From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Nov 12 1:43:27 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from njord.bart.nl (njord.bart.nl [194.158.170.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 12A4337B479; Sun, 12 Nov 2000 01:43:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from daemon.chronias.ninth-circle.org (root@daemon.ninth-circle.org [195.38.210.81]) by njord.bart.nl (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id eAC9hLm41295; Sun, 12 Nov 2000 10:43:21 +0100 (CET) Received: (from asmodai@localhost) by daemon.chronias.ninth-circle.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) id eAC9gx277797; Sun, 12 Nov 2000 10:42:59 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from asmodai) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 10:42:59 +0100 From: Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai To: Terry Lambert Cc: Boris Popov , freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Installation: what to (not) do about it Message-ID: <20001112104259.G67634@daemon.ninth-circle.org> References: <20001105161028.F48312@daemon.ninth-circle.org> <200011062250.PAA23840@usr08.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2i In-Reply-To: <200011062250.PAA23840@usr08.primenet.com>; from tlambert@primenet.com on Mon, Nov 06, 2000 at 10:50:54PM +0000 Organisation: Ninth-Circle Enterprises Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG -On [20001107 00:02], Terry Lambert (tlambert@primenet.com) wrote: >> Boris Popov has actually been working already on fixing stacking layers. >> >> AFAIK he is actually pretty far, aside from bumping into some locking >> issues. > >How is he handling the cache coherency issue caused by having >two vmobject_t's? > >Getting mmap() to work is a bit of a chore. > >Is his stuff available for download anywhere? I just saw that one of the previous mail agents managed to mess up Boris' email address, so I guess he never saw this mail. Could you answer Terry's questions Boris? I assume we want to push this to arch or hackers though. -- Jeroen Ruigrok vd Werven/Asmodai asmodai@[wxs.nl|bart.nl|freebsd.org] Documentation nutter/C-rated Coder BSD: Technical excellence at its best The BSD Programmer's Documentation Project Take thy beak from out my heart and take thy form from off my door! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Nov 12 17:19: 2 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from satan.freebsdsystems.com (unknown [24.69.168.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 99A7637B479 for ; Sun, 12 Nov 2000 17:18:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from satan.freebsdsystems.com (satan.freebsdsystems.com [24.69.168.5]) by satan.freebsdsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.0) with ESMTP id eAD1Ivv91514 for ; Sun, 12 Nov 2000 20:18:57 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 20:18:57 -0500 (EST) From: Lanny Baron To: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: accessing portal site In-Reply-To: <20001110195629.J1686@sydney.worldwide.lemis.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG You may not like my "tone". Which is to me,is unimportant in this issue. The ISSUE was, Intel not allowing non I.E. browsers to access the portal and other private to channel users, site(s). I had already talked to a few people at Intel that had heard of complaints along the same thing. Though, nothing was done. When I wrote that letter and was contacted by phone by a more senior person, she had told me that it was not the intent of Intel to disallow other browsers (like lynx-ssl). She went on further to say that she would find out who had made the site to function in the evil way in which M$ does. Had I not did what I did, nothing would have changed. The end result is that I have made no enemies at Intel, and that now anyone can get to the site irregardless of what browser (so long as it is ssl capable) they use. This is not some apologetic answer back. This is to defend my warranted mail as a person whom is dedicated to promoting FreeBSD. In no way did I make any representation or link between myself and The FreeBSD Project or any of its communities. Lanny On Fri, 10 Nov 2000, Greg Lehey in the last wild and more than exciting...: >On Wednesday, 8 November 2000 at 13:19:03 -0500, Lanny Baron wrote: >> To whom this may concern, >> The fact that the site, >> http://program.intel.com/mp/admin/c_dynamic.asp?FILE=businessadvantage/index1.htm >> FORCES a user to use Micro$oft i.e. 5 is disgusting. >> >> I cannot think of any reason(s) why, Intel Corporation would not allow a >> user to use Netscape to get into the portal site. The same applies to the >> online training for the Intel Certification downloads. >> >> Our company, Freedom Technologies Corporation, only builds Intel Inside >> and (not currently allowed by your gov't) Intel Outside Servers. By that I >> mean we only sell/promote Intel Chassis, Intel serverboards, Intel Pentium >> III Processors (no celerons). >> >> We only put on the servers sold, the OS called FreeBSD, which Micro$oft >> uses to run HotMail.com and Yahoo! uses for its more than 1000+ web >> servers. >> >> I kindly ask on behalf of the Unix community, that your corporation ceases >> from forcing the use of Micro$oft products to get into some sites (the >> portal for example). >> >> To backup what I have said about MS and Yahoo! please visit the following >> URL: >> >> http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2000/05/29/BU20648.DTL >> >> Thank you, >> >> Lanny Baron >> http://freedomtc.com > >Lanny, I'd appreciate if you wouldn't copy the FreeBSD advocacy list >on this kind of message. I personally disagree with its tone, and I'm >sure that you're not going to make any friends at Intel with words >like "disgusting". By copying us on this kind of message, you're >implying that we agree with this opinion. > >It's another matter if you want to forward this kind of message to us. >I'm still not interested, but others might be. I don't want to limit >your freedom of expression, just the incorrect impressions of the >FreeBSD project that you might arouse with such messages. > >Apart from that, I tried accessing the URL about which you are >complaining, and the only problem I had was that it required a >password. If there's a problem, it would seem that at least you have >specified the wrong URL. > >Greg >-- >Finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key >See complete headers for address and phone numbers > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Nov 12 20:11:33 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from wantadilla.lemis.com (wantadilla.lemis.com [192.109.197.80]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1AD7837B479 for ; Sun, 12 Nov 2000 20:11:13 -0800 (PST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by wantadilla.lemis.com (8.11.0/8.9.3) id eAD49bb32733; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 14:39:37 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from grog) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 14:39:37 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: Lanny Baron Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: accessing portal site Message-ID: <20001113143936.C32175@wantadilla.lemis.com> References: <20001110195629.J1686@sydney.worldwide.lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0i In-Reply-To: ; from lnb@FreeBSDsystems.COM on Sun, Nov 12, 2000 at 08:18:57PM -0500 Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-418-838-708 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sunday, 12 November 2000 at 20:18:57 -0500, Lanny Baron wrote: > On Fri, 10 Nov 2000, Greg Lehey in the last wild and more than exciting...: >> On Wednesday, 8 November 2000 at 13:19:03 -0500, Lanny Baron wrote: >>> To whom this may concern, >>> The fact that the site, >>> http://program.intel.com/mp/admin/c_dynamic.asp?FILE=businessadvantage/index1.htm >>> FORCES a user to use Micro$oft i.e. 5 is disgusting. >>> >>> I cannot think of any reason(s) why, Intel Corporation would not allow a >>> user to use Netscape to get into the portal site. The same applies to the >>> online training for the Intel Certification downloads. >>> >>> Our company, Freedom Technologies Corporation, only builds Intel Inside >>> and (not currently allowed by your gov't) Intel Outside Servers. By that I >>> mean we only sell/promote Intel Chassis, Intel serverboards, Intel Pentium >>> III Processors (no celerons). >>> >>> We only put on the servers sold, the OS called FreeBSD, which Micro$oft >>> uses to run HotMail.com and Yahoo! uses for its more than 1000+ web >>> servers. >>> >>> I kindly ask on behalf of the Unix community, that your corporation ceases >>> from forcing the use of Micro$oft products to get into some sites (the >>> portal for example). >>> >>> To backup what I have said about MS and Yahoo! please visit the following >>> URL: >>> >>> http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2000/05/29/BU20648.DTL >>> >>> Thank you, >>> >>> Lanny Baron >>> http://freedomtc.com >> >> Lanny, I'd appreciate if you wouldn't copy the FreeBSD advocacy list >> on this kind of message. I personally disagree with its tone, and I'm >> sure that you're not going to make any friends at Intel with words >> like "disgusting". By copying us on this kind of message, you're >> implying that we agree with this opinion. >> >> It's another matter if you want to forward this kind of message to us. >> I'm still not interested, but others might be. I don't want to limit >> your freedom of expression, just the incorrect impressions of the >> FreeBSD project that you might arouse with such messages. >> >> Apart from that, I tried accessing the URL about which you are >> complaining, and the only problem I had was that it required a >> password. If there's a problem, it would seem that at least you have >> specified the wrong URL. > > You may not like my "tone". Which is to me,is unimportant in this > issue. The ISSUE was, Intel not allowing non I.E. browsers to > access the portal and other private to channel users, site(s). > > I had already talked to a few people at Intel that had heard of > complaints along the same thing. Though, nothing was done. It's not very likely that this kind of message will help. > When I wrote that letter and was contacted by phone by a more senior > person, she had told me that it was not the intent of Intel to > disallow other browsers (like lynx-ssl). She went on further to say > that she would find out who had made the site to function in the > evil way in which M$ does. > > Had I not did what I did, nothing would have changed. This is not correct. Somebody else might have come with a more diplomatic approach. Maybe they did, even. You can't be sure that this change is due to your rather abrasive message. I am personally convinced that it happened despite your tone, rather than because of it. > The end result is that I have made no enemies at Intel, and that now > anyone can get to the site irregardless of what browser (so long as > it is ssl capable) they use. Again, you can't be sure you have made no enemies. > This is not some apologetic answer back. This is to defend my > warranted mail as a person whom is dedicated to promoting FreeBSD. As I said, you're welcome to do what you want as long as you don't involve us. > In no way did I make any representation or link between myself and The > FreeBSD Project or any of its communities. By copying -advocacy, you implied exactly that. Please don't do it again. You're more than welcome to behave in whatever manner you see fit, but have the courtesy to not raise the impression that FreeBSD-advocacy is behind you. Greg -- Finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key See complete headers for address and phone numbers To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Nov 12 22: 9:17 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from spammie.svbug.com (mg136-070.ricochet.net [204.179.136.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5E4937B4C5 for ; Sun, 12 Nov 2000 22:09:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from spammie.svbug.com (localhost.mozie.org [127.0.0.1]) by spammie.svbug.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA05168; Sun, 12 Nov 2000 22:10:30 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jessem@spammie.svbug.com) Message-Id: <200011130610.WAA05168@spammie.svbug.com> Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 22:10:28 -0800 (PST) From: opentrax@email.com Reply-To: opentrax@email.com Subject: Re: accessing portal site To: grog@lemis.com Cc: lnb@FreeBSDsystems.COM, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <20001113143936.C32175@wantadilla.lemis.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 13 Nov, Greg Lehey wrote: > On Sunday, 12 November 2000 at 20:18:57 -0500, Lanny Baron wrote: >> >> You may not like my "tone". Which is to me,is unimportant in this >> issue. The ISSUE was, Intel not allowing non I.E. browsers to >> access the portal and other private to channel users, site(s). >> >>.....[Trimmed massive malarque].... >> >> This is not some apologetic answer back. This is to defend my >> warranted mail as a person whom is dedicated to promoting FreeBSD. > > As I said, you're welcome to do what you want as long as you don't > involve us. > >> In no way did I make any representation or link between myself and The >> FreeBSD Project or any of its communities. > > By copying -advocacy, you implied exactly that. Please don't do it > again. You're more than welcome to behave in whatever manner you see > fit, but have the courtesy to not raise the impression that > FreeBSD-advocacy is behind you. > I disagree with your last statement, Greg. I will concure(sp?) that the original posting has no business in Advocacy@freebsd.org. I also agree that his topic is definitely of subject. I further agree that using a more diplomatic approach does have it merits and at times can be more effective that the 'gunshot and dynamite' method. As I see this posting, this person is informing us of some rather important information, which we might want to take note of. The topic, while NOT belonging to 'advocacy', is of importance to those who advocacte *BSD. Personally I can recount many such stories, but this is not about me. I should finish by saying that while this person's information is important to those who advocate *BSD. There seems to be no one willing to 'step up to the plate' and deal with this information so that we might make effective use of it. best regards, Jessem. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Nov 12 22:20:40 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from wantadilla.lemis.com (wantadilla.lemis.com [192.109.197.80]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E67237B479 for ; Sun, 12 Nov 2000 22:19:47 -0800 (PST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by wantadilla.lemis.com (8.11.0/8.9.3) id eAD6FkX33322; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 16:45:46 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from grog) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 16:45:46 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: opentrax@email.com Cc: lnb@FreeBSDsystems.COM, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: accessing portal site Message-ID: <20001113164546.O32175@wantadilla.lemis.com> References: <20001113143936.C32175@wantadilla.lemis.com> <200011130610.WAA05168@spammie.svbug.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0i In-Reply-To: <200011130610.WAA05168@spammie.svbug.com>; from opentrax@email.com on Sun, Nov 12, 2000 at 10:10:28PM -0800 Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-418-838-708 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sunday, 12 November 2000 at 22:10:28 -0800, opentrax@email.com wrote: > > > On 13 Nov, Greg Lehey wrote: >> On Sunday, 12 November 2000 at 20:18:57 -0500, Lanny Baron wrote: >>> >>> You may not like my "tone". Which is to me,is unimportant in this >>> issue. The ISSUE was, Intel not allowing non I.E. browsers to >>> access the portal and other private to channel users, site(s). >>> >>> .....[Trimmed massive malarque].... >>> >>> This is not some apologetic answer back. This is to defend my >>> warranted mail as a person whom is dedicated to promoting FreeBSD. >> >> As I said, you're welcome to do what you want as long as you don't >> involve us. >> >>> In no way did I make any representation or link between myself and The >>> FreeBSD Project or any of its communities. >> >> By copying -advocacy, you implied exactly that. Please don't do it >> again. You're more than welcome to behave in whatever manner you see >> fit, but have the courtesy to not raise the impression that >> FreeBSD-advocacy is behind you. >> > I disagree with your last statement, Greg. > > I will concure(sp?) that the original posting has no business in > Advocacy@freebsd.org. I also agree that his topic is definitely of > subject. I further agree that using a more diplomatic approach > does have it merits and at times can be more effective that > the 'gunshot and dynamite' method. > > As I see this posting, this person is informing us of some > rather important information, which we might want to take note of. > The topic, while NOT belonging to 'advocacy', is of importance > to those who advocacte *BSD. Personally I can recount many > such stories, but this is not about me. > > I should finish by saying that while this person's information > is important to those who advocate *BSD. There seems to be > no one willing to 'step up to the plate' and deal with this > information so that we might make effective use of it. Sorry, maybe I need to clarify my statement. I don't have an issue with Lanny copying the list on the followups; as you say, it's certainly of interest, especially since he has been successful. My concern is the same as yours, that he shouldn't have copied us on his initial message to Intel. I wouldn't have objected if he had sent the message to Intel and then forwarded it to us. Greg -- Finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key See complete headers for address and phone numbers To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Nov 12 23:27: 4 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from satan.freebsdsystems.com (unknown [24.69.168.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E41937B479 for ; Sun, 12 Nov 2000 23:27:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from satan.freebsdsystems.com (satan.freebsdsystems.com [24.69.168.5]) by satan.freebsdsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.0) with ESMTP id eAD7Qiv95958; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 02:26:44 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 02:26:44 -0500 (EST) From: Lanny Baron To: Greg Lehey Cc: opentrax@email.com, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, freedom@FreedomTC.COM Subject: Re: accessing portal site In-Reply-To: <20001113164546.O32175@wantadilla.lemis.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greg, what are you trying to do to me??? Are you trying to get people to hate me? I have spent almost 1 year trying to make business plans for Freedom Technologies Corporation, which exists, and sells FREEDOM SERVERS with FreeBSD installed. I do not know this opentrax@email.com or whom the writer is. But since the person is getting this mail, lets set the freeking record straight. I cc'd advocacy because I thought that people might be interested in seeing someone that is a FreeBSD user, tell a giant like Intel something is very wrong. To the person at opentrax@email.com, since I came up with domains freebsdsystems.org, net and com Mr. Lehey was Adamantly* against me doing this. He demanded business plans. In fact Jordan said that he was not against it, but would not certify the systems. Which I can understand. He said it was ok to have our company listed on the FreeBSD site (we are in the gallery under freebsdsystems i think). We have sold a few servers into the U.S. from people hitting on that link from FreeBSD. We have one particular customer that is so "high" on our service, he is ordering dial-up equipment and wants to have wireless Internet available. Greg told me in mail, that he had a private IRC conversation with some people. Part of the conversation (or possibly all of it..i don't really know) was "what is Lanny Baron's role going to be". Well Greg, my role seems to work. Mr.Lehey then demanded any sits I had that had referece or an http link to Mr.Lehey's site removed at once, or he would pursue other courses to get them off. I obliged his request. I thought of the idea. I registered the domain names. I checked with someone besides Jordan at CDROM.COM prior to the takeover or buy-out by BSDi. I had told the person that Greg Lehey Adamantly objected to my usage of the name FreeBSD on our site. The answer was, Greg has no say what goes on, MR.Lehey writes books and left it at that. I was told by that person that the decision for anything with FreeBSD is entirely up to Jordan Hubbard. I have already stated that Jordan had no problem with us. Prior to my setting up the site (which still needs a lot of work), Mr. Lehey was helping me with all sorts of things. This stopped in late December, 1999 or early January, 2000. Yes I am no UNIX GURU. I never claimed to be. I do know enough to set up servers with the correct hardware and config the system to perform to the customers expectations. The proof of which can be furnished. I also contacted Marshall McKusick regarding the use of the BSD DAEMON. He said it was fine when he checked out our site. Reason being, we are promoting FreeBSD or a BSD system. From the whole advocacy list only one person besides Greg did not like the fact that I cc'd advocacy. Well I have one question. WTF does ADVOCACY mean?? In my little brain it means to promote. Our company ONLY sells systems with FreeBSD installed on it. Is that not Advocating the greatness of FreeBSD?? Greg. Please stop trying to get people to hate me or our organization. We are part of the FreeBSD community. I could have been an S.O.B. and for the book we provide to customers, The Complete FreeBSD by Greg Lehey, could have been substituted with some other. I know how much you want our company to fail. To the person at opentrax@email.com, I am sorry we must correspond in this hostile manner. I would like to know who you are, if you would consider that. Yours Truly Lanny Baron http://freedomtc.com On Mon, 13 Nov 2000, Greg Lehey in the last wild and more than exciting...: >On Sunday, 12 November 2000 at 22:10:28 -0800, opentrax@email.com wrote: >> >> >> On 13 Nov, Greg Lehey wrote: >>> On Sunday, 12 November 2000 at 20:18:57 -0500, Lanny Baron wrote: >>>> >>>> You may not like my "tone". Which is to me,is unimportant in this >>>> issue. The ISSUE was, Intel not allowing non I.E. browsers to >>>> access the portal and other private to channel users, site(s). >>>> >>>> .....[Trimmed massive malarque].... >>>> >>>> This is not some apologetic answer back. This is to defend my >>>> warranted mail as a person whom is dedicated to promoting FreeBSD. >>> >>> As I said, you're welcome to do what you want as long as you don't >>> involve us. >>> >>>> In no way did I make any representation or link between myself and The >>>> FreeBSD Project or any of its communities. >>> >>> By copying -advocacy, you implied exactly that. Please don't do it >>> again. You're more than welcome to behave in whatever manner you see >>> fit, but have the courtesy to not raise the impression that >>> FreeBSD-advocacy is behind you. >>> >> I disagree with your last statement, Greg. >> >> I will concure(sp?) that the original posting has no business in >> Advocacy@freebsd.org. I also agree that his topic is definitely of >> subject. I further agree that using a more diplomatic approach >> does have it merits and at times can be more effective that >> the 'gunshot and dynamite' method. >> >> As I see this posting, this person is informing us of some >> rather important information, which we might want to take note of. >> The topic, while NOT belonging to 'advocacy', is of importance >> to those who advocacte *BSD. Personally I can recount many >> such stories, but this is not about me. >> >> I should finish by saying that while this person's information >> is important to those who advocate *BSD. There seems to be >> no one willing to 'step up to the plate' and deal with this >> information so that we might make effective use of it. > >Sorry, maybe I need to clarify my statement. I don't have an issue >with Lanny copying the list on the followups; as you say, it's >certainly of interest, especially since he has been successful. My >concern is the same as yours, that he shouldn't have copied us on his >initial message to Intel. I wouldn't have objected if he had sent the >message to Intel and then forwarded it to us. > >Greg >-- >Finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key >See complete headers for address and phone numbers > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 0:24: 3 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from spammie.svbug.com (mg136-070.ricochet.net [204.179.136.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 76A8237B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 00:23:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from spammie.svbug.com (localhost.mozie.org [127.0.0.1]) by spammie.svbug.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA05297; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 00:21:45 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jessem@spammie.svbug.com) Message-Id: <200011130821.AAA05297@spammie.svbug.com> Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 00:21:43 -0800 (PST) From: opentrax@email.com Reply-To: opentrax@email.com Subject: How can we be more effective? (was: Re: accessing portal site) To: grog@lemis.com Cc: lnb@FreeBSDsystems.COM, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <20001113164546.O32175@wantadilla.lemis.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 13 Nov, Greg Lehey wrote: > On Sunday, 12 November 2000 at 22:10:28 -0800, opentrax@email.com wrote: >> >> I should finish by saying that while this person's information >> is important to those who advocate *BSD. There seems to be >> no one willing to 'step up to the plate' and deal with this >> information so that we might make effective use of it. > > Sorry, maybe I need to clarify my statement. I don't have an issue > with Lanny copying the list on the followups; as you say, it's > certainly of interest, especially since he has been successful. My > concern is the same as yours, that he shouldn't have copied us on his > initial message to Intel. I wouldn't have objected if he had sent the > message to Intel and then forwarded it to us. > I guess I should appoligize also. I didn't note the message being sent to Intel. I'm not sure Intel would like us spamming their support people un-intentionally on any matter. The point being, as stated, we should stick to matters that help *BSD in 'advocacy'. As for Lanny's point, it clear to me more needs to be done. The question is How can we be more effective? Lanny's (indirect) point is that M$ takes every opportunity it can to suppress OSs that it can't control. Currently, it's busy razing Linux. But we can be assured that M$ will get to us, especially if we can answer this question. The question, again, is: How can we be more effective? I'm not speaking about something we can measure easily. We have a combined self-interest in making *BSD the OS of choice, especially in areas each of us has a $$ interest. The area where work is needed is in the area of Public Relations. Currently, some points are being lost in the heat of the moment. One point, which we habitually fail to mention is the multiple trees that *BSD supports. Sure we call the 2.x and 3.x tree retired, but the code is there and if I'm not mistaken a security bug or a panic situation will be cause for a new release. So, if I'm not mistaken, this means that developers that still need support on previous version have it to an extent. Is this point I'm making correct? Can someone verify it for me? Jessem. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 0:45: 0 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from spammie.svbug.com (mg136-070.ricochet.net [204.179.136.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDF4F37B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 00:44:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from spammie.svbug.com (localhost.mozie.org [127.0.0.1]) by spammie.svbug.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA05325; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 00:46:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jessem@spammie.svbug.com) Message-Id: <200011130846.AAA05325@spammie.svbug.com> Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 00:46:21 -0800 (PST) From: opentrax@email.com Reply-To: opentrax@email.com Subject: Re: accessing portal site To: lnb@FreeBSDsystems.COM Cc: grog@lemis.com, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, freedom@FreedomTC.COM In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 13 Nov, Lanny Baron wrote: >...[Trimmed a bunch of stuff]... > To the person at opentrax@email.com, I am sorry we must correspond > in this hostile manner. I would like to know who you are, if you > would consider that. > To know me is to love me. :-) Lanny, Like you, I get upset when I see large corporations and greedy individuals perpetrate poor busines practices. Your issue with Mr. Lehey, is not an issue with me. Your opinion of Mr. Lehey, is yours; I may, or may not, agree. Currently, I'm the President of the SVBUG (Silicon Valley *BSD User Group). My job is promote ALL BSD's, including Apple's OS-X. In addition, I'm charged as a liason from our company to *BSD. Our company builds servers. However, right now we are in the middle of a reorganization. I can't show anything until about Dec. 14, 2000 (Streaming Media West starts). We build video server, rebroadcast servers, high-performance web servers and soon high-peformance webring servers. My job includes listening to many people. Many who don't have the time to read mail-lists, follow newsgroups or get on IRC. Many of these people are good people. Some of these people are really Linux Users, high in their community, but unwilling to get in our fray. These people are willing to listen and follow. These people tell me things; I report them to the *BSD-mailing-lists. I take your point (about M$/Intel) and appearances lead me to beleive you are correct. However, if you read between the lines, you'll see every response is now measured. Why? I burned much engery (in the early days) fighting with everyone in *BSD. Just ask Jordan. I would consel(sp?) you to do the same (measure your resonse). Sure you can fight, if you want. I'm not going to stop you or even complain. However, if your points are correct about *BSD, there are other means to about them. Means that will allow you to win, be the hero and come out ahead. This choice can only be made by you. best regards, Jessem. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 0:54:10 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mss.rdc2.nsw.optushome.com.au (ha1.rdc2.nsw.optushome.com.au [203.164.2.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 76BAD37B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 00:54:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from ellipsis.briz.net ([203.164.24.4]) by mss.rdc2.nsw.optushome.com.au (InterMail vM.4.01.03.00 201-229-121) with ESMTP id <20001113085403.MZEK10244.mss.rdc2.nsw.optushome.com.au@ellipsis.briz.net>; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 19:54:03 +1100 Message-Id: <4.3.2.7.2.20001113185029.00b4d100@briz.net> X-Sender: soltan@briz.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.2 Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 18:53:57 +1000 To: Jordan Hubbard From: Mike Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <96873.973243644@winston.osd.bsdi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >Offering the satisfaction of seeing your artwork in lights and >the warm fuzzy glow that comes from helping to promote the FreeBSD cause. :-) Sign me UP! [[ http://www.briz.net/mike/bnr-bsd-3.gif ]] Any comments or suggestions are welcome. I kept the file size below 15k and set it to loop through 10 repetitions before stopping. Mike To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 1:52: 4 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mozart.singa.pore.net (mozart.singa.pore.net [202.156.1.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05A2537B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 01:52:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from sleipnir (mcns46.docsis24.singa.pore.net [202.156.24.46]) by mozart.singa.pore.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id RAA16381; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 17:52:57 +0800 (SST) Message-ID: <001701c04d57$562f2e40$2e189cca@sleipnir> From: "James Lim" To: "Jordan Hubbard" , "Mike" Cc: References: <4.3.2.7.2.20001113185029.00b4d100@briz.net> Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 17:51:45 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Nice banner :) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike" To: "Jordan Hubbard" Cc: Sent: Monday, November 13, 2000 4:53 PM Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? > > >Offering the satisfaction of seeing your artwork in lights and > >the warm fuzzy glow that comes from helping to promote the FreeBSD cause. :-) > > Sign me UP! > > [[ http://www.briz.net/mike/bnr-bsd-3.gif ]] > > Any comments or suggestions are welcome. > > I kept the file size below 15k and set it to loop through 10 repetitions > before stopping. > > Mike > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 1:54:24 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from nef.ens.fr (nef.ens.fr [129.199.96.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E09437B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 01:54:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from corto.lpt.ens.fr (corto.lpt.ens.fr [129.199.122.2]) by nef.ens.fr (8.10.1/1.01.28121999) with ESMTP id eAD9rOH32237 ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 10:53:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from (rsidd@localhost) by corto.lpt.ens.fr (8.9.3/jtpda-5.3.1) id KAA98004 ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 10:53:23 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 10:53:23 +0100 From: Rahul Siddharthan To: Lanny Baron Cc: Greg Lehey , opentrax@email.com, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, freedom@FreedomTC.COM Subject: Re: accessing portal site Message-ID: <20001113105323.B96905@lpt.ens.fr> References: <20001113164546.O32175@wantadilla.lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from lnb@FreeBSDsystems.COM on Mon, Nov 13, 2000 at 02:26:44AM -0500 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.4-STABLE i386 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Lanny Baron said on Nov 13, 2000 at 02:26:44: > Greg, what are you trying to do to me??? Are you trying to get people to > hate me? I have spent almost 1 year trying to make business plans for > Freedom Technologies Corporation, which exists, and sells FREEDOM > SERVERS with FreeBSD installed. > > I do not know this opentrax@email.com or whom the writer is. But since the > person is getting this mail, lets set the freeking record straight. Excuse me if I butt in, but have you considered getting your letters written by somebody else? A secretary or someone who knows how to phrase these things? Maybe you mean no harm, but if these are examples of how you normally write letters (especially the one to Intel) I'm not at all surprised that people don't like it. > I cc'd advocacy because I thought that people might be interested in > seeing someone that is a FreeBSD user, tell a giant like Intel something > is very wrong. It's plain common sense not to cc advocacy. Apart from the unwanted implication that you're a spokesman for FreeBSD advocacy, there is a danger of the recipient of your mail getting submerged in a deluge of -advocacy replies. Luckily that didn't happen in this case. Never put someone on a group mailing list unless they ask for it. > From the whole advocacy list only one person besides Greg did not like the > fact that I cc'd advocacy. How do you know that? Maybe others just didn't want to fan the flames. Rahul. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 2:28:55 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from unet.univie.ac.at (unet.univie.ac.at [131.130.230.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CE0337B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 02:28:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.localdomain (le.adsl.cc.univie.ac.at [193.171.3.9]) by unet.univie.ac.at (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA45248; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 11:28:49 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by localhost.localdomain (8.11.1/8.11.0) with ESMTP id eADA91n01407; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 11:09:01 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from a9404849@unet.univie.ac.at) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 11:09:01 +0100 (CET) From: Lukas Ertl X-Sender: lukas@localhost.localdomain To: Mike Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20001113185029.00b4d100@briz.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 13 Nov 2000, Mike wrote: > > >Offering the satisfaction of seeing your artwork in lights and > >the warm fuzzy glow that comes from helping to promote the FreeBSD cause. :-) > > Sign me UP! > > [[ http://www.briz.net/mike/bnr-bsd-3.gif ]] > > Any comments or suggestions are welcome. I like this one a lot. But, my 0.02 cents: one needs more time to read the text, so slow down the animation a little bit, "The Power to serve" is hard to read, at least on my screen, and I would change the font of the "Click here to get..." flashing text, ... maybe "FreeBSD is FREE" doesn't need three exclamation marks :-) But, apart from that, I really like it. lg, le -- "Whip me. Beat me. Make me maintain AIX." -- Stephan Zielinski To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 3:15: 6 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mss.rdc2.nsw.optushome.com.au (ha1.rdc2.nsw.optushome.com.au [203.164.2.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32B2437B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 03:15:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from ellipsis.briz.net ([203.164.24.4]) by mss.rdc2.nsw.optushome.com.au (InterMail vM.4.01.03.00 201-229-121) with ESMTP id <20001113110915.NZME10244.mss.rdc2.nsw.optushome.com.au@ellipsis.briz.net>; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 22:09:15 +1100 Message-Id: <4.3.2.7.2.20001113210505.00bae6d0@briz.net> X-Sender: soltan@briz.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.2 Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 21:09:16 +1000 To: Lukas Ertl From: Mike Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: References: <4.3.2.7.2.20001113185029.00b4d100@briz.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > Any comments or suggestions are welcome. > >I like this one a lot. But, my 0.02 cents: >one needs more time to read the text, so slow down the animation a little >bit, "The Power to serve" is hard to read, at least on my screen, and I >would change the font of the "Click here to get..." flashing >text, ... maybe "FreeBSD is FREE" doesn't need three exclamation marks :-) > >But, apart from that, I really like it. Thanks for your thoughts. I've put up a modified version for any further chump change you might have... :) [[ http://www.briz.net/mike/bnr-bsd-4.gif ]] Mike To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 4:28:59 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from unet.univie.ac.at (unet.univie.ac.at [131.130.230.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1331C37B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 04:28:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.localdomain (le.adsl.cc.univie.ac.at [193.171.3.9]) by unet.univie.ac.at (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA54616; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 13:28:50 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by localhost.localdomain (8.11.1/8.11.0) with ESMTP id eADBoon02005; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 12:50:50 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from a9404849@unet.univie.ac.at) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 12:50:50 +0100 (CET) From: Lukas Ertl X-Sender: lukas@localhost.localdomain To: Mike Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20001113210505.00bae6d0@briz.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 13 Nov 2000, Mike wrote: > > > > Any comments or suggestions are welcome. > > > >I like this one a lot. But, my 0.02 cents: > >one needs more time to read the text, so slow down the animation a little > >bit, "The Power to serve" is hard to read, at least on my screen, and I > >would change the font of the "Click here to get..." flashing > >text, ... maybe "FreeBSD is FREE" doesn't need three exclamation marks :-) > > > >But, apart from that, I really like it. > > Thanks for your thoughts. > > I've put up a modified version for any further chump change you might > have... :) > > [[ http://www.briz.net/mike/bnr-bsd-4.gif ]] Much better :-) -- "Whip me. Beat me. Make me maintain AIX." -- Stephan Zielinski To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 6:25:43 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from spammie.svbug.com (mg136-070.ricochet.net [204.179.136.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B579037B4D7 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 06:25:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from spammie.svbug.com (localhost.mozie.org [127.0.0.1]) by spammie.svbug.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id GAA05652; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 06:27:27 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jessem@spammie.svbug.com) Message-Id: <200011131427.GAA05652@spammie.svbug.com> Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 06:27:24 -0800 (PST) From: opentrax@email.com Reply-To: opentrax@email.com Subject: Re: accessing portal site To: Rahul.Siddharthan@lpt.ens.fr Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <20001113105323.B96905@lpt.ens.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 13 Nov, Rahul Siddharthan wrote: > Lanny Baron said on Nov 13, 2000 at 02:26:44: >> Greg, what are you trying to do to me??? Are you trying to get people to >> hate me? I have spent almost 1 year trying to make business plans for >> Freedom Technologies Corporation, which exists, and sells FREEDOM >> SERVERS with FreeBSD installed. >> >> I do not know this opentrax@email.com or whom the writer is. But since the >> person is getting this mail, lets set the freeking record straight. > > Excuse me if I butt in, but have you considered getting your letters > written by somebody else? A secretary or someone who knows how to > phrase these things? > Hey, relax. It's only a leter. And BTW, there is no need to spam the recipeints on this. We get 'advocacy' and we each get 'CC'. I guess my secretary should write this [:-) , but please trim the CC line. :-) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 6:41:28 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from spammie.svbug.com (mg136-070.ricochet.net [204.179.136.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CAD6937B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 06:41:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from spammie.svbug.com (localhost.mozie.org [127.0.0.1]) by spammie.svbug.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id GAA05670; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 06:41:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jessem@spammie.svbug.com) Message-Id: <200011131441.GAA05670@spammie.svbug.com> Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 06:41:46 -0800 (PST) From: opentrax@email.com Reply-To: opentrax@email.com Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner ? To: a9404849@unet.univie.ac.at Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 13 Nov, Lukas Ertl wrote: > On Mon, 13 Nov 2000, Mike wrote: > >> >> > > Any comments or suggestions are welcome. >> > >> >I like this one a lot. But, my 0.02 cents: >> >one needs more time to read the text, so slow down the animation a little >> >bit, "The Power to serve" is hard to read, at least on my screen, and I >> >would change the font of the "Click here to get..." flashing >> >text, ... maybe "FreeBSD is FREE" doesn't need three exclamation marks :-) >> > >> >But, apart from that, I really like it. >> >> Thanks for your thoughts. >> >> I've put up a modified version for any further chump change you might >> have... :) >> >> [[ http://www.briz.net/mike/bnr-bsd-4.gif ]] > > Much better :-) > Sorry, it looks like a pornographic blip board. Three exclamations points, and reduce the total time to the ad to 10 seconds (including download @ 56Kbps) Right now it takes 30 sec. Say what you want, keep it short and sweet. After all, we are not selling toliet paper or roll-on anti-perspirant. It's an OS. BTW, if you insist on such a long ad, maybe humor would work.... I.E. -- Works Great, Less Filling. - Old and reliable, not new and improved. - It Free, because people want to pay for things that suck. - If we made it any easier, we charge for it. - We no list on the stock exchange, so we don't need to charge for that. - This thing got loose from AT & T. We're not supposed to say that. :-) - More people use us, than Bill likes to admit. - If Microsoft owned us, they have a true monopoly. - It's Free. Money back gauranteed! Hope this help! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 6:59: 9 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from satan.freebsdsystems.com (unknown [24.69.168.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 671B037B4D7 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 06:59:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from satan.freebsdsystems.com (satan.freebsdsystems.com [24.69.168.5]) by satan.freebsdsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.0) with ESMTP id eADEw5v00736; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 09:58:05 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 09:58:04 -0500 (EST) From: Lanny Baron To: opentrax@email.com Cc: grog@lemis.com, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, freedom@FreedomTC.COM Subject: Re: accessing portal site In-Reply-To: <200011130846.AAA05325@spammie.svbug.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello Jessem, As I said in previous mail and contrary to Mr. Lehey's comments about people at Intel hating me. It was only a day later when a upper management person called me and thanked me for pushing the matter. She had no idea that non-I.E. users could not access the portal (and other Channel member site(s)). Intel knows what I am doing and they like it (why shouldn't they). The sites in question are now available to all SSL compliant browsers. I asked the people at Intel regarding the certification of FreeBSD on its server boards. They asked me if I had any problems or our customers had any problems with FreeBSD and our servers. I said no. As it works perfectly. So what am I doing? Trying to promote FreeBSD as the great OS it is. I guess to people like Mr. Lehey I am wrong in doing so. I still think I am right. And sometimes those nice little super polite letters are looked at by the people in the know, and then forgotten. That route was tried and went no where. Thats when I wrote the "disgusting" one. It worked. I call it Victory. Regards, Lanny Baron http://freedomtc.com On Mon, 13 Nov 2000, opentrax@email.com in the last wild and more than...: > > >On 13 Nov, Lanny Baron wrote: >>...[Trimmed a bunch of stuff]... >> To the person at opentrax@email.com, I am sorry we must correspond >> in this hostile manner. I would like to know who you are, if you >> would consider that. >> >To know me is to love me. :-) > >Lanny, > Like you, I get upset when I see large corporations >and greedy individuals perpetrate poor busines practices. > > Your issue with Mr. Lehey, is not an issue with me. >Your opinion of Mr. Lehey, is yours; I may, or may not, agree. > > Currently, I'm the President of the >SVBUG (Silicon Valley *BSD User Group). My job is promote ALL >BSD's, including Apple's OS-X. In addition, I'm charged >as a liason from our company to *BSD. > > Our company builds servers. However, right now >we are in the middle of a reorganization. I can't show >anything until about Dec. 14, 2000 (Streaming Media West starts). >We build video server, rebroadcast servers, high-performance >web servers and soon high-peformance webring servers. > > My job includes listening to many people. Many who don't >have the time to read mail-lists, follow newsgroups or get >on IRC. Many of these people are good people. Some of these >people are really Linux Users, high in their community, >but unwilling to get in our fray. > > These people are willing to listen and follow. These people >tell me things; I report them to the *BSD-mailing-lists. > > I take your point (about M$/Intel) and appearances >lead me to beleive you are correct. > > However, if you read between the lines, you'll see >every response is now measured. Why? > > I burned much engery (in the early days) fighting >with everyone in *BSD. Just ask Jordan. I would consel(sp?) >you to do the same (measure your resonse). Sure you can fight, >if you want. I'm not going to stop you or even complain. > > However, if your points are correct about *BSD, there >are other means to about them. Means that will allow >you to win, be the hero and come out ahead. This choice >can only be made by you. > > best regards, > Jessem. > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 7:21:50 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from c014.sfo.cp.net (c014-h001.c014.sfo.cp.net [209.228.12.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 5D5BA37B4C5 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 07:21:47 -0800 (PST) Received: (cpmta 5418 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2000 07:21:46 -0800 Received: from m12hRs4n205.midsouth.rr.com (HELO mike) (24.95.125.205) by smtp.valuedata.net (209.228.12.65) with SMTP; 13 Nov 2000 07:21:46 -0800 X-Sent: 13 Nov 2000 15:21:46 GMT Message-ID: <00c701c04d85$737c77e0$0200000a@mike> From: "Daryl Chance" To: "Mike" Cc: References: <4.3.2.7.2.20001113185029.00b4d100@briz.net> <4.3.2.7.2.20001113210505.00bae6d0@briz.net> Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 09:21:52 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG maybe 1 more thing. Run a variety of apps easy to install perhaps 2 differnt frames? :) otherwise...its great. Plus all the others are great too :) Daryl ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike" To: "Lukas Ertl" Cc: Sent: Monday, November 13, 2000 5:09 AM Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? > > > > Any comments or suggestions are welcome. > > > >I like this one a lot. But, my 0.02 cents: > >one needs more time to read the text, so slow down the animation a little > >bit, "The Power to serve" is hard to read, at least on my screen, and I > >would change the font of the "Click here to get..." flashing > >text, ... maybe "FreeBSD is FREE" doesn't need three exclamation marks :-) > > > >But, apart from that, I really like it. > > Thanks for your thoughts. > > I've put up a modified version for any further chump change you might > have... :) > > [[ http://www.briz.net/mike/bnr-bsd-4.gif ]] > > Mike > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 7:29:54 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from homer.softweyr.com (bsdconspiracy.net [208.187.122.220]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02DA137B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 07:29:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=softweyr.com ident=Fools trust ident!) by homer.softweyr.com with esmtp (Exim 3.16 #1) id 13vLYf-0000QK-00; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 08:30:09 -0700 Message-ID: <3A100901.B4D7811@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 08:30:09 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.12 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: opentrax@email.com Cc: grog@lemis.com, lnb@FreeBSDsystems.COM, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: accessing portal site References: <200011130610.WAA05168@spammie.svbug.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG opentrax@email.com wrote: > > On 13 Nov, Greg Lehey wrote: > > On Sunday, 12 November 2000 at 20:18:57 -0500, Lanny Baron wrote: > > > >> In no way did I make any representation or link between myself and The > >> FreeBSD Project or any of its communities. > > > > By copying -advocacy, you implied exactly that. Please don't do it > > again. You're more than welcome to behave in whatever manner you see > > fit, but have the courtesy to not raise the impression that > > FreeBSD-advocacy is behind you. > > As I see this posting, this person is informing us of some > rather important information, which we might want to take note of. > The topic, while NOT belonging to 'advocacy', is of importance > to those who advocacte *BSD. Personally I can recount many > such stories, but this is not about me. That's what BCC: was invented for. Greg is exactly right in that publicly copying an address @freebsd.org implies some sort of complicity or agree- ment on the part of the FreeBSD project. I certainly did not agree with the tone of Lanny's original message. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC wes@softweyr.com http://softweyr.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 9:42:24 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from homer.softweyr.com (mail.dobox.com [208.187.122.44]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF23737B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 09:42:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=softweyr.com ident=Fools trust ident!) by homer.softweyr.com with esmtp (Exim 3.16 #1) id 13vNcX-00007s-00; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 10:42:17 -0700 Message-ID: <3A1027F9.81900EA3@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 10:42:17 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.12 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Lanny Baron Cc: Greg Lehey , opentrax@email.com, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, freedom@FreedomTC.COM Subject: Re: accessing portal site References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Lanny Baron wrote: > > Greg, what are you trying to do to me??? Are you trying to get people to > hate me? I have spent almost 1 year trying to make business plans for > Freedom Technologies Corporation, which exists, and sells FREEDOM > SERVERS with FreeBSD installed. No, he's just trying to get you to stop sending email that have the appearance of collusion with the FreeBSD Project. If you want to send a "heads up" to a FreeBSD mailing list, use BCC so the person or company you're sending the mail to will not misconstrue your message as coming from or being approved by the FreeBSD Project or the Advocacy group. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC wes@softweyr.com http://softweyr.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 10:27:20 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from nef.ens.fr (nef.ens.fr [129.199.96.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F3E3437B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 10:27:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from corto.lpt.ens.fr (corto.lpt.ens.fr [129.199.122.2]) by nef.ens.fr (8.10.1/1.01.28121999) with ESMTP id eADIR3H86835 ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 19:27:03 +0100 (CET) Received: from (rsidd@localhost) by corto.lpt.ens.fr (8.9.3/jtpda-5.3.1) id TAA21816 ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 19:27:02 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 19:27:02 +0100 From: Rahul Siddharthan To: Daryl Chance Cc: Mike , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? Message-ID: <20001113192702.D14936@lpt.ens.fr> References: <4.3.2.7.2.20001113185029.00b4d100@briz.net> <4.3.2.7.2.20001113210505.00bae6d0@briz.net> <00c701c04d85$737c77e0$0200000a@mike> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <00c701c04d85$737c77e0$0200000a@mike>; from dchance@valuedata.net on Mon, Nov 13, 2000 at 09:21:52AM -0600 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.4-STABLE i386 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG OK here's version 2 of mine, same place as earlier http://www.lpt.ens.fr/~rsidd/freebsd.gif Some colour and advertising slogans added, and existing writing enlarged. Rahul. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 10:34:23 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from c014.sfo.cp.net (c014-h017.c014.sfo.cp.net [209.228.12.81]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 9816837B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 10:34:21 -0800 (PST) Received: (cpmta 2921 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2000 10:31:41 -0800 Received: from m12hRs4n205.midsouth.rr.com (HELO mike) (24.95.125.205) by smtp.valuedata.net (209.228.12.81) with SMTP; 13 Nov 2000 10:31:41 -0800 X-Sent: 13 Nov 2000 18:31:41 GMT Message-ID: <008f01c01a83$cfae04a0$0200000a@mike> From: "Daryl Chance" To: "Rahul Siddharthan" Cc: "Mike" , References: <4.3.2.7.2.20001113185029.00b4d100@briz.net> <4.3.2.7.2.20001113210505.00bae6d0@briz.net> <00c701c04d85$737c77e0$0200000a@mike> <20001113192702.D14936@lpt.ens.fr> Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? Date: Sat, 9 Sep 2000 12:31:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG looks real nice :). One last thing. on the url, would you move it down just a hair? it almost looks like it's getting chopped off (ok, i'm being too nitpicky, sorry). Good Job, ----------------------------------------------------------------------- | Daryl Chance | We start seeing these new accounts being created, | | -------------- | but that could be an anomaly of the system. After | | Valuedata, LLC | a day or two, we realized it was someone hacking | | Memphis, TN | into the system. - Microsoft on thier hacker | ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rahul Siddharthan" To: "Daryl Chance" Cc: "Mike" ; Sent: Monday, November 13, 2000 1:27 PM Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? > OK here's version 2 of mine, same place as earlier > http://www.lpt.ens.fr/~rsidd/freebsd.gif > > Some colour and advertising slogans added, and existing writing enlarged. > > Rahul. > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 10:43:14 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from nef.ens.fr (nef.ens.fr [129.199.96.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75E0E37B4E5 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 10:43:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from corto.lpt.ens.fr (corto.lpt.ens.fr [129.199.122.2]) by nef.ens.fr (8.10.1/1.01.28121999) with ESMTP id eADIh7H88236 ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 19:43:07 +0100 (CET) Received: from (rsidd@localhost) by corto.lpt.ens.fr (8.9.3/jtpda-5.3.1) id TAA22367 ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 19:43:07 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 19:43:06 +0100 From: Rahul Siddharthan To: Daryl Chance Cc: Mike , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? Message-ID: <20001113194306.B21853@lpt.ens.fr> References: <4.3.2.7.2.20001113185029.00b4d100@briz.net> <4.3.2.7.2.20001113210505.00bae6d0@briz.net> <00c701c04d85$737c77e0$0200000a@mike> <20001113192702.D14936@lpt.ens.fr> <008f01c01a83$cfae04a0$0200000a@mike> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <008f01c01a83$cfae04a0$0200000a@mike>; from dchance@valuedata.net on Sat, Sep 09, 2000 at 12:31:38PM -0500 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.4-STABLE i386 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Daryl Chance said on Sep 9, 2000 at 12:31:38: > looks real nice :). Thanks > One last thing. on the url, would you move it down just a hair? it > almost looks like it's getting chopped off (ok, i'm being too nitpicky, > sorry). I could, quite easily, but it will have to be tomorrow... I'll wait for more comments meanwhile. Rahul. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 11: 4:56 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from exchange-bridge.epicor.com (mail.dataworks.com [63.64.20.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6726637B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 11:04:50 -0800 (PST) Received: by exchange-bridge.epicor.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 11:04:49 -0800 Message-ID: <454E2EA86391D21191830008C75D2EDC58F5A5@exchange-corp.epicor.com> From: Shanon Fernald To: "'advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG'" Cc: 'Rahul Siddharthan' Subject: RE: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF bann er? Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 11:04:46 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I would redo the white area containing the daemon and the computer. Lower it and maybe make it a round cartoon like oval or at least make it symmetric. I would also shrink the fonts down a little bit as they crowd the screen. the "." on the discover phrase is too close to the right hand edge of the screen. I would bring the url (www.freebsd.org) at the end of the animation down just ever so slightly. I would try to use consistent fonts throughout the animation and try to use the same size fonts for the descriptive text except for the last piece of text "freebsd" which is perfect. Finally I would shrink the lightening bolt down just a little bit and angle it so that it is exactly points between the center of the pitchfork and the monitor. Good work tho, overall! -----Original Message----- From: Rahul Siddharthan [mailto:rsidd@physics.iisc.ernet.in] Sent: Monday, November 13, 2000 10:43 AM To: Daryl Chance Cc: Mike; advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? Daryl Chance said on Sep 9, 2000 at 12:31:38: > looks real nice :). Thanks > One last thing. on the url, would you move it down just a hair? it > almost looks like it's getting chopped off (ok, i'm being too nitpicky, > sorry). I could, quite easily, but it will have to be tomorrow... I'll wait for more comments meanwhile. Rahul. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 17:58:47 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from spammie.svbug.com (mg136-070.ricochet.net [204.179.136.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55EDE37B681 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 17:58:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from spammie.svbug.com (localhost.mozie.org [127.0.0.1]) by spammie.svbug.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA06322; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 18:00:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jessem@spammie.svbug.com) Message-Id: <200011140200.SAA06322@spammie.svbug.com> Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 18:00:08 -0800 (PST) From: opentrax@email.com Reply-To: opentrax@email.com Subject: Re: accessing portal site To: lnb@FreeBSDsystems.COM Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 13 Nov, Lanny Baron wrote: > Hello Jessem, > >...[Trimmed].. > > I said no. As it works perfectly. So what am I doing? Trying to > promoteFreeBSD as the great OS it is. > > I guess to people like Mr. Lehey I am wrong in doing so. I still think I > am right. And sometimes those nice little super polite letters are looked > at by the people in the know, and then forgotten. > > That route was tried and went no where. Thats when I wrote the > "disgusting" one. It worked. I call it Victory. > I can argue with your results. And I'm not completely aware of your situation, neither an I aware of any of the steps you went throught. I'm sure there will be many people who are unaware of your effort, but will be helped directly by it. My notes were so that you might encounter less friction and work when trying to accomplish your tasks. Medociracy(sp?) and incompitance(sp?) are a normal part of our lives. We see these situations all the time. However, recently I've taken the tack to try to change people I'm directly in contact with, like the manage at Starbucks. Currently, this store does a great deal of busines, day and night. However, when this certain manager is on the entire business crawls. To say the least, this is frustrating to customers waiting in line. My goals is, now, is to make this manager change his ways. Make this starbucks more profitable. Make the customers happier. You may ask, What's in it for me? :-) Simple, if I can change this store and manager to be better for the community we all win. Personally, if I can accomplish this, it means that I have a good chance of running large organizations. In large organization, people rarely see their bosses; the guys that sign the checks. If I can influence some busines, without my direct involvement the skies the limit. In your case, I would consider setting my goals higher. Certainly, burning energy arguing with Mr. Lehey, et al. has it's benifits. However, I believe you can achieve better benifits by not arguing. More energy by not arguing, means more energy to do other things. Again, this is only a suggestion. best regards, Jessem. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 18: 2:37 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from spammie.svbug.com (mg136-070.ricochet.net [204.179.136.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F75C37B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 18:02:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from spammie.svbug.com (localhost.mozie.org [127.0.0.1]) by spammie.svbug.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA06326; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 18:04:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jessem@spammie.svbug.com) Message-Id: <200011140204.SAA06326@spammie.svbug.com> Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 18:04:10 -0800 (PST) From: opentrax@email.com Reply-To: opentrax@email.com Subject: Re: accessing portal site To: wes@softweyr.com Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <3A100901.B4D7811@softweyr.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 13 Nov, Wes Peters wrote: > opentrax@email.com wrote: >> >> On 13 Nov, Greg Lehey wrote: >> > On Sunday, 12 November 2000 at 20:18:57 -0500, Lanny Baron wrote: >> > >> >> In no way did I make any representation or link between myself and The >> >> FreeBSD Project or any of its communities. >> > >> > By copying -advocacy, you implied exactly that. Please don't do it >> > again. You're more than welcome to behave in whatever manner you see >> > fit, but have the courtesy to not raise the impression that >> > FreeBSD-advocacy is behind you. >> >> As I see this posting, this person is informing us of some >> rather important information, which we might want to take note of. >> The topic, while NOT belonging to 'advocacy', is of importance >> to those who advocacte *BSD. Personally I can recount many >> such stories, but this is not about me. > > That's what BCC: was invented for. Greg is exactly right in that publicly > copying an address @freebsd.org implies some sort of complicity or agree- > ment on the part of the FreeBSD project. I certainly did not agree with > the tone of Lanny's original message. > I think we agree that Lanny's message does not belong in 'advocacy'. We must ask then, How important is his information? Does it add to the longivity of *BSD? Can we benifit from his information? If we can benifit from his information, what should be done with it? Can I say we agree that his message does not belong in 'advocacy'? Jessem. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 19:20:41 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mss.rdc2.nsw.optushome.com.au (ha1.rdc2.nsw.optushome.com.au [203.164.2.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1667637B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 19:20:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from ellipsis.briz.net ([203.164.24.4]) by mss.rdc2.nsw.optushome.com.au (InterMail vM.4.01.03.00 201-229-121) with ESMTP id <20001114032036.UAQQ10244.mss.rdc2.nsw.optushome.com.au@ellipsis.briz.net> for ; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 14:20:36 +1100 Message-Id: <4.3.2.7.2.20001114131658.00bb6610@briz.net> X-Sender: soltan@briz.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.2 Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 13:20:36 +1000 To: Advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG From: Mike Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20001113185029.00b4d100@briz.net> References: <96873.973243644@winston.osd.bsdi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >>Offering the satisfaction of seeing your artwork in lights and >>the warm fuzzy glow that comes from helping to promote the FreeBSD cause. :-) At the risk of flooding the Advocacy list here is one more revision. [[ http://www.briz.net/mike/bnr-bsd-6.gif ]] Any comments or suggestions for alterations will be dealt with via private email. mike To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 19:22: 9 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mss.rdc2.nsw.optushome.com.au (ha1.rdc2.nsw.optushome.com.au [203.164.2.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E82737B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 19:22:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from ellipsis.briz.net ([203.164.24.4]) by mss.rdc2.nsw.optushome.com.au (InterMail vM.4.01.03.00 201-229-121) with ESMTP id <20001114032205.UAXL10244.mss.rdc2.nsw.optushome.com.au@ellipsis.briz.net>; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 14:22:05 +1100 Message-Id: <4.3.2.7.2.20001114130444.00b5b2f0@briz.net> X-Sender: soltan@briz.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.2 Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 13:07:00 +1000 To: "Daryl Chance" From: Mike Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <00c701c04d85$737c77e0$0200000a@mike> References: <4.3.2.7.2.20001113185029.00b4d100@briz.net> <4.3.2.7.2.20001113210505.00bae6d0@briz.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 09:21 AM 13/11/00 -0600, you wrote: >maybe 1 more thing. > >Run a variety of apps >easy to install > >perhaps 2 differnt frames? :) Ok just for you cause you're so special. [[ http://www.briz.net/mike/bnr-bsd-5.gif ]] >otherwise...its great. Plus all the others are great too :) Thanks or your critical enthusiasm! mike To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Nov 13 19:43:44 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from spammie.svbug.com (mg136-070.ricochet.net [204.179.136.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA6C237B479 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 19:43:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from spammie.svbug.com (localhost.mozie.org [127.0.0.1]) by spammie.svbug.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA06422; Mon, 13 Nov 2000 19:45:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jessem@spammie.svbug.com) Message-Id: <200011140345.TAA06422@spammie.svbug.com> Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 19:45:49 -0800 (PST) From: opentrax@email.com Reply-To: opentrax@email.com Subject: Re: accessing portal site To: wes@softweyr.com Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <3A1027F9.81900EA3@softweyr.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [I'm trimming the CC line. .. In the interest of sanity. :=) ] On 13 Nov, Wes Peters wrote: > Lanny Baron wrote: >> >>...[More triming]... > > No, he's just trying to get you to stop sending email that have the appearance > of collusion with the FreeBSD Project. If you want to send a "heads up" to > a FreeBSD mailing list, use BCC so the person or company you're sending the > mail to will not misconstrue your message as coming from or being approved by > the FreeBSD Project or the Advocacy group. > I appoligize, Wes, but I must concur with Lanny. Not that his behaviour is warrented, but he has valuable(sp?) and at this point it looks like we are only helping M$ by this arguement amoung us. I can take as much blame as anyone for extending this thread. However, the point remains - He has valuable information. And rather than accept it, we are shooting the messenger (along with his envelope). My point is that such information needs a medium. Where should the medium be? Jessem. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Nov 14 9: 0:10 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from smtp04.primenet.com (smtp04.primenet.com [206.165.6.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A24437B4C5 for ; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 09:00:06 -0800 (PST) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp04.primenet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA13321; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 09:56:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from usr08.primenet.com(206.165.6.208) via SMTP by smtp04.primenet.com, id smtpdAAAR0aONz; Tue Nov 14 09:56:11 2000 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA21802; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 09:59:33 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <200011141659.JAA21802@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: accessing portal site To: wes@softweyr.com (Wes Peters) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 16:59:33 +0000 (GMT) Cc: lnb@FreeBSDsystems.COM (Lanny Baron), grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey), opentrax@email.com, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, freedom@FreedomTC.COM In-Reply-To: <3A1027F9.81900EA3@softweyr.com> from "Wes Peters" at Nov 13, 2000 10:42:17 AM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > Greg, what are you trying to do to me??? Are you trying to get people to > > hate me? I have spent almost 1 year trying to make business plans for > > Freedom Technologies Corporation, which exists, and sells FREEDOM > > SERVERS with FreeBSD installed. > > No, he's just trying to get you to stop sending email that have the appearance > of collusion with the FreeBSD Project. If you want to send a "heads up" to > a FreeBSD mailing list, use BCC so the person or company you're sending the > mail to will not misconstrue your message as coming from or being approved by > the FreeBSD Project or the Advocacy group. I always see these types of postings from the corporate perspective as a threat of a "call to arms" to mobilize a large group of some unknown vitriolic bent. As such, seeing the Cc: can be an incredibly effective tool, if it is used correctly. That said, I suspect that if there is intent to use the advocacy address as a truncheon to get your way, that it would be best if it were a padded truncheon: polite, with no rancor. I rather expect that Intel reacted as it did to avoid getting "slashdotted" by a bunch of advocacy lunatics (promptly, and with a higher level than might otherwise be expected management response, and with rapidly implemented changes to the site, not just "lip service"). I personally have no objection to the list being used as a mild threat/lever in order to get a result that one might not otherwise be able to get, using simply a private note to the webmaster, who probably gets hundreds of such things each day, and files them in his/her /dev/null folder. But next time, let's pad that whiffle-bat. PS: Setting a "Reply-To:" would take care of most of the concerns about them getting SPAMmed with a bunch of responses in the context of a list. Probably a better idea would be a list whose sole intent is to be used as a lever with vendors, but that would probably not be approved by The Powers That Be, for the same reasons they object to using advocacy that way in the first place. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Nov 14 9:36:59 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from satan.freebsdsystems.com (unknown [24.69.168.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8438337B4FE for ; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 09:36:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from satan.freebsdsystems.com (satan.freebsdsystems.com [24.69.168.5]) by satan.freebsdsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.0) with ESMTP id eAEHaKv64348; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 12:36:20 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 12:36:20 -0500 (EST) From: Lanny Baron To: Terry Lambert Cc: Wes Peters , Greg Lehey , opentrax@email.com, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, freedom@FreedomTC.COM Subject: Re: enough already -->accessing portal site In-Reply-To: <200011141659.JAA21802@usr08.primenet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello, For the last and final time, the reason for sending the mail with the word "disgusting" to Intel, was that to me, it was disgusting that it appeard that Intel had gone the M$ way in terms of accessing M$'s site(s). I had told numerous call centers about the problem with the inabilatiy to access sites within Intel. None of the other mail was cc'd to advocacy. It was the last mail, in which "disgusting" was used (and I still maintain it was used rightly, and was warranted) and cc'd to advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, that I had only .. underline ONLY, had the intent of showing the advocacy community that as a commited person in the sense of using FreeBSD as the focal point of our business, that people on the list would see someone taking an active role in getting the site at Intel to be able to be used by other browsers and for people like myself who will not be forced to use I.E. The next step is to try to get audio/video software makers to make code for FreeBSD so that courses offered by various companies such as, Intel's certification programs, do not have to use Windows to use online learning tracks. Please end this constant mailing about the portal site. It's a shame that one cannot be like a top notch lawyer (very strong in cross examination) and then cc it to advocacy. Once again, I did not occur to me that my mail would construe to anyone that I was trying to get Intel to think that they would receive tons of mail from the FreeBSD community. Lanny On Tue, 14 Nov 2000, Terry Lambert in the last wild and more than exciting...: > > Greg, what are you trying to do to me??? Are you trying to get people to > > hate me? I have spent almost 1 year trying to make business plans for > > Freedom Technologies Corporation, which exists, and sells FREEDOM > > SERVERS with FreeBSD installed. > > No, he's just trying to get you to stop sending email that have the appearance > of collusion with the FreeBSD Project. If you want to send a "heads up" to > a FreeBSD mailing list, use BCC so the person or company you're sending the > mail to will not misconstrue your message as coming from or being approved by > the FreeBSD Project or the Advocacy group. I always see these types of postings from the corporate perspective as a threat of a "call to arms" to mobilize a large group of some unknown vitriolic bent. As such, seeing the Cc: can be an incredibly effective tool, if it is used correctly. That said, I suspect that if there is intent to use the advocacy address as a truncheon to get your way, that it would be best if it were a padded truncheon: polite, with no rancor. I rather expect that Intel reacted as it did to avoid getting "slashdotted" by a bunch of advocacy lunatics (promptly, and with a higher level than might otherwise be expected management response, and with rapidly implemented changes to the site, not just "lip service"). I personally have no objection to the list being used as a mild threat/lever in order to get a result that one might not otherwise be able to get, using simply a private note to the webmaster, who probably gets hundreds of such things each day, and files them in his/her /dev/null folder. But next time, let's pad that whiffle-bat. PS: Setting a "Reply-To:" would take care of most of the concerns about them getting SPAMmed with a bunch of responses in the context of a list. Probably a better idea would be a list whose sole intent is to be used as a lever with vendors, but that would probably not be approved by The Powers That Be, for the same reasons they object to using advocacy that way in the first place. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Nov 14 15:16:16 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from peloton.runet.edu (peloton.runet.edu [137.45.96.205]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 570DC37B4C5 for ; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 15:16:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (brett@localhost) by peloton.runet.edu (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id eAENFmZ05395; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 18:15:48 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from brett@peloton.runet.edu) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 18:15:47 -0500 (EST) From: Brett Taylor To: Mike Cc: Advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20001114131658.00bb6610@briz.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi Mike, On Tue, 14 Nov 2000, Mike wrote: > [[ http://www.briz.net/mike/bnr-bsd-6.gif ]] I really like this one - clear text, easy to read, and not too many frames flashing by (ie, each is up long enough to read comfortably). Very nice. Brett ***************************************************** Dr. Brett Taylor brett@peloton.runet.edu * Dept of Chem and Physics * Curie 39A (540) 831-6147 * Dept. of Mathematics and Statistics * Walker 234 (540) 831-5410 * ***************************************************** To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Nov 14 15:35:39 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from winston.osd.bsdi.com (winston.osd.bsdi.com [204.216.27.229]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CDC6837B4C5 for ; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 15:35:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from winston.osd.bsdi.com (jkh@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by winston.osd.bsdi.com (8.11.1/8.9.3) with ESMTP id eAENYsI41868; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 15:34:58 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@winston.osd.bsdi.com) To: Brett Taylor Cc: Mike , Advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? In-Reply-To: Message from Brett Taylor of "Tue, 14 Nov 2000 18:15:47 EST." Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 15:34:54 -0800 Message-ID: <41865.974244894@winston.osd.bsdi.com> From: Jordan Hubbard Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I like this one quite a bit as well - I think we should go with it! - Jordan > Hi Mike, > > On Tue, 14 Nov 2000, Mike wrote: > > > [[ http://www.briz.net/mike/bnr-bsd-6.gif ]] > > I really like this one - clear text, easy to read, and not too many frames > flashing by (ie, each is up long enough to read comfortably). > > Very nice. > > Brett > ***************************************************** > Dr. Brett Taylor brett@peloton.runet.edu * > Dept of Chem and Physics * > Curie 39A (540) 831-6147 * > Dept. of Mathematics and Statistics * > Walker 234 (540) 831-5410 * > ***************************************************** > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Nov 14 16:58:47 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from homer.softweyr.com (mail.dobox.com [208.187.122.44]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B05A737B4C5 for ; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 16:58:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=softweyr.com ident=Fools trust ident!) by homer.softweyr.com with esmtp (Exim 3.16 #1) id 13vqvp-000KMs-00; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 18:00:09 -0700 Message-ID: <3A11E019.2129CAA5@softweyr.com> Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 18:00:09 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.12 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: opentrax@email.com Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: accessing portal site References: <200011140345.TAA06422@spammie.svbug.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG opentrax@email.com wrote: > > [I'm trimming the CC line. .. In the interest of sanity. :=) ] > > On 13 Nov, Wes Peters wrote: > > Lanny Baron wrote: > >> > >>...[More triming]... > > > > No, he's just trying to get you to stop sending email that have the appearance > > of collusion with the FreeBSD Project. If you want to send a "heads up" to > > a FreeBSD mailing list, use BCC so the person or company you're sending the > > mail to will not misconstrue your message as coming from or being approved by > > the FreeBSD Project or the Advocacy group. > > > I appoligize, Wes, but I must concur with Lanny. > Not that his behaviour is warrented, but he has valuable(sp?) > and at this point it looks like we are only helping M$ by > this arguement amoung us. I can take as much blame as anyone > for extending this thread. I did not say he was wrong to chide Intel for their short-sighted web site, only that he was wrong to do so and involve FreeBSD in it. If he wants to advocate FreeBSD, that's fine. If he wants to tell Intel they suck giant lizard eggs, that's his right. To involve the FreeBSD Project in it without their collective permission is NOT right. I also patiently explained how he could still provide such information to this forum if, as he stated, he merely wanted to inform us that the situation existed. This will allow him to do so without any extra work, except perhaps typing that extra 'B' character. I did act on Lanny's message. I called a friend at Intel, who works with Linux, and pointed them at the web page Lanny referred to. He entered a bug report against the entire site, since he couldn't view it with Linux Netscape, which is a corporate standard at Intel these days. I still don't agree with the tone of Lanny's message, it was rude and condescending, but he has the right to be rude and condescending if he wants. He does NOT have the right to be rude and condescending on behalf of FreeBSD, you can object all you want, agree with him all you want, it will still not make it right. > However, the point remains - He has valuable information. > And rather than accept it, we are shooting the messenger > (along with his envelope). My point is that such information > needs a medium. Where should the medium be? Does it really now? Will his message make the least little bit of difference? That remains to be seen. No message needs a "medium" so desperately that the tone and content don't matter. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC wes@softweyr.com http://softweyr.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Nov 14 17:53:38 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from smtp1.sentex.ca (smtp1.sentex.ca [199.212.134.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1BA537B4CF for ; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 17:53:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from chimp.simianscience.com (cage.simianscience.com [64.7.134.1]) by smtp1.sentex.ca (8.11.0/8.11.0) with SMTP id eAF1r2B87034; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 20:53:02 -0500 (EST) From: Mike Tancsa To: mike@briz.net (Mike) Cc: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 20:53:02 -0500 Message-ID: <20r31tsfv1o609h3var11rtiscpfovnuv0@4ax.com> References: <4.3.2.7.2.20001113185029.00b4d100@briz.net> <4.3.2.7.2.20001113210505.00bae6d0@briz.net> In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 13 Nov 2000 22:22:15 -0500, in sentex.lists.freebsd.advocacy you = wrote: >At 09:21 AM 13/11/00 -0600, you wrote: >>maybe 1 more thing. >> >>Run a variety of apps >>easy to install >> What about an extra frame after the, "Cutting edge features..." "Without getting cut on the bleeding edge" or something similar to that to emphasize stability ? ---Mike Mike Tancsa (mdtancsa@sentex.net) =09 Sentex Communications Corp, =09 Waterloo, Ontario, Canada "Given enough time, 100 monkeys on 100 routers=20 could setup a national IP network." (KDW2) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Nov 14 18:33:46 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from pike.osd.bsdi.com (pike.osd.bsdi.com [204.216.28.222]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF62F37B4CF for ; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 18:33:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from laptop.baldwin.cx (john@jhb-laptop.osd.bsdi.com [204.216.28.241]) by pike.osd.bsdi.com (8.11.0/8.9.3) with ESMTP id eAF2XWB08280; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 18:33:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jhb@FreeBSD.org) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.4.0 on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <41865.974244894@winston.osd.bsdi.com> Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 18:34:03 -0800 (PST) From: John Baldwin To: Jordan Hubbard Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banne Cc: Advocacy@FreeBSD.org, Mike , Brett Taylor Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 14-Nov-00 Jordan Hubbard wrote: > I like this one quite a bit as well - I think we should go with it! It is the best of the ones I've seen so far on the list.. > - Jordan > >> Hi Mike, >> >> On Tue, 14 Nov 2000, Mike wrote: >> >> > [[ http://www.briz.net/mike/bnr-bsd-6.gif ]] >> >> I really like this one - clear text, easy to read, and not too many frames >> flashing by (ie, each is up long enough to read comfortably). >> >> Very nice. >> >> Brett -- John Baldwin -- http://www.FreeBSD.org/~jhb/ PGP Key: http://www.baldwin.cx/~john/pgpkey.asc "Power Users Use the Power to Serve!" - http://www.FreeBSD.org/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Thu Nov 16 2:35:36 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0AF837B4D7; Thu, 16 Nov 2000 02:35:32 -0800 (PST) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA03947; Thu, 16 Nov 2000 11:35:28 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from des@ofug.org) X-URL: http://www.ofug.org/~des/ X-Disclaimer: The views expressed in this message do not necessarily coincide with those of any organisation or company with which I am or have been affiliated. To: chat@freebsd.org Cc: advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: Good BSD press in feedmag From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 16 Nov 2000 11:35:27 +0100 Message-ID: Lines: 12 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0802 (Gnus v5.8.2) Emacs/20.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "The underground's latest heroes are the directors of software projects based on 4.4 BSD Lite, the free operating system pioneered at the University of California at Berkeley in the late 1970s. The gratis software churned out by projects like FreeBSD and OpenBSD is inarguably superior to most mainstream Linux distributions, both in terms of security and portability." DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@ofug.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Thu Nov 16 14:41:19 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from homer.softweyr.com (mail.dobox.com [208.187.122.44]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4DC6A37B479 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 2000 14:41:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=softweyr.com ident=Fools trust ident!) by homer.softweyr.com with esmtp (Exim 3.16 #1) id 13wXif-00007t-00; Thu, 16 Nov 2000 15:41:25 -0700 Message-ID: <3A146295.BF13E32B@softweyr.com> Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 15:41:25 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.12 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Terry Lambert Cc: Lanny Baron , Greg Lehey , opentrax@email.com, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, freedom@FreedomTC.COM Subject: Re: accessing portal site References: <200011141659.JAA21802@usr08.primenet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Terry Lambert wrote: > > > > Greg, what are you trying to do to me??? Are you trying to get people to > > > hate me? I have spent almost 1 year trying to make business plans for > > > Freedom Technologies Corporation, which exists, and sells FREEDOM > > > SERVERS with FreeBSD installed. > > > > No, he's just trying to get you to stop sending email that have the appearance > > of collusion with the FreeBSD Project. If you want to send a "heads up" to > > a FreeBSD mailing list, use BCC so the person or company you're sending the > > mail to will not misconstrue your message as coming from or being approved by > > the FreeBSD Project or the Advocacy group. > > I always see these types of postings from the corporate perspective > as a threat of a "call to arms" to mobilize a large group of some > unknown vitriolic bent. > > As such, seeing the Cc: can be an incredibly effective tool, if it > is used correctly. > > That said, I suspect that if there is intent to use the advocacy > address as a truncheon to get your way, that it would be best if it > were a padded truncheon: polite, with no rancor. Precisely my point. As you well know, I'm not the most polite person in the world, but I certain take care to use careful language when speaking on behalf of others. I advise the same approach for everyone here. If this makes us timid to say anything, so be it. It's hard to justify some of the harsh language used in public over something so trivial as a misguided website that only accepts browser X. It should suffice to tell them "I cannot buy your products because I cannot view your web pages with browser Y." If they want you to buy their products, they will rectify the situation; if they don't, you didn't want to have them as a supplier anyhow. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC wes@softweyr.com http://softweyr.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Thu Nov 16 17:20: 9 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from homer.softweyr.com (mail.dobox.com [208.187.122.44]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59DAE37B479 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 2000 17:20:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=softweyr.com ident=Fools trust ident!) by homer.softweyr.com with esmtp (Exim 3.16 #1) id 13waDh-0000AX-00; Thu, 16 Nov 2000 18:21:37 -0700 Message-ID: <3A148821.A51776DE@softweyr.com> Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 18:21:37 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.12 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Brett Taylor Cc: Mike , Advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Any artists interested in doing a FreeBSD animated GIF banner? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Brett Taylor wrote: > > Hi Mike, > > On Tue, 14 Nov 2000, Mike wrote: > > > [[ http://www.briz.net/mike/bnr-bsd-6.gif ]] > > I really like this one - clear text, easy to read, and not too many frames > flashing by (ie, each is up long enough to read comfortably). Except it still doesn't have beastie doing the Macarena. That would be cool. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC wes@softweyr.com http://softweyr.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message