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Date:      Thu, 27 Jul 2000 12:17:11 -0600 (MDT)
From:      Nick Rogness <nick@rapidnet.com>
To:        Dan Debertin <airboss@bitstream.net>
Cc:        Paul Herman <pherman@frenchfries.net>, Albert Chin-A-Young <china@thewrittenword.com>, freebsd-net@FreeBSD.ORG
Subject:   Re: Routing help
Message-ID:  <Pine.BSF.4.21.0007271154280.84874-100000@rapidnet.com>
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SGI.4.21.0007270703390.1929-100000@copper.air-boss.net>

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On Thu, 27 Jul 2000, Dan Debertin wrote:

> On Thu, 27 Jul 2000, Nick Rogness wrote:
> > 
> > 	NO, it is not too different.  It is hard to work with the upstream
> > 	provider to announce anything smaller than a /24.  However, some
> > 	of them do run other Routing protocols that you could
> > 	accomplish the same thing (In some cases) and they are
> > 	usually easier to work with on that level.  Or maybe he's
> > 	multi-homed within the same provider...
> > 
> > 	Either way, it's a pain in the butt to work with these people.
> 
> Hey now. Keep in mind the responsibilities of your upstreams. They have
> around 80K BGP routes to manage; the feasibility of announcing and
> propagating something smaller than a /24 is laughable, when the majority
> of your routes are /19 and the like. Even if they did agree to run BGP out
> to you for your /28 (or whatever), somehow getting other providers to
> accept the announcement (most of whom will neither accept nor announce
> anything smaller than a /24) would be impossible, and undesirable, even if
> it were possible.

	I know I work for one ;-) And I was talking more of a multi-homed
	situation within the same upstream and running some sort of
	IRP.  You are correct though, announcements of anything smaller than a /24
	just is not doable in todays Backbones.

> 
> The best way to do what he wants is to have a large-ish (larger than /24,
> anyway) netblock that is portable, i.e. obtained from ARIN or other
> registry, not leased from one of the upstreams, and run BGP to both,
> advertising a lower MED to the preferred (primary) ISP, and a higher one
> to the backup. Such a setup would also require an AS number.
> 

	ARIN will not give anything smaller than a /19...


> With a smaller netblock, he could run another routing protocol such as
> OSPF. You might run into problems if your address space isn't portable,
> though. It would make it technically more difficult, as well as
> administratively, as I doubt that ISP A will really want you advertising
> its prefixes to ISP B. I am making a leap in logic here, though, so
> correct me if this is inaccurate.
> 

	You are correct.  This is practically undoable.  Unless ISP-A
	and ISP-B are the same ISP...

	I think we have beat this dog to death...

Nick Rogness
- Drive defensively.  Buy a tank.




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