From owner-freebsd-advocacy Thu Apr 1 6:33:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from srv1.thuntek.net (srv1.thuntek.net [206.206.98.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F219F14F5B for ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 06:33:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dwilde1@thuntek.net) Received: from thuntek.net (abq-044.thuntek.net [207.66.52.44]) by srv1.thuntek.net (8.9.1/8.6.12TNT1.0) with ESMTP id HAA11114; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 07:33:30 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <37038330.CBD75F1B@thuntek.net> Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 07:31:12 -0700 From: Donald Wilde X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.1-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Wes Peters Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Clueless users are bad for debian (was Let's CENSOR it!) References: <3702BF21.2B23AFB3@softweyr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Oh, boy, back to one of my FAVORITE subjects... ;-) Thanks, Wes! I think it is possible to give both Clueless Luser and SuperSysAdmin what they need. The problem is that 'novice' install is still too techy and unexplained, not to mention un-undoable. We need one more option there that explores the system and then sets it up properly. Not to the X point, the decision tree should merge again after CONGTRATS! You now have... Then, there should be another menu fork where Joe L. can choose to build a desktop (with basic programs, Internet and VGA or SVGA X) or a webserver or a firewall or a db server or a mailbox, or even several of those... or choose what he wants to do. We should be able to achieve this with just C in sysinstall and scripts that snoop to config Apache and Postgres and things like that. The key to success is to examine it from the non-UNIX-geek POV and explain the tech in English. The Ports are a perfect example, only a geek who knows the tradition can figure out the one-liners, and the DESCRs are hardly better. Then, we add a layer of FreeBSD-specific tricks like active root windows and FBSD-specific xscreensavers and tricks like that. Not GNOME, necessarily or KDE, but well-set-up fvwm1.24, maybe. Showcase what FreeBSD can be without turning it into bloatware! Finally, we add a "what do I do now" system -- both text and GUI -- that they can page through that explains integration techniques and holds hands while leading into the real docs. I can't get too deep into this thread, I'm supposed to be encouraging you guys to figure it out and do it, but I'll be glad to establish a spot on the ./advo site for posting of white-papers-in-progress and signup lists for coordination. -- Don Wilde "Bringing the Internet to everyone!" Wilde Media 1380 Rio Rancho Blvd. SE #117 voice: 505-771-0709 Rio Rancho, New Mexico 87124 e-mail: dwilde1@thuntek.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message