From owner-freebsd-x11@freebsd.org Tue May 22 12:07:13 2018 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-x11@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16B41EF39AA for ; Tue, 22 May 2018 12:07:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from johalun0@gmail.com) Received: from mail-wm0-x229.google.com (mail-wm0-x229.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::229]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 811D2716A6 for ; Tue, 22 May 2018 12:07:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from johalun0@gmail.com) Received: by mail-wm0-x229.google.com with SMTP id t11-v6so31319151wmt.0 for ; Tue, 22 May 2018 05:07:12 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=tikXqKoA1U/o+YreYXgmo+PZEdbQzI551K8CzdZA8pk=; b=U/CnRbb+1ws7WvQ2rfxtdhwA1RNG/ASna6mKcgfTzSr4QaxQJDNvHTO+gtTX9tUDvP +NEyx0FIL5WX2BircHDqli7nNM8Wh5T21a9YZ8QLs7is7oInjfjeztC+gM5lhhm2+VNr acRsC/qO/eQhf1ZeVL9csiFsvUAgdomrYAarhS9yU6iAupGtqnPD0iTkLHD9jGVKfj8J O9IbKQ8i77jdm7IAumlB4ol8lkLaG6+luA0bGbhvhtfoZFR6D33n2bVeHI+odwJG3ZYS CD4wmSiMz8h/MJdYm5WYe0MrK+oBNuptCEfWU4QwMZagdJeYfEuc3X34PbDv8YGyriqw +38w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=tikXqKoA1U/o+YreYXgmo+PZEdbQzI551K8CzdZA8pk=; b=VGL72773w/ksLPA831kKbTwmwoQGrQr6UKbYi2CW6jUkvpVvHlbz7VD/+/ILhS+QVm +Veq7rF9BP+pVEvOjw0YwyCUbw6uFIRRy4A+JjIBnFB9901WKahBVDtOleRBlR/cT7rR kfYg96YDPkK65z1TkwYrouZu5QjeLNisqf9bbGDNqV8NKlXhreAbZRcsPKjTYZD95FZd 3cc0dK0ferUckV3cJn1Mre5OsP87LZ/fHfLf6lIgJnzcRx1oLNRS5TCNs+Ll6bVl/cQd wGqx0Y38Qs9JiTc339nN/fdgJVsffsgcZKReY11t7eIUQgLFvNAfVDh51Rf/ttXVfRCE 4k2g== X-Gm-Message-State: ALKqPweoDthaScBXx3LA2aNGUYHfnhtRH4bXhQK0vo839egoGW+RLUIt 8d7q8weniO3KAyNO8VWMW3u4PQfgLh8uqL10184= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AB8JxZrRvmSxVlyfQlkkubtvG1wT7MHy8QoleaTY2cqYco9sDZYo1anyV7RKppyT4cf1ajydIe4Jf0S8nEfQB5mf+YM= X-Received: by 2002:a1c:9ec2:: with SMTP id h185-v6mr1077184wme.68.1526990831537; Tue, 22 May 2018 05:07:11 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.167.137 with HTTP; Tue, 22 May 2018 05:06:31 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <5e092e7b-9d5a-528c-c838-55debcb2678f@gmail.com> References: <20180518193009.GA88432@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20180520164011.GA6276@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <88843bfb-34de-382c-9409-83f9ad54c8c4@daemonic.se> <20180521024050.0857a787@gmail.com> <20180521170728.GA14025@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20180522011543.3f621882@gmail.com> <20180521224927.GA9925@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <368b7106-d9c9-c860-cc00-54a45a07d34c@gmail.com> <5e092e7b-9d5a-528c-c838-55debcb2678f@gmail.com> From: Johannes Lundberg Date: Tue, 22 May 2018 13:06:31 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [RFC] Deprecation and removal of the drm2 driver To: dpolyg Cc: FreeBSD X11 mailing list Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.26 X-BeenThere: freebsd-x11@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: X11 on FreeBSD -- maintaining and support List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 22 May 2018 12:07:13 -0000 On Tue, May 22, 2018 at 1:03 PM, dpolyg wrote: > Hi Johannes, > > sorry, I forgot to mention in my previous e-mail that I tried drm-stable > too with the same result: > > root@ShuttleD47:/usr/ports/graphics/drm-stable-kmod # make > =3D=3D=3D> drm-stable-kmod-g20180505_5 not supported on 10.x or older, n= o kernel > support. > *** Error code 1 > > Stop. > make: stopped in /usr/ports/graphics/drm-stable-kmod > > I have latest port tree > (run '# portsnap fetch update' in advance). > Yes, sorry I wasn't clear. You'll need 11.2-PRERELEASE or wait for 11.2 release. > > Regards, > Denis. > > > On 22/05/2018 8:55 PM, Johannes Lundberg wrote: > >> On Tue, May 22, 2018 at 12:47 PM, dpolyg wrote: >> >> I have one comment regarding usage of the drm2 on a "legacy" hardware. >>> Excuse me in advance if I misunderstand something. >>> For the last 2-3 years I'm playing with devices such as small form fact= or >>> PCs from Shuttle: >>> http://global.shuttle.com/products/productsList?categoryId=3D69 >>> or from Gigabyte: >>> https://www.gigabyte.com/us/Mini-PcBarebone >>> or Intel "NUC"s. >>> To my experience drm-next doesn't work on lower price (Celeron/Atom) >>> models. Do I missing something? >>> Here is concrete example: >>> I have a Shuttle DS47: http://global.shuttle.com/main >>> /productsDetail?productId=3D1718 >>> running FreeBSD 11.1-RELEASE and drm2.ko loaded + Xorg + compton. >>> Having that I made a box with a voice control and ability to make a SIP >>> video call to it from a smartphone (WebRTC) (imagine "Amazon Show" >>> powered >>> by stock FeeBSD) but I never install any drm-next on it. Stock amd64 >>> kernel >>> used. No ports compiled. Only "pkg install ..." + custom code as the mo= st >>> front end. >>> After reading this thread I tried to compile drm-next on my DS47 box: >>> >>> root@ShuttleD47:/usr/ports/graphics/drm-next-kmod # uname -a >>> FreeBSD ShuttleD47 11.1-RELEASE-p10 FreeBSD 11.1-RELEASE-p10 #0: Tue Ma= y >>> 8 05:21:56 UTC 2018 root@amd64-builder.daemonology >>> .net:/usr/obj/usr/src/sys/GENERIC amd64 >>> root@ShuttleD47:/usr/ports/graphics/drm-next-kmod # make >>> =3D=3D=3D> drm-next-kmod-4.11.g20180505_1 not supported on 10.x or old= er, no >>> kernel >>> support. >>> *** Error code 1 >>> >>> Stop. >>> make: stopped in /usr/ports/graphics/drm-next-kmod >>> >>> Why drm-next thinks it lives on a 10.x kernel or older? >>> Is such usage case already considered as legacy? >>> Is this hardware supported by drm-next? >>> https://www.amazon.com/Best-Sellers-Electronics-Mini-Compute >>> rs/zgbs/electronics/13896591011 >>> >>> >>> >> Hi Denis >> >> For FreeBSD 11, please use drm-stable-kmod (this is based on drm drivers >> in >> Linux 4.9 and has been backported to FreeBSD 11) >> >> For FreeBSD 12, drm-next-kmod is currently Linux 4.11 but will updated t= o >> Linux 4.15 soon. (of course, drm-stable-kmod is also usable on 12-CURREN= T. >> you might wanna use that if drm-next-kmod is buggy) >> >> If you need the firmware, gpu-firmware-kmod port is used for both >> drm-xxx-kmod ports. >> >> >> >> >> Regards, >>> Denis. >>> >>> >>> >>> On 22/05/2018 4:51 PM, Andreas Nilsson wrote: >>> >>> On Tue, May 22, 2018 at 8:50 AM, Johannes Lundberg >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> On Mon, May 21, 2018 at 23:50 Steve Kargl >>> >>>>> edu> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, May 21, 2018 at 03:20:49PM -0700, K. Macy wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> I just ask. >>>>>>>> Or why not include drm-next to base svn repo and add some >>>>>>>> option to make.conf to swith drm2/dem-next ? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> Even if it's not being built on amd64 we're still responsible for >>>>>>> keeping it building on !amd64 so long as it's in base. This makes >>>>>>> changing APIs and universe runs more burdensome. The graphics >>>>>>> developers have given you notice that it will now be your collectiv= e >>>>>>> responsibility to keep it up to date. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Not quite. One graphics developer has indicated a desire >>>>>> to remove working code, because it interferes with the >>>>>> graphics developers' port on a single architecture. There >>>>>> is no indication by that graphics developer that drm2 will >>>>>> be available in ports. You can go read the original post >>>>>> here: >>>>>> >>>>>> https://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-current/2018- >>>>>> May/069401.html >>>>>> >>>>>> The last paragraph is >>>>>> >>>>>> What does the community think? Is there anyone still using >>>>>> the drm2 driver on 12-CURRENT? If so, what is preventing >>>>>> you from switching to the port? >>>>>> >>>>>> The answer to the last two questions are "yes" and "the port >>>>>> does not work on i386". >>>>>> >>>>>> Yes, I recognize that you're clever enough to purposefully >>>>>> break the API so that you can thumb your nose at those of >>>>>> us who have older hardware. >>>>>> >>>>>> What is wrong with using >>>>>> >>>>>> .if ${MACHINE_ARCH} !=3D amd64 >>>>>> ... >>>>>> .endif >>>>>> >>>>>> to enable/disable drm2? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> The answer to the first question is that the consensus seem to be tha= t >>>>> moving to a port is best for the _majority_. >>>>> >>>>> Let me ask you, what=E2=80=99s wrong with this one-liner after base i= nstall >>>>> pkg install drm2 >>>>> ? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>>> Steve >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> Hello, >>>> >>>> If you were running GNU/Linux, you would be using the equivalent of >>>> drm-stable-kmod or drm-next-kmod. Why do you want to run older code on >>>> FreeBSD? >>>> >>>> Hardware and software moves on. One does not expect to run the latest >>>> hardware with old software, old hardware and new software might work, = if >>>> someone is willing to maintain old code. >>>> >>>> Since the proposal was to keep drm2 in 11, you're looking at support >>>> until >>>> 2021, will you still run that old hardware then? >>>> >>>> With such long-time support offered by 11- branch, why hamper >>>> development >>>> of 12 by lugging around old, hard to maintain code that is relevant fo= r >>>> only legacy hardware? >>>> >>>> Best regards >>>> Andreas >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> freebsd-x11@freebsd.org mailing list >>>> https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-x11 >>>> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-x11-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" >>>> >>>> >>>> >>