From nobody Mon Apr 15 00:21:27 2024 X-Original-To: freebsd-stable@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4VHnsk48DHz5HMkr for ; Mon, 15 Apr 2024 00:21:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-lj1-x233.google.com (mail-lj1-x233.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::233]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1D4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4VHnsk0hbYz4C8b for ; Mon, 15 Apr 2024 00:21:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: by mail-lj1-x233.google.com with SMTP id 38308e7fff4ca-2d82713f473so44978271fa.3 for ; Sun, 14 Apr 2024 17:21:43 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20230601.gappssmtp.com; s=20230601; t=1713140501; x=1713745301; darn=freebsd.org; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=N/dhJUv1a7uUoczFlI0jLqnS8vSSGAlnOISYjDGGR+k=; b=gHkVnQh6MswuDdFemxmQSR6Xv2ohruUhT/Ek8DdL2FWd1QoYXmyMyy4peFFWphSsXw 0L/NAP/wvV0KwpTlQmp4vAvjenew6x12OGMShPd92TrUzqU9DBA4Wx82W7NASd+4WHJe /beaxLjiOok4p8SUzJBbVMsVNeKsCg3mn1IfkISiLumvyCo3QqGDzEfWAkUSjLbFieBs hhNpE1r3Kbekzb8eOBFN/E1VC4vJ+CJnM1MNOFj5ECSHvFazhIGJpp7M7nrp2MkVPF6g 4cL8xSgLzWPMjGDBnNqqeY3KicH4ipLMTz2B2LTzJ2+zNmkph5i8rkHeUnImQHivkSIe we0w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1713140501; x=1713745301; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=N/dhJUv1a7uUoczFlI0jLqnS8vSSGAlnOISYjDGGR+k=; b=hQK55QyVBO7Viq8Pk49P+yRTrLgeYFdnaol1+UM9FXAGTnIw3JItJLF5ZR2uFiGDQT +kY7m/4M+I8ci/ZtBtt81uByV8N/6LDrTvtQ1CILGl2lsrPziJ2n3jE85CyOAQiASH3r etV2n+WskYyOl7EsNcdePjfa3BHKp/zX2qev1/+xaMrCt4mMmJjUJIp4BKu+hoqedZg/ HjHZPKjpPL0ARrM8Gr6wt52V3omOIM9L5JnscZAkrAlB8uH1tRw45KWnjwLzzHoxT6gT NYSWEnn6glPapXmzMzmOgSW9H0qVvtu2/4zSHX/qtdj+9qqO4NaiYmaPK4edFGpFhho+ I/Og== X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCVDsWGznbtyiC+JkSbLLP3MoOqTM5OLgTlNijF21ebwd6fUBZRLVMyJ4/TG4pd9q96HRPECCWJiXxjh03RG29WEiHAcXvjLzsHe0w== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YyBe8Q7mJIW6+CW0DeaUHtsK/Vve7h0cV0tqgDvgHJHCRCEsm3O 8pDrfHXsDsot38UtfzrEJsAACEXdKMvbN7MU3kD49m5Y7Y4hk8Vx/L0hEGfHZPG7xE4HcDl37o1 0xZGcfkgBN8rYfVP3kLEE1xsVKg32YxddQm2exA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IFOb0RLc3RuK1zJniwN1kzZP9WNabfF2XTPkYTWC3+p1TAPsykTCLKzkaT4dYTMkTCJ/rbWLX/A5xo2rARAqWo= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:3209:0:b0:2d6:8e88:5a8b with SMTP id y9-20020a2e3209000000b002d68e885a8bmr6527708ljy.32.1713140500561; Sun, 14 Apr 2024 17:21:40 -0700 (PDT) List-Id: Production branch of FreeBSD source code List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-stable List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-BeenThere: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <7338D9DD-E075-4382-9769-8188FDC639EB@iitbombay.org> In-Reply-To: <7338D9DD-E075-4382-9769-8188FDC639EB@iitbombay.org> From: Warner Losh Date: Sun, 14 Apr 2024 18:21:27 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: Re: What's happening to Sender: headers? To: Bakul Shah Cc: Andrew Reilly , FreeBSD-STABLE Mailing List Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000fca6900616179a70" X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4VHnsk0hbYz4C8b --000000000000fca6900616179a70 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Apr 14, 2024, 6:11=E2=80=AFPM Bakul Shah wrot= e: > > > > On Apr 14, 2024, at 3:33=E2=80=AFPM, Andrew Reilly > wrote: > > > > > > Over the weekend I got around to investigating, and discovered that the > errant messages don=E2=80=99t _have_ a Sender: header. There=E2=80=99s a= Return-Path: > header that captures the envelope-from, but I haven=E2=80=99t figured out= how to > make sieve check that yet: it doesn=E2=80=99t seem to like it. Sieve doc= umentation > is spectacularly inconclusive, but I suspect that the envelope extension > might do what I want, but that=E2=80=99s not really my question. > > > > Does anyone know why the Sender: header, which used to be so reliable > that I had thought it an intrinsic part of the SMTP/MTA ecosystem, has go= ne > away, or is at least not ubiquitous? > > The Sender: field is optional. I don't know why FreeBSD stopped using it > but I filter on List-Id: (which is used by pretty much every mailing list= ), > which seems more appropriate. > Bapt is going to restore it Monday. It's useful for vacation(1) still apparently. Warner > --000000000000fca6900616179a70 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


On Sun, Apr 14, 2024, 6:11=E2=80=AFPM Bakul Shah <<= a href=3D"mailto:bakul@iitbombay.org">bakul@iitbombay.org> wrote:


> On Apr 14, 2024, at 3:33=E2=80=AFPM, Andrew Reilly <areilly@big= pond.net.au> wrote:
>
>
> Over the weekend I got around to investigating, and discovered that th= e errant messages don=E2=80=99t _have_ a Sender: header.=C2=A0 There=E2=80= =99s a Return-Path: header that captures the envelope-from, but I haven=E2= =80=99t figured out how to make sieve check that yet: it doesn=E2=80=99t se= em to like it.=C2=A0 Sieve documentation is spectacularly inconclusive, but= I suspect that the envelope extension might do what I want, but that=E2=80= =99s not really my question.
>
> Does anyone know why the Sender: header, which used to be so reliable = that I had thought it an intrinsic part of the SMTP/MTA ecosystem, has gone= away, or is at least not ubiquitous?

The Sender: field is optional. I don't know why FreeBSD stopped using i= t but I filter on List-Id: (which is used by pretty much every mailing list= ), which seems more appropriate.

Bapt is going to restore it Monday. It'= s useful for vacation(1) still apparently.=C2=A0
Warner=C2=A0
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