From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Sun May 8 04:29:40 2005 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB12816A4E2 for ; Sun, 8 May 2005 04:29:39 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zproxy.gmail.com (zproxy.gmail.com [64.233.162.192]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25ECA43D8E for ; Sun, 8 May 2005 04:29:39 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from tomasq@gmail.com) Received: by zproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 34so1375784nzf for ; Sat, 07 May 2005 21:29:38 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=O3Ppx5rF2UEGh8zaqzXXXN9ZxdC7P1Ev9GVK2dk3tJm4ZgacpDohvllRF0qIj/evoctzEdP5iiEYAnctO8a7yYmKcaqR3Q6UXq7OZa5eG52rfD9c8Gq0Eq+MX/AAymh9iIpZmwXDME/isgvbTn37iY+/MUhgLNtWmhvu3HLr+KI= Received: by 10.36.3.16 with SMTP id 16mr963379nzc; Sat, 07 May 2005 21:29:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.36.2.19 with HTTP; Sat, 7 May 2005 21:29:38 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <9e46c99e0505072129490fb077@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 00:29:38 -0400 From: Tomas Quintero To: Fafa Hafiz Krantz In-Reply-To: <20050507112421.BAA854BEAD@ws1-1.us4.outblaze.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline References: <20050507112421.BAA854BEAD@ws1-1.us4.outblaze.com> cc: advocacy@freebsd.org cc: questions@freebsd.org cc: "Julian H. Stacey" Subject: Re: Want a logo competition? Do it properly. X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Tomas Quintero List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 May 2005 04:29:40 -0000 I really must say that Fafa is a useless troll. He requests his name not be on any mailing lists, yet acknowledges that it infact isn't even his/her name, and continues to mail the lists. Topposting hurray. On 5/7/05, Fafa Hafiz Krantz wrote: >=20 > > I recall hearing of an announcement to comitters list that they'd get a= vote. > > - though that's not on http://logo-contest.freebsd.org/announce.txt >=20 > Now we are talking :) >=20 > > > They've certainly earned it. > > > > Yes. >=20 > Uhuh! Ain't nothing wrong with that. >=20 > -- >=20 > Fafa Hafiz Krantz > Research Designer @ http://www.home.no/barbershop > Enlightened @ http://www.home.no/barbershop/smart/sharon.pdf >=20 > -- > ___________________________________________________________ > Sign-up for Ads Free at Mail.com > http://promo.mail.com/adsfreejump.htm >=20 > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.o= rg" >=20 --=20 -Tomas Quintero From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Sun May 8 10:14:15 2005 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 99C1616A4E1 for ; Sun, 8 May 2005 10:14:15 +0000 (GMT) Received: from webmail-outgoing.us4.outblaze.com (webmail-outgoing.us4.outblaze.com [205.158.62.67]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 667A243D5C for ; Sun, 8 May 2005 10:14:15 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from fteg@london.com) Received: from unknown (unknown [192.168.9.180])5BF141800136 for ; Sun, 8 May 2005 10:14:15 +0000 (GMT) X-OB-Received: from unknown (205.158.62.49) by wfilter.us4.outblaze.com; 8 May 2005 10:14:15 -0000 Received: by ws1-1.us4.outblaze.com (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 478604BEAD; Sun, 8 May 2005 10:14:15 +0000 (GMT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: from [213.187.181.70] by ws1-1.us4.outblaze.com with http for fteg@london.com; Sun, 08 May 2005 05:14:15 -0500 From: "Fafa Hafiz Krantz" To: "Tomas Quintero" Date: Sun, 08 May 2005 05:14:15 -0500 X-Originating-Ip: 213.187.181.70 X-Originating-Server: ws1-1.us4.outblaze.com Message-Id: <20050508101415.478604BEAD@ws1-1.us4.outblaze.com> cc: advocacy@freebsd.org cc: questions@freebsd.org cc: "Julian H. Stacey" Subject: Re: Want a logo competition? Do it properly. X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 May 2005 10:14:15 -0000 > I really must say that Fafa is a useless troll. Is the point of your rudeness towards me, whatever person I am, of any more use to the FreeBSD community? <0> You're a troll! <1> No you're a troll! <0> No you! <1> NO! > He requests his name not be on any mailing lists, yet acknowledges > that it infact isn't even his/her name, and continues to mail the > lists. I asked for advice on how to clear names off mailinglists. Not my own name, be it Fafa or be it Afaf, but the name of someone I know who has been threatened by triads. The only response I've gotten on that subject (THIS AIN'T IT, SO WHY ARE YOU INTERMIXING YOU LITTLE *) is: you shold have been aware. Oh well. -- Fafa Hafiz Krantz Research Designer @ http://www.home.no/barbershop Enlightened @ http://www.home.no/barbershop/smart/sharon.pdf --=20 ___________________________________________________________ Sign-up for Ads Free at Mail.com http://promo.mail.com/adsfreejump.htm From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Mon May 9 15:52:48 2005 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0419A16A4E8 for ; Mon, 9 May 2005 15:52:48 +0000 (GMT) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.205]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 516A343D8F for ; Mon, 9 May 2005 15:52:47 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from bschonhorst@gmail.com) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 69so1579222wri for ; Mon, 09 May 2005 08:52:46 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=NzNkwiNzZm+0ym6THT1cZT23QS9Fog+aXpifCKWeUxOiCiLULXWyfjpxp0qZFnYWAdcFNlXcMtFbhlhMCekBq3eB04X3dCh8Q4ClH2InymkHiIlJxuScdiH0NAXwD7dVkSac7gdR6Tz/wxA6ZRmmhQDjGE7LnFmAfrR2eTFwVrM= Received: by 10.54.11.42 with SMTP id 42mr2633408wrk; Mon, 09 May 2005 08:52:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.54.2.16 with HTTP; Mon, 9 May 2005 08:52:46 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <7708fd6805050908526a679832@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 11:52:46 -0400 From: Brad Schonhorst To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Subject: NYC*BUG Announces BSDTracker Database X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Brad Schonhorst List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 May 2005 15:52:48 -0000 NYC*BUG Announces BSDTracker Database The New York City *BSD User Group (NYC*BUG) is pleased to announce the BSDTracker Database. The BSDTracker includes both a database of Users and *BSD Resources. The Resources database is for firms that provide technical services or support for the *BSD operating systems. This is a great resource for people in need of BSD consulting and services.=20 The online application can be found on the NYC*BUG website: http://nycbug.org/index.php?NAV=3DBSDTracker The goal of the database is to help promote the use and awareness of the *BSDs, giving those who use, promote or develop the BSDs, another opportunity to get their name out as supporters. Compiling a list of businesses that use BSD will bring more credibility to the BSDs and help support decisions to switch by companies that may be considering it. If your business supports or makes use of *BSD in some way, please take a moment to submit your information. From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Mon May 9 17:08:57 2005 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7885F16A4EC for ; Mon, 9 May 2005 17:08:57 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ylpvm15.prodigy.net (ylpvm15-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.46]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E724F43D9D for ; Mon, 9 May 2005 17:08:56 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from badanov@hard-log.com) Received: from pimout2-ext.prodigy.net (pimout2-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.101])j49H57DE006375 for ; Mon, 9 May 2005 13:05:08 -0400 X-ORBL: [70.240.48.99] Received: from hard-log.com (adsl-70-240-48-99.dsl.okcyok.swbell.net [70.240.48.99])j49H8omd343240 for ; Mon, 9 May 2005 13:08:54 -0400 Message-ID: <427F9A48.8050306@hard-log.com> Date: Mon, 09 May 2005 12:13:44 -0500 From: Chris User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.9) Gecko/20020408 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org References: <20050508120028.CA8DA16A4E3@hub.freebsd.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: New to the list -- Hiya X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 May 2005 17:08:57 -0000 Looks like I happened smooth up into a pissing match. About the logo contest: are they really gonna change it? I kinda like the daemon logo myself. Chris Covert From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Mon May 9 17:32:47 2005 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F5B016A4EA for ; Mon, 9 May 2005 17:32:47 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zeus.acuson.com (ac17860.acuson.com [157.226.71.80]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA6D143D8B for ; Mon, 9 May 2005 17:32:46 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from davidjohnson@siemens.com) Received: from mvwcim1a.acuson.com ([157.226.95.42]:2804 helo=mvwcim1a.ww005.siemens.net) by zeus.acuson.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1DVC7Z-0001Dt-3U; Mon, 09 May 2005 10:32:45 -0700 Received: by mvwcim1a.ww005.siemens.net with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 9 May 2005 10:32:44 -0700 Message-ID: <6F2F8FD3FBCF7A489CB18912A4807EBA0E078B@mvwcim1a.ww005.siemens.net> From: Johnson David To: 'Chris' , freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 10:32:41 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: RE: New to the list -- Hiya X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 May 2005 17:32:47 -0000 From: Chris [mailto:badanov@hard-log.com] > About the logo contest: are they really gonna change it? > I kinda like the daemon logo myself. The daemon (Beastie) isn't a logo, he's a mascot. He is not going away. One of the rules for the logo is that it can be used with Beastie. There's also no requirement to use the new logo if you don't happen to like it. David From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Mon May 9 19:37:38 2005 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C3D4B16A4EA for ; Mon, 9 May 2005 19:37:38 +0000 (GMT) Received: from tomts43-srv.bellnexxia.net (tomts43-srv.bellnexxia.net [209.226.175.110]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 047B943D68 for ; Mon, 9 May 2005 19:37:38 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from dlavigne6@sympatico.ca) Received: from [192.168.2.99] ([67.68.18.63]) by tomts43-srv.bellnexxia.net ESMTP <20050509193737.JIHO2981.tomts43-srv.bellnexxia.net@[192.168.2.99]>; Mon, 9 May 2005 15:37:37 -0400 Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 15:38:54 -0400 (EDT) From: Dru X-X-Sender: dlavigne6@dru.domain.org To: Brad Schonhorst In-Reply-To: <7708fd6805050908526a679832@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050509153839.J596@dru.domain.org> References: <7708fd6805050908526a679832@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed cc: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: Re: NYC*BUG Announces BSDTracker Database X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 May 2005 19:37:38 -0000 Excellent work. I blogged it here: http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/7041 Dru From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Mon May 9 20:07:40 2005 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 87AE616A4EA for ; Mon, 9 May 2005 20:07:40 +0000 (GMT) Received: from cicero0.cybercity.dk (cicero0.cybercity.dk [212.242.40.52]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C77D843D78 for ; Mon, 9 May 2005 20:07:39 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from jwl@io.dk) Received: from user1.cybercity.dk (user1.cybercity.dk [212.242.41.34]) by cicero0.cybercity.dk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2486C2976E for ; Mon, 9 May 2005 22:07:38 +0200 (CEST) Received: from gentoo (0x5551206f.adsl.cybercity.dk [85.81.32.111]) by user1.cybercity.dk (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5F6874FDEB for ; Mon, 9 May 2005 22:07:37 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 22:07:37 +0200 From: "Jeppe W. Larsen" To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20050509200737.GA18593@gentoo> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.8i Subject: is this your culture? X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 May 2005 20:07:40 -0000 Hi there I am writing as a representive for myself and the rest of my group of students at CBS (Copenhagen Business School). We are writing a larger project of the FreeBSD culture and have now come to a point in our analysis, where we are supposed to reveal our "conclusions" to the organisation we have researched, and then see how they respond to that. So thats it! They might seem a bit obvious and commonplace, but just say how well and correct they seem to you. It should be said that I have translated them from danish into english, and therefore something might seem a little weird, but I hope it is understandable. That we use "We" in our statements should be understand as "the FreeBSD organisation" and not "we" as in my group. Behind these statements we have a lot of other data describeing your culture. These are just the "short conclusions", so anything you might think of as part of the culture, should hopefully lay beneath these statements in some way. Thanks for your co-operation :-) -If you want to be seen and get status, you have to show what you are good at -We are the helpfull faceless people -In the end, it is the code that matters most -We want to share our knowledge with others -We control each other regarding to a set of norms, standards and guidelines -Wisdom and truth is defined by the experienced members Regards, Jeppe W. Larsen From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Tue May 10 06:43:18 2005 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9211E16A4EF for ; Tue, 10 May 2005 06:43:18 +0000 (GMT) Received: from mail.bitfreak.org (mail.bitfreak.org [65.75.198.146]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1BC0343D48 for ; Tue, 10 May 2005 06:43:18 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from dmp@bitfreak.org) Received: from Sonomago (mail.bitfreak.org [65.75.198.146]) by mail.bitfreak.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4EE5619F3B; Mon, 9 May 2005 23:43:46 -0700 (PDT) From: "Darren Pilgrim" To: "'Jeppe W. Larsen'" , Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 23:43:04 -0700 Message-ID: <000001c5552b$87ef5190$0a2a15ac@Sonomago> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 In-Reply-To: <20050509200737.GA18593@gentoo> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2527 Subject: RE: is this your culture? X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 06:43:18 -0000 My comments are inline to make it a bit easier to see which point I'm addressing. Jeppe W. Larsen wrote: >=20 > -If you want to be seen and get status, you have to show what you are > good at I think a better way of putting it would be, "you have to make valuable contributions to the project." > -In the end, it is the code that matters most I think it would be better to say that the ultimate goal is fast, highly standards-compliant, well-engineered code. There's a significant = emphasis on proper engineering and implementation in this project that is = dangerously lacking in most open- and closed-source software. > -Wisdom and truth is defined by the experienced members Wisdom and truth are defined by the experience of ALL members. Even a newbie can provide valuable information. From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Tue May 10 07:50:31 2005 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5FF7F16A4F0 for ; Tue, 10 May 2005 07:50:31 +0000 (GMT) Received: from rambo.401.cx (rambo.401.cx [80.65.205.166]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9833543D46 for ; Tue, 10 May 2005 07:50:28 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from listsub@401.cx) Received: from [10.3.101.26] (132.dairy.twenty4help.se [80.65.195.132]) by rambo.401.cx (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j4A7oQui063249; Tue, 10 May 2005 09:50:26 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from listsub@401.cx) Message-ID: <428067BD.4000104@401.cx> Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 09:50:21 +0200 From: "Roger 'Rocky' Vetterberg" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Windows/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Jeppe W. Larsen" References: <20050509200737.GA18593@gentoo> In-Reply-To: <20050509200737.GA18593@gentoo> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit cc: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: Re: is this your culture? X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 07:50:31 -0000 Jeppe W. Larsen wrote: > Hi there *snip* > > -If you want to be seen and get status, you have to show what you are > good at Change that to 'you have to contribute to the project' > -We are the helpfull faceless people > -In the end, it is the code that matters most Not just code, the quality of the code also matters a great deal. I for one value ten lines of good code higher then hundred lines of bad code. Anyone can write code, but it takes atleast some skill to write high quality code. FreeBSD, as well as the BSD's in general, have always been known for high quality, standards compliant code. > -We want to share our knowledge with others > -We control each other regarding to a set of norms, standards and > guidelines > -Wisdom and truth is defined by the experienced members > > Regards, > Jeppe W. Larsen > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-advocacy-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Tue May 10 16:53:50 2005 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB22016A540 for ; Tue, 10 May 2005 16:53:50 +0000 (GMT) Received: from server.nsurl.com (nsurl.com [69.50.196.120]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E70F43D48 for ; Tue, 10 May 2005 16:53:50 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from ac@miensk.com) Received: from [195.50.4.174] (helo=[192.168.100.13]) by server.nsurl.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.44) id 1DVXzP-00027z-9D for freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org; Tue, 10 May 2005 09:53:48 -0700 Message-ID: <4280E8D1.4030009@miensk.com> Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 20:01:05 +0300 From: ac User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.5) Gecko/20041217 MultiZilla/1.6.4.0b X-Accept-Language: be, en, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org References: <7708fd6805050908526a679832@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <7708fd6805050908526a679832@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-PopBeforeSMTPSenders: ac@miensk.com X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - server.nsurl.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - freebsd.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - miensk.com X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: Subject: Re: NYC*BUG Announces BSDTracker Database X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 16:53:50 -0000 Is it for NY-ers only, for Americans only, or for planet Earth only ;) ? Brad Schonhorst wrote: >NYC*BUG Announces BSDTracker Database > >The New York City *BSD User Group (NYC*BUG) is pleased to announce the >BSDTracker Database. The BSDTracker includes both a database of Users >and *BSD Resources. The Resources database is for firms that provide >technical services or support for the *BSD operating systems. This is >a great resource for people in need of BSD consulting and services. >The online application can be found on the NYC*BUG website: >http://nycbug.org/index.php?NAV=BSDTracker > >The goal of the database is to help promote the use and awareness of >the *BSDs, giving those who use, promote or develop the BSDs, another >opportunity to get their name out as supporters. Compiling a list of >businesses that use BSD will bring more credibility to the BSDs and >help support decisions to switch by companies that may be considering >it. > >If your business supports or makes use of *BSD in some way, please >take a moment to submit your information. >_______________________________________________ >freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list >http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy >To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-advocacy-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > > > > > From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Tue May 10 18:09:57 2005 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0BC416A4D0 for ; Tue, 10 May 2005 18:09:57 +0000 (GMT) Received: from tower.berklix.org (bsd.bsn.com [194.221.32.7]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB4F343D45 for ; Tue, 10 May 2005 18:09:56 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from jhs@flat.berklix.net) Received: from js.berklix.net (p549A3B2C.dip.t-dialin.net [84.154.59.44]) (authenticated bits=0) by tower.berklix.org (8.12.9p2/8.12.9) with ESMTP id j4AI9h8o039662; Tue, 10 May 2005 20:09:55 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from jhs@flat.berklix.net) Received: from fire.jhs.private (fire.jhs.private [192.168.91.41]) by js.berklix.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j4AI9Z5r003061; Tue, 10 May 2005 20:09:38 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from jhs@flat.berklix.net) Received: from fire.jhs.private (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by fire.jhs.private (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j4AI9YTR020674; Tue, 10 May 2005 20:09:35 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from jhs@fire.jhs.private) Message-Id: <200505101809.j4AI9YTR020674@fire.jhs.private> To: ac From: "Julian Stacey" Organization: http://berklix.com/~jhs/ Munich Unix, BSD, Internet User-agent: EXMH http://beedub.com/exmh/ on FreeBSD http://freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 10 May 2005 20:01:05 +0300." <4280E8D1.4030009@miensk.com> Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 20:09:34 +0200 Sender: jhs@flat.berklix.net cc: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: Re: NYC*BUG Announces BSDTracker Database X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 18:09:58 -0000 Reference: > From: ac > Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 20:01:05 +0300 > Message-id: <4280E8D1.4030009@miensk.com> ac wrote: > >The New York City *BSD User Group (NYC*BUG) is pleased to announce the > >BSDTracker Database. The BSDTracker includes both a database of Users > >and *BSD Resources. The Resources database is for firms that provide > >technical services or support for the *BSD operating systems. This is > >a great resource for people in need of BSD consulting and services. > >The online application can be found on the NYC*BUG website: > >http://nycbug.org/index.php?NAV=BSDTracker > > > >The goal of the database is to help promote the use and awareness of > >the *BSDs, giving those who use, promote or develop the BSDs, another > >opportunity to get their name out as supporters. Compiling a list of > >businesses that use BSD will bring more credibility to the BSDs and > >help support decisions to switch by companies that may be considering > >it. > > > >If your business supports or makes use of *BSD in some way, please > >take a moment to submit your information. There's been at least 2 lists of BSD consultants for many years: I believe I started mine first, but wouldnt swear to it, not important, (& a good idea has many authors, & a good idea will likely happen about the same time, demand driven, regardless by who :-) Anyway, mine's at http://berklix.org/~jhs/consultants.html & is geographically sorted. FreeBSD has one too (alpha, not geo. sorted). (& each list points at the other.) - Julian Stacey Net & Sys Eng Consultant, Munich http://berklix.com Mail in Ascii (Html=Spam). Ihr Rauch = mein allergischer Kopfschmerz. From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Tue May 10 18:21:28 2005 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94A6C16A4CE for ; Tue, 10 May 2005 18:21:28 +0000 (GMT) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.195]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B82143D41 for ; Tue, 10 May 2005 18:21:28 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from beowuff@gmail.com) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id a41so1002335rng for ; Tue, 10 May 2005 11:21:27 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=irrAOmucz9DtBhRoWMP8BywoBy2Y/tyNIcXUGlhnN2KYnK1+7J1447tkZvtthskcrLkgbBVMw7noGneCYZVjV8J62LAO/U934UHzmSNuIF90CCmp031xF8CArAJmULiUitAAHM316UU17LOiwt2T3e7DuhbUvhs78FECOZKsW4s= Received: by 10.38.152.61 with SMTP id z61mr381699rnd; Tue, 10 May 2005 11:21:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.38.24.29 with HTTP; Tue, 10 May 2005 11:21:27 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 11:21:27 -0700 From: beowuff To: ac In-Reply-To: <4280E8D1.4030009@miensk.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline References: <7708fd6805050908526a679832@mail.gmail.com> <4280E8D1.4030009@miensk.com> cc: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: Re: NYC*BUG Announces BSDTracker Database X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: beowuff List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 18:21:28 -0000 On 5/10/05, ac wrote: > Is it for NY-ers only, for Americans only, or for planet Earth only ;) ? I would imagine it's none of the above. From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Wed May 11 18:58:53 2005 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A93516A4CE for ; Wed, 11 May 2005 18:58:53 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ciao.gmane.org (main.gmane.org [80.91.229.2]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AAEB043D70 for ; Wed, 11 May 2005 18:58:51 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from freebsd-advocacy@m.gmane.org) Received: from root by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1DVwHs-0003f8-0b for freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org; Wed, 11 May 2005 20:50:28 +0200 Received: from 0x5551206f.adsl.cybercity.dk ([85.81.32.111]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Wed, 11 May 2005 20:50:27 +0200 Received: from jwl by 0x5551206f.adsl.cybercity.dk with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Wed, 11 May 2005 20:50:27 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org From: Jeppe Larsen Date: Wed, 11 May 2005 20:46:41 +0200 Lines: 35 Message-ID: References: <20050509200737.GA18593@gentoo> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: 0x5551206f.adsl.cybercity.dk User-Agent: Pan/0.14.2 (This is not a psychotic episode. It's a cleansing moment of clarity.) Sender: news Subject: Re: is this your culture? X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 May 2005 18:58:53 -0000 Hi again Thanx for your replies, and I can assure you that we have written all over our report, that _good_ code is almost all that matters, so there shouldn't be anything missing there. We will consider wbat to do with your other suggestions. Anyways, we have today tried a little different approach in desribeing your culture. The following statements should be more broad and general, and not related to some single things. They should be considered as what you take for granted and what is "hidden" in the everyday life of FreeBSD, but still matters. So again, I hope you have time for a comment or two :-) -That we share our knowledge makes us stronger (this should refer to the whole "open-source/free software" ideology and that you value this approach to knowledge and software and code) -One must think for himself and do "the right thing" (here hopefully referring to the mentality that one should at least have searched google, the mailinglist archive and read som man-pages, before involving others in his problems. It should also refer to the idea about "elegant software" and writing software that gives the user the abillity to do what he wants and not the other way around) -Our way of doing things is right (well, this is very commonsense, because of course you think that FreeBS at least has some things right, or else you wouldn't be working on the project vulentarily. But it should also say something about your little "distance" you make to the way for example GNU/Linux does things. "The BSDL is true free software", "We love Unix, we don't hate Windows" and so on) Regards, Jeppe Larsen From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Wed May 11 19:51:24 2005 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 327BA16A4CE for ; Wed, 11 May 2005 19:51:24 +0000 (GMT) Received: from mx3.mail.ru (mx3.mail.ru [194.67.23.149]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C4D143D76 for ; Wed, 11 May 2005 19:51:23 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from vadim_nuclight@mail.ru) Received: from [83.172.3.181] (port=32435 helo=[83.172.3.181]) by mx3.mail.ru with esmtp id 1DVxEn-0004PG-00; Wed, 11 May 2005 23:51:22 +0400 Date: Thu, 12 May 2005 02:42:32 +0700 From: Vadim Goncharov X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.10.01) Personal Organization: Home X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <825873532.20050512024232@mail.ru> To: Jeppe Larsen In-Reply-To: References: <20050509200737.GA18593@gentoo> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit cc: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: Re[2]: is this your culture? X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Vadim Goncharov List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 May 2005 19:51:24 -0000 Hello Jeppe, Thursday, May 12, 2005, 1:46:41 AM, you wrote: JL> Thanx for your replies, and I can assure you that we have written all over JL> our report, that _good_ code is almost all that matters, so there JL> shouldn't be anything missing there. We will consider wbat to do with your JL> other suggestions. (1) [...] JL> -One must think for himself and do "the right thing" (here hopefully JL> referring to the mentality that one should at least have searched google, JL> the mailinglist archive and read som man-pages, before involving others in JL> his problems. It should also refer to the idea about "elegant software" JL> and writing software that gives the user the abillity to do what he wants JL> and not the other way around) (2) JL> -Our way of doing things is right (well, this is very commonsense, because JL> of course you think that FreeBS at least has some things right, or else JL> you wouldn't be working on the project vulentarily. But it should also say JL> something about your little "distance" you make to the way for example JL> GNU/Linux does things. "The BSDL is true free software", "We love Unix, JL> we don't hate Windows" and so on) Yes, in addition to (1) and (2) it must be said that BSD users tend to have more deep knowledge in used areas. It is preferred that you gain through way described in (2) systematic knowledge: not pieces "do this, it will work way 1, do that, it will work way 2", but overall understanding. En masse comparison of systems: Linux way: following HOWTOs, quick-n-dirty making things work, doing by example, writing HOWTOs for a few practical things not counting other variants, not big all-covering docs. BSD way: long preparative reading of all available docs, understanding how it works (you do nothing practical before this and patiently learn), then you have ability to do whatever you want as you know all, so you prefer to do it the most elegant (as seen from theory) way. After that, good all-descriptive docs (academic way!) are written, not step-by-step HOWTOs. -- Best regards, Vadim Goncharov ICQ UIN 166852181 mailto:vadim_nuclight@mail.ru From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Wed May 11 21:21:29 2005 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E81EA16A4CE for ; Wed, 11 May 2005 21:21:29 +0000 (GMT) Received: from rambo.401.cx (rambo.401.cx [80.65.205.166]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0CBD043D75 for ; Wed, 11 May 2005 21:21:29 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from listsub@401.cx) Received: from [192.168.200.2] (rocky [192.168.200.2]) by rambo.401.cx (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j4BLLRDt093552; Wed, 11 May 2005 23:21:27 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from listsub@401.cx) Message-ID: <42827757.8040202@401.cx> Date: Wed, 11 May 2005 23:21:27 +0200 From: "Roger 'Rocky' Vetterberg" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.2 (Windows/20050317) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jeppe Larsen References: <20050509200737.GA18593@gentoo> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit cc: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: Re: is this your culture? X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 May 2005 21:21:30 -0000 Jeppe Larsen wrote: > Hi again [snip] > -Our way of doing things is right (well, this is very commonsense, because > of course you think that FreeBS at least has some things right, or else > you wouldn't be working on the project vulentarily. But it should also say > something about your little "distance" you make to the way for example > GNU/Linux does things. "The BSDL is true free software", "We love Unix, > we don't hate Windows" and so on) I would not say that "our way of doing things is right" is typical for FreeBSD, or BSD in general for that matter. Being a person that works with Windows and Linux but runs to BSD when given freedom to do so, I must say that BSD has the by far most "tolerant" user base. I frequently hear BSD users say things like "look at that project, their way of solving this is way better then ours" or "I wish BSD was as good as OtherOS on this" or similar. I think the ability to admit weakness is one of the strenghts of the BSD community. If we can face the fact that others do things better, we can also improve the way we do things. To rephrase, I would like to put it something like "Lets try to do things the right way", be it our way or someone elses. I must say that the "true free software" and "we love UNIX, we don't hate windows" quotes are very descriptive of the BSD attitude. Couldnt say it better myself. -- R