From owner-svn-src-head@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 15 07:25:53 2015 Return-Path: Delivered-To: svn-src-head@hub.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [8.8.178.115]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AD291B2F; Mon, 15 Jun 2015 07:25:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sjg@juniper.net) Received: from na01-bl2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-bl2on0102.outbound.protection.outlook.com [65.55.169.102]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mail.protection.outlook.com", Issuer "MSIT Machine Auth CA 2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D2DD1E46; Mon, 15 Jun 2015 07:25:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sjg@juniper.net) Received: from BL2PR05CA0015.namprd05.prod.outlook.com (10.255.226.15) by DM2PR05MB719.namprd05.prod.outlook.com (10.141.177.151) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.190.14; Mon, 15 Jun 2015 07:25:44 +0000 Received: from BL2FFO11FD054.protection.gbl (2a01:111:f400:7c09::159) by BL2PR05CA0015.outlook.office365.com (2a01:111:e400:c04::15) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.190.14 via Frontend Transport; Mon, 15 Jun 2015 07:25:44 +0000 Authentication-Results: spf=softfail (sender IP is 66.129.239.19) smtp.mailfrom=juniper.net; freebsd.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none; Received-SPF: SoftFail (protection.outlook.com: domain of transitioning juniper.net discourages use of 66.129.239.19 as permitted sender) Received: from P-EMF02-SAC.jnpr.net (66.129.239.19) by BL2FFO11FD054.mail.protection.outlook.com (10.173.161.182) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.190.9 via Frontend Transport; Mon, 15 Jun 2015 07:25:43 +0000 Received: from magenta.juniper.net (172.17.27.123) by P-EMF02-SAC.jnpr.net (172.24.192.21) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.146.0; Mon, 15 Jun 2015 00:25:42 -0700 Received: from chaos.jnpr.net (chaos.jnpr.net [172.21.16.28]) by magenta.juniper.net (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id t5F7PfD47077; Mon, 15 Jun 2015 00:25:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sjg@juniper.net) Received: from chaos (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chaos.jnpr.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id ADBC8580A3; Mon, 15 Jun 2015 00:25:41 -0700 (PDT) To: Julian Elischer CC: Dimitry Andric , , , Subject: Re: svn commit: r284345 - in head: . bin/cat bin/chflags bin/chio bin/chmod bin/cp bin/csh bin/date bin/dd bin/df bin/domainname bin/echo bin/ed bin/expr bin/freebsd-version bin/getfacl bin/hostname bi... In-Reply-To: <557E51B4.1000102@freebsd.org> References: <201506131920.t5DJKwMH033508@svn.freebsd.org> <24490.1434318198@chaos> <557E51B4.1000102@freebsd.org> Comments: In-reply-to: Julian Elischer message dated "Mon, 15 Jun 2015 12:16:52 +0800." From: "Simon J. Gerraty" X-Mailer: MH-E 8.0.3; nmh 1.3; GNU Emacs 22.3.1 Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2015 00:25:41 -0700 Message-ID: <25709.1434353141@chaos> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-EOPAttributedMessage: 0 X-Microsoft-Exchange-Diagnostics: 1; BL2FFO11FD054; 1:MYjLcQpOa6PLcKouRxh3VRIVvGIv2oxxtd8iwPmoYP4tAPn+J+nat3HZ6oMdExryV1O80igxZLQ5ABjD7OKJRmabTo/qh1UzDeslESsVYWpI7Mz5w/fGO5WIKI/LuLBnkZ9RlP7PtQ/TvmnZjFEgNnnWvSVPaahD/kfIDC3k5UrWOkNQleoywysHjQaMpHgdReLRlcHXsAJPICqWvMJOaS+Je0z4Fq/xlxE+Jz7JB+HKcLGAH6ZGm7cDAMVLnmDf+VohSicC9Vy1dfsyNooPO7pOoc458tslnjHfpzQfegM= X-Forefront-Antispam-Report: CIP:66.129.239.19; CTRY:US; IPV:NLI; EFV:NLI; SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(6009001)(199003)(189002)(24454002)(86362001)(33716001)(77156002)(5001960100002)(110136002)(76506005)(47776003)(92566002)(57986006)(50226001)(6806004)(2950100001)(77096005)(117636001)(450100001)(62966003)(46102003)(93886004)(105596002)(106466001)(19580405001)(50986999)(87936001)(48376002)(50466002)(19580395003)(76176999)(189998001)(42262002)(62816006); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DM2PR05MB719; H:P-EMF02-SAC.jnpr.net; FPR:; SPF:SoftFail; MLV:sfv; A:1; MX:1; LANG:en; X-Microsoft-Exchange-Diagnostics: 1; DM2PR05MB719; 2:R0ykzvrB/kfqsrvy4rxoEDr/mHjLWXN8wfMkIrTKB4syBn6DWUHp3b/n2HBN7MiJ; 2:c3l7qqSTBizM0FoL4IFbCG43xpJtUfPCAIDnG3JgVyTflsCNh8NGrha0IdBCKK8DBTvnbtP893w2k6xQwhV3Oi2EMBI1DUogeu/rrXhvDapIiS3RkM+b8PO279OwiF1+fOZlQwli2aOl8hi5ew+2Ss0w0fVHCYTlmGiJCZHj7wqNIY5nVhNVG3wGoi3TmWH+Fqp1uVTHtLGsnZkN4078rlSpQFK5JiJNEy9e+G98Qwc=; 6: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 X-Microsoft-Antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DM2PR05MB719; X-Microsoft-Antispam-PRVS: X-Exchange-Antispam-Report-Test: UriScan:; X-Exchange-Antispam-Report-CFA-Test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(601004)(5005006)(520003)(3002001); SRVR:DM2PR05MB719; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DM2PR05MB719; X-Microsoft-Exchange-Diagnostics: 1; DM2PR05MB719; 3:ykxVgROm8VigimXM+Y3tpC4sCNQLl00T3VaWAmbvq6Nv8SvfDy2TOiErvmva5Kapk47PtbjwZE3oZIkftlJSrw+qCvVw+rLPhRr7lNp7K8bK8F4+9rNcv30r2ekZ8FWGkFTv76SEVMbmXvHl7MpNSp0FKGT4Vf6DAW/c6qAz7pI33/kd8v3JKKi59cZZePsywMYIixrIxsxkRPj2OZPnXd3/knQsGZ6wccV3vGCj4wENQxz9X35HEn223DgzaHcJo3mvz+xcHRgH6654e2pgWpBcTeZTxTKlVj7lhsEiezGKVBlhuGWFjf+t5ixvKUIm X-Forefront-PRVS: 0608DEDB67 X-Microsoft-Exchange-Diagnostics: 1; DM2PR05MB719; 9: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 X-Microsoft-Exchange-Diagnostics: 1; DM2PR05MB719; 3:fVfazANJOsf2UHwPbqjB72otT0zw6sXhVqtKklY7CbMu/36AKnWvB/mT/zLj1c6lMgut1nakpWrmM5a9oUO29L3NRETa9brklqli/2dVFeg3NoAWAV0XUeFkOeI3tNi5Ow5oXO/a4TnWVRf2vQVAuA==; 10:IWn5Zj/gfKwS8h1rxCjQt/PR3sEDq73uBj59LtUP1bLRg8+rH2paYYpYeuDT6eTSLAy6c5LwF2tc/NLqx588BoMQw+/6N2nA3V9zy/2Wv+o=; 6:WbUdzc7nIKxA+c4aL26Tzf/JDpOlQxrdTNBvKf2MZagxdzLp41vIER9RsvJo34y+ X-OriginatorOrg: juniper.net X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 Jun 2015 07:25:43.9368 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Id: bea78b3c-4cdb-4130-854a-1d193232e5f4 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-OriginalAttributedTenantConnectingIp: TenantId=bea78b3c-4cdb-4130-854a-1d193232e5f4; Ip=[66.129.239.19]; Helo=[P-EMF02-SAC.jnpr.net] X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-FromEntityHeader: HybridOnPrem X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DM2PR05MB719 X-BeenThere: svn-src-head@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: SVN commit messages for the src tree for head/-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2015 07:25:53 -0000 Julian Elischer wrote: > As long as there is a REALLY EASY WAY to regenerate them and it's well > documented, Building each directory (in meta mode) is all that is/should be needed. > EXACTLY the same output > each time unless there is a source change, (so svn doesn't see a > change if there is none) Yes the results are stable - in the absense of bugs in makefiles. I think I fixed all those in the projects/bmake branch, but it is easy to introduce new issues. Anytime a makefile changes its behavior based on the existance of something it risks churning the dependencies b/w clean/update build. This same tech has been used by 1000+ engineers daily for a number of years now, it has made it much harder for them to break the build. > then I guess having them checked in is ok. (though a bit "yucky"). > I'd like the ability to make a full make however that DOES regenerate > them if I feel I have the time. When we've added targets to build system packages etc, then that should be simple. I still need to catch up with what bapt has been doing on that front though. Thanks --sjg