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Date:      Fri, 10 Mar 2000 18:58:16 -0600 (CST)
From:      Ryan Thompson <ryan@sasknow.com>
To:        Kazutaka YOKOTA <yokota@zodiac.mech.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp>
Cc:        freebsd-current@freebsd.org
Subject:   Re: 4.0-20000307-CURRENT kern.flp keyboard probe questions 
Message-ID:  <Pine.BSF.4.21.0003101843100.8418-100000@ren.sasknow.com>
In-Reply-To: <200003110048.JAA10261@zodiac.mech.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp>

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Kazutaka YOKOTA wrote to Ryan Thompson:

> >Maybe there is a valid reason for this, but when I attempt to boot the 4.0
> >kern.flp without a keyboard attached (I share one keyboard between four
> >systems, here), it displays keyboard: no and the BTX loader message, and
> >ceases to display ANY output on the attached monitor (though it does
> >continue to access the disk, I'm assuming, until the MFS root floppy is
> >needed)?
> >
> >I assume this is because, without a keyboard, the loader assumes a serial
> >console is attached.  
> 
> Yes. And this has been the behavior since FreeBSD 2.X.

I thought as much.


> >This is not the case in my situation.
> >
> >Isn't there a better way to identify a serial console?  
> 
> I don't understand.  What do you expect the boot loader to do?

I'm not sure, that's why I asked the list :-)  Really, what I was asking
is if there is a better way to detect a serial console.. Rather than the
current logic of "If there is no keyboard, there must be a serial
console".  I can think of N reasons why a box would have no keyboard
attached, besides having a serial console.

I know very little about serial consoles, but can they not be probed
somehow to determine their existence?  If that's not possible, at least,
what I'm suggesting below still sounds reasonable.

 
> >And, if not, could
> >the loader at least not display a message on the local monitor like
> >"Switching output to serial console...", or better yet, "Switching output
> >to serial console in 10 seconds.. press any key to abort"?
> 
> Which key do you mean?  The system has found no keyboard, you know :-)
> 
> Kazu

Exactly... My suggestion resembles the common BIOS boot message from days
of old:

	Keyboard not found.  Press [F1] to continue.

The novice reads, laughs out loud, and wonders if the joke is really on
them.  After all, how COULD they press F1 if a keyboard does not exist?  

The expert checks his/her keyboard connection, (or plugs a keyboard in)
and, indeed, hits F1 to continue.  BIOS programmers have been doing it
for about two decades.  Why not the FreeBSD boot loader? :-)

My idea is a similar one.  Have the boot loader (with a reasonably
configured timeout--we don't want to wait indefinitely) display a similar
message (perhaps with copious beeping), giving the busy sysadmin a chance
to switch keyboards, or at least notice that a keyboard was not detected.

If I install FreeBSD on multiple systems, I might throw boot disks in a
dozen machines so I don't have to wait for each one.  I come around with
my $370 keyboard later to start the actual installs over NFS.  I call it
'pipelining' :-)

-- 
  Ryan Thompson <ryan@sasknow.com>
  Systems Administrator, Accounts
  Phone: +1 (306) 664-1161

  SaskNow Technologies     http://www.sasknow.com
  #106-380 3120 8th St E   Saskatoon, SK  S7H 0W2



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