From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Jun 16 13:46:08 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 201CF339DB5 for ; Tue, 16 Jun 2020 13:46:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cknipe@savage.za.org) Received: from mail-yb1-xb34.google.com (mail-yb1-xb34.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::b34]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 49mTxW0lnZz41dN for ; Tue, 16 Jun 2020 13:46:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cknipe@savage.za.org) Received: by mail-yb1-xb34.google.com with SMTP id t9so10829753ybk.9 for ; Tue, 16 Jun 2020 06:46:06 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=savage-za-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=TVCqI3EE4Chz11jzOLJvCVYoephQlb9LYh5rcJTZaZU=; b=L4pdImeWBTpPnH+U78ySXR3U9OA/KebLgz3xX+B1z+2u0izyGvUXLDSb10YApwfb9J 2OUauDSM103qWKRmo6larHh36Hm8zoBnzOFZOFdg9yf2pB+6gtCtuTMm9MVaFx6bccJQ UwfLQ/LPOHhbxXmw1JW7tR5kOxB9owb0pBHx/XEN98s+sQFpXLO+5z1Bw9rh3ILEkeAn IjKr2RiU48zeIbBpuUYeVuNBZZ+hYGsgjG/Im0aCatrHo/7rjVnzybwM9avGn3dN4n+l Dn2OoxdNwAJxCokfawmYuUCUbmjtHzFoTKESuJJteYyjhEhJ08tCH8x8uRTOkSSc6f/O Rt9A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=TVCqI3EE4Chz11jzOLJvCVYoephQlb9LYh5rcJTZaZU=; b=fiH6WIShY6q13hwxEirMld4xAi/lbA9dPZnrjFs9ueIGxbgnFaVqjbOPiigRJ5nrNK 9+frMdlI/EnlT/VDzntPjmFelgZyqvXKgtdXAqQ/BG6u3dAmnOzWmJAHUM5lxpXkPDEa zIOyL4hPBHySbYHNMLLdQJftlqbKch+3bc0eHZwlPeuzMkiOgiqFz2ml64tFaY61t111 x+5ZTc21FWjy07Zd4ZU9veqSitCZB4JvTM82fGHCVFFc9KovIw0RQTfx0VYQSMgHlZVI 8Zb3U70rQ7XA5KC/Ih3/xhROUVgIS98q5zFAG6zT4v0AFYkWKvv4IXVSV5W/g1eUDIBG QGJw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530l4Uke+Tfc2Nmokyx/O7BmrL6bfxl7YSZqOq6rjx7a9V6v1+FM 70XuHo/dinj8Rs081EgfJ7vSv+7vMDL6ygbJ8Lw7Zu0mNuQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyuZXf6nMqpayKfq6p+V/dRz7pFVsF7Z4yB/mrG/+v/Aeyz9tOFfcuVonMjsvWdZc2UUlLllHfQ4IyJR6rFt/4= X-Received: by 2002:a25:d755:: with SMTP id o82mr3959509ybg.166.1592315165909; Tue, 16 Jun 2020 06:46:05 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200613154409.GA89618@neutralgood.org> <13115.1592302784@segfault.tristatelogic.com> <20200616071153.00006f4d@seibercom.net> <20200616075548.000066f1@seibercom.net> <20200616140416.bd7b8bf2.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200616142043.7d599458.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200616092901.000002f7@seibercom.net> In-Reply-To: From: Chris Knipe Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2020 15:45:54 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Mailing List Etiquette was freebsd vs. netbsd To: Aryeh Friedman Cc: FreeBSD Mailing List X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 49mTxW0lnZz41dN X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=savage-za-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=L4pdImeW; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of cknipe@savage.za.org designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::b34 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=cknipe@savage.za.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.24 / 15.00]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[savage-za-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.04)[-1.042]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.01)[-1.015]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[savage.za.org]; TAGGED_RCPT(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[savage-za-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2607:f8b0:4864:20::b34:from]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.98)[-0.981]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[savage@savage.za.org,cknipe@savage.za.org]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[savage@savage.za.org,cknipe@savage.za.org] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.33 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.33 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2020 13:46:08 -0000 On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 3:35 PM Aryeh Friedman wrote: > On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 9:29 AM Jerry wrote: > > > > > 1) Not everybody buys the bargain basement item. > > > > [snip] > > > 3) In virtually all cases, I never buy the entry level product of any > > line. It is almost always the first one to go obsolete and/or not be > > supported by its creators. > > > > News for you: > 1. Not everyone is made out of money or works for someone who is > > 2. Some of us have more useful things to do then buying tech we don't need > like paying the rent and putting food on our table > > 3. To deny that the above facts are not true for at least some people is > the height of lack of empathy and/or the understanding needed to pick the > right defaults for a system that needs to be useful to as many people as > possible. > > We are talking about https://www.freebsd.org/doc/en/articles/mailing-list-faq/etiquette.html#idp44832888 It would -seem- to me (personally at least), the majority is kept back to cater for the minority. As I've said in my initial post, I will use whatever MUA I want, and I will send email in whatever standard I deem to be acceptable. It would -seem- to me, that the problem is YOUR choice of MUA that cannot decode / display said email correctly, and not mine that is not encoding it correctly. If you want to use old / outdated technologies, that is your choice. I know of many, many freelancers having even better hardware than I. If you choose to be stuck in the old age, then so be it. The majority, can't be technologically held back to cater for the minority. If you depend on said tech to generate income to pay rent and put food on the table (like all of us btw, not just you), common sense would dictate that you'd want to continuously improve on said tech to be able to use the latest and greatest technologies to woo said clients and get the business in order to get the $$$ you need to pay the rent / put food on said table. No my friend, it is your CHOICE to be stuck in the stone age... In fact, the entire tone of your message basically reads "I use old tech, and therefore it MUST be supported".... -- Regards, Chris Knipe