From owner-freebsd-x11@freebsd.org Sun Jan 1 15:37:05 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-x11@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08FB2C9717F for ; Sun, 1 Jan 2017 15:37:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from zaphod@berentweb.com) Received: from mail-pg0-x22b.google.com (mail-pg0-x22b.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c05::22b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D546A18B5 for ; Sun, 1 Jan 2017 15:37:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from zaphod@berentweb.com) Received: by mail-pg0-x22b.google.com with SMTP id y62so143617351pgy.1 for ; Sun, 01 Jan 2017 07:37:04 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=berentweb-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=sender:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=ZtTgJBT6n/gudmffmnj7HomjlgvXLaQOFwrqjyZwcgY=; b=niAFFBBWldATE8ARw6SzruNJ7bBFUi2oRvjMlQ6JvQLfcsy6l6BTmFmWx5x8bzpCfJ Be94nImT0VWV22MP9twCiXsyQdcN3NPOgzMo++ajos14e0ygeTqjmM52StPwDo6nVIGZ MbWoN58kQLt/56vSzLsYIWcLTy4YrQzqqIL/Qcp77Sk4NeJ+crO+0IIxgs+EQ8QdPTmw EIH4rYKvPH+VpwMOV3Fd/QesH3SU02tyvx6uejV9xq1oERw4/1xYUVPAp731weeoE4wX HA5aM3tbnGqgg4iABIe1Cg2Rmwax+QOP/+XtPf8BSERMvGDgaiJQJLDb0RZgH2rFsMya ncWQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id :in-reply-to:references:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=ZtTgJBT6n/gudmffmnj7HomjlgvXLaQOFwrqjyZwcgY=; b=EbM23f/kVgnwmmPe+AOK3+NIIdSJG3PR2CicDmYWf4hMf6ivEZbOu7vmiNEMxPUpm1 oAw2/WtIB6w5XPc9tmEMUsS7I1G0Qx7ZrU7hchUyFUG0RlQViVIRpvWMW37TVgE+mhaM DV1h+I860cR8tHPRxg4Uj9PQzwWEolDzII2BnRJmd7R+Wz+rzxl2uirCgKSf0CJJXo83 X7FouLMP/yxvAzSq5V/Awo8rPby7ll5uWs8OB6Dnd1CHQriEiBnEeYzTotlgei9kHtto hwaDtbu4W4eI+Faon0l+lumo4oU7RuhcTwSJX8ingVDPkW5znzTKcdH/gS/r4yOHt32W LDUA== X-Gm-Message-State: AIkVDXIhTqp4/pNDxNrnZg1PbiMtuuWgkMJVKuOXYzYK9eHxcvhJFLBop8PyQdxN6g2xig== X-Received: by 10.99.135.200 with SMTP id i191mr101049640pge.162.1483285024222; Sun, 01 Jan 2017 07:37:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from rsbsd.rsb ([88.232.253.185]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a11sm125714793pfe.96.2017.01.01.07.37.00 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305 bits=256/256); Sun, 01 Jan 2017 07:37:03 -0800 (PST) Sender: "Raif S. Berent" Date: Sun, 1 Jan 2017 18:36:53 +0300 From: Beeblebrox To: Fernando Herrero =?UTF-8?B?Q2FycsOzbg==?= Cc: "freebsd-x11@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: End of year Xorg status rant Message-ID: <20170101183653.2c85698a@rsbsd.rsb> In-Reply-To: References: <20161230163653.54909631@rsbsd.rsb> <15952279f17.e0be0d8c34357.732964216134709731@nextbsd.org> <20161231120453.13adf858@thor.walstatt.dynvpn.de> <20161231145143.18e6ac99@rsbsd.rsb> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: freebsd-x11@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: X11 on FreeBSD -- maintaining and support List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 Jan 2017 15:37:05 -0000 Interesting discussion; thank you for all comments. I have several questions: * Is TrueOS/PC-BSD ahead of FreeBSD on the Desktop? If so, why? The answer = is probably "depends on the card", but again, is it ahead of FreeBsd for ce= rtain cards and why? If it's because they have integrated Matt's work, why = has FreeBSD not opted to do so? * Does the problem have anything to do with the Kernel Compat Layer for Lin= ux (https://wiki.freebsd.org/linux-kernel)? I'm asking to understand the ex= tent of the issue.=20 * Other than that, perhaps we could try and slice this problem in the short= term from another angle: Which GPU cards work (and are expected to work with new hardware) as of now= ? If anything, this discussion shows that the Graphics Wiki page (https://w= iki.freebsd.org/Graphics) is inadequate for GPU selection. Perhaps it could= be updated to a parametrised format showing functions by column each GPU c= ard supports (rather than simply works"/"does not work"). For example, as an immediate solution to my problem I would prefer (as I as= sume most others would) to purchase a new card that is confirmed to be work= ing on multiple parameters rather than slog through a "hopefully soon" scen= ario for the next couple of years (I'm not on a laptop, btw). I'm still willing to contribute, but above solution would at least reduce f= rustration and increase my productivity. New systems would also benefit by = selecting decent cards and reducing noise to the developers/list. Regards.