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Date:      Fri, 30 Nov 2001 22:15:47 -0600
From:      Mike Meyer <mwm@mired.org>
To:        swear@blarg.net (Gary W. Swearingen)
Cc:        "Anthony Atkielski" <anthony@freebie.atkielski.com>, <chat@FreeBSD.ORG>
Subject:   Re: Feeding the Troll (Was: freebsd as a desktop ?)
Message-ID:  <15368.22899.323884.742712@guru.mired.org>
In-Reply-To: <mfelmfr3iy.lmf@localhost.localdomain>
References:  <15367.37543.15609.362257@guru.mired.org> <040701c179af$4bda25f0$0a00000a@atkielski.com> <15367.43943.686638.723011@guru.mired.org> <003301c179ea$8925d270$0a00000a@atkielski.com> <15368.2156.193643.17139@guru.mired.org> <005601c179f3$a4030640$0a00000a@atkielski.com> <15368.5624.255357.964607@guru.mired.org> <mfelmfr3iy.lmf@localhost.localdomain>

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Gary W. Swearingen <swear@blarg.net> types:
> Mike Meyer <mwm@mired.org> writes:
> > I don't believe there was any way they could have sold Unix
> > workstations at PC prices. You can't build a reasonable Unix
> > workstation using PC parts for PC prices today; why should they have
> > been able to do it with proprietary hardware back then?
> 
> Remember late '80s Apollo/DOMAIN workstations?  68000 CPU; ISA
> peripheral bus; PC-class hardware, but still twice the cost of a
> top-of-the-line IBM PC clone, IIRC.

Not really, but I remember other 68000 based Unix workstations. The
68000 couldn't handle a page fault properly, so there was custom
hardware in the system to help deal with that. At least one of them
used a second 68000. The hardware held the "memory wait" line high
while it went and fetched the page that was faulting.

Of course, if you wanted to get a *really* good system - the kind that
the people who wrote the Unix-haters Handbook used - you could put
some serious cash down, and get a Symbolics box that used a couple of
68000's for handling low and medium speed I/O.

> Workstation buyers wanted/needed better-than-PC systems.  Like huge 200
> MB disks, big B&W monitor with custom, better-than-PC video, token-ring
> network interface, mouse.  Plus enough memory to run really good GUI
> document publishing software like Interleaf or Framemaker.

Those huge 200MB disk drives were all SCSI as well. IDE couldn't
deliver the performance a real worstation needed.

> Plus they had to pay for the cost of developing their GUI OS which
> was better than M$ could come up with in years of foot dragging.
> Actually they said it was really a custom OS (DOMAIN?) simulating Unix.
> (I think you could also run X, but we normally didn't.)

Yup, the OS was called DOMAIN. They used the slogan "The network is
the computer" before Sun did.

	<mike

--
Mike Meyer <mwm@mired.org>			http://www.mired.org/home/mwm/
Independent WWW/Perforce/FreeBSD/Unix consultant, email for more information.

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