Date: Wed, 19 Dec 2018 09:55:37 -0600 From: Matt Joras <mjoras@freebsd.org> To: araujo@freebsd.org Cc: Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com>, Joe Maloney <jmaloney@ixsystems.com>, ken@ixsystems.com, Martin Wilke <miwi@freebsd.org>, "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" <freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org>, Warren Block <wblock@freebsd.org>, Kris Moore <kmoore@freebsd.org> Subject: Re: OpenRC on FreeBSD Message-ID: <CADdTf%2BhbUywEuAKoRjySp9G=_D1Bw3JYsryF1DTOydBZDrousg@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <CAOfEmZh4RHCkfSsxNGjtg%2BSa6CowgGSTntkicd0Ny4g=m5n0Og@mail.gmail.com> References: <397FBAFF-2575-4AE4-B2BC-2DFDA769040A@FreeBSD.org> <CANCZdfp%2BQXngCRqevXT%2BDKgQj1S276PdpvqyZpiuOC%2BvMAP24A@mail.gmail.com> <7BBA9943-7CA1-4349-9B48-1641BA11FCA3@FreeBSD.org> <CANCZdfoFXjx_dEW-8CkAB5Wq1=H806jJeoLAStVWcJ=ErcHm0A@mail.gmail.com> <CAOfEmZh4RHCkfSsxNGjtg%2BSa6CowgGSTntkicd0Ny4g=m5n0Og@mail.gmail.com>
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On Wed, Dec 19, 2018, 9:49 AM Marcelo Araujo <araujobsdport@gmail.com wrote= : > Em qua, 19 de dez de 2018 =C3=A0s 23:02, Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com> esc= reveu: > > > > > > > On Wed, Dec 19, 2018 at 7:57 AM Martin Wilke <miwi@freebsd.org> wrote: > > > >> Hi, > >> > >> The missing bit was actually the flag for switching the rc=E2=80=99s w= hich have > >> been resolved. > >> > > > > No. The missing bit is an articulated plan. While that minor sub-issue > may > > be resolved, I see no plan for integration into the tree. Unless the pl= an > > is 'commit the review in one big push' which really isn't a viable plan= . > > There are problems with the review (it's too large to be successful, an= d > > has issues that need to be discussed in a less massively huge > environment). > > This isn't what the working group's conclusion would be the next steps. > The > > FCP I provided feedback on died. It was a good start on a plan, but was > > just dropped with my feedback completely ignored. > > > > Hi Warner, > > I have asked miwi@ to keep that huge patch on the review because of the > lack of coordination and discussion between different groups and also > because there is not a clear plan how to bring OpenRC into FreeBSD. So in > that way people could try the patch easily without chasing different open > reviews, and to be honest, without further discussion regarding to how th= e > transition would happens between rcd and OpenRC, there is nothing much to > review there. > Just making a small suggestion here, does our Phabricator support "stacked" diffs? That is the defacto way for a group of diffs on Phabricator to be logically grouped so they are easy to navigate and review separately. > IMHO, if we want to move forward with OpenRC on FreeBSD we would need a > broad discussion, because it will impacts not only the base system but al= so > ports, and also docs needs to get involved because we eventually would ne= ed > to update our documentation. We have people that wants OpenRC also in oth= er > hands we have people that wants to keep things as it is. > > NOTE: I have updated the review with the same content of this email just = to > make it registered there. > > I agree for review purpose small chunks are better, however I don't see y= et > a plan for all this migration between rcd and OpenRC. > Best, > > > > > > Warner > > > > > >> - Martin > >> > >> On 19 Dec 2018, at 10:51 PM, Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com> wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >> On Wed, Dec 19, 2018 at 7:39 AM Martin Wilke <miwi@freebsd.org> wrote: > >> > >>> Hi > >>> > >>> I'd like to reopen the discussion for OpenRC on FreeBSD. Basically th= is > >>> is the second attempt to get it into FreeBSD. > >>> > >>> I've opened a review here with a working patch for CURRENT, > >>> https://reviews.freebsd.org/D18578 > >>> > >>> > >>> To recap the discussion > >>> * First attempt of RFC in March of 2018: > >>> > https://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-hackers/2018-March/052358.htm= l > >>> * Working group at BSDCan: > >>> https://wiki.freebsd.org/DevSummit/201806/OpenRC > >>> > >>> Here some key points: > >>> > >>> OpenRC provides additional features for service management without > >>> requiring kernel changes or replacing pid 1, unlike launchd and other > >>> solutions. All rc.d scripts have been converted with a few changes, > >>> typically changing the shebang and making sure the start function is > named > >>> start(). Most service scripts are simplified, usually needing only > name, > >>> command, and, if required, depends statements. > >>> > >>> History: > >>> OpenRC started out as an init system by Roy Marples, developed for th= e > >>> Gentoo Alt (FreeBSD) kernel branch. It was more widely adopted into > Gentoo > >>> as baselayout v2, and was then split off as a separate BSD-licensed > >>> project. It is under active development, portable, and remains BSD > licensed > >>> today. > >>> > >>> OpenRC and RC: > >>> Both can coexist and be chosen with a setting in /boot/loader.conf. > >>> > >>> OpenRC Features: > >>> > >>> Service supervision and service monitoring: any service can be > >>> supervised. Supervised services that crash are automatically > restarted. The > >>> rc-status command shows how many times a service has restarted. > >>> > >>> Device hotplug support and event-driven service management: the hotpl= ug > >>> feature allows devd to take actions when devices are connected. For > >>> example, a USB wifi adapter can create additional network services wh= en > >>> attached. The net-online service can, for example, detect when a > network > >>> connection is restored, and restart ntp. > >>> > >>> Network profiles: using stacked runlevels, different profiles can be > >>> established for different networking settings. For instance, differen= t > >>> profiles can be used for wired or wireless networking, or for differi= ng > >>> wireless networks, as well as dependency caching and parallel startup > speed > >>> up booting. > >>> > >>> Interactive mode: > >>> The boot process can be run interactively for more effective debuggin= g. > >>> > >>> OpenRC uses the term =E2=80=9Crunlevels=E2=80=9D to refer to the cont= ext in which a > >>> script is running. There are only three at present: > >>> sysinit (the OpenRC system is starting), boot (start base services wh= en > >>> the computer is booting), and default (normal execution). > >>> > >>> OpenRC, by default, provides a =E2=80=9Ccolorized=E2=80=9D text boot,= using ANSI color > >>> sequences. This can be disabled. > >>> > >>> Ports: > >>> As of July 2017, iXsystems has created OpenRC versions of port servic= e > >>> scripts for the entire ports tree. These scripts coexist with the rc.= d > >>> versions. > >>> > >>> License: > >>> OpenRC is a BSD licensed RC init system written in C. From a user > >>> perspective, it is very similar to the FreeBSD rc.d init system, > making it > >>> easy to use and learn. > >>> > >>> Tested: OpenRC has been used as the init system for TrueOS since > October > >>> 2016. > >>> > >>> Ken Moore has an OpenRC vs RC.d comparison which can be found here: > >>> http://www.wonkity.com/~wblock/openrc/OpenRC_rc.d.pdf < > >>> http://www.wonkity.com/~wblock/openrc/OpenRC_rc.d.pdf>; > >>> I look forward to discuss the features and capabilities of OpenRC. > >>> > >> > >> This is cool technology. > >> > >> However, what was missing last time was a written plan that could be > >> critiqued for fit with the project's needs. The result of the working > group > >> was that this was to be produced, and we'd iterate through it to ease > the > >> landing of openrc in the tree. I think there's wide agreement this is > cool, > >> and that we'd like tot have both it and rc.d in the tree for a > transition > >> period. Absent a plan, though, it's not really possible to say 'go do > it' > >> or 'that's insane'. > >> > >> So maybe start there? > >> > >> Warner > >> > >> > >> > > -- > > -- > Marcelo Araujo (__)araujo@FreeBSD.org > \\\'',)http://www.FreeBSD.org <http://www.freebsd.org/>; \/ \ ^ > Power To Server. .\. /_) > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org= " >
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