From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Nov 21 20:26:17 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from echunga.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93F2E37B479 for ; Tue, 21 Nov 2000 20:26:11 -0800 (PST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by echunga.lemis.com (8.11.1/8.9.3) id eAM4KvF84966; Wed, 22 Nov 2000 14:50:57 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from grog) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 14:50:57 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: Brett Glass Cc: Neil Blakey-Milner , chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Ridding ourselves of GNU software (was: Jordan Hubbard on Darwin) Message-ID: <20001122145057.F83853@echunga.lemis.com> References: <4.3.2.7.2.20001118142924.00cb6850@localhost> <4.3.2.7.2.20001118142924.00cb6850@localhost> <20001119050641.A4791@mithrandr.moria.org> <4.3.2.7.2.20001119182538.043874b0@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20001119182538.043874b0@localhost>; from brett@lariat.org on Sun, Nov 19, 2000 at 06:57:33PM -0700 Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-418-838-708 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sunday, 19 November 2000 at 18:57:33 -0700, Brett Glass wrote: > At 08:06 PM 11/18/2000, Neil Blakey-Milner wrote: > >> Ok Brett, we'll just force Jordan to lie next time. Thanks for the >> advice. Here we were innocently thinking that it was good to tell the >> truth, and evil to lie and obscure the truth, but luckily you're here to >> set us right. > > I would not advocate lying; that is a trait of both the FSF and Microsoft, > and FreeBSD should not practice it. *sigh* Brett, many would accuse you of lying with that statement, that it must be against your better judgement. I suspect, however, that you believe it. It still doesn't help us. >> While I dislike bash, many others don't, > > Fine. But it is not appropriate for a leader of a BSD development > project to advocate the use of GPLed software. > >> and GNU tar is pretty much standard for a Unix system. > > If GNU tar is a "standard," it is through the negligence of the BSD > world. We must fight this and develop equivalent or superior BSD-licensed > software. If we do not, we are dependent upon an organization which > would like nothing better than to destroy us! (And could, easily, by > changing the next version of the GPL.) Brett, GNU tar is *really* not very good. I'd love to see a better replacement. If you were to go and create one, people would love you for it. And don't say "I can't program well enough"; you can learn. >> Your posts about the evils of the FSF, GPL, and GNU products have >> lost FreeBSD more users and credibility than your articles, though. > > Actually, the only thing that has cost FreeBSD credibility is when > people WITHIN the FreeBSD community bash me for those postings. They > see this as portending a lack of unity and of perspective. Surely the > BSD community should be unanimous in opposing a group that seeks to > destroy it and the good it has done! I think we would be. Your mistake is to assume that we agree with your views on this matter. > We really need to unify in opposition to the GPL and purge it from the > code base. Yes, including the toolchain. If you lead well, people will follow you. Greg -- Finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key See complete headers for address and phone numbers To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message