From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Dec 31 01:27:21 1995 Return-Path: owner-chat Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA14668 for chat-outgoing; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 01:27:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA14637 for ; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 01:27:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id KAA07854; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 10:27:06 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id KAA12621; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 10:27:05 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id JAA15327; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 09:32:41 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199512310832.JAA15327@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: FreeBSD Lounge: Jordans makes it to club 8) To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com (Amancio Hasty Jr.) Date: Sun, 31 Dec 1995 09:32:41 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199512310315.TAA00449@rah.star-gate.com> from "Amancio Hasty Jr." at Dec 30, 95 07:15:32 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-chat@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > > I just spent a few minutes with Jordan in cyberspace -- kind of cool > to have our fearless leader on the Mbone. Can you please move such discussions to freebsd-chat? -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Dec 31 06:26:50 1995 Return-Path: owner-chat Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA04924 for chat-outgoing; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 06:26:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from server.id.net (root@server.id.net [199.125.1.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA04918 for ; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 06:26:45 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rls@localhost) by server.id.net (8.7.1/8.7.1) id JAA01215; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 09:27:09 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Shady Message-Id: <199512311427.JAA01215@server.id.net> Subject: Re: 4 Gig SCSI disks. To: chuckr@glue.umd.edu (Chuck Robey) Date: Sun, 31 Dec 1995 09:27:09 -0500 (EST) Cc: FreeBSD-chat@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Chuck Robey" at Dec 29, 95 11:17:55 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > I don't follow the magazine ads closely enough (too busy with classes is > an excuse that seems to work) but I need to know what the present idea of > a good deal on a 4 gig SCSI drive is (I'm thinking of expanding). Does > anyone have any recent numbers they'd care to share? What we considered a good deal when we purchased two months ago. Micropolis 4243W SCSI-3 Fast & Wide 4.3GB Hard Drive......$1100.00 Note: The 'wide' option generally makes it a couple hundred dollars more than just a 'normal' hard drive. -- Rob === _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ Innovative Data Services Serving South-Eastern Michigan Internet Service Provider / Hardware Sales / Consulting Services Voice: (810)855-0404 / Fax: (810)855-3268 / Web: http://www.id.net From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Dec 31 06:38:08 1995 Return-Path: owner-chat Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA05763 for chat-outgoing; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 06:38:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from chemserv.umd.edu (chemserv.umd.edu [129.2.64.40]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA05752 for ; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 06:38:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from cappuccino.eng.umd.edu (cappuccino.eng.umd.edu [129.2.98.14]) by chemserv.umd.edu (8.7.3/8.7) with ESMTP id JAA05003; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 09:37:59 -0500 (EST) Received: (chuckr@localhost) by cappuccino.eng.umd.edu (8.7.3/8.6.4) id JAA00701; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 09:37:59 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 31 Dec 1995 09:37:58 -0500 (EST) From: Chuck Robey X-Sender: chuckr@cappuccino.eng.umd.edu To: Robert Shady cc: FreeBSD-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 4 Gig SCSI disks. In-Reply-To: <199512311427.JAA01215@server.id.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Sun, 31 Dec 1995, Robert Shady wrote: > > I don't follow the magazine ads closely enough (too busy with classes is > > an excuse that seems to work) but I need to know what the present idea of > > a good deal on a 4 gig SCSI drive is (I'm thinking of expanding). Does > > anyone have any recent numbers they'd care to share? > > What we considered a good deal when we purchased two months ago. > > Micropolis 4243W SCSI-3 Fast & Wide 4.3GB Hard Drive......$1100.00 > > Note: The 'wide' option generally makes it a couple hundred dollars more > than just a 'normal' hard drive. > Thanks, Rob. I'm starting to get a feel for it, from yours and other replies, and it looks like you got a good deal. > -- Rob > === > _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/ > _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ > _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ > > Innovative Data Services > Serving South-Eastern Michigan > Internet Service Provider / Hardware Sales / Consulting Services > Voice: (810)855-0404 / Fax: (810)855-3268 / Web: http://www.id.net > ============================================================================ Chuck Robey chuckr@eng.umd.edu -- I run FreeBSD on n3lxx and Journey2 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Dilbert Zone is Dilbert's new WWW home! The area features never-before-seen original sketches of Dilbert, a photo tour of Scott Adams' studio, Dilbert Trivia and memorabilia, high school photos and much more!: From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Dec 31 07:37:47 1995 Return-Path: owner-chat Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA10525 for chat-outgoing; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 07:37:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA10509 for ; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 07:37:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id QAA25643 ; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 16:37:38 +0100 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id QAA19740 ; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 16:37:38 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.7.3/keltia-uucp-2.7) id QAA22396; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 16:04:41 +0100 (MET) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199512311504.QAA22396@keltia.freenix.fr> Subject: Re: 4 Gig SCSI disks. To: rls@kilroy.id.net (Robert Shady) Date: Sun, 31 Dec 1995 16:04:40 +0100 (MET) Cc: chuckr@glue.umd.edu, FreeBSD-chat@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199512311427.JAA01215@server.id.net> from "Robert Shady" at Dec 31, 95 09:27:09 am X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1489 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8b] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk It seems that Robert Shady said: > Micropolis 4243W SCSI-3 Fast & Wide 4.3GB Hard Drive......$1100.00 > > Note: The 'wide' option generally makes it a couple hundred dollars more > than just a 'normal' hard drive. I'm getting wary of recent Micropolis drives... Between a few friends nothing less than 5 died recently (mix of 1/2/9 GB), some after a few weeks of operation. Agreed there are no 4 GB involved to my knowledge... Older drives have been working fine (I have a 1624 -- 640 MB -- 5"1/4, no problem) for years. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #9: Mon Dec 25 22:55:52 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Dec 31 13:26:43 1995 Return-Path: owner-chat Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA20712 for chat-outgoing; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 13:26:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (ppp3-31.GANet.NET [198.30.255.31]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA20705 for ; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 13:26:32 -0800 (PST) Received: (from ejc@localhost) by localhost (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA04598; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 16:26:09 -0500 Date: Sun, 31 Dec 1995 16:26:06 -0500 (EST) From: "Eric J. Chet" To: Robert Shady cc: Chuck Robey , FreeBSD-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 4 Gig SCSI disks. In-Reply-To: <199512311427.JAA01215@server.id.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Sun, 31 Dec 1995, Robert Shady wrote: > > I don't follow the magazine ads closely enough (too busy with classes is > > an excuse that seems to work) but I need to know what the present idea of > > a good deal on a 4 gig SCSI drive is (I'm thinking of expanding). Does > > anyone have any recent numbers they'd care to share? > > What we considered a good deal when we purchased two months ago. > > Micropolis 4243W SCSI-3 Fast & Wide 4.3GB Hard Drive......$1100.00 > > Note: The 'wide' option generally makes it a couple hundred dollars more > than just a 'normal' hard drive. I just purchased one of these, it had spindle problems(would not spin up, tech said it was bearing problems). I sent it back for another one, I had the same problems. I replaced the second bad one, for a Seagate Barracuda ST15150W 4.29 GB Wide drive. The Cuda is working great, just make sure you have redundant cooling for these drives. Eric ejc@nasvr1.cb.att.com > > -- Rob > === > _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/ > _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ > _/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/_/ _/ > > Innovative Data Services > Serving South-Eastern Michigan > Internet Service Provider / Hardware Sales / Consulting Services > Voice: (810)855-0404 / Fax: (810)855-3268 / Web: http://www.id.net > > From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Dec 31 14:29:03 1995 Return-Path: owner-chat Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA22601 for chat-outgoing; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 14:29:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from ulc199.residence.gatech.edu (root@ulc199.residence.gatech.edu [199.77.162.99]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA22596 for ; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 14:28:58 -0800 (PST) Received: (from ken@localhost) by ulc199.residence.gatech.edu (8.6.11/8.6.11) id RAA10850; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 17:28:40 -0500 From: Kenneth Merry Message-Id: <199512312228.RAA10850@ulc199.residence.gatech.edu> Subject: Re: 4 Gig SCSI disks. To: chuckr@glue.umd.edu Date: Sun, 31 Dec 1995 17:28:40 -0500 (EST) Cc: chat@FreeBSD.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-chat@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk (note: I originally just sent this to Chuck, but he wanted to see it go to the list as well. And sorry about the delay Chuck...I'm 'away' from my net connection until Tuesday, and only check mail via long distance. ) > I don't follow the magazine ads closely enough (too busy with classes is > an excuse that seems to work) but I need to know what the present idea of > a good deal on a 4 gig SCSI drive is (I'm thinking of expanding). Does > anyone have any recent numbers they'd care to share? Well, lesse. If you go for a Quantum Grand Prix, look for something under $1000. If you go for a Micropolis 4 gig, look for something a little over $1000. (like $1030-1050) If you want a Quantum Atlas, they'll probably be in the mid 1100's to the mid 1200's. If it's more, it's probably not a good deal. I'm not sure about the Connor drives, I suppose something around $1000. Barracudas will probably run you about what the Quantum Atlases will.... As far as what's 'recommended'...well, I've seen pro and con for just about every drive. The Grand Prix drives have gotten mixed reviews, I'm not sure whether net.opinion is pro or con on those. The Barracudas are known to run hot. I think if you keep them _well_ cooled, they should do fine. I've heard good and bad about Micropolis as well. I dunno about Conner. I have a Quantum Atlas in my machine (model # XP34300, the XP34301 is a Grand Prix, so make sure you know what you're getting!) The 4 gig Atlas has 2 megs of buffer on board, and I can get some pretty decent throughput with it. For example: --- IOZONE writes a 39 Megabyte sequential file consisting of 4992 records which are each 8192 bytes in length. It then reads the file. It prints the bytes-per-second rate at which the computer can read and write files. Writing the 39 Megabyte file, 'iozone.tmp'...6.390625 seconds Reading the file...7.695312 seconds IOZONE performance measurements: 6399133 bytes/second for writing the file 5314204 bytes/second for reading the file ---- The machine is an i486/100, 32 megs of ram, Adaptec 2842, FreeBSD 2.1.0. I'm not sure why the writes are faster than the reads. Anyway, hope this helps some. Hope I didn't ramble too much. :) Ken -- Kenneth Merry ken@ulc199.residence.gatech.edu Disclaimer: I don't speak for GTRI, GT, or Elvis. From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Dec 31 18:58:32 1995 Return-Path: owner-chat Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id SAA03925 for chat-outgoing; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 18:58:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from Aspen.Woc.Atinc.COM ([198.138.38.205]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA03920 for ; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 18:58:27 -0800 (PST) Received: (from jmb@localhost) by Aspen.Woc.Atinc.COM (8.6.12/8.6.9) id VAA22877; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 21:57:48 -0500 Date: Sun, 31 Dec 1995 21:57:47 -0500 (EST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" X-Sender: jmb@Aspen.Woc.Atinc.COM To: Carey Nairn cc: Barry Masterson , chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ppp as su & normal user In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Mon, 1 Jan 1996, Carey Nairn wrote: > > xterm -e ppp & > > which just starts ppp in a new window for me. I have also used the > demand dial feature of ppp at times, in fact I set up a FreeBSD box for a > local business to connect their Windows LAN to their ISP and run POP mail > clients to retrieve their mail in this way (it was a very nice solution for > them). can you believe it...i set up a 2.1.0 box for a firm downtown that uses microsoft office and their smtp gateway. dedicated 28.8 link to a local service provider. the smtp gateway box crashed everyday. thousands of $ in software. installed a 2.1.0 to talk to the service provider and then send the mail on microsh*t smtp gateway.....no more crashes. blimey, one computer (2.1.0) to prevent another computer from dying. and microsh*t is a multi-billion dollar company. sh*t sells. bloody unbelieveable. Jonathan M. Bresler FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.ORG play go. ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life i am moving to a new job. PLEASE USE: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Dec 31 20:20:49 1995 Return-Path: owner-chat Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA06925 for chat-outgoing; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 20:20:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from wedge.cc.utas.edu.au (wedge.cc.utas.edu.au [131.217.10.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA06917 Sun, 31 Dec 1995 20:20:41 -0800 (PST) Received: (from cp_nairn@localhost) by wedge.cc.utas.edu.au (8.7.1/8.6.6) id PAA27823; Mon, 1 Jan 1996 15:20:36 +1100 (EST) Date: Mon, 1 Jan 1996 15:20:36 +1100 (EST) From: Carey Nairn To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" cc: Barry Masterson , chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ppp as su & normal user In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Sun, 31 Dec 1995, Jonathan M. Bresler wrote: > On Mon, 1 Jan 1996, Carey Nairn wrote: > > > > > xterm -e ppp & > > > > which just starts ppp in a new window for me. I have also used the > > demand dial feature of ppp at times, in fact I set up a FreeBSD box for a > > local business to connect their Windows LAN to their ISP and run POP mail > > clients to retrieve their mail in this way (it was a very nice solution for > > them). > > can you believe it...i set up a 2.1.0 box for a firm downtown > that uses microsoft office and their smtp gateway. dedicated 28.8 link > to a local service provider. the smtp gateway box crashed everyday. > thousands of $ in software. installed a 2.1.0 to talk to the service > provider and then send the mail on microsh*t smtp gateway.....no more > crashes. > > blimey, one computer (2.1.0) to prevent another computer from dying. > and microsh*t is a multi-billion dollar company. sh*t sells. > > bloody unbelieveable. My situation was much the same, except they were using WinNT as their gateway before I gave them a *real* solution... They kept on having crashes or worse yet the server wouldn't disconnect at idle times costing them a fortune in interstate calls to their ISP, and nothing was automatic... I'm not blowing my own trumpet here, I'm just so happy with the flexibility and stability of FreeBSD... I recommend it to lots of people all the time.. ========================================================================= Carey Nairn ! email : Carey.Nairn@its.utas.edu.au Networks and Communications ! phone : (002) 20 7419 Information Technology Services ! fax : (002) 20 7898 University of Tasmania. ! ========================================================================= From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Dec 31 20:27:52 1995 Return-Path: owner-chat Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA07101 for chat-outgoing; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 20:27:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from toadflax.cs.ucdavis.edu (toadflax.cs.ucdavis.edu [128.120.56.188]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA07095 for ; Sun, 31 Dec 1995 20:27:47 -0800 (PST) Received: by toadflax.cs.ucdavis.edu (4.1/UCD.CS.2.6) id AA07663; Sun, 31 Dec 95 20:27:45 PST From: obrien@cs.ucdavis.edu (David E. O'Brien) Message-Id: <9601010427.AA07663@toadflax.cs.ucdavis.edu> Subject: Re: ppp as su & normal user To: FreeBSD-chat@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD misc chating list) Date: Sun, 31 Dec 1995 20:27:43 -72800 (PST) In-Reply-To: from "Jonathan M. Bresler" at Dec 31, 95 09:57:47 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 PGP3ALPHA] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-chat@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > On Mon, 1 Jan 1996, Carey Nairn wrote: > > can you believe it...i set up a 2.1.0 box for a firm downtown > that uses microsoft office and their smtp gateway. dedicated 28.8 link > to a local service provider. the smtp gateway box crashed everyday. Not at all. I spent all last year fighting with Microshit's smtp gateway. Runs on only on a MS-DOS box notice. I really get tired of all those zealists telling me how great MS-NT is for TCP/IP networking and Internet service stuff. If it is SO great, why hasn't Microshit written an smtp server for MS-NT??? > thousands of $ in software. installed a 2.1.0 to talk to the service > provider and then send the mail on microsh*t smtp gateway.....no more > crashes. Yep, you got the fix. You have to funnel all smtp mail through a Unix box. Microshit's smtp gateway simply can't take the beating of many hosts pounding on its door with the T-1 connection we had. Since the whole company LAN was connect to the Internet the solultion was either block smtp from the msgates or point the MX records to the Unix box and hack sendmail.cf on the unix machine to attach directly to the ms-gateways by passing MX. :-( > blimey, one computer (2.1.0) to prevent another computer from dying. > and microsh*t is a multi-billion dollar company. sh*t sells. > > bloody unbelieveable. Na, totally believeable in the corporate world. MS is big, they MUST know what they are doing. Yea BS! I just can't understand why people put up with this stuff. Just last night I spoke to an office worker and she was saying how both MS-Word and WordPerfect for Windows running under MS-win3.1 keeps dieing when they write documents. They have to save every 10 minutes to keep their losses at a minimum. No wonder so many people are learning to hate computers. :-) -- David (obrien@cs.ucdavis.edu)