From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Apr 22 18:40:01 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F59C2BD3BD for ; Wed, 22 Apr 2020 18:40:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from roberthuff@rcn.com) Received: from smtp.rcn.com (smtp.rcn.com [69.168.97.78]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 496q4030hNz4d3C for ; Wed, 22 Apr 2020 18:40:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from roberthuff@rcn.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; d=rcn.com; s=20180516; c=relaxed/simple; q=dns/txt; i=@rcn.com; t=1587580799; h=From:Subject:Date:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; bh=isyRjqCFZ/2XvIB3Wzpd4AEOhW4=; b=KqCGj3WJ0P6AQU/gZuRHoruLUeSGX6qSOgPPAapQ3OROjZT+cviIYgL0KLjVrZ/U tVmHW2gs1lIJzIlJIS+HfrFskSih5YURYeSMX4p+lIkdBhT236HRmPYdaesPE4S3 fvkc/SlKc065F5dxQXsYJAd51Ih+RRNWsCHh1r44UmHG715XbwHTp1V9amy7Tt7p xfSSmOQykIe9c19UGqhoI3LXRH2giwlBE8ATdlf28G5KbS7zbyh8q6ZnH2+BSALM Gzo1ouaNYonc2B3+2Tk6rWpqUHaGb8u0eHdejdTbp0Bqy+JpCYQ19GLRiDfZ6V0s K5nIgt0VyjkFYj2VpRKU8A==; X_CMAE_Category: , , X-CNFS-Analysis: v=2.3 cv=F/kpiZpN c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=9TgA2UwI6Wy+6BV4wQM/cQ==:117 a=9TgA2UwI6Wy+6BV4wQM/cQ==:17 a=KGjhK52YXX0A:10 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=XRQyMpdBKAEA:10 a=cl8xLZFz6L8A:10 a=48faUk6PgeAA:10 a=wfd47yYHV6AYApsRbEoA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 X-CM-Score: 0 X-Scanned-by: Cloudmark Authority Engine X-Authed-Username: cm9iZXJ0aHVmZkByY24uY29t Received: from [209.6.230.48] ([209.6.230.48:16289] helo=jerusalem.litteratus.org.litteratus.org) by smtp.rcn.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.6.25.56547 r(Core:3.6.25.0)) with ESMTPSA (cipher=AES256-GCM-SHA384) id 41/70-51190-E7F80AE5; Wed, 22 Apr 2020 14:39:59 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <24224.36734.511093.415773@jerusalem.litteratus.org> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2020 14:39:58 -0400 From: Robert Huff To: "Steve O'Hara-Smith" Cc: Robert Huff , freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Wayland on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <20200422171751.e85396afb993a0c61a248565@sohara.org> References: <5058973.kMyvyFPq5o@amos> <20200421150741.28dd6309.freebsd@edvax.de> <24223.11679.688616.192643@jerusalem.litteratus.org> <20200422023243.GA81187@neutralgood.org> <20200422070028.30dd2fb16ccae9b6d9cde901@sohara.org> <24224.11002.960241.607629@jerusalem.litteratus.org> <20200422124356.5329c504e03524a59b536cc6@sohara.org> <24224.26111.448437.531092@jerusalem.litteratus.org> <20200422171751.e85396afb993a0c61a248565@sohara.org> X-Mailer: VM 8.2.0b under 26.3 (amd64-portbld-freebsd13.0) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 496q4030hNz4d3C X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=rcn.com header.s=20180516 header.b=KqCGj3WJ; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=rcn.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of roberthuff@rcn.com designates 69.168.97.78 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=roberthuff@rcn.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.62 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[rcn.com:s=20180516]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:69.168.97.0/24]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(-1.52)[ip: (-9.01), ipnet: 69.168.97.0/24(0.71), asn: 36271(0.74), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_LOW(-1.00)[rcn.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[rcn.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[rcn.com,none]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[78.97.168.69.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36271, ipnet:69.168.97.0/24, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[78.97.168.69.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2020 18:40:01 -0000 Steve O'Hara-Smith writes: > > 2) Based on 1980s concepts and hardware (which affects what code > > is written and how) > > Hmm unix is based on 1970s concepts and 1960s hardware, Is it? I'll leave this to people with deeper knowledge, but I get the impression a _lot_ has changed - and not just under the hood - over the last thirty years. > > 3) "It just grew." (Which contributes to (1).) > > That I'd have to disagree with, the gap betweem X11Rn and X11Rn+1 > was always long and seemed to involve considerable care and there has never > been an X12 (despite getting to X11 between 1984 and 1987). The comparison that leapt to mind was to GCC, and its replacement with LLVM. I am not a compiler guru ... but I have heard those who are muttering in eldritch tongues about minor decisions made long ago that have become irreversibly embedded and block non-trivial improvements to speed and/or accuracy. Now LLVM _may_ be following a similar path - but there seems to be a vigorous effort to avoid that where possible. Respectfully, Robert Huff