeric definitions. Index: init.c =================================================================== RCS file: /project/cvs/PCN/freebsd/src/libexec/getty/init.c,v retrieving revision 1.1.1.1 retrieving revision 1.2 diff -u -r1.1.1.1 -r1.2 --- init.c 1998/12/03 15:38:11 1.1.1.1 +++ init.c 1999/04/01 13:18:50 1.2 @@ -83,6 +83,7 @@ { "if" }, /* sysv-like 'issue' filename */ { "ic" }, /* modem init-chat */ { "ac" }, /* modem answer-chat */ + { "al" }, /* user to auto-login */ { 0 } }; Index: main.c =================================================================== RCS file: /project/cvs/PCN/freebsd/src/libexec/getty/main.c,v retrieving revision 1.1.1.1 retrieving revision 1.2 diff -u -r1.1.1.1 -r1.2 --- main.c 1998/12/03 15:38:11 1.1.1.1 +++ main.c 1999/04/01 13:18:51 1.2 @@ -348,13 +348,29 @@ signal(SIGALRM, dingdong); alarm(TO); } - if ((rval = getname()) == 2) { + if (AL) { + const char *p = AL; + char *q = name; + int n = sizeof name; + + while (*p && q < &name[sizeof name - 1]) { + if (isupper(*p)) + upper = 1; + else if (islower(*p)) + lower = 1; + else if (isdigit(*p)) + digit++; + *q++ = *p++; + } + } else + rval = getname(); + if (rval == 2) { oflush(); alarm(0); execle(PP, "ppplogin", ttyn, (char *) 0, env); syslog(LOG_ERR, "%s: %m", PP); exit(1); - } else if (rval) { + } else if (rval || AL) { register int i; oflush(); @@ -389,7 +405,8 @@ limit.rlim_max = RLIM_INFINITY; limit.rlim_cur = RLIM_INFINITY; (void)setrlimit(RLIMIT_CPU, &limit); - execle(LO, "login", "-p", name, (char *) 0, env); + execle(LO, "login", AL ? "-fp" : "-p", name, + (char *) 0, env); syslog(LOG_ERR, "%s: %m", LO); exit(1); } ------- =_aaaaaaaaaa0-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 10:54:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from silver.teardrop.net (silver.teardrop.net [216.155.28.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8115D15D46 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 10:54:30 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sno@teardrop.org) Received: from localhost (sno@localhost) by silver.teardrop.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id NAA41142 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 13:57:01 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from sno@teardrop.org) Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 13:57:01 -0500 (EST) From: James Snow X-Sender: sno@silver.teardrop.net To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: That Array Thing Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Just to quickly and generically reply to everyone who wrote to me about my curiosity and my array: Apologies if it wasn't the correct list, but my question wasn't really about C, it was more about how the FreeBSD kernel does stuff with a process and how that process is laid out in memory. What gets overwritten, why did the process start sucking up swap, etc. All in all though, your replies answered my question and cleared up some of my understanding of kernel process management. And yes, I know that no C program would be written like that. That's why I wrote it that way. :) Thanks and sorry for the noise. -sno o - - - - - - - - - - - - - o - - - - - - - - - - - - o | We live in the short term | sno at teardrop dot org | | and hope for the best. | I am Geek. Hear me ^G | o - - - - - - - - - - - - - o - - - - - - - - - - - - o To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 12:10: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 325EF1527A for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 12:09:47 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id PAA05275; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 15:09:17 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199904012009.PAA05275@cs.rpi.edu> To: Matthew Dillon Cc: "David E. Cross" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, schimken@cs.rpi.edu, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: More death to nfsiod (workarround) In-Reply-To: Message from Matthew Dillon of "Tue, 30 Mar 1999 22:24:45 PST." <199903310624.WAA45232@apollo.backplane.com> Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 15:09:17 -0500 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > AMD is a rather complex piece of software. It's creating a situation > that the kernel isn't happy with but I really don't have time to delve > into it ( anyone else care to take a shot at it? ) on top of everything > else I'm doing. If there is any way you can avoid using AMD, I would > avoid using AMD. Late yesterday I was able to determine how amd was mounting the partitions, and I was able to replicate it with a hand-mounted filesystem. I was in the process of digging through NFS packets between 2 hosts when I made the observation "Hey, this isn't UDP". I then hand mounted a filesytstem with "mount_nfs -2T -r 8192 -w 8192 server:/path /mnt" ran my test, and it failed :) Since then I have updated AMD to use vers3/UDP for mounts, and guess what, so far the problem has not come back. I have run the test 4 times now, not a single failure, and it is *FAST*. To tickle this you need to have a relatively fast connect between the NFS client and server (switched half duplex 10M segment was enough to do it, although the primary machine that was having the problem was dedicated 100M full-duplex). I am able to reproduce this with relative ease here. (mount_nfs -3T -r 8192 -w 8192 ... also seemed to work) -- David Cross To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 12:42:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C506314EBD for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 12:42:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id MAA59589; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 12:42:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 12:42:09 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904012042.MAA59589@apollo.backplane.com> To: "David E. Cross" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, schimken@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: More death to nfsiod (workarround) References: <199904012009.PAA05275@cs.rpi.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> AMD is a rather complex piece of software. It's creating a situation :> that the kernel isn't happy with but I really don't have time to delve :> into it ( anyone else care to take a shot at it? ) on top of everything :> else I'm doing. If there is any way you can avoid using AMD, I would :> avoid using AMD. :Late yesterday I was able to determine how amd was mounting the partitions, :and I was able to replicate it with a hand-mounted filesystem. I was in the :process of digging through NFS packets between 2 hosts when I made the :observation "Hey, this isn't UDP". I then hand mounted a filesytstem with :"mount_nfs -2T -r 8192 -w 8192 server:/path /mnt" ran my test, and it failed :) There are lots of areas of NFS that need work, and TCP is one of them. I think there is a fairly good chance that we can solve the TCP problems. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 14:18:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from panzer.plutotech.com (panzer.plutotech.com [206.168.67.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4453A14D5C for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 14:18:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ken@panzer.plutotech.com) Received: (from ken@localhost) by panzer.plutotech.com (8.9.3/8.8.5) id PAA04791; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 15:17:41 -0700 (MST) From: "Kenneth D. Merry" Message-Id: <199904012217.PAA04791@panzer.plutotech.com> Subject: Re: More death to nfsiod (workarround) In-Reply-To: <199904012009.PAA05275@cs.rpi.edu> from "David E. Cross" at "Apr 1, 1999 3: 9:17 pm" To: crossd@cs.rpi.edu (David E. Cross) Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 15:17:41 -0700 (MST) Cc: dillon@apollo.backplane.com, crossd@cs.rpi.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, schimken@cs.rpi.edu X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG David E. Cross wrote... > > AMD is a rather complex piece of software. It's creating a situation > > that the kernel isn't happy with but I really don't have time to delve > > into it ( anyone else care to take a shot at it? ) on top of everything > > else I'm doing. If there is any way you can avoid using AMD, I would > > avoid using AMD. > Late yesterday I was able to determine how amd was mounting the partitions, > and I was able to replicate it with a hand-mounted filesystem. I was in the > process of digging through NFS packets between 2 hosts when I made the > observation "Hey, this isn't UDP". I then hand mounted a filesytstem with > "mount_nfs -2T -r 8192 -w 8192 server:/path /mnt" ran my test, and it failed :) > > Since then I have updated AMD to use vers3/UDP for mounts, and guess what, so > far the problem has not come back. I have run the test 4 times now, not a > single failure, and it is *FAST*. To tickle this you need to have a relatively > fast connect between the NFS client and server (switched half duplex 10M > segment was enough to do it, although the primary machine that was having the > problem was dedicated 100M full-duplex). I am able to reproduce this with > relative ease here. > > (mount_nfs -3T -r 8192 -w 8192 ... also seemed to work) Yeah, I upgraded a number of machines (30+) to -stable about 10 days ago, and was irritated to discover that AMD defaulted to TCP mounts. I put proto=udp in the amd configuration files, and things got back to normal. I had some hang problems with TCP mounts under amd, but that may have also been because of a routing problem I fixed at the same time that I changed from TCP mounts to UDP. And, I'll have to say that NFS is much better than it has been in the past. Ken -- Kenneth Merry ken@plutotech.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 16: 6:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net (smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net [199.45.39.156]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7BA9D15502 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 16:06:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from babkin@bellatlantic.net) Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-117-165.bellatlantic.net [151.198.117.165]) by smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id TAA10838; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 19:05:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <37040BB7.56E25907@bellatlantic.net> Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 19:13:43 -0500 From: Sergey Babkin X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.0-980222-SNAP i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Wes Peters Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Y2K issue References: <3702BF79.EE5801AE@bellatlantic.net> <37031575.F7A2399D@softweyr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Wes Peters wrote: > > I do some Y2K testing for my employer, so I have run some of the Y2K > > tests on FreeBSD too. In particular, this one: > > > > ftp://ftp.rdg.opengroup.org/pub/unsupported/stdtools/y2k/ > > > > This directory contains two small tests for the data conversion functions, > > getdate() and strptime(). Getdate() seems to not be supported in FreeBSD > > at all, so it's not a Y2K issue although probably a POSIX conformance > > issue. But strptime() fails. It is supposed to understand the 2-digit > > year from 0 to 38 as years 2000 to 2038. > > Sez who? strptime behaves exactly as the man page says: Sez the Open Group. > > %G is replaced by a year as a decimal number with century. This year > is the one that contains the greater part of the week (Monday as > the first day of the week). > > %g is replaced by the same year as in ``%G'', but as a decimal number > without century (00-99). > > [...] > > %Y is replaced by the year with century as a decimal number. > > %y is replaced by the year without century as a decimal number > (00-99). > > I don't see what could be much more explicit than that. Right, but the man page says about _printing_ in strftime() which can just drop the century. Strptime() is used for parsing, so it has to guess the century from the last two digits. POSIX says that the years 70-99 should be understood as 1970-1999, 00-38 as 2000-2038 and the 39-69 may be understood in either way. This is the thing that users expect, if someone will use the year 01 he obviously will mean 2001, not 1901. -SB To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 16: 6:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8BC6E15613; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 16:06:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id JAA14549; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 09:36:00 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id JAA93217; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 09:35:57 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990402093557.F413@lemis.com> Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 09:35:57 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Darryl Okahata Cc: FreeBSD Hackers , FreeBSD SCSI Mailing List Subject: HEADS UP (was: CCD and Vinum compared with new performance measuring tool) References: <19990401122922.Q413@lemis.com> <199904011734.JAA27068@mina.sr.hp.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904011734.JAA27068@mina.sr.hp.com>; from Darryl Okahata on Thu, Apr 01, 1999 at 09:34:56AM -0800 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday, 1 April 1999 at 9:34:56 -0800, Darryl Okahata wrote: > Greg Lehey wrote: > >> In the past few weeks, I've been bitching about the fact that bonnie >> doesn't do what I want in measuring storage device performance. I've >> now solved the problem: I've written another program. You can pick it >> up at ftp://ftp.lemis.com/pub/rawio.tar.gz. From the man page: > > I hope I'm wrong, but it appears that doing any of the write tests > will destroy/corrupt any existing filesystem (and the write tests are > enabled if no tests are specified). If so, you may want to make this > very clear, as both bonnie and iozone will work file with existing > filesystems. No, you're right. And yes, I've updated the man page to warn about the overwriting, and I've changed the default to read-only. The new version is available at the same place, ftp://ftp.lemis.com/pub/rawio.tar.gz. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 16:33:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quack.kfu.com (quack.kfu.com [170.1.70.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F570151DE for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 16:33:45 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nsayer@medusa.kfu.com) Received: from medusa.kfu.com (medusa.kfu.com [170.1.70.5]) by quack.kfu.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA00416 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 16:33:29 -0800 (PST) Received: (from nsayer@localhost) by medusa.kfu.com (8.9.2/8.8.8) id QAA09981 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 16:33:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nsayer) Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 16:33:25 -0800 (PST) From: Nick Sayer Message-Id: <199904020033.QAA09981@medusa.kfu.com> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Suggestion: loosen slightly securelevel>1 time change restriction Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At the moment, setting the time to any point in the past (that is, if the delta being applied is negative) is not allowed if the securelevel of the system is >1. The problem with this is that even if you run ntpdate at boot time, xntpd can occasionally want to make small negative steps. I suggest easing up slightly on the restriction. Say, negative steps of more than a minute are disallowed. It would seem to me that this would let xntpd operate correctly in most cases while still denying the opportunity for serious mischief to hackers desiring to wreak havoc with time warps. Comments? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 16:42:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailhub.psn.ie (mailhub.psn.ie [194.106.150.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8E48152F5 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 16:42:28 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ad@psn.ie) Received: from vmunix.psn.ie ([194.106.150.252]) by mailhub.psn.ie with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #3) id 10Ss21-00011u-00; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 01:41:57 +0100 Received: from localhost.psn.ie ([127.0.0.1] helo=localhost) by vmunix.psn.ie with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #1) id 10Ss2y-00006E-00; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 01:42:56 +0100 Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 01:42:56 +0100 (IST) From: Andy Doran To: Nick Sayer Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Suggestion: loosen slightly securelevel>1 time change restriction In-Reply-To: <199904020033.QAA09981@medusa.kfu.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 1 Apr 1999, Nick Sayer wrote: > > I suggest easing up slightly on the restriction. Say, negative steps of > more than a minute are disallowed. It would seem to me that this would > let xntpd operate correctly in most cases while still denying the > opportunity for serious mischief to hackers desiring to wreak havoc > with time warps. > What if you continiously set the time back 59 seconds? If you made this change, you'd need restrictions on how *often* the time is changed too. Also, xntpd/ntpdate would have to be intelligent enough to know that it can't set the time back more than the limit. Andy. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 17:26: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com (gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com [207.113.159.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A9E314F98 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:26:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gdonl@tsc.tdk.com) Received: from sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com (root@sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com [192.168.241.191]) by gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA11942; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:25:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gdonl@tsc.tdk.com) Received: from salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com (salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com [192.168.241.194]) by sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA16994; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:25:22 -0800 (PST) Received: (from gdonl@localhost) by salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA29744; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:25:21 -0800 (PST) From: Don Lewis Message-Id: <199904020125.RAA29744@salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com> Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:25:21 -0800 In-Reply-To: Andy Doran "Re: Suggestion: loosen slightly securelevel>1 time change restriction" (Apr 2, 1:42am) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(3) 7/19/95) To: Andy Doran , Nick Sayer Subject: Re: Suggestion: loosen slightly securelevel>1 time change restriction Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Apr 2, 1:42am, Andy Doran wrote: } Subject: Re: Suggestion: loosen slightly securelevel>1 time change restric } On Thu, 1 Apr 1999, Nick Sayer wrote: } > } > I suggest easing up slightly on the restriction. Say, negative steps of } > more than a minute are disallowed. It would seem to me that this would } > let xntpd operate correctly in most cases while still denying the } > opportunity for serious mischief to hackers desiring to wreak havoc } > with time warps. I think that a minute is too much. A second or so should be plenty. Maybe this should be a system tuneable that can't be changed when securelevel > 0. } What if you continiously set the time back 59 seconds? If you made this } change, you'd need restrictions on how *often* the time is changed too. How about preventing a negative step from setting the time back further than the most recent negative step? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 17:30:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10E2814F98 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:30:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id RAA61810; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:30:10 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:30:10 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904020130.RAA61810@apollo.backplane.com> To: Nick Sayer Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Suggestion: loosen slightly securelevel>1 time change restriction References: <199904020033.QAA09981@medusa.kfu.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :At the moment, setting the time to any point in the past (that is, :if the delta being applied is negative) is not allowed if the securelevel :of the system is >1. : :The problem with this is that even if you run ntpdate at boot time, :xntpd can occasionally want to make small negative steps. : :I suggest easing up slightly on the restriction. Say, negative steps of :more than a minute are disallowed. It would seem to me that this would :let xntpd operate correctly in most cases while still denying the :opportunity for serious mischief to hackers desiring to wreak havoc :with time warps. : :Comments? We should remove the securelevel code that prevents the date from being set backwards. It's stupid code and doesn't work anyway... you can set the date forward enough times to wrap it. Also consider the fact that Kerberos will fail of the time isn't synchronized between machines and that NFS and many other subsystems will do weird things when the time is out of sync between machines. The 'protection' that securelevel is giving us, in regards to the time, is zip. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 17:37:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kithrup.com (kithrup.com [205.179.156.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C426154E3 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:37:52 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sef@kithrup.com) Received: (from sef@localhost) by kithrup.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA18306; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:37:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sef) Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:37:34 -0800 (PST) From: Sean Eric Fagan Message-Id: <199904020137.RAA18306@kithrup.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Suggestion: loosen slightly securelevel>1 time change restriction In-Reply-To: <199904020130.RAA61810.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@apollo.backplane.com> References: <199904020033.QAA09981@medusa.kfu.com> Organization: Kithrup Enterprises, Ltd. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article <199904020130.RAA61810.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@apollo.backplane.com> you write: > the fact that Kerberos will fail of the time isn't synchronized between > machines and that NFS and many other subsystems will do weird things > when the time is out of sync between machines. The 'protection' > that securelevel is giving us, in regards to the time, is zip. I can't tell if this is an april fool's joke as well. The purpose of prohibiting setting the time backwards is to prevent a cracker from changing the ctime of a file to before he actually changed it. This change means you can do security audits more easily. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 17:53:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from implode.root.com (root.com [209.102.106.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CAFB15104 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:53:21 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from root@implode.root.com) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA00499; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:52:47 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199904020152.RAA00499@implode.root.com> To: Nick Sayer Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Suggestion: loosen slightly securelevel>1 time change restriction In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 01 Apr 1999 16:33:25 PST." <199904020033.QAA09981@medusa.kfu.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 17:52:47 -0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >At the moment, setting the time to any point in the past (that is, >if the delta being applied is negative) is not allowed if the securelevel >of the system is >1. > >The problem with this is that even if you run ntpdate at boot time, >xntpd can occasionally want to make small negative steps. > >I suggest easing up slightly on the restriction. Say, negative steps of >more than a minute are disallowed. It would seem to me that this would >let xntpd operate correctly in most cases while still denying the >opportunity for serious mischief to hackers desiring to wreak havoc >with time warps. > >Comments? So if I want to go back an hour, I just do 60 settimeofday() calls. I don't think this is a solution. -DG David Greenman Co-founder/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 18:11:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6A161521C for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 18:11:12 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA01387; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 18:03:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904020203.SAA01387@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Graham Wheeler Cc: Mike Smith , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Changing param.c for different environments In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 30 Mar 1999 10:31:31 +0200." <37008BE3.C4AC882B@cdsec.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 18:03:53 -0800 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Mike Smith wrote: > > > > FWIW, I am slowly pulling the items specified in param.c into such a > > shape that they can be individually tuned (from the bootloader). > > > > This is, unfortunately, going to be a 3+ -ism only. > > Still, that's good news (we won't use 2.2.7 for ever). It would still > be useful to have some real world examples from big sites. For example, > the Walnut Creek FTP server itself... The issue is mostly just that the various paramters tend to be pushed around to suit the behaviour of a given system, and that doesn't really tend to follow the "generic" application of a system much. > And does anyone know how these parameters are tuned in NetBSD and > OpenBSD? Are they also statically predefined before kernel compilation, > or tuneable at boot? And are they a function of MAXUSERS, or a more > complex function of MAXUSERS, available RAM, etc? OpenBSD/NetBSD use the static configuration like we used to; the boot-time tunables are my recent additions. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 18:18: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A68BA1517F for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 18:18:08 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id SAA63090; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 18:17:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 18:17:48 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904020217.SAA63090@apollo.backplane.com> To: Sean Eric Fagan Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Suggestion: loosen slightly securelevel>1 time change restriction References: <199904020033.QAA09981@medusa.kfu.com> <199904020137.RAA18306@kithrup.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :In article <199904020130.RAA61810.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@apollo.backplane.com> you write: :> the fact that Kerberos will fail of the time isn't synchronized between :> machines and that NFS and many other subsystems will do weird things :> when the time is out of sync between machines. The 'protection' :> that securelevel is giving us, in regards to the time, is zip. : :I can't tell if this is an april fool's joke as well. : :The purpose of prohibiting setting the time backwards is to prevent a cracker :from changing the ctime of a file to before he actually changed it. This :change means you can do security audits more easily. The current securelevel solution is a half-assed solution, IMHO. It creates more problems then it solves. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 19:25:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from shell.futuresouth.com (shell.futuresouth.com [198.78.58.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CDBF714CE4 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 19:25:29 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from fullermd@futuresouth.com) Received: (from fullermd@localhost) by shell.futuresouth.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA09994; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 21:24:56 -0600 (CST) Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 21:24:56 -0600 From: "Matthew D. Fuller" To: Greg Lehey Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) Message-ID: <19990401212456.J11572@futuresouth.com> References: <19990331003535.E17547@futuresouth.com> <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Wed, Mar 31, 1999 at 04:51:39PM +0930 X-OS: FreeBSD Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Mar 31, 1999 at 04:51:39PM +0930, a little birdie told me that Greg Lehey remarked > > Here are some comparative figures for building a kernel on my main > machine (AMD K6-2/333, 160 MB memory): > > normal debug > Make all 4:30 5:0 > Kernel size 1.8 MB 9 MB > Directory size 5.5 MB 24 MB Well, to return to my original question about the base system... The kernel seems to be about 4.5x as big with debugging symbols. If we assume (perhaps a flawed assumption) that an approximately 5x ratio will hold throughout the system... 48 dev 669 etc 680 lkm 2068 root 6088 sbin 3357 bin 1784 stand I'm guessing /modules will be about the same as /lkm, so we're talking about somewhere in the realm of perhaps 15 megs in /. Be generous and call it 30 for safety. If everything is 5x bigger, that's 150 megs to hold it with -g (in reality less, because -g won't affect the size of text files in /etc, /dev files, all the extra stuff I have in /root, etc). So, if I left a 150-200 meg / partition (assume /var and /tmp, as well as /usr are seperate), would that be generally big enough to hold the full system with -g? /usr is another story of course, but if these proportions hold for /, I'd guess they'll hold for /usr and I can work from there. --- *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* | Matthew Fuller http://www.over-yonder.net/ | * fullermd@futuresouth.com fullermd@over-yonder.net * | UNIX Systems Administrator Specializing in FreeBSD | * FutureSouth Communications ISPHelp ISP Consulting * | "The only reason I'm burning my candle at both ends, | * is because I haven't figured out how to light the * | middle yet" | *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 1 20: 7:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7088A151E6 for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 20:07:21 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id XAA13920; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 23:06:55 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199904020406.XAA13920@cs.rpi.edu> To: "Kenneth D. Merry" Cc: crossd@cs.rpi.edu (David E. Cross), dillon@apollo.backplane.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, schimken@cs.rpi.edu, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: More death to nfsiod (workarround) In-Reply-To: Message from "Kenneth D. Merry" of "Thu, 01 Apr 1999 15:17:41 MST." <199904012217.PAA04791@panzer.plutotech.com> Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 23:06:55 -0500 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > AMD is a rather complex piece of software. It's creating a situation > > > that the kernel isn't happy with but I really don't have time to delve > > > into it ( anyone else care to take a shot at it? ) on top of everything > > > else I'm doing. If there is any way you can avoid using AMD, I would > > > avoid using AMD. > > Late yesterday I was able to determine how amd was mounting the partitions, > > and I was able to replicate it with a hand-mounted filesystem. I was in the > > process of digging through NFS packets between 2 hosts when I made the > > observation "Hey, this isn't UDP". I then hand mounted a filesytstem with > > "mount_nfs -2T -r 8192 -w 8192 server:/path /mnt" ran my test, and it failed :) > > > > Since then I have updated AMD to use vers3/UDP for mounts, and guess what, so > > far the problem has not come back. I have run the test 4 times now, not a > > single failure, and it is *FAST*. To tickle this you need to have a relatively > > fast connect between the NFS client and server (switched half duplex 10M > > segment was enough to do it, although the primary machine that was having the > > problem was dedicated 100M full-duplex). I am able to reproduce this with > > relative ease here. > > > > (mount_nfs -3T -r 8192 -w 8192 ... also seemed to work) > > Yeah, I upgraded a number of machines (30+) to -stable about 10 days ago, > and was irritated to discover that AMD defaulted to TCP mounts. > > I put proto=udp in the amd configuration files, and things got back to > normal. I had some hang problems with TCP mounts under amd, but that may > have also been because of a routing problem I fixed at the same time that > I changed from TCP mounts to UDP. > > And, I'll have to say that NFS is much better than it has been in the past. We had hang problems as well. I can reproduce those too (they are not really hangs, they are more pauses, the machine pauses for ~45 minutes in a deadlock condition(I am guessing), then seems to come out of it. A wee bit annoying. I am fairly all of these problems are not with AMD per-se but the kernel NFS/TCP implementation... mind you I have *never* seen (Solaris/SGI/Linux) a working NFS/TCP implementation. Irritated is not the correct word to describe me finding out that AMD had switched from using UDP to TCP as the default (I am also on the amd-dev list, and there was discussion of amd being modified to not use TCP on machines that didn't handle it well, so I had assumed that it wasn't using TCP.. *bad*). I have a packet trace of 221 packets that cause a spurious NFS problem... not sure which one anymore. If people think it would be of benefit I can continue to analyze it, or hand it off to somone to analyze. I feel the problem is entirely client side though, so it won't show up in what I have. I am also going to email amd-dev asking Erez to have freeBSD be NFSv3/UDP by default. -- David Cross To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 5:38:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from darkside.magda.ru (darkside.magda.ru [194.85.102.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A209714CB3 for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 05:38:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from main@main.ru) Received: from [194.85.102.164] ([194.85.102.164]:11781 "HELO main.ru" ident: "TIMEDOUT") by darkside.magda.ru with SMTP id <119390-265>; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 17:40:17 +0400 Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 17:37:03 +0400 From: anatoly v ivanov X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.21) UNREG Reply-To: anatoly v ivanov Organization: MAIN.RU X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1734.990402@main.ru> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: DummyNET Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, When i'm adding "add pipe N tcp from any to any via ed1" rule to my firewall, I'm getting a strange effect: default gateway disappears and (of course) network is down, until I directly send packets to it. Of course, I can avoid this rules, but I like this idea: limiting default bandwidth via interface. Any ideas? --- avi PS: I'm getting such effect on 3.0-R & 3.1-R & in the different networks. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 5:49:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 5414914CB3 for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 05:49:08 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id NAA18417; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 13:28:42 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199904021128.NAA18417@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: DummyNET To: main@main.ru Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 13:28:41 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <1734.990402@main.ru> from "anatoly v ivanov" at Apr 2, 99 05:36:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 835 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Hi, > > When i'm adding "add pipe N tcp from any to any via ed1" > rule to my firewall, I'm getting a strange effect: > default gateway disappears and (of course) network is down, > until I directly send packets to it. there have been some fixes recently in dummynet to address this problem. i think you can just upgrade ip_output.c and things should work fine. it took some time to understand the problem, it was Emmanuel Duros who pointed me to the right direction cheers luigi > Of course, I can avoid this rules, but I like this idea: > limiting default bandwidth via interface. > > Any ideas? > > --- avi > > PS: I'm getting such effect on 3.0-R & 3.1-R & in the different > networks. > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 6:32:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.aprcity.ru (unknown [194.85.132.55]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 3E54C14D6D for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 06:32:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from zaitsev@mail.aprcity.ru) Received: by mail.aprcity.ru(Lotus SMTP MTA v4.6.1 (569.2 2-6-1998)) id C3256747.004FB10E ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 18:30:26 +0400 X-Lotus-FromDomain: APRCITY From: zaitsev@mail.aprcity.ru To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Message-ID: Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 18:30:21 +0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG auth 4e17822f subscribe freebsd-hackers zaitsev@mail.aprcity.ru Please, help! I just installed FreeBSD3.1-release and try to use sendmail. It's look like impossible. When I try to send email the sendmail brings message "reject=550 Relaying denied". I don't something with /etc/sendmail.conf, it has been untouched after succesful install. Early I had not have such problem with sendmail under FreeBSD 2.2.X with default config. How to fix it? I don't need SPAM filtering at all or something like options - simple email. Please answer to zaitsev@mail.aprcity.ru zaitsev@aprcity.ru after upgrade does not work. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 9: 7:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail1.its.rpi.edu (mail1.its.rpi.edu [128.113.100.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52BFD14C9E for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 09:07:54 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from drosih@rpi.edu) Received: from [128.113.24.47] (gilead.acs.rpi.edu [128.113.24.47]) by mail1.its.rpi.edu (8.8.8/8.8.6) with ESMTP id MAA167088; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 12:07:28 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Sender: drosih@pop1.rpi.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199904020033.QAA09981@medusa.kfu.com> Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 12:07:25 -0500 To: Nick Sayer , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: Garance A Drosihn Subject: Re: Suggestion: loosen slightly securelevel>1 time change restriction Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 4:33 PM -0800 4/1/99, Nick Sayer wrote: > [...] setting the time to any point in the past (...) is not allowed > if the securelevel of the system is >1. The problem with this is that > even if you run ntpdate at boot time, xntpd can occasionally want to > make small negative steps. > > I suggest easing up slightly on the restriction. Say, negative steps > of more than a minute are disallowed. I understand the problem you're interested in, but that's the wrong solution... Of course, that begs the question "What is the right solution?". If someone has a PC which does have a slightly-fast clock, how can that be handled under securelevels>1? I am not using securelevels yet, but it's something I do hope to look into at some point. My PC does gain about a second a day. Need a solution something more like 'you can never jump back more than 1 second prior to the maximum value of time ever seen after the machine switched into securelevel'... (and attempts to do more than one second will only change the clock by one second). At that point, the worst an evil hacker could do is keep time from going forward (by running an infinite loop of setting the time back), but they couldn't really screw around with setting older time values. --- Garance Alistair Drosehn = gad@eclipse.acs.rpi.edu Senior Systems Programmer or drosih@rpi.edu Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 9:16:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail1.its.rpi.edu (mail1.its.rpi.edu [128.113.100.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A7CC14CB1 for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 09:15:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from drosih@rpi.edu) Received: from [128.113.24.47] (gilead.acs.rpi.edu [128.113.24.47]) by mail1.its.rpi.edu (8.8.8/8.8.6) with ESMTP id MAA152946; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 12:15:36 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Sender: drosih@pop1.rpi.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199904020130.RAA61810@apollo.backplane.com> References: <199904020033.QAA09981@medusa.kfu.com> Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 12:15:33 -0500 To: Matthew Dillon , Nick Sayer From: Garance A Drosihn Subject: Re: Suggestion: loosen slightly securelevel>1 time change restriction Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 5:30 PM -0800 4/1/99, Matthew Dillon wrote: > We should remove the securelevel code that prevents the date from > being set backwards. It's stupid code and doesn't work anyway... > you can set the date forward enough times to wrap it. Well, obviously it would be nice to fix *that* problem, separate from whether one is allowed to set time backwards by an explicit backwards request. > Also consider the fact that Kerberos will fail of the time isn't > synchronized between machines and that NFS and many other > subsystems will do weird things when the time is out of sync > between machines. Do any securelevel's put any limitations on setting time forwards? It would be nice if some check could be made to prevent 'obviously' bad forward-jumps too, but I can't think of a plausibly reliable way to determine that a forward-jump is 'obviously' bad... --- Garance Alistair Drosehn = gad@eclipse.acs.rpi.edu Senior Systems Programmer or drosih@rpi.edu Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 10:10:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bingsun2.cc.binghamton.edu (bingsun2.cc.binghamton.edu [128.226.1.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F16E615054 for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 10:10:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bf20761@binghamton.edu) Received: from localhost (bf20761@localhost) by bingsun2.cc.binghamton.edu (8.8.7/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA10848 for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 13:10:25 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 13:10:25 -0500 (EST) From: zhihuizhang X-Sender: bf20761@bingsun2 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Question of #ifdef __i386__ Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I am wondering whether "#ifdef __i386__" is created because of the following line at the beginning of the file i386/conf/GENERIC: machine "i386" If so, what source code is responsible for translating it into "#ifdef __i386__"? Thanks a lot. -------------------------------------------------- | Zhihui Zhang, http://cs.binghamton.edu/~zzhang | | Dept. of Computer Science, SUNY at Binghamton | -------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 11:25:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from addr2.addr.com (addr.com [209.249.147.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3902414CA9 for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 11:25:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from admin@addr.net) Received: from comp3.addr.com ([209.152.191.146]) by addr2.addr.com (8.9.2/8.9.1) with SMTP id LAA33198 for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 11:26:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from admin@addr.net) Message-Id: <4.1.19990402112404.0267b120@mail.addr.com> X-Sender: addr@mail.addr.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Fri, 02 Apr 1999 11:25:33 -0800 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Addr.com Web Hosting" Subject: Kernel panic question. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, Recently I received the following kernel panic. I was wondering if anyone has any thoughts or comments on this before I investigate further myself. The system is a dual PII 400 with 1GB ram and an internal DPT raid controller running several mirrored disks. Maxusers for the kernel is set to 256, which I know is low, but anything above that makes the system unstable (512 makes it panic every hour!). The system is running FreeBSD 3.0-Release. The system is very stable in general, and is running high load and with very diverse applications (http, https, sendmail, ftpd, ipop3d, all the possible cgi scripts in this world and many more), however a panic like this does occur once every few weeks. Sorry, no core dump for this one, since I can't replicate the scenario. Any help, comments or general information would be greatly appreciated. Fatal trap 12: page fault while in kernel mode mp_lock = 00000002; cpuid = 0; lapic.id = 00000000 fault virtual address = 0x30 fault code = supervisor write, page not present instruction pointer = 0x8:0xf020ba9d stack pointer = 0x10:0xfe3e1ebc frame pointer = 0x10:0xfe3e1ecc code segment = base 0x0, limit 0xfffff, type 0x1b = DPL 0, pres 1, def32 1, gran 1 processor eflags = interrupt enabled, resume, IOPL = 0 current process = 25908 (dir) interrupt mask = <- SMP: XXX trap number = 12 panic: page fault mp_lock = 00000002; cpuid = 0; lapic.id = 00000000 boot() called on cpu#0 as the FAQ requested, here is the results of "nm" that matched most closely with the instruction pointer in the kernel. I'm guessing the "_ufsspec_write" was the funtion which actually caused the panic. f020baf4 t _ufsfifo_read f020baac t _ufsspec_close f020ba34 t _ufsspec_read f020ba70 t _ufsspec_write Thank you in advance, Anthony Bourov To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 11:34:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D3EE14EC9 for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 11:34:06 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA26517; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 14:33:31 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199904021933.OAA26517@cs.rpi.edu> To: "Addr.com Web Hosting" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: Kernel panic question. In-Reply-To: Message from "Addr.com Web Hosting" of "Fri, 02 Apr 1999 11:25:33 PST." <4.1.19990402112404.0267b120@mail.addr.com> Date: Fri, 02 Apr 1999 14:33:31 -0500 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Recently I received the following kernel panic. I was wondering if anyone > has any thoughts or comments on this before I investigate further myself. > The system is a dual PII 400 with 1GB ram and an internal DPT raid > controller running several mirrored disks. Maxusers for the kernel is set > to 256, which I know is low, but anything above that makes the system > unstable (512 makes it panic every hour!). The system is running FreeBSD > 3.0-Release. The system is very stable in general, and is running high load > and with very diverse applications (http, https, sendmail, ftpd, ipop3d, > all the possible cgi scripts in this world and many more), however a panic > like this does occur once every few weeks. Sorry, no core dump for this > one, since I can't replicate the scenario. > Any help, comments or general information would be greatly appreciated. You have ben hit by the KVA issue. (WE *NEED* TO FIX THIS) It is tickled by a large ammount of RAM and/or a high maxusers, you have both. :I If you wish I can (via private email) step you through the patch for this, it is not complicated. -- David Cross To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 12:48:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail1.its.rpi.edu (mail1.its.rpi.edu [128.113.100.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B55BE14D1C for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 12:48:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from drosih@rpi.edu) Received: from [128.113.24.47] (gilead.acs.rpi.edu [128.113.24.47]) by mail1.its.rpi.edu (8.8.8/8.8.6) with ESMTP id PAA49836; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 15:47:59 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Sender: drosih@pop1.rpi.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199904021933.OAA26517@cs.rpi.edu> References: Message from "Addr.com Web Hosting" of "Fri, 02 Apr 1999 11:25:33 PST." <4.1.19990402112404.0267b120@mail.addr.com> Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 15:47:56 -0500 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu From: Garance A Drosihn Subject: Re: Kernel panic question. - need KVA fix in -STABLE!! Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 2:33 PM -0500 4/2/99, David E. Cross wrote: > You have been hit by the KVA issue. (WE *NEED* TO FIX THIS) > It is tickled by a large ammount of RAM and/or a high maxusers, > you have both. :I > > If you wish I can (via private email) step you through the patch > for this, it is not complicated. Will we (FreeBSD) be sure to have this fix in -STABE before it becomes 3.2-RELEASE? The way this KVA issue behaves, it causes things to break in very non-obvious ways. It's cheap enough to buy RAM that more and more people may find themselves running into this. (this is a question for freebsd-stable or the core team, of course, and not Dave!) --- Garance Alistair Drosehn = gad@eclipse.acs.rpi.edu Senior Systems Programmer or drosih@rpi.edu Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 12:51:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quack.kfu.com (quack.kfu.com [170.1.70.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71AA514BDD for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 12:51:26 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nsayer@medusa.kfu.com) Received: from medusa.kfu.com (medusa.kfu.com [170.1.70.5]) by quack.kfu.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA57291 for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 12:51:06 -0800 (PST) Received: (from nsayer@localhost) by medusa.kfu.com (8.9.2/8.8.8) id MAA19553 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 12:51:06 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nsayer) Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 12:51:06 -0800 (PST) From: Nick Sayer Message-Id: <199904022051.MAA19553@medusa.kfu.com> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Add smbclient to root crunch for installs? Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Since 3.1-RELEASE has gone to 2 floppies, it somehow hit my mind today that it ought to be possible to hack the installation program to use smbclient to fetch installation tarballs from a shared CDROM on a nearby Microsoft machine (my love for Microsoft is low, but for many users there often is one nearby :-/ ). I have done no research yet on how this might be achieved. I just wanted to mention it here first to see if it was a fruitful line of inquiry or not. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 13:43:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B555E14D61 for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 13:43:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA13838; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 13:43:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Nick Sayer Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Add smbclient to root crunch for installs? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 02 Apr 1999 12:51:06 PST." <199904022051.MAA19553@medusa.kfu.com> Date: Fri, 02 Apr 1999 13:43:34 -0800 Message-ID: <13836.923089414@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG It's certainly a possibility... If somebody's got some space to test make release, they can try hacking the mfsroot crunch config file and building smbclient into it. There would be some dependency issues, of course, since samba isn't part of the base system. - Jordan > Since 3.1-RELEASE has gone to 2 floppies, it somehow hit my mind > today that it ought to be possible to hack the installation > program to use smbclient to fetch installation tarballs from > a shared CDROM on a nearby Microsoft machine (my love for > Microsoft is low, but for many users there often is one > nearby :-/ ). > > I have done no research yet on how this might be achieved. > I just wanted to mention it here first to see if it was a > fruitful line of inquiry or not. > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 14:21:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp.enteract.com (thor.enteract.com [207.229.143.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 18B5714E84 for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 14:21:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dscheidt@enteract.com) Received: (qmail 6150 invoked from network); 2 Apr 1999 22:21:06 -0000 Received: from nathan.enteract.com (dscheidt@207.229.143.6) by thor.enteract.com with SMTP; 2 Apr 1999 22:21:06 -0000 Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 16:21:06 -0600 (CST) From: David Scheidt To: Garance A Drosihn Cc: Matthew Dillon , Nick Sayer , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Suggestion: loosen slightly securelevel>1 time change restriction In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 2 Apr 1999, Garance A Drosihn wrote: :Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 12:15:33 -0500 :At 5:30 PM -0800 4/1/99, Matthew Dillon wrote: :> We should remove the securelevel code that prevents the date from :> being set backwards. It's stupid code and doesn't work anyway... :> you can set the date forward enough times to wrap it. : :Well, obviously it would be nice to fix *that* problem, separate from :whether one is allowed to set time backwards by an explicit backwards :request. What is wrong with running the system clock slower than normal? That way time still advances monotonically forward, but at say 90 or 95% of the rate of the wall clock. Obviously, things that depend on the time of day clock will be misled, but setting the clock back would break them too. David Scheidt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 15: 0:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE01C14FA2 for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 15:00:15 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id IAA21566 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 08:29:55 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id IAA01332 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 08:29:54 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990403082954.N413@lemis.com> Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 08:29:54 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Any reason not to enable panic dumps earlier? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'm just looking at a panic I'm getting early on in the boot phase. I can't get a dump because no dump device is specified. Does anybody see a reason why it shouldn't be done at the same time that swap is mounted? Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 15:59:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailhub.psn.ie (mailhub.psn.ie [194.106.150.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 426E414D5E for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 15:59:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ad@psn.ie) Received: from vmunix.psn.ie ([194.106.150.252]) by mailhub.psn.ie with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #3) id 10TDkf-0001l6-00; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 00:53:29 +0100 Received: from localhost.psn.ie ([127.0.0.1] helo=localhost) by vmunix.psn.ie with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #1) id 10TDlc-00005U-00; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 00:54:28 +0100 Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 00:54:28 +0100 (IST) From: Andy Doran To: Greg Lehey Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Any reason not to enable panic dumps earlier? In-Reply-To: <19990403082954.N413@lemis.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I'm just looking at a panic I'm getting early on in the boot phase. I > can't get a dump because no dump device is specified. Does anybody > see a reason why it shouldn't be done at the same time that swap is > mounted? Not that I'm a FreeBSD developer, but no I don't see a reason. You can do this in the 'config' statement in kernel configuration files anyway. 'dumps on' I believe. BTW Greg, I'll patch rawio tonight. The disklabel stuff is different for NetBSD, although I don't know how different in userland. Andy. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 16:14:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 22AAA14D5E for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 16:14:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA95233 for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 19:14:21 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 19:14:20 -0500 (EST) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: dd(1) seek/skip limited why? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Why are dd(1) seek and skip operations limited to INT_MAX? Is this for any real use, hysterical raisins, or just because noone cares? It's very useful to allow larger seeks/skips, and I've made the modifications to do so (very little, actually), but I wonder if we actually WANT this limitation... Do we? Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 16:27:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from detlev.UUCP (tex-88.camalott.com [208.229.74.88]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D037915057 for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 16:27:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from joelh@gnu.org) Received: (from joelh@localhost) by detlev.UUCP (8.9.3/8.9.1) id SAA47658; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 18:26:49 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from joelh) To: Matthew Dillon Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: another ufs panic.. References: <199904010648.QAA09525@cheops.anu.edu.au> <199904010707.XAA53697@apollo.backplane.com> From: Joel Ray Holveck Date: 02 Apr 1999 18:26:48 -0600 In-Reply-To: Matthew Dillon's message of "Wed, 31 Mar 1999 23:07:46 -0800 (PST)" Message-ID: <861zi2pn07.fsf@detlev.UUCP> Lines: 16 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 20.3 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Next week: The best ways to smoke a computer with an Arc Welder. Matt's > top 5 picks! And, as a bonus from the archives and old reader favorite, > Matt's 1986 article entitled "how to build a highly directional > medium-range wave-guided EMP generator for less then five hundred thousand > dollars". Nah, give me a tesla coil any day. Happy hacking, joelh -- Joel Ray Holveck - joelh@gnu.org Fourth law of programming: Anything that can go wrong wi sendmail: segmentation violation - core dumped To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 16:40:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from detlev.UUCP (tex-88.camalott.com [208.229.74.88]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 877B714E1A for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 16:40:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from joelh@gnu.org) Received: (from joelh@localhost) by detlev.UUCP (8.9.3/8.9.1) id SAA47703; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 18:40:29 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from joelh) To: Ladavac Marino Cc: "'Chuck Robey'" , "Alton, Matthew" , DL-ADM , "'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG'" Subject: Re: AIX going BSD References: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D097586@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at> From: Joel Ray Holveck Date: 02 Apr 1999 18:40:29 -0600 In-Reply-To: Ladavac Marino's message of "Thu, 1 Apr 1999 10:54:03 +0200" Message-ID: <86zp4qo7sy.fsf@detlev.UUCP> Lines: 20 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 20.3 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >> AIX is *not* doing anything at all outside the usual, and it would, >> in fact, be remarkable (and outside the expected norm) if you >> *didn't* find some BSD code in it. Why don't you go look at, oh, >> Hewlett Packard, or some other mainstream vendor? > [ML] I'm afraid you are not getting it. > I was actually commending IBM/AIX on its good taste in choice of > source bits (i.e. ours and NetBSD's) and actually acknowledging that (by > not removing the RCS id lines). I've always been amused that AIX left the fortunes in the file that disparage IBM. Cheers, joelh -- Joel Ray Holveck - joelh@gnu.org Fourth law of programming: Anything that can go wrong wi sendmail: segmentation violation - core dumped To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 2 16:44: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from detlev.UUCP (tex-88.camalott.com [208.229.74.88]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB36214E1A for ; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 16:43:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from joelh@gnu.org) Received: (from joelh@localhost) by detlev.UUCP (8.9.3/8.9.1) id SAA47706; Fri, 2 Apr 1999 18:43:12 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from joelh) To: Matthew Dillon Cc: Graham Wheeler , Ladavac Marino , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: select() on UDP socket returns ECONNREFUSED References: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D097583@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at> <37020CE5.477F888D@cdsec.com> <199903311717.JAA49728@apollo.backplane.com> From: Joel Ray Holveck Date: 02 Apr 1999 18:43:12 -0600 In-Reply-To: Matthew Dillon's message of "Wed, 31 Mar 1999 09:17:07 -0800 (PST)" Message-ID: <86yakao7of.fsf@detlev.UUCP> Lines: 20 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 20.3 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > People should remember that system calls do *NOT* clear errno. If > errno is set from a previous error, it stays set even if the system > call succeeds. > Also, system and library routines do not reliably overwrite errno if > errno is non-zero prior to making the call. If you intend to check > errno after a library or system call returns < 0, you have clear > errno prior to making the call or you may get stale data. I also seem to recall that some C library routines will set errno even if they succeed. FreeBSD's malloc used to do this under normal conditions. Happy hacking, joelh -- Joel Ray Holveck - joelh@gnu.org Fourth law of programming: Anything that can go wrong wi sendmail: segmentation violation - core dumped To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 0:27: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from relay.nuxi.com (nuxi.ucdavis.edu [169.237.7.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9139A14C09 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 00:27:04 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: (from obrien@localhost) by relay.nuxi.com (8.9.2/8.9.1) id AAA65984; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 00:23:29 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from obrien) Message-ID: <19990403002329.C65887@nuxi.com> Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 00:23:29 -0800 From: "David O'Brien" To: zhihuizhang , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Question of #ifdef __i386__ Reply-To: obrien@NUXI.com References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: ; from zhihuizhang on Fri, Apr 02, 1999 at 01:10:25PM -0500 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE Organization: The NUXI BSD group X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Keyid: 34F9F9D5 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I am wondering whether "#ifdef __i386__" is created because of the > following line at the beginning of the file i386/conf/GENERIC: > > machine "i386" No. It is due to ``CPP_PREDEFINES'' in /usr/src/contrib/gcc/config/i386/freebsd.h. -- -- David (obrien@NUXI.com -or- obrien@FreeBSD.org) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 0:47: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from relay.nuxi.com (nuxi.ucdavis.edu [169.237.7.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65C6A14F79; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 00:47:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: (from obrien@localhost) by relay.nuxi.com (8.9.2/8.9.1) id AAA66064; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 00:44:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from obrien) Message-ID: <19990403004459.F65887@nuxi.com> Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 00:44:59 -0800 From: "David O'Brien" To: Greg Lehey , FreeBSD Hackers , FreeBSD SCSI Mailing List Subject: Re: CCD and Vinum compared with new performance measuring tool Reply-To: obrien@NUXI.com References: <19990401122922.Q413@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990401122922.Q413@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Thu, Apr 01, 1999 at 12:29:22PM +0930 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE Organization: The NUXI BSD group X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Keyid: 34F9F9D5 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > now solved the problem: I've written another program. You can pick it > up at ftp://ftp.lemis.com/pub/rawio.tar.gz. From the man page: Port? :-) -- -- David (obrien@NUXI.com -or- obrien@FreeBSD.org) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 0:50: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B54A14F2A; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 00:49:58 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id SAA23230; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 18:18:02 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id SAA02456; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 18:18:01 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990403181800.C2142@lemis.com> Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 18:18:00 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: obrien@NUXI.com, FreeBSD Hackers , FreeBSD SCSI Mailing List Subject: Re: CCD and Vinum compared with new performance measuring tool References: <19990401122922.Q413@lemis.com> <19990403004459.F65887@nuxi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990403004459.F65887@nuxi.com>; from David O'Brien on Sat, Apr 03, 1999 at 12:44:59AM -0800 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Saturday, 3 April 1999 at 0:44:59 -0800, David O'Brien wrote: >> now solved the problem: I've written another program. You can pick it >> up at ftp://ftp.lemis.com/pub/rawio.tar.gz. From the man page: > > Port? :-) Once it has stabilised a bit. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 7:15:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6D6B14D01 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 07:15:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA07022 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 10:13:51 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 10:13:50 -0500 (EST) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: dd(1) seek/skip limited why? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 2 Apr 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > Why are dd(1) seek and skip operations limited to INT_MAX? Is this for any > real use, hysterical raisins, or just because noone cares? It's very useful > to allow larger seeks/skips, and I've made the modifications to do so (very > little, actually), but I wonder if we actually WANT this limitation... Do we? > > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ > green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ > FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | > http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Also, I find that dd(1) refuses to lseek for the skip operation (pos_in) on a cdev, even though it certainly does seem to work on all that I've tried except sndstat... Now I could have dd(1) work around this if lseek actually worked correctly on these cdevs. However, lseek succeeds on devices that cannot be seeked (joy0, sndstat, etc). Am I the only one who thinks this is wrong? Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 8:18:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bingsun1.cc.binghamton.edu (bingsun1.cc.binghamton.edu [128.226.1.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4004314C8B for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 08:18:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bf20761@binghamton.edu) Received: from localhost by bingsun1.cc.binghamton.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA14177 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 11:16:13 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: bingsun1.cc.binghamton.edu: bf20761 owned process doing -bs Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 11:16:12 -0500 (EST) From: zhihuizhang X-Sender: bf20761@bingsun1 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: What does the "s" in insl and insw mean? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The instructions insl() and insw() should read a long word (l) or a word (w) from a specified I/O port. But what does the "s" in both instructions stand for? I can not find it in the Info files. Why I ask this? I come across these two instructions when I am reading source code wdgetctlr() in file isa/wd.c, where the source code checks if we really have a 32-bit controller by a bcmp(tb,tb2,sizeof(struct wdparams)). However, tb2 has not been assigned with anything (all 0s by default). So I have to figure out what has been read into tb by an earlier insl() or insw(). I doubt if there is a bug in that routine or some option is never actually used. Any help is appreciated. -------------------------------------------------- | Zhihui Zhang, http://cs.binghamton.edu/~zzhang | | Dept. of Computer Science, SUNY at Binghamton | -------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 8:30:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F12E814C8B for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 08:30:50 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA13410; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 11:39:29 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 11:39:28 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: zhihuizhang Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: What does the "s" in insl and insw mean? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 3 Apr 1999, zhihuizhang wrote: > > The instructions insl() and insw() should read a long word (l) or a word > (w) from a specified I/O port. But what does the "s" in both instructions > stand for? I can not find it in the Info files. in from port string operation it grabs a byte/word from the port, stores it into DS:DI and increments DI, (that's in x86 real mode) afaik in prot mode it prolly just stores to the segemtn pointed to DS and uses EDI. The opcodes without 's' use al/ax/eax for the destination. -Alfred > > Why I ask this? > > I come across these two instructions when I am reading source code > wdgetctlr() in file isa/wd.c, where the source code checks if we really > have a 32-bit controller by a bcmp(tb,tb2,sizeof(struct wdparams)). > However, tb2 has not been assigned with anything (all 0s by default). So > I have to figure out what has been read into tb by an earlier insl() or > insw(). I doubt if there is a bug in that routine or some option is never > actually used. > > Any help is appreciated. > > -------------------------------------------------- > | Zhihui Zhang, http://cs.binghamton.edu/~zzhang | > | Dept. of Computer Science, SUNY at Binghamton | > -------------------------------------------------- > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 9:47: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from etinc.com (et-gw.etinc.com [207.252.1.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6333814C90 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 09:47:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dennis@etinc.com) Received: from dbsys (dbsys.etinc.com [207.252.1.18]) by etinc.com (8.8.8/8.6.9) with SMTP id MAA26618; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 12:44:33 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199904031744.MAA26618@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Sat, 03 Apr 1999 12:38:51 -0500 To: Alfred Perlstein From: Dennis Subject: Re: What does the "s" in insl and insw mean? Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 11:39 AM 4/3/99 -0500, you wrote: >On Sat, 3 Apr 1999, zhihuizhang wrote: > >> >> The instructions insl() and insw() should read a long word (l) or a word >> (w) from a specified I/O port. But what does the "s" in both instructions >> stand for? I can not find it in the Info files. > >in from port string operation > >it grabs a byte/word from the port, stores it into DS:DI and increments >DI, (that's in x86 real mode) afaik in prot mode it prolly just stores >to the segemtn pointed to DS and uses EDI. > >The opcodes without 's' use al/ax/eax for the destination. Its important to note that is a string read in that it will read multiple words (count of CX) ....of REP fame for memory copies. If you have an IO mapped card (rather than a memory mapped on) ins? functions can simulate a memory copy from IO space. DB To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 10: 7:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C3DA614C13 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 10:07:30 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA05452 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 11:05:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id LAA50282 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 11:06:02 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <199904031806.LAA50282@harmony.village.org> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Any way to... Date: Sat, 03 Apr 1999 11:06:02 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ... get a kernel stack trace of a running process? I'm seeing pppd hang from time to time and it would be nice to see where in the kernel it is hung. The kernel in question doesn't have ddb enabled, but does have symbols. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 10:35:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 836EA14EDC for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 10:35:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id NAA03960; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 13:43:48 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 13:43:46 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Dennis Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: What does the "s" in insl and insw mean? In-Reply-To: <199904031744.MAA26618@etinc.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 3 Apr 1999, Dennis wrote: > At 11:39 AM 4/3/99 -0500, you wrote: > >On Sat, 3 Apr 1999, zhihuizhang wrote: > > > >> > >> The instructions insl() and insw() should read a long word (l) or a word > >> (w) from a specified I/O port. But what does the "s" in both instructions > >> stand for? I can not find it in the Info files. > > > >in from port string operation > > > >it grabs a byte/word from the port, stores it into DS:DI and increments > >DI, (that's in x86 real mode) afaik in prot mode it prolly just stores > >to the segemtn pointed to DS and uses EDI. > > > >The opcodes without 's' use al/ax/eax for the destination. > > Its important to note that is a string read in that it will read multiple > words (count of CX) ....of REP fame for memory copies. If you > have an IO mapped card (rather than a memory mapped on) ins? > functions can simulate a memory copy from IO space. er, isn't that only if you prefix the opcode with the 'rep' prefix? -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 11: 7:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from isbalham.ist.co.uk (isbalham.ist.co.uk [192.31.26.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C75B2151EF for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 11:07:50 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: from gid.co.uk (uucp@localhost) by isbalham.ist.co.uk (8.8.7/8.8.7) with UUCP id UAA22968; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 20:05:51 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: from [194.32.164.2] by seagoon.gid.co.uk; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 20:02:01 +0100 (BST) X-Sender: rb@194.32.164.1 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199904031806.LAA50282@harmony.village.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 20:02:09 +0000 To: Warner Losh From: Bob Bishop Subject: Re: Any way to... Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, At 11:06 am -0700 3/4/99, Warner Losh wrote: >... get a kernel stack trace of a running process? gdb -k /kernel /dev/mem, I expect -- Bob Bishop (0118) 977 4017 international code +44 118 rb@gid.co.uk fax (0118) 989 4254 between 0800 and 1800 UK To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 11:17: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quackerjack.cc.vt.edu (quackerjack.cc.vt.edu [198.82.160.250]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F0DF14E16 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 11:17:01 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jobaldwi@vt.edu) Received: from sable.cc.vt.edu (sable.cc.vt.edu [128.173.16.30]) by quackerjack.cc.vt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA09526; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 14:15:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from john.baldwin.cx (jobaldwi.campus.vt.edu [198.82.67.63]) by sable.cc.vt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA18405; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 14:15:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Date: Sat, 03 Apr 1999 14:15:00 -0500 (EST) From: John Baldwin To: Alfred Perlstein Subject: Re: What does the "s" in insl and insw mean? Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, zhihuizhang Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 03-Apr-99 Alfred Perlstein wrote: > On Sat, 3 Apr 1999, zhihuizhang wrote: > >> >> The instructions insl() and insw() should read a long word (l) or a word >> (w) from a specified I/O port. But what does the "s" in both instructions >> stand for? I can not find it in the Info files. > > in from port string operation > > it grabs a byte/word from the port, stores it into DS:DI and increments > DI, (that's in x86 real mode) afaik in prot mode it prolly just stores > to the segemtn pointed to DS and uses EDI. > > The opcodes without 's' use al/ax/eax for the destination. > > -Alfred Actually, ins* use ES, not DS, and ignore segment overrides to boot. Also, if the direction flag is set via std, (E)DI is decremented instead of incremented. --- John Baldwin -- http://members.freedomnet.com/~jbaldwin/ PGP Key: http://members.freedomnet.com/~jbaldwin/pgpkey.asc "Power Users Use the Power to Serve!" - http://www.freebsd.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 14: 8: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A39215035 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 14:07:57 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA05755; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 15:06:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id PAA50844; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 15:06:27 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <199904032206.PAA50844@harmony.village.org> To: Bob Bishop Subject: Re: Any way to... Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 03 Apr 1999 20:02:09 GMT." References: Date: Sat, 03 Apr 1999 15:06:27 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message Bob Bishop writes: : >... get a kernel stack trace of a running process? : gdb -k /kernel /dev/mem, I expect How to I get that from gdb? gdb will tell me where in the kernel things are now, but not where a process may be sleeping or stuck. Actually, looking at the "top" output, shows that pppd is stuck in "select" state, so getting a kernel stack trace of that wouldn't be helpful. I don't know how ppp works in the kernel, but am trying to track down problems where it wedges our serial line and we have to kill pppd with SIGKILL in order for it to notice (SIGTERM and SIGHUP don't seem to produce any effect). Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 17:21:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50AEC14BDB for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 17:21:47 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id KAA25927; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 10:49:50 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id KAA04237; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 10:49:48 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990404104947.N2142@lemis.com> Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 10:49:47 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Warner Losh , Bob Bishop Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Any way to... References: <199904032206.PAA50844@harmony.village.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904032206.PAA50844@harmony.village.org>; from Warner Losh on Sat, Apr 03, 1999 at 03:06:27PM -0700 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Saturday, 3 April 1999 at 15:06:27 -0700, Warner Losh wrote: > In message Bob Bishop writes: > : >... get a kernel stack trace of a running process? > : gdb -k /kernel /dev/mem, I expect > > How to I get that from gdb? gdb will tell me where in the kernel > things are now, but not where a process may be sleeping or stuck. Take a look at /usr/src/sys/modules/vinum/.gdbinit.kernel. It contains a number of (barely documented) macros for looking at other processes. Unfortunately, I've just tried them on a running system, and they don't work. I'll fix them and let you know. In principle, the defproc macro will give you a back trace of the process you specify. Here's a case from a remote debug session: (kgdb) ps pid proc addr uid ppid pgrp flag stat comm wchan ... 133 f68b5860 f6dbb000 0 1 133 000084 3 rpc.statd select f029ce70 130 f68b59c0 f6db7000 0 125 125 000084 3 nfsd nfsd f0efd600 129 f68b5b20 f6db4000 0 125 125 000084 3 nfsd nfsd f0efd800 128 f68b5c80 f6db1000 0 125 125 000084 3 nfsd nfsd f0efda00 127 f68b5de0 f6dae000 0 125 125 000084 3 nfsd nfsd f0ec4600 125 f68b5f40 f6dab000 0 1 125 000084 3 nfsd accept f648d036 122 f68b60a0 f6da8000 0 1 122 000084 3 mountd select f029ce70 114 f68b6200 f6da5000 1 1 114 000184 3 portmap select f029ce70 110 f68b6360 f6da2000 0 1 110 000084 2 xntpd 100 f68b6620 f6d8c000 0 1 100 000084 2 syslogd 4 f68b6a40 f68c1000 0 0 0 000204 2 syncer 3 f68b6ba0 f68bf000 0 0 0 000204 3 vmdaemon psleep f0293bb0 2 f68b6d00 f68bd000 0 0 0 000604 2 pagedaemon 1 f68b6e60 f68bb000 0 0 1 004084 3 init wait f68b6e60 0 f029c0fc f02f0000 0 0 0 000204 2 swapper (kgdb) defproc 1 1 f68b4260 f68bb000 0 0 1 004084 3 init wait f68b6e60 frame 0 at 0xf68bcf04: ebp f68bcf20, eip 0xf015234d : movb 0xf5(%ebx),%al frame 1 at 0xf68bcf20: ebp f68bcf4c, eip 0xf014a860 : addl $0x10,%esp frame 2 at 0xf68bcf4c: ebp f68bcf60, eip 0xf014a538 : leave frame 3 at 0xf68bcf60: ebp f68bcfb4, eip 0xf021d7a7 : movl %eax,%edi (kgdb) defproc 110 110 f68b4260 f6da2000 0 0 110 000084 2 xntpd frame 0 at 0xf6da3de4: ebp f6da3e00, eip 0xf015234d : movb 0xf5(%ebx),%al frame 1 at 0xf6da3e00: ebp f6da3f60, eip 0xf015bdb4 : movl %eax,%esi frame 2 at 0xf6da3f60: ebp f6da3fb4, eip 0xf021d7a7 : movl %eax,%edi (kgdb) defproc 114 114 f68b4260 f6da5000 1 0 114 000184 3 portmap select f029ce70 frame 0 at 0xf6da6de4: ebp f6da6e00, eip 0xf015234d : movb 0xf5(%ebx),%al frame 1 at 0xf6da6e00: ebp f6da6f60, eip 0xf015bdb4 : movl %eax,%esi frame 2 at 0xf6da6f60: ebp f6da6fb4, eip 0xf021d7a7 : movl %eax,%edi (kgdb) defproc 2 2 f68b4260 f68bd000 0 0 0 000604 2 pagedaemon frame 0 at 0xf68bef64: ebp f68bef80, eip 0xf015234d : movb 0xf5(%ebx),%al frame 1 at 0xf68bef80: ebp f68bef9c, eip 0xf01fdc1f : addl $0x10,%esp frame 2 at 0xf68bef9c: ebp f68befb0, eip 0xf0142d4a : pushl (%ebx) frame 3 at 0xf68befb0: ebp f02f1ff4, eip 0xf0210748 : addl $0x4,%esp (kgdb) You can then look at individual stack frames: (kgdb) fr 2 frame 2 at 0xf68bef9c: ebp f68befb0, eip 0xf0142d4a : pushl (%ebx) Called from f0210748, stack frame at f02f1ff4 last 20 local variables: 0xf68bef60 : 0x000b1d03 0xf68bef80 0xf015234d 0x80000000 0xf68bef70 : 0xf0142d18 0x00008000 0xf232dad8 0xc00f54da 0xf68bef80 : 0xf68bef9c 0xf01fdc1f 0xf0274978 0x00000004 0xf68bef90 : 0xf0257390 0x000001f4 0xf0274938 0xf68befb0 0xf68befa0 : 0xf0142d4a 0xf68b6df7 0xf025722c 0xf0274938 call parameters: 0xf68befb8 : 0xf0274938 0xf0403000 0x00008000 0x00008000 0xf68befc8 : 0xf02106b0 0xf02f1ff4 0xf0215375 0xf0000000 (kgdb) It's not as comfortable as real gdb, but it's better than nothing. > Actually, looking at the "top" output, shows that pppd is stuck in > "select" state, so getting a kernel stack trace of that wouldn't be > helpful. Depends on where you get the trace from. The real problem is that you can't trace back into a non-executing processes user space, because it isn't mapped (can some VM guru tell me how to locate the pages?). Anyway, as I say, some buglet stops it from working on my machine with /dev/mem, though maybe it'll work for you. I'll investigate what's going on, but it won't be immediately. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 18:42:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 246FA14D91 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 18:42:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bob@luke.pmr.com) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id UAA11331 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 20:40:38 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from bob) Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 20:40:38 -0600 From: Bob Willcox To: hackers list Subject: dump wd0: wddump: timeout waiting for DRQ ... Message-ID: <19990403204038.A10887@luke.pmr.com> Reply-To: Bob Willcox Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG When I get a panic on one of my systems here and attempt to take a dump from the debugger (via the "panic" command) I get this error message: dumping to dev 20001, offset 155776 dump wd0: wddump: timeout waiting for DRQ (status 51 error 10 (no_id) i/o error Can somebody possibly tell me whats wrong? Normally I use SCSI drives (except for my laptop, this is the only system I have with IDE) and have not had any trouble getting crash dumps to work. I have included my kernel configuration file below. Thanks, Bob # # DEATHSTAR -- Configure file of the DEATHSTAR system # # For more information read the handbook part System Administration -> # Configuring the FreeBSD Kernel -> The Configuration File. # The handbook is available in /usr/share/doc/handbook or online as # latest version from the FreeBSD World Wide Web server # # # An exhaustive list of options and more detailed explanations of the # device lines is present in the ./LINT configuration file. If you are # in doubt as to the purpose or necessity of a line, check first in LINT. # # $Id$ machine "i386" cpu "I586_CPU" cpu "I686_CPU" ident DEATHSTAR maxusers 64 options INET #InterNETworking options FFS #Berkeley Fast Filesystem options FFS_ROOT #FFS usable as root device [keep this!] options MFS #Memory Filesystem options NFS #Network Filesystem options MSDOSFS #MSDOS Filesystem options "CD9660" #ISO 9660 Filesystem options "CD9660_ROOT" #CD-ROM usable as root. "CD9660" req'ed options PROCFS #Process filesystem options "COMPAT_43" #Compatible with BSD 4.3 [KEEP THIS!] options SCSI_DELAY=10000 #Be pessimistic about Joe SCSI device options UCONSOLE #Allow users to grab the console options FAILSAFE #Be conservative options USERCONFIG #boot -c editor options VISUAL_USERCONFIG #visual boot -c editor options SOFTUPDATES #enable soft updates support options "NMBCLUSTERS=4096" options "MSGBUF_SIZE=40960" config kernel root on wd0 controller isa0 controller pci0 controller fdc0 at isa? port "IO_FD1" bio irq 6 drq 2 disk fd0 at fdc0 drive 0 controller wdc0 at isa? port "IO_WD1" bio irq 14 flags 0xb0ffb0ff disk wd0 at wdc0 drive 0 #disk wd1 at wdc0 drive 1 #controller wdc1 at isa? port "IO_WD2" bio irq 15 #disk wd2 at wdc1 drive 0 #disk wd3 at wdc1 drive 1 #options ATAPI #Enable ATAPI support for IDE bus #options ATAPI_STATIC #Don't do it as an LKM #device acd0 #IDE CD-ROM #device wfd0 #IDE Floppy (e.g. LS-120) # A single entry for any of these controllers (ncr, ahb, ahc) is # sufficient for any number of installed devices. controller ncr0 controller ahc0 controller scbus0 device da0 device sa0 device pass0 device cd0 device ch0 # atkbdc0 controlls both the keyboard and the PS/2 mouse controller atkbdc0 at isa? port IO_KBD tty device atkbd0 at isa? tty irq 1 device psm0 at isa? tty irq 12 device vga0 at isa? port ? conflicts # splash screen/screen saver pseudo-device splash # syscons is the default console driver, resembling an SCO console device sc0 at isa? tty device npx0 at isa? port IO_NPX irq 13 # Serial ports device sio0 at isa? port "IO_COM1" flags 0x10 tty irq 4 device sio1 at isa? port "IO_COM2" tty irq 3 # Parallel port device ppc0 at isa? port? net irq 7 controller ppbus0 device nlpt0 at ppbus? device plip0 at ppbus? device ppi0 at ppbus? #controller vpo0 at ppbus? # Order is important here due to intrusive probes, do *not* alphabetize # this list of network interfaces until the probes have been fixed. # Right now it appears that the ie0 must be probed before ep0. See # revision 1.20 of this file. device de0 device fxp0 pseudo-device loop pseudo-device ether pseudo-device sl 2 pseudo-device ppp 2 pseudo-device tun 2 pseudo-device pty 64 pseudo-device gzip # Exec gzipped a.out's # # Enable debug support # options KTRACE #kernel tracing options DDB #kernel debugger options INVARIANTS #extra sanity checks options INVARIANT_SUPPORT #needed for INVARIANTS # # These three options provide support for System V Interface # Definition-style interprocess communication, in the form of shared # memory, semaphores, and message queues, respectively. # options SYSVSHM options SYSVSEM options SYSVMSG # The `bpfilter' pseudo-device enables the Berkeley Packet Filter. Be # aware of the legal and administrative consequences of enabling this # option. The number of devices determines the maximum number of # simultaneous BPF clients programs runnable. pseudo-device bpfilter 4 #Berkeley packet filter -- Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 19:10:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0131D14D91 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 19:10:39 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA14848 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 22:08:50 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 22:08:49 -0500 (EST) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: ipfw uid Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Is anyone interested in trying out my addition of per-uid firewalling capabilities to ipfw? I just did them today, but they seem to work fine. For instance, logging/accounting purpouses: {"/usr/src/sbin/ipfw"}# ipfw show 00050 8157 2864127 count ip from any to any uid 1000 in 00060 8952 1834453 count ip from any to any uid 1000 out Just let me know if you'd like it! Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 19:51: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ausmtp02.au.ibm.com (ausmtp02.au.ibm.COM [202.135.136.105]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7D3A14F0B; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 19:50:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hawkkuan@tw.ibm.com) Received: from f03n07e.au.ibm.com (f03n07s.au.ibm.com [9.185.166.74]) by ausmtp02.au.ibm.com (1.0.0) with ESMTP id NAA41486; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 13:41:59 +1000 From: hawkkuan@tw.ibm.com Received: from tw.ibm.com (f06n09s [9.185.166.69]) by f03n07e.au.ibm.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA27474; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 13:47:53 +1000 Received: by tw.ibm.com(Lotus SMTP MTA Internal build v4.6.2 (651.2 6-10-1998)) id 48256749.0014DC7C ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 11:47:51 +0800 X-Lotus-FromDomain: IBMTW To: questions@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Message-ID: <48256749.0014DAC4.00@tw.ibm.com> Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 11:32:29 +0800 Subject: About FreeBSD supporting RAID controller ? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=big5 Content-Disposition: inline Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Dear all friends, Is there anyone can tell me FreeBSD 3.1 support which RAID controller ? Since I found Linux support many RAID controller, but it seems like FreeBSD support few RAID controller. It's better to have a single channel RAID card for me, it will be a little bit cheaper. Best Regards, Hawk Kuan ©x®¶µØ Sales Specialist , PSG, IBM Taiwan, 206, Sec.1 Keelung Rd, Taipei, Taiwan, R.O.C. Tel:886-2-2725-9522, Pager:0959-316961, Mobile: 0936-945920 Notes ID: Hawk JH Kuan/Taiwan/IBM , E-Mail: hawkkuan@tw.ibm.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 20: 2:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CDAF14BE6 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 20:02:15 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA09813; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 23:10:38 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 23:10:36 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Bob Willcox Cc: hackers list Subject: Re: dump wd0: wddump: timeout waiting for DRQ ... In-Reply-To: <19990403204038.A10887@luke.pmr.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 3 Apr 1999, Bob Willcox wrote: > When I get a panic on one of my systems here and attempt to take a dump from > the debugger (via the "panic" command) I get this error message: > > dumping to dev 20001, offset 155776 > dump wd0: wddump: timeout waiting for DRQ (status 51 error 10 (no_id) > i/o error > > Can somebody possibly tell me whats wrong? Normally I use SCSI drives > (except for my laptop, this is the only system I have with IDE) and have > not had any trouble getting crash dumps to work. I have included my > kernel configuration file below. Try to enable apm in your kernel, i think that your drive took a nap and the dump code wasn't expecting that. If that fails and you can spare the battery life trun off APM in your bios. -Alfred > > Thanks, > Bob To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 21:27:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ausmtp01.au.ibm.com (ausmtp01.au.ibm.COM [202.135.136.97]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1FAC114C33; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 21:27:08 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hawkkuan@tw.ibm.com) Received: from f03n05e.au.ibm.com (f03n05s.au.ibm.com [9.185.166.73]) by ausmtp01.au.ibm.com (1.0.0) with ESMTP id PAA16788; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 15:20:32 +1000 From: hawkkuan@tw.ibm.com Received: from tw.ibm.com (f06n09s [9.185.166.69]) by f03n05e.au.ibm.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA30926; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 15:24:08 +1000 Received: by tw.ibm.com(Lotus SMTP MTA Internal build v4.6.2 (651.2 6-10-1998)) id 48256749.001DA903 ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 13:23:58 +0800 X-Lotus-FromDomain: IBMTW To: questions@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Message-ID: <48256749.001DA61D.00@tw.ibm.com> Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 13:15:52 +0800 Subject: Free BSD support Adaptec AAA-130 or AAA-131?? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=big5 Content-Disposition: inline Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Dear all, Since AAA-130 or AAA-131 can user RAID-port II to upgrade AIC 7895 to support RAID , Does FreeBSD 3.1 support it ?? It's really need your help. Best Regards, Hawk Kuan ©x®¶µØ Sales Specialist , PSG, IBM Taiwan, 206, Sec.1 Keelung Rd, Taipei, Taiwan, R.O.C. Tel:886-2-2725-9522, Pager:0959-316961, Mobile: 0936-945920 Notes ID: Hawk JH Kuan/Taiwan/IBM , E-Mail: hawkkuan@tw.ibm.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 21:55:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from panzer.plutotech.com (panzer.plutotech.com [206.168.67.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4903C14CB0; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 21:55:49 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ken@panzer.plutotech.com) Received: (from ken@localhost) by panzer.plutotech.com (8.9.3/8.8.5) id WAA14342; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 22:53:44 -0700 (MST) From: "Kenneth D. Merry" Message-Id: <199904040553.WAA14342@panzer.plutotech.com> Subject: Re: About FreeBSD supporting RAID controller ? In-Reply-To: <48256749.0014DAC4.00@tw.ibm.com> from "hawkkuan@tw.ibm.com" at "Apr 4, 1999 11:32:29 am" To: hawkkuan@tw.ibm.com Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 22:53:44 -0700 (MST) Cc: questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hawkkuan@tw.ibm.com wrote... > Dear all friends, > > Is there anyone can tell me FreeBSD 3.1 support which RAID controller > ? > Since I found Linux support many RAID controller, but it seems like FreeBSD > support > few RAID controller. > > It's better to have a single channel RAID card for me, it will be a > little bit > cheaper. You can either use a DPT card (only their series III and IV cards are supported, not the V series) or any external SCSI to SCSI RAID controller. Ken -- Kenneth Merry ken@plutotech.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 22: 6:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from panzer.plutotech.com (panzer.plutotech.com [206.168.67.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 469D114D73; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 22:06:27 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ken@panzer.plutotech.com) Received: (from ken@localhost) by panzer.plutotech.com (8.9.3/8.8.5) id XAA14411; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 23:04:29 -0700 (MST) From: "Kenneth D. Merry" Message-Id: <199904040604.XAA14411@panzer.plutotech.com> Subject: Re: Free BSD support Adaptec AAA-130 or AAA-131?? In-Reply-To: <48256749.001DA61D.00@tw.ibm.com> from "hawkkuan@tw.ibm.com" at "Apr 4, 1999 1:15:52 pm" To: hawkkuan@tw.ibm.com Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 23:04:29 -0700 (MST) Cc: questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hawkkuan@tw.ibm.com wrote... > Dear all, > > Since AAA-130 or AAA-131 can user RAID-port II to upgrade AIC 7895 > to support RAID , Does FreeBSD 3.1 support it ?? It will work only as a normal SCSI card. The RAID functionality of those boards is not supported. Ken -- Kenneth Merry ken@plutotech.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 22:20:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from home.dragondata.com (home.dragondata.com [204.137.237.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 88392150A4 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 22:19:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from toasty@home.dragondata.com) Received: (from toasty@localhost) by home.dragondata.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id AAA19930; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 00:17:49 -0600 (CST) From: Kevin Day Message-Id: <199904040617.AAA19930@home.dragondata.com> Subject: Re: ipfw uid In-Reply-To: from Brian Feldman at "Apr 3, 1999 10: 8:49 pm" To: green@unixhelp.org (Brian Feldman) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 00:17:48 -0600 (CST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Is anyone interested in trying out my addition of per-uid firewalling > capabilities to ipfw? I just did them today, but they seem to work fine. > For instance, logging/accounting purpouses: > > {"/usr/src/sbin/ipfw"}# ipfw show > 00050 8157 2864127 count ip from any to any uid 1000 in > 00060 8952 1834453 count ip from any to any uid 1000 out > > Just let me know if you'd like it! > If I'm understanding this correctly, could this be used to prevent all but one or two users from using a certain IP? (Yes, i realize they could still try to bind to it, but it wouldn't do them any good). I was thinking about doing some kind of file per IP in /proc, that could be chmod'ed to allow/disallow users from doing things with, but this sounds much more elegant. :) Kevin To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 22:49:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za (zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za [146.64.24.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51DD514DC5 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 22:49:15 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jhay@zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za) Received: (from jhay@localhost) by zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za (8.9.2/8.9.2) id IAA28163; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 08:47:08 +0200 (SAT) (envelope-from jhay) From: John Hay Message-Id: <199904040647.IAA28163@zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za> Subject: Re: Suggestion: loosen slightly securelevel>1 time change restriction In-Reply-To: <199904020033.QAA09981@medusa.kfu.com> from Nick Sayer at "Apr 1, 1999 4:33:25 pm" To: nsayer@quack.kfu.com (Nick Sayer) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 08:47:08 +0200 (SAT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > At the moment, setting the time to any point in the past (that is, > if the delta being applied is negative) is not allowed if the securelevel > of the system is >1. > > The problem with this is that even if you run ntpdate at boot time, > xntpd can occasionally want to make small negative steps. > > I suggest easing up slightly on the restriction. Say, negative steps of > more than a minute are disallowed. It would seem to me that this would > let xntpd operate correctly in most cases while still denying the > opportunity for serious mischief to hackers desiring to wreak havoc > with time warps. > I think that you should just tell ntpd that it can't step the time. With xntpd 3.x it was a compile time define SLEWALWAYS and with ntpd 4.x the -x commandline option can be used. John -- John Hay -- John.Hay@mikom.csir.co.za To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 3 22:58:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1428014E73 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 1999 22:58:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA17236; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 01:56:43 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 01:56:43 -0500 (EST) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: Kevin Day Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw uid In-Reply-To: <199904040617.AAA19930@home.dragondata.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Kevin Day wrote: > > Is anyone interested in trying out my addition of per-uid firewalling > > capabilities to ipfw? I just did them today, but they seem to work fine. > > For instance, logging/accounting purpouses: > > > > {"/usr/src/sbin/ipfw"}# ipfw show > > 00050 8157 2864127 count ip from any to any uid 1000 in > > 00060 8952 1834453 count ip from any to any uid 1000 out > > > > Just let me know if you'd like it! > > > > If I'm understanding this correctly, could this be used to prevent all but > one or two users from using a certain IP? (Yes, i realize they could still > try to bind to it, but it wouldn't do them any good). > > I was thinking about doing some kind of file per IP in /proc, that could be > chmod'ed to allow/disallow users from doing things with, but this sounds > much more elegant. :) Certainly, that's one use for this! I must clarify that previously I had my uid test in the wrong place in ip_fw.c, so now output looks more like: {"/home/green"}# ipfw show 00040 2 100 count ip from any to any uid 1000 in 00050 3310 479624 count ip from any to any uid 1000 out The only problem is that incoming packets aren't counted yet, as I haven't figured out the best solution for that. I hope others have ideas so I don't have to wrack my brain too much! The current code can be found at http://janus.syracuse.net/~green/ipfw_uid.patch. Anyone who wants to help with getting incoming packets working with uids, I welcome! Of course, outgoing packet uid firewalling is much more useful in the first place, as it can prevent access to whatever you specify, or track data sent, etc. > > Kevin > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 1: 6:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ren.detir.qld.gov.au (ns.detir.qld.gov.au [203.46.81.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C08D151B5 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 01:06:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from syssgm@detir.qld.gov.au) Received: by ren.detir.qld.gov.au; id TAA18601; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 19:07:26 +1000 (EST) Received: from ogre.detir.qld.gov.au(167.123.8.3) by ren.detir.qld.gov.au via smap (4.1) id xma018599; Sun, 4 Apr 99 19:07:23 +1000 Received: from atlas.detir.qld.gov.au (atlas.detir.qld.gov.au [167.123.8.9]) by ogre.detir.qld.gov.au (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA19505; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 19:04:08 +1000 (EST) Received: from nymph.detir.qld.gov.au (nymph.detir.qld.gov.au [167.123.10.10]) by atlas.detir.qld.gov.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA23498; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 19:04:07 +1000 (EST) Received: from nymph.detir.qld.gov.au (localhost.detir.qld.gov.au [127.0.0.1]) by nymph.detir.qld.gov.au (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA24558; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 19:04:05 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from syssgm@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au) Message-Id: <199904040904.TAA24558@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au> To: Brian Feldman Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, syssgm@detir.qld.gov.au Subject: Re: dd(1) seek/skip limited why? References: In-Reply-To: from Brian Feldman at "Sat, 03 Apr 1999 10:13:50 -0500" Date: Sun, 04 Apr 1999 19:04:05 +1000 From: Stephen McKay Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Saturday, 3rd April 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > Also, I find that dd(1) refuses to lseek for the skip operation (pos_in) on >a cdev, even though it certainly does seem to work on all that I've tried >except sndstat... Now I could have dd(1) work around this if lseek actually >worked correctly on these cdevs. However, lseek succeeds on devices that >cannot be seeked (joy0, sndstat, etc). Am I the only one who thinks this is >wrong? Historically, the only thing lseek() failed on was a pipe (extended to include sockets when they turned up). For other things that you wouldn't expect to be seekable (like ttys), lseek() "worked" in as much as it set the file position pointer. But then the pointer was ignored. When I was a young pup, I asked why it was so. The answer would have been very close to "Some devices are incapable of seeking. The value of the file pointer associated with such a device is undefined." That's not likely to change. I assume you want dd to work better on raw disks. Find an ioctl() that only works on raw disks (and optionally other seekable things) and you have a winner. Stephen. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 1:33: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from firewall.reed.wattle.id.au (darren2.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.53.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E4D3150E8 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 01:32:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from darrenr@reed.wattle.id.au) Received: (from root@localhost) by firewall.reed.wattle.id.au (8.9.1/8.8.7) id JAA10228 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 09:30:56 GMT Received: from avalon.reed.wattle.id.au(192.168.1.1) by firewall.reed.wattle.id.au via smap (V1.3) id sma010226; Sun Apr 4 09:30:31 1999 Received: from percival.reed.wattle.id.au. (percival.reed.wattle.id.au [192.168.1.5]) by avalon.reed.wattle.id.au (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.Beta3) with SMTP id TAA00441 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 19:30:31 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199904040930.TAA00441@avalon.reed.wattle.id.au> Subject: scsi message To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 19:30:30 +1000 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG does anyone know what this portends (during bootup): ahc0: ahc_intr - referenced scb not valid during SELTO scb(128) SEQADDR = 0x4 SCSISEQ = 0x5a SSTAT0 = 0x15 SSTAT1 = 0x88 Darren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 3:21:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sasami.jurai.net (sasami.jurai.net [207.153.65.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 774E614F4E for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 03:21:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from winter@jurai.net) Received: from localhost (winter@localhost) by sasami.jurai.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id GAA17096; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 06:19:45 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 06:19:44 -0400 (EDT) From: "Matthew N. Dodd" To: Brian Feldman Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw uid In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 3 Apr 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > {"/usr/src/sbin/ipfw"}# ipfw show > 00050 8157 2864127 count ip from any to any uid 1000 in > 00060 8952 1834453 count ip from any to any uid 1000 out This is, by far, the most BOFHly software feature I've seen in a while. Add 'gid', 'egid', 'euid' etc. support and you'll have it. Something like this can help prevent individual users from sucking up your whole line. -- | Matthew N. Dodd | 78 280Z | 75 164E | 84 245DL | FreeBSD/NetBSD/Sprite/VMS | | winter@jurai.net | This Space For Rent | ix86,sparc,m68k,pmax,vax | | http://www.jurai.net/~winter | Are you k-rad elite enough for my webpage? | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 5:29: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lion.butya.kz (butya-gw.butya.kz [194.87.112.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF1FD15282 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 05:28:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bp@butya.kz) Received: from bp (helo=localhost) by lion.butya.kz with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10Tlwq-000DXQ-00; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 19:24:20 +0700 Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 19:24:20 +0700 (ALMST) From: Boris Popov To: Brian Feldman Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw uid In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 3 Apr 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > Is anyone interested in trying out my addition of per-uid firewalling > capabilities to ipfw? I just did them today, but they seem to work fine. > For instance, logging/accounting purpouses: > > {"/usr/src/sbin/ipfw"}# ipfw show > 00050 8157 2864127 count ip from any to any uid 1000 in > 00060 8952 1834453 count ip from any to any uid 1000 out > This should help to simplify accounting/access restriction on a per-daemon basis. Good examples are httpd and bind (running in sandbox). -- Boris Popov http://www.butya.kz/~bp/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 7:30:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pluto.ipass.net (pluto.ipass.net [198.79.53.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3EC5814F08 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 07:30:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mmercer@ipass.net) Received: from ipass.net (ts4-47-ppp.ipass.net [207.120.205.47]) by pluto.ipass.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id KAA14215 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 10:28:54 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <370777B3.EF5C328@ipass.net> Date: Sun, 04 Apr 1999 10:31:15 -0400 From: "Michael E. Mercer" Reply-To: mmercer@ipass.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Config file builder? References: <37070C34.1113084F@ipass.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello all, I have gotten Greg Lehey's input on writing a curses-based program to build your kernel config file. Can I get your input as well? Thanks Michael Mercer mmercer@ipass.net >On Sunday, 4 April 1999 at 1:52:36 -0500, Michael E. Mercer wrote: >> Greg, >> >> I am sitting here toying around with the idea of writing >> a curses based kernel configuration tool, that when used >> will write your kernel configuration file for you. >> >> Is there already an existing tool to do this for you? > >For me personally? No. I don't know of any. > >> If not, what is the feasibility of writing one and keeping it up to >> date? > >It's feasible. I don't know if it's a good idea. It would certainly >be a lot of work keeping it up-to-date. > >> I was thinking about this because it would seem easier for newbies >> and others to get a custom kernel. > >Yes, it would seem easier. > >> Let me know your thoughts man. > >I personally don't think much of this kind of tool, though possibly >you could convince me of the contrary. My main concerns are: > >1. "Curses-based" makes it sound like an editor. We already have > editors, and I don't know if a new one wouldn't duplicate effort > and still not do what people want. > >2. I don't know how it would present the information more succinctly > or in a more easily understood manner than in the text. Sure, we > could tidy up, say, LINT, but to build a kernel config file you > have to understand the underlying concepts. I don't see how a > utility would help there. > >I'm not trying to discourage you, and it's quite possible that you can >prove me wrong. But I don't think the main effort will be in the >curses-based part, though that could be a challenge in itself, but in >the logic of building a config file in the first place. I'll >certainly answer any questions you may have, but you might like to >pass it past -hackers. I fear you won't get a very enthusiastic >reception. > >Greg >-- >See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers >finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 8: 6:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1F8914E9F for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 08:06:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA21344; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 11:04:55 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 11:04:54 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: "Matthew N. Dodd" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw uid In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Matthew N. Dodd wrote: > On Sat, 3 Apr 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > > {"/usr/src/sbin/ipfw"}# ipfw show > > 00050 8157 2864127 count ip from any to any uid 1000 in > > 00060 8952 1834453 count ip from any to any uid 1000 out > > This is, by far, the most BOFHly software feature I've seen in a while. > > Add 'gid', 'egid', 'euid' etc. support and you'll have it. > > Something like this can help prevent individual users from sucking up your > whole line. Especially coupled with dummynet, which I haven't tried yet. My order for working on this is now two priorites. 1. Get incoming packets counted correctly. This is not easy, it seems. 2. Get gids working. This won't be too hard, but it's less important. If you have any good ideas on the easiest way to find the destination of a packet (tcp and udp) BEFORE they reach ipfw (in ip_input of course), I'm interested (as it will save me time trying to figure this out.) > > -- > | Matthew N. Dodd | 78 280Z | 75 164E | 84 245DL | FreeBSD/NetBSD/Sprite/VMS | > | winter@jurai.net | This Space For Rent | ix86,sparc,m68k,pmax,vax | > | http://www.jurai.net/~winter | Are you k-rad elite enough for my webpage? | > > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 9: 5:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.skylink.it (ns.skylink.it [194.177.113.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4277714D40 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 09:05:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hibma@skylink.it) Received: from heidi.plazza.it (va-188.skylink.it [194.177.113.188]) by ns.skylink.it (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA26539; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 18:01:53 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost.plazza.it [127.0.0.1]) by heidi.plazza.it (8.8.8/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA01804; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 18:02:43 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 18:02:43 +0200 (CEST) From: Nick Hibma X-Sender: n_hibma@heidi.plazza.it Reply-To: Nick Hibma To: FreeBSD hackers mailing list Cc: USB BSD list Subject: disassembling i386 code Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I would like to fetch some hints for doing things out of the object code of a windblows driver for a FreeBSD driver I am writing (USB Zip drive). The device is standards compliant, but the marketing department of Iomega has forgotten to tell us about how compliant it is and where the compliancy breaks (for the iMac: 'We suggest you use our drivers, not the ones from Apple' :-/ ). Could anyone tell me what I could use to disassemble the object code file, either into assembler or otherwise maybe into C? Cheers, Nick FreeBSD USB project To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 9:34:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D5B314D40 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 09:34:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bob@luke.pmr.com) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id LAA17303 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 11:32:15 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bob) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 11:32:15 -0500 From: Bob Willcox To: hackers list Subject: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable Message-ID: <19990404113214.A17251@luke.pmr.com> Reply-To: Bob Willcox Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi all, I cvsuped and did a make world and new kernel build on one of my systems here yesterday and everytime I attempt to boot the new kernels I get the following: elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed can't read 'kernel' Fortunately, I can still boot the old kernel (its about a week old). On the off chance something changed in the boot blocks I did install that as well. Anyone have any idea what may be wrong here? Thanks, Bob -- Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 10:17: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21DAB14CE8 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 10:17:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA78632; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 18:17:13 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 18:17:13 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Nick Hibma Cc: FreeBSD hackers mailing list , USB BSD list Subject: Re: disassembling i386 code In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Nick Hibma wrote: > > I would like to fetch some hints for doing things out of the object code > of a windblows driver for a FreeBSD driver I am writing (USB Zip drive). > > The device is standards compliant, but the marketing department of > Iomega has forgotten to tell us about how compliant it is and where the > compliancy breaks (for the iMac: 'We suggest you use our drivers, not > the ones from Apple' :-/ ). > > Could anyone tell me what I could use to disassemble the object code > file, either into assembler or otherwise maybe into C? If you are lucky, you might be able to use 'objdump --disassemble' using the version of objdump in the cygwin toolset. There is a commercial disassembler for Windows, Sourcer from V Communications. Have a look at http://www.v-com.com/products/sourcer.html but it costs money... -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 10:19: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFF3114CD2 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 10:18:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bob@luke.pmr.com) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id MAA17733 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 12:16:55 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bob) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 12:16:55 -0500 From: Bob Willcox To: hackers list Subject: Re: dump wd0: wddump: timeout waiting for DRQ ... Message-ID: <19990404121655.A17678@luke.pmr.com> Reply-To: Bob Willcox References: <19990403204038.A10887@luke.pmr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <19990403204038.A10887@luke.pmr.com>; from Bob Willcox on Sat, Apr 03, 1999 at 08:40:38PM -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG To followup on this, I was able to get a crash dump written by turning off all of the flags on wdc0 (i.e., disabling DMA and LBA support). It looks like there may be a bug here but with a workaround and the new IDE support on the horizon, perhaps its not too important. Bob On Sat, Apr 03, 1999 at 08:40:38PM -0600, Bob Willcox wrote: > When I get a panic on one of my systems here and attempt to take a dump from > the debugger (via the "panic" command) I get this error message: > > dumping to dev 20001, offset 155776 > dump wd0: wddump: timeout waiting for DRQ (status 51 error 10 (no_id) > i/o error > > Can somebody possibly tell me whats wrong? Normally I use SCSI drives > (except for my laptop, this is the only system I have with IDE) and have > not had any trouble getting crash dumps to work. I have included my > kernel configuration file below. > > Thanks, > Bob > [ snipped kernel config ] -- Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 11:21:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7668915304 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 11:21:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA63112; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 11:18:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904041818.LAA63112@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Doug Rabson Cc: Nick Hibma , FreeBSD hackers mailing list , USB BSD list Subject: Re: disassembling i386 code In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 04 Apr 1999 18:17:13 BST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 04 Apr 1999 11:18:35 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Is it possible to write a USB sniffer where the sniffer runs in a FreeBSD box? Amancio > On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Nick Hibma wrote: > > > > > I would like to fetch some hints for doing things out of the object code > > of a windblows driver for a FreeBSD driver I am writing (USB Zip drive). > > > > The device is standards compliant, but the marketing department of > > Iomega has forgotten to tell us about how compliant it is and where the > > compliancy breaks (for the iMac: 'We suggest you use our drivers, not > > the ones from Apple' :-/ ). > > > > Could anyone tell me what I could use to disassemble the object code > > file, either into assembler or otherwise maybe into C? > > If you are lucky, you might be able to use 'objdump --disassemble' using > the version of objdump in the cygwin toolset. > > There is a commercial disassembler for Windows, Sourcer from V > Communications. Have a look at http://www.v-com.com/products/sourcer.html > but it costs money... > > -- > Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com > Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 11:35: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.dyn.ml.org (pm3-26.ppp.wenet.net [206.15.85.26]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A2AF14F4E for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 11:35:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garbanzo@hooked.net) Received: from localhost (garbanzo@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.dyn.ml.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA22865; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 11:32:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garbanzo@hooked.net) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 11:32:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex Zepeda To: Bob Willcox Cc: hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable In-Reply-To: <19990404113214.A17251@luke.pmr.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Bob Willcox wrote: > On the off chance something changed in the boot blocks I did install > that as well. This is AFAIK a boot blocks issue. Go into /usr/src/sys/boot && make all install && disklabel -B wd0 or whatever your boot device is. - alex To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 11:37:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1918814C36 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 11:37:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bob@luke.pmr.com) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id NAA18433; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 13:35:38 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bob) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 13:35:38 -0500 From: Bob Willcox To: Alex Zepeda Cc: hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable Message-ID: <19990404133538.A18402@luke.pmr.com> Reply-To: Bob Willcox References: <19990404113214.A17251@luke.pmr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: ; from Alex Zepeda on Sun, Apr 04, 1999 at 11:32:56AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Apr 04, 1999 at 11:32:56AM -0700, Alex Zepeda wrote: > On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Bob Willcox wrote: > > > On the off chance something changed in the boot blocks I did install > > that as well. > > This is AFAIK a boot blocks issue. Go into /usr/src/sys/boot && make all > install && disklabel -B wd0 or whatever your boot device is. Hmm, does not a "make installworld" do this? It looked like my boot blocks were current (as of when I did the installworld) and I did do a disklabel -B da0 yet the boot still failed. > > - alex -- Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 11:40:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.dyn.ml.org (pm3-26.ppp.wenet.net [206.15.85.26]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E75714CBB for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 11:40:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garbanzo@hooked.net) Received: from localhost (garbanzo@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.dyn.ml.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA26402; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 11:38:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garbanzo@hooked.net) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 11:38:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex Zepeda To: Bob Willcox Cc: hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable In-Reply-To: <19990404133538.A18402@luke.pmr.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Bob Willcox wrote: > Hmm, does not a "make installworld" do this? It looked like my boot > blocks were current (as of when I did the installworld) and I did do a > > disklabel -B da0 > > yet the boot still failed. Hmm, well, the above solution fixed things for me. You can check the date stamps/versions of the boot blocks when you boot to see if they really did get updated. - alex To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 11:42:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sasami.jurai.net (sasami.jurai.net [207.153.65.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B13015342 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 11:41:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from winter@jurai.net) Received: from localhost (winter@localhost) by sasami.jurai.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA22644; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 14:39:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 14:39:26 -0400 (EDT) From: "Matthew N. Dodd" To: Brian Feldman Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw uid In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > Especially coupled with dummynet, which I haven't tried yet. My order for > working on this is now two priorites. > 1. Get incoming packets counted correctly. This is not easy, it seems. > 2. Get gids working. This won't be too hard, but it's less important. > > If you have any good ideas on the easiest way to find the destination of a > packet (tcp and udp) BEFORE they reach ipfw (in ip_input of course), I'm > interested (as it will save me time trying to figure this out.) I was looking around in some of this code trying to figure out how to determing the output interface inside of tcp_output() or udp_output. Similar problem. (problem in the sense that theres no easy solution). This was related to Bill Paul's checksum offloading in his gigabit ethernet driver. Anyhow, I've got no solutions for either problem. :/ -- | Matthew N. Dodd | 78 280Z | 75 164E | 84 245DL | FreeBSD/NetBSD/Sprite/VMS | | winter@jurai.net | This Space For Rent | ix86,sparc,m68k,pmax,vax | | http://www.jurai.net/~winter | Are you k-rad elite enough for my webpage? | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 11:43:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 024871502C for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 11:43:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bob@luke.pmr.com) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id NAA18490; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 13:40:49 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bob) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 13:40:49 -0500 From: Bob Willcox To: Alex Zepeda Cc: hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable Message-ID: <19990404134049.B18402@luke.pmr.com> Reply-To: Bob Willcox References: <19990404133538.A18402@luke.pmr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: ; from Alex Zepeda on Sun, Apr 04, 1999 at 11:38:56AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Apr 04, 1999 at 11:38:56AM -0700, Alex Zepeda wrote: > On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Bob Willcox wrote: > > > Hmm, does not a "make installworld" do this? It looked like my boot > > blocks were current (as of when I did the installworld) and I did do a > > > > disklabel -B da0 > > > > yet the boot still failed. > > Hmm, well, the above solution fixed things for me. You can check the > date stamps/versions of the boot blocks when you boot to see if they > really did get updated. If I can figure out how. I haven't much experience with the new boot loader yet so I don't know what's available. Not sure just when I will get to rebooting the machine (its one of my main servers). > > - alex -- Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 12: 4:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 63B4714CBB for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 12:04:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA08044; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 13:02:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id NAA82653; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 13:03:13 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199904041903.NAA82653@harmony.village.org> To: Chuck Robey Subject: Re: gdb 4.17 Cc: "David O'Brien" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 27 Mar 1999 07:55:18 EST." References: Date: Sun, 04 Apr 1999 13:03:13 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message Chuck Robey writes: : You know what you're doing, but I want to suggest that perhaps you want : to run that archs part past Warner, who recently (boy, I hope it was : Warner, I think it was) added the MIPS stuff into the tree, and is : pretty strongly in favor of making cross-compilation possible. Yes. I added support to our binutils to generate mips binaries. I think that if other groups want their port in the tree, that should be the first step, with the second making egcs work for the port. I hope to have that done in the next couple of weeks. The only other two architectures that I think there'd be support for would be sparc and arm. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 14: 0:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5EC1152BC for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 14:00:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA51478; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 16:56:13 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 16:56:12 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Bob Willcox Cc: Alex Zepeda , hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable In-Reply-To: <19990404133538.A18402@luke.pmr.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Bob Willcox wrote: > On Sun, Apr 04, 1999 at 11:32:56AM -0700, Alex Zepeda wrote: > > On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Bob Willcox wrote: > > > > > On the off chance something changed in the boot blocks I did install > > > that as well. > > > > This is AFAIK a boot blocks issue. Go into /usr/src/sys/boot && make all > > install && disklabel -B wd0 or whatever your boot device is. > > Hmm, does not a "make installworld" do this? It looked like my boot > blocks were current (as of when I did the installworld) and I did do a > > disklabel -B da0 Why did you leave off the -b and -s flags (as shown in disklabel(5)) ? > > yet the boot still failed. > > > > > - alex > > -- > Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no > bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is > Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever > been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@glue.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 14:16:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from localhost (00-60-67-24-29-83.bconnected.net [209.53.16.157]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 813C1152FA for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 14:16:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jwalther@localhost) Received: from jwalther by localhost with local-smtp (Exim 2.11 #1 (Debian)) id 10TuCb-0000XP-00; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 14:13:09 -0700 Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 14:13:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Jonathan Walther X-Sender: jwalther@localhost To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Luigi sound: fullduplex taken out? why? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Browsing the source, it looks like the full duplex capability for soundblasters was taken out of the Luigi code thats in 3.1-CURRENT and up. Can anyone tell me why this is so? Or do I need to make some ioctl's other than SNDCTL_DSP_SETDUPLEX to access the card in full duplex mode? Jonathan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 14:44:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D898150BE for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 14:44:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bob@luke.pmr.com) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id QAA20388; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 16:42:50 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bob) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 16:42:50 -0500 From: Bob Willcox To: Chuck Robey Cc: Bob Willcox , Alex Zepeda , hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable Message-ID: <19990404164249.B19096@luke.pmr.com> Reply-To: Bob Willcox References: <19990404133538.A18402@luke.pmr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: ; from Chuck Robey on Sun, Apr 04, 1999 at 04:56:12PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Apr 04, 1999 at 04:56:12PM -0400, Chuck Robey wrote: > On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Bob Willcox wrote: > > > On Sun, Apr 04, 1999 at 11:32:56AM -0700, Alex Zepeda wrote: > > > On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Bob Willcox wrote: > > > > > > > On the off chance something changed in the boot blocks I did install > > > > that as well. > > > > > > This is AFAIK a boot blocks issue. Go into /usr/src/sys/boot && make all > > > install && disklabel -B wd0 or whatever your boot device is. > > > > Hmm, does not a "make installworld" do this? It looked like my boot > > blocks were current (as of when I did the installworld) and I did do a > > > > disklabel -B da0 > > Why did you leave off the -b and -s flags (as shown in disklabel(5)) ? Guess I assumed the defaults would be correct. The boot files in /boot on the system appeared to be what I wanted: total 294 -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 512 Apr 4 09:59 boot0 -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 512 Apr 4 09:59 boot1 -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 7680 Apr 4 09:59 boot2 -r-xr-xr-x 1 root wheel 131072 Apr 4 09:59 loader -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 11462 Mar 27 21:12 loader.help -r-xr-xr-x 1 root wheel 131072 Mar 27 21:12 loader.old > > > > > yet the boot still failed. > > > > > > > > - alex > > > > -- > > Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no > > bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is > > Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever > > been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- > Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data > chuckr@glue.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. > 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | > Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) > (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- > > > -- Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 14:58: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.dyn.ml.org (pm3-7.ppp.wenet.net [206.15.85.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16F9414E28 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 14:57:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garbanzo@hooked.net) Received: from localhost (garbanzo@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.dyn.ml.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA33021; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 14:56:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garbanzo@hooked.net) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 14:56:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex Zepeda To: Chuck Robey Cc: Bob Willcox , hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Chuck Robey wrote: > > disklabel -B da0 > > Why did you leave off the -b and -s flags (as shown in disklabel(5)) ? The defaults should be correct. At least they worked for me :) - alex To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 15:16:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82CF515330 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 15:16:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA00557; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 18:11:22 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 18:11:22 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Alex Zepeda Cc: Bob Willcox , hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Alex Zepeda wrote: > On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Chuck Robey wrote: > > > > disklabel -B da0 > > > > Why did you leave off the -b and -s flags (as shown in disklabel(5)) ? > > The defaults should be correct. At least they worked for me :) The defaults come from the disktab, but what harm could there be in doing the explicit version? You can do it 10 times over with no problem involved, so give it a try. > > - alex > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@glue.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 15:23:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BED461536F for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 15:23:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bob@luke.pmr.com) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id RAA20755; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 17:21:05 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bob) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 17:21:05 -0500 From: Bob Willcox To: Chuck Robey Cc: Alex Zepeda , Bob Willcox , hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable Message-ID: <19990404172105.C19096@luke.pmr.com> Reply-To: Bob Willcox References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: ; from Chuck Robey on Sun, Apr 04, 1999 at 06:11:22PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Apr 04, 1999 at 06:11:22PM -0400, Chuck Robey wrote: > On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Alex Zepeda wrote: > > > On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Chuck Robey wrote: > > > > > > disklabel -B da0 > > > > > > Why did you leave off the -b and -s flags (as shown in disklabel(5)) ? > > > > The defaults should be correct. At least they worked for me :) > > The defaults come from the disktab, but what harm could there be in > doing the explicit version? You can do it 10 times over with no problem > involved, so give it a try. Perhaps, but I'm fairly certain that the boot blocks are not the problem. The 5-day old 3.1-stable kernel boots just fine with the current boot blocks as well as with the previous boot blocks that were there. I suspect the problem is elsewhere, but I don't know where. Unfortunately I've been real busy with trying to find a fix or workaround to my "Receive 1" panic on my amanda backup server and haven't tried rebooting the system in question lately (in the last 4 hours). Bob -- Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 15:25:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.dyn.ml.org (pm3-7.ppp.wenet.net [206.15.85.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B855D15368 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 15:25:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garbanzo@hooked.net) Received: from localhost (garbanzo@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.dyn.ml.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id PAA33179; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 15:23:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garbanzo@hooked.net) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 15:23:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex Zepeda To: Chuck Robey Cc: Bob Willcox , hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > The defaults come from the disktab, but what harm could there be in > doing the explicit version? You can do it 10 times over with no problem > involved, so give it a try. From the disklabel(8) man page: [...] The names of the programs are taken from the ``b0'' and ``b1'' parameters of the disktab(5) entry for the disk if disktype was given and its disktab entry exists and includes those param- eters. Otherwise, the default boot image names are used, these being: /boot/boot1 and /boot/boot2 for the standard stage1 and stage2 boot im- ages (details may vary on architectures like the Alpha, where only a sin- gle-stage boot is used). [...] disklabel -B da0 Install a new bootstrap on da0. The boot code comes from /boot/boot1 and possibly /boot/boot2. On-disk and in-core labels are unchanged. So it seems to me that disklabel -B da0 will take /boot/boot1 and /boot/boot2 unless you tell it otherwise, sure nothing would be harmed by explicitly setting anything, but it seems like disklabel should pick up the right boot blocks (and this can easily be checked). - alex To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 16:58:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5272815332 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 16:58:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id IAA06561; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 08:56:25 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <3707FBC9.39820384@newsguy.com> Date: Mon, 05 Apr 1999 08:54:49 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Chuck Robey Cc: Bob Willcox , Alex Zepeda , hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Chuck Robey wrote: > > > Hmm, does not a "make installworld" do this? It looked like my boot > > blocks were current (as of when I did the installworld) and I did do a > > > > disklabel -B da0 > > Why did you leave off the -b and -s flags (as shown in disklabel(5)) ? Because they are not needed? :-) -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "nothing better than the ability to perform cunning linguistics" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 17:19:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F2DF14C56 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 17:19:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA94005; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 20:10:09 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 20:10:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Cc: Bob Willcox , Alex Zepeda , hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable In-Reply-To: <3707FBC9.39820384@newsguy.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 5 Apr 1999, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > Chuck Robey wrote: > > > > > Hmm, does not a "make installworld" do this? It looked like my boot > > > blocks were current (as of when I did the installworld) and I did do a > > > > > > disklabel -B da0 > > > > Why did you leave off the -b and -s flags (as shown in disklabel(5)) ? > > Because they are not needed? :-) My philosophy is, first do things precisely as they are explained in the manual. If it still fails, you have a baseline. Too many times, in troubleshooting, one makes assumptions, even wholly defensible ones like the boot default files, and it makes you look stupid later on when they are proven false. It's a tiny test, costs nothing, and stops you from looking foolish later on. FWIW, yes, it *should* work as advertised, I read it before I posted, but trust *nothing* when troubleshooting. ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@glue.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 18:19:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 31AAB151E3 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 18:19:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA09240; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 19:17:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id TAA66919; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 19:18:18 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199904050118.TAA66919@harmony.village.org> To: Doug Rabson Subject: Re: disassembling i386 code Cc: Nick Hibma , FreeBSD hackers mailing list , USB BSD list In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 04 Apr 1999 18:17:13 BST." References: Date: Sun, 04 Apr 1999 19:18:18 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message Doug Rabson writes: : If you are lucky, you might be able to use 'objdump --disassemble' using : the version of objdump in the cygwin toolset. This supposedly works. However, the objdump output is somewhat less than wonderful for these projects. : There is a commercial disassembler for Windows, Sourcer from V : Communications. Have a look at http://www.v-com.com/products/sourcer.html : but it costs money... Sourcer is why I took an interest in the doscmd program earlier in the year. I managed to get things to the point where sourcer's main programs would run, but not the batch files. The program is a pain to use, but does give OK results. There are boatloads of disassemblers that run under windows. Do a web search for them and you'll see plenty. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 22:15:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from danberlin.resnet.rochester.edu (danberlin.resnet.rochester.edu [128.151.84.217]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id AFAC1153C6 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 22:15:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@danberlin.resnet.rochester.edu) Received: (from root@localhost) by danberlin.resnet.rochester.edu (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) id BAA21404; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 01:08:20 -0700 From: Daniel Berlin MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <14088.28531.908490.405287@danberlin.resnet.rochester.edu> Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 01:08:19 -0700 (PDT) To: Warner Losh Cc: Doug Rabson , Nick Hibma , FreeBSD hackers mailing list , USB BSD list Subject: Re: disassembling i386 code In-Reply-To: <199904050118.TAA66919@harmony.village.org> References: <199904050118.TAA66919@harmony.village.org> X-Mailer: VM 6.67 under 21.0 "20 minutes to Nikko" XEmacs Lucid (beta67) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Actually, the best dissasembler around is IDA Pro from DataRescue. This is for just about any executable format on x86, ELF/PEF on PPC, and a few other andom processors in the standard version (i860, SH-4, and JAVA). It's really pretty damn amazing. I've used sourcer before (used it for years), but ever since IDA came about, it's blown everything else out of the water. I've dissasembled BeOS executables (PEF on PPC, ELF on x86, used to be PE) , JAVA class files (I'll admit it's not the best tool for doing JAVA class files, because it looks at it from the point of view of a java processor), and a bunch of other stuff with it, never had a problem. It makes sourcer look like a 3rd grade science project. There little blurb says it best: " IDA Pro is simply the world's most advanced disassembler. It mixes multi pass analysis, stack variables, symbolic constants, unicode, ELF support, color highlighting, C++ name demangling to compiler library recognition in a stunning package ! " http://www.datarescue.com grab the demo, but the input file size is limited to 64k. it's a bit pricey, but do a dejanews search on ida 3.84 or ida 3.8, and read what people say about it. I've yet to see a negative comment yet. I'll stop now before i start to sound like i get paid to say this stuff :P, Dan Warner Losh writes: > In message Doug Rabson writes: > : If you are lucky, you might be able to use 'objdump --disassemble' using > : the version of objdump in the cygwin toolset. > > This supposedly works. However, the objdump output is somewhat less > than wonderful for these projects. > > : There is a commercial disassembler for Windows, Sourcer from V > : Communications. Have a look at http://www.v-com.com/products/sourcer.html > : but it costs money... > > Sourcer is why I took an interest in the doscmd program earlier in the > year. I managed to get things to the point where sourcer's main > programs would run, but not the batch files. The program is a pain to > use, but does give OK results. > > There are boatloads of disassemblers that run under windows. Do a web > search for them and you'll see plenty. > > Warner > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 22:28:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C63114ED6 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 22:28:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id WAA06459; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 22:26:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 22:26:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904050526.WAA06459@apollo.backplane.com> To: Garance A Drosihn Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: Kernel panic question. - need KVA fix in -STABLE!! References: Message from "Addr.com Web Hosting" of "Fri, 02 Apr 1999 11:25:33 PST." <4.1.19990402112404.0267b120@mail.addr.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> you have both. :I :> :> If you wish I can (via private email) step you through the patch :> for this, it is not complicated. : :Will we (FreeBSD) be sure to have this fix in -STABE before it :becomes 3.2-RELEASE? The way this KVA issue behaves, it causes :things to break in very non-obvious ways. It's cheap enough to :buy RAM that more and more people may find themselves running :into this. If the %ebx hack handles the more commonly available BSDI binaries, which it apparently does, I'd say almost certainly. Hopefully nobody will forget :-). The parallel port probing also needs to be fixed prior to 3.2. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 22:36:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4F3C14C1F; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 22:36:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id PAA01372; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:04:17 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id PAA07729; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:04:15 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990405150414.G2142@lemis.com> Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:04:14 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Mark Ovens Cc: "Matthew D. Fuller" , questions@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) References: <19990331003535.E17547@futuresouth.com> <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com> <19990401003831.A2788@marder-1.localhost> <19990401091616.M413@lemis.com> <3703325A.445E99E4@uk.radan.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <3703325A.445E99E4@uk.radan.com>; from Mark Ovens on Thu, Apr 01, 1999 at 09:46:18AM +0100 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday, 1 April 1999 at 9:46:18 +0100, Mark Ovens wrote: > Greg Lehey wrote: >> >> On Thursday, 1 April 1999 at 0:38:31 +0100, Mark Ovens wrote: >>> On Wed, Mar 31, 1999 at 04:51:39PM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: >>>> >>>> Here are some comparative figures for building a kernel on my main >>>> machine (AMD K6-2/333, 160 MB memory): >>>> >>>> normal debug >>>> Make all 4:30 5:0 >>>> Kernel size 1.8 MB 9 MB >>>> Directory size 5.5 MB 24 MB >>>> >>> >>> Out of interest I did a ``make all'' on the 3.1-R GENERIC kernel and >>> these are my figures. My machine is an AMD K6/233 (an original K6, >>> not a -2), 64MB memory, 128MB swap, U/W SCSI HD: >>> >>> normal >>> Make all 4:25 >>> Kernel size 2.2 MB >>> Directory size 6.3 MB >>> >>> Are the clock and clock multiplier jumpers set correctly on your >>> m/b ;-). >> >> I'm wondering about that, too. I just replaced a K6/233 with a >> K6-2/333 and got almost no performance increase. But the speed is >> reported correctly on bootup. I'm using a really old Conner drive, >> and I suspect that's the bottleneck. >> > > Hmm, what m/b are you using One that you've almost certainly never heard of, a Rise Mustang R581A with a SiS 5591/5595 chip set. > (a K6-2/333 requires 100MHz doesn't it?). No. It can support 100MHz, but I don't know of any processors which require it. > I've noticed several m/b manufacturers announcing that their m/bs > for the original K6's will run K6-2s with just a BIOS u/g. I'm a bit > suspicious of that, AFAIK there are some significant architecture > differences between the K6 and K6-2. Shouldn't that require a > new/modified chipset to support properly?. I don't see why. Anyway, it works, and I don't even have enough information to be sure that it's not working correctly. The times shown above were compiling on a big, old SCSI drive which is definitely the slowest of the disks on my system (the others are all fast IDE :-). > Have you'd looked at http://www.amd.com ? Yes, I've looked there, and downloaded a lot of information. > They have lists of m/bs that they have tested (and approved) for > each of their chips. I used that to decide which m/b to buy > (Gigabyte GA586-TX3). I don't see that at that URL. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 22:46: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBB5F14D64 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 22:46:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA30907 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 01:44:14 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 01:44:05 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: ipfw uid mods (seemingly) done Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'd like some more testing of the ipfw uid mods (found at http://janus.syracuse.net/~green/public_html/ipfw_uid.patch) before I'm truly comfortable that it's fine and dandy. I added incoming packet support today, as you can see: {"/home/green"}# ipfw show 00010 26 4810 count udp from any to any uid 1000 in 00020 36 3451 count udp from any to any uid 1000 out 00030 62 8261 count udp from any to any uid 1000 00040 10027 3515352 count tcp from any to any uid 1000 in 00050 10722 730029 count tcp from any to any uid 1000 out 00060 20749 4245381 count tcp from any to any uid 1000 00070 10053 3520162 count ip from any to any uid 1000 in 00080 10758 733480 count ip from any to any uid 1000 out 00090 20811 4253642 count ip from any to any uid 1000 00100 17388 5219622 allow ip from any to any via lo0 00200 0 0 allow ip from any to 127.0.0.0/8 out 00300 0 0 deny ip from any to 127.0.0.0/8 00400 0 0 allow ip from any to 10.0.0.0/8 via ppp0 00410 0 0 deny ip from any to 10.0.0.0/8 in 00500 0 0 allow ip from any to 192.168.0.0/16 via ppp0 00510 0 0 deny ip from any to 192.168.0.0/16 in 00600 0 0 allow tcp from any to any 6010 in 00610 0 0 deny tcp from any to any 6000-6063 in 65535 6731 2122739 allow ip from any to any Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 22:56:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (spinner.netplex.com.au [202.12.86.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9E1E14FAD for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 22:56:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spinner.netplex.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3/Netplex) with ESMTP id NAA06717; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 13:54:17 +0800 (WST) (envelope-from peter@spinner.netplex.com.au) Message-Id: <199904050554.NAA06717@spinner.netplex.com.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "Matthew N. Dodd" Cc: Brian Feldman , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw uid In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 04 Apr 1999 14:39:26 -0400." Date: Mon, 05 Apr 1999 13:54:17 +0800 From: Peter Wemm Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Matthew N. Dodd" wrote: > On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > > Especially coupled with dummynet, which I haven't tried yet. My order for > > working on this is now two priorites. > > 1. Get incoming packets counted correctly. This is not easy, it seems. > > 2. Get gids working. This won't be too hard, but it's less important. > > > > If you have any good ideas on the easiest way to find the destination of a > > packet (tcp and udp) BEFORE they reach ipfw (in ip_input of course), I'm > > interested (as it will save me time trying to figure this out.) > > I was looking around in some of this code trying to figure out how to > determing the output interface inside of tcp_output() or udp_output. > Similar problem. (problem in the sense that theres no easy solution). > This was related to Bill Paul's checksum offloading in his gigabit > ethernet driver. > > Anyhow, I've got no solutions for either problem. :/ At one point I was toying with the idea of trying to do something like this kind of counting at the socket level, rather than at the packet stream level. Sure, it would have lost the packet overheads, but it should be easier.. Cheers, -Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 23:37:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5381514FAD for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 23:37:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from s204m82.isp.whistle.com (s204m82.isp.whistle.com [207.76.204.82] (may be forged)) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id XAA53777; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 23:32:41 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 23:32:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer X-Sender: julian@s204m82.isp.whistle.com To: Peter Wemm Cc: "Matthew N. Dodd" , Brian Feldman , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw uid In-Reply-To: <199904050554.NAA06717@spinner.netplex.com.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 5 Apr 1999, Peter Wemm wrote: > At one point I was toying with the idea of trying to do something like this > kind of counting at the socket level, rather than at the packet stream > level. Sure, it would have lost the packet overheads, but it should be > easier.. > > Cheers, > -Peter One reason to do it at the socket level is that UID accounting can only work on the local level anyway. Doing it at the lower levels uses resources for all traffic local or not.. You also get charged for all retries etc which may, or may not, be fair depending on your point of view. Also doing it at socket layer allows you to not incur any work in the case of excempt processes. Whether a process should or should not be charged can be cached in the socket structure rather than being worked out on the fly each time. I don't think the ipfw interface is the right place for this. ipfw is acting as a cancerous growth. Speaking as one of the culprits, I think it's possibly time to think about the careful cleaning of hte FreeBSD stacks. Garret has som good work in the wings re: the tcp timers, but there are a number of really messy parts. e.g. rtentries refer directly to interfaces in a number of places where they should refer to the ifaddrs. reference counting between ifaddrs and ifnets and rtentries is pretty much broken, and only works by 'good will'. The ability to invalidate addresses and interfaces is held together by chewing gum. Recovery of old rtentries is in great need of cleaning up. julian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 4 23:51:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 76C1A14FAD for ; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 23:51:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA31647; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 02:49:43 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 02:49:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: Julian Elischer Cc: Peter Wemm , "Matthew N. Dodd" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw uid In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Julian Elischer wrote: > On Mon, 5 Apr 1999, Peter Wemm wrote: > > > At one point I was toying with the idea of trying to do something like this > > kind of counting at the socket level, rather than at the packet stream > > level. Sure, it would have lost the packet overheads, but it should be > > easier.. > > > > Cheers, > > -Peter > > One reason to do it at the socket level is that UID accounting can only > work on the local level anyway. Doing it at the lower levels uses > resources for all traffic local or not.. You also get charged for all > retries etc which may, or may not, be fair depending on your point of > view. But this is about so much more than accounting. Say, I could prevent certain users from certain IPs with certain ports, certain protocols, etc. This is flexibility in a REAL firewall, not just some little IP accounting thing. Besides, I'm finished with it! > > Also doing it at socket layer allows you to not incur any work in the case > of excempt processes. Whether a process should or should not be charged > can be cached in the socket structure rather than being worked out on the > fly each time. > > I don't think the ipfw interface is the right place for this. > > ipfw is acting as a cancerous growth. Speaking as one of the culprits, > I think it's possibly time to think about the careful cleaning of hte > FreeBSD stacks. Garret has som good work in the wings re: the tcp timers, > but there are a number of really messy parts. > > e.g. > rtentries refer directly to interfaces in a number of places where they > should refer to the ifaddrs. reference counting between ifaddrs and ifnets > and rtentries is pretty much broken, and only works by 'good will'. > The ability to invalidate addresses and interfaces is held together by > chewing gum. Recovery of old rtentries is in great need of cleaning up. > > > julian > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 0: 2:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0417614FAD for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 00:02:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA31799; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 03:00:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 03:00:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: Julian Elischer Cc: Peter Wemm , "Matthew N. Dodd" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw uid In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 5 Apr 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Julian Elischer wrote: > > > On Mon, 5 Apr 1999, Peter Wemm wrote: > > > > > At one point I was toying with the idea of trying to do something like this > > > kind of counting at the socket level, rather than at the packet stream > > > level. Sure, it would have lost the packet overheads, but it should be > > > easier.. > > > > > > Cheers, > > > -Peter > > > > One reason to do it at the socket level is that UID accounting can only > > work on the local level anyway. Doing it at the lower levels uses > > resources for all traffic local or not.. You also get charged for all > > retries etc which may, or may not, be fair depending on your point of > > view. > > But this is about so much more than accounting. Say, I could prevent > certain users from certain IPs with certain ports, certain protocols, etc. > This is flexibility in a REAL firewall, not just some little IP accounting > thing. Besides, I'm finished with it! Oh yes, I almost forgot! With chroot(2) and this, you can now have a TRUE sandbox for whatever you desire. > > > > > Also doing it at socket layer allows you to not incur any work in the case > > of excempt processes. Whether a process should or should not be charged > > can be cached in the socket structure rather than being worked out on the > > fly each time. > > > > I don't think the ipfw interface is the right place for this. > > > > ipfw is acting as a cancerous growth. Speaking as one of the culprits, > > I think it's possibly time to think about the careful cleaning of hte > > FreeBSD stacks. Garret has som good work in the wings re: the tcp timers, > > but there are a number of really messy parts. > > > > e.g. > > rtentries refer directly to interfaces in a number of places where they > > should refer to the ifaddrs. reference counting between ifaddrs and ifnets > > and rtentries is pretty much broken, and only works by 'good will'. > > The ability to invalidate addresses and interfaces is held together by > > chewing gum. Recovery of old rtentries is in great need of cleaning up. > > > > > > julian > > > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ > green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ > FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | > http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 3:27:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.skylink.it (ns.skylink.it [194.177.113.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 298C514C2D for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 03:27:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hibma@skylink.it) Received: from heidi.plazza.it (va-152.skylink.it [194.177.113.152]) by ns.skylink.it (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA00851; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 12:23:04 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost.plazza.it [127.0.0.1]) by heidi.plazza.it (8.8.8/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA01804; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 18:02:43 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 18:02:43 +0200 (CEST) From: Nick Hibma X-Sender: n_hibma@heidi.plazza.it Reply-To: Nick Hibma To: FreeBSD hackers mailing list Cc: USB BSD list Subject: disassembling i386 code Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I would like to fetch some hints for doing things out of the object code of a windblows driver for a FreeBSD driver I am writing (USB Zip drive). The device is standards compliant, but the marketing department of Iomega has forgotten to tell us about how compliant it is and where the compliancy breaks (for the iMac: 'We suggest you use our drivers, not the ones from Apple' :-/ ). Could anyone tell me what I could use to disassemble the object code file, either into assembler or otherwise maybe into C? Cheers, Nick FreeBSD USB project To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 3:58:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net (post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 454F614D1E; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 03:58:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from marko@uk.radan.com) Received: from [158.152.75.22] (helo=uk.radan.com) by post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.10 #2) id 10U73i-0001ri-0K; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 10:56:50 +0000 Organisation: Radan Computational Ltd., Bath, UK. Phone: +44-1225-320320 Fax: +44-1225-320311 Received: from marder-1. (rasnt-1 [193.114.228.211]) by uk.radan.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with ESMTP id LAA01820; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 11:56:18 +0100 Received: (from marko@localhost) by marder-1. (8.9.2/8.8.8) id LAA01412; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 11:53:27 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from marko) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 11:53:27 +0100 From: Mark Ovens To: Greg Lehey Cc: questions@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) Message-ID: <19990405115327.A1360@marder-1.localhost> References: <19990331003535.E17547@futuresouth.com> <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com> <19990401003831.A2788@marder-1.localhost> <19990401091616.M413@lemis.com> <3703325A.445E99E4@uk.radan.com> <19990405150414.G2142@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <19990405150414.G2142@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Mon, Apr 05, 1999 at 03:04:14PM +0930 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Apr 05, 1999 at 03:04:14PM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: > On Thursday, 1 April 1999 at 9:46:18 +0100, Mark Ovens wrote: > > > > Hmm, what m/b are you using > > One that you've almost certainly never heard of, a Rise Mustang R581A > with a SiS 5591/5595 chip set. > > > (a K6-2/333 requires 100MHz doesn't it?). > > No. It can support 100MHz, but I don't know of any processors which > require it. > See below > > I've noticed several m/b manufacturers announcing that their m/bs > > for the original K6's will run K6-2s with just a BIOS u/g. I'm a bit > > suspicious of that, AFAIK there are some significant architecture > > differences between the K6 and K6-2. Shouldn't that require a > > new/modified chipset to support properly?. > > I don't see why. Anyway, it works, and I don't even have enough > information to be sure that it's not working correctly. The times > shown above were compiling on a big, old SCSI drive which is > definitely the slowest of the disks on my system (the others are all > fast IDE :-). > > > Have you'd looked at http://www.amd.com ? > > Yes, I've looked there, and downloaded a lot of information. > > > They have lists of m/bs that they have tested (and approved) for > > each of their chips. I used that to decide which m/b to buy > > (Gigabyte GA586-TX3). > > I don't see that at that URL. > Go to the page http://www1.amd.com/K6/k6mbl/ and choose your CPU and form factor (from www.amd.com, select "PC Processors", then "Motherboard list" from the "Product Information" drop down list box. For the K6-2/333 it says you need 95MHz bus and 3.5x multiplier. > Greg > -- > See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers > finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-questions" in the body of the message > -- FreeBSD - The Power To Serve http://www.freebsd.org My Webpage http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~markov _______________________________________________________________ Mark Ovens, CNC Apps Engineer, Radan Computational Ltd. Bath UK CAD/CAM solutions for Sheetmetal Working Industry mailto:marko@uk.radan.com http://www.radan.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 4:25:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpha.comkey.com.au (alpha.comkey.com.au [203.9.152.215]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 3142B15408 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 04:25:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gjb@comkey.com.au) Received: (qmail 728 invoked by uid 1001); 5 Apr 1999 01:25:45 -0000 Message-ID: <19990405012545.727.qmail@alpha.comkey.com.au> X-Posted-By: GBA-Post 1.04 06-Feb-1999 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 5A91 6942 8CEA 9DAB B95B C249 1CE1 493B 2B5A CE30 Date: Mon, 05 Apr 1999 11:25:44 +1000 From: Greg Black To: Greg Lehey Cc: questions@FreeBSD.ORG, FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) References: <19990331003535.E17547@futuresouth.com> <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com> In-reply-to: <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com> of Wed, 31 Mar 1999 16:51:39 +0930 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey writes: > Interestingly enough, we are currently discussing this in -hackers. > We're thinking about changing the way the kernel is built so that a > debug kernel will be the default. I think this is a terrible idea, except possibly for -current. I run a lot of FreeBSD machines, all of them -release (though some might move to -stable if needed). They never crash and I expect they never will, so debug kernels are just a waste of resources as far as I'm concerned. I'm sure this applies to lots of people who run production machines. At the very least, the decision to build a debug kernel should be up to the installer and should default to non-debug. After all, those people who might do anything with a debug kernel can easily read the instructions on building/installing such a thing and those people who just want to use FreeBSD won't be burdened with the extra compilation time, disk space, memory waste during normal operation, etc., associated with a debug kernel. -- Greg Black To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 6:45: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (blaubaer.kn-bremen.de [194.94.232.249]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1BEDA15061 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 06:45:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nox@saturn.kn-bremen.de) Received: from saturn.kn-bremen.de (uucp@localhost) by blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (8.9.1/8.9.1) with UUCP id PAA10126 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:41:56 +0200 Received: (from nox@localhost) by saturn.kn-bremen.de (8.8.8/8.8.5) id PAA14629; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:27:07 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:27:07 +0200 (MET DST) From: Juergen Lock Message-Id: <199904051327.PAA14629@saturn.kn-bremen.de> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: rfork - how to use it? X-Newsgroups: local.list.freebsd.hackers Organization: home Cc: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG OK so maybe -stable was not the right place to ask this... Do I cc -pthread ... ? Do I need current? At least on 2.2.8-stable rfork(2) is only in libc but not in libc_r and libc is not thread-safe, right? What I really want is threads that pass a valid sigcontext struct to signal handlers, I'm trying to update the emulators/wine port in case anyone wonders... Thanx, -- Juergen Lock To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 7:38:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sasami.jurai.net (sasami.jurai.net [207.153.65.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1DB2F14D21 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 07:38:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from winter@jurai.net) Received: from localhost (winter@localhost) by sasami.jurai.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA16754; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 10:36:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 10:36:27 -0400 (EDT) From: "Matthew N. Dodd" To: Brian Feldman Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw uid mods (seemingly) done In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 5 Apr 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > I'd like some more testing of the ipfw uid mods (found at > http://janus.syracuse.net/~green/public_html/ipfw_uid.patch) before > I'm truly comfortable that it's fine and dandy. I added incoming > packet support today, as you can see: If you're going to bloat the size of an m_buf, why not store a pid_t instead of a uid_t? This means you'll have to make up a struct to hold all of the values to match rules against in ip_fw (might I suggest a value/context type arrangement here as a single rule never need match more than a single gid/uid/euid/egid etc. -- | Matthew N. Dodd | 78 280Z | 75 164E | 84 245DL | FreeBSD/NetBSD/Sprite/VMS | | winter@jurai.net | This Space For Rent | ix86,sparc,m68k,pmax,vax | | http://www.jurai.net/~winter | Are you k-rad elite enough for my webpage? | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 7:43: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BCFD15125 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 07:43:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA35543; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 10:41:06 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 10:41:05 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: "Matthew N. Dodd" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw uid mods (seemingly) done In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 5 Apr 1999, Matthew N. Dodd wrote: > On Mon, 5 Apr 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > > I'd like some more testing of the ipfw uid mods (found at > > http://janus.syracuse.net/~green/public_html/ipfw_uid.patch) before > > I'm truly comfortable that it's fine and dandy. I added incoming > > packet support today, as you can see: > > If you're going to bloat the size of an m_buf, why not store a pid_t > instead of a uid_t? This means you'll have to make up a struct to hold > all of the values to match rules against in ip_fw (might I suggest a > value/context type arrangement here as a single rule never need match more > than a single gid/uid/euid/egid etc. The problem with that is that the pid might not be alive anymore, or replaced with another one! I plan on adding a random 64-bit number to struct proc for identification purpouses. I.e. p->p_pid and p->p_cookie must both match to the mbuf ones. Does this sound good to everyone? This would be a bit cleaner, and require mbuf to add both a m_pid and m_cookie. How does this sound to everyone? Generating 8 random bytes per proc invocation shouldn't be very expensive at all... > > -- > | Matthew N. Dodd | 78 280Z | 75 164E | 84 245DL | FreeBSD/NetBSD/Sprite/VMS | > | winter@jurai.net | This Space For Rent | ix86,sparc,m68k,pmax,vax | > | http://www.jurai.net/~winter | Are you k-rad elite enough for my webpage? | > > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 8:27:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hp9000.chc-chimes.com (hp9000.chc-chimes.com [206.67.97.84]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0FDBF15462 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 08:27:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from billf@chc-chimes.com) Received: from localhost by hp9000.chc-chimes.com with SMTP (1.39.111.2/16.2) id AA032463843; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 10:50:43 -0400 Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 10:50:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Bill Fumerola To: "Matthew N. Dodd" Cc: Brian Feldman , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw uid In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Matthew N. Dodd wrote: > This is, by far, the most BOFHly software feature I've seen in a while. Yes, but insanely useful. > Something like this can help prevent individual users from sucking up your > whole line. .. and be considered quite a feature. Good job Brian. - bill fumerola - billf@chc-chimes.com - BF1560 - computer horizons corp - - ph:(800) 252-2421 - bfumerol@computerhorizons.com - billf@FreeBSD.org - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 8:33:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pippin.jblhome.ping.dk (28.ppp1-15.image.dk [212.54.76.156]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D28514BE7; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 08:33:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jablo@e-postboks.dk) Received: (from jacob@localhost) by pippin.jblhome.ping.dk (8.9.2/8.9.1) id RAA79893; Sun, 4 Apr 1999 17:31:43 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from jacob) To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: Ruslan Ermilov , jkh@FreeBSD.ORG, FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: doscmd is disabled in RELENG_3 References: <24312.921273427@zippy.cdrom.com> From: Jacob Bohn Lorensen Date: 04 Apr 1999 17:31:42 +0200 In-Reply-To: "Jordan K. Hubbard"'s message of "Fri, 12 Mar 1999 13:17:07 -0800" Message-ID: <87u2uwpfkx.fsf@pippin.jblhome.ping.dk> Lines: 34 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 20.3 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >>>>> "Jordan" == Jordan K Hubbard writes: >> It seems it's safe now to re-enable doscmd in RELENG_3. What >> do you think? Jordan> Seems to work with and without X, done. Except for one thing (though I'm not sure if this is supposed to be supported): On my ELF FreeBSD-stable system I wanted to "make aout-to-elf-build" so that I later, on another computer still running 2.2.6-release (I think it is), could do a make install-aout-to-elf. However "make aout-to-elf-build" breaks trying to build doscmd. The Makefile is fooled into trying to link in the installed X11 libraries, which of course are ELF format and not suitable for use in aout-to-elf-build. Sigh. Seems that the makefile should test both if the X libraries/directories exist and whether the libraries are in the correct binary format. It looks like I can use the command "make aout-to-elf-build X11BASE=/nonexistant" to fool the Makefile into not including X11 support ind doscmd. (running this as a test right now). If this sort of "cross-compilation"/updating is not supported, it's not an issue. -- Jacob Lorensen; Mosebuen 33, 1.; DK-2820 Gentofte, Denmark; +45 39560401 PGPid: 0x752EB4DE Fingerprint: F609A0BAFF393EA904F7-F344680F8EED752EB4DE To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 8:40:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B762E14BE7 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 08:40:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA36110; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 11:38:11 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 11:38:10 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: Bill Fumerola Cc: "Matthew N. Dodd" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw uid In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 5 Apr 1999, Bill Fumerola wrote: > On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Matthew N. Dodd wrote: > > > This is, by far, the most BOFHly software feature I've seen in a while. > > Yes, but insanely useful. > > > Something like this can help prevent individual users from sucking up your > > whole line. > > .. and be considered quite a feature. Good job Brian. Thank you very much! *bows* > > - bill fumerola - billf@chc-chimes.com - BF1560 - computer horizons corp - > - ph:(800) 252-2421 - bfumerol@computerhorizons.com - billf@FreeBSD.org - > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 9: 9:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13C251543C for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 09:09:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA36428 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 12:07:09 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 12:07:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: more dd(1) weirdness Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I think I've fixed all of the dd(1) weirdness, and these patches should be committed (except for the part about block device lseeking, that should be better thought out now). Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ diff -u src/bin/dd/args.c ./args.c --- src/bin/dd/args.c Wed May 13 03:33:36 1998 +++ ./args.c Fri Apr 2 12:23:09 1999 @@ -67,7 +67,7 @@ static void f_of __P((char *)); static void f_seek __P((char *)); static void f_skip __P((char *)); -static u_long get_bsz __P((char *)); +static u_quad_t get_bsz __P((char *)); static struct arg { char *name; @@ -173,8 +173,6 @@ */ if (in.dbsz > INT_MAX || out.dbsz > INT_MAX) errx(1, "buffer sizes cannot be greater than %d", INT_MAX); - if (in.offset > INT_MAX / in.dbsz || out.offset > INT_MAX / out.dbsz) - errx(1, "seek offsets cannot be larger than %d", INT_MAX); } static int @@ -321,7 +319,7 @@ } /* - * Convert an expression of the following forms to an unsigned long. + * Convert an expression of the following forms to an unsigned quad_t. * 1) A positive decimal number. * 2) A positive decimal number followed by a b (mult by 512). * 3) A positive decimal number followed by a k (mult by 1024). @@ -331,15 +329,15 @@ * seperated by x (also * for backwards compatibility), specifying * the product of the indicated values. */ -static u_long +static u_quad_t get_bsz(val) char *val; { - u_long num, t; + u_quad_t num, t; char *expr; - num = strtoul(val, &expr, 0); - if (num == ULONG_MAX) /* Overflow. */ + num = strtouq(val, &expr, 0); + if (num == UQUAD_MAX) /* Overflow. */ err(1, "%s", oper); if (expr == val) /* No digits. */ errx(1, "%s: illegal numeric value", oper); diff -u src/bin/dd/dd.h ./dd.h --- src/bin/dd/dd.h Tue Feb 10 21:23:31 1998 +++ ./dd.h Fri Apr 2 12:09:03 1999 @@ -69,7 +69,7 @@ u_long out_part; /* # of partial output blocks */ u_long trunc; /* # of truncated records */ u_long swab; /* # of odd-length swab blocks */ - u_int64_t bytes; /* # of bytes written */ + u_quad_t bytes; /* # of bytes written */ double start; /* start time of dd */ } STAT; diff -u src/bin/dd/misc.c ./misc.c --- src/bin/dd/misc.c Mon Jan 18 11:04:13 1999 +++ ./misc.c Fri Apr 2 11:20:24 1999 @@ -58,7 +58,7 @@ { struct timeval tv; double secs; - char buf[100]; + char buf[120]; (void)gettimeofday(&tv, (struct timezone *)NULL); secs = tv.tv_sec + tv.tv_usec * 1e-6 - st.start; @@ -81,7 +81,7 @@ } (void)snprintf(buf, sizeof(buf), "%qu bytes transferred in %.6f secs (%.0f bytes/sec)\n", - st.bytes, secs, st.bytes / secs); + st.bytes, secs, (double)st.bytes / secs); (void)write(STDERR_FILENO, buf, strlen(buf)); } --- src/bin/dd/position.c.orig Sat Apr 3 09:51:26 1999 +++ src/bin/dd/position.c Sat Apr 3 09:49:27 1999 @@ -64,7 +64,7 @@ int bcnt, cnt, nr, warned; /* If not a character, pipe or tape device, try to seek on it. */ - if (!(in.flags & (ISCHR|ISPIPE|ISTAPE))) { + if (!(in.flags & (ISPIPE|ISTAPE))) { if (lseek(in.fd, (off_t)in.offset * in.dbsz, SEEK_CUR) == -1) err(1, "%s", in.name); return; --- src/bin/dd/dd.c Mon Apr 5 12:03:25 1999 +++ src/bin/dd/dd.c.new Mon Apr 5 11:57:09 1999 @@ -178,8 +178,8 @@ * table that does both at once. If just converting case, use the * built-in tables. */ - if (ddflags & (C_LCASE|C_UCASE)) - if (ddflags & C_ASCII) + if (ddflags & (C_LCASE|C_UCASE)) { + if (ddflags & C_ASCII) { if (ddflags & C_LCASE) { for (cnt = 0; cnt <= 0377; ++cnt) if (isupper(ctab[cnt])) @@ -189,7 +189,7 @@ if (islower(ctab[cnt])) ctab[cnt] = toupper(ctab[cnt]); } - else if (ddflags & C_EBCDIC) + } else if (ddflags & C_EBCDIC) { if (ddflags & C_LCASE) { for (cnt = 0; cnt <= 0377; ++cnt) if (isupper(cnt)) @@ -199,7 +199,7 @@ if (islower(cnt)) ctab[cnt] = ctab[toupper(cnt)]; } - else { + } else { ctab = ddflags & C_LCASE ? u2l : l2u; if (ddflags & C_LCASE) { for (cnt = 0; cnt <= 0377; ++cnt) @@ -215,6 +215,7 @@ ctab[cnt] = cnt; } } + } (void)gettimeofday(&tv, (struct timezone *)NULL); st.start = tv.tv_sec + tv.tv_usec * 1e-6; } @@ -247,11 +248,12 @@ * Zero the buffer first if sync; If doing block operations * use spaces. */ - if (ddflags & C_SYNC) + if (ddflags & C_SYNC) { if (ddflags & (C_BLOCK|C_UNBLOCK)) memset(in.dbp, ' ', in.dbsz); else memset(in.dbp, 0, in.dbsz); + } n = read(in.fd, in.dbp, in.dbsz); if (n == 0) { To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 11:38:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fdy2.demon.co.uk (fdy2.demon.co.uk [194.222.102.143]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3799A14EC6 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 11:38:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rjs@fdy2.demon.co.uk) Received: (from rjs@localhost) by fdy2.demon.co.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA00550; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:32:47 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from rjs) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:32:47 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199904051432.PAA00550@fdy2.demon.co.uk> From: Robert Swindells To: imp@harmony.village.org Cc: chuckr@mat.net, obrien@NUXI.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: <199904041903.NAA82653@harmony.village.org> (message from Warner Losh on Sun, 04 Apr 1999 13:03:13 -0600) Subject: Re: gdb 4.17 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Warner Losh wrote: >In message Chuck Robey writes: >: You know what you're doing, but I want to suggest that perhaps you want >: to run that archs part past Warner, who recently (boy, I hope it was >: Warner, I think it was) added the MIPS stuff into the tree, and is >: pretty strongly in favor of making cross-compilation possible. >Yes. I added support to our binutils to generate mips binaries. I >think that if other groups want their port in the tree, that should be >the first step, with the second making egcs work for the port. I hope >to have that done in the next couple of weeks. The only other two >architectures that I think there'd be support for would be sparc and >arm. I would vote for including sparc and arm as well. I'm getting a SparcStation next month and want to get either a SA1100/SA1101 evaluation board or a Chaltech motherboard for work. Robert Swindells To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 11:44:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nero.cybersites.com (nero.cybersites.com [207.92.123.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23DC214D23 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 11:44:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cyouse@cybersites.com) Received: from ns1.cybersites.com (ns1.cybersites.com [207.92.123.2]) by nero.cybersites.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA13165 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 14:49:07 -0400 From: Chuck Youse To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: gdb 4.17 Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 14:37:40 -0400 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.17] Content-Type: text/plain References: <199904051432.PAA00550@fdy2.demon.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <99040514400105.93995@ns1.cybersites.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-KMail-Mark: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'll have to put my vote in here too. Please include alternative architecture support. I ordered an eval NetWinder the other day, and will be launching a FreeBSD port shortly thereafter. The "net appliance" wave is great -- the fact that Linux is really the only choice thus far is not so great. Can't wait to have a rack full of FreeBSD NetWinders ... Chuck On Mon, 05 Apr 1999, Robert Swindells wrote: > Warner Losh wrote: > >In message Chuck Robey writes: > >: You know what you're doing, but I want to suggest that perhaps you want > >: to run that archs part past Warner, who recently (boy, I hope it was > >: Warner, I think it was) added the MIPS stuff into the tree, and is > >: pretty strongly in favor of making cross-compilation possible. > > >Yes. I added support to our binutils to generate mips binaries. I > >think that if other groups want their port in the tree, that should be > >the first step, with the second making egcs work for the port. I hope > >to have that done in the next couple of weeks. The only other two > >architectures that I think there'd be support for would be sparc and > >arm. > > I would vote for including sparc and arm as well. > > I'm getting a SparcStation next month and want to get either a > SA1100/SA1101 evaluation board or a Chaltech motherboard for > work. > > Robert Swindells > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- Chuck Youse Director of Systems cyouse@cybersites.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 12:19:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-relay2.yahoo.com (mail-relay2.yahoo.com [206.251.17.77]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABB2D1515F for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 12:19:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jayanth@yahoo-inc.com) Received: from borogove.yahoo.com (borogove.yahoo.com [205.216.162.65]) by mail-relay2.yahoo.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA18484 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 12:17:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from yahoo-inc.com (milk.yahoo.com [206.132.89.117]) by borogove.yahoo.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA17443 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 12:09:08 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <37090A53.A20F9CB8@yahoo-inc.com> Date: Mon, 05 Apr 1999 11:09:07 -0800 From: Jayanth Vijayaraghavan X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers Subject: sendfile(2) related question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Any reason why the flags used for the send() call are not being used by sendfile() ? Some of the flags like MSG_EOF can be used. thanks, jayanth To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 13:20:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E61191545C for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 13:20:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA08101; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:16:11 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:16:11 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Chuck Youse Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: gdb 4.17 In-Reply-To: <99040514400105.93995@ns1.cybersites.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 5 Apr 1999, Chuck Youse wrote: > I'll have to put my vote in here too. Please include alternative > architecture support. I ordered an eval NetWinder the other day, > and will be launching a FreeBSD port shortly thereafter. The "net > appliance" wave is great -- the fact that Linux is really the only > choice thus far is not so great. > > Can't wait to have a rack full of FreeBSD NetWinders ... I hear this a lot, but it's a little hard to believe, then there's never any code. It's fine when it's your hobby, but you guys are asking everyone to take in code, which you could very easily add yourselves on your own hook. I know it's fun, and I've got my own hobby things hidden around here that haven't all gotten as far as I'd hoped, but I don't ask everyone to pay the freight for them, either, so I feel justified. I hate to be a part-pooper. Is it not true that you can add, on your own machine, all the bits you want for your projects on your own? And, also, that just the moment your project starts to show even the teeniest bit of life, that *at that point* the code could be added to FreeBSD? It's starting to seem that merely the vaguest wish that a FreeBSD port might be nice, is enough to qualify for including all the support code. I don't want to place the too high, but how about the possibility of placing the bar just a small step higher? Maybe you could suggest some rules on where to set the bar? Something you feel would be fair to you, fair to the FreeBSDers who don't want FreeBSD to get too overweight, and also easy to quantify, so we avoid arguments in the future. > Chuck > > > On Mon, 05 Apr 1999, Robert Swindells wrote: > > Warner Losh wrote: > > >In message Chuck Robey writes: > > >: You know what you're doing, but I want to suggest that perhaps you want > > >: to run that archs part past Warner, who recently (boy, I hope it was > > >: Warner, I think it was) added the MIPS stuff into the tree, and is > > >: pretty strongly in favor of making cross-compilation possible. > > > > >Yes. I added support to our binutils to generate mips binaries. I > > >think that if other groups want their port in the tree, that should be > > >the first step, with the second making egcs work for the port. I hope > > >to have that done in the next couple of weeks. The only other two > > >architectures that I think there'd be support for would be sparc and > > >arm. > > > > I would vote for including sparc and arm as well. > > > > I'm getting a SparcStation next month and want to get either a > > SA1100/SA1101 evaluation board or a Chaltech motherboard for > > work. > > > > Robert Swindells > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > -- > Chuck Youse > Director of Systems > cyouse@cybersites.com > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@glue.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 13:35:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nero.cybersites.com (nero.cybersites.com [207.92.123.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A827715545 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 13:35:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cyouse@cybersites.com) Received: from ns1.cybersites.com (ns1.cybersites.com [207.92.123.2]) by nero.cybersites.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA18824; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:40:19 -0400 From: Chuck Youse To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: gdb 4.17 Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:29:55 -0400 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.17] Content-Type: text/plain References: Cc: chuckr@glue.umd.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <99040516311000.17621@ns1.cybersites.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-KMail-Mark: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Actually, you make a valid point. I'll keep my mouth shut until I actually have something of substance in hand. Chuck On Mon, 05 Apr 1999, Chuck Robey wrote: > On Mon, 5 Apr 1999, Chuck Youse wrote: > > > I'll have to put my vote in here too. Please include alternative > > architecture support. I ordered an eval NetWinder the other day, > > and will be launching a FreeBSD port shortly thereafter. The "net > > appliance" wave is great -- the fact that Linux is really the only > > choice thus far is not so great. > > > > Can't wait to have a rack full of FreeBSD NetWinders ... > > I hear this a lot, but it's a little hard to believe, then there's never > any code. It's fine when it's your hobby, but you guys are asking > everyone to take in code, which you could very easily add yourselves on > your own hook. I know it's fun, and I've got my own hobby things hidden > around here that haven't all gotten as far as I'd hoped, but I don't ask > everyone to pay the freight for them, either, so I feel justified. > > I hate to be a part-pooper. Is it not true that you can add, on your > own machine, all the bits you want for your projects on your own? And, > also, that just the moment your project starts to show even the teeniest > bit of life, that *at that point* the code could be added to FreeBSD? > > It's starting to seem that merely the vaguest wish that a FreeBSD port > might be nice, is enough to qualify for including all the support code. > I don't want to place the too high, but how about the possibility of > placing the bar just a small step higher? > > Maybe you could suggest some rules on where to set the bar? Something > you feel would be fair to you, fair to the FreeBSDers who don't want > FreeBSD to get too overweight, and also easy to quantify, so we avoid > arguments in the future. > > > Chuck > > > > > > On Mon, 05 Apr 1999, Robert Swindells wrote: > > > Warner Losh wrote: > > > >In message Chuck Robey writes: > > > >: You know what you're doing, but I want to suggest that perhaps you want > > > >: to run that archs part past Warner, who recently (boy, I hope it was > > > >: Warner, I think it was) added the MIPS stuff into the tree, and is > > > >: pretty strongly in favor of making cross-compilation possible. > > > > > > >Yes. I added support to our binutils to generate mips binaries. I > > > >think that if other groups want their port in the tree, that should be > > > >the first step, with the second making egcs work for the port. I hope > > > >to have that done in the next couple of weeks. The only other two > > > >architectures that I think there'd be support for would be sparc and > > > >arm. > > > > > > I would vote for including sparc and arm as well. > > > > > > I'm getting a SparcStation next month and want to get either a > > > SA1100/SA1101 evaluation board or a Chaltech motherboard for > > > work. > > > > > > Robert Swindells > > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > -- > > Chuck Youse > > Director of Systems > > cyouse@cybersites.com > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- > Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data > chuckr@glue.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. > 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | > Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) > (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 14:47: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 724C215162 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 14:47:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA02037; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 14:44:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904052144.OAA02037@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Amancio Hasty Cc: Doug Rabson , Nick Hibma , FreeBSD hackers mailing list , USB BSD list Subject: Re: disassembling i386 code In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 04 Apr 1999 11:18:35 PDT." <199904041818.LAA63112@rah.star-gate.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 05 Apr 1999 14:44:06 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Is it possible to write a USB sniffer where the sniffer runs in a FreeBSD box? USB sniffing requires hardware support that you don't get with a USB controller (much of the bus protocol is run inside the USB hardware. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 14:49:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2270415551 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 14:49:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA02060; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 14:46:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904052146.OAA02060@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Bob Willcox Cc: Alex Zepeda , hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 04 Apr 1999 13:35:38 CDT." <19990404133538.A18402@luke.pmr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 05 Apr 1999 14:46:09 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > On Sun, Apr 04, 1999 at 11:32:56AM -0700, Alex Zepeda wrote: > > On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Bob Willcox wrote: > > > > > On the off chance something changed in the boot blocks I did install > > > that as well. > > > > This is AFAIK a boot blocks issue. Go into /usr/src/sys/boot && make all > > install && disklabel -B wd0 or whatever your boot device is. > > Hmm, does not a "make installworld" do this? It looked like my boot > blocks were current (as of when I did the installworld) and I did do a It's actually the loader complaining, and it's typically "old loader, new kernel" symptoms. Having said that, your world build should have given you a new loader. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 14:53: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01FE0154F5 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 14:52:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bob@luke.pmr.com) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id QAA32775; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:50:42 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bob) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:50:42 -0500 From: Bob Willcox To: Mike Smith Cc: Bob Willcox , Alex Zepeda , hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable Message-ID: <19990405165042.A32712@luke.pmr.com> Reply-To: Bob Willcox References: <19990404133538.A18402@luke.pmr.com> <199904052146.OAA02060@dingo.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <199904052146.OAA02060@dingo.cdrom.com>; from Mike Smith on Mon, Apr 05, 1999 at 02:46:09PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Apr 05, 1999 at 02:46:09PM -0700, Mike Smith wrote: > > On Sun, Apr 04, 1999 at 11:32:56AM -0700, Alex Zepeda wrote: > > > On Sun, 4 Apr 1999, Bob Willcox wrote: > > > > > > > On the off chance something changed in the boot blocks I did install > > > > that as well. > > > > > > This is AFAIK a boot blocks issue. Go into /usr/src/sys/boot && make all > > > install && disklabel -B wd0 or whatever your boot device is. > > > > Hmm, does not a "make installworld" do this? It looked like my boot > > blocks were current (as of when I did the installworld) and I did do a > > It's actually the loader complaining, and it's typically "old loader, > new kernel" symptoms. Having said that, your world build should have > given you a new loader. How can I verify that I have a new loader? Where is it located? My /boot directory contains: bob@obiwan-p3 /boot> ls -l total 294 -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 512 Apr 4 09:59 boot0 -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 512 Apr 4 09:59 boot1 -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 7680 Apr 4 09:59 boot2 -r-xr-xr-x 1 root wheel 131072 Apr 4 09:59 loader -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 11462 Mar 27 21:12 loader.help -r-xr-xr-x 1 root wheel 131072 Mar 27 21:12 loader.old The Apr 4 09:59 timestamp was the time of my make installworld. Is there somewhere else that it might be picking up an older version of the loader? Thanks, Bob -- Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 15:44:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8504914C8F for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:44:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA12046; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:42:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id QAA73739; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:43:20 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199904052243.QAA73739@harmony.village.org> To: Daniel Berlin Subject: Re: disassembling i386 code Cc: Doug Rabson , Nick Hibma , FreeBSD hackers mailing list , USB BSD list In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Apr 1999 01:08:19 PDT." <14088.28531.908490.405287@danberlin.resnet.rochester.edu> References: <14088.28531.908490.405287@danberlin.resnet.rochester.edu> <199904050118.TAA66919@harmony.village.org> Date: Mon, 05 Apr 1999 16:43:20 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <14088.28531.908490.405287@danberlin.resnet.rochester.edu> Daniel Berlin writes: : Actually, the best dissasembler around is IDA Pro from DataRescue. : This is for just about any executable format on x86, ELF/PEF on PPC, : and a few other andom processors in the standard version (i860, SH-4, : and JAVA). : It's really pretty damn amazing. Does it work with any of the emulators that run on FreeBSD? Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 15:49:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from relay.nuxi.com (nuxi.ucdavis.edu [169.237.7.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D330815167 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:49:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: (from obrien@localhost) by relay.nuxi.com (8.9.2/8.9.1) id PAA23452; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:47:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien) Message-ID: <19990405154728.A23410@nuxi.com> Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:47:28 -0700 From: "David O'Brien" To: Bob Willcox Cc: hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable Reply-To: obrien@NUXI.com References: <19990404133538.A18402@luke.pmr.com> <199904052146.OAA02060@dingo.cdrom.com> <19990405165042.A32712@luke.pmr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990405165042.A32712@luke.pmr.com>; from Bob Willcox on Mon, Apr 05, 1999 at 04:50:42PM -0500 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE Organization: The NUXI BSD group X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Keyid: 34F9F9D5 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > How can I verify that I have a new loader? Where is it located? > > My /boot directory contains: > > bob@obiwan-p3 /boot> ls -l > total 294 > -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 512 Apr 4 09:59 boot0 > -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 512 Apr 4 09:59 boot1 > -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 7680 Apr 4 09:59 boot2 > -r-xr-xr-x 1 root wheel 131072 Apr 4 09:59 loader ^^^^^^ this is your new loader > -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 11462 Mar 27 21:12 loader.help > -r-xr-xr-x 1 root wheel 131072 Mar 27 21:12 loader.old ^^^^^^ this is your old loader -- -- David (obrien@NUXI.com -or- obrien@FreeBSD.org) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 15:57:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94DD2152A0 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:57:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA95353 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 18:53:34 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 18:53:33 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: palm-pilot guys Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'd like to ask a question about the palm pilot, I'm finally able to convince myself that it would help my low level of organization. I see an ad for a Palm IIIx, and supposedly they actually have them and can ship today. They list a couple of different options, and I'd appreciate a comment about, well, if I need them, or if they're fluff. There's options of a 3 pack replacement styluses, leather carrying case (I think this one's really unneeded, unless they're fragile), modem cable, AC adaptor (do they use a commonly available voltage, like one I can get at Radio Shack?) PalmIII cradle windows (this one's a complete mystery to me), and a HoySync cable for PC. I intend to use this in conjunction with my home FreeBSD PC, and I don't think I'll probably need any other comm for it. Suggestions as to what I oughta buy are needed. What's the HotSync cable, is it supported by the palm pilot software in ports? ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@glue.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 16: 0:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0FA0152A0; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:59:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id IAA05086; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 08:27:54 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id IAA09226; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 08:27:53 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990406082753.U2142@lemis.com> Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 08:27:53 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Greg Black Cc: questions@FreeBSD.ORG, FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) References: <19990331003535.E17547@futuresouth.com> <19990331165139.W413@lemis.com> <19990405012545.727.qmail@alpha.comkey.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990405012545.727.qmail@alpha.comkey.com.au>; from Greg Black on Mon, Apr 05, 1999 at 11:25:44AM +1000 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Monday, 5 April 1999 at 11:25:44 +1000, Greg Black wrote: > Greg Lehey writes: > >> Interestingly enough, we are currently discussing this in -hackers. >> We're thinking about changing the way the kernel is built so that a >> debug kernel will be the default. > > I think this is a terrible idea, except possibly for -current. > I run a lot of FreeBSD machines, all of them -release (though > some might move to -stable if needed). They never crash and I > expect they never will, so debug kernels are just a waste of > resources as far as I'm concerned. I'm sure this applies to > lots of people who run production machines. That's the whole problem. Then you get a mystery crash which is never repeated, and because you don't have a debug kernel you can't analyse it. > At the very least, the decision to build a debug kernel should > be up to the installer Yes, we never disputed this. > and should default to non-debug. So far, you're the only person to voice this opinion. > After all, those people who might do anything with a debug kernel > can easily read the instructions on building/installing such a thing > and those people who just want to use FreeBSD won't be burdened with > the extra compilation time, disk space, memory waste during normal > operation, etc., associated with a debug kernel. I don't think you've read my proposition properly. You certainly haven't replied to the points I raised. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 16: 0:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C136615539 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:00:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id PAA00660; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:58:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:58:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904052258.PAA00660@apollo.backplane.com> To: Chuck Robey Cc: FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: palm-pilot guys References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :I'd like to ask a question about the palm pilot, I'm finally able to :convince myself that it would help my low level of organization. : :I see an ad for a Palm IIIx, and supposedly they actually have them and :can ship today. They list a couple of different options, and I'd :appreciate a comment about, well, if I need them, or if they're fluff. : :There's options of a 3 pack replacement styluses, leather carrying case :(I think this one's really unneeded, unless they're fragile), modem :cable, AC adaptor (do they use a commonly available voltage, like one I :can get at Radio Shack?) PalmIII cradle windows (this one's a complete :mystery to me), and a HoySync cable for PC. I intend to use this in :conjunction with my home FreeBSD PC, and I don't think I'll probably :need any other comm for it. : :Suggestions as to what I oughta buy are needed. What's the HotSync :cable, is it supported by the palm pilot software in ports? : :----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- :Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data :chuckr@glue.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. :213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | :Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) :(301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). :----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- I'm waiting for the Palm 7 to come out later this year. It is supposed to have a color screen and, more importantly, wireless internet connectivity built into a slimline case ( no more bulky external radios! ) -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 16:15:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C102C154DC for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:15:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA02484; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:11:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904052311.QAA02484@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Bob Willcox Cc: Mike Smith , Alex Zepeda , hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Apr 1999 16:50:42 CDT." <19990405165042.A32712@luke.pmr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 05 Apr 1999 16:11:54 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > It's actually the loader complaining, and it's typically "old loader, > > new kernel" symptoms. Having said that, your world build should have > > given you a new loader. > > How can I verify that I have a new loader? Where is it located? > > My /boot directory contains: > > bob@obiwan-p3 /boot> ls -l > total 294 > -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 512 Apr 4 09:59 boot0 > -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 512 Apr 4 09:59 boot1 > -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 7680 Apr 4 09:59 boot2 > -r-xr-xr-x 1 root wheel 131072 Apr 4 09:59 loader Gosh, you know this just might be it. And it's been updated, so the problem is that it doesn't like your kernel. It's possible that you have outdated sources, but apart from that I can't think of anything that would cause it to fail if it's up to date. Try booting the kernel directly from the boot2 phase; when the spinner stops briefly before the loader starts, hit a key and specify the name of the new kernel. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 16:29: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6AD9914C1F for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:29:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bob@luke.pmr.com) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id SAA33763; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 18:26:33 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bob) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 18:26:33 -0500 From: Bob Willcox To: Mike Smith Cc: Bob Willcox , Alex Zepeda , hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable Message-ID: <19990405182633.A33584@luke.pmr.com> Reply-To: Bob Willcox References: <19990405165042.A32712@luke.pmr.com> <199904052311.QAA02484@dingo.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <199904052311.QAA02484@dingo.cdrom.com>; from Mike Smith on Mon, Apr 05, 1999 at 04:11:54PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Apr 05, 1999 at 04:11:54PM -0700, Mike Smith wrote: > > > It's actually the loader complaining, and it's typically "old loader, > > > new kernel" symptoms. Having said that, your world build should have > > > given you a new loader. > > > > How can I verify that I have a new loader? Where is it located? > > > > My /boot directory contains: > > > > bob@obiwan-p3 /boot> ls -l > > total 294 > > -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 512 Apr 4 09:59 boot0 > > -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 512 Apr 4 09:59 boot1 > > -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 7680 Apr 4 09:59 boot2 > > -r-xr-xr-x 1 root wheel 131072 Apr 4 09:59 loader > > Gosh, you know this just might be it. And it's been updated, so the > problem is that it doesn't like your kernel. > > It's possible that you have outdated sources, but apart from that I > can't think of anything that would cause it to fail if it's up to date. > > Try booting the kernel directly from the boot2 phase; when the spinner > stops briefly before the loader starts, hit a key and specify the name > of the new kernel. I have done that (its the only way I can currently boot the system). When I specify the *old* kernel it boots fine. Is there some specific outdated source I should look for? I am now suspecting that that might be the cause. Thanks, Bob > > -- > \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith > \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au > \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org > \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com > -- Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 16:43:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1775714D1D for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:43:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA02669; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:40:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904052340.QAA02669@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Bob Willcox Cc: Mike Smith , Alex Zepeda , hackers list Subject: Re: "elf_loadexec: archsw.readin failed" on recent 3.1-stable In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Apr 1999 18:26:33 CDT." <19990405182633.A33584@luke.pmr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 05 Apr 1999 16:40:03 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I have done that (its the only way I can currently boot the system). > When I specify the *old* kernel it boots fine. Is there some specific > outdated source I should look for? I am now suspecting that that might > be the cause. Check that you don't have any sticky tags attached to any part of the loader (sys/boot/*). It was updated a while back to deal with a kernel change. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 16:44:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from stennis.ca.sandia.gov (stennis.ca.sandia.gov [146.246.243.44]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4387915563 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:44:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bmah@stennis.ca.sandia.gov) Received: (from bmah@localhost) by stennis.ca.sandia.gov (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA26050; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:42:04 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904052342.QAA26050@stennis.ca.sandia.gov> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Chuck Robey Cc: FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: palm-pilot guys In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 05 Apr 1999 18:53:33 EDT." From: bmah@CA.Sandia.GOV (Bruce A. Mah) Reply-To: bmah@CA.Sandia.GOV X-Face: g~c`.{#4q0"(V*b#g[i~rXgm*w;:nMfz%_RZLma)UgGN&=j`5vXoU^@n5v4:OO)c["!w)nD/!!~e4Sj7LiT'6*wZ83454H""lb{CC%T37O!!'S$S&D}sem7I[A 2V%N&+ X-Url: http://www.ca.sandia.gov/~bmah/ Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="==_Exmh_335620428P"; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Mon, 05 Apr 1999 16:42:04 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --==_Exmh_335620428P Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii If memory serves me right, Chuck Robey wrote: > I see an ad for a Palm IIIx, and supposedly they actually have them and > can ship today. They list a couple of different options, and I'd > appreciate a comment about, well, if I need them, or if they're fluff. I don't have a IIIx, but I've had a III for a long time. Very nice replacement for the scraps of paper I used to keep everything on. > There's options of a 3 pack replacement styluses, There's two styluses (styli?) that come with it...one is plastic and one is metal. I lost the metal one after about a month (it's so heavy, it falls out of the case). I'm currently using a third-party metal stylus. > leather carrying case > (I think this one's really unneeded, unless they're fragile), It comes with a flip-top to protect the screen (think of the communicators on the old Star Trek). > modem > cable, For connecting to an external modem...sounds like you don't need this. > AC adaptor (do they use a commonly available voltage, like one I > can get at Radio Shack?) For the modem. The Palm III and IIIx use "normal" AAA batteries. Palm V uses rechargeables that recharge through the cradle. > PalmIII cradle windows (this one's a complete > mystery to me), An extra cradle to hook up to another PC (as opposed to a Mac). You get one with the original unit. If you might be hooking up the Palm to multiple PCs (e.g. home and office), this might be useful. > and a HoySync cable for PC. Identical in function, but physically smaller. > I intend to use this in > conjunction with my home FreeBSD PC, and I don't think I'll probably > need any other comm for it. > > Suggestions as to what I oughta buy are needed. What's the HotSync > cable, is it supported by the palm pilot software in ports? From what you've said, it sounds like you won't need anything other than what comes in the box. Grab pilot-link in ports, and you've got a lot of the functionality of what comes with the 3Com Windoze software, and all without leaving our favorite operating system! Good luck...hope it works out as well for you as it has for me. Bruce. --==_Exmh_335620428P Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP MESSAGE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBNwlKS6jOOi0j7CY9AQGL8gQAlEkqWHY9KFwlnIBVxotZrHGvW09ak94a v/la0SP7XMN1w/Rhk9szGy8z0uH/UoIWuK6fcqzrI0v9X0kOirWsVstGWiLn0kHO 3z9PjZwmUEwliVYpb4Jm3WEh2ZlJinvjaJ4CpvCWf9zV48LukaK5IghZwsoq+5dj KMrcA1UNsfE= =DMnV -----END PGP MESSAGE----- --==_Exmh_335620428P-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 18:21:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B49B14E68 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 18:21:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA42782; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 21:19:17 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 21:19:08 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: "Bruce A. Mah" Cc: Chuck Robey , FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: palm-pilot guys In-Reply-To: <199904052342.QAA26050@stennis.ca.sandia.gov> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Try KPilot, actually. It's very nice. Also, where did Matt here about a Palm 7 being color?!? I sincerely doubt that. Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 18:30:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A38A6151F4 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 18:30:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id SAA62977; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 18:28:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 18:28:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904060128.SAA62977@apollo.backplane.com> To: Brian Feldman Cc: "Bruce A. Mah" , Chuck Robey , FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: palm-pilot guys References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : Try KPilot, actually. It's very nice. Also, where did Matt here about a :Palm 7 being color?!? I sincerely doubt that. : : Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ : green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ : FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | : http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ : Hmm.. it isn't in the press release. I could have gotten that part mixed up with something else. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 19: 4:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quack.kfu.com (quack.kfu.com [170.1.70.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E8CE14CA5 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 19:04:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nsayer@medusa.kfu.com) Received: from medusa.kfu.com (medusa.kfu.com [170.1.70.5]) by quack.kfu.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA97618 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 19:02:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nsayer@localhost) by medusa.kfu.com (8.9.2/8.8.8) id TAA31558 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 19:02:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nsayer) Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 19:02:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Nick Sayer Message-Id: <199904060202.TAA31558@medusa.kfu.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Revised suggestion for securelevel negative time deltas Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Thanks to Garance A Droshihn for a better idea. Attempts to negatively offset the clock are clamped to one second less than the highest the clock has yet reached. This will allow xntpd (or a miscreant, alas) to "freeze" the clock in place, but not go backwards in time beyond a second. Here is a proposed patch. Note the big blank spot where a proposal for handling positive deltas should go. :-) --- kern_time.c.orig Fri Apr 2 13:35:13 1999 +++ kern_time.c Fri Apr 2 13:34:11 1999 @@ -77,7 +77,8 @@ settime(tv) struct timeval *tv; { - struct timeval delta, tv1; + struct timeval delta, tv1, tv2; + static struct timeval maxtime; struct timespec ts; int s; @@ -88,13 +89,30 @@ /* * If the system is secure, we do not allow the time to be - * set to an earlier value (it may be slowed using adjtime, - * but not set back). This feature prevent interlopers from - * setting arbitrary time stamps on files. + * set to a value earlier than 1 second less than the highest + * time we have yet seen. The worst a miscreant can do in + * this circumstance is "freeze" time. He couldn't go + * back to the past. */ - if (delta.tv_sec < 0 && securelevel > 1) { - splx(s); - return (EPERM); + if (securelevel > 1) { + if (delta.tv_sec < 0 || delta.tv_usec < 0) { + if ( tv1.tv_sec > maxtime.tv_sec ) + maxtime=tv1; + tv2=maxtime; + timevalsub( &tv2, &tv ); + if ( tv2.tv_sec < -1 ) { + tv.tv_sec=maxtime.tv_sec-1; + } + } + else { + /* XXX + * We have to figure out how to be secure + * in this case. Allowing arbitrary + * positive increases allows a miscreant + * to simply wrap time around the end + * of time. + */ + } } ts.tv_sec = tv->tv_sec; To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 5 23:10: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from homer.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D6FD15013 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 23:09:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by homer.softweyr.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id WAA00382; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 22:33:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <37098EB1.CED75C36@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 05 Apr 1999 22:33:53 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Chuck Robey Cc: FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: palm-pilot guys References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Chuck Robey wrote: > > I'd like to ask a question about the palm pilot, I'm finally able to > convince myself that it would help my low level of organization. > > I see an ad for a Palm IIIx, and supposedly they actually have them and > can ship today. They list a couple of different options, and I'd > appreciate a comment about, well, if I need them, or if they're fluff. If you're looking to save some money, I think the III is identical to the IIIx except for the screen. Friends at work have the Pro and III and seem to think the IIIx isn't worth the extra $$$. I bought one of the original CE machines, an NEC MobilePro 400, and gave up on it as too heavy and too limited after about a year. I used it to read email on a couple of trips, and that was fun, but replying on that keyboard just wasn't in the game plan. If Warner gets FreeBSD booting on MobilePros I may have to revive it. As far as the goodies go, get the machine and use it for a while. If you need something else, it will become apparent quickly. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 2:50:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from relay03.indigo.ie (relay03.indigo.ie [194.125.133.227]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id B488314BCF for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 02:50:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from niall@pobox.com) Received: (qmail 6105 messnum 46114 invoked from network[194.125.220.32/ts05-022.dublin.indigo.ie]); 6 Apr 1999 09:48:17 -0000 Received: from ts05-022.dublin.indigo.ie (HELO pobox.com) (194.125.220.32) by relay03.indigo.ie (qp 6105) with SMTP; 6 Apr 1999 09:48:17 -0000 Message-ID: <3709D915.E3592B05@pobox.com> Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 10:51:17 +0100 From: Niall Smart X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Nick Sayer Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Revised suggestion for securelevel negative time deltas References: <199904060202.TAA31558@medusa.kfu.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Nick Sayer wrote: > > Thanks to Garance A Droshihn for a better idea. > > Attempts to negatively offset the clock are clamped to one second less > than the highest the clock has yet reached. This will allow xntpd > (or a miscreant, alas) to "freeze" the clock in place, but not > go backwards in time beyond a second. > Here is a proposed patch. Note the big blank spot where a proposal > for handling positive deltas should go. :-) Well, how about a sysctl (kern.maxclockdelta) which specifies the maximum amount of seconds that the clock can be brought forward or back in a specified period, say 7 days. This fixes the problem mentioned by Matt Dillon (?) whereby an attacker can wind the clock forward indefinately and overflow a time_t. (Naturally this sysctl would be read-only when securelevel > 1). Regards, Niall > --- kern_time.c.orig Fri Apr 2 13:35:13 1999 > +++ kern_time.c Fri Apr 2 13:34:11 1999 > @@ -77,7 +77,8 @@ > settime(tv) > struct timeval *tv; > { > - struct timeval delta, tv1; > + struct timeval delta, tv1, tv2; > + static struct timeval maxtime; > struct timespec ts; > int s; > > @@ -88,13 +89,30 @@ > > /* > * If the system is secure, we do not allow the time to be > - * set to an earlier value (it may be slowed using adjtime, > - * but not set back). This feature prevent interlopers from > - * setting arbitrary time stamps on files. > + * set to a value earlier than 1 second less than the highest > + * time we have yet seen. The worst a miscreant can do in > + * this circumstance is "freeze" time. He couldn't go > + * back to the past. > */ > - if (delta.tv_sec < 0 && securelevel > 1) { > - splx(s); > - return (EPERM); > + if (securelevel > 1) { > + if (delta.tv_sec < 0 || delta.tv_usec < 0) { > + if ( tv1.tv_sec > maxtime.tv_sec ) > + maxtime=tv1; > + tv2=maxtime; > + timevalsub( &tv2, &tv ); > + if ( tv2.tv_sec < -1 ) { > + tv.tv_sec=maxtime.tv_sec-1; > + } > + } > + else { > + /* XXX > + * We have to figure out how to be secure > + * in this case. Allowing arbitrary > + * positive increases allows a miscreant > + * to simply wrap time around the end > + * of time. > + */ > + } > } > > ts.tv_sec = tv->tv_sec; > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 3:47:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua (ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua [212.42.68.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C530914F5E for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 03:47:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sobomax@altavista.net) Received: from vega. (async2-00.iptelecom.net.ua [212.42.68.128]) by ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA17310 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:45:59 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from sobomax@altavista.net) Received: from altavista.net (big_brother [192.168.1.1]) by vega. (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id NAA03480 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:45:14 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from sobomax@altavista.net) Message-ID: <3709E5BA.58EE35EE@altavista.net> Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 13:45:14 +0300 From: Maxim Sobolev Reply-To: sobomax@altavista.net Organization: Vega International Capital X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: ru,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: PPPCTL for Win32 available (2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, Here I am again. Finally I succeded in uploading pppctl port for Win32 to my homepage. You can download it on http://hup.go.com/~sobomax/pppctl/pppctl-win32-0.11.zip. Now it must be qualified as alpha level software, however it works well for me. It was ported using GNU Readline library and Cygwin32 toolchain. If anyone will found better location for it please drop me a line. Any suggestions highly appreciated as well. Sincerely, Maxim Sobolev     To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 3:57:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D40014F5E for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 03:57:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA01496; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 06:50:05 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 06:50:05 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Wes Peters Cc: FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: palm-pilot guys In-Reply-To: <37098EB1.CED75C36@softweyr.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 5 Apr 1999, Wes Peters wrote: > Chuck Robey wrote: > > > > I'd like to ask a question about the palm pilot, I'm finally able to > > convince myself that it would help my low level of organization. > > > > I see an ad for a Palm IIIx, and supposedly they actually have them and > > can ship today. They list a couple of different options, and I'd > > appreciate a comment about, well, if I need them, or if they're fluff. > > > If you're looking to save some money, I think the III is identical to > the IIIx except for the screen. Friends at work have the Pro and III > and seem to think the IIIx isn't worth the extra $$$. > > I bought one of the original CE machines, an NEC MobilePro 400, and gave > up on it as too heavy and too limited after about a year. I used it to > read email on a couple of trips, and that was fun, but replying on that > keyboard just wasn't in the game plan. If Warner gets FreeBSD booting > on MobilePros I may have to revive it. > > As far as the goodies go, get the machine and use it for a while. If > you need something else, it will become apparent quickly. OK, thanks. I'll take the advice, and order the goodies later if needed. > > -- > "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" > > Wes Peters Softweyr LLC > http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com > > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@glue.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 4:15:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua (ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua [212.42.68.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42A0C150FE for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 04:15:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sobomax@altavista.net) Received: from vega. (async2-21.iptelecom.net.ua [212.42.68.149]) by ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA18955 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 14:13:51 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from sobomax@altavista.net) Received: from altavista.net (big_brother [192.168.1.1]) by vega. (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id OAA03620 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 14:13:06 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from sobomax@altavista.net) Message-ID: <3709EC42.AEF14641@altavista.net> Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 14:13:06 +0300 From: Maxim Sobolev Reply-To: sobomax@altavista.net Organization: Vega International Capital X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: ru,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: PPPCTL for Win32 available (2) - sorry bad URL Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Sorry URL misprinted in previous message. It should be: http://homepages.infoseek.com/~sobomax/pppctl/pppctl-win32-0.11.zip Maxim To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 4:25:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF0F214E14 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 04:25:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA01573; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 07:21:07 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 07:21:07 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Maxim Sobolev Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PPPCTL for Win32 available (2) - sorry bad URL In-Reply-To: <3709EC42.AEF14641@altavista.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 6 Apr 1999, Maxim Sobolev wrote: > Sorry URL misprinted in previous message. It should be: > http://homepages.infoseek.com/~sobomax/pppctl/pppctl-win32-0.11.zip Maybe I'm misunderstanding something ... what's this got to do with FreeBSD? > > Maxim > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@glue.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 4:37: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua (ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua [212.42.68.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 700D015067 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 04:37:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sobomax@altavista.net) Received: from vega. (async2-21.iptelecom.net.ua [212.42.68.149]) by ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA20085; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 14:35:42 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from sobomax@altavista.net) Received: from altavista.net (big_brother [192.168.1.1]) by vega. (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id OAA03707; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 14:34:26 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from sobomax@altavista.net) Message-ID: <3709F141.B37341F@altavista.net> Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 14:34:25 +0300 From: Maxim Sobolev Reply-To: sobomax@altavista.net Organization: Vega International Capital X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: ru,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Chuck Robey Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PPPCTL for Win32 available (2) - sorry bad URL References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Maybe I'm missing something, but I think that all stuff which may cause better integration of FreeBSD in windows (or any other) enviropment IS related to FreeBSD. Pppctl in this case can be used to remote control FreeBSD ppp program from any windows box and therefore my opinion is that it is related to FreeBSD. Sincerely, Maxim Sobolev Chuck Robey wrote: > On Tue, 6 Apr 1999, Maxim Sobolev wrote: > > > Sorry URL misprinted in previous message. It should be: > > http://homepages.infoseek.com/~sobomax/pppctl/pppctl-win32-0.11.zip > > Maybe I'm misunderstanding something ... what's this got to do with > FreeBSD? > > > > > Maxim To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 4:48: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6923D15067 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 04:47:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA28804; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 07:44:02 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 07:44:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Maxim Sobolev Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PPPCTL for Win32 available (2) - sorry bad URL In-Reply-To: <3709F141.B37341F@altavista.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 6 Apr 1999, Maxim Sobolev wrote: > Maybe I'm missing something, but I think that all stuff which may > cause better integration of FreeBSD in windows (or any other) > enviropment IS related to FreeBSD. Pppctl in this case can be used > to remote control FreeBSD ppp program from any windows box and > therefore my opinion is that it is related to FreeBSD. OK, I don't use pppctl, so I didn't understand. Anything which interacts with FreeBSD could be considered fair game. I'm just trying to keep the Windows Horde offa this list. You certainly don't qualify there, Maxim, but I want anyone else reading the lists (which have been gated, one way, to newsgroups by individuals) to understand the posting rules right away, before we get inundated. Next time you post something like this, maybe you could make the FreeBSD connection a little more obvious? Thanks. > > Sincerely, > > Maxim Sobolev > > Chuck Robey wrote: > > > On Tue, 6 Apr 1999, Maxim Sobolev wrote: > > > > > Sorry URL misprinted in previous message. It should be: > > > http://homepages.infoseek.com/~sobomax/pppctl/pppctl-win32-0.11.zip > > > > Maybe I'm misunderstanding something ... what's this got to do with > > FreeBSD? > > > > > > > > Maxim > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@glue.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 5:47:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from grizz.avalon.net (grizz.avalon.net [204.71.107.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB5A715203 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 05:47:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cmf@iabears.org) Received: from [208.252.166.183] (1Cust157.tnt2.iowa-city.ia.da.uu.net [208.252.167.157]) by grizz.avalon.net (8.8.8/8.6.12) with ESMTP id HAA05827 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 07:45:19 -0500 (CDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Sender: cmf@mail.iabears.org Message-Id: Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 07:43:55 -0500 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org From: Carl Fongheiser Subject: Re: palm-pilot guys Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >> I see an ad for a Palm IIIx, and supposedly they actually have them and >> can ship today. They list a couple of different options, and I'd >> appreciate a comment about, well, if I need them, or if they're fluff. > > >If you're looking to save some money, I think the III is identical to >the IIIx except for the screen. Friends at work have the Pro and III >and seem to think the IIIx isn't worth the extra $$$. No, the IIIx also has twice the memory (4 MB vs 2 MB). This may or may not be an issue; I've had my Palm III for a number of months and haven't hit the memory ceiling yet. If my Palm III weren't so new, I'd jump for the IIIx right now. The glare on the older screen really bugs me sometimes. Carl Fongheiser cmf@iabears.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 7: 0: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.clientlogic.com (ns.clientlogic.com [207.51.66.75]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0D910151AA; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 07:00:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ChrisMic@clientlogic.com) Received: by site0s1 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id <2J8LTR9H>; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 09:58:51 -0400 Message-ID: <6C37EE640B78D2118D2F00A0C90FCB441A5FF9@site2s1> From: Christopher Michaels To: 'Greg Lehey' , Greg Black Cc: questions@FreeBSD.ORG, FreeBSD Hackers Subject: RE: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 09:59:13 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Maybe I'm a little out of the loop, but as a general user I feel I should voice my opinions (questions). I understand the up-sides of a debug kernel (although I wouldn't mind some clarification), but what are the down sides? - The kernel is larger, correct? Is this just file size or does it take up significantly more memory as well? - Does a debug kernel impart any performance hit? Any other down sides? Consider this from the stand-point of an average user. -Chris > -----Original Message----- > From: Greg Lehey [SMTP:grog@lemis.com] > Sent: Monday, April 05, 1999 6:58 PM > To: Greg Black > Cc: questions@FreeBSD.ORG; FreeBSD Hackers > Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) > > On Monday, 5 April 1999 at 11:25:44 +1000, Greg Black wrote: > > Greg Lehey writes: > > > >> Interestingly enough, we are currently discussing this in -hackers. > >> We're thinking about changing the way the kernel is built so that a > >> debug kernel will be the default. > > > > I think this is a terrible idea, except possibly for -current. > > I run a lot of FreeBSD machines, all of them -release (though > > some might move to -stable if needed). They never crash and I > > expect they never will, so debug kernels are just a waste of > > resources as far as I'm concerned. I'm sure this applies to > > lots of people who run production machines. > > That's the whole problem. Then you get a mystery crash which is never > repeated, and because you don't have a debug kernel you can't analyse > it. > > > At the very least, the decision to build a debug kernel should > > be up to the installer > > Yes, we never disputed this. > > > and should default to non-debug. > > So far, you're the only person to voice this opinion. > > > After all, those people who might do anything with a debug kernel > > can easily read the instructions on building/installing such a thing > > and those people who just want to use FreeBSD won't be burdened with > > the extra compilation time, disk space, memory waste during normal > > operation, etc., associated with a debug kernel. > > I don't think you've read my proposition properly. You certainly > haven't replied to the points I raised. > > Greg > -- > See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers > finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 7: 5:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from narnia.plutotech.com (narnia.plutotech.com [206.168.67.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1FA8151AA for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 07:05:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gibbs@narnia.plutotech.com) Received: (from gibbs@localhost) by narnia.plutotech.com (8.9.1/8.7.3) id HAA01465; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 07:54:20 -0600 (MDT) Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 07:54:20 -0600 (MDT) From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Message-Id: <199904061354.HAA01465@narnia.plutotech.com> To: Darren Reed Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: scsi message X-Newsgroups: pluto.freebsd.hackers In-Reply-To: <199904040930.TAA00441@avalon.reed.wattle.id.au> User-Agent: tin/pre-1.4-980818 ("Laura") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.0-CURRENT (i386)) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article <199904040930.TAA00441@avalon.reed.wattle.id.au> you wrote: > > does anyone know what this portends (during bootup): > > ahc0: ahc_intr - referenced scb not valid during SELTO scb(128) > SEQADDR = 0x4 SCSISEQ = 0x5a SSTAT0 = 0x15 SSTAT1 = 0x88 It means you are not using the latest driver. -- Justin To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 7:15: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from axl.noc.iafrica.com (axl.noc.iafrica.com [196.31.1.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF6BC1567F for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 07:14:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sheldonh@axl.noc.iafrica.com) Received: from sheldonh (helo=axl.noc.iafrica.com) by axl.noc.iafrica.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10UWaP-00060x-00; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 16:12:17 +0200 From: Sheldon Hearn To: Brian Feldman Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: more dd(1) weirdness In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Apr 1999 12:07:09 -0400." Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 16:12:17 +0200 Message-ID: <23122.923407937@axl.noc.iafrica.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 05 Apr 1999 12:07:09 -0400, Brian Feldman wrote: > I think I've fixed all of the dd(1) weirdness, and these patches should be > committed (except for the part about block device lseeking, that should be > better thought out now). When you say "I've fixed all of the dd(1) weirdness", does that mean you believe your patches fix the reboots that occur when one tries to write past the end of a block device, eg ``dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/fd0''? Ciao, Sheldon. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 7:53:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E0AE1510C for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 07:53:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA50294; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 10:51:09 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 10:51:08 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: Sheldon Hearn Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: more dd(1) weirdness In-Reply-To: <23122.923407937@axl.noc.iafrica.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 6 Apr 1999, Sheldon Hearn wrote: > > > On Mon, 05 Apr 1999 12:07:09 -0400, Brian Feldman wrote: > > > I think I've fixed all of the dd(1) weirdness, and these patches should be > > committed (except for the part about block device lseeking, that should be > > better thought out now). > > When you say "I've fixed all of the dd(1) weirdness", does that mean you > believe your patches fix the reboots that occur when one tries to write > past the end of a block device, eg ``dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/fd0''? When did this start happening? I meant only dd itself, but I didn't know that trying to write past the end of a bdev crashes you now... then again, you're SUPPOSED to use a cdev to do that. > > Ciao, > Sheldon. > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 9:53:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from news.IAEhv.nl (news.IAE.nl [194.151.64.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC88F14F27 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 09:53:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from devet@adv.iae.nl) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by news.IAEhv.nl (8.9.1/8.9.1) with IAEhv.nl id SAA27954 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 18:51:41 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from devet@localhost) by adv.iae.nl (8.9.2/8.8.6) id SAA11984 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 18:51:26 +0200 (CEST) From: Arjan de Vet Message-Id: <199904061651.SAA11984@adv.iae.nl> Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 18:51:26 +0200 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Increasing both NBUF and NMBCLUSTERS leads to panics Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, I'm testing a new 3.1-stable server with 640MB RAM for running Squid and I would like to increase the NBUF parameter in the kernel configuration file. The default maximum size of the buffercache seems to be around 8MB irrespective of the amount of physical memory (see nbuf calculation code in i386/i386/machdep.c). For this Squid server I would like to have at least 32MB buffer cache or more because the 2-level directory hierarchy used by Squid contains in my setup 4096 directories whose size is <=8KB and I would like to cache all metadata to speedup the open() calls which are becoming a bottleneck on my current Squid server on BSD/OS 3.0. If I understand correctly, metadata only gets cached in the buffer cache whereas other file data can be cached by the VM system too. Some time ago John Dyson also posted some sysctl settings for keeping metadata in the buffer cache as much as possible; I was planning on using those too. Besides increasing the NBUF parameter I also want to increase NMBCLUSTERS of course because the machine will handle quite some network traffic. But for some reason increasing both NBUF and NMBCLUSTERS only leads to panics :-(. Below you will find various combinations of NBUF and NMBCLUSTERS settings together with some attempts of VM_KMEM_SIZE_MAX tuning. I added some printf's in the kernel sources to print the sizes of the maps being allocated and to determine which map allocation causes the panic. If I understand correctly the maps have the following relation: kernel_map | |-kmem_map (npg * PAGE_SIZE) | | = (nmbufs * MSIZE + nmbclusters * MCLBYTES + vm_kmem_size) | | | |-mb_map nmbufs * MSIZE + nmbclusters * MCLBYTES | |-clean_map (nbuf*BKVASIZE) + (nswbuf*MAXPHYS) + pager_map_size | | | |-buffer_map (nbuf*BKVASIZE) | | | |-pager_map (nswbuf*MAXPHYS) + pager_map_size | |-exec_map 16*(ARG_MAX+(PAGE_SIZE*3)) The buffercache and nmbclusters are allocated in different maps so I suspect the problem to be in their common parent map kernel_map. Any explanations or hints for avoiding these panics are greatly appreciated. Arjan ============================================================================= Version : FreeBSD 3.1-stable, cvsup-ped April 6, 1999 Hardware: Pentium Pro-200, 640MB RAM ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Increase NBUF: maxusers 128 options "NBUF=10240" #options "NMBCLUSTERS=8192" #options "VM_KMEM_SIZE_MAX=(256*1024*1024)" This works OK: initial vm_kmem_size 12582912 vm_kmem_size after memory tuning 219460949 vm_kmem_size after VM_KMEM_SIZE_MAX 83886080 final vm_kmem_size 83886080 kmem_map 90439680 kmem_map done real memory = 671088640 (655360K bytes) clean_map 100663296 clean_map done buffer_map 83886080 buffer_map done pager_map 16777216 pager_map done exec_map 1245184 exec_map done mb_map 6553600 mb_map done avail memory = 647626752 (632448K bytes) ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Now increase NMBCLUSTERS at the same time: maxusers 128 options "NBUF=10240" options "NMBCLUSTERS=8192" #options "VM_KMEM_SIZE_MAX=(256*1024*1024)" initial vm_kmem_size 12582912 vm_kmem_size after memory tuning 219460949 vm_kmem_size after VM_KMEM_SIZE_MAX 83886080 final vm_kmem_size 83886080 kmem_map 104857600 kmem_map done real memory = 671088640 (655360K bytes) clean_map 100663296 clean_map done buffer_map 83886080 buffer_map done pager_map 16777216 pager_map done exec_map 1245184 exec_map done mb_map 20971520 mb_map done avail memory = 647589888 (632412K bytes) Now it panics in some in_pcballoc code: Doing additional network setup: xntpd portmap Fatal trap 12: page fault while in kernel mode fault virtual address = 0x8 fault code = supervisor read, page not present instruction pointer = 0x8:0xf01c9e13 stack pointer = 0x10:0xffb70eac frame pointer = 0x10:0xffb70eb4 code segment = base 0x0, limit 0xfffff, type 0x1b = DPL 0, pres 1, def32 1, gran 1 processor eflags = interrupt enabled, resume, IOPL = 0 current process = 117 (portmap) interrupt mask = net tty bio cam kernel: type 12 trap, code=0 Stopped at zalloci+0xf: movl 0x8(%ebx),%eax db> t zalloci(0,ff871c80,ff871c80,80000000,ffb70eec) at zalloci+0xf in_pcballoc(ff871c80,f024a018,ffb39360) at in_pcballoc+0x14 tcp_attach(ff871c80,ffb39360,ff871c80,f02251c8,1) at tcp_attach+0x3c tcp_usr_attach(ff871c80,6,ffb39360,0,ffb70f94) at tcp_usr_attach+0x29 socreate(2,ffb70f54,1,6,ffb39360) at socreate+0xc7 socket(ffb39360,ffb70f94,804d000,1,10) at socket+0x54 syscall(27,27,10,1,efbfdddc) at syscall+0x187 Xint0x80_syscall() at Xint0x80_syscall+0x2c db> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- same kernel, but now from the loader: set kern.vm.kmem.size=268435456 # 256*1024*1024 Then it panics when creating kmem_map: initial vm_kmem_size 12582912 vm_kmem_size after memory tuning 219460949 vm_kmem_size after VM_KMEM_SIZE_MAX 83886080 final vm_kmem_size 268435456 kmem_map 289406976 kmem_suballoc: bad status return of 3. panic: kmem_suballoc Debugger("panic") Stopped at 0xf01d87e7: movl $0,0xf022a4c8 db> t (null)(f0202bd7) at 0xf01d87e7 (null)(f020cb95,f020cb6c,3,11400000,f022f454) at 0xf014d3b4 (null)(f0239eac,f02326d4,f02326d8,11400000,f020248b) at 0xf01be80a (null)(0) at 0xf014a2f2 (null)(f0299fb8,f0403000,2000,2000,f01d8ea0) at 0xf013fdde (null)() at 0xf0116f3b db> f014d340 T panic f01be7b8 T kmem_suballoc f014a1c8 t kmeminit ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Increase VM_KMEM_SIZE_MAX in kernel config instead of using the boot loader 'set kern.vm.kmem.size' option: maxusers 128 options "NBUF=10240" options "NMBCLUSTERS=8192" options "VM_KMEM_SIZE_MAX=(256*1024*1024)" Then it panics in cpu_startup: initial vm_kmem_size 12582912 vm_kmem_size after memory tuning 219460949 vm_kmem_size after VM_KMEM_SIZE_MAX 219460949 final vm_kmem_size 219460949 kmem_map 240431104 kmem_map done real memory = 671088640 (655360K bytes) panic: startup: no room for tables Debugger("panic") Stopped at 0xf01d87e7: movl $0,0xf022a4c8 db> t (null)(f0202bd7) at 0xf01d87e7 (null)(f0211d44,f0226dc0,f022f564,29a000,f0226dc0) at 0xf014d3b4 (null)(0) at 0xf01dc91a (null)(f0299fb8,f0403000,2000,2000,f01d8ea0) at 0xf013fdde (null)() at 0xf0116f3b db> f014d340 T panic f01dc644 t cpu_startup ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Only increase NMBCLUSTERS: maxusers 128 #options "NBUF=10240" options "NMBCLUSTERS=8192" #options "VM_KMEM_SIZE_MAX=(256*1024*1024)" OK: initial vm_kmem_size 12582912 vm_kmem_size after memory tuning 219460949 vm_kmem_size after VM_KMEM_SIZE_MAX 83886080 final vm_kmem_size 83886080 kmem_map 104857600 kmem_map done real memory = 671088640 (655360K bytes) clean_map 33800192 clean_map done buffer_map 17022976 buffer_map done pager_map 16777216 pager_map done exec_map 1245184 exec_map done mb_map 20971520 mb_map done avail memory = 650076160 (634840K bytes) ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Increase VM_KMEM_SIZE_MAX in kernel config: maxusers 128 #options "NBUF=10240" options "NMBCLUSTERS=8192" options "VM_KMEM_SIZE_MAX=(256*1024*1024)" Then it panics when allocating the clean_map: initial vm_kmem_size 12582912 vm_kmem_size after memory tuning 219460949 vm_kmem_size after VM_KMEM_SIZE_MAX 219460949 final vm_kmem_size 219460949 kmem_map 240431104 kmem_map done real memory = 671088640 (655360K bytes) clean_map 33800192 kmem_suballoc: bad status return of 3. panic: kmem_suballoc Debugger("panic") Stopped at 0xf01d87e7: movl $0,0xf022a4c8 db> t (null)(f0202bd7) at 0xf01d87e7 (null)(f020cb95,f020cb6c,3,f0226dc0,d0768) at 0xf014d3b4 (null)(f0239eac,f024ccdc,f024d200,203c000,f0211d82) at 0xf01be80a (null)(0) at 0xf01dc97f (null)(f0299fb8,f0403000,2000,2000,f01d8ea0) at 0xf013fdde (null)() at 0xf0116f3b db> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 10:42: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from axl.noc.iafrica.com (axl.noc.iafrica.com [196.31.1.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 585F214D82 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 10:41:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sheldonh@axl.noc.iafrica.com) Received: from sheldonh (helo=axl.noc.iafrica.com) by axl.noc.iafrica.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10UZp6-0006PT-00; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 19:39:40 +0200 From: Sheldon Hearn To: Brian Feldman Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: more dd(1) weirdness In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Apr 1999 10:51:08 -0400." Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 19:39:40 +0200 Message-ID: <24642.923420380@axl.noc.iafrica.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 06 Apr 1999 10:51:08 -0400, Brian Feldman wrote: > When did this start happening? I have no idea. I just know that there are a good number of PR's describing the problem (see kern/10828), and at least one of them contains followup from bde, claiming that writes beyond the end of a block device are known to cause problems. The claims are certainly supported by the few tests I tried out on my machines here. Ciao, Sheldon. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 10:55:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EFEEB14BF5 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 10:55:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bob@luke.pmr.com) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id MAA42905; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 12:51:37 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bob) Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 12:51:37 -0500 From: Bob Willcox To: Chuck Robey Cc: "Alton, Matthew" , DL-ADM , "'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG'" Subject: Re: AIX going BSD Message-ID: <19990406125137.A41889@luke.pmr.com> Reply-To: Bob Willcox References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: ; from Chuck Robey on Wed, Mar 31, 1999 at 04:24:24PM -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Mar 31, 1999 at 04:24:24PM -0500, Chuck Robey wrote: > On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Alton, Matthew wrote: > > > This lends credence to my lond-held hypothesis that all > > commercial UNICES are secretly floating on 4.4BSD UNIX - > > The OS that God runs on his PDP/11 up in Heaven. No > > wonder they won't free up their source code. It'd be too > > embarassing. > > You guys are showing snobbery, just as surely as the commercial world. > You forget that BSD was proprietary software for years (only available > if you had AT&T licenses) and it would be very difficult to find any > Unix version at all (outside of that bought directly from AT&T) that > didn't have some BSD code in it. That's been the situation for 15 > years, and now you want to discover it? > > AIX is *not* doing anything at all outside the usual, and it would, in > fact, be remarkable (and outside the expected norm) if you *didn't* find > some BSD code in it. Why don't you go look at, oh, Hewlett Packard, or > some other mainstream vendor? There is some interesting history here. Back in 1986 (I think it was, I may be off by a year or two, though) I was the manager of a department at IBM working on the AIX kernel for the RT (precursor to RS/6K's, do you remember them...not a very memorable product, I'm afraid). At that time the version of AIX (it was 1.1 or 2.1, not sure any more) running on the RT's had a rather poor implementation of TCP/IP from IBM Research (SNA was still king at IBM). Anyway, my department (credit goes mostly to the folks working for me at the time) lobbied for tossing the IBM Research implementation of TCP/IP that we had and integrating the BSD code. Eventually we were successful in convincing the powers that be. This was somewhat of a major coup for us in that our department didn't own the networking responsibility, and we had to convince the manager of the department that did own it (my principle role in it all) that it would be good for the product and for his department. Of course, we (my department) did all of the work integrating it and simply handed the completed code over to the networking department. I guess the jist of this is that nothing is necessarily GIVEN (at least not in those days at IBM). Certainly, ditching the IBM Research code and converting to the BSD TCP/IP code wasn't. It sounds like the current folks working on AIX have continued to use good ideas from outside of IBM as well (I retired from IBM almost 4 years ago now). Ah, well, enough with the nastalgia, Bob. -- Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 11: 1:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bubba.whistle.com (s205m7.whistle.com [207.76.205.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A48F14BF5; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 11:01:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from archie@whistle.com) Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.whistle.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id KAA73737; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 10:57:37 -0700 (PDT) From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199904061757.KAA73737@bubba.whistle.com> Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) In-Reply-To: <6C37EE640B78D2118D2F00A0C90FCB441A5FF9@site2s1> from Christopher Michaels at "Apr 6, 99 09:59:13 am" To: ChrisMic@clientlogic.com (Christopher Michaels) Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 10:57:37 -0700 (PDT) Cc: grog@lemis.com, gjb@comkey.com.au, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL38 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Christopher Michaels writes: > Maybe I'm a little out of the loop, but as a general user I feel I should > voice my opinions (questions). > > I understand the up-sides of a debug kernel (although I wouldn't mind some > clarification), but what are the down sides? > - The kernel is larger, correct? Is this just file size or does it take up > significantly more memory as well? You would install two kernels: /kernel and /kernel.debug. The first one is a normal kernel (but no debugging info) and this is the one you run. So no more memory is used (except on your disk). The second you only need as a debug reference for the first when you get a core dump. > - Does a debug kernel impart any performance hit? No... the same code is being executed as before. -Archie ___________________________________________________________________________ Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 11: 8: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 53C2F14BF5 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 11:08:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA38267; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 14:03:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 14:03:27 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Bob Willcox Cc: "Alton, Matthew" , DL-ADM , "'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG'" Subject: Re: AIX going BSD In-Reply-To: <19990406125137.A41889@luke.pmr.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 6 Apr 1999, Bob Willcox wrote: > I guess the jist of this is that nothing is necessarily GIVEN (at least > not in those days at IBM). Certainly, ditching the IBM Research code > and converting to the BSD TCP/IP code wasn't. It sounds like the current > folks working on AIX have continued to use good ideas from outside of > IBM as well (I retired from IBM almost 4 years ago now). > > Ah, well, enough with the nastalgia, Bob. I've heard the same, and I think I'm seeing it at the IBM website. Now that the days of Akers are over at IBM, it's no longer a nasty place to be near. I don't know about working for them, but as a neighbor, IBM was a vicious attack dog in those days. Times really have changed, and it feels odd to be able to say nice things about IBM these days. ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 11: 8:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8BE00156E0 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 11:08:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id LAA09677; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 11:06:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 11:06:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904061806.LAA09677@apollo.backplane.com> To: Arjan de Vet Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Increasing both NBUF and NMBCLUSTERS leads to panics References: <199904061651.SAA11984@adv.iae.nl> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Hi, : :I'm testing a new 3.1-stable server with 640MB RAM for running Squid and :I would like to increase the NBUF parameter in the kernel configuration :file. The default maximum size of the buffercache seems to be around :8MB irrespective of the amount of physical memory (see nbuf calculation :code in i386/i386/machdep.c). : :For this Squid server I would like to have at least 32MB buffer cache or :more because the 2-level directory hierarchy used by Squid contains in :my setup 4096 directories whose size is <=8KB and I would like to cache :all metadata to speedup the open() calls which are becoming a bottleneck :on my current Squid server on BSD/OS 3.0. : :If I understand correctly, metadata only gets cached in the buffer cache :whereas other file data can be cached by the VM system too. Some time :ago John Dyson also posted some sysctl settings for keeping metadata in :the buffer cache as much as possible; I was planning on using those too. No, it's around physmem ( in kilobytes ) / 8. It should scale ok. Metadata is cached in the VM buffer cache, which uses all available memory. The VFS buffer cache, which is the 'nbuf' stuff, is really only a mapping from the VM buffer cache. Your directories are still being cached even if you do not have a lot of nbuf's, but since nbufs hold logical to physical block translations and are used to stage I/O, in your case having more of them may be beneficial. :Besides increasing the NBUF parameter I also want to increase :NMBCLUSTERS of course because the machine will handle quite some network :traffic. But for some reason increasing both NBUF and NMBCLUSTERS only :leads to panics :-(. The problem is that insufficient KVM is being reserved. You need to upgrade to the latest -CURRENT ( i.e. 4.x ). The fixes will probably go into -STABLE before the next release, but they are not in yet. The 3.1 release is definitely broken for systems with large amounts of real memory which try to raise the default limits. -Matt : :Any explanations or hints for avoiding these panics are greatly :appreciated. : :Arjan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 11:19:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD2E11522F; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 11:19:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id LAA08196; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 11:11:08 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 11:11:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Archie Cobbs Cc: Christopher Michaels , grog@lemis.com, gjb@comkey.com.au, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) In-Reply-To: <199904061757.KAA73737@bubba.whistle.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The down side is that you really need 32MB to compile a debug kernel in timescales measurable by humans, and you need an extra 20MB or so of disk per kernel compile directory. julian On Tue, 6 Apr 1999, Archie Cobbs wrote: > Christopher Michaels writes: > > Maybe I'm a little out of the loop, but as a general user I feel I should > > voice my opinions (questions). > > > > I understand the up-sides of a debug kernel (although I wouldn't mind some > > clarification), but what are the down sides? > > - The kernel is larger, correct? Is this just file size or does it take up > > significantly more memory as well? > > You would install two kernels: /kernel and /kernel.debug. The first > one is a normal kernel (but no debugging info) and this is the one > you run. So no more memory is used (except on your disk). The second > you only need as a debug reference for the first when you get a core dump. > > > - Does a debug kernel impart any performance hit? > > No... the same code is being executed as before. > > -Archie > > ___________________________________________________________________________ > Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 12:22:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from frmug.org (frmug-gw.frmug.org [193.56.58.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 206E314F5B for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 12:22:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by frmug.org (8.9.1/frmug-2.3/nospam) with UUCP id VAA13313 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 21:20:24 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: by keltia.freenix.fr (Postfix, from userid 101) id 99039884E; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 20:43:41 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 20:43:41 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: palm-pilot guys Message-ID: <19990406204341.A53869@keltia.freenix.fr> Reply-To: FreeBSD Chat Mailing List Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-15 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Mutt/0.95.3i In-Reply-To: ; from Carl Fongheiser on Tue, Apr 06, 1999 at 07:43:55AM -0500 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT/ELF ctm#5173 AMD-K6 MMX @ 200 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Followups to -chat. According to Carl Fongheiser: > No, the IIIx also has twice the memory (4 MB vs 2 MB). This may or may not > be an issue; I've had my Palm III for a number of months and haven't hit > the memory ceiling yet. If my Palm III weren't so new, I'd jump for the IIIx > right now. The glare on the older screen really bugs me sometimes. I brought my PIII last year (at USENIX) and am pretty happy with it but could do with a better screen... Is there any way to "upgrade" a PIII to a PIIIx ? 4 MB would be nice but are not necessary either here. Even with such an heavy (but very good) package as DateBook3 (245 KB), I have more than 700 KB free. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 4.0-CURRENT #70: Sat Feb 27 09:43:08 CET 1999 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 13: 6:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quack.kfu.com (quack.kfu.com [170.1.70.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73BFE151D6 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:06:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nsayer@medusa.kfu.com) Received: from medusa.kfu.com (medusa.kfu.com [170.1.70.5]) by quack.kfu.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA16449 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:04:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nsayer@localhost) by medusa.kfu.com (8.9.2/8.8.8) id NAA34014 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:04:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nsayer) From: Nick Sayer Message-Id: <199904062004.NAA34014@medusa.kfu.com> Subject: Re: cvs commit: ports/security/identify - Imported sources In-Reply-To: <18803.923390753@axl.noc.iafrica.com> from Sheldon Hearn at "Apr 6, 1999 11:25:53 am" To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:04:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > On Fri, 02 Apr 1999 11:07:31 PST, Nick Sayer wrote: > > > Log Message: > > Add "identify" daemon wrapper. Allows one to add ident lookup and logging > > to arbitrary daemons (like telnetd or fingerd). > > Since a remote host's response to your ident request offers you nothing > in terms of security, I'd _strongly_ recommend that this port be moved > to net and _not_ left in security, where it's bound to mislead the > uninitiated. It is appropriate to leave it in security, because it is a logging tool. It can be used to identify miscreants in certain, limited circumstances. Specifically... You get a connection from a shell account ISP. The machine is not evil, but a particular user is. Under those circumstances, the data you get from the remote identd daemon is useful to the extent that you can send the ident readback to the administrators of the machine. There are programs (ircd, for one) and users who misconstrue ident as being an authentication protocols (in ircd's case, despite their protestations, the de facto use to which they put identd is authentication, since they take the ident protocol output and make that the left-hand-side of your e-mail address, even if the data is a logging token only -- as allowed by the RFC when you set the machine type to OTHER). identify certainly isn't one of them. -- echo afnlre@dhnpx.xsh.pbz |\ : Anita Hill then, Paula Jones now. tr 'a-z' 'n-za-m' : or remove nospam in From: line : What goes around, comes around. http://www.kfu.com/~nsayer/ : To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 13: 8:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quack.kfu.com (quack.kfu.com [170.1.70.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E04BB14A14 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:08:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nsayer@medusa.kfu.com) Received: from medusa.kfu.com (medusa.kfu.com [170.1.70.5]) by quack.kfu.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA16884 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:06:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nsayer@localhost) by medusa.kfu.com (8.9.2/8.8.8) id NAA34065 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:06:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nsayer) From: Nick Sayer Message-Id: <199904062006.NAA34065@medusa.kfu.com> Subject: Re: cvs commit: ports/security/identify - Imported sources In-Reply-To: <24922.923423806@axl.noc.iafrica.com> from Sheldon Hearn at "Apr 6, 1999 8:36:46 pm" To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:06:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > On Tue, 06 Apr 1999 12:23:23 CST, Warner Losh wrote: > > > Unless someone has broken root, or has sniffed packets on your network > > and quickly responded with his/her own evil identity. > > Leave the red herrings alone, they're still trying to figure out whether > they're allowed to split their infinitives. ;-) > > The point is that pidentd's primary role is as a security tool, while > identify's isn't. If _this_ isn't true, then identify should stay where > it is. Otherwise, it really should move. How can you say that one is and the other isn't? They both do the same work, one as a client, and one as a server. It's like saying Samba's smbd is a file sharing utility and smbclient isn't. -- echo afnlre@dhnpx.xsh.pbz |\ : "...You tiny-brained wipers tr 'a-z' 'n-za-m' : of other people's bottoms!" or remove nospam in From: line : http://www.kfu.com/~nsayer/ : -- French Taunter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 13:34:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quack.kfu.com (quack.kfu.com [170.1.70.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 70D4F14D6A for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:34:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nsayer@medusa.kfu.com) Received: from medusa.kfu.com (medusa.kfu.com [170.1.70.5]) by quack.kfu.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA19740 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:32:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nsayer@localhost) by medusa.kfu.com (8.9.2/8.8.8) id NAA34426 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:32:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nsayer) From: Nick Sayer Message-Id: <199904062032.NAA34426@medusa.kfu.com> Subject: Damn! Wrong list! (was Re: cvs commit: ports/security/identify...) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:32:27 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Oops. That all was supposed to go to committers. -- echo afnlre@dhnpx.xsh.pbz |\ : TRUE GIANTS OF HISTORY #102 tr 'a-z' 'n-za-m' : or remove nospam in From: line : Edwin Armstrong http://www.kfu.com/~nsayer/ : Radio Pioneer To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 14:16:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3745114BCF for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 14:16:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA10003 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 17:14:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904062114.RAA10003@cs.rpi.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: NFS pause in 3.1-STABLE Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 17:14:11 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG We had one of our machines "pause" earlier today. The machine is running 3.1-STABLE from March 26. The machine was running fine for 4+ days (has been very stable), when it stoped respondning. It would still answer pings, and new connects would be accept()ed, but apparently never passed onto the process. Existing processes all hung (I had a number of ssh X connections going through the machine, and with no additional disk accesses they all stoped.). From prior experience when this happens, it will eventually recover (anywhere from 45 minuts to hours). We were able to do a tcpdump on the network, and wathced the traffic. What we saw was repeated NFS lookups (with a reply from the server), and then get_attr requests. This was not a spam condition, the requests were only 3 or 3 per second. We identified which file it was asking for and moved it arround until it generated a STALE_NFS error. After that we placed a same named file back and the next lookup found it. Still the machine would not respond. The machine would also not respond to its serial console. Hitting return where a login prompt should have been produced no echo or other response. Any ideas what causes this? It is much rarer than the other, extinct, problems with NFS/TCP and KVA, but still annoying. -- David Cross To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 14:37:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from isbalham.ist.co.uk (isbalham.ist.co.uk [192.31.26.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A3E7C15710 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 14:37:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: from gid.co.uk (uucp@localhost) by isbalham.ist.co.uk (8.8.7/8.8.7) with UUCP id WAA02830; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 22:35:38 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: from [194.32.164.2] by seagoon.gid.co.uk; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 22:29:50 +0100 (BST) X-Sender: rb@194.32.164.1 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199904062114.RAA10003@cs.rpi.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 22:29:46 +0000 To: "David E. Cross" From: Bob Bishop Subject: Re: NFS pause in 3.1-STABLE Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 5:14 pm -0400 6/4/99, David E. Cross wrote: >We had one of our machines "pause" earlier today. The machine is running >3.1-STABLE from March 26. >[etc] Just out of interest, what netcard(s) do you have in that machine? -- Bob Bishop (0118) 977 4017 international code +44 118 rb@gid.co.uk fax (0118) 989 4254 between 0800 and 1800 UK To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 14:45:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net (post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4737A14C92 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 14:45:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dmlb@ragnet.demon.co.uk) Received: from [158.152.46.40] (helo=ragnet.demon.co.uk) by post-20.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #2) id 10Udd0-0004KH-0K for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 21:43:26 +0000 Received: from dmlb by ragnet.demon.co.uk with local (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10UdSm-000GCP-00 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 22:32:52 +0100 Content-Length: 1292 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 22:32:52 +0100 (BST) From: Duncan Barclay To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Suggested additions for periodic Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi I've just modified periodic to read configuration files to decide whether to run the script or not. This removes the hardcoded "exit 0"s which are difficult to maintain across system updates in the /etc/periodic/* scripts The configuration is read from $dir/perodic.conf $periodic_conf_files /etc/defaults/periodic.conf The files consist of lines containing the pathname of each script and a field indicating whether to run the script or not. The first matching entry in the configuration files determines the run policy. If there is no match then the script is run anyway - this is to provide some backwards compatability and reduce the burden of adding local scripts (if you add your own you probably want them to run). TODO: Write a manual page for the configuration files. Set periodic_conf_files in rc.conf/rc.conf.local. Makefile updates Submit a PR. I'll finish the TODO's if people think this is a worthwhile addition, otherwise I'll keep them as local patches. Duncan --- ________________________________________________________________________ Duncan Barclay | God smiles upon the little children, dmlb@ragnet.demon.co.uk | the alcoholics, and the permanently stoned. ________________________________________________________________________ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 14:47:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fdy2.demon.co.uk (fdy2.demon.co.uk [194.222.102.143]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3429114C92 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 14:47:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rjs@fdy2.demon.co.uk) Received: (from rjs@localhost) by fdy2.demon.co.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA00481; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 22:38:45 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from rjs) Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 22:38:45 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199904062138.WAA00481@fdy2.demon.co.uk> From: Robert Swindells To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: <99040516311000.17621@ns1.cybersites.com> (message from Chuck Youse on Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:29:55 -0400) Subject: Re: gdb 4.17 Reply-To: rjs@fdy2.demon.co.uk Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Chuck Youse wrote: >Chuck Robey wrote: >>I hear this a lot, but it's a little hard to believe, then there's never >>any code. It's fine when it's your hobby, but you guys are asking >>everyone to take in code, which you could very easily add yourselves on >>your own hook. I know it's fun, and I've got my own hobby things hidden >>around here that haven't all gotten as far as I'd hoped, but I don't ask >>everyone to pay the freight for them, either, so I feel justified. >>I hate to be a part-pooper. Is it not true that you can add, on your >>own machine, all the bits you want for your projects on your own? And, >>also, that just the moment your project starts to show even the teeniest >>bit of life, that *at that point* the code could be added to FreeBSD? >>It's starting to seem that merely the vaguest wish that a FreeBSD port >>might be nice, is enough to qualify for including all the support code. >>I don't want to place the too high, but how about the possibility of >>placing the bar just a small step higher? >>Maybe you could suggest some rules on where to set the bar? Something >>you feel would be fair to you, fair to the FreeBSDers who don't want >>FreeBSD to get too overweight, and also easy to quantify, so we avoid >>arguments in the future. >Actually, you make a valid point. I'll keep my mouth shut until I actually >have something of substance in hand. Yeah, point taken, probably just knowing the versions of egcs and binutils used in the base system is enough to work with. I did state that the arm tools would be used at work - i.e. I will be getting paid to work on it - but I have a fast enough internet connection there to just download egcs again. Robert Swindells To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 14:49:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81D5F14BE0 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 14:49:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA10644; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 17:46:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904062146.RAA10644@cs.rpi.edu> To: Bob Bishop Cc: "David E. Cross" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: NFS pause in 3.1-STABLE In-Reply-To: Message from Bob Bishop of "Tue, 06 Apr 1999 22:29:46 -0000." Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 17:46:59 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Somehow I knew you were going to ask that... xl0 -- David Cross To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 14:58:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA6C714EF2 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 14:58:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.2/8.9.1) id XAA57675; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 23:55:59 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: Matthew Dillon Cc: Arjan de Vet , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Increasing both NBUF and NMBCLUSTERS leads to panics References: <199904061651.SAA11984@adv.iae.nl> <199904061806.LAA09677@apollo.backplane.com> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 06 Apr 1999 23:55:58 +0200 In-Reply-To: Matthew Dillon's message of "Tue, 6 Apr 1999 11:06:27 -0700 (PDT)" Message-ID: Lines: 17 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matthew Dillon writes: > :Besides increasing the NBUF parameter I also want to increase > :NMBCLUSTERS of course because the machine will handle quite some network > :traffic. But for some reason increasing both NBUF and NMBCLUSTERS only > :leads to panics :-(. > > The problem is that insufficient KVM is being reserved. You need > to upgrade to the latest -CURRENT ( i.e. 4.x ). The fixes will probably > go into -STABLE before the next release, but they are not in yet. Nah, just read section 13.15 in the FreeBSD FAQ. Beware that in FreeBSD 3.x, changing the kvm size will break BSDI binary compatibility. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 15:16:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D19E015361 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 15:16:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA15564 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 16:14:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: (from imp@localhost) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) id QAA80385 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 16:15:47 -0600 (MDT) Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 16:15:47 -0600 (MDT) From: Warner Losh Message-Id: <199904062215.QAA80385@harmony.village.org> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Learning Japanese for native English speaker Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greetings, I'd like to learn Japanese so I might communicate with some Japanese hackers that are doing cool things in areas that I'm interested in. In addition, I'd like to be able to read most tecnical web pages. I'd also like to know what good software to deal with 16-bit character sets (kanji, hiragana and katakana) which people use. I'm an emacs user if that matters. Thank you for any pointers you can give me that would further my quest. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 15:56:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF893156C1; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 15:56:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id IAA10824; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:24:18 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id IAA12662; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:24:16 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990407082416.H2142@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:24:16 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Archie Cobbs , Christopher Michaels Cc: gjb@comkey.com.au, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) References: <6C37EE640B78D2118D2F00A0C90FCB441A5FF9@site2s1> <199904061757.KAA73737@bubba.whistle.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904061757.KAA73737@bubba.whistle.com>; from Archie Cobbs on Tue, Apr 06, 1999 at 10:57:37AM -0700 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tuesday, 6 April 1999 at 10:57:37 -0700, Archie Cobbs wrote: > Christopher Michaels writes: >> Maybe I'm a little out of the loop, but as a general user I feel I should >> voice my opinions (questions). >> >> I understand the up-sides of a debug kernel (although I wouldn't mind some >> clarification), but what are the down sides? >> - The kernel is larger, correct? Is this just file size or does it take up >> significantly more memory as well? > > You would install two kernels: /kernel and /kernel.debug. You don't need to install the kernel.debug on the root file system. The obvious place to put it is in /var/crash. > The first one is a normal kernel (but no debugging info) and this is > the one you run. So no more memory is used (except on your > disk). The second you only need as a debug reference for the first > when you get a core dump. To make it clear, you build the kernel.debug. To get the kernel without debugging symbols, you use `strip -g'. A number of other people have observed that the current boot loader doesn't load the symbols anyway, so you could install /kernel.debug only and still run normally. I consider this a deficiency in the boot loader, since it should be possible to load the symbols. Of course, an alternative solution would be to install /kernel.debug and leave it until boot time to decide whether to load the symbols. That would have the great advantage that you wouldn't get any mismatch between the two kernels. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 16:15:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bubba.whistle.com (s205m7.whistle.com [207.76.205.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E425D14EE9; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 16:15:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from archie@whistle.com) Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.whistle.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id QAA96785; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 16:11:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199904062311.QAA96785@bubba.whistle.com> Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) In-Reply-To: <19990407082416.H2142@lemis.com> from Greg Lehey at "Apr 7, 99 08:24:16 am" To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 16:11:24 -0700 (PDT) Cc: archie@whistle.com, ChrisMic@clientlogic.com, gjb@comkey.com.au, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL38 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey writes: > A number of other people have observed that the current boot loader > doesn't load the symbols anyway, so you could install /kernel.debug > only and still run normally. I consider this a deficiency in the boot > loader, since it should be possible to load the symbols. Of course, What advantage would that give? Ie, how would you use all the debugging gunk better if it was loaded into memory instead of on the disk? DDB doesn't understand it does it? In any case, I like the idea of having ONE kernel and having the loader not load the debugging gunk into memory. -Archie ___________________________________________________________________________ Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 16:17: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 399CA14BC9; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 16:16:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id IAA10943; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:44:59 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id IAA12717; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:44:54 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990407084453.L2142@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:44:53 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Archie Cobbs Cc: ChrisMic@clientlogic.com, gjb@comkey.com.au, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) References: <19990407082416.H2142@lemis.com> <199904062311.QAA96785@bubba.whistle.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904062311.QAA96785@bubba.whistle.com>; from Archie Cobbs on Tue, Apr 06, 1999 at 04:11:24PM -0700 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tuesday, 6 April 1999 at 16:11:24 -0700, Archie Cobbs wrote: > Greg Lehey writes: >> A number of other people have observed that the current boot loader >> doesn't load the symbols anyway, so you could install /kernel.debug >> only and still run normally. I consider this a deficiency in the boot >> loader, since it should be possible to load the symbols. Of course, > > What advantage would that give? Ie, how would you use all the > debugging gunk better if it was loaded into memory instead of on > the disk? DDB doesn't understand it does it? I believe ddb *does* understand it. That would be the only advantage. I don't use ddb, since it's too restrictive (no access to sources), so it wouldn't make any difference for me. > In any case, I like the idea of having ONE kernel and having the > loader not load the debugging gunk into memory. Yes, I think that's the superior solution as well. It would mean that you would have to make root file systems 20 MB larger by default. There are other options here. Since it's a separate issue, I'll send out a separate message: how about having a boot partition with just the kernels and enough information to locate the root file system? Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 16:19:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D56AB14BC9 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 16:19:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (bob.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.153]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id TAA11935; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 19:17:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904062317.TAA11935@cs.rpi.edu> To: "David E. Cross" Cc: Bob Bishop , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: NFS pause in 3.1-STABLE In-Reply-To: Message from "David E. Cross" of "Tue, 06 Apr 1999 17:46:59 EDT." <199904062146.RAA10644@cs.rpi.edu> Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 19:17:13 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Somehow I knew you were going to ask that... > > xl0 > Hmm.. I take that back, I remember it happened last night to a different machine (this one a much older buiild, it had been up 68 days). I was not able to tcpdump the machine (I forgot) to see if it was exactly the same, but everything else behaved identically to the earlier "pause". This machine had "ed0" as its Ethernet interface. -- David Cross To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 16:26:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38ABC15233 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 16:26:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id IAA10995 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:54:38 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id IAA12754 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:54:36 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990407085435.M2142@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:54:35 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Separate boot partition? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG One of the most asked-for features currently not implemented in Vinum is to be able to have the root file system running under Vinum. It looks simple enough, but there's a powerful chicken-and-egg problem in there: the bootstrap doesn't run Vinum, so it can't read the kernel from a Vinum volume. There is little provision to remount the root file system elsewhere than where the bootstrap thinks it is, and since by this time there are open file descriptors, it's difficult to change this behaviour. I've been thinking about this, and the best I can come up with is a separate boot file system, like some System Vs do. In System V the interest seems to come from the fact that the bootstraps are too stupid to understand file systems such as VxFS, but basically they just contain the kernel. I was thinking of additional information such as the name of the root file system, though of course that could be compiled into the kernel. The sequence would then be: boot loads the kernel from /boot/kernel. kernel initializes, including Vinum if desired, and loads the root file system The kernel data file is still available via a symlink from /kernel to /boot/kernel, or as a copy somewhere. Note that the original file from which the kernel is loaded is no longer needed once the kernel was loaded. Some programs, such as ps, may use the kernel file to extract information about the kernel, but this doesn't have to be from the same file as from which the kernel was loaded: the file just needs the same contents, so a copy would be OK. Comments? Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 16:36:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from noc.demon.net (server.noc.demon.net [193.195.224.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D9A6154B2 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 16:36:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fanf@demon.net) Received: by noc.demon.net; id AAA03096; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 00:34:49 +0100 (BST) Received: from fanf.noc.demon.net(195.11.55.83) by inside.noc.demon.net via smap (3.2) id xma003078; Wed, 7 Apr 99 00:34:48 +0100 Received: from fanf by fanf.noc.demon.net with local (Exim 1.73 #2) id 10UfMl-0004wW-00; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 00:34:47 +0100 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: Tony Finch Subject: Re: Increasing both NBUF and NMBCLUSTERS leads to panics In-Reply-To: References: <199904061651.SAA11984@adv.iae.nl> <199904061806.LAA09677@apollo.backplane.com> Message-Id: Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 00:34:47 +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: >Matthew Dillon writes: >> >> The problem is that insufficient KVM is being reserved. You need >> to upgrade to the latest -CURRENT ( i.e. 4.x ). The fixes will probably >> go into -STABLE before the next release, but they are not in yet. > >Nah, just read section 13.15 in the FreeBSD FAQ. I don't think that covers all the bases: after patching the kernel for a larger address space we couldn't boot it until we also patched /boot/loader. I can't log into the machine with the patches right now to get the details, but looking for recent threads on freebsd-current about large memory machines will get you what you need. Tony. -- f.a.n.finch dot@dotat.at fanf@demon.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 17:51:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from finch-post-12.mail.demon.net (finch-post-12.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.41]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A76F151C6; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 17:51:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from marko@uk.radan.com) Received: from [158.152.75.22] (helo=uk.radan.com) by finch-post-12.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10UgXD-0009yj-0C; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 00:49:39 +0000 Organisation: Radan Computational Ltd., Bath, UK. Phone: +44-1225-320320 Fax: +44-1225-320311 Received: from marder-1. (rasnt-1 [193.114.228.211]) by uk.radan.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with ESMTP id BAA00630; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 01:48:57 +0100 Received: (from marko@localhost) by marder-1. (8.9.2/8.8.8) id BAA04170; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 01:47:06 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from marko) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 01:47:06 +0100 From: Mark Ovens To: Greg Lehey Cc: Archie Cobbs , ChrisMic@clientlogic.com, gjb@comkey.com.au, questions@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) Message-ID: <19990407014706.X1360@marder-1.localhost> References: <19990407082416.H2142@lemis.com> <199904062311.QAA96785@bubba.whistle.com> <19990407084453.L2142@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <19990407084453.L2142@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 08:44:53AM +0930 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tuesday, 6 April 1999 at 16:11:24 -0700, Archie Cobbs wrote: > Greg Lehey writes: > > In any case, I like the idea of having ONE kernel and having the > > loader not load the debugging gunk into memory. > > Yes, I think that's the superior solution as well. It would mean that > you would have to make root file systems 20 MB larger by default. > Can you give me a figure in MB for a root fs that can support a debug kernel. My new HD arrives tomorrow so I'm going to do a fresh install (FreeBSD will be spread over the 2 disks). -- FreeBSD - The Power To Serve http://www.freebsd.org My Webpage http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~markov _______________________________________________________________ Mark Ovens, CNC Apps Engineer, Radan Computational Ltd. Bath UK CAD/CAM solutions for Sheetmetal Working Industry mailto:marko@uk.radan.com http://www.radan.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 17:52:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gizmo.internode.com.au (gizmo.internode.com.au [192.83.231.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2351B15749; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 17:52:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from newton@gizmo.internode.com.au) Received: (from newton@localhost) by gizmo.internode.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA16506; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:18:30 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from newton) From: Mark Newton Message-Id: <199904070048.KAA16506@gizmo.internode.com.au> Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:18:30 +0930 (CST) Cc: archie@whistle.com, ChrisMic@clientlogic.com, gjb@comkey.com.au, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19990407082416.H2142@lemis.com> from "Greg Lehey" at Apr 7, 99 08:24:16 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey wrote: > You don't need to install the kernel.debug on the root file system. > The obvious place to put it is in /var/crash. Not so sure about that: If you have half a dozen crash dumps in /var/crash all from different kernels, how do you work out which one matches the debug kernel you happen to have there too? Pity we can't trust the system's state at crash time. It should be possible to boot from a debug kernel in / without reading the symbol table, and copy its symbol table into the crash dump at the time the system panics. Core dumps could then be, for all intents and purposes, self-contained. Perhaps savecore could do that. Maybe "make install" in /sys/compile/WHATEVER needs to copy two kernels: One of them is the normal one which ends up in /, and put a debug kernel into /var/crash like you suggest; make savecore copy the symbol table from /var/crash/kernel.debug into crash dumps so that the problem I pointed to in my first paragraph above doesn't happen. > A number of other people have observed that the current boot loader > doesn't load the symbols anyway, so you could install /kernel.debug > only and still run normally. I consider this a deficiency in the boot > loader, since it should be possible to load the symbols. Of course, > an alternative solution would be to install /kernel.debug and leave it > until boot time to decide whether to load the symbols. That would > have the great advantage that you wouldn't get any mismatch between > the two kernels. Load the symbols when you drop into ddb for the first time. CTRL-ALT-ESC can bring up the spinner for a moment... Anther idea - Is there any reason why symbol table data can't be in a KLD that's built at kernel build time and left in /sys/compile/WHATEVER? - mark ---- Mark Newton Email: newton@internode.com.au Network Engineer Desk: +61-8-82232999 Internode Mobile: +61-416-202-223 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 18: 0: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1FC6715597; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 18:00:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA01436; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 17:54:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904070054.RAA01436@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Mark Newton Cc: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey), archie@whistle.com, ChrisMic@clientlogic.com, gjb@comkey.com.au, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Apr 1999 10:18:30 +0930." <199904070048.KAA16506@gizmo.internode.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 17:54:44 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Greg Lehey wrote: > > > You don't need to install the kernel.debug on the root file system. > > The obvious place to put it is in /var/crash. > > Not so sure about that: If you have half a dozen crash dumps in > /var/crash all from different kernels, how do you work out which > one matches the debug kernel you happen to have there too? > > Pity we can't trust the system's state at crash time. It should > be possible to boot from a debug kernel in / without reading the > symbol table, and copy its symbol table into the crash dump at the > time the system panics. Core dumps could then be, for all intents and > purposes, self-contained. > > Perhaps savecore could do that. Er, it does more or less that already. When it recovers the core image, it also copies the kernel file matching it. Even if the running kernel didn't have symbols loaded, this gets you the symbols out of the kernel file. It still doesn't quite work right for loadable modules, but someone will fix this someday, we hope. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 18:22:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E86014E02; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 18:22:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id KAA11527; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:50:39 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id KAA12950; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:50:38 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990407105038.U2142@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:50:38 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Mark Newton Cc: archie@whistle.com, ChrisMic@clientlogic.com, gjb@comkey.com.au, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) References: <19990407082416.H2142@lemis.com> <199904070048.KAA16506@gizmo.internode.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904070048.KAA16506@gizmo.internode.com.au>; from Mark Newton on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 10:18:30AM +0930 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wednesday, 7 April 1999 at 10:18:30 +0930, Mark Newton wrote: > Greg Lehey wrote: > >> You don't need to install the kernel.debug on the root file system. >> The obvious place to put it is in /var/crash. > > Not so sure about that: If you have half a dozen crash dumps in > /var/crash all from different kernels, how do you work out which > one matches the debug kernel you happen to have there too? You name them according to the dump. vmcore.1 gets kernel.1, etc. savecore does this already, but the kernel it saves (without debug symbols) is pretty much useless. > Pity we can't trust the system's state at crash time. It should be > possible to boot from a debug kernel in / without reading the symbol > table, It is. In fact, it's currently the only way. > and copy its symbol table into the crash dump at the time the system > panics. Core dumps could then be, for all intents and purposes, > self-contained. I don't see much advantage in this. When I have a panic, I can take a dump. I need the symbols in core mainly in a running system that I don't want to reboot. > Perhaps savecore could do that. > > Maybe "make install" in /sys/compile/WHATEVER needs to copy two > kernels: One of them is the normal one which ends up in /, and > put a debug kernel into /var/crash like you suggest; make savecore > copy the symbol table from /var/crash/kernel.debug into crash dumps > so that the problem I pointed to in my first paragraph above doesn't > happen. One way of looking at it. On the whole, I think the way to go is to install the debug kernel in the root or boot file system, and by default not to load the symbols. Then savecore can save the kernel along with the dump exactly as it does now, and we'd have the symbols available for dump analysis. >> A number of other people have observed that the current boot loader >> doesn't load the symbols anyway, so you could install /kernel.debug >> only and still run normally. I consider this a deficiency in the boot >> loader, since it should be possible to load the symbols. Of course, >> an alternative solution would be to install /kernel.debug and leave it >> until boot time to decide whether to load the symbols. That would >> have the great advantage that you wouldn't get any mismatch between >> the two kernels. > > Load the symbols when you drop into ddb for the first time. CTRL-ALT-ESC > can bring up the spinner for a moment... Have you investigated the feasibility of doing this? I think it would make more sense to have a userland program which loads the symbols, then calls the debugger. > Anther idea - Is there any reason why symbol table data can't be in > a KLD that's built at kernel build time and left in > /sys/compile/WHATEVER? Just that it's more work. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 18:35:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55DC6156F0; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 18:35:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.2/8.9.1) id DAA60784; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 03:33:36 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: chat@freebsd.org Subject: Lightbulbs revisited From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 07 Apr 1999 03:33:35 +0200 Message-ID: Lines: 83 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Q) How many FreeBSD hackers does it take to change a light bulb? A) One thousand, one hundred and seventy-two: Twenty-three to complain to -current about the lights being out; Four to claim that it is a configuration problem, and that such matters really belong on -questions; Three to submit PRs about it, one of which is misfiled under doc and consists only of "it's dark"; One to commit an untested lightbulb which breaks buildworld, then back it out five minutes later; Eight to flame the PR originators for not including patches in their PRs; Five to complain about buildworld being broken; Thirty-one to answer that it works for them, and they must have cvsupped at a bad time; One to post a patch for a new lightbulb to -hackers; One to complain that he had patches for this three years ago, but when he sent them to -current they were just ignored, and he has had bad experiences with the PR system; besides, the proposed new lightbulb is non-reflexive; Thirty-seven to scream that lightbulbs do not belong in the base system, that committers have no right to do things like this without consulting the Community, and WHAT IS -CORE DOING ABOUT IT!? Two hundred to complain about the color of the bicycle shed; Three to point out that the patch breaks style(9); Seventeen to complain that the proposed new lightbulb is under GPL; Five hundred and eighty-six to engage in a flame war about the comparative advantages of the GPL, the BSD license, the MIT license, the NPL, and the personal hygiene of unnamed FSF founders; Seven to move various portions of the thread to -chat and -advocacy; One to commit the suggested lightbulb, even though it shines dimmer than the old one; Two to back it out with a furious flame of a commit message, arguing that FreeBSD is better off in the dark than with a dim lightbulb; Forty-six to argue vociferously about the backing out of the dim lightbulb and demanding a statement from -core; Eleven to request a smaller lightbulb so it will fit their Tamagotchi if we ever decide to port FreeBSD to that platform; Seventy-three to complain about the SNR on -hackers and -chat and unsubscribe in protest; Thirteen to post "unsubscribe", "How do I unsubscribe?", or "Please remove me from the list", followed by the usual footer; One to commit a working lightbulb while everybody is too busy flaming everybody else to notice; Thirty-one to point out that the new lightbulb would shine 0.364% brighter if compiled with TenDRA (although it will have to be reshaped into a cube), and that FreeBSD should therefore switch to TenDRA instead of EGCS; One to complain that the new lightbulb lacks fairings; Nine (including the PR originators) to ask "what is MFC?"; Fifty-seven to complain about the lights being out two weeks after the bulb has been changed. DES (with a little help from my friend) -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 19:18:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC95215252 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 19:18:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id LAA11786; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:46:48 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id LAA13088; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:46:48 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990407114647.A2142@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:46:47 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , Matthew Dillon Cc: Arjan de Vet , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Increasing both NBUF and NMBCLUSTERS leads to panics References: <199904061651.SAA11984@adv.iae.nl> <199904061806.LAA09677@apollo.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: ; from Dag-Erling Smorgrav on Tue, Apr 06, 1999 at 11:55:58PM +0200 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tuesday, 6 April 1999 at 23:55:58 +0200, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > Matthew Dillon writes: >> :Besides increasing the NBUF parameter I also want to increase >> :NMBCLUSTERS of course because the machine will handle quite some network >> :traffic. But for some reason increasing both NBUF and NMBCLUSTERS only >> :leads to panics :-(. >> >> The problem is that insufficient KVM is being reserved. You need >> to upgrade to the latest -CURRENT ( i.e. 4.x ). The fixes will probably >> go into -STABLE before the next release, but they are not in yet. > > Nah, just read section 13.15 in the FreeBSD FAQ. Beware that in > FreeBSD 3.x, changing the kvm size will break BSDI binary > compatibility. I thought that had been fixed again. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 19:21: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2BBE154D9 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 19:21:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.2/8.9.1) id EAA61415; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 04:18:57 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: Greg Lehey Cc: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , Matthew Dillon , Arjan de Vet , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Increasing both NBUF and NMBCLUSTERS leads to panics References: <199904061651.SAA11984@adv.iae.nl> <199904061806.LAA09677@apollo.backplane.com> <19990407114647.A2142@lemis.com> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 07 Apr 1999 04:18:56 +0200 In-Reply-To: Greg Lehey's message of "Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:46:47 +0930" Message-ID: Lines: 12 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey writes: > On Tuesday, 6 April 1999 at 23:55:58 +0200, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > Nah, just read section 13.15 in the FreeBSD FAQ. Beware that in > > FreeBSD 3.x, changing the kvm size will break BSDI binary > > compatibility. > I thought that had been fixed again. In -CURRENT, yes. I don't think it was MFCed. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 19:29:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E0D4154D4; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 19:29:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id TAA24029; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 19:21:31 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 19:21:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Greg Lehey Cc: Archie Cobbs , Christopher Michaels , gjb@comkey.com.au, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Veto? (was: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g)) In-Reply-To: <19990407114127.Y2142@lemis.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 7 Apr 1999, Greg Lehey wrote: > > Have you tried this out? I have. I did the following on a 486DX/2-66 > with 16 MB, running 2.2.6: > > time build directory size > no symbols 34 min 5 MB > symbols 44 min 25 MB On my P90 non-symbols.. about 6 minutes symbols... about 25 minutes :-) (running X machine was unusable however) this is from memory.. I added more RAM (and anyhow build on another machine now :-) > > So you're right about the size. I don't see a really big difference > with the time; after using modern machines, it's painful either way, > but people who are used to building kernels on a 386/20 with 8 MB will > be delighted :-) > > I still definitely think that there should be a way to override the > symbols for people who really insist on not having them, but I don't > think that time or space are such an argument. > > Does anybody want to execute a power of veto, or shall I commit some > changes? If you turn it on, make it a DEAD SNAP to turn it off (maybe even look as sysctl hw.usermem or something.) > > Greg > -- > See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers > finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 19:34:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0A25154D4; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 19:34:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id LAA11756; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:41:28 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id LAA13067; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:41:28 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990407114127.Y2142@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:41:27 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Julian Elischer , Archie Cobbs Cc: Christopher Michaels , gjb@comkey.com.au, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Veto? (was: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g)) References: <199904061757.KAA73737@bubba.whistle.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: ; from Julian Elischer on Tue, Apr 06, 1999 at 11:11:08AM -0700 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tuesday, 6 April 1999 at 11:11:08 -0700, Julian Elischer wrote: > On Tue, 6 Apr 1999, Archie Cobbs wrote: > >> Christopher Michaels writes: >>> Maybe I'm a little out of the loop, but as a general user I feel I should >>> voice my opinions (questions). >>> >>> I understand the up-sides of a debug kernel (although I wouldn't mind some >>> clarification), but what are the down sides? >>> - The kernel is larger, correct? Is this just file size or does it take up >>> significantly more memory as well? >> >> You would install two kernels: /kernel and /kernel.debug. The first >> one is a normal kernel (but no debugging info) and this is the one >> you run. So no more memory is used (except on your disk). The second >> you only need as a debug reference for the first when you get a core dump. >> >>> - Does a debug kernel impart any performance hit? >> >> No... the same code is being executed as before. > > The down side is that you really need 32MB to compile a debug kernel > in timescales measurable by humans, and you need an extra 20MB or so of > disk per kernel compile directory. Have you tried this out? I have. I did the following on a 486DX/2-66 with 16 MB, running 2.2.6: time build directory size no symbols 34 min 5 MB symbols 44 min 25 MB So you're right about the size. I don't see a really big difference with the time; after using modern machines, it's painful either way, but people who are used to building kernels on a 386/20 with 8 MB will be delighted :-) I still definitely think that there should be a way to override the symbols for people who really insist on not having them, but I don't think that time or space are such an argument. Does anybody want to execute a power of veto, or shall I commit some changes? Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 20:54:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from asteroid.svib.ru (asteroid.svib.ru [195.151.166.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC05E14E93; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 20:54:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tarkhil@asteroid.svib.ru) Received: from shuttle.svib.ru (root@shuttle.svib.ru [195.151.166.144]) by asteroid.svib.ru (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id HAA00540; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 07:52:30 +0400 (MSD) Received: from shuttle.svib.ru (tarkhil@minas-tirith.pol.ru [127.0.0.1]) by shuttle.svib.ru (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA20690; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 07:55:01 +0400 (MSD) (envelope-from tarkhil@shuttle.svib.ru) Message-Id: <199904070355.HAA20690@shuttle.svib.ru> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Some questions on PLIP and EPP/ECP modes X-URL: http://freebsd.svib.ru From: "Alex Povolotsky" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 07:55:01 +0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello! Can't anyone please enlighten me in the following questions: 1. What cable is used to PLIP? I.e. is http://www.freebsd.org/FAQ/FAQ38.html still relevant? 2. Does EPP or ECP modes enhance PLIP performance? 3. Are there any DOS or Win95 drivers compartible with PLIP? Alex. --- Alexander B. Povolotsky [ICQ 18277558] [2:5020/145] [http://freebsd.svib.ru] [tarkhil@asteroid.svib.ru] [Urgent messages: 234-9696 ÁÂ.#35442 or tarkhil@pager.express.ru] To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 21:51:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 840B114CC0; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 21:51:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id OAA12327; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 14:19:30 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id OAA13260; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 14:19:29 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990407141928.C2142@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 14:19:28 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Julian Elischer Cc: Archie Cobbs , Christopher Michaels , gjb@comkey.com.au, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Veto? (was: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g)) References: <19990407114127.Y2142@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: ; from Julian Elischer on Tue, Apr 06, 1999 at 07:21:30PM -0700 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tuesday, 6 April 1999 at 19:21:30 -0700, Julian Elischer wrote: > On Wed, 7 Apr 1999, Greg Lehey wrote: >> >> Have you tried this out? I have. I did the following on a 486DX/2-66 >> with 16 MB, running 2.2.6: >> >> time build directory size >> no symbols 34 min 5 MB >> symbols 44 min 25 MB > > On my P90 > > non-symbols.. about 6 minutes > symbols... about 25 minutes :-) (running X machine was unusable however) > > this is from memory.. I added more RAM (and anyhow build on another machine > now :-) I don't even rely on my own memory :-) Evidence is more convincing. >> Does anybody want to execute a power of veto, or shall I commit some >> changes? > > If you turn it on, make it a DEAD SNAP to turn it off > (maybe even look as sysctl hw.usermem or something.) I think a sysctl would be wrong. Environment variable if you want. But I think config -s would be the way to go. Maybe I can print an explicit message: # config GENERIC Building kernel with full symbolic support. Do "config -s GENERIC" for historic partial symbolic support. Don't forget to do a ``make depend'' Kernel build directory is ../../compile/GENERIC, Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 22: 1:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from buddha.ghandi.cx (satori.rt66.com [198.59.162.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F2D614CC0 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 22:00:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ghandi@ghandi.cx) Received: from localhost (ghandi@localhost) by buddha.ghandi.cx (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id WAA06454; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 22:59:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ghandi@ghandi.cx) Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 22:58:59 -0600 (MDT) From: Dino Dai Zovi X-Sender: ghandi@localhost To: hackers@freebsd.org Cc: ghandi@mindless.com Subject: Forks hang in libsocket++ Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In the libsocket++ package (from ports), some of the tests either hang or bomb out in different ways. Usually when the test program bombs, it will print out something to the effect of: "tfork0 in free(): warning: chunk is already free." Where tfork just uses the C++ class to fork and pass messages between the parent and child. The tests fail in tpipe, tsockpair, tfork, and tfork0. I am running FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE (cvsup on April 4). I have not tested it on any other platforms myself, but I am told that all tests pass on Linux 2.0.xx and SunOS 4.1.X. If anyone has any insight into what's going on, I'd greatly appreciate it, a CS assignment requires that we use this library, and I'd like to develop it on my machine :) Thanks. -Dino --------------------------------------------------------------------- Dino A. Dai Zovi "The world grasps after systems, ghandi@mindless.com and is imprisoned in dogmas." http://www.ghandi.cx -Buddha --------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 23: 1:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (spinner.netplex.com.au [202.12.86.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8228214BEF; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 23:01:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spinner.netplex.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3/Netplex) with ESMTP id NAA03953; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 13:57:56 +0800 (WST) (envelope-from peter@spinner.netplex.com.au) Message-Id: <199904070557.NAA03953@spinner.netplex.com.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Greg Lehey Cc: Archie Cobbs , Christopher Michaels , gjb@comkey.com.au, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Apr 1999 08:24:16 +0930." <19990407082416.H2142@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 13:57:56 +0800 From: Peter Wemm Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey wrote: [..] > A number of other people have observed that the current boot loader > doesn't load the symbols anyway, so you could install /kernel.debug > only and still run normally. I consider this a deficiency in the boot > loader, since it should be possible to load the symbols. Of course, > an alternative solution would be to install /kernel.debug and leave it > until boot time to decide whether to load the symbols. That would > have the great advantage that you wouldn't get any mismatch between > the two kernels. I'll chime in here since this was the result of something I spent a lot of time on. A couple of points: 1: The loader *does* load symbols, just not the debugging ones on elf. It does this for runtime linking purposes. 2: Under ELF, the debug symbols are *seperate* to the symbol table. 3: A number of compromises had to be made to get around various restrictions in the environment being worked in. At present, the only symbols that DDB *might* be able to use from the debug symbols in the .stabs section are the line number tables to associate an address with a line number of source. This is an awful lot of baggage to carry for such a small gain. Yes, it would be nice to have a traceback show line numbers in the list, but I doubt it's worth implementation cost since the addresses can be matched in other ways. On the whole though, I feel that the best way to deal with loading extra debugging symbols is to do it shortly after boot. And on the subject of debugging kernels getting built, I'd tend to agree. Don't install them though, install the stripped version. Incidently, the loader works on kernels that have been plain stripped too, but it's restricted to global symbols only as a result. Cheers, -Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 23:11: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2430615134; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 23:10:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id PAA12636; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:38:25 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id PAA13691; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:38:21 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990407153821.L2142@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:38:21 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Peter Wemm Cc: Archie Cobbs , Christopher Michaels , gjb@comkey.com.au, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) References: <19990407082416.H2142@lemis.com> <199904070557.NAA03953@spinner.netplex.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904070557.NAA03953@spinner.netplex.com.au>; from Peter Wemm on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 01:57:56PM +0800 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wednesday, 7 April 1999 at 13:57:56 +0800, Peter Wemm wrote: > Greg Lehey wrote: > [..] >> A number of other people have observed that the current boot loader >> doesn't load the symbols anyway, so you could install /kernel.debug >> only and still run normally. I consider this a deficiency in the boot >> loader, since it should be possible to load the symbols. Of course, >> an alternative solution would be to install /kernel.debug and leave it >> until boot time to decide whether to load the symbols. That would >> have the great advantage that you wouldn't get any mismatch between >> the two kernels. > > I'll chime in here since this was the result of something I spent a lot > of time on. > > A couple of points: > 1: The loader *does* load symbols, just not the debugging ones on elf. It > does this for runtime linking purposes. Good point. I suppose that for the benefit of others I should point out that current kernels always (should) contain some symbols (see the reference to ps(1) in another message I sent. We're talking about full ("debug") symbols here. > 2: Under ELF, the debug symbols are *seperate* to the symbol table. Aren't they under a.out as well? Otherwise strip(1) would have a lot of trouble stripping. That's probably why the bootstrap doesn't load them, too. > 3: A number of compromises had to be made to get around various > restrictions in the environment being worked in. > > At present, the only symbols that DDB *might* be able to use from the debug > symbols in the .stabs section are the line number tables to associate an > address with a line number of source. This is an awful lot of baggage to > carry for such a small gain. Yes, it would be nice to have a traceback show > line numbers in the list, but I doubt it's worth implementation cost since > the addresses can be matched in other ways. Good point. > On the whole though, I feel that the best way to deal with loading > extra debugging symbols is to do it shortly after boot. Before or after starting process 0? > And on the subject of debugging kernels getting built, I'd tend to > agree. Don't install them though, install the stripped version. I had planned to leave that to the user: 'make install' will install a stripped kernel, 'make install.debug' will install the full symbol kernel. I still think this is a reasonable compromise. > Incidently, the loader works on kernels that have been plain > stripped too, but it's restricted to global symbols only as a > result. I'm not sure I understand this. By "plain stripped" do you mean strip -g or strip -s? The way I see it, the result of 'strip -g' is identical to a kernel built without the -g option to config. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 23:14:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from frmug.org (frmug-gw.frmug.org [193.56.58.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8870515134 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 23:14:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by frmug.org (8.9.1/frmug-2.3/nospam) with UUCP id IAA11344 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:12:01 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: by keltia.freenix.fr (Postfix, from userid 101) id B3D9387B6; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:01:13 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:01:13 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? Message-ID: <19990407080113.A4122@keltia.freenix.fr> Mail-Followup-To: FreeBSD Hackers References: <19990407085435.M2142@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <19990407085435.M2142@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 08:54:35AM +0930 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT/ELF ctm#5173 AMD-K6 MMX @ 200 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG According to Greg Lehey: > boot loads the kernel from /boot/kernel. > kernel initializes, including Vinum if desired, and > loads the root file system > The kernel data file is still available via a symlink from /kernel > to /boot/kernel, or as a copy somewhere. HP-UX uses a similar scheme with /stand/vmunix (and /stand/system for tuned parameters). /stand is always an HFS (aka UFS) whereas all the other FS can be VxFS. Speaking of HP, their LVM system is cool. Now, that would be a nice addition to vinum (please don't look at me, I'm not a FS expert). -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 4.0-CURRENT #70: Sat Feb 27 09:43:08 CET 1999 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 23:28:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from homer.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C25F41527D for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 23:28:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by homer.softweyr.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id XAA00397; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 23:22:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <370AEB83.5FB06D98@softweyr.com> Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 23:22:11 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Sergey Babkin , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Y2K issue References: <3702BF79.EE5801AE@bellatlantic.net> <37031575.F7A2399D@softweyr.com> <37040BB7.56E25907@bellatlantic.net> <3705AE7E.23D356D8@softweyr.com> <3706A4D6.5BDE3F87@bellatlantic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Sergey Babkin has suggested the following fix to the strptime library function so it will behave in a manner compatible with the Posix spec. Specifically, two-digit years on input will be interpreted in the 20th century if greater than 69, and in the 21st century otherwise. Any objections to committing this in -CURRENT and/or -RELENG_3? DG? Sergey Babkin wrote: > > Thanks! Here is the patch (a fairly simple one, also attached): > > ----------------------------- cut here ------------------------------------ > *** strptime.c 1999/04/03 23:15:37 1.1 > --- lib/libc/stdtime/strptime.c 1999/04/03 23:20:08 > *************** > *** 333,338 **** > --- 333,340 ---- > } > if (c == 'Y') > i -= 1900; > + if (c == 'y' && i < 69) > + i += 100; > if (i < 0) > return 0; > > ------------------------------- cut here ----------------------------------- > > Hare is the test program (also at > ftp://ftp.rdg.opengroup.org/pub/unsupported/stdtools/y2k/strptime.c) : > > ------------------------------- cut here ----------------------------------- > /* > * Taken from comp.unix.aix > * From: John Crothers > * Subject: strptime() and %y checker > */ > > #ifndef lint > static char *_version = "@(#)strptime_win.c 1.1 - 98/05/04"; > #endif > /* > * Determine window for the strptime(3C) function. > */ > #include > #include > #include > #ifdef sun > #include > #else > #define TM_YEAR_BASE 1900 > #endif > > main() > { > int i; > struct tm tm; > char buf[4]; > int years[100]; > > for (i = 0; i < 100; i++) { > sprintf(buf, "%02d", i); > (void) strptime(buf, "%y", &tm); > years[i] = tm.tm_year + TM_YEAR_BASE; > } > > printf("strptime(3C) window: %04d-", years[0]); > for (i = 1; i < 100; i++) { > if (years[i-1] / 100 != years[i] / 100) > printf("%04d %04d-", years[i-1], years[i]); > } > printf("%04d\n", years[99]); > exit(0); > return (0); /* quiet lint gripes */ > } > > ------------------------------- cut here ----------------------------------- > > And its description is at > ftp://ftp.rdg.opengroup.org/pub/unsupported/stdtools/y2k/README -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 23:30:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C44631527D for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 23:30:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id PAA12707; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:58:41 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id PAA13810; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:58:36 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990407155835.M2142@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:58:35 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? References: <19990407085435.M2142@lemis.com> <19990407080113.A4122@keltia.freenix.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990407080113.A4122@keltia.freenix.fr>; from Ollivier Robert on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 08:01:13AM +0200 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wednesday, 7 April 1999 at 8:01:13 +0200, Ollivier Robert wrote: > According to Greg Lehey: >> boot loads the kernel from /boot/kernel. >> kernel initializes, including Vinum if desired, and >> loads the root file system >> The kernel data file is still available via a symlink from /kernel >> to /boot/kernel, or as a copy somewhere. > > HP-UX uses a similar scheme with /stand/vmunix (and /stand/system for tuned > parameters). /stand is always an HFS (aka UFS) whereas all the other FS can > be VxFS. Right, most System Vs I know with this method call it /stand. But that name is taken :-) On Tandem, the boot file system is (wait for it) bfs. It's the most stupid file system I've seen yet, but it makes it easier for the bootstrap to find the kernel. > Speaking of HP, their LVM system is cool. Now, that would be a nice > addition to vinum (please don't look at me, I'm not a FS expert). Well, you *could* tell me which parts are cool and why. Then you'd have at least a hope of getting it. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 23:36: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from homer.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 63B8A156DA for ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 23:36:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by homer.softweyr.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id XAA00413; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 23:30:40 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <370AED80.2E22FA87@softweyr.com> Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 23:30:40 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Greg Lehey Cc: Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? References: <19990407085435.M2142@lemis.com> <19990407080113.A4122@keltia.freenix.fr> <19990407155835.M2142@lemis.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey wrote: > > On Wednesday, 7 April 1999 at 8:01:13 +0200, Ollivier Robert wrote: > > > > Speaking of HP, their LVM system is cool. Now, that would be a nice > > addition to vinum (please don't look at me, I'm not a FS expert). > > Well, you *could* tell me which parts are cool and why. Then you'd > have at least a hope of getting it. I think it is actually a variant of Veritas, just like the volume manager in AIX. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 6 23:49: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (spinner.netplex.com.au [202.12.86.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FB30156CE; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 23:48:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spinner.netplex.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3/Netplex) with ESMTP id OAA09741; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 14:45:25 +0800 (WST) (envelope-from peter@spinner.netplex.com.au) Message-Id: <199904070645.OAA09741@spinner.netplex.com.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Greg Lehey Cc: Archie Cobbs , Christopher Michaels , gjb@comkey.com.au, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Apr 1999 15:38:21 +0930." <19990407153821.L2142@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 14:45:24 +0800 From: Peter Wemm Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey wrote: > On Wednesday, 7 April 1999 at 13:57:56 +0800, Peter Wemm wrote: > > Greg Lehey wrote: > > [..] > >> A number of other people have observed that the current boot loader > >> doesn't load the symbols anyway, so you could install /kernel.debug > >> only and still run normally. I consider this a deficiency in the boot > >> loader, since it should be possible to load the symbols. Of course, > >> an alternative solution would be to install /kernel.debug and leave it > >> until boot time to decide whether to load the symbols. That would > >> have the great advantage that you wouldn't get any mismatch between > >> the two kernels. > > > > I'll chime in here since this was the result of something I spent a lot > > of time on. > > > > A couple of points: > > 1: The loader *does* load symbols, just not the debugging ones on elf. It > > does this for runtime linking purposes. > > Good point. I suppose that for the benefit of others I should point > out that current kernels always (should) contain some symbols (see the > reference to ps(1) in another message I sent. We're talking about > full ("debug") symbols here. Yep, I've decided to take a shot at exporting the symbol table and lookup to userland via dynamic sysctl's and see what I can do. Then we can toast kvm_mkdb and have libkvm look it up directly and also see kld's for free. > > 2: Under ELF, the debug symbols are *seperate* to the symbol table. > > Aren't they under a.out as well? Otherwise strip(1) would have a lot > of trouble stripping. That's probably why the bootstrap doesn't load > them, too. No, under a.out they are all lumped together with different stab types. The a.out strip process sifts through the list and keeps the ones it wants. Under ELF though, they are in different sections. There's .dynsym which has the symbols for the loader to use and they are in a PT_LOAD chunk and get loaded along with the code. Then there's the .symtab which contains a verbose ELF symbol table that also includes static symbols (.dynsym contains globals only). The debug symbols are in their own sections, usually .lineno*, .dwarf_* while .stabs_* has a.out-style symbols (*not* ELF style symbols!). .symtab and the others are generally not in the PT_LOAD program segments, and locating them requires jumping all around the file while getting the two PT_LOAD chunks is relatively easy. > > On the whole though, I feel that the best way to deal with loading > > extra debugging symbols is to do it shortly after boot. > > Before or after starting process 0? After, since they are not used for anything at all and just waste unpageable kernel memory. > > And on the subject of debugging kernels getting built, I'd tend to > > agree. Don't install them though, install the stripped version. > > I had planned to leave that to the user: 'make install' will install a > stripped kernel, 'make install.debug' will install the full symbol > kernel. I still think this is a reasonable compromise. Yep. I'd suggest modifying the Makefile to produce kernel.debug as the final link stage, and then do a: objcopy --strip-debug kernel.debug kernel This will save a copy of a large file. :-) > > Incidently, the loader works on kernels that have been plain > > stripped too, but it's restricted to global symbols only as a > > result. > > I'm not sure I understand this. By "plain stripped" do you mean strip > -g or strip -s? The way I see it, the result of 'strip -g' is > identical to a kernel built without the -g option to config. 'strip /kernel' will work, and the loader still functions. Once libkvm looks up the runtime symbols, then ps etc will still work even on that stripped kernel, or if the booted kernel is unavailable (ie: dosboot, netboot from a tftp server etc). > Greg Cheers, -Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 0:15:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-01.cdsnet.net (mail-01.cdsnet.net [206.107.16.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 1A6E214F6A for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 00:15:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mrcpu@internetcds.com) Received: (qmail 1866 invoked from network); 7 Apr 1999 07:13:33 -0000 Received: from schizo.cdsnet.net (204.118.244.32) by mail.cdsnet.net with SMTP; 7 Apr 1999 07:13:33 -0000 Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 00:12:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Jaye Mathisen X-Sender: mrcpu@schizo.cdsnet.net To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Nice FreeBSD mention Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Just a note, there was a cache comparison benchmark between a whole bunch of caching people... FreeBSD was mentioned in the summary as being the test platform for both the client and server portions of the test... http://bakeoff.ircache.net/bakeoff-01/ In a different section, they mention some tuning that they had to do to get FreeBSD to hop a long a bit faster... I don't have the exact URL handy, but it's in the software section... Perhaps the tips they suggest could be incorporated into a FAQ or note somewhere... To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 0:53: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-01.cdsnet.net (mail-01.cdsnet.net [206.107.16.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 67ABB155FF for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 00:53:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mrcpu@internetcds.com) Received: (qmail 15349 invoked from network); 7 Apr 1999 07:51:05 -0000 Received: from schizo.cdsnet.net (204.118.244.32) by mail.cdsnet.net with SMTP; 7 Apr 1999 07:51:05 -0000 Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 00:50:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Jaye Mathisen X-Sender: mrcpu@schizo.cdsnet.net To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: PXE services? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Does anybody have any experience with this? "PreBoot Execution Environment?"... To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 1:34:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sucuri.amazon.com.br (sucuri.amazon.com.br [200.241.240.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 167291527D; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 01:34:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from aldrin@americasnet.com) Received: from athome.logicStudios.org (root@pm3-s05.amazon.com.br [200.242.245.38]) by sucuri.amazon.com.br (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id FAA18644; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 05:32:08 -0300 Received: from athome.logicStudios.org (aldrin@athome.logicStudios.org [10.0.0.1]) by athome.logicStudios.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id FAA02851; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 05:40:21 -0300 (EST) (envelope-from aldrin@americasnet.com) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 05:40:21 -0300 (EST) From: Aldrin L X-Sender: aldrin@athome.logicStudios.org To: Alex Povolotsky Cc: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Some questions on PLIP and EPP/ECP modes In-Reply-To: <199904070355.HAA20690@shuttle.svib.ru> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 7 Apr 1999, Alex Povolotsky wrote: > 3. Are there any DOS or Win95 drivers compartible with PLIP? Yes. At least for DOS. Read the "Linux PLIP Mini-howto", at http://metalab.unc.edu/pub/Linux/docs/howto/mini/ The other questions should get their answers there too, i think. :] done, Aldrin Leal . To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 1:53:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail1.atl.bellsouth.net (mail1.atl.bellsouth.net [205.152.0.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B54A1577B for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 01:53:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wghicks@bellsouth.net) Received: from wghicks.bellsouth.net (host-216-76-138-41.atl.bellsouth.net [216.76.138.41]) by mail1.atl.bellsouth.net (8.8.8-spamdog/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA07897; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 04:50:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from wghicks (wghicks@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by wghicks.bellsouth.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id EAA01265; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 04:51:14 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net) Message-Id: <199904070851.EAA01265@bellsouth.net> To: sobomax@altavista.net Cc: Chuck Robey , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: PPPCTL for Win32 available (2) - sorry bad URL In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Apr 1999 14:34:25 +0300." <3709F141.B37341F@altavista.net> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 04:51:14 -0400 From: W Gerald Hicks Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Maybe *I* missed something... Oh I did! Sources please :-) I agree that these sort of facilitators are helpful with deploying FreeBSD but wonder what this one achieves that couldn't be done with a simpler sockets program perhaps wrapped in a GUI? That could be implemented easily in Tcl/Tk on Win32. Would a port for a cross-toolchain hosted on FreeBSD to target Win32 be useful? Then yours and other similar applications could be supported by the ports framework. Some developers might even be able to rid themselves of M$ development seats entirely. Cheers, Jerry Hicks To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 2:19:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from eltex.ru (ELTEX-2-SPIIRAS.nw.ru [195.19.204.46]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECB5615575 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 02:19:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from antuan@eltex.ru) Received: from gadget.eltex.ru (root@gadget.eltex.ru [195.19.198.14]) by eltex.ru (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id NAA15816 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 13:17:46 +0400 (MSD) Received: by gadget.eltex.ru (ssmtp TIS-0.5alpha, 19 Oct 1998); Wed, 7 Apr 1999 13:17:07 +0400 Received: from undisclosed-intranet-sender id xma029030; Wed, 7 Apr 99 13:16:47 +0400 Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 13:22:21 +0400 (MSD) From: Antuan Avdioukhine To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Mixed versions kernel building Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG People, Can anyone guide me how to organize environment for building kernels for mixed FreeBSD version on single machine? I'd tried to do such thing on 3.0-RELEASE machine for 2.2.6 version, but it failed. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 2:41: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from axl.noc.iafrica.com (axl.noc.iafrica.com [196.31.1.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 785481577B for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 02:40:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sheldonh@axl.noc.iafrica.com) Received: from sheldonh (helo=axl.noc.iafrica.com) by axl.noc.iafrica.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10Uon8-0007PF-00; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:38:38 +0200 From: Sheldon Hearn To: Duncan Barclay Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Suggested additions for periodic In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Apr 1999 22:32:52 +0100." Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 11:38:38 +0200 Message-ID: <28472.923477918@axl.noc.iafrica.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 06 Apr 1999 22:32:52 +0100, Duncan Barclay wrote: > The files consist of lines containing the pathname of each script > and a field indicating whether to run the script or not. Hi Duncan, I suspect you're going to take a lot of heat over whether or not the configuration of periodic(8) should be in its own conf files, or whether rc.conf is "good enough". Ignore it. :-) > The first matching entry in the configuration files determines the > run policy. > I'll finish the TODO's if people think this is a worthwhile addition, > otherwise I'll keep them as local patches. Let's see what you've got so far. If the diffs are big, post a URL. I like the sound of this. It's nice to see you working on how to improve what we've got, rather than joining the masses who bitch about what we don't have. :-) Ciao, Sheldon. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 2:56: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C67A614D12 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 02:56:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id SAA23410; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:53:31 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <370B2A1B.BA8877D6@newsguy.com> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 18:49:15 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Greg Lehey Cc: Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? References: <19990407085435.M2142@lemis.com> <19990407080113.A4122@keltia.freenix.fr> <19990407155835.M2142@lemis.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey wrote: > > > Speaking of HP, their LVM system is cool. Now, that would be a nice > > addition to vinum (please don't look at me, I'm not a FS expert). > > Well, you *could* tell me which parts are cool and why. Then you'd > have at least a hope of getting it. It's like AIX LVM... I sent you a message describing AIX LVM once. There are three features really worth in them. First, the Logical Volume is a set of Physical Volumes (VINUM does that). Second, you allocate partitions in the logical volumes through bitmaps of LPs (sectors/clusters/blocks/whatever you want to call it) instead of ranges. Third, you can increase logical volumes or partitions at any time. Then, there is the volume group stuff, which is a minor point. The problem is that the underlying filesystem would need to support dynamic size increase. BTW, I recall that you need to unmount the fs in HP-UX, while AIX supports increasing the logical volume (and underlying filesystem) without unmounting it. Anyway, if you can't increase the size of a filesystem, even having to unmount it, the other benefits of a LVM over Vinum are greatly diminished. I have worked with both, and AIX one is much superior. -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "nothing better than the ability to perform cunning linguistics" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 3:17:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tuminfo2.informatik.tu-muenchen.de (tuminfo2.informatik.tu-muenchen.de [131.159.0.81]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AFC3514D12 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 03:16:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hafner@informatik.tu-muenchen.de) Received: from hprbg5.informatik.tu-muenchen.de ([131.159.0.200] EHLO hprbg5.informatik.tu-muenchen.de ident: root [port 2173]) by tuminfo2.informatik.tu-muenchen.de with ESMTP id <110873-226>; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 12:15:01 +0000 Received: from hafner@localhost by hprbg5.informatik.tu-muenchen.de id <24223-660>; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 12:14:32 +0200 Newsgroups: muc.lists.freebsd.hackers To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: hafner@informatik.tu-muenchen.de Subject: IP Type of service (FTP proxy in German c`t) From: Walter Hafner Date: 07 Apr 1999 12:14:28 +0200 Message-ID: Lines: 85 X-Newsreader: Gnus v5.5/XEmacs 20.3 - "Vatican City" Posted-To: muc.lists.freebsd.hackers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The following message is a courtesy copy of an article that has been posted to muc.lists.freebsd.hackers as well. So - it finally happened. The well known german computer magazine c't released an FTP proxy, that sends requests with user-definable IP_TOS entries. The software (for Mac, Windows and Linux) is downloadable under http://www.heise.de/ct/ftp/99/07/194/ The text on the page (an excerpt from the article in the magazine), roughly in english: : Surfing on the fast lane : : Faster downloads with 'Quaility of Service' : : Article from c't 07/99, p. 194 (ju) : : The FTP-Booster accelerates FTP-Downloads, by setting the ToS-bits of : the IP-Header appropriately. After startup it runs as a FTP-Proxy-Server : on 127.0.0.1, port 1414. It has to be added to the browser-preferences : manually. : : The following customizations have to be made: type of connection and : priority. : : Level 0 runs with normal speed, level 1 (bulk) slows down downloads. : Levels 2-7 accelerate. Levels 3-7 are password protected. : : qos-lin.tgz Linux-version of the ftp-Booster : qos-win.tgz Windows-version of the ftp-Booster : qos-mac.hqx Mac-version of the ftp-Booster The passwords for levels 3-6 are phrases in older c't magazines, level 7 is for the c't staff only. Imho it's just a matter of time, until all the passwords are common knowledge or the software gets hacked and the proxy is widely used. (I got the passwords for the levels 3-5 simply by a "strings" ...) I tried the Linux version on a FreeBSD 3.1 box: tcsh > FTPBooster-linux -Modem:128 -Priority:2 FTPBooster 1.0 1999 c't/Matthias Withopf Gestartet auf 127.0.0.1:1414, Uebertragung 128 KBit/s, Stufe 2 - Priority 1... Well ... :-( The article states, that *BSD is the only operating system, that supports a direct setting of the IP_TOS bits via "setsockopt". I don´t know, whether that is true, but I truly and strongly second the comment in /usr/include/netinet/ip.h: /* * Definitions for IP precedence (also in ip_tos) (hopefully unused) */ The c't proxy operates by bypassing the normal IP stacks of the operating systems. c't claims, that in their tests, about 80% of all routers honored the TOS flags. On a sidenote - I just checked the FreeBSD fcpd code and noticed, that IP_TOS calls are in there already. So, what's the purpose of this mail? I don't really know, to be honest. I'd like to see a discussion on what to do now. Disabling the TOS features? Adding switches to the main net applications that allow to set the priority, too? Urging router manufacturers to disable priority handling by default? Imho it's a very bad thing, that users can manipulate IP priorities. Priority handling should be limited to specific applications for which it is really needed! Something must be done about this. Fast. Bye, -Walter [ adding "boosting" capabilities to the FreeBSD kernel - just to be one step ahead. :-( ] -- Walter Hafner__________________________________ hafner@in.tum.de *CLICK* "Multiple exclamation marks," he went on, shaking his head, "are a sure sign of a diseased mind." (Terry Pratchett, "Eric") To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 4:37:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fep2-orange.clear.net.nz (fep2-orange.clear.net.nz [203.97.32.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8DE4814C8C for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 04:37:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jabley@buddha.clear.net.nz) Received: from buddha.clear.net.nz (buddha.clear.net.nz [192.168.24.106]) by fep2-orange.clear.net.nz (1.5/1.9) with ESMTP id XAA23757; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 23:35:02 +1200 (NZST) Received: (from jabley@localhost) by buddha.clear.net.nz (8.9.2/8.9.2) id XAA24633; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 23:34:46 +1200 (NZST) (envelope-from jabley) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 23:34:46 +1200 From: Joe Abley To: Walter Hafner Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jabley@clear.co.nz Subject: Re: IP Type of service (FTP proxy in German c`t) Message-ID: <19990407233446.A24511@clear.co.nz> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: ; from Walter Hafner on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 12:14:28PM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, If the intention is to accelerate downloads, then I don't think this proxy is going to do much. It might promote the treatment of packets outbound from the client if the rfc1349 precedence is set to 7, but it can have no control over the return packets -- and that's where all the data is on a download (which is what most people do). In networks which _do_ support aggregate treatment of packets based on the rfc1349 precedence or diffserv bits, the usual strategy is to enforce the setting of these bits on ingress to the provider's network from the customer. No sane network provider operates on the principle that their customers are (a) skilled enough or (b) honest enough to set the bits correctly themselves. Having said that, I don't believe that many significant networks do anything at all with the rfc1349/diffserv bits further than cisco's alleged special treatment of precedence-7 traffic which is used for routing protocols. Concert Internet Plus is a notable exception, but they do ingress policing and shaping. Just my $0.02. I'm not worried about _our_ network :) Joe On Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 12:14:28PM +0200, Walter Hafner wrote: > The following message is a courtesy copy of an article > that has been posted to muc.lists.freebsd.hackers as well. > > So - it finally happened. > > The well known german computer magazine c't released an FTP proxy, that > sends requests with user-definable IP_TOS entries. > > The software (for Mac, Windows and Linux) is downloadable under > > http://www.heise.de/ct/ftp/99/07/194/ > > The text on the page (an excerpt from the article in the magazine), > roughly in english: > > : Surfing on the fast lane > : > : Faster downloads with 'Quaility of Service' > : > : Article from c't 07/99, p. 194 (ju) > : > : The FTP-Booster accelerates FTP-Downloads, by setting the ToS-bits of > : the IP-Header appropriately. After startup it runs as a FTP-Proxy-Server > : on 127.0.0.1, port 1414. It has to be added to the browser-preferences > : manually. > : > : The following customizations have to be made: type of connection and > : priority. > : > : Level 0 runs with normal speed, level 1 (bulk) slows down downloads. > : Levels 2-7 accelerate. Levels 3-7 are password protected. > : > : qos-lin.tgz Linux-version of the ftp-Booster > : qos-win.tgz Windows-version of the ftp-Booster > : qos-mac.hqx Mac-version of the ftp-Booster > > The passwords for levels 3-6 are phrases in older c't magazines, level 7 > is for the c't staff only. Imho it's just a matter of time, until all > the passwords are common knowledge or the software gets hacked and the > proxy is widely used. (I got the passwords for the levels 3-5 simply by > a "strings" ...) > > I tried the Linux version on a FreeBSD 3.1 box: > > tcsh > FTPBooster-linux -Modem:128 -Priority:2 > FTPBooster 1.0 1999 c't/Matthias Withopf > Gestartet auf 127.0.0.1:1414, Uebertragung 128 KBit/s, Stufe 2 - Priority 1... > > Well ... :-( > > The article states, that *BSD is the only operating system, that > supports a direct setting of the IP_TOS bits via "setsockopt". I don´t > know, whether that is true, but I truly and strongly second the comment > in /usr/include/netinet/ip.h: > > /* > * Definitions for IP precedence (also in ip_tos) (hopefully unused) > */ > > The c't proxy operates by bypassing the normal IP stacks of the > operating systems. c't claims, that in their tests, about 80% of all > routers honored the TOS flags. > > On a sidenote - I just checked the FreeBSD fcpd code and noticed, that > IP_TOS calls are in there already. > > > So, what's the purpose of this mail? I don't really know, to be > honest. I'd like to see a discussion on what to do now. Disabling the > TOS features? Adding switches to the main net applications that allow to > set the priority, too? Urging router manufacturers to disable priority > handling by default? > > Imho it's a very bad thing, that users can manipulate IP > priorities. Priority handling should be limited to specific > applications for which it is really needed! Something must be done > about this. Fast. > > Bye, > > -Walter [ adding "boosting" capabilities to the FreeBSD kernel - just to > be one step ahead. :-( ] > > -- > Walter Hafner__________________________________ hafner@in.tum.de > *CLICK* > "Multiple exclamation marks," he went on, shaking his head, > "are a sure sign of a diseased mind." (Terry Pratchett, "Eric") > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 5: 8:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E6CC15111 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 05:08:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id OAA21099 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 14:06:29 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA19622 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 14:06:28 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 14:06:28 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Call for coders Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Please reply in private to this. I'm looking for coders to get involved in the creation of a partition + slice management utility for freebsd (ala pqmagic). --- Marius Bendiksen, ScanCall AS To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 5:16:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from unix1.it-datacntr.louisville.edu (unix1.it-datacntr.louisville.edu [136.165.4.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D93E157AB for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 05:16:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from k.stevenson@louisville.edu) Received: from homer.louisville.edu (ktstev01@homer.louisville.edu [136.165.1.20]) by unix1.it-datacntr.louisville.edu (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA27966 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:14:48 -0400 Received: (from ktstev01@localhost) by homer.louisville.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA00726 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:14:48 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19990407081448.A28786@homer.louisville.edu> Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:14:48 -0400 From: Keith Stevenson To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? References: <19990407085435.M2142@lemis.com> <19990407080113.A4122@keltia.freenix.fr> <19990407155835.M2142@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990407155835.M2142@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 03:58:35PM +0930 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 03:58:35PM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: > On Wednesday, 7 April 1999 at 8:01:13 +0200, Ollivier Robert wrote: > > > > HP-UX uses a similar scheme with /stand/vmunix (and /stand/system for tuned > > parameters). /stand is always an HFS (aka UFS) whereas all the other FS can > > be VxFS. > > Right, most System Vs I know with this method call it /stand. But > that name is taken :-) On Tandem, the boot file system is (wait for > it) bfs. It's the most stupid file system I've seen yet, but it makes > it easier for the bootstrap to find the kernel. With LVM on AIX, the boot "device" isn't even mounted at run time. If you do anything with the root LVM configuration, you have to update the system boot blocks, but otherwise you'd never know that the boot device even exists. In the case of an extended vinum, would it even be necessary for the boot device to be mounted after the system is running? As for the various commercial LVMs, I've used LVM under both HPUX and AIX. In my opinion, AIX's implementation is far superior. The ability to increase the size of a mounted filesystem is extremely powerful. AIX's LVM also seems more robust than HPUX's. Regards, --Keith Stevenson-- -- Keith Stevenson System Programmer - Data Center Services - University of Louisville k.stevenson@louisville.edu PGP key fingerprint = 4B 29 A8 95 A8 82 EA A2 29 CE 68 DE FC EE B6 A0 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 5:52:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua (ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua [212.42.68.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A97814CAF for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 05:52:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sobomax@altavista.net) Received: from vega. (async2-23.iptelecom.net.ua [212.42.68.151]) by ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA27797; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:51:12 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from sobomax@altavista.net) Received: from altavista.net (big_brother [192.168.1.1]) by vega. (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id PAA09652; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:50:17 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from sobomax@altavista.net) Message-ID: <370B5489.9DE589BC@altavista.net> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 15:50:17 +0300 From: Maxim Sobolev Reply-To: sobomax@altavista.net Organization: Vega International Capital X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: ru,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: W Gerald Hicks Cc: Chuck Robey , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: PPPCTL for Win32 available (2) - sorry bad URL References: <199904070851.EAA01265@bellsouth.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG W Gerald Hicks wrote: > Maybe *I* missed something... > > Oh I did!ššš Sources pleaseš :-) Ok, I put the sources in the archive ( http://homepages.infoseek.com:80/~sobomax/pppctl/pppctl-win32-0.11.zip ). This sources can be useful not only to Windows owners, but to those FreeBSD'ers who uses pppctl often, because I've patched original pppctl to use GNU Readline library instead of BSD Editline and I found that Readline is in fact better for command line editing purposes. It should compile without a problem on FreeBSD - all Win32 dependent stuff made with #ifdef. > I agree that these sort of facilitators are helpful with deploying > FreeBSD but wonder what this one achieves that couldn't be done with a > simpler sockets program perhaps wrapped in a GUI?š That could be > implemented easily in Tcl/Tk on Win32. GUI is not really needed for pppctl, however maybe some time... > Would a port for a cross-toolchain hosted onš FreeBSD to target Win32 > be useful?š Then yours and other similar applications could be supported > by the ports framework. Yes it should be useful (as far as I know Cygwin toolchain supports cross-compiling and it is open-source), however it's too involved for me to make such port. My goal was far more simpler - I ported application, which I think may be useful not only for me but to all FreeBSD community. > Some developers might even be able to rid themselves of M$ development seats > entirely. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 6:15: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpha.comkey.com.au (alpha.comkey.com.au [203.9.152.215]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 82701157BB for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 06:14:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gjb-freebsd@gba.oz.au) Received: (qmail 15722 invoked by uid 1001); 7 Apr 1999 12:49:41 -0000 Message-ID: <19990407124941.15721.qmail@alpha.comkey.com.au> X-Posted-By: GBA-Post 1.04 06-Feb-1999 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 5A91 6942 8CEA 9DAB B95B C249 1CE1 493B 2B5A CE30 Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 22:49:41 +1000 From: Greg Black To: Greg Lehey Cc: Peter Wemm , Archie Cobbs , Christopher Michaels , questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) References: <19990407082416.H2142@lemis.com> <199904070557.NAA03953@spinner.netplex.com.au> <19990407153821.L2142@lemis.com> In-reply-to: <19990407153821.L2142@lemis.com> of Wed, 07 Apr 1999 15:38:21 +0930 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > And on the subject of debugging kernels getting built, I'd tend to > > agree. Don't install them though, install the stripped version. > > I had planned to leave that to the user: 'make install' will install a > stripped kernel, 'make install.debug' will install the full symbol > kernel. I still think this is a reasonable compromise. Agreed. -- Greg Black To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 6:15: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpha.comkey.com.au (alpha.comkey.com.au [203.9.152.215]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 5D94415751 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 06:14:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gjb-freebsd@gba.oz.au) Received: (qmail 15661 invoked by uid 1001); 7 Apr 1999 12:46:42 -0000 Message-ID: <19990407124642.15660.qmail@alpha.comkey.com.au> X-Posted-By: GBA-Post 1.04 06-Feb-1999 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 5A91 6942 8CEA 9DAB B95B C249 1CE1 493B 2B5A CE30 Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 22:46:42 +1000 From: Greg Black To: Peter Wemm Cc: Greg Lehey , Archie Cobbs , Christopher Michaels , questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) References: <199904070645.OAA09741@spinner.netplex.com.au> In-reply-to: <199904070645.OAA09741@spinner.netplex.com.au> of Wed, 07 Apr 1999 14:45:24 +0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > On the whole though, I feel that the best way to deal with loading > > > extra debugging symbols is to do it shortly after boot. > > > > Before or after starting process 0? > > After, since they are not used for anything at all and just waste > unpageable kernel memory. My major concern was indeed waste of memory in this way, so this sounds like a good move. > > > And on the subject of debugging kernels getting built, I'd tend to > > > agree. Don't install them though, install the stripped version. > > > > I had planned to leave that to the user: 'make install' will install a > > stripped kernel, 'make install.debug' will install the full symbol > > kernel. I still think this is a reasonable compromise. > > Yep. I'd suggest modifying the Makefile to produce kernel.debug as the > final link stage, and then do a: > > objcopy --strip-debug kernel.debug kernel > > This will save a copy of a large file. :-) I like the sound of this, especially if it's combined with the other suggestion to make config a bit verbose about just what it's setting up. -- Greg Black To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 6:15:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpha.comkey.com.au (alpha.comkey.com.au [203.9.152.215]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 8DA60157CD for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 06:14:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gjb-freebsd@gba.oz.au) Received: (qmail 15860 invoked by uid 1001); 7 Apr 1999 12:54:53 -0000 Message-ID: <19990407125453.15859.qmail@alpha.comkey.com.au> X-Posted-By: GBA-Post 1.04 06-Feb-1999 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 5A91 6942 8CEA 9DAB B95B C249 1CE1 493B 2B5A CE30 Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 22:54:52 +1000 From: Greg Black To: Greg Lehey Cc: Julian Elischer , Archie Cobbs , Christopher Michaels , questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Veto? (was: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g)) References: <19990407114127.Y2142@lemis.com> <19990407141928.C2142@lemis.com> In-reply-to: <19990407141928.C2142@lemis.com> of Wed, 07 Apr 1999 14:19:28 +0930 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I don't even rely on my own memory :-) Evidence is more convincing. :-) > >> Does anybody want to execute a power of veto, or shall I commit some > >> changes? > > > > If you turn it on, make it a DEAD SNAP to turn it off > > (maybe even look as sysctl hw.usermem or something.) > > I think a sysctl would be wrong. Environment variable if you want. > But I think config -s would be the way to go. Maybe I can print an > explicit message: > > # config GENERIC > Building kernel with full symbolic support. Do "config -s GENERIC" > for historic partial symbolic support. > > Don't forget to do a ``make depend'' > Kernel build directory is ../../compile/GENERIC, This looks good to me. -- Greg Black To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 6:27:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from axl.noc.iafrica.com (axl.noc.iafrica.com [196.31.1.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62377157E8 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 06:26:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sheldonh@axl.noc.iafrica.com) Received: from sheldonh (helo=axl.noc.iafrica.com) by axl.noc.iafrica.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10UsJu-000E4g-00 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:24:42 +0200 From: Sheldon Hearn To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: misc/10700: find(1) and the current directory Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 15:24:41 +0200 Message-ID: <54105.923491481@axl.noc.iafrica.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi folks, I'm looking at PR 10700, which suggests a fix for a simple problem, where a find is run as nobody from /usr/libexec/locate.updatedb (called from /etc/periodic/weekly/310.locate) and blows if it can't fchdir to root's homedir. The fix suggested is a work-around. The real issue seems to lie within an assumption made in find(1), namely that the current directory will always be accessible. That isn't true in a case like this (run as root): # cd /tmp # mkdir problem # chmod 700 problem # cd problem # echo find / | su -fm nobody This doesn't work because find(1) always tries to open a file descriptor for '.' (the current direcory) on startup. The only time this descriptor might be used is for a fchdir after a fork, before an execvp (in support of the -exec and -ok options). So all I need now is some approach guidance. Where's the right place to fix the reported bug? a) In the way the periodic script calls locate.updatedb, b) in the way locate.updatedb uses find, or c) in find itself? Thanks, Sheldon. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 6:30:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tick.ssec.wisc.edu (tick.ssec.wisc.edu [144.92.108.121]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 604F715801 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 06:30:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dglo@tick.ssec.wisc.edu) Received: from tick.ssec.wisc.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tick.ssec.wisc.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA23965; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:28:05 -0500 (CDT) From: Dave Glowacki Message-Id: <199904071328.IAA23965@tick.ssec.wisc.edu> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Warner Losh Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Learning Japanese for native English speaker In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Apr 1999 16:15:47 MDT." <199904062215.QAA80385@harmony.village.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 08:28:04 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Warner Losh wrote: > Greetings, > I'd like to learn Japanese so I might communicate with some Japanese > hackers that are doing cool things in areas that I'm interested in. In > addition, I'd like to be able to read most tecnical web pages. I'd also > like to know what good software to deal with 16-bit character sets (kanji, > hiragana and katakana) which people use. I'm an emacs user if that matters. > > Thank you for any pointers you can give me that would further my quest. I'm trying to pick up some Japanese, too, so I'd appreciate you forwarding anything you find. I've found the following: http://www.bolthole.com/kdrill/ Kanji Drill program http://www.rdt.monash.edu.au/~jwb/japanese.html A page on EDICT, the online Japanese/English dictionary http://www.righto.com/ Ken Shirriff has Kana/Kanji quiz programs for Java and PalmOS Good luck in your search! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 6:38:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mrelay.jrc.it (mrelay.jrc.it [139.191.1.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FB4514DA5; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 06:38:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nick.hibma@jrc.it) Received: from elpc36.jrc.it (elpc36.jrc.it [139.191.71.36]) by mrelay.jrc.it (LMC5692) with SMTP id PAA19258; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:38:45 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:35:15 +0200 (CEST) From: Nick Hibma X-Sender: n_hibma@elpc36.jrc.it Reply-To: Nick Hibma To: Greg Black Cc: Greg Lehey , Peter Wemm , Archie Cobbs , Christopher Michaels , questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) In-Reply-To: <19990407124941.15721.qmail@alpha.comkey.com.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Will that include a stripping of the previous kernel? if -x /kernel strip -g /kernel mv /kernel This is required or otherwise make the root partition bigger by default. 2x10Mb for the kernel does not leave a lot of room for etc. Patch for this is available if wanted. Just bounce me a message. Nick On Wed, 7 Apr 1999, Greg Black wrote: > > > And on the subject of debugging kernels getting built, I'd tend to > > > agree. Don't install them though, install the stripped version. > > > > I had planned to leave that to the user: 'make install' will install a > > stripped kernel, 'make install.debug' will install the full symbol > > kernel. I still think this is a reasonable compromise. > > Agreed. > > -- > Greg Black > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 7:24:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from darkside.magda.ru (darkside.magda.ru [194.85.102.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1123F14DA1 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 07:24:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from main@main.ru) Received: from [194.85.102.164] ([194.85.102.164]:32524 "EHLO main.ru" ident: "TIMEDOUT") by darkside.magda.ru with ESMTP id <119415-267>; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:24:11 +0400 Message-ID: <370B69DF.89995AF4@main.ru> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 18:21:20 +0400 From: Anatoly V Ivanov Organization: KROVAVI ABRIKOSI X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.36 i586) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: IPFW, DummyNET, Kernel Panic, af91 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, I have 3.1-R with DummyNET (with upgraded ip_output.c) and sometimes, after executing `sh /etc/rc.firewall` with a lot of pipe and skipto rules, kernel panic happens. I don't give a damn - it's only config-time bug, I can reboot my system atleast. But now I have some strange messages from kernel: "ed1: can't handle af91". I caught such message before last kernel panic. What the hell is af91? AFAIK, AF_MAX=31. Maybe, it's THE BUG? System running quite stable right now, but who knows... To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 7:50:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from relay01.esat.net (relay01.esat.net [192.111.39.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 562F515810 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 07:50:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nsmart@kira.team400.ie) Received: from (kira.team400.ie) [193.120.161.61] by relay01.esat.net with esmtp id 10Utcw-00006u-00; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:48:26 +0100 Message-ID: <370B7039.4AEE986B@kira.team400.ie> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 15:48:25 +0100 From: Niall Smart Organization: Trinity Commerce X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.30 i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Greg Black Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Veto? (was: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g)) References: <19990407114127.Y2142@lemis.com> <19990407141928.C2142@lemis.com> <19990407125453.15859.qmail@alpha.comkey.com.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Black wrote: > > > I don't even rely on my own memory :-) Evidence is more convincing. > > :-) > > > >> Does anybody want to execute a power of veto, or shall I commit some > > >> changes? > > > > > > If you turn it on, make it a DEAD SNAP to turn it off > > > (maybe even look as sysctl hw.usermem or something.) > > > > I think a sysctl would be wrong. Environment variable if you want. > > But I think config -s would be the way to go. Maybe I can print an > > explicit message: > > > > # config GENERIC > > Building kernel with full symbolic support. Do "config -s GENERIC" > > for historic partial symbolic support. > > > > Don't forget to do a ``make depend'' > > Kernel build directory is ../../compile/GENERIC, "Historical partial symbolic support"? There has to be a better wording. Niall "Two Cents" Smart To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 8: 0:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tuminfo2.informatik.tu-muenchen.de (tuminfo2.informatik.tu-muenchen.de [131.159.0.81]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E62BD14D72 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 07:59:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hafner@informatik.tu-muenchen.de) Received: from hprbg5.informatik.tu-muenchen.de ([131.159.0.200] EHLO hprbg5.informatik.tu-muenchen.de ident: root [port 2230]) by tuminfo2.informatik.tu-muenchen.de with ESMTP id <110886-226>; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 16:57:30 +0000 Received: from hafner@localhost by hprbg5.informatik.tu-muenchen.de id <24223-662>; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 16:57:12 +0200 To: Joe Abley Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, hafner@informatik.tu-muenchen.de Subject: Re: IP Type of service (FTP proxy in German c`t) References: <19990407233446.A24511@clear.co.nz> From: Walter Hafner Date: 07 Apr 1999 16:57:11 +0200 In-Reply-To: Joe Abley's message of "Wed, 7 Apr 1999 23:34:46 +1200" Message-ID: Lines: 102 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/XEmacs 20.3 - "Vatican City" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG First of all: A couple of people mailed me directly and told me, that I'm probably the victim of an April fools joke of the c't (The article was in the April's issue). I had the suspection myself, therefore I tested the program before I posted. As you can see below, I really got speed improvements. If this is just coincidence, well, go on, laugh at me. :-) (Ok. You can stop now.) If not, then I see a problem. Joe Abley writes: > If the intention is to accelerate downloads, then I don't think this > proxy is going to do much. It might promote the treatment of packets outbound > from the client if the rfc1349 precedence is set to 7, but it can have > no control over the return packets -- and that's where all the data is > on a download (which is what most people do). I had a look on 1349, as soon as I read the article. The article states, that "normally" all TOS and precedence settings from incoming packets are simply copied to the outgoing packets (which makes sense). That's the reason I checked the RFC. Unfortunately I didn't find it mentioned. RCF1195 doesn't say much about it either. I can't verify the assumption in detail (I´m no expert), but in a few quick tests I watched this or a similar behaviour: tcsh > ./FTPBooster-linux -Modem:128 -Priority:5 FTPBooster 1.0 1999 c't/Matthias Withopf Bitte geben Sie das Kennwort fuer Stufe 5 - Priority 4 ein. Wie lautet in c't 5/94 das 5. Wort in der vorletzten Zeile der 1. Spalte auf Seite 170? Kennwort: Gestartet auf 127.0.0.1:1414, Uebertragung 128 KBit/s, Stufe 5 - Priority 4... tcsh > setenv ftp_proxy localhost:1414 tcsh > wget -Y off ftp://ftp.distributed.net/pub/rc5-64/current-client/rc5des-freebsd3-x86-elf-nomt.tar.gz ... Connecting to ftp.distributed.net:21... connected! ... 13:28:26 (5.73 KB/s) - `rc5des-freebsd3-x86-elf-nomt.tar.gz' saved [206076] tcsh > wget -Y on ftp://ftp.distributed.net/pub/rc5-64/current-client/rc5des-freebsd3-x86-elf-nomt.tar.gz ... Connecting to localhost:1414... connected! ... 13:30:08 (14.11 KB/s) - `rc5des-freebsd3-x86-elf-nomt.tar.gz.1' saved [206076/206076] From 5 to 14 KB/s ... and that's reproducable, not only for this specific host. I experienced a speedup for some hosts I tested. e.g. ftp.xig.com 4.5 KB/s --> 14 KB/s ftp.sendmail.org 1.9 - 2.3 KB/s --> 2 - 14 KB/s ftp.vix.com 1.5 - 2.8 KB/s --> 5 - 14 KB/s Yes, I downloaded several times (using wget) to get a representative value. I didn't test different providers, router hardware, ftp software etc. The above is really only a quick snapshot. So, the proxy does _something_ and isn't a pure April fools joke. :-) Please don't ask me, why this works, unless you accept the above explanation. > In networks which _do_ support aggregate treatment of packets based on > the rfc1349 precedence or diffserv bits, the usual strategy is to enforce the > setting of these bits on ingress to the provider's network from the customer. > No sane network provider operates on the principle that their customers are > (a) skilled enough or (b) honest enough to set the bits correctly themselves. Unfortunately, I don't think so. Most of the providers are too lazy to configure their routers correctly ("never touch a running system") or simply don't know what they need to to. > Having said that, I don't believe that many significant networks do anything > at all with the rfc1349/diffserv bits further than cisco's alleged special > treatment of precedence-7 traffic which is used for routing protocols. > Concert Internet Plus is a notable exception, but they do ingress policing > and shaping. > > Just my $0.02. I'm not worried about _our_ network :) Well, download the proxy and test for yourself. It runs on FreeBSD 3.1. I _am_ worried. -Walter -- Walter Hafner__________________________________ hafner@in.tum.de *CLICK* "Multiple exclamation marks," he went on, shaking his head, "are a sure sign of a diseased mind." (Terry Pratchett, "Eric") To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 8: 3:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from florence.pavilion.net (florence.pavilion.net [194.242.128.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 418CC14D72; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:03:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from joe@florence.pavilion.net) Received: (from joe@localhost) by florence.pavilion.net (8.9.2/8.8.8) id QAA63126; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 16:01:19 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from joe) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 16:01:19 +0100 From: Josef Karthauser To: questions@freebsd.org Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Apache, Java servlet engine, and Java. Message-ID: <19990407160118.A62651@pavilion.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i X-NCC-RegID: uk.pavilion Organisation: Pavilion Internet plc, 24 The Old Steine, Brighton, BN1 1EL, England Phone: +44-845-333-5000 Fax: +44-845-333-5001 Mobile: +44-403-596893 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Has anyone had any experience with running the Apache Java servlet engine on FreeBSD? What Java engine would you recommend? Joe -- Josef Karthauser FreeBSD: How many times have you booted today? Technical Manager Viagra for your server (http://www.uk.freebsd.org) Pavilion Internet plc. [joe@pavilion.net, joe@uk.freebsd.org, joe@tao.org.uk] To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 8:16:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from etinc.com (et-gw.etinc.com [207.252.1.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9A3615790 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:16:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dennis@etinc.com) Received: from dbsys (dbsys.etinc.com [207.252.1.18]) by etinc.com (8.8.8/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA01121 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:13:33 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904071513.LAA01121@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 10:09:01 -0400 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: Dennis Subject: bpfilters in 2.2.8 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG No matter whan I do bpfilter.h generates NBPFILTER 0 is this a bug in 2.2.8? Is there something else I need to do? Dennis To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 8:21:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from titan.metropolitan.at (unknown [195.212.98.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE71614CE1 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:21:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mladavac@metropolitan.at) Received: by TITAN with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id <2AY773HM>; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:22:06 +0200 Message-ID: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D09758E@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at> From: Ladavac Marino To: 'Walter Hafner' , Joe Abley Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: RE: IP Type of service (FTP proxy in German c`t) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:16:25 +0200 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > -----Original Message----- > From: Walter Hafner [SMTP:hafner@informatik.tu-muenchen.de] > Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 1999 4:57 PM > To: Joe Abley > Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; hafner@informatik.tu-muenchen.de > Subject: Re: IP Type of service (FTP proxy in German c`t) >=20 > First of all: >=20 > A couple of people mailed me directly and told me, that I'm probably > the=20 > victim of an April fools joke of the c't (The article was in the > April's=20 > issue). I had the suspection myself, therefore I tested the program > before I posted. >=20 > As you can see below, I really got speed improvements. If this is = just > coincidence, well, go on, laugh at me. :-) >=20 > (Ok. You can stop now.) >=20 > If not, then I see a problem. >=20 >=20 >=20 > Joe Abley writes: >=20 > > If the intention is to accelerate downloads, then I don't think = this > > proxy is going to do much. It might promote the treatment of = packets > outbound > > from the client if the rfc1349 precedence is set to 7, but it can > have > > no control over the return packets -- and that's where all the data > is > > on a download (which is what most people do). [ML] Unless the proxy always tries to use passive mode thus opening BOTH connections if the server supports it. The observed results would seem to agree. > I had a look on 1349, as soon as I read the article. The article > states, that "normally" all TOS and precedence settings from incoming > packets are simply copied to the outgoing packets (which makes > sense). That's the reason I checked the RFC. Unfortunately I didn't > find > it mentioned. RCF1195 doesn't say much about it either. >=20 > I can't verify the assumption in detail (I=B4m no expert), but in a = few > quick tests I watched this or a similar behaviour: >=20 [ML] One should really try to tcpdump the connections. [measurements deleted] Sounds like trouble /Marino To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 8:22:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5945A14F67; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:22:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA03206; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 09:20:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id JAA20994; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 09:20:36 -0600 Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 09:20:36 -0600 Message-Id: <199904071520.JAA20994@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Josef Karthauser Cc: questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Apache, Java servlet engine, and Java. In-Reply-To: <19990407160118.A62651@pavilion.net> References: <19990407160118.A62651@pavilion.net> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Has anyone had any experience with running the Apache Java servlet engine > on FreeBSD? What Java engine would you recommend? I've done it, and it worked fine. This was 6-9 months ago though, though I don't expect it to be broken now. As far as performance goes I can't answer, since we were using it for servlet development, and it's not getting hit much at all. Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 8:27:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.tar.com (ns.tar.com [204.95.187.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A087914CE1 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:27:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dick@ns.tar.com) Received: (from dick@localhost) by ns.tar.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA08734 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:25:39 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dick) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:25:39 -0500 From: "Richard Seaman, Jr." To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Linuxthreads "port" status and a request Message-ID: <19990407102539.G467@tar.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Status ------ The Linux threads "port" is designed to provide 1-1 native kernel pthreads under FreeBSD. The idea has been that this is a temporary stop gap solution until FreeBSD gets it own kernel pthreads implementation, for those who want kernel pthreads rather than the FreeBSD "user" pthreads. The "port" is available at http://lt.tar.com It has now been about 3 weeks since the last reported bug in the Linux threads "port". It has received fairly heavy testing under stress, including some stress testing under SMP using Luoqi Chen's SMP vmspace sharing patches. That doesn't mean there might not be more bugs, but its at least reasonably stable. The tar ball of the "port" has now been downloaded more than 450 times, though I'm sure the actual number of users is dramatically less than this. Never-the-less, there are a number of users, and even some third party products that now use it. I'm prepared to submit the "port" to be committed to the ports tree (assuming someone will commit it), but there is one key problem. The Linux threads pthread.h and semaphore.h headers conflict with the corresponding FreeBSD headers. Solution to header problem -------------------------- After trying a variety of solutions, the consensus of the "port" users seems to be that the best solution involves: 1) copying the existing pthread.h and pthread_np.h headers to a subdirectory (I've proposed /usr/include/pthread/uthread -- in case the FreeBSD kernel threads also produces a conflict, it could use /usr/include/pthread/kthread). 2) installing a new top level pthread.h that looks like: #if defined(LINUXTHREADS) || defined(LINUXTHREAD) #include #include #include #elif defined(UTHREADS) || defined(UTHREAD) #include #else #include #endif 3) making a comparable change pthread_np.h and patching semaphore.h to #ifdef in the minor changes needed for linuxthreads 4) implementing the change by making appropriate fixes to the src tree (I have patches to accomplish this). Request ------- 1) does any one have a better solution? 2) does any one object to this solution? 3) would someone be willing to commit the changes if I send the patches or submit a new PR (I submitted PR 9778 on January 29, but the patches there became obsolete on March 22). Thanks. PS. It would also be helpful, though not essential to also make the following changes which I've recommended before: 1) Fix the posix priority extension functions (sched_*). Peter Dufault has developed patches to fix these which were "about to be committed" a couple of months ago. 2) Make the posix priority extension functions the default, rather than requiring a custom kernel. These changes would also be very helpful to Linux emulation when using linux pthreads. -- Richard Seaman, Jr. email: dick@tar.com 5182 N. Maple Lane phone: 414-367-5450 Chenequa WI 53058 fax: 414-367-5852 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 8:31:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from excalibur.oceanis.net (ns.dotcom.fr [195.154.74.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ADDD414CE1 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:31:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pixel@excalibur.oceanis.net) Received: (from pixel@localhost) by excalibur.oceanis.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) id PAA24816; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:29:05 GMT From: Emmanuel DELOGET Message-Id: <199904071529.PAA24816@excalibur.oceanis.net> Subject: Re: IP Type of service (FTP proxy in German c`t) In-Reply-To: from Walter Hafner at "Apr 7, 1999 4:57:11 pm" To: hafner@informatik.tu-muenchen.de (Walter Hafner) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:29:05 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers Mail List) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As the well known Walter Hafner said... ->>From 5 to 14 KB/s ... and that's reproducable, not only for this ->specific host. I experienced a speedup for some hosts I tested. -> ->e.g. ftp.xig.com 4.5 KB/s --> 14 KB/s -> ftp.sendmail.org 1.9 - 2.3 KB/s --> 2 - 14 KB/s -> ftp.vix.com 1.5 - 2.8 KB/s --> 5 - 14 KB/s -> These 14 KB/s are very strange. It seems that the product do something like file caching (or whatever you want to call it : saving [part of] accessed files on the local disk. [yes, it's a proxy, my son]. But 14 KB/s is very slow for a 'local disk to localhost to localhost' connection. My idea of this (sorry Walter) is : they created a great article with some nasty april fools inside. Then, they coded a real proxy, and slow down it in order to give the user some feeling such as "Hey, look at that ! My INet downloads are faster that yours !". The ftp proxy does not speed up the connecton. It just slow down local transferts in order to emulate a faster connection. :) Oh. This is what I think. This may not be the truth, of course. My name is *not* God. ->Well, download the proxy and test for yourself. It runs on FreeBSD ->3.1. I _am_ worried. We allready have a ftp/http/whatever proxy installed. But I'll try it at home soon :) -> ->-Walter -> ->-- ->Walter Hafner__________________________________ hafner@in.tum.de -> *CLICK* -> "Multiple exclamation marks," he went on, shaking his head, ->"are a sure sign of a diseased mind." (Terry Pratchett, "Eric") -- ____________________________________________________________________ Emmanuel DELOGET [pixel] pixel@{dotcom.fr,epita.fr} ---- DotCom SA -------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 8:31:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp04.wxs.nl (smtp04.wxs.nl [195.121.6.59]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC4AD157DF; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:31:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from asmodai@wxs.nl) Received: from daemon.ninth-circle.org ([195.121.56.113]) by smtp04.wxs.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 3.61) with ESMTP id AAA4B25; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:29:42 +0200 Received: from daemon.ninth-circle.org (abaddon@daemon [192.168.0.1]) by daemon.ninth-circle.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA29196; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:29:44 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from asmodai@wxs.nl) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 17:29:44 +0200 (CEST) Organization: Ninth Circle Enterprises From: Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai To: Daniel Hagan Subject: RE: POSIX compliance? Cc: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Hackers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 07-Apr-99 Daniel Hagan wrote: > Does anyone know what areas of POSIX FreeBSD is not compliant with? This > is apparently an important issue to some of the professors here at Va. > Tech. I am busy categorising the POSIX compliance as well as the Single Unix Specification v2 for FreeBSD on source level basis. Thus far I have done some things on SSv2 already at http://home.wxs.nl/~asmodai under the Programmer's Documentation Project link. I also am a member of the Austin group which reviews the POSIX specs for their new version. I hope to do positive work for FreeBSD there (NetBSD, BSDI, and the Linux Standard Base are amongst the other attendees) and I urge other people with at least more longstanding POSIX/FreeBSD hacking to join as well just for the sake of compliancy and pre-information. [ cross-posted to hackers as well for a call to the die hard hackers ;) please do NOT reply to this message without trimming the cc: list please ] --- Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven asmodai(at)wxs.nl The idea does not replace the work... Network/Security Specialist *BSD: Powered by Knowledge & Know-how To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 8:59:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gidgate.gid.co.uk (gidgate.gid.co.uk [193.123.140.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FE3315790 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:58:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: (from rb@localhost) by gidgate.gid.co.uk (8.8.8/8.8.7) id QAA10944; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 16:55:34 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from rb) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19990407165528.007b9680@192.168.255.1> X-Sender: rbmail@192.168.255.1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 16:55:28 +0100 To: Warner Losh From: Bob Bishop Subject: Re: Learning Japanese for native English speaker Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Warner Losh wrote: > Greetings, > I'd like to learn Japanese so I might communicate with some Japanese > hackers that are doing cool things in areas that I'm interested in. In > addition, I'd like to be able to read most tecnical web pages. I'd also > like to know what good software to deal with 16-bit character sets (kanji, > hiragana and katakana) which people use. I'm an emacs user if that matters. > > Thank you for any pointers you can give me that would further my quest. Have a look at: http://rivendel.com/%7Eric/resources/course.html http://www.ntt.co.jp/japan/japanese/ and possibly other links from http://www.utexas.edu/world/lecture/lang/ -- Bob Bishop +44 118 977 4017 rb@gid.co.uk fax +44 118 989 4254 (0800-1800 UK) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 9: 2:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from florence.pavilion.net (florence.pavilion.net [194.242.128.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DEFCD157C6; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 09:02:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from joe@florence.pavilion.net) Received: (from joe@localhost) by florence.pavilion.net (8.9.2/8.8.8) id RAA76832; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:00:07 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from joe) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:00:07 +0100 From: Josef Karthauser To: Nate Williams Cc: questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Apache, Java servlet engine, and Java. Message-ID: <19990407170007.A76462@pavilion.net> References: <19990407160118.A62651@pavilion.net> <199904071520.JAA20994@mt.sri.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904071520.JAA20994@mt.sri.com>; from Nate Williams on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 09:20:36AM -0600 X-NCC-RegID: uk.pavilion Organisation: Pavilion Internet plc, 24 The Old Steine, Brighton, BN1 1EL, England Phone: +44-845-333-5000 Fax: +44-845-333-5001 Mobile: +44-403-596893 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 09:20:36AM -0600, Nate Williams wrote: > > Has anyone had any experience with running the Apache Java servlet engine > > on FreeBSD? What Java engine would you recommend? > > I've done it, and it worked fine. This was 6-9 months ago though, > though I don't expect it to be broken now. As far as performance goes I > can't answer, since we were using it for servlet development, and it's > not getting hit much at all. Thanks for the swift reply Nate. Could you tell me which Java engine you're using as I believe that there are a few in the ports collection. Joe -- Josef Karthauser FreeBSD: How many times have you booted today? Technical Manager Viagra for your server (http://www.uk.freebsd.org) Pavilion Internet plc. [joe@pavilion.net, joe@uk.freebsd.org, joe@tao.org.uk] To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 9:14:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gw-nl3.philips.com (gw-nl3.philips.com [192.68.44.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D6A315790 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 09:14:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Jos.Backus@nl.origin-it.com) Received: from smtprelay-nl1.philips.com (localhost.philips.com [127.0.0.1]) by gw-nl3.philips.com with ESMTP id SAA05531 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:12:48 +0200 (MEST) (envelope-from Jos.Backus@nl.origin-it.com) Received: from smtprelay-eur1.philips.com(130.139.36.3) by gw-nl3.philips.com via mwrap (4.0a) id xma005529; Wed, 7 Apr 99 18:12:48 +0200 Received: from hal.mpn.cp.philips.com (hal.mpn.cp.philips.com [130.139.64.195]) by smtprelay-nl1.philips.com (8.9.3/8.6.10-1.2.2m-970826) with SMTP id SAA04293 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:12:47 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 6609 invoked by uid 666); 7 Apr 1999 16:13:09 -0000 Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:13:09 +0200 From: Jos Backus To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: bpfilters in 2.2.8 Message-ID: <19990407181309.A6068@hal.mpn.cp.philips.com> Reply-To: Jos Backus References: <199904071513.LAA01121@etinc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <199904071513.LAA01121@etinc.com>; from Dennis on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 10:09:01AM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 10:09:01AM -0400, Dennis wrote: > No matter whan I do bpfilter.h generates > > NBPFILTER 0 > > is this a bug in 2.2.8? Is there something else I need to do? > > Dennis Also, when building, say, the if_tun module, ${NBPFILTER} isn't being set, causing tcpdump to fail on the tunnel device afterwards. Just a thought: shouldn't /usr/obj/usr/src/sys/modules/if_tun/bpfilter.h somehow point to /usr/src/sys/compile/KERNEL/bpfilter.h? -- Jos Backus _/ _/_/_/ "Reliability means never _/ _/ _/ having to say you're sorry." _/ _/_/_/ -- D. J. Bernstein _/ _/ _/ _/ Jos.Backus@nl.origin-it.com _/_/ _/_/_/ use Std::Disclaimer; To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 9:28:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [129.188.136.102]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3593B14D59 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 09:28:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Don_Esry-FDE005@email.mot.com) Received: [from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate2.mot.com (MOT-motgate2 1.0) with ESMTP id LAA09261 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:27:44 -0500 (CDT)] Received: [from fl19exbh01.paging.mot.com (fl19exbh01.paging.mot.com [199.3.38.45]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-mothost 2.0) with ESMTP id LAA16014 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:26:16 -0500 (CDT)] Received: by fl19exbh01.paging.mot.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2417.0) id ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 12:26:16 -0400 Message-ID: <681FCF3A6828D211A37F00A0C9992A2101880FFE@fl19exch01.paging.mot.com> From: Esry Don-FDE005 To: "'Daniel C. Sobral'" , Greg Lehey Cc: Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: RE: Separate boot partition? Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 12:26:10 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2417.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I believe that IBM, HP, and Sun all buy their LVM from Veritous. Hopefully I am close enough in spelling that you can figure it out. :-) -----Original Message----- From: Daniel C. Sobral [mailto:dcs@newsguy.com] Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 1999 5:49 AM To: Greg Lehey Cc: Ollivier Robert; FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? Greg Lehey wrote: > > > Speaking of HP, their LVM system is cool. Now, that would be a nice > > addition to vinum (please don't look at me, I'm not a FS expert). > > Well, you *could* tell me which parts are cool and why. Then you'd > have at least a hope of getting it. It's like AIX LVM... I sent you a message describing AIX LVM once. There are three features really worth in them. First, the Logical Volume is a set of Physical Volumes (VINUM does that). Second, you allocate partitions in the logical volumes through bitmaps of LPs (sectors/clusters/blocks/whatever you want to call it) instead of ranges. Third, you can increase logical volumes or partitions at any time. Then, there is the volume group stuff, which is a minor point. The problem is that the underlying filesystem would need to support dynamic size increase. BTW, I recall that you need to unmount the fs in HP-UX, while AIX supports increasing the logical volume (and underlying filesystem) without unmounting it. Anyway, if you can't increase the size of a filesystem, even having to unmount it, the other benefits of a LVM over Vinum are greatly diminished. I have worked with both, and AIX one is much superior. -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "nothing better than the ability to perform cunning linguistics" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 9:34: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E7DC14D59 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 09:33:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id BAA01763; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 01:31:36 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <370B8804.2E0752C@newsguy.com> Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 01:29:56 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Esry Don-FDE005 Cc: Greg Lehey , Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? References: <681FCF3A6828D211A37F00A0C9992A2101880FFE@fl19exch01.paging.mot.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Esry Don-FDE005 wrote: > > I believe that IBM, HP, and Sun all buy their LVM from Veritous. Hopefully I > am close enough in spelling that you can figure it out. :-) I don't believe that's the case with IBM. I have been known to be wrong before, though... :-) -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "nothing better than the ability to perform cunning linguistics" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 9:39:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 088461580E; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 09:39:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id KAA03853; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:37:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id KAA21491; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:37:22 -0600 Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:37:22 -0600 Message-Id: <199904071637.KAA21491@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Josef Karthauser Cc: Nate Williams , questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Apache, Java servlet engine, and Java. In-Reply-To: <19990407170007.A76462@pavilion.net> References: <19990407160118.A62651@pavilion.net> <199904071520.JAA20994@mt.sri.com> <19990407170007.A76462@pavilion.net> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > Has anyone had any experience with running the Apache Java servlet engine > > > on FreeBSD? What Java engine would you recommend? > > > > I've done it, and it worked fine. This was 6-9 months ago though, > > though I don't expect it to be broken now. As far as performance goes I > > can't answer, since we were using it for servlet development, and it's > > not getting hit much at all. > > Thanks for the swift reply Nate. Could you tell me which Java engine you're > using as I believe that there are a few in the ports collection. Note, I'm a bit biased, being the case that makes the releases and I'm very involved in the port, but there is only *ONE* valid Java engine for FreeBSD, and that's the one in lang/jdk. With regard to the only other java engine I'd consider using (kaffe), I've had bad luck getting things to work at times, and at other times it didn't support a number of features that the JDK port above support. However, for servlet development those features may not be necessary, and due to the built-in JIT in kaffe, it might be a better solution. (On the other hand, there are two JIT's for the FreeBSD JDK port, ShuJIT and TYAJit, which work with varying degrees of success.) See http://www.freebsd.org/java Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 9:43:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from etinc.com (et-gw.etinc.com [207.252.1.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7638014C27 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 09:43:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dennis@etinc.com) Received: from dbsys (dbsys.etinc.com [207.252.1.18]) by etinc.com (8.8.8/8.6.9) with SMTP id MAA02374; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 12:40:25 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904071640.MAA02374@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 11:35:53 -0400 To: Jos Backus From: Dennis Subject: Re: bpfilters in 2.2.8 Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <19990407181309.A6068@hal.mpn.cp.philips.com> References: <199904071513.LAA01121@etinc.com> <199904071513.LAA01121@etinc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 06:13 PM 4/7/99 +0200, you wrote: >On Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 10:09:01AM -0400, Dennis wrote: >> No matter whan I do bpfilter.h generates >> >> NBPFILTER 0 >> >> is this a bug in 2.2.8? Is there something else I need to do? >> >> Dennis > >Also, when building, say, the if_tun module, ${NBPFILTER} isn't being set, >causing tcpdump to fail on the tunnel device afterwards. actually I spelled it wrong (bpfilters instead of bpfilter)....2.2.8 doesnt complain and it probably should. dennis To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 9:55:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wall.polstra.com (rtrwan160.accessone.com [206.213.115.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B4D414D10 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 09:55:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Received: from vashon.polstra.com (vashon.polstra.com [206.213.73.13]) by wall.polstra.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA07166; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 09:53:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) From: John Polstra Received: (from jdp@localhost) by vashon.polstra.com (8.9.2/8.9.1) id JAA10155; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 09:53:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 09:53:36 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904071653.JAA10155@vashon.polstra.com> To: des@flood.ping.uio.no Subject: Re: Increasing both NBUF and NMBCLUSTERS leads to panics In-Reply-To: References: <199904061651.SAA11984@adv.iae.nl> <199904061806.LAA09677@apollo.backplane.com> <19990407114647.A2142@lemis.com> Organization: Polstra & Co., Seattle, WA Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article , Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > Greg Lehey writes: > > On Tuesday, 6 April 1999 at 23:55:58 +0200, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > > Nah, just read section 13.15 in the FreeBSD FAQ. Beware that in > > > FreeBSD 3.x, changing the kvm size will break BSDI binary > > > compatibility. > > I thought that had been fixed again. > > In -CURRENT, yes. I don't think it was MFCed. Not yet, but I'm planning to merge it. John -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-interest is the aphrodisiac of belief." -- James V. DeLong To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 10:10: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.university.microsoft.com (mail.university.microsoft.com [131.107.65.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78C9014C27 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:09:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DanielB@university.microsoft.com) Received: by mail.university.microsoft.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id <2L0JMFVA>; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:10:21 -0700 Message-ID: <117CB81A9C37D211887D00805F6563F126B781@mail.university.microsoft.com> From: Daniel Berlin To: 'Warner Losh ' , Daniel Berlin Cc: 'Doug Rabson ' , 'Nick Hibma ' , 'FreeBSD hackers mailing list ' , 'USB BSD list ' Subject: RE: disassembling i386 code Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:10:01 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >Does it work with any of the emulators that run on FreeBSD? > >Warner Good question. I've played with it under VMWare (which should run under FreeBSD through linux emulation, though i've not tried it), and it worked fine. It includes a win32 console executable, os/2 text mode executable, and DOS extended executable. I'm mainly stuck using it on my very nice laptop (which can even run NT5 at a reasonable speed, but that's because it's a P2-350), which FreeBSD doesn't run on. --Dan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 10:44: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ryouko.nas.nasa.gov (ryouko.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.34.113]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0135715818 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:44:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from greg@ryouko.nas.nasa.gov) Received: from ryouko.nas.nasa.gov (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ryouko.nas.nasa.gov (8.8.7/NAS8.8.7n) with ESMTP id KAA24349 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:41:51 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904071741.KAA24349@ryouko.nas.nasa.gov> To: "'FreeBSD hackers mailing list '" Subject: Re: VMWare under FreeBSD [was: disassembling i386 code] In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Apr 1999 10:10:01 PDT." <117CB81A9C37D211887D00805F6563F126B781@mail.university.microsoft.com> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 10:41:51 -0700 From: "Gregory P. Smith" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I've played with it under VMWare (which should run under FreeBSD through > linux emulation, though i've not tried it), and it worked fine. VMWare loads a few Linux kernel modules. You'll have to port those first.. -G To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 10:52:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-out2.apple.com (mail-out2.apple.com [17.254.0.51]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA11F14BFF for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:52:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from justin@rhapture.apple.com) Received: from mailgate1.apple.com (A17-128-100-225.apple.com [17.128.100.225]) by mail-out2.apple.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA08896 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:42:26 -0700 Received: from scv1.apple.com (scv1.apple.com) by mailgate1.apple.com (mailgate1.apple.com- SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Wed, 07 Apr 1999 10:42:15 -0700 Received: from rhapture.apple.com (rhapture.apple.com [17.202.40.59]) by scv1.apple.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA15312; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:42:14 -0700 Received: by rhapture.apple.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) id KAA05909; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:42:13 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904071742.KAA05909@rhapture.apple.com> To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? Cc: Esry Don-FDE005 , Greg Lehey , Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:42:06 -0700 From: "Justin C. Walker" Reply-To: justin@apple.com X-Mailer: by Apple MailViewer (2.105.dev) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > From: "Daniel C. Sobral" > Date: 1999-04-07 09:32:07 -0700 > To: Esry Don-FDE005 > Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? > Cc: Greg Lehey , Ollivier Robert > ,FreeBSD Hackers > X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja > Delivered-to: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org > X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) > X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > Esry Don-FDE005 wrote: > > > > I believe that IBM, HP, and Sun all buy their LVM from Veritous. Hopefully I > > am close enough in spelling that you can figure it out. > > I don't believe that's the case with IBM. I have been known to be > wrong before, though... The company name, I think, is Veritas (as in Veritas Vos Liberabit). And you're correct that IBM didn't *buy* the implementation from Veritas. It's quite similar in idea, though. Regards, Justin Justin C. Walker, Curmudgeon-At-Large * Institute for General Semantics | Manager, CoreOS Networking | Men are from Earth. Apple Computer, Inc. | Women are from Earth. 2 Infinite Loop | Deal with it. Cupertino, CA 95014 | *-------------------------------------*-------------------------------* To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 11:20:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from news.IAEhv.nl (news.IAE.nl [194.151.64.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 818F314C10 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:20:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from devet@adv.iae.nl) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by news.IAEhv.nl (8.9.1/8.9.1) with IAEhv.nl id UAA08057 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:18:00 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from devet@localhost) by adv.iae.nl (8.9.2/8.8.6) id UAA25325 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:17:22 +0200 (CEST) From: Arjan de Vet Message-Id: <199904071817.UAA25325@adv.iae.nl> Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:17:22 +0200 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Increasing both NBUF and NMBCLUSTERS leads to panics (solved) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I wrote: >Besides increasing the NBUF parameter I also want to increase >NMBCLUSTERS of course because the machine will handle quite some network >traffic. But for some reason increasing both NBUF and NMBCLUSTERS only >leads to panics :-(. Based on some reactions I got I took the following 4.0-current changes and ported them to 3.1-stable: dg 1999/03/11 10:28:47 PST Modified files: sys/i386/conf Makefile.i386 kernel.script sys/i386/include pmap.h Log: Increased kernel virtual address space to 1GB. NOTE: You MUST have fixed bootblocks in order to boot the kernel after this! Also note that this change breaks BSDI BSD/OS compatibility. Also increased default NKPT to 17 so that FreeBSD can boot on machines with >=2GB of RAM. Booting on machines with exactly 4GB requires other patches, not included. Revision Changes Path 1.141 +2 -2 src/sys/i386/conf/Makefile.i386 1.2 +1 -1 src/sys/i386/conf/kernel.script 1.59 +4 -4 src/sys/i386/include/pmap.h tegge 1999/02/15 09:36:59 PST Modified files: sys/boot/common load_elf.c Log: Enable load of i386 ELF kernels with larger KVA range (e.g. starting at 0xe0100000u or 0xc0100000u instead of the usual 0xf0100000u). Revision Changes Path 1.11 +2 -2 src/sys/boot/common/load_elf.c After recompiling the kernel and recompiling/reinstalling the bootblocks I was able to load a kernel with increased NBUF and NMBCLUSTERS settings. I was going to suggest that these changes be merged in 3.1-stable but I just saw that Peter Wemm merged the load_elf.c change today. I suppose we'll see a 'HEADS UP' warning on freebsd-stable and in the UPDATING file somewhere in the future urging everybody to recompile and install their bootblocks after which the other change can be merged (I thought the BSD/OS compatibility was fixed somewhere else already). Thank you all for your suggestions and remarks. Arjan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 11:32:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (spinner.netplex.com.au [202.12.86.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E9A814F38 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:32:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spinner.netplex.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3/Netplex) with ESMTP id CAA13784; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 02:28:42 +0800 (WST) (envelope-from peter@spinner.netplex.com.au) Message-Id: <199904071828.CAA13784@spinner.netplex.com.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Arjan de Vet Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Increasing both NBUF and NMBCLUSTERS leads to panics (solved) In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Apr 1999 20:17:22 +0200." <199904071817.UAA25325@adv.iae.nl> Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 02:28:42 +0800 From: Peter Wemm Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Arjan de Vet wrote: [..] > I was going to suggest that these changes be merged in 3.1-stable but I > just saw that Peter Wemm merged the load_elf.c change today. I suppose > we'll see a 'HEADS UP' warning on freebsd-stable and in the UPDATING > file somewhere in the future urging everybody to recompile and install > their bootblocks after which the other change can be merged (I thought > the BSD/OS compatibility was fixed somewhere else already). I merged the loader fix early to give people a head start.. I'm not planning on merging over the KVM stuff myself, but I think it's a good plan in general. Cheers, -Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 11:55:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com (gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com [207.113.159.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C45AA14D0A for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:55:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gdonl@tsc.tdk.com) Received: from sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com (root@sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com [192.168.241.191]) by gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA28812; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:52:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gdonl@tsc.tdk.com) Received: from salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com (salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com [192.168.241.194]) by sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA16262; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:52:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from gdonl@localhost) by salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA16057; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:52:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Don Lewis Message-Id: <199904071852.LAA16057@salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com> Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 11:52:03 -0700 In-Reply-To: Sheldon Hearn "misc/10700: find(1) and the current directory" (Apr 7, 3:24pm) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(3) 7/19/95) To: Sheldon Hearn , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: misc/10700: find(1) and the current directory Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Apr 7, 3:24pm, Sheldon Hearn wrote: } Subject: misc/10700: find(1) and the current directory } } Hi folks, } } I'm looking at PR 10700, which suggests a fix for a simple problem, } where a find is run as nobody from /usr/libexec/locate.updatedb (called } from /etc/periodic/weekly/310.locate) and blows if it can't fchdir to } root's homedir. } } The fix suggested is a work-around. The real issue seems to lie within } an assumption made in find(1), namely that the current directory will } always be accessible. I think the suggested fix in the PR is probably the way to go. I don't think there is much you can do about finds assumptions without building in a special purpose workaround for this case. What if you wanted to to do (assuming "." is readable): find /some/path . -whatever --- Truck To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 12: 2:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ikhala.tcimet.net (ikhala.tcimet.net [198.109.166.215]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF6AA14E42 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 12:02:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dervish@ikhala.tcimet.net) Received: (from dervish@localhost) by ikhala.tcimet.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA57067 for hackers@FreeBSD.org; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:19:32 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from dervish) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:19:31 -0400 From: Natty Rebel To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Nice FreeBSD mention Message-ID: <19990407151931.A36308@ikhala.tcimet.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: ; from Jaye Mathisen on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 12:12:36AM -0700 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 2C CE A5 D7 FA 4D D5 FD 9A CC 2B 23 04 46 48 F8 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Quoting Jaye Mathisen (mrcpu@internetcds.com): > > Just a note, there was a cache comparison benchmark between a whole bunch > of caching people... > > > FreeBSD was mentioned in the summary as being the test platform for both > the client and server portions of the test... > > http://bakeoff.ircache.net/bakeoff-01/ > > > In a different section, they mention some tuning that they had to do to > get FreeBSD to hop a long a bit faster... I don't have the exact URL > handy, but it's in the software section... Perhaps the tips they suggest > could be incorporated into a FAQ or note somewhere... here's the url http://polygraph.ircache.net/caveats.html #;^) -- natty rebel harder than the rest ... To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 12:10:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1BF3D15836 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 12:10:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id MAA05105; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 12:07:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from utah.XYLAN.COM by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id MAA14024; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 12:07:00 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com by utah.XYLAN.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (xylan utah [SPOOL])) id NAA24401; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 13:06:34 -0600 Message-ID: <370B9DFB.908971CA@softweyr.com> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 12:03:39 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Daniel Berlin Cc: "'Warner Losh '" , "'Doug Rabson '" , "'Nick Hibma '" , "'FreeBSD hackers mailing list '" , "'USB BSD list '" Subject: Re: disassembling i386 code References: <117CB81A9C37D211887D00805F6563F126B781@mail.university.microsoft.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Daniel Berlin wrote: > > >Does it work with any of the emulators that run on FreeBSD? > > > >Warner > > Good question. > I've played with it under VMWare (which should run under FreeBSD through > linux emulation, though i've not tried it), and it worked fine. > It includes a win32 console executable, os/2 text mode executable, and DOS > extended executable. > > I'm mainly stuck using it on my very nice laptop (which can even run NT5 at > a reasonable speed, but that's because it's a P2-350), which FreeBSD doesn't > run on. What sort of botched up laptop did you get? FreeBSD runs quite nicely on my shiny new Sony F160. PII/300, 64MB, 4.3GB, 14.1" NeoMagic. I haven't gotten sound working yet, but I haven't tried. This little box is COOL. Now, I need to dump some of the Sony-supplied windows spooge so I can free up a Gig or so for BeOS. ;^) -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 12:13:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25D3B15945 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 12:12:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bob@luke.pmr.com) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id OAA55710; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 14:09:51 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bob) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 14:09:51 -0500 From: Bob Willcox To: Ladavac Marino Cc: "'Chuck Robey'" , "Alton, Matthew" , DL-ADM , "'Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG'" Subject: Re: AIX going BSD Message-ID: <19990407140951.A54187@luke.pmr.com> Reply-To: Bob Willcox References: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D097586@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D097586@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at>; from Ladavac Marino on Thu, Apr 01, 1999 at 10:54:03AM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 01, 1999 at 10:54:03AM +0200, Ladavac Marino wrote: > > I was actually commending IBM/AIX on its good taste in choice of > source bits (i.e. ours and NetBSD's) and actually acknowledging that (by > not removing the RCS id lines). > > If it weren't for the funky executable/shared-library format and > toolchain, I'd actually like it a lot (where did it get that from? > OS/2--AFAIR OS/2 had DLL's before AIX got them). Actually, AIX 2.x (on the RT, remember those) had shared libraries in '87. These were quite limited in functionality (you could not replace a member without quite probably breaking *all* executables that linked to them since they didn't have indirect linkage to the functions in them. For AIX 3.1 and beyond (RS6K versions of AIX) an all-new shared library mechanism was implemented. This (as I remember) hit the streets in '90. The funky object file and shared library format (XTOC) came from IBM research folks. Unfortunately, no too much attention (none?) was paid by them to what was taking shape in the Unix community (I believe Elf was not seriously considered at the time, due, at least in part, to political issues between IBM and AT&T/USL). This is my recollection anyway. (I was there [AIX architecture] at the time, but I learned some time ago that my memory is not infallable.) > > /Marino > > > > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------- > > ------ > > Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or > > data > > chuckr@glue.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and > > Unix. > > 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | > > Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) > > (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). > > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------- > > ------ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 12:27: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2A0014D2C for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 12:27:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id MAA05253; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 12:23:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from utah.XYLAN.COM by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id MAA14492; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 12:23:40 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com by utah.XYLAN.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (xylan utah [SPOOL])) id NAA25451; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 13:23:23 -0600 Message-ID: <370BA1EC.5EE0AA4B@softweyr.com> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 12:20:28 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: justin@apple.com Cc: "Daniel C. Sobral" , Esry Don-FDE005 , Greg Lehey , Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? References: <199904071742.KAA05909@rhapture.apple.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Justin C. Walker" wrote: > > > From: "Daniel C. Sobral" > > > > Esry Don-FDE005 wrote: > > > > > > I believe that IBM, HP, and Sun all buy their LVM from Veritous. > Hopefully I > > > am close enough in spelling that you can figure it out. > > > > I don't believe that's the case with IBM. I have been known to be > > wrong before, though... > The company name, I think, is Veritas (as in Veritas Vos > Liberabit). Or as in "In vino veritas." ;^) > And you're correct that IBM didn't *buy* the > implementation from Veritas. It's quite similar in idea, though. No, actually IBM *did* originally buy the volume manager bits from Veritas. They then took the additional step(s) of completely integrating volume management and journalling into their filesystem and making it the default. This was about AIX 3.0 or 3.1 timeframe, if memory serves correctly. I propose we should do the same with Vinum, pending agreement from Greg for technical porpoises and the owners of Vinum from a license standpoint. Adding disk space to a system is MUCH easier when you can throw a new drive onto the system, slice it up, and throw a slice into swap, another slice into /usr, and a third slice into /var without moving files or other chicanery. Greg, do you think this might be possible for 4.0 RELEASE? -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 12:55:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns1.yes.no (ns1.yes.no [195.204.136.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5883514E85; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 12:55:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eivind@bitbox.follo.net) Received: from bitbox.follo.net (bitbox.follo.net [195.204.143.218]) by ns1.yes.no (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id VAA01709; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 21:53:18 +0200 (CEST) Received: (from eivind@localhost) by bitbox.follo.net (8.8.8/8.8.6) id VAA76780; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 21:53:15 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 21:53:14 +0200 From: Eivind Eklund To: Nick Sayer Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/sys/kern kern_time.c Message-ID: <19990407215314.B75317@bitbox.follo.net> References: <199904071924.MAA05436@apollo.backplane.com> <199904071932.MAA38634@medusa.kfu.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <199904071932.MAA38634@medusa.kfu.com>; from Nick Sayer on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 12:32:51PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [Moved to -hackers] On Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 12:32:51PM -0700, Nick Sayer wrote: > > :On Apr 7, 9:36am, Nick Sayer wrote: > > :} Subject: cvs commit: src/sys/kern kern_time.c > > : > > :} We still need to decide on an algorithm to clamp positive adjustments. > > :} As it stands, it is possible to achieve arbitrary negative adjustments > > :} by "wrapping" time around. > > : > > :Limit positive steps to MIN(1 second, elapsed time since last postive step). > > :At worst the clock could be made to run at 2x normal speed. > > I was looking at a much uglier version of the above, involving > having a 'step allowed' variable that gets cleared by the clock > interrupt or something, but the above looks much nicer. Let me > go to my little workshop. :-) I'd suggest going for at least a minute instead of a second, to allow re-adjustement after loosing an ntp server for a while. Possibly more; I've not thought too closely about this. It might be reasonable to do maxstep = MIN(1 minute, elapsed time since last positive step / 10) to keep the present "max 10% time adjustement" limitation. Eivind. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 13:48:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-out1.apple.com (mail-out1.apple.com [17.254.0.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B4AAD158CD for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 13:48:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from justin@rhapture.apple.com) Received: from mailgate1.apple.com (A17-128-100-225.apple.com [17.128.100.225]) by mail-out1.apple.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA24316 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 13:32:27 -0700 Received: from scv2.apple.com (scv2.apple.com) by mailgate1.apple.com (mailgate1.apple.com- SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Wed, 07 Apr 1999 13:32:21 -0700 Received: from rhapture.apple.com (rhapture.apple.com [17.202.40.59]) by scv2.apple.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA23268; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 13:32:19 -0700 Received: by rhapture.apple.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) id NAA24606; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 13:32:19 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904072032.NAA24606@rhapture.apple.com> To: Wes Peters Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? Cc: "Daniel C. Sobral" , Esry Don-FDE005 , Greg Lehey , Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 13:32:06 -0700 From: "Justin C. Walker" Reply-To: justin@apple.com X-Mailer: by Apple MailViewer (2.105.dev) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > From: Wes Peters > Date: 1999-04-07 12:23:45 -0700 > To: justin@apple.com > Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? > > "Justin C. Walker" wrote: > > > > > From: "Daniel C. Sobral" > > > > > > Esry Don-FDE005 wrote: > > > > > > > > I believe that IBM, HP, and Sun all buy their LVM from Veritous. > > Hopefully I > > > > am close enough in spelling that you can figure it out. > > > > > > I don't believe that's the case with IBM. I have been known to be > > > wrong before, though... > > The company name, I think, is Veritas (as in Veritas Vos > > Liberabit). > > Or as in "In vino veritas." ;^) Sounds even better this way. > > And you're correct that IBM didn't *buy* the > > implementation from Veritas. It's quite similar in idea, though. > > No, actually IBM *did* originally buy the volume manager bits from > Veritas. They then took the additional step(s) of completely > integrating volume management and journalling into their filesystem > and making it the default. This was about AIX 3.0 or 3.1 timeframe, > if memory serves correctly. My recollection is from talking with the Veritas folks several years back, and that's what they told me. Over time, of course, the bits get fuzzier, until it's hard to tell the zeros from the ones :-} Regards, Justin Justin C. Walker, Curmudgeon-At-Large * Institute for General Semantics | Manager, CoreOS Networking | Men are from Earth. Apple Computer, Inc. | Women are from Earth. 2 Infinite Loop | Deal with it. Cupertino, CA 95014 | *-------------------------------------*-------------------------------* To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 14: 3:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kalypso.cybercom.net (kalypso.cybercom.net [209.21.136.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6EC714D2F for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 14:03:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ksmm@threespace.com) Received: from localhost (ksmm@localhost) by kalypso.cybercom.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id RAA14785 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:01:21 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:01:17 -0400 (EDT) From: The Classiest Man Alive X-Sender: ksmm@kalypso.cybercom.net To: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? In-Reply-To: <199904072032.NAA24606@rhapture.apple.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 7 Apr 1999, Justin C. Walker wrote: : > No, actually IBM *did* originally buy the volume manager bits from : > Veritas. They then took the additional step(s) of completely : > integrating volume management and journalling into their filesystem : > and making it the default. This was about AIX 3.0 or 3.1 timeframe, : > if memory serves correctly. : My recollection is from talking with the Veritas folks several : years back, and that's what they told me. Over time, of course, the : bits get fuzzier, until it's hard to tell the zeros from the ones :-} This is not correct. Despite the similarities between IBM's volume manager and VERITAS' own, IBM wrote theirs independently. From what I've heard it has very similar functionality, but it has always been a separate product. K.S. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 14:15:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quack.kfu.com (quack.kfu.com [170.1.70.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B564714CFD; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 14:15:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nsayer@medusa.kfu.com) Received: from medusa.kfu.com (medusa.kfu.com [170.1.70.5]) by quack.kfu.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA02328; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 14:13:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nsayer@localhost) by medusa.kfu.com (8.9.2/8.8.8) id OAA39221; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 14:13:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nsayer) From: Nick Sayer Message-Id: <199904072113.OAA39221@medusa.kfu.com> Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/sys/kern kern_time.c In-Reply-To: <19990407215314.B75317@bitbox.follo.net> from Eivind Eklund at "Apr 7, 1999 9:53:14 pm" To: eivind@FreeBSD.org (Eivind Eklund) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 14:13:26 -0700 (PDT) Cc: nsayer@quack.kfu.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I'd suggest going for at least a minute instead of a second, to allow > re-adjustement after loosing an ntp server for a while. Possibly > more; I've not thought too closely about this. It might be reasonable > to do I'd say that if the time was off by more than a few seconds (remember, we're talking about secure machines here), a reboot might not be inappropriate. But if the machine is not rebooted, xntpd will step the clock, the step will be clamped to +1 second, and xntpd will recompute the delta, decide another step is in order, etc. So the time will slowly reconverge. The behavior before (at least for negative deltas) was that the clock would continue to drift out of control even if there were suitable peers for xntpd. -- echo afnlre@dhnpx.xsh.pbz |\ : "Quick man! Cling tenaciously to my tr 'a-z' 'n-za-m' : buttocks!" or remove nospam in From: line : http://www.kfu.com/~nsayer/ : -- Powdered Toast Man To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 14:54: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 241DF14D66; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 14:54:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA06156; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 14:51:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904072151.OAA06156@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Nate Williams Cc: Josef Karthauser , questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Apache, Java servlet engine, and Java. In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Apr 1999 10:37:22 MDT." <199904071637.KAA21491@mt.sri.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 14:51:41 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG apache + jserv + kaffe works fine and I have used it quite a bit. Amancio To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 15:20:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from frmug.org (frmug-gw.frmug.org [193.56.58.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8836F14CE7 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:20:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by frmug.org (8.9.1/frmug-2.3/nospam) with UUCP id AAA21956 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 00:18:03 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: by keltia.freenix.fr (Postfix, from userid 101) id 8B08F87B6; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 00:09:55 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 00:09:55 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? Message-ID: <19990408000955.D8314@keltia.freenix.fr> Mail-Followup-To: FreeBSD Hackers References: <19990407085435.M2142@lemis.com> <19990407080113.A4122@keltia.freenix.fr> <19990407155835.M2142@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <19990407155835.M2142@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 03:58:35PM +0930 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT/ELF ctm#5173 AMD-K6 MMX @ 200 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG According to Greg Lehey: > Right, most System Vs I know with this method call it /stand. But > that name is taken :-) On Tandem, the boot file system is (wait for > it) bfs. It's the most stupid file system I've seen yet, but it makes > it easier for the bootstrap to find the kernel. On SVR4 (at least some of the older 4.0 ones) used bfs as the filesystem used for /stand. It is much simplier than UFS (contiguous allocation and all that) and fits in the boot blocks. > Well, you *could* tell me which parts are cool and why. Then you'd > have at least a hope of getting it. It is something that for some parts is akind to vinum (mirror, raid and all) with resizing of partitions (both VxfS and HFS). The LVM module from AIX is even better because you don't need to unmount the filesystem before (HP does it with an extra package called OnlineJFS). You have Physical Volumes, grouped into Volume Groups, each Volume Group is divided into Logical Volumes and a LV can contain a filesystem. A given filesystem is extendable within a LV and you can enlarge a LV. Probably near what Veritas' stuff does. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 4.0-CURRENT #70: Sat Feb 27 09:43:08 CET 1999 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 15:38:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from atlrel2.hp.com (atlrel2.hp.com [156.153.255.202]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4DD9B14F86 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:38:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from darrylo@sr.hp.com) Received: from srmail.sr.hp.com (srmail.sr.hp.com [15.4.45.14]) by atlrel2.hp.com (8.8.6 (PHNE_17135)/8.8.5tis) with ESMTP id SAA02484 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:35:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mina.sr.hp.com by srmail.sr.hp.com with ESMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA241894560; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:36:01 -0700 Received: from localhost (darrylo@mina.sr.hp.com [15.4.42.247]) by mina.sr.hp.com with ESMTP (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.7.3 TIS 5.0) id PAA03480 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:35:56 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904072235.PAA03480@mina.sr.hp.com> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Preliminary UDI spec available Reply-To: Darryl Okahata Mime-Version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 1.1.1.1) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 15:35:54 -0700 From: Darryl Okahata Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG FYI, I just saw that a preliminary UDI spec (0.90) is available for public review (UDI is the "Uniform Driver Interface", which should allow for portable drivers across hardware *and* operating systems -- at the source and not binary level). I don't know if anyone here is following it, but here it is: http://www.sco.com/UDI/specs.html -- Darryl Okahata darrylo@sr.hp.com DISCLAIMER: this message is the author's personal opinion and does not constitute the support, opinion, or policy of Hewlett-Packard, or of the little green men that have been following him all day. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 15:55:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from colnta.acns.ab.ca (clgr000532.hs.telusplanet.net [161.184.82.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F4F114FE7 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:55:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from davidc@colnta.acns.ab.ca) Received: from localhost (davidc@localhost) by colnta.acns.ab.ca (8.9.2/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA15452 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 16:51:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from davidc@colnta.acns.ab.ca) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 16:51:30 -0600 (MDT) From: Chad David To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Closing file descriptors with cc -pthread Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I have been porting a threaded server from Solaris to FreeBSD, and I noticed that on FreeBSD the server uses 100% of the processor even when it is "idle". top shows it climb to the top of the list and eventually take up 99.8% on a fairly idle system. truss shows that the process is calling select() and gettimeofday() over and over... I tracked the problem to an init_daemon() call (much like daemon(), only a little more complete), and within that I found it was a loop that closed all open descriptors and dup2()'d 0,1,2 -> /dev/null that was causing the problem. In a seperate test I was able to duplicate the problem, but I am not sure what I am seeing or why. Is this a bug, or am I missing something? Also, why are descriptors 3 and 4 open when the program starts? --CODE-- /* testfd.c */ #include #include #include extern int errno; int main() { int fd; int nfile=256; int i; for (i = nfile; i >= 0; i--) { printf("[%d]",i); if (i == 3 || i == 4) { printf(" ??\n"); close(i); continue; } if (i == STDOUT_FILENO) { printf(" stdout\n"); continue; } if (close(i) != 0) printf(" error [%d]\n",errno); else printf(" ok\n"); } sleep(100); } If this code is compiled with cc -o testfd testfd.c it will run as expected. If it is compiled with cc -pthread -o testfd testfd.c then it seems to loop out of control. If I do not close 3 and 4 the code will run normally both with -pthread and without. Again, what are they for? Not closing all open descriptors, and dup2()'ing 0,1, and 2 like daemon() does solves my problem, but I do not understand why. Any information would be appreciated. Thanks. Chad David ACNS Inc. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 16: 6:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5CAD8158AD for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 16:06:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id TAA06730 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 19:04:34 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904072304.TAA06730@cs.rpi.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: device driver question Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 19:04:33 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As some of you know I have been writing a KLD SIO as a reference for a class. I have the driver working fully *except* for one thing I cannot figure out. The order of my driver initialization is as follows: probe(); /*mostly a stub, just fills in some hard coded values */ attach(); /*init buffers, enable interupts */ connect_intr(); /*connect to the kernel intr routines */ siodev_intr(NULL); /*handle the race condition between attach()/connect_intr()*/ return 0; /* pass control back to the kernel */ that works OK, as far as I can tell, and it is just background information. when the write() function of my driver is called, if 1: The old data buffer had no data in it and 2: the UART is not busy sending any data then "prime" the driver, so the interrupts will chain and it will send the entire buffer. I have it print out the IIR (Interrupt Information Register) before it primes the buffer, no interrupts pending. at a later point I call write() again, and again view the IIR. It shows interupts, yet my handler was never called! Finally in desperation I put a "siodev_intr(NULL)" in the close routine, and it works! It processes that interrupt, exits. and then is triggered again by the kernel for an interrupt condition and sends all of the data (receives too since the device is in loopback mode). Any ideas what I am missing? -- David Cross To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 16:20:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD088158AD for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 16:20:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id IAA16622; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 08:48:24 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id IAA19457; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 08:48:22 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990408084822.X2142@lemis.com> Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 08:48:22 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Wes Peters , justin@apple.com Cc: "Daniel C. Sobral" , Esry Don-FDE005 , Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Volume managers (was: Separate boot partition?) References: <199904071742.KAA05909@rhapture.apple.com> <370BA1EC.5EE0AA4B@softweyr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <370BA1EC.5EE0AA4B@softweyr.com>; from Wes Peters on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 12:20:28PM -0600 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [Format recovered--see http://www.lemis.com/email/email-format.html] On Wednesday, 7 April 1999 at 12:20:28 -0600, Wes Peters wrote: > "Justin C. Walker" wrote: >> >>> From: "Daniel C. Sobral" >>> >>> Esry Don-FDE005 wrote: >>>> >>>> I believe that IBM, HP, and Sun all buy their LVM from Veritous. >>>> Hopefully I am close enough in spelling that you can figure it >>>> out. >>> >>> I don't believe that's the case with IBM. I have been known to be >>> wrong before, though... >> The company name, I think, is Veritas (as in Veritas Vos >> Liberabit). > > Or as in "In vino veritas." ;^) > >> And you're correct that IBM didn't *buy* the >> implementation from Veritas. It's quite similar in idea, though. Do you think they could take the truth? > No, actually IBM *did* originally buy the volume manager bits from > Veritas. They then took the additional step(s) of completely > integrating volume management and journalling into their filesystem > and making it the default. This was about AIX 3.0 or 3.1 timeframe, > if memory serves correctly. From what I've been told, IBM's approach is orthogonal to Vinum and Veritas. Vinum and Veritas have plexes as the middle element in the hierarchy, whereas IBM has replicated subdisks. > I propose we should do the same with Vinum, pending agreement from > Greg for technical porpoises and the owners of Vinum from a license > standpoint. Adding disk space to a system is MUCH easier when you > can throw a new drive onto the system, slice it up, and throw a > slice into swap, another slice into /usr, and a third slice into > /var without moving files or other chicanery. > > Greg, do you think this might be possible for 4.0 RELEASE? I can't see why not, since it's possible now. What we still need to do is find a way to extend a file system, but that's a ufs issue (which has a solution), not a volume manager issue. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 16:43:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90D2514CA9 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 16:43:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id IAA27205; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 08:41:20 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <370BEBC4.954E5A0E@newsguy.com> Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 08:35:32 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ollivier Robert Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? References: <19990407085435.M2142@lemis.com> <19990407080113.A4122@keltia.freenix.fr> <19990407155835.M2142@lemis.com> <19990408000955.D8314@keltia.freenix.fr> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ollivier Robert wrote: > > You have Physical Volumes, grouped into Volume Groups, each Volume Group > is divided into Logical Volumes and a LV can contain a filesystem. A given > filesystem is extendable within a LV and you can enlarge a LV. Mirroring can be set at VG level, either synchronous or assynchronous. I don't recall if this was set at VG or LV level, but default allocation for LV could be in a most PV or least PV fashion, LV could also have PV allocated in an explicitly (down to the PP map, the minimum allocation unit for physical volumes -- usually 4 Mb). FS are allocated 1-to-1 on LV. (MMmmm.... I notice my memory did indeed fail me on previous mails...) -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "nothing better than the ability to perform cunning linguistics" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 17: 9: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EEBA14F28 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:08:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id UAA07543; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:06:56 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904080006.UAA07543@cs.rpi.edu> To: "David E. Cross" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: device driver question In-Reply-To: Message from "David E. Cross" of "Wed, 07 Apr 1999 19:04:33 EDT." <199904072304.TAA06730@cs.rpi.edu> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 20:06:55 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > As some of you know I have been writing a KLD SIO as a reference for a class. > I have the driver working fully *except* for one thing I cannot figure out. > > The order of my driver initialization is as follows: > > probe(); /*mostly a stub, just fills in some hard coded values */ > attach(); /*init buffers, enable interupts */ > connect_intr(); /*connect to the kernel intr routines */ > siodev_intr(NULL); /*handle the race condition between attach()/connect_intr()*/ > return 0; /* pass control back to the kernel */ > > that works OK, as far as I can tell, and it is just background information. > > when the write() function of my driver is called, if 1: The old data buffer > had no data in it and 2: the UART is not busy sending any data then "prime" > the driver, so the interrupts will chain and it will send the entire buffer. > I have it print out the IIR (Interrupt Information Register) before it > primes the buffer, no interrupts pending. at a later point I call write() > again, and again view the IIR. It shows interupts, yet my handler was never > called! > > Finally in desperation I put a "siodev_intr(NULL)" in the close routine, and > it works! It processes that interrupt, exits. and then is triggered again > by the kernel for an interrupt condition and sends all of the data (receives > too since the device is in loopback mode). > > Any ideas what I am missing? It turns out that the handler is only getting called _one_ time, when I actually call it. It is handling all the IO within that one call. Therefore the problem appears that I am not calling intr_create() and connect_intr() correctly. Here is a code sample, what am I doing wrong? imask=1<<(4-1); /* i have tried both 1<<(4-1) and 1<<4 */ idesc=intr_create(NULL, 4, siodev_intr, NULL, &imask, 0); if (idesc==NULL)....; if (intr_connect(idesc))....; -- David Cross To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 17:26:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D852515019 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:26:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id JAA16886; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 09:54:49 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id JAA19632; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 09:54:49 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990408095449.F2142@lemis.com> Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 09:54:49 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Keith Stevenson , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? References: <19990407085435.M2142@lemis.com> <19990407080113.A4122@keltia.freenix.fr> <19990407155835.M2142@lemis.com> <19990407081448.A28786@homer.louisville.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990407081448.A28786@homer.louisville.edu>; from Keith Stevenson on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 08:14:48AM -0400 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wednesday, 7 April 1999 at 8:14:48 -0400, Keith Stevenson wrote: > On Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 03:58:35PM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: >> On Wednesday, 7 April 1999 at 8:01:13 +0200, Ollivier Robert wrote: >>> >>> HP-UX uses a similar scheme with /stand/vmunix (and /stand/system for tuned >>> parameters). /stand is always an HFS (aka UFS) whereas all the other FS can >>> be VxFS. >> >> Right, most System Vs I know with this method call it /stand. But >> that name is taken :-) On Tandem, the boot file system is (wait for >> it) bfs. It's the most stupid file system I've seen yet, but it makes >> it easier for the bootstrap to find the kernel. > > With LVM on AIX, the boot "device" isn't even mounted at run time. If you do > anything with the root LVM configuration, you have to update the system boot > blocks, but otherwise you'd never know that the boot device even exists. > In the case of an extended vinum, would it even be necessary for the boot > device to be mounted after the system is running? No. That's the whole point. The boot partition does not run under Vinum, so it's not failure-tolerant. If we needed it, it would be a weak point in the implementation. > As for the various commercial LVMs, I've used LVM under both HPUX > and AIX. In my opinion, AIX's implementation is far superior. The > ability to increase the size of a mounted filesystem is extremely > powerful. This is theoretically possible in Vinum as well; we just need to modify ufs to understand it's in a bigger volume. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 17:31:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nomis.simon-shapiro.org (nomis.simon-shapiro.org [209.86.126.163]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id B032F158E9 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:31:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from shimon@simon-shapiro.org) Received: (qmail 39939 invoked by uid 1000); 8 Apr 1999 00:32:55 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 20:32:55 -0400 (EDT) X-Face: --Q&x/1^%>&*}<-P_Nc`3TWi's/BcC?8]O1b,;r$#7wzaSo-\/:3NE{Wm=?;i8{R'h.gsd8 %Hz|Y~=sSW"`VLLNW/{>Ap1%:OB*:KP|LD>" =)I@7r|wU}a To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: wait4 - Proof I am stupid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi Y'll, Please bear with me: int x; pid_t my_pgid; switch (fork()) { case 0: (void)setpgid(getpid(), getpid()); my_pgid = getpgrp(); for (x = 0; x < 10; x++) { switch (fork()) { case 0: /* Go do something useful */ break; case -1: /* Ooops! */ break; default: /* Ignore */ break; } } exit(0); break;; case -1: /* Ooops! */ break; default: /* ignore */ break; } /* * So far, this code should (and does) fork a process. * This process (child then changes its process group to something else * than the parent and then forks 10 children. * * Now the parent wants to wait for the grandchidren... */ x = 10; /* redundant, for demo purposes... */ while (x) { pid_t y; int z; switch (y = wait4((-1)* my_pgid, &z, NULL)) { case 0: /* Never happens */ break; case -1: /* ALWAYS HAPPENS */ break; default: /* Never happens */ break; } } Question: Why? Obviously I am doing something wrong, but what? I tried changing just about any argument to the wait4() function. Eliminating the child and having the grandparent fork and wait for the chilfren via ``wait(0);'' works. The chilfren are there and all seems correct; the children are in a new process group (different than grandpa's), once the son exits, they all have ppid of 1, etc. Any suggestion will be greatly appreciated. Note: The ``code'' above is illutration only... Sincerely Yours, Shimon@Simon-Shapiro.ORG 770.265.7340 Simon Shapiro Unwritten code has no bugs and executes at twice the speed of mouth To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 17:31:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E3B615954 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:31:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id JAA16924; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 09:59:51 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id JAA19644; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 09:59:49 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990408095949.G2142@lemis.com> Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 09:59:49 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? References: <19990407085435.M2142@lemis.com> <19990407080113.A4122@keltia.freenix.fr> <19990407155835.M2142@lemis.com> <19990408000955.D8314@keltia.freenix.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990408000955.D8314@keltia.freenix.fr>; from Ollivier Robert on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 12:09:55AM +0200 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 0:09:55 +0200, Ollivier Robert wrote: > According to Greg Lehey: >> Right, most System Vs I know with this method call it /stand. But >> that name is taken :-) On Tandem, the boot file system is (wait for >> it) bfs. It's the most stupid file system I've seen yet, but it makes >> it easier for the bootstrap to find the kernel. > > On SVR4 (at least some of the older 4.0 ones) used bfs as the filesystem > used for /stand. It is much simplier than UFS (contiguous allocation and > all that) and fits in the boot blocks. Right, that sounds the same as Tandem's bfs. But with space for two kernels, the "boot blocks" are slightly larger than on FreeBSD :-) >> Well, you *could* tell me which parts are cool and why. Then you'd >> have at least a hope of getting it. > > It is something that for some parts is akind to vinum (mirror, raid and > all) with resizing of partitions (both VxfS and HFS). The LVM module from > AIX is even better because you don't need to unmount the filesystem before > (HP does it with an extra package called OnlineJFS). I hope that we'll be able to expand ufs online with Vinum. It's a ufs issue, not a Vinum issue. > You have Physical Volumes, grouped into Volume Groups, each Volume > Group is divided into Logical Volumes and a LV can contain a > filesystem. A given filesystem is extendable within a LV and you can > enlarge a LV. > > Probably near what Veritas' stuff does. A lot of the differences are conceptual. What are volume groups? They correspond in position to plexes, but I believe they're different I think in IBM VGs (or whatever they're called there) contain the replicated data for part of a volume. A plex contains one copy of the data for the entire volume. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 17:33:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C68CB15911 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:33:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id KAA16942; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:01:11 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id KAA19655; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:01:11 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990408100111.H2142@lemis.com> Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:01:11 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: "Daniel C. Sobral" , Ollivier Robert Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? References: <19990407085435.M2142@lemis.com> <19990407080113.A4122@keltia.freenix.fr> <19990407155835.M2142@lemis.com> <19990408000955.D8314@keltia.freenix.fr> <370BEBC4.954E5A0E@newsguy.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <370BEBC4.954E5A0E@newsguy.com>; from Daniel C. Sobral on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 08:35:32AM +0900 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 8:35:32 +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > Ollivier Robert wrote: >> >> You have Physical Volumes, grouped into Volume Groups, each Volume Group >> is divided into Logical Volumes and a LV can contain a filesystem. A given >> filesystem is extendable within a LV and you can enlarge a LV. > > Mirroring can be set at VG level, either synchronous or > assynchronous. Vinum doesn't do asynchronous mirroring. I suppose it will have to when I introduce remote mirroring. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 17:38: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-01.cdsnet.net (mail-01.cdsnet.net [206.107.16.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 75062158E9 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:37:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mrcpu@internetcds.com) Received: (qmail 16891 invoked from network); 8 Apr 1999 00:36:00 -0000 Received: from schizo.cdsnet.net (204.118.244.32) by mail.cdsnet.net with SMTP; 8 Apr 1999 00:36:00 -0000 Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:35:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Jaye Mathisen X-Sender: mrcpu@schizo.cdsnet.net To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Anybody taken a whack at the new Intel Pro100's and their remote boot? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG It's a half-high PCI card, got a BIOS that you get into with ^S, and it has 2 modes, PXE boot, or RPL, plus some other stuff I don't understand... Anybody seen/played with one? if anybody wants to give it a shot, I'd drop one in the mail... To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 17:41:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD5B9158E9 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:41:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id RAA07199; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:38:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:38:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904080038.RAA07199@apollo.backplane.com> To: Simon Shapiro Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: wait4 - Proof I am stupid References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Hi Y'll, : :Please bear with me: :... : : switch (y = wait4((-1)* my_pgid, &z, NULL)) { :... : :Question: Why? Obviously I am doing something wrong, but what? wait4 takes four arguments, not three. man wait4. I also strongly suggest compiling with -Wall so you get appropriate errors when you forget to include the right header files. Also, your code flow for fork() is dangerous, even if it is only demonstration code :-). When you fork, the child should never fall through into the parents code... it should _exit(0) ( note the underscore ) before then. You also need to make sure that any FILE buffers are flushed before you fork to avoid a double-flush ( where both parent and child flush the same buffered data in FILEs ). fflush(stdout); /* prevent double flush from occuring in child */ fflush(stderr); /* prevent double flush from occuring in child */ if ((pid = fork()) == 0) { /* child does something */ _exit(0); } if (pid == (pid_t)-1) { /* fork error occured */ exit(1); } /* parent continues execution */ To wait for the child to exit with wait4(): if (wait4(pid, NULL, 0, NULL) < 0) { /* something unexpected happened */ } /* wait complete. child is gone */ If you are interested in using a more portable function, look at waitpid() rather then wait4(). if (waitpid(pid, NULL, 0) < 0) { /* something unexpected happened */ } /* wait complete. child is gone */ If you want the return code: int status; int return_code; if (waitpid(pid, &status, 0) < 0) { /* something unexpected happened */ } return_code = WEXITSTATUS(status); See 'man waitpid'. -Matt Matthew Dillon :Note: The ``code'' above is illutration only... : :Sincerely Yours, Shimon@Simon-Shapiro.ORG : 770.265.7340 :Simon Shapiro To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 17:49:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com (gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com [207.113.159.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E83EB15835 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:49:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gdonl@tsc.tdk.com) Received: from sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com (root@sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com [192.168.241.191]) by gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA05193; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:47:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gdonl@tsc.tdk.com) Received: from salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com (salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com [192.168.241.194]) by sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA18759; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:47:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from gdonl@localhost) by salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA17480; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:47:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Don Lewis Message-Id: <199904080047.RAA17480@salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com> Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:47:04 -0700 In-Reply-To: Simon Shapiro "wait4 - Proof I am stupid" (Apr 7, 8:32pm) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(3) 7/19/95) To: shimon@simon-shapiro.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: wait4 - Proof I am stupid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Apr 7, 8:32pm, Simon Shapiro wrote: } Subject: wait4 - Proof I am stupid } /* } * So far, this code should (and does) fork a process. } * This process (child then changes its process group to something else } * than the parent and then forks 10 children. } * } * Now the parent wants to wait for the grandchidren... } */ I don't believe that it is possible to wait for processes other than immediate children. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 17:51:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D60515919 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:51:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id KAA17043; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:19:38 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id KAA19724; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:19:37 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990408101937.K2142@lemis.com> Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:19:37 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Niall Smart , Greg Black Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Veto? (was: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g)) References: <19990407114127.Y2142@lemis.com> <19990407141928.C2142@lemis.com> <19990407125453.15859.qmail@alpha.comkey.com.au> <370B7039.4AEE986B@kira.team400.ie> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <370B7039.4AEE986B@kira.team400.ie>; from Niall Smart on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 03:48:25PM +0100 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wednesday, 7 April 1999 at 15:48:25 +0100, Niall Smart wrote: >>>> Does anybody want to execute a power of veto, or shall I commit some >>>> changes? >>> >>> If you turn it on, make it a DEAD SNAP to turn it off >>> (maybe even look as sysctl hw.usermem or something.) >> >> I think a sysctl would be wrong. Environment variable if you want. >> But I think config -s would be the way to go. Maybe I can print an >> explicit message: >> >> # config GENERIC >> Building kernel with full symbolic support. Do "config -s GENERIC" >> for historic partial symbolic support. >> >> Don't forget to do a ``make depend'' >> Kernel build directory is ../../compile/GENERIC, > > "Historical partial symbolic support"? There has > to be a better wording. Suggestions? Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 18:15:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from relay.nuxi.com (nuxi.ucdavis.edu [169.237.7.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF0B214C46 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:15:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: (from obrien@localhost) by relay.nuxi.com (8.9.2/8.9.1) id SAA07078; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:13:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien) Message-ID: <19990407181328.A7059@nuxi.com> Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:13:28 -0700 From: "David O'Brien" To: "Richard Seaman, Jr." , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Linuxthreads "port" status and a request Reply-To: obrien@NUXI.com References: <19990407102539.G467@tar.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990407102539.G467@tar.com>; from Richard Seaman, Jr. on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 10:25:39AM -0500 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE Organization: The NUXI BSD group X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Keyid: 34F9F9D5 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Solution to header problem > -------------------------- > 1) copying the existing pthread.h and pthread_np.h headers to a subdirectory > (I've proposed /usr/include/pthread/uthread -- in case the FreeBSD kernel > threads also produces a conflict, it could use /usr/include/pthread/kthread). Why not just rename pthread.h to linux_pthread.h and pthread_np.h to linux_pthread_np.h ? > 2) installing a new top level pthread.h that looks like: > > #if defined(LINUXTHREADS) || defined(LINUXTHREAD) > #include What if PREFIX was set to something other than "/usr/local" when the person compiled the port? -- -- David (obrien@NUXI.com -or- obrien@FreeBSD.org) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 18:19: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from moebius2.Space.Net (moebius2.Space.Net [195.30.1.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 2F1F214CE3 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:19:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from maex@Space.Net) Received: (qmail 2420 invoked by uid 1013); 8 Apr 1999 01:17:19 -0000 Message-ID: <19990408031719.M28680@space.net> Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 03:17:19 +0200 From: Markus Stumpf To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: squid and FreeBSD (was: Re: Nice FreeBSD mention) References: <19990407151931.A36308@ikhala.tcimet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990407151931.A36308@ikhala.tcimet.net>; from Natty Rebel on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 03:19:31PM -0400 Organization: SpaceNet GmbH, Muenchen, Germany Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 03:19:31PM -0400, Natty Rebel wrote: > > In a different section, they mention some tuning that they had to do to > > get FreeBSD to hop a long a bit faster... I don't have the exact URL > > handy, but it's in the software section... Perhaps the tips they suggest > > could be incorporated into a FAQ or note somewhere... > here's the url > http://polygraph.ircache.net/caveats.html The IMHO more speed limiting factor I experience is with swapping. I have asked this list some time ago, but none of the answers (thanks again anyway ;-) did help. I have a FreeBSD 2.2.5 box with 256 MB RAM. It's dedicated to squid (1.NOVM.22), no other services running. "top" says PID USERNAME PRI NICE SIZE RES STATE TIME WCPU CPU COMMAND 8542 root 2 -15 204M 177M select 60:27 0.00% 0.00% squid From that point I would imagine that 256 MB RAM is enough to fit in squid and - with about 50 megs left - some other processes. However, due to the precautionary swapping algorithm in FreeBSD squid gets swapped out and after running some time. squid then reports a ratio of page faults to http requests > 1 and the system is constantly swapping. This can also be monitored with "systat -vmstat". My current solution is to restart the squid every 2-3 weeks or so. This puts the above ratio down to 0.5 and from that it increases within this period to 1.0 again. I also thought of completely removing swap space on the machine. Do you guys think it would help? Or would it crash squid/the system? (I am rather careful with try and error in this case as not to interupt service for our customers, who rely on the cache a lot). Any comments/suggestions/solutions welcome! Other than that we are more than happy with FreeBSD: $ uptime 3:05AM up 251 days, 3:03, 3 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.03, 0.09 :-)))) \Maex -- SpaceNet GmbH | http://www.Space.Net/ | In a world without Research & Development | mailto:maex-sig@Space.Net | walls and fences, Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14 | Tel: +49 (89) 32356-0 | who needs D-80807 Muenchen | Fax: +49 (89) 32356-299 | Windows and Gates? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 18:29:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gizmo.internode.com.au (gizmo.internode.com.au [192.83.231.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3719114D54 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:29:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from newton@gizmo.internode.com.au) Received: (from newton@localhost) by gizmo.internode.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA20918; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:56:18 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from newton) From: Mark Newton Message-Id: <199904080126.KAA20918@gizmo.internode.com.au> Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:56:18 +0930 (CST) Cc: k.stevenson@louisville.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19990408095449.F2142@lemis.com> from "Greg Lehey" at Apr 8, 99 09:54:49 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey wrote: > > In the case of an extended vinum, would it even be necessary for the boot > > device to be mounted after the system is running? > > No. That's the whole point. The boot partition does not run under > Vinum, so it's not failure-tolerant. If we needed it, it would be a > weak point in the implementation. With Online Disksuite on Solaris systems you can mirror the root filesystem; You boot from one of the mirrors as if it's a normal ufs filesystem, and very soon after booting it does the ODS configuration stuff to bring mirrors online and remounts root. It means that you may have to boot manually (to pick an alternative mirror) if your "primary" boot device fails, but you still get the advantages of mirroring on your root filesystem. You can't stripe or concatenate it, though. I guess that counts as a different weak point in the implementation :-) - mark ---- Mark Newton Email: newton@internode.com.au Network Engineer Desk: +61-8-82232999 Internode Mobile: +61-416-202-223 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 18:40:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.university.microsoft.com (mail.university.microsoft.com [131.107.65.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5275014C3D for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:40:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DanielB@university.microsoft.com) Received: by mail.university.microsoft.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id <2L0JMF7L>; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:40:28 -0700 Message-ID: <117CB81A9C37D211887D00805F6563F126B786@mail.university.microsoft.com> From: Daniel Berlin To: 'Wes Peters' , Daniel Berlin Cc: 'Warner Losh ' , 'Doug Rabson ' , 'Nick Hibma ' , 'FreeBSD hackers mailing list ' , 'USB BSD list ' Subject: RE: disassembling i386 code Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:39:57 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > What sort of botched up laptop did you get? Compaq armada 7800. PII/366, 128Meg, 14gig, 14.1" S3 Virge/MX This was before i just upgraded the BIOS, now FreeBSD runs fine. The real problem is that i need AcceleratedX to get an X server that can use the Virge/MX properly, so that i don't lose 80% of the performance (this is an official statistic). It hurts my eyes to watch it. > quite nicely > on my shiny new Sony F160. PII/300, 64MB, 4.3GB, 14.1" NeoMagic. > I haven't gotten sound working yet, but I haven't tried. This little > box is COOL. I know where you are coming from. > > Now, I need to dump some of the Sony-supplied windows spooge > so I can free > up a Gig or so for BeOS. ;^) hehe. > > -- > "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" > > Wes Peters > Softweyr LLC > http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr > wes@softweyr.com > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 18:40:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nomis.simon-shapiro.org (nomis.simon-shapiro.org [209.86.126.163]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id B0EC214E2A for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:40:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from shimon@simon-shapiro.org) Received: (qmail 44451 invoked by uid 1000); 8 Apr 1999 01:42:29 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="_=XFMail.1.3.p0.FreeBSD:990407214229:834=_" In-Reply-To: <199904080038.RAA07199@apollo.backplane.com> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 21:42:29 -0400 (EDT) X-Face: --Q&x/1^%>&*}<-P_Nc`3TWi's/BcC?8]O1b,;r$#7wzaSo-\/:3NE{Wm=?;i8{R'h.gsd8 %Hz|Y~=sSW"`VLLNW/{>Ap1%:OB*:KP|LD>" =)I@7r|wU}a To: Matthew Dillon Subject: Re: wait4 - Proof I am stupid Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This message is in MIME format --_=XFMail.1.3.p0.FreeBSD:990407214229:834=_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii On 08-Apr-99 Matthew Dillon wrote: >:Hi Y'll, >: >:Please bear with me: >:... >: >: switch (y = wait4((-1)* my_pgid, &z, NULL)) { >:... >: >:Question: Why? Obviously I am doing something wrong, but what? > > wait4 takes four arguments, not three. man wait4. > > I also strongly suggest compiling with -Wall so you get > appropriate > errors when you forget to include the right header files. > > Also, your code flow for fork() is dangerous, even if it is only > demonstration code :-). When you fork, the child should never > fall > through into the parents code... it should _exit(0) > ( note the underscore ) before then. You also need to make sure > that > any FILE buffers are flushed before you fork to avoid a > double-flush > ( where both parent and child flush the same buffered data in > FILEs ). I know all that, Matt. Thanx! :-) Here is ``real'' code that compiles cleanly with -Wall. Still does the wrong thing (for me). The problem I am having, is that wait4() says there are no processes to wait for, while they are there. for sure. In the real program, the gandchildren run, do I/O, talk to grandpa over shared memory, get signals from grandpa, etc. Just grandpa cannot see them in wait4 :-( > > > fflush(stdout); /* prevent double flush from occuring in child */ > fflush(stderr); /* prevent double flush from occuring in child */ > if ((pid = fork()) == 0) { > /* child does something */ > _exit(0); > } > if (pid == (pid_t)-1) { > /* fork error occured */ > exit(1); > } > /* parent continues execution */ > > To wait for the child to exit with wait4(): > > if (wait4(pid, NULL, 0, NULL) < 0) { > /* something unexpected happened */ > } > /* wait complete. child is gone */ > > If you are interested in using a more portable function, look at > waitpid() rather then wait4(). > > if (waitpid(pid, NULL, 0) < 0) { > /* something unexpected happened */ > } > /* wait complete. child is gone */ > > If you want the return code: > > int status; > int return_code; > > if (waitpid(pid, &status, 0) < 0) { > /* something unexpected happened */ > } > return_code = WEXITSTATUS(status); > > See 'man waitpid'. > > -Matt > Matthew Dillon > > >:Note: The ``code'' above is illutration only... >: >:Sincerely Yours, Shimon@Simon-Shapiro.ORG >: 770.265.7340 >:Simon Shapiro > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message Sincerely Yours, Shimon@Simon-Shapiro.ORG 770.265.7340 Simon Shapiro Unwritten code has no bugs and executes at twice the speed of mouth --_=XFMail.1.3.p0.FreeBSD:990407214229:834=_ Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="msg.c" Content-Transfer-Encoding: none Content-Description: Compilable demonstration of Wai4 difficulty Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name=msg.c; SizeOnDisk=2329 #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include extern const char * const sys_errlist[]; extern const int sys_nerr; int main(int argc, char **argv) { int x =0, a = 0; pid_t my_pgid = getpgrp(); (void)fprintf(stderr, "grandpa grpid = %d\n", my_pgid); switch (fork()) { case 0: (void)setpgid(getpid(), getpid()); my_pgid = getpgrp(); (void)fprintf(stderr, "son: my_pgid = %d\n", my_pgid); for (x = 0; x < 10; x++) { switch (fork()) { case 0: /* Go do something useful */ (void)fprintf(stderr, "grandchild %d pid %d " "in pgrp %d\n", x, getpid(), getpgrp()); sleep(60); exit(0); break; case -1: (void)fprintf(stderr, "failed in line %d\n", __LINE__); exit(1); /* Ooops! */ break; default: /* Ignore */ break; } } (void)fprintf(stderr, "son exits\n"); exit(0); break;; case -1: /* Ooops! */ (void)fprintf(stderr, "forking the son failed (%s)\n", strerror(errno)); exit(1); break; default: /* ignore */ (void)fprintf(stderr, "grandpa continues to wait loop\n"); break; } x = 10; sleep(10); (void)fprintf(stderr, "before wait loop, x = %d\n", x); while (x) { pid_t y; int z; (void)fprintf(stderr, "in wait loop (%d), my_pgid = %d\n", ++a, my_pgid); switch (y = wait4((-1)* my_pgid, &z, 0, NULL)) { case 0: /* Never happens */ (void)fprintf(stderr, "wait returned 0\n"); if (a == 20) exit(2); break; case -1: /* ALWAYS HAPPENS */ (void)fprintf(stderr, "wait failed (%s)\n", strerror(errno)); if (a == 20) exit(2); break; default: /* Never happens */ (void)fprintf(stderr, "wait returned %d in pass %d\n", y, x); --x; break; } } return(0); } --_=XFMail.1.3.p0.FreeBSD:990407214229:834=_-- End of MIME message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 18:43:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from huset.math.ntnu.no (huset.math.ntnu.no [129.241.211.212]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 85F5B14E65 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:43:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from perhov@stud.math.ntnu.no) Received: (qmail 11065 invoked by uid 29119); 8 Apr 1999 01:41:11 -0000 Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 03:41:10 +0200 (MET DST) From: Per Kristian Hove X-Sender: perhov@huset.math.ntnu.no To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: data corruption using loopback fs Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'm experiencing severe data corruption when I use loopback mounting of filesystes. Am I doing anything really really wrong, or is there a problem with nullfs? I'm running 3.1-RELEASE. I have a filesystem /export, and my homedir is /home/a/perhov. When /home/a is a symlink to /export/home/a, everything works fine: perhov@phi:~$ pwd /home/a/perhov perhov@phi:~$ ls -l /home/a lrwxr-xr-x 1 root wheel 14 Apr 8 02:41 /home/a -> /export/home/a perhov@phi:~$ df . Filesystem 1K-blocks Used Avail Capacity Mounted on /dev/wd0s4f 6222892 4970752 754309 87% /export perhov@phi:~$ md5sum foo 5c137d93793d1c6b75344de07f4ccb76 foo perhov@phi:~$ cp foo bar perhov@phi:~$ md5sum foo bar 5c137d93793d1c6b75344de07f4ccb76 foo 5c137d93793d1c6b75344de07f4ccb76 bar But when /export/home/a is mounted on /home/a, it fails: phi:~# cd /home phi:/home# ls a@ b@ phi:/home# rm a phi:/home# mkdir a phi:/home# mount_null /export/home/a /home/a perhov@phi:~$ md5sum foo 5c137d93793d1c6b75344de07f4ccb76 foo perhov@phi:~$ cp foo bar cp: bar: Bad address perhov@phi:~$ md5sum foo bar 5c137d93793d1c6b75344de07f4ccb76 foo d41d8cd98f00b204e9800998ecf8427e bar and the file 'bar' is empty. syslog says: Apr 8 02:43:59 phi /kernel: vm_fault: pager read error, pid 327 (cp) It also happens when mounting /export itself and not a subdirectory: /export mounted onto /mnt2: phi:/mnt2# mount | grep mnt2 /export on /mnt2 (local) phi:/mnt2# df . Filesystem 1K-blocks Used Avail Capacity Mounted on /dev/wd0s4f 6222892 5074152 650909 89% /export phi:/mnt2# cp foo bar (this time no kernel messages appears, and 'bar' is the same size as 'foo') phi:/mnt2# md5sum foo bar 58e14256750b3eb43079de73dc14e616 foo eef586fa9bfd12b496912e78e4e2680f bar phi:/mnt2# md5sum foo bar 58e14256750b3eb43079de73dc14e616 foo eef586fa9bfd12b496912e78e4e2680f bar well, at least it's equally wrong for both invocations of md5sum. I copy the file again: phi:/mnt2# cp foo bar phi:/mnt2# md5sum foo bar 58e14256750b3eb43079de73dc14e616 foo ada96c644ec1992213c61a87c1e1d744 bar and now it's different. But when I try to copy the file in /export, not in /mnt2, it works fine: phi:/mnt2# cd /export phi:/export# cp foo bar phi:/export# md5sum foo bar 58e14256750b3eb43079de73dc14e616 foo 58e14256750b3eb43079de73dc14e616 bar Strange. Then, when I go back to /mnt2 and tries again, it also works fine there, presumably because it's in the cache. If this unexpected behaviour is a bug, is it fixed in 3.1-STABLE? If it's not a bug, what am I doing wrong? Most of the times i try, it only says cp: bar: Bad address and the destination file ends up empty. I didn't save the "wrong" bar-file, but from taking a quick glance at its contents, it seemed that the beginning of the file was damaged, but the end was okay. -- per kristian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 18:46:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF0E514C3D for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:46:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id LAA17331; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 11:14:39 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id LAA19850; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 11:14:38 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990408111438.T2142@lemis.com> Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 11:14:38 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Mark Newton Cc: k.stevenson@louisville.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? References: <19990408095449.F2142@lemis.com> <199904080126.KAA20918@gizmo.internode.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904080126.KAA20918@gizmo.internode.com.au>; from Mark Newton on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 10:56:18AM +0930 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 10:56:18 +0930, Mark Newton wrote: > Greg Lehey wrote: > >>> In the case of an extended vinum, would it even be necessary for the boot >>> device to be mounted after the system is running? >> >> No. That's the whole point. The boot partition does not run under >> Vinum, so it's not failure-tolerant. If we needed it, it would be a >> weak point in the implementation. > > With Online Disksuite on Solaris systems you can mirror the root > filesystem; You boot from one of the mirrors as if it's a normal ufs > filesystem, and very soon after booting it does the ODS > configuration stuff to bring mirrors online and remounts root. Right, that was one of the alternatives I was thinking of. I believe there's a problem (probably soluble) that you need to close all fds and start again, since the vnodes would have to change. It might be possible to do without this if Vinum can find its config at attach time. > It means that you may have to boot manually (to pick an alternative > mirror) if your "primary" boot device fails, but you still get the > advantages of mirroring on your root filesystem. Tandem does this automatically by having a number of alternative boot partitions which the autoboot cycles through when trying to boot. > You can't stripe or concatenate it, though. I guess that counts as > a different weak point in the implementation :-) Right, that's the problem I saw as well. Of course, you can stripe or concatenate additional plexes. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 18:48:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nomis.simon-shapiro.org (nomis.simon-shapiro.org [209.86.126.163]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id DA84614C98 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:48:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from shimon@simon-shapiro.org) Received: (qmail 44501 invoked by uid 1000); 8 Apr 1999 01:49:59 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199904080047.RAA17480@salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 21:49:59 -0400 (EDT) X-Face: --Q&x/1^%>&*}<-P_Nc`3TWi's/BcC?8]O1b,;r$#7wzaSo-\/:3NE{Wm=?;i8{R'h.gsd8 %Hz|Y~=sSW"`VLLNW/{>Ap1%:OB*:KP|LD>" =)I@7r|wU}a To: Don Lewis Subject: Re: wait4 - Proof I am stupid Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 08-Apr-99 Don Lewis wrote: > On Apr 7, 8:32pm, Simon Shapiro wrote: > } Subject: wait4 - Proof I am stupid > > } /* > } * So far, this code should (and does) fork a process. > } * This process (child then changes its process group to something > else > } * than the parent and then forks 10 children. > } * > } * Now the parent wants to wait for the grandchidren... > } */ > > I don't believe that it is possible to wait for processes other than > immediate children. Then the man pages lie. They (both Linux and FreeBSD) say: ... The wpid parameter specifies the set of child processes for which to wait. If wpid is -1, the call waits for any child process. If wpid is 0, the call waits for any child process in the process group of the caller. If wpid is greater than zero, the call waits for the process with process id wpid. If wpid is less than -1, the call waits for any process whose process group id equals the absolute value of wpid. Nowhere does it say what you say. This is not to say you are wrong! In case you are right, how would you go about accomplishing what I want: I have a set of worker processes, which need to get certain signals. They are being managed by a monitor process which may need to get the same signals but react quite differently. Also, the monitor must wait for all the workers to exit, before doing some other work. I could make the shared memory channel more complex and signal completion that way, but this is uncertain and ugly (if a grandson dies without first telling grandpa ``I'm gone'' how is grandpa to know? Simon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 19: 1:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from phobos.illtel.denver.co.us (dsl-206.169.4.82.wenet.com [206.169.4.82]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B180A14E2A for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 19:01:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from abelits@phobos.illtel.denver.co.us) Received: from localhost (abelits@localhost) by phobos.illtel.denver.co.us (8.9.1a/8.6.9) with SMTP id SAA16840; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:59:49 -0700 Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:59:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex Belits To: Simon Shapiro Cc: Don Lewis , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: wait4 - Proof I am stupid In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 7 Apr 1999, Simon Shapiro wrote: > In case you are right, how would you go about accomplishing what I want: > > I have a set of worker processes, which need to get certain signals. > They are being managed by a monitor process which may need to get the > same signals but react quite differently. Also, the monitor must wait > for all the workers to exit, before doing some other work. > > I could make the shared memory channel more complex and signal > completion that way, but this is uncertain and ugly (if a grandson dies > without first telling grandpa ``I'm gone'' how is grandpa to know? Use pipes and poll()/select() on them. -- Alex ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Excellent.. now give users the option to cut your hair you hippie! -- Anonymous Coward To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 19: 7:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rigel.vigrid.com (pm3-pt28.pcnet.net [206.105.29.102]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DEF2150AB for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 19:07:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eischen@vigrid.com) Received: from vigrid.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rigel.vigrid.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA00565; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:59:08 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from eischen@vigrid.com) Message-ID: <370BD52C.C07E5170@vigrid.com> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 17:59:08 -0400 From: "Daniel M. Eischen" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: davidc@colnta.acns.ab.ca Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Closing file descriptors with cc -pthread Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I have been porting a threaded server from Solaris to > FreeBSD, and I noticed that on FreeBSD the server uses > 100% of the processor even when it is "idle". top shows > it climb to the top of the list and eventually take > up 99.8% on a fairly idle system. > > truss shows that the process is calling select() and > gettimeofday() over and over... > > I tracked the problem to an init_daemon() call > (much like daemon(), only a little more complete), and > within that I found it was a loop that closed all open > descriptors and dup2()'d 0,1,2 -> /dev/null that was causing > the problem. > > In a seperate test I was able to duplicate the problem, but > I am not sure what I am seeing or why. Is this a bug, or > am I missing something? Also, why are descriptors 3 and 4 > open when the program starts? > > If this code is compiled with > cc -o testfd testfd.c > it will run as expected. If it is compiled with > cc -pthread -o testfd testfd.c > then it seems to loop out of control. > > If I do not close 3 and 4 the code will run normally both > with -pthread and without. Again, what are they for? > > Not closing all open descriptors, and dup2()'ing 0,1, and 2 like > daemon() does solves my problem, but I do not understand why. > > Any information would be appreciated. File descriptors 3 and 4 are probably for the pipe that the uthread kernel uses when the scheduling signal occurs. The scheduling signal handler writes to the pipe to wake the uthread kernel up when it's blocked in select. Since you closed the file descriptors, the uthread kernel is probably looping continuously with select returning -1. Don't close file descriptors 3 and 4 :-) Dan Eischen eischen@vigrid.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 19:27:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from frmug.org (frmug-gw.frmug.org [193.56.58.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B67014DF8 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 19:27:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by frmug.org (8.9.1/frmug-2.3/nospam) with UUCP id EAA04091 for hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 04:25:06 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: by keltia.freenix.fr (Postfix, from userid 101) id 704148855; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 00:15:49 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 00:15:49 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? Message-ID: <19990408001549.A8505@keltia.freenix.fr> Mail-Followup-To: FreeBSD Hackers References: <19990407085435.M2142@lemis.com> <19990407080113.A4122@keltia.freenix.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <19990407080113.A4122@keltia.freenix.fr>; from Ollivier Robert on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 08:01:13AM +0200 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT/ELF ctm#5173 AMD-K6 MMX @ 200 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG According to Ollivier Robert: > Speaking of HP, their LVM system is cool. Now, that would be a nice > addition to vinum (please don't look at me, I'm not a FS expert). Speaking of HP again, another well-done things in HP-UX is their packaging system (swinstall, swpackage and all that). It works well for the system, packages and patches and makes building of packages very easy... I don't know the status of our future packaging system but HP's system is very nice, especially compared to SVR4 horrible one. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 4.0-CURRENT #70: Sat Feb 27 09:43:08 CET 1999 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 19:35:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from paprika.michvhf.com (paprika.michvhf.com [209.57.60.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id F389E15007 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 19:35:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from vev@michvhf.com) Received: (qmail 29452 invoked by uid 1001); 8 Apr 1999 02:33:48 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <19990408001549.A8505@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 22:33:48 -0400 (EDT) X-Face: *0^4Iw) To: Ollivier Robert Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 07-Apr-99 Ollivier Robert wrote: > According to Ollivier Robert: >> Speaking of HP, their LVM system is cool. Now, that would be a nice >> addition to vinum (please don't look at me, I'm not a FS expert). > > Speaking of HP again, another well-done things in HP-UX is their packaging > system (swinstall, swpackage and all that). It works well for the system, > packages and patches and makes building of packages very easy... Hate to disagree, but HP has the most unfriendly and wastful method with swinstall, etc. It may be more thorough in it's testing and reporting, but I'll take a FreeBSD system with ports and/or packages over it any day. Unless, of course, I'm looking for some time to get other stuff done. Vince. -- ========================================================================== Vince Vielhaber -- KA8CSH email: vev@michvhf.com flame-mail: /dev/null # include TEAM-OS2 Online Campground Directory http://www.camping-usa.com Online Giftshop Superstore http://www.cloudninegifts.com ========================================================================== To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 20: 2: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27AC0151F1; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:01:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id MAA17698; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:29:51 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id MAA20280; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:29:44 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990408122944.D2142@lemis.com> Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:29:44 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Nick Hibma , Greg Black Cc: Peter Wemm , Archie Cobbs , Christopher Michaels , questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) References: <19990407124941.15721.qmail@alpha.comkey.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: ; from Nick Hibma on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 03:35:15PM +0200 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wednesday, 7 April 1999 at 15:35:15 +0200, Nick Hibma wrote: > On Wed, 7 Apr 1999, Greg Black wrote: > >>>> And on the subject of debugging kernels getting built, I'd tend to >>>> agree. Don't install them though, install the stripped version. >>> >>> I had planned to leave that to the user: 'make install' will install a >>> stripped kernel, 'make install.debug' will install the full symbol >>> kernel. I still think this is a reasonable compromise. >> >> Agreed. > > Will that include a stripping of the previous kernel? > > if -x /kernel > strip -g /kernel > mv /kernel > > This is required or otherwise make the root partition bigger by > default. 2x10Mb for the kernel does not leave a lot of room for > etc. Patch for this is available if wanted. Just bounce me a > message. Well, that's not quite the way I'm doing it. By default, I make a kernel called kernel.debug and use the following rule to create a stripped kernel: ${KERNEL}: ${KERNEL}.debug objcopy --strip-debug ${KERNEL}.debug ${KERNEL} The 'install' target installs the stripped kernel, and depends on this rule. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 20: 9:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0D5415177 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:09:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA71392; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 23:05:05 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 23:05:04 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Greg Lehey Cc: Nick Hibma , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) In-Reply-To: <19990408122944.D2142@lemis.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Greg Lehey wrote: [cc list trimmed back on one list, and some names] > > Will that include a stripping of the previous kernel? > > > > if -x /kernel > > strip -g /kernel > > mv /kernel > > > > This is required or otherwise make the root partition bigger by > > default. 2x10Mb for the kernel does not leave a lot of room for > > etc. Patch for this is available if wanted. Just bounce me a > > message. > > Well, that's not quite the way I'm doing it. By default, I make a > kernel called kernel.debug and use the following rule to create a > stripped kernel: > > ${KERNEL}: ${KERNEL}.debug > objcopy --strip-debug ${KERNEL}.debug ${KERNEL} > > The 'install' target installs the stripped kernel, and depends on this > rule. Seeing as most folks don't have an extra 10 megs of room in / to play around with, they'd be real unhappy to have the full kernel stuck in /, even if it was immediately stripped. That's not going to occur here, right? > > Greg > -- > See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers > finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 20: 9:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from noao.edu (noao.edu [140.252.1.54]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 131EF15161 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:09:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grandi@noao.edu) Received: from mirfak.tuc.noao.edu (IDENT:grandi@mirfak.tuc.noao.edu [140.252.1.9]) by noao.edu (8.9.2/8.8.8/SAG-14Jan99) with ESMTP id UAA51723; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:07:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from grandi@noao.edu) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:07:35 -0700 (MST) From: Steve Grandi X-Sender: grandi@mirfak.tuc.noao.edu To: Markus Stumpf Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: squid and FreeBSD (was: Re: Nice FreeBSD mention) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Have you tried the undocumented config file option: options "NO_SWAPPING" which turns off swapping completely (paging still works). John Dyson suggested this to me when I was having trouble with a system that would crash during an INN expire almost every night (it turns out that I had messed up /etc/login.conf and had really low limits on the news user that caused expire to thrash horribly). Nevertheless I kept this option in the 2.2.x kernel for over a year until upgrading to 3.1. Steve Grandi, National Optical Astronomy Observatories/AURA Inc., Tucson AZ USA Internet: grandi@noao.edu Voice: +1 520 318-8228 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 20:13:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ayukawa.aus.org (ayukawa.aus.org [199.166.246.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6790A1513A for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:13:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from lh@aus.org) Received: from zer0.net (lh@PHOENIX.ZER0.NET [199.166.246.189]) by ayukawa.aus.org (8.8.7/8.7.3) with ESMTP id XAA17176 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 23:11:26 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904080311.XAA17176@ayukawa.aus.org> X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 23:11:26 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: lh@aus.org From: Luke To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Proposal/Question Newsyslog Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'm running 4.0-990212, keeping alot of logfiles with newsyslog. I looked in the manpage and couldn't see anything related to what I wanted. What I was wondering is can newsyslog put the old logfiles in another directory? we are keeping sometimes @30 old logfiles , and it makes looking through the log dir a pain. If there isn't a compelling reason to not have this as an option or buildtime variable, I would be willing to try and add it and submit patches. Thanks --- E-Mail: Luke Sent by XFMail ---------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 20:17:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F42415177 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:17:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id UAA66750; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:14:18 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:14:15 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer Reply-To: Julian Elischer To: Simon Shapiro Cc: Matthew Dillon , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: wait4 - Proof I am stupid In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 7 Apr 1999, Simon Shapiro wrote: [stuff] Since you don't store the pid of the son, how do you know what pgrp to wait on? The son changes it's pgrp, but you wait on it's original pgrp. julian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 20:23:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4C721513A for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:23:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id MAA17820; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:51:25 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id MAA20404; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:51:24 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990408125124.I2142@lemis.com> Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:51:24 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Chuck Robey Cc: Nick Hibma , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) References: <19990408122944.D2142@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: ; from Chuck Robey on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 11:05:04PM -0400 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wednesday, 7 April 1999 at 23:05:04 -0400, Chuck Robey wrote: > On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Greg Lehey wrote: > > [cc list trimmed back on one list, and some names] > >>> Will that include a stripping of the previous kernel? >>> >>> if -x /kernel >>> strip -g /kernel >>> mv /kernel >>> >>> This is required or otherwise make the root partition bigger by >>> default. 2x10Mb for the kernel does not leave a lot of room for >>> etc. Patch for this is available if wanted. Just bounce me a >>> message. >> >> Well, that's not quite the way I'm doing it. By default, I make a >> kernel called kernel.debug and use the following rule to create a >> stripped kernel: >> >> ${KERNEL}: ${KERNEL}.debug >> objcopy --strip-debug ${KERNEL}.debug ${KERNEL} >> >> The 'install' target installs the stripped kernel, and depends on this >> rule. > > Seeing as most folks don't have an extra 10 megs of room in / to play > around with, they'd be real unhappy to have the full kernel stuck in /, > even if it was immediately stripped. That's not going to occur here, > right? No, that's what I'm saying. The only place you use more space is in the kernel build directory. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 20:29:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C61D1528A for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:29:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id MAA24857; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:27:23 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <370C1A72.D5FD0B25@newsguy.com> Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 11:54:42 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ollivier Robert Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? References: <19990407085435.M2142@lemis.com> <19990407080113.A4122@keltia.freenix.fr> <19990408001549.A8505@keltia.freenix.fr> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ollivier Robert wrote: > > Speaking of HP again, another well-done things in HP-UX is their packaging > system (swinstall, swpackage and all that). It works well for the system, > packages and patches and makes building of packages very easy... > > I don't know the status of our future packaging system but HP's system is > very nice, especially compared to SVR4 horrible one. Again, I prefer AIX's one, though, in this case, I didn't have much experience with HP packaging system. (And, just in case you are wondering, yes, there are HP-UX features I prefer to the equivalent ones in AIX... :) -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "nothing better than the ability to perform cunning linguistics" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 20:30:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7547915238 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:30:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id MAA24871; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:27:29 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <370C1D6E.C447CB11@newsguy.com> Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 12:07:26 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Greg Lehey Cc: Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? References: <19990407085435.M2142@lemis.com> <19990407080113.A4122@keltia.freenix.fr> <19990407155835.M2142@lemis.com> <19990408000955.D8314@keltia.freenix.fr> <19990408095949.G2142@lemis.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey wrote: > > A lot of the differences are conceptual. What are volume groups? > They correspond in position to plexes, but I believe they're different > I think in IBM VGs (or whatever they're called there) contain the > replicated data for part of a volume. A plex contains one copy of the > data for the entire volume. A volume group is a collection of physical volumes. You can have it replicating a single physical volume two or three times (ie, two or three hd with replicated data). It cannot replicate data that spans more than one physical volume (ie, you can't have four physical volumes replicated 2-2). This replication feature is a minor feature, though. The main use of volume groups is in a collection of non-replicated physical volumes, over which you'll be allocating logical volumes. You can add and subtract physical volumes to/from a volume group. A volume group contains information about the logical volumes it's logical volumes and their mappings over the volume group (you can remap a logical volume -- moving it out of a disk you want to replace, for instance). It also has the "boot sectors". This information is replicated in each physical volume. It also has a, err, feature where you can specify a volume group automatically shuts down once the number of active physical volumes (and inactive one being one that crashed) gets below 50%. I wish my AIX books were not on the other side of the world... :-( -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "nothing better than the ability to perform cunning linguistics" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 20:51:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail0.atl.bellsouth.net (mail0.atl.bellsouth.net [205.152.0.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CF1215262 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:51:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wghicks@bellsouth.net) Received: from wghicks.bellsouth.net (host-209-214-67-190.atl.bellsouth.net [209.214.67.190]) by mail0.atl.bellsouth.net (8.8.8-spamdog/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA22098; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 23:48:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from wghicks (wghicks@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by wghicks.bellsouth.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id XAA09945; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 23:49:02 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net) Message-Id: <199904080349.XAA09945@bellsouth.net> To: Darryl Okahata Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: Preliminary UDI spec available In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Apr 1999 15:35:54 PDT." <199904072235.PAA03480@mina.sr.hp.com> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 23:49:02 -0400 From: W Gerald Hicks Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I just saw that a preliminary UDI spec (0.90) is available for > public review (UDI is the "Uniform Driver Interface", which should allow > for portable drivers across hardware *and* operating systems -- at the > source and not binary level). I don't know if anyone here is following > it, but here it is: > > http://www.sco.com/UDI/specs.html I cornered the SCO folks together with Dialogic during their joint customer conference in Ft. Lauderdale last October about UDI. I came away feeling that UDI might be just a nice dream (from some marketing person). -- Jerry Hicks wghicks@bellsouth.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 21: 4:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rice.edu (cs.rice.edu [128.42.1.30]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8717814D66 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 21:03:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from aron@cs.rice.edu) Received: (from aron@localhost) by cs.rice.edu (8.9.0/8.9.0) id XAA07250 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 23:01:05 -0500 (CDT) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 23:01:05 -0500 (CDT) From: Mohit Aron Message-Id: <199904080401.XAA07250@cs.rice.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: scheduling queues in FreeBSD Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, I'm using FreeBSD-2.2.6. It seems that the scheduler maintains more than 1 queue for process scheduling - whichqs, whichrtqs, ... Can someone please tell me the significance of all these queues. Also which processes go in which queues. Thanks, - Mohit To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 21:23: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4707B151F6 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 21:23:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id VAA67929; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 21:14:24 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 21:14:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: W Gerald Hicks Cc: Darryl Okahata , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: Preliminary UDI spec available In-Reply-To: <199904080349.XAA09945@bellsouth.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 7 Apr 1999, W Gerald Hicks wrote: > > > I just saw that a preliminary UDI spec (0.90) is available for > > public review (UDI is the "Uniform Driver Interface", which should allow > > for portable drivers across hardware *and* operating systems -- at the > > source and not binary level). I don't know if anyone here is following > > it, but here it is: > > > > http://www.sco.com/UDI/specs.html > > I cornered the SCO folks together with Dialogic during their joint customer > conference in Ft. Lauderdale last October about UDI. > > I came away feeling that UDI might be just a nice dream (from some marketing > person). I printed out the main spec.. (thank god for psnup) It looks like a lot of work. I haven't got my mind around it all yet but it seems to remind me of NT a lot. julian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 21:27:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4AD5151F6; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 21:27:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id VAA68002; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 21:16:50 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 21:16:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Greg Lehey Cc: Nick Hibma , Greg Black , Peter Wemm , Archie Cobbs , Christopher Michaels , questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) In-Reply-To: <19990408122944.D2142@lemis.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Greg Lehey wrote: > On Wednesday, 7 April 1999 at 15:35:15 +0200, Nick Hibma wrote: > > On Wed, 7 Apr 1999, Greg Black wrote: > > > >>>> And on the subject of debugging kernels getting built, I'd tend to > >>>> agree. Don't install them though, install the stripped version. > >>> > >>> I had planned to leave that to the user: 'make install' will install a > >>> stripped kernel, 'make install.debug' will install the full symbol > >>> kernel. I still think this is a reasonable compromise. > >> > >> Agreed. > > > > Will that include a stripping of the previous kernel? > > > > if -x /kernel > > strip -g /kernel > > mv /kernel > > > > This is required or otherwise make the root partition bigger by > > default. 2x10Mb for the kernel does not leave a lot of room for > > etc. Patch for this is available if wanted. Just bounce me a > > message. > > Well, that's not quite the way I'm doing it. By default, I make a > kernel called kernel.debug and use the following rule to create a > stripped kernel: > > ${KERNEL}: ${KERNEL}.debug > objcopy --strip-debug ${KERNEL}.debug ${KERNEL} So I presume you've made an aout kernel? (we still use aout kernels on 3.1 but I haven't tried in 4.0 for a while now) > > The 'install' target installs the stripped kernel, and depends on this > rule. > > Greg > -- > See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers > finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 21:49:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alcanet.com.au (news.alcanet.com.au [203.62.196.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6AF21152B3 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 21:49:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au) Received: by border.alcanet.com.au id <40323>; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 14:34:20 +1000 Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 14:47:21 +1000 From: Peter Jeremy Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Message-Id: <99Apr8.143420est.40323@border.alcanet.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Mark Newton wrote: >With Online Disksuite on Solaris systems you can mirror the root ... >You can't stripe or concatenate it, though. I guess that counts as >a different weak point in the implementation :-) I'm not sure that this is a real problem. root is usually fairly small (although Solaris seems to be moving towards a combined root and /usr). The major reason (IMHO) for wanting to use volume management S/W on root is for protecting it against disk failure. There's not a great deal to be gained by striping it. Concatenating it could be useful (if you've under-dimensioned it), but it's not a major loss. Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 22:31: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alcanet.com.au (news.alcanet.com.au [203.62.196.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B871715257 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 22:30:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au) Received: by border.alcanet.com.au id <40342>; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 15:15:34 +1000 Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 15:28:40 +1000 From: Peter Jeremy Subject: Re: Volume managers To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Message-Id: <99Apr8.151534est.40342@border.alcanet.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Whilst we're all making up wishlists for things we'd like to see (someone else implement): The `clone filesystem' command supported by Digital UNIX ADVfs is _very_ nice for `point-in-time' backups. (Basically clonefset makes a read-only snapshot of the filesystem - changes to the `active' filesystem are done using copy-on-write). Unfortunately, I suspect it couldn't be implemented within UFS (because UFS relies on blocks being at particular physical locations within a CG - ie superblock, array of inode blocks, data blocks - which would make creating the copy-on-write blocks difficult). Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 23:22:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ren.detir.qld.gov.au (ns.detir.qld.gov.au [203.46.81.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A835215888 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 23:22:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from syssgm@detir.qld.gov.au) Received: by ren.detir.qld.gov.au; id QAA06906; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:24:35 +1000 (EST) Received: from ogre.detir.qld.gov.au(167.123.8.3) by ren.detir.qld.gov.au via smap (4.1) id xma006895; Thu, 8 Apr 99 16:24:28 +1000 Received: from atlas.detir.qld.gov.au (atlas.detir.qld.gov.au [167.123.8.9]) by ogre.detir.qld.gov.au (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA24840; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:19:56 +1000 (EST) Received: from nymph.detir.qld.gov.au (nymph.detir.qld.gov.au [167.123.10.10]) by atlas.detir.qld.gov.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA09630; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:19:55 +1000 (EST) Received: from nymph.detir.qld.gov.au (localhost.detir.qld.gov.au [127.0.0.1]) by nymph.detir.qld.gov.au (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA19070; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:19:53 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from syssgm@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au) Message-Id: <199904080619.QAA19070@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au> To: Greg Lehey Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, syssgm@detir.qld.gov.au Subject: Re: Veto? (was: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g)) References: <19990408101937.K2142@lemis.com> In-Reply-To: <19990408101937.K2142@lemis.com> from Greg Lehey at "Thu, 08 Apr 1999 10:19:37 +0930" Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 16:19:53 +1000 From: Stephen McKay Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday, 8th April 1999, Greg Lehey wrote: >On Wednesday, 7 April 1999 at 15:48:25 +0100, Niall Smart wrote: >>> # config GENERIC >>> Building kernel with full symbolic support. Do "config -s GENERIC" >>> for historic partial symbolic support. >>> >>> Don't forget to do a ``make depend'' >>> Kernel build directory is ../../compile/GENERIC, >> >> "Historical partial symbolic support"? There has >> to be a better wording. > >Suggestions? `Use "config -s FOO" to build a much smaller kernel without debugging support.' And since I'm on the topic, if this change is to be made, then /kernel is the right place for the debugging kernel, even though it gets 4x bigger. This has an impact on the default sizing for root. Since this is all to help newbies, I hope the rest of the system (esp sysinstall) cooperates. Stephen. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 7 23:51:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5D4015873 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 23:51:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id XAA08733; Wed, 7 Apr 1999 23:49:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 23:49:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904080649.XAA08733@apollo.backplane.com> To: Mohit Aron Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: scheduling queues in FreeBSD References: <199904080401.XAA07250@cs.rice.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Hi, : I'm using FreeBSD-2.2.6. It seems that the scheduler maintains :more than 1 queue for process scheduling - whichqs, whichrtqs, ... Can someone :please tell me the significance of all these queues. Also which processes :go in which queues. Thanks, : : :- Mohit The scheduler has a notion of an 'idle', 'normal', and 'realtime' process queue. Unless you do something explicitly, all processes on the system are going to be on the 'normal' queue. i.e. 'whichqs'. The 'idle' and 'realtime' queues were hacked in I don't know when, but they don't work very well... there are a number of situations that can cause machine lockups. Frankly, I'd like to see both ripped out completely and a better solution put in later on. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 0: 5:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from thneed.ubergeeks.com (thneed.ubergeeks.com [206.205.41.245]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 731D21583C for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 00:05:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adrian@ubergeeks.com) Received: from localhost (adrian@localhost) by thneed.ubergeeks.com (8.9.2/8.9.1) with ESMTP id DAA00760; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 03:07:19 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from adrian@ubergeeks.com) X-Authentication-Warning: thneed.ubergeeks.com: adrian owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 03:07:19 -0400 (EDT) From: Adrian Filipi-Martin Reply-To: Adrian Filipi-Martin To: Greg Lehey Cc: Mark Newton , k.stevenson@louisville.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? In-Reply-To: <19990408111438.T2142@lemis.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Greg Lehey wrote: > On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 10:56:18 +0930, Mark Newton wrote: > > Greg Lehey wrote: > > > >>> In the case of an extended vinum, would it even be necessary for the boot > >>> device to be mounted after the system is running? > >> > >> No. That's the whole point. The boot partition does not run under > >> Vinum, so it's not failure-tolerant. If we needed it, it would be a > >> weak point in the implementation. > > > > With Online Disksuite on Solaris systems you can mirror the root > > filesystem; You boot from one of the mirrors as if it's a normal ufs > > filesystem, and very soon after booting it does the ODS > > configuration stuff to bring mirrors online and remounts root. > > Right, that was one of the alternatives I was thinking of. I believe > there's a problem (probably soluble) that you need to close all fds > and start again, since the vnodes would have to change. It might be > possible to do without this if Vinum can find its config at attach > time. > > > It means that you may have to boot manually (to pick an alternative > > mirror) if your "primary" boot device fails, but you still get the > > advantages of mirroring on your root filesystem. I actually have a couple of systems set up with manually mirrored roots. There is a gotcha that you need to wire down your SCSI devices or you find yourself in single-user mode editing your fstab with ex. Being able really boot from a vinum device would solve this, since the device name doesn't change just because a plex, drive, whatever, disappeared. My biggest grip about not being able to boot from a vinum partition is that you cannot also install directly onto a vinum partition. I found myself spreading the OS onto small partitoins on each disk, then turning them into swap or root mirrors once I have vinum partitions built. Why not just smarten up the loader to do the dirty work. It's much smaller and more likely to fit in to a bootstrap portion of the disk. As to the comparisons with HP's LVM, vinum wins hands down. Simply putting everything in an interactive tool makes, having simple text configuration files and clear terminology is enough to mke me never go back to LVM. This make is much more flexible in my book. Adrian -- [ adrian@ubergeeks.com -- Ubergeeks Consulting -- http://www.ubergeeks.com/ ] To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 0:10:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from thneed.ubergeeks.com (thneed.ubergeeks.com [206.205.41.245]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDF1E1583C for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 00:10:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adrian@ubergeeks.com) Received: from localhost (adrian@localhost) by thneed.ubergeeks.com (8.9.2/8.9.1) with ESMTP id DAA00768; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 03:12:08 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from adrian@ubergeeks.com) X-Authentication-Warning: thneed.ubergeeks.com: adrian owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 03:12:08 -0400 (EDT) From: Adrian Filipi-Martin Reply-To: Adrian Filipi-Martin To: Vince Vielhaber Cc: Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 7 Apr 1999, Vince Vielhaber wrote: > > On 07-Apr-99 Ollivier Robert wrote: > > According to Ollivier Robert: > >> Speaking of HP, their LVM system is cool. Now, that would be a nice > >> addition to vinum (please don't look at me, I'm not a FS expert). > > > > Speaking of HP again, another well-done things in HP-UX is their packaging > > system (swinstall, swpackage and all that). It works well for the system, > > packages and patches and makes building of packages very easy... > > Hate to disagree, but HP has the most unfriendly and wastful method > with swinstall, etc. It may be more thorough in it's testing and > reporting, but I'll take a FreeBSD system with ports and/or packages > over it any day. Unless, of course, I'm looking for some time to get > other stuff done. Same here. The rigamarole of creating a software depot so I could put my CD's in a drawer and forget about them is a teedious and drawn out process. It's slower than a sloth and it can chew up tons of disk when applying patches. I've had to break up patch depots because some machines would fill up half way through the patch process. It does ok when you clean the old files out after each chunk of patches. If I need precompiled custom packages, I just say "make package" after hacking the port. Life is much better this way. Adrian -- [ adrian@ubergeeks.com -- Ubergeeks Consulting -- http://www.ubergeeks.com/ ] To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 0:14:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tuminfo2.informatik.tu-muenchen.de (tuminfo2.informatik.tu-muenchen.de [131.159.0.81]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2674015891 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 00:14:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hafner@informatik.tu-muenchen.de) Received: from hprbg5.informatik.tu-muenchen.de ([131.159.0.200] EHLO hprbg5.informatik.tu-muenchen.de ident: root [port 2486]) by tuminfo2.informatik.tu-muenchen.de with ESMTP id <110976-226>; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 09:12:37 +0000 Received: from hafner@localhost by hprbg5.informatik.tu-muenchen.de id <24223-660>; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 09:12:11 +0200 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: IP Type of service (FTP proxy in German c`t) References: <199904071529.PAA24816@excalibur.oceanis.net> From: Walter Hafner Date: 08 Apr 1999 09:12:10 +0200 In-Reply-To: Emmanuel DELOGET's message of "Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:29:05 +0200 (MET DST)" Message-ID: Lines: 27 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/XEmacs 20.3 - "Vatican City" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ok, it was a joke. Stop laughing. *sigh* I mean, they mentioned RFC1414, written in April 1995 and I didn't realize it. I just had a look on that RFC - submitted in February 93 and nothing about QoS (in fact it's a proposal for a SNMP MIB) ... Still, I'd like to know how they did it. This prooves again, that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing. I should stick to my main competence. Anyone in need of an image analysis tutorial? :-) I could have sworn, that the Aprils joke for this year was the article about using Tesa (3Com) tapes as mass storage ... -Walter, still blushing -- Walter Hafner__________________________________ hafner@in.tum.de *CLICK* "Multiple exclamation marks," he went on, shaking his head, "are a sure sign of a diseased mind." (Terry Pratchett, "Eric") To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 0:21: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 943FE15891 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 00:20:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id AAA09117; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 00:18:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 00:18:50 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904080718.AAA09117@apollo.backplane.com> To: Markus Stumpf Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: squid and FreeBSD (was: Re: Nice FreeBSD mention) References: <19990407151931.A36308@ikhala.tcimet.net> <19990408031719.M28680@space.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :"top" says : : PID USERNAME PRI NICE SIZE RES STATE TIME WCPU CPU COMMAND : 8542 root 2 -15 204M 177M select 60:27 0.00% 0.00% squid : :>From that point I would imagine that 256 MB RAM is enough to fit in :squid and - with about 50 megs left - some other processes. I'm not familiar with squid. Why is it eating 204M of VM? If that is programmable, simply reduce it to 150M. FreeBSD can't give over all of its physical memory to a process. It needs memory for kernel buffers and file caching. It *especially* needs memory for kernel buffers in a network-heavy setup. Turning off swap in this case will cause the machine to lockup when it runs out of memory -- probably not what you want. -Matt : \Maex : :-- :SpaceNet GmbH | http://www.Space.Net/ | In a world without To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 0:32:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ewok.creative.net.au (ewok.creative.net.au [203.30.44.41]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id C21DA15910 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 00:32:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adrian@freebsd.org) Received: (qmail 5270 invoked by uid 1008); 8 Apr 1999 07:13:30 -0000 Message-ID: <19990408071330.5268.qmail@ewok.creative.net.au> From: adrian@freebsd.org To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: Markus Stumpf Subject: Re: squid and FreeBSD (was: Re: Nice FreeBSD mention) In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 08 Apr 1999 00:18:50 MST." <199904080718.AAA09117@apollo.backplane.com> Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 15:13:29 +0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matthew Dillon writes: > >:"top" says >: >: PID USERNAME PRI NICE SIZE RES STATE TIME WCPU CPU COMMAND >: 8542 root 2 -15 204M 177M select 60:27 0.00% 0.00% squid >: >:>From that point I would imagine that 256 MB RAM is enough to fit in >:squid and - with about 50 megs left - some other processes. > > I'm not familiar with squid. Why is it eating 204M of VM? If that > is programmable, simply reduce it to 150M. > > FreeBSD can't give over all of its physical memory to a process. It > needs memory for kernel buffers and file caching. It *especially* > needs memory for kernel buffers in a network-heavy setup. > > Turning off swap in this case will cause the machine to lockup when > it runs out of memory -- probably not what you want. > Drop your cache_mem to something really small if possible. Let the OS do the file buffering and you'll find it should swap less. If squid starts complaining the cache_mem is way way too small, its time for FreeBSD is probably paging out unused pages in squid, and since most of squids footprint will be the cache object database, on a busy squid it will result in lots of pageins, causing degraded performance. Adrian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 0:51:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (mail.palmerharvey.co.uk [62.172.109.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48F5C14E1D for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 00:51:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Dom.Mitchell@palmerharvey.co.uk) Received: from ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk (unverified) by mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Thu, 08 Apr 1999 08:48:57 +0100 Received: from voodoo.pandhm.co.uk ([10.100.35.12]) by ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) id GZL8KH1L; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 08:42:16 +0100 Received: from dom by voodoo.pandhm.co.uk with local (Exim 2.10 #1) id 10V9bs-0009Ag-00; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 08:52:24 +0100 To: Greg Lehey Cc: Wes Peters , justin@apple.com, "Daniel C. Sobral" , Esry Don-FDE005 , Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Volume managers (was: Separate boot partition?) X-Mailer: nmh-1.0 X-Colour: Green Organization: Palmer & Harvey McLane In-Reply-To: Greg Lehey's message of "Thu, 08 Apr 1999 08:48:22 +0930" <19990408084822.X2142@lemis.com> Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 08:52:24 +0100 From: Dom Mitchell Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 8 April 1999, Greg Lehey proclaimed: > I can't see why not, since it's possible now. What we still need to > do is find a way to extend a file system, but that's a ufs issue > (which has a solution), not a volume manager issue. What about shrinking an fs? Is that feasible? Possible? -- Dom Mitchell -- Palmer & Harvey McLane -- Unix Systems Administrator "Value of 2 may go down as well as up" -- FORTRAN programmers manual -- ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. ********************************************************************** To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 1: 2:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A67F15953 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 01:02:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id RAA18950; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 17:30:23 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id RAA21138; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 17:30:16 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990408173016.X2142@lemis.com> Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 17:30:16 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Dom Mitchell Cc: Wes Peters , justin@apple.com, "Daniel C. Sobral" , Esry Don-FDE005 , Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Volume managers (was: Separate boot partition?) References: <19990408084822.X2142@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: ; from Dom Mitchell on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 08:52:24AM +0100 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 8:52:24 +0100, Dom Mitchell wrote: > On 8 April 1999, Greg Lehey proclaimed: >> I can't see why not, since it's possible now. What we still need to >> do is find a way to extend a file system, but that's a ufs issue >> (which has a solution), not a volume manager issue. > > What about shrinking an fs? Is that feasible? Possible? According to Kirk McKusick, no. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 1:28: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ewok.creative.net.au (ewok.creative.net.au [203.30.44.41]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 5085A15950 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 01:27:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adrian@freebsd.org) Received: (qmail 5444 invoked by uid 1008); 8 Apr 1999 08:09:15 -0000 Message-ID: <19990408080915.5442.qmail@ewok.creative.net.au> From: adrian@freebsd.org To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: squid and FreeBSD (was: Re: Nice FreeBSD mention) In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 08 Apr 1999 15:13:29 +0800." <19990408071330.5268.qmail@ewok.creative.net.au> Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 16:09:15 +0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > >Drop your cache_mem to something really small if possible. Let the OS do the >file buffering and you'll find it should swap less. > >If squid starts complaining the cache_mem is way way too small, its time for some extra memory to be installed. >FreeBSD is probably paging out unused pages in squid, and since most of squids >footprint will be the cache object database, on a busy squid it will result >in lots of pageins, causing degraded performance. Adrian, who shouldn't post to mailing lists 10 minutes after waking up. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 1:46:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rt2.synx.com (tech.boostworks.com [194.167.81.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 99480158A5 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 01:46:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@synx.com) Received: from synx.com (rn.synx.com [192.1.1.241]) by rt2.synx.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id KAA07975; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:44:18 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <199904080844.KAA07975@rt2.synx.com> Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:44:15 +0200 (CEST) From: Remy Nonnenmacher Reply-To: remy@synx.com Subject: Re: Volume managers (was: Separate boot partition?) To: grog@lemis.com Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19990408173016.X2142@lemis.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 8 Apr, Greg Lehey wrote: > On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 8:52:24 +0100, Dom Mitchell wrote: >> On 8 April 1999, Greg Lehey proclaimed: >>> I can't see why not, since it's possible now. What we still need to >>> do is find a way to extend a file system, but that's a ufs issue >>> (which has a solution), not a volume manager issue. >> >> What about shrinking an fs? Is that feasible? Possible? > > According to Kirk McKusick, no. > too bad !! Really, merging the best of all worlds (AIX PV migration, fs 'live' extendability) *AND* fs shrinking would be a really impressive performance. Think about it : A set of SCA, hot-pluggable disks. Every fs movable, resizable (up/down), every disk content movable from/to every other one.... the perfect power-on once, run till-end-of-universe server. > Greg > -- > See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers > finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 2: 1:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5CE3215966 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 02:01:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id SAA19181; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:29:18 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id SAA22330; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:29:17 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990408182917.G2142@lemis.com> Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:29:17 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: remy@synx.com Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Volume managers (was: Separate boot partition?) References: <19990408173016.X2142@lemis.com> <199904080844.KAA07975@rt2.synx.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904080844.KAA07975@rt2.synx.com>; from Remy Nonnenmacher on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 10:44:15AM +0200 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 10:44:15 +0200, Remy Nonnenmacher wrote: > On 8 Apr, Greg Lehey wrote: >> On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 8:52:24 +0100, Dom Mitchell wrote: >>> On 8 April 1999, Greg Lehey proclaimed: >>>> I can't see why not, since it's possible now. What we still need to >>>> do is find a way to extend a file system, but that's a ufs issue >>>> (which has a solution), not a volume manager issue. >>> >>> What about shrinking an fs? Is that feasible? Possible? >> >> According to Kirk McKusick, no. >> > too bad !! > > Really, merging the best of all worlds (AIX PV migration, fs 'live' > extendability) *AND* fs shrinking would be a really impressive > performance. > > Think about it : A set of SCA, hot-pluggable disks. Every fs movable, > resizable (up/down), every disk content movable from/to every other > one.... the perfect power-on once, run till-end-of-universe server. Well, with the exception of the file system shrinking, we have all that. I honestly don't think we'll find a need to shrink file systems too often. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 2:39: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from europa.salford.ac.uk (europa.salford.ac.uk [146.87.3.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 5C88B14C28 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 02:39:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from M.S.Powell@ais.salford.ac.uk) Received: (qmail 29364 invoked by alias); 8 Apr 1999 09:37:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 29358 invoked from network); 8 Apr 1999 09:37:01 -0000 Received: from plato.salford.ac.uk (146.87.255.76) by europa.salford.ac.uk with SMTP; 8 Apr 1999 09:37:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 27750 invoked by alias); 8 Apr 1999 09:37:00 -0000 Delivered-To: catchall-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: (qmail 27732 invoked by uid 141); 8 Apr 1999 09:36:59 -0000 Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:36:59 +0100 (BST) From: Mark Powell To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Subject: Real time clock problem in 3.1-STABLE Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Installed 3.1-STABLE on an Apricot Shogun server. xntpd wouldn't sync time correctly though. I set it up just as I do on any other machine. However, on the same machine RedHat 5.2 can sync the time just fine. FreeBSD had problems both before and after the recent kernel clock mods. I notice that with 3.1-S looking at the clocks at boot up, it would appear that over 40 reboots, the TSC clock has varied from 126668897 to 132002659, a variance of almost 5%. Is this normal? Whereas when Linux boots up the variance in processor clock speed is only about 1000Hz. Could this be causing the time problems, and if so is there anyway I can fiddle with tickadj or something to let xntpd work on this machine? Unfortunately I'm going to have to go with Linux on this machine if 3.1-S can't sync the time correctly. Anyone help? Cheers. Mark Powell - System Administrator (UNIX) - Clifford Whitworth Building A.I.S., University of Salford, Salford, Manchester, UK. Tel: +44 161 295 5936 Fax: +44 161 295 5888 www.pgp.com for PGP key M.S.Powell@ais.salfrd.ac.uk (spell salford correctly to reply to me) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 2:57:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rt2.synx.com (tech.boostworks.com [194.167.81.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD67B14D66 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 02:57:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@synx.com) Received: from synx.com (rn.synx.com [192.1.1.241]) by rt2.synx.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA08304; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 11:55:26 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <199904080955.LAA08304@rt2.synx.com> Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 11:55:23 +0200 (CEST) From: Remy Nonnenmacher Reply-To: remy@synx.com Subject: Re: Volume managers (was: Separate boot partition?) To: grog@lemis.com Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19990408182917.G2142@lemis.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 8 Apr, Greg Lehey wrote: > On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 10:44:15 +0200, Remy Nonnenmacher wrote: >> On 8 Apr, Greg Lehey wrote: >>> On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 8:52:24 +0100, Dom Mitchell wrote: >>>> On 8 April 1999, Greg Lehey proclaimed: >>>>> I can't see why not, since it's possible now. What we still need to >>>>> do is find a way to extend a file system, but that's a ufs issue >>>>> (which has a solution), not a volume manager issue. >>>> >>>> What about shrinking an fs? Is that feasible? Possible? >>> >>> According to Kirk McKusick, no. >>> >> too bad !! >> >> Really, merging the best of all worlds (AIX PV migration, fs 'live' >> extendability) *AND* fs shrinking would be a really impressive >> performance. >> >> Think about it : A set of SCA, hot-pluggable disks. Every fs movable, >> resizable (up/down), every disk content movable from/to every other >> one.... the perfect power-on once, run till-end-of-universe server. > > Well, with the exception of the file system shrinking, we have all > that. I honestly don't think we'll find a need to shrink file systems > too often. > Sure, but 'not too often' is not 'never' and when case raises, for exemple with these messages : (assuming you can't hot-add disks...) - "too bad: you are 100MB too short on this fs. 200MB are wasted here and here. watch and cry!!" - "Ha Ha !! 100MB needed for install, 50 MB available. Anyway, have a look around there: 10 fs with 50MB wasted on each one!!" The main problem is that you need to plan a shutdown and a time-costly work (nightly ;). BTW, a workaround (with spares) would be to be able to create a new, downsized, fs and then migrate content of the old one to the new one. Steps something like : - Have everybody using the old one freeze (hands up!) - sync the old fs - Move the content of the old fs - alias old->new - Everybody warm. - free space owned by the old fs. Feasible ? (ANW, would be helpfull sometime to freeze every process using a fs...) RN. IaM To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 3:15: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from relay04.indigo.ie (relay04.indigo.ie [194.125.133.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id B1B581533D for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 03:15:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from niall@pobox.com) Received: (qmail 6175 messnum 46437 invoked from network[194.125.205.180/ts08-050.dublin.indigo.ie]); 8 Apr 1999 10:13:01 -0000 Received: from ts08-050.dublin.indigo.ie (HELO pobox.com) (194.125.205.180) by relay04.indigo.ie (qp 6175) with SMTP; 8 Apr 1999 10:13:01 -0000 Message-ID: <370C81CC.A39B1743@pobox.com> Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 11:15:40 +0100 From: Niall Smart X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Revised suggestion for securelevel negative time deltas Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > Well, how about a sysctl (kern.maxclockdelta) which specifies the > > maximum > > amount of seconds that the clock can be brought forward or back in a > > specified period, say 7 days. This fixes the problem mentioned by Matt > > Dillon (?) whereby an attacker can wind the clock forward indefinately > > and overflow a time_t. (Naturally this sysctl would be read-only > > when securelevel > 1). > > The problem is, how do you measure time when the clock is being > changed a lot? If you limit the change an attacker can make, > all he has to do is do it a billion times to achieve the same > end. Clamping the negative adjustment to the maximum time seen -1 sec > works because time is an increasing function. You can't similarly > clamp positive excursions quite so easily. Every 7 days you store the current timestamp in "timebase", you can't change the system clock more than +/- kern.maxclockdelta from this value. Regards, Niall. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 3:48:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (spinner.netplex.com.au [202.12.86.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 47A7515296 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 03:48:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spinner.netplex.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3/Netplex) with ESMTP id SAA17649; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:45:58 +0800 (WST) (envelope-from peter@spinner.netplex.com.au) Message-Id: <199904081045.SAA17649@spinner.netplex.com.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Niall Smart Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Revised suggestion for securelevel negative time deltas In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 08 Apr 1999 11:15:40 +0100." <370C81CC.A39B1743@pobox.com> Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 18:45:57 +0800 From: Peter Wemm Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Niall Smart wrote: > > > Well, how about a sysctl (kern.maxclockdelta) which specifies the > > > maximum > > > amount of seconds that the clock can be brought forward or back in a > > > specified period, say 7 days. This fixes the problem mentioned by Matt > > > Dillon (?) whereby an attacker can wind the clock forward indefinately > > > and overflow a time_t. (Naturally this sysctl would be read-only > > > when securelevel > 1). > > > > The problem is, how do you measure time when the clock is being > > changed a lot? If you limit the change an attacker can make, > > all he has to do is do it a billion times to achieve the same > > end. Clamping the negative adjustment to the maximum time seen -1 sec > > works because time is an increasing function. You can't similarly > > clamp positive excursions quite so easily. > > Every 7 days you store the current timestamp in "timebase", you > can't change the system clock more than +/- kern.maxclockdelta > from this value. IMHO, this is all getting way too convoluted. I think it would be far better to simply set the time at boot with ntpdate, and once the system is running with a raised securelevel, deny settimeofday() entirely and tell xntpd to just use adjtime(2) to speed or slow the clock. If the clock needs a major adjustment for some reason, a reboot is probably the least of your worries. About the only other thing I can think of is to make settimeofday() do an xntpd-like adjtime() over a given interval. That gets complicated too though. (ie: setting the clock backwards 2 seconds is implemented by shortening the clock by 10% of a second for 20 seconds or something like that.) That's a bit hit-and-miss though and would probably not please xntpd. Cheers, -Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 6:46:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk [130.159.196.126]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C69A1529A; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 06:46:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roger@cs.strath.ac.uk) Received: from cs.strath.ac.uk (scary.dmem.strath.ac.uk [130.159.202.5]) by fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA18967 Thu, 8 Apr 1999 14:44:21 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <370CB2DC.709E7CEA@cs.strath.ac.uk> Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 14:45:00 +0100 From: Roger Hardiman Organization: Strathclyde University X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org, multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: Bt848 corruption since upgrading to 3.1. Has DMA code changed? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, Several people (including Luigi) have reported that video capture with the bt848 driver is not working right since they upgraded from 2.2.6 or 2.2.8 to 3.1-release Luigi and I noticed the problem in VIC (lots of horizontal lines in the image) and others have rpeorted FXTV problems. It looks like a DMA problem. The DMA is either timing out or the bus mastering is failing or the DMA transfer data is getting corrupted. Nothing has changed in the bt848 driver in this area since 2.2.x and I tested with the vic from 2.2.6 a.out format pkg_add. It looks like something has changed in the kernel's PCI bus setup code. Does anyone know what is different in the 3.x kernel (compared to the 2.2.x kernel) which could be causing this corruption. HELP! Roger -- Roger Hardiman Strathclyde Uni Telepresence Research Group, Glasgow, Scotland. http://telepresence.dmem.strath.ac.uk 0141 548 2897 roger@cs.strath.ac.uk roger@freebsd.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 6:54:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hp9000.chc-chimes.com (hp9000.chc-chimes.com [206.67.97.84]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5786B159FC for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 06:54:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from billf@chc-chimes.com) Received: from localhost by hp9000.chc-chimes.com with SMTP (1.39.111.2/16.2) id AA207239438; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 09:50:38 -0400 Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 09:50:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Bill Fumerola To: Ollivier Robert Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? In-Reply-To: <19990408001549.A8505@keltia.freenix.fr> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Ollivier Robert wrote: > Speaking of HP again, another well-done things in HP-UX is their packaging > system (swinstall, swpackage and all that). It works well for the system, > packages and patches and makes building of packages very easy... I can safely say that I could not get a single patch to apply cleanly when I cared about my HP9000/e25 (HP/UX 10.10) machine. The above machine was turned into the cheezy SMTP server that it is now, and the machine from which I send this e-mail. Oh well. - bill fumerola - billf@chc-chimes.com - BF1560 - computer horizons corp - - ph:(800) 252-2421 - bfumerol@computerhorizons.com - billf@FreeBSD.org - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 6:58:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from Genesis.Denninger.Net (kdhome-2.pr.mcs.net [205.164.6.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90D1615A0F for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 06:58:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from karl@Genesis.Denninger.Net) Received: (from karl@localhost) by Genesis.Denninger.Net (8.9.3/8.8.2) id IAA33892; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 08:55:55 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <19990408085555.A33885@Denninger.Net> Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 08:55:55 -0500 From: Karl Denninger To: Bill Fumerola , Ollivier Robert Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? References: <19990408001549.A8505@keltia.freenix.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: ; from Bill Fumerola on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 09:50:38AM -0400 Organization: Karl's Sushi and Packet Smashers X-Die-Spammers: Spammers will be LARTed and the remains fed to my cat Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I personally HATE HPs software installation and management system. Its ok for a stand-alone system. It BITES when you're trying to distribute updates and changes. One thing good about FreeBSD - you can rationally have one "master" machine and do the rest of them (from a software perspective) on a network with "rdist" and friends. This is dangerous on HP and other "embedded boot" types of machines, because its not difficult at all to run into a situation where you can't boot the machine any longer (I've had it happen). I STRONGLY dislike "hidden" configuration and operating system components which make it difficult to be certain that what you're doing is going to work. -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@denninger.net) Web: fathers.denninger.net I ain't even *authorized* to speak for anyone other than myself, so give up now on trying to associate my words with any particular organization. On Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 09:50:38AM -0400, Bill Fumerola wrote: > On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Ollivier Robert wrote: > > > Speaking of HP again, another well-done things in HP-UX is their packaging > > system (swinstall, swpackage and all that). It works well for the system, > > packages and patches and makes building of packages very easy... > > I can safely say that I could not get a single patch to apply cleanly when > I cared about my HP9000/e25 (HP/UX 10.10) machine. > > The above machine was turned into the cheezy SMTP server that it is now, > and the machine from which I send this e-mail. > > Oh well. > > - bill fumerola - billf@chc-chimes.com - BF1560 - computer horizons corp - > - ph:(800) 252-2421 - bfumerol@computerhorizons.com - billf@FreeBSD.org - > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 7:13:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E96A159FC; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 07:13:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com ([204.68.178.225]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA25199; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 08:11:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <370CAA37.3645E2B9@softweyr.com> Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 07:08:08 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Roger Hardiman Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Bt848 corruption since upgrading to 3.1. Has DMA code changed? References: <370CB2DC.709E7CEA@cs.strath.ac.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Roger Hardiman wrote: > > Hi, > > Several people (including Luigi) have reported that video capture with > the bt848 driver is not working right since they upgraded from 2.2.6 or > 2.2.8 to 3.1-release > > Luigi and I noticed the problem in VIC (lots of horizontal lines in the > image) and others have rpeorted FXTV problems. > > It looks like a DMA problem. The DMA is either timing out or the bus > mastering is failing or the DMA transfer data is getting corrupted. > > Nothing has changed in the bt848 driver in this area since 2.2.x and I > tested with the vic from 2.2.6 a.out format pkg_add. > It looks like something has changed in the kernel's PCI bus setup code. > > > Does anyone know what is different in the 3.x kernel (compared to the > 2.2.x kernel) which could be causing this corruption. Does the driver explicitly turn on PCI bus mastering on the card? The PCI initialization code no longer does this. This change bit the fxp driver on some machines where the BIOS doesn't initialize bus mastering on the card. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 7:34:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bingsun2.cc.binghamton.edu (bingsun2.cc.binghamton.edu [128.226.1.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04E5215A13 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 07:34:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bf20761@binghamton.edu) Received: from localhost (bf20761@localhost) by bingsun2.cc.binghamton.edu (8.8.7/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA20285; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:32:30 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:32:30 -0400 (EDT) From: zhihuizhang X-Sender: bf20761@bingsun2 To: Mohit Aron Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: scheduling queues in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <199904080401.XAA07250@cs.rice.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 7 Apr 1999, Mohit Aron wrote: > Hi, > I'm using FreeBSD-2.2.6. It seems that the scheduler maintains > more than 1 queue for process scheduling - whichqs, whichrtqs, ... Can someone > please tell me the significance of all these queues. Also which processes > go in which queues. Thanks, > > > - Mohit As far as I know, normal time-sharing process goes to whichqs. whichrtqs is probably for real time processes. Please read the source code file swtch.s. -Zhihui To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 8: 7:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id CD074159BC; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 08:07:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id OAA28948; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 14:45:26 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199904081245.OAA28948@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Bt848 corruption since upgrading to 3.1. Has DMA code changed? To: wes@softweyr.com (Wes Peters) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 14:45:26 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: roger@cs.strath.ac.uk, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <370CAA37.3645E2B9@softweyr.com> from "Wes Peters" at Apr 8, 99 07:07:49 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 240 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Does the driver explicitly turn on PCI bus mastering on the card? The > PCI initialization code no longer does this. This change bit the fxp what happens if one does not turn on bus mastering ? nothing works at all, or what ? luigi To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 8:44:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.tar.com (ns.tar.com [204.95.187.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D630159F6 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 08:44:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dick@ns.tar.com) Received: (from dick@localhost) by ns.tar.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA24828; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:42:45 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dick) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:42:45 -0500 From: "Richard Seaman, Jr." To: "David O'Brien" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Linuxthreads "port" status and a request Message-ID: <19990408104245.G440@tar.com> References: <19990407102539.G467@tar.com> <19990407181328.A7059@nuxi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <19990407181328.A7059@nuxi.com>; from David O'Brien on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 06:13:28PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 06:13:28PM -0700, David O'Brien wrote: > > Solution to header problem > > -------------------------- > > 1) copying the existing pthread.h and pthread_np.h headers to a subdirectory > > (I've proposed /usr/include/pthread/uthread -- in case the FreeBSD kernel > > threads also produces a conflict, it could use /usr/include/pthread/kthread). > > Why not just rename pthread.h to linux_pthread.h and pthread_np.h to > linux_pthread_np.h ? Could be done. But, the POSIX pthread spec names pthread.h as the primary header file. This would require apps that want to be portable to have separate non-standard include files for FreeBSD. It would be a big PITA for port in the ports tree, as well as for other apps. With my proposed solution, people would still have to add -DLINUXTHREADS to the compile options, which would be "non-standard", but thats a lot easier that editing all the source files to have different headers. Plus, FreeBSD already makes life difficult because we require the non-standard -D_THREAD_SAFE compile option (most pthreads implementations require -D_REENTRANT if they require anything at all). > > > 2) installing a new top level pthread.h that looks like: > > > > #if defined(LINUXTHREADS) || defined(LINUXTHREAD) > > #include > > What if PREFIX was set to something other than "/usr/local" when the > person compiled the port? Then the user would have to add an additional compile option like: -I/nonstandard_prefix/include/pthread/linuxthreads in order for the app to find the right files. In fact, the main alternative to what I have proposed is simply to make them do this anyway using whatever PREFIX they chose, and not mess with the FreeBSD src tree. -- Richard Seaman, Jr. email: dick@tar.com 5182 N. Maple Lane phone: 414-367-5450 Chenequa WI 53058 fax: 414-367-5852 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 9: 1:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk [130.159.196.126]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B93E14BCD; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 09:01:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roger@cs.strath.ac.uk) Received: from cs.strath.ac.uk (scary.dmem.strath.ac.uk [130.159.202.5]) by fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA21862 Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:59:11 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <370CD277.E9A64E04@cs.strath.ac.uk> Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 16:59:51 +0100 From: Roger Hardiman Organization: Strathclyde University X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Wes Peters Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Bt848 corruption since upgrading to 3.1. Has DMA code changed? References: <370CB2DC.709E7CEA@cs.strath.ac.uk> <370CAA37.3645E2B9@softweyr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Wes, > Does the driver explicitly turn on PCI bus mastering on the card? The > PCI initialization code no longer does this. This change bit the fxp > driver on some machines where the BIOS doesn't initialize bus mastering > on the card. The driver has this code which enables the Bus Mastering. It was added back in the days of 3.0-current (about 12 months ago) when the driver was common to 2.2.x and 3.x. That is why there is a #if around the code. #if __FreeBSD__ > 2 fun = pci_conf_read(tag, PCI_COMMAND_STATUS_REG); pci_conf_write(tag, PCI_COMMAND_STATUS_REG, fun | 4); #endif Any other suggestions I can check? Bye Roger -- Roger Hardiman Strathclyde Uni Telepresence Research Group, Glasgow, Scotland. http://telepresence.dmem.strath.ac.uk 0141 548 2897 roger@cs.strath.ac.uk To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 9:52: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nero.cybersites.com (nero.cybersites.com [207.92.123.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA2B9159F9 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 09:51:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cyouse@cybersites.com) Received: from ns1.cybersites.com (ns1.cybersites.com [207.92.123.2]) by nero.cybersites.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA19017 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:57:41 -0400 From: Chuck Youse To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 3Com 3C5x9 Network cards Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:44:14 -0400 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.17] Content-Type: text/plain References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <99040812471303.39387@ns1.cybersites.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-KMail-Mark: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 08 Apr 1999, Bob K wrote: > The 3c905tx works quite well (it's the xl driver). I've also had problems > with the 509b, though: With exact same circumstances, a file that'll > transfer at 700kb/sec with a 3c905-TX will transfer at 60kb/sec with a > 3c509b... The 3c905 w/ the xl driver runs quite nicely. As a matter of fact, I use a pair of them in a firewall box which routes quite a bit of traffic. I've never had a single problem. (The box runs 3.1-STABLE). -- Chuck Youse Director of Systems cyouse@cybersites.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 10:36: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from vtopus.cs.vt.edu (vtopus.cs.vt.edu [128.173.40.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFF7C15ACE for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:35:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dhagan@vtopus.cs.vt.edu) Received: (from dhagan@localhost) by vtopus.cs.vt.edu (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id NAA18361 for hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:33:53 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:33:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Daniel Hagan To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Broken c89 or limits.h? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've started trying to run the NIST-PCTS for POSIX compliance (FreeBSD-3.1-RELEASE system), but I've hit a snag. The tools won't compile because: 1) c89 is a shell script which translates into 'cc -ansi -pedantic -D_ANSI_SOURCE ... 2) /usr/include/limits.h turns off POSIX symbols (like _POSIX_OPEN_MAX) when _ANSI_SOURCE is defined. This is a bit of problem ;-). Which one should be fixed? Daniel -- Daniel Hagan Computer Systems Engineer dhagan@cs.vt.edu To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 10:36:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pcnet1.pcnet.com (pcnet1.pcnet.com [204.213.232.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8223D15ACB for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:36:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eischen@vigrid.com) Received: (from eischen@localhost) by pcnet1.pcnet.com (8.8.7/PCNet) id NAA24731; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:34:01 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:34:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Daniel Eischen Message-Id: <199904081734.NAA24731@pcnet1.pcnet.com> To: dick@tar.com, obrien@NUXI.com Subject: Re: Linuxthreads "port" status and a request Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > 2) installing a new top level pthread.h that looks like: > > > > > > #if defined(LINUXTHREADS) || defined(LINUXTHREAD) > > > #include > > > > What if PREFIX was set to something other than "/usr/local" when the > > person compiled the port? > > Then the user would have to add an additional compile option like: > > -I/nonstandard_prefix/include/pthread/linuxthreads > > in order for the app to find the right files. In fact, the main > alternative to what I have proposed is simply to make them > do this anyway using whatever PREFIX they chose, and not mess with > the FreeBSD src tree. So any application that wants to use Linuxthreads must ensure that /include is first in the include path so that pthread.h and pthread_np.h are found there instead of /usr/include? This seems to make sense to me. I haven't looked at Linuxthreads, but is it possible for our pthread.h and pthread_np.h to be compatible (assuming we add missing capabilities)? Dan Eischen eischen@vigrid.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 10:53:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4FF7915AC4 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:53:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id NAA15266; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:03:42 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:03:40 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Peter Jeremy Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Volume managers In-Reply-To: <99Apr8.151534est.40342@border.alcanet.com.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Peter Jeremy wrote: > Whilst we're all making up wishlists for things we'd like to see > (someone else implement): The `clone filesystem' command supported by > Digital UNIX ADVfs is _very_ nice for `point-in-time' backups. > (Basically clonefset makes a read-only snapshot of the filesystem - > changes to the `active' filesystem are done using copy-on-write). > > Unfortunately, I suspect it couldn't be implemented within UFS > (because UFS relies on blocks being at particular physical locations > within a CG - ie superblock, array of inode blocks, data blocks - > which would make creating the copy-on-write blocks difficult). If there was a way to stick a mapping vn under a FS it could be done. Imagine a 'vn' device that was would start mapping blocks into itself you configure said vn, enable it under ffs, ffs tried to write to phys block 1000, the vn maps it into a file at location 1, then a request comes in for block 100, the vn maps it to the underlying block device, then a write comes in for it (block 100) it gets translated to block 2. This would just be a MMU but for disks. When the vn is "yanked out" it could just flush all blocks back the underlying real block device. in fact you don't really have to worry about shoving this vn between FFs and the block device, you can make it a prereq that the admin set it up beforehand. other applications for this would be using it to do fast recoveries if fsck can examine this log device and the log device was used for a certain tolerance level until it overflowed and dumped back into the real block device... you could examine the log and bring the FS up COW asap. This would be a bit slow of course, but damn interesting i think the original application for a FS snapshot is really cool though. hmmmmm.... -Alfred FFS FFS | | da0s1f mirvn / \ da0s1f logfile <- regular vn? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 10:56:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 37F5515A72 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:56:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id NAA26904; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:05:59 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:05:57 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Remy Nonnenmacher Cc: grog@lemis.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Volume managers (was: Separate boot partition?) In-Reply-To: <199904080844.KAA07975@rt2.synx.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Remy Nonnenmacher wrote: > On 8 Apr, Greg Lehey wrote: > > On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 8:52:24 +0100, Dom Mitchell wrote: > >> On 8 April 1999, Greg Lehey proclaimed: > >>> I can't see why not, since it's possible now. What we still need to > >>> do is find a way to extend a file system, but that's a ufs issue > >>> (which has a solution), not a volume manager issue. > >> > >> What about shrinking an fs? Is that feasible? Possible? > > > > According to Kirk McKusick, no. > > > too bad !! > > Really, merging the best of all worlds (AIX PV migration, fs 'live' > extendability) *AND* fs shrinking would be a really impressive > performance. > > Think about it : A set of SCA, hot-pluggable disks. Every fs movable, > resizable (up/down), every disk content movable from/to every other > one.... the perfect power-on once, run till-end-of-universe server. *nod* have you heard of RAID? :) -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 10:57:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.tar.com (ns.tar.com [204.95.187.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8FFF15B08 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:57:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dick@ns.tar.com) Received: (from dick@localhost) by ns.tar.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA26121; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:55:41 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dick) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:55:41 -0500 From: "Richard Seaman, Jr." To: Daniel Eischen Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Linuxthreads "port" status and a request Message-ID: <19990408125541.H440@tar.com> References: <199904081734.NAA24731@pcnet1.pcnet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904081734.NAA24731@pcnet1.pcnet.com>; from Daniel Eischen on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 01:34:01PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 01:34:01PM -0400, Daniel Eischen wrote: > So any application that wants to use Linuxthreads must ensure that > /include is first in the include path so that pthread.h and > pthread_np.h are found there instead of /usr/include? This seems > to make sense to me. Almost. Its got to be /include/something_unique rather than just /include, but other than that, yes. The reason it has to be unique is that lots of ports already do -I/usr/local/include, and for those that are threaded and want FreeBSD user threads, they'ed get the wrong headers if the linux pthread.h was in /usr/local/include. > > I haven't looked at Linuxthreads, but is it possible for our pthread.h > and pthread_np.h to be compatible (assuming we add missing capabilities)? I think the differences are very extensive, so apart from one big #ifdef clause that totally bifurcates pthread.h, I'd say no. -- Richard Seaman, Jr. email: dick@tar.com 5182 N. Maple Lane phone: 414-367-5450 Chenequa WI 53058 fax: 414-367-5852 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 11: 7:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF8C715A78 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 11:07:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA41305; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 14:05:17 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 14:05:16 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: Alfred Perlstein Cc: Remy Nonnenmacher , grog@lemis.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Volume managers (was: Separate boot partition?) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Alfred Perlstein wrote: > On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Remy Nonnenmacher wrote: > > > On 8 Apr, Greg Lehey wrote: > > > On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 8:52:24 +0100, Dom Mitchell wrote: > > >> On 8 April 1999, Greg Lehey proclaimed: > > >>> I can't see why not, since it's possible now. What we still need to > > >>> do is find a way to extend a file system, but that's a ufs issue > > >>> (which has a solution), not a volume manager issue. > > >> > > >> What about shrinking an fs? Is that feasible? Possible? > > > > > > According to Kirk McKusick, no. > > > > > too bad !! > > > > Really, merging the best of all worlds (AIX PV migration, fs 'live' > > extendability) *AND* fs shrinking would be a really impressive > > performance. > > > > Think about it : A set of SCA, hot-pluggable disks. Every fs movable, > > resizable (up/down), every disk content movable from/to every other > > one.... the perfect power-on once, run till-end-of-universe server. > > *nod* have you heard of RAID? :) > > -Alfred > > I think he meant maybe adding more RAID volumes :) As per earlier in the thread, resizing is a ffs issue, not ufs. Resizing an FFS would definitely be hard but not _impossible_. What exactly did Kirk say? > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 11:10:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (osmium.gn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1404B15AED for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 11:09:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wilko@yedi.iaf.nl) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (8.9.2/8.9.2) with UUCP id TAA18958; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 19:52:21 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.8.8/8.6.12) id TAA00427; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 19:28:22 +0200 (CEST) From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199904081728.TAA00427@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? In-Reply-To: <19990408100111.H2142@lemis.com> from Greg Lehey at "Apr 8, 1999 10: 1:11 am" To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 19:28:22 +0200 (CEST) Cc: dcs@newsguy.com, roberto@keltia.freenix.fr, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem, The Netherlands X-pgp-info: PGP public key at 'finger wilko@freefall.freebsd.org' X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As Greg Lehey wrote ... > On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 8:35:32 +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > > Ollivier Robert wrote: > >> > >> You have Physical Volumes, grouped into Volume Groups, each Volume Group > >> is divided into Logical Volumes and a LV can contain a filesystem. A given > >> filesystem is extendable within a LV and you can enlarge a LV. > > > > Mirroring can be set at VG level, either synchronous or > > assynchronous. > > Vinum doesn't do asynchronous mirroring. I suppose it will have to > when I introduce remote mirroring. Why? Do you want to grow your own SRDF? Groeten / Cheers, Wilko _ ______________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Arnhem, The Netherlands |/|/ / / /( (_) Bulte WWW : http://www.tcja.nl _______________________ Powered by FreeBSD ___ http://www.freebsd.org _____ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 11:27:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pcnet1.pcnet.com (pcnet1.pcnet.com [204.213.232.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C8F414EE5 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 11:27:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eischen@vigrid.com) Received: (from eischen@localhost) by pcnet1.pcnet.com (8.8.7/PCNet) id OAA01949; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 14:24:26 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 14:24:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Daniel Eischen Message-Id: <199904081824.OAA01949@pcnet1.pcnet.com> To: dick@tar.com, eischen@vigrid.com Subject: Re: Linuxthreads "port" status and a request Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > So any application that wants to use Linuxthreads must ensure that > > /include is first in the include path so that pthread.h and > > pthread_np.h are found there instead of /usr/include? This seems > > to make sense to me. > > Almost. Its got to be /include/something_unique rather than > just /include, but other than that, yes. The reason it has > to be unique is that lots of ports already do -I/usr/local/include, > and for those that are threaded and want FreeBSD user threads, > they'ed get the wrong headers if the linux pthread.h was in > /usr/local/include. Hmm, well you could still put your version of the FreeBSD modified pthread[_np].h in /usr/include and conditionalize inclusion of /usr/include/pthread.h with #ifndef _LINUXTHREADS. > > I haven't looked at Linuxthreads, but is it possible for our pthread.h > > and pthread_np.h to be compatible (assuming we add missing capabilities)? > > I think the differences are very extensive, so apart from one big > #ifdef clause that totally bifurcates pthread.h, I'd say no. Too bad :( Dan Eischen eischen@vigrid.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 11:32: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pcnet1.pcnet.com (pcnet1.pcnet.com [204.213.232.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B27D914C3F for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 11:31:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eischen@vigrid.com) Received: (from eischen@localhost) by pcnet1.pcnet.com (8.8.7/PCNet) id OAA02668; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 14:29:21 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 14:29:21 -0400 (EDT) From: Daniel Eischen Message-Id: <199904081829.OAA02668@pcnet1.pcnet.com> To: dick@tar.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Linuxthreads "port" status and a request Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I wrote: > Hmm, well you could still put your version of the FreeBSD modified > pthread[_np].h in /usr/include and conditionalize inclusion of > /usr/include/pthread.h with #ifndef _LINUXTHREADS. I meant: > Hmm, well you could still put your version of the FreeBSD modified > pthread[_np].h in /usr/local/include and conditionalize inclusion of ^^^^^^ Dan Eischen eischen@vigrid.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 11:39:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05F9E14E2A; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 11:39:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA15180; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:37:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id MAA28461; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:37:24 -0600 Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:37:24 -0600 Message-Id: <199904081837.MAA28461@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Roger Hardiman Cc: Wes Peters , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Bt848 corruption since upgrading to 3.1. Has DMA code changed? In-Reply-To: <370CD277.E9A64E04@cs.strath.ac.uk> References: <370CB2DC.709E7CEA@cs.strath.ac.uk> <370CAA37.3645E2B9@softweyr.com> <370CD277.E9A64E04@cs.strath.ac.uk> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > Does the driver explicitly turn on PCI bus mastering on the card? The > > PCI initialization code no longer does this. This change bit the fxp > > driver on some machines where the BIOS doesn't initialize bus mastering > > on the card. > > The driver has this code which enables the Bus Mastering. > It was added back in the days of 3.0-current (about 12 months ago) when > the driver > was common to 2.2.x and 3.x. That is why there is a #if around the code. > > #if __FreeBSD__ > 2 > fun = pci_conf_read(tag, PCI_COMMAND_STATUS_REG); > pci_conf_write(tag, PCI_COMMAND_STATUS_REG, fun | 4); > #endif Other than using a magic number of 4, that's almost the same as what's used in the fxp code. However, that also enables adds 0x2, which has another meaning. (It should be updated to not use the magic numbers, and instead use the constants supplied in , but that's a minor issue). Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 11:40:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from poynting.physics.purdue.edu (poynting.physics.purdue.edu [128.210.146.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 98D5414E11 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 11:39:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ajk@physics.purdue.edu) Received: from physics.purdue.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by poynting.physics.purdue.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA26342 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:37:56 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from ajk@physics.purdue.edu) Message-Id: <199904081837.NAA26342@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: [PATCH] mount and umount support for mortal users From: "Andrew J. Korty" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----- =_aaaaaaaaaa0" Content-ID: <26335.923596675.0@physics.purdue.edu> Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 13:37:56 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ------- =_aaaaaaaaaa0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <26335.923596675.1@physics.purdue.edu> These new versions of mount(8) and umount(8) are designed to be installed set-uid root. They behave as normal if invoked by root, but act according to a configuration file otherwise. Mortal users (console users only if desired) are given permission to mount certain devices on a fixed mount point. This mount point must be at least two levels deep, so that the owner and modes on the parent directory can be changed so as to only allow access by the calling user. One or more filesystems may be specified for a given device. I hope someone finds this useful enough to warrant a commit. I've submitted this patch via send-pr; see bin/11031. Andrew J. 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KwlpZiAodWlkICYmICgtMSA9PSBjaG93bihkaXIsIDAsIC0xKSB8fCAtMSA9PSBjaG1vZChkaXIs IDA3MDApKSkKKwkJZXJyKEVYX09TRVJSLCAiJXMiLCBkaXIpOworI2VuZGlmIC8qIGRlZmluZWQo TU9SVEFMKSAqLwogCiAJaWYgKChocCAhPSBOVUxMKSAmJiAhKGZmbGFnICYgTU5UX0ZPUkNFKSkg ewogCQkqZGVsaW1wID0gJ1wwJzsK ------- =_aaaaaaaaaa0-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 12: 6: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B635414D55 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:06:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA00834; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:03:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904081903.MAA00834@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Jaye Mathisen Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: PXE services? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Apr 1999 00:50:08 PDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 12:03:12 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > Does anybody have any experience with this? "PreBoot Execution > Environment?"... Yes. It's on the list of host environments that we want the loader's diskless boot stuff to support. Last time it was looked at it was still a bit on the green side. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 12:14:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27C9B14D9D; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:14:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA28529; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:15:31 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:15:31 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Roger Hardiman Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Bt848 corruption since upgrading to 3.1. Has DMA code changed? In-Reply-To: <370CB2DC.709E7CEA@cs.strath.ac.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Roger Hardiman wrote: > Hi, > > Several people (including Luigi) have reported that video capture with > the bt848 driver is not working right since they upgraded from 2.2.6 or > 2.2.8 to 3.1-release > > Luigi and I noticed the problem in VIC (lots of horizontal lines in the > image) and others have rpeorted FXTV problems. > > It looks like a DMA problem. The DMA is either timing out or the bus > mastering is failing or the DMA transfer data is getting corrupted. > > Nothing has changed in the bt848 driver in this area since 2.2.x and I > tested with the vic from 2.2.6 a.out format pkg_add. > It looks like something has changed in the kernel's PCI bus setup code. > > > Does anyone know what is different in the 3.x kernel (compared to the > 2.2.x kernel) which could be causing this corruption. > > HELP! Try hexdumping all the configuration registers from both 2.2.x and current to see what the differences are. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 12:32:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB91114DF6; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:32:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA01011; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:30:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904081930.MAA01011@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Mark Powell Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Real time clock problem in 3.1-STABLE In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 08 Apr 1999 10:36:59 BST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 12:30:32 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Installed 3.1-STABLE on an Apricot Shogun server. xntpd wouldn't sync time > correctly though. I set it up just as I do on any other machine. However, > on the same machine RedHat 5.2 can sync the time just fine. > FreeBSD had problems both before and after the recent kernel clock mods. > I notice that with 3.1-S looking at the clocks at boot up, it would appear > that over 40 reboots, the TSC clock has varied from 126668897 to > 132002659, a variance of almost 5%. Is this normal? Whereas when Linux > boots up the variance in processor clock speed is only about 1000Hz. Could > this be causing the time problems, and if so is there anyway I can fiddle > with tickadj or something to let xntpd work on this machine? > Unfortunately I'm going to have to go with Linux on this machine if > 3.1-S can't sync the time correctly. Anyone help? Cheers. The problem is probably our "advanced" timecounter code being screwed by the Apricot's firmware. You might try sysctl -w kern.timecounter.method=1 and see if that helps. Also talk to phk@freebsd.org about this if you haven't already. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 13:23:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 98C5114F47 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:23:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id NAA14426; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:21:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:21:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904082021.NAA14426@apollo.backplane.com> To: "John S. Dyson" Cc: aron@cs.rice.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: scheduling queues in FreeBSD References: <199904081457.JAA00705@y.dyson.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Matthew Dillon said: :> :> The 'idle' and 'realtime' queues were hacked in I don't know when, but :> they don't work very well... there are a number of situations that can :> cause machine lockups. Frankly, I'd like to see both ripped out completely :> and a better solution put in later on. :> :I agree -- they create messy LL code, and as you say, just don't work correctly. :-- :John | Never try to teach a pig to sing, :dyson@iquest.net | it makes one look stupid :jdyson@nc.com | and it irritates the pig. One thing we could do that would accomplish virtually the same goals would be to 'lock' the cpu priority. This would be a great temporary solution. If the cpu priority is locked into queue 0, we are effectively equivalent to the idle queue. If the cpu priority is locked into queue 31, we are effectively equivalent to the realtime queue. We then reduce the priority range that 'normal' processes are allowed to obtain such that they fall into queues 1-30. Poof, done. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 13:36:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 832A314D21; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:36:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id NAA21317; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:32:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from utah.XYLAN.COM by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id NAA22062; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:32:52 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com by utah.XYLAN.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (xylan utah [SPOOL])) id OAA25912; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 14:32:25 -0600 Message-ID: <370D039D.FC2D907A@softweyr.com> Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 13:29:33 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Nate Williams Cc: Roger Hardiman , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Bt848 corruption since upgrading to 3.1. Has DMA code changed? References: <370CB2DC.709E7CEA@cs.strath.ac.uk> <370CAA37.3645E2B9@softweyr.com> <370CD277.E9A64E04@cs.strath.ac.uk> <199904081837.MAA28461@mt.sri.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Nate Williams wrote: > > > > Does the driver explicitly turn on PCI bus mastering on the card? The > > > PCI initialization code no longer does this. This change bit the fxp > > > driver on some machines where the BIOS doesn't initialize bus mastering > > > on the card. > > > > The driver has this code which enables the Bus Mastering. > > It was added back in the days of 3.0-current (about 12 months ago) when > > the driver > > was common to 2.2.x and 3.x. That is why there is a #if around the code. Actually the #if is unnecessary, it only saves you the pci_conf_read and pci_conf_write, which are small potatoes in an attach routine. Worst case, you're turning on a bit that was already turned on. > > #if __FreeBSD__ > 2 > > fun = pci_conf_read(tag, PCI_COMMAND_STATUS_REG); > > pci_conf_write(tag, PCI_COMMAND_STATUS_REG, fun | 4); > > #endif > > Other than using a magic number of 4, that's almost the same as what's > used in the fxp code. However, that also enables adds 0x2, which has > another meaning. The correct name for "4" here would be PCIM_CMD_BUSMASTEREN. > (It should be updated to not use the magic numbers, and instead use the > constants supplied in , but that's a minor issue). Unless you're trying to maintain that and don't know to look in pcireg.h for the bit definitions. Magic numbers BAD! Other than that, I have no help to offer. Do you know for sure where it dies? I tracked down the problem in fxp with some simple printfs, and then several someones on -hackers pointed out the fix. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 13:59:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quack.kfu.com (quack.kfu.com [170.1.70.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C995F14F3D for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:59:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nsayer@medusa.kfu.com) Received: from medusa.kfu.com (medusa.kfu.com [170.1.70.5]) by quack.kfu.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA31429 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:57:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nsayer@localhost) by medusa.kfu.com (8.9.2/8.8.8) id NAA44080 for hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:57:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nsayer) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:57:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Nick Sayer Message-Id: <199904082057.NAA44080@medusa.kfu.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Any updates to ppbus? Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I tried looking in the archives and in the CVS repository, but didn't find anything. One of my 3.1 machines has an HP 540 on it. When used with lpt0, it works perfectly. With nlpt0 and the requisite ppbus stuff, it fails miserably, giving, perhaps a dozen lines correctly, then turning into garbage. I did note in the mailing list archives that I am not the only one, but I never saw a solution. Is there one? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 14:32:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 379B615717 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 14:32:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id OAA91967; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 14:27:56 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 14:27:53 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Matthew Dillon Cc: "John S. Dyson" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: scheduling queues in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <199904082021.NAA14426@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG not sure I follow.. going ot the meeting tonight? maybe I can get you to explain better there.. julian On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Matthew Dillon wrote: > :Matthew Dillon said: > :> > :> The 'idle' and 'realtime' queues were hacked in I don't know when, but > :> they don't work very well... there are a number of situations that can > :> cause machine lockups. Frankly, I'd like to see both ripped out completely > :> and a better solution put in later on. > :> > :I agree -- they create messy LL code, and as you say, just don't work correctly. > :-- > :John | Never try to teach a pig to sing, > :dyson@iquest.net | it makes one look stupid > :jdyson@nc.com | and it irritates the pig. > > One thing we could do that would accomplish virtually the same goals would > be to 'lock' the cpu priority. This would be a great temporary solution. > > If the cpu priority is locked into queue 0, we are effectively equivalent > to the idle queue. If the cpu priority is locked into queue 31, we are > effectively equivalent to the realtime queue. We then reduce the > priority range that 'normal' processes are allowed to obtain such that they > fall into queues 1-30. Poof, done. > > -Matt > Matthew Dillon > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 14:33:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from finch-post-11.mail.demon.net (finch-post-11.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.39]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8DC6D1559F for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 14:32:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dmlb@ragnet.demon.co.uk) Received: from [158.152.46.40] (helo=ragnet.demon.co.uk) by finch-post-11.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10VM16-000Bju-0B; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 21:07:17 +0000 Received: from dmlb by ragnet.demon.co.uk with local (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10VKYn-000FzJ-00; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:33:57 +0100 Content-Length: 1743 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 20:33:57 +0100 (BST) From: Duncan Barclay To: Alfred Perlstein Subject: Re: Volume managers Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Peter Jeremy Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Peter Jeremy wrote: > Whilst we're all making up wishlists for things we'd like to see > (someone else implement): The `clone filesystem' command supported by > Digital UNIX ADVfs is _very_ nice for `point-in-time' backups. > (Basically clonefset makes a read-only snapshot of the filesystem - > changes to the `active' filesystem are done using copy-on-write). > > Unfortunately, I suspect it couldn't be implemented within UFS > (because UFS relies on blocks being at particular physical locations > within a CG - ie superblock, array of inode blocks, data blocks - > which would make creating the copy-on-write blocks difficult). Well NetApps file system does a similar thing and it is based on UFS. The main trick they use is similar to that described in http://www.pdos.lcs.mit.edu/papers/cffs.html where inodes are allowed to "float" - the above paper tries to group inodes near directories so there isn't a seek between reading a directory and reading the inode and there is a high probability that the read-ahead will get the directory and inode together. It seems to work well for directories with a number of small files in them. Once you have removed the inode position constraint snap shots can be taken by using COW for directories, inodes and blocks and creating at least one directory which points to the old inodes. There were/are some papers at the NetApp site that go into how they do it in more detail. Duncan --- ________________________________________________________________________ Duncan Barclay | God smiles upon the little children, dmlb@ragnet.demon.co.uk | the alcoholics, and the permanently stoned. ________________________________________________________________________ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 15:44:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alcanet.com.au (news.alcanet.com.au [203.62.196.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EAF6414E7D for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 15:44:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au) Received: by border.alcanet.com.au id <40334>; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 08:28:56 +1000 Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 08:41:53 +1000 From: Peter Jeremy Subject: Re: Volume managers (was: Separate boot partition?) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Message-Id: <99Apr9.082856est.40334@border.alcanet.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Remy Nonnenmacher wrote: >Think about it : A set of SCA, hot-pluggable disks. Every fs movable, >resizable (up/down), every disk content movable from/to every other >one.... the perfect power-on once, run till-end-of-universe server. Not quite. The [amc]time stamps in the inode run out in 2038. This was discussed at length here last year (without any satisfactory solution). (For one possible solution, check out RFC2550). Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 15:52:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from implode.root.com (root.com [209.102.106.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 475E014F73 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 15:52:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@implode.root.com) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA21483; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 15:48:58 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904082248.PAA21483@implode.root.com> To: Matthew Dillon Cc: "John S. Dyson" , aron@cs.rice.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: scheduling queues in FreeBSD In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 08 Apr 1999 13:21:33 PDT." <199904082021.NAA14426@apollo.backplane.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 15:48:58 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >:> The 'idle' and 'realtime' queues were hacked in I don't know when, but >:> they don't work very well... there are a number of situations that can >:> cause machine lockups. Frankly, I'd like to see both ripped out completely >:> and a better solution put in later on. >:> >:I agree -- they create messy LL code, and as you say, just don't work correctly. >:-- >:John | Never try to teach a pig to sing, >:dyson@iquest.net | it makes one look stupid >:jdyson@nc.com | and it irritates the pig. > > One thing we could do that would accomplish virtually the same goals would > be to 'lock' the cpu priority. This would be a great temporary solution. > > If the cpu priority is locked into queue 0, we are effectively equivalent > to the idle queue. If the cpu priority is locked into queue 31, we are > effectively equivalent to the realtime queue. We then reduce the > priority range that 'normal' processes are allowed to obtain such that they > fall into queues 1-30. Poof, done. That would probably be adequate, but it does sacrifice the ability to have multiple realtime (and idletime) priorities and thus may deminish the usefulness of the whole thing even more. -DG David Greenman Co-founder/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project - http://www.freebsd.org Creator of high-performance Internet servers - http://www.terasolutions.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 16:42:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gizmo.internode.com.au (gizmo.internode.com.au [192.83.231.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F20B8151B0 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:42:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from newton@gizmo.internode.com.au) Received: (from newton@localhost) by gizmo.internode.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA25787; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 09:09:50 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from newton) From: Mark Newton Message-Id: <199904082339.JAA25787@gizmo.internode.com.au> Subject: Re: Any updates to ppbus? To: nsayer@quack.kfu.com (Nick Sayer) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 09:09:50 +0930 (CST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199904082057.NAA44080@medusa.kfu.com> from "Nick Sayer" at Apr 8, 99 01:57:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Nick Sayer wrote: > I tried looking in the archives and in the CVS repository, but > didn't find anything. One of my 3.1 machines has an HP 540 > on it. When used with lpt0, it works perfectly. With nlpt0 and > the requisite ppbus stuff, it fails miserably, giving, perhaps > a dozen lines correctly, then turning into garbage. I did note > in the mailing list archives that I am not the only one, but > I never saw a solution. Is there one? I had something similar. Do this: freebsd# lptcontrol -p ... which switches the ppc driver into polled mode. - mark ---- Mark Newton Email: newton@internode.com.au (W) Network Engineer Email: newton@atdot.dotat.org (H) Internode Systems Pty Ltd Desk: +61-8-82232999 "Network Man" - Anagram of "Mark Newton" Mobile: +61-416-202-223 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 16:43: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7FC20150AA for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:43:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id QAA15598; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:41:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:41:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904082341.QAA15598@apollo.backplane.com> To: David Greenman Cc: "John S. Dyson" , aron@cs.rice.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: scheduling queues in FreeBSD References: <199904082248.PAA21483@implode.root.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> One thing we could do that would accomplish virtually the same goals would :> be to 'lock' the cpu priority. This would be a great temporary solution. :> :> If the cpu priority is locked into queue 0, we are effectively equivalent :> to the idle queue. If the cpu priority is locked into queue 31, we are :> effectively equivalent to the realtime queue. We then reduce the :> priority range that 'normal' processes are allowed to obtain such that they :> fall into queues 1-30. Poof, done. : : That would probably be adequate, but it does sacrifice the ability to have :multiple realtime (and idletime) priorities and thus may deminish the :usefulness of the whole thing even more. : :-DG : :David Greenman I think it would be useful for 'idle' priority processes, but I agree that it would not be useful for any sort of true 'realtime' ( i.e. when there is more then one realtime process ). But the existing realtime scheduler isn't useful for true realtime either since there are no scheduling primitives. If nobody xxxx not to many people have objections, I would be happy to remove the realtime & idle queue junk and replace it with the locked priority concept. ( Cavet: the priority would only be locked while running in user mode, I wouldn't mess with the supervisor sleep priority override mechanism ). This would make idle processes useful again. I would also be happy if someone else did this... but if nobody else wants to, I can :-) -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 16:53: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from relay.nuxi.com (nuxi.ucdavis.edu [169.237.7.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41402151B0; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:52:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: (from obrien@localhost) by relay.nuxi.com (8.9.2/8.9.1) id QAA20592; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:50:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien) Message-ID: <19990408165056.D20453@nuxi.com> Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:50:56 -0700 From: "David O'Brien" To: current@freebsd.org Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. Reply-To: obrien@NUXI.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE Organization: The NUXI BSD group X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Keyid: 34F9F9D5 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've only heard back from 4 folks about adding EGCS's g77 to the base system -- all 4 said "yes". Unless I get more feedback, I will add g77 to the base system this weekend. -- -- David (obrien@NUXI.com -or- obrien@FreeBSD.org) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 17: 4:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E37014DB2; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 17:04:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA22010; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:00:10 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:00:10 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: "David O'Brien" Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: <19990408165056.D20453@nuxi.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, David O'Brien wrote: > I've only heard back from 4 folks about adding EGCS's g77 to the base > system -- all 4 said "yes". Unless I get more feedback, I will add g77 > to the base system this weekend. Personally, yes, lets do it. In fact, I'd like to hear serious discussion, now that libgcj is available, of making gcj (a part of egcs) also get installed. Java is extremely popular, and libgcj is going to increase that a great deal. Yeah, I'm serious, I would really like gcj+libgcj, to get java stuff compiled (non portably) into binaries on FreeBSD. > > -- > -- David (obrien@NUXI.com -or- obrien@FreeBSD.org) > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 17: 7:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.tar.com (ns.tar.com [204.95.187.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B63B14E5F for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 17:07:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dick@ns.tar.com) Received: (from dick@localhost) by ns.tar.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA51241; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 19:04:51 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dick) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 19:04:51 -0500 From: "Richard Seaman, Jr." To: Matthew Dillon Cc: David Greenman , "John S. Dyson" , aron@cs.rice.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: scheduling queues in FreeBSD Message-ID: <19990408190450.L440@tar.com> References: <199904082248.PAA21483@implode.root.com> <199904082341.QAA15598@apollo.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904082341.QAA15598@apollo.backplane.com>; from Matthew Dillon on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 04:41:03PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 04:41:03PM -0700, Matthew Dillon wrote: > I think it would be useful for 'idle' priority processes, but I agree > that it would not be useful for any sort of true 'realtime' ( i.e. > when there is more then one realtime process ). But the existing > realtime scheduler isn't useful for true realtime either since there > are no scheduling primitives. > > If nobody xxxx not to many people have objections, I would be happy to > remove the realtime & idle queue junk and replace it with the locked > priority concept. ( Cavet: the priority would only be locked while > running in user mode, I wouldn't mess with the supervisor sleep priority > override mechanism ). This would make idle processes useful again. > I would also be happy if someone else did this... but if nobody else > wants to, I can :-) I think Peter Dufault did some work about 3 months ago, that he was about ready to commit, that was a significant rework of the priority related code, and which fixed the buggy sched_* functions, and which would have put them into the kernel by default. I assume he got sidetracked. I think there are some "bugs" even in the normal priority scheduling code. I think the last version was at: ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/development/misc/PATCHES.sched The linux emulation code, especially the linuxthreads code, really needs working sched_* functions. Whether they they implement fully "real time" scheduling, whatever that means, is not so important. -- Richard Seaman, Jr. email: dick@tar.com 5182 N. Maple Lane phone: 414-367-5450 Chenequa WI 53058 fax: 414-367-5852 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 17:27:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6553F150B1 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 17:27:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id RAA15927; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 17:25:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 17:25:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904090025.RAA15927@apollo.backplane.com> To: Julian Elischer Cc: "John S. Dyson" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: scheduling queues in FreeBSD References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : :not sure I follow.. :going ot the meeting tonight? :maybe I can get you to explain better there.. : :julian Sure, I'll be there. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 17:27:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E612156CE for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 17:27:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id JAA22797; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 09:55:24 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id JAA24022; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 09:55:22 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990409095522.O2142@lemis.com> Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 09:55:22 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Peter Jeremy , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Volume managers References: <99Apr8.151534est.40342@border.alcanet.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <99Apr8.151534est.40342@border.alcanet.com.au>; from Peter Jeremy on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 03:28:40PM +1000 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 15:28:40 +1000, Peter Jeremy wrote: > Whilst we're all making up wishlists for things we'd like to see > (someone else implement): The `clone filesystem' command supported by > Digital UNIX ADVfs is _very_ nice for `point-in-time' backups. > (Basically clonefset makes a read-only snapshot of the filesystem - > changes to the `active' filesystem are done using copy-on-write). > > Unfortunately, I suspect it couldn't be implemented within UFS > (because UFS relies on blocks being at particular physical locations > within a CG - ie superblock, array of inode blocks, data blocks - > which would make creating the copy-on-write blocks difficult). I've seen the follow-up to this, but I haven't analysed it yet. Anyway, this is one of the things that I have been planning, and it's pretty simple. I take a "snapshot" of a volume in a detached plex. This plex is so different in structure from other plexes that I might look for a different name, but I believe Veritas calls it a plex. Instead of the plex data, it is initially empty. Every time a block in the volume is updated, the before image is written to the snapshot plex. Reading the snapshot plex first checks to see if it contains a before image for the area. If it does, it supplies it; otherwise the data in the volume hasn't changed, so it supplies the data from the volume. Since this works at a block level, there's no problem with whatever data you want to freeze in this manner. And no, it hasn't been implemented; that's why I'm vague on some of the details. The main problem is yet another layer of "where do I get this byte from?". Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 17:58:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alcanet.com.au (news.alcanet.com.au [203.62.196.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B883814FCA for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 17:58:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au) Received: by border.alcanet.com.au id <40352>; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:42:49 +1000 Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:55:50 +1000 From: Peter Jeremy Subject: Re: Volume managers To: grog@lemis.com Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Message-Id: <99Apr9.104249est.40352@border.alcanet.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey wrote: >On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 15:28:40 +1000, Peter Jeremy wrote: ... >> The `clone filesystem' command supported by >> Digital UNIX ADVfs is _very_ nice for `point-in-time' backups. > The main problem is yet another layer of "where do I get >this byte from?". ADVfs uses the free list within the FS (actually within the file domain). This _does_ mean that clonefset doesn't work on very full, dynamic filesystems. The upside is that it works most of the time and doesn't require reserved free disk space. If there's no free space left, a kernel error message is generated warning that the clone filesystem is no longer consistent (but I don't think it actually inhibits access to it). Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 18:15: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail1.lig.bellsouth.net (mail1.lig.bellsouth.net [205.152.0.55]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3138C14CB4; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:15:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gljohns@bellsouth.net) Received: from gforce.johnson.home (host-216-76-187-94.sld.bellsouth.net [216.76.187.94]) by mail1.lig.bellsouth.net (8.8.8-spamdog/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA04486; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 21:12:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from glenn@localhost) by gforce.johnson.home (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA31320; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:12:55 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from glenn) From: Glenn Johnson Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:12:20 -0500 To: "David O'Brien" Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. Message-ID: <19990408201220.A26477@gforce.johnson.home> References: <19990408165056.D20453@nuxi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <19990408165056.D20453@nuxi.com>; from David O'Brien on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 04:50:56PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 04:50:56PM -0700, David O'Brien wrote: > I've only heard back from 4 folks about adding EGCS's g77 to the base > system -- all 4 said "yes". Unless I get more feedback, I will add g77 > to the base system this weekend. > > -- > -- David (obrien@NUXI.com -or- obrien@FreeBSD.org) David, First off, great job on the egcs import. Maybe you have already counted me among the four, but if not, add me to the list. I would love to see g77 in the base system. Thanks. -- Glenn Johnson gljohns@bellsouth.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 18:18:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC62914EF2; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:18:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.2/8.9.1) id DAA95729; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 03:16:41 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: obrien@NUXI.com Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. References: <19990408165056.D20453@nuxi.com> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 09 Apr 1999 03:16:41 +0200 In-Reply-To: "David O'Brien"'s message of "Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:50:56 -0700" Message-ID: Lines: 14 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "David O'Brien" writes: > I've only heard back from 4 folks about adding EGCS's g77 to the base > system -- all 4 said "yes". Unless I get more feedback, I will add g77 > to the base system this weekend. I beg your pardon? You're adding g77 to the system because you know of four people who would find it useful? Where's the logic in that? If you do add it to the base system, make it optional. I don't care if it defaults to on, as long as I have the option to turn it off. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 18:20:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BCE4C14EF2; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:20:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA22293; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 21:16:28 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 21:16:28 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: obrien@NUXI.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 9 Apr 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > "David O'Brien" writes: > > I've only heard back from 4 folks about adding EGCS's g77 to the base > > system -- all 4 said "yes". Unless I get more feedback, I will add g77 > > to the base system this weekend. > > I beg your pardon? You're adding g77 to the system because you know of > four people who would find it useful? Where's the logic in that? > > If you do add it to the base system, make it optional. I don't care if > it defaults to on, as long as I have the option to turn it off. If that gives me the option to bring in gcj and libgcj, then I think it's a GREAT idea. > > DES > -- > Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 18:20:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fep1-orange.clear.net.nz (fep1-orange.clear.net.nz [203.97.32.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0FE8814EF2; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:20:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jabley@buddha.clear.net.nz) Received: from buddha.clear.net.nz (buddha.clear.net.nz [192.168.24.106]) by fep1-orange.clear.net.nz (1.5/1.11) with ESMTP id NAA19082; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 13:18:42 +1200 (NZST) Received: (from jabley@localhost) by buddha.clear.net.nz (8.9.2/8.9.2) id NAA52526; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 13:18:24 +1200 (NZST) (envelope-from jabley) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 13:18:24 +1200 From: Joe Abley To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: obrien@NUXI.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jabley@clear.co.nz Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. Message-ID: <19990409131824.A52442@clear.co.nz> References: <19990408165056.D20453@nuxi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: ; from Dag-Erling Smorgrav on Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 03:16:41AM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 03:16:41AM +0200, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > "David O'Brien" writes: > > I've only heard back from 4 folks about adding EGCS's g77 to the base > > system -- all 4 said "yes". Unless I get more feedback, I will add g77 > > to the base system this weekend. > > I beg your pardon? You're adding g77 to the system because you know of > four people who would find it useful? Where's the logic in that? > > If you do add it to the base system, make it optional. I don't care if > it defaults to on, as long as I have the option to turn it off. Oh good lord, not again. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 18:25:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp.enteract.com (thor.enteract.com [207.229.143.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 9AD3915A76 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:25:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dscheidt@enteract.com) Received: (qmail 10959 invoked from network); 9 Apr 1999 01:23:36 -0000 Received: from shell-3.enteract.com (dscheidt@207.229.143.42) by thor.enteract.com with SMTP; 9 Apr 1999 01:23:36 -0000 Received: from localhost (dscheidt@localhost) by shell-3.enteract.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with SMTP id UAA47393; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:23:34 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dscheidt@enteract.com) X-Authentication-Warning: shell-3.enteract.com: dscheidt owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:23:34 -0500 (CDT) From: David Scheidt To: Brian Feldman Cc: Alfred Perlstein , Remy Nonnenmacher , grog@lemis.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Volume managers (was: Separate boot partition?) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: :On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Alfred Perlstein wrote: :> On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Remy Nonnenmacher wrote: :> > On 8 Apr, Greg Lehey wrote: :> > > On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 8:52:24 +0100, Dom Mitchell wrote: :> > >> What about shrinking an fs? Is that feasible? Possible? :> > > :> > > According to Kirk McKusick, no. :> > > :> > too bad !! :I think he meant maybe adding more RAID volumes :) As per earlier in the :thread, resizing is a ffs issue, not ufs. Resizing an FFS would definitely :be hard but not _impossible_. What exactly did Kirk say? I was looking at ffs, and I think you could do it. I have much better things to do with my sanity, and think that a filesystem needs to have resizing as a design criteria to be able to this usefully, especially if you want to be able to do it online. David Scheidt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 18:42:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9508214CD1; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:42:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id LAA23189; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:10:12 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id LAA24203; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:10:09 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990409111009.W2142@lemis.com> Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:10:09 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Julian Elischer Cc: Nick Hibma , Greg Black , Peter Wemm , Archie Cobbs , Christopher Michaels , questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Debug kernel by default (was: System size with -g) References: <19990408122944.D2142@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: ; from Julian Elischer on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 09:16:48PM -0700 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wednesday, 7 April 1999 at 21:16:48 -0700, Julian Elischer wrote: > On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Greg Lehey wrote: >> On Wednesday, 7 April 1999 at 15:35:15 +0200, Nick Hibma wrote: >>> On Wed, 7 Apr 1999, Greg Black wrote: >>> >>>>>> And on the subject of debugging kernels getting built, I'd tend to >>>>>> agree. Don't install them though, install the stripped version. >>>>> >>>>> I had planned to leave that to the user: 'make install' will install a >>>>> stripped kernel, 'make install.debug' will install the full symbol >>>>> kernel. I still think this is a reasonable compromise. >>>> >>>> Agreed. >>> >>> Will that include a stripping of the previous kernel? >>> >>> if -x /kernel >>> strip -g /kernel >>> mv /kernel >>> >>> This is required or otherwise make the root partition bigger by >>> default. 2x10Mb for the kernel does not leave a lot of room for >>> etc. Patch for this is available if wanted. Just bounce me a >>> message. >> >> Well, that's not quite the way I'm doing it. By default, I make a >> kernel called kernel.debug and use the following rule to create a >> stripped kernel: >> >> ${KERNEL}: ${KERNEL}.debug >> objcopy --strip-debug ${KERNEL}.debug ${KERNEL} > > So I presume you've made an aout kernel? Bad presumption. > (we still use aout kernels on 3.1 but I haven't tried in 4.0 for a > while now) I thought they weren't supported in -CURRENT. That's the only place I've implemented it. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 18:47:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46B8F14BFC for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:47:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id LAA23222; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:15:08 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id LAA24222; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:15:04 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990409111503.Y2142@lemis.com> Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:15:03 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Wilko Bulte Cc: dcs@newsguy.com, roberto@keltia.freenix.fr, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? References: <19990408100111.H2142@lemis.com> <199904081728.TAA00427@yedi.iaf.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904081728.TAA00427@yedi.iaf.nl>; from Wilko Bulte on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 07:28:22PM +0200 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 19:28:22 +0200, Wilko Bulte wrote: > As Greg Lehey wrote ... >> On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 8:35:32 +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: >>> Ollivier Robert wrote: >>>> >>>> You have Physical Volumes, grouped into Volume Groups, each Volume Group >>>> is divided into Logical Volumes and a LV can contain a filesystem. A given >>>> filesystem is extendable within a LV and you can enlarge a LV. >>> >>> Mirroring can be set at VG level, either synchronous or >>> assynchronous. >> >> Vinum doesn't do asynchronous mirroring. I suppose it will have to >> when I introduce remote mirroring. > > Why? Do you want to grow your own SRDF? What's that FLAT? Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 18:47:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3C0C1596F for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:47:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id SAA00783; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:43:34 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:43:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Matthew Dillon Cc: David Greenman , "John S. Dyson" , aron@cs.rice.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: scheduling queues in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <199904082341.QAA15598@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Matthew Dillon wrote: > > I think it would be useful for 'idle' priority processes, but I agree > that it would not be useful for any sort of true 'realtime' ( i.e. > when there is more then one realtime process ). But the existing > realtime scheduler isn't useful for true realtime either since there > are no scheduling primitives. Before getting too excited by the possibility of a code massacre.. you should check with Peter Dufault. I believe some people are using this in production and I have even done so myself at times. One tends to hardly ever need 32 queues in all three categories (well I haven't) but it's be a bummer to lose the functionality entirely. As I said.. Please make sure you here from Peter D before you act as he's involved in this sort of thing.. Julian > > If nobody xxxx not to many people have objections, I would be happy to > remove the realtime & idle queue junk and replace it with the locked > priority concept. ( Cavet: the priority would only be locked while > running in user mode, I wouldn't mess with the supervisor sleep priority > override mechanism ). This would make idle processes useful again. > I would also be happy if someone else did this... but if nobody else > wants to, I can :-) > julian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 18:57:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from stampede.cs.berkeley.edu (stampede.CS.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.45.124]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A42114C15; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:57:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from asami@cs.berkeley.edu) Received: from silvia.hip.berkeley.edu (sji-ca1-146.ix.netcom.com [209.109.232.146]) by stampede.cs.berkeley.edu (8.8.7/8.7.3) with ESMTP id SAA05254; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:55:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from asami@localhost) by silvia.hip.berkeley.edu (8.9.2/8.6.9) id SAA98077; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:55:26 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:55:26 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904090155.SAA98077@silvia.hip.berkeley.edu> X-Authentication-Warning: silvia.hip.berkeley.edu: asami set sender to asami@cs.berkeley.edu using -f To: obrien@NUXI.com Cc: current@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: <19990408165056.D20453@nuxi.com> (obrien@NUXI.com) Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. From: asami@freebsd.org (Satoshi - the Ports Wraith - Asami) References: <19990408165056.D20453@nuxi.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG * From: "David O'Brien" * I've only heard back from 4 folks about adding EGCS's g77 to the base * system -- all 4 said "yes". Unless I get more feedback, I will add g77 * to the base system this weekend. Sorry, I wasn't paying enough attention I guess. What's wrong with it being a port? If the answer is "it's very hard to separate just the g77 functionality into /usr/local", then count me as a yes. If it is "some people want it in the base system", then count me as a no. -PW To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 19: 2:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from psf.Pinyon.ORG (ip-17-201.prc.primenet.com [207.218.17.201]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A74C14CAB for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 19:02:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rcarter@psf.Pinyon.ORG) Received: from psf.Pinyon.ORG (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by psf.Pinyon.ORG (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id SAA00920 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:56:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rcarter@psf.Pinyon.ORG) Message-Id: <199904090156.SAA00920@psf.Pinyon.ORG> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.3 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: scheduling queues in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 08 Apr 1999 16:41:03 MST." <199904082341.QAA15598@apollo.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 18:56:58 -0700 From: "Russell L. Carter" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG % If nobody xxxx not to many people have objections, I would be happy to % remove the realtime & idle queue junk and replace it with the locked % priority concept. ( Cavet: the priority would only be locked while % running in user mode, I wouldn't mess with the supervisor sleep priority % override mechanism ). This would make idle processes useful again. % I would also be happy if someone else did this... but if nobody else % wants to, I can :-) Why isn't this as significant a change as Peter's changes that perhaps go a long way to fixing the problem? There is getting to be *a lot* of stuff that wants multiple realtime priorities, and it seems short sighted to just say ah crap we can't do that. Russell % % -Matt % Matthew Dillon % % % % %To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org %with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message % To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 19:26:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E83514FC8 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 19:26:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id LAA23413; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:54:07 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id LAA24335; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:54:05 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990409115405.F2142@lemis.com> Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:54:05 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: remy@synx.com Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Volume managers (was: Separate boot partition?) References: <19990408182917.G2142@lemis.com> <199904080955.LAA08304@rt2.synx.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904080955.LAA08304@rt2.synx.com>; from Remy Nonnenmacher on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 11:55:23AM +0200 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 11:55:23 +0200, Remy Nonnenmacher wrote: > On 8 Apr, Greg Lehey wrote: >> On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 10:44:15 +0200, Remy Nonnenmacher wrote: >>> On 8 Apr, Greg Lehey wrote: >>>> On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 8:52:24 +0100, Dom Mitchell wrote: >>>>> On 8 April 1999, Greg Lehey proclaimed: >>>>>> I can't see why not, since it's possible now. What we still need to >>>>>> do is find a way to extend a file system, but that's a ufs issue >>>>>> (which has a solution), not a volume manager issue. >>>>> >>>>> What about shrinking an fs? Is that feasible? Possible? >>>> >>>> According to Kirk McKusick, no. >>>> >>> too bad !! >>> >>> Really, merging the best of all worlds (AIX PV migration, fs 'live' >>> extendability) *AND* fs shrinking would be a really impressive >>> performance. >>> >>> Think about it : A set of SCA, hot-pluggable disks. Every fs movable, >>> resizable (up/down), every disk content movable from/to every other >>> one.... the perfect power-on once, run till-end-of-universe server. >> >> Well, with the exception of the file system shrinking, we have all >> that. I honestly don't think we'll find a need to shrink file systems >> too often. >> > > Sure, but 'not too often' is not 'never' and when case raises, for > exemple with these messages : (assuming you can't hot-add disks...) > > - "too bad: you are 100MB too short on this fs. 200MB are wasted here > and here. watch and cry!!" > - "Ha Ha !! 100MB needed for install, 50 MB available. Anyway, have a > look around there: 10 fs with 50MB wasted on each one!!" > > The main problem is that you need to plan a shutdown and a time-costly > work (nightly ;). > > BTW, a workaround (with spares) would be to be able to create a new, > downsized, fs and then migrate content of the old one to the new one. > Steps something like : > > - Have everybody using the old one freeze (hands up!) If you're prepared to do this, sure. An easier way would be simply to create another plex on the new disk and synchronize it. > - sync the old fs Remove the old plex(es). > - Move the content of the old fs Create a new file system in the physical disk space which the old one used to occupy. > - alias old->new Copy. > - Everybody warm. No need. > - free space owned by the old fs. > > Feasible ? The way I suggest is better, since it can happen on-line. Vinum already has everything you need for that. > (ANW, would be helpfull sometime to freeze every process using a > fs...) Ideally, you should never need to freeze processes. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 19:27:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDFE2155FC for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 19:27:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id LAA23431; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:55:40 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id LAA24346; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:55:40 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990409115540.G2142@lemis.com> Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:55:40 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Brian Feldman , Alfred Perlstein Cc: Remy Nonnenmacher , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Volume managers (was: Separate boot partition?) References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: ; from Brian Feldman on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 02:05:16PM -0400 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 14:05:16 -0400, Brian Feldman wrote: > On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Alfred Perlstein wrote: >> On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Remy Nonnenmacher wrote: >>> On 8 Apr, Greg Lehey wrote: >>>> On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 8:52:24 +0100, Dom Mitchell wrote: >>>>> On 8 April 1999, Greg Lehey proclaimed: >>>>>> I can't see why not, since it's possible now. What we still need to >>>>>> do is find a way to extend a file system, but that's a ufs issue >>>>>> (which has a solution), not a volume manager issue. >>>>> >>>>> What about shrinking an fs? Is that feasible? Possible? >>>> >>>> According to Kirk McKusick, no. >>>> >>> too bad !! >>> >>> Really, merging the best of all worlds (AIX PV migration, fs 'live' >>> extendability) *AND* fs shrinking would be a really impressive >>> performance. >>> >>> Think about it : A set of SCA, hot-pluggable disks. Every fs movable, >>> resizable (up/down), every disk content movable from/to every other >>> one.... the perfect power-on once, run till-end-of-universe server. >> >> *nod* have you heard of RAID? :) > > I think he meant maybe adding more RAID volumes :) As per earlier in the > thread, resizing is a ffs issue, not ufs. Resizing an FFS would definitely > be hard but not _impossible_. What exactly did Kirk say? From a review of a paper I presented last year: > Future directions (pg 22): Extensible UFS: making UFS bigger > is trivial. Cutting it back is not. I didn't follow up. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 19:29:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9171015654 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 19:29:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id LAA23439; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:57:41 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id LAA24361; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:57:41 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990409115741.H2142@lemis.com> Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:57:41 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Peter Jeremy , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Volume managers (was: Separate boot partition?) References: <99Apr9.082856est.40334@border.alcanet.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <99Apr9.082856est.40334@border.alcanet.com.au>; from Peter Jeremy on Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 08:41:53AM +1000 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Friday, 9 April 1999 at 8:41:53 +1000, Peter Jeremy wrote: > Remy Nonnenmacher wrote: >> Think about it : A set of SCA, hot-pluggable disks. Every fs movable, >> resizable (up/down), every disk content movable from/to every other >> one.... the perfect power-on once, run till-end-of-universe server. > > Not quite. The [amc]time stamps in the inode run out in 2038. This > was discussed at length here last year (without any satisfactory > solution). (For one possible solution, check out RFC2550). Not a worry. In the meantime an upwards-compatible file system will be created, and you can copy the stuff across. The real problem is updating the kernel without rebooting. It would require some loosely-coupled MP system to achieve. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 19:43:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from friley-185-206.res.iastate.edu (friley-185-206.res.iastate.edu [129.186.185.206]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11E1915832 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 19:43:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cc@137.org) Received: from friley-185-205.res.iastate.edu (friley-185-205.res.iastate.edu [129.186.185.205]) by friley-185-206.res.iastate.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE2C6A7; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:41:19 -0600 (CST) Received: from friley-185-205.res.iastate.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by friley-185-205.res.iastate.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83B86AC; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 21:41:19 -0500 (CDT) X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Duncan Barclay Cc: Alfred Perlstein , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Peter Jeremy Subject: Re: Volume managers In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 08 Apr 1999 20:33:57 BST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 21:41:19 -0500 From: Chris Csanady Message-Id: <19990409024119.83B86AC@friley-185-205.res.iastate.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > >On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Peter Jeremy wrote: > >> Whilst we're all making up wishlists for things we'd like to see >> (someone else implement): The `clone filesystem' command supported by >> Digital UNIX ADVfs is _very_ nice for `point-in-time' backups. >> (Basically clonefset makes a read-only snapshot of the filesystem - >> changes to the `active' filesystem are done using copy-on-write). >> >> Unfortunately, I suspect it couldn't be implemented within UFS >> (because UFS relies on blocks being at particular physical locations >> within a CG - ie superblock, array of inode blocks, data blocks - >> which would make creating the copy-on-write blocks difficult). > >Well NetApps file system does a similar thing and it is based on UFS. >The main trick they use is similar to that described in I thought that NetApp now uses a log structured file system. This inherently makes growing/shrinking filesystems and snapshots very easy. It would be great to have a good lfs implementation. Chris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 19:45:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from netrinsics.com (unknown [210.74.174.205]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C55C1515E; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 19:43:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from robinson@netrinsics.com) Received: (from robinson@localhost) by netrinsics.com (8.9.2/8.8.7) id KAA46490; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:41:28 +0800 (CST) (envelope-from robinson) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:41:28 +0800 (CST) From: Michael Robinson Message-Id: <199904090241.KAA46490@netrinsics.com> To: mike@smith.net.au Subject: Re: Real time clock problem in 3.1-STABLE Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199904081930.MAA01011@dingo.cdrom.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Mike Smith writes: >The problem is probably our "advanced" timecounter code being screwed >by the Apricot's firmware. You might try > >sysctl -w kern.timecounter.method=1 Could this also be used to get rid of "negative calcru" and clock drift problems? -Michael Robinson To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 19:49:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C08C159EF for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 19:49:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id WAA05496 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 22:47:24 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904090247.WAA05496@cs.rpi.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: debugging a panic in a kld-ed kernel Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 22:47:24 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Somoone posted awhile back about how to get the kgdb to show symbols, debug information from a crash dump. Could someone repost that, or point me to it, I cannot seem to find it. -- David Cross To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 19:59:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C87215A7F for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 19:59:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id MAA23559; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 12:27:03 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id MAA24438; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 12:27:03 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990409122703.J2142@lemis.com> Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 12:27:03 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: "David E. Cross" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: debugging a panic in a kld-ed kernel References: <199904090247.WAA05496@cs.rpi.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904090247.WAA05496@cs.rpi.edu>; from David E. Cross on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 10:47:24PM -0400 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 22:47:24 -0400, David E. Cross wrote: > Somoone posted awhile back about how to get the kgdb to show symbols, > debug information from a crash dump. Could someone repost that, or > point me to it, I cannot seem to find it. I've posted a number of messages. If you're tracking -CURRENT, take a look at the .gdbinit* files in /usr/src/sys/modules/vinum. The Vinum-specific stuff won't help you much, but in .gdbinit.vinum.paths there's this example: define asf set $file = files.tqh_first set $found = 0 while ($found == 0) p *$file if (*$file->filename == 'v') set $found = 1 else set $file = $file->link.tqe_next end end shell /usr/bin/objdump --section-headers /modules/vinum/vinum.ko | grep ' .text' | awk '{print "add-symbol-file /modules/vinum/vinum.ko \$file->address+0x" $4}' > .asf source .asf end This kludge walks down the list of klds until it finds one with the correct initial letter 'v' (see what I mean about kludge?) and creates a file which it then sources in the last two lines. With a little modification it should work for any one kld. Possibly you could fix it to DTRT and make a command file for all klds. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 20: 1:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lambic.physics.montana.edu (lambic.physics.montana.edu [153.90.192.128]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1614515A1E; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:01:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from handy@lambic.physics.montana.edu) Received: from localhost (handy@localhost) by lambic.physics.montana.edu (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA19600; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:59:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from handy@lambic.physics.montana.edu) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:59:04 -0600 (MDT) From: Brian Handy To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: obrien@NUXI.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: X-files: The truth is out there MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 9 Apr 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: >> [4 people said "YES! Add g77!"] >I beg your pardon? You're adding g77 to the system because you know of >four people who would find it useful? Where's the logic in that? Well, statistically speaking, that's a bunch of "ayes" and no "noes". Lots of things happen via implicit acceptance. (I was one of the people who spoke up in favor of this after David mentioned this.) >If you do add it to the base system, make it optional. I don't care if >it defaults to on, as long as I have the option to turn it off. This doesn't seem unreasonable. (I also really like Chuck's idea of adding gcj in the same light.) Happy trails, Brian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 20:38:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from catarina.usc.edu (catarina.usc.edu [128.125.51.47]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D2EB415AB7 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:37:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pavlin@catarina.usc.edu) Received: from hugo.usc.edu (hugo.usc.edu [128.125.51.40]) by catarina.usc.edu (8.6.10/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA23740; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:35:54 -0700 Received: from hugo (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hugo.usc.edu (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA23923; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:35:53 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904090335.UAA23923@hugo.usc.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: pavlin@catarina.usc.edu Subject: IGMP membership report not received by mrouted Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 20:35:53 -0700 From: Pavlin Ivanov Radoslavov Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD-3.1 If I start mrouted (3.9-beta3+IOS12), mrouted cannot see the IGMP membership reports. If I start tcpdump on the interface with receivers, then mrouted can see the IGMP membership reports!! No other mrouted running on neighbor machines. Anyone seen something like this? Thanks, Pavlin (not on the ML) P.S. The Ethernet card is: Cogent (now Adaptec) 2xQuad Ethernet 10BaseT, EM964TP (now ANA-6904), PCI, based on DEC21040 chip2: rev 0x02 on pci0.12.0 chip3: rev 0x02 on pci0.13.0 Probing for devices on PCI bus 1: de0: rev 0x24 int a irq 11 on pci1.4.0 de0: Cogent 21040 [10Mb/s] pass 2.4 de0: address 00:00:92:92:44:30 de1: rev 0x24 int a irq 10 on pci1.5.0 de1: Cogent 21040 [10Mb/s] pass 2.4 de1: address 00:00:92:92:44:31 de2: rev 0x24 int a irq 12 on pci1.6.0 de2: Cogent 21040 [10Mb/s] pass 2.4 de2: address 00:00:92:92:44:32 de3: rev 0x24 int a irq 9 on pci1.7.0 de3: Cogent 21040 [10Mb/s] pass 2.4 de3: address 00:00:92:92:44:33 Probing for devices on PCI bus 2: de4: rev 0x24 int a irq 9 on pci2.4.0 de4: Cogent 21040 [10Mb/s] pass 2.4 de4: address 00:00:92:92:44:58 de5: rev 0x24 int a irq 11 on pci2.5.0 de5: Cogent 21040 [10Mb/s] pass 2.4 de5: address 00:00:92:92:44:59 de6: rev 0x24 int a irq 10 on pci2.6.0 de6: Cogent 21040 [10Mb/s] pass 2.4 de6: address 00:00:92:92:44:5a de7: rev 0x24 int a irq 12 on pci2.7.0 de7: Cogent 21040 [10Mb/s] pass 2.4 de7: address 00:00:92:92:44:5b To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 21:26:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.54]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F98E14EB5; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 21:26:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) id VAA93282; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 21:21:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sgk) From: Steve Kargl Message-Id: <199904090421.VAA93282@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: <199904090155.SAA98077@silvia.hip.berkeley.edu> from Satoshi - the Ports Wraith - Asami at "Apr 8, 1999 06:55:26 pm" To: asami@FreeBSD.ORG (Satoshi - the Ports Wraith - Asami) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 21:21:58 -0700 (PDT) Cc: obrien@NUXI.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL54 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Satoshi - the Ports Wraith - Asami wrote: > * From: "David O'Brien" > > * I've only heard back from 4 folks about adding EGCS's g77 to the base > * system -- all 4 said "yes". Unless I get more feedback, I will add g77 > * to the base system this weekend. > > Sorry, I wasn't paying enough attention I guess. What's wrong with it > being a port? > > If the answer is "it's very hard to separate just the g77 > functionality into /usr/local", then count me as a yes. If it is > "some people want it in the base system", then count me as a no. > Speaking of ports, I have a working port of f2c and a new f77(1) wrapper sitting on my machine. The f2c port includes all of the FreeBSD changes to the f2c in usr/src. -- Steve To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 21:30:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.54]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B304814EB5; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 21:30:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) id VAA93304; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 21:25:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sgk) From: Steve Kargl Message-Id: <199904090425.VAA93304@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: from Dag-Erling Smorgrav at "Apr 9, 1999 03:16:41 am" To: des@flood.ping.uio.no (Dag-Erling Smorgrav) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 21:25:59 -0700 (PDT) Cc: obrien@NUXI.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL54 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > "David O'Brien" writes: > > I've only heard back from 4 folks about adding EGCS's g77 to the base > > system -- all 4 said "yes". Unless I get more feedback, I will add g77 > > to the base system this weekend. > > I beg your pardon? You're adding g77 to the system because you know of > four people who would find it useful? Where's the logic in that? Please add g77. That's five. Search the mail archive for the last round of Fortran discussion. > If you do add it to the base system, make it optional. I don't care if > it defaults to on, as long as I have the option to turn it off. A knob would be fine, but you're saving yourself 100k or so of disk space and 5 minutes during "make world". -- Steve To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 21:31:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kyrnet.kg (ns.kyrnet.kg [195.254.160.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58FF415AEF for ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 21:31:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fygrave@tigerteam.net) Received: from localhost by kyrnet.kg (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA25534; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 09:22:14 +0500 (GMT) X-Authentication-Warning: kyrnet.kg: fygrave owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 09:22:14 +0500 (GMT) From: CyberPsychotic X-Sender: fygrave@kyrnet.kg To: linux-c-programming@tower.itis.com Cc: linux-kernel@vger.rutgers.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: linux recvfrom differencies Message-ID: Confirm-receipt-to: fygrave@usa.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG There was a sort of discussion raised at euro-coders mailing list recently which related to the differencies in implementation of recvfrom() call in linux socket API and the rest of Unixes (Solaris and two BSD clones (BSDi and FreeBSD were tested). We played with a sort of self-made udp echo daemon, which basically was listening to the udp packets on certain port and was sending them back to the same IP:port-no. The curious thing is that if the packet is spoofed, and no port is being listened on remote machine (and icmp port unreachable goes back) linux returns -1 for next recvfrom with herrno(?) set to REFUSED, while BSD/Solaris just ignore this. The question is: is there any paper/RFC/FYI which puts a standard on such things, or this is basically `the matter of taste' of OS developers, and thus just should being watched carefully, while developing multi-platform applications? thanks ahead regards Fyodor ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:05:13 +0500 From: stealth@dione.ids.pl Reply-To: euro-coders@gizmo.kyrnet.kg Subject:Re: TCP/IP-stack obscurities #2 >yeah.. I also tested the same thing on Solaris and got the similar >behaviour. Seems that Linux is again the only `spoiled kid'. The thing >appears in recvfrom call, and whenever kernel receives ICMP port unreach. >packet it probably returns this call with `connection refused' errie. >Whether this is correct or not, I have no clue, but it would be worth to >check out POSIX(?) notation. POSIX.1 doesn't spec NET-stuff :-( socket_call() which leads to recvfrom() is linux-specific in this way. Maybe RFC 793 (tcp?) says more... : ---- main(){fork();main();} ---- : Stealth - atexit(main) to call me again. : stealth@gizmo.kyrnet.kg <-> http://www.kalug.lug.net/stealth To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 23: 5: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk [130.159.196.126]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D51414C21; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 23:05:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roger@cs.strath.ac.uk) Received: from cs.strath.ac.uk (scary.dmem.strath.ac.uk [130.159.202.5]) by fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA01684 Fri, 9 Apr 1999 07:02:34 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <370D9821.2E646AA4@cs.strath.ac.uk> Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 07:03:13 +0100 From: Roger Hardiman Organization: Strathclyde University X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Wes Peters Cc: Nate Williams , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Bt848 corruption since upgrading to 3.1. Has DMA code changed? References: <370CB2DC.709E7CEA@cs.strath.ac.uk> <370CAA37.3645E2B9@softweyr.com> <370CD277.E9A64E04@cs.strath.ac.uk> <199904081837.MAA28461@mt.sri.com> <370D039D.FC2D907A@softweyr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Wes > Other than that, I have no help to offer. Do you know for sure where it > dies? I tracked down the problem in fxp with some simple printfs, and > then several someones on -hackers pointed out the fix. It does not die. The DMA transfers continue, but there is corruption. There is nothing to add to the driver. The bt848 does all the mastering itself. It takes control of the bus and does the transfer all by itself, for every video frame received. Bye Roger -- Roger Hardiman Strathclyde Uni Telepresence Research Group, Glasgow, Scotland. http://telepresence.dmem.strath.ac.uk 0141 548 2897 roger@cs.strath.ac.uk To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 23: 5:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk [130.159.196.126]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52BAE14D7F; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 23:05:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roger@cs.strath.ac.uk) Received: from cs.strath.ac.uk (scary.dmem.strath.ac.uk [130.159.202.5]) by fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA01689 Fri, 9 Apr 1999 07:02:48 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <370D9830.47C3A40B@cs.strath.ac.uk> Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 07:03:28 +0100 From: Roger Hardiman Organization: Strathclyde University X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Nate Williams Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Bt848 corruption since upgrading to 3.1. Has DMA code changed? References: <370CB2DC.709E7CEA@cs.strath.ac.uk> <370CAA37.3645E2B9@softweyr.com> <370CD277.E9A64E04@cs.strath.ac.uk> <199904081837.MAA28461@mt.sri.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Nate > Other than using a magic number of 4, that's almost the same as what's > used in the fxp code. However, that also enables adds 0x2, which has > another meaning. The bt848 driver also enables 0x2. The magic numbers should be changed. I'll do that in the next commit. bye roger To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 8 23:30:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7358155D3; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 23:30:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA76410; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 23:27:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904090627.XAA76410@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Doug Rabson Cc: Roger Hardiman , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Bt848 corruption since upgrading to 3.1. Has DMA code changed? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 08 Apr 1999 20:15:31 BST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 23:27:42 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I don't think there is any problem with the bt848 driver on 3.1 if you guys can't figure out what is the problem just mail me. Do make sure that your driver is the correct version for 3.1 . In the interrupt routine there is a printf for those having problems just uncomment it. The values printed will give a clue as to what the bt848 is being upset about. /* printf( " STATUS %x %x %x \n", dstatus, bktr_status, bt848->risc_count ); */ Amancio To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 0:43:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 281E11510A; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 00:43:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id JAA19069; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 09:41:07 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA04630; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 09:41:07 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 09:41:07 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: Roger Hardiman Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Bt848 corruption since upgrading to 3.1. Has DMA code changed? In-Reply-To: <370CB2DC.709E7CEA@cs.strath.ac.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Several people (including Luigi) have reported that video capture with > the bt848 driver is not working right since they upgraded from 2.2.6 or > 2.2.8 to 3.1-release Just FYI, I've been unable to use video capture all along (w/fxtv), as it never seems to grab anything. Also, fxtv frequently garbles my entire display. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 1:11:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from titan.metropolitan.at (mail.metropolitan.at [195.212.98.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C839114D74 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 01:11:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mladavac@metropolitan.at) Received: by TITAN with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id <2AY77QW6>; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:11:41 +0200 Message-ID: <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D09758F@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at> From: Ladavac Marino To: 'Ollivier Robert' , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: RE: Separate boot partition? Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:05:55 +0200 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > -----Original Message----- > From: Ollivier Robert [SMTP:roberto@keltia.freenix.fr] > Sent: Thursday, April 08, 1999 12:16 AM > To: FreeBSD Hackers > Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? > > According to Ollivier Robert: > > Speaking of HP, their LVM system is cool. Now, that would be a nice > > addition to vinum (please don't look at me, I'm not a FS expert). > > Speaking of HP again, another well-done things in HP-UX is their > packaging > system (swinstall, swpackage and all that). It works well for the > system, > packages and patches and makes building of packages very easy... [ML] Then your definition of easy is very different from mine. As far as I am concerned, HP packaging system is brain dead. The manpage lies, and most of the features mentioned in the page are not implemented. Furthermore, swpackage bails out on the first missing file thus making prototype debugging a PITA. Also, we could not find an easy way to build relocatable packages (which is trivial in SVR4). > I don't know the status of our future packaging system but HP's system > is > very nice, especially compared to SVR4 horrible one. [ML] SVR4 was *much* better than HP in the package make department. /Marino > -- > Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- > roberto@keltia.freenix.fr > FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 4.0-CURRENT #70: Sat Feb 27 09:43:08 CET > 1999 > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 1:19:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (mail.palmerharvey.co.uk [62.172.109.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DF3914D74 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 01:18:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Dom.Mitchell@palmerharvey.co.uk) Received: from ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk (unverified) by mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Fri, 09 Apr 1999 09:16:34 +0100 Received: from voodoo.pandhm.co.uk ([10.100.35.12]) by ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) id GZL8KHQ9; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 09:09:53 +0100 Received: from dom by voodoo.pandhm.co.uk with local (Exim 2.10 #1) id 10VWW9-000Ix6-00; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 09:20:01 +0100 To: Ladavac Marino Cc: 'Ollivier Robert' , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? X-Mailer: nmh-1.0 X-Colour: Green Organization: Palmer & Harvey McLane In-Reply-To: Ladavac Marino's message of "Fri, 09 Apr 1999 10:05:55 +0200" <97A8CA5BF490D211A94F0000F6C2E55D09758F@s-lmh-wi-900.corpnet.at> Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 09:20:01 +0100 From: Dom Mitchell Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 9 April 1999, Ladavac Marino proclaimed: > [ML] SVR4 was *much* better than HP in the package make > department. And it still sucks. :-( I've been packaging lots of freeware utilities for use under Solaris since I've been in this job. I really wouldn't wish this task on anybody. Maybe we should look at rpm ;-) -- Dom Mitchell -- Palmer & Harvey McLane -- Unix Systems Administrator "Value of 2 may go down as well as up" -- FORTRAN programmers manual -- ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. ********************************************************************** To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 1:59:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk [130.159.196.126]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2BAB15000 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 01:59:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roger@cs.strath.ac.uk) Received: from cs.strath.ac.uk (scary.dmem.strath.ac.uk [130.159.202.5]) by fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA04069 Fri, 9 Apr 1999 09:57:21 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <370DC114.E0A81FDE@cs.strath.ac.uk> Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 09:57:56 +0100 From: Roger Hardiman Organization: Strathclyde University X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: dick@tar.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: cc -pthread and -kthread switches Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, What do you think to a new switch for cc? cc has the extra compiler options -pthread and -kthread which invoke the userland pthreads or the kernel threads respectivly. How easy would it be to change this to cc -pthread *New meaning*. It invokes either -uthread or -kthread, depending on a envoronment variable or a setting in a config file (eg /etc/thread_type) cc -uthread use useland threads (what is currently -pthread) cc -kthread use kernel threads I compile pthreaded code on several machines, some uni-processor, some SMP using kthreads and Luoqi's SMP thread patches. It means I could have one makefile, with just the -pthread option, and compile my code on all my machines with the same makefile. Is this even possible? (there is the problem of issuing the -DLINUXTHREAD option alongside -kthread, but perhaps this is already done) Comment please? Bye Roger -- Roger Hardiman Strathclyde Uni Telepresence Research Group, Glasgow, Scotland. http://telepresence.dmem.strath.ac.uk 0141 548 2897 roger@cs.strath.ac.uk To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 2: 7: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from patriot.wipinfo.soft.net (patriot.wipinfo.soft.net [164.164.6.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4AFCE14C21 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 02:06:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ksree@wipinfo.soft.net) Received: from rishabh.wipinfo.soft.net (ksree@rishabh [192.168.2.5]) by patriot.wipinfo.soft.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id OAA09282 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 14:37:12 -0500 (GMT) Received: (from ksree@localhost) by rishabh.wipinfo.soft.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA26119 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 14:40:57 +0530 From: Krishna Sree A Message-Id: <199904090910.OAA26119@rishabh.wipinfo.soft.net> Subject: Regarding TCP/IP testing To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 14:40:56 +0530 (IST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, We have developed our own TCP/IP stack. Now, we are in the stage of testing it. We were wondring how do we go about doing it. Are there any standard test suites for testing TCP/IP ? How do you normally do it ? Do you have your own test suites or use some other tools ? Also, if we want to validate our stack against the corresponding RFCs, how do we go about doing that ? Again, are there any protocol validation tools available ? Thanks a lot. -Krishna To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 2:16: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cimlogic.com.au (cimlog.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.51.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 44A2B15078 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 02:16:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jb@cimlogic.com.au) Received: (from jb@localhost) by cimlogic.com.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id TAA29901; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 19:19:30 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jb) From: John Birrell Message-Id: <199904090919.TAA29901@cimlogic.com.au> Subject: Re: cc -pthread and -kthread switches In-Reply-To: <370DC114.E0A81FDE@cs.strath.ac.uk> from Roger Hardiman at "Apr 9, 1999 9:57:56 am" To: roger@cs.strath.ac.uk (Roger Hardiman) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 19:19:30 +1000 (EST) Cc: dick@tar.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Roger Hardiman wrote: > I compile pthreaded code on several machines, some uni-processor, > some SMP using kthreads and Luoqi's SMP thread patches. > It means I could have one makefile, with just the -pthread option, and > compile my > code on all my machines with the same makefile. > > Is this even possible? > > (there is the problem of issuing the -DLINUXTHREAD option alongside > -kthread, but > perhaps this is already done) > > Comment please? Yuk. Please don't corrupt FreeBSD with Linux. By all means help to make FreeBSD provide a compatibility mode to run Linux executables, but leave FreeBSD as FreeBSD. If people want to _develop_ Linux applications, let the run _Linux_. And for those of us who choose to use _FreeBSD_, allow us to live in a Linux and Microsoft free zone. -- John Birrell - jb@cimlogic.com.au; jb@freebsd.org http://www.cimlogic.com.au/ CIMlogic Pty Ltd, GPO Box 117A, Melbourne Vic 3001, Australia +61 418 353 137 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 2:31:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hda.hda.com (hda-bicnet.bicnet.net [209.244.238.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E69B315000 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 02:31:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dufault@hda.hda.com) Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.hda.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id FAA23160; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 05:21:14 -0400 (EDT) From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199904090921.FAA23160@hda.hda.com> Subject: Re: scheduling queues in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: from Julian Elischer at "Apr 8, 99 06:43:32 pm" To: julian@whistle.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 05:21:14 -0400 (EDT) Cc: dillon@apollo.backplane.com, dg@root.com, dyson@iquest.net, aron@cs.rice.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL25 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Matthew Dillon wrote: > > > > I think it would be useful for 'idle' priority processes, but I agree > > that it would not be useful for any sort of true 'realtime' ( i.e. > > when there is more then one realtime process ). But the existing > > realtime scheduler isn't useful for true realtime either since there > > are no scheduling primitives. > > Before getting too excited by the possibility of a code massacre.. > you should check with Peter Dufault. > I believe some people are using this in production and I have even done so > myself at times. > > One tends to hardly ever need 32 queues in all three categories > (well I haven't) but it's be a bummer to lose the functionality > entirely. > > As I said.. Please make sure you here from Peter D before you act as he's > involved in this sort of thing.. I'm involved with a small medical device company at a critical stage in their business, and I'm the only one there who understands software or digital hardware and that will change only when the "something big" that is happening now finishes happening. I'm pointing this out to explain why I never committed those patches, which I thought were OK, as I know some folks want them badly: 1. I wouldn't have the time to support them properly if there were problems; 2. Bruce didn't like them because they were too invasive, moving things around in the kernel source (and they probably had lots of style bugs). If someone with some spare cycles would like to adopt them then on Sunday I'll get them to patch against -current again, they can then pick them up and run with them. As for scheduling, here is the way I will go when and if I get the time and especially if I get the grant I'm applying for: I'd like to see all scheduling related stuff in one module that can be replaced; To get toward real time I'd extend the concept of scheduling classes and add CPU resources. CPU resources are either multiple CPUS or a time multiplexed CPU with time reserved for real time processes. In this second case you'd essentially have something similar to an SMP kernel running on a single CPU. CPU resources would have a bitmap of permitted scheduling classes that were allowed to be scheduled on them. Multiple scheduling classes eligible to run on a single CPU resource would be ordered by priority, treating them as if they were a single priority queue. A CPU resource running a process marked as "real real time" would signal the process if something happened that wasn't determined to be real time safe. This would include many system calls and handling an interrupt other than a fast interrupt. Fast interrupt related code would be verified to be reentrant. Then in an MP realtime system a process would set everything up, become the scheduling class that had a second CPU dedicated to it and thus become realtime. If your analysis was screwed up or during debugging it would catch the you-screwed-up signal. Anyway, that is what I'll do if I have time. Oh, and transitive closure. Peter -- Peter Dufault (dufault@hda.com) Realtime development, Machine control, HD Associates, Inc. Safety critical systems, Agency approval To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 2:34:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C303A14FCA for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 02:34:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id CAA77141; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 02:31:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904090931.CAA77141@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: John Birrell Cc: roger@cs.strath.ac.uk (Roger Hardiman), dick@tar.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cc -pthread and -kthread switches In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 09 Apr 1999 19:19:30 +1000." <199904090919.TAA29901@cimlogic.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 02:31:52 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi John, I think the idea here is to motivate "someone" to write a kernel threads package and I am not even suggesting that you should because I know that you have contributed much in in this area. Best Regards, Amancio > Roger Hardiman wrote: > > I compile pthreaded code on several machines, some uni-processor, > > some SMP using kthreads and Luoqi's SMP thread patches. > > It means I could have one makefile, with just the -pthread option, and > > compile my > > code on all my machines with the same makefile. > > > > Is this even possible? > > > > (there is the problem of issuing the -DLINUXTHREAD option alongside > > -kthread, but > > perhaps this is already done) > > > > Comment please? > > Yuk. Please don't corrupt FreeBSD with Linux. By all means help to make > FreeBSD provide a compatibility mode to run Linux executables, but leave > FreeBSD as FreeBSD. If people want to _develop_ Linux applications, let > the run _Linux_. And for those of us who choose to use _FreeBSD_, > allow us to live in a Linux and Microsoft free zone. > > -- > John Birrell - jb@cimlogic.com.au; jb@freebsd.org http://www.cimlogic.com.au/ > CIMlogic Pty Ltd, GPO Box 117A, Melbourne Vic 3001, Australia +61 418 353 137 > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 2:40: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF246151C5; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 02:39:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id CAA67981; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 02:37:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Chuck Robey Cc: "David O'Brien" , current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 08 Apr 1999 20:00:10 EDT." Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 02:37:37 -0700 Message-ID: <67979.923650657@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Yeah, I'm serious, I would really like gcj+libgcj, to get java stuff > compiled (non portably) into binaries on FreeBSD. 1. I agree in principle. 2. I'd sort of like to see a second release of this, at least, before we start talking seriously of bringing it into -current. I predict a rapidly changing Doppler on this target. - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 2:49:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cimlogic.com.au (cimlog.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.51.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 611EB1522E for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 02:49:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jb@cimlogic.com.au) Received: (from jb@localhost) by cimlogic.com.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id TAA29982; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 19:53:31 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jb) From: John Birrell Message-Id: <199904090953.TAA29982@cimlogic.com.au> Subject: Re: cc -pthread and -kthread switches In-Reply-To: <199904090931.CAA77141@rah.star-gate.com> from Amancio Hasty at "Apr 9, 1999 2:31:52 am" To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com (Amancio Hasty) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 19:53:30 +1000 (EST) Cc: jb@cimlogic.com.au, roger@cs.strath.ac.uk, dick@tar.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Amancio Hasty wrote: > Hi John, > > I think the idea here is to motivate "someone" to write a kernel threads > package and I am not > even suggesting that you should because I know that you have contributed much > in > in this area. I can understand that, but I would prefer that people contribute to improving FreeBSD instead of trying to make it a poor-man's Linux. -- John Birrell - jb@cimlogic.com.au; jb@freebsd.org http://www.cimlogic.com.au/ CIMlogic Pty Ltd, GPO Box 117A, Melbourne Vic 3001, Australia +61 418 353 137 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 2:54:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A6DDE1522E for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 02:54:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id CAA77298; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 02:52:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904090952.CAA77298@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: John Birrell Cc: roger@cs.strath.ac.uk, dick@tar.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cc -pthread and -kthread switches In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 09 Apr 1999 19:53:30 +1000." <199904090953.TAA29982@cimlogic.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 02:52:07 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Setup a web page perhaps at www.freebsd.org and draw a rough outline of what is required to write a FreeBSD kernel thread package and if possible include existing technical references. This mailing list is the wrong forum to draft or start such projects. Best Regards, Amancio > Amancio Hasty wrote: > > Hi John, > > > > I think the idea here is to motivate "someone" to write a kernel threads > > package and I am not > > even suggesting that you should because I know that you have contributed much > > in > > in this area. > > I can understand that, but I would prefer that people contribute to > improving FreeBSD instead of trying to make it a poor-man's Linux. > > -- > John Birrell - jb@cimlogic.com.au; jb@freebsd.org http://www.cimlogic.com.au/ > CIMlogic Pty Ltd, GPO Box 117A, Melbourne Vic 3001, Australia +61 418 353 137 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 3:55:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rose.niw.com.au (app3022-2.gw.connect.com.au [203.63.119.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1988214D2C for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 03:55:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ian@apdata.com.au) Received: from apdata.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rose.niw.com.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9AC18A3203; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 20:23:06 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <370DDC12.3FDE2ECD@apdata.com.au> Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 20:23:06 +0930 From: Ian West Organization: Applied Data Control X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Amancio Hasty Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Bt848 corruption since upgrading to 3.1. Has DMA code changed? References: <199904090627.XAA76410@rah.star-gate.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Amancio Hasty wrote: > > I don't think there is any problem with the bt848 driver on 3.1 if you guys > can't > figure out what is the problem just mail me. Do make sure that your driver > is the correct version for 3.1 . > > In the interrupt routine there is a printf for those having problems just > uncomment it. > > The values printed will give a clue as to what the bt848 is being upset about. > > /* printf( " STATUS %x %x %x \n", > dstatus, bktr_status, bt848->risc_count ); > */ > > Amancio > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message On a similar but slightly different note, (sorry, you figure prominently in the brooktree driver intro :-) Are you aware of any simple reason why fxtv would end up with the actual image offset on my system ? (Matrox millenium II AGP, running 1400x1120 resolution, 32 bit.) The vertical location seems correct, but the image is almost always on the far right of the screen, not nicely tucked inside the frame. Moving the fxtv frame up and down, the image does track it vertically. Horizontal is completely wrong. I did try at 1600x1200, results were the same. Anything I should try ? Thanks, Ian West To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 3:56: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp1.vnet.net (smtp1.vnet.net [166.82.1.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5CED114D2C; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 03:55:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp1.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id GAA02375; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 06:54:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA18163; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 06:53:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id GAA31643; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 06:53:38 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 06:53:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199904091053.GAA31643@lakes.dignus.com> To: dfr@nlsystems.com, hasty@rah.star-gate.com Subject: Re: Bt848 corruption since upgrading to 3.1. Has DMA code changed? Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG, roger@cs.strath.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <199904090627.XAA76410@rah.star-gate.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > I don't think there is any problem with the bt848 driver on 3.1 if you guys > can't > figure out what is the problem just mail me. Do make sure that your driver > is the correct version for 3.1 . > > In the interrupt routine there is a printf for those having problems just > uncomment it. > > The values printed will give a clue as to what the bt848 is being upset about. > > > > /* printf( " STATUS %x %x %x \n", > dstatus, bktr_status, bt848->risc_count ); > */ > > Amancio > Well - there's some problem.. when I run the TV ap for awhile, the machine will lock up (interestingly enough, sound from the bt848 is still pumping out the of the speakers :-) ) Everything is hung solid. (Ping doesn't answer...) This has been the case since the driver that came out with 2.2.7. (Running in 2.2.5 with whatever driver was there didn't have this problem.) That may not, however, be a problem in the bt848 - but a problem elsewhere (say, X11, the kernel, etc... it could be almost anywhere.) - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 4: 8:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 07FB014D2C; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 04:08:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id KAA00742; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:47:48 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199904090847.KAA00742@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Bt848 corruption since upgrading to 3.1. Has DMA code changed? To: rivers@dignus.com (Thomas David Rivers) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:47:48 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: dfr@nlsystems.com, hasty@rah.star-gate.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG, roger@cs.strath.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <199904091053.GAA31643@lakes.dignus.com> from "Thomas David Rivers" at Apr 9, 99 06:53:19 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 300 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Well - there's some problem.. when I run the TV ap for awhile, the > machine will lock up (interestingly enough, sound from the bt848 is > still pumping out the of the speakers :-) ) Everything is hung solid. audio works because it only goes through the mixer -- no processing involved. luigi To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 4:16: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cimlogic.com.au (cimlog.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.51.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EBAC414F9B; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 04:15:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jb@cimlogic.com.au) Received: (from jb@localhost) by cimlogic.com.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id VAA00259; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 21:19:17 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jb) From: John Birrell Message-Id: <199904091119.VAA00259@cimlogic.com.au> Subject: Re: Bt848 corruption since upgrading to 3.1. Has DMA code changed? In-Reply-To: <199904090847.KAA00742@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from Luigi Rizzo at "Apr 9, 1999 10:47:48 am" To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 21:19:17 +1000 (EST) Cc: rivers@dignus.com, dfr@nlsystems.com, hasty@rah.star-gate.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG, roger@cs.strath.ac.uk X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > Well - there's some problem.. when I run the TV ap for awhile, the > > machine will lock up (interestingly enough, sound from the bt848 is > > still pumping out the of the speakers :-) ) Everything is hung solid. > > audio works because it only goes through the mixer -- no processing > involved. "sound from the bt848" is probably direct from the PC TV board - nothing to do with the mixer. I plug speakers into the audio socket on my MIRO PC when the pcm driver can't talk to my AME64. -- John Birrell - jb@cimlogic.com.au; jb@freebsd.org http://www.cimlogic.com.au/ CIMlogic Pty Ltd, GPO Box 117A, Melbourne Vic 3001, Australia +61 418 353 137 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 4:21:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp2.vnet.net (smtp2.vnet.net [166.82.1.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F2F414F9B for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 04:21:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp2.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id HAA20915; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 07:20:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA18202; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 07:19:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id HAA31810; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 07:19:03 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 07:19:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199904091119.HAA31810@lakes.dignus.com> To: dick@tar.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, roger@cs.strath.ac.uk Subject: Re: cc -pthread and -kthread switches In-Reply-To: <370DC114.E0A81FDE@cs.strath.ac.uk> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > Hi, > > What do you think to a new switch for cc? > > cc has the extra compiler options -pthread and -kthread which invoke > the userland pthreads or the kernel threads respectivly. > > How easy would it be to change this to > cc -pthread *New meaning*. It invokes either -uthread or -kthread, > depending on a > envoronment variable or a setting in a config file (eg > /etc/thread_type) > > cc -uthread use useland threads (what is currently -pthread) > cc -kthread use kernel threads > In general, having _external_ influences on options (e.g. an environment variable) is not a good idea, IMHO. The problem is the build works fine for you, then someone else runs what he thinks is the *exact same build* and it doesn't work... The answer is: "Oh yeah, did you check XXXX, or YYYY, and some other thingy I set on my system last year but forgot about." I've "been there, done that" - it doesn't work out well in the long run. If you would like to change your own build environment/makefile, you could do something like: PTHREAD=-pthread -or- PTHREAD=-kthread then cc $PTHREAD .... then, you would be setting your own environment variable... that's easy to do without changing cc. Or, you could do something like: PTHREAD=`cat etc/thread_type` ... cc $PTHREAD ... which implements your second example. Why is this better? There's no "hidden" magic here... it's obvious in either case that the environment variable PTHREAD matters to the build. - Just my thoughts - - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 4:23:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp1.vnet.net (smtp1.vnet.net [166.82.1.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5C2814F9B; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 04:23:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp1.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id HAA03698; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 07:22:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA18212; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 07:21:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id HAA31833; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 07:21:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 07:21:27 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199904091121.HAA31833@lakes.dignus.com> To: jb@cimlogic.com.au, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it Subject: Re: Bt848 corruption since upgrading to 3.1. Has DMA code changed? Cc: dfr@nlsystems.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, hasty@rah.star-gate.com, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG, rivers@dignus.com, roger@cs.strath.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <199904091119.VAA00259@cimlogic.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > > Well - there's some problem.. when I run the TV ap for awhile, the > > > machine will lock up (interestingly enough, sound from the bt848 is > > > still pumping out the of the speakers :-) ) Everything is hung solid. > > > > audio works because it only goes through the mixer -- no processing > > involved. > > "sound from the bt848" is probably direct from the PC TV board - nothing > to do with the mixer. I plug speakers into the audio socket on my > MIRO PC when the pcm driver can't talk to my AME64. > In my case, I believe it's going through the mixer... I was just remarking on how strange it "feels" for the TV to still be playing sound when nothing else is working. It's readily understood, just feels "odd" (sorta like a dead man talking...) :-) - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 4:30:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from snowcrash.cymru.net (snowcrash.cymru.net [163.164.160.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F02E14E61 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 04:30:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk) Received: from the-village.bc.nu (lightning.swansea.uk.linux.org [194.168.151.1]) by snowcrash.cymru.net (8.8.7/8.7.1) with SMTP id MAA19447; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 12:28:04 +0100 Received: by the-village.bc.nu (Smail3.1.29.1 #2) id m10VaHk-0007TvC; Fri, 9 Apr 99 13:21 BST Message-Id: From: alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk (Alan Cox) Subject: Re: linux recvfrom differencies To: fygrave@tigerteam.net (CyberPsychotic) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 13:21:24 +0100 (BST) Cc: linux-c-programming@tower.itis.com, linux-kernel@vger.rutgers.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "CyberPsychotic" at Apr 9, 99 09:22:14 am Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > back) linux returns -1 for next recvfrom with herrno(?) set to REFUSED, > while BSD/Solaris just ignore this. > > The question is: > is there any paper/RFC/FYI which puts a standard on such things, or this is > basically `the matter of taste' of OS developers, and thus just should being > watched carefully, while developing multi-platform applications? RFC1122 requires that icmp errors get back to the application. POSIX 1003.1g was written by people who didn't read the RFC. Now that 1003.1g is basically completed we finally have scope for a spec that means something. Linux quite intentionally has #ifdef SO_BSDCOMPAT int one=1; setsockopt(socket_fd, SOL_SOCKET, SO_BSDCOMPAT, &one, sizeof(one)); #endif so you can force the relevant BSDisms. Unfortunately despite repeated requests to the glibc team it appears this is _still_ not being set by glibc when you compile with -D__BSD_SOURCE. Alan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 4:57:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from eltex.ru (ELTEX-2-SPIIRAS.nw.ru [195.19.204.46]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E3D314FD2 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 04:57:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from antuan@eltex.ru) Received: from gadget.eltex.ru (root@gadget.eltex.ru [195.19.198.14]) by eltex.ru (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id PAA28989 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 15:55:05 +0400 (MSD) Received: by gadget.eltex.ru (ssmtp TIS-0.5alpha, 19 Oct 1998); Fri, 9 Apr 1999 15:54:55 +0400 Received: from undisclosed-intranet-sender id xma026318; Fri, 9 Apr 99 15:54:53 +0400 Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 15:59:49 +0400 (MSD) From: Antuan Avdioukhine To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG People, Can anyone guide me how to organize environment for building kernels for mixed FreeBSD version on single machine? I'd tried to do such thing on 3.0-RELEASE machine for 2.2.6 version, but it failed. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 5:10:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk [130.159.196.126]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73E4814FD3 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 05:10:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roger@cs.strath.ac.uk) Received: from cs.strath.ac.uk (scary.dmem.strath.ac.uk [130.159.202.5]) by fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA07891 Fri, 9 Apr 1999 13:08:29 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <370DEDE5.ACFA4F13@cs.strath.ac.uk> Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 13:09:09 +0100 From: Roger Hardiman Organization: Strathclyde University X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Thomas David Rivers Cc: dick@tar.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cc -pthread and -kthread switches References: <199904091119.HAA31810@lakes.dignus.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Thomas Or, you could do something like: > > PTHREAD=`cat etc/thread_type` > ... > cc $PTHREAD ... > > which implements your second example. Ok, that looks like a good idea. Thanks. Bye Roger To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 5:13:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk [130.159.196.126]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B9C714FD3 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 05:13:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roger@cs.strath.ac.uk) Received: from cs.strath.ac.uk (scary.dmem.strath.ac.uk [130.159.202.5]) by fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA07946 Fri, 9 Apr 1999 13:10:28 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <370DEE5D.53FF9FB7@cs.strath.ac.uk> Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 13:11:09 +0100 From: Roger Hardiman Organization: Strathclyde University X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Amancio Hasty Cc: John Birrell , dick@tar.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cc -pthread and -kthread switches References: <199904090931.CAA77141@rah.star-gate.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG John Amancio was right. This is a Native FreeBSD Kernel Thread issue. I'm not trying to make us into Linux or corrput FreeBSD in any way. Richard (dick@lt.tar.com) has done a great job of getting native FreeBSD kernel threads running on FreeBSD, by porting the linuxthreads (linux ptheads) library to be a Native FreeBSD library. You can take pthreaded code and make it run over both CPUs in my SMP machine using Dicks port of linuxthreads to native freebsd and Luoqi's SMP patches. Userland pthreads make no use of SMP machines at all. The -DLINUXTHREADs is only there to specify the right pthread header files. (If I build userland pthreads, I want the normal header files) (If I build Kernel pthreads, I need different header files, selected by -DLINUXTHREADS) Perhaps it should have been called -DKERNELTHREDS if that makes you feel better. > I think the idea here is to motivate "someone" to write a kernel threads That is what Dick is trying to do. Take a look at http://lt.tar.com > > Yuk. Please don't corrupt FreeBSD with Linux. > > And for those of us who choose to use _FreeBSD_, > > allow us to live in a Linux and Microsoft free zone. I _want_ to run FreeBSD. For years I've been tempted to switch to Linux for SMP pthreads. FreeBSD seems to be in the stone age here. All I want is to use the kernel threads code Dick has produced. And I was looking at perhaps a change to the cc switches to make it easier to select kernel threads or userland threads. Roger To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 5:13:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nomad.dataplex.net (nomad.dataplex.net [216.140.184.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42D5315191 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 05:13:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rkw@dataplex.net) Received: from localhost (rkw@localhost) by nomad.dataplex.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id HAA03471; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 07:10:45 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from rkw@dataplex.net) X-Authentication-Warning: nomad.dataplex.net: rkw owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 07:10:45 -0500 (CDT) From: Richard Wackerbarth Reply-To: rkw@dataplex.net To: Roger Hardiman Cc: dick@tar.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cc -pthread and -kthread switches In-Reply-To: <370DC114.E0A81FDE@cs.strath.ac.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Too many switches already. These things should be abstracted and set by make variables high in the make tree. On Fri, 9 Apr 1999, Roger Hardiman wrote: > Hi, > > What do you think to a new switch for cc? > > cc has the extra compiler options -pthread and -kthread which invoke > the userland pthreads or the kernel threads respectivly. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 5:38:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fep03-svc.tin.it (mta03-acc.tin.it [212.216.176.34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F2AE150E8 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 05:38:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from paipai@box4.tin.it) Received: from harlock ([212.216.239.43]) by fep03-svc.tin.it (InterMail v4.0 201-221-105) with SMTP id <19990409123634.EGBS23771.fep03-svc@harlock> for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 14:36:34 +0200 From: "Paolo Di Francesco" To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 14:39:28 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: UDI X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01d) Message-Id: <19990409123634.EGBS23771.fep03-svc@harlock> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG anyone implementing, thinking about Uniform Driver Interface? How could an UDI driver ported on a not-i386 platform? (Easly, difficuiltly?) Ciao Ciao Paolo Di Francesco _ ->B<- All Recycled Bytes Message ... ~ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 6:37:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from thelab.hub.org (nat192.236.mpoweredpc.net [142.177.192.236]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C0EC151E1; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 06:37:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from scrappy@hub.org) Received: from localhost (scrappy@localhost) by thelab.hub.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id KAA10678; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:35:47 -0300 (ADT) (envelope-from scrappy@hub.org) X-Authentication-Warning: thelab.hub.org: scrappy owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:35:43 -0300 (ADT) From: The Hermit Hacker To: Joe Abley Cc: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , obrien@NUXI.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: <19990409131824.A52442@clear.co.nz> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 9 Apr 1999, Joe Abley wrote: > On Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 03:16:41AM +0200, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > "David O'Brien" writes: > > > I've only heard back from 4 folks about adding EGCS's g77 to the base > > > system -- all 4 said "yes". Unless I get more feedback, I will add g77 > > > to the base system this weekend. > > > > I beg your pardon? You're adding g77 to the system because you know of > > four people who would find it useful? Where's the logic in that? > > > > If you do add it to the base system, make it optional. I don't care if > > it defaults to on, as long as I have the option to turn it off. > > Oh good lord, not again. I have to agree here...I personally know noone that actually uses Fortran...having it as an option to turn off would be nice...one less thing to compile on a buildworld... I personally liked the whole ports concept... Marc G. Fournier ICQ#7615664 IRC Nick: Scrappy Systems Administrator @ hub.org primary: scrappy@hub.org secondary: scrappy@{freebsd|postgresql}.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 6:40: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from thelab.hub.org (nat192.236.mpoweredpc.net [142.177.192.236]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D32BD151EA; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 06:39:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from scrappy@hub.org) Received: from localhost (scrappy@localhost) by thelab.hub.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id KAA10682; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:37:55 -0300 (ADT) (envelope-from scrappy@hub.org) X-Authentication-Warning: thelab.hub.org: scrappy owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:37:55 -0300 (ADT) From: The Hermit Hacker To: Brian Handy Cc: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , obrien@NUXI.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Brian Handy wrote: > On 9 Apr 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > >> [4 people said "YES! Add g77!"] > > >I beg your pardon? You're adding g77 to the system because you know of > >four people who would find it useful? Where's the logic in that? > > Well, statistically speaking, that's a bunch of "ayes" and no "noes". > Lots of things happen via implicit acceptance. (I was one of the people > who spoke up in favor of this after David mentioned this.) > > >If you do add it to the base system, make it optional. I don't care if > >it defaults to on, as long as I have the option to turn it off. > > This doesn't seem unreasonable. (I also really like Chuck's idea of > adding gcj in the same light.) Geez, and I used to think it was only the commercial OSs that had a problem with bloat and creeping featurisms ... :( Chuck's idea makes more sense...how many programs does the average system run that needs a fortran compiler? *raised eyebrow* Marc G. Fournier ICQ#7615664 IRC Nick: Scrappy Systems Administrator @ hub.org primary: scrappy@hub.org secondary: scrappy@{freebsd|postgresql}.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 6:47: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C880815187 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 06:47:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.2/8.9.1) id PAA97277; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 15:44:48 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: Pavlin Ivanov Radoslavov Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: IGMP membership report not received by mrouted References: <199904090335.UAA23923@hugo.usc.edu> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 09 Apr 1999 15:44:47 +0200 In-Reply-To: Pavlin Ivanov Radoslavov's message of "Thu, 08 Apr 1999 20:35:53 -0700" Message-ID: Lines: 15 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Pavlin Ivanov Radoslavov writes: > If I start mrouted (3.9-beta3+IOS12), mrouted cannot see the IGMP > membership reports. If I start tcpdump on the interface with > receivers, then mrouted can see the IGMP membership reports!! > No other mrouted running on neighbor machines. Starting tcpdump puts the interface in promiscuous mode. It sounds to me like a) the NIC driver is incorrectly discarding multicast packets when not in promiscuous mode, or b) mrouted uses bpf but forgets to put the interface in promiscuous mode. I'm not familiar with mrouted, but my take is that b) is the likeliest scenario. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 6:59: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from shale.csir.co.za (shale.csir.co.za [146.64.46.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02AD815285; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 06:58:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from reg@shale.csir.co.za) Received: (from reg@localhost) by shale.csir.co.za (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA05783; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 15:52:58 +0200 (SAT) (envelope-from reg) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 15:52:58 +0200 From: Jeremy Lea To: The Hermit Hacker Cc: Brian Handy , Dag-Erling Smorgrav , obrien@NUXI.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. Message-ID: <19990409155258.A3791@shale.csir.co.za> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: ; from The Hermit Hacker on Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 10:37:55AM -0300 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, On Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 10:37:55AM -0300, The Hermit Hacker wrote: > Geez, and I used to think it was only the commercial OSs that had a > problem with bloat and creeping featurisms ... :( Chuck's idea makes more > sense...how many programs does the average system run that needs a fortran > compiler? *raised eyebrow* I always thought the criteria for inclusion of things into the base system was: 1. Needed for 'make world'; 2. Needed to get a basic functioning server up and running; 3. Something usefull only within FreeBSD (like the kernel ;), or 4. Can't be effectively built outside of /usr/src. If {g77|f77} can be built as a port, using the system EGCS, then to port's it goes. Otherwise why don't we include the Top 20 ports, or maybe the Top 25, or... Regards, -Jeremy -- | "I could be anything I wanted to, but one things true --+-- Never gonna be as big as Jesus, never gonna hold the world in my hand | Never gonna be as big as Jesus, never gonna build a promised land | But that's, that's all right, OK with me..." -Audio Adrenaline To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 7: 1:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from stennis.ca.sandia.gov (stennis.ca.sandia.gov [146.246.243.44]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2EE515285 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 07:01:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bmah@stennis.ca.sandia.gov) Received: (from bmah@localhost) by stennis.ca.sandia.gov (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA08806; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 06:59:34 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904091359.GAA08806@stennis.ca.sandia.gov> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: Pavlin Ivanov Radoslavov , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: IGMP membership report not received by mrouted In-Reply-To: Your message of "09 Apr 1999 15:44:47 +0200." From: bmah@CA.Sandia.GOV (Bruce A. Mah) Reply-To: bmah@CA.Sandia.GOV X-Face: g~c`.{#4q0"(V*b#g[i~rXgm*w;:nMfz%_RZLma)UgGN&=j`5vXoU^@n5v4:OO)c["!w)nD/!!~e4Sj7LiT'6*wZ83454H""lb{CC%T37O!!'S$S&D}sem7I[A 2V%N&+ X-Url: http://www.ca.sandia.gov/~bmah/ Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="==_Exmh_98576044P"; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 06:59:34 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --==_Exmh_98576044P Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii If memory serves me right, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > Pavlin Ivanov Radoslavov writes: > > If I start mrouted (3.9-beta3+IOS12), mrouted cannot see the IGMP > > membership reports. If I start tcpdump on the interface with > > receivers, then mrouted can see the IGMP membership reports!! > > No other mrouted running on neighbor machines. > > Starting tcpdump puts the interface in promiscuous mode. It sounds to > me like a) the NIC driver is incorrectly discarding multicast packets > when not in promiscuous mode, or b) mrouted uses bpf but forgets to > put the interface in promiscuous mode. I'm not familiar with mrouted, > but my take is that b) is the likeliest scenario. To the best of my knowledge, mrouted doesn't use BPF, but a variant of a) seems pretty likely. mrouted needs the NICs to be in promiscuous mode because it needs to be able to receive packets for arbitrary multicast groups without having to explicitly join them (at the MAC layer level). Pavlin, I don't mean to insult you, but did you remember to put: options MROUTING in the kernel configuration of your FreeBSD machine? I'm not sure what would happen if you forget to do this, but I'm pretty sure the machine isn't going to do what you want... Bruce. PS. I could be wrong...I haven't had any caffeine yet this morning. --==_Exmh_98576044P Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP MESSAGE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBNw4HxajOOi0j7CY9AQHWxAP9F4X0oIolw0big/VuG6xWyWC7al+coXlS rUsS/8IImmJ0dXjUKnpy4Cl99AGvYpmZ4hyg6MBy23/V2PyyXZvITdxxbujub4C1 vAn1Fdnb02FvkWghicNAxBuJ1lO1Qx4cV352Pnz0JQFSr2vZgDxyJZZw18iKpQsK pSrBdpTuhjU= =a2ae -----END PGP MESSAGE----- --==_Exmh_98576044P-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 7: 3:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp2.vnet.net (smtp2.vnet.net [166.82.1.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40E6E15285; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 07:03:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp2.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id KAA05783; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:02:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA18477; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:01:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id KAA32326; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:01:01 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:01:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199904091401.KAA32326@lakes.dignus.com> To: handy@lambic.physics.montana.edu, scrappy@hub.org Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, des@flood.ping.uio.no, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, obrien@NUXI.com In-Reply-To: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Marc G. Fournier wrote: > On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Brian Handy wrote: > > > On 9 Apr 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > > > >> [4 people said "YES! Add g77!"] > > > > >I beg your pardon? You're adding g77 to the system because you know of > > >four people who would find it useful? Where's the logic in that? > > > > Well, statistically speaking, that's a bunch of "ayes" and no "noes". > > Lots of things happen via implicit acceptance. (I was one of the people > > who spoke up in favor of this after David mentioned this.) > > > > >If you do add it to the base system, make it optional. I don't care if > > >it defaults to on, as long as I have the option to turn it off. > > > > This doesn't seem unreasonable. (I also really like Chuck's idea of > > adding gcj in the same light.) > > Geez, and I used to think it was only the commercial OSs that had a > problem with bloat and creeping featurisms ... :( Chuck's idea makes more > sense...how many programs does the average system run that needs a fortran > compiler? *raised eyebrow* Personally, I'm not sure g77 is needed, but let me play devil's advocate here and turn your question around: "How many programs does the average system not run because the system doesn't have a FORTRAN compiler?" That seems to be a more pertinent question... and - a good bit more difficult to answer. - Dave Rivers - (My personal preference is to put it in there, with an option to disable it in "make world". ) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 7:17: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from shale.csir.co.za (shale.csir.co.za [146.64.46.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C264C14FBC for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 07:16:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from reg@shale.csir.co.za) Received: (from reg@localhost) by shale.csir.co.za (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA06021; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 16:12:03 +0200 (SAT) (envelope-from reg) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 16:12:03 +0200 From: Jeremy Lea To: Roger Hardiman Cc: dick@tar.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cc -pthread and -kthread switches Message-ID: <19990409161203.B3791@shale.csir.co.za> References: <370DC114.E0A81FDE@cs.strath.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <370DC114.E0A81FDE@cs.strath.ac.uk>; from Roger Hardiman on Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 09:57:56AM +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, I've spoken about this before, but I'll throw my ideas in again. On Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 09:57:56AM +0100, Roger Hardiman wrote: > cc -uthread use useland threads (what is currently -pthread) > cc -kthread use kernel threads This could break anything using -pthread. Something like this: cc -pthread - links with '-lc_r' and defines -D_THREAD_SAFE. cc -kthread - links with '-lpthread -lc' and defines -D_THREAD_SAFE and -DLINUXTHREADS. would really make porting applications a lot easier. If anyone does conjure up the magic 'FreeBSD kernel threads' it can replace -kthread, and the LinuxThreads can either die or be moved to -lthread (or if a -l?? option isn't workable -xthread) I still feel that Richard's LinuxThreads port belongs in the base system and not in Ports. I looked at it, and it shouldn't be to difficult to 'contribify'. If you haven't looked, the poor port has to go rumaging around in /usr/src to find half of it's source files. This is a reciepe for disaster. Maybe the Linux threads should go straight to -lthread or -xthread, with library names 'liblthread' and headers in /usr/include/pthread/lthread'. That leaves 'kthread' open. -xthread sounds like something which is going to leave soon... Regards, -Jeremy -- | "I could be anything I wanted to, but one things true --+-- Never gonna be as big as Jesus, never gonna hold the world in my hand | Never gonna be as big as Jesus, never gonna build a promised land | But that's, that's all right, OK with me..." -Audio Adrenaline To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 7:51: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from iquest3.iquest.net (iquest3.iquest.net [209.43.20.203]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 2E58B1548A for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 07:50:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from toor@dyson.iquest.net) Received: (qmail 5001 invoked from network); 9 Apr 1999 14:48:56 -0000 Received: from dyson.iquest.net (198.70.144.127) by iquest3.iquest.net with SMTP; 9 Apr 1999 14:48:56 -0000 Received: (from root@localhost) by dyson.iquest.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) id JAA08463; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 09:48:53 -0500 (EST) From: "John S. Dyson" Message-Id: <199904091448.JAA08463@dyson.iquest.net> Subject: Re: scheduling queues in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <199904090921.FAA23160@hda.hda.com> from Peter Dufault at "Apr 9, 99 05:21:14 am" To: dufault@hda.com (Peter Dufault) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 09:48:53 -0500 (EST) Cc: julian@whistle.com, dillon@apollo.backplane.com, dg@root.com, dyson@iquest.net, aron@cs.rice.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL32 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Matthew Dillon wrote: > > > > > > I think it would be useful for 'idle' priority processes, but I agree > > > that it would not be useful for any sort of true 'realtime' ( i.e. > > > when there is more then one realtime process ). But the existing > > > realtime scheduler isn't useful for true realtime either since there > > > are no scheduling primitives. > > > > Before getting too excited by the possibility of a code massacre.. > > you should check with Peter Dufault. > > I believe some people are using this in production and I have even done so > > myself at times. > > > > One tends to hardly ever need 32 queues in all three categories > > (well I haven't) but it's be a bummer to lose the functionality > > entirely. > > > > As I said.. Please make sure you here from Peter D before you act as he's > > involved in this sort of thing.. > > > I'm pointing this out to explain why I never committed those patches, > which I thought were OK, as I know some folks want them badly: > I didn't see everything that you did, but everything that I saw, I liked... just FWIW. John To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 14:32:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.tar.com (ns.tar.com [204.95.187.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62CA915E06 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 13:52:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dick@ns.tar.com) Received: (from dick@localhost) by ns.tar.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA34108; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:42:33 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dick) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:42:32 -0500 From: "Richard Seaman, Jr." To: Jeremy Lea Cc: Roger Hardiman , dick@tar.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cc -pthread and -kthread switches Message-ID: <19990409114232.S440@tar.com> References: <370DC114.E0A81FDE@cs.strath.ac.uk> <19990409161203.B3791@shale.csir.co.za> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <19990409161203.B3791@shale.csir.co.za>; from Jeremy Lea on Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 04:12:03PM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 04:12:03PM +0200, Jeremy Lea wrote: > I've spoken about this before, but I'll throw my ideas in again. [snip] > I still feel that Richard's LinuxThreads port belongs in the base system > and not in Ports. I looked at it, and it shouldn't be to difficult to > 'contribify'. Agreed. The only issue is that I've heard a number of people argue against this. That's why its been structured as a port. > If you haven't looked, the poor port has to go rumaging > around in /usr/src to find half of it's source files. This is a reciepe > for disaster. I agree its an ugly port. > Maybe the Linux threads should go straight to -lthread or -xthread, with > library names 'liblthread' and headers in /usr/include/pthread/lthread'. > That leaves 'kthread' open. -xthread sounds like something which is > going to leave soon... The library names currently are liblthread, and libpthread is installed as a soft link to liblthread, provided libpthread doesn't already exist. -- Richard Seaman, Jr. email: dick@tar.com 5182 N. Maple Lane phone: 414-367-5450 Chenequa WI 53058 fax: 414-367-5852 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 14:32:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.tar.com (ns.tar.com [204.95.187.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 87F0615E20 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 13:52:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dick@ns.tar.com) Received: (from dick@localhost) by ns.tar.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA96890; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:14:09 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dick) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:14:09 -0500 From: "Richard Seaman, Jr." To: Peter Dufault Cc: Julian Elischer , dillon@apollo.backplane.com, dg@root.com, dyson@iquest.net, aron@cs.rice.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: scheduling queues in FreeBSD Message-ID: <19990409101409.O440@tar.com> References: <199904090921.FAA23160@hda.hda.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904090921.FAA23160@hda.hda.com>; from Peter Dufault on Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 05:21:14AM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 05:21:14AM -0400, Peter Dufault wrote: > I'm pointing this out to explain why I never committed those patches, > which I thought were OK, as I know some folks want them badly: > > 1. I wouldn't have the time to support them properly if there were > problems; > > 2. Bruce didn't like them because they were too invasive, moving > things around in the kernel source (and they probably had lots of > style bugs). > > If someone with some spare cycles would like to adopt them then on > Sunday I'll get them to patch against -current again, they can then > pick them up and run with them. As you know, I did quite a bit of testing of these patches as they were under development, and they worked fine, and solved lots of problems. I'm not using them at the moment, as they don't seem to apply cleanly anymore. If you post updated patches, I'd happily volunteer to test them again. Or, if you're short of time, I'd even volunteer to try to fix them so they apply cleanly. If a few others would then try them out, and if there are no problems, maybe someone would be willing to commit them to -current? -- Richard Seaman, Jr. email: dick@tar.com 5182 N. Maple Lane phone: 414-367-5450 Chenequa WI 53058 fax: 414-367-5852 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 14:32:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.tar.com (ns.tar.com [204.95.187.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB40F15C88 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 13:52:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dick@ns.tar.com) Received: (from dick@localhost) by ns.tar.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA27356; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:57:33 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dick) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:57:32 -0500 From: "Richard Seaman, Jr." To: John Birrell Cc: Roger Hardiman , Julian Elischer , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cc -pthread and -kthread switches Message-ID: <19990409105732.Q440@tar.com> References: <370DC114.E0A81FDE@cs.strath.ac.uk> <199904090919.TAA29901@cimlogic.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904090919.TAA29901@cimlogic.com.au>; from John Birrell on Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 07:19:30PM +1000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 07:19:30PM +1000, John Birrell wrote: > Yuk. Please don't corrupt FreeBSD with Linux. By all means help to make > FreeBSD provide a compatibility mode to run Linux executables, but leave > FreeBSD as FreeBSD. If people want to _develop_ Linux applications, let > the run _Linux_. And for those of us who choose to use _FreeBSD_, > allow us to live in a Linux and Microsoft free zone. The linuxthreads "port" is simply intended to provide native FreeBSD one-to-one kernel threads. It isn't Linux. Its just a port of some Linux code. My position is, and has always been, that the existence of the port is intended as a stop-gap measure until FreeBSD has its own kernel threads code. When that happens, I would asssume the need for the port would evaporate, and certainly my support of it would evaporate. You and I have corresponded privately, and I have offered my assistance in creating a FreeBSD kernel threads implementation. As I have indicated to you, as well as to Julian, I don't think I'm the right person to lead this effort, since there are technical issues involved with "many-to-many" kernel threads that I don't fully understand how to resolve, yet. But, I'd certainly be willing to be an active contributor to this project. On another note, the recent changes to the FreeBSD user pthreads code, which you committed on about March 22, appears to be a major improvement in this code. On my very crude benchmarks, the linuxthreads port used to beat the heck out of the uthread code. This is no longer true. Most tests show them about equal, except that uthread context switches are now much faster than the linuxthreads code, as they should be (before March 22 uthread was slower). It strikes me that the uthread code seems to be in pretty good shape now, and would be a nice foundation for a FreeBSD kernel threads implementation. -- Richard Seaman, Jr. email: dick@tar.com 5182 N. Maple Lane phone: 414-367-5450 Chenequa WI 53058 fax: 414-367-5852 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 14:35:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from phoenix.volant.org (phoenix.volant.org [205.179.79.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82FD515035; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 14:32:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from patl@phoenix.volant.org) Received: from asimov.phoenix.volant.org ([205.179.79.65]) by phoenix.volant.org with smtp (Exim 1.92 #8) id 10VhRJ-0001dz-00; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 12:59:45 -0700 Received: from localhost by asimov.phoenix.volant.org (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id MAA10768; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 12:59:33 -0700 Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 12:59:33 -0700 (PDT) From: patl@phoenix.volant.org Reply-To: patl@phoenix.volant.org Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. To: Jeremy Lea Cc: The Hermit Hacker , Brian Handy , Dag-Erling Smorgrav , obrien@NUXI.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19990409155258.A3791@shale.csir.co.za> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I always thought the criteria for inclusion of things into the base > system was: > > 1. Needed for 'make world'; > 2. Needed to get a basic functioning server up and running; > 3. Something usefull only within FreeBSD (like the kernel ;), or > 4. Can't be effectively built outside of /usr/src. > > If {g77|f77} can be built as a port, using the system EGCS, then to > port's it goes. Otherwise why don't we include the Top 20 ports, or > maybe the Top 25, or... The criteria for adding something to the base system is different than the criteria for removing something from it. In both cases, it requires compelling reasons to change the status quo. Replacing an existing component is somewhat easier, particularly if backwards compatability is retained. I may be mistaken, but I believe the current discussion is whether or not to replace f77 with g77. -Pat To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 14:40:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (osmium.gn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA6B61631A for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 14:37:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wilko@yedi.iaf.nl) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (8.9.2/8.9.2) with UUCP id SAA16995; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 18:19:26 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.8.8/8.6.12) id SAA12245; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 18:11:16 +0200 (CEST) From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199904091611.SAA12245@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? In-Reply-To: <19990409111503.Y2142@lemis.com> from Greg Lehey at "Apr 9, 1999 11:15: 3 am" To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 18:11:16 +0200 (CEST) Cc: dcs@newsguy.com, roberto@keltia.freenix.fr, hackers@freebsd.org X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem, The Netherlands X-pgp-info: PGP public key at 'finger wilko@freefall.freebsd.org' X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As Greg Lehey wrote ... > On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 19:28:22 +0200, Wilko Bulte wrote: > > As Greg Lehey wrote ... > >> On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 8:35:32 +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > >>> Ollivier Robert wrote: > >>>> > >>>> You have Physical Volumes, grouped into Volume Groups, each Volume Group > >>>> is divided into Logical Volumes and a LV can contain a filesystem. A given > >>>> filesystem is extendable within a LV and you can enlarge a LV. > >>> > >>> Mirroring can be set at VG level, either synchronous or > >>> assynchronous. > >> > >> Vinum doesn't do asynchronous mirroring. I suppose it will have to > >> when I introduce remote mirroring. > > > > Why? Do you want to grow your own SRDF? > > What's that FLAT? SRDF is EMC^2 's implementation of remote data mirroring to enable disaster tolerant sites etc. You need a couple of Symmetrix boxes, can probably be had for a mere 1 M$ or so ;-) www.emc.com probably has a couple of whitepapers on it. Groeten / Cheers, Wilko _ ______________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Arnhem, The Netherlands |/|/ / / /( (_) Bulte WWW : http://www.tcja.nl _______________________ Powered by FreeBSD ___ http://www.freebsd.org _____ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 15: 7:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hda.hda.com (hda-bicnet.bicnet.net [209.244.238.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A85A515CA4 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 14:49:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dufault@hda.hda.com) Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.hda.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA23750; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:48:15 -0400 (EDT) From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199904091548.LAA23750@hda.hda.com> Subject: Re: scheduling queues in FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <19990409101409.O440@tar.com> from "Richard Seaman, Jr." at "Apr 9, 99 10:14:09 am" To: dick@tar.com (Richard Seaman, Jr.) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:48:14 -0400 (EDT) Cc: dufault@hda.com, julian@whistle.com, dillon@apollo.backplane.com, dg@root.com, dyson@iquest.net, aron@cs.rice.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL25 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > As you know, I did quite a bit of testing of these patches as they > were under development, and they worked fine, and solved lots of > problems. I'm not using them at the moment, as they don't seem > to apply cleanly anymore. > > If you post updated patches, I'd happily volunteer to test them > again. Or, if you're short of time, I'd even volunteer to try > to fix them so they apply cleanly. If a few others would then > try them out, and if there are no problems, maybe someone would > be willing to commit them to -current? I'm willing to get them to apply but I'm not going to commit them unless Bruce will sign off on them. Someone may want to redo them using the existing sprinkling of things around the kernel. If I do a lot of work on this I'll want to do it my way and I'll be willing to argue for it. But I'm not going to drop the changes in and then vanish, which unfortunately is likely to happen now. Peter -- Peter Dufault (dufault@hda.com) Realtime development, Machine control, HD Associates, Inc. Safety critical systems, Agency approval To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 15: 7:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wall.polstra.com (rtrwan160.accessone.com [206.213.115.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F70F16005 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 14:57:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Received: from vashon.polstra.com (vashon.polstra.com [206.213.73.13]) by wall.polstra.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA21161; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:07:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) From: John Polstra Received: (from jdp@localhost) by vashon.polstra.com (8.9.2/8.9.1) id LAA67608; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:07:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:07:49 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904091807.LAA67608@vashon.polstra.com> To: antuan@eltex.ru Subject: Re: none In-Reply-To: Organization: Polstra & Co., Seattle, WA Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article , Antuan Avdioukhine wrote: > Can anyone guide me how to organize environment for building kernels > for mixed FreeBSD version on single machine? I'd tried to do such thing on > 3.0-RELEASE machine for 2.2.6 version, but it failed. On a 3.1-stable machine here, I regularly build both worlds and kernels for 2.2.8 machines. Here are the tricks: Assuming that "$SRC" is the top-level "src" directory of your 2.2.x source tree ... 1. Use "make -m $SRC/share/mk" so that make uses the 2.2.x versions of the *.mk files. 2. When configuring kernels, use the 2.2.x version of /sbin/config that you've built. (Find it in the obj tree.) John -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-interest is the aphrodisiac of belief." -- James V. DeLong To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 15: 8:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.54]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B6B5D16065; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 14:58:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) id OAA21686; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 14:17:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sgk) From: Steve Kargl Message-Id: <199904092117.OAA21686@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: <19990409140618.B26149@nuxi.com> from "David O'Brien" at "Apr 9, 1999 02:06:18 pm" To: obrien@NUXI.com Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 14:17:30 -0700 (PDT) Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL54 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG David O'Brien wrote: > > Speaking of ports, I have a working port of f2c and a new > > f77(1) wrapper sitting on my machine. > > I guess naming is going to get sticky here... if f2c has `f77', then *if* > I put egcs/g77 in the main tree, do I install it as `g77' or `f77'? > > The Egcs port installs it as `g77'... and what if someone makes some port > of an updated g77? > I would expect that you'll want to have a symlink from f77 to g77 in /usr/bin. If g77 includes a man page, you'll also want a symlink from f77.1 to g77.1. In the Makefile for the port of my f77 wrapper I have: do-install: ${INSTALL_PROGRAM} ${WRKSRC}/f77 ${PREFIX}/bin ${INSTALL_MAN} ${WRKSRC}/f77.1 ${PREFIX}/man/man1 This could be changed to: do-install: ${INSTALL_PROGRAM} ${WRKSRC}/f77 ${PREFIX}/bin/${F77NAME} ${INSTALL_MAN} ${WRKSRC}/f77.1 ${PREFIX}/man/man1/${F77NAME}.1 where F77NAME would default to fc. Why fc? Because, f2c provides an old Bourne shell script of the same name. -- Steve To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 15: 8:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from symbion.srrc.usda.gov (symbion.srrc.usda.gov [199.133.86.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AB12160A9; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 15:00:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gjohnson@nola.srrc.usda.gov) Received: (from glenn@localhost) by symbion.srrc.usda.gov (8.9.2/8.9.2) id LAA14881; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:28:52 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from glenn) From: Glenn Johnson Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:28:52 -0500 To: Jeremy Lea Cc: The Hermit Hacker , Brian Handy , Dag-Erling Smorgrav , obrien@NUXI.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. Message-ID: <19990409112852.A14614@symbion.srrc.usda.gov> References: <19990409155258.A3791@shale.csir.co.za> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <19990409155258.A3791@shale.csir.co.za>; from Jeremy Lea on Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 03:52:58PM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 03:52:58PM +0200, Jeremy Lea wrote: > Hi, > > On Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 10:37:55AM -0300, The Hermit Hacker wrote: > > Geez, and I used to think it was only the commercial OSs that had a > > problem with bloat and creeping featurisms ... :( Chuck's idea makes more > > sense...how many programs does the average system run that needs a fortran > > compiler? *raised eyebrow* > > I always thought the criteria for inclusion of things into the base > system was: > > 1. Needed for 'make world'; > 2. Needed to get a basic functioning server up and running; > 3. Something usefull only within FreeBSD (like the kernel ;), or > 4. Can't be effectively built outside of /usr/src. > > If {g77|f77} can be built as a port, using the system EGCS, then to > port's it goes. Otherwise why don't we include the Top 20 ports, or > maybe the Top 25, or... > > Regards, > -Jeremy First off, g77 is not your typical port. The build of g77 depends on having the source to gcc on your system. The last time I checked, installing the source was optional. The reason the current port of g77 is marked broken is because of this. History: Newer versions of g77 cannot be built against gcc 2.7.2 and older versions that can be built against gcc 2.7.2 don't work with FreeBSD. This is because the FreeBSD gcc 2.7.2 was hacked too far away from what g77 was developed for. I would expect to see the same type of scenario arise with egcs as the FreeBSD version becomes significantly changed from stock egcs. David has already said that "ports/egcs != src/contrib/egcs". Future: Now it may be true that newer versions of g77 may not build against whatever version of egcs we have but at least we would be guaranteed of having a functional Fortran compiler. Many people don't seem to understand that FreeBSD can be used for workstations as well as servers and Fortran is *essential* on a scientific/engineering workstation. I don't doubt that there are more people using FreeBSD as a server but that doesn't mean that workstation users should be denied an essential tool because it takes up a few hundred kilobytes. I would predict that with SGI's entry into the NT market you will see more people looking at "Unix on Intel" to replace their aging SGI Irix boxes. It would be a shame for them to choose Linux over FreeBSD because Linux can compile their Fortran programs and FreeBSD cannot. -- Glenn Johnson Technician USDA, ARS, SRRC New Orleans, LA To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 15: 8:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6031B16071; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 14:58:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA57494; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 17:24:41 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 17:24:40 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Thomas David Rivers Cc: handy@lambic.physics.montana.edu, scrappy@hub.org, current@FreeBSD.ORG, des@flood.ping.uio.no, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, obrien@NUXI.com Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: <199904091401.KAA32326@lakes.dignus.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 9 Apr 1999, Thomas David Rivers wrote: > > Geez, and I used to think it was only the commercial OSs that had a > > problem with bloat and creeping featurisms ... :( Chuck's idea makes more > > sense...how many programs does the average system run that needs a fortran > > compiler? *raised eyebrow* > > Personally, I'm not sure g77 is needed, but let me play devil's > advocate here and turn your question around: > > "How many programs does the average system not run because > the system doesn't have a FORTRAN compiler?" > > That seems to be a more pertinent question... and - a good bit > more difficult to answer. Not as hard as all that. Just go about compiling from ports/math, and notice how many programs use f2c. Some also from graphics, and from others. Especially when you consider the low cost in terms of source size and executeable size, getting rid of fortran, or not allowing the upgraded fortran, it just doesn't make sense. We have NO_SENDMAIL now as a precedent, we just need NO_FORTRAN and NO_GCJ. This is very, very doable, and can only make FreeBSD look better. OTOH, as Jordan pointed out, maybe we need a *little* more experience with gcj, but fortran, it's ready *now*. ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 15:31:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [204.156.12.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D26BE1525E for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 15:31:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from robert@cyrus.watson.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (robert@fledge.pr.watson.org [192.0.2.3]) by fledge.watson.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id SAA23283 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 18:29:03 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from robert@cyrus.watson.org) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 18:29:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Watson X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org Reply-To: Robert Watson To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Reliable way to clear kernel fs caches? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'm experimenting with some performance-related changes to FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT. Is there some existing nice reliable call that flushes both the buffer cache and name cache (and any other interesting cache) so I can measure performance on initial reads from disk? Thanks in advance, Robert N Watson robert@fledge.watson.org http://www.watson.org/~robert/ PGP key fingerprint: 03 01 DD 8E 15 67 48 73 25 6D 10 FC EC 68 C1 1C Carnegie Mellon University http://www.cmu.edu/ TIS Labs at Network Associates, Inc. http://www.tis.com/ Safeport Network Services http://www.safeport.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 15:38:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mulligatwani.msrl.com (mulligatwani.msrl.com [206.246.79.135]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 81E3214C06 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 15:38:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from shields@msrl.com) Received: (qmail 28850 invoked by uid 1000); 9 Apr 1999 15:29:26 -0000 From: shields@msrl.com (Michael Shields) Organization: Mad Science Research Labs Message-Id: <8790c1x1ao.fsf@mulligatwani.msrl.com> Mail-Copies-To: never To: Chuck Robey Cc: FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: palm-pilot guys References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 7.106) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=NIL Date: 09 Apr 1999 15:29:26 +0000 In-Reply-To: Chuck Robey's message of "Mon, 5 Apr 1999 18:53:33 -0400 (EDT)" Lines: 16 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.6.45/Emacs 20.3 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article , Chuck Robey wrote: > There's options of a 3 pack replacement styluses, leather carrying case > (I think this one's really unneeded, unless they're fragile), modem > cable, AC adaptor (do they use a commonly available voltage, like one I > can get at Radio Shack?) PalmIII cradle windows (this one's a complete > mystery to me), and a HoySync cable for PC. You don't need any of these. It comes with the cradle you need to talk with it over a serial port. The replacement styli aren't needed unless you lose them, and if you do, you can use any object that won't scratch the screen (for example, a capped pen). The modem and its AC adaptor are truly optional. (The AC adaptor is not for the Palmpilot itself; it runs on AAAs.) -- Shields. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 15:40:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mulligatwani.msrl.com (mulligatwani.msrl.com [206.246.79.135]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id E73E414A2F for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 15:40:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from shields@msrl.com) Received: (qmail 28827 invoked by uid 1000); 9 Apr 1999 15:26:33 -0000 From: shields@msrl.com (Michael Shields) Organization: Mad Science Research Labs Message-Id: <87d81dx1dm.fsf@mulligatwani.msrl.com> Mail-Copies-To: never To: Wes Peters Cc: Chuck Robey , FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: palm-pilot guys References: <37098EB1.CED75C36@softweyr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 7.106) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=NIL Date: 09 Apr 1999 15:26:33 +0000 In-Reply-To: Wes Peters's message of "Mon, 05 Apr 1999 22:33:53 -0600" Lines: 13 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.6.45/Emacs 20.3 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article <37098EB1.CED75C36@softweyr.com>, Wes Peters wrote: > If you're looking to save some money, I think the III is identical to > the IIIx except for the screen. No; the IIIx also has 4 MB vs. 2 on the III; and, it has a slightly better CPU (it's faster at some things, and can display 16 grayscales vs. 4 on the III). Another way of looking at it is that a IIIx is a V in a III case, and with 4 MB of RAM. -- Shields. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 16:49:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ewok.creative.net.au (ewok.creative.net.au [203.30.44.41]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 6B02515363 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 16:49:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adrian@freebsd.org) Received: (qmail 14930 invoked by uid 1008); 9 Apr 1999 23:46:36 -0000 Message-ID: <19990409234636.14928.qmail@ewok.creative.net.au> From: adrian@freebsd.org To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 09 Apr 1999 11:28:52 EST." <19990409112852.A14614@symbion.srrc.usda.gov> Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 07:46:36 +0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Glenn Johnson writes: [snip] >hundred kilobytes. I would predict that with SGI's entry into the NT >market you will see more people looking at "Unix on Intel" to replace >their aging SGI Irix boxes. It would be a shame for them to choose >Linux over FreeBSD because Linux can compile their Fortran programs and >FreeBSD cannot. Personally I don't mind either way, however keep this in mind: Most linux systems are so package based anyway that "Linux can compile their Fortran programs and FreeBSD cannot" is equivalent to "you can't read the install documentation" . Hell, I'd be happy to have each type of compiler a tarball and install option there under 'compilers', with C/C++ standard. Then people really can't complain 'ahh but its a package, one package amongst too many..' Adrian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 17:34:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quackerjack.cc.vt.edu (quackerjack.cc.vt.edu [198.82.160.250]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BCAD514BEA for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 17:34:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gemorga2@vt.edu) Received: from sable.cc.vt.edu (sable.cc.vt.edu [128.173.16.30]) by quackerjack.cc.vt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA23324 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 20:32:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gemorga2.campus.vt.edu (gemorga2.campus.vt.edu [198.82.100.219]) by sable.cc.vt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id UAA32515 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 20:32:38 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904100032.UAA32515@sable.cc.vt.edu> From: "George Morgan" To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 20:32:38 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Loader, "3rd Stage"... X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01d) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG What is the purpose of the "Loader" in FreeBSD 3.x (I assume it appeared first in 3.0???) I have helped with several installs and the "loader" never seems to be set up find the root slice... I have reconfigured at least one of those systems in the /boot.config file to use the second level boot program to load from the correct location. Are their plans to document the loader? I plan to set up all systems that I help install to use the second level boot program since this is the only way I know how to do it.. Thank you for your time. George Morgan Virginia Tech Electrical Engineering Class of 2000! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 17:40:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D49A514E04 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 17:40:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA01587; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 17:38:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904100038.RAA01587@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "George Morgan" Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Loader, "3rd Stage"... In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 09 Apr 1999 20:32:38 EDT." <199904100032.UAA32515@sable.cc.vt.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 17:38:09 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > What is the purpose of the "Loader" in FreeBSD 3.x (I assume it > appeared first in 3.0???) > > I have helped with several installs and the "loader" never seems to > be set up find the root slice... I have reconfigured at least one of > those systems in the /boot.config file to use the second level boot > program to load from the correct location. > > Are their plans to document the loader? I plan to set up all > systems that I help install to use the second level boot program > since this is the only way I know how to do it.. You might try the loader(8) manpage, and the online help in the loader. It would help if you actually detailed the problem you're having, I suspect that "help set root_disk_unit" would probably tell you everything you need to know. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 17:52:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pcnet1.pcnet.com (pcnet1.pcnet.com [204.213.232.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3655B15002 for ; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 17:52:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eischen@vigrid.com) Received: (from eischen@localhost) by pcnet1.pcnet.com (8.8.7/PCNet) id UAA14445; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 20:49:52 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 20:49:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Daniel Eischen Message-Id: <199904100049.UAA14445@pcnet1.pcnet.com> To: dick@tar.com, jb@cimlogic.com.au Subject: Re: cc -pthread and -kthread switches Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, julian@whistle.com, roger@cs.strath.ac.uk Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Richard Seaman, Jr. wrote: > You and I have corresponded privately, and I have offered my > assistance in creating a FreeBSD kernel threads implementation. > As I have indicated to you, as well as to Julian, I don't > think I'm the right person to lead this effort, since there > are technical issues involved with "many-to-many" kernel threads > that I don't fully understand how to resolve, yet. But, I'd > certainly be willing to be an active contributor to this > project. Let me add my support for this also. I'm working on changing the select() mechanism that libc_r uses now, to poll. After that, I want to investigate kernel threads. Dan Eischen eischen@vigrid.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 18:40: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from eagle.phc.igs.net (eagle.phc.igs.net [207.210.17.201]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 384961518D; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 18:39:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eagle@eagle.phc.igs.net) Received: from localhost (eagle@localhost) by eagle.phc.igs.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA33242; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 20:29:18 GMT (envelope-from eagle@eagle.phc.igs.net) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 20:29:15 +0000 (GMT) From: eagle To: patl@phoenix.volant.org Cc: Jeremy Lea , The Hermit Hacker , Brian Handy , Dag-Erling Smorgrav , obrien@NUXI.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 9 Apr 1999 patl@phoenix.volant.org wrote: > > I always thought the criteria for inclusion of things into the base > > system was: > > > > 1. Needed for 'make world'; > > 2. Needed to get a basic functioning server up and running; > > 3. Something usefull only within FreeBSD (like the kernel ;), or > > 4. Can't be effectively built outside of /usr/src. > > > > If {g77|f77} can be built as a port, using the system EGCS, then to > > port's it goes. Otherwise why don't we include the Top 20 ports, or > > maybe the Top 25, or... > > The criteria for adding something to the base system is different > than the criteria for removing something from it. In both cases, > it requires compelling reasons to change the status quo. > > Replacing an existing component is somewhat easier, particularly > if backwards compatability is retained. I may be mistaken, but I > believe the current discussion is whether or not to replace f77 > with g77. Didn't we just have this discussion a few months ago??? just put it in the tree already ;) rob To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 9 22:54:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bubba.whistle.com (s205m7.whistle.com [207.76.205.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8AFD14E5C; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 22:54:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from archie@whistle.com) Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.whistle.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id WAA93232; Fri, 9 Apr 1999 22:51:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199904100551.WAA93232@bubba.whistle.com> Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: <67979.923650657@zippy.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at "Apr 9, 99 02:37:37 am" To: jkh@zippy.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 22:51:45 -0700 (PDT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL38 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jordan K. Hubbard writes: > > Yeah, I'm serious, I would really like gcj+libgcj, to get java stuff > > compiled (non portably) into binaries on FreeBSD. > > 1. I agree in principle. > > 2. I'd sort of like to see a second release of this, at least, before > we start talking seriously of bringing it into -current. I predict > a rapidly changing Doppler on this target. gcj is still pretty wet behind the ears at this point. So it seems one approach would be to have it in there but by default not compiled/included (the sources are already part of egcs and so in the tree as I understand it). Then when/if it becomes more stable and loved by the world we can flip that switch to default to on. Additionally, the "libgjc" component that was just released should be made into a port for now (this is the runtime that goes with the gcj Java compiler). Longer term, I think there is enough interest in it that this combo will eventually become the most popular freeware runtime for Java. -Archie ___________________________________________________________________________ Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 6:14:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0751D15352; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 06:14:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA72239; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 09:10:15 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 09:10:15 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Archie Cobbs Cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: <199904100551.WAA93232@bubba.whistle.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 9 Apr 1999, Archie Cobbs wrote: > Jordan K. Hubbard writes: > > > Yeah, I'm serious, I would really like gcj+libgcj, to get java stuff > > > compiled (non portably) into binaries on FreeBSD. > > > > 1. I agree in principle. > > > > 2. I'd sort of like to see a second release of this, at least, before > > we start talking seriously of bringing it into -current. I predict > > a rapidly changing Doppler on this target. > > gcj is still pretty wet behind the ears at this point. So it seems > one approach would be to have it in there but by default not > compiled/included (the sources are already part of egcs and so in > the tree as I understand it). Then when/if it becomes more stable > and loved by the world we can flip that switch to default to on. > > Additionally, the "libgjc" component that was just released should > be made into a port for now (this is the runtime that goes with > the gcj Java compiler). > > Longer term, I think there is enough interest in it that this combo > will eventually become the most popular freeware runtime for Java. As long as we can bring it in conditionally, have libgcj is possibly more important to FreeBSD than you'd think. Realize there are a large number of us out there doing Java development (I'm only doing it for classes now, but there's a lot of folks doing this) and since there's no Java2 yet for FreeBSD, it's a drawback. I have Solaris7 at my elbow here, *extremely* unwillingly, only because I need Java2. It's going to be possible to get a pretty good idea of how well libgcj works, pretty quickly; what I'm saying here is, it's not a 3 month wait here, it's probably a couple weeks. The reason gcj is "wet behind the ears" is because it's not useful without the runtime support, which has just been released as libgcj, so don't make any judgements about gcj, make them about gcj+libgcj. > > -Archie > > ___________________________________________________________________________ > Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message > > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 6:40:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6C5B14D28; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 06:40:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA70072; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 09:38:02 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 09:38:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: Archie Cobbs Cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: <199904100551.WAA93232@bubba.whistle.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 9 Apr 1999, Archie Cobbs wrote: > Jordan K. Hubbard writes: > > > Yeah, I'm serious, I would really like gcj+libgcj, to get java stuff > > > compiled (non portably) into binaries on FreeBSD. > > > > 1. I agree in principle. > > > > 2. I'd sort of like to see a second release of this, at least, before > > we start talking seriously of bringing it into -current. I predict > > a rapidly changing Doppler on this target. > > gcj is still pretty wet behind the ears at this point. So it seems > one approach would be to have it in there but by default not > compiled/included (the sources are already part of egcs and so in > the tree as I understand it). Then when/if it becomes more stable > and loved by the world we can flip that switch to default to on. > > Additionally, the "libgjc" component that was just released should > be made into a port for now (this is the runtime that goes with > the gcj Java compiler). > > Longer term, I think there is enough interest in it that this combo > will eventually become the most popular freeware runtime for Java. I agree. A Java compiler in the base system would be Very Nice, especially one that compiles to NATIVE code so we can have Java without all the overhead. Sure, I vote on importing it, and maybe even enabling it by default :) > > -Archie > > ___________________________________________________________________________ > Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 8:13: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5B6315048; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 08:12:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA05122; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 09:10:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id JAA08971; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 09:10:42 -0600 Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 09:10:42 -0600 Message-Id: <199904101510.JAA08971@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Chuck Robey Cc: Archie Cobbs , "Jordan K. Hubbard" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: References: <199904100551.WAA93232@bubba.whistle.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > As long as we can bring it in conditionally, have libgcj is possibly > more important to FreeBSD than you'd think. Realize there are a large > number of us out there doing Java development (I'm only doing it for > classes now, but there's a lot of folks doing this) and since there's no > Java2 yet for FreeBSD, it's a drawback. I have Solaris7 at my elbow > here, *extremely* unwillingly, only because I need Java2. Is libgcj and the like Java2 compliant? I was under the impression that it was less 'featureful' than the JDK1 stuff the porting team released? Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 9:11:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from shale.csir.co.za (shale.csir.co.za [146.64.46.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0036114E6E; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 09:11:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from reg@shale.csir.co.za) Received: (from reg@localhost) by shale.csir.co.za (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA77648; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 18:05:32 +0200 (SAT) (envelope-from reg) Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 18:05:32 +0200 From: Jeremy Lea To: Glenn Johnson Cc: The Hermit Hacker , Brian Handy , Dag-Erling Smorgrav , obrien@NUXI.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. Message-ID: <19990410180531.E6250@shale.csir.co.za> References: <19990409155258.A3791@shale.csir.co.za> <19990409112852.A14614@symbion.srrc.usda.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <19990409112852.A14614@symbion.srrc.usda.gov>; from Glenn Johnson on Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 11:28:52AM -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, On Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 11:28:52AM -0500, Glenn Johnson wrote: > On Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 03:52:58PM +0200, Jeremy Lea wrote: > > I always thought the criteria for inclusion of things into the base > > system was: > > > > 1. Needed for 'make world'; > > 2. Needed to get a basic functioning server up and running; > > 3. Something usefull only within FreeBSD (like the kernel ;), or > > 4. Can't be effectively built outside of /usr/src. > > > > If {g77|f77} can be built as a port, using the system EGCS, then to > > port's it goes. Otherwise why don't we include the Top 20 ports, or > > maybe the Top 25, or... > > First off, g77 is not your typical port. The build of g77 depends on > having the source to gcc on your system. The last time I checked, > installing the source was optional. The reason the current port of g77 > is marked broken is because of this. See (4) above. Adding it to /usr/src, with a NO_FORTRAN option, would get my vote. > Future: Now it may be true that newer versions of g77 may not build > against whatever version of egcs we have but at least we would be > guaranteed of having a functional Fortran compiler. lang/g77-devel? Depends on lang/egcs-devel? > Many people don't seem to understand that FreeBSD can be used for > workstations as well as servers and Fortran is *essential* on a > scientific/engineering workstation. I don't doubt that there are more > people using FreeBSD as a server but that doesn't mean that workstation > users should be denied an essential tool because it takes up a few > hundred kilobytes. I'm a civil engineer, specialising in data analysis... Regards, -Jeremy -- | "I could be anything I wanted to, but one things true --+-- Never gonna be as big as Jesus, never gonna hold the world in my hand | Never gonna be as big as Jesus, never gonna build a promised land | But that's, that's all right, OK with me..." -Audio Adrenaline To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 11:52: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quark.ChrisBowman.com (crbowman.erols.com [209.122.47.155]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA64614E07 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 11:52:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crb@ChrisBowman.com) Received: from fermion (fermion.ChrisBowman.com [10.0.1.2]) by quark.ChrisBowman.com (8.9.2/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA05615 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 14:49:00 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from crb@ChrisBowman.com) Message-Id: <199904101849.OAA05615@quark.ChrisBowman.com> X-Sender: crb@quark X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 14:48:34 -0400 To: Hackers@FreeBSD.org From: "Christopher R. Bowman" Subject: Free book to good home Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I have ended up with an extra copy of: UNIX Network Programming: Interprocess Communications Vol 2 Second Ed by W Richard Stevens. At this point it is easier for me to give it away than to continue to argue with www.spree.com. So I will give it away *FREE* to any person in the US (sorry, over seas shipping is too much of a hassle) who can provide a good home for it. All I need is a postal address (I will probably ship it cheapest USPS). Please email me directly (including all flames about list appropriateness) not the list. -------- Christopher R. Bowman crb@ChrisBowman.com http://www.ChrisBowman.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 12:46:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 546D114F8D; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 12:46:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA08435; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 12:44:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904101944.MAA08435@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Chuck Robey Cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Native Java Compilers In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 10 Apr 1999 09:10:15 EDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 12:44:31 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I would wait till gcj+libgcj is stable to incorporate it into the tree. I can't get libcgj to compile over here and I tried updating libgcj a couple of times additionally it looks like it has had zero testing out on the field well at least the version available from cygnus cvs repository. We do need java vm experts and compiler people to hash out the problems with the currrent crop of Java to Native binaries compilers: 1. Electrical Fire http://www.mozilla.org/projects/ef 2. Japhar http://www.japhar.org The above compilers perform a java to native binary compilation . Whats the difference between this approach and JITs not much other than the compiler does more work to optmize the code for instance in the of EF it does a Chaitin-Briggs Register Allocation. It should be interesting comparing gcj and EF so far EF appears to generate the best code and I have tested against Kaffe and Japhar. This is going to be a good year for Freebsd ! Amancio > On Fri, 9 Apr 1999, Archie Cobbs wrote: > > > Jordan K. Hubbard writes: > > > > Yeah, I'm serious, I would really like gcj+libgcj, to get java stuff > > > > compiled (non portably) into binaries on FreeBSD. > > > > > > 1. I agree in principle. > > > > > > 2. I'd sort of like to see a second release of this, at least, before > > > we start talking seriously of bringing it into -current. I predict > > > a rapidly changing Doppler on this target. > > > > gcj is still pretty wet behind the ears at this point. So it seems > > one approach would be to have it in there but by default not > > compiled/included (the sources are already part of egcs and so in > > the tree as I understand it). Then when/if it becomes more stable > > and loved by the world we can flip that switch to default to on. > > > > Additionally, the "libgjc" component that was just released should > > be made into a port for now (this is the runtime that goes with > > the gcj Java compiler). > > > > Longer term, I think there is enough interest in it that this combo > > will eventually become the most popular freeware runtime for Java. > > As long as we can bring it in conditionally, have libgcj is possibly > more important to FreeBSD than you'd think. Realize there are a large > number of us out there doing Java development (I'm only doing it for > classes now, but there's a lot of folks doing this) and since there's no > Java2 yet for FreeBSD, it's a drawback. I have Solaris7 at my elbow > here, *extremely* unwillingly, only because I need Java2. > > It's going to be possible to get a pretty good idea of how well libgcj > works, pretty quickly; what I'm saying here is, it's not a 3 month wait > here, it's probably a couple weeks. > > The reason gcj is "wet behind the ears" is because it's not useful > without the runtime support, which has just been released as libgcj, so > don't make any judgements about gcj, make them about gcj+libgcj. > > > > > -Archie > > > > ___________________________________________________________________________ > > Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message > > > > > > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- > Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data > chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. > 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | > Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) > (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 12:54:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1571D14E35 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 12:54:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bob@luke.pmr.com) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id OAA25956; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 14:51:11 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bob) Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 14:51:11 -0500 From: Bob Willcox To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Cc: Esry Don-FDE005 , Greg Lehey , Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? Message-ID: <19990410145111.A25635@luke.pmr.com> Reply-To: Bob Willcox References: <681FCF3A6828D211A37F00A0C9992A2101880FFE@fl19exch01.paging.mot.com> <370B8804.2E0752C@newsguy.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <370B8804.2E0752C@newsguy.com>; from Daniel C. Sobral on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 01:29:56AM +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 01:29:56AM +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > Esry Don-FDE005 wrote: > > > > I believe that IBM, HP, and Sun all buy their LVM from Veritous. Hopefully I > > am close enough in spelling that you can figure it out. :-) > > I don't believe that's the case with IBM. I have been known to be > wrong before, though... :-) You are correct. I was there. (I worked on AIX from 1983 (RT days) to 1995 when I retired from IBM...well, actually I'm still working on AIX at IBM but as a contractor these days.) The IBM volume manager was created by the IBM folks here in Austin for version 3.1 on the RS6K. Bob -- Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 12:59:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81FD214E35 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 12:59:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bob@luke.pmr.com) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id OAA26015; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 14:57:04 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bob) Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 14:57:04 -0500 From: Bob Willcox To: "Justin C. Walker" Cc: "Daniel C. Sobral" , Esry Don-FDE005 , Greg Lehey , Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? Message-ID: <19990410145704.B25635@luke.pmr.com> Reply-To: Bob Willcox References: <199904071742.KAA05909@rhapture.apple.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <199904071742.KAA05909@rhapture.apple.com>; from Justin C. Walker on Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 10:42:06AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 10:42:06AM -0700, Justin C. Walker wrote: > > > > Esry Don-FDE005 wrote: > > > > > > I believe that IBM, HP, and Sun all buy their LVM from Veritous. > Hopefully I > > > am close enough in spelling that you can figure it out. > > > > I don't believe that's the case with IBM. I have been known to be > > wrong before, though... > The company name, I think, is Veritas (as in Veritas Vos > Liberabit). And you're correct that IBM didn't *buy* the > implementation from Veritas. It's quite similar in idea, though. I was under the impression that the IBM design predated Veritas', though I could be mistaken. Design for IBM's volume manager began in 1987 and was first introduced with AIX 3.1 on the RS6K (1990, I believe). Also, if my memory serves me, the OSF implemented a volume manager similar to the one in AIX. They were originally intending to use IBM's but decided to re-implement it (they were disastified with the IBM implementation, but I never knew for certain the details). Bob -- Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 13:18:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40FB314E1C for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 13:18:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bob@luke.pmr.com) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id PAA26177; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 15:07:02 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bob) Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 15:07:02 -0500 From: Bob Willcox To: Greg Lehey Cc: Dom Mitchell , Wes Peters , justin@apple.com, "Daniel C. Sobral" , Esry Don-FDE005 , Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Volume managers (was: Separate boot partition?) Message-ID: <19990410150702.D25635@luke.pmr.com> Reply-To: Bob Willcox References: <19990408084822.X2142@lemis.com> <19990408173016.X2142@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <19990408173016.X2142@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 05:30:16PM +0930 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 05:30:16PM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: > On Thursday, 8 April 1999 at 8:52:24 +0100, Dom Mitchell wrote: > > On 8 April 1999, Greg Lehey proclaimed: > >> I can't see why not, since it's possible now. What we still need to > >> do is find a way to extend a file system, but that's a ufs issue > >> (which has a solution), not a volume manager issue. > > > > What about shrinking an fs? Is that feasible? Possible? > > According to Kirk McKusick, no. Another anecodotal aside, in AIX there was always someone asking for this same functionality. Though Al Chang (author of IBM's JFS and VMM in AIX) thought that it could be done, it would be quite difficult and the risk of data loss would be very high. As far as I know, it was never implemented. Bob -- Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 13:49:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 506C915046; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 13:49:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA97778; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 16:44:50 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 16:44:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Nate Williams Cc: Archie Cobbs , "Jordan K. Hubbard" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: <199904101510.JAA08971@mt.sri.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 10 Apr 1999, Nate Williams wrote: > > As long as we can bring it in conditionally, have libgcj is possibly > > more important to FreeBSD than you'd think. Realize there are a large > > number of us out there doing Java development (I'm only doing it for > > classes now, but there's a lot of folks doing this) and since there's no > > Java2 yet for FreeBSD, it's a drawback. I have Solaris7 at my elbow > > here, *extremely* unwillingly, only because I need Java2. > > Is libgcj and the like Java2 compliant? I was under the impression that > it was less 'featureful' than the JDK1 stuff the porting team released? It doesn't have all the libs in it, all the stuff that was swing in Java1. It's possible it could be made to work, if I added in the swingall.jar, but I don't yet know, I haven't finished my homework yet, so I can't play as I'd like. > > > Nate > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message > > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 14:17:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E342153AE for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 14:17:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id OAA01764; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 14:15:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 14:15:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904102115.OAA01764@apollo.backplane.com> To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Annoying debug-kernel config messages References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I am getting wholely sick of this blasted config message. If you are going to print the message, print it once and be done with it. Not every time I config! I'd get rid of the message entirely, in fact. Also, if you guys insist of making 'make' generate a debug kernel called 'kernel.debug' by default, at LEAST objcopy it to 'kernel' to generate the non-debug version during the main 'make' procedure rather then during the 'make install' procedure. Not all of us use make install to install new kernels. I've gone from having to cp/strip to having to objcopy. My life is not made easier. I don't mind generating both a debug and non-debug kernel by default. But it must be done in the correct fashion. -Matt apollo:/usr/src/sys/i386/conf# config TEST2 Building kernel with full debugging symbols. Do <<<<<< "config -s TEST2" for historic partial symbolic support. <<<<<< To install the debugging kernel, do make install.debug <<<<<< Don't forget to do a ``make depend'' Kernel build directory is ../../compile/TEST2 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 14:18: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 056D5153D7; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 14:17:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id PAA07736; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 15:13:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id PAA10092; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 15:13:18 -0600 Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 15:13:18 -0600 Message-Id: <199904102113.PAA10092@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Chuck Robey Cc: Nate Williams , Archie Cobbs , "Jordan K. Hubbard" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: References: <199904101510.JAA08971@mt.sri.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > As long as we can bring it in conditionally, have libgcj is possibly > > > more important to FreeBSD than you'd think. Realize there are a large > > > number of us out there doing Java development (I'm only doing it for > > > classes now, but there's a lot of folks doing this) and since there's no > > > Java2 yet for FreeBSD, it's a drawback. I have Solaris7 at my elbow > > > here, *extremely* unwillingly, only because I need Java2. > > > > Is libgcj and the like Java2 compliant? I was under the impression that > > it was less 'featureful' than the JDK1 stuff the porting team released? > > It doesn't have all the libs in it, all the stuff that was swing in > Java1. That stuff doesn't require JDK2 to work. Swing actually works better (faster, more robust, etc..) in JDK1 that it does in JDK2, so why do you say you need Java2? I'm confused about the statement that libgcj will give you Java2 compliance, when as I understand it's not even completely JDK1 compliant. Given that, why not just use the 'JDK' or 'kaffe' port along with the Swing package for JDK1 that Sun provides? (That's the stuff we use for our commercial deployment.) Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 14:56:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from relay.nuxi.com (unknown [169.237.7.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B4F3014D22; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 14:56:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: (from obrien@localhost) by relay.nuxi.com (8.9.2/8.9.1) id OAA35950; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 14:54:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien) Message-ID: <19990410145404.A35939@nuxi.com> Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 14:54:04 -0700 From: "David O'Brien" To: current@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. Reply-To: obrien@FreeBSD.ORG References: <19990408165056.D20453@nuxi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990408165056.D20453@nuxi.com>; from David O'Brien on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 04:50:56PM -0700 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE Organization: The NUXI BSD group X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Keyid: 34F9F9D5 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Unless I get more feedback, I will add g77 to the base system this > weekend. I should have posted this yesterday... but I had hoped to just get it done. There has been suffient YES response to keep Fortran in the base system. As someone posted to the point: g77 will add very little additional size and compile time over the bits of EGCS we are already using. -- -- David (obrien@NUXI.com -or- obrien@FreeBSD.org) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 15: 5:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quark.ChrisBowman.com (crbowman.erols.com [209.122.47.155]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE92C14CC6 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 15:05:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crb@ChrisBowman.com) Received: from fermion (fermion.ChrisBowman.com [10.0.1.2]) by quark.ChrisBowman.com (8.9.2/8.8.8) with SMTP id SAA06095; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 18:01:49 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from crb@ChrisBowman.com) Message-Id: <199904102201.SAA06095@quark.ChrisBowman.com> X-Sender: crb@quark X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 18:01:23 -0400 To: nsj@ncsu.edu (Nate Johnson) From: "Christopher R. Bowman" Subject: Re: Free book to good home Cc: Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199904101849.OAA05615@quark.ChrisBowman.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 02:48 PM 4/10/99 -0400, Christopher R. Bowman wrote: >I have ended up with an extra copy of: > >UNIX Network Programming: Interprocess Communications Vol 2 Second Ed >by W Richard Stevens. > >At this point it is easier for me to give it away than to continue to argue with www.spree.com. > >So I will give it away *FREE* to any person in the US (sorry, over seas shipping is too much of a hassle) who can provide a good home for it. All I need is a postal address (I will probably ship it cheapest USPS). I have received over a dozen replies in the 2 hours since I posted my message. I wish that I had more than one copy to give away, I am sorry, but I don't. The first person to reply with a seemingly valid postal address was Nate Johnson, and so I will send him the book. Thank you all for your replies and please do not send any more requests for the book. -------- Christopher R. Bowman crb@ChrisBowman.com http://www.ChrisBowman.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 16:58: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D637D15129 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 16:58:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id JAA03692; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 09:25:45 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id JAA38079; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 09:25:44 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990411092544.T2142@lemis.com> Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 09:25:44 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Bob Willcox , "Justin C. Walker" Cc: "Daniel C. Sobral" , Esry Don-FDE005 , Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Separate boot partition? References: <199904071742.KAA05909@rhapture.apple.com> <19990410145704.B25635@luke.pmr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990410145704.B25635@luke.pmr.com>; from Bob Willcox on Sat, Apr 10, 1999 at 02:57:04PM -0500 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [Format recovered--see http://www.lemis.com/email/email-format.html] On Saturday, 10 April 1999 at 14:57:04 -0500, Bob Willcox wrote: > On Wed, Apr 07, 1999 at 10:42:06AM -0700, Justin C. Walker wrote: >>> >>> Esry Don-FDE005 wrote: >>>> >>>> I believe that IBM, HP, and Sun all buy their LVM from Veritous. >>>> Hopefully I am close enough in spelling that you can figure it >>>> out. >>> >>> I don't believe that's the case with IBM. I have been known to be >>> wrong before, though... >> The company name, I think, is Veritas (as in Veritas Vos >> Liberabit). And you're correct that IBM didn't *buy* the >> implementation from Veritas. It's quite similar in idea, though. > > I was under the impression that the IBM design predated Veritas', though > I could be mistaken. Design for IBM's volume manager began in 1987 and > was first introduced with AIX 3.1 on the RS6K (1990, I believe). This looks earlier than Veritas. IIRC Veritas is what's left of one of Tandem's competitors of the late 80's (Tolerant, I think), and when they gave up as a computer manufacturer, they started marketing their software. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 18:10:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7AE7715115; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 18:10:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id KAA03922; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 10:38:26 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id KAA38204; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 10:38:25 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990411103824.Y2142@lemis.com> Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 10:38:24 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: "Andrey A. Chernov" , Bruce Evans , "Kenneth D. Merry" , FreeBSD Hackers Cc: cvs-all@freebsd.org, cvs-committers@freebsd.org, ache@freebsd.org Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/usr.sbin/config main.c References: <199904101415.AAA28666@godzilla.zeta.org.au> <19990410182224.A18709@nagual.pp.ru> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990410182224.A18709@nagual.pp.ru>; from Andrey A. Chernov on Sat, Apr 10, 1999 at 06:22:25PM +0400 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Saturday, 10 April 1999 at 18:22:25 +0400, Andrey A. Chernov wrote: > On Sun, Apr 11, 1999 at 12:15:43AM +1000, Bruce Evans wrote: >> The -s changes should be backed out completely. They were as uncouth >> as making -l the default for ls and adding a deprecated -S flag to give >> normal behaviour. > > I agree. Anyone who need -g kernel space/time bloat must use -g directly. > Please ask for removing not me but '-s change' author. On Saturday, 10 April 1999 at 17:41:19 -0600, Kenneth D. Merry wrote: > Bruce Evans wrote... >>> Modified files: >>> usr.sbin/config main.c >>> Log: >>> add -s to usage >>> >>> PR: 11056 >>> Submitted by: Nickolay N. Dudorov >> >> The -s changes should be backed out completely. They were as uncouth >> as making -l the default for ls and adding a deprecated -S flag to give >> normal behaviour. > > I agree. This was discussed at great length on -hackers before the changes were made. People were (after a while) unanimously in favour of the change. It would have been nice if you had responded there before I did it, rather than afterwards. Bruce explained that he doesn't read -hackers. OK, in that case we need somewhere else to discuss this kind of proposed change, rather than making changes and then having people wanting them backed out. Suggestions? In any case, it's all very well to "agree", but none of you have presented any arguments for your viewpoint. In particular you, Ken, have in the past asked people to use a debug kernel to get adequate information after a panic. If no symbols is the default, 99% of people who have problems won't be able to report them. As I proposed in the discussion on -hackers, this solution should make everybody happy: there is no difference in the running system, on modern machines it only takes fractionally longer to build a debug kernel, and it helps a lot in finding problems. To summarize the changes: By default, config configures a kernel with full debug symbols. If you really want to build one without symbols, you use the -s option. 'make install' always installs a kernel without debug symbols. If you have a debug kernel (no -s option) and want to install it, use the 'install.debug' target. The debug kernel is called kernel.debug in the kernel build directory. The non-debug kernel is called kernel, sa before, and is created by using objcopy --strip-debug, so the code in the non-debug kernel is identical to the code in the debug kernel. It appears that it's possible to have difference in the code between kernels built with symbols and without, but this issue does not arise here. If you still think the change to the default should be backed out, that doesn't affect the changes to the Makefiles: if you have a debug kernel, it was previously difficult to install a stripped version. Now you have two targets which give you the choice. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 18:13:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gongshow.masterplan.org (masterplan.powersurfr.com [24.108.43.174]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED10A15219 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 18:13:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jbg@masterplan.org) Received: from infomat (infomat.precident.com [192.168.4.2]) by gongshow.masterplan.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id TAA19427 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 19:11:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from jbg@masterplan.org) Message-Id: <199904110111.TAA19427@gongshow.masterplan.org> From: jbg@masterplan.org (Jason George) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Add smbclient to root crunch for installs? Organization: The Master Plan Always Fails... Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 01:13:01 GMT Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I guess, by this way of thinking, that using the "used-to-be-called Rumba/now-called Sharity-light" port is also a possibility. Comparing file sizes, it looks like Sharity (I have the older Rumba installed) is a lot more compact than is SMBclient. > ls -l /usr/local/bin/smbclient -rwxr-xr-x 1 root wheel 244731 May 20 1998 /usr/local/bin/smbclient > ls -l /usr/local/sbin/*rumba* -r-xr-xr-x 1 bin bin 69632 Jun 7 1998 /usr/local/sbin/rumba -r-xr-xr-x 1 bin bin 8192 Jun 7 1998 /usr/local/sbin/unrumba > Just some food for thought... --Jason j.b.georgeieee.org jbgmasterplan.org >It's certainly a possibility... If somebody's got some space to >test make release, they can try hacking the mfsroot crunch config >file and building smbclient into it. There would be some dependency >issues, of course, since samba isn't part of the base system. > >- Jordan > >> Since 3.1-RELEASE has gone to 2 floppies, it somehow hit my mind >> today that it ought to be possible to hack the installation >> program to use smbclient to fetch installation tarballs from >> a shared CDROM on a nearby Microsoft machine (my love for >> Microsoft is low, but for many users there often is one >> nearby :-/ ). >> >> I have done no research yet on how this might be achieved. >> I just wanted to mention it here first to see if it was a >> fruitful line of inquiry or not. >> >> >> To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >> with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 18:49:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from implode.root.com (root.com [209.102.106.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AAD8D150B5 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 18:49:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@implode.root.com) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA27717; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 18:45:54 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904110145.SAA27717@implode.root.com> To: Matthew Dillon Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Annoying debug-kernel config messages In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 10 Apr 1999 14:15:30 PDT." <199904102115.OAA01764@apollo.backplane.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 18:45:54 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I am getting wholely sick of this blasted config message. If you are > going to print the message, print it once and be done with it. Not > every time I config! I'd get rid of the message entirely, in fact. > > Also, if you guys insist of making 'make' generate a debug kernel called > 'kernel.debug' by default, at LEAST objcopy it to 'kernel' to generate > the non-debug version during the main 'make' procedure rather then > during the 'make install' procedure. Not all of us use make install to > install new kernels. > > I've gone from having to cp/strip to having to objcopy. My life is not > made easier. > > I don't mind generating both a debug and non-debug kernel by default. But > it must be done in the correct fashion. I agree with Matt. Actually I really don't like the idea of building a debug kernel by default and would really prefer that we not do that. -DG David Greenman Co-founder/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project - http://www.freebsd.org Creator of high-performance Internet servers - http://www.terasolutions.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 18:55:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from panzer.plutotech.com (panzer.plutotech.com [206.168.67.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E39515060; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 18:55:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ken@panzer.plutotech.com) Received: (from ken@localhost) by panzer.plutotech.com (8.9.3/8.8.5) id TAA34645; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 19:51:12 -0600 (MDT) From: "Kenneth D. Merry" Message-Id: <199904110151.TAA34645@panzer.plutotech.com> Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/usr.sbin/config main.c In-Reply-To: <19990411103824.Y2142@lemis.com> from Greg Lehey at "Apr 11, 1999 10:38:24 am" To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 19:51:12 -0600 (MDT) Cc: ache@nagual.pp.ru, bde@zeta.org.au, ken@plutotech.com, hackers@freebsd.org, cvs-all@freebsd.org, cvs-committers@freebsd.org, ache@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey wrote... > On Saturday, 10 April 1999 at 18:22:25 +0400, Andrey A. Chernov wrote: > > On Sun, Apr 11, 1999 at 12:15:43AM +1000, Bruce Evans wrote: > >> The -s changes should be backed out completely. They were as uncouth > >> as making -l the default for ls and adding a deprecated -S flag to give > >> normal behaviour. > > > > I agree. Anyone who need -g kernel space/time bloat must use -g directly. > > Please ask for removing not me but '-s change' author. > > On Saturday, 10 April 1999 at 17:41:19 -0600, Kenneth D. Merry wrote: > > Bruce Evans wrote... > >>> Modified files: > >>> usr.sbin/config main.c > >>> Log: > >>> add -s to usage > >>> > >>> PR: 11056 > >>> Submitted by: Nickolay N. Dudorov > >> > >> The -s changes should be backed out completely. They were as uncouth > >> as making -l the default for ls and adding a deprecated -S flag to give > >> normal behaviour. > > > > I agree. > > This was discussed at great length on -hackers before the changes were > made. People were (after a while) unanimously in favour of the > change. It would have been nice if you had responded there before I > did it, rather than afterwards. > > Bruce explained that he doesn't read -hackers. OK, in that case we > need somewhere else to discuss this kind of proposed change, rather > than making changes and then having people wanting them backed out. > Suggestions? I don't have any suggestions for that, but I will say that I tend to ignore most of the stuff on -hackers. It often tends to be more noise than signal. -current is often that way as well. The amount I read on either list varies with available time and interest in the subject. > In any case, it's all very well to "agree", but none of you have > presented any arguments for your viewpoint. In particular you, Ken, > have in the past asked people to use a debug kernel to get adequate > information after a panic. If no symbols is the default, 99% of > people who have problems won't be able to report them. As I proposed > in the discussion on -hackers, this solution should make everybody > happy: there is no difference in the running system, on modern > machines it only takes fractionally longer to build a debug kernel, > and it helps a lot in finding problems. Of course I've asked people to build debugging kernels. I just did yesterday, in fact. I've also been bitten by not having debugging symbols for a kernel on a machine that's paniced. > To summarize the changes: > > By default, config configures a kernel with full debug symbols. If > you really want to build one without symbols, you use the -s option. > > 'make install' always installs a kernel without debug symbols. If > you have a debug kernel (no -s option) and want to install it, use > the 'install.debug' target. The debug kernel is called kernel.debug > in the kernel build directory. The non-debug kernel is called > kernel, sa before, and is created by using objcopy --strip-debug, so > the code in the non-debug kernel is identical to the code in the > debug kernel. It appears that it's possible to have difference in > the code between kernels built with symbols and without, but this > issue does not arise here. > > If you still think the change to the default should be backed out, > that doesn't affect the changes to the Makefiles: if you have a debug > kernel, it was previously difficult to install a stripped version. > Now you have two targets which give you the choice. I really don't feel strongly about it either way. I almost always build kernels with debugging symbols in any case, but not everyone needs them. My main concern was with the fair amount of extra space it takes to build and store debugging and non-debugging kernels. The difference with a sample kernel config file here is 6MB for the non-debugging version versus 27MB for the debugging version. I dunno, maybe it is worth the extra disk space to get debugging symbols in case of a panic. You have made a reasonable case for it. In any case, consider my objection withdrawn. Ken -- Kenneth Merry ken@plutotech.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 18:59:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 343D715060 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 18:59:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id LAA04061; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 11:27:20 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id LAA38331; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 11:27:09 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990411112709.D2142@lemis.com> Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 11:27:09 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: dg@root.com, Matthew Dillon Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Annoying debug-kernel config messages References: <199904102115.OAA01764@apollo.backplane.com> <199904110145.SAA27717@implode.root.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904110145.SAA27717@implode.root.com>; from David Greenman on Sat, Apr 10, 1999 at 06:45:54PM -0700 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Saturday, 10 April 1999 at 18:45:54 -0700, David Greenman wrote: > It appears that Matthew Dillon wrote: >> I am getting wholely sick of this blasted config message. If you are >> going to print the message, print it once and be done with it. Not >> every time I config! I'd get rid of the message entirely, in fact. Sorry, I either haven't received this message yet, or I missed it by accident. I don't like the message either, but I'm surprised that you find it so upsetting. >> Also, if you guys insist of making 'make' generate a debug kernel >> called 'kernel.debug' by default, at LEAST objcopy it to 'kernel' >> to generate the non-debug version during the main 'make' >> procedure rather then during the 'make install' procedure. Not >> all of us use make install to install new kernels. That's reasonable. I'll do that. >> I've gone from having to cp/strip to having to objcopy. My life is not >> made easier. >> >> I don't mind generating both a debug and non-debug kernel by default. But >> it must be done in the correct fashion. > > I agree with Matt. Actually I really don't like the idea of building a > debug kernel by default and would really prefer that we not do that. I think we need to discuss this a little more. We also need to have a place to discuss this sort of change. I discussed it at length in -hackers, and nobody objected. How about a "heads up" or a "proposed change" mailing list to which nothing else should be posted? Anyway, while I still think that the default debug kernel is the way to go, I'll back out the changed defaults (and the messages) until such time as we come to another agreement. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 20:43:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D1FC15379 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 20:43:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id XAA17071 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 23:41:09 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904110341.XAA17071@cs.rpi.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: increased crashing in NFS server Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 23:41:04 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I recently updated all of our FreeBSD3 clients to use NFSv3/UDP when contacting our servers (FreeBSD3 of the same build tree). We have noticed an increase in crashing of our main home directory server (which is the only server really handling RW mounts, our other servers are mostly RO, with some minor RW activity.) The first crash was obviously NFS. I traced it to one of 2 possible crash points in the kernel (sorry, no stack trace, we don't [yet] have a crashlogs enabled for that machine.). The panic was: mbuf siz=33476 panic: Bad nfs svc reply The second panic just happened, it claims to be softupdate related. I think it may have something to do with NFSv3 however since this machine used to be very stable (ie, not 2 crashes in a week). This panic was: panic: softdep_write_inodeblock: indirect pointer #0 mismatch 0 != 102192 8 syncing disks... panic: softdep_lock: locking against myself Here is some dmesg output for your amusement ;) /kernel text=0x13557d data=0x17ba8+0x1fb64 syms=[0x4+0x1ee30+0x4+0x20f1b] BIOS basemem (639K) != RTC basemem (640K), setting to BIOS value Copyright (c) 1992-1999 FreeBSD Inc. Copyright (c) 1982, 1986, 1989, 1991, 1993 The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE #0: Sun Mar 21 02:23:19 EST 1999 schimken@wobble.cs.rpi.edu:/usr/src/sys/compile/STAGGER Timecounter "i8254" frequency 1193182 Hz CPU: Pentium Pro (198.67-MHz 686-class CPU) Origin = "GenuineIntel" Id = 0x619 Stepping=9 Features=0xfbff real memory = 100663296 (98304K bytes) avail memory = 94965760 (92740K bytes) Preloaded elf kernel "kernel" at 0xf02af000. Probing for devices on PCI bus 0: Correcting Natoma config for non-SMP chip0: rev 0x02 on pci0.0.0 fxp0: rev 0x02 int a irq 11 on pci0.6. 0 fxp0: Ethernet address 00:a0:c9:55:a0:27 chip1: rev 0x01 on pci0.7.0 ide_pci0: rev 0x00 on pci0.7.1 ahc0: rev 0x00 int a irq 11 on pci0.9.0 ahc0: aic7880 Wide Channel A, SCSI Id=7, 16/255 SCBs vga0: rev 0x9a on pci0.19.0 Probing for devices on the ISA bus: sc0 on isa sc0: VGA color <16 virtual consoles, flags=0x0> atkbdc0 at 0x60-0x6f on motherboard atkbd0 irq 1 on isa psm0 not found sio0 at 0x3f8-0x3ff irq 4 flags 0x10 on isa sio0: type 16550A, console sio1 at 0x2f8-0x2ff irq 3 on isa sio1: type 16550A lpt0 at 0x378-0x37f irq 7 on isa lpt0: Interrupt-driven port lp0: TCP/IP capable interface lpt-266023096: this driver is deprecated; use ppbus instead. fdc0 at 0x3f0-0x3f7 irq 6 drq 2 on isa fdc0: FIFO enabled, 8 bytes threshold fd0: 1.44MB 3.5in wdc0 at 0x1f0-0x1f7 irq 14 flags 0xa0ffa0ff on isa wdc0: unit 0 (wd0): , DMA, 32-bit, multi-block-16 wd0: 8693MB (17803440 sectors), 17662 cyls, 16 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S wdc0: unit 1 (wd1): , DMA, 32-bit, multi-block-16 wd1: 8693MB (17803440 sectors), 17662 cyls, 16 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S wdc1 at 0x170-0x177 irq 15 flags 0xa0ffa0ff on isa wdc1: unit 0 (wd2): , DMA, 32-bit, multi-block-16 wd2: 16124MB (33022080 sectors), 32760 cyls, 16 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S wdc1: unit 1 (wd3): , DMA, 32-bit, multi-block-16 wd3: 16124MB (33022080 sectors), 32760 cyls, 16 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S vga0 at 0x3b0-0x3df maddr 0xa0000 msize 131072 on isa npx0 on motherboard npx0: INT 16 interface IP packet filtering initialized, divert enabled, rule-based forwarding disabled, logging limited to 200 packets/entry Waiting 5 seconds for SCSI devices to settle changing roda3 at ahc0 bus 0 target 3 lun 0 da3: Fixed Direct Access SCSI-2 device da3: 5.000MB/s transfers (5.000MHz, offset 15), Tagged Queueing Enabled da3: 4095MB (8386733 512 byte sectors: 255H 63S/T 522C) ot devicd0 at ahc0 bus 0 target 5 lun 0 cd0: Removable CD-ROM SCSI-2 device cd0: 4.901MB/s transfers (4.901MHz, offset 15) cd0: Attempt to query device size failed: NOT READY, Medium not present da2 at ahc0 bus 0 target 2 lun 0 da2: Fixed Direct Access SCSI-2 device da2: 5.000MB/s transfers (5.000MHz, offset 15), Tagged Queueing Enabled da2: 4095MB (8386733 512 byte sectors: 255H 63S/T 522C) da1 at ahc0 bus 0 target 1 lun 0 da1: Fixed Direct Access SCSI-2 device da1: 5.000MB/s transfers (5.000MHz, offset 15), Tagged Queueing Enabled da1: 4095MB (8386733 512 byte sectors: 255H 63S/T 522C) da0 at ahc0 bus 0 target 0 lun 0 da0: Fixed Direct Access SCSI-2 device da0: 5.000MB/s transfers (5.000MHz, offset 15), Tagged Queueing Enabled da0: 4095MB (8386733 512 byte sectors: 255H 63S/T 522C) -- David Cross | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | This space intentionally Department of Computer Science | left unblank I speak only for myself. | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 20:47:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from detlev.UUCP (tex-68.camalott.com [208.229.74.68]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6269714BFC for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 20:47:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from joelh@gnu.org) Received: (from joelh@localhost) by detlev.UUCP (8.9.3/8.9.1) id WAA00963; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 22:45:10 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from joelh@gnu.org) Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 22:45:10 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199904110345.WAA00963@detlev.UUCP> X-Authentication-Warning: detlev.UUCP: joelh set sender to joelh@gnu.org using -f To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Baud rate of 0 From: Joel Ray Holveck Reply-To: joelh@gnu.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Why does setting the baud rate of a (wired tty) connection to 0 terminate it? When is this useful? Thanks, joelh -- Joel Ray Holveck - joelh@gnu.org Fourth law of programming: Anything that can go wrong wi sendmail: segmentation violation - core dumped To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 20:48:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hydrogen.fircrest.net (metriclient-3.uoregon.edu [128.223.172.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6634114BFC for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 20:48:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gurney_j@efn.org) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.fircrest.net (8.9.1/8.8.7) id UAA08197; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 20:46:20 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19990410204620.48742@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 20:46:20 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: date as userland strptime Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG currently date cannot be used as a userland interface to strptime when using the -f flag as it always trys to set the date with the -f flag, and aborts if you are not root. I quickly hacked date to have an option (I used -j for some reason, this can be changed) that would have date not set the date... this allows you to run: date -j -f "%a, %d %b %Y %H:%M:%S %Z" "" +%s to get the number of seconds of time... this works great except the fact that strptime (on 3.0-R or 3.1-R) ignores %Z and blindly assumes the time is in the local timezone... I haven't looked into fixing this problem yet... so, would people be interested in seeing this change in the tree? or any objections to adding the option? (I also made the nflag an option instead of it being a global variable) -- John-Mark Gurney Voice: +1 541 684 8449 Cu Networking P.O. Box 5693, 97405 Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD Don't trust anyone you don't have the source for To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 21:12:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72B6C14E1C for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 21:12:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id NAA15516; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 13:08:07 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <37101FC3.FC873691@newsguy.com> Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 13:06:28 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bob Willcox Cc: Greg Lehey , Dom Mitchell , Wes Peters , justin@apple.com, Esry Don-FDE005 , Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Volume managers (was: Separate boot partition?) References: <19990408084822.X2142@lemis.com> <19990408173016.X2142@lemis.com> <19990410150702.D25635@luke.pmr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Bob Willcox wrote: > > Another anecodotal aside, in AIX there was always someone asking for > this same functionality. Though Al Chang (author of IBM's JFS and VMM > in AIX) thought that it could be done, it would be quite difficult and > the risk of data loss would be very high. As far as I know, it was never > implemented. A third-party product was available for doing that, but not on-line. -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "nothing better than the ability to perform cunning linguistics" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 21:34:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 99BDD14CAE for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 21:34:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com ([204.68.178.225]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA03074; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 22:32:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <371025DE.A53B7FD7@softweyr.com> Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 22:32:30 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: joelh@gnu.org Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Baud rate of 0 References: <199904110345.WAA00963@detlev.UUCP> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Joel Ray Holveck wrote: > > Why does setting the baud rate of a (wired tty) connection to 0 > terminate it? When is this useful? When you want to get rid of an annoying smartass who{{{{ee To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 22:42:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail1.lig.bellsouth.net (mail1.lig.bellsouth.net [205.152.0.55]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD0D4153FC; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 22:42:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gljohns@bellsouth.net) Received: from gforce.johnson.home (host-209-214-148-170.msy.bellsouth.net [209.214.148.170]) by mail1.lig.bellsouth.net (8.8.8-spamdog/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA18033; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 01:40:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gforce.johnson.home (localhost.johnson.home [127.0.0.1]) by gforce.johnson.home (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id AAA64761; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 00:40:23 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from gljohns@bellsouth.net) From: gljohns@bellsouth.net Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:12:20 -0500 To: "David O'Brien" Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. Message-ID: <19990408201220.A26477@gforce.johnson.home> References: <19990408165056.D20453@nuxi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <19990408165056.D20453@nuxi.com>; from David O'Brien on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 04:50:56PM -0700 Lines: 18 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 04:50:56PM -0700, David O'Brien wrote: > I've only heard back from 4 folks about adding EGCS's g77 to the base > system -- all 4 said "yes". Unless I get more feedback, I will add g77 > to the base system this weekend. > > -- > -- David (obrien@NUXI.com -or- obrien@FreeBSD.org) David, First off, great job on the egcs import. Maybe you have already counted me among the four, but if not, add me to the list. I would love to see g77 in the base system. Thanks. -- Glenn Johnson gljohns@bellsouth.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 23:39:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from arnold.neland.dk (mail.neland.dk [194.255.12.232]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 153FD14E30 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 23:39:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by arnold.neland.dk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA00923; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 08:36:51 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from leifn@swimsuit.internet.dk) Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 08:36:51 +0200 (CEST) From: Leif Neland X-Sender: leifn@arnold.neland.dk To: Joel Ray Holveck Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Baud rate of 0 In-Reply-To: <199904110345.WAA00963@detlev.UUCP> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 10 Apr 1999, Joel Ray Holveck wrote: > Why does setting the baud rate of a (wired tty) connection to 0 > terminate it? When is this useful? > Why shouldn't it? How else would you terminate it? Or rather, it is easier to do it this way, than to find pid's running on that line, and kill 'em separately. I could think of many reasons for wanting to terminate a terminal session. Leif To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 10 23:43:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C88914C12 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 23:43:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id XAA03249; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 23:40:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 23:40:59 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904110640.XAA03249@apollo.backplane.com> To: Greg Lehey Cc: dg@root.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Annoying debug-kernel config messages References: <199904102115.OAA01764@apollo.backplane.com> <199904110145.SAA27717@implode.root.com> <19990411112709.D2142@lemis.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :I don't like the message either, but I'm surprised that you find it so :upsetting. I run config a dozen times a day :-( Sorry Greg. I don't think it's a bad idea, but it's like taking a clue stick to people who are already mostly clueful. I make debug kernels my setting 'makeoptions' in the kernel config, aka makeoptions DEBUG="-g" I think this is the proper way to do it. This way you can just 'config' your kernel labels and not have to remember which ones are supposed to generate debug symbols and which ones are not. This ability to use makeoptions is not well documented in LINT. Considering its usefulness, it would sure be nice if someone would add and document it in LINT ( hint hint ) :-). : :Greg -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 0: 0:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from detlev.UUCP (tex-66.camalott.com [208.229.74.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE33514F4A for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 00:00:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from joelh@gnu.org) Received: (from joelh@localhost) by detlev.UUCP (8.9.3/8.9.1) id BAA05165; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 01:57:11 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from joelh) To: Leif Neland Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Baud rate of 0 References: From: Joel Ray Holveck Date: 11 Apr 1999 01:57:10 -0500 In-Reply-To: Leif Neland's message of "Sun, 11 Apr 1999 08:36:51 +0200 (CEST)" Message-ID: <86emlrzltl.fsf@detlev.UUCP> Lines: 36 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 20.3 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >> Why does setting the baud rate of a (wired tty) connection to 0 >> terminate it? When is this useful? > Why shouldn't it? > How else would you terminate it? As a program or a user? From a program's perspective, init uses revoke(2) to terminate it; this seems to be the most effective way. I'm not sure how revoke is implemented in the kernel, though; it may involve frobbing the baud rate at some point. If you're talking about doing this as a user, then I suppose that 'stty 0 < /dev/ttyS1' would do that, although is not really terribly general since it doesn't work on net connections. > Or rather, it is easier to do it this way, than to find pid's > running on that line, and kill 'em separately. Yes, that is true, although killing the process group leader seems to be generally effective as well. > I could think of many reasons for wanting to terminate a terminal > session. So can I. I just don't see why that would be a useful manner to do this. Cheers, joelh -- Joel Ray Holveck - joelh@gnu.org Fourth law of programming: Anything that can go wrong wi sendmail: segmentation violation - core dumped To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 0: 6:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE1E714F4A; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 00:06:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id AAA03493; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 00:03:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 00:03:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904110703.AAA03493@apollo.backplane.com> To: "David E. Cross" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-security@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: increased crashing in NFS server References: <199904110341.XAA17071@cs.rpi.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :I recently updated all of our FreeBSD3 clients to use NFSv3/UDP when :contacting our servers (FreeBSD3 of the same build tree). We have :noticed an increase in crashing of our main home directory server :(which is the only server really handling RW mounts, our other servers :are mostly RO, with some minor RW activity.) The first crash was :obviously NFS. I traced it to one of 2 possible crash points in the :kernel (sorry, no stack trace, we don't [yet] have a crashlogs enabled :for that machine.). : :The panic was: :mbuf siz=33476 :panic: Bad nfs svc reply You are using a 32K file block size? If so, reduce it to 8K. I think you've just shown us a security hole in the NFS system -- it panics if it is given too large a response packet. Oops. It should just print a message and drop the packet. :The second panic just happened, it claims to be softupdate related. I :think it may have something to do with NFSv3 however since this machine :used to be very stable (ie, not 2 crashes in a week). : :This panic was: :panic: softdep_write_inodeblock: indirect pointer #0 mismatch 0 != 102192 :8 :syncing disks... panic: softdep_lock: locking against myself :... : The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. :FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE #0: Sun Mar 21 02:23:19 EST 1999 : schimken@wobble.cs.rpi.edu:/usr/src/sys/compile/STAGGER :... :David Cross | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD This is when you built it. When did you check the source out of the CVS tree? There have been a few commits in this area since Mar 21st, you definitely want to update your sources, but I don't think any of the commits address the above softupdates panic. I've never seen that panic before. I recommend fsck'ing all your filesystems from single-user just in case there's some garbage in there. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 15:31:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sussie.interbizz.se (ns.datadesign.se [194.23.109.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CDD9A15422 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:31:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Joachim.Isaksson@ibfs.com) Received: from bacardi (bacardi.home.ibfs.com [194.23.109.245]) by sussie.interbizz.se (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA10018 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 16:59:22 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <000a01be842b$eeff6e10$f56d17c2@home.ibfs.com> From: "Joachim Isaksson" To: Subject: IrDA? PnP? Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 16:59:34 +0200 Organization: Interbizz Financial Systems MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I started, just for fun, to look at implementing some IrDA functionality under FreeBSD and ended up with a few question marks regarding implementation (they're all sort of interconnected) Some are probably answered before, but the mailing list search on FreeBSD.org doesn't seem to be working today :-( 1) Is anyone already working on IrDA support? If so, I'd be happy to assist time permitting. I have a lot of catching up to do on device driver writing under FreeBSD though, so can't guarantee any instant results. (anyone got a good book to recommend btw?) I've only written a couple of very simple device drivers for the initial VAX port of NetBSD, and that was quite a while ago. :) 2) If noone has already started it, how should IrDA be implemented? I started off thinking of IrDA as a bus, but then I saw something about Linux implementing it as a network protocol(?) Still it would to me make sense to implement it as a bus (a'la USB?) with PnP devices, but I'd rather have input on this before doing something terribly silly :) 3) I've been trying to understand the PnP functionality of FreeBSD, but so far I've failed miserably. Is there any good documentation on the subject besides the source code? 4) As I (so far) understand it, the PnP functionality is a special "hack" for the ISA bus right now and could not easily be extended to integrate PnP devices on the IrDA bus? Is this assumption correct? If so, is anyone working on extending PnP device management so that, for example, the kernel (or more likely a process communicating with the kernel) could dynamically load driver kernel objects if the device was plugged in? I can see that this would be very useful for PCMCIA use too, as well as USB, IrDA and ISA/PCI hotplug solutions. 5) Is there any reason (besides the probably rather major work it would mean) not to move most if not all FreeBSD drivers to dynamically loadable modules? It would sure be easier for the "common man" to add device drivers, and it would make things like PnP much easier to implement in a dynamic way. Well, that sort of sums up my questions for now, hope you're all having a good weekend! /Joachim To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 15:32:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from isbalham.ist.co.uk (isbalham.ist.co.uk [192.31.26.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3DA6D15173 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:32:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: from gid.co.uk (uucp@localhost) by isbalham.ist.co.uk (8.9.2/8.8.7) with UUCP id UAA02418; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 20:20:43 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: from [194.32.164.2] by seagoon.gid.co.uk; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 20:18:52 +0100 (BST) X-Sender: rb@194.32.164.1 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199904110345.WAA00963@detlev.UUCP> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 20:18:49 +0000 To: joelh@gnu.org From: Bob Bishop Subject: Re: Baud rate of 0 Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, At 10:45 pm -0500 10/4/99, Joel Ray Holveck wrote: >Why does setting the baud rate of a (wired tty) connection to 0 >terminate it? When is this useful? It's been the standard way of hanging up a modem since V7 at least. -- Bob Bishop (0118) 977 4017 international code +44 118 rb@gid.co.uk fax (0118) 989 4254 between 0800 and 1800 UK To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 15:33: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E992515312 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:32:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id XAA29472; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 23:31:27 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <3710ADCC.E6FC6A49@newsguy.com> Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 23:12:28 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bob Willcox Cc: Greg Lehey , Dom Mitchell , Wes Peters , justin@apple.com, Esry Don-FDE005 , Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Volume managers (was: Separate boot partition?) References: <19990408084822.X2142@lemis.com> <19990408173016.X2142@lemis.com> <19990410150702.D25635@luke.pmr.com> <37101FC3.FC873691@newsguy.com> <19990411081951.A33484@luke.pmr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Bob Willcox wrote: > > Doing it off-line isn't nearly as challenging (or interesting) and > wasn't what people were wanting at the time. Agreed, but you weren't clear on wanting to do it while the fs is mounted. For instance, HP-UX can't even increase the size while the fs is mounted (shame on them! :). -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "nothing better than the ability to perform cunning linguistics" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 15:43: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from frmug.org (frmug-gw.frmug.org [193.56.58.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50E1715C05 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:36:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by frmug.org (8.9.1/frmug-2.3/nospam) with UUCP id LAA23212 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 11:10:26 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: by keltia.freenix.fr (Postfix, from userid 101) id 4A40387B6; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 07:31:48 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 07:31:48 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Baud rate of 0 Message-ID: <19990411073148.A32823@keltia.freenix.fr> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <199904110345.WAA00963@detlev.UUCP> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <199904110345.WAA00963@detlev.UUCP>; from Joel Ray Holveck on Sat, Apr 10, 1999 at 10:45:10PM -0500 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT/ELF ctm#5173 AMD-K6 MMX @ 200 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG According to Joel Ray Holveck: > Why does setting the baud rate of a (wired tty) connection to 0 > terminate it? When is this useful? Historical behaviour. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 4.0-CURRENT #70: Sat Feb 27 09:43:08 CET 1999 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 15:47:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gidgate.gid.co.uk (gidgate.gid.co.uk [193.123.140.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C05E162DB for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:41:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: (from rb@localhost) by gidgate.gid.co.uk (8.8.8/8.8.7) id NAA05733 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 13:26:24 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from rb) Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 13:26:24 +0100 (BST) From: Bob Bishop Message-Id: <199904111226.NAA05733@gidgate.gid.co.uk> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: arp weirdness Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, I've just upgraded a pair of servers which each have more than one netcard and sit on multiple networks, with aliases. The catch is that two of the networks are on the same physical cable. Eg: ed1: flags=8843 mtu 1500 inet 192.31.26.1 netmask 0xffffff00 broadcast 192.31.26.255 inet 192.31.26.2 netmask 0xffffffff broadcast 192.31.26.2 ether 00:00:c0:6d:1a:bc ed2: flags=8843 mtu 1500 inet 193.123.140.10 netmask 0xffffff00 broadcast 193.123.140.255 inet 193.123.140.99 netmask 0xffffffff broadcast 193.123.140.99 ether 00:40:95:15:42:7d I'm getting lots of messages like the following (edited for readability): /kernel: arp: 192.31.26.12 is on ed1 but got reply from 00:20:18:2c:26:6f on ed2 Anything I can do about this (apart from cabling or a kernel hack!)? TIA To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 15:51:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (osmium.gn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51CE316EB3 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:47:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wilko@yedi.iaf.nl) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (8.9.2/8.9.2) with UUCP id RAA16217; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 17:05:03 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.8.8/8.6.12) id NAA00980; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 13:48:36 +0200 (CEST) From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199904111148.NAA00980@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: Annoying debug-kernel config messages In-Reply-To: <199904102115.OAA01764@apollo.backplane.com> from Matthew Dillon at "Apr 10, 1999 2:15:30 pm" To: dillon@apollo.backplane.com (Matthew Dillon) Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 13:48:36 +0200 (CEST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem, The Netherlands X-pgp-info: PGP public key at 'finger wilko@freefall.freebsd.org' X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As Matthew Dillon wrote ... > I am getting wholely sick of this blasted config message. If you are > going to print the message, print it once and be done with it. Not > every time I config! I'd get rid of the message entirely, in fact. It was useful to me the first time. Then it became annoying. Interestingly enough the 'usage' is outdated: p100#config -? config: illegal option -- ? usage: config [-gpr] sysname as it does not mention -s > Also, if you guys insist of making 'make' generate a debug kernel called > 'kernel.debug' by default, at LEAST objcopy it to 'kernel' to generate > the non-debug version during the main 'make' procedure rather then > during the 'make install' procedure. Not all of us use make install to > install new kernels. > > I've gone from having to cp/strip to having to objcopy. My life is not > made easier. > > I don't mind generating both a debug and non-debug kernel by default. But > it must be done in the correct fashion. Why both? Takes quite some extra time on slower machines. If people are going after a bug needing a full 'symbolised' kernel let them run the correct config invocation. I suggest putting the new config behaviour in UPDATING and remove the message. > apollo:/usr/src/sys/i386/conf# config TEST2 > Building kernel with full debugging symbols. Do <<<<<< > "config -s TEST2" for historic partial symbolic support. <<<<<< > To install the debugging kernel, do make install.debug <<<<<< > Don't forget to do a ``make depend'' > Kernel build directory is ../../compile/TEST2 Groeten / Cheers, Wilko _ ______________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Arnhem, The Netherlands |/|/ / / /( (_) Bulte WWW : http://www.tcja.nl _______________________ Powered by FreeBSD ___ http://www.freebsd.org _____ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 16: 8:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from reliam.teaser.fr (reliam.teaser.fr [194.51.80.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B5E11634A for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:42:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nsouch@teaser.fr) Received: from teaser.fr (ppp1087-ft.teaser.fr [194.206.156.40]) by reliam.teaser.fr (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA20707; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:39:42 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from nsouch@localhost) by teaser.fr (8.9.2/8.9.1) id PAA02866; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:38:36 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from nsouch) Message-ID: <19990411153832.10625@breizh.teaser.fr> Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:38:32 +0200 From: Nicolas Souchu To: Nick Sayer Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Any updates to ppbus? References: <199904082057.NAA44080@medusa.kfu.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199904082057.NAA44080@medusa.kfu.com>; from Nick Sayer on Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 01:57:09PM -0700 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD breizh 4.0-CURRENT FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 08, 1999 at 01:57:09PM -0700, Nick Sayer wrote: > >I tried looking in the archives and in the CVS repository, but >didn't find anything. One of my 3.1 machines has an HP 540 >on it. When used with lpt0, it works perfectly. With nlpt0 and >the requisite ppbus stuff, it fails miserably, giving, perhaps >a dozen lines correctly, then turning into garbage. I did note >in the mailing list archives that I am not the only one, but >I never saw a solution. Is there one? Dump me your dmesg. I'll see what your parallel port chipset is. Does it work well with 'lptcontrol -p'? Did you also try 'lptcontrol -e'? > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > -- nsouch@teaser.fr / nsouch@freebsd.org FreeBSD - Turning PCs into workstations - http://www.FreeBSD.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 16: 9:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.43.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BEA20163B8 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:43:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jwm@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU) Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (8.8.8/) via ESMTP id OAA22352 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 14:16:45 -0700 (PDT) env-from (jwm@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU) Message-Id: <199904112116.OAA22352@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: read() and pread() syscalls Reply-To: jwm@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 14:16:45 -0700 From: John Milford Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Should read() be turned into a library function now that we have pread(), and read() is a proper subset of pread()? I am not sure if this is a POSIX compliance issue, but I've been digging around in this code recently, and it seems that there is a lot of overlap in the read system calls, and we might want to consider doing something similar to the approach taken with wait(). I could understand that this case is different so we may not want to be doing conversion of read() or readv() into a hypothetical preadv(), but I can see no issue with converting read()'s into pread()'s. I am willing to make this change and submit diffs, if it is something that makes sense to folks on the list. --John To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 16:17:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4EE115020 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:53:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bob@luke.pmr.com) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id IAA33528; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 08:19:51 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bob) Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 08:19:51 -0500 From: Bob Willcox To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Cc: Bob Willcox , Greg Lehey , Dom Mitchell , Wes Peters , justin@apple.com, Esry Don-FDE005 , Ollivier Robert , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Volume managers (was: Separate boot partition?) Message-ID: <19990411081951.A33484@luke.pmr.com> Reply-To: Bob Willcox References: <19990408084822.X2142@lemis.com> <19990408173016.X2142@lemis.com> <19990410150702.D25635@luke.pmr.com> <37101FC3.FC873691@newsguy.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <37101FC3.FC873691@newsguy.com>; from Daniel C. Sobral on Sun, Apr 11, 1999 at 01:06:28PM +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Apr 11, 1999 at 01:06:28PM +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > Bob Willcox wrote: > > > > Another anecodotal aside, in AIX there was always someone asking for > > this same functionality. Though Al Chang (author of IBM's JFS and VMM > > in AIX) thought that it could be done, it would be quite difficult and > > the risk of data loss would be very high. As far as I know, it was never > > implemented. > > A third-party product was available for doing that, but not on-line. Doing it off-line isn't nearly as challenging (or interesting) and wasn't what people were wanting at the time. Bob -- Bob Willcox The man who follows the crowd will usually get no bob@luke.pmr.com further than the crowd. The man who walks alone is Austin, TX likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. -- Alan Ashley-Pitt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 16:17:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns1.seidata.com (ns1.seidata.com [208.10.211.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A80215284 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:56:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@seidata.com) Received: from localhost (mike@localhost) by ns1.seidata.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA15476; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:04:29 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:04:29 -0400 (EDT) From: To: "Christopher R. Bowman" Cc: Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Free book to good home In-Reply-To: <199904101849.OAA05615@quark.ChrisBowman.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 10 Apr 1999, Christopher R. Bowman wrote: > I have ended up with an extra copy of: > > UNIX Network Programming: Interprocess Communications Vol 2 Second Ed > by W Richard Stevens. I'm sure you've already gotten flooded with responses... but if the book is still available, I'd like to buy it (not just take it). I'm relocating to San Francisco with Qwest Communications on the 26th, so a move, etc. has be tied up right now, but I'd be glad to get you my address there (and get yours so I can forward you a check) if this offer is still available. Later, -Mike To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 16:18: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32771154B9 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:55:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA00601; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 08:14:29 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 08:14:28 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Matthew Dillon Cc: Greg Lehey , dg@root.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Annoying debug-kernel config messages In-Reply-To: <199904110640.XAA03249@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 10 Apr 1999, Matthew Dillon wrote: > > :I don't like the message either, but I'm surprised that you find it so > :upsetting. > > I run config a dozen times a day :-( Sorry Greg. I don't think it's > a bad idea, but it's like taking a clue stick to people who are already > mostly clueful. You know, ALL you folks complaining, while being right, ought to remember that Greg was very nice about trying to get feedback before he did this. If you don't like it now, fine, and maybe it ought to be reverted, but Greg did precisely the right thing in the right way, and maybe saying that (at least once) when you complain, would be fitting. You're going to introduce too much lethargy into committers, if you show them that even giving clear notice won't save them from being dumped on. > > I make debug kernels my setting 'makeoptions' in the kernel config, aka > > makeoptions DEBUG="-g" > > I think this is the proper way to do it. This way you can just 'config' > your kernel labels and not have to remember which ones are supposed to > generate debug symbols and which ones are not. > > This ability to use makeoptions is not well documented in LINT. > Considering its usefulness, it would sure be nice if someone would add > and document it in LINT ( hint hint ) :-). > > : > :Greg > > -Matt > Matthew Dillon > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 16:18:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-out2.apple.com (mail-out2.apple.com [17.254.0.51]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F406154D2 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 16:03:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from justin@walker3.apple.com) Received: from mailgate1.apple.com (A17-128-100-225.apple.com [17.128.100.225]) by mail-out2.apple.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA22742 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:55:36 -0700 Received: from scv2.apple.com (scv2.apple.com) by mailgate1.apple.com (mailgate1.apple.com- SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:55:26 -0700 Received: from walker3.apple.com (walker3.apple.com [17.219.24.201]) by scv2.apple.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA03756; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:55:24 -0700 Received: by walker3.apple.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) id PAA01954; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:55:28 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904112255.PAA01954@walker3.apple.com> To: Joachim Isaksson Subject: Re: IrDA? PnP? Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 15:55:24 -0700 From: "Justin C. Walker" Reply-To: justin@apple.com X-Mailer: by Apple MailViewer (2.105.dev) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > 2) If noone has already started it, how should IrDA be implemented? > I started off thinking of IrDA as a bus, but then I saw something about > Linux implementing it as a network protocol(?) Still it would to me make > sense to implement it as a bus (a'la USB?) with PnP devices, but I'd rather > have input on this before doing something terribly silly. I don't have much to add to the discussion, but FYI, you can find info at www.irda.org. For reasons that escape me, the good folks working on this elected to duplicate most of the IP functionality (media layer, network layer, a couple of transports, name resolution, ...) rather than treat the IrDA as a media type (as done, e.g., with IRtalk by Apple some time back). Therefore, you get all the benefits of IP over, say, ATM; that is, a lot of wasted cycles to get your bits flowing. One man's opinion, of course :-} Regards, Justin Justin C. Walker, Curmudgeon-At-Large * Institute for General Semantics | Manager, CoreOS Networking | Men are from Earth. Apple Computer, Inc. | Women are from Earth. 2 Infinite Loop | Deal with it. Cupertino, CA 95014 | *-------------------------------------*-------------------------------* To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 16:29:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 374AC15612; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 16:06:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA25039; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 13:10:30 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904111710.NAA25039@cs.rpi.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: crossd@cs.rpi.edu, freebsd-security@freebsd.org, schimken@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: increased crashing in NFS server In-Reply-To: Message from Matthew Dillon of "Sun, 11 Apr 1999 00:03:49 PDT." <199904110703.AAA03493@apollo.backplane.com> Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 13:10:30 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > : The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. > :FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE #0: Sun Mar 21 02:23:19 EST 1999 > : schimken@wobble.cs.rpi.edu:/usr/src/sys/compile/STAGGER > :... > :David Cross | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD > > This is when you built it. When did you check the source out of the CVS > tree? As was pointed out to me (and sent to Matt). A checkout on the 26th would not have been possible. It was checked out on the previous Friday, the 19th. -- David Cross | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | This space intentionally Department of Computer Science | left unblank I speak only for myself. | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 16:29:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BA0015C37; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 16:06:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id MAA24421; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 12:00:09 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904111600.MAA24421@cs.rpi.edu> To: Matthew Dillon Cc: "David E. Cross" , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-security@freebsd.org, schimken@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: increased crashing in NFS server In-Reply-To: Message from Matthew Dillon of "Sun, 11 Apr 1999 00:03:49 PDT." <199904110703.AAA03493@apollo.backplane.com> Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 12:00:04 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > :I recently updated all of our FreeBSD3 clients to use NFSv3/UDP when > :contacting our servers (FreeBSD3 of the same build tree). We have > :noticed an increase in crashing of our main home directory server > :(which is the only server really handling RW mounts, our other servers > :are mostly RO, with some minor RW activity.) The first crash was > :obviously NFS. I traced it to one of 2 possible crash points in the > :kernel (sorry, no stack trace, we don't [yet] have a crashlogs enabled > :for that machine.). > : > :The panic was: > :mbuf siz=33476 > :panic: Bad nfs svc reply > > You are using a 32K file block size? If so, reduce it to 8K. > > I think you've just shown us a security hole in the NFS system -- it > panics if it is given too large a response packet. Oops. It should > just print a message and drop the packet. We are using AMD, so I have no idea what size it is using. I will again say that it would be really nice to be able to query the full mount options. I have tried statfs(2), but it does not seem to have what I want. I will tell amd to use rsize/wsize of 8192 to force the issue. It is becoming slightly annoying that amd would cdefault to unstable options ;) > :The second panic just happened, it claims to be softupdate related. I > :think it may have something to do with NFSv3 however since this machine > :used to be very stable (ie, not 2 crashes in a week). > : > :This panic was: > :panic: softdep_write_inodeblock: indirect pointer #0 mismatch 0 != 102192 > :8 > :syncing disks... panic: softdep_lock: locking against myself > :... > : The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. > :FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE #0: Sun Mar 21 02:23:19 EST 1999 > : schimken@wobble.cs.rpi.edu:/usr/src/sys/compile/STAGGER > :... > > This is when you built it. When did you check the source out of the CVS > tree? > > There have been a few commits in this area since Mar 21st, you definitely > want to update your sources, but I don't think any of the commits address > the above softupdates panic. I've never seen that panic before. > > I recommend fsck'ing all your filesystems from single-user just in case > there's some garbage in there. Ok, we will do all of that when we can schedule a convienient downtime. The sources were checked out arround noon, Fri, Mar 26. Is it possibly a NFS3/Softupdates problem? All the exported filesystems on that drive are softupdate mounted, and the only access to that filesystem is via NFS. -- David Cross | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | This space intentionally Department of Computer Science | left unblank I speak only for myself. | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 16:47:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from november.jaded.net (november.jaded.net [209.90.128.250]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 492EB15B3A for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 16:19:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dan@november.jaded.net) Received: (from dan@localhost) by november.jaded.net (8.9.3/8.9.3+trinsec_nospam) id TAA65752 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 19:20:38 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 19:20:38 -0400 From: Dan Moschuk To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: CPU info not being reported? Message-ID: <19990411192038.A65718@trinsec.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greetings, Not really a problem per se but just a question of general interest. I noticed something today that I've never seen before... CPU states: 0.0% user, 0.0% nice, 0.0% system, 0.0% interrupt, 0.0% idle What would cause that? Regards, Dan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 16:47:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A05015DC3 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 16:20:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id IAA06827; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 08:48:27 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id IAA45994; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 08:48:26 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990412084825.L2142@lemis.com> Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 08:48:25 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Wilko Bulte , Matthew Dillon Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Annoying debug-kernel config messages References: <199904102115.OAA01764@apollo.backplane.com> <199904111148.NAA00980@yedi.iaf.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904111148.NAA00980@yedi.iaf.nl>; from Wilko Bulte on Sun, Apr 11, 1999 at 01:48:36PM +0200 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sunday, 11 April 1999 at 13:48:36 +0200, Wilko Bulte wrote: > As Matthew Dillon wrote ... >> I am getting wholely sick of this blasted config message. If you are >> going to print the message, print it once and be done with it. Not >> every time I config! I'd get rid of the message entirely, in fact. > > It was useful to me the first time. Then it became annoying. > > Interestingly enough the 'usage' is outdated: > > p100#config -? > config: illegal option -- ? > usage: config [-gpr] sysname > > as it does not mention -s Yes, I missed this, but ache fixed it a little later. > >> Also, if you guys insist of making 'make' generate a debug kernel called >> 'kernel.debug' by default, at LEAST objcopy it to 'kernel' to generate >> the non-debug version during the main 'make' procedure rather then >> during the 'make install' procedure. Not all of us use make install to >> install new kernels. >> >> I've gone from having to cp/strip to having to objcopy. My life is not >> made easier. >> >> I don't mind generating both a debug and non-debug kernel by default. But >> it must be done in the correct fashion. > > Why both? Takes quite some extra time on slower machines. If people are > going after a bug needing a full 'symbolised' kernel let them run the > correct config invocation. With the debug option, the Makefile builds a debug kernel kernel.debug, and then uses objcopy to create a stripped version called kernel. The additional time is negligible. We've done the reasoning to death here already: the debug kernel is good for crash dumps, but it's not needed in the root file system. > I suggest putting the new config behaviour in UPDATING and remove > the message. Well, three core team members have asked me to remove the defaults, so I have done so. When I recover, I'll start a new discussion on -arch, since it seems that few core team members read -hackers. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 16:50:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDBDA15F46 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 16:35:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id QAA08352; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 16:33:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 16:33:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904112333.QAA08352@apollo.backplane.com> To: John Milford Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls References: <199904112116.OAA22352@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : Should read() be turned into a library function now that we :have pread(), and read() is a proper subset of pread()? I am not sure :if this is a POSIX compliance issue, but I've been digging around in :this code recently, and it seems that there is a lot of overlap in the :read system calls, and we might want to consider doing something :similar to the approach taken with wait(). I could understand that :this case is different so we may not want to be doing conversion of :read() or readv() into a hypothetical preadv(), but I can see no issue :with converting read()'s into pread()'s. : : I am willing to make this change and submit diffs, if it is :something that makes sense to folks on the list. : : : --John No. This would screw up backwards compatibility and, besides, read()'s semantics cannot be simulated with pread() because read() updates the offset stored in the file descriptor and pread() does not. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 16:53:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F738155AA; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 16:51:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.2/8.9.1) id BAA07847; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 01:48:46 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 12 Apr 1999 01:48:45 +0200 Message-ID: Lines: 47 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hey gang, Here are a few ideas I have running around my head about things I'd love to see happen to -CURRENT: - Finish the transition to the new sysctl code. Doug committed the "killer patch" on 02/16: sysctls can now be registered and unregistered dynamically, which allows KLD modules to decalre sysctl variables. Let's get rid of the hardcoded sysctl OIDs and declare all sysctl variables with OID_AUTO. I have patches for all the _net_inet sysctls (including patches for userland code which uses them). This change will be a flag day, since it will break binary compatibility with userland code which references sysctl variables by numeric ID rather than by name. - Revamp the PCI code. Voices in my head tell me Doug has patches that allow converting all PCI device drivers to KLD modules. Me want! - Making more kernel tunables settable by the boot loader. I'd *particularly* like to be able to specify the location of init at boot time. If somebody can give me a hint on how to do that, I'm willing to do the work myself. - Kernel threads. 'nuff said. - Smaller-grained locks in the SMP code. - New rc system (e.g. http://www.freebsd.org/~eivind/newrc.html) - Working stacking layers, proper vnode locking, working NULLFS and friends (Eivind is working on that, with moral support from yours truly) - Native DPT support, including the configuration stuff. This requires implementing a few compatibility ioctls to get DPT's SCO software running on FreeBSD (they were present in the old DPT driver, but got nuked on C-day) - Fuller-featured sound drivers so we can nuke VoxWare once and for all - Insert Your Favorite Vapor Feature: ____________________________ DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 17: 4:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.43.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D270F153A8 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 17:04:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jwm@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU) Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (8.8.8/) via ESMTP id RAA15550; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 17:02:10 -0700 (PDT) env-from (jwm@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU) Message-Id: <199904120002.RAA15550@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU> To: Matthew Dillon Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls In-reply-to: Message from Matthew Dillon of "Sun, 11 Apr 1999 16:33:35 PDT." <199904112333.QAA08352@apollo.backplane.com> Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 17:02:10 -0700 From: John Milford Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matthew Dillon wrote: > No. This would screw up backwards compatibility and, besides, > read()'s semantics cannot be simulated with pread() because > read() updates the offset stored in the file descriptor and > pread() does not. > > -Matt > Sorry that slipped by me. THanks for the quick reply. --John To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 17:21:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EEE2514F8A for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 17:21:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com ([204.68.178.225]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA04924; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:19:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <37113C04.66E6D463@softweyr.com> Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:19:16 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Joachim Isaksson Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: IrDA? PnP? References: <000a01be842b$eeff6e10$f56d17c2@home.ibfs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Joachim Isaksson wrote: > > I started, just for fun, to look at implementing some IrDA functionality > under FreeBSD and ended up with a few question marks regarding > implementation (they're all sort of interconnected) Some are probably > answered before, but the mailing list search on FreeBSD.org doesn't seem to > be working today :-( > > 1) Is anyone already working on IrDA support? I've been toying with IrLAN support a little bit. Linux 2.2 has some limited support for this, so I'll be looking at what they've done for pointers on strategy and documentation. > If so, I'd be happy to assist time permitting. I have a lot of catching up > to do on device driver writing under FreeBSD though, so can't guarantee any > instant results. (anyone got a good book to recommend btw?) I've only > written a couple of very simple device drivers for the initial VAX port of > NetBSD, and that was quite a while ago. :) I'm not exactly a device driver maven either, but I've done a lot of device and network level work on other systems. My biggest problem is time, but that is becoming less of a problem now, for the next few months. > 2) If noone has already started it, how should IrDA be implemented? > I started off thinking of IrDA as a bus, but then I saw something about > Linux implementing it as a network protocol(?) Still it would to me make > sense to implement it as a bus (a'la USB?) with PnP devices, but I'd rather > have input on this before doing something terribly silly :) Actually, it's a whole bunch of semi-related protocols. Support for Ir printers would be nice, but I'm mostly interested in using it as a network link for laptops initially. Sure, 4mbps isn't screaming fast, but it's entirely acceptable for email and web surfing, where your ultimate desitnation is a shared T1 (or less) to the internet. > 3) I've been trying to understand the PnP functionality of FreeBSD, but so > far I've failed miserably. Is there any good documentation on the subject > besides the source code? > > 4) As I (so far) understand it, the PnP functionality is a special "hack" > for the ISA bus right now and could not easily be extended to integrate PnP > devices on the IrDA bus? Is this assumption correct? If so, is anyone > working on extending PnP device management so that, for example, the kernel > (or more likely a process communicating with the kernel) could dynamically > load driver kernel objects if the device was plugged in? I can see that this > would be very useful for PCMCIA use too, as well as USB, IrDA and ISA/PCI > hotplug solutions. And CardBus, while we're cleaning up the world. > 5) Is there any reason (besides the probably rather major work it would > mean) not to move most if not all FreeBSD drivers to dynamically loadable > modules? It would sure be easier for the "common man" to add device drivers, > and it would make things like PnP much easier to implement in a dynamic way. > > Well, that sort of sums up my questions for now, hope you're all having a > good weekend! Quite good so far. One birthday party and now off to buy a car. Not much time for hacking, though. ;^) -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 17:36:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EFA8314BE0 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 17:36:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA01522; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 19:47:48 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 19:47:46 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 12 Apr 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > Hey gang, > > Here are a few ideas I have running around my head about things I'd > love to see happen to -CURRENT: > > - Finish the transition to the new sysctl code. Doug committed the > "killer patch" on 02/16: sysctls can now be registered and > unregistered dynamically, which allows KLD modules to decalre > sysctl variables. Let's get rid of the hardcoded sysctl OIDs > and declare all sysctl variables with OID_AUTO. I have patches for > all the _net_inet sysctls (including patches for userland code > which uses them). This change will be a flag day, since it will > break binary compatibility with userland code which references > sysctl variables by numeric ID rather than by name. > > - Revamp the PCI code. Voices in my head tell me Doug has patches > that allow converting all PCI device drivers to KLD modules. Me > want! > > - Making more kernel tunables settable by the boot loader. I'd > *particularly* like to be able to specify the location of init at > boot time. If somebody can give me a hint on how to do that, I'm > willing to do the work myself. very easily done, take a peak at sys/kern/init_main.c around line 594 just use getenv() to get at the enviorment passed in by the bootloader. i don't have my cvs repo, else i'd do it. > - Kernel threads. 'nuff said. > > - Smaller-grained locks in the SMP code. > > - New rc system (e.g. http://www.freebsd.org/~eivind/newrc.html) > > - Working stacking layers, proper vnode locking, working NULLFS and > friends (Eivind is working on that, with moral support from yours > truly) > > - Native DPT support, including the configuration stuff. This > requires implementing a few compatibility ioctls to get DPT's SCO > software running on FreeBSD (they were present in the old DPT > driver, but got nuked on C-day) yes yes yes yes and YES!... > > - Fuller-featured sound drivers so we can nuke VoxWare once and for > all besideds mmap() support, what is missing? > > - Insert Your Favorite Vapor Feature: ____________________________ sparc64, LFS... *hides* -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 17:46:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1609914FEF for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 17:46:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.2/8.9.1) id CAA08429; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 02:44:30 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: Alfred Perlstein Cc: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT References: From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 12 Apr 1999 02:44:29 +0200 In-Reply-To: Alfred Perlstein's message of "Sun, 11 Apr 1999 19:47:46 -0500 (EST)" Message-ID: Lines: 28 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Alfred Perlstein writes: > On 12 Apr 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > - Fuller-featured sound drivers so we can nuke VoxWare once and for > > all > besideds mmap() support, what is missing? MIDI support, FM synthesis... > > - Insert Your Favorite Vapor Feature: ____________________________ > sparc64, LFS... *hides* Oh, yes! I forgot to add: more architecture ports, beginning with MIPS and Sparc. I also forgot to add: now that we've seen that PicoBSD works, perhaps it's time to take it beyond the proof-of-concept stage? In its current state, it's nowhere near production quality and I'm sure Bruce would have a fit if he ever stumbled across some of the code in there. I also think it's wrong to have PicoBSD hidden away in src/release, and to have tinyware hidden away in PicoBSD. One more thing: fixing the build system to make it possible to make a static binary of *any* program by just defining a symbol (e.g. cd /usr/src/usr.bin/tftp ; make -DSTATIC) DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 18: 4:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lestat.nas.nasa.gov (lestat.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.50.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 734AB14CAE for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:04:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from thorpej@lestat.nas.nasa.gov) Received: from lestat (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lestat.nas.nasa.gov (8.8.8/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA24587; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:02:09 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904120102.SAA24587@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> To: jwm@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls Reply-To: Jason Thorpe From: Jason Thorpe Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:02:08 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 11 Apr 1999 14:16:45 -0700 John Milford wrote: > Should read() be turned into a library function now that we > have pread(), and read() is a proper subset of pread()? I am not sure Not that I care too much, since read/pread, etc work fine in NetBSD (which is what I use), but... read() is _NOT_ a subset if pread() in the common sense. read() works from the current file offset, while pread() always takes an explicit offset. There is no way to emulate read() with pread() in userspace. > if this is a POSIX compliance issue, but I've been digging around in > this code recently, and it seems that there is a lot of overlap in the > read system calls, and we might want to consider doing something > similar to the approach taken with wait(). I could understand that > this case is different so we may not want to be doing conversion of > read() or readv() into a hypothetical preadv(), but I can see no issue > with converting read()'s into pread()'s. ...and why not implement preadv()? I did when I implemented pread()/pwrite() in NetBSD. But, see above about it not being possible to emulate read() with pread() in userspace. -- Jason R. Thorpe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 18:13: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.43.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E76C114CAE for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:13:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jwm@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU) Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (8.8.8/) via ESMTP id SAA25240; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:10:45 -0700 (PDT) env-from (jwm@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU) Message-Id: <199904120110.SAA25240@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU> To: Jason Thorpe Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls In-reply-to: Message from Jason Thorpe of "Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:02:08 PDT." <199904120102.SAA24587@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:10:45 -0700 From: John Milford Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jason Thorpe wrote: > On Sun, 11 Apr 1999 14:16:45 -0700 > John Milford wrote: > > > Should read() be turned into a library function now that we > > have pread(), and read() is a proper subset of pread()? I am not sure > > Not that I care too much, since read/pread, etc work fine in NetBSD (which > is what I use), but... > > read() is _NOT_ a subset if pread() in the common sense. read() works > from the current file offset, while pread() always takes an explicit offset. > > There is no way to emulate read() with pread() in userspace. > > > if this is a POSIX compliance issue, but I've been digging around in > > this code recently, and it seems that there is a lot of overlap in the > > read system calls, and we might want to consider doing something > > similar to the approach taken with wait(). I could understand that > > this case is different so we may not want to be doing conversion of > > read() or readv() into a hypothetical preadv(), but I can see no issue > > with converting read()'s into pread()'s. > > ...and why not implement preadv()? I did when I implemented pread()/pwrite() > in NetBSD. > > But, see above about it not being possible to emulate read() with pread() > in userspace. > Yeah, I sort let that slip by me. However the concept of emulating read() with readv() and pread() with preadv() does seem valid. I originally was looking at emulating read() with readv() from userspace, but when pread showed up it looked like a better match, unfortuantely I didn't look close enough. It would appear that there is no efficiency trade off in a read() to readv() user space conversion since the kernel essentially does the convertion internally anyway. --JOhn To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 18:23:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B195C14FF4 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:23:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA35677; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 21:20:55 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 21:20:53 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: Jason Thorpe Cc: jwm@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls In-Reply-To: <199904120102.SAA24587@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 11 Apr 1999, Jason Thorpe wrote: > On Sun, 11 Apr 1999 14:16:45 -0700 > John Milford wrote: > > > Should read() be turned into a library function now that we > > have pread(), and read() is a proper subset of pread()? I am not sure > > Not that I care too much, since read/pread, etc work fine in NetBSD (which > is what I use), but... > > read() is _NOT_ a subset if pread() in the common sense. read() works > from the current file offset, while pread() always takes an explicit offset. > > There is no way to emulate read() with pread() in userspace. > > > if this is a POSIX compliance issue, but I've been digging around in > > this code recently, and it seems that there is a lot of overlap in the > > read system calls, and we might want to consider doing something > > similar to the approach taken with wait(). I could understand that > > this case is different so we may not want to be doing conversion of > > read() or readv() into a hypothetical preadv(), but I can see no issue > > with converting read()'s into pread()'s. > > ...and why not implement preadv()? I did when I implemented pread()/pwrite() > in NetBSD. > > But, see above about it not being possible to emulate read() with pread() > in userspace. You mean, without lseek(2) =) > > -- Jason R. Thorpe > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 18:25:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lestat.nas.nasa.gov (lestat.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.50.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A46E1511F for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:25:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from thorpej@lestat.nas.nasa.gov) Received: from lestat (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lestat.nas.nasa.gov (8.8.8/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA24995; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:23:32 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904120123.SAA24995@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: Alfred Perlstein , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT Reply-To: Jason Thorpe From: Jason Thorpe Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:23:32 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 12 Apr 1999 02:44:29 +0200 Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > Alfred Perlstein writes: > > On 12 Apr 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > > - Fuller-featured sound drivers so we can nuke VoxWare once and for > > > all > > besideds mmap() support, what is missing? > > MIDI support, FM synthesis... FWIW, mmap, MIDI, and FM synth are all there in the NetBSD audio code. > > sparc64, LFS... *hides* ..FWIW, LFS works in NetBSD now. -- Jason R. Thorpe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 18:29: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F118714CE6 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:29:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id SAA11924; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:26:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:26:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904120126.SAA11924@apollo.backplane.com> To: Brian Feldman Cc: Jason Thorpe , jwm@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> But, see above about it not being possible to emulate read() with pread() :> in userspace. : :You mean, without lseek(2) =) pread/pwrite + lseek is not atomic, so exact emulation is not possible. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 18:29:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lestat.nas.nasa.gov (lestat.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.50.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A2BD14E21 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:29:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from thorpej@lestat.nas.nasa.gov) Received: from lestat (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lestat.nas.nasa.gov (8.8.8/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA25072; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:27:05 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904120127.SAA25072@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> To: John Milford Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls Reply-To: Jason Thorpe From: Jason Thorpe Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:27:04 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:10:45 -0700 John Milford wrote: > Yeah, I sort let that slip by me. However the concept of > emulating read() with readv() and pread() with preadv() does seem > valid. I originally was looking at emulating read() with readv() > from userspace, but when pread showed up it looked like a better > match, unfortuantely I didn't look close enough. It would appear that > there is no efficiency trade off in a read() to readv() user space > conversion since the kernel essentially does the convertion internally > anyway. ...and since you must provide the old syscall stubs for binary compatibility, and the read() interface is much easier for some things to deal with (e.g. assembly language), "what's the point"? Just share as much of the in-kernel code as you can. -- Jason R. Thorpe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 18:29:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns1.seidata.com (ns1.seidata.com [208.10.211.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DDBB14EA7 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 18:29:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@seidata.com) Received: from localhost (mike@localhost) by ns1.seidata.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA20852 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 21:27:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 21:27:26 -0400 (EDT) From: To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Free book to good home In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 11 Apr 1999 mike@seidata.com wrote: > I'm sure you've already gotten flooded with responses... but if the > book is still available, I'd like to buy it (not just take it). I'm [snip] To Hackers: Sorry for my stupidity. Later, -Mike To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 20:16:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 63FE3151F3 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 20:16:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA36823; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 23:14:17 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 23:14:16 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: Matthew Dillon Cc: Jason Thorpe , jwm@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls In-Reply-To: <199904120126.SAA11924@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 11 Apr 1999, Matthew Dillon wrote: > :> But, see above about it not being possible to emulate read() with pread() > :> in userspace. > : > :You mean, without lseek(2) =) > > pread/pwrite + lseek is not atomic, so exact emulation is not > possible. That's true (didn't think about atomicity). But on the other hand, I would oppose read being taken away and replaced with readv. It would break backward compatibility. And if the syscall slot was still there and read was there, there's no reason to have a readv wrapper... What was the point of this whole thing? > > -Matt > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 20:52:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-01.cdsnet.net (mail-01.cdsnet.net [206.107.16.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 9AD4D1521B for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 20:52:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mrcpu@internetcds.com) Received: (qmail 6633 invoked from network); 12 Apr 1999 03:50:21 -0000 Received: from schizo.cdsnet.net (204.118.244.32) by mail.cdsnet.net with SMTP; 12 Apr 1999 03:50:21 -0000 Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 20:49:16 -0700 (PDT) From: Jaye Mathisen X-Sender: mrcpu@schizo.cdsnet.net To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 12 Apr 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > Hey gang, > > Here are a few ideas I have running around my head about things I'd > love to see happen to -CURRENT: > > - Insert Your Favorite Vapor Feature: ____________________________ OK: 1) A method to communicate successful boot (persistence) between the kernel and the bootblocks, so if a newly built kernel fails to boot, it drops back to the older kernel, and reboots with it. 2) The more NFS fixes the better. 3) Working DOS fbsdboot.exe (for 3.1 stable actually, but -current would be fine. :) 4) PXE boot environment support ala intel 5) PAM enhancements to make PAM support full-featured. 6) As many devices moved to KLD's as possible. 7) The return of the single floppy boot (perhaps via building more than 1 GENERIC. :()) 8) More of the tweaks, knobs, and frobs documented, and as many as possible made into sysctl's. 9) A extension credential mechanism that only allows certain binaries access to certain files... :) 10) ACL's ala Domain/OS 11) Movement of SMB support into the kernel, rather than a user process for maximum performance. (Gotta kick NT's butt, and wouldn't mind dusting Linux in the process). OK, I'm done for now... To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 21:15: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1215814F5B for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 21:14:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.2/8.9.1) id GAA09043; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 06:12:36 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: Jaye Mathisen Cc: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT References: From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 12 Apr 1999 06:12:36 +0200 In-Reply-To: Jaye Mathisen's message of "Sun, 11 Apr 1999 20:49:16 -0700 (PDT)" Message-ID: Lines: 12 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jaye Mathisen writes: > 7) The return of the single floppy boot (perhaps via building more than 1 > GENERIC. :()) Having spent three days building boot/installation floppies for a system I'm working on at my day job, I can tell you that this is not trivial. Maybe the advent of the new system installer will make it possible, or maybe not. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 21:15:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dorifer.heim3.tu-clausthal.de (dorifer.heim3.tu-clausthal.de [139.174.243.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7694C14FFD for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 21:15:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from olli@dorifer.heim3.tu-clausthal.de) Received: (from olli@localhost) by dorifer.heim3.tu-clausthal.de (8.8.8/8.8.8) id GAA20304 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 06:12:44 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from olli) Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 06:12:44 +0200 (CEST) From: Oliver Fromme Message-Id: <199904120412.GAA20304@dorifer.heim3.tu-clausthal.de> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT Newsgroups: list.freebsd-hackers Organization: Administration Heim 3 Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 RZTUC(3) PL2] Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote in list.freebsd-hackers: > Here are a few ideas I have running around my head about things I'd > love to see happen to -CURRENT: I'd pretty much like to see usable netboot support in the bootloader. > [...] > - Revamp the PCI code. Voices in my head tell me Doug has patches > that allow converting all PCI device drivers to KLD modules. Me > want! That sounds very nice! Maybe that would help for the netboot stuff, too (the network drivers could be designed in a modular fashion, so that the bootloader can use part of their code). > - Fuller-featured sound drivers so we can nuke VoxWare once and for > all In particular, we need support for those newer PCI cards. However, I understand that it's very difficult to get docs from the manufacturers. :-( > - Insert Your Favorite Vapor Feature: ____________________________ See above. :-) Regards Oliver -- Oliver Fromme, Leibnizstr. 18/61, 38678 Clausthal, Germany (Info: finger userinfo:olli@dorifer.heim3.tu-clausthal.de) "In jedem Stück Kohle wartet ein Diamant auf seine Geburt" (Terry Pratchett) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 21:37:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C95414F34 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 21:37:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA33975; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 22:35:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id WAA03416; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 22:34:48 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199904120434.WAA03416@harmony.village.org> To: "Joachim Isaksson" Subject: Re: IrDA? PnP? Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 11 Apr 1999 16:59:34 +0200." <000a01be842b$eeff6e10$f56d17c2@home.ibfs.com> References: <000a01be842b$eeff6e10$f56d17c2@home.ibfs.com> Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 22:34:48 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <000a01be842b$eeff6e10$f56d17c2@home.ibfs.com> "Joachim Isaksson" writes: : 1) Is anyone already working on IrDA support? Yes. However, they are doing it in Linux. http://www.cs.uit.no/~dagb/irda/irda.html The Linux/IR Project : 2) If noone has already started it, how should IrDA be implemented? : I started off thinking of IrDA as a bus, but then I saw something about : Linux implementing it as a network protocol(?) Still it would to me make : sense to implement it as a bus (a'la USB?) with PnP devices, but I'd rather : have input on this before doing something terribly silly :) They implemented it as a protocol stack, which it is. The IrDA stuff is a layered protocol thing, with file transfer and printer servier stuff. When viewed as a stack, many things become easier to implement. : 3) I've been trying to understand the PnP functionality of FreeBSD, but so : far I've failed miserably. Is there any good documentation on the subject : besides the source code? No. : 4) As I (so far) understand it, the PnP functionality is a special "hack" : for the ISA bus right now and could not easily be extended to integrate PnP : devices on the IrDA bus? Is this assumption correct? If so, is anyone Yes. PnP is too generic a term to have generic code. PCI pnp and parallel port PnP are both radically different than isa pnp or serial port pnp. : 5) Is there any reason (besides the probably rather major work it would : mean) not to move most if not all FreeBSD drivers to dynamically loadable : modules? It would sure be easier for the "common man" to add device drivers, : and it would make things like PnP much easier to implement in a dynamic way. There are a raft of tiny technical issues that currently preclude this for most drivers. However, work is underway to rectify the shortcomings of config. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 21:39:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (Ilsa.StevesCafe.com [205.168.119.129]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8B7814E21 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 21:39:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fbsd@Ilsa.StevesCafe.com) Received: from Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (localhost.StevesCafe.com [127.0.0.1]) by Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA01409 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 22:41:35 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199904120441.WAA01409@Ilsa.StevesCafe.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 From: Steve Passe To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT In-reply-to: Your message of "12 Apr 1999 01:48:45 +0200." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 22:41:35 -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, > - Smaller-grained locks in the SMP code. Perhaps someone will prove me wrong, but I don't think there's a lot of milage to be had pursuing the "small-grained SMP lock" grail. It could be done to some extent, but would be costly in programming effort and would be a never ending battle... Up to now the SMP effort has been evolutionary, to go much further it needs to be revolutionary. The current kernel model just doesn't fit. To create a true SMP system we need: mutex model as oppossed to spl(). kernel threads (and thread-based ISRs). (preferably) pre-emptible processes. -- Steve Passe | powered by smp@csn.net | Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 22:19: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailhub.psn.ie (mailhub.psn.ie [194.106.150.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E376153EC for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 22:18:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ad@psn.ie) Received: from vmunix.psn.ie ([194.106.150.252]) by mailhub.psn.ie with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #3) id 10WYuP-000Alz-00; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 06:05:23 +0100 Received: from localhost.psn.ie ([127.0.0.1] helo=localhost) by vmunix.psn.ie with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #1) id 10WVXj-0000Bq-00; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 02:29:43 +0100 Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 02:29:43 +0100 (IST) From: Andy Doran To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 12 Apr 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > > - Insert Your Favorite Vapor Feature: ____________________________ > > sparc64, LFS... *hides* A lot of work has been put into LFS on NetBSD recently. It's in a very usable state and more apparently is planned. See the various notes in the ufs/lfs directory. > Oh, yes! I forgot to add: more architecture ports, beginning with MIPS > and Sparc. Are the beginnings of MIPS support in-tree? Andy. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 23:24:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4046F15261 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 23:24:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (haldjas.folklore.ee [172.17.2.1] (may be forged)) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.8.8/8.8.4) with SMTP id JAA13377; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 09:22:06 +0300 (EEST) Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 09:22:06 +0300 (EEST) From: Narvi To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 12 Apr 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > Hey gang, > > Here are a few ideas I have running around my head about things I'd > love to see happen to -CURRENT: > [snip] > - Insert Your Favorite Vapor Feature: ____________________________ > * A ufs variant that changed (only) the directory structure to hold the entries in a btree. > DES > -- > Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no > Sander There is no love, no good, no happiness and no future - all these are just illusions. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 23:45:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.dyn.ml.org (sf3-23.ppp.wenet.net [206.15.84.23]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1ED4115221 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 23:45:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garbanzo@hooked.net) Received: from localhost (garbanzo@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.dyn.ml.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id XAA83229 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 23:43:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garbanzo@hooked.net) Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 23:43:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex Zepeda To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT In-Reply-To: <199904120412.GAA20304@dorifer.heim3.tu-clausthal.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 12 Apr 1999, Oliver Fromme wrote: > > - Fuller-featured sound drivers so we can nuke VoxWare once and for > > all > > In particular, we need support for those newer PCI cards. > However, I understand that it's very difficult to get docs > from the manufacturers. :-( Well, if all else fails, tell the mfrs that you're interested in the documentation, and explain why it would be worth their while. (Perhaps some sort of works with chuck logo?). One person alone might not pique their interest. A few hundred people explaining why they will not buy brand-x pci audio might. - alex To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 11 23:52:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from catarina.usc.edu (catarina.usc.edu [128.125.51.47]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 9EA9714EF4 for ; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 23:51:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pavlin@catarina.usc.edu) Received: from rumi.usc.edu (rumi.usc.edu [128.125.51.41]) by catarina.usc.edu (8.6.10/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA02321; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 23:49:27 -0700 Received: from rumi (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rumi.usc.edu (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA10028; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 23:49:26 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904120649.XAA10028@rumi.usc.edu> To: bmah@CA.Sandia.GOV Cc: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , Pavlin Ivanov Radoslavov , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: IGMP membership report not received by mrouted In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 09 Apr 1999 06:59:34 PDT." <199904091359.GAA08806@stennis.ca.sandia.gov> Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 23:49:26 -0700 From: Pavlin Ivanov Radoslavov Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > --==_Exmh_98576044P > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > If memory serves me right, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > Pavlin Ivanov Radoslavov writes: > > > If I start mrouted (3.9-beta3+IOS12), mrouted cannot see the IGMP > > > membership reports. If I start tcpdump on the interface with > > > receivers, then mrouted can see the IGMP membership reports!! > > > No other mrouted running on neighbor machines. > > > > Starting tcpdump puts the interface in promiscuous mode. It sounds to > > me like a) the NIC driver is incorrectly discarding multicast packets > > when not in promiscuous mode, or b) mrouted uses bpf but forgets to Thanks for all suggestions/explanations. A mcast routing daemon like mrouted puts an interface in a mode similar to promiscuous: there is a flag IFF_ALLMULTI that enables receiving all multicast groups. After looking in the source code, it seems like the problem is in the de driver. Below is a simple patch to pci/if_de.c that fixed it. I will send an email to the author of the device driver. Regards, Pavlin --- if_de.c.orig Tue Dec 29 16:37:43 1998 +++ if_de.c Sun Apr 11 23:32:40 1999 @@ -3378,9 +3378,11 @@ } else { sc->tulip_flags &= ~TULIP_PROMISC; sc->tulip_cmdmode &= ~TULIP_CMD_PROMISCUOUS; - if (sc->tulip_flags & TULIP_ALLMULTI) { + if (sc->tulip_if.if_flags & IFF_ALLMULTI) { + sc->tulip_flags |= TULIP_ALLMULTI; sc->tulip_cmdmode |= TULIP_CMD_ALLMULTI; } else { + sc->tulip_flags &= ~TULIP_ALLMULTI; sc->tulip_cmdmode &= ~TULIP_CMD_ALLMULTI; } } To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 0: 2:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk [193.237.89.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE2EC1500D for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 00:02:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nik@nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk) Received: (from nik@localhost) by nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (8.9.2/8.9.2) id UAA42750; Sun, 11 Apr 1999 20:59:23 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from nik) Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 20:59:22 +0100 From: Nik Clayton To: Matthew Dillon Cc: Greg Lehey , dg@root.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Annoying debug-kernel config messages Message-ID: <19990411205922.A41677@catkin.nothing-going-on.org> References: <199904102115.OAA01764@apollo.backplane.com> <199904110145.SAA27717@implode.root.com> <19990411112709.D2142@lemis.com> <199904110640.XAA03249@apollo.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904110640.XAA03249@apollo.backplane.com>; from Matthew Dillon on Sat, Apr 10, 1999 at 11:40:59PM -0700 Organization: Nik at home, where there's nothing going on Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, Apr 10, 1999 at 11:40:59PM -0700, Matthew Dillon wrote: > I make debug kernels my setting 'makeoptions' in the kernel config, aka > > makeoptions DEBUG="-g" > > I think this is the proper way to do it. This way you can just 'config' > your kernel labels and not have to remember which ones are supposed to > generate debug symbols and which ones are not. > > This ability to use makeoptions is not well documented in LINT. > Considering its usefulness, it would sure be nice if someone would add > and document it in LINT ( hint hint ) :-). Got any idea how to word it? I just had a look, and LINT already has a few examples of "makeoptions" in there. I thought about adding something like == # # Additional options that will be included verbatim on the make(1) # command line when this kernel is compiled. # #makeoptions DEBUG="-g" == but thought I'd run it past you guys first. N -- Bagel: The carbohydrate with the hole To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 0:32:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0718F15327 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 00:32:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id JAA26520; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 09:30:12 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA00884; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 09:30:12 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 09:30:12 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: Greg Lehey Cc: dg@root.com, Matthew Dillon , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Annoying debug-kernel config messages In-Reply-To: <19990411112709.D2142@lemis.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I think we need to discuss this a little more. We also need to have a > place to discuss this sort of change. I discussed it at length in > -hackers, and nobody objected. How about a "heads up" or a "proposed > change" mailing list to which nothing else should be posted? Very good suggestion, IMO. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 2:10:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B253914D28 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 02:10:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA42642; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 10:11:23 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 10:11:23 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 12 Apr 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > - Revamp the PCI code. Voices in my head tell me Doug has patches > that allow converting all PCI device drivers to KLD modules. Me > want! This is well underway and there is a cvs repository for people who want to experiment. Be warned that this is pre-alpha code and may not work on your machine without tweaking. Use this cvsup file to get the cvs repository: *default host=freefall.FreeBSD.org *default base=/usr *default prefix=/home/newbus *default release=cvs *default delete use-rel-suffix *default compress newbus -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 2:26: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk [130.159.196.126]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B3BB14C1F for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 02:25:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roger@cs.strath.ac.uk) Received: from cs.strath.ac.uk (scary.dmem.strath.ac.uk [130.159.202.5]) by fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA23283 Mon, 12 Apr 1999 10:18:47 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <3711BA9F.6072EAD1@cs.strath.ac.uk> Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 10:19:27 +0100 From: Roger Hardiman Organization: Strathclyde University X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jeremy Lea Cc: dick@tar.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cc -pthread and -kthread switches References: <370DC114.E0A81FDE@cs.strath.ac.uk> <19990409161203.B3791@shale.csir.co.za> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jeremy, I agree Dick's port should be in the base source tree. The port currently has to patch the source tree so installing the port actually needs the kernel source and requires a kernel rebuild. Roger -- Roger Hardiman Strathclyde Uni Telepresence Research Group, Glasgow, Scotland. http://telepresence.dmem.strath.ac.uk 0141 548 2897 roger@cs.strath.ac.uk To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 4:34:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from penmax.com (cc595093-a.mdltwn1.nj.home.com [24.3.192.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C488C15469 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 04:34:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from vincef@penmax.com) Received: from REMBRANDT (rembrandt.penmax.com [10.1.2.3]) by penmax.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id HAA01556; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 07:34:06 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from vincef@penmax.com) Received: by REMBRANDT with Microsoft Mail id <01BE84B6.B983F5E0@REMBRANDT>; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 07:33:14 -0400 Message-ID: <01BE84B6.B983F5E0@REMBRANDT> From: Vincent Fleming To: "'Ollivier Robert'" , "freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG" Subject: RE: Baud rate of 0 Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 07:33:12 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG According to Joel Ray Holveck: > Why does setting the baud rate of a (wired tty) connection to 0 > terminate it? When is this useful? Historical behaviour. [] It was an easy way to get a modem to drop the line. The old AT&T modems of about 20 years ago would drop the line if you set the baud rate to zero. You could also use this to disconnect users at terminals, with stty 0 > /dev/tty15 - could be fun when you're bored. ;-} Vince To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 4:55:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alice.gba.oz.au (gba-254.tmx.com.au [203.9.155.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id CBD4A154E5 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 04:55:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gjb-freebsd@gba.oz.au) Received: (qmail 29837 invoked by uid 1001); 11 Apr 1999 21:48:01 -0000 Message-ID: <19990411214801.29836.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au> X-Posted-By: GBA-Post 1.03 20-Sep-1998 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 5A91 6942 8CEA 9DAB B95B C249 1CE1 493B 2B5A CE30 Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 07:48:00 +1000 From: Greg Black To: Greg Lehey Cc: dg@root.com, Matthew Dillon , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Annoying debug-kernel config messages References: <199904102115.OAA01764@apollo.backplane.com> <199904110145.SAA27717@implode.root.com> <19990411112709.D2142@lemis.com> In-reply-to: <19990411112709.D2142@lemis.com> of Sun, 11 Apr 1999 11:27:09 +0930 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey writes: > I think we need to discuss this a little more. We also need to have a > place to discuss this sort of change. I discussed it at length in > -hackers, and nobody objected. How about a "heads up" or a "proposed > change" mailing list to which nothing else should be posted? If you're going to take this discussion (and similar ones) off the -hackers list, please announce that here and make it possible for others to know where to follow the discussions. Even if I can't influence what happens, it makes my job of getting my customers moved to FreeBSD much easier if I don't have to deal with too many surprises at each new release. -- Greg Black To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 5:13:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from abc.aaa-mainstreet.nl (abc.aaa-mainstreet.nl [195.64.77.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 0BD71150D1 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 05:13:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gary@hotlava.com) Received: (qmail 9511 invoked by uid 666); 12 Apr 1999 12:11:45 -0000 Date: 12 Apr 1999 12:11:45 -0000 Message-ID: <19990412121145.9510.qmail@abc.aaa-mainstreet.nl> From: "Gary Howland" To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: New system call? Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, I am considering the part-time development of an application which relies on new functionality. The functionality I need is to mainly to hide process information from users on the system, but also mapping of process information (so that process 1 is not necessarily init, since I want to hide system process such as init from the users). I am thinking along the lines of giving each user their own process "set", and spawning an init for each user so that orphan processes stay in the same "set". But I'm now waffling, and describing bits of the application that are irrelevant right now. What I am thinking of is a system call along the lines of chroot(). Perhaps it would be called procroot(). The idea is that this would take a process id as an argument, and would make this process the grandfather (what is the term for the adopter of orphans??? - currently the init process) for this porcess and all process spawned from this. After the call has been made, the process would only be able to "see" (from the point of view of system calls such as kill) this process and any derived from it. This process would have the id of 1 (thereby eliminating the need to change the orphaning code to point to the new grandfather process), which also means that another procroot(1) would NOT change the root process back to the original process, but instead just have no effect. This changing of process information would work by simply using a mapping from the new process numbers to the original ones. So when the procroot(x) is made, an entry is created mapping pseudo process 1 to real process x. Any new processes spawned from this process will also make use of these mappings, and their process ids will themselves be added to this list. This list also serves as the list of processes viewable to the procroot'ed processes (after all, that is the main aim of this call - to place processes into an environment where they cannot access all process info - a "chroot for process info"). I hope I have explained this OK. So, has anyone done anything like this before? If not, does anyone have any advice or tips on how to proceed? (such as listing the kernel files that will need to be looked at - the obvious ones are of course kill & fork, but exec and the process data will also need modification, along with procfs). And what is the best way of doing this? Surrounding my code in #ifdefs? Or is there no way that this code will ever make it into the kernel, so the #ifdefs are a waste of time? Many thanks, Gary To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 5:24:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B43815226 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 05:24:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id VAA26941; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 21:17:47 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <3711E1FE.9A049D98@newsguy.com> Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 21:07:26 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > - New rc system (e.g. http://www.freebsd.org/~eivind/newrc.html) http://www.roguetrader.com/~brandon/sas/ > - Working stacking layers, proper vnode locking, working NULLFS and > friends (Eivind is working on that, with moral support from yours > truly) Veto-based locking, symmetric interfaces, all that stuff, eh? :-) > - Insert Your Favorite Vapor Feature: ____________________________ A PCMCIA SCSI card, please? Any card. Whatever the card gets supported, I'll dump mine (if needed) and buy that one... -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "nothing better than the ability to perform cunning linguistics" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 5:24:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from stephens.ml.org (cm2081634025.ponderosa.ispchannel.com [208.163.40.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A4D615512 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 05:24:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tas@stephens.ml.org) Received: from stephens.ml.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by stephens.ml.org (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id NAA00464; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 13:21:58 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from tas@stephens.ml.org) Message-Id: <199904121221.NAA00464@stephens.ml.org> To: Jaye Mathisen Cc: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Thomas Stephens From: Thomas Stephens Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 11 Apr 1999 20:49:16 PDT." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <459.923919716.1@stephens.ml.org> Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 05:21:57 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jaye Mathisen wrote: > >11) Movement of SMB support into the kernel, rather than a user process >for maximum performance. (Gotta kick NT's butt, and wouldn't mind dusting >Linux in the process). This is something I'd like, and I'm willing to make an effort to contribute if I can (I'll have to look at what's involved). Unfortunately, Sharity Light is under the GPL (as is the Linux SMBFS), so an SMB/CIFS filesystem would presumably have to be built from the ground up. Apart from the (expired) draft spec, any pointers to CIFS resources which aren't restrictively licensed? Thomas Stephens tas@stephens.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 6:18:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from axl.noc.iafrica.com (axl.noc.iafrica.com [196.31.1.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F92914A2E for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 06:18:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sheldonh@axl.noc.iafrica.com) Received: from sheldonh (helo=axl.noc.iafrica.com) by axl.noc.iafrica.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10WgZB-0000ET-00; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 15:15:57 +0200 From: Sheldon Hearn To: lh@aus.org Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Proposal/Question Newsyslog In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Apr 1999 23:11:26 -0400." <199904080311.XAA17176@ayukawa.aus.org> Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 15:15:56 +0200 Message-ID: <896.923922956@axl.noc.iafrica.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 07 Apr 1999 23:11:26 -0400, Luke wrote: > What I was wondering is can newsyslog put the old logfiles in another > directory? we are keeping sometimes @30 old logfiles , and it makes > looking through the log dir a pain. Hi Luke, Why are you trying to use newsyslog to sort logfiles into subdirectories of the ones in which the logfiles are found? Why not simply log to subdirecties of /var/log/ in the first place? Ciao, Sheldon. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 7: 4:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.oeno.com (ns.oeno.com [194.100.99.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 93C7B14E95 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 07:04:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from will@ns.oeno.com) Received: (qmail 2207 invoked by uid 1001); 12 Apr 1999 14:02:06 -0000 To: dillon@apollo.backplane.com (Matthew Dillon) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls References: <199904120126.SAA11924@apollo.backplane.com> From: Ville-Pertti Keinonen Date: 12 Apr 1999 17:01:50 +0300 In-Reply-To: dillon@apollo.backplane.com's message of "12 Apr 1999 04:27:16 +0300" Message-ID: <86hfqmgcoh.fsf@not.demophon.com> Lines: 20 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/XEmacs 20.4 - "Emerald" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG dillon@apollo.backplane.com (Matthew Dillon) writes: > :> But, see above about it not being possible to emulate read() with pread() > :> in userspace. > : > :You mean, without lseek(2) =) > > pread/pwrite + lseek is not atomic, so exact emulation is not > possible. This may come as a shock to you, but read(2)/write(2) aren't atomic in updating the file pointer, either. Actually, read(2) is equivalent to lseek(2)+pread(2)+lseek(2), with the last lseek(2) being SEEK_CUR by the read count returned by pread(2). The difference is that read(2) can only be pre-empted if it blocks doing I/O (which is not unusual). Of course emulating read(2) would be ugly and slow. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 7:14:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.oeno.com (ns.oeno.com [194.100.99.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 2F88514C92 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 07:14:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from will@ns.oeno.com) Received: (qmail 2501 invoked by uid 1001); 12 Apr 1999 14:12:18 -0000 To: will@iki.fi (Ville-Pertti Keinonen) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls References: <86hfqmgcoh.fsf@not.demophon.com> From: Ville-Pertti Keinonen Date: 12 Apr 1999 17:12:05 +0300 In-Reply-To: will@iki.fi's message of "12 Apr 1999 17:04:17 +0300" Message-ID: <86g166gc7e.fsf@not.demophon.com> Lines: 7 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/XEmacs 20.4 - "Emerald" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG will@iki.fi (Ville-Pertti Keinonen) writes: > Actually, read(2) is equivalent to lseek(2)+pread(2)+lseek(2), with the Minor clarification - they are not exactly equivalent, of course, read(2) only looks up the file descriptor once. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 7:27:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ayukawa.aus.org (ayukawa.aus.org [199.166.246.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1812154E3 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 07:27:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from lh@aus.org) Received: from zer0.net (lh@PHOENIX.ZER0.NET [199.166.246.189]) by ayukawa.aus.org (8.8.7/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA09022; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 10:24:35 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904121424.KAA09022@ayukawa.aus.org> X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <896.923922956@axl.noc.iafrica.com> Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 10:24:35 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: lh@aus.org From: Luke To: Sheldon Hearn Subject: Re: Proposal/Question Newsyslog Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 >> What I was wondering is can newsyslog put the old logfiles in another >> directory? we are keeping sometimes @30 old logfiles , and it makes >> looking through the log dir a pain. >Hi Luke, > > Why are you trying to use newsyslog to sort logfiles into subdirectories > of the ones in which the logfiles are found? Why not simply log to > subdirecties of /var/log/ in the first place? > > Ciao, > Sheldon. I never thought of that (doh), that would probably neaten things up. I still think it would be nice if newsyslog would do it in another directory if you wanted, I just can't think of any great pressing reason to add it though.. - --- E-Mail: Luke Sent by XFMail - ---------------------------------- -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGPfreeware 5.0i for non-commercial use Charset: noconv iQA/AwUBNxICIx8Qu3OCfndzEQIAKQCg3agg7ljvS5d3WNN/UbHXXIuGKj4AniOD 8OBWWtYlQ1Bl6KjrmsEiEQea =HZ4S -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 7:42:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from axl.noc.iafrica.com (axl.noc.iafrica.com [196.31.1.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FED114E0C for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 07:42:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sheldonh@axl.noc.iafrica.com) Received: from sheldonh (helo=axl.noc.iafrica.com) by axl.noc.iafrica.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10Whs7-000EW7-00; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 16:39:35 +0200 From: Sheldon Hearn To: lh@aus.org Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Proposal/Question Newsyslog In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 12 Apr 1999 10:24:35 -0400." <199904121424.KAA09022@ayukawa.aus.org> Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 16:39:35 +0200 Message-ID: <55806.923927975@axl.noc.iafrica.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 12 Apr 1999 10:24:35 -0400, Luke wrote: > I still think it would be nice if newsyslog would do it in another > directory if you wanted, I just can't think of any great pressing > reason to add it though. Hi Luke, Given that Necessity is the Mother of Invention, I reckon this idea will stay orphaned for a while. :-) Later, Sheldon. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 7:45:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.com (runyon.cygnus.com [205.180.230.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4160614E0C; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 07:45:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@cygnus.com) Received: from hoser.cygnus.com (hoser.cygnus.com [205.180.230.193]) by runyon.cygnus.com (8.8.7-cygnus/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA16236; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 07:43:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (green@localhost) by hoser.cygnus.com (8.8.7/8.6.4) id HAA19102; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 07:43:10 -0700 Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 07:43:10 -0700 Message-Id: <199904121443.HAA19102@hoser.cygnus.com> From: Anthony Green To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com Cc: chuckr@mat.net, jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: <199904101944.MAA08435@rah.star-gate.com> (message from Amancio Hasty on Sat, 10 Apr 1999 12:44:31 -0700) Subject: Re: Native Java Compilers X-Organization: Cygnus Solutions, Sunnyvale, California X-URL: http://www.cygnus.com/~green References: <199904101944.MAA08435@rah.star-gate.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Amancio wrote: > I would wait till gcj+libgcj is stable to incorporate it into the > tree. I can't get libcgj to compile over here and I tried updating > libgcj a couple of times Please report your build problems to java-discuss@sourceware.cygnus.com. Unless you plan of fixing them yourself (not a bad idea!), we need to know about build problems before we can fix them. :-) Thanks! AG -- Anthony Green Cygnus Solutions Sunnyvale, California To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 8: 4:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lamb.sas.com (lamb.sas.com [192.35.83.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5C53155B5 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 08:04:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brdean@unx.sas.com) Received: from mozart (mozart.unx.sas.com [192.58.184.8]) by lamb.sas.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id LAA20278 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 11:02:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dean.pc.sas.com by mozart (5.65c/SAS/Domains/5-6-90) id AA03385; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 11:02:19 -0400 Received: (from brdean@localhost) by dean.pc.sas.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id LAA15248; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 11:02:18 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from brdean) From: Brian Dean Message-Id: <199904121502.LAA15248@dean.pc.sas.com> Subject: behaviour of open(foo,O_CREAT) in regards to setting 'group' To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 11:02:18 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, In FreeBSD, the open(foo,O_CREAT) call creates the file and sets the group of the new file to that of the directory in which the file was created. Why do we not set the group of the new file to the effective group id of the process creating the file? Or, if the set-gid bit is set on the directory in which the file is being created, use that over the effective gid of the process? (This appears to be the behaviour of SVR4.) For example, if the group of /tmp is wheel, the FreeBSD behaviour causes files created there to have the group of wheel, and when the files are moved to another (non-local) file system (using 'mv'), an error is generated indicating that the operation is not permitted if the user is not a member of 'wheel'. The error is harmless in this case (because the group of the file should not have been wheel in the first place because the user was not a member of wheel), but it is annoying. Thanks, -Brian -- Brian Dean brdean@unx.sas.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 8:12:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from verdi.nethelp.no (verdi.nethelp.no [158.36.41.162]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id F0D9F14E7A for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 08:12:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sthaug@nethelp.no) Received: (qmail 61813 invoked by uid 1001); 12 Apr 1999 15:09:58 +0000 (GMT) To: brdean@unx.sas.com Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: behaviour of open(foo,O_CREAT) in regards to setting 'group' From: sthaug@nethelp.no In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 12 Apr 1999 11:02:18 -0400 (EDT)" References: <199904121502.LAA15248@dean.pc.sas.com> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.05+ on Emacs 19.34.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 17:09:58 +0200 Message-ID: <61811.923929798@verdi.nethelp.no> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Why do we not set the group of the new file to the effective group id > of the process creating the file? Or, if the set-gid bit is set on > the directory in which the file is being created, use that over the > effective gid of the process? (This appears to be the behaviour of > SVR4.) This was discussed only a couple of days ago. See the answer from Cy Schubert to my comment. Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Cy Schubert - ITSD Open Systems Group To: sthaug@nethelp.no cc: brett@lariat.org, ingham@i-pi.com, security@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Interesting problem: chowning files sent via FTP Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 13:34:30 -0700 In message <31184.923728628@verdi.nethelp.no>, sthaug@nethelp.no writes: > > Is this so? I was under the impression that the default group of a > > new file was the login group of the creator, as specified in /etc/passwd. > > AFAIK, in all BSD versions the default group of a new file is the group > of the directory it is created in. > > > As for the setgid-on-execution bit: there's no documentation on what it > > does when set on a directory. The chmod(1) man page doesn't say anything. > > Does it change the group ownership of newly created files? > > setgid on a directory is a SYSV-ism (or rather, close to a SVR4-ism). It > means that the SYSV system in question should follow the BSD semantics > for files created in this directory, instead of the default SYSV semantics > (set the group of the file to the effective gid of the creating process). The SVR4-ism is there because SYSV does not conform to FIPS-151. FIPS-151 states BSD semantics must be used for newly created files and directories. FIPS-151 is a US Government standard, if not adhered to by a vendor, the said system cannot be purchased by agencies of the US government. That's why SVR4 uses the sgid bit for for directories, to conform to FIPS-151. It's all described in Stevens' book on Advanced UNIX Programming. > > setgid on a directory works this way at least in Solaris 2 and HP-UX 10.x/ > 11.x. Regards, Phone: (250)387-8437 Cy Schubert Fax: (250)387-5766 Open Systems Group Internet: Cy.Schubert@uumail.gov.bc.ca ITSD Cy.Schubert@gems8.gov.bc.ca Province of BC "e**(i*pi)+1=0" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 8:16:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nero.cybersites.com (nero.cybersites.com [207.92.123.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 425FE15174 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 08:16:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cyouse@cybersites.com) Received: from ns1.cybersites.com (ns1.cybersites.com [207.92.123.2]) by nero.cybersites.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA05494 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 11:23:38 -0400 From: Chuck Youse To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: behaviour of open(foo,O_CREAT) in regards to setting 'group' Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 11:10:03 -0400 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.17] Content-Type: text/plain References: <199904121502.LAA15248@dean.pc.sas.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <99041211112105.93133@ns1.cybersites.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-KMail-Mark: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 12 Apr 1999, Brian Dean wrote: > In FreeBSD, the open(foo,O_CREAT) call creates the file and sets the > group of the new file to that of the directory in which the file was > created. As far as I know, this is standard UNIX behavior. I.e., it's not specific to FreeBSD. -- Chuck Youse Director of Systems cyouse@cybersites.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 8:23:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (mail.palmerharvey.co.uk [62.172.109.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5757D15562 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 08:23:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Dom.Mitchell@palmerharvey.co.uk) Received: from ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk (unverified) by mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 16:20:34 +0100 Received: from voodoo.pandhm.co.uk ([10.100.35.12]) by ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) id GZL8K2H2; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 16:13:52 +0100 Received: from dom by voodoo.pandhm.co.uk with local (Exim 2.10 #1) id 10WiZJ-000L3d-00; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 16:24:13 +0100 To: Brian Dean Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: behaviour of open(foo,O_CREAT) in regards to setting 'group' X-Mailer: nmh-1.0 X-Colour: Green Organization: Palmer & Harvey McLane In-Reply-To: Brian Dean's message of "Mon, 12 Apr 1999 11:02:18 EDT" <199904121502.LAA15248@dean.pc.sas.com> Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 16:24:13 +0100 From: Dom Mitchell Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 12 April 1999, Brian Dean proclaimed: > In FreeBSD, the open(foo,O_CREAT) call creates the file and sets the > group of the new file to that of the directory in which the file was > created. Yup. > Why do we not set the group of the new file to the effective group id > of the process creating the file? Or, if the set-gid bit is set on > the directory in which the file is being created, use that over the > effective gid of the process? (This appears to be the behaviour of > SVR4.) That's correct, and it's listed as "BSD emulation behaviour", for the reason that we've always done it that way. > For example, if the group of /tmp is wheel, the FreeBSD behaviour > causes files created there to have the group of wheel, and when the > files are moved to another (non-local) file system (using 'mv'), an > error is generated indicating that the operation is not permitted if > the user is not a member of 'wheel'. The error is harmless in this > case (because the group of the file should not have been wheel in the > first place because the user was not a member of wheel), but it is > annoying. Maybe the behaviour should not apply to directories with a sticky bit? I'm not sure that there is much room for change around this whole subject area, though. It's been pretty much this way for some 15 years or more. Teach your users to use "cp" instead of "mv"? -- Dom Mitchell -- Palmer & Harvey McLane -- Unix Systems Administrator "Value of 2 may go down as well as up" -- FORTRAN programmers manual -- ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. ********************************************************************** To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 10:28:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B9F11500C for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 10:28:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.2/8.9.1) id TAA11065; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 19:09:15 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Cc: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT References: <3711E1FE.9A049D98@newsguy.com> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 12 Apr 1999 19:09:15 +0200 In-Reply-To: "Daniel C. Sobral"'s message of "Mon, 12 Apr 1999 21:07:26 +0900" Message-ID: Lines: 11 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Daniel C. Sobral" writes: > A PCMCIA SCSI card, please? Any card. Whatever the card gets > supported, I'll dump mine (if needed) and buy that one... Yes! I have a laptop with a builtin AIC6360 chip (I believe it's commonly used in PCMCIA SCSI cards?), so I can help test such a driver. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 10:49:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail4.aracnet.com (mail4.aracnet.com [205.159.88.46]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE2F714CF6 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 10:48:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from beattie@aracnet.com) Received: from shell2.aracnet.com (IDENT:1728@shell2.aracnet.com [205.159.88.20]) by mail4.aracnet.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id KAA30283; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 10:46:29 -0700 Received: from localhost by shell2.aracnet.com (8.8.7) id KAA04279; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 10:46:29 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: shell2.aracnet.com: beattie owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 10:46:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Brian Beattie To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: "Daniel C. Sobral" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 12 Apr 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > "Daniel C. Sobral" writes: > > A PCMCIA SCSI card, please? Any card. Whatever the card gets > > supported, I'll dump mine (if needed) and buy that one... > > Yes! I have a laptop with a builtin AIC6360 chip (I believe it's > commonly used in PCMCIA SCSI cards?), so I can help test such a > driver. > > DES > -- > Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > I am currently, in my spare time, working on support for ISA boards based ion the 6360 chip. All these offers to test 1460 support are quite hearting. However; with out a pcmcia interface it is unlikely, that I will be able make much progress in that direction. Whan I have a working aic driver I would suggest that some who has access to a 1460 volenteer write the support, or maybe even do the whole thing. Brian Beattie | The only problem with beattie@aracnet.com | winning the rat race ... www.aracnet.com/~beattie | in the end you're still a rat To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 11:54:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from shell6.ba.best.com (shell6.ba.best.com [206.184.139.137]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25057155CE; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 11:54:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkb@shell6.ba.best.com) Received: (from jkb@localhost) by shell6.ba.best.com (8.9.3/8.9.2/best.sh) id LAA16357; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 11:50:45 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19990412115045.B8671@best.com> Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 11:50:45 -0700 From: "Jan B. Koum " To: Matthew Dillon , "David E. Cross" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-security@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: increased crashing in NFS server Mail-Followup-To: Matthew Dillon , "David E. Cross" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-security@FreeBSD.ORG References: <199904110341.XAA17071@cs.rpi.edu> <199904110703.AAA03493@apollo.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904110703.AAA03493@apollo.backplane.com>; from Matthew Dillon on Sun, Apr 11, 1999 at 12:03:49AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Apr 11, 1999 at 12:03:49AM -0700, Matthew Dillon wrote: > :I recently updated all of our FreeBSD3 clients to use NFSv3/UDP when > :contacting our servers (FreeBSD3 of the same build tree). We have > :noticed an increase in crashing of our main home directory server > :(which is the only server really handling RW mounts, our other servers > :are mostly RO, with some minor RW activity.) The first crash was > :obviously NFS. I traced it to one of 2 possible crash points in the > :kernel (sorry, no stack trace, we don't [yet] have a crashlogs enabled > :for that machine.). > : > :The panic was: > :mbuf siz=33476 > :panic: Bad nfs svc reply > > You are using a 32K file block size? If so, reduce it to 8K. > > I think you've just shown us a security hole in the NFS system -- it > panics if it is given too large a response packet. Oops. It should > just print a message and drop the packet. This is not a new bug Matt :( Take a look at kern/6771 PR (still open). -- Yan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 11:55: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 98E0D1571A for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 11:54:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA22126 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 14:52:30 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904121852.OAA22126@cs.rpi.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: ypserv Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 14:52:30 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Our ypserv processes have been dieing a great deal lately (luckily they restart themselves, but not before all the clients rebind to another machine). I have tracked the problem down to a stack corruption. Apparently caused by a stack overflow (I am still working on it, don't get excited yet ;). I have run into a bit of a snag with gdb, I do not understand the following when I print out a function pointer: "" I have found many such references to the same function, but with different numbers. I am confused as to what this notation means, I haven't found any reference to it in the gdb manpage or the gdb "info". I realize this isn't exactly on topic, but I figured since it involved ypserv, it would pass. -- David Cross | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | This space intentionally Department of Computer Science | left unblank I speak only for myself. | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 12:21:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lestat.nas.nasa.gov (lestat.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.50.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E47231557D for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 12:20:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from thorpej@lestat.nas.nasa.gov) Received: from lestat (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lestat.nas.nasa.gov (8.8.8/8.6.12) with ESMTP id MAA07413; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 12:16:12 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904121916.MAA07413@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> To: Ville-Pertti Keinonen Cc: dillon@apollo.backplane.com (Matthew Dillon), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls Reply-To: Jason Thorpe From: Jason Thorpe Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 12:16:12 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 12 Apr 1999 17:01:50 +0300 Ville-Pertti Keinonen wrote: > This may come as a shock to you, but read(2)/write(2) aren't atomic in > updating the file pointer, either. Then that's a bug in the FreeBSD kernel. > Actually, read(2) is equivalent to lseek(2)+pread(2)+lseek(2), with the > last lseek(2) being SEEK_CUR by the read count returned by pread(2). > The difference is that read(2) can only be pre-empted if it blocks > doing I/O (which is not unusual). Geez, how did this get implemented in FreeBSD?! It's certainly not that complicated. -- Jason R. Thorpe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 12:23:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 974751575F for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 12:23:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA36185; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 13:21:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id NAA02162; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 13:21:00 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199904121921.NAA02162@harmony.village.org> To: Brian Beattie Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT Cc: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , "Daniel C. Sobral" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 12 Apr 1999 10:46:28 PDT." References: Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 13:21:00 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message Brian Beattie writes: : All these offers to test 1460 support are quite hearting. However; with : out a pcmcia interface it is unlikely, that I will be able make much : progress in that direction. Whan I have a working aic driver I would : suggest that some who has access to a 1460 volenteer write the support, or : maybe even do the whole thing. I'll be happy to add pcmcia support to an aic driver. I have done that to other drivers in the past, and have a SlimSCSI card that I can get access to for testing. However, I need an aic driver to do that with first :-). What's the eta on this one? Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 12:44:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67F681568E; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 12:44:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id EAA03962; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 04:40:41 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <37124BCE.EA44818E@newsguy.com> Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 04:38:54 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Greg Lehey Cc: "Andrey A. Chernov" , Bruce Evans , "Kenneth D. Merry" , FreeBSD Hackers , cvs-all@FreeBSD.ORG, cvs-committers@FreeBSD.ORG, ache@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/usr.sbin/config main.c References: <199904101415.AAA28666@godzilla.zeta.org.au> <19990410182224.A18709@nagual.pp.ru> <19990411103824.Y2142@lemis.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey wrote: > > In any case, it's all very well to "agree", but none of you have > presented any arguments for your viewpoint. In particular you, Ken, > have in the past asked people to use a debug kernel to get adequate > information after a panic. If no symbols is the default, 99% of > people who have problems won't be able to report them. As I proposed > in the discussion on -hackers, this solution should make everybody > happy: there is no difference in the running system, on modern > machines it only takes fractionally longer to build a debug kernel, > and it helps a lot in finding problems. You failed to mention one of the most important points, Greg. People have argued that in a production machine you don't want the excess. In this case, the "excess" is just a few megabytes of disk space, and not even that if you use -s. Someone who doesn't fails to learn about the change and the new flag has a good chance of needing the kernel with debug symbols built by default. And, most important of all, if a production machine crashes, it is very likely that you *don't want* to reboot it just to install a new kernel, and you almost certainly don't want to try to reproduce the panic. So, for a production server, it's better to have the kernel with debug symbols built by default. It can also be argued that *not* doing it serves almost no purpose. -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "nothing better than the ability to perform cunning linguistics" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 12:58:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from jumping-spider.aracnet.com (jumping-spider.ARACNET.com [205.159.88.14]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3E4114D5E for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 12:58:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from beattie@aracnet.com) Received: from shell2.aracnet.com (IDENT:1728@shell2.aracnet.com [205.159.88.20]) by jumping-spider.aracnet.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id MAA12850; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 12:56:38 -0700 Received: from localhost by shell2.aracnet.com (8.8.7) id MAA07342; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 12:56:37 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: shell2.aracnet.com: beattie owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 12:56:37 -0700 (PDT) From: Brian Beattie To: Warner Losh Cc: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , "Daniel C. Sobral" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT In-Reply-To: <199904121921.NAA02162@harmony.village.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 12 Apr 1999, Warner Losh wrote: > In message Brian Beattie writes: > : All these offers to test 1460 support are quite hearting. However; with > : out a pcmcia interface it is unlikely, that I will be able make much > : progress in that direction. Whan I have a working aic driver I would > : suggest that some who has access to a 1460 volenteer write the support, or > : maybe even do the whole thing. > > I'll be happy to add pcmcia support to an aic driver. I have done > that to other drivers in the past, and have a SlimSCSI card that I can > get access to for testing. > > However, I need an aic driver to do that with first :-). What's the > eta on this one? > > Warner > I have to admit, that while I am making some progress the eta is still several weeks :). I know where I am heading, I am making progress, but since this is happening in my free time it is moving slowly. Brian Beattie | The only problem with beattie@aracnet.com | winning the rat race ... www.aracnet.com/~beattie | in the end you're still a rat To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 13:53: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7C4615639 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 13:52:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id NAA81954; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 13:48:05 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 13:48:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Jaye Mathisen Cc: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 11 Apr 1999, Jaye Mathisen wrote: > > > On 12 Apr 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > > Hey gang, > > > > Here are a few ideas I have running around my head about things I'd > > love to see happen to -CURRENT: > > > > - Insert Your Favorite Vapor Feature: ____________________________ > > OK: > > 1) A method to communicate successful boot (persistence) between the > kernel and the bootblocks, so if a newly built kernel fails to boot, it > drops back to the older kernel, and reboots with it. The old bootblocks had this with the whistle options we added. (we use it in the field to upgrade THOUSANDS of boxes an dhave only once had a failure (hardware screwed up)). > > 6) As many devices moved to KLD's as possible. KLD is presently broken badly.. the following fails.. 1/ compile in module X 2/ load module Y that depends on module X note that module Y can't find module X because it's not loaded.. (it can only find modules that are loaded and not compiled in) In out code we added code to automatically load the missing module. this ended up with TWO COPIES of X in the kernel. Y talks to one, and the kernel talks to the other so it still doesn't work. > > 11) Movement of SMB support into the kernel, rather than a user process > for maximum performance. (Gotta kick NT's butt, and wouldn't mind dusting > Linux in the process). Talking to the SAMBA guys, they indicate the biggest support assistance would be a case-insensitive case preserving Unicode filesystem. They have to emulate all that name munging at the moment. They are already kicking NT's butt in many situations. julian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 13:55:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from www.whyy.org (www.whyy.org [207.245.67.105]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FEC5154F4 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 13:55:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jehrenkrantz@www.whyy.org) Received: (from jehrenkrantz@localhost) by www.whyy.org (8.8.8/8.7.3) id QAA07009; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 16:53:12 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 16:53:12 -0400 (EDT) From: Jeff Ehrenkrantz To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Upgrade -namedb problem Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG HI all I have just slamed into the wall. I upgraded a 2.2.7 system to 3.1release and now the named.conf file is rejected by named ... Apr 12 16:31:08 unix1 named[744]: starting. named 8.1.2 Mon Feb 15 10:10:31 GMd Apr 12 16:31:08 unix1 named[744]: /etc/namedb/named.conf:1: syntax error near ; Apr 12 16:31:08 unix1 named[745]: Ready to answer quries I get the syntax error on a file that has been running for months. Can any one help out? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 14: 4:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from verdi.nethelp.no (verdi.nethelp.no [158.36.41.162]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D2D0614E13 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 14:04:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sthaug@nethelp.no) Received: (qmail 69941 invoked by uid 1001); 12 Apr 1999 21:01:44 +0000 (GMT) To: jehrenkrantz@www.whyy.org Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Upgrade -namedb problem From: sthaug@nethelp.no In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 12 Apr 1999 16:53:12 -0400 (EDT)" References: X-Mailer: Mew version 1.05+ on Emacs 19.34.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 23:01:43 +0200 Message-ID: <69939.923950903@verdi.nethelp.no> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > HI all I have just slamed into the wall. I upgraded a 2.2.7 system to > 3.1release and now the named.conf file is rejected by named ... Apr 12 > 16:31:08 unix1 named[744]: starting. named 8.1.2 Mon Feb 15 10:10:31 GMd > Apr 12 16:31:08 unix1 named[744]: /etc/namedb/named.conf:1: syntax error > near ; Apr 12 16:31:08 unix1 named[745]: Ready to answer quries I get the > syntax error on a file that has been running for months. > Can any one help out? Sounds like you have simply *renamed* your 4.9.x named.boot to named.conf. Doesn't work. It needs to be *converted* - run /usr/sbin/named-bootconf (which is a Perl script). Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 14:26:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dan.emsphone.com (dan.emsphone.com [199.67.51.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D5301553F for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 14:26:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dan@dan.emsphone.com) Received: (from dan@localhost) by dan.emsphone.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id QAA42891; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 16:23:57 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dan) Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 16:23:56 -0500 From: Dan Nelson To: "David E. Cross" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ypserv Message-ID: <19990412162356.A42830@dan.emsphone.com> References: <199904121852.OAA22126@cs.rpi.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <199904121852.OAA22126@cs.rpi.edu>; from "David E. Cross" on Mon Apr 12 14:52:30 GMT 1999 X-OS: FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In the last episode (Apr 12), David E. Cross said: > Our ypserv processes have been dieing a great deal lately (luckily > they restart themselves, but not before all the clients rebind to > another machine). I have tracked the problem down to a stack > corruption. Apparently caused by a stack overflow (I am still > working on it, don't get excited yet ;). I have run into a bit of a > snag with gdb, I do not understand the following when I print out a > function pointer: > > "" I have found many such references to the > same function, but with different numbers. I am confused as to what > this notation means, I haven't found any reference to it in the gdb > manpage or the gdb "info". It's the offset (in bytes) into a function from a source file not compiled with "-g". gcc can't get line-number information, so it prints the next best thing. The solution is to recompile ypserv with CFLAGS=-g, and make sure you install a non-stripped version. Then gdb will be able to print line number and variable contents from coredumps. -Dan Nelson dnelson@emsphone.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 14:46: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18C0315542 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 14:45:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA25814; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 17:43:31 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904122143.RAA25814@cs.rpi.edu> To: Dan Nelson Cc: "David E. Cross" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: ypserv In-Reply-To: Message from Dan Nelson of "Mon, 12 Apr 1999 16:23:56 CDT." <19990412162356.A42830@dan.emsphone.com> Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 17:43:30 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > In the last episode (Apr 12), David E. Cross said: > > Our ypserv processes have been dieing a great deal lately (luckily > > they restart themselves, but not before all the clients rebind to > > another machine). I have tracked the problem down to a stack > > corruption. Apparently caused by a stack overflow (I am still > > working on it, don't get excited yet ;). I have run into a bit of a > > snag with gdb, I do not understand the following when I print out a > > function pointer: > > > > "" I have found many such references to the > > same function, but with different numbers. I am confused as to what > > this notation means, I haven't found any reference to it in the gdb > > manpage or the gdb "info". > > It's the offset (in bytes) into a function from a source file not > compiled with "-g". gcc can't get line-number information, so it > prints the next best thing. > > The solution is to recompile ypserv with CFLAGS=-g, and make sure you > install a non-stripped version. Then gdb will be able to print line > number and variable contents from coredumps. ypserv is compiled with debugging information, not stripped, and is compiled statically. The reference that I am referring to is not in a backtrace in GDB it is the result of "print *functionpointer", where functionpointer is later used to call a function with arguments that do not match that function. For example, I see the following in the code: *(dbp->seq)(dbp, &ldata, &lkey, ...,...); I do "print dbp->seq" and I see "<__hash_open+14541>" (number made up). If I then look at __hash_open, I see it takes char *filename, ... (things I forget). So the parameters that are being passed clearly do not match what the function is expecting, but I doubt it is calling that function at all. -- David Cross | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | This space intentionally Department of Computer Science | left unblank I speak only for myself. | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 15: 3:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dan.emsphone.com (dan.emsphone.com [199.67.51.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F51F14CF8 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 15:03:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dan@dan.emsphone.com) Received: (from dan@localhost) by dan.emsphone.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id RAA43380; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 17:00:45 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dan) Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 17:00:45 -0500 From: Dan Nelson To: "David E. Cross" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ypserv Message-ID: <19990412170045.B42830@dan.emsphone.com> References: <199904122143.RAA25814@cs.rpi.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <199904122143.RAA25814@cs.rpi.edu>; from "David E. Cross" on Mon Apr 12 17:43:30 GMT 1999 X-OS: FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In the last episode (Apr 12), David E. Cross said: > > ypserv is compiled with debugging information, not stripped, and is > compiled statically. The reference that I am referring to is not in > a backtrace in GDB it is the result of "print *functionpointer", > where functionpointer is later used to call a function with arguments > that do not match that function. For example, I see the following in > the code: > > *(dbp->seq)(dbp, &ldata, &lkey, ...,...); > > I do "print dbp->seq" and I see "<__hash_open+14541>" (number made > up). If I then look at __hash_open, I see it takes char *filename, > ... (things I forget). So the parameters that are being passed > clearly do not match what the function is expecting, but I doubt it > is calling that function at all. Aah, but are you linking in a debugging libc? :) dbp->seq is function pointer into the Berkeley DB code in libc.a. The nearest user-visible function in the library is hash_open(), go that's what gdb printed. Try setting DEBUG_FLAGS=-g, then rebuild libc and relink your program. That should let you see into the DB functions. But if you're crashing there, chances are your problem is elsewhere. All dbp->seq() does is walk through a .db database one record at a time. I don't think there are any overflow problems assosicated with the functions themselves. -Dan Nelson dnelson@emsphone.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 15:32:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from frmug.org (frmug-gw.frmug.org [193.56.58.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1388B150DA for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 15:32:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by frmug.org (8.9.1/frmug-2.3/nospam) with UUCP id AAA27947 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 00:30:12 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: by keltia.freenix.fr (Postfix, from userid 101) id 03F468841; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 23:54:35 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 23:54:35 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: behaviour of open(foo,O_CREAT) in regards to setting 'group' Message-ID: <19990412235435.A7861@keltia.freenix.fr> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <199904121502.LAA15248@dean.pc.sas.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <199904121502.LAA15248@dean.pc.sas.com>; from Brian Dean on Mon, Apr 12, 1999 at 11:02:18AM -0400 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT/ELF ctm#5173 AMD-K6 MMX @ 200 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG According to Brian Dean: > In FreeBSD, the open(foo,O_CREAT) call creates the file and sets the > group of the new file to that of the directory in which the file was > created. This is standard BSD behaviour since the beginning. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 4.0-CURRENT #70: Sat Feb 27 09:43:08 CET 1999 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 16:10:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hq.globix.net (hq.globix.net [206.139.190.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1FE35150AC for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 16:10:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from marko@hq.globix.net) Received: (from marko@localhost) by hq.globix.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1/AmF) id TAA24272; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 19:08:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19990412190816.O23025@globix.net> Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 19:08:16 -0400 From: Marko Bukvic To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: 'alternate system clock has died!' message from systat under 3.1-REL & STABLE with SMP Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi all, I've got a new Asus XG-DLS dual Xeon motherboard with two Pentium II 450MHz Xeon procs and if I compile in SMP support I get the following problem: After bootup, if I start top and set the delay seconds (s) to 0(zero) the cpu load for the top process goes all the way up, and then after a little while it goes all the way down and everything has the same cpu utilization of 0.00%. Then if I start systat vmstat 1, it says: The alternate system clock has died! Reverting to ``pigs'' display. I can start systat -vmstat 1 without any problems if I do not 'stress' the cpu or if I do it right after bootup. I am running the latest stable, but I also had the problem with 3.1-RELEASE. I tried using the MP1.1 spec setting in my bios to no avail. Any help or suggestions would be appreciated. It might be of importance to note that the CPU line does not show the MHz of the chip. Thanks in advance for any help. Marko marko@globix.net here is my dmesg and mptable output. Copyright (c) 1992-1999 FreeBSD Inc. Copyright (c) 1982, 1986, 1989, 1991, 1993 The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE #1: Fri Apr 9 06:54:25 EDT 1999 marko@foo.com:/usr/src/sys/compile/foo Timecounter "i8254" frequency 1193182 Hz CPU: Pentium II/Xeon/Celeron (686-class CPU) Origin = "GenuineIntel" Id = 0x653 Stepping=3 Features=0x183fbff> real memory = 402653184 (393216K bytes) avail memory = 388345856 (379244K bytes) Programming 24 pins in IOAPIC #0 FreeBSD/SMP: Multiprocessor motherboard cpu0 (BSP): apic id: 1, version: 0x00040011, at 0xfee00000 cpu1 (AP): apic id: 0, version: 0x00040011, at 0xfee00000 io0 (APIC): apic id: 2, version: 0x00170011, at 0xfec00000 Preloaded elf kernel "kernel" at 0xf02fe000. Probing for devices on PCI bus 0: chip0: rev 0x00 on pci0.0.0 chip1: rev 0x00 on pci0.1.0 chip2: rev 0x02 on pci0.4.0 ide_pci0: rev 0x01 on pci0.4.1 chip3: rev 0x02 on pci0.4.3 ahc0: rev 0x00 int a irq 17 on pci0.6.0 ahc0: aic7896/97 Wide Channel A, SCSI Id=7, 16/255 SCBs ahc1: rev 0x00 int a irq 17 on pci0.6.1 ahc1: aic7896/97 Wide Channel B, SCSI Id=7, 16/255 SCBs fxp0: rev 0x05 int a irq 19 on pci0.7. 0 fxp0: Ethernet address 00:e0:18:b0:04:c3 de0: rev 0x41 int a irq 17 on pci0.11.0 de0: 21143 [10-100Mb/s] pass 4.1 de0: address 00:c0:f0:3b:7a:af Probing for devices on PCI bus 1: vga0: rev 0x01 int a irq 16 on pci1.0.0 Probing for PnP devices: CSN 1 Vendor ID: CTL00f0 [0xf0008c0e] Serial 0xffffffff Comp ID: PNPb02f [0x2fb0 d041] pcm1 (SB16pnp sn 0xffffffff) at 0x220-0x22f irq 10 drq 1 flags 0x10 o n isa Probing for devices on the ISA bus: sc0 on isa sc0: VGA color <16 virtual consoles, flags=0x0> pcm0 not probed due to drq conflict with pcm1 at 1 atkbdc0 at 0x60-0x6f on motherboard atkbd0 irq 1 on isa psm0 irq 12 on isa psm0: model Generic PS/2 mouse, device ID 0 sio0 at 0x3f8-0x3ff irq 4 flags 0x10 on isa sio0: type 16550A sio1 at 0x2f8-0x2ff irq 3 on isa sio1: type 16550A fdc0 at 0x3f0-0x3f7 irq 6 drq 2 on isa fdc0: FIFO enabled, 8 bytes threshold fd0: 1.44MB 3.5in wdc0 at 0x1f0-0x1f7 irq 14 flags 0xa0ffa0ff on isa wdc0: unit 0 (atapi): , removable, accel, dma, ior dis acd0: drive speed 6890KB/sec, 256KB cache acd0: supported read types: CD-R, CD-RW, CD-DA acd0: Audio: play, 16 volume levels acd0: Mechanism: ejectable tray acd0: Medium: CD-ROM 120mm audio disc loaded, unlocked wdc1 not found at 0x170 ppc0 at 0x378 irq 7 on isa ppc0: SMC-like chipset (ECP/EPP/PS2/NIBBLE) in COMPATIBLE mode ppc0: FIFO with 16/16/9 bytes threshold nlpt0: on ppbus 0 nlpt0: Interrupt-driven port ppi0: on ppbus 0 plip0: on ppbus 0 vga0 at 0x3b0-0x3df maddr 0xa0000 msize 131072 on isa npx0 on motherboard npx0: INT 16 interface APIC_IO: Testing 8254 interrupt delivery APIC_IO: routing 8254 via pin 2 IP packet filtering initialized, divert enabled, rule-based forwarding disabled, default to accept, logging limited to 100 packets/entry DUMMYNET initialized (990326) -- size dn_pkt 48 Waiting 15 seconds for SCSI devices to settle SMP: AP CPU #1 Launched! de0: autosense failed: cable problem? changing root device to da0s1a da1 at ahc0 bus 0 target 1 lun 0 da1: Fixed Direct Access SCSI-2 device da1: 80.000MB/s transfers (40.000MHz, offset 15, 16bit), Tagged Queueing Enabled da1: 8715MB (17850000 512 byte sectors: 255H 63S/T 1111C) da0 at ahc0 bus 0 target 0 lun 0 da0: Fixed Direct Access SCSI-2 device da0: 80.000MB/s transfers (40.000MHz, offset 15, 16bit), Tagged Queueing Enabled da0: 4357MB (8925000 512 byte sectors: 255H 63S/T 555C) ffs_mountfs: superblock updated for soft updates ffs_mountfs: superblock updated for soft updates ffs_mountfs: superblock updated for soft updates ffs_mountfs: superblock updated for soft updates ffs_mountfs: superblock updated for soft updates ffs_mountfs: superblock updated for soft updates mptable output: =============================================================================== MPTable, version 2.0.15 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MP Floating Pointer Structure: location: BIOS physical address: 0x000f6df0 signature: '_MP_' length: 16 bytes version: 1.1 checksum: 0x45 mode: Virtual Wire ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MP Config Table Header: physical address: 0x000f69e6 signature: 'PCMP' base table length: 252 version: 1.1 checksum: 0x59 OEM ID: 'OEM00000' Product ID: 'PROD00000000' OEM table pointer: 0x00000000 OEM table size: 0 entry count: 23 local APIC address: 0xfee00000 extended table length: 0 extended table checksum: 0 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MP Config Base Table Entries: -- Processors: APIC ID Version State Family Model Step Flags 1 0x11 BSP, usable 6 5 3 0x183fbff 0 0x11 AP, usable 6 5 3 0x183fbff -- Bus: Bus ID Type 0 PCI 1 PCI 2 ISA -- I/O APICs: APIC ID Version State Address 2 0x11 usable 0xfec00000 -- I/O Ints: Type Polarity Trigger Bus ID IRQ APIC ID PIN# ExtINT conforms conforms 2 0 2 0 INT conforms conforms 2 1 2 1 INT conforms conforms 2 0 2 2 INT conforms conforms 2 3 2 3 INT conforms conforms 2 4 2 4 INT conforms conforms 2 6 2 6 INT conforms conforms 2 7 2 7 INT conforms conforms 2 8 2 8 INT conforms conforms 2 9 2 9 INT conforms conforms 2 10 2 10 INT conforms conforms 2 12 2 12 INT conforms conforms 2 14 2 14 INT active-lo level 2 11 2 16 INT active-lo level 2 15 2 17 INT active-lo level 2 5 2 19 -- Local Ints: Type Polarity Trigger Bus ID IRQ APIC ID PIN# ExtINT active-hi edge 2 0 255 0 NMI active-hi edge 2 0 255 1 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- # SMP kernel config file options: # Required: options SMP # Symmetric MultiProcessor Kernel options APIC_IO # Symmetric (APIC) I/O # Optional (built-in defaults will work in most cases): #options NCPU=2 # number of CPUs #options NBUS=3 # number of busses #options NAPIC=1 # number of IO APICs #options NINTR=24 # number of INTs =============================================================================== To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 20:16:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailhub.psn.ie (mailhub.psn.ie [194.106.150.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 440C815676 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 20:16:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ad@psn.ie) Received: from vmunix.psn.ie ([194.106.150.252]) by mailhub.psn.ie with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #3) id 10Wtc4-000BjX-00 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 04:11:48 +0100 Received: from localhost.psn.ie ([127.0.0.1] helo=localhost) by vmunix.psn.ie with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #1) id 10Wtcz-0000LD-00 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 04:12:45 +0100 Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 04:12:45 +0100 (IST) From: Andy Doran To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Licensing on syscons fonts Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi all. Can somebody please point me to a license for iso8x16.fnt in /usr/share/syscons, or tell me if it's in the public domain? I've looked around but can't find one anywhere. Thanks, Andy. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 21:48:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alcanet.com.au (news.alcanet.com.au [203.62.196.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFC6815212 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 21:48:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au) Received: by border.alcanet.com.au id <40354>; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 14:32:55 +1000 Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 14:46:10 +1000 From: Peter Jeremy Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: bright@rush.net Message-Id: <99Apr13.143255est.40354@border.alcanet.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Alfred Perlstein wrote: >> - Insert Your Favorite Vapor Feature: ____________________________ > >sparc64, LFS... *hides* To quote from the relevant FreeBSD LINT log entry: If you want to play with it, you can find the final version of the code in the repository the tag LFS_RETIREMENT. If somebody makes LFS work again, adding it back is certainly desireable, but as it is now nobody seems to care much about it, and it has suffered considerable bitrot since its somewhat haphazard integration. Several other people have commented that NetBSD has got it going. How difficult would it be to merge the NetBSD stuff? Personally, I'd like to see a C-FFS implementation (recently mentioned here) - see http://www.pdos.lcs.mit.edu/papers/cffs.html Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 23:10:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from frmug.org (frmug-gw.frmug.org [193.56.58.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 166FE14D03 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 23:10:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by frmug.org (8.9.1/frmug-2.3/nospam) with UUCP id IAA16692 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 08:08:25 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: by keltia.freenix.fr (Postfix, from userid 101) id C33968841; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 07:45:38 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 07:45:38 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Licensing on syscons fonts Message-ID: <19990413074538.A10790@keltia.freenix.fr> Mail-Followup-To: hackers@freebsd.org References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/0.95.3i In-Reply-To: ; from Andy Doran on Tue, Apr 13, 1999 at 04:12:45AM +0100 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT/ELF ctm#5173 AMD-K6 MMX @ 200 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG According to Andy Doran: > Can somebody please point me to a license for iso8x16.fnt in > /usr/share/syscons, or tell me if it's in the public domain? I've looked > around but can't find one anywhere. I don't know for other fonts but as the author of the two -thin fonts, they are in the public domain. I can write it into a README file if there is any need. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 4.0-CURRENT #70: Sat Feb 27 09:43:08 CET 1999 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 23:51:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp [133.34.17.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06B251501E for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 23:51:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp) Received: from rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (8.9.3/3.7W-Naklab-2.1-19981120) with ESMTP id PAA34093; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 15:48:54 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <199904130648.PAA34093@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: Seigo TANIMURA Subject: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports From: Seigo TANIMURA X-Mailer: Mew version 1.70 on Emacs 19.34.1 / Mule 2.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 15:48:54 +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi! I am writing on behalf of Tsuyoshi Iguchi-san, who ported the Voxware midi driver for serial ports from Linux to FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE and 4.0-CURRENT(by me). With this driver, you get to plug your synthesizer into the serial port to use playmidi, rosegarden and other popular midi players and tools for VoxWare. I tried playing a midi sequence with heavy exclusives using playmidi to get NO latency at all like sbmidi. Tsuyoshi-san is working to merge his driver into the new audio drivers by Luigi. Prior to it, we would like someone to have a review on Tsuyoshi-san's work. For those who interested, here is what you have to do: 1. Fetch the patch for the driver. For 3.1-STABLE: http://www.eie.yz.yamagata-u.ac.jp/~a95516/zinnia/hack/rsmidi/uart16550patch.tar.gz For 4.0-CURRENT: http://www.eie.yz.yamagata-u.ac.jp/~a95516/zinnia/hack/rsmidi/uart16550.egcsfixed.diff.gz 2. Patch your kernel source. For 3.1-STABLE: % cd (somewhere) % tar zxvf uart16550-3.1-STABLE.tar.gz % cp uart16550.c /usr/src/sys/i386/isa/sound % cd /usr/src/sys/i386 % patch -p < (somewhere)/uart16550/uart16550-3.1-STABLE.patch For 4.0-CURRENT: % cd /usr/src/sys % zcat (somewhere)/uart16550.egcsfixed.diff.gz | patch 3. Modify your kernel config. a. Comment out the sio device to use for midi output. eg: #device sio0 at isa? port "IO_COM1" flags 0x10 tty irq 4 If you don't want to remove sio device, set disable flag to sio device. eg: device sio0 at isa? disable port "IO_COM1" flags 0x10 tty irq 4 b. Add the midi serial device. The device name is 'uartsio' at this moment. controller snd0 # Do not forget this! device uartsio0 at isa? port 0x3f8 irq 4 The port and irq for uartsio0 may vary, of course. 4. Make your new kernel, install it and reboot your box as usual. 5. cat(1) /dev/sndstat. You should have something like this: Card config: (snip) 16550 UART Midi at 0x3f8 irq 4 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Midi devices: 0: SoundBlaster 16 Midi 1: uart16550A MIDI ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Check the underlined messages. 6. That's it! Have a nice tune! Comments and requests are all welcome. Thanks! Seigo TANIMURA |M2, Nakagawa Lab, Dept of Electronics & CS =========================|Faculty of Engineering, Yokohama National Univ Powered by SIEMENS, |http://www.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp/~tanimura/ FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT |http://www.sakura.ne.jp/~tcarrot/ (10th Apr 1999) & muesli.|tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp tcarrot@sakuramail.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 12 23:57: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B18B915202 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 1999 23:56:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (haldjas.folklore.ee [172.17.2.1] (may be forged)) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.8.8/8.8.4) with SMTP id JAA06913; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 09:54:12 +0300 (EEST) Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 09:54:12 +0300 (EEST) From: Narvi To: Jason Thorpe Cc: Ville-Pertti Keinonen , Matthew Dillon , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls In-Reply-To: <199904121916.MAA07413@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 12 Apr 1999, Jason Thorpe wrote: > On 12 Apr 1999 17:01:50 +0300 > Ville-Pertti Keinonen wrote: > > > This may come as a shock to you, but read(2)/write(2) aren't atomic in > > updating the file pointer, either. > > Then that's a bug in the FreeBSD kernel. > > > Actually, read(2) is equivalent to lseek(2)+pread(2)+lseek(2), with the > > last lseek(2) being SEEK_CUR by the read count returned by pread(2). > > The difference is that read(2) can only be pre-empted if it blocks > > doing I/O (which is not unusual). > > Geez, how did this get implemented in FreeBSD?! It's certainly not that > complicated. > I can say nothing but that you shouldn't believe everything you are told. *IF* NetBSD read in sys_generic does the same that OpenBSD read does, then all the three do the same things: a) they do permission checking b) they set up the iovec c) they call (*fp->f_ops->fo_read) d) they check for error And that's it. Anybody claiming otherwise is *STRONGLY* advised to point me to the code where I can see that it isn't so. Sander There is no love, no good, no happiness and no future - all these are just illusions. > -- Jason R. Thorpe > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 0:12:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB75E1501E for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 00:12:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (haldjas.folklore.ee [172.17.2.1] (may be forged)) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.8.8/8.8.4) with SMTP id KAA07019; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 10:02:34 +0300 (EEST) Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 10:02:34 +0300 (EEST) From: Narvi To: Ville-Pertti Keinonen Cc: Matthew Dillon , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls In-Reply-To: <86hfqmgcoh.fsf@not.demophon.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 12 Apr 1999, Ville-Pertti Keinonen wrote: > > dillon@apollo.backplane.com (Matthew Dillon) writes: > > > :> But, see above about it not being possible to emulate read() with pread() > > :> in userspace. > > : > > :You mean, without lseek(2) =) > > > > pread/pwrite + lseek is not atomic, so exact emulation is not > > possible. > > This may come as a shock to you, but read(2)/write(2) aren't atomic in > updating the file pointer, either. > How come? > Actually, read(2) is equivalent to lseek(2)+pread(2)+lseek(2), with the > last lseek(2) being SEEK_CUR by the read count returned by pread(2). > The difference is that read(2) can only be pre-empted if it blocks > doing I/O (which is not unusual). > I would like to hear where is the code that would back up your claims. At least in 3.1 it is not so. Sander There is no love, no good, no happiness and no future - all these are just illusions. > Of course emulating read(2) would be ugly and slow. > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 0:37: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.oeno.com (ns.oeno.com [194.100.99.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 51FAE14CA9 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 00:37:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from will@ns.oeno.com) Received: (qmail 1761 invoked by uid 1001); 13 Apr 1999 07:34:39 -0000 To: narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee (Narvi) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls References: <86hfqmgcoh.fsf@not.demophon.com> From: Ville-Pertti Keinonen Date: 13 Apr 1999 10:34:24 +0300 In-Reply-To: narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee's message of "13 Apr 1999 10:10:40 +0300" Message-ID: <861zhp2cu7.fsf@not.demophon.com> Lines: 32 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/XEmacs 20.4 - "Emerald" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee (Narvi) writes: > On 12 Apr 1999, Ville-Pertti Keinonen wrote: > > This may come as a shock to you, but read(2)/write(2) aren't atomic in > > updating the file pointer, either. > How come? I'm not sure whether the locking is supposed to prevent multiple simultaneous readers on a vnode (which would be silly), it certainly doesn't. Updating the pointer consistently over blocks without nasty locking operations is quite impossible the way things work now, the file descriptor object isn't available to the low-level I/O code. > > Actually, read(2) is equivalent to lseek(2)+pread(2)+lseek(2), with the > > last lseek(2) being SEEK_CUR by the read count returned by pread(2). > > The difference is that read(2) can only be pre-empted if it blocks > > doing I/O (which is not unusual). > I would like to hear where is the code that would back up your claims. Just follow the code path for file I/O operations. /sys/kern/vfs_vnops.c, grep for ^vn_read. > At least in 3.1 it is not so. I'm absolutely certain that it is. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 0:42: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.oeno.com (ns.oeno.com [194.100.99.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id C8C90154F4 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 00:42:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from will@ns.oeno.com) Received: (qmail 2057 invoked by uid 1001); 13 Apr 1999 07:39:47 -0000 To: Jason Thorpe Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls References: <199904121916.MAA07413@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> From: Ville-Pertti Keinonen Date: 13 Apr 1999 10:39:33 +0300 In-Reply-To: thorpej@nas.nasa.gov's message of "12 Apr 1999 22:21:18 +0300" Message-ID: <86zp4d0y16.fsf@not.demophon.com> Lines: 9 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/XEmacs 20.4 - "Emerald" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG thorpej@nas.nasa.gov (Jason Thorpe) writes: > Geez, how did this get implemented in FreeBSD?! It's certainly not that > complicated. I don't have a NetBSD machine around, but it might apply to NetBSD, as well, unless NetBSD keeps the vnode exclusively locked for the entire duration of a VOP_READ, even if it blocks. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 1:43:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alice.gba.oz.au (gba-254.tmx.com.au [203.9.155.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 3E92815012 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 01:43:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gjb-freebsd@gba.oz.au) Received: (qmail 4793 invoked by uid 1001); 13 Apr 1999 08:39:46 -0000 Message-ID: <19990413083946.4792.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au> X-Posted-By: GBA-Post 1.03 20-Sep-1998 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 5A91 6942 8CEA 9DAB B95B C249 1CE1 493B 2B5A CE30 Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 18:39:45 +1000 From: Greg Black To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Bugs in 3.1-release install Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've done around 100 full installs of various FreeBSD releases from the Walnut Creek CDs to a bunch of test machines. Each of those installs (2.2.6, 2.2.7, mostly 2.2.8) has gone from start to finish without any kind of problem. But I've had plenty of problems with the 3.1 CDs (I have never touched 3.0 in any form). I cannot provide a repeatable complete path to the issues that I list below, partly because the behaviour is not repeatable in any simple way and partly because the only way I think I can repeat it involves hours of time wasting and writing things down and I just don't have the time to do that. If I boot from the CD, choose custom install (as I always have done previously), follow the normal sequence of the menus, choose new partitions on the disk, select everything (except the kerberos stuff), and finally move to the media menu, I get told there is no CDROM, despite the fact that I booted from it and everything I have done to this point comes from the CD. On one of my attempts at this, I managed to go back to the novice install (which I've never used before), select a minimal install with X11, avoid the media menu, and it went ahead and did the install -- but it left out the X stuff. So, not wanting to repeat the entire exercise, I thought I'd have another crack at that with /stand/sysinstall since it was the 3.1 version, having been loaded from the CD. I did the obvious things, but was again stymied by a message about no CDROM detected. This was not quite as irritating, given that I had not actually used the CD to get to this point, but it was still a pretty stupid message. I found no way around this, even though I could easily mount the CD and access it. Then I tried to repeat a full install, from the already running /stand/sysinstall. I noted that certain menus had slight differences (e.g., one of the disk setup menus -- probably the partition table one -- presented a `Q' option when I booted from the CD, but this was missing when I ran /stand/sysinstall), but I found no way at all of selecting some set of operations that would allow me to select my CDROM from the media menu. So I began another full install, after booting from the CD. This time, I went to the media menu first (just to save me from going through a million other menus only to be told that I couldn't proceed). It was quite happy to select the CDROM when I did that as my first operation, and then the rest of the install (the full install of everything but the kerberos stuff) went as I thought it should have. I then tried another full install, booting from the CD and proceeding through the menus in the indicated order. Again, I was unable to select my CDROM. So I rebooted from the CD yet again, selected the media menu first, selected the CDROM, and completed another full install. That's what I have running now and I'm in the process of learning the new rc file stuff and incorporating all my customization for 2.2.8 into my 3.1 box. I have no idea how much of the new system actually works, but I'll find out a bit more over the next few days. At any rate, until this bug is fixed, it might be helpful to novice installers if the instructions mentioned the possibility that it might be wise to select the CDROM media before doing all the other stuff. -- Greg Black To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 5:35:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.oeno.com (ns.oeno.com [194.100.99.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D2F8214BFA for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 05:35:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from will@ns.oeno.com) Received: (qmail 10215 invoked by uid 1001); 13 Apr 1999 12:32:54 -0000 To: hackers@freebsd.org Cc: thorpej@nas.nasa.gov, dillon@apollo.backplane.com Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls References: <199904121916.MAA07413@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> <86zp4d0y16.fsf@not.demophon.com> From: Ville-Pertti Keinonen Date: 13 Apr 1999 15:32:39 +0300 In-Reply-To: will@iki.fi's message of "13 Apr 1999 10:40:11 +0300" Message-ID: <86yajw1z14.fsf@not.demophon.com> Lines: 42 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/XEmacs 20.4 - "Emerald" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG will@iki.fi (Ville-Pertti Keinonen) writes: > thorpej@nas.nasa.gov (Jason Thorpe) writes: > > Geez, how did this get implemented in FreeBSD?! It's certainly not that > > complicated. > I don't have a NetBSD machine around, but it might apply to NetBSD, as > well, unless NetBSD keeps the vnode exclusively locked for the entire > duration of a VOP_READ, even if it blocks. I checked the source - the above is true, so NetBSD (and 4.4 BSD-Lite2 in general) should not be affected as severely as recent versions of FreeBSD (this still doesn't mean that it's safe). The significant difference is the locking modes given to the vn_lock call. Unlike NetBSD/Lite2, FreeBSD uses a shared lock in vn_read. Currently (in releases starting with 3.0) FreeBSD is particularly unpredictable, e.g. if you have two processes reading large chunks of data from the same file descriptor, you can end up with results like: data = a b c d process 1 reads a, c, process 2 reads a, d process 1 reads a, b, process 2 reads b, d process 1 reads a, c, process 2 reads a, c etc. In other words, some chunks are returned twice, some are skipped. Additionally, lseek(2) is free to change the offset in the file descriptor while read/write operations are blocked. This applies to all versions of all 4.4 BSD derivatives AFAIK. If this behavior is considered a bug (in the absence of multithreaded processes, it isn't necessarily one, shared file descriptors between processes only strictly need offset consistency for synchronized, sequential operations), the correct fix is to add a lock to the file descriptor object (using a lock on the vnode to prevent the modification of the f_offset of a file would obviously be bogus). To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 7:19:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from noc.demon.net (server.noc.demon.net [193.195.224.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0119D15239 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 07:19:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fanf@demon.net) Received: by noc.demon.net; id PAA27320; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 15:17:20 +0100 (BST) Received: from fanf.noc.demon.net(195.11.55.83) by inside.noc.demon.net via smap (3.2) id xma027286; Tue, 13 Apr 99 15:17:09 +0100 Received: from fanf by fanf.noc.demon.net with local (Exim 1.73 #2) id 10X3zx-0002t8-00; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 15:17:09 +0100 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: Tony Finch Cc: Tony Finch Subject: Re: 'alternate system clock has died!' message from systat under 3.1-REL & STABLE with SMP In-Reply-To: <19990412190816.O23025@globix.net> Message-Id: Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 15:17:09 +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Marko Bukvic wrote: > >I've got a new Asus XG-DLS dual Xeon motherboard with two Pentium II 450MHz Xeon >procs and if I compile in SMP support I get the following problem: > >After bootup, if I start top and set the delay seconds (s) to 0(zero) the cpu >load for the top process goes all the way up, and then after a little while it >goes all the way down and everything has the same cpu utilization of 0.00%. > >Then if I start systat vmstat 1, it says: > > The alternate system clock has died! > Reverting to ``pigs'' display. We have also seen this on an Asus P2B-DS (440BX chip set) with dual PII 450MHz (not Xeon). The problem doesn't occur with 400MHz processors. As a guess we tried compiling a kernel with BETTER_CLOCK_DIAGNOSTIC but we didn't get any additional diagnostics. Tony. -- f.a.n.finch dot@dotat.at fanf@demon.net Arthur: "Oh, that sounds better, have you worked out the controls?" Ford: "No, we just stopped playing with them." Copyright (c) 1992-1999 FreeBSD Inc. Copyright (c) 1982, 1986, 1989, 1991, 1993 The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE #3: Thu Apr 1 14:00:53 BST 1999 root@quake2.games.uk.demon.net:/usr/src/sys/compile/QUAKE2 Timecounter "i8254" frequency 1193182 Hz CPU: Pentium II/Xeon/Celeron (686-class CPU) Origin = "GenuineIntel" Id = 0x652 Stepping=2 Features=0x183fbff> real memory = 268435456 (262144K bytes) avail memory = 258236416 (252184K bytes) Programming 24 pins in IOAPIC #0 FreeBSD/SMP: Multiprocessor motherboard cpu0 (BSP): apic id: 1, version: 0x00040011, at 0xfee00000 cpu1 (AP): apic id: 0, version: 0x00040011, at 0xfee00000 io0 (APIC): apic id: 2, version: 0x00170011, at 0xfec00000 Preloaded elf kernel "kernel" at 0xf02c5000. Probing for devices on PCI bus 0: chip0: rev 0x03 on pci0.0.0 chip1: rev 0x03 on pci0.1.0 chip2: rev 0x02 on pci0.4.0 chip3: rev 0x02 on pci0.4.3 ahc0: rev 0x00 int a irq 19 on pci0.6.0 ahc0: aic7890/91 Wide Channel A, SCSI Id=7, 16/255 SCBs fxp0: rev 0x08 int a irq 18 on pci0.10.0 fxp0: Ethernet address 00:90:27:41:c2:9b Probing for devices on PCI bus 1: vga0: rev 0x7a int a irq 16 on pci1.0.0 Probing for devices on the ISA bus: sc0 on isa sc0: VGA color <16 virtual consoles, flags=0x0> atkbdc0 at 0x60-0x6f on motherboard atkbd0 irq 1 on isa psm0 not found sio0 at 0x3f8-0x3ff irq 4 flags 0x10 on isa sio0: type 16550A sio1: configured irq 3 not in bitmap of probed irqs 0 sio1 not found at 0x2f8 fdc0 at 0x3f0-0x3f7 irq 6 drq 2 on isa fdc0: FIFO enabled, 8 bytes threshold fd0: 1.44MB 3.5in wt0 not found at 0x300 mcd0 not found at 0x300 matcdc0 not found at 0x230 scd0 not found at 0x230 ppc0 not found vga0 at 0x3b0-0x3df maddr 0xa0000 msize 131072 on isa npx0 on motherboard npx0: INT 16 interface APIC_IO: Testing 8254 interrupt delivery APIC_IO: routing 8254 via pin 2 Waiting 25 seconds for SCSI devices to settle SMP: AP CPU #1 Launched! changing root device to da0s1a da0 at ahc0 bus 0 target 0 lun 0 da0: Fixed Direct Access SCSI-2 device da0: 80.000MB/s transfers (40.000MHz, offset 15, 16bit), Tagged Queueing Enabled da0: 4340MB (8888924 512 byte sectors: 255H 63S/T 553C) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 7:30:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from etinc.com (et-gw.etinc.com [207.252.1.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8697E15239 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 07:30:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dennis@etinc.com) Received: from dbsys (dbsys.etinc.com [207.252.1.18]) by etinc.com (8.8.8/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA03942 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 10:27:45 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904131427.KAA03942@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 09:21:20 -0400 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: Dennis Subject: PCI burst determination Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Is there a way to determine the max burst of the PCI bridge on the MB for controller optimization? I dont see a fuction...is it stored somewhere? Dennis To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 7:45:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gate.lustig.com (gate.lustig.com [205.246.2.242]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id E4673152F7 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 07:45:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from barry@lustig.com) Received: (qmail 72827 invoked from network); 13 Apr 1999 14:43:17 -0000 Received: from devious.lustig.com (205.246.2.244) by gate.lustig.com with SMTP; 13 Apr 1999 14:43:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 16672 invoked by uid 1001); 13 Apr 1999 14:44:09 -0000 Message-ID: <19990413144409.16671.qmail@devious.lustig.com> Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 4.2mach v148) In-Reply-To: <199904122143.RAA25814@cs.rpi.edu> X-Nextstep-Mailer: Mail 4.2mach (Enhance 2.2p1) Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.148.RR) From: Barry Lustig Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 10:44:08 -0400 To: "David E. Cross" Subject: Re: ypserv Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: barry@Lustig.COM References: <199904122143.RAA25814@cs.rpi.edu> X-Organizations: Barry Lustig & Associates, Inc. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG David, You need to compile ypserv with ElectricFence to start to track down this problem. Otherwise, you don't see the problem until much later after the problem really occurs. I have a network with 3 2.x-stable machines running ypserv and 1 3.x-stable machine running ypserv. These machines serve yp to solaris 2.5.1, 2.6, 2.7, irix 5.3, 6.2, 6.3, 6.4, 6.5, and openstep 4.2 machines. I see dozens of SEGV's from the ypserv processes on the FreeBSD boxes. Here is what I managed to find. I was waiting for Bill Paul to get back to me on this, but haven't heard from him. Here is a stack trace from one of my cores: (gdb) bt #0 0x62ef in readtcp (xprt=0x20524fcc, buf=0x2066b05c , len=4000) at /usr/src/lib/libc/../libc/rpc/svc_tcp.c:346 #1 0xf103 in fill_input_buf (rstrm=0x204eefbc) at /usr/src/lib/libc/../libc/xdr/xdr_rec.c:510 #2 0xf1ed in skip_input_bytes (rstrm=0x204eefbc, cnt=4) at /usr/src/lib/libc/../libc/xdr/xdr_rec.c:576 #3 0xefd5 in xdrrec_eof (xdrs=0x204ece58) at /usr/src/lib/libc/../libc/xdr/xdr_rec.c:436 #4 0x636d in svctcp_stat (xprt=0x20524fcc) at /usr/src/lib/libc/../libc/rpc/svc_tcp.c:381 #5 0x7a0e in svc_getreqset (readfds=0xefbfd924) at /usr/src/lib/libc/../libc/rpc/svc.c:480 #6 0x4241 in yp_svc_run () at /usr/src/usr.sbin/ypserv/yp_main.c:144 #7 0x47e4 in main (argc=1, argv=0xefbfd99c) at /usr/src/usr.sbin/ypserv/yp_main.c:335 *** By the way, this is applicable to 3.x-Stable as well If you follow the stack frames up, it is clear that the problem is stemming from svc_getreqset in libc/rpc/svc.c (which I've included below). I get the SEGV at the call to SVC_STAT(xprt). Based upon the values of sock and bit: $31 = (SVCXPRT *) 0x20524fcc (gdb) p sock $32 = 0 (gdb) p bit $33 = 21 (gdb) p *xprt Error accessing memory address 0x20524fcc: Bad address. xprt should be pointing to xports[20]. Here is xports[20] (gdb) p xports[20] $28 = (SVCXPRT *) 0x0 I think that one of the children processes (or the parent process) may be calling svctcp_destroy(xprt) or svcudp_destroy(xprt) on the slot that the parent process (or child process) is working with. barry void svc_getreqset(readfds) fd_set *readfds; { enum xprt_stat stat; struct rpc_msg msg; int prog_found; u_long low_vers; u_long high_vers; struct svc_req r; register SVCXPRT *xprt; register u_long mask; register int bit; register u_long *maskp; register int setsize; register int sock; char cred_area[2*MAX_AUTH_BYTES + RQCRED_SIZE]; msg.rm_call.cb_cred.oa_base = cred_area; msg.rm_call.cb_verf.oa_base = &(cred_area[MAX_AUTH_BYTES]); r.rq_clntcred = &(cred_area[2*MAX_AUTH_BYTES]); setsize = _rpc_dtablesize(); maskp = (u_long *)readfds->fds_bits; for (sock = 0; sock < setsize; sock += NFDBITS) { for (mask = *maskp++; (bit = ffs(mask)); mask ^= (1 << (bit - 1))) { /* sock has input waiting */ xprt = xports[sock + bit - 1]; if (xprt == NULL) /* But do we control sock? */ continue; /* now receive msgs from xprtprt (support batch calls) */ do { if (SVC_RECV(xprt, &msg)) { /* now find the exported program and call it */ register struct svc_callout *s; enum auth_stat why; r.rq_xprt = xprt; r.rq_prog = msg.rm_call.cb_prog; r.rq_vers = msg.rm_call.cb_vers; r.rq_proc = msg.rm_call.cb_proc; r.rq_cred = msg.rm_call.cb_cred; /* first authenticate the message */ if ((why= _authenticate(&r, &msg)) != AUTH_OK) { svcerr_auth(xprt, why); goto call_done; } /* now match message with a registered service*/ prog_found = FALSE; low_vers = 0 - 1; high_vers = 0; for (s = svc_head; s != NULL_SVC; s = s->sc_next) { if (s->sc_prog == r.rq_prog) { if (s->sc_vers == r.rq_vers) { (*s->sc_dispatch)(&r, xprt); goto call_done; } /* found correct version */ prog_found = TRUE; if (s->sc_vers < low_vers) low_vers = s->sc_vers; if (s->sc_vers > high_vers) high_vers = s->sc_vers; } /* found correct program */ } /* * if we got here, the program or version * is not served ... */ if (prog_found) svcerr_progvers(xprt, low_vers, high_vers); else svcerr_noprog(xprt); /* Fall through to ... */ } call_done: if ((stat = SVC_STAT(xprt)) == XPRT_DIED){ SVC_DESTROY(xprt); break; } } while (stat == XPRT_MOREREQS); } } } static void svctcp_destroy(xprt) register SVCXPRT *xprt; { register struct tcp_conn *cd = (struct tcp_conn *)xprt->xp_p1; xprt_unregister(xprt); (void)close(xprt->xp_sock); if (xprt->xp_port != 0) { /* a rendezvouser socket */ xprt->xp_port = 0; } else { /* an actual connection socket */ XDR_DESTROY(&(cd->xdrs)); } mem_free((caddr_t)cd, sizeof(struct tcp_conn)); mem_free((caddr_t)xprt, sizeof(SVCXPRT)); } static void svcudp_destroy(xprt) register SVCXPRT *xprt; { register struct svcudp_data *su = su_data(xprt); xprt_unregister(xprt); (void)close(xprt->xp_sock); XDR_DESTROY(&(su->su_xdrs)); mem_free(rpc_buffer(xprt), su->su_iosz); mem_free((caddr_t)su, sizeof(struct svcudp_data)); mem_free((caddr_t)xprt, sizeof(SVCXPRT)); } To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 9:19:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lestat.nas.nasa.gov (lestat.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.50.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C25B15BAA for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 09:18:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from thorpej@lestat.nas.nasa.gov) Received: from lestat (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lestat.nas.nasa.gov (8.8.8/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA20900; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 09:16:08 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904131616.JAA20900@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> To: Ville-Pertti Keinonen Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls Reply-To: Jason Thorpe From: Jason Thorpe Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 09:16:07 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 13 Apr 1999 10:39:33 +0300 Ville-Pertti Keinonen wrote: > I don't have a NetBSD machine around, but it might apply to NetBSD, as > well, unless NetBSD keeps the vnode exclusively locked for the entire > duration of a VOP_READ, even if it blocks. There is no need to keep the _vnode_ locked; the file offset is not stored in the vnode, but in the struct file that references that vnode. -- Jason R. Thorpe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 10:57:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from noc.demon.net (server.noc.demon.net [193.195.224.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75B2315773 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 10:57:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fanf@demon.net) Received: by noc.demon.net; id SAA12839; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 18:55:32 +0100 (BST) Received: from fanf.noc.demon.net(195.11.55.83) by inside.noc.demon.net via smap (3.2) id xmap12811; Tue, 13 Apr 99 18:55:17 +0100 Received: from fanf by fanf.noc.demon.net with local (Exim 1.73 #2) id 10X7P2-00036B-00; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 18:55:16 +0100 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: Tony Finch Subject: Re: 'alternate system clock has died!' message from systat under 3.1-REL & STABLE with SMP In-Reply-To: References: <19990412190816.O23025@globix.net> Message-Id: Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 18:55:16 +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Tony Finch wrote: >Marko Bukvic wrote: >> >>I've got a new Asus XG-DLS dual Xeon motherboard with two Pentium II 450MHz Xeon >>procs and if I compile in SMP support I get the following problem: >> >>After bootup, if I start top and set the delay seconds (s) to 0(zero) the cpu >>load for the top process goes all the way up, and then after a little while it >>goes all the way down and everything has the same cpu utilization of 0.00%. >> >>Then if I start systat vmstat 1, it says: >> >> The alternate system clock has died! >> Reverting to ``pigs'' display. > >We have also seen this on an Asus P2B-DS (440BX chip set) with dual >PII 450MHz (not Xeon). The problem doesn't occur with 400MHz >processors. As a guess we tried compiling a kernel with >BETTER_CLOCK_DIAGNOSTIC but we didn't get any additional diagnostics. A suggestion from Tor Egge seems to have solved the problem (although he says it's a kludge that doesn't solve it properly). We added the contents of rtcintr() to the start of clkintr() in /sys/i386/isa/clock.c. Tony. -- f.a.n.finch dot@dotat.at fanf@demon.net Arthur: "Oh, that sounds better, have you worked out the controls?" Ford: "No, we just stopped playing with them." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 11:32:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailhub.psn.ie (mailhub.psn.ie [194.106.150.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16DCA14BF6 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 11:32:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ad@psn.ie) Received: from vmunix.psn.ie ([194.106.150.252]) by mailhub.psn.ie with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #3) id 10X7uL-000CEc-00; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 19:27:38 +0100 Received: from localhost.psn.ie ([127.0.0.1] helo=localhost) by vmunix.psn.ie with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #1) id 10X7vH-00006m-00; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 19:28:35 +0100 Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 19:28:35 +0100 (IST) From: Andy Doran To: Ollivier Robert Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Licensing on syscons fonts In-Reply-To: <19990413074538.A10790@keltia.freenix.fr> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 13 Apr 1999, Ollivier Robert wrote: > According to Andy Doran: > > Can somebody please point me to a license for iso8x16.fnt in > > /usr/share/syscons, or tell me if it's in the public domain? I've looked > > around but can't find one anywhere. > > I don't know for other fonts but as the author of the two -thin fonts, they > are in the public domain. I can write it into a README file if there is any > need. This'd be nice. It seens that I cannot use the 'iso8x16.fnt' due to licensing concerns at this end (NetBSD). Thanks!, Andy. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 13: 9:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail1.its.rpi.edu (mail1.its.rpi.edu [128.113.100.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 169F114CED for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 13:09:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from drosih@rpi.edu) Received: from [128.113.24.47] (gilead.acs.rpi.edu [128.113.24.47]) by mail1.its.rpi.edu (8.8.8/8.8.6) with ESMTP id QAA180490; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 16:06:58 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Sender: drosih@pop1.rpi.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Brian Dean's message of "Mon, 12 Apr 1999 11:02:18 EDT" <199904121502.LAA15248@dean.pc.sas.com> Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 16:07:00 -0400 To: Dom Mitchell , Brian Dean From: Garance A Drosihn Subject: Re: behaviour of open(foo,O_CREAT) in regards to setting 'group' Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 4:24 PM +0100 4/12/99, Dom Mitchell wrote: >On 12 April 1999, Brian Dean proclaimed: >> For example, if the group of /tmp is wheel, the FreeBSD behaviour >> causes files created there to have the group of wheel, and when the >> files are moved to another (non-local) file system (using 'mv'), an >> error is generated indicating that the operation is not permitted if >> the user is not a member of 'wheel'. The error is harmless in this >> case (because the group of the file should not have been wheel in the >> first place because the user was not a member of wheel), but it is >> annoying. > > Maybe the behaviour should not apply to directories with a sticky bit? > I'm not sure that there is much room for change around this whole > subject area, though. It's been pretty much this way for some 15 years > or more. Teach your users to use "cp" instead of "mv"? It seems to me that the file should not be created as group 'wheel' if the user is not in that group... (that then begs the question of what it *should* be set to, but in any case it does seem odd to me that a user can create a file to have a group that they could not specify on a 'chgrp' command) --- Garance Alistair Drosehn = gad@eclipse.acs.rpi.edu Senior Systems Programmer or drosih@rpi.edu Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 13:35:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from baerenklau.de.freebsd.org (baerenklau.de.freebsd.org [195.185.195.14]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1432914E5D; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 13:35:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wosch@panke.de.freebsd.org) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by baerenklau.de.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with UUCP id WAA21774; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 22:33:15 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from wosch@panke.de.freebsd.org) Received: (from wosch@localhost) by paula.panke.de.freebsd.org (8.9.3/8.8.8) id VAA01948; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 21:27:45 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from wosch) Message-ID: <19990413212745.57557@panke.de.freebsd.org> Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 21:27:45 +0200 From: Wolfram Schneider To: hackers@freebsd.org Cc: jdp@freebsd.org Subject: [jip@tibco.com: elf (man, lib, and header files)] Reply-To: jip@tibco.com, hackers@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.89i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ----- Forwarded message from Jip Muongpruan ----- Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 11:42:03 -0700 From: jip@tibco.com (Jip Muongpruan) Message-Id: <199904131842.LAA08919@giraffe.21net> To: wosch@panke.de.freebsd.org Subject: elf (man, lib, and header files) Hello, My name is Jip, and am working to port a licensing software to FreeBSD. I happened to see your name and e-mail on freebsd.org website associated with question regarding elf man page. I thought you may know other things related to 'elf' as well. On out FreeBSD machine (version 3.1), we don't currently have any header files libelf.h or anything else that provides elf-related function prototypes. I also don't see libelf.a anywhere. Needless to say, ther is no man page on 'elf' either. Do you know if the above (lib, header files, and man) should be available in this version of FreeBSD ? BTW, I do see elf.h, elf32.h, elf_common.h, elf_generic.h, imgact_elf.h. Thanks in advance, and sorry to bother you with this issue. Jip ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Wolfram Schneider http://wolfram.schneider.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 13:36:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bingsun1.cc.binghamton.edu (bingsun1.cc.binghamton.edu [128.226.1.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B141314C8E for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 13:36:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bf20761@binghamton.edu) Received: from localhost by bingsun1.cc.binghamton.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA22737 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 16:34:30 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: bingsun1.cc.binghamton.edu: bf20761 owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 16:34:30 -0400 (EDT) From: zhihuizhang X-Sender: bf20761@bingsun1 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: malloc() in libc vs. sbrk() Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In file mkfs.c, I find that the program uses the following sequence of system/library calls instead of a simple malloc() in libc to allocate memory: getpagesize() -> getrlimit() -> sbrk() --> memset() Is there any particular reason for doing this? Any help is appreciated. -------------------------------------------------- | Zhihui Zhang, http://cs.binghamton.edu/~zzhang | | Dept. of Computer Science, SUNY at Binghamton | -------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 13:55:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D75FF157C9 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 13:55:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.2/8.9.1) id WAA16443; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 22:53:16 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: lsock(1) From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 13 Apr 1999 22:53:15 +0200 Message-ID: Lines: 7 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG If nobody has any objections, I'll import my lsock(1) utility into src/usr.bin/lsock inside of a few days. The code, man page and makefile are available at . DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 14:12:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lupo.thebarn.com (lupo.lcse.umn.edu [128.101.182.105]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C24114D09 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 14:12:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cattelan@thebarn.com) Received: from thebarn.com (jizz.thebarn.com [128.101.182.205]) by lupo.thebarn.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA27304 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 16:10:26 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3713B0E5.B9241E07@thebarn.com> Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 16:02:30 -0500 From: Russell Cattelan X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51C-SGI [en] (X11; U; IRIX 6.5 IP22) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: KLD and gdb Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ok quick question: How does one import the symbols from a KLD into gdb? The handbook talks about add symbol file for KLMs but that doesn't seem to work for KLDs Oh one other thing... I have remote debugging working via the serial line. Has anybody ever done the same thing but with the console of one machine connected to a terminal server, and the remote gdb machine connected via a network connection to the terminal server. I guess I could do it by writing a little program that bridges a socket and a named pipe... just wondering if anybody has already done it. -- Russell Cattelan cattelan@thebarn.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 14:31:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32499151C2 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 14:31:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA01257; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 14:27:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904132127.OAA01257@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Dennis Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: PCI burst determination In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 13 Apr 1999 09:21:20 EDT." <199904131427.KAA03942@etinc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 14:27:50 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > Is there a way to determine the max burst of the PCI bridge on the > MB for controller optimization? I dont see a fuction...is it stored > somewhere? PCI is arbitrated with a latency timer, so there is no maximum burst length per se. As for limitations in the bridge chipset, you're probably going to want to look up the documentation for the individual bridges. However, having said, that, as a general rule with PCI bursting "longer is better". -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 14:34: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from frmug.org (frmug-gw.frmug.org [193.56.58.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02143150BC for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 14:33:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by frmug.org (8.9.1/frmug-2.3/nospam) with UUCP id XAA27262 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 23:31:30 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: by keltia.freenix.fr (Postfix, from userid 101) id C48208841; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 22:46:12 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 22:46:12 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Licensing on syscons fonts Message-ID: <19990413224612.A15371@keltia.freenix.fr> Mail-Followup-To: hackers@freebsd.org References: <19990413074538.A10790@keltia.freenix.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/0.95.3i In-Reply-To: ; from Andy Doran on Tue, Apr 13, 1999 at 07:28:35PM +0100 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT/ELF ctm#5173 AMD-K6 MMX @ 200 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG According to Andy Doran: > This'd be nice. It seens that I cannot use the 'iso8x16.fnt' due to > licensing concerns at this end (NetBSD). To -hackers: what is the best way to put a notice on these font files ? Inside INDEX.fonts ? In a separate README.thin file ? In a generic README file ? -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 4.0-CURRENT #70: Sat Feb 27 09:43:08 CET 1999 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 14:46:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dan.emsphone.com (dan.emsphone.com [199.67.51.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EBF9151E5 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 14:45:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dan@dan.emsphone.com) Received: (from dan@localhost) by dan.emsphone.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id QAA14181; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 16:43:08 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dan) Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 16:43:08 -0500 From: Dan Nelson To: Ollivier Robert Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Licensing on syscons fonts Message-ID: <19990413164307.A11748@dan.emsphone.com> References: <19990413074538.A10790@keltia.freenix.fr> <19990413224612.A15371@keltia.freenix.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <19990413224612.A15371@keltia.freenix.fr>; from "Ollivier Robert" on Tue Apr 13 22:46:12 GMT 1999 X-OS: FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In the last episode (Apr 13), Ollivier Robert said: > According to Andy Doran: > > This'd be nice. It seens that I cannot use the 'iso8x16.fnt' due to > > licensing concerns at this end (NetBSD). > > what is the best way to put a notice on these font files ? Inside > INDEX.fonts ? In a separate README.thin file ? In a generic README file ? It looks like the decode() function that vidcontrol uses to read the font files will ignore any text before "^begin ": do { if (!fgets(temp, sizeof(temp), fd)) return(0); } while (strncmp(temp, "begin ", 6)); So you could probably just put the copyright message in the .fnt files themselves. You can put a standard BSD-style font on swiss-8x8.fnt and swiss-8x16.fnt if you want, since I created those. -Dan Nelson dnelson@emsphone.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 16:12:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from etinc.com (et-gw.etinc.com [207.252.1.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14C1614EE4 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 16:12:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dennis@etinc.com) Received: from dbsys (dbsys.etinc.com [207.252.1.18]) by etinc.com (8.8.8/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA07157; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 19:09:18 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904132309.TAA07157@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 18:02:51 -0400 To: Mike Smith From: Dennis Subject: Re: PCI burst determination Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199904132127.OAA01257@dingo.cdrom.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 02:27 PM 4/13/99 -0700, Mike Smith wrote: >> >> Is there a way to determine the max burst of the PCI bridge on the >> MB for controller optimization? I dont see a fuction...is it stored >> somewhere? > >PCI is arbitrated with a latency timer, so there is no maximum burst >length per se. As for limitations in the bridge chipset, you're >probably going to want to look up the documentation for the individual >bridges. > >However, having said, that, as a general rule with PCI bursting "longer >is better". Well, mike, the goal of my question was to be able to dynamically determine the burst rate of the bridge installed to tune it at config time, allowing for automatic optimization. Dennis To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 16:22:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4EF2814D89 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 16:22:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA01942; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 16:19:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904132319.QAA01942@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Dennis Cc: Mike Smith , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: PCI burst determination In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 13 Apr 1999 18:02:51 EDT." <199904132309.TAA07157@etinc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 16:19:06 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > At 02:27 PM 4/13/99 -0700, Mike Smith wrote: > >> > >> Is there a way to determine the max burst of the PCI bridge on the > >> MB for controller optimization? I dont see a fuction...is it stored > >> somewhere? > > > >PCI is arbitrated with a latency timer, so there is no maximum burst > >length per se. As for limitations in the bridge chipset, you're > >probably going to want to look up the documentation for the individual > >bridges. > > > >However, having said, that, as a general rule with PCI bursting "longer > >is better". > > Well, mike, the goal of my question was to be able to dynamically determine > the burst rate of the bridge installed to tune it at config time, allowing > for automatic optimization. I fail to see any utility in this. Bursts are terminated either by the initiator or the arbiter; it's irrelevant as to which does the termination from a performance standpoint. As the designer of the initiator, you should just open up with a burst when you have data, and keep going until you either run out of data or you get arbited off the bus. There's no other behaviour model that makes any sense; why would you want to try to second-guess the exact count at which the bridge (which typically contains the arbiter) is going to cut you off? That's its job, let it do it. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 16:56:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0132214CC7 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 16:56:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id QAA23919; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 16:54:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 16:54:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904132354.QAA23919@apollo.backplane.com> To: Jason Thorpe Cc: Ville-Pertti Keinonen , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls References: <199904121916.MAA07413@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :On 12 Apr 1999 17:01:50 +0300 : Ville-Pertti Keinonen wrote: : : > This may come as a shock to you, but read(2)/write(2) aren't atomic in : > updating the file pointer, either. : :Then that's a bug in the FreeBSD kernel. : : > Actually, read(2) is equivalent to lseek(2)+pread(2)+lseek(2), with the : > last lseek(2) being SEEK_CUR by the read count returned by pread(2). : > The difference is that read(2) can only be pre-empted if it blocks : > doing I/O (which is not unusual). : :Geez, how did this get implemented in FreeBSD?! It's certainly not that :complicated. : : -- Jason R. Thorpe There's an overriding issue with all of this related to the fact that vnodes have only one lock structure associated with them. What we really need are two lock structures -- one that can be used as a rename/delete interlock against namei, allowing namei operations to run in parallel and not block each other out, and a second one that handles everything else. Atomicy can be handle by creating a second POSIX locking structure for the vnode which could be used by the kernel to parallelize read and write ops. If there were five of me, I'd go and do it. But I've got my hands full. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 17:58:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp [133.34.17.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D2721507B; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 17:58:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp) Received: from rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (8.9.3/3.7W-Naklab-2.1-19981120) with ESMTP id JAA82937; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 09:56:03 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <199904140056.JAA82937@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp> To: nox@jelal.kn-bremen.de Cc: Seigo TANIMURA , zinnia@jan.ne.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports From: Seigo TANIMURA In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 13 Apr 1999 20:06:23 +0200 (MET DST)" References: <199904131806.UAA38140@saturn.kn-bremen.de> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.70 on Emacs 19.34.1 / Mule 2.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 09:56:03 +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [cc'ed to freebsd-multimedia] On Tue, 13 Apr 1999 20:06:23 +0200 (MET DST), Juergen Lock said: >> I am writing on behalf of Tsuyoshi Iguchi-san, who ported >> the Voxware midi driver for serial ports from Linux to FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE >> and 4.0-CURRENT(by me). With this driver, you get to plug your synthesizer >> into the serial port to use playmidi, rosegarden and other popular midi >> players and tools for VoxWare. I tried playing a midi sequence with heavy >> exclusives using playmidi to get NO latency at all like sbmidi. nox> Hey that sounds great :) what is needed in terms of hardware, i mean you nox> don't just make a cable that connects the midi to the rs232 lines right? Since I had Roland SC-88, I purchased a serial port cable by Roland at a local PC shop. Please have a look at http://www.edirol.com/music_equipment/roland_accessories/cable.html. It costed around 1,500 yens or 22 DM, without the driver for Windows 95. I have no idea for midi modules by the manufacturers other than Roland, sorry for that. Could you give us some clues, Tsuyoshi-san? Seigo TANIMURA |M2, Nakagawa Lab, Dept of Electronics & CS =========================|Faculty of Engineering, Yokohama National Univ Powered by SIEMENS, |http://www.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp/~tanimura/ FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT |http://www.sakura.ne.jp/~tcarrot/ (10th Apr 1999) & muesli.|tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp tcarrot@sakuramail.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 19:25:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (blaubaer.kn-bremen.de [194.94.232.249]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DCBEF14FA7; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 19:25:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nox@saturn.kn-bremen.de) Received: from saturn.kn-bremen.de (uucp@localhost) by blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (8.9.1/8.9.1) with UUCP id EAA01115; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 04:19:43 +0200 Received: (from nox@localhost) by saturn.kn-bremen.de (8.9.3/8.8.5) id EAA64805; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 04:19:17 +0200 (MET DST) From: Juergen Lock Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 04:19:16 +0200 To: Seigo TANIMURA Cc: zinnia@jan.ne.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports Message-ID: <19990414041916.A64069@saturn.kn-bremen.de> References: <199904131806.UAA38140@saturn.kn-bremen.de> <199904140056.JAA82937@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904140056.JAA82937@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp>; from Seigo TANIMURA on Wed, Apr 14, 1999 at 09:56:03AM +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 14, 1999 at 09:56:03AM +0900, Seigo TANIMURA wrote: > [cc'ed to freebsd-multimedia] > [I only read -hackers but i kept the crossposting...] > > On Tue, 13 Apr 1999 20:06:23 +0200 (MET DST), > Juergen Lock said: > nox> Hey that sounds great :) what is needed in terms of hardware, i mean you > nox> don't just make a cable that connects the midi to the rs232 lines right? > > > Since I had Roland SC-88, I purchased a serial port cable by Roland at a local PC shop. > Please have a look at http://www.edirol.com/music_equipment/roland_accessories/cable.html. > It costed around 1,500 yens or 22 DM, without the driver for Windows 95. > > I have no idea for midi modules by the manufacturers other than Roland, sorry for that. > Could you give us some clues, Tsuyoshi-san? Hmm, the cable on that page looks like for a MAC serial port to me... Is there something for the good old 5-pin DIN MIDI sockets, the ones that use a 20 mA (i think) current loop? Regards, -- Juergen Lock To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 19:49:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08F7614C34 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 19:49:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id LAA27069; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 11:45:31 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <3713F96E.ABB91EA6@newsguy.com> Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 11:11:58 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Matthew Dillon Cc: Jason Thorpe , Ville-Pertti Keinonen , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls References: <199904121916.MAA07413@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> <199904132354.QAA23919@apollo.backplane.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matthew Dillon wrote: > > If there were five of me, I'd go and do it. But I've got my hands full. Where are the miracles of cloning when we need them? ;-) -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "nothing better than the ability to perform cunning linguistics" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 20: 8:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gongshow.masterplan.org (masterplan.powersurfr.com [24.108.43.174]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F012F14FDA for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 20:08:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jbg@masterplan.org) Received: from infomat (infomat.precident.com [192.168.4.2]) by gongshow.masterplan.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA10623 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 21:05:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from jbg@masterplan.org) Message-Id: <199904140305.VAA10623@gongshow.masterplan.org> From: jbg@masterplan.org (Jason George) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: IrDA? PnP? Organization: The Master Plan Always Fails... Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 03:07:56 GMT Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Justin Walker wrote: > I don't have much to add to the discussion, but FYI, you can find >info at www.irda.org. For reasons that escape me, the good folks >working on this elected to duplicate most of the IP functionality >(media layer, network layer, a couple of transports, name resolution, >....) rather than treat the IrDA as a media type (as done, e.g., with >IRtalk by Apple some time back). Therefore, you get all the >benefits of IP over, say, ATM; that is, a lot of wasted cycles to get >your bits flowing. One man's opinion, of course :-} > I second that opinion! I smashed my head into a bloody pulp with this 3.5 years ago when I worked for a large nameless Canadian telecom equipment vendor. (The same vendor that merged/bought Bay Networks...) The counselling to get me over that period was going so well until this setback! :-) I had to implement basic IrDA on a microcontroller with serious RAM, ROM, and real-time constraints. It was supposed to be a proof-of-concept IrDA-enabled telset. Ultimately, the infrared phone worked, only after I invented a piece-of-crap basic protocol that was actually feasible to implement, given what that teensy microcontroller had left to offer. Thanks to the original poster for bringing up IrDA. It was enough to push me to take the binder on my shelf containing the Link Access and Link Management Protocol documents and to dump the contents in the recycle bin! On a serious note, I would suggest that it might be easier to simply port the Linux code. I haven't kept up with the progression of IrDA in the last few years, but I know that in the days of the original 1.0 (and pre-1.0) specs , there was a sample implementation of the state machines and some little demo apps available from an IBM ftp site. At least 1 company had $$$ source available for multiple target platforms back in '95. It might be an idea to investigate who has this available now and make an "open source" argument to them... Hope this helps... --Jason j.b.georgeieee.org jbgmasterplan.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 22:22: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from jan-wc.jan.ne.jp (jan-wc.jan.ne.jp [202.235.10.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A34214D56; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 22:21:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from zinnia@jan.ne.jp) Received: from localhost (yone0010-044.jan.ne.jp [203.141.87.44]) by jan-wc.jan.ne.jp (8.8.8+2.7Wbeta7/3.7W) with ESMTP id OAA35466; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 14:19:32 +0900 Message-Id: <199904140519.OAA35466@jan-wc.jan.ne.jp> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: nox@jelal.kn-bremen.de, freebsd-multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports From: Tsuyoshi Iguchi In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 14 Apr 1999 09:56:03 +0900" <199904140056.JAA82937@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp> References: <199904140056.JAA82937@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.93 on Emacs 19.34 / Mule 2.3 (SUETSUMUHANA) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 14:12:20 +0900 X-Dispatcher: imput version 980905(IM100) Lines: 53 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG From: Seigo TANIMURA Subject: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 15:48:54 +0900 >2. Patch your kernel source. > > For 3.1-STABLE: > % cd (somewhere) > % tar zxvf uart16550-3.1-STABLE.tar.gz ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ uart16550.tar.gz in correct. It's my mistake. Sorry, Seigo-san and all. From: Seigo TANIMURA Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 09:56:03 +0900 > nox> Hey that sounds great :) what is needed in terms of hardware, i mean you > nox> don't just make a cable that connects the midi to the rs232 lines right? > > Since I had Roland SC-88, I purchased a serial port cable by Roland at a local PC shop. > Please have a look at http://www.edirol.com/music_equipment/roland_accessories/cable.html. > It costed around 1,500 yens or 22 DM, without the driver for Windows 95. > > I have no idea for midi modules by the manufacturers other than Roland, sorry for that. > Could you give us some clues, Tsuyoshi-san? To use serial driver for MIDI, your MIDI tools/instruments must have MINI-DIN8pin terminal called "HOST" or "COMPUTER". ((( You can't use serial-MIDI with old MIDI terminal(DIN-5pin), except your machine can set serial baud rate to 31250bps and prepare exclusive circuit to communicate Dsub-25(9) and Din-5. ))) The pin connections of serial cable for MIDI are like below ... PC D-Sub9(25) MIDI(Host or Computer) MINI-DIN8 RTS 7(4) -------- 2 HSKi CTS 8(5) -------- 1 HSKo TxD 3(2) -------- 5 RxD GND 5(7) -------- 4 GND RxD 2(3) -------- 3 TxD If you have Mac's serial cable(straight) and PC's one (and you don't mind these cables never to be used for original way), you can easily compose the serial cable for MIDI using these two cables. ----- Tsuyoshi Iguchi (zinnia@jan.ne.jp) http://www.eie.yz.yamagata-u.ac.jp/~a95516/zinnia/index.shtml To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 22:22:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from shibumi.feralmonkey.org (shibumi.feralmonkey.org [203.41.114.182]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECAF014D56 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 22:22:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nick@shibumi.feralmonkey.org) Received: from localhost (nick@localhost) by shibumi.feralmonkey.org (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id QAA00613 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 16:16:27 GMT (envelope-from nick@shibumi.feralmonkey.org) Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 16:16:11 +0000 (GMT) From: 0x1c To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: IrDA? PnP? In-Reply-To: <199904140305.VAA10623@gongshow.masterplan.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG If anyone has code that needs road testing, I have an acer notebook (soon to be 3.1, currently 2.2.8) that has a presently useless IR device. Cheers, Nick -- Therefore those skilled at the unorthodox are as infinite as heaven and earth, inexhaustible as the great rivers. -- Sun Tzu, The Art of War To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 13 22:48:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp [133.34.17.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B98414F51; Tue, 13 Apr 1999 22:48:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp) Received: from rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (8.9.3/3.7W-Naklab-2.1-19981120) with ESMTP id OAA85232; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 14:46:06 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <199904140546.OAA85232@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp> To: nox@jelal.kn-bremen.de Cc: zinnia@jan.ne.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-multimedia@freebsd.org Cc: Seigo TANIMURA Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports From: Seigo TANIMURA In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 14 Apr 1999 04:19:16 +0200" References: <19990414041916.A64069@saturn.kn-bremen.de> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.70 on Emacs 19.34.1 / Mule 2.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 14:46:06 +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 14 Apr 1999 04:19:16 +0200, Juergen Lock said: nox> Hey that sounds great :) what is needed in terms of hardware, i mean you nox> don't just make a cable that connects the midi to the rs232 lines right? >> >> >> Since I had Roland SC-88, I purchased a serial port cable by Roland at a local PC shop. >> Please have a look at http://www.edirol.com/music_equipment/roland_accessories/cable.html. >> It costed around 1,500 yens or 22 DM, without the driver for Windows 95. >> >> I have no idea for midi modules by the manufacturers other than Roland, sorry for that. >> Could you give us some clues, Tsuyoshi-san? nox> Hmm, the cable on that page looks like for a MAC serial port to me... nox> Is there something for the good old 5-pin DIN MIDI sockets, the ones nox> that use a 20 mA (i think) current loop? I tried serching 'serial' and 'midi', to find some resources... We have at least one product to convert a serial port to a midi port and vice versa: http://www.midi-classics.com/p2615.htm has one midi output and one input, although our driver is not capable to receive midi signal yet. I see Midiman has some cool interfaces. Have a look at: http://www.midiman.net/ for the list of the products. They even have one for USB!(anyone wanna try? ;-) Seigo TANIMURA |M2, Nakagawa Lab, Dept of Electronics & CS =========================|Faculty of Engineering, Yokohama National Univ Powered by SIEMENS, |http://www.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp/~tanimura/ FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT |http://www.sakura.ne.jp/~tcarrot/ (10th Apr 1999) & muesli.|tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp tcarrot@sakuramail.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 0:32: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-01.cdsnet.net (mail-01.cdsnet.net [206.107.16.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 2E29614D67 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 00:32:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mrcpu@internetcds.com) Received: (qmail 25205 invoked from network); 14 Apr 1999 07:29:41 -0000 Received: from schizo.cdsnet.net (204.118.244.32) by mail.cdsnet.net with SMTP; 14 Apr 1999 07:29:41 -0000 Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 00:28:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Jaye Mathisen X-Sender: mrcpu@schizo.cdsnet.net To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Does the -g option to pw work? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG pw usermod -u mrcpu -g network doesn't seem to change my /etc/master.passwd... Am I missing something from the man page? Seems like it should work. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 0:53:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.oeno.com (ns.oeno.com [194.100.99.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 522D314ED5 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 00:53:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from will@ns.oeno.com) Received: (qmail 12743 invoked by uid 1001); 14 Apr 1999 07:51:03 -0000 Date: 14 Apr 1999 07:51:03 -0000 Message-ID: <19990414075103.12740.qmail@ns.oeno.com> From: Ville-Pertti Keinonen To: thorpej@nas.nasa.gov Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: <199904131616.JAA20900@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> (message from Jason Thorpe on Tue, 13 Apr 1999 09:16:07 -0700) Subject: Re: read() and pread() syscalls Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > I don't have a NetBSD machine around, but it might apply to NetBSD, as > > well, unless NetBSD keeps the vnode exclusively locked for the entire > > duration of a VOP_READ, even if it blocks. > > There is no need to keep the _vnode_ locked; the file offset is not stored > in the vnode, but in the struct file that references that vnode. Of course, but my assumption was that current *BSD code does not make any explicit attempts to protect f_offset and that it might, in some cases, be protected as a side-effect of vnode locking. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 6:51:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from leap.innerx.net (leap.innerx.net [38.179.176.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C079914FD0 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 06:51:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chris@holly.dyndns.org) Received: from holly.dyndns.org (ip107.houston2.tx.pub-ip.psi.net [38.11.201.107]) by leap.innerx.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BCE4C37098; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 09:49:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from chris@localhost) by holly.dyndns.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA00988; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 08:49:31 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from chris) Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 08:49:30 -0500 From: Chris Costello To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: lsock(1) Message-ID: <19990414084930.C584@holly.dyndns.org> Reply-To: chris@calldei.com References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: ; from Dag-Erling Smorgrav on Tue, Apr 13, 1999 at 10:53:15PM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Apr 13, 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > If nobody has any objections, I'll import my lsock(1) utility into > src/usr.bin/lsock inside of a few days. The code, man page and > makefile are available at . Excellent code! I say go for it! > DES > -- > Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- Chris Costello This message transmitted on 100% recycled electrons. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 7: 3:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from vespucci.advicom.net (vespucci.advicom.net [199.170.120.42]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D871915763 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 07:03:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from avalon@vespucci.advicom.net) Received: from localhost (avalon@localhost) by vespucci.advicom.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA17829 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 09:01:24 -0500 (CDT) X-Envelope-Recipient: Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 09:01:23 -0500 (CDT) From: Avalon Books To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Programming Resources Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Does anyone have any useful links/ftp sites/books (etc.) for those of us new to multi-threaded programming (for daemons, etc.)? Obviously, resources specific to FBSD would be preferred, but any and all suggestions would be appreciated. Has anyone actually written any kind of definitive guide for multi-threaded (et. al.) programming for BSD (and is it available on-line)? O'Reilly and Associates, perhaps? --R. Pelletier Sys Admin, House Galiagante We are a Micro$oft-free site To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 7:46:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from axl.noc.iafrica.com (axl.noc.iafrica.com [196.31.1.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D71F157A7 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 07:46:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sheldonh@axl.noc.iafrica.com) Received: from sheldonh (helo=axl.noc.iafrica.com) by axl.noc.iafrica.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10XQtD-000488-00; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 16:43:43 +0200 From: Sheldon Hearn To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: lsock(1) In-reply-to: Your message of "13 Apr 1999 22:53:15 +0200." Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 16:43:42 +0200 Message-ID: <15879.924101022@axl.noc.iafrica.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 13 Apr 1999 22:53:15 +0200, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > If nobody has any objections, I'll import my lsock(1) utility into > src/usr.bin/lsock inside of a few days. The code, man page and > makefile are available at . Yes please! :-) I didn't look at the code, but the functionality described in the manpage looks cool and froody. I take it that this signifies closure on the "Won't lsof ever be imported?" issue. ;-) Ciao, Sheldon. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 8: 2:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 358FA14CC0 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 08:02:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com ([204.68.178.225]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA11291; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 09:00:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <3714AD7A.BC38FCB@softweyr.com> Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 09:00:10 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Avalon Books Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Programming Resources References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Avalon Books wrote: > > Does anyone have any useful links/ftp sites/books (etc.) for those of us > new to multi-threaded programming (for daemons, etc.)? Obviously, > resources specific to FBSD would be preferred, but any and all suggestions > would be appreciated. > > Has anyone actually written any kind of definitive guide for > multi-threaded (et. al.) programming for BSD (and is it available > on-line)? O'Reilly and Associates, perhaps? Try searching fatbrain.com (formerly computerliteracy.com) and/or amazon for "posix threads". I've heard good things about David Butenhof's book published by Addison-Wesley. The price is terrible, but they always are. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 8:19:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from etinc.com (et-gw.etinc.com [207.252.1.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B10AF15266 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 08:19:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dennis@etinc.com) Received: from dbsys (dbsys.etinc.com [207.252.1.18]) by etinc.com (8.8.8/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA11788; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 11:17:11 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904141517.LAA11788@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 10:10:37 -0400 To: Mike Smith From: Dennis Subject: Re: PCI burst determination Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199904132319.QAA01942@dingo.cdrom.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 04:19 PM 4/13/99 -0700, you wrote: >> At 02:27 PM 4/13/99 -0700, Mike Smith wrote: >> >> >> >> Is there a way to determine the max burst of the PCI bridge on the >> >> MB for controller optimization? I dont see a fuction...is it stored >> >> somewhere? >> > >> >PCI is arbitrated with a latency timer, so there is no maximum burst >> >length per se. As for limitations in the bridge chipset, you're >> >probably going to want to look up the documentation for the individual >> >bridges. >> > >> >However, having said, that, as a general rule with PCI bursting "longer >> >is better". >> >> Well, mike, the goal of my question was to be able to dynamically determine >> the burst rate of the bridge installed to tune it at config time, allowing >> for automatic optimization. > >I fail to see any utility in this. Bursts are terminated either by the >initiator or the arbiter; it's irrelevant as to which does the >termination from a performance standpoint. > >As the designer of the initiator, you should just open up with a burst >when you have data, and keep going until you either run out of data or >you get arbited off the bus. > >There's no other behaviour model that makes any sense; why would you >want to try to second-guess the exact count at which the bridge (which >typically contains the arbiter) is going to cut you off? That's its >job, let it do it. You are being a bit short-sighted..... With a multi-channel controller you have several controllers sharing a single PCI dma fifo, and in order to maximize efficiency you need to maximize the emptying of the central fifo...if you fill it with exactly the burst of the bridge then you get maximum performance. If the central fifo doesnt empty on a burst it forces a hold-off of other controllers that may need servicing. Dennis To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 8:22:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from isbalham.ist.co.uk (isbalham.ist.co.uk [192.31.26.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D3C3151E1 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 08:22:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: from gid.co.uk (uucp@localhost) by isbalham.ist.co.uk (8.9.2/8.8.7) with UUCP id QAA52664; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 16:20:28 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: from [194.32.164.2] by seagoon.gid.co.uk; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 16:14:07 +0100 (BST) X-Sender: rb@194.32.164.1 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 16:14:05 +0000 To: Avalon Books From: Bob Bishop Subject: Re: Programming Resources Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, As far as books go, I reckon this is pretty good. But it's a few years old; maybe there is a later edition. Programming with Threads Kleiman, Shah, Smaalders Prentice Hall, 1996 ISBN 0 13 172389 8 -- Bob Bishop (0118) 977 4017 international code +44 118 rb@gid.co.uk fax (0118) 989 4254 between 0800 and 1800 UK To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 8:49:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nero.cybersites.com (nero.cybersites.com [207.92.123.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C002152B7 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 08:49:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cyouse@cybersites.com) Received: from ns1.cybersites.com (ns1.cybersites.com [207.92.123.2]) by nero.cybersites.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA01845; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 11:57:35 -0400 From: Chuck Youse To: Avalon Books , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Programming Resources Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 11:43:31 -0400 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.17] Content-Type: text/plain References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <99041411442200.24010@ns1.cybersites.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-KMail-Mark: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The O'Reilly called _Programming with Pthreads_ pretty much covers it all, as FreeBSD uses a user-space pthreads implementation. -- Chuck Youse Director of Systems cyouse@cybersites.com On Wed, 14 Apr 1999, Avalon Books wrote: > Does anyone have any useful links/ftp sites/books (etc.) for those of us > new to multi-threaded programming (for daemons, etc.)? Obviously, > resources specific to FBSD would be preferred, but any and all suggestions > would be appreciated. > > Has anyone actually written any kind of definitive guide for > multi-threaded (et. al.) programming for BSD (and is it available > on-line)? O'Reilly and Associates, perhaps? > > --R. Pelletier > Sys Admin, House Galiagante > We are a Micro$oft-free site To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 9:44:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA6AC14FCA for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 09:44:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id BAA03096; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 01:42:06 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <3714C4F0.579FDDEE@newsguy.com> Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 01:40:16 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Sheldon Hearn Cc: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: lsock(1) References: <15879.924101022@axl.noc.iafrica.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Sheldon Hearn wrote: > > I didn't look at the code, but the functionality described in the > manpage looks cool and froody. I did. The code is smaller than the man page, actually. :-) It's just a matter of calling netstat and fstat, and correlating the results. > I take it that this signifies closure on the "Won't lsof ever be > imported?" issue. ;-) General consensus seems to be that lsof would rot if imported, making a port a much better option. If you doubt it, look at more(1). :-) -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "nothing better than the ability to perform cunning linguistics" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 10:12:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailer.syr.edu (mailer.syr.edu [128.230.18.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7B78150B3 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 10:12:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cmsedore@mailbox.syr.edu) Received: from rodan.syr.edu by mailer.syr.edu (LSMTP for Windows NT v1.1a) with SMTP id <0.2AF10A70@mailer.syr.edu>; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 13:10:28 -0400 Received: from localhost (cmsedore@localhost) by rodan.syr.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA17108 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 13:10:27 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: rodan.syr.edu: cmsedore owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 13:10:27 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Sedore X-Sender: cmsedore@rodan.syr.edu To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: clustering for FreeBSD 3.1 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've written a simple clustering system for FreeBSD 3.1. It was discussed a little on FreeBSD-net (so you might want to look at the archives). I've put a testing version of it up for grabs at http://tfeed.maxwell.syr.edu/ -Chris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 10:47:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from relay.nuxi.com (nuxi.cs.ucdavis.edu [169.237.7.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6026715728 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 10:47:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: (from obrien@localhost) by relay.nuxi.com (8.9.2/8.9.1) id KAA56515; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 10:44:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien) Message-ID: <19990414104449.A56479@nuxi.com> Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 10:44:49 -0700 From: "David O'Brien" To: Ollivier Robert , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Licensing on syscons fonts Reply-To: obrien@NUXI.com References: <19990413074538.A10790@keltia.freenix.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990413074538.A10790@keltia.freenix.fr>; from Ollivier Robert on Tue, Apr 13, 1999 at 07:45:38AM +0200 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE Organization: The NUXI BSD group X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Keyid: 34F9F9D5 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I don't know for other fonts but as the author of the two -thin fonts, they > are in the public domain. You might want to copyrite them BSD-style rather than put them in the public domain. There is a difference. -- -- David (obrien@NUXI.com -or- obrien@FreeBSD.org) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 12: 0: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wall.polstra.com (rtrwan160.accessone.com [206.213.115.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 176031582E for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 11:59:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Received: from vashon.polstra.com (vashon.polstra.com [206.213.73.13]) by wall.polstra.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA23655; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 11:57:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Received: (from jdp@localhost) by vashon.polstra.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id LAA00707; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 11:57:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <19990413212745.57557@panke.de.freebsd.org> Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 11:57:27 -0700 (PDT) Organization: Polstra & Co., Inc. From: John Polstra To: jip@tibco.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: RE: [jip@tibco.com: elf (man, lib, and header files)] Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > On out FreeBSD machine (version 3.1), we don't currently have any header > files libelf.h or anything else that provides elf-related function > prototypes. I also don't see libelf.a anywhere. Needless to say, ther is > no man page on 'elf' either. > > Do you know if the above (lib, header files, and man) should be available > in this version of FreeBSD ? > > BTW, I do see elf.h, elf32.h, elf_common.h, elf_generic.h, imgact_elf.h. We don't have a "libelf" for applications at this time. Maybe some day we'll have one. John --- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-interest is the aphrodisiac of belief." -- James V. DeLong To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 12:32:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from houston.matchlogic.com (houston.matchlogic.com [205.216.147.127]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9523D14DE6 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 12:32:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crandall@matchlogic.com) Received: by HOUSTON with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) id <26XZL3F0>; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 13:29:32 -0600 Message-ID: <64003B21ECCAD11185C500805F31EC03022B681E@HOUSTON> From: Charles Randall To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, Avalon Books Subject: RE: Programming Resources Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 13:29:31 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Consider this one, Programming with POSIX Threads By Butenhof, David Softcover; 224 Pages Published by Addison Wesley Date Published: 05/1997 ISBN: 0201633922 This guy is the resident expert in comp.programming.threads. FYI, Charles -----Original Message----- From: Avalon Books [mailto:avalon@advicom.net] Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 1999 8:01 AM To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Programming Resources Does anyone have any useful links/ftp sites/books (etc.) for those of us new to multi-threaded programming (for daemons, etc.)? Obviously, resources specific to FBSD would be preferred, but any and all suggestions would be appreciated. Has anyone actually written any kind of definitive guide for multi-threaded (et. al.) programming for BSD (and is it available on-line)? O'Reilly and Associates, perhaps? --R. Pelletier Sys Admin, House Galiagante We are a Micro$oft-free site To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 12:44:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lor.watermarkgroup.com (lor.watermarkgroup.com [207.202.73.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC1FC14C3D for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 12:44:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luoqi@chen.ml.org) Received: from chen.ml.org (torres.watermarkgroup.com [207.202.73.118]) by lor.watermarkgroup.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA01631 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 15:42:31 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from luoqi@chen.ml.org) Message-ID: <3714EFA7.239DEBF5@chen.ml.org> Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 15:42:31 -0400 From: Luoqi Chen X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Saw this on yesterday's slashdot news: http://www.mindcraft.com/whitepapers/nts4rhlinux.html I wonder how well FreeBSD would perform. -lq To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 13: 8:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lcremeans.erols.com (lcremeans.erols.com [216.164.87.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81EFE157ED for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 13:08:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from lee@lcremeans.erols.com) Received: (from lee@localhost) by lcremeans.erols.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id PAA00780; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 15:55:46 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from lee) Message-ID: <19990414155546.A753@erols.com> Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 15:55:46 -0400 From: Lee Cremeans To: Luoqi Chen , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux References: <3714EFA7.239DEBF5@chen.ml.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <3714EFA7.239DEBF5@chen.ml.org>; from Luoqi Chen on Wed, Apr 14, 1999 at 03:42:31PM -0400 X-OS: FreeBSD 3.0-STABLE Organization: My room? Are you crazy? :) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 14, 1999 at 03:42:31PM -0400, Luoqi Chen wrote: > Saw this on yesterday's slashdot news: > http://www.mindcraft.com/whitepapers/nts4rhlinux.html > I wonder how well FreeBSD would perform. It should be noted, right now, that this test wasn't fair at all. They didn't tune up the Linux box at all; in fact, judging from some of the options used, they actually crippled it. The NT box, however, was tweaked to the gills, using every performance feature they could think of. Or *did* they think of it? If you look closely, you'll find the following blurb in the paper: Mindcraft Certification Mindcraft, Inc. conducted the performance tests described in this report between March 10 and March 13, 1999. Microsoft Corporation sponsored the testing reported herein. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ That should speak volumes about the test's credibility. -lee -- +--------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Lee Cremeans -- Manassas, VA, USA (WakkyMouse on WTnet) | | lcremeans@erols.com | http://wakky.dyndns.org/~lee | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 14: 1:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from paert.tse-online.de (paert.tse-online.de [194.97.69.172]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 9E62A158D0 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 14:01:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ab@paert.tse-online.de) Received: (qmail 19922 invoked by uid 1000); 14 Apr 1999 21:01:24 -0000 Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 23:01:24 +0200 From: Andreas Braukmann To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux Message-ID: <19990414230124.F12303@paert.tse-online.de> References: <3714EFA7.239DEBF5@chen.ml.org> <19990414155546.A753@erols.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i In-Reply-To: <19990414155546.A753@erols.com>; from Lee Cremeans on Wed, Apr 14, 1999 at 03:55:46PM -0400 Organization: TSE TeleService GmbH Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, On Wed, Apr 14, 1999 at 03:55:46PM -0400, Lee Cremeans wrote: > On Wed, Apr 14, 1999 at 03:42:31PM -0400, Luoqi Chen wrote: > > http://www.mindcraft.com/whitepapers/nts4rhlinux.html > It should be noted, right now, that this test wasn't fair at all. They I have to second this ... > report between March 10 and March 13, 1999. Microsoft Corporation > sponsored the testing reported herein. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > That should speak volumes about the test's credibility. yes. I would recommend following the performance-related links on the samba website. http://www.samba.org or http://us1.samba.org -andreas -- : PGP-Key: http://www.tse-online.de/~ab/public-key : : Key fingerprint: 12 13 EF BC 22 DD F4 B6 3C 25 C9 06 DC D3 45 9B : To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 14:19:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (blaubaer.kn-bremen.de [194.94.232.249]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB7D015908; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 14:19:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nox@saturn.kn-bremen.de) Received: from saturn.kn-bremen.de (uucp@localhost) by blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (8.9.1/8.9.1) with UUCP id XAA25561; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 23:13:33 +0200 Received: (from nox@localhost) by saturn.kn-bremen.de (8.9.3/8.8.5) id WAA01458; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 22:43:46 +0200 (MET DST) From: Juergen Lock Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 22:43:45 +0200 To: Seigo TANIMURA Cc: zinnia@jan.ne.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports Message-ID: <19990414224345.A99120@saturn.kn-bremen.de> References: <19990414041916.A64069@saturn.kn-bremen.de> <199904140546.OAA85232@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904140546.OAA85232@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp>; from Seigo TANIMURA on Wed, Apr 14, 1999 at 02:46:06PM +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 14, 1999 at 02:46:06PM +0900, Seigo TANIMURA wrote: > On Wed, 14 Apr 1999 04:19:16 +0200, > Juergen Lock said: > nox> Hmm, the cable on that page looks like for a MAC serial port to me... > nox> Is there something for the good old 5-pin DIN MIDI sockets, the ones > nox> that use a 20 mA (i think) current loop? > > > I tried serching 'serial' and 'midi', to find some resources... > > > We have at least one product to convert a serial port to a midi port and vice versa: > > http://www.midi-classics.com/p2615.htm > > has one midi output and one input, although our driver is not capable to receive midi signal yet. Huh, it is send only? :) or do you mean with that interface... What would be required to make it work? > > I see Midiman has some cool interfaces. Have a look at: > > http://www.midiman.net/ > > for the list of the products. They even have one for USB!(anyone wanna try? ;-) not me... Regards, -- Juergen Lock To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 14:46:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from jane.lfn.org (jane.lfn.org [209.16.92.240]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id C2E6215824 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 14:45:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from caj@lfn.org) Received: (qmail 13095 invoked by uid 100); 14 Apr 1999 21:43:34 -0000 Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 16:43:34 -0500 (CDT) From: Craig Johnston To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: <3714EFA7.239DEBF5@chen.ml.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 14 Apr 1999, Luoqi Chen wrote: > Saw this on yesterday's slashdot news: > http://www.mindcraft.com/whitepapers/nts4rhlinux.html > I wonder how well FreeBSD would perform. I notice that the test server had both OSes on one disk and each OS had a separate data partition, also both on one disk. Gee, I wonder which OS got the outer tracks? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 15:35:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from frmug.org (frmug-gw.frmug.org [193.56.58.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83FFC15822 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 15:35:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by frmug.org (8.9.1/frmug-2.3/nospam) with UUCP id AAA01048 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 00:33:02 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: by keltia.freenix.fr (Postfix, from userid 101) id D282A8841; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 23:44:54 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 23:44:54 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Licensing on syscons fonts Message-ID: <19990414234454.B23610@keltia.freenix.fr> Mail-Followup-To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <19990413074538.A10790@keltia.freenix.fr> <19990414104449.A56479@nuxi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <19990414104449.A56479@nuxi.com>; from David E . O'Brien on Wed, Apr 14, 1999 at 10:44:49AM -0700 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT/ELF ctm#5173 AMD-K6 MMX @ 200 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG According to David E . O'Brien: > You might want to copyrite them BSD-style rather than put them in the > public domain. There is a difference. For regular source files yes I'd use the BSD license. For just two font files, I just don't care. Unless it is a problem. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 4.0-CURRENT #70: Sat Feb 27 09:43:08 CET 1999 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 15:36:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from frmug.org (frmug-gw.frmug.org [193.56.58.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3E9D157DB for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 15:36:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by frmug.org (8.9.1/frmug-2.3/nospam) with UUCP id AAA01054 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 00:33:45 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: by keltia.freenix.fr (Postfix, from userid 101) id A26B78840; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 00:02:08 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 00:02:08 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux Message-ID: <19990415000208.A23723@keltia.freenix.fr> Mail-Followup-To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <3714EFA7.239DEBF5@chen.ml.org> <19990414155546.A753@erols.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <19990414155546.A753@erols.com>; from Lee Cremeans on Wed, Apr 14, 1999 at 03:55:46PM -0400 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT/ELF ctm#5173 AMD-K6 MMX @ 200 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG According to Lee Cremeans: > Or *did* they think of it? If you look closely, you'll find the following > blurb in the paper: Even more, there is a another "comparison" from the same guys between NT4 and Novell. Interestingly enough, NT seem to win against Novell as well (which make the "test" even more suspect). -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 4.0-CURRENT #70: Sat Feb 27 09:43:08 CET 1999 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 17:11:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lcremeans.erols.com (lcremeans.erols.com [216.164.87.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05253151BE for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 17:11:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from lee@lcremeans.erols.com) Received: (from lee@localhost) by lcremeans.erols.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id UAA01454; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 20:09:07 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from lee) Message-ID: <19990414200907.A1423@erols.com> Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 20:09:07 -0400 From: Lee Cremeans To: Ollivier Robert , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux References: <3714EFA7.239DEBF5@chen.ml.org> <19990414155546.A753@erols.com> <19990415000208.A23723@keltia.freenix.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990415000208.A23723@keltia.freenix.fr>; from Ollivier Robert on Thu, Apr 15, 1999 at 12:02:08AM +0200 X-OS: FreeBSD 3.0-STABLE Organization: My room? Are you crazy? :) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 15, 1999 at 12:02:08AM +0200, Ollivier Robert wrote: > According to Lee Cremeans: > > Or *did* they think of it? If you look closely, you'll find the following > > blurb in the paper: > > Even more, there is a another "comparison" from the same guys between NT4 > and Novell. Interestingly enough, NT seem to win against Novell as well > (which make the "test" even more suspect). Yup; I get the distinct impression that Mindcraft are a bunch of shills-for-hire; they'll make your system win if you say so and pay 'em enough. -- +--------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Lee Cremeans -- Manassas, VA, USA (WakkyMouse on WTnet) | | lcremeans@erols.com | http://wakky.dyndns.org/~lee | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 18:52:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D35814F69 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 18:52:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA84101 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 21:49:58 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 21:49:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: 3rd Revision of ipfw uid Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Okay, here we go for the third time around with the ipfw uid biz. Now: * mbuf is back to normal, no overstuffing it * ICMP is not per-uid supported. It's only useable by root anyway. * Everything is working correctly (yes, a feature I carried over from the previous version. I'll implement per-gid support too soon :) Everyone have fun with the code at http://janus.syracuse.net/~green/ipfw_uid.patch Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 18:55:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from WEBBSD1.turnaround.com.au (webbsd1.turnaround.com.au [203.39.138.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4950514F69 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 18:55:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from J_Shevland@TurnAround.com.au) Received: from TurnAround.com.au (dhcp68.turnaround.com.au [192.168.1.68]) by WEBBSD1.turnaround.com.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA06152; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 12:01:15 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from J_Shevland@TurnAround.com.au) Message-ID: <371546CA.BE216FD3@TurnAround.com.au> Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:54:18 +1000 From: Joe Shevland Reply-To: J_Shevland@TurnAround.com.au Organization: Turnaround Solutions Pty. Ltd. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Lee Cremeans Cc: Ollivier Robert , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux References: <3714EFA7.239DEBF5@chen.ml.org> <19990414155546.A753@erols.com> <19990415000208.A23723@keltia.freenix.fr> <19990414200907.A1423@erols.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG They've going about losing their credibility in a very efficient and direct way... Joe. Lee Cremeans wrote: > > On Thu, Apr 15, 1999 at 12:02:08AM +0200, Ollivier Robert wrote: > > According to Lee Cremeans: > > > Or *did* they think of it? If you look closely, you'll find the following > > > blurb in the paper: > > > > Even more, there is a another "comparison" from the same guys between NT4 > > and Novell. Interestingly enough, NT seem to win against Novell as well > > (which make the "test" even more suspect). > > Yup; I get the distinct impression that Mindcraft are a bunch of > shills-for-hire; they'll make your system win if you say so and pay 'em > enough. > > -- > +--------------------------------------------------------------------+ > | Lee Cremeans -- Manassas, VA, USA (WakkyMouse on WTnet) | > | lcremeans@erols.com | http://wakky.dyndns.org/~lee | > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- --------------------------------------------- ,-._|\ | Joe Shevland / \ | Principal Consultant \_,--._/ | Turnaround Solutions Pty. Ltd. v | http://www.TurnAround.com.au --------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 19: 7:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp [133.34.17.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E34A14C4F; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 19:07:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp) Received: from rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (8.9.3/3.7W-Naklab-2.1-19981120) with ESMTP id LAA33326; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:04:39 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <199904150204.LAA33326@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp> To: nox@jelal.kn-bremen.de Cc: zinnia@jan.ne.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-multimedia@freebsd.org Cc: Seigo TANIMURA Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports From: Seigo TANIMURA In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 14 Apr 1999 22:43:45 +0200" References: <19990414224345.A99120@saturn.kn-bremen.de> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.70 on Emacs 19.34.1 / Mule 2.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:04:39 +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 14 Apr 1999 22:43:45 +0200, Juergen Lock said: >> We have at least one product to convert a serial port to a midi port and vice versa: >> >> http://www.midi-classics.com/p2615.htm >> >> has one midi output and one input, although our driver is not capable to receive midi signal yet. nox> Huh, it is send only? :) or do you mean with that interface... What nox> would be required to make it work? Sorry, I had a misunderstanding. Tsuyoshi-san pointed me out that our driver is able to receive midi signal as well. I was just not able to test by myself... Using Portman PC/S, you will have something like this: 38.4kbps 31.25kbps PC ---------- Portman PC/S ----------- Midi Module Portman Midi Serial Cable Cable Portman transforms the singal bitrate and the electrical characteristics. Portman has its own cable contained in the product. Since I do not have a Portman now, I am not convinced whether we can drive it using our driver or not. Things will be tough if Portman cooks the signal from and/or to PC. This seems more likely for the multi-port midi-serial interfaces, especially the ones capable to select the {in,out}out ports by the PC. For the modules with serial interfaces(most modern ones like Roland SC-88 have): 38.4kbps PC ----------------------------- Midi Module Serial Cable for the Module I got to play sequences successfully under the situation shown above. I used SC-88, with a 'computer port'. It accepts the bitrates of both 31.25kbps and 38.4kbps, transforming the signal internally. You can plug some other midi modules and instruments to the module connected to the PC. In this case the module also acts as a midi interface. Seigo TANIMURA |M2, Nakagawa Lab, Dept of Electronics & CS =========================|Faculty of Engineering, Yokohama National Univ Powered by SIEMENS, |http://www.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp/~tanimura/ FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT |http://www.sakura.ne.jp/~tcarrot/ (10th Apr 1999) & muesli.|tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp tcarrot@sakuramail.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 19:11:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp2.vnet.net (smtp2.vnet.net [166.82.1.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03D1414C4F for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 19:11:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp2.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id WAA12678; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 22:10:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA01394; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 22:09:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id WAA03010; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 22:09:14 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 22:09:14 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199904150209.WAA03010@lakes.dignus.com> To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, lcremeans@erols.com, roberto@keltia.freenix.fr Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: <19990414200907.A1423@erols.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > On Thu, Apr 15, 1999 at 12:02:08AM +0200, Ollivier Robert wrote: > > According to Lee Cremeans: > > > Or *did* they think of it? If you look closely, you'll find the following > > > blurb in the paper: > > > > Even more, there is a another "comparison" from the same guys between NT4 > > and Novell. Interestingly enough, NT seem to win against Novell as well > > (which make the "test" even more suspect). > > Yup; I get the distinct impression that Mindcraft are a bunch of > shills-for-hire; they'll make your system win if you say so and pay 'em > enough. > Perhaps we should take up contributions and hire them to compare Windows and FreeBSD (before Microsoft does) :-) - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 14 20:33:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from leap.innerx.net (leap.innerx.net [38.179.176.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 39B1E14FE0 for ; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 20:33:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chris@holly.dyndns.org) Received: from holly.dyndns.org (ip107.houston2.tx.pub-ip.psi.net [38.11.201.107]) by leap.innerx.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 34E4A37087; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 23:30:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from chris@localhost) by holly.dyndns.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA02660; Wed, 14 Apr 1999 22:31:07 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from chris) Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 22:31:06 -0500 From: Chris Costello To: Lee Cremeans Cc: Luoqi Chen , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux Message-ID: <19990414223106.I584@holly.dyndns.org> Reply-To: chris@calldei.com References: <3714EFA7.239DEBF5@chen.ml.org> <19990414155546.A753@erols.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <19990414155546.A753@erols.com>; from Lee Cremeans on Wed, Apr 14, 1999 at 03:55:46PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 14, 1999, Lee Cremeans wrote: > Mindcraft Certification > > Mindcraft, Inc. conducted the performance tests described in this > report between March 10 and March 13, 1999. Microsoft Corporation > sponsored the testing reported herein. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Read their disclaimer, too. They report they're not liable for inaccuracies, etc. And that the information on the page may change without notice. > That should speak volumes about the test's credibility. > > -lee -- Chris Costello Unprecedented performance: Nothing ever ran this slow before. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 0:33:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 344CE14C21 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 00:33:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA82745; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 00:30:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904150730.AAA82745@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Lee Cremeans Cc: Ollivier Robert , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 14 Apr 1999 20:09:07 EDT." <19990414200907.A1423@erols.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 00:30:03 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I wouldn't worry too much about mindcraft just wait till the linux hordes get there 8) Cheers, Amancio > On Thu, Apr 15, 1999 at 12:02:08AM +0200, Ollivier Robert wrote: > > According to Lee Cremeans: > > > Or *did* they think of it? If you look closely, you'll find the following > > > blurb in the paper: > > > > Even more, there is a another "comparison" from the same guys between NT4 > > and Novell. Interestingly enough, NT seem to win against Novell as well > > (which make the "test" even more suspect). > > Yup; I get the distinct impression that Mindcraft are a bunch of > shills-for-hire; they'll make your system win if you say so and pay 'em > enough. > > -- > +--------------------------------------------------------------------+ > | Lee Cremeans -- Manassas, VA, USA (WakkyMouse on WTnet) | > | lcremeans@erols.com | http://wakky.dyndns.org/~lee | > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 0:42:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au (adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.36.247]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 34FA51502A for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 00:42:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kkennawa@physics.adelaide.edu.au) Received: from bragg (bragg [129.127.36.34]) by adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8/UofA-1.5) with SMTP id RAA32533; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:10:18 +0930 (CST) Received: from localhost by bragg; (5.65/1.1.8.2/05Aug95-0227PM) id AA06381; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:10:18 +0930 Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:10:17 +0930 (CST) From: Kris Kennaway X-Sender: kkennawa@bragg To: Amancio Hasty Cc: Lee Cremeans , Ollivier Robert , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: <199904150730.AAA82745@rah.star-gate.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 15 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > I wouldn't worry too much about mindcraft just wait till the linux hordes get > there 8) What would be funny is if the Linux guys paid for an evaluation, to read "Linux server 2.5 times faster than NT4" :-) Kris ----- The Feynman problem-solving algorithm: 1. Write down the problem 2. Think real hard 3. Write down the solution To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 2: 1:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 202A814D0E for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 02:01:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA83324; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 01:58:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904150858.BAA83324@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Kris Kennaway Cc: Lee Cremeans , Ollivier Robert , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:10:17 +0930." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 01:58:25 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I wonder how cheap is mindcraft -- they could be very cheap -- you know they could just crank a report for lets say $100 sort of like duplicating paper real cheap 8) Cheers Amancio > On Thu, 15 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > > > I wouldn't worry too much about mindcraft just wait till the linux hordes get > > there 8) > > What would be funny is if the Linux guys paid for an evaluation, to read > "Linux server 2.5 times faster than NT4" :-) > > Kris > > ----- > The Feynman problem-solving algorithm: 1. Write down the problem > 2. Think real hard > 3. Write down the solution > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 2:24:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ren.detir.qld.gov.au (ns.detir.qld.gov.au [203.46.81.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62A1014BE2 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 02:24:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from syssgm@detir.qld.gov.au) Received: by ren.detir.qld.gov.au; id TAA25780; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:21:47 +1000 (EST) Received: from ogre.detir.qld.gov.au(167.123.8.3) by ren.detir.qld.gov.au via smap (4.1) id xma025775; Thu, 15 Apr 99 19:21:27 +1000 Received: from atlas.detir.qld.gov.au (atlas.detir.qld.gov.au [167.123.8.9]) by ogre.detir.qld.gov.au (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA07408; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:21:27 +1000 (EST) Received: from nymph.detir.qld.gov.au (nymph.detir.qld.gov.au [167.123.10.10]) by atlas.detir.qld.gov.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA14522; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:21:26 +1000 (EST) Received: from nymph.detir.qld.gov.au (localhost.detir.qld.gov.au [127.0.0.1]) by nymph.detir.qld.gov.au (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA28780; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:21:26 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from syssgm@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au) Message-Id: <199904150921.TAA28780@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au> To: Luoqi Chen Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, syssgm@detir.qld.gov.au Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux References: <3714EFA7.239DEBF5@chen.ml.org> In-Reply-To: <3714EFA7.239DEBF5@chen.ml.org> from Luoqi Chen at "Wed, 14 Apr 1999 15:42:31 -0400" Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:21:26 +1000 From: Stephen McKay Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wednesday, 14th April 1999, Luoqi Chen wrote: >Saw this on yesterday's slashdot news: > http://www.mindcraft.com/whitepapers/nts4rhlinux.html >I wonder how well FreeBSD would perform. I wonder also. The load is much higher than similar NT vs Linux tests that I've seen. And the hardware is all very, very new. People shouldn't be so quick to dump on Mindcraft, even if they were bought by Microsoft. The facts of the report should be digested and argued rationally. Then, if we find that Mindcraft have deliberately distorted things, we can dump on them. :-) So far I've spotted only 2 relevant facts: 1) "Drive D/Data: 8 x 4 GB Seagate Barracuda, Model ST34573WC, 7,200 RPM; two partitions - one data partition for each OS" The two operating systems shared the drive array, so one of them got the good bit, and one got the bad bit. This is flawed testing. 2) "The Linux kernel limited itself to use only 960 MB of RAM" The box had 4GB of RAM, but Linux got to use less than 1GB. Poor Linux. This was such a fair test! :-( Do we recall a previous test where our favourite OS used only a portion of the total RAM? Now, what are the chances that FreeBSD Inc could purchase the services of Mindcraft to test a properly tuned FreeBSD box vs this NT box? Stephen. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 2:31:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (mail.palmerharvey.co.uk [62.172.109.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 66A98153C1 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 02:31:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Dom.Mitchell@palmerharvey.co.uk) Received: from ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk (unverified) by mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 10:29:02 +0100 Received: from voodoo.pandhm.co.uk ([10.100.35.12]) by ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) id GZL8KJFR; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 10:22:18 +0100 Received: from dom by voodoo.pandhm.co.uk with local (Exim 2.10 #1) id 10XiVn-000ExA-00; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 10:32:43 +0100 To: Stephen McKay Cc: Luoqi Chen , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux X-Mailer: nmh-1.0 X-Colour: Green Organization: Palmer & Harvey McLane In-Reply-To: Stephen McKay's message of "Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:21:26 +1000" <199904150921.TAA28780@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au> Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 10:32:43 +0100 From: Dom Mitchell Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 15 April 1999, Stephen McKay proclaimed: > On Wednesday, 14th April 1999, Luoqi Chen wrote: > >Saw this on yesterday's slashdot news: > > http://www.mindcraft.com/whitepapers/nts4rhlinux.html > >I wonder how well FreeBSD would perform. > > I wonder also. The load is much higher than similar NT vs Linux tests > that I've seen. And the hardware is all very, very new. > > People shouldn't be so quick to dump on Mindcraft, even if they were > bought by Microsoft. The facts of the report should be digested and > argued rationally. Then, if we find that Mindcraft have deliberately > distorted things, we can dump on them. :-) Well, the Linux folks have already come up with quite a few reasons why the test was invalid. A good summary is in this week's LWN, and another is at . I think the most important point to note here is simply that Mindcraft managed to produce such outrageously *different* results to everybody else that a closer inspection must be made. Oh, and that we should have lobbied for FreeBSD inclusion in their tests. -- Dom Mitchell -- Palmer & Harvey McLane -- Unix Systems Administrator "Value of 2 may go down as well as up" -- FORTRAN programmers manual -- ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. ********************************************************************** To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 2:41:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E84215726 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 02:41:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id CAA14438; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 02:39:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Stephen McKay Cc: Luoqi Chen , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:21:26 +1000." <199904150921.TAA28780@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au> Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 02:39:05 -0700 Message-ID: <14436.924169145@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Now, what are the chances that FreeBSD Inc could purchase the services > of Mindcraft to test a properly tuned FreeBSD box vs this NT box? And what are the chances that anyone would trust the results of this test after what they did to Linux and Novell? :) Seems to me like it would be a waste of the kind of money they're likely to charge (and if it were anything less than $10K, I'd be amazed). - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 2:47:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from PacHell.TelcoSucks.org (PacHell.TelcoSucks.org [207.90.181.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 454AC14DC6 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 02:47:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ulf@PacHell.TelcoSucks.org) Received: (from ulf@localhost) by PacHell.TelcoSucks.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) id CAA70398; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 02:44:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ulf) Message-ID: <19990415024454.B81624@TelcoSucks.org> Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 02:44:54 -0700 From: Ulf Zimmermann To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , Stephen McKay Cc: Luoqi Chen , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux Reply-To: ulf@Alameda.net References: <199904150921.TAA28780@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au> <14436.924169145@zippy.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <14436.924169145@zippy.cdrom.com>; from Jordan K. Hubbard on Thu, Apr 15, 1999 at 02:39:05AM -0700 Organization: Alameda Networks, Inc. X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 15, 1999 at 02:39:05AM -0700, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > Now, what are the chances that FreeBSD Inc could purchase the services > > of Mindcraft to test a properly tuned FreeBSD box vs this NT box? > > And what are the chances that anyone would trust the results of this > test after what they did to Linux and Novell? :) Seems to me like it > would be a waste of the kind of money they're likely to charge (and if > it were anything less than $10K, I'd be amazed). What is the possibility to have a platform simular to the one Mindcraft used and do our own testing ? Then do not repeat the errors they did. Invite someone from the Linux community to participate and also someone who could tune an NT box. I wouldn't mind to do something like that. > > - Jordan > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- Regards, Ulf. --------------------------------------------------------------------- Ulf Zimmermann, 1525 Pacific Ave., Alameda, CA-94501, #: 510-769-2936 Alameda Networks, Inc. | http://www.Alameda.net | Fax#: 510-521-5073 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 2:49:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sussie.interbizz.se (ns.datadesign.se [194.23.109.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BC2C14DC6 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 02:49:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Joachim.Isaksson@ibfs.com) Received: from tequila (dhcp140.ibfs.com [193.45.188.140]) by sussie.interbizz.se (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA19745; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:47:00 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <004201be8724$e7b89a40$8cbc2dc1@ibfs.com> From: "Joachim Isaksson" To: "Luoqi Chen" , "Stephen McKay" Cc: , References: <3714EFA7.239DEBF5@chen.ml.org> <199904150921.TAA28780@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au> Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:46:58 +0200 Organization: Interbizz Financial Systems MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >> 2) "The Linux kernel limited itself to use only 960 MB of RAM" > > The box had 4GB of RAM, but Linux got to use less than 1GB. Poor Linux. > This was such a fair test! :-( Do we recall a previous test where our > favourite OS used only a portion of the total RAM? Well, does Linux really limit itself to 960MB of RAM as they claim? If so, I'd say it's not an unfair test to not limit NT to the same low memory use. If on the other hand they limited Linux to 960MB of RAM by not doing proper tuning, that's another matter... Guess I better go read up on the Linux people's opinion on the testing... /me To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 2:55:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cain.gsoft.com.au (genesi.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C4DE14DC6 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 02:55:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Received: from lot.gsoft.com.au (lot.gsoft.com.au [203.38.152.106]) by cain.gsoft.com.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA08788; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:22:43 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <004201be8724$e7b89a40$8cbc2dc1@ibfs.com> Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:27:10 +0930 (CST) From: "Daniel O'Connor" To: Joachim Isaksson Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Stephen McKay , Luoqi Chen Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 15-Apr-99 Joachim Isaksson wrote: > If on the other hand they limited Linux to 960MB of RAM by not doing proper > tuning, that's another matter... There are 2Gb patches for Linux apparently.. I read in one rebuttal to the test (the Linux World News) that NT server was only using 1Gb of RAM too, so its a non issue. --- Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." -- Andrew Tanenbaum To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 2:57:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (castles539.castles.com [208.214.165.103]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6CD4714DC6 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 02:57:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id CAA00923; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 02:54:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904150954.CAA00923@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: ulf@Alameda.net Cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , Stephen McKay , Luoqi Chen , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Apr 1999 02:44:54 PDT." <19990415024454.B81624@TelcoSucks.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 02:54:28 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > On Thu, Apr 15, 1999 at 02:39:05AM -0700, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > > Now, what are the chances that FreeBSD Inc could purchase the services > > > of Mindcraft to test a properly tuned FreeBSD box vs this NT box? > > > > And what are the chances that anyone would trust the results of this > > test after what they did to Linux and Novell? :) Seems to me like it > > would be a waste of the kind of money they're likely to charge (and if > > it were anything less than $10K, I'd be amazed). > > What is the possibility to have a platform simular to the one Mindcraft > used and do our own testing ? Then do not repeat the errors they did. We have the server. We need the 144 workstations and 12 switches. Want to rent us some machines? -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 3: 0:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rucus.ru.ac.za (rucus.ru.ac.za [146.231.29.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 3E31A15860 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 03:00:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nbm@rucus.ru.ac.za) Received: (qmail 10383 invoked by uid 1003); 15 Apr 1999 11:56:54 -0000 Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:56:54 +0000 From: Neil Blakey-Milner To: Ulf Zimmermann Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux Message-ID: <19990415115654.A8721@rucus.ru.ac.za> References: <199904150921.TAA28780@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au> <14436.924169145@zippy.cdrom.com> <19990415024454.B81624@TelcoSucks.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <19990415024454.B81624@TelcoSucks.org>; from Ulf Zimmermann on Thu, Apr 15, 1999 at 02:44:54AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu 1999-04-15 (02:44), Ulf Zimmermann wrote: > What is the possibility to have a platform simular to the one Mindcraft > used and do our own testing ? Then do not repeat the errors they did. > > Invite someone from the Linux community to participate and also someone > who could tune an NT box. I wouldn't mind to do something like that. This is the problem with independent labs doing in-house testing of products they know and have tested before (NT), versus something they can sorta work out from documentation, and poorly at that (Linux). With the Linux community, you have to hit someone really high to do your performance enhancements for Linux, otherwise the rest of them will spend too much time spamming saying that your tests are FUD, FUD, FUD, FUD etc, because "I've never heard of this guy, he isn't Linus" or possibly Alan Cox, "and is thus noone". (You can't really blame them, they don't seem to have the depth recognition we apparently enjoy - there isn't just "jkh and possibly davidg", you have a long list of people who are assumed to have a clue) And, of course, the NT people will say it was these outrageous zealous Open Source people running the test, and you're not likely to find anyone of sufficient standing to manage the system. However, since you need only hit the people buying the systems, any "performance test" is likely to affect them - somehow if it's on the web, or in the newspapers it is necessarily true. Neil -- Neil Blakey-Milner nbm@rucus.ru.ac.za To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 3: 3:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 036FD15860 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 03:03:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id TAA26323; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:31:26 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id TAA26713; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:31:25 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990415193124.U23745@lemis.com> Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:31:24 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Joachim Isaksson , Luoqi Chen , Stephen McKay Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux References: <3714EFA7.239DEBF5@chen.ml.org> <199904150921.TAA28780@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au> <004201be8724$e7b89a40$8cbc2dc1@ibfs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <004201be8724$e7b89a40$8cbc2dc1@ibfs.com>; from Joachim Isaksson on Thu, Apr 15, 1999 at 11:46:58AM +0200 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday, 15 April 1999 at 11:46:58 +0200, Joachim Isaksson wrote: >>> 2) "The Linux kernel limited itself to use only 960 MB of RAM" >> >> The box had 4GB of RAM, but Linux got to use less than 1GB. Poor Linux. >> This was such a fair test! :-( Do we recall a previous test where our >> favourite OS used only a portion of the total RAM? > > Well, does Linux really limit itself to 960MB of RAM as they claim? > If so, I'd say it's not an unfair test to not limit NT to the same low memory > use. It looks as if they did. To quote http://www.lwn.net/1999/features/MindCraft1.0.phtml, which I found to be a well-reasoned summary, though I didn't check their reasoning: Non-issues A few complaints that have been sent to us probably do not figure into the test results. We list them here in the hopes of helping to slow their propagation and improve the quality of information out there. Some complaints have been raised about the test being run on a 4GB server, even though the Linux kernel, in its default form, can only use 960M of that. Patches can be applied to make 2GB available fairly easily. But, in any case, they claim that NT was limited (with the maxmem parameter) to 1G of memory, so this aspect of the test was fair. It would have been more straightforward of them, however, to have simply remove the other 3G from the system. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 3: 5:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F17DB14DC6 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 03:05:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id DAA14581; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 03:03:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: ulf@Alameda.net Cc: Stephen McKay , Luoqi Chen , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Apr 1999 02:44:54 PDT." <19990415024454.B81624@TelcoSucks.org> Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 03:03:35 -0700 Message-ID: <14579.924170615@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > What is the possibility to have a platform simular to the one Mindcraft > used and do our own testing ? Then do not repeat the errors they did. I can loan you a quad Xeon with 1GB of memory if you like (better bring your truck though) but I can't say much about the actual benchmarking software you'd use or how you'd simulate (or obtain) the number of client machines they used. That remains an open question for which I've no practical answers. - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 3: 6: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from axl.noc.iafrica.com (axl.noc.iafrica.com [196.31.1.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8BBD14DC6 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 03:06:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sheldonh@axl.noc.iafrica.com) Received: from sheldonh (helo=axl.noc.iafrica.com) by axl.noc.iafrica.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10XizO-000O4k-00; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 12:03:18 +0200 From: Sheldon Hearn To: Neil Blakey-Milner Reply-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Cc: Ulf Zimmermann , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:56:54 GMT." <19990415115654.A8721@rucus.ru.ac.za> Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 12:03:18 +0200 Message-ID: <92549.924170598@axl.noc.iafrica.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:56:54 GMT, Neil Blakey-Milner wrote: > This is the problem with independent labs doing in-house testing of > products they know and have tested before (NT), versus something they > can sorta work out from documentation, and poorly at that (Linux). As a vendor, you really need something like this on your web page: "If you'd like to benchmark this Operating System against another, please feel free to contact XXX_sucker_XXX to arrange for co-pilot assistance in your endeavours." Of course, that's a pipe-dream for all but the most financially prosperous ventures, for reasons unworthy of discussion anywhere but freebsd-chat, if at all. :-) Ciao,l Sheldon. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 3:12:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rucus.ru.ac.za (rucus.ru.ac.za [146.231.29.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 4790514D91 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 03:12:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nbm@rucus.ru.ac.za) Received: (qmail 12845 invoked by uid 1003); 15 Apr 1999 12:08:52 -0000 Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 12:08:52 +0000 From: Neil Blakey-Milner To: Greg Lehey Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux Message-ID: <19990415120852.A11702@rucus.ru.ac.za> References: <3714EFA7.239DEBF5@chen.ml.org> <199904150921.TAA28780@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au> <004201be8724$e7b89a40$8cbc2dc1@ibfs.com> <19990415193124.U23745@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <19990415193124.U23745@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Thu, Apr 15, 1999 at 07:31:24PM +0930 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu 1999-04-15 (19:31), Greg Lehey wrote: > make 2GB available fairly easily. But, in any case, they > claim that NT was limited (with the maxmem parameter) to 1G > of memory, so this aspect of the test was fair. It would have > been more straightforward of them, however, to have simply > remove the other 3G from the system. Is this the maxmem parameter that affects the maximum amount of Virtual Memory (address space) assigned to user processes by the VMM? Usually it's 2GB for applications maximum with the remainder assigned to the kernel-mode portions of NT. (I'm just wondering since in NT4SP3 and NT Server, Enterprise Edition 4, an administrator can move that to a 3/1gig ratio in the favour of user-mode.) Of course, this is probably a non-issue, but I'm just interested, since it would have otherwise seemed logical to physically remove the memory. Neil -- Neil Blakey-Milner nbm@rucus.ru.ac.za To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 3:32: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from excalibur.oceanis.net (ns.dotcom.fr [195.154.74.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF5AB14E9F for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 03:32:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pixel@excalibur.oceanis.net) Received: (from pixel@localhost) by excalibur.oceanis.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) id KAA14859; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 10:29:31 GMT From: Emmanuel DELOGET Message-Id: <199904151029.KAA14859@excalibur.oceanis.net> Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: <199904150921.TAA28780@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au> from Stephen McKay at "Apr 15, 1999 7:21:26 pm" To: syssgm@detir.qld.gov.au (Stephen McKay) Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 12:29:31 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers Mail List) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As the well known Stephen McKay said... ->On Wednesday, 14th April 1999, Luoqi Chen wrote: -> ->>Saw this on yesterday's slashdot news: ->> http://www.mindcraft.com/whitepapers/nts4rhlinux.html ->>I wonder how well FreeBSD would perform. -> ->I wonder also. The load is much higher than similar NT vs Linux tests ->that I've seen. And the hardware is all very, very new. -> ->People shouldn't be so quick to dump on Mindcraft, even if they were ->bought by Microsoft. The facts of the report should be digested and ->argued rationally. Then, if we find that Mindcraft have deliberately ->distorted things, we can dump on them. :-) -> ->So far I've spotted only 2 relevant facts: Note a third on the apache configuration : 3) Set OPTIM = "-04 -m486" before compiling Will you choose 486 optim on a 4xPII Xeon ? I would not, since this will slow down the whole program... But the goal was not to have it to run fast... On a similar point of view, It could be nice to have the complete configuration of the linux box (maybe they have choosen 486 cpus too :) And More in IIS : 4)Server set to maximize throughput for applications when doing WebBench tests No comment about this... In fact, we don't care that linux/apache is slower than nt/iss, since linux/apache is able to run without any reboot for months, and nt/iss is not (I experienced 5/10 reboot a week during 3 months in a small french ISP). -> ->1) "Drive D/Data: 8 x 4 GB Seagate Barracuda, Model ST34573WC, 7,200 RPM; -> two partitions - one data partition for each OS" -> ->The two operating systems shared the drive array, so one of them got the ->good bit, and one got the bad bit. This is flawed testing. -> ->2) "The Linux kernel limited itself to use only 960 MB of RAM" -> ->The box had 4GB of RAM, but Linux got to use less than 1GB. Poor Linux. ->This was such a fair test! :-( Do we recall a previous test where our ->favourite OS used only a portion of the total RAM? -> ->Now, what are the chances that FreeBSD Inc could purchase the services ->of Mindcraft to test a properly tuned FreeBSD box vs this NT box? -> ->Stephen. -> -> ->To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org ->with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -> -- ____________________________________________________________________ Emmanuel DELOGET [pixel] pixel@{dotcom.fr,epita.fr} ---- DotCom SA -------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 5:19:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns1.seidata.com (ns1.seidata.com [208.10.211.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F3B4414BD3 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 05:19:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@seidata.com) Received: from localhost (mike@localhost) by ns1.seidata.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA14110; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 08:17:32 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 08:17:32 -0400 (EDT) From: To: Craig Johnston Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 14 Apr 1999, Craig Johnston wrote: > > I wonder how well FreeBSD would perform. [snip] > I notice that the test server had both OSes on one disk and each [snip] Such 'benchmarks' are pretty laughable... did you see the amount of Registry tuning they did compared to the amount of kernel tuning? I always take these things with a grain of salt when the people conducting the tests obviously have no (or very little) Linux or Unix knowledge themselves. *shrug* Later, -Mike To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 5:26:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns1.seidata.com (ns1.seidata.com [208.10.211.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D980D14BD8 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 05:26:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@seidata.com) Received: from localhost (mike@localhost) by ns1.seidata.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA15667; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 08:23:57 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 08:23:57 -0400 (EDT) From: To: Kris Kennaway Cc: Amancio Hasty , Lee Cremeans , Ollivier Robert , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 15 Apr 1999, Kris Kennaway wrote: > What would be funny is if the Linux guys paid for an evaluation, to read > "Linux server 2.5 times faster than NT4" :-) They're too busy writing an OS that works... Later, -Mike To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 6: 1: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alumni.cs.colorado.edu (alumni.cs.Colorado.EDU [128.138.192.80]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 555F114CCF for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 06:00:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from atk@alumni.cs.colorado.edu) Received: (from atk@localhost) by alumni.cs.colorado.edu (8.9.2/8.9.2) id GAA24333 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 06:58:33 -0600 (MDT) Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 06:58:33 -0600 (MDT) From: Alan T Krantz Message-Id: <199904151258.GAA24333@alumni.cs.colorado.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: kernel threads Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello, I'm curious who is working on kernel threads and what the user and implementation models will be. Will the threads work more like threads under solaris, linux or sgi (I think linux and sgi hack the process table and threads are sort of like a special process where in solaris the threads seem to be a bit cleaner I suspect they are similar to Mach threads). Also, someone posted that there would be N kernel threads (where N was the number of processor). ifthis is the case does this mean the programmer will be limited to creating N threads and the M other threads (M = T - N) will really be statically d defined user threads or did the person really mean that only N threads would be active at a time? I guess there are a couple of questions here - one is the user model (which I suspect is suppose to be the same on all systems) and the other is the implementation. I'm not on this mailing list so please cc replies to atk@cs.colorado.edu To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 6:45:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.tar.com (ns.tar.com [204.95.187.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6D2514FD4; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 06:45:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dick@ns.tar.com) Received: (from dick@localhost) by ns.tar.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA06081; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 08:43:09 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dick) Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 08:43:09 -0500 From: "Richard Seaman, Jr." To: hackers@freebsd.org Cc: bde@freebsd.org Subject: Posix sched-*() functions and other scheduling issues Message-ID: <19990415084309.B442@tar.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Sometime around the beginning of the year, Peter Dufault did quite a bit of work revamping the posix priority code (sched_*() functions) as well as fixing other problems in the scheduling code. The results are posted at ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/development/misc/PATCHES.sched In a recent posting to the -hackers mailing list, he indicated he would not commit the patches any time soon in part because he lacked the time to support them, and in part due to objections from a core team member that the proposed changes were too invasive. In a followup posting He also suggested that someone might want to rework them into a smaller set of patches. I have believed that these patches solve a number of problems, and have extracted (and very slightly modified) a portion of his patches to address the problems noted below. These modified patches are available at http://lt.tar.com/sched.diff I hope that some people will test them, and that if they test well, that someone will commit them. I will submit a PR with the patches if I receive reports that they work ok (they do here). (1) donice() in kern_resource.c ------------------------------- After the nice value is adjusted, maybe_resched() is called indirectly via resetpriority(). However, the value of p_priority does not get updated until after the call, so that maybe_resched() does its test based on the old p_priority value. The result is that if rescheduling is warranted (ie. want_resched should be set), it doesn't happen. Also, if the process is on a run queue, it is not put on a new run queue, if warranted by the priority change. As result the process will continue to be scheduled based on its old priority until is actually selected to run. (2) rtprio() in kern_resource.c ------------------------------- If the priority of a process is adjusted by rtprio(), there is no check made to see if want_resched should be set due to the change (maybe_resched() is never called). In addition, if the process is on a runqueue, its position on the runqueue will not reflect its new priority and it will be scheduled based on its old priority until it is selected to run. In addition, it would be nice to use rtprio() to adjust real and idle time priorities in the posix sched_*() functions. However, the only interface to rtprio() is for the rtprio() syscall, which does copyin/copyout of paramters. It would be helpful to split this function, creating a "dortprio" function, analagous to donice(), that can be called internally in the kernel. (3) maybe_resched() in kern_synch.c ------------------------------- If the process being checked (chk) is not the current process, the result of maybe_resched is correct. But, if the process being checked is the current process, the result is the opposite of what if should be (ie. the current process should be considered for rescheduling if its priority is made less favorable). In addition, when checking whether a non-RTP_PRIO_NORMAL process should be rescheduled, the value of proc->p_priority is used for the test. This value is meaningless for such processes. In addition, when the the process being checked is the current process, there is no value maintained of what the previous priority was (for non-RTP_PRIO_NORMAL processes), so if the comparison is corrected, there is nothing to compare against. (4) curpriority (global variable) -------------------------------- The value of proc->p_priority is stored in a global variable curpriority for the current process as it exists the kernel via userret(). The value of curpriority is used in maybe_resched() to decide if a process should be rescheduled. This implicitly assumes that the curpriority of the last process to exit the kernel is the proper basis for comparison. On a uniprocessor system curpriority should also be the value of curproc->p_priority. Its not clear to me what this value represents on an SMP system. If a global variable such as this is to be maintained, it should also reflect the rtprio values of the process, so the comparison in maybe_resched() reflects the rtprio values for rtp processes. However, I wonder if its better to maintain this value on a per-proc basis? I don't really understand what the global variable curpriority really means in an SMP environment. It seems to me this could be the p_priority value of the process running on a different processor if that process was the last to exist the kernel. I wonder if this is the comparison that is intended? Note: The modified patches do not address the SMP issue I have raised here. They follow the existing pattern of using a global variable (but modified to reflect rtp information). (5) resetpriority() in kern_synch.c ----------------------------------- This function adjusts the value of p_usrpri and then calls maybe_resched(). However, maybe_resched() does not use the values of p_usrpri, but only the value of p_priority (for a RTP_PRIO_NORMAL process). Since p_priority has not generally been updated at this point, maybe_resched() may generate the wrong result. The proper sequence would appear to be: resetpriority() /* which updates p_usrpri */ if (on a run queue) { remove from the existing run queue /* uses old p_priority */ proc->p_priority = proc->p_usrpri put on new run queue /* uses new p_priority */ } else { proc->p_priority = proc->p_usrpri } maybe_resched() /* uses updated p_priority to compare with * previously stored value of curpriority */ (6) statclock(), schedcpu(), forwarded_statclock() in kern_synch.c kern_clock.c and mp_machdep.c) ------------------------------------------------------------------ Variables such as proc->p_estcpu, proc->p_usrpri, and proc->p_priority which are used exclusively by RTP_PRIO_NORMAL processes are maintained and adjusted for non-RTP_PRIO_NORMAL processes as well. This is not necessarily wrong, since these values could be used again if the process priority class is reset to RTP_PRIO_NORMAL. There is a policy decision though, as to what these values should be upon return to class RTP_PRIO_NORMAL. Note: The modified patches do not change the current code on this point, whereas Peter's patches modified the code to only update these statistics if the process in question was RTP_PRIO_NORMAL. (7) sched_setparam() sched_getparam() in ksched.c ------------------------------------------------- sched_setparam treats SCHED_OTHER as EINVAL, while sched_getparam does not. sched_getparam does not set the return value for the priority in the case of SCHED_OTHER and does not return an error value to indicate the return value is invalid. This is also inconsistent with sched_setscheduler which allows setting of priority for SCHED_OTHER. (8) sched_get_priority_max() in ksched.c ---------------------------------------- The values returned for all cases are wrong. (9) sched_get_priority_min() in ksched.c ---------------------------------------- The value returned for SCHED_OTHER is wrong. (10) sched_setscheduler() in ksched.c ------------------------------------- Allows a priority to be set for SCHED_OTHER (which is equated to RTP_PRIO_NORMAL), but the value set is rtprio.prio which is not not used in any way by RTP_PRIO_NORMAL processes, so this is meaningless. Nor is the value range checked. Also, after priority reset, if the process is on a run queue, there is no adjustment of the run queue. This is a similar issue to the donice and rtprio problems noted above. Also, want_resched is always set after a priority adjustment, whether the priority change necessitates it or not (need_resched() is called instead of maybe_resched()). (11) sched_*() functions generally, see ksched.c and p1003_1b.c --------------------------------------------------------------- The permission gate implemented here is much more restrictive than the permission gates for setpriority() and rtprio(), even though these functions do not implement any more functionality. In general the caller must be uid 0 to execute any of these functions. Most apps that use these functions expect to be able to execute all but the sched_set*() functions as a normal user. This causes problems in porting applications that use the sched_*() interface. If these functions are completely implemented in terms of donice() and dortprio(), they could simply use the permission gate already in place for these functions. Note: The modified patches leave the code for the separate permission gate in place, but effectively disable it. See the CAN_AFFECT macro in p1003_1b.c. The permission gates in donice and dortprio are used instead. Also, the sched_*() functions currently require a custom kernel. These functions are the primary scheduling interface for Linux, so that some linux applications running in Linux emu require them. Also, since these are POSIX and Unix98 interfaces, a number of applications use them, which affects ported applications. Properly implemented, theses should add *very little* code to the kernel since they can easily be implemented in terms of donice() and dortprio(). Therefore it would be very desireable to include the necessary options in the GENERIC kernel. Also, these functions do not have any way of dealing with RTP_PRIO_IDLE processes, and thus are an incomplete interface to the FreeBSD priority scheduling system. -- Richard Seaman, Jr. email: dick@tar.com 5182 N. Maple Lane phone: 414-367-5450 Chenequa WI 53058 fax: 414-367-5852 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 7:58:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mobil.surnet.ru (mobil.surnet.ru [195.54.2.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B550214D24 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 07:58:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ilia@cgilh.chel.su) Received: (from uucgilh@localhost) by mobil.surnet.ru (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with UUCP id UAA16995; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 20:50:28 +0600 (UDT) X-Authentication-Warning: mobil.surnet.ru: uucgilh set sender to ilia@cgilh.chel.su using -f Received: (from uucp@localhost) by cgilh.chel.su (8.8.7/8.8.7) with UUCP id SAA00832; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 18:33:53 +0600 Received: from localhost (ilia@localhost) by jane.cgu.chel.su (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id SAA00303; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 18:21:44 GMT (envelope-from ilia@jane.cgu.chel.su) Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 18:21:44 +0000 (GMT) From: Ilia Chipitsine To: Luoqi Chen Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: <3714EFA7.239DEBF5@chen.ml.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: MULTIPART/MIXED; BOUNDARY="0-376418369-924200504=:256" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. Send mail to mime@docserver.cac.washington.edu for more info. --0-376418369-924200504=:256 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Folks ! Microsoft NT is probably faster, because they use faster compilers :-))) Any volunteer to compile benchmark attached here ? Make sure to use optimization options ! Waiting for your response !!! Ilia Chipitsine On Wed, 14 Apr 1999, Luoqi Chen wrote: > Saw this on yesterday's slashdot news: > http://www.mindcraft.com/whitepapers/nts4rhlinux.html > I wonder how well FreeBSD would perform. > > -lq > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > --0-376418369-924200504=:256 Content-Type: APPLICATION/octet-stream; name="dwhet.tgz" Content-Transfer-Encoding: BASE64 Content-ID: Content-Description: dwhet.tgz Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="dwhet.tgz" H4sICCctFjcAA2R3aGV0LnRhcgDtGmtT20gyn/0rumprFxlLRg9jw+7lqgiY hBSBHDiX/ZYS1mALyxKnB2Cu7r9f98xIGsmyYbc2uQ+nrijIM/2anp6enh55 j3OW9m/ffE+wTHM4GMAbAGu0b6l/CWzbGo0AhiNzf2APB6aD3eZo6LwB87tq JSFLUjcGeOMHvrsdj8XJj1Dox8LxMcDJ1w/jSf/08goMOImym4DBfcymfuJH IXxF/0jSKKS2aBa7y36HaFT4xNwki1kCyGJydXQBbujB8ecvcM/i2yheuuGU gR+u0RWsDT9M0jibpigwISpI2DQKPRIl/lUJr9gtixlyTUDVMPm1CbkEA+A4 Wt5nKQr4GGVx6AZwym5gNNxChHA/g4FjDA7hIQrAOoQwAmvdChU4Ru7RIzfE 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Of1ycTw5o4/+yi+oBEL+baQN8yjDQ+HSDzP6OlOw1mGehV7MvHRefD1IlUOh uPYSTXFwFlIpvdJEnYMIeSHbGdI5mBJN2SOYUddQdKyfogSikKZQKmIxeePn 6263TYFaaKGFFlpooYUWWmihhRZaaKGFFlpooYUWWmihhRZaaKGFFlpooYW/ Dv4LpFCN0QBQAAA= --0-376418369-924200504=:256-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 9: 3: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from postoffice.sarnoff.com (postoffice.sarnoff.com [130.33.10.147]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 30A2A15407 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 09:02:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from amarks@sarnoff.com) Received: from sarnoff.com ([130.33.11.110]) by postoffice.sarnoff.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.5) with ESMTP id AAA4BA8 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 12:00:18 -0400 Message-ID: <3715644D.3B1A770B@sarnoff.com> Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 00:00:13 -0400 From: "AARON MARKS" Reply-To: amarks@sarnoff.com Organization: Sarnoff Corporation X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Memory-Based VFS Contribution Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG All, Ron Minnich and myself have written a memory-based VFS for FreeBSD (we based it on the procfs code and added most of the standard fs operations). I believe this code would be very useful for anyone wanting to write their own fs or to learn the basics of the vfs and would very much like to see it incorporated into the source tree. Who is the priciple contact for this submission? Thanks, -A. -- Aaron J. Marks Communications and Computing Systems Lab Assoc. Member Tech Staff Advanced Networks and Computation Group amarks@sarnoff.com Sarnoff Corporation To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 9: 9:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from csudsu.com (clockwork.csudsu.com [209.0.50.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07E5114CCB for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 09:09:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from stefan@csudsu.com) Received: from localhost (stefan@localhost) by csudsu.com (8.8.8/1.3.2) with SMTP id JAA24450; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 09:06:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from stefan@csudsu.com) Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 09:06:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Stefan Molnar To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: ulf@Alameda.net, Stephen McKay , Luoqi Chen , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: <14579.924170615@zippy.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ulf can just bring the box to my house. I can offer the clients. !%> Stefan On Thu, 15 Apr 1999, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > What is the possibility to have a platform simular to the one Mindcraft > > used and do our own testing ? Then do not repeat the errors they did. > > I can loan you a quad Xeon with 1GB of memory if you like (better > bring your truck though) but I can't say much about the actual > benchmarking software you'd use or how you'd simulate (or obtain) the > number of client machines they used. That remains an open question for > which I've no practical answers. > > - Jordan > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 10:40:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gilgamesch.bik-gmbh.de (gilgamesch.bik-gmbh.de [194.233.237.194]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 973041512C for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 10:39:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cracauer@gilgamesch.bik-gmbh.de) Received: (from cracauer@localhost) by gilgamesch.bik-gmbh.de (8.9.3/8.7.3) id TAA08114; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:31:06 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:31:06 +0200 From: Martin Cracauer To: Avalon Books Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Programming Resources Message-ID: <19990415193106.A6631@cons.org> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: ; from Avalon Books on Wed, Apr 14, 1999 at 09:01:23AM -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In , Avalon Books wrote: > > Does anyone have any useful links/ftp sites/books (etc.) for those of us > new to multi-threaded programming (for daemons, etc.)? Obviously, > resources specific to FBSD would be preferred, but any and all suggestions > would be appreciated. If you aren't already set for threading, you should also consider the classic fork()/pipe()-based concurrency scheme of UNIX systems. Steven's "Advanced Programming in the UNIX Environment" is the cannonical best choice here. I generally prefer it over threads for various reasons and most daemons on FreeBSD use it as well. As for thread books, I don't like most Posix threads books. They focus on the interface, not the actual happenings; at the surface, not providing appropriate informations to judge over tradeofs of various choices. This one is better: Practical Unix Programming : A Guide to Concurrency, Communication, and Multithreading by Kay A. Robbins, Steven Robbins, Steve Robbins(Contributor) Prentice Hall; ISBN: 0134437063. Martin -- %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Martin Cracauer http://www.cons.org/cracauer/ BSD User Group Hamburg, Germany http://www.bsdhh.org/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 10:46:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gatewaya.anheuser-busch.com (gatewaya.anheuser-busch.com [151.145.250.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id C9A65150A9 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 10:46:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Matthew.Alton@anheuser-busch.com) Received: by gatewaya.anheuser-busch.com; id MAA07810; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 12:36:12 -0500 Received: from stlabcexg006.anheuser-busch.com(unknown 151.145.101.161) by gatewaya via smap (V2.1) id xma007754; Thu, 15 Apr 99 12:35:52 -0500 Received: by stlabcexg006.anheuser-busch.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id <29YH07AP>; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 12:43:39 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Alton, Matthew" To: "'amarks@sarnoff.com'" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: Memory-Based VFS Contribution Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 12:20:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Outstanding! Where is it? > -----Original Message----- > From: AARON MARKS [SMTP:amarks@sarnoff.com] > Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 1999 11:00 PM > To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG > Subject: Memory-Based VFS Contribution > > All, > > Ron Minnich and myself have written a memory-based VFS for FreeBSD (we > based it on the procfs code and added most of the standard fs > operations). I believe this code would be very useful for anyone wanting > to write their own fs or to learn the basics of the vfs and would very > much like to see it incorporated into the source tree. > > Who is the priciple contact for this submission? > > Thanks, > -A. > > -- > Aaron J. Marks Communications and Computing Systems Lab > Assoc. Member Tech Staff Advanced Networks and Computation Group > amarks@sarnoff.com Sarnoff Corporation > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 10:48:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 25C721506D for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 10:48:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id RAA13015; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:30:11 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199904151530.RAA13015@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Programming Resources To: cracauer@cons.org (Martin Cracauer) Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:30:10 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: avalon@advicom.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19990415193106.A6631@cons.org> from "Martin Cracauer" at Apr 15, 99 07:30:47 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1594 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > Does anyone have any useful links/ftp sites/books (etc.) for those of us > > new to multi-threaded programming (for daemons, etc.)? Obviously, ... > If you aren't already set for threading, you should also consider the > classic fork()/pipe()-based concurrency scheme of UNIX > systems. Steven's "Advanced Programming in the UNIX Environment" is > the cannonical best choice here. I generally prefer it over threads > for various reasons and most daemons on FreeBSD use it as well. as another alternative to threads, in many cases i also tend to use a single process looping around a select(), and structure the handling of each socket as a state machine, doing non-blocking actions at once and returning to the select when a blocking calls is about to be made. For some types of servers (e.g. www, multi-user talk daemons, etc.) this works quite nicely because most of times there is little processing involved between I/O calls, and restructuring the code in a way that can be put into the main loop almost only requires to replace read() and write()'s with things like state = THE_NEW_STATE ; break ; case THE_NEW_STATE : (if you know what you do, that is...) cheers luigi -----------------------------------+------------------------------------- Luigi RIZZO . EMAIL: luigi@iet.unipi.it . Dip. di Ing. dell'Informazione HTTP://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ . Universita` di Pisa TEL/FAX: +39-050-568.533/522 . via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) -----------------------------------+------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 10:49:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from eyelab.psy.msu.edu (eyelab.psy.msu.edu [35.8.64.179]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9BBA1595D for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 10:49:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@eyelab.psy.msu.edu) Received: from devel-eyelab (dhcp109.baker.ssc.msu.edu [35.8.194.109]) by eyelab.psy.msu.edu (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id NAA33969 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 13:46:45 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from root@eyelab.psy.msu.edu) Message-Id: <4.2.0.32.19990415134842.00a34700@eyelab.msu.edu> X-Sender: root@eyelab.msu.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.32 (Beta) Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 13:50:55 -0400 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org From: Gary Schrock Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: <199904151029.KAA14859@excalibur.oceanis.net> References: <199904150921.TAA28780@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Microsoft isn't going to have too much luck in succeeding with the results of this "test" if even the Ziff-Davis magazines won't swallow it. This article just showed up on PC Week's website today: http://www.zdnet.com/pcweek/stories/news/0,4153,1014383,00.html (Highly tuned NT whips barely tuned Linux in Microsoft-backed test) Gary Schrock root@eyelab.msu.edu To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 11:32: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFA9F14BD5 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:32:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA85761; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:28:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904151828.LAA85761@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Gary Schrock Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Apr 1999 13:50:55 EDT." <4.2.0.32.19990415134842.00a34700@eyelab.msu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:28:42 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG That article mentioned that getting the linux tuning parameters was scattered all over the place and it also mentioned that getting hold of a technical person was difficult . Amancio -- Amancio Hasty To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 11:43: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (blaubaer.kn-bremen.de [194.94.232.249]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 35B65152C4; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:42:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nox@saturn.kn-bremen.de) Received: from saturn.kn-bremen.de (uucp@localhost) by blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (8.9.1/8.9.1) with UUCP id UAA21142; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 20:36:24 +0200 Received: (from nox@localhost) by saturn.kn-bremen.de (8.9.3/8.8.5) id UAA34116; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 20:33:07 +0200 (MET DST) From: Juergen Lock Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 20:33:07 +0200 To: Seigo TANIMURA Cc: zinnia@jan.ne.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports Message-ID: <19990415203307.A33640@saturn.kn-bremen.de> References: <19990414224345.A99120@saturn.kn-bremen.de> <199904150204.LAA33326@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904150204.LAA33326@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp>; from Seigo TANIMURA on Thu, Apr 15, 1999 at 11:04:39AM +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 15, 1999 at 11:04:39AM +0900, Seigo TANIMURA wrote: > On Wed, 14 Apr 1999 22:43:45 +0200, > Juergen Lock said: > > >> We have at least one product to convert a serial port to a midi port and vice versa: > >> > >> http://www.midi-classics.com/p2615.htm > >> > >> has one midi output and one input, although our driver is not capable to receive midi signal yet. > > nox> Huh, it is send only? :) or do you mean with that interface... What > nox> would be required to make it work? > > > Sorry, I had a misunderstanding. Tsuyoshi-san pointed me out that our driver is > able to receive midi signal as well. I was just not able to test by myself... > > > Using Portman PC/S, you will have something like this: > > 38.4kbps 31.25kbps > PC ---------- Portman PC/S ----------- Midi Module > Portman Midi > Serial Cable > Cable > > > Portman transforms the singal bitrate and the electrical characteristics. Hmm as 38.4kbps is > 31.25kbps, does the driver respect flow control when sending? > Portman has its own cable contained in the product. > > Since I do not have a Portman now, I am not convinced whether we can drive > it using our driver or not. Things will be tough if Portman cooks the signal > from and/or to PC. This seems more likely for the multi-port midi-serial > interfaces, especially the ones capable to select the {in,out}out ports > by the PC. > Agreed... > > For the modules with serial interfaces(most modern ones like Roland SC-88 have): > > 38.4kbps > PC ----------------------------- Midi Module > Serial Cable for the Module > > I got to play sequences successfully under the situation shown above. > I used SC-88, with a 'computer port'. It accepts the bitrates of both 31.25kbps > and 38.4kbps, transforming the signal internally. You can plug some other > midi modules and instruments to the module connected to the PC. In this case > the module also acts as a midi interface. Has anyone tried things like sending a big sysex dump to something connected there? Regards, -- Juergen Lock To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 11:44: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from eyelab.psy.msu.edu (eyelab.psy.msu.edu [35.8.64.179]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18C96158B4 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:43:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@eyelab.psy.msu.edu) Received: from devel-eyelab (dhcp109.baker.ssc.msu.edu [35.8.194.109]) by eyelab.psy.msu.edu (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id OAA35131; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 14:41:33 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from root@eyelab.psy.msu.edu) Message-Id: <4.2.0.32.19990415144237.00a84aa0@eyelab.msu.edu> X-Sender: root@eyelab.msu.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.32 (Beta) Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 14:45:31 -0400 To: Amancio Hasty From: Gary Schrock Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199904151828.LAA85761@rah.star-gate.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 11:28 AM 4/15/99 -0700, Amancio Hasty wrote: >That article mentioned that getting the linux tuning parameters was scattered >all >over the place and it also mentioned that getting hold of a technical person >was difficult . Well, I'd have to argue that those points probably are somewhat valid (although I don't think it takes *too* much searching to at least come up with some optimizations for linux). However, it did clearly point out the fact that the tests were run with a highly tuned nt server and a linux kernel that wasn't really tuned at all. It also pointed out that on a platform that's on the lower end of the spectrum that linux will consistently outperform nt. Gary Schrock root@eyelab.msu.edu To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 11:59:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92959158D1 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:59:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA85934; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:56:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904151856.LAA85934@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Gary Schrock Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Apr 1999 14:45:31 EDT." <4.2.0.32.19990415144237.00a84aa0@eyelab.msu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:56:29 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I am trying to suggest to plug the hole that got Linux into trouble : Tuning configuration documentation, sample harware configuration and software configuration for a high performance web server and preferred mailing list to contact for performance or tuning questions. The later is important for in the past people have posted on usenet and their queries have gone unanswered or worse they didn't know where to send their questions to . > At 11:28 AM 4/15/99 -0700, Amancio Hasty wrote: > > >That article mentioned that getting the linux tuning parameters was scattered > >all > >over the place and it also mentioned that getting hold of a technical person > >was difficult . > > Well, I'd have to argue that those points probably are somewhat valid > (although I don't think it takes *too* much searching to at least come up > with some optimizations for linux). However, it did clearly point out the > fact that the tests were run with a highly tuned nt server and a linux > kernel that wasn't really tuned at all. It also pointed out that on a > platform that's on the lower end of the spectrum that linux will > consistently outperform nt. > > > Gary Schrock > root@eyelab.msu.edu > -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 12:14:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D38D814DAE for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 12:14:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA46304; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 13:12:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id NAA03600; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 13:12:16 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199904151912.NAA03600@harmony.village.org> To: amarks@sarnoff.com Subject: Re: Memory-Based VFS Contribution Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Apr 1999 00:00:13 EDT." <3715644D.3B1A770B@sarnoff.com> References: <3715644D.3B1A770B@sarnoff.com> Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 13:12:15 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <3715644D.3B1A770B@sarnoff.com> "AARON MARKS" writes: : Who is the priciple contact for this submission? Post a pointer to it, and a lot of people will take a look. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 12:17:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from paprika.michvhf.com (paprika.michvhf.com [209.57.60.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id DED0715333 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 12:17:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from vev@michvhf.com) Received: (qmail 3250 invoked by uid 1001); 15 Apr 1999 19:15:26 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199904151856.LAA85934@rah.star-gate.com> Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 15:15:25 -0400 (EDT) X-Face: *0^4Iw) To: Amancio Hasty Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Gary Schrock Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 15-Apr-99 Amancio Hasty wrote: > > I am trying to suggest to plug the hole that got Linux into trouble : > > Tuning configuration documentation, sample harware configuration > and software configuration for a high performance web server and > preferred mailing list to contact for performance or tuning questions. > > The later is important for in the past people have posted on usenet > and their queries have gone unanswered or worse they > didn't know where to send their questions to . You mean besides it already being printed on the CD's? Vince. -- ========================================================================== Vince Vielhaber -- KA8CSH email: vev@michvhf.com flame-mail: /dev/null # include TEAM-OS2 Online Campground Directory http://www.camping-usa.com Online Giftshop Superstore http://www.cloudninegifts.com ========================================================================== To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 13:13: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.wolves.k12.mo.us (mail.wolves.k12.mo.us [207.160.214.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EA7415322 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 13:12:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cdillon@wolves.k12.mo.us) Received: from mail.wolves.k12.mo.us (cdillon@mail.wolves.k12.mo.us [207.160.214.1]) by mail.wolves.k12.mo.us (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id PAA15135; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 15:09:36 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from cdillon@wolves.k12.mo.us) Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 15:09:35 -0500 (CDT) From: Chris Dillon To: Amancio Hasty Cc: Gary Schrock , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: <199904151856.LAA85934@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 15 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > > I am trying to suggest to plug the hole that got Linux into trouble : > > Tuning configuration documentation, sample harware configuration > and software configuration for a high performance web server and > preferred mailing list to contact for performance or tuning questions. > > The later is important for in the past people have posted on usenet > and their queries have gone unanswered or worse they > didn't know where to send their questions to . I've always wanted to see, for example, the kernel config file for wcarchive and maybe some other little notes on "how this was tweaked to gain maximum performance in this situation". It might be in the CVS tree somewhere for all I know, but unless it has a big red flag on it, I probably won't see it. :-) -- Chris Dillon - cdillon@wolves.k12.mo.us - cdillon@inter-linc.net FreeBSD: The fastest and most stable server OS on the planet. For Intel x86 and Alpha architectures (SPARC under development). ( http://www.freebsd.org ) -- "One should admire Windows users. It takes a great deal of courage to trust Windows with your data." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 14: 6: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gwis.com (darcy.gwis.com [209.57.72.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E82B14E46 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 14:06:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from droberts@gwis.com) Received: from localhost (droberts@localhost) by gwis.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id RAA26189 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:03:40 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:03:40 -0400 (EDT) From: Dan Roberts To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: pam error(?): no modules loaded for `XXX' service Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I do not profess to be a programmer, nor do I claim to have mastered anything beyond a simple hello.c. However, I do feel I've managed a reasonable attempt at hacking a qpopper PAM patch that was originally intended for Linux. It compiles and runs, however in attempting to authenticate, I receive an error in /var/log/messages that says popper[61181]: no modules loaded for `popper' service Seemingly, the only significant difference between the linux implementation and what I have is that there is in linux, libdl is loaded.. It seemed reasonable that if popper wasn't able to load the library that this is what would cause the error, but a post I saw by John Polstra stated that dynamically loaded libraries are handled within libc. So I'm not really sure where to turn now.. I could really use a good point in the right direction if anyone has any suggestions. To answer a few questions I perceive: I'm running 3.1-R, I do have the pam library linked, I remembered to set up pam.conf for this service, and it does match the name referenced in the pam_start function call. pam_start("popper", user, &conv, &pamh) user is a const char, pam_start is being returned into an int, pamh is a pam_handle_t type and conv is some structure created beforehand that I don't really understand. If anyone wants to see the code, just say so. Thank you. -- Dan Roberts, http://gwis.com/~droberts Systems Engineer - Gateway to Internet Services To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 15: 5:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from postoffice.sarnoff.com (postoffice.sarnoff.com [130.33.10.147]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8AA901542A for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 15:05:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from amarks@sarnoff.com) Received: from sarnoff.com ([130.33.11.110]) by postoffice.sarnoff.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.5) with ESMTP id AAA379B; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 18:02:59 -0400 Message-ID: <37166201.821E52BB@sarnoff.com> Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 18:02:41 -0400 From: "AARON MARKS" Reply-To: amarks@sarnoff.com Organization: Sarnoff Corporation X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Warner Losh Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Memory-Based VFS Contribution References: <3715644D.3B1A770B@sarnoff.com> <199904151912.NAA03600@harmony.village.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I will make arrangements and post the location. Thanks guys, -A. Warner Losh wrote: > > In message <3715644D.3B1A770B@sarnoff.com> "AARON MARKS" writes: > : Who is the priciple contact for this submission? > > Post a pointer to it, and a lot of people will take a look. > > Warner -- Aaron J. Marks Communications and Computing Systems Lab Assoc. Member Tech Staff Advanced Networks and Computation Group amarks@sarnoff.com Sarnoff Corporation To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 15:27:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from etinc.com (et-gw.etinc.com [207.252.1.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20E1014D20 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 15:27:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dennis@etinc.com) Received: from dbsys (dbsys.etinc.com [207.252.1.18]) by etinc.com (8.8.8/8.6.9) with SMTP id SAA20324; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 18:25:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904152225.SAA20324@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:18:24 -0400 To: chris@calldei.com From: Dennis Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <19990414223106.I584@holly.dyndns.org> References: <19990414155546.A753@erols.com> <3714EFA7.239DEBF5@chen.ml.org> <19990414155546.A753@erols.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 10:31 PM 4/14/99 -0500, you wrote: >On Wed, Apr 14, 1999, Lee Cremeans wrote: >> Mindcraft Certification >> >> Mindcraft, Inc. conducted the performance tests described in this >> report between March 10 and March 13, 1999. Microsoft Corporation >> sponsored the testing reported herein. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > Read their disclaimer, too. They report they're not liable >for inaccuracies, etc. And that the information on the page may >change without notice. > >> That should speak volumes about the test's credibility. Maybe so, but it MAY simply be that microsoft's multiprocessor support is better than LINUX's...I'd like to see the same test on a single processor machine....its not impossible that NT4 was optimized for use on a multi-cpu machine...they certainly have had more time with intel to work on it than the linux people have. If you keep trying systems you'll find one that makes your product look good...at least you dont have to reboot linux to change an IP address :-) Dennis To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 15:44:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C181614F84 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 15:44:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA00664 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 15:42:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904152242.PAA00664@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Spring Comdex / Chicago dialin Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 15:42:04 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG A little off-topic. We'll be in Chicago this weekend and next week for Spring Comdex. Drop by the FreeBSD booth (C227) and natter which you're checking out all the new vaporware! Note that we will have the new BSD plushies on display and for sale. I'm also looking for a dialin in Chicagoland for the duration; any offers or recommendations? Thanks; catch you there! -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 16:56:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [204.156.12.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6651814A2F for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 16:56:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from robert@cyrus.watson.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (robert@fledge.pr.watson.org [192.0.2.3]) by fledge.watson.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id TAA13532 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:54:34 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from robert@cyrus.watson.org) Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:54:33 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Watson X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org Reply-To: Robert Watson To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: child return in fork--question Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'm playing around with process scheduling and doing funky things with syscalls. I notice that on i386, fork_return() hard codes the return values from the fork syscall: frame.tf_eax = 0; /* Child returns zero */ frame.tf_eflags &= ~PSL_C; /* success */ frame.tf_edx = 1; userret(p, &frame, 0); Most other places, we copy the p_retval[] fields out of the appropriate process structure, rather than hard coding. Is there a reason why the same thing doesn't happen here, and p_retval[] be set in the child proc structure in fork1()? If not, if I submit patches, would they be put in? (presumably the same code alpha-side would have to be done also). I'd like to be able to make a machine independent change to the fork return values in the fork code without munging into i386/alpha/etc code in the future if I need to change it. Robert N Watson robert@fledge.watson.org http://www.watson.org/~robert/ PGP key fingerprint: 03 01 DD 8E 15 67 48 73 25 6D 10 FC EC 68 C1 1C Carnegie Mellon University http://www.cmu.edu/ TIS Labs at Network Associates, Inc. http://www.tis.com/ Safeport Network Services http://www.safeport.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 17:49:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from eagle.phc.igs.net (eagle.phc.igs.net [207.210.17.201]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A27C314C36; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:49:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eagle@eagle.phc.igs.net) Received: from localhost (eagle@localhost) by eagle.phc.igs.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA85917; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:43:59 GMT (envelope-from eagle@eagle.phc.igs.net) Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:43:58 +0000 (GMT) From: eagle To: Amancio Hasty Cc: Gary Schrock , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, docs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: <199904151856.LAA85934@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG CC'd docs On Thu, 15 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > > I am trying to suggest to plug the hole that got Linux into trouble : > > Tuning configuration documentation, sample harware configuration > and software configuration for a high performance web server and > preferred mailing list to contact for performance or tuning questions. > > The later is important for in the past people have posted on usenet > and their queries have gone unanswered or worse they > didn't know where to send their questions to . > This sounds like a great idea, freebsd tuning docs ... rob To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 19:22: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86BA315046 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:21:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA98092 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 22:19:44 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 22:19:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 3rd Revision of ipfw uid In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 14 Apr 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > Okay, here we go for the third time around with the ipfw uid biz. Now: > > * mbuf is back to normal, no overstuffing it > * ICMP is not per-uid supported. It's only useable by root anyway. > * Everything is working correctly (yes, a feature I carried over from > the previous version. > > I'll implement per-gid support too soon :) Everyone have fun with the code > at http://janus.syracuse.net/~green/ipfw_uid.patch Ahem, a braino got in there ;) I updated it, and the 4th revision should show my mistake clearly from the third *blush* The problem would not have been very prevalent, anyway... > > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ > green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ > FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \__ \ |) | > http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ __ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___/___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 15 20:35:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from poynting.physics.purdue.edu (poynting.physics.purdue.edu [128.210.146.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5695F14F30 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 20:35:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ajk@physics.purdue.edu) Received: from physics.purdue.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by poynting.physics.purdue.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id WAA28377 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 22:32:55 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from ajk@physics.purdue.edu) Message-Id: <199904160332.WAA28377@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Entombing for FreeBSD From: "Andrew J. Korty" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <28370.924233574.1@physics.purdue.edu> Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 22:32:55 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Here at the Physics Computer Network, we've been experimenting with building Kevin Braunsdorf's file entombing system into FreeBSD. Entombing is an ingenious facility that allows a mortal user to recover accidentally deleted or clobbered files. To make entombing work, we replace the C library wrappers for the system calls open(), rename(), truncate(), and unlink() (and creat() on systems that have it) with versions that archive the file in a repository before doing the bona fide syscall. Each filesystem with entombing support has its own repository, usually located in a subdirectory of the filesystem root called "tomb". This tomb is owned by a special pseudo-user (charon :-). The actual moving of the file is done by a setuid-charon executable so that the files may be chowned away from the user. Thus, the file (now called a "crypt") is no longer counted against the user's quota. A crypt is kept in its tomb for a duration inversely related to its size and the used space on the filesystem. The "preend" daemon is responsible for the task of purging old crypts. The setuid-charon "unrm" command allows users to list, purge, and restore crypts. Because files are given unique names when entombed, arbitrary versions of a file may be restored. Entombing can be configured and disabled by the user through the environment variable ENTOMB. We think entombing is an elegant solution for a very common problem. It saves users time because it makes most of their mistakes reversible. Systems administrators profit as well, since entombing allows them to avoid the time-consuming task of restoring files from tape. I can't remember the last restore I did! If this sounds like it would be worth committing, let me know, and we'll contrib the source patches. The only changes are the added code in src/contrib and changes to a few libc Makefiles. There are no kernel mods. Andrew J. Korty, Director http://www.physics.purdue.edu/~ajk/ Physics Computer Network 85 73 1F 04 63 D9 9D 65 Purdue University 65 2E 7A A8 81 8C 45 75 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 1:47:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alice.gba.oz.au (gba-254.tmx.com.au [203.9.155.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 9F67115382 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 01:47:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gjb-freebsd@gba.oz.au) Received: (qmail 17031 invoked by uid 1001); 15 Apr 1999 21:26:05 -0000 Message-ID: <19990415212605.17030.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au> X-Posted-By: GBA-Post 1.03 20-Sep-1998 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 5A91 6942 8CEA 9DAB B95B C249 1CE1 493B 2B5A CE30 Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 07:26:04 +1000 From: Greg Black To: Chuck Youse Cc: Avalon Books , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Programming Resources References: <99041411442200.24010@ns1.cybersites.com> In-reply-to: <99041411442200.24010@ns1.cybersites.com> of Wed, 14 Apr 1999 11:43:31 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > The O'Reilly called _Programming with Pthreads_ pretty much covers it all, as > FreeBSD uses a user-space pthreads implementation. The first print of this book was a disgrace. I know they fixed a lot of the blatant errors that I spotted when browsing it at a conference, but I have no comment on the value of the revised edition as I never got around to reviewing it. -- Greg Black To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 3:13:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from axis1.axis.de (mail.axis.de [194.163.241.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 100D315340 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 03:13:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chn@intego.de) Received: from vscanreal.axis.de (vscanreal.axis.de [195.180.213.22]) by axis1.axis.de (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA09343 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:10:42 +0200 (CEST) Received: from 194.163.241.15 by vscanreal.axis.de (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT) Received: from ep075.intego.de ([195.180.213.23]) by syslog.axis.de (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA23189 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:10:41 +0200 (CEST) Received: from intego.de (localhost.intego.de [127.0.0.1]) by ep075.intego.de (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id MAA04649 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:13:59 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from chn@ep075.intego.de) Message-Id: <199904161013.MAA04649@ep075.intego.de> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: KMOD and PPBUS Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:13:59 +0200 From: Christian Haan Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello, I want to write a kernel module which attaches to the ppbus. I have already written a driver which works much like the ppi driver. Now I would like to convert this driver into a module. First tests show that this seems possible but I don't quite understand the KMODDEPS functionality. Could someone out there enlighten me? Thanks, Christian -- ================================================================ Christian Haan Intego Plankensteiner Wagner Gbr Tel : +49-9131-691-3823 Am Weichselgarten 7 Fax : +49-9131-691-111 91058 Erlangen Email: chn@intego.de GERMANY ================================================================ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 4: 7:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from noc.demon.net (server.noc.demon.net [193.195.224.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 825BD153EB for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 04:07:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from geoffb@gti.noc.demon.net) Received: by noc.demon.net; id MAA02677; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:05:20 +0100 (BST) Received: from gti.noc.demon.net(195.11.55.101) by inside.noc.demon.net via smap (3.2) id xma002651; Fri, 16 Apr 99 12:05:07 +0100 Received: (from geoffb@localhost) by gti.noc.demon.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA02223 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:05:06 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <19990416120505.J3680@gti.noc.demon.net> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:05:05 +0100 From: Geoff Buckingham To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux Reply-To: Geoff Buckingham Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i Organisation: Demon Internet Ltd Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I believe the test would have had similar results even if the Linux install had been tuned: This isn't to say the test was fair however.... Anyone considering benchmarking FreeBSD (or Linux) with specweb or similar should remember the following. Apache is an entirely inappropriate choice of httpd for performance work, any good apache benchmarks you see will are likely to have been achieved running apache on a non standard port and a caching accelerator on port 80. The problem with apache is you will not get the big numbers you want from the tests because apache requires a process per client. For better results I would suggest zeus or thttpd. http://www.zeus.co.uk Anyone seriously persuing this may be able to get some help from zeus, including information on enabeling the use of sendfile with Zeus (maybe) http://www.acme.com thttpd is a nice open source httpd that people could base a performance httpd on. Basically you need to agressivly mmap the test data set, sendfile would be another nice addition. The next problem for FreeBSD is the giant lock, all your httpds want to push data through the system. My own preliminary work shows a performance drop when running SMP to benchmark apache. You burn most of your CPU spinning waiting on the giant lock. I am not sure how devolved linux's lock is, however this is likely to cause them problems too as everyting wants to use the network. There is no easy way round the above any serious benckmarking should perhaps initially be done uniprocesser. I have no knowledge of how the giant lock is likely to break down. Is it likely that individual interfaces may get ther own locks? If you do run SMP and have a single process httpd you will need multiple processes (unless it is threaded, avoid thread per client implimentations) :-) More general points. Specweb requires you to write full logs during the benchmark, you need stripped disks for this. Memory, you want to get your whole data set into memory. Network, you need a lot. For PCs you are probably best going for the 64bit Alteon nics.(Do they do checksumming yet?) TCP extensions, most of these are intended for WANs you should experiment with disabeling these. There is probably more i have forgotten..... -- GeoffB To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 4:25:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mercury.Sun.COM (mercury.Sun.COM [192.9.25.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC86614D45; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 04:25:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Dimitri.Tombroff@sun.com) Received: from France.Sun.COM ([129.157.188.1]) by mercury.Sun.COM (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) with SMTP id EAA10391; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 04:22:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sunchorus.france.sun.com by France.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4-sd.fkk205) id NAA05875; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:22:48 +0200 Received: from tumba.France.Sun.COM by sunchorus.france.sun.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id NAA17676; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:22:48 +0200 Received: from sun.com by tumba.France.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id NAA01856; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:18:18 +0200 Message-ID: <37171C7A.1D6F5A02@sun.com> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:18:18 +0200 From: Dimitri Tombroff Organization: Sun Microsystems X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (X11; U; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-net@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Default route for multicast IP addresses Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, It seems that all multicast IP addresses are associated to the default route. > route get 225.332.324.213 route to: 225.77.68.213 destination: default mask: default .... I can't see what part of the routing kernel code does that, or what initialisation utility/script configure the routing table to obtain that behavior, thanks for any help, Dimiti To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 4:25:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from jan-wc.jan.ne.jp (jan-wc.jan.ne.jp [202.235.10.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84127152A0; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 04:25:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from zinnia@jan.ne.jp) Received: from localhost (yone0010-117.jan.ne.jp [203.141.87.117]) by jan-wc.jan.ne.jp (8.8.8+2.7Wbeta7/3.7W) with ESMTP id UAA08044; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 20:22:40 +0900 Message-Id: <199904161122.UAA08044@jan-wc.jan.ne.jp> To: nox@jelal.kn-bremen.de Cc: tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports From: Tsuyoshi Iguchi In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 15 Apr 1999 20:33:07 +0200" <19990415203307.A33640@saturn.kn-bremen.de> References: <19990415203307.A33640@saturn.kn-bremen.de> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.93 on Emacs 19.34 / Mule 2.3 (SUETSUMUHANA) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 19:19:23 +0900 X-Dispatcher: imput version 980905(IM100) Lines: 19 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG From: Juergen Lock Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 20:33:07 +0200 > Hmm as 38.4kbps is > 31.25kbps, does the driver respect flow control > when sending? If CTS is off when the driver is about to sending, transfer is expected to be disabled by hardware. So THRE -- transmission holding register empty -- flag should be off, then the interrupt routine of the driver is forced to stop sending. ( Since I don't have much confidence about the hardware mechanism of sio, please point out any errors to me. ) ----- Tsuyoshi Iguchi (zinnia@jan.ne.jp) http://www.eie.yz.yamagata-u.ac.jp/~a95516/zinnia/index.shtml To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 5: 3: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from danberlin.resnet.rochester.edu (danberlin.resnet.rochester.edu [128.151.84.217]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 005F814E44; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 05:03:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@danberlin.resnet.rochester.edu) Received: from localhost (root@localhost) by danberlin.resnet.rochester.edu (980427.SGI.8.8.8/970903.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id HAA56114; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 07:52:48 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 07:52:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Super-User To: eagle Cc: Amancio Hasty , Gary Schrock , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, docs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Wouldn't have mattered in this case. The samba team's beef is that Mindcraft is that they changed the widelinks setting. What widelinks does is check to see where a symbolic link is going. Without it, if i put a symlink to / or whatever in the wrong dir, well then that person now has *full* access to my puter. As you would imagine, any smart samba admin changes the setting from the default, to avoid this (or has no symlinks anywhere on the system). You take a *large* performance hit though, as it adds a bunch of various calls. IMHO, this is the fault of the samba team. They claim it takes 6 extra chdir and such calls for every file access. I can't see the reason you'd need that many, or that they don't do something to alleviate the problem of checking every single link every single time. There was also a kernel bug in 2.2.2 that was fixed in 2.2.5 that would have a major impact on performance. Of course, the linux advocates don't seem to get the fact that just becuase your kernel is buggy, doesn't mean someone else screwed up in testing with it, since it was what was available at the time. You know, the whole "actually getting real work done" thing? Mindcraft also posted to a few usenet newsgroups asking why they were getting such abyssmal performance, and the tradition of the great helping linux community, they got no answer. I could understand complaints if they got the answer "The kernel you are using has a bug in it, here's a patch, or wait for a fix, or else you'll take a major performance hit". But they got no such answer. "Why didn't they use 2.0.36" i hear also. Well, because everyone and their grandmother said to upgrade to 2.2.0. After all, it is in the stable series, right? It should be, ya know, stable? Although Mindcraft's past tests make me weary, in this particular case, i don't see how they screwed up all that badly. --Dan On Thu, 15 Apr 1999, eagle wrote: > > > > CC'd docs > On Thu, 15 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > > > > > I am trying to suggest to plug the hole that got Linux into trouble : > > > > Tuning configuration documentation, sample harware configuration > > and software configuration for a high performance web server and > > preferred mailing list to contact for performance or tuning questions. > > > > The later is important for in the past people have posted on usenet > > and their queries have gone unanswered or worse they > > didn't know where to send their questions to . > > > > > This sounds like a great idea, freebsd tuning docs ... > > > rob > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 6: 9: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from thelab.hub.org (nat192.236.mpoweredpc.net [142.177.192.236]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCAAE15041 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 06:09:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from scrappy@hub.org) Received: from localhost (scrappy@localhost) by thelab.hub.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id KAA19259; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:03:03 -0300 (ADT) (envelope-from scrappy@hub.org) X-Authentication-Warning: thelab.hub.org: scrappy owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:03:03 -0300 (ADT) From: The Hermit Hacker To: Greg Lehey Cc: Joachim Isaksson , Luoqi Chen , Stephen McKay , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: <19990415193124.U23745@lemis.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG How much RAM can we support, max? On Thu, 15 Apr 1999, Greg Lehey wrote: > On Thursday, 15 April 1999 at 11:46:58 +0200, Joachim Isaksson wrote: > >>> 2) "The Linux kernel limited itself to use only 960 MB of RAM" > >> > >> The box had 4GB of RAM, but Linux got to use less than 1GB. Poor Linux. > >> This was such a fair test! :-( Do we recall a previous test where our > >> favourite OS used only a portion of the total RAM? > > > > Well, does Linux really limit itself to 960MB of RAM as they claim? > > If so, I'd say it's not an unfair test to not limit NT to the same low memory > > use. > > It looks as if they did. To quote > http://www.lwn.net/1999/features/MindCraft1.0.phtml, which I found to > be a well-reasoned summary, though I didn't check their reasoning: > > Non-issues > > A few complaints that have been sent to us probably do not > figure into the test results. We list them here in the hopes of > helping to slow their propagation and improve the quality of > information out there. > > Some complaints have been raised about the test being run on > a 4GB server, even though the Linux kernel, in its default > form, can only use 960M of that. Patches can be applied to > make 2GB available fairly easily. But, in any case, they > claim that NT was limited (with the maxmem parameter) to 1G > of memory, so this aspect of the test was fair. It would have > been more straightforward of them, however, to have simply > remove the other 3G from the system. > > Greg > -- > See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers > finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Marc G. Fournier ICQ#7615664 IRC Nick: Scrappy Systems Administrator @ hub.org primary: scrappy@hub.org secondary: scrappy@{freebsd|postgresql}.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 7:30:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu [18.24.4.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1831153FD; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 07:30:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wollman@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu) Received: (from wollman@localhost) by khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) id KAA25127; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:28:23 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from wollman) Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:28:23 -0400 (EDT) From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <199904161428.KAA25127@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> To: Dimitri Tombroff Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-net@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Default route for multicast IP addresses In-Reply-To: <37171C7A.1D6F5A02@sun.com> References: <37171C7A.1D6F5A02@sun.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG < said: > It seems that all multicast IP addresses are associated to the default > route. > I can't see what part of the routing kernel code does that, or what > initialisation utility/script > configure the routing table to obtain that behavior, The part that sets up a default route. A zero-bit-long mask matches all addresses -- that's what makes it a default route. If you want multicasts to go out some other interface, create a route specifically for them. -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame MIT, LCS, CRS, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 8: 8:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from axl.noc.iafrica.com (axl.noc.iafrica.com [196.31.1.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A92715109 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 08:08:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sheldonh@axl.noc.iafrica.com) Received: from sheldonh (helo=axl.noc.iafrica.com) by axl.noc.iafrica.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10YABU-000Cm4-00; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 17:05:36 +0200 From: Sheldon Hearn To: "Andrew J. Korty" Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Apr 1999 22:32:55 EST." <199904160332.WAA28377@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 17:05:36 +0200 Message-ID: <49107.924275136@axl.noc.iafrica.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 15 Apr 1999 22:32:55 EST, "Andrew J. Korty" wrote: > If this sounds like it would be worth committing, let me know, and > we'll contrib the source patches. The only changes are the added > code in src/contrib and changes to a few libc Makefiles. There > are no kernel mods. Sounds interesting. Why don't you let us know where we can pick up the patchset so that those of us who're keen can play around with it for a while. That's the best way of finding out whether something "would be worth committing". Ciao, Sheldon. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 8:10:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from poynting.physics.purdue.edu (poynting.physics.purdue.edu [128.210.146.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78CA91544B for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 08:10:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ajk@physics.purdue.edu) Received: from physics.purdue.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by poynting.physics.purdue.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id KAA00206; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:07:43 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from ajk@physics.purdue.edu) Message-Id: <199904161507.KAA00206@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> To: Sheldon Hearn Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD In-Reply-To: Message from Sheldon Hearn of "Fri, 16 Apr 1999 17:05:36 +0200." <49107.924275136@axl.noc.iafrica.com> From: "Andrew J. Korty" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <199.924275262.1@physics.purdue.edu> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:07:42 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > On Thu, 15 Apr 1999 22:32:55 EST, "Andrew J. Korty" wrote: > > > If this sounds like it would be worth committing, let me know, and > > we'll contrib the source patches. The only changes are the added > > code in src/contrib and changes to a few libc Makefiles. There > > are no kernel mods. > > Sounds interesting. Why don't you let us know where we can pick up the > patchset so that those of us who're keen can play around with it for a > while. That's the best way of finding out whether something "would be > worth committing". Should the patches be against -RELEASE, -STABLE, or -CURRENT? ajk To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 9:37:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ftp.dns.ne.jp (ftp.dns.ne.jp [210.155.3.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B62E4158E2; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 09:36:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tanimura@sakuramail.com) Received: from silver.carrots (yksk0203.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp [210.131.91.115]) by ftp.dns.ne.jp (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA07063; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 01:03:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by silver.carrots (8.9.3+3.1W/3.7W) with ESMTP id BAA43306; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 01:02:50 +0900 (JST) To: nox@jelal.kn-bremen.de Cc: tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp, zinnia@jan.ne.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-multimedia@freebsd.org Cc: Seigo TANIMURA Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports From: Seigo TANIMURA In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 15 Apr 1999 20:33:07 +0200" <19990415203307.A33640@saturn.kn-bremen.de> References: <19990415203307.A33640@saturn.kn-bremen.de> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.93 on Emacs 19.34 / Mule 2.3 (SUETSUMUHANA) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <19990417010250B.tanimura@sakuramail.com> Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 01:02:50 +0900 X-Dispatcher: imput version 980905(IM100) Lines: 34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG From: Juergen Lock Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 20:33:07 +0200 Message-ID: <19990415203307.A33640@saturn.kn-bremen.de> nox> > For the modules with serial interfaces(most modern ones like Roland SC-88 have): nox> > nox> > 38.4kbps nox> > PC ----------------------------- Midi Module nox> > Serial Cable for the Module nox> > nox> > I got to play sequences successfully under the situation shown above. nox> > I used SC-88, with a 'computer port'. It accepts the bitrates of both 31.25kbps nox> > and 38.4kbps, transforming the signal internally. You can plug some other nox> > midi modules and instruments to the module connected to the PC. In this case nox> > the module also acts as a midi interface. nox> nox> Has anyone tried things like sending a big sysex dump to something nox> connected there? I tried sending sysex messages to display some frames of picture on the LCD of SC-88. One frame takes 64 bytes. I sent sysex at around 6-8 frames/sec for 10 seconds. I had no latency to recognize, as I experienced on sbmidi. I have not tried bulk dumps yet. It takes about 20 secs for an SC-88 to dump the every single parameter, more than 60KB! Seigo TANIMURA |M2, Nakagawa Lab, Dept of Electronics & CS =========================|Faculty of Engineering, Yokohama National Univ Powered by SIEMENS, |http://www.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp/~tanimura/ FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT |http://www.sakura.ne.jp/~tcarrot/ (10th Apr 1999) & muesli.|tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp tcarrot@sakuramail.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 9:56:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from noc.demon.net (server.noc.demon.net [193.195.224.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B1C9215940 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 09:56:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fanf@demon.net) Received: by noc.demon.net; id RAA03848; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 17:54:01 +0100 (BST) Received: from fanf.noc.demon.net(195.11.55.83) by inside.noc.demon.net via smap (3.2) id xmaa03814; Fri, 16 Apr 99 17:53:55 +0100 Received: from fanf by fanf.noc.demon.net with local (Exim 1.73 #2) id 10YBsJ-00060v-00; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 17:53:55 +0100 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: Tony Finch Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: References: <19990415193124.U23745@lemis.com> Message-Id: Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 17:53:55 +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The Hermit Hacker wrote: > >How much RAM can we support, max? We have a machine using 3GB. Tony. -- f.a.n.finch dot@dotat.at fanf@demon.net Arthur: "Oh, that sounds better, have you worked out the controls?" Ford: "No, we just stopped playing with them." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 10: 0:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from implode.root.com (root.com [209.102.106.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5248E1541A for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:00:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@implode.root.com) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA22643; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 09:56:19 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904161656.JAA22643@implode.root.com> To: Tony Finch Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 16 Apr 1999 17:53:55 BST." From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 09:56:19 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >The Hermit Hacker wrote: >> >>How much RAM can we support, max? > >We have a machine using 3GB. With specialized tuning (which is what I do for a living these days :-)), FreeBSD can handle a full 4GB. -DG David Greenman Co-founder/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project - http://www.freebsd.org Creator of high-performance Internet servers - http://www.terasolutions.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 10: 5:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (castles509.castles.com [208.214.165.73]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10CC915A1B for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:05:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA02636; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:02:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904161702.KAA02636@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: dg@root.com Cc: Tony Finch , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 16 Apr 1999 09:56:19 PDT." <199904161656.JAA22643@implode.root.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:02:21 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > >The Hermit Hacker wrote: > >> > >>How much RAM can we support, max? > > > >We have a machine using 3GB. > > With specialized tuning (which is what I do for a living these days :-)), > FreeBSD can handle a full 4GB. Is that modulo the 64MB of physical space reserved for the PCI bus, or are we now doing the 36-bit physical address thing? -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 10:12: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E264B15962 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:12:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id CAA18460; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 02:08:52 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <37176E39.9EE36387@newsguy.com> Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 02:07:05 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Tony Finch Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux References: <19990415193124.U23745@lemis.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Tony Finch wrote: > > The Hermit Hacker wrote: > > > >How much RAM can we support, max? > > We have a machine using 3GB. It depends on tuning and patches. -current can presently support up to 4 Gb, but not 4 Gb precisely. I don't think this patch was merged into stable yet, but I think it is about time (specially given that the BSD/OS patch has been merged already). -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "Well, Windows works, using a loose definition of 'works'..." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 10:19:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from chiark.greenend.org.uk (chiark.greenend.org.uk [195.224.76.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE1CA15978 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:19:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fanf@chiark.greenend.org.uk) Received: from fanf by chiark.greenend.org.uk with local (Exim 2.02 #1) id 10YCEs-0004y6-00 (Debian); Fri, 16 Apr 1999 18:17:14 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <14103.28826.21231.85510@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 18:17:14 +0100 (BST) From: Tony Finch To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: <37176E39.9EE36387@newsguy.com> References: <19990415193124.U23745@lemis.com> <37176E39.9EE36387@newsguy.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.47 under Emacs 19.34.1 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Daniel C. Sobral writes: > Tony Finch wrote: > > > > The Hermit Hacker wrote: > > > > > >How much RAM can we support, max? > > > > We have a machine using 3GB. > > It depends on tuning and patches. -current can presently support up > to 4 Gb, but not 4 Gb precisely. I don't think this patch was merged > into stable yet, but I think it is about time (specially given that > the BSD/OS patch has been merged already). The machine in question is running 3.1-STABLE with the appropriate large memory patches added (excluding the BSDI compatibility one). I should note that we had stability problems under load when using the full 3GB, so the machine has MAXMEM set to 2GB. Tony. -- f.a.n.finch dot@dotat.at fanf@demon.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 10:26:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from repulse.cnchost.com (repulse.concentric.net [207.155.248.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D71CF15987 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:26:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from skoh@vixell.com) Received: from vixell.com ([207.82.123.131]) by repulse.cnchost.com (8.9.3/) id NAA04298; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:23:51 -0400 (EDT) [ConcentricHost SMTP Relay 1.5] Message-ID: <371772E9.CB787F71@vixell.com> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:27:05 -0700 From: "Steve W. Koh" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en,ko MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: subscribe freebsd-hackers Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG subscribe freebsd-hackers -- Steve W. Koh swkoh@usa.net 510-523-6606 x.424 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 10:45:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from implode.root.com (root.com [209.102.106.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE7C215970 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:45:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@implode.root.com) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA22807; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:40:29 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904161740.KAA22807@implode.root.com> To: Mike Smith Cc: Tony Finch , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:02:21 PDT." <199904161702.KAA02636@dingo.cdrom.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:40:29 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >> >The Hermit Hacker wrote: >> >> >> >>How much RAM can we support, max? >> > >> >We have a machine using 3GB. >> >> With specialized tuning (which is what I do for a living these days :-)), >> FreeBSD can handle a full 4GB. > >Is that modulo the 64MB of physical space reserved for the PCI bus, or >are we now doing the 36-bit physical address thing? Minus the PCI space. -DG David Greenman Co-founder/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project - http://www.freebsd.org Creator of high-performance Internet servers - http://www.terasolutions.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 11: 9:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from postoffice.sarnoff.com (postoffice.sarnoff.com [130.33.10.147]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21E6C159CB for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 11:09:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from amarks@sarnoff.com) Received: from sarnoff.com ([130.33.14.232]) by postoffice.sarnoff.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.5) with ESMTP id AAA2F1E; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 14:07:26 -0400 Message-ID: <37177C57.629E76AB@sarnoff.com> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 14:07:19 -0400 From: "AARON MARKS" Reply-To: amarks@sarnoff.com Organization: Sarnoff Corporation X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: RONALD MINNICH Subject: Memory-Based VFS Available Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The source for the memory-based vfs that I mentioned yesterday on this list is now available via anonymous ftp at: ftp.cis.upenn.edu:/pub/v9fs/v9fs.tgz Have at it and enjoy. There's an INSTALL doc for help installing and some other bits of information. Also, there's a tech doc, but it's incomplete and out of date. We welcome all feeback (ajmarks@seas.upenn.edu, rminnich@acl.lanl.gov). Thanks, -A. -- Aaron J. Marks Communications and Computing Systems Lab Assoc. Member Tech Staff Advanced Networks and Computation Group amarks@sarnoff.com Sarnoff Corporation To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 12: 2: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7FCC814EBE for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:01:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA92644; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 11:53:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904161853.LAA92644@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Geoff Buckingham Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: High Perfomance Web Page? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:05:05 BST." <19990416120505.J3680@gti.noc.demon.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 11:53:14 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, Your posting sounds really good any chance that you can create a web page to include such information ? -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 12: 3:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alice.gba.oz.au (gba-254.tmx.com.au [203.9.155.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id BBB7C14EBE for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:03:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gjb-freebsd@gba.oz.au) Received: (qmail 18606 invoked by uid 1001); 16 Apr 1999 11:37:34 -0000 Message-ID: <19990416113734.18605.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au> X-Posted-By: GBA-Post 1.03 20-Sep-1998 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 5A91 6942 8CEA 9DAB B95B C249 1CE1 493B 2B5A CE30 Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 21:37:33 +1000 From: Greg Black To: "Andrew J. Korty" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD References: <199904160332.WAA28377@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> In-reply-to: <199904160332.WAA28377@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> of Thu, 15 Apr 1999 22:32:55 EST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > We think entombing is an elegant solution for a very common problem. > It saves users time because it makes most of their mistakes > reversible. Systems administrators profit as well, since entombing > allows them to avoid the time-consuming task of restoring files > from tape. I can't remember the last restore I did! If we're restricting this to restoring lost files, I can't remember the last time I did that either. It was certainly more than 15 years ago. I don't use entombing. Can't see the point. -- Greg Black To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 12:58: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A446714D4A for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:58:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id MAA59781; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:55:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:55:37 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904161955.MAA59781@apollo.backplane.com> To: Greg Black Cc: "Andrew J. Korty" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD References: <199904160332.WAA28377@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> <19990416113734.18605.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> We think entombing is an elegant solution for a very common problem. :> It saves users time because it makes most of their mistakes :> reversible. Systems administrators profit as well, since entombing :> allows them to avoid the time-consuming task of restoring files :> from tape. I can't remember the last restore I did! : :If we're restricting this to restoring lost files, I can't :remember the last time I did that either. It was certainly more :than 15 years ago. I don't use entombing. Can't see the point. : :-- :Greg Black I've been thinking about this enombing thing... well, I hate to say it, but crowbaring into libc is *not* the right way to do it. It's just too intrusive. The right way to do it would be to write a device driver similar to NULLFS which handles backing up the files, thus giving the sysad the option to use such a device to mount-through those partitions that the sysad wants to keep checkpointed. Also, putting such intrusive code into libc would be fairly dangreous from a security point of view even if it is turned off. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 13: 9:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from poynting.physics.purdue.edu (poynting.physics.purdue.edu [128.210.146.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1042415A59 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:09:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ajk@physics.purdue.edu) Received: from physics.purdue.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by poynting.physics.purdue.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id PAA05648; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 15:06:47 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from ajk@physics.purdue.edu) Message-Id: <199904162006.PAA05648@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> To: Matthew Dillon Cc: Greg Black , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD In-Reply-To: Message from Matthew Dillon of "Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:55:37 MST." <199904161955.MAA59781@apollo.backplane.com> From: "Andrew J. Korty" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <5641.924293206.1@physics.purdue.edu> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 15:06:46 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I've been thinking about this enombing thing... well, I hate to > say it, but crowbaring into libc is *not* the right way to do > it. It's just too intrusive. The right way to do it would be > to write a device driver similar to NULLFS which handles backing > up the files, thus giving the sysad the option to use such a > device to mount-through those partitions that the sysad wants to > keep checkpointed. Also, putting such intrusive code into libc > would be fairly dangreous from a security point of view even if > it is turned off. > > -Matt > Matthew Dillon > That makes sense, but do stackable filesystems work properly in FreeBSD? I have many uses for the null and union filesystems, but they seem to tend to cause panics. ajk To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 13: 9:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from london.physics.purdue.edu (london.physics.purdue.edu [128.210.67.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C036015A99 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:09:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from csg@physics.purdue.edu) Received: from ohm.physics.purdue.edu (ohm.physics.purdue.edu [128.210.146.32]) by london.physics.purdue.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA21399; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 15:07:05 -0500 (EST) Received: (from csg@localhost) by ohm.physics.purdue.edu (8.9.2/8.9.2) id PAA01139; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 15:06:50 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from csg@physics.purdue.edu) Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 15:06:49 -0500 From: "C. Stephen Gunn" To: Greg Black Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD Message-ID: <19990416150649.A1060@ohm.physics.purdue.edu> References: <199904160332.WAA28377@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> <19990416113734.18605.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i In-Reply-To: <19990416113734.18605.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au>; from Greg Black on Fri, Apr 16, 1999 at 09:37:33PM +1000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Apr 16, 1999 at 09:37:33PM +1000, Greg Black wrote: > If we're restricting this to restoring lost files, I can't > remember the last time I did that either. It was certainly more > than 15 years ago. I don't use entombing. Can't see the point. It's not the last time _you_ had to restore a file that's the issue. If you've not had to do it for 15 years, entombing probably isn't for you. When was the last time you took care of 500+ users on a single machine. Users delete files. Users clobber files. Users intentionally make changes to files and then don't want them tomorrow. We have _serious_ users around here with serious needs. We have all of our important data on hardware RAID 5, and we still do nightly backups to DLT. DLT's are fast, but pulling one file off tape (which would happen) can take 45 minutes to an hour, even with good tools like Amanda. I don't really need entombing at home, but I sure take advange of it when I shoot myself in the foot. I guess that real UNIX studs don't ever do that, or apparently don't live to tell the story. The best part is if you don't like it, don't use it. ENTOMB=no, and you're completely screwed as usual when you delete a file. ;-) - Steve -- C. Stephen Gunn, Computer Systems Engineer Physics Computer Network, Purdue University To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 13:11:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB06915AB7 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:11:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id NAA59918; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:08:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:08:54 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904162008.NAA59918@apollo.backplane.com> To: "Andrew J. Korty" Cc: Greg Black , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD References: <199904162006.PAA05648@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> -Matt :> Matthew Dillon :> : :That makes sense, but do stackable filesystems work properly in :FreeBSD? I have many uses for the null and union filesystems, but :they seem to tend to cause panics. : :ajk Well, if you were to write one, you could make it work fairly easily. The *existing* VFS stacks are broken because they are not being maintained through the massive number of changes the VM system has gone through in the last few years, not because of some sort of basic problem with the VFS layering. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 13:28:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kalypso.cybercom.net (kalypso.cybercom.net [209.21.136.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E87A414CCE for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:28:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ksmm@threespace.com) Received: from localhost (ksmm@localhost) by kalypso.cybercom.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id QAA12899 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 16:26:21 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 16:26:18 -0400 (EDT) From: The Classiest Man Alive X-Sender: ksmm@kalypso.cybercom.net To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <199904161955.MAA59781@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG For that matter, does it offer anything that a set of intelligent scripts/wrappers for common destructive commands wouldn't give you? --K.S. On Fri, 16 Apr 1999, Matthew Dillon wrote: : I've been thinking about this enombing thing... well, I hate to say it, : but crowbaring into libc is *not* the right way to do it. It's : just too intrusive. The right way to do it would be to write a device : driver similar to NULLFS which handles backing up the files, thus giving : the sysad the option to use such a device to mount-through those partitions : that the sysad wants to keep checkpointed. Also, putting such intrusive : code into libc would be fairly dangreous from a security point of view : even if it is turned off. : : -Matt : Matthew Dillon : To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 13:40:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E9B014E44 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:40:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id NAA60139; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:38:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:38:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904162038.NAA60139@apollo.backplane.com> To: "C. Stephen Gunn" Cc: Greg Black , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD References: <199904160332.WAA28377@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> <19990416113734.18605.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au> <19990416150649.A1060@ohm.physics.purdue.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :On Fri, Apr 16, 1999 at 09:37:33PM +1000, Greg Black wrote: : :> If we're restricting this to restoring lost files, I can't :> remember the last time I did that either. It was certainly more :> than 15 years ago. I don't use entombing. Can't see the point. : :It's not the last time _you_ had to restore a file that's the issue. :If you've not had to do it for 15 years, entombing probably isn't :for you. : :When was the last time you took care of 500+ users on a single :machine. Users delete files. Users clobber files. Users intentionally :make changes to files and then don't want them tomorrow. : :We have _serious_ users around here with serious needs. We have :all of our important data on hardware RAID 5, and we still do :nightly backups to DLT. DLT's are fast, but pulling one file off :tape (which would happen) can take 45 minutes to an hour, even with :good tools like Amanda. : :I don't really need entombing at home, but I sure take advange of :it when I shoot myself in the foot. I guess that real UNIX studs :don't ever do that, or apparently don't live to tell the story. : :The best part is if you don't like it, don't use it. ENTOMB=no, :and you're completely screwed as usual when you delete a file. ;-) : : - Steve :-- :C. Stephen Gunn, Computer Systems Engineer :Physics Computer Network, Purdue University I completely agree in regards to having to manage machines with a large number of users. There have been many times at BEST where I would have loved such a feature. *But* ( don't you hate buts? ) ... the right place to put this sort of feature is not in libc, but as a filesystem layer. Of course, that brings up the argument 'well, wouldn't it be better to have at least some form of entombing vs nothing at all?'.... The answer to that is not necessarily yes. I think that messing around with libc in this manner is just too much of a hack and not appropriate for a commit. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 13:49:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail4.aracnet.com (mail4.aracnet.com [205.159.88.46]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF1A51598B for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:49:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from beattie@aracnet.com) Received: from shell2.aracnet.com (IDENT:1728@shell2.aracnet.com [205.159.88.20]) by mail4.aracnet.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id NAA26529; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:47:04 -0700 Received: from localhost by shell2.aracnet.com (8.8.7) id NAA28881; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:47:04 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: shell2.aracnet.com: beattie owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:47:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Brian Beattie To: "C. Stephen Gunn" Cc: Greg Black , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <19990416150649.A1060@ohm.physics.purdue.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 16 Apr 1999, C. Stephen Gunn wrote: > On Fri, Apr 16, 1999 at 09:37:33PM +1000, Greg Black wrote: > > > If we're restricting this to restoring lost files, I can't > > remember the last time I did that either. It was certainly more > > than 15 years ago. I don't use entombing. Can't see the point. > > It's not the last time _you_ had to restore a file that's the issue. > If you've not had to do it for 15 years, entombing probably isn't > for you. > > When was the last time you took care of 500+ users on a single > machine. Users delete files. Users clobber files. Users intentionally > make changes to files and then don't want them tomorrow. > > We have _serious_ users around here with serious needs. We have > all of our important data on hardware RAID 5, and we still do > nightly backups to DLT. DLT's are fast, but pulling one file off > tape (which would happen) can take 45 minutes to an hour, even with > good tools like Amanda. > I am philosophically opposed to this type of feature, I believe it promotes slovenly work habits. On the other hand as a practical matter it would probably save a lot of time, when dealing with non-professionals. I would also agree that libc hacking is a poor route. I'm waiting until secondary storage becomes compact and cheap so that we can keep all versions of all files indefinitely :) I predict that if *BSD and Linux implement this feature, MS will introduce a similar feature within 6mos and announce it as a new MS inovation, under development for 15 years, unavailable on any other OS. Brian Beattie | The only problem with beattie@aracnet.com | winning the rat race ... www.aracnet.com/~beattie | in the end you're still a rat To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 13:51:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wopr.caltech.edu (wopr.caltech.edu [131.215.240.222]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 589D3159C4 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:51:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mph@wopr.caltech.edu) Received: (from mph@localhost) by wopr.caltech.edu (8.9.2/8.9.1) id NAA43009; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:48:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mph) Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:48:46 -0700 From: Matthew Hunt To: The Classiest Man Alive Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD Message-ID: <19990416134846.A42425@wopr.caltech.edu> References: <199904161955.MAA59781@apollo.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: ; from The Classiest Man Alive on Fri, Apr 16, 1999 at 04:26:18PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Apr 16, 1999 at 04:26:18PM -0400, The Classiest Man Alive wrote: > For that matter, does it offer anything that a set of intelligent > scripts/wrappers for common destructive commands wouldn't give you? I hardly ever lose data. I don't alias rm or cp or mv or anything else, I'm just good at typing what I mean. But on the rare occasions that I do lose data, it's almost always because I overwrite a file inside an application or something like that, which aliasing commands wouldn't help with. I think the technology under discussion here does preserve overwritten data and would help. Matt, backing up as he types this. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 13:56:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from london.physics.purdue.edu (london.physics.purdue.edu [128.210.67.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D0C5159C4 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:56:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from csg@physics.purdue.edu) Received: from ohm.physics.purdue.edu (ohm.physics.purdue.edu [128.210.146.32]) by london.physics.purdue.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA24509; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 15:54:22 -0500 (EST) Received: (from csg@localhost) by ohm.physics.purdue.edu (8.9.2/8.9.2) id PAA01307; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 15:54:07 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from csg@physics.purdue.edu) Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 15:54:07 -0500 From: "C. Stephen Gunn" To: The Classiest Man Alive Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD Message-ID: <19990416155407.A1158@ohm.physics.purdue.edu> References: <199904161955.MAA59781@apollo.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i In-Reply-To: ; from The Classiest Man Alive on Fri, Apr 16, 1999 at 04:26:18PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Apr 16, 1999 at 04:26:18PM -0400, The Classiest Man Alive wrote: > For that matter, does it offer anything that a set of intelligent > scripts/wrappers for common destructive commands wouldn't give you? Well. It's in libc, so it works for all binaries that are dynamically linked against libc. We had someone around here debate its advantages to an alias for rm that moves files into /tmp. Ugh! From AJK's website: http://www.physics.purdue.edu/~ajk/projects.html > ... we replace the C library wrappers for the system calls open(), > rename(), truncate(), and unlink() (and creat() on systems that > have it) with versions that archive the file in a repository before > doing the bona fide syscall. - Steve -- C. Stephen Gunn, Computer Systems Engineer Physics Computer Network, Purdue University To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 14: 3:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from london.physics.purdue.edu (london.physics.purdue.edu [128.210.67.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4CB4159C9 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 14:03:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from csg@physics.purdue.edu) Received: from ohm.physics.purdue.edu (ohm.physics.purdue.edu [128.210.146.32]) by london.physics.purdue.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA25079; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 16:00:50 -0500 (EST) Received: (from csg@localhost) by ohm.physics.purdue.edu (8.9.2/8.9.2) id QAA01333; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 16:00:35 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from csg@physics.purdue.edu) Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 16:00:35 -0500 From: "C. Stephen Gunn" To: Matthew Dillon Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD Message-ID: <19990416160035.B1158@ohm.physics.purdue.edu> References: <199904160332.WAA28377@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> <19990416113734.18605.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au> <19990416150649.A1060@ohm.physics.purdue.edu> <199904162038.NAA60139@apollo.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i In-Reply-To: <199904162038.NAA60139@apollo.backplane.com>; from Matthew Dillon on Fri, Apr 16, 1999 at 01:38:27PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Apr 16, 1999 at 01:38:27PM -0700, Matthew Dillon wrote: > *But* ( don't you hate buts? ) ... the right place to put this sort of > feature is not in libc, but as a filesystem layer. Of course, that > brings up the argument 'well, wouldn't it be better to have at least some > form of entombing vs nothing at all?'.... The answer to that is not > necessarily yes. I think that messing around with libc in this manner > is just too much of a hack and not appropriate for a commit. This solution works on lots of architectures. A VFS layer is specifically for FreeBSD. Perhaps that is the correct place to put it in FreeBSD. This solution was originally written to run on many flavors of UNIX. Including SunOS, NeXTStep, FreeBSD, Linux, and even Dynix. It's flexible. I wish the entire world ran FreeBSD, but it doesn't. Andy and I can't even get our entire world to run FreeBSD. We've got Irix, SunOS, TitanOS, AIX, NeXT, and Linux to deal with. Can I get the source to write VFS layers for all of those as well? (It's fun to argue about *BUTS* ) - Steve -- C. Stephen Gunn, Computer Systems Engineer Physics Computer Network, Purdue University To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 21:39:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail1.atl.bellsouth.net (mail1.atl.bellsouth.net [205.152.0.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D511014ED2 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 21:39:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wghicks@bellsouth.net) Received: from wghicks.bellsouth.net (host-209-214-75-63.atl.bellsouth.net [209.214.75.63]) by mail1.atl.bellsouth.net (8.8.8-spamdog/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA18713; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 00:35:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from wghicks (wghicks@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by wghicks.bellsouth.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id AAA07152; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 00:37:08 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net) Message-Id: <199904170437.AAA07152@bellsouth.net> To: Matthew Dillon Cc: "Andrew J. Korty" , Greg Black , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 16 Apr 1999 13:08:54 PDT." <199904162008.NAA59918@apollo.backplane.com> Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 00:37:08 -0400 From: W Gerald Hicks Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > The *existing* VFS stacks are broken because they are not being maintained > through the massive number of changes the VM system has gone through in > the last few years, not because of some sort of basic problem with the > VFS layering. Eivind seems to have some interesting work towards the goal of making these functional for contemporary FreeBSD. Anybody else have any spare machines available for testing? I don't :-( Cheers, Jerry Hicks wghicks@bellsouth.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 16 22:58:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mx.nsu.ru (mx.nsu.ru [193.124.215.71]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 690321519A for ; Fri, 16 Apr 1999 22:57:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fjoe@iclub.nsu.ru) Received: from iclub.nsu.ru (fjoe@iclub.nsu.ru [193.124.222.66]) by mx.nsu.ru (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id MAA27401; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 12:53:15 +0700 (NOVST) Received: from localhost (fjoe@localhost) by iclub.nsu.ru (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA06262; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 12:53:02 +0700 (NSS) Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 12:53:01 +0700 (NSS) From: Max Khon To: W Gerald Hicks Cc: Matthew Dillon , "Andrew J. Korty" , Greg Black , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <199904170437.AAA07152@bellsouth.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hi, there! On Sat, 17 Apr 1999, W Gerald Hicks wrote: > > The *existing* VFS stacks are broken because they are not being maintained > > through the massive number of changes the VM system has gone through in > > the last few years, not because of some sort of basic problem with the > > VFS layering. > > Eivind seems to have some interesting work towards the goal of > making these functional for contemporary FreeBSD. > > Anybody else have any spare machines available for testing? > > I don't :-( I have two /fjoe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 17 5: 4:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alice.gba.oz.au (gba-254.tmx.com.au [203.9.155.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 2CAE5151ED for ; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 05:04:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gjb-freebsd@gba.oz.au) Received: (qmail 22987 invoked by uid 1001); 17 Apr 1999 11:48:14 -0000 Message-ID: <19990417114814.22986.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au> X-Posted-By: GBA-Post 1.03 20-Sep-1998 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 5A91 6942 8CEA 9DAB B95B C249 1CE1 493B 2B5A CE30 Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 21:48:14 +1000 From: Greg Black To: "C. Stephen Gunn" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD References: <199904160332.WAA28377@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> <19990416113734.18605.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au> <19990416150649.A1060@ohm.physics.purdue.edu> In-reply-to: <19990416150649.A1060@ohm.physics.purdue.edu> of Fri, 16 Apr 1999 15:06:49 EST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > If we're restricting this to restoring lost files, I can't > > remember the last time I did that either. It was certainly more > > than 15 years ago. I don't use entombing. Can't see the point. > > It's not the last time _you_ had to restore a file that's the issue. For me, it *is* the point. I'm the person who would be restoring files for all the users on my networks and for all the users on my customers' networks. > If you've not had to do it for 15 years, entombing probably isn't > for you. Indeed. But I don't think it's desirable for anybody in the way you have proposed, and I was (and still am) arguing against that. > When was the last time you took care of 500+ users on a single > machine. Is this supposed to mean something? What makes you imagine that you know anything at all about what I do? If it matters, which it doesn't, I have regularly taken care of many hundreds of users on individual systems; and I do have some practical experience with what that means. But I don't think this should degenerate into one of those "mine is bigger than yours" things. > Users delete files. Users clobber files. Users intentionally > make changes to files and then don't want them tomorrow. Users can be trained, no matter what anybody claims to the contrary. Users who are so difficult to train that it doesn't seem to be worth the effort rarely have to be let loose with tools that can delete files, but can be accommodated within some GUI interface to the company database or whatever it is they do. > We have _serious_ users around here with serious needs. My users are serious. Their needs are serious. Their data is precious, both to them and to their customers. I go to great lengths to ensure that their data is not in danger. And those efforts are successful, as I indicated in my initial response. > The best part is if you don't like it, don't use it. ENTOMB=no, > and you're completely screwed as usual when you delete a file. ;-) Ah, no -- that's not what you have presented to us. You're talking about hacking this thing into libc where it will affect every program in the world, to provide a facility that would have been invented a million years ago if it was really useful. If you can dream up a way to provide it *without* affecting all those people who don't want it, then I would have no objection. But if it has to be via a hack to libc, then I trust that the decision makers in the FreeBSD team will choose not to commit it to the standard system. -- Greg Black To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 17 5: 5: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alice.gba.oz.au (gba-254.tmx.com.au [203.9.155.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 3E7DB151EE for ; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 05:04:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gjb-freebsd@gba.oz.au) Received: (qmail 23044 invoked by uid 1001); 17 Apr 1999 11:52:14 -0000 Message-ID: <19990417115214.23043.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au> X-Posted-By: GBA-Post 1.03 20-Sep-1998 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 5A91 6942 8CEA 9DAB B95B C249 1CE1 493B 2B5A CE30 Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 21:52:14 +1000 From: Greg Black To: Matthew Dillon Cc: "Andrew J. Korty" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD References: <199904160332.WAA28377@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> <19990416113734.18605.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au> <199904161955.MAA59781@apollo.backplane.com> In-reply-to: <199904161955.MAA59781@apollo.backplane.com> of Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:55:37 MST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matthew Dillon writes: > I've been thinking about this enombing thing... well, I hate to say it, > but crowbaring into libc is *not* the right way to do it. It's > just too intrusive. The right way to do it would be to write a device > driver similar to NULLFS which handles backing up the files, thus giving > the sysad the option to use such a device to mount-through those partitions > that the sysad wants to keep checkpointed. Also, putting such intrusive > code into libc would be fairly dangreous from a security point of view > even if it is turned off. I am completely in agreement with this. It's not something for libc and it needs to be kept at arm's length from everything else if it's ever to be part of the core of FreeBSD. -- Greg Black To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 17 6:25: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from axl.noc.iafrica.com (axl.noc.iafrica.com [196.31.1.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 607D115205 for ; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 06:24:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sheldonh@axl.noc.iafrica.com) Received: from sheldonh (helo=axl.noc.iafrica.com) by axl.noc.iafrica.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10YV31-0003Dr-00; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 15:22:15 +0200 From: Sheldon Hearn To: "Andrew J. Korty" Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:07:42 EST." <199904161507.KAA00206@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 15:22:15 +0200 Message-ID: <12390.924355335@axl.noc.iafrica.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:07:42 EST, "Andrew J. Korty" wrote: > Should the patches be against -RELEASE, -STABLE, or -CURRENT? As recent a CURRENT as is convenient for you. :-) Ciao, Sheldon. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 17 6:57: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (blaubaer.kn-bremen.de [194.94.232.249]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B111515185; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 06:57:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nox@saturn.kn-bremen.de) Received: from saturn.kn-bremen.de (uucp@localhost) by blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (8.9.1/8.9.1) with UUCP id PAA08837; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 15:50:22 +0200 Received: (from nox@localhost) by saturn.kn-bremen.de (8.9.3/8.8.5) id NAA40402; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 13:37:07 +0200 (MET DST) From: Juergen Lock Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 13:37:07 +0200 To: Seigo TANIMURA Cc: zinnia@jan.ne.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports Message-ID: <19990417133707.A39454@saturn.kn-bremen.de> References: <19990415203307.A33640@saturn.kn-bremen.de> <19990417010250B.tanimura@sakuramail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <19990417010250B.tanimura@sakuramail.com>; from Seigo TANIMURA on Sat, Apr 17, 1999 at 01:02:50AM +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, Apr 17, 1999 at 01:02:50AM +0900, Seigo TANIMURA wrote: > From: Juergen Lock > Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports > Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 20:33:07 +0200 > Message-ID: <19990415203307.A33640@saturn.kn-bremen.de> > > nox> > For the modules with serial interfaces(most modern ones like Roland SC-88 have): > nox> > > nox> > 38.4kbps > nox> > PC ----------------------------- Midi Module > nox> > Serial Cable for the Module > nox> > > nox> > I got to play sequences successfully under the situation shown above. > nox> > I used SC-88, with a 'computer port'. It accepts the bitrates of both 31.25kbps > nox> > and 38.4kbps, transforming the signal internally. You can plug some other > nox> > midi modules and instruments to the module connected to the PC. In this case > nox> > the module also acts as a midi interface. > nox> > nox> Has anyone tried things like sending a big sysex dump to something > nox> connected there? > > > I tried sending sysex messages to display some frames of picture on the LCD of SC-88. > One frame takes 64 bytes. I sent sysex at around 6-8 frames/sec for 10 seconds. > I had no latency to recognize, as I experienced on sbmidi. I thought about that as a means to test flow control, for that I'd guess you have to hook someting up on the SC-88's midi port and send _it_ something big. OTOH maybe even that won't be enough, RAM is cheap today and who knows how big a buffer the SC-88 has... Regards, -- Juergen Lock To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 17 9:30:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from london.physics.purdue.edu (london.physics.purdue.edu [128.210.67.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A1CF14C0B for ; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 09:30:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from csg@physics.purdue.edu) Received: from ohm.physics.purdue.edu (ohm.physics.purdue.edu [128.210.146.32]) by london.physics.purdue.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA27857; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 11:27:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (from csg@localhost) by ohm.physics.purdue.edu (8.9.2/8.9.2) id LAA06616; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 11:27:34 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from csg@physics.purdue.edu) Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 11:27:34 -0500 From: "C. Stephen Gunn" To: Greg Black Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD Message-ID: <19990417112734.A6483@ohm.physics.purdue.edu> References: <199904160332.WAA28377@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> <19990416113734.18605.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au> <19990416150649.A1060@ohm.physics.purdue.edu> <19990417114814.22986.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i In-Reply-To: <19990417114814.22986.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au>; from Greg Black on Sat, Apr 17, 1999 at 09:48:14PM +1000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, Apr 17, 1999 at 09:48:14PM +1000, Greg Black wrote: > Indeed. But I don't think it's desirable for anybody in the way > you have proposed, and I was (and still am) arguing against that. Thats fine. :-) > Is this supposed to mean something? What makes you imagine that > you know anything at all about what I do? If it matters, which > it doesn't, I have regularly taken care of many hundreds of > users on individual systems; and I do have some practical > experience with what that means. But I don't think this should > degenerate into one of those "mine is bigger than yours" things. I didn't mean for it to. Apparently, from your description, our environments are very different. As you describe, your users are using GUI's and interfaces to large databases. Some of mine use FreeBSD Boxes, NCD X11 terminals, some use freaking Wyse Terminals at 19,200 baud. They all telnet/ssh into several central machines. > Users can be trained, no matter what anybody claims to the > contrary. Users who are so difficult to train that it doesn't > seem to be worth the effort rarely have to be let loose with > tools that can delete files, but can be accommodated within some > GUI interface to the company database or whatever it is they do. My users are professors of physics, with egos the size of Manhattan (some days). The average age of prof in our department is something like 62. We've got secretaries, and the "business" side of the department, alas, runs on Windows. But on the academic side of our department, we have 500 people who do their real work with vi/emacs and LaTeX. They're the first to balk at the fact that they need training, and the first to demand that they get that deleted file back. We have 3 computer staff, for 500+ people in our department. That's to manage a network of over 700 nodes. My job entails everything from filling the papers with printer, to debugging Fortran code, to troubleshooting the network, to restoring files. Again, we back up 100G of disk every night to DLT from 20 or so hosts on our network. We even have a DLT Changer to change the tapes for us. The average "restore" takes 45 minutes, assuming the person who wants/needs a file back knows when they last had it. If it's a directory it could take 1.5 hours or so to do Level 0,1,2,3 restore. > Ah, no -- that's not what you have presented to us. You're > talking about hacking this thing into libc where it will affect > every program in the world, to provide a facility that would > have been invented a million years ago if it was really useful. I didn't present it, but I'm familiar with it, so I'm contributing. The code, yes in libc (right now), checks the environment before doing the deed. Actually it checks a glob pattern to be precise. As far as "really useful" and long times, I will direct you to the USENIX paper presented at the 1989 Winter conference by Matthew Bradburn of Purdue University. The original implementation used RPC, and it was re-implemented by Kevin Braunsdorf at Purdue sometime thereafter. This has been in production at Purdue University for nearly 10 years. This has been in production on FreeBSD (2.x/3.x) for nearly 2 years here at the Department of Physics. I will try to get the paper and some documentation into HTML and online, and post a link when I do. > If you can dream up a way to provide it *without* affecting all > those people who don't want it, then I would have no objection. > But if it has to be via a hack to libc, then I trust that the > decision makers in the FreeBSD team will choose not to commit it > to the standard system. I would argue that _if_ this is accepted to FreeBSD, it should be off by default, and documented ala FTPD_INTERNAL_LS in make.conf. If you want it, build it into the system. Even if it is there, there are plenty of ways to get it turned off for a user, or the entire system as a whole (if you want). Let us get the patches/documentation prepared so that people can look at the internals and how it works. - Steve -- C. Stephen Gunn, Computer Systems Engineer Physics Computer Network, Purdue University To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 17 11:47:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BE6515205 for ; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 11:47:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id LAA75452; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 11:44:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 11:44:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904171844.LAA75452@apollo.backplane.com> To: David Greenman Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Directories not VMIO cached at all! Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've been playing with my new large-memory configured box and, especially, looking at disk I/O. When I scan enough directories ( e.g. a megabyte worth of directories on a 1 GB machine), then scan again, the data is re-fetched from disk. I was under the impression that large directories were B_VMIO'd, while small ones are B_MALLOC'd in the buffer cache. But I've examined the code, and I do not believe directories are being B_VMIO'd at all! This means that the device blocks backing directories must fit within the malloc-only portion of the buffer cache. I think it would be worthwhile to VMIO directories as well as regular files. In fact, I think that it would be worthwhile to VMIO directories whether they are large or small - small directories will wind up in the namei cache allowing the VMIO backing to be freed up. Plus it is possible that a system might have thousands of small directories, and hey - we might as well use available memory to cache the ones for which the namei lookup misses ( like news related dirs ). Right now, the buffer cache appears to limit itself to 8 MBytes or so, and the maximum malloc space limits itself to only 400K! Rather absurdly small for a directory cache, I think, yet I also believe that increasing the size of the buffer cache may be detrimental due to the amount of I/O it can bind up. The buffer cache is really designed to deal with I/O and has the side effect of caching block mappings. It isn't really designed to cache things long term. If we VMIO directories, the buffer cache becomes truely transparent ( i.e. everything related to a filesystem is VMIO'd and thus backed by the VM cache ). If I understand the problem correctly, doing this should be as simple as allowing VDIR vnode types to be object-backed, as per the patch below. I would appreciate it if DG could look into this. I've applied the below patch to my 1G machine and it seems to work - my disk I/O has gone pretty much to zero. I think the performance benefits are there. The only question is whether losing malloc-caching for small directories is a win or a lose in regards to namei hits allowing VMIO-backed small directories to be freed from the VM cache. -Matt Index: kern/vfs_subr.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/sys/kern/vfs_subr.c,v retrieving revision 1.189 diff -u -r1.189 vfs_subr.c --- vfs_subr.c 1999/03/12 02:24:56 1.189 +++ vfs_subr.c 1999/04/17 18:35:56 @@ -2574,12 +2574,12 @@ vm_object_t object; int error = 0; - if ((vp->v_type != VREG) && (vp->v_type != VBLK)) + if ((vp->v_type != VREG) && (vp->v_type != VBLK) && (vp->v_type != VDIR)) return 0; retry: if ((object = vp->v_object) == NULL) { - if (vp->v_type == VREG) { + if (vp->v_type == VREG || vp->v_type == VDIR) { if ((error = VOP_GETATTR(vp, &vat, cred, p)) != 0) goto retn; object = vnode_pager_alloc(vp, vat.va_size, 0, 0); Index: kern/vfs_lookup.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/sys/kern/vfs_lookup.c,v retrieving revision 1.33 diff -u -r1.33 vfs_lookup.c --- vfs_lookup.c 1999/01/28 00:57:47 1.33 +++ vfs_lookup.c 1999/04/17 18:35:56 @@ -163,7 +163,7 @@ else cnp->cn_flags |= HASBUF; - if (ndp->ni_vp && ndp->ni_vp->v_type == VREG && + if (ndp->ni_vp && (ndp->ni_vp->v_type == VREG || ndp->ni_vp->v_type == VDIR) && (cnp->cn_nameiop != DELETE) && ((cnp->cn_flags & (NOOBJ|LOCKLEAF)) == LOCKLEAF)) @@ -687,7 +687,7 @@ if (!wantparent) vrele(dvp); - if (dp->v_type == VREG && + if ((dp->v_type == VREG || dp->v_type == VDIR) && ((cnp->cn_flags & (NOOBJ|LOCKLEAF)) == LOCKLEAF)) vfs_object_create(dp, cnp->cn_proc, cnp->cn_cred); Index: kern/vfs_syscalls.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/sys/kern/vfs_syscalls.c,v retrieving revision 1.121 diff -u -r1.121 vfs_syscalls.c --- vfs_syscalls.c 1999/03/23 14:26:40 1.121 +++ vfs_syscalls.c 1999/04/17 18:35:58 @@ -1012,7 +1012,7 @@ vn_lock(vp, LK_EXCLUSIVE | LK_RETRY, p); fp->f_flag |= FHASLOCK; } - if ((vp->v_type == VREG) && (vp->v_object == NULL)) + if ((vp->v_type == VREG || vp->v_type == VDIR) && (vp->v_object == NULL)) vfs_object_create(vp, p, p->p_ucred); VOP_UNLOCK(vp, 0, p); p->p_retval[0] = indx; Index: kern/vfs_vnops.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/sys/kern/vfs_vnops.c,v retrieving revision 1.65 diff -u -r1.65 vfs_vnops.c --- vfs_vnops.c 1999/04/04 21:41:17 1.65 +++ vfs_vnops.c 1999/04/17 18:35:58 @@ -171,7 +171,7 @@ /* * Make sure that a VM object is created for VMIO support. */ - if (vp->v_type == VREG) { + if (vp->v_type == VREG || vp->v_type == VDIR) { if ((error = vfs_object_create(vp, p, cred)) != 0) goto bad; } To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 17 13:52:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (blaubaer.kn-bremen.de [194.94.232.249]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B95B714CA2 for ; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 13:52:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nox@saturn.kn-bremen.de) Received: from saturn.kn-bremen.de (uucp@localhost) by blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (8.9.1/8.9.1) with UUCP id WAA18067 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 22:45:42 +0200 Received: (from nox@localhost) by saturn.kn-bremen.de (8.9.3/8.8.5) id WAA58982 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 22:45:34 +0200 (MET DST) From: Juergen Lock Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 22:45:34 +0200 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: strange things happening while trying to update ports/emulators/wine, could use some help... Message-ID: <19990417224534.A55834@saturn.kn-bremen.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Using the patches below, and after updating to 3.1-stable, I can get freecell to run again, but only that: using its help menu (normally starts winhelp) still makes it die. But first what happened: 1. configure hangs in: checking whether external symbols need an underscore prefix... and checking whether assembler accepts .string... if i type ^D (EOF) it continues. both checks assemble .s files and ktrace'ing reveals they hang in as in a read() from stdin. they didn't hang on 2.2.8-stable. 2. an ELF wine (the aout executable built on 2.2.8-stable `worked' as described above) dies on the first call to malloc() (SIGSEGV in .cerror called from .cbrk called from malloc if i remember right), it even dies in malloc if i call that as the first thing in main(). huh!?? :) and when i want to debug that and link libc static (explicit /usr/lib/libc.a in the Makefiles link line), it works again. other ports i built since the 3.1 upgrade and everything else thats ELF and uses libc.so.3 still runs so it (libc) can't be completely broken on my system... 3. exiting wine always gives: wine in free(): warning: junk pointer, too high to make sense. but that could also be a bug in wine of course. Oh and about the fist insn in miscemu/emulate.c: i figured it is needed for the TRACE line below it only so i simply disabled both, for now. The diffs are against the current wine port in the tree. Removed files: patches/patch-ar, new files: patches/patch-thread* If you leave out patches/patch-thread3-elf you can build it on 2.2.8-stable as i first did, but to try out win32 code you'll need 3.1-stable (or maybe -release also works, i don't know. I also don't know about -current, sorry) cvs diff: Diffing . Index: Makefile =================================================================== RCS file: /home/cvs/cvs/ports/emulators/wine/Makefile,v retrieving revision 1.69 diff -u -r1.69 Makefile --- Makefile 1999/02/20 00:08:36 1.69 +++ Makefile 1999/04/11 20:25:49 @@ -6,9 +6,9 @@ # $Id: Makefile,v 1.69 1999/02/20 00:08:36 se Exp $ # -DATE= 990214 +DATE= 990328 DISTNAME= Wine-${DATE} -PKGNAME= wine-99.02.14 +PKGNAME= wine-99.03.28 CATEGORIES= emulators MASTER_SITES= ${MASTER_SITE_SUNSITE} MASTER_SITE_SUBDIR= ALPHA/wine/development @@ -19,6 +19,7 @@ WRKSRC= ${WRKDIR}/wine-${DATE} GNU_CONFIGURE= yes +USE_AUTOCONF= yes MAN1= wine.1 pre-configure: cvs diff: Diffing files Index: files/md5 =================================================================== RCS file: /home/cvs/cvs/ports/emulators/wine/files/md5,v retrieving revision 1.45 diff -u -r1.45 md5 --- md5 1999/02/20 00:08:37 1.45 +++ md5 1999/03/30 17:32:14 @@ -1 +1 @@ -MD5 (Wine-990214.tar.gz) = ee9447f18a19223d5d45e199e6629751 +MD5 (Wine-990328.tar.gz) = c753471f829138d43ab7dde6f20875fd cvs diff: Diffing patches cvs diff: cannot find patches/patch-ar cvs diff: Diffing pkg Index: patches/patch-thread0 @@ -0,0 +1,65 @@ +Index: configure.in +@@ -337,23 +337,6 @@ + AC_SUBST(DLLFLAGS) + AC_SUBST(LDSHARED) + +-dnl **** Check for reentrant libc **** +-dnl +-dnl For cross-compiling we blindly assume that libc is reentrant. This is +-dnl ok since non-reentrant libc is quite rare (mostly old libc5 versions). +- +-AC_CACHE_CHECK("for reentrant libc", wine_cv_libc_reentrant, +- [AC_TRY_RUN([int myerrno = 0; +-char buf[256]; +-int *__errno_location(){return &myerrno;} +-main(){connect(0,buf,255); exit(!myerrno);}], +- wine_cv_libc_reentrant=yes, wine_cv_libc_reentrant=no, +- wine_cv_libc_reentrant=yes ) ] ) +-if test "$wine_cv_libc_reentrant" = "no" +-then +- AC_DEFINE(NO_REENTRANT_LIBC) +-fi +- + dnl **** Check for reentrant X libraries **** + dnl + dnl This may fail to determine whether X libraries are reentrant if +@@ -399,12 +382,38 @@ + + dnl **** Check for functions and header files **** + +-AC_CHECK_FUNCS(clone getpagesize memmove sendmsg sigaltstack strerror stricmp tcgetattr timegm usleep wait4 waitpid vfscanf) ++AC_CHECK_FUNCS(clone rfork getpagesize memmove sendmsg sigaltstack strerror stricmp tcgetattr timegm usleep wait4 waitpid vfscanf) + AC_CHECK_HEADERS(wctype.h sys/syscall.h syscall.h sys/param.h sys/vfs.h sys/mount.h sys/statfs.h float.h linux/cdrom.h linux/ucdrom.h sys/cdio.h sys/filio.h sys/modem.h strings.h sys/strtio.h dlfcn.h unistd.h sys/sockio.h net/if.h netinet/in.h sys/file.h libio.h curses.h ncurses.h elf.h arpa/nameser.h resolv.h) + AC_HEADER_STAT() + AC_C_CONST() + AC_TYPE_SIZE_T() + AC_CHECK_SIZEOF(long long,0) ++ ++dnl **** Check for reentrant libc **** ++dnl ++dnl For cross-compiling we blindly assume that libc is reentrant. This is ++dnl ok since non-reentrant libc is quite rare (mostly old libc5 versions). ++ ++AC_CACHE_CHECK("for reentrant libc", wine_cv_libc_reentrant, ++ [AC_TRY_RUN([int myerrno = 0; ++char buf[256]; ++#ifdef HAVE_SYS_PARAM_H ++#include ++#endif ++/* how do i check for libc_r on *BSD? */ ++#if defined(BSD) && (BSD > 199001) ++char __error(); ++main(){exit(0);} ++#else ++int *__errno_location(){return &myerrno;} ++main(){connect(0,buf,255); exit(!myerrno);} ++#endif], ++ wine_cv_libc_reentrant=yes, wine_cv_libc_reentrant=no, ++ wine_cv_libc_reentrant=yes ) ] ) ++if test "$wine_cv_libc_reentrant" = "no" ++then ++ AC_DEFINE(NO_REENTRANT_LIBC) ++fi + + dnl **** Check for sendmsg in -lsocket if not found above **** + Index: patches/patch-thread1 @@ -0,0 +1,546 @@ +Index: configure.in +@@ -400,7 +400,7 @@ + #ifdef HAVE_SYS_PARAM_H + #include + #endif +-/* how do i check for libc_r on *BSD? */ ++/* how do i check for reentrant libc on *BSD? */ + #if defined(BSD) && (BSD > 199001) + char __error(); + main(){exit(0);} +Index: include/thread.h +@@ -17,11 +17,10 @@ + + /* This is what we will use on *BSD, once threads using rfork() get + * implemented: +- * +- * #if defined(__NetBSD__) || defined(__FreeBSD__) || defined(__OpenBSD__) +- * #define HAVE_RFORK +- * #endif + */ ++#if defined(__NetBSD__) || defined(__FreeBSD__) || defined(__OpenBSD__) ++#define HAVE_RFORK ++#endif + + #if (defined(HAVE_CLONE_SYSCALL) || defined(HAVE_RFORK)) && !defined(NO_REENTRANT_LIBC) + #define USE_THREADS +Index: miscemu/emulate.c +@@ -67,8 +67,10 @@ + * wrong. + */ + __asm__ __volatile__("frndint"); ++#ifndef __FreeBSD__ + __asm__ __volatile__("fist %0;wait" : "=m" (dw) : : "memory"); + TRACE(int,"On top of stack is %ld\n",dw); ++#endif + } + break; + +Index: scheduler/Makefile.in +@@ -17,7 +17,12 @@ + synchro.c \ + sysdeps.c \ + syslevel.c \ +- thread.c ++ thread.c \ ++ spinlock.c ++ ++ASM_SRCS = \ ++ _atomic_lock.S \ ++ rf.S + + all: $(MODULE).o + +Index: scheduler/sysdeps.c +@@ -80,6 +80,10 @@ + */ + static void SYSDEPS_StartThread( THDB *thdb ) + { ++#ifdef HAVE_RFORK ++ extern int __isthreaded; ++ __isthreaded = 1; ++#endif /* HAVE_RFORK */ + SET_CUR_THREAD( thdb ); + CLIENT_InitThread(); + thdb->startup(); +@@ -107,7 +111,25 @@ + #endif + + #ifdef HAVE_RFORK ++#if 1 ++ extern int __isthreaded; ++ int pid; ++#ifndef RFTHREAD ++#define RFTHREAD 0 ++#endif ++ switch(pid = thrfork(RFPROC|RFMEM|RFTHREAD, thread->teb.stack_top, ++ SYSDEPS_StartThread, thread, 0, 0)) { ++ case -1: ++ return 0; ++ default: ++ /* FIXME: close the child socket in the parent process */ ++/* close( thread->socket );*/ ++ __isthreaded = 1; ++ break; ++ } ++#else + FIXME(thread, "Threads using rfork() not implemented\n" ); ++#endif + #endif + + #else /* !USE_THREADS */ +Index: scheduler/spinlock.c Sat Apr 10 15:43:53 1999 +@@ -0,0 +1,114 @@ ++/* ++ * Copyright (c) 1997 John Birrell . ++ * All rights reserved. ++ * ++ * Redistribution and use in source and binary forms, with or without ++ * modification, are permitted provided that the following conditions ++ * are met: ++ * 1. Redistributions of source code must retain the above copyright ++ * notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer. ++ * 2. Redistributions in binary form must reproduce the above copyright ++ * notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer in the ++ * documentation and/or other materials provided with the distribution. ++ * 3. All advertising materials mentioning features or use of this software ++ * must display the following acknowledgement: ++ * This product includes software developed by John Birrell. ++ * 4. Neither the name of the author nor the names of any co-contributors ++ * may be used to endorse or promote products derived from this software ++ * without specific prior written permission. ++ * ++ * THIS SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED BY JOHN BIRRELL AND CONTRIBUTORS ``AS IS'' AND ++ * ANY EXPRESS OR IMPLIED WARRANTIES, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE ++ * IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE ++ * ARE DISCLAIMED. IN NO EVENT SHALL THE REGENTS OR CONTRIBUTORS BE LIABLE ++ * FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, EXEMPLARY, OR CONSEQUENTIAL ++ * DAMAGES (INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, PROCUREMENT OF SUBSTITUTE GOODS ++ * OR SERVICES; LOSS OF USE, DATA, OR PROFITS; OR BUSINESS INTERRUPTION) ++ * HOWEVER CAUSED AND ON ANY THEORY OF LIABILITY, WHETHER IN CONTRACT, STRICT ++ * LIABILITY, OR TORT (INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE OR OTHERWISE) ARISING IN ANY WAY ++ * OUT OF THE USE OF THIS SOFTWARE, EVEN IF ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF ++ * SUCH DAMAGE. ++ * ++ * $Id: uthread_spinlock.c,v 1.4.2.1 1998/11/04 08:42:12 tg Exp $ ++ * ++ */ ++ ++#include ++#include ++#include ++#include ++#include ++#include ++#include ++#include "spinlock.h" ++ ++#ifndef SYS_yield ++#define SYS_yield 321 ++#endif ++ ++extern char *__progname; ++ ++/* ++ * Lock a location for the running thread. Yield to allow other ++ * threads to run if this thread is blocked because the lock is ++ * not available. Note that this function does not sleep. It ++ * assumes that the lock will be available very soon. ++ */ ++void ++_spinlock(spinlock_t *lck) ++{ ++ /* ++ * Try to grab the lock and loop if another thread grabs ++ * it before we do. ++ */ ++ while(_atomic_lock(&lck->access_lock)) { ++ /* Give up the time slice: */ ++ syscall(SYS_yield); ++ ++ /* Check if already locked by the running thread: */ ++ if (lck->lock_owner == (long) getpid()) ++ return; ++ } ++ ++ /* The running thread now owns the lock: */ ++ lck->lock_owner = (long) getpid(); ++} ++ ++/* ++ * Lock a location for the running thread. Yield to allow other ++ * threads to run if this thread is blocked because the lock is ++ * not available. Note that this function does not sleep. It ++ * assumes that the lock will be available very soon. ++ * ++ * This function checks if the running thread has already locked the ++ * location, warns if this occurs and creates a thread dump before ++ * returning. ++ */ ++void ++_spinlock_debug(spinlock_t *lck, char *fname, int lineno) ++{ ++ /* ++ * Try to grab the lock and loop if another thread grabs ++ * it before we do. ++ */ ++ while(_atomic_lock(&lck->access_lock)) { ++ /* Give up the time slice: */ ++ syscall(SYS_yield); ++ ++ /* Check if already locked by the running thread: */ ++ if (lck->lock_owner == (long) getpid()) { ++ char str[256]; ++ snprintf(str, sizeof(str), "%s - Warning: Thread %p attempted to lock %p from %s (%d) which it had already locked in %s (%d)\n", __progname, getpid(), lck, fname, lineno, lck->fname, lck->lineno); ++ write(2,str,strlen(str)); ++ ++ /* Create a thread dump to help debug this problem: */ ++ /*_thread_dump_info();*/ ++ return; ++ } ++ } ++ ++ /* The running thread now owns the lock: */ ++ lck->lock_owner = (long) getpid(); ++ lck->fname = fname; ++ lck->lineno = lineno; ++} +Index: scheduler/_atomic_lock.S Sat Apr 10 15:08:49 1999 +@@ -0,0 +1,45 @@ ++/* ++ * Copyright (c) 1995-1998 John Birrell . ++ * All rights reserved. ++ * copyright Douglas Santry 1996 ++ * ++ * Redistribution and use in source and binary forms, with or without ++ * modification, are permitted provided that the above copyright is retained ++ * in the source form. ++ * ++ * THIS SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED BY Douglas Santry AND CONTRIBUTORS ``AS IS'' AND ++ * ANY EXPRESS OR IMPLIED WARRANTIES, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE ++ * IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE ++ * ARE DISCLAIMED. IN NO EVENT SHALL Douglas Santry OR CONTRIBUTORS BE LIABLE ++ * FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, EXEMPLARY, OR CONSEQUENTIAL ++ * DAMAGES (INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, PROCUREMENT OF SUBSTITUTE GOODS ++ * OR SERVICES; LOSS OF USE, DATA, OR PROFITS; OR BUSINESS INTERRUPTION) ++ * HOWEVER CAUSED AND ON ANY THEORY OF LIABILITY, WHETHER IN CONTRACT, STRICT ++ * LIABILITY, OR TORT (INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE OR OTHERWISE) ARISING IN ANY WAY ++ * OUT OF THE USE OF THIS SOFTWARE, EVEN IF ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF ++ * SUCH DAMAGE. ++ * ++ * $Id: _atomic_lock.S,v 1.1.2.1 1998/11/04 08:42:08 tg Exp $ ++ * ++ */ ++ ++#if defined(LIBC_RCS) && !defined(lint) ++ .text ++ .asciz "$Id: _atomic_lock.S,v 1.1.2.1 1998/11/04 08:42:08 tg Exp $" ++#endif /* LIBC_RCS and not lint */ ++ ++#include ++ ++/* ++ * Atomicly lock a location with an identifier provided the location ++ * is not currently locked. ++ * ++ * long _atomic_lock(long *); ++ * eax will contain the return value (zero if lock obtained). ++ */ ++ENTRY(_atomic_lock) ++ movl 4(%esp), %ecx ++ movl $1, %eax ++ xchg %eax, (%ecx) ++ ret ++ +Index: scheduler/rf.S Sat Apr 10 19:31:18 1999 +@@ -0,0 +1,129 @@ ++ .file "rf.S" ++#include ++#include ++#include "SYS.h" ++#define KERNEL ++#include ++#undef KERNEL ++ ++#undef DEBUG ++ ++/* ++ * 8 12 16 20 24 28 ++ * _rfork(flags, stack, startrtn, startarg, userrtn, arg); ++ * ++ * flags: RF* flags for rfork in unistd.h. ++ * subr: subroutine to run as a thread. ++ * stack: top of stack for thread. ++ * arg: argument to thread. ++ */ ++.stabs "rf.S",100,0,0,Ltext0 ++ .text ++Ltext0: ++ .type _thrfork,@function ++ .stabd 68,0,1 ++ENTRY(thrfork) ++ pushl %ebp ++ movl %esp, %ebp ++ pushl %esi ++ ++ /* ++ * Push thread info onto the new thread's stack ++ */ ++ movl 12(%ebp), %esi / get stack addr ++ ++ subl $4, %esi ++ movl 28(%ebp), %eax / get user argument ++ movl %eax, (%esi) ++ ++ subl $4, %esi ++ movl 24(%ebp), %eax / get user thread address ++ movl %eax, (%esi) ++ ++ subl $4, %esi ++ movl 20(%ebp), %eax / get internal argument ++ movl %eax, (%esi) ++ ++ subl $4, %esi ++ movl 16(%ebp), %eax / get internal subroutine ++ movl %eax, (%esi) ++ ++ .stabd 68,0,2 ++ /* ++ * Prepare and execute rfork ++ */ ++ pushl 8(%ebp) ++ pushl %esi ++ ++ leal SYS_rfork, %eax ++ KERNCALL ++ jb 2f ++ ++ .stabd 68,0,3 ++ /* ++ * Check to see if we are in the parent or child ++ */ ++ cmpl $0, %edx ++ jnz 1f ++ addl $8, %esp ++ popl %esi ++ movl %ebp, %esp ++ popl %ebp ++ ret ++ .p2align 2 ++ ++ /* ++ * If we are in the child (new thread), then ++ * set-up the call to the internal subroutine. If it ++ * returns, then call __exit. ++ */ ++ .stabd 68,0,4 ++1: ++ movl %esi,%esp ++#ifdef DEBUG ++ movl %esp, _stackaddr ++ movl (%esp), %eax ++ movl %eax, _stack ++ movl 4(%esp), %eax ++ movl %eax,_stack+4 ++ movl 8(%esp), %eax ++ movl %eax,_stack+8 ++ movl 12(%esp), %eax ++ movl %eax,_stack+12 ++#endif ++ popl %eax ++#ifdef DEBUG ++ movl %eax,_fcn ++#endif ++ call %eax ++ addl $12, %esp ++ ++ /* ++ * Exit system call ++ */ ++ call PIC_PLT(__exit) ++ ++ .stabd 68,0,5 ++2: addl $8, %esp ++ popl %esi ++ movl %ebp, %esp ++ popl %ebp ++ jmp PIC_PLT(HIDENAME(cerror)) ++ ++.stabs "thrfork:f67",36,0,6,_thrfork ++Lfe1: ++ .size _thrfork,Lfe1-_thrfork ++ ++#ifdef DEBUG ++ .data ++ .globl _stack ++_stack: .long 0 ++ .long 0 ++ .long 0 ++ .long 0 ++ .long 0 ++ .globl _stackaddr ++_stackaddr: .long 0 ++ .globl _fcn ++_fcn: .long 0 ++#endif +Index: scheduler/spinlock.h +@@ -0,0 +1,71 @@ ++/* ++ * Copyright (c) 1998 John Birrell . ++ * All rights reserved. ++ * ++ * Redistribution and use in source and binary forms, with or without ++ * modification, are permitted provided that the following conditions ++ * are met: ++ * 1. Redistributions of source code must retain the above copyright ++ * notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer. ++ * 2. Redistributions in binary form must reproduce the above copyright ++ * notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer in the ++ * documentation and/or other materials provided with the distribution. ++ * 3. All advertising materials mentioning features or use of this software ++ * must display the following acknowledgement: ++ * This product includes software developed by John Birrell. ++ * 4. Neither the name of the author nor the names of any co-contributors ++ * may be used to endorse or promote products derived from this software ++ * without specific prior written permission. ++ * ++ * THIS SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED BY JOHN BIRRELL AND CONTRIBUTORS ``AS IS'' AND ++ * ANY EXPRESS OR IMPLIED WARRANTIES, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE ++ * IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE ++ * ARE DISCLAIMED. IN NO EVENT SHALL THE REGENTS OR CONTRIBUTORS BE LIABLE ++ * FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, EXEMPLARY, OR CONSEQUENTIAL ++ * DAMAGES (INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, PROCUREMENT OF SUBSTITUTE GOODS ++ * OR SERVICES; LOSS OF USE, DATA, OR PROFITS; OR BUSINESS INTERRUPTION) ++ * HOWEVER CAUSED AND ON ANY THEORY OF LIABILITY, WHETHER IN CONTRACT, STRICT ++ * LIABILITY, OR TORT (INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE OR OTHERWISE) ARISING IN ANY WAY ++ * OUT OF THE USE OF THIS SOFTWARE, EVEN IF ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF ++ * SUCH DAMAGE. ++ * ++ * $Id: spinlock.h,v 1.3.2.1 1998/11/04 08:42:02 tg Exp $ ++ * ++ * Lock definitions used in both libc and libpthread. ++ * ++ */ ++ ++#ifndef _SPINLOCK_H_ ++#define _SPINLOCK_H_ ++#include ++#include ++ ++/* ++ * Lock structure with room for debugging information. ++ */ ++typedef struct { ++ volatile long access_lock; ++ volatile long lock_owner; ++ volatile char *fname; ++ volatile int lineno; ++} spinlock_t; ++ ++#define _SPINLOCK_INITIALIZER { 0, 0, 0, 0 } ++ ++#define _SPINUNLOCK(_lck) (_lck)->access_lock = 0 ++#ifdef _LOCK_DEBUG ++#define _SPINLOCK(_lck) _spinlock_debug(_lck, __FILE__, __LINE__) ++#else ++#define _SPINLOCK(_lck) _spinlock(_lck) ++#endif ++ ++/* ++ * Thread function prototype definitions: ++ */ ++__BEGIN_DECLS ++long _atomic_lock __P((volatile long *)); ++void _spinlock __P((spinlock_t *)); ++void _spinlock_debug __P((spinlock_t *, char *, int)); ++__END_DECLS ++ ++#endif /* _SPINLOCK_H_ */ +Index: scheduler/SYS.h +@@ -0,0 +1,86 @@ ++/*- ++ * Copyright (c) 1990 The Regents of the University of California. ++ * All rights reserved. ++ * ++ * This code is derived from software contributed to Berkeley by ++ * William Jolitz. ++ * ++ * Redistribution and use in source and binary forms, with or without ++ * modification, are permitted provided that the following conditions ++ * are met: ++ * 1. Redistributions of source code must retain the above copyright ++ * notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer. ++ * 2. Redistributions in binary form must reproduce the above copyright ++ * notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer in the ++ * documentation and/or other materials provided with the distribution. ++ * 3. All advertising materials mentioning features or use of this software ++ * must display the following acknowledgement: ++ * This product includes software developed by the University of ++ * California, Berkeley and its contributors. ++ * 4. Neither the name of the University nor the names of its contributors ++ * may be used to endorse or promote products derived from this software ++ * without specific prior written permission. ++ * ++ * THIS SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED BY THE REGENTS AND CONTRIBUTORS ``AS IS'' AND ++ * ANY EXPRESS OR IMPLIED WARRANTIES, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE ++ * IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE ++ * ARE DISCLAIMED. IN NO EVENT SHALL THE REGENTS OR CONTRIBUTORS BE LIABLE ++ * FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, EXEMPLARY, OR CONSEQUENTIAL ++ * DAMAGES (INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, PROCUREMENT OF SUBSTITUTE GOODS ++ * OR SERVICES; LOSS OF USE, DATA, OR PROFITS; OR BUSINESS INTERRUPTION) ++ * HOWEVER CAUSED AND ON ANY THEORY OF LIABILITY, WHETHER IN CONTRACT, STRICT ++ * LIABILITY, OR TORT (INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE OR OTHERWISE) ARISING IN ANY WAY ++ * OUT OF THE USE OF THIS SOFTWARE, EVEN IF ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF ++ * SUCH DAMAGE. ++ * ++ * from: @(#)SYS.h 5.5 (Berkeley) 5/7/91 ++ * ++ * $Id: SYS.h,v 1.7.2.2 1997/12/28 19:40:43 steve Exp $ ++ */ ++ ++#include ++#include ++ ++#define SYSCALL(x) 2: PIC_PROLOGUE; jmp PIC_PLT(HIDENAME(cerror)); \ ++ ENTRY(x); lea __CONCAT(SYS_,x),%eax; KERNCALL; jb 2b ++#define RSYSCALL(x) SYSCALL(x); ret ++ ++#define PSEUDO(x,y) ENTRY(x); lea __CONCAT(SYS_,y), %eax; KERNCALL; ret ++/* gas messes up offset -- although we don't currently need it, do for BCS */ ++#define LCALL(x,y) .byte 0x9a ; .long y; .word x ++ ++/* ++ * Design note: ++ * ++ * The macros PSYSCALL() and PRSYSCALL() are intended for use where a ++ * syscall needs to be renamed in the threaded library. When building ++ * a normal library, they default to the traditional SYSCALL() and ++ * RSYSCALL(). This avoids the need to #ifdef _THREAD_SAFE everywhere ++ * that the renamed function needs to be called. ++ */ ++#if 0 /*def _THREAD_SAFE*/ ++/* ++ * For the thread_safe versions, we prepend _thread_sys_ to the function ++ * name so that the 'C' wrapper can go around the real name. ++ */ ++#define PSYSCALL(x) 2: PIC_PROLOGUE; jmp PIC_PLT(HIDENAME(cerror)); \ ++ ENTRY(__CONCAT(_thread_sys_,x)); \ ++ lea __CONCAT(SYS_,x),%eax; KERNCALL; jb 2b ++#define PRSYSCALL(x) PSYSCALL(x); ret ++#define PPSEUDO(x,y) ENTRY(__CONCAT(_thread_sys_,x)); \ ++ lea __CONCAT(SYS_,y), %eax; KERNCALL; ret ++#else ++/* ++ * The non-threaded library defaults to traditional syscalls where ++ * the function name matches the syscall name. ++ */ ++#define PSYSCALL(x) SYSCALL(x) ++#define PRSYSCALL(x) RSYSCALL(x) ++#define PPSEUDO(x,y) PSEUDO(x,y) ++#endif ++ ++#ifdef __ELF__ ++#define KERNCALL int $0x80 /* Faster */ ++#else ++#define KERNCALL LCALL(7,0) /* The old way */ ++#endif Index: patches/patch-thread2 @@ -0,0 +1,10 @@ +Index: Make.rules.in +@@ -19,7 +19,7 @@ + CC = @CC@ + CPP = @CPP@ + CFLAGS = @CFLAGS@ +-OPTIONS = @OPTIONS@ -D_REENTRANT ++OPTIONS = @OPTIONS@ -D_REENTRANT -D_THREAD_SAFE + X_CFLAGS = @X_CFLAGS@ + X_LIBS = @X_LIBS@ + XLIB = @X_PRE_LIBS@ @XLIB@ @X_EXTRA_LIBS@ Index: patches/patch-thread3-elf @@ -0,0 +1,22 @@ +Index: scheduler/rf.S +@@ -20,7 +20,7 @@ + .stabs "rf.S",100,0,0,Ltext0 + .text + Ltext0: +- .type _thrfork,@function ++ .type thrfork,@function + .stabd 68,0,1 + ENTRY(thrfork) + pushl %ebp +@@ -110,9 +110,9 @@ + popl %ebp + jmp PIC_PLT(HIDENAME(cerror)) + +-.stabs "thrfork:f67",36,0,6,_thrfork ++.stabs "thrfork:f67",36,0,6,thrfork + Lfe1: +- .size _thrfork,Lfe1-_thrfork ++ .size thrfork,Lfe1-thrfork + + #ifdef DEBUG + .data Thanx, -- Juergen Lock To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 17 18: 6:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (207-229-172-24.d.enteract.com [207.229.172.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 524DD14D42 for ; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 18:06:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.enteract.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA00742; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 18:03:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904180103.SAA00742@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Greg Black Cc: Matthew Dillon , "Andrew J. Korty" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 17 Apr 1999 21:52:14 +1000." <19990417115214.23043.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 18:03:39 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Matthew Dillon writes: > > > I've been thinking about this enombing thing... well, I hate to say it, > > but crowbaring into libc is *not* the right way to do it. It's > > just too intrusive. The right way to do it would be to write a device > > driver similar to NULLFS which handles backing up the files, thus giving > > the sysad the option to use such a device to mount-through those partitions > > that the sysad wants to keep checkpointed. Also, putting such intrusive > > code into libc would be fairly dangreous from a security point of view > > even if it is turned off. > > I am completely in agreement with this. It's not something for > libc and it needs to be kept at arm's length from everything > else if it's ever to be part of the core of FreeBSD. You might want to think about how LD_PRELOAD works. You could trivially add entombing support simply by specifying your libentomb.so which overlays the libc functionality for those users that might want it. Then you just need to deal with static binaries like /bin/rm. 8) -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 17 21:21: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F179A14D0F for ; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 21:21:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id AAA23919 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 00:18:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904180418.AAA23919@cs.rpi.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: "paused" system Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 00:18:42 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I have another 'paused' system. It responds to kernel level stuff fine; pings, VTY switches, scroll lock/pgup/pgdn. Nothing beyond that. No network activity beyond what I send at it (the last case had NFS traffic). This is not a critical system this time, so I am quite willing to let it sit for awhile (it seemed to have died on april 15th). Anyone have any commands or anything they would like me to try? BTW: This is a system from the days of 3.1-BETA. -- David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 17 23: 9:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ftp.dns.ne.jp (ftp.dns.ne.jp [210.155.3.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF51A14F29; Sat, 17 Apr 1999 23:09:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tanimura@sakuramail.com) Received: from silver.carrots (yksk0117.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp [210.131.91.81]) by ftp.dns.ne.jp (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA05613; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 15:06:24 +0900 (JST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by silver.carrots (8.9.3+3.1W/3.7W) with ESMTP id PAA40136; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 15:06:17 +0900 (JST) To: nox@jelal.kn-bremen.de Cc: tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp, zinnia@jan.ne.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports From: Seigo TANIMURA In-Reply-To: Your message of "Sat, 17 Apr 1999 13:37:07 +0200" <19990417133707.A39454@saturn.kn-bremen.de> References: <19990417133707.A39454@saturn.kn-bremen.de> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.93 on Emacs 19.34 / Mule 2.3 (SUETSUMUHANA) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <19990418150617N.tanimura@sakuramail.com> Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 15:06:17 +0900 X-Dispatcher: imput version 980905(IM100) Lines: 44 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG From: Juergen Lock Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 13:37:07 +0200 Message-ID: <19990417133707.A39454@saturn.kn-bremen.de> nox> > nox> > For the modules with serial interfaces(most modern ones like Roland SC-88 have): nox> > nox> > nox> > nox> > 38.4kbps nox> > nox> > PC ----------------------------- Midi Module nox> > nox> > Serial Cable for the Module nox> > nox> > nox> > nox> > I got to play sequences successfully under the situation shown above. nox> > nox> > I used SC-88, with a 'computer port'. It accepts the bitrates of both 31.25kbps nox> > nox> > and 38.4kbps, transforming the signal internally. You can plug some other nox> > nox> > midi modules and instruments to the module connected to the PC. In this case nox> > nox> > the module also acts as a midi interface. nox> > nox> nox> > nox> Has anyone tried things like sending a big sysex dump to something nox> > nox> connected there? nox> > nox> > nox> > I tried sending sysex messages to display some frames of picture on the LCD of SC-88. nox> > One frame takes 64 bytes. I sent sysex at around 6-8 frames/sec for 10 seconds. nox> > I had no latency to recognize, as I experienced on sbmidi. nox> nox> I thought about that as a means to test flow control, for that I'd guess nox> you have to hook someting up on the SC-88's midi port and send _it_ nox> something big. OTOH maybe even that won't be enough, RAM is cheap today nox> and who knows how big a buffer the SC-88 has... I am afraid I have no more modules nor instruments, so I cannot do anything further. Another bad news, I tried driving my SC-88 connected directly to a PC using Windows 95 and Portman PC/S driver, to find a miserable result. I saw no midi messages come properly, so Portman PC/S should be cooking the signals in some way... Seigo TANIMURA |M2, Nakagawa Lab, Dept of Electronics & CS =========================|Faculty of Engineering, Yokohama National Univ Powered by SIEMENS, |http://www.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp/~tanimura/ FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT |http://www.sakura.ne.jp/~tcarrot/ (10th Apr 1999) & muesli.|tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp tcarrot@sakuramail.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 0:13: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5423E15164 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 00:13:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id AAA77612; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 00:10:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 00:10:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904180710.AAA77612@apollo.backplane.com> To: "John S. Dyson" Cc: dg@root.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :You are right about VDIR's not being B_VMIO. That was a decision made early :on when the vfs_bio code was not trustworthy :-). It is okay, and advantageous :to cache VDIR's with merged cache. : :I agree that it is time to make the change. : :-- :John | Never try to teach a pig to sing, DG agrees. Great! David says he will do the commit. I really like the effect the patch has had on my systems, I think this patch is a candidate for MFC'ing to -stable later on, too ( before the next release ). We might eventually be able to get rid of B_MALLOC entirely, but I'll save that for a later time. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 0:30:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0D8E150AB for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 00:30:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id AAA77722; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 00:28:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 00:28:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904180728.AAA77722@apollo.backplane.com> To: "David E. Cross" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: "paused" system References: <199904180418.AAA23919@cs.rpi.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :I have another 'paused' system. It responds to kernel level stuff fine; :pings, VTY switches, scroll lock/pgup/pgdn. Nothing beyond that. No :network activity beyond what I send at it (the last case had NFS traffic). :This is not a critical system this time, so I am quite willing to let it sit :for awhile (it seemed to have died on april 15th). Anyone have any commands :or anything they would like me to try? : :BTW: This is a system from the days of 3.1-BETA. : :-- :David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu If you can break into DDB ( usually ctl-alt-esc ), you can do a 'ps' to see what the processes are blocked on. It ought to be possible to narrow the problem down given that information. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 1:57:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cerebus.nectar.com (nectar-gw.nectar.com [204.0.249.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 624CC14F86 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 01:57:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nectar@nectar.com) Received: (from smap@localhost) by cerebus.nectar.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) id DAA61035 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 03:55:11 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from nectar@nectar.com) Received: from spawn.nectar.com(10.0.0.101) by cerebus.nectar.com via smap (V2.1) id xma061033; Sun, 18 Apr 99 03:55:04 -0500 Received: from spawn.nectar.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spawn.nectar.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id DAA22110 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 03:53:42 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from nectar@spawn.nectar.com) Message-Id: <199904180853.DAA22110@spawn.nectar.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 X-Exmh-Isig-CompType: unknown X-Exmh-Isig-Folder: mlist/freebsd/hackers X-PGP-RSAfprint: 00 F9 E6 A2 C5 4D 0A 76 26 8B 8B 57 73 D0 DE EE X-PGP-RSAkey: http://www.nectar.com/nectar-rsa.txt X-PGP-DSSfprint: AB2F 8D71 A4F4 467D 352E 8A41 5D79 22E4 71A2 8C73 X-PGP-DHfprint: 2D50 12E5 AB38 60BA AF4B 0778 7242 4460 1C32 F6B1 X-PGP-DH-DSSkey: http://www.nectar.com/nectar-dh-dss.txt From: Jacques Vidrine Subject: __attribute__ ((constructor)) functions & shared libs Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 03:53:42 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi all, I'm porting an application that uses ``__attribute__ ((constructor))'' to give shared libraries initialization functions. Unfortunately, it seems that environ is not yet initialized when these functions are called. A brief example: libfoo.so has init function ``libfoo_init'' which looks like this: extern char **environ; void libfoo_init(void) __attribute__ ((constructor)); void libfoo_init(void) { fprintf(stderr, "getenv(\"HOME\") = \"%s\"\n", getenv("HOME")); fprintf(stderr, "environ = %p\n", environ); } An application linked with this library will display: getenv("HOME") = "(null)" environ = 0x0 even though HOME is, of course, set in the environment. What might I be missing? Looking at src/lib/csu/i386-elf/crt1.c, it seems as if environ is set before invoking the run time linker. Jacques Vidrine / n@nectar.com / nectar@FreeBSD.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 2:18: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cerebus.nectar.com (nectar-gw.nectar.com [204.0.249.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3580514D98 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 02:18:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nectar@nectar.com) Received: (from smap@localhost) by cerebus.nectar.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) id EAA61090 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 04:15:41 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from nectar@nectar.com) Received: from spawn.nectar.com(10.0.0.101) by cerebus.nectar.com via smap (V2.1) id xma061088; Sun, 18 Apr 99 04:15:35 -0500 Received: from spawn.nectar.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spawn.nectar.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id EAA22349 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 04:14:13 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from nectar@spawn.nectar.com) Message-Id: <199904180914.EAA22349@spawn.nectar.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 X-PGP-RSAfprint: 00 F9 E6 A2 C5 4D 0A 76 26 8B 8B 57 73 D0 DE EE X-PGP-RSAkey: http://www.nectar.com/nectar-rsa.txt X-PGP-DSSfprint: AB2F 8D71 A4F4 467D 352E 8A41 5D79 22E4 71A2 8C73 X-PGP-DHfprint: 2D50 12E5 AB38 60BA AF4B 0778 7242 4460 1C32 F6B1 X-PGP-DH-DSSkey: http://www.nectar.com/nectar-dh-dss.txt From: Jacques Vidrine In-reply-to: <199904180853.DAA22110@spawn.nectar.com> References: <199904180853.DAA22110@spawn.nectar.com> Subject: Re: __attribute__ ((constructor)) functions & shared libs Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 04:14:13 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 18 April 1999 at 3:53, Jacques Vidrine wrote: > I'm porting an application that uses ``__attribute__ ((constructor))'' > to give shared libraries initialization functions. Unfortunately, it > seems that environ is not yet initialized when these functions are > called. BTW, this is the situation on ELF systems only. a.out systems behave as expected. Jacques Vidrine / n@nectar.com / nectar@FreeBSD.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 2:55:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8AFD5152F5 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 02:55:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id FAA09116; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 05:08:00 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 05:07:58 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Jacques Vidrine Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: __attribute__ ((constructor)) functions & shared libs In-Reply-To: <199904180914.EAA22349@spawn.nectar.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 18 Apr 1999, Jacques Vidrine wrote: > On 18 April 1999 at 3:53, Jacques Vidrine wrote: > > I'm porting an application that uses ``__attribute__ ((constructor))'' > > to give shared libraries initialization functions. Unfortunately, it > > seems that environ is not yet initialized when these functions are > > called. > > BTW, this is the situation on ELF systems only. a.out systems > behave as expected. I'm no compiler/linker expert, but when i wanted to do this sort of thing, what i did was create my shared objects with functions void _init(void) and void _fini(void) if you link the .so with -nostdlib then the init and fini functions will be called when the shared object is linked in. gcc -shared -nostdlib -o blah.so obj1.o obj2.o .... i'm not sure if this is the solution you are looking for, but it may be. -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 4:32:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4EF7E150AF for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 04:32:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA31727 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 07:29:57 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 07:29:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: LinuxThreads doesn't fdfree? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Is it just me, or at kern_exit.c:441, I notice that fd's are never freed? This can cause problems (of course leaked memory) such as a socket remaining open when a process exits! That can definitely lead to a panic. Now, can someone evaluate all of the code Dick added around exit() and wait() (mach dep too), and at least tell me if I'm right about this. fdfree() shouldn't free fd in this case, but shouldn't we at least be decrementing the refcnt? Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \ _ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___)___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 7:54:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from iquest3.iquest.net (iquest3.iquest.net [209.43.20.203]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 3C05A14FC3 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 07:54:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from toor@dyson.iquest.net) Received: (qmail 6897 invoked from network); 18 Apr 1999 14:52:24 -0000 Received: from dyson.iquest.net (198.70.144.127) by iquest3.iquest.net with SMTP; 18 Apr 1999 14:52:24 -0000 Received: (from root@localhost) by dyson.iquest.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) id JAA18474; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 09:52:22 -0500 (EST) From: "John S. Dyson" Message-Id: <199904181452.JAA18474@dyson.iquest.net> Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! In-Reply-To: <199904180710.AAA77612@apollo.backplane.com> from Matthew Dillon at "Apr 18, 99 00:10:41 am" To: dillon@apollo.backplane.com (Matthew Dillon) Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 09:52:21 -0500 (EST) Cc: dyson@iquest.net, dg@root.com, hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL32 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > :You are right about VDIR's not being B_VMIO. That was a decision made early > :on when the vfs_bio code was not trustworthy :-). It is okay, and advantageous > :to cache VDIR's with merged cache. > : > :I agree that it is time to make the change. > : > :-- > :John | Never try to teach a pig to sing, > > DG agrees. Great! David says he will do the commit. > > I really like the effect the patch has had on my systems, I think this > patch is a candidate for MFC'ing to -stable later on, too ( before the next > release ). We might eventually be able to get rid of B_MALLOC entirely, > but I'll save that for a later time. > The purpose of B_MALLOC was to eliminate the unnecessary overhead for lots of small directories being backed by entire pages instead of partial pages. (Internal memory fragmentation.) Most dirs are 512 or 2048 and wasting an entire page for most directories seems to be undesireable. The advantage of coherent caching of directories is pretty much non-existant, since such naming happens through the VFS layering framework. The big advantage of what you have suggested is that directory caching isn't limited by the size of the buffer cache. I originally designed the code to support the buffer cache only being a temporary mapping, and dirty pages could be passed from the buffer cache to the anonymous cache. The only advantage of getting rid of B_MALLOC would be to totally relax the amount of memory used for caching directories. The disadvantage is the potentially gross amount of internal fragmentation of memory. Perhaps before getting rid of B_MALLOC, take a look at the standard mix of directory sizes (don't just look at news servers.) If there is an extreme bias towards 512 or 2048, then you might consider keeping B_MALLOC. John To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 9:42:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wall.polstra.com (rtrwan160.accessone.com [206.213.115.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E08E14CEC for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 09:42:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Received: from vashon.polstra.com (vashon.polstra.com [206.213.73.13]) by wall.polstra.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA21664; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 09:39:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) From: John Polstra Received: (from jdp@localhost) by vashon.polstra.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id JAA20403; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 09:39:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 09:39:41 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904181639.JAA20403@vashon.polstra.com> To: n@nectar.com Subject: Re: __attribute__ ((constructor)) functions & shared libs In-Reply-To: <199904180853.DAA22110@spawn.nectar.com> Organization: Polstra & Co., Seattle, WA Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article <199904180853.DAA22110@spawn.nectar.com>, Jacques Vidrine wrote: > Hi all, > > I'm porting an application that uses ``__attribute__ ((constructor))'' > to give shared libraries initialization functions. Unfortunately, it > seems that environ is not yet initialized when these functions are > called. Which version/date of FreeBSD? > What might I be missing? Looking at src/lib/csu/i386-elf/crt1.c, it > seems as if environ is set before invoking the run time linker. If it's ELF, the dynamic linker runs before crt1 gets control. The kernel invokes the dynamic linker directly. After it has finished its job, the dynamic linker transfers control to the main program's entry point. You are not officially "allowed" to assume that anything is already initialized in those constructor/destructor functions. Not even printf is really guaranteed to work. But perhaps we can make some simple changes so that most things will work despite that. John -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-interest is the aphrodisiac of belief." -- James V. DeLong To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 9:45: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (spinner.netplex.com.au [202.12.86.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8E78152F7 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 09:44:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) Received: from netplex.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spinner.netplex.com.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4DC7C1F2A; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 00:42:30 +0800 (WST) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "John S. Dyson" Cc: dillon@apollo.backplane.com (Matthew Dillon), dyson@iquest.net, dg@root.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 18 Apr 1999 09:52:21 EST." <199904181452.JAA18474@dyson.iquest.net> Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 00:42:30 +0800 From: Peter Wemm Message-Id: <19990418164232.4DC7C1F2A@spinner.netplex.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "John S. Dyson" wrote: > > :You are right about VDIR's not being B_VMIO. That was a decision made ear ly > > :on when the vfs_bio code was not trustworthy :-). It is okay, and advanta geous > > :to cache VDIR's with merged cache. [..] > The only advantage of getting rid of B_MALLOC would be to totally relax > the amount of memory used for caching directories. The disadvantage > is the potentially gross amount of internal fragmentation of memory. > > Perhaps before getting rid of B_MALLOC, take a look at the standard > mix of directory sizes (don't just look at news servers.) If there is an > extreme bias towards 512 or 2048, then you might consider keeping B_MALLOC. Would small block devices/filesystems likely be affected? (ie: msdos, ext2fs etc) Cheers, -Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 9:45:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wall.polstra.com (rtrwan160.accessone.com [206.213.115.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC1EE152F7 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 09:45:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Received: from vashon.polstra.com (vashon.polstra.com [206.213.73.13]) by wall.polstra.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA21688; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 09:42:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) From: John Polstra Received: (from jdp@localhost) by vashon.polstra.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id JAA20431; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 09:42:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 09:42:54 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904181642.JAA20431@vashon.polstra.com> To: bright@rush.net Subject: Re: __attribute__ ((constructor)) functions & shared libs In-Reply-To: Organization: Polstra & Co., Seattle, WA Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article , Alfred Perlstein wrote: > I'm no compiler/linker expert, but when i wanted to do this sort of > thing, what i did was create my shared objects with functions > void _init(void) > and > void _fini(void) > > if you link the .so with -nostdlib then the init and fini functions > will be called when the shared object is linked in. It's better to use the attributes as Jacques did. The _init() and _fini() functions, like almost all functions whose names begin with "_", are private to the implementation. That is, they are for the use of the runtime system. Applications aren't allowed to override them. We probably shouldn't even mention them in the documentation. John -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-interest is the aphrodisiac of belief." -- James V. DeLong To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 10: 0:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from iquest3.iquest.net (iquest3.iquest.net [209.43.20.203]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 5FA4115516 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 10:00:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from toor@dyson.iquest.net) Received: (qmail 18939 invoked from network); 18 Apr 1999 16:57:16 -0000 Received: from dyson.iquest.net (198.70.144.127) by iquest3.iquest.net with SMTP; 18 Apr 1999 16:57:16 -0000 Received: (from root@localhost) by dyson.iquest.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) id LAA18643; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 11:57:14 -0500 (EST) From: "John S. Dyson" Message-Id: <199904181657.LAA18643@dyson.iquest.net> Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! In-Reply-To: <19990418164232.4DC7C1F2A@spinner.netplex.com.au> from Peter Wemm at "Apr 19, 99 00:42:30 am" To: peter@netplex.com.au (Peter Wemm) Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 11:57:14 -0500 (EST) Cc: dillon@apollo.backplane.com, dyson@iquest.net, dg@root.com, hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL32 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > "John S. Dyson" wrote: > > > :You are right about VDIR's not being B_VMIO. That was a decision made ear > ly > > > :on when the vfs_bio code was not trustworthy :-). It is okay, and advanta > geous > > > :to cache VDIR's with merged cache. > [..] > > The only advantage of getting rid of B_MALLOC would be to totally relax > > the amount of memory used for caching directories. The disadvantage > > is the potentially gross amount of internal fragmentation of memory. > > > > Perhaps before getting rid of B_MALLOC, take a look at the standard > > mix of directory sizes (don't just look at news servers.) If there is an > > extreme bias towards 512 or 2048, then you might consider keeping B_MALLOC. > > Would small block devices/filesystems likely be affected? (ie: msdos, > ext2fs etc) > Special dispensation is given to those filesystems... All blocks are laid out into merged cache pages. The locality of reference associated with typical filesystem usage argues against the overhead of the fragmentation. In the case of directories, the fragmentation is due to the allocation unit size of the merged cache (1 PAGE), and the size of the directory typically being < 1PAGE. Of course, it is advantageous to have block sized directory chunks for disk filesystem consistancy reasons. (I don't really know if it is so valuable now.) For small block filesystems, it would be wasteful (or would cause incoherence) to either use B_MALLOC buffers, or allocate each block as a portion of a page. This is where alot of the complexity of the current caching scheme comes into play. Also, NFS is a weird monster in it's own right. Frankly, NFS is a candidate to make into a true merged filesystem (bypassing the buffer cache entirely), and FFS is such a candidate because of it being so common. Since the need for backwards compatibility with the old BSD style buffer cache isn't really needed any more (softupdates is likely the only important development that legacy support is needed), I strongly suggest "fixing" the commonly used filesystems to bypass the majority of the vfs_bio complexity now. (That was in my plans.) John To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 10: 6:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from i4got.pechter.dyndns.org (bg-tc-ppp424.monmouth.com [209.191.61.173]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9968C14DC1 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 10:06:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pechter@i4got.pechter.dyndns.org) Received: (from pechter@localhost) by i4got.pechter.dyndns.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA03039 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 13:03:55 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from pechter) From: Bill Pechter Message-Id: <199904181703.NAA03039@i4got.pechter.dyndns.org> Subject: Re: freebsd-hackers-digest V4 #458 In-Reply-To: from freebsd-hackers-digest at "Apr 17, 1999 11: 9:15 pm" To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 13:03:44 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: bpechter@shell.monmouth.com X-Phone-Number: 908-389-3592 X-OS-Type: FreeBSD 3.0-Stable X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 21:52:14 +1000 > From: Greg Black > Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD > > Matthew Dillon writes: > > > I've been thinking about this enombing thing... well, I hate to say it, > > but crowbaring into libc is *not* the right way to do it. It's > > just too intrusive. The right way to do it would be to write a device > > driver similar to NULLFS which handles backing up the files, thus giving > > the sysad the option to use such a device to mount-through those partitions > > that the sysad wants to keep checkpointed. Also, putting such intrusive > > code into libc would be fairly dangreous from a security point of view > > even if it is turned off. > > I am completely in agreement with this. It's not something for > libc and it needs to be kept at arm's length from everything > else if it's ever to be part of the core of FreeBSD. > > - -- > Greg Black Actually, the entombing stuff is interesting, but not for libc. Perhaps a separate daemon and rm replacement might be reasonable. Maybe something like an attribute could be used to turn it on and off by directory or user id. We don't need this on all files and on all file systems. Imagine entombing on /usr/spool/news/... Ugh. I'd even like to see a file system with VAX/VMS like version numbers available which would make the entombing less necessary. Bill To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 10:28:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cerebus.nectar.com (nectar-gw.nectar.com [204.0.249.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5828614DC1 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 10:28:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nectar@nectar.com) Received: (from smap@localhost) by cerebus.nectar.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) id MAA62374; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 12:26:23 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from nectar@nectar.com) Received: from spawn.nectar.com(10.0.0.101) by cerebus.nectar.com via smap (V2.1) id xma062372; Sun, 18 Apr 99 12:25:55 -0500 Received: from spawn.nectar.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spawn.nectar.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id MAA30234; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 12:24:31 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from nectar@spawn.nectar.com) Message-Id: <199904181724.MAA30234@spawn.nectar.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 X-Exmh-Isig-CompType: repl X-Exmh-Isig-Folder: mlist/freebsd/hackers X-PGP-RSAfprint: 00 F9 E6 A2 C5 4D 0A 76 26 8B 8B 57 73 D0 DE EE X-PGP-RSAkey: http://www.nectar.com/nectar-rsa.txt X-PGP-DSSfprint: AB2F 8D71 A4F4 467D 352E 8A41 5D79 22E4 71A2 8C73 X-PGP-DHfprint: 2D50 12E5 AB38 60BA AF4B 0778 7242 4460 1C32 F6B1 X-PGP-DH-DSSkey: http://www.nectar.com/nectar-dh-dss.txt From: Jacques Vidrine In-reply-to: <199904181639.JAA20403@vashon.polstra.com> References: <199904181639.JAA20403@vashon.polstra.com> Subject: Re: __attribute__ ((constructor)) functions & shared libs Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain To: John Polstra Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 12:24:31 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 18 April 1999 at 9:39, John Polstra wrote: > Which version/date of FreeBSD? Tested on 3.1-STABLE circa Apr 12 > If it's ELF, the dynamic linker runs before crt1 gets control. The > kernel invokes the dynamic linker directly. After it has finished > its job, the dynamic linker transfers control to the main program's > entry point. Where can I find this code (which invokes the dynamic linker)? A backtrace from the debugger showed _rtld -> _init -> do_ctors -> libfoo_init, but I'm not sure where to find _rtld() and _init(). > You are not officially "allowed" to assume that anything is already > initialized in those constructor/destructor functions. Not even > printf is really guaranteed to work. But perhaps we can make some > simple changes so that most things will work despite that. I hope so. This code does some fairly heavy duty stuff during initialization, including XOpenDisplay! It apparently works on some versions of OSF/1, HP/UX, AIX, SCO, IRIX, Solaris, SunOS, and Linux. I have a hunch it would work on a FreeBSD a.out system, though I haven't tested this. Jacques Vidrine / n@nectar.com / nectar@FreeBSD.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 11:22:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheddar.netmonger.net (cheddar.netmonger.net [209.54.21.140]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B1CA114DD8 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 11:22:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chris@cheddar.netmonger.net) Received: (from chris@localhost) by cheddar.netmonger.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA09651; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 14:19:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19990418141949.A7676@netmonger.net> Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 14:19:49 -0400 From: Christopher Masto To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <199904162008.NAA59918@apollo.backplane.com> <199904170437.AAA07152@bellsouth.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.91.1i In-Reply-To: <199904170437.AAA07152@bellsouth.net>; from W Gerald Hicks on Sat, Apr 17, 1999 at 12:37:08AM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, Apr 17, 1999 at 12:37:08AM -0400, W Gerald Hicks wrote: > > The *existing* VFS stacks are broken because they are not being maintained > > through the massive number of changes the VM system has gone through in > > the last few years, not because of some sort of basic problem with the > > VFS layering. > > Eivind seems to have some interesting work towards the goal of > making these functional for contemporary FreeBSD. > > Anybody else have any spare machines available for testing? If hardware is what's needed, there's a scratch machine available here (it can't be sent to someone, but full remote access can be given). I would be very happy to see stuff that has fallen to entropy over the years resurrected. -- Christopher Masto Senior Network Monkey NetMonger Communications chris@netmonger.net info@netmonger.net http://www.netmonger.net Free yourself, free your machine, free the daemon -- http://www.freebsd.org/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 12:10:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheddar.netmonger.net (cheddar.netmonger.net [209.54.21.140]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01E5614DEA for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 12:10:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chris@cheddar.netmonger.net) Received: (from chris@localhost) by cheddar.netmonger.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA11441; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 15:08:29 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19990418150829.B7676@netmonger.net> Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 15:08:29 -0400 From: Christopher Masto To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: lsock(1) References: <15879.924101022@axl.noc.iafrica.com> <3714C4F0.579FDDEE@newsguy.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=cWoXeonUoKmBZSoM Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Mutt 0.91.1i In-Reply-To: <3714C4F0.579FDDEE@newsguy.com>; from Daniel C. Sobral on Thu, Apr 15, 1999 at 01:40:16AM +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --cWoXeonUoKmBZSoM Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii On Thu, Apr 15, 1999 at 01:40:16AM +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > Sheldon Hearn wrote: > > > > I didn't look at the code, but the functionality described in the > > manpage looks cool and froody. > > I did. The code is smaller than the man page, actually. :-) It's > just a matter of calling netstat and fstat, and correlating the > results. It's a heck of a lot cleaner than the piece of crap I threw together at my old job. My only excuse is that this file was dated 1996, and I'm three years smarter now: #!/usr/local/bin/perl #First learn all PCBs open FS, "fstat|"; while () { chop; ($uname, $net, $pcb) = (split)[0,4,7]; if ($net eq "internet" and $pcb) { $name{$pcb} = $uname; } } close FS; #fancy netstat open NS, "netstat -nAa -f inet|"; while () { if (/^(........)\s+(\S+)\s+(\S+)\s+(\S+)\s+([\d\.\*]+)\.(\d+)\s+(\S+)\s*(\S*)$/) { if ($name{$1} and ($2 eq "tcp" or $2 eq "udp")) { printf "%-8s %-15s %-7s %-15s %s\n", $name{$1}, $5, "($6)", $8, $7; } } } close NS; I do have a minor suggestion though. To be consistent with other utilities that have headers (such as ps), it should probably not use the _TOP format, which adds a formfeed and a repeated header periodically. It's a simple change (attached). -- Christopher Masto Senior Network Monkey NetMonger Communications chris@netmonger.net info@netmonger.net http://www.netmonger.net Free yourself, free your machine, free the daemon -- http://www.freebsd.org/ --cWoXeonUoKmBZSoM Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=lsock-diff --- lsock.pl Tue Apr 13 17:41:09 1999 +++ lsock-notop.pl Sun Apr 18 15:03:34 1999 @@ -1,4 +1,4 @@ -#!/usr/bin/perl5 +#!/usr/bin/perl #- # Copyright (c) 1999 Dag-Erling Coïdan Smørgrav # All rights reserved. @@ -32,9 +32,9 @@ my %myaddr, %hisaddr; my $user, $cmd, $pid, $fd, $inet, $type, $proto, $sock, $laddr, $faddr; -format STDOUT_TOP = +print <>>> @>>> @<< @<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< @<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< $user, $cmd, $pid, $fd, $proto,$laddr, $faddr --cWoXeonUoKmBZSoM-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 12:58: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E161114D3B for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 12:58:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id MAA81804; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 12:55:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 12:55:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904181955.MAA81804@apollo.backplane.com> To: "John S. Dyson" Cc: peter@netplex.com.au (Peter Wemm), dyson@iquest.net, dg@root.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! References: <199904181657.LAA18643@dyson.iquest.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :... :the current caching scheme comes into play. Also, NFS is a weird :monster in it's own right. Frankly, NFS is a candidate to make into :a true merged filesystem (bypassing the buffer cache entirely), and :FFS is such a candidate because of it being so common. : :Since the need for backwards compatibility with the old BSD style :buffer cache isn't really needed any more (softupdates is likely :the only important development that legacy support is needed), I :strongly suggest "fixing" the commonly used filesystems to bypass :the majority of the vfs_bio complexity now. (That was in my plans.) : :John The new NFS hacks I've been working on use the buffer cache the same way FFS does, except for one case that still requires use of b_dirtyoff/dirtyend. I think bypassing the buffer cache ( getting rid of it entirely, or devolving it into a simple KVM mapping scheme! ) is doable. Maybe later this year, though. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 13: 0:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79C8814D3B for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 13:00:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id MAA81828; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 12:58:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 12:58:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904181958.MAA81828@apollo.backplane.com> To: Peter Wemm Cc: "John S. Dyson" , dyson@iquest.net, dg@root.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! References: <19990418164232.4DC7C1F2A@spinner.netplex.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> the amount of memory used for caching directories. The disadvantage :> is the potentially gross amount of internal fragmentation of memory. :> :> Perhaps before getting rid of B_MALLOC, take a look at the standard :> mix of directory sizes (don't just look at news servers.) If there is an :> extreme bias towards 512 or 2048, then you might consider keeping B_MALLOC. : :Would small block devices/filesystems likely be affected? (ie: msdos, :ext2fs etc) : :Cheers, :-Peter Remember all those VFS/BIO fixes Luoqi made a few weeks ago? They were mainly to fix bugs in VFS/BIO relating to small block filesystems. small block filesystems use VMIO, but since the block size is less then a page the base offset in the struct buf for any given small-block buffer is *NOT* the same as the base offset the page being mapped to that struct buf. We could conceivably do the same thing with directories, but it probably would not be worth the hassle. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 13: 5:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E52A014E00 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 13:05:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id NAA81858; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 13:02:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 13:02:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904182002.NAA81858@apollo.backplane.com> To: "John S. Dyson" Cc: dg@root.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! References: <199904181452.JAA18474@dyson.iquest.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> DG agrees. Great! David says he will do the commit. :> :> I really like the effect the patch has had on my systems, I think this :> patch is a candidate for MFC'ing to -stable later on, too ( before the next :> release ). We might eventually be able to get rid of B_MALLOC entirely, :> but I'll save that for a later time. :> :The purpose of B_MALLOC was to eliminate the unnecessary overhead for lots :of small directories being backed by entire pages instead of partial pages. :(Internal memory fragmentation.) Most dirs are 512 or 2048 and wasting :an entire page for most directories seems to be undesireable. The advantage :of coherent caching of directories is pretty much non-existant, since such :naming happens through the VFS layering framework. : :The big advantage of what you have suggested is that directory caching isn't :limited by the size of the buffer cache. I originally designed the code to :support the buffer cache only being a temporary mapping, and dirty pages :could be passed from the buffer cache to the anonymous cache. : :John I see an advantage both ways. Not only are we able to use the VM cache to cache directories ( and thus scale directory operations to memory ), but I don't think there is even a downside to mapping whole pages even for small directories. The reason is simple: When you access small directories you tend to access specific files in said directories. When you access specific files, there's a good chance they will be in the namei cache. If they are in the namei cache, the VMIO mapping will not be referenced very often for most small directories which means that the VM cache will throw it away. Hence, no waste. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 13:21:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wall.polstra.com (rtrwan160.accessone.com [206.213.115.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A44414D13 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 13:21:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Received: from vashon.polstra.com (vashon.polstra.com [206.213.73.13]) by wall.polstra.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA22478; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 13:18:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Received: (from jdp@localhost) by vashon.polstra.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id NAA20628; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 13:18:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199904181724.MAA30234@spawn.nectar.com> Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 13:18:45 -0700 (PDT) Organization: Polstra & Co., Inc. From: John Polstra To: Jacques Vidrine Subject: Re: __attribute__ ((constructor)) functions & shared libs Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jacques Vidrine wrote: > On 18 April 1999 at 9:39, John Polstra wrote: > >> If it's ELF, the dynamic linker runs before crt1 gets control. The >> kernel invokes the dynamic linker directly. After it has finished >> its job, the dynamic linker transfers control to the main program's >> entry point. > > Where can I find this code (which invokes the dynamic linker)? In "src/sys/kern/imgact_elf.c". The dynamic linker is referred to there as the "interpreter". The kernel finds its pathname in the executable. The kernel loads both the executable and the interpreter, and then it passes control to the interpreter. The interpreter is responsible for getting control to the entry point of the executable, eventually. You'll find the jump instruction that does that in "src/libexec/rtld-elf/i386/rtld_start.S". > A backtrace from the debugger showed _rtld -> _init -> do_ctors -> > libfoo_init, but I'm not sure where to find _rtld() and _init(). _rtld() is in "src/libexec/rtld-elf/rtld.c". _init() is a little bit more complicated. It is in several pieces, all of which can be found in "src/lib/csu/i386-elf/". The function label comes from "crti.S". The body consists of whatever is in the ".init" section. "crtbegin.c" puts a call to do_ctors() there, to invoke all the global constructors. Other components (libraries, etc) can contribute additional code if they want to. (None of ours do.) Finally, the return from subroutine instruction comes from "crtn.S". To see how the pieces fit together, link something using "cc -v" and examine the "ld" command that is generated. >> You are not officially "allowed" to assume that anything is already >> initialized in those constructor/destructor functions. Not even >> printf is really guaranteed to work. But perhaps we can make some >> simple changes so that most things will work despite that. > > I hope so. This code does some fairly heavy duty stuff during > initialization, including XOpenDisplay! It apparently works on some > versions of OSF/1, HP/UX, AIX, SCO, IRIX, Solaris, SunOS, and Linux. > I have a hunch it would work on a FreeBSD a.out system, though I > haven't tested this. I'm sure I can make it work for ELF too. I know how to do it. I'll send you a patch to try when it's ready, but I have to do some other things first for a few hours. John --- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-interest is the aphrodisiac of belief." -- James V. DeLong To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 13:23:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (blaubaer.kn-bremen.de [194.94.232.249]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D94E914BEE; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 13:23:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nox@saturn.kn-bremen.de) Received: from saturn.kn-bremen.de (uucp@localhost) by blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (8.9.1/8.9.1) with UUCP id WAA10951; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 22:16:47 +0200 Received: (from nox@localhost) by saturn.kn-bremen.de (8.9.3/8.8.5) id WAA94208; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 22:15:05 +0200 (MET DST) From: Juergen Lock Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 22:15:05 +0200 To: Seigo TANIMURA Cc: zinnia@jan.ne.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports Message-ID: <19990418221505.A86834@saturn.kn-bremen.de> References: <19990417133707.A39454@saturn.kn-bremen.de> <19990418150617N.tanimura@sakuramail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <19990418150617N.tanimura@sakuramail.com>; from Seigo TANIMURA on Sun, Apr 18, 1999 at 03:06:17PM +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Apr 18, 1999 at 03:06:17PM +0900, Seigo TANIMURA wrote: > Another bad news, I tried driving my SC-88 connected directly to a PC using > Windows 95 and Portman PC/S driver, to find a miserable result. I saw no midi > messages come properly, so Portman PC/S should be cooking the signals in some way... Or uses a higher speed than 38k4, can you check that? Hmm, or maybe i should just take my old Atari MSTe and use that as serial<->midi interface... Regards, -- Juergen Lock To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 13:47:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cerebus.nectar.com (nectar-gw.nectar.com [204.0.249.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EAC3114F1B for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 13:47:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nectar@nectar.com) Received: (from smap@localhost) by cerebus.nectar.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) id PAA62947; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 15:44:58 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from nectar@nectar.com) Received: from spawn.nectar.com(10.0.0.101) by cerebus.nectar.com via smap (V2.1) id xma062945; Sun, 18 Apr 99 15:44:41 -0500 Received: from spawn.nectar.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spawn.nectar.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id PAA12230; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 15:43:16 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from nectar@spawn.nectar.com) Message-Id: <199904182043.PAA12230@spawn.nectar.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 X-Exmh-Isig-CompType: repl X-Exmh-Isig-Folder: mlist/freebsd/hackers X-PGP-RSAfprint: 00 F9 E6 A2 C5 4D 0A 76 26 8B 8B 57 73 D0 DE EE X-PGP-RSAkey: http://www.nectar.com/nectar-rsa.txt X-PGP-DSSfprint: AB2F 8D71 A4F4 467D 352E 8A41 5D79 22E4 71A2 8C73 X-PGP-DHfprint: 2D50 12E5 AB38 60BA AF4B 0778 7242 4460 1C32 F6B1 X-PGP-DH-DSSkey: http://www.nectar.com/nectar-dh-dss.txt From: Jacques Vidrine In-reply-to: References: Subject: Re: __attribute__ ((constructor)) functions & shared libs Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain To: John Polstra Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 15:43:16 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 18 April 1999 at 13:18, John Polstra wrote: [snip] > I'm sure I can make it work for ELF too. I know how to do it. I'll > send you a patch to try when it's ready, but I have to do some other > things first for a few hours. Fair enough. Thanks for all the info! Jacques Vidrine / n@nectar.com / nectar@FreeBSD.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 15: 7:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (skynet.ctr.columbia.edu [128.59.64.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id DF09B14D68; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 15:07:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu) Received: (from wpaul@localhost) by skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (8.6.12/8.6.9) id SAA11727; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 18:04:51 -0400 From: Bill Paul Message-Id: <199904182204.SAA11727@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> Subject: Call for testers for ADMtek AL981 fast ethernet driver To: hackers@freebsd.org, hardware@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 18:04:50 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 2536 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This is a call for testers for the if_al driver for the ADMtek AL981 "Comet" 10/100 ethernet chip. This chip is fairly new, so I don't know how many people actually have boards with them, but if you have one please give the driver a try. I have only tested 10Mbps at this point since I can't test anything else at home. The driver is at: http://www.freebsd.org/~wpaul/ADMtek/3.0 To add it, do the following: - Download if_al.c and if_alreg.h and copy them to /sys/pci - Edit /sys/conf/files and add a line that says: pci/if_al.c optional al device-driver - Edit your kernel config (e.g. /sys/i386/conf/GENERIC) and add a line that says: device al0 - Compile a new kernel and boot it. This driver should work on FreeBSD 3.0 and up, though I have not tested it with the new bus stuff (it still uses the old PCI interface mechanism). FreeBSD/i386 and FreeBSD/alpha are both supported. (I do plan to make a 2.2.x version soon, as well as convert the other drivers to the new bus architecture. Just at the moment I have too many other things to do.) The AL981 is yet another tulip style clone. Unlike the real tulip, the AL981's receive filter is programmed using registers; there's one perfect filter entry for the station address and a 64-bit multicast hash table. The AL981 has a built-in 10/100Mbps transceiver with pseudo-MII interface. It also supports power management and wake on lan. Very nice programming documentation is available from http://www.admtek.com.tw. The AL981 has one downside, which is that like all the other taiwanese chips, it doesn't decode all of the bits in the RX DMA buffer address, which means that receive buffers must be longword aligned. This makes life a little difficult on the alpha, but at least this limitation is properly documented in the manual. A big thanks to ADMtek for sending me two test boards and for making their documentation freely available. As usual, if you have problems, please let me know at wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu. -Bill -- ============================================================================= -Bill Paul (212) 854-6020 | System Manager, Master of Unix-Fu Work: wpaul@ctr.columbia.edu | Center for Telecommunications Research Home: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu | Columbia University, New York City ============================================================================= "It is not I who am crazy; it is I who am mad!" - Ren Hoek, "Space Madness" ============================================================================= To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 17:59:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cain.gsoft.com.au (genesi.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E98614C8D for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 17:59:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Received: from lot.gsoft.com.au (lot.gsoft.com.au [203.38.152.106]) by cain.gsoft.com.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA20984; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:26:42 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:33:12 +0930 (CST) From: "Daniel O'Connor" To: Brian Beattie Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Greg Black , "C. Stephen Gunn" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 16-Apr-99 Brian Beattie wrote: > I am philosophically opposed to this type of feature, I believe it > promotes slovenly work habits. On the other hand as a practical matter it > would probably save a lot of time, when dealing with non-professionals. Professionals don't make mistakes? wow. I don't know any then. ;) > I would also agree that libc hacking is a poor route. I think its more useful than kernel hacking.. (ie reading enviromental variables from the kernel would be difficult AFAIK) --- Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." -- Andrew Tanenbaum To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 18: 7:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 22DE214CA3 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 18:07:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA46511; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 21:04:57 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 21:04:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: "Daniel O'Connor" Cc: Brian Beattie , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Greg Black , "C. Stephen Gunn" Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Daniel O'Connor wrote: > > On 16-Apr-99 Brian Beattie wrote: > > I am philosophically opposed to this type of feature, I believe it > > promotes slovenly work habits. On the other hand as a practical matter it > > would probably save a lot of time, when dealing with non-professionals. > > Professionals don't make mistakes? wow. I don't know any then. ;) > > > I would also agree that libc hacking is a poor route. > > I think its more useful than kernel hacking.. (ie reading enviromental > variables from the kernel would be difficult AFAIK) Why would you think that? Copyin is your friend. > > --- > Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer > for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au > "The nice thing about standards is that there > are so many of them to choose from." > -- Andrew Tanenbaum > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \ _ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___)___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 18:39:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC92E14E8F; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 18:39:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id SAA83121; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 18:36:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 18:36:37 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904190136.SAA83121@apollo.backplane.com> To: Bob Bishop , Wilko Bulte , current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: NFS patch #5 avail - need testers files) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG NFS patch #5 is now available for -current. I believe I have fixed all the bugs for NFSV3 over UDP, but I need people to help test it. http://www.backplane.com/FreeBSD4/ This patch also includes general B_VMIO caching for directories ( ufs, nfs, anyone ), which DG may commit soon so if you get errors just wait a bit for me to update the patch or fix collisions yourself. To use, unapply any previous patches and start fresh. I believe this patch to be reasonably stable -- enough that it should be possible to perform meaningful testing with it. But, as always, do not run this on any box containing critical data. It has successfully passed *all* of my tests so far. Note that this is for NFSV3 UDP only, and although all the fixes apply to TCP and most of them apply to NFS V2 too, TCP probably still has other bugs. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 22:32:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A47215071 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 22:32:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dmlb@ragnet.demon.co.uk) Received: from [158.152.46.40] (helo=ragnet.demon.co.uk) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 10Z6dQ-000Nmk-0K; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 05:30:21 +0000 Received: from dmlb by ragnet.demon.co.uk with local (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10Yw8x-000OQx-00; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 19:18:11 +0100 Content-Length: 2042 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199904181452.JAA18474@dyson.iquest.net> Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 19:18:10 +0100 (BST) From: Duncan Barclay To: "John S. Dyson" Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, (Matthew Dillon) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 18-Apr-99 John S. Dyson wrote: > Perhaps before getting rid of B_MALLOC, take a look at the standard > mix of directory sizes (don't just look at news servers.) If there is an > extreme bias towards 512 or 2048, then you might consider keeping B_MALLOC. > > John From my home machine which I'd classify as a workstation: Directory Size Count 512 34354 1024 963 1536 358 2048 245 2560 74 3072 50 3584 37 4096 39 4608 7 5120 13 5632 14 6144 22 6656 7 7168 1 7680 4 8192 4 8704 1 9216 6 9728 2 10240 5 10752 2 11264 1 12288 3 12800 2 13824 1 14336 2 16384 1 17408 1 17920 1 18432 1 18944 1 20480 1 20992 1 22528 1 24064 1 26624 2 30208 1 30720 3 31232 1 33792 1 41984 1 42496 2 169984 1 This includes the FreeBSD CVS repository, a couple of smaller projects, a small news server (about 50 groups) and the first CDROM from 3.1R (giving the 169984 directory /cdrom/packages/All!). A fairly convincing bias to directories less than 8192 bytes. Duncan --- ________________________________________________________________________ Duncan Barclay | God smiles upon the little children, dmlb@ragnet.demon.co.uk | the alcoholics, and the permanently stoned. ________________________________________________________________________ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 18 23: 0:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD0FF14E51 for ; Sun, 18 Apr 1999 23:00:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id BAA12774 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 01:57:45 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904190557.BAA12774@cs.rpi.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: wchar support for FreeBSD Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 01:57:43 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This should be considered a pre alpha quality work. I have written it and so far eyeball checked it. I have only verified it compiles without errors. (It does give a couple of warnings). What "it" is, is a set of routines for the "wchar_t" type that match the standard C string routines (strcat, strncat, strcpy, etc.). I would like that [corrected] versions of these make their way into the libc source. I would appreciate comments/bugfixes/etc to be emailed to me at: crossd@cs.rpi.edu. You can download the pre-alpha tarball from: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd/FreeBSD/wcs.tar The list of things I am still working on, and will have done in the next day or so are: Documentation (man pages and source comments), bug testing and fixes. Have fun. -- David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 0: 8:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-01.cdsnet.net (mail-01.cdsnet.net [206.107.16.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id EF59515062 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 00:08:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mrcpu@internetcds.com) Received: (qmail 3802 invoked from network); 19 Apr 1999 07:05:51 -0000 Received: from schizo.cdsnet.net (204.118.244.32) by mail.cdsnet.net with SMTP; 19 Apr 1999 07:05:51 -0000 Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 00:04:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Jaye Mathisen X-Sender: mrcpu@schizo.cdsnet.net To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Anybody besides me seeing hangs/weird NFS anomalies under SMP? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG One of my test boxes gets frozen up with NFS mounts under heavy loads, when running SMP. If I boot a kernel w/o the second processor support, it seems to work just fine. My kernel is about 4 days old, from the RELENG_3 branch. News via CNFS generates the problem relatively trivially (within 24-36 hours). Running uniprocessor on the same hardware has not hung yet I believe. Anyway, I know Matt's been a busy little beaver over in -current, I was just curious if there were any obvious fixes for -stable... Thanks. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 0:11:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B369014FBF for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 00:11:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id AAA84280; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 00:08:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 00:08:59 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904190708.AAA84280@apollo.backplane.com> To: Jaye Mathisen Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Anybody besides me seeing hangs/weird NFS anomalies under SMP? References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :If I boot a kernel w/o the second processor support, it seems to work just :fine. : :My kernel is about 4 days old, from the RELENG_3 branch. : :News via CNFS generates the problem relatively trivially (within 24-36 :hours). Running uniprocessor on the same hardware has not hung yet I :believe. : :Anyway, I know Matt's been a busy little beaver over in -current, I was :just curious if there were any obvious fixes for -stable... : :Thanks. If you have the kernel configured for DDB you should be able to break into it with ctl-alt-esc and do two things. First, a 'trace' ( just in case the current process is in a tight supervisor loop ), then a 'ps' to see what various processes are blocked on. That might give us enough info to narrow the problem down a bit. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 2: 5:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D298914F9E; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 02:05:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id CAA03745; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 02:03:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: hackers@freebsd.org Cc: gibbs@freebsd.org Subject: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 02:03:18 -0700 Message-ID: <3743.924512598@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG My fault for not plugging it in for quite some time, but it now appears that CAM has broken support for my Scanjet 4P. I have a copy of xvscan from Tummysoft and it no longer works, nor does our hpscan port (which I also had working for the HP back when I maintained that port). I'll contact Tummysoft and figure out if there's some way I can get them to do a new xvscan release, but in the interim, does anyone have any suggestions? Of course, I've plugged it in because I need to scan some pictures in for advocacy purposes and the fact that it doesn't work has come as something of an unexpected setback to that project. I've tried the obvious stuff, like using pass0..passn (which appears equivalent to uk), but it's no go. It makes me wonder how many of tummysoft's other FreeBSD customers have suddenly woken up to the fact that we broke their commercial software. :( - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 3:15:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 062F614EF1; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 03:15:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id DAA41893; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 03:11:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904191011.DAA41893@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 02:03:18 PDT." <3743.924512598@zippy.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 03:11:51 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I use SANE and GIMP to do my scanning and processing of images . My scsi scanner is a UMAX. Amancio -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 3:21:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D953014EF1; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 03:21:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id DAA04145; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 03:18:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Amancio Hasty Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 03:11:51 PDT." <199904191011.DAA41893@rah.star-gate.com> Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 03:18:53 -0700 Message-ID: <4143.924517133@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I use SANE and GIMP to do my scanning and processing of images . > My scsi scanner is a UMAX. I'm just looking into this now - any pointers on using it? How do you get gimp to "know" about sane, or is this an automagic side-effect of installing the sane port? Thanks! - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 4: 0:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 262241501D; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 04:00:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id DAA42105; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 03:56:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904191056.DAA42105@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 03:18:53 PDT." <4143.924517133@zippy.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 03:56:52 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Is all auto magic. Install GIMP and then install SANE which should detect the GIMP port and creates a GIMP plug in. After that you have the option of using SANE stand alone or scan via GIMP that is the images get directly imported into GIMP which then you can do image post processing to your hearts content. Amancio > > I use SANE and GIMP to do my scanning and processing of images . > > My scsi scanner is a UMAX. > > I'm just looking into this now - any pointers on using it? How do you > get gimp to "know" about sane, or is this an automagic side-effect of > installing the sane port? > > Thanks! > > - Jordan -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 5: 7:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 5C4E2150F5; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 05:07:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id LAA19976; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 11:49:39 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199904190949.LAA19976@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). To: jkh@zippy.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 11:49:39 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <3743.924512598@zippy.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Apr 19, 99 02:02:59 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1040 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > My fault for not plugging it in for quite some time, but it now > appears that CAM has broken support for my Scanjet 4P. I have a copy i reported this some time ago when i tried to use hpscanpbm and some other home-grown thing for controlling my scanjet 5p on 3.1. "fortunately" my scanjet seems not to work anymore (i have no idea if it is having firmware problems or servo problems or what...) so i had to replace it with a parallel port Artec AS6E for which i managed to write a control program at http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ppscan990326.c the AS6E is very cheap, kind of poor quality but its data sheets are available... cheers luigi -----------------------------------+------------------------------------- Luigi RIZZO . EMAIL: luigi@iet.unipi.it . Dip. di Ing. dell'Informazione HTTP://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ . Universita` di Pisa TEL/FAX: +39-050-568.533/522 . via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) -----------------------------------+------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 5:18:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mrelay.jrc.it (mrelay.jrc.it [139.191.1.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C02E714DC9 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 05:18:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nick.hibma@jrc.it) Received: from elpc36.jrc.it (elpc36.jrc.it [139.191.71.36]) by mrelay.jrc.it (LMC5692) with SMTP id OAA27921 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 14:20:12 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 14:16:24 +0200 (CEST) From: Nick Hibma X-Sender: n_hibma@elpc36.jrc.it Reply-To: Nick Hibma To: FreeBSD hackers mailing list Subject: USB ISDN adapter Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Anyone willing to pick up the implementation of a USB driver for the 3COM USB ISDN adapter? Cheers, Nick To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 6:56: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nero.cybersites.com (nero.cybersites.com [207.92.123.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 28C08150A4 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 06:55:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cyouse@cybersites.com) Received: from ns1.cybersites.com (ns1.cybersites.com [207.92.123.2]) by nero.cybersites.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA09534; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 09:53:27 -0400 From: Chuck Youse To: Dennis , chris@calldei.com Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 09:47:45 -0400 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.17] Content-Type: text/plain Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <199904152225.SAA20324@etinc.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <99041909500702.38298@ns1.cybersites.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-KMail-Mark: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The ability of NT to take better advantage of multiple processors is a function of design, rather than "working with Intel". NT follows the microkernel design model, with message passing, which is much easier to spread over multiple processors than a typical monolithic kernel design. -- Chuck Youse Director of Systems cyouse@cybersites.com On Thu, 15 Apr 1999, Dennis wrote: > Maybe so, but it MAY simply be that microsoft's multiprocessor support > is better than LINUX's...I'd like to see the same test on a single processor > machine....its not impossible that NT4 was optimized for use on a > multi-cpu machine...they certainly have had more time with intel to > work on it than the linux people have. > Dennis To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 7: 5:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mrelay.jrc.it (mrelay.jrc.it [139.191.1.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C792414FF6; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 07:05:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nick.hibma@jrc.it) Received: from elpc36.jrc.it (elpc36.jrc.it [139.191.71.36]) by mrelay.jrc.it (LMC5692) with SMTP id QAA02852; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 16:06:55 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 16:03:07 +0200 (CEST) From: Nick Hibma X-Sender: n_hibma@elpc36.jrc.it Reply-To: Nick Hibma To: Luigi Rizzo Cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-Reply-To: <199904190949.LAA19976@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Anyone fancy buying a HP USB scanner and writing the support for it? There is a number of HP scanners out there. I expect them to be SCSI scanners with a USB wrapper. If this is the case than we can support them through the Mass Storage Bulk-Only transport layer which is being used already for the USB ZIP drives and make them look like SCSI scanners. Cheers, Nick FreeBSD USB project. http://www.etla.net/~n_hibma/usb/usb.pl On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > My fault for not plugging it in for quite some time, but it now > > appears that CAM has broken support for my Scanjet 4P. I have a copy > > i reported this some time ago when i tried to use hpscanpbm and some > other home-grown thing for controlling my scanjet 5p on 3.1. > > "fortunately" my scanjet seems not to work anymore (i have no idea > if it is having firmware problems or servo problems or what...) so > i had to replace it with a parallel port Artec AS6E for which i > managed to write a control program at > > http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ppscan990326.c > > the AS6E is very cheap, kind of poor quality but its data sheets are > available... > > cheers > luigi > -----------------------------------+------------------------------------- > Luigi RIZZO . > EMAIL: luigi@iet.unipi.it . Dip. di Ing. dell'Informazione > HTTP://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ . Universita` di Pisa > TEL/FAX: +39-050-568.533/522 . via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) > -----------------------------------+------------------------------------- > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 7:13:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE82C154BE for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 07:13:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (homer.softweyr.com [204.68.178.39]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA24168; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 08:10:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <371B3961.D87FA1F9@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 08:10:41 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Chuck Youse Cc: Dennis , chris@calldei.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux References: <199904152225.SAA20324@etinc.com> <99041909500702.38298@ns1.cybersites.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Chuck Youse wrote: > > The ability of NT to take better advantage of multiple processors is a function > of design, rather than "working with Intel". NT follows the microkernel design > model, with message passing, which is much easier to spread over multiple > processors than a typical monolithic kernel design. Please note that NTs multiprocessor efficiency is nowhere near that of Solaris. Perhaps it will get better in the Win2K bug, since Microsoft has gained the assistance of Sequent, who actually know how to do SMP. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 8:32:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ifi.uio.no (ifi.uio.no [129.240.64.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6708A14CFB for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 08:32:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@ifi.uio.no) Received: from gladsheim.ifi.uio.no (2602@gladsheim.ifi.uio.no [129.240.64.132]) by ifi.uio.no (8.8.8/8.8.7/ifi0.2) with ESMTP id RAA06959 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 17:30:13 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from des@localhost) by gladsheim.ifi.uio.no ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 17:30:13 +0200 (MET DST) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: [ifi.test.boa] [comp.std.c] Re: coding style advice ... really source & binary constraints From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 19 Apr 1999 17:30:11 +0200 Message-ID: Lines: 129 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Thought this might interest some of you guys. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@ifi.uio.no ------- Start of forwarded message ------- From: mash@mash.engr.sgi.com (John R. Mashey) Newsgroups: ifi.test.boa Subject: [comp.std.c] Re: coding style advice ... really source & binary constraints Date: 14 Apr 1999 21:51:48 +0200 Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc. Message-ID: <7f2rkg$3h2$1%murrow.corp.sgi.com@ifi.uio.no> References: <7dvdbl$4tp$1@shade.twinsun.com> <7e1uer$c4e$1@shade.twinsun.com> <7e3704$cgm$1@shade.twinsun.com> <3712688E.4A921D21@technologist.com> <37127362.A1EF701F@wizard.net> <3714BBB1.EE94C780@technologist.com> There still seems to be a lot of confusion arounbd portability, consistency, and data types whose sizes may be different in different implementations, and at least some of the statements in this thread have over-stated or mis-stated some of the cases. Suppose you start with code that is clean, portable, and self-consistent, but consider the different kinds of contraints that may be placed on any given data declaration: 1) INTERNAL CONSISTENCY Internal consistency inside an application or app suite, i.e., that it is the "right size" in relationship to other sizes. Most of the discussions here focus on issues around this kind of consistency. [There are, of course, plenty of programs that don't do binary I/O, don't have device dependencies, and port cleanly to almost any of the programming models.] One uses char, short, int long, long long, pointer, etc, preferably indireclty through typedefs. One might use fastest and least types. Direct use of exact-sized datatypes ought to be avoided. 2) EXTERNAL, IMMUTABLE CONSTRAINTS Consistency with external, immutable constraints set by: 2a) Hardware 2b) External network protocols 2c) Binary file interfaces external to an application suite These are 100% not under your control, and where exact-size datatypes are natural and appropriate, and where problems get caused by use of data types whose size might get changed. 3) INDUCED CODE-LOCK Binary consistency with other software interlinked with this software: 3a) Library binary interfaces, i.e., code interfaces. You may start with perfectly-portable source code for apps and libraries, that in fact can be compiled under various memory models, but once you have done this and established an environment, if you want to change the size of almost anything, you have to create an entire new parallel environment, or else do certain kinds of additions: a) This is why people with ILP32 converted to ILp32LL, rather than changing the sizeof long there, and then, for 64-bit CPUs, added entire complete LP64 environments alongside. b) This is why the Large File Summit *added* off64_t, lseek64, etc, rather than changing the size of off_t. 4) INDUCED DATA-LOCK Binary consistency with other software on same machine, possibly at different times, induced by data issues. 4a) Shared-memory 4b) Non-transient binary files For 4a), people occasionally create application suites where some executables are 32-bit and a few that have both 32- and 64-bit versions, and maybe use shared-memory for fast communication. This requires care in the definition of structs that are used from both sides. For example, to go from an ILP32LL to mixed ILP32LL/LP64 environment, one would want to do things like eliminating any direct long specifications in favor of ints, or better, typdefs that are mapped appropriately. You will have to be careful with pointer definitions, if any. 4b) It is imprecise to claim there is a problem in using variably-sized data types when writing to binary files. There is no problem if the binary files are transient temp files used inside one program, or a suite of programs that may always be recompiled together. There are plenty of program suites where one program reads data from the outside world, then gets it into an internal format that many other codes use, and this works fine. The problem arises when the code is recompiled with a different model and expected to read the existing data. For example, if you have a set of utilities for manipulating object files, doen in ILP32LL, and you used longs in those structs, you will probably be unhappy if you just recompile to LP64 [and in fact, most people's tools are still ILP32LL, even when dealing with LP64 object files.] In summary, 1) There are internal data items whose sizes can be chsoen for speed, portability, etc, and mainly need to be consistent as a group, and are fairly portable. 2) There are data sizes set by external constraints that are simply immutable, and you have must have exact descriptions of what's out there, preferably using exact types to make this absolutely clear. The issue of course, is the size relationships of these items to those in 1). 3) In portable code, some data items may have different sizes in different environments, but once you instantiate code in one environment, the sizes are locked down, in that environment, and you can't make a different choice until you can acquire an entire new environment with a consistent set of sizes. 4) There are data sizes where you start with portable code, but you create data whose sizes propagate into permanent data, and even if you acquire an entire additional environment (like LP64), there are binary interfaces that persist, and you will have to look carefully at any structures that describe the interfaces, and you will find yourself wanting typedefs that either convert to exact types, or equivalent, and of course, you will have to look at consistency between structs that go outside, and internal consistency. Note the difference between 2) where exact types are good, and 1), and even 3), where exact types should probably mostly be avoided, and 4), where they should be avoided, except sometimes in interface definitions. In almost all cases, Microsoft-like advice actually works: hardly ever use the base data types directly, use typedefs, and understand the constraints likely to be faced by them. -- -john mashey DISCLAIMER: EMAIL: mash@sgi.com DDD: 650-933-3090 FAX: 650-933-4392 USPS: Silicon Graphics/Cray Research 40U-005, 2011 N. Shoreline Blvd, Mountain View, CA 94043-1389 ------- End of forwarded message ------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 9:14:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sol (cs1-gw.cs.binghamton.edu [128.226.171.72]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 4E5E414F4A for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 09:14:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu) Received: from localhost (zzhang@localhost) by sol (SMI-8.6/8.6.9) with SMTP id MAA20391; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 12:01:35 -0400 Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 12:01:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Zhihui Zhang To: Matthew Dillon Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! In-Reply-To: <199904171844.LAA75452@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I tried to apply your patch to FreeBSD 2.2.8. I only made changes to file vfs_subr.c (vfs_object_create()) and vfs_vnops.c (vn_open()) because I can not find the corresponding places in file vfs_lookup.c and vfs_syscalls.c. After this, I made a new kernel and reboot. I issue the following command: # find /usr/src -name "*.?" -exec grep "dummy" /dev/null {} \; It takes about five minutes as it did before I modified the kernel and reboot. So obviously the modifications I made are not enough. I should change something else to really use it. Can you please tell me where to look at in 2.2.8? Somewhere in namei()? I believe your idea is a good one because it may help to solve the directory layout problem when you do depth-first search of directories (as in find?). The reason I need it now is that each time I spend 5 minutes to search for a symbol in the source code tree under /usr/src. Thanks for your help. -Zhihui To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 9:52:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wall.polstra.com (rtrwan160.accessone.com [206.213.115.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 416B71529F for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 09:52:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Received: from vashon.polstra.com (vashon.polstra.com [206.213.73.13]) by wall.polstra.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA27199; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 09:50:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) From: John Polstra Received: (from jdp@localhost) by vashon.polstra.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id JAA24137; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 09:50:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 09:50:12 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904191650.JAA24137@vashon.polstra.com> To: dillon@apollo.backplane.com Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! In-Reply-To: <199904171844.LAA75452@apollo.backplane.com> Organization: Polstra & Co., Seattle, WA Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article <199904171844.LAA75452@apollo.backplane.com>, Matthew Dillon wrote: > When I scan enough directories ( e.g. a megabyte worth of directories > on a 1 GB machine), then scan again, the data is re-fetched from disk. If I understand your description correctly, this fix could really benefit master CVSup servers such as freefall. Those servers typically have 8-12 running cvsupd processes, all doing tree walks over the same CVS repository and making a stat() call on every file. Do you think it would help? John -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-interest is the aphrodisiac of belief." -- James V. DeLong To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 10:30:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 977F715533 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:30:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA43931; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:26:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904191726.KAA43931@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Wes Peters Cc: Chuck Youse , Dennis , chris@calldei.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 08:10:41 MDT." <371B3961.D87FA1F9@softweyr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:26:23 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi , Don't forget that Microsoft has found HP to be a strong ally and I am not saying that HP is evil is just that it chose to go along the business lines of Microsoft. > > Please note that NTs multiprocessor efficiency is nowhere near that of > Solaris. Perhaps it will get better in the Win2K bug, since Microsoft > has gained the assistance of Sequent, who actually know how to do SMP. -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 10:41: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B04614DB2 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:40:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id CAA29595; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 02:37:33 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <371B6966.7D020080@newsguy.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 02:35:34 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Amancio Hasty Cc: Wes Peters , Chuck Youse , Dennis , chris@calldei.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux References: <199904191726.KAA43931@rah.star-gate.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Amancio Hasty wrote: > > Don't forget that Microsoft has found HP to be a strong ally and > I am not saying that HP is evil is just that it chose to go along > the business lines of Microsoft. And aren't the business lines of Microsoft Evil? -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "Well, Windows works, using a loose definition of 'works'..." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 10:43:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C711715160 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:43:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA44113; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:39:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904191739.KAA44113@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Cc: Wes Peters , Chuck Youse , Dennis , chris@calldei.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 20 Apr 1999 02:35:34 +0900." <371B6966.7D020080@newsguy.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:39:15 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, Look is more like HP surrendered to Microsoft > Amancio Hasty wrote: > > > > Don't forget that Microsoft has found HP to be a strong ally and > > I am not saying that HP is evil is just that it chose to go along > > the business lines of Microsoft. > > And aren't the business lines of Microsoft Evil? > > -- > Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) > dcs@newsguy.com > dcs@freebsd.org > > "Well, Windows works, using a loose definition of 'works'..." -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 10:53:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19DCD155E6; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:53:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA05564; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:50:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Amancio Hasty Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 03:56:52 PDT." <199904191056.DAA42105@rah.star-gate.com> Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:50:37 -0700 Message-ID: <5562.924544237@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Is all auto magic. > > Install GIMP and then install SANE which should detect the GIMP port and > creates a GIMP plug in. That much appears to have worked. > After that you have the option of using SANE stand alone or scan via GIMP > that is the images get directly imported into GIMP which then you can do > image post processing to your hearts content. That much does not - when I bring up acquire in the "xtras" menu, it gives me no option to select the scanner device or communicate with the scanner in any way. When I click on preview or anything on that window, I get: "scanner: invalid argument" How's this supposed to work, anyway? :) - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 10:54:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 987B814C8E; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:54:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA05575; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:51:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Nick Hibma Cc: Luigi Rizzo , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 16:03:07 +0200." Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:51:25 -0700 Message-ID: <5573.924544285@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Anyone fancy buying a HP USB scanner and writing the support for it? I dunno, but I'd be more than happy to buy YOU an HP USB scanner if you're interested? :-) - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 11: 7: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from phobos.illtel.denver.co.us (dsl-206.169.4.82.wenet.com [206.169.4.82]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9854114FC8 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 11:07:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from abelits@phobos.illtel.denver.co.us) Received: from localhost (abelits@localhost) by phobos.illtel.denver.co.us (8.9.1a/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA28484; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 11:06:05 -0700 Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 11:06:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex Belits To: Amancio Hasty Cc: "Daniel C. Sobral" , Wes Peters , Chuck Youse , Dennis , chris@calldei.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: <199904191739.KAA44113@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > Look is more like HP surrendered to Microsoft Rick Belluzo sabotaged HP and is finishing SGI now. -- Alex ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Excellent.. now give users the option to cut your hair you hippie! -- Anonymous Coward To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 11:35:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0EF571501D; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 11:35:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA00550; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 11:32:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904191832.LAA00550@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 03:18:53 PDT." <4143.924517133@zippy.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 11:32:58 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ls -ald /dev/xpt0 104, 0 Nov 22 23:38 /dev/xpt0 ls -ald /dev/pass1 31, 3 Apr 19 11:20 /dev/pass1 The minor number 3 denotes the pass thru device: From the output of dmesg: rah /kernel: pass3: Fixed Scanner SCSI-2 device /usr/local/sane.d cat umax.conf /dev/pass1 cat dll.conf umax That should do it. -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 12:40:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C83CA1567B for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 12:40:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id MAA20323; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 12:34:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omni.xylan.com by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id MAA16641; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 12:34:50 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com (dyn5.utah.xylan.com) by omni.xylan.com (4.1/SMI-4.1 (xylan engr [SPOOL])) id AA11840; Mon, 19 Apr 99 12:34:42 PDT Message-Id: <371B854F.A527BFE4@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 13:34:39 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Amancio Hasty Cc: Chuck Youse , Dennis , chris@calldei.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux References: <199904191726.KAA43931@rah.star-gate.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Amancio Hasty wrote: > > Hi , > > Don't forget that Microsoft has found HP to be a strong ally and > I am not saying that HP is evil is just that it chose to go along > the business lines of Microsoft. Of course HP is evil; they've heavily partnered with Microsoft on NT 5.0/Win2K/Whatever they're calling it next week, and are the design partner with Intel on "IA64." They're trying to become the systems manufacturing partner in the unholy trio, it's just failing because they insist on making their hardware just weird enough it won't interoperate with standard hardware or software. Personally, I think it's a good thing their instruments division is getting rid of their computer division and keeping the only good part that came out of computer division - OpenView. I think the instruments division got first choice. ;^) -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 12:58: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from news.IAEhv.nl (news.IAE.nl [194.151.64.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8D9B15208 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 12:57:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from devet@adv.iae.nl) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by news.IAEhv.nl (8.9.1/8.9.1) with IAEhv.nl id VAA28481 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 21:55:12 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from devet@localhost) by adv.iae.nl (8.9.3/8.8.6) id VAA05105; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 21:51:09 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 21:51:09 +0200 (CEST) From: Arjan de Vet Message-Id: <199904191951.VAA05105@adv.iae.nl> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! X-Newsgroups: list.freebsd.hackers In-Reply-To: <199904171844.LAA75452@apollo.backplane.com> Organization: Internet Access Eindhoven, the Netherlands Cc: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article <199904171844.LAA75452@apollo.backplane.com> Matt Dillon writes: > I've been playing with my new large-memory configured box and, > especially, looking at disk I/O. I've been doing this with a 640MB Squid server too the last weeks. > When I scan enough directories ( e.g. a megabyte worth of directories > on a 1 GB machine), then scan again, the data is re-fetched from disk. I've been tuning my machine to be able to cache at least 32MB worth of directories, on which I which I mailed on April 6 already. > [...] > > Right now, the buffer cache appears to limit itself to 8 MBytes or so, > and the maximum malloc space limits itself to only 400K! Rather absurdly > small for a directory cache, I think, yet I also believe that increasing > the size of the buffer cache may be detrimental due to the amount of I/O > it can bind up. I did some tests as explained below and my results (on a 3.1-stable machine, I don't now how much different -current already is) seems to indicate that directories are not limited to the malloc space only. I reran the test after applying your patch and the results are indeed different and as expected. I'm still doing some performance testing with Squid and I'll try to report on it later; Squid's usage of the filesystem and I/O behavior under heavy load is quite absurd and a good test-case for these kind of things I think. Arjan ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - 3.1 stable April 6 + big-KVM patches, 640MB RAM - /cache contains 4096 Squid directories (64 dirs with 64 subdirs each) with 384 files per directory (maximum, so dirs stay <8K). Total size of the directories is 22MB (that's 5632 bytes/directory on average). - Buffer cache size limited to 80MB instead of 8MB by patching machdep.c: diff -u -w -r1.322.2.4 machdep.c --- machdep.c 1999/02/17 13:08:41 1.322.2.4 +++ machdep.c 1999/04/09 08:23:31 @@ -369,7 +369,7 @@ if (nbuf == 0) { nbuf = 30; if( physmem > 1024) - nbuf += min((physmem - 1024) / 8, 2048); + nbuf += min((physmem - 1024) / 8, 20480); } nswbuf = max(min(nbuf/4, 64), 16); - in rc.local: tmp=`sysctl -n vfs.maxvmiobufspace` sysctl -w vfs.maxvmiobufspace=`expr $tmp / 4` to favor metadata in the buffer cache as suggested by John Dyson some time ago. - After a fresh reboot: 25544 wire 3740 act 3552 inact 0 cache 610048 free 7702 buf vfs.maxbufspace: 83251200 vfs.bufspace: 7875584 vfs.maxvmiobufspace: 13875200 vfs.vmiospace: 7613440 vfs.maxmallocbufspace: 4162560 vfs.bufmallocspace: 57344 - Read all directories: [/cache] > time ls -R > /dev/null 5.622u 2.398s 0:46.45 17.2% 210+400k 4975+0io 6pf+0w 57756 wire 3768 act 3688 inact 0 cache 577672 free 37838 buf vfs.maxbufspace: 83251200 vfs.bufspace: 38746112 vfs.maxvmiobufspace: 13875200 vfs.vmiospace: 14290944 vfs.maxmallocbufspace: 4162560 vfs.bufmallocspace: 1472512 bufspace has increased by 30MB, vmiospace has increased by 7MB (I'm wondering what data is in it...) and bufmallocspace has increased by 1.4MB. There was no other activity on the system so all this should be due to reading the directories I guess. Note that 22MB (size of all directories) plus that strange 7MB vmio data is close to the 30MB increase in bufspace... - Check whether they're really cached now: [/cache] > time ls -R > /dev/null 5.658u 1.147s 0:06.94 97.8% 208+396k 0+0io 0pf+0w OK, zero I/O. - Now add the -l option so all files needs to be stat()-ed too: [/cache] > time ls -lR > /dev/null 40.124u 54.509s 2:46.99 56.6% 209+464k 12370+0io 0pf+0w 99140 wire 3948 act 61376 inact 0 cache 478420 free 81302 buf vfs.maxbufspace: 83251200 vfs.bufspace: 83252224 vfs.maxvmiobufspace: 13875200 vfs.vmiospace: 58797056 vfs.maxmallocbufspace: 4162560 vfs.bufmallocspace: 1472512 bufspace has reached its maximum value and 58MB of pages have been moved from the buffer cache to the VM inact queue. vmiospace has increased by 44MB, bufmallocspace stayed the same. The amount of non-vmio and non-malloc space in the buffer cache is now 22MB... which is the size of all directories. Coincidence or not? If not, John Dyson's suggestion about vfs.maxvmiobufspace seems to work. - Check whether everything is really cached: [/cache] > time ls -lR > /dev/null 40.045u 54.867s 1:37.09 97.7% 208+463k 0+0io 0pf+0w OK, zero I/O again. - Applied Matt's patches, installed the new kernel, removed the vfs.maxvmiobufspace hack from rc.local, and rebooted: 26168 wire 3964 act 3696 inact 0 cache 609048 free 8411 buf vfs.maxbufspace: 83251200 vfs.bufspace: 8621056 vfs.maxvmiobufspace: 55500800 vfs.vmiospace: 8376320 vfs.maxmallocbufspace: 4162560 vfs.bufmallocspace: 44032 - [/cache] > time ls -R > /dev/null 5.572u 2.600s 0:46.82 17.4% 213+405k 4975+0io 6pf+0w 63076 wire 3852 act 3832 inact 0 cache 572112 free 38513 buf vfs.maxbufspace: 83251200 vfs.bufspace: 39437312 vfs.maxvmiobufspace: 55500800 vfs.vmiospace: 39192576 vfs.maxmallocbufspace: 4162560 vfs.bufmallocspace: 44032 Indeed, bufmallocspace did not increase and bufspace has increased by a slightly higher amount than in the old case because of this. vmiospace clearly differs, 39MB instead of 14MB. So all directory data seems indeed to be VMIO'ed now. - [/cache] > time ls -R > /dev/null 5.535u 1.203s 0:07.02 95.8% 211+402k 0+0io 0pf+0w - [/cache] > time ls -lR > /dev/null 40.492u 57.054s 2:51.16 56.9% 207+460k 12370+0io 0pf+0w 103744 wire 3976 act 62256 inact 0 cache 472900 free 81304 buf vfs.maxbufspace: 83251200 vfs.bufspace: 83246080 vfs.maxvmiobufspace: 55500800 vfs.vmiospace: 83000320 vfs.maxmallocbufspace: 4162560 vfs.bufmallocspace: 45056 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 13:12:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3257615749 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 13:12:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id NAA90029; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 13:10:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 13:10:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904192010.NAA90029@apollo.backplane.com> To: Arjan de Vet Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! References: <199904191951.VAA05105@adv.iae.nl> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Side note and warning: Those VDIR VMIO patches will run under 3.x, but they will *BREAK* NFS under 3.x. You can apply them to 4.x and include my NFS patches for 4.x ( http://www.backplane.com/FreeBSD4 ) and everything will work fine. But not on -3.x. I am pretty confident of my current NFS patch for 4.x. I was able to successfully buildworld 30 times overnight on two SMP test boxes without any errors using a FFS+softupdates /usr/obj and an NFS /usr/src. I am testing with an NFS /usr/obj now. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 13:23: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from news.IAEhv.nl (news.IAE.nl [194.151.64.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5FD2914BED for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 13:22:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from devet@adv.iae.nl) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by news.IAEhv.nl (8.9.1/8.9.1) with IAEhv.nl id WAA03823 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:20:12 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from devet@localhost) by adv.iae.nl (8.9.3/8.8.6) id WAA05340; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:19:19 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:19:19 +0200 (CEST) From: Arjan de Vet Message-Id: <199904192019.WAA05340@adv.iae.nl> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! X-Newsgroups: list.freebsd.hackers In-Reply-To: <199904191650.JAA24137@vashon.polstra.com> References: <199904171844.LAA75452@apollo.backplane.com> Organization: Internet Access Eindhoven, the Netherlands Cc: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article <199904191650.JAA24137@vashon.polstra.com> John Polstra writes: >If I understand your description correctly, this fix could really >benefit master CVSup servers such as freefall. Those servers >typically have 8-12 running cvsupd processes, all doing tree walks >over the same CVS repository and making a stat() call on every file. > >Do you think it would help? It helps to some extend I think. The Squid server I've been testing can keep 32MB worth of directories cached after some tuning but because of the enormous amount of reads and writes being done half of the directories get removed from the cache after 5-10 minutes. We're speaking about 750,000-1,000,000 files in 4096 directories in a two-level hierarchy where 80% of the files is 9 KB or less in size. B.t.w., the Squid people are working on a SquidFS which will not use individual files anymore. Given the complete random read behavior of a proxy cache this means that for 50% of the cache-hits the directories and probably inodes too need to be fetched from disk before the real data can be read. And there's also a process 'unlinkd' which unlinks()s expired files (as far as I know also in a random way too, 16-32 files/sec). All this hurts performance of course. What is needed I think is a (preferably) sysctl variable which would favor metadata w.r.t. caching whenever possible. Matt's patch makes directories VMIO data too, so I don't know whether we still can decide easily whether a cached block is metadata or not (I just started studying the buffer cache code this weekend and it's quite complicated). Arjan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 13:40:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4601814DA4 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 13:40:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id NAA90197; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 13:38:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 13:38:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904192038.NAA90197@apollo.backplane.com> To: Arjan de Vet Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! References: <199904171844.LAA75452@apollo.backplane.com> <199904192019.WAA05340@adv.iae.nl> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :What is needed I think is a (preferably) sysctl variable which would :favor metadata w.r.t. caching whenever possible. Matt's patch makes :directories VMIO data too, so I don't know whether we still can decide :easily whether a cached block is metadata or not (I just started :studying the buffer cache code this weekend and it's quite complicated). : :Arjan Hint: Ignore the buffer cache code until you understand the VM cache code, vm/vm_page.c. To answer your question re: metadata vs filedata. Neither the buffer cache nor the VM system can really tell unless they run through and check the vnode structure type. I don't think that weighting it would help anyway. The VM system does a better job then the buffer cache figuring out which pages it can throw away and which it needs to keep because it has a larger statistical sample to work with. You should be able to let it operate without any major tweaking. One thing that could be effecting the caching is the size of the vnode cache. The 'kern.maxvnodes' sysctl variable may help here ( though I suggest upping 'maxusers' rather then upping kern.maxvnodes to ensure that you do not run out of KVM, or perhaps doing both ). The VM system caches pages. Pages belong to objects. Objects belong either to running processes in an unassociated manner ( i.e. program RSS or copy-on-write pages ), or to vnodes. 'systat -vm 1' will give you a good synopsis of the vnode cache. Both files and directories are represented by vnodes. This means that if the kernel has to throw a vnode away, it has to throw the VM cache pages associated with the vnode's object away too. I think this will provide a natural weighting towards the directory vnodes from the perspective of a system running squid, because the directories are accessed far more often then any given file. This should cause the file vnodes to be thrown away first and thus weight the VM cache a bit more towards the directories. -- Another issue the namei cache. Squid is probably defeating the namei cache due to the huge number of file misses that occur. Even with the negative caching, directories are going to be scanned. The VMIO patch ought to make a huge difference for your application. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 13:41:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from iquest3.iquest.net (iquest3.iquest.net [209.43.20.203]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id A09D3150B3 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 13:41:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dyson@dyson.iquest.net) Received: (qmail 7578 invoked from network); 19 Apr 1999 20:39:03 -0000 Received: from dyson.iquest.net (198.70.144.127) by iquest3.iquest.net with SMTP; 19 Apr 1999 20:39:03 -0000 Received: (from root@localhost) by dyson.iquest.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) id PAA20464; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 15:39:00 -0500 (EST) From: "John S. Dyson" Message-Id: <199904192039.PAA20464@dyson.iquest.net> Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! In-Reply-To: <199904182002.NAA81858@apollo.backplane.com> from Matthew Dillon at "Apr 18, 99 01:02:47 pm" To: dillon@apollo.backplane.com (Matthew Dillon) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 15:38:59 -0500 (EST) Cc: dg@root.com, hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL32 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > I see an advantage both ways. Not only are we able to use the VM cache > to cache directories ( and thus scale directory operations to memory ), > but I don't think there is even a downside to mapping whole pages even for > small directories. The reason is simple: When you access small > directories you tend to access specific files in said directories. When > you access specific files, there's a good chance they will be in the namei > cache. If they are in the namei cache, the VMIO mapping will not be > referenced very often for most small directories which means that the > VM cache will throw it away. Hence, no waste. > I cannot believe that you said that: The size of the cache buffers are then up to 8X larger when using a whole page instead of a 512byte buffer. BTW, VMIO is a misnomer, and I named it... VMIO was an earlier incarnation, and some of it spilled into the existant code. Again, do a study to find out if the internal fragmentation makes things worse. Don't depend on the VM code to just "throw" things away -- if you can make considered decisions instead of deferring them to a policy somewhere, make the decision... John To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 13:44:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from iquest3.iquest.net (iquest3.iquest.net [209.43.20.203]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 86AA015051 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 13:44:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dyson@dyson.iquest.net) Received: (qmail 12453 invoked from network); 19 Apr 1999 20:42:23 -0000 Received: from dyson.iquest.net (198.70.144.127) by iquest3.iquest.net with SMTP; 19 Apr 1999 20:42:23 -0000 Received: (from root@localhost) by dyson.iquest.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) id PAA20471; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 15:42:21 -0500 (EST) From: "John S. Dyson" Message-Id: <199904192042.PAA20471@dyson.iquest.net> Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! In-Reply-To: from Duncan Barclay at "Apr 18, 99 07:18:10 pm" To: dmlb@ragnet.demon.co.uk (Duncan Barclay) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 15:42:21 -0500 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, dillon@apollo.backplane.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL32 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > On 18-Apr-99 John S. Dyson wrote: > > Perhaps before getting rid of B_MALLOC, take a look at the standard > > mix of directory sizes (don't just look at news servers.) If there is an > > extreme bias towards 512 or 2048, then you might consider keeping B_MALLOC. > > > > John > > >From my home machine which I'd classify as a workstation: > > Directory Size Count > 512 34354 > 1024 963 > 1536 358 > 2048 245 > 2560 74 > 3072 50 > 3584 37 > 4096 39 .... > Your results show the wastefulness of using a page for everything. There is NO gain from wasting the memory by rounding everything up to a page. If buffers are not used for sub-page entities, another scheme should be used. I fear expediency or sloppiness will prevail. John To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 13:53:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D68F714E12 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 13:53:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id NAA90282; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 13:51:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 13:51:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904192051.NAA90282@apollo.backplane.com> To: "John S. Dyson" Cc: dg@root.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! References: <199904192039.PAA20464@dyson.iquest.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> I see an advantage both ways. Not only are we able to use the VM cache :> to cache directories ( and thus scale directory operations to memory ), :> but I don't think there is even a downside to mapping whole pages even for :> small directories. The reason is simple: When you access small :> directories you tend to access specific files in said directories. When :> you access specific files, there's a good chance they will be in the namei :> cache. If they are in the namei cache, the VMIO mapping will not be :> referenced very often for most small directories which means that the :> VM cache will throw it away. Hence, no waste. :> : :I cannot believe that you said that: : The size of the cache buffers are then up to 8X larger when using : a whole page instead of a 512byte buffer. BTW, VMIO is a misnomer, : and I named it... VMIO was an earlier incarnation, and some of : it spilled into the existant code. : : Again, do a study to find out if the internal fragmentation makes : things worse. Don't depend on the VM code to just "throw" things : away -- if you can make considered decisions instead of deferring : them to a policy somewhere, make the decision... : :John My concern is over the fact that the buffer cache is relatively restrictive. Things get thrown out of it very quickly due to its small size. You yourself have said that one of the VM system's most important features was its ability to not throw away things that it may need to I/O back in soon. Well, I submit that whatever space we 'waste' by using the VM system to back directory information we gain by not having to re-I/O the data. But I truely do not believe that we are really wasting all that much space. How many directories are in-use on a system at any given point? Now subtract the ones that are fully namei cached... now take into account the fact that once disassociated from its struct buf, the backing pages are managed on a page-by-page basis rather then on a buffer-by-buffer basis. I do not think you are left with much, and what you ARE left with is easily managed by the VM system. Or, let me put it another way: If enough directories are being cached to make the wasteage theoretically significant, then enough directories are being cached to blow away the existing malloc buffer space and cause active data to be thrown away, resulting in unnecessary I/O. Hell, the processes *accessing* the directories are already an order of magnitude larger then the storage required for the directories. I just don't think we lose much by VMIOing directories. VM management devolves down into the art of not throwing away things you need -- you said it yourself. I think this helps enormously. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 13:55:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ewok.creative.net.au (ewok.creative.net.au [203.30.44.41]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 203CC15208 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 13:55:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adrian@freebsd.org) Received: (qmail 28412 invoked by uid 1008); 19 Apr 1999 20:52:47 -0000 Message-ID: <19990419205247.28410.qmail@ewok.creative.net.au> From: adrian@freebsd.org To: Arjan de Vet Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:19:19 +0200." <199904192019.WAA05340@adv.iae.nl> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 04:52:46 +0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Arjan de Vet writes: >In article <199904191650.JAA24137@vashon.polstra.com> John Polstra writes: > >>If I understand your description correctly, this fix could really >>benefit master CVSup servers such as freefall. Those servers >>typically have 8-12 running cvsupd processes, all doing tree walks >>over the same CVS repository and making a stat() call on every file. >> >>Do you think it would help? > >It helps to some extend I think. The Squid server I've been testing can >keep 32MB worth of directories cached after some tuning but because of >the enormous amount of reads and writes being done half of the >directories get removed from the cache after 5-10 minutes. We're >speaking about 750,000-1,000,000 files in 4096 directories in a >two-level hierarchy where 80% of the files is 9 KB or less in size. >B.t.w., the Squid people are working on a SquidFS which will not use >individual files anymore. Which is nice, but another method to fix this kind of problem (lots of memory used up to cache directory entries which really shouldn't be needed) is an inodefs - the namespace is pure inode only, and then you 'layer' stuff on top of it via stacking layers - so you'd write a squidfs stacking layer to give the virtual namespace squid uses. However, stacking layers are not quite functional yet (come on Eivind, we're all cheering here. :), and I don't think anyone would do this in the near future. If it happened, it would certinaly make applications like squid and news *fly*. Adrian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 14: 1:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sumatra.americantv.com (sumatra.americantv.com [207.170.17.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8162915637 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 14:01:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jlemon@americantv.com) Received: from right.PCS (right.PCS [148.105.10.31]) by sumatra.americantv.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA26703; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 15:58:58 -0500 (CDT) Received: from free.pcs (free.PCS [148.105.10.51]) by right.PCS (8.6.13/8.6.4) with ESMTP id PAA02158; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 15:58:27 -0500 Received: (from jlemon@localhost) by free.pcs (8.8.6/8.8.5) id PAA16517; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 15:58:27 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 15:58:27 -0500 (CDT) From: Jonathan Lemon Message-Id: <199904192058.PAA16517@free.pcs> To: Arjan.deVet@adv.iae.nl, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! X-Newsgroups: local.mail.freebsd-hackers In-Reply-To: References: Organization: Architecture and Operating System Fanatics Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article you write: >In article <199904191650.JAA24137@vashon.polstra.com> John Polstra writes: > >>If I understand your description correctly, this fix could really >>benefit master CVSup servers such as freefall. Those servers >>typically have 8-12 running cvsupd processes, all doing tree walks >>over the same CVS repository and making a stat() call on every file. >> >>Do you think it would help? > >It helps to some extend I think. The Squid server I've been testing can >keep 32MB worth of directories cached after some tuning but because of >the enormous amount of reads and writes being done half of the >directories get removed from the cache after 5-10 minutes. We're >speaking about 750,000-1,000,000 files in 4096 directories in a >two-level hierarchy where 80% of the files is 9 KB or less in size. >B.t.w., the Squid people are working on a SquidFS which will not use >individual files anymore. Which is why Peregrine prefers to use raw disk partitions (along with a userland variant of LFS) to store the pages, since the filesystem currently imposes too much overhead for good performance. It's interesting, LFS seems to be a great web-cache filesystem, you don't really need to preserve every file, you just throw some away. No fsck; if the system crashes, you can just start all over again; after all, it _is_ a cache, right? (In Peregrine, this behavior is tunable; some environments don't want to lose the entire cache). -- Jonathan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 14: 2: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9C63156E8; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 14:01:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA01617; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 16:59:20 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904192059.QAA01617@cs.rpi.edu> To: adrian@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: Arjan de Vet , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! In-Reply-To: Message from adrian@FreeBSD.ORG of "Tue, 20 Apr 1999 04:52:46 +0800." <19990419205247.28410.qmail@ewok.creative.net.au> Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 16:59:19 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > However, stacking layers are not quite functional yet (come on Eivind, we're > all cheering here. :), and I don't think anyone would do this in the near > future. If it happened, it would certinaly make applications like squid > and news *fly*. Hey, I have a machine for Eivind too. It can be shipped to him if needed, or it can stay here. Or he can give me patches, and have me do the rest of the work, his call ;) -- David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 14: 6:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 850A8156AA for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 14:06:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id OAA90382; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 14:04:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 14:04:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904192104.OAA90382@apollo.backplane.com> To: "John S. Dyson" Cc: dmlb@ragnet.demon.co.uk (Duncan Barclay), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! References: <199904192042.PAA20471@dyson.iquest.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> Directory Size Count :> 512 34354 :> 1024 963 :> 1536 358 :> 2048 245 :.... :> :Your results show the wastefulness of using a page for everything. There :is NO gain from wasting the memory by rounding everything up to a page. :If buffers are not used for sub-page entities, another scheme should be :used. I fear expediency or sloppiness will prevail. : :John You are still ignoring the several points I brought up. I wish you would address them. I put forth several theories as to why there would be relatively little waste. * Just because there are 34354 512 byte directories does not mean there are 34354 512 byte directories in active use! * The namei cache will tend to fully-cache smaller directories ( or at least produce a very high percentage of cache hits ) allowing their VMIO-backed directories to go away. This is my theory, anyway. * Larger directories benefit greatly from being VM backed, and smaller ones in certain configurations - such as a squid configuration or a general large-memory configuration -- also benefit because the VM cache scales to memory and the buffer cache does not. * Smaller systems with less memory have fewer processes which are hitting fewer directories actively, so the wasteage scales down as well. * I think the issue devolves down into how much I/O we can avoid. I don't really care how much temporary memory we waste. I/O costs a lot more then a bcopy. The existing B_MALLOC buffer cache code does not scale. At all. Even my small test systems - with 48MB of ram - appear to benefit from the change! It is turning out that far more memory is being used by the programs accessing the directory structure then is being eaten by the directory structure. Considering the immensly critical nature of the directory structure, if there were any single place where I'd be willing to waste some bytes it would be there. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 14:22: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C38DD14F59 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 14:21:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id OAA90535; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 14:19:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 14:19:29 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904192119.OAA90535@apollo.backplane.com> To: Jonathan Lemon Cc: Arjan.deVet@adv.iae.nl, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! References: <199904192058.PAA16517@free.pcs> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Which is why Peregrine prefers to use raw disk partitions (along with :a userland variant of LFS) to store the pages, since the filesystem :currently imposes too much overhead for good performance. : :It's interesting, LFS seems to be a great web-cache filesystem, you :don't really need to preserve every file, you just throw some away. :No fsck; if the system crashes, you can just start all over again; :after all, it _is_ a cache, right? (In Peregrine, this behavior is :tunable; some environments don't want to lose the entire cache). :-- :Jonathan Going through the buffered block device for a partition would be quite efficient. FreeBSD can parallelize block I/O very nicely - there are no locks to get in the way. Using a file isn't terrible, though. You just have to use more then one. I used this trick in Diablo ( my usenet news transit system ). Each file caches multiple articles. It doesn't take a very large ratio to achieve optimal performance. By limiting the number of files, you virtually guarentee namei cache hits. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 14:58: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0683F14C3E; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 14:57:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA57590; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 14:55:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904192155.OAA57590@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:50:37 PDT." <5562.924544237@zippy.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 14:55:24 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, Please let me know if you are still having problems. Just finished rebuilding sane and gimp over here and it works. The magic to get sane working with gimp is: cp /usr/local/bin/xscanimage ~/.gimp-1.1/plug-ins -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 15:12: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from finland.ispro.net.tr (finland.ispro.net.tr [195.174.18.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84C1D14C9B for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 15:11:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from yurtesen@ispro.net.tr) Received: from localhost (yurtesen@localhost) by finland.ispro.net.tr (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA49413 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 01:09:19 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from yurtesen@ispro.net.tr) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 01:09:19 +0300 (EEST) From: Evren Yurtesen X-Sender: yurtesen@localhost To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: how to powerdown? APM? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hello, I have an intel T440BX board and freebsd is not able to detect APM support of the bios... what is wrong? I have compiled the kernel with APM support and there is no option about APM in the bios setup! and freebsd says apm0 not found! that is all, how will I enable it? win98 is able to shutdown the system and also power down too Evren thanks +---------------------------------------------------------+ | Name : Evren Yurtesen - yurtesen@ispro.net.tr | | Job Title : Technical Consultant & System Administrator| | Work Tel. : +90-232-2463992 | | Mobile Tel.: +90-542-6854748 | +---------------------------------------------------------+ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 16:33:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 44C0F14C59 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 16:33:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id QAA91277; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 16:30:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 16:30:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904192330.QAA91277@apollo.backplane.com> To: John Polstra Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! References: <199904191650.JAA24137@vashon.polstra.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :In article <199904171844.LAA75452@apollo.backplane.com>, :Matthew Dillon wrote: : :> When I scan enough directories ( e.g. a megabyte worth of directories :> on a 1 GB machine), then scan again, the data is re-fetched from disk. : :If I understand your description correctly, this fix could really :benefit master CVSup servers such as freefall. Those servers :typically have 8-12 running cvsupd processes, all doing tree walks :over the same CVS repository and making a stat() call on every file. : :Do you think it would help? : :John Yes, but you can't apply the VMIO fix to the 3.x tree if you are also using NFS. NFS will barf on it. I believe my patch to NFS that solves the VMIO problem can be backported to -3.x, though, if you want to try the combination. It's a two line patch to a simple bug: NFS depends on the buffer's b_resid field to represent the EOF of the file. This works as long as the buffer is a B_MALLOC buffer (i.e. its backing store goes away when the buffer goes away). If the buffer is a B_VMIO buffer, though, the buffer can go away and the backing store will be saved in the VM cache. If the buffer is then later reconstituted, b_resid is set to 0 and no longer represents the actual EOF of the directory, causing getdirentries() to screw up. NFS happens to remember the offset of the directory eof in the np structure, so the two-line fix is to impose that on top of the b_resid test when looking for the directory EOF within the buffer. If you don't want to mess with the VMIO stuff, increasing the size of the buffer cache as a workaround will help, but not as well as the VMIO fix. It doesn't work as well because the buffer cache has high turnover and the directory data will still be lost even if B_MALLOC space has not been exhausted. I do not know what the memory impact of the constant scanning would be w/ the VMIO fix -- probably pretty wasteful (for this situation John's complaints are certainly real). But FreeFall's problem has always been I/O rather then memory. Given the choice between I/O and memory, it's always cheaper to buy more memory. I think the VMIO fix would be a win despite the memory. At a rough guess, there are 2800 directories in the CVS tree. Assuming 4K per directory you wind up with around 11 MBytes worth of directory data. Not a very high price to pay if you ask me. Quite reasonable. -Matt Matthew Dillon : John Polstra jdp@polstra.com : John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA : "Self-interest is the aphrodisiac of belief." -- James V. DeLong : To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 16:47:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E04F151FA for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 16:47:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id QAA91499; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 16:45:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 16:45:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904192345.QAA91499@apollo.backplane.com> To: Zhihui Zhang Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ack! I would not apply that patch to the 2.2.x tree. I recommend you back it out. It probably didn't work because you didn't make all the necessary changes, but I have not researched what changes would be necessary to make it work for 2.2.x. While conceptually simple, it would be fairly dangerous to just patch it into 2.2.x without a considerable amount of testing. Also, the test you are running is not going to time directory lookups very well because you are exec'ing 'grep' for each file. Try doing the find and redirecting to /dev/null. Like this: time find -x /usr/src > /dev/null time find -x /usr/src > /dev/null time find -x /usr/src > /dev/null (But you still may not see an improvement) -Matt Matthew Dillon :I tried to apply your patch to FreeBSD 2.2.8. I only made changes to file :vfs_subr.c (vfs_object_create()) and vfs_vnops.c (vn_open()) because I can :not find the corresponding places in file vfs_lookup.c and vfs_syscalls.c. : :After this, I made a new kernel and reboot. I issue the following :command: : : # find /usr/src -name "*.?" -exec grep "dummy" /dev/null {} \; : :It takes about five minutes as it did before I modified the kernel and :reboot. So obviously the modifications I made are not enough. I should :change something else to really use it. Can you please tell me where to :look at in 2.2.8? Somewhere in namei()? : :I believe your idea is a good one because it may help to solve the :directory layout problem when you do depth-first search of directories (as :in find?). The reason I need it now is that each time I spend 5 minutes :to search for a symbol in the source code tree under /usr/src. : :Thanks for your help. : :-Zhihui To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 17:34:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wall.polstra.com (rtrwan160.accessone.com [206.213.115.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 687E514CE4 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 17:34:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Received: from vashon.polstra.com (vashon.polstra.com [206.213.73.13]) by wall.polstra.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA29840; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 17:32:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Received: (from jdp@localhost) by vashon.polstra.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id RAA26020; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 17:32:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199904192330.QAA91277@apollo.backplane.com> Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 17:32:00 -0700 (PDT) Organization: Polstra & Co., Inc. From: John Polstra To: Matthew Dillon Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matthew Dillon wrote: [cvsupd on freefall] >:Do you think it would help? > > Yes, but you can't apply the VMIO fix to the 3.x tree if you are also > using NFS. NFS will barf on it. I believe my patch to NFS that solves > the VMIO problem can be backported to -3.x, though, if you want to try > the combination. That's OK -- I was thinking longer term. I wouldn't want to mess with freefall until the code had had more time in current, anyway. > At a rough guess, there are 2800 directories in the CVS tree. Heh -- I bet you didn't count the ports tree. :-) When I last counted (a few months ago), the repository as a whole had 48,500 files in 12,900 directories, totaling 564 MB of space. I'm sure it has grown since then (egcs plus the ports team's usual 8000 ports per month). The vast majority of directories are in the ports tree, and they're very small. I don't know whether that makes a difference or not with regard to the VMIO fix. If I can figure out a way to do a realistic test here locally, I'll try it out. John --- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-interest is the aphrodisiac of belief." -- James V. DeLong To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 18:32:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.stox.sa.enteract.com (dyn1-tnt1-167.chicago.il.ameritech.net [199.179.160.167]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0B07150CA for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 18:32:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ken@stox.sa.enteract.com) Received: from localhost (localhost.stox.sa.enteract.com [127.0.0.1]) by m4.stox.sa.enteract.com (8.9.3/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA11226; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 08:28:56 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 08:28:56 -0500 (CDT) From: "Kenneth P. Stox" Reply-To: stox@enteract.com To: Alex Belits Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Alex Belits wrote: > On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > > > Look is more like HP surrendered to Microsoft > > Rick Belluzo sabotaged HP and is finishing SGI now. Well, I wouldn't be so fast to attack Rick Belluzo. I just saw his keynote at COMDEX this evening, and among other things he did announce SGI's support of LINUX, and the intent of SGI to donate technology to the Open Software Community. So far, I have not seen any other big vendor announce the same intent to do so. -Ken Stox stox@enteract.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 19: 5:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp [133.34.17.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7C7614E6A; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:05:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp) Received: from rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (8.9.3/3.7W-Naklab-2.1-19981120) with ESMTP id KAA92159; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 10:27:35 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <199904200127.KAA92159@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp> To: nox@jelal.kn-bremen.de Cc: zinnia@jan.ne.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports From: Seigo TANIMURA In-Reply-To: Your message of "Sun, 18 Apr 1999 22:15:05 +0200" References: <19990418221505.A86834@saturn.kn-bremen.de> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.70 on Emacs 19.34.1 / Mule 2.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 10:27:35 +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 18 Apr 1999 22:15:05 +0200, Juergen Lock said: >> Another bad news, I tried driving my SC-88 connected directly to a PC using >> Windows 95 and Portman PC/S driver, to find a miserable result. I saw no midi >> messages come properly, so Portman PC/S should be cooking the signals in some way... nox> Or uses a higher speed than 38k4, can you check that? Hmm, or maybe nox> i should just take my old Atari MSTe and use that as serial<->midi nox> interface... Bitrate > 38.4k... I wish I had a looooong serial cable. The PC I had a test on the Portman driver is not in my room, and it is not a portable one. Atari, I have only heard the name. I played with an Acorn when I was a kiwi. (should we move to chat?) Seigo TANIMURA |M2, Nakagawa Lab, Dept of Electronics & CS =========================|Faculty of Engineering, Yokohama National Univ Powered by SIEMENS, |http://www.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp/~tanimura/ FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT |http://www.sakura.ne.jp/~tcarrot/ (10th Apr 1999) & muesli.|tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp tcarrot@sakuramail.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 19:25: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7140714DB4; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:24:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA58904; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:22:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904200222.TAA58904@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: Nick Hibma , Luigi Rizzo , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:51:25 PDT." <5573.924544285@zippy.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:22:12 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi Jordan, If you buy me a 3COM USB 56k Voice Faxmodem Pro -- external model , I promise to support it 8) > > Anyone fancy buying a HP USB scanner and writing the support for it? > > I dunno, but I'd be more than happy to buy YOU an HP USB scanner if > you're interested? :-) > > - Jordan > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 19:30:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from linux.cca.usart.ru (linux.cca.usart.ru [194.226.230.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9837714DB4 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:30:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from max@cca.usart.ru) Received: from localhost (max@localhost) by linux.cca.usart.ru (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id HAA16529 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 07:32:42 +0600 Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 07:32:40 +0600 (ESD) From: Max Gotlib To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: -current and aout kernels ? In-Reply-To: <199904200222.TAA58904@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi! I've got a question for hackers sosiety ... Is it possible to compile a bootable (it does not metter how: via rawboot, netboot, ...) the _AOUT_ kernel, based on the -current kernel sources withing the -current system environment (I mean egcs) ? I've got 19990412 snapshot, by the way ... Best regards, Max. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 19:32: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0733014F83; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:32:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA08099; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:29:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Amancio Hasty Cc: Nick Hibma , Luigi Rizzo , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:22:12 PDT." <199904200222.TAA58904@rah.star-gate.com> Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:29:17 -0700 Message-ID: <8097.924575357@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > If you buy me a 3COM USB 56k Voice Faxmodem Pro -- external model , I > promise to support it 8) Gosh, such an offer - I'm sure you want a dual PIII/500 so that you can "support" that as well, don't you? :-) - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 19:52:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail0.atl.bellsouth.net (mail0.atl.bellsouth.net [205.152.0.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55E7515625 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:52:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wghicks@bellsouth.net) Received: from wghicks.bellsouth.net (host-209-214-67-19.atl.bellsouth.net [209.214.67.19]) by mail0.atl.bellsouth.net (8.8.8-spamdog/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA02191; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:49:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from wghicks (wghicks@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by wghicks.bellsouth.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id WAA05452; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:50:36 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net) Message-Id: <199904200250.WAA05452@bellsouth.net> To: stox@enteract.com Cc: Alex Belits , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 08:28:56 CDT." Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:50:36 -0400 From: W Gerald Hicks Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Well, I wouldn't be so fast to attack Rick Belluzo. I just saw his keynote > at COMDEX this evening, and among other things he did announce SGI's > support of LINUX, and the intent of SGI to donate technology to the Open > Software Community. So far, I have not seen any other big vendor announce > the same intent to do so. Ahem... http://www.opentelecom.org Completely ignored (so far) by the *BSD community. It's high time that FreeBSD assumed its rightful role in the CTI niche. Cheers, Jerry Hicks wghicks@bellsouth.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 19:59:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 487A715625; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:59:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA59136; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:56:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904200256.TAA59136@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: Nick Hibma , Luigi Rizzo , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:29:17 PDT." <8097.924575357@zippy.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:56:48 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Aside from me having a PIII 450Mhz I not not that interested on having a dual PIII 450 Mhz , I am interested on an intelligent and fast external USB modem such as the 3 COM one . Thank You! > > If you buy me a 3COM USB 56k Voice Faxmodem Pro -- external model , I > > promise to support it 8) > > Gosh, such an offer - I'm sure you want a dual PIII/500 so that you > can "support" that as well, don't you? :-) > > - Jordan -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 20: 1: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84FF715625; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:01:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA08391; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:58:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Amancio Hasty Cc: Nick Hibma , Luigi Rizzo , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:56:48 PDT." <199904200256.TAA59136@rah.star-gate.com> Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:58:17 -0700 Message-ID: <8389.924577097@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Aside from me having a PIII 450Mhz I not not that interested on having a dua l > PIII 450 Mhz , I am interested on an intelligent and fast external USB > modem such as the 3 COM one . Ah, sorry, I misunderstood you and thought you were joking about this (I figured it was just a normal serial modem). If you'd like to help Nick work on USB modem support, I'd like to buy one for you. - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 20: 3:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from edam.direct.ca (edam.direct.ca [199.60.229.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 76C8815648; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:03:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sparhawk@sparhawk.bc.ca) Received: from vic-53-0207.direct.ca ([216.66.129.103] helo=sorack) by edam.direct.ca with smtp (Exim 2.02 #21) id 10ZQmP-00032e-00; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:00:57 -0700 From: Sparhawk To: FreeBSD-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Vmware Virtual Net card? Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:48:44 -0700 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.17] Content-Type: text/plain Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <99041919553800.00172@sorack> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-KMail-Mark: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I am running VMware under linux, and have gotten FreeBSD-current (as of about 2 weeks ago) to boot under it, but cannot get it to detect the network interface (I believe it should be lnc0, but I may be wrong on this). Has anyone got FreeBSD to detect the VMware Network interface properly, and if so how? what entry did you have to set in the kernel config file for the networking support? Any help would be greatly apreciated? -- Seamus Wassman Sparhawk@sparhawk.bc.ca http://www.sparhawk.bc.ca ICQ#: 7682151 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 20: 3:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8B46156BE for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:03:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA59195; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:01:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904200301.UAA59195@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: W Gerald Hicks Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:50:36 EDT." <199904200250.WAA05452@bellsouth.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:01:01 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I am pretty sure that Rick Belluzo has nothing to do with Linux at SGI which was started from the SGI troops and not management . > > Well, I wouldn't be so fast to attack Rick Belluzo. I just saw his keynote > > at COMDEX this evening, and among other things he did announce SGI's > > support of LINUX, and the intent of SGI to donate technology to the Open > > Software Community. So far, I have not seen any other big vendor announce > > the same intent to do so. > > Ahem... > > http://www.opentelecom.org > > Completely ignored (so far) by the *BSD community. It's high time that > FreeBSD assumed its rightful role in the CTI niche. > > Cheers, > > Jerry Hicks > wghicks@bellsouth.net > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 20: 7: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B9EA15648; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:07:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA59235; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:04:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904200304.UAA59235@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: Nick Hibma , Luigi Rizzo , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 19:58:17 PDT." <8389.924577097@zippy.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:04:22 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Well, is more like I want to help myself by having a nice USB modem which handles fax / voice / data . If you get me one soon I will get going on the driver stuff --- don't take too long for I am in between contracts right now which means is "FreeBSD Time" 8) Cheers, Amancio > > Aside from me having a PIII 450Mhz I not not that interested on having a dua > l > > PIII 450 Mhz , I am interested on an intelligent and fast external USB > > modem such as the 3 COM one . > > Ah, sorry, I misunderstood you and thought you were joking about this > (I figured it was just a normal serial modem). If you'd like to help > Nick work on USB modem support, I'd like to buy one for you. > > - Jordan -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 20:16:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com (gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com [207.113.159.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E195715038; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:16:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gdonl@tsc.tdk.com) Received: from sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com (root@sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com [192.168.241.191]) by gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA16419; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:13:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gdonl@tsc.tdk.com) Received: from salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com (salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com [192.168.241.194]) by sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA22519; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:13:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from gdonl@localhost) by salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA22956; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:13:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Don Lewis Message-Id: <199904200313.UAA22956@salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com> Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:13:26 -0700 In-Reply-To: Amancio Hasty "Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again)." (Apr 19, 7:22pm) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(3) 7/19/95) To: Amancio Hasty , "Jordan K. Hubbard" Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). Cc: Nick Hibma , Luigi Rizzo , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Apr 19, 7:22pm, Amancio Hasty wrote: } Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). } Hi Jordan, } } If you buy me a 3COM USB 56k Voice Faxmodem Pro -- external model , I } promise to support it 8) I've got one of these attached to my FreeBSD box, alas only with a serial cable. Be sure that you get a recent version of the firmware, otherwise it won't hold a connection worth a damn. If you get stuck with old firmware, you'll need access to a Windoze >= 95 box. I haven't done anything fancy with mine other than use it to install FreeBSD :-) Having USB support would be really cool, though I'd have to scare up a cable. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 20:32:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4BC415038 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:32:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (homer.softweyr.com [204.68.178.39]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA26177; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 21:30:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <371BF4B9.54427709@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 21:30:01 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Evren Yurtesen Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: how to powerdown? APM? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Evren Yurtesen wrote: > > hello, > I have an intel T440BX board and freebsd is not able > to detect APM support of the bios... > what is wrong? > > I have compiled the kernel with APM support and there is no > option about APM in the bios setup! and freebsd says > > apm0 not found! > > that is all, how will I enable it? win98 is able to shutdown > the system and also power down too By enabling it. ;^) You can do this by running "userconfig" during the booting process; boot with the -c flag and enable the apm device from configuration editor, or edit your kernel configuration file and remove the "disable" keyword from the apm0 line, make a new kernel, and reboot. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 20:33:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA16015038 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:33:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id XAA08749; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 23:30:48 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904200330.XAA08749@cs.rpi.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: -lpthread Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 23:30:48 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Can we have it so that '-lpthread' accomplishes the same as '-lc_r' in terms of allowing threaded programs to link/run correctly? As was pointed out to me recently '-lc_r' for pthread support is a bit non-standard. -- David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 20:33:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (207-229-172-83.d.enteract.com [207.229.172.83]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2AC8150F3 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:33:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.enteract.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA13278; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:30:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904200330.UAA13278@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Amancio Hasty Cc: W Gerald Hicks , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:01:01 PDT." <199904200301.UAA59195@rah.star-gate.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:30:24 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I am pretty sure that Rick Belluzo has nothing to do with Linux at SGI which > was > started from the SGI troops and not management . Interesting that I was talking to SGI folks about getting hardware, and I have a heavy SGI customer helping out. I'll try again more tomorrow; if you're at Comdex and want to come form a team to approach them sometime after lunch tomorrow (hit them when they're unsteady), pull up at the FreeBSD booth sometime around 2:30. > > > > Well, I wouldn't be so fast to attack Rick Belluzo. I just saw his keynote > > > at COMDEX this evening, and among other things he did announce SGI's > > > support of LINUX, and the intent of SGI to donate technology to the Open > > > Software Community. So far, I have not seen any other big vendor announce > > > the same intent to do so. > > > > Ahem... > > > > http://www.opentelecom.org > > > > Completely ignored (so far) by the *BSD community. It's high time that > > FreeBSD assumed its rightful role in the CTI niche. > > > > Cheers, > > > > Jerry Hicks > > wghicks@bellsouth.net > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > -- > > Amancio Hasty > hasty@star-gate.com > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 20:35:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51403150F3 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:35:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (homer.softweyr.com [204.68.178.39]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA26202; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 21:33:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <371BF56D.9BD68BD8@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 21:33:01 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: stox@enteract.com Cc: Alex Belits , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Kenneth P. Stox" wrote: > > On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Alex Belits wrote: > > > On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > > > > > Look is more like HP surrendered to Microsoft > > > > Rick Belluzo sabotaged HP and is finishing SGI now. > > Well, I wouldn't be so fast to attack Rick Belluzo. I just saw his keynote > at COMDEX this evening, and among other things he did announce SGI's > support of LINUX, and the intent of SGI to donate technology to the Open > Software Community. So far, I have not seen any other big vendor announce > the same intent to do so. Sun? IBM? Intel? Oh that's right, they're all too small to count. But they did beat SGI to the punch on the Linux thing. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 20:36:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DDC1150F3; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:36:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA71236; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 23:33:51 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 23:33:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: Amancio Hasty Cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , Nick Hibma , Luigi Rizzo , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-Reply-To: <199904200222.TAA58904@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > Hi Jordan, > > If you buy me a 3COM USB 56k Voice Faxmodem Pro -- external model , I > promise to support it 8) Hmm... not the Internal USB version, right? ;> > > > > > > > Anyone fancy buying a HP USB scanner and writing the support for it? > > > > I dunno, but I'd be more than happy to buy YOU an HP USB scanner if > > you're interested? :-) > > > > - Jordan > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > -- > > Amancio Hasty > hasty@star-gate.com > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \ _ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___)___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 20:40:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF4FD150F3; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:40:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA59601; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:37:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904200337.UAA59601@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Brian Feldman Cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , Nick Hibma , Luigi Rizzo , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 23:33:50 EDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:37:56 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I am interested on the external one to setup a voice / fax "machine". The attractive option on the 3 COM USB Modem is that it can store fax and voice mail messages unattended which means that I don't have to have my box up just to answer the phone or receive a fax, i.e, I am free to hack on the system. > On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > > > Hi Jordan, > > > > If you buy me a 3COM USB 56k Voice Faxmodem Pro -- external model , I > > promise to support it 8) > > Hmm... not the Internal USB version, right? ;> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyone fancy buying a HP USB scanner and writing the support for it? > > > > > > I dunno, but I'd be more than happy to buy YOU an HP USB scanner if > > > you're interested? :-) > > > > > > - Jordan > > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > > -- > > > > Amancio Hasty > > hasty@star-gate.com > > > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ > green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ > FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \ _ \ |) | > http://www.freebsd.org _ |___)___/___/ > -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 20:41:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pyrl.eye (ppp-233.centerplacenet.com [208.29.63.233]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CEE6315335; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:41:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ortmann@sparc.isl.net) Received: (from ortmann@localhost) by pyrl.eye (8.9.3/8.9.1) id WAA14595; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:35:10 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from ortmann) From: Daniel Ortmann Message-Id: <199904200335.WAA14595@pyrl.eye> Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: <19990409112852.A14614@symbion.srrc.usda.gov> from Glenn Johnson at "Apr 9, 1999 11:28:52 am" To: gjohnson@nola.srrc.usda.gov (Glenn Johnson) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:35:09 -0500 (CDT) Cc: reg@shale.csir.co.za, scrappy@hub.org, handy@lambic.physics.montana.edu, des@flood.ping.uio.no, obrien@NUXI.com, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > On Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 03:52:58PM +0200, Jeremy Lea wrote: ... > Many people don't seem to understand that FreeBSD can be used for > workstations as well as servers and Fortran is *essential* on a > scientific/engineering workstation. ... Absolutely correct. Some up-and-coming IBM simulation ports require Fortran categorically. It's tough answering questions like "FreeB... what? Is that like Linux?" Without a STANDARD system Fortran compiler an operating system is unlikely to be taken seriously by ANY large engineering company. We could, however, do without "fortune". :-) -- Daniel Ortmann IBM Circuit Technology 2414 30 av NW, #D E315, bldg 040-2 Rochester, MN 55901 3605 Hwy 52 N 507.288.7732 (h) 507.253.6795 (w) ortmann@isl.net ortmann@us.ibm.com -- "The answers are so simple and we all know where to look, but it's easier just to avoid the question." -- Kansas To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 20:45: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quackerjack.cc.vt.edu (quackerjack.cc.vt.edu [198.82.160.250]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDA6815628 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:44:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jobaldwi@vt.edu) Received: from sable.cc.vt.edu (sable.cc.vt.edu [128.173.16.30]) by quackerjack.cc.vt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA17314 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 23:42:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from john.baldwin.cx (jobaldwi.campus.vt.edu [198.82.67.63]) by sable.cc.vt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA31076 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 23:42:23 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 23:42:19 -0400 (EDT) From: John Baldwin To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Is it ok to include sys/signal.h directly? Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Well, no response on -questions, so I figured I'd try -hackers. :) -----FW: Is it ok to include sys/signal.h directly?----- I've a question, should programs always include /usr/include/signal.h or is it ok for them to include /usr/include/sys/signal.h directly? Currently on 3.0+ programs that include sys/signal.h fail to compile. I.e.: > cat temp.c #include #include void main() { printf("foobar\n"); } > make temp.o cc -O -pipe -c temp.c In file included from temp.c:1: /usr/include/sys/signal.h:163: parse error before `size_t' /usr/include/sys/signal.h:163: warning: no semicolon at end of struct or union /usr/include/sys/signal.h:165: parse error before `}' *** Error code 1 Stop. They die because size_t is not defined when the sigaltstack struct is defined. In /usr/include/signal.h, machine/ansi.h is #include'd before sys/signal.h so that this problem is avoided. If it is desirable for programs to include just sys/signal.h by itself, then this patch would fix the problem: --- signal.h.orig Sat Apr 17 15:33:02 1999 +++ signal.h Sat Apr 17 15:33:37 1999 @@ -45,6 +45,7 @@ #include #include #include /* sig_atomic_t; trap codes; sigcontext */ +#include #if !defined(_ANSI_SOURCE) && !defined(_POSIX_SOURCE) #define NSIG 32 /* counting 0; could be 33 (mask is 1-32) */ Note that these programs worked fine on 2.2.x, AFAIK. At least, one of the ports (devel/cccc) #include'd sys/signal.h, and it was broken in 3.0 but worked in 2.2. --- John Baldwin -- http://members.freedomnet.com/~jbaldwin/ PGP Key: http://members.freedomnet.com/~jbaldwin/pgpkey.asc "Power Users Use the Power to Serve!" - http://www.freebsd.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 20:56: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (207-229-172-83.d.enteract.com [207.229.172.83]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5251514D6F for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:55:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.enteract.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA13432; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:52:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904200352.UAA13432@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: stox@enteract.com Cc: Alex Belits , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 08:28:56 CDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:52:41 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Well, I wouldn't be so fast to attack Rick Belluzo. I just saw his keynote > at COMDEX this evening, and among other things he did announce SGI's > support of LINUX, and the intent of SGI to donate technology to the Open > Software Community. So far, I have not seen any other big vendor announce > the same intent to do so. I wouldn't mind bending you and your rep's ear about getting some of this stuff, preferably sooner rather than later. Documentation would be significant as well... -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 20:59:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.stox.sa.enteract.com (dyn1-tnt1-167.chicago.il.ameritech.net [199.179.160.167]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFFE914F66 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:59:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ken@stox.sa.enteract.com) Received: from localhost (localhost.stox.sa.enteract.com [127.0.0.1]) by m4.stox.sa.enteract.com (8.9.3/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA11493; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:57:03 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:57:03 -0500 (CDT) From: "Kenneth P. Stox" Reply-To: stox@enteract.com To: Wes Peters Cc: stox@enteract.com, Alex Belits , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: <371BF56D.9BD68BD8@softweyr.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Wes Peters wrote: > "Kenneth P. Stox" wrote: > > > > On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Alex Belits wrote: > > > > > On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > > > > > > > Look is more like HP surrendered to Microsoft > > > > > > Rick Belluzo sabotaged HP and is finishing SGI now. > > > > Well, I wouldn't be so fast to attack Rick Belluzo. I just saw his keynote > > at COMDEX this evening, and among other things he did announce SGI's > > support of LINUX, and the intent of SGI to donate technology to the Open > > Software Community. So far, I have not seen any other big vendor announce > > the same intent to do so. > > Sun? IBM? Intel? > > Oh that's right, they're all too small to count. But they did beat > SGI to the punch on the Linux thing. Well, I'm not so sure about that. What technology has Sun, IBM, or Intel agreed to to donate to Linux right now ? I know Sun has made Java open, but have they donated any technology directly to the O/S ? -Ken Stox stox@fnal.gov To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 21: 2:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50E5415335 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 21:02:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA15871; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:00:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id WAA02437; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:00:25 -0600 Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:00:25 -0600 Message-Id: <199904200400.WAA02437@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Free Hardware (Not!) (was Re: Trying to get ...) In-Reply-To: <8097.924575357@zippy.cdrom.com> References: <199904200222.TAA58904@rah.star-gate.com> <8097.924575357@zippy.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [ Moved to -chat ] > > If you buy me a 3COM USB 56k Voice Faxmodem Pro -- external model , I > > promise to support it 8) > > Gosh, such an offer - I'm sure you want a dual PIII/500 so that you > can "support" that as well, don't you? :-) If you're doling out hardware, I could certainly use a new Quad-Xeon box. :) :) Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 21: 3:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.stox.sa.enteract.com (dyn1-tnt1-167.chicago.il.ameritech.net [199.179.160.167]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9AEF1156B0 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 21:02:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ken@stox.sa.enteract.com) Received: from localhost (localhost.stox.sa.enteract.com [127.0.0.1]) by m4.stox.sa.enteract.com (8.9.3/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA11501; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:59:11 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 10:59:11 -0500 (CDT) From: "Kenneth P. Stox" Reply-To: stox@enteract.com To: Amancio Hasty Cc: W Gerald Hicks , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: <199904200301.UAA59195@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > I am pretty sure that Rick Belluzo has nothing to do with Linux at SGI which > was > started from the SGI troops and not management . Yes, the Linux initiative started before Belluzo, but did they ever state that they wold donate technology ? If so, I must have missed it. -Ken Stox stox@enteract.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 21:15:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.stox.sa.enteract.com (dyn1-tnt1-167.chicago.il.ameritech.net [199.179.160.167]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA6E415335 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 21:15:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ken@stox.sa.enteract.com) Received: from localhost (localhost.stox.sa.enteract.com [127.0.0.1]) by m4.stox.sa.enteract.com (8.9.3/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA11525; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 11:12:06 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 11:12:06 -0500 (CDT) From: "Kenneth P. Stox" Reply-To: stox@enteract.com To: W Gerald Hicks Cc: Alex Belits , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: <199904200250.WAA05452@bellsouth.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, W Gerald Hicks wrote: > > Well, I wouldn't be so fast to attack Rick Belluzo. I just saw his keynote > > at COMDEX this evening, and among other things he did announce SGI's > > support of LINUX, and the intent of SGI to donate technology to the Open > > Software Community. So far, I have not seen any other big vendor announce > > the same intent to do so. > > Ahem... > > http://www.opentelecom.org > > Completely ignored (so far) by the *BSD community. It's high time that > FreeBSD assumed its rightful role in the CTI niche. > > Cheers, I stand corrected in this perspective, and agree that this is a role that we have not pursued. I have converted a few members of Bell Labs to FreeBSD ( I actually live about two miles down the street from Bell Labs Naperville ) but have not really put the heat on. Maybe I can convince some of my buddies at the Labs to try an install-a-thon for FreeBSD to get the ball rolling. Interestingly enough, Linus Torvalds was out at Fermilab Sunday evening, and one of the members of the audience from Bell Labs was commenting on two limitations of Linux that were dogging him, 1GB RAM and 2GB filesystem limitations. I think I just might know a solution to his problems. :-> -Ken To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 21:18:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1360B155FE for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 21:18:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (homer.softweyr.com [204.68.178.39]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA26360; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:15:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <371BFF76.227D7B18@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:15:50 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: stox@enteract.com Cc: Alex Belits , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Kenneth P. Stox" wrote: > > On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Wes Peters wrote: > > > "Kenneth P. Stox" wrote: > > > > > > On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Alex Belits wrote: > > > > > > > On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > > > > > > > > > Look is more like HP surrendered to Microsoft > > > > > > > > Rick Belluzo sabotaged HP and is finishing SGI now. > > > > > > Well, I wouldn't be so fast to attack Rick Belluzo. I just saw his keynote > > > at COMDEX this evening, and among other things he did announce SGI's > > > support of LINUX, and the intent of SGI to donate technology to the Open > > > Software Community. So far, I have not seen any other big vendor announce > > > the same intent to do so. > > > > Sun? IBM? Intel? > > > > Oh that's right, they're all too small to count. But they did beat > > SGI to the punch on the Linux thing. > > Well, I'm not so sure about that. What technology has Sun, IBM, or Intel > agreed to to donate to Linux right now ? I know Sun has made Java open, > but have they donated any technology directly to the O/S ? Sun gave them a StarFire to play with. Is that enough? How many multi- million dollar machines do they need? ;^) IBM has sent several dozen workstations and a couple of large SMP servers to their Linux PPC partner, somewhere in Florida. Motorola has 3 engineers doing full-time support for Linux on their CPU boards over in Computer Division. SGI is already dead, they just haven't bothered to fall over yet. Their executive staff have been driving them into the ground for years, so it's not surprising. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 21:34:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from finland.ispro.net.tr (finland.ispro.net.tr [195.174.18.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B41A15685 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 21:34:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from yurtesen@ispro.net.tr) Received: from localhost (yurtesen@localhost) by finland.ispro.net.tr (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id HAA63015; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 07:32:05 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from yurtesen@ispro.net.tr) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 07:32:04 +0300 (EEST) From: Evren Yurtesen X-Sender: yurtesen@localhost To: Wes Peters Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: how to powerdown? APM? or ACPI? In-Reply-To: <371BF4B9.54427709@softweyr.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG well, the APM support is compiled in and FreeBSD is probing for it! but the problem, FreeBSD is not able to find any APM device on the system! well I have searched for this a lot on the net and found something called ACPI (I am not sure what it is yet though) maybe new intel boards support it only? thanks for the reply On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Wes Peters wrote: > Evren Yurtesen wrote: > > > > hello, > > I have an intel T440BX board and freebsd is not able > > to detect APM support of the bios... > > what is wrong? > > > > I have compiled the kernel with APM support and there is no > > option about APM in the bios setup! and freebsd says > > > > apm0 not found! > > > > that is all, how will I enable it? win98 is able to shutdown > > the system and also power down too > > By enabling it. ;^) > > You can do this by running "userconfig" during the booting process; > boot with the -c flag and enable the apm device from configuration > editor, or edit your kernel configuration file and remove the > "disable" keyword from the apm0 line, make a new kernel, and reboot. > > -- > "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" > > Wes Peters Softweyr LLC > http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 22:14:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quackerjack.cc.vt.edu (quackerjack.cc.vt.edu [198.82.160.250]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FD8215151 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:14:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jobaldwi@vt.edu) Received: from sable.cc.vt.edu (sable.cc.vt.edu [128.173.16.30]) by quackerjack.cc.vt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA00240 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 01:12:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from john.baldwin.cx (jobaldwi.campus.vt.edu [198.82.67.63]) by sable.cc.vt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA11507 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 01:12:18 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199904200335.WAA14595@pyrl.eye> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 01:12:18 -0400 (EDT) From: John Baldwin To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 20-Apr-99 Daniel Ortmann wrote: >> On Fri, Apr 09, 1999 at 03:52:58PM +0200, Jeremy Lea wrote: > ... >> Many people don't seem to understand that FreeBSD can be used for >> workstations as well as servers and Fortran is *essential* on a >> scientific/engineering workstation. > ... > > Absolutely correct. Some up-and-coming IBM simulation ports require > Fortran categorically. > > It's tough answering questions like "FreeB... what? Is that like Linux?" > > Without a STANDARD system Fortran compiler an operating system is > unlikely to be taken seriously by ANY large engineering company. > > We could, however, do without "fortune". :-) I'd rather keep both. :) IMHO, we should only add or delete stuff from the main tree if there is a pressing reason. Having knobs in /etc/make.conf should fix most people's complaints about the disk space, although if you are too tight for 518k (for f77/f2c on 3-stable) or 3631k for fortune and friends, you must be *really* tight on disk space. Also, one of the primary arguments in favor of FreeBSD over one other well-know Un*x like OS is that BSD is derived from "real" Un*x code, and preserving that tradition, except when it is absolutely critical for it to be changed/abandoned, is a good thing. > -- > Daniel Ortmann IBM Circuit Technology --- John Baldwin -- http://members.freedomnet.com/~jbaldwin/ PGP Key: http://members.freedomnet.com/~jbaldwin/pgpkey.asc "Power Users Use the Power to Serve!" - http://www.freebsd.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 22:25:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from shell.futuresouth.com (shell.futuresouth.com [198.78.58.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E31C15151 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:25:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fullermd@futuresouth.com) Received: (from fullermd@localhost) by shell.futuresouth.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA01322; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 00:22:29 -0500 (CDT) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 00:22:29 -0500 From: "Matthew D. Fuller" To: John Polstra Cc: Matthew Dillon , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! Message-ID: <19990420002229.C1229@futuresouth.com> References: <199904192330.QAA91277@apollo.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: ; from John Polstra on Mon, Apr 19, 1999 at 05:32:00PM -0700 X-OS: FreeBSD Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Apr 19, 1999 at 05:32:00PM -0700, a little birdie told me that John Polstra remarked > Matthew Dillon wrote: > > > At a rough guess, there are 2800 directories in the CVS tree. > > Heh -- I bet you didn't count the ports tree. :-) When I last counted > (a few months ago), the repository as a whole had 48,500 files in > 12,900 directories, totaling 564 MB of space. I'm sure it has grown > since then (egcs plus the ports team's usual 8000 ports per month). > The vast majority of directories are in the ports tree, and they're > very small. I don't know whether that makes a difference or not > with regard to the VMIO fix. Ha! This is something I can jump in on (and rather quickly, having noatime on my /usr/cvs partition ;) doc/, ports/, src/, www/ mortis:/usr/cvs root% df /usr/cvs Filesystem 1024-blocks Used Avail Capacity Mounted on /dev/sd1s1f 1017327 630491 305450 67% /usr/cvs mortis:/usr/cvs root% find . -type d -print | wc -l 13948 mortis:/usr/cvs root% find . -type f -print | wc -l 51920 Big. And if I CVSup daily, it takes about 4 minutes ;> -- *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* | Matthew Fuller http://www.over-yonder.net/ | * fullermd@futuresouth.com fullermd@over-yonder.net * | UNIX Systems Administrator Specializing in FreeBSD | * FutureSouth Communications ISPHelp ISP Consulting * | "The only reason I'm burning my candle at both ends, | * is because I haven't figured out how to light the * | middle yet" | *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 22:31:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wall.polstra.com (rtrwan160.accessone.com [206.213.115.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B82D15172 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:31:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Received: from vashon.polstra.com (vashon.polstra.com [206.213.73.13]) by wall.polstra.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id WAA01208; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:29:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Received: (from jdp@localhost) by vashon.polstra.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id WAA26343; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:29:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jdp@polstra.com) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <19990420002229.C1229@futuresouth.com> Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:29:01 -0700 (PDT) Organization: Polstra & Co., Inc. From: John Polstra To: "Matthew D. Fuller" Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Matthew Dillon Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matthew D. Fuller wrote: > doc/, ports/, src/, www/ > > mortis:/usr/cvs > root% df /usr/cvs > Filesystem 1024-blocks Used Avail Capacity Mounted on > /dev/sd1s1f 1017327 630491 305450 67% /usr/cvs > > mortis:/usr/cvs > root% find . -type d -print | wc -l > 13948 > > mortis:/usr/cvs > root% find . -type f -print | wc -l > 51920 Thanks for the update. > Big. Yep. > And if I CVSup daily, it takes about 4 minutes ;> I'm curious -- are you using the "-s" option on the command line? It usually takes about 1.5 minutes for me, using the "-s" option over a 56 kbit frame relay link. John --- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-interest is the aphrodisiac of belief." -- James V. DeLong To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 22:41:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02F0B1534A for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:41:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id AAA27798; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 00:54:42 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 00:54:40 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: stox@enteract.com Cc: Wes Peters , Alex Belits , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Kenneth P. Stox wrote: > > > On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Wes Peters wrote: > > > "Kenneth P. Stox" wrote: > > > > > > On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Alex Belits wrote: > > > > > > > On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > > > > > > > > > Look is more like HP surrendered to Microsoft > > > > > > > > Rick Belluzo sabotaged HP and is finishing SGI now. > > > > > > Well, I wouldn't be so fast to attack Rick Belluzo. I just saw his keynote > > > at COMDEX this evening, and among other things he did announce SGI's > > > support of LINUX, and the intent of SGI to donate technology to the Open > > > Software Community. So far, I have not seen any other big vendor announce > > > the same intent to do so. > > > > Sun? IBM? Intel? > > > > Oh that's right, they're all too small to count. But they did beat > > SGI to the punch on the Linux thing. > > Well, I'm not so sure about that. What technology has Sun, IBM, or Intel > agreed to to donate to Linux right now ? I know Sun has made Java open, > but have they donated any technology directly to the O/S ? *cough* I think sun is still busy taking technology from _us_ to be giving it away just yet (Kirk's softupdates, sendfile etc..) :) -Alfred (yes it belongs on -chat, but i couldn't resist) :) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 23: 5:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from november.jaded.net (november.jaded.net [209.90.128.250]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5FF1114C0A for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 23:05:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dan@november.jaded.net) Received: (from dan@localhost) by november.jaded.net (8.9.3/8.9.3+trinsec_nospam) id CAA52011; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 02:06:56 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 02:06:55 -0400 From: Dan Moschuk To: "David E. Cross" Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: -lpthread Message-ID: <19990420020654.A51944@trinsec.com> References: <199904200330.XAA08749@cs.rpi.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904200330.XAA08749@cs.rpi.edu>; from David E. Cross on Mon, Apr 19, 1999 at 11:30:48PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG | Can we have it so that '-lpthread' accomplishes the same as '-lc_r' in | terms of allowing threaded programs to link/run correctly? As was pointed | out to me recently '-lc_r' for pthread support is a bit non-standard. What's wrong with the -pthread option to gcc? (egcs as well?) -Dan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 19 23: 6:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69AB314C0A for ; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 23:06:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id PAA22224; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 15:33:38 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id PAA45528; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 15:33:37 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19990420153336.A45522@lemis.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 15:33:36 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Luigi Rizzo Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Artec AS6E (was: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again).) References: <3743.924512598@zippy.cdrom.com> <199904190949.LAA19976@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904190949.LAA19976@labinfo.iet.unipi.it>; from Luigi Rizzo on Mon, Apr 19, 1999 at 11:49:39AM +0200 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Monday, 19 April 1999 at 11:49:39 +0200, Luigi Rizzo wrote: >> My fault for not plugging it in for quite some time, but it now >> appears that CAM has broken support for my Scanjet 4P. I have a copy > > i reported this some time ago when i tried to use hpscanpbm and some > other home-grown thing for controlling my scanjet 5p on 3.1. > > "fortunately" my scanjet seems not to work anymore (i have no idea > if it is having firmware problems or servo problems or what...) so > i had to replace it with a parallel port Artec AS6E for which i > managed to write a control program at > > http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ppscan990326.c > > the AS6E is very cheap, kind of poor quality but its data sheets are > available... This looks great. I'm surprised nobody else has made any comments. How well does it work? Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 0: 2:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B703214FEB for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 00:02:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id IAA16422; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:59:55 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA25891; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:59:55 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:59:55 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: "Andrew J. Korty" Cc: Matthew Dillon , Greg Black , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <199904162006.PAA05648@poynting.physics.purdue.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > That makes sense, but do stackable filesystems work properly in > FreeBSD? I have many uses for the null and union filesystems, but > they seem to tend to cause panics. > This is in the works. Eivind has done most of the work already, as I recall. Nullfs appears pretty stable, though. - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 0: 7:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A49B1526D for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 00:07:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id JAA17917; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 09:04:57 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA25949; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 09:04:57 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 09:04:57 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: "C. Stephen Gunn" Cc: Matthew Dillon , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Entombing for FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <19990416160035.B1158@ohm.physics.purdue.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > It's flexible. I wish the entire world ran FreeBSD, but it doesn't. > Andy and I can't even get our entire world to run FreeBSD. We've got > Irix, SunOS, TitanOS, AIX, NeXT, and Linux to deal with. Can I get > the source to write VFS layers for all of those as well? Wouldn't some parts of the code base still be common? In that case, you could probably seperate large portions of the code from the implementation specifics, and thus build it as a filesystem stack on FreeBSD, and as a libc mod on systems with different stacking models, or, as the case may be, none at all. - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 0:27: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id CD28614C1B for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 00:26:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id HAA22712; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 07:07:27 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199904200507.HAA22712@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Artec AS6E (was: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again).) To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 07:07:27 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19990420153336.A45522@lemis.com> from "Greg Lehey" at Apr 20, 99 03:33:17 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1601 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > i had to replace it with a parallel port Artec AS6E for which i > > managed to write a control program at > > > > http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ppscan990326.c > > > > the AS6E is very cheap, kind of poor quality but its data sheets are > > available... > > This looks great. I'm surprised nobody else has made any comments. > How well does it work? it just works, at the moment a bit slow and only in two modes (color and grey, 300dpi), and only with command line interface. I just did not have the time to clean up the code but don't see any major trouble with my program. This said, the scanner -- at least in the optical part -- is rather poor quality, nothing to share with the much nicer (until it worked) Scanjet (which, however, did cost me five times as much, plus a SCSI interface...). A major problem in this particular scanner is that the sensor is not a CCD but another thing called CIS which seems to have large variations of response from one pixel to the next, so the data straight from the scanner need a correction for every pixel. My driver does not do it at the moment but it is a simple thing. On why nobody commented... well, i am very bad at advertising my stuff! cheers luigi -----------------------------------+------------------------------------- Luigi RIZZO . EMAIL: luigi@iet.unipi.it . Dip. di Ing. dell'Informazione HTTP://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ . Universita` di Pisa TEL/FAX: +39-050-568.533/522 . via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) -----------------------------------+------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 1:15:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C528150D2 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 01:15:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id BAA94408; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 01:13:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 01:13:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904200813.BAA94408@apollo.backplane.com> To: John Polstra Cc: "Matthew D. Fuller" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG We're going to hold off committing the VMIO stuff until we track down a softupdates panics that seems to occur sometimes with it. It probably will not make it into 3.2. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 2: 1:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0F8214CD4 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 02:01:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA94941; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 10:04:07 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 10:04:07 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Mike Smith Cc: stox@enteract.com, Alex Belits , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: <199904200352.UAA13432@dingo.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Mike Smith wrote: > > Well, I wouldn't be so fast to attack Rick Belluzo. I just saw his keynote > > at COMDEX this evening, and among other things he did announce SGI's > > support of LINUX, and the intent of SGI to donate technology to the Open > > Software Community. So far, I have not seen any other big vendor announce > > the same intent to do so. > > I wouldn't mind bending you and your rep's ear about getting some of > this stuff, preferably sooner rather than later. Documentation would > be significant as well... If this is the new SGI x86 box, I have a partially complete arc bootloader which would be useful in trying to get FreeBSD running on it. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 2:23:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F19F14C1B for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 02:23:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gram@cdsec.com) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA18581 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:21:03 +0200 (SAST) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 18579; Tue Apr 20 11:20:58 1999 From: Graham Wheeler Message-Id: <199904200921.LAA09941@cdsec.com> Subject: Using select() to implement a delay To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:21:21 +0200 (SAST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi all I have an interesting problem. I have a routine to implement delays: void Sleep(int secs, int usecs = 0) { struct timeval tv; tv.tv_sec = secs; tv.tv_usec = usecs; (void)select(0, 0, 0, 0, &tv); } I am using this both because it gives better resolution than sleep(), and also because it doesn't require the use of SIGALRM, which I am using elsewhere. On my development machine, Sleep(60) does exactly what is expected. On my clients machine, Sleep(60) returns immediately. Both are running FreeBSD 2.2.7. I don't have access to the clients machine, which is in another city, and has no development environment, so I can't run gdb, although it may not give away anything in any case. Does anyone have any ideas why the one works and the other doesn't? TIA gram -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 2:53:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from news.IAEhv.nl (news.IAE.nl [194.151.64.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E7B21555E for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 02:53:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from marc@bowtie.nl) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by news.IAEhv.nl (8.9.1/8.9.1) with IAEhv.nl id LAA11298; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:50:07 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bowtie.nl (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA28715; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:45:09 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from marc@bowtie.nl) Message-Id: <199904200945.LAA28715@bowtie.nl> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Graham Wheeler Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay In-reply-to: gram's message of Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:21:21 +0200. <199904200921.LAA09941@cdsec.com> Reply-To: marc@bowtie.nl Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:45:08 +0200 From: Marc van Kempen Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Hi all > > I have an interesting problem. I have a routine to implement delays: > > void Sleep(int secs, int usecs = 0) > { > struct timeval tv; > tv.tv_sec = secs; > tv.tv_usec = usecs; > (void)select(0, 0, 0, 0, &tv); > } > > I am using this both because it gives better resolution than sleep(), > and also because it doesn't require the use of SIGALRM, which I am > using elsewhere. > > On my development machine, Sleep(60) does exactly what is expected. On > my clients machine, Sleep(60) returns immediately. Both are running > FreeBSD 2.2.7. I don't have access to the clients machine, which is > in another city, and has no development environment, so I can't run gdb, > although it may not give away anything in any case. > > Does anyone have any ideas why the one works and the other doesn't? > Did you try catching the return value from select, it might be getting a signal. Marc. ---------------------------------------------------- Marc van Kempen BowTie Technology Email: marc@bowtie.nl WWW & Databases tel. +31 40 2 43 20 65 fax. +31 40 2 44 21 86 http://www.bowtie.nl ---------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 3:12:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0576C14EA6 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 03:12:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gram@cdsec.com) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA21457 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 12:09:35 +0200 (SAST) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 21455; Tue Apr 20 12:08:54 1999 Message-ID: <371C524D.36DBAC17@cdsec.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 12:09:17 +0200 From: Graham Wheeler X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay References: <199904200945.LAA28715@bowtie.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Marc van Kempen wrote: > > Graham Wheeler wrote: > > > Hi all > > > > I have an interesting problem. I have a routine to implement delays: > > > > void Sleep(int secs, int usecs = 0) > > { > > struct timeval tv; > > tv.tv_sec = secs; > > tv.tv_usec = usecs; > > (void)select(0, 0, 0, 0, &tv); > > } > > > > I am using this both because it gives better resolution than sleep(), > > and also because it doesn't require the use of SIGALRM, which I am > > using elsewhere. > > > > On my development machine, Sleep(60) does exactly what is expected. On > > my clients machine, Sleep(60) returns immediately. Both are running > > FreeBSD 2.2.7. I don't have access to the clients machine, which is > > in another city, and has no development environment, so I can't run gdb, > > although it may not give away anything in any case. > > > > Does anyone have any ideas why the one works and the other doesn't? > > > > Did you try catching the return value from select, it might be getting a > signal. > I've changed the code to: void Sleep(int secs, int usecs = 0) { struct timeval tv; tv.tv_sec = secs; tv.tv_usec = usecs; if (select(0, 0, 0, 0, &tv)<0) syslog(LOG_INFO, "Sleep(): select: %m"); } and have asked the client to run the program. I'll post the results when I get them back. On the one hand, a signal seems like the only explanation; on the other, there are no calls to alarm() or other SIGALRM related routines in the code, and this is also happening with 100% consistency. -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 3:20: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from imo11.mx.aol.com (imo11.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6602414C9D for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 03:20:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from MattR116@aol.com) Received: from MattR116@aol.com by imo11.mx.aol.com (IMOv20.11) id nNFUa24965 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 06:17:06 -0400 (EDT) From: MattR116@aol.com Message-ID: <3fb4cf36.244dae21@aol.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 06:17:05 EDT Subject: Re: freebsd-hackers-digest V4 #460 To: hackers@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 49 Reply-To: MattR116@aol.com Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG UNSUBSCRIBE To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 3:23:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D97814EA6 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 03:23:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gram@cdsec.com) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA22200 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 12:20:43 +0200 (SAST) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 22140; Tue Apr 20 12:20:25 1999 Message-ID: <371C5501.3AA0A34@cdsec.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 12:20:49 +0200 From: Graham Wheeler X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay References: <199904200945.LAA28715@bowtie.nl> <371C53FE.3CE190C9@cdsec.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Marc van Kempen wrote: > > > Hi all > > > > I have an interesting problem. I have a routine to implement delays: > > > > void Sleep(int secs, int usecs = 0) > > { > > struct timeval tv; > > tv.tv_sec = secs; > > tv.tv_usec = usecs; > > (void)select(0, 0, 0, 0, &tv); > > } > > > > I am using this both because it gives better resolution than sleep(), > > and also because it doesn't require the use of SIGALRM, while I am > > using elsewhere. > > > > On my development machine, Sleep(60) does exactly what is expected. On > > my clients machine, Sleep(60) returns immediately. Both are running > > FreeBSD 2.2.7. I don't have access to the clients machine, which is > > in another city, and has no development environment, so I can't run gdb, > > although it may not give away anything in any case. > > > > Does anyone have any ideas why the one works and the other doesn't? > > > > Did you try catching the return value from select, it might be getting a > signal. I'm starting to suspect that this is the case, and that the signal is SIGCHLD. The process does spin off child processes, and there may be some reason why these are terminating almost immediately on the client's system but running to completion on ours. This seems like the only sensible explanation that I can think of. It means there is still a problem, but that it is nothing strange to do with select itself. I didn't consider this a possibility at first because of the consistent difference in behaviour; I would have expected the SIGCHLDs to have a more erratic effect. I've put some debug logs in the SIGCHLD handler, so I should have confirmation within about half an hour. -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 3:28:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gidgate.gid.co.uk (gidgate.gid.co.uk [193.123.140.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6A3A14C9D for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 03:28:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: (from rb@localhost) by gidgate.gid.co.uk (8.8.8/8.8.7) id LAA22368; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:25:33 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from rb) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19990420112535.007d27d0@192.168.255.1> X-Sender: rbmail@192.168.255.1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:25:35 +0100 To: Graham Wheeler From: Bob Bishop Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199904200921.LAA09941@cdsec.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, Most likely your select() is taking a signal; truss might be revealing. You should in theory be able to write something along the lines of: do r = select(0, 0, 0, 0, &tv); while (r == -1 && errno == EINTR); but AFAIK tv won't get updated correctly, see the BUGS entry in select(2). At 11:21 20/04/99 +0200, Graham Wheeler wrote: >Hi all > >I have an interesting problem. I have a routine to implement delays: > >void Sleep(int secs, int usecs = 0) >{ > struct timeval tv; > tv.tv_sec = secs; > tv.tv_usec = usecs; > (void)select(0, 0, 0, 0, &tv); >} > >I am using this both because it gives better resolution than sleep(), >and also because it doesn't require the use of SIGALRM, which I am >using elsewhere. > >On my development machine, Sleep(60) does exactly what is expected. On >my clients machine, Sleep(60) returns immediately. Both are running >FreeBSD 2.2.7. I don't have access to the clients machine, which is >in another city, and has no development environment, so I can't run gdb, >although it may not give away anything in any case. > >Does anyone have any ideas why the one works and the other doesn't? > >TIA >gram >-- >Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com >Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 >Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 >Internet/Intranet Network Specialists >Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ > > > > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > -- Bob Bishop +44 118 977 4017 rb@gid.co.uk fax +44 118 989 4254 (0800-1800 UK) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 4: 6:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0FA391510C for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 04:06:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id HAA14512; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 07:03:55 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904201103.HAA14512@cs.rpi.edu> To: Dan Moschuk Cc: "David E. Cross" , hackers@freebsd.org, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: -lpthread In-Reply-To: Message from Dan Moschuk of "Tue, 20 Apr 1999 02:06:55 EDT." <19990420020654.A51944@trinsec.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 07:03:54 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > | Can we have it so that '-lpthread' accomplishes the same as '-lc_r' in > | terms of allowing threaded programs to link/run correctly? As was pointed > | out to me recently '-lc_r' for pthread support is a bit non-standard. > > What's wrong with the -pthread option to gcc? (egcs as well?) From FreeBSD: A FreeBSD specific option ... gcc -pthread .... ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ From Solaris 2.6: POSIX cc [ flag ... ] file ... -lpthread [ library ... ] ^^^^^^^^^ From Irix 6.5.2f: cc -D_POSIX_C_SOURCE=199506L app.c -llib0 -llib1 ... -lpthread ^^^^^^^^^ It was just brought to my attention that our use of -lc_r was non-standard. Solaris, Irix, Linux, and I believe even AIX all use -lpthread. -- David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 4:43: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 527BA14CF1 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 04:43:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gram@cdsec.com) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA26910 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:40:33 +0200 (SAST) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 26850; Tue Apr 20 13:40:11 1999 Message-ID: <371C67B3.1E7CE39A@cdsec.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:40:35 +0200 From: Graham Wheeler X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay References: <3.0.6.32.19990420112535.007d27d0@192.168.255.1> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Bob Bishop wrote: > > Hi, > > Most likely your select() is taking a signal; truss might be It was indeed SIGCHLDs that were causing the problem. > should in theory be able to write something along the lines of: > > do > r = select(0, 0, 0, 0, &tv); > while (r == -1 && errno == EINTR); > > but AFAIK tv won't get updated correctly, see the BUGS entry in select(2). I am now using: void Sleep(int sec_dlay, int usec_dlay) { struct timeval tv; if (sec_dlay > 0) { time_t start = time(0); // We do this in a loop to be signal-resilient for (;;) { tv.tv_sec = sec_dlay - (time(0) - start); if (tv.tv_sec <= 0) break; tv.tv_usec = 0; (void)select(0, 0, 0, 0, &tv); } } if (usec_dlay > 0) // we don't worry about signals for usecs { tv.tv_sec = 0; tv.tv_usec = usec_dlay; (void)select(0, 0, 0, 0, &tv); } } and all is well. -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 4:53: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.tar.com (ns.tar.com [204.95.187.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4AE4414FE0 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 04:53:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dick@ns.tar.com) Received: (from dick@localhost) by ns.tar.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA66816; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 06:50:29 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dick) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 06:50:29 -0500 From: "Richard Seaman, Jr." To: "David E. Cross" Cc: Dan Moschuk , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: -lpthread Message-ID: <19990420065029.G533@tar.com> References: <199904201103.HAA14512@cs.rpi.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904201103.HAA14512@cs.rpi.edu>; from David E. Cross on Tue, Apr 20, 1999 at 07:03:54AM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Apr 20, 1999 at 07:03:54AM -0400, David E. Cross wrote: > > | Can we have it so that '-lpthread' accomplishes the same as '-lc_r' in > > | terms of allowing threaded programs to link/run correctly? As was pointed > > | out to me recently '-lc_r' for pthread support is a bit non-standard. > > > > What's wrong with the -pthread option to gcc? (egcs as well?) > > >From FreeBSD: > A FreeBSD specific option ... gcc -pthread .... > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > >From Solaris 2.6: > POSIX > cc [ flag ... ] file ... -lpthread [ library ... ] > ^^^^^^^^^ > >From Irix 6.5.2f: > cc -D_POSIX_C_SOURCE=199506L app.c -llib0 -llib1 ... -lpthread > ^^^^^^^^^ > It was just brought to my attention that our use of -lc_r was non-standard. > Solaris, Irix, Linux, and I believe even AIX all use -lpthread. Its my understanding that the goal, though now delayed for a long time, is that the FreeBSD user threads would eventually be re-implemented as kernel threads and be placed in libpthread. I understood that the libpthread name was reserved for this migration. Also, in most implementations, -lpthread is in addition to -lc, whereas in the FreeBSD user thread library, -lc_r replaces -lc as well as -lpthread. What you suggest would make a lot more sense if libc_r was pulled apart into separate libc and libpthread libraries. It wouldn't be hard to do with the current setup. -- Richard Seaman, Jr. email: dick@tar.com 5182 N. Maple Lane phone: 414-367-5450 Chenequa WI 53058 fax: 414-367-5852 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 4:57:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from as5200-01-254.no.neosoft.com (as5200-01-254.no.neosoft.com [206.27.167.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A36E15765 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 04:57:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from conrads@as5200-01-254.no.neosoft.com) Received: (from conrads@localhost) by as5200-01-254.no.neosoft.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id GAA27630; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 06:53:32 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from conrads) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 06:53:31 -0500 (CDT) Reply-To: conrads@neosoft.com From: Conrad Sabatier To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: FW: Re: TkWine setup under FreeBSD Cc: Jean-Louis Thirot Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The following is a message I sent to the author of "TkWine", a nice tool for downloading, configuring, building. installing and running Wine, which unfortunately, doesn't work on FreeBSD! I'm really not knowledgeable enough to provide the information he requested in response, so I thought this might be a good place to ask. :-) I've Cc'ed this message to the author, to include him in any discussion that arises. He seems genuinely interested in getting this thing to work under FreeBSD. Thanks, Conrad -----FW: <371C57D6.DDE280A4@univ-brest.fr>----- Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 12:32:54 +0200 Sender: jl@sdt.univ-brest.fr From: Jean-Louis Thirot To: Conrad Sabatier Subject: Re: TkWine setup under FreeBSD Conrad Sabatier wrote: > "TkWine was intended to be used on any unix computer. It only makes > calls to basic shell commands and wish." > > So says your web page. Unfortunately, the calls to > grep the /proc filesystem are quite Linux-centric, and fail miserably > under FreeBSD. > > Are they really necessary? > Hi Conrad, Hmm, I'm not really suprised with this pb. I could avoid this error easily, but I prefer to know when it causes pb and fix it. Why do I need this? Because I provide an option for make in parallel on bi(or more) processors. This makes make much faster if it succed (ie the dependencies are written well in Makefiles...). So, better than switching the multi processor detection under FreeBSD, I'd prefer to find a way to make it working. As I don't have FreeBSD, I need your help. What I need is: output of uname -a from freeBSD and how do you know the # of processors under FreeBSD ? uname probably has an option for that. man uname > /tmp/uname.FreeBSD.man and send me the file would be great, or find out how it works and let me know. I really want to make it working on any unix suystem... but I can't test myself... Great if you can help FreeBSD to be added to the list of supported systems..... but be aware that, once this one is fixed, we still can encouter other pb (I know at least 2 places with critical instructions...) Thanks for using it and for your report. Jean-Louis --------------End of forwarded message------------------------- -- Conrad Sabatier To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 5:14:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA82615716 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 05:14:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id IAA15751; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:11:54 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904201211.IAA15751@cs.rpi.edu> To: "Richard Seaman, Jr." Cc: "David E. Cross" , Dan Moschuk , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: -lpthread In-Reply-To: Message from "Richard Seaman, Jr." of "Tue, 20 Apr 1999 06:50:29 CDT." <19990420065029.G533@tar.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:11:53 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > On Tue, Apr 20, 1999 at 07:03:54AM -0400, David E. Cross wrote: > > > | Can we have it so that '-lpthread' accomplishes the same as '-lc_r' in > > > | terms of allowing threaded programs to link/run correctly? As was pointed > > > | out to me recently '-lc_r' for pthread support is a bit non-standard. > > > > > > What's wrong with the -pthread option to gcc? (egcs as well?) > > > > >From FreeBSD: > > A FreeBSD specific option ... gcc -pthread .... > > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > >From Solaris 2.6: > > POSIX > > cc [ flag ... ] file ... -lpthread [ library ... ] > > ^^^^^^^^^ > > >From Irix 6.5.2f: > > cc -D_POSIX_C_SOURCE=199506L app.c -llib0 -llib1 ... -lpthread > > ^^^^^^^^^ > > It was just brought to my attention that our use of -lc_r was non-standard. > > Solaris, Irix, Linux, and I believe even AIX all use -lpthread. > > Its my understanding that the goal, though now delayed for a long time, > is that the FreeBSD user threads would eventually be re-implemented as > kernel threads and be placed in libpthread. I understood that the > libpthread name was reserved for this migration. > > Also, in most implementations, -lpthread is in addition to -lc, whereas > in the FreeBSD user thread library, -lc_r replaces -lc as well as -lpthread. > What you suggest would make a lot more sense if libc_r was pulled apart > into separate libc and libpthread libraries. It wouldn't be hard to do > with the current setup. I know this is a kludge, but it appears that a simple symlink from libc_r.* to libpthread.* would accomplish this. My only goal is to make us "more standard". -- David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 5:31:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gidgate.gid.co.uk (gidgate.gid.co.uk [193.123.140.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C55B15598 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 05:31:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: (from rb@localhost) by gidgate.gid.co.uk (8.8.8/8.8.7) id NAA22537; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:29:12 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from rb) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19990420132918.007d9bf0@192.168.255.1> X-Sender: rbmail@192.168.255.1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:29:18 +0100 To: Graham Wheeler From: Bob Bishop Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <371C67B3.1E7CE39A@cdsec.com> References: <3.0.6.32.19990420112535.007d27d0@192.168.255.1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 13:40 20/04/99 +0200, Graham Wheeler wrote: >[...] > if (usec_dlay > 0) // we don't worry about signals for usecs Er, so your resolution is now no better than sleep(), but at least you are free of SIGALRM. -- Bob Bishop +44 118 977 4017 rb@gid.co.uk fax +44 118 989 4254 (0800-1800 UK) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 6:29:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.oeno.com (ns.oeno.com [194.100.99.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 51AE114D27 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 06:29:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from will@ns.oeno.com) Received: (qmail 24175 invoked by uid 1001); 20 Apr 1999 13:26:48 -0000 To: cyouse@cybersites.com (Chuck Youse) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux References: <199904152225.SAA20324@etinc.com> <99041909500702.38298@ns1.cybersites.com> From: Ville-Pertti Keinonen Date: 20 Apr 1999 16:26:28 +0300 In-Reply-To: cyouse@cybersites.com's message of "19 Apr 1999 16:55:06 +0300" Message-ID: <86iuar5sor.fsf@not.demophon.com> Lines: 23 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/XEmacs 20.4 - "Emerald" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG cyouse@cybersites.com (Chuck Youse) writes: > The ability of NT to take better advantage of multiple processors is a function > of design, rather than "working with Intel". NT follows the microkernel design > model, with message passing, which is much easier to spread over multiple > processors than a typical monolithic kernel design. A monolithic kernel design does not restrict scalability, as long as locking is sufficiently fine-grained. In Linux, it isn't (even though some people claim that it scales just as well as truly fine-grained kernels). Current Linux versions *do* have slightly finer-grained locking than before (it's finer-grained than FreeBSD) but most filesystem and network system calls hold the giant lock during everything, so things like accessing cached data can't be expected to scale. Basically, the scaling of Linux/SMP (and FreeBSD/SMP) is currently pretty bad for kernel-intensive applications, NT doesn't need to be exceptionally good to be better. Message passing can help parallelism for asynchronous operations, but this is not typical in a general-purpose system. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 6:30:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.stox.sa.enteract.com (unknown [199.179.173.157]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8965115784 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 06:29:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ken@stox.sa.enteract.com) Received: from localhost (localhost.stox.sa.enteract.com [127.0.0.1]) by m4.stox.sa.enteract.com (8.9.3/8.6.12) with ESMTP id UAA12211; Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:26:24 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:26:23 -0500 (CDT) From: "Kenneth P. Stox" Reply-To: stox@enteract.com To: Wes Peters Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: <371BFF76.227D7B18@softweyr.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Wes Peters wrote: > > > Sun? IBM? Intel? > > > > > > Oh that's right, they're all too small to count. But they did beat > > > SGI to the punch on the Linux thing. > > > > Well, I'm not so sure about that. What technology has Sun, IBM, or Intel > > agreed to to donate to Linux right now ? I know Sun has made Java open, > > but have they donated any technology directly to the O/S ? > > Sun gave them a StarFire to play with. Is that enough? How many multi- > million dollar machines do they need? ;^) > > IBM has sent several dozen workstations and a couple of large SMP > servers to their Linux PPC partner, somewhere in Florida. Motorola > has 3 engineers doing full-time support for Linux on their CPU boards > over in Computer Division. > > SGI is already dead, they just haven't bothered to fall over yet. > Their executive staff have been driving them into the ground for > years, so it's not surprising. When I said donating technology, I meant things like XFS ( although SGI has not stated that this is one of the technologies ). Is IBM going to donate JFS and the volume management software ? -Ken Stox stox@enteract.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 6:35:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C658114FEA for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 06:35:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id IAA10963; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:48:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:48:52 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Conrad Sabatier Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Jean-Louis Thirot Subject: Re: FW: Re: TkWine setup under FreeBSD In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 20 Apr 1999, Conrad Sabatier wrote: > The following is a message I sent to the author of "TkWine", a nice tool > for downloading, configuring, building. installing and running Wine, which > unfortunately, doesn't work on FreeBSD! > > I'm really not knowledgeable enough to provide the information he requested > in response, so I thought this might be a good place to ask. :-) > > I've Cc'ed this message to the author, to include him in any discussion > that arises. He seems genuinely interested in getting this thing to work > under FreeBSD. > > Thanks, > > Conrad He's asking how to get the number of processors in a FreeBSD system. If he must know this then he can take the output of: `sysctl -n hw.ncpu` that will give him the number of CPUs in a FreeBSD box. If he has any other questions, or you wish to post a URL to his program I can show him other ways of getting this system dependant information from FreeBSD. i think the uname he wants from freebsd is: uname -srm which on my box is: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT i386 (this is the experimental version of freebsd, akin to the odd numbered kernel releases of linux) on a non-developemental version he should expect FreeBSD 3.[0-9](\.[0-9])?-STABLE i386 meaning 3.0, 3.1, 3.2, 3.2.1 i think he should really just grab the output of "uname" which is "FreeBSD" most freebsd systems behave the same way. -Alfred > > -----FW: <371C57D6.DDE280A4@univ-brest.fr>----- > > Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 12:32:54 +0200 > Sender: jl@sdt.univ-brest.fr > From: Jean-Louis Thirot > To: Conrad Sabatier > Subject: Re: TkWine setup under FreeBSD > > Conrad Sabatier wrote: > > > "TkWine was intended to be used on any unix computer. It only makes > > calls to basic shell commands and wish." > > > > So says your web page. Unfortunately, the calls to > > grep the /proc filesystem are quite Linux-centric, and fail miserably > > under FreeBSD. > > > > Are they really necessary? > > > > Hi Conrad, > > Hmm, I'm not really suprised with this pb. I could avoid this error > easily, but I prefer to know when it causes pb and fix it. Why do I need > this? Because I provide an option for make in parallel on bi(or more) > processors. This makes make much faster if it succed (ie the > dependencies are written well in Makefiles...). > > So, better than switching the multi processor detection under FreeBSD, > I'd prefer to find a way to make it working. > As I don't have FreeBSD, I need your help. > > What I need is: > output of uname -a from freeBSD > and > how do you know the # of processors under FreeBSD ? > > uname probably has an option for that. man uname > > /tmp/uname.FreeBSD.man and send me the file would be great, or find > out how it works and let me know. > > I really want to make it working on any unix suystem... but I can't test > myself... > > Great if you can help FreeBSD to be added to the list of supported > systems..... but be aware that, once this one is fixed, we still can > encouter other pb (I know at least 2 places with critical > instructions...) > > Thanks for using it and for your report. > Jean-Louis > > > --------------End of forwarded message------------------------- > > -- > Conrad Sabatier > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 6:52:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from excalibur.oceanis.net (ns.dotcom.fr [195.154.74.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A204014FEA for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 06:52:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pixel@excalibur.oceanis.net) Received: (from pixel@localhost) by excalibur.oceanis.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) id NAA20519; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:50:09 GMT From: Emmanuel DELOGET Message-Id: <199904201350.NAA20519@excalibur.oceanis.net> Subject: Re: TkWine setup under FreeBSD In-Reply-To: from Alfred Perlstein at "Apr 20, 1999 8:48:52 am" To: bright@rush.net (Alfred Perlstein) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 15:50:09 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers Mail List) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As the well known Alfred Perlstein said... ->On Tue, 20 Apr 1999, Conrad Sabatier wrote: -> ->FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT i386 -> ->(this is the experimental version of freebsd, akin to the odd numbered ->kernel releases of linux) -> ->on a non-developemental version he should expect ->FreeBSD 3.[0-9](\.[0-9])?-STABLE i386 -> ->meaning 3.0, 3.1, 3.2, 3.2.1 With respect to you, you mean [23].[0-9]..., don't you :) ? Since the 3-branch is not used by everyone yet (I still uses 2.2.8, some other at work here use 2.2.5/7...). We'll use these old versions for some time befor moving to 3.x. -> ->i think he should really just grab the output of "uname" ->which is "FreeBSD" most freebsd systems behave the same way. -> ->-Alfred -> -- ____________________________________________________________________ Emmanuel DELOGET [pixel] pixel@{dotcom.fr,epita.fr} ---- DotCom SA Windows 2000 is a trademark of... Bob Kerstein [www.windows2000.com] -------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 7:13:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sdt.univ-brest.fr (sdt.univ-brest.fr [194.167.226.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D979C14D9E for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 07:13:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from thirot@univ-brest.fr) Received: from univ-brest.fr (jl@rtc7.univ-brest.fr [195.83.247.106]) by sdt.univ-brest.fr (8.9.1a/jtpda-5.3.1) with ESMTP id QAA08716 ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:10:50 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <371C993F.5D4579D2@univ-brest.fr> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 17:11:59 +0200 From: Jean-Louis Thirot X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.29 i586) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Alfred Perlstein Cc: Conrad Sabatier , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FW: Re: TkWine setup under FreeBSD References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Alfred Perlstein wrote: > On Tue, 20 Apr 1999, Conrad Sabatier wrote: > > > The following is a message I sent to the author of "TkWine", a nice tool > > for downloading, configuring, building. installing and running Wine, which > > unfortunately, doesn't work on FreeBSD! > > > > I'm really not knowledgeable enough to provide the information he requested > > in response, so I thought this might be a good place to ask. :-) > > > > I've Cc'ed this message to the author, to include him in any discussion > > that arises. He seems genuinely interested in getting this thing to work > > under FreeBSD. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Conrad > > He's asking how to get the number of processors in a FreeBSD > system. If he must know this then he can take the output of: > > `sysctl -n hw.ncpu` > > that will give him the number of CPUs in a FreeBSD box. > > If he has any other questions, or you wish to post a URL to > his program I can show him other ways of getting this system dependant > information from FreeBSD. > > i think the uname he wants from freebsd is: > > uname -srm > > which on my box is: > > FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT i386 > > (this is the experimental version of freebsd, akin to the odd numbered > kernel releases of linux) > > on a non-developemental version he should expect > FreeBSD 3.[0-9](\.[0-9])?-STABLE i386 > > meaning 3.0, 3.1, 3.2, 3.2.1 > > i think he should really just grab the output of "uname" > which is "FreeBSD" most freebsd systems behave the same way. Thanks a lot to both Conrad and Alfred. The above info is enough for this point... I'll come back to you when somebody complains again about some linuxism in my script! (I'm quite sure there are a few of them, just let me know!) Bye, Jean-Louis To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 7:32:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pcnet1.pcnet.com (pcnet1.pcnet.com [204.213.232.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3059B14BEF for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 07:32:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eischen@vigrid.com) Received: (from eischen@localhost) by pcnet1.pcnet.com (8.8.7/PCNet) id KAA06752; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 10:28:37 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 10:28:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Daniel Eischen Message-Id: <199904201428.KAA06752@pcnet1.pcnet.com> To: crossd@cs.rpi.edu, dick@tar.com Subject: Re: -lpthread Cc: dan@trinsec.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I know this is a kludge, but it appears that a simple symlink from libc_r.* > to libpthread.* would accomplish this. My only goal is to make us > "more standard". Yeah, but you can't just link with -lc_r (or -lpthread) and expect everything to work. The reason -pthread switch was added as a gcc option, was to inhibit linking against libc and to only link against libc_r. Adding a link for -lpthread seems like a bad idea. Dan Eischen eischen@vigrid.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 7:50:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0611D14EA6 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 07:50:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (homer.softweyr.com [204.68.178.39]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA27703; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:48:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <371C93AE.8ED830B@softweyr.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:48:14 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Evren Yurtesen Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: how to powerdown? APM? or ACPI? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Evren Yurtesen wrote: > > well, the APM support is compiled in and FreeBSD > is probing for it! but the problem, FreeBSD is not > able to find any APM device on the system! > well I have searched for this a lot on the net and > found something called ACPI (I am not sure what it > is yet though) maybe new intel boards support it only? Hmm. I poked through the code a little bit, and couldn't make any real sense of it, but I've never looked at APM before. The last hacker to really work on it much appears to have been Poul Henning- Kamp, phk@freebsd.org. You may want to ask him about what you're seeing, and about ACPI. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 8:19:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from shidahara1.planet.sci.kobe-u.ac.jp (shidahara1.planet.sci.kobe-u.ac.jp [133.30.50.200]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 463631579B for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:19:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from takawata@shidahara1.planet.sci.kobe-u.ac.jp) Received: from shidahara1.planet.sci.kobe-u.ac.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by shidahara1.planet.sci.kobe-u.ac.jp (8.8.8+2.7Wbeta7/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA09273; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 00:08:01 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <199904201508.AAA09273@shidahara1.planet.sci.kobe-u.ac.jp> To: wes@softweyr.com, yurtesen@ispro.net.tr Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: how to powerdown? APM? or ACPI? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:48:14 CST" References: <371C93AE.8ED830B@softweyr.com> Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 00:08:01 +0900 From: Takanori Watanabe Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <371C93AE.8ED830B@softweyr.com>, Wes Peters wrote: >Evren Yurtesen wrote: >> well I have searched for this a lot on the net and >> found something called ACPI (I am not sure what it >> is yet though) maybe new intel boards support it only? If the code you mention is my code,it has no function to power management. The code only shows data about ACPI,Searching on Memory. The reason I wrote is to get mother board infomation >Hmm. I poked through the code a little bit, and couldn't make any >real sense of it, but I've never looked at APM before. The last I think all ACPI complient machine will work with APM if ACPI is disabled. >hacker to really work on it much appears to have been Poul Henning- >Kamp, phk@freebsd.org. You may want to ask him about what you're >seeing, and about ACPI. I know one group working on ACPI for Linux, but what they can is not so different from what my code can do. See http://phobos.fachschaften.tu-muenchen.de/acpi/ . Takanori Watanabe Public Key Key fingerprint = 2C 51 E2 78 2C E1 C5 2D 0F F1 20 A3 11 3A 62 2A To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 8:22:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 918A9157B5 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:22:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA62780; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 09:19:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id JAA02956; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 09:19:26 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199904201519.JAA02956@harmony.village.org> To: stox@enteract.com Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux Cc: Wes Peters , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 20:26:23 CDT." References: Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 09:19:26 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message "Kenneth P. Stox" writes: : When I said donating technology, I meant things like XFS ( although SGI : has not stated that this is one of the technologies ). Is IBM going to : donate JFS and the volume management software ? SGI has funded development of readonly xfs file system for Linux. Not quite what you had in mind, but better than a poke in the eye with a sharp stick. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 8:31:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FD7114FD4 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:31:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (homer.softweyr.com [204.68.178.39]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA27811; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 09:28:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <371C9D1D.CBBB6A8F@softweyr.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 09:28:29 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Graham Wheeler Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay References: <199904200921.LAA09941@cdsec.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Graham Wheeler wrote: > > Hi all > > I have an interesting problem. I have a routine to implement delays: > > void Sleep(int secs, int usecs = 0) > { > struct timeval tv; > tv.tv_sec = secs; > tv.tv_usec = usecs; > (void)select(0, 0, 0, 0, &tv); > } > > I am using this both because it gives better resolution than sleep(), > and also because it doesn't require the use of SIGALRM, which I am > using elsewhere. Do you have any reasons not to use usleep(3) or nanosleep(2)? -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 8:34:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id E4FE714E04 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:34:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id PAA23736; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 15:16:35 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199904201316.PAA23736@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay To: wes@softweyr.com (Wes Peters) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 15:16:35 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: gram@cdsec.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <371C9D1D.CBBB6A8F@softweyr.com> from "Wes Peters" at Apr 20, 99 09:28:10 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 350 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > I have an interesting problem. I have a routine to implement delays: ... > > I am using this both because it gives better resolution than sleep(), > > and also because it doesn't require the use of SIGALRM, which I am > > using elsewhere. > > Do you have any reasons not to use usleep(3) or nanosleep(2)? portability to other unixes... luigi To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 8:52:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57F3D14CEA for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:52:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA08002; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:06:07 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:06:05 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Jean-Louis Thirot Cc: Conrad Sabatier , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FW: Re: TkWine setup under FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <371C993F.5D4579D2@univ-brest.fr> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 20 Apr 1999, Jean-Louis Thirot wrote: > Alfred Perlstein wrote: > > > On Tue, 20 Apr 1999, Conrad Sabatier wrote: > > > > > The following is a message I sent to the author of "TkWine", a nice tool > > > for downloading, configuring, building. installing and running Wine, which > > > unfortunately, doesn't work on FreeBSD! > > > > > > I'm really not knowledgeable enough to provide the information he requested > > > in response, so I thought this might be a good place to ask. :-) > > > > > > I've Cc'ed this message to the author, to include him in any discussion > > > that arises. He seems genuinely interested in getting this thing to work > > > under FreeBSD. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Conrad > > > > He's asking how to get the number of processors in a FreeBSD > > system. If he must know this then he can take the output of: > > > > `sysctl -n hw.ncpu` > > > > that will give him the number of CPUs in a FreeBSD box. > > > > If he has any other questions, or you wish to post a URL to > > his program I can show him other ways of getting this system dependant > > information from FreeBSD. > > > > i think the uname he wants from freebsd is: > > > > uname -srm > > > > which on my box is: > > > > FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT i386 > > > > (this is the experimental version of freebsd, akin to the odd numbered > > kernel releases of linux) > > > > on a non-developemental version he should expect > > FreeBSD 3.[0-9](\.[0-9])?-STABLE i386 > > > > meaning 3.0, 3.1, 3.2, 3.2.1 > > > > i think he should really just grab the output of "uname" > > which is "FreeBSD" most freebsd systems behave the same way. > > Thanks a lot to both Conrad and Alfred. > The above info is enough for this point... > I'll come back to you when somebody complains again about some linuxism in my > script! > (I'm quite sure there are a few of them, just let me know!) Cool, we just want to see more programs available for people using alternate operating systems :) > > Bye, > Jean-Louis > -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 8:54:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA64614CEA for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:54:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (homer.softweyr.com [204.68.178.39]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA27885; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 09:52:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <371CA2B1.D2B495F5@softweyr.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 09:52:17 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: stox@enteract.com Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Kenneth P. Stox" wrote: > > > > Well, I'm not so sure about that. What technology has Sun, IBM, or Intel > > > agreed to to donate to Linux right now ? I know Sun has made Java open, > > > but have they donated any technology directly to the O/S ? > > > > Sun gave them a StarFire to play with. Is that enough? How many multi- > > million dollar machines do they need? ;^) > > > > IBM has sent several dozen workstations and a couple of large SMP > > servers to their Linux PPC partner, somewhere in Florida. Motorola > > has 3 engineers doing full-time support for Linux on their CPU boards > > over in Computer Division. > > > > SGI is already dead, they just haven't bothered to fall over yet. > > Their executive staff have been driving them into the ground for > > years, so it's not surprising. > > When I said donating technology, I meant things like XFS ( although SGI > has not stated that this is one of the technologies ). Is IBM going to > donate JFS and the volume management software ? I doubt it, but Sun has apparently given the Linux developers access to Solaris code for StarFire booting. They want Linux to be able to run on a partition on the StarFire, which can split sets of CPUs into a processor partition and run multiple operating systems on the same system. This would allow a StarFire to run both Solaris and Linux at the same time. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 8:54:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lestat.nas.nasa.gov (lestat.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.50.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9EB914F09 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:54:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from thorpej@lestat.nas.nasa.gov) Received: from lestat (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lestat.nas.nasa.gov (8.8.8/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA11637; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:51:57 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904201551.IAA11637@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> To: Bob Bishop Cc: Graham Wheeler , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay Reply-To: Jason Thorpe From: Jason Thorpe Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:51:57 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:25:35 +0100 Bob Bishop wrote: > Most likely your select() is taking a signal; truss might be revealing. You > should in theory be able to write something along the lines of: > > do > r = select(0, 0, 0, 0, &tv); > while (r == -1 && errno == EINTR); > > but AFAIK tv won't get updated correctly, see the BUGS entry in select(2). What do you mean "won't get updated correctly"? A const timeval is the correct behavior :-) In NetBSD, sleep(3) uses nanosleep(2), and thus doesn't stomp on SIGALARM. -- Jason R. Thorpe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 8:56:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E8FD151B3 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 08:56:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gram@cdsec.com) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA12110 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 17:54:21 +0200 (SAST) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 12048; Tue Apr 20 17:53:26 1999 Message-ID: <371CA30F.6F84565B@cdsec.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 17:53:52 +0200 From: Graham Wheeler X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay References: <199904201316.PAA23736@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > > > I have an interesting problem. I have a routine to implement delays: > ... > > > I am using this both because it gives better resolution than sleep(), > > > and also because it doesn't require the use of SIGALRM, which I am > > > using elsewhere. > > > > Do you have any reasons not to use usleep(3) or nanosleep(2)? > > portability to other unixes... As well as the fact that usleep uses signals. I am trying to avoid using signals, as there is a Timer C++ class in the same library which implements timeouts for system calls using SIGALRM (and a SignalHandler class), and I want to be able to use the Timer class in the same code as the Sleep routine should the need arise. -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 9: 5:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E58C514CEA for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 09:05:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (homer.softweyr.com [204.68.178.39]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA27929; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 10:02:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <371CA524.400D66F8@softweyr.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 10:02:44 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Luigi Rizzo Cc: gram@cdsec.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay References: <199904201316.PAA23736@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > > > I have an interesting problem. I have a routine to implement delays: > ... > > > I am using this both because it gives better resolution than sleep(), > > > and also because it doesn't require the use of SIGALRM, which I am > > > using elsewhere. > > > > Do you have any reasons not to use usleep(3) or nanosleep(2)? > > portability to other unixes... Non-Posix ones? Do any of those exist anymore? I just checked NetBSD, Solaris, and Linux, it exists on all of those. Apparently it doesn't on SunOS 4.1.4, which is odd, since that was 4.3BSD. I'd still suggest an #ifdef test in the code and use nanosleep where- ever it is available. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 9:19:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from verdi.nethelp.no (verdi.nethelp.no [158.36.41.162]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 76CB214C49 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 09:19:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sthaug@nethelp.no) Received: (qmail 19007 invoked by uid 1001); 20 Apr 1999 16:17:17 +0000 (GMT) To: wes@softweyr.com Cc: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, gram@cdsec.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay From: sthaug@nethelp.no In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 20 Apr 1999 10:02:44 -0600" References: <371CA524.400D66F8@softweyr.com> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.05+ on Emacs 19.34.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 18:17:16 +0200 Message-ID: <19005.924625036@verdi.nethelp.no> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Non-Posix ones? Do any of those exist anymore? I just checked NetBSD, > Solaris, and Linux, it exists on all of those. Apparently it doesn't > on SunOS 4.1.4, which is odd, since that was 4.3BSD. 4.2BSD, AFAIK. And some SYSV extensions. We still have some of those machines running. Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 10: 6: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mercury.inktomi.com (mercury.inktomi.com [209.1.32.126]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1EFB15237 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 10:06:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jplevyak@inktomi.com) Received: from proxydev.inktomi.com (proxydev.inktomi.com [209.1.32.44]) by mercury.inktomi.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id KAA22677 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 10:03:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jplevyak@localhost) by proxydev.inktomi.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) id KAA10756 for hackers@FreeBSD.org; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 10:03:33 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19990420100333.B10370@proxydev.inktomi.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 10:03:33 -0700 From: John Plevyak To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: flock + kernel threads bug Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Currently, kernel threads + flock does not work. The lock is not necessarily released with the multi-threaded application shuts down. I have a patch which I have been running for a month now with no problems; who might I send it to to get it reviewed/committed? It would greatly simplify the installation of our multi-threaded apps on FreeBSD if a kernel patch was not required. Not to mention a general increase in confidence to have them work with FreeBSD "out-of-the-box". john -- John Bradley Plevyak, PhD, jplevyak@inktomi.com, PGP KeyID: 051130BD Inktomi Corporation, 1900 S. Norfolk Street, Suite 310, San Mateo, CA 94403 W:(650)653-2830 F:(650)653-2889 P:(888)491-1332/5103192436.4911332@pagenet.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 10:20:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from beelzebubba.sysabend.org (beelzebubba.sysabend.org [208.243.107.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0038414ED7 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 10:20:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ragnar@sysabend.org) Received: by beelzebubba.sysabend.org (Postfix, from userid 1004) id BC7693F79; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:18:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by beelzebubba.sysabend.org (Postfix) with SMTP id B932D997E; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:18:03 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:18:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Jamie Bowden To: Daniel Ortmann Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTENTION PLEASE: g77 in base system. In-Reply-To: <199904200341.XAA29141@gatekeeper.itribe.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Daniel Ortmann wrote: :Without a STANDARD system Fortran compiler an operating system is :unlikely to be taken seriously by ANY large engineering company. : :We could, however, do without "fortune". :-) Never. :) Jamie Bowden -- If we've got to fight over grep, sign me up. But boggle can go. -Ted Faber (on Hasbro's request for removal of /usr/games/boggle) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 10:27: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C833914ED7 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 10:27:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gram@cdsec.com) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA18438 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 19:24:28 +0200 (SAST) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 18377; Tue Apr 20 19:23:57 1999 Message-ID: <371CB846.FD0F4422@cdsec.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 19:24:22 +0200 From: Graham Wheeler X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: File locking problem Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi all I'm having some problems with file locking; perhaps someone can clarify this as the flock man page isn't very illuminating. I have a process which obtains an exclusive lock on a file. It then forks off a child that execs another process, after dup-ing the file descriptor so that the exec'ed process sees the file as standard input. From the behaviour I am seeing, it appears as if when the execed process completes the file gets unlocked, even though the parent still has it open. What exactly happens when a process obtains an exclusive lock on a file and then forks? Does the lock get removed only after both processes have closed the file, or after either one of them closes it? And if the latter, is there a way I can get around this? In my code I actually have three processes: grandparent: locks the file, forks off parent, closes file, and loops around looking for more files to process parent: forks off child and waits to see if it exits with value 0 if so it unlinks the file in either case it closes the file and exits child: dups the file descriptor to be fd 0 and execs another program to handle the input The problem is that when the child exits the grandparent is looping around and relocking the file (which should have been unlinked), and forking off another parent - which then complains because the file is empty (fgets fails and feof is set). So it appears the lock is being removed by the child upon termination, and the grandparent is obtaining another lock before the unlink takes effect. -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 10:42:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pcayk.ukc.ac.uk (pcayk.ukc.ac.uk [129.12.41.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83F0C1509C for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 10:42:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dlombardo@excite.com) Received: from excite.com (xtsw12c.ukc.ac.uk [129.12.41.85]) by pcayk.ukc.ac.uk (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id SAA49832 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 18:41:46 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dlombardo@excite.com) Message-ID: <371CBCCA.277AA259@excite.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 18:43:38 +0100 From: Dean Lombardo Organization: University of Kent at Canterbury X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay References: <199904201316.PAA23736@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> <371CA524.400D66F8@softweyr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Wes Peters wrote: > > Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > > > > Do you have any reasons not to use usleep(3) or nanosleep(2)? > > > > portability to other unixes... > > Non-Posix ones? Do any of those exist anymore? I just checked NetBSD, > Solaris, and Linux, it exists on all of those. Apparently it doesn't > on SunOS 4.1.4, which is odd, since that was 4.3BSD. Just checked - usleep exists on SunOS 4.1.3, nanosleep doesn't. Dean To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 10:59:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nero.cybersites.com (nero.cybersites.com [207.92.123.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 352971578C for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 10:59:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cyouse@cybersites.com) Received: from ns1.cybersites.com (ns1.cybersites.com [207.92.123.2]) by nero.cybersites.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA06574 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:58:17 -0400 From: Chuck Youse To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Informix and BSD Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:52:22 -0400 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.17] Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <99042013535505.14339@ns1.cybersites.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-KMail-Mark: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I was wondering if anyone has had any experience using the Informix (for Linux) client SDK with FreeBSD (I guess under Linux emulation). In particular, I'm hoping that it's a stable, viable solution. I need to get rid of these Linux boxes, they're hurting me. -- Chuck Youse Director of Systems cyouse@cybersites.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 11: 2:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lor.watermarkgroup.com (lor.watermarkgroup.com [207.202.73.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 963CC1578C for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:02:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luoqi@watermarkgroup.com) Received: (from luoqi@localhost) by lor.watermarkgroup.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA15897; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:59:58 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from luoqi) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:59:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Luoqi Chen Message-Id: <199904201759.NAA15897@lor.watermarkgroup.com> To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jplevyak@inktomi.com Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Currently, kernel threads + flock does not work. The lock is not > necessarily released with the multi-threaded application shuts down. > Could you elaborate on the problem? > I have a patch which I have been running for a month now with no problems; > who might I send it to to get it reviewed/committed? > You could file a bug reports, see send-pr(1). Or you can send to me, I'm very interested in seeing it. > It would greatly simplify the installation of our multi-threaded apps > on FreeBSD if a kernel patch was not required. Not to mention a > general increase in confidence to have them work with FreeBSD "out-of-the-box". > > john > > -- > John Bradley Plevyak, PhD, jplevyak@inktomi.com, PGP KeyID: 051130BD > Inktomi Corporation, 1900 S. Norfolk Street, Suite 310, San Mateo, CA 94403 > W:(650)653-2830 F:(650)653-2889 P:(888)491-1332/5103192436.4911332@pagenet.net > -lq To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 11:10:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from feral.com (feral.com [192.67.166.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A0F61578C for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:10:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mjacob@feral.com) Received: from feral.com (mjacob@feral.com [192.67.166.1]) by feral.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA24445; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:07:40 -0700 Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:07:39 -0700 (PWT) From: Matthew Jacob Reply-To: mjacob@feral.com To: Matthew Dillon , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: FFS Stuff... good job... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ran a 7 day test of light to medium testing on a -current system- the clustering code works quite well and so I was running a load average of ~30 and a net of 20MB/s for the entire time. Not a peep. No errors or data corruption detected. Very good. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 11:19: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mercury.inktomi.com (mercury.inktomi.com [209.1.32.126]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB1FB14FE9 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:19:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jplevyak@inktomi.com) Received: from proxydev.inktomi.com (proxydev.inktomi.com [209.1.32.44]) by mercury.inktomi.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA01197; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:16:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jplevyak@localhost) by proxydev.inktomi.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) id LAA12296; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:16:34 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19990420111634.D10370@proxydev.inktomi.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:16:34 -0700 From: John Plevyak To: Luoqi Chen , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jplevyak@inktomi.com Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug References: <199904201759.NAA15897@lor.watermarkgroup.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904201759.NAA15897@lor.watermarkgroup.com>; from Luoqi Chen on Tue, Apr 20, 1999 at 01:59:58PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I sumbmitted a bug: kern/10265 it includes a description, a program to repro and a patch. The problem is: releases of file locks depend on the close coming from the same PID as took out the lock. Since kernel threads have different PIDs it is possible for a peer thread to close the file locked by another peer. This results in the file lock not being cleared. The patch does: 1. to use p->p_leader as the PID for file locking, 2. to use p->p_leader->p_flag & P_ADVLOCK to determine if locks are held 3. ensure that p->p_leader does not complete exit1() before all the peers. The full patch is in the bug report. I can send it to you also if that is more convenient. The patch in the bug report is non-optimal since it wakes up the leader for each child instead of the just the last one. If you change the last lines to: if(p->p_leader->p_peers) { q = p->p_leader; while(q->p_peers != p) q = q->p_peers; q->p_peers = p->p_peers; if (!p->p_leader->p_peers) wakeup((caddr_t)p->p_leader); } from + if(p->p_leader->p_peers) { + q = p->p_leader; + while(q->p_peers != p) + q = q->p_peers; + q->p_peers = p->p_peers; + wakeup((caddr_t)p->p_leader); + } This fixes it. Thanx! john On Tue, Apr 20, 1999 at 01:59:58PM -0400, Luoqi Chen wrote: > > Currently, kernel threads + flock does not work. The lock is not > > necessarily released with the multi-threaded application shuts down. > > > Could you elaborate on the problem? > > > I have a patch which I have been running for a month now with no problems; > > who might I send it to to get it reviewed/committed? > > > You could file a bug reports, see send-pr(1). Or you can send to me, I'm > very interested in seeing it. > > > It would greatly simplify the installation of our multi-threaded apps > > on FreeBSD if a kernel patch was not required. Not to mention a > > general increase in confidence to have them work with FreeBSD "out-of-the-box". > > > > john > > > > -- > > John Bradley Plevyak, PhD, jplevyak@inktomi.com, PGP KeyID: 051130BD > > Inktomi Corporation, 1900 S. Norfolk Street, Suite 310, San Mateo, CA 94403 > > W:(650)653-2830 F:(650)653-2889 P:(888)491-1332/5103192436.4911332@pagenet.net > > > -lq > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- John Bradley Plevyak, PhD, jplevyak@inktomi.com, PGP KeyID: 051130BD Inktomi Corporation, 1900 S. Norfolk Street, Suite 310, San Mateo, CA 94403 W:(650)653-2830 F:(650)653-2889 P:(888)491-1332/5103192436.4911332@pagenet.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 11:24:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lor.watermarkgroup.com (lor.watermarkgroup.com [207.202.73.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5DAE14E78 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:24:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luoqi@watermarkgroup.com) Received: (from luoqi@localhost) by lor.watermarkgroup.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA16150; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 14:21:40 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from luoqi) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 14:21:40 -0400 (EDT) From: Luoqi Chen Message-Id: <199904201821.OAA16150@lor.watermarkgroup.com> To: gram@cdsec.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: File locking problem Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > What exactly happens when a process obtains an exclusive lock on > a file and then forks? Does the lock get removed only after both > processes have closed the file, or after either one of them closes it? > And if the latter, is there a way I can get around this? > From flock(2): Locks are on files, not file descriptors. That is, file descriptors du- plicated through dup(2) or fork(2) do not result in multiple instances of a lock, but rather multiple references to a single lock. If a process holding a lock on a file forks and the child explicitly unlocks the file, the parent will lose its lock. Try using the POSIX style fcntl(2) lock instead? -lq To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 11:42:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from deimos.nc.com (deimos.nc.com [207.88.167.190]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7256B14F60 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:42:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dyson@iquest.net) Received: from iquest.net (dyson.nc.com [172.17.1.177]) by deimos.nc.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with ESMTP id LAA29395; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:33:11 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <371CCB06.2DDECFA@iquest.net> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 11:44:22 -0700 From: John Dyson Organization: NCI X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Matthew Dillon , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! References: <199904192039.PAA20464@dyson.iquest.net> <199904192051.NAA90282@apollo.backplane.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Because I am under alot of pressure right now, all of my responses to Matt's concerns follow. Note that it seems that he and I are arguing about expediency vs. solution. I prefer solution, and more work is necessary (a quick-fix isn't a solution.) > > My concern is over the fact that the buffer cache is relatively > restrictive. Things get thrown out of it very quickly due to its small > size. You yourself have said that one of the VM system's most important > features was its ability to not throw away things that it may need to > I/O back in soon. > > Well, I submit that whatever space we 'waste' by using the VM system > to back directory information we gain by not having to re-I/O the data. > That begs the question of forcing buffer cache entries to be PAGE_SIZE (4K-16K or so). Yuck!!! There are other ways to deal with the caching of directories, including some approaches that I hadn't developed yet (including explicit mgmt of the sub-page sized data through a different mechanism.) > > VM management devolves down into the art of not throwing away things > you need -- you said it yourself. I think this helps enormously. > That isn't quite accurate. VM mgmt devolves down to avoiding I/O, by using the resources at hand. The minimization goal is minimal I/O, and not to "fit as much into memory as possible." Queueing methods are critical (don't plop as much into queues as they will hold.) Be ready to correct policy mistakes, and more to this point: don't throw away resources that you will likely use. The Namei cache just doesn't cut it for the purposes of directory caching (unless it is changed significantly), because it doesn't utilize the entire directory for it's caching function. By wasting between 3.5K and 15.5K per directory (almost on average), it is apparent that something other than PAGE_SIZE granularity is important. The B_MALLOC was an add-on, and not a design feature in order to get around the wastage. Eventually, a better method was to appear, but that is water under the bridge. One work around that would be satsifactory (until the better scheme arrives) is to allow up to a certain number of buffers, and then spill over into the merged scheme. A reasonable policy needs to be developed, but most of the high and low watermarking mechanisms were in my original code (some of it now broken and/or removed.) I am not claiming that you MUST keep B_MALLOC, but it seems that using the traditional merged VM buffer cache mechanisms isn't correct either. A solution eventually needs to be found, and not just a fix or hack. > :If buffers are not used for sub-page entities, another scheme should be > :used. I fear expediency or sloppiness will prevail. > : > :John > > You are still ignoring the several points I brought up. I wish you would > address them. I put forth several theories as to why there would be > relatively little waste. > You are still throwing a "hack" out as a solution. It isn't an adequate solution to waste so much memory, it is better to solve the problem. The original code had the mechanisms (with a few minor changes) both memory thriftiness for directories and more cache. In a rush to "fix" imaginary problems, the solution for a real one has been significantly complicated. My local codebase, without the broken vfs_bio will have both, with only a few fixes. Alas, you get to invent again, and again and again... If you asked before hacking, things would move along in a more forward path. Various points that beg the issue elided... > > Considering the immensly critical nature of the directory structure, if > there were any single place where I'd be willing to waste some bytes it > would be there. > Here you admit waste, and don't solve the problem... Sigh... The "fix" is a problem statement and not a solution. It is indicative of seeing solutions to problems as coding style or quick work arounds within a given framework, and doesn't show a depth of understanding that supports growth. The issue that you see is a problem statement, and the solution presented is only a lab exercise. Now, a good solution is needed. Support can be gained by asking, rather than the necessary after the fact criticism. A big *sigh*... John Matthew Dillon wrote: > > :> I see an advantage both ways. Not only are we able to use the VM cache > :> to cache directories ( and thus scale directory operations to memory ), > :> but I don't think there is even a downside to mapping whole pages even for > :> small directories. The reason is simple: When you access small > :> directories you tend to access specific files in said directories. When > :> you access specific files, there's a good chance they will be in the namei > :> cache. If they are in the namei cache, the VMIO mapping will not be > :> referenced very often for most small directories which means that the > :> VM cache will throw it away. Hence, no waste. > :> > : > :I cannot believe that you said that: > : The size of the cache buffers are then up to 8X larger when using > : a whole page instead of a 512byte buffer. BTW, VMIO is a misnomer, > : and I named it... VMIO was an earlier incarnation, and some of > : it spilled into the existant code. > : > : Again, do a study to find out if the internal fragmentation makes > : things worse. Don't depend on the VM code to just "throw" things > : away -- if you can make considered decisions instead of deferring > : them to a policy somewhere, make the decision... > : > :John > > My concern is over the fact that the buffer cache is relatively > restrictive. Things get thrown out of it very quickly due to its small > size. You yourself have said that one of the VM system's most important > features was its ability to not throw away things that it may need to > I/O back in soon. > > Well, I submit that whatever space we 'waste' by using the VM system > to back directory information we gain by not having to re-I/O the data. > > But I truely do not believe that we are really wasting all that much > space. How many directories are in-use on a system at any given point? > Now subtract the ones that are fully namei cached... now take into account > the fact that once disassociated from its struct buf, the backing pages > are managed on a page-by-page basis rather then on a buffer-by-buffer > basis. I do not think you are left with much, and what you ARE left with > is easily managed by the VM system. > > Or, let me put it another way: If enough directories are being cached > to make the wasteage theoretically significant, then enough directories > are being cached to blow away the existing malloc buffer space and cause > active data to be thrown away, resulting in unnecessary I/O. Hell, the > processes *accessing* the directories are already an order of magnitude > larger then the storage required for the directories. I just don't think > we lose much by VMIOing directories. > > VM management devolves down into the art of not throwing away things > you need -- you said it yourself. I think this helps enormously. > > -Matt > Matthew Dillon > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 12: 3:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B6B714BCD for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 12:03:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id MAA99210; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 12:00:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 12:00:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904201900.MAA99210@apollo.backplane.com> To: Graham Wheeler Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay References: <199904200921.LAA09941@cdsec.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Hi all : :I have an interesting problem. I have a routine to implement delays: : :void Sleep(int secs, int usecs = 0) :{ : struct timeval tv; : tv.tv_sec = secs; : tv.tv_usec = usecs; : (void)select(0, 0, 0, 0, &tv); :} : :I am using this both because it gives better resolution than sleep(), :and also because it doesn't require the use of SIGALRM, which I am :using elsewhere. : :On my development machine, Sleep(60) does exactly what is expected. On :my clients machine, Sleep(60) returns immediately. Both are running :FreeBSD 2.2.7. I don't have access to the clients machine, which is :in another city, and has no development environment, so I can't run gdb, :although it may not give away anything in any case. : :Does anyone have any ideas why the one works and the other doesn't? : :TIA :Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Well, select() breaks out when the process gets a signal. I recommend checking select()'s return code & errno. I don't think select() is restartable. What you would have to do is use gettimeofday() and then call select(). Check the return value, and if select() was interrupted call gettimeofday() again to figure out how much time elapsed, fixup the tv structure, and loop up. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 12: 5:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0442C14BCF for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 12:05:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id MAA99248; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 12:02:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 12:02:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904201902.MAA99248@apollo.backplane.com> To: Graham Wheeler Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay References: <199904200945.LAA28715@bowtie.nl> <371C53FE.3CE190C9@cdsec.com> <371C5501.3AA0A34@cdsec.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : :I'm starting to suspect that this is the case, and that the signal :is SIGCHLD. The process does spin off child processes, and there may be Another thing you can do, if you want, is block all signals during the select using sigprocmask(). But this entails three system calls ( sigprocmask(), select(), sigprocmask() ) instead of two in the nominal case ( gettimeofday(), select(), [ gettimeofday() if select() returns that it was interrupted ] ). -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 12: 9: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (osmium.gn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19AD6157FE for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 12:08:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wilko@yedi.iaf.nl) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (8.9.2/8.9.2) with UUCP id UAA30976; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 20:38:05 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.9.3/8.6.12) id UAA01002; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 20:33:56 +0200 (CEST) From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199904201833.UAA01002@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: Is it ok to include sys/signal.h directly? In-Reply-To: from John Baldwin at "Apr 19, 1999 11:42:19 pm" To: jobaldwi@vt.edu (John Baldwin) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 20:33:56 +0200 (CEST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem, The Netherlands X-pgp-info: PGP public key at 'finger wilko@freefall.freebsd.org' X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As John Baldwin wrote ... > Well, no response on -questions, so I figured I'd try -hackers. :) Well, in case it is any consolation compiling netatalk (netatalk-1.4b2 to be exact) fails exactly in the same fashion: gcc -p -DBSD4_4 -O2 -I../../include -c asp_getsess.c In file included from asp_getsess.c:7: /usr/include/sys/signal.h:163: parse error before `size_t' /usr/include/sys/signal.h:163: warning: no semicolon at end of struct or union /usr/include/sys/signal.h:165: parse error before `}' Tried this yesterday evening and have not tried to find out why. On 2.2.8-stable this worked like a charm, on 3.1-stable it does not Wilko > > -----FW: Is it ok to include sys/signal.h directly?----- > > I've a question, should programs always include /usr/include/signal.h or is it > ok for them to include /usr/include/sys/signal.h directly? Currently on 3.0+ > programs that include sys/signal.h fail to compile. I.e.: > > > cat temp.c > #include > #include > > void main() > { > printf("foobar\n"); > } > > make temp.o > cc -O -pipe -c temp.c > In file included from temp.c:1: > /usr/include/sys/signal.h:163: parse error before `size_t' > /usr/include/sys/signal.h:163: warning: no semicolon at end of struct or union > /usr/include/sys/signal.h:165: parse error before `}' > *** Error code 1 > > Stop. > > They die because size_t is not defined when the sigaltstack struct is defined. > In /usr/include/signal.h, machine/ansi.h is #include'd before sys/signal.h so > that this problem is avoided. If it is desirable for programs to include just > sys/signal.h by itself, then this patch would fix the problem: > > --- signal.h.orig Sat Apr 17 15:33:02 1999 > +++ signal.h Sat Apr 17 15:33:37 1999 > @@ -45,6 +45,7 @@ > #include > #include > #include /* sig_atomic_t; trap codes; sigcontext */ > +#include > > #if !defined(_ANSI_SOURCE) && !defined(_POSIX_SOURCE) > #define NSIG 32 /* counting 0; could be 33 (mask is 1-32) */ > > Note that these programs worked fine on 2.2.x, AFAIK. At least, one of the > ports (devel/cccc) #include'd sys/signal.h, and it was broken in 3.0 but worked > in 2.2. Groeten / Cheers, Wilko _ ______________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Arnhem, The Netherlands |/|/ / / /( (_) Bulte WWW : http://www.tcja.nl _______________________ Powered by FreeBSD ___ http://www.freebsd.org _____ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 12:31:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D025115437 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 12:31:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id MAA99383; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 12:28:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 12:28:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904201928.MAA99383@apollo.backplane.com> To: John Dyson Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! References: <199904192039.PAA20464@dyson.iquest.net> <199904192051.NAA90282@apollo.backplane.com> <371CCB06.2DDECFA@iquest.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Because I am under alot of pressure right now, all of my responses :to Matt's concerns follow. Note that it seems that he and I are :arguing about expediency vs. solution. I prefer solution, and more :work is necessary (a quick-fix isn't a solution.) All right. Then what about this.... right now vm_page_t's are required to be PAGE_SIZE'd. We change this. We allow vm_page_t's to be sized in multiples of DEV_BSIZE from 0 through to PAGE_SIZE, but not crossing a physical page boundry. We get rid of vm_page_t->valid and vm_page_t->dirty and turn those into PG_VALID and PG_DIRTY flags. we add vm_page_t->size. When the VM systems goes to lookup a page, the caller requests the page size. If pgsize is 0, any page size is allowed to be returned. vm_page_lookup(object, pindex) becomes vm_page_lookup(object, pindex, pgsize) Any portion of the VM system which needs PAGE_SIZE'd VM pages specifically requests the page with pgsize == PAGE_SIZE, resulting in NULL if the page does not exist or if it is the wrong size which then forces an I/O ( the I/O routines would be responsible for 'resizing' an underlying page ). If non-NULL is returned when a PAGE_SIZE page is requested, the vm_page_t is perfectly suitable for being sent through the pmap() routines. Otherwise it is not. The portions of the VM system that need the page to be PAGE_SIZEd, such as vm_fault, require it and then continue to operate as they currently do. The portions of the VM system that do not specify pgsize == 0 and deal with the result. So: * get rid of valid * get rid of dirty * add PG_VALID, PG_DIRTY * add 'short size' * the 'parent' VM page is inherent based on the physical address of the page found in phys_addr. when a sub-page-sized page is allocated, the associated parent is disassociated from the page queues and held. And: * Require pgsize argument to vm_page_lookup() * Implement secondary static or dynamic vm_page_t array * Remove buffer cache valid/dirty bitmask code * Add buffer cache sized vm_page handling code * Remove buffer cache B_MALLOC junk entirely * Consolidate and clean up buffer cache code The BUFFER CACHE then says 'ok, we do *not* need PAGE_SIZE'd VM pages'. Buffer cache problem solved. Not only that, but the buffer cache is greatly simplified because it does not have to scan the valid/dirty bits. The core vm_page array stays as it currently is and is only used for PAGE_SIZE chunks. A secondary 'dynamic' vm_page array is used to allocate sub-page-sized vm_page_t's. When a sub-page-sized vm_page_t is allocated, it may have to reserve a full but unassociated vm_page_t 'parent' as backing for it. However, when multiple sub-page-sized chunks are allocated, the same parent can be used as long as there is space. We would also be able to use this to extend support for segment sized pages. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 13: 8:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from spoon.beta.com (mcgovern.ne.mediaone.net [24.218.8.93]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD50B1509F for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:08:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mcgovern@spoon.beta.com) Received: from spoon.beta.com (localhost.beta.com [127.0.0.1]) by spoon.beta.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id QAA18232 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:06:27 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from mcgovern@spoon.beta.com) Message-Id: <199904202006.QAA18232@spoon.beta.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Reply-To: mcgovern@spoon.beta.com Subject: Wanted: Comments on new cyclades (Z) driver... Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:06:27 -0400 From: "Brian J. McGovern" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'm currently in the process of debugging and testing a new (Version 2) driver for the Cyclades "Z"-line of high-density/speed serial port cards, specifically the 8Zo, and Ze product lines. The driver is currently at ftp://spoon.beta.com/pub/cz200.alpha.tgz. I'm looking for comments on cleanliness, commenting, and structure, as I'll be submitting the driver to the core team once its pretty well shaken out. If you have one of the boards, you're more than welcome to take it for a test drive. The only think that I'm aware of that outright doesn't work is using host memory for the serial buffers (it seems to crash the firmware). All-in-all, its a major step over the version thats been being distributed in the xperimnt directory of FreeBSD 2.X and 3.X (the newest version of the 1.X driver is also there...). -Brian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 13:11:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.tar.com (ns.tar.com [204.95.187.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F032715815 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:11:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dick@ns.tar.com) Received: (from dick@localhost) by ns.tar.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA35737; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 15:09:02 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dick) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 15:09:02 -0500 From: "Richard Seaman, Jr." To: Luoqi Chen , John Plevyak Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug Message-ID: <19990420150902.A89750@tar.com> References: <199904201759.NAA15897@lor.watermarkgroup.com> <19990420111634.D10370@proxydev.inktomi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <19990420111634.D10370@proxydev.inktomi.com>; from John Plevyak on Tue, Apr 20, 1999 at 11:16:34AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Apr 20, 1999 at 11:16:34AM -0700, John Plevyak wrote: > > I sumbmitted a bug: kern/10265 it includes a description, > a program to repro and a patch. > > The problem is: > > releases of file locks depend on the close coming from the > same PID as took out the lock. Since kernel threads have > different PIDs it is possible for a peer thread to close > the file locked by another peer. This results in the file > lock not being cleared. > > The patch does: > > 1. to use p->p_leader as the PID for file locking, > 2. to use p->p_leader->p_flag & P_ADVLOCK to determine if locks are held > 3. ensure that p->p_leader does not complete exit1() before > all the peers. I think this patch is a reasonable kludge to solve a problem. However, it should be noted (perhaps even in a comment to the commit or in the code) that there is really a bigger issue here. That is that POSIX threads specs require "threads" to have the same PID as the "process" that spawns them. The current kernel structure in FreeBSD does not support this notion. Once consequence is that posix kernel threads in FreeBSD will have trouble being fully compliant, which affects at least signal handling and the priority functions, and probably others (in addition to the file locking issue raised here). Using p->p_leader to proxy for the idea that each thread should have the same PID as the process is helpful, but doesn't solve the problem completely. The better solution to this problem will come when/if there is better support for the distinction between "kernel threads" and "processes". -- Richard Seaman, Jr. email: dick@tar.com 5182 N. Maple Lane phone: 414-367-5450 Chenequa WI 53058 fax: 414-367-5852 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 13:13: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailer.syr.edu (mailer.syr.edu [128.230.18.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3AE8F15860 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:13:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cmsedore@mailbox.syr.edu) Received: from rodan.syr.edu by mailer.syr.edu (LSMTP for Windows NT v1.1a) with SMTP id <0.548E2320@mailer.syr.edu>; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:10:38 -0400 Received: from localhost (cmsedore@localhost) by rodan.syr.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA03655 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:10:35 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: rodan.syr.edu: cmsedore owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:10:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Sedore X-Sender: cmsedore@rodan.syr.edu To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: aio_suspend() Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'm curious if anyone has investigated allowing aio_suspend to return upon the completion of any outstanding io request. I'd like to see aio_suspend accept a single element array of pointers to aiocb's where the element value is NULL. By adding a little glue, aio_suspend could simply tsleep as now and then stick the pointer to the completed aiocb into the (previously NULL) single element array when awoken, and then return. This would (optionally) end the polling of all the specified aiocb's, and would allow a more "fire and forget" type of async IO while remaining compatible with the current behavior. (I may be shooting myself in the foot to mention it, but this would allow a behavior similar to NT's GetQueuedCompletionStatus) -Chris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 13:36:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mercury.inktomi.com (mercury.inktomi.com [209.1.32.126]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 318EA15857 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:36:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jplevyak@inktomi.com) Received: from proxydev.inktomi.com (proxydev.inktomi.com [209.1.32.44]) by mercury.inktomi.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA16910; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:34:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jplevyak@localhost) by proxydev.inktomi.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) id NAA14260; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:34:25 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19990420133425.G10370@proxydev.inktomi.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:34:25 -0700 From: John Plevyak To: "Richard Seaman, Jr." , Luoqi Chen , John Plevyak Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug References: <199904201759.NAA15897@lor.watermarkgroup.com> <19990420111634.D10370@proxydev.inktomi.com> <19990420150902.A89750@tar.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990420150902.A89750@tar.com>; from Richard Seaman, Jr. on Tue, Apr 20, 1999 at 03:09:02PM -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > POSIX threads specs require "threads" to have the same PID as the "process" > that spawns them. > > The current kernel structure in FreeBSD does not support this notion. > Once consequence is that posix kernel threads in FreeBSD will have > trouble being fully compliant, which affects at least signal handling > and the priority functions, and probably others (in addition to the > file locking issue raised here). Using p->p_leader to proxy for the > idea that each thread should have the same PID as the process is > helpful, but doesn't solve the problem completely. > > The better solution to this problem will come when/if there is better > support for the distinction between "kernel threads" and "processes". I fully agree. Given that kernel threads are currently implemented as processes it might be easiest to migrate to such a model by initially using struct proc for both processes and kernel threads and use 'p->p_leader->XXX' to access 'process' values including PID, and p->XXX to access 'thread' values. It may be prefereble to do a little rename p_leader -> p_proc. At some point it may be possible to bifricate 'struct proc' and 'struct thread'. john > > -- > Richard Seaman, Jr. email: dick@tar.com > 5182 N. Maple Lane phone: 414-367-5450 > Chenequa WI 53058 fax: 414-367-5852 > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- John Bradley Plevyak, PhD, jplevyak@inktomi.com, PGP KeyID: 051130BD Inktomi Corporation, 1900 S. Norfolk Street, Suite 310, San Mateo, CA 94403 W:(650)653-2830 F:(650)653-2889 P:(888)491-1332/5103192436.4911332@pagenet.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 14: 0:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from implode.root.com (root.com [209.102.106.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7CBBE15792 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 14:00:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@implode.root.com) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA11478; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:56:32 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904202056.NAA11478@implode.root.com> To: Matthew Dillon Cc: John Dyson , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 20 Apr 1999 12:28:26 PDT." <199904201928.MAA99383@apollo.backplane.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:56:32 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > All right. Then what about this.... right now vm_page_t's are > required to be PAGE_SIZE'd. > > We change this. We allow vm_page_t's to be sized in multiples of > DEV_BSIZE from 0 through to PAGE_SIZE, but not crossing a physical > page boundry. We get rid of vm_page_t->valid and vm_page_t->dirty and > turn those into PG_VALID and PG_DIRTY flags. we add vm_page_t->size. I prefer the current architecture, actually. Several problems come to mind with your proposed scheme: On for example is problems with handling filesystems with block sizes less than a page. I think there are a lot of other problems, too, but I'm too busy to go looking for them. I don't really see how it fixes anything, either - the wastage for directory blocks will still be there unless you create fictitious pages and/or support offsets within a page (in which case you likely will have page aliasing problems to deal with). Yuck. -DG David Greenman Co-founder/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project - http://www.freebsd.org Creator of high-performance Internet servers - http://www.terasolutions.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 14: 2:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AFF1E1582F for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 14:02:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id NAA00957; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:59:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 13:59:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904202059.NAA00957@apollo.backplane.com> To: David Greenman Cc: John Dyson , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! References: <199904202056.NAA11478@implode.root.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : :> All right. Then what about this.... right now vm_page_t's are :> required to be PAGE_SIZE'd. :> :> We change this. We allow vm_page_t's to be sized in multiples of :> DEV_BSIZE from 0 through to PAGE_SIZE, but not crossing a physical :> page boundry. We get rid of vm_page_t->valid and vm_page_t->dirty and :> turn those into PG_VALID and PG_DIRTY flags. we add vm_page_t->size. : : I prefer the current architecture, actually. Several problems come to :mind with your proposed scheme: On for example is problems with handling :filesystems with block sizes less than a page. I think there are a lot of :other problems, too, but I'm too busy to go looking for them. I don't :really see how it fixes anything, either - the wastage for directory blocks :will still be there unless you create fictitious pages and/or support offsets :within a page (in which case you likely will have page aliasing problems :to deal with). Yuck. : :-DG Oof. read the proposal more carefully ... I *AM* creating ficticious pages. Basically we are removing the functionality from the buffer cache and putting it in the VM cache directly. -Matt Matthew Dillon :David Greenman :Co-founder/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project - http://www.freebsd.org :Creator of high-performance Internet servers - http://www.terasolutions.com : To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 14:23: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lor.watermarkgroup.com (lor.watermarkgroup.com [207.202.73.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2BB211588B for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 14:22:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luoqi@watermarkgroup.com) Received: (from luoqi@localhost) by lor.watermarkgroup.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA17889; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 17:19:57 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from luoqi) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 17:19:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Luoqi Chen Message-Id: <199904202119.RAA17889@lor.watermarkgroup.com> To: dick@tar.com, jplevyak@inktomi.com Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > POSIX threads specs require "threads" to have the same PID as the "process" > > that spawns them. > > > > The current kernel structure in FreeBSD does not support this notion. > > Once consequence is that posix kernel threads in FreeBSD will have > > trouble being fully compliant, which affects at least signal handling > > and the priority functions, and probably others (in addition to the > > file locking issue raised here). Using p->p_leader to proxy for the > > idea that each thread should have the same PID as the process is > > helpful, but doesn't solve the problem completely. > > > > The better solution to this problem will come when/if there is better > > support for the distinction between "kernel threads" and "processes". > > I fully agree. Given that kernel threads are currently implemented > as processes it might be easiest to migrate to such a model by > initially using struct proc for both processes and kernel threads > and use 'p->p_leader->XXX' to access 'process' values including > PID, and p->XXX to access 'thread' values. It may be prefereble > to do a little rename p_leader -> p_proc. > > At some point it may be possible to bifricate 'struct proc' and 'struct thread'. > No, this is not an issue of separate task and thread structures. You may have the same problem for two separate processes that share file descriptor table, and john's fix would not work for this case. The correct solution to this problem (in my opinion) is to clear all POSIX locks upon closure of a file descriptor, which requires we keep in the file descriptor table a list of procs that reference it. -lq To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 15:53:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from isbalham.ist.co.uk (isbalham.ist.co.uk [192.31.26.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E0F04151F8 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 15:53:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: from gid.co.uk (uucp@localhost) by isbalham.ist.co.uk (8.9.2/8.8.7) with UUCP id XAA79763; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 23:50:40 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: from [194.32.164.2] by seagoon.gid.co.uk; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 23:40:44 +0100 (BST) X-Sender: rb@194.32.164.1 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199904201551.IAA11637@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 23:40:39 +0000 To: Jason Thorpe From: Bob Bishop Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay Cc: Graham Wheeler , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, > > but AFAIK tv won't get updated correctly, see the BUGS entry in select(2). > >What do you mean "won't get updated correctly"? A const timeval is the >correct behavior :-) I'll not rise to that, but instead refer you again to select(2) :-) >In NetBSD, sleep(3) uses nanosleep(2), and thus doesn't stomp on SIGALARM. Ditto 3.x; but the victim is on 2.2.7 -- Bob Bishop (0118) 977 4017 international code +44 118 rb@gid.co.uk fax (0118) 989 4254 between 0800 and 1800 UK To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 16:10:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pluto.ipass.net (pluto.ipass.net [198.79.53.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 229C614D4E; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:10:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rhh@ipass.net) Received: from stealth.ipass.net. (ts6-175-ppp.ipass.net [198.78.59.175]) by pluto.ipass.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id TAA13185; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 19:08:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rhh@localhost) by stealth.ipass.net. (8.9.1/8.8.8) id TAA01892; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 19:08:35 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from rhh) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 19:08:35 -0400 From: Randall Hopper To: hardware@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: AMD K6-III and FreeBSD? Message-ID: <19990420190835.A1851@ipass.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Is anyone running FreeBSD on a K6-III? Randall To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 16:33:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C61614D4E; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:33:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA12266; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:30:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Amancio Hasty Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 19 Apr 1999 11:32:58 PDT." <199904191832.LAA00550@rah.star-gate.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:30:55 -0700 Message-ID: <12264.924651055@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > ls -ald /dev/xpt0 > 104, 0 Nov 22 23:38 /dev/xpt0 Got one of those, yup. > ls -ald /dev/pass1 > 31, 3 Apr 19 11:20 /dev/pass1 Hmmm. root@time-> ls -l /dev/pass* crw------- 1 root operator 31, 0 Apr 19 02:01 /dev/pass0 crw------- 1 root operator 31, 1 Apr 19 02:01 /dev/pass1 crw------- 1 root operator 31, 2 Jan 26 00:37 /dev/pass2 crw------- 1 root operator 31, 3 Jan 26 00:37 /dev/pass3 Isn't the minor number for pass1 wrong in your example? In any case, my scanner is on: pass2: Fixed Processor SCSI-2 device > /usr/local/sane.d > > cat umax.conf > /dev/pass1 > cat dll.conf > umax The problem is this doesn't exist if you build /usr/ports/graphics/sane; anybody know where this configuration file is if you build the port the "official" way? Thanks! - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 16:37:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6108C14D4E; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:37:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id QAA00567; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:34:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:34:39 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904202334.QAA00567@apollo.backplane.com> To: Bob Bishop , Wilko Bulte , current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: solid NFS patch #6 avail for -current - need testers files) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG NFS patch #6 is now available for -current. This patch has been extensively tested with NFS and with FFS+softupdates and has not screwed up yet, so I'm reasonably confident that it will not scrap whole filesystems :-) http://www.backplane.com/FreeBSD4/ Please remember to back-out all prior patches before applying this one. Note that the memory-zeroing code ( which is committed to -current ), is *correct* and should not be disabled. This patch is for CURRENT ONLY. Do not apply to -3.x unless you like seeing computer equipment melt! The only difference between patch #5 and patch #6 is that the VMIO directory backing mods have been removed. These mods worked, but appear to have resulted in an occassional softupdates panic during 'installworld'. It is more important for us to have a rock solid implementation then majorly optimized implementation, so... The patch will probably return later on when we figure out why it is causing softupdates to panic. Please post bug reports to -current or -hackers. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 16:43:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CED2B14EDF; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:43:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA02655; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:40:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904202340.QAA02655@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:30:55 PDT." <12264.924651055@zippy.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:40:54 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Try /usr/local/etc/sane.d If aint there then do : find /usr/local -name saned.conf or find /usr/local -name umax.conf > > ls -ald /dev/xpt0 > > 104, 0 Nov 22 23:38 /dev/xpt0 > > Got one of those, yup. > > > ls -ald /dev/pass1 > > 31, 3 Apr 19 11:20 /dev/pass1 > > Hmmm. > > root@time-> ls -l /dev/pass* > crw------- 1 root operator 31, 0 Apr 19 02:01 /dev/pass0 > crw------- 1 root operator 31, 1 Apr 19 02:01 /dev/pass1 > crw------- 1 root operator 31, 2 Jan 26 00:37 /dev/pass2 > crw------- 1 root operator 31, 3 Jan 26 00:37 /dev/pass3 > > Isn't the minor number for pass1 wrong in your example? In any > case, my scanner is on: > > pass2: Fixed Processor SCSI-2 device > > > /usr/local/sane.d > > > > cat umax.conf > > /dev/pass1 > > cat dll.conf > > umax > > The problem is this doesn't exist if you build /usr/ports/graphics/sane; > anybody know where this configuration file is if you build the port > the "official" way? > > Thanks! > > - Jordan -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 16:45: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F3A514EE0; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:45:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA02679; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:42:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904202342.QAA02679@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Matthew Dillon Cc: Bob Bishop , Wilko Bulte , current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: solid NFS patch #6 avail for -current - need testers files) In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:34:39 PDT." <199904202334.QAA00567@apollo.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:42:21 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG What does this patch fix? Tnks! Amancio -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 18: 0:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mercury.inktomi.com (mercury.inktomi.com [209.1.32.126]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5A8F14A2F for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 18:00:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jplevyak@inktomi.com) Received: from proxydev.inktomi.com (proxydev.inktomi.com [209.1.32.44]) by mercury.inktomi.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA17011; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 17:57:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jplevyak@localhost) by proxydev.inktomi.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) id RAA18179; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 17:57:42 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19990420175741.H10370@proxydev.inktomi.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 17:57:41 -0700 From: John Plevyak To: Luoqi Chen , dick@tar.com, jplevyak@inktomi.com Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug References: <199904202119.RAA17889@lor.watermarkgroup.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904202119.RAA17889@lor.watermarkgroup.com>; from Luoqi Chen on Tue, Apr 20, 1999 at 05:19:57PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Apr 20, 1999 at 05:19:57PM -0400, Luoqi Chen wrote: > No, this is not an issue of separate task and thread structures. You may > have the same problem for two separate processes that share file descriptor > table, and john's fix would not work for this case. The correct solution > to this problem (in my opinion) is to clear all POSIX locks upon closure > of a file descriptor, which requires we keep in the file descriptor table > a list of procs that reference it. > > -lq I think the problem is a little different since you need to clear all the lock when the process termintes whereas for threads you do not remove the locks when the thread terminates (only when the last thread in the process terminates). Implementationally, you could trigger that off the close with a list in the file descriptor table, which would solve the problem of shared file descriptor tables by non-threads, but you still need to store the 'process id' instead of the 'thread id' for locks by threads which is what my patch is doing. john -- John Bradley Plevyak, PhD, jplevyak@inktomi.com, PGP KeyID: 051130BD Inktomi Corporation, 1900 S. Norfolk Street, Suite 310, San Mateo, CA 94403 W:(650)653-2830 F:(650)653-2889 P:(888)491-1332/5103192436.4911332@pagenet.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 18: 1:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 518F615065; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 18:01:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA12380; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 20:14:29 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 20:14:27 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Amancio Hasty Cc: Matthew Dillon , Bob Bishop , Wilko Bulte , current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: solid NFS patch #6 avail for -current - need testers files) In-Reply-To: <199904202342.QAA02679@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 20 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > What does this patch fix? NFS clients getting blocks of 0x00 in the cache. try to link a large object over NFS without the patches, you'll see what i mean. Matt, i'm going to test your patches now, I really appreciate the work and explanations you've given as to the problem and the solution you've devised. If anyone's gonna find a NFS bug.... :) I'm impressed with the changes you're proposing for the VM system and was wondering if these patches include the work for directory caching you've been working on. Thanks, -Alfred > > Tnks! > Amancio > > -- > > Amancio Hasty > hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 18: 3:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D521915101 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 18:03:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id SAA08746; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 18:01:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omni.xylan.com by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id SAA10058; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 18:01:01 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com (dyn5.utah.xylan.com) by omni.xylan.com (4.1/SMI-4.1 (xylan engr [SPOOL])) id AA29108; Tue, 20 Apr 99 18:00:58 PDT Message-Id: <371D234A.E5C2AD8D@softweyr.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 19:00:58 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Graham Wheeler Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay References: <199904201316.PAA23736@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> <371CA30F.6F84565B@cdsec.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Graham Wheeler wrote: > > Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > > > > > I have an interesting problem. I have a routine to implement delays: > > ... > > > > I am using this both because it gives better resolution than sleep(), > > > > and also because it doesn't require the use of SIGALRM, which I am > > > > using elsewhere. > > > > > > Do you have any reasons not to use usleep(3) or nanosleep(2)? > > > > portability to other unixes... > > As well as the fact that usleep uses signals. Whatever gave you that idea? From the 3.1 man page for usleep: This function is implemented using nanosleep(2) by pausing for microseconds microseconds or until a signal occurs. Consequently, in this implementation, sleeping has no effect on the state of process timers, and there is no special handling for SIGALRM. NetBSD has the same implementation, apparently. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 18:25:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C988014EF0; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 18:25:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id KAA27377; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:53:25 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id KAA53715; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:53:24 +0930 (CST) Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:53:24 +091800 From: Greg Lehey To: Randall Hopper Cc: hardware@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: AMD K6-III and FreeBSD? Message-ID: <19990421105324.F53374@freebie.lemis.com> References: <19990420190835.A1851@ipass.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <19990420190835.A1851@ipass.net>; from Randall Hopper on Tue, Apr 20, 1999 at 07:08:35PM -0400 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tuesday, 20 April 1999 at 19:08:35 -0400, Randall Hopper wrote: > Is anyone running FreeBSD on a K6-III? I heard of somebody, but I didn't keep the message. IIRC he didn't have any problems to mention. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 18:46:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D3C3150D7; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 18:46:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA03160; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 18:43:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904210143.SAA03160@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:30:55 PDT." <12264.924651055@zippy.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 18:43:39 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Also not sure that it matter however you can update and use your locate database. locate saned.conf Thats it for me till I get more info from you. Amancio > > ls -ald /dev/xpt0 > > 104, 0 Nov 22 23:38 /dev/xpt0 > > Got one of those, yup. > > > ls -ald /dev/pass1 > > 31, 3 Apr 19 11:20 /dev/pass1 > > Hmmm. > > root@time-> ls -l /dev/pass* > crw------- 1 root operator 31, 0 Apr 19 02:01 /dev/pass0 > crw------- 1 root operator 31, 1 Apr 19 02:01 /dev/pass1 > crw------- 1 root operator 31, 2 Jan 26 00:37 /dev/pass2 > crw------- 1 root operator 31, 3 Jan 26 00:37 /dev/pass3 > > Isn't the minor number for pass1 wrong in your example? In any > case, my scanner is on: > > pass2: Fixed Processor SCSI-2 device > > > /usr/local/sane.d > > > > cat umax.conf > > /dev/pass1 > > cat dll.conf > > umax > > The problem is this doesn't exist if you build /usr/ports/graphics/sane; > anybody know where this configuration file is if you build the port > the "official" way? > > Thanks! > > - Jordan -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 19: 0:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gizmo.internode.com.au (gizmo.internode.com.au [192.83.231.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC1351512E; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 19:00:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from newton@gizmo.internode.com.au) Received: (from newton@localhost) by gizmo.internode.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA70229; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 11:25:51 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from newton) From: Mark Newton Message-Id: <199904210155.LAA70229@gizmo.internode.com.au> Subject: Re: solid NFS patch #6 avail for -current - need testers To: dillon@apollo.backplane.com (Matthew Dillon) Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 11:25:51 +0930 (CST) Cc: rb@gid.co.uk, wilko@yedi.iaf.nl, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199904202334.QAA00567@apollo.backplane.com> from "Matthew Dillon" at Apr 20, 99 04:34:39 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matthew Dillon wrote: > This patch is for CURRENT ONLY. Do not apply to -3.x unless you like > seeing computer equipment melt! Wow. I makes NFS access *that* fast?! - mark :-) ---- Mark Newton Email: newton@internode.com.au (W) Network Engineer Email: newton@atdot.dotat.org (H) Internode Systems Pty Ltd Desk: +61-8-82232999 "Network Man" - Anagram of "Mark Newton" Mobile: +61-416-202-223 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 19: 7: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8AB1214CFE; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 19:06:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id TAA01245; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 19:04:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 19:04:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904210204.TAA01245@apollo.backplane.com> To: Alfred Perlstein Cc: Amancio Hasty , Bob Bishop , Wilko Bulte , current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: solid NFS patch #6 avail for -current - need testers files) References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : :Matt, i'm going to test your patches now, I really appreciate the work :and explanations you've given as to the problem and the solution you've :devised. If anyone's gonna find a NFS bug.... :) : :I'm impressed with the changes you're proposing for the VM system :and was wondering if these patches include the work for directory :caching you've been working on. : :Thanks, :-Alfred No, we removed it temporarily while we track down a softupdates bug. Plus it's more an optimization ... not really a bug fix, so it should be separate. I didn't really propose that we do what I said in the last posting in re: to the VM system, though it is a possibility. Any changes at that level would not occur for a year or so ... not until 4.x becomes stable and 5.x becomes current. It wouldn't be worthwhile unless we could simplify some of the complexity in the existing setup, and there may be other ways to do that ( like, for example, embedding the I/O within the buffer cache routines rather then requiring that the caller issue the I/O, which encapsulates a great deal of the buffer cache's current complexity ). -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 19:22:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cain.gsoft.com.au (genesi.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92777150D4 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 19:22:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Received: from lot.gsoft.com.au (lot.gsoft.com.au [203.38.152.106]) by cain.gsoft.com.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA27088; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 11:49:22 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199904200921.LAA09941@cdsec.com> Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 11:57:00 +0930 (CST) From: "Daniel O'Connor" To: Graham Wheeler Subject: RE: Using select() to implement a delay Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 20-Apr-99 Graham Wheeler wrote: > I am using this both because it gives better resolution than sleep(), > and also because it doesn't require the use of SIGALRM, which I am > using elsewhere. What about usleep()? Although it can return EINTR too, so I suppose you only save about 2 lines of code :) --- Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." -- Andrew Tanenbaum To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 19:27:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23A861500F; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 19:27:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id TAA01414; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 19:25:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 19:25:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904210225.TAA01414@apollo.backplane.com> To: Amancio Hasty Cc: Bob Bishop , Wilko Bulte , current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: solid NFS patch #6 avail for -current - need testers files) References: <199904202342.QAA02679@rah.star-gate.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :What does this patch fix? : : Tnks! : Amancio : : Amancio Hasty : hasty@star-gate.com It mainly fixes interactions between mmap(), read(), and write() on NFS files. Many utilities ( such as the compiler/linker ) these days use a combination of the three and NFS was making assumptions that would leave a VM page partially uncovered - where the NFS system is storing critical data in the page but the VM system didn't know it was. The mmap-zero fixes that were committed last week brought the problem to light. As part of the fix, a bunch of things were ripped out of the buffer cache code. For example, the b_validoff/b_validend fields were ripped out because only NFS previously used them ( but don't any more ). Also pieces of the buffer cache code were rewritten in regards to dealing with the B_CACHE bit, leading to more optimal code in the critical path ( fewer scans the the b_pages array when figuring out the B_CACHE state of a struct buf ). And some other stuff. The whole thing stems from fixes made to -current over the last several months, fixes made by Luoqi, Alan, Julian, DG, and me. Luoqi concentrated on fixing up the vm_page_t valid/dirty handling and struct buf b_offset handling when dealing with small-block devices ( people may recall that this fixed, then broke, then fixed msdos floppy mounts that would occur after a ufs mount attempt, and also fixed CDROM panics ). The rest of us were working on a mmap-zeroing problem, NFS, and a mmap-garbage-after-file-EOF problem brought up by Tor. A number of vnode interlock issues came up that we fixed, a getnewbuf() supervisor stack overflow was fixed (I rewrote getnewbuf()), a bunch of low-memory handling issues were dealt with but there are still a few left. A few minor bugs in softupdates were fixed with Kirk's help. A VNOP/MMAP deadlock was fixed. Tor & DG and someone else threw in fixes for KVM exhaustion in large-memory subsystems, the ability to handle > 2G of ram, and BSDI compatibility w/ the new KVM increase. Earlier this year I tackled basic bugs in the VM system, rewrote the swapper, rewrote the VN device, and formalized and documented most of the VM system, and Alan and I began removing unused cruft. All in all, it has been a good beginning to the year. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 19:27:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lor.watermarkgroup.com (lor.watermarkgroup.com [207.202.73.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74672155D4 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 19:27:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luoqi@watermarkgroup.com) Received: (from luoqi@localhost) by lor.watermarkgroup.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA20594; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 22:24:50 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from luoqi) Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 22:24:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Luoqi Chen Message-Id: <199904210224.WAA20594@lor.watermarkgroup.com> To: dick@tar.com, jplevyak@inktomi.com Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I think the problem is a little different since you need > to clear all the lock when the process termintes whereas for threads > you do not remove the locks when the thread terminates (only > when the last thread in the process terminates). Implementationally, Termination is not a problem, locks won't be cleared (fd not closed) as long as the reference count of the fd table is not zero, it is the explicit close() by any of the threads. > you could trigger that off the close with a list in the file descriptor > table, which would solve the problem of shared file descriptor tables > by non-threads, but you still need to store the 'process id' > instead of the 'thread id' for locks by threads which is what my patch > is doing. This is a different (bigger) problem, i.e. pid sharing among threads, it is also desirable for signal handling. I doubt that which id is stored in the lock really matters, and this issue will go away as soon as we solve the bigger pid sharing problem. For the current problem at hand, we want a solution that works for both threads and non-threads. > > john > > -- > John Bradley Plevyak, PhD, jplevyak@inktomi.com, PGP KeyID: 051130BD > Inktomi Corporation, 1900 S. Norfolk Street, Suite 310, San Mateo, CA 94403 > W:(650)653-2830 F:(650)653-2889 P:(888)491-1332/5103192436.4911332@pagenet.net > -lq To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 20:24:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from stennis.ca.sandia.gov (stennis.ca.sandia.gov [146.246.243.44]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FDC515819 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 20:24:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bmah@stennis.ca.sandia.gov) Received: (from bmah@localhost) by stennis.ca.sandia.gov (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA17759; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 20:21:47 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904210321.UAA17759@stennis.ca.sandia.gov> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: bmah@CA.Sandia.GOV Subject: LINT PRs From: bmah@CA.Sandia.GOV (Bruce A. Mah) Reply-To: bmah@CA.Sandia.GOV X-Face: g~c`.{#4q0"(V*b#g[i~rXgm*w;:nMfz%_RZLma)UgGN&=j`5vXoU^@n5v4:OO)c["!w)nD/!!~e4Sj7LiT'6*wZ83454H""lb{CC%T37O!!'S$S&D}sem7I[A 2V%N&+ X-Url: http://www.ca.sandia.gov/~bmah/ Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="==_Exmh_-637663382P"; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 20:21:47 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --==_Exmh_-637663382P Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I was curious to see if anyone had looked at a PR I'd submitted about a definition in the LINT configuration (kern/10812). For kicks, I looked for open PRs mentioning LINT in their description and came up with these five: i386/5779 BOUNCE_BUFFERS option in LINT needs modification. conf/6096 /sys/i386/conf/LINT: edit(???) sound_config.h kern/7976 VM86 comment in LINT is incomplete kern/10642 exports(5) mentions KERBNFS but that's not in LINT kern/10812 LINT configuration MAXDSIZ/DFLDSIZ misleading It looks to me like most of these should pretty simple changes to make (with the possible exception of conf/6096, which I don't completely understand), and it'd be a quick way for someone to knock out five open PRs...???... Thanks, Bruce. --==_Exmh_-637663382P Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP MESSAGE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBNx1ESqjOOi0j7CY9AQHu4QP/RwkGXpO8o550Yt0PPHZIPHahEp8wup0J ksUWOGldx1StMz5ymkPaD43X3Ieaj0TUbNOa5JRrzoQxidw7hdXHFAf1HekgOnAN ITDmVWUtpflEfu+UlUvRczd1GM3z562ZgT/VILEVAckjRipchl5xMQBUWGSkgI7M KGbJ4b+9w8w= =e0Sb -----END PGP MESSAGE----- --==_Exmh_-637663382P-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 23:13:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mercury.inktomi.com (mercury.inktomi.com [209.1.32.126]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BB5714F54 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 23:13:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jplevyak@inktomi.com) Received: from tsdev (tsdev.inktomi.com [209.1.32.119]) by mercury.inktomi.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id XAA06333; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 23:10:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jplevyak@localhost) by tsdev (SMI-8.6/) id XAA28515; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 23:10:43 -0700 Message-ID: <19990420231043.A27095@tsdev.inktomi.com> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 23:10:43 -0700 From: John Plevyak To: Luoqi Chen , dick@tar.com, jplevyak@inktomi.com Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug References: <199904210224.WAA20594@lor.watermarkgroup.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904210224.WAA20594@lor.watermarkgroup.com>; from Luoqi Chen on Tue, Apr 20, 1999 at 10:24:50PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Apr 20, 1999 at 10:24:50PM -0400, Luoqi Chen wrote: > > This is a different (bigger) problem, i.e. pid sharing among threads, > it is also desirable for signal handling. I doubt that which id is stored in > the lock really matters, and this issue will go away as soon as we solve > the bigger pid sharing problem. > > For the current problem at hand, we want a solution that works for both > threads and non-threads. > I see what you mean: since the PIDs would be stored in the table it matters little what they are so long as they are unique. The patch does prevent conflicts with recycled PIDs for what it is worth. So, there are 2 solutions for this problem, but they are not in conflict as they are really general solutions in different domains, and I can envision both eventually being used for different reasons. Given that, I guess I am proposing the idea of using of storing process specific information in p->p_leader and preventing the leader from terminating as a step in moving toward more standard kernel thread semantics. I am also motivated since it fixes a bug which I find particularly onerous. Regarding storing the PIDs with the fds: I like the idea, but I understand that NFS locking also has issues and I am wondering how if those might be addressed as well by a locking solution. john -- John Bradley Plevyak, PhD, jplevyak@inktomi.com, PGP KeyID: 051130BD Inktomi Corporation, 1900 S. Norfolk Street, Suite 310, San Mateo, CA 94403 W:(650)653-2830 F:(650)653-2889 P:(888)491-1332/5103192436.4911332@pagenet.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 20 23:50:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from redbox.venux.net (redbox.venux.net [216.47.238.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C305115450 for ; Tue, 20 Apr 1999 23:50:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from matthew@venux.net) Received: from thunder (net177138.hcv.com [209.153.177.138]) by redbox.venux.net (Postfix) with SMTP for id C0C082E228; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 02:46:56 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <4.1.19990421023954.009ff400@mail.venux.net> X-Sender: mhagerty@mail.venux.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 02:47:32 -0400 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: Matthew Hagerty Subject: 3.1-RELEASE Lock-up Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greetings, I am running FreeBSD-3.1-RELEASE and after doing a simple find these two lines popped up on the console and the system froze. I had to power off to recover. Any idea what might have caused this? I have never had FreeBSD just lock-up like this before. DEBUG: MakeDev: Unknown major/minor for devtype - DEBUG: MakeDev: Unknown major/minor for devtype - Thanks, Matthew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 0:16:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB0FA151DE; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 00:16:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA13550; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 00:13:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Amancio Hasty Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:40:54 PDT." <199904202340.QAA02655@rah.star-gate.com> Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 00:13:38 -0700 Message-ID: <13548.924678818@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > If aint there then do : > > find /usr/local -name saned.conf OK, I found /usr/local/etc/sane.d and it contains a bunch of files, but there's no indication of how it finds which scanner you want to use and saned.conf appears to contain network permissions info and nothing more. How would gimp even know I had an HP scanner, for example? Of course, there's no real docs for this feature of the gimp and reading sane-scsi(5), sane-hp(5) and other related man pages gives no indication of this at all. There doesn't appear to be any configuration file for *local* access at all - saned appears to be for allowing remote access, which is not really what I need at all. Oh well, so much for that idea. :) - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 0:18: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E3E514FE3 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 00:17:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id JAA02483; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 09:15:28 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA04618; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 09:15:28 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 09:15:28 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: Chuck Youse Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Informix and BSD In-Reply-To: <99042013535505.14339@ns1.cybersites.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I was wondering if anyone has had any experience using the Informix (for Linux) > client SDK with FreeBSD (I guess under Linux emulation). Go do a search for Rexx/SQL or something on the web. The source is freely downloadable, and available for FreeBSD Rexx/IMC. You could start here. Note that Rexx/SQL is a viable alternative for low- traffic SQL operations in itself. - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 0:51:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DEE014C48; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 00:51:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (homer.softweyr.com [204.68.178.39]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA29598; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 01:48:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <371D82D4.D39D31E5@softweyr.com> Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 01:48:36 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Randall Hopper Cc: hardware@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: AMD K6-III and FreeBSD? References: <19990420190835.A1851@ipass.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Randall Hopper wrote: > > Is anyone running FreeBSD on a K6-III? I installed 3.1-R on a 400 Mhz K6-3 system yesterday. No problems to report. It was VERY fast. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 1: 0:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EEF715778; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 01:00:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA00837; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 00:58:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904210758.AAA00837@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, gibbs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 21 Apr 1999 00:13:38 PDT." <13548.924678818@zippy.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 00:58:15 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Good glad that you managed to locate the sane configuration directory . The file that you need to modify is : /usr/local/etc/sane.d/dll.conf If you like to know more about it see: man sane-dll If you want to know about sane support for your HP scanners see: man sane-hp In your case configure sane like this: --------------------- /usr/local/etc/sane.d:/dll.conf hp --------------------- /usr/local/etc/sane.d/hp.conf /dev/pass2 In my case, I have : cat /usr/local/etc/sane.d/dll.conf umax cat /usr/local/etc/sane.d/umax.conf /dev/pass1 If you need to know about xscanimage for instance how to use sane with gimp: man xscanimage: RUNNING UNDER THE GIMP To run xscanimage under the gimp(1), simply copy it to one of the gimp(1) plug-ins directories. If you want to con- serve disk-space, you can create a symlink instead. For example, the command ln -s /usr/local/bin/xscanimage ~/.gimp/plug-ins/ adds a symlink for the xscanimage binary to the user's plug-ins directory. After creating this symlink, xscanim- age will be queried by gimp(1) the next time it's invoked. From then on, xscanimage can be invoked through "Xtns->Acquire Image->Device dialog..." menu entry. You'll also find that the "Xtns->Acquire Image" menu con- tains short-cuts to the SANE devices that were available at the time the xscanimage was queried. For example, the first PNM pseudo-device is typically available as the short-cut "Xtns->Acquire Image->pnm:0". Note that gimp(1) caches these short-cuts in ~/.gimp/pluginrc. Thus, when the list of available devices changes (e.g., a new scanner is installed), then it is typically desirable to rebuild this cache. To do this, you can either touch(1) the xscanimage binary (e.g., "touch /usr/local/bin/xscanim- age") or delete the plug-ins cache (e.g., "rm ~/.gimp/plug-ins"). Either way, invoking gimp(1) Here is the nice Web pointer to the SANE project: http://panda.mostang.com/sane/ A side note with respect to the FreeBSD scsi api, the last time that I checked your pass devices must be named "pass" that is if I create a device node : mknod foo c 31 3 which in my case is my scsi scanner the scsi library will fail to access my scsi scanner. Last but not least gimp/sane with my umax scsi scanner works wonderfully over here and since you well pointed it out you can access sane over the network which I have done in the past over here. If sane still does not work for you , don't hesitate to e-mail > > If aint there then do : > > > > find /usr/local -name saned.conf > > OK, I found /usr/local/etc/sane.d and it contains a bunch of files, > but there's no indication of how it finds which scanner you want to > use and saned.conf appears to contain network permissions info and > nothing more. How would gimp even know I had an HP scanner, for > example? Of course, there's no real docs for this feature of the gimp > and reading sane-scsi(5), sane-hp(5) and other related man pages gives > no indication of this at all. There doesn't appear to be any > configuration file for *local* access at all - saned appears to be for > allowing remote access, which is not really what I need at all. > > Oh well, so much for that idea. :) > > - Jordan -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 1:11:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 656CD14C1E for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 01:11:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from andrew@lake.com.au) Received: from m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20]) by m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id SAA12688 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 18:08:22 +1000 (EST) X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: andrew@lake.com.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. Received: from areilly.bpc-users.org (CPE-24-192-51-95.nsw.bigpond.net.au [24.192.51.95]) by m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with SMTP id SAA25597 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 18:08:22 +1000 (EST) Received: (qmail 60552 invoked from network); 21 Apr 1999 08:08:22 -0000 Received: from localhost (HELO gurney.reilly.home) (@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 21 Apr 1999 08:08:22 -0000 From: Andrew Reilly Organization: Lake DSP To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Pentium-III and FreeBSD? Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 18:01:37 +1000 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.17] Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <99042118082205.43091@gurney.reilly.home> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi all, I've been meaning to ask this for a while, but it took the question about the K6-III to goad me into action: I'm currently running FreeBSD-3.1-STABLE on a P-III, and yes, it's damn fast, but it's really just a P-II at this stage, isn't it? Does anyone know of any efforts in the direction of a) tweaking as to understand the new (KNI SIMD float) instructions. b) tweaking cc (egcs) to emit those, if it can (much less likely, my guess) c) tweaking the kernel to save and restore the new state on task switches. I guess that as long as (a) doesn't exist, there won't be any programs using the new instructions or registers, so (c) doesn't matter (yet). Working up some KNI BLAS routines is on my agenda, though. -- Andrew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 1:13: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B109815000 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 01:13:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA14045; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 01:10:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Amancio Hasty Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 21 Apr 1999 00:58:15 PDT." <199904210758.AAA00837@rah.star-gate.com> Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 01:10:37 -0700 Message-ID: <14043.924682237@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG OK, I have: root@time-> cat /usr/local/etc/sane.d/dll.conf hp root@time-> cat /usr/local/etc/sane.d/hp.conf /dev/pass2 And huzzah, it works! Sorta. :) I can at least see sane talking to my scanner now. The gimp itself falls over with segmentation faults and lots of error messages, as does xscanimage, but heck, I'm a lot further along than I was before! :-) Thanks, Amancio. - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 1:16:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97A6B15000 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 01:16:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA01079; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 01:14:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904210814.BAA01079@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Trying to get an HP Scanjet to work (again). In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 21 Apr 1999 01:10:37 PDT." <14043.924682237@zippy.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 01:14:19 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ktrace -di xscanimage kdump >trace mail me the last 300 lines or so of the trace. also can you mail me the very first error message generated by xscanimage -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 1:35:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.oeno.com (ns.oeno.com [194.100.99.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 18EAF14C1E for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 01:35:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from will@ns.oeno.com) Received: (qmail 26304 invoked by uid 1001); 21 Apr 1999 08:32:41 -0000 To: dg@root.com Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Directories not VMIO cached at all! References: <199904201928.MAA99383@apollo.backplane.com> <199904202056.NAA11478@implode.root.com> From: Ville-Pertti Keinonen Date: 21 Apr 1999 11:32:19 +0300 In-Reply-To: dg@root.com's message of "21 Apr 1999 00:00:13 +0300" Message-ID: <86r9pejrvw.fsf@not.demophon.com> Lines: 46 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/XEmacs 20.4 - "Emerald" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG dg@root.com (David Greenman) writes: > I prefer the current architecture, actually. Several problems come to > mind with your proposed scheme: On for example is problems with handling > filesystems with block sizes less than a page. I think there are a lot of Perhaps the "page-block-sizes" should only be sub-pages if there is only a sub-page's worth of data left in the object (sort of like ffs end fragments). This would mean that the valid/dirty masks wouldn't be discarded. And you certainly don't need a short for size, two bits are enough if you stick to powers of two. The size of struct vm_page wouldn't need to change, nor would the ability to track finer-granularity validity and dirtyness for pages without having multiple headers. Then there's the case of mmapping the last (possibly sub-page) block, which would require extending it to a full page, breaking the size "rule"...more special cases - not good. But one can also argue that the complexity in ffs for dealing with end fragments isn't good, either, but for a block-based filesystem, it is quite beneficial. If I had any influence over the matter, I wouldn't make any quick judgements as to whether Matt's suggestion is useful or not. I've seen the idea of getting rid of the separate buffer cache altogether mentioned a few times - if this is something that FreeBSD intends to do, then memory is either going to be wasted by fragmentation or sub-page vm_page allocations eventually need to be supported. Not necessarily using the first scheme presented, of course. If the buffer cache is here to stay...isn't it philosophically wrong to use vm_pages for general-purpose caching when there are bufs that exist for this purpose (even if the storage is actually shared)? Maybe not if the purpose of bufs is redefined, but redefining their purpose could make replacing their current use with a kind of "block I/O request" with a much shorter lifetime more appropriate. And this would effectively get rid of the buffer cache. > other problems, too, but I'm too busy to go looking for them. I don't > really see how it fixes anything, either - the wastage for directory blocks > will still be there unless you create fictitious pages and/or support offsets I always thought that the use of the term fictitious referred to the fact that the placeholders don't have associated memory, rather than the fact that they aren't statically allocated per-page. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 2:20:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D17FC14DDB for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 02:20:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gram@cdsec.com) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA13560 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 11:18:05 +0200 (SAST) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 13499; Wed Apr 21 11:17:27 1999 Message-ID: <371D97C4.B7EFA0B1@cdsec.com> Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 11:17:56 +0200 From: Graham Wheeler X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: File locking problem References: <199904201821.OAA16150@lor.watermarkgroup.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Luoqi Chen wrote: > > > What exactly happens when a process obtains an exclusive lock on > > a file and then forks? Does the lock get removed only after both > > processes have closed the file, or after either one of them closes it? > > And if the latter, is there a way I can get around this? > > > Try using the POSIX style fcntl(2) lock instead? I need the open and lock to be atomic. I am currently trying to write a small program which replicates the problem I am having so I can post it. Currently everything works in the small program (as it does when I run the real program), but a client sees the failures I reported every now and then (about one failure per thousand files processed). I should mention I am not explicitly unlocking the file, but am relying on it being unlocked upon the last close. This appears to be the correct approach based on the flock, open and close manual pages. I am also relying on the file being removed upon the last close due to the call to unlink that happens before the last close. However, the behaviour we are seeing seems to indicate that on rare occasions, after the last close, the parent process is somehow managing to open and lock the file again, even though it cannot read anything (the first fgets() fails and feof() gets set). If the problem was that my code was buggy, and unlink() wasn't being called, then there would be no reason for the fgets() to fail. So it seems that although my assorted processes are doing things in the order: ... child:unlink() child:close() // and unlock parent:open() // and lock - should not succeed due to unlink parent:fgets() // should never occur as open() should fail ... there is some kind of race happening between the file being removed by the unlink and the parent:open() - the parent:open() is succeeding when it shouldn't, and then the fgets() is failing (which it shouldn't if the open was successful). -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 2:25: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49E9A14DDB for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 02:24:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gram@cdsec.com) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA13800 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 11:22:08 +0200 (SAST) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 13740; Wed Apr 21 11:21:42 1999 Message-ID: <371D98C4.DC0E61D1@cdsec.com> Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 11:22:12 +0200 From: Graham Wheeler X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay References: <199904201316.PAA23736@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> <371CA30F.6F84565B@cdsec.com> <371D234A.E5C2AD8D@softweyr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Wes Peters wrote: > > Graham Wheeler wrote: > > > > As well as the fact that usleep uses signals. > > Whatever gave you that idea? From the 3.1 man page for usleep: > > This function is implemented using nanosleep(2) by pausing for > microseconds microseconds or until a signal occurs. Consequently, in > this implementation, sleeping has no effect on the state of process > timers, and there is no special handling for SIGALRM. I saw that. But I also looked at the source. The thread-safe implementation calls microsleep; the non-thread safe implementation uses itimers and messes with SIGALRM handling (that is in 2.2.7). My code needs to run on FreeBSD 2.2.2 and later. So I'm playing safe. -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 4:17:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gidgate.gid.co.uk (gidgate.gid.co.uk [193.123.140.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A1E1153E2 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 04:17:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: (from rb@localhost) by gidgate.gid.co.uk (8.8.8/8.8.7) id MAA24937; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 12:14:20 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from rb) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19990421121220.007a9100@gid.co.uk> X-Sender: rbmail@gid.co.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 12:12:20 +0100 To: Graham Wheeler From: Bob Bishop Subject: Re: File locking problem Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <371D97C4.B7EFA0B1@cdsec.com> References: <199904201821.OAA16150@lor.watermarkgroup.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, At 11:17 21/04/99 +0200, Graham Wheeler wrote: >[...] >So it seems that although my assorted processes are doing >things in the order: > > ... > child:unlink() > child:close() // and unlock > parent:open() // and lock - should not succeed due to unlink > parent:fgets() // should never occur as open() should fail > ... > >there is some kind of race happening between the file being removed >by the unlink and the parent:open() More than likely. unlink() has never claimed to be synchronous AFAIK. -- Bob Bishop +44 118 977 4017 rb@gid.co.uk fax +44 118 989 4254 (0800-1800 UK) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 4:52:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from osbie.layer8.net (osbie.layer8.net [166.88.69.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 08F7D14EA8 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 04:51:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from black@osbie.layer8.net) Received: (qmail 99807 invoked by uid 1001); 21 Apr 1999 11:49:21 -0000 Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 04:49:21 -0700 From: Ben Black To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: PCnet/PCI still broken in -stable? Message-ID: <19990421044920.J98028@layer8.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've got an IBM 325 server with integrated PCnet/PCI ethernet which worked fine under 3.1-release, but now does nothing but spew device timeout -- resetting messages in -stable. I saw an exchange from September indicating a patch to fix a similar sounding problem. Any ideas? -- --b This time my name is Ben. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 5:59:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77F25151B4 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 05:59:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gram@cdsec.com) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA26469 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 14:56:46 +0200 (SAST) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 26409; Wed Apr 21 14:56:18 1999 Message-ID: <371DCB0C.286F5EA9@cdsec.com> Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 14:56:44 +0200 From: Graham Wheeler X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: File locking problem References: <199904201821.OAA16150@lor.watermarkgroup.com> <371D97C4.B7EFA0B1@cdsec.com> <371DC775.BF2DF3EA@cdsec.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Graham Wheeler wrote: > > It seems that although my assorted processes are doing > things in the order: > > ... > child:unlink() > child:close() // and unlock > parent:open() // and lock - should not succeed due to unlink > parent:fgets() // should never occur as open() should fail > ... > > there is some kind of race happening between the file being removed > by the unlink and the parent:open() - the parent:open() is > succeeding when it shouldn't, and then the fgets() is failing (which > it shouldn't if the open was successful). I have now found the problem - it is a race between the process which is reading the directory contents and the one which is unlinking the file. The one that reads the directory gets the name of a file that the other is busy processing. The one doing the processing does the unlink and close, at which point the one reading the directory does an open. The problem is that it does the open with both read and write permission, and as a consequence ends up creating a new empty file with the old name. I'm not quite sure how I'm going to solve this one yet, but at least there is now a rational explanation. -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 6: 9:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from titan.metropolitan.at (mail.metropolitan.at [195.212.98.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91D2D151B4 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 06:09:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mladavac@metropolitan.at) Received: by TITAN with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id <26KYDBAF>; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 15:09:54 +0200 Message-ID: <55586E7391ACD211B9730000C11002761795EE@r-lmh-wi-100.corpnet.at> From: Ladavac Marino To: 'Graham Wheeler' , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: RE: File locking problem Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 15:05:41 +0200 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > -----Original Message----- > From: Graham Wheeler [SMTP:gram@cdsec.com] > Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 1999 2:57 PM > To: hackers@freebsd.org > Subject: Re: File locking problem > > I have now found the problem - it is a race between the process which > is reading the directory contents and the one which is unlinking the > file. The one that reads the directory gets the name of a file that > the > other is busy processing. The one doing the processing does the unlink > and close, at which point the one reading the directory does an open. > The problem is that it does the open with both read and write > permission, and as a consequence ends up creating a new empty file > with > the old name. > > I'm not quite sure how I'm going to solve this one yet, but at least > there is now a rational explanation. [ML] Sounds like a race in your code, if I have understood you correctly. Obviously, you will need to synchronize these two processes somehow. Either the reader should not read the directory while the unlinker is doing its deed (flock on a directory--sholud work, you can open a directory as a file, you should be able to lock it as well, but I cannot test that now since this NT box in front of me just doesn't cut it), or, a hacky solution, the reader opens the file readonly first, and if this succeeds, read-write (it then closes the readonly fd). /Marino > -- > Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com > Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 > Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 > Internet/Intranet Network Specialists > Data Security Products WWW: > http://www.cdsec.com/ > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 6:14:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from titan.metropolitan.at (mail.metropolitan.at [195.212.98.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE5C31534B for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 06:14:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mladavac@metropolitan.at) Received: by TITAN with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id <26KYDBA4>; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 15:14:40 +0200 Message-ID: <55586E7391ACD211B9730000C11002761795EF@r-lmh-wi-100.corpnet.at> From: Ladavac Marino To: 'Graham Wheeler' , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: RE: File locking problem Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 15:10:38 +0200 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > -----Original Message----- > From: Graham Wheeler [SMTP:gram@cdsec.com] > Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 1999 2:57 PM > To: hackers@freebsd.org > Subject: Re: File locking problem > > Graham Wheeler wrote: > [ML] Please disregard my second "solution". It won't work (the second open will create the file if you specify O_CREAT). Talking about that, the real solution might be to open the file read-write without O_CREAT flag--the open will fail if the file was unlinked between dir read and open. /Marino To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 6:54:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A81015388 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 06:54:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gram@cdsec.com) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA29679; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 15:51:42 +0200 (SAST) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 29677; Wed Apr 21 15:50:53 1999 Message-ID: <371DD7DC.4B5356E@cdsec.com> Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 15:51:24 +0200 From: Graham Wheeler X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ladavac Marino , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: File locking problem References: <55586E7391ACD211B9730000C11002761795EF@r-lmh-wi-100.corpnet.at> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ladavac Marino wrote: > [ML] Please disregard my second "solution". It won't work (the > second open will create the file if you specify O_CREAT). Talking about > that, the real solution might be to open the file read-write without > O_CREAT flag--the open will fail if the file was unlinked between dir > read and open. That is the solution. I have a routine: FILE *OpenExclusive(const char *path, const char *mode); This routine maps normal fopen() style modes to open() style flags, does the open() with locking, and then an fdopen(). The code that uses it was quite correctly passing "r+" through as the mode, but the OpenExclusive routine was incorrectly setting the O_CREAT flag in this case. After checking Stephens' APitUE fig 5.3 I realised that this was wrong. Removing the O_CREAT solved the problem. I've been using the OpenExclusive routine for a long time, and have never had problems with it before (probably because this is the first time I've used it with the "r+" mode, and also because the problem actually occurs so intermittently and I couldn't reliably replicate it), so I wasted a couple of days poring over the (fairly complex) code of the process that uses it, and couldn't find anything wrong (so I posted the problem). I figured I was misunderstanding file locking in the context of multiple processes. I'm glad that that wasn't the problem, or I would have had to implement my locks using UUCP style `semafiles'. Thanks to everyone for their suggestions. -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)423-6065/6/7 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 7:23:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from aaka.3skel.com (3skel-inch-rtr.3skel.com [207.240.212.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 61BC814D78 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 07:23:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from danj@3skel.com) Received: from fnur.3skel.com (fnur.3Skel.COM [192.168.0.8]) by aaka.3skel.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA14135 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:22:19 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from danj@3skel.com) Received: (from danj@localhost) by fnur.3skel.com (8.9.2/8.8.2) id KAA02221 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:21:09 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:21:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Dan Janowski Message-Id: <199904211421.KAA02221@fnur.3skel.com> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: FIFO and FIONREAD in 3.1 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG It's been a while. Hope everyone is doing well. It seems that the kernel in 3.1 no longer supports FIONREAD on fifos. Is there a suggested alternative for finding the number of bytes queued in a fifo? Dan -- Dan Janowski danj@3skel.com Triskelion Systems, Inc. Bronx, NY To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 8:19: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0001915357; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 08:18:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA03575; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:32:20 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:32:19 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Matthew Dillon Cc: Bob Bishop , Wilko Bulte , current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Alright, who's the smart alleck that fixed NFS this last week? :) , WAS: Re: solid NFS patch #6 avail for -current - need testers files) In-Reply-To: <199904202334.QAA00567@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 20 Apr 1999, Matthew Dillon wrote: > NFS patch #6 is now available for -current. This patch has been > extensively tested with NFS and with FFS+softupdates and has not > screwed up yet, so I'm reasonably confident that it will not > scrap whole filesystems :-) > > http://www.backplane.com/FreeBSD4/ > > Please remember to back-out all prior patches before applying this one. > Note that the memory-zeroing code ( which is committed to -current ), is > *correct* and should not be disabled. > > This patch is for CURRENT ONLY. Do not apply to -3.x unless you like > seeing computer equipment melt! > > The only difference between patch #5 and patch #6 is that the VMIO > directory backing mods have been removed. These mods worked, but > appear to have resulted in an occassional softupdates panic during > 'installworld'. It is more important for us to have a rock solid > implementation then majorly optimized implementation, so... The > patch will probably return later on when we figure out why it is > causing softupdates to panic. > > Please post bug reports to -current or -hackers. .(14:57:37)(root@thumper.reserved) /usr # mount /dev/da0s1a on / (local, soft-updates, writes: sync 598 async 27021) /dev/da0s1g on /home (local, soft-updates, writes: sync 25 async 679) /dev/da0s1f on /usr (local, soft-updates, writes: sync 738 async 42763) /dev/da0s1e on /var (local, soft-updates, writes: sync 106 async 1783) procfs on /proc (local) server:/usr/src on /usr/src server:/usr/obj on /usr/obj server:/home/ncvs on /home/ncvs /usr/src # for i in 1 2 3 4 5 6 ; do make world -j64 ; echo "$i done.." ; done >& ../build.log nfs server server:/usr/obj: not responding nfs server server:/usr/obj: is alive again .(15:00:59)(root@thumper.reserved) /usr # uptime 3:01PM up 6:55, 1 user, load averages: 1.72, 7.03, 7.34 .(15:01:47)(root@thumper.reserved) /usr # grep "^[0-9] done" build.log 1 done.. 2 done.. 3 done.. .(15:05:05)(root@thumper.reserved) /usr # .(03:33:51)(root@bright.reserved) /usr/obj # uptime 10:02AM up 14:40, 1 user, load averages: 0.18, 0.16, 0.14 yeah the clocks are not setup properly :) but otherwise i'm just gonna say HOLY SH*T you fixed NFS! :) Actually I just realized I'm not running nfsiod on the client, I just started up 8 of them (it's an SMP box). So far no problems. I'm using the default mount operations, as far as NFS server not responding messages, i have no clue, but the server is still up and i've seen that message happen when a lot of pressure is being put on an NFS server even though everything is fine. Normally i'd have client corruption and a rebooted server with both of them locked up sending out garbled RPC about now, but everything seems fine... great work! 2 questions I had: 1) you said you disabled partial writes that were causing these mmap() problems, they were causing problems because NFS had to muck with the structures directly in order to do zero copy? so if our NFS impelementation didn't do that it wouldn't be an issue probably. I know it's a good thing for speed and definetly essensial, but i'm not sure i understand NFS and the FS getting out of sync. 2) at BAFUG 2 or 3 months ago I, *cough* attempted to keep up with you an Julian talking about VM issues. :) Something you guys brought up was problems with mmap() + read()/write() no staying in sync and requireing an msync() to correctly syncronize. I really didn't understand how this could happen except recently I figured that my first question could be the answer. Does this problem only happen on NFS mounted dirs? Is it fixed? thanks again, -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 9:30:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from thorin.hway.ru (thorin.hway.ru [195.170.38.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E999514C27 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 09:30:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from flash@intech.hway.ru) Received: from balin.intech.hway.ru (balin.intech.hway.ru [192.168.1.25]) by thorin.hway.ru (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id UAA10883; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 20:26:34 +0400 (MSD) Received: from localhost (flash@localhost) by balin.intech.hway.ru (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA09268; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 20:26:28 +0400 (MSD) (envelope-from flash@balin.intech.hway.ru) Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 20:26:28 +0400 (MSD) From: "Alexander V. Tischenko" To: Garance A Drosihn Cc: Dom Mitchell , Brian Dean , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: behaviour of open(foo,O_CREAT) in regards to setting 'group' In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello, may be i am a bit late with the reply, just got to my mail %), but my two cents: 1. True, file is created under a group that he can't _set_ with chgrp. 2. But: He can always _change_ the group of this file to _any_ that he is member of, while he is the owner. On Tue, 13 Apr 1999, Garance A Drosihn wrote: > Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 16:07:00 -0400 > From: Garance A Drosihn > To: Dom Mitchell , Brian Dean > Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG > Subject: Re: behaviour of open(foo,O_CREAT) in regards to setting 'group' > > At 4:24 PM +0100 4/12/99, Dom Mitchell wrote: > >On 12 April 1999, Brian Dean proclaimed: > >> For example, if the group of /tmp is wheel, the FreeBSD behaviour > >> causes files created there to have the group of wheel, and when the > >> files are moved to another (non-local) file system (using 'mv'), an > >> error is generated indicating that the operation is not permitted if > >> the user is not a member of 'wheel'. The error is harmless in this > >> case (because the group of the file should not have been wheel in the > >> first place because the user was not a member of wheel), but it is > >> annoying. > > > > Maybe the behaviour should not apply to directories with a sticky bit? > > I'm not sure that there is much room for change around this whole > > subject area, though. It's been pretty much this way for some 15 years > > or more. Teach your users to use "cp" instead of "mv"? > > It seems to me that the file should not be created as group 'wheel' > if the user is not in that group... (that then begs the question of > what it *should* be set to, but in any case it does seem odd to me > that a user can create a file to have a group that they could not > specify on a 'chgrp' command) > > --- > Garance Alistair Drosehn = gad@eclipse.acs.rpi.edu > Senior Systems Programmer or drosih@rpi.edu > Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Alexander V. Tischenko ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Integrated Network Technologies | Tel: +7 095 978-47-37 7, Miusskaya sq., Moscow, 125047 Russia | Fax: +7 095 978-47-37 Internet: flash@hway.ru | NIC: AT55-RIPE To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 9:34: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from home.dragondata.com (home.dragondata.com [204.137.237.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CA5114C3E; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 09:34:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from toasty@home.dragondata.com) Received: (from toasty@localhost) by home.dragondata.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id LAA29863; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 11:31:05 -0500 (CDT) From: Kevin Day Message-Id: <199904211631.LAA29863@home.dragondata.com> Subject: Re: Alright, who's the smart alleck that fixed NFS this last week? :) , WAS: Re: solid NFS patch #6 avail for -current - need tester In-Reply-To: from Alfred Perlstein at "Apr 21, 1999 10:32:19 am" To: bright@rush.net (Alfred Perlstein) Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 11:31:05 -0500 (CDT) Cc: dillon@apollo.backplane.com, rb@gid.co.uk, wilko@yedi.iaf.nl, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > yeah the clocks are not setup properly :) but otherwise i'm just > gonna say HOLY SH*T you fixed NFS! :) We all owe Matt big for this. :) > I'm using the default mount operations, as far as NFS server > not responding messages, i have no clue, but the server is still > up and i've seen that message happen when a lot of pressure is > being put on an NFS server even though everything is fine. Try mounting with -d... Can I make a guess that the NFS mount is going over 100MB ethernet? I have a strong theory that the dynamic retransmit timer needs rework for low latency connections, with high variability in their performance during high traffic. (lots of collisions) Kevin To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 10:23: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 480D514E23; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:22:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id KAA06806; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:20:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:20:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904211720.KAA06806@apollo.backplane.com> To: Alfred Perlstein Cc: Bob Bishop , Wilko Bulte , current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Alright, who's the smart alleck that fixed NFS this last week? :) , WAS: Re: solid NFS patch #6 avail for -current - need testers files) References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :2 questions I had: : :1) you said you disabled partial writes that were causing these :mmap() problems, they were causing problems because NFS had to :muck with the structures directly in order to do zero copy? : so if our NFS impelementation didn't do that it wouldn't be :an issue probably. I know it's a good thing for speed and definetly :essensial, but i'm not sure i understand NFS and the FS getting out :of sync. The problem w/ the partial writes has to do with cache coherency between the server, the client's VFS subsystem ( read() and write() ), and the client's VM subsystem ( mmap() ). NFS implemented the notion of unaligned valid and dirty range using struct buf's b_validoff, b_validend, b_dirtyoff, and b_dirtyend fields in order to keep track of partial writes without having to read-in the rest of the buffer. The implementation was very fragile and failed to address a number of combination situations that would occur with mmap(), read(), and write(). This in turn lead to a series of problems and, further, lead to the situation where we would fix unrelated bugs in the VM system and cause NFS to break. I finally gave up on it. What NFS does now is optimize only two write situations: (1) when a write covers the entire buffer, e.g. an 8K+ write on an 8K boundry. And (2) piecemeal writes in the write-append case. Both cases allow us to mark the buffer as essentially being fully valid without having to mess with valid and dirty ranges. We use buf->b_bcount to handle the file EOF case and resize it rather then try to use b_validoff/b_validend. Thus, b_validoff/b_validend have been completely removed. b_dirtyoff/b_dirtyend have been left intact in order to allow us to support piecemeal write RPC's. This is different from the piecemeal write optimizations we were doing before. In this case, we are able to support piecemeal writes in the middle of the file that go into *PRELOADED* buffers. That is, A read-merge-write case. The original code attempted to do piecemeal writes without the read-before resulting in the partially invalid, partially dirty buffer. Now we only allow piecemeal writes to occur in fully-valid buffers. While we could theoretically discard the dirty range and simply writeback the entire buffer when a modification is made to part of it, we keep the dirty range in order to *only* write the portion of the buffer that the explicit write() covered. This is done for cache coherency reasons. For example, take the situation where two different client machines do a seek/write to different portions of the same server-backed NFS file, where the two areas abut each other. Say one client writes 2 bytes at seek offset 10 and the second client writes 2 bytes at seek offset 12. As long as the areas are not overlapping, we want this type of operation to work properly and not scramble the data on the server even if the client's idea of the state of the date is not coherent. :2) at BAFUG 2 or 3 months ago I, *cough* attempted to keep up with you :an Julian talking about VM issues. :) Something you guys brought up :was problems with mmap() + read()/write() no staying in sync and requireing :an msync() to correctly syncronize. I really didn't understand how this :could happen except recently I figured that my first question could be :the answer. Does this problem only happen on NFS mounted dirs? Is it :fixed? : :thanks again, :-Alfred This should not be an issue any more for either UFS or NFS. If people find that it is an issue, there's a bug somewhere that needs to be addressed. This *was* an issue for NFS prior to the patch set. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 10:29:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from boreas.isi.edu (boreas.isi.edu [128.9.160.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D701B15428 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:29:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from faber@ISI.EDU) Received: from ISI.EDU (vex-e.isi.edu [128.9.160.240]) by boreas.isi.edu (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id KAA15016; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:26:48 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904211726.KAA15016@boreas.isi.edu> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Ben Black Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, paul@originative.co.uk (Paul Richards) Subject: Re: PCnet/PCI still broken in -stable? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 21 Apr 1999 04:49:21 PDT." <19990421044920.J98028@layer8.net> X-Url: http://www.isi.edu/~faber Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:26:48 -0700 From: Ted Faber Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ben Black wrote: >I've got an IBM 325 server with integrated PCnet/PCI ethernet which >worked fine under 3.1-release, but now does nothing but spew >device timeout -- resetting messages in -stable. I saw an exchange from >September indicating a patch to fix a similar sounding problem. > >Any ideas? Sure. Try this. I submitted a similar patch to Paul Richards, and although it works for him in general, someone's having a problem with a combination SCSI-PCnet/PCI ethernet so he hasn't committed it. Paul: this patch is slightly different than the one I mailed you originally. For some reason, unfathomable to me now, the patch I sent you has the driver becoming a bus master *after* it calls the pci attach routine, not before. This is almost certainly a bug, and I wouldn't be surprised if it was causing the problems with the SCSI card (of course, I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't :-)). Give this new patch a try and see if it helps. The patch is relative to the /sys directory on 3.1-RELEASE, but you should be able to apply it manually if it doesn't work on -stable. Let me know of any problems or comments. *** pci/if_lnc_p.c.orig Mon Mar 8 21:38:19 1999 --- pci/if_lnc_p.c Wed Apr 21 10:13:39 1999 *************** *** 72,88 **** int unit; { unsigned iobase; void *lnc; /* device specific data for interrupt handler ... */ - /* pci_map_port correctly initializes bridge chips -- tvf */ - if ( !pci_map_port(config_id,PCI_MAP_REG_START,(u_short *)&iobase) ) printf("lnc%d: pci_port_map_attach failed?!\n",unit); lnc = lnc_attach_ne2100_pci(unit, iobase); if (!lnc) return; - if(!(pci_map_int(config_id, lncintr_sc, (void *)lnc, &net_imask))) { free (lnc, M_DEVBUF); return; --- 72,95 ---- int unit; { unsigned iobase; + unsigned data; /* scratch to make this device a bus master*/ void *lnc; /* device specific data for interrupt handler ... */ if ( !pci_map_port(config_id,PCI_MAP_REG_START,(u_short *)&iobase) ) printf("lnc%d: pci_port_map_attach failed?!\n",unit); + + /* Make this device a bus master. This was implictly done by + pci_map_port under 2.2.x -- tvf */ + + data = pci_cfgread(config_id, PCIR_COMMAND, 4); + data |= PCIM_CMD_PORTEN | PCIM_CMD_BUSMASTEREN; + pci_cfgwrite(config_id, PCIR_COMMAND, data, 4); + lnc = lnc_attach_ne2100_pci(unit, iobase); + if (!lnc) return; if(!(pci_map_int(config_id, lncintr_sc, (void *)lnc, &net_imask))) { free (lnc, M_DEVBUF); return; To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 10:52:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C35715420; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:51:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id NAA01767; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 13:05:01 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 13:04:58 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Matthew Dillon Cc: Bob Bishop , Wilko Bulte , current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Alright, who's the smart alleck that fixed NFS this last week? , :) , WAS: Re: solid NFS patch #6 avail for -current - need testers , files) In-Reply-To: <199904211720.KAA06806@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 21 Apr 1999, Matthew Dillon wrote: > :2 questions I had: > : > :2) at BAFUG 2 or 3 months ago I, *cough* attempted to keep up with you > :an Julian talking about VM issues. :) Something you guys brought up > :was problems with mmap() + read()/write() no staying in sync and requireing > :an msync() to correctly syncronize. I really didn't understand how this > :could happen except recently I figured that my first question could be > :the answer. Does this problem only happen on NFS mounted dirs? Is it > :fixed? > : > :thanks again, > :-Alfred > > This should not be an issue any more for either UFS or NFS. If people > find that it is an issue, there's a bug somewhere that needs to be > addressed. This *was* an issue for NFS prior to the patch set. Ok, so is this what you and Julian were discussing about coherency issues? And it is fixed... cool. :) -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 13:50:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55D5915876 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 13:50:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA21541 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 16:48:00 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904212048.QAA21541@cs.rpi.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Deadlock on -stable Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 16:48:01 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This is a continuation of the 'pausing' problem I described earlier. I am now able to easily reproduce it. I have a ddb induced panic/corefile of one of the systems I paused. Since I can do this at will, I can get you and ddb information that you may need. I have reproduced this on systems built 60 days ago, and one built ~18 days ago. Is there anything people wish me to look at? -- David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 14:10:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7418158E0 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 14:10:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id OAA08532; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 14:07:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 14:07:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904212107.OAA08532@apollo.backplane.com> To: "David E. Cross" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Deadlock on -stable References: <199904212048.QAA21541@cs.rpi.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :This is a continuation of the 'pausing' problem I described earlier. I am now :able to easily reproduce it. I have a ddb induced panic/corefile of one of :the systems I paused. Since I can do this at will, I can get you and ddb :information that you may need. : :I have reproduced this on systems built 60 days ago, and one built ~18 days :ago. : :Is there anything people wish me to look at? : :-- :David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu :Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd If you have a core file, do a 'man ps' and look at the -M and -N options. vmstat and netstat also have these options. Then try to get as much info as you can out of the core file using these commands w/ the appropriate options. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 14:23:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CEDCC158E5 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 14:23:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA22131; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 17:21:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904212121.RAA22131@cs.rpi.edu> To: Matthew Dillon Cc: "David E. Cross" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: Deadlock on -stable In-Reply-To: Message from Matthew Dillon of "Wed, 21 Apr 1999 14:07:32 PDT." <199904212107.OAA08532@apollo.backplane.com> Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 17:21:15 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Here is the PS you requested: Interesting, since if I read this correctly *everything* is swapped out, and tt3 is still running while swapped out. (tt3 is the program that kills the machine, you need to get 2 of them going under gdb, then break/continue them a number of times. apparently when 1 tries to exit the system stops.) com12# ps auxww -N ./kernel.0 -M ./vmcore.0 USER PID %CPU %MEM VSZ RSS TT STAT STARTED TIME COMMAND thompe2 333 90.3 0.1 4920 0 v0 RX+ - 0:00.00 (tt3) root 1 0.0 0.0 496 0 ?? IWs - 0:00.00 (init) root 2 0.0 0.1 0 0 ?? RL - 0:00.00 (pagedaemon) root 3 0.0 0.1 0 0 ?? DL - 0:00.00 (vmdaemon) root 4 0.0 0.1 0 0 ?? RL - 0:00.00 (syncer) root 94 0.0 0.1 820 0 ?? Rs - 0:00.00 (syslogd) root 102 0.0 0.1 1040 0 ?? R In-Reply-To: <199904202334.QAA00567@apollo.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 22:11:53 +0000 To: Matthew Dillon From: Bob Bishop Subject: Re: solid NFS patch #6 avail for -current - need testers files) Cc: Wilko Bulte , current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, At 4:34 pm -0700 20/4/99, Matthew Dillon wrote: > NFS patch #6 is now available for -current.[etc] Looks real good here. Been running two servers continuously building the world with their /usr/obj cross-mounted on each other. Oh, and one of them is SMP running -j8. Great job! -- Bob Bishop (0118) 977 4017 international code +44 118 rb@gid.co.uk fax (0118) 989 4254 between 0800 and 1800 UK To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 15: 3: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC79815935 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 15:02:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA22824; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 17:59:50 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904212159.RAA22824@cs.rpi.edu> To: "David E. Cross" Cc: Matthew Dillon , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: Deadlock on -stable In-Reply-To: Message from "David E. Cross" of "Wed, 21 Apr 1999 17:21:15 EDT." <199904212121.RAA22131@cs.rpi.edu> Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 17:59:49 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Oops, one last thing, here is a backtrace (complete with debugging symbols). The last 3 calls are from the program itself, which is compiled with bebugging support too, I just don't know the magic to let gdb reference it. Don't let the NFS references fool you, I was able to replicate this off of local disk. Also, is this how a system 'locks up' with the mmap() bug (I ask since this is a really nasty program, using semaphores, shared memory, file locking, mmap()-ed files, file locking, etc.) #0 boot (howto=256) at ../../kern/kern_shutdown.c:285 285 dumppcb.pcb_cr3 = rcr3(); (kgdb) bt #0 boot (howto=256) at ../../kern/kern_shutdown.c:285 #1 0xf012a1f5 in panic (fmt=0xf01ea1c4 "from debugger") at ../../kern/kern_shutdown.c:446 #2 0xf0117045 in db_panic (addr=-266548297, have_addr=0, count=-1, modif=0xf35d3c9c "") at ../../ddb/db_command.c:432 #3 0xf0116fe5 in db_command (last_cmdp=0xf02016dc, cmd_table=0xf020153c, aux_cmd_tablep=0xf02122f0) at ../../ddb/db_command.c:332 #4 0xf01170aa in db_command_loop () at ../../ddb/db_command.c:454 #5 0xf01193fb in db_trap (type=3, code=0) at ../../ddb/db_trap.c:71 #6 0xf01cc992 in kdb_trap (type=3, code=0, regs=0xf35d3d8c) at ../../i386/i386/db_interface.c:157 #7 0xf01d5bcc in trap (frame={tf_es = 16, tf_ds = 16, tf_edi = -266600892, tf_esi = 134, tf_ebp = -211993136, tf_isp = -211993164, tf_ebx = 0, tf_edx = -266370364, tf_ecx = -267677952, tf_eax = 38, tf_trapno = 3, tf_err = 0, tf_eip = -266548297, tf_cs = 8, tf_eflags = 582, tf_esp = -266370380, tf_ss = -266381435}) at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:548 #8 0xf01ccbb7 in Debugger (msg=0xf01f5785 "manual escape to debugger") at ../../i386/i386/db_interface.c:317 #9 0xf01c83a0 in scgetc (kbd=0xf0227674, flags=2) at ../../dev/syscons/syscons.c:3702 #10 0xf01c3120 in sckbdevent (thiskbd=0xf0227674, event=0, arg=0x0) at ../../dev/syscons/syscons.c:812 #11 0xf01bfd0f in atkbd_intr (kbd=0xf0227674) at ../../dev/kbd/atkbd.c:536 #12 0xf01d9ae2 in atkbd_isa_intr (unit=0) at ../../i386/isa/atkbd_isa.c:97 #13 0xf0126deb in lf_wakelock (listhead=0xf088f8c0) at ../../kern/kern_lockf.c:721 #14 0xf0126902 in lf_clearlock (unlock=0xf0889ec0) at ../../kern/kern_lockf.c:446 #15 0xf01264ee in lf_advlock (ap=0xf35d3f10, head=0xf35c976c, size=2048000) at ../../kern/kern_lockf.c:167 #16 0xf019f1ce in nfs_advlock (ap=0xf35d3f10) at ../../nfs/nfs_vnops.c:2963 #17 0xf01231c2 in closef (fp=0xf0889f40, p=0xf356f020) at vnode_if.h:979 #18 0xf01228c9 in close (p=0xf356f020, uap=0xf35d3f94) at ../../kern/kern_descrip.c:504 #19 0xf01d6407 in syscall (frame={tf_es = 39, tf_ds = 39, tf_edi = -272639276, tf_esi = 4, tf_ebp = -272639528, tf_isp = -211992604, tf_ebx = -272639256, tf_edx = 3, tf_ecx = 4, tf_eax = 6, tf_trapno = 0, tf_err = 2, tf_eip = 671760260, tf_cs = 31, tf_eflags = 582, tf_esp = -272639600, tf_ss = 39}) at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:1100 #20 0xf01cd2ec in Xint0x80_syscall () #21 0x804905b in ?? () #22 0x804a3e4 in ?? () #23 0x8048cf1 in ?? () -- David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 15:18: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1BD5115941 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 15:18:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id PAA08857; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 15:15:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 15:15:37 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904212215.PAA08857@apollo.backplane.com> To: "David E. Cross" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: Deadlock on -stable References: <199904212121.RAA22131@cs.rpi.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : :Here is the PS you requested: : :Interesting, since if I read this correctly *everything* is swapped out, and :tt3 is still running while swapped out. (tt3 is the program that kills the :machine, you need to get 2 of them going under gdb, then break/continue them :a number of times. apparently when 1 tries to exit the system stops.) I should have been more specific Use a long listing. 'l' option. We need to know what the commands are waiting on. The processes are not swapped out --- the core file does not contain sufficient information for ps to figure out the u-area for the processes. :David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 17:53: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B5A215405 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 17:52:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id JAA18345; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 09:49:38 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <371DC34D.418B5D2C@newsguy.com> Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 21:23:41 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bob Bishop Cc: Jason Thorpe , Graham Wheeler , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Using select() to implement a delay References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Bob Bishop wrote: > > >What do you mean "won't get updated correctly"? A const timeval is the > >correct behavior :-) > > I'll not rise to that, but instead refer you again to select(2) :-) I, myself, wonder when are we going to correct the man page... :-) -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "Well, Windows works, using a loose definition of 'works'..." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 18: 5:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0813115553 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 18:04:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from andrew@lake.com.au) Received: from m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20]) by m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id LAA22323 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 11:01:55 +1000 (EST) X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: andrew@lake.com.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. Received: from areilly.bpc-users.org (CPE-24-192-51-95.nsw.bigpond.net.au [24.192.51.95]) by m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with SMTP id LAA11991 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 11:01:54 +1000 (EST) Received: (qmail 84325 invoked from network); 22 Apr 1999 01:01:54 -0000 Received: from localhost (HELO gurney.reilly.home) (@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 22 Apr 1999 01:01:54 -0000 From: Andrew Reilly Organization: Lake DSP To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: mmap() vs wine-990214 Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:51:54 +1000 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.17] Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <99042211015406.43091@gurney.reilly.home> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi all, I had been running -2.2.8 and wine-9807xx for some time. Aparent stability and improvements to both encouraged me to upgrade to the current releases of both. I'm pretty happy with 3.1-STABLE, but the applications I used to run under wine (Win32 console applications: the Motorola DSP development tools) now don't (run). These applications are all stripped of relocation information, and the problem appears to be that wine can't load them into the appropriate memory locations. After turning on some debugging trace, and adding a bit more of my own, I see the following: X-Newsreader: knews 1.0b.1 Reply-To: andrew@lake.com.au Organization: Lake DSP References: <7fj9gp$9o3$1@m2.c2.telstra-mm.net.au> <7fjd5f$f1m@faui11.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <7fllo8$t8k$1@m2.c2.telstra-mm.net.au> From: andrew@gurney.reilly.home (Andrew Reilly) Subject: Re: PE_LoadImage wants to relocate "not relocatable" executables Newsgroups: comp.emulators.ms-windows.wine In article <7fllo8$t8k$1@m2.c2.telstra-mm.net.au>, andrew@gurney.reilly.home (Andrew Reilly) writes: > Here's the last bit of the -debugmsg +win32 trace. Sorry about > the long lines... Just to make matters more interesting, I added a few more trace statements, and turned on file debugging, because FILE_dommap seems to be where this particular piece of action is. The relevant (I think) last piece of trace is now: trace:file:FILE_DoOpenFile (asm56300.exe): OK, return = 19 trace:virtual:CreateFileMapping32A (13,0x0,08000002,0000000000000000,(null)) trace:virtual:MapViewOfFileEx handle=14 size=60000 offset=0 trace:file:FILE_dommap mmap(0,60000,1,2,5,0) = trace:file:FILE_dommap 28a10000 View: 28a10000 - 28a6ffff 19 @ 00000000 28a10000 - 28a6ffff c-r-- trace:win32:calc_vma_size Dump of segment table trace:win32:calc_vma_size Name VSz Vaddr SzRaw Fileadr *Reloc *Lineum #Reloc #Linum Char trace:win32:calc_vma_size .text: 4e2a0 00001000 0004e400 00000400 00000000 00000000 0000 0000 60000020 trace:win32:calc_vma_size .rdata: 0690 00050000 00000800 0004e800 00000000 00000000 0000 0000 40000040 trace:win32:calc_vma_size .data: 18244 00051000 00010400 0004f000 00000000 00000000 0000 0000 c0000040 trace:win32:calc_vma_size .idata: 05a2 0006a000 00000600 0005f400 00000000 00000000 0000 0000 c0000040 fixme:win32:PE_LoadImage Try VirtualAlloc(0x00400000, 0x0006a600, MEM_RESERVE | MEM_COMMIT, PAGE_EXECUTE_READWRITE ) trace:virtual:VirtualAlloc 00400000 0006a600 3000 00000040 trace:virtual:VirtualAlloc base = 0x00400000, size = 0x0006b000 trace:file:FILE_dommap mmap(400000,6b000,7,1002,-1,0) = trace:file:FILE_dommap 28a70000 trace:virtual:VirtualAlloc We couldn't get the address we wanted: 0x28a70000 vs 0x00400000 fixme:win32:PE_LoadImage VirtualAlloc result = 0x00000000 fixme:win32:PE_LoadImage Need to relocate F:\BIN\WINEBIN\ASM56300.EXE, but no relocation records present (stripped during link). wine: can't exec 'asm56300.exe': error=0 OK, so I guess that the questions that need to be asked are: a) Why can't FreeBSD's mmap() give me a block at 0x00400000? b) Why are we asking for 0x00400000 when the Vaddr of the program is 0x1000? c) Why isn't everyone else falling over this one straight away, given that it seems to be the normal situation for Win32 console applications? d) How did it ever work before? Could this be a FreeBSD-3.1 vs 2.2.8 thing, rather than a wine 990214 vs 9807xx thing? The mmap(2) manual page says (of MAP_FIXED, which isn't being used here) [EINVAL] MAP_FIXED was specified and the addr parameter was not page aligned, or part of the desired address space resides out of the valid address space for a user process. But none of the See Also pages would tell me what constituted a valid address space for a user process. Clues, hints, hope? -- Andrew Reilly To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 18:23: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sol (cs1-gw.cs.binghamton.edu [128.226.171.72]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D158A1569A for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 18:22:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu) Received: from localhost (zzhang@localhost) by sol (SMI-8.6/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA03215 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 21:10:16 -0400 Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 21:10:16 -0400 (EDT) From: Zhihui Zhang To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Matthew Dillon's patch to VMIO directories Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I have downloaded FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE and applied Matthew Dillon's patch postes very recently. Here are my results: # date; time find -x /usr/src > /dev/null; date Wed Apr 21 19:45:06 GMT 1999 0.255u 0.841s 0:30.75 3.5% 21+317k 2284+0io 1pf+0w Wed Apr 21 19:45:37 GMT 1999 # date ; time find -x /usr/src > /dev/null ; date Wed Apr 21 19:45:42 GMT 1999 0.328u 0.476s 0:02.62 30.1% 25+377k 0+259io 0pf+0w Wed Apr 21 19:45:45 GMT 1999 The first time I run find command, the time elapsed is 30 seconds, comparable to the kernel without patch. The second time I run find command, the time elapsed is only 2 seconds. And if I interprete the output of time correctly, the first time we did 2284 I/O read, 0 I/O write. The second time we did 0 I/O read, 259 I/O write. If I am wrong, please correct me. The machine is Pentium 233 with 64M memory. I did this test via a remote log in. -Zhihui To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 19:18:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA8D414D8D for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 19:18:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA26743 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 22:15:42 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 22:15:42 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: IPFW [ug]id support Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've finished my implementation of UID/GID-based firewall support for IPFW; all it lacks is outside testing, so without further ado, the patches can be found at: http://janus.syracuse.net/~green/ipfw_uid.patch MD5 (patches/ipfw_uid.patch) = b9c0a2f1010d349d00a1bbdc06f0d089 Enjoy! Please report any problems to me; heck, report any successes too :) Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \ _ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___)___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 19:28: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailer.syr.edu (mailer.syr.edu [128.230.18.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E43415905 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 19:27:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cmsedore@mailbox.syr.edu) Received: from rodan.syr.edu by mailer.syr.edu (LSMTP for Windows NT v1.1a) with SMTP id <0.DA2D3360@mailer.syr.edu>; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 22:25:25 -0400 Received: from localhost (cmsedore@localhost) by rodan.syr.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA08004 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 22:25:19 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: rodan.syr.edu: cmsedore owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 22:25:18 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Sedore X-Sender: cmsedore@rodan.syr.edu To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: aio_suspend() functionality Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I sent a message a day or two ago asking if anyone had looked into changing the behavior of aio_suspend so that it did not require a list of aiocb's, but rather would accept an array of null pointers, and then fill them in for you when an operation completed. A patch to vfs_aio.c that does just this is available at ftp://ftp.maxwell.syr.edu/freebsd/vfs_aio.c-aio_suspend-patch Why would one care about this? If one were going to have hundreds (or thousands) of outstanding asynchronous IO requests, it isn't very efficient to handle them buy building arrays of pointers to control blocks and then polling each one to determine whether or not it has completed, particularly since the kernel already has them in a handy list. It essentially allows you to use aiocb's as fire and forget: malloc one (possibly "growing it" to keep your own state), give it to the OS with aio_read/aio_write, then simply poll for completed events using aio_suspend. When an operation completes, you'll get the pointer to the aiocb back. This patch is against FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE It works in my testing, and is not entirely backwardly compatible with the old aio_suspend (it won't behave the same way if you pass in an array of all NULL pointers, otherwise it should be functionally equivalent). The patch will generate a warning during compiling because the upper layers pointing to aio_suspend expect the array of pointers to be a const, and I deconstify it. -Chris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 20:37:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hydrogen.fircrest.net (metriclient-3.uoregon.edu [128.223.172.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85D4B15439 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 20:37:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gurney_j@efn.org) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.fircrest.net (8.9.1/8.8.7) id UAA27277; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 20:34:38 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19990421203437.35158@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 20:34:37 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: Christopher Sedore Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: aio_suspend() functionality References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: ; from Christopher Sedore on Wed, Apr 21, 1999 at 10:25:18PM -0400 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Christopher Sedore scribbled this message on Apr 21: > > I sent a message a day or two ago asking if anyone had looked into > changing the behavior of aio_suspend so that it did not require a list of > aiocb's, but rather would accept an array of null pointers, and then fill > them in for you when an operation completed. > > A patch to vfs_aio.c that does just this is available at > ftp://ftp.maxwell.syr.edu/freebsd/vfs_aio.c-aio_suspend-patch thanks for doing the work.... > Why would one care about this? If one were going to have hundreds (or > thousands) of outstanding asynchronous IO requests, it isn't very I wish this was possible.. you can only queue 256 and have 32 active at once right now... sounds like we need to LINT some more options for this... > efficient to handle them buy building arrays of pointers to control blocks > and then polling each one to determine whether or not it has completed, > particularly since the kernel already has them in a handy list. > > It essentially allows you to use aiocb's as fire and forget: malloc one > (possibly "growing it" to keep your own state), give it to the OS with > aio_read/aio_write, then simply poll for completed events using > aio_suspend. When an operation completes, you'll get the pointer to the > aiocb back. > > This patch is against FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE It works in my testing, and > is not entirely backwardly compatible with the old aio_suspend (it won't > behave the same way if you pass in an array of all NULL pointers, > otherwise it should be functionally equivalent). I've been trying to get Dyson's attention about aio too... there is one major problem with the code that allows any user that can do aio to panic the system... also it doesn't honor the FREAD flag on a descriptor... if you have a descriptor open just for writing, you can read from it with aio... I have fixes for both of these bugs... but right now I don't have a machine to do -current testing on, so I won't be able to throughly be able to test the patches... > The patch will generate a warning during compiling because the upper > layers pointing to aio_suspend expect the array of pointers to be a const, > and I deconstify it. we should find out what DG and bde think about this change... it is a nice change, though we need to evaluate what it does to the standard.. one thing we might look at is just using a new aio_sleep function that provides this functionality... -- John-Mark Gurney Voice: +1 541 684 8449 Cu Networking P.O. Box 5693, 97405 "The soul contains in itself the event that shall presently befall it. The event is only the actualizing of its thought." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 21: 6:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alcanet.com.au (border.alcanet.com.au [203.62.196.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F7A9158D2 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 21:05:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au) Received: by border.alcanet.com.au id <40369>; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 13:49:28 +1000 Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:03:10 +1000 From: Peter Jeremy Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug To: luoqi@watermarkgroup.com Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Message-Id: <99Apr22.134928est.40369@border.alcanet.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Luoqi Chen wrote: >This is a different (bigger) problem, i.e. pid sharing among threads, >it is also desirable for signal handling. I doubt that which id is stored in >the lock really matters, and this issue will go away as soon as we solve >the bigger pid sharing problem. How about the following (off the top of my head so it may not be feasible): The underlying problem is that POSIX requires each thread to have the same PID whereas rfork gives each thread a different PID. How about adding a new `thread group' (similar to a process group) to a process. Normally, fork() would make the thread group the same as the PID. A flag to rfork() would allow the child process to inherit the thread group (and probably parent pid) from its parent instead. If I understand POSIX correctly, signal semantics would need to be altered to send signals to the thread group, rather than a process id. Two new system calls would be required to allow a process (rather than a thread group) to be killed, as well as obtain the thread group. As a further naming change, `process ID' could be changed to `thread ID', allowing `thread group' to be renamed `process ID'. This may make the terminology clearer to multi-threaded processes outside the kernel. Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 21 21:15:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alcanet.com.au (border.alcanet.com.au [203.62.196.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2861115935 for ; Wed, 21 Apr 1999 21:15:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au) Received: by border.alcanet.com.au id <40349>; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 13:58:45 +1000 Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:12:30 +1000 From: Peter Jeremy Subject: Re: Deadlock on -stable To: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Message-Id: <99Apr22.135845est.40349@border.alcanet.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "David E. Cross" wrote: > (I ask since this is a really nasty program, using semaphores, >shared memory, file locking, mmap()-ed files, file locking, etc.) It's worthwhile noting that there are a variety of bugs in the semaphore code. (I have fixes, but haven't tested them yet). Most of these only affect boundary conditions, but there is one case where semop() can return (with an error) after processing part of the sops array without rolling back. None of the bugs should lead to panic's though. There was a bug where the semaphore code could tread on innocent kernel memory, but that was fixed just before 3.1-RELEASE. Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 0: 7:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.Technion.AC.IL (csa.cs.technion.ac.il [132.68.32.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E12081595E for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 00:07:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nadav@cs.technion.ac.il) Received: from csd.csa (csd.cs.technion.ac.il [132.68.32.8]) by cs.Technion.AC.IL (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id KAA28495; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:06:28 +0300 (IDT) Received: from localhost by csd.csa (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id KAA17025; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:06:26 +0300 Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:06:26 +0300 (IDT) From: Nadav Eiron X-Sender: nadav@csd To: stox@enteract.com Cc: Wes Peters , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NT4 server 2.5 times faster than Linux In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Kenneth P. Stox wrote: > > > On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Wes Peters wrote: > > > > > > > Sun? IBM? Intel? > > > > > > > > Oh that's right, they're all too small to count. But they did beat > > > > SGI to the punch on the Linux thing. > > > > > > Well, I'm not so sure about that. What technology has Sun, IBM, or Intel > > > agreed to to donate to Linux right now ? I know Sun has made Java open, > > > but have they donated any technology directly to the O/S ? > > > > Sun gave them a StarFire to play with. Is that enough? How many multi- > > million dollar machines do they need? ;^) > > > > IBM has sent several dozen workstations and a couple of large SMP > > servers to their Linux PPC partner, somewhere in Florida. Motorola > > has 3 engineers doing full-time support for Linux on their CPU boards > > over in Computer Division. > > > > SGI is already dead, they just haven't bothered to fall over yet. > > Their executive staff have been driving them into the ground for > > years, so it's not surprising. > > When I said donating technology, I meant things like XFS ( although SGI > has not stated that this is one of the technologies ). Is IBM going to > donate JFS and the volume management software ? I read recently in a Compaq (DEC) site somwhere (sorry, don't remember where) that Compaq is going to donate its compiler technology for the Alpha. It was some mumbling of it being available for free, but w/o sources for Linux developers (both RedHat and ISVs). I think details are not yet finilized, but Compaq seems to be pushing Linux/alpha real hard. > > -Ken Stox > stox@enteract.com > > Nadav To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 6: 7: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kirk.giovannelli.it (kirk.giovannelli.it [194.184.65.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA570153E3 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 06:06:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gmarco@giovannelli.it) Received: from suzy (modem13.masternet.it [194.184.65.23]) by kirk.giovannelli.it (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id NAA06121 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 13:04:18 GMT (envelope-from gmarco@giovannelli.it) Message-Id: <4.1.19990422133009.00b95d10@194.184.65.4> Message-Id: <4.1.19990422133009.00b95d10@194.184.65.4> X-Sender: gmarco@194.184.65.4 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 13:55:20 +0200 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: Gianmarco Giovannelli Subject: Uox, Linux emul and missing things. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I know this msg can be a little off-topics here, but I really don't know where it have to be posted. Here is the problem: I am trying to make uox3 v69.03 (ultima online emulator) working on freebsd too (it works on linux and Winslow). But I find some problems: First I try with the linux binary: gmarco:/usr/local/gm/games/uo/uox.03# file uox3.linux uox3.linux: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, Intel 80386, version 1, dynamically linked, not stripped gmarco:/usr/local/gm/games/uo/uox.03# ./uox3.linux ./uox3.linux: error in loading shared libraries : undefined symbol: __register_frame_info The begin is not so good. The linux binary refuses to work. I have Linux lib 2.6.1 installed and the system is a 4.0-current (of today). Trying to compile by myself it result in a waited result : gmarco:/tmp/dev# gmake linux gmake uox3 "EXE=uox3" "LIBS=-lm" gmake[1]: Entering directory `/usr/tmp/dev' gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 admin.cpp -o admin.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 archive.cpp -o archive.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 combat.cpp -o combat.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 data.cpp -o data.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 debug.cpp -o debug.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 globals.cpp -o globals.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 house.cpp -o house.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 im.cpp -o im.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 items.cpp -o items.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 magic.cpp -o magic.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 msgboard.cpp -o msgboard.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 necro.cpp -o necro.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 newbie.cpp -o newbie.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 pointer.cpp -o pointer.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 regions.cpp -o regions.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 scriptc.cpp -o scriptc.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 skills.cpp -o skills.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 trigger.cpp -o trigger.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 uox3.cpp -o uox3.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 weight.cpp -o weight.o gcc -c -w -funsigned-char -fconserve-space -O2 worldmain.cpp -o worldmain.o gcc -o uox3 admin.o archive.o combat.o data.o debug.o globals.o house.o im.o items.o magic.o msgboard.o necro.o newbie.o pointer.o regions.o scriptc.o skills.o trigger.o uox3.o weight.o worldmain.o -lm archive.o: In function `ArchiveID(char *)': archive.o(.text+0x172): undefined reference to `_itoa' archive.o(.text+0x1c1): undefined reference to `_itoa' archive.o(.text+0x1ff): undefined reference to `_itoa' archive.o(.text+0x23a): undefined reference to `_itoa' archive.o(.text+0x273): undefined reference to `_itoa' So let'g go to add this function to the file archive.cpp like Donald Burr made for the v69.02. void _itoa(char* dest, int num, int maxlen) { char buf[80]; sprintf(buf, "%d", num); strncpy(dest, buf, maxlen); } It compile and seems to work. But it's not true... it crashes after a few seconds (technically when spawn some NPC :-) UOX3: Startup Complete. UOX3: Client 0 connected [Total:1]. UOX3: Client 1 connected [Total:2]. UOX3: Client 0 disconnected. [Total:1] Floating exception (core dumped) So I tried to change in this way: #define _itoa(dest, num, maxlen) snprintf(dest, maxlen, "%d", num) or void _itoa(char *dest, int num, int maxlen) { snprintf(dest, maxlen, "%d", num); } But the result are the same... Any hints ? Best Regards, Gianmarco Giovannelli , "Unix expert since yesterday" http://www.giovannelli.it/~gmarco http://www2.masternet.it To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 7:14:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sol (cs1-gw.cs.binghamton.edu [128.226.171.72]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id EF12514D96 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 07:14:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu) Received: from localhost (zzhang@localhost) by sol (SMI-8.6/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA05630 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:02:09 -0400 Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:02:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Zhihui Zhang To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: VFS initialization in FreeBSD 3.1 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I am trying to understand how VFS gets initialized in FreeBSD 3.1. In FreeBSD 2.2.8, the file vnode_if.c is created by vnode_if.sh. At the end of vnode_if.c, there is the following array: struct vnodeop_desc *vfs_op_descs[] = {......} This array will be traversed by vfs_op_init() (does not exist in FreeBSD 3.1) and the number of vnode operations is thus determined to be 44 in FreeBSD 2.2.8. In FreeBSD 3.1, however, I can not find where the vfs_op_descs is initialized. It seems to be initialized in vfs_add_vnodeops(), which is in turn called by some LKM routine. Is VFS initialized by LKM mechanism in FreeBSD 3.1. I expect all system initialization is done by SYSINIT() or SYSINIT_KT() macros as in FreeBSD 2.2.8. I hope some guru can give me some enlightment. Any help is appreciated. -------------------------------------------------- Zhihui Zhang. Please visit http://www.freebsd.org -------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 7:26:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from GWSserver.solutions.ie (unknown [193.120.161.26]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D4E8A15A74 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 07:26:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from niall@pobox.com) Received: by GWSserver.solutions.ie id AA18666; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 15:23:49 +0100 Message-Id: <371F30F5.2B56818F@pobox.com> Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 15:23:49 +0100 From: Niall Smart X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; OSF1 V4.0 alpha) X-Accept-Language: en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Zhihui Zhang Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Matthew Dillon's patch to VMIO directories References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > The first time I run find command, the time elapsed is 30 seconds, > comparable to the kernel without patch. The second time I run find > command, the time elapsed is only 2 seconds. And if I interprete the > output of time correctly, the first time we did 2284 I/O read, 0 I/O > write. The second time we did 0 I/O read, 259 I/O write. Would it be correct to attribute the writes due to paging caused by the memory used to cache directory entries, or is this more likely to be noise? Regards, Niall To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 7:51:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hda.hda.com (hda-bicnet.bicnet.net [209.244.238.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 66C4E14C0C for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 07:51:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dufault@hda.hda.com) Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.hda.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA29489; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:39:51 -0400 (EDT) From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199904221439.KAA29489@hda.hda.com> Subject: Re: aio_suspend() functionality In-Reply-To: from Christopher Sedore at "Apr 21, 99 10:25:18 pm" To: cmsedore@mailbox.syr.edu (Christopher Sedore) Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:39:51 -0400 (EDT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL25 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I sent a message a day or two ago asking if anyone had looked into > changing the behavior of aio_suspend so that it did not require a list of > aiocb's, but rather would accept an array of null pointers, and then fill > them in for you when an operation completed. Unfortunately this explicitly violates the standard so be sure to conditionalize it properly. In 6.7.8.2 about the array: "This array may contain NULL pointers, which shall be ignored." The hooks POSIX tries to provide to implement what you want are via signals - using aio_sigevent, SIGEV_SIGNAL, "Realtime Signals", and the associated si_value for the completion cookie. Peter -- Peter Dufault (dufault@hda.com) Realtime development, Machine control, HD Associates, Inc. Safety critical systems, Agency approval To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 7:58:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tornado.cisco.com (tornado.cisco.com [171.69.104.22]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B62A1503A for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 07:58:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bmcgover@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com) Received: from bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (bmcgover-pc.cisco.com [171.69.104.147]) by tornado.cisco.com (8.8.5-Cisco.1/8.6.5) with ESMTP id KAA15189 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:56:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (localhost.pa.dtd.cisco.com [127.0.0.1]) by bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id KAA00569 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:56:22 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from bmcgover@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com) Message-Id: <199904221456.KAA00569@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Issue with 3.1 making package Index... Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:56:22 -0400 From: Brian McGovern Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ok. Here is one thats gotten me for far too many hours... Up until using 3.1, when I made a custom distribution, I also made packages from the ports tree with "make package". I was also able to generate a somewhat messy INDEX file for it with "make describe". A little cleanup, and I was all set. Unforutnately, it seems that 3.1 softened the "make describe" target, so that it would list the path to the dependancy, but not the dependancy itself. Therefore, when installing, the packages that depended on the target would complain it wasn't installed. To wit: 3.0 would do this (note: indents are line wraps): xpm-3.4k|/usr/ports/graphics/xpm|/usr/X11R6|The X Pixmap library.| /usr/ports/graphics/xpm/pkg/DESCR|jseger@FreeBSD.org|graphics x11| XFree86-3.3.2|XFree86-3.3.2 xlockmore-4.12|/usr/ports/x11/xlockmore|/usr/X11R6| Like XLock session locker/screen saver, but just more.| /usr/ports/x11/xlockmore/pkg/DESCR|tg@FreeBSD.ORG|x11| Mesa-3.0 XFree86-3.3.2 xpm-3.4k|Mesa-3.0 XFree86-3.3.2 xpm-3.4k ^^^^^^^^ Note the format of the dependancy 3.1 does this: xpm-3.4k|/usr2/tmp/ports/graphics/xpm|/usr/X11R6|The X Pixmap library.| /usr2/tmp/ports/graphics/xpm/pkg/DESCR|jseger@FreeBSD.org| graphics x11|/usr/ports/x11/XFree86|/usr/ports/x11/XFree86 xlockmore-4.12|/usr2/tmp/ports/x11/xlockmore|/usr/X11R6| Like XLock session locker/screen saver, but just more.| /usr2/tmp/ports/x11/xlockmore/pkg/DESCR|tg@FreeBSD.ORG|x11| /usr/ports/graphics/Mesa3 /usr/ports/graphics/xpm /usr/ports/x11/XFree86|/usr/ports/graphics/Mesa3 /usr/ports/graphics/xpm /usr/ports/x11/XFree86 Now it appears with the full path. So, the questions are) 1.) Am I doing something wrong to generate the index. 2.) Is the ports collection with 3.1 broken? 3.) If I cvsup to something newer, will it fix it, and more importantly, will it not break anyting else? -Brian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 8: 9:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F0A71503A for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 08:09:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA10662; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 11:06:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904221506.LAA10662@cs.rpi.edu> To: Matthew Dillon Cc: "David E. Cross" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: Deadlock on -stable In-Reply-To: Message from Matthew Dillon of "Wed, 21 Apr 1999 15:15:37 PDT." <199904212215.PAA08857@apollo.backplane.com> Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 11:06:48 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I should have been more specific > > Use a long listing. 'l' option. We need to know what the commands > are waiting on. > > The processes are not swapped out --- the core file does not contain > sufficient information for ps to figure out the u-area for the > processes. Ok, take 2: USER PID %CPU %MEM VSZ RSS TT STAT STARTED TIME COMMAND UID PID PPID CPU PRI NI VSZ RSS WCHAN STAT TT TIME COMMAND thompe2 333 90.3 0.1 4920 0 v0 RX+ - 0:00.00 (tt3) 2568 333 332 2490 105 0 4920 0 - RX+ v0 0:00.00 (tt3) root 1 0.0 0.0 496 0 ?? IWs - 0:00.00 (init) 0 1 0 0 10 0 496 0 wait IWs ?? 0:00.00 (init) root 2 0.0 0.1 0 0 ?? RL - 0:00.00 (pagedaemon) 0 2 0 0 -18 0 0 0 - RL ?? 0:00.00 (pagedaemon) root 3 0.0 0.1 0 0 ?? DL - 0:00.00 (vmdaemon) 0 3 0 0 18 0 0 0 psleep DL ?? 0:00.00 (vmdaemon) root 4 0.0 0.1 0 0 ?? RL - 0:00.00 (syncer) 0 4 0 0 18 0 0 0 - RL ?? 0:00.00 (syncer) root 94 0.0 0.1 820 0 ?? Rs - 0:00.00 (syslogd) 0 94 1 0 2 0 820 0 - Rs ?? 0:00.00 (syslogd) root 102 0.0 0.1 1040 0 ?? R; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 09:25:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cmsedore@mailbox.syr.edu) Received: from rodan.syr.edu by mailer.syr.edu (LSMTP for Windows NT v1.1a) with SMTP id <0.D2B16780@mailer.syr.edu>; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 12:22:47 -0400 Received: from localhost (cmsedore@localhost) by rodan.syr.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA13439; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 12:22:35 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: rodan.syr.edu: cmsedore owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 12:22:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Sedore X-Sender: cmsedore@rodan.syr.edu Reply-To: Christopher Sedore To: John-Mark Gurney Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: aio_suspend() functionality In-Reply-To: <19990421203437.35158@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 21 Apr 1999, John-Mark Gurney wrote: > Christopher Sedore scribbled this message on Apr 21: > > > Why would one care about this? If one were going to have hundreds (or > > thousands) of outstanding asynchronous IO requests, it isn't very > > I wish this was possible.. you can only queue 256 and have 32 active > at once right now... sounds like we need to LINT some more options for > this... It looks to me like you can just up the limits with sysctl, though it would be nice to be able to have config options too. > > This patch is against FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE It works in my testing, and > > is not entirely backwardly compatible with the old aio_suspend (it won't > > behave the same way if you pass in an array of all NULL pointers, > > otherwise it should be functionally equivalent). > > I've been trying to get Dyson's attention about aio too... there is > one major problem with the code that allows any user that can do aio > to panic the system... also it doesn't honor the FREAD flag on a > descriptor... if you have a descriptor open just for writing, you can > read from it with aio... It looks to me like specifying an aiocb that fails copyin to aio_read() causes a memory leak. Is this what you're referring to? > I have fixes for both of these bugs... but right now I don't have a > machine to do -current testing on, so I won't be able to throughly > be able to test the patches... I'd be willing to put up a web page with a full collection of aio patches available if you'd like to share off-line. > > The patch will generate a warning during compiling because the upper > > layers pointing to aio_suspend expect the array of pointers to be a const, > > and I deconstify it. > > we should find out what DG and bde think about this change... it is a > nice change, though we need to evaluate what it does to the standard.. > one thing we might look at is just using a new aio_sleep function that > provides this functionality... Another issue of concern to me: it appears that the AIO daemons do blocking io on the descriptors, so if I had lots of sockets (more than max_aio_procs) open with async operations pending, the first max_aio_procs async reads would block all the async operations until one read was successful. This seems to make the async io somewhat less useful. I've been looking into modifying aio_process to have it requeue aio operations on sockets that get EWOULDBLOCK back from the read/write into a "waiting" queue, and then using socket upcalls to move them back to the job queue when the underlying socket is ready for a read or write. One other modification I've been considering would be to change the behavior of _aio_queue when it can't create an additional proc because of resource limits. Right now it returns EAGAIN, but I was thinking that it should check to see if there are aio daemons already running, and if so, just queue the job for later. If not, then EAGAIN seems appropriate. -Chris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 9:31:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from etinc.com (et-gw.etinc.com [207.252.1.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6AC0A153A0 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 09:31:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dennis@etinc.com) Received: from dbsys (dbsys.etinc.com [207.252.1.18]) by etinc.com (8.8.8/8.6.9) with SMTP id MAA26315 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 12:31:03 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904221631.MAA26315@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 11:22:36 -0400 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: Dennis Subject: speeding up boots... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Is there a simple tuning parameter for 1) losing the 10 second countdown on boot.... 2) speeding up the large IDE hard disk check Thanks, Dennis To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 9:39:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailer.syr.edu (mailer.syr.edu [128.230.18.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43F2A15467 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 09:39:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cmsedore@mailbox.syr.edu) Received: from rodan.syr.edu by mailer.syr.edu (LSMTP for Windows NT v1.1a) with SMTP id <0.958DA1A0@mailer.syr.edu>; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 12:35:22 -0400 Received: from localhost (cmsedore@localhost) by rodan.syr.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA20069; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 12:35:17 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: rodan.syr.edu: cmsedore owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 12:35:16 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Sedore X-Sender: cmsedore@rodan.syr.edu Reply-To: Christopher Sedore To: Peter Dufault Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: aio_suspend() functionality In-Reply-To: <199904221439.KAA29489@hda.hda.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 22 Apr 1999, Peter Dufault wrote: > > I sent a message a day or two ago asking if anyone had looked into > > changing the behavior of aio_suspend so that it did not require a list of > > aiocb's, but rather would accept an array of null pointers, and then fill > > them in for you when an operation completed. > > Unfortunately this explicitly violates the standard so be sure to > conditionalize it properly. In 6.7.8.2 about the array: "This > array may contain NULL pointers, which shall be ignored." I thought that a variant of aio_return that would sleep until a completed io was ready might be a better alternative. This would eliminate the need to call aio_return as you are required to do with this modified aio_suspend. > The hooks POSIX tries to provide to implement what you want are > via signals - using aio_sigevent, SIGEV_SIGNAL, "Realtime Signals", > and the associated si_value for the completion cookie. FreeBSD doesn't have support for this, does it? I can't say I'm a fan of the POSIX aio spec--seems a little crippled. -Chris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 9:44:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from arjun.niksun.com (gw.niksun.com [206.20.52.122]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4A4D153A0 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 09:44:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ath@niksun.com) Received: from stiegl.niksun.com (stiegl.niksun.com [10.0.0.44]) by arjun.niksun.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA05420 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 12:42:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from stiegl.niksun.com (localhost.niksun.com [127.0.0.1]) by stiegl.niksun.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA08575 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 12:42:12 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from ath@stiegl.niksun.com) Message-Id: <199904221642.MAA08575@stiegl.niksun.com> From: Andrew Heybey To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: SMP nerd toy report Mime-Version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 7.108) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 12:42:11 -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG After reading about the hacks to make Celerons do SMP, I decided to give cheap SMP a try for no real good reason except that I wanted to. I bought: DFI P2XBL/D dual Slot 1 motherboard ($192) 2 Celeron 300A socket 370 processors ($65 each) 2 prewired-for-SMP socket 370 to Slot 1 converters (you don't want to see me with a soldering iron) ($22 each) Case, keyboard, 64MB of memory. ($140 total) I had an ethernet card and a disk lying around and I am using a serial console, so for about $500 (plus shipping) I have myself a very fast system. I have been very pleased with it so far. I installed 3.1-RELEASE for now. At 300MHz (66MHz FSB), my worldstone (CFLAGS="-O -pipe", make -j8 buildworld, softupdates, /usr/src & /usr/obj on the same partition of a Maxtor IDE disk) is about 1:15. At 450MHz (100MHz FSB) "make -j8 buildworld" takes about 0:55. (I know, bad hacker. I promise not to submit any PRs unless they can be duplicated at 300MHz.) I expect that if I got a second disk for /usr/obj that the build would really fly. All in all, I'm a happy nerd. One random question: has anyone ever seen a BIOS that works over a serial line? I'm perfectly happy with a serial console except that I have to drag the system within reach of a monitor if I want to change something in the BIOS. Plus I have to waste a slot for a video card unless I also want to install that everytime I want to poke around in the BIOS. andrew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 10: 5:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sussie.interbizz.se (ns.datadesign.se [194.23.109.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B887159F0 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:05:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Joachim.Isaksson@ibfs.com) Received: from tequila (dhcp140.ibfs.com [193.45.188.140]) by sussie.interbizz.se (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.7) with SMTP id TAA00976; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 19:02:22 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <00ae01be8ce1$e2f686d0$8cbc2dc1@ibfs.com> From: "Joachim Isaksson" To: "Warner Losh" Cc: References: <000a01be842b$eeff6e10$f56d17c2@home.ibfs.com> <199904120434.WAA03416@harmony.village.org> Subject: Generic PnP? (Was: Re: IrDA? PnP?) Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 19:02:19 +0200 Organization: Interbizz Financial Systems MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > : 4) As I (so far) understand it, the PnP functionality is a special "hack" > : for the ISA bus right now and could not easily be extended to integrate PnP > : devices on the IrDA bus? Is this assumption correct? If so, is anyone > > Yes. PnP is too generic a term to have generic code. PCI pnp and > parallel port PnP are both radically different than isa pnp or serial > port pnp. Well, in the kernel I agree that it would be hard to use generic code, but does it have to be as tough as it is now for userland to do something intelligent, really? For example, if the PCI, ISA, USB and sio drivers know how to plug and play devices connected to "their bus" and export collected info through a common device (for example /dev/pnp0), a userland process would easily load and unload kernel modules as needed without knowing the bus PnP specifics. This model would rather easily integrate IrDA PnP too. I can't see that this would be very hard to implement, but then I'm not a kernel guru (yet :-) /Joachim To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 10:13: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (spinner.netplex.com.au [202.12.86.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1982514EBB for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:12:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) Received: from netplex.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spinner.netplex.com.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E83F1F49; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 01:10:24 +0800 (WST) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Zhihui Zhang Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: VFS initialization in FreeBSD 3.1 In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:02:09 -0400." Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 01:10:24 +0800 From: Peter Wemm Message-Id: <19990422171026.3E83F1F49@spinner.netplex.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Zhihui Zhang wrote: > > I am trying to understand how VFS gets initialized in FreeBSD 3.1. In > FreeBSD 2.2.8, the file vnode_if.c is created by vnode_if.sh. At the end > of vnode_if.c, there is the following array: > > struct vnodeop_desc *vfs_op_descs[] = {......} > > This array will be traversed by vfs_op_init() (does not exist in FreeBSD > 3.1) and the number of vnode operations is thus determined to be 44 in > FreeBSD 2.2.8. > > In FreeBSD 3.1, however, I can not find where the vfs_op_descs is > initialized. It seems to be initialized in vfs_add_vnodeops(), which is > in turn called by some LKM routine. Is VFS initialized by LKM mechanism in > FreeBSD 3.1. I expect all system initialization is done by SYSINIT() or > SYSINIT_KT() macros as in FreeBSD 2.2.8. I hope some guru can give me > some enlightment. It's initiallized dynamically, via the VNODEOP_SET() macro: /* Global vfs data structures for ufs. */ static vop_t **ufs_vnodeop_p; static struct vnodeopv_entry_desc ufs_vnodeop_entries[] = { { &vop_default_desc, (vop_t *) vop_defaultop }, { &vop_fsync_desc, (vop_t *) ufs_missingop }, { &vop_read_desc, (vop_t *) ufs_missingop }, [..] { &vop_whiteout_desc, (vop_t *) ufs_whiteout }, { NULL, NULL } }; static struct vnodeopv_desc ufs_vnodeop_opv_desc = { &ufs_vnodeop_p, ufs_vnodeop_entries }; [..] VNODEOP_SET(ufs_vnodeop_opv_desc); VNODEOP_SET() arranges for a SYSINIT() to call the add/remove functions at kernel boot and/or module load/unload times. The VOP_*() vectors are 100% dynamic now - but there's a fair bit of torture to get this to fly. You can add *new* VOP's on the fly and they will correctly pass through stacked layers, assuming the stacking works right. :-) VNODEOP_SET() is a legacy name from when this was all implemented with linker sets. This will go away and will get a proper name somewhere along the line now that LKM mechanism has gone from 4.0-current and been replaced with kld modules managed by the boot loader and the in-kernel linker. Cheers, -Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 10:26:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quackerjack.cc.vt.edu (quackerjack.cc.vt.edu [198.82.160.250]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E362A14EBB for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:26:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jobaldwi@vt.edu) Received: from sable.cc.vt.edu (sable.cc.vt.edu [128.173.16.30]) by quackerjack.cc.vt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA22671; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 13:24:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from john.baldwin.cx (jobaldwi.campus.vt.edu [198.82.67.63]) by sable.cc.vt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA22925; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 13:24:07 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199904221631.MAA26315@etinc.com> Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 13:24:06 -0400 (EDT) From: John Baldwin To: Dennis Subject: RE: speeding up boots... Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 22-Apr-99 Dennis wrote: > Is there a simple tuning parameter for > > 1) losing the 10 second countdown on boot.... Hit space during the next pause, then press '?' for a list of commands you can use. Once you figure out what you want to do, put the appropriate commands in /boor/loader.rc and they will be executed every time. For example, "autoboot 10" waits 10 seconds and then boots. > 2) speeding up the large IDE hard disk check Look in LINT for IDE_DELAY. The delay is during the probe for ATAPI devices. HTH. > Thanks, > > Dennis --- John Baldwin -- http://members.freedomnet.com/~jbaldwin/ PGP Key: http://members.freedomnet.com/~jbaldwin/pgpkey.asc "Power Users Use the Power to Serve!" - http://www.freebsd.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 10:34:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C8AD14EBB for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:34:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id CAA13449; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 02:31:32 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <371F5A3E.7CB87A4E@newsguy.com> Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 02:19:58 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Gianmarco Giovannelli Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Uox, Linux emul and missing things. References: <4.1.19990422133009.00b95d10@194.184.65.4> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Gianmarco Giovannelli wrote: > > It compile and seems to work. But it's not true... it crashes after a few > seconds (technically when spawn some NPC :-) > > UOX3: Startup Complete. > UOX3: Client 0 connected [Total:1]. > UOX3: Client 1 connected [Total:2]. > UOX3: Client 0 disconnected. [Total:1] > Floating exception (core dumped) FreeBSD defaults to signal floating point exceptions in case of overflow and things like that. Linux, I take it, does not. Short of correcting the program, I think there is a system wide setting to turn off floating point exceptions. -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "Well, Windows works, using a loose definition of 'works'..." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 10:48: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D386A15B59 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:48:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id CAA14482; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 02:45:26 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <371F5E06.AAFDCA84@newsguy.com> Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 02:36:06 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dennis , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: speeding up boots... References: <199904221631.MAA26315@etinc.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Dennis wrote: > > Is there a simple tuning parameter for > > 1) losing the 10 second countdown on boot.... echo "boot" >/boot/loader.rc If you have a /boot/loader.rc, though (for loading userconfig_script, for instance), better edit the file, and either append the boot line, or replace any existing autoboot line with boot. -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "Well, Windows works, using a loose definition of 'works'..." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 10:54:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A68F14F0C for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:54:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id KAA15876; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:51:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:51:50 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904221751.KAA15876@apollo.backplane.com> To: "David E. Cross" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: Deadlock on -stable References: <199904221506.LAA10662@cs.rpi.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Ok, take 2: : :USER PID %CPU %MEM VSZ RSS TT STAT STARTED TIME COMMAND UID PID PPID CPU PRI NI VSZ RSS WCHAN STAT TT TIME COMMAND :... Ok, the ps plus the stack backtrace makes it fairly obvious to me what is going on. Your program is using fcntl locks, right? What it is doing is creating thousands or tens of thousands of separate fcntl locks and never unlocking them. The kernel is eating a huge amount of time scanning the lists, and this is bringing the rest of the system to a grinding halt. Are you by chance attempting to create a lock in one process and unlock it another? That will NOT work for a fcntl lock. Alternatively, you may not be unlocking the locks at all or you may not be unlocking the same (offset,byte) range that you locked, which could leave a lock fragment linked in. I would look at the locking portion of the code very closely. -Matt Matthew Dillon :David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu :Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 10:57:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from noc.demon.net (server.noc.demon.net [193.195.224.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B8B514F0C for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:57:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fanf@demon.net) Received: by noc.demon.net; id SAA01741; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 18:55:05 +0100 (BST) Received: from fanf.noc.demon.net(195.11.55.83) by inside.noc.demon.net via smap (3.2) id xma001723; Thu, 22 Apr 99 18:54:53 +0100 Received: from fanf by fanf.noc.demon.net with local (Exim 1.73 #2) id 10aNgZ-0002kq-00; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 18:54:51 +0100 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: Tony Finch Subject: Re: Matthew Dillon's patch to VMIO directories In-Reply-To: <371F30F5.2B56818F@pobox.com> References: Message-Id: Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 18:54:52 +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Niall Smart wrote: >> The first time I run find command, the time elapsed is 30 seconds, >> comparable to the kernel without patch. The second time I run find >> command, the time elapsed is only 2 seconds. And if I interprete the >> output of time correctly, the first time we did 2284 I/O read, 0 I/O >> write. The second time we did 0 I/O read, 259 I/O write. > >Would it be correct to attribute the writes due to paging >caused by the memory used to cache directory entries, or >is this more likely to be noise? atime? but why didn't that happen during the first run? Tony. -- f.a.n.finch dot@dotat.at fanf@demon.net Arthur: "Oh, that sounds better, have you worked out the controls?" Ford: "No, we just stopped playing with them." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 11:51: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lor.watermarkgroup.com (lor.watermarkgroup.com [207.202.73.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 354C314A12 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 11:50:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luoqi@watermarkgroup.com) Received: (from luoqi@localhost) by lor.watermarkgroup.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA06740; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:48:02 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from luoqi) Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:48:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Luoqi Chen Message-Id: <199904221848.OAA06740@lor.watermarkgroup.com> To: peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > How about the following (off the top of my head so it may not be > feasible): > > The underlying problem is that POSIX requires each thread to have the > same PID whereas rfork gives each thread a different PID. How about > adding a new `thread group' (similar to a process group) to a process. > > Normally, fork() would make the thread group the same as the PID. A > flag to rfork() would allow the child process to inherit the thread > group (and probably parent pid) from its parent instead. If I > understand POSIX correctly, signal semantics would need to be altered > to send signals to the thread group, rather than a process id. > > Two new system calls would be required to allow a process (rather than > a thread group) to be killed, as well as obtain the thread group. > > As a further naming change, `process ID' could be changed to `thread > ID', allowing `thread group' to be renamed `process ID'. This may > make the terminology clearer to multi-threaded processes outside the > kernel. > > Peter > I've been thinking about a more drastic one, store the same PID in the threads' proc structure. PID is no more than a name of a process in the userland, and in userland we see all the threads as the same process. I don't think we really need a thread id, the threads are anonymous. Inside the kernel, the threads or processes are still named by their (struct proc *) pointer, so there won't be any confusion. -lq To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 12:11:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from verdi.nethelp.no (verdi.nethelp.no [158.36.41.162]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 56D1714D14 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 12:11:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sthaug@nethelp.no) Received: (qmail 61424 invoked by uid 1001); 22 Apr 1999 19:08:50 +0000 (GMT) To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: 3.1-STABLE is currently broken From: sthaug@nethelp.no X-Mailer: Mew version 1.05+ on Emacs 19.34.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 21:08:50 +0200 Message-ID: <61422.924808130@verdi.nethelp.no> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ... because usr.bin/colldef/data/de_DE.DIS_8859-15.src has been updated: # $Id: de_DE.DIS_8859-15.src,v 1.3.2.1 1999/04/22 08:34:03 foxfair Exp $ without the corresponding update to scan.l and parse.y in the colldef source. End result: ===> usr.bin/colldef/data colldef -I /usr/src/usr.bin/colldef/data -o de_DE.DIS_8859-15.out /usr/src/usr.bin /colldef/data/de_DE.DIS_8859-15.src colldef: syntax error near line 6 *** Error code 69 Stop. *** Error code 1 This is from a 3.1-RELEASE box, attemtping a buildworld to 3.1-STABLE. Using usr.bin/colldef/data/{scan.l,parse.y} from -CURRENT and generating colldef from these seems to fix the problem. Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 12:13:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.tar.com (ns.tar.com [204.95.187.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8943F14CCD for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 12:13:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dick@ns.tar.com) Received: (from dick@localhost) by ns.tar.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA46967; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:10:31 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dick) Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:10:31 -0500 From: "Richard Seaman, Jr." To: Luoqi Chen Cc: peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug Message-ID: <19990422141030.A484@tar.com> References: <199904221848.OAA06740@lor.watermarkgroup.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904221848.OAA06740@lor.watermarkgroup.com>; from Luoqi Chen on Thu, Apr 22, 1999 at 02:48:02PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 22, 1999 at 02:48:02PM -0400, Luoqi Chen wrote: > > How about the following (off the top of my head so it may not be > > feasible): > > > > The underlying problem is that POSIX requires each thread to have the > > same PID whereas rfork gives each thread a different PID. How about > > adding a new `thread group' (similar to a process group) to a process. > > > > Normally, fork() would make the thread group the same as the PID. A > > flag to rfork() would allow the child process to inherit the thread > > group (and probably parent pid) from its parent instead. If I > > understand POSIX correctly, signal semantics would need to be altered > > to send signals to the thread group, rather than a process id. > > > > Two new system calls would be required to allow a process (rather than > > a thread group) to be killed, as well as obtain the thread group. > > > > As a further naming change, `process ID' could be changed to `thread > > ID', allowing `thread group' to be renamed `process ID'. This may > > make the terminology clearer to multi-threaded processes outside the > > kernel. > > > > Peter > > > I've been thinking about a more drastic one, store the same PID in the > threads' proc structure. PID is no more than a name of a process in the > userland, and in userland we see all the threads as the same process. > I don't think we really need a thread id, the threads are anonymous. Maybe. But, if you want POSIX compliant pthreads, you need to be able to send a signal to a thread (pthread_kill()), as well as to the process (kill()). Also, you need to be able to set the priority of a thread (pthread_setschedparam()) as well a the priority of the process (setpriority() or sched_setscheduler(), etc). The pthread functions take a pthread_t parameter to identify the threads. If the threads are kernel threads, how do you communicate to the kernel which thread you're acting on if the threads are "anonymous" in userland? > Inside the kernel, the threads or processes are still named by their > (struct proc *) pointer, so there won't be any confusion. -- Richard Seaman, Jr. email: dick@tar.com 5182 N. Maple Lane phone: 414-367-5450 Chenequa WI 53058 fax: 414-367-5852 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 12:38:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from scotty.masternet.it (scotty.masternet.it [194.184.65.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E40FA1512D for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 12:38:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gmarco@scotty.masternet.it) Received: from suzy (modem33.masternet.it [194.184.65.43]) by scotty.masternet.it (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id VAA47911; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 21:35:26 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from gmarco@scotty.masternet.it) Message-Id: <4.1.19990422213220.00a1bf00@194.184.65.4> X-Sender: gmarco@scotty.masternet.it X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 21:33:46 +0200 To: "Daniel C. Sobral" , Gianmarco Giovannelli From: Gianmarco Giovannelli Subject: Re: Uox, Linux emul and missing things. Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <371F5A3E.7CB87A4E@newsguy.com> References: <4.1.19990422133009.00b95d10@194.184.65.4> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 02.19 23/04/99 +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: >FreeBSD defaults to signal floating point exceptions in case of >overflow and things like that. Linux, I take it, does not. > >Short of correcting the program, I think there is a system wide >setting to turn off floating point exceptions. :-) can you input more verbosely ? Best Regards, Gianmarco Giovannelli , "Unix expert since yesterday" http://www.giovannelli.it/~gmarco http://www2.masternet.it To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 13: 0:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pcnet1.pcnet.com (pcnet1.pcnet.com [204.213.232.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6993115189 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 13:00:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eischen@vigrid.com) Received: (from eischen@localhost) by pcnet1.pcnet.com (8.8.7/PCNet) id PAA24764; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 15:57:19 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 15:57:19 -0400 (EDT) From: Daniel Eischen Message-Id: <199904221957.PAA24764@pcnet1.pcnet.com> To: dick@tar.com, luoqi@watermarkgroup.com Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Maybe. But, if you want POSIX compliant pthreads, you need to be able > to send a signal to a thread (pthread_kill()), as well as to the process > (kill()). Also, you need to be able to set the priority of a thread > (pthread_setschedparam()) as well a the priority of the process > (setpriority() or sched_setscheduler(), etc). The pthread functions > take a pthread_t parameter to identify the threads. If the threads > are kernel threads, how do you communicate to the kernel which thread > you're acting on if the threads are "anonymous" in userland? You still have thread IDs in userland, but you now add: _lwp_kill, _lwp_setschedparam, etc, system calls to control the kernel threads. Or maybe one big _lwp_control... Dan Eischen eischen@vigrid.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 13:48:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from otto.oss.uswest.net (otto.oss.uswest.net [204.147.85.81]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1BAC114C29 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 13:48:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pmckenna@otto.oss.uswest.net) Received: (from pmckenna@localhost) by otto.oss.uswest.net (8.9.3/8.9.2) id PAA28459; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 15:46:03 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from pmckenna) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199904221642.MAA08575@stiegl.niksun.com> Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 15:46:03 -0500 (CDT) From: Pete Mckenna To: Andrew Heybey Subject: RE: SMP nerd toy report Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Yes Compaq has something called IRC on it's 1600 servers and probably others Also Intel's N440BX and L440GX MB's are supposed to do this. I haven't been able to get the Intel working yet but am getting some different hardware tomorrow. We use it for the remote access ability to toggle floppies etc. It's nice when it works. On 22-Apr-99 Andrew Heybey wrote: > One random question: has anyone ever seen a BIOS that works over a > serial line? I'm perfectly happy with a serial console except that I > have to drag the system within reach of a monitor if I want to change > something in the BIOS. Plus I have to waste a slot for a video card > unless I also want to install that everytime I want to poke around in > the BIOS. > ---------------------------------- E-Mail: Pete Mckenna Date: 22-Apr-99 Time: 15:39:47 This message was sent by XFMail ---------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 14: 6:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from norn.ca.eu.org (cr965240-b.abtsfd1.bc.wave.home.com [24.113.19.137]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B1B4159D1 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:06:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from norn@norn.ca.eu.org) Received: by norn.ca.eu.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 9D1C71655; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:03:54 -0700 (PDT) Content-Length: 922 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199904221642.MAA08575@stiegl.niksun.com> Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:03:54 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: Chris Piazza From: Chris Piazza To: Andrew Heybey Subject: RE: SMP nerd toy report Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 22-Apr-99 Andrew Heybey wrote: > I have been very pleased with it so far. I installed 3.1-RELEASE for > now. At 300MHz (66MHz FSB), my worldstone (CFLAGS="-O -pipe", > make -j8 buildworld, softupdates, /usr/src & /usr/obj on the same > partition of a Maxtor IDE disk) is about 1:15. > > At 450MHz (100MHz FSB) "make -j8 buildworld" takes about 0:55. (I > know, bad hacker. I promise not to submit any PRs unless they can be > duplicated at 300MHz.) I expect that if I got a second disk for > /usr/obj that the build would really fly. > > All in all, I'm a happy nerd. Hmm... IMO that's not a very good speed, though it might prove how I/O based buildworld is. My K6-2 300 (100mhz FSB) with 96 megs of ram does a buildworld in 75-80 minutes without any '-j' flags, and this is a single processor! --- Chris Piazza Abbotsford, BC, Canada cpiazza@home.net finger norn@norn.ca.eu.org for PGP key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 14:12:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from arjun.niksun.com (gw.niksun.com [206.20.52.122]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BE25154DD for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:12:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ath@niksun.com) Received: from stiegl.niksun.com (stiegl.niksun.com [10.0.0.44]) by arjun.niksun.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA06200; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 17:10:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from stiegl.niksun.com (localhost.niksun.com [127.0.0.1]) by stiegl.niksun.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA10023; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 17:10:07 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from ath@stiegl.niksun.com) Message-Id: <199904222110.RAA10023@stiegl.niksun.com> From: Andrew Heybey To: Chris Piazza Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: SMP nerd toy report In-reply-to: Your message of Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:03:54 -0700. Mime-Version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 7.108) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 17:10:07 -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >>On Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:03:54 -0700 (PDT), Chris Piazza said: cpiazza> Hmm... IMO that's not a very good speed, though it might cpiazza> prove how I/O based buildworld is. My K6-2 300 (100mhz cpiazza> FSB) with 96 megs of ram does a buildworld in 75-80 minutes cpiazza> without any '-j' flags, and this is a single processor! Well, this is in part why I sent mail--I have no idea what is good or not. I meant I'm a happy nerd more in the "look at my neat SMP toy" as opposed to "look how fast buildworld runs". I do know that the speed of make world is dependent to a large extent on the speed of your disks and how many spindles you have. How many disks do you have and where is your /usr/src and /usr/obj? At work I have a 450MHz PII with multiple 10000RPM SCSI disks, though I have never actually timed make buildworld on it. I should. andrew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 14:20:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from norn.ca.eu.org (cr965240-b.abtsfd1.bc.wave.home.com [24.113.19.137]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3633E15A5F for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:20:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from norn@norn.ca.eu.org) Received: by norn.ca.eu.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 128911655; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:18:01 -0700 (PDT) Content-Length: 1338 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199904222110.RAA10023@stiegl.niksun.com> Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:18:01 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: Chris Piazza From: Chris Piazza To: Andrew Heybey Subject: Re: SMP nerd toy report Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 22-Apr-99 Andrew Heybey wrote: >>>On Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:03:54 -0700 (PDT), Chris Piazza >>>said: > > cpiazza> Hmm... IMO that's not a very good speed, though it might > cpiazza> prove how I/O based buildworld is. My K6-2 300 (100mhz > cpiazza> FSB) with 96 megs of ram does a buildworld in 75-80 minutes > cpiazza> without any '-j' flags, and this is a single processor! > > Well, this is in part why I sent mail--I have no idea what is good or > not. I meant I'm a happy nerd more in the "look at my neat SMP toy" > as opposed to "look how fast buildworld runs". I do know that the > speed of make world is dependent to a large extent on the speed of > your disks and how many spindles you have. How many disks do you have > and where is your /usr/src and /usr/obj? > > At work I have a 450MHz PII with multiple 10000RPM SCSI disks, though > I have never actually timed make buildworld on it. I should. Understood, I use a single 5400 RPM UDMA Ide disk with the new ATA drivers - /usr/obj and /usr/src are on the same partition. I'm *extremely* pleased with this system as my P166 took over 4 hours(!). I'd be interested in seeing what a difference SCSI over IDE has in a buildworld. --- Chris Piazza Abbotsford, BC, Canada cpiazza@home.net finger norn@norn.ca.eu.org for PGP key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 15:24:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gizmo.internode.com.au (gizmo.internode.com.au [192.83.231.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC7AD14D74 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 15:24:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from newton@gizmo.internode.com.au) Received: (from newton@localhost) by gizmo.internode.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA77865; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 07:50:21 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from newton) From: Mark Newton Message-Id: <199904222220.HAA77865@gizmo.internode.com.au> Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug To: eischen@vigrid.com (Daniel Eischen) Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 07:50:21 +0930 (CST) Cc: dick@tar.com, luoqi@watermarkgroup.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au In-Reply-To: <199904221957.PAA24764@pcnet1.pcnet.com> from "Daniel Eischen" at Apr 22, 99 03:57:19 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Daniel Eischen wrote: > > If the threads > > are kernel threads, how do you communicate to the kernel which thread > > you're acting on if the threads are "anonymous" in userland? > > You still have thread IDs in userland, but you now add: > _lwp_kill, _lwp_setschedparam, etc, > system calls to control the kernel threads. Or maybe one big > _lwp_control... If you make the BSD API the same as the SysVR4 API it'll make emulating it really easy :-) lwp_info lwp_sema_wait lwp_sema_post lwp_sema_trywait lwp_create lwp_exit lwp_suspend lwp_continue lwp_kill lwp_self lwp_getprivate lwp_setprivate lwp_wait lwp_mutex_unlock lwp_mutex_lock lwp_cond_wait lwp_cond_signal lwp_cond_broadcast lwp_sigredirect lwp_alarm - mark ---- Mark Newton Email: newton@internode.com.au (W) Network Engineer Email: newton@atdot.dotat.org (H) Internode Systems Pty Ltd Desk: +61-8-82232999 "Network Man" - Anagram of "Mark Newton" Mobile: +61-416-202-223 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 16:30: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pcnet1.pcnet.com (pcnet1.pcnet.com [204.213.232.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14D3514C22 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 16:30:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eischen@vigrid.com) Received: (from eischen@localhost) by pcnet1.pcnet.com (8.8.7/PCNet) id TAA21462; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 19:26:54 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 19:26:54 -0400 (EDT) From: Daniel Eischen Message-Id: <199904222326.TAA21462@pcnet1.pcnet.com> To: eischen@vigrid.com, newton@internode.com.au Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug Cc: dick@tar.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, luoqi@watermarkgroup.com, peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Mark Newton wrote: > > You still have thread IDs in userland, but you now add: > > _lwp_kill, _lwp_setschedparam, etc, > > system calls to control the kernel threads. Or maybe one big > > _lwp_control... > > If you make the BSD API the same as the SysVR4 API it'll make emulating > it really easy :-) > > lwp_info > lwp_sema_wait > lwp_sema_post > lwp_sema_trywait > lwp_create > lwp_exit > lwp_suspend > lwp_continue > lwp_kill > lwp_self > lwp_getprivate > lwp_setprivate > lwp_wait > lwp_mutex_unlock > lwp_mutex_lock > lwp_cond_wait > lwp_cond_signal > lwp_cond_broadcast > lwp_sigredirect > lwp_alarm Seems like a good idea to me. But are these all system calls, or are some library routines? Having lwp_self be a system call doesn't seem optimal. Dan Eischen eischen@vigrid.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 16:51: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.54]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BDC91512D for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 16:50:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) id QAA11181 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 16:45:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sgk) From: Steve Kargl Message-Id: <199904222345.QAA11181@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Subject: revisiting Motif policy in ports To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 16:45:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL54 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hackers, I've submitted a port of the latest release from the Hungry Programmers of their LessTif effort. In testing, lesstif-0.88.1, I have compiled nedit, xmcd, amaya, xmaddressbook, llnlxdir, ddd, and few other items in the ports collection. These ports all work fairly well with 0.88.1. Although the Hungry Programmers will state that LessTif is still in a development stage, it seems to be an acceptable alternative if some one does not have Motif installed on their system. Thus, it may be time to revisit the policy of HAVE_MOTIF in /etc/make.conf. Currently, if HAVE_MOTIF is not defined, then the building of a port exits with a message like "ddd-3.1.3 requires motif". I think it might be appropriate to suggest that LessTif is a viable alternative. Opinions? -- Steve To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 16:57:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gizmo.internode.com.au (gizmo.internode.com.au [192.83.231.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A2B91512D for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 16:57:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from newton@gizmo.internode.com.au) Received: (from newton@localhost) by gizmo.internode.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA78068; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 09:23:38 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from newton) From: Mark Newton Message-Id: <199904222353.JAA78068@gizmo.internode.com.au> Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug To: eischen@vigrid.com (Daniel Eischen) Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 09:23:38 +0930 (CST) Cc: eischen@vigrid.com, newton@internode.com.au, dick@tar.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, luoqi@watermarkgroup.com, peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au In-Reply-To: <199904222326.TAA21462@pcnet1.pcnet.com> from "Daniel Eischen" at Apr 22, 99 07:26:54 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Daniel Eischen wrote: > Mark Newton wrote: > > > You still have thread IDs in userland, but you now add: > > > _lwp_kill, _lwp_setschedparam, etc, > > > system calls to control the kernel threads. Or maybe one big > > > _lwp_control... > > > > If you make the BSD API the same as the SysVR4 API it'll make emulating > > it really easy :-) [ list of SysVR4 syscalls deleted ] > Seems like a good idea to me. But are these all system calls, or are some > library routines? Having lwp_self be a system call doesn't seem optimal. They're all syscalls (or, at least, they all have syscall numbers reserved for them). - mark ---- Mark Newton Email: newton@internode.com.au (W) Network Engineer Email: newton@atdot.dotat.org (H) Internode Systems Pty Ltd Desk: +61-8-82232999 "Network Man" - Anagram of "Mark Newton" Mobile: +61-416-202-223 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 18:14: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp [133.34.17.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 030B915A04 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 18:13:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp) Received: from rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (8.9.3/3.7W-Naklab-2.1-19981120) with ESMTP id KAA19925; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 10:11:20 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <199904230111.KAA19925@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: Seigo TANIMURA Subject: Update to POST_NEWBUS: Voxware midi driver for serial ports From: Seigo TANIMURA In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 13 Apr 1999 15:48:54 +0900" References: <199904130648.PAA34093@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.70 on Emacs 19.34.1 / Mule 2.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 10:11:19 +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I have updated the patch to meet POST_NEWBUS on CURRENT. For those interested, please have a go to: http://www.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp/~tanimura/freebsd-serialmidi/ BTW, I have two questions to ask: 1. Has anybody been working on midi sequencer device under Luigi's sound driver framework? 2. Has anybody been working on new-bus for VoxWare? Seigo TANIMURA |M2, Nakagawa Lab, Dept of Electronics & CS =========================|Faculty of Engineering, Yokohama National Univ Powered by SIEMENS, |http://www.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp/~tanimura/ FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT |http://www.sakura.ne.jp/~tcarrot/ (10th Apr 1999) & muesli.|tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp tcarrot@sakuramail.com VoxWare Midi Driver for Serial Ports on FreeBSD: http://www.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp/~tanimura/freebsd-serialmidi/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 18:47:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail0.atl.bellsouth.net (mail0.atl.bellsouth.net [205.152.0.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E73FC14FD1 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 18:47:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wghicks@bellsouth.net) Received: from wghicks.bellsouth.net (host-209-214-66-221.atl.bellsouth.net [209.214.66.221]) by mail0.atl.bellsouth.net (8.8.8-spamdog/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA25396; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 21:44:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from wghicks (wghicks@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by wghicks.bellsouth.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id VAA74106; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 21:45:54 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net) Message-Id: <199904230145.VAA74106@bellsouth.net> To: Steve Kargl Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: revisiting Motif policy in ports In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 22 Apr 1999 16:45:49 PDT." <199904222345.QAA11181@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 21:45:54 -0400 From: W Gerald Hicks Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG How about a new DEPENDS_MOTIF (supplied by a port) which might build lesstif if HAVE_MOTIF is not set? I agree that lesstif has become useful. (former skeptic) Cheers, Jerry Hicks wghicks@bellsouth.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 18:58: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.dyn.ml.org (pm3-42.ppp.wenet.net [206.15.85.42]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1DFC14CF8 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 18:58:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garbanzo@hooked.net) Received: from localhost (garbanzo@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.dyn.ml.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id SAA02072; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 18:55:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garbanzo@hooked.net) Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 18:55:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex Zepeda To: Chris Piazza Cc: Andrew Heybey , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: SMP nerd toy report In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 22 Apr 1999, Chris Piazza wrote: > Understood, I use a single 5400 RPM UDMA Ide disk with the new ATA drivers - > /usr/obj and /usr/src are on the same partition. I'm *extremely* pleased with > this system as my P166 took over 4 hours(!). I'd be interested in seeing what > a difference SCSI over IDE has in a buildworld. I doubt that the question is SCSI v. IDE. I know with my P166, I had horribly cheap "fast" narrow Quantum drives (3.2gb and 640mb) hooked to an aic7880, and with the PII/450, I've got a 13gb IDE (UDMA2)drive. rm -rf of /usr/obj runs much quicker with the UDMA drive... Sure top-of-the-line SCSI drives probably max out at faster speeds than the top-of-the-line IDE drives, but I imagine with softupdates and separate IDE busses, one could create a non diskbound PII (under buildworld conditions). - alex To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 19: 3:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sol (cs1-gw.cs.binghamton.edu [128.226.171.72]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 34F9B14CF8 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 19:03:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu) Received: from localhost (zzhang@localhost) by sol (SMI-8.6/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA09045 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 21:50:51 -0400 Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 21:50:51 -0400 (EDT) From: Zhihui Zhang To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Source code dealing with raw I/O Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I am interested to know where in source code the raw I/O is handled. I guess that when you write something like open("/dev/r",flag) instead of open("/dev/",flag), raw I/O happens. Can anyone tell me which soure code files or routines handle RAW I/O? How to get the dev argument to a device read() routine like wdopen() in wd.c? Any help is appreciated. -------------------------------------------------- Zhihui Zhang. Please visit http://www.freebsd.org -------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 19: 8: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3718615019 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 19:08:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA00556; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 19:05:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904230205.TAA00556@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Alex Zepeda Cc: Chris Piazza , Andrew Heybey , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: SMP nerd toy report In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 22 Apr 1999 18:55:17 PDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 19:05:05 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I suspect that buildworld is mostly memory bound and not necessarily disk i/o bound unless you have a slow disk. > On Thu, 22 Apr 1999, Chris Piazza wrote: > > > Understood, I use a single 5400 RPM UDMA Ide disk with the new ATA drivers - > > /usr/obj and /usr/src are on the same partition. I'm *extremely* pleased with > > this system as my P166 took over 4 hours(!). I'd be interested in seeing what > > a difference SCSI over IDE has in a buildworld. > > I doubt that the question is SCSI v. IDE. I know with my P166, I had > horribly cheap "fast" narrow Quantum drives (3.2gb and 640mb) hooked to > an aic7880, and with the PII/450, I've got a 13gb IDE (UDMA2)drive. rm > -rf of /usr/obj runs much quicker with the UDMA drive... > > Sure top-of-the-line SCSI drives probably max out at faster speeds than > the top-of-the-line IDE drives, but I imagine with softupdates and > separate IDE busses, one could create a non diskbound PII (under > buildworld conditions). > > - alex > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 19:38:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lor.watermarkgroup.com (lor.watermarkgroup.com [207.202.73.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E9301548C for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 19:38:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luoqi@watermarkgroup.com) Received: (from luoqi@localhost) by lor.watermarkgroup.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA09957; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 22:35:46 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from luoqi) Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 22:35:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Luoqi Chen Message-Id: <199904230235.WAA09957@lor.watermarkgroup.com> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu Subject: Re: Source code dealing with raw I/O Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I am interested to know where in source code the raw I/O is handled. I > guess that when you write something like open("/dev/r",flag) instead > of open("/dev/",flag), raw I/O happens. Can anyone tell me which > soure code files or routines handle RAW I/O? How to get the dev argument > to a device read() routine like wdopen() in wd.c? > > Any help is appreciated. > > -------------------------------------------------- > Zhihui Zhang. Please visit http://www.freebsd.org > -------------------------------------------------- > kern/kern_physio.c -lq To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 21:25:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quackerjack.cc.vt.edu (quackerjack.cc.vt.edu [198.82.160.250]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C47214C59 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 21:25:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jobaldwi@vt.edu) Received: from sable.cc.vt.edu (sable.cc.vt.edu [128.173.16.30]) by quackerjack.cc.vt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA06806; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 00:22:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from john.baldwin.cx (jobaldwi.campus.vt.edu [198.82.67.63]) by sable.cc.vt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA07686; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 00:22:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199904222345.QAA11181@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 00:22:49 -0400 (EDT) From: John Baldwin To: Steve Kargl Subject: RE: revisiting Motif policy in ports Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG That's why I install LessTif and then edit /etc/make.conf to define HAVE_MOTIF as yes. No big deal there. What are you asking for? That the 'make install' portion of the port do that? On 22-Apr-99 Steve Kargl wrote: > Hackers, > > I've submitted a port of the latest release from the Hungry > Programmers of their LessTif effort. In testing, lesstif-0.88.1, > I have compiled nedit, xmcd, amaya, xmaddressbook, llnlxdir, ddd, > and few other items in the ports collection. These ports all > work fairly well with 0.88.1. Although the Hungry Programmers > will state that LessTif is still in a development stage, it seems > to be an acceptable alternative if some one does not have Motif > installed on their system. Thus, it may be time to revisit the > policy of HAVE_MOTIF in /etc/make.conf. > > Currently, if HAVE_MOTIF is not defined, then the building of > a port exits with a message like "ddd-3.1.3 requires motif". > I think it might be appropriate to suggest that LessTif is > a viable alternative. > > Opinions? > > -- > Steve > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message --- John Baldwin -- http://members.freedomnet.com/~jbaldwin/ PGP Key: http://members.freedomnet.com/~jbaldwin/pgpkey.asc "Power Users Use the Power to Serve!" - http://www.freebsd.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 21:27:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BADE14C59 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 21:27:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id AAA26019; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 00:24:38 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904230424.AAA26019@cs.rpi.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: crossd@cs.rpi.edu, schimken@cs.rpi.edu Subject: what are the possible causes of the following... Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 00:24:37 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In the logs for a machine: vm_fault: pager read error, pid 26656 (valtest) vm_page_free: freeing wired page Apr 22 20:40:00 monica /kernel: pid 26656 (valtest), uid 2436: exited on signal 11 ... ... Apr 22 21:11:32 monica routed .... panic: vm_page_unwire: invalid wire count: 0 It seems obvious the 3 messages are all tied together. What would cause the first (whihc is the apparent cause of the other, and the final panic). There is no mention anywhere in the logs of mechanical difficulties. The swap disk is a , DMA, 32-bit, multi-block-16>. (the other messages ahre there just to provide a time context for when this happened.) -- David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 21:34:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F103614C59 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 21:34:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id VAA19604; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 21:31:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 21:31:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904230431.VAA19604@apollo.backplane.com> To: "David E. Cross" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu, schimken@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: what are the possible causes of the following... References: <199904230424.AAA26019@cs.rpi.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :In the logs for a machine: :vm_fault: pager read error, pid 26656 (valtest) :vm_page_free: freeing wired page :Apr 22 20:40:00 monica /kernel: pid 26656 (valtest), uid 2436: exited on signal 11 :... :... :Apr 22 21:11:32 monica routed .... :panic: vm_page_unwire: invalid wire count: 0 : :It seems obvious the 3 messages are all tied together. What would cause the :first (whihc is the apparent cause of the other, and the final panic). :There is no mention anywhere in the logs of mechanical difficulties. The :swap disk is a , DMA, 32-bit, multi-block-16>. : :(the other messages ahre there just to provide a time context for when this :happened.) :-- :David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu :Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Where is the valtest binary? Over NFS? Did you compile up a new binary while a client was running the old one? This is the most typical cause of a pager read error. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 22:25:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.54]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B797F14FFB for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 22:25:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) id WAA64167; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 22:20:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sgk) From: Steve Kargl Message-Id: <199904230520.WAA64167@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Subject: Re: revisiting Motif policy in ports In-Reply-To: from John Baldwin at "Apr 23, 1999 00:22:49 am" To: jobaldwi@vt.edu (John Baldwin) Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 22:20:44 -0700 (PDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL54 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG John Baldwin wrote: > That's why I install LessTif and then edit /etc/make.conf to define HAVE_MOTIF > as yes. No big deal there. What are you asking for? That the 'make install' > portion of the port do that? No. If you don't have HAVE_MOTIF in /etc/make.conf, then you get: cd /usr/ports/editors/nedit make install nedit-5.0.2 requires motif. I think the last line should at least be changed to advertise the availability of LessTif. cd /usr/ports/editors/nedit make install nedit-5.0.2 requires motif. LessTif is a LGPL implementation of the Motif API. A port is available in ports/x11-toolkits/lesstif. See /etc/make.conf. If you want to get fancy, then one could do .if !exists(${PREFIX}/lib/libXm.so) && !defined(HAVE_MOTIF) Go build lesstif and install Set HAVE_MOTIF in the environment. .endif Continue with the building of nedit. Echo 'You should set HAVE_MOTIF in /etc/make.conf' This fancy one requires some thought because you don't want to blow away a valid Motif installation. > > On 22-Apr-99 Steve Kargl wrote: > > Hackers, > > > > I've submitted a port of the latest release from the Hungry > > Programmers of their LessTif effort. In testing, lesstif-0.88.1, > > I have compiled nedit, xmcd, amaya, xmaddressbook, llnlxdir, ddd, > > and few other items in the ports collection. These ports all > > work fairly well with 0.88.1. Although the Hungry Programmers > > will state that LessTif is still in a development stage, it seems > > to be an acceptable alternative if some one does not have Motif > > installed on their system. Thus, it may be time to revisit the > > policy of HAVE_MOTIF in /etc/make.conf. > > > > Currently, if HAVE_MOTIF is not defined, then the building of > > a port exits with a message like "ddd-3.1.3 requires motif". > > I think it might be appropriate to suggest that LessTif is > > a viable alternative. > > > > Opinions? > > > > -- > > Steve > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > --- > > John Baldwin -- http://members.freedomnet.com/~jbaldwin/ > PGP Key: http://members.freedomnet.com/~jbaldwin/pgpkey.asc > "Power Users Use the Power to Serve!" - http://www.freebsd.org > -- Steve To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 23:36: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from thneed.ubergeeks.com (thneed.ubergeeks.com [206.205.41.245]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0AC415A4F for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 23:35:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adrian@ubergeeks.com) Received: from localhost (adrian@localhost) by thneed.ubergeeks.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id CAA03618; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 02:32:18 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from adrian@ubergeeks.com) X-Authentication-Warning: thneed.ubergeeks.com: adrian owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 02:32:18 -0400 (EDT) From: Adrian Filipi-Martin Reply-To: Adrian Filipi-Martin To: W Gerald Hicks Cc: Steve Kargl , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: revisiting Motif policy in ports In-Reply-To: <199904230145.VAA74106@bellsouth.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 22 Apr 1999, W Gerald Hicks wrote: > How about a new DEPENDS_MOTIF (supplied by a port) which might > build Lesstif if HAVE_MOTIF is not set? > > I agree that Lesstif has become useful. (former skeptic) Maybe something a little more flexible. How about replacing REQUIRES_MOTIF with MOTIF_REQUIREMENTS and use the values MOTIF and LESSTIF. Then in the make.conf the users could define HAVE_MOTIF and/or HAVE_LESSTIF as necessary. What I'm getting at here is if Lesstif is a weaker version of Motif that may not work for every package, we should treat the requirements as ranging from strong (true Motif) to weak (works with Lesstif). Of course no one's going to test everything with Lesstif immediately. But as packages are known to work well enough, the requirements can be relaxed. Adrian -- [ adrian@ubergeeks.com -- Ubergeeks Consulting -- http://www.ubergeeks.com/ ] To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 23:43:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (spinner.netplex.com.au [202.12.86.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C566115A49 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 23:43:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) Received: from netplex.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spinner.netplex.com.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B0DA1F49; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 14:40:51 +0800 (WST) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Luoqi Chen Cc: peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:48:02 -0400." <199904221848.OAA06740@lor.watermarkgroup.com> Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 14:40:51 +0800 From: Peter Wemm Message-Id: <19990423064055.6B0DA1F49@spinner.netplex.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Luoqi Chen wrote: > I've been thinking about a more drastic one, store the same PID in the > threads' proc structure. PID is no more than a name of a process in the > userland, and in userland we see all the threads as the same process. > I don't think we really need a thread id, the threads are anonymous. > Inside the kernel, the threads or processes are still named by their > (struct proc *) pointer, so there won't be any confusion. selwakeup() is keyed from pid, not 'struct proc *' and is rather dependent on these being unique... Cheers, -Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 22 23:56:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3372D14E65 for ; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 23:56:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id PAA02884; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 15:46:15 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <371FB41B.B4B7A375@newsguy.com> Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 08:43:23 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Gianmarco Giovannelli Cc: Gianmarco Giovannelli , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Uox, Linux emul and missing things. References: <4.1.19990422133009.00b95d10@194.184.65.4> <4.1.19990422213220.00a1bf00@194.184.65.4> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Gianmarco Giovannelli wrote: > > At 02.19 23/04/99 +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > > >FreeBSD defaults to signal floating point exceptions in case of > >overflow and things like that. Linux, I take it, does not. > > > >Short of correcting the program, I think there is a system wide > >setting to turn off floating point exceptions. > > :-) can you input more verbosely ? Like in, explaining what to do? :-) I don't know how to change the setting, I'm not even 100% sure it exists. Try listing sysctls. -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "Well, Windows works, using a loose definition of 'works'..." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 0:23:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C1A0114E0C for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 00:23:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA03471; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 08:25:56 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 08:25:56 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Cc: Gianmarco Giovannelli , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Uox, Linux emul and missing things. In-Reply-To: <371F5A3E.7CB87A4E@newsguy.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 23 Apr 1999, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > Gianmarco Giovannelli wrote: > > > > It compile and seems to work. But it's not true... it crashes after a few > > seconds (technically when spawn some NPC :-) > > > > UOX3: Startup Complete. > > UOX3: Client 0 connected [Total:1]. > > UOX3: Client 1 connected [Total:2]. > > UOX3: Client 0 disconnected. [Total:1] > > Floating exception (core dumped) > > FreeBSD defaults to signal floating point exceptions in case of > overflow and things like that. Linux, I take it, does not. > > Short of correcting the program, I think there is a system wide > setting to turn off floating point exceptions. FreeBSD/i386 signals exceptions for these conditions but FreeBSD/alpha doesn't (to be compatible with OSF1). I think they should be disabled on i386 too (we have an api for enabling them for people that really want them). Perhaps a sysctl for a global preference. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 0:27:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64A981517D for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 00:27:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA03479; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 08:31:13 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 08:31:13 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Seigo TANIMURA Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Update to POST_NEWBUS: Voxware midi driver for serial ports In-Reply-To: <199904230111.KAA19925@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 23 Apr 1999, Seigo TANIMURA wrote: > I have updated the patch to meet POST_NEWBUS on CURRENT. > For those interested, please have a go to: > > http://www.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp/~tanimura/freebsd-serialmidi/ > > > BTW, I have two questions to ask: > > 1. Has anybody been working on midi sequencer device under Luigi's > sound driver framework? I don't know. > > 2. Has anybody been working on new-bus for VoxWare? I will probably re-work the probe and attach methods to new-bus when I do new-bus isapnp support. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 2:59:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail1.relcom.ru (mail1.relcom.ru [193.125.153.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 349A014D31 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 02:59:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from voux@iname.com) Received: from voux.pp.relcom.ru (voux.pp.relcom.ru [193.125.20.103]) by mail1.relcom.ru (8.8.8/Relcom-2A) with ESMTP id NAA18592 for ;Fri, 23 Apr 1999 13:24:40 +0400 (MSD) Received: by hedgehog.shadow.net (Postfix, from userid 1001) id BF99842582; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 13:22:34 +0400 (MSD) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hedgehog.shadow.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B84393C688 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 13:22:34 +0400 (MSD) Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 13:22:34 +0400 (MSD) From: voux X-Sender: voux@localhost To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: url. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Good day, My friend have told me that here was an url about security for newbie users. I need to do something like "howto make basic security for your box?" page on my web for unix users. So, can anybody here send it to me ? (Sorry for offtopic). To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 3:56:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B89A151F3 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 03:56:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id GAA12216 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 06:10:36 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 06:10:34 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: where is the spec for rpc.lockd Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG is there anything to base rpc.lockd and the mechanism for NFS locking on? Anyone have any URLs or literature to recommend? thanks, -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 6:39:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from idefix.omnix.net (idefix.omnix.net [195.154.168.68]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 15D0F152F9 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 06:39:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from didier@omnix.net) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by idefix.omnix.net (8.9.1/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA03198 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 16:37:20 +0200 (CEST) Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 16:37:19 +0200 (CEST) From: Didier Derny X-Sender: didier@idefix To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: large shared memory (increasing kvm) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hi, for the SQL server, I need a large shared memory (SHMMAXPGS=9216) I have maxusers = 512 the memory is actually of 256Mb and will be increased to 1Gb the kernel is still a.out [I have no possibility to stop the machine to upgrade to 3.1-RELEASE or 3.1-STABLE (upgrade planned in july/august)] (I'm running FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE on a dual pentium II machine [ASUS P2B mother board] everything works just fine except that we need to largely increase the shared memories and the semaphores]) is VM_KMEM_SIZE working with FreeBSD-3.0-RELEASE ? what value would you suggest ? thanks for your help ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Didier Derny | FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT Site Email: didier@omnix.net | Microsoft Free Computer. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 8:39:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gatekeeper.iserver.com (gatekeeper.iserver.com [192.41.0.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2CF9614D03 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 08:39:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gritton@iserver.com) Received: by gatekeeper.iserver.com; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 09:36:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from unknown(192.168.1.110) by gatekeeper.iserver.com via smap (V3.1.1) id xma019471; Fri, 23 Apr 99 09:36:26 -0600 Received: by guppy.orem.iserver.com; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 09:36:22 -0600 (MDT) From: jamie@gritton.org (James Gritton) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: revisiting Motif policy in ports References: Date: 23 Apr 1999 09:36:22 -0600 In-Reply-To: Adrian Filipi-Martin's message of "Fri, 23 Apr 1999 02:32:18 -0400 (EDT)" Message-ID: Lines: 16 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 20.3 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Maybe something a little more flexible. How about replacing > REQUIRES_MOTIF with MOTIF_REQUIREMENTS and use the values MOTIF and > LESSTIF. Then in the make.conf the users could define HAVE_MOTIF and/or > HAVE_LESSTIF as necessary. This would be useful not only to tag the (few and getting fewer) programs that work with Motif and not Lesstif, but also to note which version of Motif is required. There are programs that require at least Motif 1.2, 2.0, or 2.1 (and some that need 2.0 and not 2.1, thanks OSF). So how about some MOTIF_VERSION or somesuch. Lesstif can be version 0, not because it's "weaker", but simply to acknowlege that's Lesstif's version. - Jamie Gritton jamie@gritton.org gritton@lesstif.org (OK, so I'm biased). To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 9:40:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4CEF154F0 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 09:40:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id BAA03489; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 01:37:54 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <3720A168.2A8A8975@newsguy.com> Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 01:35:52 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: cvsweb.cgi Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Who is responsible for that thing? Could we have tags on Submitted by lines? -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "Well, Windows works, using a loose definition of 'works'..." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 9:50: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-gw1adm.rcsntx.swbell.net (mail-gw1.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.51]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F06414D32 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 09:49:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chris@holly.dyndns.org) Received: from holly.dyndns.org (ppp-207-193-10-190.hstntx.swbell.net [207.193.10.190]) by mail-gw1adm.rcsntx.swbell.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA06002; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 11:47:18 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from chris@localhost) by holly.dyndns.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA03034; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 11:48:02 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from chris) Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 11:48:00 -0500 From: Chris Costello To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cvsweb.cgi Message-ID: <19990423114759.A2974@holly.dyndns.org> Reply-To: chris@calldei.com References: <3720A168.2A8A8975@newsguy.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=wac7ysb48OaltWcw; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature" User-Agent: Mutt/0.96.1i In-Reply-To: <3720A168.2A8A8975@newsguy.com>; from Daniel C. Sobral on Sat, Apr 24, 1999 at 01:35:52AM +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --wac7ysb48OaltWcw Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Apr 23, 1999, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > Who is responsible for that thing? Could we have tags on > Submitted by lines? #!/usr/bin/perl -s # # cvsweb - a CGI interface to the CVS tree. # # Written by Bill Fenner on his # own time. >=20 > -- > Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) > dcs@newsguy.com > dcs@freebsd.org >=20 > "Well, Windows works, using a loose definition of 'works'..." >=20 >=20 > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message >=20 --=20 Chris Costello In the long run, every program becomes rococco, and then rubble. - Alan Pe= rlis --wac7ysb48OaltWcw Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQB1AwUBNyCkPrfyXY/Dmk2NAQERlQL/fbpaqyms0QQRE6MG9J3sJzYw3YGY0ywV muSsbk/Z53+kIFWWW1FM6TXjeBURp3R26W5qsdsS7mYvWcsYvY5ySZsmqU6tV4Pn 90CGEmHXnRmQ9Sb+0z6sN5QZ1oRCBFKo =kICn -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --wac7ysb48OaltWcw-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 10: 1:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from arjun.niksun.com (gw.niksun.com [206.20.52.122]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC33D14C05 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 10:01:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ath@niksun.com) Received: from stiegl.niksun.com (stiegl.niksun.com [10.0.0.44]) by arjun.niksun.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA09453; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 12:58:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from stiegl.niksun.com (localhost.niksun.com [127.0.0.1]) by stiegl.niksun.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA13662; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 12:58:44 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from ath@stiegl.niksun.com) Message-Id: <199904231658.MAA13662@stiegl.niksun.com> From: Andrew Heybey To: Amancio Hasty Cc: Alex Zepeda , Chris Piazza , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: SMP nerd toy report In-reply-to: Your message of Thu, 22 Apr 1999 19:05:05 -0700. <199904230205.TAA00556@rah.star-gate.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 7.108) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 12:58:44 -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hasty> I suspect that buildworld is mostly memory bound and not hasty> necessarily disk i/o bound unless you have a slow disk. >> On Thu, 22 Apr 1999, Chris Piazza wrote: >> >> > Understood, I use a single 5400 RPM UDMA Ide disk with the new >> ATA drivers - > /usr/obj and /usr/src are on the same partition. >> I'm *extremely* pleased with > this system as my P166 took over 4 >> hours(!). I'd be interested in seeing what > a difference SCSI >> over IDE has in a buildworld. >> >> I doubt that the question is SCSI v. IDE. I know with my P166, I >> had horribly cheap "fast" narrow Quantum drives (3.2gb and 640mb) >> hooked to an aic7880, and with the PII/450, I've got a 13gb IDE >> (UDMA2)drive. rm -rf of /usr/obj runs much quicker with the UDMA >> drive... >> >> Sure top-of-the-line SCSI drives probably max out at faster >> speeds than the top-of-the-line IDE drives, but I imagine with >> softupdates and separate IDE busses, one could create a non >> diskbound PII (under buildworld conditions). >> >> - alex >> >> >> >> To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with >> "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message Well, I tried a couple of "make buildworld" on a single-processor P-II 450, 256MB ram, /usr/src and /usr/obj on separate 10000RPM IBM scsi disks, softupdates. This is a build with an empty /usr/obj. No changes to /etc/make.conf except CFLAGS="-O -pipe". The OS is 3.1-STABLE as of 03/21/1999. Took about 1:15 (tried one with -j4 and one with -j8--no difference). This is about the same as my dual celeron 300A (at 300MHz/66MHz FSB) with a *single* IDE drive and 64MB of memory. I expected it to be faster presuming that the build is IO or memory bound (faster disks (or at least two spindles) and faster memory). This system is building 3.1-RELEASE if that makes a difference. It is noticably slower than my dual celery at 450 MHz/100MHz FSB (about 0:55), which seems to say that CPU does have something to do with it. So what conclusions can I draw? Softupdates schedules the disk so well as to negate the effect of an extra spindle? buildworld is at least partially CPU bound? 3.1-RELEASE takes less to build than 3.1-STABLE (as of 03/21/1999)? (I didn't think there were any major new chunks added but I could be wrong.) andrew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 10:58:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from atlrel1.hp.com (atlrel1.hp.com [156.153.255.210]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58D7715491 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 10:58:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from darrylo@sr.hp.com) Received: from srmail.sr.hp.com (srmail.sr.hp.com [15.4.45.14]) by atlrel1.hp.com (8.8.6 (PHNE_17135)/8.8.5tis) with ESMTP id NAA09999; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 13:55:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mina.sr.hp.com by srmail.sr.hp.com with ESMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA145240139; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 10:55:39 -0700 Received: from localhost (darrylo@mina.sr.hp.com [15.4.42.247]) by mina.sr.hp.com with ESMTP (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.7.3 TIS 5.0) id KAA27714; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 10:55:38 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904231755.KAA27714@mina.sr.hp.com> To: Andrew Heybey Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: SMP nerd toy report Reply-To: Darryl Okahata In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 22 Apr 1999 17:10:07 EDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 1.1.1.1) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 10:55:38 -0700 From: Darryl Okahata Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Andrew Heybey wrote: > Well, this is in part why I sent mail--I have no idea what is good or > not. I meant I'm a happy nerd more in the "look at my neat SMP toy" > as opposed to "look how fast buildworld runs". I do know that the > speed of make world is dependent to a large extent on the speed of > your disks and how many spindles you have. How many disks do you have > and where is your /usr/src and /usr/obj? Also note that, with SMP and Celerons, the 66MHz FSB may be an issue. If Amancio is right, and buildworld is memory bound, then a 100MHz FSB may give a noticeable improvement. [ I should try to write a benchmark that tests memory contention and SMP. I've got a similar system to yours, except that I've got striped SCSI disks. I've never done a buildworld; perhaps it's time I did. ] -- Darryl Okahata darrylo@sr.hp.com DISCLAIMER: this message is the author's personal opinion and does not constitute the support, opinion, or policy of Hewlett-Packard, or of the little green men that have been following him all day. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 11:10:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D938E14D74 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 11:10:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id LAA23991; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 11:08:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 11:08:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904231808.LAA23991@apollo.backplane.com> To: Andrew Heybey Cc: Amancio Hasty , Alex Zepeda , Chris Piazza , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: SMP nerd toy report References: <199904231658.MAA13662@stiegl.niksun.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Well, I tried a couple of "make buildworld" on a single-processor P-II :450, 256MB ram, /usr/src and /usr/obj on separate 10000RPM IBM scsi :disks, softupdates. This is a build with an empty /usr/obj. No :changes to /etc/make.conf except CFLAGS="-O -pipe". The OS :is 3.1-STABLE as of 03/21/1999. : :Took about 1:15 (tried one with -j4 and one with -j8--no difference). :This is about the same as my dual celeron 300A (at 300MHz/66MHz FSB) :with a *single* IDE drive and 64MB of memory. I expected it to be :faster presuming that the build is IO or memory bound (faster disks :(or at least two spindles) and faster memory). This system is :building 3.1-RELEASE if that makes a difference. : :It is noticably slower than my dual celery at 450 MHz/100MHz FSB :(about 0:55), which seems to say that CPU does have something to do :with it. : :So what conclusions can I draw? Softupdates schedules the disk so :well as to negate the effect of an extra spindle? buildworld is at :least partially CPU bound? 3.1-RELEASE takes less to build than :3.1-STABLE (as of 03/21/1999)? (I didn't think there were any major :new chunks added but I could be wrong.) : :andrew Also, buildworld doesn't parallelize as well as it could. There are so many small programs that one processor is often idle while the otherone is doing a link. I only get 150% cpu utilization even with the entire contents of the disk cached. The 1:15 makes sense verses 50 minutes for my duel-PIII/450. 150% of 50 is 50+25 = 1:15. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 11:53: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FC0914FE2 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 11:53:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA04040; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 11:50:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904231850.LAA04040@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Andrew Heybey Cc: Alex Zepeda , Chris Piazza , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: SMP nerd toy report In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 23 Apr 1999 12:58:44 EDT." <199904231658.MAA13662@stiegl.niksun.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 11:50:05 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I would just run top and periodiacally observe the system to see if there is noticeable idle time if there isn't then the system is either cpu or memory i/o bound. -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 12:48:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from poboxer.pobox.com (unknown [208.149.16.22]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7ACCC14D6D for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 12:48:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from alk@poboxer.pobox.com) Received: (from alk@localhost) by poboxer.pobox.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id OAA09571; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 14:44:13 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from alk) From: Anthony Kimball MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 14:44:13 -0500 (CDT) X-Face: \h9Jg:Cuivl4S*UP-)gO.6O=T]]@ncM*tn4zG);)lk#4|lqEx=*talx?.Gk,dMQU2)ptPC17cpBzm(l'M|H8BUF1&]dDCxZ.c~Wy6-j,^V1E(NtX$FpkkdnJixsJHE95JlhO 5\M3jh'YiO7KPCn0~W`Ro44_TB@&JuuqRqgPL'0/{):7rU-%.*@/>q?1&Ed Reply-To: alk@pobox.com To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: signal permissions X-Mailer: VM 6.43 under 20.4 "Emerald" XEmacs Lucid Message-ID: <14112.52532.671480.997467@avalon.east> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Here's a trial balloon: Anyone who can write to an executable file should be permitted to signal a derived process. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 12:52:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gargoyle.bazzle.com (gargoyle.bazzle.com [206.103.246.189]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D8CC315070 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 12:52:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ejc@bazzle.com) Received: (qmail 50390 invoked from network); 23 Apr 1999 19:49:35 -0000 Received: from gargoyle.bazzle.com (206.103.246.189) by gargoyle.bazzle.com with SMTP; 23 Apr 1999 19:49:35 -0000 Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 15:49:35 -0400 (EDT) From: "Eric J. Chet" To: Chris Piazza Cc: Andrew Heybey , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: SMP nerd toy report In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 22 Apr 1999, Chris Piazza wrote: > On 22-Apr-99 Andrew Heybey wrote: > > > I have been very pleased with it so far. I installed 3.1-RELEASE for > > now. At 300MHz (66MHz FSB), my worldstone (CFLAGS="-O -pipe", > > make -j8 buildworld, softupdates, /usr/src & /usr/obj on the same > > partition of a Maxtor IDE disk) is about 1:15. > > > > At 450MHz (100MHz FSB) "make -j8 buildworld" takes about 0:55. (I > > know, bad hacker. I promise not to submit any PRs unless they can be > > duplicated at 300MHz.) I expect that if I got a second disk for > > /usr/obj that the build would really fly. > > > > All in all, I'm a happy nerd. > > > Hmm... IMO that's not a very good speed, though it might prove how I/O based > buildworld is. My K6-2 300 (100mhz FSB) with 96 megs of ram does a buildworld > in 75-80 minutes without any '-j' flags, and this is a single processor! > Hello A $70 celeron 300A clocked at 450Mhz and 100Mhz FSB, 128MB RAM. buildworld as of 4/22 takes 50 minutes. ejc To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 13:17:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sun-sparc1.infoglobe.com (mail.infoglobe.com [38.216.162.162]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 61254153D0 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 13:17:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jhermes@infoglobe.com) Received: from kenny ([38.216.162.189]) by sun-sparc1.infoglobe.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 560-34435U100L100S0) with SMTP id AAA6369 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 16:12:29 -0400 Message-ID: <00fa01be8dc5$ba1a6bc0$bda2d826@kenny.infoglobe.com> From: "John S. Hermes" To: Subject: Re: signal permissions Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 16:13:17 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG -----Original Message----- From: Anthony Kimball To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Friday, April 23, 1999 3:43 PM Subject: signal permissions > >Here's a trial balloon: Anyone who can write to an executable file >should be permitted to signal a derived process. > I dunno, I like to keep process space (who it runs as) separate from file space (how it exists). Implied permissions from one space being applied to another always reduces flexibility, right? John Hermes jhermes@infoglobe.com Infoglobe, Inc. (937) 225-9999 x317 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 13:47:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-out2.apple.com (mail-out2.apple.com [17.254.0.51]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CC8615520 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 13:47:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from conrad@apple.com) Received: from mailgate2.apple.com ([17.129.100.225]) by mail-out2.apple.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA06632 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 13:35:36 -0700 Received: from scv3.apple.com (scv3.apple.com) by mailgate2.apple.com (mailgate2.apple.com- SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 13:35:31 -0700 Received: from [17.202.43.185] (wa.apple.com [17.202.43.185]) by scv3.apple.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA32016; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 13:35:30 -0700 X-Sender: conrad@mail.apple.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 13:35:28 -0700 To: Alfred Perlstein , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: Conrad Minshall Subject: Re: where is the spec for rpc.lockd Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 4:10 AM -0700 4/23/99, Alfred Perlstein wrote: >is there anything to base rpc.lockd and the mechanism for NFS locking on? > >Anyone have any URLs or literature to recommend? The reference I always see given for the nfs lock manager protocol is a 1991 document from X/Open (now Open Group). The title is "X/Open CAE Specification: Protocols for X/Open Internetworking: XNFS" and you can view and/or buy it at http://www.opengroup.org/pubs/catalog/c702.htm -- Conrad Minshall ... conrad@apple.com ... 408 974-2749 Apple Computer ... Mac OS X Core Operating Systems ... Filesystems & Kernel Alternative email address: rad@acm.org. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 13:48: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp1.xs4all.nl (smtp1.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.51]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97D2D15A33 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 13:48:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from plm@smtp1.xs4all.nl) Received: from localhost. (dc2-isdn1998.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.155.206]) by smtp1.xs4all.nl (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA25715 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 22:45:29 +0200 (CEST) Received: (from plm@localhost) by localhost. (8.9.3/8.9.1) id WAA00568; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 22:45:29 +0200 (MET DST) (envelope-from plm) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: How can I get FreeBSD's CVSROOT? From: Peter Mutsaers Date: 23 Apr 1999 22:28:28 +0200 Message-ID: <87n1zz3wur.fsf@muon.xs4all.nl> X-Mailer: Gnus v5.6.45/Emacs 20.3 Lines: 13 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello, I'd like to get FreeBSD's CVSROOT, mainly to see how those nice cvs commit messages are produced (assuming it's in there). I'd like to use the same for my job where we just switched from SCCS to CVS. Thanks, -- Peter Mutsaers | Abcoude (Utrecht), | Trust me, I know plm@xs4all.nl | the Netherlands | what I'm doing. ---------------+---------------------+------------------ Running FreeBSD-current UNIX. See http://www.freebsd.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 13:57:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hp9000.chc-chimes.com (hp9000.chc-chimes.com [206.67.97.84]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECC44154E2 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 13:57:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from billf@chc-chimes.com) Received: from localhost by hp9000.chc-chimes.com with SMTP (1.39.111.2/16.2) id AA161815670; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 12:41:10 -0400 Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 12:41:10 -0400 (EDT) From: Bill Fumerola To: Peter Mutsaers Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How can I get FreeBSD's CVSROOT? In-Reply-To: <87n1zz3wur.fsf@muon.xs4all.nl> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 23 Apr 1999, Peter Mutsaers wrote: > I'd like to get FreeBSD's CVSROOT, mainly to see how those nice cvs > commit messages are produced (assuming it's in there). I'd like to use > the same for my job where we just switched from SCCS to CVS. Of course it's in the tree. :> http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/CVSROOT/log_accum.pl - bill fumerola - billf@chc-chimes.com - BF1560 - computer horizons corp - - ph:(800) 252-2421 - bfumerol@computerhorizons.com - billf@FreeBSD.org - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 15: 4:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hawaii.conterra.com (hawaii.conterra.com [209.12.164.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BB3914F1C for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 15:04:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from myself@conterra.com) Received: from dmaddox.conterra.com (myself@dmaddox.conterra.com [209.12.169.48]) by hawaii.conterra.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA13983; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 18:02:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from myself@localhost) by dmaddox.conterra.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id SAA01898; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 18:01:43 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from myself) Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 18:01:42 -0400 From: "Donald J . Maddox" To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Cc: Gianmarco Giovannelli , Gianmarco Giovannelli , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Uox, Linux emul and missing things. Message-ID: <19990423180142.B435@dmaddox.conterra.com> Reply-To: dmaddox@conterra.com References: <4.1.19990422133009.00b95d10@194.184.65.4> <4.1.19990422213220.00a1bf00@194.184.65.4> <371FB41B.B4B7A375@newsguy.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <371FB41B.B4B7A375@newsguy.com>; from Daniel C. Sobral on Fri, Apr 23, 1999 at 08:43:23AM +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Apr 23, 1999 at 08:43:23AM +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > Gianmarco Giovannelli wrote: > > > > At 02.19 23/04/99 +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > > > > >FreeBSD defaults to signal floating point exceptions in case of > > >overflow and things like that. Linux, I take it, does not. > > > > > >Short of correcting the program, I think there is a system wide > > >setting to turn off floating point exceptions. > > > > :-) can you input more verbosely ? > > Like in, explaining what to do? :-) I don't know how to change the > setting, I'm not even 100% sure it exists. Try listing sysctls. If you really want to do this globally, try this patch to src/sys/i386/include/npx.h: --- npx.h.orig Sun Jul 20 07:06:44 1997 +++ npx.h Fri Jan 15 22:42:23 1999 @@ -142,5 +142,6 @@ void npxinit __P((int control)); void npxsave __P((struct save87 *addr)); #endif - +#undef __INITIAL_NPXCW__ +#define __INITIAL_NPXCW__ __BETTER_BDE_NPXCW__ #endif /* !_MACHINE_NPX_H_ */ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 15:26:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (castles539.castles.com [208.214.165.103]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 200B31557E for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 15:25:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA00635; Thu, 22 Apr 1999 19:15:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904230215.TAA00635@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Luoqi Chen Cc: dick@tar.com, jplevyak@inktomi.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 20 Apr 1999 17:19:57 EDT." <199904202119.RAA17889@lor.watermarkgroup.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 19:15:02 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > No, this is not an issue of separate task and thread structures. You may > have the same problem for two separate processes that share file descriptor > table, and john's fix would not work for this case. The correct solution > to this problem (in my opinion) is to clear all POSIX locks upon closure > of a file descriptor, which requires we keep in the file descriptor table > a list of procs that reference it. Hmm. We seem to need some better process/resource affinity tracking. I've just recently been looking at some code that wants for a callout on process exit; rather than adding yet more code to the process exit path it'd be nice to have a callout list for process events (fork, exit, etc.) More to think about I guess. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 16:51:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (castles539.castles.com [208.214.165.103]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 807A614CF5 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 16:51:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (LOCALHOST [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA01772; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 16:48:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904232348.QAA01772@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "Joachim Isaksson" Cc: "Warner Losh" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Generic PnP? (Was: Re: IrDA? PnP?) In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 22 Apr 1999 19:02:19 +0200." <00ae01be8ce1$e2f686d0$8cbc2dc1@ibfs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 16:48:15 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > : 4) As I (so far) understand it, the PnP functionality is a special "hack" > > : for the ISA bus right now and could not easily be extended to integrate PnP > > : devices on the IrDA bus? Is this assumption correct? If so, is anyone > > > > Yes. PnP is too generic a term to have generic code. PCI pnp and > > parallel port PnP are both radically different than isa pnp or serial > > port pnp. > > Well, in the kernel I agree that it would be hard to use generic code, but does > it have to be as tough as it is now for userland to do something intelligent, > really? > > For example, if the PCI, ISA, USB and sio drivers know how to plug and play > devices connected to "their bus" and export collected info through a common > device (for example /dev/pnp0), a userland process would easily load and unload > kernel modules as needed without knowing the bus PnP specifics. This model would > rather easily integrate IrDA PnP too. > > I can't see that this would be very hard to implement, but then I'm not a kernel > guru (yet :-) It's not a question of "hard" so much as "useful". -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 17:24:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C367B14CBB for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 17:24:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA69155; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 20:21:37 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 20:21:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: "Donald J . Maddox" Cc: "Daniel C. Sobral" , Gianmarco Giovannelli , Gianmarco Giovannelli , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Uox, Linux emul and missing things. In-Reply-To: <19990423180142.B435@dmaddox.conterra.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 23 Apr 1999, Donald J . Maddox wrote: > On Fri, Apr 23, 1999 at 08:43:23AM +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > > Gianmarco Giovannelli wrote: > > > > > > At 02.19 23/04/99 +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > > > > > > >FreeBSD defaults to signal floating point exceptions in case of > > > >overflow and things like that. Linux, I take it, does not. > > > > > > > >Short of correcting the program, I think there is a system wide > > > >setting to turn off floating point exceptions. > > > > > > :-) can you input more verbosely ? > > > > Like in, explaining what to do? :-) I don't know how to change the > > setting, I'm not even 100% sure it exists. Try listing sysctls. > > If you really want to do this globally, try this patch to > src/sys/i386/include/npx.h: > > --- npx.h.orig Sun Jul 20 07:06:44 1997 > +++ npx.h Fri Jan 15 22:42:23 1999 > @@ -142,5 +142,6 @@ > void npxinit __P((int control)); > void npxsave __P((struct save87 *addr)); > #endif > - > +#undef __INITIAL_NPXCW__ > +#define __INITIAL_NPXCW__ __BETTER_BDE_NPXCW__ > #endif /* !_MACHINE_NPX_H_ */ Actually, I'd like a sysctl of machdep.npxcw, as most others probably would. And the INITAL to be BDE's, too. > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \ _ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___)___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 18:39:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2774A14E00 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 18:39:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA02261; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 20:53:32 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 20:53:30 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Ivan Samuelson Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: help? Re: Installing FreeBSD 3.1 on HP Vectra VL 6 Series 7 DT In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 23 Apr 1999, Ivan Samuelson wrote: > On Fri, 23 Apr 1999, Alfred Perlstein wrote: > > > On Fri, 23 Apr 1999, Ivan Samuelson wrote: > > > > > I'm trying to install FreeBSD 3.1 onto an HP Vectra VL 6/266 Series 7 DT > > > PC. It's a PII-233 with 32 megs of memory, 4 gig IDE harddrive, a Cirrus Logic > > > 546X video card (AGP), Diamond Monster 3D card, SMC EtherEZ (8416) ethernet > > > card, Aztech 23230 Compatible PnP Audio card (came with machine), Matshita > > > CD-ROM CR-588 (IDE) and a Phoenix BIOS 6.0.0 > > > > > > I can boot the Kernel floppy with no problem. When I insert the MFS root floppy > > > and hit enter, I get the following dump: > > > > > > int=0000000e eir=00000004 efl=00030246 eip=000020da > > > eax=00002001 ebx=00000000 ecx=0000df07 edx=000003f5 > > > esi=0000a6fc edi=0000a6fc ebp=000003da esp=000003d0 > > > cs=ebfa ds=0040 fs=0000 gs=0000 ss=9db7 > > > cs:eip=8a 64 0a 8a c4 d0 e4 c0-e8 02 02 e0 b0 ff 2a c4 > > > ss:esp=00 f0 fd 20 ca 28 31 25-fc a6 00 00 fe 9d fc a6 > > > System Halted > > > > Could you format the disks again, or use different floppies and > > try again? Most really weird booth problems are caused by bad > > floppies. > > > > Then just use "fdimage.exe" to make the floppies again. (It seems > > that Linux's 'dd' doesn't make for good boot floppies.) > > > > If this doesn't help, then please post again we'd love to help. > > I've reformatted them again (three times) and they still don't work on the PII > VL. But, as I stated in my post, they work on other machines (not Vectra VLs), > so I know this is not the problem. > > I've downloaded the 2.2.8 release and it boots fine on the VL, so I'm pretty > sure it's a VL problem with FreeBSD... Hmmm, not a good thing, I'm cc'ing a -hackers where this might get more visibility. Can someone make something of this? -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 22:49:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rice.edu (cs.rice.edu [128.42.1.30]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D684F14D01 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 22:49:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from alc@cs.rice.edu) Received: from nonpc.cs.rice.edu (nonpc.cs.rice.edu [128.42.1.219]) by cs.rice.edu (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id AAA09314; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 00:46:37 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from alc@localhost) by nonpc.cs.rice.edu (8.9.2/8.7.3) id AAA06937; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 00:46:37 -0500 (CDT) Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 00:46:37 -0500 From: Alan Cox To: Christopher Sedore Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: aio_suspend() functionality Message-ID: <19990424004637.A6930@nonpc.cs.rice.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 22 Apr 1999, Christopher Sedore wrote: > I'd be willing to put up a web page with a full collection of aio patches > available if you'd like to share off-line. Please do. I'll try to make sure that the bug fixes get checked in. Alan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 23:25:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (spinner.netplex.com.au [202.12.86.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7C6E14D05 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 23:25:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) Received: from netplex.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spinner.netplex.com.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57CB91F5A; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 14:22:28 +0800 (WST) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Bill Fumerola Cc: Peter Mutsaers , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How can I get FreeBSD's CVSROOT? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 23 Apr 1999 12:41:10 -0400." Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 14:22:28 +0800 From: Peter Wemm Message-Id: <19990424062232.57CB91F5A@spinner.netplex.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Bill Fumerola wrote: > On 23 Apr 1999, Peter Mutsaers wrote: > > > I'd like to get FreeBSD's CVSROOT, mainly to see how those nice cvs > > commit messages are produced (assuming it's in there). I'd like to use > > the same for my job where we just switched from SCCS to CVS. > > Of course it's in the tree. :> > > http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/CVSROOT/log_accum.pl Note that there is a bit more to it than that. It depends on having cvs_acls.pl run first to create some checkpoint files so that it knows how to properly aggregate commits in multiple directories. CVS doesn't support this too well, so the scripts do it instead. Cheers, -Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 23 23:44: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hydrogen.fircrest.net (metriclient-2.uoregon.edu [128.223.172.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5070A14D17 for ; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 23:44:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gurney_j@efn.org) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.fircrest.net (8.9.1/8.8.7) id XAA12229; Fri, 23 Apr 1999 23:41:13 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19990423234113.22302@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 23:41:13 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: Alan Cox Cc: Christopher Sedore , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: aio_suspend() functionality References: <19990424004637.A6930@nonpc.cs.rice.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <19990424004637.A6930@nonpc.cs.rice.edu>; from Alan Cox on Sat, Apr 24, 1999 at 12:46:37AM -0500 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Alan Cox scribbled this message on Apr 24: > On Thu, 22 Apr 1999, Christopher Sedore wrote: > > > I'd be willing to put up a web page with a full collection of aio patches > > available if you'd like to share off-line. > > Please do. I'll try to make sure that the bug fixes get checked in. actually, I got dg's approval to commit my fixes to aio thursday, so I'll be committing them as soon as I verify they don't break anything.. -- John-Mark Gurney Voice: +1 541 684 8449 Cu Networking P.O. Box 5693, 97405 "The soul contains in itself the event that shall presently befall it. The event is only the actualizing of its thought." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 24 1:35:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from poboxer.pobox.com (unknown [208.149.16.22]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 374F614D17 for ; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 01:35:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from alk@poboxer.pobox.com) Received: (from alk@localhost) by poboxer.pobox.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id DAA24915; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 03:33:36 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from alk) From: Anthony Kimball MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 03:33:36 -0500 (CDT) X-Face: \h9Jg:Cuivl4S*UP-)gO.6O=T]]@ncM*tn4zG);)lk#4|lqEx=*talx?.Gk,dMQU2)ptPC17cpBzm(l'M|H8BUF1&]dDCxZ.c~Wy6-j,^V1E(NtX$FpkkdnJixsJHE95JlhO 5\M3jh'YiO7KPCn0~W`Ro44_TB@&JuuqRqgPL'0/{):7rU-%.*@/>q?1&Ed Reply-To: alk@pobox.com To: jhermes@infoglobe.com Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: signal permissions X-Mailer: VM 6.43 under 20.4 "Emerald" XEmacs Lucid Message-ID: <14113.32330.554950.935946@avalon.east> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : > : >Here's a trial balloon: Anyone who can write to an executable file : >should be permitted to signal a derived process. : > : I dunno, I like to keep process space (who it runs as) separate from file : space (how it exists). : Implied permissions from one space being applied to another always reduces : flexibility, right? I don't see how, in this case. It increases practical flexibility. We're not talking about orthogonality. But your criticism suggests another which you left implicit, but which perhaps motivated yours in some fundamental way: Overloading is almost always sucky. Perhaps a flag would be better. I can only think of 6 cases worth implementing: exec'ing/any uid/gid can sighup/sigterm, where any uid can sighup/sigterm == any gid can sighup/sigterm. That takes 3 flag bits to support. Blech. Oh, for capability tickets! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 24 1:40: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from poboxer.pobox.com (unknown [208.149.16.22]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FE5214D01 for ; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 01:40:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from alk@poboxer.pobox.com) Received: (from alk@localhost) by poboxer.pobox.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id DAA24935; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 03:38:26 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from alk) From: Anthony Kimball MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 03:38:26 -0500 (CDT) X-Face: \h9Jg:Cuivl4S*UP-)gO.6O=T]]@ncM*tn4zG);)lk#4|lqEx=*talx?.Gk,dMQU2)ptPC17cpBzm(l'M|H8BUF1&]dDCxZ.c~Wy6-j,^V1E(NtX$FpkkdnJixsJHE95JlhO 5\M3jh'YiO7KPCn0~W`Ro44_TB@&JuuqRqgPL'0/{):7rU-%.*@/>q?1&Ed Reply-To: alk@pobox.com To: green@unixhelp.org Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Uox, Linux emul and missing things. X-Mailer: VM 6.43 under 20.4 "Emerald" XEmacs Lucid Message-ID: <14113.33416.661696.901998@avalon.east> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : Actually, I'd like a sysctl of machdep.npxcw, as most others probably would. : And the INITAL to be BDE's, too. Here's a witness: "Amen, Brother!" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 24 3:45:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (spinner.netplex.com.au [202.12.86.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FBD114C3F for ; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 03:45:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) Received: from netplex.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spinner.netplex.com.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id 392FF1F0B; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 18:45:32 +0800 (WST) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: alk@pobox.com Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: signal permissions In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 23 Apr 1999 14:44:13 EST." <14112.52532.671480.997467@avalon.east> Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 18:45:32 +0800 From: Peter Wemm Message-Id: <19990424104534.392FF1F0B@spinner.netplex.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Anthony Kimball wrote: > > Here's a trial balloon: Anyone who can write to an executable file > should be permitted to signal a derived process. Umm, do you mean "could if not for ETXTBSY"? Cheers, -Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 24 6:10:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sol (cs1-gw.cs.binghamton.edu [128.226.171.72]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 4774114CBB for ; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 06:10:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu) Received: from localhost (zzhang@localhost) by sol (SMI-8.6/8.6.9) with SMTP id JAA13550 for ; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 09:00:24 -0400 Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 09:00:23 -0400 (EDT) From: Zhihui Zhang To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Logical block number caching Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The 4.4BSD book says the following on page 227: The drawback to using a *logical* address cache is that it is difficult to detect aliases for a block belonging to a local file and the same block accessed through the block device disk whose logical block address is the same as the physical block address. The kernel handles these aliases by administratively preventing them from occuring. The kernel does not allow the block device for a partition to be opened while that partition is mounted and vice versa. Is this the same situation with FreeBSD 3.1? I have tried to find where in the source code this gets handled without luck. I hope someone will tell me whether FreeBSD uses the same strategy and which routines handle this. Any help is appreciated. -------------------------------------------------- Zhihui Zhang. Please visit http://www.freebsd.org -------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 24 13:11: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hp9000.chc-chimes.com (hp9000.chc-chimes.com [206.67.97.84]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01DA814D2B for ; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 13:10:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from billf@chc-chimes.com) Received: from localhost by hp9000.chc-chimes.com with SMTP (1.39.111.2/16.2) id AA034949382; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 11:56:22 -0400 Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 11:56:22 -0400 (EDT) From: Bill Fumerola To: Peter Wemm Cc: Peter Mutsaers , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How can I get FreeBSD's CVSROOT? In-Reply-To: <19990424062232.57CB91F5A@spinner.netplex.com.au> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 24 Apr 1999, Peter Wemm wrote: > Note that there is a bit more to it than that. It depends on having > cvs_acls.pl run first to create some checkpoint files so that it knows how > to properly aggregate commits in multiple directories. CVS doesn't support > this too well, so the scripts do it instead. Whoops, I forgot that I hacked my empoyer's repository the reduce the complexities. Yes, multiple files get called for the complete 'freebsd' experience, though log_accum does most(all) of the mailing. - bill fumerola - billf@chc-chimes.com - BF1560 - computer horizons corp - - ph:(800) 252-2421 - bfumerol@computerhorizons.com - billf@FreeBSD.org - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 24 13:19: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hp9000.chc-chimes.com (hp9000.chc-chimes.com [206.67.97.84]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB95014F1B for ; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 13:18:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from billf@chc-chimes.com) Received: from localhost by hp9000.chc-chimes.com with SMTP (1.39.111.2/16.2) id AA036719865; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 12:04:25 -0400 Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 12:04:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Bill Fumerola To: Peter Wemm Cc: Peter Mutsaers , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How can I get FreeBSD's CVSROOT? In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 24 Apr 1999, Bill Fumerola wrote: > Yes, multiple files get called for the complete 'freebsd' experience, > though log_accum does most(all) of the mailing. Also, make sure you change the destination o the mail (as the comments in the file suggest) otherwise you're going to look very silly. :> - bill fumerola - billf@chc-chimes.com - BF1560 - computer horizons corp - - ph:(800) 252-2421 - bfumerol@computerhorizons.com - billf@FreeBSD.org - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 24 14:43: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from baerenklau.de.freebsd.org (baerenklau.de.freebsd.org [195.185.195.14]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFC7614D66 for ; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 14:42:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from w@panke.de.freebsd.org) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by baerenklau.de.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with UUCP id XAA27225; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 23:42:56 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from w@panke.de.freebsd.org) Received: (from w@localhost) by paula.panke.de.freebsd.org (8.9.3/8.8.8) id WAA00474; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 22:48:03 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from w) Message-ID: <19990424224803.30626@panke.de.freebsd.org> Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 22:48:03 +0200 From: Wolfram Schneider To: "Daniel C. Sobral" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cvsweb.cgi References: <3720A168.2A8A8975@newsguy.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.89i In-Reply-To: <3720A168.2A8A8975@newsguy.com>; from Daniel C. Sobral on Sat, Apr 24, 1999 at 01:35:52AM +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 1999-04-24 01:35:52 +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > Who is responsible for that thing? Could we have tags on > Submitted by lines? I don't want more spam in my mailbox. Cut&paste the email address and use your favourite email client. -- Wolfram Schneider http://wolfram.schneider.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 24 14:43:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from baerenklau.de.freebsd.org (baerenklau.de.freebsd.org [195.185.195.14]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D48114D66 for ; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 14:43:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wosch@panke.de.freebsd.org) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by baerenklau.de.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with UUCP id XAA27243 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 23:43:23 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from wosch@panke.de.freebsd.org) Received: (from wosch@localhost) by paula.panke.de.freebsd.org (8.9.3/8.8.8) id XAA00563; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 23:27:18 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from wosch) Message-ID: <19990424232718.14407@panke.de.freebsd.org> Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 23:27:18 +0200 From: Wolfram Schneider To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: [nickm@t-online.de: WAN Adapters with FreeBSD Driver Support] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.89i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ----- Forwarded message from Nick Maddicks ----- Message-ID: <000b01be8d68$cf2e8440$de77fea9@home> Reply-To: "Nick Maddicks" To: Subject: WAN Adapters with FreeBSD Driver Support Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 11:07:55 +0200 Dear Webmaster, Many of our customers have expressed the view that while information on FreeBSD software is relatively easy to find on the Web they still have very real problems finding information about which hardware is available with FreeBSD driver support, particularly when it comes to connectivity products. Consequently, we have investigated their claims and indeed concluded that looking for connectivity (I/O) products is a little like "looking for a needle in a haystack". In fact we can't help feeling this state of affairs must act as a deterrent for some prospective FreeBSD users. When visiting your site we were delighted, and more than somewhat heartened, to see that someone was at least trying to provide the help FreeBSD users so desperately need. We therefore ask you to help us to "spread the word" about the commercial viability of FreeBSD by including links to our main website at http://www.adcomtec.com and our partner website at http://www.lanmedia.com or by including our products in your Hardware section. For your reference, ADCOMTEC is the combined European Business Center for LAN Media Corporation (LMC). ADCOMTEC specializes in providing high-performance, advanced communications and networking solutions for CompactPCI, PCI, and PMC based applications. FreeBSD driver support is provided for a range of high-performance adapters providing connectivity Synchronous Serial, T1/E1, DS3/T3, and HSSI. PCI Adapters ------------------- LMC1000P-U Synchronous Serial WAN Adapter (PCI) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Supports wide range of serial interfaces including: RS-232, EIA-530, RS-449, V.35, V.36 and X.21bis Cable selects proper electrical interface standard Hardware performs HDLC functions (Flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) Transmits and receives variable length frames Can receive minimum sized frames with single flag separator Data bit rates up to 10Mbps LMC5200P-U HSSI WAN Adapter (PCI) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Full T3 to support DS3 Network Service Unit Full E3 for speeds of up to 32Mbps Fractional T3 and E3 bandwidth Inverse T1 and E1 multiplexors DTE to DCE connectivity Hardware performs HDLC functions (flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) Uses Scatter/Gather Bus Master DMA Transmits and receives variable length frames Data bit rates up to 52 Mbps LMC5245P-U DS3/T3 WAN Adapter (PCI) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ On board DSX-3 transceiver Two 75 ohm BNC coaxial connectors Full Duplex connectivity at DS3 rate of 44.736 Mbps B3ZS line encoding/decoding C-bit parity encoding and error counting Far End Block Error (FEBE) detection and counters Fully integrates DS3 Framer and Transceiver Hardware performs HDLC functions (flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) Uses Scatter/Gather Bus Master DMA PMC (PCI Mezzanine Card) Adapters ------------------------------------------------------ LMC1000M-U Synchronous Serial WAN Adapter (PMC) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Supports wide range of serial interfaces including: RS-232, EIA-530, RS-449, V.35, V.36 and X.21bis Cable selects proper electrical interface standard Hardware performs HDLC functions (Flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) Transmits and receives variable length frames Can receive minimum sized frames with single flag separator Data bit rates up to 10Mbps LMC5200M-U HSSI WAN Adapter (PMC) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Full T3 to support DS3 Network Service Unit Full E3 for speeds of up to 32Mbps Fractional T3 and E3 bandwidth Inverse T1 and E1 multiplexors DTE to DCE connectivity Hardware performs HDLC functions (flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) Uses Scatter/Gather Bus Master DMA Transmits and receives variable length frames Data bit rates from 1.5 Mbps to 52 Mbps LMC5245M-U DS3/T3 WAN Adapter (PMC) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- On board DSX-3 transceiver Two 75 ohm BNC coaxial connectors Full Duplex connectivity at DS3 rate of 44.736 Mbps B3ZS line encoding/decoding C-bit parity encoding and error counting Far End Block Error (FEBE) detection and counters Fully integrates DS3 Framer and Transceiver Hardware performs HDLC functions (flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) Uses Scatter/Gather Bus Master DMA CompactPCI Adapters -------------------------------- LMC5200C-U HSSI WAN Adapter (CompactPCI) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Full T3 to support DS3 Network Service Unit Full E3 for speeds of up to 32Mbps Fractional T3 and E3 bandwidth Inverse T1 and E1 multiplexors DTE to DCE connectivity Hardware performs HDLC functions (flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) Uses Scatter/Gather Bus Master DMA Transmits and receives variable length frames Data bit rates up to 52 Mbps Best Regards, Nick Maddicks ADCOMTEC Tel: (+49) 8062-8987 Fax: (+49) 8062-8891 Email: nickm@t-online.de Internet: www.adcomtec.om [...] ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Wolfram Schneider http://wolfram.schneider.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Apr 24 16:29:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-01.cdsnet.net (mail-01.cdsnet.net [206.107.16.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 96E3514D61 for ; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 16:29:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mrcpu@internetcds.com) Received: (qmail 10651 invoked from network); 24 Apr 1999 23:29:30 -0000 Received: from schizo.cdsnet.net (204.118.244.32) by mail.cdsnet.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 1999 23:29:30 -0000 Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 16:28:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Jaye Mathisen X-Sender: mrcpu@schizo.cdsnet.net To: Wolfram Schneider Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: [nickm@t-online.de: WAN Adapters with FreeBSD Driver Support] In-Reply-To: <19990424232718.14407@panke.de.freebsd.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This is interesting... I have a few of the ET boards, but am not real wild about recommending them at this point in time. I will definitely get a couple of these to try soon, since I'm a big fan of the open source movement, it's a leg up in the purchasing decision as compared to other vendors. On Sat, 24 Apr 1999, Wolfram Schneider wrote: > ----- Forwarded message from Nick Maddicks ----- > Message-ID: <000b01be8d68$cf2e8440$de77fea9@home> > Reply-To: "Nick Maddicks" > To: > Subject: WAN Adapters with FreeBSD Driver Support > Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 11:07:55 +0200 > > > Dear Webmaster, > > Many of our customers have expressed the view that while information on FreeBSD software is relatively easy to find on the Web they still have very real problems finding information about which hardware is available with FreeBSD driver support, particularly when it comes to connectivity products. > > Consequently, we have investigated their claims and indeed concluded that looking for connectivity (I/O) products is a little like "looking for a needle in a haystack". In fact we can't help feeling this state of affairs must act as a deterrent for some prospective FreeBSD users. > > When visiting your site we were delighted, and more than somewhat heartened, to see that someone was at least trying to provide the help FreeBSD users so desperately need. > > We therefore ask you to help us to "spread the word" about the commercial viability of FreeBSD by including links to our main website at http://www.adcomtec.com and our partner website at http://www.lanmedia.com or by including our products in your Hardware section. > > For your reference, ADCOMTEC is the combined European Business Center for LAN Media Corporation (LMC). ADCOMTEC specializes in providing high-performance, advanced communications and networking solutions for CompactPCI, PCI, and PMC based applications. FreeBSD driver support is provided for a range of high-performance adapters providing connectivity Synchronous Serial, T1/E1, DS3/T3, and HSSI. > > > PCI Adapters > ------------------- > > LMC1000P-U Synchronous Serial WAN Adapter (PCI) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Supports wide range of serial interfaces including: > RS-232, EIA-530, RS-449, V.35, V.36 and X.21bis > Cable selects proper electrical interface standard > Hardware performs HDLC functions (Flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) > Transmits and receives variable length frames > Can receive minimum sized frames with single flag separator > Data bit rates up to 10Mbps > > > LMC5200P-U HSSI WAN Adapter (PCI) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Full T3 to support DS3 Network Service Unit > Full E3 for speeds of up to 32Mbps > Fractional T3 and E3 bandwidth > Inverse T1 and E1 multiplexors > DTE to DCE connectivity > Hardware performs HDLC functions (flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) > Uses Scatter/Gather Bus Master DMA > Transmits and receives variable length frames > Data bit rates up to 52 Mbps > > > LMC5245P-U DS3/T3 WAN Adapter (PCI) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > On board DSX-3 transceiver > Two 75 ohm BNC coaxial connectors > Full Duplex connectivity at DS3 rate of 44.736 Mbps > B3ZS line encoding/decoding > C-bit parity encoding and error counting > Far End Block Error (FEBE) detection and counters > Fully integrates DS3 Framer and Transceiver > Hardware performs HDLC functions (flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) > Uses Scatter/Gather Bus Master DMA > > > PMC (PCI Mezzanine Card) Adapters > ------------------------------------------------------ > > LMC1000M-U Synchronous Serial WAN Adapter (PMC) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Supports wide range of serial interfaces including: > RS-232, EIA-530, RS-449, V.35, V.36 and X.21bis > Cable selects proper electrical interface standard > Hardware performs HDLC functions (Flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) > Transmits and receives variable length frames > Can receive minimum sized frames with single flag separator > Data bit rates up to 10Mbps > > > LMC5200M-U HSSI WAN Adapter (PMC) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Full T3 to support DS3 Network Service Unit > Full E3 for speeds of up to 32Mbps > Fractional T3 and E3 bandwidth > Inverse T1 and E1 multiplexors > DTE to DCE connectivity > Hardware performs HDLC functions (flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) > Uses Scatter/Gather Bus Master DMA > Transmits and receives variable length frames > Data bit rates from 1.5 Mbps to 52 Mbps > > > LMC5245M-U DS3/T3 WAN Adapter (PMC) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > On board DSX-3 transceiver > Two 75 ohm BNC coaxial connectors > Full Duplex connectivity at DS3 rate of 44.736 Mbps > B3ZS line encoding/decoding > C-bit parity encoding and error counting > Far End Block Error (FEBE) detection and counters > Fully integrates DS3 Framer and Transceiver > Hardware performs HDLC functions (flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) > Uses Scatter/Gather Bus Master DMA > > > CompactPCI Adapters > -------------------------------- > > LMC5200C-U HSSI WAN Adapter (CompactPCI) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Full T3 to support DS3 Network Service Unit > Full E3 for speeds of up to 32Mbps > Fractional T3 and E3 bandwidth > Inverse T1 and E1 multiplexors > DTE to DCE connectivity > Hardware performs HDLC functions (flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) > Uses Scatter/Gather Bus Master DMA > Transmits and receives variable length frames > Data bit rates up to 52 Mbps > > > > Best Regards, > Nick Maddicks > ADCOMTEC > Tel: (+49) 8062-8987 > Fax: (+49) 8062-8891 > Email: nickm@t-online.de > Internet: www.adcomtec.om > [...] > ----- End forwarded message ----- > -- > Wolfram Schneider http://wolfram.schneider.org > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 25 10:23: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from etinc.com (et-gw.etinc.com [207.252.1.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C3CE14C0F for ; Sun, 25 Apr 1999 10:23:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dennis@etinc.com) Received: from workstation.etinc.com (port50.netsvr1.cst.vastnet.net [207.252.73.50]) by etinc.com (8.8.8/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA11135; Sun, 25 Apr 1999 13:25:18 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904251725.NAA11135@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@mail.etinc.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 01:23:44 -0400 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: Dennis Subject: Re: [nickm@t-online.de: WAN Adapters with FreeBSD Driver Support] Cc: wosch@panke.de.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <19990424232718.14407@panke.de.freebsd.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hey, how come I get my ass flamed if I blatently advertise on this list? :-( Saying theres a driver available is one thing, but the inverse muxes and all that other crap is a bit out of line. But what I want to know is who wrote that product summery on the web site? "transmits and recieves variable length frames"...wow thats really something! Dennis ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Emerging Technologies, Inc. http://www.etinc.com T1/T3 boards for FreeBSD and Linux ET/BWMGR Bandwidth Manage for FreeBSD,BSD/OS ET/BWMGR now available for LINUX also At 11:27 PM 4/24/99 +0200, you wrote: >----- Forwarded message from Nick Maddicks ----- >Message-ID: <000b01be8d68$cf2e8440$de77fea9@home> >Reply-To: "Nick Maddicks" >To: >Subject: WAN Adapters with FreeBSD Driver Support >Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 11:07:55 +0200 > > >Dear Webmaster, > >Many of our customers have expressed the view that while information on FreeBSD software is relatively easy to find on the Web they still have very real problems finding information about which hardware is available with FreeBSD driver support, particularly when it comes to connectivity products. > >Consequently, we have investigated their claims and indeed concluded that looking for connectivity (I/O) products is a little like "looking for a needle in a haystack". In fact we can't help feeling this state of affairs must act as a deterrent for some prospective FreeBSD users. > >When visiting your site we were delighted, and more than somewhat heartened, to see that someone was at least trying to provide the help FreeBSD users so desperately need. > >We therefore ask you to help us to "spread the word" about the commercial viability of FreeBSD by including links to our main website at http://www.adcomtec.com and our partner website at http://www.lanmedia.com or by including our products in your Hardware section. > >For your reference, ADCOMTEC is the combined European Business Center for LAN Media Corporation (LMC). ADCOMTEC specializes in providing high-performance, advanced communications and networking solutions for CompactPCI, PCI, and PMC based applications. FreeBSD driver support is provided for a range of high-performance adapters providing connectivity Synchronous Serial, T1/E1, DS3/T3, and HSSI. > > >PCI Adapters >------------------- > >LMC1000P-U Synchronous Serial WAN Adapter (PCI) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------------- >Supports wide range of serial interfaces including: >RS-232, EIA-530, RS-449, V.35, V.36 and X.21bis >Cable selects proper electrical interface standard >Hardware performs HDLC functions (Flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) >Transmits and receives variable length frames >Can receive minimum sized frames with single flag separator >Data bit rates up to 10Mbps > > >LMC5200P-U HSSI WAN Adapter (PCI) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------- >Full T3 to support DS3 Network Service Unit >Full E3 for speeds of up to 32Mbps >Fractional T3 and E3 bandwidth >Inverse T1 and E1 multiplexors >DTE to DCE connectivity >Hardware performs HDLC functions (flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) >Uses Scatter/Gather Bus Master DMA >Transmits and receives variable length frames >Data bit rates up to 52 Mbps > > >LMC5245P-U DS3/T3 WAN Adapter (PCI) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------- >On board DSX-3 transceiver >Two 75 ohm BNC coaxial connectors >Full Duplex connectivity at DS3 rate of 44.736 Mbps >B3ZS line encoding/decoding >C-bit parity encoding and error counting >Far End Block Error (FEBE) detection and counters >Fully integrates DS3 Framer and Transceiver >Hardware performs HDLC functions (flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) >Uses Scatter/Gather Bus Master DMA > > >PMC (PCI Mezzanine Card) Adapters >------------------------------------------------------ > >LMC1000M-U Synchronous Serial WAN Adapter (PMC) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------- >Supports wide range of serial interfaces including: >RS-232, EIA-530, RS-449, V.35, V.36 and X.21bis >Cable selects proper electrical interface standard >Hardware performs HDLC functions (Flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) >Transmits and receives variable length frames >Can receive minimum sized frames with single flag separator >Data bit rates up to 10Mbps > > >LMC5200M-U HSSI WAN Adapter (PMC) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------- >Full T3 to support DS3 Network Service Unit >Full E3 for speeds of up to 32Mbps >Fractional T3 and E3 bandwidth >Inverse T1 and E1 multiplexors >DTE to DCE connectivity >Hardware performs HDLC functions (flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) >Uses Scatter/Gather Bus Master DMA >Transmits and receives variable length frames >Data bit rates from 1.5 Mbps to 52 Mbps > > >LMC5245M-U DS3/T3 WAN Adapter (PMC) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------- >On board DSX-3 transceiver >Two 75 ohm BNC coaxial connectors >Full Duplex connectivity at DS3 rate of 44.736 Mbps >B3ZS line encoding/decoding >C-bit parity encoding and error counting >Far End Block Error (FEBE) detection and counters >Fully integrates DS3 Framer and Transceiver >Hardware performs HDLC functions (flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) >Uses Scatter/Gather Bus Master DMA > > >CompactPCI Adapters >-------------------------------- > >LMC5200C-U HSSI WAN Adapter (CompactPCI) with Open Source (FreeBSD) Driver >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------- >Full T3 to support DS3 Network Service Unit >Full E3 for speeds of up to 32Mbps >Fractional T3 and E3 bandwidth >Inverse T1 and E1 multiplexors >DTE to DCE connectivity >Hardware performs HDLC functions (flags, bit-stuffing, CRCs) >Uses Scatter/Gather Bus Master DMA >Transmits and receives variable length frames >Data bit rates up to 52 Mbps > > > >Best Regards, >Nick Maddicks >ADCOMTEC >Tel: (+49) 8062-8987 >Fax: (+49) 8062-8891 >Email: nickm@t-online.de >Internet: www.adcomtec.om >[...] >----- End forwarded message ----- >-- >Wolfram Schneider http://wolfram.schneider.org > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 25 13:59:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from moebius2.Space.Net (moebius2.Space.Net [195.30.1.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id B587A14D15 for ; Sun, 25 Apr 1999 13:59:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from maex@Space.Net) Received: (qmail 4959 invoked by uid 1013); 25 Apr 1999 20:59:46 -0000 Message-ID: <19990425225946.B4805@space.net> Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 22:59:46 +0200 From: Markus Stumpf To: Dennis , hackers@freebsd.org Cc: wosch@panke.de.freebsd.org Subject: Re: [nickm@t-online.de: WAN Adapters with FreeBSD Driver Support] References: <19990424232718.14407@panke.de.freebsd.org> <199904251725.NAA11135@etinc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904251725.NAA11135@etinc.com>; from Dennis on Mon, Apr 26, 1999 at 01:23:44AM -0400 Organization: SpaceNet GmbH, Muenchen, Germany Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Apr 26, 1999 at 01:23:44AM -0400, Dennis wrote: > Hey, how come I get my ass flamed if I blatently advertise on this list? :-( Maybe because you are too lame to know how to use your MUA? 6.8K for an article we've all seen and a "cry baby" line ... go away \Maex To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Apr 25 21:31:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bilby.prth.tensor.pgs.com (unknown [157.147.232.237]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B552B14C29 for ; Sun, 25 Apr 1999 21:31:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from shocking@bandicoot.prth.tensor.pgs.com) Received: from bandicoot.prth.tensor.pgs.com (bandicoot.prth.tensor.pgs.com [157.147.224.1]) by bilby.prth.tensor.pgs.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA01524 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 12:30:59 +0800 (WST) Received: from ariadne.tensor.pgs.com (ariadne [157.147.227.36]) by bandicoot.prth.tensor.pgs.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA09598 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 12:31:27 +0800 (WST) Received: by ariadne.tensor.pgs.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id MAA04537; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 12:31:27 +0800 Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 12:31:27 +0800 From: shocking@prth.pgs.com (Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth) Message-Id: <199904260431.MAA04537@ariadne.tensor.pgs.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Porting Linux Device drivers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've nearly finished porting the 3dfx device driver, prior to trying to persuade someone to let me port glide, but have come across an interesting problem. Linux device drivers will return a non-negative number on an ioctl to indicate success and possibly some useful information (such as the number of 3dfx cards, for example). They return errors as negative errnos. The problem I'm having is that I'm using the glide Linux binaries to test the device, and the positive return values are being trapped somewhere and turned into -1, an obvious failure which the Linux glide library interprets as an error, spitting the dummy. I don't have the source to the Linux glide library, so can't correct this error there (where it should be done!). Does anyone have any clues as how to work around this horror? Stephen To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 1:44:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 031C115108 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 01:43:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA34648; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 09:43:33 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 09:43:33 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Porting Linux Device drivers In-Reply-To: <199904260431.MAA04537@ariadne.tensor.pgs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 26 Apr 1999, Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth wrote: > > I've nearly finished porting the 3dfx device driver, prior to trying to > persuade someone to let me port glide, but have come across an interesting > problem. Linux device drivers will return a non-negative number on an > ioctl to indicate success and possibly some useful information (such as > the number of 3dfx cards, for example). They return errors as negative > errnos. The problem I'm having is that I'm using the glide Linux > binaries to test the device, and the positive return values are being > trapped somewhere and turned into -1, an obvious failure which the > Linux glide library interprets as an error, spitting the dummy. > > I don't have the source to the Linux glide library, so can't correct > this error there (where it should be done!). Does anyone have any clues as > how to work around this horror? I think the right thing is to put the required return value in p_retval[0] and return zero. That is what syscalls do anyway. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 5: 9:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lor.watermarkgroup.com (lor.watermarkgroup.com [207.202.73.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 606F61515F for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 05:09:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luoqi@watermarkgroup.com) Received: (from luoqi@localhost) by lor.watermarkgroup.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA13139; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 08:09:16 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from luoqi) Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 08:09:16 -0400 (EDT) From: Luoqi Chen Message-Id: <199904261209.IAA13139@lor.watermarkgroup.com> To: peter@netplex.com.au Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Luoqi Chen wrote: > > > I've been thinking about a more drastic one, store the same PID in the > > threads' proc structure. PID is no more than a name of a process in the > > userland, and in userland we see all the threads as the same process. > > I don't think we really need a thread id, the threads are anonymous. > > Inside the kernel, the threads or processes are still named by their > > (struct proc *) pointer, so there won't be any confusion. > > selwakeup() is keyed from pid, not 'struct proc *' and is rather dependent > on these being unique... > I could see why pid is used here, the process selecting on the fd may have disappeared. Using pid doesn't solve the problem completely, another process may have assumed the same pid. A better solution would be store both struct proc * and pid, and use pid as some kind of generation number: if this pid is different from p_pid in struct proc, we know the original struct proc * must have gone (with the rare exception that another process has assumed both the struct proc storage and pid number). We could do this because struct proc's are allocated from type safe storage. This would save us the costly pfind(). > Cheers, > -Peter > -lq To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 5:29:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (spinner.netplex.com.au [202.12.86.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F2DAD14C21 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 05:29:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) Received: from netplex.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spinner.netplex.com.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id 063D91F58; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 20:29:31 +0800 (WST) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Luoqi Chen Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 26 Apr 1999 08:09:16 -0400." <199904261209.IAA13139@lor.watermarkgroup.com> Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 20:29:31 +0800 From: Peter Wemm Message-Id: <19990426122933.063D91F58@spinner.netplex.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Luoqi Chen wrote: > > Luoqi Chen wrote: > > > > > I've been thinking about a more drastic one, store the same PID in the > > > threads' proc structure. PID is no more than a name of a process in the > > > userland, and in userland we see all the threads as the same process. > > > I don't think we really need a thread id, the threads are anonymous. > > > Inside the kernel, the threads or processes are still named by their > > > (struct proc *) pointer, so there won't be any confusion. > > > > selwakeup() is keyed from pid, not 'struct proc *' and is rather dependent > > on these being unique... > > > I could see why pid is used here, the process selecting on the fd may have > disappeared. Using pid doesn't solve the problem completely, another process > may have assumed the same pid. A better solution would be store both struct > proc * and pid, and use pid as some kind of generation number: if this pid > is different from p_pid in struct proc, we know the original struct proc * > must have gone (with the rare exception that another process has assumed > both the struct proc storage and pid number). We could do this because > struct proc's are allocated from type safe storage. This would save us the > costly pfind(). In order to minimize select very costly select wakeup collisions, we need to be able to track multiple waiters.. Tracking a couple of hundred waiters on a selinfo multiplies any extra storage.. FWIW, a 32-bit secondary pid is probably a good (or better) generation number for this sort of thing (and elsewhere, as long as it's not exposed to users). Hmm, perhaps... Hmmmmm.. Perhaps create a 32 bit "thread id" now and use that for process/identification in things like this. At some point down the track, pid's can become non-unique when there is a proc/thread split. > -lq Cheers, -Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 5:48:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.sanda.gr.jp (ns.sanda.gr.jp [210.232.122.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D2F414C21 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 05:48:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from non@ever.sanda.gr.jp) Received: from ever.sanda.gr.jp (epoch [10.93.63.51]) by ns.sanda.gr.jp (8.8.8/3.6W) with ESMTP id VAA22926; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 21:48:39 +0900 From: non@ever.sanda.gr.jp Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ever.sanda.gr.jp (8.8.8/3.3W9) with ESMTP id VAA07625; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 21:58:42 +0900 (JST) To: newconfig@jp.freebsd.org Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: newconfig/dynamic configuration (sys4c990410-newconfig990413-kld990426test3.patch) References: <19990426035932W.uch@nop.or.jp> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.93 on Emacs 19.28 / Mule 2.3 =?iso-2022-jp?B?KBskQkt2RSYyVhsoQik=?= Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <19990426215841Z.non@ever.sanda.gr.jp> Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 21:58:41 +0900 X-Dispatcher: imput version 980905(IM100) Lines: 20 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG FYI: from [newconfig-jp 1774] Newconfig/dynamic configuration patch by Mr. UCHIYAMA Yasushi is available at: ftp://ftp.nop.or.jp/users/uch/PCMCIA/FreeBSD/sys4c990410-newconfig990413-kld990426test3.patch.gz You will need: Base FreeBSD 4.0-current at 1999/04/10 sys4c990410.tar.gz Base newconfig patch sys4c990410-newconfig990413.patch.gz xl at pci ne at pci ne at isa are attached dynamically by kld. Put modules (xl, ne, dp8390nic, rt180x9, ne_pci and ne_isa in sys/module) in /modules. Codes around files and kld are in sys/dconf. // Noriaki Mitsunaga To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 5:49:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailer.syr.edu (mailer.syr.edu [128.230.18.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 61F6E14E30 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 05:49:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cmsedore@mailbox.syr.edu) Received: from rodan.syr.edu by mailer.syr.edu (LSMTP for Windows NT v1.1a) with SMTP id <0.ADC26190@mailer.syr.edu>; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 8:49:22 -0400 Received: from localhost (cmsedore@localhost) by rodan.syr.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id IAA00927 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 08:49:15 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: rodan.syr.edu: cmsedore owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 08:49:15 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Sedore X-Sender: cmsedore@rodan.syr.edu Reply-To: Christopher Sedore To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: aio and sockets (long) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've been working on modifying the kernel aio routines so that they are more useful for sockets. Currently, if you ask for an async read or write on a socket, this takes up one aiod which blocks waiting for the operation to complete, which is undesireable. What I've currently implemented (and am not happy with) is a alternate queueing for socket operations. Basically, if the descriptor is DTYPE_SOCKET, we check to see if it is readable or writeable (soreadable()/sowriteable()) and if it is we queue as before. If it is not, then the aiocb is put on a socket queue, and the socket is modified to call a wakeup routine with a pointer to the aiocb. I modified the aiocb to contain another pointer to create a singly linked list of aiocbs pending on a socket. When the wakeup routine is called, all the aiocbs that are waiting on the socket (and are of the same read or write type) are moved to the aio job queue. This worked really well until I hit control-c and paniced the system :) I had missed aio_proc_rundown, which cleans up the outstanding aio requests before process exists. I fixed this by a fair bit of frobbing around in the aio_proc_rundown (find the socket, work through the queued aiocbs, and remove the ones that are for the proc that is going away). I'm now getting system hangs instead of panics, but I'm betting that's a problem with my code since I think the concepts are sound. Here's what I don't like: 1. It seems silly to requeue socket read operations back to the main job queue on an upcall--why not simply do the read in the upcall and be done with it? 1a. Likewise for writes, but I'd much prefer the whole write to be completed in one call, and we'd have to do a bit more messing around to ensure this (like checking available buffer space, etc). 2. The linked list stuff for the socket queued aiocbs is really ugly. The head of the list is the so_upcallarg element in the socket struct. This linked list can include operations from multiple processes, and one can't use the linked list macros since there's no place to have the head end. Here are a few things I don't understand, but live with: 1. I don't see what protects the async code from having the file descriptor closed underneath it. It seems that it is checked when the operation is queued, but not afterward. 2. We always call splx(s) _after_ tsleep(), which seems wierd to someone who is used to userland multithreaded programming. (so I'm no kernel expert) (I also realized that my brain was AWOL when I commented previously on what I thought might be a memory leak in the aio routines.) Here's what I think I'd like to do: 1. Add a couple of tailqs to the socket structure, one to hold async read requests, one for async write requests. Arguably, a single one should be sufficient, though it requires stepping through the list to find one with a relevant operation. 2. Fix the socket close routines to dispose of the aiocbs properly. Fix aio_proc_rundown to handle this scenario. 3. Fix the wakeup routine to execute reads in the wakeup, rather than requeueing them. Only the number of reads necessary to empty the buffer should be executed (or all in the case of an error). 4. Leave writes alone for now, by just requeueing them as I currently do. This could also present a solution for the pid vs struct proc * problem in the "flock + kernel threads bug" series. Select operations could be queued as async requests on the socket--they would then get killed by aio_proc_rundown (with proper glue). Same actually goes for all the wakeup functions. Just a thought. Any comments or enlightenment would be appreciated. -Chris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 6:10: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailer.syr.edu (mailer.syr.edu [128.230.18.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 790BD14E30 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 06:10:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cmsedore@mailbox.syr.edu) Received: from rodan.syr.edu by mailer.syr.edu (LSMTP for Windows NT v1.1a) with SMTP id <0.7B9BE990@mailer.syr.edu>; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 9:09:26 -0400 Received: from localhost (cmsedore@localhost) by rodan.syr.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA07229 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 09:09:19 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: rodan.syr.edu: cmsedore owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 09:09:19 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Sedore X-Sender: cmsedore@rodan.syr.edu To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: aio and sockets (long) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 26 Apr 1999, Christopher Sedore wrote: > > This could also present a solution for the pid vs struct proc * problem in > the "flock + kernel threads bug" series. Select operations could be > queued as async requests on the socket--they would then get killed by > aio_proc_rundown (with proper glue). Same actually goes for all the > wakeup functions. Just a thought. But only for sockets, of course. Not to helpful unless its implemented for other descriptor types. Someday I'll get my brain engaged before my fingers. -Chris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 6:44:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from silver.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (silver.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp [133.34.17.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E4AD1515F for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 06:44:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp) Received: from silver.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by silver.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp (8.9.1a/3.7W-Naklab-2.0-19981001) with ESMTP id WAA00782; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 22:44:19 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <199904261344.WAA00782@silver.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp> To: zinnia@jan.ne.jp Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Update to POST_NEWBUS: Voxware midi driver for serial ports X-Mailer: Mew version 1.70 on Emacs 19.28.2 / Mule 2.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 22:44:19 +0900 From: Seigou Tanimura Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Whoops, typoed '.' for ','. From: Doug Rabson Subject: Re: Update to POST_NEWBUS: Voxware midi driver for serial ports Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 08:31:13 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: dfr> On Fri, 23 Apr 1999, Seigo TANIMURA wrote: dfr> dfr> > I have updated the patch to meet POST_NEWBUS on CURRENT. dfr> > For those interested, please have a go to: dfr> > dfr> > http://www.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp/~tanimura/freebsd-serialmidi/ dfr> > dfr> > dfr> > BTW, I have two questions to ask: dfr> > dfr> > 1. Has anybody been working on midi sequencer device under Luigi's dfr> > sound driver framework? dfr> dfr> I don't know. The author might have an idea... If no one is on this work, we(Tsuyoshi Iguchi-san and I) would love to do it. dfr> > 2. Has anybody been working on new-bus for VoxWare? dfr> dfr> I will probably re-work the probe and attach methods to new-bus when I do dfr> new-bus isapnp support. Is it gonna be in 3.2-RELEASE or later? Seigo TANIMURA |M2, Nakagawa Lab, Dept of Electronics & CS =========================|Faculty of Engineering, Yokohama National Univ Powered by SIEMENS, |http://www.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp/~tanimura/ FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT |http://www.sakura.ne.jp/~tcarrot/ (25th Apr 1999) & muesli.|tanimura@naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp tcarrot@sakuramail.com VoxWare Midi Driver for Serial Ports on FreeBSD: http://www.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp/~tanimura/freebsd-serialmidi/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 6:53:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1B7E151A9 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 06:53:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA78722; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 09:51:06 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 09:51:05 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Seigou Tanimura Cc: zinnia@jan.ne.jp, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Update to POST_NEWBUS: Voxware midi driver for serial ports In-Reply-To: <199904261344.WAA00782@silver.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 26 Apr 1999, Seigou Tanimura wrote: > dfr> > 1. Has anybody been working on midi sequencer device under Luigi's > dfr> > sound driver framework? > dfr> > dfr> I don't know. I've been watching, and there's been no word of anything like that at all, so if it's going on, it's completely silent. > The author might have an idea... > > If no one is on this work, we(Tsuyoshi Iguchi-san and I) > would love to do it. Sure would be *very* popular! ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 7:32:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sun-sparc1.infoglobe.com (sun-sparc1.infoglobe.com [38.216.162.162]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B16E151FF for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 07:32:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jhermes@infoglobe.com) Received: from kenny ([38.216.162.189]) by sun-sparc1.infoglobe.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 560-34435U100L100S0) with SMTP id AAA9026 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 10:30:29 -0400 Message-ID: <004301be8ff1$851579a0$bda2d826@kenny.infoglobe.com> From: "John S. Hermes" To: Subject: Bounce buffers in 3.1-Stable? Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 10:31:49 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Are there still bounce buffers available to call out from kernel config, or is there a better way to provide <16M service to ISA devices? Can't find anything in LINT about it. I have an old PC with an ISA lnc ethernet, and 64M of RAM. As luck would have it, the lnc driver is getting memory at boot time that it can't use (>16M). This is after make world from a 4/23/99 CVS. John Hermes jhermes@infoglobe.com Infoglobe, Inc. (937) 225-9999 x317 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 7:34:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from feral.com (feral.com [192.67.166.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69DE815228 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 07:34:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mjacob@feral.com) Received: from feral.com (mjacob@feral.com [192.67.166.1]) by feral.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA15437; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 07:34:03 -0700 Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 07:34:02 -0700 (PWT) From: Matthew Jacob Reply-To: mjacob@feral.com To: "John S. Hermes" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Bounce buffers in 3.1-Stable? In-Reply-To: <004301be8ff1$851579a0$bda2d826@kenny.infoglobe.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG they're an integral part of the bus_dma code. On Mon, 26 Apr 1999, John S. Hermes wrote: > Are there still bounce buffers available to call out from kernel config, or > is there a better way to provide <16M service to ISA devices? Can't find > anything in LINT about it. > > I have an old PC with an ISA lnc ethernet, and 64M of RAM. > > As luck would have it, the lnc driver is getting memory at boot time that it > can't use (>16M). This is after make world from a 4/23/99 CVS. > > > John Hermes jhermes@infoglobe.com > Infoglobe, Inc. (937) 225-9999 x317 > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 7:35:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from horse.supranet.net (horse.supranet.net [205.164.160.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17D23152AA for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 07:35:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gavinb@supranet.net) Received: from rat (rat.supranet.net [205.164.160.15]) by horse.supranet.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA22374 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 09:35:12 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <4.1.19990426093052.00c20150@mail.supranet.net> X-Sender: gavinb@mail.supranet.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 09:34:22 -0500 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org From: Benjamin Gavin Subject: EGCS and Threads Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi all, I am working with someone who is trying to get EGCS to compile in thread support under FreeBSD 3.1-R. I was wondering what configuration hacks were necessary to get EGCS to use libc_r rather than libc. I have tried compiling with the -pthread option as well as using -lc_r in the linker commands, but neither seems to be working. I seem to remember reading somewhere that you needed to actually compile EGCS to support threads. Does anyone have some detailed intructions, or possibly pointers to some. I have checked out the egcs site, but I didn't find anything. Thanks, Ben Gavin /--------------------------------------------------------------------------/ Benjamin Gavin - Senior Consultant *********** NO SPAM!! ************ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 8: 6:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from idefix.omnix.net (idefix.omnix.net [195.154.168.68]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC051151A9 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 08:06:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from didier@omnix.net) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by idefix.omnix.net (8.9.1/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA16277 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 18:06:46 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 18:06:45 +0200 (CEST) From: Didier Derny X-Sender: didier@idefix To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: large shared memory (increasing kvm) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hi, for the SQL server, I need a large shared memory (SHMMAXPGS=9216) I have maxusers = 512 the memory is actually of 256Mb and will be increased to 1Gb the kernel is still a.out [I have no possibility to stop the machine to upgrade to 3.1-RELEASE or 3.1-STABLE (upgrade planned in july/august)] (I'm running FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE on a dual pentium II machine [ASUS P2B mother board] everything works just fine except that we need to largely increase the shared memories and the semaphores]) is VM_KMEM_SIZE working with FreeBSD-3.0-RELEASE ? what value would you suggest ? thanks for your help ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Didier Derny | FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT Site Email: didier@omnix.net | Microsoft Free Computer. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 9:12:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lor.watermarkgroup.com (lor.watermarkgroup.com [207.202.73.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E6E9152AA for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 09:12:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luoqi@watermarkgroup.com) Received: (from luoqi@localhost) by lor.watermarkgroup.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA15096; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 12:12:05 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from luoqi) Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 12:12:05 -0400 (EDT) From: Luoqi Chen Message-Id: <199904261612.MAA15096@lor.watermarkgroup.com> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu Subject: Re: Logical block number caching Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > The 4.4BSD book says the following on page 227: > > The drawback to using a *logical* address cache is that it is difficult to > detect aliases for a block belonging to a local file and the same block > accessed through the block device disk whose logical block address is the > same as the physical block address. The kernel handles these aliases by > administratively preventing them from occuring. The kernel does not allow > the block device for a partition to be opened while that partition is > mounted and vice versa. > > Is this the same situation with FreeBSD 3.1? I have tried to find where in > the source code this gets handled without luck. I hope someone will tell > me whether FreeBSD uses the same strategy and which routines handle this. > > Any help is appreciated. > > -------------------------------------------------- > Zhihui Zhang. Please visit http://www.freebsd.org > -------------------------------------------------- > I believe it still applies to FreeBSD. The code that prevents mounted block device from being opened is in miscfs/specfs/spec_vnops.c -lq To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 9:51:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pcayk.ukc.ac.uk (pcayk.ukc.ac.uk [129.12.41.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26DC6150C2; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 09:51:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ayk1 @ukc.ac.uk) Received: from ukc.ac.uk (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pcayk.ukc.ac.uk (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id RAA89313; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 17:53:47 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from "ayk1 "@ukc.ac.uk) Message-Id: <199904261653.RAA89313@pcayk.ukc.ac.uk> Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 17:53:47 +0100 From: Dean Lombardo <"ayk1 "@ukc.ac.uk> Organization: University of Kent at Canterbury, UK X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: file disappeared? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The subject says it all: I removed a file, but according to df, it's still there! pcayk:~/tmp$ df -k . Filesystem 1K-blocks Used Avail Capacity Mounted on /dev/wd0s1f 7621844 6975669 36428 99% /usr pcayk:~/tmp$ ls -l -rw-r--r-- 1 ayk1 users 716247040 Apr 22 1999 bigcdimage.iso pcayk:~/tmp$ rm bigcdimage.iso pcayk:~/tmp$ df -k . Filesystem 1K-blocks Used Avail Capacity Mounted on /dev/wd0s1f 7621844 6975669 36428 99% /usr How on earth did that happen?!!! So I decided to run fsck, with -p at first: pcayk:/usr/home/ayk1# fsck -p -f /dev/wd0s1f /dev/rwd0s1f: UNREF FILE I=1111053 OWNER=ayk1 MODE=100644 /dev/rwd0s1f: SIZE=716247040 MTIME=Apr 22 20:36 1999 (CLEARED) /dev/rwd0s1f: SUMMARY INFORMATION BAD (SALVAGED) /dev/rwd0s1f: BLK(S) MISSING IN BIT MAPS (SALVAGED) /dev/rwd0s1f: FREE BLK COUNT(S) WRONG IN SUPERBLK (SALVAGED) /dev/rwd0s1f: 176217 files, 6275813 used, 1346031 free (39575 frags, 163307 blocks, 0.5% fragmentation) OK - the file's there - time to salvage it. pcayk:/usr/home/ayk1# fsck -f /dev/wd0s1f ** /dev/rwd0s1f ** Last Mounted on /usr ** Phase 1 - Check Blocks and Sizes ** Phase 2 - Check Pathnames ** Phase 3 - Check Connectivity ** Phase 4 - Check Reference Counts ** Phase 5 - Check Cyl groups SUMMARY INFORMATION BAD SALVAGE? [yn] y BLK(S) MISSING IN BIT MAPS SALVAGE? [yn] y FREE BLK COUNT(S) WRONG IN SUPERBLK SALVAGE? [yn] y 176217 files, 6275839 used, 1346005 free (39581 frags, 163303 blocks, 0.5% fragmentation) ***** FILE SYSTEM MARKED CLEAN ***** ***** FILE SYSTEM WAS MODIFIED ***** pcayk:/usr/home/ayk1# df -k Filesystem 1K-blocks Used Avail Capacity Mounted on /dev/wd0s1a 63503 32799 25624 56% / /dev/wd0s1f 7621844 6975664 36433 99% /usr /dev/wd0s1e 63503 11211 47212 19% /var /dev/wd2s1e 8002964 7346107 16620 100% /usr/local/mp3-archive procfs 4 4 0 100% /proc Arrgghhh - now I've done it! Any suggestions on how to deal with this? Thanks, Alex pcayk:~/tmp$ uname -a FreeBSD pcayk.ukc.ac.uk 3.1-STABLE FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE #0: Sun Apr 4 15:58:45 BST 1999 ayk1@pcayk.ukc.ac.uk:/usr/src/sys/compile/SHAKA i386 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 10: 2:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from etinc.com (et-gw.etinc.com [207.252.1.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 219CD14F48 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 10:02:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dennis@etinc.com) Received: from dbsys (dbsys.etinc.com [207.252.1.18]) by etinc.com (8.8.8/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA14857; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 13:04:41 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904261704.NAA14857@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 11:55:38 -0400 To: Markus Stumpf , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: Dennis Subject: Re: [nickm@t-online.de: WAN Adapters with FreeBSD Driver Support] Cc: wosch@panke.de.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <19990425225946.B4805@space.net> References: <199904251725.NAA11135@etinc.com> <19990424232718.14407@panke.de.freebsd.org> <199904251725.NAA11135@etinc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 10:59 PM 4/25/99 +0200, Markus Stumpf wrote: >On Mon, Apr 26, 1999 at 01:23:44AM -0400, Dennis wrote: >> Hey, how come I get my ass flamed if I blatently advertise on this list? :-( > >Maybe because you are too lame to know how to use your MUA? >6.8K for an article we've all seen and a "cry baby" line ... > >go away > > \Maex another German uprising? Just pointing out the double standard. I will feel free to post such things now. DB Emerging Technologies, Inc. http://www.etinc.com ISA and PCI T1/T3/V35/HSSI Cards for FreeBSD and LINUX HSSI/T3 UNIX-based Routers Bandwidth Manager http://www.etinc.com/bwmgr.htm To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 10: 6: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.chromatix.com (unknown [207.97.115.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5159814F48 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 10:05:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nick@chromatix.com) Received: from dogwood (dogwood.chromatix.com [207.97.115.140]) by mail.chromatix.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id NAA00630 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 13:06:09 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from nick@chromatix.com) Message-ID: <005301be9007$81f83210$8c7361cf@dogwood.chromatix.com> From: "Nick LoPresti" To: Subject: Got a SOCKS question for ya Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 13:09:13 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I was wondering how to get my 3.0 FreeBSD machine to work behind a socks proxy server. I tried looking at the SOCKS v5 Application Layer but couldn't get anything out of it. Does anyone else do this? Anyone know how? ================================================ Nick nick@chromatix.com Web Page: http://www.lopresti.dhs.org/users/nick To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 10:10: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pcayk.ukc.ac.uk (pcayk.ukc.ac.uk [129.12.41.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF2D514F48; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 10:09:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dlombardo@excite.com) Received: from excite.com (xtsw12c.ukc.ac.uk [129.12.41.85]) by pcayk.ukc.ac.uk (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id SAA89332; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 18:12:22 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dlombardo@excite.com) Message-ID: <37249EE8.85E9133F@excite.com> Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 18:14:16 +0100 From: Dean Lombardo Organization: University of Kent at Canterbury X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: file disappeared? References: <199904261653.RAA89313@pcayk.ukc.ac.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Dean Lombardo didn't write: > > The subject says it all: I removed a file, but according to df, it's > still there! (snipped) > Thanks, > > Alex Sorry about the name mixup - I accidentally left Netscape open on a friend's box... Anyway, email ayk1@ukc.ac.uk, not me! Dean To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 10:16:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from poboxer.pobox.com (unknown [208.149.16.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DBB3415249 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 10:15:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from alk@poboxer.pobox.com) Received: (from alk@localhost) by poboxer.pobox.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id LAA30020; Sat, 24 Apr 1999 11:55:32 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from alk) From: Anthony Kimball MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 11:55:32 -0500 (CDT) X-Face: \h9Jg:Cuivl4S*UP-)gO.6O=T]]@ncM*tn4zG);)lk#4|lqEx=*talx?.Gk,dMQU2)ptPC17cpBzm(l'M|H8BUF1&]dDCxZ.c~Wy6-j,^V1E(NtX$FpkkdnJixsJHE95JlhO 5\M3jh'YiO7KPCn0~W`Ro44_TB@&JuuqRqgPL'0/{):7rU-%.*@/>q?1&Ed Reply-To: alk@pobox.com To: peter@netplex.com.au Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: signal permissions References: <14112.52532.671480.997467@avalon.east> <19990424104534.392FF1F0B@spinner.netplex.com.au> X-Mailer: VM 6.43 under 20.4 "Emerald" XEmacs Lucid Message-ID: <14113.63246.592506.386823@avalon.east> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Quoth Peter Wemm on Sat, 24 April: : Anthony Kimball wrote: : > : > Here's a trial balloon: Anyone who can write to an executable file : > should be permitted to signal a derived process. : : Umm, do you mean "could if not for ETXTBSY"? I meant 'should...' as in 'a change should be accepted for inclusion into the code base such that...' I don't understand how your 'could...' formulation applies though, even in the absence of ETXTBSY. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 10:42:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from november.jaded.net (november.jaded.net [209.90.128.250]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0962714F19 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 10:42:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dan@november.jaded.net) Received: (from dan@localhost) by november.jaded.net (8.9.3/8.9.3+trinsec_nospam) id NAA41647 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 13:46:34 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 13:46:33 -0400 From: Dan Moschuk To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: dlopen() and family? Message-ID: <19990426134633.A41603@trinsec.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greetings, I'm having a small problem with using the dlopen() interface. More specifically, I'm not entirely sure how to compile the shared objects. Here are the compile options and the errors I get: cc -aout -c dlopen() -- Invalid file format cc -Wl,-export-dynamic dlopen() -- mmap returned wrong address: wanted ... cc -c dlopen() -- Unsupported file type Suggestions? -Dan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 11: 7:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F2C611530D for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 11:07:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA83793; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 12:06:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id MAA11221; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 12:07:09 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199904261807.MAA11221@harmony.village.org> To: "Nick LoPresti" Subject: Re: Got a SOCKS question for ya Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 26 Apr 1999 13:09:13 EDT." <005301be9007$81f83210$8c7361cf@dogwood.chromatix.com> References: <005301be9007$81f83210$8c7361cf@dogwood.chromatix.com> Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 12:07:09 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <005301be9007$81f83210$8c7361cf@dogwood.chromatix.com> "Nick LoPresti" writes: : I was wondering how to get my 3.0 FreeBSD machine to work behind a socks : proxy server. I tried looking at the SOCKS v5 Application Layer but : couldn't get anything out of it. Does anyone else do this? Anyone know : how? /usr/ports/net/socks5 Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 11:26:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF4B314C03 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 11:26:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id LAA47015; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 11:26:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 11:26:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904261826.LAA47015@apollo.backplane.com> To: Luoqi Chen Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu Subject: Re: Logical block number caching References: <199904261612.MAA15096@lor.watermarkgroup.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> the block device for a partition to be opened while that partition is :> mounted and vice versa. :> :> Is this the same situation with FreeBSD 3.1? I have tried to find where in :> the source code this gets handled without luck. I hope someone will tell :> me whether FreeBSD uses the same strategy and which routines handle this. :> :> Any help is appreciated. :> :> -------------------------------------------------- :> Zhihui Zhang. Please visit http://www.freebsd.org :> -------------------------------------------------- :> :I believe it still applies to FreeBSD. The code that prevents mounted block :device from being opened is in miscfs/specfs/spec_vnops.c : :-lq Yes, and it would be extremely dangerous to allow any block device that the filesystem also has a handle on to be separately openned. There is no real cache coherency between logical and physical blocks - the filesystem code manages it all very carefully. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 12: 5:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 646B715277 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 12:05:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id OAA25961; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 14:23:00 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 14:22:57 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Dan Moschuk Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: dlopen() and family? In-Reply-To: <19990426134633.A41603@trinsec.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 26 Apr 1999, Dan Moschuk wrote: > > Greetings, > > I'm having a small problem with using the dlopen() interface. More > specifically, I'm not entirely sure how to compile the shared objects. > > Here are the compile options and the errors I get: > > cc -aout -c > dlopen() -- Invalid file format > > cc -Wl,-export-dynamic > dlopen() -- mmap returned wrong address: wanted ... > > cc -c > dlopen() -- Unsupported file type er, why did you not give us the complete commandline you used? On my system: .(16:01:12)(bright@thumper.reserved) ~ % cc -aout -c cc: No input files specified .(16:01:17)(bright@thumper.reserved) ~ % cc -Wl,-export-dynamic /usr/lib/crt1.o: In function `_start': /usr/lib/crt1.o(.text+0x6c): undefined reference to `main' .(16:01:23)(bright@thumper.reserved) ~ % cc -c cc: No input files specified perhaps you missed the '-shared' flag? cc -shared -o blah.so.1 obj1.o obj2.o obj3.o you probably want to compiled the object files with: cc -c obj1.c -fpic -fPIC if you are compiling a program and want its local symbols visible to dlsym(), you need the -export-dynamic flag. -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 12:21: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from november.jaded.net (november.jaded.net [209.90.128.250]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED3D31535E for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 12:21:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dan@november.jaded.net) Received: (from dan@localhost) by november.jaded.net (8.9.3/8.9.3+trinsec_nospam) id PAA42818 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 15:25:26 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 15:25:26 -0400 From: Dan Moschuk To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: dlopen() and family? Message-ID: <19990426152526.B42727@trinsec.com> References: <19990426134633.A41603@trinsec.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: ; from Alfred Perlstein on Mon, Apr 26, 1999 at 02:22:57PM -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG | er, why did you not give us the complete commandline you used? I chopped out the names of the source files. I figured it would be pretty self-explanitory by providing only relevant parts of the command line. However, you're right, I was missing the -shared flag. Silly me. cc -shared -Wl,-export-dynamic -o foo.so foo.c does what its supposed to. Thanks! -Dan | On my system: | | .(16:01:12)(bright@thumper.reserved) | ~ % cc -aout -c | cc: No input files specified | .(16:01:17)(bright@thumper.reserved) | ~ % cc -Wl,-export-dynamic | /usr/lib/crt1.o: In function `_start': | /usr/lib/crt1.o(.text+0x6c): undefined reference to `main' | .(16:01:23)(bright@thumper.reserved) | ~ % cc -c | cc: No input files specified | | perhaps you missed the '-shared' flag? | | cc -shared -o blah.so.1 obj1.o obj2.o obj3.o | | you probably want to compiled the object files with: | | cc -c obj1.c -fpic -fPIC | | if you are compiling a program and want its local symbols visible | to dlsym(), you need the -export-dynamic flag. | | -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 12:25:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (blaubaer.kn-bremen.de [194.94.232.249]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC2CC14C8B; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 12:25:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nox@saturn.kn-bremen.de) Received: from saturn.kn-bremen.de (uucp@localhost) by blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (8.9.1/8.9.1) with UUCP id VAA16143; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 21:19:27 +0200 Received: (from nox@localhost) by saturn.kn-bremen.de (8.9.3/8.8.5) id VAA03311; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 21:10:28 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 21:10:28 +0200 (MET DST) From: Juergen Lock Message-Id: <199904261910.VAA03311@saturn.kn-bremen.de> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: kern/11287: rfork(RFMEM...) doesn't share LDTs set by i386_set_ldt, breaking wine X-Newsgroups: local.list.freebsd.bugs In-Reply-To: <199904222239.AAA43095@saturn.kn-bremen.de> Organization: home Cc: freebsd-emulation@FreeBSD.org, FreeBSD-gnats-submit@FreeBSD.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article <199904222239.AAA43095@saturn.kn-bremen.de> you write: >>Description: > > wine now uses kernel threads (rfork()) and expects i386_set_ldt() > to work across threads, i.e. the new LDT be global to all threads. > rfork() copies the ldt regardless of the RFMEM flag so each thread > ends up with its own ldt (sys/i386/i386/vm_machdep.c, cpu_fork()). >>Fix: Here's a patch that makes it share the user LDT for rfork(RFTHREAD...), tested on 3.1-stable. It works by copying only the pcb_ldt pointer and copying it to all peers in i386_set_ldt(2). the status `copied pointer' is indicated by setting pcb_ldt_len = -1, only p_leader's pcb_ldt_len holds the real size. This appears to fix the wine crashes (more in the newsgroups...) if you add RFTHREAD to its rfork args. Everything else works as before, there is only one `problem': if you rfork(RFTHREAD...) and then in the parent do an exec() the exec'd program will still share the LDT as it will still be the p_leader... But as there is nothing else besides wine that uses i386_set_ldt(2) and wine doesn't do this it shouldn't really matter. (Btw. if a child exec()s shouldn't it unlink itself from the p_peers list? Looks like it currently doesn't. Hmm.) One other change: i added a handler for trap 12's at cpu_switch_load_{f,g}s as i was getting these while testing. the finished patch doesn't seem to generate them anymore (only trap 9's for which there already is a handler), but handling them anyway doesn't hurt, right? :) As for style etc., any comments are welcome. this is only my second patch to FreeBSD's kernel... cvs diff: Diffing sys Index: sys/proc.h =================================================================== RCS file: /home/cvs/cvs/src/sys/sys/proc.h,v retrieving revision 1.66.2.2 diff -u -r1.66.2.2 proc.h --- proc.h 1999/02/23 13:44:36 1.66.2.2 +++ proc.h 1999/04/25 17:35:14 @@ -373,6 +373,7 @@ void unsleep __P((struct proc *)); void wakeup_one __P((void *chan)); +void cpu_kill9 __P((struct proc *)); void cpu_exit __P((struct proc *)) __dead2; void exit1 __P((struct proc *, int)) __dead2; void cpu_fork __P((struct proc *, struct proc *)); cvs diff: Diffing kern Index: kern/kern_exit.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/cvs/cvs/src/sys/kern/kern_exit.c,v retrieving revision 1.71.2.2 diff -u -r1.71.2.2 kern_exit.c --- kern_exit.c 1999/03/02 00:42:08 1.71.2.2 +++ kern_exit.c 1999/04/26 14:48:47 @@ -41,6 +41,9 @@ #include "opt_compat.h" #include "opt_ktrace.h" +#ifdef __i386__ +#include "opt_user_ldt.h" +#endif #include #include @@ -139,6 +142,12 @@ * than the internal signal */ kill(p, &killArgs); +#ifdef __i386__ +#ifdef USER_LDT + /* hook to undo LDT sharing */ + cpu_kill9(q); +#endif +#endif nq = q; q = q->p_peers; /* cvs diff: Diffing i386/i386 Index: i386/i386/machdep.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/cvs/cvs/src/sys/i386/i386/machdep.c,v retrieving revision 1.322.2.4 diff -u -r1.322.2.4 machdep.c --- machdep.c 1999/02/17 13:08:41 1.322.2.4 +++ machdep.c 1999/04/26 16:34:31 @@ -815,13 +815,34 @@ #ifdef USER_LDT /* was i386_user_cleanup() in NetBSD */ if (pcb->pcb_ldt) { - if (pcb == curpcb) { - lldt(_default_ldt); - currentldt = _default_ldt; + if (pcb->pcb_ldt_len != -1) { +#ifdef DIAGNOSTIC + if (p->p_leader != p) + panic("setregs: pcb_ldt_len != -1 in peer"); +#endif + if (!p->p_peers) { + if (pcb == curpcb) { + lldt(_default_ldt); + currentldt = _default_ldt; + } + pcb->pcb_ldt_len = (int)pcb->pcb_ldt = 0; + kmem_free(kernel_map, (vm_offset_t)pcb->pcb_ldt, + pcb->pcb_ldt_len * sizeof(union descriptor)); + } else { + /* XXX what to do here? */ + printf("setregs: leader exec()ing, keeping shared user ldt\n"); + } +#ifdef DIAGNOSTIC + } else if (!p->p_leader || p->p_leader == p) { + panic("setregs: pcb_ldt_len == -1 in leader"); +#endif + } else { + if (pcb == curpcb) { + lldt(_default_ldt); + currentldt = _default_ldt; + } + pcb->pcb_ldt_len = (int)pcb->pcb_ldt = 0; } - kmem_free(kernel_map, (vm_offset_t)pcb->pcb_ldt, - pcb->pcb_ldt_len * sizeof(union descriptor)); - pcb->pcb_ldt_len = (int)pcb->pcb_ldt = 0; } #endif Index: i386/i386/sys_machdep.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/cvs/cvs/src/sys/i386/i386/sys_machdep.c,v retrieving revision 1.38 diff -u -r1.38 sys_machdep.c --- sys_machdep.c 1998/12/07 21:58:19 1.38 +++ sys_machdep.c 1999/04/26 15:05:02 @@ -259,8 +259,16 @@ void set_user_ldt(struct pcb *pcb) { + int nldt = pcb->pcb_ldt_len; + if (nldt == -1) { +#ifdef DIAGNOSTIC + if (pcb != (struct pcb *)&curproc->p_addr->u_pcb) + panic("set_user_ldt: pcb->pcb_ldt_len == -1 and pcb != curproc's"); +#endif + nldt = ((struct pcb *)&curproc->p_leader->p_addr->u_pcb)->pcb_ldt_len; + } gdt_segs[GUSERLDT_SEL].ssd_base = (unsigned)pcb->pcb_ldt; - gdt_segs[GUSERLDT_SEL].ssd_limit = (pcb->pcb_ldt_len * sizeof(union descriptor)) - 1; + gdt_segs[GUSERLDT_SEL].ssd_limit = (nldt * sizeof(union descriptor)) - 1; ssdtosd(&gdt_segs[GUSERLDT_SEL], &gdt[GUSERLDT_SEL].sd); lldt(GSEL(GUSERLDT_SEL, SEL_KPL)); currentldt = GSEL(GUSERLDT_SEL, SEL_KPL); @@ -301,6 +309,13 @@ if (pcb->pcb_ldt) { nldt = pcb->pcb_ldt_len; + if (nldt == -1) { +#ifdef DIAGNOSTIC + if (!p->p_leader || p->p_leader == p) + panic("i386_get_ldt: pcb_ldt_len == -1 in leader"); +#endif + nldt = ((struct pcb *)&p->p_leader->p_addr->u_pcb)->pcb_ldt_len; + } num = min(uap->num, nldt); lp = &((union descriptor *)(pcb->pcb_ldt))[uap->start]; } else { @@ -335,7 +350,8 @@ int error = 0, i, n; int largest_ld; struct pcb *pcb = &p->p_addr->u_pcb; - int s; + struct proc *q; + int nldt, s; struct i386_set_ldt_args ua, *uap; if ((error = copyin(args, &ua, sizeof(struct i386_set_ldt_args))) < 0) @@ -359,24 +375,54 @@ return(EINVAL); /* allocate user ldt */ - if (!pcb->pcb_ldt || (largest_ld >= pcb->pcb_ldt_len)) { + nldt = pcb->pcb_ldt_len; + if (nldt == -1) { +#ifdef DIAGNOSTIC + if (!p->p_leader || p->p_leader == p) + panic("i386_set_ldt: pcb_ldt_len == -1 in leader"); +#endif + nldt = ((struct pcb *)&p->p_leader->p_addr->u_pcb)->pcb_ldt_len; + } + if (!pcb->pcb_ldt || (largest_ld >= nldt)) { union descriptor *new_ldt = (union descriptor *)kmem_alloc( kernel_map, SIZE_FROM_LARGEST_LD(largest_ld)); if (new_ldt == NULL) { return ENOMEM; } if (pcb->pcb_ldt) { - bcopy(pcb->pcb_ldt, new_ldt, pcb->pcb_ldt_len + bcopy(pcb->pcb_ldt, new_ldt, nldt * sizeof(union descriptor)); kmem_free(kernel_map, (vm_offset_t)pcb->pcb_ldt, - pcb->pcb_ldt_len * sizeof(union descriptor)); + nldt * sizeof(union descriptor)); } else { bcopy(ldt, new_ldt, sizeof(ldt)); } - pcb->pcb_ldt = (caddr_t)new_ldt; - pcb->pcb_ldt_len = NEW_MAX_LD(largest_ld); + /* + * copy pcb_ldt for peers, set their pcb_ldt_len = -1 + * to indicate this is a copy + */ + for (q = p->p_leader; q; q = q->p_peers) { + struct pcb *pcb2 = &q->p_addr->u_pcb; + + pcb2->pcb_ldt = (caddr_t)new_ldt; + /* the leader gets the real pcb_ldt_len */ + if (q == p->p_leader) + pcb2->pcb_ldt_len = NEW_MAX_LD(largest_ld); + else + pcb2->pcb_ldt_len = -1; + if (pcb2 == curpcb) + set_user_ldt((struct pcb *)&p->p_leader->p_addr->u_pcb); + } +#ifdef DIAGNOSTIC + if (!p->p_leader) + panic("i386_set_ldt: p_leader == 0"); + if (pcb->pcb_ldt != (caddr_t)new_ldt) + panic("i386_set_ldt: pcb->pcb_ldt != new_ldt"); +#endif +#if 0 if (pcb == curpcb) set_user_ldt(pcb); +#endif } /* Check descriptors for access violations */ Index: i386/i386/trap.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/cvs/cvs/src/sys/i386/i386/trap.c,v retrieving revision 1.133 diff -u -r1.133 trap.c --- trap.c 1999/01/06 23:05:36 1.133 +++ trap.c 1999/04/26 13:44:35 @@ -434,6 +434,29 @@ switch (type) { case T_PAGEFLT: /* page fault */ + if (intr_nesting_level == 0) { + /* + * Invalid %fs's and %gs's can be created using + * procfs or PT_SETREGS or by invalidating the + * underlying LDT entry. This causes a fault + * in kernel mode when the kernel attempts to + * switch contexts. Lose the bad context + * (XXX) so that we can continue, and generate + * a signal. + */ + if (frame.tf_eip == (int)cpu_switch_load_fs + && curpcb->pcb_fs) { + curpcb->pcb_fs = 0; + psignal(p, SIGBUS); + return; + } + if (frame.tf_eip == (int)cpu_switch_load_gs + && curpcb->pcb_gs) { + curpcb->pcb_gs = 0; + psignal(p, SIGBUS); + return; + } + } (void) trap_pfault(&frame, FALSE, eva); return; Index: i386/i386/vm_machdep.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/cvs/cvs/src/sys/i386/i386/vm_machdep.c,v retrieving revision 1.115 diff -u -r1.115 vm_machdep.c --- vm_machdep.c 1999/01/06 23:05:37 1.115 +++ vm_machdep.c 1999/04/26 15:31:35 @@ -173,11 +173,32 @@ /* Copy the LDT, if necessary. */ if (pcb2->pcb_ldt != 0) { union descriptor *new_ldt; - size_t len = pcb2->pcb_ldt_len * sizeof(union descriptor); + int nldt = pcb2->pcb_ldt_len; - new_ldt = (union descriptor *)kmem_alloc(kernel_map, len); - bcopy(pcb2->pcb_ldt, new_ldt, len); - pcb2->pcb_ldt = (caddr_t)new_ldt; + if (nldt == -1) { +#ifdef DIAGNOSTIC + if (!p2->p_leader || p2->p_leader == p2) + panic("cpu_fork: pcb_ldt_len == -1 in leader"); +#endif + nldt = ((struct pcb *)&p2->p_leader->p_addr->u_pcb)->pcb_ldt_len; + } + if (p2->p_leader == p1->p_leader) { + /* + * this is a rfork(RFTHREAD|...), + * indicate pcb_ldt is a copy + */ + pcb2->pcb_ldt_len = -1; +#ifdef DIAGNOSTIC + if (p2->p_leader == p2) + panic("cpu_fork: p2->p_leader == p1->p_leader and p2 is leader"); +#endif + } else { + new_ldt = (union descriptor *)kmem_alloc(kernel_map, + nldt * sizeof(union descriptor)); + bcopy(pcb2->pcb_ldt, new_ldt, + nldt * sizeof(union descriptor)); + pcb2->pcb_ldt = (caddr_t)new_ldt; + } } #endif @@ -240,8 +261,13 @@ lldt(_default_ldt); currentldt = _default_ldt; } - kmem_free(kernel_map, (vm_offset_t)pcb->pcb_ldt, - pcb->pcb_ldt_len * sizeof(union descriptor)); + if (pcb->pcb_ldt_len != -1) + kmem_free(kernel_map, (vm_offset_t)pcb->pcb_ldt, + pcb->pcb_ldt_len * sizeof(union descriptor)); +#ifdef DIAGNOSTIC + else if (!p->p_leader || p->p_leader == p) + panic("cpu_exit: pcb_ldt_len == -1 in leader"); +#endif pcb->pcb_ldt_len = (int)pcb->pcb_ldt = 0; } #endif @@ -249,6 +275,25 @@ cpu_switch(p); panic("cpu_exit"); } + +#ifdef USER_LDT +void +cpu_kill9(p) + register struct proc *p; +{ + struct pcb *pcb = &p->p_addr->u_pcb; + /* + * hook to undo ldt sharing: + * we are going to be SIGKILL'd so we can just forget our ldt + */ + if (pcb->pcb_ldt_len == -1) + pcb->pcb_ldt_len = (int)pcb->pcb_ldt = 0; +#ifdef DIAGNOSTIC + if (pcb == curpcb) + panic("cpu_kill9: pcb == curpcb"); +#endif +} +#endif void cpu_wait(p) cvs diff: Diffing pc98/i386 Index: pc98/i386/machdep.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/cvs/cvs/src/sys/pc98/i386/machdep.c,v retrieving revision 1.105.2.3 diff -u -r1.105.2.3 machdep.c --- machdep.c 1999/02/19 14:39:52 1.105.2.3 +++ machdep.c 1999/04/26 16:34:38 @@ -828,13 +828,34 @@ #ifdef USER_LDT /* was i386_user_cleanup() in NetBSD */ if (pcb->pcb_ldt) { - if (pcb == curpcb) { - lldt(_default_ldt); - currentldt = _default_ldt; + if (pcb->pcb_ldt_len != -1) { +#ifdef DIAGNOSTIC + if (p->p_leader != p) + panic("setregs: pcb_ldt_len != -1 in peer"); +#endif + if (!p->p_peers) { + if (pcb == curpcb) { + lldt(_default_ldt); + currentldt = _default_ldt; + } + pcb->pcb_ldt_len = (int)pcb->pcb_ldt = 0; + kmem_free(kernel_map, (vm_offset_t)pcb->pcb_ldt, + pcb->pcb_ldt_len * sizeof(union descriptor)); + } else { + /* XXX what to do here? */ + printf("setregs: leader exec()ing, keeping shared user ldt\n"); + } +#ifdef DIAGNOSTIC + } else if (!p->p_leader || p->p_leader == p) { + panic("setregs: pcb_ldt_len == -1 in leader"); +#endif + } else { + if (pcb == curpcb) { + lldt(_default_ldt); + currentldt = _default_ldt; + } + pcb->pcb_ldt_len = (int)pcb->pcb_ldt = 0; } - kmem_free(kernel_map, (vm_offset_t)pcb->pcb_ldt, - pcb->pcb_ldt_len * sizeof(union descriptor)); - pcb->pcb_ldt_len = (int)pcb->pcb_ldt = 0; } #endif Happy hacking, -- Juergen Lock (remove dot foo from address to reply) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 18:41: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cain.gsoft.com.au (genesi.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 086411519B for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 18:40:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Received: from lot.gsoft.com.au (lot.gsoft.com.au [203.38.152.106]) by cain.gsoft.com.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA16458; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 11:10:01 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199904232348.QAA01772@dingo.cdrom.com> Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 11:10:00 +0930 (CST) From: "Daniel O'Connor" To: Mike Smith Subject: Re: Generic PnP? (Was: Re: IrDA? PnP?) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Warner Losh , Joachim Isaksson Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 23-Apr-99 Mike Smith wrote: > > I can't see that this would be very hard to implement, but then I'm not a > > kernel > > guru (yet :-) > It's not a question of "hard" so much as "useful". Well.. IRDA printers are moderatly common for laptops.. Though implementing an IRDA stack is apparently a pain in the ass.. So maybe its hard (ish) and not too useful :) --- Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." -- Andrew Tanenbaum To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 18:57: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32C4814BF2 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 18:57:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA62682 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 18:56:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Arlan 655 driver for FreeBSD. Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 18:56:30 -0700 Message-ID: <62679.925178190@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Is anyone interesting in working with Mr. Sharov to make this happen? I don't have any access to ARLAN equipment myself. ------- Forwarded Message Date: Sun, 04 Apr 1999 16:56:59 +0700 From: ivan sharov Reply-To: ivan.sharov@iname.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.5-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: jkh@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: new freebsd driver Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from base64 to 8bit by zippy.cdrom.com id BAA23998 Hi Jordan ! First, thanx for your great work ! Second, I had developed arlan 655 driver for freebsd. This is 2Mbit radioethernet ISA card, for more info see http://www.aironet.com I am tested it with all freebsd version 2.2.5 - 2.2.8. Driver worked also with freebsd 3.0, and now i am testing it with 3.1 release. Can you include this driver in freebsd current ? or that steep I need for make it ? Driver source and same instruction any people can find at http://www.gcom.ru/~arlan/arlan655-021298.tgz - -- /ivan sharov, e-mail ivan.sharov@iname.com fidonet 2:5000/81 ------- End of Forwarded Message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 23:29:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83C6914F65 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 23:28:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id PAA29404 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 15:58:18 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id PAA60339 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 15:57:53 +0930 (CST) Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 15:57:42 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Does booting from install floppy with a serial console still work? Message-ID: <19990427155741.A46511@freebie.lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've just tried to capture the sequence of booting on 3.1 for the next edition of "The Complete FreeBSD". I was somewhat less than successful. Simply removing the keyboard and telling the BIOS I had none had no effect whatsoever: it went on merrily booting from floppy and displaying on the monitor. Next, I tried interrupting the first level boot. This worked fine: I got my connection on the serial line, but I couldn't find anything to boot. Here's the dialogue: Connected. >> FreeBSD/i386 BOOT Default: 0:fd(0,a)boot boot: (pressed Enter) No boot >> FreeBSD/i386 BOOT Default: 0:fd(0,a)boot boot: fd()kernel >> FreeBSD/i386 BOOT Default: 0:fd(0,a)boot boot: kernel No kernel >> FreeBSD/i386 BOOT Default: 0:fd(0,a)kernel boot: ? . .. boot kernel.gz kernel.config >> FreeBSD/i386 BOOT Default: 0:fd(0,a)? boot: kernel.gz Invalid format >> FreeBSD/i386 BOOT Default: 0:fd(0,a)kernel boot: peace No peace Any ideas? Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 23:31:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from plexus.nu (cm2081634025.ponderosa.ispchannel.com [208.163.40.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9917714F65 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 23:31:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tas@stephens.org) Received: from plexus.nu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by plexus.nu (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id HAA07150; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 07:31:16 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from tas@plexus.nu) Message-Id: <199904270631.HAA07150@plexus.nu> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: Thomas Stephens From: Thomas Stephens Subject: O_SYNC and O_FSYNC MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <7146.925194675.1@plexus.nu> Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 23:31:16 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Would there be any objection to defining O_SYNC as O_FSYNC in /usr/include/sys/fcntl.h? O_SYNC is part of the Single UNIX Specification, and adding it would ease porting. Regards, Thomas Stephens tas@stephens.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Apr 26 23:46: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk [130.159.196.126]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B19014D92 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 23:45:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roger@cs.strath.ac.uk) Received: from cs.strath.ac.uk (scary.dmem.strath.ac.uk [130.159.202.5]) by fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA13724 Tue, 27 Apr 1999 07:45:55 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <37255D21.ED7A3F6E@cs.strath.ac.uk> Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 07:45:53 +0100 From: Roger Hardiman Organization: Strathclyde University X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Is pci0.16.0 a valid PCI location? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi. Someone on -multimedia reported kernel panics when they enabled the bt848 driver. a) Does anyone know of any brain damaged Micron 440 LX motherboards. b) I noticed this in their boot log > bktr0: rev 0x11 int a irq 11 on pci0.16.0 Is PCI location 16 valid? I have never seen anything go higher than pci0.12.0 before. Bye Roger To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 0:24:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (spinner.netplex.com.au [202.12.86.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0A391517E for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 00:24:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) Received: from netplex.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spinner.netplex.com.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8BAC21F58; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 15:24:04 +0800 (WST) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Greg Lehey Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Does booting from install floppy with a serial console still work? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 27 Apr 1999 15:57:42 +0930." <19990427155741.A46511@freebie.lemis.com> Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 15:24:04 +0800 From: Peter Wemm Message-Id: <19990427072411.8BAC21F58@spinner.netplex.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey wrote: > I've just tried to capture the sequence of booting on 3.1 for the next > edition of "The Complete FreeBSD". I was somewhat less than > successful. Simply removing the keyboard and telling the BIOS I had > none had no effect whatsoever: it went on merrily booting from floppy > and displaying on the monitor. > > Next, I tried interrupting the first level boot. This worked fine: I > got my connection on the serial line, but I couldn't find anything to > boot. Here's the dialogue: > > Connected. > >> FreeBSD/i386 BOOT > Default: 0:fd(0,a)boot > boot: (pressed Enter) > No boot Hmm, that should be /boot/loader, not boot. This works for me... >> FreeBSD/i386 BOOT Default: 0:da(0,a)/boot/loader boot: /-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\ Console: serial port BIOS drive A: is disk0 BIOS drive C: is disk1 [..] But I have: # cat /boot.config /boot/loader -P Cheers, -Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 0:36:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from public2.east.net.cn (public2.east.cn.net [202.96.49.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 016AC1517E for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 00:36:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from suihy@ucscomm.com) Received: from public.east.net.cn (public [202.96.49.1]) by public2.east.net.cn with ESMTP id PAA09058 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 15:35:44 +0900 (CDT) Received: from host1 ([202.99.55.35]) by public.east.net.cn with SMTP id PAA18011 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 15:35:29 +0900 (CDT) Message-ID: <006501be9080$31e41f40$1801020a@host> From: "163.net" To: Subject: application Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 15:33:05 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0062_01BE90C3.3EB7ADC0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.0810.800 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.0810.800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0062_01BE90C3.3EB7ADC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable auth 55ec40a6 subscribe freebsd-hackers suihy@ucscomm.com ------=_NextPart_000_0062_01BE90C3.3EB7ADC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ------=_NextPart_000_0062_01BE90C3.3EB7ADC0-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 1:31: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA5D114BF8 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 01:30:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id SAA29840; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 18:00:54 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id SAA63014; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 18:00:52 +0930 (CST) Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 18:00:52 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Peter Wemm Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Does booting from install floppy with a serial console still work? Message-ID: <19990427180052.G46511@freebie.lemis.com> References: <19990427155741.A46511@freebie.lemis.com> <19990427072411.8BAC21F58@spinner.netplex.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <19990427072411.8BAC21F58@spinner.netplex.com.au>; from Peter Wemm on Tue, Apr 27, 1999 at 03:24:04PM +0800 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tuesday, 27 April 1999 at 15:24:04 +0800, Peter Wemm wrote: > Greg Lehey wrote: >> I've just tried to capture the sequence of booting on 3.1 for the next >> edition of "The Complete FreeBSD". I was somewhat less than >> successful. Simply removing the keyboard and telling the BIOS I had >> none had no effect whatsoever: it went on merrily booting from floppy >> and displaying on the monitor. >> >> Next, I tried interrupting the first level boot. This worked fine: I >> got my connection on the serial line, but I couldn't find anything to >> boot. Here's the dialogue: >> >> Connected. >>>> FreeBSD/i386 BOOT >> Default: 0:fd(0,a)boot >> boot: (pressed Enter) >> No boot > > Hmm, that should be /boot/loader, not boot. This works for me... > >>> FreeBSD/i386 BOOT > Default: 0:da(0,a)/boot/loader > boot: > /-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\ > Console: serial port > BIOS drive A: is disk0 > BIOS drive C: is disk1 > [..] > > But I have: # cat /boot.config > /boot/loader -P Oops, sorry, I didn't make as clear as I should have that this was the install floppy. I don't have any difficulties doing this from an installed system (modulo the undocumented fact that if you have sio0 configured as a low-level debug port that it will switch back to vga again). Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 2:35:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE1CB14CD4 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 02:35:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id CAA00567; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 02:35:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 02:35:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904270935.CAA00567@apollo.backplane.com> To: David Greenman , Julian Elischer , luoqi@watermarkgroup.com, alc@cs.rice.edu, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Found TCP NFS bug in packet trace. Looks like nfs_realign() is broken Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I direct everyone's attention to the '30fb 64XX' sequence in the below packet trace. This demonstrates why TCP NFS links get stuck. The TCP packet is encompassing *two* requests rather then one. This is correct. However, the server is screwing up on it. Note that in the NFS request, the NFS xid is '30fb 64dc' for the first request and '30fb 64dd' for the second. Note that in the NFS reply, *BOTH* xid's in the reply are 30fb 64dd. 30fb 64dc got destroyed! In fact, it looks like the server is sending two copies of the 30fb 64dd response instead of a 30fb 64dc and 30fb 64dd response. I tracked it down to nfs_realign(). The routine tries to realign data contained in an mbuf. It completely destroys one of the commands in the mbuf while attempting to realign the other. The destruction occurs due to the shared-data nature of mbufs when ( as far as I can tell ) the mbuf is flagged M_EXT. If I turn nfs_realign() into a NOP, TCP mounts appear to work again ( at least better then they did before. There is still occassional weirdness ). Doh! I'll have a patch to fix this properly later on tuesday. This brings up another problem, though - unaligned mbufs appear to be a regular occurance w/NFS but the data *appears* to be aligned in the tcpdump. Is the MAC header or TCP options causing the packet data to be unaligned? I'm guessing that NFS is doing a lot of buffer realigning and its probably having a negative effect on performance. I can rewrite the alignment code to allocate fresh mbufs, but I would kinda like to know why the below tcp packets appear to be unaligned from the point of view of the NFS code. there might be a quick fix we can make somewhere to increase performance. -Matt Matthew Dillon 23:48:09.209937 209.157.86.12.1021 > 209.157.86.2.2049: P 100656:100920(264) ack 60585 win 17200 (DF) 4500 0130 1436 4000 4006 d648 d19d 560c d19d 5602 03fd 0801 186c d0c5 7371 bbce 5018 4330 3ab3 0000 8000 0080 30fb 64dc <<<<<<<<< 0000 0000 0000 0002 0001 86a3 0000 0003 0000 0003 0000 0001 0000 0030 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0007 0000 0000 0000 0002 0000 0003 0000 0004 0000 0005 0000 0014 0000 001f 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 001c 0700 0000 4216 9c77 0c00 0000 8e45 0300 6922 8679 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0004 6c69 623a 8000 0080 >>>>>>>> 30fb 64dd 0000 0000 0000 0002 0001 86a3 0000 0003 0000 0003 0000 0001 0000 0030 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0007 0000 0000 0000 0002 0000 0003 0000 0004 0000 0005 0000 0014 0000 001f 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 001c 0700 0000 4216 9c77 0c00 0000 8e45 0300 6922 8679 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0003 6c69 6200 23:48:09.214561 209.157.86.2.2049 > 209.157.86.12.1021: P 60749:60989(240) ack 101116 win 33176 (DF) 4500 0118 7cdc 4000 4006 6dba d19d 5602 d19d 560c 0801 03fd 7371 bc72 186c d291 5018 8198 7102 0000 8000 0074 30fb 64dd <<<<<<<< 0000 0001 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0002 0000 0001 0000 0002 0000 01ed 0000 0003 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0200 0000 0000 0000 0400 0000 00c6 000d 0016 0000 0000 0000 0007 0000 0000 0003 458e 3725 5d9d 0000 0000 3725 5d9d 0000 0000 3725 5d9d 0000 0000 >>>>>>>> 8000 0074 30fb 64dd 0000 0001 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0002 0000 0001 0000 0002 0000 01ed 0000 0003 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0200 0000 0000 0000 0400 0000 00c6 000d 0016 0000 0000 0000 0007 0000 0000 0003 458e 3725 5d9d 0000 0000 3725 5d9d 0000 0000 3725 5d9d 0000 0000 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 2:40:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from stampede.cs.berkeley.edu (stampede.CS.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.45.124]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B484014DC7 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 02:40:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from asami@cs.berkeley.edu) Received: from silvia.hip.berkeley.edu (sji-ca41-179.ix.netcom.com [209.111.208.179]) by stampede.cs.berkeley.edu (8.8.7/8.7.3) with ESMTP id CAA11427; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 02:41:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from asami@localhost) by silvia.hip.berkeley.edu (8.9.2/8.6.9) id CAA23892; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 02:40:29 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 02:40:29 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904270940.CAA23892@silvia.hip.berkeley.edu> X-Authentication-Warning: silvia.hip.berkeley.edu: asami set sender to asami@cs.berkeley.edu using -f To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu Cc: jobaldwi@vt.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: <199904230520.WAA64167@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> (message from Steve Kargl on Thu, 22 Apr 1999 22:20:44 -0700 (PDT)) Subject: Re: revisiting Motif policy in ports From: asami@freebsd.org (Satoshi - Ports Wraith - Asami) References: <199904230520.WAA64167@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG * From: Steve Kargl * No. If you don't have HAVE_MOTIF in /etc/make.conf, then you get: * * cd /usr/ports/editors/nedit * make install * nedit-5.0.2 requires motif. * * I think the last line should at least be changed to advertise * the availability of LessTif. * * cd /usr/ports/editors/nedit * make install * nedit-5.0.2 requires motif. LessTif is a LGPL implementation * of the Motif API. A port is available in ports/x11-toolkits/lesstif. * See /etc/make.conf. I think this is a good idea. Is this wording OK for everyone? (I'll substitute "${PORTSDIR}/" for the "ports/" part above.) -PW To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 6:48:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.54]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B1D4153FF; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 06:48:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) id GAA85213; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 06:46:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sgk) From: Steve Kargl Message-Id: <199904271346.GAA85213@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Subject: Re: revisiting Motif policy in ports In-Reply-To: <199904270940.CAA23892@silvia.hip.berkeley.edu> from Satoshi - Ports Wraith - Asami at "Apr 27, 1999 02:40:29 am" To: asami@freebsd.org (Satoshi - Ports Wraith - Asami) Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 06:46:03 -0700 (PDT) Cc: jobaldwi@vt.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL54 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Satoshi - Ports Wraith - Asami wrote: > * From: Steve Kargl > > * No. If you don't have HAVE_MOTIF in /etc/make.conf, then you get: > * > * cd /usr/ports/editors/nedit > * make install > * nedit-5.0.2 requires motif. > * > * I think the last line should at least be changed to advertise > * the availability of LessTif. > * > * cd /usr/ports/editors/nedit > * make install > * nedit-5.0.2 requires motif. LessTif is a LGPL implementation > * of the Motif API. A port is available in ports/x11-toolkits/lesstif. > * See /etc/make.conf. > > I think this is a good idea. Is this wording OK for everyone? (I'll > substitute "${PORTSDIR}/" for the "ports/" part above.) > It's okay with me :-) -- Steve To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 8:30:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from panzer.plutotech.com (panzer.plutotech.com [206.168.67.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C521815661 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 08:30:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ken@panzer.plutotech.com) Received: (from ken@localhost) by panzer.plutotech.com (8.9.3/8.8.5) id JAA63243; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 09:30:41 -0600 (MDT) From: "Kenneth D. Merry" Message-Id: <199904271530.JAA63243@panzer.plutotech.com> Subject: Re: Is pci0.16.0 a valid PCI location? In-Reply-To: <37255D21.ED7A3F6E@cs.strath.ac.uk> from Roger Hardiman at "Apr 27, 1999 7:45:53 am" To: roger@cs.strath.ac.uk (Roger Hardiman) Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 09:30:41 -0600 (MDT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Roger Hardiman wrote... > Hi. > Someone on -multimedia reported kernel panics when they enabled the > bt848 driver. > > a) Does anyone know of any brain damaged Micron 440 LX motherboards. > > b) I noticed this in their boot log > > > bktr0: rev 0x11 int a irq 11 on pci0.16.0 > > Is PCI location 16 valid? I have never seen anything go higher than > pci0.12.0 before. Yes, that's a valid bus/device/function. The device/slot numbers can go up to 31. Ken -- Kenneth Merry ken@plutotech.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 8:33:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5D45151A1 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 08:33:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA02141 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 11:33:54 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904271533.LAA02141@cs.rpi.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: iicbus and smbus Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 11:33:54 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I have compiled my kernel with the following 'config' options/devices/ controllers: controller smbus0 controller iicbus0 controller iicbb0 device ic0 at iicbus? device iic0 at iicbus? device iicsmb0 at iicbus? device smb0 at iicbus? Any attempts to open() /dev/smb0 result in "Invalid argument". This includes the detect.c from http://www.freebsd.org/~nsouch/. Below is my dmesg, I notice no messages about iicbus or smbus at all, but the open on the device is not "device not configured". My end goal is to use the lm.c linked from the above page to get mobo status information. ---------------dmesg---------------- Copyright (c) 1992-1999 FreeBSD Inc. Copyright (c) 1982, 1986, 1989, 1991, 1993 The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE #0: Tue Apr 27 10:08:23 EDT 1999 root@phoenix.home:/usr/src/sys/compile/PHOENIX_HOME Timecounter "i8254" frequency 1193182 Hz Timecounter "TSC" frequency 350796609 Hz CPU: Pentium II/Xeon/Celeron (350.80-MHz 686-class CPU) Origin = "GenuineIntel" Id = 0x652 Stepping=2 Features=0x183f9ff> real memory = 134217728 (131072K bytes) avail memory = 127590400 (124600K bytes) Preloaded elf kernel "kernel" at 0xc02cc000. Probing for devices on PCI bus 0: chip0: rev 0x03 on pci0.0.0 chip1: rev 0x03 on pci0.1.0 chip2: rev 0x02 on pci0.7.0 ide_pci0: rev 0x01 on pci0.7.1 chip3: rev 0x02 on pci0.7.3 ahc0: rev 0x00 int a irq 10 on pci0.11.0 ahc0: aic7880 Wide Channel A, SCSI Id=7, 16/255 SCBs xl0: <3Com 3c900-TPO Etherlink XL> rev 0x00 int a irq 10 on pci0.13.0 xl0: Ethernet address: 00:60:08:a9:db:e2 xl0: selecting 10baseT transceiver, half duplex Probing for devices on PCI bus 1: vga0: rev 0x04 int a irq 10 on pci1.0.0 Probing for devices on the ISA bus: sc0 on isa sc0: VGA color <4 virtual consoles, flags=0x0> atkbdc0 at 0x60-0x6f on motherboard atkbd0 irq 1 on isa psm0 irq 12 on isa psm0: model Generic PS/2 mouse, device ID 0 fdc0 at 0x3f0-0x3f7 irq 6 drq 2 on isa fdc0: FIFO enabled, 8 bytes threshold fd0: 1.44MB 3.5in fd1: 1.2MB 5.25in wdc0 at 0x1f0-0x1f7 irq 14 flags 0xa0ffa0ff on isa wdc0: unit 0 (wd0): , DMA, 32-bit, multi-block-16 wd0: 6149MB (12594960 sectors), 13328 cyls, 15 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S wdc0: unit 1 (wd1): , DMA, 32-bit, multi-block-16 wd1: 4924MB (10085040 sectors), 10672 cyls, 15 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S wdc1 at 0x170-0x177 irq 15 flags 0xa0ffa0ff on isa wdc1: unit 0 (atapi): , removable, intr, iordis acd0: drive speed 689KB/sec, 128KB cache acd0: supported read types: acd0: Audio: play, 255 volume levels acd0: Mechanism: ejectable tray acd0: Medium: CD-ROM 120mm data disc loaded, unlocked, lock protected wdc1: unit 1 (atapi): , removable, dma, iordy acd1: drive speed 1377KB/sec, 256KB cache acd1: supported read types: acd1: Audio: play, 256 volume levels acd1: Mechanism: ejectable tray acd1: Medium: no/blank disc inside, unlocked, lock protected ppc0 at 0x378 irq 7 on isa ppc0: SMC-like chipset (ECP/EPP/PS2/NIBBLE) in COMPATIBLE mode ppc0: FIFO with 16/16/16 bytes threshold ppb0: IEEE1284 device found /NIBBLE Probing for PnP devices on ppbus0: ppbus0: HP ENHANCED PCL5,PJL 1 3C5x9 board(s) on ISA found at 0x310 ep0 at 0x310-0x31f irq 11 on isa ep0: utp[*UTP*] address 00:a0:24:12:8d:10 npx0 on motherboard npx0: INT 16 interface vga0 at 0x3b0-0x3df maddr 0xa0000 msize 131072 on isa -- David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 8:48:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from shidahara1.planet.sci.kobe-u.ac.jp (shidahara1.planet.sci.kobe-u.ac.jp [133.30.50.200]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F423115553 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 08:48:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from takawata@shidahara1.planet.sci.kobe-u.ac.jp) Received: from libr.scitec.kobe-u.ac.jp (cs22105.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp [202.219.4.21]) by shidahara1.planet.sci.kobe-u.ac.jp (8.8.8+2.7Wbeta7/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA16463; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 00:39:13 +0900 (JST) Received: from shidahara1.planet.kobe-u.ac.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by libr.scitec.kobe-u.ac.jp (8.9.1/3.5Wpl7) with ESMTP id AAA11592; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 00:44:34 +0900 (JST) From: takawata@shidahara1.planet.sci.kobe-u.ac.jp Message-Id: <199904271544.AAA11592@libr.scitec.kobe-u.ac.jp> To: "David E. Cross" Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: iicbus and smbus In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 27 Apr 1999 11:33:54 -0400." <199904271533.LAA02141@cs.rpi.edu> Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 00:44:33 +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <199904271533.LAA02141@cs.rpi.edu>, "David E. Cross" wrote: >I have compiled my kernel with the following 'config' options/devices/ >controllers: >controller smbus0 >controller iicbus0 >controller iicbb0 > >device ic0 at iicbus? >device iic0 at iicbus? >device iicsmb0 at iicbus? >device smb0 at iicbus? You may forgotten controller (int|al)pm0 . >chip3: rev 0x02 on pci0.7.3 In your case you may need controller intpm0 Takanori Watanabe Public Key Key fingerprint = 2C 51 E2 78 2C E1 C5 2D 0F F1 20 A3 11 3A 62 2A To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 9: 0:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailhub.scl.ameslab.gov (mailhub.scl.ameslab.gov [147.155.137.127]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7EA815553 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 09:00:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ghelmer@scl.ameslab.gov) Received: from demios.ether.scl.ameslab.gov ([147.155.137.54]) by mailhub.scl.ameslab.gov with esmtp (Exim 1.90 #1) id 10cAIV-0001O9-00; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 11:01:23 -0500 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 11:00:36 -0500 From: Guy Helmer To: "David E. Cross" Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: iicbus and smbus In-Reply-To: <199904271533.LAA02141@cs.rpi.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 27 Apr 1999, David E. Cross wrote: > I have compiled my kernel with the following 'config' options/devices/ > controllers: > controller smbus0 > controller iicbus0 > controller iicbb0 > > device ic0 at iicbus? > device iic0 at iicbus? > device iicsmb0 at iicbus? > device smb0 at iicbus? Should the last line be device smb0 at smbus? That's how the line looks in the LINT config file. > Any attempts to open() /dev/smb0 result in "Invalid argument". This includes > the detect.c from http://www.freebsd.org/~nsouch/. Below is my dmesg, I > notice no messages about iicbus or smbus at all, but the open on the device > is not "device not configured". Yes, I encountered the same problem (no bootup recognition of the I2C stuff) when I tried to use this with my ASUS P2BD-S motherboard. I'm using 4.0-CURRENT from April 20 or so. Guy Guy Helmer, Ph.D. Candidate, Iowa State University Dept. of Computer Science Research Assistant, Ames Laboratory --- ghelmer@scl.ameslab.gov Research Assistant, Dept. of Computer Science --- ghelmer@cs.iastate.edu http://www.cs.iastate.edu/~ghelmer To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 9:14:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apb.lg.ua (apb.lg.ua [195.5.44.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9AFD15648 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 09:14:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nl@umeh.apb.lg.ua) Received: from umeh.apb.lg.ua (IDENT:nl@gw.umeh.apb.lug [192.168.70.249]) by apb.lg.ua (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA19249 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 19:15:35 +0300 Received: from localhost (nl@localhost) by umeh.apb.lg.ua (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA27731 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 19:28:56 +0300 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 19:28:55 +0300 (EEST) From: "eugeni v. tatarincev" To: hackers@freebsd.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG unsubscribe freebsd-hackers To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 9:49:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za (zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za [146.64.24.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92B2714E5B for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 09:49:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jhay@zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za) Received: (from jhay@localhost) by zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA78205; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 18:48:39 +0200 (SAT) (envelope-from jhay) From: John Hay Message-Id: <199904271648.SAA78205@zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za> Subject: Re: iicbus and smbus In-Reply-To: <199904271544.AAA11592@libr.scitec.kobe-u.ac.jp> from "takawata@shidahara1.planet.sci.kobe-u.ac.jp" at "Apr 28, 1999 00:44:33 am" To: takawata@shidahara1.planet.sci.kobe-u.ac.jp Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 18:48:39 +0200 (SAT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL54 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > In message <199904271533.LAA02141@cs.rpi.edu>, "David E. Cross" wrote: > >I have compiled my kernel with the following 'config' options/devices/ > >controllers: > >controller smbus0 > >controller iicbus0 > >controller iicbb0 > > > >device ic0 at iicbus? > >device iic0 at iicbus? > >device iicsmb0 at iicbus? > >device smb0 at iicbus? > > You may forgotten > controller (int|al)pm0 > . > > >chip3: rev 0x02 on pci0.7.3 > > In your case you may need > controller intpm0 > It looks like intpm and almp hasn't been merged to -stable yet. Are there any plans to do it? John -- John Hay -- John.Hay@mikom.csir.co.za To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 10:51: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tornado.cisco.com (tornado.cisco.com [171.69.104.22]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25AE415627; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 10:51:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bmcgover@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com) Received: from bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (bmcgover-pc.cisco.com [171.69.104.147]) by tornado.cisco.com (8.8.5-Cisco.1/8.6.5) with ESMTP id NAA01545; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 13:51:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (localhost.pa.dtd.cisco.com [127.0.0.1]) by bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id NAA00825; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 13:51:05 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from bmcgover@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com) Message-Id: <199904271751.NAA00825@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com> To: ports@freebsd.org Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Make index issue w/3.1-RELEASE Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 13:51:05 -0400 From: Brian McGovern Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I hate to follow up on my own post, but I think I found the issue I've been having with package Indexes trying to use a category as a dependency. It appears that the port system's "make index" does in fact make the index, but inserts spaces before the dependencies (and some other fields). This apparently confuses sysinstall, and sysinstall tries to install the first category of packages as a dependency. Anyhow, now that I know what I need to fix, I can fix it, but I thought you'd like to make changes on your end so this doesn't become an issue for someone else :) -Brian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 12:34:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F06014D64 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 12:34:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA02448; Mon, 26 Apr 1999 19:25:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904270225.TAA02448@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Arlan 655 driver for FreeBSD. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 26 Apr 1999 18:56:30 PDT." <62679.925178190@zippy.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 19:25:08 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Is anyone interesting in working with Mr. Sharov to make this happen? > I don't have any access to ARLAN equipment myself. This was discussed last time around; the AR655 is an obsolete (and no longer available) model; about as moribund as the ISA Wavelan cards that we support. It's probably better for the driver to remain externally maintained, but putting it on the CD somewhere might be nice. > ------- Forwarded Message > > Date: Sun, 04 Apr 1999 16:56:59 +0700 > From: ivan sharov > Reply-To: ivan.sharov@iname.com > X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.5-RELEASE i386) > X-Accept-Language: en > MIME-Version: 1.0 > To: jkh@FreeBSD.ORG > Subject: new freebsd driver > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit > X-MIME-Autoconverted: from base64 to 8bit by zippy.cdrom.com id BAA23998 > > Hi Jordan ! > > First, thanx for your great work ! > > Second, I had developed arlan 655 driver for freebsd. This is 2Mbit > radioethernet ISA card, for more info see http://www.aironet.com I am > tested it with all freebsd version 2.2.5 - 2.2.8. Driver worked also > with freebsd 3.0, and now i am testing it with 3.1 release. > > Can you include this driver in freebsd current ? or that steep I need > for make it ? > > Driver source and same instruction any people can find at > http://www.gcom.ru/~arlan/arlan655-021298.tgz > > - -- > > /ivan sharov, > e-mail ivan.sharov@iname.com > fidonet 2:5000/81 > > > > ------- End of Forwarded Message > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 13:18:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6CC0E15174; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 13:18:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id NAA00464; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 13:18:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 13:18:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904272018.NAA00464@apollo.backplane.com> To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: NFS Patch #8 for current available - new TCP fixes Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG (fanfair!) NFS Patch #8 for -current is now available. This patch fixes serious bugs w/ NFS/TCP. Probably not *all* the failure conditions, but hopefully most of them. http://www.backplane.com/FreeBSD4/ NFS attempts to realign packet buffers and trods all over the underlying mbufs. For TCP connections, several RPC's may be present in an mbuf chain. The realignment of one of them may destroy the others. This does not occur with UDP because each UDP packet contains only a single rpc. Packet buffers may be unaligned for a number of reasons. The main reason is due to the 14 byte MAC header on the ethernet frame. This causes the remainder of the packet - the ip payload - to NOT be 4-byte aligned. Many ethernet drivers fudge the packet buffer in order to cause the IP payload to be aligned. Some do not. The ones that do not cause the NFS code to realign the packet and it is the nfs_realign() procedure that is broken. So the combination of having the wrong ethernet card in the server and trying to use NFS/TCP would cause some people to have lots of problems while other people might not have any problems. Neither the 'de' nor the 'xl' ethernet drivers align the packet. The 'xl' driver conditionally aligns it for the alpha. Part of the patch fixes the 'xl' driver to unconditionally align the packet buffer in order to improve NFS performance. I could not do the same for the 'de' driver because I am unsure if the dec chipset can handle an unaligned start address. The patch also fixes the nfs_realign() code so it will work properly with unaligned packets. The patch has also been updated to patch against the latest -current. As usual, any and all feedback will be appreciated. There are still NFS issues to be resolved, including a number related to AMD ( automountdaemon). Depending on how my testing works, further TCP patches may be in the wings. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 13:43:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sol (cs1-gw.cs.binghamton.edu [128.226.171.72]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 4475814CF6 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 13:43:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu) Received: from localhost (zzhang@localhost) by sol (SMI-8.6/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA05410 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 16:33:28 -0400 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 16:33:28 -0400 (EDT) From: Zhihui Zhang To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Basic SMP-kernel questions Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Since I have moved from FreeBSD 2.2.8 to FreeBSD 3.1, I want to know some of the issues not related to uni-processor kernel. For example: (1) During the system bootup, which CPU gets started first. Does this CPU have to start up other CPUs (via some special instruction)? If all CPU startup at the same time, who is going to run locore.s? (2) If an external interrupt occurs, which CPU will respond to it? Or all CPUs will respond to it? How about internal exceptions? (3) What is the kernel model of FreeeBSD 3.1? I believe that it is not master-slave model. I hope I can get some document sources (URLs) on questions (1) and (2). Any help is appreciated. -------------------------------------------------- Zhihui Zhang. Please visit http://www.freebsd.org -------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 14:27:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailhost2.yahoo.com (mailhost2.yahoo.com [206.132.89.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51599151DD for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 14:27:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jayanth@yahoo-inc.com) Received: from borogove.yahoo.com (borogove.yahoo.com [205.216.162.65]) by mailhost2.yahoo.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA60599 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 14:27:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from yahoo-inc.com (milk.yahoo.com [206.132.89.117]) by borogove.yahoo.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA23753 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 14:27:25 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <37262BBD.889C66D@yahoo-inc.com> Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 14:27:25 -0700 From: Jayanth Vijayaraghavan X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: kernel to disk file Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I need to copy chunks of data from the kernel to a disk file . what would be an efficient way to do that ? thanks jayanth To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 15:26:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D394C15056; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 15:26:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id PAA00952; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 15:26:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 15:26:54 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904272226.PAA00952@apollo.backplane.com> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, peter@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: thanks re: kernel.debug/kernel mess! Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I would like to thank Peter and the other architects of the new kernel/kernel.debug build methodology! Having it generate a kernel.debug, create the debug-stripped 'kernel' in /usr/src/sys/compile/ID/, and install the stripped version on make install really makes life a lot easier for me and, probably, everyone else who is compiling up debug kernels. Thanks! -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 15:32:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailhub.psn.ie (mailhub.psn.ie [194.106.150.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1274714D35 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 15:32:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ad@psn.ie) Received: from vmunix.psn.ie ([194.106.150.252]) by mailhub.psn.ie with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #3) id 10cGMy-000IPg-00; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 23:30:25 +0100 Received: from localhost.psn.ie ([127.0.0.1] helo=localhost) by vmunix.psn.ie with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #1) id 10cGMF-0000Dl-00; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 23:29:39 +0100 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 23:29:39 +0100 (IST) From: Andy Doran To: Jayanth Vijayaraghavan Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: kernel to disk file In-Reply-To: <37262BBD.889C66D@yahoo-inc.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 27 Apr 1999, Jayanth Vijayaraghavan wrote: > I need to copy chunks of data from the kernel to a disk file . > what would be an efficient way to do that ? man 3 kvm Andy. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 15:34:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C14814D35 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 15:34:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA38974; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 23:34:35 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 23:34:35 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Matthew Dillon Cc: David Greenman , Julian Elischer , luoqi@watermarkgroup.com, alc@cs.rice.edu, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Found TCP NFS bug in packet trace. Looks like nfs_realign() is broken In-Reply-To: <199904270935.CAA00567@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 27 Apr 1999, Matthew Dillon wrote: > I direct everyone's attention to the '30fb 64XX' sequence in the below > packet trace. This demonstrates why TCP NFS links get stuck. Good catch! -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 16: 7:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BF0D1528F for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 16:07:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id IAA28841; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 08:06:44 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <37262ED8.125DCD2E@newsguy.com> Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 06:40:40 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Greg Lehey Cc: Peter Wemm , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Does booting from install floppy with a serial console still work? References: <19990427155741.A46511@freebie.lemis.com> <19990427072411.8BAC21F58@spinner.netplex.com.au> <19990427180052.G46511@freebie.lemis.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg Lehey wrote: > > Oops, sorry, I didn't make as clear as I should have that this was the > install floppy. I don't have any difficulties doing this from an > installed system (modulo the undocumented fact that if you have sio0 > configured as a low-level debug port that it will switch back to vga > again). The installation floppy also uses loader (in fact, even if you did boot kernel directly, it would have failed because loader.rc was not run). -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "Well, Windows works, using a loose definition of 'works'..." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 16:24:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FA5414BE6; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 16:24:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA95685; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 19:22:13 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 19:22:13 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Matthew Dillon Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, peter@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: thanks re: kernel.debug/kernel mess! In-Reply-To: <199904272226.PAA00952@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 27 Apr 1999, Matthew Dillon wrote: > I would like to thank Peter and the other architects of the > new kernel/kernel.debug build methodology! Having it > generate a kernel.debug, create the debug-stripped 'kernel' > in /usr/src/sys/compile/ID/, and install the stripped version > on make install really makes life a lot easier for me and, > probably, everyone else who is compiling up debug kernels. I agree. Greg's idea was right, it's too bad that his implementation *changed* instead of *adding*. I've seen *so* many good ideas go out the door here, because folks want to force change instead of adding options. The battle over init/shtudown, doing it the BSD way versus the AT&T way, is a great example of an idea that won't fly until those involved learn to cooperate, not coerce. That said, I would like to propose one addition. If you don't like it, fine, but if there was a 'debug-install' target that did the normal install thing, then copied kernel.debug to /var/crash for me, that would be the cherry on top! Any of us could do that, but one or two dissenters here would stop me. Notice, this would change *nothing* if the user didn't specifically use that target. > > Thanks! > > -Matt > Matthew Dillon > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 17: 4:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B15D154BB for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 17:04:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA12330; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 17:04:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904280004.RAA12330@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: greg@ncd.com Subject: cvs repository for NAS? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 17:04:14 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG One good thing about NAS (among many ) is that it has a BSD-like license hint not GNU and it will be nice if we can keep NAS alive and well. greg@ncd.com said: > Due to the mailing list maintainer's (that would be me) impending > departure from NCD and the low volume of traffic on the list I'll be > shutting the list down by the end of the week. The archives will > continue to be available from the ftp site. > -Greg -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 19: 0: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E4F0150FD for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 19:00:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id SAA57455 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 18:58:06 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <37266B2C.1CFBAE39@whistle.com> Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 18:58:04 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Voice recog. from IBM soon.. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG IBM has anounced it will be making a binary of it's voice recog. engine available for Linux.. Free for personal use. I'm guessing it should work for FreeBSD too. Apparently Red-Hat are involved... hmmm... Hal? take a letter... arrrr, emmm start at... NO NO stop! julian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 20: 9:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bilby.prth.tensor.pgs.com (unknown [157.147.232.237]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF39F14CA4 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 20:09:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from shocking@ariadne.prth.tensor.pgs.com) Received: from bandicoot.prth.tensor.pgs.com (bandicoot.prth.tensor.pgs.com [157.147.224.1]) by bilby.prth.tensor.pgs.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA05151; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:08:48 +0800 (WST) Received: from ariadne.tensor.pgs.com (ariadne [157.147.227.36]) by bandicoot.prth.tensor.pgs.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with SMTP id LAA04326; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:09:05 +0800 (WST) Received: from ariadne by ariadne.tensor.pgs.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id LAA09496; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:09:05 +0800 Message-Id: <199904280309.LAA09496@ariadne.tensor.pgs.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: hackers@freebsd.org Cc: dfr@nlsystems.com, toasty@dragondata.com, mike@smith.net.au Subject: 3dfx driver and ioctl return value issues. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:09:04 +0800 From: Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As some of you know, I 've been porting the Linux 3dfx driver to FreeBSD and it's complete, modulo bugs found by testing. I'm using the test programs supplied with the Linux glide SDK to do the testing have come up with an interesting problem. Basically, the Linux drivers return a negative value on ioctl for an error (which is then converted to a positive number and stashed in errno, whilst the user program sees the negative return from ioctl) but returns *non-negative* numbers to indicate success. This means that an ioctl can return information such as the number of 3dfx card in a system as a return value, rather than in the variable that the third argument of ioctl points to. This would not normally be a problem, except for the fact that the Linux glide library depends on this perverse behaivior, making testing rather difficult. I tried placing the appropriate value in p->p_retval[0] in the section of code I've hacked into linux_ioctl.c for my ioctl, and it's not working. It takes the return value of the ioctl instead (which is 0, for success) and passes that back to the program. I need a way to hack the ioctl system call and allow it to return a non negative value. There's another way out - I obtain the Glide source, alter it to pass pointers to variables in ioctl calls rather than relying on the return value of the ioctl call. For those people who wish to use the driver in the Linux "realtime 3d simulations" aka glquake, we recompile it after the alterations with the Linux dev kit. Doug, do you still have contacts within 3dfx? I'd like to go about getting the NDA so I can port glide to FreeBSD. Stephen -- The views expressed above are not those of PGS Tensor. "We've heard that a million monkeys at a million keyboards could produce the Complete Works of Shakespeare; now, thanks to the Internet, we know this is not true." Robert Wilensky, University of California To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 20:22: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cain.gsoft.com.au (genesi.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE82714CA4 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 20:21:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Received: from lot.gsoft.com.au (lot.gsoft.com.au [203.38.152.106]) by cain.gsoft.com.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA08024; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 12:51:28 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199904280309.LAA09496@ariadne.tensor.pgs.com> Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 12:51:28 +0930 (CST) From: "Daniel O'Connor" To: Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth Subject: RE: 3dfx driver and ioctl return value issues. Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 28-Apr-99 Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth wrote: > returns *non-negative* numbers to indicate success. This means that an ioctl > can return information such as the number of 3dfx card in a system as a > value, rather than in the variable that the third argument of ioctl points > This would not normally be a problem, except for the fact that the Linux > library depends on this perverse behaivior, making testing rather difficult. Why oh why? Thats pretty vile :( > There's another way out - I obtain the Glide source, alter it to pass > to variables in ioctl calls rather than relying on the return value of the > ioctl call. For those people who wish to use the driver in the Linux > "realtime > 3d simulations" aka glquake, we recompile it after the alterations with the > Linux dev kit. Any chance of getting the Linux porter to fix this (really really) bad behaviour? :) --- Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." -- Andrew Tanenbaum To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Apr 27 23:41:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cimlogic.com.au (cimlog.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.51.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4CD8615351 for ; Tue, 27 Apr 1999 23:41:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jb@cimlogic.com.au) Received: (from jb@localhost) by cimlogic.com.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id QAA26783 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:47:35 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jb) From: John Birrell Message-Id: <199904280647.QAA26783@cimlogic.com.au> Subject: Adding desktop support To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:47:35 +1000 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'm working on an application that is targeted at users who, based on their exposure to a certain commercial OS, expect to be able to point and clip their way through life, and to recognise things by little pictures. There are a few things that I'd like to add to FreeBSD to support this sort of application. The first is to build icon pixmaps into each executable program. Now that we've made the transition to ELF, adding an XPM formatted pixmap to a program is simply a matter of: objcopy --add-section=.icon=file.xpm file I could just keep this in my local tree, but that would mean that I have to build my own distribution and that 3rd-party vendor software won't contain icons (like it would if built for Windows). I'm hoping that there is sufficient interest to convince those people who will no doubt be horrified by doing such a think to a UNIX operating system. (Some of those people don't read this list, but that's another problem). I've hacked up a demo application which you can get from if you are interested in what I am proposing. The demo program (filedemo) requires an X server, was statically linked on a 4.0-current system, but will probably run on 3.X-whatever. The program displays a tree widget that allows directories to be opened and closed, with open directories listing the files with their icons. If the file is executable, in ELF format and has a .icon section, the demo program will convert the .icon data to a pixmap and display that instead of the default pixmap. I've also put up a modified bsd.prog.mk to allow pixmaps to be built into programs during `make world'. Using the modified bsd.prog.mk, any program built with ICON_NAME=file.xpm in the Makefile will have a .icon section added containing the contents of the file.xpm. Assuming that this proposal doesn't get shot down in flames, I'd like to hear from users (some of whom probably only listen to this list) who would like to contribute pixmaps for the myriad of programs in FreeBSD. This is a task best done by non-developers who can look at things from a non-source perspective. I have to admit that I find the thought of having to create so many pixmaps somewhat daunting. Surely there is someone listening who has a flair for that sort of thing and wants a chance to contribute to FreeBSD. I chose the hackers list rather than current, committers or arch in the hope that more user-type people will read this. -- John Birrell - jb@cimlogic.com.au; jb@freebsd.org http://www.cimlogic.com.au/ CIMlogic Pty Ltd, GPO Box 117A, Melbourne Vic 3001, Australia +61 418 353 137 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 0:45:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sussie.interbizz.se (ns.datadesign.se [194.23.109.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF57314FC5 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 00:45:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Joachim.Isaksson@ibfs.com) Received: from tequila (dhcp140.ibfs.com [193.45.188.140]) by sussie.interbizz.se (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA14238; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:44:55 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <00d801be914a$fcc79be0$8cbc2dc1@ibfs.com> From: "Joachim Isaksson" To: "John Birrell" , References: <199904280647.QAA26783@cimlogic.com.au> Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:44:44 +0200 Organization: Interbizz Financial Systems MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I'm working on an application that is targeted at users who, based on > their exposure to a certain commercial OS, expect to be able to point > and clip their way through life, and to recognise things by little > pictures. There are a few things that I'd like to add to FreeBSD to > support this sort of application. The first is to build icon pixmaps > into each executable program. I know too little about the ELF linker to know this - would the .icon section be loaded into the memory space of the running process by the runtime linker or would it just take some (presumably minimal) disk space? /Joachim To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 0:52:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cimlogic.com.au (cimlog.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.51.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EBE5E14FC5 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 00:52:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jb@cimlogic.com.au) Received: (from jb@localhost) by cimlogic.com.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id RAA26957; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:59:11 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jb) From: John Birrell Message-Id: <199904280759.RAA26957@cimlogic.com.au> Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <00d801be914a$fcc79be0$8cbc2dc1@ibfs.com> from Joachim Isaksson at "Apr 28, 1999 9:44:44 am" To: Joachim.Isaksson@ibfs.com (Joachim Isaksson) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:59:11 +1000 (EST) Cc: jb@cimlogic.com.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Joachim Isaksson wrote: > I know too little about the ELF linker to know this - would the .icon > section be loaded into the memory space of the running process by the > runtime linker or would it just take some (presumably minimal) disk space? Just disk space = about 46 bytes plus the size of the XPM file. -- John Birrell - jb@cimlogic.com.au; jb@freebsd.org http://www.cimlogic.com.au/ CIMlogic Pty Ltd, GPO Box 117A, Melbourne Vic 3001, Australia +61 418 353 137 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 1:13:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDE9E154AA for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 01:13:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from andrew@lake.com.au) Received: from m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20]) by m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id SAA21063 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:13:41 +1000 (EST) X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: andrew@lake.com.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. Received: from areilly.bpc-users.org (CPE-24-192-51-95.nsw.bigpond.net.au [24.192.51.95]) by m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with SMTP id SAA16673 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:13:34 +1000 (EST) Received: (qmail 28836 invoked by uid 1000); 28 Apr 1999 08:13:36 -0000 From: "Andrew Reilly" Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:13:36 +1000 To: John Birrell Cc: Joachim Isaksson , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990428181336.A28746@gurney.reilly.home> References: <00d801be914a$fcc79be0$8cbc2dc1@ibfs.com> <199904280759.RAA26957@cimlogic.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904280759.RAA26957@cimlogic.com.au>; from John Birrell on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 05:59:11PM +1000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 05:59:11PM +1000, John Birrell wrote: > Just disk space = about 46 bytes plus the size of the XPM file. Is this how GNOME works? I'm pretty sure that it's not how KDE or Motif works. Are you proposing the building of _another_ desktop infrastructure? Besides, none of the executables in the standard FreeBSD distribution do anything without arguments anyway, so you're really only talking about X applications, aren't you? Even on Windows, the command-line tools don't get their own icon. -- Andrew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 1:21:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cimlogic.com.au (cimlog.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.51.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BBDB7154AA for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 01:21:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jb@cimlogic.com.au) Received: (from jb@localhost) by cimlogic.com.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id SAA27054; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:27:53 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jb) From: John Birrell Message-Id: <199904280827.SAA27054@cimlogic.com.au> Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <19990428181336.A28746@gurney.reilly.home> from Andrew Reilly at "Apr 28, 1999 6:13:36 pm" To: andrew@lake.com.au (Andrew Reilly) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:27:53 +1000 (EST) Cc: jb@cimlogic.com.au, Joachim.Isaksson@ibfs.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Andrew Reilly wrote: > On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 05:59:11PM +1000, John Birrell wrote: > > Just disk space = about 46 bytes plus the size of the XPM file. > > Is this how GNOME works? I'm pretty sure that it's not how KDE > or Motif works. Are you proposing the building of _another_ desktop > infrastructure? I'm not talking about the desktop itself, just the icon information that goes with an executable. How the particular desktop formats the icon is up to the desktop applications. > Besides, none of the executables in the standard FreeBSD > distribution do anything without arguments anyway, so you're > really only talking about X applications, aren't you? Even on > Windows, the command-line tools don't get their own icon. Providing arguments for an executable is a separate issue to browsing a file system. I don't want to cloud the current subject by talking about how a desktop application might allow command-line tools to be executed. -- John Birrell - jb@cimlogic.com.au; jb@freebsd.org http://www.cimlogic.com.au/ CIMlogic Pty Ltd, GPO Box 117A, Melbourne Vic 3001, Australia +61 418 353 137 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 1:37:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 046FB1561C for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 01:37:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.2/8.9.1) id KAA20837; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 10:37:39 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: Didier Derny Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: large shared memory (increasing kvm) References: From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 28 Apr 1999 10:37:37 +0200 In-Reply-To: Didier Derny's message of "Fri, 23 Apr 1999 16:37:19 +0200 (CEST)" Message-ID: Lines: 44 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Didier Derny writes: > for the SQL server, I need a large shared memory (SHMMAXPGS=9216) > I have maxusers = 512 You shouldn't. Such as it is, your kernel can't properly cope with values of maxusers greater than 64. You need a larger kvm to handle that. > the memory is actually of 256Mb and will be increased to 1Gb > > the kernel is still a.out > > [I have no possibility to stop the machine to upgrade to 3.1-RELEASE or > 3.1-STABLE (upgrade planned in july/august)] There is a FAQ entry (13.15) on modifying the size of the kernel virtual address space. However: a) doing so will break binary compatibility with BSD/OS unless you also apply John Polstra's patches or upgrade to 3.1. b) you will need to upgrade your boot blocks and loader to cope with the kvm size change; you have to change the load address as well as the kvm size, and the 3.0-RELEASE. > (I'm running FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE on a dual pentium II machine > [ASUS P2B mother board] everything works just fine except that > we need to largely increase the shared memories and the semaphores]) Running 3.0-RELEASE on a mission-critical database server? Bad dog, bad! No bone for you today! > is VM_KMEM_SIZE working with FreeBSD-3.0-RELEASE ? I *think* so, but I've never frobbed it, so I can't really comment. > what value would you suggest ? 1 GB, which is the default in 3.1 and 4.0 now. Just follow the instructions in the FAQ. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 1:58:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from excalibur.oceanis.net (ns.dotcom.fr [195.154.74.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2380215644 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 01:58:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pixel@excalibur.oceanis.net) Received: (from pixel@localhost) by excalibur.oceanis.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) id IAA11087; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 08:58:03 GMT From: Emmanuel DELOGET Message-Id: <199904280858.IAA11087@excalibur.oceanis.net> Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <199904280827.SAA27054@cimlogic.com.au> from John Birrell at "Apr 28, 1999 6:27:53 pm" To: jb@cimlogic.com.au (John Birrell) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 10:58:03 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers Mail List) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As the well known John Birrell said... ->Andrew Reilly wrote: ->> On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 05:59:11PM +1000, John Birrell wrote: ->> > Just disk space = about 46 bytes plus the size of the XPM file. ->> ->> Is this how GNOME works? I'm pretty sure that it's not how KDE ->> or Motif works. Are you proposing the building of _another_ desktop ->> infrastructure? -> ->I'm not talking about the desktop itself, just the icon information ->that goes with an executable. How the particular desktop formats the ->icon is up to the desktop applications. -> ->> Besides, none of the executables in the standard FreeBSD ->> distribution do anything without arguments anyway, so you're ->> really only talking about X applications, aren't you? Even on ->> Windows, the command-line tools don't get their own icon. -> ->Providing arguments for an executable is a separate issue to browsing ->a file system. I don't want to cloud the current subject by talking ->about how a desktop application might allow command-line tools to ->be executed. Since the graphic interface and the system are separated, I do not understand the *real* value of this (putting an icon in the exe). A lot of window manager are able to create a exe/pixmap array to handle these particular associations. I think it would be better to hack such window manager (this would let the users choose their icons if they want, and that should be (I think) a better solution. You may work with the (example) Window Maker people and provide a ${KnownCommercialOsName} compatibility mode (... not sure they will accept... Those linux folks are rather... anti-${KnownCommercialOsName} :) -> ->-- ->John Birrell - jb@cimlogic.com.au; jb@freebsd.org http://www.cimlogic.com.au/ ->CIMlogic Pty Ltd, GPO Box 117A, Melbourne Vic 3001, Australia +61 418 353 137 -> -- __________________________________________________________________________ Emmanuel DELOGET [pixel] pixel@{dotcom.fr,epita.fr} ---- DotCom SA http://www.epita.fr/~pixel | http://www.dotcom.fr/~pixel "On the last day, God created Linux. And Microsoft won its antitrust case" -------------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 2: 0:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E66A15644 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 02:00:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.2/8.9.1) id LAA20874; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:00:42 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: shocking@prth.pgs.com (Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Porting Linux Device drivers References: <199904260431.MAA04537@ariadne.tensor.pgs.com> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 28 Apr 1999 11:00:41 +0200 In-Reply-To: shocking@prth.pgs.com's message of "Mon, 26 Apr 1999 12:31:27 +0800" Message-ID: Lines: 14 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG shocking@prth.pgs.com (Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth) writes: > The problem I'm having is that I'm using the glide Linux > binaries to test the device, and the positive return values are being > trapped somewhere and turned into -1, an obvious failure which the > Linux glide library interprets as an error, spitting the dummy. The userland part of the syscall mechanism stores the returned value in errno and returns ((ret == 0) ? p_retval[0] : -1). Hence, if you want to return a specific value, store it in p_retval[0] and return 0 to indicate success. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 2: 2: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from send205.yahoomail.com (web131.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.174]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id B436014D26 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 02:01:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from thallgren@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <19990428090343.23988.rocketmail@send205.yahoomail.com> Received: from [131.116.188.2] by web131.yahoomail.com; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 02:03:43 PDT Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 02:03:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Tommy Hallgren Subject: Desktop... To: hackers@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG (I've tried to mail John directly, but my @yahoo address is not accepted bu cimlogic. :-/ ) I think it's an excellent idea! Why not include some sort of meta info(mime-ish) as well? In the executable: Format: operation/mimetype For example: view/jpeg view/gif view/avi edit/plain-text remove/* and so on... My suggestion is probably even more controversial for some people, but that info along with the icon data could be made an optional make world option. Regards, Tommy _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 2: 5:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bilby.prth.tensor.pgs.com (unknown [157.147.232.237]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4EF514E61 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 02:05:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from shocking@ariadne.prth.tensor.pgs.com) Received: from bandicoot.prth.tensor.pgs.com (bandicoot.prth.tensor.pgs.com [157.147.224.1]) by bilby.prth.tensor.pgs.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA05963; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:05:09 +0800 (WST) Received: from ariadne.tensor.pgs.com (ariadne [157.147.227.36]) by bandicoot.prth.tensor.pgs.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with SMTP id RAA26668; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:05:41 +0800 (WST) Received: from ariadne by ariadne.tensor.pgs.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id RAA10274; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:05:40 +0800 Message-Id: <199904280905.RAA10274@ariadne.tensor.pgs.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: shocking@bandicoot.prth.tensor.pgs.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Porting Linux Device drivers In-reply-to: Your message of "28 Apr 1999 11:00:41 +0200." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:05:40 +0800 From: Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > shocking@prth.pgs.com (Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth) writes: > > The problem I'm having is that I'm using the glide Linux > > binaries to test the device, and the positive return values are being > > trapped somewhere and turned into -1, an obvious failure which the > > Linux glide library interprets as an error, spitting the dummy. > > The userland part of the syscall mechanism stores the returned value > in errno and returns ((ret == 0) ? p_retval[0] : -1). Hence, if you > want to return a specific value, store it in p_retval[0] and return 0 > to indicate success. > Do you mean the bit within libc? This is odd, as the app I'm running to test this is a Linux binary. I've tried adding this within the code to handle these ioctls in linux_ioctl.c, but don't seem to be having any joy. Should I be looking a bit higher, within the linuxulator syscall mechanism? Stephen -- The views expressed above are not those of PGS Tensor. "We've heard that a million monkeys at a million keyboards could produce the Complete Works of Shakespeare; now, thanks to the Internet, we know this is not true." Robert Wilensky, University of California To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 2:17:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from web119.yahoomail.com (web119.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 1E00914C1B for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 02:17:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from thallgren@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <19990428091840.4655.rocketmail@web119.yahoomail.com> Received: from [131.116.188.2] by web119.yahoomail.com; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 02:18:40 PDT Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 02:18:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Tommy Hallgren Subject: Re: Adding desktop support To: Emmanuel DELOGET , John Birrell Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Mail List MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --- Emmanuel DELOGET wrote: > I think it would be better to hack such window manager (this > would let the users choose their icons if they want, and that > should be (I think) a better solution. You are confusing a window manager and a filsystem browser/desktop. A window manager is NOT a desktop. Regards, Tommy === Regards, Tommy Hallgren Briljantg. 31, SE-421 49, Göteborg Tel.: 031 - 770 5232 (Work: Telia Prosoft) Tel.: 0709 - 312 404 (GSM) Tel.: 031 - 47 65 28 (Home) _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 2:39: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from excalibur.oceanis.net (ns.dotcom.fr [195.154.74.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8925414E91 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 02:38:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pixel@excalibur.oceanis.net) Received: (from pixel@localhost) by excalibur.oceanis.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) id JAA12007; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:38:52 GMT From: Emmanuel DELOGET Message-Id: <199904280938.JAA12007@excalibur.oceanis.net> Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <19990428091840.4655.rocketmail@web119.yahoomail.com> from Tommy Hallgren at "Apr 28, 1999 2:18:40 am" To: thallgren@yahoo.com (Tommy Hallgren) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:38:52 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers Mail List) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As the well known Tommy Hallgren said... ->--- Emmanuel DELOGET wrote: ->> I think it would be better to hack such window manager (this ->> would let the users choose their icons if they want, and that ->> should be (I think) a better solution. -> ->You are confusing a window manager and a filsystem browser/desktop. A window ->manager is NOT a desktop. Of course. But I speak about the new wave of WMs. Those things, named E, Window Maker and so on, have some desktop functionnalities that are incorporated with the wm (such as icon-based quick app launcher and so on - could you say me that a qal is a needed part of a wm ?). Plus : they (the wms) have a bunch of config file that any application could read (such as the themes files, or, more easily (for example in Window Maker), the iconsets files). So I really think that it is better to hack the wm - or, if you prefer, to create gnome/whatever proggies to handle this - than to hack the fbsd kernel. Yours, -> ->Regards, Tommy -> ->=== ->Regards, Tommy Hallgren ->Briljantg. 31, SE-421 49, Göteborg ->Tel.: 031 - 770 5232 (Work: Telia Prosoft) ->Tel.: 0709 - 312 404 (GSM) ->Tel.: 031 - 47 65 28 (Home) -> -- __________________________________________________________________________ Emmanuel DELOGET [pixel] pixel@{dotcom.fr,epita.fr} ---- DotCom SA http://www.epita.fr/~pixel | http://www.dotcom.fr/~pixel "On the last day, God created Linux. And Microsoft won its antitrust case" -------------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 2:47:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mx.nsu.ru (mx.nsu.ru [193.124.215.71]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1FAD150AB for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 02:47:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fjoe@iclub.nsu.ru) Received: from iclub.nsu.ru (fjoe@iclub.nsu.ru [193.124.222.66]) by mx.nsu.ru (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id QAA02273 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:46:18 +0700 (NOVST) Received: from localhost (fjoe@localhost) by iclub.nsu.ru (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA12001 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:46:17 +0700 (NSS) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:46:17 +0700 (NSS) From: Max Khon To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: could not mount nfs filesystems from fstab Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hi, there! 3.1-RELEASE: with firewall_enable="YES" firewall_type="open" firewall_quiet="NO" natd_enable="YES" natd_interface="ed0" nfs filesystems could not be mounted from fstab because ipfw is started before mounting nfs filesystems and natd is started after mounting them /fjoe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 2:59:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cimlogic.com.au (cimlog.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.51.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0341514FF8 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 02:58:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jb@cimlogic.com.au) Received: (from jb@localhost) by cimlogic.com.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id UAA27348; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:04:04 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jb) From: John Birrell Message-Id: <199904281004.UAA27348@cimlogic.com.au> Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <199904280938.JAA12007@excalibur.oceanis.net> from Emmanuel DELOGET at "Apr 28, 1999 11:38:52 am" To: pixel@DotCom.FR (Emmanuel DELOGET) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:04:04 +1000 (EST) Cc: thallgren@yahoo.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Emmanuel DELOGET wrote: > Of course. But I speak about the new wave of WMs. Those things, named > E, Window Maker and so on, have some desktop functionnalities that are > incorporated with the wm (such as icon-based quick app launcher and so > on - could you say me that a qal is a needed part of a wm ?). > > Plus : they (the wms) have a bunch of config file that any application > could read (such as the themes files, or, more easily (for example in > Window Maker), the iconsets files). If someone copies a file to some arbitrary directory or creates a link to an existing file, all those configuration files are out-of-date. I can't image how non-hacker-type users could manage that sort of configuration complexity. Did you look at the demo application I referred to in my original mail? Try it! Then see if you can come up with a window-manager based implementation that provides the same level of functionality and performance. > > So I really think that it is better to hack the wm - or, if you > prefer, to create gnome/whatever proggies to handle this - than to > hack the fbsd kernel. The FreeBSD kernel is not affected. I'm not proposing to specify what the desktop looks like, just the information that is made available to the desktop programs. -- John Birrell - jb@cimlogic.com.au; jb@freebsd.org http://www.cimlogic.com.au/ CIMlogic Pty Ltd, GPO Box 117A, Melbourne Vic 3001, Australia +61 418 353 137 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 3: 7:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from paprika.michvhf.com (paprika.michvhf.com [209.57.60.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 8DE1B14FF8 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 03:07:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from vev@michvhf.com) Received: (qmail 16140 invoked by uid 1001); 28 Apr 1999 10:07:31 -0000 Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 06:07:31 -0400 (EDT) From: Vince Vielhaber To: Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 3dfx driver and ioctl return value issues. In-Reply-To: <199904280309.LAA09496@ariadne.tensor.pgs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 28 Apr 1999, Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth wrote: > There's another way out - I obtain the Glide source, alter it to pass pointers > to variables in ioctl calls rather than relying on the return value of the > ioctl call. For those people who wish to use the driver in the Linux "realtime > 3d simulations" aka glquake, we recompile it after the alterations with the > Linux dev kit. Would it be feasible to put a wrapper around ioctl for the driver? Or would that slow it down too much? Vince. -- ========================================================================== Vince Vielhaber -- KA8CSH email: vev@michvhf.com flame-mail: /dev/null # include TEAM-OS2 Online Campground Directory http://www.camping-usa.com Online Giftshop Superstore http://www.cloudninegifts.com ========================================================================== To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 3:17:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pcayk.ukc.ac.uk (pcayk.ukc.ac.uk [129.12.41.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A22D914CEB; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 03:17:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dlombardo@excite.com) Received: from excite.com (xtsw12c.ukc.ac.uk [129.12.41.85]) by pcayk.ukc.ac.uk (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id LAA09827; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:17:10 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dlombardo@excite.com) Message-ID: <3726E12F.47C8F277@excite.com> Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:21:35 +0100 From: Dean Lombardo Organization: University of Kent at Canterbury X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Julian Elischer , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Voice recog. from IBM soon.. References: <37266B2C.1CFBAE39@whistle.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Julian Elischer wrote: > > IBM has anounced it will be making a binary of it's voice recog. engine > available for Linux.. Free for personal use. > > I'm guessing it should work for FreeBSD too. > > Apparently Red-Hat are involved... I believe the binary is already available for download at http://www.software.ibm.com/speech - choose the "Linux" option, or go directly to http://www.software.ibm.com/is/voicetype/dev_linux.html. (BTW, information about IBM's Linux support is available at http://www.ibm.com/linux.) Dean To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 3:20:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fep2-orange.clear.net.nz (fep2-orange.clear.net.nz [203.97.32.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CDFAD14CEB for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 03:20:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jabley@buddha.clear.net.nz) Received: from buddha.clear.net.nz (buddha.clear.net.nz [192.168.24.106]) by fep2-orange.clear.net.nz (1.5/1.9) with ESMTP id WAA18082; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 22:20:28 +1200 (NZST) Received: (from jabley@localhost) by buddha.clear.net.nz (8.9.3/8.9.2) id WAA71818; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 22:20:20 +1200 (NZST) (envelope-from jabley) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 22:20:20 +1200 From: Joe Abley To: John Birrell Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jabley@clear.co.nz Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990428222020.A70537@clear.co.nz> References: <199904280647.QAA26783@cimlogic.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904280647.QAA26783@cimlogic.com.au>; from John Birrell on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 04:47:35PM +1000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 04:47:35PM +1000, John Birrell wrote: > > [idea to imbed relevant .xpm icon data in ELF executables] > Every response so far has been pretty negative, so I thought I'd break the running theme and say, for what it's worth, I like the idea. If there is going to be icon data associated with an executable, I can think of no better place for it. Presumably, for this to be useful, some guidelines ought to be well known regarding the dimensions of the icon, and the colour depth available? Maybe (for those application authors with severe artistic ability) there could be a number of optional images present, e.g. one mono image, one 16-colour image, one 256-colour image, one 65536-colour image, etc... An application such as a file manager could then select an icon for display which is appropriate to the number of available colours. In fact, running amok with this idea, perhaps an xml section describing the command-line parameters of the executable with a known (minimal) DTD would be useful for applications for which an ability to pre-parse command-line syntaxes would be useful (like file managers, once again). This all sounds very non-unixy. But I don't really know why. Joe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 3:25:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (mail.palmerharvey.co.uk [62.172.109.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C700114F38 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 03:25:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Dom.Mitchell@palmerharvey.co.uk) Received: from ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk (unverified) by mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:24:34 +0100 Received: from voodoo.pandhm.co.uk ([10.100.35.12]) by ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) id JR5C7PMB; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:17:44 +0100 Received: from dom by voodoo.pandhm.co.uk with local (Exim 2.10 #1) id 10cRZr-000LHz-00; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:28:27 +0100 To: Joe Abley Cc: John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support X-Mailer: nmh-1.0 X-Colour: Green Organization: Palmer & Harvey McLane In-Reply-To: Joe Abley's message of "Wed, 28 Apr 1999 22:20:20 +1200" <19990428222020.A70537@clear.co.nz> Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:28:26 +0100 From: Dom Mitchell Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 28 April 1999, Joe Abley proclaimed: > This all sounds very non-unixy. But I don't really know why. Because it's exactly what the Mac has been doing for over a decade. I don't think that there's anything terribly wrong with the idea. In fact, it's good we are making use of the facilities that our ELF changeover has bought us. The one problem I do see with this idea however, is that it only applies to binaries, and not data. -- Dom Mitchell -- Palmer & Harvey McLane -- Unix Systems Administrator "Value of 2 may go down as well as up" -- FORTRAN programmers manual -- ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. ********************************************************************** To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 3:31:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ewok.creative.net.au (ewok.creative.net.au [203.30.44.41]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 547D514F97 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 03:31:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adrian@freebsd.org) Received: (qmail 4919 invoked by uid 1008); 28 Apr 1999 10:31:20 -0000 Message-ID: <19990428103120.4917.qmail@ewok.creative.net.au> From: adrian@freebsd.org To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:28:26 +0100." Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:31:20 +0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Dom Mitchell writes: >On 28 April 1999, Joe Abley proclaimed: >> This all sounds very non-unixy. But I don't really know why. > >Because it's exactly what the Mac has been doing for over a decade. I >don't think that there's anything terribly wrong with the idea. In >fact, it's good we are making use of the facilities that our ELF >changeover has bought us. > >The one problem I do see with this idea however, is that it only applies >to binaries, and not data. >-- >Dom Mitchell -- Palmer & Harvey McLane -- Unix Systems Administrator ... and so have pcs in the .exe file format. If you want to do it for data, then you would have to make mime-type (or whatever you use to slap on a file type) part of the filesystem entry. Or use extensions. Like what happens now. Adrian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 4: 8:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from titan.metropolitan.at (mail.metropolitan.at [195.212.98.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1CFC150CC for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 04:08:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mladavac@metropolitan.at) Received: by TITAN with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id <26KYD24G>; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:11:05 +0200 Message-ID: <55586E7391ACD211B9730000C11002761795F3@r-lmh-wi-100.corpnet.at> From: Ladavac Marino To: 'Joe Abley' , John Birrell Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: Adding desktop support Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:06:47 +0200 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > -----Original Message----- > From: Joe Abley [SMTP:jabley@clear.co.nz] > Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 1999 12:20 PM > To: John Birrell > Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; jabley@clear.co.nz > Subject: Re: Adding desktop support > > On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 04:47:35PM +1000, John Birrell wrote: > > > > [idea to imbed relevant .xpm icon data in ELF executables] > > > > Every response so far has been pretty negative, so I thought I'd break > the running theme and say, for what it's worth, I like the idea. > [ML] Seconded. [ML] ... > An application such as a file manager could then select an icon for > display which is appropriate to the number of available colours. > [ML] would be a nice touch, yes. If .icon exists, a 4-bit version is mandatory, the others are optional. > In fact, running amok with this idea, perhaps an xml section > describing > the command-line parameters of the executable with a known (minimal) > DTD > would be useful for applications for which an ability to pre-parse > command-line syntaxes would be useful (like file managers, once > again). [ML] .usage is probably what you are thinking about. .purpose is another one (what does this executable actually do). > This all sounds very non-unixy. But I don't really know why. [ML] Well, it sounds like MacOS, or OS/2 with their structured files. It sounds like Windows, too. But these capabilities are not bad (in fact, a colleague of mine has been recently complaining about missing desktop support under X11--he is a OS/2 fan). Until ELF, UNIX didn't really have support for structured executables; now it does, this meta-info does not cost much, is completely backwardly compatible (image loader ignores unknown ELF sections) and it opens a way for unified executable desktop representation. Shortly, a GoodIdea John. /Marino > Joe > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 6:16: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9559414C08 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 06:15:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA18357; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:13:02 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:13:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: John Birrell Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <199904280647.QAA26783@cimlogic.com.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 28 Apr 1999, John Birrell wrote: > I'm working on an application that is targeted at users who, based on > their exposure to a certain commercial OS, expect to be able to point > and clip their way through life, and to recognise things by little > pictures. There are a few things that I'd like to add to FreeBSD to > support this sort of application. The first is to build icon pixmaps > into each executable program. I like this idea a great deal. I've long wanted some way to attach data to programs, so as to add some continuing state. This is a first step. If there was a utility, that would allow a user to replace the default icon with one of their own choosing (if they care), then that ought to eliminate any other problems. If the user complains about the extra data space, then they could replace the icon with a null value, right? I don't see a downside. ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 6:23:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailgate.cadence.com (mailgate.Cadence.COM [158.140.2.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 208B714EAF for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 06:23:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dmlb@ragnet.demon.co.uk) Received: (from smap@localhost) by mailgate.cadence.com (8.8.5/8.6.8) id GAA25328 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 06:23:23 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904281323.GAA25328@mailgate.cadence.com> Received: from symnt3.Cadence.COM(194.32.101.100) by mailgate.cadence.com via smap (mjr-v1.2) id xma925305801.025301; Wed, 28 Apr 99 06:23:21 -0700 Received: from pc287-cam.cadence.com ([194.32.96.111]) by symnt3.Cadence.COM with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2232.9) id JHJKDKQ1; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:18:27 +0100 Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Duncan Barclay" To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:23:52 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Reply-To: dmlb@ragnet.demon.co.uk In-reply-to: <19990428222020.A70537@clear.co.nz> References: <199904280647.QAA26783@cimlogic.com.au>; from John Birrell on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 04:47:35PM +1000 X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.53/R1) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 04:47:35PM +1000, John Birrell wrote: > > > > [idea to imbed relevant .xpm icon data in ELF executables] > > > > Every response so far has been pretty negative, so I thought I'd > break the running theme and say, for what it's worth, I like the > idea. > > If there is going to be icon data associated with an executable, I > can think of no better place for it. > > Presumably, for this to be useful, some guidelines ought to be well > known regarding the dimensions of the icon, and the colour depth > available? > > Maybe (for those application authors with severe artistic ability) > there could be a number of optional images present, e.g. one mono > image, one 16-colour image, one 256-colour image, one 65536-colour > image, etc... > > An application such as a file manager could then select an icon for > display which is appropriate to the number of available colours. > > In fact, running amok with this idea, perhaps an xml section > describing the command-line parameters of the executable with a > known (minimal) DTD would be useful for applications for which an > ability to pre-parse command-line syntaxes would be useful (like > file managers, once again). > > This all sounds very non-unixy. But I don't really know why. > > > Joe > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message RE: icons in exectuables and maybe more I mainly use Unix boxes for running applications (CAD, text, simulations), both at home and work for over ten years. As much as I love Unix for the flexibility it gives me when I program I do think that there is huge room for improvements on the desktop side of things. I whole heartadly support John's idea and would like to add support for the ideas of taking with further to encode whatever to get rid of the obscene hack that is file extension -> action databases in current desktops. Time to go and read up on objcopy.... Duncan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 6:27:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (skynet.ctr.columbia.edu [128.59.64.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D15AE14C08; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 06:27:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu) Received: (from wpaul@localhost) by skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (8.6.12/8.6.9) id JAA29467; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:27:06 -0400 From: Bill Paul Message-Id: <199904281327.JAA29467@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> Subject: Re: NFS Patch #8 for current available - new TCP fixes To: dillon@apollo.backplane.com (Matthew Dillon) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:27:05 -0400 (EDT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199904272018.NAA00464@apollo.backplane.com> from "Matthew Dillon" at Apr 27, 99 01:18:21 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 2310 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Of all the gin joints in all the towns in all the world, Matthew Dillon had to walk into mine and say: > (fanfair!) (Darth Vader's imperial march theme) > NFS Patch #8 for -current is now available. This patch fixes serious bugs > w/ NFS/TCP. Probably not *all* the failure conditions, but hopefully > most of them. [...] > Neither the 'de' nor the 'xl' ethernet drivers align the packet. The 'xl' > driver conditionally aligns it for the alpha. Part of the patch fixes > the 'xl' driver to unconditionally align the packet buffer in order to > improve NFS performance. I could not do the same for the 'de' driver > because I am unsure if the dec chipset can handle an unaligned start > address. From what I can tell, the DEC parts make you specify an RX DMA buffer address that is longword aligned. There are actually not that many devices where you're allowed to use arbitrary byte-aligned addresses for receive buffers (the 3Com XL and Intel 'speedo' chips let you do it, as well as the ThunderLAN, and the Alteon Tigon NIC; I _think_ the AMD PCnet/LANCE devices let you do it, but that's about it). For parts that don't support arbitrary alignment, you have to copy. Now, in some of the drivers that I ported to the alpha, I only copied the first small section of the packet in order to get the IP header aligned (since failing to do this causes an unaligned access trap in the IP code). This is faster than copying the entire packet to fix the alignment, but I'm not sure what effect it has on NFS. That said, although I haven't looked too closely at the de driver (it scares me -- a lot), it should have some sort of gimmick to fix the packet alignment otherwise it wouldn't work on the alpha. -Bill -- ============================================================================= -Bill Paul (212) 854-6020 | System Manager, Master of Unix-Fu Work: wpaul@ctr.columbia.edu | Center for Telecommunications Research Home: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu | Columbia University, New York City ============================================================================= "It is not I who am crazy; it is I who am mad!" - Ren Hoek, "Space Madness" ============================================================================= To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 6:30:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from germanium.xtalwind.net (germanium.xtalwind.net [205.160.242.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D62D15274 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 06:30:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jack@germanium.xtalwind.net) Received: from localhost (jack@localhost) by germanium.xtalwind.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA22855; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:29:49 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:29:49 -0400 (EDT) From: jack To: John Birrell Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <199904280647.QAA26783@cimlogic.com.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Today John Birrell wrote: > I've also put up a modified bsd.prog.mk to allow pixmaps to be built > into programs during `make world'. Using the modified bsd.prog.mk, > any program built with ICON_NAME=file.xpm in the Makefile will have a > .icon section added containing the contents of the file.xpm. Please make the default NOT to build them, as this is totally useless for servers that don't run X or are headless. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Jack O'Neill Systems Administrator / Systems Analyst jack@germanium.xtalwind.net Crystal Wind Communications, Inc. Finger jack@germanium.xtalwind.net for my PGP key. PGP Key fingerprint = F6 C4 E6 D4 2F 15 A7 67 FD 09 E9 3C 5F CC EB CD enriched, vcard, HTML messages > /dev/null -------------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 6:31:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F6BE1527A for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 06:31:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from andrew@lake.com.au) Received: from m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20]) by m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id XAA11394 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 23:31:31 +1000 (EST) X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: andrew@lake.com.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. Received: from areilly.bpc-users.org (CPE-24-192-51-95.nsw.bigpond.net.au [24.192.51.95]) by m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with SMTP id XAA27454 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 23:31:30 +1000 (EST) Received: (qmail 31390 invoked by uid 1000); 28 Apr 1999 13:31:31 -0000 From: "Andrew Reilly" Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 23:31:31 +1000 To: Chuck Robey Cc: John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990428233131.A30171@gurney.reilly.home> References: <199904280647.QAA26783@cimlogic.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: ; from Chuck Robey on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 09:13:02AM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 09:13:02AM -0400, Chuck Robey wrote: > I like this idea a great deal. I've long wanted some way to attach data > to programs, so as to add some continuing state. This is a first step. I like the idea of adding data to programs, a bit. There were ways to do this before elf was invented, though. Applications already have images and icons in them, that's why the xpm file format looks like a C declaration. I really, really, don't like the idea of mutable state in an application (executable). There are reasons that I log in as me, and use executables owned by root, that I can't modify. > If there was a utility, that would allow a user to replace the default > icon with one of their own choosing (if they care), then that ought to > eliminate any other problems. If the user complains about the extra > data space, then they could replace the icon with a null value, right? > I don't see a downside. Everyone who uses a system, who wants to change the icon in an application has to make their own copy, and put it in their ~/bin directory? -- Andrew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 6:33:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 567B415274 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 06:33:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from andrew@lake.com.au) Received: from m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20]) by m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id XAA11772 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 23:33:06 +1000 (EST) X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: andrew@lake.com.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. Received: from areilly.bpc-users.org (CPE-24-192-51-95.nsw.bigpond.net.au [24.192.51.95]) by m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with SMTP id XAA27834 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 23:33:05 +1000 (EST) Received: (qmail 31400 invoked by uid 1000); 28 Apr 1999 13:33:07 -0000 From: "Andrew Reilly" Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 23:33:07 +1000 To: Duncan Barclay Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990428233307.B30171@gurney.reilly.home> References: <199904280647.QAA26783@cimlogic.com.au>; <19990428222020.A70537@clear.co.nz> <199904281323.GAA25328@mailgate.cadence.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904281323.GAA25328@mailgate.cadence.com>; from Duncan Barclay on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 02:23:52PM +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 02:23:52PM +0000, Duncan Barclay wrote: > I whole heartadly support John's idea and would like to add support > for the ideas of taking with further to encode whatever to get rid of > the obscene hack that is file extension -> action databases in > current desktops. I think that there's a big difference between data file typing and application-specific icons. -- Andrew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 6:42:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE2681528B for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 06:42:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA18445; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:39:32 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:39:31 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Andrew Reilly Cc: John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <19990428233131.A30171@gurney.reilly.home> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 28 Apr 1999, Andrew Reilly wrote: > On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 09:13:02AM -0400, Chuck Robey wrote: > > I like this idea a great deal. I've long wanted some way to attach data > > to programs, so as to add some continuing state. This is a first step. > > I like the idea of adding data to programs, a bit. There were > ways to do this before elf was invented, though. Wrong. The only way to do this before was to either have a separate file structure (a filename that the program knew to look for), or to recompile your application when you wanted to change icons. This method is new in that it lets you add, change, or remove icons without worrying about having source. Applications > already have images and icons in them, that's why the xpm file > format looks like a C declaration. And that is why you needed to recompile your programs to make changes. > > I really, really, don't like the idea of mutable state in an > application (executable). There are reasons that I log in as > me, and use executables owned by root, that I can't modify. > > > If there was a utility, that would allow a user to replace the default > > icon with one of their own choosing (if they care), then that ought to > > eliminate any other problems. If the user complains about the extra > > data space, then they could replace the icon with a null value, right? > > I don't see a downside. > > Everyone who uses a system, who wants to change the icon in an > application has to make their own copy, and put it in their > ~/bin directory? You could have the old, existing system simply by using objcopy to remove that section. Or maybe you object to others having an ability that you don't use, even if it costs you nothing (no disk space, no memory space, nothing)? ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 6:43:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from quackerjack.cc.vt.edu (quackerjack.cc.vt.edu [198.82.160.250]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 878CD14DC4 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 06:43:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jobaldwi@vt.edu) Received: from sable.cc.vt.edu (sable.cc.vt.edu [128.173.16.30]) by quackerjack.cc.vt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA04091; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:43:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from john.baldwin.cx (jobaldwi.campus.vt.edu [198.82.67.63]) by sable.cc.vt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA23860; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:43:09 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <55586E7391ACD211B9730000C11002761795F3@r-lmh-wi-100.corpnet.at> Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:43:08 -0400 (EDT) From: John Baldwin To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: Adding desktop support Cc: John Birrell , Joe Abley Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 28-Apr-99 Ladavac Marino wrote: >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Joe Abley [SMTP:jabley@clear.co.nz] >> Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 1999 12:20 PM >> To: John Birrell >> Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; jabley@clear.co.nz >> Subject: Re: Adding desktop support >> >> On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 04:47:35PM +1000, John Birrell wrote: >> > >> > [idea to imbed relevant .xpm icon data in ELF executables] >> > >> >> Every response so far has been pretty negative, so I thought I'd break >> the running theme and say, for what it's worth, I like the idea. >> > [ML] Seconded. > [ML] ... >> An application such as a file manager could then select an icon for >> display which is appropriate to the number of available colours. >> > [ML] would be a nice touch, yes. If .icon exists, a 4-bit > version is mandatory, the others are optional. Thirded. >> In fact, running amok with this idea, perhaps an xml section >> describing >> the command-line parameters of the executable with a known (minimal) >> DTD >> would be useful for applications for which an ability to pre-parse >> command-line syntaxes would be useful (like file managers, once >> again). > [ML] .usage is probably what you are thinking about. > .purpose is another one (what does this executable actually do). I think these are nice too. To the list: remember that these are simply *optional* data stored in the executable, no kernel hacks involved. The only change that might be made would be support in the bsd.*.mk Makefiles so you can have ICON=blah.xpm, or USAGE=blah.xml, etc. to make it easier for developers to use this feature, but it wouldn't be required, just a nice touch that desktops have the option of using. >> This all sounds very non-unixy. But I don't really know why. > [ML] Well, it sounds like MacOS, or OS/2 with their structured > files. It sounds like Windows, too. But these capabilities are not bad > (in fact, a colleague of mine has been recently complaining about > missing desktop support under X11--he is a OS/2 fan). Until ELF, UNIX > didn't really have support for structured executables; now it does, this > meta-info does not cost much, is completely backwardly compatible (image > loader ignores unknown ELF sections) and it opens a way for unified > executable desktop representation. > > Shortly, a GoodIdea John. > > /Marino > >> Joe --- John Baldwin -- http://members.freedomnet.com/~jbaldwin/ PGP Key: http://members.freedomnet.com/~jbaldwin/pgpkey.asc "Power Users Use the Power to Serve!" - http://www.freebsd.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 6:50:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rnocserv.urc.ac.ru (rnocserv.urc.ac.ru [193.233.85.48]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7AF214D5C for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 06:49:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from joy@urc.ac.ru) Received: from urc.ac.ru (y.urc.ac.ru [193.233.85.37]) by rnocserv.urc.ac.ru (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id TAA59597 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 19:49:44 +0600 (ESS) (envelope-from joy@urc.ac.ru) Message-ID: <372711F8.8A981B98@urc.ac.ru> Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 19:49:44 +0600 From: Konstantin Chuguev Organization: Southern Ural Regional Center of FREEnet X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386) X-Accept-Language: ru, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: IPXIP usage Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi. Does anybody know how can I use IPX-over-IP in FreeBSD (RELENG_3)? I would like to use dummynet to restrict IPX bandwidth on our backbone. I see the option IPXIP in LINT, although it is marked as not available. But there is /sys/netipx/ipx_ip.[ch]. It seems like ipx_ip is a standalone interface named "ipxip", but I don'd see details anywhere. There is no pseudo-device ipxip. I have tried to ifconfig tun0 ipx 00EEEE04; ifconfig tun1 ipx 00EEEE05, and I see now: RR02:~# ifconfig -a ... tun0: flags=8051 mtu 1500 ipx eeee04 --> 7400H.50e10000000.5180H tun1: flags=8051 mtu 1500 ipx eeee05 --> 7400H.50e10000000.4980H I don't understand what these strange IPX addresses mean: 7400H.50e10000000.xxxx And I don't know how to link two tunnel interfaces on different hosts? Where is IP settings? I'm even not sure IPXIP works through tunnel interfaces. Please help me. -- Konstantin V. Chuguev. System administrator of Southern http://www.urc.ac.ru/~joy/ Ural Regional Center of FREEnet, mailto:joy@urc.ac.ru Chelyabinsk, Russia. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 7:17:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from noc.demon.net (server.noc.demon.net [193.195.224.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B34D14C1E for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 07:17:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fanf@demon.net) Received: by noc.demon.net; id PAA13821; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:17:32 +0100 (BST) Received: from fanf.noc.demon.net(195.11.55.83) by inside.noc.demon.net via smap (3.2) id xma013795; Wed, 28 Apr 99 15:17:26 +0100 Received: from fanf by fanf.noc.demon.net with local (Exim 1.73 #2) id 10cV9P-0007en-00; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:17:23 +0100 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: Tony Finch Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <19990428103120.4917.qmail@ewok.creative.net.au> References: Message-Id: Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:17:23 +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG adrian@freebsd.org wrote: > >If you want to do it for data, then you would have to make mime-type >(or whatever you use to slap on a file type) part of the filesystem >entry. What about using the magic directory, as used by file(1) and Apache's mod_mime_magic? Tony. -- f.a.n.finch dot@dotat.at fanf@demon.net Arthur: "Oh, that sounds better, have you worked out the controls?" Ford: "No, we just stopped playing with them." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 7:36:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-gw1adm.rcsntx.swbell.net (mail-gw1.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.51]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E9F014E34 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 07:36:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chris@holly.dyndns.org) Received: from holly.dyndns.org (ppp-207-193-12-204.hstntx.swbell.net [207.193.12.204]) by mail-gw1adm.rcsntx.swbell.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA13096; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:36:16 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from chris@localhost) by holly.dyndns.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA14416; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:36:54 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from chris) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:36:53 -0500 From: "Chris M. Costello" To: John Birrell Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990428093652.B12244@holly.dyndns.org> Reply-To: chris@calldei.com References: <199904280647.QAA26783@cimlogic.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=GvXjxJ+pjyke8COw; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature" User-Agent: Mutt/0.96.1i In-Reply-To: <199904280647.QAA26783@cimlogic.com.au>; from John Birrell on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 04:47:35PM +1000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --GvXjxJ+pjyke8COw Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, Apr 28, 1999, John Birrell wrote: > I'm working on an application that is targeted at users who, based on > their exposure to a certain commercial OS, expect to be able to point > and clip their way through life, and to recognise things by little > pictures. There are a few things that I'd like to add to FreeBSD to > support this sort of application. The first is to build icon pixmaps > into each executable program. >=20 > Now that we've made the transition to ELF, adding an XPM formatted pixmap > to a program is simply a matter of: >=20 > objcopy --add-section=3D.icon=3Dfile.xpm file >=20 > I could just keep this in my local tree, but that would mean that I have > to build my own distribution and that 3rd-party vendor software won't > contain icons (like it would if built for Windows). I'm hoping that > there is sufficient interest to convince those people who will no doubt > be horrified by doing such a think to a UNIX operating system. (Some of > those people don't read this list, but that's another problem). I don't see why this can't be a port instead, if the '.icon' section is optional and can be added by a user process instead of the linker. > --=20 > John Birrell - jb@cimlogic.com.au; jb@freebsd.org http://www.cimlogic.com= .au/ > CIMlogic Pty Ltd, GPO Box 117A, Melbourne Vic 3001, Australia +61 418 353= 137 >=20 >=20 > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message >=20 --=20 Chris Costello Logic is neither an art or a science but a dodge. --GvXjxJ+pjyke8COw Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQB1AwUBNycdA7fyXY/Dmk2NAQFfUwMAoIRJncoBYLeE8A9d8amab1lEnEjzr3gu G9q4e9zeQXVpt5mThxyQ28gQz2d0oSfn7fqYdpHhW9/U5i6c5PFO4xT57ueuKww1 EfDkLtMqLNkfsNR1UTfEFA0zMMrryTOK =4JgQ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --GvXjxJ+pjyke8COw-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 8: 0:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp11.bellglobal.com (smtp11.bellglobal.com [204.101.251.53]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F279815245 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 08:00:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from vanderh@ecf.toronto.edu) Received: from localhost.nowhere (ppp18323.on.bellglobal.com [206.172.130.3]) by smtp11.bellglobal.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA21859; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:02:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from tim@localhost) by localhost.nowhere (8.9.3/8.9.1) id KAA45345; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 10:59:12 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from tim) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 10:59:11 -0400 From: Tim Vanderhoek To: Emmanuel DELOGET Cc: Tommy Hallgren , FreeBSD Hackers Mail List , John Birrell Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990428105911.B45259@mad> References: <19990428091840.4655.rocketmail@web119.yahoomail.com> <199904280938.JAA12007@excalibur.oceanis.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i In-Reply-To: <199904280938.JAA12007@excalibur.oceanis.net>; from Emmanuel DELOGET on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 11:38:52AM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 11:38:52AM +0200, Emmanuel DELOGET wrote: > > So I really think that it is better to hack the wm - or, if you > prefer, to create gnome/whatever proggies to handle this - than to > hack the fbsd kernel. So you hack this window manager, and then you hack that window manager, and then a new window manager is released, etc.. And then the poor users ask why rm(1) is a trash can in fvwm but is a pair of scissors in enlightenment. I think the idea is cool. The only concerns that strike me at the moment are for future extensibility. This is really the sort of thing that belongs in the filesystem, either as some sort of "extended attributes", or whatever. Being in the filesystem would also solve the problem with letting individual users modify the icon associated with a file. The user would simply overlay their own filesystem ontop of the system's /usr/bin and modify attributes as appropriate. Other future extensibility considerations include what others have mentioned: - large programs feeping creature programs that perform multiple tasks, each deserving of a different icon. - associating larger/smaller icons with programs. - some people have expressed some thoughts on MIME. Whatever they say. :) So long as the appropriate libicon interface is developed that will allow for smooth integration of these features when FreeBSD 11.2 is released on Febuary 27, 2007, then I would love to see standardized icons. -- This .sig is not innovative, witty, or profund. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 8: 5:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from octopus.originative (originat.demon.co.uk [158.152.220.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B540C153CB; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 08:05:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from paul@originative.co.uk) Received: by octopus with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) id ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:03:04 +0100 Message-ID: From: paul@originative.co.uk To: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu, dillon@apollo.backplane.com Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: NFS Patch #8 for current available - new TCP fixes Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:03:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > -----Original Message----- > From: Bill Paul [mailto:wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu] > Sent: 28 April 1999 14:27 > To: dillon@apollo.backplane.com > Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; current@FreeBSD.ORG > Subject: Re: NFS Patch #8 for current available - new TCP fixes > > > Of all the gin joints in all the towns in all the world, > Matthew Dillon > had to walk into mine and say: > > > (fanfair!) > > (Darth Vader's imperial march theme) > > > NFS Patch #8 for -current is now available. This patch > fixes serious bugs > > w/ NFS/TCP. Probably not *all* the failure conditions, > but hopefully > > most of them. > [...] > > > Neither the 'de' nor the 'xl' ethernet drivers align > the packet. The 'xl' > > driver conditionally aligns it for the alpha. Part of > the patch fixes > > the 'xl' driver to unconditionally align the packet > buffer in order to > > improve NFS performance. I could not do the same for > the 'de' driver > > because I am unsure if the dec chipset can handle an > unaligned start > > address. > > From what I can tell, the DEC parts make you specify an RX DMA buffer > address that is longword aligned. There are actually not that > many devices > where you're allowed to use arbitrary byte-aligned addresses > for receive > buffers (the 3Com XL and Intel 'speedo' chips let you do it, > as well as the > ThunderLAN, and the Alteon Tigon NIC; I _think_ the AMD PCnet/LANCE > devices let you do it, but that's about it). The Lance requires longword alignement, the PCnet requires 16 byte alignement if you put it in 32 bit mode, otherwise it's the same as the lance. Paul. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 8: 6:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailgate.cadence.com (mailgate.Cadence.COM [158.140.2.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2923E15758 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 08:06:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dmlb@ragnet.demon.co.uk) Received: (from smap@localhost) by mailgate.cadence.com (8.8.5/8.6.8) id IAA20223 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 08:06:44 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904281506.IAA20223@mailgate.cadence.com> Received: from symnt3.Cadence.COM(194.32.101.100) by mailgate.cadence.com via smap (mjr-v1.2) id xma925312001.020178; Wed, 28 Apr 99 08:06:41 -0700 Received: from pc287-cam.cadence.com ([194.32.96.111]) by symnt3.Cadence.COM with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2232.9) id JHJKDK5X; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:01:48 +0100 Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Duncan Barclay" To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:07:13 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Reply-To: dmlb@ragnet.demon.co.uk In-reply-to: <19990428233307.B30171@gurney.reilly.home> References: <199904281323.GAA25328@mailgate.cadence.com>; from Duncan Barclay on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 02:23:52PM +0000 X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.53/R1) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 02:23:52PM +0000, Duncan Barclay wrote: > > I whole heartadly support John's idea and would like to add support > > for the ideas of taking with further to encode whatever to get rid of > > the obscene hack that is file extension -> action databases in > > current desktops. > > I think that there's a big difference between data file typing > and application-specific icons. > > Andrew There is, but things like magic and Apache try and type data by scrabbling around in the fiules and guessing...sometime badly. Duncan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 8:39: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (Ilsa.StevesCafe.com [205.168.119.129]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A676156FA for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 08:39:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fbsd@Ilsa.StevesCafe.com) Received: from Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA61141; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:41:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fbsd@Ilsa.StevesCafe.com) Message-Id: <199904281541.JAA61141@Ilsa.StevesCafe.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 From: Steve Passe To: Zhihui Zhang Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Basic SMP-kernel questions In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 27 Apr 1999 16:33:28 EDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:41:11 -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, > Since I have moved from FreeBSD 2.2.8 to FreeBSD 3.1, I want to know some > of the issues not related to uni-processor kernel. For example: > ... > (2) If an external interrupt occurs, which CPU will respond to it? Or all > CPUs will respond to it? How about internal exceptions? Its a bit out of date, but look at: http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/papers/apicsubsystem.txt -- Steve Passe | powered by smp@csn.net | Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 8:43:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from boreas.isi.edu (boreas.isi.edu [128.9.160.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E9471570F for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 08:43:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from faber@ISI.EDU) Received: from ISI.EDU (vex-e.isi.edu [128.9.160.240]) by boreas.isi.edu (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id IAA10262 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 08:43:21 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904281543.IAA10262@boreas.isi.edu> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: PR followup? X-Url: http://www.isi.edu/~faber Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 08:43:21 -0700 From: Ted Faber Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- How long should I expect to wait before hearing feedback on a PR. I submitted kern/11222 19 April, and have only heard from the autoresponder. The bug therein is not critical, but I would like someone to look over the included patch and either get the fix included or give me a chance to find a suitable one before the details drift too far out of my mind. I understand folks are busy, and the list of prs is long. What's a reasonable amount of time I should wait before trying to prod some action? - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Ted Faber faber@isi.edu USC/ISI Computer Scientist http://www.isi.edu/~faber (310) 822-1511 x190 PGP Key: http://www.isi.edu/~faber/pubkey.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBNycsR4b4eisfQ5rpAQESHAP/VplRhPYpoiJE0CH6ihnMfBv2PlRYh+OM NUETx105wjbbJUFJDyC7/kBxZzwKMhbTTT7eG6D8MWGxZk/2fBLoD0XsP/YpaKJc /hgcQ5VYi+9MPL4K6ev5cN8koaQc747nmoGCAcY3xfPOlZKGHipNvr/5+bBlDHqd FBWxA0jXSvk= =8B03 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 9:44:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.76.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5112015754 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:44:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au) Received: (from avalon@localhost) by cheops.anu.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id CAA16134 for hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 02:44:25 +1000 (EST) From: Darren Reed Message-Id: <199904281644.CAA16134@cheops.anu.edu.au> Subject: NFS problems in 2.2.8 ? To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 02:44:25 +1000 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Well, this is a very bizarre problem! Running 2.2.8, if I create a directory (NFS mounted) as root which is mode 555, then attempt to create a file in it, nfsiod hangs. Well, the whole system experiences hangs because an nfsiod is in disk-wait. I've *never* seen that problem before (FWIW, NFS server is SunOS4). Well, it's 2.2.8-STABLE, not -RELEASE...if I run -RELEASE I do not experience any problem! Should I have upgraded other parts of 2.2.8 besides the kernel to fix this ? The behaviour in question is a result of a tar from tape onto an NFS mounted disk. Darren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 10:36:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from heathers.stdio.com (heathers.stdio.com [199.89.192.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16A8D15753 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 10:36:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from lile@stdio.com) Received: from heathers.stdio.com (lile@heathers.stdio.com [199.89.192.5]) by heathers.stdio.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA28082 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:36:14 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from lile@stdio.com) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:36:13 -0400 (EDT) From: Larry Lile To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Token-ring and 3.x-stable Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG If I were to roll up the patches for token-ring, what are the chances that we can get them merged into the 3.x branch? They have lived in -current for a while now with no real problems to report, other than the Olicom driver itself needs some work. Now that I am just about over my recent health problems I can get back to work on those. Larry Lile lile@stdio.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 10:36:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90A47154B8 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 10:36:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA89718; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:36:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id LAA15179; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:36:15 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199904281736.LAA15179@harmony.village.org> To: John Birrell Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:04:04 +1000." <199904281004.UAA27348@cimlogic.com.au> References: <199904281004.UAA27348@cimlogic.com.au> Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:36:14 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <199904281004.UAA27348@cimlogic.com.au> John Birrell writes: : The FreeBSD kernel is not affected. I'm not proposing to specify what : the desktop looks like, just the information that is made available : to the desktop programs. I really like this idea. For too long there have been too many kludges to get around not having this infomation co-located with the executable. After all, we're just talking an icon here. Window managers can display it, or override it as they see fit. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 10:55:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail0.atl.bellsouth.net (mail0.atl.bellsouth.net [205.152.0.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4D2814CF7 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 10:55:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wghicks@bellsouth.net) Received: from wghicks.bellsouth.net (host-209-214-69-179.atl.bellsouth.net [209.214.69.179]) by mail0.atl.bellsouth.net (8.8.8-spamdog/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA09726; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:54:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from wghicks (wghicks@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by wghicks.bellsouth.net (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id NAA93179; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:56:24 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net) Message-Id: <199904281756.NAA93179@bellsouth.net> To: Warner Losh Cc: John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:36:14 MDT." <199904281736.LAA15179@harmony.village.org> Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:56:24 -0400 From: W Gerald Hicks Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <199904281004.UAA27348@cimlogic.com.au> John Birrell writes: > : The FreeBSD kernel is not affected. I'm not proposing to specify what > : the desktop looks like, just the information that is made available > : to the desktop programs. > I really like this idea. For too long there have been too many > kludges to get around not having this infomation co-located with the > executable. Definitely agree. > > After all, we're just talking an icon here. Window managers can > display it, or override it as they see fit. Well maybe not. There are quite a few other uses for a "resource fork". As I communicated to John in private email, it might be useful to consider generalizing his concept. For this first application I'd suggest some sort of directory within the section a stub entry pointing to the solitary ICON resource. Later some sort of resource compiler might be fashioned to generate and insert these sections into executable images. Cheers, Jerry Hicks wghicks@bellsouth.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 10:57:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42D5C151BC for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 10:57:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA19188; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:54:37 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:54:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Warner Losh Cc: John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <199904281736.LAA15179@harmony.village.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 28 Apr 1999, Warner Losh wrote: > In message <199904281004.UAA27348@cimlogic.com.au> John Birrell writes: > : The FreeBSD kernel is not affected. I'm not proposing to specify what > : the desktop looks like, just the information that is made available > : to the desktop programs. > > I really like this idea. For too long there have been too many > kludges to get around not having this infomation co-located with the > executable. > > After all, we're just talking an icon here. Window managers can > display it, or override it as they see fit. Honestly, even tho it can be done via objcopy, what we need is a API, something that we guarantee to folks that we won't subtract from (additions only, and no changing stuff), a standard way to ask a application for a property, and get back that property, whether that property is a gif file, or a string, or data. I'm aware that this would be global data, but it could include things like ~ based paths to user state files. If we offer folks a neat way to store state, this would be a strong attraction for GUI programmers to do things for FreeBSD. This could actually become very interesting. This isn't all that difficult a job, and can be done in a way that would have no effect at all to those folks who don't want the new features, removing any sane basis for complaint. We'd still get the insane complaints, but I give you permission to forward those to me (great, Chuck, open mouth, insert foot!) ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 11: 0:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 456B414D0B; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:00:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA18361; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 10:59:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904281759.KAA18361@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Dean Lombardo Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Voice recog. from IBM soon.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:21:35 BST." <3726E12F.47C8F277@excite.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 10:59:31 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG It is a 40MB tar file . Currently, downloading it to give a whirl ... We should request a copy for FreeBSD and also ask Dragon Systems to see if they would make a similar offering 8) Cheers -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 11: 4:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FCC214D38 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:04:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id NAA11330; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:22:52 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:22:50 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Warner Losh Cc: John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) In-Reply-To: <199904281736.LAA15179@harmony.village.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 28 Apr 1999, Warner Losh wrote: > In message <199904281004.UAA27348@cimlogic.com.au> John Birrell writes: > : The FreeBSD kernel is not affected. I'm not proposing to specify what > : the desktop looks like, just the information that is made available > : to the desktop programs. > > I really like this idea. For too long there have been too many > kludges to get around not having this infomation co-located with the > executable. > > After all, we're just talking an icon here. Window managers can > display it, or override it as they see fit. I really liked the idea at first as well, but the more i thought about it, the more it made more sense for it to go into /usr/share/pixmaps or somesuch. Also note that all userland programs (with the exception of dosemu) are command line driven. Running them by clicking on them in X will most likely do nothing. This doesn't belong in the base system, instead it's a standard should be proposed to the GNOME, KDE and other windowing systems people. I even thought of a "make buildworld PIXMAP=NO" option, but refering to my second point this really doesn't make sense especially in a command line driven enviornment like FreeBSD. thanks, -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 11:14:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp2.vnet.net (smtp2.vnet.net [166.82.1.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5902715012 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:14:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp2.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA08540; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:15:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA32643; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:13:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id OAA15682; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:13:55 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:13:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199904281813.OAA15682@lakes.dignus.com> To: chuckr@picnic.mat.net, imp@harmony.village.org Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jb@cimlogic.com.au In-Reply-To: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > On Wed, 28 Apr 1999, Warner Losh wrote: > > > In message <199904281004.UAA27348@cimlogic.com.au> John Birrell writes: > > : The FreeBSD kernel is not affected. I'm not proposing to specify what > > : the desktop looks like, just the information that is made available > > : to the desktop programs. > > > > I really like this idea. For too long there have been too many > > kludges to get around not having this infomation co-located with the > > executable. > > > > After all, we're just talking an icon here. Window managers can > > display it, or override it as they see fit. > > Honestly, even tho it can be done via objcopy, what we need is a API, > something that we guarantee to folks that we won't subtract from > (additions only, and no changing stuff), a standard way to ask a > application for a property, and get back that property, whether that > property is a gif file, or a string, or data. I'm aware that this would > be global data, but it could include things like ~ based paths to user > state files. If we offer folks a neat way to store state, this would be > a strong attraction for GUI programmers to do things for FreeBSD. > > This could actually become very interesting. > > This isn't all that difficult a job, and can be done in a way that would > have no effect at all to those folks who don't want the new features, > removing any sane basis for complaint. We'd still get the insane > complaints, but I give you permission to forward those to me (great, > Chuck, open mouth, insert foot!) > > I can think of one possible complaint (beyond the non-UNIXy feel of this.) Will adding stuff to the execution image impact load time? I mean, even though that section will (likely) not be available in-core at run time, one will still have to read through it to load the executable. Perhaps if it were guaranteed to be at the end (and thus not read at all.)? Another possible complaint - "the operating system used to fit on my small disk, and now doesn't." (Of course, that always seems to be the case - and with the price of disk drives... there's little sympathy for this...) However, in a more abstract sort of mind... What I want out of FreeBSD is not a platform with icons that you can point-and-click on. But, a powerful system I can use for my development activities. I don't use the icons I have now... but, perhaps I'm just an old fogey... My point being, introduction of this may cause a dichotomy in the FreeBSD user community. Power/programming users and casual point-and-click users. I've never seen an operating system that was successful at addressing both of these at once (although Windows certainly claims to be) and, in my opinion, I want the power/programming OS, not the point-and-click one. We may be headed down a slippery-slope... I would certainly argue that any program that *required* this information to be present in an executable was flawed. - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 11:22:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail2.atl.bellsouth.net (mail2.atl.bellsouth.net [205.152.0.22]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27B991557B for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:22:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wghicks@bellsouth.net) Received: from wghicks.bellsouth.net (host-209-214-69-179.atl.bellsouth.net [209.214.69.179]) by mail2.atl.bellsouth.net (8.8.8-spamdog/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA03839; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:22:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from wghicks (wghicks@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by wghicks.bellsouth.net (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id OAA93307; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:23:46 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net) Message-Id: <199904281823.OAA93307@bellsouth.net> To: Alfred Perlstein Cc: Warner Losh , John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:22:50 CDT." Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:23:46 -0400 From: W Gerald Hicks Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Also note that all userland programs (with the exception of dosemu) > are command line driven. Running them by clicking on them in X will > most likely do nothing. This doesn't belong in the base system, > instead it's a standard should be proposed to the GNOME, KDE and other > windowing systems people. A resource fork can be useful to help application developers targeting multiple OS's. Each OS seems to have its own special rules about where supplemental static data should be stored. Often a vendor will shrug the burden and offer support for only one or two OS's. Having a resource fork within executable images might help make multiple target support more manageable for ISV types. It would not be an error to have a null resource fork... The concept isn't necessarily limited to GUI applications and has been successfully used by OS/2, Macs and Windows among others. I'm not aware of anything similar for any Unix but ELF seems to open the door for interesting possibilities there too. Cheers, Jerry Hicks wghicks@bellsouth.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 11:29:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D22B615481 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:29:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA19358; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:26:15 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:26:15 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: W Gerald Hicks Cc: Alfred Perlstein , Warner Losh , John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) In-Reply-To: <199904281823.OAA93307@bellsouth.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 28 Apr 1999, W Gerald Hicks wrote: > > Also note that all userland programs (with the exception of dosemu) > > are command line driven. Running them by clicking on them in X will > > most likely do nothing. This doesn't belong in the base system, > > instead it's a standard should be proposed to the GNOME, KDE and other > > windowing systems people. > > A resource fork can be useful to help application developers targeting > multiple OS's. Each OS seems to have its own special rules about where > supplemental static data should be stored. > > Often a vendor will shrug the burden and offer support for only one or > two OS's. Having a resource fork within executable images might help > make multiple target support more manageable for ISV types. > > It would not be an error to have a null resource fork... > > The concept isn't necessarily limited to GUI applications and has been > successfully used by OS/2, Macs and Windows among others. I'm not aware > of anything similar for any Unix but ELF seems to open the door for > interesting possibilities there too. Agreed, but I think you're missing the point. It's not the HAVING of a resource fork that's the key, any programmer working in isolation can have that. It's the having a standard place to stick those resource forks, and a standard method to get and find them, that's the key thing. Doing this via elf, that could be a godsend, because it's such a natural place to stick things. That's why I asked for a standard API for such a thing. Folks probably looked at that request anf thought "but it's trivial and can be done via objcopy now" but it's the advertising of the standard, that FreeBSD will offer this neat place to put things, and a standard way to get at them, that's where the real value lies. > > Cheers, > > Jerry Hicks > wghicks@bellsouth.net > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 11:32:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5CB9D14C2A for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:32:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA90043; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 12:31:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id MAA15792; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 12:31:54 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199904281831.MAA15792@harmony.village.org> To: Chuck Robey Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) Cc: W Gerald Hicks , Alfred Perlstein , John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:26:15 EDT." References: Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 12:31:54 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [[ cc lines trimmed ]] PEOPLE. PLEASE TRIM THE CC LINES!!!! Thanks In message Chuck Robey writes: : Doing this via elf, that could be a godsend, because it's such a natural : place to stick things. That's why I asked for a standard API for such a : thing. Folks probably looked at that request anf thought "but it's : trivial and can be done via objcopy now" but it's the advertising of the : standard, that FreeBSD will offer this neat place to put things, and a : standard way to get at them, that's where the real value lies. I agree completely. We need a standard way of doing this, and that's why the OS people are doing it, not the X people... It isn't just for X things. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 11:39: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp2.vnet.net (smtp2.vnet.net [166.82.1.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 656841575C for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:39:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp2.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA11373; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:39:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA32710; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:38:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id OAA16131; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:38:33 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:38:33 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199904281838.OAA16131@lakes.dignus.com> To: chuckr@picnic.mat.net, imp@harmony.village.org Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) Cc: bright@rush.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jb@cimlogic.com.au, wghicks@bellsouth.net In-Reply-To: <199904281831.MAA15792@harmony.village.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > In message Chuck Robey writes: > : Doing this via elf, that could be a godsend, because it's such a natural > : place to stick things. That's why I asked for a standard API for such a > : thing. Folks probably looked at that request anf thought "but it's > : trivial and can be done via objcopy now" but it's the advertising of the > : standard, that FreeBSD will offer this neat place to put things, and a > : standard way to get at them, that's where the real value lies. > > I agree completely. We need a standard way of doing this, and that's > why the OS people are doing it, not the X people... It isn't just for > X things. > > Warner > Well then, given that... shouldn't we design the interface people would use - and then worry about the implementation (which could very well take advantage of ELF on FreeBSD, and some other mechanism on a different box.) - Dave R. - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 11:41:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2B2C15481; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:41:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA41287; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 19:41:25 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 19:41:25 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Bill Paul Cc: Matthew Dillon , hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: NFS Patch #8 for current available - new TCP fixes In-Reply-To: <199904281327.JAA29467@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 28 Apr 1999, Bill Paul wrote: > Of all the gin joints in all the towns in all the world, Matthew Dillon > had to walk into mine and say: > > > (fanfair!) > > (Darth Vader's imperial march theme) > > > NFS Patch #8 for -current is now available. This patch fixes serious bugs > > w/ NFS/TCP. Probably not *all* the failure conditions, but hopefully > > most of them. > [...] > > > Neither the 'de' nor the 'xl' ethernet drivers align the packet. The 'xl' > > driver conditionally aligns it for the alpha. Part of the patch fixes > > the 'xl' driver to unconditionally align the packet buffer in order to > > improve NFS performance. I could not do the same for the 'de' driver > > because I am unsure if the dec chipset can handle an unaligned start > > address. > > >From what I can tell, the DEC parts make you specify an RX DMA buffer > address that is longword aligned. There are actually not that many devices > where you're allowed to use arbitrary byte-aligned addresses for receive > buffers (the 3Com XL and Intel 'speedo' chips let you do it, as well as the > ThunderLAN, and the Alteon Tigon NIC; I _think_ the AMD PCnet/LANCE > devices let you do it, but that's about it). > > For parts that don't support arbitrary alignment, you have to copy. > Now, in some of the drivers that I ported to the alpha, I only copied > the first small section of the packet in order to get the IP header > aligned (since failing to do this causes an unaligned access trap in > the IP code). This is faster than copying the entire packet to fix > the alignment, but I'm not sure what effect it has on NFS. > > That said, although I haven't looked too closely at the de driver (it > scares me -- a lot), it should have some sort of gimmick to fix the > packet alignment otherwise it wouldn't work on the alpha. The de driver copies the entire packet. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 12:13:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gta.com (mailgate.gta.com [199.120.225.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6162E1572E for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 12:13:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from lab@gta.com) Received: from gta.com (GTA internal mail system) by gta.com with ESMTP id PAA21145 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:14:15 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <37275D5B.9CC6EE@gta.com> Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:11:26 -0400 From: Larry Baird X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > After all, we're just talking an icon here. Window managers can > display it, or override it as they see fit. Not sure how I feel about the icons in the binaries issue. A slightly different approach might be to use the "objcopy" command to embed unique numbers into the applications that could then be mapped to icons by the window manager. This number might also come handy for other mappings in the future. -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- _________ ////T\\\\ | This momentary escape from the lab brought to you by: ///(o o)\\\ | Larry Baird | Email: lab@gta.com --oOOo-(_)-oOOo-----| Global Technology Associates, Inc. | Orlando, FL /// \\\ | TEL: 407-380-0220 | FAX: 407-380-6080 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 12:53:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED7E4154A4 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 12:53:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA00893; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 12:52:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904281952.MAA00893@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: John Birrell Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:47:35 +1000." <199904280647.QAA26783@cimlogic.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 12:52:00 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Now that we've made the transition to ELF, adding an XPM formatted pixmap > to a program is simply a matter of: > > objcopy --add-section=.icon=file.xpm file Nice idea, and making it a standard part of the bsd.prog.mk infrastructure is a good idea, but a couple of suggestions: - Add a NO_ICONS option so that icons are ignored by the build (if you haven't already). - Work out a mechanism for supporting more than one icon per executable. At the very least, you want to have several different sizes, and many people will want to either add their own icons to an application or chose amongst them. This obviously then requires you to add an "active" flag to each of the "active" icons at each size. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 13: 7:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3123914EAD for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:07:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA17961; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:06:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Larry Lile Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Token-ring and 3.x-stable In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:36:13 EDT." Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:06:57 -0700 Message-ID: <17959.925330017@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > If I were to roll up the patches for token-ring, what are the > chances that we can get them merged into the 3.x branch? Hmmm. We're heading for freeze in just over 10 days here and I have to say that I have my doubts... - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 13:13: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from heathers.stdio.com (heathers.stdio.com [199.89.192.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7D111579B for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:12:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from lile@stdio.com) Received: from heathers.stdio.com (lile@heathers.stdio.com [199.89.192.5]) by heathers.stdio.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA05107; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:12:18 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from lile@stdio.com) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:12:17 -0400 (EDT) From: Larry Lile To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Token-ring and 3.x-stable In-Reply-To: <17959.925330017@zippy.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 28 Apr 1999, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > If I were to roll up the patches for token-ring, what are the > > chances that we can get them merged into the 3.x branch? > > Hmmm. We're heading for freeze in just over 10 days here and I have > to say that I have my doubts... I don't mind waiting until after the freeze/release, I just wanted to get feedback and get a place in the queue, if acceptable. Larry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 13:16:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from jumping-spider.aracnet.com (jumping-spider.aracnet.com [205.159.88.14]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9437B157BB for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:16:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from beattie@aracnet.com) Received: from shell2.aracnet.com (IDENT:1728@shell2.aracnet.com [205.159.88.20]) by jumping-spider.aracnet.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id NAA19102; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:16:08 -0700 Received: from localhost by shell2.aracnet.com (8.8.7) id NAA05667; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:16:07 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: shell2.aracnet.com: beattie owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:16:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Brian Beattie To: Chuck Robey Cc: W Gerald Hicks , Alfred Perlstein , Warner Losh , John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 28 Apr 1999, Chuck Robey wrote: > > Agreed, but I think you're missing the point. It's not the HAVING of a > resource fork that's the key, any programmer working in isolation can > have that. It's the having a standard place to stick those resource > forks, and a standard method to get and find them, that's the key thing. > > Doing this via elf, that could be a godsend, because it's such a natural > place to stick things. That's why I asked for a standard API for such a > thing. Folks probably looked at that request anf thought "but it's > trivial and can be done via objcopy now" but it's the advertising of the > standard, that FreeBSD will offer this neat place to put things, and a > standard way to get at them, that's where the real value lies. > The problem I have with this is, I'd like resource forks on all files. You could stick a small elf executable on the from of a data file, but that would break the UNIX file model. Brian Beattie | The only problem with beattie@aracnet.com | winning the rat race ... www.aracnet.com/~beattie | in the end you're still a rat To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 13:20: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 361ED157D5 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:20:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA01044; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:17:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: jack Cc: John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:29:49 EDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:17:46 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Today John Birrell wrote: > > > I've also put up a modified bsd.prog.mk to allow pixmaps to be built > > into programs during `make world'. Using the modified bsd.prog.mk, > > any program built with ICON_NAME=file.xpm in the Makefile will have a > > .icon section added containing the contents of the file.xpm. > > Please make the default NOT to build them, as this is totally > useless for servers that don't run X or are headless. Since the overhead is minimal, and costs nothing at runtime, the default would be to build _with_ them. Please focus your worry on things that actually matter to the server application. 8) -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 13:20:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C5E0154C4 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:20:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA18120; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:20:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Larry Lile Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Token-ring and 3.x-stable In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:12:17 EDT." Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:20:01 -0700 Message-ID: <18118.925330801@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I don't mind waiting until after the freeze/release, I just wanted to > get feedback and get a place in the queue, if acceptable. I have absolutely zero objections to this coming into -stable after the 3.2-RELEASE date. It would make a fine 3.3 feature. :) - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 13:26:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from heathers.stdio.com (heathers.stdio.com [199.89.192.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4BEE1575C for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:26:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from lile@stdio.com) Received: from heathers.stdio.com (lile@heathers.stdio.com [199.89.192.5]) by heathers.stdio.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA05873; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:26:05 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from lile@stdio.com) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:26:04 -0400 (EDT) From: Larry Lile To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Token-ring and 3.x-stable In-Reply-To: <18118.925330801@zippy.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 28 Apr 1999, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > I don't mind waiting until after the freeze/release, I just wanted to > > get feedback and get a place in the queue, if acceptable. > > I have absolutely zero objections to this coming into -stable after > the 3.2-RELEASE date. It would make a fine 3.3 feature. :) Good, that will make my life much easier! Now I just have to talk someone into making the commits for me (after the release). Once more into the breach... Larry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 13:38:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cimlogic.com.au (cimlog.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.51.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B076C154C4 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:38:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jb@cimlogic.com.au) Received: (from jb@localhost) by cimlogic.com.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id GAA28992; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 06:44:45 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jb) From: John Birrell Message-Id: <199904282044.GAA28992@cimlogic.com.au> Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: from Tony Finch at "Apr 28, 1999 3:17:23 pm" To: dot@dotat.at (Tony Finch) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 06:44:45 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Tony Finch wrote: > adrian@freebsd.org wrote: > > > >If you want to do it for data, then you would have to make mime-type > >(or whatever you use to slap on a file type) part of the filesystem > >entry. > > What about using the magic directory, as used by file(1) and Apache's > mod_mime_magic? I have a separate proposal for magic(5) as used by file(1). For each file type, add a comment: #"file.xpm" immediately before the first magic value of each type. Since it is a comment, file(1) will ignore it, whereas other applications can look for it as a special case. It's a kludge, but it should work. I'm still prototyping that. -- John Birrell - jb@cimlogic.com.au; jb@freebsd.org http://www.cimlogic.com.au/ CIMlogic Pty Ltd, GPO Box 117A, Melbourne Vic 3001, Australia +61 418 353 137 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 14: 2:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FF27151A8 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:02:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA01272; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:59:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199904282059.NAA01272@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Thomas David Rivers Cc: chuckr@picnic.mat.net, imp@harmony.village.org, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jb@cimlogic.com.au Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:13:55 EDT." <199904281813.OAA15682@lakes.dignus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:59:56 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > Will adding stuff to the execution image impact load time? I mean, > even though that section will (likely) not be available in-core at run > time, one will still have to read through it to load the executable. We page executables, we don't "load" them, so the answer is no - the region containing the pixmap is never going to be referenced by the running code, so it'll never be touched. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 14:49: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from borderware.com (gateway.borderware.com [207.236.65.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 844A914C86 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:48:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dchapes@borderware.com) Received: by gateway.borderware.com id <115201>; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:49:32 -0400 From: Dave Chapeskie Message-Id: <99Apr28.174932edt.115201@gateway.borderware.com> Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:48:50 -0400 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: gdbserver broken? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i X-no-archive: yes Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Is it just me or is gdbserver broken in FreeBSD-3.1? % uname -sr FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE % gdbserver /dev/cuaa0 /bin/ls Process /bin/ls created; pid = 14099 reading register 0: Bad address Exiting Exit 1 -- Dave Chapeskie, To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 15: 4:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF58A154A6; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:04:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id PAA09667; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:04:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:04:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904282204.PAA09667@apollo.backplane.com> To: Bill Paul Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NFS Patch #8 for current available - new TCP fixes References: <199904281327.JAA29467@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :For parts that don't support arbitrary alignment, you have to copy. :Now, in some of the drivers that I ported to the alpha, I only copied :the first small section of the packet in order to get the IP header :aligned (since failing to do this causes an unaligned access trap in :the IP code). This is faster than copying the entire packet to fix :the alignment, but I'm not sure what effect it has on NFS. : :-Bill : :-- :============================================================================= :-Bill Paul (212) 854-6020 | System Manager, Master of Unix-Fu What will happen is that NFS will realign the unaligned mbufs, which requires a copy. NFS previously copied in-place, but my patch rewrites that code to copy to a new buffer ( because copying in-place breaks NFS/TCP ). We could avoid realigning the mbufs by changing the various NFS 32 bit read/write macros to operate in 16 bit chunks. This might be the best solution ultimately. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 15:17:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from germanium.xtalwind.net (germanium.xtalwind.net [205.160.242.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E2D014C9F for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:17:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jack@germanium.xtalwind.net) Received: from localhost (jack@localhost) by germanium.xtalwind.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA47316; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:16:37 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:16:37 -0400 (EDT) From: jack To: Mike Smith Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Today Mike Smith wrote: > > Please make the default NOT to build them, as this is totally > > useless for servers that don't run X or are headless. > > Since the overhead is minimal, and costs nothing at runtime, the > default would be to build _with_ them. Please focus your worry on > things that actually matter to the server application. 8) We're rapidly approaching the time when upgrading an older box with a 32meg (default) / partition will involve repartitioning, since 32megs won't hold it all. To have to do that for functionality is one thing, to have to do it for icons on "The Power to Serve" OS seems an oxymoron. I just hope someone drops a tag before the system goes totally GUI. :) -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Jack O'Neill Systems Administrator / Systems Analyst jack@germanium.xtalwind.net Crystal Wind Communications, Inc. Finger jack@germanium.xtalwind.net for my PGP key. PGP Key fingerprint = F6 C4 E6 D4 2F 15 A7 67 FD 09 E9 3C 5F CC EB CD enriched, vcard, HTML messages > /dev/null -------------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 15:34:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 882CE14BC9 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:34:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from andrew@lake.com.au) Received: from m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20]) by m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id IAA28622 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:34:23 +1000 (EST) X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: andrew@lake.com.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. Received: from areilly.bpc-users.org (CPE-24-192-51-95.nsw.bigpond.net.au [24.192.51.95]) by m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with SMTP id IAA01951 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:34:21 +1000 (EST) Received: (qmail 34679 invoked by uid 1000); 28 Apr 1999 22:34:21 -0000 From: "Andrew Reilly" Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:34:21 +1000 To: Mike Smith Cc: jack , John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990429083421.A34373@gurney.reilly.home> References: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com>; from Mike Smith on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 01:17:46PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Since the overhead is minimal, and costs nothing at runtime, the > default would be to build _with_ them. Please focus your worry on Look, I realise that I'm coming across as a total nay-sayer, and that's a pity, because I do think that we should be trying to make the desktop thing work more conveniently. But it seems to me that this resource-fork argument is missing or avoiding a few important points, the most important one (to me) is that this is Unix, a _multi-user_ system. Unix uses ownership and permissions to protect the system against whole classes of problems (such as viruses) that plague the exact same systems that have been held up as shining examples of resource-fork induced ease of use: Windows, MacOS, and OS/2. Unix has hier(7), which, when followed, allows us to back up the mutable bits of our computers easily, without even looking at the immutable bits. If you're going to standardise some sort of window-system API, that's wonderful, but I think that it can be built on _top_ of the existing, well-organised file system, rather than permuting that system. I offer Acorn's RISC-OS as a working example of a minimally permuted file system that has "resource forks". Admittedly, that file system has a single 12-bit type associated with files, to help it figure out what they are, but beyond that, it's all just plain files and directories. The windowing system and associated APIs used by applications collude to treat certain directories "applications". These directories, according to the API, contain files (at least) "!Boot" "!Run", and often "icon". Icon is just a regulation-sized pixmap. "!Boot" is usually a script that does system-registration of the file data types used by that application, and "!Run" is often a script that sets environment variables before executing the real program. Now this model works pretty well, (again, for a single-user system), but does not fit hier(7) at all. My argument is basically that the right way to do a desktop under Unix is more-or-less exactly the way it's done now, but with the bennefit of standardisation. For application foo, executables go in ${PREFIX}/bin/foo, system default data goes in ${PREFIX}/share/foo/, install-time configuration goes in ${PREFIX}/etc/foo.rc, and user-specific configuration or state data goes in ${HOME}/.foo/ or ${HOME}/.foorc. If you're looking for an icon, it's in ${PREFIX}/share/foo/icon.{xpm,gif,tiff}, unless the user has overridden the default by creating ${HOME}/.foo/icon.xpm. The whole lot is registered in /var/db/pkg/foo-x.y/+CONTENTS. What's so hard about that? If you're argument is that that's hard to just copy to another place (something I don't think I've ever felt the need to do), then you need a tool that uses +CONTENTS. We probably have such a thing already. If your argument is that "all of the window managers do it diferently", you've hit the nail on the head. There _are_ different solutions to this problem. Some superficially or gratuitously different, some fundamentally different. Getting them to work together is a tough business, because it involves human interaction. Meetings. White-papers. Standards. -- Andrew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 15:36:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F81314EC4 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:36:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from andrew@lake.com.au) Received: from m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20]) by m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id IAA28997 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:36:40 +1000 (EST) X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: andrew@lake.com.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. Received: from areilly.bpc-users.org (CPE-24-192-51-95.nsw.bigpond.net.au [24.192.51.95]) by m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with SMTP id IAA02525 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:36:38 +1000 (EST) Received: (qmail 34725 invoked by uid 1000); 28 Apr 1999 22:36:38 -0000 From: "Andrew Reilly" Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:36:38 +1000 To: Mike Smith Cc: jack , John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990429083638.B34373@gurney.reilly.home> References: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com>; from Mike Smith on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 01:17:46PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 01:17:46PM -0700, Mike Smith wrote: > Since the overhead is minimal, and costs nothing at runtime, the > default would be to build _with_ them. Please focus your worry on > things that actually matter to the server application. 8) I have no argument about size costs. I have no argument about collecting per-program icons. My argument is that the executable is the wrong place to put them. -- Andrew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 15:42:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cimlogic.com.au (cimlog.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.51.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2D3715531 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:41:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jb@cimlogic.com.au) Received: (from jb@localhost) by cimlogic.com.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id IAA29340; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:45:57 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jb) From: John Birrell Message-Id: <199904282245.IAA29340@cimlogic.com.au> Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: from jack at "Apr 28, 1999 6:16:37 pm" To: jack@germanium.xtalwind.net (jack) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:45:57 +1000 (EST) Cc: mike@smith.net.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG jack wrote: > We're rapidly approaching the time when upgrading an older box > with a 32meg (default) / partition will involve repartitioning, > since 32megs won't hold it all. To have to do that for > functionality is one thing, to have to do it for icons on "The > Power to Serve" OS seems an oxymoron. IMHO, "The Power to Serve" was coined because that is the only market that FreeBSD can hope to address at the moment. As a workstation, FreeBSD requires a hell of a lot of hacking. A lot of people will never be capable of doing that. > I just hope someone drops a tag before the system goes totally > GUI. :) Nobody is talking about going "totally GUI". I'd like to see a lot more people using FreeBSD. We should look at what problems people have using FreeBSD. The word "difficult" comes to mind. I choose to use vi as an editor because I can use it without thinking. When I listen to what users want, I try to understand how they go about using a system "without thinking". -- John Birrell - jb@cimlogic.com.au; jb@freebsd.org http://www.cimlogic.com.au/ CIMlogic Pty Ltd, GPO Box 117A, Melbourne Vic 3001, Australia +61 418 353 137 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 15:44:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kithrup.com (kithrup.com [205.179.156.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52413151D1 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:44:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sef@kithrup.com) Received: (from sef@localhost) by kithrup.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA28325; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:44:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sef) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:44:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Sean Eric Fagan Message-Id: <199904282244.PAA28325@kithrup.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Reply-To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <19990429083638.B34373.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@gurney.reilly.home> References: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com>; from Mike Smith on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 01:17:46PM -0700 Organization: Kithrup Enterprises, Ltd. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article <19990429083638.B34373.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@gurney.reilly.home> you write: >On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 01:17:46PM -0700, Mike Smith wrote: >> Since the overhead is minimal, and costs nothing at runtime, the >> default would be to build _with_ them. Please focus your worry on >> things that actually matter to the server application. 8) >I have no argument about size costs. I have no argument about >collecting per-program icons. My argument is that the >executable is the wrong place to put them. Andrew is correct. For example... Apple Computer currently has a system like what was proposed. Actually, it's a considerably better system, since it's general-purpose, extensible, and user-modifiable if desired, but it's along the same lines. They're dropping it, and going with what NeXTStEP uses, for MacOS X -- each "application" is a directory, and has certain files in the directory. These files include the icons (multiple ones for multiple uses, of course -- how is the original propronent of this bloat going to handle that?), the executable, and all sorts of other metadata. Other unix systems have done similar. Putting icons in the executable itself is pretty stupid -- it's a single instance of something that a window manager can use, and there are much less-invasive ways of doing the same thing. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 15:55:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.stox.sa.enteract.com (dyn1-tnt18-239.chicago.il.ameritech.net [206.141.221.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C743814D98 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:55:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ken@stox.sa.enteract.com) Received: from localhost (localhost.stox.sa.enteract.com [127.0.0.1]) by m4.stox.sa.enteract.com (8.9.3/8.6.12) with ESMTP id FAA00453; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 05:54:59 -0500 (CDT) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 05:54:59 -0500 (CDT) From: "Kenneth P. Stox" Reply-To: stox@enteract.com To: Julian Elischer Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Voice recog. from IBM soon.. In-Reply-To: <37266B2C.1CFBAE39@whistle.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG http://www.software.ibm.com/is/voicetype/dev_linux.htm In case you're interested. -Ken Stox stox@imagescape.com On Tue, 27 Apr 1999, Julian Elischer wrote: > IBM has anounced it will be making a binary of it's voice recog. engine > available for Linux.. Free for personal use. > > I'm guessing it should work for FreeBSD too. > > Apparently Red-Hat are involved... > > hmmm... > Hal? take a letter... > > arrrr, emmm start at... NO NO stop! > > julian > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 16:15:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fep1-orange.clear.net.nz (fep1-orange.clear.net.nz [203.97.32.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 61882154A6 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:15:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jabley@buddha.clear.net.nz) Received: from buddha.clear.net.nz (buddha.clear.net.nz [192.168.24.106]) by fep1-orange.clear.net.nz (1.5/1.11) with ESMTP id LAA10686; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:15:47 +1200 (NZST) Received: (from jabley@localhost) by buddha.clear.net.nz (8.9.3/8.9.2) id LAA82209; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:15:34 +1200 (NZST) (envelope-from jabley) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:15:34 +1200 From: Joe Abley To: W Gerald Hicks Cc: Alfred Perlstein , Warner Losh , John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net, jabley@clear.co.nz Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) Message-ID: <19990429111534.B81921@clear.co.nz> References: <199904281823.OAA93307@bellsouth.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904281823.OAA93307@bellsouth.net>; from W Gerald Hicks on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 02:23:46PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 02:23:46PM -0400, W Gerald Hicks wrote: > A resource fork can be useful to help application developers targeting > multiple OS's. Each OS seems to have its own special rules about where > supplemental static data should be stored. While we're busy re-inventing the Mac :) how about the concept of fat binaries? Is there any reason why we couldn't support ELF binaries with multiple pageable executables embedded in it, so that a single distributed binary could support multiple architectures? You could always strip the binaries down to a single architecture if you were short of space... Joe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 16:20:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fep1-orange.clear.net.nz (fep1-orange.clear.net.nz [203.97.32.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 031271545A for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:20:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jabley@buddha.clear.net.nz) Received: from buddha.clear.net.nz (buddha.clear.net.nz [192.168.24.106]) by fep1-orange.clear.net.nz (1.5/1.11) with ESMTP id LAA12188; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:20:15 +1200 (NZST) Received: (from jabley@localhost) by buddha.clear.net.nz (8.9.3/8.9.2) id LAA82250; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:20:07 +1200 (NZST) (envelope-from jabley) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:20:07 +1200 From: Joe Abley To: Andrew Reilly Cc: Chuck Robey , John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jabley@clear.co.nz Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990429112007.C81921@clear.co.nz> References: <199904280647.QAA26783@cimlogic.com.au> <19990428233131.A30171@gurney.reilly.home> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <19990428233131.A30171@gurney.reilly.home>; from Andrew Reilly on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 11:31:31PM +1000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 11:31:31PM +1000, Andrew Reilly wrote: > I really, really, don't like the idea of mutable state in an > application (executable). There are reasons that I log in as > me, and use executables owned by root, that I can't modify. This reminds me of another idea that sprang to mind as I wound through traffic to work this morning. Why not store a PGP signature for the executable section in a separate metadata section? All binaries could be essentially signed by root@buildhost, which ought to make routine checks for validity of Important System Binaries easier and better. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 16:26: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fep1-orange.clear.net.nz (fep1-orange.clear.net.nz [203.97.32.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C7211545A for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:25:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jabley@buddha.clear.net.nz) Received: from buddha.clear.net.nz (buddha.clear.net.nz [192.168.24.106]) by fep1-orange.clear.net.nz (1.5/1.11) with ESMTP id LAA14293; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:25:46 +1200 (NZST) Received: (from jabley@localhost) by buddha.clear.net.nz (8.9.3/8.9.2) id LAA82372; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:25:38 +1200 (NZST) (envelope-from jabley) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:25:38 +1200 From: Joe Abley To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: jabley@clear.co.nz Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990429112538.D81921@clear.co.nz> References: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com>; <19990429083638.B34373.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@gurney.reilly.home> <199904282244.PAA28325@kithrup.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904282244.PAA28325@kithrup.com>; from Sean Eric Fagan on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 03:44:47PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 03:44:47PM -0700, Sean Eric Fagan wrote: > Putting icons in the executable itself is pretty stupid -- it's a single > instance of something that a window manager can use, and there are much > less-invasive ways of doing the same thing. What's invasive about it? [not trying to go wild with advocacy-fever, just wondering what downside there is to this apart from taking up a little more disk space] Joe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 16:30:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC6CF15570; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:30:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id QAA88801; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:25:21 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:25:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Amancio Hasty Cc: Dean Lombardo , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Voice recog. from IBM soon.. In-Reply-To: <199904281759.KAA18361@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG we're all ears! On Wed, 28 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > It is a 40MB tar file . Currently, downloading it to give a whirl ... > > We should request a copy for FreeBSD and also ask > Dragon Systems to see if they would make a similar > offering 8) > > Cheers > -- > > Amancio Hasty > hasty@star-gate.com > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 16:31:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0464514CAF for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:31:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id RAA23277; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:31:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id RAA11927; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:31:43 -0600 Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:31:43 -0600 Message-Id: <199904282331.RAA11927@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Joe Abley Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <19990429112538.D81921@clear.co.nz> References: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com> <19990429083638.B34373.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@gurney.reilly.home> <199904282244.PAA28325@kithrup.com> <19990429112538.D81921@clear.co.nz> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > Putting icons in the executable itself is pretty stupid -- it's a single > > instance of something that a window manager can use, and there are much > > less-invasive ways of doing the same thing. > > What's invasive about it? The fact that the user may not like the icon you've chosen to use due to many criteria, including size, # of colors, transparency, 2D/3D, etc... So, do we embed every icon the user may want to use inside the executable to meet everyone's needs, or do we find an alternative location such that the user can use any icon it finds appropriate. This also allows for such things as 'themes', whereby I can change the behavior of my system if the location of the icons are in a centralized place by replacing the contents with a similar layout with different icons. Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 16:36: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF15B14D3B for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:36:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from andrew@lake.com.au) Received: from m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20]) by m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id JAA11047 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:36:02 +1000 (EST) X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: andrew@lake.com.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. Received: from areilly.bpc-users.org (CPE-24-192-51-95.nsw.bigpond.net.au [24.192.51.95]) by m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with SMTP id JAA21526 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:36:02 +1000 (EST) Received: (qmail 35186 invoked by uid 1000); 28 Apr 1999 23:36:02 -0000 From: "Andrew Reilly" Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:36:02 +1000 To: Joe Abley Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990429093602.A35123@gurney.reilly.home> References: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com>; <19990429083638.B34373.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@gurney.reilly.home> <199904282244.PAA28325@kithrup.com> <19990429112538.D81921@clear.co.nz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <19990429112538.D81921@clear.co.nz>; from Joe Abley on Thu, Apr 29, 1999 at 11:25:38AM +1200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 29, 1999 at 11:25:38AM +1200, Joe Abley wrote: > On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 03:44:47PM -0700, Sean Eric Fagan wrote: > > Putting icons in the executable itself is pretty stupid -- it's a single > > instance of something that a window manager can use, and there are much > > less-invasive ways of doing the same thing. > > What's invasive about it? It breaks the multi-user ownership/protection model. Regarding your comment about PGP signatures: the reason that we don't need them is that for someone to be able to modify a (system) executable on FreeBSD, they have to already be root on your system. If they're root, they can do anything. -- Andrew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 17: 3: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-out1.apple.com (mail-out1.apple.com [17.254.0.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7E3B15122 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:02:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from justin@rhapture.apple.com) Received: from mailgate2.apple.com ([17.129.100.225]) by mail-out1.apple.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA32824 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:01:24 -0700 Received: from scv4.apple.com (scv4.apple.com) by mailgate2.apple.com (mailgate2.apple.com- SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:01:14 -0700 Received: from rhapture.apple.com (rhapture.apple.com [17.202.40.59]) by scv4.apple.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA61014 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:59:42 -0700 Received: by rhapture.apple.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) id RAA02855 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:01:13 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904290001.RAA02855@rhapture.apple.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <19990429083638.B34373.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@gurney.reilly.home> Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:01:11 -0700 From: "Justin C. Walker" Reply-To: justin@apple.com X-Mailer: by Apple MailViewer (2.105.dev) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > From: Sean Eric Fagan > Date: 1999-04-28 15:45:03 -0700 > > In article > <19990429083638.B34373.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@gurney.reilly.home> > you write: > >On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 01:17:46PM -0700, Mike Smith wrote: > >> Since the overhead is minimal, and costs nothing at runtime, the > >> default would be to build _with_ them. Please focus your worry on > >> things that actually matter to the server application. 8) > >I have no argument about size costs. I have no argument about > >collecting per-program icons. My argument is that the > >executable is the wrong place to put them. > > Andrew is correct. > > For example... Apple Computer currently has a system like what was proposed. > Actually, it's a considerably better system, since it's general-purpose, > extensible, and user-modifiable if desired, but it's along the same lines. > > They're dropping it, and going with what NeXTStEP uses, for MacOS X -- each > "application" is a directory, and has certain files in the directory. These > files include the icons (multiple ones for multiple uses, of course -- how is > the original propronent of this bloat going to handle that?), the executable, > and all sorts of other metadata. I don't have much to add to the ongoing discussion in this thread, but I have to note that this is just wrong. We're not dropping any of the "general-purpose, extensible, user-modifiable" aspects of Mac OS X. We're changing how some of this is achieved, but Apple's goal is *not* to replace Mac OS with Unix. Our goal is to maintain and improve what's proven effective in Mac OS, by replacing some pieces of the system with others, with the aim of improving stability and performance. File forks, finder info, and other file system extensions under discussion here, are not slated for the slag heap. Regards, Justin -- Justin C. Walker, Curmudgeon-At-Large * Institute for General Semantics | Manager, CoreOS Networking | Men are from Earth. Apple Computer, Inc. | Women are from Earth. 2 Infinite Loop | Deal with it. Cupertino, CA 95014 | *-------------------------------------*-------------------------------* To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 17:14:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from palrel3.hp.com (palrel3.hp.com [156.153.255.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD61D15122 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:14:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from darrylo@sr.hp.com) Received: from srmail.sr.hp.com (srmail.sr.hp.com [15.4.45.14]) by palrel3.hp.com (8.8.6 (PHNE_17135)/8.8.5tis) with ESMTP id RAA16877 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:14:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mina.sr.hp.com by srmail.sr.hp.com with ESMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA013184857; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:14:17 -0700 Received: from localhost (darrylo@mina.sr.hp.com [15.4.42.247]) by mina.sr.hp.com with ESMTP (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.7.3 TIS 5.0) id RAA24394 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:14:17 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904290014.RAA24394@mina.sr.hp.com> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) Reply-To: Darryl Okahata In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:26:15 EDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 1.1.1.1) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:14:16 -0700 From: Darryl Okahata Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Chuck Robey wrote: > Agreed, but I think you're missing the point. It's not the HAVING of a > resource fork that's the key, any programmer working in isolation can > have that. It's the having a standard place to stick those resource > forks, and a standard method to get and find them, that's the key thing. Other key points: * With icons in the binary, maintainance is easier ("How much easier?", is another issue, though). It's much easier to maintain icons if they're attached to the executable. Also, among other things, you don't run into the problem of having out-of-date icons when upgrading binaries. [ Yes, in theory, things like this don't happen with proper installation procedures, but they're all too common in real life. ] * Probable less disk space. It sounds as if adding an icon to an executable will only add a few tens of bytes. If you make the icon a separate file (per icon), the disk space requirements skyrocket (what's the default frag size for FFS -- I forget?). Of course, you could have an icon database to get around this, but you make icon maintanance much more difficult. Disk space is also pretty cheap these days but, if people are screaming over a piddly few bytes, they'll scream even louder when you start talking about Kbytes. -- Darryl Okahata darrylo@sr.hp.com DISCLAIMER: this message is the author's personal opinion and does not constitute the support, opinion, or policy of Hewlett-Packard, or of the little green men that have been following him all day. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 17:28:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp1.vnet.net (smtp1.vnet.net [166.82.1.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 686E615122 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:28:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp1.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id UAA09634 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:29:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA33200 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:28:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id UAA18577 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:28:28 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:28:28 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199904290028.UAA18577@lakes.dignus.com> To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: icons in executables - another thought... In-Reply-To: <199904282331.RAA11927@mt.sri.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > > Putting icons in the executable itself is pretty stupid -- it's a single > > > instance of something that a window manager can use, and there are much > > > less-invasive ways of doing the same thing. > > > > What's invasive about it? > > The fact that the user may not like the icon you've chosen to use due to > many criteria, including size, # of colors, transparency, 2D/3D, etc... > > So, do we embed every icon the user may want to use inside the > executable to meet everyone's needs, or do we find an alternative > location such that the user can use any icon it finds appropriate. This > also allows for such things as 'themes', whereby I can change the > behavior of my system if the location of the icons are in a centralized > place by replacing the contents with a similar layout with different > icons. > > > > Nate > Yes... and coupled with the previous mutli-user argument... what if user #1 wants foo.xpm to be associated with /bin/rm, but user #2 wants bar.xpm associated with /bin/rm. Seems like, in that environment - the icon doesn't belong in the executable... But - what could go in the executable is an "icon class" (indirection to the rescue again.) Then, the window manager could associate a default (or user-defined) icon with the class... or it could get sophisticated and associate a name with a particular executable. Or - we could go the "shortcut" route... and have the window manager manage "shortcuts" (which would basically be files of a window-manager defined format, or perhaps a public format that many window managers use). Then, the information is associated with the "shortcut", e.g. executable name, arguments and icon. This route 1) Would seem to solve the problem (at least as good as Windows does) 2) Doesn't globally embed "stuff" in executables. 3) Can be used by any window manager (if the file format, i.e. "interface" is designed up-front and made public.) 4) Operates on just about any UNIX, ELF or not. 5) If the interface is extensible - other info can be added to the "shortcut" (as several people have mentioned) 6) The OS could even be extended to be able to exec() shortcuts by simply starting them with #!/bin/shortcut-exec - Thoughts? - - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 17:43:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp2.vnet.net (smtp2.vnet.net [166.82.1.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7FBDF14F42 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:43:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp2.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id UAA19100; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:37:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA33217; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:35:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id UAA18606; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:35:55 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:35:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199904290035.UAA18606@lakes.dignus.com> To: darrylo@sr.hp.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) In-Reply-To: <199904290014.RAA24394@mina.sr.hp.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Darryl Okahata writes: > > Chuck Robey wrote: > > > Agreed, but I think you're missing the point. It's not the HAVING of a > > resource fork that's the key, any programmer working in isolation can > > have that. It's the having a standard place to stick those resource > > forks, and a standard method to get and find them, that's the key thing. > > Other key points: > ... > > * Probable less disk space. It sounds as if adding an icon to an > executable will only add a few tens of bytes. If you make the icon a > separate file (per icon), the disk space requirements skyrocket > (what's the default frag size for FFS -- I forget?). Of course, you > could have an icon database to get around this, but you make icon > maintanance much more difficult. Disk space is also pretty cheap > these days but, if people are screaming over a piddly few bytes, > they'll scream even louder when you start talking about Kbytes. I'd have to disagree here... Consider, hypothetically, 20 executables each with the same icon in them... let's say the icon is absurdley small... only 10 bytes (and, let's neglect file system/inode blocking.) So, we've consumed 20*10 = 200 bytes. Not much you say. Well - the icon all by itself consumes 10 bytes. We went from 10 to 200. Seems quite an increase to me. Also, clever ways of defining these 20 executables as an equivalence class would provide the association of the 20 executables without much of a maintenance burden. And, I would also argue that the 20 executables would need to be an equivalence class of some sort - if nothing else they are related by the fact that they have icons. At that point, higher-level management becomes easier, not more difficult... But, this would have to be born out in practice. My point is - it easy to cause just about any mechanism to consume more disk space. It depends on how it is applied. So, if you're going to associate icons with executables; it's probably quite individualistic which way would consume less disk space. - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 17:47:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fep2-orange.clear.net.nz (fep2-orange.clear.net.nz [203.97.32.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5CE9514F42 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:47:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jabley@buddha.clear.net.nz) Received: from buddha.clear.net.nz (buddha.clear.net.nz [192.168.24.106]) by fep2-orange.clear.net.nz (1.5/1.9) with ESMTP id MAA21688; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:47:20 +1200 (NZST) Received: (from jabley@localhost) by buddha.clear.net.nz (8.9.3/8.9.2) id MAA83327; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:47:12 +1200 (NZST) (envelope-from jabley) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:47:12 +1200 From: Joe Abley To: Andrew Reilly Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jabley@clear.co.nz Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990429124712.A82488@clear.co.nz> References: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com>; <19990429083638.B34373.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@gurney.reilly.home> <199904282244.PAA28325@kithrup.com> <19990429112538.D81921@clear.co.nz> <19990429093602.A35123@gurney.reilly.home> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <19990429093602.A35123@gurney.reilly.home>; from Andrew Reilly on Thu, Apr 29, 1999 at 09:36:02AM +1000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 29, 1999 at 09:36:02AM +1000, Andrew Reilly wrote: > On Thu, Apr 29, 1999 at 11:25:38AM +1200, Joe Abley wrote: > > On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 03:44:47PM -0700, Sean Eric Fagan wrote: > > > Putting icons in the executable itself is pretty stupid -- it's a single > > > instance of something that a window manager can use, and there are much > > > less-invasive ways of doing the same thing. > > > > What's invasive about it? > > It breaks the multi-user ownership/protection model. > > Regarding your comment about PGP signatures: the reason that we > don't need them is that for someone to be able to modify a (system) > executable on FreeBSD, they have to already be root on your system. > If they're root, they can do anything. They can't easily fake a PGP signature without access to the private key, though. I was assuming that the private key would expressly not be kept on a local fixed volume. Joe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 17:54:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailer.syr.edu (mailer.syr.edu [128.230.18.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7814514EB2 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:54:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cmsedore@mailbox.syr.edu) Received: from rodan.syr.edu by mailer.syr.edu (LSMTP for Windows NT v1.1a) with SMTP id <0.5E256980@mailer.syr.edu>; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:54:54 -0400 Received: from localhost (cmsedore@localhost) by rodan.syr.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA29624 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:54:49 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: rodan.syr.edu: cmsedore owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:54:49 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Sedore X-Sender: cmsedore@rodan.syr.edu Reply-To: Christopher Sedore To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: async io and sockets update Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've mostly finished what I set out to do with the kernel aio routines. Below is a summary: 1. I've added a new system call, aio_waitcomplete(struct aiocb **cb, struct timespec *tv). This system call will cause a process to sleep until the next async io op completes or the timeout expires. When the operation completes, a pointer to the userland aiocb is placed cb. This makes fire and forget async io programming both possible and easy. 2. I've changed the way that async operations on sockets get handled. a. Sockets are checked to see if the operations will complete immediately. If not, they are placed on a separate queue are processed when upcalled by the sowakeup routine. b. When upcalled as writeable all pending writes are moved to the regular io queue to be processed. c. When upcalled as readable, reads are executed in the upcall routine as long as the socket stays readable. 3. I believe I fixed a bug in aio_process that would allow it to try to execute operations on descriptors that have been closed, causing a panic. Notes: Ideally, operations on sockets that would complete immediately should be executed during the aio_read system call, and the results made ready to be picked up later. Benefits: The old aio code would pass socket operations on to the aio daemons immediately, causing them to block (sbwait). Once you blocked the maximum number of aiod's, no more operations would progress until one of the aiods could complete an operation. This methodology can be significantly faster than using select() to poll sockets. A simple test program showed that before optimization 2c above, the async io routines would only be faster than select() after about 37 descriptors were being monitored. With optimization 2c, async io is faster for the all testing I did (I did not test with less than 10 descriptors). The performance difference (again with a simple test program) between aio and select() for reading looks something like this: select() aio_read()/aio_waitcomplete() num fds kb/s secs kb/s secs 10 26315 19 35714 14 20 20833 24 35714 14 30 17241 29 33333 15 40 14285 35 33333 15 50 12195 41 33333 15 60 10416 48 33333 15 70 9259 54 31250 16 80 8196 61 33333 15 90 7575 66 31250 16 100 6944 72 33333 15 select() continues to trail off up to 250 descriptors, while aio shows no significant degradation. Note that using aio_suspen instead of aio_waitcomplete would probably be non-trivially slower than aio_waitcomplete, but still faster than select on large numbers of descriptors (though it might not be much faster, depending on the order that operations completed vs the order of the pointers to them passed into aio_suspend). The test program simply creates the requested number of descriptors using socketpair(), and either places an outstanding aio_read on each, or puts each in an fd_set for select. Then, descriptors are chosen at random() out of this set, and written to. aio_waitcomplete or select() are used to get the [completed aio_read aiocb/fd to read], and then [aio_read is done again/the fd_set is reset]. The tests above were done with 1000000 writes of 512 bytes each, and a corresponding read of 1000000 buffers of 512 bytes each. One remaining problem with the aio code is that aio operations won't "cross over" to other kernel threads, because they are based on the procs that issue them, rather than the file descriptor itself. I may investigate creating a variation of NT's io completion ports to enable async io with kernel threads. I don't think that the modifications are too invasive. There are numerous mods to kern/vfs_aio.c, some mods to uipc_socket.c and uipc_socket2.c and small changes sys/aio.h, and sys/socketvar.h. (Plus the syscall addition). I hope to do some more tweaking and see if I can get some one to look it over with an eye to committing some or all of it. -Chris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 18:23:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from germanium.xtalwind.net (germanium.xtalwind.net [205.160.242.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06E2014FAE for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:23:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jack@germanium.xtalwind.net) Received: from localhost (jack@localhost) by germanium.xtalwind.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA55762; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 21:22:24 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 21:22:24 -0400 (EDT) From: jack To: John Birrell Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <199904282245.IAA29340@cimlogic.com.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Apr 29 John Birrell wrote: > > I just hope someone drops a tag before the system goes totally > > GUI. :) > > Nobody is talking about going "totally GUI". > > I'd like to see a lot more people using FreeBSD. We should look at > what problems people have using FreeBSD. The word "difficult" comes > to mind. I choose to use vi as an editor because I can use it without > thinking. I guess it depends on your definition of difficult. To me that means having to get up a 3am to prop up a system that fell over. > When I listen to what users want, I try to understand how > they go about using a system "without thinking". Let's not end up with a system that any idiot can use, because then only idiots will want to use it. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Jack O'Neill Systems Administrator / Systems Analyst jack@germanium.xtalwind.net Crystal Wind Communications, Inc. Finger jack@germanium.xtalwind.net for my PGP key. PGP Key fingerprint = F6 C4 E6 D4 2F 15 A7 67 FD 09 E9 3C 5F CC EB CD enriched, vcard, HTML messages > /dev/null -------------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 18:31:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bilby.prth.tensor.pgs.com (unknown [157.147.232.237]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF83414D08 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:31:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from shocking@ariadne.prth.tensor.pgs.com) Received: from bandicoot.prth.tensor.pgs.com (bandicoot.prth.tensor.pgs.com [157.147.224.1]) by bilby.prth.tensor.pgs.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA06636; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:30:19 +0800 (WST) Received: from ariadne.tensor.pgs.com (ariadne [157.147.227.36]) by bandicoot.prth.tensor.pgs.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA26340; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:30:49 +0800 (WST) Received: from ariadne by ariadne.tensor.pgs.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id JAA12353; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:30:49 +0800 Message-Id: <199904290130.JAA12353@ariadne.tensor.pgs.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Porting Linux Device drivers In-reply-to: Your message of "28 Apr 1999 11:00:41 +0200." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:30:48 +0800 From: Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > shocking@prth.pgs.com (Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth) writes: > > The problem I'm having is that I'm using the glide Linux > > binaries to test the device, and the positive return values are being > > trapped somewhere and turned into -1, an obvious failure which the > > Linux glide library interprets as an error, spitting the dummy. > > The userland part of the syscall mechanism stores the returned value > in errno and returns ((ret == 0) ? p_retval[0] : -1). Hence, if you > want to return a specific value, store it in p_retval[0] and return 0 > to indicate success. Aaagh, I just found out where I goofed when trying to do this. That bit now works. What happens now is that a passed structure from the glide lib's ioctl calls doesn't seem to agree with the definition I have in the driver. Sigh. Stephen -- The views expressed above are not those of PGS Tensor. "We've heard that a million monkeys at a million keyboards could produce the Complete Works of Shakespeare; now, thanks to the Internet, we know this is not true." Robert Wilensky, University of California To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 18:35:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gizmo.internode.com.au (gizmo.internode.com.au [192.83.231.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B17861548B for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:35:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from newton@gizmo.internode.com.au) Received: (from newton@localhost) by gizmo.internode.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA08038; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:02:06 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from newton) From: Mark Newton Message-Id: <199904290132.LAA08038@gizmo.internode.com.au> Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) To: wghicks@bellsouth.net (W Gerald Hicks) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:02:06 +0930 (CST) Cc: bright@rush.net, imp@harmony.village.org, jb@cimlogic.com.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net.adelaide.on.net In-Reply-To: <199904281823.OAA93307@bellsouth.net> from "W Gerald Hicks" at Apr 28, 99 02:23:46 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG W Gerald Hicks wrote: [ "resource forks" ] > The concept isn't necessarily limited to GUI applications and has been > successfully used by OS/2, Macs and Windows among others. I'm not aware > of anything similar for any Unix but ELF seems to open the door for > interesting possibilities there too. SGI's XFS supports the idea of multiple streams per file. There's a btree of streams referenced by each XFS inode, and an API you can use to manipulate the various streams. By default, they provide a standard data stream, an ACL stream and a guaranteed-rate I/O stream (so you can say things like, "I want to access this data at 5 Mbytes/sec. Kick other I/O requests out of the way to give me what I need as a matter of priority...") - mark ---- Mark Newton Email: newton@internode.com.au (W) Network Engineer Email: newton@atdot.dotat.org (H) Internode Systems Pty Ltd Desk: +61-8-82232999 "Network Man" - Anagram of "Mark Newton" Mobile: +61-416-202-223 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 18:43:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2419215772; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:43:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id KAA04796; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 10:43:33 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <3727A995.F755CCDA@newsguy.com> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:36:37 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: adrian@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support References: <19990428103120.4917.qmail@ewok.creative.net.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG adrian@FreeBSD.ORG wrote: > > Dom Mitchell writes: > >On 28 April 1999, Joe Abley proclaimed: > >> This all sounds very non-unixy. But I don't really know why. > > > >Because it's exactly what the Mac has been doing for over a decade. I > >don't think that there's anything terribly wrong with the idea. In > >fact, it's good we are making use of the facilities that our ELF > >changeover has bought us. > > > >The one problem I do see with this idea however, is that it only applies > >to binaries, and not data. > >-- > >Dom Mitchell -- Palmer & Harvey McLane -- Unix Systems Administrator > > ... and so have pcs in the .exe file format. > > If you want to do it for data, then you would have to make mime-type > (or whatever you use to slap on a file type) part of the filesystem > entry. > > Or use extensions. Like what happens now. Or create a fs layer so all of the above would be moot. I find it really curious that layered filesystems seem to never be considered for the jobs they were created for. -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "Proof of Trotsky's farsightedness if that _none_ of his predictions have come true yet." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 18:44:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7F5A15772 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:44:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id KAA04829; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 10:43:45 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <3727AA03.AA84571E@newsguy.com> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:38:27 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ladavac Marino Cc: "'Joe Abley'" , John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support References: <55586E7391ACD211B9730000C11002761795F3@r-lmh-wi-100.corpnet.at> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ladavac Marino wrote: > > [ML] Well, it sounds like MacOS, or OS/2 with their structured > files. It sounds like Windows, too. But these capabilities are not bad > (in fact, a colleague of mine has been recently complaining about > missing desktop support under X11--he is a OS/2 fan). Until ELF, UNIX > didn't really have support for structured executables; now it does, this Sure it did. FS layers. And they work for all kinds of files, not only executables. -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "Proof of Trotsky's farsightedness if that _none_ of his predictions have come true yet." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 19: 5:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-out2.apple.com (mail-out2.apple.com [17.254.0.51]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA4B314CAE for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 19:05:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wsanchez@scv3.apple.com) Received: from mailgate2.apple.com ([17.129.100.225]) by mail-out2.apple.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA44652 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:59:31 -0700 Received: from scv3.apple.com (scv3.apple.com) by mailgate2.apple.com (mailgate2.apple.com- SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:59:24 -0700 Received: from joliet-jake (joliet-jake.apple.com [17.202.40.140]) by scv3.apple.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id SAA33648; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:59:22 -0700 Message-Id: <199904290159.SAA33648@scv3.apple.com> To: W Gerald Hicks Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Cc: Warner Losh , John Birrell , hackers@freebsd.org, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net In-Reply-To: "Your message of Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:36:14 MDT."<199904281736.LAA15179@harmony.village.org> Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:59:18 -0700 From: Wilfredo Sanchez Reply-To: wsanchez@apple.com X-Mailer-Extensions: SWSignature 1.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v106) X-Mailer: by Apple MailViewer (2.106) Content-Type: text/enriched; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Helvetica You guys might want to look at = what NeXT did with NeXTStep a while back; the Mach-O binary format = allowed for icons and so on. In fact, /usr/bin/emacs still works that = way today on Mac OS X Server (some legacy code really lasts). If you = make a directory called Emacs.app, and make a symlink to /usr/bin/emacs = called Emacs in that directory, the workspace will find the icon in the = Mach-O executable, and display it in the viewer. Double clicking on it = will launch it as an app, etc. The program itself is buggy as hell, but = that mechanism still works. dyld has the API for getting to that data, and that will be release in = Darwin fairly soon. What we did find eventually was that you're going to end up wanting = additional resources as things get more complicated, like icons for the = UI elements and so on, so we moved from one file to directory bundles = which contain the executable and all associated resources in one place. = For example: TextEdit.app/ TextEdit - the program binary, (n-way fat = for all supported architectures) TextEdit.tiff - 48x48 Icon Resources/ more images utility programs (sort of an app-specific = libexec) blah Headers/ API into the app, if any, for loadable bundles, = etc. You can do this without resource forks, and it's pretty general. Alfred Perlstein: Ohlfs| Also = note that all userland programs (with the exception of dosemu) | are command line driven. Running them by clicking on them in X will | most likely do nothing. This doesn't belong in the base system, | instead it's a standard should be proposed to the GNOME, KDE and other | windowing systems people. Helvetica In Mac OS X Server, clicking on a Unix tool launches Terminal, and the = tool runs in a Terminal window. You can do the same with xterm -exec = blah, as I recall. In fact, you can script Terminal to do services, so = (for example), I can navigate to a directory in the file viewer, and = select a menu or command-FOO item which will do a cvs = checkout/update/commit/etc. in that directory in a Terminal window. Also = not hard to do in X. Thomas David Rivers:Ohlfs | However, in a more abstract sort of mind... What I want out of = FreeBSD is=20 | not a platform with icons that you can point-and-click on. But, a = powerful=20 | system I can use for my development activities. I don't use the icons = I=20 | have now... but, perhaps I'm just an old fogey... My point being,=20 | introduction of this may cause a dichotomy in the FreeBSD user = community. =20 | Power/programming users and casual point-and-click users. I've = never seen=20 | an operating system that was successful at addressing both of these at=20= | once (although Windows certainly claims to be) and, in my opinion, I = want=20 | the power/programming OS, not the point-and-click one. We may be = headed=20 | down a slippery-slope... I would certainly argue that any program | that *required* this information to be present in an executable was | flawed. Helvetica Adding ease-of-use options doesn't exclude doing things The Old Way. = You *can* have both. Sean Eric Fagan: Ohlfs| For example... = Apple Computer currently has a system like what was proposed. | Actually, it's a considerably better system, since it's = general-purpose, | extensible, and user-modifiable if desired, but it's along the same = lines. |=20 | They're dropping it, and going with what NeXTStEP uses, for MacOS X -- = each | "application" is a directory, and has certain files in the directory. = These | files include the icons (multiple ones for multiple uses, of course -- = how is | the original propronent of this bloat going to handle that?), the = executable, | and all sorts of other metadata. Helvetica Hold on there... We ain't dropping the Mac OS thing. We're using the = NeXT bundle strategy in Mac OS X Server, because there we use UFS. Mac = OS X will have HFS+ which gives us named attributes on any file, and = we'll probably make heavy use of that, as before. Both work pretty well. = I do think the NeXT thing suits BSD a lot better, because it fits the = Unix model nicely, and you don't have HFS+ support (yet). Certainly you = can't count on everyone using HFS+. -Fred -- =
CourierWilf= redo S=E1nchez, wsanchez@apple.com
CourierApple Computer, = Inc., Core Operating Systems / BSD 1 Infinite Loop, 302-4K, Cupertino, CA 95014 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 19:39: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-out2.apple.com (mail-out2.apple.com [17.254.0.51]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A83314FF1 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 19:39:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from conrad@apple.com) Received: from mailgate1.apple.com (A17-128-100-225.apple.com [17.128.100.225]) by mail-out2.apple.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA15156 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 19:36:50 -0700 Received: from scv1.apple.com (scv1.apple.com) by mailgate1.apple.com (mailgate1.apple.com- SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 19:36:37 -0700 Received: from [17.202.43.185] (wa.apple.com [17.202.43.185]) by scv1.apple.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA25330; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 19:36:35 -0700 X-Sender: conrad@mail.apple.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199904290159.SAA33648@scv3.apple.com> References: "Your message of Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:36:14 MDT." <199904281736.LAA15179@harmony.village.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 19:36:33 -0700 To: wsanchez@apple.com, hackers@freebsd.org From: Conrad Minshall Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Cc: warner.c@apple.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 6:59 PM -0700 4/28/99, Wilfredo Sanchez wrote: > Hold on there... We ain't dropping the Mac OS thing. We're using the >NeXT bundle strategy in Mac OS X Server, because there we use UFS. Mac OS >X will have HFS+ which gives us named attributes on any file, and we'll >probably make heavy use of that, as before. Both work pretty well. I do >think the NeXT thing suits BSD a lot better, because it fits the Unix >model nicely, and you don't have HFS+ support (yet). Certainly you can't >count on everyone using HFS+. BTW "named attributes" (aka named forks, aka named streams, etc) are not only in HFS+. They are in UDF, in NTFS, and in the current NFS V4 draft. So on my wish-list is a VFS layer to transparently provide them over UFS. -- Conrad Minshall ... conrad@apple.com ... 408 974-2749 Apple Computer ... Mac OS X Core Operating Systems ... Filesystems & Kernel Alternative email address: rad@acm.org. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 19:48:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E48F14E5D for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 19:48:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (homer.softweyr.com [204.68.178.39]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA18781; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:45:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <3727C7DA.F08AD1B4@softweyr.com> Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:45:46 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Thomas David Rivers Cc: darrylo@sr.hp.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) References: <199904290035.UAA18606@lakes.dignus.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This entire discussion seems to have skipped over an important concept: is the icon an attribute of the executable, or an attribute of the file manager? This is a point that is often missed, especially by the microserfs in Redmond. I think the icons are more an attribute of the file manager, they are a virtual view of the file rather than an attribute of the file. The response that mentioned heir(7) was precisely right; UNIX already has a way of handling this situation and we should use and extend THAT appropriately. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 20: 7: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-out1.apple.com (mail-out1.apple.com [17.254.0.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7757914C9C for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:07:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wsanchez@scv4.apple.com) Received: from mailgate2.apple.com ([17.129.100.225]) by mail-out1.apple.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA56214 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:02:47 -0700 Received: from scv4.apple.com (scv4.apple.com) by mailgate2.apple.com (mailgate2.apple.com- SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:02:41 -0700 Received: from joliet-jake (joliet-jake.apple.com [17.202.40.140]) by scv4.apple.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA62176; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:01:09 -0700 Message-Id: <199904290301.UAA62176@scv4.apple.com> To: Wes Peters Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) Cc: Thomas David Rivers , darrylo@sr.hp.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:02:37 -0700 From: Wilfredo Sanchez Reply-To: wsanchez@apple.com X-Mailer-Extensions: SWSignature 1.2 X-Mailer: by Apple MailViewer (2.106) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG | This entire discussion seems to have skipped over an important concept: | is the icon an attribute of the executable, or an attribute of the | file manager? This is a point that is often missed, especially by the | microserfs in Redmond. I think the icons are more an attribute of the | file manager, they are a virtual view of the file rather than an | attribute of the file. Um, no. This is how you end up with that stupid thing Windows 3 did with the PIF thingies or whatever they're called, where what you see in the viewer really has nothing to do with what is on the disk. You get all sorts of goofy problems that way. The icon representation you get in the file viewer (and in other tools, hopefully) is a property of the file and belongs bundled (somehow) with the file. You can do the icon-by-file-extention trick, but that doesn't get you very far, in particular with files like executables, where you don't usually add an extention, unless you want the same icon for all files and rename everything cp.exe, etc. :-) The icon represents the file, not the viewer's notion of the file. The file manager knows nothing of some file I may drop in tomorrow. How could that file's icon be a property of the file manager? It's supposed to know ahead of time about all files and file types on the disk? That's pretty tough to deliver. -Fred -- Wilfredo Sanchez, wsanchez@apple.com Apple Computer, Inc., Core Operating Systems / BSD 1 Infinite Loop, 302-4K, Cupertino, CA 95014 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 20:18:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from palrel3.hp.com (palrel3.hp.com [156.153.255.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4779114C9C for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:18:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from darrylo@sr.hp.com) Received: from srmail.sr.hp.com (srmail.sr.hp.com [15.4.45.14]) by palrel3.hp.com (8.8.6 (PHNE_17135)/8.8.5tis) with ESMTP id UAA24582; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:18:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mina.sr.hp.com by srmail.sr.hp.com with ESMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA045705920; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:18:40 -0700 Received: from localhost (darrylo@mina.sr.hp.com [15.4.42.247]) by mina.sr.hp.com with ESMTP (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.7.3 TIS 5.0) id UAA24935; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:18:39 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904290318.UAA24935@mina.sr.hp.com> To: Thomas David Rivers Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) Reply-To: Darryl Okahata In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:35:55 EDT." <199904290035.UAA18606@lakes.dignus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 1.1.1.1) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:18:39 -0700 From: Darryl Okahata Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Thomas David Rivers wrote: > Darryl Okahata writes: > > > * Probable less disk space. It sounds as if adding an icon to an > > executable will only add a few tens of bytes. If you make the icon a > > separate file (per icon), the disk space requirements skyrocket > > (what's the default frag size for FFS -- I forget?). Of course, you > > could have an icon database to get around this, but you make icon > > maintanance much more difficult. Disk space is also pretty cheap > > these days but, if people are screaming over a piddly few bytes, > > they'll scream even louder when you start talking about Kbytes. > > I'd have to disagree here... > > Consider, hypothetically, 20 executables each with the same icon > in them... let's say the icon is absurdley small... only 10 bytes > (and, let's neglect file system/inode blocking.) So, we've consumed > 20*10 = 200 bytes. Not much you say. > > Well - the icon all by itself consumes 10 bytes. We went from > 10 to 200. Seems quite an increase to me. Well, not quite. The icon by itself consumes one filesystem fragment (default 1K). The system allocates space for files in chunks of disks (one "fragment", if I understand how the FFS works, which I may not). Your 10 byte file is now occupying an additional 1K. Assuming executable sizes are randomly distributed, you need, on average, this many executables with identical icons before an additional fragment is used: ( - ) / or: (1K - 1K / 2) / 10 --> ~51 executables [ I *think* this is right -- I may be off by a factor of 2. I was never very good at statistics. ;-( ] In other words, icons in executables will almost always occupy less space, unless you have lots of executables with identical icons, which is probably not likely. You'll have lots of data files that'll use identical icons, but data files won't have icons. We're only talking about executable files. > Also, clever ways of defining these 20 executables as an equivalence class > would provide the association of the 20 executables without much > of a maintenance burden. Again, with the exception of a few ports/packages (e.g., imagemagick, sox, etc.), most executables will (hopefully) have different icons. The majority of ports/packages have few executables, and so the case of lots of executables with the same icon is rare. > And, I would also argue that the 20 executables would need to be an > equivalence class of some sort - if nothing else they are related > by the fact that they have icons. At that point, higher-level > management becomes easier, not more difficult... If you have lots of executables with the same icon, yes -- but the usual case is lots of data files (without icons) with the same icon. I don't know what the answer is. -- Darryl Okahata darrylo@sr.hp.com DISCLAIMER: this message is the author's personal opinion and does not constitute the support, opinion, or policy of Hewlett-Packard, or of the little green men that have been following him all day. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 20:27:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp11.bellglobal.com (smtp11.bellglobal.com [204.101.251.53]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A2BD314D65 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:26:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from vanderh@ecf.toronto.edu) Received: from localhost.nowhere (ppp1626.on.bellglobal.com [206.172.249.90]) by smtp11.bellglobal.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA12297; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 23:28:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from tim@localhost) by localhost.nowhere (8.9.3/8.9.1) id XAA48816; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 23:26:02 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from tim) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 23:25:59 -0400 From: Tim Vanderhoek To: Nate Williams Cc: Joe Abley , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990428232559.A47260@mad> References: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com> <19990429083638.B34373.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@gurney.reilly.home> <199904282244.PAA28325@kithrup.com> <19990429112538.D81921@clear.co.nz> <199904282331.RAA11927@mt.sri.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i In-Reply-To: <199904282331.RAA11927@mt.sri.com>; from Nate Williams on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 05:31:43PM -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 05:31:43PM -0600, Nate Williams wrote: > > > Putting icons in the executable itself is pretty stupid -- it's a single > > > instance of something that a window manager can use, and there are much > > > less-invasive ways of doing the same thing. > > > > What's invasive about it? > > The fact that the user may not like the icon you've chosen to use due to > many criteria, including size, # of colors, transparency, 2D/3D, etc... Use extended attributes, and let the user layer their own fs ontop of the system that changes a few of the attributes. Let me remind people a second... No matter how much talking goes on, the whole thing is _not_ going to be done this year. Whatever John adds will only be a step in some direction, whether thats resource forks, or quirky directory structures. -- This .sig is not innovative, witty, or profund. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 20:27:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0FCF14CE9 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:27:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from andrew@lake.com.au) Received: from m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20]) by m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id NAA25187 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:27:14 +1000 (EST) X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: andrew@lake.com.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. Received: from areilly.bpc-users.org (CPE-24-192-51-95.nsw.bigpond.net.au [24.192.51.95]) by m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with SMTP id NAA11056 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:27:13 +1000 (EST) Received: (qmail 38423 invoked by uid 1000); 29 Apr 1999 03:27:13 -0000 From: "Andrew Reilly" Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:27:13 +1000 To: Darryl Okahata Cc: Thomas David Rivers , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) Message-ID: <19990429132713.A38300@gurney.reilly.home> References: <199904290035.UAA18606@lakes.dignus.com> <199904290318.UAA24935@mina.sr.hp.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904290318.UAA24935@mina.sr.hp.com>; from Darryl Okahata on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 08:18:39PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 08:18:39PM -0700, Darryl Okahata wrote: > Well, not quite. The icon by itself consumes one filesystem > fragment (default 1K). The system allocates space for files in chunks > of disks (one "fragment", if I understand how the FFS works, which I may > not). Your 10 byte file is now occupying an additional 1K. This sounds like an argument for file system use profiling and tweaking to me. We already have an optimisation for symlinks of a certain size that can reside directly in the inode (replacing the indirect pointers). Perhaps icons can do that too. I believe (memory is rusty) that the RISC-OS file system was optimised for small files in this way, too. -- Andrew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 20:29:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp13.bellglobal.com (smtp13.bellglobal.com [204.101.251.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A69414CE9 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:29:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from vanderh@ecf.toronto.edu) Received: from localhost.nowhere (ppp1626.on.bellglobal.com [206.172.249.90]) by smtp13.bellglobal.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA18593 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 23:30:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from tim@localhost) by localhost.nowhere (8.9.3/8.9.1) id XAA48866 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 23:29:25 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from tim) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 23:29:22 -0400 From: Tim Vanderhoek To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990428232922.B47260@mad> References: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com>; <19990429083638.B34373.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@gurney.reilly.home> <199904282244.PAA28325@kithrup.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i In-Reply-To: <199904282244.PAA28325@kithrup.com>; from Sean Eric Fagan on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 03:44:47PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 03:44:47PM -0700, Sean Eric Fagan wrote: > > They're dropping it, and going with what NeXTStEP uses, for MacOS X -- each > "application" is a directory, and has certain files in the directory. These /usr/bin/rm/icons/{icon1, icon2, ...} /usr/bin/rm/executable /usr/bin/rm/cmd_arg_format /usr/bin/jot/icons/{icon1, icon2, ...} /usr/bin/jot/executable /usr/bin/jot/cmd_arg_format /usr/bin/find/icons/{icon1, icon2, ...} ... Need I go on? I don't think I have that many inodes available... -- This .sig is not innovative, witty, or profund. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 20:37:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7387614CE9 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:37:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id UAA11634; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:37:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:37:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199904290337.UAA11634@apollo.backplane.com> To: Tim Vanderhoek Cc: Nate Williams , Joe Abley , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support References: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com> <19990429083638.B34373.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@gurney.reilly.home> <199904282244.PAA28325@kithrup.com> <19990429112538.D81921@clear.co.nz> <199904282331.RAA11927@mt.sri.com> <19990428232559.A47260@mad> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I think the easiest way to deal with icons is to simply have an .icons.dbm dbm file in each directory. i.e. /bin/.icons.dbm. /usr/bin/.icons.dbm., and so forth, and then allow the icons to be overridden by a .icons.dbm file in each user's home directory or even overridden hierarchically. When a binary is installed, its icons would be placed in the appropriate dbm file via a simple call to an icon support library. Problem solved. After all, you might want icons for things other then files. For example, directories, softlinks, unix domain sockets, devices. Whatever. I think modifying the filesystem to provide a metadata extension for files is ridiculous. Embedding icons in binaries also seems pretty silly considering that sophisticated applications tend to need auxillary ( and often editable ) data anyway. For example, configuration files. These do not belong embedded in the binaries and neither do (potentially customizable) icons. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 20:39:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85A7114CF8 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:39:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from andrew@lake.com.au) Received: from m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20]) by m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id NAA27329 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:39:08 +1000 (EST) X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: andrew@lake.com.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. Received: from areilly.bpc-users.org (CPE-24-192-51-95.nsw.bigpond.net.au [24.192.51.95]) by m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with SMTP id NAA15097 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:39:07 +1000 (EST) Received: (qmail 38545 invoked by uid 1000); 29 Apr 1999 03:39:07 -0000 From: "Andrew Reilly" Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:39:07 +1000 To: Wilfredo Sanchez Cc: Wes Peters , Thomas David Rivers , darrylo@sr.hp.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990429133907.B38300@gurney.reilly.home> References: <199904290301.UAA62176@scv4.apple.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904290301.UAA62176@scv4.apple.com>; from Wilfredo Sanchez on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 08:02:37PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 08:02:37PM -0700, Wilfredo Sanchez wrote: > | microserfs in Redmond. I think the icons are more an attribute of the > | file manager, they are a virtual view of the file rather than an > | attribute of the file. > > Um, no. This is how you end up with that stupid thing Windows 3 > did with the PIF thingies or whatever they're called, where what you > see in the viewer really has nothing to do with what is on the disk. > You get all sorts of goofy problems that way. It's true that MS borked that implementation, but at Apple you have the ?luxury? of having the "one true GUI", which is always part of the system, which is single-user. > The icon representation you get in the file viewer (and in other > tools, hopefully) is a property of the file and belongs bundled > (somehow) with the file. It doesn't feel like a property of the file to me. Window managers happily apply different icons to files right now, when they don't have one otherwise associated with them. Apart from anything else, that is one thing that allows window managers and other GUIs to feel different from one another. Themes are a natural extension of that. > You can do the icon-by-file-extention > trick, but that doesn't get you very far, in particular with files > like executables, where you don't usually add an extention, unless > you want the same icon for all files and rename everything cp.exe, > etc. :-) We have a file typing scheme that identifies executables very well, thank you. If there are problems with it, I'd suggest that ways to tie down file types would be more proffitable. > The file manager knows nothing of some file I may drop in tomorrow. > How could that file's icon be a property of the file manager? It's > supposed to know ahead of time about all files and file types on the > disk? That's pretty tough to deliver. No, but if you're designing an icon/GUI standard API---as we are now---then you can say things like: ``when application foo is installed in the system, and it doesn't want to get the "generic executable" icon, then the installation process puts the default icon in ${PREFIX}/share/foo/icon.{xpm,tiff,gif,png}.'' The file manager, having been taught about the standard, looks there for icons when it is displaying executables. Of course it also looks for ${HOME}/.foo/icon.{xpm,tiff,gif,png} too, in case the user has decided to change their view of things. -- Andrew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 20:46:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 885BA14CF8 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:46:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from andrew@lake.com.au) Received: from m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20]) by m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id NAA28415 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:46:46 +1000 (EST) X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: andrew@lake.com.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. Received: from areilly.bpc-users.org (CPE-24-192-51-95.nsw.bigpond.net.au [24.192.51.95]) by m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with SMTP id NAA17499 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:46:45 +1000 (EST) Received: (qmail 38635 invoked by uid 1000); 29 Apr 1999 03:46:46 -0000 From: "Andrew Reilly" Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:46:46 +1000 To: Tim Vanderhoek Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990429134646.C38300@gurney.reilly.home> References: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com>; <19990429083638.B34373.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@gurney.reilly.home> <199904282244.PAA28325@kithrup.com> <19990428232922.B47260@mad> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <19990428232922.B47260@mad>; from Tim Vanderhoek on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 11:29:22PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 11:29:22PM -0400, Tim Vanderhoek wrote: > On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 03:44:47PM -0700, Sean Eric Fagan wrote: > > > > They're dropping it, and going with what NeXTStEP uses, for MacOS X -- each > > "application" is a directory, and has certain files in the directory. These > > /usr/bin/rm/icons/{icon1, icon2, ...} > /usr/bin/rm/executable > /usr/bin/rm/cmd_arg_format > /usr/bin/jot/icons/{icon1, icon2, ...} > /usr/bin/jot/executable > /usr/bin/jot/cmd_arg_format > /usr/bin/find/icons/{icon1, icon2, ...} Well, I think that looks significantly more hideous than the plan I suggested. Besides, none of /usr/bin are ever going to be executed by a double-click, and simply don't need that kind of elaboration. The things that need icons and what-have-you are the things that behave like GUI applications. Sure, that's most of /usr/X11R6/bin, but they already have all of those auxiliary files scattered around the place, and you don't seem to mind that. I'm not sure where John Birrel was going with his original proposal, but does anyone actually suggest that the way to operate a system is to have a file viewer open up and show icons for all of the utilities in /usr/bin? Sounds perfectly hideous to me. > I don't think I have that many inodes available... That strikes me as a particularly feeble argument. -- Andrew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 21:40:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail0.atl.bellsouth.net (mail0.atl.bellsouth.net [205.152.0.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 492201509E; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 21:40:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wghicks@bellsouth.net) Received: from wghicks.bellsouth.net (host-209-214-71-206.atl.bellsouth.net [209.214.71.206]) by mail0.atl.bellsouth.net (8.8.8-spamdog/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA24075; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 00:39:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from wghicks (wghicks@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by wghicks.bellsouth.net (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id AAA02012; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 00:41:17 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net) Message-Id: <199904290441.AAA02012@bellsouth.net> To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Cc: adrian@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:36:37 +0900." <3727A995.F755CCDA@newsguy.com> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 00:41:17 -0400 From: W Gerald Hicks Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I find it really curious that layered filesystems seem to never be > considered for the jobs they were created for. Filesystem layering is not in very good shape right now, although Eivind has been spotted making good progress. Cheers, Jerry Hicks wghicks@bellsouth.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 21:45: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from poboxer.pobox.com (unknown [208.149.16.14]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6CCD14E67 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 21:44:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from alk@poboxer.pobox.com) Received: (from alk@localhost) by poboxer.pobox.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id XAA03517; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 23:44:48 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from alk) From: Anthony Kimball MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 23:44:48 -0500 (CDT) X-Face: \h9Jg:Cuivl4S*UP-)gO.6O=T]]@ncM*tn4zG);)lk#4|lqEx=*talx?.Gk,dMQU2)ptPC17cpBzm(l'M|H8BUF1&]dDCxZ.c~Wy6-j,^V1E(NtX$FpkkdnJixsJHE95JlhO 5\M3jh'YiO7KPCn0~W`Ro44_TB@&JuuqRqgPL'0/{):7rU-%.*@/>q?1&Ed Reply-To: alk@pobox.com To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Adding desktop support X-Mailer: VM 6.43 under 20.4 "Emerald" XEmacs Lucid Message-ID: <14119.57636.213346.880816@avalon.east> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 03:44:47PM -0700, Sean Eric Fagan wrote: > Putting icons in the executable itself is pretty stupid -- it's a single > instance of something that a window manager can use, and there are much > less-invasive ways of doing the same thing. One problem with the traditional hier(7) approach is that the data for a single application is scattered across the filesystem. One-file simplicity is a worthwhile cause for deviation from this tradition. I agree that putting *only* icons in the executable would be silly, when one could solve a much bigger problem with relatively little incremental effort. I don't see it as invasive, however. I strongly favor a generalization which adds not a .icon section but a more general .desk section, and adopts an extensible, well-defined structure for this section. I suggest .desk is ( unsigned annotation_type + unsigned annotation_databytes + uchar_t annotation_data[annotation_databytes] + uchar_t pad[4*((annotation_databytes+3)/4)-annotation_databytes] ) * and a well-known system file defining known annotation_type values. I think XML is over-engineering. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Apr 28 22:25:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lion.butya.kz (butya-gw.butya.kz [194.87.112.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2833514F22 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 1999 22:25:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bp@butya.kz) Received: from bp (helo=localhost) by lion.butya.kz with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10cjK8-0000OM-00 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:25:24 +0700 Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:25:24 +0700 (ALMST) From: Boris Popov To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Drivers collection (was:Arlan 655 driver for FreeBSD) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello, Previous letter about Arlan driver give me the thought that information about external hardware drivers, file systems and other kernel side stuffs isn't put together like ports collection. May be it is desirable to create the same mechanism for kernel drivers ? Drivers repository can be organized much more like ports collection with exception that many fs drivers will require src/sys directory for building and can create temporary subdirectories in /sys/modules. Any opinions ? -- Boris Popov http://www.butya.kz/~bp/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 2:35:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9F3814F2F; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 02:35:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id SAA19332; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 18:35:07 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <37281E66.7AAF71A3@newsguy.com> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 17:55:02 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: W Gerald Hicks Cc: adrian@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: Adding desktop support References: <199904290441.AAA02012@bellsouth.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG W Gerald Hicks wrote: > > > I find it really curious that layered filesystems seem to never be > > considered for the jobs they were created for. > > Filesystem layering is not in very good shape right now, although > Eivind has been spotted making good progress. AFAIK, he is making the existing fs (more specifically nullfs and maybe unionfs) work, not correcting any existing flaw in the layering code. -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "Proof of Trotsky's farsightedness if that _none_ of his predictions have come true yet." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 3:12:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FEE51516A; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:12:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id MAA13773; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:12:41 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA04987; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:12:40 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:12:40 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: adrian@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: MIME types in filesystem (was Adding ... ) In-Reply-To: <19990428103120.4917.qmail@ewok.creative.net.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > >The one problem I do see with this idea however, is that it only applies > >to binaries, and not data. > > If you want to do it for data, then you would have to make mime-type > (or whatever you use to slap on a file type) part of the filesystem > entry. I believe this could be managed through stacking, similar to how an UMSDOS fs would be implemented. You'd probably have a .MIME file or somesuch in each directory, containing this information, and supermount a stacking layer to manage these. Eivind would be the one to consult on this, though, I think. - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 3:14:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 288EC1509D for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:14:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id MAA14256; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:14:24 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA04996; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:14:24 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:14:24 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: Chuck Robey Cc: John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I like this idea a great deal. I've long wanted some way to attach data > to programs, so as to add some continuing state. This is a first step. > If there was a utility, that would allow a user to replace the default > icon with one of their own choosing (if they care), then that ought to > eliminate any other problems. If the user complains about the extra > data space, then they could replace the icon with a null value, right? > I don't see a downside. Me neither. I feel we should provide a NOICONS tab in make world, but otherwise, I say go for it. We should additionally provide scripts to add and strip such icons, of course. - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 3:15:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 298341509D for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:15:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id MAA14653; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:15:47 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA05012; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:15:46 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:15:46 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: jack Cc: John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Please make the default NOT to build them, as this is totally > useless for servers that don't run X or are headless. Whether it's default or not isn't relevant. Production servers do not run -current, or at least their administrators follow the lists. An appropriate heads-up, and a tab in make world to disable it would do nicely. - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 3:23:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86F8114C01 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:23:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id MAA16919; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:23:30 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA05056; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:23:30 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:23:30 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: Joe Abley Cc: Andrew Reilly , Chuck Robey , John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <19990429112007.C81921@clear.co.nz> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Why not store a PGP signature for the executable section in a separate > metadata section? All binaries could be essentially signed by root@buildhost, > which ought to make routine checks for validity of Important System Binaries > easier and better. This could be done using the idea of directory hiearchies inside files, as suggested earlier on. Optional, of course. - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 3:25:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E33314C01 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:25:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id MAA17385; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:25:08 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA05067; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:25:08 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:25:08 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: Nate Williams Cc: Joe Abley , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <199904282331.RAA11927@mt.sri.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > The fact that the user may not like the icon you've chosen to use due to > many criteria, including size, # of colors, transparency, 2D/3D, etc... That's where overrides, and such, come into it. Some users will not like the defaults and want to change them, whereas other users don't want to mess with it at all. I say, stick a tag in buildworld, and there are no issues with this. Overrides would be the task of the window manager in question. - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 3:26:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7CA0814E17; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:26:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id DAA23645; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:25:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904291025.DAA23645@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Julian Elischer Cc: Dean Lombardo , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Voice recog. from IBM soon.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:25:20 PDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:25:18 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Their tar ball appears to be corrupt and I tried downloading the file a couple of times. {hasty} tar -tf viavoice_sdk_rtk.tar ViaVoice_runtime-1.0-1.0.i386.rpm tar: Unexpected EOF on archive file -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 3:27:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from SPEEDY.JCRT.HARVARD.EDU (jcrt.harvard.edu [134.174.68.170]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 8C52714C01 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:27:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ) Message-Id: <19990429102748.8C52714C01@hub.freebsd.org> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:27:48 -0700 (PDT) From: "" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 3:28:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC67614CA9 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:28:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id MAA18322; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:28:24 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA05095; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:28:24 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:28:24 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: jack Cc: John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Let's not end up with a system that any idiot can use, because > then only idiots will want to use it. This has just got to be the worst argument so far. The point here is for a user to still be able to go in-depth, if the user so chooses, but to make life easier when the user wants that. With your policy, you should go back to inserting instructions directly into the processor using In Circuit Equipment. The main argument around where I work, for not using unix, that is, is that it is text-based, and doesn't have an intuitive interface. To me, it seems perfectly logical. To them, it's cryptic. - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 3:29:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FFB614F0F; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:29:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id MAA18626; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:29:32 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA05101; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:29:32 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:29:32 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Cc: adrian@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <3727A995.F755CCDA@newsguy.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Or create a fs layer so all of the above would be moot. > I find it really curious that layered filesystems seem to never be > considered for the jobs they were created for. Exactly. Extended attribute layers and such are a _good thing_. - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 3:31:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2BEC314C01 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:31:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id MAA19182; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:31:41 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA05118; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:31:40 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:31:40 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: Tim Vanderhoek Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <19990428232922.B47260@mad> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I don't think I have that many inodes available... Perhaps not, but it could certainly be stuck in the individual files, or, in a file used by a stackinglayer (ala umsdos) - marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 3:33:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB76014EC8 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:33:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id MAA19668; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:33:15 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA05126; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:33:15 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:33:15 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: Matthew Dillon Cc: Tim Vanderhoek , Nate Williams , Joe Abley , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <199904290337.UAA11634@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > After all, you might want icons for things other then files. For example, > directories, softlinks, unix domain sockets, devices. Whatever. > I think modifying the filesystem to provide a metadata extension for > files is ridiculous. Embedding icons in binaries also seems pretty silly You would not be modifying the physical structure of the filesystem, but rather, providing an optional stacking layer. - marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 3:34:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE02914C01; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:34:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id MAA20123; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:34:54 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA05133; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:34:53 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:34:53 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: W Gerald Hicks Cc: "Daniel C. Sobral" , adrian@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <199904290441.AAA02012@bellsouth.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Filesystem layering is not in very good shape right now, although > Eivind has been spotted making good progress. I use nullfs without problems atm. Last I spoke to Eivind, he had mods in www.freebsd.org/~eivind/ to fix some of these issues. He also had tracked a large portion of the problem to the VFS locking code being buggy, as I recall. - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 3:36:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ACDD014EC8; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:36:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id MAA20569; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:36:29 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA05143; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:36:28 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:36:28 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Cc: W Gerald Hicks , adrian@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <37281E66.7AAF71A3@newsguy.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > AFAIK, he is making the existing fs (more specifically nullfs and > maybe unionfs) work, not correcting any existing flaw in the > layering code. From what he's told me, this is not correct. In fact, his efforts are, as I recall, specifically targetted at resolving issues in the actual layering code, not in the fs themselves. - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 3:39:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B83615823 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:39:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id MAA21371; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:39:17 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA05150; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:39:16 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:39:16 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: Joe Abley Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) In-Reply-To: <19990429111534.B81921@clear.co.nz> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Is there any reason why we couldn't support ELF binaries with multiple > pageable executables embedded in it, so that a single distributed > binary could support multiple architectures? > > You could always strip the binaries down to a single architecture if > you were short of space... I like this. It would have to be optional at build time, though. - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 3:57:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp1.vnet.net (smtp1.vnet.net [166.82.1.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5ED0514F0E for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:57:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp1.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id GAA14373; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 06:58:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA34174; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 06:57:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id GAA20645; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 06:57:46 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 06:57:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199904291057.GAA20645@lakes.dignus.com> To: mbendiks@eunet.no, nate@mt.sri.com Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jabley@clear.co.nz In-Reply-To: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > The fact that the user may not like the icon you've chosen to use due to > > many criteria, including size, # of colors, transparency, 2D/3D, etc... > > That's where overrides, and such, come into it. Some users will not like > the defaults and want to change them, whereas other users don't want to > mess with it at all. I say, stick a tag in buildworld, and there are no > issues with this. Overrides would be the task of the window manager in > question. > > - Marius - I point out that if the executable has no icon in it, then this "overrides" from the window manager would come into play, right? Since the "overrides" have to be there anyway - what's the advantage of putting the icon in the exe? - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 4:20:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from titan.metropolitan.at (mail.metropolitan.at [195.212.98.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C896E157FB for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 04:19:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mladavac@metropolitan.at) Received: by TITAN with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:22:27 +0200 Message-ID: <55586E7391ACD211B9730000C11002761795F4@r-lmh-wi-100.corpnet.at> From: Ladavac Marino To: 'Thomas David Rivers' , mbendiks@eunet.no, nate@mt.sri.com Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jabley@clear.co.nz Subject: RE: Adding desktop support Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:18:12 +0200 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > -----Original Message----- > From: Thomas David Rivers [SMTP:rivers@dignus.com] > Sent: Thursday, April 29, 1999 12:58 PM > To: mbendiks@eunet.no; nate@mt.sri.com > Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; jabley@clear.co.nz > Subject: Re: Adding desktop support > > > I point out that if the executable has no icon in it, then this > "overrides" from the window manager would come into play, right? > > Since the "overrides" have to be there anyway - what's the advantage > of putting the icon in the exe? > [ML] Convenience for the users. Just plain and simple. The same reason one has clickable icons in filemanagers/desktops instead of starting an application from an xterm command line. Don't ever underestimate the driving force of plain convenience (or don't you ever use icon clicks to start something under X?) /Marino > - Dave Rivers - > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 4:53: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.nobell.com (ns.nobell.com [216.140.184.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC11014DF2 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 04:52:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rkw@dataplex.net) Received: from [216.140.184.150] (st84150.nobell.com [216.140.184.150]) by ns.nobell.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id GAA89418; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 06:52:43 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from rkw@dataplex.net) X-Sender: rkw@mail.dataplex.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199904291057.GAA20645@lakes.dignus.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 06:48:32 -0500 To: Thomas David Rivers From: Richard Wackerbarth Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 5:57 AM -0500 4/29/99, Thomas David Rivers wrote: > I point out that if the executable has no icon in it, then this > "overrides" from the window manager would come into play, right? > > Since the "overrides" have to be there anyway - what's the advantage > of putting the icon in the exe? I think that you miss the hierarchy of "defaults". If the USER has specified the icon for the entity, use his, else if the AUTHOR provided an icon, use it, else if the USER gave a default to the window manager, ... else if the WM-AUTHOR, ... else use a totally generic icon. - - - - Keeping the AUTHOR supplied information in one place certainly has advantages. Richard Wackerbarth To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 4:58:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cimlogic.com.au (cimlog.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.51.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D8B614F7A for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 04:58:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jb@cimlogic.com.au) Received: (from jb@localhost) by cimlogic.com.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id WAA01206; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 22:05:05 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jb) From: John Birrell Message-Id: <199904291205.WAA01206@cimlogic.com.au> Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <199904291057.GAA20645@lakes.dignus.com> from Thomas David Rivers at "Apr 29, 1999 6:57:46 am" To: rivers@dignus.com (Thomas David Rivers) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 22:05:05 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Thomas David Rivers wrote: > I point out that if the executable has no icon in it, then this > "overrides" from the window manager would come into play, right? > > Since the "overrides" have to be there anyway - what's the advantage > of putting the icon in the exe? Window managers wrap top-level windows of active processes. The icon in the exe is for browsing the file system prior to executing the process. These are two _very_ different things. -- John Birrell - jb@cimlogic.com.au; jb@freebsd.org http://www.cimlogic.com.au/ CIMlogic Pty Ltd, GPO Box 117A, Melbourne Vic 3001, Australia +61 418 353 137 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 5:25: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from at.dotat.com (zed.dotat.com [203.2.134.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF64D15801 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 05:24:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hart@at.dotat.com) Received: from at.dotat.com (localhost.dotat.com [127.0.0.1]) by at.dotat.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA03092 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 21:56:32 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199904291226.VAA03092@at.dotat.com> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Enough already with adding desktop icons Reply-To: hart@dotat.com Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 21:56:32 +0930 From: Leigh Hart Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hey, its great to see some healthy discussions, but geez, this isn't a "General technical discussion" any more, and as such breaches the charter of this mailing list. I hate to be a stiff, but 60+ messages on the same (non technical) topic in one day is a bit much for a technical list, eh? Cheers Leigh -- | "By the time they had diminished | Leigh Hart, | | from 50 to 8, the other dwarves | CCNA - http://www.cisco.com/ | | began to suspect 'Hungry' ..." | GPO Box 487 Adelaide SA 5001 | | -- Gary Larson, "The Far Side" | http://www.dotat.com/hart/ | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 5:25:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from assurance.rstcorp.com (assurance.rstcorp.com [206.29.49.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 909C814FAE for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 05:25:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from vshah@rstcorp.com) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by assurance.rstcorp.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA12908; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:21:54 -0400 Received: from sandbox.rstcorp.com(206.29.49.63) by assurance.rstcorp.com via smap (V2.0) id xma012905; Thu, 29 Apr 99 12:21:44 GMT Received: from jabberwock.rstcorp.com (jabberwock [206.29.49.98]) by sandbox.rstcorp.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA21505; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:20:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from vshah@localhost) by jabberwock.rstcorp.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) id IAA15363; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:20:16 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:20:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904291220.IAA15363@jabberwock.rstcorp.com> From: "Viren R. Shah" To: Wes Peters Cc: Thomas David Rivers , darrylo@sr.hp.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) In-Reply-To: <3727C7DA.F08AD1B4@softweyr.com> References: <199904290035.UAA18606@lakes.dignus.com> <3727C7DA.F08AD1B4@softweyr.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Reply-To: "Viren R. Shah" X-Face: )~y+U*K:yzjz{q<5lzpI_SVef'U.])9g[C9`1N@]u3,MHY7f*l7C)[_NjM4y4K8$uIUh|\u (K&&HS6,M!61&GMTk'mqmB/Qg]]X}"?TzsFl]"2v!bl8']dma.:^IY^a[lbOI>U:b<~FyK3q-p{HmZ mn~g.`~BE!5{2D:}Yi+\_KkWe?XaHj9$ko1k8iKLYv5*_2c8"G=?Up[}hn+7RNM(bzBZ_wWk6!Pf&B ?3Tcm7M7B~W%K/I0aX3]*=jP?aM]H6HBPT`oLk+0n^_;N\2\%|Rhy;p}34Q.jEsM\qtnxcm;ag%Nq Mime-Version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 7.106) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >>>>> "Wes" == Wes Peters writes: Wes> This entire discussion seems to have skipped over an important concept: Wes> is the icon an attribute of the executable, or an attribute of the Wes> file manager? This is a point that is often missed, especially by the Wes> microserfs in Redmond. I think the icons are more an attribute of the Wes> file manager, they are a virtual view of the file rather than an Wes> attribute of the file. The response that mentioned heir(7) was precisely Wes> right; UNIX already has a way of handling this situation and we should Wes> use and extend THAT appropriately. I think you missed the original point. You are talking about icons as seen representing an application in a desktop. What the original proposal seemed to be was to include data associated with that application (in this case the only data suggested was an icon). Look at the demo application (filedemo) that was presented. It *uses* the icons to display a file hierarchy. The icons embedded within it are not used when the application is minimised -- that's a function of my window manager. I would like to hear arguments against "data" being embedded -- not window manager icons, which has been a perpetual strawman since this thread began. Viren -- Viren R. Shah, viren @ rstcorp . com, http://www.rstcorp.com/~vshah/ If you understand what you're doing, you are not learning anything To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 5:46:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from po9.andrew.cmu.edu (PO9.ANDREW.CMU.EDU [128.2.10.109]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7CD114FAE for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 05:46:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tcrimi+@andrew.cmu.edu) Received: (from postman@localhost) by po9.andrew.cmu.edu (8.8.5/8.8.2) id IAA10159 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:46:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: via switchmail; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:46:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from unix4.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:45:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from unix4.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:45:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mms.4.60.Jun.27.1996.03.02.53.sun4.51.EzMail.2.0.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.unix4.andrew.cmu.edu.sun4m.54 via MS.5.6.unix4.andrew.cmu.edu.sun4_51; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:45:22 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:45:22 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas Valentino Crimi To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) In-Reply-To: <199904290014.RAA24394@mina.sr.hp.com> References: <199904290014.RAA24394@mina.sr.hp.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Sorry to be adding more fuel to the fire, but I have a question, and then a proposal. Except for initial 'wonder what there is in /usr/bin?' type browsing, can anyone imagine actually sauntering up to to a chock-full (379 commands at my count) directory and looking at each one through it's icon? I could envision a very nice 'learn unix browser' which shows a list of each command and lets the user choose to see the short description or the man page, but really, assuming you did make about 450 new icons for each and every system binary. One alternative I'd like to propose is an icons.db file, laid out for optimum keysearch, with the .ICON elf section possibly containing a unique identifier for the binary. The .db file could contain multiple versions of each icon, in all the popular styles, and the user could have his/her own .icons.db file which is searched prior to the system list. Next comes /usr/local/share/icons.db where the administrator could install 'icon packages' to override system-default binaries as well as icons for the ports. Now, from here we would need to add in some pkg_add, pkg_delete like utilties icon_add, icon_delete which access this db.. the syntax could look like icon_add [stylename:iconfile]... where icon_add could extract the unique identifier from the binary, and then add in the iconfile. The user can then always retrieve icons of any style type from the db, and everyone can have the interface they want. I volunteer to send patches if people want this :) icond? anyone? Thomas To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 6: 6:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp1.vnet.net (smtp1.vnet.net [166.82.1.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20A7815178 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 06:06:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp1.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA24369; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:07:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA34340; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:05:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id JAA20952; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:05:59 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:05:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199904291305.JAA20952@lakes.dignus.com> To: mbendiks@eunet.no, mladavac@metropolitan.at, nate@mt.sri.com, rivers@dignus.com Subject: RE: Adding desktop support Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jabley@clear.co.nz In-Reply-To: <55586E7391ACD211B9730000C11002761795F4@r-lmh-wi-100.corpnet.at> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Thomas David Rivers [SMTP:rivers@dignus.com] > > Sent: Thursday, April 29, 1999 12:58 PM > > To: mbendiks@eunet.no; nate@mt.sri.com > > Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; jabley@clear.co.nz > > Subject: Re: Adding desktop support > > > > > > I point out that if the executable has no icon in it, then this > > "overrides" from the window manager would come into play, right? > > > > Since the "overrides" have to be there anyway - what's the advantage > > of putting the icon in the exe? > > > [ML] Convenience for the users. Just plain and simple. > > The same reason one has clickable icons in filemanagers/desktops > instead of starting an application from an xterm command line. Don't > ever underestimate the driving force of plain convenience (or don't you > ever use icon clicks to start something under X?) > > /Marino As it happens, on UNIX, nope - I quit doing that... for one very good reason. When I start something from an ICON, typically stderr is directed "away". And, typically, UNIX programs (including such mostly-GUI applications as Netscape) write useful information to stderr. So - after struggling for awhile with a particular problem, then trying to run the program from the command line and seeing the nice/helpful message which would have prevented a lot of frustration... I quit starting things by "clicking." - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 6:12:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp2.vnet.net (smtp2.vnet.net [166.82.1.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C505E14D1B for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 06:12:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp2.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA04977; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:13:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA34356; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:12:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id JAA20991; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:12:04 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:12:04 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199904291312.JAA20991@lakes.dignus.com> To: rivers@dignus.com, rkw@dataplex.net Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > At 5:57 AM -0500 4/29/99, Thomas David Rivers wrote: > > I point out that if the executable has no icon in it, then this > > "overrides" from the window manager would come into play, right? > > > > Since the "overrides" have to be there anyway - what's the advantage > > of putting the icon in the exe? > > I think that you miss the hierarchy of "defaults". > > If the USER has specified the icon for the entity, use his, > > else if the AUTHOR provided an icon, use it, > > else if the USER gave a default to the window manager, ... > > else if the WM-AUTHOR, ... > > else use a totally generic icon. > And - my point - which you really made - is that all of the alternatives can't go in the executable, or you begin to have many copies of the executable, or one executable with large repository & information for each user that may run it... both of which can be quite a nightmare. So, the program (the window manager) has to support a mechanism for specifying all of these alternate "locations" in the hierarchy. Given that mechanism - which is a necessity... why would I choose a different implementation technique for one out of the five "locations" you list? What advantage does that bring to the problem? You still have to implement solutions for 4/5ths of the uses. Thus, it seems, that placing information in the executable isn't worthwhile given the description above, as it doesn't really "save" anything. Furthermore, it wouldn't be portable (presumably, this window manager is going to want to run on other UNIXes?) So, the presumed window manager really doesn't have a good reason to use that approach. - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 6:14:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from excalibur.oceanis.net (ns.dotcom.fr [195.154.74.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3024B14D1B for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 06:14:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pixel@excalibur.oceanis.net) Received: (from pixel@localhost) by excalibur.oceanis.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) id NAA06217; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:14:02 GMT From: Emmanuel DELOGET Message-Id: <199904291314.NAA06217@excalibur.oceanis.net> Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <199904291305.JAA20952@lakes.dignus.com> from Thomas David Rivers at "Apr 29, 1999 9: 5:59 am" To: rivers@dignus.com (Thomas David Rivers) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 15:14:01 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers Mail List) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As the well known Thomas David Rivers said... -> As it happens, on UNIX, nope - I quit doing that... for one -> very good reason. When I start something from an ICON, typically -> stderr is directed "away". And, typically, UNIX programs (including -> such mostly-GUI applications as Netscape) write useful information -> to stderr. Clicking on an icon and getting the result of the command is allways possible. Classical WMs/desktops need work to do this (redirect stderr to something, such as a file, and display the content of this file if anything goes wrong). It's not a problem. -> -> So - after struggling for awhile with a particular problem, then -> trying to run the program from the command line and seeing the nice/helpful -> message which would have prevented a lot of frustration... I quit -> starting things by "clicking." -> -> - Dave Rivers - -- __________________________________________________________________________ Emmanuel DELOGET [pixel] pixel@{dotcom.fr,epita.fr} ---- DotCom SA http://www.epita.fr/~pixel | http://www.dotcom.fr/~pixel "On the last day, God created Linux. And Microsoft won its antitrust case" -------------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 6:17:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp1.vnet.net (smtp1.vnet.net [166.82.1.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4114B14D1B for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 06:17:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp1.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA25630; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:18:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA34382; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:17:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id JAA21100; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:17:42 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:17:42 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199904291317.JAA21100@lakes.dignus.com> To: jb@cimlogic.com.au, rivers@dignus.com Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199904291205.WAA01206@cimlogic.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Thomas David Rivers wrote: > > I point out that if the executable has no icon in it, then this > > "overrides" from the window manager would come into play, right? > > > > Since the "overrides" have to be there anyway - what's the advantage > > of putting the icon in the exe? > > Window managers wrap top-level windows of active processes. The icon > in the exe is for browsing the file system prior to executing the > process. These are two _very_ different things. > Ah.. I see... something like Window's "Explorer"? And, why wouldn't something based on file(1) with an association of file-type to icon do the same thing? At least, I know when I want to "explore" a directory on UNIX, I typically do: cd file * It seems, however, that the disadvantage of that is the all executables show up with the same "icon". Now, perhaps, I'm beginning to see a good reason for this. 1) If I were implementing an "explorer", ala Windows and 2) If we neglect multiuser impacts (i.e. don't allow users to, on a per-user basis, change the icon) (Maybe to do this, all the user needs is write access to the executable... - which would seem to allow a user to change his own icons & not the system ones.) and 3) Provide default icons based on the output of file(1), or maybe on file extension... or whatever... (perhaps taylorable on a per-user basis.) then, placing an icon in an exe, would make sense... yes. In fact, I rather like that idea. - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 6:21:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp2.vnet.net (smtp2.vnet.net [166.82.1.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7309015835 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 06:21:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp2.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA06032; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:22:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA34397; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:21:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id JAA21156; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:21:42 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:21:42 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199904291321.JAA21156@lakes.dignus.com> To: pixel@DotCom.FR, rivers@dignus.com Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199904291314.NAA06217@excalibur.oceanis.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > As the well known Thomas David Rivers said... > -> As it happens, on UNIX, nope - I quit doing that... for one > -> very good reason. When I start something from an ICON, typically > -> stderr is directed "away". And, typically, UNIX programs (including > -> such mostly-GUI applications as Netscape) write useful information > -> to stderr. > Clicking on an icon and getting the result of the command > is allways possible. Classical WMs/desktops need work to do this > (redirect stderr to something, such as a file, and display > the content of this file if anything goes wrong). It's not > a problem. While this is certainly true... it seems to be the case that very few of them actually do it. - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 6:23:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from excalibur.oceanis.net (ns.dotcom.fr [195.154.74.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3300015838 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 06:23:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pixel@excalibur.oceanis.net) Received: (from pixel@localhost) by excalibur.oceanis.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) id NAA06412; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:23:05 GMT From: Emmanuel DELOGET Message-Id: <199904291323.NAA06412@excalibur.oceanis.net> Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) In-Reply-To: from Thomas Valentino Crimi at "Apr 29, 1999 8:45:22 am" To: tcrimi+@andrew.cmu.edu (Thomas Valentino Crimi) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 15:23:05 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers Mail List) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As the well known Thomas Valentino Crimi said... -> -> One alternative I'd like to propose is an icons.db file, laid out for ->optimum keysearch, with the .ICON elf section possibly containing a ->unique identifier for the binary. The .db file could contain multiple ->versions of each icon, in all the popular styles, and the user could ->have his/her own .icons.db file which is searched prior to the system ->list. Next comes /usr/local/share/icons.db where the administrator ->could install 'icon packages' to override system-default binaries as ->well as icons for the ports. Now, from here we would need to add in some ->pkg_add, pkg_delete like utilties icon_add, icon_delete which access ->this db.. the syntax could look like -> -> icon_add [stylename:iconfile]... -> ->where icon_add could extract the unique identifier from the binary, and ->then add in the iconfile. The user can then always retrieve icons of ->any style type from the db, and everyone can have the interface they ->want. -> ->I volunteer to send patches if people want this :) I think this idea is far more better than putting ressources into the executable. Those magic could be generated by md5 or something else. In addition to icons, we could have a generic way to handle any kind of ressources (dtd for usage and so on). It just need a decent interface, a way to avoid duplication of ressources, and we have it. -> -> icond? anyone? -> ->Thomas -- __________________________________________________________________________ Emmanuel DELOGET [pixel] pixel@{dotcom.fr,epita.fr} ---- DotCom SA http://www.epita.fr/~pixel | http://www.dotcom.fr/~pixel "On the last day, God created Linux. And Microsoft won its antitrust case" -------------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 6:28:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from excalibur.oceanis.net (ns.dotcom.fr [195.154.74.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE0DE15835 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 06:28:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pixel@excalibur.oceanis.net) Received: (from pixel@localhost) by excalibur.oceanis.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) id NAA06508; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:28:41 GMT From: Emmanuel DELOGET Message-Id: <199904291328.NAA06508@excalibur.oceanis.net> Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <199904291321.JAA21156@lakes.dignus.com> from Thomas David Rivers at "Apr 29, 1999 9:21:42 am" To: rivers@dignus.com (Thomas David Rivers) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 15:28:41 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers Mail List) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As the well known Thomas David Rivers said... ->> ->> As the well known Thomas David Rivers said... ->> -> As it happens, on UNIX, nope - I quit doing that... for one ->> -> very good reason. When I start something from an ICON, typically ->> -> stderr is directed "away". And, typically, UNIX programs (including ->> -> such mostly-GUI applications as Netscape) write useful information ->> -> to stderr. ->> Clicking on an icon and getting the result of the command ->> is allways possible. Classical WMs/desktops need work to do this ->> (redirect stderr to something, such as a file, and display ->> the content of this file if anything goes wrong). It's not ->> a problem. -> -> While this is certainly true... it seems to be the case that -> very few of them actually do it. Enlignenment, for example, already check the return code of some proggies. If the future WindowMaker 0.54.0 does not do this, we'll propose it to them (it's very simple, in fact). Others will probably follow... [I don't speak of these old [c]twm, or fvwm(2|95) based wm's...]. -> -> - Dave Rivers - -> -- __________________________________________________________________________ Emmanuel DELOGET [pixel] pixel@{dotcom.fr,epita.fr} ---- DotCom SA http://www.epita.fr/~pixel | http://www.dotcom.fr/~pixel "On the last day, God created Linux. And Microsoft won its antitrust case" -------------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 7:52:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pau-amma.whistle.com (s205m64.whistle.com [207.76.205.64]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9A5714C4E for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 07:52:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dhw@whistle.com) Received: (from dhw@localhost) by pau-amma.whistle.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id HAA60435 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 07:52:19 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 07:52:19 -0700 (PDT) From: David Wolfskill Message-Id: <199904291452.HAA60435@pau-amma.whistle.com> Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19990429132713.A38300@gurney.reilly.home> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >From: "Andrew Reilly" >Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:27:13 +1000 >This sounds like an argument for file system use profiling and >tweaking to me. We already have an optimisation for symlinks of >a certain size that can reside directly in the inode (replacing >the indirect pointers). Perhaps icons can do that too.... While I was reading the above, it occurred to me that it isn't all that uncommon for a given executable to have multiple links, sometimes with different behavior depending on the name by which the executable was invoked. I would be moderately surprised if, in an environment where different executables had distinguishable icons, the different links to the same executable were required to share the same icon. That would seem to complicate the above a bit. It then (finally!) dawned on me that this same concern could well complicate the original proposal (of making use of a new section in the ELF executable). Note: this by no means makes the proposal impossible, or even (necessarily) infeasible; it merely requires that the issue be addressed -- preferably, intentionally. Some days I'm slower than others.... :-} But since I didn't recall anyone else mentioning the point (well, at least I didn't recognize it if it *was* being made), I thought it might be useful to mention. Cheers, david -- David Wolfskill UNIX System Administrator dhw@whistle.com voice: (650) 577-7158 pager: (650) 371-4621 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 7:55:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA89314C4E for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 07:55:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id QAA09555; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 16:55:18 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA06737; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 16:55:18 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 16:55:18 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: hart@dotat.com Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Enough already with adding desktop icons In-Reply-To: <199904291226.VAA03092@at.dotat.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I hate to be a stiff, but 60+ messages on the same (non technical) > topic in one day is a bit much for a technical list, eh? As a matter of fact, it is a technical topic, as it is concerned with changes to the buildworld process and possibly the implementation of additional layered filesystems. Perhaps we should have a freebsd-policy list for the part of the discussion which is concerned with the moral/ethical issues of adding this to the base system? - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 8: 8: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from poboxer.pobox.com (unknown [208.149.16.14]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27D3114CE1; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:07:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from alk@poboxer.pobox.com) Received: (from alk@localhost) by poboxer.pobox.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id KAA05330; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 10:07:39 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from alk) From: Anthony Kimball MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 10:07:39 -0500 (CDT) X-Face: \h9Jg:Cuivl4S*UP-)gO.6O=T]]@ncM*tn4zG);)lk#4|lqEx=*talx?.Gk,dMQU2)ptPC17cpBzm(l'M|H8BUF1&]dDCxZ.c~Wy6-j,^V1E(NtX$FpkkdnJixsJHE95JlhO 5\M3jh'YiO7KPCn0~W`Ro44_TB@&JuuqRqgPL'0/{):7rU-%.*@/>q?1&Ed Reply-To: alk@pobox.com To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com Cc: julian@whistle.com, dlombardo@excite.com, freebsd-multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Voice recog. from IBM soon.. References: <199904291025.DAA23645@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.43 under 20.4 "Emerald" XEmacs Lucid Message-ID: <14120.29927.978801.781981@avalon.east> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Quoth Amancio Hasty on Thu, 29 April: : Their tar ball appears to be corrupt and I tried downloading : the file a couple of times. I d/l'd it sans glitch: ;tar tf viavoice_sdk_rtk.tar ViaVoice_runtime-1.0-1.0.i386.rpm ViaVoice_sdk-1.0-1.0.i386.rpm readme.txt You're probably losing the connection. Go to the web site and copy the url. Then do like I did, and wget -c http://www6.software.ibm.com/dl/viavoice/linux-ftpdl\?REG_FTPINFO=204.146.24.110:speech:ibmspeech/viavoice_sdk_rtk.tar\®_ONO=925230512-56896\®_SOURCE=linux only with the REG_FTP_INFO and REG_ONO values from your url. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 8: 9: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kalypso.cybercom.net (kalypso.cybercom.net [209.21.136.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8332D14FA6 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:08:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ksmm@threespace.com) Received: from localhost (ksmm@localhost) by kalypso.cybercom.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id LAA26487 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:08:53 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:08:50 -0400 (EDT) From: The Classiest Man Alive X-Sender: ksmm@kalypso.cybercom.net To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Enough already with adding desktop icons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This is starting to look more and more like that "How many mailing list users does it take to change a light bulb?" joke... --K. On Thu, 29 Apr 1999, Marius Bendiksen wrote: : > I hate to be a stiff, but 60+ messages on the same (non technical) : > topic in one day is a bit much for a technical list, eh? : : As a matter of fact, it is a technical topic, as it is concerned with : changes to the buildworld process and possibly the implementation of : additional layered filesystems. : : Perhaps we should have a freebsd-policy list for the part of the : discussion which is concerned with the moral/ethical issues of adding : this to the base system? : : - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 8:32: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from postoffice.sarnoff.com (postoffice.sarnoff.com [130.33.10.147]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2C5915858 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:32:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from amarks@sarnoff.com) Received: from sarnoff.com ([130.33.14.232]) by postoffice.sarnoff.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.5) with ESMTP id AAA5DBE for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:31:59 -0400 Message-ID: <37287B6F.6E453E8D@sarnoff.com> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:31:59 -0400 From: "AARON MARKS" Reply-To: amarks@sarnoff.com Organization: Sarnoff Corporation X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Netgear 620 Driver? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Anyone know if there's a FreeBSD driver for the Netgear 620 (Gbit NIC)? Thanks, -A. -- Aaron J. Marks Communications and Computing Systems Lab Assoc. Member Tech Staff Advanced Networks and Computation Group amarks@sarnoff.com Sarnoff Corporation To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 8:48: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from verdi.nethelp.no (verdi.nethelp.no [158.36.41.162]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 19ED1150BA for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:48:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sthaug@nethelp.no) Received: (qmail 85166 invoked by uid 1001); 29 Apr 1999 15:48:05 +0000 (GMT) To: amarks@sarnoff.com Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netgear 620 Driver? From: sthaug@nethelp.no In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:31:59 -0400" References: <37287B6F.6E453E8D@sarnoff.com> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.05+ on Emacs 19.34.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 17:48:04 +0200 Message-ID: <85164.925400884@verdi.nethelp.no> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Anyone know if there's a FreeBSD driver for the Netgear 620 (Gbit NIC)? Yes, Bill Paul made a driver, see ti(4) in -CURRENT. Can be used with 3.1 also, see http://www.freebsd.org/~wpaul/Alteon/. Works great here. Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 9:12:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp13.bellglobal.com (smtp13.bellglobal.com [204.101.251.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DE7E14FBA for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:12:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from vanderh@ecf.toronto.edu) Received: from localhost.nowhere (ppp18341.on.bellglobal.com [206.172.130.21]) by smtp13.bellglobal.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA16913; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:13:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from tim@localhost) by localhost.nowhere (8.9.3/8.9.1) id LAA51607; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:58:03 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from tim) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:58:02 -0400 From: Tim Vanderhoek To: Andrew Reilly Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990429115802.A51491@mad> References: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com>; <19990429083638.B34373.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@gurney.reilly.home> <199904282244.PAA28325@kithrup.com> <19990428232922.B47260@mad> <19990429134646.C38300@gurney.reilly.home> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i In-Reply-To: <19990429134646.C38300@gurney.reilly.home>; from Andrew Reilly on Thu, Apr 29, 1999 at 01:46:46PM +1000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 29, 1999 at 01:46:46PM +1000, Andrew Reilly wrote: > > > > /usr/bin/rm/icons/{icon1, icon2, ...} > > /usr/bin/rm/executable [...] > Besides, none of /usr/bin are ever going to be executed by a > double-click, and simply don't need that kind of elaboration. John was talking about the "myriad of programs in FreeBSD", whatever that means. Regardless, one could potentially want to associate icons with many different files. -- This .sig is not innovative, witty, or profund. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 9:12:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp11.bellglobal.com (smtp11.bellglobal.com [204.101.251.53]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7843814FBA for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:12:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from vanderh@ecf.toronto.edu) Received: from localhost.nowhere (ppp18341.on.bellglobal.com [206.172.130.21]) by smtp11.bellglobal.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA08961; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:15:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from tim@localhost) by localhost.nowhere (8.9.3/8.9.1) id MAA51629; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:11:26 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from tim) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:11:26 -0400 From: Tim Vanderhoek To: Matthew Dillon Cc: Nate Williams , Joe Abley , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990429121126.B51491@mad> References: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com> <19990429083638.B34373.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@gurney.reilly.home> <199904282244.PAA28325@kithrup.com> <19990429112538.D81921@clear.co.nz> <199904282331.RAA11927@mt.sri.com> <19990428232559.A47260@mad> <199904290337.UAA11634@apollo.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i In-Reply-To: <199904290337.UAA11634@apollo.backplane.com>; from Matthew Dillon on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 08:37:01PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 08:37:01PM -0700, Matthew Dillon wrote: > I think the easiest way to deal with icons is to simply have an .icons.dbm > dbm file in each directory. i.e. /bin/.icons.dbm. /usr/bin/.icons.dbm., [...] > > After all, you might want icons for things other then files. For example, > directories, softlinks, unix domain sockets, devices. Whatever. I was actually about to agree, but... This has coherency problems. Consider a script that produces several thousand different files and calls the appropriate "associate icon" program, associating different icons with different files. Whoever, whatever, decides to delete those programs is going to need to also call the correct "dissasociate icon" program. I don't see that happening. Icons are just as much a part of the file as the filename is a part of the file. "The icon is the filename." (Did you hear that, everyone?) Whatever proposals are made in this thread, I don't expect any of them to be implemented anytime this year. John Birrel needs an immediate solution to his problem, and nothing more. What we need is a libicon interface, and we should be arguing of the _definition_ of that interface, not its implementation. So long as that interface can be reasonably extended in the future, I'm happy. I think most potential extensions have been mentioned in the discussion, by now (mime?, multiple icons, etc.). -- This .sig is not innovative, witty, or profund. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 9:29:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from frmug.org (frmug-gw.frmug.org [193.56.58.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97EEE14CE2 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:29:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by frmug.org (8.9.1/frmug-2.3/nospam) with UUCP id SAA20630 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 18:29:21 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: by keltia.freenix.fr (Postfix, from userid 101) id EC9D08840; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 10:47:12 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from roberto) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 10:47:12 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: FreeBSD Hackers Mail List Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990429104712.A79836@keltia.freenix.fr> Mail-Followup-To: FreeBSD Hackers Mail List References: <199904280827.SAA27054@cimlogic.com.au> <199904280858.IAA11087@excalibur.oceanis.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/0.95.5i In-Reply-To: <199904280858.IAA11087@excalibur.oceanis.net>; from Emmanuel DELOGET on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 10:58:03AM +0200 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT/ELF ctm#5244 AMD-K6 MMX @ 200 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG According to Emmanuel DELOGET: > Since the graphic interface and the system are separated, > I do not understand the *real* value of this (putting > an icon in the exe). A lot of window manager are > able to create a exe/pixmap array to handle these particular > associations. Yes but the associations are static, generally based on either the extension or a static list of mapping. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 4.0-CURRENT #2: Fri Apr 16 22:37:03 CEST 1999 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 9:31:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fry.cs.purdue.edu (fry.cs.purdue.edu [128.10.2.30]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 755E714F93 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:31:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from splite@fry.cs.purdue.edu) Received: (qmail 771 invoked by uid 118); 29 Apr 1999 16:31:55 -0000 Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:31:55 -0500 From: splite@purdue.edu To: Tim Vanderhoek Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990429113155.A492@fry.cs.purdue.edu> References: <199904282017.NAA01044@dingo.cdrom.com> <19990429083638.B34373.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@gurney.reilly.home> <199904282244.PAA28325@kithrup.com> <19990429112538.D81921@clear.co.nz> <199904282331.RAA11927@mt.sri.com> <19990428232559.A47260@mad> <199904290337.UAA11634@apollo.backplane.com> <19990429121126.B51491@mad> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii In-Reply-To: <19990429121126.B51491@mad>; from Tim Vanderhoek on Thu, Apr 29, 1999 at 12:11:26PM -0400 X-Disclaimer: Any similarity to an opinion of Purdue is purely coincidental Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 29, 1999 at 12:11:26PM -0400, Tim Vanderhoek wrote: > > Icons are just as much a part of the file as the filename is a part of > the file. "The icon is the filename." (Did you hear that, everyone?) Ummm... filenames are not part of a file. That's what directories are for. Seems expanding the directory structure to handle icons would be the right way to handle this. Good luck ever getting it committed, though. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 10:47:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from po9.andrew.cmu.edu (PO9.ANDREW.CMU.EDU [128.2.10.109]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C31514FA2 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 10:47:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tcrimi+@andrew.cmu.edu) Received: (from postman@localhost) by po9.andrew.cmu.edu (8.8.5/8.8.2) id NAA14744; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:47:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: via switchmail; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:47:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from elijah.weh.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:45:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from elijah.weh.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:45:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mms.4.60.Jun.27.1996.03.02.53.sun4.51.EzMail.2.0.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.elijah.weh.andrew.cmu.edu.sun4m.54 via MS.5.6.elijah.weh.andrew.cmu.edu.sun4_51; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:45:42 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:45:42 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas Valentino Crimi To: Emmanuel DELOGET Subject: Re: Adding desktop support (please don't) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers Mail List) In-Reply-To: <199904291323.NAA06412@excalibur.oceanis.net> References: <199904291323.NAA06412@excalibur.oceanis.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Excerpts from mail: 29-Apr-99 Re: Adding desktop support .. by Emmanuel DELOGET@DotCom. > something else. In addition to icons, we could have a > generic way to handle any kind of ressources (dtd for usage > and so on). The dtd usage should definitely be in the ELF section (I doubt it would change on a per-user basis). So, definitely, lets not neglect what can be put in the ELF block.. One usefulness of keeping icons on the outside, as well, would be for datafiles. One could have a file(1)/mime based icon selection as well as icons given to particular long lived files (specialized project directories, whatever). ports could add in files for the data of particular packages, ghostscipt, lyx.. It's all up to how complex the db/libraries care to be. SPEAKING of which. Have any opinions been formed on the usefulness of capabilities? It'd be a major kernel hack, but this ELF section data would be very useful for holding such things, and an administrator could use it to selectively disable root-abilties of an SUID root executable according to policy, weird, but, if we were to every deal with capabilities (the REAL work), the interface ELF would provide would be fairly easy to implement and powerful. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 11: 2:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ADD77153B4 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:02:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA23423 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:59:26 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:59:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <199904282244.PAA28325@kithrup.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 28 Apr 1999, Sean Eric Fagan wrote: > Andrew is correct. > > For example... Apple Computer currently has a system like what was proposed. > Actually, it's a considerably better system, since it's general-purpose, > extensible, and user-modifiable if desired, but it's along the same lines. > > They're dropping it, and going with what NeXTStEP uses, for MacOS X -- each > "application" is a directory, and has certain files in the directory. These > files include the icons (multiple ones for multiple uses, of course -- how is > the original propronent of this bloat going to handle that?), the executable, > and all sorts of other metadata. > > Other unix systems have done similar. > > Putting icons in the executable itself is pretty stupid -- it's a single > instance of something that a window manager can use, and there are much > less-invasive ways of doing the same thing. I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'd appreciate you trying better arguments. Above, I see "the other guy doesn't like it" and "it's stupid". Try a technical argument, without buzzwords, and you could convince folks. I don't care about popularity or IQ. ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 11:22: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from timingpdc.timing.com (timingpdc.timing.com [208.203.137.194]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 869D71517A for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:21:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chanders@timing.com) Received: from count.timing.com ([208.203.137.222]) by timingpdc.timing.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) ID# 103-49575U100L2S100) with ESMTP id AAA306; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:25:17 -0600 Received: from count.timing.com (chanders@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by count.timing.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA09709; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:23:32 -0600 Message-Id: <199904291823.MAA09709@count.timing.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: chanders@timing.com Subject: Advice for X on SBC with LCD? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:23:30 -0600 From: chanders@timing.com (Craig Anderson) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I would like to get an X server running on a 640x480 Sharp TFT color panel connected to an ISA single board computer. Advice on how to do this will be much appreciated. Here are some details on the setup. FreeBSD 3.x Axiom SBC8242 486 Chips and Technology F65550 video controller. Sharp LQ64D343 640x480 18bit color TFT display. The SBC8242 has jumper settings to support TFT Color panels. #5, 640x480 Sharp TFT Color Panel $6, 640x480 18-bit TFT Color Panel The SBC8242 User's Manual lists VESA VBE modes that are identical to the CRT/TFT modes listed in a Chips and Technology application note. VESA VBE mode 0x112, grapnic mode, Pack pixel memory organization Res Screen refresh horiz. freq. dot clock display mem+cursor 640x480x24bpp 60 Hz 31.5 KHz 25.174 MHz 900KB + 4.2KB 640x480x24bpp 75 Hz 37.5 KHz 31.5 MHz 900KB + 4.2KB 640x480x24bpp 85 Hz 43.3 KHz 36MHz MHz 900KB + 4.2KB Thanks, Craig H. Anderson Timing Solutions Corporation chanders@timing.com 303-939-8481 (fbsd_hacker_mail_990429.txt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 12:35:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk [193.237.89.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F8EF150F9 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:34:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nik@nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk) Received: (from nik@localhost) by nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (8.9.2/8.9.2) id UAA15941; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 20:25:08 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from nik) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 20:25:08 +0100 From: Nik Clayton To: Marius Bendiksen Cc: hart@dotat.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Enough already with adding desktop icons Message-ID: <19990429202508.A14009@catkin.nothing-going-on.org> References: <199904291226.VAA03092@at.dotat.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: ; from Marius Bendiksen on Thu, Apr 29, 1999 at 04:55:18PM +0200 Organization: Nik at home, where there's nothing going on Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 29, 1999 at 04:55:18PM +0200, Marius Bendiksen wrote: > Perhaps we should have a freebsd-policy list for the part of the > discussion which is concerned with the moral/ethical issues of adding > this to the base system? Maybe freebsd-arch? Eivind is the moderator. N -- There's some milk in the fridge about to go off. . . and there it goes. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 12:44: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from moebius2.Space.Net (moebius2.Space.Net [195.30.1.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 3E0441539A for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:43:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from maex@Space.Net) Received: (qmail 4935 invoked by uid 1013); 29 Apr 1999 19:43:47 -0000 Message-ID: <19990429214347.T384@space.net> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 21:43:47 +0200 From: Markus Stumpf To: John Birrell , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Adding desktop support References: <199904280647.QAA26783@cimlogic.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199904280647.QAA26783@cimlogic.com.au>; from John Birrell on Wed, Apr 28, 1999 at 04:47:35PM +1000 Organization: SpaceNet GmbH, Muenchen, Germany Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ok, I'll start from scratch ;-) 1) If I compare the number of binaries to the number of datafiles (.txt, .ps, .whatsoever) on the systems I have access too, the latter outnumber the binaries by FAR. I can't see the advantage of having icons defined only for the executables in a filesystem browser. You can't use .icons sections with "datafiles", so you need some mapping mechanism for them anyway. 2) How often do you REALLY copy or link binaries from /bin to /somewhereelse and therefor loose a "external" mapping? (Can't remember ever having done this except for chroot()ed environments in FTP servers for the last 10 years or so). 3) GNOME has a real tricky way to find which application/datafile should be represented by which icon. (They use file extensions and file(1) and a database of filenames that can be managed by the user and overrides the defaults). And they have a management tool thats aids you in configuring that. Take a look at "gmc" (Midnight Commander), it is a filesystem browser that really does it nicely. \Maex -- SpaceNet GmbH | http://www.Space.Net/ | Yeah, yo mama dresses Research & Development | mailto:maex-sig@Space.Net | you funny and you need Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14 | Tel: +49 (89) 32356-0 | a mouse to delete files D-80807 Muenchen | Fax: +49 (89) 32356-299 | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 13: 4:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D873615154 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:04:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA26376; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:03:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904292003.NAA26376@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: John Birrell Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 29 Apr 1999 21:43:47 +0200." <19990429214347.T384@space.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:03:25 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi John, A simple suggestion: Develop your desktop system and provide a web page on how to use it and/or how people can help your project. -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 13:45:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E88015155; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:45:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id NAA18475; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:40:20 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:40:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Amancio Hasty Cc: Dean Lombardo , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Voice recog. from IBM soon.. In-Reply-To: <199904291025.DAA23645@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I fetched it ok.. it contains two RPM packages.. julian On Thu, 29 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > Their tar ball appears to be corrupt and I tried downloading > the file a couple of times. > > > {hasty} tar -tf viavoice_sdk_rtk.tar > ViaVoice_runtime-1.0-1.0.i386.rpm > tar: Unexpected EOF on archive file > > > -- > > Amancio Hasty > hasty@star-gate.com > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 14:14:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from home.dragondata.com (home.dragondata.com [204.137.237.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B617214DB2 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 14:14:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from toasty@home.dragondata.com) Received: (from toasty@localhost) by home.dragondata.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id QAA00336 for hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 16:14:09 -0500 (CDT) From: Kevin Day Message-Id: <199904292114.QAA00336@home.dragondata.com> Subject: mmaping /dev/mem then spawning children To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 16:14:09 -0500 (CDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'm completely at a loss as to why this happens, but it just sprang up when we upgraded from 3.0-RELEASE to 3.1-RELEASE. I have a process that mmap's a device. (Our own custom driver). It then spawns some children that don't really need access to it. However, top/ps/etc show that the child is eating 32760 megabytes of ram. This also seems to happen if you mmap /dev/mem, or a few other devices. Am I just doing something stupid here, or is this an honest bug? Here's sample code to reproduce this. Compile them both, then run '1'. 1.c: #include #include #include #include #include #include void main(void) { int k; char *low; int devmem; devmem = open("/dev/mem",O_RDWR); low1mb = (char *)mmap(0, 0x800000, (PROT_READ | PROT_WRITE), MAP_INHERIT | MAP_SHARED, devmem, 0); printf("Starting 2...\n"); if (rfork(RFCFDG|RFPROC)) { usleep(100); } else { k = execl("./2", "2", (char *) 0); if (k) { printf("io returned %d errno %d\n",k, errno); } _exit(0); } } 2.c: void main(void) { while(1) sleep(10000); } I run ./1 top shows: PID USERNAME PRI NICE SIZE RES STATE TIME WCPU CPU COMMAND 899 root 10 0 748K 32760M nanslp 0:00 0.00% 0.00% 2 ps shows: root 899 0.0 53622.9 748 -7960 p1 I 6:14AM 0:00.00 2 0 899 1 0 10 0 748 -7960 nanslp I p1 0:00.00 2 -7960k.... which is about 8M (from the mmap) minus how much '2' should really be taking up. Is this a real bug? Kevin To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 14:15:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FC4514F35; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 14:15:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA27074; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 14:14:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199904292114.OAA27074@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Julian Elischer Cc: Dean Lombardo , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Voice recog. from IBM soon.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:40:19 PDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 14:14:48 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Turns out that the problem was a login.conf problem -- had the maximum file size set to 32M so I increased it to 100MB 8) Will try out via voice later on tonite -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 14:40:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cimlogic.com.au (cimlog.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.51.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A411D1527F for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 14:40:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jb@cimlogic.com.au) Received: (from jb@localhost) by cimlogic.com.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id HAA02452; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 07:47:31 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jb) From: John Birrell Message-Id: <199904292147.HAA02452@cimlogic.com.au> Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <19990429121126.B51491@mad> from Tim Vanderhoek at "Apr 29, 1999 12:11:26 pm" To: vanderh@ecf.utoronto.ca (Tim Vanderhoek) Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 07:47:31 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Tim Vanderhoek wrote: > Icons are just as much a part of the file as the filename is a part of > the file. "The icon is the filename." (Did you hear that, everyone?) > > Whatever proposals are made in this thread, I don't expect any of them > to be implemented anytime this year. John Birrel needs an immediate > solution to his problem, and nothing more. What we need is a libicon > interface, and we should be arguing of the _definition_ of that > interface, not its implementation. I have implemented the solution. The demo program I posted was hacked out of that solution. The top level "Files" button is just one of many things (like installed packages, ports index, etc) that are browsable. I considered whether the underlying software should remain proprietary or whether I should contribute it to the project (under a BSD license). It doesn't _have_ to go into FreeBSD IMO - I just thought (and still think) that it is worthwile. -- John Birrell - jb@cimlogic.com.au; jb@freebsd.org http://www.cimlogic.com.au/ CIMlogic Pty Ltd, GPO Box 117A, Melbourne Vic 3001, Australia +61 418 353 137 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 16:18:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fep1-orange.clear.net.nz (fep1-orange.clear.net.nz [203.97.32.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C68F315130 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 16:18:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jabley@buddha.clear.net.nz) Received: from buddha.clear.net.nz (buddha.clear.net.nz [192.168.24.106]) by fep1-orange.clear.net.nz (1.5/1.11) with ESMTP id LAA01456; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 11:18:35 +1200 (NZST) Received: (from jabley@localhost) by buddha.clear.net.nz (8.9.3/8.9.2) id LAA07565; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 11:18:25 +1200 (NZST) (envelope-from jabley) Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 11:18:25 +1200 From: Joe Abley To: Thomas David Rivers Cc: rkw@dataplex.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jabley@clear.co.nz Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990430111825.K98083@clear.co.nz> References: <199904291312.JAA20991@lakes.dignus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904291312.JAA20991@lakes.dignus.com>; from Thomas David Rivers on Thu, Apr 29, 1999 at 09:12:04AM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 29, 1999 at 09:12:04AM -0400, Thomas David Rivers wrote: > > > > At 5:57 AM -0500 4/29/99, Thomas David Rivers wrote: > > > I point out that if the executable has no icon in it, then this > > > "overrides" from the window manager would come into play, right? > > > > > > Since the "overrides" have to be there anyway - what's the advantage > > > of putting the icon in the exe? > > > > I think that you miss the hierarchy of "defaults". > > > > If the USER has specified the icon for the entity, use his, > > > > else if the AUTHOR provided an icon, use it, > > > > else if the USER gave a default to the window manager, ... > > > > else if the WM-AUTHOR, ... > > > > else use a totally generic icon. > > And - my point - which you really made - is that all of the > alternatives can't go in the executable, or you begin to have > many copies of the executable, or one executable with large > repository & information for each user that may run it... both > of which can be quite a nightmare. I don't think this is contentious at all. With reference to Thomas' e-mail above, the idea is to put the author- rovided icon in the binary. This is the one place this icon can live where it will not be displaced by file copies, renames, etc. Joe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 16:37:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EFACB1526C; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 16:37:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id JAA14907; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 09:07:34 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id JAA80593; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 09:07:33 +0930 (CST) Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 09:07:33 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: FreeBSD Chat , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: USENIX: which hotel? Message-ID: <19990430090733.A80561@freebie.lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I see that there are two different hotels associated with USENIX this year. Where are people planning to stay? Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 17: 4:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wrath.cs.utah.edu (wrath.cs.utah.edu [155.99.198.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB40514C11 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 17:04:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from danderse@cs.utah.edu) Received: from torrey.cs.utah.edu (torrey.cs.utah.edu [155.99.212.91]) by wrath.cs.utah.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA11099; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 18:04:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: (from danderse@localhost) by torrey.cs.utah.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) id SAA11461; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 18:04:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from danderse@cs.utah.edu) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 18:04:29 -0600 (MDT) From: "David G. Andersen" To: "David E. Cross" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ypserv In-Reply-To: David E. Cross's message of Mon, April 12 1999 <199904121852.OAA22126@cs.rpi.edu> References: <199904121852.OAA22126@cs.rpi.edu> X-Mailer: VM 6.43 under 20.4 "Emerald" XEmacs Lucid Message-ID: <14120.61942.222606.324094@torrey.cs.utah.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Lo and Behold, David E. Cross said: > Our ypserv processes have been dieing a great deal lately (luckily they > restart themselves, but not before all the clients rebind to another > machine). I have tracked the problem down to a stack corruption. Apparently > caused by a stack overflow (I am still working on it, don't get excited yet ;). Sorry for taking so long to reply to this, David. We've been pounding on ypserv lately, and have managed to get it to a fairly stable state on our servers, but unfortunately, there's one patch we haven't committed in because it breaks the semantics of the databases. The problem you're most likely seeing is the database concurrent access problem (bin/10971). The solution to this is modifying the Berkeley DB routines to use pread(), which has only been introduced into -current recently, and I'm not sure if the db routines have been modified accordingly. We patched our DB routines (ONLY for ypserv) to explicitly lock the database before doing their reads, but since it's a read lock, it requires *write* access to the database, which changes the semantics of how ypserv behaves. It's not a great solution, but it does the trick for us pretty well. There's another fix we sent in to stop hangs due to an incorrect use of the RPC library. You'll want to apply it. It's in bin/10970. If you fix that and get things stable enough, you'll then run into another probem which is fixed in -current and -stable (bin/11122) with a bad length into strncmp. Bill Paul committed this fix a few weeks ago, so if you've got an up to date system you'll be OK on that scope. If you'd like, I can ship you a functioning ypserv binary for 3.0 with all of our patches, statically linked against the locking DB routines. -Dave Andersen -- work: danderse@cs.utah.edu me: angio@pobox.com University of Utah http://www.angio.net/ Computer Science - Flux Research Group "What's footnote FIVE?" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 17: 8:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wrath.cs.utah.edu (wrath.cs.utah.edu [155.99.198.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F60214E4F for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 17:08:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from danderse@cs.utah.edu) Received: from torrey.cs.utah.edu (torrey.cs.utah.edu [155.99.212.91]) by wrath.cs.utah.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA11209; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 18:08:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: (from danderse@localhost) by torrey.cs.utah.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) id SAA11481; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 18:08:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from danderse@cs.utah.edu) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 18:08:35 -0600 (MDT) From: "David G. Andersen" To: barry@lustig.com Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ypserv In-Reply-To: Barry Lustig's message of Tue, April 13 1999 <19990413144409.16671.qmail@devious.lustig.com> References: <199904122143.RAA25814@cs.rpi.edu> <19990413144409.16671.qmail@devious.lustig.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.43 under 20.4 "Emerald" XEmacs Lucid Message-ID: <14120.62381.372738.414544@torrey.cs.utah.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As I mentioned, see these PRs: bin/10970 - Child processes hanging bin/10971 - DB locking bin/11122 - bad strncmp (fixed in -stable and -current). I'll prepare a patch that does our DB locking and submit it as a followup to bin/10971 tomorrow. -Dave Lo and Behold, Barry Lustig said: > 2.6, 2.7, irix 5.3, 6.2, 6.3, 6.4, 6.5, and openstep 4.2 machines. I see > dozens of SEGV's from the ypserv processes on the FreeBSD boxes. Here is > what I managed to find. I was waiting for Bill Paul to get back to me on > this, but haven't heard from him. -- work: danderse@cs.utah.edu me: angio@pobox.com University of Utah http://www.angio.net/ Computer Science - Flux Research Group "What's footnote FIVE?" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 17:25:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9512E14E4F for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 17:25:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA24544; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 20:22:45 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 20:22:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Amancio Hasty Cc: John Birrell , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <199904292003.NAA26376@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 29 Apr 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > Hi John, > > A simple suggestion: Develop your desktop system and provide > a web page on how to use it and/or how people can help > your project. Which completely misses the point ... we have desktops, we want to provide tools and APIs which attract developers of applications to code for FreeBSD. You might have well asked yourself to write the desktop, you care as much (or more) about it as John does, and you know that. I know what your answer is, and I'm not surprised or bothered by that, but I am surprised at your discouraging John from providing tools to those folks who ARE interested in it. ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 18: 4:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from psf.Pinyon.ORG (ip-17-245.prc.primenet.com [207.218.17.245]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1291815403 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 18:04:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rcarter@psf.Pinyon.ORG) Received: from psf.Pinyon.ORG (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by psf.Pinyon.ORG (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id SAA17606 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 18:00:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rcarter@psf.Pinyon.ORG) Message-Id: <199904300100.SAA17606@psf.Pinyon.ORG> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.3 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: async io and sockets update In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:54:49 -0400." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 18:00:55 -0700 From: "Russell L. Carter" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG cmsedore@mailbox.syr.edu said: %I've mostly finished what I set out to do with the kernel aio %routines. Below is a summary: Can you make a patch against current so others can try it out? ACE in particular is supposed to be able to use aio to great advantage, I'd like to see if this is true. Tho they mix in RT-signals in their aio code, might have a barrier there. Russell To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 20:36:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp (tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp [202.239.16.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3CEA114D3D for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 20:36:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from junichi@astec.co.jp) Received: from amont.astec.co.jp (amont.astec.co.jp [172.20.10.1]) by tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp (8.9.1+3.0W/3.7W-astecMX2.3) with ESMTP id MAA11445; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 12:36:30 +0900 (JST) Received: from localhost (sakura.astec.co.jp [172.20.10.61]) by amont.astec.co.jp (8.7.6/3.6W-astecMX2.4) with ESMTP id MAA21665; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 12:36:29 +0900 (JST) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: junichi@astec.co.jp, junichi@junichi.org Subject: High speed serial patch X-Mailer: Mew version 1.93 on Emacs 19.34 / Mule 2.3 (SUETSUMUHANA) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <19990430123628Y.junichi@astec.co.jp> Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 12:36:28 +0900 From: Satoh Junichi X-Dispatcher: imput version 980905(IM100) Lines: 25 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I made a patch that supports high speed serial boards on FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE. It is now available at: http://configure.sh/FreeBSD # http://www.jp.FreeBSD.ORG/~junichi is moved. It supports following boards: Vendor board --------------------------- I-O DATA RSA-DV/S I-O DATA RSA-DVII/S ZyXEL SP111AT Planex FS-460 AMI S-650 After apply it, the sio driver allows over 115kbps using these boards. Can anyone test it? --- Junichi To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 21:49:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bootp.sls.usu.edu (bootp.sls.usu.edu [129.123.82.251]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F11E153E1 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 21:49:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kurto@bootp.sls.usu.edu) Received: (from kurto@localhost) by bootp.sls.usu.edu (8.8.2/8.8.2) id WAA26904 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 22:49:48 -0600 (MDT) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 22:49:48 -0600 (MDT) From: Kurt Olsen Message-Id: <199904300449.WAA26904@bootp.sls.usu.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: usb/ums/uhci panic fix for 3.1? Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Can somebody point me to a fix for the apparently known panic for mice on uhci controllers for 3.1-STABLE? I checked through the mailing lists and could only find a few tantalizing bits, but no solution. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 23:27: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FCC415840 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 23:27:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id IAA29938; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 08:27:05 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA11504; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 08:27:04 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 08:27:04 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: splite@purdue.edu Cc: Tim Vanderhoek , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support In-Reply-To: <19990429113155.A492@fry.cs.purdue.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Seems expanding the directory structure to handle icons would be the right > way to handle this. Good luck ever getting it committed, though. This may be a more appropriate way to do it. There should be no real hassle with it, if it is provided as a layered filesystem, though. - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Apr 29 23:29:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA7B71508D for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 23:29:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id IAA00519; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 08:29:32 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA11513; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 08:29:31 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 08:29:31 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: Nik Clayton Cc: hart@dotat.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: move thread to freebsd-arch? (was Desktop) In-Reply-To: <19990429202508.A14009@catkin.nothing-going-on.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Maybe freebsd-arch? Eivind is the moderator. Good idea. Let's move the thread to the more appropriate list, everybody. (The parts of it which are concerned with architectural questions) - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 30 0:26:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from thelab.hub.org (nat193.65.mpoweredpc.net [142.177.193.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4507115868 for ; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 00:26:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from scrappy@hub.org) Received: from localhost (scrappy@localhost) by thelab.hub.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id EAA10242; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 04:26:16 -0300 (ADT) (envelope-from scrappy@hub.org) X-Authentication-Warning: thelab.hub.org: scrappy owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 04:26:16 -0300 (ADT) From: The Hermit Hacker To: stox@enteract.com Cc: Julian Elischer , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Voice recog. from IBM soon.. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG document not found... On Wed, 28 Apr 1999, Kenneth P. Stox wrote: > > http://www.software.ibm.com/is/voicetype/dev_linux.htm > > In case you're interested. > > -Ken Stox > stox@imagescape.com > > On Tue, 27 Apr 1999, Julian Elischer wrote: > > > IBM has anounced it will be making a binary of it's voice recog. engine > > available for Linux.. Free for personal use. > > > > I'm guessing it should work for FreeBSD too. > > > > Apparently Red-Hat are involved... > > > > hmmm... > > Hal? take a letter... > > > > arrrr, emmm start at... NO NO stop! > > > > julian > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Marc G. Fournier ICQ#7615664 IRC Nick: Scrappy Systems Administrator @ hub.org primary: scrappy@hub.org secondary: scrappy@{freebsd|postgresql}.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 30 2:52:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mrelay.jrc.it (mrelay.jrc.it [139.191.1.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50E7B14D21 for ; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 02:52:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nick.hibma@jrc.it) Received: from elpc36.jrc.it (elpc36.jrc.it [139.191.71.36]) by mrelay.jrc.it (LMC5692) with SMTP id LAA03375; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 11:52:09 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 11:52:06 +0200 (CEST) From: Nick Hibma X-Sender: n_hibma@elpc36.jrc.it Reply-To: Nick Hibma To: Kurt Olsen Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: usb/ums/uhci panic fix for 3.1? In-Reply-To: <199904300449.WAA26904@bootp.sls.usu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Could you tell me more about what problem you see? Nick On Thu, 29 Apr 1999, Kurt Olsen wrote: > > Can somebody point me to a fix for the apparently known panic > for mice on uhci controllers for 3.1-STABLE? I checked > through the mailing lists and could only find a few tantalizing > bits, but no solution. > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 30 3:49:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pcayk.ukc.ac.uk (pcayk.ukc.ac.uk [129.12.41.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A18F214C99 for ; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 03:49:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dlombardo@excite.com) Received: from excite.com (pcdd.ukc.ac.uk [129.12.48.67]) by pcayk.ukc.ac.uk (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id LAA02556; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 11:48:38 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dlombardo@excite.com) Message-ID: <37298BA4.1AC52CDE@excite.com> Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 11:53:24 +0100 From: Dean Lombardo Organization: University of Kent at Canterbury X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: John Birrell Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Adding desktop support References: <199904280647.QAA26783@cimlogic.com.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG John Birrell wrote: > > I'm working on an application that is targeted at users who, based on > their exposure to a certain commercial OS, expect to be able to point > and clip their way through life, and to recognise things by little > pictures. There are a few things that I'd like to add to FreeBSD to > support this sort of application. The first is to build icon pixmaps > into each executable program. > > Now that we've made the transition to ELF, adding an XPM formatted pixmap > to a program is simply a matter of: > > objcopy --add-section=.icon=file.xpm file I think that embedding additional information into ELF executables is a very good idea, although I'm not sure that icons are one of the things you want to see embedded in this way. Anyway, are icons *really* that useful in recognising a particular program amongst a large number of executables? It's ok if the number of icons is small, and the icons themselves are relatively large (e.g. icons on a Windows desktop), but the tiny little icons in Windows Explorer I find totally useless. On the other hand, it would be very helpful if executables contained one-line descriptions of what they do (à la pkg/COMMENT - or even pkg/DESCR in ports) - these could be put into .comment and .descr sections respectively. A file manager could then display this one-line information alongside each executable (and, optionally, you could request a more detailed description). As quite a few people already mentioned, icons only make sense for executables in /usr/X11R6/bin; descriptions make sense for all programs, command-line driven or not. There are a lot of programs for which man pages do not exist, and which have manual pages installed in various places, such as /usr/local/share(/doc), /usr/X11R6/share(/doc) - these often come in different formats - txt, html, pdf, ps, etc - which sometimes makes it non-trivial to find a description of a program. Also, while different users of the same program may want to assign different icons to it, they definitely wouldn't want to have different descriptions of it! A "FreeBSD File Manager" (well done, John!) that could describe what each program does would certainly be worthwhile, and people used to point-and-clicking will find it a lot easier to use than other file managers. Having said that, I don't really object to having icons inside executables *as well* - it certainly wouldn't hurt anyone - disk space is not a problem these days; but if icons are to be embedded into programs, perhaps all command-line programs, such as rm or ls, should have a generic "command-line" icon (similar to Windows' MSDOS icon for Win32 console apps), to prevent people from clicking on it. It would also make a lot of sense if the file manager was distributed as part of the system. If this "little feature" can help FreeBSD gain the support of more users, this is the way to go. UNIX was once command-line-driven, but things have changed since then, and modern UNIX desktop systems have to become user-friendlier if they are to compete with Microsoft. Dean To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 30 4:55:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix, from userid 608) id 75BBD14BFA; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 04:55:53 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" To: grog@lemis.com Cc: chat@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: <19990430090733.A80561@freebie.lemis.com> (message from Greg Lehey on Fri, 30 Apr 1999 09:07:33 +0930) Subject: Re: USENIX: which hotel? Message-Id: <19990430115553.75BBD14BFA@hub.freebsd.org> Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 04:55:53 -0700 (PDT) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > I see that there are two different hotels associated with USENIX this > year. Where are people planning to stay? > the doubletree. jmb To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 30 5:26:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bytor.rush.net (bytor.rush.net [209.45.245.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 12AFA14E08; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 05:26:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from lynch@rush.net) Received: from localhost (lynch@localhost) by bytor.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA11042; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 08:26:25 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 08:26:24 -0400 (EDT) From: Pat Lynch To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Cc: grog@lemis.com, chat@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: USENIX: which hotel? In-Reply-To: <19990430115553.75BBD14BFA@hub.freebsd.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hrrrm guess I should make my reservations this week, eh? -Pat ___________________________________________________________________________ Pat Lynch lynch@rush.net Systems Administrator Rush Networking "Wow, everyone looks different in Real Life (tm)"- Nathan Dorfman meeting people at FUNY "Suicide is painless, switching to NT isn't."- Unknown ___________________________________________________________________________ On Fri, 30 Apr 1999, Jonathan M. Bresler wrote: > > > > I see that there are two different hotels associated with USENIX this > > year. Where are people planning to stay? > > > > > the doubletree. > > jmb > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 30 6:47:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE83114D07; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 06:47:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.2/8.9.1) id PAA28748; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 15:47:01 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Cc: W Gerald Hicks , adrian@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: Adding desktop support References: <199904290441.AAA02012@bellsouth.net> <37281E66.7AAF71A3@newsguy.com> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 30 Apr 1999 15:47:01 +0200 In-Reply-To: "Daniel C. Sobral"'s message of "Thu, 29 Apr 1999 17:55:02 +0900" Message-ID: Lines: 20 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Daniel C. Sobral" writes: > W Gerald Hicks wrote: > > > I find it really curious that layered filesystems seem to never be > > > considered for the jobs they were created for. > > Filesystem layering is not in very good shape right now, although > > Eivind has been spotted making good progress. > AFAIK, he is making the existing fs (more specifically nullfs and > maybe unionfs) work, not correcting any existing flaw in the > layering code. He is fixing the (currently completely bogus) vnode locking system so it will actually lock vnodes. The downside is, our current NFS implementation relies on vnode locking being broken. Fixing stacking layers will break NFS. That's my understanding of the matter, anyway. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 30 10: 0:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from etinc.com (et-gw.etinc.com [207.252.1.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25BC8150A4 for ; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 10:00:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dennis@etinc.com) Received: from dbsys (dbsys.etinc.com [207.252.1.18]) by etinc.com (8.8.8/8.6.9) with SMTP id MAA04293 for ; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 12:59:29 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199904301659.MAA04293@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 11:53:45 -0400 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: Dennis Subject: Loading lkms in 3.1R Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG modload whatever.o always returns a "malformed input file"....no matter what module I try to install. Any hints? Dennis To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 30 10: 7:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns1.yes.no (ns1.yes.no [195.204.136.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0226C14E20 for ; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 10:07:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eivind@bitbox.follo.net) Received: from bitbox.follo.net (bitbox.follo.net [195.204.143.218]) by ns1.yes.no (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id TAA08740; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 19:07:08 +0200 (CEST) Received: (from eivind@localhost) by bitbox.follo.net (8.8.8/8.8.6) id TAA11452; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 19:07:07 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 19:07:06 +0200 From: Eivind Eklund To: Peter Jeremy Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, bright@rush.net Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT Message-ID: <19990430190706.A11334@bitbox.follo.net> References: <99Apr13.143255est.40354@border.alcanet.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <99Apr13.143255est.40354@border.alcanet.com.au>; from Peter Jeremy on Tue, Apr 13, 1999 at 02:46:10PM +1000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Apr 13, 1999 at 02:46:10PM +1000, Peter Jeremy wrote: > Alfred Perlstein wrote: > >> - Insert Your Favorite Vapor Feature: ____________________________ > > > >sparc64, LFS... *hides* > > To quote from the relevant FreeBSD LINT log entry: > > If you want to play with it, you can find the final version of the > code in the repository the tag LFS_RETIREMENT. > > If somebody makes LFS work again, adding it back is certainly > desireable, but as it is now nobody seems to care much about it, > and it has suffered considerable bitrot since its somewhat haphazard > integration. > > Several other people have commented that NetBSD has got it going. > How difficult would it be to merge the NetBSD stuff? Very - the problems are in the directions the VM system has taken. NetBSDs work in this area is unlikely to be useful, I think - AFAIK, even with UVM they haven't gone to a fully merged VM/buffer cache. I would be happy to be proved wrong, of course. Eivind. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 30 10:13:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0921C15949 for ; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 10:13:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA20400; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 12:32:18 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 12:32:14 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Dennis Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Loading lkms in 3.1R In-Reply-To: <199904301659.MAA04293@etinc.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 30 Apr 1999, Dennis wrote: > > modload whatever.o > > always returns a "malformed input file"....no matter what module I try to > install. Any hints? use kldload. -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 30 10:37:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns1.yes.no (ns1.yes.no [195.204.136.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8794114BD2; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 10:37:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eivind@bitbox.follo.net) Received: from bitbox.follo.net (bitbox.follo.net [195.204.143.218]) by ns1.yes.no (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id TAA09130; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 19:37:44 +0200 (CEST) Received: (from eivind@localhost) by bitbox.follo.net (8.8.8/8.8.6) id TAA11676; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 19:37:43 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 19:37:43 +0200 From: Eivind Eklund To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Cc: W Gerald Hicks , adrian@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: Adding desktop support Message-ID: <19990430193743.B11334@bitbox.follo.net> References: <199904290441.AAA02012@bellsouth.net> <37281E66.7AAF71A3@newsguy.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <37281E66.7AAF71A3@newsguy.com>; from Daniel C. Sobral on Thu, Apr 29, 1999 at 05:55:02PM +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Apr 29, 1999 at 05:55:02PM +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > W Gerald Hicks wrote: > > > > > I find it really curious that layered filesystems seem to never be > > > considered for the jobs they were created for. > > > > Filesystem layering is not in very good shape right now, although > > Eivind has been spotted making good progress. > > AFAIK, he is making the existing fs (more specifically nullfs and > maybe unionfs) work, not correcting any existing flaw in the > layering code. I'm fixing bugs in the layering code. I've also fixed a couple of bugs in NULLFS itself (seems to be "bit-rot", actually, due to people doing changes elsewhere without propagating them), but the main part of the work is on the infrastructure. Main problems so far: * v_object is attached to the vnode as a property, instead of having a call to get hold of it. In most cases, this is wrong. * The locking protocol for vnodes is NOT being followed. It seems to be more or less completely ignored. (That's a little unfair, but there is a whole host of bugs). My present state is that I have patches that seems to fix the first issue (but I'm not certain they're correct - they need me to re-review them, and to test them in an environment where locking actually works); these are at http://www.freebsd.org/~eivind/FixNULL.patch These give a locked vnode problem if run with the present kernel; I'm not sure if this is due to bugs in the locking in the kernel or bugs in the patches. In order to clean out the locking problems of the kernel (so I can work on problems that are only in my patches, instead of the interaction between a buggy kernel and my patches) I also have ported vnode_if.sh to perl and made it emit locking assertions; this is at http://www.freebsd.org/~eivind/vnode_if_asserts.pl I'm presently working privately on getting a kernel with locking assertions enabled to actually boot. I have not gotten far enough to be able to mount a read-write filesystem; I don't know how much longer it will take. As I said, there seems to be a lot of bugs. Eivind. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 30 11:22:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bootp.sls.usu.edu (bootp.sls.usu.edu [129.123.82.251]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7538151E3 for ; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 11:22:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kurto@bootp.sls.usu.edu) Received: (from kurto@localhost) by bootp.sls.usu.edu (8.8.2/8.8.2) id MAA03994 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 12:22:21 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 12:22:21 -0600 (MDT) From: Kurt Olsen Message-Id: <199904301822.MAA03994@bootp.sls.usu.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: q3test Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In case anybody cares, the linux emulation is good enough to run the new q3test from id. Now all I need to do is get my usb mouse talkin', hack up a vesa based x-server for my i740 and I would be able to play for more than 10 minutes at a time. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 30 11:58:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mars.aros.net (mail.aros.net [207.173.16.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1271E154FC; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 11:58:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from msanders@shell.aros.net) Received: from shell.aros.net (root@shell.aros.net [207.173.16.19]) by mars.aros.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id MAA27413; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 12:58:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.aros.net (msanders@localhost.aros.net [127.0.0.1]) by shell.aros.net (8.9.3/8.9.3a) with ESMTP id MAA98176; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 12:58:29 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199904301858.MAA98176@shell.aros.net> X-Attribution: msanders From: "Michael K. Sanders" To: Eivind Eklund Cc: Peter Jeremy , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, bright@rush.net Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 30 Apr 1999 19:07:06 +0200." <19990430190706.A11334@bitbox.follo.net> X-Mailer: MH 6.8.3 Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 12:58:29 -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <19990430190706.A11334@bitbox.follo.net>, Eivind Eklund writes: [ ... LFS ... ] >> Several other people have commented that NetBSD has got it going. >> How difficult would it be to merge the NetBSD stuff? > >Very - the problems are in the directions the VM system has taken. >NetBSDs work in this area is unlikely to be useful, I think - AFAIK, >even with UVM they haven't gone to a fully merged VM/buffer cache. I >would be happy to be proved wrong, of course. It's not unified yet, but work is being done in that area. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 30 12: 0:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailhub.psn.ie (mailhub.psn.ie [194.106.150.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65DAD155D9; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 12:00:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ad@netbsd.org) Received: from vmunix.psn.ie ([194.106.150.252]) by mailhub.psn.ie with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #3) id 10dI2k-000KVh-00; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 19:29:46 +0100 Received: from localhost.psn.ie ([127.0.0.1] helo=localhost) by vmunix.psn.ie with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #1) id 10dI1z-00006R-00; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 19:28:59 +0100 Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 19:28:59 +0100 (IST) From: Andy Doran X-Sender: ad@vmunix.psn.ie To: Eivind Eklund Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT In-Reply-To: <19990430190706.A11334@bitbox.follo.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 30 Apr 1999, Eivind Eklund wrote: [About LFS] > even with UVM they haven't gone to a fully merged VM/buffer cache. I You're right, NetBSD doesn't have merged VM/buffer cache just yet. A substantial number of bugs were squashed in the LFS code. Getting diffs of -current LFS code against older RCS versions in the NetBSD tree would probably be useful to see the changes. The person to talk to about this AFAIR, is perseant@NetBSD.org (although don't hold me to this). > NetBSDs work in this area is unlikely to be useful, I think - AFAIK, It would be a shame to end up with two quite different implementations. Andy. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 30 12: 3:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from feral.com (feral.com [192.67.166.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C1B4014BFA; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 12:03:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mjacob@feral.com) Received: from feral.com (mjacob@feral.com [192.67.166.1]) by feral.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA03063; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 12:03:03 -0700 Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 12:03:02 -0700 (PWT) From: Matthew Jacob Reply-To: mjacob@feral.com To: Andy Doran Cc: Eivind Eklund , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > even with UVM they haven't gone to a fully merged VM/buffer cache. I Chuck Silvers is getting pretty close to being done with this. He asked me to do some testing for him of it at NASA/Ames. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 30 13: 4: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lestat.nas.nasa.gov (lestat.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.50.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 44A9D14BD8; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 13:03:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from thorpej@lestat.nas.nasa.gov) Received: from lestat (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lestat.nas.nasa.gov (8.8.8/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA17973; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 13:03:56 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199904302003.NAA17973@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> To: Andy Doran Cc: Eivind Eklund , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Some ideas on the evolution of -CURRENT Reply-To: Jason Thorpe From: Jason Thorpe Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 13:03:55 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 30 Apr 1999 19:28:59 +0100 (IST) Andy Doran wrote: > On Fri, 30 Apr 1999, Eivind Eklund wrote: > > [About LFS] > > > even with UVM they haven't gone to a fully merged VM/buffer cache. I > > You're right, NetBSD doesn't have merged VM/buffer cache just yet. A ...however, Chuck Silvers is doing work on it on a source branch. It's called "UBC", like the unified buffer cache in Tru64 UNIX (formerly Digital UNIX (formerly DEC OSF/1)). -- Jason R. Thorpe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 30 19:27:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from at.dotat.com (zed.dotat.com [203.2.134.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB57715938; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 19:27:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hart@at.dotat.com) Received: from at.dotat.com (localhost.dotat.com [127.0.0.1]) by at.dotat.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA11042; Sat, 1 May 1999 11:59:19 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199905010229.LAA11042@at.dotat.com> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Voice recog. from IBM soon.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 29 Apr 1999 03:25:18 MST." <199904291025.DAA23645@rah.star-gate.com> Date: Sat, 01 May 1999 11:59:19 +0930 From: Leigh Hart Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi all, Amancio Hasty wrote: > > {hasty} tar -tf viavoice_sdk_rtk.tar > ViaVoice_runtime-1.0-1.0.i386.rpm > tar: Unexpected EOF on archive file I've got it all happening apart from what seems to be an obvious missing dependancy on my system, specifically: libstdc++-libc6.1-1.so.2 which I presume is why I get: /usr/lib/ViaVoice/bin/vvuseradm: error in loading shared libraries /usr/lib/libsmapi.so: undefined symbol: __bzero when I try to run vvsetenv to get started (and any other ViaVoice app). Anyone have any clues? Cheers Leigh -- | "By the time they had diminished | Leigh Hart, | | from 50 to 8, the other dwarves | CCNA - http://www.cisco.com/ | | began to suspect 'Hungry' ..." | GPO Box 487 Adelaide SA 5001 | | -- Gary Larson, "The Far Side" | http://www.dotat.com/hart/ | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Apr 30 21:37:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94FDB151FA for ; Fri, 30 Apr 1999 21:37:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id NAA22521; Sat, 1 May 1999 13:37:14 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <372A8469.27DE508A@newsguy.com> Date: Sat, 01 May 1999 13:34:49 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dennis Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Loading lkms in 3.1R References: <199904301659.MAA04293@etinc.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Dennis wrote: > > modload whatever.o > > always returns a "malformed input file"....no matter what module I try to > install. Any hints? Do you have "options LKM" in your kernel? -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com dcs@freebsd.org "Proof of Trotsky's farsightedness if that _none_ of his predictions have come true yet." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 1 0:57:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au (adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.36.247]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 764C015052 for ; Sat, 1 May 1999 00:57:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kkennawa@physics.adelaide.edu.au) Received: from bragg (bragg [129.127.36.34]) by adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8/UofA-1.5) with SMTP id RAA08599 for ; Sat, 1 May 1999 17:27:47 +0930 (CST) Received: from localhost by bragg; (5.65/1.1.8.2/05Aug95-0227PM) id AA31122; Sat, 1 May 1999 17:28:21 +0930 Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 17:28:21 +0930 (CST) From: Kris Kennaway X-Sender: kkennawa@bragg To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: softupdates still alpha? Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG /usr/src/sys/ufs/ffs/README.softupdates contains the following warning: IMPORTANT NOTE: The Soft Updates code is currently in ALPHA test. Use at your own risk! Is this still a valid comment? I haven't seen or experienced any softupdates-related problems for ages.. Kris ----- The Feynman problem-solving algorithm: 1. Write down the problem 2. Think real hard 3. Write down the solution To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 1 1: 9:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bleep.ishiboo.com (gw.spinlock.com [206.165.173.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 95D2014F56 for ; Sat, 1 May 1999 01:09:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nirva@ishiboo.com) Received: (qmail 10887 invoked by uid 1000); 1 May 1999 08:10:21 -0000 Date: 1 May 1999 08:10:21 -0000 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline From: nirva@ishiboo.com (Danny Dulai) To: hart@at.dotat.com (Leigh Hart), freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Voice recog. from IBM soon.. Reply-To: nirva@ishiboo.com (Danny Dulai) X-Mailer: Liam [version 0.7] In-Reply-To: <199905010229.LAA11042@at.dotat.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 05/01/99, Leigh Hart said: > >Hi all, > >Amancio Hasty wrote: >>=20 >> {hasty} tar -tf viavoice_sdk_rtk.tar >> ViaVoice_runtime-1.0-1.0.i386.rpm >> tar: Unexpected EOF on archive file =20 > >I've got it all happening apart from what seems to be an obvious >missing dependancy on my system, specifically: > >libstdc++-libc6.1-1.so.2=20 its in redhat-6.0 libstdc++ rpm's ___________________________________________________________________________ Danny Dulai Feet. Pumice. Lotion. http://www.ishiboo.com/~nirva/ nirva@ishiboo.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 1 5:39:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from at.dotat.com (zed.dotat.com [203.2.134.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 098EF150F0; Sat, 1 May 1999 05:38:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hart@at.dotat.com) Received: from at.dotat.com (localhost.dotat.com [127.0.0.1]) by at.dotat.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA12346; Sat, 1 May 1999 22:09:56 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199905011239.WAA12346@at.dotat.com> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Voice recog. from IBM soon.. In-reply-to: Your message of "01 May 1999 08:10:21 GMT." Date: Sat, 01 May 1999 22:09:56 +0930 From: Leigh Hart Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG So has anyone *actually* got this working on FreeBSD yet? If so, can they please post a summary of effort required to one of these lists and me personally so I can get it working :-) It's driving me nuts :) I'm running on FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT #0: Wed Mar 31 13:43:57 CST 1999 Cheers Leigh -- | "By the time they had diminished | Leigh Hart, | | from 50 to 8, the other dwarves | CCNA - http://www.cisco.com/ | | began to suspect 'Hungry' ..." | GPO Box 487 Adelaide SA 5001 | | -- Gary Larson, "The Far Side" | http://www.dotat.com/hart/ | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 1 8:17:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from trem.cnt.org.br (trem.cnt.org.br [200.19.123.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60B80150C0 for ; Sat, 1 May 1999 08:17:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ormonde@aker.com.br) Received: from fire2 ([10.2.0.14]) by trem.cnt.org.br (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA08349 for ; Sat, 1 May 1999 12:04:40 -0300 (EST) (envelope-from ormonde@aker.com.br) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19990501122021.0069eac8@cnt.org.br> X-Sender: ormonde@cnt.org.br X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Sat, 01 May 1999 12:20:21 -0300 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: Rodrigo Ormonde Subject: Problems with a device KLD module Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I wrote a device kld module for FreeBSD 3.1. The module is working fine, however there are two problems I was unable to solve: 1 - I can load the module several times using kldload, which should not be possible (the old lkm interface didn't let this happen). In order to prevent the module for being loaded twice, I wrote the events function to return EBUSY when receiving the MOD_LOAD command if the module was already loaded, but it didn't work. 2 - I can unload the module even if the device it is controlling is being used by an application. In this case, when I kill the application (after unloading the module) the kernel panics. I tried to return EBUSY when receiving the MOD_UNLOAD command, in order to prevent the module of being unloaded. This worked in part: the kldunload reported the module was busy and didn't unloaded it, however, the device no longer operated. No applications were able to access it anymore. Does anyone know how to prevent a kld module of being loaded twice and how to prevent it of being unloaded when the device it controls is in use ? Please send a copy of the answers directly to me, I'm not on the list. Thanks in advance, -- Rodrigo de La Rocque Ormonde e-mail: ormonde@aker.com.br Aker Consultoria e Informatica LTDA - http:///www.aker.com.br --> Turn your PC into a workstation. Use FreeBSD <-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 1 12:52:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pootpoot.com (adsl-216-101-109-17.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [216.101.109.17]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 956C815124 for ; Sat, 1 May 1999 12:52:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dlowe@pootpoot.com) Received: (qmail 14998 invoked by uid 1000); 1 May 1999 19:56:50 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 1 May 1999 19:56:50 -0000 Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 12:56:50 -0700 (PDT) From: David Lowe To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: adduser, rmuser, and perl... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hacker folks - I found myself hacking up adduser the other day, and I had some thoughts. First, since FreeBSD has finally caught ships with perl5, adduser (and other perl shipped with FreeBSD) could be rewritten to take advantage of the many improvements of perl5 over perl4. Most of this would be cosmetic & 'perl-anal' stuff like lexically scoping variables, 'use strict' and '/usr/bin/perl -w' (roughly equivalent to gcc -Wall) and using the object-oriented IO subsystem. Basically, switching from perl-as-scripting-language to perl-as-programming-language. Second, I thought it would be nice to provide for easy added functionality on a per-site basis, without having to edit the main adduser script. Something like: 'local-stuff = "/usr/local/bin/adduser-extra"' in /etc/adduser.conf, where the script $local-stuff would be called with all of the new user's data as arguments. Those are my thoughts. My questions, then, are: is anyone currently working on adduser? I searched the list archives and turned up nothing since August '97. Anyone? And would these changes be welcome? I have some spare cycles right now I could apply to this, but is this a case best left untouched - "If it works, don't fix it" or are changes/improvements welcome? Finally, are there any perl people working on FreeBSD in general? I mean, there are a number of perl programs in the core distribution, but they're all looking very perl4ish to me. Again, perhaps I could apply some of those spare cycles here. : : : J. David Lowe :: dlowe@pootpoot.com :: http://pootpoot.com : : : : "The secret to happiness is short-term, stupid self-interest!" : : - Calvin, /Calvin and Hobbes/ : :: fingerprint: 1F E7 D3 24 04 18 72 67 CC E6 66 1B 79 79 CB 3A :: To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 1 13: 2:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gateway.cybernet.com (gateway.cybernet.com [192.245.33.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D42814C82; Sat, 1 May 1999 13:02:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mtaylor@cybernet.com) Received: from gateway.cybernet.com (gateway.cybernet.com [192.245.33.1]) by gateway.cybernet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id QAA17461; Sat, 1 May 1999 16:02:43 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from mtaylor@cybernet.com) Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 16:02:43 -0400 (EDT) From: "Mark J. Taylor" To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-announce@freebsd.org Subject: Quake3 Arena Test: complete install instructions Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG http://www.cybernet.com/~mtaylor/q3ahowto.html The "Quake3 Arena Test" software from id is a really huge thing in gaming (it has been said that its only competition is the upcoming "Star Wars" movie), and I wanted people to know that it works and IS FULLY FUNCTIONAL on a FreeBSD 3.1 system using the Linux emulation. Sound, full-screen 3D, etc. I've been playing in on a dual PII-350... Thanks to the FreeBSD team for the EXCELLENT Linux emulation! This should be all that you need to get going to play q3a on your FreeBSD 3.1 system (all relevant files are linked off of it): http://www.cybernet.com/~mtaylor/q3ahowto.html BTW: I am in no way responsible for any damages done by installing any of this software. If it melts your PC, just remember that I said "YMMV". :) If there are any errors on the web page, or something that I missed, please feel free to contact me. Oh yeah- Quake2 works pretty much the same way... -Mark Taylor NetMAX developer mtaylor@netmax.com Cybernet Systems Corporation http://www.netmax.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 1 13:55:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91A0814BEC for ; Sat, 1 May 1999 13:55:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA08599; Sat, 1 May 1999 16:53:41 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 16:53:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: David Lowe Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: adduser, rmuser, and perl... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 1 May 1999, David Lowe wrote: > Those are my thoughts. My questions, then, are: is anyone currently > working on adduser? Realize no one is going to chime in "no", because there isn't any central "I do this" registry. If you don't get an "I do" response in several days, then you have to interpret it as "we don't". Possible exception, many folks don't real -hackers anymore due to it's increased noise level. I think you don't need to be all that concerned, tho. I searched the list archives and turned up nothing > since August '97. Anyone? And would these changes be welcome? Do one, and post it, let's see. If it's well written, could be. You have to understand, no one is going to give you a yes or no, you can't have that until you show code. It's certainly been asked before, and in fact some folks got really huffy about not being given a carte blanche to work in a certain area, with prior understanding that their work would be contributed. That will NEVER happen ... do your work, pick a target that won't be the largest, perhaps, and give it a trial run. Our system works pretty well, you'll see. It's not perfect, but no one has found a better way, yet. ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 1 14:25:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 106B315140 for ; Sat, 1 May 1999 14:25:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id OAA79115; Sat, 1 May 1999 14:25:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 14:25:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199905012125.OAA79115@apollo.backplane.com> To: Kris Kennaway Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: softupdates still alpha? References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :/usr/src/sys/ufs/ffs/README.softupdates contains the following warning: : :IMPORTANT NOTE: The Soft Updates code is currently in ALPHA test. :Use at your own risk! : :Is this still a valid comment? I haven't seen or experienced any :softupdates-related problems for ages.. : :Kris I think the only known bugs right now occur sometimes when the filesystem runs out of space. I would say that softupdates is essentially production quality. I've been using it on all my systems for months with no problems beyond a few esoteric issues. A couple of problems showed up when I began softupdates on swap-backed VN volumes. Those have now been solved. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 1 14:28:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from feral.com (feral.com [192.67.166.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB16114CC8 for ; Sat, 1 May 1999 14:28:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mjacob@feral.com) Received: from feral.com (mjacob@feral.com [192.67.166.1]) by feral.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA17134; Sat, 1 May 1999 14:28:06 -0700 Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 14:28:06 -0700 (PWT) From: Matthew Jacob Reply-To: mjacob@feral.com To: Matthew Dillon Cc: Kris Kennaway , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: softupdates still alpha? In-Reply-To: <199905012125.OAA79115@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > I think the only known bugs right now occur sometimes when the filesystem > runs out of space. I would say that softupdates is essentially > production quality. I've been using it on all my systems for months > with no problems beyond a few esoteric issues. A couple of problems > showed up when I began softupdates on swap-backed VN volumes. Those have > now been solved. What about the 'do not use with DEVFS' ? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 1 14:29:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 607771529F for ; Sat, 1 May 1999 14:29:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id OAA79750; Sat, 1 May 1999 14:29:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 14:29:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199905012129.OAA79750@apollo.backplane.com> To: Matthew Jacob Cc: Kris Kennaway , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: softupdates still alpha? References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> I think the only known bugs right now occur sometimes when the filesystem :> runs out of space. I would say that softupdates is essentially :> production quality. I've been using it on all my systems for months :> with no problems beyond a few esoteric issues. A couple of problems :> showed up when I began softupdates on swap-backed VN volumes. Those have :> now been solved. : :What about the 'do not use with DEVFS' ? Better to say "Do not use DEVFS". DevFS's problems have little to do with softupdates. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 1 16:51:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.adinet.com.uy (mail.adinet.com.uy [206.99.44.235]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2295815197 for ; Sat, 1 May 1999 16:51:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ang@adinet.com.uy) Received: from adinet.com.uy (r243-161.adinet.com.uy [207.50.243.161]) by mail.adinet.com.uy (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id UAA18775 for ; Sat, 1 May 1999 20:51:23 -0300 (GMT) Message-ID: <372B93CF.9050025B@adinet.com.uy> Date: Sat, 01 May 1999 20:52:48 -0300 From: Angelo Nardone X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: bktr (brooktree device) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I have a 3.1-stable, and I included the "bktr" device in my local config for create a new kernel. I generated the directory, and when I made "make depend" i had the messages that the file "smbus_if.h" , "iicbus_if.h" and "iicbb_if.h" doesn't exist. And dos not exists, but the files "smbus_if.m" ,"iicbus_if.m" and "iicbb_if.m" exists. I can't compile the kernel, the files with the problems are "brooktree848.c" and bt848_i2c.c". Do somebody know what is the problem ? Thanks. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 1 17:20:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (blaubaer.kn-bremen.de [194.94.232.249]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7847114CA3; Sat, 1 May 1999 17:20:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nox@saturn.kn-bremen.de) Received: from saturn.kn-bremen.de (uucp@localhost) by blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (8.9.1/8.9.1) with UUCP id BAA07441; Sun, 2 May 1999 01:21:58 +0200 Received: (from nox@localhost) by saturn.kn-bremen.de (8.9.3/8.8.5) id CAA04722; Sun, 2 May 1999 02:15:00 +0200 (MET DST) From: Juergen Lock Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 02:15:00 +0200 To: Seigo TANIMURA Cc: zinnia@jan.ne.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports Message-ID: <19990502021500.A3181@saturn.kn-bremen.de> References: <19990418221505.A86834@saturn.kn-bremen.de> <199904200127.KAA92159@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199904200127.KAA92159@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp>; from Seigo TANIMURA on Tue, Apr 20, 1999 at 10:27:35AM +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Apr 20, 1999 at 10:27:35AM +0900, Seigo TANIMURA wrote: > On Sun, 18 Apr 1999 22:15:05 +0200, > Juergen Lock said: > > >> Another bad news, I tried driving my SC-88 connected directly to a PC using > >> Windows 95 and Portman PC/S driver, to find a miserable result. I saw no midi > >> messages come properly, so Portman PC/S should be cooking the signals in some way... > > nox> Or uses a higher speed than 38k4, can you check that? Hmm, or maybe > nox> i should just take my old Atari MSTe and use that as serial<->midi > nox> interface... > > > Bitrate > 38.4k... I wish I had a looooong serial cable. The PC I had a test > on the Portman driver is not in my room, and it is not a portable one. > > Atari, I have only heard the name. I played with an Acorn when I was a kiwi. Acorn, what CPU did it have again? :) Anyway I now have restored the m68k-atari crosscompiler from tape and made a little /dev/midi <-> /dev/modem2 connection program. Well, it works! Now, does anyone know a sequencer program that has a tick display and that can record one track while playing back another? rosegarden can only do one thing at a time... Oh and i had to patch this to get my kernel to build: Index: i386/conf/files.i386 @@ -225,8 +225,10 @@ i386/isa/sound/uart6850.c optional uart device-driver i386/isa/sound/uart16550.c optional uartsio device-driver i386/isa/sound/midi_synth.c optional uart device-driver +i386/isa/sound/midi_synth.c optional uartsio device-driver i386/isa/sound/midi_synth.c optional css device-driver i386/isa/sound/midibuf.c optional uart device-driver +i386/isa/sound/midibuf.c optional uartsio device-driver i386/isa/sound/midibuf.c optional css device-driver i386/isa/sound/trix.c optional trix device-driver i386/isa/sound/adlib_card.c optional trix device-driver (the box has no sound card so these files were not compiled before.) If anyone wants the program i use on the atari mail me, it is only 111 lines of C... Happy MIDI'ing, -- Juergen Lock (remove dot foo from address to reply) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 1 18:19:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (blaubaer.kn-bremen.de [194.94.232.249]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3BACC15040; Sat, 1 May 1999 18:19:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nox@saturn.kn-bremen.de) Received: from saturn.kn-bremen.de (uucp@localhost) by blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (8.9.1/8.9.1) with UUCP id CAA09171; Sun, 2 May 1999 02:20:36 +0200 Received: (from nox@localhost) by saturn.kn-bremen.de (8.9.3/8.8.5) id DAA07254; Sun, 2 May 1999 03:17:42 +0200 (MET DST) From: Juergen Lock Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 03:17:42 +0200 To: Seigo TANIMURA Cc: zinnia@jan.ne.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Call for Review: Voxware midi driver for serial ports Message-ID: <19990502031742.A7250@saturn.kn-bremen.de> References: <19990418221505.A86834@saturn.kn-bremen.de> <199904200127.KAA92159@rina.naklab.dnj.ynu.ac.jp> <19990502021500.A3181@saturn.kn-bremen.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <19990502021500.A3181@saturn.kn-bremen.de>; from Juergen Lock on Sun, May 02, 1999 at 02:15:00AM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, May 02, 1999 at 02:15:00AM +0200, Juergen Lock wrote: > Anyway I now have restored the m68k-atari crosscompiler from tape and made > a little /dev/midi <-> /dev/modem2 connection program. Well, it works! > Now, does anyone know a sequencer program that has a tick display and > that can record one track while playing back another? rosegarden can only > do one thing at a time... >... I forgot to say i'm not on the -multimedia list so please Cc answers to me... Thanx, -- Juergen Lock (remove dot foo from address to reply) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 1 18:39:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tch.org (tacostand.tch.org [199.74.220.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF33314CC3 for ; Sat, 1 May 1999 18:39:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ser@tch.org) Received: (from ser@localhost) by tch.org (8.9.1/8.9.1) id SAA26120; Sat, 1 May 1999 18:39:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ser) Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 18:39:00 -0700 From: Steve Rubin To: Angelo Nardone Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: bktr (brooktree device) Message-ID: <19990501183900.A26114@tch.org> References: <372B93CF.9050025B@adinet.com.uy> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <372B93CF.9050025B@adinet.com.uy>; from Angelo Nardone on Sat, May 01, 1999 at 08:52:48PM -0300 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG My current config for my WinTV card looks like this.. device bktr0 # WinTV card controller smbus0 device smb0 at smbus? controller iicbus0 device ic0 at iicbus? device iic0 at iicbus? device iicsmb0 at iicbus? device iicbb0 at iicbus? On Sat, May 01, 1999 at 08:52:48PM -0300, Angelo Nardone wrote: > I have a 3.1-stable, and I included the "bktr" device in my local config > for create a new kernel. > I generated the directory, and when I made "make depend" i had the > messages that the file "smbus_if.h" , "iicbus_if.h" and "iicbb_if.h" > doesn't exist. And dos not exists, but the files "smbus_if.m" > ,"iicbus_if.m" and "iicbb_if.m" exists. > I can't compile the kernel, the files with the problems are > "brooktree848.c" and bt848_i2c.c". > Do somebody know what is the problem ? > Thanks. > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- Steve Rubin ser@tch.org TCH Network Services http://www.tch.org/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 1 19:25:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp13.bellglobal.com (smtp13.bellglobal.com [204.101.251.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFD6D151A0 for ; Sat, 1 May 1999 19:25:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from vanderh@ecf.toronto.edu) Received: from localhost.nowhere (Hamilton-ppp44895.sympatico.ca [206.172.76.88]) by smtp13.bellglobal.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA14959; Sat, 1 May 1999 22:26:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from tim@localhost) by localhost.nowhere (8.9.3/8.9.1) id SAA92142; Sat, 1 May 1999 18:24:04 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from tim) Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 18:24:04 -0400 From: Tim Vanderhoek To: Chuck Robey Cc: David Lowe , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: adduser, rmuser, and perl... Message-ID: <19990501182404.A92090@mad> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i In-Reply-To: ; from Chuck Robey on Sat, May 01, 1999 at 04:53:41PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, May 01, 1999 at 04:53:41PM -0400, Chuck Robey wrote: > On Sat, 1 May 1999, David Lowe wrote: > > > Those are my thoughts. My questions, then, are: is anyone currently > > working on adduser? > > Realize no one is going to chime in "no", because there isn't any See FAQ 8.2. Supposedly Ollivier is working on a "new-account" package. This could well be some outdated 60's thing, but you probably should check with him, first. ollivier@FreeBSD.ORG -- This .sig is not innovative, witty, or profund. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun May 2 1:49:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from awfulhak.org (awfulhak.force9.co.uk [195.166.136.63]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BD241519B for ; Sun, 2 May 1999 01:49:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brian@lan.awfulhak.org) Received: from keep.lan.Awfulhak.org (root@keep.lan.Awfulhak.org [172.16.0.8]) by awfulhak.org (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id JAA09051; Sun, 2 May 1999 09:42:38 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from brian@lan.awfulhak.org) Received: from keep.lan.Awfulhak.org (brian@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by keep.lan.Awfulhak.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA40738; Sun, 2 May 1999 09:42:17 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from brian@keep.lan.Awfulhak.org) Message-Id: <199905020842.JAA40738@keep.lan.Awfulhak.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Steve Rubin Cc: Angelo Nardone , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: bktr (brooktree device) In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 01 May 1999 18:39:00 PDT." <19990501183900.A26114@tch.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 02 May 1999 09:42:17 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > My current config for my WinTV card looks like this.. > > device bktr0 # WinTV card > controller smbus0 > device smb0 at smbus? > controller iicbus0 > device ic0 at iicbus? > device iic0 at iicbus? > device iicsmb0 at iicbus? > device iicbb0 at iicbus? iicbb0 should be a controller according to LINT. -- Brian Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour ! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun May 2 2: 8:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from frmug.org (frmug-gw.frmug.org [193.56.58.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF558159CC for ; Sun, 2 May 1999 02:08:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by frmug.org (8.9.1/frmug-2.3/nospam) with UUCP id LAA01160; Sun, 2 May 1999 11:07:43 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Received: by keltia.freenix.fr (Postfix, from userid 101) id A87818840; Sun, 2 May 1999 10:38:12 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from roberto) Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 10:38:12 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: Tim Vanderhoek Cc: Chuck Robey , David Lowe , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: adduser, rmuser, and perl... Message-ID: <19990502103812.A3022@keltia.freenix.fr> Mail-Followup-To: Tim Vanderhoek , Chuck Robey , David Lowe , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <19990501182404.A92090@mad> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/0.95.5i In-Reply-To: <19990501182404.A92090@mad>; from Tim Vanderhoek on Sat, May 01, 1999 at 06:24:04PM -0400 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT/ELF ctm#5244 AMD-K6 MMX @ 200 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG According to Tim Vanderhoek: > See FAQ 8.2. Supposedly Ollivier is working on a "new-account" > package. This could well be some outdated 60's thing, but you > probably should check with him, first. I should remove that comment... new-account is a Perl4 script and was written before pw(8) existed. I don't maintain it anymore as pw(8) does everything new-account does (and some more now). > ollivier@FreeBSD.ORG Wrong :-) -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 4.0-CURRENT #2: Fri Apr 16 22:37:03 CEST 1999 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun May 2 4:50:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gratis.grondar.za (gratis.grondar.za [196.7.18.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8295114C59 for ; Sun, 2 May 1999 04:49:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mark@grondar.za) Received: from greenpeace.grondar.za (greenpeace.grondar.za [196.7.18.132]) by gratis.grondar.za (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA35904; Sun, 2 May 1999 13:49:46 +0200 (SAST) (envelope-from mark@grondar.za) Received: from grondar.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by greenpeace.grondar.za (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA00970; Sun, 2 May 1999 13:49:32 +0200 (SAST) (envelope-from mark@grondar.za) Message-Id: <199905021149.NAA00970@greenpeace.grondar.za> To: David Lowe Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: adduser, rmuser, and perl... In-Reply-To: Your message of " Sat, 01 May 1999 12:56:50 MST." References: Date: Sun, 02 May 1999 13:49:27 +0200 From: Mark Murray Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG David Lowe wrote: > Finally, are there any perl people working on FreeBSD in general? I mean, > there are a number of perl programs in the core distribution, but they're > all looking very perl4ish to me. Again, perhaps I could apply some of > those spare cycles here. Me. M -- Mark Murray Join the anti-SPAM movement: http://www.cauce.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun May 2 9: 0: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fionn.sports.gov.uk (dns0.sports.gov.uk [195.89.151.148]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E81214F58 for ; Sun, 2 May 1999 08:59:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ad@fionn.sports.gov.uk) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] ident=ad) by fionn.sports.gov.uk with smtp (Exim 2.10 #1) id 10dza5-00079e-00; Sun, 2 May 1999 16:59:05 +0000 Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 16:59:00 +0000 (GMT) From: Andy Doran X-Sender: ad@dns0.sports.gov.uk To: David Lowe Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: adduser, rmuser, and perl... In-Reply-To: <19990501182404.A92090@mad> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'm working on something a *lot* more powerful right now. (Actually nothing to do with FreeBSD, but BSD in general). Let me know if you're interested and I'll try to find a stable version. Andy. On Sat, 1 May 1999, Tim Vanderhoek wrote: > On Sat, May 01, 1999 at 04:53:41PM -0400, Chuck Robey wrote: > > On Sat, 1 May 1999, David Lowe wrote: > > > > > Those are my thoughts. My questions, then, are: is anyone currently > > > working on adduser? > > > > Realize no one is going to chime in "no", because there isn't any > > See FAQ 8.2. Supposedly Ollivier is working on a "new-account" > package. This could well be some outdated 60's thing, but you > probably should check with him, first. > > ollivier@FreeBSD.ORG > > > -- > This .sig is not innovative, witty, or profund. > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun May 2 10: 9:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F516153AE; Sun, 2 May 1999 10:09:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA61453; Sun, 2 May 1999 10:07:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199905021707.KAA61453@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Julian Elischer Cc: Dean Lombardo , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Voice recog. from IBM soon.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:40:19 PDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 02 May 1999 10:07:49 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I don't have motif for linux... {root} ./audiog ./audiog: error in loading shared libraries libXm.so.1: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun May 2 10:35:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from beelzebubba.sysabend.org (beelzebubba.sysabend.org [208.243.107.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C19C514D9E for ; Sun, 2 May 1999 10:35:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ragnar@sysabend.org) Received: by beelzebubba.sysabend.org (Postfix, from userid 1004) id 6558E4015; Sun, 2 May 1999 13:35:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by beelzebubba.sysabend.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 5AB6199F5 for ; Sun, 2 May 1999 13:35:34 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 13:35:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Jamie Bowden To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: cdrom.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Congrats on your upgrade, been seeing these every so often since then though: Can't create data socket (209.155.82.18,20): Bad file descriptor. That was attempting an ls. I also got it on a get command as well. Jamie Bowden -- If we've got to fight over grep, sign me up. But boggle can go. -Ted Faber (on Hasbro's request for removal of /usr/games/boggle) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun May 2 10:37:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from chmls05.mediaone.net (ne.mediaone.net [24.128.1.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5790D14D9E for ; Sun, 2 May 1999 10:37:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from housley@frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net) Received: from frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net (frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net [24.128.74.10]) by chmls05.mediaone.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA18495; Sun, 2 May 1999 13:37:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net (housley@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA38556; Sun, 2 May 1999 13:37:20 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from housley@frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net) Message-ID: <372C8D4F.F53D2AB8@frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net> Date: Sun, 02 May 1999 13:37:19 -0400 From: "James E. Housley" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jamie Bowden Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: cdrom.com References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jamie Bowden wrote: > > Congrats on your upgrade, been seeing these every so often since then > though: > > Can't create data socket (209.155.82.18,20): Bad file descriptor. > I also was getting that this AM, but was on an new machine I was setting up, thought it was me. But maybe not. -- James E. Housley PGP: 1024/03983B4D System Supply, Inc. 2C 3F 3A 0D A8 D8 C3 13 Pager: pagejim@notepage.com 7C F0 B5 BF 27 8B 92 FE To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun May 2 10:54:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.stox.sa.enteract.com (stox.sa.enteract.com [207.229.132.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 542EE14D8D for ; Sun, 2 May 1999 10:52:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ken@stox.sa.enteract.com) Received: from localhost (localhost.stox.sa.enteract.com [127.0.0.1]) by m4.stox.sa.enteract.com (8.9.3/8.6.12) with ESMTP id AAA02932; Sun, 2 May 1999 00:50:29 -0500 (CDT) Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 00:50:29 -0500 (CDT) From: "Kenneth P. Stox" Reply-To: stox@enteract.com To: Amancio Hasty Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Voice recog. from IBM soon.. In-Reply-To: <199905021707.KAA61453@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 2 May 1999, Amancio Hasty wrote: > I don't have motif for linux... > > {root} ./audiog > ./audiog: error in loading shared libraries > libXm.so.1: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory Well, believe it or not, IBM used lesstif not Motif. -Ken Stox stox@imagescape.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun May 2 11:16:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za (zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za [146.64.24.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D866153EA for ; Sun, 2 May 1999 11:16:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jhay@zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za) Received: (from jhay@localhost) by zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA85133; Sun, 2 May 1999 20:16:01 +0200 (SAT) (envelope-from jhay) From: John Hay Message-Id: <199905021816.UAA85133@zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za> Subject: Re: cdrom.com In-Reply-To: from Jamie Bowden at "May 2, 1999 01:35:34 pm" To: ragnar@sysabend.org (Jamie Bowden) Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 20:16:00 +0200 (SAT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL54 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > Congrats on your upgrade, been seeing these every so often since then > though: > > Can't create data socket (209.155.82.18,20): Bad file descriptor. > > That was attempting an ls. I also got it on a get command as well. > Hey, you were lucky, it still knew its own address. I just got: 425 Can't create data socket (0.0.0.0,20): Bad file descriptor. :-) John -- John Hay -- John.Hay@mikom.csir.co.za To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun May 2 11:19:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from poboxer.pobox.com (unknown [208.149.16.26]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 28FC41533C; Sun, 2 May 1999 11:19:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from alk@poboxer.pobox.com) Received: (from alk@localhost) by poboxer.pobox.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id NAA43574; Sun, 2 May 1999 13:19:36 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from alk) From: Anthony Kimball MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 13:19:36 -0500 (CDT) X-Face: \h9Jg:Cuivl4S*UP-)gO.6O=T]]@ncM*tn4zG);)lk#4|lqEx=*talx?.Gk,dMQU2)ptPC17cpBzm(l'M|H8BUF1&]dDCxZ.c~Wy6-j,^V1E(NtX$FpkkdnJixsJHE95JlhO 5\M3jh'YiO7KPCn0~W`Ro44_TB@&JuuqRqgPL'0/{):7rU-%.*@/>q?1&Ed Reply-To: alk@pobox.com To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com Cc: julian@whistle.com, dlombardo@excite.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Voice recog. from IBM soon.. References: <199905021707.KAA61453@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.43 under 20.4 "Emerald" XEmacs Lucid Message-ID: <14124.38687.402903.541661@avalon.east> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Quoth Amancio Hasty on Sun, 2 May: : I don't have motif for linux... : : {root} ./audiog : ./audiog: error in loading shared libraries : libXm.so.1: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory Use lesstif. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun May 2 12: 4:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EB92155E6; Sun, 2 May 1999 12:04:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA62076; Sun, 2 May 1999 12:02:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199905021902.MAA62076@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: alk@pobox.com Cc: julian@whistle.com, dlombardo@excite.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Voice recog. from IBM soon.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 02 May 1999 13:19:36 CDT." <14124.38687.402903.541661@avalon.east> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 02 May 1999 12:02:59 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Tnks guys! -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun May 2 12:48:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kronos.alcnet.com (kronos.alcnet.com [207.244.223.187]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9890315414 for ; Sun, 2 May 1999 12:48:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kbyanc@alcnet.com) X-Provider: ALC Communications, Inc. http://www.alcnet.com/ Received: from localhost (kbyanc@localhost) by kronos.alcnet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/antispam) with ESMTP id QAA35989 for ; Sun, 2 May 1999 16:00:20 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 16:00:20 -0400 (EDT) From: Kelly Yancey To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: new loader question / module question Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I was working on a module and need to be able to pass parameters to the module (preferably without having to compile them in). I noticed that the splash module does this (sort of) by having you load the image to display and specifying a "tag" for it so that the module can scan for the tag and find the image. I need to be able to pass more than a single configuration option though. I am considering putting all of the configuration options into a single config file, having that loaded into memory by the boot loader (much the way the splash module loads it's image) and then when the module loads it can scan memory for the configuration information and parse it. Is there a better way? Also, it got me thinking? Is there a way to "through away" the informaiton after I'm done with it. For example, in the splash module, once you load the image into memory, it's stuck there forever (ie. the "feature" that you can re-use it as a screen saver because it is still in memory). I was under the impression that we don't page kernel memory and thus the image is wired into RAM all the time (it will never be paged). Please tell me I'm wrong...because if not, doesn't this seem like a Bad Thing? Thanks for all of your help! By the way? Is anyone working on improving the splash module. With all the examining I've been doing of it recently, I would like to add the ability for it to scale the image to fit the screen size (rather than die of rimages which are too large). I was also thinking about adding XPM support so I don't have to use Windows BMP files :) anyway, those are just a couple of the ideas I thought I could implement to improve it, but I don't want to mess with it if someone else is already working on it. Thanks again! ~kbyanc@alcnet.com~ "Silly penguin, Linux is for kids" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun May 2 14:33:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from baerenklau.de.freebsd.org (baerenklau.de.freebsd.org [195.185.195.14]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B6E4A14ED8 for ; Sun, 2 May 1999 14:33:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wosch@panke.de.freebsd.org) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by baerenklau.de.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with UUCP id XAA13745; Sun, 2 May 1999 23:33:20 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from wosch@panke.de.freebsd.org) Received: (from wosch@localhost) by paula.panke.de.freebsd.org (8.9.3/8.8.8) id WAA01190; Sun, 2 May 1999 22:57:16 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from wosch) Message-ID: <19990502225716.47385@panke.de.freebsd.org> Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 22:57:16 +0200 From: Wolfram Schneider To: David Lowe , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: adduser, rmuser, and perl... References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.89i In-Reply-To: ; from David Lowe on Sat, May 01, 1999 at 12:56:50PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 1999-05-01 12:56:50 -0700, David Lowe wrote: > Hacker folks - > > I found myself hacking up adduser the other day, and I had some thoughts. > > First, since FreeBSD has finally caught ships with perl5, adduser (and > other perl shipped with FreeBSD) could be rewritten to take advantage of > the many improvements of perl5 over perl4. Most of this would be cosmetic > & 'perl-anal' stuff like lexically scoping variables, 'use strict' and > '/usr/bin/perl -w' (roughly equivalent to gcc -Wall) and using the > object-oriented IO subsystem. Basically, switching from > perl-as-scripting-language to perl-as-programming-language. > > Second, I thought it would be nice to provide for easy added functionality > on a per-site basis, without having to edit the main adduser script. > Something like: 'local-stuff = "/usr/local/bin/adduser-extra"' in > /etc/adduser.conf, where the script $local-stuff would be called with all > of the new user's data as arguments. > > Those are my thoughts. My questions, then, are: is anyone currently > working on adduser? I searched the list archives and turned up nothing > since August '97. Anyone? And would these changes be welcome? I have No. The development of adduser is dead. We have now a replacement for adduser - the pw(8) command: pw - create, remove, modify & display system users and groups pw is written in C. If you want rewrite adduser you should a) write adduser as a front-end to pw(8). Call it directly or better write a perl Module for pw(8) or libutil(3). b) write adduser from scratch. The current version is an ugly perl hack > some spare cycles right now I could apply to this, but is this a case best > left untouched - "If it works, don't fix it" or are changes/improvements > welcome? > Finally, are there any perl people working on FreeBSD in general? I mean, > there are a number of perl programs in the core distribution, but they're > all looking very perl4ish to me. Again, perhaps I could apply some of > those spare cycles here. I wrote most of the perl4 scripts in FreeBSD. I simple don't have the time to rewrite them in perl5. There are many real bugs in the system which must be fixed first. Feel free to rewrite the perl scripts and send me the patches ;-) -- Wolfram Schneider http://wolfram.schneider.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun May 2 15:48: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B11814E7A for ; Sun, 2 May 1999 15:48:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.2/8.9.1) id AAA39582; Mon, 3 May 1999 00:47:54 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: Kelly Yancey Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: new loader question / module question References: From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 03 May 1999 00:47:53 +0200 In-Reply-To: Kelly Yancey's message of "Sun, 2 May 1999 16:00:20 -0400 (EDT)" Message-ID: Lines: 53 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Kelly Yancey writes: > Also, it got me thinking? Is there a way to "through away" the > informaiton after I'm done with it. For example, in the splash module, > once you load the image into memory, it's stuck there forever (ie. the > "feature" that you can re-use it as a screen saver because it is still > in memory). I was under the impression that we don't page kernel memory > and thus the image is wired into RAM all the time (it will never be > paged). Please tell me I'm wrong...because if not, doesn't this seem like > a Bad Thing? Unfortunately, you're correct. What's more, the memory occupied by a module is not reclaimed when the module is unloaded. > Thanks for all of your help! By the way? Is anyone working on improving > the splash module. To a certain degree, yes. > With all the examining I've been doing of it recently, > I would like to add the ability for it to scale the image to fit the > screen size (rather than die of rimages which are too large). I might look into it some day, but the result of scaling the image is likely to be very ugly due to aliasing. > I was also > thinking about adding XPM support so I don't have to use Windows BMP > files :) You don't have to use BMP files; you can use PCX files instead (PCX is the file format Paintbrush used before it got bought by Microsoft) by loading splash_pcx instead of splash_bmp. You won't get a fadeout effect, though; I left that part out of the PCX decoder because it didn't work properly and I didn't feel like trying to understand or debug the code. BTW, those "Windows BMP files" are properly called DIBs (Device Independent Bitmaps) and come in two slightly different variants: a Windows version and an OS/2 version. I don't recall the differences in format between the two. A PNG decoder is also planned, but it's a lot more work than a PCX decoder and I haven't found the time to finish it yet. > anyway, those are just a couple of the ideas I thought I could > implement to improve it, but I don't want to mess with it if someone else > is already working on it. Patches are always welcome. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun May 2 19:18:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.adinet.com.uy (mail.adinet.com.uy [206.99.44.235]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABB1014BCE for ; Sun, 2 May 1999 19:18:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ang@adinet.com.uy) Received: from adinet.com.uy (r243-157.adinet.com.uy [207.50.243.157]) by mail.adinet.com.uy (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id XAA08505; Sun, 2 May 1999 23:14:33 -0300 (GMT) Message-ID: <372D06E5.4EE29999@adinet.com.uy> Date: Sun, 02 May 1999 23:16:05 -0300 From: Angelo Nardone X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Brian Somers Cc: Steve Rubin , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: bktr (brooktree device) References: <199905020842.JAA40738@keep.lan.Awfulhak.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Thanks very, very much. I'll try this night. Brian Somers wrote: > > My current config for my WinTV card looks like this.. > > > > device bktr0 # WinTV card > > controller smbus0 > > device smb0 at smbus? > > controller iicbus0 > > device ic0 at iicbus? > > device iic0 at iicbus? > > device iicsmb0 at iicbus? > > device iicbb0 at iicbus? > > iicbb0 should be a controller according to LINT. > -- > Brian > > Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour ! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun May 2 19:29:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F91E15374 for ; Sun, 2 May 1999 19:29:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA65033; Sun, 2 May 1999 19:26:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199905030226.TAA65033@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Angelo Nardone Cc: Brian Somers , Steve Rubin , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: bktr (brooktree device) In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 02 May 1999 23:16:05 -0300." <372D06E5.4EE29999@adinet.com.uy> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 02 May 1999 19:26:08 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Sorry about that . Originally the Bt848 driver was very easy to configure and it didn't need any other external drivers . There outght to be a way for a driver to query for dependent drivers and load them if necessary to avoid the current driver dependency configuration and if it doesnt find the dependent driver whenever possible fall back to a default behavior. Amancio > Thanks very, very much. > I'll try this night. > > Brian Somers wrote: > > > > My current config for my WinTV card looks like this.. > > > > > > device bktr0 # WinTV card > > > controller smbus0 > > > device smb0 at smbus? > > > controller iicbus0 > > > device ic0 at iicbus? > > > device iic0 at iicbus? > > > device iicsmb0 at iicbus? > > > device iicbb0 at iicbus? > > > > iicbb0 should be a controller according to LINT. > > -- > > Brian > > > > Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour ! > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun May 2 19:54: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08C0B14C1D for ; Sun, 2 May 1999 19:54:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id WAA27609; Sun, 2 May 1999 22:53:55 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199905030253.WAA27609@cs.rpi.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: schimken@cs.rpi.edu, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: 'nother NFS panic on 3.1-STABLE-Sun Mar 21 Date: Sun, 02 May 1999 22:53:54 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This is another instance of the mbuf 32k problem that caused our previous crash, this time I have the crashdump. (BTW: I issued 'savecore' on the machine and it said "no coredump", yet I issued a dd bs=512 if=/dev/wd0s1b skip= OFFSET of=crashfile, and I have a valid core.) Below is what I find to be interesting in the PS output: USER PID %CPU %MEM VSZ RSS TT STAT STARTED TIME COMMAND UID PID PPID CPU PRI NI VSZ RSS WCHAN STAT TT TIME COMMAND root 34338 39.2 0.0 296 0 ?? R - 0:00.00 (nfsd) 0 34338 34337 276 -6 0 296 0 - R ?? 0:00.00 (nfsd) root 167 0.0 0.0 262984 0 ?? Ss - 0:00.00 (rpc.statd) 0 167 1 0 2 0 262984 0 select Ss ?? 0:00.00 (rpc.statd) Does this sugggest anything to anyone? (We will be upgrading this machine shortly, I just hope to gather some insight as to what tripped this. Our new kernels will be config -g; strip --no-debug kernels :) -- David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 0: 3:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hermes.epita.fr (hermes.epita.fr [194.98.116.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64E5B14DA5 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 00:03:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pixel@dotcom.fr) Received: from aux.epita.fr (aux [10.42.1.37]) by hermes.epita.fr id JAA18317 for EPITA Paris France Mon, 3 May 1999 09:03:41 GMT Received: from ppp-an-04.epita.fr [163.5.44.4] by aux.epita.fr for Paris France Mon, 3 May 1999 09:03:44 GMT Message-ID: <005001be94f8$0aaa8460$042c05a3@celtic> Reply-To: "pixel" From: "pixel" To: Subject: setlocale() returns NULL when it should not Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 01:43:23 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, Lords, Using this small test program on my 2.2.8 box (which I cannot upgrade to 3.x for some political reasons) : #include void main(void) { char *l; l = setlocale(LC_MESSAGES,NULL); printf("%p : %s\n",l,(l ? l : "NO LC_MESSAGES"); } prints : 0x0 : NO LC_MESSAGES on my screen. Since It should not, I want to know if this is normal (ie setlocale() is broken on 2.2.8) or not (ie my box is *really* broken :). Thanks for your help. -- pixel@{epita,dotcom}.fr To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 1:42: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bilby.prth.tensor.pgs.com (bilby.prth.tensor.pgs.com [157.147.232.237]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7D1F15637 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 01:42:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from shocking@ariadne.prth.tensor.pgs.com) Received: from bandicoot.prth.tensor.pgs.com (bandicoot.prth.tensor.pgs.com [157.147.224.1]) by bilby.prth.tensor.pgs.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA15238 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 16:41:21 +0800 (WST) Received: from ariadne.tensor.pgs.com (ariadne [157.147.227.36]) by bandicoot.prth.tensor.pgs.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with SMTP id QAA22686 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 16:41:56 +0800 (WST) Received: from ariadne by ariadne.tensor.pgs.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id QAA25568; Mon, 3 May 1999 16:41:56 +0800 Message-Id: <199905030841.QAA25568@ariadne.tensor.pgs.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 16:41:55 +0800 From: Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Having discovered that the Realtek chipset is a flatulent sack of pus, I'm wondering what results people have had with other PCI network cards, and what order of preference they'd put them in. Stephen -- The views expressed above are not those of PGS Tensor. "We've heard that a million monkeys at a million keyboards could produce the Complete Works of Shakespeare; now, thanks to the Internet, we know this is not true." Robert Wilensky, University of California To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 2: 8:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from at.dotat.com (zed.dotat.com [203.2.134.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BA3714CF9 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 02:08:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hart@at.dotat.com) Received: from at.dotat.com (localhost.dotat.com [127.0.0.1]) by at.dotat.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA17770; Mon, 3 May 1999 18:40:06 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199905030910.SAA17770@at.dotat.com> To: Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 03 May 1999 16:41:55 +0800." <199905030841.QAA25568@ariadne.tensor.pgs.com> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 18:40:06 +0930 From: Leigh Hart Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi Steve, What a shocking email address you have there *chortle* sorry, couldn't resist. Stephen Hocking-Senior wrote: > > Having discovered that the Realtek chipset is a > flatulent sack of pus, Um, what gives you that idea? I've used literally dozens of them throughout my network on both router based bsd boxen as well as busy servers (the 10Mb variety). > I'm wondering what results people have had with other PCI > network cards, and what order of preference they'd put > them in. I've never had a problem with any PCI based NIC, but in order of preference for 10Mb I prefer RealTek 8029 PCI, for 100Mb I prefer Intel Pro 10/100B+. Cheers Leigh -- | "By the time they had diminished | Leigh Hart, | | from 50 to 8, the other dwarves | CCNA - http://www.cisco.com/ | | began to suspect 'Hungry' ..." | GPO Box 487 Adelaide SA 5001 | | -- Gary Larson, "The Far Side" | http://www.dotat.com/hart/ | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 2:16:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cain.gsoft.com.au (genesi.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7BD3F14CF9 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 02:16:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Received: from lot.gsoft.com.au (lot.gsoft.com.au [203.38.152.106]) by cain.gsoft.com.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA21600; Mon, 3 May 1999 18:45:51 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199905030841.QAA25568@ariadne.tensor.pgs.com> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 18:45:50 +0930 (CST) From: "Daniel O'Connor" To: Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth Subject: RE: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 03-May-99 Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth wrote: > Having discovered that the Realtek chipset is a flatulent sack of pus, I'm > wondering what results people have had with other PCI network cards, and > what > order of preference they'd put them in. DEC Tulip cards are nice.. I have noticed that when you change media they get confused (you have to flush the arp table and generally kick it a bit) but they seem quite nice. Intel Etherexpress pro 10/100's are probably better but I've only used one for a short while :) --- Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." -- Andrew Tanenbaum To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 3:54: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 31B4F14E6B for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 03:52:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id KAA21954; Mon, 3 May 1999 10:36:35 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199905030836.KAA21954@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? To: hart@at.dotat.com (Leigh Hart) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 10:36:35 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: shocking@prth.pgs.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199905030910.SAA17770@at.dotat.com> from "Leigh Hart" at May 3, 99 06:39:47 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1244 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Stephen Hocking-Senior wrote: > > > > Having discovered that the Realtek chipset is a > > flatulent sack of pus, > > Um, what gives you that idea? I've used literally dozens of > them throughout my network on both router based bsd boxen as > well as busy servers (the 10Mb variety). i think he refers to the 8139 (100Mbit version) which has some performance limitations according to the driver, and essentially forces you to do a memory copy. This said, you get what you pay for! While the board might have its problems and bugs (e.g. i get occasional timeouts and watchdog interventions with the 8139 on a 10Mbit bus), several other cards are not exempt from bugs, and they only work well because various software workarounds. Here we have a variety of 2114x (i think over 100 in various labs, 1996 to 1999 vintages[buy date]) and i have experienced quite a few problems in multicast usage (and fixed some of them; but there are still systematic problems with the 21143...), plus the cards tend to fall asleep and you need to manually restart it every now and then. The Intel "fxp" is advertised by these lists as a very good one, but it costs twice the Tulip and 3-4 times as much as the 8139 cheers luigi To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 4:52:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from PacHell.TelcoSucks.org (PacHell.TelcoSucks.org [207.90.181.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5E1E15484 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 04:52:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ulf@PacHell.TelcoSucks.org) Received: (from ulf@localhost) by PacHell.TelcoSucks.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) id EAA11785; Mon, 3 May 1999 04:52:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ulf) Message-ID: <19990503045227.C17829@TelcoSucks.org> Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 04:52:27 -0700 From: Ulf Zimmermann To: Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? Reply-To: ulf@Alameda.net References: <199905030841.QAA25568@ariadne.tensor.pgs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199905030841.QAA25568@ariadne.tensor.pgs.com>; from Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth on Mon, May 03, 1999 at 04:41:55PM +0800 Organization: Alameda Networks, Inc. X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, May 03, 1999 at 04:41:55PM +0800, Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth wrote: > > Having discovered that the Realtek chipset is a flatulent sack of pus, I'm > wondering what results people have had with other PCI network cards, and what > order of preference they'd put them in. ASIX (ax driver) is cheap, if you can find it and works pretty well. Otherwise fxp for me. > > > Stephen > -- > The views expressed above are not those of PGS Tensor. > > "We've heard that a million monkeys at a million keyboards could produce > the Complete Works of Shakespeare; now, thanks to the Internet, we know > this is not true." Robert Wilensky, University of California > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- Regards, Ulf. --------------------------------------------------------------------- Ulf Zimmermann, 1525 Pacific Ave., Alameda, CA-94501, #: 510-769-2936 Alameda Networks, Inc. | http://www.Alameda.net | Fax#: 510-521-5073 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 7:32:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kronos.alcnet.com (kronos.alcnet.com [207.244.223.187]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9CD7151F2 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 07:32:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kbyanc@alcnet.com) X-Provider: ALC Communications, Inc. http://www.alcnet.com/ Received: from localhost (kbyanc@localhost) by kronos.alcnet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/antispam) with ESMTP id KAA54848; Mon, 3 May 1999 10:44:01 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 10:44:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Kelly Yancey To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: new loader question / module question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 3 May 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > Kelly Yancey writes: > > Also, it got me thinking? Is there a way to "through away" the > > informaiton after I'm done with it. For example, in the splash module, > > once you load the image into memory, it's stuck there forever (ie. the > > "feature" that you can re-use it as a screen saver because it is still > > in memory). I was under the impression that we don't page kernel memory > > and thus the image is wired into RAM all the time (it will never be > > paged). Please tell me I'm wrong...because if not, doesn't this seem like > > a Bad Thing? > > Unfortunately, you're correct. What's more, the memory occupied by a > module is not reclaimed when the module is unloaded. Is there a way to free the memory allocated by the loader for the image? I don't see how since we didn't actually allocate the memory ourselves...I suppose it should still be possible free() the memory once we have located it by the tag, but I'm not sure how to do this? I'm thinking about providing a way to pass additional options to the splash module to enable/disable certain features (hence the idea in the original posting of using the loader to load a config file and then locating the tag and reading the configuration). One such option (for those people who would prefer the extra memory be reclaimed rather than being able to re-use it as a non-X screen saver) would be to free the memory allocated to the image after the system is booted (that is...if it is possible). > > > Thanks for all of your help! By the way? Is anyone working on improving > > the splash module. > > To a certain degree, yes. > > > With all the examining I've been doing of it recently, > > I would like to add the ability for it to scale the image to fit the > > screen size (rather than die of rimages which are too large). > > I might look into it some day, but the result of scaling the image is > likely to be very ugly due to aliasing. > > > I was also > > thinking about adding XPM support so I don't have to use Windows BMP > > files :) > > You don't have to use BMP files; you can use PCX files instead (PCX is > the file format Paintbrush used before it got bought by Microsoft) by > loading splash_pcx instead of splash_bmp. You won't get a fadeout > effect, though; I left that part out of the PCX decoder because it > didn't work properly and I didn't feel like trying to understand or > debug the code. Is this in -stable? or -current? My 3.1-19990309-STABLE machine only had a decoder for BMP files. > > BTW, those "Windows BMP files" are properly called DIBs (Device > Independent Bitmaps) and come in two slightly different variants: a > Windows version and an OS/2 version. I don't recall the differences in > format between the two. I think I've got it in a Dr. Dobbs somewhere...as I recall the headers are just slightly different. > > A PNG decoder is also planned, but it's a lot more work than a PCX > decoder and I haven't found the time to finish it yet. > Ouch...and I was starting to feel bad for investing any more kernel memory for something as trivial as a splash screen ;) > > anyway, those are just a couple of the ideas I thought I could > > implement to improve it, but I don't want to mess with it if someone else > > is already working on it. > > Patches are always welcome. Well, the first set of related patches (which I hope to have done by the end of the week) are to add some extra video modes to the syscons driver (320x400, 320x480, 360x200, 360x240, 360x400, and 360x480 modex). I'll post those to -hackers when I'm done. > > DES > -- > Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no > Kelly Yancey ~kbyanc@alcnet.com~ "Silly penguin, Linux is for kids" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 8:16:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71E0114D5E for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 08:16:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.2/8.9.1) id RAA42283; Mon, 3 May 1999 17:16:29 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: Kelly Yancey Cc: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: new loader question / module question References: From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 03 May 1999 17:16:28 +0200 In-Reply-To: Kelly Yancey's message of "Mon, 3 May 1999 10:44:01 -0400 (EDT)" Message-ID: Lines: 46 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Kelly Yancey writes: > On 3 May 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > Unfortunately, you're correct. What's more, the memory occupied by a > > module is not reclaimed when the module is unloaded. > Is there a way to free the memory allocated by the loader for the image? No. The image is a module as any other. > I'm thinking about providing a way to pass additional options to the > splash module to enable/disable certain features (hence the idea in the > original posting of using the loader to load a config file and then > locating the tag and reading the configuration). What's wrong with sysctls? > > You don't have to use BMP files; you can use PCX files instead [...] > Is this in -stable? or -current? My 3.1-19990309-STABLE machine only had > a decoder for BMP files. Both. I MFCed the PCX decoder a week or two ago. > > A PNG decoder is also planned, but it's a lot more work than a PCX > > decoder and I haven't found the time to finish it yet. > Ouch...and I was starting to feel bad for investing any more kernel > memory for something as trivial as a splash screen ;) What do you mean? The memory occupied by the decoder is inconsequential (we're talking ten kilobytes on the outside). What really eats up memory is the image, especially if you use a hi-res one (my home box has a 1024x768 splash screen). PNG images have much better compression than BMP or PCX, and will therefore occupy less memory. > Well, the first set of related patches (which I hope to have done by the > end of the week) are to add some extra video modes to the syscons driver > (320x400, 320x480, 360x200, 360x240, 360x400, and 360x480 modex). I'll > post those to -hackers when I'm done. I don't think these are really interesting, since mode X is interleaved, which makes for added complexity the decoder. It will just add complexity for no real gain. Support for mode Q, on the other hand, might be interesting for screen savers, and easy to implement. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 8:44:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (unknown [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B80E14D5E for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 08:44:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (homer.softweyr.com [204.68.178.39]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA01229; Mon, 3 May 1999 09:44:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <372DC456.D1653941@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 09:44:22 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? References: <199905030841.QAA25568@ariadne.tensor.pgs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth wrote: > > Having discovered that the Realtek chipset is a flatulent sack of pus, I'm > wondering what results people have had with other PCI network cards, and what > order of preference they'd put them in. Yeah, the 8129/8139 leave a lot to be desired. I've been through this a lot lately, and have just replaced a bunch of 3c905 and 3c905B cards with LinkSys EtherFast (LNE100TX) cards. Our through is still not stellar, but much better than the 3c905s or the onboard EtherExpress Pro 100B on one of the machines. The LinkSys cards use the LiteOn PNIC chip, which is a "follow-on" to the DEC Tulip. There is a driver for it in 3.x (device pn), you'd have to back-port it to 2.2.x if you want to use it there. I've only had them for a few days but so far everything has come up roses. They're selling at warehouse.com for $29.99 with a $10 rebate, making them about the cost of an expensive lunch. ;^) -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 9: 1:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kronos.alcnet.com (kronos.alcnet.com [207.244.223.187]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B50715043 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 09:01:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kbyanc@alcnet.com) X-Provider: ALC Communications, Inc. http://www.alcnet.com/ Received: from localhost (kbyanc@localhost) by kronos.alcnet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/antispam) with ESMTP id MAA56249; Mon, 3 May 1999 12:12:50 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 12:12:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Kelly Yancey To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: new loader question / module question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ~kbyanc@alcnet.com~ "Silly penguin, Linux is for kids" On 3 May 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > Kelly Yancey writes: > > On 3 May 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > > Unfortunately, you're correct. What's more, the memory occupied by a > > > module is not reclaimed when the module is unloaded. > > Is there a way to free the memory allocated by the loader for the image? > > No. The image is a module as any other. So it should be possible to unload it right? I'm not at home right now so I can't try kldunload. If you can unload it, what happens if the user hits the saver key? > > > I'm thinking about providing a way to pass additional options to the > > splash module to enable/disable certain features (hence the idea in the > > original posting of using the loader to load a config file and then > > locating the tag and reading the configuration). > > What's wrong with sysctls? Where was my head :) Works for me. Maybe sysctl knobs under kern.splash? Really, where should they go? > > > > You don't have to use BMP files; you can use PCX files instead [...] > > Is this in -stable? or -current? My 3.1-19990309-STABLE machine only had > > a decoder for BMP files. > > Both. I MFCed the PCX decoder a week or two ago. > > > > A PNG decoder is also planned, but it's a lot more work than a PCX > > > decoder and I haven't found the time to finish it yet. > > Ouch...and I was starting to feel bad for investing any more kernel > > memory for something as trivial as a splash screen ;) > > What do you mean? The memory occupied by the decoder is > inconsequential (we're talking ten kilobytes on the outside). What > really eats up memory is the image, especially if you use a hi-res one > (my home box has a 1024x768 splash screen). PNG images have much > better compression than BMP or PCX, and will therefore occupy less > memory. Well, that was part of my point above...I'm trying to figure out a way to reduce the memory requirements of the image too. Really it was just a joke (hence the ;) ), but I have to admit it does at least seem odd to think we would funtionally have a PNG decoder in the kernel (albeit in a module), or even that we currently any picture decoder in the kernel...I would have laughed at the idea 10 years ago :) > > > Well, the first set of related patches (which I hope to have done by the > > end of the week) are to add some extra video modes to the syscons driver > > (320x400, 320x480, 360x200, 360x240, 360x400, and 360x480 modex). I'll > > post those to -hackers when I'm done. > > I don't think these are really interesting, since mode X is > interleaved, which makes for added complexity the decoder. It will > just add complexity for no real gain. Support for mode Q, on the other > hand, might be interesting for screen savers, and easy to implement. > 320x240 is currently in syscons and that is interleaved. And believe it or not...320x240 looks a lot nicer than 320x200. And not to hold Windows up as a shining example of the way things ought to be, but I'm almost positive their splash screen is actually 320x240 mode X. Really, I don't mind adding in the support in the splash module for the mode X resolutions. But the first thing I have to do is finish is adding support for them all to the syscons driver before I can use them. Thanks again, Kelly To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 9:14:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7AB0C15043 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 09:14:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.2/8.9.1) id SAA42410; Mon, 3 May 1999 18:14:11 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: Kelly Yancey Cc: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: new loader question / module question References: From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 03 May 1999 18:14:11 +0200 In-Reply-To: Kelly Yancey's message of "Mon, 3 May 1999 12:12:50 -0400 (EDT)" Message-ID: Lines: 26 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Kelly Yancey writes: > On 3 May 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > No. The image is a module as any other. > So it should be possible to unload it right? I'm not at home right now > so I can't try kldunload. If you can unload it, what happens if the user > hits the saver key? I don't think you can unload preloaded modules - I'm not sure. > > What's wrong with sysctls? > Where was my head :) Works for me. Maybe sysctl knobs under kern.splash? > Really, where should they go? *not* under kern.splash, since the splash decoders are syscons- specific (I don't think they work with pcvt). > 320x240 is currently in syscons and that is interleaved. And believe it > or not...320x240 looks a lot nicer than 320x200. And not to hold Windows > up as a shining example of the way things ought to be, but I'm almost > positive their splash screen is actually 320x240 mode X. No, it's 320x400. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 9:29:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gateway.cybernet.com (gateway.cybernet.com [192.245.33.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80C8714BDC for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 09:29:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mtaylor@cybernet.com) Received: from spiffy.cybernet.com (spiffy.cybernet.com [192.245.33.55]) by gateway.cybernet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA22398; Mon, 3 May 1999 12:29:11 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from mtaylor@cybernet.com) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 12:30:27 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: mtaylor@cybernet.com Organization: Cybernet Systems From: "Mark J. Taylor" To: "Daniel O'Connor" Subject: RE: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The Tulip-based cards are flatulent sacks of pus as well. There are multicast problem with them. I'm sure Bill Paul can give us a few words about these cards... Ever try to do multicast under Windows/NT with a Tulip-based card? It does not work, even with the latest NT and DEC drivers. We use the Intel EEPro 10/100 here, but we don't really use them in 100MB mode very often. DG wrote the driver, and he is one of the "special people" that I can trust to write a good driver. ;) (doesn't wcarchive have a EEPro 10/100?) --- Mark J. Taylor Networking Research Cybernet Systems mtaylor@cybernet.com 727 Airport Blvd. PHONE (734) 668-2567 Ann Arbor, MI 48108 FAX (734) 668-8780 http://www.cybernet.com/ http://www.netmax.com/ On 03-May-99 Daniel O'Connor wrote: > > On 03-May-99 Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth wrote: >> Having discovered that the Realtek chipset is a flatulent sack of pus, I'm >> wondering what results people have had with other PCI network cards, and >> what >> order of preference they'd put them in. > > DEC Tulip cards are nice.. I have noticed that when you change media they get > confused (you have to flush the arp table and generally kick it a bit) but they > seem quite nice. > > Intel Etherexpress pro 10/100's are probably better but I've only used one for > a short while :) > > --- > Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer > for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au > "The nice thing about standards is that there > are so many of them to choose from." > -- Andrew Tanenbaum > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 9:37:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from whizkidtech.net (r29.bfm.org [208.18.213.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55CF115043 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 09:37:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adam@whizkidtech.net) Received: (from adam@localhost) by whizkidtech.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) id LAA00296 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 3 May 1999 11:37:20 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from adam) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 11:36:48 -0500 From: "G. Adam Stanislav" To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: wc* routines Message-ID: <19990503113648.A284@whizkidtech.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello, I have posted this message last night, but apparently it never made it through. My apologies if this is a duplicate. (And, BTW, if it isn't, this is my first post to this list.) Because John Fieber no longer has the time to work on the wc* routines for FreeBSD C library, I offered to continue his work, and started doing so two days ago. I have created a web page dedicated to informing you of the progress of this work. I would like to receive comments and suggestions about anything I post there. I would like to receive those comments here rather than in private mail, so we can get input from others. At the present, the page contains some introduction to what wc* routines are for, as well as the headers and . I also created an additional, system specific, header which I called . I would like your input on whether the contents of this header belong there, or should be moved to , or perhaps whether its name should be changed, and such. I started with the headers because it does not seem to make much sense to me to work on the code without good headers. Also, what belongs inside those headers is pretty much defined by standards, so they were fairly easy to write. :-) Additionally, I know that David Cross is working on several of the wc* routines, so having common headers is probably a good thing. Again, please let me know what you think of the headers, so I can submit them. Also, please, if anyone else is doing work in this area, let me know, so we can coordinate our efforts. If you want your current code posted on the page, send it to me. Anyway, the page is at http://www.whizkidtech.net/i18n/wc/ or if you just want the headers, get wc.tar.gz from the same URL. I will keep changing the contents of that file (and of the page) as I have more work done. Adam P.S. I mention certain problems with Unicode on the page, problems that require big lookup tables. If you have any suggestions about solving those problems, fire away! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 9:54:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B34DB15320 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 09:54:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id MAA11629; Mon, 3 May 1999 12:54:11 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199905031654.MAA11629@cs.rpi.edu> To: "G. Adam Stanislav" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: wc* routines In-Reply-To: Message from "G. Adam Stanislav" of "Mon, 03 May 1999 11:36:48 CDT." <19990503113648.A284@whizkidtech.net> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 12:54:10 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ugh... I am already working on this, and have 99% of the wc* functions written and documented (I posted awhile back with the location of a very pre-alpha set of my work, and asked for patches ;) -- David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 9:59:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 383C31538A for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 09:59:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA92818 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 12:57:01 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 12:57:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: linux compat question Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Anyone know if linux apps use our own magic file, or if they look into /compat/linux/etc for a magic file? I'm trying to install word perfect, and I won't yet let it touch my FreeBSD magic file. Maybe, anyone have a recent Linux magic file? ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 10: 4:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from verdi.nethelp.no (verdi.nethelp.no [158.36.41.162]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 69B8115453 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 10:04:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sthaug@nethelp.no) Received: (qmail 49075 invoked by uid 1001); 3 May 1999 17:04:26 +0000 (GMT) To: mtaylor@cybernet.com Cc: doconnor@gsoft.com.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, shocking@prth.pgs.com Subject: RE: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? From: sthaug@nethelp.no In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 03 May 1999 12:30:27 -0400 (EDT)" References: X-Mailer: Mew version 1.05+ on Emacs 19.34.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 19:04:26 +0200 Message-ID: <49073.925751066@verdi.nethelp.no> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > The Tulip-based cards are flatulent sacks of pus as well. > There are multicast problem with them. I'm sure Bill Paul can give us a > few words about these cards... Well, it also depends on the driver. In a previous job situation, using Linux, we had to ditch several Intel Pro 100B cards and switch to Tulip based cards - because the Linux driver for the Pro 100B couldn't handle the multicast stuff while the Tulip cards worked fine. Myself, I've used both Tulip and Intel cards for FreeBSD. I have a slight preference for the Intel cards these days, but have always had good luck with the Tulip based cards. And of course, if you need something like a 4-port 10/100 card, Tulip is your only choice at the moment. Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 10: 7: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from socket.vexpanse.net (socket.vexpanse.net [216.36.2.121]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4FF514BD0 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 10:07:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gent@vexpanse.net) Received: from localhost (gent@localhost) by socket.vexpanse.net (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id KAA51328 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 10:08:01 GMT (envelope-from gent@vexpanse.net) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 10:08:01 +0000 (GMT) From: Mike Gent To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: new loader question / module question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 3 May 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > 320x240 is currently in syscons and that is interleaved. And believe it > > or not...320x240 looks a lot nicer than 320x200. And not to hold Windows > > up as a shining example of the way things ought to be, but I'm almost > > positive their splash screen is actually 320x240 mode X. > > No, it's 320x400. I believe it is 320x400 in mode Z. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 10:37:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from whizkidtech.net (r36.bfm.org [208.18.213.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 39500153A8 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 10:37:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adam@whizkidtech.net) Received: (from adam@localhost) by whizkidtech.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) id MAA00233; Mon, 3 May 1999 12:36:22 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from adam) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 12:35:51 -0500 From: "G. Adam Stanislav" To: "David E. Cross" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: wc* routines Message-ID: <19990503123551.A220@whizkidtech.net> References: <199905031654.MAA11629@cs.rpi.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <199905031654.MAA11629@cs.rpi.edu>; from David E. Cross on Mon, May 03, 1999 at 12:54:10PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, May 03, 1999 at 12:54:10PM -0400, David E. Cross wrote: > Ugh... I am already working on this, and have 99% of the wc* functions > written and documented (I posted awhile back with the location of a very > pre-alpha set of my work, and asked for patches ;) Yes, I am aware of that. I did get the pre-alpha back then. But are you doing ALL of the functions from wchar.h and wctype.h? Such as fwprintf()? I did not see those in the pre-alpha. This is why I am asking in the first place. I certainly do not want to duplicate your effort. :-) If you are doing it all, great! If not, please let me know what else needs to be done. Adam To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 11:37:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (osmium.gn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FEE4156B5 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 11:37:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wilko@yedi.iaf.nl) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (8.9.2/8.9.2) with UUCP id UAA30375; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:12:38 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.9.3/8.6.12) id RAA08918; Mon, 3 May 1999 17:49:24 +0200 (CEST) From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199905031549.RAA08918@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? In-Reply-To: <199905030841.QAA25568@ariadne.tensor.pgs.com> from Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth at "May 3, 1999 4:41:55 pm" To: shocking@prth.pgs.com (Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 17:49:24 +0200 (CEST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem, The Netherlands X-pgp-info: PGP public key at 'finger wilko@freefall.freebsd.org' X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth wrote ... > > Having discovered that the Realtek chipset is a flatulent sack of pus, I'm > wondering what results people have had with other PCI network cards, and what > order of preference they'd put them in. I'm quite happy with the 3Com Etherlink III aka 3C905. But Tulip cards (de driver) I've also used successfully (apart from the fact that they gave me some hassle with the 10/100 detection) Groeten / Cheers, | / o / / _ Arnhem, The Netherlands - Powered by FreeBSD - |/|/ / / /( (_) Bulte WWW : http://www.tcja.nl http://www.freebsd.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 11:44:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ss1000.ms.mff.cuni.cz (ss1000.ms.mff.cuni.cz [195.113.19.221]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CAF1414F13 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 11:44:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mkop5230@ss1000.ms.mff.cuni.cz) Received: from beta.ms.mff.cuni.cz (mkop5230@beta.ms.mff.cuni.cz [195.113.16.70]) by ss1000.ms.mff.cuni.cz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA26154; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:44:12 +0200 Received: from localhost (mkop5230@localhost) by beta.ms.mff.cuni.cz (980427.SGI.8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA51874; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:44:12 +0200 (MDT) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 20:44:11 +0200 From: Milan Kopacka Reply-To: Milan Kopacka To: Chuck Robey Cc: FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: linux compat question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 3 May 1999, Chuck Robey wrote: > Anyone know if linux apps use our own magic file, or if they look into > /compat/linux/etc for a magic file? I'm trying to install word perfect, > and I won't yet let it touch my FreeBSD magic file. I know only one application using magic, that's file(1). You need to run file in Linux emulation? Wordperfect has some add-ons to magic, for file(1) to be able to properly recognize Wordperfect's documents. > Maybe, anyone have a recent Linux magic file? Get "file" package from your favorite Linux mirror site. :) Milan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 11:48:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F399F15043 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 11:48:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id LAA18979; Mon, 3 May 1999 11:46:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omni.xylan.com by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id LAA07150; Mon, 3 May 1999 11:46:48 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com (dyn3.utah.xylan.com) by omni.xylan.com (4.1/SMI-4.1 (xylan engr [SPOOL])) id AA25284; Mon, 3 May 99 11:46:41 PDT Message-Id: <372DEF0E.67B76176@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 12:46:38 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Wilko Bulte Cc: Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? References: <199905031549.RAA08918@yedi.iaf.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Wilko Bulte wrote: > > As Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth wrote ... > > > > Having discovered that the Realtek chipset is a flatulent sack of pus, I'm > > wondering what results people have had with other PCI network cards, and what > > order of preference they'd put them in. > > I'm quite happy with the 3Com Etherlink III aka 3C905. I've been able to get 3c905s to work OK in 2.2.x and 3.x, but you can't buy them anymore. The 3c905B you can buy now doesn't seem to work in any release. Much work has been going on on the xl driver recently to make the 905B actually work, but I've just replaced my 905s and 905Bs. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 11:52:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1275D15010 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 11:52:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA93190; Mon, 3 May 1999 14:49:51 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 14:49:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Milan Kopacka Cc: FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: linux compat question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 3 May 1999, Milan Kopacka wrote: > On Mon, 3 May 1999, Chuck Robey wrote: > > > Anyone know if linux apps use our own magic file, or if they look into > > /compat/linux/etc for a magic file? I'm trying to install word perfect, > > and I won't yet let it touch my FreeBSD magic file. > > I know only one application using magic, that's file(1). You need to run > file in Linux emulation? > > Wordperfect has some add-ons to magic, for file(1) to be able to properly > recognize Wordperfect's documents. > > > Maybe, anyone have a recent Linux magic file? > > Get "file" package from your favorite Linux mirror site. :) Oh, I thought I would only need the magic file, you say I need the linux file binary too? Darn. I hope those packages on the Linux sites have binaries (I don't run Linux here). I gotta go hunt down a Linux-friend. ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 11:55:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp1.vnet.net (smtp1.vnet.net [166.82.1.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C7E2156F1 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 11:55:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp1.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA20350; Mon, 3 May 1999 14:55:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA00506; Mon, 3 May 1999 14:54:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id OAA47041; Mon, 3 May 1999 14:54:54 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 14:54:54 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199905031854.OAA47041@lakes.dignus.com> To: chuckr@picnic.mat.net, Milan.Kopacka@st.ms.mff.cuni.cz Subject: Re: linux compat question Cc: FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Just a note... you don't need to add the WP information to the magic file... And, if you added to the one in /etc - the FreeBSD file(1) command would then "know" about wordperfect files. But - it's not necessary - the FreeBSD file(1) command seems to already know about them: [lakes.dignus.com]$ file doc doc: WordPerfect document So - it seems to be safe to just "skip" this step. - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 11:56:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from panzer.plutotech.com (panzer.plutotech.com [206.168.67.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DE3D156EF for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 11:56:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ken@panzer.plutotech.com) Received: (from ken@localhost) by panzer.plutotech.com (8.9.3/8.8.5) id MAA25061; Mon, 3 May 1999 12:56:03 -0600 (MDT) From: "Kenneth D. Merry" Message-Id: <199905031856.MAA25061@panzer.plutotech.com> Subject: Re: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? In-Reply-To: <49073.925751066@verdi.nethelp.no> from "sthaug@nethelp.no" at "May 3, 1999 7: 4:26 pm" To: sthaug@nethelp.no Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 12:56:03 -0600 (MDT) Cc: mtaylor@cybernet.com, doconnor@gsoft.com.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, shocking@prth.pgs.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG sthaug@nethelp.no wrote... > > The Tulip-based cards are flatulent sacks of pus as well. > > There are multicast problem with them. I'm sure Bill Paul can give us a > > few words about these cards... > > Well, it also depends on the driver. In a previous job situation, using > Linux, we had to ditch several Intel Pro 100B cards and switch to Tulip > based cards - because the Linux driver for the Pro 100B couldn't handle > the multicast stuff while the Tulip cards worked fine. > > Myself, I've used both Tulip and Intel cards for FreeBSD. I have a slight > preference for the Intel cards these days, but have always had good luck > with the Tulip based cards. And of course, if you need something like a > 4-port 10/100 card, Tulip is your only choice at the moment. I'd recommend the Intel Pro 100 cards. I've got 30-40 machines with those cards (Pro/100B and Pro/100+), and haven't had any trouble. As Steinar points out, the key is the driver. In this case, the Intel driver works well. (That's not to say that other drivers don't work, just that my experience with the fxp driver has been good.) Ken -- Kenneth Merry ken@plutotech.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 12: 5:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26CB714D0B for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 12:05:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA93264; Mon, 3 May 1999 15:02:25 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 15:02:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Thomas David Rivers Cc: Milan.Kopacka@st.ms.mff.cuni.cz, FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: linux compat question In-Reply-To: <199905031854.OAA47041@lakes.dignus.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 3 May 1999, Thomas David Rivers wrote: > Just a note... you don't need to add the WP information to the > magic file... > > And, if you added to the one in /etc - the FreeBSD file(1) command > would then "know" about wordperfect files. > > But - it's not necessary - the FreeBSD file(1) command seems to > already know about them: > > [lakes.dignus.com]$ file doc > doc: WordPerfect document > > So - it seems to be safe to just "skip" this step. From what I see, their own magic file allows their various wp apps to recognize their own files, maybe 30 differing types. I don't know if it uses our file, or forces a Linux file. I gotta see if I can scare up a technical Linux user. I think I need their magic file, and their 'file' executeable. > > - Dave Rivers - > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 12:23:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from club-internet.fr (ppp-159-108.villette.club-internet.fr [195.36.159.108]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 61D0C1565C for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 12:22:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dbateman@club-internet.fr) Received: from club-internet.fr (dbateman@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by club-internet.fr (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA01450; Mon, 3 May 1999 21:19:44 +0200 Message-Id: <199905031919.VAA01450@club-internet.fr> To: chips@XFree86.Org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: chanders@timings.com Subject: Re: [chanders@timing.com: Advice for X on SBC with LCD?] In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 30 Apr 1999 12:27:28 +1000." <19990430122728.S21534@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 21:19:44 +0200 From: "David Bateman" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >I would like to get an X server running on a >640x480 Sharp TFT color panel connected to >an ISA single board computer. Advice on how >to do this will be much appreciated. Here are >some details on the setup. > >FreeBSD 3.x >Axiom SBC8242 > 486 > Chips and Technology F65550 video controller. >Sharp LQ64D343 640x480 18bit color TFT display. Where flat panels vary from CRT's is that they have a fixed number of pixels. The result of this is that the flat panel timings in general never need to be changed once the BIOS has set them up correctly. So the C&T chipsets, and probably others as well, have two sets of timing registers. The normal ones for the CRT and a second set for the flat panel. Where an SBC differs from a notebook computer is that you attach the screen yourself. So the BIOS might not be setting up the flat panel registers correctly for your panel as it might not know about the timings required. The way I'd suggest working around this is to steal the panel timings from the M$-windows driver if it works on your machine. Then you can use the "use_modeline" with XFree to force the modeline to program the flat panel registers I have utilities to dump the video processors registers under both M$-window and more sensible operating systems, as well as a utility to convert the register dumps to suitable modelines. Contact me if you are interested. Cheers David | David Bateman | tele: +33 (1) 69 29 02 47 Work | | Satimo | +33 (1) 46 04 02 18 Home | | 4 Rue de la Terre de Feu | fax: +33 (1) 69 29 02 27 | | F-91952 Les Ulis FRANCE | email: dbateman@club-internet.fr | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 12:30:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D660F15638 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 12:30:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id MAA19762; Mon, 3 May 1999 12:27:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omni.xylan.com by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id MAA08869; Mon, 3 May 1999 12:27:52 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com (dyn3.utah.xylan.com) by omni.xylan.com (4.1/SMI-4.1 (xylan engr [SPOOL])) id AA27370; Mon, 3 May 99 12:27:46 PDT Message-Id: <372DF8B2.667763F0@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 13:27:46 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: "Kenneth D. Merry" Cc: sthaug@nethelp.no, mtaylor@cybernet.com, doconnor@gsoft.com.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, shocking@prth.pgs.com Subject: Re: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? References: <199905031856.MAA25061@panzer.plutotech.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Kenneth D. Merry" wrote: > > I'd recommend the Intel Pro 100 cards. I've got 30-40 machines with those > cards (Pro/100B and Pro/100+), and haven't had any trouble. > > As Steinar points out, the key is the driver. In this case, the Intel > driver works well. (That's not to say that other drivers don't work, just > that my experience with the fxp driver has been good.) My only complaint about the EEPro 100B cards is paying Intel $65 for a card that has a single $4 chip on it. Bleh. Plus, the performance I've seen hasn't been all that stellar, but I may be doing something wrong. I haven't really tried tuning the system much yet, just doing some simple throughput tests using ftp and tcpblast. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 12:32:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from panzer.plutotech.com (panzer.plutotech.com [206.168.67.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBFDF1595D for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 12:32:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ken@panzer.plutotech.com) Received: (from ken@localhost) by panzer.plutotech.com (8.9.3/8.8.5) id NAA25435; Mon, 3 May 1999 13:32:13 -0600 (MDT) From: "Kenneth D. Merry" Message-Id: <199905031932.NAA25435@panzer.plutotech.com> Subject: Re: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? In-Reply-To: <372DF8B2.667763F0@softweyr.com> from Wes Peters at "May 3, 1999 1:27:46 pm" To: wes@softweyr.com (Wes Peters) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 13:32:13 -0600 (MDT) Cc: ken@plutotech.com, sthaug@nethelp.no, mtaylor@cybernet.com, doconnor@gsoft.com.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, shocking@prth.pgs.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Wes Peters wrote... > "Kenneth D. Merry" wrote: > > > > I'd recommend the Intel Pro 100 cards. I've got 30-40 machines with those > > cards (Pro/100B and Pro/100+), and haven't had any trouble. > > > > As Steinar points out, the key is the driver. In this case, the Intel > > driver works well. (That's not to say that other drivers don't work, just > > that my experience with the fxp driver has been good.) > > My only complaint about the EEPro 100B cards is paying Intel $65 for > a card that has a single $4 chip on it. Bleh. Plus, the performance > I've seen hasn't been all that stellar, but I may be doing something > wrong. I haven't really tried tuning the system much yet, just doing > some simple throughput tests using ftp and tcpblast. I've gotten pretty decent performance out of them, and I know one guy that claims to have gotten 98Mbits/sec out of one... Ken -- Kenneth Merry ken@plutotech.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 12:37:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from verdi.nethelp.no (verdi.nethelp.no [158.36.41.162]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 9CFFD154FE for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 12:37:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sthaug@nethelp.no) Received: (qmail 51250 invoked by uid 1001); 3 May 1999 19:37:16 +0000 (GMT) To: wes@softweyr.com Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? From: sthaug@nethelp.no In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 03 May 1999 13:27:46 -0600" References: <372DF8B2.667763F0@softweyr.com> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.05+ on Emacs 19.34.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 21:37:15 +0200 Message-ID: <51248.925760235@verdi.nethelp.no> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > My only complaint about the EEPro 100B cards is paying Intel $65 for > a card that has a single $4 chip on it. Bleh. Plus, the performance > I've seen hasn't been all that stellar, but I may be doing something > wrong. I haven't really tried tuning the system much yet, just doing > some simple throughput tests using ftp and tcpblast. Performance from these cards should be very good. I was able to receive a full 100 Mbps with one of these cards in a P-133 running 3.0-970124-SNAP, ie. more than two years ago. To *send* a full 100 Mbps you need slightly more CPU, say a P-166. Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 15: 9:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (osmium.gn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90DF6151A8 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 15:09:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wilko@yedi.iaf.nl) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (8.9.2/8.9.2) with UUCP id XAA07964; Mon, 3 May 1999 23:40:33 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.9.3/8.6.12) id WAA01206; Mon, 3 May 1999 22:15:17 +0200 (CEST) From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199905032015.WAA01206@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? In-Reply-To: <372DEF0E.67B76176@softweyr.com> from Wes Peters at "May 3, 1999 12:46:38 pm" To: wes@softweyr.com (Wes Peters) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 22:15:17 +0200 (CEST) Cc: shocking@prth.pgs.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem, The Netherlands X-pgp-info: PGP public key at 'finger wilko@freefall.freebsd.org' X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As Wes Peters wrote ... > Wilko Bulte wrote: > > > > As Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth wrote ... > > > > > > Having discovered that the Realtek chipset is a flatulent sack of pus, I'm > > > wondering what results people have had with other PCI network cards, and what > > > order of preference they'd put them in. > > > > I'm quite happy with the 3Com Etherlink III aka 3C905. > > I've been able to get 3c905s to work OK in 2.2.x and 3.x, but you can't > buy them anymore. The 3c905B you can buy now doesn't seem to work in > any release. Much work has been going on on the xl driver recently > to make the 905B actually work, but I've just replaced my 905s and 905Bs. I got older ones, work fine with 3.1-stable and -current here. Never seen a 905B yet. Groeten / Cheers, | / o / / _ Arnhem, The Netherlands - Powered by FreeBSD - |/|/ / / /( (_) Bulte WWW : http://www.tcja.nl http://www.freebsd.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 15:57:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7775814D8E for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 15:57:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id PAA23141; Mon, 3 May 1999 15:57:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omni.xylan.com by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id PAA17448; Mon, 3 May 1999 15:57:09 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com (dyn3.utah.xylan.com) by omni.xylan.com (4.1/SMI-4.1 (xylan engr [SPOOL])) id AA08283; Mon, 3 May 99 15:57:04 PDT Message-Id: <372E29B7.2102CC39@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 16:56:55 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: sthaug@nethelp.no Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? References: <372DF8B2.667763F0@softweyr.com> <51248.925760235@verdi.nethelp.no> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG sthaug@nethelp.no wrote: > > > My only complaint about the EEPro 100B cards is paying Intel $65 for > > a card that has a single $4 chip on it. Bleh. Plus, the performance > > I've seen hasn't been all that stellar, but I may be doing something > > wrong. I haven't really tried tuning the system much yet, just doing > > some simple throughput tests using ftp and tcpblast. > > Performance from these cards should be very good. I was able to receive a > full 100 Mbps with one of these cards in a P-133 running 3.0-970124-SNAP, > ie. more than two years ago. > > To *send* a full 100 Mbps you need slightly more CPU, say a P-166. I should probably point out I'm doing network throughput torture tests with 64-byte packets. ;^) Any reasonably good Fast Ethernet card on a respectable PCI machine will do 100 Mbps using 1500 byte packets. Using FreeBSD-3.1 (somewhere between RELEASE and STABLE) on a PII/233 (sender) and PPro 200 (receiver), I get the following figures: Driver Card Throughput ------ ------ ------------------------------------- xl 3c905 30.4 Mbps xl 3c905B 32.0 Mbps doesn't work unless there is a 3c905 in the system as well. fxp EEPro 100B 32.7 Mbps pn LNE100TX 39.6 Mbps I haven't attempted to measure interrupt overhead or anything like that since the only important measure for MY needs are "how fast can this thing stuff bits onto the wire?" I think the pn device is approaching the saturation point; the others do not come close. I'll also be using these for testing multicast throughput later on, with a lot of multicast groups. Since the PNIC chip supports "perfect multicast filtering," I.e. it has hardware filters for all ethernet multicast addresses, I am hoping these cards will perform well in this environment as well. Your mileage may vary. ;^) -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 16: 7:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.skylink.it (ns.skylink.it [194.177.113.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9102154AC for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 16:07:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hibma@skylink.it) Received: from heidi.plazza.it (va-157.skylink.it [194.185.55.157]) by ns.skylink.it (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA02235 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 01:08:46 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost.plazza.it [127.0.0.1]) by heidi.plazza.it (8.8.8/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA04514 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 00:43:39 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 00:43:39 +0200 (CEST) From: Nick Hibma X-Sender: n_hibma@heidi.plazza.it Reply-To: Nick Hibma To: FreeBSD hackers mailing list Subject: CAM: devices without path Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG What extra calls are needed to remove the path as well as the devices if a CAM controller disappears? Currently I do the following static void umass_cam_detach(umass_softc_t *sc) { /* Detach from CAM layer * XXX do we need to delete the device first? */ xpt_free_path(sc->path); xpt_bus_deregister(cam_sim_path(sc->sim)); cam_sim_free(sc->sim, /*free_devq*/TRUE); } But if I unplug the USB Zip drive, camcontrol shows a device ('Iomega...') without an accompanying scbus entry. Nick To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 16: 7:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.skylink.it (ns.skylink.it [194.177.113.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0F8314E6E for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 16:07:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hibma@skylink.it) Received: from heidi.plazza.it (va-157.skylink.it [194.185.55.157]) by ns.skylink.it (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA02238 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 01:08:48 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost.plazza.it [127.0.0.1]) by heidi.plazza.it (8.8.8/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA03997 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 23:20:36 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 23:20:35 +0200 (CEST) From: Nick Hibma X-Sender: n_hibma@heidi.plazza.it Reply-To: Nick Hibma To: FreeBSD hackers mailing list Subject: names of globale variables Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Isn't the choice of the variables names below a bit odd? It crashed my machine three times because of a typo (buf instead of buffer) in the USB Communications Class Driver. Wouldn't some more elaborate names be more appropriate to avoid these problems? sys/buf.h: extern int nbuf; /* The number of buffer headers */ extern struct buf *buf; /* The buffer headers. */ extern char *buffers; /* The buffer contents. */ extern int bufpages; /* Number of memory pages in the buffer */ Nick. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 16:19:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from midget.dons.net.au (daniel.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.137.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65627154AC for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 16:19:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Received: from guppy.dons.net.au (guppy.dons.net.au [203.31.81.9]) by midget.dons.net.au (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id IAA01545; Tue, 4 May 1999 08:47:56 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 08:47:55 +0930 (CST) From: "Daniel J. O'Connor" To: "Mark J. Taylor" Subject: RE: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? Cc: Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth Cc: Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 03-May-99 Mark J. Taylor wrote: > The Tulip-based cards are flatulent sacks of pus as well. > There are multicast problem with them. I'm sure Bill Paul can give us a > few words about these cards... Hmm, well I never use multicast so it doesn't really bother me. > Ever try to do multicast under Windows/NT with a Tulip-based card? It does > not work, even with the latest NT and DEC drivers. NT? Why would I do that? :) --- Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." -- Andrew Tanenbaum To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 16:20:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gateway.cybernet.com (gateway.cybernet.com [192.245.33.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8B2315525 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 16:20:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mtaylor@cybernet.com) Received: from spiffy.cybernet.com (spiffy.cybernet.com [192.245.33.55]) by gateway.cybernet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA24728; Mon, 3 May 1999 19:20:24 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from mtaylor@cybernet.com) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 19:21:39 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: mtaylor@cybernet.com Organization: Cybernet Systems From: "Mark J. Taylor" To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Problem in 3.1 with 16650 serial chip Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG There is a problem with the 16650's: they have high-speed capabilites, but by default they are "off". This means that bit 7 of the MCR (the high bit) will be "1" by default. This causes sio probe "2" to fail, because the value that is read back from the MCR is 0x80, instead of the expected 0x00 (at least in the multiport case). Someone posted fixes for high-speed serial ports a few days ago. Perhaps it needs a review? Now that I've got one of these boards, I could test some code... Also note that this chipset has a 64 byte TX and RX FIFO. There is a datasheet at: http://www.exar.com/products/st16c654.pdf Of particular interest is page 19 (baud rate table), and page 23 (register bit definitions). A quick hack/fix to get the port to at least probe/attach would be to look at the MCR in failures[2], detect the high-speed capability by looking at bit 7, and keeping this character value as an AND/OR mask for the MCR in the com_s structure. "OR" it in for MCR writes, and "AND ~" of it on reads. Later, it could be used to set higher baud rates. --- Mark J. Taylor Networking Research Cybernet Systems mtaylor@cybernet.com 727 Airport Blvd. PHONE (734) 668-2567 Ann Arbor, MI 48108 FAX (734) 668-8780 http://www.cybernet.com/ http://www.netmax.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 16:22:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from implode.root.com (root.com [209.102.106.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 173EE154AC for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 16:22:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@implode.root.com) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA04559; Mon, 3 May 1999 16:18:40 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199905032318.QAA04559@implode.root.com> To: Wes Peters Cc: sthaug@nethelp.no, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 03 May 1999 16:56:55 MDT." <372E29B7.2102CC39@softweyr.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 16:18:40 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >sthaug@nethelp.no wrote: >> >> > My only complaint about the EEPro 100B cards is paying Intel $65 for >> > a card that has a single $4 chip on it. Bleh. Plus, the performance >> > I've seen hasn't been all that stellar, but I may be doing something >> > wrong. I haven't really tried tuning the system much yet, just doing >> > some simple throughput tests using ftp and tcpblast. >> >> Performance from these cards should be very good. I was able to receive a >> full 100 Mbps with one of these cards in a P-133 running 3.0-970124-SNAP, >> ie. more than two years ago. >> >> To *send* a full 100 Mbps you need slightly more CPU, say a P-166. > >I should probably point out I'm doing network throughput torture >tests with 64-byte packets. ;^) Any reasonably good Fast Ethernet >card on a respectable PCI machine will do 100 Mbps using 1500 byte >packets. Using FreeBSD-3.1 (somewhere between RELEASE and STABLE) >on a PII/233 (sender) and PPro 200 (receiver), I get the following >figures: > > Driver Card Throughput > ------ ------ ------------------------------------- > xl 3c905 30.4 Mbps > xl 3c905B 32.0 Mbps > doesn't work unless there is a 3c905 > in the system as well. > fxp EEPro 100B 32.7 Mbps > pn LNE100TX 39.6 Mbps > >I haven't attempted to measure interrupt overhead or anything like >that since the only important measure for MY needs are "how fast >can this thing stuff bits onto the wire?" I think the pn device is >approaching the saturation point; the others do not come close. > >I'll also be using these for testing multicast throughput later on, >with a lot of multicast groups. Since the PNIC chip supports "perfect >multicast filtering," I.e. it has hardware filters for all ethernet >multicast addresses, I am hoping these cards will perform well in this >environment as well. > >Your mileage may vary. ;^) You benchmark is broken. The pro/100, for one, can easily do 100Mbps continuously. I should know since not only did I write the driver, but I use it exclusively here and on wcarchive (and in the latter, I have graphs and download stats to prove it). -DG David Greenman Co-founder/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project - http://www.freebsd.org Creator of high-performance Internet servers - http://www.terasolutions.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 17:39:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2227814CA8 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 17:39:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA00888; Mon, 3 May 1999 17:37:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199905040037.RAA00888@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Chuck Robey Cc: FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: linux compat question In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 03 May 1999 12:57:01 EDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 17:37:40 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Anyone know if linux apps use our own magic file, or if they look into > /compat/linux/etc for a magic file? I'm trying to install word perfect, > and I won't yet let it touch my FreeBSD magic file. > > Maybe, anyone have a recent Linux magic file? Our magic file already has Wordperfect documents in it. Just ignore the option to frob the magic file. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 17:44:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8316156D2 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 17:44:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA94768; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:41:30 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 20:41:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Mike Smith Cc: FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: linux compat question In-Reply-To: <199905040037.RAA00888@dingo.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 3 May 1999, Mike Smith wrote: > > Anyone know if linux apps use our own magic file, or if they look into > > /compat/linux/etc for a magic file? I'm trying to install word perfect, > > and I won't yet let it touch my FreeBSD magic file. > > > > Maybe, anyone have a recent Linux magic file? > > Our magic file already has Wordperfect documents in it. Just ignore > the option to frob the magic file. Ours lists ONE. Their's lists about 80 of them, so WP can recognize many of their subformats intelligently. I guess I could patch our magic to do that ... you have any idea if Word Perfect uses our file command, not one from /compat/linux/usr/bin? > > -- > \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith > \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au > \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org > \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com > > > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 17:48: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E3AE14FE8 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 17:47:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA00937; Mon, 3 May 1999 17:45:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199905040045.RAA00937@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Wes Peters Cc: Wilko Bulte , Stephen Hocking-Senior Programmer PGS Tensor Perth , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 03 May 1999 12:46:38 MDT." <372DEF0E.67B76176@softweyr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 17:45:40 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I've been able to get 3c905s to work OK in 2.2.x and 3.x, but you can't > buy them anymore. The 3c905B you can buy now doesn't seem to work in > any release. Much work has been going on on the xl driver recently > to make the 905B actually work, but I've just replaced my 905s and 905Bs. The 905B works just fine, modulo some reliability problems that seem to have been recently dealt with. If you were having total failures, I'm curious to hear why you weren't talking to Bill Paul about them. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 18:20:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DB6E14BE0 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 18:20:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id SAA24874; Mon, 3 May 1999 18:19:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omni.xylan.com by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id SAA01285; Mon, 3 May 1999 18:19:34 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com (dyn3.utah.xylan.com) by omni.xylan.com (4.1/SMI-4.1 (xylan engr [SPOOL])) id AA15390; Mon, 3 May 99 18:19:32 PDT Message-Id: <372E4B22.4EC5B758@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 19:19:30 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: dg@root.com Cc: sthaug@nethelp.no, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? References: <199905032318.QAA04559@implode.root.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG David Greenman wrote: > > Wes Peters wrote: > > > >I should probably point out I'm doing network throughput torture > >tests with 64-byte packets. ;^) Any reasonably good Fast Ethernet ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > You benchmark is broken. The pro/100, for one, can easily do 100Mbps > continuously. I should know since not only did I write the driver, but I The benchmark isn't broken, it's just weird. No card can do 100Mbps with 64-byte packets, the preamble lops off 1/3 of your performance using those itty bitty packets. The PNIC came closer to the theoretical max than anything else. > use it exclusively here and on wcarchive (and in the latter, I have graphs > and download stats to prove it). IIRC, the EEPro has significantly lower interrupt overhead at 100 Mbps than the Tulip, or probably the PNIC. For a web or ftp server, that's a big plus. For a multicast router, the EEPro is probably going to suffer somewhat vs. cards that can hash all valid ethernet multicast addresses. At least that's the assumption we're running on. One of the systems has an EEPro on-board in it, when we get the full test running I'll try it on both interfaces and see how the EEPro does against the PNIC. I assume the 3c905, with a single-bit control for multicast, is going to suck. The 3c905B seems to have varying degrees of support for multicast filtering, according to comments in the driver. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 18:31: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B56F014EA4 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 18:31:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA01167; Mon, 3 May 1999 18:28:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199905040128.SAA01167@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Chuck Robey Cc: Mike Smith , FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: linux compat question In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 03 May 1999 20:41:29 EDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 18:28:36 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > Maybe, anyone have a recent Linux magic file? > > > > Our magic file already has Wordperfect documents in it. Just ignore > > the option to frob the magic file. > > Ours lists ONE. Their's lists about 80 of them, so WP can recognize > many of their subformats intelligently. > > I guess I could patch our magic to do that ... you have any idea if Word > Perfect uses our file command, not one from /compat/linux/usr/bin? Don't. Go back and look at the magic file again. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 18:33: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4EAA914EA4 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 18:33:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA94969; Mon, 3 May 1999 21:30:39 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 21:30:39 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Mike Smith Cc: FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: linux compat question In-Reply-To: <199905040128.SAA01167@dingo.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 3 May 1999, Mike Smith wrote: > > > > Maybe, anyone have a recent Linux magic file? > > > > > > Our magic file already has Wordperfect documents in it. Just ignore > > > the option to frob the magic file. > > > > Ours lists ONE. Their's lists about 80 of them, so WP can recognize > > many of their subformats intelligently. > > > > I guess I could patch our magic to do that ... you have any idea if Word > > Perfect uses our file command, not one from /compat/linux/usr/bin? > > Don't. Go back and look at the magic file again. Mike, I wasn't gonna edit magic directly. Anyways, there's a copyright issue involved, let it lie. > > -- > \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith > \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au > \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org > \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com > > > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 18:44:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F4B3156B4 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 18:44:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA01330; Mon, 3 May 1999 18:43:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199905040143.SAA01330@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Nick Hibma Cc: FreeBSD hackers mailing list Subject: Re: names of globale variables In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 03 May 1999 23:20:35 +0200." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 18:43:09 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > Isn't the choice of the variables names below a bit odd? It crashed my > machine three times because of a typo (buf instead of buffer) in the > USB Communications Class Driver. > > Wouldn't some more elaborate names be more appropriate to avoid these > problems? "struct buf" is actually a very longstanding BSD tradition. I don't think we would easily be able to rename it, no. > sys/buf.h: > > extern int nbuf; /* The number of buffer headers */ > extern struct buf *buf; /* The buffer headers. */ > extern char *buffers; /* The buffer contents. */ > extern int bufpages; /* Number of memory pages in the buffer */ -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 19: 6:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pluto.ipass.net (pluto.ipass.net [198.79.53.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCB28156D5 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 19:06:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rhh@ipass.net) Received: from stealth.ipass.net. (ts4-55-ppp.ipass.net [207.120.205.55]) by pluto.ipass.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id WAA13975; Mon, 3 May 1999 22:06:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rhh@localhost) by stealth.ipass.net. (8.9.1/8.8.8) id WAA07768; Mon, 3 May 1999 22:07:21 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from rhh) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 22:07:21 -0400 From: Randall Hopper To: Amancio Hasty Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: bktr (brooktree device) Message-ID: <19990503220721.A7476@ipass.net> References: <372D06E5.4EE29999@adinet.com.uy> <199905030226.TAA65033@rah.star-gate.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <199905030226.TAA65033@rah.star-gate.com>; from Amancio Hasty on Sun, May 02, 1999 at 07:26:08PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Amancio Hasty: |Sorry about that . Originally the Bt848 driver was very easy to configure and |it didn't need any other external drivers . There outght to be a way for |a driver to query for dependent drivers and load them if necessary to |avoid the current driver dependency configuration and if it doesnt find the |dependent driver whenever possible fall back to a default behavior. Agreed. I've been thinking the same thing. Why force users that don't know (and don't want to know) the code to get intimate with implementation-specific details? Some will post to this list and maybe get a reply. Others will just give up and move on. Randall To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 19:18:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B813F14D35 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 19:18:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA08391; Mon, 3 May 1999 19:18:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199905040218.TAA08391@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Randall Hopper Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: bktr (brooktree device) In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 03 May 1999 22:07:21 EDT." <19990503220721.A7476@ipass.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 19:18:07 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG HI Randall, Can you ask Roger to "ifdef" out the icbus stuff in the bt848 driver if an icbus application really needs the device then they can compile in the icbus code in the bt848 driver for 99.999 percent of the bt848 users don't use the icbus driver. At a later date if a process is implemented to resolv inter driver dependencies for static drivers such as the bt848 then we can revert back to the icbus default in the bt848 driver. -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 19:23:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7799514D35 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 19:23:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id TAA09564; Mon, 3 May 1999 19:23:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 19:23:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199905040223.TAA09564@apollo.backplane.com> To: Mike Smith Cc: Nick Hibma , FreeBSD hackers mailing list Subject: Re: names of globale variables References: <199905040143.SAA01330@dingo.cdrom.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> machine three times because of a typo (buf instead of buffer) in the :> USB Communications Class Driver. :> :> Wouldn't some more elaborate names be more appropriate to avoid these :> problems? : :"struct buf" is actually a very longstanding BSD tradition. I don't :think we would easily be able to rename it, no. : :> sys/buf.h: :> :> extern int nbuf; /* The number of buffer headers */ :> extern struct buf *buf; /* The buffer headers. */ :> extern char *buffers; /* The buffer contents. */ :> extern int bufpages; /* Number of memory pages in the buffer */ We can't change the struct name, but we could change the name of the globals... 'buf' and 'buffers' are only used in a couple of places. But... not now. Maybe in a few months when things are more settled down. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 20: 1:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0128E14FC0 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:01:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id XAA24353; Mon, 3 May 1999 23:01:26 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199905040301.XAA24353@cs.rpi.edu> To: "G. Adam Stanislav" Cc: "David E. Cross" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: wc* routines In-Reply-To: Message from "G. Adam Stanislav" of "Mon, 03 May 1999 12:35:51 CDT." <19990503123551.A220@whizkidtech.net> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 23:01:25 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > Ugh... I am already working on this, and have 99% of the wc* functions > > written and documented (I posted awhile back with the location of a very > > pre-alpha set of my work, and asked for patches ;) > > Yes, I am aware of that. I did get the pre-alpha back then. But are you > doing ALL of the functions from wchar.h and wctype.h? Such as fwprintf()? > I did not see those in the pre-alpha. > > This is why I am asking in the first place. I certainly do not want to > duplicate your effort. :-) If you are doing it all, great! If not, please > let me know what else needs to be done. Ah, sorry. I didn't even know of fwprintf(). My experience with wchar and NLS library functions is limited to what motif and CDE requires to build. I would be most interested in working with you to get a complete set of everything done. I will post a beta version of my work shortly (including man pages :). -- David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 20:15:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6AE5414FB1 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:15:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id UAA40827 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:13:49 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 20:13:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Clock code patch sought. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG There was a patch floating around that re-read the clock registers several times for broken hardware, to get rid of the problems of user time going backwards due to misreads. I have been unable to find exact references in the archives.. does anyone remember the patches in question? It was within the last year.. julian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 20:20:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from home.dragondata.com (home.dragondata.com [204.137.237.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81E08156B3 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:20:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from toasty@home.dragondata.com) Received: (from toasty@localhost) by home.dragondata.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id WAA09953; Mon, 3 May 1999 22:20:43 -0500 (CDT) From: Kevin Day Message-Id: <199905040320.WAA09953@home.dragondata.com> Subject: Re: Clock code patch sought. In-Reply-To: from Julian Elischer at "May 3, 1999 8:13:47 pm" To: julian@whistle.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 22:20:42 -0500 (CDT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > There was a patch floating around that re-read the clock registers several > times for broken hardware, to get rid of the problems of user time going > backwards due to misreads. > > I have been unable to find exact references in the archives.. > does anyone remember the patches in question? > > It was within the last year.. > > julian > > http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr.cgi?pr=6630 Take a look. I had to modify it to do 4 reads, instead of 2 though. Kevin To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 20:35:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DB7F15791 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:35:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id UAA41179; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:34:08 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 20:34:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Kevin Day Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Clock code patch sought. In-Reply-To: <199905040320.WAA09953@home.dragondata.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG do you have a 4 read version ofthe patch :-) julian On Mon, 3 May 1999, Kevin Day wrote: > > There was a patch floating around that re-read the clock registers several > > times for broken hardware, to get rid of the problems of user time going > > backwards due to misreads. > > > > I have been unable to find exact references in the archives.. > > does anyone remember the patches in question? > > > > It was within the last year.. > > > > julian > > > > > > http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr.cgi?pr=6630 > > Take a look. > > I had to modify it to do 4 reads, instead of 2 though. > > > Kevin > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 20:44:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.HiWAAY.net (fly.HiWAAY.net [208.147.154.56]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FF23159CE for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:44:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sprice@hiwaay.net) Received: from localhost (sprice@localhost) by mail.HiWAAY.net (8.9.1a/8.9.0) with ESMTP id WAA24779; Mon, 3 May 1999 22:44:23 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 22:44:23 -0500 (CDT) From: Steve Price To: "David E. Cross" Cc: "G. Adam Stanislav" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: wc* routines In-Reply-To: <199905040301.XAA24353@cs.rpi.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 3 May 1999, David E. Cross wrote: # > > Ugh... I am already working on this, and have 99% of the wc* functions # > > written and documented (I posted awhile back with the location of a very # > > pre-alpha set of my work, and asked for patches ;) # > # > Yes, I am aware of that. I did get the pre-alpha back then. But are you # > doing ALL of the functions from wchar.h and wctype.h? Such as fwprintf()? # > I did not see those in the pre-alpha. # > # > This is why I am asking in the first place. I certainly do not want to # > duplicate your effort. :-) If you are doing it all, great! If not, please # > let me know what else needs to be done. # # Ah, sorry. I didn't even know of fwprintf(). My experience with wchar and # NLS library functions is limited to what motif and CDE requires to build. # I would be most interested in working with you to get a complete set of # everything done. I will post a beta version of my work shortly (including # man pages :). Great! Adam and I spoke about this in private mail at some length before he made his orginal post. He (nor do I) has any intention of duplicating any of your work. We are here to help with what you and John Fieber have already started. We all want to see wchar support make it into FreeBSD. Adam has offered to help with the coding. Just for the record I'd like to help too, but I'm not as strong at this stuff as the rest of you. I do have commit privs so I'm sure I can help get it into the distribution at least. :) Would anyone besides me (and Adam whom I've already talked about this) think it wise to have jmb setup a mailing list for posts specific to i18n and l10n? I'd be glad to send him a request if there was enough interest. -steve To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 20:50:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A2118157D1 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:50:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id UAA41446; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:46:31 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 20:46:29 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Kevin Day Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Clock code patch sought. In-Reply-To: <199905040320.WAA09953@home.dragondata.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 3 May 1999, Kevin Day wrote: > > There was a patch floating around that re-read the clock registers several > > times for broken hardware, to get rid of the problems of user time going > > backwards due to misreads. > > > > I have been unable to find exact references in the archives.. > > does anyone remember the patches in question? > > > > It was within the last year.. > > > > julian > > > > > > http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr.cgi?pr=6630 > > Take a look. > > I had to modify it to do 4 reads, instead of 2 though. like this? retrieving revision 1.129 diff -u -r1.129 clock.c --- clock.c 1998/12/14 13:30:29 1.129 +++ clock.c 1999/05/04 03:44:52 @@ -416,6 +416,9 @@ { u_long ef; int high, low; +#if CPU_CYRIX_NO_I8254_LATCH + int ret1, ret2; +#endif ef = read_eflags(); disable_intr(); @@ -425,10 +428,35 @@ low = inb(TIMER_CNTR0); high = inb(TIMER_CNTR0); +#if CPU_CYRIX_NO_I8254_LATCH + ret1 = (high << 8) | low; + outb(TIMER_MODE, TIMER_SEL0 | TIMER_LATCH); + low = inb(TIMER_CNTR0); + high= inb(TIMER_CNTR0); + ret2 = (high <<8) | low; + ret1 = ret1 > ret2 ? ret1 : ret2; + + outb(TIMER_MODE, TIMER_SEL0 | TIMER_LATCH); + low = inb(TIMER_CNTR0); + high= inb(TIMER_CNTR0); + ret2 = (high <<8) | low; + ret1 = ret1 > ret2 ? ret1 : ret2; + + outb(TIMER_MODE, TIMER_SEL0 | TIMER_LATCH); + low = inb(TIMER_CNTR0); + high= inb(TIMER_CNTR0); + ret2 = (high <<8) | low; + ret1 = ret1 > ret2 ? ret1 : ret2; +#endif + CLOCK_UNLOCK(); write_eflags(ef); +#if CPU_CYRIX_NO_I8254_LATCH + return (ret1); +#else return ((high << 8) | low); +#endif } > > > Kevin > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 21: 5:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F3FEF157AC for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 21:05:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id VAA41717; Mon, 3 May 1999 21:03:36 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 21:03:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Steve Price Cc: "David E. Cross" , "G. Adam Stanislav" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: wc* routines In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 3 May 1999, Steve Price wrote: > On Mon, 3 May 1999, David E. Cross wrote: > > Would anyone besides me (and Adam whom I've already talked > about this) think it wise to have jmb setup a mailing list > for posts specific to i18n and l10n? I'd be glad to send > him a request if there was enough interest. I presume you've got all the wchar support stuff SUN released on a BSD license? > > -steve > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 21:10:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.HiWAAY.net (fly.HiWAAY.net [208.147.154.56]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2FCD14D4D for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 21:10:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sprice@hiwaay.net) Received: from localhost (sprice@localhost) by mail.HiWAAY.net (8.9.1a/8.9.0) with ESMTP id XAA06160; Mon, 3 May 1999 23:10:45 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 23:10:45 -0500 (CDT) From: Steve Price To: Julian Elischer Cc: "David E. Cross" , "G. Adam Stanislav" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: wc* routines In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 3 May 1999, Julian Elischer wrote: # I presume you've got all the wchar support stuff SUN released on a BSD # license? No, please do tell. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 21:13:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 522E41520C for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 21:13:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id AAA25615 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 00:13:20 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199905040413.AAA25615@cs.rpi.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: getting the MAC address of an interface Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 00:13:19 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I have looked at the source for ifconfig as well as dhclient, but I still a bit confused as to how one obtains the MAC address of an interface (there seem to be mutliple ways). I am interested in the following, I am given the symbolic name (ie 'xl0') of an interface, from that get the IP, netmask, broadcast, and MAC for the card. For the first 3, I just create a unbound UDP socket, ioctl(fd, SIOCG[IFADDR|IFBRDADDR],...). How do I get the netmask? How do I get the MAC (looking arround it seems I could get the MAC with AF_LINK, is that correct?) How do I get the hardware type? It would be no god to get the MAC without being on an ETHER or FDDI network connection. -- David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 21:37:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from implode.root.com (root.com [209.102.106.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2459E15467 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 21:37:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@implode.root.com) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA05874; Mon, 3 May 1999 21:34:29 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199905040434.VAA05874@implode.root.com> To: Wes Peters Cc: sthaug@nethelp.no, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Decent network cards for 100Mbit? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 03 May 1999 19:19:30 MDT." <372E4B22.4EC5B758@softweyr.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 21:34:29 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >> >I should probably point out I'm doing network throughput torture >> >tests with 64-byte packets. ;^) Any reasonably good Fast Ethernet > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > >> Your benchmark is broken. The pro/100, for one, can easily do 100Mbps >> continuously. I should know since not only did I write the driver, but I > >The benchmark isn't broken, it's just weird. No card can do 100Mbps with >64-byte packets, the preamble lops off 1/3 of your performance using those >itty bitty packets. The PNIC came closer to the theoretical max than anything >else. Sorry, I read your message too quickly. I retract my statement. :-) The Intel card _should_ perform as well as anything. I don't think the code could be written any more efficiently (I've tried, believe me), and the architecture is very clean, so I guess I don't understand how another card could do better unless there are some latencies or inter-frame gaps that the hardware is creating. -DG David Greenman Co-founder/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project - http://www.freebsd.org Creator of high-performance Internet servers - http://www.terasolutions.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 21:55: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 689CB15025 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 21:54:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA08325 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 22:54:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id WAA54862 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 22:55:33 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199905040455.WAA54862@harmony.village.org> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: What does this error message mean? Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 22:55:33 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In debugging some experimental code in the kernel, I started seeing the following message, followed a little while later by a panic. Data modified on freelist: word 2 of object 0xc059e260 size 20 previous type devbuf (0x80 != 0xdeadc0de) My guess is that one of two things is happening. Either I'm writing to memory after I've free'd it, or I'm freeing something twice. Is it possible to tell from this message which one I'm doing? Or am I all wet and it really means something else? Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 22: 3: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from home.dragondata.com (home.dragondata.com [204.137.237.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ACE19156B3 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 22:03:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from toasty@home.dragondata.com) Received: (from toasty@localhost) by home.dragondata.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id AAA17090; Tue, 4 May 1999 00:03:03 -0500 (CDT) From: Kevin Day Message-Id: <199905040503.AAA17090@home.dragondata.com> Subject: Re: Clock code patch sought. In-Reply-To: from Julian Elischer at "May 3, 1999 8:46:29 pm" To: julian@whistle.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 00:03:01 -0500 (CDT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > > There was a patch floating around that re-read the clock registers several > > > times for broken hardware, to get rid of the problems of user time going > > > backwards due to misreads. > > > > > > I have been unable to find exact references in the archives.. > > > does anyone remember the patches in question? > > > > > > It was within the last year.. > > > > > > julian > > > > > > > > > > http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr.cgi?pr=6630 > > > > Take a look. > > > > I had to modify it to do 4 reads, instead of 2 though. > > > > like this? > retrieving revision 1.129 > diff -u -r1.129 clock.c > --- clock.c 1998/12/14 13:30:29 1.129 > +++ clock.c 1999/05/04 03:44:52 Yep, that's it. :) Kevin To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 22: 4:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DD0915122 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 22:04:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA08360; Mon, 3 May 1999 23:04:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id XAA54935; Mon, 3 May 1999 23:05:26 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199905040505.XAA54935@harmony.village.org> To: non@ever.sanda.gr.jp Subject: Re: newconfig/dynamic configuration (sys4c990410-newconfig990413-kld990426test3.patch) Cc: newconfig@jp.freebsd.org, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 26 Apr 1999 21:58:41 +0900." <19990426215841Z.non@ever.sanda.gr.jp> References: <19990426215841Z.non@ever.sanda.gr.jp> <19990426035932W.uch@nop.or.jp> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 23:05:26 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <19990426215841Z.non@ever.sanda.gr.jp> non@ever.sanda.gr.jp writes: : FYI: from [newconfig-jp 1774] : : Newconfig/dynamic configuration patch by Mr. UCHIYAMA Yasushi is : available at: : ftp://ftp.nop.or.jp/users/uch/PCMCIA/FreeBSD/sys4c990410-newconfig990413-kld990426test3.patch.gz I was able to boot this kernel (actually the one that was in the newconfig CVS repository on April 28) on my Sony VAIO. It recognized my cardbus card, and I was able to attach the ep driver to my 3C589D. I didn't have a network handy to test the card out on, however. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 22: 7:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B339A15122 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 22:07:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA08374; Mon, 3 May 1999 23:06:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id XAA54964; Mon, 3 May 1999 23:07:54 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199905040507.XAA54964@harmony.village.org> To: Boris Popov Subject: Re: Drivers collection (was:Arlan 655 driver for FreeBSD) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:25:24 +0700." References: Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 23:07:54 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message Boris Popov writes: : Any opinions ? I'm surprised no one has followed up on this. I think this is an excellent idea. It will allow an easy way for GPL'd things to be included in a system by the end user. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 22: 8:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 15333154FB for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 22:08:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA08381; Mon, 3 May 1999 23:07:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id XAA54990; Mon, 3 May 1999 23:08:51 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199905040508.XAA54990@harmony.village.org> To: newconfig@jp.freebsd.org Subject: Re: [newconfig 39] Re: newconfig/dynamic configuration (sys4c990410-newconfig990413-kld990426test3.patch) Cc: non@ever.sanda.gr.jp, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 03 May 1999 23:05:26 MDT." <199905040505.XAA54935@harmony.village.org> References: <199905040505.XAA54935@harmony.village.org> <19990426215841Z.non@ever.sanda.gr.jp> <19990426035932W.uch@nop.or.jp> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 23:08:51 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <199905040505.XAA54935@harmony.village.org> Warner Losh writes: : I was able to boot this kernel (actually the one that was in the : newconfig CVS repository on April 28) on my Sony VAIO. It recognized : my cardbus card, and I was able to attach the ep driver to my 3C589D. ^^^^ I should have said bridge here. My cardbus bridge. and my PC CARD 3C589D. Sorry for my mistaken. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 22:20: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A9A015054 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 22:20:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id WAA42856; Mon, 3 May 1999 22:12:43 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 22:12:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Steve Price Cc: "David E. Cross" , "G. Adam Stanislav" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, terry@whistle.com Subject: Re: wc* routines In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG terry posted the URL several times.. I'll forward this to him again..... julian On Mon, 3 May 1999, Steve Price wrote: > On Mon, 3 May 1999, Julian Elischer wrote: > > # I presume you've got all the wchar support stuff SUN released on a BSD > # license? > > No, please do tell. > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 23:29:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from login-2.eunet.no (login-2.eunet.no [193.71.71.239]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0B5E1508E for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 23:29:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) Received: from login-1.eunet.no (mbendiks@login-1.eunet.no [193.71.71.238]) by login-2.eunet.no (8.9.3/8.9.0/GN) with ESMTP id IAA07637; Tue, 4 May 1999 08:29:37 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (mbendiks@localhost) by login-1.eunet.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA11174; Tue, 4 May 1999 08:29:37 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from mbendiks@eunet.no) X-Authentication-Warning: login-1.eunet.no: mbendiks owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 08:29:37 +0200 (CEST) From: Marius Bendiksen To: Kelly Yancey Cc: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: new loader question / module question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > 320x240 is currently in syscons and that is interleaved. And believe it > or not...320x240 looks a lot nicer than 320x200. And not to hold Windows > up as a shining example of the way things ought to be, but I'm almost > positive their splash screen is actually 320x240 mode X. It is 320x400. The reason why 320x240 looks better is due to the 4:3 aspect ratio. - Marius - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 23:33:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D4D915043 for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 23:32:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id PAA09714; Tue, 4 May 1999 15:50:18 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id PAA38304; Tue, 4 May 1999 15:50:12 +0930 (CST) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 15:50:12 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Warner Losh Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: No deadc0de (was: What does this error message mean?) Message-ID: <19990504155011.T10134@freebie.lemis.com> References: <199905040455.WAA54862@harmony.village.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199905040455.WAA54862@harmony.village.org>; from Warner Losh on Mon, May 03, 1999 at 10:55:33PM -0600 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Monday, 3 May 1999 at 22:55:33 -0600, Warner Losh wrote: > > In debugging some experimental code in the kernel, I started seeing > the following message, followed a little while later by a panic. > > Data modified on freelist: word 2 of object 0xc059e260 size 20 previous type devbuf (0x80 != 0xdeadc0de) This suggests you're using INVARIANTS, right? > My guess is that one of two things is happening. Either I'm writing > to memory after I've free'd it, or I'm freeing something twice. Is > it possible to tell from this message which one I'm doing? It suggests to me that it's at least the first. The message comes from malloc() in kern/kern_malloc.c, and it's expecting to find what it put in there in free() (0xdeadc0de). Of course, that doesn't mean you're not free()ing twice, but free() checks for that with INVARIANTS, so I'd guess you're not doing that. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 23:33:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 071441508E; Mon, 3 May 1999 23:32:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id PAA09691; Tue, 4 May 1999 15:42:44 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id PAA38267; Tue, 4 May 1999 15:42:26 +0930 (CST) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 15:42:26 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Mike Smith Cc: Nick Hibma , FreeBSD Chat Subject: Hysterical names (was: names of globale variables) Message-ID: <19990504154225.S10134@freebie.lemis.com> References: <199905040143.SAA01330@dingo.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199905040143.SAA01330@dingo.cdrom.com>; from Mike Smith on Mon, May 03, 1999 at 06:43:09PM -0700 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [following up to -chat] On Monday, 3 May 1999 at 18:43:09 -0700, Mike Smith wrote: >> >> Isn't the choice of the variables names below a bit odd? It crashed my >> machine three times because of a typo (buf instead of buffer) in the >> USB Communications Class Driver. >> >> Wouldn't some more elaborate names be more appropriate to avoid these >> problems? > > "struct buf" is actually a very longstanding BSD tradition. I don't > think we would easily be able to rename it, no. It goes back further than BSD. Here's the definition from a pre-BSD /usr/src/buf.h, probably some of the oldest C code in existence: -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 592 Jan 22 1973 buf.h struct buf { int b_flags; struct buf *b_forw; struct buf *b_back; struct buf *av_forw; struct buf *av_back; int b_dev; int b_wcount; char *b_addr; char *b_blkno; } buf[NBUF]; This is the Third Edition of AT&T UNIX (and no, it doesn't have a copyright notice :-). Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 3 23:46:33 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6EC0314D8E for ; Mon, 3 May 1999 23:46:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA08567; Tue, 4 May 1999 00:45:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id AAA55414; Tue, 4 May 1999 00:47:05 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199905040647.AAA55414@harmony.village.org> To: Greg Lehey Subject: Re: No deadc0de (was: What does this error message mean?) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 04 May 1999 15:50:12 +0930." <19990504155011.T10134@freebie.lemis.com> References: <19990504155011.T10134@freebie.lemis.com> <199905040455.WAA54862@harmony.village.org> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 00:47:05 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <19990504155011.T10134@freebie.lemis.com> Greg Lehey writes: : This suggests you're using INVARIANTS, right? Yes. Otherwise I might have tried to commit this code by now :-) The INVARIANTS stuff has found a few other errors in my new code, so I'm very happy about them. : > My guess is that one of two things is happening. Either I'm writing : > to memory after I've free'd it, or I'm freeing something twice. Is : > it possible to tell from this message which one I'm doing? : : It suggests to me that it's at least the first. The message comes : from malloc() in kern/kern_malloc.c, and it's expecting to find what : it put in there in free() (0xdeadc0de). Of course, that doesn't mean : you're not free()ing twice, but free() checks for that with : INVARIANTS, so I'd guess you're not doing that. OK. That is a good hint. I think I'll look more closely at what I'm doing... Too bad I it would be so "hard" to implement purify like functionality in the kernel. Hmmm, on second thought how hard is it to unmap pages from the kernel. I'm not worried about the performance hit, I just want to get the panic where I touch the free'd memory rather than later when I reboot. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 1:48:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from awfulhak.org (awfulhak.force9.co.uk [195.166.136.63]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D004154DF for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 01:48:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brian@lan.awfulhak.org) Received: from keep.lan.Awfulhak.org (brian@keep.lan.Awfulhak.org [172.16.0.8]) by awfulhak.org (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id JAA18521; Tue, 4 May 1999 09:48:42 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from brian@lan.awfulhak.org) Received: from keep.lan.Awfulhak.org (brian@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by keep.lan.Awfulhak.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA00704; Tue, 4 May 1999 08:46:41 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from brian@keep.lan.Awfulhak.org) Message-Id: <199905040746.IAA00704@keep.lan.Awfulhak.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "David E. Cross" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: getting the MAC address of an interface In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 04 May 1999 00:13:19 EDT." <199905040413.AAA25615@cs.rpi.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 08:46:41 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Have a look at src/usr.sbin/ppp/iface.c. It's probably a bit less abstract than the ifconfig code. > I have looked at the source for ifconfig as well as dhclient, but I > still a bit confused as to how one obtains the MAC address of an interface > (there seem to be mutliple ways). I am interested in the following, > I am given the symbolic name (ie 'xl0') of an interface, from that > get the IP, netmask, broadcast, and MAC for the card. For the first 3, I > just create a unbound UDP socket, ioctl(fd, SIOCG[IFADDR|IFBRDADDR],...). > How do I get the netmask? How do I get the MAC (looking arround it seems > I could get the MAC with AF_LINK, is that correct?) How do I get the > hardware type? It would be no god to get the MAC without being on an > ETHER or FDDI network connection. > > -- > David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu > Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd > Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 > Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 > I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD -- Brian Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour ! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 2:42:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tch.org (tacostand.tch.org [199.74.220.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B052414EFC for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 02:42:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ser@tch.org) Received: (from ser@localhost) by tch.org (8.9.1/8.9.1) id CAA37463; Tue, 4 May 1999 02:40:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ser) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 02:40:53 -0700 From: Steve Rubin To: Brian Somers Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: bktr (brooktree device) Message-ID: <19990504024052.A37443@tch.org> References: <19990501183900.A26114@tch.org> <199905020842.JAA40738@keep.lan.Awfulhak.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <199905020842.JAA40738@keep.lan.Awfulhak.org>; from Brian Somers on Sun, May 02, 1999 at 09:42:17AM +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > iicbb0 should be a controller according to LINT. Did this change at some point? -- Steve Rubin ser@tch.org TCH Network Services http://www.tch.org/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 2:56:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp1.vnet.net (smtp1.vnet.net [166.82.1.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06CE6150C4 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 02:56:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp1.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id FAA14418; Tue, 4 May 1999 05:57:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA02017; Tue, 4 May 1999 05:56:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id FAA50237; Tue, 4 May 1999 05:56:12 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 05:56:12 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199905040956.FAA50237@lakes.dignus.com> To: julian@whistle.com, sprice@hiwaay.net Subject: Re: wc* routines Cc: adam@whizkidtech.net, crossd@cs.rpi.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, terry@whistle.com In-Reply-To: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > terry posted the URL several times.. > I'll forward this to him again..... Maybe it was to a different forum?? I don't recall seeing it either. Anyway, please send me the URL as well... - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 4:19:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from relay01.indigo.ie (relay01.indigo.ie [194.125.133.225]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 092E514E45 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 04:19:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from niall@pobox.com) Received: (qmail 22571 messnum 238228 invoked from network[194.125.148.32/ts03-032.dublin.indigo.ie]); 4 May 1999 11:19:25 -0000 Received: from ts03-032.dublin.indigo.ie (HELO pobox.com) (194.125.148.32) by relay01.indigo.ie (qp 22571) with SMTP; 4 May 1999 11:19:25 -0000 Message-ID: <372EE68D.C8775DCC@pobox.com> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 12:22:37 +0000 From: Niall Smart X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Unresolved symbols in dynamically loaded shared objects. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, Is it possible to arrange for unresolved symbols in shared objects which have been loaded using dlopen() to be searched for in the parent object? i.e. if fn_x is defined in the parent object and undefined in the loaded object then the linker would resolve it to the aforementioned fn_x. If this isn't possible then is there a way to emulate this behaviour, by using stubs in the dynamically loaded object perhaps? Regards, Niall To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 5:28:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02C671511C; Tue, 4 May 1999 05:28:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id FAA15591; Tue, 4 May 1999 05:28:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199905041228.FAA15591@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: ViaVoice... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 05:28:36 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG From one of IBM's software engineers: ---- Distributions - we're pleased to be shipping initially with Red Hat to make this technology widely available. Caldera has signed on for a future release. IBM is committed to supporting multiple distributions, and we expect there will be additional channels over time, particularly as we expand beyond US English. (Oops, I violated that "no strategy" rule!) ----- Who knows if enough interest is shown from the FreeBSD camp , the ViaVoice team may release their product for FreeBSD. The ViaVoice mailing list is at: http://viavoice.sparklist.com -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 6:13:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.HiWAAY.net (fly.HiWAAY.net [208.147.154.56]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F75D14F57 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 06:13:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sprice@hiwaay.net) Received: from localhost (sprice@localhost) by mail.HiWAAY.net (8.9.1a/8.9.0) with ESMTP id IAA26667; Tue, 4 May 1999 08:13:29 -0500 (CDT) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 08:13:29 -0500 (CDT) From: Steve Price To: Julian Elischer Cc: "David E. Cross" , "G. Adam Stanislav" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, terry@whistle.com Subject: Re: wc* routines In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 3 May 1999, Julian Elischer wrote: # terry posted the URL several times.. # I'll forward this to him again..... Yes, the ones I saw pointed to a set of patches and to some code that was claimed to be in the xview source from X11R5. Here's the URL for the messsage that I found. http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/getmsg.cgi?fetch=323385+325924+/usr/local/www/db/text/1998/freebsd-hackers/19981206.freebsd-hackers The URL in that message is now unreachable from my location on the net planet. I did find a set of patches that fit this description here: ftp://ftp.x.org/contrib/R5contrib-fixes/Xwchar/ But if you'll take a look at these patches they definitely do go with any code I can find in xview-3.2. There is some code in xview that looks like it can be for this, but it doesn't have things like fwprintf. It only appears to have enough to suit its own purposes not a full implementation. Needless to say I'd be very interested if Terry could enlighten us once again with the magic URL. :) -steve To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 6:28:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kronos.alcnet.com (kronos.alcnet.com [207.244.223.187]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BC0715117 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 06:28:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kbyanc@alcnet.com) X-Provider: ALC Communications, Inc. http://www.alcnet.com/ Received: from localhost (kbyanc@localhost) by kronos.alcnet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/antispam) with ESMTP id JAA72890; Tue, 4 May 1999 09:39:57 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 09:39:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Kelly Yancey To: Marius Bendiksen Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: new loader question / module question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 4 May 1999, Marius Bendiksen wrote: > > 320x240 is currently in syscons and that is interleaved. And believe it > > or not...320x240 looks a lot nicer than 320x200. And not to hold Windows > > up as a shining example of the way things ought to be, but I'm almost > > positive their splash screen is actually 320x240 mode X. > > It is 320x400. > > The reason why 320x240 looks better is due to the 4:3 aspect ratio. > > - Marius - > > Great. All the more reason to finish these patches for supporting the various "tweaked" modes. :) Hopefully, I'll have something out by the end of the week. Kelly ~kbyanc@alcnet.com~ "Silly penguin, Linux is for kids" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 7:26:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from at.dotat.com (zed.dotat.com [203.2.134.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA7EF14E4C; Tue, 4 May 1999 07:26:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hart@at.dotat.com) Received: from at.dotat.com (localhost.dotat.com [127.0.0.1]) by at.dotat.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA22540; Tue, 4 May 1999 23:57:35 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199905041427.XAA22540@at.dotat.com> To: Amancio Hasty Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ViaVoice... In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 04 May 1999 05:28:36 MST." <199905041228.FAA15591@rah.star-gate.com> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 23:57:35 +0930 From: Leigh Hart Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi Amancio, I presume from this that you had no luck getting it working? The list has been deathly silent about it... I have managed to get over the missing libary issues, but now I just core dump (Bad system call) when trying to run the engine, and this when I run vvuseradm: /usr/lib/ViaVoice/bin/vvuseradm -newuser -userid hart Connect: SmConnect() failed, rc = -4 Connect: SmConnect() failed, SM_RC_OK, Successful completion. /usr/lib/ViaVoice/bin/vvuseradm: Connect() failed, rc = -4 *sigh* Amancio Hasty wrote: > From one of IBM's software engineers: > ---- > Distributions - we're pleased to be shipping initially with Red > Hat to make thistechnology widely available. Caldera has signed > on for a future release. IBM is committed to supporting multiple > distributions, and we expect there will be additional channels over > time, particularly as we expand beyond US English. > (Oops, I violated that "no strategy" rule!) > ----- > > Who knows if enough interest is shown from the FreeBSD camp , > the ViaVoice team may release their product for FreeBSD. > > The ViaVoice mailing list is at: > > http://viavoice.sparklist.com Cheers Leigh -- | "By the time they had diminished | Leigh Hart, | | from 50 to 8, the other dwarves | CCNA - http://www.cisco.com/ | | began to suspect 'Hungry' ..." | GPO Box 487 Adelaide SA 5001 | | -- Gary Larson, "The Far Side" | http://www.dotat.com/hart/ | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 7:37:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from whizkidtech.net (r13.bfm.org [208.18.213.109]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 886CA154CC for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 07:37:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adam@whizkidtech.net) Received: (from adam@localhost) by whizkidtech.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) id JAA00249; Tue, 4 May 1999 09:37:09 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from adam) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 09:37:08 -0500 From: "G. Adam Stanislav" To: "David E. Cross" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: wc* routines Message-ID: <19990504093708.C217@whizkidtech.net> References: <199905040301.XAA24353@cs.rpi.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <199905040301.XAA24353@cs.rpi.edu>; from David E. Cross on Mon, May 03, 1999 at 11:01:25PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, May 03, 1999 at 11:01:25PM -0400, David E. Cross wrote: > Ah, sorry. I didn't even know of fwprintf(). My experience with wchar and > NLS library functions is limited to what motif and CDE requires to build. > I would be most interested in working with you to get a complete set of > everything done. I will post a beta version of my work shortly (including > man pages :). Very good. Thanks, Adam To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 8:30:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E9DAE157A4 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 08:30:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from terry@whistle.com) Received: from whistle.com (tlambert.whistle.com [207.76.205.208]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id IAA52845; Tue, 4 May 1999 08:24:19 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <372F0E66.605A31E3@whistle.com> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 08:12:38 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.06 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steve Price Cc: Julian Elischer , "David E. Cross" , "G. Adam Stanislav" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: wc* routines References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Steve Price wrote: > > On Mon, 3 May 1999, Julian Elischer wrote: > > # terry posted the URL several times.. > # I'll forward this to him again..... > > Needless to say I'd be very interested if Terry could enlighten > us once again with the magic URL. :) ftp://ftp.whistle.com/pub/terry/i18n/ -- Terry Lambert -- Whistle Communications, Inc. -- terry@whistle.com ------------------------------------------------------------------- This is formal notice under California Assembly Bill 1629, enacted 9/26/98 that any UCE sent to my email address will be billed $50 per incident to the legally allowed maximum of $25,000. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 9: 6:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gwdu60.gwdg.de (gwdu60.gwdg.de [134.76.10.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD3E11520C for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 09:06:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kheuer@gwdu60.gwdg.de) Received: from localhost (kheuer@localhost) by gwdu60.gwdg.de (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id SAA81181 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 18:06:45 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from kheuer@gwdu60.gwdg.de) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 18:06:45 +0200 (CEST) From: Konrad Heuer To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: the new ar utility ... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=X-UNKNOWN Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Sorry for asking a question here but I fear I won't get any response in freebsd-questions ... From=20time to time I give a course titled `Introduction into Program Development in the UNIX Environment'. I was happy all the time with the `ar' utility of FreeBSD not providing an `s' flag - so I could demonstrate the difference between an object file archive and a random library (after applying `ranlib'). A few days ago, first time with 3.1-R, I was very surprised that the archive I created during the course as an example immediately had a symbol table (`s' seems to be applied by default)! `Ar' is now GNU `ar' - as far as I've seen. No problem with that - in the future I will know. But: How can I best keep track of such changes? Any suggestion? // // Konrad Heuer ____ ___ _____= __=20 // Gesellschaft f=FCr wissenschaftliche / __/______ ___ / _ )/ __= / _ \ // Datenverarbeitung mbH G=D6ttingen / _// __/ -_) -_) _ |\ \/= // / // Am Fa=DFberg, D-37077 G=D6ttingen /_/ /_/ \__/\__/____/___= /____/=20 // Deutschland (Germany) ----- The Power to Serve ----= - // http://www.freebsd.org // kheuer@gwdu60.gwdg.de // To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 10:12:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from helios.dnttm.ru (unknown [193.232.0.205]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8384314C0F for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 10:12:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dima@tejblum.dnttm.rssi.ru) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by helios.dnttm.ru (8.9.1/8.9.1/IP-3) with UUCP id VAA20971; Tue, 4 May 1999 21:09:12 +0400 Received: from tejblum.dnttm.rssi.ru (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tejblum.dnttm.rssi.ru (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id VAA04689; Tue, 4 May 1999 21:11:45 +0400 (MSD) (envelope-from dima@tejblum.dnttm.rssi.ru) Message-Id: <199905041711.VAA04689@tejblum.dnttm.rssi.ru> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0gamma 1/27/96 To: "G. Adam Stanislav" Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: wc* routines In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 03 May 1999 11:36:48 CDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 21:11:45 +0400 From: Dmitrij Tejblum Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Well, just several comments (all IMO). > At the present, the page contains some introduction to what wc* routines are > for, as well as the headers and . I also created an > additional, system specific, header which I called . I would > like your input on whether the contents of this header belong there, or should > be moved to , or perhaps whether its name should be changed, > and such. Well, not bad. Still, your headers apparently have too much namespace pollution. Your include . Apparently, to get definition of va_list. First, the modern definition of va_list is in (symlink to , conflict with ), second, you should not include any of them, you should use _BSD_VA_LIST_, just like . Likewise, you should not include . Try use some similar trick. In general, everything more than and is too much. should not exist. _BSD* macros missng from should be added there. WCS* macros have unknown purpose and pollute the namespace, therefore they should not exist. In general, headers under machine/ should be machine-depended :-). I don't like your idea that WEOF == INT_MIN. Apparently, everyone else have WEOF == -1 (== EOF), and there is no reason why we should not too. I don't know about "debugging purposes". WEOF == EOF should allow more code sharing with existing libc. Note that FreeBSD already have some very sparse and nonstandard (but functional) wchar support. > I started with the headers because it does not seem to make much sense to me > to work on the code without good headers. Well, but implementation is also important ;-). Unimplemented headers are somewhat confusing when committed into the tree - we already have examples... > Also, what belongs inside those > headers is pretty much defined by standards, so they were fairly easy to > write. :-) Note that a major portion of already almost implemented in FreeBSD: plain ctype functions work with wide characters. So it should be fairly easy to write an almost working . (BTW, it is somewhere on my ToDo list for quite some time, but now not that far from the top). Good luck. Dima To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 10:21:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lamb.sas.com (lamb.sas.com [192.35.83.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4C4B14C0F for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 10:21:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brdean@unx.sas.com) Received: from mozart (mozart.unx.sas.com [192.58.184.8]) by lamb.sas.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) with SMTP id NAA17120 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 13:21:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dean.pc.sas.com by mozart (5.65c/SAS/Domains/5-6-90) id AA11039; Tue, 4 May 1999 13:20:54 -0400 Received: (from brdean@localhost) by dean.pc.sas.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id NAA22383; Tue, 4 May 1999 13:20:54 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from brdean) From: Brian Dean Message-Id: <199905041720.NAA22383@dean.pc.sas.com> Subject: udp checksum overkill To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 13:20:54 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, I've implemented my own OS and have recently added network boot capability to it. In the process of doing this I have implemented a TFTP download of my kernel from my FreeBSD system. It has been a very enlightening experience, especially with regard to my admittedly minimal IP stack. My question to those in the know is why does the UDP checksum not only cover it's own header and data, but also portions of the IP header, i.e., the checksum is calculated over the udp pseudo header which includes the source/dest ip addresses, the protocol, and a repeat of the udp hdr+data length? Steven's book (vol 1) indicates that it is there to provide a double check that the udp layer was delivered a packet that was actually intended for it (hence the inclusion of the ip addresses). However, isn't this checksum coverage redundant because IP has it's own header checksum (which is mandatory, unlike UDP) that covers these fields. The packet would be discarded if the IP header checksum fails, and unless the ip layer is buggy, the udp layer would never get a packet that was not intended for it. Additionally, if a host has multiple interfaces, how (without more extensive processing) can the udp layer determine (by using the checksum which includes src/dst ip addresses) that a packet was intended for it or not? I.e., wouldn't the udp checksum verification require a computation of the checksum using all possible interface addresses installed on the system before it could say whether the packet was delivered to it by mistake? It seems to me that it would be much simpler just to run down the list of interfaces and see if one of their addresses matches the dst ip address in the packet, if not, then discard it. Or am I totally missing the point of the extended coverage of the checksum? Thanks, -Brian -- Brian Dean brdean@unx.sas.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 11:15:54 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gateway.cybernet.com (gateway.cybernet.com [192.245.33.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 695B315B1B for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 11:15:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mtaylor@cybernet.com) Received: from spiffy.cybernet.com (spiffy.cybernet.com [192.245.33.55]) by gateway.cybernet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA21322 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 14:15:51 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from mtaylor@cybernet.com) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 14:17:28 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: mtaylor@cybernet.com Organization: Cybernet Systems From: "Mark J. Taylor" To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: sio patch to make 65650 work Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Here's a quick patch to sio.c, relative to 3.1-RELEASE, to make the 65654 serial chip work. It is a high-speed serial port, and bit 7 of the MCR is a "divide by 4" indicator. In divide by four mode, its rates go down from 115200 kbps, like "normal" serial chips. This patch basically keeps bit 7 "as-is", and does NOT support the higer rates. It is only meant as an interim patch to at least get these boards *working*. I've tested it on an 8-port board with this chipset on it. It does not break the "regular" serial chipset support. (I put a serial mouse on a few of the ports, and it worked under X11.) Perhaps someone can review this and maybe commit it? Or is it too much of a "hack"? This is the -hackers list, right. ;) *** sio.c Mon Jan 25 23:04:01 1999 --- sio.c Tue May 4 12:24:36 1999 *************** *** 743,746 **** --- 743,747 ---- failures[1] = inb(iobase + com_ier) - IER_ETXRDY; failures[2] = inb(iobase + com_mcr) - mcr_image; + if (failures[2] == 0x80) { mcr_image |= 0x80; failures[2] = 0; } DELAY(10000); /* Some internal modems need this time */ irqmap[1] = isa_irq_pending(); *************** *** 2327,2331 **** return (bits); } ! mcr = 0; if (bits & TIOCM_DTR) mcr |= MCR_DTR; --- 2328,2332 ---- return (bits); } ! mcr = ((how != DMBIC) && (com->mcr_image & 0x80)) ? 0x80 : 0; if (bits & TIOCM_DTR) mcr |= MCR_DTR; *************** *** 2586,2590 **** * an interrupt by floating the IRQ line. */ ! outb(iobase + com_mcr, (sp->mcr & MCR_IENABLE) | MCR_DTR | MCR_RTS); } --- 2587,2591 ---- * an interrupt by floating the IRQ line. */ ! outb(iobase + com_mcr, (sp->mcr & MCR_IENABLE) | MCR_DTR | MCR_RTS | (sp->mcr & 0x80) ? 0x80 : 0); } --- Mark J. Taylor Networking Research Cybernet Systems mtaylor@cybernet.com 727 Airport Blvd. PHONE (734) 668-2567 Ann Arbor, MI 48108 FAX (734) 668-8780 http://www.cybernet.com/ http://www.netmax.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 11:44:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2659714F94 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 11:44:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id LAA18532; Tue, 4 May 1999 11:42:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 11:42:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199905041842.LAA18532@apollo.backplane.com> To: Doug Rabson , Kevin Day , jso@research.att.com Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: kern/11470: V3 NFS problem (fwd) References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'm going to move this to -hackers to allow people to pool their interest in regards to fixing the remaining NFS problems. I am also CCing the parties involved. In regards to kern/11470. This bug report is relative to FreeBSD-3.1. I haven't had rm -rf problems myself, and there were a huge number of bugs fixed in NFS in FreeBSD-stable (3.x) since the 3.1 release. I would ask jso@research.att.com to update his 3.1 machines to the latest FreeBSD-stable and repeat his tests. I will comment on Kevin's bug report below next to his itemized list. -Matt Matthew Dillon :Did you see this one? It is almost certainly caused by the client being :confused when we invalidate their directory cookies. The BSD nfs server is :pretty fascist about cookies and invalidates them too often. Can you think :of a better scheme than the directory timestamp for cookies? : :-- :Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com :Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 : : :---------- Forwarded message ---------- :Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 14:23:47 -0700 (PDT) :From: jso@research.att.com :To: freebsd-gnats-submit@freebsd.org :Subject: kern/11470: V3 NFS problem : :>Number: 11470 :>Category: kern :>Synopsis: V3 NFS problem :>Confidential: no :>Severity: critical :>Priority: high :>Responsible: freebsd-bugs :>State: open :>Quarter: :>Keywords: :>Date-Required: :>Class: sw-bug :>Submitter-Id: current-users :>Arrival-Date: Mon May 3 14:30:00 PDT 1999 :>Closed-Date: :>Last-Modified: :>Originator: Jerry So :>Release: 3.1 :>Organization: :AT&T Labs-Research :>Environment: :FreeBSD spaceless 3.1-RELEASE FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE #0: Tue Apr 20 17:57:03 EDT 1999 root@spaceless:/usr/src/sys/compile/SPACELESS i386 : :>Description: :NFS client is solaris 2.6 or irix 6.4 :NFS server is freebsd 3.1 : :For example: :When doing a rm -Rf gcc-2.8.1 on NFS client :rm: Unable to remove directory gcc-2.8.1/config/i386: File exists :rm: Unable to remove directory gcc-2.8.1/config/m68k: File exists :rm: Unable to remove directory gcc-2.8.1/config: File exists :rm: Unable to remove directory gcc-2.8.1: File exists : :resulted. : :Only NFS v3 is having problem. Machines with V2 is OK. : :>How-To-Repeat: : :Repeat any time :>Fix: : : :>Release-Note: :>Audit-Trail: :>Unformatted: : : :To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org :with "unsubscribe freebsd-bugs" in the body of the message : : :From: Kevin Day : :Ok, I've been playing with your last patches (just before they were :committed). : :I still see at least three outstanding things. :) : : :1) if I 'sysctl -w vfs.nfs.async=1' on the server, the client will :eventually get deadlocked, with most processes stuck in 'nfsrcvlk' or :'nfsinval'(i think) Yes, I'm sure there are still a couple of lockup situations that we need to fix in this area. I need to know whether this is via NFSV2 or NFSV3 and whether this is a UDP or TCP mount. And, if it is a TCP mount, whether the problem occurs with a UDP mount. A similar situation occured with TCP when I was doing makes that turned out to be a data corruption bug related to multiple RPC's winding up in the same mbuf. Note: If your *SERVER* is not running the latest -current, you have to upgrade it. If your server is running FreeBSD-stable, the TCP fix (which is a server-side bug) has NOT yet been committed to FreeBSD-stable. :2) If I set a cpu time limit for a process, and the executable file is being :ran over NFS, if it exceeds the CPU limit, i get flooded with "vm_fault: pager :error"'s This is definitely a bug. I'll bet you are using an 'intr' or 'soft' mount, yes? There are still some serious bugs with 'intr' mounts interacting badly with the VM system, but they should be relatively easy to fix. :3) See PR 7728. NFS server is also a web server, dumping logs into user's :home directories. Our FTP server is an NFS client. When clients try to :download their log files, the ftpd process gets stuck (kill -9 won't kill :it). This also happens when they try to upload over top of a file they just :viewed on the web server. : :Processes seem to get stuck in 'sbwait' (which really doesn't seem like it's :stuck), or 'nfsrcv' What is occuring is that existing VM cache pages are being ripped out from under the client and the client is getting confused. I'll need to work up a reliable way to reproduce the problem between a client and server in order to squash it. If someone else can come up with a simple script to run on the client & the server that reproduces the problem, we will be able to squash it more quickly. -Matt :In all though, thanks a *lot* for your help with NFS. :) It seems much more :stable now, i'm not afraid to compile things over nfs anymore. :) : :Kevin To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 11:44:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E1A515238; Tue, 4 May 1999 11:44:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA17973; Tue, 4 May 1999 11:44:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199905041844.LAA17973@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Leigh Hart Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ViaVoice... In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 04 May 1999 23:57:35 +0930." <199905041427.XAA22540@at.dotat.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 11:44:17 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi Leigh, I guess is time to do a little debugging on the linux layer and find out what is upsetting it . It should be straight forward to put in a few printfs in linux_newuname... > Hi Amancio, > > I presume from this that you had no luck getting it working? > > The list has been deathly silent about it... I have managed > to get over the missing libary issues, but now I just core > dump (Bad system call) when trying to run the engine, and > this when I run vvuseradm: > > /usr/lib/ViaVoice/bin/vvuseradm -newuser -userid hart > Connect: SmConnect() failed, rc = -4 > Connect: SmConnect() failed, SM_RC_OK, Successful completion. > > /usr/lib/ViaVoice/bin/vvuseradm: Connect() failed, rc = -4 > > *sigh* > > Amancio Hasty wrote: > > From one of IBM's software engineers: > > ---- > > Distributions - we're pleased to be shipping initially with Red > > Hat to make thistechnology widely available. Caldera has signed > > on for a future release. IBM is committed to supporting multiple > > distributions, and we expect there will be additional channels over > > time, particularly as we expand beyond US English. > > (Oops, I violated that "no strategy" rule!) > > ----- > > > > Who knows if enough interest is shown from the FreeBSD camp , > > the ViaVoice team may release their product for FreeBSD. > > > > The ViaVoice mailing list is at: > > > > http://viavoice.sparklist.com > > Cheers > > Leigh > -- > | "By the time they had diminished | Leigh Hart, | > | from 50 to 8, the other dwarves | CCNA - http://www.cisco.com/ | > | began to suspect 'Hungry' ..." | GPO Box 487 Adelaide SA 5001 | > | -- Gary Larson, "The Far Side" | http://www.dotat.com/hart/ | -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 12: 7:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from home.dragondata.com (home.dragondata.com [204.137.237.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42156154E6 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 12:07:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from toasty@home.dragondata.com) Received: (from toasty@localhost) by home.dragondata.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id OAA07822; Tue, 4 May 1999 14:06:11 -0500 (CDT) From: Kevin Day Message-Id: <199905041906.OAA07822@home.dragondata.com> Subject: Re: kern/11470: V3 NFS problem (fwd) In-Reply-To: <199905041842.LAA18532@apollo.backplane.com> from Matthew Dillon at "May 4, 1999 11:42:56 am" To: dillon@apollo.backplane.com (Matthew Dillon) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 14:06:10 -0500 (CDT) Cc: dfr@nlsystems.com, jso@research.att.com, hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > :From: Kevin Day > : > :Ok, I've been playing with your last patches (just before they were > :committed). > : > :1) if I 'sysctl -w vfs.nfs.async=1' on the server, the client will > :eventually get deadlocked, with most processes stuck in 'nfsrcvlk' or > :'nfsinval'(i think) > > Yes, I'm sure there are still a couple of lockup situations that > we need to fix in this area. I need to know whether this is via > NFSV2 or NFSV3 and whether this is a UDP or TCP mount. And, if it is > a TCP mount, whether the problem occurs with a UDP mount. A similar > situation occured with TCP when I was doing makes that turned out to be > a data corruption bug related to multiple RPC's winding up in the same > mbuf. > > Note: If your *SERVER* is not running the latest -current, you have to > upgrade it. If your server is running FreeBSD-stable, the TCP fix (which > is a server-side bug) has NOT yet been committed to FreeBSD-stable. We're mounting with NFS V3, and UDP. The nfs server in most of my testing was a 2.2.5 server, but this also occurred with a 4.0 nfs server. > > :2) If I set a cpu time limit for a process, and the executable file is being > :ran over NFS, if it exceeds the CPU limit, i get flooded with "vm_fault: pager > :error"'s > > This is definitely a bug. I'll bet you are using an 'intr' or 'soft' > mount, yes? There are still some serious bugs with 'intr' mounts > interacting badly with the VM system, but they should be relatively easy > to fix. No, I ended up taking out soft and intr a while ago, since they created instability when the nfs server became unreachable. > > :3) See PR 7728. NFS server is also a web server, dumping logs into user's > :home directories. Our FTP server is an NFS client. When clients try to > :download their log files, the ftpd process gets stuck (kill -9 won't kill > :it). This also happens when they try to upload over top of a file they just > :viewed on the web server. > : > :Processes seem to get stuck in 'sbwait' (which really doesn't seem like it's > :stuck), or 'nfsrcv' > > What is occuring is that existing VM cache pages are being ripped out from > under the client and the client is getting confused. I'll need to work > up a reliable way to reproduce the problem between a client and server > in order to squash it. If someone else can come up with a simple script > to run on the client & the server that reproduces the problem, we will > be able to squash it more quickly. > If my time permits, I'll try to find a easily reproducable instance, but I think my weekend is going to go to upgrading the NFS server from 2.2.5 to something more current. Kevin To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 12:19:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B6A4314E09 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 12:19:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA53767; Tue, 4 May 1999 20:19:34 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 20:19:34 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Matthew Dillon Cc: Kevin Day , jso@research.att.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: kern/11470: V3 NFS problem (fwd) In-Reply-To: <199905041842.LAA18532@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 4 May 1999, Matthew Dillon wrote: > I'm going to move this to -hackers to allow people to pool their interest > in regards to fixing the remaining NFS problems. I am also CCing the > parties involved. > > In regards to kern/11470. This bug report is relative to FreeBSD-3.1. > I haven't had rm -rf problems myself, and there were a huge number of bugs > fixed in NFS in FreeBSD-stable (3.x) since the 3.1 release. > > I would ask jso@research.att.com to update his 3.1 machines to the latest > FreeBSD-stable and repeat his tests. > > I will comment on Kevin's bug report below next to his itemized list. Note that this is really a bug in someone elses NFS client. FreeBSD is running the server here and is gratuitously (but perfectly legally) invalidating the client's cookies. I fixed a bunch of this kind of thing in FreeBSD's client a couple of years ago. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 13: 0:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E2E115740 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 13:00:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA53777; Tue, 4 May 1999 20:29:38 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 20:29:38 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Kevin Day Cc: Matthew Dillon , jso@research.att.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: kern/11470: V3 NFS problem (fwd) In-Reply-To: <199905041906.OAA07822@home.dragondata.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 4 May 1999, Kevin Day wrote: > > :From: Kevin Day > > : > > :Ok, I've been playing with your last patches (just before they were > > :committed). > > : > > :1) if I 'sysctl -w vfs.nfs.async=1' on the server, the client will > > :eventually get deadlocked, with most processes stuck in 'nfsrcvlk' or > > :'nfsinval'(i think) > > > > Yes, I'm sure there are still a couple of lockup situations that > > we need to fix in this area. I need to know whether this is via > > NFSV2 or NFSV3 and whether this is a UDP or TCP mount. And, if it is > > a TCP mount, whether the problem occurs with a UDP mount. A similar > > situation occured with TCP when I was doing makes that turned out to be > > a data corruption bug related to multiple RPC's winding up in the same > > mbuf. > > > > Note: If your *SERVER* is not running the latest -current, you have to > > upgrade it. If your server is running FreeBSD-stable, the TCP fix (which > > is a server-side bug) has NOT yet been committed to FreeBSD-stable. > > We're mounting with NFS V3, and UDP. The nfs server in most of my testing was a > 2.2.5 server, but this also occurred with a 4.0 nfs server. I would expect the same behaviour for virtually any version of FreeBSD NFS server since 2.2. I don't think the algorithm in the server has changed since then. Basically, what is happening is that we are using the modtime of a directory to validate the seek offsets which are being sent to us by a client. Since files are being removed, this means that the client is told that its cookies are invalid and ought to re-read the directory from scratch. Instead it is giving up and pretending that the directory was truncated. This is a client bug, not a FreeBSD server bug but it would be possible to use a different algorithm for validating directory seek cookies. It would probably need hooks into the underlying vfs to be really efficient. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 14:49:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from whizkidtech.net (r22.bfm.org [208.18.213.118]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6751814DD8 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 14:49:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adam@whizkidtech.net) Received: (from adam@localhost) by whizkidtech.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) id QAA00299; Tue, 4 May 1999 16:49:35 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from adam) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 16:49:04 -0500 From: "G. Adam Stanislav" To: Dmitrij Tejblum Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: wc* routines Message-ID: <19990504164904.A217@whizkidtech.net> References: <199905041711.VAA04689@tejblum.dnttm.rssi.ru> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <199905041711.VAA04689@tejblum.dnttm.rssi.ru>; from Dmitrij Tejblum on Tue, May 04, 1999 at 09:11:45PM +0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, May 04, 1999 at 09:11:45PM +0400, Dmitrij Tejblum wrote: > Well, just several comments (all IMO). Actually, you made some very good suggestions. Spasibo! :-) > Well, not bad. Still, your headers apparently have too much namespace > pollution. Your include . Apparently, to > get definition of va_list. First, the modern definition of va_list is > in (symlink to , conflict with ), > second, you should not include any of them, you should use _BSD_VA_LIST_, > just like . Likewise, you should not include . Try use some > similar trick. In general, everything more than and > is too much. Done. Changed all occurences of "va_list" to "_BSD_VA_LIST". Removed "#include ". Replaced "#include " with "struct __sFILE;". Replaced all occurences of "FILE *" with "struct __sFILE *". This will have a side effect: If someone uses putwchar or getwchar without including explicitly, they will get an error (since stdin and stdout will be undefined). But I suppose that should be an error anyway. (Should it?) > should not exist. _BSD* macros missng from > should be added there. Yes, that was the original idea. Then I decided to use for now since I want to have something that works but that I can change as necessary before I request the formal change to . I did not mention it on the web page because I wanted to hear what others think about it. :-) But eventually, I would like to have moved. > WCS* macros have unknown > purpose and pollute the namespace, therefore they should not exist. In > general, headers under machine/ should be machine-depended :-). OK, they can be easily moved to or even removed, renamed, whatever. They are not part of the standard. I thought they might be useful for internal use of the code (but then, I can move them to the appropriate C file). The wctype(const char*) function is to convert a character string, such as "upper" into a return value of type wctype_t which can then be used as an argument to iswctype(). So, for example, iswctype(ch, wctype("upper")); is functionally identical with (wint_t) iswupper(ch); Similarly, towctrans(ch, wctrans("upper"); is the functional equivalent of towupper(ch); > I don't like your idea that WEOF == INT_MIN. Apparently, everyone else > have WEOF == -1 (== EOF), and there is no reason why we should not too. > I don't know about "debugging purposes". WEOF == EOF should allow more > code sharing with existing libc. Note that FreeBSD already have some > very sparse and nonstandard (but functional) wchar support. OK, noted. I have not changed this one (not saying I won't). I would like to hear others' opinions on this one. There is at least one function (I do not recall straight from the head which one or which ones) that must return WEOF if EOF is passed to it. Their purpose is similar but not absolutely identical. The standard says WEOF need not be -1, or for that matter a negative number. Although I fail to see how it could be positive since any positive wint_t can later become a valid ISO-10646 wide character, and we have no way of knowing which codes will be added in the future. > > I started with the headers because it does not seem to make much sense to me > > to work on the code without good headers. > > Well, but implementation is also important ;-). Unimplemented headers are > somewhat confusing when committed into the tree - we already have examples... It's the chicken and the egg dilemma. I wanted to create the headers first because I am not the only one working on the code, and we all need to use the same headers. Besides, I need to include them in my code anyway. > Note that a major portion of already almost implemented in FreeBSD: > plain ctype functions work with wide characters. So it should be fairly > easy to write an almost working . (BTW, it is somewhere on my > ToDo list for quite some time, but now not that far from the top). Thanks for the tip. I'll take a look at the code. > Good luck. Thanks, Adam P.S. I have uploaded the changes to the web page. Independent of this message, I also added some more links to the page earlier today, including the link to the web page which contains the formal request to add Klingon alphabet to ISO 10646 (I just couldn't resist when I discovered it :). I think ISO 10646 will grow so big, we will eventually need to create dedicated font servers (hmmm... there's a tought...). To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 14:55: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp1.vnet.net (smtp1.vnet.net [166.82.1.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC75F14DD8 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 14:54:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp1.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA18370; Tue, 4 May 1999 17:55:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA02992; Tue, 4 May 1999 17:54:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id RAA54448; Tue, 4 May 1999 17:54:43 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 17:54:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199905042154.RAA54448@lakes.dignus.com> To: adam@whizkidtech.net, dima@tejblum.dnttm.rssi.ru Subject: Re: wc* routines Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19990504164904.A217@whizkidtech.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > P.S. I have uploaded the changes to the web page. Independent of this message, > I also added some more links to the page earlier today, including the link to > the web page which contains the formal request to add Klingon alphabet to > ISO 10646 (I just couldn't resist when I discovered it :). > > I think ISO 10646 will grow so big, we will eventually need to create > dedicated font servers (hmmm... there's a tought...). > And, for those of us that lost the web page URL - can you post it again? :-) - Thanks - - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 15:53:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from whizkidtech.net (r6.bfm.org [208.18.213.102]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F040914A12 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 15:53:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adam@whizkidtech.net) Received: (from adam@localhost) by whizkidtech.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) id RAA00229; Tue, 4 May 1999 17:52:55 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from adam) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 17:52:23 -0500 From: "G. Adam Stanislav" To: Thomas David Rivers Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: wc* routines Message-ID: <19990504175223.A217@whizkidtech.net> References: <19990504164904.A217@whizkidtech.net> <199905042154.RAA54448@lakes.dignus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <199905042154.RAA54448@lakes.dignus.com>; from Thomas David Rivers on Tue, May 04, 1999 at 05:54:43PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, May 04, 1999 at 05:54:43PM -0400, Thomas David Rivers wrote: > And, for those of us that lost the web page URL - can you post it again? :-) Sure: http://www.whizkidtech.net/i18n/wc/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 16:16:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com (gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com [207.113.159.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EC4214E65 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 16:16:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gdonl@tsc.tdk.com) Received: from sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com (root@sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com [192.168.241.191]) by gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA05762; Tue, 4 May 1999 16:16:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gdonl@tsc.tdk.com) Received: from salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com (salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com [192.168.241.194]) by sunrise.gv.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA18280; Tue, 4 May 1999 16:16:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from gdonl@localhost) by salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA06393; Tue, 4 May 1999 16:16:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Don Lewis Message-Id: <199905042316.QAA06393@salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com> Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 16:16:13 -0700 In-Reply-To: Peter Wemm "Re: flock + kernel threads bug" (Apr 26, 8:29pm) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(3) 7/19/95) To: Peter Wemm , Luoqi Chen Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, peter.jeremy@auss2.alcatel.com.au Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Apr 26, 8:29pm, Peter Wemm wrote: } Subject: Re: flock + kernel threads bug } Luoqi Chen wrote: } > > Luoqi Chen wrote: } > > } > > > I've been thinking about a more drastic one, store the same PID in the } > > > threads' proc structure. PID is no more than a name of a process in the } > > > userland, and in userland we see all the threads as the same process. } > > > I don't think we really need a thread id, the threads are anonymous. } > > > Inside the kernel, the threads or processes are still named by their } > > > (struct proc *) pointer, so there won't be any confusion. } > > } > > selwakeup() is keyed from pid, not 'struct proc *' and is rather dependent } > > on these being unique... } > > } > I could see why pid is used here, the process selecting on the fd may have } > disappeared. Using pid doesn't solve the problem completely, another process } > may have assumed the same pid. A better solution would be store both struct } > proc * and pid, and use pid as some kind of generation number: if this pid } > is different from p_pid in struct proc, we know the original struct proc * } > must have gone (with the rare exception that another process has assumed } > both the struct proc storage and pid number). We could do this because } > struct proc's are allocated from type safe storage. This would save us the } > costly pfind(). I solved a similar problem with F_SETOWN and friends. See kern/7899 for more details, though the final patch is slightly different. } In order to minimize select very costly select wakeup collisions, we need } to be able to track multiple waiters.. Tracking a couple of hundred } waiters on a selinfo multiplies any extra storage.. Yeah, the solution I used for F_SETOWN, might be too heavy-weight for select(). To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 16:56:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6CCE515268 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 16:55:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id QAA20828; Tue, 4 May 1999 16:55:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 16:55:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199905042355.QAA20828@apollo.backplane.com> To: "David E. Cross" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, schimken@cs.rpi.edu, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: 'nother NFS panic on 3.1-STABLE-Sun Mar 21 References: <199905030253.WAA27609@cs.rpi.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :crash, this time I have the crashdump. (BTW: I issued 'savecore' on the machine :and it said "no coredump", yet I issued a dd bs=512 if=/dev/wd0s1b skip= :OFFSET of=crashfile, and I have a valid core.) Below is what I find to be :interesting in the PS output: : :USER PID %CPU %MEM VSZ RSS TT STAT STARTED TIME COMMAND UID PID PPID CPU PRI NI VSZ RSS WCHAN STAT TT TIME COMMAND :root 34338 39.2 0.0 296 0 ?? R - 0:00.00 (nfsd) 0 34338 34337 276 -6 0 296 0 - R ?? 0:00.00 (nfsd) :root 167 0.0 0.0 262984 0 ?? Ss - 0:00.00 (rpc.statd) 0 167 1 0 2 0 262984 0 select Ss ?? 0:00.00 (rpc.statd) : :Does this sugggest anything to anyone? (We will be upgrading this machine :shortly, I just hope to gather some insight as to what tripped this. Our :new kernels will be config -g; strip --no-debug kernels :) : :-- :David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu :Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd :Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 :Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 :I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD I looked at the code and your original bug report but could not find anything obvious. A stack backtrace will probably not yield enough information, but a crash dump would be primo if you can manage to get one. In order for a crash dump to work, total swap space must be at least as large as main memory, /var/crash must have sufficient space (i.e. be a tad larger then main memory), and crash dumps must be enabled via the 'dumpdev' /etc/rc.conf variable. For example, if your swap partition is /dev/sd0b, you would put 'dumpdev="/dev/sd0b"' in your rc.conf. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 18: 9:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from Genesis.Denninger.Net (kdhome-2.pr.mcs.net [205.164.6.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73EB6150EC for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 18:09:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from karl@Genesis.Denninger.Net) Received: (from karl@localhost) by Genesis.Denninger.Net (8.9.3/8.8.2) id UAA13936 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 4 May 1999 20:09:37 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net> Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 20:09:37 -0500 From: Karl Denninger To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: MP3 player? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i Organization: Karl's Sushi and Packet Smashers X-Die-Spammers: Spammers will be LARTed and the remains fed to my cat Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@denninger.net) Web: fathers.denninger.net I ain't even *authorized* to speak for anyone other than myself, so give up now on trying to associate my words with any particular organization. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 18:16:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wcug.wwu.edu (sloth.wcug.wwu.edu [140.160.164.200]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 02EEE1586D for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 18:16:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tcole@wcug.wwu.edu) Received: (qmail 7520 invoked by uid 1085); 5 May 1999 01:16:29 -0000 Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 18:16:29 -0700 From: Travis Cole To: Karl Denninger Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: MP3 player? Message-ID: <19990504181629.A7487@wcug.wwu.edu> References: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net>; from Karl Denninger on Tue, May 04, 1999 at 08:09:37PM -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, May 04, 1999 at 08:09:37PM -0500, Karl Denninger wrote: > Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? > Tons. Check the ports. I use mpg123 all the time. /usr/ports/audio/mpg123 There are also several graphical players. I think x11amp is even supposed to work. -- --Travis Take a look at: www.OpenBSD.org www.NetBSD.org www.FreeBSD.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 18:18:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from paprika.michvhf.com (paprika.michvhf.com [209.57.60.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id CC0F314DD3 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 18:18:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from vev@michvhf.com) Received: (qmail 14898 invoked by uid 1001); 5 May 1999 01:18:41 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 21:18:41 -0400 (EDT) X-Face: *0^4Iw) To: Karl Denninger Subject: RE: MP3 player? Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 05-May-99 Karl Denninger wrote: > Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? mpg123 works, it may even be in ports/packages. The current version of X11Amp requires linux threads so I didn't bother trying to compile it and AFAIK it's the first version that would play from over the net. mpg123 does that, at least. mpg123 is also command line. Vince. -- ========================================================================== Vince Vielhaber -- KA8CSH email: vev@michvhf.com flame-mail: /dev/null # include TEAM-OS2 Online Campground Directory http://www.camping-usa.com Online Giftshop Superstore http://www.cloudninegifts.com ========================================================================== To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 18:21: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from Genesis.Denninger.Net (kdhome-2.pr.mcs.net [205.164.6.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE578150EC for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 18:20:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from karl@Genesis.Denninger.Net) Received: (from karl@localhost) by Genesis.Denninger.Net (8.9.3/8.8.2) id UAA15816; Tue, 4 May 1999 20:20:42 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <19990504202042.A15807@Denninger.Net> Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 20:20:42 -0500 From: Karl Denninger To: Vince Vielhaber Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: MP3 player? References: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: ; from Vince Vielhaber on Tue, May 04, 1999 at 09:18:41PM -0400 Organization: Karl's Sushi and Packet Smashers X-Die-Spammers: Spammers will be LARTed and the remains fed to my cat Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, May 04, 1999 at 09:18:41PM -0400, Vince Vielhaber wrote: > > On 05-May-99 Karl Denninger wrote: > > Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? > > mpg123 works, it may even be in ports/packages. The current version of > X11Amp requires linux threads so I didn't bother trying to compile it and > AFAIK it's the first version that would play from over the net. mpg123 > does that, at least. mpg123 is also command line. Thanks; I'm actually looking for command line, not graphical. BTW, if anyone's curious the new Real MP3 "ripper/Jukebox" is awesome. Combine with Samba and you get a HUGE repository (just read in all your CDs) in MP3 format. Consider the possibilities for whole-house audio with something like this! -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@denninger.net) Web: fathers.denninger.net I ain't even *authorized* to speak for anyone other than myself, so give up now on trying to associate my words with any particular organization. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 18:21: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from web129.yahoomail.com (web129.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.198]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id C88ED14DD3 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 18:21:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from robertbutler@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <19990505012101.21135.rocketmail@web129.yahoomail.com> Received: from [205.226.11.3] by web129.yahoomail.com; Tue, 04 May 1999 18:21:01 PDT Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 18:21:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Robert Butler Subject: How do you trace/debug the shared library using gdb? To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG If I load only the symbol of the dynamically linked executable I cannot go into the the shared library at all. But if I assign the symbol to the shared library when it reaches the breakpoint it will print out something like "Error accessing memory address 0xfd3005ff: Invalid argument". For instance, how can I trace the source code of routine pcap_open_live() called from tcpdump? Thanks in advance -Robert _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 18:46: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from wopr.caltech.edu (wopr.caltech.edu [131.215.240.222]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BA3F15081 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 18:45:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mph@wopr.caltech.edu) Received: (from mph@localhost) by wopr.caltech.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) id SAA25960; Tue, 4 May 1999 18:45:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mph) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 18:45:37 -0700 From: Matthew Hunt To: Vince Vielhaber Cc: Karl Denninger , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MP3 player? Message-ID: <19990504184537.A25930@wopr.caltech.edu> References: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: ; from Vince Vielhaber on Tue, May 04, 1999 at 09:18:41PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, May 04, 1999 at 09:18:41PM -0400, Vince Vielhaber wrote: > mpg123 works, it may even be in ports/packages. The current version of > X11Amp requires linux threads so I didn't bother trying to compile it and > AFAIK it's the first version that would play from over the net. mpg123 > does that, at least. mpg123 is also command line. Both mpg123 and x11amp are in ports. -- Matthew Hunt * Science rules. http://www.pobox.com/~mph/ * To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 18:54: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gw1.pl.cp (adsl-209-76-108-39.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [209.76.108.39]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBB72154AE for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 18:53:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ab@ab.zoopark.org) Received: from localhost (gene@localhost) by gw1.pl.cp (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id SAA03731; Tue, 4 May 1999 18:53:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ab@ab.zoopark.org) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 18:53:54 -0700 (PDT) From: "Eugene M. Kim" X-Sender: gene@gw1.pl.cp To: Karl Denninger Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MP3 player? In-Reply-To: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG /usr/ports/audio/mpg123 Cheers, Eugene On Tue, 4 May 1999, Karl Denninger wrote: | Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? | | -- | -- Eugene M. Kim "Is your music unpopular? Make it popular; make music which people like, or make people who like your music." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 18:55: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 190E315527 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 18:55:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id SAA73362; Tue, 4 May 1999 18:50:18 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 18:50:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Karl Denninger Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MP3 player? In-Reply-To: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG lots of them in ports/audio mgp123 is good for me.. (no yucky gui interface :-) On Tue, 4 May 1999, Karl Denninger wrote: > Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? > > -- > -- > Karl Denninger (karl@denninger.net) Web: fathers.denninger.net > I ain't even *authorized* to speak for anyone other than myself, so give > up now on trying to associate my words with any particular organization. > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 18:56:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp.enteract.com (thor.enteract.com [207.229.143.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 8272315076 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 18:56:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dscheidt@enteract.com) Received: (qmail 24603 invoked from network); 5 May 1999 01:56:14 -0000 Received: from shell-2.enteract.com (dscheidt@207.229.143.41) by thor.enteract.com with SMTP; 5 May 1999 01:56:14 -0000 Received: from localhost (dscheidt@localhost) by shell-2.enteract.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id UAA66612; Tue, 4 May 1999 20:56:10 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dscheidt@enteract.com) X-Authentication-Warning: shell-2.enteract.com: dscheidt owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 20:56:10 -0500 (CDT) From: David Scheidt To: Karl Denninger Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MP3 player? In-Reply-To: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 4 May 1999, Karl Denninger wrote: :Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? Several of em. Look in /usr/ports/audio, of course. David To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 19: 0:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lcremeans.erols.com (lcremeans.erols.com [216.164.87.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77BC215076 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 19:00:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from lee@lcremeans.erols.com) Received: (from lee@localhost) by lcremeans.erols.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id VAA60306; Tue, 4 May 1999 21:59:05 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from lee) Message-ID: <19990504215905.A60301@erols.com> Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 21:59:05 -0400 From: Lee Cremeans To: Karl Denninger , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MP3 player? References: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net>; from Karl Denninger on Tue, May 04, 1999 at 08:09:37PM -0500 X-OS: FreeBSD 3.0-STABLE Organization: My room? Are you crazy? :) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, May 04, 1999 at 08:09:37PM -0500, Karl Denninger wrote: > Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? /usr/ports/audio/mpg123 has always worked fine for me. -lee -- +--------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Lee Cremeans -- Manassas, VA, USA (WakkyMouse on WTnet) | | lcremeans@erols.com | http://wakky.dyndns.org/~lee | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 19:37:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 33C5E15B99 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 19:37:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA35379; Tue, 4 May 1999 22:37:30 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 22:37:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: Karl Denninger Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MP3 player? In-Reply-To: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 4 May 1999, Karl Denninger wrote: > Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? *chuckle* I find it silly that the you don't know the best MP3 player, period, which is for Unix of course, is sitting right under your nose: it's called mpg123. It's even in the ports (it's been there for a long time), along with several other MP3 players and some encoders. > > -- > -- > Karl Denninger (karl@denninger.net) Web: fathers.denninger.net > I ain't even *authorized* to speak for anyone other than myself, so give > up now on trying to associate my words with any particular organization. > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \ _ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___)___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 19:45:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from Genesis.Denninger.Net (kdhome-2.pr.mcs.net [205.164.6.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0ECF815088 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 19:45:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from karl@Genesis.Denninger.Net) Received: (from karl@localhost) by Genesis.Denninger.Net (8.9.3/8.8.2) id VAA18643; Tue, 4 May 1999 21:45:24 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <19990504214523.A18633@Denninger.Net> Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 21:45:23 -0500 From: Karl Denninger To: Brian Feldman Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MP3 player? References: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: ; from Brian Feldman on Tue, May 04, 1999 at 10:37:29PM -0400 Organization: Karl's Sushi and Packet Smashers X-Die-Spammers: Spammers will be LARTed and the remains fed to my cat Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, May 04, 1999 at 10:37:29PM -0400, Brian Feldman wrote: > On Tue, 4 May 1999, Karl Denninger wrote: > > > Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? > > *chuckle* I find it silly that the you don't know the best MP3 > player, period, which is for Unix of course, is sitting right > under your nose: it's called mpg123. It's even in the ports (it's > been there for a long time), along with several other MP3 players > and some encoders. Well, that's why I asked. I saw a bunch of things that *might* play MP3s, but WHAT to use, and what's out there and actually *works*, is another matter. (Yes, I have a "ports" tree :-) I'll check it out. (That might be the perfect excuse to put a second processor in my primary server box here at the house :-) -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@denninger.net) Web: fathers.denninger.net I ain't even *authorized* to speak for anyone other than myself, so give up now on trying to associate my words with any particular organization. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 19:47:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC38215AF1 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 19:47:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id WAA21537; Tue, 4 May 1999 22:47:11 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199905050247.WAA21537@cs.rpi.edu> To: Matthew Dillon Cc: "David E. Cross" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, schimken@cs.rpi.edu, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: 'nother NFS panic on 3.1-STABLE-Sun Mar 21 In-Reply-To: Message from Matthew Dillon of "Tue, 04 May 1999 16:55:52 PDT." <199905042355.QAA20828@apollo.backplane.com> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 22:47:09 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > :crash, this time I have the crashdump. (BTW: I issued 'savecore' on the machine > :and it said "no coredump", yet I issued a dd bs=512 if=/dev/wd0s1b skip= > :OFFSET of=crashfile, and I have a valid core.) Below is what I find to be > :interesting in the PS output: > : > :USER PID %CPU %MEM VSZ RSS TT STAT STARTED TIME COMMAND UID PID PPID CPU PRI NI VSZ RSS WCHAN STAT TT TIME COMMAND > :root 34338 39.2 0.0 296 0 ?? R - 0:00.00 (nfsd) 0 34338 34337 276 -6 0 296 0 - R ?? 0:00.00 (nfsd) > :root 167 0.0 0.0 262984 0 ?? Ss - 0:00.00 (rpc.statd) 0 167 1 0 2 0 262984 0 select Ss ?? 0:00.00 (rpc.statd) > : > :Does this sugggest anything to anyone? (We will be upgrading this machine > :shortly, I just hope to gather some insight as to what tripped this. Our > :new kernels will be config -g; strip --no-debug kernels :) > : > :-- > :David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu > :Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd > :Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 > :Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 > :I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD > > I looked at the code and your original bug report but could not find > anything obvious. A stack backtrace will probably not yield enough > information, but a crash dump would be primo if you can manage to get > one. > > In order for a crash dump to work, total swap space must be at least > as large as main memory, /var/crash must have sufficient space (i.e. be > a tad larger then main memory), and crash dumps must be enabled via > the 'dumpdev' /etc/rc.conf variable. For example, if your swap > partition is /dev/sd0b, you would put 'dumpdev="/dev/sd0b"' in your > rc.conf. > > -Matt > Matthew Dillon > I do have the complete crashdump (unfortunately the kernel was compiled sans debuging information). Would this still be of use? -- David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 19:48: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hp9000.chc-chimes.com (hp9000.chc-chimes.com [206.67.97.84]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 614A1155CD for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 19:48:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from billf@chc-chimes.com) Received: from localhost by hp9000.chc-chimes.com with SMTP (1.39.111.2/16.2) id AA015647229; Tue, 4 May 1999 18:33:49 -0400 Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 18:33:49 -0400 (EDT) From: Bill Fumerola To: Karl Denninger Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MP3 player? In-Reply-To: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 4 May 1999, Karl Denninger wrote: > Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? ports/audio/* has quite a few. This question belongs on freebsd-ports, though it could be easily avoided by an easy trip to http://www.FreeBSD.org/ports/ - bill fumerola - billf@chc-chimes.com - BF1560 - computer horizons corp - - ph:(800) 252-2421 - bfumerol@computerhorizons.com - billf@FreeBSD.org - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 20:48: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from narnia.plutotech.com (narnia.plutotech.com [206.168.67.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48FB414D2B for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 20:47:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gibbs@narnia.plutotech.com) Received: (from gibbs@localhost) by narnia.plutotech.com (8.9.1/8.7.3) id VAA01260; Tue, 4 May 1999 21:38:05 -0600 (MDT) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 21:38:05 -0600 (MDT) From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Message-Id: <199905050338.VAA01260@narnia.plutotech.com> To: Nick Hibma Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: CAM: devices without path X-Newsgroups: pluto.freebsd.hackers In-Reply-To: User-Agent: tin/pre-1.4-980818 ("Laura") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.0-CURRENT (i386)) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article you wrote: > > What extra calls are needed to remove the path as well as the devices if > a CAM controller disappears? I haven't gone through and verified that a manual detach of a SIM is possible yet. I figured I'd cross that bridge once the configuration framework was up to the task, and I'm not sure it quite is yet. I'll be able to look into this in more detail in another week or so. > Currently I do the following > > static void > umass_cam_detach(umass_softc_t *sc) > { > /* Detach from CAM layer > * XXX do we need to delete the device first? > */ > At a minimum, you need to additionally perform an AC_LOST_DEVICE async notification so that the peripheral drivers detach. > xpt_free_path(sc->path); > xpt_bus_deregister(cam_sim_path(sc->sim)); > cam_sim_free(sc->sim, /*free_devq*/TRUE); > } -- Justin To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 20:53:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from jumping-spider.aracnet.com (jumping-spider.aracnet.com [205.159.88.14]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7068214DCF for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 20:53:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from beattie@aracnet.com) Received: from shell2.aracnet.com (IDENT:1728@shell2.aracnet.com [205.159.88.20]) by jumping-spider.aracnet.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id UAA12040 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 20:53:39 -0700 Received: from localhost by shell2.aracnet.com (8.8.7) id UAA07786; Tue, 4 May 1999 20:53:38 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: shell2.aracnet.com: beattie owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 20:53:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Brian Beattie To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: writing cdr or cdrw atapi Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I asked this question on questions and did not get any answer: I have a refurbished Philips CDD3610 CDR/CDRW ATAPI drive. I am trying to get this working, under 3.1-stable as of last night. The driver messages claim to support this drive in both CDR and CDRW. I have tried cdrecord on /dev/racd0c which appears not to work. I have tried wormcontrol which seemed to work but the documentation leads me to think that wormcontrol might be obsolete. Can anybody tell me if ATAPI drives are supported under 3.1-stable. If so what is the correct command to use, and some hint as to what arguments to use. Thanks Brian Beattie | The only problem with beattie@aracnet.com | winning the rat race ... www.aracnet.com/~beattie | in the end you're still a rat To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 21:11: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE976157D6 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 21:10:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from andrew@lake.com.au) Received: from m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20]) by m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id OAA11690 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 14:10:46 +1000 (EST) X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: andrew@lake.com.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. Received: from areilly.bpc-users.org (CPE-24-192-51-95.nsw.bigpond.net.au [24.192.51.95]) by m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with SMTP id OAA07327 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 14:10:44 +1000 (EST) Received: (qmail 69365 invoked by uid 1000); 5 May 1999 04:10:45 -0000 From: "Andrew Reilly" Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 14:10:45 +1000 To: Vince Vielhaber Cc: Karl Denninger , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MP3 player? Message-ID: <19990505141045.A69277@gurney.reilly.home> References: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: ; from Vince Vielhaber on Tue, May 04, 1999 at 09:18:41PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, May 04, 1999 at 09:18:41PM -0400, Vince Vielhaber wrote: > On 05-May-99 Karl Denninger wrote: > > Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? > > mpg123 works, it may even be in ports/packages. The current version of > X11Amp requires linux threads so I didn't bother trying to compile it and Are you sure? gurney [202]$ which x11amp /usr/local/bin/x11amp gurney [203]$ file /usr/local/bin/x11amp /usr/local/bin/x11amp: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, Intel 80386, version 1 (FreeBSD), dynamically linked, not stripped gurney [204]$ ldd $_ /usr/local/bin/x11amp: libX11.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libX11.so.6 (0x280be000) libXext.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libXext.so.6 (0x28153000) libstdc++.so.2 => /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.2 (0x2815d000) libm.so.2 => /usr/lib/libm.so.2 (0x28194000) libc.so.3 => /usr/lib/libc.so.3 (0x281ae000) Seems to work OK for me. I haven't tried to play any files straight from a remote URL, though, if that's what you were talking about. -- Andrew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 21:11:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cain.gsoft.com.au (genesi.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB75A157D3 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 21:11:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Received: from lot.gsoft.com.au (lot.gsoft.com.au [203.38.152.106]) by cain.gsoft.com.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA10837; Wed, 5 May 1999 13:40:39 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net> Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 13:40:39 +0930 (CST) From: "Daniel O'Connor" To: Karl Denninger Subject: RE: MP3 player? Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 05-May-99 Karl Denninger wrote: > Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? There are several.. Have a look in the audio directory of the ports collection. I use gqmpeg and mpg123. --- Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." -- Andrew Tanenbaum To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 21:21: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from WEBBSD1.turnaround.com.au (webbsd1.turnaround.com.au [203.39.138.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 029F9157D6 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 21:20:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from J_Shevland@TurnAround.com.au) Received: from TurnAround.com.au (dhcp68.turnaround.com.au [192.168.1.68]) by WEBBSD1.turnaround.com.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA25799; Wed, 5 May 1999 14:31:32 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from J_Shevland@TurnAround.com.au) Message-ID: <372FC7F3.3280F59A@TurnAround.com.au> Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 14:24:19 +1000 From: Joe Shevland Reply-To: J_Shevland@TurnAround.com.au Organization: Turnaround Solutions Pty. Ltd. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Karl Denninger Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MP3 player? References: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Bundles of. Look in the ports... amp is the only one I've used so far. Karl Denninger wrote: > > Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? > > -- > -- > Karl Denninger (karl@denninger.net) Web: fathers.denninger.net > I ain't even *authorized* to speak for anyone other than myself, so give > up now on trying to associate my words with any particular organization. > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- --------------------------------------------- ,-._|\ | Joe Shevland / \ | Principal Consultant \_,--._/ | Turnaround Solutions Pty. Ltd. v | http://www.TurnAround.com.au --------------------------------------------- It is a dangerous thing to try to reform anyone - Oscar Wilde To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 21:24:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gate.hentschel.net (gate.hentschel.net [209.249.198.42]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A3CD157D6 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 21:24:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@dorothy.hentschel.net) Received: from dorothy.hentschel.net (dorothy [192.168.1.2]) by gate.hentschel.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA00356; Tue, 4 May 1999 21:18:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@dorothy.hentschel.net) Message-Id: <199905050418.VAA00356@gate.hentschel.net> Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 22:15:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Thomas@hentschel.net Subject: Re: MP3 player? To: Karl Denninger Cc: Vince Vielhaber , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19990504202042.A15807@Denninger.Net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 4 May, Karl Denninger wrote: > On Tue, May 04, 1999 at 09:18:41PM -0400, Vince Vielhaber wrote: >> >> On 05-May-99 Karl Denninger wrote: >> > Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? >> >> mpg123 works, it may even be in ports/packages. The current version of > Thanks; I'm actually looking for command line, not graphical. try socket -p 'amp -' $url $port both socket and amp are in the ports tree -Th To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 22:28:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.dyn.ml.org (pm3-15.ppp.wenet.net [206.15.85.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D75951553A for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 22:28:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garbanzo@hooked.net) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.dyn.ml.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id WAA06592; Tue, 4 May 1999 22:28:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garbanzo@hooked.net) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 22:28:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex Zepeda To: Andrew Reilly Cc: Vince Vielhaber , Karl Denninger , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MP3 player? In-Reply-To: <19990505141045.A69277@gurney.reilly.home> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 5 May 1999, Andrew Reilly wrote: > On Tue, May 04, 1999 at 09:18:41PM -0400, Vince Vielhaber wrote: > > On 05-May-99 Karl Denninger wrote: > > > Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? > > > > mpg123 works, it may even be in ports/packages. The current version of > > X11Amp requires linux threads so I didn't bother trying to compile it and > > Are you sure? > > gurney [202]$ which x11amp > /usr/local/bin/x11amp > gurney [203]$ file /usr/local/bin/x11amp > /usr/local/bin/x11amp: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, Intel 80386, > version 1 (FreeBSD), dynamically linked, not stripped > gurney [204]$ ldd $_ > /usr/local/bin/x11amp: > libX11.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libX11.so.6 (0x280be000) > libXext.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libXext.so.6 (0x28153000) > libstdc++.so.2 => /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.2 (0x2815d000) > libm.so.2 => /usr/lib/libm.so.2 (0x28194000) > libc.so.3 => /usr/lib/libc.so.3 (0x281ae000) > > Seems to work OK for me. I haven't tried to play any files > straight from a remote URL, though, if that's what you were > talking about. That is an old version of x11amp, the newer version 0.9x was rewritten to use Gtk+ and LinuxThreads. I personally haven't had any luck getting it to compile, haven't tried any binaries of it (if there are any available), etc. This obviously doesn't mean that it won't work, but it sure won't work without some effort. - alex To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 23:15:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B2F114CE3 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 23:15:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id BAA09216; Wed, 5 May 1999 01:35:19 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 01:35:16 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Matthew Dillon Cc: Doug Rabson , Kevin Day , jso@research.att.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: kern/11470: V3 NFS problem (fwd) In-Reply-To: <199905041842.LAA18532@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 4 May 1999, Matthew Dillon wrote: > :2) If I set a cpu time limit for a process, and the executable file is being > :ran over NFS, if it exceeds the CPU limit, i get flooded with "vm_fault: pager > :error"'s > > This is definitely a bug. I'll bet you are using an 'intr' or 'soft' > mount, yes? There are still some serious bugs with 'intr' mounts > interacting badly with the VM system, but they should be relatively easy > to fix. > > :3) See PR 7728. NFS server is also a web server, dumping logs into user's > :home directories. Our FTP server is an NFS client. When clients try to > :download their log files, the ftpd process gets stuck (kill -9 won't kill > :it). This also happens when they try to upload over top of a file they just > :viewed on the web server. > : > :Processes seem to get stuck in 'sbwait' (which really doesn't seem like it's > :stuck), or 'nfsrcv' > > What is occuring is that existing VM cache pages are being ripped out from > under the client and the client is getting confused. I'll need to work > up a reliable way to reproduce the problem between a client and server > in order to squash it. If someone else can come up with a simple script > to run on the client & the server that reproduces the problem, we will > be able to squash it more quickly. just grab some huge program like 'wine' (i can provide a binary if you want it) and run the program over 10mbit (or serial?) NFS on two slow machines... and delete the binary before it gets entirely paged in? -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 23:25:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cain.gsoft.com.au (genesi.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 584B014C1B for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 23:25:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Received: from lot.gsoft.com.au (lot.gsoft.com.au [203.38.152.106]) by cain.gsoft.com.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA11783; Wed, 5 May 1999 15:53:38 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <19990504202042.A15807@Denninger.Net> Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 15:53:38 +0930 (CST) From: "Daniel O'Connor" To: Karl Denninger Subject: Re: MP3 player? Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Vince Vielhaber Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 05-May-99 Karl Denninger wrote: > BTW, if anyone's curious the new Real MP3 "ripper/Jukebox" is awesome. > Combine with Samba and you get a HUGE repository (just read in all your > CDs) in MP3 format. > > Consider the possibilities for whole-house audio with something like this! Well, I have all my mp3's on my internet gateway machine which always runs FreeBSD. It exports the mp3 tree as NFS and SMB, so no matter what OS my workstation is running it can play my mp3's =) Now all I need is to get a decent Jukebox thingy.. --- Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." -- Andrew Tanenbaum To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 23:29:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD1C514BF7 for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 23:29:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id BAA21161; Wed, 5 May 1999 01:49:37 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 01:49:33 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Alex Zepeda Cc: Andrew Reilly , Vince Vielhaber , Karl Denninger , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MP3 player? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 4 May 1999, Alex Zepeda wrote: > On Wed, 5 May 1999, Andrew Reilly wrote: > > > On Tue, May 04, 1999 at 09:18:41PM -0400, Vince Vielhaber wrote: > > > On 05-May-99 Karl Denninger wrote: > > > > Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? > > > > > > mpg123 works, it may even be in ports/packages. The current version of > > > X11Amp requires linux threads so I didn't bother trying to compile it and > > > > Are you sure? > > > > gurney [202]$ which x11amp > > /usr/local/bin/x11amp > > gurney [203]$ file /usr/local/bin/x11amp > > /usr/local/bin/x11amp: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, Intel 80386, > > version 1 (FreeBSD), dynamically linked, not stripped > > gurney [204]$ ldd $_ > > /usr/local/bin/x11amp: > > libX11.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libX11.so.6 (0x280be000) > > libXext.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libXext.so.6 (0x28153000) > > libstdc++.so.2 => /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.2 (0x2815d000) > > libm.so.2 => /usr/lib/libm.so.2 (0x28194000) > > libc.so.3 => /usr/lib/libc.so.3 (0x281ae000) > > > > Seems to work OK for me. I haven't tried to play any files > > straight from a remote URL, though, if that's what you were > > talking about. > > That is an old version of x11amp, the newer version 0.9x was rewritten to > use Gtk+ and LinuxThreads. I personally haven't had any luck getting it > to compile, haven't tried any binaries of it (if there are any available), > etc. This obviously doesn't mean that it won't work, but it sure won't > work without some effort. someone posted explicit direction on -hackers, -current or -questions to get the linux binary working in the last 2 weeks, do a search. :) -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue May 4 23:51:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from freebsd.dk (freebsd.dk [212.242.42.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9AC0E152DB for ; Tue, 4 May 1999 23:51:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sos@freebsd.dk) Received: (from sos@localhost) by freebsd.dk (8.9.1/8.9.1) id IAA24908; Wed, 5 May 1999 08:51:23 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from sos) From: Soren Schmidt Message-Id: <199905050651.IAA24908@freebsd.dk> Subject: Re: writing cdr or cdrw atapi In-Reply-To: from Brian Beattie at "May 4, 1999 8:53:38 pm" To: beattie@aracnet.com (Brian Beattie) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 08:51:23 +0200 (CEST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG It seems Brian Beattie wrote: > I asked this question on questions and did not get any answer: I have a > refurbished Philips CDD3610 CDR/CDRW ATAPI drive. I am trying to get this > working, under 3.1-stable as of last night. The driver messages claim to > support this drive in both CDR and CDRW. > > I have tried cdrecord on /dev/racd0c which appears not to work. I have > tried wormcontrol which seemed to work but the documentation leads me to > think that wormcontrol might be obsolete. Cdrecord doesn't work on our ATAPI system. Wormcontrol still works for ATAPI, its only our new SCSI system that lost that ability. > Can anybody tell me if ATAPI drives are supported under 3.1-stable. If so > what is the correct command to use, and some hint as to what arguments to > use. Use the scripts in /usr/share/examples/atapi to burn CD's, they are crude, but they do work. -Søren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 0:18:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ol.kyrnet.kg (ol.kyrnet.kg [195.254.160.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5855914FBB for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 00:18:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mlists@gizmo.kyrnet.kg) Received: from gizmo.kyrnet.kg (gizmo.kyrnet.kg [195.254.160.13]) by ol.kyrnet.kg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA18299; Wed, 5 May 1999 17:41:34 +0600 Received: from localhost (mlists@localhost) by gizmo.kyrnet.kg (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA11784; Wed, 5 May 1999 13:17:42 +0600 Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 13:17:42 +0600 (KGST) From: CyberPsychotic Reply-To: fygrave@tigerteam.net To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: tech@openbsd.org Subject: io ports reading/writing Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello people, I am abit stuck with io ports access using BSD kernel routines. I searched the sources three for the apropriate examples but didn't find much. On linux I used ioperm/inb/outb routines, but they don't seem to be implemented in BSD world (while inb/outb isn't a problem, since two asm instructions would represent that, ioperm is). I would appreciate if anyone could point me to apropriate examples or drop a sample code. regards F. -- fygrave@tigerteam.net http://www.kalug.lug.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 0:29:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E27E81584D for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 00:29:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id AAA22575; Wed, 5 May 1999 00:29:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 00:29:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199905050729.AAA22575@apollo.backplane.com> To: "David E. Cross" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, schimken@cs.rpi.edu, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: 'nother NFS panic on 3.1-STABLE-Sun Mar 21 References: <199905050247.WAA21537@cs.rpi.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> the 'dumpdev' /etc/rc.conf variable. For example, if your swap :> partition is /dev/sd0b, you would put 'dumpdev="/dev/sd0b"' in your :> rc.conf. :> :> -Matt :> Matthew Dillon :> :I do have the complete crashdump (unfortunately the kernel was compiled sans :debuging information). Would this still be of use? : :-- :David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu :Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Absolutely. We'll switch this to private email. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 0:36:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from idefix.omnix.net (idefix.omnix.net [195.154.168.68]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55C6F14DA2 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 00:36:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from didier@omnix.net) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by idefix.omnix.net (8.9.1/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA11613 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 10:36:19 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 10:36:17 +0200 (CEST) From: Didier Derny X-Sender: didier@idefix To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: HELP! large shared memory (increasing kvm) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hi, for the SQL server, I need a large shared memory (SHMMAXPGS=9216) I have maxusers = 512 the memory is actually of 256Mb and will be increased to 1Gb the kernel is still a.out [I have no possibility to stop the machine to upgrade to 3.1-RELEASE or 3.1-STABLE (upgrade planned in july/august)] (I'm running FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE on a dual pentium II machine [ASUS P2B mother board] everything works just fine except that we need to largely increase the shared memories and the semaphores]) is VM_KMEM_SIZE working with FreeBSD-3.0-RELEASE ? what value would you suggest ? thanks for your help ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Didier Derny | FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT Site Email: didier@omnix.net | Microsoft Free Computer. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 1: 9:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E73BD1559E for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 01:09:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA00429; Wed, 5 May 1999 09:09:06 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 09:09:06 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: fygrave@tigerteam.net Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, tech@openbsd.org Subject: Re: io ports reading/writing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 5 May 1999, CyberPsychotic wrote: > Hello people, > I am abit stuck with io ports access using BSD kernel routines. I > searched the sources three for the apropriate examples but didn't find > much. On linux I used ioperm/inb/outb routines, but they don't seem to be > implemented in BSD world (while inb/outb isn't a problem, since two asm > instructions would represent that, ioperm is). I would appreciate if > anyone could point me to apropriate examples or drop a sample code. I think you just open /dev/io and use inb/outb. Be warned that this will only work on i386 - the alpha uses a library, libio, to emulate inb/outb in user programs. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 1:56:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kyrnet.kg (news.kyrnet.kg [195.254.160.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C60714C02 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 01:56:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fygrave@tigerteam.net) Received: from localhost by kyrnet.kg (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA22502; Wed, 5 May 1999 13:47:16 +0500 (GMT) X-Authentication-Warning: kyrnet.kg: fygrave owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 13:47:16 +0500 (GMT) From: CyberPsychotic X-Sender: fygrave@kyrnet.kg To: Doug Rabson Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, tech@openbsd.org Subject: Re: io ports reading/writing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Confirm-receipt-to: fygrave@usa.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ~ ~ I think you just open /dev/io and use inb/outb. Be warned that this will ~ only work on i386 - the alpha uses a library, libio, to emulate inb/outb ~ in user programs. you say that on i386, open("/dev/io",O_RDWR); foo=inb(PORT_X); bar=outb(foo,PORT_Y); would work? if so, in this scheme I don't quite understand how kernel would handle the access to io ports. F.e. assuming that opening /dev/io, would give permittions to all io ports would be quite dangerous (since not all programs which could be permitted to modify cmos, should be permitted to ports controlling disk access etc). would you mind eleborating this abit? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 2: 2:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB93E15D3E for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 02:01:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA00593; Wed, 5 May 1999 10:01:55 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 10:01:55 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: CyberPsychotic Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, tech@openbsd.org Subject: Re: io ports reading/writing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 5 May 1999, CyberPsychotic wrote: > ~ > ~ I think you just open /dev/io and use inb/outb. Be warned that this will > ~ only work on i386 - the alpha uses a library, libio, to emulate inb/outb > ~ in user programs. > > you say that on i386, > open("/dev/io",O_RDWR); foo=inb(PORT_X); bar=outb(foo,PORT_Y); would work? > if so, in this scheme I don't quite understand how kernel would handle the > access to io ports. F.e. assuming that opening /dev/io, would give > permittions to all io ports would be quite dangerous (since not all programs > which could be permitted to modify cmos, should be permitted to ports > controlling disk access etc). > > would you mind eleborating this abit? > The access control for io ports is controlled by the file-system permissions on /dev/io. In a standard setup, only root can access this device. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 2:10: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kyrnet.kg (news.kyrnet.kg [195.254.160.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1F4014C82 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 02:09:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fygrave@tigerteam.net) Received: from localhost by kyrnet.kg (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA22893; Wed, 5 May 1999 14:01:44 +0500 (GMT) X-Authentication-Warning: kyrnet.kg: fygrave owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 14:01:44 +0500 (GMT) From: CyberPsychotic X-Sender: fygrave@kyrnet.kg To: Doug Rabson Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, tech@openbsd.org Subject: Re: io ports reading/writing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Confirm-receipt-to: fygrave@usa.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ~ ~ The access control for io ports is controlled by the file-system ~ permissions on /dev/io. In a standard setup, only root can access this ~ device. ~ yes. But I was refering to linux scheme, where you can set the port-range, so the code wouldn't make any unintentional damage. (like if you're working with cmos you could only permit 0x70/0x71 ports, so even if code goes nuts, your disks will be safe). This is basically programmer's problem of course, but the feature is very handy. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 2:18:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AFBD214CE2 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 02:18:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA00656; Wed, 5 May 1999 10:18:23 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 10:18:23 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: CyberPsychotic Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, tech@openbsd.org Subject: Re: io ports reading/writing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 5 May 1999, CyberPsychotic wrote: > ~ > ~ The access control for io ports is controlled by the file-system > ~ permissions on /dev/io. In a standard setup, only root can access this > ~ device. > ~ > > yes. But I was refering to linux scheme, where you can set the port-range, > so the code wouldn't make any unintentional damage. (like if you're working > with cmos you could only permit 0x70/0x71 ports, so even if code goes nuts, > your disks will be safe). This is basically programmer's problem of course, > but the feature is very handy. I don't quite understand the i386 architecture at this level but I seem to remember that this support would require significant changes in the way we handle processes and there might have been some performance implications. I don't think its a big problem in practice. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 2:41:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D68B115137 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 02:41:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id CAA06889; Wed, 5 May 1999 02:40:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199905050940.CAA06889@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Doug Rabson Cc: CyberPsychotic , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, tech@openbsd.org Subject: Re: io ports reading/writing In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 05 May 1999 10:18:23 BST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 02:40:45 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Very early on for 386bsd I implemented ioperms in the kernel mostly for X servers however later on the XFree86 team decided that was not a good approach due to the crazy way that vga controllers were being design with sparse memory mapped io ports. Not sure how linux handles the later case and I doubt that it does. Cheers -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 2:49:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from paprika.michvhf.com (paprika.michvhf.com [209.57.60.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 25EE31554D for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 02:49:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from vev@michvhf.com) Received: (qmail 16918 invoked by uid 1001); 5 May 1999 09:49:28 -0000 Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 05:49:28 -0400 (EDT) From: Vince Vielhaber To: Andrew Reilly Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MP3 player? In-Reply-To: <19990505141045.A69277@gurney.reilly.home> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 5 May 1999, Andrew Reilly wrote: > On Tue, May 04, 1999 at 09:18:41PM -0400, Vince Vielhaber wrote: > > On 05-May-99 Karl Denninger wrote: > > > Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? > > > > mpg123 works, it may even be in ports/packages. The current version of > > X11Amp requires linux threads so I didn't bother trying to compile it and > > Are you sure? > > gurney [202]$ which x11amp > /usr/local/bin/x11amp > gurney [203]$ file /usr/local/bin/x11amp > /usr/local/bin/x11amp: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, Intel 80386, > version 1 (FreeBSD), dynamically linked, not stripped > gurney [204]$ ldd $_ > /usr/local/bin/x11amp: > libX11.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libX11.so.6 (0x280be000) > libXext.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libXext.so.6 (0x28153000) > libstdc++.so.2 => /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.2 (0x2815d000) > libm.so.2 => /usr/lib/libm.so.2 (0x28194000) > libc.so.3 => /usr/lib/libc.so.3 (0x281ae000) > > Seems to work OK for me. I haven't tried to play any files > straight from a remote URL, though, if that's what you were > talking about. > > And what version of X11amp? This one is 0.9beta1.1, ports (last I looked) has 0.8. I just tried running configure but it needs a version of GLIB newer than I have installed. I'll have to check it out later. There may also be a newer X11Amp - this one's from April 13. Vince. -- ========================================================================== Vince Vielhaber -- KA8CSH email: vev@michvhf.com flame-mail: /dev/null # include TEAM-OS2 Online Campground Directory http://www.camping-usa.com Online Giftshop Superstore http://www.cloudninegifts.com ========================================================================== To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 4:37:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (fwns1d.raleigh.ibm.com [204.146.167.235]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF77214CC7 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 04:37:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nadas@raleigh.ibm.com) Received: from rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com (rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.172.47]) by fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (8.9.0/8.9.0/RTP-FW-1.2) with ESMTP id HAA32304; Wed, 5 May 1999 07:37:40 -0400 Received: from roundout (roundout.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.176.120]) by rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/RTP-ral-1.1) with SMTP id HAA33622; Wed, 5 May 1999 07:37:41 -0400 Message-Id: <199905051137.HAA33622@rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com> From: "Stephen Nadas" To: mike@smith.net.au, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 07:39:01 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: High resolution timers Reply-To: nadas@raleigh.ibm.com Cc: lli@ralvm6.rscs, vperis@watson.ibm.com, Brian Adamson , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: References: <199905032133.RAA29164@rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01d) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Mike, Luigi, We run around a dozen or more FreeBSD machines (2.2.8 CD level) in a networking lab. Mostly these are pentiums of speed 75mhz-200mhz. We use xntpdc to synchronize their clocks to one of these machines (so it is important they be synchronized, but only to each other). We also use a tool called MGEN to generate traffic. This tool uses the select system call. On a faster pentium (180mhz) repeated calls to gettimeofday suggest that the gettimeofday() call takes about 6 usecs. But similar measurements show that a select system call takes at least 20 millisec. This 20msec is causing the application to send very bursty traffic for higher packet rates because when it wakes up from select there are many packets to send. This burstiness is undesirable in our testing. So, my main question is: Why is this 20 millisec? (there's quite a few older appends about this that don't resolve much) What can I do to make it shorter? I have read quite a few appends on high resolution timing and a solution remains unclear. Since you both have posted the hackers list on this subject so I am hopeful you can suggest a solution direction. I gather that the sysgen option HZ controls the number of ticks per sec that the kernel sees? (why is this option not in LINT?) and for higher granularity some appends suggest to increase HZ. Other appends suggest doing so will screw up xntpdc (is this true if all the machins involved use the same HZ?) There are some references to other functions e.g., microtime() but no man pages - where are these? can they be used in application code safely? Thanks in advance. Best Regards, Steve Nadas ip: nadas@raleigh.ibm.com / VM: nadas at rtp/notes: nadas@ibmusm23 +1-919-254-2363 / Tieline: 8-444-2363 / Fax: use X-5483 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 4:44:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4F36152B0 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 04:44:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA43518; Wed, 5 May 1999 07:43:40 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 07:43:39 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: Doug Rabson Cc: CyberPsychotic , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, tech@openbsd.org Subject: Re: io ports reading/writing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 5 May 1999, Doug Rabson wrote: > On Wed, 5 May 1999, CyberPsychotic wrote: > > > ~ > > ~ The access control for io ports is controlled by the file-system > > ~ permissions on /dev/io. In a standard setup, only root can access this > > ~ device. > > ~ > > > > yes. But I was refering to linux scheme, where you can set the port-range, > > so the code wouldn't make any unintentional damage. (like if you're working > > with cmos you could only permit 0x70/0x71 ports, so even if code goes nuts, > > your disks will be safe). This is basically programmer's problem of course, > > but the feature is very handy. > > I don't quite understand the i386 architecture at this level but I seem to > remember that this support would require significant changes in the way we > handle processes and there might have been some performance implications. > I don't think its a big problem in practice. What about i386_[gs]et_ioperm()? > > -- > Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com > Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \ _ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___)___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 4:56:23 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kyrnet.kg (news.kyrnet.kg [195.254.160.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1350314BC9 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 04:56:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fygrave@tigerteam.net) Received: from localhost by kyrnet.kg (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA26117; Wed, 5 May 1999 16:46:55 +0500 (GMT) X-Authentication-Warning: kyrnet.kg: fygrave owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 16:46:55 +0500 (GMT) From: CyberPsychotic X-Sender: fygrave@kyrnet.kg To: Brian Feldman Cc: Doug Rabson , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, tech@openbsd.org Subject: Re: io ports reading/writing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Confirm-receipt-to: fygrave@usa.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ~ > ~ > I don't quite understand the i386 architecture at this level but I seem to ~ > remember that this support would require significant changes in the way we ~ > handle processes and there might have been some performance implications. ~ > I don't think its a big problem in practice. ~ ~ What about i386_[gs]et_ioperm()? ~ is it documented anywhere? `find /usr/share/man -name '*386*'' showed me only manual page for i386_[gs]et_ldt which is a different thing. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 5:33:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from noc.demon.net (server.noc.demon.net [193.195.224.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B079115318 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 05:33:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fanf@demon.net) Received: by noc.demon.net; id NAA27249; Wed, 5 May 1999 13:33:49 +0100 (BST) Received: from fanf.noc.demon.net(195.11.55.83) by inside.noc.demon.net via smap (3.2) id xma027168; Wed, 5 May 99 13:33:32 +0100 Received: from fanf by fanf.noc.demon.net with local (Exim 1.73 #2) id 10f0rj-0005DC-00; Wed, 5 May 1999 13:33:31 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Tony Finch To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: MM_CHARSET X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under Emacs 19.34.1 Message-Id: Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 13:33:31 +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG What is the purpose of this environment variable? It seems entirely vestigial to me. fanf@shirt.www.demon.net:/usr/src :; find . | xargs grep MM_CHARSET ./etc/csh.login:# setenv MM_CHARSET KOI8-R ./etc/csh.login:# setenv MM_CHARSET ISO-8859-1 ./etc/profile:# MM_CHARSET=KOI8-R; export MM_CHARSET ./etc/profile:# MM_CHARSET=ISO-8859-1; export MM_CHARSET ./lib/libutil/login.conf.5:.It charset string Set $MM_CHARSET environment variable to the specified ./lib/libutil/login_class.3:charset MM_CHARSET ./lib/libutil/login_class.c: { "charset", "MM_CHARSET", NULL }, fanf@shirt.www.demon.net:/usr/src :; Tony. -- f.a.n.finch dot@dotat.at fanf@demon.net Arthur: "Oh, that sounds better, have you worked out the controls?" Ford: "No, we just stopped playing with them." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 5:59:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (mail.palmerharvey.co.uk [62.172.109.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E2EF14F66 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 05:59:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Dom.Mitchell@palmerharvey.co.uk) Received: from ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk (unverified) by mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Wed, 05 May 1999 13:59:06 +0100 Received: from voodoo.pandhm.co.uk ([10.100.35.12]) by ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) id K2JT78Y4; Wed, 5 May 1999 13:51:27 +0100 Received: from dom by voodoo.pandhm.co.uk with local (Exim 2.10 #1) id 10f1K4-0009Gr-00; Wed, 5 May 1999 14:02:48 +0100 To: Tony Finch Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: MM_CHARSET X-Mailer: nmh-1.0 X-Colour: Green Organization: Palmer & Harvey McLane In-Reply-To: Tony Finch's message of "Wed, 05 May 1999 13:33:31 BST" Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 14:02:48 +0100 From: Dom Mitchell Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 5 May 1999, Tony Finch proclaimed: > What is the purpose of this environment variable? It seems entirely > vestigial to me. Most likely. I know that I have to use it with nmh to get it to display a bunch of messages without throwing up an xterm, but I'd hardly call it an essential part of the base system. It might also be the case that metamail uses it, too. -- Dom Mitchell -- Palmer & Harvey McLane -- Unix Systems Administrator "Value of 2 may go down as well as up" -- FORTRAN programmers manual -- ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. ********************************************************************** To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 6:41:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sussie.interbizz.se (ns.datadesign.se [194.23.109.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E33A15335 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 06:41:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Joachim.Isaksson@ibfs.com) Received: from tequila (dhcp140.ibfs.com [193.45.188.140]) by sussie.interbizz.se (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA27443 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 15:41:06 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <000f01be96fc$ebafe210$8cbc2dc1@ibfs.com> From: "Joachim Isaksson" To: Subject: Changes to console code? Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 15:41:03 +0200 Organization: Interbizz Financial Systems MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, I was running current 4.0 990318 (as far as I can remember, can look that up once I get home from work), and yesterday I decided to do an upgrade to 990504 via a clean install from boot floppy. My console now decides to go blank when the probe for sc0 is attempted. As far as I can see it never gets any further in the boot sequence. Luckily I got the problem at floppy boot, not after killing my old system off :) Any ideas what has been changed in the console code since 990318 (and maybe what I can do about it?) My motherboard is an old Intel Advanced/EV with an integrated Trio64 chipset (and integrated audio) so a bit hard to replace the video card... :) I can try to binary search with boot floppies until I can find the exact date when it stopped working if that helps. /Joachim To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 6:50:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from freebsd.dk (freebsd.dk [212.242.42.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57A061573D for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 06:50:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sos@freebsd.dk) Received: (from sos@localhost) by freebsd.dk (8.9.1/8.9.1) id PAA25947; Wed, 5 May 1999 15:50:44 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from sos) From: Soren Schmidt Message-Id: <199905051350.PAA25947@freebsd.dk> Subject: Re: Changes to console code? In-Reply-To: <000f01be96fc$ebafe210$8cbc2dc1@ibfs.com> from Joachim Isaksson at "May 5, 1999 3:41: 3 pm" To: Joachim.Isaksson@ibfs.com (Joachim Isaksson) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 15:50:44 +0200 (CEST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG It seems Joachim Isaksson wrote: > Hi, > > I was running current 4.0 990318 (as far as I can remember, can look that up > once I get home from work), and yesterday I decided to do an upgrade to 990504 > via a clean install from boot floppy. > > My console now decides to go blank when the probe for sc0 is attempted. As far > as I can see it never gets any further in the boot sequence. Luckily I got the > problem at floppy boot, not after killing my old system off :) Hmm, I've seen this a couble of times, but a reboot have succeded every time. The machine is locked solid when this happens, so I've kindof written it off as flaky HW, that might have been premature. I thought it was hanging in the VESA/VM86 code, but I dont think that is enabled on the boot floppy... Hmm... -Søren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 7:25:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lor.watermarkgroup.com (lor.watermarkgroup.com [207.202.73.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D326B14E00 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 07:25:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luoqi@watermarkgroup.com) Received: (from luoqi@localhost) by lor.watermarkgroup.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA09357; Wed, 5 May 1999 10:23:50 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from luoqi) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 10:23:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Luoqi Chen Message-Id: <199905051423.KAA09357@lor.watermarkgroup.com> To: dfr@nlsystems.com, fygrave@tigerteam.net Subject: Re: io ports reading/writing Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, tech@openbsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > ~ The access control for io ports is controlled by the file-system > ~ permissions on /dev/io. In a standard setup, only root can access this > ~ device. > ~ > > yes. But I was refering to linux scheme, where you can set the port-range, > so the code wouldn't make any unintentional damage. (like if you're working > with cmos you could only permit 0x70/0x71 ports, so even if code goes nuts, > your disks will be safe). This is basically programmer's problem of course, > but the feature is very handy. > We have this level of io permission control, through the i386_g/set_ioperm syscalls (man 2 i386_get_ioperm). You will need to enable kernel option VM86 to use them. -lq To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 7:25:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rnocserv.urc.ac.ru (rnocserv.urc.ac.ru [193.233.85.48]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 31A5514DCC for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 07:24:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from joy@urc.ac.ru) Received: from urc.ac.ru (y.urc.ac.ru [193.233.85.37]) by rnocserv.urc.ac.ru (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id TAA78044; Wed, 5 May 1999 19:10:53 +0600 (ESS) (envelope-from joy@urc.ac.ru) Message-ID: <3730435D.B44AD72D@urc.ac.ru> Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 19:10:53 +0600 From: Konstantin Chuguev Organization: Southern Ural Regional Center of FREEnet X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386) X-Accept-Language: ru, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dom Mitchell Cc: Tony Finch , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MM_CHARSET References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Dom Mitchell wrote: > On 5 May 1999, Tony Finch proclaimed: > > What is the purpose of this environment variable? It seems entirely > > vestigial to me. > > Most likely. I know that I have to use it with nmh to get it to display > a bunch of messages without throwing up an xterm, but I'd hardly call it > an essential part of the base system. It might also be the case that > metamail uses it, too. > -- Exactly. MM_CHARSET = MetaMail Charset. -- Konstantin V. Chuguev. System administrator of Southern http://www.urc.ac.ru/~joy/ Ural Regional Center of FREEnet, mailto:joy@urc.ac.ru Chelyabinsk, Russia. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 7:25:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id A858015C54 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 07:25:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id OAA28848; Wed, 5 May 1999 14:14:33 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199905051214.OAA28848@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: High resolution timers To: nadas@raleigh.ibm.com Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 14:14:33 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: mike@smith.net.au, lli@ralvm6.rscs, vperis@watson.ibm.com, adamson@itd.nrl.navy.mil, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199905051137.HAA33622@rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com> from "Stephen Nadas" at May 5, 99 07:38:42 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 907 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > On a faster pentium (180mhz) repeated calls to gettimeofday suggest > that the gettimeofday() call takes about 6 usecs. But similar > measurements show that a select system call takes at least 20 > millisec. This 20msec is causing the application to send very bursty > traffic for higher packet rates because when it wakes up from select > there are many packets to send. This burstiness is undesirable in > our testing. So, my main question is: Why is this 20 millisec? > (there's quite a few older appends about this that don't resolve > much) What can I do to make it shorter? for sime reason it seems to be twice the HZ interval -- i suppose this is because you process gets scheduled at the beginning of a tick, goes to sleep on select, and is put in the ready queue at the beginning (or the end ?) of the next tick. I have no idea of the impact of HZ changing on ntp stuff.. luigi To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 7:40:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from whizkidtech.net (r6.bfm.org [208.18.213.102]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F86F14E37 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 07:40:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adam@whizkidtech.net) Received: (from adam@localhost) by whizkidtech.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) id JAA00547; Wed, 5 May 1999 09:38:33 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from adam) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 09:38:02 -0500 From: "G. Adam Stanislav" To: Jens Schweikhardt Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: wc* routines Message-ID: <19990505093802.A533@whizkidtech.net> References: <199905041711.VAA04689@tejblum.dnttm.rssi.ru> <199905051319.PAA05002@diamant.noc.dfn.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <199905051319.PAA05002@diamant.noc.dfn.de>; from Jens Schweikhardt on Wed, May 05, 1999 at 03:19:37PM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, May 05, 1999 at 03:19:37PM +0200, Jens Schweikhardt wrote: > You can (hah should :-) test your new headers for ISO C namespace > problems with a little C program to be found at > You should place it into the ports collection. :-) I downloaded your program, and after running it made the following changes to : Added a comment that this should ultimately go to and that would then disappear altogether. Commented out the various text macros, noting that they belong to a private header (or where do they belong??? - comments please). Uploaded the changes to http://www.whizkidtech.net/i18n/wc/. > Have fun. Ah, you just cost me $30, man! I ordered a book you recommend on your site.:) Adam To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 7:58: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from chiark.greenend.org.uk (chiark.greenend.org.uk [195.224.76.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 296151517C for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 07:57:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fanf@chiark.greenend.org.uk) Received: from fanf by chiark.greenend.org.uk with local (Exim 2.02 #1) id 10f37S-0003b0-00 (Debian); Wed, 5 May 1999 15:57:54 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <14128.23666.159364.651951@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 15:57:54 +0100 (BST) From: Tony Finch To: Konstantin Chuguev Cc: Dom Mitchell , Tony Finch , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MM_CHARSET In-Reply-To: <3730435D.B44AD72D@urc.ac.ru> References: <3730435D.B44AD72D@urc.ac.ru> X-Mailer: VM 6.47 under Emacs 19.34.1 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Konstantin Chuguev writes: > > Exactly. MM_CHARSET = MetaMail Charset. Why doesn't it use LC_CTYPE? Tony (who hates metamail). -- f.a.n.finch fanf@demon.net dot@dotat.at To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 7:58:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from home.dragondata.com (home.dragondata.com [204.137.237.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A23B0158D7 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 07:58:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from toasty@home.dragondata.com) Received: (from toasty@localhost) by home.dragondata.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id JAA18024; Wed, 5 May 1999 09:56:30 -0500 (CDT) From: Kevin Day Message-Id: <199905051456.JAA18024@home.dragondata.com> Subject: Re: Changes to console code? In-Reply-To: <199905051350.PAA25947@freebsd.dk> from Soren Schmidt at "May 5, 1999 3:50:44 pm" To: sos@freebsd.dk (Soren Schmidt) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 09:56:29 -0500 (CDT) Cc: Joachim.Isaksson@ibfs.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > It seems Joachim Isaksson wrote: > > Hi, > > > > I was running current 4.0 990318 (as far as I can remember, can look that up > > once I get home from work), and yesterday I decided to do an upgrade to 990504 > > via a clean install from boot floppy. > > > > My console now decides to go blank when the probe for sc0 is attempted. As far > > as I can see it never gets any further in the boot sequence. Luckily I got the > > problem at floppy boot, not after killing my old system off :) > > Hmm, I've seen this a couble of times, but a reboot have succeded every time. > The machine is locked solid when this happens, so I've kindof written it > off as flaky HW, that might have been premature. I thought it was hanging > in the VESA/VM86 code, but I dont think that is enabled on the boot floppy... > > Hmm... > > -Søren > I'm seeing something similar.... very current code makes my system essentially throw the cursor all over a blank screen (like it's printing spaces or tabs very fast)... Going back to Mar 15th's kernel, it went away. I haven't had time to track this down any further, but i blamed it on weird hardware too. :) Kevin To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 8:38:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gateway.cybernet.com (gateway.cybernet.com [192.245.33.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 284FC15542 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 08:38:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mtaylor@cybernet.com) Received: from spiffy.cybernet.com (spiffy.cybernet.com [192.245.33.55]) by gateway.cybernet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA29556 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 11:38:40 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from mtaylor@cybernet.com) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 11:40:12 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: mtaylor@cybernet.com Organization: Cybernet Systems From: "Mark J. Taylor" To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: NetGear 10/100 Ethernet: an oversight? Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The NetGear 10/100 Ethernet card is not supported in -current. It is supposedly DEC 21140-based. Perhaps it is because the Vendor ID is not recognized? --- Mark J. Taylor Networking Research Cybernet Systems mtaylor@cybernet.com 727 Airport Blvd. PHONE (734) 668-2567 Ann Arbor, MI 48108 FAX (734) 668-8780 http://www.cybernet.com/ http://www.netmax.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 8:42:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sussie.interbizz.se (ns.datadesign.se [194.23.109.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0E6915AF1 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 08:42:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Joachim.Isaksson@ibfs.com) Received: from bacardi (bacardi.home.ibfs.com [193.45.188.13]) by sussie.interbizz.se (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA01347; Wed, 5 May 1999 17:42:49 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <001201be970d$f53bf970$0dbc2dc1@home.ibfs.com> From: "Joachim Isaksson" To: "Joachim Isaksson" , References: <000f01be96fc$ebafe210$8cbc2dc1@ibfs.com> Subject: Re: Changes to console code? Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 17:43:00 +0200 Organization: Interbizz Financial Systems MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I was running current 4.0 990318 (as far as I can remember, can look that up > once I get home from work), and yesterday I decided to do an upgrade to 990504 > via a clean install from boot floppy. As it turned out I was running; FreeBSD 4.0-19990328-CURRENT ...so I was off by 10 days. Since current.freebsd.org isn't responding at the moment I can't check when it stopped working, but I'll try that out later tonight. /Joachim To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 8:45:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (mail.palmerharvey.co.uk [62.172.109.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB73114E5F for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 08:45:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Dom.Mitchell@palmerharvey.co.uk) Received: from ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk (unverified) by mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Wed, 05 May 1999 16:45:25 +0100 Received: from voodoo.pandhm.co.uk ([10.100.35.12]) by ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) id K2JT7872; Wed, 5 May 1999 16:37:46 +0100 Received: from dom by voodoo.pandhm.co.uk with local (Exim 2.10 #1) id 10f3v1-000AFJ-00; Wed, 5 May 1999 16:49:07 +0100 To: Tony Finch Cc: Konstantin Chuguev , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MM_CHARSET X-Mailer: nmh-1.0 X-Colour: Green Organization: Palmer & Harvey McLane In-Reply-To: Tony Finch's message of "Wed, 05 May 1999 15:57:54 BST" <14128.23666.159364.651951@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 16:49:07 +0100 From: Dom Mitchell Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 5 May 1999, Tony Finch proclaimed: > Konstantin Chuguev writes: > > > > Exactly. MM_CHARSET = MetaMail Charset. > > Why doesn't it use LC_CTYPE? Most likely because it was written before that variable was in general usage. Metamail *must* be old; it still uses csh scripts... -- Dom Mitchell -- Palmer & Harvey McLane -- Unix Systems Administrator "Value of 2 may go down as well as up" -- FORTRAN programmers manual -- ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. ********************************************************************** To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 8:58:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ontario.mooseriver.com (ontario.mooseriver.com [208.138.31.116]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1BB2814C45 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 08:58:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jgrosch@ontario.mooseriver.com) Received: (from jgrosch@localhost) by ontario.mooseriver.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id IAA50757; Wed, 5 May 1999 08:57:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jgrosch) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 08:57:59 -0700 From: Josef Grosch To: "Mark J. Taylor" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NetGear 10/100 Ethernet: an oversight? Message-ID: <19990505085759.A50711@ontario.mooseriver.com> Reply-To: jgrosch@MooseRiver.com References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: ; from Mark J. Taylor on Wed, May 05, 1999 at 11:40:12AM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, May 05, 1999 at 11:40:12AM -0400, Mark J. Taylor wrote: > > The NetGear 10/100 Ethernet card is not supported in -current. > It is supposedly DEC 21140-based. The NetGear Ethernet cards were based on the DEC "Tulip" chip a while back. In this configuration they were a very good NIC. However NetGear has stopped manufacturing these with the DEC "Tulip" chip, probably had something to do with the fact that Compaq bought DEC, and are now shipping with something else. So much for NetGear. Josef -- Josef Grosch | Another day closer to a | FreeBSD 3.1 jgrosch@MooseRiver.com | Micro$oft free world | UNIX for the masses To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 10:39:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sumatra.americantv.com (sumatra.americantv.com [208.139.222.227]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3270914D18 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 10:39:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jlemon@americantv.com) Received: from right.PCS (right.PCS [148.105.10.31]) by sumatra.americantv.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA05345; Wed, 5 May 1999 12:39:18 -0500 (CDT) Received: from free.pcs (free.PCS [148.105.10.51]) by right.PCS (8.6.13/8.6.4) with ESMTP id MAA29884; Wed, 5 May 1999 12:39:17 -0500 Received: (from jlemon@localhost) by free.pcs (8.8.6/8.8.5) id MAA11985; Wed, 5 May 1999 12:39:16 -0500 (CDT) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 12:39:16 -0500 (CDT) From: Jonathan Lemon Message-Id: <199905051739.MAA11985@free.pcs> To: Doug Rabson , CyberPsychotic , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: io ports reading/writing X-Newsgroups: local.mail.freebsd-hackers In-Reply-To: References: Organization: Architecture and Operating System Fanatics Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article you write: >On Wed, 5 May 1999, CyberPsychotic wrote: > >> ~ >> ~ The access control for io ports is controlled by the file-system >> ~ permissions on /dev/io. In a standard setup, only root can access this >> ~ device. >> ~ >> >> yes. But I was refering to linux scheme, where you can set the port-range, >> so the code wouldn't make any unintentional damage. (like if you're working >> with cmos you could only permit 0x70/0x71 ports, so even if code goes nuts, >> your disks will be safe). This is basically programmer's problem of course, >> but the feature is very handy. > >I don't quite understand the i386 architecture at this level but I seem to >remember that this support would require significant changes in the way we >handle processes and there might have been some performance implications. >I don't think its a big problem in practice. It is supported via the i386_get_ioperm(2) system call, which requires "options VM86" in the kernel. But you are right, it is slower than just opening up "/dev/io". -- Jonathan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 11:41:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peloton.physics.montana.edu (peloton.physics.montana.edu [153.90.192.177]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 66DC815C80 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 11:41:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brett@peloton.physics.montana.edu) Received: from localhost (brett@localhost) by peloton.physics.montana.edu (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA25835; Wed, 5 May 1999 12:39:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from brett@peloton.physics.montana.edu) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 12:39:44 -0600 (MDT) From: Brett Taylor To: Karl Denninger Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: MP3 player? In-Reply-To: <19990504200937.A13932@Denninger.Net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, > Does such a thing exist for FreeBSD at this point? /usr/ports/audio/x11amp Brett *********************************************************** Brett Taylor brett@peloton.physics.montana.edu * brett@daemonnews.org * * http://www.daemonnews.org/ * *********************************************************** To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 11:55:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82C7D14CC5 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 11:55:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id LAA95089; Wed, 5 May 1999 11:54:47 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 11:54:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Doug Rabson Cc: fygrave@tigerteam.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, tech@openbsd.org Subject: Re: io ports reading/writing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 5 May 1999, Doug Rabson wrote: > On Wed, 5 May 1999, CyberPsychotic wrote: > > > Hello people, > > I am abit stuck with io ports access using BSD kernel routines. I [...] > > I think you just open /dev/io and use inb/outb. Be warned that this will > only work on i386 - the alpha uses a library, libio, to emulate inb/outb > in user programs. Also beware the arguments are in the oposite order to linux in outb() > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 12: 2:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7FC5314E6E for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 12:02:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA01404; Wed, 5 May 1999 12:01:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199905051901.MAA01404@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: CyberPsychotic Cc: Doug Rabson , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, tech@openbsd.org Subject: Re: io ports reading/writing In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 05 May 1999 14:01:44 +0500." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 12:01:16 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > ~ > ~ The access control for io ports is controlled by the file-system > ~ permissions on /dev/io. In a standard setup, only root can access this > ~ device. > ~ > > yes. But I was refering to linux scheme, where you can set the port-range, > so the code wouldn't make any unintentional damage. (like if you're working > with cmos you could only permit 0x70/0x71 ports, so even if code goes nuts, > your disks will be safe). This is basically programmer's problem of course, > but the feature is very handy. Try i386_get_ioperm/i386_set_ioperm -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 13:50:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp3.xs4all.nl (smtp3.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.53]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FB3215551 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 13:50:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from plm@smtp3.xs4all.nl) Received: from localhost. (dc2-isdn1764.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.154.228]) by smtp3.xs4all.nl (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA14273 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 22:50:20 +0200 (CEST) Received: (from plm@localhost) by localhost. (8.9.3/8.9.1) id WAA49964; Wed, 5 May 1999 22:50:19 +0200 (MET DST) (envelope-from plm) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Is FreeBSD's make easily ported to non-BSD UNICES? From: Peter Mutsaers Date: 05 May 1999 22:50:05 +0200 Message-ID: <87btfzutqa.fsf@muon.xs4all.nl> X-Mailer: Gnus v5.6.45/Emacs 20.3 Lines: 14 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello, I really like FreeBSD's make (pmake) and would like to use it instead for our companies development on IRIX and Solaris. Before trying to port it, the question: is it easy to run it on other (SYSV-like) Unices, or maybe has it already been ported? Thanks, -- Peter Mutsaers | Abcoude (Utrecht), | Trust me, I know plm@xs4all.nl | the Netherlands | what I'm doing. ---------------+---------------------+------------------ Running FreeBSD-current UNIX. See http://www.freebsd.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 14: 2:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp2.vnet.net (smtp2.vnet.net [166.82.1.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D66915317 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 14:02:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp2.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA04138; Wed, 5 May 1999 17:03:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA08909; Wed, 5 May 1999 17:01:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id RAA72143; Wed, 5 May 1999 17:01:48 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 17:01:48 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199905052101.RAA72143@lakes.dignus.com> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, plm@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: Is FreeBSD's make easily ported to non-BSD UNICES? In-Reply-To: <87btfzutqa.fsf@muon.xs4all.nl> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Hello, > > I really like FreeBSD's make (pmake) and would like to use it instead > for our companies development on IRIX and Solaris. Before trying to > port it, the question: is it easy to run it on other (SYSV-like) > Unices, or maybe has it already been ported? I had little trouble porting it to HP/UX. Unfortunately, I'm no longer with that company; so I don't have the modifications. But, it was pretty easy... - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 14: 5:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F453158B4 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 14:04:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA11236; Wed, 5 May 1999 16:25:18 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 16:25:13 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Peter Mutsaers Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Is FreeBSD's make easily ported to non-BSD UNICES? In-Reply-To: <87btfzutqa.fsf@muon.xs4all.nl> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 5 May 1999, Peter Mutsaers wrote: > Hello, > > I really like FreeBSD's make (pmake) and would like to use it instead > for our companies development on IRIX and Solaris. Before trying to > port it, the question: is it easy to run it on other (SYSV-like) > Unices, or maybe has it already been ported? I'll take you about 30 minutes tops :) -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 14:12:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from beowulf.utmb.edu (beowulf.utmb.edu [129.109.59.83]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4AFC1536A for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 14:12:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bdodson@beowulf.utmb.edu) Received: (from bdodson@localhost) by beowulf.utmb.edu (8.9.3/8.9.2) id QAA27980; Wed, 5 May 1999 16:10:18 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bdodson) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 16:10:18 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199905052110.QAA27980@beowulf.utmb.edu> From: "M. L. Dodson" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Peter Mutsaers Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Is FreeBSD's make easily ported to non-BSD UNICES? In-Reply-To: <87btfzutqa.fsf@muon.xs4all.nl> References: <87btfzutqa.fsf@muon.xs4all.nl> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hmmmmm...... IRIX Release 6.4 IP30 tryptophan Copyright 1987-1997 Silicon Graphics, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Last login: Mon May 3 09:31:49 CDT 1999 by bdodson@beowulf.utmb.edu [tryptophan:bdodson:1] % which pmake /usr/sbin/pmake [tryptophan:bdodson:2] % Peter Mutsaers writes: > Hello, > > I really like FreeBSD's make (pmake) and would like to use it instead > for our companies development on IRIX and Solaris. Before trying to > port it, the question: is it easy to run it on other (SYSV-like) > Unices, or maybe has it already been ported? > > Thanks, > > -- > Peter Mutsaers | Abcoude (Utrecht), | Trust me, I know > plm@xs4all.nl | the Netherlands | what I'm doing. > ---------------+---------------------+------------------ > Running FreeBSD-current UNIX. See http://www.freebsd.org > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > -- M. L. Dodson bdodson@scms.utmb.edu 409-772-2178 FAX: 409-772-1790 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 16: 8:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EA4615597 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 16:08:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id QAA20553; Wed, 5 May 1999 16:00:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omni.xylan.com by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id QAA26373; Wed, 5 May 1999 16:00:48 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com (dyn5.utah.xylan.com) by omni.xylan.com (4.1/SMI-4.1 (xylan engr [SPOOL])) id AA15458; Wed, 5 May 99 16:00:45 PDT Message-Id: <3730CD9C.3E7A0D54@softweyr.com> Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 17:00:44 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Soren Schmidt Cc: Brian Beattie , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: writing cdr or cdrw atapi References: <199905050651.IAA24908@freebsd.dk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Soren Schmidt wrote: > > It seems Brian Beattie wrote: > > I asked this question on questions and did not get any answer: I have a > > refurbished Philips CDD3610 CDR/CDRW ATAPI drive. I am trying to get this > > working, under 3.1-stable as of last night. The driver messages claim to > > support this drive in both CDR and CDRW. > > > > I have tried cdrecord on /dev/racd0c which appears not to work. I have > > tried wormcontrol which seemed to work but the documentation leads me to > > think that wormcontrol might be obsolete. > > Cdrecord doesn't work on our ATAPI system. Wormcontrol still works > for ATAPI, its only our new SCSI system that lost that ability. > > > Can anybody tell me if ATAPI drives are supported under 3.1-stable. If so > > what is the correct command to use, and some hint as to what arguments to > > use. > > Use the scripts in /usr/share/examples/atapi to burn CD's, they are > crude, but they do work. But doesn't wormcontrol require a worm(4) driver, unsupported on 3.1-stable? If so, would he then need new versions of the scripts in /usr/share/examples/atapi? -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 17: 1:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from stumpy.dannyland.org (danman.isdn.uiuc.edu [192.17.16.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 807B714ED6 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 17:00:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dannyman@stumpy.dannyland.org) Received: (qmail 65121 invoked by uid 1000); 6 May 1999 00:01:00 -0000 Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 19:01:00 -0500 From: dannyman To: Ollivier Robert Cc: Tim Vanderhoek , Chuck Robey , David Lowe , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: adduser, rmuser, and perl... Message-ID: <19990505190059.H51802@stumpy.dannyland.org> References: <19990501182404.A92090@mad> <19990502103812.A3022@keltia.freenix.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i In-Reply-To: <19990502103812.A3022@keltia.freenix.fr>; from Ollivier Robert on Sun, May 02, 1999 at 10:38:12AM +0200 X-Loop: djhoward@uiuc.edu X-URL: http://www.dannyland.org/~dannyman/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, May 02, 1999 at 10:38:12AM +0200, Ollivier Robert wrote: > According to Tim Vanderhoek: > > See FAQ 8.2. Supposedly Ollivier is working on a "new-account" > > package. This could well be some outdated 60's thing, but you > > probably should check with him, first. > > I should remove that comment... new-account is a Perl4 script and was written > before pw(8) existed. I don't maintain it anymore as pw(8) does everything > new-account does (and some more now). In next month's Daemon News I'll be unveiling a script I developed for the ISP I worked at last year. It's Perl5 and uses pw and is pretty modular and thus "hackable". If anyone is interested in "previewing" the public version of this script and the article accompanying it, let me know. imho, the script fairly rocks. :) -danny -- dannyman - http://www.dannyland.org/~dannyman/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 17:19:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from panzer.plutotech.com (panzer.plutotech.com [206.168.67.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4542814ECF for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 17:19:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ken@panzer.plutotech.com) Received: (from ken@localhost) by panzer.plutotech.com (8.9.3/8.8.5) id SAA41546; Wed, 5 May 1999 18:17:22 -0600 (MDT) From: "Kenneth D. Merry" Message-Id: <199905060017.SAA41546@panzer.plutotech.com> Subject: Re: writing cdr or cdrw atapi In-Reply-To: <3730CD9C.3E7A0D54@softweyr.com> from Wes Peters at "May 5, 1999 5: 0:44 pm" To: wes@softweyr.com (Wes Peters) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 18:17:22 -0600 (MDT) Cc: sos@freebsd.dk, beattie@aracnet.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Wes Peters wrote... > Soren Schmidt wrote: > > > > It seems Brian Beattie wrote: > > > I asked this question on questions and did not get any answer: I have a > > > refurbished Philips CDD3610 CDR/CDRW ATAPI drive. I am trying to get this > > > working, under 3.1-stable as of last night. The driver messages claim to > > > support this drive in both CDR and CDRW. > > > > > > I have tried cdrecord on /dev/racd0c which appears not to work. I have > > > tried wormcontrol which seemed to work but the documentation leads me to > > > think that wormcontrol might be obsolete. > > > > Cdrecord doesn't work on our ATAPI system. Wormcontrol still works > > for ATAPI, its only our new SCSI system that lost that ability. It "lost" the ability because cdrecord supports tons of devices, whereas the worm driver really only supported two. (HP/Philips and Plasmon) > > > Can anybody tell me if ATAPI drives are supported under 3.1-stable. If so > > > what is the correct command to use, and some hint as to what arguments to > > > use. > > > > Use the scripts in /usr/share/examples/atapi to burn CD's, they are > > crude, but they do work. > > But doesn't wormcontrol require a worm(4) driver, unsupported on > 3.1-stable? If so, would he then need new versions of the scripts > in /usr/share/examples/atapi? No, wormcontrol will work on any device that accepts the worm ioctls. Soren's ATAPI CD driver supports the ioctls. The whole reason I didn't nuke wormcontrol from the tree when CAM went in is because Soren is using it for his ATAPI CD driver. Ken -- Kenneth Merry ken@plutotech.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 18:13:35 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from merlin.rz.tu-clausthal.de (merlin.rz.tu-clausthal.de [139.174.1.23]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E74E614CF8 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 18:13:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rk@merlin.rz.tu-clausthal.de) Received: (from rk@localhost) by merlin.rz.tu-clausthal.de (8.9.3/8.9.1) id DAA02046; Thu, 6 May 1999 03:13:26 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 03:13:26 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <199905060113.DAA02046@merlin.rz.tu-clausthal.de> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Is FreeBSD's make easily ported to non-BSD UNICES? From: Ronald Kuehn X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 CURRENT #124 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In freebsd-hackers Peter Mutsaers wrote: > Hello, > I really like FreeBSD's make (pmake) and would like to use it instead > for our companies development on IRIX and Solaris. Before trying to > port it, the question: is it easy to run it on other (SYSV-like) > Unices, or maybe has it already been ported? I use pmake on Solaris for some projects. Porting was easy. Only some minor tweaks. I added some missing things like err(3) support from the BSD libc. Bye, Ronald To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 18:47:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sol (cs1-gw.cs.binghamton.edu [128.226.171.72]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id B2BCF158EE for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 18:47:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu) Received: from localhost (zzhang@localhost) by sol (SMI-8.6/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA11838 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 21:36:38 -0400 Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 21:36:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Zhihui Zhang To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: What is define(...)dnl in a .m4 file Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I find in the file boot1.m4 under /usr/src/sys/boot the following line: define(_bp_,0x6)dnl define(_bx_,0x7)dnl define(o16,`.byte 0x66')dnl define(addbr1,`.byte 0x0; .byte 0x40 | ($1 << 0x3) | $3; .byte $2')dnl I assume boot1.m4 is an assembly file but I can not find any information on define(...)dnl in the GNU Assembler manual (info files). Please tell me how a .m4 file is used and what does "define" mean exactly. Thanks for your help. -------------------------------------------------- Zhihui Zhang. Please visit http://www.freebsd.org -------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 18:51:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 28759158DC for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 18:51:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA03960; Wed, 5 May 1999 18:50:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199905060150.SAA03960@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Zhihui Zhang Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: What is define(...)dnl in a .m4 file In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 05 May 1999 21:36:38 EDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 18:50:02 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG A .m4 file is input for the m4 macro preprocessor. See the m4 manpage. > I find in the file boot1.m4 under /usr/src/sys/boot the following line: > > define(_bp_,0x6)dnl > define(_bx_,0x7)dnl > define(o16,`.byte 0x66')dnl > define(addbr1,`.byte 0x0; .byte 0x40 | ($1 << 0x3) | $3; .byte $2')dnl > > I assume boot1.m4 is an assembly file but I can not find any information > on define(...)dnl in the GNU Assembler manual (info files). > > Please tell me how a .m4 file is used and what does "define" mean exactly. > > Thanks for your help. > > -------------------------------------------------- > Zhihui Zhang. Please visit http://www.freebsd.org > -------------------------------------------------- > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 19:11:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from spinner.netplex.com.au (spinner.netplex.com.au [202.12.86.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B498014A2F for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 19:11:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) Received: from netplex.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spinner.netplex.com.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74C221F69; Thu, 6 May 1999 10:10:58 +0800 (WST) (envelope-from peter@netplex.com.au) X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Zhihui Zhang Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: What is define(...)dnl in a .m4 file In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 05 May 1999 21:36:38 -0400." Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 10:10:58 +0800 From: Peter Wemm Message-Id: <19990506021105.74C221F69@spinner.netplex.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Zhihui Zhang wrote: > > I find in the file boot1.m4 under /usr/src/sys/boot the following line: > > define(_bp_,0x6)dnl > define(_bx_,0x7)dnl > define(o16,`.byte 0x66')dnl > define(addbr1,`.byte 0x0; .byte 0x40 | ($1 << 0x3) | $3; .byte $2')dnl > > I assume boot1.m4 is an assembly file but I can not find any information > on define(...)dnl in the GNU Assembler manual (info files). > > Please tell me how a .m4 file is used and what does "define" mean exactly. This is probably better served as a RTFM, see m4(1). However, define in m4 is a little like #define in cpp, and dnl is 'delete through to newline'. define() in m4 is masked out leaving a blank line where the define() was, so the dnl is used to "eat" the newline that causes the blank in the first place. This is also an issue with the sendmail .mc files. For the C compiler, a blank line is irrelevant, but for human readable preprocessed files, such as /etc/sendmail.cf, all those blank lines do add up. Cheers, -Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 19:11:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 459DC15870 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 19:11:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id TAA22215; Wed, 5 May 1999 19:10:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omni.xylan.com by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id TAA11465; Wed, 5 May 1999 19:10:41 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com (dyn5.utah.xylan.com) by omni.xylan.com (4.1/SMI-4.1 (xylan engr [SPOOL])) id AA24314; Wed, 5 May 99 19:10:38 PDT Message-Id: <3730FA1E.7024C8C8@softweyr.com> Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 20:10:38 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: jgrosch@MooseRiver.com Cc: "Mark J. Taylor" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NetGear 10/100 Ethernet: an oversight? References: <19990505085759.A50711@ontario.mooseriver.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Josef Grosch wrote: > > On Wed, May 05, 1999 at 11:40:12AM -0400, Mark J. Taylor wrote: > > > > The NetGear 10/100 Ethernet card is not supported in -current. > > It is supposedly DEC 21140-based. > > The NetGear Ethernet cards were based on the DEC "Tulip" chip a while > back. In this configuration they were a very good NIC. However NetGear has > stopped manufacturing these with the DEC "Tulip" chip, probably had > something to do with the fact that Compaq bought DEC, and are now shipping > with something else. So much for NetGear. When Compaq bought DEC, most of DEC's network manufacturing, including the design rights to the Tulip chip, were bought by Bay Networks, nee Nortel. I assume the FA310TX is still being made with the Tulip, unless Bay got smart and killed it. In that case, it's probably either a PNIC or the other Tulip-like chip from Winbond. Unfortunately their website http://netgear.baynetworks.com is completely unhelpful, so I can't confirm any of the above. Just for giggles, you may want to see if you can probe the thing as a pn or wb device, that'll tell you if it's just a PNIC or Winbond chip. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 19:35: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from copperhead.cisco.com (copperhead.cisco.com [171.69.198.231]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F330914CE3 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 19:35:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brainey@cisco.com) Received: (brainey@localhost) by copperhead.cisco.com (8.8.5-Cisco.2-SunOS.5.5.1.sun4/8.6.5) id TAA03139; Wed, 5 May 1999 19:33:50 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 19:33:50 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199905060233.TAA03139@copperhead.cisco.com> From: Bill Rainey To: wes@softweyr.com Cc: jgrosch@MooseRiver.com, mtaylor@cybernet.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: <3730FA1E.7024C8C8@softweyr.com> (message from Wes Peters on Wed, 05 May 1999 20:10:38 -0600) Subject: Re: NetGear 10/100 Ethernet: an oversight? Reply-To: brainey@cisco.com Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > When Compaq bought DEC, most of DEC's network manufacturing, including > the design rights to the Tulip chip, were bought by Bay Networks, nee > Nortel. I assume the FA310TX is still being made with the Tulip, It was actually Cabletron that bought DEC's networking business and Intel bought the chip stuff. I don't know where that left the Tulip chips though. Bill To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 19:50:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from whizkidtech.net (r3.bfm.org [208.18.213.99]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD9CE14D3E for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 19:50:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adam@whizkidtech.net) Received: (from adam@localhost) by whizkidtech.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) id VAA00236; Wed, 5 May 1999 21:50:05 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from adam) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 21:49:34 -0500 From: "G. Adam Stanislav" To: Dmitrij Tejblum Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: wc* routines Message-ID: <19990505214934.B217@whizkidtech.net> References: <199905041711.VAA04689@tejblum.dnttm.rssi.ru> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <199905041711.VAA04689@tejblum.dnttm.rssi.ru>; from Dmitrij Tejblum on Tue, May 04, 1999 at 09:11:45PM +0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, May 04, 1999 at 09:11:45PM +0400, Dmitrij Tejblum wrote: > I don't like your idea that WEOF == INT_MIN. Apparently, everyone else > have WEOF == -1 (== EOF), and there is no reason why we should not too. > I don't know about "debugging purposes". WEOF == EOF should allow more > code sharing with existing libc. Note that FreeBSD already have some > very sparse and nonstandard (but functional) wchar support. Now that I have actually started coding, I agree with you. :-) I changed it to (-1). > Note that a major portion of already almost implemented in FreeBSD: > plain ctype functions work with wide characters. So it should be fairly > easy to write an almost working . (BTW, it is somewhere on my > ToDo list for quite some time, but now not that far from the top). It is fairly easy regardless. :-) It is different from plain ctype functions though. For example, iswdigit(ch) must return TRUE if ch is a digit in Devanagari or Chinese or anything else. It also must be locale independent. If ch is a digit in Unicode (or on any plane of its ISO 10646 extension), then it is a digit even if one's locale does not know about it. I have evaluated two existing packages today. They both include the functionality of and more (the authors thought C standard did not go far enough). I exchanged email with both authors. They both suggested I should include either library in the base distribution and have the C routines be a front end to it. I liked the idea at first, but, having thought about it for a couple hours, I am now more inclined to place both libraries into the ports collection and continue working on my routines. One good thing about evaluating those two packages is that I noticed one of them is using very much the same algorithms I have come up with. It is good to get an affirmation that I am moving on the right track. :-) The main problem with doing the front end is that we would either have to include one of their libraries into the C library, thus adding to it things that simply do not belong there, or we have to link programs with their library just to use wctype functions from the standard C library, which would open a whole can of worms. Nevertheless, I have posted links to their libraries on the web page and am open to comments. I have also discovered an important link today: It is no longer necessary to spend $305 to get your own copy of the ISO 10646 standard: It can be downloaded from the web either in MS Word format (yeah, right) or as a PostScript file. The link is now listed on the page, which, again, is at http://www.whizkidtech.net/i18n/wc/. I will also need to get some input on some "philosophical" questions. Namely, I will need to build several tables for the wctype.h functionality. The thing is that the standard is open: New codes can and will be added to it. I need to decide whether to hardcode the tables or place them into files. At this point, I am leaning toward the hardcoded solution for several reasons: A file can be misplaced or lost, or even corrupted; the changes do not happen too often; the changes do not affect major languages and are of little consequence to most computer users (so if Egyptian hieroglyphics are added to plane 1 as planned, Egyptologists will need to update their C libraries, while us mortals may pretty much ignore it); it is just as easy to download an update of the C library as an update of several files. For what it's worth, I will need to write some utilities for my own use, utilities to create the code for tables. So any time they add some new code of interest to only a small group of people, the group can use the utilities on their own computers, and simply recompile the library even if I am on vacation, or whatever. Adam To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 20:38:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bubba.whistle.com (s205m7.whistle.com [207.76.205.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DE0014C44 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 20:38:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from archie@whistle.com) Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.whistle.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id UAA07378; Wed, 5 May 1999 20:37:37 -0700 (PDT) From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199905060337.UAA07378@bubba.whistle.com> Subject: Re: wc* routines In-Reply-To: <19990505214934.B217@whizkidtech.net> from "G. Adam Stanislav" at "May 5, 99 09:49:34 pm" To: adam@whizkidtech.net (G. Adam Stanislav) Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 20:37:37 -0700 (PDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL38 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG G. Adam Stanislav writes: > I will also need to get some input on some "philosophical" questions. Namely, > I will need to build several tables for the wctype.h functionality. The thing Not sure if this is completely relevant or not, but in kaffe we face the same problem storing the tables for Unicode to implement Character.isDigit(), etc. One developer came up with a nice compression scheme for this information and a perl script to generate the tables. This is nice because the tables don't end up taking up tons of space. If you're interested, see http://www.kaffe.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/kaffe/developers/ http://www.kaffe.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/kaffe/FAQ/FAQ.unicode for the perl scripts and description, and the source for java/lang/Character.java (which for some reason is missing from the web site cvs thing). In C you could use 'file2c' to store the tables in libc or wherever. -Archie ___________________________________________________________________________ Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 21:16:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (castles532.castles.com [208.214.165.96]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 768CB14E3A for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 21:16:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA04147; Wed, 5 May 1999 19:17:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199905060217.TAA04147@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Wes Peters Cc: jgrosch@MooseRiver.com, "Mark J. Taylor" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NetGear 10/100 Ethernet: an oversight? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 05 May 1999 20:10:38 MDT." <3730FA1E.7024C8C8@softweyr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 19:17:59 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > When Compaq bought DEC, most of DEC's network manufacturing, including > the design rights to the Tulip chip, were bought by Bay Networks, nee > Nortel. I assume the FA310TX is still being made with the Tulip, > unless Bay got smart and killed it. In that case, it's probably > either a PNIC or the other Tulip-like chip from Winbond. The Tulip design is owned by Intel. The new Netgear cards are not the FA310TX. I think they use the PNIC part, but my memory's never been the best. Ask Bill Paul if you really care. Alternatively, if the GENERIC kernel isn't probing the card, please tell us which chip is actually on it, so that we can fix things. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 21:31:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kyrnet.kg (news.kyrnet.kg [195.254.160.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C45914E3A for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 21:31:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fygrave@tigerteam.net) Received: from localhost by kyrnet.kg (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA16202; Thu, 6 May 1999 09:23:45 +0500 (GMT) X-Authentication-Warning: kyrnet.kg: fygrave owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 09:23:45 +0500 (GMT) From: CyberPsychotic X-Sender: fygrave@kyrnet.kg To: Julian Elischer Cc: Doug Rabson , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, tech@openbsd.org Subject: Re: io ports reading/writing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Confirm-receipt-to: fygrave@usa.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ~ > I think you just open /dev/io and use inb/outb. Be warned that this will ~ > only work on i386 - the alpha uses a library, libio, to emulate inb/outb ~ > in user programs. ~ ~ Also beware the arguments are in the oposite order to linux in outb() ~ oops.. I actually wasn't able to find inb/outb routines in standard-linked library at all. Should I link any external routines? (as for now I just made them of my own, using inline asm directives). To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 21:37:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C44714EE1 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 21:37:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA13304; Wed, 5 May 1999 21:36:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199905060436.VAA13304@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Mike Smith Cc: Wes Peters , jgrosch@MooseRiver.com, "Mark J. Taylor" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NetGear 10/100 Ethernet: an oversight? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 05 May 1999 19:17:59 PDT." <199905060217.TAA04147@dingo.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 21:36:57 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I have a BayNetworks card which I guess has the Lite-On PNIC PCI network controller (/sys/pci/if_pn.c) Works okay over here. May 5 21:35:40 muadib /kernel: pn0: <82c169 PNIC 10/100BaseTX> at device 20 Cheers, Amancio > > When Compaq bought DEC, most of DEC's network manufacturing, including > > the design rights to the Tulip chip, were bought by Bay Networks, nee > > Nortel. I assume the FA310TX is still being made with the Tulip, > > unless Bay got smart and killed it. In that case, it's probably > > either a PNIC or the other Tulip-like chip from Winbond. > > The Tulip design is owned by Intel. > > The new Netgear cards are not the FA310TX. I think they use the PNIC > part, but my memory's never been the best. Ask Bill Paul if you really > care. > > Alternatively, if the GENERIC kernel isn't probing the card, please > tell us which chip is actually on it, so that we can fix things. > > -- > \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith > \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au > \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org > \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- Amancio Hasty hasty@star-gate.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed May 5 23: 5:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (osmium.gn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 392A114F60 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 23:05:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wilko@yedi.iaf.nl) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (8.9.2/8.9.2) with UUCP id HAA29728 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 6 May 1999 07:57:26 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.9.3/8.6.12) id IAA50587 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 6 May 1999 08:03:46 GMT From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199905060803.IAA50587@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: anybody ever seen this? To: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers list) Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 08:03:46 +0000 (GMT) X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem, The Netherlands X-pgp-info: PGP public key at 'finger wilko@freefall.freebsd.org' X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG To: newscrisis Subject: news (urgent): possible expire problems awk in free(): warning: chunk is already free. awk in free(): warning: chunk is already free. awk in free(): warning: chunk is already free. awk in free(): warning: chunk is already free. awk in free(): warning: chunk is already free. awk in free(): warning: chunk is already free. awk in free(): warning: chunk is already free. etc etc. This is C-news running expire under 3.1-stable. Am I missing anything or is this a FAQ? Groeten / Cheers, | / o / / _ Arnhem, The Netherlands - Powered by FreeBSD - |/|/ / / /( (_) Bulte WWW : http://www.tcja.nl http://www.freebsd.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 0:34: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from Vorlon.odc.net (Vorlon.odc.net [207.137.42.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25DBD14DDB for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 00:33:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nwestfal@Vorlon.odc.net) Received: from localhost (nwestfal@localhost) by Vorlon.odc.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA21160; Thu, 6 May 1999 00:33:26 -0700 Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 00:33:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Neal Westfall To: Mike Smith Cc: Wes Peters , jgrosch@MooseRiver.com, "Mark J. Taylor" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NetGear 10/100 Ethernet: an oversight? In-Reply-To: <199905060217.TAA04147@dingo.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 5 May 1999, Mike Smith wrote: > > The new Netgear cards are not the FA310TX. I think they use the PNIC > part, but my memory's never been the best. Ask Bill Paul if you really > care. Actually, they are. The newer FA310TX use the PNIC chip, while the older ones use the TULIP chip. They of course both work under FreeBSD, but use different drivers, which makes it kind of confusing, but that can be blamed on NetGear for using the same model number for two different cards. I have serveral of the older TULIP based ones, which work great for me. Don't know how well the newer PNIC ones work. Neal To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 1:10:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.cintel.co.kr (unknown [210.123.201.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5FAD0158BF for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 01:10:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hjyoo@ns.cintel.co.kr) Received: from cintel.co.kr (korando.cintel.co.kr [210.123.201.21]) by ns.cintel.co.kr (8.8.6H1/8.8.6) with ESMTP id RAA14559 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 17:06:13 +0900 (KST) Message-ID: <37314E8A.FF7C219C@cintel.co.kr> Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 17:10:51 +0900 From: "HyunJong, Yoo" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: ko MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Loadable kernel HOWTO ? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=EUC-KR Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, all... I'm having questions about Loadable Kernel. I want to learn HOWTO make a loadable kernel. Will you please recommend me a good reference site or HOWTO doc.? -- ========== À¯ÇöÁ¾(HyunJong, Yoo) =========== Cintel Co., Ltd. --- http://www.cintel.co.kr cruz staff & engineering manager of R&D E-mail : hjyoo@cintel.co.kr Phone : +82-42-828-6088 Fax : +82-42-828-6089 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 1:29: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43E0114F9E for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 01:28:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA35290; Thu, 6 May 1999 09:28:59 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 09:28:59 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: CyberPsychotic Cc: Julian Elischer , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, tech@openbsd.org Subject: Re: io ports reading/writing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 6 May 1999, CyberPsychotic wrote: > ~ > I think you just open /dev/io and use inb/outb. Be warned that this will > ~ > only work on i386 - the alpha uses a library, libio, to emulate inb/outb > ~ > in user programs. > ~ > ~ Also beware the arguments are in the oposite order to linux in outb() > ~ > > oops.. I actually wasn't able to find inb/outb routines in standard-linked > library at all. Should I link any external routines? (as for now I just made > them of my own, using inline asm directives). There are inline macros in -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 1:33: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from docenti.ing.unipi.it (docenti.ing.unipi.it [131.114.28.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5AD014E10 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 01:32:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gabriele@ing.unipi.it) Received: from localhost (gabriele@localhost) by docenti.ing.unipi.it (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA21440 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 10:34:29 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 10:34:28 +0200 (CEST) From: Gabriele Cecchetti To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Is FreeBSD's make easily ported to non-BSD UNICES? In-Reply-To: <199905060113.DAA02046@merlin.rz.tu-clausthal.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 6 May 1999, Ronald Kuehn wrote: > In freebsd-hackers Peter Mutsaers wrote: > > > Hello, > > > I really like FreeBSD's make (pmake) and would like to use it instead > > for our companies development on IRIX and Solaris. Before trying to > > port it, the question: is it easy to run it on other (SYSV-like) > > Unices, or maybe has it already been ported? > What's about FreeBSD's pmake on AIX 4+ ? Gabriele To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 4:49:25 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.promo.de (mail.Promo.DE [194.45.188.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E96ED1587F for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 04:49:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from stefan.bethke@hanse.de) Received: from d225.promo.de (d225.Promo.DE [194.45.188.225]) by mail.promo.de (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA21465; Thu, 6 May 1999 13:48:55 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 13:48:13 +0200 From: Stefan Bethke To: brainey@cisco.com Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NetGear 10/100 Ethernet: an oversight? Message-ID: <539603.3134987293@d225.promo.de> In-Reply-To: <199905060233.TAA03139@copperhead.cisco.com> Originator-Info: login-id=stefan; server=mail X-Mailer: Mulberry (MacOS) [1.4.2, s/n U-301178] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Bill Rainey wrote: >> When Compaq bought DEC, most of DEC's network manufacturing, including >> the design rights to the Tulip chip, were bought by Bay Networks, nee >> Nortel. I assume the FA310TX is still being made with the Tulip, > > It was actually Cabletron that bought DEC's networking business and > Intel bought the chip stuff. I don't know where that left the Tulip > chips though. With Intel. I have a 4-port card with 21143 (produced 9842) and the 21152 bridge with Intel printed on them. The data sheets (even for the supposedly out-of-production 21040 and 21041) are at http://developer.intel.com/. Stefan -- M=FChlendamm 12 | Voice +49-40-256848, +49-177-3504009 D-22089 Hamburg | e-mail: stefan.bethke@hanse.de Germany | stb@freebsd.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 4:54:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp1.vnet.net (smtp1.vnet.net [166.82.1.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55CBF14C84 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 04:54:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp1.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id HAA05067; Thu, 6 May 1999 07:54:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA10155; Thu, 6 May 1999 07:54:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id HAA73794; Thu, 6 May 1999 07:54:01 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 07:54:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199905061154.HAA73794@lakes.dignus.com> To: adam@whizkidtech.net, dima@tejblum.dnttm.rssi.ru Subject: Re: wc* routines Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19990505214934.B217@whizkidtech.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I will also need to get some input on some "philosophical" questions. Namely, > I will need to build several tables for the wctype.h functionality. The thing > is that the standard is open: New codes can and will be added to it. I need > to decide whether to hardcode the tables or place them into files. At this > point, I am leaning toward the hardcoded solution for several reasons: A file > can be misplaced or lost, or even corrupted; the changes do not happen too > often; the changes do not affect major languages and are of little consequence > to most computer users (so if Egyptian hieroglyphics are added to plane 1 as > planned, Egyptologists will need to update their C libraries, while us mortals > may pretty much ignore it); it is just as easy to download an update of the > C library as an update of several files. For what it's worth, I will need to > write some utilities for my own use, utilities to create the code for tables. > So any time they add some new code of interest to only a small group of people, > the group can use the utilities on their own computers, and simply recompile > the library even if I am on vacation, or whatever. I mention this, somewhat facetiously... but one of the fundamental discoveries in computer science was the idea of separation between code and data. Although you bring up good points; realize that you are violating that tenet... and as such, are inviting potential trouble. I'm not saying that it is to be taken to the extreme... and there certainly are situations that call for placing data in the "code" as it were... If you want to do such a thing, I would suggest that the reasons _for_ it be *very* strong, and there be none against it... I don't get the impression, from your description above, that is the case. Perhaps a half-way point is needed, much as the locale library is implemented. Provide, in the library, some default table that is a "reasonable subset of everything" so programs don't just blow up if they can't find the file... then, provide the mechanism for reading the file if they can find it. And, you shouldn't assume those Egyptologists can actually recompile & relink their code. For example, if a word-processing company has sold them a program - it's likely to be quite some time before the next release which is recompiled/relinked with newer FreeBSD libraries is available... But, if the data was separate from the code - the Egyptologists would simply need to get the new file & not require a new release from their vendor (see - powerful, ain't it.) Since you mentioned "philisophical" :-) . - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 5:38:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52F3314F8F for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 05:38:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA34710; Thu, 6 May 1999 08:35:36 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 08:35:36 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Milan Kopacka Cc: FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: linux compat question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 3 May 1999, Milan Kopacka wrote: > On Mon, 3 May 1999, Chuck Robey wrote: > > > Anyone know if linux apps use our own magic file, or if they look into > > /compat/linux/etc for a magic file? I'm trying to install word perfect, > > and I won't yet let it touch my FreeBSD magic file. > > I know only one application using magic, that's file(1). You need to run > file in Linux emulation? > > Wordperfect has some add-ons to magic, for file(1) to be able to properly > recognize Wordperfect's documents. > > > Maybe, anyone have a recent Linux magic file? > > Get "file" package from your favorite Linux mirror site. :) No, 1) there is no "file" package (at least not in Debian, I checked) 2) the "fileutils" package, which I did find, didn't have file. I don't think I need it anymore, but since I got this same advice now from two places, it seems the old adage holds: the only folks who will give you directions are those who don't know where it is. ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@picnic.mat.net | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (Solaris7). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 5:49:42 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.sanda.gr.jp (ns.sanda.gr.jp [210.232.122.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B498D15044 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 05:49:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from non@ever.sanda.gr.jp) Received: from ever.sanda.gr.jp (epoch [10.93.63.51]) by ns.sanda.gr.jp (8.8.8/3.6W) with ESMTP id VAA06790; Thu, 6 May 1999 21:49:33 +0900 From: non@ever.sanda.gr.jp Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ever.sanda.gr.jp (8.8.8/3.3W9) with ESMTP id WAA08066; Thu, 6 May 1999 22:01:35 +0900 (JST) To: newconfig@jp.freebsd.org Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: FYI from [newconfig-jp 1855] newconfig/dynamic configuration (sysnewconfig990503-kld990505test6.patch.gz) In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 06 May 1999 01:09:34 +0900" <19990506010934J.uch@nop.or.jp> References: <19990506010934J.uch@nop.or.jp> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.93 on Emacs 19.28 / Mule 2.3 =?iso-2022-jp?B?KBskQkt2RSYyVhsoQik=?= Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <19990506220134G.non@ever.sanda.gr.jp> Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 22:01:34 +0900 X-Dispatcher: imput version 980905(IM100) Lines: 46 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG FYI this is brief translation from [newconfig-jp 1855]. From: UCHIYAMA Yasushi Subject: [newconfig-jp 1855] newconfig/dynamic configuration (sysnewconfig990503-kld990505test6.patch.gz) Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 01:09:34 +0900 ftp://f77.nop.or.jp/users/uch/PCMCIA/FreeBSD/ sysnewconfig990503-kld990505test6.patch.gz ... patch from newconfig CVS repository at the date of 1999/05/03 dconfig990503.tar.gz new `config.new' Previously, cfdata was from the array in ioconf.c generated by config.new. In this version, cfdata is made at boot time by newioconf.c which is generated by dconfig. Driver modules xl, ne, dp8390nic, rtl80x9, ne_pci and ne_isa for dynamic configuration is in sys/modules. `dconfig(8)' is modified from http://home.jp.freebsd.org/~furuta/dconf.tar.gz This is used to generate newioconf.[ch] at compile time and load drivers at run time. Interfaces are temporal. Extract in the directory usr.sbin. You cannot compile the kernel source with sysnewconfig990503-kld990505test6.patch.gz without dconfig. 1) To compile a kernel, instead of config.new NEWCONF, use dconfig --compile=NEWCONF 2) To load/unload drivers, in /dev directory, do mknod config c 80 0 For example, to load `ne3 at pci0 dev ? func ?', do, dconfig --load --driver=ne --unit=3 --bus=pci --busunit=0 --locator=-1,-1 --flags=0 To unload, dconfig --unload --driver=ne --unit=3 --bus=pci --busunit=0 --locator=-1,-1 --flags=0 To load/unload `ne4 at isa0 iobase 0x280 irq 9' do, dconfig --load --driver=ne --unit=4 --bus=isa --busunit=0 --locator=640,0,0,0,9,-1,-1,0,1,0 --flags=0 dconfig --unload --driver=ne --unit=4 --bus=isa --busunit=0 --locator=640,0,0,0,9,-1,-1,0,1,0 --flags=0 > --- > UCHIYAMA Yasushi > uch@nop.or.jp // Noriaki Mitsunaga To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 6:30:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mrelay.jrc.it (mrelay.jrc.it [139.191.1.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 39F0814E60 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 06:30:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nick.hibma@jrc.it) Received: from elpc36.jrc.it (elpc36.jrc.it [139.191.71.36]) by mrelay.jrc.it (LMC5692) with SMTP id PAA01221 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 15:30:17 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 15:29:25 +0200 (CEST) From: Nick Hibma X-Sender: n_hibma@elpc36.jrc.it Reply-To: Nick Hibma To: FreeBSD hackers mailing list Subject: Re: USB In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [an answer for the archives] The Via is a bit special in that it resets the frame base register as well. See patch in my other message. Nick On Wed, 5 May 1999, Jamie Bowden wrote: > On Wed, 5 May 1999, Mike Smith wrote: > > :> > :> I've compiled in USB support into 3.1-R, just to see if I can perhaps see > :> a probe of my scanner (HP ScanJet 6200c). During boot my dmesg looks like > :> so: > :> > :> usb0: > :... > :> uhci_waitintr: timeout > : > :Looks like your BIOS isn't giving the USB controller an IRQ. Update > :your BIOS if possible, and go hunting for an option to turn it on. > > uhci0: rev 0x02 int d irq 9 on pci0.7.2 > usb0: USB version 1.0, interrupting at 9 > > It is being assigned an interrupt. I have the latest bios for this > motherboard installed (1.13cd13). > > Jamie Bowden > > -- > > If we've got to fight over grep, sign me up. But boggle can go. > -Ted Faber (on Hasbro's request for removal of /usr/games/boggle) > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 6:32:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mrelay.jrc.it (mrelay.jrc.it [139.191.1.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A315D14E60 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 06:32:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nick.hibma@jrc.it) Received: from elpc36.jrc.it (elpc36.jrc.it [139.191.71.36]) by mrelay.jrc.it (LMC5692) with SMTP id PAA01306; Thu, 6 May 1999 15:32:07 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 15:31:15 +0200 (CEST) From: Nick Hibma X-Sender: n_hibma@elpc36.jrc.it Reply-To: Nick Hibma To: Kevin Day Cc: FreeBSD hackers mailing list Subject: Re: USB In-Reply-To: <199905051857.NAA05623@home.dragondata.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG That's a separate issue. Are you running current or 3.1? Your problem is probably the BIOS setting some bits in the legacy support register and forgetting to set the PRIQDEnable bit as well. I'll do an MFC tonight and send you the patch. If you could test things that would be great. Cheers, Nick On Wed, 5 May 1999, Kevin Day wrote: > > On Wed, 5 May 1999, Mike Smith wrote: > > > > :> > > :> I've compiled in USB support into 3.1-R, just to see if I can perhaps see > > :> a probe of my scanner (HP ScanJet 6200c). During boot my dmesg looks like > > :> so: > > :> > > :> usb0: > > :... > > :> uhci_waitintr: timeout > > : > > :Looks like your BIOS isn't giving the USB controller an IRQ. Update > > :your BIOS if possible, and go hunting for an option to turn it on. > > > > uhci0: rev 0x02 int d irq 9 on pci0.7.2 > > usb0: USB version 1.0, interrupting at 9 > > > > It is being assigned an interrupt. I have the latest bios for this > > motherboard installed (1.13cd13). > > > > Jamie Bowden > > > > FWIW, I'm seeing the same thing on an Intel chipset board, when I plug any > devices in. If I unplug the device while it's repeating that timeout > message, i see a 'stray irq' message appear. > > Kevin > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 6:44:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from devserv.devel.redhat.com (devserv.devel.redhat.com [207.175.42.156]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E9B4156D7 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 06:44:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from zab@zabbo.net) Received: from hoser.devel (hoser.devel.redhat.com [207.175.42.139]) by devserv.devel.redhat.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA16090; Thu, 6 May 1999 09:44:39 -0400 Received: from localhost (zab@localhost) by hoser.devel (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA28785; Thu, 6 May 1999 09:44:39 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: hoser.devel: zab owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 09:44:39 -0400 (EDT) From: Zach Brown X-Sender: zab@hoser To: Andrew Reilly Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Pentium-III and FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: <99042118082205.43091@gurney.reilly.home> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 21 Apr 1999, Andrew Reilly wrote: > a) tweaking as to understand the new (KNI SIMD float) instructions. > b) tweaking cc (egcs) to emit those, if it can (much less likely, my guess) > c) tweaking the kernel to save and restore the new state on task switches. its also quite worth using the magical cache instructions (prefecth, cache avoiding stores) in some parts of the kernel. We're having fun with these in parts of the linux kernel. Mail me if you want to discuss things further :) -- zach - - - - - - 007 373 5963 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 7:33:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from icicle.winternet.com (icicle.winternet.com [198.174.169.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4A0714D67 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 07:33:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nrahlstr@mail.winternet.com) Received: from tundra.winternet.com (nrahlstr@tundra.winternet.com [198.174.169.11]) by icicle.winternet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA09089; Thu, 6 May 1999 09:33:09 -0500 (CDT) SMTP "HELO" (ESMTP) greeting from tundra.winternet.com But _really_ from :: nrahlstr@tundra.winternet.com [198.174.169.11] SMTP "MAIL From" = nrahlstr@mail.winternet.com (Nathan Ahlstrom) SMTP "RCPT To" = Received: (from nrahlstr@localhost) by tundra.winternet.com (8.8.7/8.8.4) id JAA25990; Thu, 6 May 1999 09:33:08 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <19990506093308.C25855@winternet.com> Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 09:33:08 -0500 From: Nathan Ahlstrom To: Wilko Bulte , FreeBSD hackers list Subject: Re: anybody ever seen this? References: <199905060803.IAA50587@yedi.iaf.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <199905060803.IAA50587@yedi.iaf.nl>; from Wilko Bulte on Thu, May 06, 1999 at 08:03:46AM +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Wilko Bulte wrote: > To: newscrisis > Subject: news (urgent): possible expire problems > > awk in free(): warning: chunk is already free. > awk in free(): warning: chunk is already free. > awk in free(): warning: chunk is already free. > awk in free(): warning: chunk is already free. > awk in free(): warning: chunk is already free. > awk in free(): warning: chunk is already free. > awk in free(): warning: chunk is already free. > etc etc. > > This is C-news running expire under 3.1-stable. Am I missing anything or is > this a FAQ? Check out PR gnu/7821. -- Nathan Ahlstrom FreeBSD: http://www.FreeBSD.org/ nrahlstr@winternet.com PGP Key ID: 0x67BC9D19 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 8:34:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bytor.rush.net (bytor.rush.net [209.45.245.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB71E1512C; Thu, 6 May 1999 08:34:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from lynch@rush.net) Received: from localhost (lynch@localhost) by bytor.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA02627; Thu, 6 May 1999 11:34:49 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 11:34:48 -0400 (EDT) From: Pat Lynch To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: USENIX FreeBSD Dinner Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Well all, a few months ago, jkh handed the dinner plans off to me for USENIX, so I've been doing a little research : I want people to look at these URL's and let me know which of them sound the most interesting (I lean towards the Mission Ranch in Carmel, but I'm not sure how far it is from the Conference Center). Mission Ranch http://www.digitallantern.com/monterey/r/5/rm549.html Tarpy's Roadhouse (a little expensive) http://www.digitallantern.com/monterey/r/8/rm859.html Domenico's (this sounds very promising, inexpensive) http://www.digitallantern.com/monterey/r/2/rm229.html Jardines De San Juan (possibly too far away, but inexpensive, and listed as one of the "If you in Monterey only one time" places) and last but not least, inexpensive too, Rappa's http://www.digitallantern.com/monterey/r/7/rm700.html please let me know what you guys think, I want this to be a good time for all... -Pat ___________________________________________________________________________ Pat Lynch lynch@rush.net Systems Administrator Rush Networking "Wow, everyone looks different in Real Life (tm)"- Nathan Dorfman meeting people at FUNY "Suicide is painless, switching to NT isn't."- Unknown ___________________________________________________________________________ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 8:49:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.cintel.co.kr (unknown [210.123.201.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 632CC150DB; Thu, 6 May 1999 08:49:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hjyoo@ns.cintel.co.kr) Received: from cintel.co.kr (korando.cintel.co.kr [210.123.201.21]) by ns.cintel.co.kr (8.8.6H1/8.8.6) with ESMTP id AAA18786; Fri, 7 May 1999 00:44:48 +0900 (KST) Message-ID: <3731BA05.F6E45A7C@cintel.co.kr> Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 00:49:25 +0900 From: "HyunJong, Yoo" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: ko MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Loadable Kernel HOWTO? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, all... I'm having questions about Loadable Kernel. I want to learn HOWTO make a loadable kernel. Will you please recommend me a good reference site or HOWTO doc.? -- ========== À¯ÇöÁ¾(HyunJong, Yoo) =========== Cintel Co., Ltd. --- http://www.cintel.co.kr cruz staff & engineering manager of R&D E-mail : hjyoo@cintel.co.kr Phone : +82-42-828-6088 Fax : +82-42-828-6089 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 9:42:24 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8174A14E32 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 09:42:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.3/8.9.1) id SAA05280; Thu, 6 May 1999 18:42:16 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Adding desktop support References: <199905050647.CAA32197@bellsouth.net> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 06 May 1999 18:42:15 +0200 In-Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG's message of "Wed, 05 May 1999 02:47:54 -0400" Message-ID: Lines: 23 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG writes: > > He is fixing the (currently completely bogus) vnode locking system so > > it will actually lock vnodes. The downside is, our current NFS > > implementation relies on vnode locking being broken. Fixing stacking > > layers will break NFS. > You're saying NFS isn't broken? ;) Heh :) What i meant was that fixing stacking layers will make NFS not work at all. I may be wrong; the right people to consult about this matter are eivind@freebsd.org and dillon@freebsd.org. > But more seriously, we do look forward to the day when the union > (tranluscent) filesystem is present in -STABLE and can be recommended > for production use. It *is* present in -STABLE, with a big warning in the man page, and it *will* work when Eivind is done. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 11:38: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk [193.237.89.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7013E15AA0 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 11:37:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nik@nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk) Received: (from nik@localhost) by nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (8.9.2/8.9.2) id TAA22253; Thu, 6 May 1999 19:11:50 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from nik) Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 19:11:49 +0100 From: Nik Clayton To: Peter Mutsaers Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Is FreeBSD's make easily ported to non-BSD UNICES? Message-ID: <19990506191149.A21890@catkin.nothing-going-on.org> References: <87btfzutqa.fsf@muon.xs4all.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <87btfzutqa.fsf@muon.xs4all.nl>; from Peter Mutsaers on Wed, May 05, 1999 at 10:50:05PM +0200 Organization: Nik at home, where there's nothing going on Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, May 05, 1999 at 10:50:05PM +0200, Peter Mutsaers wrote: > I really like FreeBSD's make (pmake) and would like to use it instead > for our companies development on IRIX and Solaris. Before trying to > port it, the question: is it easy to run it on other (SYSV-like) > Unices, or maybe has it already been ported? http://www.quick.com.au/ftp/pub/sjg/help/bmake.html N -- There's some milk in the fridge about to go off. . . and there it goes. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 11:58: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mx.nsu.ru (mx.nsu.ru [193.124.215.71]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A73C514C2F for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 11:57:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fjoe@iclub.nsu.ru) Received: from iclub.nsu.ru (fjoe@iclub.nsu.ru [193.124.222.66]) by mx.nsu.ru (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id BAA06690 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 01:56:36 +0700 (NOVST) Received: from localhost (fjoe@localhost) by iclub.nsu.ru (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA02294 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 01:56:36 +0700 (NSS) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 01:56:36 +0700 (NSS) From: Max Khon To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Arcnet driver for FreeBSD Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hi, there! I have ported NetBSD/amiga arcnet driver to FreeBSD. The drivers supports SMC90c26, SMC90c56 and SMC90c66 (in '56 comp. mode) arcnet ISA cards. Both RFC1201 and RFC1051 (untested) protocols are supported. The driver is known to be compatible with Linux arcnet driver. (I have ~180-190K/s via ftp between Linux and FreeBSD) This work also includes generic ARP support. Is it possible to merge this stuff in? This should help FreeBSD Token Ring project a lot. http://iclub.nsu.ru/~fjoe for details /fjoe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 12:20:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sol (cs1-gw.cs.binghamton.edu [128.226.171.72]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 5F9B114DE3 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 12:20:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu) Received: from localhost (zzhang@localhost) by sol (SMI-8.6/8.6.9) with SMTP id PAA15291 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 15:09:30 -0400 Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 15:09:30 -0400 (EDT) From: Zhihui Zhang To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Copies of superblocks in FFS Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG After reading the FFS source code, I can not help wondering why we keep N+1 superblocks in a file system, where N is the number of cylinder groups in the file system. It seems to me that only the second superblock in cylinder group 0 is actually used (cylinder group 0 contains two copies of superblocks). All other superblocks are never touched. If the primary superblock (the second copy in cylinder group 0, at offset 8192+8192) is updated and other superblocks are not updated at the same time, how can any of other copies be used to restore file system in case that the primary copy is corrupted somehow? If so, the performance will be degraded. Also, except for the root filesystem (/), all other filesystems (/var, /usr, etc.) do not have the (boot code + disklabel) installed, these space are also wasted (8192 bytes for each non-root filesystem). BTW, the hard disks are more stable nowadays and any bad sectors may have been hidden by the disk controllers (the filesystem does not have to deal with them). Any enlightment or correction is appreciated. -------------------------------------------------- Zhihui Zhang. Please visit http://www.freebsd.org -------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 12:28:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.skylink.it (ns.skylink.it [194.177.113.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E17014C42; Thu, 6 May 1999 12:28:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hibma@skylink.it) Received: from heidi.plazza.it (va-178.skylink.it [194.185.55.178]) by ns.skylink.it (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA28218; Thu, 6 May 1999 21:29:16 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost.plazza.it [127.0.0.1]) by heidi.plazza.it (8.8.8/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA00572; Thu, 6 May 1999 21:27:55 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 21:27:55 +0200 (CEST) From: Nick Hibma X-Sender: n_hibma@heidi.plazza.it Reply-To: Nick Hibma To: Jamie Bowden Cc: FreeBSD current Mailing list , FreeBSD hackers mailing list , USB BSD list Subject: info on USB, URL's and Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG If you want some information on USB: FreeBSD USB homepage: http://www.etla.net/~n_hibma/usb/usb.pl USB homepage: http://www.usb.org Mailing list: usb-bsd@egroups.com subscribe: http://www.egroups.com Specs on chips: http://www.intel.com/ (UHCI) http://www.via.com.tw/ (UHCI) http://www.opti.com.tw/ (OHCI) (and other chipset manufacturers I can't remember the name of) UDI (info on USBDI you can find on USB homepage, I think): http://www.sco.com/UDI A reasonable list of devices for USB: http://www.usbstuff.com/ URL's on devices that have supported/will be supported soon: http://www.cherry.com/ 3504 keyboard http://www.yedata.co.jp/ Flashbuster-U (soon) http://www.3com.com/ ISDN-TA (not available yet, I have Sample 73 :-) (soon) 56K0 Voice Faxmodem Pro, aka 5605 (soon) (the above companies: thanks for sending me samples!) http://www.iomega.com/ USB Zip drive Linux: http://peloncho.fis.ucm.es/~inaky/USB.html If you just want to talk lots about USB related things and what one _could_ do :-): linux-usb@peloncho.fis.ucm.es subscribe: majordomo@peloncho.fis.ucm.es Hope this is of any use to anyone. Nick FreeBSD USB project. n_hibma@freebsd.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 13: 3:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp.enteract.com (thor.enteract.com [207.229.143.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 7946615A5D for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 13:02:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dscheidt@enteract.com) Received: (qmail 4791 invoked from network); 6 May 1999 20:02:41 -0000 Received: from shell-1.enteract.com (dscheidt@207.229.143.40) by thor.enteract.com with SMTP; 6 May 1999 20:02:41 -0000 Received: from localhost (dscheidt@localhost) by shell-1.enteract.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id PAA47276; Thu, 6 May 1999 15:02:38 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dscheidt@enteract.com) X-Authentication-Warning: shell-1.enteract.com: dscheidt owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 15:02:38 -0500 (CDT) From: David Scheidt To: Zhihui Zhang Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Copies of superblocks in FFS In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 6 May 1999, Zhihui Zhang wrote: :If the primary superblock (the second copy in cylinder group 0, at offset :8192+8192) is updated and other superblocks are not updated at the same :time, how can any of other copies be used to restore file system in case :that the primary copy is corrupted somehow? If so, the performance will :be degraded. Most of what is in the superblock is static, and doesn't change from filesystem creation time. The things that don't can be created from the disk, at fsck time. fsck -b has saved a lot of filesystems, and is clearly worth a few wasted blocks. : :Also, except for the root filesystem (/), all other filesystems (/var, :/usr, etc.) do not have the (boot code + disklabel) installed, these space :are also wasted (8192 bytes for each non-root filesystem). It is very handy to be able to make a filesytem bootable after it has been created. Much easier than dumping the filesytem, remaking the filesytem, and then restoring it. I'll pay 16K per filesystem for this. : :BTW, the hard disks are more stable nowadays and any bad sectors may have :been hidden by the disk controllers (the filesystem does not have to deal :with them). Panics still can leave the primary superblock hosed. Trust me. David Scheidt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 13:30:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mtu.ru (ns.mtu.ru [195.34.32.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6C471517B; Thu, 6 May 1999 13:30:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from daktaklakpak@public.mtu.ru) Received: from dial56188.mtu-net.ru (dial56188.mtu-net.ru [195.34.56.188]) by mtu.ru (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F2992E77; Thu, 6 May 1999 23:30:03 +0400 (MSK) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 00:28:06 +0400 (MSD) From: Danil Shebunin X-Sender: danil@free-bsd.space To: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Kernel PPP (PPPD): ip-up & ip-down scripts execution In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Recipient: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG X-Envelope-To: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi! We have a small net and using FreeBSD 2.2.8 machine as Internet gate. To dial a provider we use kernel PPP - PPPD. I need to setup a firewall after connection established. For this purpose I use file /etc/ppp/ip-up, as described in man page, to setup firewall using ipfw. But it seems, that this script is called with effective uid of current user, not root ,as described in man! I decide that, because the script is executed (I've placed simple 'echo executed > /exec.txt' in this script to check this). But all ipfw commands is not executed - firewall settings remain unchanged. What I'm doing wrong? How can I force ip-up and ip-down scripts to execute correctly? P.S. PLEASE! PLEASE! PLEASE! Reply to my e-mail - I'm not subscribed to these mail-lists -- ===---===---===---===---===---=== Have a nice CONNECT! Dan (daktaklakpak@public.mtu.ru) ===---===---===---===---===---=== To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 13:36:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sol (cs1-gw.cs.binghamton.edu [128.226.171.72]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id AD96B14C45 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 13:35:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu) Received: from localhost (zzhang@localhost) by sol (SMI-8.6/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA15684; Thu, 6 May 1999 16:25:02 -0400 Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 16:25:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Zhihui Zhang To: David Scheidt Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Copies of superblocks in FFS In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Thanks for your reply, but I still have a little problem with it: > :Also, except for the root filesystem (/), all other filesystems (/var, > :/usr, etc.) do not have the (boot code + disklabel) installed, these space > :are also wasted (8192 bytes for each non-root filesystem). > > It is very handy to be able to make a filesytem bootable after it has been > created. Much easier than dumping the filesytem, remaking the filesytem, and > then restoring it. I'll pay 16K per filesystem for this. But the BIOS always read boot blocks from the beginning of a FreeBSD slice, which is the root filesystem space (or can we let other non-root filesystems to occupy the beginning of the FreeBSD slice?). > :BTW, the hard disks are more stable nowadays and any bad sectors may have > :been hidden by the disk controllers (the filesystem does not have to deal > :with them). > > Panics still can leave the primary superblock hosed. Trust me. What kind of panic? The kernel is a trusted program anyway. Thanks for you help. -Zhihui To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 13:59:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EC9115A36 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 13:59:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id NAA01761; Thu, 6 May 1999 13:58:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omni.xylan.com by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id NAA27184; Thu, 6 May 1999 13:58:47 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com (dyn5.utah.xylan.com) by omni.xylan.com (4.1/SMI-4.1 (xylan engr [SPOOL])) id AA13605; Thu, 6 May 99 13:58:46 PDT Message-Id: <37320285.B39C21CE@softweyr.com> Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 14:58:45 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: mtaylor@cybernet.com Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Problem in 3.1 with 16650 serial chip References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Mark J. Taylor" wrote: > > There is a problem with the 16650's: they have high-speed capabilites, > but by default they are "off". This means that bit 7 of the MCR (the > high bit) will be "1" by default. This causes sio probe "2" to fail, > because the value that is read back from the MCR is 0x80, instead > of the expected 0x00 (at least in the multiport case). Did you try "flags 0x20000" in the kernel config? It seems to be working on my system recently upgraded to 3.1. I haven't had a chance to test the serial port speed yet, because somebody walked off with my ISDN TA, but I'm supposed to get it back today. My two 16650 ports do at least probe correctly with the above flags. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 14: 2: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp.enteract.com (thor.enteract.com [207.229.143.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 253C815A36 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 14:02:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dscheidt@enteract.com) Received: (qmail 15342 invoked from network); 6 May 1999 21:02:03 -0000 Received: from shell-1.enteract.com (dscheidt@207.229.143.40) by thor.enteract.com with SMTP; 6 May 1999 21:02:03 -0000 Received: from localhost (dscheidt@localhost) by shell-1.enteract.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id QAA47927; Thu, 6 May 1999 16:02:03 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dscheidt@enteract.com) X-Authentication-Warning: shell-1.enteract.com: dscheidt owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 16:02:03 -0500 (CDT) From: David Scheidt To: Zhihui Zhang Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Copies of superblocks in FFS In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 6 May 1999, Zhihui Zhang wrote: :But the BIOS always read boot blocks from the beginning of a FreeBSD :slice, which is the root filesystem space (or can we let other non-root :filesystems to occupy the beginning of the FreeBSD slice?). I often build machines with more than one FreeBSD slice, and only one root filesystem. : :What kind of panic? The kernel is a trusted program anyway. One that hoses the in-core copy of the superblock, and then writes it back out to disk would have this effect. Never seen this on FreeBSD, but I dealt with a bunch of NeXTstep machines that would do this on every other panic. A physical disk failure could casue this too. David To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 14:13:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mx.nsu.ru (mx.nsu.ru [193.124.215.71]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E24114A14 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 14:13:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fjoe@iclub.nsu.ru) Received: from iclub.nsu.ru (fjoe@iclub.nsu.ru [193.124.222.66]) by mx.nsu.ru (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id EAA17049 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 04:12:40 +0700 (NOVST) Received: from localhost (fjoe@localhost) by iclub.nsu.ru (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA04338 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 04:12:26 +0700 (NSS) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 04:12:25 +0700 (NSS) From: Max Khon To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Can someone tell me what caused this panic? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hi, there! --- cut here --- GDB is free software and you are welcome to distribute copies of it under certain conditions; type "show copying" to see the conditions. There is absolutely no warranty for GDB; type "show warranty" for details. GDB 4.16 (i386-unknown-freebsd), Copyright 1996 Free Software Foundation, Inc... IdlePTD 3612672 initial pcb at 2f6d7c panicstr: from debugger panic messages: --- Fatal trap 12: page fault while in kernel mode fault virtual address = 0x6c05b fault code = supervisor read, page not present instruction pointer = 0x8:0xc0179a40 stack pointer = 0x10:0xc45a9d4c frame pointer = 0x10:0xc45a9d58 code segment = base 0x0, limit 0xfffff, type 0x1b = DPL 0, pres 1, def32 1, gran 1 processor eflags = interrupt enabled, resume, IOPL = 0 current process = 1276 (ftpd) interrupt mask = net tty panic: from debugger panic: from debugger dumping to dev 40001, offset 142128 dump 63 62 61 60 59 58 57 56 55 54 53 52 51 50 49 48 47 46 45 44 43 42 41 40 39 38 37 36 35 34 33 32 31 30 29 28 27 26 25 24 23 22 21 20 19 18 17 16 15 14 13 12 11 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1 --- #0 boot (howto=260) at ../../kern/kern_shutdown.c:285 285 dumppcb.pcb_cr3 = rcr3(); (kgdb) #0 boot (howto=260) at ../../kern/kern_shutdown.c:285 #1 0xc0162df5 in panic (fmt=0xc029b13c "from debugger") at ../../kern/kern_shutdown.c:446 #2 0xc012b479 in db_panic (addr=-1072195008, have_addr=0, count=-1, modif=0xc45a9bd0 "") at ../../ddb/db_command.c:432 #3 0xc012b419 in db_command (last_cmdp=0xc02dad90, cmd_table=0xc02dabf0, aux_cmd_tablep=0xc02f4538) at ../../ddb/db_command.c:332 #4 0xc012b4de in db_command_loop () at ../../ddb/db_command.c:454 #5 0xc012d82f in db_trap (type=12, code=0) at ../../ddb/db_trap.c:71 #6 0xc024df1e in kdb_trap (type=12, code=0, regs=0xc45a9d10) at ../../i386/i386/db_interface.c:157 #7 0xc025bc78 in trap_fatal (frame=0xc45a9d10, eva=442459) at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:937 #8 0xc025b957 in trap_pfault (frame=0xc45a9d10, usermode=0, eva=442459) at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:835 #9 0xc025b58a in trap (frame={tf_es = 16, tf_ds = 16, tf_edi = -1073610752, tf_esi = -1067785984, tf_ebp = -1000694440, tf_isp = -1000694472, tf_ebx = 442459, tf_edx = -1073278286, tf_ecx = 492, tf_eax = -1073610752, tf_trapno = 12, tf_err = 0, tf_eip = -1072195008, tf_cs = 8, tf_eflags = 66050, tf_esp = -1067785984, tf_ss = 2}) at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:437 #10 0xc0179a40 in m_prepend (m=0xc05ae100, len=6, how=1) at ../../kern/uipc_mbuf.c:394 #11 0xc019eb66 in arc_output (ifp=0xc030e2dc, m0=0xc05b6300, dst=0xc4449db0, rt0=0xc0874a00) at ../../net/if_arcsubr.c:295 #12 0xc01b0ee4 in ip_output (m0=0xc05b6300, opt=0x0, ro=0xc4449dac, flags=0, imo=0x0) at ../../netinet/ip_output.c:608 #13 0xc01b55f9 in tcp_output (tp=0xc4449de0) at ../../netinet/tcp_output.c:696 #14 0xc01b6989 in tcp_usr_send (so=0xc4407a00, flags=4, m=0xc05b9500, nam=0x0, control=0x0, p=0xc459ca40) at ../../netinet/tcp_usrreq.c:374 #15 0xc017b35a in sosend (so=0xc4407a00, addr=0x0, uio=0xc45a9f30, top=0xc05b9500, control=0x0, flags=0, p=0xc459ca40) at ../../kern/uipc_socket.c:539 #16 0xc0170c9c in soo_write (fp=0xc0a1e340, uio=0xc45a9f30, cred=0xc09ffb00) at ../../kern/sys_socket.c:80 #17 0xc016dae6 in write (p=0xc459ca40, uap=0xc45a9f84) at ../../kern/sys_generic.c:270 #18 0xc025bee7 in syscall (frame={tf_es = 39, tf_ds = 39, tf_edi = 672134044, tf_esi = 6, tf_ebp = -1077948508, tf_isp = -1000693804, tf_ebx = 8192, tf_edx = 8192, tf_ecx = 0, tf_eax = 4, tf_trapno = 7, tf_err = 2, tf_eip = 671829748, tf_cs = 31, tf_eflags = 518, tf_esp = -1077948576, tf_ss = 39}) at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:1100 #19 0xc024e86c in Xint0x80_syscall () #20 0x804b9c3 in ?? () #21 0x804ef70 in ?? () #22 0x804a83d in ?? () #23 0x8049f81 in ?? () (kgdb) --- cut here --- --- ../../kern/uipc_mbuf.c:394 (m_prepend) --- MGET(mn, how, m->m_type); --- cut here --- /fjoe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 15: 3:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sussie.interbizz.se (ns.datadesign.se [194.23.109.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 807EC151F0 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 15:03:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Joachim.Isaksson@ibfs.com) Received: from bacardi (bacardi.home.ibfs.com [193.45.188.13]) by sussie.interbizz.se (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA19168; Fri, 7 May 1999 00:03:05 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <001701be980c$38a8f920$0dbc2dc1@home.ibfs.com> From: "Joachim Isaksson" To: "Joachim Isaksson" , References: <000f01be96fc$ebafe210$8cbc2dc1@ibfs.com> Subject: Re: Changes to console code? Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 00:03:05 +0200 Organization: Interbizz Financial Systems MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > My console now decides to go blank when the probe for sc0 is attempted. As far > as I can see it never gets any further in the boot sequence. Luckily I got the > problem at floppy boot, not after killing my old system off :) > My motherboard is an old Intel Advanced/EV with an integrated Trio64 chipset > (and integrated audio) so a bit hard to replace the video card... :) > > I can try to binary search with boot floppies until I can find the exact date > when it stopped working if that helps. Just did this, it stopped working between 19990417 and 19990418, at the same time as a lot of "miscellaneous" devices were added and the probe order was changed so that sc0 is probed after the IDE disks instead of first. It's also probed after atkbd0 now instead of before. The problem is 100% reproducible, but I'm not quite sure how to best find out what's happening. I'd not really want to upgrade to the non working version to test... :) Any suggestions? /Joachim To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 15: 5:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (osmium.gn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C420415F10 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 15:05:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wilko@yedi.iaf.nl) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by uni4nn.gn.iaf.nl (8.9.2/8.9.2) with UUCP id AAA14201; Fri, 7 May 1999 00:04:48 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.9.3/8.6.12) id XAA00433; Thu, 6 May 1999 23:26:42 +0200 (CEST) From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199905062126.XAA00433@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: anybody ever seen this? In-Reply-To: <19990506093308.C25855@winternet.com> from Nathan Ahlstrom at "May 6, 1999 9:33: 8 am" To: nrahlstr@winternet.com (Nathan Ahlstrom) Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 23:26:42 +0200 (CEST) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem, The Netherlands X-pgp-info: PGP public key at 'finger wilko@freefall.freebsd.org' X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG As Nathan Ahlstrom wrote ... > Wilko Bulte wrote: > > To: newscrisis > > Subject: news (urgent): possible expire problems > > > > awk in free(): warning: chunk is already free. > > awk in free(): warning: chunk is already free. > > awk in free(): warning: chunk is already free. > > etc etc. > > > > This is C-news running expire under 3.1-stable. Am I missing anything or is > > this a FAQ? > > Check out PR gnu/7821. Right. Thanks, exactly the same thing. I was running my ancient C-news on 2.2.8 until a couple of days ago so I never saw it before. Groeten / Cheers, | / o / / _ Arnhem, The Netherlands - Powered by FreeBSD - |/|/ / / /( (_) Bulte WWW : http://www.tcja.nl http://www.freebsd.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 15:10:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sol (cs1-gw.cs.binghamton.edu [128.226.171.72]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 1977E150DE for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 15:09:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu) Received: from localhost (zzhang@localhost) by sol (SMI-8.6/8.6.9) with SMTP id RAA16257 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 17:58:51 -0400 Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 17:58:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Zhihui Zhang To: freebsd-hackers@freeBSD.ORG Subject: Boot blocks Questions (was: superblocks in FFS) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I have some questions regarding the new boot blocks used in FreeBSD 3.1: (1) Can these boot blocks (I assume that they can occupy at most 15 sectors because we need one sector for the disklabel in the first 16 sectors. BBSIZE == 8192) reside in a filesystem other than the root file system? (2) Is the boot block code smart enough to find the kernel or loader (/boot/loader) in a different FreeBSD slice (Suppose we have more than one FreeBSD slice on the same machine and the root filesystem happens to be on a different slice. I believe that the slice where the boot block code is used must be set to be active). (3) It seems to me that the loader (/boot/loader) can set up some kernerl configuration parameters (e.g. nmbcluster) that override what you have in the kernel. Can anyone describe a little for me on how this is achieved? Any help is appreciated. -------------------------------------------------- Zhihui Zhang. Please visit http://www.freebsd.org -------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 15:17:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 807581602B for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 15:17:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA01771; Thu, 6 May 1999 15:16:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199905062216.PAA01771@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Zhihui Zhang Cc: freebsd-hackers@freeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Boot blocks Questions (was: superblocks in FFS) In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 06 May 1999 17:58:50 EDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 15:16:29 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > I have some questions regarding the new boot blocks used in FreeBSD 3.1: > > (1) Can these boot blocks (I assume that they can occupy at most 15 > sectors because we need one sector for the disklabel in the first 16 > sectors. BBSIZE == 8192) reside in a filesystem other than the root file > system? They don't reside in the root filesystem, they reside at the beginning of the slice. > (2) Is the boot block code smart enough to find the kernel or loader > (/boot/loader) in a different FreeBSD slice (Suppose we have more than one > FreeBSD slice on the same machine and the root filesystem happens to be on > a different slice. I believe that the slice where the boot block code is > used must be set to be active). Yes. > (3) It seems to me that the loader (/boot/loader) can set up some kernerl > configuration parameters (e.g. nmbcluster) that override what you have in > the kernel. Can anyone describe a little for me on how this is achieved? The loader passes its variable space into the kernel in environment format. There are kernel functions for extracting variables out of this environment that are used to provide seed values for constants that need to be established before the system is running. I have almost completely eliminated param.c in my working tree, and established a couple of new macros for dealing with kernel tunable values that should make this process even easier. The process is pretty simple; you create a very early sysinit bracket and a tiny init function for every tunable. Each init function calls the kernel environment code to see if there is an overried, and otherwise sets the tunable to the compile-time default. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 15:28:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sol (cs1-gw.cs.binghamton.edu [128.226.171.72]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 1C01B151E3 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 15:28:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu) Received: from localhost (zzhang@localhost) by sol (SMI-8.6/8.6.9) with SMTP id SAA16405; Thu, 6 May 1999 18:16:39 -0400 Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 18:16:39 -0400 (EDT) From: Zhihui Zhang To: Mike Smith Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Boot blocks Questions (was: superblocks in FFS) In-Reply-To: <199905062216.PAA01771@dingo.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 6 May 1999, Mike Smith wrote: > > > > I have some questions regarding the new boot blocks used in FreeBSD 3.1: > > > > (1) Can these boot blocks (I assume that they can occupy at most 15 > > sectors because we need one sector for the disklabel in the first 16 > > sectors. BBSIZE == 8192) reside in a filesystem other than the root file > > system? > > They don't reside in the root filesystem, they reside at the beginning > of the slice. > Thanks for the fastest reply I have ever got! For this above point, the beginning of a FreeBSD slice should belong to the cylinder group 0 of the first filesystem in the slice, although this filesystem may not be the root filesystem. Am I right? -Zhihui To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 15:34:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C85015A31 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 15:34:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA01917; Thu, 6 May 1999 15:32:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199905062232.PAA01917@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Zhihui Zhang Cc: Mike Smith , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Boot blocks Questions (was: superblocks in FFS) In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 06 May 1999 18:16:39 EDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 15:32:06 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > On Thu, 6 May 1999, Mike Smith wrote: > > > > > > > I have some questions regarding the new boot blocks used in FreeBSD 3.1: > > > > > > (1) Can these boot blocks (I assume that they can occupy at most 15 > > > sectors because we need one sector for the disklabel in the first 16 > > > sectors. BBSIZE == 8192) reside in a filesystem other than the root file > > > system? > > > > They don't reside in the root filesystem, they reside at the beginning > > of the slice. > > > > Thanks for the fastest reply I have ever got! For this above point, the > beginning of a FreeBSD slice should belong to the cylinder group 0 of the > first filesystem in the slice, although this filesystem may not be the > root filesystem. Am I right? Not entirely. In order to simplify offset calculations, there's a large gap at the beginning of the filesystem. If the filesystem starts at the very bottom of the slice, this gap will contain the disklabel and bootblocks. If the filesystem is elsewhere, it's just empty. So the beginning of the slice doesn't belong to any CG at all. But you're correct that the first filesystem in a slice may not be the 'a' filesystem, and it may also not be a root filesystem. -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 15:45:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sol (cs1-gw.cs.binghamton.edu [128.226.171.72]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 14ACC14CCB for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 15:45:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu) Received: from localhost (zzhang@localhost) by sol (SMI-8.6/8.6.9) with SMTP id SAA16568; Thu, 6 May 1999 18:34:33 -0400 Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 18:34:33 -0400 (EDT) From: Zhihui Zhang To: Mike Smith Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Boot blocks Questions (was: superblocks in FFS) In-Reply-To: <199905062232.PAA01917@dingo.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > > Thanks for the fastest reply I have ever got! For this above point, the > > beginning of a FreeBSD slice should belong to the cylinder group 0 of the > > first filesystem in the slice, although this filesystem may not be the > > root filesystem. Am I right? > > Not entirely. > > In order to simplify offset calculations, there's a large gap at the > beginning of the filesystem. If the filesystem starts at the very > bottom of the slice, this gap will contain the disklabel and > bootblocks. If the filesystem is elsewhere, it's just empty. > Let me put my understanding in your words: (1) The gap is BBSIZE bytes or 16 sectors. (2) This gap does not belong to cylinder group 0 and the size of cylinder group 0 is BBSIZE less than other cylinder groups. But if you say this gap belongs to cylinder group 0 (the block bitmap will not include them of course), then all cylinder groups are of the same size (the last cylinder group may of a different size). -Zhihui To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 16:13:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from melete.ch.intel.com (melete.ch.intel.com [143.182.246.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F11E014C0D for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 16:13:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jreynold@sedona.ch.intel.com) Received: from sedona.intel.com (sedona.ch.intel.com [143.182.218.21]) by melete.ch.intel.com (8.9.1a+p1/8.9.1/d: relay.m4,v 1.6 1998/11/24 22:10:56 iwep Exp iwep $) with ESMTP id QAA07997 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 16:13:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from hip186.ch.intel.com (hip186.ch.intel.com [143.182.225.68]) by sedona.intel.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1/d: sendmail.cf,v 1.8 1999/04/16 15:25:49 steved Exp steved $) with ESMTP id QAA24057 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 16:13:19 -0700 (MST) X-Envelope-To: X-Envelope-From: jreynold@sedona.ch.intel.com Received: (from jreynold@localhost) by hip186.ch.intel.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1/d: client.m4,v 1.3 1998/09/29 16:36:11 sedayao Exp sedayao $) id TAA21919; Thu, 6 May 1999 19:13:20 -0400 (EDT) From: John Reynolds~ MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <14130.8719.567168.600154@hip186.ch.intel.com> Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 16:13:19 -0700 (MST) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: FYI: P2B-DS BIOS update to 1008B available X-Mailer: VM 6.70 under Emacs 19.34.1 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hello all, I'm sending this out as an FYI for folks who might not have seen it. Asus has a new BIOS update for practically of their motherboards with the AIC7890 chipset. This BIOS update updates the onboard Adaptec SCSI bios to version v2.11. I know I've seen traffic here and elsewhere about this chipset and also the 2940U2W cards--some solutions people with the add-on cards had were to update the bios to the latest one (v2.11). Well, now us folks with the embedded stuff can update it as well. ftp://ftp.asus.com/pub/BIOS/bxds108b.zip (P2B-DS--other flavors exist too). Go get it. -Jr -- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= | John Reynolds CEG, CCE, Next Generation Flows, HLA | | Intel Corporation MS: CH6-210 Phone: 480-554-9092 pgr: 868-6512 | | jreynold@sedona.ch.intel.com http://www-aec.ch.intel.com/~jreynold/ | =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 16:30:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC57414CB3 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 16:30:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id QAA40337; Thu, 6 May 1999 16:28:11 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 16:28:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Mike Smith Cc: Zhihui Zhang , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Boot blocks Questions (was: superblocks in FFS) In-Reply-To: <199905062232.PAA01917@dingo.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 6 May 1999, Mike Smith wrote: > > So the beginning of the slice doesn't belong to any CG at all. But > you're correct that the first filesystem in a slice may not be the 'a' > filesystem, and it may also not be a root filesystem. > Since it could be a filesystem or a swap partition, neither FS or SWAP use the first 8K of their space, just in case the bootblock code and disklabel has been put on those blocks.. This is for historical reasons. If we were doing this now, we would probably insist that the sd0s1a not be permitted to start within X blocks of the beginning of sd0s1, therebye reserving that space, (or assignign a special BOOT type partition, (as done in the VTOC system used by MACH2.5)) julian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 17:56:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B05FF151BD for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 17:56:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id RAA39946; Thu, 6 May 1999 17:56:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 17:56:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199905070056.RAA39946@apollo.backplane.com> To: Zach Brown Cc: Andrew Reilly , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Pentium-III and FreeBSD? References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :On Wed, 21 Apr 1999, Andrew Reilly wrote: : :> a) tweaking as to understand the new (KNI SIMD float) instructions. :> b) tweaking cc (egcs) to emit those, if it can (much less likely, my guess) :> c) tweaking the kernel to save and restore the new state on task switches. : :its also quite worth using the magical cache instructions (prefecth, cache :avoiding stores) in some parts of the kernel. We're having fun with these :in parts of the linux kernel. Mail me if you want to discuss things :further :) : :-- zach : :- - - - - - :007 373 5963 The SMP guys have been playing with the tlb instructions to reduce the number of tlb flushes and interprocess interrupts. This has produced a measureable performance improvement. I don't see much advantage to trying to fine-tune some of the weirder instructions, though... it's usually a waste of time and tends to obscure the larger issues that, if fixed, would have yielded an even greater gain. A good example of this in FreeBSD is the page coloring code in the VM system, the multiply-linked lists and hash table access methods used to manage I/O, and (major bias here) radix tree based swap management system in FreeBSD-current. In regards to FP: The best place for extreme FP optimization is in a high level FP library, not in native compiler-produced code. The reason for this is simple: Many of these new instructions work only with specific processors or specific revs of processors. Most of Intel's new FP instructions don't work on a K6. If you produce a native-compiled binary with such instructions embedded within it, it will not run on all platforms. On the otherhand, if you produce a high level FP library which can be taylored to the specific platform it is installed on, then distributed binaries can utilize the library and not have to be compiled for a specific platform. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 18: 1:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sasami.jurai.net (sasami.jurai.net [63.67.141.99]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 61A22151BD for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 18:01:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from winter@jurai.net) Received: from localhost (winter@localhost) by sasami.jurai.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id VAA29219; Thu, 6 May 1999 21:00:37 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 21:00:36 -0400 (EDT) From: "Matthew N. Dodd" To: Max Khon Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Arcnet driver for FreeBSD In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 7 May 1999, Max Khon wrote: > I have ported NetBSD/amiga arcnet driver to FreeBSD. > The drivers supports SMC90c26, SMC90c56 and SMC90c66 (in '56 comp. mode) > arcnet ISA cards. Both RFC1201 and RFC1051 (untested) protocols are > supported. Sweet! Sweet! Sweet! > The driver is known to be compatible with Linux arcnet driver. > (I have ~180-190K/s via ftp between Linux and FreeBSD) Cool. > This work also includes generic ARP support. > Is it possible to merge this stuff in? This should help > FreeBSD Token Ring project a lot. Indeed, the generic ARP stuff would be very nice. > http://iclub.nsu.ru/~fjoe for details I'll go about qualifying all the cards I have here. I've also got some 100 meg TCNS arcnet cards here that should work in compatibility mode. I'll whip up EISA shims for them and test them as well. :) -- | Matthew N. Dodd | 78 280Z | 75 164E | 84 245DL | FreeBSD/NetBSD/Sprite/VMS | | winter@jurai.net | This Space For Rent | ix86,sparc,m68k,pmax,vax | | http://www.jurai.net/~winter | Are you k-rad elite enough for my webpage? | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 18:50:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hydrogen.fircrest.net (metriclient-2.uoregon.edu [128.223.172.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1BFA14CFD for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 18:50:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gurney_j@efn.org) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.fircrest.net (8.9.1/8.8.7) id SAA15183; Thu, 6 May 1999 18:48:57 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19990506184856.10474@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 18:48:56 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: Max Khon Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Arcnet driver for FreeBSD References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: ; from Max Khon on Fri, May 07, 1999 at 01:56:36AM +0700 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Max Khon scribbled this message on May 7: > hi, there! > > I have ported NetBSD/amiga arcnet driver to FreeBSD. > The drivers supports SMC90c26, SMC90c56 and SMC90c66 (in '56 comp. mode) > arcnet ISA cards. Both RFC1201 and RFC1051 (untested) protocols are > supported. hmm... I have a coupld Puredata arcnet cards... they are Novell RX compatible, would I have to port a driver over to get them to work? > The driver is known to be compatible with Linux arcnet driver. > (I have ~180-190K/s via ftp between Linux and FreeBSD) > > This work also includes generic ARP support. > Is it possible to merge this stuff in? This should help > FreeBSD Token Ring project a lot. > > http://iclub.nsu.ru/~fjoe for details cool... :) -- John-Mark Gurney Voice: +1 541 684 8449 Cu Networking P.O. Box 5693, 97405 "The soul contains in itself the event that shall presently befall it. The event is only the actualizing of its thought." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 19: 7:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D16D14CFD; Thu, 6 May 1999 19:07:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id LAA27483; Fri, 7 May 1999 11:37:09 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id LAA87899; Fri, 7 May 1999 11:37:03 +0930 (CST) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 11:37:03 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Pat Lynch Cc: freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: USENIX FreeBSD Dinner Message-ID: <19990507113703.A40359@freebie.lemis.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: ; from Pat Lynch on Thu, May 06, 1999 at 11:34:48AM -0400 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday, 6 May 1999 at 11:34:48 -0400, Pat Lynch wrote: > > Well all, a few months ago, jkh handed the dinner plans off to me > for USENIX, so I've been doing a little research : I want people to look > at these URL's and let me know which of them sound the most interesting (I > lean towards the Mission Ranch in Carmel, but I'm not sure how far it is > from the Conference Center). > > Mission Ranch > http://www.digitallantern.com/monterey/r/5/rm549.html > > Tarpy's Roadhouse (a little expensive) > http://www.digitallantern.com/monterey/r/8/rm859.html > > Domenico's (this sounds very promising, inexpensive) > http://www.digitallantern.com/monterey/r/2/rm229.html > > Jardines De San Juan (possibly too far away, but inexpensive, and listed > as one of the "If you in Monterey only one time" places) > > and last but not least, inexpensive too, > > Rappa's > http://www.digitallantern.com/monterey/r/7/rm700.html > > please let me know what you guys think, I want this to be a good time for > all... Hmm. I trust it'll cost less than $50 per head? One of my favourite restaurants in the world is (or was, last time I went there, about 6 years ago) on Fisherman's Wharf in Monterey. Unfortunately I can't remember the name, but Domenico's fits the description, so I'll vote for that one. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 22: 0: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2C1214CA3 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 22:00:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id VAA48831 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 21:56:00 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3732725E.2781E494@whistle.com> Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 21:55:58 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.8-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Slight suggested change to PCI config stuff. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The PCI probe routines for chipset_probe() are called while the PCI code is traversing the linker set of loaded drivers. However it will catch any 'generic' bridge devices. Thus if the user has linked in a specific driver for a particular bridge device, it may not be called as the generic code may get there first. I propose to change the several places that traverse the linker set so that the 'chipset' default code is either skipped and called last, or, not put in the linker set, but rather called directly after the linker set has failed to find the correct driver. I want to do this so that I may load a specific driver to handle some of the features that are not normally set up in some of these chipsets, and that the generic code doesn't know about, due to their 'local' nature. For example, some of the Bridge chips have such things as GPIO pins that can be controlled from the control registers of the chipset. Obviously only a platform specific driver can know what those IO pins are attached to (e.g. power sensing. or an I2C bus.) These pins are changed by doing PCI config-space writes to the chipset, so should be controlled by that driver. Allowing a more specific driver to over-ride the generic default driver would seem to be the clean way to do this.. Any comments? (this is in 3.x but I presume the same makes sense in 4.x) julian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 22:31:39 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from polio.ecst.csuchico.edu (polio.ecst.csuchico.edu [132.241.4.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 6E70014C99 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 22:31:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from manek@ecst.csuchico.edu) Received: (qmail 8045 invoked by uid 21024); 6 May 1999 22:31:35 -0700 Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 22:31:35 -0700 (PDT) From: "Sameer R. Manek" To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: bug with lockf(3)? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I had posted this originally to freebsd-stable but didn't get any response from that list. On freebsd 3-1-stable I'm not sure if this is a bug or my misinterpetation of how lockf() works. But here's the situation. Given 2 processes A and B, both with open file descriptors to a file, using open ("file.txt",O_RDWR) A calls lockf (fd,F_LOCK,0) and proceeds to read/write to file while file is still locked....including using lseek to jump to the begining of the file B calls lockf (fd,F_LOCK,0) and enters blocked state A calls lockf (fd,F_ULOCK,0) B is still in blocked state, until A exit(3)s. According to the man page: F_LOCK and F_TLOCK requests differ only by the action taken if the section is not available. F_LOCK blocks the calling process until the section is available. F_TLOCK makes the function fail if the section is already locked by another process. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Sameer Manek manek@ecst.csuchico.edu "They that will sacrifice liberty in exchange for temporary safety deserve neither liberty or safety." -Ben Franklin -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 23:43:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mx.nsu.ru (mx.nsu.ru [193.124.215.71]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DC6715357 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 23:43:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fjoe@iclub.nsu.ru) Received: from iclub.nsu.ru (fjoe@iclub.nsu.ru [193.124.222.66]) by mx.nsu.ru (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id NAA08076; Fri, 7 May 1999 13:42:34 +0700 (NOVST) Received: from localhost (fjoe@localhost) by iclub.nsu.ru (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA16692; Fri, 7 May 1999 13:42:34 +0700 (NSS) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 13:42:34 +0700 (NSS) From: Max Khon To: John-Mark Gurney Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Arcnet driver for FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <19990506184856.10474@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hi, there! On Thu, 6 May 1999, John-Mark Gurney wrote: > > I have ported NetBSD/amiga arcnet driver to FreeBSD. > > The drivers supports SMC90c26, SMC90c56 and SMC90c66 (in '56 comp. mode) > > arcnet ISA cards. Both RFC1201 and RFC1051 (untested) protocols are > > supported. > > hmm... I have a coupld Puredata arcnet cards... they are Novell RX > compatible, would I have to port a driver over to get them to work? I don't know. At least with my patches it should be pretty easy to create new arcnet drivers /fjoe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 23:51:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hydrogen.fircrest.net (metriclient-2.uoregon.edu [128.223.172.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1A62153D2 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 23:51:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gurney_j@efn.org) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.fircrest.net (8.9.1/8.8.7) id XAA17912; Thu, 6 May 1999 23:50:43 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19990506235043.15092@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 23:50:43 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: Max Khon Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Arcnet driver for FreeBSD References: <19990506184856.10474@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: ; from Max Khon on Fri, May 07, 1999 at 01:42:34PM +0700 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Max Khon scribbled this message on May 7: > hi, there! > > On Thu, 6 May 1999, John-Mark Gurney wrote: > > > > I have ported NetBSD/amiga arcnet driver to FreeBSD. > > > The drivers supports SMC90c26, SMC90c56 and SMC90c66 (in '56 comp. mode) > > > arcnet ISA cards. Both RFC1201 and RFC1051 (untested) protocols are > > > supported. > > > > hmm... I have a coupld Puredata arcnet cards... they are Novell RX > > compatible, would I have to port a driver over to get them to work? > > I don't know. At least with my patches it should be pretty easy to create > new arcnet drivers kool, I'll take a look at them, at one point i was looking at porting netbsd's driver for the Novell RX cards, of course I'm not sure what I'd use 'em for now days... :) 3mbit isn't much... -- John-Mark Gurney Voice: +1 541 684 8449 Cu Networking P.O. Box 5693, 97405 "The soul contains in itself the event that shall presently befall it. The event is only the actualizing of its thought." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu May 6 23:57:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from magnesium.ideal.net.au (magnesium.ideal.net.au [203.20.241.212]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7C48154C3 for ; Thu, 6 May 1999 23:56:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from andrew@ugh.net.au) Received: from localhost (andrew@localhost) by magnesium.ideal.net.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id QAA01525; Fri, 7 May 1999 16:56:45 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from andrew@ugh.net.au) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 16:56:45 +1000 (EST) From: andrew@ugh.net.au X-Sender: andrew@magnesium.ideal.net.au To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: snadge@gemcorp.com.au Subject: Termcap and cursor keys Message-ID: X-WonK: *wibble* MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, I'm having trouble with identifying the press of cursor keys. To use the up arrow key as an example... Under FreeBSD 3.0-19990206-STABLE the the termcap library says a vt220 terminal sends ESC O A, as does an xterm. SunOS 5.6 says vt220 sends ESC [ A and xterm sends ESC O A. Linux (Debian) agrees with SunOS. I determined this by quering for the ku capability. The xterm that ships with SunOS 5.6 actually sends ESC [ A as does xterm that comes with Debian Linux...I cant try the FreeBSd one from here but I would assume it will be the same as Linux. I determined this by typing ctrl-V from an xterm on both systems. If I type ctrl-V within vi under SunOS gives ESC O A (from an xterm) and the same thing under Linux gives the same (despite getting different thins in the shell (tried tcsh, bash and /bin/sh). Jason Fesler has told me the correct thing for vt220 to send is ESC [ A but I cant find the standard anywhere. Now I'm just very confused...what causes the keys to show up differently in the shell as oppsoed to vi? I'm assuming curses...which termcap is correct?... My main problem is that in my program (under an xterm on SunOS and kvt on FreeBSD at least) that termcap tells me the up arrow key sends something different to what it actually does and I'm not sure where the problem is...I can provide code if anyone is interested. Thanks, Andrew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 0:41: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from implode.root.com (root.com [209.102.106.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E0B7615D74; Fri, 7 May 1999 00:40:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@implode.root.com) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA17669; Fri, 7 May 1999 00:37:36 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199905070737.AAA17669@implode.root.com> To: "Sameer R. Manek" Cc: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: bug with lockf(3)? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 06 May 1999 22:31:35 PDT." From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 00:37:36 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >I had posted this originally to freebsd-stable but didn't get any response >from that list. > >On freebsd 3-1-stable I'm not sure if this is a bug or my misinterpetation >of how lockf() works. But here's the situation. > >Given 2 processes A and B, both with open file descriptors to a file, >using open ("file.txt",O_RDWR) >A calls lockf (fd,F_LOCK,0) and proceeds to read/write to file >while file is still locked....including using lseek to jump to the >begining of the file >B calls lockf (fd,F_LOCK,0) and enters blocked state >A calls lockf (fd,F_ULOCK,0) >B is still in blocked state, until A exit(3)s. > >According to the man page: > F_LOCK and F_TLOCK requests differ only by the action taken if the >section is not available. F_LOCK blocks the calling process until the >section is available. F_TLOCK makes the function fail if the section is >already locked by another process. Does the same problem occur when using flock()? -DG David Greenman Co-founder/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project - http://www.freebsd.org Creator of high-performance Internet servers - http://www.terasolutions.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 1:40:49 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C431E15CC6 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 01:40:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA10089; Fri, 7 May 1999 09:40:57 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 09:40:57 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Julian Elischer Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Slight suggested change to PCI config stuff. In-Reply-To: <3732725E.2781E494@whistle.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 6 May 1999, Julian Elischer wrote: > The PCI probe routines for chipset_probe() are called while the PCI > code is traversing the linker set of loaded drivers. However it will > catch any 'generic' bridge devices. Thus if the user has linked in > a specific driver for a particular bridge device, it may not be > called as the generic code may get there first. I propose to change > the several places that traverse the linker set so that the > 'chipset' default code is either skipped and called last, or, not > put in the linker set, but rather called directly after the linker > set has failed to find the correct driver. I want to do this so that > I may load a specific driver to handle some of the features that > are not normally set up in some of these chipsets, and that the > generic code doesn't know about, due to their 'local' nature. > > For example, some of the Bridge chips have such things as > GPIO pins that can be controlled from the control registers > of the chipset. Obviously only a platform specific > driver can know what those IO pins are attached to (e.g. power > sensing. or an I2C bus.) > These pins are changed by doing PCI config-space writes to the > chipset, so should be controlled by that driver. Allowing a more > specific driver to over-ride the generic default driver would > seem to be the clean way to do this.. > > > Any comments? (this is in 3.x but I presume the same makes sense > in 4.x) This makes sense for 3.x. Everything is different for 4.x though post new-bus. The right think in 4.x is to use priority ordered probes (which I have working but haven't committed). If a driver matches the generic class it would return a lower priority than a driver which matches the device exactly. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 2:18:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from awfulhak.org (awfulhak.force9.co.uk [195.166.136.63]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8775314A14; Fri, 7 May 1999 02:17:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brian@lan.awfulhak.org) Received: from keep.lan.Awfulhak.org (brian@keep.lan.Awfulhak.org [172.16.0.8]) by awfulhak.org (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id KAA32998; Fri, 7 May 1999 10:17:46 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from brian@lan.awfulhak.org) Received: from keep.lan.Awfulhak.org (brian@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by keep.lan.Awfulhak.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA10146; Fri, 7 May 1999 08:32:26 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from brian@keep.lan.Awfulhak.org) Message-Id: <199905070732.IAA10146@keep.lan.Awfulhak.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Danil Shebunin Cc: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Kernel PPP (PPPD): ip-up & ip-down scripts execution In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 07 May 1999 00:28:06 +0400." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 08:32:16 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Your best bet is to run pppd as root. Alternatively, use user-ppp and the ``set filter'' command. > Hi! > > We have a small net and using FreeBSD 2.2.8 machine as Internet gate. > To dial a provider we use kernel PPP - PPPD. > I need to setup a firewall after connection established. For this purpose > I use file /etc/ppp/ip-up, as described in man page, to setup firewall > using ipfw. But it seems, that this script is called with effective uid of > current user, not root ,as described in man! I decide that, because the > script is executed (I've placed simple 'echo executed > /exec.txt' in this > script to check this). But all ipfw commands is not executed - firewall > settings remain unchanged. > > What I'm doing wrong? How can I force ip-up and ip-down scripts to execute > correctly? > > P.S. PLEASE! PLEASE! PLEASE! > Reply to my e-mail - I'm not subscribed to these mail-lists > > -- > ===---===---===---===---===---=== > Have a nice CONNECT! > Dan (daktaklakpak@public.mtu.ru) > ===---===---===---===---===---=== -- Brian Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour ! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 3:37: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mtu.ru (ns.mtu.ru [195.34.32.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9CCB14E7C; Fri, 7 May 1999 03:36:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from daktaklakpak@public.mtu.ru) Received: from dial57224.mtu-net.ru (dial57224.mtu-net.ru [195.34.57.224]) by mtu.ru (Postfix) with ESMTP id 078242E70; Fri, 7 May 1999 13:36:54 +0400 (MSK) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 14:34:57 +0400 (MSD) From: Danil Shebunin X-Sender: danil@free-bsd.space To: Brian Somers Cc: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Kernel PPP (PPPD): ip-up & ip-down scripts execution In-Reply-To: <199905070732.IAA10146@keep.lan.Awfulhak.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Recipient: brian@Awfulhak.org X-Envelope-To: brian@Awfulhak.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 7 May 1999, Brian Somers wrote: > Your best bet is to run pppd as root. Alternatively, use user-ppp > and the ``set filter'' command. > In my situation I can't run pppd as root. Furthermore, pppd have owner root and group bin and have setuid bit set (I understand so, it must run as root). You ask: Why I can't run pppd as root? I have create a special account on gate machine. Inernet users may login with this account via telnet and remotely manage pppd work, view connection info, statistics, e.t.c. And pppd doing well with this account, no 'Permission denied' or other things. And finally - the cut from man 8 pppd: "[...] The scripts (ip-up, ip-down and others - D.S.) are executed as root (with the real and effective user-id set to 0), so that they can do things such as update routing tables or run privileged daemons. [...]" I don't see any obstructions to run ipfw from ip-up script - but it don't run. I do 'ipfw show' and it shows me firewall rules after machine boot, not the ones, I set in ip-up. And user ppp... Well, I think it will be harder to manage user ppp daemon from scripts. Maybe it's a bug: in pppd or in my head? P.S. PLEASE! PLEASE! PLEASE! Reply to my e-mail - I have not subscribed to these maillists. -- ===---===---===---===---===---=== Have a nice CONNECT! Dan (daktaklakpak@public.mtu.ru) ===---===---===---===---===---=== To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 5: 7: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from magnesium.ideal.net.au (magnesium.ideal.net.au [203.20.241.212]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7FE0F153E6 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 05:06:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from andrew@ugh.net.au) Received: from localhost (andrew@localhost) by magnesium.ideal.net.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id WAA02689; Fri, 7 May 1999 22:06:24 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from andrew@ugh.net.au) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 22:06:24 +1000 (EST) From: andrew@ugh.net.au X-Sender: andrew@magnesium.ideal.net.au To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: snadge@gemcorp.com.au Subject: Re: Termcap and cursor keys In-Reply-To: Message-ID: X-WonK: *wibble* MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 7 May 1999 andrew@ugh.net.au wrote: > I'm having trouble with identifying the press of cursor keys. To use the > up arrow key as an example... Well I have now found out (from www.kermit-project.org/faq-c-arr.html) that vt220 keypads can be in one of 2 modes - application or cursor. In cursor mode the keys send ESC [ A and in application mode they send ESC O A. Apparently it is never same to assume that the keypad is in any one particular mode and application software should set the keypad mode. The questions is...how do I make it switch modes? How do I tell for which mode the termcap entries have been written? One of the FAQs suggestions is to accept both styles...are both styles available from the termcap entry? up seems to have the correct value but from my reading of the man page up is what you have to send to move the cursor up one line (ie FreeBSD sends it to the terminal...not the other way around)... Thanks, Andrew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 6: 2:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.ppp.net (mail.ppp.net [194.64.12.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDFBD14DCB for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 06:02:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ernie!bert.kts.org!hm@ppp.net) Received: from casparc.ppp.net (casparc2.ppp.net [194.64.12.42]) by mail.ppp.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id PAA32723; Fri, 7 May 1999 15:02:18 +0200 Received: from ernie by casparc.ppp.net with uucp (Smail3.1.28.1 #1) id m10fkGP-002ZjZC; Fri, 7 May 99 15:02 MET DST Received: from bert.kts.org([194.55.156.2]) (2037 bytes) by ernie.kts.org via sendmail with P:smtp/R:smart_host/T:uux (sender: ) id for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 14:30:15 +0200 (CEST) (Smail-3.2.0.103 1998-Oct-9 #5 built 1999-Apr-19) Received: from localhost (1583 bytes) by bert.kts.org via sendmail with P:stdio/R:smart_host/T:smtp (sender: ) (ident using unix) id for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 14:31:01 +0200 (CEST) (Smail-3.2.0.103 1998-Oct-9 #4 built 1998-Dec-26) Message-Id: From: hm@kts.org (Hellmuth Michaelis) Subject: Re: Termcap and cursor keys In-Reply-To: from "andrew@ugh.net.au" at "May 7, 1999 4:56:45 pm" To: andrew@ugh.net.au Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 14:31:01 +0200 (CEST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, snadge@gemcorp.com.au Organization: Kitchen Table Systems Reply-To: hm@kts.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG andrew@ugh.net.au wrote: > Under FreeBSD 3.0-19990206-STABLE the the termcap library says a vt220 > terminal sends ESC O A, as does an xterm. SunOS 5.6 says vt220 sends ESC [ > A and xterm sends ESC O A. Linux (Debian) agrees with SunOS. The cursor keys generate 2 different sequences depending on wether they are in "normal" mode or "application mode": normal sends "CSI A" (where CSI is 0x9b in 8-bit mode or "ESC [" in 7-bit mode) and application sends "SS3 A" (where SS3 is 0x8f in 8-bit mode or "ESC O" in 7-bit mode). Mode switching is done by the sequence "CSI ? 1 h" (application) and "CSI ? 1 l" (normal). Now what a given terminal sends depend on what it was switched to (or not) in the init string(s) (look at "is=xxxx" in the termcap db entry). Hope this helps, hellmuth -- Hellmuth Michaelis hm@kts.org Hamburg, Europe We all live in a yellow subroutine, yellow subroutine, yellow subroutine ... To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 7: 8:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from awfulhak.org (awfulhak.force9.co.uk [195.166.136.63]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3167F152F6; Fri, 7 May 1999 07:08:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brian@lan.awfulhak.org) Received: from keep.lan.Awfulhak.org (keep.lan.Awfulhak.org [172.16.0.8]) by awfulhak.org (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id PAA33339; Fri, 7 May 1999 15:08:25 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from brian@lan.awfulhak.org) Received: from keep.lan.Awfulhak.org (brian@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by keep.lan.Awfulhak.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA50095; Fri, 7 May 1999 14:36:41 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from brian@keep.lan.Awfulhak.org) Message-Id: <199905071336.OAA50095@keep.lan.Awfulhak.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Danil Shebunin Cc: Brian Somers , freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Kernel PPP (PPPD): ip-up & ip-down scripts execution In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 07 May 1999 14:34:57 +0400." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 14:36:40 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [.....] > And user ppp... Well, I think it will be harder to manage user ppp daemon > from scripts. Have you looked at pppctl(8) ? [.....] > -- > ===---===---===---===---===---=== > Have a nice CONNECT! > Dan (daktaklakpak@public.mtu.ru) > ===---===---===---===---===---=== -- Brian Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour ! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 7:10: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from acl.lanl.gov (acl.lanl.gov [128.165.147.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48673152F6 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 07:10:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rminnich@acl.lanl.gov) Received: from localhost (rminnich@localhost) by acl.lanl.gov (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA483478 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 08:10:04 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 08:10:04 -0600 From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: memory-based VFS Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The v9fs memory-based VFS, written by Aaron Marks, is available at http://www.acl.lanl.gov/~rminnich/ This is intended to serve as the basis of private name spaces for FreeBSD. I have a VFS and full implementation for Linux kernel 2.0.x, soon to go on the web page too. Anyone who'd like to talk to me about private name spaces for freebsd, give me a ring. ron To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 7:19:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-gw3adm.rcsntx.swbell.net (mail-gw3.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.53]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B94114D86 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 07:18:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chris@holly.dyndns.org) Received: from holly.dyndns.org (ppp-207-193-9-69.hstntx.swbell.net [207.193.9.69]) by mail-gw3adm.rcsntx.swbell.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA20509; Fri, 7 May 1999 09:18:51 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from chris@localhost) by holly.dyndns.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA01086; Fri, 7 May 1999 09:20:10 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from chris) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 09:20:09 -0500 From: Chris Costello To: "Ronald G. Minnich" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: memory-based VFS Message-ID: <19990507092008.A580@holly.dyndns.org> Reply-To: chris@calldei.com References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/0.96.1i In-Reply-To: ; from Ronald G. Minnich on Fri, May 07, 1999 at 08:10:04AM -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, May 7, 1999, Ronald G. Minnich wrote: > The v9fs memory-based VFS, written by Aaron Marks, is available at > http://www.acl.lanl.gov/~rminnich/ Doesn't this do the same thing as MFS? > > This is intended to serve as the basis of private name spaces for FreeBSD. > I have a VFS and full implementation for Linux kernel 2.0.x, soon to go on > the web page too. > > Anyone who'd like to talk to me about private name spaces for freebsd, > give me a ring. > > ron > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > -- Chris Costello Me and my two friends... GIF and Wesson. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 7:23:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.promo.de (mail.Promo.DE [194.45.188.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62E1115162 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 07:22:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from stefan.bethke@hanse.de) Received: from d225.promo.de (d225.Promo.DE [194.45.188.225]) by mail.promo.de (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA07766; Fri, 7 May 1999 16:19:35 +0200 (CEST) Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 16:18:54 +0200 From: Stefan Bethke To: Max Khon Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Can someone tell me what caused this panic? Message-ID: <1055449.3135082734@d225.promo.de> In-Reply-To: Originator-Info: login-id=stefan; server=mail X-Mailer: Mulberry (MacOS) [1.4.2, s/n U-301178] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Max Khon wrote: > #9 0xc025b58a in trap (frame=3D{tf_es =3D 16, tf_ds =3D 16, tf_edi =3D > -1073610752, tf_esi =3D -1067785984, tf_ebp =3D -1000694440, tf_isp =3D > -1000694472, tf_ebx =3D 442459, tf_edx =3D -1073278286, tf_ecx = =3D 492, > tf_eax =3D -1073610752, tf_trapno =3D 12, tf_err =3D 0, tf_eip =3D > -1072195008, tf_cs =3D 8, tf_eflags =3D 66050, tf_esp =3D = -1067785984, > tf_ss =3D 2}) at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:437 > #10 0xc0179a40 in m_prepend (m=3D0xc05ae100, len=3D6, how=3D1) > at ../../kern/uipc_mbuf.c:394 > #11 0xc019eb66 in arc_output (ifp=3D0xc030e2dc, m0=3D0xc05b6300, > dst=3D0xc4449db0, rt0=3D0xc0874a00) at ../../net/if_arcsubr.c:295 > #12 0xc01b0ee4 in ip_output (m0=3D0xc05b6300, opt=3D0x0, = ro=3D0xc4449dac, > flags=3D0, imo=3D0x0) at ../../netinet/ip_output.c:608 > #13 0xc01b55f9 in tcp_output (tp=3D0xc4449de0) at > ../../netinet/tcp_output.c:696 #14 0xc01b6989 in tcp_usr_send > (so=3D0xc4407a00, flags=3D4, m=3D0xc05b9500, nam=3D0x0, control=3D0x0, > p=3D0xc459ca40) at ../../netinet/tcp_usrreq.c:374 > #15 0xc017b35a in sosend (so=3D0xc4407a00, addr=3D0x0, uio=3D0xc45a9f30, = > top=3D0xc05b9500, control=3D0x0, flags=3D0, p=3D0xc459ca40) > at ../../kern/uipc_socket.c:539 > #16 0xc0170c9c in soo_write (fp=3D0xc0a1e340, uio=3D0xc45a9f30, > cred=3D0xc09ffb00) at ../../kern/sys_socket.c:80 > #17 0xc016dae6 in write (p=3D0xc459ca40, uap=3D0xc45a9f84) > at ../../kern/sys_generic.c:270 > #18 0xc025bee7 in syscall (frame=3D{tf_es =3D 39, tf_ds =3D 39, tf_edi = =3D > 672134044, tf_esi =3D 6, tf_ebp =3D -1077948508, tf_isp =3D = -1000693804, > tf_ebx =3D 8192, tf_edx =3D 8192, tf_ecx =3D 0, tf_eax =3D 4, = tf_trapno =3D > 7, tf_err =3D 2, tf_eip =3D 671829748, tf_cs =3D 31, tf_eflags = =3D 518, > tf_esp =3D -1077948576, tf_ss =3D 39}) at = ./../i386/i386/trap.c:1100 > #19 0xc024e86c in Xint0x80_syscall () > #20 0x804b9c3 in ?? () > #21 0x804ef70 in ?? () > #22 0x804a83d in ?? () > #23 0x8049f81 in ?? () > (kgdb) > --- cut here --- > > --- ../../kern/uipc_mbuf.c:394 (m_prepend) --- > MGET(mn, how, m->m_type); > --- cut here --- Probably the mbuf chain is hosed. Work your way back through = arc_output(). Look for MGET(m,M_DONTWAIT,xxx) and m not being checked for NULL. Stefan -- M=FChlendamm 12 | Voice +49-40-256848, +49-177-3504009 D-22089 Hamburg | e-mail: stefan.bethke@hanse.de Germany | stb@freebsd.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 7:35:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from acl.lanl.gov (acl.lanl.gov [128.165.147.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0D9B514D92 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 07:35:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rminnich@acl.lanl.gov) Received: from localhost (rminnich@localhost) by acl.lanl.gov (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA520347 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 08:35:43 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 08:35:43 -0600 From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: memory-based VFS In-Reply-To: <19990507092008.A580@holly.dyndns.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Doesn't this do the same thing as MFS? Good question. Bad answer: See the web page. It is quite different. MFS provides a memory-based file system at the "disk block" level. It's kind of a backend to FFS, so you can't really get control of vnode operations the way you might like. v9fs is more like the "malloc file system" we talked about on this list a while back. Compare the source for the two systems and you'll see what I mean :-) ron To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 8:16:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from devserv.devel.redhat.com (devserv.devel.redhat.com [207.175.42.156]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CEAC715381 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 08:16:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from zab@zabbo.net) Received: from hoser.devel (hoser.devel.redhat.com [207.175.42.139]) by devserv.devel.redhat.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA27139; Fri, 7 May 1999 11:15:55 -0400 Received: from localhost (zab@localhost) by hoser.devel (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA01725; Fri, 7 May 1999 11:15:54 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: hoser.devel: zab owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 11:15:53 -0400 (EDT) From: Zach Brown X-Sender: zab@hoser To: Matthew Dillon Cc: Andrew Reilly , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Pentium-III and FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: <199905070056.RAA39946@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 6 May 1999, Matthew Dillon wrote: > trying to fine-tune some of the weirder instructions, though... it's > usually a waste of time and tends to obscure the larger issues that, > if fixed, would have yielded an even greater gain. A good example of do some profiling after doing clever things with the cache in some of the bulk operations (memcpy/memset/tcp checksumming/software raid/etc), thats all I'm suggesting :) > In regards to FP: The best place for extreme FP optimization is in > a high level FP library, not in native compiler-produced code. The yes. -- zach - - - - - - 007 373 5963 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 8:51:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82E5914C30; Fri, 7 May 1999 08:50:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA09584; Fri, 7 May 1999 11:11:43 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 11:11:41 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: "Sameer R. Manek" Cc: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: bug with lockf(3)? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 6 May 1999, Sameer R. Manek wrote: > I had posted this originally to freebsd-stable but didn't get any response > from that list. > > On freebsd 3-1-stable I'm not sure if this is a bug or my misinterpetation > of how lockf() works. But here's the situation. > > Given 2 processes A and B, both with open file descriptors to a file, > using open ("file.txt",O_RDWR) > A calls lockf (fd,F_LOCK,0) and proceeds to read/write to file > while file is still locked....including using lseek to jump to the > begining of the file > B calls lockf (fd,F_LOCK,0) and enters blocked state > A calls lockf (fd,F_ULOCK,0) > B is still in blocked state, until A exit(3)s. > > According to the man page: > F_LOCK and F_TLOCK requests differ only by the action taken if the > section is not available. F_LOCK blocks the calling process until the > section is available. F_TLOCK makes the function fail if the section is > already locked by another process. According to _further down_ in the man page: F_ULOCK requests release (wholly or in part) one or more locked sections controlled by the process. Locked sections will be unlocked starting at the current file offset through size bytes or to the end of file if size is 0. When all of a locked section is not released (that is, when the be- ginning or end of the area to be unlocked falls within a locked section), the remaining portions of that section are still locked by the process. .... please have 'A' reset the file position via lseek to where it initially created the lock before calling lockf (fd,F_ULOCK,0). if this doesn't work, then something probably is broken in -stable: #include #include #include int main(int argc, char **argv, char **envp) { int fd,x; char s[20]; fd = open("xxx", O_RDWR); if (fd == -1) { perror("open"); exit(1); } fprintf(stderr, "attempting lock...\n"); lockf(fd,F_LOCK,0); fprintf(stderr, "aquired lock.\n"); write(fd, "spam", sizeof("spam")-1); lseek(fd, 0, SEEK_SET); fprintf(stderr, "press enter to unlock...\n"); fgets(s,10,stdin); lockf(fd,F_ULOCK,0); fprintf(stderr, "released lock.\n"); fprintf(stderr, "press enter to exit...\n"); fgets(s,10,stdin); } just make sure "xxx" exists, and run 2 copies of this program at the same time.... this works on my box, perhaps a sample of your code could explain the problem... hope this helps, -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 9:13: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk [130.159.196.126]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0248C14A09; Fri, 7 May 1999 09:12:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from roger@cs.strath.ac.uk) Received: from muir-10 (roger@muir-10.cs.strath.ac.uk [130.159.148.10]) by fleming.cs.strath.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id RAA09540 Fri, 7 May 1999 17:12:54 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <37331109.167E@cs.strath.ac.uk> Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 17:12:57 +0100 From: Roger Hardiman Organization: University of Strathclyde X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04Gold (X11; I; OSF1 V4.0 alpha) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sos@freebsd.org Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Advantech 1750 PCI IO card Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Soren, (cc to Hackers for general information) In our Telepresence Lab we have almost finished a driver for the Advantach PCI 1750 card. This is a I/O card with 16 inputs and 16 outputs, timer chips and interrupts triggered by changes in state on the input lines or the outputs of the timer chips. So far our driver only supports digital outputs. (no inputs or interrupt handlers) We want to make the driver freely available to all (subject to final approval from our project supervisor). Some questions? 1) Is this worth including in the main source tree? 2) How do I get a major device number. 3) If our supervisor makes us release binary only drivers, what would be the best way forwards? On -current, we can have a loadable PCI device driver. What happens on 3.x systems. 4) If it does not go into a release, is there somewhere on the web site to mention the driver, prehaps in the 'projects' section. Hopefully, we can make it open source and have the source in the FreeBSD source tree for everyone to use. What do people think about this? Comment please. Bye Roger -- Roger Hardiman | Telepresence Research Group roger@cs.strath.ac.uk | DMEM, University of Strathclyde tel: 0141 548 2897 | Glasgow, Scotland, G1 1XJ, UK fax: 0141 552 0557 | http://telepresence.dmem.strath.ac.uk To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 9:18:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mrelay.jrc.it (mrelay.jrc.it [139.191.1.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C71C14E59 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 09:18:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nick.hibma@jrc.it) Received: from elpc36.jrc.it (elpc36.jrc.it [139.191.71.36]) by mrelay.jrc.it (LMC5692) with SMTP id SAA11944 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 18:18:11 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 18:17:15 +0200 (CEST) From: Nick Hibma X-Sender: n_hibma@elpc36.jrc.it Reply-To: Nick Hibma To: FreeBSD hackers mailing list Subject: Re: Advantech 1750 PCI IO card In-Reply-To: <37331109.167E@cs.strath.ac.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Is there on the FreeBSD website a page with a list of binary only drivers? With PCI being newbus it would be great to start something like that. It would be dead easy to have a list of drivers + contact addresses. The only problem is that binary drivers might need recompilation once in a while for new versions of the OS. Nick. On Fri, 7 May 1999, Roger Hardiman wrote: > Soren, > (cc to Hackers for general information) > > In our Telepresence Lab we have almost finished a driver > for the Advantach PCI 1750 card. This is a I/O card > with 16 inputs and 16 outputs, timer chips and interrupts triggered > by changes in state on the input lines or the outputs of the timer > chips. > > So far our driver only supports digital outputs. > (no inputs or interrupt handlers) > > We want to make the driver freely available to all > (subject to final approval from our project supervisor). > > > Some questions? > 1) Is this worth including in the main source tree? > > 2) How do I get a major device number. > > 3) If our supervisor makes us release binary only drivers, > what would be the best way forwards? > On -current, we can have a loadable PCI device driver. > What happens on 3.x systems. > > 4) If it does not go into a release, is there somewhere on the > web site to mention the driver, prehaps in the 'projects' section. > > Hopefully, we can make it open source and have the source > in the FreeBSD source tree for everyone to use. > > What do people think about this? > Comment please. > > Bye > Roger > -- > Roger Hardiman | Telepresence Research Group > roger@cs.strath.ac.uk | DMEM, University of Strathclyde > tel: 0141 548 2897 | Glasgow, Scotland, G1 1XJ, UK > fax: 0141 552 0557 | http://telepresence.dmem.strath.ac.uk > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 9:34:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5A1B14E59 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 09:34:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA24806; Fri, 7 May 1999 11:55:25 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 11:55:24 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: chris@calldei.com Cc: "Ronald G. Minnich" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: memory-based VFS In-Reply-To: <19990507092008.A580@holly.dyndns.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 7 May 1999, Chris Costello wrote: > On Fri, May 7, 1999, Ronald G. Minnich wrote: > > The v9fs memory-based VFS, written by Aaron Marks, is available at > > http://www.acl.lanl.gov/~rminnich/ > > Doesn't this do the same thing as MFS? Yes, but without the mount_mfs process kludge it seems to allow for single copy, rather than double copy and extra context switches, it uses kvm instead of a user process for backing store. My question, can/will this ever be backed by swap? Also, doesn't this limit us to just kvm memory (much smaller than total memory) ? -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 9:39:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE7FF152AE for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 09:39:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id JAA45587; Fri, 7 May 1999 09:39:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 09:39:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199905071639.JAA45587@apollo.backplane.com> To: Zach Brown Cc: Andrew Reilly , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Pentium-III and FreeBSD? References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG : :On Thu, 6 May 1999, Matthew Dillon wrote: : :> trying to fine-tune some of the weirder instructions, though... it's :> usually a waste of time and tends to obscure the larger issues that, :> if fixed, would have yielded an even greater gain. A good example of : :do some profiling after doing clever things with the cache in some of :the bulk operations (memcpy/memset/tcp checksumming/software raid/etc), :thats all I'm suggesting :) Oh, I agree for block ops! In fact, FreeBSD already does clever things with the cache when doing block ops. Not quite as clever as it could, but some cleverness. For example, on a 686 class cpu the zeroing code forces cache line reads prior to issuing writes to get around the slowness in the bus write-allocate crap, and then only issues writes for elements which are found to be non-zero. On the otherhand, FreeBSD is even more clever in that it avoids having to do a considerable amount of page zeroing on the fly by caching pre-zero'd pages ( and zeroing pages when the cpu is otherwise idle ). This yields a much larger improvement in performance then the cache cleverness. But, as I said... better for the clever optimizations to be hand-coded assembly then to try to put that sort of cleverness in the compiler. :> In regards to FP: The best place for extreme FP optimization is in :> a high level FP library, not in native compiler-produced code. The : :yes. : :-- zach -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 9:45:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from t15.tempest.sk (t15.tempest.sk [195.28.96.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7AE661538C for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 09:45:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ludo_koren@tempest.sk) Received: (from koren@localhost) by t15.tempest.sk (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA32811; Fri, 7 May 1999 18:46:13 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from koren) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 18:46:13 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <199905071646.SAA32811@t15.tempest.sk> From: Ludo Koren To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi. I am running 3.1-STABLE and developing a program which uses ncurses. After localization of the problem, I minimized it to the following: #include #include #include int main() { struct sigaction act; act.sa_handler = SIG_IGN; act.sa_flags = 0; sigemptyset(&act.sa_mask); sigaction(SIGINT,&act,0); sigaction(SIGINT,0,&act); printf("%d\n", act.sa_handler == SIG_IGN); initscr(); sigaction(SIGINT,0,&act); printf("%d\n", act.sa_handler == SIG_IGN); return 0; } Could somebody point, why the first output is 1 and the second is 0? Is it bug or feature. Any help is appreciated. Regards, ludo PS: I hope, it is the appropriate list. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 9:46:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48C7815327 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 09:46:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id JAA45627; Fri, 7 May 1999 09:46:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 09:46:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199905071646.JAA45627@apollo.backplane.com> To: Chris Costello Cc: "Ronald G. Minnich" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: memory-based VFS References: <19990507092008.A580@holly.dyndns.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :On Fri, May 7, 1999, Ronald G. Minnich wrote: :> The v9fs memory-based VFS, written by Aaron Marks, is available at :> http://www.acl.lanl.gov/~rminnich/ : : Doesn't this do the same thing as MFS? Not to detract from the cool things people have been writing, but in FreeBSD-current, it is possible to directly swap-back the VN device and mount a softupdates-enabled filesystem over it. You effectively get a memory filesystem due to the way the standard VM cache works. MFS is also a memory filesystem, but MFS wastes memory because the data representing a block exists in two places ( non-shared ) - the MFS process's VM space, and in the system VM cache. With the VN device, you wind up with more swap activity but ( probably ) better VM management - it doesn't starve memory and force defensive paging like MFS does. There are some very cool things coming down the pipe in the next 6 months. Poul has some excellent ideas on how to fix the VFS/BIO I/O subsystem. -Matt Matthew Dillon :> This is intended to serve as the basis of private name spaces for FreeBSD. :> I have a VFS and full implementation for Linux kernel 2.0.x, soon to go on :> the web page too. :> :> Anyone who'd like to talk to me about private name spaces for freebsd, :> give me a ring. :> :> ron :-- :Chris Costello :Me and my two friends... GIF and Wesson. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 10:29:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4E4D153F6 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 10:29:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (monica.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.7.2]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA22690; Fri, 7 May 1999 13:29:00 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199905071729.NAA22690@cs.rpi.edu> To: "G. Adam Stanislav" Cc: Dmitrij Tejblum , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: wc* routines In-Reply-To: Message from "G. Adam Stanislav" of "Wed, 05 May 1999 21:49:34 CDT." <19990505214934.B217@whizkidtech.net> Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 13:28:58 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The second (this is still pre-alpha/untested) WC string functions have been written. This version is obtainable from: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd/wcs-19990507.tar.gz New in this version is bug fixes and Man pages :) The code generates a couple of warnings when compiled, I don't know how to efficiently get rid of them, I would appreciate any suggestions. This code is in addition to Adam's, but I haven't taken the step to use his header files yet; that is the next step for me. -- David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 10:42:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp1.vnet.net (smtp1.vnet.net [166.82.1.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E91D7152EC for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 10:42:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp1.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA21164; Fri, 7 May 1999 13:42:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA12715; Fri, 7 May 1999 13:41:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id NAA98338; Fri, 7 May 1999 13:41:21 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 13:41:21 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199905071741.NAA98338@lakes.dignus.com> To: adam@whizkidtech.net, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: wc* routines Cc: dima@tejblum.dnttm.rssi.ru, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199905071729.NAA22690@cs.rpi.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > The second (this is still pre-alpha/untested) WC string functions have > been written. This version is obtainable from: > http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd/wcs-19990507.tar.gz > I get: Not Found The requested URL /~crossd/wcs-19990507.tar.gz was not found on this server. Apache/1.3.4 Server at www.cs.rpi.edu Port 80 when I try to access that URL. - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 10:42:32 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from acl.lanl.gov (acl.lanl.gov [128.165.147.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F99715247 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 10:42:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rminnich@acl.lanl.gov) Received: from localhost (rminnich@localhost) by acl.lanl.gov (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA507199 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 11:42:29 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 11:42:29 -0600 From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: memory-based VFS In-Reply-To: <199905071646.JAA45627@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 7 May 1999, Matthew Dillon wrote: > Not to detract from the cool things people have been writing, but > in FreeBSD-current, it is possible to directly swap-back the VN device > and mount a softupdates-enabled filesystem over it. You effectively get Quite cool. This still doesn't do what v9fs does, though. v9fs is a simple VFS (which aspiring VFS writers can use as a tutorial) which is intended as the starting point for private name spaces for freebsd. As such, we need to grab control at the vnop level. We looked at -current to see if there was a suitable candidate, and found none: hence v9fs. ron To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 10:45:38 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cs.rpi.edu (mumble.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.8.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2395B152E8 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 10:45:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crossd@cs.rpi.edu) Received: from cs.rpi.edu (loot.cs.rpi.edu [128.213.16.22]) by cs.rpi.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA23013; Fri, 7 May 1999 13:44:47 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199905071744.NAA23013@cs.rpi.edu> To: Thomas David Rivers Cc: adam@whizkidtech.net, crossd@cs.rpi.edu, dima@tejblum.dnttm.rssi.ru, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, crossd@cs.rpi.edu Subject: Re: wc* routines In-Reply-To: Message from Thomas David Rivers of "Fri, 07 May 1999 13:41:21 EDT." <199905071741.NAA98338@lakes.dignus.com> Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 13:44:24 -0400 From: "David E. Cross" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > Not Found > > The requested URL /~crossd/wcs-19990507.tar.gz was not found on this server. > > Apache/1.3.4 Server at www.cs.rpi.edu Port 80 > > when I try to access that URL. Oops, sorry, that URL should have been: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd/FreeBSD/wcs-19990507.tar.gz -- David Cross | email: crossd@cs.rpi.edu Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860 Department of Computer Science | Fax: 518.276.4033 I speak only for myself. | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 11:26:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (dingo.cdrom.com [204.216.28.145]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2CF7F14E46 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 11:26:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Received: from dingo.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by dingo.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA00810; Fri, 7 May 1999 11:24:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@dingo.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <199905071824.LAA00810@dingo.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Julian Elischer Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Slight suggested change to PCI config stuff. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 06 May 1999 21:55:58 PDT." <3732725E.2781E494@whistle.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 11:24:50 -0700 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > Any comments? (this is in 3.x but I presume the same makes sense > in 4.x) Sounds good. You'd do it totally differently in 4.x (use a "generic match" priority driver for the catchall bridge code and a "device match" priority for the chipset-aware drivers). -- \\ Sometimes you're ahead, \\ Mike Smith \\ sometimes you're behind. \\ mike@smith.net.au \\ The race is long, and in the \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ end it's only with yourself. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 12:50:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 806F314DC3 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 12:50:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA93951; Fri, 7 May 1999 15:50:12 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 15:50:12 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: Alfred Perlstein Cc: chris@calldei.com, "Ronald G. Minnich" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: memory-based VFS In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 7 May 1999, Alfred Perlstein wrote: > On Fri, 7 May 1999, Chris Costello wrote: > > > On Fri, May 7, 1999, Ronald G. Minnich wrote: > > > The v9fs memory-based VFS, written by Aaron Marks, is available at > > > http://www.acl.lanl.gov/~rminnich/ > > > > Doesn't this do the same thing as MFS? > > Yes, but without the mount_mfs process kludge it seems to allow for > single copy, rather than double copy and extra context switches, it > uses kvm instead of a user process for backing store. So what would be wrong with using a swap-backed vn(4) and newfs/tunefs/ mounting it? > > My question, can/will this ever be backed by swap? Also, > doesn't this limit us to just kvm memory (much smaller than > total memory) ? > > -Alfred > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \ _ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___)___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 13: 3:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [209.157.86.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD1761508B for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 13:03:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id NAA46718; Fri, 7 May 1999 13:03:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 13:03:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <199905072003.NAA46718@apollo.backplane.com> To: Brian Feldman Cc: Alfred Perlstein , chris@calldei.com, "Ronald G. Minnich" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: memory-based VFS References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :On Fri, 7 May 1999, Alfred Perlstein wrote: : :> On Fri, 7 May 1999, Chris Costello wrote: :> :> > On Fri, May 7, 1999, Ronald G. Minnich wrote: :> > > The v9fs memory-based VFS, written by Aaron Marks, is available at :> > > http://www.acl.lanl.gov/~rminnich/ :> > :> > Doesn't this do the same thing as MFS? :> :> Yes, but without the mount_mfs process kludge it seems to allow for :> single copy, rather than double copy and extra context switches, it :> uses kvm instead of a user process for backing store. : :So what would be wrong with using a swap-backed vn(4) and newfs/tunefs/ :mounting it? v9fs accomplishes a different purpose, as the author indicated. If all you want is a swap-backed filesystem then MFS or VN ( under current ) will work fine. MFS and VN both tie in at the device-block level. A real filesystem (UFS) must be emplaced above them. v9fs ties in at the VFS layer level. v9fs is not swap-backed ... what it is, really, is a fully-working demonstration project that people can build useful things on top of. Fully working demonstration projects are very cool things. People tend to build doubly cool things on top of them. I can see an immediate use for something like v9fs: a better devfs. Another futuristic cool use would be to make it the root filesystem with tie-ins from the loader. Add swap-backing and it could become a better union fs, or a more efficient swap-backed FS ( both MFS and VN can only partially recover swap space when files are deleted ). -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 13:27: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luna.lyris.net (unknown [207.90.155.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 645EA155EE for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 13:26:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kip@lyris.com) Received: from mail.lyris.com by luna.lyris.net (8.9.1b+Sun/SMI-SVR4) id NAA03474; Fri, 7 May 1999 13:21:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from (luna.shelby.com [207.90.155.6]) by mail.lyris.com with SMTP (MailShield v1.50); Fri, 07 May 1999 13:26:42 -0700 Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 13:21:27 -0700 (PDT) From: X-Sender: kip@luna To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: pthread_mutex_init requires malloc Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-SMTP-HELO: luna X-SMTP-MAIL-FROM: kip@lyris.com X-SMTP-RCPT-TO: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-SMTP-PEER-INFO: luna.shelby.com [207.90.155.6] Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I am trying to get a debug replacement for malloc to run on FreeBSD. One problem that I am running across that I have not run across on other platforms is that pthread_mutex_init requires malloc but of course malloc in order to be thread-safe needs a mutex around the pool of memory that it is using. So I get problems like the following: #0 0x283cbc54 in _exit () #1 0x283f623e in exit () #2 0x283c9f96 in _thread_kern_sched () #3 0x283c9feb in _thread_kern_sched_state () #4 0x283dab1b in nanosleep () #5 0x283da84f in sleep () #6 0x82c77ac in MemInitDefaultPool () at defpool.c:28 #7 0x82baaea in malloc (size=436) at shmalloc.c:83 #8 0x283caf50 in _thread_init () #9 0x283f6329 in _thread_init_invoker::_thread_init_invoker () #10 0x283f6350 in global constructors keyed to _thread_init_invoker::_thread_init_invoker () #11 0x28397ec0 in _init () #12 0x283953b9 in _init () #13 0x8002390 in _rtld_error () #14 0x800226a in _rtld () It appears that my malloc is being called before all the thread initialization routines have been run. Any assistance/advice would be much appreciated. -Kip To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 15: 8:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C3FD14C35 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 15:08:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from andrew@lake.com.au) Received: from m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20]) by m4.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id IAA25584 for ; Sat, 8 May 1999 08:08:43 +1000 (EST) X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: andrew@lake.com.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au [24.192.3.20] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. Received: from areilly.bpc-users.org (CPE-24-192-51-95.nsw.bigpond.net.au [24.192.51.95]) by m5.c2.telstra-mm.net.au (8.8.6 (PHNE_14041)/8.8.6) with SMTP id IAA27762 for ; Sat, 8 May 1999 08:08:42 +1000 (EST) Received: (qmail 11528 invoked by uid 1000); 7 May 1999 22:08:42 -0000 From: "Andrew Reilly" Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 08:08:42 +1000 To: Zach Brown Cc: Matthew Dillon , Andrew Reilly , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Pentium-III and FreeBSD? Message-ID: <19990508080842.A11385@gurney.reilly.home> References: <199905070056.RAA39946@apollo.backplane.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: ; from Zach Brown on Fri, May 07, 1999 at 11:15:53AM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, May 07, 1999 at 11:15:53AM -0400, Zach Brown wrote: > > In regards to FP: The best place for extreme FP optimization is in > > a high level FP library, not in native compiler-produced code. The > > yes. That's pretty much all I really want to do, but the catch with the P-III is that the new SIMD registers do _not_ map over the fp registers, the way MMX did. They are new processor state. So we need OS support to save and restore them on context switches. Intel supplies a "patch" for NT that does this, appently. Should be an interesting introduction to the bottom levels of the kernel. -- Andrew To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 15:25:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E654B14CA1 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 15:25:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA18811; Fri, 7 May 1999 23:25:15 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 23:25:15 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Andrew Reilly Cc: Zach Brown , Matthew Dillon , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Pentium-III and FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: <19990508080842.A11385@gurney.reilly.home> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 8 May 1999, Andrew Reilly wrote: > On Fri, May 07, 1999 at 11:15:53AM -0400, Zach Brown wrote: > > > In regards to FP: The best place for extreme FP optimization is in > > > a high level FP library, not in native compiler-produced code. The > > > > yes. > > That's pretty much all I really want to do, but the catch with > the P-III is that the new SIMD registers do _not_ map over the > fp registers, the way MMX did. They are new processor state. > > So we need OS support to save and restore them on context > switches. Intel supplies a "patch" for NT that does this, > appently. > > Should be an interesting introduction to the bottom levels of > the kernel. If you fix this, I can review it. I more or less promised this support to the XFree86 folks if they started using the extra state. You should also consider the AMD 3DNow! stuff which also has extra state I think. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 15:57:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cygnus.rush.net (cygnus.rush.net [209.45.245.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 875D914F5B for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 15:57:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bright@rush.net) Received: from localhost (bright@localhost) by cygnus.rush.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id SAA24386; Fri, 7 May 1999 18:18:29 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 18:18:25 -0500 (EST) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Brian Feldman Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: memory-based VFS In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 7 May 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > On Fri, 7 May 1999, Alfred Perlstein wrote: > > > On Fri, 7 May 1999, Chris Costello wrote: > > > > > On Fri, May 7, 1999, Ronald G. Minnich wrote: > > > > The v9fs memory-based VFS, written by Aaron Marks, is available at > > > > http://www.acl.lanl.gov/~rminnich/ > > > > > > Doesn't this do the same thing as MFS? > > > > Yes, but without the mount_mfs process kludge it seems to allow for > > single copy, rather than double copy and extra context switches, it > > uses kvm instead of a user process for backing store. > > So what would be wrong with using a swap-backed vn(4) and newfs/tunefs/ > mounting it? It's a kludge, a MUCH improved kludge, but yet a kludge. You can't for instance... resize the filesystem, it will do FFS-y type things where there is no need to do them, even in async mode. Limits on inodes, limits on block sizes... it could all be changed dynamically with a "real" mfs. -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 16:20:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A29515273 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 16:20:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id QAA76520; Fri, 7 May 1999 16:15:10 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 16:15:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer Reply-To: Julian Elischer To: Doug Rabson Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Slight suggested change to PCI config stuff. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 7 May 1999, Mike Smith wrote: > Sounds good. You'd do it totally differently in 4.x (use a "generic > match" priority driver for the catchall bridge code and a "device > match" priority for the chipset-aware drivers). and On Fri, 7 May 1999, Doug Rabson wrote: > > This makes sense for 3.x. Everything is different for 4.x though post > new-bus. The right thing in 4.x is to use priority ordered probes (which I > have working but haven't committed). If a driver matches the generic class > it would return a lower priority than a driver which matches the device > exactly. ok here is a patch for 3.x it's excedingly simple, and allows a specific driver to have precedence over the builtin generic entries.. I'd like to sneak this in asap if possible.. I think it can be proven to be benign. any seconders? julian Index: pci_compat.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/sys/pci/pci_compat.c,v retrieving revision 1.20 diff -c -r1.20 pci_compat.c *** pci_compat.c 1999/01/19 23:29:19 1.20 --- pci_compat.c 1999/05/07 23:07:18 *************** *** 384,392 **** --- 384,403 ---- lkm = lkm->next; } + /* + * it wasn't a loaded driver, look in the linked in ones + */ dvpp = (struct pci_device **)pcidevice_set.ls_items; while (drvname == NULL && (dvp = *dvpp++) != NULL) drvname = pci_probedrv(cfg, dvp); + + /* + * It wasn't one of the linked in drivers either, so try the defaults. + */ + if (drvname == NULL) { + dvp = &chipset_device; + drvname = pci_probedrv(cfg, dvp); + } return (dvp); } Index: pcisupport.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/sys/pci/pcisupport.c,v retrieving revision 1.86.2.4 diff -c -r1.86.2.4 pcisupport.c *** pcisupport.c 1999/05/07 04:06:38 1.86.2.4 --- pcisupport.c 1999/05/07 23:07:18 *************** *** 67,73 **** static void chipset_attach(pcici_t tag, int unit); static u_long chipset_count; ! static struct pci_device chipset_device = { "chip", chipset_probe, chipset_attach, --- 67,73 ---- static void chipset_attach(pcici_t tag, int unit); static u_long chipset_count; ! struct pci_device chipset_device = { "chip", chipset_probe, chipset_attach, *************** *** 75,81 **** NULL }; ! DATA_SET (pcidevice_set, chipset_device); struct condmsg { unsigned char port; --- 75,81 ---- NULL }; ! /*DATA_SET (pcidevice_set, chipset_device);*/ struct condmsg { unsigned char port; Index: pcivar.h =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/sys/pci/pcivar.h,v retrieving revision 1.25 diff -c -r1.25 pcivar.h *** pcivar.h 1999/01/19 23:29:20 1.25 --- pcivar.h 1999/05/07 23:07:18 *************** *** 165,170 **** --- 165,171 ---- struct pci_conf conf; }; + extern struct pci_device chipset_device; /* the default bridge handler */ extern u_int32_t pci_numdevs; To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 16:25:55 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A220B15296 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 16:25:49 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA19426; Sat, 8 May 1999 00:26:12 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 00:26:12 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Julian Elischer Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Slight suggested change to PCI config stuff. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 7 May 1999, Julian Elischer wrote: > > On Fri, 7 May 1999, Mike Smith wrote: > > Sounds good. You'd do it totally differently in 4.x (use a "generic > > match" priority driver for the catchall bridge code and a "device > > match" priority for the chipset-aware drivers). > > and > > On Fri, 7 May 1999, Doug Rabson wrote: > > > > This makes sense for 3.x. Everything is different for 4.x though post > > new-bus. The right thing in 4.x is to use priority ordered probes (which I > > have working but haven't committed). If a driver matches the generic class > > it would return a lower priority than a driver which matches the device > > exactly. > > ok here is a patch for 3.x > > it's excedingly simple, and allows a specific driver to have precedence > over the builtin generic entries.. > > I'd like to sneak this in asap if possible.. > I think it can be proven to be benign. > > any seconders? It looks like it would work. A bit ugly but I don't mind since we have the possibility of the 'right' solution in -current. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 16:45:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07EAE152AA for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 16:45:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id QAA77236; Fri, 7 May 1999 16:40:20 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 16:40:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Doug Rabson Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Slight suggested change to PCI config stuff. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 8 May 1999, Doug Rabson wrote: > > It looks like it would work. A bit ugly but I don't mind since we have the > possibility of the 'right' solution in -current. My thought exactly.. this is simple, and changes a minimum set of code. it's not pretty but it does the job.. I'll commit it.. thanks julian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 17:28:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailer.syr.edu (mailer.syr.edu [128.230.18.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 716C114F23 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 17:28:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cmsedore@mailbox.syr.edu) Received: from rodan.syr.edu by mailer.syr.edu (LSMTP for Windows NT v1.1a) with SMTP id <0.3CA2DCA0@mailer.syr.edu>; Fri, 7 May 1999 20:28:59 -0400 Received: from localhost (cmsedore@localhost) by rodan.syr.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA13195 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 20:28:53 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: rodan.syr.edu: cmsedore owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 20:28:53 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Sedore X-Sender: cmsedore@rodan.syr.edu To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: aio patches available Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've bundled up my patches and made them available at http://tfeed.maxwell.syr.edu/aio_diffs.tgz These patches are against -current of just a few minutes ago. They can be applied to 3.x easily, but I don't recommend you undertake any projects with AIO on 3.x as it seems to have other problems with the AIO code related to vfs locking. In any case, these patches add a new system call aio_waitcomplete() which has the process suspend until an operation completes, then passes you back the pointer the the userland aiocb (which you've probably "grown"). The other, more important, addition is a separate queueing mechanism for sockets. This allows you to queue operations for sockets without blocking an aiod process. It should be possible to service quite a number of sockets efficiently. It becomes faster than select() at about 37 sockets, and becomes progressively faster each socket you add. Note that I no longer do reads outside of an aiod because I could not make it work reliably (this made it faster than select in all cases, but when it doesn't work its not so useful :). I've been beating this code pretty hard (pushing 2-3MB/sec through sockets to disk, all async) and believe it to be reasonably stable. I've had no problems with this version. I'd like to see this committed, and would be more than willing to work with someone to have that happen. -Chris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 17:30:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E82714C47 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 17:30:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id KAA04671; Sat, 8 May 1999 10:00:38 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id KAA52667; Sat, 8 May 1999 10:00:37 +0930 (CST) Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 10:00:37 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Ludo Koren Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: ncurses problems (was: no subject) Message-ID: <19990508100037.F50800@freebie.lemis.com> References: <199905071646.SAA32811@t15.tempest.sk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <199905071646.SAA32811@t15.tempest.sk>; from Ludo Koren on Fri, May 07, 1999 at 06:46:13PM +0200 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Friday, 7 May 1999 at 18:46:13 +0200, Ludo Koren wrote: > > Hi. > > I am running 3.1-STABLE and developing a program which uses > ncurses. After localization of the problem, I minimized it to the > following: > > #include > #include > #include > > > int main() > { > struct sigaction act; > > act.sa_handler = SIG_IGN; > act.sa_flags = 0; > sigemptyset(&act.sa_mask); > sigaction(SIGINT,&act,0); > > sigaction(SIGINT,0,&act); > printf("%d\n", act.sa_handler == SIG_IGN); > > initscr(); > > sigaction(SIGINT,0,&act); > printf("%d\n", act.sa_handler == SIG_IGN); > > return 0; > } You've missed out an important part: which library are you using? This is what I get: $ cc -g -Wall bar.c -o bar -lcurses $ ./bar 1 1 $ cc -g -Wall bar.c -o bar -lncurses $ ./bar 1 0 > Could somebody point, why the first output is 1 and the second is 0? > Is it bug or feature. It looks like ncurses is setting its own SIGINT handler. I suppose you could think of this as a feature. Does it worry you? Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 17:35:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74C5314C8D for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 17:35:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id RAA79052; Fri, 7 May 1999 17:34:10 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 17:34:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Christopher Sedore Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: aio patches available In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 7 May 1999, Christopher Sedore wrote: > > I've bundled up my patches and made them available at > http://tfeed.maxwell.syr.edu/aio_diffs.tgz > As the Aio stuff is supposed to be posix inspired, a comment on the standards compiance of these features might be in order.. julian > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 18:12:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from whizkidtech.net (r20.bfm.org [208.18.213.116]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0A24153A3 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 18:11:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adam@whizkidtech.net) Received: (from adam@localhost) by whizkidtech.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) id UAA00241; Fri, 7 May 1999 20:11:32 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from adam) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 20:11:01 -0500 From: "G. Adam Stanislav" To: Thomas David Rivers Cc: dima@tejblum.dnttm.rssi.ru, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: wc* routines Message-ID: <19990507201101.A216@whizkidtech.net> References: <19990505214934.B217@whizkidtech.net> <199905061154.HAA73794@lakes.dignus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <199905061154.HAA73794@lakes.dignus.com>; from Thomas David Rivers on Thu, May 06, 1999 at 07:54:01AM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, May 06, 1999 at 07:54:01AM -0400, Thomas David Rivers wrote: > I mention this, somewhat facetiously... but one of the fundamental > discoveries in computer science was the idea of separation between > code and data. Although you bring up good points; realize that > you are violating that tenet... and as such, are inviting potential > trouble. Well, in my home country we have a proverb: Exceptions confirm rules. :-) (Oh, it's Slovakia, before anyone asks.) > Perhaps a half-way point is needed, much as the locale library > is implemented. Provide, in the library, some default table > that is a "reasonable subset of everything" so programs don't > just blow up if they can't find the file... then, provide the > mechanism for reading the file if they can find it. I like that idea. I think the EES (Extended European Subset) would be a reasonable one: It contains a little over 3000 characters, covering more than European languages. Although I would probably add Devanagari to it - a small price to pay to include many languages of India to the default subset. And probably the two kanas as well. > And, you shouldn't assume those Egyptologists can actually > recompile & relink their code. Hehe. Good point. > For example, if a word-processing > company has sold them a program - it's likely to be quite some > time before the next release which is recompiled/relinked with > newer FreeBSD libraries is available... Hmmmm.... Isn't the C library linked dynamically? I was under the impression that if you update the library, all C programs are automatically going to use it. Isn't that correct? Now to the big question (since I am still relatively new to FreeBSD): Suppose several programs running at the same time want to use the wctype functions. Since there is only one Unicode/ISO 10646, they all need to use the exact same data loaded from the exact same file. This data, once loaded, is read only. Is there a way for all programs to share the same data? I mean, I will have a pointer, _wct, which initially is NULL. Once any of the wctype functions is called for the first time, the library will check for the existence of that file. If it does not find it, it will use the reasonable subset. However, if it does find the file, it will allocate memory and read the file to it. This is where I would like the _wct pointer and the memory allocated to it shared by all programs. By the same token, I need to know how many programs are using it, so when a program exits, it only frees the memory if it is the last of the programs using it. In other words, is there a way to allocate memory shared by several programs, and is there a way to declare that certain specific variables (e.g. the _wcs pointer) be shared by all programs? And if it is possible (I sure hope so, because it would be a major waste of memory to have to read the same file separately for each program), is there a way to change the memory, once allocated and filled, to read only, so if some wild pointer tries to overwrite it, it will not be able to do it? I know this sounds like a somewhat naive question, but, as I said, I am still not fully familiar with the inner workings of FreeBSD. I am assuming the answer to all these questions is yes, and what I really need to know is how to do it. Adam To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 18:13:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from whizkidtech.net (r20.bfm.org [208.18.213.116]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2977A14CC8 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 18:13:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adam@whizkidtech.net) Received: (from adam@localhost) by whizkidtech.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) id UAA00247; Fri, 7 May 1999 20:13:10 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from adam) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 20:13:10 -0500 From: "G. Adam Stanislav" To: Archie Cobbs Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: wc* routines Message-ID: <19990507201310.B216@whizkidtech.net> References: <19990505214934.B217@whizkidtech.net> <199905060337.UAA07378@bubba.whistle.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <199905060337.UAA07378@bubba.whistle.com>; from Archie Cobbs on Wed, May 05, 1999 at 08:37:37PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, May 05, 1999 at 08:37:37PM -0700, Archie Cobbs wrote: > http://www.kaffe.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/kaffe/developers/ > http://www.kaffe.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/kaffe/FAQ/FAQ.unicode Thanks, I'll take a look at it. Adam To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 18:30:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailer.syr.edu (mailer.syr.edu [128.230.18.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2506214CE0 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 18:30:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cmsedore@mailbox.syr.edu) Received: from rodan.syr.edu by mailer.syr.edu (LSMTP for Windows NT v1.1a) with SMTP id <0.D953CD40@mailer.syr.edu>; Fri, 7 May 1999 21:30:37 -0400 Received: from localhost (cmsedore@localhost) by rodan.syr.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id VAA26382; Fri, 7 May 1999 21:30:32 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: rodan.syr.edu: cmsedore owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 21:30:32 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Sedore X-Sender: cmsedore@rodan.syr.edu To: Julian Elischer Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: aio patches available In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 7 May 1999, Julian Elischer wrote: > > > On Fri, 7 May 1999, Christopher Sedore wrote: > > > > > I've bundled up my patches and made them available at > > http://tfeed.maxwell.syr.edu/aio_diffs.tgz > > > > As the Aio stuff is supposed to be posix inspired, a comment on the > standards compiance of these features might be in order.. WRT aio_waitcomplete, as far as I know its not part of the spec, so doesn't affect compliance. IMHO, its sorely needed though. The rest of the modifications are performance enhancements or a bug fix, and don't change the behavior of the function calls except to be more efficient. With the implementation in -current now, if you queued 32 reads on sockets, no other aio operations (except physio) would do anything until one of the socket reads completed. Seems like a recipe for problems of various kinds if you didn't know this. Is there a web-downloadable spec available? Do I need to buy a book? A pointer would be appreciated. -Chris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 18:51:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from Genesis.Denninger.Net (kdhome-2.pr.mcs.net [205.164.6.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0860E14DC7 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 18:51:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from karl@Genesis.Denninger.Net) Received: (from karl@localhost) by Genesis.Denninger.Net (8.9.3/8.8.2) id UAA03434 for hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 7 May 1999 20:51:17 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <19990507205117.A3412@Denninger.Net> Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 20:51:17 -0500 From: Karl Denninger To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Uh, what's up doc :-) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i Organization: Karl's Sushi and Packet Smashers X-Die-Spammers: Spammers will be LARTed and the remains fed to my cat Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Trying to build a -CURRENT kernel (updated this morning) I get this: loading kernel sio.o: In function `siocnprobe': sio.o(.text+0x26d2): undefined reference to `gdbdev' sio.o(.text+0x26d8): undefined reference to `gdb_getc' sio.o(.text+0x26e2): undefined reference to `gdb_putc' sio.o(.text+0x26f9): undefined reference to `gdbdev' sio.o(.text+0x272d): undefined reference to `gdbdev' sio.o(.text+0x2733): undefined reference to `gdb_getc' sio.o(.text+0x273d): undefined reference to `gdb_putc' *** Error code 1 Investigating this it appears that there is a stub module that is used by gdb (I don't have kernel DDB enabled) that is in a file that is included in the build ONLY if GDB is defined. Is this a mistake in the most recent revision to sio.c? -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@denninger.net) Web: fathers.denninger.net I ain't even *authorized* to speak for anyone other than myself, so give up now on trying to associate my words with any particular organization. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 18:55:43 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alice.gba.oz.au (gba-254.tmx.com.au [203.9.155.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id EF31E14D8D for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 18:55:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gjb-freebsd@gba.oz.au) Received: (qmail 12552 invoked by uid 1001); 8 May 1999 01:51:48 -0000 Message-ID: <19990508015148.12551.qmail@alice.gba.oz.au> X-Posted-By: GBA-Post 1.03 20-Sep-1998 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 5A91 6942 8CEA 9DAB B95B C249 1CE1 493B 2B5A CE30 Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 11:51:47 +1000 From: Greg Black To: Danil Shebunin Cc: Brian Somers , freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Kernel PPP (PPPD): ip-up & ip-down scripts execution References: In-reply-to: of Fri, 07 May 1999 14:34:57 +0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > Your best bet is to run pppd as root. Alternatively, use user-ppp > > and the ``set filter'' command. > "[...] The scripts (ip-up, ip-down and others - D.S.) are executed as > root (with the real and effective user-id set to 0), so that they can do > things such as update routing tables or run privileged daemons. [...]" > I don't see any obstructions to run ipfw from ip-up script - but it don't > run. I do 'ipfw show' and it shows me firewall rules after machine boot, > not the ones, I set in ip-up. There is definitely something dysfunctional in the running of those scripts in kernel ppp (certainly in 2.2.8, not tested since). I could not easily discover what the problem was and abandoned it because the timeout code is also broken in pppd and that mattered to me. I switched to user-ppp and all my problems went away. Because I don't have spare boxes to test ppp-type problems with, I have not reported the kernel-ppp problems as I cannot provide any useful data. I do recall that the scripts seemed to run in part, but never did everything that I wanted them to do. > And user ppp... Well, I think it will be harder to manage user ppp daemon > from scripts. I very much doubt this -- take some time to fully read the documentation and I think you'll find you can do anything you want to, and you'll benefit from using a package that is both actively maintained and apparently more useful. -- Greg Black To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 19:40: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EFBD915256 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 19:40:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: from current1.whistle.com (current1.whistle.com [207.76.205.22]) by alpo.whistle.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id TAA82167 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 19:36:45 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 19:36:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Advice on terrible hacky PCI driver. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I have a driver for a device that exists onthe PCI bus.. unfortunatly (don't ask) it has a separate interrupt as well that runs directly to int6 of the 8259. (not via the PCI bus and not configured in by the bios etc.) I've tried the following terrible hack in the driver, but it didn't seem to work. any thoughts? static void pwrfailPCIattach( pcici_t config_id, int unit) { sc_p scp; scp = sca[unit]; config_id->intline = 6; /* pretend the chip said irq 6 */ config_id->intpin = 4; /* pretend it's pin D */ /* * Allocate our (hardwired) interrupt. */ if (!pci_map_int(config_id, pwrfailintr, scp, &bio_imask)) { printf("pwrfail%d: couldn't map interrupt\n", unit); } else { printf("pwrfail%d: interrupt %d mapped\n", unit, config_id->intline); } } It get's the success message, but the interrupt is never delivered to the routine pwrfailintr(). julian To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 19:56: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from luna.lyris.net (unknown [207.90.155.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DCCEC153C0 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 19:56:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kip@lyris.com) Received: from mail.lyris.com by luna.lyris.net (8.9.1b+Sun/SMI-SVR4) id TAA04899; Fri, 7 May 1999 19:50:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from (luna.shelby.com [207.90.155.6]) by mail.lyris.com with SMTP (MailShield v1.50); Fri, 07 May 1999 19:55:50 -0700 Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 19:50:33 -0700 (PDT) From: X-Sender: kip@luna To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: john@lyris.com Subject: problems with recursion in libc_r Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-SMTP-HELO: luna X-SMTP-MAIL-FROM: kip@lyris.com X-SMTP-RCPT-TO: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org,john@lyris.com X-SMTP-PEER-INFO: luna.shelby.com [207.90.155.6] Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I am running FreeBSD 3.1 STABLE. There appears to be a problem with wrterror and wrtwarning from malloc/free when using threads because it calls _thread_fd_lock_ which in turn calls malloc etc. I have made a stopgap fix to the two functions, by having them return before calling write. I hope that someone else will have a more intelligent fix. A partial trace follows: #0 malloc (size=76) at /usr/src/lib/libc_r/../libc/stdlib/malloc.c:1066 #1 0x82ee633 in _thread_fd_table_init (fd=2) at /usr/src/lib/libc_r/uthread/uthread_fd.c:75 #2 0x82eea9b in _thread_fd_lock (fd=2, lock_type=2, timeout=0x0) at /usr/src/lib/libc_r/uthread/uthread_fd.c:272 #3 0x82e9aa9 in write (fd=2, buf=0xefbfdc27, nbytes=5) at /usr/src/lib/libc_r/uthread/uthread_write.c:58 #4 0x830f370 in wrtwarning (p=0x8399c81 "recursive call.\n") at /usr/src/lib/libc_r/../libc/stdlib/malloc.c:292 #5 0x8310050 in malloc (size=76) at /usr/src/lib/libc_r/../libc/stdlib/malloc.c:1069 #6 0x82ee633 in _thread_fd_table_init (fd=2) at /usr/src/lib/libc_r/uthread/uthread_fd.c:75 #7 0x82eea9b in _thread_fd_lock (fd=2, lock_type=2, timeout=0x0) at /usr/src/lib/libc_r/uthread/uthread_fd.c:272 #8 0x82e9aa9 in write (fd=2, buf=0xefbfdc27, nbytes=5) at /usr/src/lib/libc_r/uthread/uthread_write.c:58 #9 0x830f370 in wrtwarning (p=0x8399b95 "junk pointer, too high to make sense.\n") at /usr/src/lib/libc_r/../libc/stdlib/malloc.c:292 #10 0x830ffb9 in ifree (ptr=0x863c0a0) at /usr/src/lib/libc_r/../libc/stdlib/malloc.c:1043 #11 0x8310151 in free (ptr=0x863c0a0) at /usr/src/lib/libc_r/../libc/stdlib/malloc.c:1097 #12 0x82e2df1 in __builtin_vec_delete (ptr=0x863c0a0) -Kip To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 21:16:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hp9000.chc-chimes.com (hp9000.chc-chimes.com [206.67.97.84]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 874F014CBF for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 21:16:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from billf@chc-chimes.com) Received: from localhost by hp9000.chc-chimes.com with SMTP (1.39.111.2/16.2) id AA033601741; Fri, 7 May 1999 20:02:21 -0400 Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 20:02:21 -0400 (EDT) From: Bill Fumerola To: Karl Denninger Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Uh, what's up doc :-) In-Reply-To: <19990507205117.A3412@Denninger.Net> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 7 May 1999, Karl Denninger wrote: > Is this a mistake in the most recent revision to sio.c? Kirk fixed this. - bill fumerola - billf@chc-chimes.com - BF1560 - computer horizons corp - - ph:(800) 252-2421 - bfumerol@computerhorizons.com - billf@FreeBSD.org - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 21:25:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp2.vnet.net (smtp2.vnet.net [166.82.1.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F70215618 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 21:25:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp2.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id AAA08734; Sat, 8 May 1999 00:03:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA13544; Sat, 8 May 1999 00:02:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.2/8.6.9) id AAA01012; Sat, 8 May 1999 00:01:55 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 00:01:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199905080401.AAA01012@lakes.dignus.com> To: adam@whizkidtech.net, rivers@dignus.com Subject: Re: wc* routines Cc: dima@tejblum.dnttm.rssi.ru, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19990507201101.A216@whizkidtech.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > Hmmmm.... Isn't the C library linked dynamically? I was under the impression > that if you update the library, all C programs are automatically going to > use it. Isn't that correct? Actually - it's up to the program developers - they can deliver their program linked either statically, or dynamically. Several years ago; I used to be a big advocate for linking with dynamic libraries... but, trying to maintain an old version of a program on progressively new releases of the library became too much of a headache. (things aren't _supposed_ to break when you put that new library on, but, they do... and more frequently than I care for.) So - now, I'm an advocate of statically linked programs. Disk space and memory aren't very big concerns for me anymore. As far as the potential load time improvements - well, the maintanence burden just got too big to support it. > > Now to the big question (since I am still relatively new to FreeBSD): Suppose > several programs running at the same time want to use the wctype functions. > Since there is only one Unicode/ISO 10646, they all need to use the exact > same data loaded from the exact same file. This data, once loaded, is read only. > > Is there a way for all programs to share the same data? I mean, I will have > a pointer, _wct, which initially is NULL. Once any of the wctype functions is > called for the first time, the library will check for the existence of that > file. If it does not find it, it will use the reasonable subset. You can use shared memory... but, honestly, I don't think it will be a big issue... I mean, it's 3000 characters, give or take, which is 6000 bytes (maybe 12000 if you have a 4-byte character code) - this really isn't enough to bother with. > > However, if it does find the file, it will allocate memory and read the file > to it. This is where I would like the _wct pointer and the memory allocated > to it shared by all programs. > > By the same token, I need to know how many programs are using it, so when a > program exits, it only frees the memory if it is the last of the programs > using it. > > In other words, is there a way to allocate memory shared by several programs, > and is there a way to declare that certain specific variables (e.g. the > _wcs pointer) be shared by all programs? > > And if it is possible (I sure hope so, because it would be a major waste of > memory to have to read the same file separately for each program), is there > a way to change the memory, once allocated and filled, to read only, so if > some wild pointer tries to overwrite it, it will not be able to do it? > > I know this sounds like a somewhat naive question, but, as I said, I am still > not fully familiar with the inner workings of FreeBSD. I am assuming the answer > to all these questions is yes, and what I really need to know is how to do it. > > Adam > All these questions are answered "yep - I think so" - by using shared memory. However, I'd add that: 1) I don't believe the complications that brings are worth the savings 2) It will keep me from using the library in other (non-UNIX) contexts, which would be disappointing. 3) You are not guaranteed that a FreeBSD kernel has been compiled with shared memory enabled, so you'd need to "fall back" to allocating them separately anyway. You goal of minimizing space is laudable... perhaps the file could be broken up so that each program only read the code it needed, instead of everyone reading the entire file? As far as "finding the file" - I suggest you look at how the locale library does this (in fact, I suggest you simply "steal" much of this from there) - basically, define a location in /usr/include/paths.h. Look there for the file... if it's not there - well, you didn't find it. - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 23:18:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from whizkidtech.net (r26.bfm.org [208.18.213.122]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B90D15582 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 23:18:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from adam@whizkidtech.net) Received: (from adam@localhost) by whizkidtech.net (8.9.2/8.9.2) id BAA00243; Sat, 8 May 1999 01:17:48 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from adam) Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 01:17:17 -0500 From: "G. Adam Stanislav" To: Thomas David Rivers Cc: dima@tejblum.dnttm.rssi.ru, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: wc* routines Message-ID: <19990508011716.A218@whizkidtech.net> References: <19990507201101.A216@whizkidtech.net> <199905080401.AAA01012@lakes.dignus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i In-Reply-To: <199905080401.AAA01012@lakes.dignus.com>; from Thomas David Rivers on Sat, May 08, 1999 at 12:01:55AM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, May 08, 1999 at 12:01:55AM -0400, Thomas David Rivers wrote: > Actually - it's up to the program developers - they can deliver their > program linked either statically, or dynamically. Mhm, you had me go to man gcc, and sure enough, there is a -static option I was not aware of before. > [snip] > As far as the potential load time improvements - well, the maintanence > burden just got too big to support it. > [snip] > You can use shared memory... but, honestly, I don't think it will be > a big issue... I mean, it's 3000 characters, give or take, which is > 6000 bytes (maybe 12000 if you have a 4-byte character code) - this > really isn't enough to bother with. No, no, I wish it were that simple! 3000 in the subset I am considering for hard coding just in case the file is not there (actually giving the user a choice of deliberately not having the file if they do not want or need all of Unicode). But currently there are close to 7000 characters in Unicode (I just checked), not counting "han" which is the combined character set for Chinese, Japanese, and Korean (my Chinese dictionary alone has 7773 characters in it). However, there are a number of proposals under consideration for the addition of other scripts. With ISO 10646 extending Unicode to 31 bits, we can, theoretically, end up with 2 billion characters. Now, we are far from there, but ISO divides the space into planes. A plane is the upper 16 (or actually 15) bits of the code. Each plane can then contain 64K characters. Even though none does, and right now only plane 0 is in use, many of the proposals are for plane 1 already. That means that even though we only have thousands of characters, their codes are not consecutive. Hence a simplest table would consist of at least 5 bytes per character: 4 bytes to tell us which character we are talking about, 1 byte to tell us about the properties of the character. But there is more... Take conversion functions, such as towupper and towlower. There is no system to it. Unlike in ASCII, you cannot just turn a bit on or off. You need a map. So, for example to map the lower case variety, you need 4 bytes to list which code we are dealing with, plus we need to list its lower case version. Now, the lower case version will always be on the same plane, so you do not need 4 bytes for that. Indeed, it seems you could just use one byte (I need to do further analysis to make sure that the upper and lower case character always share the 3 upper bytes). Then you need a separate map to go the other way. Unicode even defines the title version of a character. Luckily ANSI C has no towtitle! But we do need yet another table for towdigit. Again, I need to do some further analysis to see how many characters can have a lower case or upper case conversion, how many represent a digit, an xdigit, etc. I am pretty sure that having separate maps for each function will take up less space than having one global map. Most of the characters do not have upper/lower case as that concept pretty much exists only in Roman, Greek, and Cyrillic alphabets. There are no cases in Indic alphabets, Hebrew, Arabic, etc. And in each alphabet only a few characters are digits. As for xdigits, that is a recent mathematical concept. For all I know, a hexadecimal number is by definition taken from Roman alphabet. Right now, my towxdigit(c) looks like: { return toxdigit(c); }. There is another good reason for separate maps for each function: ANSI C reserves the right to add more conversion functions in the future. It is much less painfull to add a new map for each new function than to redo the structure of a single map every time a new function is added. So, anyway, we are definitely talking about more than 12000 bytes. That said, it is not as bad as it seems. Some of the maps can simply list ranges of codes rather than the codes themselves, 8 bytes per range, i.e., from-to, from-to, from-to... Others need to list every lower case/upper case combination, or digit/value combination, and such, but there are only so many characters in each. > However, I'd add that: > 1) I don't believe the complications that brings are > worth the savings > > 2) It will keep me from using the library in other (non-UNIX) > contexts, which would be disappointing. > > 3) You are not guaranteed that a FreeBSD kernel has been > compiled with shared memory enabled, so you'd need to > "fall back" to allocating them separately anyway. > > > You goal of minimizing space is laudable... perhaps the file could > be broken up so that each program only read the code it needed, instead > of everyone reading the entire file? Yes, that seems like a good idea. Perhaps putting each map into a separate file. Not every program that uses towlower will use towdigit. And it is easier to extend. Could, for example, add functions to convert between katakana and hiragana without affecting programs that do not even know what that is. > As far as "finding the file" - I suggest you look at how the locale > library does this (in fact, I suggest you simply "steal" much of this > from there) - basically, define a location in /usr/include/paths.h. > Look there for the file... if it's not there - well, you didn't > find it. Ah, nice. I did not know about paths.h. Interesting, though. Makes me wonder where I should put the files. I have been thinking of /usr/share/wctypes/ (or possibly /usr/share/wcmaps/). The file names can simply be the same as the type names, as those are defined by ANSI C, e.g. lower, upper, digit, xdigit, etc. As for the conversion maps, they could be named toupper, tolower, todigit, etc. I'm thinking outloud here. It is always helpful to me to write my ideas down in a message. :-) I have already done it somewhat differently, but I have no qualms about tossing what I have done and doing it over. I just came with an idea while typing this: There is a function called wctype which converts a text string, such as "alpha" into the corresponding wctype_t value which is simply a number. I can actually add new types in the future without having to rewrite the code! Each of the files (lower, upper...) can contain its wctype_t inside. So, if wctype receives a string it does not recognize, it can just check if a file of that name exists, and if so, it can read its wctype_t from the file, and associate that number with that name, so the rest of the library knows about it. Hey, gee, thanks for the inspiration. :-) Adam To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 23:23: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9798414EC2 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 23:23:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA23480; Sat, 8 May 1999 00:22:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id AAA09339; Sat, 8 May 1999 00:22:18 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199905080622.AAA09339@harmony.village.org> To: Peter Mutsaers Subject: Re: Is FreeBSD's make easily ported to non-BSD UNICES? Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "05 May 1999 22:50:05 +0200." <87btfzutqa.fsf@muon.xs4all.nl> References: <87btfzutqa.fsf@muon.xs4all.nl> Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 00:22:17 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <87btfzutqa.fsf@muon.xs4all.nl> Peter Mutsaers writes: : I really like FreeBSD's make (pmake) and would like to use it instead : for our companies development on IRIX and Solaris. Before trying to : port it, the question: is it easy to run it on other (SYSV-like) : Unices, or maybe has it already been ported? The last time I ported bmake from FreeBSD to another machine it took less than half a day or so, but it was all real easy. This was to solaris, but I no longer have the port. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri May 7 23:24:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C219B155A8 for ; Fri, 7 May 1999 23:24:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA23487; Sat, 8 May 1999 00:23:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id AAA09359; Sat, 8 May 1999 00:23:39 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199905080623.AAA09359@harmony.village.org> To: "M. L. Dodson" Subject: Re: Is FreeBSD's make easily ported to non-BSD UNICES? Cc: Peter Mutsaers , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 05 May 1999 16:10:18 CDT." <199905052110.QAA27980@beowulf.utmb.edu> References: <199905052110.QAA27980@beowulf.utmb.edu> <87btfzutqa.fsf@muon.xs4all.nl> Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 00:23:39 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <199905052110.QAA27980@beowulf.utmb.edu> "M. L. Dodson" writes: : IRIX Release 6.4 IP30 tryptophan : /usr/sbin/pmake Is that the same as pmake :-). I know that Solbourne shipped pmake with OS/MP which was parallel make, a hacked SunOS 4.x make to add -c n (same as Gnu Make's -j n). Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 0:30:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cj.net.cn (unknown [202.99.41.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5CEEC154B6 for ; Sat, 8 May 1999 00:29:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from yuguo@cj.net.cn) Received: from cj.net.cn ([166.111.69.234]) by cj.net.cn (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA04915 for ; Sat, 8 May 1999 15:44:49 +0800 (CST) Message-ID: <2DCC86F1.29738EB2@cj.net.cn> Date: Sun, 08 May 1994 15:30:09 +0900 From: yuguo@cj.net.cn Reply-To: jls@csnet1.cs.tsinghua.edu.cn X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.5 sun4m) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: i want some info about hacker tech of freebsd Content-Type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG dear, I've installed freebsd in my workstation.In not to be hackered, I want some issue and tools of hackers on freebsd to test my system.will u pls send some to me,especially how to get the right of root. Thanks. Best Regards Jils To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 1: 6: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC66F150E2 for ; Sat, 8 May 1999 01:06:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id RAA06074; Sat, 8 May 1999 17:35:52 +0930 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id RAA69262; Sat, 8 May 1999 17:35:45 +0930 (CST) Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 17:35:44 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: jls@csnet1.cs.tsinghua.edu.cn Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: i want some info about hacker tech of freebsd Message-ID: <19990508173544.C68170@freebie.lemis.com> References: <2DCC86F1.29738EB2@cj.net.cn> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <2DCC86F1.29738EB2@cj.net.cn>; from yuguo@cj.net.cn on Sun, May 08, 1994 at 03:30:09PM +0900 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sunday, 8 May 1994 at 15:30:09 +0900, yuguo@cj.net.cn wrote: > dear, > > I've installed freebsd in my workstation.In not to be hackered, > I want some issue and tools of hackers on freebsd to test my > system.will u pls send some to me,especially how to get the right > of root. To get root, use su(1). To set the date, use date(1). The rest of the information is in the sources; we have no secrets. If you have specific questions, please follow up to FreeBSD-questions@FreeBSD.org. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 1:50:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from isbalham.ist.co.uk (isbalham.ist.co.uk [192.31.26.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DCAC8154B7 for ; Sat, 8 May 1999 01:50:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: from gid.co.uk (uucp@localhost) by isbalham.ist.co.uk (8.9.2/8.8.7) with UUCP id JAA18849 for freebsd.org!hackers; Sat, 8 May 1999 09:50:13 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: from [194.32.164.2] by seagoon.gid.co.uk; Sat, 8 May 1999 09:44:07 +0100 (BST) X-Sender: rb@194.32.164.1 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 09:44:04 +0000 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: Bob Bishop Subject: visiting Palo Alto Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, I'm going to be in Palo Alto from tonight through Thursday. If there's any opportunities within those space-time coordinates for FreeBSD-related chat over a beer or similar I wouldn't mind hearing about it. -- Bob Bishop (0118) 977 4017 international code +44 118 rb@gid.co.uk fax (0118) 989 4254 between 0800 and 1800 UK To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 2: 9:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lcremeans.erols.com (lcremeans.erols.com [216.164.87.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 923531560C; Sat, 8 May 1999 02:09:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from lee@lcremeans.erols.com) Received: (from lee@localhost) by lcremeans.erols.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id FAA05050; Sat, 8 May 1999 05:09:46 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from lee) Message-ID: <19990508050945.A4995@erols.com> Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 05:09:45 -0400 From: Lee Cremeans To: hackers@freebsd.org Cc: multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: G200 GLX and SIGFPU Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i X-OS: FreeBSD 3.0-STABLE Organization: My room? Are you crazy? :) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'm playing with the GLX (server-side OpenGL-to-hardware interface) drivers for the Matrox G200 2D/3D chip (very good chip, btw), and the good news is that they work in FreeBSD. Mostly. My problem is that sometimes, the driver (which loads into a XFree86 3.3.x server as a module, and also comes with a Mesa-based libGL.so) likes to kill the X server with a SIGFPU at a certain point in the code (in the hardware pixel/texel-smoothing routines, to be exact). When I run the SGI logo.c demo, it will kill the server, eventually, with SIGFPU, and when I play q3test through the driver, it'll drop the server at or near the same place in the code as logo.c. This doesn't happen when Mesa itself is doing the rendering in software. The reason I'm asking here on the FreeBSD lists about this is because I remember some rumblings a while back about differences in the way FreeBSD and Linux handle the FPU, and whether they'd be pertinent to this. It'd appear, from what I've seen, that all development on these drivers (until now) has been done on Linux, so a lot of these SIGFPU issues would be "invisible" to them. If anyone wants a look at the code, the CVS information is at http://lists.openprojects.net/mailman/listinfo/g200-dev and I can also get crash dumps and backtraces for anyone who wants them. -lee -- +--------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Lee Cremeans -- Manassas, VA, USA (WakkyMouse on WTnet) | | lcremeans@erols.com | http://wakky.dyndns.org/~lee | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 2:24:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from eagle.phc.igs.net (eagle.phc.igs.net [207.210.17.201]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B6D9E153AB; Sat, 8 May 1999 02:24:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eagle@eagle.phc.igs.net) Received: by eagle.phc.igs.net (Postfix, from userid 1003) id 69C471897; Sat, 8 May 1999 04:24:03 +0000 (GMT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by eagle.phc.igs.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 63E1A38; Sat, 8 May 1999 04:24:03 +0000 (GMT) Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 04:24:03 +0000 (GMT) From: eagle To: Lee Cremeans Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: G200 GLX and SIGFPU In-Reply-To: <19990508050945.A4995@erols.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 8 May 1999, Lee Cremeans wrote: > I'm playing with the GLX (server-side OpenGL-to-hardware interface) drivers > for the Matrox G200 2D/3D chip (very good chip, btw), and the good news is > that they work in FreeBSD. > > Mostly. > > My problem is that sometimes, the driver (which loads into a XFree86 3.3.x > server as a module, and also comes with a Mesa-based libGL.so) likes to kill > the X server with a SIGFPU at a certain point in the code (in the hardware > pixel/texel-smoothing routines, to be exact). When I run the SGI logo.c > demo, it will kill the server, eventually, with SIGFPU, and when I play > q3test through the driver, it'll drop the server at or near the same place > in the code as logo.c. This doesn't happen when Mesa itself is doing the > rendering in software. > > The reason I'm asking here on the FreeBSD lists about this is because I > remember some rumblings a while back about differences in the way FreeBSD > and Linux handle the FPU, and whether they'd be pertinent to this. It'd > appear, from what I've seen, that all development on these drivers (until > now) has been done on Linux, so a lot of these SIGFPU issues would be > "invisible" to them. > > If anyone wants a look at the code, the CVS information is at > > http://lists.openprojects.net/mailman/listinfo/g200-dev > > and I can also get crash dumps and backtraces for anyone who wants them. > > -lee I've seen similar error messages with mesa in particalur in relation to flightgear, I don't have a solution as of yet though. Rob To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 2:31:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from peedub.muc.de (newpc.muc.ditec.de [194.120.126.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9776215615 for ; Sat, 8 May 1999 02:31:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garyj@peedub.muc.de) Received: from peedub.muc.de (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by peedub.muc.de (8.9.3/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA32929; Sat, 8 May 1999 11:30:09 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <199905080930.LAA32929@peedub.muc.de> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Julian Elischer Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Advice on terrible hacky PCI driver. Reply-To: Gary Jennejohn In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 07 May 1999 19:36:44 PDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 11:30:09 +0200 From: Gary Jennejohn Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Julian Elischer writes: > > >I have a driver for a device that exists onthe PCI bus.. >unfortunatly (don't ask) it has a separate interrupt as well that runs >directly to int6 of the 8259. (not via the PCI bus and not configured in >by the bios etc.) > >I've tried the following terrible hack in the driver, but it didn't seem >to work. any thoughts? > > > >static void >pwrfailPCIattach( pcici_t config_id, int unit) >{ > sc_p scp; > scp = sca[unit]; > > config_id->intline = 6; /* pretend the chip said irq 6 */ > config_id->intpin = 4; /* pretend it's pin D */ > /* > * Allocate our (hardwired) interrupt. > */ > if (!pci_map_int(config_id, pwrfailintr, scp, &bio_imask)) { > printf("pwrfail%d: couldn't map interrupt\n", unit); > } else { > printf("pwrfail%d: interrupt %d mapped\n", > unit, config_id->intline); > } >} > > >It get's the success message, but the interrupt is never delivered to the >routine pwrfailintr(). > it seems like this should work, but the new-bus code is such a maze of twisty little passages, all alike, that I can't wrap my head around it. --- Gary Jennejohn Home - garyj@muc.de Work - garyj@fkr.dec.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 2:40:17 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hydrogen.fircrest.net (metriclient-2.uoregon.edu [128.223.172.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A355B15615; Sat, 8 May 1999 02:39:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gurney_j@efn.org) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.fircrest.net (8.9.1/8.8.7) id CAA29014; Sat, 8 May 1999 02:37:46 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19990508023745.20308@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 02:37:45 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: eagle Cc: Lee Cremeans , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: G200 GLX and SIGFPU References: <19990508050945.A4995@erols.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: ; from eagle on Sat, May 08, 1999 at 04:24:03AM +0000 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG eagle scribbled this message on May 8: > > > On Sat, 8 May 1999, Lee Cremeans wrote: > > > I'm playing with the GLX (server-side OpenGL-to-hardware interface) drivers > > for the Matrox G200 2D/3D chip (very good chip, btw), and the good news is > > that they work in FreeBSD. > > > > Mostly. > > > > My problem is that sometimes, the driver (which loads into a XFree86 3.3.x > > server as a module, and also comes with a Mesa-based libGL.so) likes to kill > > the X server with a SIGFPU at a certain point in the code (in the hardware > > pixel/texel-smoothing routines, to be exact). When I run the SGI logo.c > > demo, it will kill the server, eventually, with SIGFPU, and when I play > > q3test through the driver, it'll drop the server at or near the same place > > in the code as logo.c. This doesn't happen when Mesa itself is doing the > > rendering in software. > > > > The reason I'm asking here on the FreeBSD lists about this is because I > > remember some rumblings a while back about differences in the way FreeBSD > > and Linux handle the FPU, and whether they'd be pertinent to this. It'd > > appear, from what I've seen, that all development on these drivers (until > > now) has been done on Linux, so a lot of these SIGFPU issues would be > > "invisible" to them. > > > > If anyone wants a look at the code, the CVS information is at > > > > http://lists.openprojects.net/mailman/listinfo/g200-dev > > > > and I can also get crash dumps and backtraces for anyone who wants them. > > I've seen similar error messages with mesa in particalur in relation to > flightgear, I don't have a solution as of yet though. use fpsetmask to mask the SIGFPE's that you don't want... usually this is all of them as FreeBSD has them turned on my default while other OS's don't... if you do a search of the mailing lists on SIGFPR and fpsetmask your bound to turn up many postings on the subject... -- John-Mark Gurney Voice: +1 541 684 8449 Cu Networking P.O. Box 5693, 97405 "The soul contains in itself the event that shall presently befall it. The event is only the actualizing of its thought." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 3: 4:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8D5E14D14; Sat, 8 May 1999 03:04:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA43470; Sat, 8 May 1999 11:01:43 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 11:01:43 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: John-Mark Gurney Cc: eagle , Lee Cremeans , hackers@freebsd.org, multimedia@freebsd.org Subject: Re: G200 GLX and SIGFPU In-Reply-To: <19990508023745.20308@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 8 May 1999, John-Mark Gurney wrote: > eagle scribbled this message on May 8: > > > > > > On Sat, 8 May 1999, Lee Cremeans wrote: > > > > > I'm playing with the GLX (server-side OpenGL-to-hardware interface) drivers > > > for the Matrox G200 2D/3D chip (very good chip, btw), and the good news is > > > that they work in FreeBSD. > > > > > > Mostly. > > > > > > My problem is that sometimes, the driver (which loads into a XFree86 3.3.x > > > server as a module, and also comes with a Mesa-based libGL.so) likes to kill > > > the X server with a SIGFPU at a certain point in the code (in the hardware > > > pixel/texel-smoothing routines, to be exact). When I run the SGI logo.c > > > demo, it will kill the server, eventually, with SIGFPU, and when I play > > > q3test through the driver, it'll drop the server at or near the same place > > > in the code as logo.c. This doesn't happen when Mesa itself is doing the > > > rendering in software. > > > > > > The reason I'm asking here on the FreeBSD lists about this is because I > > > remember some rumblings a while back about differences in the way FreeBSD > > > and Linux handle the FPU, and whether they'd be pertinent to this. It'd > > > appear, from what I've seen, that all development on these drivers (until > > > now) has been done on Linux, so a lot of these SIGFPU issues would be > > > "invisible" to them. > > > > > > If anyone wants a look at the code, the CVS information is at > > > > > > http://lists.openprojects.net/mailman/listinfo/g200-dev > > > > > > and I can also get crash dumps and backtraces for anyone who wants them. > > > > I've seen similar error messages with mesa in particalur in relation to > > flightgear, I don't have a solution as of yet though. > > use fpsetmask to mask the SIGFPE's that you don't want... usually this > is all of them as FreeBSD has them turned on my default while other OS's > don't... if you do a search of the mailing lists on SIGFPR and fpsetmask > your bound to turn up many postings on the subject... This should be done by the GL implementation. At Microsoft, we used to save/restore the fp flags on entry to Direct3D so that we could force the correct mode for our maths to work properly. We had all sorts of trouble before doing that (stupid exceptions enabled, people changing fp precision etc). I think in current versions of D3D, there is an api which you can call to say 'I agree not to touch the fp flags' which improves performance slightly. Mesa should be doing something similar, IMHO. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 3:12: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from eagle.phc.igs.net (eagle.phc.igs.net [207.210.17.201]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 00C33151D6; Sat, 8 May 1999 03:12:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eagle@eagle.phc.igs.net) Received: by eagle.phc.igs.net (Postfix, from userid 1003) id 3227A1897; Sat, 8 May 1999 05:11:33 +0000 (GMT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by eagle.phc.igs.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 0578638; Sat, 8 May 1999 05:11:32 +0000 (GMT) Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 05:11:32 +0000 (GMT) From: eagle To: Doug Rabson Cc: John-Mark Gurney , Lee Cremeans , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: G200 GLX and SIGFPU In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 8 May 1999, Doug Rabson wrote: > On Sat, 8 May 1999, John-Mark Gurney wrote: > > > eagle scribbled this message on May 8: > > > > > > > > > On Sat, 8 May 1999, Lee Cremeans wrote: > > > > > > > I'm playing with the GLX (server-side OpenGL-to-hardware interface) drivers > > > > for the Matrox G200 2D/3D chip (very good chip, btw), and the good news is > > > > that they work in FreeBSD. > > > > > > > > Mostly. > > > > > > > > My problem is that sometimes, the driver (which loads into a XFree86 3.3.x > > > > server as a module, and also comes with a Mesa-based libGL.so) likes to kill > > > > the X server with a SIGFPU at a certain point in the code (in the hardware > > > > pixel/texel-smoothing routines, to be exact). When I run the SGI logo.c > > > > demo, it will kill the server, eventually, with SIGFPU, and when I play > > > > q3test through the driver, it'll drop the server at or near the same place > > > > in the code as logo.c. This doesn't happen when Mesa itself is doing the > > > > rendering in software. > > > > > > > > The reason I'm asking here on the FreeBSD lists about this is because I > > > > remember some rumblings a while back about differences in the way FreeBSD > > > > and Linux handle the FPU, and whether they'd be pertinent to this. It'd > > > > appear, from what I've seen, that all development on these drivers (until > > > > now) has been done on Linux, so a lot of these SIGFPU issues would be > > > > "invisible" to them. > > > > > > > > If anyone wants a look at the code, the CVS information is at > > > > > > > > http://lists.openprojects.net/mailman/listinfo/g200-dev > > > > > > > > and I can also get crash dumps and backtraces for anyone who wants them. > > > > > > I've seen similar error messages with mesa in particalur in relation to > > > flightgear, I don't have a solution as of yet though. > > > > use fpsetmask to mask the SIGFPE's that you don't want... usually this > > is all of them as FreeBSD has them turned on my default while other OS's > > don't... if you do a search of the mailing lists on SIGFPR and fpsetmask > > your bound to turn up many postings on the subject... > > This should be done by the GL implementation. At Microsoft, we used to > save/restore the fp flags on entry to Direct3D so that we could force the > correct mode for our maths to work properly. We had all sorts of trouble > before doing that (stupid exceptions enabled, people changing fp > precision etc). > > I think in current versions of D3D, there is an api which you can call to > say 'I agree not to touch the fp flags' which improves performance > slightly. Mesa should be doing something similar, IMHO. > That was my next question shouldn't this be done in the port of MESA since thats whats throwing the sigfpe, disabling it in flightgear wouldn't help the problem at all.. Rob To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 3:25:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 99B0E15296; Sat, 8 May 1999 03:25:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA10196; Sat, 8 May 1999 06:25:02 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 06:25:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: eagle Cc: Doug Rabson , John-Mark Gurney , Lee Cremeans , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: G200 GLX and SIGFPU In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 8 May 1999, eagle wrote: > > > On Sat, 8 May 1999, Doug Rabson wrote: > > > On Sat, 8 May 1999, John-Mark Gurney wrote: > > > > > eagle scribbled this message on May 8: > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, 8 May 1999, Lee Cremeans wrote: > > > > > > > > > I'm playing with the GLX (server-side OpenGL-to-hardware interface) drivers > > > > > for the Matrox G200 2D/3D chip (very good chip, btw), and the good news is > > > > > that they work in FreeBSD. > > > > > > > > > > Mostly. > > > > > > > > > > My problem is that sometimes, the driver (which loads into a XFree86 3.3.x > > > > > server as a module, and also comes with a Mesa-based libGL.so) likes to kill > > > > > the X server with a SIGFPU at a certain point in the code (in the hardware > > > > > pixel/texel-smoothing routines, to be exact). When I run the SGI logo.c > > > > > demo, it will kill the server, eventually, with SIGFPU, and when I play > > > > > q3test through the driver, it'll drop the server at or near the same place > > > > > in the code as logo.c. This doesn't happen when Mesa itself is doing the > > > > > rendering in software. > > > > > > > > > > The reason I'm asking here on the FreeBSD lists about this is because I > > > > > remember some rumblings a while back about differences in the way FreeBSD > > > > > and Linux handle the FPU, and whether they'd be pertinent to this. It'd > > > > > appear, from what I've seen, that all development on these drivers (until > > > > > now) has been done on Linux, so a lot of these SIGFPU issues would be > > > > > "invisible" to them. > > > > > > > > > > If anyone wants a look at the code, the CVS information is at > > > > > > > > > > http://lists.openprojects.net/mailman/listinfo/g200-dev > > > > > > > > > > and I can also get crash dumps and backtraces for anyone who wants them. > > > > > > > > I've seen similar error messages with mesa in particalur in relation to > > > > flightgear, I don't have a solution as of yet though. > > > > > > use fpsetmask to mask the SIGFPE's that you don't want... usually this > > > is all of them as FreeBSD has them turned on my default while other OS's > > > don't... if you do a search of the mailing lists on SIGFPR and fpsetmask > > > your bound to turn up many postings on the subject... > > > > This should be done by the GL implementation. At Microsoft, we used to > > save/restore the fp flags on entry to Direct3D so that we could force the > > correct mode for our maths to work properly. We had all sorts of trouble > > before doing that (stupid exceptions enabled, people changing fp > > precision etc). > > > > I think in current versions of D3D, there is an api which you can call to > > say 'I agree not to touch the fp flags' which improves performance > > slightly. Mesa should be doing something similar, IMHO. > > > That was my next question shouldn't this be done in the port of MESA since > thats whats throwing the sigfpe, disabling it in flightgear wouldn't help > the problem at all.. What about switching to __BETTER_BDE_NPXCW__? > > Rob > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \ _ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___)___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 3:33:27 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from eagle.phc.igs.net (eagle.phc.igs.net [207.210.17.201]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 708AC15A80; Sat, 8 May 1999 03:33:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eagle@eagle.phc.igs.net) Received: by eagle.phc.igs.net (Postfix, from userid 1003) id B98C7189C; Sat, 8 May 1999 05:32:47 +0000 (GMT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by eagle.phc.igs.net (Postfix) with SMTP id B70643D; Sat, 8 May 1999 05:32:47 +0000 (GMT) Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 05:32:47 +0000 (GMT) From: eagle To: Brian Feldman Cc: Doug Rabson , John-Mark Gurney , Lee Cremeans , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: G200 GLX and SIGFPU In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 8 May 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: < major wack> > > What about switching to __BETTER_BDE_NPXCW__? > Brian, umm one more time in somthing resembling english? Rob To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 3:39:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D9D214F12; Sat, 8 May 1999 03:39:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA10381; Sat, 8 May 1999 06:39:46 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 06:39:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: eagle Cc: Doug Rabson , John-Mark Gurney , Lee Cremeans , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: G200 GLX and SIGFPU In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 8 May 1999, eagle wrote: > > > On Sat, 8 May 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > < major wack> > > > > What about switching to __BETTER_BDE_NPXCW__? > > > Brian, > > umm one more time in somthing resembling english? > > Rob Look at npx.h, starting around line 90. I think that we should probably switch to __BETTER_BDE_NPXCW__ and then getting more finely tuned exceptions in userland. Just my 2 cents. > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \ _ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___)___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 3:40: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from herring.nlsystems.com (nlsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.125.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9530E1508C; Sat, 8 May 1999 03:39:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from localhost (dfr@localhost) by herring.nlsystems.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA50156; Sat, 8 May 1999 11:40:10 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 11:40:09 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Brian Feldman Cc: eagle , John-Mark Gurney , Lee Cremeans , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: G200 GLX and SIGFPU In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 8 May 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > On Sat, 8 May 1999, eagle wrote: > > > > > > > On Sat, 8 May 1999, Doug Rabson wrote: > > > > > > This should be done by the GL implementation. At Microsoft, we used to > > > save/restore the fp flags on entry to Direct3D so that we could force the > > > correct mode for our maths to work properly. We had all sorts of trouble > > > before doing that (stupid exceptions enabled, people changing fp > > > precision etc). > > > > > > I think in current versions of D3D, there is an api which you can call to > > > say 'I agree not to touch the fp flags' which improves performance > > > slightly. Mesa should be doing something similar, IMHO. > > > > > That was my next question shouldn't this be done in the port of MESA since > > thats whats throwing the sigfpe, disabling it in flightgear wouldn't help > > the problem at all.. > > What about switching to __BETTER_BDE_NPXCW__? It looks like __BETTER_BDE_NPXCW__ would mask OVF, DIV0 and INV which I think is a better default. Is there some reason other than inertia for not changing to __BETTER_BDE_NPXCW__? I still think Mesa should deal with the flags itself (and save/restore them) otherwise it can get hosed by a stupid application changing to 23bit precision or something similar. -- Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 3:45:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lcremeans.erols.com (lcremeans.erols.com [216.164.87.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2953156DD; Sat, 8 May 1999 03:45:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from lee@lcremeans.erols.com) Received: (from lee@localhost) by lcremeans.erols.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id GAA05420; Sat, 8 May 1999 06:44:50 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from lee) Message-ID: <19990508064450.A5407@erols.com> Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 06:44:50 -0400 From: Lee Cremeans To: Doug Rabson , Brian Feldman Cc: eagle , John-Mark Gurney , Lee Cremeans , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: G200 GLX and SIGFPU References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: ; from Doug Rabson on Sat, May 08, 1999 at 11:40:09AM +0100 X-OS: FreeBSD 3.0-STABLE Organization: My room? Are you crazy? :) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, May 08, 1999 at 11:40:09AM +0100, Doug Rabson wrote: > I still think Mesa should deal with the flags itself (and save/restore > them) otherwise it can get hosed by a stupid application changing to 23bit > precision or something similar. Exactly; it's not the application that's trapping, it's the X server with the GLX module loaded. Thing is, I'm not sure where to stick the set/restore mask stuff; I'll dig into that after I get some sleep. -lee -- +--------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Lee Cremeans -- Manassas, VA, USA (WakkyMouse on WTnet) | | lcremeans@erols.com | http://wakky.dyndns.org/~lee | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 3:46: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 504241565F; Sat, 8 May 1999 03:45:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA10507; Sat, 8 May 1999 06:45:39 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 06:45:39 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: eagle Cc: Doug Rabson , John-Mark Gurney , Lee Cremeans , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: G200 GLX and SIGFPU In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 8 May 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > On Sat, 8 May 1999, eagle wrote: > > > > > > > On Sat, 8 May 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > > < major wack> > > > > > > What about switching to __BETTER_BDE_NPXCW__? > > > > > Brian, > > > > umm one more time in somthing resembling english? > > > > Rob > > Look at npx.h, starting around line 90. I think that we should probably switch > to __BETTER_BDE_NPXCW__ and then getting more finely tuned exceptions in > userland. Just my 2 cents. Clarification for using confusing English: I mean using finely tuned exceptions in userland programs that depend on them, as well, to provide support for older FreeBSD's if we were to switch. > > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ > green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ > FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \ _ \ |) | > http://www.freebsd.org _ |___)___/___/ > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \ _ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___)___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 3:52:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from janus.syracuse.net (janus.syracuse.net [205.232.47.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A84A1516F; Sat, 8 May 1999 03:52:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from green@unixhelp.org) Received: from localhost (green@localhost) by janus.syracuse.net (8.9.2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA10620; Sat, 8 May 1999 06:52:01 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 06:52:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Feldman X-Sender: green@janus.syracuse.net To: Doug Rabson Cc: eagle , John-Mark Gurney , Lee Cremeans , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: G200 GLX and SIGFPU In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 8 May 1999, Doug Rabson wrote: > On Sat, 8 May 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > > > On Sat, 8 May 1999, eagle wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, 8 May 1999, Doug Rabson wrote: > > > > > > > > This should be done by the GL implementation. At Microsoft, we used to > > > > save/restore the fp flags on entry to Direct3D so that we could force the > > > > correct mode for our maths to work properly. We had all sorts of trouble > > > > before doing that (stupid exceptions enabled, people changing fp > > > > precision etc). > > > > > > > > I think in current versions of D3D, there is an api which you can call to > > > > say 'I agree not to touch the fp flags' which improves performance > > > > slightly. Mesa should be doing something similar, IMHO. > > > > > > > That was my next question shouldn't this be done in the port of MESA since > > > thats whats throwing the sigfpe, disabling it in flightgear wouldn't help > > > the problem at all.. > > > > What about switching to __BETTER_BDE_NPXCW__? > > It looks like __BETTER_BDE_NPXCW__ would mask OVF, DIV0 and INV which I > think is a better default. Is there some reason other than inertia for not > changing to __BETTER_BDE_NPXCW__? I've never seen anyone cite one. And think about this: there are ports like {"/home/green"}$ find /usr/ports -name patch-?? -exec grep fpsetmask {} \; + fpsetmask(0); + fpsetmask(0); + fpsetmask(fpgetmask() & ~FP_X_INV); + fpsetmask(0); > > I still think Mesa should deal with the flags itself (and save/restore > them) otherwise it can get hosed by a stupid application changing to 23bit > precision or something similar. > > -- > Doug Rabson Mail: dfr@nlsystems.com > Nonlinear Systems Ltd. Phone: +44 181 442 9037 > > > Brian Feldman _ __ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ green@unixhelp.org _ __ ___ | _ ) __| \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! _ __ | _ \ _ \ |) | http://www.freebsd.org _ |___)___/___/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 3:54:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from eagle.phc.igs.net (eagle.phc.igs.net [207.210.17.201]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A50614FE6; Sat, 8 May 1999 03:54:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eagle@eagle.phc.igs.net) Received: by eagle.phc.igs.net (Postfix, from userid 1003) id 9F7C61897; Sat, 8 May 1999 05:53:39 +0000 (GMT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by eagle.phc.igs.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 8F41E38; Sat, 8 May 1999 05:53:39 +0000 (GMT) Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 05:53:39 +0000 (GMT) From: eagle To: Brian Feldman Cc: Doug Rabson , John-Mark Gurney , Lee Cremeans , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, multimedia@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: G200 GLX and SIGFPU In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 8 May 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > On Sat, 8 May 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > > > On Sat, 8 May 1999, eagle wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, 8 May 1999, Brian Feldman wrote: > > > < major wack> > > > > > > > > What about switching to __BETTER_BDE_NPXCW__? > > > > > > > Brian, > > > > > > umm one more time in somthing resembling english? > > > > > > Rob > > > > Look at npx.h, starting around line 90. I think that we should probably switch > > to __BETTER_BDE_NPXCW__ and then getting more finely tuned exceptions in > > userland. Just my 2 cents. > > Clarification for using confusing English: I mean using finely tuned > exceptions in userland programs that depend on them, as well, to provide > support for older FreeBSD's if we were to switch. Thanks you lost me completely with that the first time i saw it. the __BETTER_BDE_NPXCW__ thing just didn't mean anything to me, though next time I run across it it will. Rob To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 4:32: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ren.detir.qld.gov.au (ns.detir.qld.gov.au [203.46.81.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 865C015192 for ; Sat, 8 May 1999 04:31:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from syssgm@detir.qld.gov.au) Received: by ren.detir.qld.gov.au; id VAA20072; Sat, 8 May 1999 21:31:20 +1000 (EST) Received: from ogre.detir.qld.gov.au(167.123.8.3) by ren.detir.qld.gov.au via smap (4.1) id xma020066; Sat, 8 May 99 21:30:54 +1000 Received: from atlas.detir.qld.gov.au (atlas.detir.qld.gov.au [167.123.8.9]) by ogre.detir.qld.gov.au (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA11993; Sat, 8 May 1999 21:30:54 +1000 (EST) Received: from nymph.detir.qld.gov.au (nymph.detir.qld.gov.au [167.123.10.10]) by atlas.detir.qld.gov.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA26132; Sat, 8 May 1999 21:30:53 +1000 (EST) Received: from nymph.detir.qld.gov.au (localhost.detir.qld.gov.au [127.0.0.1]) by nymph.detir.qld.gov.au (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA22585; Sat, 8 May 1999 21:30:53 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from syssgm@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au) Message-Id: <199905081130.VAA22585@nymph.detir.qld.gov.au> To: Doug Rabson Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, syssgm@detir.qld.gov.au, Andrew Reilly Subject: Re: Pentium-III and FreeBSD? References: In-Reply-To: from Doug Rabson at "Fri, 07 May 1999 23:25:15 +0100" Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 21:30:52 +1000 From: Stephen McKay Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Friday, 7th May 1999, Doug Rabson wrote: >If you fix this, I can review it. I more or less promised this support to >the XFree86 folks if they started using the extra state. You should also >consider the AMD 3DNow! stuff which also has extra state I think. 3DNow! overlays the same FP registers that MMX overlays. But it has a cute cache line prefetch instruction that might be useful in some areas (I'm thinking bcopy/bzero). I can test K6-2 specfic stuff, but can't seem to find the time to write any. :-( Stephen. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 6:32:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EEB0014FEF for ; Sat, 8 May 1999 06:32:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.3/8.9.1) id PAA15636; Sat, 8 May 1999 15:32:33 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: Didier Derny Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: HELP! large shared memory (increasing kvm) References: From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 08 May 1999 15:32:32 +0200 In-Reply-To: Didier Derny's message of "Wed, 5 May 1999 10:36:17 +0200 (CEST)" Message-ID: Lines: 12 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Didier Derny writes: > for the SQL server, I need a large shared memory (SHMMAXPGS=9216) > I have maxusers = 512 > [...] I've already answered that. If you were not satisified with my answer, why don't you just say it out loud instead of reasking the same question? DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 8: 9:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from nagling.611.chedworth.hou.tx.us (13.252.nas6.ippool.hypercon.com [198.64.252.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A305514CCA for ; Sat, 8 May 1999 08:09:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bdodson@beowulf.utmb.edu) Received: from wotan.611.chedworth.hou.tx.us (wotan.611.chedworth.hou.tx.us [10.1.1.49]) by nagling.611.chedworth.hou.tx.us (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA23659; Sat, 8 May 1999 09:02:23 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bdodson@beowulf.utmb.edu) Received: (from bdodson@localhost) by wotan.611.chedworth.hou.tx.us (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA12422; Sat, 8 May 1999 08:45:18 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bdodson) Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 08:45:18 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199905081345.IAA12422@wotan.611.chedworth.hou.tx.us> From: "M. L. Dodson" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Warner Losh Cc: Peter Mutsaers , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Is FreeBSD's make easily ported to non-BSD UNICES? In-Reply-To: <199905080623.AAA09359@harmony.village.org> References: <199905052110.QAA27980@beowulf.utmb.edu> <87btfzutqa.fsf@muon.xs4all.nl> <199905080623.AAA09359@harmony.village.org> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I believe it is, but am not absolutely positive. I know I was surprised to find it installed, and the options look quite similar, although I have not done a detailed comparison. The only IRIX package I have that uses it is Gaussian. (The IRIX boxes just run commercial software and enough open source stuff to make the environment livable, and that all builds correctly with some sort of configure script.) If anyone wants me to check it out in detail, let me know and I'll investigate Monday. Warner Losh writes: > In message <199905052110.QAA27980@beowulf.utmb.edu> "M. L. Dodson" writes: > : IRIX Release 6.4 IP30 tryptophan > : /usr/sbin/pmake > > Is that the same as pmake :-). I know that Solbourne shipped pmake > with OS/MP which was parallel make, a hacked SunOS 4.x make to add -c > n (same as Gnu Make's -j n). > > Warner > -- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat May 8 8:54:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21832153D3 for ; Sat, 8 May 1999 08:54:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA10422; Sat, 8 May 1999 09:54:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id JAA04790; Sat, 8 May 1999 09:54:53 -0600 Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 09:54:53 -0600 Message-Id: <199905081554.JAA04790@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Bob Bishop Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: visiting Palo Alto In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I'm going to be in Palo Alto from tonight through Thursday. If there's any > opportunities within those space-time coordinates for FreeBSD-related chat > over a beer or similar I wouldn't mind hearing about it. I'll be in from Montana Mon/Tues nights. Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message