From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 00:24:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA03583 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 00:24:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA03578 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 00:24:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id JAA14541; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:24:00 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id JAA05532; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:17:58 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970907091757.ST01979@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:17:57 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org (Jamil J. Weatherbee) Subject: Re: SIGCLD References: <199709020249.TAA16490@implode.root.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709020249.TAA16490@implode.root.com>; from David Greenman on Sep 1, 1997 19:49:17 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As David Greenman wrote: > Uh, I think you are misunderstanding this. Under FreeBSD, you *must* > call wait to reap child processes. Ignoring SIGCHLD doesn't let you off > the hook. The behavior is different under System V, but that isn't > relavent. The behaviour is different on SysV in that for SysV, SIG_DFL != SIG_IGN for SIGCLD. That is, while their default behaviour effectively ignores this signal, it isn't called SIG_IGN. By explicitly setting the signal handler to SIG_IGN, you tell the system that you aren't interested in the death of your child, and you won't get zombies. This of course is a terrible crock, but was the only way to express this in SVR3. SVR4 and Posix use the option SA_NOCLDWAIT in sigaction(2) to express this wish. FreeBSD doesn't implement this option (yet). -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 00:53:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA05746 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 00:53:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA05740 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 00:53:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id JAA14726; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:52:52 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id JAA05631; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:30:12 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970907093012.CE57420@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:30:12 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: babkin@hq.icb.chel.su (Serge A. Babkin) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NPX old bug References: <199709010535.LAA16143@hq.icb.chel.su> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709010535.LAA16143@hq.icb.chel.su>; from Serge A. Babkin on Sep 1, 1997 11:35:13 +0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Serge A. Babkin wrote: > After I found this reason of panic I checked -current and > found that npx just has no kdc_* structure anymore ! Did > someone else found these panics before me or is it > just a coincidence ? The entire kdc stuff has been removed, and is not in danger to reappear in its old form. (It actually never got ready at all.) > P.S. I've found that `vtophys' is worth adding it to DDB. The > addition is very simple. Does anyone from the core team think > that it's worth too ? That's certainly not worth a core-team decision. ;-) Are you sure there's not already one of the `show' commands that could do this? -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 00:54:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA05816 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 00:54:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA05803 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 00:53:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id JAA14751; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:53:56 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id JAA05662; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:41:52 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970907094152.MT27230@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:41:52 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: jmattson@wco.com (Jim Mattson) Subject: Re: Patch for small annoyance in st driver References: <199709011918.MAA00247@denali.campbell.ca.us> <199709012126.XAA02739@yedi.iaf.nl> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709012126.XAA02739@yedi.iaf.nl>; from Wilko Bulte on Sep 1, 1997 23:26:37 +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Wilko Bulte wrote: > > With 2.2.2-RELEASE, I get the following error on every open of my tape > > device: > > > > st0(ahc0:4:0): ILLEGAL REQUEST asc:20,0 Invalid command operation code > > Whether this happens depends on the device at hand. Some devices (the > smarter ones) simply accept and ignore the command when they cannot > act on the PREVENT MEDIUM REMOVAL (think it's called that). But the command is optional by the standard, so i agree the kernel shouldn't complain. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 00:54:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA05849 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 00:54:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA05836 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 00:54:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id JAA14752; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:54:03 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id JAA05674; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:44:48 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970907094448.OR32111@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:44:48 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org (Jamil J. Weatherbee) Subject: Re: Syslog Facility References: X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from Jamil J. Weatherbee on Sep 1, 1997 13:56:19 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > Why is sysylog still using the varargs.h facility (instead of stdarg.h)? Where do you see this? #if __STDC__ #include #else #include #endif The question is, of course, whether the !__STDC__ hooks are really 1) needed, and 2) functional anymore. > Also am I right to assume that va_end() doesn't really do anything under > bsd? Who cares? UTSL. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 00:54:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA05890 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 00:54:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA05875 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 00:54:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id JAA14758; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:54:11 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id JAA05701; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:48:55 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970907094855.FR18909@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:48:55 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org (Jamil J. Weatherbee) Subject: Re: Syslog Facility References: X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from Jamil J. Weatherbee on Sep 1, 1997 14:38:58 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > I have looked at the code to lpd and pppd and I can't figure what I am > doing wrong here. I am doing an: > > openlog (argv[0], LOG_PID|LOG_NDELAY, LOG_DAEMON); > > in main an later in another function > > syslog (LOG_ERR, "some message"); > > but the syslog facillity is refusing to log the process id number eg: > > date machine programname[pid]: message j@uriah 973% cat > foo.c #include #include int main(void) { openlog("junk", LOG_PID | LOG_NDELAY, LOG_USER); syslog(LOG_ERR, "some junk"); return 0; } ^D j@uriah 974% make foo cc -O2 -m486 -pipe foo.c -o foo j@uriah 975% ./foo j@uriah 976% Sep 7 09:47:21 uriah junk[5692]: some junk It works for me. Btw., using argv[0] directly is not a good idea. Strip off the leading pathname components. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 01:53:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA08768 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 01:53:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id BAA08763 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 01:52:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id KAA15050; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 10:52:56 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id KAA05934; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 10:30:23 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970907103022.YU02721@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 10:30:22 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: handy@sag.space.lockheed.com (Brian N. Handy) Subject: Re: Tape question References: X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from Brian N. Handy on Sep 2, 1997 14:19:30 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Brian N. Handy wrote: > The problem is easily described: > > - The Exabyte tapes to be read have a variable (logical) block size, > it typically is 8192 bytes, but often shorter. > > - My original c program always attempted to read a 8192 byte block: > > nn = read(unit,buffer,8192); > > - On the sun this worked, it would read one (logical) block, and > return the actual number of bytes read. > > - In FreeBSD this created unpredictable results, if the logical block > was shorter than 8192. This must be a problem with the Exabyte then. It works fine for me, with a Tandberg TDC4222, and a QIC-525 cartridge (QIC-150, of course, doesn't work since it's fixed-length blocking). Also, i know that restore(8) basically relies on this feature in order to determine the tape block size. ISTR that this once was broken, but that's been quite some time ago. Here's my test program: #include #include #include #include #include #include int main(int argc, char **argv) { size_t table[] = {512, 1024, 2048, 4096, 8192, 20480, 10240, 15555, 33333, 0}; int i, fd, mode; ssize_t rv; char buf[65536], obuf[65536]; const char *op; ssize_t (*func)(int, void *, size_t); if (argc != 2) { fprintf(stderr, "usage: foo {read|write}\n"); return 1; } if (strcmp(argv[1], "write") == 0) { mode = O_WRONLY; func = (ssize_t (*)(int, void *, size_t))write; op = "write()"; } else { mode = O_RDONLY; func = read; op = "read()"; } if ((fd = open("/dev/rst0", mode)) == -1) { fprintf(stderr, "open() failed\n"); return 1; } for (i = 0; i < 65536; i++) obuf[i] = buf[i] = (char)random(); for (i = 0; table[i]; i++) { size_t amnt = func == read? 65536: table[i]; rv = func(fd, buf, amnt); if (rv == -1) { fprintf(stderr, "%s failed\n", op); return -1; } printf("%s returned %d out of %d\n", op, rv, amnt); if (func == read && memcmp(buf, obuf, rv)) fprintf(stderr, "buffer fails comparision\n"); } return 0; } And the results are: j@uriah 1010% ./foo write write() returned 512 out of 512 write() returned 1024 out of 1024 write() returned 2048 out of 2048 write() returned 4096 out of 4096 write() returned 8192 out of 8192 write() returned 20480 out of 20480 write() returned 10240 out of 10240 write() returned 15555 out of 15555 write() returned 33333 out of 33333 j@uriah 1011% ./foo read read() returned 512 out of 65536 read() returned 1024 out of 65536 read() returned 2048 out of 65536 read() returned 4096 out of 65536 read() returned 8192 out of 65536 read() returned 20480 out of 65536 read() returned 10240 out of 65536 read() returned 15555 out of 65536 read() returned 33333 out of 65536 -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 01:53:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA08801 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 01:53:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id BAA08779 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 01:53:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id KAA15052; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 10:53:06 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id KAA05959; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 10:45:28 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970907104528.OH62321@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 10:45:28 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: gmarco@giovannelli.it (Gianmarco Giovannelli) Subject: Re: a c at the place of x (tar error) References: <19970903133610.20557@lemis.com> <199709030529.AAA01636@argus.tfs.net> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709030529.AAA01636@argus.tfs.net>; from Jim Bryant on Sep 3, 1997 00:29:13 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jim Bryant wrote: > i think that if a formal survey were done, nobody has made this > mistake [heh, heh], but then you are one of the brave few who have > admitted to such braindeath [we all should be so brave]. > > try this: > > tar -tvzf /dev/nr[sw]t[0-7] > > that will skip past the "oops" archive. > > next > > use dd to get the remainder of the damaged archive. > > next Sheesh! You should at least have a little knowledge about tape drives before posting... Your suggestion won't work. EOM (``end of recorded medium'', as the SCSI specs call it) is a condition that is caught inside the drive itself. You can't position a tape behind this spot as long as the tape's firmware adheres to the SCSI specs. (Companies specializing on data recovery are said to have drives with patched firmware for just this purpose.) The only trick that, as rude as it sounds, would work is the following: Start writing some archive to the tape (preferrably some junk that doesn't interfere with the data you're going to recover, but don't just write NULs since programs like tar(1) might misinterpret them as the end of their archive). Just after this process started, turn off the power of the tape drive(!). This prevents the drive's firmware from recording the EOM mark that it would normally add. Now, turn power on again, rewind the tape, try skipping the junk you've just written (which must have been large enough to clobber the previous EOM mark), and try to make some sense out of the data that became visible again. Seriously, getting used to always write-protect your tapes after taking them out of the drive is the simpler method... -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 01:53:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA08849 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 01:53:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gateway.senet.com.au (root@gateway.senet.com.au [203.11.90.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA08831 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 01:53:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from holly.rd.net (root@c3-p48.senet.com.au [203.56.237.177]) by gateway.senet.com.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA09407 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:23:30 +0930 Received: from holly (darius@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by holly.rd.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA03149 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:23:34 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199709070853.SAA03149@holly.rd.net> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Divert sockets.. Reply-to: doconnor@ist.flinders.edu.au Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 18:23:32 +0930 From: "Daniel J. O'Connor" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I was wondering if its possible to write a program which would do 'dial on demand', by grabbing packets, and seeing if they are destined to go out of the system, and if so, run a script(which would cause a dialup). I know ijppp can do this, but I have problems with ijppp =) The only problem I can see is that since a default route wouldn't be established yet(since you aren't dialed up), the packets would be killed off before they pass through a divert socket.(I don't know much about how that stuff works :) Thanks. Seeya Darius ~~~~~~ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 02:07:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA09454 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 02:07:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from micron.efn.org (d198-232.uoregon.edu [128.223.198.232]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA09449 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 02:06:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mini@localhost) by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA04053; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 02:06:58 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970907020657.59233@micron.efn.org> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 02:06:57 -0700 From: Jonathan Mini To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: 'warning: function declaration isn't a prototype' Reply-To: Jonathan Mini Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e X-files: The Truth is Out There. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I am getting warnings along the lines of 'function declaration isn't a prototype' every time I declare a function that is void func(); (static or public) Does anybody know what this warning is trying to tell me? That is, why isn't the function a prototype, why does it do this, how do I get rid of the problem, and why does it warn me both on the prototype for the function and the actual declaration of the function? (this is source for an isa device in the kernel) -- Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) Ingenious Productions Software Development P.O. Box 5693 Eugene, Or 97405 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 02:20:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA10021 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 02:20:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id CAA10014 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 02:20:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id LAA15309 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:20:27 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id LAA06033; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:04:12 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970907110411.XU48502@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:04:11 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: IOCTL Commands - Where is my mistake? References: <199709030821.RAA00286@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709030821.RAA00286@word.smith.net.au>; from Mike Smith on Sep 3, 1997 17:51:57 +0930 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Mike Smith wrote: > > I want to pass IOCTL commands to a driver. This is what I do: > > > > #define DPT_IOCTL_INTERNAL_METRICS _IOW('D', 1, dpt_perf_t) > > You want to pass a pointer to the struct, not the struct itself. He does. The last argument of the _IOR, _IOW, and _IOWR macros always translates into ``pointer to the given type''. Passing an `int' directly (as SysV does) is not directly supported in FreeBSD, but can be emulated using the _IO macro. (The SysV compat syscalls in the console drivers do need this feature.) > caddr_t dest; > > /* get address in userspace */ > dest = fuword(*(caddr_t *)cmdarg); > /* copy out to userspace */ > return(copyout(&dpt->performance, dest, > sizeof(dpt->performance)) In Simon's case, the copyin/copyout would be handled by the upper ioctl() layers already (unlike SysV). I don't see why he should not use this feature. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 02:20:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA10040 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 02:20:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id CAA10020 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 02:20:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id LAA15310 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:20:30 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id LAA06048; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:09:03 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970907110903.WE07508@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:09:03 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: IOCTL Commands - Where is my mistake? References: <199709040519.PAA09446@ogre.dtir.qld.gov.au> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from Simon Shapiro on Sep 4, 1997 01:29:00 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Simon Shapiro wrote: > In SystemV, it would not have been luck, it would have been the way it > should be. One could argue that BSD's was of encoding three separate > arguments into one is not exactly a mark of engineering ellegance. Well, it offers two advantages: . It's failsafe. Change the size of the structure, and it will make it a different ioctl command. You can still support the old one if you want, if your kernel driver declares the old struct as `ofoo_ioctl_t'. Otherwise, an application will simply get an ENOTTY, as opposed to trashing arbitrary data in the kernel in the assumption the ioctl would be called from a matching userland program. . It concentrates the copyin/copyout at a single place, including all the EFAULT handling etc (that older SysV's IMHO didn't even provide for). When i first saw the BSD approach, i immediately thought: ``Hey, why hasn't it been this way all the time?'' The SysV approach where each driver does a boring copyin/copyout plain sucks. :) (...and is more prone to kernel programmer errors) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 02:50:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA10962 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 02:50:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id CAA10957 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 02:50:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id LAA15609; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:50:46 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id LAA06168; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:35:04 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970907113504.JM23534@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:35:04 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: totii@est.is (=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DEor=F0ur_Ivarsson?=) Subject: Re: How do I write device driver References: <340ED42B.41C67EA6@est.is> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?=3C340ED42B=2E41C67EA6=40est=2Eis=3E=3B_from_=DEor=F0ur_I?= =?iso-8859-1?Q?varsson_on_Sep_4=2C_1997_15=3A30=3A51_+0000?= Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Žoršur Ivarsson wrote: > I heard of something like /dev/IO but I did not find any information > about > writing interface to it. man 4 io > What files in the kernel do I need to add into to get this working. Best pick a template driver in /sys/i386/isa, and tweak it for your needs. There's also a /usr/share/examples/drivers. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 02:51:30 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA11062 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 02:51:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id CAA11046 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 02:51:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id LAA15669; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:51:16 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id LAA06188; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:38:37 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970907113836.CC36423@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:38:36 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: brian@firehouse.net (Brian Mitchell) Subject: Re: sysctl within lkm? References: X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from Brian Mitchell on Sep 4, 1997 21:40:41 -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Brian Mitchell wrote: > Is it possible to create sysctl nodes/entries/etc in a LKM driver? It should be, but IMHO isn't. (Of course, removal should be supported then as well.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 02:57:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA11261 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 02:57:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nico.telstra.net (nico.telstra.net [139.130.204.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id CAA11256 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 02:57:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by nico.telstra.net (8.6.10/8.6.10) with ESMTP id TAA17109; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:56:37 +1000 Received: (grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.6.12) id TAA14483; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:26:36 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970907192636.59178@lemis.com> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:26:36 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: doconnor@Ist.flinders.edu.au Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. References: <199709070853.SAA03149@holly.rd.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709070853.SAA03149@holly.rd.net>; from Daniel J. O'Connor on Sun, Sep 07, 1997 at 06:23:32PM +0930 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, Sep 07, 1997 at 06:23:32PM +0930, Daniel J. O'Connor wrote: > Hi, > I was wondering if its possible to write a program which would do > 'dial on demand', by grabbing packets, and seeing if they are destined > to go out of the system, and if so, run a script(which would cause a > dialup). I know ijppp can do this, but I have problems with ijppp =) Maybe you should first address your problems with iijppp. Are you the bloke who gets a line drop after 30 seconds? Did you follow up Brian's suggestions? What happened? > The only problem I can see is that since a default route wouldn't be > established yet(since you aren't dialed up), the packets would be > killed off before they pass through a divert socket.(I don't know much > about how that stuff works :) You can establish the default route with 'route add default' if you want. you need to do that for iijppp as well. But before you do any of that, you should ask yourself why you want to do it this way. If you ask us, you should tell us the answer to that 'why'. So far, I can't see what you're trying to achieve that iijppp won't do for you a whole lot better. Greg -- Greg Lehey LEMIS grog@lemis.com PO Box 460 Tel: +61-8-8388-8286 Echunga SA 5153 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Australia From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 03:19:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA12282 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 03:19:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id DAA12274 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 03:19:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id MAA16362; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 12:19:25 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id LAA06242; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:54:17 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970907115417.VA15613@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:54:17 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: j_mini@efn.org (Jonathan Mini) Subject: Re: 'warning: function declaration isn't a prototype' References: <19970907020657.59233@micron.efn.org> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <19970907020657.59233@micron.efn.org>; from Jonathan Mini on Sep 7, 1997 02:06:57 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jonathan Mini wrote: > I am getting warnings along the lines of 'function declaration isn't a > prototype' every time I declare a function that is void func(); (static or > public) > Does anybody know what this warning is trying to tell me? That you should use prototypes. extern void func(void); See also style(9). -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 03:19:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA12327 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 03:19:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id DAA12315 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 03:19:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id MAA16364; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 12:19:36 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id MAA06318; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 12:12:29 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970907121229.HL52279@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 12:12:29 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: jmattson@wco.com (Jim Mattson) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Patch for small annoyance in st driver References: <199709011918.MAA00247@denali.campbell.ca.us> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709011918.MAA00247@denali.campbell.ca.us>; from Jim Mattson on Sep 1, 1997 12:17:59 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jim Mattson wrote: > I've tracked this down to the call to scsi_prevent() in st_open(). > Given the pre-existing comment, the following change seems justified. > (Oh, and it gets rid of the annoying message too!) Committed, thanks! -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 03:29:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA12663 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 03:29:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bike.cs.curtin.edu.au (bike.cs.curtin.edu.au [134.7.1.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA12658 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 03:29:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from abel.cs.curtin.edu.au (abel.cs.curtin.edu.au [134.7.1.19]) by bike.cs.curtin.edu.au (8.7.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id SAA18453 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:28:55 +0800 (WST) Received: by abel.cs.curtin.edu.au id AA00984 (5.67a/IDA-1.4.4 for freebsd-hackers-digest@FreeBSD.ORG); Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:28:55 +0800 Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:28:55 +0800 From: Richard Sather Message-Id: <199709071028.AA00984@abel.cs.curtin.edu.au> To: freebsd-hackers-digest@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: IDE Hardware hack Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello out there... I currently have an old 486 running FreeBSD 2.1.7.1 at home with 4 IDE hard disks attached (using local buss cards). The other day I decided to try adding another 2 by making a few hardware mods to an ISA IDE card. I have cut/rerouted the interrupt 14 line and tried various methods of changing the address lines (by swapping and by running a 74ALS04 inverter between the ISA address lines and the card). FreeBSD picks up the extra wdc OK but steadfastly then refuses to acknowledge theres a hard disk attached to the card. My question is 'what am i missing', it does seem to me reasonable that I can do this? Any ideas would be appreciated, I eventually want to get an array of disks working (2 are already using ccd). Regards: satherrl@cs.curtin.edu.au ( and sometimes root@wilma.bedrock.cs.curtin.edu.au [134.7.1.103] ) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 04:12:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA13872 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 04:12:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hq.icb.chel.su (hq.icb.chel.su [193.125.10.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA13849 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 04:11:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: (babkin@localhost) by hq.icb.chel.su (8.8.3/8.6.5) id RAA08431; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:10:05 +0600 (ESD) From: "Serge A. Babkin" Message-Id: <199709071110.RAA08431@hq.icb.chel.su> Subject: Re: NPX old bug To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:10:04 +0600 (ESD) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970907093012.CE57420@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Sep 7, 97 09:30:12 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > P.S. I've found that `vtophys' is worth adding it to DDB. The > > addition is very simple. Does anyone from the core team think > > that it's worth too ? > > That's certainly not worth a core-team decision. ;-) Are you sure > there's not already one of the `show' commands that could do this? No, it does not. My patch is: *** db_command.c 1997/08/29 20:58:08 1.1 --- db_command.c 1997/08/29 21:21:03 *************** *** 47,52 **** --- 47,54 ---- #include + #include + /* * Exported global variables */ *************** *** 59,64 **** --- 61,67 ---- static db_cmdfcn_t db_fncall; static db_cmdfcn_t db_panic; + static db_cmdfcn_t db_vtophys; /* * if 'ed' style: 'dot' is set at start of last item printed, * and '+' points to next line. *************** *** 366,371 **** --- 369,375 ---- { "show", 0, 0, db_show_cmds }, { "ps", db_ps, 0, 0 }, { "panic", db_panic, 0, 0 }, + { "vtophys", db_vtophys, 0, 0 }, { (char *)0, } }; *************** *** 393,398 **** --- 397,412 ---- char * dummy4; { panic("from debugger"); + } + + static void + db_vtophys(addr, dummy2, dummy3, dummy4) + db_expr_t addr; + boolean_t dummy2; + db_expr_t dummy3; + char * dummy4; + { + db_printf("0x%08x\n",vtophys(addr)); } void From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 04:18:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA14096 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 04:18:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id EAA14091 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 04:18:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id NAA17049; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:18:40 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id NAA06853; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:18:10 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970907131808.BK39107@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:18:08 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: babkin@hq.icb.chel.su (Serge A. Babkin) Subject: Re: NPX old bug References: <19970907093012.CE57420@uriah.heep.sax.de> <199709071110.RAA08431@hq.icb.chel.su> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709071110.RAA08431@hq.icb.chel.su>; from Serge A. Babkin on Sep 7, 1997 17:10:04 +0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Serge A. Babkin wrote: > > > P.S. I've found that `vtophys' is worth adding it to DDB. The > > > addition is very simple. Does anyone from the core team think > > > that it's worth too ? > > > > That's certainly not worth a core-team decision. ;-) Are you sure > > there's not already one of the `show' commands that could do this? > > No, it does not. My patch is: > --- 369,375 ---- > { "show", 0, 0, db_show_cmds }, > { "ps", db_ps, 0, 0 }, > { "panic", db_panic, 0, 0 }, > + { "vtophys", db_vtophys, 0, 0 }, > { (char *)0, } > }; I wouldn't like to make this a new major command. This IMHO should become something like ``show phys'' (or ``show pa'', pa is a common abbreviation for physical address). -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 05:17:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA15453 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 05:17:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from iafnl.es.iaf.nl (uucp@iafnl.es.iaf.nl [195.108.17.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id FAA15447 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 05:17:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: by iafnl.es.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA06777 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org); Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:18:04 +0200 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.8.5/8.6.12) id OAA01395 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:08:06 +0200 (MET DST) From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199709071208.OAA01395@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: 2.2.2R lockup during boot in ahc driver?? To: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers list) Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:08:06 +0200 (MET DST) X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem, The Netherlands X-Pgp-Info: PGP public key at 'finger wilko@freefall.freebsd.org' X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi there Having just received the 2.2.2R cds I'm currently trying to install it on my testbox. Machine is a 486/33DX2 with an Adaptec 2742A dual channel scsi controller. Bootflop recognises the available scsi devices OK, but then I get: apm0: disabled, not probed ahc0: brkadrint, Illegal Host Access at seqaddr = 0x0 Same box has no trouble with 2.2.1R Thoughts? _ ____________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl http://www.tcja.nl/~wilko |/|/ / / /( (_) Arnhem, The Netherlands - Do, or do not. There is no 'try' ----------------------------------------------------------------------Yoda From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 05:25:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA15755 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 05:25:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.8.15.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA15747 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 05:25:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA07186; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:25:33 +1000 (EST) Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:25:32 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: doconnor@ist.flinders.edu.au cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-Reply-To: <199709070853.SAA03149@holly.rd.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 7 Sep 1997, Daniel J. O'Connor wrote: > Hi, > I was wondering if its possible to write a program which would do > 'dial on demand', by grabbing packets, and seeing if they are destined > to go out of the system, and if so, run a script(which would cause a > dialup). I know ijppp can do this, but I have problems with ijppp =) > The only problem I can see is that since a default route wouldn't be > established yet(since you aren't dialed up), the packets would be > killed off before they pass through a divert socket.(I don't know much > about how that stuff works :) You could do it with divert(4) - divert an incoming packet, rather than an outgoing packet, and only put it back into the kernel if the link is up. /* Daniel O'Callaghan */ /* HiLink Internet danny@hilink.com.au */ /* FreeBSD - works hard, plays hard... danny@freebsd.org */ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 05:34:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA16086 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 05:34:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hda.hda.com (hda-bicnet.bicnet.net [208.220.66.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA16078 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 05:34:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.hda.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA10630; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 07:46:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199709071146.HAA10630@hda.hda.com> Subject: Re: Tape question In-Reply-To: <19970907103022.YU02721@uriah.heep.sax.de> from J Wunsch at "Sep 7, 97 10:30:22 am" To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 07:46:37 -0400 (EDT) Cc: handy@sag.space.lockheed.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL25 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > This must be a problem with the Exabyte then... Or something in the specific host adapter driver. Peter -- Peter Dufault (dufault@hda.com) Realtime development, Machine control, HD Associates, Inc. Safety critical systems, Agency approval From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 06:11:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA17356 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 06:11:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id GAA17351 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 06:11:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id PAA18299; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:11:47 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id OAA07167; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:53:08 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970907145308.QP30824@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:53:08 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: FreeBSD-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD hackers list) Cc: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl (Wilko Bulte) Subject: Re: 2.2.2R lockup during boot in ahc driver?? References: <199709071208.OAA01395@yedi.iaf.nl> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709071208.OAA01395@yedi.iaf.nl>; from Wilko Bulte on Sep 7, 1997 14:08:06 +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Wilko Bulte wrote: > Machine is a 486/33DX2 with an Adaptec 2742A dual channel scsi controller. > Bootflop recognises the available scsi devices OK, but then I get: > > apm0: disabled, not probed > ahc0: brkadrint, Illegal Host Access at seqaddr = 0x0 I've also seen this with an AHA2742. The problem vanishes if you take the time to go through UserConfig, and disable all the drivers that are not needed. I slightly remember Justin telling that this might be the `bt' driver that kills the Adaptec. Maybe it would be sufficient to disable this one. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 06:39:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA18402 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 06:39:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA18393 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 06:39:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA06816; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 06:39:19 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709071339.GAA06816@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: SIGCLD To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:39:17 +0000 (GMT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org In-Reply-To: <19970907091757.ST01979@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Sep 7, 97 09:17:57 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > By explicitly setting the signal handler to SIG_IGN, you tell the system > that you aren't interested in the death of your child, and you won't > get zombies. > > This of course is a terrible crock, but was the only way to express > this in SVR3. SVR4 and Posix use the option SA_NOCLDWAIT in > sigaction(2) to express this wish. FreeBSD doesn't implement this > option (yet). Are you sure about this? The only POSIX defined SA_ flag I know about is SA_NOCLDSTOP, which prevents SIGCHLD when child processes are stopped, but still generates it for child process death. While we are on the subject, SA_NODEFER is kind of wierd, and BSDI compatability is impossible with SA_DISABLE being 0x0004 on BSDI (which disables the taking of signals on an alternate stack). I understand the need for SA_RESETHAND; it lets you use the general underlying "POSIX + flag extensions" signal implementation to get backward compatability with SVR3/SVR2, etc.. But shouldn't any FreeBSD-only flags really be higher in the flag space, like the SA_USERTRAMP? Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 07:08:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA19276 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 07:08:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA19262 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 07:08:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA07835; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 07:07:56 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709071407.HAA07835@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: IOCTL Commands - Where is my mistake? To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:07:54 +0000 (GMT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970907110903.WE07508@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Sep 7, 97 11:09:03 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > In SystemV, it would not have been luck, it would have been the way it > > should be. One could argue that BSD's was of encoding three separate > > arguments into one is not exactly a mark of engineering ellegance. > > Well, it offers two advantages: > > . It's failsafe. Change the size of the structure, and it will make > it a different ioctl command. You can still support the old one > if you want, if your kernel driver declares the old struct as > `ofoo_ioctl_t'. Otherwise, an application will simply get an ENOTTY, > as opposed to trashing arbitrary data in the kernel in the assumption > the ioctl would be called from a matching userland program. In fact, I use exactly this fact to transparently include system id and remote pid information in the NFS locking code. The reason it works is that the old fcntl() values don't transport the information, but the new fcntl() values (F_R...) do. So in the kernel, I can choose to pull in only the old structure, which is a subset of the new structure, anytime I'm not decoding a new call. This maintains binary compatability with old applications without needing to recompile them for the larger structure size (which you would have to do, since the data in user space being copied to kernel space may butt-up against an unmapped region, and attempting to copy in a larger-than-old-structure could cause the program to segfault). > . It concentrates the copyin/copyout at a single place, including all > the EFAULT handling etc (that older SysV's IMHO didn't even provide > for). When i first saw the BSD approach, i immediately thought: > ``Hey, why hasn't it been this way all the time?'' The SysV approach > where each driver does a boring copyin/copyout plain sucks. :) > (...and is more prone to kernel programmer errors) There are other issues as well, dealing with this. In a kernel threaded or kernel preemptive environment (realtime or SMP, etc.), you can easily get screwed. Putting the copies in up front and out at the end means the the intermediate code is no longer dependent on maintaining the page mappings for the user process. This would be an especially serious issue for an async call gate, which is critical to the functioning of a cooperative scheduling of user space threads on kernel threads to ensure that you don't give away quantum as frequently. This is actually a necessity, since without a CPU affinity model in the scheduler, a kernel thread (a normal process is a user thread bound to a single kernel thread) may be run on any CPU... after all, the CPU's are symmetric. Without this, you will end up migrating processes unnecessarily. This destroys the value of your L1 cache and your instruction pipelines, and would have a big negative impact on overall performance, and in the end, the amount of CPUs you can add before diminishing your returns. Actually, SVR4 and Solaris kernel threading have this problem now, which is why you won't see an unmodified version of either running on Sequent-type boxes (ie: 10's of processors). Think of it as "not being like SVR4"... most BSD people find that palletable enough that they won't even adopt a good technology, if it passed through SVR4, and was thus impugned by association. 8-) 8-). Linux had a big problem, in that it prevalidated source and target ranges, especially on ioctl's that took arguments in a structure and returned arguments in the same area. This was a win, in that it saved a validation, and increased concurrency (for some operations). But overall, it's a loss, since with kernel preeemption coming on line, the mapping may have changed between the time the call started and when it completed. I don't know if they still do this, or if they thrash the page table on each wakeup, or if they are simply succeptible to race condition based hacks at this time (I haven't looked lately). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 07:15:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA19591 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 07:15:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA19586 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 07:15:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA08027; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 07:15:32 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709071415.HAA08027@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:15:31 +0000 (GMT) Cc: doconnor@Ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970907192636.59178@lemis.com> from "Greg Lehey" at Sep 7, 97 07:26:36 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I was wondering if its possible to write a program which would do > > 'dial on demand', by grabbing packets, and seeing if they are destined > > to go out of the system, and if so, run a script(which would cause a > > dialup). I know ijppp can do this, but I have problems with ijppp =) > > Maybe you should first address your problems with iijppp. Are you the > bloke who gets a line drop after 30 seconds? Did you follow up > Brian's suggestions? What happened? Maybe he's just the bloke who uses SLIP instead of PPP, or the bloke who wants to work on ISDN code for the 4 second reconnect. Or maybe he's like me, and he can't get the thing to idle disconnect because of the !@#$! keep-alives that are near-impossible to turn off if you have a local net as well. There are a lot of general uses, besides PPP, for interface event notification. PPP just uses one of them. In answer to te original question, yes, it's possible, if you are the packet transporter and use the tunnel devices, just like iijppp, to let you sleep waiting for a packet "event". But there is no general event interface, even though it's becoming more and more of a kludge to not have one (e.g.: say I want to register for a directory change event because I'm a file browser, and I want to see files show up immediately, not after 10's of seconds when my poll-the-directory timer fires off). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 07:19:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA19697 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 07:19:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from news1.gtn.com (news1.gtn.com [194.77.0.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA19686 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 07:19:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by news1.gtn.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with UUCP id QAA18561 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:15:07 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from andreas@localhost) by klemm.gtn.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA00275; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:04:23 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19970907160423.39071@klemm.gtn.com> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:04:23 +0200 From: Andreas Klemm To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79 X-Disclaimer: A free society is one where it is safe to be unpopular X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT SMP Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi ! I'm just repartitioning my system. When thinking about a new disk layout and partitioning I came to the conclusion, that putting the ports collection to /usr/local/ports would be cleaner, than using /usr/ports. I think /usr should only contain stuff, that actually belong to the basic system. Sometimes there are situations, where I want to recursively remove the whole ports tree and this lasts so long, that I use the async mount option. But I don't feel well, since I then use async on the complete /usr file system... It might hurt the basic OS if things go wrong (power fail ...). IMHO best would be to make /usr so large, that it fits the normal /usr filesystem contents and to put /usr/local into a separate filesystem together with the ports, which is the ,basis' of /usr/local. Would it be a big thing to move it to /usr/local ? Or is this an religious issue ? Would be fine, if the standard installation would install the ports into this /usr/local/ports target ... Just some thoughts, not a big deal ... Andreas /// -- Andreas Klemm | klemm.gtn.com - powered by Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/SMP.html http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/benches.html From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 07:22:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA19848 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 07:22:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA19842 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 07:22:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA08365; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 07:22:02 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709071422.HAA08365@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Tape question To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:22:01 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, handy@sag.space.lockheed.com In-Reply-To: <19970907103022.YU02721@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Sep 7, 97 10:30:22 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > - The Exabyte tapes to be read have a variable (logical) block size, > > it typically is 8192 bytes, but often shorter. > > > > - My original c program always attempted to read a 8192 byte block: > > > > nn = read(unit,buffer,8192); > > > > - On the sun this worked, it would read one (logical) block, and > > return the actual number of bytes read. > > > > - In FreeBSD this created unpredictable results, if the logical block > > was shorter than 8192. > > This must be a problem with the Exabyte then. It works fine for me, > with a Tandberg TDC4222, and a QIC-525 cartridge (QIC-150, of course, > doesn't work since it's fixed-length blocking). > > Also, i know that restore(8) basically relies on this feature in order > to determine the tape block size. ISTR that this once was broken, but > that's been quite some time ago. I think it is a driver issue. I would hesitate to actually call it a problem, however. Effectively, one driver does a "sync" for you, and the other does not: man dd /osync ...then read about the "osync" and "sync" options to "conv=". So it's not the driver *OR* the controller (at least IMO). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 07:56:30 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA22857 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 07:56:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from conductor.synapse.net (conductor.synapse.net [199.84.54.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id HAA22851 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 07:56:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 15465 invoked from network); 7 Sep 1997 14:56:21 -0000 Received: from cello.synapse.net (HELO synapse.net) (199.84.54.81) by conductor.synapse.net with SMTP; 7 Sep 1997 14:56:21 -0000 Message-ID: <3412C092.57D67DA9@synapse.net> Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 10:56:18 -0400 From: Evan Champion X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en] (WinNT; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Andreas Klemm CC: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? References: <19970907160423.39071@klemm.gtn.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Andreas Klemm wrote: > I'm just repartitioning my system. When thinking about a new > disk layout and partitioning I came to the conclusion, that > putting the ports collection to /usr/local/ports would be cleaner, > than using /usr/ports. I find that /usr/local/ is overused as it is. You could move it to /usr/local/ and make a symlink, or make a new slice for /usr/ports/. Evan From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 08:02:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA23148 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 08:02:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from awfulhak.demon.co.uk (awfulhak.demon.co.uk [158.152.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA23118 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 08:01:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lan.awfulhak.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by awfulhak.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA23059; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:00:04 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199709071500.QAA23059@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Terry Lambert cc: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey), doconnor@Ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 07 Sep 1997 14:15:31 -0000." <199709071415.HAA08027@usr09.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 16:00:04 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [.....] > Or maybe he's like me, and he can't get the thing to idle disconnect > because of the !@#$! keep-alives that are near-impossible to turn > off if you have a local net as well. Hmm. I have a local net of 8 machines, and I don't have any such problems. Of course you know about "set afilter". The thing I don't understand is how re-writing anything is going to solve a problem where people want the link to shutdown subliminally :-) > There are a lot of general uses, besides PPP, for interface event > notification. PPP just uses one of them. Agreed. > In answer to te original question, yes, it's possible, if you are the > packet transporter and use the tunnel devices, just like iijppp, to > let you sleep waiting for a packet "event". But there is no general > event interface, even though it's becoming more and more of a kludge > to not have one (e.g.: say I want to register for a directory change > event because I'm a file browser, and I want to see files show up > immediately, not after 10's of seconds when my poll-the-directory > timer fires off). You've been working w/ Windoze too long !!! You're becoming a heretic ! Perhaps that idea warrants some sort of ability to do a select() on a seekable file. If you've got the O_APPEND flag, select will return when there's more data at the end (tail(1) would be almost perfect). When you haven't got O_APPEND, maybe a file update would wake up the select(). Of course the implementation is trivial ;-I (not) > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org > --- > Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present > or previous employers. -- Brian , Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 08:50:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA25713 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 08:50:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id IAA25708 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 08:50:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id RAA20135 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:50:33 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id RAA12844; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:22:01 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970907172200.ZJ25357@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:22:00 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Tape question References: <19970907103022.YU02721@uriah.heep.sax.de> <199709071422.HAA08365@usr09.primenet.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709071422.HAA08365@usr09.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Sep 7, 1997 14:22:01 +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Terry Lambert wrote: > > This must be a problem with the Exabyte then. It works fine for me, > > with a Tandberg TDC4222, and a QIC-525 cartridge (QIC-150, of course, > > doesn't work since it's fixed-length blocking). > > > > Also, i know that restore(8) basically relies on this feature in order > > to determine the tape block size. ISTR that this once was broken, but > > that's been quite some time ago. > > I think it is a driver issue. > > I would hesitate to actually call it a problem, however. > > Effectively, one driver does a "sync" for you, and the other does > not: Terry, Terry. You ought not to talk about things you neither understand nor verify before posting. Both (mine and his) were the same drivers (st(4)), and all this has nothing to do with dd(1)'s sync option or such. Raw devices write just what is being passed down to a write(2) syscall. Better talk about things you've got some clue about... The SCSI tape driver definately doesn't belong to this (and no, you don't need to change the subject now to match your claims). -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 09:20:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA26948 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:20:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA26943 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:20:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by alpo.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA29094; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:14:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) via SMTP by alpo.whistle.com, id smtpd029091; Sun Sep 7 16:14:19 1997 Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:13:54 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Joerg Wunsch cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, =?iso-8859-1?Q?=DEor=F0ur_Ivarsson?= Subject: Re: How do I write device driver In-Reply-To: <19970907113504.JM23534@uriah.heep.sax.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by hub.freebsd.org id JAA26944 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 7 Sep 1997, J Wunsch wrote: > As Žoršur Ivarsson wrote: > > > I heard of something like /dev/IO but I did not find any information > > about > > writing interface to it. > > man 4 io > > > What files in the kernel do I need to add into to get this working. > > Best pick a template driver in /sys/i386/isa, and tweak it for your > needs. There's also a /usr/share/examples/drivers. though I think they are only tagged for -current so you may need to use the web0cvs tool to get them if you only have 2.2.2 > > -- > cheers, J"org > > joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE > Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 09:48:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA28647 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:48:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA28632 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:48:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id SAA21097 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:48:39 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id SAA07461; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:37:38 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970907183735.JM22464@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:37:35 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How do I write device driver References: <19970907113504.JM23534@uriah.heep.sax.de> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from Julian Elischer on Sep 7, 1997 09:13:54 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Julian Elischer wrote: > > There's also a /usr/share/examples/drivers. > > though I think they are only tagged for -current > so you may need to use the web0cvs tool > to get them if you only have 2.2.2 Well, i think they can safely be tagged into RELENG_2_2 as well. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 11:56:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA05753 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:56:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sos.freebsd.dk (sos.freebsd.dk [195.8.129.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA05748 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:55:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from sos@localhost) by sos.freebsd.dk (8.8.7/8.7.3) id UAA17987; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:55:44 +0200 (MEST) From: Sųren Schmidt Message-Id: <199709071855.UAA17987@sos.freebsd.dk> Subject: Re: IDE Hardware hack In-Reply-To: <199709071028.AA00984@abel.cs.curtin.edu.au> from Richard Sather at "Sep 7, 97 06:28:55 pm" To: satherrl@cs.curtin.edu.au (Richard Sather) Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:55:43 +0200 (MEST) Cc: freebsd-hackers-digest@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL30 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Richard Sather who wrote: > Hello out there... > > I currently have an old 486 running FreeBSD 2.1.7.1 at home with 4 IDE > hard disks attached (using local buss cards). The other day I decided to > try adding another 2 by making a few hardware mods to an ISA IDE card. > I have cut/rerouted the interrupt 14 line and tried various methods of > changing the address lines (by swapping and by running a 74ALS04 inverter > between the ISA address lines and the card). FreeBSD picks up the extra > wdc OK but steadfastly then refuses to acknowledge theres a hard disk > attached to the card. My question is 'what am i missing', it does seem > to me reasonable that I can do this? Any ideas would be appreciated, I > eventually want to get an array of disks working (2 are already using > ccd). I did this once long ago on a cheapo IDE card, IIRC there was a problem with the status port (that one that share with the floppy ctrl), that demanded a bit more logic.. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Sųren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team Even more code to hack -- will it ever end .. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 12:51:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA07724 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 12:51:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr07.primenet.com (tlambert@usr07.primenet.com [206.165.6.207]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA07717 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 12:51:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr07.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA24121; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 12:50:53 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709071950.MAA24121@usr07.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. To: brian@awfulhak.org (Brian Somers) Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:50:52 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, grog@lemis.com, doconnor@Ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709071500.QAA23059@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> from "Brian Somers" at Sep 7, 97 04:00:04 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Or maybe he's like me, and he can't get the thing to idle disconnect > > because of the !@#$! keep-alives that are near-impossible to turn > > off if you have a local net as well. > > Hmm. I have a local net of 8 machines, and I don't have any such > problems. Of course you know about "set afilter". Sure. I just don't know what packets are triggering it. There's almost nothing running at all (literally; no routed, named, whatever). And there's the annoying localhost DNS lookup, even though host.conf has "hosts" first, and the name of the machine I'm rlogin'ing into is in /etc/hosts (it's myself). It triggers the PPP dial anyway, and I think that should only happen for non-local hosts. > The thing I don't understand is how re-writing anything is going to > solve a problem where people want the link to shutdown subliminally :-) Change the ground rules on the shutdown, for one... different issues for SLIP/ISDN, for another. > > But there is no general > > event interface, even though it's becoming more and more of a kludge > > to not have one (e.g.: say I want to register for a directory change > > event because I'm a file browser, and I want to see files show up > > immediately, not after 10's of seconds when my poll-the-directory > > timer fires off). > > You've been working w/ Windoze too long !!! You're becoming a > heretic ! > > Perhaps that idea warrants some sort of ability to do a select() on a > seekable file. If you've got the O_APPEND flag, select will return > when there's more data at the end (tail(1) would be almost perfect). > When you haven't got O_APPEND, maybe a file update would wake up the > select(). > > Of course the implementation is trivial ;-I (not) It's moderately trivial. FS's can be defined in terms of event dependency relationships, actually (in fact, they need to be for Soft Updates to be generalizable or to work under stacking), so it's a bit trivial to externalize those events. Directory modification is one such event that "just falls out". I was thinking more in terms of SIGIO and "poll()" as an implementation detail, anyway. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 13:01:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA08107 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:01:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr07.primenet.com (tlambert@usr07.primenet.com [206.165.6.207]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA08090 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:01:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr07.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA24896; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:01:06 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709072001.NAA24896@usr07.primenet.com> Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? To: evanc@synapse.net (Evan Champion) Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:01:05 +0000 (GMT) Cc: andreas@klemm.gtn.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <3412C092.57D67DA9@synapse.net> from "Evan Champion" at Sep 7, 97 10:56:18 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I'm just repartitioning my system. When thinking about a new > > disk layout and partitioning I came to the conclusion, that > > putting the ports collection to /usr/local/ports would be cleaner, > > than using /usr/ports. > > I find that /usr/local/ is overused as it is. You could move it to > /usr/local/ and make a symlink, or make a new slice for /usr/ports/. Each package should go into an independently mountable subsection of the FS. A volume/package descriptor, if you will. That lets me move descriptors around at will, if they are non-local. Consider the case of an IR capable laptop accessing a copy of a presentation software package in a West coast office via an ethernet connection to an NFS server in the West cost office, and via an IR link to an NFS server in the East coast office. The software doesn't need to take up space on the laptop proper, but unlike Windows 95/NT, where the volume identifier is important (it's hard-coded in the registry), it could be totally anonymous; preferrably, the package name. Ideally, you would install each package on it's own LP which consisted of one or more PP's (logical/physical partitions; like in AIX, a PP would be ~4M in size -- or smaller). See, you don't want to acess /usr/local/ports or /usr/ports, you want to access a software package. Only a slight modification is necessary for NFS to export package identifiers instead of volume identifiers. The last piece is the name services modification needed to say "servers x, y, and z export package Q" when the name service is asked "where is package Q?". Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 13:14:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA08746 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:14:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr07.primenet.com (tlambert@usr07.primenet.com [206.165.6.207]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA08730 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:13:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr07.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA25379; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:13:45 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709072013.NAA25379@usr07.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Tape question To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:13:44 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970907172200.ZJ25357@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Sep 7, 97 05:22:00 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Terry, Terry. You ought not to talk about things you neither > understand nor verify before posting. > > Both (mine and his) were the same drivers (st(4)), and all this has > nothing to do with dd(1)'s sync option or such. Raw devices write > just what is being passed down to a write(2) syscall. > > Better talk about things you've got some clue about... The SCSI tape > driver definately doesn't belong to this (and no, you don't need to > change the subject now to match your claims). Well, for one thing, I was under the impression that he was comparing SunOS vs. FreeBSD, with SunOS working and FreeBSD failing, so it wasn't the same driver. Unfortunately, I didn't save the original posting to verify this. I do know that *you* were talking about not having problems with the hardware, but you could easily be using it differently. If you aren't trying to read tapes written on a non-FreeBSD system on a FreeBSD system, that's almost a guarantee *yo* won't have problems. Second, he was complaining about read failures, not write failures. Third, if you'd read the referenced man page instead of immediately flying into another "you don't know what you are talking about" posting, you would see that I was referencing whether or not the driver permitted partial blocks to be written, or if it wrote full blocks when you requested partial blocks (effectively, osync), and whether it expected partial blocks on reads, or expected only full block output had taken place (a stupid assumption, but one shared by most NCR tape drivers, which is why you must write tapes from other systems -- like Sun machines, which support partial block writes -- through dd using conv=osync). Fourth, a raw device can be written to pad requests to media block boundries, despite it appearing to be a character at a time device. TK50's are well know helical scan tape devices that require that kind of software coddling. Finally, if he were to pipe through dd and use conv=osync, he would probably not have the problems he's having... but that was not the intent of my posting, since he has legacy tape issues which that would not address. In any case, that hardware is capable of partial block reads and writes, so it's clearly a driver problem if they aren't working under one OS, but are under another. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 13:33:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA09554 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:33:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hda.hda.com (hda-bicnet.bicnet.net [208.220.66.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA09545 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:32:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.hda.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA11495 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:45:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199709071945.PAA11495@hda.hda.com> Subject: Re: Tape question In-Reply-To: <199709071146.HAA10630@hda.hda.com> from Peter Dufault at "Sep 7, 97 07:46:37 am" To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:45:01 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL25 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > This must be a problem with the Exabyte then... > > Or something in the specific host adapter driver. I take that back, since the residual is coming back in the sense data when the ILI bit is set. I know some exabytes work properly - Alliant used exabytes and had a program that would figure out the structure of a tape by doing long reads. Peter -- Peter Dufault (dufault@hda.com) Realtime development, Machine control, HD Associates, Inc. Safety critical systems, Agency approval From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 13:37:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA09861 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:37:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sag.space.lockheed.com (sag.space.lockheed.com [192.68.162.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA09856 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:37:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost by sag.space.lockheed.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/21Nov95-0423PM) id AA05207; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:37:16 -0700 Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:37:16 -0700 (PDT) From: "Brian N. Handy" To: Terry Lambert Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Tape question In-Reply-To: <199709072013.NAA25379@usr07.primenet.com> Message-Id: X-Files: The truth is out there Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> [Terry and Joerg beat their chests in anger] Maybe more information would be useful here, I'm not sure. I'll detail a bit better the situation as I know it: 1. The tapes were written on a Sun box. (FWIW, they're Solar Magnetogram data from the Mees Solar Observatory in Hawaii. I don't mean to sound proprietary, I'm assuredly not.) I can't say as to whether it's SunOS or Solaris, though I could find out Monday. The tapes are old and already written with partial block writes. 2. The tapes were read on my FreeBSD box, using an old Exabyte drive on my NCR controller. I'm not near the machine right now or I'd play with this stuff a bit. BUT the guy who needs the data is near there, I'll have him fiddle with this next week. Brian From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 13:55:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA10747 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:55:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pandora.hh.kew.com (root@kendra.ne.mediaone.net [24.128.53.73]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA10736; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 13:55:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sonata (sonata.hh.kew.com [192.195.203.135]) by pandora.hh.kew.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA25108; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:55:10 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <341314D0.E22ADFF3@kew.com> Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 16:55:44 -0400 From: Drew Derbyshire Organization: Kendra Electronic Wonderworks X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en]C-MOENE (WinNT; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" CC: hackers@hub.freebsd.org, support@kew.com Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <199709070254.TAA21387@hub.freebsd.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jonathan M. Bresler wrote: > therefore, we are not blocking mail from sites that can not be > resolved in the DNS. not that i dont want to, there are just too > many newbies out there that send mail to the lists. You really do want to enable that. First off, it really does kill much spam. Just as important, however, is that bounce messages just plain _don't_ _work_ for such users when they are legitimate, and a specific useful message reporting that the host cannot be resolved is going to do more to solve their (or their ISP's) long term problem with lost bounces more than blindly accepting mail which doesn't have a valid address. The TCP/IP protocol implicitly requires public IP address to be properly registered to be routed (otherwise, you don't get your ACK's back!), there is no sin in requiring public e-mail addresses registered as well. Note too, that newbies tend to not start with e-mail from their own sites, they use their existing connection (Windows connected to an ISP POP3 server or whatever) to get up and then migrate. I've handled e-mail support for UUPC/extended for ~ 8 years, I've watched the pattern for that long -- my help desk is now reading this over my shoulder, and her comment is "Yup -- and that any list which is spammed is less helpful". -- Internet: ahd@kew.com Voice: 617-279-9810 "MS-DOS didn't get as bad as it is overnight -- it took over ten years of careful development." - dmeggins@aix1.uottawa.ca From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 14:04:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA11210 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:04:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from micron.efn.org (d198-232.uoregon.edu [128.223.198.232]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA11205 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:04:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mini@localhost) by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA05916; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:04:17 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970907140416.33084@micron.efn.org> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:04:16 -0700 From: Jonathan Mini To: Joerg Wunsch Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 'warning: function declaration isn't a prototype' Reply-To: Jonathan Mini References: <19970907020657.59233@micron.efn.org> <19970907115417.VA15613@uriah.heep.sax.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e In-Reply-To: <19970907115417.VA15613@uriah.heep.sax.de>; from J Wunsch on Sun, Sep 07, 1997 at 11:54:17AM +0200 X-files: The Truth is Out There. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk J Wunsch stands accused of saying : > As Jonathan Mini wrote: > > > I am getting warnings along the lines of 'function declaration isn't a > > prototype' every time I declare a function that is void func(); (static or > > public) > > > Does anybody know what this warning is trying to tell me? > > That you should use prototypes. > > extern void func(void); > > See also style(9). Seen style(9) -- a friend pointed it out to me before I started working on the kernel. ...and I was prototyping. Like this : static void msctimer(); I changed it to : static void msctimer(void); ... and the problem went away. Funny, I have never received that watning before, and I have been using C (with prototypes like that) for many years. > -- > cheers, J"org > > joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE > Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) -- Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) Ingenious Productions Software Development P.O. Box 5693 Eugene, Or 97405 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 14:36:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA12303 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:36:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from micron.efn.org (d198-232.uoregon.edu [128.223.198.232]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA12294 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:36:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mini@localhost) by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA06026; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:36:44 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970907143644.18865@micron.efn.org> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:36:44 -0700 From: Jonathan Mini To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: evil disk drives. Reply-To: Jonathan Mini Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e X-files: The Truth is Out There. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have a hardcard in my crash machine that does not like having the "second unit" on it's IDE interface probed. When this happens, it puts the card in a messed state. As a result of this, it takes my machine a "little longer" to boot that would be expected. I was wondering if anybody would be interested in patches to allow the wdc code to not probe various units on thier system? I plan on writing a quick hack for myself, but if anybody shows interest, I would be willing to make a much nicer patch. (Or is there such an option in place that I have missed?) -- Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) Ingenious Productions Software Development P.O. Box 5693 Eugene, Or 97405 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 14:59:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA13146 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:59:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cypher.net (black@zen.pratt.edu [205.232.115.155]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA13141 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:58:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from black@localhost) by cypher.net (8.8.7/8.7.1) id SAA17879; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:09:34 -0400 Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:09:33 -0400 (EDT) From: Ben Black To: Jonathan Mini cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: evil disk drives. In-Reply-To: <19970907143644.18865@micron.efn.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk perhaps i am just confused, but i thought only drives specifically listed with wd? lines were actually probed. On Sun, 7 Sep 1997, Jonathan Mini wrote: > I have a hardcard in my crash machine that does not like having the "second > unit" on it's IDE interface probed. When this happens, it puts the card in a > messed state. As a result of this, it takes my machine a "little longer" to > boot that would be expected. > I was wondering if anybody would be interested in patches to allow the wdc > code to not probe various units on thier system? I plan on writing a quick hack > for myself, but if anybody shows interest, I would be willing to make a much > nicer patch. (Or is there such an option in place that I have missed?) > > -- > Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) Ingenious Productions > Software Development P.O. Box 5693 > Eugene, Or 97405 > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 15:04:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA13394 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:04:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from micron.efn.org (d198-232.uoregon.edu [128.223.198.232]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA13388 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:04:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mini@localhost) by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA06111; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:04:07 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970907150406.08100@micron.efn.org> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:04:06 -0700 From: Jonathan Mini To: Ben Black Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: evil disk drives. Reply-To: Jonathan Mini References: <19970907143644.18865@micron.efn.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e In-Reply-To: ; from Ben Black on Sun, Sep 07, 1997 at 06:09:33PM -0400 X-files: The Truth is Out There. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Ben Black stands accused of saying : > perhaps i am just confused, but i thought only drives specifically listed > with wd? lines were actually probed. I tried removing wd1 from the line below wdc1 -- the compile had syntax errors. appears that is fills out a static struct that wdc want to be full. It was a 2.2.1-R box I tried it on, perhaps I should try the change on a -current box. > > On Sun, 7 Sep 1997, Jonathan Mini wrote: > > > I have a hardcard in my crash machine that does not like having the "second > > unit" on it's IDE interface probed. When this happens, it puts the card in a > > messed state. As a result of this, it takes my machine a "little longer" to > > boot that would be expected. > > I was wondering if anybody would be interested in patches to allow the wdc > > code to not probe various units on thier system? I plan on writing a quick hack > > for myself, but if anybody shows interest, I would be willing to make a much > > nicer patch. (Or is there such an option in place that I have missed?) > > > > -- > > Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) Ingenious Productions > > Software Development P.O. Box 5693 > > Eugene, Or 97405 > > -- Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) Ingenious Productions Software Development P.O. Box 5693 Eugene, Or 97405 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 15:11:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA13690 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:11:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from awfulhak.demon.co.uk (awfulhak.demon.co.uk [158.152.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA13682 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:11:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lan.awfulhak.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by awfulhak.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA26087; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:38:06 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199709072138.WAA26087@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Terry Lambert cc: brian@awfulhak.org (Brian Somers), grog@lemis.com, doconnor@Ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 07 Sep 1997 19:50:52 -0000." <199709071950.MAA24121@usr07.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 22:38:05 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > Or maybe he's like me, and he can't get the thing to idle disconnect > > > because of the !@#$! keep-alives that are near-impossible to turn > > > off if you have a local net as well. > > > > Hmm. I have a local net of 8 machines, and I don't have any such > > problems. Of course you know about "set afilter". > > Sure. I just don't know what packets are triggering it. There's > almost nothing running at all (literally; no routed, named, whatever). If you "set log +tcp/ip", you get to see the IP packets logged. > And there's the annoying localhost DNS lookup, even though host.conf > has "hosts" first, and the name of the machine I'm rlogin'ing into > is in /etc/hosts (it's myself). It triggers the PPP dial anyway, > and I think that should only happen for non-local hosts. This is probably a "dot" thing. If your domain's "x.y", you should have 127.0.0.1 localhost.x.y. localhost. 127.0.0.1 localhost.x.y localhost > > The thing I don't understand is how re-writing anything is going to > > solve a problem where people want the link to shutdown subliminally :-) > > Change the ground rules on the shutdown, for one... different issues > for SLIP/ISDN, for another. What sort of ground rules are you talking about ? I've always thought it would be nice to have different timeouts based on different aspects of the packet. For instance, you may want port 80 packets to timeout the connection after 900 seconds, but port 25 to time out after 60 seconds. You may also want all packets from machine 'x' to timeout after 600 seconds. [.....] > > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org > --- > Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present > or previous employers. -- Brian , Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 15:20:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA14139 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:20:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA14116 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:20:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id AAA25570 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:20:29 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id AAA12772; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:17:04 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970908001704.DW50899@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:17:04 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Tape question References: <199709072013.NAA25379@usr07.primenet.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from Brian N. Handy on Sep 7, 1997 13:37:16 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Brian N. Handy wrote: > Maybe more information would be useful here, I'm not sure. I'll detail a > bit better the situation as I know it: > > 1. The tapes were written on a Sun box. (FWIW, they're Solar > Magnetogram data from the Mees Solar Observatory in Hawaii. I don't > mean to sound proprietary, I'm assuredly not.) I can't say as to > whether it's SunOS or Solaris, though I could find out Monday. > The tapes are old and already written with partial block writes. Sorry, i neither have an Exabyte available right now, nor could i try it immediately on a Sun. (If at all, only under Solaris.) My only point was to prove that the FreeBSD st(4) driver behaves as i would expect it. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 15:20:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA14163 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:20:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA14147 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:20:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id AAA25573 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:20:48 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id AAA12760; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:12:16 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970908001216.PA02497@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:12:16 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Tape question References: <19970907172200.ZJ25357@uriah.heep.sax.de> <199709072013.NAA25379@usr07.primenet.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709072013.NAA25379@usr07.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Sep 7, 1997 20:13:44 +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Terry Lambert wrote: > Fourth, a raw device can be written to pad requests to media block > boundries, despite it appearing to be a character at a time device. We aren't talking about media block boundaries. We are talking about variable-length recording media, i.e. the media block boundary is just what you've been requesting in your write(2) syscall. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 15:29:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA14510 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:29:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA14503 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:29:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA27195 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:28:14 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:28:14 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: i refuse to spend the $$$ Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk There is no good reason in the world I should have to go out and spend $400+ dollars on a 2940 and scsi cdrom just so I can digitally pull a couple tracks off of a cdrom, therefore I am requesting that someone point me towards info (i guess ioctls) i need to get tracks off an atapi cdrom --- I sure hope the atapi drivers support this?? Since its not fair that lame ass windows users should be able to do this but I can not. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 15:33:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA14744 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:33:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA14739 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:33:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA27216; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:32:19 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:32:19 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Joerg Wunsch cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How do I write device driver In-Reply-To: <19970907183735.JM22464@uriah.heep.sax.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I agree I don't seem to have these files in my stable setup. On Sun, 7 Sep 1997, J Wunsch wrote: > As Julian Elischer wrote: > > > > There's also a /usr/share/examples/drivers. > > > > though I think they are only tagged for -current > > so you may need to use the web0cvs tool > > to get them if you only have 2.2.2 > > Well, i think they can safely be tagged into RELENG_2_2 as well. > > -- > cheers, J"org > > joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE > Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 15:34:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA14890 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:34:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brickbat9.mindspring.com (brickbat9.mindspring.com [207.69.200.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA14885 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:34:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bogus.mindspring.com (user-38lc58v.dialup.mindspring.com [209.86.21.31]) by brickbat9.mindspring.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA01401; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:34:23 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970907223328.008be880@mail.mindspring.com> X-Sender: kpneal@mail.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 18:33:28 -0400 To: Terry Lambert From: "Kevin P. Neal" Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 02:15 PM 9/7/97 +0000, Terry Lambert wrote: >There are a lot of general uses, besides PPP, for interface event >notification. PPP just uses one of them. >let you sleep waiting for a packet "event". But there is no general >event interface, even though it's becoming more and more of a kludge >to not have one (e.g.: say I want to register for a directory change >event because I'm a file browser, and I want to see files show up >immediately, not after 10's of seconds when my poll-the-directory >timer fires off). Well, the Amiga OS had a system for message transferral. You would set up a message port. Do stuff. Then when you have nothing to do you sleep, waiting on a signal. When you get a signal (because you got a message at one of your message ports) then you wake up and check the message. The GUI notified you of events via just this messaging scheme. ARexx programs could direct you to do stuff through another message port. This was so common that most programs main loop's were just a simple Wait() Get Message() Copy Data Out of message Reply Message() Do Stuff() Loop back to Wait(). The File Notification scheme (useful for Terry's file browser) may have used this messaging scheme as well (I honestly don't remember). You certainly could be notified of disk change events (floppy insert/removal, later removable HD change) through messages. Now, here's the question: How difficult would it be to do something like this? It would take some sort of shared memory or other scheme to get the data from one program to another. Or would that be too general? How about just a scheme to get messages to and from the kernel? I love my Amiga, still use it. In fact, I just got NetBSD up and running on it day before yesterday. Bonus. -- XCOMM Kevin P. Neal, Junior, Comp. Sci. - House of Retrocomputing XCOMM mailto:kpneal@pobox.com - http://www.pobox.com/~kpn/ XCOMM kpneal@eos.ncsu.edu Spoken by Keir Finlow-Bates: XCOMM "Good grief, I've just noticed I've typed in a rant. Sorry chaps!" From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 15:37:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA15041 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:37:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA15035; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:37:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA27223; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:36:30 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:36:30 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Drew Derbyshire cc: "Jonathan M. Bresler" , hackers@hub.freebsd.org, support@kew.com Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists In-Reply-To: <341314D0.E22ADFF3@kew.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Actually I was told that numerous government agencies have networks of machines that don't reverse out. > The TCP/IP protocol implicitly requires public IP address to be properly > registered to be routed (otherwise, you don't get your ACK's back!), > there is no sin in requiring public e-mail addresses registered as well. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 15:37:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA15068 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:37:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA15062 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:37:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id AAA25706 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:37:43 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id AAA12829; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:26:42 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970908002641.TV55800@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:26:41 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 'warning: function declaration isn't a prototype' References: <19970907020657.59233@micron.efn.org> <19970907115417.VA15613@uriah.heep.sax.de> <19970907140416.33084@micron.efn.org> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <19970907140416.33084@micron.efn.org>; from Jonathan Mini on Sep 7, 1997 14:04:16 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jonathan Mini wrote: > ...and I was prototyping. Like this : > > static void msctimer(); > > I changed it to : > > static void msctimer(void); > > ... and the problem went away. Funny, I have never received that watning > before, and I have been using C (with prototypes like that) for many years. That's not a `prototype' in the strict ANSI sense. Unless we were talking about C++, where the omission of function parameters is equivalent to declaring the list as just `void'. But then, C++ always requires prototypes, unlike ANSI C. What you've been using is what K&R II calls ``old-style function declarations''. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 15:42:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA15337 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:42:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA15330 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:42:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id AAA25811; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:42:17 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id AAA12928; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:40:31 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970908004031.BO19348@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:40:31 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org (Jamil J. Weatherbee) Subject: Re: How do I write device driver References: <19970907183735.JM22464@uriah.heep.sax.de> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from Jamil J. Weatherbee on Sep 7, 1997 15:32:19 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > I agree I don't seem to have these files in my stable setup. Your 2.2-stable is too old then. :-)) (I've tagged them into RELENG_2_2 today.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 16:00:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA15962 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:00:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr04.primenet.com (tlambert@usr04.primenet.com [206.165.6.204]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA15954 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:00:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr04.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA23747; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:00:03 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709072300.QAA23747@usr04.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Tape question To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:00:03 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970908001216.PA02497@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Sep 8, 97 00:12:16 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Fourth, a raw device can be written to pad requests to media block > > boundries, despite it appearing to be a character at a time device. > > We aren't talking about media block boundaries. We are talking about > variable-length recording media, i.e. the media block boundary is just > what you've been requesting in your write(2) syscall. Sorry; I was unclear. I should have said "a raw device *driver*". The drivers in the SVR3 NCR Tower XP and Tower 32 boxes would not read partial blocks, even though the physical hardware could support it (the same NCR controller chip and drive was used on the Arete 1100's OEM'ed by Unisys, which did not have the problem). I used to have to borrow machines to port software (it was one of the many reasons I hate prototype function declarations and the volatile keyword: most of the 140 machines I had to maintain ports were K&R compilers); we had an SCO box with a Computone tape controller and a QIC tape drive (the controller could be soft switched when the power was off between QIC-11 and QIC-24; I hardware hacked a toggle switch to do this, since Sun 3's only had QIC-11). We used this box to write the source tapes we used to go do the port. The point being that if I didn't do tar xvf - sources | dd obs=20 conv=osync of=/dev/rst0 To write the tapes on the SCO box, the last block of data, which would otherwise be a partial block, could not be read on the NCR boxes (and Convergent, CCI, and a couple others that nobody ever heard of since). It was a driver issue, and resulted in symptoms exactly like those the original poster was seeing. For what it's worth, knowing that the source box is a Sun box, and knowing the hardware is capable of partial block writes, and knowing that the Sun boxes had the same problem writing tapes that could be read by the NCR Towers, it's pretty obvious that the driver is having fits on partial block reads. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 16:01:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA16031 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:01:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pandora.hh.kew.com (root@kendra.ne.mediaone.net [24.128.53.73]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA16023; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:01:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sonata (sonata.hh.kew.com [192.195.203.135]) by pandora.hh.kew.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA25514; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:00:50 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <34133244.7F7AF767@kew.com> Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 19:01:24 -0400 From: Drew Derbyshire Organization: Kendra Electronic Wonderworks X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en]C-MOENE (WinNT; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" CC: "Jonathan M. Bresler" , support@kew.com, chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > > Actually I was told that numerous government agencies have networks of > machines that don't reverse out. > > > The TCP/IP protocol implicitly requires public IP address to be properly > > registered to be routed (otherwise, you don't get your ACK's back!), > > there is no sin in requiring public e-mail addresses registered as well. > > No, I didn't mean the IP was in DNS, I mean the network itself had to be registered with the 'Net routers for the packets to be ACK'ed. IMHO, SMTP should refuse connections from sites that don't reverse out, but that's a different issue. (I suspect this should be moved to -chat ..., follow-ups will go there) -ahd- -- Internet: ahd@kew.com Voice: 617-279-9810 "MS-DOS didn't get as bad as it is overnight -- it took over ten years of careful development." - dmeggins@aix1.uottawa.ca From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 16:02:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA16157 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:02:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr04.primenet.com (tlambert@usr04.primenet.com [206.165.6.204]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA16143 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:02:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr04.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA23834; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:02:39 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709072302.QAA23834@usr04.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Tape question To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:02:38 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970908001704.DW50899@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Sep 8, 97 00:17:04 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Maybe more information would be useful here, I'm not sure. I'll detail a > > bit better the situation as I know it: > > > > 1. The tapes were written on a Sun box. (FWIW, they're Solar > > Magnetogram data from the Mees Solar Observatory in Hawaii. I don't > > mean to sound proprietary, I'm assuredly not.) I can't say as to > > whether it's SunOS or Solaris, though I could find out Monday. > > The tapes are old and already written with partial block writes. > > Sorry, i neither have an Exabyte available right now, nor could i try > it immediately on a Sun. (If at all, only under Solaris.) My only > point was to prove that the FreeBSD st(4) driver behaves as i would > expect it. That's about what I said in my original response posting as well: it behaves in a manner which is consistent with many other systems, so it's not technically a bug. On the other hand, I could see where partial block reads could be useful, especially now that he has a bunch of legacy tapes he needs to be able to read. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 16:30:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA17485 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:30:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ec.camitel.com (merlin.ec.camitel.com [206.231.123.137]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA17443 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:29:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from cfortin@localhost) by ec.camitel.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA18734 for FREEBSD-HACKERS@freebsd.org; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:34:05 -0400 (EDT) Resent-Message-Id: <199709072334.TAA18734@ ec.camitel.com> Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.1 [p0] on FreeBSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Resent-Date: Thu, 04 Sep 1997 18:27:00 -0400 (EDT) Resent-From: Christian Fortin Resent-To: freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 19:23:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Christian Fortin To: FREEBSD-HACKERS@freebsd.org Subject: Big Bug with: Cyclade serial board + TUN. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Somebody on this news group have an idea about where is the problem ? ........................................................ >>We have problem with the Cylcom 16Ye ISA serial board with DB25 boxe and TUN. >>It work fine in the FreeBSD 2.2-GAMMA version. > >I don't know what was in 2.2-GAMMA - it wasn't tagged :-(. With CVSUP we localised when the source have stop to work. it's: 1997.06.16.13.26.26 1997 june 16, 13h26 26s. > >>But with 2.2.2 and 2.2-970618-RELENG it not work. >>When I use the Cyclade in terminal mode, everything work fine. >>When I use with pppd it work fine also. >> >>But when I use it with TUN, we have a proble,: >>The first time, we can connect in TUN. >>When I hangup, the modem also hangup but the ppp process stay active in >memory. >>When I retry to connect on the modem, the modem answer but never give the >login >>prompt. Because the process has not been killed by the hangup. > >The cy driver in early versions of 2.2 had buggy carrier detect handling, >mainly involving CLOCAL mode. Apparently ppp depended on these bugs. >CLOCAL mode prevents normal hangup processing (of killing the process group >and returning end of file for subsequent reads). In terminal mode, CLOCAL >is usually not set and processes get killed by hangups. Similarly for >pppd in its default "modem" mode. OTOH, ppp sets CLOCAL and depends on >polling the carrier status using TIOCMGET. This polling used to be broken. > Maybe what you say is true. But we have an other cue. In the main() func. of the name.c., if we remove the two close(), it work fine. *************** *** 481,488 **** --- 491,501 ---- if_filename, strerror(errno)); VarTerm = 0; /* We know it's currently stdout */ + + #ifndef USE_CYCLOM_16YE_ISA close(0); close(2); + #endif #ifdef DOTTYINIT if (mode & (MODE_DIRECT | MODE_DEDICATED)) We cannot try somthing because our two clycloms 16 are in a big production serve r . And we have not enough $ for buy an other just for make some tests... If I am able to put a hand on an other Cyclom 16, I will be OK to debug it. But I dont know where I will find it in Quebec City, Canada. ( I program better in C then I talk english... ;-) ) Give me some news if you can find a trace of the problem with more precision. If I do this modification, it work... But I dont know why ! >>I have aplied the latest CVS sup, the problem is still there. >> >>I think the problem is in the Cyclom driver. >>... >>If I want to run in TUN, I must replace the standard TUN by the >> old 2.2-GAMMA TUN on my FreeBSD 2.2-970618-RELENG. > >I think the problem is in ppp :-). > ---------------------------------- E-Mail: Christian Fortin Date: 07-Sep-97 Heure: 19:23:46 ##############################################--------+ Electro-Conception tel:(418) 872-6641 | 3665 Croisset fax:(418) 872-9198 | Quebec,P.Q. www.ec.camitel.com/ec | G1P-1L4 | /--|<|--WM--|(--J Canada -----------------L---WM-----< \----1 --- - From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 16:31:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA17625 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:31:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA17615 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:31:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA00715; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:30:19 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:30:19 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Joerg Wunsch cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jamil@acromail.ml.org Subject: Speaking of device drivers. In-Reply-To: <19970908004031.BO19348@uriah.heep.sax.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I am currently working on a piece of software (actually an expansion of an earlier product), in house as a consultant for a small company. It involves the coordination of a horrendous number of sensors/actuators attached to a number of networked freebsd machines (actually 1 master server and 3 diskless freebsd machines which I have gone to the trouble of burning custom eproms for so they are truly diskless), anyway the Idea is that the sensors which are attached to the diskless client machines can be coordinated and controlled from the master server. I have started to build the foundations of a protocal suited (or so I hope) for making devices like these available on the network. What happens is when the diskless machines start up they send requests to the master server for a connection etc, and youv'e read, write, detachment, keepalives and protocols for one of the clients go down/ server goes down etc. Like I've said this is a work in progress but I think that the concept could be generalized a bit more to include the equivalent of nfs for character devices -- my authentication right now is by serial keys and device description shared by client and server. The original Idea comes from the need to have say a serial instrument of some type, like a force guage, connected to one of the diskless machines but controlled by the master server. Anyway my original idea was to be able to have Inter Kernel Communication links between kernels on a network of machines such as this to interconnect all of their devices so that the remote machines would have like /dev/slave/cuaa0 etc that could be locked and ioctled read, write, mmaped (from what I gather that would be the hard part) as if all machines were one --- a From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 16:35:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA17889 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:35:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmb@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA17881; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:35:42 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Message-Id: <199709072335.QAA17881@hub.freebsd.org> Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists To: ahd@kew.com (Drew Derbyshire) Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:35:42 -0700 (PDT) Cc: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@hub.freebsd.org, support@kew.com In-Reply-To: <341314D0.E22ADFF3@kew.com> from "Drew Derbyshire" at Sep 7, 97 04:55:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Drew Derbyshire wrote: > > Jonathan M. Bresler wrote: > > therefore, we are not blocking mail from sites that can not be > > resolved in the DNS. not that i dont want to, there are just too > > many newbies out there that send mail to the lists. > > You really do want to enable that. > > First off, it really does kill much spam. > > Just as important, however, is that bounce messages just plain _don't_ > _work_ for such users when they are legitimate, and a specific useful > message reporting that the host cannot be resolved is going to do more > to solve their (or their ISP's) long term problem with lost bounces more > than blindly accepting mail which doesn't have a valid address. > > The TCP/IP protocol implicitly requires public IP address to be properly > registered to be routed (otherwise, you don't get your ACK's back!), please remember to distinguish between "mail from:" addresses and relays. there is *not* reasone that i know of that a "mail from:" address must be resolvable. if the "don't get your ACK's ba" they cant establish the TCP session in order to transfer the mail in the first place. > there is no sin in requiring public e-mail addresses registered as well. > > Note too, that newbies tend to not start with e-mail from their own > sites, they use their existing connection (Windows connected to an ISP > POP3 server or whatever) to get up and then migrate. I've handled > e-mail support for UUPC/extended for ~ 8 years, I've watched the pattern > for that long -- my help desk is now reading this over my shoulder, and > her comment is "Yup -- and that any list which is spammed is less > helpful". you may well be correct about this...i am still learning the email game even though i have been postmaster for over two years. things keep changing and there is always more to learn i may change the check_relay ruleset to require DNS resolution. ;) jmb From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 16:43:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA18220 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:43:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nico.telstra.net (nico.telstra.net [139.130.204.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA18213 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:43:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by nico.telstra.net (8.6.10/8.6.10) with ESMTP id JAA04233; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:40:48 +1000 Received: (grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.6.12) id JAA16317; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:10:46 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970908091046.29405@lemis.com> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:10:46 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Terry Lambert Cc: Brian Somers , doconnor@Ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. References: <199709071500.QAA23059@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> <199709071950.MAA24121@usr07.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709071950.MAA24121@usr07.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Sun, Sep 07, 1997 at 07:50:52PM +0000 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, Sep 07, 1997 at 07:50:52PM +0000, Terry Lambert wrote: >>> Or maybe he's like me, and he can't get the thing to idle disconnect >>> because of the !@#$! keep-alives that are near-impossible to turn >>> off if you have a local net as well. >> >> Hmm. I have a local net of 8 machines, and I don't have any such >> problems. Of course you know about "set afilter". > > Sure. I just don't know what packets are triggering it. There's > almost nothing running at all (literally; no routed, named, > whatever). Who says it has to be at your end? > And there's the annoying localhost DNS lookup, even though host.conf > has "hosts" first, and the name of the machine I'm rlogin'ing into > is in /etc/hosts (it's myself). It triggers the PPP dial anyway, > and I think that should only happen for non-local hosts. Well, why aren't you running named? It's faster than looking up /etc/hosts. And if you don't tell the world it's there, it's not going to get any external traffic. >> The thing I don't understand is how re-writing anything is going to >> solve a problem where people want the link to shutdown subliminally :-) > > Change the ground rules on the shutdown, for one... different issues > for SLIP/ISDN, for another. Why? Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 17:08:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA19492 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:08:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nico.telstra.net (nico.telstra.net [139.130.204.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA19486 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:08:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by nico.telstra.net (8.6.10/8.6.10) with ESMTP id KAA04767; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:07:41 +1000 Received: (grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.6.12) id JAA16401; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:37:40 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970908093740.17864@lemis.com> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:37:40 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Evan Champion Cc: Andreas Klemm , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? References: <19970907160423.39071@klemm.gtn.com> <3412C092.57D67DA9@synapse.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <3412C092.57D67DA9@synapse.net>; from Evan Champion on Sun, Sep 07, 1997 at 10:56:18AM -0400 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, Sep 07, 1997 at 10:56:18AM -0400, Evan Champion wrote: > Andreas Klemm wrote: >> I'm just repartitioning my system. When thinking about a new >> disk layout and partitioning I came to the conclusion, that >> putting the ports collection to /usr/local/ports would be cleaner, >> than using /usr/ports. > > I find that /usr/local/ is overused as it is. Agreed. > You could move it to /usr/local/ and make a symlink, or make a new > slice for /usr/ports/. /usr/local or its replacement should possibly be a separate file system. I find the idea of mounting file systems on non-root file systems aesthetically displeasing. How about (shudder) following the System V example and mounting them on /opt? Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 17:12:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA19753 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:12:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA19748 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:12:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA21220; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:12:14 -0700 (PDT) To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: i refuse to spend the $$$ In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 07 Sep 1997 15:28:14 PDT." Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 17:12:14 -0700 Message-ID: <21216.873677534@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > There is no good reason in the world I should have to go out and spend > $400+ dollars on a 2940 and scsi cdrom just so I can digitally pull a > couple tracks off of a cdrom, therefore I am requesting that someone point > me towards info (i guess ioctls) i need to get tracks off an atapi cdrom > --- I sure hope the atapi drivers support this?? Since its not fair that > lame ass windows users should be able to do this but I can not. Well, then you'd better be prepared to do some programming ("What? Jamil write code? Aieee!") since they don't support it. And no, I don't want to hear you whinging next about how horrible this is. Either be willing to fix it yourself (and with nothing more than the source code as a reference since nobody here has time to help you sort through the details or it'd be done already) or get used to it. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 17:13:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA19806 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:13:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA19796; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:13:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA21248; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:12:54 -0700 (PDT) To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" cc: Drew Derbyshire , "Jonathan M. Bresler" , hackers@hub.freebsd.org, support@kew.com Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 07 Sep 1997 15:36:30 PDT." Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 17:12:54 -0700 Message-ID: <21245.873677574@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Good reason not to talk to them then. > > Actually I was told that numerous government agencies have networks of > machines that don't reverse out. > > > The TCP/IP protocol implicitly requires public IP address to be properly > > registered to be routed (otherwise, you don't get your ACK's back!), > > there is no sin in requiring public e-mail addresses registered as well. > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 17:16:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA20161 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:16:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr08.primenet.com (tlambert@usr08.primenet.com [206.165.6.208]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA20154; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:16:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA13014; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:16:31 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709080016.RAA13014@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists To: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG (Jonathan M. Bresler) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:16:30 +0000 (GMT) Cc: ahd@kew.com, jmb@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@hub.freebsd.org, support@kew.com In-Reply-To: <199709072335.QAA17881@hub.freebsd.org> from "Jonathan M. Bresler" at Sep 7, 97 04:35:42 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > please remember to distinguish between "mail from:" addresses > and relays. there is *not* reasone that i know of that a > "mail from:" address must be resolvable. > if the "don't get your ACK's ba" they cant establish the TCP > session in order to transfer the mail in the first place. I think the "mail from:" addr needs to be resolvable. 1) mail from: rcpt to: -> accept 2) mail from: rcpt to: -> accept 3) mail from: -> reject 4) mail from: rcpt to: -> accept 5) mail from: rcpt to: -> reject Arguably, locality should be determined by client machine netblock, not name. But rejecting as in case (3) should be done, even if it's from a valid netblock, since it spam being relayed through another host to you. > > there is no sin in requiring public e-mail addresses registered as well. > > > > Note too, that newbies tend to not start with e-mail from their own > > sites, they use their existing connection (Windows connected to an ISP > > POP3 server or whatever) to get up and then migrate. I've handled > > e-mail support for UUPC/extended for ~ 8 years, I've watched the pattern > > for that long -- my help desk is now reading this over my shoulder, and > > her comment is "Yup -- and that any list which is spammed is less > > helpful". > > you may well be correct about this...i am still learning the > email game even though i have been postmaster for over two years. > things keep changing and there is always more to learn > i may change the check_relay ruleset to require DNS resolution. ;) I typically don't. The reason for this is that it is just as easy for a spammer to reverse lookup an IP address to a valid name. If you are talking about forward DNS resoloution, then validating the domain according to the applicable RFC's will kill most of them anyway (leading numerics, etc.). I can always lie and say: mail from: anyway. That'll resolve just fine, and it's still spam. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 17:21:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA20434 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:21:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr08.primenet.com (tlambert@usr08.primenet.com [206.165.6.208]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA20429 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:21:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA13169; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:20:58 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709080020.RAA13169@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:20:58 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, brian@awfulhak.org, doconnor@Ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970908091046.29405@lemis.com> from "Greg Lehey" at Sep 8, 97 09:10:46 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Sure. I just don't know what packets are triggering it. There's > > almost nothing running at all (literally; no routed, named, > > whatever). > > Who says it has to be at your end? It may not be. I have to run in debug mode first. Maybe later tonight or tommorrow. Kinda stupid for an ISP to do that, though, and I doubt PrimeNet is that stupid. > > And there's the annoying localhost DNS lookup, even though host.conf > > has "hosts" first, and the name of the machine I'm rlogin'ing into > > is in /etc/hosts (it's myself). It triggers the PPP dial anyway, > > and I think that should only happen for non-local hosts. > > Well, why aren't you running named? It's faster than looking up > /etc/hosts. And if you don't tell the world it's there, it's not > going to get any external traffic. I will run named, once I get my HP345 stable enough that I want it up most of the time. Until then, just having a hosts file that I FTP around is enough. > >> The thing I don't understand is how re-writing anything is going to > >> solve a problem where people want the link to shutdown subliminally :-) > > > > Change the ground rules on the shutdown, for one... different issues > > for SLIP/ISDN, for another. > > Why? Because of the shorter connect time, you can have a shorter idle time for ISDN, for one. A number of ISP's in the Seattle area will actually call *you* when there are packets for you, so you are truly capable of running a server (mail, www, etc.). For SLIP, it depends. Some people actually still have NetBlazer's. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 17:28:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA20717 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:28:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr08.primenet.com (tlambert@usr08.primenet.com [206.165.6.208]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA20711 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:28:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA13331; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:27:56 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709080027.RAA13331@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Speaking of device drivers. To: jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org (Jamil J. Weatherbee) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:27:56 +0000 (GMT) Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jamil@acromail.ml.org In-Reply-To: from "Jamil J. Weatherbee" at Sep 7, 97 04:30:19 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [ ...exported device files... ] > Anyway my > original idea was to be able to have Inter Kernel Communication links > between kernels on a network of machines such as this to interconnect all > of their devices so that the remote machines would have like > /dev/slave/cuaa0 etc that could be locked and ioctled read, write, mmaped > (from what I gather that would be the hard part) as if all machines were > one --- a A unified namespace may be beyond the scope of an implementation -- I would personally use symlinks for it. As for exporting devices, devices work by having a major and minor and the driver being looked up on the local kernels devsw/cdevsw array according to the major number and device type, and then the minor is applied to get a particular instance of a device using that driver. So by default, devices don't go remote. Now devfs, being vnode based rather than major/minor based *could* be made to go remote. This is because you would be exporting normal vnodes, not device nodes, for the remote lookup, and an nfsnode remote vnode alias should be able to reference the devfs fine. Intel OpenNet did this as well, but it only worked between homogenous machines, where all the parameters were the same. One issue I'd think might bite you is the proxying of ioctl()/fcntl() calls over NFS. You may have to hack NFS to make this work properly, since by default an ioctl() on an open FS object's fd returns (at the wrong layer, IMO) ENOTTY. I suppose I could help if you were going to implement this. You may also want to look at mnfs, which does a lot of this already (goto Yahoo and search for "David Sarnoff"). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 17:32:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA20991 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:32:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kithrup.com (kithrup.com [205.179.156.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA20985; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:31:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from sef@localhost) by kithrup.com (8.8.5/8.6.6) id RAA00445; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:31:56 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:31:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Sean Eric Fagan Message-Id: <199709080031.RAA00445@kithrup.com> To: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists References: <341314D0.E22ADFF3@kew.com> from "Drew Derbyshire" at Sep 7, 97 04:55:44 pm Organization: Kithrup Enterprises, Ltd. Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In article <199709072335.QAA17881.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@hub.freebsd.org> you write: > please remember to distinguish between "mail from:" addresses > and relays. there is *not* reasone that i know of that a > "mail from:" address must be resolvable. Uh, if we can't reply to them, what are we doing allowing them to ask questions? From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 17:33:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA21144 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:33:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pandora.hh.kew.com (root@kendra.ne.mediaone.net [24.128.53.73]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA21114; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:33:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sonata (sonata.hh.kew.com [192.195.203.135]) by pandora.hh.kew.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA25801; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:33:45 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3413480B.BADF1376@kew.com> Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 20:34:19 -0400 From: Drew Derbyshire Organization: Kendra Electronic Wonderworks X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en]C-MOENE (WinNT; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" CC: hackers@hub.freebsd.org, support@kew.com Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <199709072335.QAA17881@hub.freebsd.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jonathan M. Bresler wrote: > Drew Derbyshire wrote: > > The TCP/IP protocol implicitly requires public IP address to be properly > > registered to be routed (otherwise, you don't get your ACK's back!), > > please remember to distinguish between "mail from:" addresses > and relays. The relay name (host name of the SMTP client) need not be resolvable in DNS, I didn't mean to imply it did. I mean the actual IP addresss had to be routable. Someone else was confused by my wording as well. > if the "don't get your ACK's back" they cant establish the TCP > session in order to transfer the mail in the first place. Correct, which goes back to my original statement that the network routing must be registered -- not with DNS, but with the backbone routers. > there is *not* reasone that i know of that a > "mail from:" address must be resolvable. Yes, there is. The address in the SMTP "MAIL FROM" line is used for bounce messages by sendmail. Consider if you send mail via a third-party relay (such as a back-up MX forwarder, something both kew.com and freebsd.org have) and mail lands on the backup MX forwarder because the primary is down. When the intermediate relay connects to the ultimate destination, if the user id on the final is bad then the intermediate relay's bounce message will be sent to the "MAIL FROM" address. Thus, the bounce message is lost if the "MAIL FROM" address is bad. -ahd- -- Internet: ahd@kew.com Voice: 617-279-9812 "MS-DOS didn't get as bad as it is overnight -- it took over ten years of careful development." - dmeggins@aix1.uottawa.ca From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 17:43:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA21796 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:43:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nico.telstra.net (nico.telstra.net [139.130.204.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA21791 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:43:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by nico.telstra.net (8.6.10/8.6.10) with ESMTP id KAA05782; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:41:49 +1000 Received: (grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.6.12) id KAA16567; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:11:47 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970908101147.19775@lemis.com> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:11:47 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Terry Lambert Cc: brian@awfulhak.org, doconnor@Ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. References: <19970908091046.29405@lemis.com> <199709080020.RAA13169@usr08.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709080020.RAA13169@usr08.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 12:20:58AM +0000 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 12:20:58AM +0000, Terry Lambert wrote: >>> Sure. I just don't know what packets are triggering it. There's >>> almost nothing running at all (literally; no routed, named, >>> whatever). >> >> Who says it has to be at your end? > > It may not be. I have to run in debug mode first. Maybe later tonight > or tommorrow. Kinda stupid for an ISP to do that, though, and I > doubt PrimeNet is that stupid. I've seen plenty of stupid ISPs, though I don't know PrimeNet. But you don't need to run ppp in debug mode; you can run tcpdump on a tun interface. >>> And there's the annoying localhost DNS lookup, even though host.conf >>> has "hosts" first, and the name of the machine I'm rlogin'ing into >>> is in /etc/hosts (it's myself). It triggers the PPP dial anyway, >>> and I think that should only happen for non-local hosts. >> >> Well, why aren't you running named? It's faster than looking up >> /etc/hosts. And if you don't tell the world it's there, it's not >> going to get any external traffic. > > I will run named, once I get my HP345 stable enough that I want it > up most of the time. Until then, just having a hosts file that > I FTP around is enough. It's really a lot easier with a name daemon. Set cahcing only, and you'll have the added benefit of much reduced lookup time to the outside world. >>>> The thing I don't understand is how re-writing anything is going to >>>> solve a problem where people want the link to shutdown subliminally :-) >>> >>> Change the ground rules on the shutdown, for one... different issues >>> for SLIP/ISDN, for another. >> >> Why? > > Because of the shorter connect time, you can have a shorter idle time > for ISDN, for one. OK, that's reasonable. Anyway, you can specify the idle time per destination, which implies an interface as well. > A number of ISP's in the Seattle area will actually call *you* when > there are packets for you, Good for them! Publish their names, praise them openly. > so you are truly capable of running a server (mail, www, etc.). Right. > For SLIP, it depends. Some people actually still have NetBlazer's. I thought SLIP had emigrated to Russia. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 17:52:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA22441 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:52:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from misery.sdf.com (misery.sdf.com [204.244.210.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA22402 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:52:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tom by misery.sdf.com with smtp (Exim 1.62 #1) id 0x7ryy-0005JG-00; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:47:12 -0700 Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:47:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom Samplonius To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: i refuse to spend the $$$ In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 7 Sep 1997, Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > There is no good reason in the world I should have to go out and spend > $400+ dollars on a 2940 ... You are paying way to much for that controller. I can almost get a motherboard with integrated AIC7880 (ultrawide) controller for that price. Also, ncr810 based cards are around $75, or less. Tom From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 17:56:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA22672 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:56:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from adam.ist.flinders.edu.au (root@adam.ist.flinders.edu.au [129.96.1.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA22465 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:52:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (root@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au [129.96.43.66]) by adam.ist.flinders.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA20753 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:22:50 +0930 (CST) Received: from lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (doconnor@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA00380 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:22:32 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199709080052.KAA00380@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 07 Sep 1997 18:33:28 -0400." <1.5.4.32.19970907223328.008be880@mail.mindspring.com> Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 10:22:23 +0930 From: "Daniel J. O'Connor" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > The File Notification scheme (useful for Terry's file browser) may have used > this messaging scheme as well (I honestly don't remember). You certainly I think it does... > could be notified of disk change events (floppy insert/removal, later > removable HD change) through messages. > > Now, here's the question: How difficult would it be to do something like this > ? > It would take some sort of shared memory or other scheme to get the data from > one program to another. Or would that be too general? How about just a scheme > to get messages to and from the kernel? Yeah, the Amiga had the 'advantage' of having no memory protection(at all), so you could just pass pointers around =) Maybe the kernel could manage this stuff for your program, or perhaps someone could write a library to hide all the shared memory stuff(ie use SysV IPC calls, but abstract them in a library). > I love my Amiga, still use it. In fact, I just got NetBSD up and running on i > day before yesterday. Bonus. Wohoo! Another amiga freak ;) Seeya Darius ~~~~~~ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 18:16:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA23655 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:16:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmb@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA23646; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:16:02 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Message-Id: <199709080116.SAA23646@hub.freebsd.org> Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists To: ahd@kew.com (Drew Derbyshire) Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:16:02 -0700 (PDT) Cc: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@hub.freebsd.org, support@kew.com In-Reply-To: <3413480B.BADF1376@kew.com> from "Drew Derbyshire" at Sep 7, 97 08:34:19 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Drew Derbyshire wrote: > > Jonathan M. Bresler wrote: > > Drew Derbyshire wrote: > > > The TCP/IP protocol implicitly requires public IP address to be properly > > > registered to be routed (otherwise, you don't get your ACK's back!), > > > > please remember to distinguish between "mail from:" addresses > > and relays. > > The relay name (host name of the SMTP client) need not be resolvable in > DNS, I didn't mean to imply it did. I mean the actual IP addresss had > to be routable. Someone else was confused by my wording as well. how do i probe routing tables with sendmail. rfc-1918 addresses are blocked by the routers and be many ISPs > > > if the "don't get your ACK's back" they cant establish the TCP > > session in order to transfer the mail in the first place. > > Correct, which goes back to my original statement that the network > routing must be registered -- not with DNS, but with the backbone > routers. > > > there is *not* reasone that i know of that a > > "mail from:" address must be resolvable. > > Yes, there is. The address in the SMTP "MAIL FROM" line is used for uucp mail from is valid. even though i cannot doa DNS on it. our uucp relay will accept the message and attempt delivery for us. > bounce messages by sendmail. Consider if you send mail via a > third-party relay (such as a back-up MX forwarder, something both > kew.com and freebsd.org have) and mail lands on the backup MX forwarder > because the primary is down. When the intermediate relay connects to > the ultimate destination, if the user id on the final is bad then the > intermediate relay's bounce message will be sent to the "MAIL FROM" > address. Thus, the bounce message is lost if the "MAIL FROM" address is > bad. everyone please, in your mails to me about this be kind to an old man ;) and differentiate between "mail from", relay host, uucp and all the rest of the nuances of mail ahhhh...now i feel better jmb an example of some of the crazy stuff i see: hub cf[183] grep 22278 /var/log/maillog Sep 7 17:51:03 hub sendmail[22278]: NOQUEUE: ruleset=check_relay, arg1=[200.241.133.2], arg2=200.241.133.2, relay=root@localhost, reject=451 Domain does not resolve hub cf[190] whois 200.241.133 RNP (Brazilian Research Network) (NETBLK-BRAZIL-BLK2) Rua Pio XI, 1500 - CEP 05468-901 Sao Paulo - SP - BRAZIL Netname: BRAZIL-BLK2 Netblock: 200.128.0.0 - 200.255.255.0 Maintainer: RNP Coordinator: Gomide, Alberto Courrege (ACG8) gomide@FAPESP.BR +55-11-203-1617 telex +55-11-82014 (FAX) +55-11-260-5749 Domain System inverse mapping provided by: DIXIT.ANSP.BR 143.108.1.17 FPSP.FAPESP.BR 143.108.1.1 Record last updated on 31-May-95. Database last updated on 7-Sep-97 04:42:18 EDT. traceroute to 200.241.133.2 (200.241.133.2), 30 hops max, 40 byte packets 1 gate-free.cdrom.com (204.216.27.17) 2.786 ms 1.615 ms 1.568 ms 2 R-CRL-SFO-01-EX.US.CRL.NET (165.113.118.1) 9.740 ms 6.604 ms 11.760 ms 3 T3-GW1.F0.US.CRL.NET (165.113.55.1) 6.169 ms 11.495 ms 9.854 ms 4 pb-nap-A.sprint.net (198.32.128.11) 90.045 ms 67.609 ms 53.307 ms 5 144.232.4.53 (144.232.4.53) 45.483 ms 48.438 ms 51.077 ms 6 144.232.4.62 (144.232.4.62) 47.819 ms 52.356 ms 45.453 ms 7 144.232.4.26 (144.232.4.26) 59.962 ms 62.978 ms 55.018 ms 8 sl-dc-22-H1/1/0-T3.sprintlink.net (144.228.10.1) 145.308 ms 141.519 ms 158.803 ms 9 gip-dc-3-Fddi0-0.gip.net (204.59.144.197) 159.809 ms 185.180 ms 183.921 ms 10 204.59.224.210 (204.59.224.210) 298.138 ms 295.839 ms 300.674 ms 11 200.255.197.66 (200.255.197.66) 279.356 ms 299.283 ms 286.813 ms 12 200.244.174.234 (200.244.174.234) 340.029 ms 360.515 ms 348.143 ms 13 200.241.133.2 (200.241.133.2) 351.569 ms 333.830 ms 338.070 ms From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 18:24:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA24131 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:24:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tao.sinanet.com.tw ([139.175.55.224]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA24071; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:24:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ywliu1@localhost) by tao.sinanet.com.tw (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA14004; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:24:12 +0800 (CST) From: Hoffmann Yen-Wei Liu Message-Id: <199709080124.JAA14004@tao.sinanet.com.tw> Subject: Kernel clock runs inaccurately To: question@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:24:11 +0800 (CST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, Sorry, I don't know if this question fits in questions or hackers mailing list. I just got myself a new AMD k6-200, and I found out a major problem : it runs about 30 seconds faster per day. So two days later, it runs 2 minutes faster. However, the CMOS clock runs around 2 seconds slower per day. This is acceptable to me. After fooling around with CLK_USE_I8254_CALIBRATION and CLK_USE_I586_CALIBRATION options, I can either make it run 2 seconds slower per *hour*, or several seconds faster per minutes, but not to a acceptably inaccurate ranage. The boot verbose flag gives me the following figure inf: ... Calibrating clock(s) ... i586 clock: 199932094 Hz, i8254 clock: 1194681 Hz Calibrating clock(s) ... i586 clock: 199931374 Hz, i8254 clock: 1194663 Hz CPU: AMD K6 (199.93-MHz 586-class CPU) Origin = "AuthenticAMD" Id = 0x561 Stepping=1 Features=0x8001bf ... Also, even looking into isa/i386/clock.c cannot give me too many clues. In a word, 1) I know Pentium motherboard clock isn't accurate. But is there any workaround for me to set options or modify clock.c to make the kernel clock runs in a acceptably inaccurate range ? 2) Does changing to a new motherboard with better quality help ? 3) I run OSS/FreeBSD commercial sound driver. Does this possibly matter ? THanks for your attention. Yen-Wei Liu From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 18:35:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA24833 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:35:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hydrogen.nike.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA24806; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:35:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.nike.efn.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA17234; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:17:28 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970907181727.43084@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:17:27 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Cc: Drew Derbyshire , hackers@hub.freebsd.org, support@kew.com Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists References: <341314D0.E22ADFF3@kew.com> <199709072335.QAA17881@hub.freebsd.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709072335.QAA17881@hub.freebsd.org>; from Jonathan M. Bresler on Sun, Sep 07, 1997 at 04:35:42PM -0700 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jonathan M. Bresler scribbled this message on Sep 7: > Drew Derbyshire wrote: > > > > Jonathan M. Bresler wrote: > > > therefore, we are not blocking mail from sites that can not be > > > resolved in the DNS. not that i dont want to, there are just too > > > many newbies out there that send mail to the lists. > > > > You really do want to enable that. > > > > First off, it really does kill much spam. > > > > Just as important, however, is that bounce messages just plain _don't_ > > _work_ for such users when they are legitimate, and a specific useful > > message reporting that the host cannot be resolved is going to do more > > to solve their (or their ISP's) long term problem with lost bounces more > > than blindly accepting mail which doesn't have a valid address. > > > > The TCP/IP protocol implicitly requires public IP address to be properly > > registered to be routed (otherwise, you don't get your ACK's back!), > > please remember to distinguish between "mail from:" addresses > and relays. there is *not* reasone that i know of that a > "mail from:" address must be resolvable. > if the "don't get your ACK's ba" they cant establish the TCP > session in order to transfer the mail in the first place. actually.. yes it does... the mail from: is exactly that... the return path... i.e. if it isn't resolvable, then it's not a valid return path... now if you provide a uucp address.. then it's a bit harder to verify that it's valid... > > there is no sin in requiring public e-mail addresses registered as well. > > > > Note too, that newbies tend to not start with e-mail from their own > > sites, they use their existing connection (Windows connected to an ISP > > POP3 server or whatever) to get up and then migrate. I've handled > > e-mail support for UUPC/extended for ~ 8 years, I've watched the pattern > > for that long -- my help desk is now reading this over my shoulder, and > > her comment is "Yup -- and that any list which is spammed is less > > helpful". > > you may well be correct about this...i am still learning the > email game even though i have been postmaster for over two years. > things keep changing and there is always more to learn > i may change the check_relay ruleset to require DNS resolution. ;) personally... I think that it isn't bad any more... considering how easy it is to fix, (I posted the fix a couple days ago) I'm actually heading twards the end that forces it to resolve... :) ttyl.. -- John-Mark Gurney Modem/FAX: +1 541 683 6954 Cu Networking Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 18:48:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA25609 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:48:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmb@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA25601; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:48:46 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Message-Id: <199709080148.SAA25601@hub.freebsd.org> Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists To: gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:48:46 -0700 (PDT) Cc: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG, ahd@kew.com, hackers@hub.freebsd.org, support@kew.com In-Reply-To: <19970907181727.43084@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> from "John-Mark Gurney" at Sep 7, 97 06:17:27 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk John-Mark Gurney wrote: > > > please remember to distinguish between "mail from:" addresses > > and relays. there is *not* reasone that i know of that a > > "mail from:" address must be resolvable. > > if the "don't get your ACK's ba" they cant establish the TCP > > session in order to transfer the mail in the first place. > > actually.. yes it does... the mail from: is exactly that... the return > path... i.e. if it isn't resolvable, then it's not a valid return path... > now if you provide a uucp address.. then it's a bit harder to verify > that it's valid... have we talked about x.400 yet? the "mail from" might even be a martian network behind some relay. only the relay has to be contactable via TCP/IP. not the "mail from:" jmb two more bite the dust: Sep 7 18:18:31 hub sendmail[23726]: NOQUEUE: ruleset=check_relay, arg1=imsp015.netvigator.com, arg2=205.252.144.206, relay=root@localhost, reject=521 blocked.contact postmaster@FreeBSD.ORG Sep 7 18:32:45 hub sendmail[24585]: SAA24585: ruleset=check_mail, arg1=, relay=root@[205.164.68.2], reject=521 ... specially processed assorted meats? yuck! From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 18:54:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA25847 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:54:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hwcn.org (main.hwcn.org [199.212.94.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA25841; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:54:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from james.freenet.hamilton.on.ca (ac199@james.hwcn.org [199.212.94.66]) by hwcn.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA26960; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 21:55:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (ac199@localhost) by james.freenet.hamilton.on.ca (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id VAA18117; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 21:55:19 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: james.freenet.hamilton.on.ca: ac199 owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 21:55:07 -0400 (EDT) From: Tim Vanderhoek X-Sender: ac199@james.freenet.hamilton.on.ca To: Sean Eric Fagan cc: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists In-Reply-To: <199709080031.RAA00445@kithrup.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 7 Sep 1997, Sean Eric Fagan wrote: > In article <199709072335.QAA17881.kithrup.freebsd.hackers@hub.freebsd.org> you write: > > please remember to distinguish between "mail from:" addresses > > and relays. there is *not* reasone that i know of that a > > "mail from:" address must be resolvable. > > Uh, if we can't reply to them, what are we doing allowing them to ask > questions? Anticipating that they have set the reply-to field. (Which of course leads to question #2; if they're smart enough to set the reply-to field, aren't they smart enough to use a correct mail from?) -- Outnumbered? Maybe. Outspoken? Never! tIM...HOEk From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 18:55:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA25923 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:55:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA25918; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:55:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA01090; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:54:21 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:54:20 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Hoffmann Yen-Wei Liu cc: question@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Kernel clock runs inaccurately In-Reply-To: <199709080124.JAA14004@tao.sinanet.com.tw> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I don't think this has any bearing on the problem but if you are connected to a network run xntpd to keep gettimeofday() clock synced with a master server (like the navy or something) On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Hoffmann Yen-Wei Liu wrote: > Hi, > > Sorry, I don't know if this question fits in questions or hackers > mailing list. > > I just got myself a new AMD k6-200, and I found out a major problem : > it runs about 30 seconds faster per day. So two days later, it runs > 2 minutes faster. However, the CMOS clock runs around 2 seconds slower > per day. This is acceptable to me. > > After fooling around with CLK_USE_I8254_CALIBRATION and > CLK_USE_I586_CALIBRATION options, I can either make it run 2 seconds slower > per *hour*, or several seconds faster per minutes, but not to a acceptably > inaccurate ranage. The boot verbose flag gives me the following figure inf: > > ... > Calibrating clock(s) ... i586 clock: 199932094 Hz, i8254 clock: 1194681 Hz > Calibrating clock(s) ... i586 clock: 199931374 Hz, i8254 clock: 1194663 Hz > CPU: AMD K6 (199.93-MHz 586-class CPU) > Origin = "AuthenticAMD" Id = 0x561 Stepping=1 > Features=0x8001bf > ... > > > Also, even looking into isa/i386/clock.c cannot give me too many clues. > > In a word, > > 1) I know Pentium motherboard clock isn't accurate. But is there any workaround > for me to set options or modify clock.c to make the kernel clock runs in > a acceptably inaccurate range ? > > 2) Does changing to a new motherboard with better quality help ? > > 3) I run OSS/FreeBSD commercial sound driver. Does this possibly matter ? > > > THanks for your attention. > > > Yen-Wei Liu > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 19:00:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA26243 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:00:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA26236 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:00:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by alpo.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA09418; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:55:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) via SMTP by alpo.whistle.com, id smtpd009416; Mon Sep 8 01:55:38 1997 Message-ID: <34135B01.6201DD56@whistle.com> Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 18:55:13 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "info-cvs@prep.ai.mit.edu" CC: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: [RFC] Possible CVS change.. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Dear CVS guru's (and freebsd types CC'd), By changing the following change: (big isn't it?) the following becomes possible: cvs checkout -rMY_BRANCH -D"7 days ago" my-module also cvs update -rMY_BRANCH -D"May 1" my-module is also allowable.. this seems useful to me In fact I desperatly need this.. does anyone know if tis is a reasonable thing to do, (or not?) if you are one of the maintainers I'd definitly like to hear from you, as if I don't I'll add this change to the FreeBSD CVS mirror, as we use many branches and not being able to check them out to a past date is a real pain.. better methods are of course just as welcome, e.g. "-rMY_BRANCH:May 1" would work just as well for me. julian@freebsd.org --- update.c Sun Sep 7 18:21:58 1997 +++ update.c.new Sun Sep 7 18:21:42 1997 @@ -491,7 +491,7 @@ && tag != NULL && finfo->rcs != NULL) { - char *rev = RCS_getversion (finfo->rcs, tag, NULL, 1, NULL); + char *rev = RCS_getversion (finfo->rcs, tag, date, 1, NULL); if (rev != NULL && !RCS_nodeisbranch (finfo->rcs, tag)) nonbranch = 1; From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 19:25:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA27401 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:25:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hydrogen.nike.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA27390 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:25:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.nike.efn.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA17572; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:25:37 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970907192536.54931@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:25:36 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: hackers@hub.freebsd.org Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists References: <19970907181727.43084@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> <199709080148.SAA25601@hub.freebsd.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709080148.SAA25601@hub.freebsd.org>; from Jonathan M. Bresler on Sun, Sep 07, 1997 at 06:48:46PM -0700 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jonathan M. Bresler scribbled this message on Sep 7: > John-Mark Gurney wrote: > > > > > please remember to distinguish between "mail from:" addresses > > > and relays. there is *not* reasone that i know of that a > > > "mail from:" address must be resolvable. > > > if the "don't get your ACK's ba" they cant establish the TCP > > > session in order to transfer the mail in the first place. > > > > actually.. yes it does... the mail from: is exactly that... the return > > path... i.e. if it isn't resolvable, then it's not a valid return path... > > now if you provide a uucp address.. then it's a bit harder to verify > > that it's valid... > > have we talked about x.400 yet? > the "mail from" might even be a martian network behind some > relay. > > only the relay has to be contactable via TCP/IP. > not the "mail from:" no... your not correct... read what the rfc821 has to say about it: MAIL FROM: This command tells the SMTP-receiver that a new mail transaction is starting and to reset all its state tables and buffers, including any recipients or mail data. It gives the reverse-path which can be used to report errors. If accepted, the receiver-SMTP returns a 250 OK reply. The can contain more than just a mailbox. The is a reverse source routing list of hosts and source mailbox. The first host in the should be the host sending this command. two key sentences... a) "It gives the reverse-path which can be used to report errors." b) "The frist host in the should be the host sending this command." basicly it states that the MAIL From must be a perfectly representable mail address to YOU... if this forces the person to add "@relay.host.name" at the end, then be it.. but it clearly states that if the recieving end doesn't accept it, they don't have to... > two more bite the dust: > > Sep 7 18:18:31 hub sendmail[23726]: NOQUEUE: ruleset=check_relay, arg1=imsp015.netvigator.com, arg2=205.252.144.206, relay=root@localhost, reject=521 blocked.contact postmaster@FreeBSD.ORG > Sep 7 18:32:45 hub sendmail[24585]: SAA24585: ruleset=check_mail, arg1=, relay=root@[205.164.68.2], reject=521 ... specially processed assorted meats? yuck! I like the last one.. :) -- John-Mark Gurney Modem/FAX: +1 541 683 6954 Cu Networking Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 19:27:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA27525 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:27:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from misery.sdf.com (misery.sdf.com [204.244.210.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id TAA27519; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:27:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tom by misery.sdf.com with smtp (Exim 1.62 #1) id 0x7tTG-0005VU-00; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:22:35 -0700 Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:22:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom Samplonius To: Tim Vanderhoek cc: Sean Eric Fagan , jmb@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 7 Sep 1997, Tim Vanderhoek wrote: > > Uh, if we can't reply to them, what are we doing allowing them to ask > > questions? > > Anticipating that they have set the reply-to field. Yes, but if the message should need to be returned by the MTA, it will be returned to the envelope sender (SMTP mail from:) address. Many don't know this, and lose mail because their headers (From: and Reply-To:) are right, but the envelope sender is wrong. Tom From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 19:34:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA27917 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:34:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr07.primenet.com (tlambert@usr07.primenet.com [206.165.6.207]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA27906; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:34:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr07.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA15682; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:34:28 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709080234.TAA15682@usr07.primenet.com> Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists To: ahd@kew.com (Drew Derbyshire) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 02:34:26 +0000 (GMT) Cc: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@hub.freebsd.org, support@kew.com In-Reply-To: <3413480B.BADF1376@kew.com> from "Drew Derbyshire" at Sep 7, 97 08:34:19 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > there is *not* reasone that i know of that a > > "mail from:" address must be resolvable. > > Yes, there is. The address in the SMTP "MAIL FROM" line is used for > bounce messages by sendmail. You are forgetting "MAIL FROM:<>", which is perfectly valid. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 19:43:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA28276 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:43:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr07.primenet.com (tlambert@usr07.primenet.com [206.165.6.207]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA28268; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:43:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr07.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA16013; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:43:50 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709080243.TAA16013@usr07.primenet.com> Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists To: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG (Jonathan M. Bresler) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 02:43:49 +0000 (GMT) Cc: ahd@kew.com, jmb@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@hub.freebsd.org, support@kew.com In-Reply-To: <199709080116.SAA23646@hub.freebsd.org> from "Jonathan M. Bresler" at Sep 7, 97 06:16:02 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > uucp mail from is valid. even though i cannot doa DNS on it. > our uucp relay will accept the message and attempt delivery for us. UUCP mail is specifically handled semantically in the relay syntax for the embedded responder address. THis has to be handled anyway, or you would not be able to send mail from a "normal" host to a UUCP host and then on to a bang path. For example, in the address "gang!foobar@fee.com", the address of the relay host "fee.com" must be accessible. In other words, only the RHS is examined, and the bangs are all left-associative. > hub cf[183] grep 22278 /var/log/maillog > Sep 7 17:51:03 hub sendmail[22278]: NOQUEUE: ruleset=check_relay, arg1=[200.241.133.2], arg2=200.241.133.2, relay=root@localhost, reject=451 Domain does not resolve Heh. The address rewriting rules for outbound mail will, by default, replace the 'localhost' before invoking the check_relay ruleset following rule 98. If it doesn't, your config file is broken (or, re: our LUSER_RELAY discussion, perhaps the sendmail configuration macros are flawed). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 19:51:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA28646 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:51:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr07.primenet.com (tlambert@usr07.primenet.com [206.165.6.207]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA28638; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:51:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr07.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA16323; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:51:23 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709080251.TAA16323@usr07.primenet.com> Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists To: gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 02:51:22 +0000 (GMT) Cc: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG, ahd@kew.com, hackers@hub.freebsd.org, support@kew.com In-Reply-To: <19970907181727.43084@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> from "John-Mark Gurney" at Sep 7, 97 06:17:27 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > actually.. yes it does... the mail from: is exactly that... the return > path... i.e. if it isn't resolvable, then it's not a valid return path... > now if you provide a uucp address.. then it's a bit harder to verify > that it's valid... No it's not. You only have to validate the UUCP relay domain, not the UUCP address, unless *you* are the relay, in which case it's coming in through you, and you have listed the uucp hosts which connect directly to you both as machines you MX for (to allow outbound relay to them, and to allow inbound relay to any address by them). The relay takes effect *after* the spam countermeasures. For a spammer UUCP site relaying through you: change their password; I've never seen one anyway, mostly because the route information is much better than sendmail's because the "for
" is an optional component of the "Received:" timestamp line (RFC821, page 32). > personally... I think that it isn't bad any more... considering how easy > it is to fix, (I posted the fix a couple days ago) I'm actually heading > twards the end that forces it to resolve... :) This neglects the case of a machine acting as the domain for which it is a member in order to send mail. It also neglects the point of browsers on PCs that you yourself raised earlier: Eudora, IEx.x, and NetScape all can send mail without a valid return address. As can "cyberbomber", etc.. Consider someone like that, who nevertheless subscribes to the list with a valid return address. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 20:03:12 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA29347 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:03:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA29342 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:03:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA01850; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:01:51 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709080301.UAA01850@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0gamma 1/27/96 To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: i refuse to spend the $$$ In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 07 Sep 1997 15:28:14 PDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 20:01:50 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In the audio ports section there is a program called tosha so just take a look --- it is scsi oriented. Also the scsi-2 spects available on the net can help understand how a program such as tosha works . Your task is then reduce to mapping the high level scsi commands to ide commands . Amancio >From The Desk Of "Jamil J. Weatherbee" : > > There is no good reason in the world I should have to go out and spend > $400+ dollars on a 2940 and scsi cdrom just so I can digitally pull a > couple tracks off of a cdrom, therefore I am requesting that someone point > me towards info (i guess ioctls) i need to get tracks off an atapi cdrom > --- I sure hope the atapi drivers support this?? Since its not fair that > lame ass windows users should be able to do this but I can not. > > > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 20:04:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA29469 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:04:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hydrogen.nike.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA29463 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:04:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.nike.efn.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA17901; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:04:46 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970907200445.27869@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:04:45 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: hackers@hub.freebsd.org Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists References: <19970907181727.43084@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> <199709080251.TAA16323@usr07.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709080251.TAA16323@usr07.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 02:51:22AM +0000 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert scribbled this message on Sep 8: > > personally... I think that it isn't bad any more... considering how easy > > it is to fix, (I posted the fix a couple days ago) I'm actually heading > > twards the end that forces it to resolve... :) > > This neglects the case of a machine acting as the domain for which it > is a member in order to send mail. oh, your talking about if the machine is somehost.domain.com, and that it users recieve their mail at username@domain.com?? well. then it's your job as an admin to fix those machines to properly identify itself... > It also neglects the point of browsers on PCs that you yourself raised > earlier: Eudora, IEx.x, and NetScape all can send mail without a valid > return address. As can "cyberbomber", etc.. Consider someone like > that, who nevertheless subscribes to the list with a valid return address. umm... can you refer to me the message that I brought about about how browsers can send fine? (mesg-id will do nicely, I archive all out going mail)... yes.. but that's because those programs do the masquerading for you.. I believe they take your from address and just present it in the "mail from:" part... nothing says that the return-path has to include the local machine... by default sendmail doesn't masquerade or read your mail to grab the reply-to to preset a valid mail from:... it just assumes that the machine addressing the envelope knows what it's doing.. and if you tell sendmail to rewrite addresses.. it will happily whiteout your invalid info.. and replace it with valid info (that you tell it).. -- John-Mark Gurney Modem/FAX: +1 541 683 6954 Cu Networking Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 21:04:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA02511 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 21:04:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pandora.hh.kew.com (root@kendra.ne.mediaone.net [24.128.53.73]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA02503; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 21:04:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sonata (sonata.hh.kew.com [192.195.203.135]) by pandora.hh.kew.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA26569; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:04:39 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <34137978.288AD02@kew.com> Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 00:05:12 -0400 From: Drew Derbyshire Organization: Kendra Electronic Wonderworks X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en]C-MOENE (WinNT; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Terry Lambert CC: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <199709080234.TAA15682@usr07.primenet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert wrote: > > > > there is *not* reasone that i know of that a > > > "mail from:" address must be resolvable. > > > > Yes, there is. The address in the SMTP "MAIL FROM" line is used for > > bounce messages by sendmail. > > You are forgetting "MAIL FROM:<>", which is perfectly valid. I was, but it's a document special case, but ignorable for my comments as it's a "valid" address, which is to say the bit bucket. -ahd- -- Internet: ahd@kew.com Voice: 617-279-9810 "MS-DOS didn't get as bad as it is overnight -- it took over ten years of careful development." - dmeggins@aix1.uottawa.ca From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 21:18:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA02931 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 21:18:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pandora.hh.kew.com (root@kendra.ne.mediaone.net [24.128.53.73]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA02922; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 21:18:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sonata (sonata.hh.kew.com [192.195.203.135]) by pandora.hh.kew.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA26616; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:18:41 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <34137CC3.E267B6B@kew.com> Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 00:19:15 -0400 From: Drew Derbyshire Organization: Kendra Electronic Wonderworks X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en]C-MOENE (WinNT; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" CC: hackers@hub.freebsd.org, support@kew.com Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <199709080116.SAA23646@hub.freebsd.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jonathan M. Bresler wrote: > uucp mail from is valid. even though i cannot doa DNS on it. > our uucp relay will accept the message and attempt delivery for us. If you are delivering to a UUCP domain, you can do DNS on the MX records. For example, the machine pandora.uucp.kew.com is MX only. DNS is not just address records. So the MAIL FROM address for a UUCP host should either have a valid MX record, or be rewritten to by host!user@relay.fqdn, where of course relay.fqdn has valid address and/or MX records. -- Internet: ahd@kew.com Voice: 617-279-9810 Q. What machine does Windows NT run best on? A. A 35 mm slide projector. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 22:09:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA06363 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:09:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA06354 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:09:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (lot.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [203.20.121.21]) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA24113 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:39:18 +0930 (CST) Received: from word.smith.net.au ([127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA01269; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:05:49 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709080405.OAA01269@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?=DEor=F0ur?= Ivarsson cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How do I write device driver In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 04 Sep 1997 15:30:51 GMT." <340ED42B.41C67EA6@est.is> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 14:05:39 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Can any of you help me with writing device driver for two cards i have > here on my desk. > I have all documents and API information for the cards. > > One is AD converter 8input 12bit + 1 DA 12bit > > and the other is digital IO card with 6 8bit ports and timer IO based > on two 8255 and one 8253 > > I heard of something like /dev/IO but I did not find any information > about writing interface to it. You don't have to do much for this; just open /dev/io and use the macros in , specifically the in* and out* family. The first question you should ask is : do you need a device driver? If you don't need to handle DMA or interrupts or have strict timing requirements, user-mode I/O using the /dev/io technique can be very effective. We have a data interface capable of >1MB/sec that we talk to exclusively with this method. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 22:15:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA06779 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:15:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA06761 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:15:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (lot.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [203.20.121.21]) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA24180 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:45:15 +0930 (CST) Received: from word.smith.net.au ([127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA00840; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:41:23 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709080141.LAA00840@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" cc: Joerg Wunsch , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jamil@acromail.ml.org Subject: Re: Speaking of device drivers. In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 07 Sep 1997 16:30:19 MST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 11:41:12 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk (Please, for your sake, try to learn something about the concept of the "paragraph" and the "sentence".) > I am currently working on a piece of software (actually an expansion of an > earlier product), in house as a consultant for a small company. It > involves the coordination of a horrendous number of sensors/actuators > attached to a number of networked freebsd machines. Can you qualify "horrendous"? Unless there's something *really* horrendous about it, I think you're already off on the wrong foot. > Like I've said this is a > work in progress but I think that the concept could be generalized a bit > more to include the equivalent of nfs for character devices -- my > authentication right now is by serial keys and device description shared > by client and server. Sounds like a lot of overkill, IMHO. This isn't the sort of thing you want in an industrial environment. >From my POV I would be using one or more RS-485 links and either custom slaves at suitable points or off-the-shelf 485 slaves like the Advantech ADAM modules. The only time this breaks down is when you have precise timing requirements between multiple slaves, and often the easiest way to go then is to have a separate transmit-only time-sync bus. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 22:24:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA07312 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:24:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA07304 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:24:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (lot.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [203.20.121.21]) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA24290 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:54:01 +0930 (CST) Received: from word.smith.net.au ([127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA00615; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:45:29 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709080045.KAA00615@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: doconnor@Ist.flinders.edu.au cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 07 Sep 1997 18:23:32 +0930." <199709070853.SAA03149@holly.rd.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 10:45:18 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I was wondering if its possible to write a program which would do > 'dial on demand', by grabbing packets, and seeing if they are destined > to go out of the system, and if so, run a script(which would cause a > dialup). You could hang something off a divert socket to do this. > I know ijppp can do this, but I have problems with ijppp =) Fix your problems. 8) > The only problem I can see is that since a default route wouldn't be > established yet(since you aren't dialed up), the packets would be > killed off before they pass through a divert socket.(I don't know much > about how that stuff works :) Bingo. You would have to configure an interface before any packets would be submitted to it. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 22:50:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA09027 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:50:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA09022 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:50:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id HAA00419; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 07:50:45 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id HAA15962; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 07:25:30 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970908072530.ZD14625@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 07:25:30 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org (Jamil J. Weatherbee) Subject: Re: i refuse to spend the $$$ References: X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from Jamil J. Weatherbee on Sep 7, 1997 15:28:14 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > There is no good reason in the world I should have to go out and spend > $400+ dollars on a 2940 and scsi cdrom just so I can digitally pull a > couple tracks off of a cdrom, There is no good reason why you need to spend that much. Nobody told you that it *must* be a 2940. Pick a < USD 100 NCR SymBios controller. Ask Amancio about the quality of CD-ROM drives, and you'll be surprised to learn that even in the SCSI world, only the best of them are really high-quality enough for digital audio reading. Forget about the low-end drives at all, if CD-DA is your desire. > therefore I am requesting that someone point > me towards info (i guess ioctls) i need to get tracks off an atapi cdrom > --- I sure hope the atapi drivers support this? I sure know it does not. I sure know that CD-DA is not even standardized yet on SCSI, let alone ATA. Go and read the ATA specs. Then return to this list. I'm afraid you won't return, at least not if you've got the slightest understanding of standards documents... You'll be ROTFL after reading them. The ATA specs are the best joke of the computer world i've read lately. After this reading, you're really starting to wondering why some of these IDE drives actually do work at all. (No joking.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 22:51:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA09144 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:51:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA09138 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:51:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id HAA00426 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 07:51:50 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id HAA15998; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 07:37:10 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970908073710.TX24990@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 07:37:10 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Tape question References: <19970908001216.PA02497@uriah.heep.sax.de> <199709072300.QAA23747@usr04.primenet.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709072300.QAA23747@usr04.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Sep 7, 1997 23:00:03 +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Terry Lambert wrote: > Sorry; I was unclear. I should have said "a raw device *driver*". No, you were not unclear. You were wrong. We aren't talking about `partial blocks' or such. We are talking about variable-length recording tape drives, such as DAT, EXB-8mm, or QIC >= 525. In this case, there's nothing like a `partial block', or a read or write attempt crossing a `block boundary'. Any write(2) causes a media block being written of the exact length that has been passed down to this syscall. (Within limits, of course, for FreeBSD <= 64 KB.) Any read(2) syscall is expected to specify a length that is at least the size of the next tape block (otherwise an error will be signalled), and will return the exact amount of bytes in the tape block. The person who's originally got the problem said the above expected behaviour would work on a Sun but not on FreeBSD. My test case was to prove it works on FreeBSD for me (that is, with a SymBios 83c810, and a Tandberg TDC 4222 using QIC-525 cartridges). I can test it again with an AHA-2940 and a DAT drive once i'm at work today. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 22:55:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA09465 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:55:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA09458 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:55:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA01420; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:54:37 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:54:37 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Joerg Wunsch cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: i refuse to spend the $$$ In-Reply-To: <19970908072530.ZD14625@uriah.heep.sax.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Can someone explain the real difference between an audio CD and a data CD? I seen mentions of things like "jitter correction" etc. that I don't really understand, I have a somewhat decent grip on data cd's but as for audio --- are these made differently or what? > Ask Amancio about the quality of CD-ROM drives, and you'll be > surprised to learn that even in the SCSI world, only the best of them > are really high-quality enough for digital audio reading. Forget > about the low-end drives at all, if CD-DA is your desire. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 22:58:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA09663 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:58:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nico.telstra.net (nico.telstra.net [139.130.204.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA09657 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:58:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by nico.telstra.net (8.6.10/8.6.10) with ESMTP id PAA28751; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:56:11 +1000 Received: (grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.6.12) id PAA26636; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:26:10 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970908152609.46212@lemis.com> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:26:09 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Mike Smith Cc: doconnor@Ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. References: <199709070853.SAA03149@holly.rd.net> <199709080045.KAA00615@word.smith.net.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709080045.KAA00615@word.smith.net.au>; from Mike Smith on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 10:45:18AM +1000 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 10:45:18AM +1000, Mike Smith wrote: >> I was wondering if its possible to write a program which would do >> 'dial on demand', by grabbing packets, and seeing if they are destined >> to go out of the system, and if so, run a script(which would cause a >> dialup). > > You could hang something off a divert socket to do this. > >> I know ijppp can do this, but I have problems with ijppp =) > > Fix your problems. 8) He did. Did you notice the Mail ID? A whole lot of people in Adelaide have been popping up lately. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 22:59:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA09785 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:59:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA09778 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:59:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id XAA18297; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:59:44 -0600 (MDT) Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:59:44 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709080559.XAA18297@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Terry Lambert Cc: brian@awfulhak.org (Brian Somers), freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: un-neccessary DNS lookups (was Re: Divert sockets..) In-Reply-To: <199709071950.MAA24121@usr07.primenet.com> References: <199709071500.QAA23059@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> <199709071950.MAA24121@usr07.primenet.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > And there's the annoying localhost DNS lookup, even though host.conf > has "hosts" first, and the name of the machine I'm rlogin'ing into > is in /etc/hosts (it's myself). It triggers the PPP dial anyway, > and I think that should only happen for non-local hosts. Sounds like something's misconfigured, since as we all say, "it works for me, and the 5 other co-workers whose boxes I've setup". Do you have localhost, localhost.domain, host, and host.domain all in /etc/hosts? What does /etc/resolv.conf look like? Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 23:10:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA10415 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:10:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nico.telstra.net (nico.telstra.net [139.130.204.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA10409; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:10:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by nico.telstra.net (8.6.10/8.6.10) with ESMTP id QAA29753; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:08:33 +1000 Received: (grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.6.12) id PAA26679; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:38:23 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970908153822.27586@lemis.com> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:38:22 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: FreeBSD Questions , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Do you have some neat configuration files? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jordan and I have just been discussing adding some contributed configuration files to the distribution CD-ROMs. I'm primarily thinking of .rc scripts for editors, mail readers, window managers and such. The background is the second edition of "The Complete FreeBSD", in which I'm trying to improve the introduction to FreeBSD for people who've never used UNIX before (or even for those who've used a different version). In the course of doing this, I'm describing a usable setup, which uses various configuration files which are, of course, derived from what I run on my own system. In order to make things easier for the user, I'm putting them on the CD-ROM, so anybody who wants to use this version can just load the stuff from CD-ROM and have a relatively functional system. One size doesn't fit all, of course, and there's a good chance that there are other versions out there which many (even most) people will prefer. So why not supply them too? If you have anything that you feel is worth sharing, please let me know. About the only thing I ask is that the files don't contain too much dead wood (I know mine do :-) I haven't decided on a structure for storing these files yet, though Jordan has suggested a top-level directory /usr/share/skel/extras. I'd suggest one subdirectory for each unrelated set of config files. Any other suggestions? Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 23:14:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA10661 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:14:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA10655 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:14:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA01481; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:13:24 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:13:24 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Mike Smith cc: Joerg Wunsch , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jamil@acromail.ml.org Subject: Re: Speaking of device drivers. In-Reply-To: <199709080141.LAA00840@word.smith.net.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Mike Smith wrote: > > (Please, for your sake, try to learn something about the concept of the > "paragraph" and the "sentence".) > > > I am currently working on a piece of software (actually an expansion of an > > earlier product), in house as a consultant for a small company. It > > involves the coordination of a horrendous number of sensors/actuators > > attached to a number of networked freebsd machines. > > Can you qualify "horrendous"? Unless there's something *really* > horrendous about it, I think you're already off on the wrong foot. > > > Like I've said this is a > > work in progress but I think that the concept could be generalized a bit > > more to include the equivalent of nfs for character devices -- my > > authentication right now is by serial keys and device description shared > > by client and server. > > Sounds like a lot of overkill, IMHO. This isn't the sort of thing you > want in an industrial environment. I didn't really have a word in this respect, I am just supposed to deliver a working software--- people put hardware together demonstrate that it functions correctly and then expect it all linked. > > >From my POV I would be using one or more RS-485 links and either custom > slaves at suitable points or off-the-shelf 485 slaves like the > Advantech ADAM modules. The only time this breaks down is when you > have precise timing requirements between multiple slaves, and often the > easiest way to go then is to have a separate transmit-only time-sync > bus. I actually have looked into this I've done some significant programming on a 68hc11 board with RS485 ports, also I am working on an unrelated solutions to another problem on the 68hc11KA4 a truly versatile processor (unfortunately Motorola has a little manufacturing problem and they are very hard to get for your run of the mill embedded solutions), in fact if it was up to me I would of found a multiport rs485 board (i think Industrial computer source sells some of these) and done the whole thing with a network of 68hc11's (actually you can implement rs485 stuff on a bus which is really neat -- and next time I design this kind of stuff I'll keep that In mind). One of the major problems with the networked embedded design was analog ports, I have 48 12 bit analog ports and I could not find any embedded hardware capable of sampling 256 ports at that resolution (also 10,000 samples/second) , so I am using a analog io card in a remotely connected machine, plus the processing overhead for the kind of operations being done are somewhat significant. But a remotely connected freebsd machine on ethernet can easily get that stuff apart and I am using xntpd to sync all the machines and put timestamps on the stuff --- sorry about the run on sentences I have written that way since I was 8 years old in really long sentences without periods or punctuation I guess just wanted to be rebellious because all of that private catholic schooling my mother put me through where they taught you every little detail of the english language complete with sentence structure diagrams in 6th grade which I don't think a lot of people in this sorry country don't learn until college (did you ever do sentence structure diagrams) when I was a little kid I knew all the names of word types and what they meant --- now I can only remember their names and write proper sentences (which none of this is) because I have seen it so many times before not because I understand what the hell I am doing at all, isn't it terrible when you don't think about what you do but rather just do it like a little robot, eh? In other words I needed a little more power than I could of gotten out of some embedded hc11 system for what I am doing > > mike > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 23:19:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA10910 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:19:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from news1.gtn.com (news1.gtn.com [192.109.159.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA10905 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:19:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by news1.gtn.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with UUCP id IAA20880; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:15:06 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from andreas@localhost) by klemm.gtn.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA01414; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:09:18 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19970908080917.09111@klemm.gtn.com> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:09:17 +0200 From: Andreas Klemm To: Greg Lehey Cc: Evan Champion , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? References: <19970907160423.39071@klemm.gtn.com> <3412C092.57D67DA9@synapse.net> <19970908093740.17864@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79 In-Reply-To: <19970908093740.17864@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 09:37:40AM +0930 X-Disclaimer: A free society is one where it is safe to be unpopular X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT SMP Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 09:37:40AM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: > /usr/local or its replacement should possibly be a separate file > system. I find the idea of mounting file systems on non-root file > systems aesthetically displeasing. Can't understand this. You only have to deal with a suitable order in /etc/fstab ... But whats the problem ... > How about (shudder) following the > System V example and mounting them on /opt? The pure System V R4 example follows the idea: /opt//{bin,lib,man,...} not /opt/{bin,lib,man} This was discussed already one year ago and nobody wanted /opt//bin /lib /include /info /man /man/man1 ... figure out ... 1048 or so entries in the root of /opt. Even /opt///bin /lib /include /info /man /man/man1 ... Would have the disadvantage to have many many bin subdirs and youd have to symlink everything into a global /opt/bin /opt/include /opt/lib /opt/man /opt/info I'd dislike to simply renaming /usr/local to /opt, since this wouldn't be that /opt as we know it. And we would look different to SYSV _and_ to the other BSD variants. Then better keep /usr/local in the /usr filesystem. -- Andreas Klemm | klemm.gtn.com - powered by Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/SMP.html http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/benches.html From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 23:28:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA11484 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:28:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA11479 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:28:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (lot.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [203.20.121.21]) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA24587 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:58:24 +0930 (CST) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA01633; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:54:57 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709080554.PAA01633@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Speaking of device drivers. In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 07 Sep 1997 23:13:24 MST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 15:54:56 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > Sounds like a lot of overkill, IMHO. This isn't the sort of thing you > > want in an industrial environment. > > I didn't really have a word in this respect, I am just supposed to deliver > a working software--- people put hardware together demonstrate that it > functions correctly and then expect it all linked. Yuck. I hope you are billing the crap out of these people. Unless there's something really compelling about having multiple machines, it's basically a losing architecture. > > >From my POV I would be using one or more RS-485 links and either custom > > slaves at suitable points or off-the-shelf 485 slaves like the > > Advantech ADAM modules. The only time this breaks down is when you > > have precise timing requirements between multiple slaves, and often the > > easiest way to go then is to have a separate transmit-only time-sync > > bus. > > I actually have looked into this I've done some significant programming > on a 68hc11 board with RS485 ports We use these a *lot*. > also I am working on an unrelated > solutions to another problem on the 68hc11KA4 a truly versatile processor We mostly use the HC811E2/711E9/711E12; the '2 is an all-EEPROM part and thus great for field upgrades, the E9 is easy to get, and the E12 has loads of ROM space. > very hard to get for your run of the mill embedded solutions), in fact if > it was up to me I would of found a multiport rs485 board (i think > Industrial computer source sells some of these) and done the whole thing > with a network of 68hc11's (actually you can implement rs485 stuff on a > bus which is really neat -- and next time I design this kind of stuff I'll > keep that In mind). Heh. I have a driver for stock '485 boards (we use the Advantech PCL-740) which does the 9-bit address-prefix mode, which I keep meaning to commit. As you might guess from this, we use '485 pretty heavily. > One of the major problems with the networked embedded > design was analog ports, I have 48 12 bit analog ports and I could not > find any embedded hardware capable of sampling 256 ports at that > resolution (also 10,000 samples/second) , so I am using a analog io card > in a remotely connected > machine, plus the processing overhead for the kind of operations being > done are somewhat significant. Is that 10Ksamples total, or 10K per channel? For that sort of situation, I'd go ahead with the card-in-PC approach, but that's still just one PC. > sorry about the run on > sentences I have written that way since I was 8 years old in really long > sentences without periods or punctuation I guess just wanted to be Cognitive dissonance is all well and good, but remember that your goal here is to communicate, not to piss other people off. > In other words I needed a little more power than I could of gotten out of > some embedded hc11 system for what I am doing Not just one embedded system, but lots of them. Parallel processing 8) Speaking of which, does anyone remember the old Byte daisy-chain Mandelbrot processor? mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 23:33:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA11774 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:33:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA11769 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:33:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA00721; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:33:01 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id IAA16081; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:10:10 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970908081010.DS04250@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:10:10 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: ywliu1@tao.sinanet.com.tw (Hoffmann Yen-Wei Liu) Subject: Re: Kernel clock runs inaccurately References: <199709080124.JAA14004@tao.sinanet.com.tw> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709080124.JAA14004@tao.sinanet.com.tw>; from Hoffmann Yen-Wei Liu on Sep 8, 1997 09:24:11 +0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Hoffmann Yen-Wei Liu wrote: > I just got myself a new AMD k6-200, and I found out a major problem : > it runs about 30 seconds faster per day. So two days later, it runs > 2 minutes faster. However, the CMOS clock runs around 2 seconds slower > per day. This is acceptable to me. The master clock on my machine at work is much worse. I was contemplating to hack xntpd so it could use the RTC (CMOS) clock as a refclock, but unfortunately, didn't get very far. Mainly, i don't grok the xnptd refclock implementations, and how to add a new one. An alternative solution would be to hack a small userland daemon that wakes up every hour, reads the RTC, and calls adjtime(2) to compensate for the drift. I didn't want to do it this way because it's more of a hack than the xntpd solution would be, but i might go this route. All the people i've been asking for help with xntpd haven't been any help for me, they only attempted to explain me that i don't wanna do what i do want. (They are probably living in somewhat of an ivory tower with good NTP refclocks readily available on a cheap Internet, something that is not my situation, sitting behind dialup lines everywhere.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 23:49:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA13052 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:49:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA13047 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:49:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA00871; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:49:50 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id IAA16182; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:40:37 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970908084037.MZ56268@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:40:37 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org (Jamil J. Weatherbee) Subject: Re: i refuse to spend the $$$ References: <19970908072530.ZD14625@uriah.heep.sax.de> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from Jamil J. Weatherbee on Sep 7, 1997 22:54:37 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > Can someone explain the real difference between an audio CD and a data CD? > I seen mentions of things like "jitter correction" etc. that I don't > really understand, I have a somewhat decent grip on data cd's but as for > audio --- are these made differently or what? Sorry to beat on you: but if you don't even know details, why are you starting to whine then that FreeBSD doesn't do this and FreeBSD doesn't do that? The difference is that lousy drives tend to lose track every now and then. For CD-ROM data, this can be compensated, since part of the redundant data (only 2048 bytes of data have to be obtained out of 2352 bytes per CD block) is a block sequence number, so once you've lost track, you simply wait until the desired block passes the laser again. For CD-DA, all 2352 bytes are user data, so once the drive lost track, it has to guess where to start again. Also, as you can see above, the redundancy in CD-ROM data allows for a fair amount of ECC error correction (298 ECC bytes per block), so even larger damages can be compensated completely. With CD-DA, only the lower-level error correction is available (Reed-Solomon, IIRC), potentially returning you slightly erroneous data. Yet another reason for why you need a high-quality drive if you're going into digitally processed CD-DA. Perhaps you know understand why those few people who have been working on CD-DA by now (Charles Henrich, Amancio Hasty etc.) did concentrate on SCSI first. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Sep 7 23:55:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA13363 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:55:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wakky.dyn.ml.org (lee@1Cust72.tnt1.manassas.va.da.uu.net [153.37.113.72]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA13355 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:55:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from lee@localhost) by wakky.dyn.ml.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) id CAA06125; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 02:55:29 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19970908025529.27382@wakky.dyn.ml.org> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 02:55:29 -0400 From: Lee Cremeans To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: i refuse to spend the $$$ Reply-To: hcremean@vt.edu References: <19970908072530.ZD14625@uriah.heep.sax.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79e In-Reply-To: ; from Jamil J. Weatherbee on Sun, Sep 07, 1997 at 10:54:37PM -0700 X-OS: FreeBSD 2.2-RELEASE X-Evil: microsoft.com Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, Sep 07, 1997 at 10:54:37PM -0700, Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > > Can someone explain the real difference between an audio CD and a data CD? > I seen mentions of things like "jitter correction" etc. that I don't > really understand, I have a somewhat decent grip on data cd's but as for > audio --- are these made differently or what? An audio CD has tracks and stuff just like a data CD, but the format's a little different; it follows what's called the "Red Book" standard put forth by Sony and Philips. The TOC is the same as on a data CD, but the sector size is 2352 bytes, and there's no checksumming or ECC of any kind--that's why audio CDs can skip. That's also what prompted the comment about CD-DA download quality--since there's no ECC, there's no way to tell if the data was corrupted during read or not; you only know when you hit a hard error, and that's usually too late. BTW, I'm not quite an expert on Red Book, so I'm gonna cross-post this to -hackers in hopes that someone will correct this where its needed :) -- Lee C. -- Manassas, VA, USA (WakkyMouse on DALnet #watertower) A! JW223 YWD++^i WK+++r P&B++ SL++^i GDF B&M KK--i MD+++i P++ I++++ Did $++ E5/10/70/3c/73ac Ee34/1/36 H2 PonPippi Ay77 M | hcremean (at) vt.edu FreeBSD/Linux/Unix hacker...Win95 and M$ evil! (go see www.freebsd.org) My home page: http://wakky.dyn.ml.org/~lee | finger me for geek code From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 00:04:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA13859 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:04:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from florence.pavilion.net (florence.pavilion.net [194.242.128.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA13851; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:04:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from joe@localhost) by florence.pavilion.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA10643; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:03:05 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <19970908080305.40264@pavilion.net> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:03:05 +0100 From: Josef Karthauser To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" , Drew Derbyshire , "Jonathan M. Bresler" , hackers@hub.freebsd.org, support@kew.com Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists References: <21245.873677574@time.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81 In-Reply-To: <21245.873677574@time.cdrom.com>; from Jordan K. Hubbard on Sun, Sep 07, 1997 at 05:12:54PM -0700 X-NCC-RegID: uk.pavilion Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, Sep 07, 1997 at 05:12:54PM -0700, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: Don't tell me you don't trust your government ;0) :b Joe > Good reason not to talk to them then. > > > > Actually I was told that numerous government agencies have networks of > > machines that don't reverse out. -- Josef Karthauser Technical Manager Email: joe@pavilion.net Pavilion Internet plc. [Tel: +44 1273 607072 Fax: +44 1273 607073] From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 00:14:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA14251 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:14:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA14246 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:14:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA01601; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:13:21 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:13:21 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: hcremean@vt.edu cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: i refuse to spend the $$$ In-Reply-To: <19970908025529.27382@wakky.dyn.ml.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > why audio CDs can skip. That's also what prompted the comment about CD-DA > download quality--since there's no ECC, there's no way to tell if the data > was corrupted during read or not; you only know when you hit a hard error, > and that's usually too late. So what you are saying is that if you bump an audio cd player you should expect it to skip -- where does it go? From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 00:16:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA14383 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:16:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from florence.pavilion.net (florence.pavilion.net [194.242.128.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA14378 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:16:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from joe@localhost) by florence.pavilion.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA10903; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:15:01 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <19970908081500.32320@pavilion.net> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:15:00 +0100 From: Josef Karthauser To: Greg Lehey Cc: Terry Lambert , Brian Somers , doconnor@Ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. References: <199709071500.QAA23059@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> <199709071950.MAA24121@usr07.primenet.com> <19970908091046.29405@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81 In-Reply-To: <19970908091046.29405@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 09:10:46AM +0930 X-NCC-RegID: uk.pavilion Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 09:10:46AM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: > > > And there's the annoying localhost DNS lookup, even though host.conf > > has "hosts" first, and the name of the machine I'm rlogin'ing into > > is in /etc/hosts (it's myself). It triggers the PPP dial anyway, > > and I think that should only happen for non-local hosts. > > Well, why aren't you running named? It's faster than looking up > /etc/hosts. And if you don't tell the world it's there, it's not > going to get any external traffic. > :( Running named on the end of a dial-up-demand line is bad! :( 'Tis fine until you start using the named for lookups and then it starts opening the line itself at random moments, i.e. when it's checking the validity of things still in its cache, etc. That's why I use /etc/hosts on my home machine, and resolve using an external name server on my work network. Joe -- Josef Karthauser Technical Manager Email: joe@pavilion.net Pavilion Internet plc. [Tel: +44 1273 607072 Fax: +44 1273 607073] From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 00:20:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA14660 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:20:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from florence.pavilion.net (florence.pavilion.net [194.242.128.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA14652 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:20:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from joe@localhost) by florence.pavilion.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA11037; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:19:13 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <19970908081913.36000@pavilion.net> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:19:13 +0100 From: Josef Karthauser To: "Daniel J. O'Connor" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. References: <1.5.4.32.19970907223328.008be880@mail.mindspring.com> <199709080052.KAA00380@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81 In-Reply-To: <199709080052.KAA00380@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au>; from Daniel J. O'Connor on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 10:22:23AM +0930 X-NCC-RegID: uk.pavilion Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 10:22:23AM +0930, Daniel J. O'Connor wrote: > > to get messages to and from the kernel? > Yeah, the Amiga had the 'advantage' of having no memory protection(at > all), so you could just pass pointers around =) That's not entirely true. Is it? The 4000 had memory protection and the same O/S. (a500 ran 68000, a4000 ran 68030/40). > > I love my Amiga, still use it. In fact, I just got NetBSD up and running on i > > day before yesterday. Bonus. > Wohoo! Another amiga freak ;) I miss mine. :( FreeBSD port to 680x0 anyone? *chuckle* Joe -- Josef Karthauser Technical Manager Email: joe@pavilion.net Pavilion Internet plc. [Tel: +44 1273 607072 Fax: +44 1273 607073] From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 00:37:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA15614 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:37:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA15609 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:37:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA23975; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:37:27 -0700 (PDT) To: Greg Lehey cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Do you have some neat configuration files? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 15:38:22 +0930." <19970908153822.27586@lemis.com> Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 00:37:27 -0700 Message-ID: <23971.873704247@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > course, derived from what I run on my own system. In order to make > things easier for the user, I'm putting them on the CD-ROM, so anybody > who wants to use this version can just load the stuff from CD-ROM and > have a relatively functional system. > ... > I haven't decided on a structure for storing these files yet, though > Jordan has suggested a top-level directory /usr/share/skel/extras. > I'd suggest one subdirectory for each unrelated set of config files. Some folks will probably read the above and go "Squaaawk! Those are entirely unrelated items!" so let me just note that Greg's second paragraph there actually pertains to another aspect of this topic entirely which, while entertwined in a common subject thread, is nonetheless distinct from the CD issues. Greg has really placed two separate proposals here before you, the first being the collection of some nifty startup file bits and "canned user profiles" which Joe User might crib from, just as hackers on true timesharing UNIX systems used to crib useful tidbits from various admin personnel's startup files when left readable, and the second being the actual incorporation of this data into the CVS repository for more ongoing "skeleton file" work. His book could certainly reference these files under xperimnt/ on the CD just as easily and avoid the whole question of how to organize the contents more generally, but I also think that putting this stuff into /usr/share/skel/extras might very well lead to something far nicer in the long run due to the extra exposure and collaborative opportunities bestowed by the CVS repository. It's a tough call. In any case, I think we should be careful to keep the issues separate so that if one battle is lost the whole "war" doesn't go with it. An attempt to gather this information was made once before and it failed. I'd hate to see that happen twice. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 00:56:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA16356 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:56:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wakky.dyn.ml.org (lee@1Cust72.tnt1.manassas.va.da.uu.net [153.37.113.72]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA16348; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 00:56:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from lee@localhost) by wakky.dyn.ml.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) id DAA06361; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 03:56:12 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19970908035612.36939@wakky.dyn.ml.org> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 03:56:12 -0400 From: Lee Cremeans To: Josef Karthauser Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. Reply-To: hcremean@vt.edu References: <1.5.4.32.19970907223328.008be880@mail.mindspring.com> <199709080052.KAA00380@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au> <19970908081913.36000@pavilion.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79e In-Reply-To: <19970908081913.36000@pavilion.net>; from Josef Karthauser on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 08:19:13AM +0100 X-OS: FreeBSD 2.2-RELEASE X-Evil: microsoft.com Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [crossposted to -chat] On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 08:19:13AM +0100, Josef Karthauser wrote: > On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 10:22:23AM +0930, Daniel J. O'Connor wrote: > > > to get messages to and from the kernel? > > Yeah, the Amiga had the 'advantage' of having no memory protection(at > > all), so you could just pass pointers around =) > > That's not entirely true. Is it? The 4000 had memory protection and the > same O/S. (a500 ran 68000, a4000 ran 68030/40). Well, the 68000 had user and supervisor modes, but no page-level protection like the 030 and above (and the 68020 with the 68851 MMU)--and most other processors with demand paging--do. -- Lee C. -- Manassas, VA, USA (WakkyMouse on DALnet #watertower) A! JW223 YWD++^i WK+++r P&B++ SL++^i GDF B&M KK--i MD+++i P++ I++++ Did $++ E5/10/70/3c/73ac Ee34/1/36 H2 PonPippi Ay77 M | hcremean (at) vt.edu FreeBSD/Linux/Unix hacker...Win95 and M$ evil! (go see www.freebsd.org) My home page: http://wakky.dyn.ml.org/~lee | finger me for geek code From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 02:09:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA19672 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 02:09:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rvc1.informatik.ba-stuttgart.de (rvc1.informatik.ba-stuttgart.de [141.31.112.22]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA19666 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 02:09:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from helbig@localhost) by rvc1.informatik.ba-stuttgart.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id LAA05238; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:07:52 +0200 (MET DST) From: Wolfgang Helbig Message-Id: <199709080907.LAA05238@rvc1.informatik.ba-stuttgart.de> Subject: Re: 'warning: function declaration isn't a prototype' In-Reply-To: <19970908002641.TV55800@uriah.heep.sax.de> from J Wunsch at "Sep 8, 97 00:26:41 am" To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:07:52 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL30 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > As Jonathan Mini wrote: > > > ...and I was prototyping. Like this : > > > > static void msctimer(); > > > > I changed it to : > > > > static void msctimer(void); > > > > ... and the problem went away. Funny, I have never received that watning > > before, and I have been using C (with prototypes like that) for many years. > > That's not a `prototype' in the strict ANSI sense. Unless we were > talking about C++, where the omission of function parameters is > equivalent to declaring the list as just `void'. But then, C++ always > requires prototypes, unlike ANSI C. > > What you've been using is what K&R II calls ``old-style function > declarations''. Strange thing is, I cannot provoke this warning, i. e this source compiles with -ansi -pedantic -Wall option without any messages output by cc(1). What am I missing? Wolfgang The Source(tm): #include static void func(); /* This is not valid */ static void func2(void); void main (void) { printf("Hello, world\n"); func(); func2(); } static void func() { printf("Dies ist func()\n"); } static void func2() { printf("Dies ist func2()\n"); } From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 02:27:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA20250 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 02:27:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from athena.milk.it (ssigala@line13.globalnet.it [195.206.2.42]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA20244 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 02:27:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (ssigala@localhost) by athena.milk.it (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id LAA07463 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:27:27 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: athena.milk.it: ssigala owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:27:16 +0200 (MET DST) From: "S. Sigala" X-Sender: ssigala@athena.milk.it To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: My FreeBSD Wish List... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk ... obviously IMHO (I'm sure that this will start an interesting discussion, while i don't what to start a holy war): * Move the ports packages prefix directory from /usr/local to /usr/opt or something like. /usr/local should be reserved for user compiled packages, and should be created empty by default, as other operating systems already do. The X11 ports should not be installed in /usr/X11R6 but in the ports directory /usr/opt, the X Window directories tree should be never touched by the ports, i.e. should be like /usr/bin or /usr/lib ... the user is 100% sure that: * the packages code is only in /usr/opt; * the /usr/X11R6 don't contain anything but the XFree86 Inc. code. * he may create a separate partition for /usr/local and /usr/opt (and /usr/X11R6) This makes the OS updates easy and the OS clean. * Replace the current package format with the RedHat RPM one, while using the Makefile idea for porting. The current bsd.port.mk based Makefiles porting idea is excellent, but what i suggest is an hybrid union of the two methods. The ports deltas and Makefiles should remain the same, while only the package format may change. This is because: * The current tarred+gzipped format is slow, try to do a pkg_info on a XEmacs or on a TeTeX package (a solution may be the .zip format...) * The dependencies are not so useful as they would be. The dependencies should help the user doing upgrades, and is here that the RPM format comes. * The RPM code is good and free (while is GPLed, i know...). This makes, again, the OS updates easy. Note: i'm using BOTH the FreeBSD and the RedHat Linux operating systems. I'm not talking in theory, but from experience; I suggest this because i have tried BOTH the package systems and found some pros and cons. What do you think? Regards, -sandro From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 02:41:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA20721 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 02:41:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from colin.muc.de (root@colin.muc.de [193.174.4.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id CAA20716 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 02:41:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tavari.muc.de ([193.174.4.22]) by colin.muc.de with SMTP id <86083-1>; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:41:06 +0200 Received: from [192.168.42.51] (aleisha [192.168.42.51]) by tavari.muc.de (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA09648 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:56:36 +0200 (CEST) X-Sender: lutz@mail Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19970908080917.09111@klemm.gtn.com> Illegal-Object: Syntax error in References: value found on colin.muc.de: References: <19970908093740.17864@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 09: 37: 40AM +0930 < 19970907160423 . 39071 @ klemm . gtn . com > < 3412C092 . 57D67DA9 @ synapse . net > < 19970908093740 . 17864 @ lemis . com > ^ ^ ^ ^ ^-illegal reference separator | | | \-illegal reference separator | | \-illegal reference separator | \-illegal reference separator \-illegal reference separator Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:50:58 +0200 To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: Lutz Albers Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Andreas Klemm wrote on 08.09.1997 Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /u >> How about (shudder) following the >> System V example and mounting them on /opt? > >The pure System V R4 example follows the idea: > > /opt//{bin,lib,man,...} >not > /opt/{bin,lib,man} > ... >Would have the disadvantage to have many many bin subdirs and >youd have to symlink everything into a global > /opt/bin > /opt/include > /opt/lib > /opt/man > /opt/info Or use the modules system (see ). You would use the command module add to add it to PATH, and module delete to remove it. A much more cleaner method than the trash heap called /usr/local :-) ciao lutz -- Lutz Albers, lutz@muc.de, pgp key available from Do not take life too seriously, you will never get out of it alive. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 03:38:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA22867 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 03:38:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.firehouse.net (brian@shell.firehouse.net [209.42.203.45]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA22859 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 03:38:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (brian@localhost) by shell.firehouse.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id GAA24555; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 06:38:05 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 06:38:04 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Mitchell To: Lutz Albers cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Lutz Albers wrote: what about /usr/contrib like bsd/os? > Andreas Klemm wrote on 08.09.1997 > Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /u From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 04:22:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA24418 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 04:22:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ingenieria ([168.176.15.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id EAA24410; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 04:22:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: by ingenieria (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id HAA15780; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 07:09:02 -0400 Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 07:09:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Yonny Cardenas To: questions@freebsd.org cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Problem compiling the Kernel Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > On Wed, 3 Sep 1997, Yonny Cardenas wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > > I have the following problem with compiling my Kernel: > > > > # make depend > > > > ld:/usr/lib/libgcc.a: malformatted header of archive member: __.SYMDEF > > > > *** Error code 1 > > > > Stop. > > Looks like /usr/lib/libgcc.a is corrupted. > > Try grabbing it off the live filesystem 2 (#2). > OK, but now I have the following problem: cc: internal compiler error: proogram cpp got fatal signal 11 makdep: compile failed. I remplace /usr/libexec/cpp and /bin/cpp from disk #2, but I have other problem: make: don't know how to make ../s9s/signal.h Stop Thanks for your help. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- YONNY CARDENAS B. Systems Engineer || || ||| || Universidad Nacional de Colombia || || || | || Email : yonny@ingenieria.ingsala.unal.edu.co ||||||| || ||| From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 06:07:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA29367 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 06:07:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gatekeeper.itribe.net (gatekeeper.itribe.net [209.49.144.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id GAA29355 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 06:07:21 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709081303.JAA27167@gatekeeper.itribe.net> Received: forwarded by SMTP 1.5.2. Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:09:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Jamie Bowden To: Terry Lambert cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-Reply-To: <199709080020.RAA13169@usr08.primenet.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Terry Lambert wrote: > For SLIP, it depends. Some people actually still have NetBlazer's. > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org Have? Hell, some people still -BUY- Netblazers. Jamie Bowden System Administrator, iTRiBE.net Abusenet: The Misinformation Superhighway From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 06:24:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA00809 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 06:24:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tornado.cisco.com (tornado.cisco.com [171.69.104.22]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA00790 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 06:24:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (bmcgover-pc.cisco.com [171.69.104.147]) by tornado.cisco.com (8.8.5-Cisco.1/8.6.5) with ESMTP id JAA08045; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:24:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (localhost.cisco.com [127.0.0.1]) by bmcgover-pc.cisco.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA01794; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:23:18 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709081323.JAA01794@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org cc: greg@lomis.com Subject: Re: re: libXExExt Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 09:23:18 -0400 From: Brian McGovern Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >On Fri, Sep 05, 1997 at 01:18:19PM -0400, Brian McGovern wrote: >> Where can I find this library. >This looks like a typo to me, but I can't decide whether it's yours or >something that got included in your system. In any case, it's almost >certainly looking for libXext.. It should be in >/usr/X11R6/lib. It appears to be a brain seize in the ports, then. fvwm wants it, ddd wanted it... I've tried others, but don't remember what they were at the moment. I linked libXext. to libXExExt., and all is now working fine. The ports set I'm working with was last weeks (round about 9/4 or so) ports-current. Oh, just compiled xpostit. It has -lXExExt in it, as well. I strongly suspect its a good set of X applications. But, I'm willing to accept that my system is screwed up, except they were all custom installs w/X right from the 2.2.2 CD. -Brian From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 07:54:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA05319 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 07:54:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmb@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA05309; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 07:54:50 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Message-Id: <199709081454.HAA05309@hub.freebsd.org> Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists To: ahd@kew.com (Drew Derbyshire) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 07:54:49 -0700 (PDT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, hackers In-Reply-To: <34137978.288AD02@kew.com> from "Drew Derbyshire" at Sep 8, 97 00:05:12 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Drew Derbyshire wrote: > > Terry Lambert wrote: > > > > > > there is *not* reasone that i know of that a > > > > "mail from:" address must be resolvable. > > > > > > Yes, there is. The address in the SMTP "MAIL FROM" line is used for > > > bounce messages by sendmail. > > > > You are forgetting "MAIL FROM:<>", which is perfectly valid. > > I was, but it's a document special case, but ignorable for my comments > as it's a "valid" address, which is to say the bit bucket. for me, as a person running the mail lists, <> is a very important address. i need to know when mail bounces. <> is often used to prevent a bounce message from generating a another bounce message. i need to get those messages so that i can cull dead addresses from the mailing lists. jmb From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 08:08:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA05987 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:08:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from unix.tfs.net (root@unix.tfs.net [199.79.146.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA05976 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:08:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from argus.tfs.net (pm3-p45.tfs.net [206.154.183.237]) by unix.tfs.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA00742 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:06:55 -0500 Received: (from jbryant@localhost) by argus.tfs.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA00505 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:08:15 -0500 (CDT) From: Jim Bryant Message-Id: <199709081508.KAA00505@argus.tfs.net> Subject: testing my sendmail config... To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:08:14 -0500 (CDT) Reply-to: jbryant@tfs.net X-Windows: R00LZ!@# MS-Winbl0wz DR00LZ!@# X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.2-RELEASE #0: Wed Jul 9 01:01:24 CDT 1997 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk please ignore this, but none of my messages have been getting on the list... jim -- All opinions expressed are mine, if you | "I will not be pushed, stamped, think otherwise, then go jump into turbid | briefed, debriefed, indexed, or radioactive waters and yell WAHOO !!! | numbered!" - #1, "The Prisoner" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Inet: jbryant@tfs.net AX.25: kc5vdj@wv0t.#neks.ks.usa.noam grid: EM28PW voice: KC5VDJ - 6 & 2 Meters AM/FM/SSB, 70cm FM. http://www.tfs.net/~jbryant ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ HF/6M/2M: IC-706-MkII, 2M: HTX-212, 2M: HTX-202, 70cm: HTX-404, Packet: KPC-3+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 08:12:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA06243 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:12:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from adam.adonai.net (adam.adonai.net [207.8.83.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA06237 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:12:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (leec@localhost) by adam.adonai.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA12009; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:11:59 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:11:59 -0500 (CDT) From: "Lee Crites (AEI)" To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: A quick note to those without DNS resolvable mail hosts. In-Reply-To: <26041.873509860@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 5 Sep 1997, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: =>I know that some of you are also saying right now that this is bogus =>and that you've been sending mail from ``fred@not-really.a.domain'' =>for years now without trouble, why should it suddenly be an issue, why =>are we such Nazi scumbags, etc. and so forth. I can answer that =>question in one word: SPAM. Actually, I'm surprised this (the changes being proposed) isn't already the case... I have seen spam drive a list into extinction. The old pascal_l list was spammed by some c-sick types who couldn't 'convert' the masses to their way of thinking. That list is now gone, with little chance of it ever starting up again. Probably as few as two or three individuals, using their knowledge of spoof-ing addresses pumped as much as a gig of useless spam through the mail list. Do you think some peeved off l*n*x user(s) couldn't pull the same maneuver? So, you can put my vote into the yes-get-it-done-already column. Lee From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 09:05:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA08972 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:05:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmb@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA08961; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:05:22 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Message-Id: <199709081605.JAA08961@hub.freebsd.org> Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists To: gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:05:21 -0700 (PDT) Cc: hackers@hub.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <19970907192536.54931@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> from "John-Mark Gurney" at Sep 7, 97 07:25:36 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk John-Mark Gurney wrote: > > Jonathan M. Bresler scribbled this message on Sep 7: > > only the relay has to be contactable via TCP/IP. > > not the "mail from:" > > no... your not correct... read what the rfc821 has to say about it: > MAIL FROM: > > This command tells the SMTP-receiver that a new mail > transaction is starting and to reset all its state tables and > buffers, including any recipients or mail data. It gives the > reverse-path which can be used to report errors. If accepted, can != must > the receiver-SMTP returns a 250 OK reply. > > The can contain more than just a mailbox. The > is a reverse source routing list of hosts and > source mailbox. The first host in the should be should != must > the host sending this command. > > two key sentences... a) "It gives the reverse-path which can be used to > report errors." b) "The frist host in the should be the > host sending this command." basicly it states that the MAIL From must > be a perfectly representable mail address to YOU... if this forces the > person to add "@relay.host.name" at the end, then be it.. but it clearly > states that if the recieving end doesn't accept it, they don't have to... rfc1123 p 69 has a summary table of SMTP behavior for internet hosts which in part reads: | | | | |S| | | | | | |H| |F | | | | |O|M|o | | |S| |U|U|o | | |H| |L|S|t | |M|O| |D|T|n | |U|U|M| | |o | |S|L|A|N|N|t | |T|D|Y|O|O|t FEATURE |SECTION | | | |T|T|e -----------------------------------------------|----------|-|-|-|-|-|-- RECEIVER-SMTP: | | | | | | | Support empty reverse path |5.2.9 |x| | | | | Accept and recognize self domain literal(s) |5.2.17 |x| | | | | Send error notification msg after accept |5.3.3 |x| | | | | Send using null return path |5.3.3 |x| | | | | Send to envelope return path |5.3.3 | |x| | | | Send to null address |5.3.3 | | | | |x| the reverse path may be empty, else why must an empty one be supported. null return path must be used in error notification msgs which should be send to the envelope return path, but may be sent elsewhere, Return-Path, for instance admittedly, every SMTP sender must place "Canonicalized domain names in MAIL, RCPT", but at least one of the lists (questions) is for people that dont even know what an RFC is. so, i have chosen to be more liberal in accepting "mail from:" addresses especially in light of our policy to allow mail to flow into news servers but not the reverse. the idea is that a person reading news may send mail to the lists from a misconfigured host which does not create a valid "mail from" > > > two more bite the dust: > > > > Sep 7 18:18:31 hub sendmail[23726]: NOQUEUE: ruleset=check_relay, arg1=imsp015.netvigator.com, arg2=205.252.144.206, relay=root@localhost, reject=521 blocked.contact postmaster@FreeBSD.ORG > > Sep 7 18:32:45 hub sendmail[24585]: SAA24585: ruleset=check_mail, arg1=, relay=root@[205.164.68.2], reject=521 ... specially processed assorted meats? yuck! > > I like the last one.. :) ;) jmb From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 10:19:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA13133 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:19:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from roguetrader.com (brandon@cold.org [206.81.134.103]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA13127 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:19:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (brandon@localhost) by roguetrader.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA19860; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:19:42 -0600 (MDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:19:41 -0600 (MDT) From: Brandon Gillespie To: Brian Mitchell cc: Lutz Albers , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Brian Mitchell wrote: > On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Lutz Albers wrote: > > what about /usr/contrib like bsd/os? its no different than /usr/local, just a different name. I think the main issue here is that people feel /usr/local/ should be a different fs (I agree), but many feel its unclean to mount from anything other than root. Suggestion: mount it on /local, and symlink /usr/local to /local.. -Brandon From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 10:20:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA13303 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:20:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA13292 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:20:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id TAA07760 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:20:40 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id SAA17455; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:58:08 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970908185808.ZL10971@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:58:08 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 'warning: function declaration isn't a prototype' References: <19970908002641.TV55800@uriah.heep.sax.de> <199709080907.LAA05238@rvc1.informatik.ba-stuttgart.de> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709080907.LAA05238@rvc1.informatik.ba-stuttgart.de>; from Wolfgang Helbig on Sep 8, 1997 11:07:52 +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Wolfgang Helbig wrote: > > What you've been using is what K&R II calls ``old-style function > > declarations''. > > Strange thing is, I cannot provoke this warning, i. e this source > compiles with -ansi -pedantic -Wall option without any messages > output by cc(1). What am I missing? : # # Warning flags for compiling the kernel and components of the kernel. # CWARNFLAGS?= -Wreturn-type -Wcomment -Wredundant-decls -Wimplicit \ -Wnested-externs -Wstrict-prototypes -Wmissing-prototypes \ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ -Wpointer-arith # -W -Winline -Wunused -Wcast-qual -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 10:24:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA13656 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:24:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from roguetrader.com (brandon@cold.org [206.81.134.103]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA13649 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:24:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (brandon@localhost) by roguetrader.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA19895; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:25:34 -0600 (MDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:25:33 -0600 (MDT) From: Brandon Gillespie To: "S. Sigala" cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: My FreeBSD Wish List... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > * Move the ports packages prefix directory from /usr/local > to /usr/opt or something like. /usr/local should be reserved for > user compiled packages, and should be created empty by default, as other > operating systems already do. /usr/opt is not a likely 'good' candidate.. I dont see a problem with /usr/local, as for what it ''should'' be--that is likely a personal point of preference, but I look at /usr/local/ as anything _local_ to the system, outside of the standard OS install, thus packages/ports going there is perfectly viable.. > The X11 ports should not be installed in /usr/X11R6 but in the > ports directory /usr/opt, the X Window directories tree should be > never touched by the ports, i.e. should be like /usr/bin or /usr/lib ... I agree that X11 ports should not go into /usr/X11R6.. > * Replace the current package format with the RedHat RPM one, while Your arguments sound ok, but you need to give more details as to the problems and how RPM handles them better, I think you would be more likely to find improvements to the existing pkg system over simply jumping to another system entirely. I do have one direct question, what does RPM do if it doesn't tarball packages? -Brandon From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 10:31:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA14098 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:31:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brickbat9.mindspring.com (brickbat9.mindspring.com [207.69.200.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA14077; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:31:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bogus.mindspring.com (user-37kbojt.dialup.mindspring.com [207.69.226.125]) by brickbat9.mindspring.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA27305; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:31:33 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970908173037.00e11ea0@mail.mindspring.com> X-Sender: kpneal@mail.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 13:30:37 -0400 To: hcremean@vt.edu From: "Kevin P. Neal" Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, chat@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 03:56 AM 9/8/97 -0400, Lee Cremeans wrote: > >[crossposted to -chat] > >On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 08:19:13AM +0100, Josef Karthauser wrote: >> On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 10:22:23AM +0930, Daniel J. O'Connor wrote: >> > > to get messages to and from the kernel? >> > Yeah, the Amiga had the 'advantage' of having no memory protection(at >> > all), so you could just pass pointers around =) >> >> That's not entirely true. Is it? The 4000 had memory protection and the >> same O/S. (a500 ran 68000, a4000 ran 68030/40). > >Well, the 68000 had user and supervisor modes, but no page-level protection >like the 030 and above (and the 68020 with the 68851 MMU)--and most other >processors with demand paging--do. Exactly correct. The '020+MMU and up machines were able to do memory protection, but it was never built into the Amiga OS. -- XCOMM Kevin P. Neal, Junior, Comp. Sci. - House of Retrocomputing XCOMM mailto:kpneal@pobox.com - http://www.pobox.com/~kpn/ XCOMM kpneal@eos.ncsu.edu Spoken by Keir Finlow-Bates: XCOMM "Good grief, I've just noticed I've typed in a rant. Sorry chaps!" From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 11:15:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA20164 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:15:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA20140; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:15:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id TAA16715; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:05:01 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199709081705.TAA16715@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: snd970908.tgz available To: multimedia@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:05:00 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/snd970908.tgz contains the latest snap of my sound code (and the one which should go with high probability into the 3.0 snapshot). Remember you need the PnP code to compile it, whose latest version is at http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/pnp970907.tgz This snap fixes a number of bugs, and contains updated drivers for vat and other applications. Feedback from users has been quite useful for finding and fixing the bugs so I repeat my request for trying out this code and reporting success with hardware not listed below, or problems with any hardware. The driver is known to work on full duplex: CS4236, CS4237 CS4232 (probably) OPTI931 (modulo bugs in the chip, which i try to circumvent) half duplex: SB3.X SB16 (all models including PnP) and perhaps other cards which emulate SB or WSS. The following applications are known to work (some require special drivers included in this distribution): vat (tested only in full duplex with WSS cards); speak_freely nas timidity most other applications which work with OSS/Voxware in half duplex it _does not_ work with xquake. With all probabilities, the next snap will contain support for the SB16 in full duplex (e.g. for using vat). Cheers Luigi -----------------------------+-------------------------------------- Luigi Rizzo | Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it | Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 | via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 | http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ _____________________________|______________________________________ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 11:22:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA20760 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:22:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA20755 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:22:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by alpo.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA28163 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:10:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) via SMTP by alpo.whistle.com, id smtpd028157; Mon Sep 8 18:10:38 1997 Message-ID: <34143F83.64880EEB@whistle.com> Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 11:10:11 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: 11 year old needs FreeBSD mentor in Arizona. Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------6EEA48066F5992E1773C2448" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------6EEA48066F5992E1773C2448 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Anyone in or near Scottsdale AZ.? 11YO has got lost in the disk partitionning maze, and needs talking out.... respond to me (or at least CC me if you go direct..) julian --------------6EEA48066F5992E1773C2448 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: Received: (from daemon@localhost) by alpo.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA27554 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:51:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.whistle.com(207.76.205.131), claiming to be "whistle.com" via SMTP by alpo.whistle.com, id smtpd027547; Mon Sep 8 17:51:25 1997 Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id KAA13108 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:51:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gatekeeper.whistle.com(207.76.204.2) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma013101; Mon Sep 8 10:51:08 1997 Received: (from smap@localhost) by gatekeeper.whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id KAA09035 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:51:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ne.mediaone.net(24.128.1.82) by gatekeeper.whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma009025; Mon Sep 8 10:50:39 1997 Received: from [24.128.53.52] by chmls01.highway1.com (Netscape Mail Server v2.0) with SMTP id AAA26482 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:50:33 -0400 Message-ID: <34140448.619CFE5E@mediaone.net> Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 13:57:38 +0000 From: pbpkayak@mediaone.net (Pbpkayak) X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01C-MOENE (Macintosh; U; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Julian Elischer Subject: Re: 11 year old needs FreeBSD mentor..(was "HELP") X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <3413E105.8266D760@mediaone.net> <34142B6B.63DECDAD@whistle.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Julian: Thank you for responding to my query. My nephew lives in Scottsdale, Arizona. Would it be possible for him to give you a call? If so where and when. Please advise. Thank you. Regards, Carolyn --------------6EEA48066F5992E1773C2448-- From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 11:53:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA24024 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:53:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from unix.tfs.net (root@unix.tfs.net [199.79.146.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA24015 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:53:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from argus.tfs.net (pm3-p37.tfs.net [206.154.183.229]) by unix.tfs.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA32760; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 12:51:28 -0500 Received: (from jbryant@localhost) by argus.tfs.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA01461; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:52:48 -0500 (CDT) From: Jim Bryant Message-Id: <199709081852.NAA01461@argus.tfs.net> Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? In-Reply-To: from Brandon Gillespie at "Sep 8, 97 11:19:41 am" To: brandon@roguetrader.com (Brandon Gillespie) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:52:12 -0500 (CDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Reply-to: jbryant@tfs.net X-Windows: R00LZ!@# MS-Winbl0wz DR00LZ!@# X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.2-RELEASE #0: Wed Jul 9 01:01:24 CDT 1997 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In reply: > On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Brian Mitchell wrote: > > > On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Lutz Albers wrote: > > > > what about /usr/contrib like bsd/os? > > its no different than /usr/local, just a different name. > > I think the main issue here is that people feel /usr/local/ should be a > different fs (I agree), > but many feel its unclean to mount from anything other than root. > Suggestion: mount it on /local, and symlink /usr/local to /local.. ACK!@# E-V-I-L!!!!!!! E-V-I-L!!!!!!! E-V-I-L!!!!!!! E-V-I-L!!!!!!! This would require all that much more hacking to makefiles and include files, not to mention those lame few proggies that hardcode paths in the source code... Besides, assuming /usr don't come up, why bother having /local come up, as almost everything in /local will reference the symlink /usr/local... Due to the way FreeBSD changes a lot, it is not really practical to build a seperate filesystem here, not to mention /usr/src compiles... after compiling in /usr/src or /usr/ports, I [and you to I hope] tend to do a `make clean` to get back those MEGZ and MEGZ for other uses, inluding /usr/local stuff... /dev/sd0s1f 1397791 871359 414609 68% /usr and growing... jim -- All opinions expressed are mine, if you | "I will not be pushed, stamped, think otherwise, then go jump into turbid | briefed, debriefed, indexed, or radioactive waters and yell WAHOO !!! | numbered!" - #1, "The Prisoner" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Inet: jbryant@tfs.net AX.25: kc5vdj@wv0t.#neks.ks.usa.noam grid: EM28PW voice: KC5VDJ - 6 & 2 Meters AM/FM/SSB, 70cm FM. http://www.tfs.net/~jbryant ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ HF/6M/2M: IC-706-MkII, 2M: HTX-212, 2M: HTX-202, 70cm: HTX-404, Packet: KPC-3+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 11:56:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA24701 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:56:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from unix.tfs.net (root@unix.tfs.net [199.79.146.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA24682 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:56:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from argus.tfs.net (pm3-p37.tfs.net [206.154.183.229]) by unix.tfs.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA00534; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 12:55:04 -0500 Received: (from jbryant@localhost) by argus.tfs.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA01483; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:56:25 -0500 (CDT) From: Jim Bryant Message-Id: <199709081856.NAA01483@argus.tfs.net> Subject: Re: 11 year old needs FreeBSD mentor in Arizona. In-Reply-To: <34143F83.64880EEB@whistle.com> from Julian Elischer at "Sep 8, 97 11:10:11 am" To: julian@whistle.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:56:24 -0500 (CDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Reply-to: jbryant@tfs.net X-Windows: R00LZ!@# MS-Winbl0wz DR00LZ!@# X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.2-RELEASE #0: Wed Jul 9 01:01:24 CDT 1997 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In reply: > Anyone in or near Scottsdale AZ.? > 11YO has got lost in the disk partitionning maze, and needs > talking out.... > > respond to me (or at least CC me if you go direct..) > > julian kewl!@# Let's convert them young so they never know the EVIL of WinBl0Wz!@# jim -- All opinions expressed are mine, if you | "I will not be pushed, stamped, think otherwise, then go jump into turbid | briefed, debriefed, indexed, or radioactive waters and yell WAHOO !!! | numbered!" - #1, "The Prisoner" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Inet: jbryant@tfs.net AX.25: kc5vdj@wv0t.#neks.ks.usa.noam grid: EM28PW voice: KC5VDJ - 6 & 2 Meters AM/FM/SSB, 70cm FM. http://www.tfs.net/~jbryant ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ HF/6M/2M: IC-706-MkII, 2M: HTX-212, 2M: HTX-202, 70cm: HTX-404, Packet: KPC-3+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 12:41:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA28981 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 12:41:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from iafnl.es.iaf.nl (uucp@iafnl.es.iaf.nl [195.108.17.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA28965 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 12:41:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: by iafnl.es.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA08972 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org); Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:41:35 +0200 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.8.5/8.6.12) id VAA01241; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:27:17 +0200 (MET DST) From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199709081927.VAA01241@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: 2.2.2R lockup during boot in ahc driver?? To: khelbin@sea.ntplx.net (Khelbin Sunvold) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:27:16 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers list) In-Reply-To: from "Khelbin Sunvold" at Sep 7, 97 03:00:10 pm X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem, The Netherlands X-Pgp-Info: PGP public key at 'finger wilko@freefall.freebsd.org' X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Khelbin Sunvold wrote... > > > On Sun, 7 Sep 1997, Wilko Bulte wrote: > > > Machine is a 486/33DX2 with an Adaptec 2742A dual channel scsi controller. > > Bootflop recognises the available scsi devices OK, but then I get: > > > > apm0: disabled, not probed > > ahc0: brkadrint, Illegal Host Access at seqaddr = 0x0 > > Make sure you only have the drivers that you need enabled. I find it > convenient with 2.2.2 to just use the -c option at the boot: prompt and > then enter visual mode but whatever floats your boat. In the meantime I've played around a bit and thought of the same thing. And this indeed solves it. Strange... Wilko _ ____________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl http://www.tcja.nl/~wilko |/|/ / / /( (_) Arnhem, The Netherlands - Do, or do not. There is no 'try' ----------------------------------------------------------------------Yoda From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 12:41:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA29003 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 12:41:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from iafnl.es.iaf.nl (uucp@iafnl.es.iaf.nl [195.108.17.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA28980 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 12:41:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: by iafnl.es.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA08979 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for FreeBSD-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG); Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:41:48 +0200 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.8.5/8.6.12) id VAA01254; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:28:56 +0200 (MET DST) From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199709081928.VAA01254@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: 2.2.2R lockup during boot in ahc driver?? To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:28:56 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970907145308.QP30824@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Sep 7, 97 02:53:08 pm X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem, The Netherlands X-Pgp-Info: PGP public key at 'finger wilko@freefall.freebsd.org' X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As J Wunsch wrote... > As Wilko Bulte wrote: > > > Machine is a 486/33DX2 with an Adaptec 2742A dual channel scsi controller. > > Bootflop recognises the available scsi devices OK, but then I get: > > > > apm0: disabled, not probed > > ahc0: brkadrint, Illegal Host Access at seqaddr = 0x0 > > I've also seen this with an AHA2742. The problem vanishes if you take > the time to go through UserConfig, and disable all the drivers that > are not needed. Tried that, indeed solves it. > > I slightly remember Justin telling that this might be the `bt' driver > that kills the Adaptec. Maybe it would be sufficient to disable this > one. I'll try when I reinstall the box. _ ____________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl http://www.tcja.nl/~wilko |/|/ / / /( (_) Arnhem, The Netherlands - Do, or do not. There is no 'try' ----------------------------------------------------------------------Yoda From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 13:16:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA00929 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:16:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA00924 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:16:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA05350; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:16:08 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709082016.NAA05350@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists To: gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:16:07 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@hub.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <19970907192536.54931@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> from "John-Mark Gurney" at Sep 7, 97 07:25:36 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > no... your not correct... read what the rfc821 has to say about it: > MAIL FROM: > > This command tells the SMTP-receiver that a new mail > transaction is starting and to reset all its state tables and > buffers, including any recipients or mail data. It gives the > reverse-path which can be used to report errors. If accepted, > the receiver-SMTP returns a 250 OK reply. Heh. Tell me, does it reset the ESMTP state (EHLO/HELO), the RFC1893 "ENHANCED STATUS" extension, the RFC2034 "ENHANCEDSTATUSCODES" extension, which *requires* RFC1893, the supplied greeting domain name, the draft-standard key exchange client authentication, etc.? Nope... (that was a rhetorical question). 8-) 8-). > The can contain more than just a mailbox. The > is a reverse source routing list of hosts and > source mailbox. The first host in the should be > the host sending this command. > > two key sentences... a) "It gives the reverse-path which can be used to > report errors." b) "The frist host in the should be the > host sending this command." basicly it states that the MAIL From must > be a perfectly representable mail address to YOU... if this forces the > person to add "@relay.host.name" at the end, then be it.. but it clearly > states that if the recieving end doesn't accept it, they don't have to... I think you are confusing explicit relaying with target address parsing under gatewaying. Gatewaying uses characters which are not special characters (for example, "%" and "!"), embedded in a valid mailbox address, and given significance by the gateway machine when performin address encapsulation and deencapsulation. Relaying uses source routing using the special characters "@", ";", ",", and ":", for example "@one;@two:joe@three". Relaying uses syntactically valid constructs with special characters as gramatically defined token seperators. In effect, in a "MAIL FROM:<...>" for this, the first relay component must exist and be locally contactable by this machine, even if the subsequent component(s) are not (the difference between the "," and ";" are equivalence lists vs. route order lists). This is different than requiring the entire mail address to be locally presentable. Instead of reading section "3.1 MAIL", try reading sections "3.6 RELAYING". The act of transport encapsulation (required for gatewaying) is dicussed only briefly in 821. There is actually a seperate RFC for it, but I don't have any of my RFC's in front of me now, so I can't give you an exhaustive list; sorry. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 13:26:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA01551 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:26:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hwcn.org (main.hwcn.org [199.212.94.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA01537; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:25:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from james.freenet.hamilton.on.ca (ac199@james.hwcn.org [199.212.94.66]) by hwcn.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA05252; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:26:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (ac199@localhost) by james.freenet.hamilton.on.ca (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA25505; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:26:56 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: james.freenet.hamilton.on.ca: ac199 owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:26:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Tim Vanderhoek X-Sender: ac199@james.freenet.hamilton.on.ca To: Tom Samplonius cc: Tim Vanderhoek , Sean Eric Fagan , jmb@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 7 Sep 1997, Tom Samplonius wrote: > > > Uh, if we can't reply to them, what are we doing allowing them to ask > > > questions? > > > > Anticipating that they have set the reply-to field. > > Yes, but if the message should need to be returned by the MTA, it will > be returned to the envelope sender (SMTP mail from:) address. Perhaps their question was: "Why doesn't my system, connected via dial-up ppp only, use a correct envelope sender? I read the FAQ, but it still doesn't work." -- Outnumbered? Maybe. Outspoken? Never! tIM...HOEk From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 13:36:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA02209 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:36:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA02204 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:36:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailhost.sdsp.mc.xerox.com ([13.231.132.18]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <52187(3)>; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:35:52 PDT Received: from gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com (gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com [13.231.133.90]) by mailhost.sdsp.mc.xerox.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA03626; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:34:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: by gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com (4.1/client-1.3) id AA19993; Mon, 8 Sep 97 16:34:43 EDT Message-Id: <9709082034.AA19993@gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Kenny Hanson Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape Communicator 4.02b7 In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 02 Sep 1997 05:56:46 PDT." <91DD7FDA88E4D011BED00000C0DD87E70ACA5E@pds-gateway.pdspc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:34:38 PDT From: "Marty Leisner" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have 96 mbytes of ram with little swap space... I just almost ran out of ram...I was running two netscapes...one took up 30 Mbyte, the other 20 Mbyte... -- marty leisner@sdsp.mc.xerox.com The Feynman problem solving Algorithm 1) Write down the problem 2) Think real hard 3) Write down the answer Murray Gel-mann in the NY Times From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 13:55:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA03213 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:55:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA03203 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:55:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA07610; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:54:55 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709082054.NAA07610@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: spam and the FreeBSD mailing lists To: gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:54:54 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@hub.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <19970907200445.27869@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> from "John-Mark Gurney" at Sep 7, 97 08:04:45 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > This neglects the case of a machine acting as the domain for which it > > is a member in order to send mail. > > oh, your talking about if the machine is somehost.domain.com, and that > it users recieve their mail at username@domain.com?? Yes. > well. then it's > your job as an admin to fix those machines to properly identify itself... They do. They identify the reverse path to the user sending the mail, which is all that is required. You seem to be trying to place additional requirements on them, above that. This doesn't work for single user hosts. It also doesn't work for top level domains. Consider the following arrangement: 1) I have a DNS MX record for bob.com; it states that the mail exchanger is "mail.bob.com". 2) I have a host "mail.bob.com" that accepts mail for "bob.com" as if it were the local machine. 3) I have a machine called "pc35.bob.com". It is on an internal network, and is, in fact, running a Winsock proxy server (named "proxy.bob.com") to access the net. It is a POP3/SMTP client like Eudora, NetScape, Internet Explorer, Windows PINE, etc.. 4) The user on pc35 sends mail. The net effect will be: a) proxy connection from mail client to proxy server b) proxy server connects to destination mail server (not all PC clients allow designation of a "marter host") c) client injects mail claiming to be "pc35user@bob.com" (or whatever username the user has for his maildrop on the machine "bob.com"). His HELO/EHLO claimed him to be "bob.com" 5) The user on pc35 gets mail. The net effect will be: a) proxy connection from mail client to proxy server b) proxy server connects to mail.bob.com, the mail server configured in the mail program's setup c) POP3 authentication takes place d) user agent pulls down mail delivered to maildrop "pc35user@bob.com" via exchanger to "mail.bob.com" 6) Clearly, the user will not claim to be the machine named "proxy.bob.com", though that is the machine making the connection. THe actual machine name can not be reversed. You can build all sorts of scenarios like this one, even if you don't use PC's or proxy servers. I can have the same wituation with a UNIX network which must relay outbound mail through a firewall. > > It also neglects the point of browsers on PCs that you yourself raised > > earlier: Eudora, IEx.x, and NetScape all can send mail without a valid > > return address. As can "cyberbomber", etc.. Consider someone like > > that, who nevertheless subscribes to the list with a valid return address. > > umm... can you refer to me the message that I brought about about how > browsers can send fine? (mesg-id will do nicely, I archive all out > going mail)... Sorry; I don't archive inbound mail unless it tells me something I don't already know. That's mostly Bruce, John, jmb, et. el. talking about technical issues, various announcements, patches, and source code (they aren't the only ones, they're just example names). You said something like "Browsers should be configured correctly and all machines should have reverse information". Or that was the logical effect that would have depended from implementing what you had suggested. It's just not possible. You in effect said that browsers could *not* "send fine"; the effect of the ":" above is to provide counterexample to the issue you raised, not illustrate your side. > yes.. but that's because those programs do the masquerading for you.. > I believe they take your from address and just present it in the "mail > from:" part... nothing says that the return-path has to include the > local machine... by default sendmail doesn't masquerade or read your > mail to grab the reply-to to preset a valid mail from:... it just > assumes that the machine addressing the envelope knows what it's doing.. > and if you tell sendmail to rewrite addresses.. it will happily whiteout > your invalid info.. and replace it with valid info (that you tell it).. Here's the problem, then: I can lie about my machine name, and your DNS check in this case will still work. Typically, when one is talking about DNS checking, one wants to call getpeername() to get the IP addr of the machine which has connected to you. Then one calls gethostbyaddr() to get the host name, and then compares the zone data to see if they match. The zone data in this case is the TLD, and the domain name in the TLD, without the name of the host(s). So if I send mail from "pc35.bob.com" and the revers lookup for my IP addr is "proxy.bob.com", "bob.com" == "bob.com" and I allow the message. This fails to address DNS spoofing, however, where the spammer has a netblock, and had the reverse lookup return "FreeBSD.ORG" instead of "Cyberpromo.COM" (purely as an example), and you allow the mail because the reverse lookup "matches". DNS fails to provide for the determination of ownership, in a machine comparable way, of the netblock in which the client exists. This is why many SPAM countermeasures operate by netblock instead of by address. Really, I want to accept mailfrom a.b.c.d without a reverse record claiming to be "bob.com", IFF a.b.c.d is in a netblock owned by the entity that owns "bob.com". This doesn't solve the next set of issues; I hesistate to raise them on a public list: 1) What if someone legitimate allows a relay through them, such that I believe that it's a legitimate host, and they claim to be the legitimate host to the legitimate host? 2) What if the spammers break up their netblocks into tiny and non-contiguous segments? Cyberpromo and Hotmail are already known to do this. Personally, I believe it's going to get down to trusted, criteria-based key signing authorities. You send spam, and next week your key doesn't get signed by the it's-not-spam-authority, and no one ever accepts mail from you again. As soon as spammers start using the above techniques in earnest, you are going to see most spammers go international, in any case, since this type of claiming to be who you aren't already violates Federal wire fraud statutes; it just needs someone to prosecute. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 14:06:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA03927 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:06:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA03921 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:06:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA08434; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:06:23 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709082106.OAA08434@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Tape question To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:06:22 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970908073710.TX24990@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Sep 8, 97 07:37:10 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > No, you were not unclear. You were wrong. We aren't talking about > `partial blocks' or such. We are talking about variable-length > recording tape drives, such as DAT, EXB-8mm, or QIC >= 525. In this > case, there's nothing like a `partial block', or a read or write > attempt crossing a `block boundary'. Any write(2) causes a media > block being written of the exact length that has been passed down to > this syscall. *UNLESS* the driver chooses to write out a block on a boundry that was decided upon by the driver, and pads the block regardless of the users requested transfer size. The driver can do this without the user's permission. Similarly, you may *request* a 8192 byte read, and the driver may not accept a shorter block being returned by the device in response to the larger request. This is what I believe is happening. Because the blocks were not written to the physical media with the requested read size, the read is failing. > Any > read(2) syscall is expected to specify a length that is at least the > size of the next tape block (otherwise an error will be signalled), > and will return the exact amount of bytes in the tape block. > > The person who's originally got the problem said the above expected > behaviour would work on a Sun but not on FreeBSD. My test case was to > prove it works on FreeBSD for me (that is, with a SymBios 83c810, and > a Tandberg TDC 4222 using QIC-525 cartridges). I can test it again > with an AHA-2940 and a DAT drive once i'm at work today. In point of fact, he said that when he issued a read for a tape block that requested more data than was in the physical tape block that was to be read, FreeBSD failed to operate as he expected. Whether or not it was legitimate for him to expect results other than those he got is debatable, and is a driver issue. You should know that the SCSI tape driver is the same for any SCSI controller, so the results of your proposed test are largely irrelevent, unless you believe the problem to be controller specific (admittedly, it may be that tape read requests returning short blocks are incorrectly handled in the Adaptec driver -- though I believe that this is unlikely; I think it's the st driver itself that is in error). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 14:29:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA05451 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:29:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from athena.milk.it (ssigala@line08.globalnet.it [195.206.2.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA05425 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:28:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (ssigala@localhost) by athena.milk.it (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id XAA01310; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:27:44 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: athena.milk.it: ssigala owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:27:43 +0200 (MET DST) From: "S. Sigala" X-Sender: ssigala@athena.milk.it To: Brandon Gillespie cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: My FreeBSD Wish List... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Brandon Gillespie wrote: > > The X11 ports should not be installed in /usr/X11R6 but in the > > ports directory /usr/opt, the X Window directories tree should be > > never touched by the ports, i.e. should be like /usr/bin or /usr/lib ... > > Your arguments sound ok, but you need to give more details as to the > problems and how RPM handles them better, I think you would be more likely > to find improvements to the existing pkg system over simply jumping to > another system entirely. > I have thought a bit more about the RPM idea; you are right, the differences are not so much large... it is best to extend the existing code... i will post asap in the next days a table of differences between the two packaging system (pros and cons). > I do have one direct question, what does RPM do if it doesn't tarball > packages? > I'm not an expert but it is composed at least by [header] [data] [pkg data] where [header] contains the rpm magic, the cpu on which the package works, etc. [data] contains the compilation host, author informations, package informations, the source filename, an optional PGP key, a MD5 checksum or something like, the informations on dependencies, the install and deinstall scripts, and a representation of the expanded tree of the package, for faster access instead of decompressing the whole package. [pkg data] is simply a gzipped CPIO archive. -sandro From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 14:31:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA05669 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:31:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA05662 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:31:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA09781; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:31:38 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709082131.OAA09781@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: un-neccessary DNS lookups (was Re: Divert sockets..) To: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:31:36 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, brian@awfulhak.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199709080559.XAA18297@rocky.mt.sri.com> from "Nate Williams" at Sep 7, 97 11:59:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > And there's the annoying localhost DNS lookup, even though host.conf > > has "hosts" first, and the name of the machine I'm rlogin'ing into > > is in /etc/hosts (it's myself). It triggers the PPP dial anyway, > > and I think that should only happen for non-local hosts. > > Sounds like something's misconfigured, since as we all say, "it works > for me, and the 5 other co-workers whose boxes I've setup". > > Do you have localhost, localhost.domain, host, and host.domain all in > /etc/hosts? What does /etc/resolv.conf look like? Heh. This was not intended to be a -questions posting... sorry about this... and yes, most of the machines are multiboot. host.conf: # $Id: host.conf,v 1.2 1993/11/07 01:02:57 wollman Exp $ # If that doesn't work, then try the /etc/hosts file hosts # Default is to use the nameserver first bind # If you have YP/NIS configured, uncomment the next line # nis hosts: # localhost 127.0.0.1 localhost localhost.lambert.org # dialup DNS 206.165.5.10 dns1.primenet.com 206.165.50.10 dns2.primenet.com 204.245.15.10 dns3.primenet.com # mailhost 206.165.5.53 mailhost.primenet.com # 192.168.1 FreeBSD netblock 192.168.1.1 phaeton phaeton.lambert.org 192.168.1.2 banzai banzai.lambert.org 198.168.1.8 freemca freemca.lambert.org 198.168.1.16 freeppc freeppc.lambert.org 198.168.1.32 freealpha freealpha.lambert.org 198.168.1.48 freehp freehp.lambert.org # 192.168.16 NetBSD netblock 198.168.16.1 net386 net386.lambert.org 198.168.16.16 netppc netppc.lambert.org 198.168.16.32 netalpha netalpha.lambert.org 198.168.16.48 nethp nethp.lambert.org # 192.168.32 OpenBSD netblock 198.168.32.1 open386 open386.lambert.org 198.168.32.16 openppc openppc.lambert.org 198.168.32.32 openalpha openalpha.lambert.org 198.168.32.48 openhp openhp.lambert.org # 192.168.64 Windows95 netblock 192.168.64.1 huey huey.lambert.org 192.168.64.2 dewey dewey.lambert.org 192.168.64.3 louie louie.lambert.org # 192.168.80 WindowsNT netblock 192.168.80.1 ntphaeton ntphaeton.lambert.org 192.168.80.2 oscar oscar.lambert.org 192.168.80.3 meyer meyer.lambert.org # 192.168.96 Sunblock (ar ar) 192.168.96.1 pyramus pyramus.lambert.org 192.168.96.2 thisbe thisbe.lambert.org rc.conf: domain lambert.org nameserver 206.165.5.10 nameserver 206.165.50.10 nameserver 204.245.15.10 Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 14:33:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA05862 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:33:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA05845; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:33:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA09929; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:33:29 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709082133.OAA09929@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Do you have some neat configuration files? To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:33:28 +0000 (GMT) Cc: questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970908153822.27586@lemis.com> from "Greg Lehey" at Sep 8, 97 03:38:22 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > The background is the second edition of "The Complete FreeBSD", in > which I'm trying to improve the introduction to FreeBSD for people > who've never used UNIX before (or even for those who've used a > different version). [ ... ] > Any other suggestions? fvwm95. Graphical logins. Other Windows95-type crap. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 14:38:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA06267 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:38:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA06257 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:38:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA10301; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:36:37 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709082136.OAA10301@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? To: andreas@klemm.gtn.com (Andreas Klemm) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:36:37 +0000 (GMT) Cc: grog@lemis.com, evanc@synapse.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970908080917.09111@klemm.gtn.com> from "Andreas Klemm" at Sep 8, 97 08:09:17 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > figure out ... 1048 or so entries in the root of /opt. > Even > /opt///bin > /lib > /include > /info > /man > /man/man1 > ... > > Would have the disadvantage to have many many bin subdirs and > youd have to symlink everything into a global > /opt/bin > /opt/include > /opt/lib > /opt/man > /opt/info Hmm. Not if you could support a "/opt/*/bin" or "/opt/*/*/bin" as a path entry. The idea being that the path hashing would expand it internally for you. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 14:38:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA06285 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:38:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA06266 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:38:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA10427; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:37:58 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709082137.OAA10427@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. To: joe@pavilion.net (Josef Karthauser) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:37:57 +0000 (GMT) Cc: doconnor@ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970908081913.36000@pavilion.net> from "Josef Karthauser" at Sep 8, 97 08:19:13 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I miss mine. :( FreeBSD port to 680x0 anyone? *chuckle* I have an HP345 I bought for just that purpose, actually... Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 14:46:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA07080 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:46:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA07074 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:46:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA12024; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:46:21 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709082146.OAA12024@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> To: lutz@muc.de (Lutz Albers) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:46:20 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Lutz Albers" at Sep 8, 97 10:50:58 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Who added this? Illegal-Object: Syntax error in References: value found on colin.muc.de: References: <19970908093740.17864@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Mon , Sep 08, 1997 at 09: 37: 40AM +0930 < 19970907160423 . 39071 @ klemm . gtn . co m > < 3412C092 . 57D67DA9 @ synapse . net > < 19970908093740 . 17864 @ lemis . c om > ^ ^ ^ ^ ^-illegal reference separator | | | \-illegal reference separator | | \-illegal reference separator | \-illegal reference separator \-illegal reference sepa rator This is wrong. See the semicololon? Someone's software needs to read RFC822. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 14:49:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA07379 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:49:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from roguetrader.com (brandon@cold.org [206.81.134.103]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA07368 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:49:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (brandon@localhost) by roguetrader.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA20938; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:50:21 -0600 (MDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:50:21 -0600 (MDT) From: Brandon Gillespie To: jbryant@tfs.net cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? In-Reply-To: <199709081852.NAA01461@argus.tfs.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Jim Bryant wrote: > In reply: > > On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Brian Mitchell wrote: > > > > > On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Lutz Albers wrote: > > > > > > what about /usr/contrib like bsd/os? > > > > its no different than /usr/local, just a different name. > > > > I think the main issue here is that people feel /usr/local/ should be a > > different fs (I agree), > > but many feel its unclean to mount from anything other than root. > > Suggestion: mount it on /local, and symlink /usr/local to /local.. > > ACK!@# E-V-I-L!!!!!!! E-V-I-L!!!!!!! E-V-I-L!!!!!!! E-V-I-L!!!!!!! 8) > This would require all that much more hacking to makefiles and include > files, not to mention those lame few proggies that hardcode paths in > the source code... > > Besides, assuming /usr don't come up, why bother having /local come > up, as almost everything in /local will reference the symlink > /usr/local... Hmm, true... actually, I was thinking of just having /usr/local as a link there for posterity and familiarity, but having the programs use /local as the prefix. I guess basically what i'm getting at is that to place these in a filesystem off root, we shouldn't use an existing name, as then people would assume the rest follows existing conventions (i.e. /opt) which would not be the case, thus a different name would be in order, and the first thing to pop into my head was simply /local :) However, there are problems that would arise. So perhaps simply a completely different prefix? Or even /local alone, seperate from /usr/local, then put all ports/packages and port/package info in /local and leave /usr/local for non ported/packaged stuff *shrug* perhaps /pkg (preferred over /ports) This is probably a moot discussion tho, it implies too many changes to very common but not official ''standards''... -Brandon Gillespie From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 15:01:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA08090 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:01:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zephyr.isi.edu (zephyr.isi.edu [128.9.160.160]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA08083 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:01:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gin-a.isi.edu by zephyr.isi.edu (5.65c/5.61+local-26) id ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:59:18 -0700 Message-Id: <199709082159.AA20082@zephyr.isi.edu> To: "Marty Leisner" Cc: Kenny Hanson , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape Communicator 4.02b7 In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 13:34:38 PDT." <9709082034.AA19993@gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com> X-Url: http://www.isi.edu/~faber Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 08 Sep 97 14:59:11 PDT From: Ted Faber Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- "Marty Leisner" wrote: > > >I have 96 mbytes of ram with little swap space... > >I just almost ran out of ram...I was running two netscapes...one >took up 30 Mbyte, the other 20 Mbyte... It *is* a pig. Incidentally, the latest pig, communicator403b8, is available from ftp.netscape.com . In the /pub/communicator/4.03/4.03b8/english/unix/freebsd/base_install directory. - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Ted Faber faber@isi.edu USC/ISI Computer Scientist http://www.isi.edu/~faber (310) 822-1511 x190 PGP Key: http://www.isi.edu/~faber/pubkey.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3 Charset: noconv iQCVAwUBNBR1Kob4eisfQ5rpAQF+2QQAhOE3HoYqr0OrtRZJ8ij8KlF7t9bFsaXX diSbfICmhCbHsrYvgDql3bsaFJOFvWsZ4aeUlqIEXSLZK8sxhKCeXirTMQ6SSSsq isfYVHFadyE43OSagr7k+f6lz+1HHgResu2+BGY5rLFsLyDydHWCj132WPs0wjRu C/OzUhlZnVY= =50vC -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 15:05:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA08477 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:05:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.fr [193.56.58.253]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA08454 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:05:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.fr [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.8.4/8.8.4) with ESMTP id AAA11187 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:05:19 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.8.6/brasil-1.2) with UUCP id AAA09566 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:04:55 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id XAA24791; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:32:31 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19970908233231.09396@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:32:31 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Kernel clock runs inaccurately References: <199709080124.JAA14004@tao.sinanet.com.tw> <19970908081010.DS04250@uriah.heep.sax.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76 In-Reply-To: <19970908081010.DS04250@uriah.heep.sax.de>; from J Wunsch on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 08:10:10AM +0200 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT ctm#3592 AMD-K6 MMX @ 208 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to J Wunsch: > The master clock on my machine at work is much worse. I was > contemplating to hack xntpd so it could use the RTC (CMOS) clock as a > refclock, but unfortunately, didn't get very far. Mainly, i don't > grok the xnptd refclock implementations, and how to add a new one. It is already supported (if I understand what you want): peer 127.127.1.0 -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: There are no limits -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 3.0-CURRENT #29: Tue Aug 26 21:05:09 CEST 1997 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 15:14:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA09068 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:14:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA09063 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:14:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA20902; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:14:04 -0600 (MDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:14:04 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709082214.QAA20902@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Terry Lambert Cc: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams), brian@awfulhak.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: un-neccessary DNS lookups (was Re: Divert sockets..) In-Reply-To: <199709082131.OAA09781@usr09.primenet.com> References: <199709080559.XAA18297@rocky.mt.sri.com> <199709082131.OAA09781@usr09.primenet.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > hosts: > > # localhost > 127.0.0.1 localhost localhost.lambert.org I know this sounds silly, but if you reverse the order of the hosts file, does it make any difference? 127.0.0.1 localhost.lambert.org localhost ... > # 192.168.1 FreeBSD netblock > 192.168.1.1 phaeton phaeton.lambert.org 192.168.1.1 phaeton.lambert.org phaeton ... Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 15:23:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA09702 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:23:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.firehouse.net (brian@shell.firehouse.net [209.42.203.45]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA09690 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:23:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (brian@localhost) by shell.firehouse.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA26771; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:22:45 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:22:42 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Mitchell To: Brandon Gillespie cc: Lutz Albers , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Brandon Gillespie wrote: > On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Brian Mitchell wrote: > > > On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Lutz Albers wrote: > > > > what about /usr/contrib like bsd/os? > > its no different than /usr/local, just a different name. It is. They have /usr/local as well, which is unpopulated. /usr/contrib is for contributed software on the cd but not maintained by bsdi. This is the same situation the ports collection is in. > > I think the main issue here is that people feel /usr/local/ should be a > different fs (I agree), but many feel its unclean to mount from anything > other than root. > > Suggestion: mount it on /local, and symlink /usr/local to /local.. > > -Brandon > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 15:36:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA10656 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:36:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA10650 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:36:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA15636; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:35:59 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709082235.PAA15636@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: un-neccessary DNS lookups (was Re: Divert sockets..) To: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:35:56 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, nate@mt.sri.com, brian@awfulhak.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199709082214.QAA20902@rocky.mt.sri.com> from "Nate Williams" at Sep 8, 97 04:14:04 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > # localhost > > 127.0.0.1 localhost localhost.lambert.org > > I know this sounds silly, but if you reverse the order of the hosts > file, does it make any difference? > > 127.0.0.1 localhost.lambert.org localhost > > ... > > # 192.168.1 FreeBSD netblock > > 192.168.1.1 phaeton phaeton.lambert.org > > 192.168.1.1 phaeton.lambert.org phaeton > ... Sean mentioned this as well. I'll try it. If it works, I'll consider it a bug, since I want my local machines to reverse as not having a domain qualification; the first entry is supposed to be the cannonical name, and I want 192.168.1.1 cannonized as "phaeton". Plus the default example "localhost" entry does it in this order, too. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 15:40:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA11018 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:40:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from awfulhak.demon.co.uk (awfulhak.demon.co.uk [158.152.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA11010 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:40:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lan.awfulhak.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by awfulhak.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA05402; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:35:32 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199709082235.XAA05402@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Doug White cc: Brian Somers , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: nfs startup - perhaps it is a problem In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 05 Sep 1997 23:43:30 PDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 23:35:32 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > On Thu, 4 Sep 1997, Brian Somers wrote: > > > This has to be a dumb question, but I can't fathom it. > > > > /etc/rc sources /etc/rc.network and then runs network_pass1. > > Directly afterwards, it runs ``mount -a -t nfs''. > > > > However, network_pass3 (invoked much later) starts nfsiod along with > > the other nfs stuff. > > > > How is the ``mount -a -t nfs'' supposed to work ? > > nfsiod is more of a helper daemon for nfs; it'll still work without it. > mount -a -t nfs will mount all filesystems of type nfs; this is probably > necessary for diskless boots. The problem was that mount couldn't resolve the host names from fstab. This brings up two things: 1. Why is "mount -a -t nfs" redirected to /dev/null ? It seems happy if there are no nfs filesystems in fstab, so wouldn't it be better if we see any such errors ? 2. Should named be done in pass 1, or is it done this way because your named config files may be on an nfs drive ;-/ The whole thing is worked around nicely by putting a nameserver in resolv.conf or by reading /etc/hosts first and putting all your "close friends" in there. I think 1. should be done at least. > Doug White | University of Oregon > Internet: dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu | Residence Networking Assistant > http://gladstone.uoregon.edu/~dwhite | Computer Science Major > Spam routed to /dev/null by Procmail | Death to Cyberpromo > -- Brian , Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 15:41:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA11099 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:41:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brickbat8.mindspring.com (brickbat8.mindspring.com [207.69.200.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA11086 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:41:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bogus.mindspring.com (user-37kbol4.dialup.mindspring.com [207.69.226.164]) by brickbat8.mindspring.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA09035; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:41:41 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970908224044.00c94f58@mail.mindspring.com> X-Sender: kpneal@mail.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 18:40:44 -0400 To: Brandon Gillespie From: "Kevin P. Neal" Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 11:19 AM 9/8/97 -0600, Brandon Gillespie wrote: >On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Brian Mitchell wrote: > >> On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Lutz Albers wrote: >> >> what about /usr/contrib like bsd/os? > >its no different than /usr/local, just a different name. Except that /usr/local and /usr/contrib have different connotations. /usr/local seems like it's for programs written locally, and /usr/contrib seems like it is for programs dl'd from the net. >I think the main issue here is that people feel /usr/local/ should be a >different fs (I agree), but many feel its unclean to mount from anything >other than root. What's wrong with having a /usr and a /usr/local filesystem? >Suggestion: mount it on /local, and symlink /usr/local to /local.. *bleah* I usually mount a drive at /local for kicking around in, various programs in states of build, source trees, etc. Totally different purpose than /usr/local. Where I work we have / and /local on different disks. Most if not all machines have nearly identical / disks. The /local, OTOH, is filled with all sorts of data. For example, my web servers at work are located in /local/etc/httpd.dir on the web server machines. -- XCOMM Kevin P. Neal, Junior, Comp. Sci. - House of Retrocomputing XCOMM mailto:kpneal@pobox.com - http://www.pobox.com/~kpn/ XCOMM kpneal@eos.ncsu.edu Spoken by Keir Finlow-Bates: XCOMM "Good grief, I've just noticed I've typed in a rant. Sorry chaps!" From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 15:42:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA11125 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:42:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from awfulhak.demon.co.uk (awfulhak.demon.co.uk [158.152.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA11112 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:41:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lan.awfulhak.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by awfulhak.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA05170; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:27:33 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199709082127.WAA05170@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Josef Karthauser cc: Greg Lehey , Terry Lambert , Brian Somers , doconnor@Ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 08:15:00 BST." <19970908081500.32320@pavilion.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 22:27:33 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 09:10:46AM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: > > > > > And there's the annoying localhost DNS lookup, even though host.conf > > > has "hosts" first, and the name of the machine I'm rlogin'ing into > > > is in /etc/hosts (it's myself). It triggers the PPP dial anyway, > > > and I think that should only happen for non-local hosts. > > > > Well, why aren't you running named? It's faster than looking up > > /etc/hosts. And if you don't tell the world it's there, it's not > > going to get any external traffic. > > > > :( Running named on the end of a dial-up-demand line is bad! :( > > 'Tis fine until you start using the named for lookups and then it > starts opening the line itself at random moments, i.e. when it's > checking the validity of things still in its cache, etc. That's why > I use /etc/hosts on my home machine, and resolve using an external > name server on my work network. Naaa. Just use ppp & use a dfilter to block the DNS. If you play primary for everything local (including any static *real* IP address you may have), it works wonders. The bigger your LAN gets the happier you become. > Joe > -- > Josef Karthauser > Technical Manager Email: joe@pavilion.net > Pavilion Internet plc. [Tel: +44 1273 607072 Fax: +44 1273 607073] > -- Brian , Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 15:43:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA11210 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:43:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA11204 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:43:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA16151; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:42:55 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709082242.PAA16151@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? To: brandon@roguetrader.com (Brandon Gillespie) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:42:52 +0000 (GMT) Cc: jbryant@tfs.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Brandon Gillespie" at Sep 8, 97 03:50:21 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I guess basically what i'm getting at is that to place these > in a filesystem off root, we shouldn't use an existing name, as then > people would assume the rest follows existing conventions (i.e. /opt) > which would not be the case, thus a different name would be in order, and > the first thing to pop into my head was simply /local :) [ ... ] > perhaps /pkg > > (preferred over /ports) > > This is probably a moot discussion tho, it implies too many changes to > very common but not official ''standards''... The biggest issue is not changes; changes are OK (IMO, anyway). What is upsetting is: 1) unless /whatever is a seperate partition, you are loading onto / instead of /usr, and /usr is probably where you want the loads to occur in that case. / is a small partition, traditionally. 2) If /opt is used, there is an ABI problem with installation of third party packaged wor SunOS/Solaris on FreeBSD boxes as part of an install into a SunOS/Solaris ABI environment; speficially, how do you tell /opt/cc for /opt/cc? I personally would prefer a mounting under /usr/opt, or /var/opt, if necessary, and let the "no inferior mounts of inferior mounts" purists do the fstab and symlink hacking themselves (to be purists they have to know enough about the actual layout that it's offensive to them; the same knowledge may be applied by them to fix their lcoal configuration). Worst case, it's another install option which asks "/usr/opt on a sperate partition?" and "/usr/opt really /opt?" if they say "yes". Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 15:59:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA12324 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:59:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from roguetrader.com (brandon@cold.org [206.81.134.103]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA12314 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:59:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (brandon@localhost) by roguetrader.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA21267; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 17:00:13 -0600 (MDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 17:00:13 -0600 (MDT) From: Brandon Gillespie To: Terry Lambert cc: jbryant@tfs.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? In-Reply-To: <199709082242.PAA16151@usr09.primenet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Terry Lambert wrote: > 2) If /opt is used, there is an ABI problem with installation > of third party packaged wor SunOS/Solaris on FreeBSD boxes > as part of an install into a SunOS/Solaris ABI environment; > speficially, how do you tell /opt/cc for /opt/cc? I dont think using /opt would be a good idea, not only is it normally laid-out a little different than most people seem to want, but it would also imply Solaris-isms.. *shrug* (this is a bad thing for me, but I have bad SunOS experience). The more I think about it, having the name be 'pkg' and it located wherever (/pkg or /usr/pkg, perhaps configurable as you specified for /opt) would be pretty nice, and have the file/dir structure as (keep in mind, this is only for packages/ports): /pkg/bin /usr/local/bin /pkg/sbin /usr/local/sbin /pkg/etc /usr/local/etc /pkg/man /usr/local/man /pkg/db /var/db/pkg /pkg/src (?) /usr/ports Etc.. the points on the right are where things currently reside.. -Brandon Gillespie From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 16:02:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA12538 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:02:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nico.telstra.net (nico.telstra.net [139.130.204.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA12528 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:02:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by nico.telstra.net (8.6.10/8.6.10) with ESMTP id IAA03359; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:59:42 +1000 Received: (grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.6.12) id IAA15242; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:29:40 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970909082940.32010@lemis.com> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:29:40 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Brian Somers Cc: Josef Karthauser , Terry Lambert , doconnor@Ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. References: <19970908081500.32320@pavilion.net> <199709082127.WAA05170@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709082127.WAA05170@awfulhak.demon.co.uk>; from Brian Somers on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 10:27:33PM +0100 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 10:27:33PM +0100, Brian Somers wrote: >> On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 09:10:46AM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: >>> >>>> And there's the annoying localhost DNS lookup, even though host.conf >>>> has "hosts" first, and the name of the machine I'm rlogin'ing into >>>> is in /etc/hosts (it's myself). It triggers the PPP dial anyway, >>>> and I think that should only happen for non-local hosts. >>> >>> Well, why aren't you running named? It's faster than looking up >>> /etc/hosts. And if you don't tell the world it's there, it's not >>> going to get any external traffic. >>> >> >>> ( Running named on the end of a dial-up-demand line is bad! :( >> >> 'Tis fine until you start using the named for lookups and then it >> starts opening the line itself at random moments, i.e. when it's >> checking the validity of things still in its cache, etc. That's why >> I use /etc/hosts on my home machine, and resolve using an external >> name server on my work network. > > Naaa. Just use ppp & use a dfilter Is that a typo, or something I don't know about? > to block the DNS. If you play primary for everything local > (including any static *real* IP address you may have), it works > wonders. The bigger your LAN gets the happier you become. And how do you perform DNS lookups when the link is up? What you need is to limit the kind of packet which can cause autodial. Is that a dfilter? (If this was a typo, and you introduce the feature, how about calling it dfilter? :-) Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 16:07:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA12913 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:07:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.com (s205m131.whistle.com [207.76.205.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA12899 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:07:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id QAA15601; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:06:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bubba.whistle.com(207.76.205.7) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma015599; Mon Sep 8 16:06:21 1997 Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.6.12) id QAA05241; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:06:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199709082306.QAA05241@bubba.whistle.com> Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-Reply-To: <199709080045.KAA00615@word.smith.net.au> from Mike Smith at "Sep 8, 97 10:45:18 am" To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:06:20 -0700 (PDT) Cc: doconnor@Ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I was wondering if its possible to write a program which would do > > 'dial on demand', by grabbing packets, and seeing if they are destined > > to go out of the system, and if so, run a script(which would cause a > > dialup). > > You could hang something off a divert socket to do this. IMHO, the proper way to do this is to let the PPP daemon handle it by installing a route first (so you let the routing code determine whether packets are supposed to go over the WAN link or not, as it should) and then checking each outgoing packet for suitability as "demand" (not all are, e.g., NTP packets). When "demand" is seen, it should start dialing, etc. The same "demand" test can also apply to idle timeout calculations. This is how mpd does it, anyway. > > I know ijppp can do this, but I have problems with ijppp =) > > Fix your problems. 8) Or use mpd instead :-) > > The only problem I can see is that since a default route wouldn't be > > established yet(since you aren't dialed up), the packets would be > > killed off before they pass through a divert socket.(I don't know much > > about how that stuff works :) This problem goes away if you do as described above. -Archie ___________________________________________________________________________ Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 16:19:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA13567 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:19:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from misery.sdf.com (misery.sdf.com [204.244.210.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA13552 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:19:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tom by misery.sdf.com with smtp (Exim 1.62 #1) id 0x8D0Y-0006GG-00; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:14:14 -0700 Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:14:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom To: Terry Lambert cc: Lutz Albers , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> In-Reply-To: <199709082146.OAA12024@usr09.primenet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Terry Lambert wrote: > Who added this? > > Illegal-Object: Syntax error in References: value found on colin.muc.de: Zmailer adds headers like that. Probably needs an updated version, as few can keep up with the Zmailer almost-monthly release schedule. > > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org > --- > Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present > or previous employers. > > Tom From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 16:22:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA13811 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:22:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nico.telstra.net (nico.telstra.net [139.130.204.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA13785; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:22:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by nico.telstra.net (8.6.10/8.6.10) with ESMTP id JAA03791; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 09:21:13 +1000 Received: (grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.6.12) id IAA15377; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:51:07 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970909085107.25727@lemis.com> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:51:07 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: jmcl@Acucobol.IE Cc: "Gregory G. Losik" , questions@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: /: file system is full References: <199709081258.NAA05640@guinness.acucobol.ie> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709081258.NAA05640@guinness.acucobol.ie>; from John McLaughlin on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 02:07:12PM +0000 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 02:07:12PM +0000, John McLaughlin wrote: > On 6 Sep 97 at 23:12, Gregory G. Losik wrote: > >> Hello, >> >> This is really easy one but I wasn't able to find anything that simple in >> archives and maybe you can refer me to some manual where I can learn more... >> >> I just installed 2.2.2 on my 1gig partition. Used auto for creation of /, >> /usr, /var, and /proc FS. Installed X, and later during addition of >> other packages got something like "/: file system is full" df -k reports >> 109% used for /. >> Basicly, I am trying to find out what are my options and what tools can I >> use to change things (lots of rm:)? What's best configuration? >> >> Now, my / is 31M, /usr is ~1gig, and /var = 30M. Don't have any data yet. > > Did you by chance install Linux compatibility (or any other for that > matter).This will install all the Linux lib stuff into /compat, and > will *very* quickly hose a 32Mb root partition, I've been there. Thanks. This looks like being the correct answer. > The way round it is to create a compat directory in /usr and symlink > it to /compat, and *then* install the packages. With a 31Mb root, > this is also a good time to symlink /tmp to /usr/tmp, as I've run out > of unpacking space on small root partitions occasionally while > unpacking space hungry things like Perl, Emacs et al. I don't know whether to recommend this solution as standard. I'm using it myself (sorry, I suppose I should have thought of it earlier, but I did it some time ago, and didn't think about it). I find that my Linux compatibility takes up 13.5 MB. The other alternative is, of course, to recommend a 45 MB root slice. There's nothing so holy about /compat that it *should* be in the root slice, but I don't like gratuituous symlinks either. I'm copying FreeBSD-hackers on this--there's a good chance that they'll have some input. Please follow up to -hackers. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 16:25:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA14063 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:25:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wakky.dyn.ml.org (lee@1Cust85.tnt1.manassas.va.da.uu.net [153.37.113.85]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA14056 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:25:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from lee@localhost) by wakky.dyn.ml.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) id TAA10867; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:25:05 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19970908192505.05681@wakky.dyn.ml.org> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:25:05 -0400 From: Lee Cremeans To: Ted Faber Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape Communicator 4.02b7 Reply-To: hcremean@vt.edu References: <9709082034.AA19993@gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com> <199709082159.AA20082@zephyr.isi.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79e In-Reply-To: <199709082159.AA20082@zephyr.isi.edu>; from Ted Faber on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 02:59:11PM -0800 X-OS: FreeBSD 2.2-RELEASE X-Evil: microsoft.com Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 02:59:11PM -0800, Ted Faber wrote: > Incidentally, the latest pig, communicator403b8, is available from > ftp.netscape.com . In the > /pub/communicator/4.03/4.03b8/english/unix/freebsd/base_install > directory. Have they cleared up any of the weirdness with SIGFPE? (What I mean is that I notice my copy of 4.02b7 likes to hang when it exits...an investigation with GDB showed that it was SIGFPE'ing, then continuing, then doing it again, over and over, in a loop that eats all my CPU. I have to kill -9 it to make it go away.) -- Lee C. -- Manassas, VA, USA (WakkyMouse on DALnet #watertower) A! JW223 YWD++^i WK+++r P&B++ SL++^i GDF B&M KK--i MD+++i P++ I++++ Did $++ E5/10/70/3c/73ac Ee34/1/36 H2 PonPippi Ay77 M | hcremean (at) vt.edu FreeBSD/Linux/Unix hacker...Win95 and M$ evil! (go see www.freebsd.org) My home page: http://wakky.dyn.ml.org/~lee | finger me for geek code From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 16:25:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA14093 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:25:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from awfulhak.demon.co.uk (awfulhak.demon.co.uk [158.152.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA14082 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:25:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lan.awfulhak.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by awfulhak.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA06548; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:13:51 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199709082313.AAA06548@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Nate Williams cc: Terry Lambert , brian@awfulhak.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: un-neccessary DNS lookups (was Re: Divert sockets..) In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 16:14:04 MDT." <199709082214.QAA20902@rocky.mt.sri.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 00:13:51 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > hosts: > > > > # localhost > > 127.0.0.1 localhost localhost.lambert.org > > I know this sounds silly, but if you reverse the order of the hosts > file, does it make any difference? > > 127.0.0.1 localhost.lambert.org localhost > > ... > > # 192.168.1 FreeBSD netblock > > 192.168.1.1 phaeton phaeton.lambert.org > > 192.168.1.1 phaeton.lambert.org phaeton > ... Strange.... OpenBSD gets this wrong by default (the way Terry has it). > Nate -- Brian , Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 16:35:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA14864 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:35:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA14855 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:35:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA20128; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:35:41 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709082335.QAA20128@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: un-neccessary DNS lookups (was Re: Divert sockets..) To: brian@awfulhak.org (Brian Somers) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:35:40 +0000 (GMT) Cc: nate@mt.sri.com, tlambert@primenet.com, brian@awfulhak.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199709082313.AAA06548@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> from "Brian Somers" at Sep 9, 97 00:13:51 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > # localhost > > > 127.0.0.1 localhost localhost.lambert.org > > > > I know this sounds silly, but if you reverse the order of the hosts > > file, does it make any difference? > > > > 127.0.0.1 localhost.lambert.org localhost > > > > ... > > > # 192.168.1 FreeBSD netblock > > > 192.168.1.1 phaeton phaeton.lambert.org > > > > 192.168.1.1 phaeton.lambert.org phaeton > > ... > > Strange.... OpenBSD gets this wrong by default (the way Terry has it). Ugh. Here's why: When I say "w" or "who", I want it to say "phaeton" not "phaeton.lambert.org". I know I'm in "lambert.org". I want to be able to see at a glance local domain vs. extra-local domain logins to my system. I also want to be able to make a sed script to kill of extra-local logins, if I want, without having to have the thing parse resolv.conf. The order I have them in is identical to the example i the FreeBSD distributed /etc/hosts file for "localhost". This should be *irrelevant*. The only purpose order on a line in the hosts file should have is determining which entry is reported as the cannoical name to things that display cannonical names. Like "w". Sheesh. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 16:40:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA15372 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:40:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA15355 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:40:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id JAA15482; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 09:10:23 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970909091022.09328@lemis.com> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 09:10:22 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Brian McGovern Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: re: libXExExt References: <199709081323.JAA01794@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709081323.JAA01794@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com>; from Brian McGovern on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 09:23:18AM -0400 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 09:23:18AM -0400, Brian McGovern wrote: > > cc: greg@lomis.com If you want to get me, swap the e and the o: grog@lemis.com :-) I'm on -hackers, so I got this anyway. >> On Fri, Sep 05, 1997 at 01:18:19PM -0400, Brian McGovern wrote: >>> Where can I find this library. > >> This looks like a typo to me, but I can't decide whether it's yours or >> something that got included in your system. In any case, it's almost >> certainly looking for libXext.. It should be in >> /usr/X11R6/lib. > > It appears to be a brain seize in the ports, then. fvwm wants it, > ddd wanted it... I've tried others, but don't remember what they were at > the moment. I linked libXext. to libXExExt., and all is > now working fine. The ports set I'm working with was last weeks (round > about 9/4 or so) ports-current. Thanks for that. I had more or less written this off as lack of knowledge on my part. Or is there really a libXExExt? Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 16:42:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA15498 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:42:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zephyr.isi.edu (zephyr.isi.edu [128.9.160.160]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA15488 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:42:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gin-a.isi.edu by zephyr.isi.edu (5.65c/5.61+local-26) id ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:42:17 -0700 Message-Id: <199709082342.AA25944@zephyr.isi.edu> To: hcremean@vt.edu Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape Communicator 4.02b7 In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 19:25:05 EDT." <19970908192505.05681@wakky.dyn.ml.org> X-Url: http://www.isi.edu/~faber Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 08 Sep 97 16:42:10 PDT From: Ted Faber Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Lee Cremeans wrote: >On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 02:59:11PM -0800, Ted Faber wrote: > >> Incidentally, the latest pig, communicator403b8, is available from >> ftp.netscape.com . > >Have they cleared up any of the weirdness with SIGFPE? (What I mean is that >I notice my copy of 4.02b7 likes to hang when it exits...an investigation >with GDB showed that it was SIGFPE'ing, then continuing, then doing it >again, over and over, in a loop that eats all my CPU. I have to kill -9 it >to make it go away.) I haven't seen that problem on either of my boxes, but I didn't see it with 4.02b7 either so my data point is of dubious value. The install script seems to be good about keeping old versions around, so if you want to check it out, all it should cost you is download time. - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Ted Faber faber@isi.edu USC/ISI Computer Scientist http://www.isi.edu/~faber (310) 822-1511 x190 PGP Key: http://www.isi.edu/~faber/pubkey.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3 Charset: noconv iQCVAwUBNBSNSYb4eisfQ5rpAQFFZwQAougzOffLV8qq+4xyvCZUaRYAFFYgNMqQ ey6HR//vp3BaK1CHmjU/LMOR8lIcBa9jfbQ0RgB73PePa9mbJt7D1YZFhzyyH3eJ 2W67K3/vU5bqSlMDOrWzAWCgSPhzsl/tIZS9fKfrr8EtBR23ID6MIYWbyE2I5pm9 mZO1muXLetE= =/DKN -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 16:44:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA15830 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:44:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cleopatra.ultra.net (cleopatra.ultra.net [199.232.56.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA15817 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:44:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from d7.dial-22.mbo.ma.ultra.net (d7.dial-22.mbo.ma.ultra.net [146.115.101.71]) by cleopatra.ultra.net (8.8.5/ult1.05) with SMTP id TAA23302 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:44:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: by d7.dial-22.mbo.ma.ultra.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BCBC8F.DE28EAE0@d7.dial-22.mbo.ma.ultra.net>; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:46:15 -0400 Message-ID: <01BCBC8F.DE28EAE0@d7.dial-22.mbo.ma.ultra.net> From: Preferred Customer To: "hackers@FreeBSD.ORG" Subject: sysctl Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:26:17 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by hub.freebsd.org id QAA15821 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I was looking at sysctl,h and kern_sysctl.c the other day and I was wondering why there where no predefined Sysctl_short() aka CTLTYPE_SHORT or Sysctl_char() aka CTLTYPE_CHAR (note: not string Definitions. It seems to me that short and char have to be at lease as worthy to be included as atomic types as quad. Also, shouldn't there be support for octet string, as in a not necessarily print-able sequence of unsigned char (a not uncommon mib occurance) - g From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 16:46:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA15956 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:46:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wakky.dyn.ml.org (lee@1Cust85.tnt1.manassas.va.da.uu.net [153.37.113.85]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA15931 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:45:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from lee@localhost) by wakky.dyn.ml.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) id TAA11196; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:45:10 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19970908194509.56468@wakky.dyn.ml.org> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:45:09 -0400 From: Lee Cremeans To: Greg Lehey Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. Reply-To: hcremean@vt.edu References: <19970908081500.32320@pavilion.net> <199709082127.WAA05170@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> <19970909082940.32010@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79e In-Reply-To: <19970909082940.32010@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 08:29:40AM +0930 X-OS: FreeBSD 2.2-RELEASE X-Evil: microsoft.com Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 08:29:40AM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: > On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 10:27:33PM +0100, Brian Somers wrote: > > > to block the DNS. If you play primary for everything local > > (including any static *real* IP address you may have), it works > > wonders. The bigger your LAN gets the happier you become. > > And how do you perform DNS lookups when the link is up? What you need > is to limit the kind of packet which can cause autodial. Is that a > dfilter? (If this was a typo, and you introduce the feature, how > about calling it dfilter? :-) Yes, that's what a dfilter is. Read the man page. -- Lee C. -- Manassas, VA, USA (WakkyMouse on DALnet #watertower) A! JW223 YWD++^i WK+++r P&B++ SL++^i GDF B&M KK--i MD+++i P++ I++++ Did $++ E5/10/70/3c/73ac Ee34/1/36 H2 PonPippi Ay77 M | hcremean (at) vt.edu FreeBSD/Linux/Unix hacker...Win95 and M$ evil! (go see www.freebsd.org) My home page: http://wakky.dyn.ml.org/~lee | finger me for geek code From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 16:53:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA16681 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:53:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ns2.gamespot.com (ns2.gamespot.com [206.169.18.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA16675 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:53:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tiramisu.gamespot.com (tiramisu.gamespot.com [206.169.18.119]) by ns2.gamespot.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA20988; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:53:02 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970908165505.0129fb70@mail.gamespot.com> X-Sender: ian@mail.gamespot.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 16:55:05 -0700 To: craig@cnewmark.com From: Ian Kallen Subject: (event 9/11) SF Bay Area FreeBSD User's Group Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Sameer Parekh of C2Net, fresh off the cover of Forbes (!), will be discussing political and technical issues of encryption technology in the US. Jordan Hubbard will be discussing what's new with FreeBSD and it will be a good opportunity to network with other FreeBSD enthusiasts in the San Francisco Bay Area. Meet and join the folks who are turning PC's into workstations, the San Francisco Bay Area FreeBSD User's Group meets again! Where: Silicon Reef 3057 17th Street San Francisco, CA http://www.arachna.com/freebsd/reef_map.html When: Thursday September 11, 1997 @ 7:30 pm Who: Hackers, nerds, newbies and other FreeBSD developers and enthusiasts What: http://www.arachna.com/freebsd/freebsd-sf.html -- Ian Kallen ian@gamespot.com Director of Technology and Web Administration SpotMedia Communications http://www.gamespot.com/ http://www.videogamespot.com/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 17:23:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA17916 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 17:23:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wakky.dyn.ml.org (root@1Cust85.tnt1.manassas.va.da.uu.net [153.37.113.85]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA17693 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 17:18:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from lee@localhost) by wakky.dyn.ml.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) id UAA12715; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:05:38 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19970908200533.10331@wakky.dyn.ml.org> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:05:33 -0400 From: Lee Cremeans To: Greg Lehey Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. Reply-To: hcremean@vt.edu References: <19970908081500.32320@pavilion.net> <199709082127.WAA05170@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> <19970909082940.32010@lemis.com> <19970908194509.56468@wakky.dyn.ml.org> <19970909091900.03067@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79e In-Reply-To: <19970909091900.03067@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 09:19:00AM +0930 X-OS: FreeBSD 2.2-RELEASE X-Evil: microsoft.com Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 09:19:00AM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: > On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 07:45:09PM -0400, Lee Cremeans wrote: > > On Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 08:29:40AM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: > >> And how do you perform DNS lookups when the link is up? What you need > >> is to limit the kind of packet which can cause autodial. Is that a > >> dfilter? (If this was a typo, and you introduce the feature, how > >> about calling it dfilter? :-) > > > > Yes, that's what a dfilter is. Read the man page. > > I suppose I was asking for that. But: > > === root@freebie (/dev/ttyp3) /etc 84 -> man dfilter > No manual entry for dfilter > === root@freebie (/dev/ttyp3) /etc 85 -> locate dfilter > === root@freebie (/dev/ttyp3) /etc 86 -> It's in ppp's man page... -- Lee C. -- Manassas, VA, USA (WakkyMouse on DALnet #watertower) A! JW223 YWD++^i WK+++r P&B++ SL++^i GDF B&M KK--i MD+++i P++ I++++ Did $++ E5/10/70/3c/73ac Ee34/1/36 H2 PonPippi Ay77 M | hcremean (at) vt.edu FreeBSD/Linux/Unix hacker...Win95 and M$ evil! (go see www.freebsd.org) My home page: http://wakky.dyn.ml.org/~lee | finger me for geek code From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 17:24:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA18002 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 17:24:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA17994 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 17:24:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id JAA15778; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 09:54:10 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970909095410.37753@lemis.com> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 09:54:10 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Brandon Gillespie Cc: jbryant@tfs.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? References: <199709081852.NAA01461@argus.tfs.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: ; from Brandon Gillespie on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 03:50:21PM -0600 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 03:50:21PM -0600, Brandon Gillespie wrote: > On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Jim Bryant wrote: > >> In reply: >>> On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Brian Mitchell wrote: >>> >>>> On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Lutz Albers wrote: >>>> >>>> what about /usr/contrib like bsd/os? >>> >>> its no different than /usr/local, just a different name. >>> >>> I think the main issue here is that people feel /usr/local/ should be a >>> different fs (I agree), >>> but many feel its unclean to mount from anything other than root. >>> Suggestion: mount it on /local, and symlink /usr/local to /local.. >> >> ACK!@# E-V-I-L!!!!!!! E-V-I-L!!!!!!! E-V-I-L!!!!!!! E-V-I-L!!!!!!! > > 8) > >> This would require all that much more hacking to makefiles and include >> files, not to mention those lame few proggies that hardcode paths in >> the source code... >> >> Besides, assuming /usr don't come up, why bother having /local come >> up, as almost everything in /local will reference the symlink >> /usr/local... > > Hmm, true... actually, I was thinking of just having /usr/local as a link > there for posterity and familiarity, but having the programs use /local as > the prefix. I guess basically what i'm getting at is that to place these > in a filesystem off root, we shouldn't use an existing name, as then > people would assume the rest follows existing conventions (i.e. /opt) > which would not be the case, thus a different name would be in order, and > the first thing to pop into my head was simply /local :) Sure, but that's just a name. /opt has already been in use for some years. Why change the name? Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 17:40:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA19300 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 17:40:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA19290 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 17:40:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA16486; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 17:40:30 -0700 (PDT) To: Brandon Gillespie cc: Brian Mitchell , Lutz Albers , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 11:19:41 MDT." Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 17:40:29 -0700 Message-ID: <16482.873765629@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Folks... I think it's time for a serious reality-check here. I don't think we're ever going to come to anything even *remotely* resembling a concensus to change this, so I might respectfully suggest that we simply kill the subject thread. /opt? Never. /local? You gotta be kidding me. /usr/opt? Not on your life. See? I already hate the counter-proposals discussed so far myself, and I'm hardly alone - there are many others here who would consider me a real wimp for using such tame responses as "never" and "not on your life" when they feel that "you've got to be f***ing kidding me! No way in *hell*, man!" would be closer to the proper response to these proposals so far. :-) /usr/local sucks too, sure, but at least we're used to it and people have long experience now in administering that location. Nothing but a painful and extended flame war would result from an actual change here, and we'd be complete idiots to voluntarily provoke such an outcome, so I really don't see the point in all this discussion about it. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 17:58:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA20800 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 17:58:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.firehouse.net (brian@shell.firehouse.net [209.42.203.45]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA20789 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 17:58:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (brian@localhost) by shell.firehouse.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA27542; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:58:07 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:58:05 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Mitchell To: Preferred Customer cc: "hackers@FreeBSD.ORG" Subject: Re: sysctl In-Reply-To: <01BCBC8F.DE28EAE0@d7.dial-22.mbo.ma.ultra.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Preferred Customer wrote: > > I was looking at sysctl,h and kern_sysctl.c the other day and I was wondering why there where no predefined > > Sysctl_short() aka CTLTYPE_SHORT or > Sysctl_char() aka CTLTYPE_CHAR (note: not string seems to me that SYSCTL_INT() covers both of these. I'm using SYSCTL_INT in cases where i only need on/off values, it isn't too bad :). > > Definitions. > > It seems to me that short and char have to be at lease as worthy to be included as atomic types as quad. > Also, shouldn't there be support for octet string, as in a not necessarily print-able sequence of unsigned char (a not uncommon mib occurance) > - > g > > You could add some of this with SYSCTL_PROC fairly easily. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 17:59:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA20911 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 17:59:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA20899 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 17:59:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id KAA16153; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 10:29:26 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970909102925.21559@lemis.com> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 10:29:25 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: Brandon Gillespie , Brian Mitchell , Lutz Albers , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? References: <16482.873765629@time.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <16482.873765629@time.cdrom.com>; from Jordan K. Hubbard on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 05:40:29PM -0700 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 05:40:29PM -0700, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > Folks... I think it's time for a serious reality-check here. > > I don't think we're ever going to come to anything even *remotely* > resembling a concensus to change this, so I might respectfully suggest > that we simply kill the subject thread. /opt? Never. /local? You > gotta be kidding me. /usr/opt? Not on your life. > > See? I already hate the counter-proposals discussed so far myself, > and I'm hardly alone - there are many others here who would consider > me a real wimp for using such tame responses as "never" and "not on > your life" when they feel that "you've got to be f***ing kidding me! > No way in *hell*, man!" would be closer to the proper response to > these proposals so far. :-) > > /usr/local sucks too, sure, but at least we're used to it and people > have long experience now in administering that location. Nothing but > a painful and extended flame war would result from an actual change > here, and we'd be complete idiots to voluntarily provoke such an > outcome, so I really don't see the point in all this discussion about > it. Well, your reaction doesn't surprise me. I didn't really expect anything to change, either. But I'd hate to see us degenerate to the stage where we say "It's probably not going to happen, so let's not discuss it". Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 18:00:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA21132 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:00:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA21021 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:00:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA16720; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 17:59:46 -0700 (PDT) To: "S. Sigala" cc: Brandon Gillespie , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: My FreeBSD Wish List... In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 23:27:43 +0200." Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 17:59:46 -0700 Message-ID: <16716.873766786@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I have thought a bit more about the RPM idea; you are right, the > differences are not so much large... it is best to extend the existing > code... i will post asap in the next days > a table of differences between the two packaging system (pros and cons). Well, please do also bear in mind that the entire package installer is soon to be replaced by a completely from-scratch effort. The existing package tools, like the existing system installation tools, are *prototypes* which lived about 2 years longer than intended. ;-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 18:00:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA21178 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:00:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA21171 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:00:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id TAA21758; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:00:43 -0600 (MDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:00:43 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709090100.TAA21758@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Terry Lambert Cc: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams), brian@awfulhak.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: un-neccessary DNS lookups (was Re: Divert sockets..) In-Reply-To: <199709082235.PAA15636@usr09.primenet.com> References: <199709082214.QAA20902@rocky.mt.sri.com> <199709082235.PAA15636@usr09.primenet.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [ Reversing the order ] > > > # 192.168.1 FreeBSD netblock > > > 192.168.1.1 phaeton phaeton.lambert.org > > > > 192.168.1.1 phaeton.lambert.org phaeton > > ... > > Sean mentioned this as well. I'll try it. If it works, I'll consider > it a bug, since I want my local machines to reverse as not having a > domain qualification; the first entry is supposed to be the cannonical > name, and I want 192.168.1.1 cannonized as "phaeton". 'phaeton' is only cannonical if you aren't connected to anywhere in the world. You can consider it a bug, but I think anyone would else would consider it a feature. > Plus the default > example "localhost" entry does it in this order, too. It didn't on my box. Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 18:44:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA23191 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:44:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wong.rogerswave.ca (wong.rogerswave.ca [204.92.17.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA23113 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:43:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from wong@localhost) by wong.rogerswave.ca (8.8.7/8.7.3) id UAA00416; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:41:25 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:41:22 -0400 (EDT) From: Ken Wong X-Sender: wong@wong.rogerswave.ca Reply-To: wong@rogerswave.ca To: "Kevin P. Neal" cc: Terry Lambert , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19970907223328.008be880@mail.mindspring.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 7 Sep 1997, Kevin P. Neal wrote: > Well, the Amiga OS had a system for message transferral. You would set > up a message port. Do stuff. Then when you have nothing to do you sleep, > waiting on a signal. > > When you get a signal (because you got a message at one of your message > ports) then you wake up and check the message. > > The GUI notified you of events via just this messaging scheme. ARexx > programs could direct you to do stuff through another message port. This was > so common that most programs main loop's were just a simple > > Wait() > > Get Message() > > Copy Data Out of message > > Reply Message() > > Do Stuff() > > Loop back to Wait(). > > The File Notification scheme (useful for Terry's file browser) may have used > this messaging scheme as well (I honestly don't remember). You certainly > could be notified of disk change events (floppy insert/removal, later > removable HD change) through messages. > > Now, here's the question: How difficult would it be to do something like this? > It would take some sort of shared memory or other scheme to get the data from > one program to another. Or would that be too general? How about just a scheme > to get messages to and from the kernel? I have a kernel patch do just that. actually, it applys to alot of OS; QNX, Tandem Non-Stop Kernel, Minix. I don't know how if possible to include/commit it in the kernel tree. anyhow, If you are interested, I can send you the files. it is basically can do the following: prog A: main() { while(1) { pid = receive(pid-mask, buf); // blocked ... reply(pid, buf); } } prog B: main() { send(pid, buf); // blocked } From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 18:55:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA23848 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:55:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr07.primenet.com (tlambert@usr07.primenet.com [206.165.6.207]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA23842 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:55:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr07.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA00276; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:55:31 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709090155.SAA00276@usr07.primenet.com> Subject: Re: un-neccessary DNS lookups (was Re: Divert sockets..) To: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:55:30 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, nate@mt.sri.com, brian@awfulhak.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199709090100.TAA21758@rocky.mt.sri.com> from "Nate Williams" at Sep 8, 97 07:00:43 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Sean mentioned this as well. I'll try it. If it works, I'll consider > > it a bug, since I want my local machines to reverse as not having a > > domain qualification; the first entry is supposed to be the cannonical > > name, and I want 192.168.1.1 cannonized as "phaeton". > > 'phaeton' is only cannonical if you aren't connected to anywhere in the > world. You can consider it a bug, but I think anyone would else would > consider it a feature. No one not in "lambert.org" will see plain "phaeton". If there's a phaeton.sri.com connected, I'd see phaeton.sri.com for it. If I try to rlogin to "phaeton" and the machine I'm doing it from is in "lambert.org", I'll connect to to "phaeton.lambert.org". The only readily apparent order here is what I get *locally* for a reverse lookup of a name in my *local* hosts file. Did i mention that I'm running FTP software's TCP/IP on one of theses boxes? > > Plus the default > > example "localhost" entry does it in this order, too. > > It didn't on my box. Here is the ID line: # $Id: hosts,v 1.5 1995/04/09 09:54:39 rgrimes Exp $ # I guess if you really wanted me to upgrade this file when I upgrade the rest of the box, it wouldn't be in my /etc directory. 8-) 8-). Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 19:00:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA24185 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:00:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from adam.ist.flinders.edu.au (root@adam.ist.flinders.edu.au [129.96.1.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA24178 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:00:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (root@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au [129.96.43.66]) by adam.ist.flinders.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA12443 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:30:38 +0930 (CST) Received: from lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (doconnor@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA06125 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:30:07 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199709090200.LAA06125@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 16:06:20 MST." <199709082306.QAA05241@bubba.whistle.com> Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 11:29:57 +0930 From: "Daniel J. O'Connor" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > IMHO, the proper way to do this is to let the PPP daemon handle it > by installing a route first (so you let the routing code determine > whether packets are supposed to go over the WAN link or not, as it > should) and then checking each outgoing packet for suitability as > "demand" (not all are, e.g., NTP packets). When "demand" is seen, > it should start dialing, etc. The same "demand" test can also apply > to idle timeout calculations. This is how mpd does it, anyway. Yeah, same with ijppp, but it means you can only use those packages to do a connection, ie its not very general... (So its too bad if you have dialon demand ISDN :) Err, whats mpd do? :) Seeya Darius ~~~~~~ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 19:08:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA24536 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:08:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from adam.ist.flinders.edu.au (root@adam.ist.flinders.edu.au [129.96.1.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA24526 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:08:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (root@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au [129.96.43.66]) by adam.ist.flinders.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA12658 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:38:25 +0930 (CST) Received: from lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (doconnor@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA06585 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:38:08 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199709090208.LAA06585@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 08:19:13 +0100." <19970908081913.36000@pavilion.net> Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 11:38:05 +0930 From: "Daniel J. O'Connor" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > That's not entirely true. Is it? The 4000 had memory protection and the > same O/S. (a500 ran 68000, a4000 ran 68030/40). Nope, it had non memory protection either.. You could get VM packages if you had an MMU, but memory protection would have be _really_ hard to do :) Seeya Darius ~~~~~~ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 19:25:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA25489 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:25:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (ala-ca8-21.ix.netcom.com [207.93.141.149]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA25484 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:25:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from asami@localhost) by silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (8.8.7/8.6.9) id TAA12721; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:24:26 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:24:26 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709090224.TAA12721@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> To: andreas@klemm.gtn.com CC: hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: <19970907160423.39071@klemm.gtn.com> (message from Andreas Klemm on Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:04:23 +0200) Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? From: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk * putting the ports collection to /usr/local/ports would be cleaner, * than using /usr/ports. (1) Use a symlink or just put it anywhere you want and define PORTSDIR in /etc/make.conf. (2) Why do you send this message to "hackers"? Satoshi From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 19:36:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA26054 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:36:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA26049 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:36:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA17472; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:35:32 -0700 (PDT) To: Archie Cobbs cc: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith), doconnor@Ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 16:06:20 PDT." <199709082306.QAA05241@bubba.whistle.com> Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 19:35:32 -0700 Message-ID: <17468.873772532@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Or use mpd instead :-) Speakin-o-which, is that ever going to be integrated into FreeBSD-current, guys? ;-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 19:41:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA26225 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:41:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA26220 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:41:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id MAA04233; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:11:48 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970909121148.26417@lemis.com> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:11:48 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: "Daniel J. O'Connor" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. References: <199709082306.QAA05241@bubba.whistle.com> <199709090200.LAA06125@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709090200.LAA06125@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au>; from Daniel J. O'Connor on Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 11:29:57AM +0930 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 11:29:57AM +0930, Daniel J. O'Connor wrote: > >> IMHO, the proper way to do this is to let the PPP daemon handle it >> by installing a route first (so you let the routing code determine >> whether packets are supposed to go over the WAN link or not, as it >> should) and then checking each outgoing packet for suitability as >> "demand" (not all are, e.g., NTP packets). When "demand" is seen, >> it should start dialing, etc. The same "demand" test can also apply >> to idle timeout calculations. This is how mpd does it, anyway. > > Yeah, same with ijppp, but it means you can only use those packages to > do a connection, ie its not very general... I don't understand. Which packets do you want to use? If they're not destined for that interface, they shouldn't cause a dialup. > (So its too bad if you have dialon demand ISDN :) I don't understand this statement, either. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 19:48:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA26531 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:48:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA26525 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:48:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA17557; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:47:45 -0700 (PDT) To: Greg Lehey cc: Brandon Gillespie , Brian Mitchell , Lutz Albers , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 09 Sep 1997 10:29:25 +0930." <19970909102925.21559@lemis.com> Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 19:47:45 -0700 Message-ID: <17553.873773265@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Well, your reaction doesn't surprise me. I didn't really expect > anything to change, either. But I'd hate to see us degenerate to the > stage where we say "It's probably not going to happen, so let's not > discuss it". I think that deeming a discussion pointless because something "probably won't happen" concerning it would be short-sighted, yes. If we rejected discussion on that criteria alone, traffic in -hackers would be cut by 80%. ;-) However, this would be more of a case akin to partitioning Ireland into Protestant and Catholic factions in order to bring peace and prosperity to the region. A desperately naive and short-sighted action guaranteed only to usher in a long period of argument and bloodshed, not peace and prosperity. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 19:54:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA26858 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:54:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from adam.ist.flinders.edu.au (adam.ist.flinders.edu.au [129.96.1.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA26853 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 19:54:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (root@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au [129.96.43.66]) by adam.ist.flinders.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA14330 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:24:04 +0930 (CST) Received: from lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (doconnor@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA08793 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:23:46 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199709090253.MAA08793@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 09 Sep 1997 12:16:56 +0930." <19970909121656.54373@lemis.com> Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 12:23:43 +0930 From: "Daniel J. O'Connor" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I don't know what packages you'd want to use, but why constrain > IOW, you want to write a general dialler. How are you going to handle > the fight with the owner of the port. Err, it wouldn't matter, the 'dialer' would call the program that does the dialing.. > > Also ijppp isn't exactly the worlds best written program :) > No, but it works, and Brian is tidying it up slowly but surely. I > must try the latest version and see if it fixes my redial problems. Well it fixed mine :) Having a secrets file screws it up tho :-/ Seeya Darius ~~~~~~ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 20:02:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA27275 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:02:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from polya.blah.org (slmel11p37.ozemail.com.au [203.108.200.53]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA27266 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:02:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ada@localhost) by polya.blah.org (8.8.6/8.8.5) id NAA00648 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:02:04 +1000 (EST) From: Ada T Lim Message-Id: <199709090302.NAA00648@polya.blah.org> Subject: Re: 11 year old needs FreeBSD mentor in Arizona In-Reply-To: <199709082353.QAA16694@hub.freebsd.org> from "owner-hackers-digest@FreeBSD.ORG" at "Sep 8, 97 04:53:39 pm" To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:02:04 +1000 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL32 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > kewl!@# > > Let's convert them young so they never know the EVIL of WinBl0Wz!@# I must admit... I was running linsux when I was 11... *shudder* :) (For no other reason than the fact that 386BSD 0.1 was somewhere in the order of 15 disks, and so I didn't have time to download it.) Ada From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 20:31:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA28635 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:31:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr01.primenet.com (tlambert@usr01.primenet.com [206.165.6.201]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA28629 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:31:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr01.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA28025; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:31:11 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709090331.UAA28025@usr01.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. To: wong@rogerswave.ca Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 03:31:09 +0000 (GMT) Cc: kpneal@pobox.com, terry@lambert.olg, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Ken Wong" at Sep 8, 97 08:41:22 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I have a kernel patch do just that. actually, it applys to alot of OS; > QNX, Tandem Non-Stop Kernel, Minix. > > I don't know how if possible to include/commit it in the kernel tree. > anyhow, If you are interested, I can send you the files. > > it is basically can do the following: [ ... SYSVIPC, simplified ... ] Sex would dictate that it would be neater if it worked between threads. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 20:54:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA29725 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:54:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.com (s205m131.whistle.com [207.76.205.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA29720 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:54:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id UAA17296; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:53:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bubba.whistle.com(207.76.205.7) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma017294; Mon Sep 8 20:53:34 1997 Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.6.12) id UAA26952; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:53:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199709090353.UAA26952@bubba.whistle.com> Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-Reply-To: <19970909121148.26417@lemis.com> from Greg Lehey at "Sep 9, 97 12:11:48 pm" To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:53:34 -0700 (PDT) Cc: doconnor@ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >> IMHO, the proper way to do this is to let the PPP daemon handle it > >> by installing a route first (so you let the routing code determine > >> whether packets are supposed to go over the WAN link or not, as it > >> should) and then checking each outgoing packet for suitability as > >> "demand" (not all are, e.g., NTP packets). When "demand" is seen, > >> it should start dialing, etc. The same "demand" test can also apply > >> to idle timeout calculations. This is how mpd does it, anyway. > > > > Yeah, same with ijppp, but it means you can only use those packages to > > do a connection, ie its not very general... > > I don't understand. Which packets do you want to use? If they're not > destined for that interface, they shouldn't cause a dialup. > > > (So its too bad if you have dialon demand ISDN :) > > I don't understand this statement, either. I think what he's saying is that it would be nice to divorce the "dial-on-demand" functionality from the thing that is actually doing the dialing... you could do this with divert sockets, but it would require some sort of "api" to the PPP process not only to tell it to connect (eg, send SIGUSR1), but also to be able to determine whether the link is already up (to avoid a flood of such signals). -Archie ___________________________________________________________________________ Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 20:57:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA29876 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:57:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.com (s205m131.whistle.com [207.76.205.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA29870 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:57:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id UAA17309; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:56:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bubba.whistle.com(207.76.205.7) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma017307; Mon Sep 8 20:56:38 1997 Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.6.12) id UAA26970; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:56:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199709090356.UAA26970@bubba.whistle.com> Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-Reply-To: <199709090200.LAA06125@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au> from "Daniel J. O'Connor" at "Sep 9, 97 11:29:57 am" To: doconnor@ist.flinders.edu.au (Daniel J. O'Connor) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 20:56:38 -0700 (PDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > IMHO, the proper way to do this is to let the PPP daemon handle it > > by installing a route first (so you let the routing code determine > > whether packets are supposed to go over the WAN link or not, as it > > should) and then checking each outgoing packet for suitability as > > "demand" (not all are, e.g., NTP packets). When "demand" is seen, > > it should start dialing, etc. The same "demand" test can also apply > > to idle timeout calculations. This is how mpd does it, anyway. > Yeah, same with ijppp, but it means you can only use those packages to > do a connection, ie its not very general... > (So its too bad if you have dialon demand ISDN :) > > Err, whats mpd do? :) Mpd is basically a multi-link version of ijppp.. originally based on it but completely rewritten... there's a new version available at ftp://ftp.whistle.com/pub/archie/mpd-1.0b4.tgz Some functionality was removed, such as LQR, filtering, and terminal mode. It has a (IMHO) better scripting language though, which allows you to auto-detect the modem type, etc. -Archie ___________________________________________________________________________ Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 21:24:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA01088 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:24:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (hokkshideh.jetcafe.org [207.155.21.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA01081; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:24:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hokkshideh.jetcafe.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA06437; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:27:57 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709090427.VAA06437@hokkshideh.jetcafe.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0delta 6/3/97 To: freebsd-multimedia@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Multicast socket programming question Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 21:27:57 -0700 From: Dave Hayes Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I really don't know where else to turn to, so I'll see who can answer this one. Consider: fd = socket(AF_INET, SOCK_DGRAM, 0); ... sin.sin_addr.s_addr = ; connect(fd, (struct sockaddr *)&sin, sizeof(sin)); ... c = 0; setsockopt(fd, IPPROTO_IP, IP_MULTICAST_LOOP, &c, 1); c = 3; setsockopt(fd, IPPROTO_IP, IP_MULTICAST_TTL, &c, 1); addr = INADDR_ANY; setsockopt(fd, IPPROTO_IP, IP_MULTICAST_IF, &addr, sizeof(addr)); ... send(fd, (char*)buf, len, 0) The send() call above returns EHOSTUNREACH. UDP multicast datagrams don't connect to a host. Why is this error returned? ------ Dave Hayes - Altadena CA, USA - dave@jetcafe.org >>> The opinions expressed above are entirely my own <<< Freedom Knight of Usenet - http://www.jetcafe.org/~dave/usenet People who dream impossible dreams and strive to achieve them raise man's stature a fraction of an inch in the process, whether they win or lose. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 21:36:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA01659 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:36:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from adam.ist.flinders.edu.au (adam.ist.flinders.edu.au [129.96.1.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA01651 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:36:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bay.ist.flinders.edu.au (bay.ist.flinders.edu.au [129.96.41.68]) by adam.ist.flinders.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA17808 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:06:21 +0930 (CST) Received: from bay.ist.flinders.edu.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bay.ist.flinders.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA08966 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:06:07 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199709090436.OAA08966@bay.ist.flinders.edu.au> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 14:06:07 +0930 From: "Daniel J. O'Connor" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I think what he's saying is that it would be nice to divorce the > "dial-on-demand" functionality from the thing that is actually > doing the dialing... you could do this with divert sockets, but > it would require some sort of "api" to the PPP process not only > to tell it to connect (eg, send SIGUSR1), but also to be able to > determine whether the link is already up (to avoid a flood of > such signals). Yes, or perhaps check a file(ie /var/run/ppp0.link or something), this would make things more flexible.. (IMO) Seeya Darius ~~~~~~ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 21:38:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA01693 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:38:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au [129.78.129.109]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA01483 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:34:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dawes@localhost) by rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.2) id OAA15237; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:32:54 +1000 (EST) Message-ID: <19970909143254.52297@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:32:54 +1000 From: David Dawes To: Greg Lehey Cc: Brian McGovern , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: re: libXExExt References: <199709081323.JAA01794@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com> <19970909091022.09328@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <19970909091022.09328@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 09:10:22AM +0930 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 09:10:22AM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: >On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 09:23:18AM -0400, Brian McGovern wrote: >>> On Fri, Sep 05, 1997 at 01:18:19PM -0400, Brian McGovern wrote: >>>> Where can I find this library. >> >>> This looks like a typo to me, but I can't decide whether it's yours or >>> something that got included in your system. In any case, it's almost >>> certainly looking for libXext.. It should be in >>> /usr/X11R6/lib. >> >> It appears to be a brain seize in the ports, then. fvwm wants it, >> ddd wanted it... I've tried others, but don't remember what they were at >> the moment. I linked libXext. to libXExExt., and all is >> now working fine. The ports set I'm working with was last weeks (round >> about 9/4 or so) ports-current. > >Thanks for that. I had more or less written this off as lack of >knowledge on my part. Or is there really a libXExExt? libXExExt existed in some earlier XFree86 releases (I think 3.1.2 was the last release to include it). It was a bad idea, but unfortunately it wasn't realised just how bad until some time after it had been released. Having said that, if an Imakefile is referring to it directly, the Imakefile is broken (the fvwm 1.x Imakefile is *VERY* broken -- which I discovered when building it for Solaris 2.5.1/X11R6.3). If you have an auto-generated Makefile that refers to it, maybe it is out of date, or your imake config files are old. If you have such a Makefile that is not auto-generated, then it isn't portable when it comes to building X11 applications. This shouldn't be a run-time issue since I don't think we (XFree86) made the mistake of ever building a shared libXExExt (which would have made the bad idea even worse). David From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 21:47:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA02206 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:47:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from euthyphro.uchicago.edu (euthyphro.uchicago.edu [128.135.21.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA02197 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 21:46:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaedrus.uchicago.edu (phaedrus [128.135.21.10]) by euthyphro.uchicago.edu (8.8.6/8.8.4) with ESMTP id XAA13543; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:46:40 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from sfarrell@localhost) by phaedrus.uchicago.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA22143; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:46:33 -0500 (CDT) To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: "S. Sigala" , Brandon Gillespie , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: My FreeBSD Wish List... References: <16716.873766786@time.cdrom.com> From: stephen farrell Mime-Version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 7.89) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Date: 08 Sep 1997 23:46:33 -0500 In-Reply-To: "Jordan K. Hubbard"'s message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 17:59:46 -0700" Message-ID: <87vi0b9jrq.fsf@phaedrus.uchicago.edu> Lines: 18 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.4.64/XEmacs 19.15 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk "Jordan K. Hubbard" writes: > > I have thought a bit more about the RPM idea; you are right, the > > differences are not so much large... it is best to extend the existing > > code... i will post asap in the next days > > a table of differences between the two packaging system (pros and cons). > > Well, please do also bear in mind that the entire package installer is > soon to be replaced by a completely from-scratch effort. The existing > package tools, like the existing system installation tools, are > *prototypes* which lived about 2 years longer than intended. ;-) cool--who's working on this? is there a url with more info? -- Steve Farrell From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 22:27:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA04092 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:27:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from unix.tfs.net (root@unix.tfs.net [199.79.146.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA04087 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:27:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from argus.tfs.net (pm3-p31.tfs.net [206.154.183.223]) by unix.tfs.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA16977 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:25:53 -0500 Received: (from jbryant@localhost) by argus.tfs.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA02326 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:27:16 -0500 (CDT) From: Jim Bryant Message-Id: <199709090527.AAA02326@argus.tfs.net> Subject: upsd? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:27:14 -0500 (CDT) Reply-to: jbryant@tfs.net X-Windows: R00LZ!@# MS-Winbl0wz DR00LZ!@# X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.2-RELEASE #0: Wed Jul 9 01:01:24 CDT 1997 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk isn't there something like a "upsd" out there to handle automatic powerdown upon serial port notification of a power failure? i just came across a working 540VA UPS this weekend for $25.00 [APC 520ES] i'm guessing it's a 540VA as the 120VAC outlets on the back say 4.5A max, even though the model is the 520... it has a serial port [DB-9] on the back of it, and what looks like discrete logic on the charger/inverter board, so i'm assuming it does something like toggle the DSR/DTR, RTS/CTS, or maybe even the CD... any pointers to existing code would be great, as this came with no dox... jim -- All opinions expressed are mine, if you | "I will not be pushed, stamped, think otherwise, then go jump into turbid | briefed, debriefed, indexed, or radioactive waters and yell WAHOO !!! | numbered!" - #1, "The Prisoner" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Inet: jbryant@tfs.net AX.25: kc5vdj@wv0t.#neks.ks.usa.noam grid: EM28PW voice: KC5VDJ - 6 & 2 Meters AM/FM/SSB, 70cm FM. http://www.tfs.net/~jbryant ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ HF/6M/2M: IC-706-MkII, 2M: HTX-212, 2M: HTX-202, 70cm: HTX-404, Packet: KPC-3+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 22:40:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA04629 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:40:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA04624 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:40:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA18643; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:40:39 -0700 (PDT) To: stephen farrell cc: "S. Sigala" , Brandon Gillespie , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: My FreeBSD Wish List... In-reply-to: Your message of "08 Sep 1997 23:46:33 CDT." <87vi0b9jrq.fsf@phaedrus.uchicago.edu> Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 22:40:38 -0700 Message-ID: <18640.873783638@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Well, please do also bear in mind that the entire package installer is > > soon to be replaced by a completely from-scratch effort. The existing > > package tools, like the existing system installation tools, are > > *prototypes* which lived about 2 years longer than intended. ;-) > > cool--who's working on this? is there a url with more info? Mike Smith, Ada T Lim (as soon as she releases a working libzip :-) and myself and no, there's no URL. You'll just have to wait for the first commits to hit -current before knowing more about this. ;-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 22:42:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA04697 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:42:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA04692 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:42:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA03808; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:41:42 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:41:42 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: jbryant@tfs.net cc: Julian Elischer , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 11 year old needs FreeBSD mentor in Arizona. In-Reply-To: <199709081856.NAA01483@argus.tfs.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Damn, I wish I had a freebsd machine when I was 11 --- I would be a damn genius by now. It would be awesome to be 10 again, schools easy, your parents take care of you and you get to spend lots of long nights in your room hack freebsd (unfortunately when I was 10 I only had a trash 80) On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Jim Bryant wrote: > In reply: > > Anyone in or near Scottsdale AZ.? > > 11YO has got lost in the disk partitionning maze, and needs > > talking out.... > > > > respond to me (or at least CC me if you go direct..) > > > > julian > > kewl!@# > > Let's convert them young so they never know the EVIL of WinBl0Wz!@# > > jim > -- > All opinions expressed are mine, if you | "I will not be pushed, stamped, > think otherwise, then go jump into turbid | briefed, debriefed, indexed, or > radioactive waters and yell WAHOO !!! | numbered!" - #1, "The Prisoner" > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Inet: jbryant@tfs.net AX.25: kc5vdj@wv0t.#neks.ks.usa.noam grid: EM28PW > voice: KC5VDJ - 6 & 2 Meters AM/FM/SSB, 70cm FM. http://www.tfs.net/~jbryant > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > HF/6M/2M: IC-706-MkII, 2M: HTX-212, 2M: HTX-202, 70cm: HTX-404, Packet: KPC-3+ > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 22:44:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA04815 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:44:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA04807 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:44:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA18677; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:44:20 -0700 (PDT) To: Archie Cobbs cc: doconnor@ist.flinders.edu.au (Daniel J. O'Connor), freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, andy@icc.surw.chel.su Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 20:56:38 PDT." <199709090356.UAA26970@bubba.whistle.com> Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 22:44:20 -0700 Message-ID: <18673.873783860@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Mpd is basically a multi-link version of ijppp.. originally based > on it but completely rewritten... there's a new version available at > ftp://ftp.whistle.com/pub/archie/mpd-1.0b4.tgz > Some functionality was removed, such as LQR, filtering, and terminal > mode. It has a (IMHO) better scripting language though, which allows > you to auto-detect the modem type, etc. Cool - sounds like someone needs to update ports/net/mpd then (me just now having discovered this port after wondering how critical it would be to get mpd into -current before the next 3.0 SNAP CD goes out :-). Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 22:49:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA05091 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:49:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bcarsde4.localhost (mailgate.nortel.ca [192.58.194.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA05083 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:49:07 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709090549.WAA05083@hub.freebsd.org> Received: from bcars520.ott.bnr.ca (actually 47.128.5.188) by bcarsde4.localhost; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:48:35 -0400 Received: from bnr.ca by bcars520.bnr.ca id <21067-0@bcars520.bnr.ca>; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:48:29 -0400 Date: 09 Sep 1997 01:47 EDT To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Andrew Atrens" Subject: re:Help! keyboard lockups - could be kernel bug ? Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi again, Last week I wrote about bizarre problem I was experiencing with keyboard lockups under X. Well a week has passed and the situation has not improved despite my best efforts. Actually to be honest I'm not sure what to try next. Any pointers would be appreciated... Actually, one further clue: if I'm pounding my IDE disk ( while running xdm of course ) the keyboard will also occasionally lock up. The lock up is fairly gradual, usually starts with a single key press being missed, then a few, and then eventually ( after, say 30 seconds ) I can play `chopsticks' without effect ;) . Its almost as though the activity on the PCI bus is somehow gating the keyboard i/o... unfortunately for the keyboard its a one way trip - once its locked up its dead. One last strange observation is that, under xdm if I do a - to get back to the text-console, the background color of the screen changes from black to red. No such behaviour with good ol' startx ! Cheers, Andrew. ( opinions are mine, not Nortel's ) -- In message "Help! keyboard lockups - could be kernel bug ?", I wrote: > > Hi Folks, > > Last week I was happily running FreeBSD-2.2.2 on my Pentium system with an > ASUS T2P4 motherboard ( has PCI 430HX chipset ). But unfortunately I got > the upgrade itch, and moved up (?) to an ASUS TX97 ( has PCI 430TX chipset ). > > To make a long story short, 2.2.2 consistently locked up on boot - a real > showstopper. After much trial and error I discovered the culprit to be > AUTO_EOI_X kernel option(s). When I built a kernel without these options it > booted and appeared (initially at least) to function properly. > > Then, occasionally I noticed that my xdm login window was dropping characters > and locking up. Enough of that, so I downloaded the sources and built/installed > the August 08 3.0-SNAP. > > Xdm login was still dropping characters, so I went out and got Xfree86-3.3.1 > sources and rebuilt X. Xdm login was *still* dropping characters and > occasionally locking up the keyboard, so I began to look at this symptom more > closely. > > While the xdm login banner is displayed, I run an xlock -inroot -mode random > process in the background. Depending on how graphics/cpu intensive the > particular screen saver is, the lock up behaviour worsens. For example, the > lock ups are worse when running xlock in `galaxy' mode. > > Furthermore, if I get past the xdm login window, xterms and rxvts in my > session cause keyboard lockup when xlock is running `galaxy' in the root > window. > > So here's the strange thing: IF I DON'T RUN XDM, and instead just use startx > then the system behaves normally - no keyboard lockups regardless of how > hard I pound X. > > So what the heck is going on? -- What do I try next ? > > Any help would be appreciated :) > > Andrew > ( opinions are mine, not Nortels ) > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 22:49:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA05110 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:49:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA05090 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:49:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA03815; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:48:04 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:48:03 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: "S. Sigala" , Brandon Gillespie , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: My FreeBSD Wish List... In-Reply-To: <16716.873766786@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Whatever you do, please keep in mind that after installing a lot of us don't give a damn about package tools and we might want to compile .tgz crap off the net and stick it into /usr/local with out jumping through and package installer or registration hoops, case in point: samba, I recently upgraded to the one off the net and it likes to put itself into /usr/local/samba and then I simply put /usr/local/samba/bin into my profile --- because bye the way the one that installed with the 2.2.2 disc didn't handle the log/lock files correctly because whoever ported it changed the entire layout of its config/log files etc. which I am not saying is bad, It just doesn't work right ---- run smbstatus to demonstrate this on an install from 2.2.2 and other things ---- don't go to RPM, that's a sell out On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > I have thought a bit more about the RPM idea; you are right, the > > differences are not so much large... it is best to extend the existing > > code... i will post asap in the next days > > a table of differences between the two packaging system (pros and cons). > > Well, please do also bear in mind that the entire package installer is > soon to be replaced by a completely from-scratch effort. The existing > package tools, like the existing system installation tools, are > *prototypes* which lived about 2 years longer than intended. ;-) > > Jordan > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 22:50:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA05186 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:50:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA05179 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:50:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA03820; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:49:28 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:49:28 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Ada T Lim cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 11 year old needs FreeBSD mentor in Arizona In-Reply-To: <199709090302.NAA00648@polya.blah.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk When would that of been? On Tue, 9 Sep 1997, Ada T Lim wrote: > > kewl!@# > > > > Let's convert them young so they never know the EVIL of WinBl0Wz!@# > > I must admit... I was running linsux when I was 11... *shudder* :) > (For no other reason than the fact that 386BSD 0.1 was somewhere in the > order of 15 disks, and so I didn't have time to download it.) > > Ada > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 22:51:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA05293 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:51:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA05286 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:51:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA03832; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:50:51 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:50:51 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Ada T Lim cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 11 year old needs FreeBSD mentor in Arizona In-Reply-To: <199709090302.NAA00648@polya.blah.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have concluded that I grew up in the wrong damn era, after the computer revolution but before the internet revolution. On Tue, 9 Sep 1997, Ada T Lim wrote: > > kewl!@# > > > > Let's convert them young so they never know the EVIL of WinBl0Wz!@# > > I must admit... I was running linsux when I was 11... *shudder* :) > (For no other reason than the fact that 386BSD 0.1 was somewhere in the > order of 15 disks, and so I didn't have time to download it.) > > Ada > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 22:57:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA05621 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:57:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA05609 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:57:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA03840; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:56:50 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:56:50 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: jbryant@tfs.net cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: upsd? In-Reply-To: <199709090527.AAA02326@argus.tfs.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Might want to look at linux powerd program --- I hacked this once for a ups you can just print out the serial line statuses and see what changed when it get disconnected etc. I took apart a ups the other day and was amazed to find that it used a 12 volt battery, kind of like a motor cycle battery, I was thinking of connecting it to 4 deep cycle marine batteries in parallel to increase the time it will keep the system up. I think the marine batteries are 110 Amp hour and the ups is like 12 Amp hours. giving me like 30X the rated time on the ups. On Tue, 9 Sep 1997, Jim Bryant wrote: > isn't there something like a "upsd" out there to handle automatic > powerdown upon serial port notification of a power failure? > > i just came across a working 540VA UPS this weekend for $25.00 [APC 520ES] > > i'm guessing it's a 540VA as the 120VAC outlets on the back say 4.5A > max, even though the model is the 520... > > it has a serial port [DB-9] on the back of it, and what looks like > discrete logic on the charger/inverter board, so i'm assuming it does > something like toggle the DSR/DTR, RTS/CTS, or maybe even the CD... > > any pointers to existing code would be great, as this came with no > dox... > > jim > -- > All opinions expressed are mine, if you | "I will not be pushed, stamped, > think otherwise, then go jump into turbid | briefed, debriefed, indexed, or > radioactive waters and yell WAHOO !!! | numbered!" - #1, "The Prisoner" > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Inet: jbryant@tfs.net AX.25: kc5vdj@wv0t.#neks.ks.usa.noam grid: EM28PW > voice: KC5VDJ - 6 & 2 Meters AM/FM/SSB, 70cm FM. http://www.tfs.net/~jbryant > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > HF/6M/2M: IC-706-MkII, 2M: HTX-212, 2M: HTX-202, 70cm: HTX-404, Packet: KPC-3+ > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 22:59:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA05694 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:59:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA05688 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:59:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA03844; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:58:28 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 22:58:27 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: jbryant@tfs.net cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: upsd? In-Reply-To: <199709090527.AAA02326@argus.tfs.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Anyone have a source for upses designed to be connected to banks of batteries? I saw some somewhere but I can't remember where? From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 23:29:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA06797 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:29:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (ala-ca8-21.ix.netcom.com [207.93.141.149]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA06789 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:29:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from asami@localhost) by silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (8.8.7/8.6.9) id XAA10927; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:29:32 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:29:32 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709090629.XAA10927@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> To: ssigala@globalnet.it CC: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: (ssigala@globalnet.it) Subject: Re: My FreeBSD Wish List... From: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk * The X11 ports should not be installed in /usr/X11R6 but in the This is easy to say, but too hard to implement. As long as the X folks assume "one tree" in the Imake config files, there isn't a whole lot we can do abut it. Satoshi From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 23:32:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA07072 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:32:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.fr [193.56.58.253]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA07048 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:32:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.fr [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.8.4/8.8.4) with ESMTP id IAA12349 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:32:56 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.8.6/brasil-1.2) with UUCP id IAA24810 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:32:42 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id IAA26658; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:28:59 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19970909082859.17623@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:28:59 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: re: libXExExt References: <199709081323.JAA01794@bmcgover-pc.cisco.com> <19970909091022.09328@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76 In-Reply-To: <19970909091022.09328@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 09:10:22AM +0930 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT ctm#3592 AMD-K6 MMX @ 208 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Greg Lehey: > Thanks for that. I had more or less written this off as lack of > knowledge on my part. Or is there really a libXExExt? -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 9048 Aug 18 1996 /usr/X11R6/lib/libXExExt.a -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 43246 Jun 3 15:49 /usr/X11R6/lib/libXext.a -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 45798 Jun 3 15:49 /usr/X11R6/lib/libXext.so.6.3 Looking at the date, I'd say there was a libXExExt.a but it got incorporated into one other library. "Aug 18 1996" probably means XFree86 3.2. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: There are no limits -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 3.0-CURRENT #29: Tue Aug 26 21:05:09 CEST 1997 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 23:33:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA07128 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:33:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA07121 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:33:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by mail.cdsnet.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id XAA24027 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:33:12 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:33:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Jaye Mathisen To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: How the heck do you drop DTR? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Taking my ppp problem /modem interaction to its illogical extreme, I hacked up a simple modem dialler test system under perl5. It works OK, after having to define some constants like CCTS_IFLOW and CRTS_OFLOW that for some reason the POSIX module for perl5 doesn't define. However, for the life of me, I can't figure out how to actually drop DTR. I thought closing the file handle would do it, but it doesn't, after my program exits, the modem is still on-line, and DTR is still asserted. I've looked through the termios.h include file, and can't even find any kind of constant that may have something to do with it. getty didn't show anything obvious. revoke() doesn't look right. I can't find any docs on a function called vhangup(), or at least, no man page. Looking at the source for ppp, there's something in a HangupModem() function about setting the baud rate to 0. It looks like this does the trick, but I'm not sure it's the "right" way to do it. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 23:35:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA07409 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:35:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ivcs.dtcom.dp.ua (ivcs.dtcom.dp.ua [194.93.185.36]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA07157; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:33:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from serg@localhost) by ivcs.dtcom.dp.ua (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA00337; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 09:28:42 +0300 (EEST) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.0 [p0] on FreeBSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199709082133.OAA09929@usr09.primenet.com> Date: Mon, 09 Sep 1996 09:27:24 +0300 (EEST) Organization: IVC OPES "Dniprotelecom" From: Chorny Sergey Ivanovich To: Terry Lambert Subject: Re: Do you have some neat configuration files? Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, (Greg Lehey) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On 08-Sep-97 Terry Lambert wrote: >> The background is the second edition of "The Complete FreeBSD", in >> which I'm trying to improve the introduction to FreeBSD for people >> who've never used UNIX before (or even for those who've used a >> different version). > >[ ... ] > >> Any other suggestions? > >fvwm95. > >Graphical logins. > >Other Windows95-type crap. > KDE - non comercial CDE(www.kde.org) . When try make use gmake . > > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org >--- >Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present >or previous employers. ---------------------------------- E-Mail: Chorny Sergey Ivanovich Date: 09-Sep-96 Time: 09:27:24 This message was sent by XFMail ---------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 23:36:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA07552 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:36:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hydrogen.nike.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA07537 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:36:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.nike.efn.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA05247; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:35:56 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970908233556.55337@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:35:56 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: "Daniel J. O'Connor" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. References: <19970909121656.54373@lemis.com> <199709090253.MAA08793@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709090253.MAA08793@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au>; from Daniel J. O'Connor on Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 12:23:43PM +0930 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Daniel J. O'Connor scribbled this message on Sep 9: > > > > I don't know what packages you'd want to use, but why constrain > > IOW, you want to write a general dialler. How are you going to handle > > the fight with the owner of the port. > Err, it wouldn't matter, the 'dialer' would call the program that does > the dialing.. hmm... sounds like a REALLY good use for the disc device.. :) just configure the disc device, then somehow have the ppp/dialer either down the disc, or handle the routing info in the dialer... -- John-Mark Gurney Modem/FAX: +1 541 683 6954 Cu Networking Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 23:42:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA08662 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:42:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from awfulhak.demon.co.uk (awfulhak.demon.co.uk [158.152.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA08646 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:42:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lan.awfulhak.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by awfulhak.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA09296; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 07:29:23 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199709090629.HAA09296@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Terry Lambert cc: brian@awfulhak.org (Brian Somers), nate@mt.sri.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: un-neccessary DNS lookups (was Re: Divert sockets..) In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 23:35:40 -0000." <199709082335.QAA20128@usr09.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 07:29:23 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > # localhost > > > > 127.0.0.1 localhost localhost.lambert.org > > > > > > I know this sounds silly, but if you reverse the order of the hosts > > > file, does it make any difference? > > > > > > 127.0.0.1 localhost.lambert.org localhost > > > > > > ... > > > > # 192.168.1 FreeBSD netblock > > > > 192.168.1.1 phaeton phaeton.lambert.org > > > > > > 192.168.1.1 phaeton.lambert.org phaeton > > > ... > > > > Strange.... OpenBSD gets this wrong by default (the way Terry has it). > > Ugh. Here's why: > > When I say "w" or "who", I want it to say "phaeton" not > "phaeton.lambert.org". I know I'm in "lambert.org". I want to be able > to see at a glance local domain vs. extra-local domain logins to my > system. > > I also want to be able to make a sed script to kill of extra-local > logins, if I want, without having to have the thing parse resolv.conf. > > The order I have them in is identical to the example i the FreeBSD > distributed /etc/hosts file for "localhost". > > This should be *irrelevant*. The only purpose order on a line in > the hosts file should have is determining which entry is reported > as the cannoical name to things that display cannonical names. > > Like "w". Hmm, 'w' or 'who' should be smart enough to chop off the domain bit if it's the same as hostname's. netstat does this. > Sheesh. > > > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org > --- > Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present > or previous employers. -- Brian , Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 23:42:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA08762 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:42:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from awfulhak.demon.co.uk (awfulhak.demon.co.uk [158.152.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA08744 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:42:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lan.awfulhak.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by awfulhak.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA09337; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 07:35:29 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199709090635.HAA09337@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: "Daniel J. O'Connor" cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 09 Sep 1997 12:23:43 +0930." <199709090253.MAA08793@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 07:35:29 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > I don't know what packages you'd want to use, but why constrain > > IOW, you want to write a general dialler. How are you going to handle > > the fight with the owner of the port. > Err, it wouldn't matter, the 'dialer' would call the program that does > the dialing.. > > > > Also ijppp isn't exactly the worlds best written program :) > > No, but it works, and Brian is tidying it up slowly but surely. I > > must try the latest version and see if it fixes my redial problems. > Well it fixed mine :) > > Having a secrets file screws it up tho :-/ In what way ? > Seeya > Darius > ~~~~~~ -- Brian , Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 23:43:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA08904 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:43:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from awfulhak.demon.co.uk (awfulhak.demon.co.uk [158.152.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA08879 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:43:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lan.awfulhak.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by awfulhak.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA09323; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 07:34:00 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199709090634.HAA09323@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: Archie Cobbs , mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith), doconnor@Ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 19:35:32 PDT." <17468.873772532@time.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 07:34:00 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Or use mpd instead :-) > > Speakin-o-which, is that ever going to be integrated into > FreeBSD-current, guys? ;-) It's a port (I think offhand that satoshi did the honours). I *still* plan to make it a part of ppp. The ppp code is a bit saner than it was when archie picked it up, looked at it and threw most of it away :-) > Jordan -- Brian , Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 23:48:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA10057 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:48:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA10020 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:48:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id QAA07625; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:18:07 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970909161806.61675@lemis.com> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:18:06 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: jbryant@tfs.net Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: upsd? References: <199709090527.AAA02326@argus.tfs.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709090527.AAA02326@argus.tfs.net>; from Jim Bryant on Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 12:27:14AM -0500 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 12:27:14AM -0500, Jim Bryant wrote: > isn't there something like a "upsd" out there to handle automatic > powerdown upon serial port notification of a power failure? Try picking up ftp://ftp.ww.net/pub/wildwind/upsd/. It's in the Ukraine, and last time I tried, it was down. > i just came across a working 540VA UPS this weekend for $25.00 [APC 520ES] Sounds good. At that price, I'd expect the batteries to be less than 100%, but I suppose you could find some more somewhere. > i'm guessing it's a 540VA as the 120VAC outlets on the back say 4.5A > max, even though the model is the 520... Don't count on that too much. It depends on the phase of the load. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 23:48:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA10138 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:48:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from adam.ist.flinders.edu.au (root@adam.ist.flinders.edu.au [129.96.1.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA10066 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:48:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (root@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au [129.96.43.66]) by adam.ist.flinders.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA22187 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:18:25 +0930 (CST) Received: from lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (doconnor@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA19339 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:18:05 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199709090648.QAA19339@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 23:44:09 MST." <19970908234409.49021@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 16:18:02 +0930 From: "Daniel J. O'Connor" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > hmm... sounds like a REALLY good use for the disc device.. :) > > Disc device? Never heard of it.. > > What's it do? > it's a discard device... disc(4) is a network device that throws away all > packets... that way you can have the interface "up" and trigger a > dial.. but not have to have a complex interface... Ahh, neat.. pitty it actually throws them away.. Tho what I could do is check the destination(in the program which uses divert sockets), and if its disc, then it stores them until the 'real' link goes up.. Eww, hacky =) Seeya Darius ~~~~~~ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 23:51:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA10740 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:51:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hotmail.com (F9.hotmail.com [207.82.250.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA10735 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:51:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 13092 invoked by uid 0); 9 Sep 1997 06:50:33 -0000 Message-ID: <19970909065033.13090.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 192.86.155.91 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 08 Sep 1997 23:50:33 PDT X-Originating-IP: [192.86.155.91] From: "Suresh Mali" To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Fwd: Posix thread support Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 23:50:33 PDT Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I am reposting the questions since I didn't get answer to any of the questions Thanks Suresh -------------- > >Hi, > >I want to find out is the posix thread in FreeBSD-2.2.2. REALESE is >stable? > >Are all libraries are thread safe? > >If yes then > >cd /usr/src/lib/libc_r; make all && make install > >will Install all corect thread safe libraries or anything else required? > >Is pthread packege 100 % posix thread complient or anything missing? > > >Thanks in advance! >Suresh. > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Sep 8 23:55:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA11592 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:55:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA11587 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:55:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA22446; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:54:59 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709090654.XAA22446@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: un-neccessary DNS lookups (was Re: Divert sockets..) To: brian@awfulhak.org (Brian Somers) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 06:54:58 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, brian@awfulhak.org, nate@mt.sri.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199709090629.HAA09296@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> from "Brian Somers" at Sep 9, 97 07:29:23 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > This should be *irrelevant*. The only purpose order on a line in > > the hosts file should have is determining which entry is reported > > as the cannoical name to things that display cannonical names. > > > > Like "w". > > Hmm, 'w' or 'who' should be smart enough to chop off the domain bit > if it's the same as hostname's. netstat does this. Well, I suppose I could burn the CPU cycles on that instead of having the machine do real work... 8-(. Just seems wasteful and annoying. Maybe if the lookup routines did it for me, since they are already grovelling the strings to hell and back... Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 00:02:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA13156 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:02:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from adam.ist.flinders.edu.au (root@adam.ist.flinders.edu.au [129.96.1.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA13139 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:02:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (root@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au [129.96.43.66]) by adam.ist.flinders.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA22107 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:16:31 +0930 (CST) Received: from lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (doconnor@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA19226 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:16:13 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199709090646.QAA19226@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 09 Sep 1997 07:35:29 +0100." <199709090635.HAA09337@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 16:16:10 +0930 From: "Daniel J. O'Connor" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Having a secrets file screws it up tho :-/ > In what way ? Well, when I added a screts file enrty for my machine(so I could telnet to port 3000), it seemed to not read the /etc/ppp/ppp.conf file, and so none of my dial strings got read :-/ I'm pretty sure I have my config files set up OK too :-( Seeya Darius ~~~~~~ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 00:03:12 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA13329 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:03:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA13276; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:02:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id QAA07670; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:32:50 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970909163248.43041@lemis.com> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:32:48 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Satoshi Asami Cc: FreeBSD Questions , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: /: file system is full References: <19970909085107.25727@lemis.com> <199709090659.XAA18299@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709090659.XAA18299@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU>; from Satoshi Asami on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 11:59:37PM -0700 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 11:59:37PM -0700, Satoshi Asami wrote: > * The other alternative is, of course, to recommend a 45 MB root slice. > * There's nothing so holy about /compat that it *should* be in the root > * slice, but I don't like gratuituous symlinks either. I'm copying > > IIRC, someone mentioned that /compat might be needed at startup before > mounting anything, and that is the reason why it is in /. Sure, that's the classical reason for putting something in /. But I can't see that we're going to need Linux programs before /usr is mounted. > OTOH, this question seems to come up quite often and is quite a thorn > on our collective sides. I would love to see it moved to > ${PREFIX}/compat (where I suspect it lives on most people's machines > anyway) if that is only a case of vast minority. The worst problem I could see with that would be the transition. I'm copying -hackers; what do you guys think? (Ducks until Jordan's answer has died down :-) Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 00:18:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA16921 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:18:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from superior.mooseriver.com (dynamic22.pm02.sf1.best.com [206.184.197.54]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA16812 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:18:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgrosch@localhost) by superior.mooseriver.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id AAA07594; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:16:49 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970909001648.33021@mooseriver.com> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:16:48 -0700 From: Josef Grosch To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: upsd? Reply-To: jgrosch@superior.mooseriver.com References: <199709090527.AAA02326@argus.tfs.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79 In-Reply-To: ; from Jamil J. Weatherbee on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 10:58:27PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 10:58:27PM -0700, Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > > > Anyone have a source for upses designed to be connected to banks of > batteries? I saw some somewhere but I can't remember where? > > > I have placed a copy of upsd in the incoming directory on ftp.freebsd.org (ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/incoming). This is the copy I pulled from Wild Wind several months ago. Their connection to the Internet seems to be toubled. This copy is _VERY_ incomplete. Josef -- Josef Grosch | Another day closer to a | FreeBSD 2.2.2 jgrosch@MooseRiver.com | Micro$oft free world | UNIX for the masses From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 00:23:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA17843 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:23:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from micron.efn.org (d198-232.uoregon.edu [128.223.198.232]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA17823 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:23:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mini@localhost) by micron.efn.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA02806; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:23:09 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970909002308.22200@micron.efn.org> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:23:08 -0700 From: Jonathan Mini To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: ahhh... src/release/Makefile. Reply-To: Jonathan Mini Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e X-files: The Truth is Out There. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As an entertaining digression, src/release/Makefile is 666 lines long. -- Jonathan Mini (j_mini@efn.org) Ingenious Productions Software Development P.O. Box 5693 Eugene, Or 97405 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 00:33:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA19846 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:33:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA19823 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:33:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (lot.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [203.20.121.21]) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA29872 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:03:42 +0930 (CST) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA01242; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:55:20 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709090655.QAA01242@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , "S. Sigala" , Brandon Gillespie , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: My FreeBSD Wish List... In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 22:48:03 MST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 16:55:19 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Whatever you do, please keep in mind that after installing a lot of us > don't give a damn about package tools and we might want to compile .tgz > crap off the net and stick it into /usr/local with out jumping through and > package installer or registration hoops, We respect your right to shoot yourself in the foot. However, if your .tgz crap is smart enough to use "install", then all it will take is for you to set a couple of environment variables and stuff will be automagically shadowed and registered. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 00:34:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA19915 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:34:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA19903 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:34:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id RAA07910; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:03:55 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970909170354.43104@lemis.com> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:03:54 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Jaye Mathisen Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How the heck do you drop DTR? References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: ; from Jaye Mathisen on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 11:33:12PM -0700 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 11:33:12PM -0700, Jaye Mathisen wrote: > > However, for the life of me, I can't figure out how to actually drop > DTR. > > Looking at the source for ppp, there's something in a HangupModem() > function about setting the baud rate to 0. It looks like this > does the trick, but I'm not sure it's the "right" way to do it. I suppose it's a matter for discussion (are you listening, Terry?) as to whether it's the "right" way to do it, but that's the way it's done. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 00:37:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA20665 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:37:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA20612 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 00:37:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id IAA18398 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:26:57 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199709090626.IAA18398@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: interrupts in interrupt routines To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:26:57 +0200 (MET DST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Excuse my ignorance... am I correct in assuming that within an interrupt driver interrupst are masked according to the imask declared in the config line ? e.g. device pcm0 at isa? tty ... vectpr pcmintr results in pcmintr() being called at spltty ? Cheers Luigi From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 01:04:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA26873 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:04:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hydrogen.nike.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA26783 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:03:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.nike.efn.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA20756; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:03:43 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970909010342.45615@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:03:42 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: Jaye Mathisen Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How the heck do you drop DTR? References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: ; from Jaye Mathisen on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 11:33:12PM -0700 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jaye Mathisen scribbled this message on Sep 8: > > Taking my ppp problem /modem interaction to its illogical extreme, I > hacked up a simple modem dialler test system under perl5. > > It works OK, after having to define some constants like CCTS_IFLOW and > CRTS_OFLOW that for some reason the POSIX module for perl5 doesn't define. > > However, for the life of me, I can't figure out how to actually drop > DTR. > > I thought closing the file handle would do it, but it doesn't, after > my program exits, the modem is still on-line, and DTR is still > asserted. wierd... assuming that all file descriptors to the modem is closed, DTR should drop... > I've looked through the termios.h include file, and can't even find > any kind of constant that may have something to do with it. what you need to do is set the speed to B0.. this will tell the modem to stop asserting DTR... > Looking at the source for ppp, there's something in a HangupModem() > function about setting the baud rate to 0. It looks like this > does the trick, but I'm not sure it's the "right" way to do it. yup.. this is the right way to do it... a bit of useful information from Advanced Programming in the Unix Environment (Stevens): "The constant B) means "hangup." When B0 is specified as the output baud rate when tcsetattr is called, the modem control lines are no longer asserted." ttyl.. -- John-Mark Gurney Modem/FAX: +1 541 683 6954 Cu Networking Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 01:14:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA29046 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:14:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (ala-ca32-19.ix.netcom.com [199.35.209.83]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA29028 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:14:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from asami@localhost) by silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (8.8.7/8.6.9) id BAA19512; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:13:46 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:13:46 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709090813.BAA19512@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> To: dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au CC: grog@lemis.com, bmcgover@cisco.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: <19970909143254.52297@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> (message from David Dawes on Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:32:54 +1000) Subject: Re: re: libXExExt From: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk * Having said that, if an Imakefile is referring to it directly, the * Imakefile is broken (the fvwm 1.x Imakefile is *VERY* broken -- which fvwm built fine during my last package tree build two weeks ago, so it is fine. It should be the user's Imake config files. * This shouldn't be a run-time issue since I don't think we (XFree86) * made the mistake of ever building a shared libXExExt (which would have made * the bad idea even worse). That is my recollection also. Satoshi From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 01:34:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA03564 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:34:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA03555 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:34:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA26536; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:34:14 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709090834.BAA26536@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. To: archie@whistle.com (Archie Cobbs) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:34:13 +0000 (GMT) Cc: grog@lemis.com, doconnor@ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709090353.UAA26952@bubba.whistle.com> from "Archie Cobbs" at Sep 8, 97 08:53:34 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I think what he's saying is that it would be nice to divorce the > "dial-on-demand" functionality from the thing that is actually > doing the dialing... you could do this with divert sockets, but > it would require some sort of "api" to the PPP process not only > to tell it to connect (eg, send SIGUSR1), but also to be able to > determine whether the link is already up (to avoid a flood of > such signals). Hey! You just invented a transient demand-based serial LLC! We can call it "TDS". 8-) 8-). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 01:36:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA04130 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:36:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA04113 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:36:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA26781; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:36:41 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709090836.BAA26781@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Help! keyboard lockups - could be kernel bug ? To: atrens@nortel.ca (Andrew Atrens) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:36:40 +0000 (GMT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709090549.WAA05083@hub.freebsd.org> from "Andrew Atrens" at Sep 9, 97 01:47:00 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Last week I wrote about bizarre problem I was experiencing with keyboard > lockups under X. Well a week has passed and the situation has not improved > despite my best efforts. Actually to be honest I'm not sure what to try > next. Any pointers would be appreciated... > > Actually, one further clue: if I'm pounding my IDE disk ( while running xdm > of course ) the keyboard will also occasionally lock up. The lock up is > fairly gradual, usually starts with a single key press being missed, then > a few, and then eventually ( after, say 30 seconds ) I can play `chopsticks' > without effect ;) . Its almost as though the activity on the PCI bus is > somehow gating the keyboard i/o... unfortunately for the keyboard its a > one way trip - once its locked up its dead. Somone else was reporting serial port lockups when they were hitting their IDE drive hard. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 01:38:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA04732 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:38:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lucia.shanghai.rightiming.com ([202.96.201.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA04670 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:38:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from zsd@localhost) by lucia.shanghai.rightiming.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA25451 for FreeBSD-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:24:42 +0800 Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:24:42 +0800 From: Zhou-shangde Message-Id: <199709090824.QAA25451@lucia.shanghai.rightiming.com> To: FreeBSD-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk hi, im good at BSD unix & hacker. -ZSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 01:53:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA08441 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:53:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA08405 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:53:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (lot.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [203.20.121.21]) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id SAA00673 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 18:23:17 +0930 (CST) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA01536; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 18:19:09 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709090819.SAA01536@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: John-Mark Gurney cc: Jaye Mathisen , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How the heck do you drop DTR? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 09 Sep 1997 01:03:42 MST." <19970909010342.45615@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 18:19:03 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I thought closing the file handle would do it, but it doesn't, after > > my program exits, the modem is still on-line, and DTR is still > > asserted. > > wierd... assuming that all file descriptors to the modem is closed, > DTR should drop... Not necessarily; was the port in drainwait? (ie. had output data that couldn't be sent?) mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 01:57:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA09482 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:57:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tyree.iii.co.uk (tyree.iii.co.uk [193.117.77.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA09430 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 01:57:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from carrig.strand.iii.co.uk (carrig.strand.iii.co.uk [192.168.7.25]) by tyree.iii.co.uk (8.8.4/8.8.4) with ESMTP id JAA20853; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 09:54:06 +0100 (BST) Received: (from nik@localhost) by carrig.strand.iii.co.uk (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA09649; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 09:59:24 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <19970909095924.27872@strand.iii.co.uk> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 09:59:24 +0100 From: nik@iii.co.uk To: Ted Faber Cc: hcremean@vt.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape Communicator 4.02b7 References: <19970908192505.05681@wakky.dyn.ml.org> <199709082342.AA25944@zephyr.isi.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76e In-Reply-To: <199709082342.AA25944@zephyr.isi.edu>; from Ted Faber on Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 04:42:10PM -0800 Organization: interactive investor Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 04:42:10PM -0800, Ted Faber wrote: > >Have they cleared up any of the weirdness with SIGFPE? (What I mean is that > >I notice my copy of 4.02b7 likes to hang when it exits...an investigation > >with GDB showed that it was SIGFPE'ing, then continuing, then doing it > >again, over and over, in a loop that eats all my CPU. I have to kill -9 it > >to make it go away.) > > I haven't seen that problem on either of my boxes, but I didn't see it > with 4.02b7 either so my data point is of dubious value. I have. I did some testing, and narrowed it down to: - Every time I exited NS by selecting "File -> Exit" from one of the open windows (typically > 5) it would hang, and send the system load up. - If, instead, I went to each window and hit "Alt+W" to kill the window, and then "Alt+Q" in the last window to kill it, it went away nicely. This happened consistently. It's quite bizarre. I'm now playing around with the 4.03b8 Navigator standalone, to see if it shows the same behaviour. N -- --+==[ Nik Clayton is Just Another Perl Hacker at Interactive Investor ]==+-- Diana, the roadkill formally known as Princess, 1961-1997 NC5-RIPE From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 02:10:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA12546 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 02:10:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr09.primenet.com (tlambert@usr09.primenet.com [206.165.6.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA12522 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 02:10:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA27827; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 02:10:31 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709090910.CAA27827@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: How the heck do you drop DTR? To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 09:10:30 +0000 (GMT) Cc: mrcpu@cdsnet.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970909170354.43104@lemis.com> from "Greg Lehey" at Sep 9, 97 05:03:54 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > However, for the life of me, I can't figure out how to actually drop > > DTR. > > > > Looking at the source for ppp, there's something in a HangupModem() > > function about setting the baud rate to 0. It looks like this > > does the trick, but I'm not sure it's the "right" way to do it. > > I suppose it's a matter for discussion (are you listening, Terry?) as > to whether it's the "right" way to do it, but that's the way it's > done. Setting the baud rate to 0 is the traditionally correct way to drop DTR. In System V. And we all know how much like System V we want BSD to be... even when System V has good ideas (unlike that one). Closing the port will work too, since DTR is asserted by the open on non-CLOCAL devices (and on CLOCAL devices because we have to accommodate incompetence in hardware design). You have to do that anyway, because stupid drivers can't talk to a port without being reopened after an on-to-off DCD transition has occured. But this is justifiable, because of the oft-cited and never questioned reference: "no good reason". Depending on the DTR to be dropped "long enough" to reset the modem and have it be done resetting is another matter. Traditionally, you would "sleep(2);" before setting the baud back or reopening the port, to get >1 - <3 seconds of DTR drop. According to Bell 103C and Bell 212A ("Technical Aspects of Data Communications", McNeely, Digital Press, ISBN: i_forgot_it), the "signal break" time is supposed to be sufficient: 250ms. But many cheap modems are in violation of the standards, and take more than 250ms to fully reset as if powered of-then-on on DTR drop, like they are supposed to... so "sleep(2);" should probably not be replaced with the shorter delay of a "usleep()" call, for fear of allowing those of us who buy good hardware to run at a reasonably responsive speed. FreeBSD supposedly tries to do the responsive delay for you, but you probably need the "sleep()" call anyway, since you are probably in on the "make the good hardware run as badly as the bad hardware so the people who bought it don't cry" conspiracy. If you look at /usr/include/sys/ttycom.h, you will see TIOCCDTR and TIOCSDTR. BSD would traditionally allow you to toggle DTR this way. But now "POSIX knows best" says we should all use the kludge of setting the baud to 0 (back in the "BerkNet" days, this meant "use the external RS232 clock that Intel was too stupid to implement for their supposedly RS232C standards compliant UARTS"). God knows how POSIX wants you to get a signal vs. a non-signal "BREAK" (103C defines 250ms of break as a line disconnect request, and less than that as a signal break. The difference is, one hangs up the line and the other sends a break to the remote machine. VT100's get this right: the break is asserted for as long as you hold the break key -- all hail DEC!). Most modern modems ignore long breaks, in violation of 103C and 212A, because modem designers are idiots. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 02:17:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA14308 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 02:17:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ot.stpn.soft.net (freebie.opentech.stpn.soft.net [204.143.126.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id CAA14270; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 02:16:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from andes (andes.opentech.stpn.soft.net [204.143.126.66]) by ot.stpn.soft.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id OAA10597; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:50:06 +0530 Message-ID: <3415A705.96635908@opentech.stpn.soft.net> Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 14:44:05 -0500 From: Prashant Dongre Reply-To: pdongre@opentech.stpn.soft.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Greg Lehey CC: Satoshi Asami , FreeBSD Questions , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: /: file system is full X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <19970909085107.25727@lemis.com> <199709090659.XAA18299@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> <19970909163248.43041@lemis.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Greg Lehey wrote: > On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 11:59:37PM -0700, Satoshi Asami wrote: > > * The other alternative is, of course, to recommend a 45 MB root slice. > > * There's nothing so holy about /compat that it *should* be in the root > > * slice, but I don't like gratuituous symlinks either. I'm copying > > > > IIRC, someone mentioned that /compat might be needed at startup before > > mounting anything, and that is the reason why it is in /. > > Sure, that's the classical reason for putting something in /. But I > can't see that we're going to need Linux programs before /usr is > mounted. > > > OTOH, this question seems to come up quite often and is quite a thorn > > on our collective sides. I would love to see it moved to > > ${PREFIX}/compat (where I suspect it lives on most people's machines > > anyway) if that is only a case of vast minority. > > The worst problem I could see with that would be the transition. I'm > copying -hackers; what do you guys think? > > (Ducks until Jordan's answer has died down :-) > Greg I am also having the same problem...... Can some of you throw light on this why and how can I overcome this..... Sorry for not giving attention to this thread from the beginning...... Prashant. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 02:25:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA16708 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 02:25:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA16689 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 02:25:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id SAA08343; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 18:55:09 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970909185509.62821@lemis.com> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 18:55:09 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Terry Lambert Cc: mrcpu@cdsnet.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How the heck do you drop DTR? References: <19970909170354.43104@lemis.com> <199709090910.CAA27827@usr09.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709090910.CAA27827@usr09.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 09:10:30AM +0000 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 09:10:30AM +0000, Terry Lambert wrote: >>> However, for the life of me, I can't figure out how to actually drop >>> DTR. >>> >>> Looking at the source for ppp, there's something in a HangupModem() >>> function about setting the baud rate to 0. It looks like this >>> does the trick, but I'm not sure it's the "right" way to do it. >> >> I suppose it's a matter for discussion (are you listening, Terry?) as >> to whether it's the "right" way to do it, but that's the way it's >> done. Thanks, Terry, I knew you wouldn't let us down :-) > Setting the baud rate to 0 is the traditionally correct way to drop > DTR. In System V. And before. From the UNIX Programmer's Manual, Seventh Edition (tty(4)): B0 0 hang up dataphone The System V difference was STREAMS instead of the old terminal driver, as I'm sure I don't have to tell you. > And we all know how much like System V we want BSD to be... even > when System V has good ideas (unlike that one). Was there ever any other way of doing it on an open fd? > Most modern modems ignore long breaks, in violation of 103C and > 212A, because modem designers are idiots. That'll be right. One day, when I have time, remind me about the story of the IBM junior thugs and their start-stop terminal (3101? I forget). Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 03:21:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA29249 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 03:21:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from polya.blah.org (slmel4p61.ozemail.com.au [203.108.201.149]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA29234 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 03:21:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ada@localhost) by polya.blah.org (8.8.6/8.8.5) id UAA00803 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 20:21:18 +1000 (EST) From: Ada T Lim Message-Id: <199709091021.UAA00803@polya.blah.org> Subject: Re: hackers-digest V3 #332 In-Reply-To: <199709090719.AAA16953@hub.freebsd.org> from "owner-hackers-digest@FreeBSD.ORG" at "Sep 9, 97 00:19:04 am" To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 20:21:18 +1000 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL32 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Mike Smith, Ada T Lim (as soon as she releases a working libzip :-) It works! It works! it just randomly produces files with 50k of garbage in them :( Ada From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 07:14:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA10878 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 07:14:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from relay.Germany.EU.net (relay.germany.eu.net [192.76.144.64]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA10864 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 07:14:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Bernard.Steiner@de.uu.net Received: from qwerty.germany.eu.net [193.96.65.12] by relay.Germany.EU.net with SMTP (5.61c:012/2.7.0.l-relay) id QAA24791; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:12:24 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199709091414.QAA12742@qwerty.de.uu.net> Received: from qwerty.Germany.EU.net by qwerty.de.uu.net with ESMTP (8.6.4/UUNETdeLAN-2.1a16-1.2.10) via EUnet for [mail.de.uu.net] id QAA12742; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:14:23 +0200 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: lpt ECS support. Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 16:14:18 +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi folks, forgive me if this is an inappropriate mailing list (do give me a pointer) - I have recently hacked up the 2.2.2 i386/isa/lpt driver to provide basic support for some advanced features of the ECP parallel port that comes with my motherboard, currently including - re-vectoring of lpt interrupt - use of the ECP fifo for "fast centronics" printing (both polled and IRQ) - use of the ECP DMA channel (including auto-vectoring) to the ECP fifo for "fast centronics" printing (IRQ only) - ioctls to en/disable above, including hacked up lptcontrol I'd like to know whether anybody (a) is interested in this, if so, where to send it (b) knows about a way to poll for DMA finished situations such that DMA polled mode may work (c) is working on integration of lpt as a proper tty (and get the if_lp stuff out of lpt.c) to eventually allowing ieee1284 compliant lptread(). I looked at sio.c and find siopoll() rather confusing... Ta Bernard Bernard Steiner, UUNET Deutschland GmbH, vox +49 231 972 00 Emil-Figge-Str. 80, D-44227 Dortmund, Germany fax +49 231 972 1111 Bernard.Steiner@de.uu.net >>Fast alle Raucherinnen sind weiblich.<< PGP 0x1D7C589D fingerprint 57 50 3A C1 95 71 5B 37 3A 7D B3 D0 5F 1F 60 36 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 07:23:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA11409 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 07:23:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from innocence.interface-business.de (innocence.interface-business.de [193.101.57.202]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA11397 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 07:23:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ida.interface-business.de (ida.interface-business.de [193.101.57.203]) by innocence.interface-business.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA19587; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:22:32 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by ida.interface-business.de (8.8.7/8.7.3) id QAA01870; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:22:37 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970909162235.DF18120@ida.interface-business.de> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:22:35 +0200 From: j@ida.interface-business.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: handy@sag.space.lockheed.com (Brian N. Handy) Subject: Re: Tape question References: <19970907103022.YU02721@uriah.heep.sax.de> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-31809-14 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Organization: interface business GmbH, Dresden Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@interface-business.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <19970907103022.YU02721@uriah.heep.sax.de>; from J Wunsch on Sep 7, 1997 10:30:23 +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I once wrote: > This must be a problem with the Exabyte then. It works fine for me, > with a Tandberg TDC4222, and a QIC-525 cartridge (QIC-150, of course, > doesn't work since it's fixed-length blocking). I've verified with this test program that it works on a DAT drive as well, with the ahc(4) driver in this case (and on 2.2-stable). -- J"org Wunsch Unix support engineer joerg_wunsch@interface-business.de http://www.interface-business.de/~j From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 07:41:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA12506 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 07:41:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pds-gateway.pdspc.com ([207.7.39.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA12498 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 07:41:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by pds-gateway.pdspc.com with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1457.3) id ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 09:42:56 -0500 Message-ID: <91DD7FDA88E4D011BED00000C0DD87E70BE975@pds-gateway.pdspc.com> From: Kenny Hanson To: "'Josef Karthauser'" Cc: "FreeBSD Hackers (E-mail)" Subject: RE: FTP compromise. Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 09:42:54 -0500 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1457.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I just successfully shot my cpu utilization up to 100% without any hopes of seeing it come down. I had to kill the ftp process before the system returned to a normal state. This is definitely D.O.S... anybody out there have any ideas on how to erradicate this? I ran this for 15 minutes before I had to stop because it is on a production server... > -----Original Message----- > From: Josef Karthauser [SMTP:joe@pavilion.net] > Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 1997 8:44 AM > To: security@FreeBSD.ORG > Subject: FTP compromise. > > ll versions) > > TESTED: BSDI 3.0 (all patches), FreeBSD 2.2.1 > > DATE: 15th Aug 1997 > > REPEAT BY: Log into a wu_ftp server (either anonymously or as a > user) > and issue the command... > > nlist > ../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/ > > ../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/ > > ../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/ > ../*/../*/../*/../*/../*../*../* > > DESCRIPTION: You can severly compromise the ftp servers > performance. > This command will create a HUGE directory listing, no > matter how many files/directories are in the current > directory (this is recursive). > > CONSEQUENCES: These vary. On my FreeBSD 2.2 box I was able to eat > up > all memory and swap memory until the kernel spewed > "out of swap space" errors and killed a few processes. > It also eats up all available CPU space (up to 99.22% > on my box). If repeated a few times you will no > longer use up swap space and the processor usage will > rocket and stay there for quite a while (hours). > Since > the ftpd program is still processing the command your > ftp session will not idle timeout. However, if you > do decide to kill your attacking ftp session, ftpd > will still process teh command and therefore, the > hosts > resources will take a beating. > > Basically, it looks like any user can severely drain > your systems resources - a kind of Denial of Service > attack. I was able to use up all remaining processor > time for two hours (would have gone on for much longer > only I got bored and kill it). > > CONTACT: You can email me at ener@shell.firehouse.net if you > want to discuss this problem further (or let me know > if it works on any other ftpd). > I found this today. Any comments? > > > BUG: wu_ftpd (all versions) > > TESTED: BSDI 3.0 (all patches), FreeBSD 2.2.1 > > DATE: 15th Aug 1997 > > REPEAT BY: Log into a wu_ftp server (either anonymously or as a > user) > and issue the command... > > nlist > ../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/ > > ../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/ > > ../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/../*/ > ../*/../*/../*/../*/../*../*../* > > DESCRIPTION: You can severly compromise the ftp servers > performance. > This command will create a HUGE directory listing, no > matter how many files/directories are in the current > directory (this is recursive). > > CONSEQUENCES: These vary. On my FreeBSD 2.2 box I was able to eat > up > all memory and swap memory until the kernel spewed > "out of swap space" errors and killed a few processes. > It also eats up all available CPU space (up to 99.22% > on my box). If repeated a few times you will no > longer use up swap space and the processor usage will > rocket and stay there for quite a while (hours). > Since > the ftpd program is still processing the command your > ftp session will not idle timeout. However, if you > do decide to kill your attacking ftp session, ftpd > will still process teh command and therefore, the > hosts > resources will take a beating. > > Basically, it looks like any user can severely drain > your systems resources - a kind of Denial of Service > attack. I was able to use up all remaining processor > time for two hours (would have gone on for much longer > only I got bored and kill it). > > CONTACT: You can email me at ener@shell.firehouse.net if you > want to discuss this problem further (or let me know > if it works on any other ftpd). > > -- > Josef Karthauser > Technical Manager Email: joe@pavilion.net > Pavilion Internet plc. [Tel: +44 1273 607072 Fax: +44 1273 607073] From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 08:02:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA13877 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:02:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whyy.org (whyy.org [207.245.67.105]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA13871 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:02:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tvmaster1.whyy.org (SOme@tvmaster1.whyy.org [207.245.66.48]) by whyy.org (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA09069 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:02:06 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:02:06 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709091502.LAA09069@whyy.org> X-Sender: jehrenkrantz@whyy.org X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.1.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: "..je" Subject: Different Subnet? Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi all, I have what may look like a strange queston. First the facts. using routed at this time CLOUD--[myisp xxx.8.142.4]----28.8----(24/7)---- -->|[xxx.8.142.140 {freebsd 2.2}dialup][yyy.233.15.1 ether]| ==== class c address on ethernet assigned by nick but not routable.=== ==== 3 other machines yyy.233.15.34 ,35,36. is there an existing program that would allow me to ftp to xxx.8.142.140 specify a port and have it connect to ...34,35,or 36 Thanks ..je From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 08:49:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA16271 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:49:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bcarsde4.localhost (mailgate.nortel.ca [192.58.194.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA16257 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:48:59 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709091548.IAA16257@hub.freebsd.org> Received: from bcars520.ott.bnr.ca (actually 47.128.5.188) by bcarsde4.localhost; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:47:27 -0400 Received: from bnr.ca by bcars520.bnr.ca id <28557-0@bcars520.bnr.ca>; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:46:35 -0400 Date: 09 Sep 1997 11:46 EDT To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Andrew Atrens" Subject: Re: Help! keyboard lockups - could be kernel bug ? Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Terry wrote: > > Somone else was reporting serial port lockups when they were hitting > their IDE drive hard. How well supported is the 430TX chipset? As I mentioned, with my old motherboard ( ASUS T2P4 w. 430HX chipset ) everything worked flawlessly. I guess its always possible that I have a flaky motherboard, but I don't understand why the symptoms show up under `xdm' and not `startx'. The other bogon I noted with this board ( as mentioned in my previous post ) is that the AUTO_EOI_X kernel options were causing my system to freeze on boot up. The IDE disks would probe correctly, but lock up during fsck'ing ( disk access leds stuck on ). Removing these options from the kernel solved the problem. Perhaps an appropriate kernel option change could fix my keyboard problem? Andrew. -- machine "i386" cpu "I586_CPU" cpu "I686_CPU" ident CHURCHILL maxusers 20 options INET #InterNETworking options FFS #Berkeley Fast Filesystem options NFS #Network Filesystem options MFS #Memory File System options MSDOSFS #MSDOS Filesystem options "CD9660" #ISO 9660 Filesystem options PROCFS #Process filesystem options "COMPAT_43" #Compatible with BSD 4.3 [KEEP THIS!] options UCONSOLE #Allow users to grab the console options USERCONFIG #boot -c editor options VISUAL_USERCONFIG #visual boot -c editor options MROUTING # Multicast routing options SYSVSHM options SYSVSEM options SYSVMSG options NSWAPDEV=2 options "CPU_FASTER_5X86_FPU" options USER_LDT options "MD5" options PERFMON config kernel root on wd0 controller isa0 controller pci0 controller fdc0 at isa? port "IO_FD1" bio irq 6 drq 2 vector fdintr disk fd0 at fdc0 drive 0 controller wdc0 at isa? port "IO_WD1" bio irq 14 flags 0x80ff80ff vector wdintr disk wd0 at wdc0 drive 0 controller wdc1 at isa? port "IO_WD2" bio irq 15 flags 0x80ff80ff vector wdintr device wcd0 #IDE CD-ROM options ATAPI #Enable ATAPI support for IDE bus options ATAPI_STATIC #Don't do it as an LKM device sc0 at isa? port "IO_KBD" tty irq 1 vector scintr options MAXCONS=3 # number of virtual consoles device npx0 at isa? port "IO_NPX" iosiz 0x0 flags 0x0 irq 13 vector npxintr device sio0 at isa? port "IO_COM1" tty irq 4 vector siointr device sio1 at isa? port "IO_COM2" tty irq 3 vector siointr device lpt0 at isa? port? tty irq 7 vector lptintr device ed0 at isa? port 0x280 net irq 10 iomem 0xd8000 vector edintr pseudo-device loop pseudo-device ether pseudo-device log pseudo-device sl 2 pseudo-device ppp 2 pseudo-device sppp #Generic Synchronous PPP pseudo-device bpfilter 4 #Berkeley packet filter pseudo-device tun 2 pseudo-device pty 128 pseudo-device gzip # Exec gzipped a.out's pseudo-device speaker #Play IBM BASIC-style noises out your speaker pseudo-device vn #Vnode driver (turns a file into a device) pseudo-device ccd 4 #Concatenated disk driver #options "AUTO_EOI_1" #options "AUTO_EOI_2" controller snd0 device sb0 at isa? port 0x220 irq 5 drq 1 vector sbintr device sbxvi0 at isa? drq 5 device sbmidi0 at isa? port 0x330 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 10:03:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA20550 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 10:03:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from misery.sdf.com (misery.sdf.com [204.244.210.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA20535 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 10:03:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tom by misery.sdf.com with smtp (Exim 1.62 #1) id 0x8Tci-0006vG-00; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 09:58:44 -0700 Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 09:58:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom To: Kenny Hanson cc: "'Josef Karthauser'" , "FreeBSD Hackers (E-mail)" Subject: RE: FTP compromise. In-Reply-To: <91DD7FDA88E4D011BED00000C0DD87E70BE975@pds-gateway.pdspc.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 9 Sep 1997, Kenny Hanson wrote: > I just successfully shot my cpu utilization up to 100% without any hopes > of seeing it come down. I had to kill the ftp process before the system > returned to a normal state. This is definitely D.O.S... anybody out > there > have any ideas on how to erradicate this? I ran this for 15 minutes > before Don't use wu-ftpd? The stock ftpd has lots of new features now, and can also have a builtin ls, which gives it a perf boost over wu-ftpd. Also, it doesn't say which version of wu-ftpd was used. I know there are new versions from academ. Tom From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 10:07:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA20712 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 10:07:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA20706 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 10:07:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA04523 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 10:07:38 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709091707.KAA04523@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0gamma 1/27/96 To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 11 year old needs FreeBSD mentor in Arizona In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 22:49:28 PDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 10:07:37 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk When my daughter was eleven , I bought her an Apple. For nearly seven years , I never heard anything about configuring her box till I got her a Win95 notebook for college :( Converting the young ones is good for it puts pressure on their parents to use FreeBSD 8) Cheers, Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 11:27:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA25548 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:27:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from awfulhak.demon.co.uk (awfulhak.demon.co.uk [158.152.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA25541 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:27:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lan.awfulhak.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by awfulhak.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA09286; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 07:26:47 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199709090626.HAA09286@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Greg Lehey cc: Brian Somers , Josef Karthauser , Terry Lambert , doconnor@Ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 09 Sep 1997 08:29:40 +0930." <19970909082940.32010@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 07:26:47 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 10:27:33PM +0100, Brian Somers wrote: > >> On Mon, Sep 08, 1997 at 09:10:46AM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: > >>> > >>>> And there's the annoying localhost DNS lookup, even though host.conf > >>>> has "hosts" first, and the name of the machine I'm rlogin'ing into > >>>> is in /etc/hosts (it's myself). It triggers the PPP dial anyway, > >>>> and I think that should only happen for non-local hosts. > >>> > >>> Well, why aren't you running named? It's faster than looking up > >>> /etc/hosts. And if you don't tell the world it's there, it's not > >>> going to get any external traffic. > >>> > >> > >>> ( Running named on the end of a dial-up-demand line is bad! :( > >> > >> 'Tis fine until you start using the named for lookups and then it > >> starts opening the line itself at random moments, i.e. when it's > >> checking the validity of things still in its cache, etc. That's why > >> I use /etc/hosts on my home machine, and resolve using an external > >> name server on my work network. > > > > Naaa. Just use ppp & use a dfilter > > Is that a typo, or something I don't know about? > > > to block the DNS. If you play primary for everything local > > (including any static *real* IP address you may have), it works > > wonders. The bigger your LAN gets the happier you become. > > And how do you perform DNS lookups when the link is up? What you need > is to limit the kind of packet which can cause autodial. Is that a > dfilter? (If this was a typo, and you introduce the feature, how > about calling it dfilter? :-) There are dfilters and there are ifilters and ofilters (not to mention afilters). Something that doesn't make the dfilter (dial filter) won't bring the line up. The packet'll still get passed as long as it makes the ofilter (output filter) or the ifilter (input filter). If it doesn't make the afilter (alive filter), it won't keep the line up (ie, the timer will expire despite it). Have a look in the man page - it could probably be explained a bit better. > Greg -- Brian , Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 11:32:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA25878 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:32:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from emout04.mail.aol.com (emout04.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.95]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA25873 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:32:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Temcguire@aol.com Received: (from root@localhost) by emout04.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id OAA22699 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:31:46 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:31:46 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970909142903_-131376035@emout04.mail.aol.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Interpreter compilers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Experts, For several years now (well since about 1987) I have been using awkcc (from AT&T Toolchest) to compile awk programs. I use awk and the compiled executables to do pattern analysis research with medical datasets. The compiled programs run approximately 10x faster than the interpretive versions. Recently, I installed FreeBSD (2.2.2) on a Pentium Pro in an attempt to upgrade from SPARC. When I attempted to build awkcc (from AT&T Toolchest) I discovered that flex (GNU) was not happy with awk.lx.l in the awkcc source. Seems, that flex -l option also would not accommodate the lack of POSIX compliance in awk.lx.l. I have tried blex (Berkeley port?) and had similar results. Question#1: Any suggestions on how to get around differences between AT&T lex and GNU flex differences within FreeBSD? In the realm of rapid prototyping with interpretive languages, there appear to be several options in FreeBSD (1997). I noticed tcl/tk, JAVA and PERL in particular and observed scheme and python. It appears that a compiler exists for scheme (scheme-to-C). Question#2: Can PERL scripts be translated into C and compiled into executables? Do regular expressions and associative arrays (awk) exist in any other languages that can be translated and compiled? Thank you for any possible assistance! Dr. Thomas E. McGuire 411 East 9th Avenue Salt Lake City, UT 84103 P.S., The Pentium Pro I purchased (Micron Inc.) has the option of a second processor. I have 64Mb of memory and wonder if I installed another processor, would FreeBSD operate much faster? From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 11:38:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA26228 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:38:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr04.primenet.com (tlambert@usr04.primenet.com [206.165.6.204]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA26223 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:38:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr04.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA28913; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:38:13 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709091838.LAA28913@usr04.primenet.com> Subject: Re: How the heck do you drop DTR? To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 18:38:13 +0000 (GMT) Cc: gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu, mrcpu@cdsnet.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709090819.SAA01536@word.smith.net.au> from "Mike Smith" at Sep 9, 97 06:19:03 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > wierd... assuming that all file descriptors to the modem is closed, > > DTR should drop... > > Not necessarily; was the port in drainwait? (ie. had output data > that couldn't be sent?) Ugh. I *hate* the way CTS/RTS handling is i effect in the abscence of DCD. It makes no sense whatsoever. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 11:44:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA26434 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:44:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr04.primenet.com (tlambert@usr04.primenet.com [206.165.6.204]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA26428 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:44:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr04.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA29365; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:43:51 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709091843.LAA29365@usr04.primenet.com> Subject: Re: How the heck do you drop DTR? To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 18:43:51 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, mrcpu@cdsnet.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970909185509.62821@lemis.com> from "Greg Lehey" at Sep 9, 97 06:55:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > The System V difference was STREAMS instead of the old terminal > driver, as I'm sure I don't have to tell you. > > > And we all know how much like System V we want BSD to be... even > > when System V has good ideas (unlike that one). > > Was there ever any other way of doing it on an open fd? You missed where I said: ] If you look at /usr/include/sys/ttycom.h, you will see TIOCCDTR ] and TIOCSDTR. ? The answer is "yes, via these ioctl()'s". 8-). TIOCCDTR Terminal I/O Control Clear DTR TIOCSDTR Terminal I/O Control Set DTR > One day, when I have time, remind me about the story of the IBM junior > thugs and their start-stop terminal (3101? I forget). Heh. I wrote an emulator for those things that could emulate them on anything from Wyse 50's to VT100's to Hazeltines. 8-). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 11:51:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA26790 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:51:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr04.primenet.com (tlambert@usr04.primenet.com [206.165.6.204]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA26780 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:51:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr04.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA29705; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:49:20 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709091849.LAA29705@usr04.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Tape question To: joerg_wunsch@interface-business.de Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 18:49:20 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, handy@sag.space.lockheed.com In-Reply-To: <19970909162235.DF18120@ida.interface-business.de> from "J Wunsch" at Sep 9, 97 04:22:35 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I once wrote: > > > This must be a problem with the Exabyte then. It works fine for me, > > with a Tandberg TDC4222, and a QIC-525 cartridge (QIC-150, of course, > > doesn't work since it's fixed-length blocking). > > I've verified with this test program that it works on a DAT drive as > well, with the ahc(4) driver in this case (and on 2.2-stable). I'm *really* not trying to be contentious here, but I have to ask... How did you verify that the BSD device driver was not padding records on write? AFAIK, the only way to do that is with a machine that you know doesn't do it writing the test tapes. Like a SunOS box. That said, Sun is well known to rewrite proms for no good reason (ie: Toshiba 3401B CDROMs and CDROMs as boot devices). Maybe we are both looking in the wrong place for the problem? I've done it before... 8-(. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 11:56:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA27229 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:56:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from innocence.interface-business.de (innocence.interface-business.de [193.101.57.202]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA27216 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:56:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ida.interface-business.de (ida.interface-business.de [193.101.57.203]) by innocence.interface-business.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id UAA23596 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 20:56:40 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by ida.interface-business.de (8.8.7/8.7.3) id UAA02637; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 20:56:40 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970909205639.PN18751@ida.interface-business.de> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 20:56:39 +0200 From: j@ida.interface-business.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Tape question References: <19970909162235.DF18120@ida.interface-business.de> <199709091849.LAA29705@usr04.primenet.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-31809-14 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Organization: interface business GmbH, Dresden Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@interface-business.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709091849.LAA29705@usr04.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Sep 9, 1997 18:49:20 +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Terry Lambert wrote: > I'm *really* not trying to be contentious here, but I have to ask... > > How did you verify that the BSD device driver was not padding records > on write? You should have watched the output of my program when i first posted it. I was re-reading the records from the tape, and got the exact amount of bytes that have been written. If the driver (or the device) would have padded any data, how should it have been possible to e.g. get a 33333-byte record from the tape in return? Besides, i basically know the BSD driver doesn't do it, from UTSLing. -- J"org Wunsch Unix support engineer joerg_wunsch@interface-business.de http://www.interface-business.de/~j From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 11:59:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA27423 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:59:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA27417 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:59:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA05266 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:44:11 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:44:10 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Can someone give a code snippet of the BEST way of running a 1000HZ for loop under freebsd, without consuming massive amounts of cpu time. Thank You In advance. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 12:00:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA27562 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:00:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA27555 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:00:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA05275; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:46:11 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 11:46:11 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Andrew Atrens cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: re:Help! keyboard lockups - could be kernel bug ? In-Reply-To: <199709090549.WAA05083@hub.freebsd.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk This has happened to me also quite a few times, at first I suspected netscape but then discovered that when the machine is under heavy load the CTRL-ALT-F? sequences don't work correctly to change from X to the Virtual consoles. On 9 Sep 1997, Andrew Atrens wrote: > > Hi again, > > Last week I wrote about bizarre problem I was experiencing with keyboard > lockups under X. Well a week has passed and the situation has not improved > despite my best efforts. Actually to be honest I'm not sure what to try > next. Any pointers would be appreciated... > > Actually, one further clue: if I'm pounding my IDE disk ( while running xdm > of course ) the keyboard will also occasionally lock up. The lock up is > fairly gradual, usually starts with a single key press being missed, then > a few, and then eventually ( after, say 30 seconds ) I can play `chopsticks' > without effect ;) . Its almost as though the activity on the PCI bus is > somehow gating the keyboard i/o... unfortunately for the keyboard its a > one way trip - once its locked up its dead. > > One last strange observation is that, under xdm if I do a - to > get back to the text-console, the background color of the screen changes > from black to red. No such behaviour with good ol' startx ! > > Cheers, > > Andrew. ( opinions are mine, not Nortel's ) > > -- > > In message "Help! keyboard lockups - could be kernel bug ?", I wrote: > > > > > Hi Folks, > > > > Last week I was happily running FreeBSD-2.2.2 on my Pentium system with an > > ASUS T2P4 motherboard ( has PCI 430HX chipset ). But unfortunately I got > > the upgrade itch, and moved up (?) to an ASUS TX97 ( has PCI 430TX chipset ). > > > > To make a long story short, 2.2.2 consistently locked up on boot - a real > > showstopper. After much trial and error I discovered the culprit to be > > AUTO_EOI_X kernel option(s). When I built a kernel without these options it > > booted and appeared (initially at least) to function properly. > > > > Then, occasionally I noticed that my xdm login window was dropping characters > > and locking up. Enough of that, so I downloaded the sources and built/installed > > the August 08 3.0-SNAP. > > > > Xdm login was still dropping characters, so I went out and got Xfree86-3.3.1 > > sources and rebuilt X. Xdm login was *still* dropping characters and > > occasionally locking up the keyboard, so I began to look at this symptom more > > closely. > > > > While the xdm login banner is displayed, I run an xlock -inroot -mode random > > process in the background. Depending on how graphics/cpu intensive the > > particular screen saver is, the lock up behaviour worsens. For example, the > > lock ups are worse when running xlock in `galaxy' mode. > > > > Furthermore, if I get past the xdm login window, xterms and rxvts in my > > session cause keyboard lockup when xlock is running `galaxy' in the root > > window. > > > > So here's the strange thing: IF I DON'T RUN XDM, and instead just use startx > > then the system behaves normally - no keyboard lockups regardless of how > > hard I pound X. > > > > So what the heck is going on? -- What do I try next ? > > > > Any help would be appreciated :) > > > > Andrew > > ( opinions are mine, not Nortels ) > > > > > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 12:08:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA28131 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:08:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA28123 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:08:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailhost.sdsp.mc.xerox.com ([13.231.132.18]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <53061(2)>; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:08:10 PDT Received: from gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com (gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com [13.231.133.90]) by mailhost.sdsp.mc.xerox.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA09025 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:07:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: by gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com (4.1/client-1.3) id AA22307; Tue, 9 Sep 97 15:07:07 EDT Message-Id: <9709091907.AA22307@gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: How should I partition my disk? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:07:07 PDT From: "Marty Leisner" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've seen no guidelines on how big to make partitions...(if I've missed it, please point it out to me). I have a 6.4 gig IDE quantum bigfoot...I'm willing to give about 1.2 gig to freebsd... When I have enough space, I should be able to install everything, including sources (not ports). Any reasonable ideas for a basic install (i.e. sizes and mount points) ? (I hate the fact we insiston swap space). marty leisner@sdsp.mc.xerox.com Don't confuse education with schooling. Milton Friedman to Yogi Berra -- marty leisner@sdsp.mc.xerox.com The Feynman problem solving Algorithm 1) Write down the problem 2) Think real hard 3) Write down the answer Murray Gel-mann in the NY Times From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 12:26:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA29074 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:26:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pscwa.psca.com (romulus.pscwa.psca.com [199.99.162.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA29067 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:26:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vulcan by pscwa.psca.com (NX5.67f2/NX3.0M, PSCWA update 950701) id AA18164; Tue, 9 Sep 97 12:26:01 -0700 Message-Id: <9709091926.AA18164@pscwa.psca.com> Received: by vulcan.pscwa.psca.com (NX5.67g/NX3.0X) id AA07552; Tue, 9 Sep 97 12:25:59 -0700 Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 4.2mach v148) In-Reply-To: <970909142903_-131376035@emout04.mail.aol.com> X-Nextstep-Mailer: Mail 4.2mach (Enhance 2.0b5) Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.148) From: Manu Iyengar Date: Tue, 9 Sep 97 12:25:57 -0700 To: Temcguire@aol.com Subject: Re: Interpreter compilers Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Reply-To: m@pscwa.psca.com References: <970909142903_-131376035@emout04.mail.aol.com> X-Subliminal-Message: Have you paid The Bill? Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >From the keyboard of Temcguire@aol.com on Tue, 9 Sep 1997: > > Question#2: Can PERL scripts be translated into C and compiled into > executables? Do regular expressions and associative arrays (awk) exist in > any other languages that can be translated and compiled? This question is more relevant to Perl than to FreeBSD. Yes & yes. An alpha-quality Perl compiler is available from anywhere that you can get perl itself (ftp://ftp.cdrom.com/pub/perl/CPAN/, for example). For details, see ``perlfaq3 - Programming Tools: How can I compile my Perl program into byte-code or C?'' in the Perl FAQ. Perl's regular expression support is a superset of awk's and way faster. -mi > Thank you for any possible assistance! > Dr. Thomas E. McGuire > 411 East 9th Avenue > Salt Lake City, UT 84103 > > P.S., > The Pentium Pro I purchased (Micron Inc.) has the option of a second > processor. I have 64Mb of memory and wonder if I installed another > processor, would FreeBSD operate much faster? From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 12:28:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA29199 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:28:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from watermarkgroup.com (lor.watermarkgroup.com [38.246.139.30]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA29194 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:28:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: by watermarkgroup.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA26659; Tue, 9 Sep 97 15:27:50 EDT Date: Tue, 9 Sep 97 15:27:50 EDT From: luoqi@watermarkgroup.com (Luoqi Chen) Message-Id: <9709091927.AA26659@watermarkgroup.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape Communicator 4.02b7 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Incidentally, the latest pig, communicator403b8, is available from > > /pub/communicator/4.03/4.03b8/english/unix/freebsd/base_install > > ftp.netscape.com . In the > > directory. > > Have they cleared up any of the weirdness with SIGFPE? (What I mean is that > I notice my copy of 4.02b7 likes to hang when it exits...an investigation > with GDB showed that it was SIGFPE'ing, then continuing, then doing it > again, over and over, in a loop that eats all my CPU. I have to kill -9 it > to make it go away.) Netscape is ignoring SIGFPE, so an exception could completely screw up the fp stack. One solution is to change __INITIAL_NPXCW__ in npx.h to mask all exceptions (could anyone tell me why this is not the default?). -lq From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 12:29:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA29269 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:29:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fang.cs.sunyit.edu (perlsta@fang.cs.sunyit.edu [192.52.220.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA29263 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:29:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (perlsta@localhost) by fang.cs.sunyit.edu (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA10009; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:29:42 GMT Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:29:42 +0000 (GMT) From: Alfred Perlstein To: Temcguire@aol.com cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Interpreter compilers In-Reply-To: <970909142903_-131376035@emout04.mail.aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Recently, I installed FreeBSD (2.2.2) on a Pentium Pro in an attempt to > upgrade from SPARC. When I attempted to build awkcc (from AT&T Toolchest) I > discovered that flex (GNU) was not happy with awk.lx.l in the awkcc source. > Seems, that flex -l option also would not accommodate the lack of POSIX > compliance in awk.lx.l. I have tried blex (Berkeley port?) and had similar > results. if you showed some of the problems you were getting i could help a little more, why don't you look into the book: flex & bison by O'reilly and Associates, it's really good on explaining the differences with different implementations of flex/lex... y'know what might work, see if there is an emulation package that will work with the binaries that you have, FreeBSD has a slew of emulators for various operating systems, you might just have to recompile your kernel or install a package from the distribution or ports. > Question#2: Can PERL scripts be translated into C and compiled into > executables? Do regular expressions and associative arrays (awk) exist in > any other languages that can be translated and compiled? honestly Perl is considered 5 to 10 times faster than AWK anyhow, so just using interpreted Perl might be fast enough. > Thank you for any possible assistance! > Dr. Thomas E. McGuire > 411 East 9th Avenue > Salt Lake City, UT 84103 > > P.S., > The Pentium Pro I purchased (Micron Inc.) has the option of a second > processor. I have 64Mb of memory and wonder if I installed another > processor, would FreeBSD operate much faster? Yes amazingly faster, however you would have to deal with the SMP (symetric mutiprocessing kernel) which hasn't been as stable lately, join the "freebsd-smp" mailing list to find out how it is doing, maybe you could get ahold of a earlier more stable version of the kernel godd luck, Alfred From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 12:39:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA29939 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:39:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from uno.canit.se (root@uno.canit.se [193.13.228.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA29927 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:39:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from canit.se (quiet.matematik.su.se [130.237.198.146]) by uno.canit.se (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA17440; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:38:51 +0200 Message-ID: <3415A5CB.3AA23825@canit.se> Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 21:38:51 +0200 From: Kent Boortz Organization: TMG Datakonsult X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02b7 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.2-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: fpresetsticky, fpsetmask Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have read the man page and done some experiments but can't quite understand the logic. If I want all errors like overflow, underflow and divide by zero result in an excdeption, I set the bits in 'fpsetmask()', right? But how does this 'fpresetsticky()' come into the picture? Could you please clearify how this works? I also read a note in mailing list that I "think" claimed that enabling a signal on floating point divide by zero also would trap integer divide by zero that doesn't restart correctly, causing an infinite loop. Is this true? And last, is this 'fpsetmask()'/'fresetsticky()' the same in other flawors of BSD? /kgb From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 12:50:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA00923 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:50:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA00916 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:50:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id VAA24741 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:50:42 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id VAA00332; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:48:13 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970909214812.EW16886@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:48:12 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Tape question References: <19970908073710.TX24990@uriah.heep.sax.de> <199709082106.OAA08434@usr09.primenet.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709082106.OAA08434@usr09.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Sep 8, 1997 21:06:22 +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Terry Lambert wrote: > Similarly, you may *request* a 8192 byte read, and the driver may > not accept a shorter block being returned by the device in response > to the larger request. Terry, again: the latter was exactly what the originator of the question was suspecting for the FreeBSD driver. This would IMNSHO be broken behaviour. My entire case was to prove that the FreeBSD driver does *not* behave this way. (And no, it doesn't pad garbage when writing either.) So in short, for variable-length recording media (*), the FreeBSD driver does: . Write a tape block of whatever size has been passed down to the write(2) syscall, with a lower limit of 1 byte (**) per tape block, and an upper limit of 64 KB per tape block. The latter is mainly caused by known limitations of physio(9). . Read a tape block of whatever size has been recorded onto the tape, provided the read(2) syscall has been requested with at least this size (or more). If the tape block is shorter than the requested size, a short read byte count will be returned. If the request was shorter than the next tape block, the read will fail, and an error condition will be returned (IMHO an EINVAL). Again, the upper limit is 64 KB, so if your source machine could record larger tape blocks, you cannot read them on FreeBSD. IRIX machines are known to be notorious suckers in this respect, by writing 256 KB blocks, regard- less of claiming to default to 10 KB blocks in their tar(1) man page. (They do this in the name of performance, albeit this is bogus. The block overhead is neglicible between ~ 32 KB and larger blocking.) The above is believed to be compatible behaviour to other operating systems as well. The second part of the above hasn't been this way all the time, IMHO it was broken up to and including FreeBSD 2.0. (*) QIC >= 525 MB, DAT, Exb 8 mm, DLT (**) Here's the prove that 1-byte tape blocking is possible. (Someone was suspecting it weren't.) j@uriah 52% dd if=/dev/zero bs=1 count=10 of=/dev/rst0 10+0 records in 10+0 records out 10 bytes transferred in 0.107958 secs (93 bytes/sec) j@uriah 53% dd of=/dev/zero bs=100 count=10 if=/dev/rst0 0+10 records in 0+10 records out 10 bytes transferred in 1.503833 secs (7 bytes/sec) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 12:54:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA01167 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:54:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr03.primenet.com (tlambert@usr03.primenet.com [206.165.6.203]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA01162 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:54:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr03.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA28976; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:53:58 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709091953.MAA28976@usr03.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Interpreter compilers To: Temcguire@aol.com Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:53:57 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <970909142903_-131376035@emout04.mail.aol.com> from "Temcguire@aol.com" at Sep 9, 97 02:31:46 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Recently, I installed FreeBSD (2.2.2) on a Pentium Pro in an attempt to > upgrade from SPARC. When I attempted to build awkcc (from AT&T Toolchest) I > discovered that flex (GNU) was not happy with awk.lx.l in the awkcc source. > Seems, that flex -l option also would not accommodate the lack of POSIX > compliance in awk.lx.l. I have tried blex (Berkeley port?) and had similar > results. > > Question#1: Any suggestions on how to get around differences between AT&T lex > and GNU flex differences within FreeBSD? Yes. I can help you, but I need to know the specific error messages you got when you attempted this. There are a number of differences. If you can't disclose the messages because they contain source, you will need to do the job yourself. I recommend: lex & yacc John R. Levine, Tony Mason, Doug Brown O'Reilly & Associates, Inc. ISBN 1-56592-000-7 which describes the conversion process in detail. It assumes a working knowledge of lex (or yacc, which isn't important in your case). > In the realm of rapid prototyping with interpretive languages, there appear > to be several options in FreeBSD (1997). I noticed tcl/tk, JAVA and PERL in > particular and observed scheme and python. It appears that a compiler exists > for scheme (scheme-to-C). > > Question#2: Can PERL scripts be translated into C and compiled into > executables? Do regular expressions and associative arrays (awk) exist in > any other languages that can be translated and compiled? I have not seen a PERL to C translator, but I have not really looked. There exist both translators and JITs (Just-In-Time-compilers) for JAVA. Search Yahoo for Kaffe and follow the links around to 20 or more of them. > P.S., > The Pentium Pro I purchased (Micron Inc.) has the option of a second > processor. I have 64Mb of memory and wonder if I installed another > processor, would FreeBSD operate much faster? If you run SMP FreeBSD, it should, for concurrent tasks. SMP FreeBSD is current experimental, meaning it is not a release. Normal processes are intrinsically bound to a single CPU, so adding CPU's typically won't buy you anything, uless you are running a multiprocess server (mail services, ftp services, http services) AND you are currently CPU bound (you will get a concurrency win in that case). Threaded processes are currently not SMP scalable, but are expected to become so in the future. After that, single processes with multiple threads of control willget concurrency wins under SMP as well. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 12:58:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA01573 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:58:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA01550 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 12:58:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id UAA19872; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 20:47:13 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199709091847.UAA19872@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? To: jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org (Jamil J. Weatherbee) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 20:47:13 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Jamil J. Weatherbee" at Sep 9, 97 11:43:51 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Can someone give a code snippet of the BEST way of running a 1000HZ for > loop under freebsd, without consuming massive amounts of cpu time. one way I can think of is to build a kernel with HZ=1000 (or higher). Make your process run at high priority, wake up at every tick (through setitimer or usleep etc.) do its task and go back to sleep. Cheers Luigi -----------------------------+-------------------------------------- Luigi Rizzo | Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it | Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 | via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 | http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ _____________________________|______________________________________ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 13:08:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA02462 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:08:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA02454 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:08:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA25582; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:08:27 -0600 (MDT) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:08:27 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709092008.OAA25582@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Netscape annoying dialog boxes X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I had thought that with the native version of FreebSD these would go away, but they don't. How do I get the: Warning: Action not found : insert-selection, kill-selection dialog boxes to go away? I note that these don't exist anywhere in XKesyms or whatever. They aren't a show-stopper, but they are annoying none-the-less. Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 13:16:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA02934 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:16:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr03.primenet.com (tlambert@usr03.primenet.com [206.165.6.203]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA02923 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:16:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr03.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA02182; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:15:51 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709092015.NAA02182@usr03.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Help! keyboard lockups - could be kernel bug ? To: jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org (Jamil J. Weatherbee) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 20:15:50 +0000 (GMT) Cc: atrens@nortel.ca, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Jamil J. Weatherbee" at Sep 9, 97 11:46:11 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > This has happened to me also quite a few times, at first I suspected > netscape but then discovered that when the machine is under heavy load the > CTRL-ALT-F? sequences don't work correctly to change from X to the Virtual > consoles. Changing from X works because the kernel tells X to change the video card back to what it was before X was running, and then tell it when it's done. Since X is a user process, if it can't run, then you can't change because it can't service the kernel's request. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 13:31:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA03667 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:31:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from uustar.starnet.net (root@uustar.starnet.net [199.217.253.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA03662 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:31:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from commlet.UUCP (Ucommlet@localhost) by uustar.starnet.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with UUCP id PAA10434 for freebsd.org!hackers; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:15:41 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: Interpreter compilers To: Temcguire@aol.com Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:00:00 -0500 (CDT) From: Matthew Alton Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <970909142903_-131376035@emout04.mail.aol.com> from "Temcguire@aol.com" at Sep 9, 97 02:31:46 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <9709091500.aa29712@commlet.commlet.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Recently, I installed FreeBSD (2.2.2) on a Pentium Pro in an attempt to > upgrade from SPARC. When I attempted to build awkcc (from AT&T Toolchest) I > discovered that flex (GNU) was not happy with awk.lx.l in the awkcc source. Can you use lex on another system to produce the scanner and then build with this? > The Pentium Pro I purchased (Micron Inc.) has the option of a second > processor. I have 64Mb of memory and wonder if I installed another > processor, would FreeBSD operate much faster? > > You would have to use FreeBSD 3.0 which is still in development. Matt Alton From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 13:46:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA04492 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:46:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr06.primenet.com (tlambert@usr06.primenet.com [206.165.6.206]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA04487 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:46:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr06.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA09474; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:46:34 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709092046.NAA09474@usr06.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes To: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 20:46:34 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709092008.OAA25582@rocky.mt.sri.com> from "Nate Williams" at Sep 9, 97 02:08:27 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I had thought that with the native version of FreebSD these would go > away, but they don't. How do I get the: > > Warning: Action not found : insert-selection, kill-selection > > dialog boxes to go away? I note that these don't exist anywhere in > XKesyms or whatever. > > They aren't a show-stopper, but they are annoying none-the-less. I was able to get them to go away on the nonnative version by installing the OSF keysyms for Motif *2.0*. I think the ones you kave may be *1.2*? Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 13:50:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA04750 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:50:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA04738 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:50:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA25694 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:50:26 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id WAA00612; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:26:46 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970909222646.CR26862@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:26:46 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: i refuse to spend the $$$ References: <19970908025529.27382@wakky.dyn.ml.org> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from Jamil J. Weatherbee on Sep 8, 1997 00:13:21 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > So what you are saying is that if you bump an audio cd player you should > expect it to skip -- where does it go? To wherever the laser head jumps off to. I think most CD players at least detect the inconsistency (probably by watching the subchannel data), and simply drop off completely in this case. At least, i've seen this on an older diskman. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 13:50:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA04777 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:50:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA04749 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:50:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA25695 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:50:31 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id WAA00628; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:31:07 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970909223106.MK41707@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:31:06 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do you have some neat configuration files? References: <19970908153822.27586@lemis.com> <199709082133.OAA09929@usr09.primenet.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709082133.OAA09929@usr09.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Sep 8, 1997 21:33:28 +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Terry Lambert wrote: > > Any other suggestions? > > fvwm95. qvwm instead. Less complex, and IMHO less error-prone than fvwm95. I've been setting it up for a customer's machine recently. (Looks a little green at some edges still.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 13:50:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA04790 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:50:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA04763 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:50:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA25699 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:50:35 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id WAA00637; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:34:00 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970909223400.JE31478@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:34:00 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers) Subject: Re: Do you have some neat configuration files? References: <19970908153822.27586@lemis.com> <23971.873704247@time.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <23971.873704247@time.cdrom.com>; from Jordan K. Hubbard on Sep 8, 1997 00:37:27 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > Greg has really placed two separate proposals here before you, the > first being the collection of some nifty startup file bits and "canned > user profiles" which Joe User might crib from, just as hackers on true > timesharing UNIX systems used to crib useful tidbits from various > admin personnel's startup files when left readable, and the second > being the actual incorporation of this data into the CVS repository > for more ongoing "skeleton file" work. I would rather suggest making this a port/package, something like a `defaultuser' package. Of course, we should learn from some L-system distributions, and work hard to avoid that people will actually be able to install this user setup without customizing it (thus sending out mail from an account named `default' or such later). Having said this, it now requires a volunteer... -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 13:51:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA04899 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:51:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA04888 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:51:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA25711 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:50:58 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id WAA00669; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:48:11 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970909224811.AW46227@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:48:11 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Kernel clock runs inaccurately References: <199709080124.JAA14004@tao.sinanet.com.tw> <19970908081010.DS04250@uriah.heep.sax.de> <19970908233231.09396@keltia.freenix.fr> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <19970908233231.09396@keltia.freenix.fr>; from Ollivier Robert on Sep 8, 1997 23:32:31 +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Ollivier Robert wrote: > > The master clock on my machine at work is much worse. I was > > contemplating to hack xntpd so it could use the RTC (CMOS) clock as a > > refclock, but unfortunately, didn't get very far. Mainly, i don't > > grok the xnptd refclock implementations, and how to add a new one. > > It is already supported (if I understand what you want): > > peer 127.127.1.0 No, that's a pseudo-synchronization to the system clock. I was speaking about an actual synchronization to the RTC (CMOS clock). If you follow the thread backwards to its origin, you'll know why this can sometimes be a big difference. (Well, i've finally installed our DCF-77 clock today, so perhaps i've now got a real refclock instead, which takes the pressure for the RTC-hack from me for the machine i was intending this. Let's see how this cheap DCF-77 clock will do.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 14:03:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA05662 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:03:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ic4.ic.dk (qmailr@pm5-8.image.dk [194.234.173.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA05647 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:03:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 16265 invoked from network); 9 Sep 1997 20:53:48 -0000 Received: from ic1.ic.dk (193.88.65.12) by ic4.ic.dk with SMTP; 9 Sep 1997 20:53:48 -0000 Received: from jblhome by ic1.ic.dk with UUCP id AA15498 (5.65c8/IDA-1.4.4j); Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:56:54 +0200 Received: (from jacob@localhost) by pippin.jblhome.ping.dk (8.8.7/8.7.3) id VAA00930; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:47:10 +0200 (CEST) To: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Cc: ssigala@globalnet.it, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: My FreeBSD Wish List... References: <199709090629.XAA10927@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> From: Jacob Bohn Lorensen Date: 09 Sep 1997 21:47:09 +0200 In-Reply-To: asami@cs.berkeley.edu's message of Mon, 8 Sep 1997 23:29:32 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <8767safewy.fsf@pippin.jblhome.ping.dk> Lines: 35 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.34 X-Charset: ISO_8859-1 X-Char-Esc: 29 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) writes: > * The X11 ports should not be installed in /usr/X11R6 but in the > This is easy to say, but too hard to implement. As long as the X > folks assume "one tree" in the Imake config files, there isn't a whole > lot we can do abut it. Well, actually there is. After compiling and installing the X11 distribution, you teach Imake to install future programs/libs/header files/whatever in another tree; you teach Imake to look for include files, libraries, whatever in the old tree too. Then you setup the XFILESEARCHPATH environment variable in /etc/profile et al to include the new X11-tree and the old default value from the libraries (so that X apps find their resource files whether they are located in the old or the new tree). Voila - you have the distributed X11 tree intact, and your own compilations go into the local/ tree. I am doing this on a system I maintain (mixed SUN, HPUX, Alpha machines); I am not shure that I have every situation covered, but it's been quite a while since an Imakefile did not put things where I wanted them. The thing is, now I know for sure that /usr/X11 or wherever vendor likes to install his X11 distribution does not contain any of my own compiled programs; nor any `fixed' app-defaults files etc. Everything I change I change in a local shadow X11 tree. Makes for smoother OS upgrades... Jacob. -- Jacob Lorensen; Mosebuen 33, 1.; DK-2820 Gentofte, Denmark; +45-31560401 PGP ID = E596F0B5; PGP Fingerprint = 1E8726467436DC4A 723B6678C5AD9E71 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 14:17:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA06525 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:17:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA06512 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:17:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA26087 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 23:17:48 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id XAA00796; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 23:11:53 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970909231153.EH58106@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 23:11:53 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Subject: Re: kern/4486: ahc(4) in RELENG_2_2 can't do kernel core dumps References: <199709071604.SAA19531@uriah.heep.sax.de> <199709091650.SAA28404@pat.idi.ntnu.no> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709091650.SAA28404@pat.idi.ntnu.no>; from Tor Egge on Sep 9, 1997 18:50:44 +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk (Moved to -hackers.) As Tor Egge wrote: > Some S3 cards does not like accesses to the monocrome > video memory address region (starting at memory address 0xb8000), > and the memory dump hangs when dumping that region. > > With the following ugly hack/workaround, and defining SDDUMP_HANGS > as an option in the kernel config file, the kernel will probably be > able to perform a core dump. I've already been exchanging a couple of private mails with Tor. His suggested hack indeed fixes my problem, so we could at least change the status of the PR to `analyzed'. Anyway, it's now my belief that kernel core dumps should avoid the ``ISA hole'' completely, and dump zeros in this region instead. The devices that are mapped there are free to imply whatever semantics with these memory regions, and it doesn't make much sense to try dumping it at all. The coredump hangs that are the subject of this PR are one point (perhaps a problem of the S3 Trio64 chip), another thing that quickly came to my mind are some HP network cards (HP 100VG) that have some very weird and specific semantics for their memory-mapped operation. They are likely to go belly up if you access their memory regions without sticking to the proper protocol. I'm sure this list could be continued. So unless somebody objects, i would convert all disk drivers to not attempt to dump the ``ISA hole''. This would then close my PR. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 14:19:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA06699 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:19:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA06684 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:19:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA26142; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 23:19:27 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id WAA00738; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:58:01 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970909225801.RL53370@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:58:01 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Subject: Re: interrupts in interrupt routines References: <199709090626.IAA18398@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709090626.IAA18398@labinfo.iet.unipi.it>; from Luigi Rizzo on Sep 9, 1997 08:26:57 +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Luigi Rizzo wrote: > am I correct in assuming that within an interrupt driver interrupst are > masked according to the imask declared in the config line ? > > e.g. > > device pcm0 at isa? tty ... vectpr pcmintr > > results in pcmintr() being called at spltty ? RTFM. :-) SPL(9) FreeBSD Kernel Developer's Manual SPL(9) NAME splbio, splclock, splhigh, splimp, splnet, splsoftclock, splsofttty, splstatclock, spltty, splvm, spl0, splx - manipulate interrupt priorities ... Each driver that uses interrupts is normally assigned to an interrupt priority group by a keyword in its config line. For example: device foo0 at isa? port 0x0815 irq 12 tty vector foointr assigns interrupt 12 to the ``tty'' priority group. The system automati- cally arranges for interrupts in the xxx group to be called at a priority >= splxxx (). -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 14:22:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA06984 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:22:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vader.cs.berkeley.edu (vader.CS.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.38.234]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA06973 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:21:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from asami@localhost) by vader.cs.berkeley.edu (8.8.6/8.7.3) id OAA29539; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:21:27 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:21:27 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709092121.OAA29539@vader.cs.berkeley.edu> To: jacob@jblhome.ping.dk CC: ssigala@globalnet.it, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: <8767safewy.fsf@pippin.jblhome.ping.dk> (message from Jacob Bohn Lorensen on 09 Sep 1997 21:47:09 +0200) Subject: Re: My FreeBSD Wish List... From: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk * Well, actually there is. After compiling and installing the X11 * distribution, you teach Imake to install future programs/libs/header * files/whatever in another tree; you teach Imake to look for include * files, libraries, whatever in the old tree too. Of course. That's what I said -- we need to change the Imake config to make it happen. It is conceivable that we ship our releases with those tweaked Imake config files. However, I don't think it is feasible for us to stray away from the standard X11R6/XFree86 distributions in such a major way. That is bound to cause too much confusion ("help, I installed the new XFree86 from ftp.xfree86.org, and my X ports don't work!!!"). If enough people request the XFree86 folks, maybe they will change it. But let me reiterate, this is no a FreeBSD ports issue, it is an XFree86 issue, so please don't bring it up here. Satoshi From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 14:57:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA09254 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:57:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bitbox.follo.net (bitbox.follo.net [194.198.43.36]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA09232; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:57:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from eivind@localhost) by bitbox.follo.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) id XAA04771; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 23:56:40 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 23:56:40 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199709092156.XAA04771@bitbox.follo.net> From: Eivind Eklund To: Greg Lehey CC: questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Greg Lehey's message of Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:38:22 +0930 Subject: Re: Do you have some neat configuration files? References: <19970908153822.27586@lemis.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Jordan and I have just been discussing adding some contributed > configuration files to the distribution CD-ROMs. I'm primarily > thinking of .rc scripts for editors, mail readers, window > managers and such. .{zsh,csh,bash,..}rc files too, or is this too personal again? > One size doesn't fit all, of course, and there's a good chance that > there are other versions out there which many (even most) people will > prefer. So why not supply them too? If you have anything that you > feel is worth sharing, please let me know. About the only thing I ask > is that the files don't contain too much dead wood (I know mine do :-) I can try to find time clean up my emacs setup again, if an advanced and thus large but well-documented, made-for-snatching setup is of interest. (It's close to 50k of elisp-code, including some emulation code for features missing from the emacs distribution but present in other editors, e.g. making it possible to move between windows split in multiple directions with ctrl-alt-) Eivind. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 15:06:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA09944 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:06:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from iafnl.es.iaf.nl (uucp@iafnl.es.iaf.nl [195.108.17.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA09920 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:06:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: by iafnl.es.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA01547 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG); Wed, 10 Sep 1997 00:06:41 +0200 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.8.5/8.6.12) id VAA01447; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:02:45 +0200 (MET DST) From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199709091902.VAA01447@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: Tape question To: joerg_wunsch@interface-business.de Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:02:45 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, handy@sag.space.lockheed.com In-Reply-To: <19970909162235.DF18120@ida.interface-business.de> from "J Wunsch" at Sep 9, 97 04:22:35 pm X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem, The Netherlands X-Pgp-Info: PGP public key at 'finger wilko@freefall.freebsd.org' X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As J Wunsch wrote... > I once wrote: > > > This must be a problem with the Exabyte then. It works fine for me, > > with a Tandberg TDC4222, and a QIC-525 cartridge (QIC-150, of course, > > doesn't work since it's fixed-length blocking). > > I've verified with this test program that it works on a DAT drive as > well, with the ahc(4) driver in this case (and on 2.2-stable). If you want more data I could try a DLT2000 [don't tell me, I deleted the posting] Wilko _ ____________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl http://www.tcja.nl/~wilko |/|/ / / /( (_) Arnhem, The Netherlands - Do, or do not. There is no 'try' ----------------------------------------------------------------------Yoda From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 15:24:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA11076 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:24:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA11069 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:24:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA26290; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:21:06 -0600 (MDT) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:21:06 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709092221.QAA26290@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Terry Lambert Cc: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams), hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes In-Reply-To: <199709092046.NAA09474@usr06.primenet.com> References: <199709092008.OAA25582@rocky.mt.sri.com> <199709092046.NAA09474@usr06.primenet.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I had thought that with the native version of FreebSD these would go > > away, but they don't. How do I get the: > > > > Warning: Action not found : insert-selection, kill-selection > > > > dialog boxes to go away? I note that these don't exist anywhere in > > XKesyms or whatever. > > > > They aren't a show-stopper, but they are annoying none-the-less. > > I was able to get them to go away on the nonnative version by > installing the OSF keysyms for Motif *2.0*. I think the ones > you kave may be *1.2*? I don't have any, since Netscape is statically compiled, and doesn't provide any. Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 15:35:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA11708 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:35:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr02.primenet.com (tlambert@usr02.primenet.com [206.165.6.202]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA11703 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:35:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr02.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA00959; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:35:17 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709092235.PAA00959@usr02.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Do you have some neat configuration files? To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:35:17 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970909223106.MK41707@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Sep 9, 97 10:31:06 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > Any other suggestions? > > > > fvwm95. > > qvwm instead. Less complex, and IMHO less error-prone than fvwm95. > I've been setting it up for a customer's machine recently. (Looks a > little green at some edges still.) Does it look like Windows95 as well? I haven't played with it... I'd be very interested if it did. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 15:47:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA12351 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:47:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr02.primenet.com (tlambert@usr02.primenet.com [206.165.6.202]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA12346 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:47:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr02.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA01710; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:47:15 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709092247.PAA01710@usr02.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes To: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:47:14 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, nate@mt.sri.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199709092221.QAA26290@rocky.mt.sri.com> from "Nate Williams" at Sep 9, 97 04:21:06 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > Warning: Action not found : insert-selection, kill-selection [ ... ] > > I was able to get them to go away on the nonnative version by > > installing the OSF keysyms for Motif *2.0*. I think the ones > > you kave may be *1.2*? > > I don't have any, since Netscape is statically compiled, and doesn't > provide any. You do. You just don't know it. Look at /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/XKeysymDB. You are missing bindings for: osfInsertSelection osfKillSelection Which is part of the newer Motif 2.0 Drag And Drop stuff. The bindings in the XFree86 distribution are for Motif 1.2.3. Sorry, I don't have a Motif of any kind, only the clone I've been working on forever -- I didn't want to have the reverse engineering legal issues Lesstif has, so i don't know what the proper bindings should be. 8-(. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 16:51:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA16603 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:51:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA16589 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:51:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id JAA19602; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 09:21:11 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970910092111.09646@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 09:21:11 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Joerg Wunsch Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Do you have some neat configuration files? References: <19970908153822.27586@lemis.com> <23971.873704247@time.cdrom.com> <19970909223400.JE31478@uriah.heep.sax.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <19970909223400.JE31478@uriah.heep.sax.de>; from J Wunsch on Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 10:34:00PM +0200 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 10:34:00PM +0200, J Wunsch wrote: > As Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > >> Greg has really placed two separate proposals here before you, the >> first being the collection of some nifty startup file bits and "canned >> user profiles" which Joe User might crib from, just as hackers on true >> timesharing UNIX systems used to crib useful tidbits from various >> admin personnel's startup files when left readable, and the second >> being the actual incorporation of this data into the CVS repository >> for more ongoing "skeleton file" work. > > I would rather suggest making this a port/package, something like a > `defaultuser' package. Of course, we should learn from some L-system > distributions, and work hard to avoid that people will actually be > able to install this user setup without customizing it (thus sending > out mail from an account named `default' or such later). Good idea. > Having said this, it now requires a volunteer... I suppose I volunteered. Now let's have some suggestions how to do it. As you probably know, I'm up to my eyeballs getting the next edition of CFBSD out, so it'll be a couple of weeks before I can do anything, but since I want to refer to it in the book, it would be a good idea to get our act together. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 16:58:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA16912 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:58:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA16890; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 16:58:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id JAA19751; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 09:28:00 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970910092800.19891@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 09:28:00 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Eivind Eklund Cc: questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do you have some neat configuration files? References: <19970908153822.27586@lemis.com> <199709092156.XAA04771@bitbox.follo.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709092156.XAA04771@bitbox.follo.net>; from Eivind Eklund on Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 11:56:40PM +0200 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 11:56:40PM +0200, Eivind Eklund wrote: >> >> Jordan and I have just been discussing adding some contributed >> configuration files to the distribution CD-ROMs. I'm primarily >> thinking of .rc scripts for editors, mail readers, window >> managers and such. > > .{zsh,csh,bash,..}rc files too, or is this too personal again? I don't see any reason why people shouldn't have the choice. Just one thing: I'm collecting this stuff, I'm not documenting it. I'll accept anything that looks even remotely useful, as long as it's not *very big*. I'm expecting most of these files to be less than 10 kB long, though I'll accept any size as long as it looks useful and there's space on the CD. But: people will use these files only if they can understand them. That means there should be one README file for each contribution. If there isn't, people are not likely to pay much attention to them. >> One size doesn't fit all, of course, and there's a good chance that >> there are other versions out there which many (even most) people will >> prefer. So why not supply them too? If you have anything that you >> feel is worth sharing, please let me know. About the only thing I ask >> is that the files don't contain too much dead wood (I know mine do :-) > > I can try to find time clean up my emacs setup again, if an advanced > and thus large but well-documented, made-for-snatching setup is of > interest. (It's close to 50k of elisp-code, including some emulation > code for features missing from the emacs distribution but present in > other editors, e.g. making it possible to move between windows split > in multiple directions with ctrl-alt-) I wrote my 10 kB limit before reading this. On the surface, there's no conflict, especially if it's well documented. Directory layout: we have the directory /usr/share/skel/extras. One possibility would be to create a subdirectory of that directory for each collection of config files, along with a description. Another would be to create one subdirectory for each program for which we have config files (like fvwm, bash, emacs, vi, ...). On the whole, I think the second approach is more useful, but it'll take more work (on my part). What do you others think? Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 17:01:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA17150 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:01:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sasami.jurai.net (winter@sasami.jurai.net [207.96.1.17]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA17124 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:01:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (winter@localhost) by sasami.jurai.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA09490; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 20:00:50 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 20:00:50 -0400 (EDT) From: "Matthew N. Dodd" To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: upsd? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > Anyone have a source for upses designed to be connected to banks of > batteries? I saw some somewhere but I can't remember where? http://www.bestpower.com/ /* Matthew N. Dodd | A memory retaining a love you had for life winter@jurai.net | As cruel as it seems nothing ever seems to http://www.jurai.net/~winter | go right - FLA M 3.1:53 */ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 17:13:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA17992 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:13:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gaia.coppe.ufrj.br (jonny@cisigw.coppe.ufrj.br [146.164.5.200]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA17985 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:13:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jonny@localhost) by gaia.coppe.ufrj.br (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA09555; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:13:01 -0300 (EST) From: Joao Carlos Mendes Luis Message-Id: <199709100013.VAA09555@gaia.coppe.ufrj.br> Subject: Re: FATAL:xmalloc:Unable to allocate 4096 bytes. In-Reply-To: <3415C502.EEFA722@mexcom.net> from Edwin Culp at "Sep 9, 97 04:52:02 pm" To: eculp@mexcom.net (Edwin Culp) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:13:00 -0300 (EST) Cc: squid-users@nlanr.net, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL32 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk #define quoting(Edwin Culp) // Squid 1.1.15 // FreeBSD RELEG-2_2 // pentium 133Mh // 128M Ram with 32M for squid // 1.8G divided in two disks, different controlers eide. // >7,000 connections per hour. // // Worked fine at 3,500 Connections and release 2.2.2 // I upgraded with cvsup and supprise. I'm recompiling // my kernel just in case. // // It can't even finish reading the cache before dying:-( // Anyone else seen this? This is a side effect of the new feature in FreeBSD 2_2_RELENG: login classes. Edit /etc/login.conf and change the "daemon" entry to allow more than those feeble 30M datasize, or change datasize to datasize-cur. Jonny -- Joao Carlos Mendes Luis jonny@gta.ufrj.br +55 21 290-4698 jonny@coppe.ufrj.br Universidade Federal do Rio de Janeiro UFRJ/COPPE/CISI PGP fingerprint: 29 C0 50 B9 B6 3E 58 F2 83 5F E3 26 BF 0F EA 67 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 17:21:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA18439 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:21:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from awfulhak.demon.co.uk (awfulhak.demon.co.uk [158.152.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA18376 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:20:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lan.awfulhak.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by awfulhak.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA19331; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 01:18:04 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199709100018.BAA19331@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Archie Cobbs cc: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey), doconnor@ist.flinders.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 20:53:34 PDT." <199709090353.UAA26952@bubba.whistle.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 01:18:04 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > >> IMHO, the proper way to do this is to let the PPP daemon handle it > > >> by installing a route first (so you let the routing code determine > > >> whether packets are supposed to go over the WAN link or not, as it > > >> should) and then checking each outgoing packet for suitability as > > >> "demand" (not all are, e.g., NTP packets). When "demand" is seen, > > >> it should start dialing, etc. The same "demand" test can also apply > > >> to idle timeout calculations. This is how mpd does it, anyway. > > > > > > Yeah, same with ijppp, but it means you can only use those packages to > > > do a connection, ie its not very general... > > > > I don't understand. Which packets do you want to use? If they're not > > destined for that interface, they shouldn't cause a dialup. > > > > > (So its too bad if you have dialon demand ISDN :) > > > > I don't understand this statement, either. > > I think what he's saying is that it would be nice to divorce the > "dial-on-demand" functionality from the thing that is actually > doing the dialing... you could do this with divert sockets, but > it would require some sort of "api" to the PPP process not only > to tell it to connect (eg, send SIGUSR1), but also to be able to > determine whether the link is already up (to avoid a flood of > such signals). The "ask it to dial" bit is functional now (as of a few minutes ago) with the following: pppctl -v -t 120 -p xxx 3000 dial The "is the line up" bit has been there for some time: pppctl -v -p xxx 3000 show log | grep ^PPP >/dev/null && echo UP > -Archie > > ___________________________________________________________________________ > Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com -- Brian , Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 17:24:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA18655 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:24:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from awfulhak.demon.co.uk (awfulhak.demon.co.uk [158.152.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA18585 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:23:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lan.awfulhak.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by awfulhak.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA19433; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 01:22:48 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199709100022.BAA19433@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Jaye Mathisen cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How the heck do you drop DTR? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 1997 23:33:12 PDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 01:22:48 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Taking my ppp problem /modem interaction to its illogical extreme, I > hacked up a simple modem dialler test system under perl5. > > It works OK, after having to define some constants like CCTS_IFLOW and > CRTS_OFLOW that for some reason the POSIX module for perl5 doesn't define. > > However, for the life of me, I can't figure out how to actually drop > DTR. killall -2 ppp -- Brian , Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 17:28:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA19005 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:28:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from awfulhak.demon.co.uk (awfulhak.demon.co.uk [158.152.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA18964 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:27:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lan.awfulhak.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by awfulhak.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA19526; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 01:26:02 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199709100026.BAA19526@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: "Daniel J. O'Connor" cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 09 Sep 1997 16:16:10 +0930." <199709090646.QAA19226@lofty.ist.flinders.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 01:26:01 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > Having a secrets file screws it up tho :-/ > > In what way ? > Well, when I added a screts file enrty for my machine(so I could telnet > to port 3000), it seemed to not read the /etc/ppp/ppp.conf file, and so > none of my dial strings got read :-/ > I'm pretty sure I have my config files set up OK too :-( My mistake. Should be fixed now. > Seeya > Darius > ~~~~~~ -- Brian , Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 17:46:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA20237 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:46:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA20232 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:46:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <53178(5)>; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:45:58 PDT Received: from localhost by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177486>; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:45:47 -0700 To: Lutz Albers cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 97 01:50:58 PDT." Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:45:32 PDT From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <97Sep9.174547pdt.177486@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Lutz Albers wrote: >Or use the modules system (see ). You would use the >command > module add >to add it to PATH, and > module delete >to remove it. We use something like this at PARC. It's incredibly useful, since it allows you to have multiple versions of software around and turn them on or off individually without having to rename executables, but I'm always running into hard-coded limits. My $PATH is nearly 1k bytes long, and if it gets any longer random programs start misbehaving in various strange ways. Same with $MANPATH. Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 18:33:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA23341 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 18:33:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ns.mexcom.net (mail.mexcom.net [206.103.64.9] (may be forged)) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA23336 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 18:33:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sunix (eculp@sunix.mexcom.net [206.103.64.3]) by ns.mexcom.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA00829; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 20:31:32 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3415F8E3.3BFB69CC@mexcom.net> Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 20:33:23 -0500 From: Edwin Culp Organization: Mexico Communicates, S.C. X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; Linux 2.0.14 i586) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Joao Carlos Mendes Luis CC: Edwin Culp , squid-users@nlanr.net, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FATAL:xmalloc:Unable to allocate 4096 bytes. References: <199709100013.VAA09555@gaia.coppe.ufrj.br> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Joao Carlos Mendes Luis wrote: > > #define quoting(Edwin Culp) > // Squid 1.1.15 > // FreeBSD RELEG-2_2 > // pentium 133Mh > // 128M Ram with 32M for squid > // 1.8G divided in two disks, different controlers eide. > // >7,000 connections per hour. > // > // Worked fine at 3,500 Connections and release 2.2.2 > // I upgraded with cvsup and supprise. I'm recompiling > // my kernel just in case. > // > // It can't even finish reading the cache before dying:-( > // Anyone else seen this? > > This is a side effect of the new feature in FreeBSD 2_2_RELENG: > login classes. Edit /etc/login.conf and change the "daemon" > entry to allow more than those feeble 30M datasize, or change > datasize to datasize-cur. > > Jonny > > -- > Joao Carlos Mendes Luis jonny@gta.ufrj.br > +55 21 290-4698 jonny@coppe.ufrj.br > Universidade Federal do Rio de Janeiro UFRJ/COPPE/CISI > PGP fingerprint: 29 C0 50 B9 B6 3E 58 F2 83 5F E3 26 BF 0F EA 67 That was the problem. Thanks a lot. Ed From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 18:42:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA24009 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 18:42:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kf0yn.ampr.org ([204.176.110.190]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA24002 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 18:42:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [44.50.32.7] (kf0yn-mb.ampr.org [44.50.32.7]) by kf0yn.ampr.org (8.8.5/8.6.5) with ESMTP id UAA13775; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 20:41:38 -0500 (CDT) X-Sender: cmf@44.50.32.6 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 20:18:22 -0500 To: "Suresh Mali" From: Carl Fongheiser Subject: Re: Fwd: Posix thread support Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> >>Hi, >> >>I want to find out is the posix thread in FreeBSD-2.2.2. REALESE is >>stable? >> >>Are all libraries are thread safe? I'd be surprised if *all* the libraries are thread safe. >>If yes then >> >>cd /usr/src/lib/libc_r; make all && make install >> >>will Install all corect thread safe libraries or anything else >required? >> >>Is pthread packege 100 % posix thread complient or anything missing? No, it's not 100% compliant. Some gaps: sched_yield() doesn't exist. It's there under the wrong name, though; it's called pthread_yield(). The static initializer macros (PTHREAD_MUTEX_INITIALIZER, PTHREAD_COND_INTIALIZER, etc.) aren't in the public include file; they're squirreled away in /usr/src/lib/libc_r/uthread/pthread_private.h Carl Fongheiser cmf@netins.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 19:13:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA25743 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:13:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA25725 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:13:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (lot.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [203.20.121.21]) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA03010 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 11:43:01 +0930 (CST) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA00621; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 11:39:52 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709100139.LAA00621@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Ada T Lim cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: hackers-digest V3 #332 In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 09 Sep 1997 20:21:18 +1000." <199709091021.UAA00803@polya.blah.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 11:39:52 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Mike Smith, Ada T Lim (as soon as she releases a working libzip :-) > > It works! It works! it just randomly produces files with 50k of garbage in > them :( This is obviously some new definition of "works" that I was previously unfamiliar with. 8) Is the problem on the compressing or extracting side of things? mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 19:15:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA25834 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:15:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wong.rogerswave.ca (wong.rogerswave.ca [204.92.17.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA25827 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:15:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from wong@localhost) by wong.rogerswave.ca (8.8.7/8.7.3) id UAA00801; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 20:45:51 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 20:45:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Ken Wong X-Sender: wong@wong.rogerswave.ca Reply-To: wong@rogerswave.ca To: Terry Lambert cc: kpneal@pobox.com, terry@lambert.olg, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. In-Reply-To: <199709090331.UAA28025@usr01.primenet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 9 Sep 1997, Terry Lambert wrote: > > I have a kernel patch do just that. actually, it applys to alot of OS; > > QNX, Tandem Non-Stop Kernel, Minix. > > > > I don't know how if possible to include/commit it in the kernel tree. > > anyhow, If you are interested, I can send you the files. > > > > it is basically can do the following: > > [ ... SYSVIPC, simplified ... ] > > Sex would dictate that it would be neater if it worked between threads. > if you mean kernel thread and the threads have their own pids. :( Ken From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 19:30:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA27135 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:30:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA27104 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:30:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (lot.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [203.20.121.21]) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA03256 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 11:59:59 +0930 (CST) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA00683; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 11:56:12 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709100156.LAA00683@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Bernard.Steiner@de.uu.net cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: lpt ECS support. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 09 Sep 1997 16:14:18 +0200." <199709091414.QAA12742@qwerty.de.uu.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 11:56:11 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > forgive me if this is an inappropriate mailing list (do give me a pointer) - > I have recently hacked up the 2.2.2 i386/isa/lpt driver to provide basic > support for some advanced features of the ECP parallel port that comes with > my motherboard, currently including This is somewhat unfortunate, as the lpt driver is in the process of being retired in favour of the ppbus interface. > I'd like to know whether anybody > (a) is interested in this, if so, where to send it Naturally we'd be interested to see how your work would integrate with the new ppbus model; anything that improves port performance would be just wonderful. There's a version of the ppbus code that can be integrated into 2.2 at http://www.prism.uvsq.fr/~son/PPBUS. If you want to work with us on this (and we would certainly appreciate that!), the list at ppbus@smith.net.au will reach the relevant parties. > (c) is working on integration of lpt as a proper tty (and get the > if_lp stuff out of lpt.c) to eventually allowing ieee1284 compliant > lptread(). I looked at sio.c and find siopoll() rather confusing... Hopefully the new model will make more sense. If you're looking for some background detail, hit the ppbus list and I'll fill you in. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 19:30:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA27195 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:30:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA27179 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:30:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by alpo.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA20222; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:23:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) via SMTP by alpo.whistle.com, id smtpd020212; Wed Sep 10 02:22:51 1997 Message-ID: <3416045E.446B9B3D@whistle.com> Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 19:22:22 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" CC: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > > Can someone give a code snippet of the BEST way of running a 1000HZ for > loop under freebsd, without consuming massive amounts of cpu time. > > Thank You In advance. check the pcaudio driver. it sets the hardware interrupt speed to 16000 Hz (!) using the routines in the kernel, you can get a function (in the kernel) to be called at each H/W interrupt, and you can make the H/w interrupts be a multiple of the hz value (normally 100) the pcaudio claims all the timers, (2 timers are used to control the audio hardware in PCs (pitch and beep-duration) you don't need to do that, just look at how it changes the timer.. 1000Hz, not a real problem compared to 16000. :) julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 19:31:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA27282 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:31:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA27261 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:31:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id MAA01237; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 12:00:52 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970910120052.21535@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 12:00:52 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Joerg Wunsch Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do you have some neat configuration files? References: <19970908153822.27586@lemis.com> <199709082133.OAA09929@usr09.primenet.com> <19970909223106.MK41707@uriah.heep.sax.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <19970909223106.MK41707@uriah.heep.sax.de>; from J Wunsch on Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 10:31:06PM +0200 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 10:31:06PM +0200, J Wunsch wrote: > As Terry Lambert wrote: > >>> Any other suggestions? >> >> fvwm95. > > qvwm instead. Less complex, and IMHO less error-prone than fvwm95. > I've been setting it up for a customer's machine recently. (Looks a > little green at some edges still.) Do you want to contribute a sample config? I wish I'd heard of this earlier, and I might have had time to use it in the book, but now I'm going to have to stick with fvwm2. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 19:51:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA28573 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:51:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA28559 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:51:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (lot.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [203.20.121.21]) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA03369 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 12:20:50 +0930 (CST) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA00765; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 12:17:49 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709100217.MAA00765@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 09 Sep 1997 11:44:10 MST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 12:17:49 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Can someone give a code snippet of the BEST way of running a 1000HZ for > loop under freebsd, without consuming massive amounts of cpu time. How about you tell us what you're actually trying to do? It sounds like you want to poll something at a fixed 1KHz rate, which is a) uncivilised and b) not terribly easy without fiddling. If this is what you're after, look at the 'pcaudio' driver, which fiddles one of the timers to arrange a fast regular interrupt. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 19:58:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA29117 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:58:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA29111 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:58:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (lot.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [203.20.121.21]) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA03409 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 12:28:47 +0930 (CST) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA00790; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 12:21:17 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709100221.MAA00790@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Temcguire@aol.com cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Interpreter compilers In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 09 Sep 1997 14:31:46 -0400." <970909142903_-131376035@emout04.mail.aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 12:21:16 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > In the realm of rapid prototyping with interpretive languages, there appear > to be several options in FreeBSD (1997). I noticed tcl/tk, JAVA and PERL in > particular and observed scheme and python. It appears that a compiler exists > for scheme (scheme-to-C). > > Question#2: Can PERL scripts be translated into C and compiled into > executables? Do regular expressions and associative arrays (awk) exist in > any other languages that can be translated and compiled? It looks like the Perl enthusiasts have gotten to you already, so I'll restrict myself to my own field. 8) Tcl supports both regular expressions and associative arrays, and the current Tcl (8.0) also features a JIT compiler. Depending on your choice of algorithms, Perl and Tcl are generally comparable in speed. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 21:29:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA04219 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:29:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr04.primenet.com (tlambert@usr04.primenet.com [206.165.6.204]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA04213 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:29:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr04.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA10562; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:29:15 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709100429.VAA10562@usr04.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Divert sockets.. To: wong@rogerswave.ca Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 04:29:15 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, kpneal@pobox.com, terry@lambert.olg, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Ken Wong" at Sep 9, 97 08:45:50 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Sex would dictate that it would be neater if it worked between threads. > > if you mean kernel thread and the threads have their own pids. :( No. You obviously haven't heard my lament on kernel threads giving away quantum that belongs to the process when issuing blocking calls, or the unfair competition for non-threaded processes when the number of kernel threads is less than the number of user space threads. Rather than repeat myself, see the -hackers and -current list archives for "threads". Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 21:31:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA04339 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:31:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au [129.78.129.109]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA04333 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:31:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dawes@localhost) by rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.2) id OAA29818; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 14:30:42 +1000 (EST) Message-ID: <19970910143042.08357@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 14:30:42 +1000 From: David Dawes To: Satoshi Asami Cc: jacob@jblhome.ping.dk, ssigala@globalnet.it, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: My FreeBSD Wish List... References: <8767safewy.fsf@pippin.jblhome.ping.dk> <199709092121.OAA29539@vader.cs.berkeley.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709092121.OAA29539@vader.cs.berkeley.edu>; from Satoshi Asami on Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 02:21:27PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 02:21:27PM -0700, Satoshi Asami wrote: > * Well, actually there is. After compiling and installing the X11 > * distribution, you teach Imake to install future programs/libs/header > * files/whatever in another tree; you teach Imake to look for include > * files, libraries, whatever in the old tree too. > >Of course. That's what I said -- we need to change the Imake config >to make it happen. It is conceivable that we ship our releases with >those tweaked Imake config files. > >However, I don't think it is feasible for us to stray away from the >standard X11R6/XFree86 distributions in such a major way. That is >bound to cause too much confusion ("help, I installed the new XFree86 >from ftp.xfree86.org, and my X ports don't work!!!"). > >If enough people request the XFree86 folks, maybe they will change >it. But let me reiterate, this is no a FreeBSD ports issue, it is an >XFree86 issue, so please don't bring it up here. I'm still waiting for someone to make these changes and submit them to us at XFree86. XFree86 is a bit like FreeBSD in that new features are more likely to appear when those most interested in them implement them. I personally would very much like to see this sort of thing implemented, but I have too many other higher priority things to deal with to be able to do it myself in the forseeable future. I will however review any proposed changes, and, if they are well implemented, see that they get included in a future XFree86 release. On a partly related note, a future XFree86 release will put config files (like xdm config files for example) in a directory hierarchy below /var (most likely /var/X11). It is possible that future X11 releases from The Open Group will do this too. This will make it easier to use a read-only /usr/X11R6. None of this has been set in stone yet, so if anyone has any comments about this, please let me know. David From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 21:36:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA04640 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:36:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr04.primenet.com (tlambert@usr04.primenet.com [206.165.6.204]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA04633 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:36:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr04.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA10944; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:35:56 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709100435.VAA10944@usr04.primenet.com> Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? To: fenner@parc.xerox.com (Bill Fenner) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 04:35:55 +0000 (GMT) Cc: lutz@muc.de, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <97Sep9.174547pdt.177486@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> from "Bill Fenner" at Sep 9, 97 05:45:32 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > module add > >to add it to PATH, and > > module delete > >to remove it. > > We use something like this at PARC. It's incredibly useful, since > it allows you to have multiple versions of software around and turn > them on or off individually without having to rename executables, but > I'm always running into hard-coded limits. My $PATH is nearly 1k bytes > long, and if it gets any longer random programs start misbehaving in > various strange ways. Same with $MANPATH. There is adire need for shell expanded path globbing characters (ie: they are expanded internally instead of globbed into the variable). Then, as long as you played nice with the module program installing into directories that globbing would coelesce modules, you'd be set. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 21:58:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA05551 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:58:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au [129.78.129.109]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA05543 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:57:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dawes@localhost) by rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.2) id OAA29923; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 14:56:48 +1000 (EST) Message-ID: <19970910145647.33919@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 14:56:47 +1000 From: David Dawes To: Terry Lambert Cc: Nate Williams , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes References: <199709092221.QAA26290@rocky.mt.sri.com> <199709092247.PAA01710@usr02.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709092247.PAA01710@usr02.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 10:47:14PM +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 10:47:14PM +0000, Terry Lambert wrote: >> > > Warning: Action not found : insert-selection, kill-selection > >[ ... ] > >> > I was able to get them to go away on the nonnative version by >> > installing the OSF keysyms for Motif *2.0*. I think the ones >> > you kave may be *1.2*? >> >> I don't have any, since Netscape is statically compiled, and doesn't >> provide any. > >You do. You just don't know it. > >Look at /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/XKeysymDB. > >You are missing bindings for: > > osfInsertSelection > osfKillSelection > >Which is part of the newer Motif 2.0 Drag And Drop stuff. The >bindings in the XFree86 distribution are for Motif 1.2.3. > >Sorry, I don't have a Motif of any kind, only the clone I've been >working on forever -- I didn't want to have the reverse engineering >legal issues Lesstif has, so i don't know what the proper bindings >should be. 8-(. It is complaining about unknown actions, which to me means a problem with the RHS of a translation, not a problem with unknown keysyms on the LHS. The XKeysymDB file supplied with 4.02b7 is identical to the XFree86 one in regard to the osf symbols listed. I've never seen this particular problem when running any version of netscape anywhere (including the native FreeBSD 4.02b7 version), and my guess is that there is an old Netscape app-defaults installed which refers to actions which don't exist (any more) (or something similar in a .Xdefaults file). The comments in the sample Netscape.ad file recommend strongly that it not be installed in the app-defaults directory for reasons of version skew. I've tested this theory by making the following change to Netscape.ad, and installing it in my app-defaults directory. I then get the following warning message 4 times: Warning: Actions not found: kill-selection, insert-selection *** /usr/local/lib/netscape/Netscape.ad Sun Aug 3 15:38:34 1997 --- /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/app-defaults/Netscape Wed Sep 10 14:49:22 1997 *************** *** 764,770 **** Meta ~Ctrl ~ShiftosfRight:forward-word() \n\ Alt ~Ctrl ~ShiftosfRight:forward-word() \n\ Meta ~Ctrl ShiftosfRight:forward-word(extend) \n\ ! Alt ~Ctrl ShiftosfRight:forward-word(extend) \n ! : KeyUpInText() \n ! Meta ~Ctrl w: copy-clipboard() \n\ --- 764,772 ---- Meta ~Ctrl ~ShiftosfRight:forward-word() \n\ Alt ~Ctrl ~ShiftosfRight:forward-word() \n\ Meta ~Ctrl ShiftosfRight:forward-word(extend) \n\ ! Alt ~Ctrl ShiftosfRight:forward-word(extend) \n\ ! osfCut: kill-selection() \n\ ! osfPaste: insert-selection() \n ! : KeyUpInText() \n ! Meta ~Ctrl w: copy-clipboard() \n\ If I add a line: noSuchKey: forward-word() \n I get the following warning: Warning: translation table syntax error: Unknown keysym name: noSuchKey Warning: ... found while parsing 'noSuchKey: forward-word() ' David From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 22:03:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA05818 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:03:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA05805 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:03:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id OAA01376; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 14:26:34 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970910142634.55557@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 14:26:34 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: David Dawes Cc: Satoshi Asami , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: My FreeBSD Wish List... References: <8767safewy.fsf@pippin.jblhome.ping.dk> <199709092121.OAA29539@vader.cs.berkeley.edu> <19970910143042.08357@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <19970910143042.08357@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au>; from David Dawes on Wed, Sep 10, 1997 at 02:30:42PM +1000 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, Sep 10, 1997 at 02:30:42PM +1000, David Dawes wrote: > On Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 02:21:27PM -0700, Satoshi Asami wrote: > On a partly related note, a future XFree86 release will put config files > (like xdm config files for example) in a directory hierarchy below /var > (most likely /var/X11). It is possible that future X11 releases from The > Open Group will do this too. This will make it easier to use a read-only > /usr/X11R6. None of this has been set in stone yet, so if anyone has > any comments about this, please let me know. Well, at the risk of the lives of a few protestants, why /var? My reading of /var is that it is for frequently changing files, such as spool files. I agree that it would be nice to have a read-only /usr, but I think it would be worth giving a bit more consideration for the new home of the config files. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 22:23:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA06778 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:23:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA06770 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:23:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id HAA00898 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:23:03 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id HAA04099; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:19:33 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970910071933.JD28384@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:19:33 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do you have some neat configuration files? References: <19970908153822.27586@lemis.com> <199709082133.OAA09929@usr09.primenet.com> <19970909223106.MK41707@uriah.heep.sax.de> <19970910120052.21535@lemis.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <19970910120052.21535@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Sep 10, 1997 12:00:52 +0930 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Greg Lehey wrote: > > qvwm instead. > Do you want to contribute a sample config? I wish I'd heard of this > earlier, and I might have had time to use it in the book, but now I'm > going to have to stick with fvwm2. Let's see. A colleague has prepared a neat desktop for his friend, perhaps i can steal her setup, and cut it down a little. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 22:29:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA07044 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:29:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA07039 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:29:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id GAA20837; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 06:19:15 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199709100419.GAA20837@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: interrupts in interrupt routines To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 06:19:15 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo), hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <19970909225801.RL53370@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Sep 9, 97 10:57:42 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > RTFM. :-) > > > SPL(9) FreeBSD Kernel Developer's Manual SPL(9) thanks for pointing out the page. > assigns interrupt 12 to the ``tty'' priority group. The system automati- > cally arranges for interrupts in the xxx group to be called at a priority > >= splxxx (). does the >= make any sense since there is no ordering, just masks ? Also, since we are on the subject: for certain things, such as the sound driver, etc. it would suffice to block interrupts for the single device, not for all of them or even for larger groups. Would it be a problem to have fine-grained masks ? One could worry about having too many masks, but since there are just 16 interrupt lines in the PC architecture maybe scalability is not a problem... Any ideas on how to implement this ? Cheers Luigi -----------------------------+-------------------------------------- Luigi Rizzo | Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it | Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 | via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 | http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ _____________________________|______________________________________ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 22:31:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA07209 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:31:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au [129.78.129.109]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA07198 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:31:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dawes@localhost) by rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.2) id PAA00160; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:24:44 +1000 (EST) Message-ID: <19970910152444.50890@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:24:44 +1000 From: David Dawes To: Greg Lehey Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: My FreeBSD Wish List... References: <8767safewy.fsf@pippin.jblhome.ping.dk> <199709092121.OAA29539@vader.cs.berkeley.edu> <19970910143042.08357@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> <19970910142634.55557@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <19970910142634.55557@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Wed, Sep 10, 1997 at 02:26:34PM +0930 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, Sep 10, 1997 at 02:26:34PM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: >On Wed, Sep 10, 1997 at 02:30:42PM +1000, David Dawes wrote: >> On Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 02:21:27PM -0700, Satoshi Asami wrote: >> On a partly related note, a future XFree86 release will put config files >> (like xdm config files for example) in a directory hierarchy below /var >> (most likely /var/X11). It is possible that future X11 releases from The >> Open Group will do this too. This will make it easier to use a read-only >> /usr/X11R6. None of this has been set in stone yet, so if anyone has >> any comments about this, please let me know. > >Well, at the risk of the lives of a few protestants, why /var? My >reading of /var is that it is for frequently changing files, such as >spool files. I agree that it would be nice to have a read-only /usr, >but I think it would be worth giving a bit more consideration for the >new home of the config files. It is following the precedent set by (for example) Digital Unix and some Linux distributions. CDE (as seen on Solaris 2.5 and Digital Unix) uses /etc/dt for CDE's config file overrides. We also need a place to put files that might be created at run-time (like the complied xkb map) which should really go to some writeable place that isn't publicly writeable. Currently those files get written under /usr/X11R6 when the server's uid/euid is 0. Perhaps those two issues should be separated. FWIW, the hier(5) man page on Digital Unix 4.0 gives the same basic description of /var as the hier(7) man page on FreeBSD 2.2.2, and admittedly config files don't fit into that description. A difference is that on the page on Digital Unix describes /var/adm/sendmail as being the place for sendmail configuration and database files. The nearest exception I can find on FreeBSB is /var/cron/tabs (which isn't mentioned in the hier(7) man page I have here). Anyway, I'm looking for suggestions and comments at this stage. If possible, I'd like to see something common to all the platforms XFree86 supports, and something which isn't different from existing solutions just for the sake of it. David From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 22:41:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA07841 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:41:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brickbat9.mindspring.com (brickbat9.mindspring.com [207.69.200.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA07835 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:41:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bogus.mindspring.com (user-37kbo0j.dialup.mindspring.com [207.69.224.19]) by brickbat9.mindspring.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id BAA11194; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 01:41:19 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970910054020.00cc13ec@mail.mindspring.com> X-Sender: kpneal@mail.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 01:40:20 -0400 To: David Dawes From: "Kevin P. Neal" Subject: Re: My FreeBSD Wish List... Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 02:30 PM 9/10/97 +1000, David Dawes wrote: >On a partly related note, a future XFree86 release will put config files >(like xdm config files for example) in a directory hierarchy below /var >(most likely /var/X11). It is possible that future X11 releases from The >Open Group will do this too. This will make it easier to use a read-only >/usr/X11R6. None of this has been set in stone yet, so if anyone has >any comments about this, please let me know. Wouldn't it be better to put them below, say, /etc/X11? With logging going to /var/log/X11/* or something? I personally am bothered by config files in /var. I was under the impression that /etc was the proper location of config files. >From NetBSD's hier manpage (the FreeBSD box in the apt is in the room of a sleeping person, so...): /etc system configuration files and scripts /var multi-purpose log, temporary, transient, and spool files. Am I out of line here? -- XCOMM Kevin P. Neal, Junior, Comp. Sci. - House of Retrocomputing XCOMM mailto:kpneal@pobox.com - http://www.pobox.com/~kpn/ XCOMM kpneal@eos.ncsu.edu Spoken by Keir Finlow-Bates: XCOMM "Good grief, I've just noticed I've typed in a rant. Sorry chaps!" From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 22:52:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA08340 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:52:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA08296 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:51:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id HAA01080 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:51:55 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id HAA04184; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:40:22 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970910074022.JK00558@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:40:22 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do you have some neat configuration files? References: <19970909223106.MK41707@uriah.heep.sax.de> <199709092235.PAA00959@usr02.primenet.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709092235.PAA00959@usr02.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Sep 9, 1997 22:35:17 +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Terry Lambert wrote: > > > fvwm95. > > > > qvwm instead. > Does it look like Windows95 as well? This was the reason to mention it at all, of course. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 22:53:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA08445 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:53:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA08413 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 22:52:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id HAA01102 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:52:48 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id HAA04223; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:43:43 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970910074343.JA31345@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:43:43 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Tape question References: <19970909162235.DF18120@ida.interface-business.de> <199709091902.VAA01447@yedi.iaf.nl> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709091902.VAA01447@yedi.iaf.nl>; from Wilko Bulte on Sep 9, 1997 21:02:45 +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Wilko Bulte wrote: > > I've verified with this test program that it works on a DAT drive as > > well, with the ahc(4) driver in this case (and on 2.2-stable). > > If you want more data I could try a DLT2000 [don't tell me, I deleted > the posting] I don't think that wouldn't work either. I'm rather waiting for the original poster to try the test case again. It was he who claimed the FreeBSD driver wouldn't behave like it is expected to do (and me who tried to prove it does). -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 23:20:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA10046 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 23:20:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA10041 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 23:20:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA01282 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:20:35 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id HAA04278; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:56:04 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970910075604.SS25473@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:56:04 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: interrupts in interrupt routines References: <19970909225801.RL53370@uriah.heep.sax.de> <199709100419.GAA20837@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709100419.GAA20837@labinfo.iet.unipi.it>; from Luigi Rizzo on Sep 10, 1997 06:19:15 +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > The system automati- > > cally arranges for interrupts in the xxx group to be called at > > a priority >= splxxx (). > > does the >= make any sense since there is no ordering, just masks ? Read the ``>='' as ``is or does include this priority group''. There are some priority groups that are really inclusive, like splhigh. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Sep 9 23:23:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA10266 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 23:23:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from news1.gtn.com (news1.gtn.com [192.109.159.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA10258 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 23:23:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by news1.gtn.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with UUCP id IAA27422; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:15:38 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from andreas@localhost) by klemm.gtn.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA01075; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:02:42 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19970910080241.02760@klemm.gtn.com> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:02:41 +0200 From: Andreas Klemm To: Marty Leisner Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How should I partition my disk? References: <9709091907.AA22307@gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79 In-Reply-To: <9709091907.AA22307@gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com>; from Marty Leisner on Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 12:07:07PM -0800 X-Disclaimer: A free society is one where it is safe to be unpopular X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT SMP Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 12:07:07PM -0800, Marty Leisner wrote: > > I've seen no guidelines on how big to make partitions...(if I've > missed it, please point it out to me). Filesystem 1K-blocks Used Avail Capacity Mounted on /dev/sd1a 31743 18299 10905 63% / /dev/sd1s1e 194471 151937 26977 85% /var /dev/sd1s1g 1457855 588682 752545 44% /usr /dev/sd1s1f 297663 169121 104729 62% /usr/src /dev/sd0s2e 248047 139348 88856 61% /usr/obj /dev/sd0s2f 545759 404711 97388 81% /cvs /dev/sd0s2g 179011 112631 52060 68% /news /dev/sd2s1e 99183 6888 84361 8% /www /dev/sd2s1f 1882495 1349258 382638 78% /local procfs 4 4 0 100% /proc mfs:28 30991 9 28503 0% /tmp > I have a 6.4 gig IDE quantum bigfoot...I'm willing to give > about 1.2 gig to freebsd... 32M -> root fs swap -> 66M or 130M (depends on your memory and needs) /var -> 32M + printing (server) + news spool + users mailboxes /usr -> has base os, OS src and ports and X11R6 (/usr/local) 200+ /home -> your users work space ... or better ... leave out /home, create accounts in /usr/accounts and dedicate the Rest of the space to the /usr filesystem. > When I have enough space, I should be able to install everything, > including sources (not ports). > > Any reasonable ideas for a basic install (i.e. sizes and mount points) > ? (I hate the fact we insiston swap space). Figure out ... make perhaps a small test installation, that fits your needs only to see, how much space remains ... Keep in mind, that /usr/local grows rapidly with every freshly installed application and when using X11. Mybe you want a separate filesystem for the news (if you are running an nntp server). There you maybe want to use another filesystem setup, not 8192/1024 but 4096/512 ... Maybe same for proxy cache when driving a Proxy server ... Cheers Andreas /// -- Andreas Klemm | klemm.gtn.com - powered by Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/SMP.html http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/benches.html From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 00:34:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA13746 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 00:34:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from atena.eurocontrol.fr (atena.uneec.eurocontrol.fr [147.196.69.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA13721 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 00:34:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by atena.eurocontrol.fr; (5.65v3.2/1.3/10May95) id AA21333; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 09:34:31 +0200 Received: from brteec1 (brteec1.eurocontrol.fr) by eurocontrol.fr with SMTP (1.37.109.16/16.2) id AA255736809; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 09:33:29 +0200 Received: by brteec1 with Microsoft Mail id <3416CCEB@brteec1>; Wed, 10 Sep 97 09:38:03 PDT From: BRUN Philippe To: FREEBSD Subject: Port an arinc isa bus driver from HP Unix Date: Wed, 10 Sep 97 09:36:00 PDT Message-Id: <3416CCEB@brteec1> Encoding: 28 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I would like to port an ISA bus driver from HP Unix (I/O, IRQ and Ram) to FreeBSD. I am using the FreeBSD Device Driver Writer's Guide but I would like some examples and it's documentation to do the porting of this driver and if possible some technical support.( How to ) During BSD boot the message : ARINC ac00 port $300 Irq 5 panic kvtop zero page frame Who know why ? my probe function : static int aacprobe (struct isa_device *dev) { if (inb(dev->id_iobase) == 0xff) { printf("ARINC unable proceed inb port %x\n", dev->id_iobase); return ( 0 ); } if ( dev->id_msize > ARINC_SHORT_SIZE) { printf("ARINC memory size too large : %d\n", dev->id_msize); return(0); } return(1); } Thanks for all the answers and long life to FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 00:54:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA14807 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 00:54:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA14799 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 00:53:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id RAA10043; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 17:23:36 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970910172336.17475@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 17:23:36 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: BRUN Philippe Cc: FREEBSD Subject: Re: Port an arinc isa bus driver from HP Unix References: <3416CCEB@brteec1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <3416CCEB@brteec1>; from BRUN Philippe on Wed, Sep 10, 1997 at 09:36:00AM -0800 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, Sep 10, 1997 at 09:36:00AM -0800, BRUN Philippe wrote: > > I would like to port an ISA bus driver from HP Unix (I/O, IRQ and Ram) > to FreeBSD. > I am using the FreeBSD Device Driver Writer's Guide > but I would like some examples and it's documentation to do the porting > of this driver and if possible some technical support.( How to ) > > During BSD boot the message : ARINC ac00 port $300 Irq 5 panic kvtop zero > page frame > Who know why ? If you don't, nobody will. Where did it panic? What was the instruction? There's no reason to assume it happened in the function you list. Take a look at chapter 20 of the online handbook. It'll tell you how to perform kernel debugging. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 02:08:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA18650 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 02:08:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from colin.muc.de (root@colin.muc.de [193.174.4.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id CAA18642 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 02:08:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tavari.muc.de ([193.174.4.22]) by colin.muc.de with SMTP id <86046-2>; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 11:08:14 +0200 Received: from [192.168.42.51] (aleisha [192.168.42.51]) by tavari.muc.de (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA18189; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 10:48:35 +0200 (CEST) X-Sender: lutz@mail Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <97Sep9.174547pdt.177486@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> References: Your message of "Mon, 08 Sep 97 01:50:58 PDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 10:42:12 +0200 To: Bill Fenner From: Lutz Albers Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Bill Fenner wrote on 10.09.1997 Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /u >Lutz Albers wrote: >>Or use the modules system (see ). You would use the >>command >> module add >>to add it to PATH, and >> module delete >>to remove it. > >We use something like this at PARC. It's incredibly useful, since >it allows you to have multiple versions of software around and turn >them on or off individually without having to rename executables, but >I'm always running into hard-coded limits. My $PATH is nearly 1k bytes >long, and if it gets any longer random programs start misbehaving in >various strange ways. Same with $MANPATH. Yep, I known that. I've patched my copy of tcsh to cope with PATH lengths up to 4K. There is a #define to change that. ciao lutz -- Lutz Albers, lutz@muc.de, pgp key available from Do not take life too seriously, you will never get out of it alive. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 02:08:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA18666 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 02:08:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from colin.muc.de (root@colin.muc.de [193.174.4.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id CAA18646 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 02:08:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tavari.muc.de ([193.174.4.22]) by colin.muc.de with SMTP id <86048-1>; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 11:08:17 +0200 Received: from [192.168.42.51] (aleisha [192.168.42.51]) by tavari.muc.de (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA18196; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 10:52:05 +0200 (CEST) X-Sender: lutz@mail Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199709100435.VAA10944@usr04.primenet.com> Illegal-Object: Syntax error in References: value found on colin.muc.de: References: <97Sep9.174547pdt.177486@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> from "Bill Fenner" at Sep 9, 97 05: 45: 32 pm ^ ^ ^-illegal reference separator | \-illegal reference separator \-illegal reference separator Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 10:45:42 +0200 To: Terry Lambert From: Lutz Albers Subject: Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /usr/local/ports ? Cc: fenner@parc.xerox.com (Bill Fenner), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert wrote on 10.09.1997 Re: what do you think ... should/could ports move to -> /u >> > module add >> >to add it to PATH, and >> > module delete >> >to remove it. >> >> We use something like this at PARC. It's incredibly useful, since >> it allows you to have multiple versions of software around and turn >> them on or off individually without having to rename executables, but >> I'm always running into hard-coded limits. My $PATH is nearly 1k bytes >> long, and if it gets any longer random programs start misbehaving in >> various strange ways. Same with $MANPATH. > >There is adire need for shell expanded path globbing characters (ie: they >are expanded internally instead of globbed into the variable). Then, as >long as you played nice with the module program installing into directories >that globbing would coelesce modules, you'd be set. I'm not sure I understood that correctly, but if you mean something like PATH=/opt/*/bin then this wouldn't solve some of my problems. I keep multiple versions of some packages (i.e. perl4,perl5.003,perl5.004) around, to this would screw up my setup. That's the main reason why I use modules (plus the fact that you can kill a package with a few well defined rm's !) ciao lutz -- Lutz Albers, lutz@muc.de, pgp key available from Do not take life too seriously, you will never get out of it alive. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 02:30:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA19679 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 02:30:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bunyip.cc.uq.edu.au (daemon@bunyip.cc.uq.edu.au [130.102.2.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA19667 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 02:30:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by bunyip.cc.uq.edu.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA27529; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 19:27:48 +1000 Received: from localhost.dtir.qld.gov.au by ogre.dtir.qld.gov.au (8.7.5/DEVETIR-E0.3a) with SMTP id TAA24315; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 19:27:01 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709100927.TAA24315@ogre.dtir.qld.gov.au> To: "Marty Leisner" cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, syssgm@dtir.qld.gov.au Subject: Re: How should I partition my disk? References: <9709091907.AA22307@gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com> In-Reply-To: <9709091907.AA22307@gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com> from "Marty Leisner" at "Tue, 09 Sep 1997 19:07:07 +0000" Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 19:27:01 +1000 From: Stephen McKay Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tuesday, 9th September 1997, "Marty Leisner" wrote: >I've seen no guidelines on how big to make partitions...(if I've >missed it, please point it out to me). >I have a 6.4 gig IDE quantum bigfoot...I'm willing to give >about 1.2 gig to freebsd... >Any reasonable ideas for a basic install (i.e. sizes and mount points)? >(I hate the fact we insiston swap space). It's sort of a suck-it-and-see situation. An ISP is going to have different ideas about partitioning than a home user. A power X11 user's machine will have different requirements to a dedicated name server. The answer even changes over time because the underlying reasons change over time. For example, a small root partition was once essential for system recovery purposes. Now you could dispense with that (merging / and /usr) and rely on the fixit floppy. But I can give you some hints. :-) Make a separate partition for root and usr and one for every system you want to "box in" (that is, keep from crowding other stuff). So, if I was making a news server, I'd make root, swap, usr, newsctl, newspool and possibly one for news overviews. If I was hosting user mailboxes, /var/mail would get its own partition. On production boxes around here, various database intensive applications get their own partitions to stop them stomping on other applications, and to make backup orderly and neat. It's not a cut and dried science, and the bigger the box, the more you plan ahead. "So, what's this got to do with me?" you say. In your case, you probably just want to tinker at home. So, you can get by with just root, swap and usr. I'd recommend 30 to 50 Mb for root, 60 or more Mb for swap (I never use less than 2xRAM), and the rest for usr. There is a school of thought that says you should separate system directories from user directories (because it makes backups neater and system rebuilds simpler). If you want to follow this, you could try giving half of your spare space to /usr and half to /home. At home, I run with root, swap, usr, home and cvs. I only split the last bit into home and cvs to make them fit my backup device. You will be backing your stuff up, right? ;-) If you accidentally constrict yourself you can work around most problems using symbolic links, like if /var fills up /, you can move it to /usr/var and symlink /var to /usr/var. If you run out of swap, set "swapfile" in /etc/rc.conf to add some swap using vnconfig. In time, you will get the hang of it. Then you can get a Unix sysadm job! Stephen. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 03:47:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA22757 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 03:47:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sag.space.lockheed.com (sag.space.lockheed.com [192.68.162.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id DAA22749 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 03:47:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost by sag.space.lockheed.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/21Nov95-0423PM) id AA13088; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 03:47:18 -0700 Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 03:47:18 -0700 (PDT) From: "Brian N. Handy" To: Joerg Wunsch Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Tape question In-Reply-To: <19970910074343.JA31345@uriah.heep.sax.de> Message-Id: X-Files: The truth is out there Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> If you want more data I could try a DLT2000 [don't tell me, I deleted >> the posting] > >I don't think that wouldn't work either. I'm rather waiting for the >original poster to try the test case again. It was he who claimed the >FreeBSD driver wouldn't behave like it is expected to do (and me who >tried to prove it does). That would be me. It's going to be a few days; right now I'm on the east coast and my tape drive (and the tapes) are on the west coast. If things lighten up here I'm going to see if I can coordinate with a guy back at the ranch to help me play with this. Brian From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 04:47:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA25511 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 04:47:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail11.digital.com (mail11.digital.com [192.208.46.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA25502 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 04:47:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cssmuc.frt.dec.com (cssmuc.frt.dec.com [16.186.96.161]) by mail11.digital.com (8.7.5/UNX 1.5/1.0/WV) with SMTP id HAA04007 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:41:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mofo.frt.dec.com by cssmuc.frt.dec.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/14Nov95-0232PM) id AA26811; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 13:41:22 +0200 Received: from mofo.frt.dec.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mofo.frt.dec.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA04329 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 13:39:29 GMT Message-Id: <199709101339.NAA04329@mofo.frt.dec.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: Message from j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) of Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:40:22 +0200. Reply-To: gjennejohn@frt.dec.com Subject: Re: Do you have some neat configuration files? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 13:39:28 +0000 From: Gary Jennejohn Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk J Wunsch writes: > As Terry Lambert wrote: > > > > > fvwm95. > > > > > > qvwm instead. > > > Does it look like Windows95 as well? > > This was the reason to mention it at all, of course. > it's amazingly similar to W95. The best thing is that it's so small, even smaller than fvwm. I don't care about the W95 look, but I sure do like its size. --- Gary Jennejohn (work) gjennejohn@frt.dec.com (home) garyj@muc.de (play) gj@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 05:54:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA29028 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 05:54:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (ppp20.portal.net.au [202.12.71.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA29004 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 05:53:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA00407; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 22:20:22 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709101220.WAA00407@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: BRUN Philippe cc: FREEBSD Subject: Re: Port an arinc isa bus driver from HP Unix In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 10 Sep 1997 09:36:00 PDT." <3416CCEB@brteec1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 22:20:20 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I would like to port an ISA bus driver from HP Unix (I/O, IRQ and Ram) > to FreeBSD. Qool. What's the device in question? > of this driver and if possible some technical support.( How to ) Not a problem. > During BSD boot the message : ARINC ac00 port $300 Irq 5 panic kvtop zero > page frame > Who know why ? Sounds like you're scribbling something there, but it's a bit hard to tell. > my probe function : The message above doesn't come from your probe function; it's likely to have come from something later on. Put 'options DDB' in your kernel config, and after the panic type 'trace' at the 'ddb>' prompt. This will give you a stack trace, which is where you need to start. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 07:09:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA03810 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:09:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id HAA03462 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:01:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id OAA21535 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 14:50:39 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199709101250.OAA21535@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: not the sounddriver this time .... To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 14:50:38 +0200 (MET DST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk ... but a cute new baby! Silvia Rizzo is born a couple of hours ago :) forgive the diversion and back to our regular programs... Cheers Luigi -----------------------------+-------------------------------------- Luigi Rizzo | Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it | Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 | via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 | http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ _____________________________|______________________________________ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 08:01:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA06391 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:01:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from earth.mat.net (earth.mat.net [206.246.122.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA06386 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:01:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Journey2.mat.net (journey2.mat.net [206.246.122.116]) by earth.mat.net (8.8.7/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA15038; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 10:55:25 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 10:55:19 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey X-Sender: chuckr@Journey2.mat.net To: Luigi Rizzo cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: not the sounddriver this time .... In-Reply-To: <199709101250.OAA21535@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 10 Sep 1997, Luigi Rizzo wrote: > ... but a cute new baby! > > Silvia Rizzo is born a couple of hours ago :) > > forgive the diversion and back to our regular programs... Yeah !! Congratulations !! > > Cheers > Luigi > -----------------------------+-------------------------------------- > Luigi Rizzo | Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione > email: luigi@iet.unipi.it | Universita' di Pisa > tel: +39-50-568533 | via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) > fax: +39-50-568522 | http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ > _____________________________|______________________________________ > > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@eng.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run Journey2 and picnic, both FreeBSD (301) 220-2114 | version 3.0 current -- and great FUN! ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 08:05:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA06635 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:05:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailhost.Ipsilon.COM (mailhost.ipsilon.com [205.226.5.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id IAA06630 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:05:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from munger.ipsilon.com ([205.226.22.42]) by mailhost.Ipsilon.COM (8.6.11/8.6.10) with ESMTP id IAA09703 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:05:20 -0700 Message-ID: <3416B723.D0F0C83D@ipsilon.com> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:05:07 -0700 From: Kevin Hayes Reply-To: kevin@ipsilon.com Organization: Ipsilon Networks X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: kernel symbols from objdump X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [I posted this question a couple weeks ago, but got no response. I'll try one last time.] When I use objdump(1) on the kernel to show disassembly, I only see <_btext+(somelargeoffset)> Is there a way to build the kernel so that I get objdump to give me text symbols I can peruse with objdump? Is there a better tool than objdump to get disasm? I've tried gdb, to no avail. Thanks. K++ -- Kevin Hayes | "Nobody can make you feel inferior Ipsilon Networks | without your consent." kevin@ipsilon.com | ---Eleanor Roosevelt (408)-990-2086 | From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 08:17:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA07207 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:17:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA07195 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:17:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA29308; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 09:16:37 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 09:16:37 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709101516.JAA29308@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: David Dawes Cc: Terry Lambert , Nate Williams , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes In-Reply-To: <19970910145647.33919@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> References: <199709092221.QAA26290@rocky.mt.sri.com> <199709092247.PAA01710@usr02.primenet.com> <19970910145647.33919@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >> > > Warning: Action not found : insert-selection, kill-selection > > > It is complaining about unknown actions, which to me means a problem > with the RHS of a translation, not a problem with unknown keysyms on > the LHS. OK so far. > the native FreeBSD 4.02b7 version), and my guess is that there is an > old Netscape app-defaults installed which refers to actions which don't > exist (any more) (or something similar in a .Xdefaults file). I found some stuff in my .Xdefaults file that I just removed. It came from my days at school, and I never thought to look there. > I've tested this theory by making the following change to Netscape.ad, > and installing it in my app-defaults directory. I then get the following > warning message 4 times: Netscape.ad already has kill-selection and insert-selection, so you probably didn't need to make any changes. In any case, I've removed the lines from my .Xdefaults file, and if I quit getting these errors I'll be forever in your debt. :) :) ;) Thanks! Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 08:28:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA07846 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:28:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bbs.yzu.edu.tw (bbs.yzit.edu.tw [140.138.36.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA07713 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:25:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by bbs.yzu.edu.tw (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA08210 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:25:02 +0800 (CST) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:25:02 +0800 (CST) From: System PRIVILEGED Account Message-Id: <199709101525.XAA08210@bbs.yzu.edu.tw> To: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi.. The sample output is as below: *** *** >USER PID %CPU %MEM VSZ RSS TT STAT STARTED TIME COMMAND PID STAT TIME SL RE PAGEIN VSZ RSS LIM TSIZ %CPU %MEM COMMAND >bbs 155 6.4 1.2 812 1528 ??- S 5:10PM 3:54.65 /home/bbs/innd/i 155 S 3:54.65 16 21657 151 812 1528 - 76 6.4 1.2 /home/bbs/innd/i >bbs 7229 0.0 1.2 780 1568 Qq Ss+ 10:49PM 0:01.13 bbs h181.s162.ts 7229 Ss+ 0:01.13 2 1304 0 780 1568 - 192 0.0 1.2 bbs h181.s162.ts >bbs 6709 0.0 1.2 780 1532 rr Ss+ 10:28PM 0:00.97 bbs cl99-26.dial 6709 Ss+ 0:00.97 2 2552 0 780 1532 - 192 0.0 1.2 bbs cl99-26.dial >bbs 6389 0.0 1.2 780 1524 O5 Ss+ 10:13PM 0:02.35 bbs h27.s105.ts. 6389 Ss+ 0:02.35 4 3437 0 780 1524 - 192 0.0 1.2 bbs h27.s105.ts. >root 5591 0.0 0.9 716 1096 v0 Ss 9:43PM 0:02.35 -tcsh (tcsh) 5591 Ss 0:02.35 0 5254 0 716 1096 - 248 0.0 0.9 -tcsh (tcsh) >root 168 0.0 0.9 712 1100 v2 Is+ 5:10PM 0:01.17 -tcsh (tcsh) 168 Is+ 0:01.17 2716 21656 0 712 1100 - 248 0.0 0.9 -tcsh (tcsh) >bbs 167 0.0 0.9 708 1100 v1 Is+ 5:10PM 0:01.74 -tcsh (tcsh) 167 Is+ 0:01.74 229 21656 0 708 1100 - 248 0.0 0.9 -tcsh (tcsh) >bbs 6729 0.0 1.4 628 1796 uc Ss+ 10:29PM 0:02.88 bbs ts3.tyc.edu. 6729 Ss+ 0:02.88 5 2471 0 628 1796 - 192 0.0 1.4 bbs ts3.tyc.edu. >root 7837 0.0 0.6 580 704 ?? I 11:09PM 0:00.05 sendmail: WAA063 7837 I 0:00.05 64 64 0 580 704 - 264 0.0 0.6 sendmail: WAA063 >root 7868 1.0 0.2 568 252 v0 R+ 11:10PM 0:00.02 ps -auxv 7868 R+ 0:00.02 0 1 0 568 252 - 144 1.0 0.2 ps -auxv >root 92 0.0 0.3 552 388 ?? Ss 5:09PM 0:01.46 sendmail: accept 92 Ss 0:01.46 1 21664 2 552 388 - 264 0.0 0.3 sendmail: accept What are the real meanings of the VSZ and RSS ??? Sometimes VSZ's size is larger than RSS's. Sometimes the situation is reverse. Could you explan these situations ? Thanks From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 08:34:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA08365 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:34:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sos.freebsd.dk (sos.freebsd.dk [195.8.129.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA08356 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:34:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from sos@localhost) by sos.freebsd.dk (8.8.7/8.7.3) id RAA11729; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 17:34:19 +0200 (MEST) From: Sųren Schmidt Message-Id: <199709101534.RAA11729@sos.freebsd.dk> Subject: Re: not the sounddriver this time .... In-Reply-To: <199709101250.OAA21535@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from Luigi Rizzo at "Sep 10, 97 02:50:38 pm" To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 17:34:19 +0200 (MEST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL30 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Luigi Rizzo who wrote: > ... but a cute new baby! > > Silvia Rizzo is born a couple of hours ago :) Congrats!! > forgive the diversion and back to our regular programs... You call that diversion :), you ain't seen nothing yet :) :) -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Sųren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team Even more code to hack -- will it ever end .. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 08:59:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA09778 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:59:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from atena.eurocontrol.fr (atena.uneec.eurocontrol.fr [147.196.69.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id IAA09768 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:59:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: by atena.eurocontrol.fr; (5.65v3.2/1.3/10May95) id AA27342; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 17:59:31 +0200 Received: from brteec1 (brteec1.eurocontrol.fr) by eurocontrol.fr with SMTP (1.37.109.16/16.2) id AA149917042; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 17:57:22 +0200 Received: by brteec1 with Microsoft Mail id <34174307@brteec1>; Wed, 10 Sep 97 18:01:59 PDT From: BRUN Philippe To: FREEBSD Subject: Arinc device driver kvtop problem Date: Wed, 10 Sep 97 18:01:00 PDT Message-Id: <34174307@brteec1> Encoding: 15 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I would like read and write using the arinc card mapped at 0xF00000 I wrote the driver This address can't change. my config : device arinc at isa ? port 0x300 irq 5 iomem 0xf00000 iosiz 65536 vector accintr In config_isadev_c when the kernel calls kvtop(isdp->id_maddr) id_maddr = 0xf0f00000 writes panic ..... how can i access this iomem addres in my driver TIA philippe From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 10:25:30 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA14690 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 10:25:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (ppp20.portal.net.au [202.12.71.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA14684 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 10:25:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA04895; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 02:53:17 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709101653.CAA04895@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: BRUN Philippe cc: FREEBSD Subject: Re: Arinc device driver kvtop problem In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 10 Sep 1997 18:01:00 PDT." <34174307@brteec1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 02:53:13 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I would like read and write using the arinc card mapped at 0xF00000 > I wrote the driver > This address can't change. > > my config : > device arinc at isa ? port 0x300 irq 5 iomem 0xf00000 iosiz 65536 vector > accintr > > In config_isadev_c when the kernel calls kvtop(isdp->id_maddr) > id_maddr = 0xf0f00000 writes panic ..... > how can i access this iomem addres in my driver This is outside the "ISA hole", and means that you can't use the iomem approach. You will have trouble with the card on systems that have 16M or more of memory and don't support the hole-at-15M option. Until recently, FreeBSD didn't support main memory being fragmented (if I remeber correctly). If you are running -current, all that remains is to arrange (when your driver starts) for the nominated address range to be reserved for your driver. You can probably arrange this using contigmalloc, eg. : contigmalloc(0x10000, M_DEVBUF, M_NOWAIT, 0xf00000, 0xf10000, 0, 0) (see sys/vm/vm_page.c) There may be better ways to do this. Yipe. I've just realised that you must be writing a driver for an ATR card. That's Really Scary. 8) mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 11:07:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA16750 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 11:07:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from implode.root.com (implode.root.com [198.145.90.17]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA16743 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 11:07:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA10013; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 11:09:38 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709101809.LAA10013@implode.root.com> To: Mike Smith cc: BRUN Philippe , FREEBSD Subject: Re: Arinc device driver kvtop problem In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 02:53:13 +1000." <199709101653.CAA04895@word.smith.net.au> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 11:09:38 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >I remeber correctly). If you are running -current, all that remains is >to arrange (when your driver starts) for the nominated address range to >be reserved for your driver. > >You can probably arrange this using contigmalloc, eg. : > >contigmalloc(0x10000, M_DEVBUF, M_NOWAIT, 0xf00000, 0xf10000, 0, 0) > >(see sys/vm/vm_page.c) There may be better ways to do this. contigmalloc() is the wrong tool for this job - it only works for normal memory. What you want to use is pmap_mapdev() - see i386/i386/pmap.c. -DG David Greenman Core-team/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 11:26:30 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA17989 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 11:26:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bitbox.follo.net (bitbox.follo.net [194.198.43.36]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA17970 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 11:26:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from eivind@localhost) by bitbox.follo.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) id UAA02417; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 20:26:16 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 20:26:16 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199709101826.UAA02417@bitbox.follo.net> From: Eivind Eklund To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: PnP support Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk With the integration of the PnP drivers yesterday, I thought it was time to play around a little, and attempted to convert a driver to use PnP in addition to the normal ISA probes. The PnP support seems like a nice piece of work - most of it was exceedingly simple. However, I had the following problems, and wonder if there is a stock solution to them (they might just result from me not RTSLing well enough, but answers might be enlightening to others too): (1) I wanted the driver to be able to work with both PnP and ISA cards. However, the ISA probe mess up the card (or the internal FreeBSD driver setup - I'm not certain, but it don't work unless I inhibit the ISA probe). What is the best way to inhibit this probe? Presently, I just set a static variable and return false on the probe if it is set, but I don't think that is a good solution. I've thought about setting the ISA card to disabled if PnP probes true, but somehow don't find that aestecially pleasing, either (and I suspect it will be saved in the kernel for the next boot, too). (2) I found no way to report that the driver was unable to attach if the probe came out true. This might be me thinking approaching this wrongly, but the default attach for this driver do some of the setup for the card, and can fail. Should this be re-arranged for most of that work to be done during the probe, to be certain the attach can't fail? That would start messing with the card setup during the probe, which doesn't seem right? (3) The card reports as unknown0 . I assume this can be changed somewhere, but didn't find it in the docs for the PnP code (the man-page plus the . Where do I fix this? (A source file name would be enough - I assume somebody can answer this with less work than I would spend finding it ;-) This is my first attempt at hardware driver hacking under FreeBSD, as you probably can see from the level of the questions. I'll contribute the changes back when I get it to work properly (and I get my employer to OK contributing this). Eivind. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 13:00:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA23358 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 13:00:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA23344 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 13:00:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (haldjas.folklore.ee [172.17.2.1] (may be forged)) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.8.6/8.8.4) with SMTP id WAA16552; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 22:57:19 +0300 (EEST) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 22:57:18 +0300 (EEST) From: Narvi To: Luigi Rizzo cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: not the sounddriver this time .... In-Reply-To: <199709101250.OAA21535@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Congratulations!!! On Wed, 10 Sep 1997, Luigi Rizzo wrote: > ... but a cute new baby! > > Silvia Rizzo is born a couple of hours ago :) > > forgive the diversion and back to our regular programs... > > Cheers > Luigi > -----------------------------+-------------------------------------- > Luigi Rizzo | Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione > email: luigi@iet.unipi.it | Universita' di Pisa > tel: +39-50-568533 | via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) > fax: +39-50-568522 | http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ > _____________________________|______________________________________ > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 13:18:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA24283 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 13:18:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from adam.adonai.net (adam.adonai.net [207.8.83.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA24271 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 13:17:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (leec@localhost) by adam.adonai.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA09378; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:17:03 -0500 (CDT) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:17:02 -0500 (CDT) From: "Lee Crites (AEI)" To: Luigi Rizzo cc: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: <199709091847.UAA19872@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 9 Sep 1997, Luigi Rizzo wrote: =>> Can someone give a code snippet of the BEST way of running a 1000HZ for =>> loop under freebsd, without consuming massive amounts of cpu time. => =>one way I can think of is to build a kernel with HZ=1000 (or higher). =>Make your process run at high priority, wake up at every tick (through =>setitimer or usleep etc.) do its task and go back to sleep. I will start off with a wide-open disclaimer: I have not as of yet ported *ANY* of my real-time code to fbsd. I have not as of yet tried *ANY* real-time programming on my fbsd box. I can barely say I have tinkered around with it. With that said, I am interested in this subject because I *WILL* be porting my real-time code here and I *WILL* be doing some hard-real-time development on my fbsd box. According to Stevens (et al), hard real-time programming (which is what 1ms timing is) is not reliably possible on un*x. Having said that, I have a nice hard-real-time timer class I developed which is being used as the basis for controlling sonar systems that runs in the microseconds (with a +/- 130 microsecond accuracy) on several platforms (next platform is, you guessed it, fbsd). It is self tuning in that it takes into account it's own overhead and readjusts future timings based on that. Anyway... The big question is what are you doing in the loop? I had a millisecond heart-beat timer which sent a timer interrupt to my process (which seems to be what you are asking for). Keep in mind that when the timer interrupt hits, all of your blocked i/o gets triggered as well. This is probably what you want -- otherwise you would have no need for the interrupt. And, of course, you will have to check the return code (most likely -1) and errno (EINTR or EAGAIN ?!?) with each blocked read -- including sockets. In fact, it was sockets which caused me to have to abandon the timer interrupt concept. Yes, I could build the incoming packet and/or split the outgoing packet properly. The problem is some versions of un*x do not handle the stream pointers properly. In fact, aix it doesn't handle them at all -- it just leaves them where they were. I have no idea what fbsd would do, but I will bet dollars to donut holes the person(s) who *know* the answer are on this list! Once I have the code working on my fbsd box, it will be posted on my web page for y'all to peruse. Lee From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 13:26:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA24722 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 13:26:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bitbox.follo.net (bitbox.follo.net [194.198.43.36]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA24704 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 13:26:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from eivind@localhost) by bitbox.follo.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) id WAA02815; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 22:25:50 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 22:25:50 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199709102025.WAA02815@bitbox.follo.net> From: Eivind Eklund To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) CC: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, ywliu1@tao.sinanet.com.tw In-reply-to: j@uriah.heep.sax.de's message of Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:10:10 +0200 Subject: Re: Kernel clock runs inaccurately References: <199709080124.JAA14004@tao.sinanet.com.tw> <19970908081010.DS04250@uriah.heep.sax.de> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > do want. (They are probably living in somewhat of an ivory tower with > good NTP refclocks readily available on a cheap Internet, something > that is not my situation, sitting behind dialup lines everywhere.) Shouldn't it be still be possible to set up xntpd with drift-correction and synchronization often, and just suppress xntpd-messages from starting the ppp-link? I've run xntpd on dialup-links before, and unless there is extreme inconsistencies in how your local clock run, it seem to still work nicely. (I might have patched it on that system, though - I don't remember, it is a long time since I set it up, and unfortunately it no longer exists so I can check.) Eivind. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 13:37:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA25533 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 13:37:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ingenieria ([168.176.15.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA25524 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 13:37:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by ingenieria (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id QAA23881; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:23:54 -0400 Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:23:53 -0400 (EDT) From: Yonny Cardenas To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: FreeBSD with Autonomous Systems Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I'am doing me a project in the University National of Colombia. I'am working in Autonomous Systems, in the laboratory of University I have building the following topology : Autonomous System 1000 Autonomous Systems 2000 200.20.20.9 200.20.20.1 -#-------------------------------------#- | | _____|___ ___|______ |Gateway| |Gateway| | EGP | | EGP | -*------- -*-------- *200.20.10.1 *200.20.30.9 * * * * ******* ******* * * * * *200.20.10.9 *200.20.30.1 -------*- -------*- |Gateway| |Gateway| | RIP | | RIP | -*------- -*------*- |57.1.0.5 |168.176.1.5 | | | | ------*------------- -------*------------- Where : -*-------*- is ethernet segment | | and ***** * is serial link,( RS232 with cable null modem and PPP ) * ***** I'am using FreeBSD 2.2.1 and Gated R3_5Beta_3 in this project, the following is the gated.config file for Autonomous System 1000 : # Gated.conf # #options gendefault ; traceoptions "/var/tmp/gated.salida" replace size 2m files 2 general ; autonomoussystem 1000; rip yes { interface all ripin ripout version 2; interface 200.20.20.9 noripin noripout ; }; egp yes { group peeras 2000 { neighbor 200.20.20.1 importdefault exportdefault ; }; traceoptions route ; }; kernel { traceoptions remnants request routes info interface ; }; redirect yes; static { 200.20.10.0 mask 255.255.255.0 interface 200.20.10.1 ; }; export proto egp as 2000 { proto rip interface 200.20.10.1 { 0.0.0.0 mask 0.0.0.0 refines metric 1; }; proto static { 200.20.10.0 mask 255.255.255.0 metric 0; }; }; import proto egp autonomoussystem 2000 { 0.0.0.0 mask 0.0.0.0 refines preference 10; }; export proto rip interface 200.20.10.1 { proto egp autonomoussystem 2000 { 0.0.0.0 mask 0.0.0.0 refines metric 2 ; }; }; import proto rip interface 200.20.10.1 { 0.0.0.0 mask 0.0.0.0 refines preference 10 ; }; The gated.conf for AS 2000 is alike. But, they not interchange routing information with EGP. This is routing tables in the Gateway EGP in AS 1000 Routing tables Internet: Destination Gateway Flags Refs Use Netif Expire 57 200.20.10.9 UGc 0 0 ppp0 127 127.0.0.1 URc 0 0 lo0 127.0.0.1 127.0.0.1 UH 1 0 lo0 200.20.10.1 127.0.0.1 UGH 0 0 lo0 200.20.10.9 200.20.10.1 UH 1 0 ppp0 200.20.20 link#2 UC 0 0 200.20.20.1 0:0:e8:d3:a7:85 UHLW 1 0 ed1 640 200.20.20.9 0:0:c0:36:c:9e UHLW 1 26 lo0 224.0.0.9 127.0.0.1 UH 1 55 lo0 It's not know networks from Autonomous Systems 2000. HELP ME, PLEASE ! Thanks. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- YONNY CARDENAS B. Systems Engineer || || ||| || Universidad Nacional de Colombia || || || | || Email : yonny@ingenieria.ingsala.unal.edu.co ||||||| || ||| From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 14:23:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA28019 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 14:23:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA27994 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 14:22:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id WAA22589; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 22:12:54 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199709102012.WAA22589@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: PnP support To: perhaps@yes.no (Eivind Eklund) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 22:12:53 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709101826.UAA02417@bitbox.follo.net> from "Eivind Eklund" at Sep 10, 97 08:25:57 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > With the integration of the PnP drivers yesterday, I thought it was > time to play around a little, and attempted to convert a driver to use > PnP in addition to the normal ISA probes. The PnP support seems like > a nice piece of work - most of it was exceedingly simple. > > However, I had the following problems, and wonder if there is a stock > solution to them (they might just result from me not RTSLing well > enough, but answers might be enlightening to others too): > > (1) I wanted the driver to be able to work with both PnP and ISA > cards. However, the ISA probe mess up the card (or the internal I can tell you how I solved the problem with the sound driver: I have the probe routine scan the descriptors for the same type of device, and skip (and return with a 'not found' code) the ISA probe if a PnP unit at the same address ranges has been found. Since PnP devices are probed first this works as expected. If the PnP attach routine was also recording the resource usage as isa devices do, this scan would not be necessary. I think the appropriate tests are in function haveseen_isadev(), but since I do not know the details, nor I know if the code assumes a statically built table of devices, I did not call these functions and build a special-purpose one (in the case of sound driver this is necessary in any case since many sound cards emulate both a SB and a MSS and while the driver supports one of the two modes we want to be sure that the other one is not used as well. > (2) I found no way to report that the driver was unable to attach if > the probe came out true. This might be me thinking approaching this the idea is that probe should do all the test and attach should not go wrong. As you say this is not a good approach IMHO, the attach routine should be able to return an error code. With the current status of the code, a driver failing to attach should unregister resource usage on its own. > (3) The card reports as unknown0 . I assume this can be dvp->dev.id_driver->name is what goes in place of "unknown", dvp->pd_name is the "description" dvp->dev should be initialized from the corresponding isa device entry in the attach routine. dvp->pd_name is in the PnP device descriptor. Cheers Luigi -----------------------------+-------------------------------------- Luigi Rizzo | Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it | Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 | via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 | http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ _____________________________|______________________________________ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 14:30:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA28398 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 14:30:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from room101.sysc.com (richmojm2.student.rose-hulman.edu [137.112.206.126]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA28392; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 14:30:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jayrich@localhost) by room101.sysc.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA01670; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:28:42 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:28:36 -0500 (EST) From: "Jay M. Richmond" To: John Dowdal cc: freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: mount cdrom returns "input/output error" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Whew... In a way I'm glad that I'm not the only one :).. Yes I did cvsup to 2.2-STABLE around that time as well. I'm using a Mitsumi 8x, but I assume it's the same... is that a SCSI cd-writer? if so, we may have differnt problems. I've cc'ed this to freebsd-bugs and freebsd-hackers. If you need any other info (please check through the rest of the quoted material), pleaese let me know... Thanks, Jay On Wed, 10 Sep 1997, John Dowdal wrote: > > I get the same error on a cvsup'd stable, downloaded around 9-1-97. I can > not "mount -o ro -t cd9660 /dev/worm0c /mnt" without getting a IO error. > I used to be able to mount this, using the same kernel config. The drive > is a HP 4020i CD writer. It is possible for me to do dd if=/dev/rworm0 > of=/dev/null bs=32k and read the whole CD; don't know if I can write cd's > or not with this version because I haven't tried. > > John > > On Wed, 10 Sep 1997, Jay M. Richmond wrote: > > > Please note: since I posted this I've also tried putting the CD-ROM on the > > primary controller and configuring it as a slave... same result. > > > > Thanks again for your time, > > Jay > > jayrich@sysc.com > > > > On Wed, 10 Sep 1997, Charlie ROOT wrote: > > > > > Hello-- > > > > > > I searched the FAQ and handbook for an answer to this before asking, but I > > > still apologize in advance if this is a "stupid question." > > > > > > Here's the situation... > > > > > > Ever since I upgraded to 2.2-STABLE, I am unable to mount any CD-ROM's > > > that I have (I tested this by going back to the 2.2.2-RELEASE kernel and > > > the CD-ROM worked great, unfortunately, I need 2.2-STABLE for some other > > > fixes.) I am sure the CD-ROM is working fine and the CD is OK. > > > > > > When I mount the CD, it says: > > > > > > # mount -t cd9660 /dev/wcd0a /cdrom > > > cd9660: /dev/wcd0a: Input/output error > > > > > > The drive is on the second IDE channel as a SLAVE, without a master (this > > > worked fine before with 2.2.2-RELEASE, has there been a change?). > > > > > > I also double checked my source configuration files as well: > > > > > > controller wdc1 at isa? port "IO_WD2" bio irq 15 vector wdintr > > > disk wd2 at wdc1 drive 0 > > > disk wd3 at wdc1 drive 1 > > > > > > options ATAPI > > > options ATAPI_STATIC > > > device wcd0 > > > > > > I also have it set up for the primary controller. This is the same > > > configuration that was in GENERIC for 2.2.2-RELEASE on my system. > > > > > > The drive is detected on boot up too: > > > > > > /kernel: wdc1: unit 1 (atapi): , removable, intr, dma, iordis > > > > > > I've also searched the mailing list archives, and most of the time the > > > error is due to the device not being recognized or a CD not being in the > > > drive, etc. However, none of that applies here. > > > > > > My question is: is there something in 2.2-STABLE that's changed that I > > > would need to make other changes to my OS to make the CD work? > > > > > > I don't subscribe to the freebsd-questions or freebsd-stable mailing > > > lists, so please send a copy of your reponse to me via e-mail. > > > > > > Thank you very much for your time, > > > > > > Jay > > > jayrich@sysc.com > > > > > > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 15:02:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA00734 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:02:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bcarsde4.localhost (mailgate.nortel.ca [192.58.194.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA00720 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:02:01 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709102202.PAA00720@hub.freebsd.org> Received: from bcars520.ott.bnr.ca (actually 47.128.5.188) by bcarsde4.localhost; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 18:00:44 -0400 Received: from bnr.ca by bcars520.bnr.ca id <06859-0@bcars520.bnr.ca>; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 18:00:08 -0400 Date: 10 Sep 1997 17:59 EDT To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Andrew Atrens" Subject: resolved: Help! keyboard lockups - could be kernel bug ? Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk So, I've solved my problem, but haven't completely bottomed out on the cause. Not only has the problem vanished, but the system is noticeably quicker. Here's what I did: Got the 090997 kernel sources and rebuilt a kernel *without* the following options: > cpu "I686_CPU" > options "CPU_FASTER_5X86_FPU" and with the following *changed* options: > options NSWAPDEV=1 > options MAXCONS=4 > controller wdc0 at isa? port "IO_WD1" bio irq 14 vector wdintr > controller wdc1 at isa? port "IO_WD2" bio irq 15 vector wdintr So it could be the newer kernel, or any of these other changes. I am a bit suspicious about the "CPU_FASTER_5X86_FPU", but who knows. I'm going to put back the AUTO_EOI's, re-add the flags to wdc0, and wdc1, and hope for the best. That'll probably be where my investigation ends unless someone tells me they're keen. ;) Cheers, Andrew. -- In message "Help! keyboard lockups - could be kernel bug ?", Andrew Atrens writes: > > Terry wrote: > > > > Somone else was reporting serial port lockups when they were hitting > > their IDE drive hard. > > How well supported is the 430TX chipset? As I mentioned, with my old > motherboard ( ASUS T2P4 w. 430HX chipset ) everything worked flawlessly. > I guess its always possible that I have a flaky motherboard, but I don't > understand why the symptoms show up under `xdm' and not `startx'. > > The other bogon I noted with this board ( as mentioned in my previous > post ) is that the AUTO_EOI_X kernel options were causing my system to > freeze on boot up. The IDE disks would probe correctly, but lock up during > fsck'ing ( disk access leds stuck on ). Removing these options from the > kernel solved the problem. > > Perhaps an appropriate kernel option change could fix my keyboard problem? > > > Andrew. > > -- > > machine "i386" > cpu "I586_CPU" > cpu "I686_CPU" > ident CHURCHILL > maxusers 20 > > options INET #InterNETworking > options FFS #Berkeley Fast Filesystem > options NFS #Network Filesystem > options MFS #Memory File System > options MSDOSFS #MSDOS Filesystem > options "CD9660" #ISO 9660 Filesystem > options PROCFS #Process filesystem > options "COMPAT_43" #Compatible with BSD 4.3 [KEEP THIS!] > options UCONSOLE #Allow users to grab the console > options USERCONFIG #boot -c editor > options VISUAL_USERCONFIG #visual boot -c editor > options MROUTING # Multicast routing > options SYSVSHM > options SYSVSEM > options SYSVMSG > options NSWAPDEV=2 > options "CPU_FASTER_5X86_FPU" > options USER_LDT > options "MD5" > options PERFMON > > config kernel root on wd0 > > controller isa0 > controller pci0 > > controller fdc0 at isa? port "IO_FD1" bio irq 6 drq 2 vector fdintr > disk fd0 at fdc0 drive 0 > > controller wdc0 at isa? port "IO_WD1" bio irq 14 flags 0x80ff80ff vector wdintr > disk wd0 at wdc0 drive 0 > > controller wdc1 at isa? port "IO_WD2" bio irq 15 flags 0x80ff80ff vector wdintr > > device wcd0 #IDE CD-ROM > options ATAPI #Enable ATAPI support for IDE bus > options ATAPI_STATIC #Don't do it as an LKM > > device sc0 at isa? port "IO_KBD" tty irq 1 vector scintr > options MAXCONS=3 # number of virtual consoles > > device npx0 at isa? port "IO_NPX" iosiz 0x0 flags 0x0 irq 13 vector npxintr > device sio0 at isa? port "IO_COM1" tty irq 4 vector siointr > device sio1 at isa? port "IO_COM2" tty irq 3 vector siointr > device lpt0 at isa? port? tty irq 7 vector lptintr > device ed0 at isa? port 0x280 net irq 10 iomem 0xd8000 vector edintr > > pseudo-device loop > pseudo-device ether > pseudo-device log > pseudo-device sl 2 > pseudo-device ppp 2 > pseudo-device sppp #Generic Synchronous PPP > pseudo-device bpfilter 4 #Berkeley packet filter > pseudo-device tun 2 > pseudo-device pty 128 > pseudo-device gzip # Exec gzipped a.out's > pseudo-device speaker #Play IBM BASIC-style noises out your speaker > pseudo-device vn #Vnode driver (turns a file into a device) > pseudo-device ccd 4 #Concatenated disk driver > > #options "AUTO_EOI_1" > #options "AUTO_EOI_2" > > controller snd0 > device sb0 at isa? port 0x220 irq 5 drq 1 vector sbintr > device sbxvi0 at isa? drq 5 > device sbmidi0 at isa? port 0x330 > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 15:23:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA02205 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:23:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ucsee.EECS.Berkeley.EDU (benco@ucsee.EECS.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.156.173]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA02190; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:23:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from benco@localhost) by ucsee.EECS.Berkeley.EDU (8.8.4/8.8.4) id PAA02061; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:23:05 -0700 Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:23:05 -0700 From: Ben Cottrell Message-Id: <199709102223.PAA02061@ucsee.EECS.Berkeley.EDU> To: jayrich@room101.sysc.com, jdowdal@destiny.erols.com Subject: Re: mount cdrom returns "input/output error" Cc: freebsd-bugs@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Whew... In a way I'm glad that I'm not the only one :).. Yes I did cvsup I'm glad I'm not the only one too :-) I've tried it on a sup from about august 6, plus the snap that was around that time, plus a sup from a few weeks previous to all that. It happens on both of my CD-ROM drives--a Toshiba 3401 and a Philips CDD 2600 (a cd-r drive). It does not affect my ability to read audio tracks off the drives, nor my ability to dd from the raw device files. I *also* get this on the syslog when I try to mount: Sep 10 15:19:25 pandora /kernel: ahc0: ahc_scsi_cmd: more than 32 DMA segs Sep 10 15:19:25 pandora /kernel: cd0: oops not queued Sep 10 15:19:25 pandora /kernel: biodone: buffer already done and the last two lines of that is the exact same error that happens perenially when using cd-write to write a CD under FreeBSD. Curiouser and curiouser :-P ~Ben From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 15:49:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA03820 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:49:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA03809; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:49:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id IAA27664; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 08:19:07 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970911081907.29251@lemis.com> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 08:19:07 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Luigi Rizzo Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, FreeBSD Chat Subject: Re: not the sounddriver this time .... References: <199709101250.OAA21535@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709101250.OAA21535@labinfo.iet.unipi.it>; from Luigi Rizzo on Wed, Sep 10, 1997 at 02:50:38PM +0200 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, Sep 10, 1997 at 02:50:38PM +0200, Luigi Rizzo wrote: > ... but a cute new baby! > > Silvia Rizzo is born a couple of hours ago :) Congratulations! > forgive the diversion and back to our regular programs... This must be the first if you think it's going to be business as normal :-) Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 15:51:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA03995 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:51:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA03985 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:51:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gurney.reilly.home (d5.syd2.zeta.org.au [203.26.11.5]) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id IAA12571; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 08:46:09 +1000 Received: (from andrew@localhost) by gurney.reilly.home (8.8.7/8.8.5) id IAA02091; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 08:44:30 +1000 (EST) From: Andrew Reilly Message-Id: <199709102244.IAA02091@gurney.reilly.home> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 08:44:29 +1000 (EST) Subject: Re: My FreeBSD Wish List... To: kpneal@pobox.com cc: dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19970910054020.00cc13ec@mail.mindspring.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On 10 Sep, Kevin P. Neal wrote: > At 02:30 PM 9/10/97 +1000, David Dawes wrote: >>On a partly related note, a future XFree86 release will put config files >>(like xdm config files for example) in a directory hierarchy below /var >>(most likely /var/X11). It is possible that future X11 releases from The >>Open Group will do this too. This will make it easier to use a read-only >>/usr/X11R6. None of this has been set in stone yet, so if anyone has >>any comments about this, please let me know. > > Wouldn't it be better to put them below, say, /etc/X11? With logging going > to /var/log/X11/* or something? Depends on whether X is to be a "part of the system" (plausible) or a package on its own. I vote for /etc/X11 and /var/log/X11 for the former, and something like /usr/X11R6/{etc,var,...} for the latter. If people want their log files to go to a different partition, then they can symlink them to /var/log/X11 if they like. > I personally am bothered by config files in /var. I was under the impression > that /etc was the proper location of config files. I agree. I generally consider var to be a place that would not affect the world too badly if it became corrupted. The sort of place you could mount asynch, and only back up weekly. Obviously there are a few exceptions to that being workable policy, but that's the sort of "spool" idea. >>From NetBSD's hier manpage (the FreeBSD box in the apt is in the room of a > sleeping person, so...): > > /etc system configuration files and scripts > > /var multi-purpose log, temporary, transient, and spool files. /etc is definitely the place for configuration files for "system" things. I am quite used to /usr/local/etc for configuration files for things added to the "system". Which of these XFree86 falls into is probably the core of the argument. -- Andrew "The steady state of disks is full." -- Ken Thompson From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 16:01:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA04766 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:01:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from unix.tfs.net (root@unix.tfs.net [199.79.146.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA04758 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:01:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from argus.tfs.net (node40.tfs.net [207.2.220.40]) by unix.tfs.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA12842; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 17:00:07 -0500 Received: (from jbryant@localhost) by argus.tfs.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA01896; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 18:01:34 -0500 (CDT) From: Jim Bryant Message-Id: <199709102301.SAA01896@argus.tfs.net> Subject: Re: mount cdrom returns "input/output error" In-Reply-To: <199709102223.PAA02061@ucsee.EECS.Berkeley.EDU> from Ben Cottrell at "Sep 10, 97 03:23:05 pm" To: benco@ucsee.EECS.Berkeley.EDU (Ben Cottrell) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 18:01:34 -0500 (CDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Reply-to: jbryant@tfs.net X-Windows: R00LZ!@# MS-Winbl0wz DR00LZ!@# X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.2-RELEASE #0: Wed Jul 9 01:01:24 CDT 1997 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk i've had this too.. apparently `su root` fixes my problem here... jim -- All opinions expressed are mine, if you | "I will not be pushed, stamped, think otherwise, then go jump into turbid | briefed, debriefed, indexed, or radioactive waters and yell WAHOO !!! | numbered!" - #1, "The Prisoner" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Inet: jbryant@tfs.net AX.25: kc5vdj@wv0t.#neks.ks.usa.noam grid: EM28PW voice: KC5VDJ - 6 & 2 Meters AM/FM/SSB, 70cm FM. http://www.tfs.net/~jbryant ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ HF/6M/2M: IC-706-MkII, 2M: HTX-212, 2M: HTX-202, 70cm: HTX-404, Packet: KPC-3+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 16:03:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA04972 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:03:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from caffeine.internal.enteract.com (caffeine.internal.enteract.com [207.229.129.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA04953 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:03:44 -0700 (PDT) From: kdulzo@caffeine.internal.enteract.com Received: (qmail 308 invoked by uid 100); 10 Sep 1997 23:03:37 -0000 Date: 10 Sep 1997 23:03:37 -0000 Message-ID: <19970910230337.307.qmail@caffeine.internal.enteract.com> To: atrens@nortel.ca, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: resolved: Help! keyboard lockups - could be kernel bug ? In-Reply-To: <199709102202.PAA00720@hub.freebsd.org> Reply-To: kdulzo@enteract.com X-CaffeineSource: Mountain Dew X-NowPlaying: Future Sound of London Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk The exact cause would be: #options AUTO_EOI_2 This does not work on my 430TX board either... Had the same problem and chugged through kernel options to figure it out. -Kevin In mpc.lists.freebsd.hackers, you wrote: | | So, I've solved my problem, but haven't completely bottomed out on the cause. | Not only has the problem vanished, but the system is noticeably quicker. | | Here's what I did: | | Got the 090997 kernel sources and rebuilt a kernel *without* the following | options: | > cpu "I686_CPU" | > options "CPU_FASTER_5X86_FPU" | | and with the following *changed* options: | | > options NSWAPDEV=1 | > options MAXCONS=4 | > controller wdc0 at isa? port "IO_WD1" bio irq 14 vector wdintr | > controller wdc1 at isa? port "IO_WD2" bio irq 15 vector wdintr | | So it could be the newer kernel, or any of these other changes. I am | a bit suspicious about the "CPU_FASTER_5X86_FPU", but who knows. | I'm going to put back the AUTO_EOI's, re-add the flags to wdc0, and | wdc1, and hope for the best. That'll probably be where my investigation | ends unless someone tells me they're keen. ;) | | Cheers, | | Andrew. | | -- | | In message "Help! keyboard lockups - could be kernel bug ?", Andrew Atrens | writes: | | > | > Terry wrote: | > > | > > Somone else was reporting serial port lockups when they were hitting | > > their IDE drive hard. | > | > How well supported is the 430TX chipset? As I mentioned, with my old | > motherboard ( ASUS T2P4 w. 430HX chipset ) everything worked flawlessly. | > I guess its always possible that I have a flaky motherboard, but I don't | > understand why the symptoms show up under `xdm' and not `startx'. | > | > The other bogon I noted with this board ( as mentioned in my previous | > post ) is that the AUTO_EOI_X kernel options were causing my system to | > freeze on boot up. The IDE disks would probe correctly, but lock up during | > fsck'ing ( disk access leds stuck on ). Removing these options from the | > kernel solved the problem. | > | > Perhaps an appropriate kernel option change could fix my keyboard problem? | > | > | > Andrew. | > | > -- | > | > machine "i386" | > cpu "I586_CPU" | > cpu "I686_CPU" | > ident CHURCHILL | > maxusers 20 | > | > options INET #InterNETworking | > options FFS #Berkeley Fast Filesystem | > options NFS #Network Filesystem | > options MFS #Memory File System | > options MSDOSFS #MSDOS Filesystem | > options "CD9660" #ISO 9660 Filesystem | > options PROCFS #Process filesystem | > options "COMPAT_43" #Compatible with BSD 4.3 [KEEP THIS!] | > options UCONSOLE #Allow users to grab the console | > options USERCONFIG #boot -c editor | > options VISUAL_USERCONFIG #visual boot -c editor | > options MROUTING # Multicast routing | > options SYSVSHM | > options SYSVSEM | > options SYSVMSG | > options NSWAPDEV=2 | > options "CPU_FASTER_5X86_FPU" | > options USER_LDT | > options "MD5" | > options PERFMON | > | > config kernel root on wd0 | > | > controller isa0 | > controller pci0 | > | > controller fdc0 at isa? port "IO_FD1" bio irq 6 drq 2 vector fdintr | > disk fd0 at fdc0 drive 0 | > | > controller wdc0 at isa? port "IO_WD1" bio irq 14 flags 0x80ff80ff vector wdintr | > disk wd0 at wdc0 drive 0 | > | > controller wdc1 at isa? port "IO_WD2" bio irq 15 flags 0x80ff80ff vector wdintr | > | > device wcd0 #IDE CD-ROM | > options ATAPI #Enable ATAPI support for IDE bus | > options ATAPI_STATIC #Don't do it as an LKM | > | > device sc0 at isa? port "IO_KBD" tty irq 1 vector scintr | > options MAXCONS=3 # number of virtual consoles | > | > device npx0 at isa? port "IO_NPX" iosiz 0x0 flags 0x0 irq 13 vector npxintr | > device sio0 at isa? port "IO_COM1" tty irq 4 vector siointr | > device sio1 at isa? port "IO_COM2" tty irq 3 vector siointr | > device lpt0 at isa? port? tty irq 7 vector lptintr | > device ed0 at isa? port 0x280 net irq 10 iomem 0xd8000 vector edintr | > | > pseudo-device loop | > pseudo-device ether | > pseudo-device log | > pseudo-device sl 2 | > pseudo-device ppp 2 | > pseudo-device sppp #Generic Synchronous PPP | > pseudo-device bpfilter 4 #Berkeley packet filter | > pseudo-device tun 2 | > pseudo-device pty 128 | > pseudo-device gzip # Exec gzipped a.out's | > pseudo-device speaker #Play IBM BASIC-style noises out your speaker | > pseudo-device vn #Vnode driver (turns a file into a device) | > pseudo-device ccd 4 #Concatenated disk driver | > | > #options "AUTO_EOI_1" | > #options "AUTO_EOI_2" | > | > controller snd0 | > device sb0 at isa? port 0x220 irq 5 drq 1 vector sbintr | > device sbxvi0 at isa? drq 5 | > device sbmidi0 at isa? port 0x330 | > | > -- +==-- | Kevin M. Dulzo Check us out! | |Jr. System Administrator http://www.enteract.com | | Enteract, L.L.C. mailto: info@enteract.com| | kdulzo@enteract.com (773)248-8511 | --==+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 16:50:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA07714 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:50:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sendero-ppp.i-connect.net (sendero-ppp.i-Connect.Net [206.190.143.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA07706 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:50:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 21099 invoked by uid 1000); 10 Sep 1997 23:50:31 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.2-alpha [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:50:31 -0700 (PDT) Organization: Atlas Telecom From: Simon Shapiro To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: /usr/include/sys How To question Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi Y'all, First, the story: I have a data structure that contains something like this in it: u_int32_t state_ref_count[DLM_STATE_BITS]; Now, instead of putting #define DLM_STATE_BITS in dlm.h, it is actually in sys/i386/conf/FOO as: options DLM_STATE_BITS=8 which then translates (according to sys/options, of course) to #define DLM_STATE_BITS 8 in /sys/compile/FOO/opt_dlm.h Why do that? if we need DLM_STATE_BITS to be only 8 instead of, say, 32, and we need 20,000 of these structures, the savings will be about 60KB. In reality the numbers are much higher. Now, the question: How do I integrate opt_dlm.h into sys/dlm.h so that it will reflect the proper sizing? If the kernel was built on the target machine, it is simple. If not, it can be nasty. Any suggestion is welcome. --- Sincerely Yours, (Sent on 10-Sep-97, 16:37:54 by XF-Mail) Simon Shapiro Atlas Telecom Senior Architect 14355 SW Allen Blvd., Suite 130 Beaverton OR 97005 Shimon@i-Connect.Net Voice: 503.643.5559, Emergency: 503.799.2313 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 17:10:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA08898 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 17:10:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from thor.i-connect.net (qmailr@thor.i-Connect.Net [206.190.143.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA08883 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 17:10:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 23426 invoked by uid 4028); 11 Sep 1997 00:10:13 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 0.5-alpha [p0] on Linux Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <19970911082204.53826@lemis.com> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:50:02 -0700 (PDT) From: ron@cts.com To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Greg Lehey Subject: Re: Philips monitor question Cc: questions@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Let's see... MicroSoft only Hayes modems, MicroSoft only HP printers, Microsoft only Pentium processors (think about it, Intel provides "hidden" performance features to MicroSoft that are not available to the general PC software writing community), MicroSoft only Apple Computers and now, MicroSoft only monitors. I guess the 'investment' MicroSoft makes in politicans has been very effective in holding-off the US Anti-Trust arm of the inJustice department. I only hope that soon there will be some MicroSoft toilet paper so we can wipe-off some of this stuff MicroSoft is dumping on us. Yes, I know. Not in the FreeBSD mailing lists... sorry. Ron McDaniels On 11-Sep-97 Greg Lehey wrote: >>On Wed, Sep 10, 1997 at 03:45:05PM +0200, Jacques Hugo wrote: >> Hi there >> >> I've got a Philips Brilliance 17A8808Q 17" monitor. It's not >> bad, but the only problem I have with it is that the vertical >> and horizontal size of the viewport you set through software >> ... and it is only for 95/NT. > >I wonder what this is. I'd guess that it's something to hide the >truth from you. > >> Is there any util in UN*X where you can set this. > >I'm not sure you want to. What's the viewport? Is this some kind of >crazy way to set the height and width *only* by software? > >Greg > ---------------------------------- E-Mail: ron@cts.com Date: 09/10/97 Time: 16:50:02 This message was sent by XF-Mail ---------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 17:43:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA10540 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 17:43:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gamespot.com (ns2.gamespot.com [206.169.18.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA10523; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 17:43:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tiramisu.gamespot.com (tiramisu.gamespot.com [206.169.18.119]) by gamespot.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA09754; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 17:42:32 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970910174437.012b1ad0@mail.gamespot.com> X-Sender: ian@mail.gamespot.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 17:44:37 -0700 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-current@freebsd.org From: Ian Kallen Subject: 2940UW broken in current? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I just installed current on a box with an Adaptec 2940 Ultra/Ultra W (SCSISelect v1.23). It's stalling whilst detecting the CD (vanilla Toshiba, I've run 'em on various 2.2 and 2.1 installations for a long time...) - spends about 5 minutes on it: Probing for devices on PCI bus 0: chip0: rev 0x01 on pci0.0.0 chip1: rev 0x02 on pci0.7.0 ahc0: rev 0x00 int a irq 10 on pci0.13.0 ahc0: aic7880 Wide Channel, SCSI Id=7, 16 SCBs ahc0: waiting for scsi devices to settle scbus0 at ahc0 bus 0 sd0 at scbus0 target 0 lun 0 sd0: type 0 fixed SCSI 2 sd0: Direct-Access 1013MB (2074880 512 byte sectors) sd1 at scbus0 target 1 lun 0 sd1: type 0 fixed SCSI 2 sd1: Direct-Access 2049MB (4197405 512 byte sectors) ahc0:A:4: refuses WIDE negotiation. Using 8bit transfers ahc0: board is not responding scbus0 target 4 lun 0: SCB 0x0 - timed out in datain phase, SCSISIGI == 0x44 SEQADDR = 0x12b SCSISEQ = 0x12 SSTAT0 = 0x0 SSTAT1 = 0x3 scbus0 target 4 lun 0: abort message in message buffer Unexpected busfree. LASTPHASE == 0x40 SEQADDR == 0x12d scbus0 target 4 lun 0: no longer in timeout ahc0: board is not responding cmd fail scbus0 target 4 lun 0: SCB 0x0 - timed out while idle, LASTPHASE == 0x1, SCSISIGI == 0x0 SEQADDR = 0x4 SCSISEQ = 0x12 SSTAT0 = 0x0 SSTAT1 = 0x3 scbus0 target 4 lun 0: SCB 0: Immediate reset. Flags = 0x1 scbus0 target 4 lun 0: no longer in timeout ahc0: Issued Channel A Bus Reset. 1 SCBs aborted ahc0:A:4: refuses WIDE negotiation. Using 8bit transfers cd0 at scbus0 target 4 lun 0 cd0: type 5 removable SCSI 2 cd0: CD-ROM cd present [-256634383 x -465753616 byte records] vga0: rev 0x00 int a irq 11 on pci0.14.0 vx0: <3COM 3C590 Etherlink III PCI> rev 0x00 int a irq 9 on pci0.16.0 utp/aui/bnc[*utp*]: disable 'auto select' with DOS util! address 00:20:af:f6:e3:e1 Warning! Defective early revision adapter! Probing for devices on the ISA bus: sc0 at 0x60-0x6f irq 1 on motherboard sc0: VGA color <16 virtual consoles, flags=0x0> I haven't built a new kernel or anything yet, just wondering if this is a known problem and if there's a fix. thanks, -Ian -- Ian Kallen ian@gamespot.com Director of Technology and Web Administration SpotMedia Communications http://www.gamespot.com/ http://www.videogamespot.com/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 18:39:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA13742 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 18:39:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (ppp20.portal.net.au [202.12.71.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA13737 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 18:39:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA06133; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:07:11 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709110107.LAA06133@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Simon Shapiro cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: /usr/include/sys How To question In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:50:31 MST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:07:07 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > How do I integrate opt_dlm.h into sys/dlm.h so that it will reflect the > proper sizing? If the kernel was built on the target machine, it is simple. > If not, it can be nasty. Think about it for a second, and you will realise that what you ask is impossible. (imagine two kernels built with different values, eg.) If you only have a small number of these tunables, make them sysctl variables. Otherwise, define a structure containing them and a new ioctl to retrieve it. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 18:48:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA14333 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 18:48:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from css.tuu.utas.edu.au (acs@css.tuu.utas.edu.au [131.217.115.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA14266 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 18:47:54 -0700 (PDT) From: andrew@ugh.net.au Received: from localhost (acs@localhost) by css.tuu.utas.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA11121; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:48:19 +1000 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: depravitas.tuu.utas.edu.au: acs owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:48:19 +1000 (EST) To: Temcguire@aol.com cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Interpreter compilers In-Reply-To: <970909142903_-131376035@emout04.mail.aol.com> Message-ID: X-Meaning-of-Life: none X-WonK: *wibble* MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 9 Sep 1997 Temcguire@aol.com wrote: > Question#2: Can PERL scripts be translated into C and compiled into > executables? There is a perl compiler that works under FreeBSD. Try http://www.perl.com/ > processor. I have 64Mb of memory and wonder if I installed another > processor, would FreeBSD operate much faster? Only if you were running 3.0-CURRENT with an SMP kernel. Andrew From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 20:09:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA20043 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 20:09:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from w2xo.pgh.pa.us (w2xo.pgh.pa.us [206.210.70.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA20030 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 20:09:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from w2xo.pgh.pa.us (w2xo.pgh.pa.us [206.210.70.5]) by w2xo.pgh.pa.us (8.8.5/8.8.4) with SMTP id XAA00228 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:09:35 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <341760EF.41C67EA6@w2xo.pgh.pa.us> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:09:35 -0400 From: Jim Durham Organization: Dis- X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.0-970618-SNAP i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: wt driver in 3.0-SNAP 970807 crashes system Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I recently installed 3.0_SNAP 970807.. Tried to read some tapes made on my Wangtek drive under 2.1.6, which used to read OK. Can't read them at all. They are tar gzipped archives and dump tapes. Tar tvzf /dev/rwt0 returns "not in gzipped format" and restore -if /dev/rwt0 returns "Not dump tape". At this point I tried to do a read-write test by tarring a small group of files. tar cvzf /dev/rwt0 returned "cannot write to /dev/wt0". Cassette was not write-protected. tar cvf /dev/rwt0 ran to completion. When I tried to read it back, it returned "i/o error" and promptly crashed the system. I tried this twice, crashed it immediately both times. Nothing was logged in /var/log/messages. Anyone else had a problem with the wt driver in 3.0-SNAP? -- Jim Durham From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 20:13:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA20489 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 20:13:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sendero-ppp.i-connect.net (sendero-ppp.i-Connect.Net [206.190.143.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA20478 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 20:13:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 7043 invoked by uid 1000); 11 Sep 1997 03:13:21 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.2-alpha [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199709110107.LAA06133@word.smith.net.au> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 20:13:21 -0700 (PDT) Organization: Atlas Telecom From: Simon Shapiro To: Mike Smith Subject: Re: /usr/include/sys How To question Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi Mike Smith; On 11-Sep-97 you wrote: > > > > How do I integrate opt_dlm.h into sys/dlm.h so that it will reflect the > > proper sizing? If the kernel was built on the target machine, it is > > simple. > > If not, it can be nasty. > > Think about it for a second, and you will realise that what you ask is > impossible. (imagine two kernels built with different values, eg.) I thought about it for few minutes and saw it to be impossible. This is why I posted the question :-) > If you only have a small number of these tunables, make them sysctl > variables. Otherwise, define a structure containing them and a new > ioctl to retrieve it. I have the ioctl to retrieve them. How do I go about making them sysctl variables? --- Sincerely Yours, (Sent on 10-Sep-97, 20:04:17 by XF-Mail) Simon Shapiro Atlas Telecom Senior Architect 14355 SW Allen Blvd., Suite 130 Beaverton OR 97005 Shimon@i-Connect.Net Voice: 503.643.5559, Emergency: 503.799.2313 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 21:07:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA24171 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 21:07:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hydrogen.nike.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA24165 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 21:07:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.nike.efn.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA21703; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 20:36:00 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970910203559.04301@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 20:35:59 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: Eivind Eklund Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PnP support References: <199709101826.UAA02417@bitbox.follo.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709101826.UAA02417@bitbox.follo.net>; from Eivind Eklund on Wed, Sep 10, 1997 at 08:26:16PM +0200 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Eivind Eklund scribbled this message on Sep 10: > (1) I wanted the driver to be able to work with both PnP and ISA > cards. However, the ISA probe mess up the card (or the internal > FreeBSD driver setup - I'm not certain, but it don't work unless I > inhibit the ISA probe). What is the best way to inhibit this probe? > Presently, I just set a static variable and return false on the probe > if it is set, but I don't think that is a good solution. I've thought > about setting the ISA card to disabled if PnP probes true, but somehow > don't find that aestecially pleasing, either (and I suspect it will be > saved in the kernel for the next boot, too). well... actually.. this won't be neccessary soon.. I plan on adding resource registering to the pnp code soon... once this is done, the isa probe code should automaticly skip over this... > (2) I found no way to report that the driver was unable to attach if > the probe came out true. This might be me thinking approaching this > wrongly, but the default attach for this driver do some of the setup > for the card, and can fail. Should this be re-arranged for most of > that work to be done during the probe, to be certain the attach can't > fail? That would start messing with the card setup during the probe, > which doesn't seem right? yeh.. I've thought about that too... but there is a very good way to test this... just make sure that dev.id_alive to zero if attach failed.. if your interested, I can send you my patches to sio that pnp'izes this driver... > (3) The card reports as unknown0 . I assume this can be > changed somewhere, but didn't find it in the docs for the PnP code > (the man-page plus the . Where do I fix this? (A source file name > would be enough - I assume somebody can answer this with less work > than I would spend finding it ;-) Luigi has answered this one... :) > This is my first attempt at hardware driver hacking under FreeBSD, as > you probably can see from the level of the questions. I'll contribute > the changes back when I get it to work properly (and I get my employer > to OK contributing this). sounds good... -- John-Mark Gurney Modem/FAX: +1 541 683 6954 Cu Networking Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 21:10:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA24357 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 21:10:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id VAA24351 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 21:10:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id GAA15889; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 06:09:53 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id GAA09019; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 06:08:38 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970911060837.CN01948@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 06:08:37 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FREEBSD) Cc: philippe.brun@eurocontrol.fr (BRUN Philippe) Subject: Re: Arinc device driver kvtop problem References: <34174307@brteec1> <199709101653.CAA04895@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709101653.CAA04895@word.smith.net.au>; from Mike Smith on Sep 11, 1997 02:53:13 +1000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Mike Smith wrote: > This is outside the "ISA hole", and means that you can't use the iomem > approach. You probably can, but you can only use it as a hint to the driver which memory to map. Only the ``ISA hole'' is being mapped automatically, other adapter memory regions need to be mapped manually. > Until recently, FreeBSD didn't support main memory being fragmented (if > I remeber correctly). But that's IMHO not related to adapter memory. It has always been possible to make additional mappings. The X servers are using those, for example, to access linear frame buffers. They're arranging for their mapping via /dev/mem. A kernel driver would have to map the memory itself. (Maybe John or David can give a short instruction which steps are needed for this.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 21:34:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA25348 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 21:34:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.fr [193.56.58.253]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA25324 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 21:33:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.fr [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.8.4/8.8.4) with ESMTP id GAA19022; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 06:33:55 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.8.6/brasil-1.2) with UUCP id GAA09914; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 06:33:18 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.7/keltia-uucp-2.10/nospam) id XAA05276; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:46:36 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19970910234636.15636@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:46:36 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: FREEBSD Cc: Philippe.Brun@eurocontrol.fr Subject: Re: Port an arinc isa bus driver from HP Unix References: <3416CCEB@brteec1> <19970910172336.17475@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76 In-Reply-To: <19970910172336.17475@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Wed, Sep 10, 1997 at 05:23:36PM +0930 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT ctm#3634 AMD-K6 MMX @ 208 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Greg Lehey: > If you don't, nobody will. Where did it panic? What was the > instruction? There's no reason to assume it happened in the function > you list. The code in isa.c tries to configure the card and tries to deference the address given in the config line (maddr 0xf0000) and kvtop() panics. The trace from memory is kvtop config_isadev_c config_isadev the line triggering the panic()is the following: isa.c: if (isdp->id_maddr) printf(" maddr 0x%lx", kvtop(isdp->id_maddr)); isdp->is_maddr is given to kvtop() as 0xf0f0000 (where it should probably be 0xf0000 I guess) and kvtop() can't find the address in the page tables. The main problem that I see is that the card wants to have its shared memory segment at 0xf0000 (that is, outside the usual 384 KB segment). I'm not a kernel guru and I see a problem where the kernel think it is using a virtual address where it is given a physical one (or the reverse). (in case one is wondering, Philippe is working in the same firm as I do and I'm responsible for him using FreeBSD instead of Linux :-) -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: There are no limits -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 3.0-CURRENT #31: Sat Sep 6 21:58:17 CEST 1997 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 21:37:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA25616 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 21:37:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA25611 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 21:37:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA06436; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:05:55 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709110405.OAA06436@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Simon Shapiro cc: Mike Smith , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: /usr/include/sys How To question In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 10 Sep 1997 20:13:21 MST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:05:52 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > If you only have a small number of these tunables, make them sysctl > > variables. Otherwise, define a structure containing them and a new > > ioctl to retrieve it. > > I have the ioctl to retrieve them. How do I go about making them sysctl > variables? Try something like : #ifndef FOO_TUNABLE # define FOO_TUNABLE 16 #endif static int foo_knob = FOO_TUNABLE; SYSCTL_INT(_machdep, OID_AUTO, foo_knob, CTLFLAG_RO, &foo_knob, 0, ""); See sys/sysctl.h for more details. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 21:51:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA26186 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 21:51:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id VAA26178 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 21:51:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id GAA16075 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 06:50:57 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id GAA09492; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 06:42:31 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970911064231.JG62790@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 06:42:31 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Kernel clock runs inaccurately References: <199709080124.JAA14004@tao.sinanet.com.tw> <19970908081010.DS04250@uriah.heep.sax.de> <199709102025.WAA02815@bitbox.follo.net> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709102025.WAA02815@bitbox.follo.net>; from Eivind Eklund on Sep 10, 1997 22:25:50 +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Eivind Eklund wrote: > > (They are probably living in somewhat of an ivory tower with > > good NTP refclocks readily available on a cheap Internet, something > > that is not my situation, sitting behind dialup lines everywhere.) > > Shouldn't it be still be possible to set up xntpd with > drift-correction and synchronization often, and just suppress > xntpd-messages from starting the ppp-link? Too expensive still. The dialup itself is ISDN, so the setup time is ~ 2 seconds or less, but having an xntpd calling each 5 or 15 minutes would greatly increase our phone and Internet costs. Btw., the DCF-77 receiver, with fallback to the system clock of the machine hosting this receiver, seems to work well now. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 22:20:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA27329 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 22:20:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pcpsj.pfcs.com (mJBx0aB2CQHiMhl5k+NliZ23cFSd/J/1@harlan.fred.net [205.252.219.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA27256 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 22:19:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mumps.pfcs.com (mumps.pfcs.com [192.52.69.11]) by pcpsj.pfcs.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with SMTP id BAA21923; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 01:12:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost by mumps.pfcs.com with SMTP id AA16049 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Thu, 11 Sep 1997 01:11:59 -0400 To: Eivind Eklund Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, ywliu1@tao.sinanet.com.tw Subject: Re: Kernel clock runs inaccurately In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 10 Sep 1997 22:25:50 +0200." <199709102025.WAA02815@bitbox.follo.net> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 01:11:57 -0300 Message-Id: <16047.873954717@mumps.pfcs.com> From: Harlan Stenn Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk My netsork's xntpd server syncs to the local clock whenever it can't reach the outside servers. This machine is on a demand-dial ppp link, and ntp packets don't cause a dial or keep the link up. THe biggest problem I have is when I download a bunch of stuff for a long enough period of time that the ntp packets are delayed... H From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 22:24:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA27727 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 22:24:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA27720 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 22:24:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA06562; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:53:01 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709110453.OAA06562@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: John-Mark Gurney cc: Eivind Eklund , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: PnP support In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 10 Sep 1997 20:35:59 MST." <19970910203559.04301@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:52:59 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > well... actually.. this won't be neccessary soon.. I plan on adding > resource registering to the pnp code soon... once this is done, the > isa probe code should automaticly skip over this... Please, if you are going to do this, go back to the discussion that came up last time on this topic, most particularly the allocation and attachment strategy that Stefan and I discussed. Doing this job half-assed is just going to mean that it will have to be done again. Do it right and people will love you forever. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 22:26:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA27828 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 22:26:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from super-g.inch.com (super-g.com [207.240.140.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA27820 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 22:26:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (spork@localhost) by super-g.inch.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id BAA16758 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 01:37:52 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 01:37:52 -0400 (EDT) From: spork X-Sender: spork@super-g.inch.com To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: mmap and INN Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've attached two messages I dug up out of the mail archives that seem to contradict each other. Gary says mmap + INN is a good thing, and Mike says it's a bad thing... Who should I listen to? We're close to going live with a 2.2-stable news machine, and I'm a bit confused about what INN optimizations to go with. Thanks, Charles --> Gary Subject: Re: INN 1.5.1 w/MMAP OK on FreeBSD-2.2? From: gpalmer@webspan.net (Gary Palmer) Date: 1997/04/01 Message-Id: <5hpuur$5q8@news.webspan.net> Newsgroups: news.software.nntp,comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc [More Headers] In article <5havfd$hd@gosset.maths.tcd.ie>, ajudge@maths.tcd.ie (Alan Judge) writes: > I'm just about to install an INN-1.5.1 system on a FreeBSD server > (running 2.2-RELEASE, soon to be 2.2.1-RELEASE). Does anyone know > if the past problems with mmap on FreeBSD are now fixed? I'd like > to know if I can safely set active and DBZ to use MMAP (and whether > the various shared active patches for nnrpd will work). -->MMAP is indeed fixed in 2.2. I've been running with -current (and later the 2.2 branch after the branch was made) on my news server for several months with no kernel problems (just drives dying). Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info ---> Mike Date: Thu, 24 Jul 1997 04:58:58 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith To: ksmm@cybercom.net Cc: mrcpu@cdsnet.net, chat@FreeBSD.ORG, questions@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: -current report. :) (moved to chat/questions) The Classiest Man Alive stands accused of saying: > Okay, see, now you've got me worried. What crashes? I convinced my IS > manager to let me set up our news server with FreeBSD rather than NT. I'm > using 2.2.1, but I read that 2.2.2 fixes some problems with using an > Adaptec 2940 under a heavy load, so I thought I'd upgrade to the latest > release. And now you tell me this? Lots of people are happy with 2.2-stable. I'd suggest bring it up in test mode and run it for a few days under a test load and see how it holds up. Make sure you're using inn as configured out of the ports --> collection, particularly with the mmap stuff off. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 23:10:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA29859 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:10:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hydrogen.nike.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA29854 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:10:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.nike.efn.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA22101; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:10:15 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970910231015.01243@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:10:15 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: Mike Smith Cc: Eivind Eklund , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: PnP support References: <19970910203559.04301@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> <199709110453.OAA06562@word.smith.net.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709110453.OAA06562@word.smith.net.au>; from Mike Smith on Thu, Sep 11, 1997 at 02:52:59PM +1000 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Mike Smith scribbled this message on Sep 11: > > > > well... actually.. this won't be neccessary soon.. I plan on adding > > resource registering to the pnp code soon... once this is done, the > > isa probe code should automaticly skip over this... > > Please, if you are going to do this, go back to the discussion that > came up last time on this topic, most particularly the allocation and > attachment strategy that Stefan and I discussed. Doing this job > half-assed is just going to mean that it will have to be done again. > Do it right and people will love you forever. are you talking about making auto resource assignment?? if you are, that wasn't what I was refering too... currently the PnP code DOES NOT claim that a device is using port space (i.e. to prevent conflics) or memory space for that mater... this is what I was talking about... not automaticly assigned free resources... one good example is that Pasqual who was testing out my sio aware PnP driver had his modem attached as both sio1 and sio2.. this isn't ver good from a user standpoint and needs to be fixed ASAP... ttyl.. -- John-Mark Gurney Modem/FAX: +1 541 683 6954 Cu Networking Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 23:18:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA00368 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:18:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA00360 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:18:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA06738; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 15:46:47 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709110546.PAA06738@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: John-Mark Gurney cc: Mike Smith , Eivind Eklund , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: PnP support In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:10:15 MST." <19970910231015.01243@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 15:46:47 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Mike Smith scribbled this message on Sep 11: > > > > > > well... actually.. this won't be neccessary soon.. I plan on adding > > > resource registering to the pnp code soon... once this is done, the > > > isa probe code should automaticly skip over this... > > > > Please, if you are going to do this, go back to the discussion that > > came up last time on this topic, most particularly the allocation and > > attachment strategy that Stefan and I discussed. Doing this job > > half-assed is just going to mean that it will have to be done again. > > Do it right and people will love you forever. > > are you talking about making auto resource assignment?? if you are, > that wasn't what I was refering too... I mean go back and read the discussion that came up last time "how to integrate PnP" was raised. Right now it's arriving via feeping creaturism, which is OK in that it gives us functionality that we didn't have, but it's basically Wrong, and gives us momentum in the wrong direction. If you have the time to do this, *please* take a little more of it to do it right. We've been over all this several times, and have hashed out some pretty good models. Doug Rabson got a long way through completely redesigning the ISA driver model with huge advantages before disappearing. Don't just throw all this work away. Please? > currently the PnP code DOES NOT claim that a device is using port space > (i.e. to prevent conflics) or memory space for that mater... this is > what I was talking about... not automaticly assigned free resources... If you want a decent resource/extent manager, have a look at the NetBSD extent manager. Whilst Jason may disagree, a little work would see it fitting _very_ well into the picture when it comes to carving up space, and we do need it very much. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 23:20:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA00570 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:20:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ghpc8.ihf.rwth-aachen.de (ghpc8.ihf.RWTH-Aachen.DE [134.130.90.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA00564 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:20:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ghpc6.ihf.rwth-aachen.de (ghpc6.ihf.rwth-aachen.de [134.130.90.6]) by ghpc8.ihf.rwth-aachen.de (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id IAA04025; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 08:19:59 +0200 (CEST) Received: (from thomas@localhost) by ghpc6.ihf.rwth-aachen.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id IAA22497; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 08:19:58 +0200 (CEST) To: John-Mark Gurney Cc: Eivind Eklund , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PnP support References: <199709101826.UAA02417@bitbox.follo.net> <19970910203559.04301@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> From: Thomas Gellekum Date: 11 Sep 1997 08:19:57 +0200 In-Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney's message of Wed, 10 Sep 1997 20:35:59 -0700 Message-ID: <87iuw874oi.fsf@ghpc6.ihf.rwth-aachen.de> Lines: 10 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.4.37/XEmacs 19.15 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk John-Mark Gurney writes: > > if your interested, I can send you my patches to sio that pnp'izes > this driver... How about putting the driver and/or the patches into /usr/share/examples with a few notes? tg From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 23:24:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA00991 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:24:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA00976 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:24:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id HAA23558; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 07:13:33 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199709110513.HAA23558@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: PnP support To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 07:13:32 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu, perhaps@yes.no, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709110453.OAA06562@word.smith.net.au> from "Mike Smith" at Sep 11, 97 02:52:40 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Please, if you are going to do this, go back to the discussion that > came up last time on this topic, most particularly the allocation and > attachment strategy that Stefan and I discussed. Doing this job > half-assed is just going to mean that it will have to be done again. where was it discussed ? I do not remember having seen this on -hackers, although I brought up the subject in july (specifically about the attach returning or not an error value) when I started working on PnP. I am asking because I would like to help on this. Cheers Luigi From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 23:32:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA01543 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:32:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA01518 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:31:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA06822; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:00:15 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709110600.QAA06822@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: spork cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: mmap and INN In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 01:37:52 -0400." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:00:13 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I've attached two messages I dug up out of the mail archives that seem to > contradict each other. Gary says mmap + INN is a good thing, and Mike > says it's a bad thing... No, Gary says it works. I've heard plenty of people saying that a) it doesn't always work for them, and b) it's faster without. > Who should I listen to? We're close to going live with a 2.2-stable news > machine, and I'm a bit confused about what INN optimizations to go with. Test it under your own conditions. It's not hard to cut between two versions to compare it with your workload. You will note that this is what I said last time, and I mean it - if you are going to depend on *anything*, whether it be software or a gasket, TEST IT FIRST. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 23:45:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA02483 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:45:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from misery.sdf.com (misery.sdf.com [204.244.210.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA02478 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:45:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tom by misery.sdf.com with smtp (Exim 1.62 #1) id 0x92v8-0000gx-00; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:40:06 -0700 Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:40:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom To: spork cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: mmap and INN In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, spork wrote: > I've attached two messages I dug up out of the mail archives that seem to > contradict each other. Gary says mmap + INN is a good thing, and Mike > says it's a bad thing... > > Who should I listen to? We're close to going live with a 2.2-stable news > machine, and I'm a bit confused about what INN optimizations to go with. > > Thanks, > > Charles mmap() was never really broken, INN just had some assumptions on how it ought to work. Make sure you use MMAP_SYNC. I also have the nnrpd's mmap the active file too (this is not part of stock INN 1.5.1). I have seen corruption in the active file, but only after a crash. I basically saw a bunch of zeros added near the end of the file. If innd doesn't die, I don't have a problem. I don't thing the INN port config.data defaults are the greatest. The BLOCK_BACKOFF setting is too high (should be as low as possible, since basically everyone uses channel feeds, and they will clear quickly), and ICD_SYNC_COUNT is too low and will mean that you will sync almost every second. Also, NNTP_ACTIVITY_SYNC is too low, among other things. Tom From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 23:54:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA02823 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:54:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA02816 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:53:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA26548; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:53:19 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:53:18 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Mike Smith cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: <199709100217.MAA00765@word.smith.net.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk No, I would use a select loop but the general idea is that you have a whole lot events (in the form of writing a packet to a socket or something to a serial port) that you want to be able to coordinate in time ----> If for instance I wanted to do this cyclically: send 0xff ----> port 0x260 wait 37ms send 0x00 ----> port 0x260 wait 45ms sample the value @ 0x200 etc. in a user process I would simply use /dev/io and I don't think I want to make my application a driver I simply want to be able to time events on 1ms frames (not necessarily exactly just close), on a modern machine --- running at 200mhz or so there are a lot of clock cycles in between frames, so the overhead of doing this (say in assembly) is not significant --- I have tried putting HZ=1000 and this breaks LOTS of things most notably and important for me: xntpd and it only really gives 500hz at best. On Wed, 10 Sep 1997, Mike Smith wrote: > > > > Can someone give a code snippet of the BEST way of running a 1000HZ for > > loop under freebsd, without consuming massive amounts of cpu time. > > How about you tell us what you're actually trying to do? It sounds > like you want to poll something at a fixed 1KHz rate, which is a) > uncivilised and b) not terribly easy without fiddling. > > If this is what you're after, look at the 'pcaudio' driver, which > fiddles one of the timers to arrange a fast regular interrupt. > > mike > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Sep 10 23:55:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA02875 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:55:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA02870 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:55:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA27889; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:54:59 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:54:59 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Mike Smith cc: Temcguire@aol.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Interpreter compilers In-Reply-To: <199709100221.MAA00790@word.smith.net.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk And I'll add that my experience with TCL/TK suggests that tcl is more useful --- only my opinion, but I am fiercly antiperl. > Tcl supports both regular expressions and associative arrays, and the > current Tcl (8.0) also features a JIT compiler. Depending on your > choice of algorithms, Perl and Tcl are generally comparable in speed. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 00:00:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA03148 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 00:00:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hydrogen.nike.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA03141 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 00:00:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.nike.efn.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA22231; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 00:00:11 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970911000010.53404@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 00:00:10 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: PnP support References: <19970910231015.01243@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> <199709110546.PAA06738@word.smith.net.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709110546.PAA06738@word.smith.net.au>; from Mike Smith on Thu, Sep 11, 1997 at 03:46:47PM +1000 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Mike Smith scribbled this message on Sep 11: > > Mike Smith scribbled this message on Sep 11: > > > > > > > > well... actually.. this won't be neccessary soon.. I plan on adding > > > > resource registering to the pnp code soon... once this is done, the > > > > isa probe code should automaticly skip over this... > > > > > > Please, if you are going to do this, go back to the discussion that > > > came up last time on this topic, most particularly the allocation and > > > attachment strategy that Stefan and I discussed. Doing this job > > > half-assed is just going to mean that it will have to be done again. > > > Do it right and people will love you forever. > > > > are you talking about making auto resource assignment?? if you are, > > that wasn't what I was refering too... > > I mean go back and read the discussion that came up last time "how to > integrate PnP" was raised. Right now it's arriving via feeping > creaturism, which is OK in that it gives us functionality that we > didn't have, but it's basically Wrong, and gives us momentum in the > wrong direction. I vaugely remeber the conversation.. but I didn't follow very closely as I never thought I would end up touching the PnP code.. :) > If you have the time to do this, *please* take a little more of it to > do it right. We've been over all this several times, and have hashed > out some pretty good models. Doug Rabson got a long way through > completely redesigning the ISA driver model with huge advantages before > disappearing. Don't just throw all this work away. Please? yeh... I know what you mean... but right now after I do some more work on integrating this code in (Luigi's sound code is next), I have another project that I've been wanting to work on for the past few months... so I really can't devote the time that would be neccessary for the project... but, I might be able to help in a few weeks if everything goes well.. ugh.. just remebered school starts in a few weeks too... :( hmmm... is the FreeBSD mailing list archives located in such a place that I could grab a RAW copy of 'em?? > > currently the PnP code DOES NOT claim that a device is using port space > > (i.e. to prevent conflics) or memory space for that mater... this is > > what I was talking about... not automaticly assigned free resources... > > If you want a decent resource/extent manager, have a look at the NetBSD > extent manager. Whilst Jason may disagree, a little work would see it > fitting _very_ well into the picture when it comes to carving up space, > and we do need it very much. -- John-Mark Gurney Modem/FAX: +1 541 683 6954 Cu Networking Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 00:09:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA03585 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 00:09:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA03580 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 00:09:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA08032; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 00:08:24 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 00:08:22 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Greg Lehey cc: David Dawes , Satoshi Asami , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: My FreeBSD Wish List... In-Reply-To: <19970910142634.55557@lemis.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have worked extensively with some diskless freebsd & linux machines and a read only /usr is critical, I believe I had to reorganize the /usr a bit in some cases to achieve this (for instance some of the X11 stuff in usr that is really specific config files like making /usr/X11R6/bin/X a link to /var/X11R6/bin/X which links back to the specific X server in /usr/X11R6/bin) and there are some other things for instance it would be nice to have an nfs system that would allow exporting of things other than filesystems since as I understand it you can only have 8 slices on a physical drive and if you want separate permissions for all of your diskless machines in /etc/exports to make the system so that only the machine which mounts its root directory has access to it you need at least 2* the amount of diskless mahcines which could be possibly in the order of 20-30 on a single two gig drive, meaning with the current nfs setup I need 40 filesystems (20 swap 64MB, 20 root 25MB) and I don't really think you can get that many filesystems on a single disk? (or does someone know something I don't) > Well, at the risk of the lives of a few protestants, why /var? My > reading of /var is that it is for frequently changing files, such as > spool files. I agree that it would be nice to have a read-only /usr, > but I think it would be worth giving a bit more consideration for the > new home of the config files. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 00:10:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA03678 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 00:10:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA03669 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 00:10:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA07024; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:38:38 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709110638.QAA07024@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" cc: Mike Smith , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 10 Sep 1997 23:53:18 MST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:38:37 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > No, I would use a select loop but the general idea is that you have a > whole lot events (in the form of writing a packet to a socket or something > to a serial port) that you want to be able to coordinate in time ----> > > If for instance I wanted to do this cyclically: > > send 0xff ----> port 0x260 > wait 37ms > send 0x00 ----> port 0x260 > wait 45ms > sample the value @ 0x200 > etc. The basic nature of FreeBSD (and unix systems in general) makes this almost impossible. You can say "wait at least 37ms", but the sort of determinism that you're demanding above is not achievable in the same environment as preemptive multitasking and interrupt-driven I/O. If you want to get really enthused, I would suggest writing a small pseudomachine and scheduling it off a really fast interrupt as with pcaudio. You could probably get away with a very simple instruction set, and this would give you the granularity you want without the horrific overhead. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 01:05:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA06039 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 01:05:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.giovannelli.it (www.giovannelli.it [194.184.65.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA06031; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 01:05:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gmarco (ts2port3d.masternet.it [194.184.65.217]) by www.giovannelli.it (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA00348; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:08:54 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970911100641.006992ec@giovannelli.it> X-Sender: gmarco@giovannelli.it (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:06:41 +0200 To: questions@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org From: Gianmarco Giovannelli Subject: Important: -O flag crashes cc in libncurses Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello to eveyone, first of all this is my configuration : Mb Asus Tx97-e, Pentium 233, 64mb (edo ram), 2 hd 4 giga wide scsi quantum, 2940uw, a dec 21141 ethernet card (I have read of possible conflict with ahc0 end ep0 , is it true ?) . I have a problem since I installed 3.0. And after all cvsuped I did (the last this morning...) I always receive this error during a make world: cc -O -I. -I/usr/src/lib/libncurses -Wall -DMYTINFO -I/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/include -c /usr/src/lib/libncurses/lib_insch.c -o lib_insch.o cc: Internal compiler error: program cc1 got fatal signal 10 *** Error code 1 And sometimes fatal signal 6. Now I renamed lib_insch.o ad his include file and cvsuped again but the files are identical. So I try to study a remedy for the situation by myself and I discovered a strange thing : here are my steps : gmarco:/usr/src/lib/libncurses#cc -c lib_insch.c -o lib_insch.o gmarco:/usr/src/lib/libncurses#cc -O -c lib_insch.c -o lib_insch.o cc: Internal compiler error: program cc1 got fatal signal 10 gmarco:/usr/src/lib/libncurses#cc -O2 -c lib_insch.c -o lib_insch.o gmarco:/usr/src/lib/libncurses#cc -O3 -c lib_insch.c -o lib_insch.o gmarco:/usr/src/lib/libncurses#cc -O1 -c lib_insch.c -o lib_insch.o cc: Internal compiler error: program cc1 got fatal signal 6 gmarco:/usr/src/lib/libncurses#cc -O2 -I. -I/usr/src/lib/libncurses -Wall -DMYTINFO -c usr/src/lib/libncurses/lib_insch.c -o lib_insch.o gmarco:/usr/src/lib/libncurses#cc -O -I. -I/usr/src/lib/libncurses -Wall -DMYTINFO -c /usr/src/lib/libncurses/lib_insch.c -o lib_insch.o cc: Internal compiler error: program cc1 got fatal signal 10 gmarco:/usr/src/lib/libncurses# What do you think about ? It seems that -O and -O1 crash the compiler, while -O2...3 doesn't .... Now a few considerations... I know just a little about -O, and I think it is the optimization level, but I don't know really what the number are ... Is possible to modify the Makefile to use -O2 for the libncurses instead of -O ? It would important for me if I want to complete a make world.... :-) Why it is happening ? :-) Please for the hacker list : reply directly I am not subscribed to this list... Thanks again for everything... Regards... Gianmarco "Unix expert since yesterday" Home page: http://www2.masternet.it/~gmarco Server page: http://www2.masternet.it/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 01:06:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA06114 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 01:06:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA06109 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 01:06:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA07246; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:27:49 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709110727.RAA07246@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Luigi Rizzo cc: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith), gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu, perhaps@yes.no, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: PnP support In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 07:13:32 +0200." <199709110513.HAA23558@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:27:47 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Please, if you are going to do this, go back to the discussion that > > came up last time on this topic, most particularly the allocation and > > attachment strategy that Stefan and I discussed. Doing this job > > half-assed is just going to mean that it will have to be done again. > > where was it discussed ? I do not remember having seen this on > -hackers, although I brought up the subject in july (specifically about > the attach returning or not an error value) when I started working on > PnP. Ironically, I found most of my record of this thread in a folder with your name on it. 8) The most recent evocation was on -hackers under the titles "sound driver structure and configuration" and "Advice sought on PnP configuration" The most succinct extract I have on the "new" model reads : ---8<---snip---8<--- - gather all the information : PCI probe PnP probe get ISA config (compiled in, datafile, etc.) get PCI/PnP identifier tables (compiled in, bootloader, etc.) - attach PCI devices I/O ports and IRQs are assigned by the PCI rules. - attach PnP devices IRQs are taken from the free pool left after PCI assignment and those marked for 'legacy' use. I/O ports are probed as per the PnP spec. - walk ISA config data, probe possible devices We know which IRQ and I/O resources are still available, we can hunt for devices that match the gaps. I think it's important to leave the 'legacy' devices until _last_, as this prevents a PnP device being accidentally recognised as a 'legacy' device. ---8<---snip---8<--- This was generally accepted (I think Stefan had a few claraifications on it) as being the "most effective" way of going about it. See also the thread "Backwards compatibiliy for isa_driver" on -current around mid-May for Doug R's work, which should definitely be taken seriously. > I am asking because I would like to help on this. I realise, and your work to data alone has been greatly appreciated; don't make the mistake of thinking I'm trying to put it down! mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 01:36:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA07532 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 01:36:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from minor.stranger.com (stranger.vip.best.com [204.156.129.250]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA07518 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 01:36:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dog.farm.org (dog.farm.org [207.111.140.47]) by minor.stranger.com (8.8.5/8.6.12) with ESMTP id BAA10869; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 01:42:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dk@localhost) by dog.farm.org (8.7.5/dk#3) id BAA06048; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 01:33:35 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 01:33:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Dmitry Kohmanyuk Message-Id: <199709110833.BAA06048@dog.farm.org> To: spork@super-g.com (spork) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: mmap and INN Newsgroups: cs-monolit.gated.lists.freebsd.hackers Organization: FARM Computing Association Reply-To: dk+@ua.net X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In article you wrote: > I've attached two messages I dug up out of the mail archives that seem to > contradict each other. Gary says mmap + INN is a good thing, and Mike > says it's a bad thing... > Who should I listen to? We're close to going live with a 2.2-stable news > machine, and I'm a bit confused about what INN optimizations to go with. I am running FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE with INN 1.5.1 and mmap (default setup from ports, only paths changed), and I indeed get zero-filled 4K blocks in my active file. So my advice is that mmap() is broken. I also have this suggestion: From: Ollivier Robert Message-ID: <19970720135853.17655@keltia.freenix.fr> <<< > hmm... why is uses > ## Should we msync when using mmap? Pick DO or DONT. Useful > ## with some slightly broken mmap implementations. (like HPUX and BSD/OS). > #### =()@>()= > MMAP_SYNC DONT > ?? > > should we declare FreeBSD mmap slightly broken?? ;-) Yes. You must use this in addition of the MSYNC_3_ARG parameter. That doesn't prevent the problem from happening though. >>> I haven't tried it yet; the problem with active file doesn't manifest itself often enough. I plan to upgrade to 1.6 and see if the problem persists, and then try MMAP_SYNC DONT. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 02:04:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA08754 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 02:04:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id CAA08652 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 02:03:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id JAA23875; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 09:39:09 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199709110739.JAA23875@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: PnP support To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 09:39:09 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: mike@smith.net.au, gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu, perhaps@yes.no, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199709110727.RAA07246@word.smith.net.au> from "Mike Smith" at Sep 11, 97 05:27:28 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > Please, if you are going to do this, go back to the discussion that > > > came up last time on this topic, most particularly the allocation and > > > attachment strategy that Stefan and I discussed. Doing this job > > > half-assed is just going to mean that it will have to be done again. > > > > where was it discussed ? I do not remember having seen this on > > -hackers, although I brought up the subject in july (specifically about > > the attach returning or not an error value) when I started working on > > PnP. > > Ironically, I found most of my record of this thread in a folder with > your name on it. 8) you are right, it's just that it did not end up in any actual implementation. Also you promised to send me some documentation on Doug R's work and probably both forgot, and the discussion died :) > The most succinct extract I have on the "new" model reads : > > ---8<---snip---8<--- > > - gather all the information : > PCI probe > PnP probe > get ISA config (compiled in, datafile, etc.) > get PCI/PnP identifier tables (compiled in, bootloader, etc.) > > - attach PCI devices > I/O ports and IRQs are assigned by the PCI rules. > - attach PnP devices > IRQs are taken from the free pool left after PCI assignment and > those marked for 'legacy' use. I/O ports are probed as per the > PnP spec. > - walk ISA config data, probe possible devices > We know which IRQ and I/O resources are still available, > we can hunt for devices that match the gaps. > > I think it's important to leave the 'legacy' devices until _last_, as > this prevents a PnP device being accidentally recognised as a 'legacy' > device. > > ---8<---snip---8<--- > > This was generally accepted (I think Stefan had a few claraifications > on it) as being the "most effective" way of going about it. yes unfortunately it requires changes in both the isa and PCI probe/attach sequence which are not under my jurisdiction, that's why I followed a different but compatible approach. > See also the thread "Backwards compatibiliy for isa_driver" on -current > around mid-May for Doug R's work, which should definitely be taken > seriously. I'll look into this. > I realise, and your work to data alone has been greatly appreciated; > don't make the mistake of thinking I'm trying to put it down! not at all, and I hope I have not given the impression of not accepting criticism. As a matter of fact I find criticism the only way to avoid making mistakes :) and hope everybody on this list does the same. In many messages I received lately, containing different views on various topics, the poster seemed to feel compelled to apologize for their opinion being different from mine :) Thanks for being so polite, but it's really not necessary, I have the highest esteem of all of you guys. Cheers Luigi -----------------------------+-------------------------------------- Luigi Rizzo | Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it | Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 | via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 | http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ _____________________________|______________________________________ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 02:19:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA09273 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 02:19:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr05.primenet.com (tlambert@usr05.primenet.com [206.165.6.205]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA09266 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 02:18:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr05.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA12331; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 02:18:35 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709110918.CAA12331@usr05.primenet.com> Subject: Re: My FreeBSD Wish List... To: jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org (Jamil J. Weatherbee) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 09:18:34 +0000 (GMT) Cc: grog@lemis.com, dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au, asami@cs.berkeley.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Jamil J. Weatherbee" at Sep 11, 97 00:08:22 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I have worked extensively with some diskless freebsd & linux machines and > a read only /usr is critical, I happen to be one of those people who agree with this, mostly because I want to ROM FreeBSD onto pen-based PDA's with IR or short range radio links into a local net using SSL or IPv6 + DES. Think about the waitress who comes to your table to take your order... Among other things; there are a hell of a lot of uses for this; a server for JAVA-chip based machines is another. > diskless machines in /etc/exports to make the system so that only the > machine which mounts its root directory has access to it you need at least > 2* the amount of diskless mahcines which could be possibly in the order of > 20-30 on a single two gig drive, meaning with the current nfs setup I need > 40 filesystems (20 swap 64MB, 20 root 25MB) and I don't really think you > can get that many filesystems on a single disk? (or does someone know > something I don't) Read the man page more carefully. You can export subdirectories; an NFS export cant cross a physical mount point, but multiple exports inferior to a physical mount point are allowed. If they weren't, Diskless and Dataless Sun machines would have a hell of a time existing... Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 02:35:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA10123 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 02:35:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA10118 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 02:35:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA07663; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:00:46 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709110900.TAA07663@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Luigi Rizzo cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: PnP support In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 09:39:09 +0200." <199709110739.JAA23875@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:00:45 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Ironically, I found most of my record of this thread in a folder with > > your name on it. 8) > > you are right, it's just that it did not end up in any actual > implementation. Also you promised to send me some documentation on > Doug R's work and probably both forgot, and the discussion died :) Oops. I still have the relevant bits, if the reference below is not enough. [... strategy ...] > > This was generally accepted (I think Stefan had a few claraifications > > on it) as being the "most effective" way of going about it. > > yes unfortunately it requires changes in both the isa and PCI > probe/attach sequence which are not under my jurisdiction, that's why I > followed a different but compatible approach. The point I am making is that if you take this on, the parties responsible for these fields have already agreed on the course of action, and will be supporting you all the way. You won't have to worry about jurisdiction at all. > for their opinion being different from mine :) Thanks for being so > polite, but it's really not necessary, I have the highest esteem > of all of you guys. That's as maybe, but we don't want you to miss the fact that the respect is mutual. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 03:24:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA12328 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 03:24:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hda.hda.com (hda-bicnet.bicnet.net [208.220.66.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA12323 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 03:24:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.hda.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id FAA23225; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 05:33:39 -0400 (EDT) From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199709110933.FAA23225@hda.hda.com> Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: from Lee Crites at "Sep 10, 97 03:17:02 pm" To: leec@adam.adonai.net (Lee Crites) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 05:33:38 -0400 (EDT) Cc: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL25 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > According to Stevens (et al), hard real-time programming (which > is what 1ms timing is) is not reliably possible on un*x... Hard real-time programming is independent of time base and is usually defined by being deadline driven, e.g., the glass bottle picker upper snatching bottles off the conveyer belt. When you are late you smash the bottle. There is no time base you can identify as being "hard real time". There are many issues in the fbsd kernel - it isn't reentrant, it isn't interruptible, interrupts are turned off in places, etc. The "easy" way to add demonstrably correct hard real time to unix is to time multiplex the CPU. Degrade the CPU by a duty cycle, and dedicate the part you've stolen to running something completely orthogonal to the unix kernel. You've created a second virtual CPU where you can do hard real time. Your interrupt latency suffers in the normal world. You preempt the kernel, so you have to worry about any hidden real time requirements (typically associated with devices) in the normal kernel. There are obvious problems when interrupts are turned off in the normal kernel, etc. It is doable. Oh oh, I hear Terry sneaking up on me... Peter -- Peter Dufault (dufault@hda.com) Realtime development, Machine control, HD Associates, Inc. Safety critical systems, Agency approval From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 03:24:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA12366 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 03:24:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id DAA12351 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 03:24:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id LAA24117; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:13:45 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199709110913.LAA24117@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: PnP support To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:13:45 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709110900.TAA07663@word.smith.net.au> from "Mike Smith" at Sep 11, 97 07:00:26 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > [... strategy ...] > > > This was generally accepted (I think Stefan had a few claraifications > > > on it) as being the "most effective" way of going about it. > > > > yes unfortunately it requires changes in both the isa and PCI > > probe/attach sequence which are not under my jurisdiction, that's why I > > followed a different but compatible approach. > > The point I am making is that if you take this on, the parties > responsible for these fields have already agreed on the course of > action, and will be supporting you all the way. You won't have to > worry about jurisdiction at all. ok. So a few more tech details. The resource management code should then keep a private list of used resources, with functions like haveseen_isa(), haveseen_pnp(), haveseen_pci() which check if any of the requested resource is busy and return a success only if all are free. Correspondingly there should be calls to make it possible to register/unregister resource usage. Possibly we should also have contigmalloc-like functions to return ranges of iospace etc within some desired constraint (useful to allocate PnP address ranges etc.). John-Mark is telling me that the current haveseen_isa() just scans some isa_devtab_* instead of keeping info in a private structure. This is not well suited for dynamic devices such as PnP and PCI ones, and too much isa-centric. Due to recent events :) , but also to the start of classes and to the need to keep developing the sound stuff, I don't have enough time to also rewrite this resource allocation stuff which is a necessary requirement to change the probe/attach sequence as discussed in [strategy] above, so is there any volunteer ? CHeers Luigi -----------------------------+-------------------------------------- Luigi Rizzo | Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it | Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 | via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 | http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ _____________________________|______________________________________ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 03:38:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA13158 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 03:38:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA13144 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 03:38:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA00256; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:02:41 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709111002.UAA00256@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Luigi Rizzo cc: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith), freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PnP support In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:13:45 +0200." <199709110913.LAA24117@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:02:36 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > [... strategy ...] > > The point I am making is that if you take this on, the parties > > responsible for these fields have already agreed on the course of > > action, and will be supporting you all the way. You won't have to > > worry about jurisdiction at all. > > ok. So a few more tech details. The resource management code should > then keep a private list of used resources, with functions like > haveseen_isa(), haveseen_pnp(), haveseen_pci() which check if any of > the requested resource is busy and return a success only if all are > free. Correspondingly there should be calls to make it possible to > register/unregister resource usage. Possibly we should also have > contigmalloc-like functions to return ranges of iospace etc within some > desired constraint (useful to allocate PnP address ranges etc.). This is why I exhorted you to look at the extent manager in NetBSD. It allows you to define "extents" which are just arbitrary ranges of "something". I would visualise this being used as follows : - the ISA startup code says "yup, this machine has an ISA bus", and creates an extent called "isa_io" and another called "isa_mem" - the ESCD or ISA startup code would create an extent called "isa_irq" and another called "isa_drq" indicating the resources available to the ISA bus. Traversal of these extents would then allow the PnP and vanilla-ISA probe/attach code to determine which regions were available for use and which had already been allocated. I don't think that making these extents "private" would be at all helpful. Having them public, and referenced by name, will make it easier to access them. > Due to recent events :) , but also to the start of classes and to > the need to keep developing the sound stuff, I don't have enough > time to also rewrite this resource allocation stuff which is a > necessary requirement to change the probe/attach sequence as > discussed in [strategy] above, so is there any volunteer ? I played a lot with the NetBSD extent allocator a while back. Jason didn't entirely like what I was doing (and TBH some of my ideas were pretty warped), but I would be happy to start over and just add the important bits (extent names & owners, public extents). I could probably have this ready in a few days. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 04:18:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA15132 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 04:18:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lestat.nas.nasa.gov (lestat.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.50.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA15116 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 04:18:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lestat.nas.nasa.gov (8.8.6/8.6.12) with SMTP id EAA19340; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 04:09:50 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709111109.EAA19340@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> X-Authentication-Warning: lestat.nas.nasa.gov: localhost [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Mike Smith Cc: Luigi Rizzo , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: PnP support Reply-To: Jason Thorpe From: Jason Thorpe Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 04:09:49 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:02:36 +1000 Mike Smith wrote: > - the ISA startup code says "yup, this machine has an ISA bus", and > creates an extent called "isa_io" and another called "isa_mem" ...on the PC, it makes a bit more sense to just always manage the entire addressable range of i/o ports and memory-like space, rather than creating an ISA-specific map, etc. Think about e.g. PCI VGA cards, and their ISA compatibility range. Also, if you have an all-encompassing map like this, allocation of unused physical address space for e.g. memory-mapped EISA cards is much easier. You might want to take a look at NetBSD-current's i386 machdep.c - just look for the extent_* calls. > - the ESCD or ISA startup code would create an extent called "isa_irq" > and another called "isa_drq" indicating the resources available > to the ISA bus. Erm ... an extent map is a bit overboard for this, I think - for drqs, a simple bitmap will suffice, and for irqs, and array of "share types", indexed by irq. > I don't think that making these extents "private" would be at all > helpful. Having them public, and referenced by name, will make it > easier to access them. Referenced by name can be problematic - On interesting machines, that simply doesn't scale. What you really want is to use opaque tags to reference "bus space". These tags are interpreted by machine-dependent code (which implements an MI API), and translate into the right thing. Last I heard, FreeBSD still wanted to run on the Alpha, and if that's the case, you're going to _have_ to think about this. For those wondering why it's problematic, you should take a look at an AlphaServer 8400 sometime - it can have multiple primary PCI busses, each with its own physical address space, and each of these primary PCI busses can host an EISA/ISA bus. NetBSD runs on this system, but it wouldn't have been possible if we hadn't paid careful attention to getting bus space accounting right. > I played a lot with the NetBSD extent allocator a while back. Jason > didn't entirely like what I was doing (and TBH some of my ideas were > pretty warped), but I would be happy to start over and just add the > important bits (extent names & owners, public extents). I could > probably have this ready in a few days. If you could write up a concise description of what the changes are (the last I got from you was a "well, this is basically what I did"), I'd be happy to reconsider my position on some of those things. For example, I don't think you ever mentioned the idea of a "public extent". (And, really, what does that _mean_?) Jason R. Thorpe thorpej@nas.nasa.gov NASA Ames Research Center Home: +1 408 866 1912 NAS: M/S 258-6 Work: +1 415 604 0935 Moffett Field, CA 94035 Pager: +1 415 428 6939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 05:04:30 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA16999 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 05:04:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hydrogen.nike.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA16994 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 05:04:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.nike.efn.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA25178; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 05:04:08 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970911050407.06011@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 05:04:07 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: Mike Smith Cc: Luigi Rizzo , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PnP support References: <199709110913.LAA24117@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> <199709111002.UAA00256@word.smith.net.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709111002.UAA00256@word.smith.net.au>; from Mike Smith on Thu, Sep 11, 1997 at 08:02:36PM +1000 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Mike Smith scribbled this message on Sep 11: > > > [... strategy ...] > > > The point I am making is that if you take this on, the parties > > > responsible for these fields have already agreed on the course of > > > action, and will be supporting you all the way. You won't have to > > > worry about jurisdiction at all. > > > > ok. So a few more tech details. The resource management code should > > then keep a private list of used resources, with functions like > > haveseen_isa(), haveseen_pnp(), haveseen_pci() which check if any of > > the requested resource is busy and return a success only if all are > > free. Correspondingly there should be calls to make it possible to > > register/unregister resource usage. Possibly we should also have > > contigmalloc-like functions to return ranges of iospace etc within some > > desired constraint (useful to allocate PnP address ranges etc.). > > This is why I exhorted you to look at the extent manager in NetBSD. It > allows you to define "extents" which are just arbitrary ranges of > "something". I would visualise this being used as follows : > > - the ISA startup code says "yup, this machine has an ISA bus", and > creates an extent called "isa_io" and another called "isa_mem" > - the ESCD or ISA startup code would create an extent called "isa_irq" > and another called "isa_drq" indicating the resources available > to the ISA bus. > > Traversal of these extents would then allow the PnP and vanilla-ISA > probe/attach code to determine which regions were available for use and > which had already been allocated. hehe... I was just thinking about this.. and writing a spec that was very similar to this.. but I was also trying to extend the spec to support the removal of resources (i.e. pccard gets removed)... > I don't think that making these extents "private" would be at all > helpful. Having them public, and referenced by name, will make it > easier to access them. I agree... I assume your talking about id numbers?? > > Due to recent events :) , but also to the start of classes and to > > the need to keep developing the sound stuff, I don't have enough > > time to also rewrite this resource allocation stuff which is a > > necessary requirement to change the probe/attach sequence as > > discussed in [strategy] above, so is there any volunteer ? > > I played a lot with the NetBSD extent allocator a while back. Jason > didn't entirely like what I was doing (and TBH some of my ideas were > pretty warped), but I would be happy to start over and just add the > important bits (extent names & owners, public extents). I could > probably have this ready in a few days. hmm... this sounds nice... I'm in the process of writing my spec, but would be interested in seeing what you have already... -- John-Mark Gurney Modem/FAX: +1 541 683 6954 Cu Networking Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 05:30:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA18268 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 05:30:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bmggwy1.bmg.gv.at (bmggwy1.bmg.gv.at [194.232.79.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id FAA18263 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 05:30:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: by bmggwy1.bmg.gv.at; (5.65v3.2/1.3/10May95) id AA25521; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:34:01 +0200 Received: by fw2.bmg.gv.at; (5.65v3.2/1.3/10May95) id AA30625; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:34:09 +0200 Received: from [10.41.0.35] by bmg004.bmg.gv.at (5.65v4.0/1.1.8.2/16Dec96-1116AM) id AA19424; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:40:00 +0200 Received: from hugo.bmg.gv.at (hugo.bmg.gv.at [10.41.0.35]) by hugo.bmg.gv.at (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id OAA01916 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:30:15 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.0 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 2 (High) Priority: urgent X-Chameleon-Return-To: alex@hugo.bmg.gv.at X-Xfmail-Return-To: alex@hugo.bmg.gv.at Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:02:38 +0200 (MET DST) From: Alexander Hausner To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: fd.c and Compaq AERO Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Dear All, There is a problem concerning detection of the pcmcia-floppy on compaq aero notebooks. I found some entries in the freebsd-questions archive: >Date: Thu, 17 Aug 1995 16:56:12 -0400 (EDT) >From: John Seamus >To: questions@FreeBSD.ORG >Sender: questions-owner@FreeBSD.ORG >Subject: installing on a laptop > >I want to install freebsd on a compaq contura aero laptop, but have been >having awful luck.. I got release 2.1.0-950726-SNAP from ftp.cdrom.com, >and made a copy of the root and boot disks.. my problem is occuring after >bootup.. due to the odd configuration of the floppy drive on the compaq, >after booting, FreeBSD refuses to see the floppy drive... I set >everything up, and when it goes to read the root disk, it says "Error, no >floppy devices found" or something similar to that error.. I am wondering >if I could possibly put the root disk on my dos partition that I'm >installing from, or if there is some way installing freebsd can be done >on this machine... please respond ASAP! >Pat >On Fri, 5 Jul 1996, Michael Richardson wrote: > >> I managed to get the 2.1-960627-SNAP kernel (boot4) to boot on this system. >> If I add -c to the boot flags, and remove the PCMCIA floppy drive and >> insert my etherlink III card, I can recognize it, partition the hard disk, >> and attempt to install. > >This is going to be the way you'll have to install. If your network has >inet access then you should be able to do an ftp install from >ftp.freebsd.org, or from a mounted cd on a local machine. > >> If I try to install from floppy, (leaving the floppy connected the whole >> time), I am informed that the machine does not have a floppy drive. On boot u p, >> I see fdc0, but no fd0 found. > >Welcome to compaq, the proprietary software company. :( > >Doug White | University of Oregon >Internet: dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu | Residence Networking Assistant >http://gladstone.uoregon.edu/~dwhite | Computer Science Major The problem is that this kind of drive can't be detected by reading floppy info from CMOS-RAM. I have now fixed this, by modifying fd.c as follows (output of diff -c fd.c.patch fd.c <== from Freebsd-Current): *** fd.c Thu Sep 11 14:01:20 1997 --- fd.c.new Thu Sep 11 13:56:35 1997 *************** *** 13,18 **** --- 13,20 ---- * Copyright (c) 1993, 1994, 1995 by * joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) * dufault@hda.com (Peter Dufault) + * alex@hugo.bmg.gv.at (Alexander Hausner) minor modifications to support + * compaq aero FDCs * * Redistribution and use in source and binary forms, with or without * modification, are permitted provided that the following conditions *************** *** 43,49 **** * SUCH DAMAGE. * * from: @(#)fd.c 7.4 (Berkeley) 5/25/91 ! * $Id: fd.c,v 1.100 1997/07/20 14:09:54 bde Exp $ * */ --- 45,51 ---- * SUCH DAMAGE. * * from: @(#)fd.c 7.4 (Berkeley) 5/25/91 ! * $Id: fd.c,v 1.92.2.3 1996/12/21 18:33:43 bde Exp $ * */ *************** *** 59,69 **** #include #include #include ! #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include --- 61,73 ---- #include #include #include ! #include ! #include #include #include #include #include + #include #include #include #include *************** *** 84,89 **** --- 88,99 ---- #include #endif + /* bit 0 set ==> no CMOS floppy info ==> maybe we are on a compaq aero */ + #define C_AERO_BIT0 1 + + /* bit 1 set ==> FDC is a NEC 72065B ==> maybe we are on a compaq aero */ + #define C_AERO_BIT1 2 + /* misuse a flag to identify format operation */ #define B_FORMAT B_XXX *************** *** 275,281 **** static struct cdevsw fd_cdevsw; static struct bdevsw fd_bdevsw = { Fdopen, fdclose, fdstrategy, fdioctl, /*2*/ ! nodump, nopsize, D_DISK, "fd", &fd_cdevsw, -1 }; static struct isa_device *fdcdevs[NFDC]; --- 285,291 ---- static struct cdevsw fd_cdevsw; static struct bdevsw fd_bdevsw = { Fdopen, fdclose, fdstrategy, fdioctl, /*2*/ ! nodump, nopsize, 0, "fd", &fd_cdevsw, -1 }; static struct isa_device *fdcdevs[NFDC]; *************** *** 464,469 **** --- 474,480 ---- fdattach(struct isa_device *dev) { unsigned fdt; + unsigned c_aero = 0; fdu_t fdu; fdcu_t fdcu = dev->id_unit; fdc_p fdc = fdc_data + fdcu; *************** *** 503,508 **** --- 514,524 ---- /* look up what bios thinks we have */ switch (fdu) { case 0: fdt = (rtcin(RTC_FDISKETTE) & 0xf0); + if (!(fdt || ((rtcin(RTC_FDISKETTE) << 4) & 0xf0))) { + printf("fdc%d: i belive we are on a compaq aero\n", fdcu); + c_aero ^= C_AERO_BIT0; /* maybe we are on a compaq aero */ + fdt = RTCFDT_144M; + } break; case 1: fdt = ((rtcin(RTC_FDISKETTE) << 4) & 0xf0); break; *************** *** 555,560 **** --- 571,577 ---- case 0x90: printf("NEC 72065B\n"); fdc->fdct = FDC_NE72065; + c_aero ^= C_AERO_BIT1; /* compaq aero ==> NEC 72065B */ break; default: printf("unknown IC type %02x\n", ic_type); *************** *** 604,609 **** --- 621,630 ---- set_motor(fdcu, fdsu, TURNOFF); + if ((c_aero & (C_AERO_BIT0 | C_AERO_BIT1)) == C_AERO_BIT0) { + printf("fd%d: wrong FDC for compaq aero ==> floppy disabled!\n", fdcu); + continue; /* no CMOS floppy type info, but FDC isn't */ + } /* a NEC 72065B ==> probably not a compaq aero */ if (st0 & NE7_ST0_EC) /* no track 0 -> no drive present */ continue; Note: you also need to install the latest firmware upgrade on your compaq aero, you can obtain this from www.compaq.com. I have tested this patch to fd.c not only on a compaq aero but also on an AT&T Globalyst Pentium 120 and an ASUS-Board based P166. Thanks! Alex , , /( )` \ \___ / | __________________________ /- _ `-/ ' / \ (/\/ \ \ /\ | FreeBSD | / / | ` \ |a real operating system for | O O ) / | | real users |,, `-^--'`< ' | | ,, (_.) _ ) / \__________________________/ .. `.___/` / `-----' / <----. __ / __ \ <----|====O)))==) \) /=== <----' `--' `.__,' | \ | \ / /\ ______( (_ / \______/ ,' ,-----' | `--{__________) ---------------------------------- E-Mail: Alexander Hausner Date: 11-Sep-97 Time: 14:30:14 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 05:56:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA19572 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 05:56:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id FAA19531 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 05:56:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id NAA00141; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 13:33:33 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199709111133.NAA00141@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: PnP support To: gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 13:33:33 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: mike@smith.net.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970911050407.06011@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> from "John-Mark Gurney" at Sep 11, 97 05:03:48 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > This is why I exhorted you to look at the extent manager in NetBSD. It > > allows you to define "extents" which are just arbitrary ranges of > > "something". I would visualise this being used as follows : ok, sounds like this is what we need. As a matter of fact it should be pretty simple code with some list manipulation stuff. Since we already have list management macros should not be a problem... unless of course we want to make this code memory-efficient, which we probably should since these maps take space forever whereas are used only when new devices are loaded/unloaded. > > I don't think that making these extents "private" would be at all > > helpful. Having them public, and referenced by name, will make it > > easier to access them. this is more related to religion :) I feel much more comfortable with opaque objects since there is less risk that at some point someone exploits some features on the internals of the data structures thus effectively freezing them. As an example (I am sure you can have many yourselves) I did use a semi-opaque description of dma buffers in the sound code and I am *very* glad I did that since this has allowed me to change radically the dma code twice with zero impact on the rest of the sound code. As an example of the opposite approach, Voxware exports the structure of DMA buffers to the application resulting in some restrictions on the acceptable blocksizes (powers of 2) etc. I think that if haveseen_isa() had used private resource maps instead of relying on the availability of global variables we would not be discussing this now. Cheers Luigi -----------------------------+-------------------------------------- Luigi Rizzo | Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it | Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 | via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 | http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ _____________________________|______________________________________ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 06:51:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA21742 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 06:51:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rhiannon.clari.net.au (dns1.clari.net.au [203.27.85.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA21736 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 06:51:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by rhiannon.clari.net.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA06649 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:51:04 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:51:04 +1000 (EST) From: Peter Hawkins Message-Id: <199709111351.XAA06649@rhiannon.clari.net.au> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: mfs root partition Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I am creating a diskless system with the root partition as an MFS partition. I do not seem able to get it to mount / even though it boots and gets as far as running rc (so it must be able to read vn0a up to the attempt to mount). my fstab entry is: /dev/vn0a / mfs rw 1 1 The directory structure itself is crunched and gzipped. the error message is "mfs not compiled in". I have compiled in newfs and used a link in the crunch config from that to mount_mfs and both are symbolically linked to the crunched file. What puzzles me is that it would appear it's attempting to exec "mfs" not "mount_mfs". Any help appreciated, Peter PS - please respond by email - I do not subscribe to hackers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 06:54:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA21898 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 06:54:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from seagull.rtd.com (dgy@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA21877 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 06:54:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA29545; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 06:43:26 -0700 (MST) From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199709111343.GAA29545@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: from Lee Crites at "Sep 10, 97 03:17:02 pm" To: leec@adam.adonai.net (Lee Crites) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 06:43:26 -0700 (MST) Cc: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In the words of the world-renowned author, Lee Crites: > On Tue, 9 Sep 1997, Luigi Rizzo wrote: > =>> Can someone give a code snippet of the BEST way of running a 1000HZ for > =>> loop under freebsd, without consuming massive amounts of cpu time. > => > =>one way I can think of is to build a kernel with HZ=1000 (or higher). > =>Make your process run at high priority, wake up at every tick (through > =>setitimer or usleep etc.) do its task and go back to sleep. > > I will start off with a wide-open disclaimer: I have not as of > yet ported *ANY* of my real-time code to fbsd. I have not as of > yet tried *ANY* real-time programming on my fbsd box. I can > barely say I have tinkered around with it. > > With that said, I am interested in this subject because I *WILL* > be porting my real-time code here and I *WILL* be doing some > hard-real-time development on my fbsd box. > > According to Stevens (et al), hard real-time programming (which > is what 1ms timing is) is not reliably possible on un*x. Having (sigh) Yet another misinformed "real-time" definition. Real time has nothing to do with the rate (i.e. frequency) of events nor the time required to determine a valid result. Rather, RT reflects the value function associated with the availability of the answer -- i.e. the timeliness of the answer is part of the *correctness* of the answer. In a HARD real-time (HRT) system, the value function abruptly goes to -infinity at the instant in time coinciding with the task's "deadline". In other words, having "an answer" at any time *after* the deadline is *worthless*. In a SOFT real-time system (SRT), the value function merely *decreases* at the task's deadline. In other words, the value of an "answer" diminishes the further in time you go beyond the deadline. Most actual applications are SRT -- though often (wrongly) implemented as HRT. > said that, I have a nice hard-real-time timer class I developed > which is being used as the basis for controlling sonar systems > that runs in the microseconds (with a +/- 130 microsecond > accuracy) on several platforms (next platform is, you guessed it, Yeah, and anyone who's had to implement a software UART at 9600 baud has done similar :> Again, speed isn't the important part. Nor is low latency. Decoding barcodes from raw video, on the other hand, is *quite* challenging! :> Consider the sio handler -- all it *really* has to guarantee is that the processor gets around to servicing an interrupt *before* the receive FIFO in the UART (which may only be two characters deep) overflows. So, a latency of almost a whole character time is acceptable. *But*, once that deadline is passed, the "value" of servicing the interrupt (for that particular character) drops to less than nothing -- the character is gone and can't be recovered. On the other hand, *processing* the received character can be done at a *very* leisurely rate (subject to the user's level of patience). And, in some cases, even the dropped characters can be accomodated (e.g., a PPP link vs. a direct shell) > fbsd). It is self tuning in that it takes into account it's own > overhead and readjusts future timings based on that. > > Anyway... > > The big question is what are you doing in the loop? > > I had a millisecond heart-beat timer which sent a timer interrupt > to my process (which seems to be what you are asking for). Keep > in mind that when the timer interrupt hits, all of your blocked > i/o gets triggered as well. This is probably what you want -- > otherwise you would have no need for the interrupt. And, of > course, you will have to check the return code (most likely -1) > and errno (EINTR or EAGAIN ?!?) with each blocked read -- > including sockets. The biggest problem in any non real-time OS is the fact that none of the OS's services have typically been designed with any degree of determinism in mind. Even if I'm the only active process, how long will I *have* to wait for an I/O operation to be completed? Will all malloc()s return a result in some specific time interval? What sort of overhead is associated with the interrupt system (i.e. the "service" that the OS provides to handle my IRQ's). Since you can't get hard and fast numbers on these services designing *any* sort of RT system is problematic. Now, if you just think you have a "fast application", then buy a faster processor, etc. But, even if your code is running on a rocket headed for mars (i.e. *years* available to compute certain functions), you need to be able to *quantify* the environment your code is going to be subjected to... All IMHO, of course. --don From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 07:13:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA22855 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 07:13:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cardamom.itojun.org (root@dhcp0.itojun.org [210.160.95.109]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA22843; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 07:13:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (itojun@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cardamom.itojun.org (8.8.5/3.3W3) with ESMTP id XAA02193; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:13:06 +0900 (JST) To: ports@freebsd.org cc: hackers@freebsd.org cc: itojun@csl.sony.co.jp Subject: standard place for mailing list files Dont-Reply-To: itojun@itojun.csl.sony.co.jp Dont-Return-Receipt-To: itojun@csl.sony.co.jp X-PGP-Fingerprint: F8 24 B4 2C 8C 98 57 FD 90 5F B4 60 79 54 16 E2 X-Mailer: comp (MHng project) version 1997/08/04 03:38:46, by Jun-ichiro Itoh MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Content-ID: Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:13:05 +0900 Message-ID: <2190.873987185@cardamom.itojun.org> From: Jun-ichiro Itoh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm making a port directory for "distribute", mail dispatcher for mailing list. Question: is there any standard place to put mailing list alias files? (files that are to be specified in :include:foobaa in /etc/aliases) I must set the path to there in compilation options for distribute, (there's no way to override at runtime) so I'd like to know what is the most common choice. itojun From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 07:14:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA22943 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 07:14:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bcarsde4.localhost (mailgate.nortel.ca [192.58.194.74]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA22911 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 07:13:57 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709111413.HAA22911@hub.freebsd.org> Received: from bcars520.ott.bnr.ca (actually 47.128.5.188) by bcarsde4.localhost; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:13:05 -0400 Received: from bnr.ca by bcars520.bnr.ca id <13953-0@bcars520.bnr.ca>; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:11:51 -0400 Date: 11 Sep 1997 10:08 EDT To: kdulzo@enteract.com Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Andrew Atrens" Subject: warning: Broken kernel options for 430TX motherboards Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk So then to summarize: when using a board with the 430TX chipset ( in my case an ASUS TX97 ) the following kernel options are broken: options AUTO_EOI_2 will cause lockup on restart ( during mounting/fscking of IDE disks ) options "CPU_FASTER_5X86_FPU" may cause keyboard lockups under xdm/X. Since the AUTO_EOI_* thing is a SHOWSTOPPER, it should be flagged for new users, or folks like me who are contemplating a new 430TX based motherboard. Perhaps it could be put in the `HARDWARE.TXT' file? Thanks to all who replied to my post ! Regards, Andrew. (opinions are mine, not Nortel's.) In message "resolved: Help! keyboard lockups - could be kernel bug ?", kdulzo@enteract.com writes: > The exact cause would be: > > #options AUTO_EOI_2 > This does not work on my 430TX board either... > Had the same problem and chugged through kernel options to figure it out. > > -Kevin > > In mpc.lists.freebsd.hackers, you wrote: > | > | So, I've solved my problem, but haven't completely bottomed out on the cause. > | Not only has the problem vanished, but the system is noticeably quicker. > | > | Here's what I did: > | > | Got the 090997 kernel sources and rebuilt a kernel *without* the following > | options: > | > cpu "I686_CPU" > | > options "CPU_FASTER_5X86_FPU" > | > | and with the following *changed* options: > | > | > options NSWAPDEV=1 > | > options MAXCONS=4 > | > controller wdc0 at isa? port "IO_WD1" bio irq 14 vector wdintr > | > controller wdc1 at isa? port "IO_WD2" bio irq 15 vector wdintr > | > | So it could be the newer kernel, or any of these other changes. I am > | a bit suspicious about the "CPU_FASTER_5X86_FPU", but who knows. > | I'm going to put back the AUTO_EOI's, re-add the flags to wdc0, and > | wdc1, and hope for the best. That'll probably be where my investigation > | ends unless someone tells me they're keen. ;) > | > | Cheers, > | > | Andrew. > | > | -- > | > | In message "Help! keyboard lockups - could be kernel bug ?", Andrew Atrens > | writes: > | > | > > | > Terry wrote: > | > > > | > > Somone else was reporting serial port lockups when they were hitting > | > > their IDE drive hard. > | > > | > How well supported is the 430TX chipset? As I mentioned, with my old > | > motherboard ( ASUS T2P4 w. 430HX chipset ) everything worked flawlessly. > | > I guess its always possible that I have a flaky motherboard, but I don't > | > understand why the symptoms show up under `xdm' and not `startx'. > | > > | > The other bogon I noted with this board ( as mentioned in my previous > | > post ) is that the AUTO_EOI_X kernel options were causing my system to > | > freeze on boot up. The IDE disks would probe correctly, but lock up during > | > fsck'ing ( disk access leds stuck on ). Removing these options from the > | > kernel solved the problem. > | > > | > Perhaps an appropriate kernel option change could fix my keyboard problem? > | > > | > > | > Andrew. > | > > | > -- > | > > | > machine "i386" > | > cpu "I586_CPU" > | > cpu "I686_CPU" > | > ident CHURCHILL > | > maxusers 20 > | > > | > options INET #InterNETworking > | > options FFS #Berkeley Fast Filesystem > | > options NFS #Network Filesystem > | > options MFS #Memory File System > | > options MSDOSFS #MSDOS Filesystem > | > options "CD9660" #ISO 9660 Filesystem > | > options PROCFS #Process filesystem > | > options "COMPAT_43" #Compatible with BSD 4.3 [KEEP THIS!] > | > options UCONSOLE #Allow users to grab the console > | > options USERCONFIG #boot -c editor > | > options VISUAL_USERCONFIG #visual boot -c editor > | > options MROUTING # Multicast routing > | > options SYSVSHM > | > options SYSVSEM > | > options SYSVMSG > | > options NSWAPDEV=2 > | > options "CPU_FASTER_5X86_FPU" > | > options USER_LDT > | > options "MD5" > | > options PERFMON > | > > | > config kernel root on wd0 > | > > | > controller isa0 > | > controller pci0 > | > > | > controller fdc0 at isa? port "IO_FD1" bio irq 6 drq 2 vector fdintr > | > disk fd0 at fdc0 drive 0 > | > > | > controller wdc0 at isa? port "IO_WD1" bio irq 14 flags 0x80ff80ff vector wdintr > | > disk wd0 at wdc0 drive 0 > | > > | > controller wdc1 at isa? port "IO_WD2" bio irq 15 flags 0x80ff80ff vector wdintr > | > > | > device wcd0 #IDE CD-ROM > | > options ATAPI #Enable ATAPI support for IDE bus > | > options ATAPI_STATIC #Don't do it as an LKM > | > > | > device sc0 at isa? port "IO_KBD" tty irq 1 vector scintr > | > options MAXCONS=3 # number of virtual consoles > | > > | > device npx0 at isa? port "IO_NPX" iosiz 0x0 flags 0x0 irq 13 vector npxintr > | > device sio0 at isa? port "IO_COM1" tty irq 4 vector siointr > | > device sio1 at isa? port "IO_COM2" tty irq 3 vector siointr > | > device lpt0 at isa? port? tty irq 7 vector lptintr > | > device ed0 at isa? port 0x280 net irq 10 iomem 0xd8000 vector edintr > | > > | > pseudo-device loop > | > pseudo-device ether > | > pseudo-device log > | > pseudo-device sl 2 > | > pseudo-device ppp 2 > | > pseudo-device sppp #Generic Synchronous PPP > | > pseudo-device bpfilter 4 #Berkeley packet filter > | > pseudo-device tun 2 > | > pseudo-device pty 128 > | > pseudo-device gzip # Exec gzipped a.out's > | > pseudo-device speaker #Play IBM BASIC-style noises out your speaker > | > pseudo-device vn #Vnode driver (turns a file into a device) > | > pseudo-device ccd 4 #Concatenated disk driver > | > > | > #options "AUTO_EOI_1" > | > #options "AUTO_EOI_2" > | > > | > controller snd0 > | > device sb0 at isa? port 0x220 irq 5 drq 1 vector sbintr > | > device sbxvi0 at isa? drq 5 > | > device sbmidi0 at isa? port 0x330 > | > > | > > > > -- > +==-- > | Kevin M. Dulzo Check us out! | > |Jr. System Administrator http://www.enteract.com | > | Enteract, L.L.C. mailto: info@enteract.com| > | kdulzo@enteract.com (773)248-8511 | > --==+ > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 08:26:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA27724 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 08:26:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fang.cs.sunyit.edu (chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu [192.52.220.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA27716 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 08:26:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from chuck@localhost) by fang.cs.sunyit.edu (8.8.5/8.7.3) id PAA05968 for hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 15:26:58 GMT Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 15:26:58 GMT From: Charles Green Message-Id: <199709111526.PAA05968@fang.cs.sunyit.edu> X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Devices list Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have a quick question, how do I get a list of devices currently probed by the kernel, a list of the device drivers, and their /dev names? -- Charles Green, PRC Inc. Rome Laboratory, NY From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 09:47:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA02610 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 09:47:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA02494 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 09:44:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id RAA00618; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:24:55 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199709111524.RAA00618@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: PnP support To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:24:55 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: mike@smith.net.au, gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu, perhaps@yes.no, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199709110727.RAA07246@word.smith.net.au> from "Mike Smith" at Sep 11, 97 05:27:28 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Let me edit this slightly... > The most succinct extract I have on the "new" model reads : > > ---8<---snip---8<--- > > - gather all the information : > PCI probe i.e. trust what the PCI bios says ? > PnP probe > get ISA config (compiled in, datafile, etc.) this means probe the isa devices and trust what the config info say. At this point we have already effectively allocated 'extents' for legacy ISA devices. > get PCI/PnP identifier tables (compiled in, bootloader, etc.) this looks like a second-level probe for these devices: those not recognised by PCI/PnP drivers will be used as ISA ones ? Wouldn't it make more sense to merge this step with the PCI and PnP probe, so that devices recognized as PCI/PnP can be left with some degree of freedom in reallocating resources, whereas others get fixed resources ? Also, while we are on the subject: some legacy ISA device also have software-configurable resources such as DMA or IRQ channels. methods are device-specific (pre-PnP). In other words, in this first 'probe' phase we end up with some resources which are bound to a given value, and other which might be assigned from a set of alternatives. ALLOCATE: Before going on with the attach, we have to take a decision among the available options and then just go on with the attach routines, marking those devices which could not be allocated the requested resources ? > > - attach PCI devices > I/O ports and IRQs are assigned by the PCI rules. > - attach PnP devices > IRQs are taken from the free pool left after PCI assignment and > those marked for 'legacy' use. I/O ports are probed as per the > PnP spec. > - walk ISA config data, probe possible devices > We know which IRQ and I/O resources are still available, > we can hunt for devices that match the gaps. here if some attach fails we can free the resources which have been allocated for them, and possibly go back to ALLOCATE: if any device was left out ? > I think it's important to leave the 'legacy' devices until _last_, as > this prevents a PnP device being accidentally recognised as a 'legacy' > device. Right. Comments ? Cheers Luigi -----------------------------+-------------------------------------- Luigi Rizzo | Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it | Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 | via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 | http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ _____________________________|______________________________________ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 09:57:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA03181 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 09:57:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from adam.adonai.net (adam.adonai.net [207.8.83.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA03176 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 09:57:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (leec@localhost) by adam.adonai.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA23355; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:54:57 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:54:56 -0500 (CDT) From: "Lee Crites (AEI)" To: Don Yuniskis cc: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: <199709111343.GAA29545@seagull.rtd.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Don Yuniskis wrote: =>In the words of the world-renowned author, Lee Crites: =>> On Tue, 9 Sep 1997, Luigi Rizzo wrote: =>> =>> Can someone give a code snippet of the BEST way of running a 1000HZ for =>> =>> loop under freebsd, without consuming massive amounts of cpu time. =>> => =>> =>one way I can think of is to build a kernel with HZ=1000 (or higher). =>> =>Make your process run at high priority, wake up at every tick (through =>> =>setitimer or usleep etc.) do its task and go back to sleep. =>> =>> I will start off with a wide-open disclaimer: I have not as of =>> yet ported *ANY* of my real-time code to fbsd. I have not as of =>> yet tried *ANY* real-time programming on my fbsd box. I can =>> barely say I have tinkered around with it. =>> =>> With that said, I am interested in this subject because I *WILL* =>> be porting my real-time code here and I *WILL* be doing some =>> hard-real-time development on my fbsd box. =>> =>> According to Stevens (et al), hard real-time programming (which =>> is what 1ms timing is) is not reliably possible on un*x. Having => =>(sigh) Yet another misinformed "real-time" definition. Real time =>has nothing to do with the rate (i.e. frequency) of events nor =>the time required to determine a valid result. Rather, RT =>reflects the value function associated with the availability of =>the answer -- i.e. the timeliness of the answer is part of the =>*correctness* of the answer. While you are correct -- that hard-real-time programming involves the timliness of the answer, you are incorrect that this is a 'misinformed' definition. You cannot design a hard-real-time system with timings that exceed certain limits. There is a difference between the term 'hard-real-time' and the term 'timing'. And, generally speaking, hard-real-time systems require timing which has a granularity of better than 1ms, thus the common statement which I made above. While I was somewhat guilty of mixing metaphores, so to speak, the two issues are different. =>Most actual applications are SRT -- though often (wrongly) implemented =>as HRT. This is certainly correct. =>The biggest problem in any non real-time OS is the fact that none of the =>OS's services have typically been designed with any degree of =>determinism in mind. Even if I'm the only active process, how long =>will I *have* to wait for an I/O operation to be completed? Will =>all malloc()s return a result in some specific time interval? =>What sort of overhead is associated with the interrupt system =>(i.e. the "service" that the OS provides to handle my IRQ's). These issues are true of many os's, even some of the rtos's. The thing is being able to adequately account for the overhead, and any changes to it (the overhead) if/when it occurs. So, I'll step back and say it another way... In my career as a systems programmer, I have developed many real-time systems, some soft and some hard. My last system was a hard-real-time system which controlled a state of the art sonar system (I would assume most people would agree that processing the sound waves from a set of microphones as hard-real-time -- once the sound is gone, it's gone). In doing these real-time applications, I have developed some timing classes which have been able to keep me on-track. They are, or attempt to be, anyway, accurate to a degree where 1ms accuracy (the original request) was very possible. I have not ported them to my fbsd system as of yet. Right now they run (read: have been used on) on aix, sun, hp, ultrix, and osf. If/when I get it running on my fbsd system (which is going to be soon, since I am using them in an upcoming book), I can make them available on my web site. Until then, if you have questions on how it is working, I'll be more than happy to answer them. Also, having said this much, I assume the individuals who know about the latency issues and deterministic nature of the os internals are reading these messages (probably with some mild humor), and can answer questions on the suitability of fbsd to real-time programming. That being the case, I would hope they would make themselves known. =>All IMHO, of course. Ditto... Lee From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 10:06:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA03657 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:06:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA03651; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:05:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.8.5/8.6.9) id TAA13983; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:09:53 +0200 (SAT) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 13981; Thu Sep 11 19:09:49 1997 by gram.cdsec.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA18957; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:44:23 +0200 (SAT) From: Graham Wheeler Message-Id: <199709111644.SAA18957@cdsec.com> Subject: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:44:22 +0200 (SAT) Cc: gram@gram.cdsec.com (Graham Wheeler) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25-h4.1] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi all We have recently ported our Citadel firewall software from FreeBSD 2.1.0 to FreeBSD 2.2.2. Some of our sites, particularly those whose firewall machines have only 16Mb of RAM, are now experiencing problems. We have a application-level gateway program which is occasionally freezing up, in what seems to be a busy loop (if we run `top' the gateway process is the most CPU-intensive, chewing up CPU cycles as fast as it can). We have collected several core dumps from the gateway program when this happens. In each case, while the location in our own code varies, the stack trace always ends in a call to getservbyname() or getservbyport(). These in turn are calling either malloc() or free(), which in turn seem to be calling fstat() (at least according to the stack backtrace). top also reports that the virtual memory is exhausted. We have other sites that have been running the gateway code on FreeBSD 2.1.0 for several months without a restart or reboot; the FreeBSD 2.2.2 hosts are freezing up every few hours. Is anyone aware of a problem with the implementation of the /etc/services lookup routines in FreeBSD 2.2.2? I will go through the library source code myself tomorrow, and compre it with FreeBSD 2.1.0, but I am hoping that this problem is already known, and hopefully that a fix is available. Thanks in advance Graham -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)23-6065/6/7 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Mobile: +27(83)-253-9864 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 10:18:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA04232 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:18:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr07.primenet.com (tlambert@usr07.primenet.com [206.165.6.207]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA04226 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:18:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr07.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA20383; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:17:09 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709111717.KAA20383@usr07.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? To: dufault@hda.com (Peter Dufault) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:17:08 +0000 (GMT) Cc: leec@adam.adonai.net, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709110933.FAA23225@hda.hda.com> from "Peter Dufault" at Sep 11, 97 05:33:38 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > According to Stevens (et al), hard real-time programming (which > > is what 1ms timing is) is not reliably possible on un*x... Don Yuniskis covered this in great, gory, and (IMO) accurate detail, so I won't comment on the original post directly. But Peter is right, I am sneaking up. > There are many issues in > the fbsd kernel - it isn't reentrant, it isn't interruptible, > interrupts are turned off in places, etc. These speak more to QOS (Quality Of Service) than to implementability, actually. The longest possible latency path to a required functional deadline determines the response claims you can make for HRT, IMO, and has little bearing on hardness beyond that. The real FreeBSD problems are scheduling order, followed by priority inversion issues arising from non-exclusive commision of resources, once the scheduler issues are worked out. > The "easy" way to add demonstrably correct hard real time to unix > is to time multiplex the CPU. Degrade the CPU by a duty cycle, > and dedicate the part you've stolen to running something completely > orthogonal to the unix kernel. You've created a second virtual > CPU where you can do hard real time. This addresses, crudely, the scheduling issue, but leaves the inversion issue outstanding. To truly do this the "easy" way requires commision of all necessary resources: disk, controller DMA time, etc.. Not a trivial task, needing as it does driver level modifications to allow, for example, cancellation of all outstanding tagged commands to service the RT needs exclusively. Unless you dedicate controller resources to RT, as well. Then there's the bus resources... > Your interrupt latency suffers > in the normal world. You preempt the kernel, so you have to worry > about any hidden real time requirements (typically associated with > devices) in the normal kernel. There are obvious problems when > interrupts are turned off in the normal kernel, etc. It is doable. > Oh oh, I hear Terry sneaking up on me... Two things would help immediately, without needing to go to this extreme. I think the "easy" way described is actually harder in some ways than it would need to be. If you had (1) kernel preemption, and (2) a reschedulable interval based one-shot timer, you would have the basis of a hard timing constraint for when you could begin some act. That leaves issues of priority inversion of shared resources, but that handleable through (a) lending, and (b) resource preeemption. The other issues are merely "hardness guarantee issues"... ie:, they indicate how tight a deadline the sysem can conform to, not whether or not the system can conform to any hard deadline at all. Note that even if you are significantly over the quantum in start scheduling leeway, the current system is incapable of guaranteeing to meet a deadline. Anyway, this type of discussion is why there's a FreeBSD RealTime list. Maintained by Peter, of course. 8-). Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 10:21:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA04415 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:21:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from seagull.rtd.com (dgy@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA04410 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:21:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA12948; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:13:51 -0700 (MST) From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199709111713.KAA12948@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: from Lee Crites at "Sep 11, 97 11:54:56 am" To: leec@adam.adonai.net (Lee Crites) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:13:51 -0700 (MST) Cc: dgy@rtd.com, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In the words of the world-renowned author, Lee Crites: > On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Don Yuniskis wrote: > > =>In the words of the world-renowned author, Lee Crites: > =>> On Tue, 9 Sep 1997, Luigi Rizzo wrote: > =>> =>> Can someone give a code snippet of the BEST way of running a 1000HZ for > =>> =>> loop under freebsd, without consuming massive amounts of cpu time. > =>> => > =>> =>one way I can think of is to build a kernel with HZ=1000 (or higher). > =>> =>Make your process run at high priority, wake up at every tick (through > =>> =>setitimer or usleep etc.) do its task and go back to sleep. > =>> > =>> I will start off with a wide-open disclaimer: I have not as of > =>> yet ported *ANY* of my real-time code to fbsd. I have not as of > =>> yet tried *ANY* real-time programming on my fbsd box. I can > =>> barely say I have tinkered around with it. > =>> > =>> With that said, I am interested in this subject because I *WILL* > =>> be porting my real-time code here and I *WILL* be doing some > =>> hard-real-time development on my fbsd box. > =>> > =>> According to Stevens (et al), hard real-time programming (which > =>> is what 1ms timing is) is not reliably possible on un*x. Having > => > =>(sigh) Yet another misinformed "real-time" definition. Real time > =>has nothing to do with the rate (i.e. frequency) of events nor > =>the time required to determine a valid result. Rather, RT > =>reflects the value function associated with the availability of > =>the answer -- i.e. the timeliness of the answer is part of the > =>*correctness* of the answer. > > While you are correct -- that hard-real-time programming involves No... *any* real-time programming involves time in the "correctness" of the answer. The difference between HRT and SRT lies solely in the shape of the value function at the t=deadline. > the timliness of the answer, you are incorrect that this is a > 'misinformed' definition. You cannot design a hard-real-time > system with timings that exceed certain limits. There is a > difference between the term 'hard-real-time' and the term > 'timing'. Nonsense! The magnitude of the times involved is totally irrelevant to whether a system is RT or not! An application running at 10KHz can be *non* realtime while one running at 0.000000000001Hz *can* be realtime! (for example: a spacecraft on it's way out of the solar system with a "deadline" years in the future!) > And, generally speaking, hard-real-time systems require timing > which has a granularity of better than 1ms, thus the common > statement which I made above. While I was somewhat guilty of > mixing metaphores, so to speak, the two issues are different. No! This is the *biggest* fallacy in the real-time issue! The actual times involved are not important to the definition. I can design a bar-code reader that has to react to events at 10Khz on a 2MHz processor and, in *one* application, this is HRT while in another it might be SRT or not even real-time, at all. Likewise, running a digital filter on a data stream at 100KHz, etc. It's not the fact that it's "1mS" or "10uS" that makes something "real-time" (that's how folks always confuse "real-fast" with "real-time") but, rather, the *consequences* of the timeliness of the algorithm. > =>The biggest problem in any non real-time OS is the fact that none of the > =>OS's services have typically been designed with any degree of > =>determinism in mind. Even if I'm the only active process, how long > =>will I *have* to wait for an I/O operation to be completed? Will > =>all malloc()s return a result in some specific time interval? > =>What sort of overhead is associated with the interrupt system > =>(i.e. the "service" that the OS provides to handle my IRQ's). > > These issues are true of many os's, even some of the rtos's. The Yes. I contend that most RTOS's are simply lean MTOS's with fast context switches and *not* truly deterministic. > thing is being able to adequately account for the overhead, and > any changes to it (the overhead) if/when it occurs. > > So, I'll step back and say it another way... > > In my career as a systems programmer, I have developed many > real-time systems, some soft and some hard. My last system was a > hard-real-time system which controlled a state of the art sonar > system (I would assume most people would agree that processing > the sound waves from a set of microphones as hard-real-time -- > once the sound is gone, it's gone). Yes, but one could simply *capture* the echos and process them at your leisure in a *non* real-time environment (subject, of course, to the needs of the "analyst"). I had to do this with radar echoes in the mid 70's. On the other hand, I have a current application that controls 75 discrete processes at 100Hz (the *entire* process being controlled lasts 10ms and 75 of them are running concurrently. You *can't* deal with the data after the fact, etc.) I tried to raise this issue to (hopefully) get the original querant to rethink whether "real fast" was the issue or "real time"... --don From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 10:35:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA05238 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:35:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr07.primenet.com (tlambert@usr07.primenet.com [206.165.6.207]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA05217 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:35:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr07.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA22407; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:33:58 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709111733.KAA22407@usr07.primenet.com> Subject: Re: PnP support To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:33:58 +0000 (GMT) Cc: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, mike@smith.net.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709111002.UAA00256@word.smith.net.au> from "Mike Smith" at Sep 11, 97 08:02:36 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > This is why I exhorted you to look at the extent manager in NetBSD. It > allows you to define "extents" which are just arbitrary ranges of > "something". I would visualise this being used as follows : > > - the ISA startup code says "yup, this machine has an ISA bus", and > creates an extent called "isa_io" and another called "isa_mem" > - the ESCD or ISA startup code would create an extent called "isa_irq" > and another called "isa_drq" indicating the resources available > to the ISA bus. Heh. This is grossly comparable in architecture to the hierarchical lock manager I want to use to address SMP concurrency issues. In it, an extent is a list of nosed from the root to the target, and is established by establishing an intention mode. > I don't think that making these extents "private" would be at all > helpful. Having them public, and referenced by name, will make it > easier to access them. I agree, but for a different reason: there is one global space (per bridged ISA bus, anyway) for the ports, IRQ's, and memory regions consumed by the devices. Effectively, there is a hierarchy: io+mem+irq \ \ ISA bus allocations \ \ PCI bus allocation / \ / \ PCMCIA allocation PnP ISA allocation Etc.. Resource competition is not just associative, it's commutative as well. To be able to handle device arrivals and departures, one has to be willing to move around existing hardware when a device with one set of constraints is replaced by a device with a different set of constraints. For example, if I have: dev1 IRQ 2 or IRQ 5 dev2 IRQ 2 dev3 IRQ 5 And my initial configuration is "dev1+dev2" and I change it to "dev1+dev3", then I need to relocate "dev1" for maximal function. One could easily imagine this, in fact, with a loaded machine configuration on a laptop, and replacing a modem with a network card. Or unplugging a PCMCIA cellular modem, follwed by docking the computer with a dock with an ISA network card. Etc. > I played a lot with the NetBSD extent allocator a while back. Jason > didn't entirely like what I was doing (and TBH some of my ideas were > pretty warped), but I would be happy to start over and just add the > important bits (extent names & owners, public extents). I could > probably have this ready in a few days. Way, way cool! Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 10:37:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA05434 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:37:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from athena.milk.it (ssigala@line16.globalnet.it [195.206.2.45]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA05422 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:37:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (ssigala@localhost) by athena.milk.it (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id TAA02668 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:37:00 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: athena.milk.it: ssigala owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:37:00 +0200 (MET DST) From: "S. Sigala" X-Sender: ssigala@athena.milk.it Reply-To: "S. Sigala" To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, around two month ago i have announced the latest alpha of my Emacs-clone text editor "Zile". I have just released the latest alpha of this program, and is available at ftp://ftp.vix.com/guests/ssigala/pub/zile/zile-1.0a4.tar.gz >From the previous version i have done a major rewrite and now the editor is _very_ Emacs like, while small. I have fixed a lot of bugs and added some important features, like: * Multi window; * Minibuf completion & filename completion; * Mini help window (as suggested by Jordan). The idea is to replace the "standard" FreeBSD editor "ee" with this one (if FBSD core like it). Feedback or ideas are highly appreciated :-) -sandro From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 10:41:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA05621 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:41:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr07.primenet.com (tlambert@usr07.primenet.com [206.165.6.207]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA05615 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:41:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr07.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA22666; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:39:34 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709111739.KAA22666@usr07.primenet.com> Subject: Re: PnP support To: thorpej@nas.nasa.gov Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:39:34 +0000 (GMT) Cc: mike@smith.net.au, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709111109.EAA19340@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> from "Jason Thorpe" at Sep 11, 97 04:09:49 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > For those wondering why it's problematic, you should take a look at > an AlphaServer 8400 sometime - it can have multiple primary PCI busses, > each with its own physical address space, and each of these primary > PCI busses can host an EISA/ISA bus. NetBSD runs on this system, but > it wouldn't have been possible if we hadn't paid careful attention to > getting bus space accounting right. Yes. Back when the FreeBSD PCI code was just reaching it's first revision of maturity, thanks to Stefan, Jeffrey Hsu and I both had loaner Alpha machines. The discussion between us and CGD of NetBSD about ISA busses bridged off of PCI busses on Alpha instead of vice versa was a big cognitive leap for people not used to the idea of "it has ISA and PCI busses, but the ISA bus is bridged off the PCI, not vice versa". The idea of the PCI being inferiorly linked off the ISA was just too well ingrained in the Intel mindset. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 10:53:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA06226 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:53:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmb@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA06182; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:52:02 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Message-Id: <199709111752.KAA06182@hub.freebsd.org> Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? To: tlambert@primenet.com (Terry Lambert) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:52:01 -0700 (PDT) Cc: dufault@hda.com, leec@adam.adonai.net, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199709111717.KAA20383@usr07.primenet.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Sep 11, 97 05:17:08 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert wrote: > Anyway, this type of discussion is why there's a FreeBSD RealTime > list. Maintained by Peter, of course. 8-). harump! peter is seems is the new postmaster ;) subscribe freebsd-realtime here is the info for the list FREEBSD-REALTIME Realtime extensions per POSIX 1003.4 This is the mailing list for people working realtime extenstions to FreeBSD. jmb ps. terry, domino's pizza wants to know where to deliver the humble pie. ;> From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 11:03:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA06615 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:03:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from toth.ferginc.com (toth.ferginc.com [205.139.23.69]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA06610 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:02:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost by toth.ferginc.com (You/Wish) with SMTP id OAA22666 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:02:21 -0400 (EDT) Posted-Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:02:21 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:02:20 -0400 (EDT) From: Branson Matheson X-Sender: branson@toth.hq.ferg.com Reply-To: Branson Matheson To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, S. Sigala wrote: > Hi, around two month ago i have announced the latest alpha > of my Emacs-clone text editor "Zile". ... > > The idea is to replace the "standard" FreeBSD editor "ee" with this > one (if FBSD core like it). Hmmm... I for one would not want it to be the standard editor. Vi is and always has been the standard editor for unix. I think it should stay that way. One of the first two commands on any new boxen that I create is: rm /usr/bin/ee ; ln -s /usr/bin/vi /usr/bin/ee Lets keep the unix editor the standard unix editor, vi... or at least offer a choice ,I think there is/was somthing like that in the /stand/sysconfig when configuring. At least for vipw. - branson ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Branson Matheson " If you are falling off of a mountain, System Administrator You may as well try to fly." Ferguson Enterprises - Delenn, Mimbari Ambassador ( $statements = ) !~ /Corporate Opinion/; From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 11:06:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA06846 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:06:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from adam.adonai.net (adam.adonai.net [207.8.83.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA06838 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:06:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (leec@localhost) by adam.adonai.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA24030; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 13:04:59 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 13:04:58 -0500 (CDT) From: "Lee Crites (AEI)" To: Don Yuniskis cc: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: <199709111713.KAA12948@seagull.rtd.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Don Yuniskis wrote: =>In the words of the world-renowned author, Lee Crites: =>> While you are correct -- that hard-real-time programming involves => =>No... *any* real-time programming involves time in the "correctness" =>of the answer. The difference between HRT and SRT lies solely in the =>shape of the value function at the t=deadline. => =>> the timeliness of the answer, you are incorrect that this is a =>> 'misinformed' definition. You cannot design a hard-real-time =>> system with timings that exceed certain limits. There is a =>> difference between the term 'hard-real-time' and the term =>> 'timing'. => =>Nonsense! The magnitude of the times involved is totally =>irrelevant to whether a system is RT or not! An application Calm down, Don. Take a few long breaths and clear your mind for a moment. We are saying the same thing. Re-read what I said above: "There is a difference between 'hard-real-time' and the term 'timing'." =>running at 10KHz can be *non* realtime while one running at =>0.000000000001Hz *can* be realtime! (for example: a =>spacecraft on it's way out of the solar system with a "deadline" =>years in the future!) You keep confusing my statement and talking about timing. I don't care if you have 5 billionths of a second or five billion seconds to come up with the answer. I differentiated the two above. =>> And, generally speaking, hard-real-time systems require timing =>> which has a granularity of better than 1ms, thus the common =>> statement which I made above. While I was somewhat guilty of =>> mixing metaphores, so to speak, the two issues are different. => =>No! This is the *biggest* fallacy in the real-time issue! The =>actual times involved are not important to the definition. I They might not be important to the definition, but they are *everything* in the process. If your timings are wrong, your real-time system falls apart. While the definition of real-time might not include any kind of delineation concerning time periods, the actuality of developing a real-time system is chock full of actual -- and real -- timing issues. You can't ignore that. And hyperventalating over the timing issue doesn't lend credit to your statements. The original request was for some code which could handle 1/1,000th of a second timings. I didn't care if he was working on a real-time or real-fast system. I only brought up the hard-real-time issue as an explaination of what my timing class was currently working in, and that it was performing in an environment needing 1/1,000,000th of a second accuracy. Lee From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 11:16:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA07422 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:16:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr07.primenet.com (tlambert@usr07.primenet.com [206.165.6.207]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA07414 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:16:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr07.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA24444; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:15:32 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709111815.LAA24444@usr07.primenet.com> Subject: Re: PnP support To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:15:32 +0000 (GMT) Cc: mike@smith.net.au, gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu, perhaps@yes.no, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709111524.RAA00618@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Sep 11, 97 05:24:55 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Also, while we are on the subject: some legacy ISA device also have > software-configurable resources such as DMA or IRQ channels. methods > are device-specific (pre-PnP). This is a hard problem. The reason that this is a hard problem is that dynamic reconfiguration of dynamically-reconfigurable-but-not-PnP hardware makes it difficult for FreeBSD to coexist with other OS's, which would not know about these devices ability to move around. I would still like to see a device level driver entrypoint for configuration control for these devices (especially, I'd like to see one accessible by ioctl() for WD ethernet cards!), but I'm not willing for this t be converted into something that will relocate cards that another OS will be unable to relocate back. Another issue is that the static state for allowable configurations must be kept in the device driver, and it makes the device drivers just that much less general. For example, the soft configuration of most NE2000 clone cards varies from vendor to vendor. That's a lot of data. The one exception to allowing auto relocation *might* be for the case of an otherwise unresolvable hardware conflict. Even then, I hesistate to agree that the OS prompting the user with a stern warning before the change is sufficient: just because the hardware will accept a given configuration doesn't mean another OS's drivers will be able to accept the configuration. Going back to the NE2k clone example, many NE2k clones allowed IRQ ranges out of range of various OS's NE2k drivers: FreeBSD was one such OS in the not too distant past! I would definitely caution against this. If people want to be *certain* beyond a shadow of a doubt that their hardware will work with FreeBSD, without damaging the ability of the hardware to work with another OS without reconfiguration, then they should avoid ISA cards entirely. FreeBSD should do what it can, within the "do no harm" constraints above... but should not go beyond. > ALLOCATE: > Before going on with the attach, we have to take a decision among > the available options and then just go on with the attach routines, > marking those devices which could not be allocated the requested > resources ? This is also frustrating. From the above, an ISA sound card and an ISA network card, one of which is sof reconfigurable and neither which are PnP, or a serial port COM1 and a modem COM3, both of which want IRQ 4, and one of which is soft reconfigurable and neither are PnP, are both examples. The simple answer is that you can't move these, even though they conflict, without potentially damaging the configuration of another OS. For example, with the COM ports, if 1 and 3 are never used simultaneously, many OS's can cope with the conflict by never enabling interrupts on both simultaneously. Or by polling. So while the configuration is not optimal, neither is it entirely unusable. > here if some attach fails we can free the resources which have been > allocated for them, and possibly go back to ALLOCATE: if any device was > left out ? Only if the failing device can be disabused of the resources it's known to use. This will only work for PnP devices, where the card may be disabled, and then only in the case that the OS provides PnP BIOS type services to do the port diddling necessary to shut the device down. Otherwise, the failing device must be assumed to be activated. Note that a PnP BIOS for a particular board may have ISA devices defined as if they were PnP devices, in order to consider them in the PnP conflict resolution phase. Though these devices appear to be PnP devices, and therefore you might believe that you could disable them if you didn't have a suitable driver, and reclaim their resources, you CANNOT. They will not obey the disable requests. Thus PnP BIOS alone is not enough; an OS must provide its own PnP BIOS type services to be able to distinguish these devices. > > I think it's important to leave the 'legacy' devices until _last_, as > > this prevents a PnP device being accidentally recognised as a 'legacy' > > device. > > Right. > > Comments ? You probe up the hierarchy, and attach down. Pretty simple. Note: You are screwed in this case if you do not have a PnP BIOS that knows about legacy hardware for which the OS has no drivers; to be able to deal with this issue, you need a "BIOS config" in your PnP OS. Even if you have a PnP BIOS, you still need this: Windows 95 universally fails to identify IRQ 12 as being used by the Bus mouse in some Acer machines, and reallocates it. The OS must compensate. Windows 95 "compensates" by requiring you to lock down all PnP devies in the device configuration in the Properties page for "My Computer". FreeBSD can, and should, do better. Maybe a PnP legacy device configuration in "boot: -c/visual". I *highly* recommend that anyone coding on this obtain a recent copy of the PnP specification, and consider these issues in their design. As was pointed out by someone else, if you don't, it will have to be rewritten later, and the new code, if marginally more functional, will act as a speed-bump, impeding geting it right. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 11:17:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA07467 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:17:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr07.primenet.com (tlambert@usr07.primenet.com [206.165.6.207]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA07462 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:17:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr07.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA24509; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:17:09 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709111817.LAA24509@usr07.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Devices list To: chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu (Charles Green) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:17:08 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709111526.PAA05968@fang.cs.sunyit.edu> from "Charles Green" at Sep 11, 97 03:26:58 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I have a quick question, how do I get a list of devices currently > probed by the kernel, dmesg > a list of the device drivers, dmesg > and their /dev names? You don't. This is an issue DEVFS is intended to address. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 11:24:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA07807 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:24:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from verdi.nethelp.no (verdi.nethelp.no [195.1.171.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA07793 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:24:46 -0700 (PDT) From: sthaug@nethelp.no Received: (qmail 1287 invoked by uid 1001); 11 Sep 1997 18:24:38 +0000 (GMT) To: branson.matheson@ferginc.com Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:02:20 -0400 (EDT)" References: X-Mailer: Mew version 1.05+ on Emacs 19.28.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:24:38 +0200 Message-ID: <1285.874002278@verdi.nethelp.no> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Hmmm... I for one would not want it to be the standard editor. Vi is > and always has been the standard editor for unix. I think it should > stay that way. One of the first two commands on any new boxen that I > create is: > > rm /usr/bin/ee ; ln -s /usr/bin/vi /usr/bin/ee Similarly, one of the first things I do with a new release of FreeBSD is to remove setenv EDITOR /usr/bin/ee from ~root/.cshrc Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 11:24:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA07818 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:24:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr07.primenet.com (tlambert@usr07.primenet.com [206.165.6.207]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA07800; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:24:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr07.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA24760; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:24:51 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709111824.LAA24760@usr07.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? To: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG (Jonathan M. Bresler) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:24:50 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, dufault@hda.com, leec@adam.adonai.net, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709111752.KAA06182@hub.freebsd.org> from "Jonathan M. Bresler" at Sep 11, 97 10:52:01 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Anyway, this type of discussion is why there's a FreeBSD RealTime > > list. Maintained by Peter, of course. 8-). > > harump! peter is seems is the new postmaster ;) > > subscribe freebsd-realtime > > here is the info for the list > FREEBSD-REALTIME Realtime extensions per POSIX 1003.4 > This is the mailing list for people working realtime extenstions to FreeBSD. > > jmb > > ps. terry, domino's pizza wants to know where to deliver the humble pie. ;> AUUUUUGGGGHHHHHH! When I first subscribed to the thing, it wasn't hosted by freebsd.org! No fair! You moved the thing! Collusion! Collusion! Call Agent Mulder! Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 11:33:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA08443 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:33:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.FreeBSD.ORG [204.216.27.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA08433; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:33:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer Received: (from julian@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.6/8.8.5) id LAA15114; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:30:47 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:30:47 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709111830.LAA15114@freefall.freebsd.org> To: current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Doug Rabson. Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I haven't heard from Doug since June 3. Has anyone any information as to what happenned to him? If not, maybe one of our UK members might like to go to: Doug Rabson (NLSYSTEMS-DOM) 33 The Chase Edgware, Middlesex, HA8 5DW UK and try find out what happenned? From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 11:34:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA08548 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:34:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gamespot.com (ns2.gamespot.com [206.169.18.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA08535 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:34:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tiramisu.gamespot.com (tiramisu.gamespot.com [206.169.18.119]) by gamespot.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA11590 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:33:42 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970911113550.012be2b0@mail.gamespot.com> X-Sender: ian@mail.gamespot.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:35:50 -0700 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: Ian Kallen Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 07:37 PM 9/11/97 +0200, S. Sigala wrote: >The idea is to replace the "standard" FreeBSD editor "ee" with this >one (if FBSD core like it). Better is to have sysinstall ask what editor you want, first thing for me (after setting a password :) is to make sure I'm alway's "cd ; echo 'setenv EDITOR vi' >> .cshrc ; source .cshrc" It'd be nice if sysinstall asked but this'll do :) -- Ian Kallen ian@gamespot.com Director of Technology and Web Administration SpotMedia Communications http://www.gamespot.com/ http://www.videogamespot.com/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 12:10:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA10729 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 12:10:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from seagull.rtd.com (dgy@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA10722 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 12:10:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA20883; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 12:08:54 -0700 (MST) From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199709111908.MAA20883@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: from Lee Crites at "Sep 11, 97 01:04:58 pm" To: leec@adam.adonai.net (Lee Crites) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 12:08:54 -0700 (MST) Cc: dgy@rtd.com, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In the words of the world-renowned author, Lee Crites: > > On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Don Yuniskis wrote: > =>In the words of the world-renowned author, Lee Crites: > =>> While you are correct -- that hard-real-time programming involves > => > =>No... *any* real-time programming involves time in the "correctness" > =>of the answer. The difference between HRT and SRT lies solely in the > =>shape of the value function at the t=deadline. > => > =>> the timeliness of the answer, you are incorrect that this is a > =>> 'misinformed' definition. You cannot design a hard-real-time > =>> system with timings that exceed certain limits. There is a > =>> difference between the term 'hard-real-time' and the term > =>> 'timing'. > => > =>Nonsense! The magnitude of the times involved is totally > =>irrelevant to whether a system is RT or not! An application > > Calm down, Don. Take a few long breaths and clear your mind for > a moment. We are saying the same thing. No! *I* didn't put silly "1mS" numbers to in any way pertain to whether something was RT, HRT, SRT, etc. I suppose I can dig out your post and requote the literal reference you made -- I'll leave that for you to verify! > Re-read what I said above: "There is a difference between > 'hard-real-time' and the term 'timing'." > > =>running at 10KHz can be *non* realtime while one running at > =>0.000000000001Hz *can* be realtime! (for example: a > =>spacecraft on it's way out of the solar system with a "deadline" > =>years in the future!) > > You keep confusing my statement and talking about timing. I > don't care if you have 5 billionths of a second or five billion > seconds to come up with the answer. I differentiated the two > above. *You* "quantified" RT at the 1mS/1KHz level. I merely point out that this has nothing to do with the issue. That;s the essence of the "real-fast" misconception... > =>> And, generally speaking, hard-real-time systems require timing > =>> which has a granularity of better than 1ms, thus the common > =>> statement which I made above. While I was somewhat guilty of > =>> mixing metaphores, so to speak, the two issues are different. > => > =>No! This is the *biggest* fallacy in the real-time issue! The > =>actual times involved are not important to the definition. I > > They might not be important to the definition, but they are > *everything* in the process. If your timings are wrong, your > real-time system falls apart. While the definition of real-time > might not include any kind of delineation concerning time > periods, the actuality of developing a real-time system is chock > full of actual -- and real -- timing issues. You can't ignore > that. And hyperventalating over the timing issue doesn't lend > credit to your statements. Reread (carefully) my statements and then reread *yours*. Perhaps you've been a bit sloppy in what you've written vs. what you *intended* to write. But, when it ocmes to this issue, I try to be *very* precise in my language. I repeat: the actual maginitudes of times, rates or frequencies has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with whether a system is RT, SRT or HRT. The sole criteria is the shape of the value function in the vicinity (and beyond) of the deadline. --don From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 12:16:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA11209 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 12:16:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from seagull.rtd.com (dgy@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA11196 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 12:16:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA21425; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 12:14:42 -0700 (MST) From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199709111914.MAA21425@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: <199709110933.FAA23225@hda.hda.com> from Peter Dufault at "Sep 11, 97 05:33:38 am" To: dufault@hda.com (Peter Dufault) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 12:14:42 -0700 (MST) Cc: leec@adam.adonai.net, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In the words of the world-renowned author, Peter Dufault: > > According to Stevens (et al), hard real-time programming (which > > is what 1ms timing is) is not reliably possible on un*x... [here lies the infamous "1mS" reference -- Sorry, Joerg, but I like the S capitalized! :>] > Hard real-time programming is independent of time base and is > usually defined by being deadline driven, e.g., the glass bottle Exactly! > picker upper snatching bottles off the conveyer belt. When you Ah, I'll have to remember that example... > are late you smash the bottle. There is no time base you can > identify as being "hard real time". There are many issues in > the fbsd kernel - it isn't reentrant, it isn't interruptible, > interrupts are turned off in places, etc. Right. There are no "guarantees" that the kernel can make regarding the timeliness of it's services (oh, I suppose you *could* argue that they are all in the interval (0, 3days] :> but that's kinda silly! :>). So, unless you can completely avoid *all* services aupplied by the kernel (inclucing scheduling! :-/), you can't realistically address RT issues. > The "easy" way to add demonstrably correct hard real time to unix > is to time multiplex the CPU. Degrade the CPU by a duty cycle, > and dedicate the part you've stolen to running something completely > orthogonal to the unix kernel. You've created a second virtual Yes. Unfortunately, this is nontrivial as you *really* need to ensure this orthogonality -- *nothing* can be in contention! A sort of brute force "processor reserves" implementation... > CPU where you can do hard real time. Your interrupt latency suffers > in the normal world. You preempt the kernel, so you have to worry > about any hidden real time requirements (typically associated with > devices) in the normal kernel. There are obvious problems when > interrupts are turned off in the normal kernel, etc. It is doable. > Oh oh, I hear Terry sneaking up on me... That's all right... just hand him your wallet and any jewelry you happen to have... --don From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 12:23:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA11703 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 12:23:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from news.cioe.com (news.cioe.com [204.120.165.34]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA11673; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 12:23:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by news.cioe.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id OAA08122; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:22:06 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:22:06 -0500 (EST) From: Steven Ames Message-Id: <199709111922.OAA08122@news.cioe.com> To: gmarco@giovannelli.it, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, questions@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Important: -O flag crashes cc in libncurses Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I know just a little about -O, and I think it is the optimization level, > but I don't know really what the number are ... > > Is possible to modify the Makefile to use -O2 for the libncurses instead of > -O ? It would important for me if I want to complete a make world.... :-) Try this: cp /usr/src/etc/make.conf /etc/make.conf Then edit /etc/make.conf. The first configuration option is 'CFLAGS'. These will be the flags used when when makeing the world... and at some point the make for the ports also started using this file. -STeve From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 14:08:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA18082 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:08:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr03.primenet.com (tlambert@usr03.primenet.com [206.165.6.203]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA18077 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:08:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr03.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA10561; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:06:56 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709112106.OAA10561@usr03.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? To: dgy@rtd.com (Don Yuniskis) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:06:55 +0000 (GMT) Cc: dufault@hda.com, leec@adam.adonai.net, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709111914.MAA21425@seagull.rtd.com> from "Don Yuniskis" at Sep 11, 97 12:14:42 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Oh oh, I hear Terry sneaking up on me... > > That's all right... just hand him your wallet and any jewelry > you happen to have... Be quick about it, and no one gets hurt, understand? Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 14:23:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA20085 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:23:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from seagull.rtd.com (dgy@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA20061 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:23:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA00225; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:22:11 -0700 (MST) From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199709112122.OAA00225@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: <199709112106.OAA10561@usr03.primenet.com> from Terry Lambert at "Sep 11, 97 09:06:55 pm" To: tlambert@primenet.com (Terry Lambert) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:22:11 -0700 (MST) Cc: dgy@rtd.com, dufault@hda.com, leec@adam.adonai.net, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In the words of the world-renowned author, Terry Lambert: > > > Oh oh, I hear Terry sneaking up on me... > > > > That's all right... just hand him your wallet and any jewelry > > you happen to have... > > Be quick about it, and no one gets hurt, understand? *Especially* you, right ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Terry? :> --don From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 14:25:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA20484 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:25:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hydrogen.nike.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA20463 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:25:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.nike.efn.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA26995; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:25:44 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970911142544.37798@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:25:44 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: Terry Lambert Cc: Luigi Rizzo , mike@smith.net.au, perhaps@yes.no, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PnP support References: <199709111524.RAA00618@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> <199709111815.LAA24444@usr07.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709111815.LAA24444@usr07.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Thu, Sep 11, 1997 at 06:15:32PM +0000 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert scribbled this message on Sep 11: > The reason that this is a hard problem is that dynamic reconfiguration > of dynamically-reconfigurable-but-not-PnP hardware makes it difficult > for FreeBSD to coexist with other OS's, which would not know about > these devices ability to move around. > > I would still like to see a device level driver entrypoint for > configuration control for these devices (especially, I'd like > to see one accessible by ioctl() for WD ethernet cards!), but > I'm not willing for this t be converted into something that will > relocate cards that another OS will be unable to relocate back. oh.. this isn't hard at all (except for when we panic, but FreeBSD never does that does it?? :) ).. you just call ALL the devices' detach routines before shutting down... then the device gets relocated back... > Another issue is that the static state for allowable configurations > must be kept in the device driver, and it makes the device drivers > just that much less general. For example, the soft configuration > of most NE2000 clone cards varies from vendor to vendor. That's > a lot of data. this is slightly more problematic.. as we can't very easily make sure than the boot device (that would contain all the dynamicly loadable modules with this info) will be on a bus that was attached before this device... but if we can.. we simply load and use that device specific information.. > I would definitely caution against this. If people want to be > *certain* beyond a shadow of a doubt that their hardware will > work with FreeBSD, without damaging the ability of the hardware > to work with another OS without reconfiguration, then they should > avoid ISA cards entirely. FreeBSD should do what it can, within > the "do no harm" constraints above... but should not go beyond. unless you tell it to go beyond... who cards about running other os's on your machine?? :) > > ALLOCATE: > > Before going on with the attach, we have to take a decision among > > the available options and then just go on with the attach routines, > > marking those devices which could not be allocated the requested > > resources ? > > This is also frustrating. From the above, an ISA sound card and > an ISA network card, one of which is sof reconfigurable and neither > which are PnP, or a serial port COM1 and a modem COM3, both of > which want IRQ 4, and one of which is soft reconfigurable and neither > are PnP, are both examples. hmm... so we have a flag on the list of resources that a driver uses... if it's set, then the resource is ONLY used when the device is open.. otherwise that resource is used all the time... this works nicely for com ports.. as the ioaddress space is always in use... but the irq is only used when needing to recieve data... the device open will be more complex.. we will have to include something like a check on the first open... thanks for point this out... I"m going to add this to my spec... > > here if some attach fails we can free the resources which have been > > allocated for them, and possibly go back to ALLOCATE: if any device was > > left out ? > > Only if the failing device can be disabused of the resources it's > known to use. This will only work for PnP devices, where the card > may be disabled, and then only in the case that the OS provides PnP > BIOS type services to do the port diddling necessary to shut the > device down. Otherwise, the failing device must be assumed to be > activated. hmm.. very good point... so we need to make sure that upon a failed attach that the device will leave the structure with a correct list of resources that are active... i.e. most likely just the iobase and memory mapped space... but it coulde leave irqs active... if they do, we should probably make a small routine that will catch these "stray" irqs and not through them in with the generic stray ones.. > Note that a PnP BIOS for a particular board may have ISA devices > defined as if they were PnP devices, in order to consider them in > the PnP conflict resolution phase. Though these devices appear to > be PnP devices, and therefore you might believe that you could > disable them if you didn't have a suitable driver, and reclaim > their resources, you CANNOT. They will not obey the disable > requests. Thus PnP BIOS alone is not enough; an OS must provide > its own PnP BIOS type services to be able to distinguish these > devices. umm.. you lost me there.. you mean that some motherboards ACTUALLY present the hardware emulation of the PnP card for legacy isa hardware? I really have a feeling that you didn't mean this... > > > I think it's important to leave the 'legacy' devices until _last_, as > > > this prevents a PnP device being accidentally recognised as a 'legacy' > > > device. > > > > Right. > > > > Comments ? > > You probe up the hierarchy, and attach down. Pretty simple. > > Note: You are screwed in this case if you do not have a PnP BIOS > that knows about legacy hardware for which the OS has no drivers; > to be able to deal with this issue, you need a "BIOS config" in your > PnP OS. > > Even if you have a PnP BIOS, you still need this: Windows 95 > universally fails to identify IRQ 12 as being used by the Bus mouse > in some Acer machines, and reallocates it. The OS must compensate. > Windows 95 "compensates" by requiring you to lock down all PnP > devies in the device configuration in the Properties page for "My > Computer". FreeBSD can, and should, do better. Maybe a PnP legacy > device configuration in "boot: -c/visual". > > I *highly* recommend that anyone coding on this obtain a recent > copy of the PnP specification, and consider these issues in their > design. As was pointed out by someone else, if you don't, it will > have to be rewritten later, and the new code, if marginally more > functional, will act as a speed-bump, impeding geting it right. hmm... I probably should, could you mail me the reference in private email? -- John-Mark Gurney Modem/FAX: +1 541 683 6954 Cu Networking Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 14:47:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA23419 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:47:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from unix.tfs.net (root@unix.tfs.net [199.79.146.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA23411 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:46:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from argus.tfs.net (pm3-p35.tfs.net [206.154.183.227]) by unix.tfs.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA03875 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:45:45 -0500 Received: (from jbryant@localhost) by argus.tfs.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA00288 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:46:46 -0500 (CDT) From: Jim Bryant Message-Id: <199709112146.QAA00288@argus.tfs.net> Subject: vga palette snooping? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:46:45 -0500 (CDT) Reply-to: jbryant@tfs.net X-Windows: R00LZ!@# MS-Winbl0wz DR00LZ!@# X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.2-RELEASE #0: Wed Jul 9 01:01:24 CDT 1997 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk i just installed a tv card in this packard bell, and under X it is doing pretty much the same thing as it was under WinBlowz without the VGA Palette Snooping feature in the BIOS enabled... my colors are really messed up, and there is a "sparkle" to the display, and there are pel dropouts... works fine under winblowz... the vga is going through the TV card via the feature connector... any ideas? jim -- All opinions expressed are mine, if you | "I will not be pushed, stamped, think otherwise, then go jump into turbid | briefed, debriefed, indexed, or radioactive waters and yell WAHOO !!! | numbered!" - #1, "The Prisoner" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Inet: jbryant@tfs.net AX.25: kc5vdj@wv0t.#neks.ks.usa.noam grid: EM28PW voice: KC5VDJ - 6 & 2 Meters AM/FM/SSB, 70cm FM. http://www.tfs.net/~jbryant ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ HF/6M/2M: IC-706-MkII, 2M: HTX-212, 2M: HTX-202, 70cm: HTX-404, Packet: KPC-3+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 15:46:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA28710 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 15:46:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr03.primenet.com (tlambert@usr03.primenet.com [206.165.6.203]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA28702 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 15:46:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr03.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA17225; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 15:45:49 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709112245.PAA17225@usr03.primenet.com> Subject: Re: PnP support To: gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:45:48 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, mike@smith.net.au, perhaps@yes.no, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970911142544.37798@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> from "John-Mark Gurney" at Sep 11, 97 02:25:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Only if the failing device can be disabused of the resources it's > > known to use. This will only work for PnP devices, where the card > > may be disabled, and then only in the case that the OS provides PnP > > BIOS type services to do the port diddling necessary to shut the > > device down. Otherwise, the failing device must be assumed to be > > activated. > > hmm.. very good point... so we need to make sure that upon a failed > attach that the device will leave the structure with a correct list > of resources that are active... i.e. most likely just the iobase and > memory mapped space... but it coulde leave irqs active... if they > do, we should probably make a small routine that will catch these > "stray" irqs and not through them in with the generic stray ones.. I was actually thinking about a "dummy" driver that pretended to be a device driver for the devices. This would actually allow a boot -c (if it could edit the irq/io/base) to be used to configure dummy devices into the conflict space so that nothing gets located on top of them. > > Note that a PnP BIOS for a particular board may have ISA devices > > defined as if they were PnP devices, in order to consider them in > > the PnP conflict resolution phase. Though these devices appear to > > be PnP devices, and therefore you might believe that you could > > disable them if you didn't have a suitable driver, and reclaim > > their resources, you CANNOT. They will not obey the disable > > requests. Thus PnP BIOS alone is not enough; an OS must provide > > its own PnP BIOS type services to be able to distinguish these > > devices. > > umm.. you lost me there.. you mean that some motherboards ACTUALLY > present the hardware emulation of the PnP card for legacy isa hardware? > I really have a feeling that you didn't mean this... My PnP machine here lets me define 2 ISA devices in CMOS setup, in addition to the ISA devices on the motherboard. It presents these devices as pseduo PnP devices with hard-coded values which can't be reconfigured via the BIOS because the controller for the device (generally a multi-i/o chip on the motherboard for motherboard stuff, or a legacy ISA card for the two I can configure) won't repond to PnP port munging of card resources because it *can't*. So if your "mung" was "disable this device so I can reclaim its address space", it won't work. Likewise, if your "mung" was "bsearch for PnP devices", it wouldn't find the ones from your PnP BIOS ROMs for the machine, or in the two CMOS areas that the PnP BIOS ROMs for your machine kenw about. That's why it's important to have a PnP aware OS that can do port munging, even if the machine has a PnP BIOS, and why it's important to use the PnP BIOS, if it's there, for "ISA device" identification for motherboard and CMOS setup "ISA devices". Note 1: It is vendor dependent whether the faked up PnP devices will show that the only setting they have, or whether it will claim all possible settings as configurations. As a rule of thumb, if you can change the device settings in the CMOS (COM1: IRQ, etc.), then it generally will report all possible settings. Note 2: If your machine has a PnP BIOS, the devices are configured after PnP POSTs. The only issue you have are legacy ISA devices that the BIOS doesn't know about, either because it's a minimal BIOS, or because you haven't told it. The ACER bus mouse example, where PnP stomps IRQ 12, is an example of a minimal BIOS. > > I *highly* recommend that anyone coding on this obtain a recent > > copy of the PnP specification, and consider these issues in their > > design. > > hmm... I probably should, could you mail me the reference in private > email? Plug and Play System Architecture, First Edition MindShare, Inc. ISBN: 0-201-41013-3 It's actually better than the spec., IMO. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 16:00:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA00776 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:00:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from thor.i-connect.net (qmailr@thor.i-Connect.Net [206.190.143.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA00758 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:00:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 31653 invoked by uid 4028); 11 Sep 1997 23:00:07 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 0.5-alpha [p0] on Linux Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 15:34:23 -0700 (PDT) From: ron@cts.com To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: dumb installation Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In an effort to be totally free of MicroSoft corruption, I did not provide a dos partition on my nice new 4GB SCSI drive. Well, certainly outsmarted myself there. After installing BootEasy, I get an endless F? prompt no matter which function key I depress. Well and good; I can boot with the boot floppy. I am vulnerable to unattended reboots, however. I am interested in finding a solution, short of repartitioning, for this installation gaff. One thing that comes to mind is that if I could change the default on the boot floppy, I would be molified. How would I do that (lacking the presumed dos compilers/assemblers/linkers needed to rebuild it)? Any other ideas that come to mind would be appreciated. relevent info: INTEL Tuscon motherboard Adaptec 2940 UW scsi SDT7000 tape Toshiba 16x scsi cdrom ---------------------------------- E-Mail: ron@cts.com Date: 09/11/97 Time: 15:34:23 This message was sent by XF-Mail ---------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 16:06:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA01844 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:06:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from earth.mat.net (root@earth.mat.net [206.246.122.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA01817 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:06:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Journey2.mat.net (journey2.mat.net [206.246.122.116]) by earth.mat.net (8.8.7/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA19463 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:06:18 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:06:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey X-Sender: chuckr@Journey2.mat.net To: FreeBSD-Hackers Subject: network programming. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have to do my very first network programming, a UDP client+server, and I was wondering if anyone knows of how I could go about intercepting something sent to a UDP socket, so I could use it for troubleshooting? I don't want to receive it (else the client would never get it), just to monitor what's going on. This is my home machine, and I (obviously) have root here. I don't want the application written for me, just a tool I could use to capture what's going on between my buggy server and my buggy client. Thanks for any hints, guys. ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@eng.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run Journey2 and picnic, both FreeBSD (301) 220-2114 | version 3.0 current -- and great FUN! ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 16:28:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA05636 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:28:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shark.nas.nasa.gov (shark.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.34.41]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA05630 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:28:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shark.nas.nasa.gov (edavis@localhost) by shark.nas.nasa.gov (8.8.7/NAS.6.1) with ESMTP id QAA10762; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:27:43 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709112327.QAA10762@shark.nas.nasa.gov> To: Chuck Robey cc: FreeBSD-Hackers Subject: Re: network programming. In-reply-to: chuckr's message of Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:06:26 -0400. Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:27:43 -0700 From: "Eric A. Davis" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk You want tcpdump located at /usr/sbin/tcpdump. On Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:06:26 -0400 (EDT) Chuck Robey wrote >I have to do my very first network programming, a UDP client+server, and I >was wondering if anyone knows of how I could go about intercepting >something sent to a UDP socket, so I could use it for troubleshooting? I >don't want to receive it (else the client would never get it), just to >monitor what's going on. This is my home machine, and I (obviously) have >root here. > >I don't want the application written for me, just a tool I could use to >capture what's going on between my buggy server and my buggy client. > >Thanks for any hints, guys. > >----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- >Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data >chuckr@eng.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. >213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | >Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run Journey2 and picnic, both FreeBSD >(301) 220-2114 | version 3.0 current -- and great FUN! >----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- > -- Eric Allen Davis Network Engineer edavis@nas.nasa.gov NASA Ames Research Center (415)604-2543 NAS Systems Division Pager: (415)428-6931 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 17:07:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA10381 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:07:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zippy.dyn.ml.org (garbanzo@spain-37.ppp.hooked.net [206.169.228.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA10374 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:07:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (garbanzo@localhost) by zippy.dyn.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA05163 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:18:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: zippy.dyn.ml.org: garbanzo owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:18:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.19970911113550.012be2b0@mail.gamespot.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Ian Kallen wrote: > At 07:37 PM 9/11/97 +0200, S. Sigala wrote: > >The idea is to replace the "standard" FreeBSD editor "ee" with this > >one (if FBSD core like it). > > Better is to have sysinstall ask what editor you want, first thing for me > (after setting a password :) is to make sure I'm alway's > "cd ; echo 'setenv EDITOR vi' >> .cshrc ; source .cshrc" > It'd be nice if sysinstall asked but this'll do :) You can set this by going to the options "submenu" off the main install screen. Default for editor is /usr/bin/ee. I'm sure you could change that ;-) - alex From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 17:11:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA10827 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:11:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA10822 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:11:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by alpo.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA09162 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:02:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) via SMTP by alpo.whistle.com, id smtpd009159; Fri Sep 12 00:02:09 1997 Message-ID: <34188660.1CFBAE39@whistle.com> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:01:36 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: AMD broken in 2.2.2? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk If I just turn on amd in rc.conf and use the standard settings, I get the following: # ls /host/phaser3/data # tail /var/log/messages [old stuff] Sep 11 16:54:40 phaser3 amd.hold[4252]: NIS domain name is not set. NIS ignored Sep 11 16:55:36 phaser3 amd.hold[4550]: /net/phaser3/data: mount: Bad address # mount /dev/wd0a on / (local) /dev/wd1s1e on /data (NFS exported, local) /dev/wd0s1f on /usr (local) /dev/wd0s1e on /var (local) procfs on /proc (local) amd:4252 on /host # kill 4252 # amd.2.2.0 -npr -a /net -c 1800 -k i386 -d whistle.com -l syslog -x all /host /etc/amd.map # mount /dev/wd0a on / (local) /dev/wd1s1e on /data (NFS exported, local) /dev/wd0s1f on /usr (local) /dev/wd0s1e on /var (local) procfs on /proc (local) amd:5191 on /host # !ls ls /host/phaser3/data CVSROOT freebsd oldmod build_envs mod prod # tail /var/log/messages [old stuff] Sep 11 16:59:44 phaser3 amd.2.2.0[5191]: NIS domain name is not set. NIS ignored. in other words, teh binary from a 2.2-current (kinda unknown vintage) works fine, but the binary from 2.2.2 fails miserably. I've looked through the mailing lists etc, but I don't see why the default setting in /etc/rc.conf should fail anyone have any thoughts? was there some security feature added that wasn't documented? the "Bad address" is a rather useless error message. julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 17:24:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA11611 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:24:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from earth.mat.net (root@earth.mat.net [206.246.122.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA11606 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:24:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Journey2.mat.net (journey2.mat.net [206.246.122.116]) by earth.mat.net (8.8.7/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA22539; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:24:28 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:24:36 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey X-Sender: chuckr@Journey2.mat.net To: "Eric A. Davis" cc: FreeBSD-Hackers Subject: Re: network programming. In-Reply-To: <199709112327.QAA10762@shark.nas.nasa.gov> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Eric A. Davis wrote: > > You want tcpdump located at /usr/sbin/tcpdump. Thanks, that's looks like just the ticket. I think also I can't wait for mail order, I gotta get myself a copy of Stevens tcp book tomorrow, I've been told that Volume I is the one I can't delay getting. > > > On Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:06:26 -0400 (EDT) Chuck Robey wrote > >I have to do my very first network programming, a UDP client+server, and I > >was wondering if anyone knows of how I could go about intercepting > >something sent to a UDP socket, so I could use it for troubleshooting? I > >don't want to receive it (else the client would never get it), just to > >monitor what's going on. This is my home machine, and I (obviously) have > >root here. > > > >I don't want the application written for me, just a tool I could use to > >capture what's going on between my buggy server and my buggy client. > > > >Thanks for any hints, guys. > > > >----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- > >Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data > >chuckr@eng.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. > >213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | > >Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run Journey2 and picnic, both FreeBSD > >(301) 220-2114 | version 3.0 current -- and great FUN! > >----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- > > > > > -- > Eric Allen Davis Network Engineer > edavis@nas.nasa.gov NASA Ames Research Center > (415)604-2543 NAS Systems Division > Pager: (415)428-6931 > > > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@eng.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run Journey2 and picnic, both FreeBSD (301) 220-2114 | version 3.0 current -- and great FUN! ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 17:40:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA12854 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:40:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA12839; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:40:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id KAA17151; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:10:14 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970912101014.37786@lemis.com> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:10:14 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: FreeBSD Questions Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Do *you* have problems with floppies? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've seen a lot of reports recently about problems with floppies under FreeBSD. Now I can understand a lot of that: floppies must be the most unreliable data storage medium I can think of, not to mention the most expensive per byte. But I'm getting the feeling that there is more to it than that, that possibly there's a bug in the floppy driver and that we're blaming it on the inherent unreliability of the medium. I'm looking for indications which would point towards the driver. One of these might be: 1. Floppy formatted under on the same machine. 2. FreeBSD runs into hardware problems with the floppy (typically things like checksum errors). 3. can read the entire floppy with no trouble. If you can give me hard evidence of such occurrences, I'd like to hear from you. I know that plenty of people can tell me that they've had occurrences of (2), maybe in conjunction with (1), but unless you can prove (3) as well, I don't want to hear from you. In addition, if you have any other evidence I haven't thought of which would also point to an error in the floppy driver, please contact me. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 17:49:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA13524 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:49:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA13519 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:49:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA08947; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:49:33 -0700 (PDT) To: Branson Matheson cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:02:20 EDT." Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:49:33 -0700 Message-ID: <8943.874025373@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Hmmm... I for one would not want it to be the standard editor. Vi is > and always has been the standard editor for unix. I think it should I think you misunderstand. This doesn't replace vi and never did. ee is a *different* editor, for a different audience, and the fact that you symlink it to vi on your own box is completely and utterly irrelevant to that fact. :) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 18:01:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA14449 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:01:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from seagull.rtd.com (dgy@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA14441 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:01:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA16409; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:00:32 -0700 (MST) From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199709120100.SAA16409@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: <199709111717.KAA20383@usr07.primenet.com> from Terry Lambert at "Sep 11, 97 05:17:08 pm" To: tlambert@primenet.com (Terry Lambert) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:00:31 -0700 (MST) Cc: dufault@hda.com, leec@adam.adonai.net, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In the words of the world-renowned author, Terry Lambert: > > There are many issues in > > the fbsd kernel - it isn't reentrant, it isn't interruptible, > > interrupts are turned off in places, etc. > > These speak more to QOS (Quality Of Service) than to implementability, > actually. The longest possible latency path to a required functional > deadline determines the response claims you can make for HRT, IMO, > and has little bearing on hardness beyond that. The real FreeBSD > problems are scheduling order, followed by priority inversion issues > arising from non-exclusive commision of resources, once the scheduler > issues are worked out. > > > The "easy" way to add demonstrably correct hard real time to unix > > is to time multiplex the CPU. Degrade the CPU by a duty cycle, > > and dedicate the part you've stolen to running something completely > > orthogonal to the unix kernel. You've created a second virtual > > CPU where you can do hard real time. > > This addresses, crudely, the scheduling issue, but leaves the inversion > issue outstanding. To truly do this the "easy" way requires commision > of all necessary resources: disk, controller DMA time, etc.. Not > a trivial task, needing as it does driver level modifications to > allow, for example, cancellation of all outstanding tagged commands > to service the RT needs exclusively. Unless you dedicate controller > resources to RT, as well. Then there's the bus resources... Perhaps I read more into Peter's comments than he intended *but* I was under the assumption that his (perhaps too subtle?) statement that "running something completely orthogonal to the kernel" was intended to imply that there was *no* resource sharing (hence magically waving aside the priority inversion issues :>)? If *not*, then I believe the "processor reserves" approach would need to be more integrated into the kernel to make those claims... > > Your interrupt latency suffers > > in the normal world. You preempt the kernel, so you have to worry > > about any hidden real time requirements (typically associated with > > devices) in the normal kernel. There are obvious problems when > > interrupts are turned off in the normal kernel, etc. It is doable. > > Oh oh, I hear Terry sneaking up on me... > > Two things would help immediately, without needing to go to this > extreme. I think the "easy" way described is actually harder in > some ways than it would need to be. > > If you had (1) kernel preemption, and (2) a reschedulable interval > based one-shot timer, you would have the basis of a hard timing > constraint for when you could begin some act. That leaves issues I think the one-shot can be worked around (assuming the system tick is at a frequency "high enough for the timeliness constraints of the application") since you could just ensure the events are scheduled prior to the tick *before* the deadline, etc. (i.e. err on the earlier side) > of priority inversion of shared resources, but that handleable > through (a) lending, and (b) resource preeemption. The other Yikes, Terry... you make it sound like it's *trivial*!! :> ("I'll expect those changes on my desk before 5PM...") > issues are merely "hardness guarantee issues"... ie:, they indicate > how tight a deadline the sysem can conform to, not whether or not > the system can conform to any hard deadline at all. Note that > even if you are significantly over the quantum in start scheduling > leeway, the current system is incapable of guaranteeing to meet a > deadline. > > Anyway, this type of discussion is why there's a FreeBSD RealTime > list. Maintained by Peter, of course. 8-). Agreed. --don From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 18:03:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA14587 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:03:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmb@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA14551; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:02:52 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Message-Id: <199709120102.SAA14551@hub.freebsd.org> Subject: Re: network programming. To: chuckr@glue.umd.edu (Chuck Robey) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:02:51 -0700 (PDT) Cc: edavis@nas.nasa.gov, FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Chuck Robey" at Sep 11, 97 08:24:36 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Chuck Robey wrote: > > On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Eric A. Davis wrote: > > > > > You want tcpdump located at /usr/sbin/tcpdump. > > Thanks, that's looks like just the ticket. I think also I can't wait for > mail order, I gotta get myself a copy of Stevens tcp book tomorrow, I've > been told that Volume I is the one I can't delay getting. stevens has five books out _unix_networking_programming_ how to program (600+) _tcp/ip_illustrated_ vol1 why the protocols are the way they are (500+) vol2 4.4BSD-lite source code walk-thru (1000+ pgaes) FreeBSD is diverging from this base, slowly vol3 bugs fixes, http, and news (300+) _advanced_programming_in_the_unix_enviroment_ how do signals work? signal(), sigaction, reliable signals and so much more ;) all are reviewed in the handbook. jmb From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 18:11:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA15324 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:11:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ocean.campus.luth.se (ocean.campus.luth.se [130.240.194.116]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA15317 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:11:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from karpen@localhost) by ocean.campus.luth.se (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA00578; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 03:15:54 +0200 (CEST) From: Mikael Karpberg Message-Id: <199709120115.DAA00578@ocean.campus.luth.se> Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release In-Reply-To: from Branson Matheson at "Sep 11, 97 02:02:20 pm" To: branson.matheson@ferginc.com Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 03:15:54 +0200 (CEST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Branson Matheson: > On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, S. Sigala wrote: > > > Hi, around two month ago i have announced the latest alpha > > of my Emacs-clone text editor "Zile". > ... > > > > The idea is to replace the "standard" FreeBSD editor "ee" with this > > one (if FBSD core like it). > > Hmmm... I for one would not want it to be the standard editor. Vi is > and always has been the standard editor for unix. I think it should > stay that way. One of the first two commands on any new boxen that I > create is: > > rm /usr/bin/ee ; ln -s /usr/bin/vi /usr/bin/ee > > Lets keep the unix editor the standard unix editor, vi... or at least > offer a choice ,I think there is/was somthing like that in the > /stand/sysconfig when configuring. At least for vipw. Really! After seeing three such responses I must say: - You guys have NOT being paying attention. A bit back there was this 20000 entires discussion of what we should use, and it's NOT a matter of using vi, or not using vi. It's in the system, and if you guys (like I do) want a hard to use, and very unfriendly newbie editor then you've been around, and I'm sure you can change the default EDITOR enviroment variable. And we had 3 fine examples of that in your posts. The question is if "ee" should be replaced as the newbie ALTERNATIVE to vi. If "zile" is compatible with the list of things we demand from this alternative editor, then I say kick "ee" out and put "zile" in there. Because frankly, it can't get much worse then ee, me thinks. Zile seems useful, even! If it's newbie friendly enough it is as good as ee, but it should appeal to emacs users too, who don't like messing around with vi. I for one use both vi and emacs, depending on what I'm doing. Zile would probably make me much happier then ee, which I can't stand. Just trying to help clear things out... /Mikael From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 18:33:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA16962 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:33:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wireless.4d.net (wireless.4d.net [207.137.156.159]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA16957; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:33:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from uhf.wireless.net (uhf.4d.net [207.137.157.140]) by wireless.4d.net (8.8.7/8.8.4) with ESMTP id SAA24481; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:34:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (root@localhost) by uhf.wireless.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id VAA04300; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:39:16 GMT Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:39:16 +0000 (GMT) From: System Administrator To: hackers@freebsd.org, ports@freebsd.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Just tried to compile trafshow from the ports collection, It seems to me that it is broken. Can someone please mark the 3.0 trafshow port as broken? Bernie Script started on Thu Sep 11 21:27:02 1997 You have mail. uhf:/usr/local/ports/net/trafshow # uname -a FreeBSD uhf.wireless.net 3.0-970807-SNAP FreeBSD 3.0-970807-SNAP #0: Mon Sep 8 22:42:47 GMT 1997 root@uhf.wireless.net:/usr/src/sys/compile/gw i386 uhf:/usr/local/ports/net/trafshow # make >> Checksum OK for trafshow-2.0.tgz. ===> Building for trafshow-2.0 cc -O2 -I../include -DETHER_SERVICE -c addrtoname.c In file included from addrtoname.c:53: /usr/include/net/if.h:69: field `ifi_lastchange' has incomplete type In file included from addrtoname.c:56: /usr/include/netinet/if_ether.h:90: field `ac_if' has incomplete type addrtoname.c: In function `getname': addrtoname.c:220: storage size of `itv' isn't known addrtoname.c:220: storage size of `oitv' isn't known addrtoname.c:224: dereferencing pointer to incomplete type addrtoname.c:225: dereferencing pointer to incomplete type addrtoname.c:226: `ITIMER_REAL' undeclared (first use this function) addrtoname.c:226: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only once addrtoname.c:226: for each function it appears in.) addrtoname.c:229: dereferencing pointer to incomplete type addrtoname.c:230: dereferencing pointer to incomplete type addrtoname.c: In function `etheraddr_string': addrtoname.c:297: warning: passing arg 2 of `ether_ntohost' from incompatible pointer type *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. uhf:/usr/local/ports/net/trafshow # exit Script done on Thu Sep 11 21:27:14 1997 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 18:42:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA17682 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:42:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kalypso.cybercom.net (kalypso.cybercom.net [209.21.136.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA17677 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:42:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from atlanta (mfd-dial1-14.cybercom.net [209.21.137.14]) by kalypso.cybercom.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id VAA22424 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:41:47 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970911213146.009c5680@cybercom.net> X-Sender: ksmm@cybercom.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:31:46 -0400 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: The Classiest Man Alive Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release In-Reply-To: <8943.874025373@time.cdrom.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 05:49 PM 9/11/97 -0700, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: >> Hmmm... I for one would not want it to be the standard editor. Vi is >> and always has been the standard editor for unix. I think it should > >I think you misunderstand. This doesn't replace vi and never did. >ee is a *different* editor, for a different audience, and the fact >that you symlink it to vi on your own box is completely and utterly >irrelevant to that fact. :) Perhaps more to the point, no one has actually commented on the new version of Zile. I know how resistant programmers can be to change something as sacred as an editor, but I don't think a quick evaluation/test of the new editor would kill anybody. This is the FreeBSD camp--there's always room for one more. K.S. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 18:50:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA18584 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:50:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA18575 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:50:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by alpo.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA12036; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:47:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) via SMTP by alpo.whistle.com, id smtpd012034; Fri Sep 12 01:47:42 1997 Message-ID: <34189F1C.FF6D5DF@whistle.com> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:47:08 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Chuck Robey CC: FreeBSD-Hackers Subject: Re: network programming. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Chuck Robey wrote: man bpf man tcpdump > > I have to do my very first network programming, a UDP client+server, and I > was wondering if anyone knows of how I could go about intercepting > something sent to a UDP socket, so I could use it for troubleshooting? I > don't want to receive it (else the client would never get it), just to > monitor what's going on. This is my home machine, and I (obviously) have > root here. > > I don't want the application written for me, just a tool I could use to > capture what's going on between my buggy server and my buggy client. > > Thanks for any hints, guys. > > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- > Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data > chuckr@eng.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. > 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | > Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run Journey2 and picnic, both FreeBSD > (301) 220-2114 | version 3.0 current -- and great FUN! > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 18:53:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA18856 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:53:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from awfulhak.demon.co.uk (awfulhak.demon.co.uk [158.152.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA18819; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:52:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lan.awfulhak.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by awfulhak.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA14207; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:52:42 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199709120152.CAA14207@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Julian Elischer cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Doug Rabson. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:30:47 PDT." <199709111830.LAA15114@freefall.freebsd.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:52:42 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I haven't heard from Doug since June 3. > > Has anyone any information as to what happenned to him? > > If not, maybe one of our UK members might like to go to: > Doug Rabson (NLSYSTEMS-DOM) > 33 The Chase > Edgware, Middlesex, HA8 5DW > UK > > and try find out what happenned? > Well, he logged onto freefall on August 11. I can give him a ring if you think he's really missing..... -- Brian , Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 19:10:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA20032 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:10:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA20013; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:10:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by alpo.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA12427; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:03:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) via SMTP by alpo.whistle.com, id smtpd012424; Fri Sep 12 02:03:15 1997 Message-ID: <3418A2C2.31DFF4F5@whistle.com> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:02:42 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Brian Somers CC: Julian Elischer , current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Doug Rabson. References: <199709120152.CAA14207@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Brian Somers wrote: > > > I haven't heard from Doug since June 3. > > > > Has anyone any information as to what happenned to him? > > > > If not, maybe one of our UK members might like to go to: > > Doug Rabson (NLSYSTEMS-DOM) > > 33 The Chase > > Edgware, Middlesex, HA8 5DW > > UK > > > > and try find out what happenned? > > > > Well, he logged onto freefall on August 11. > > I can give him a ring if you think he's really missing..... > -- > Brian , > > Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... that's good news.. 1 month is maybe ok, 3 is a bit too long.. Mike Prichard must have eventually turned up too, as he now has a 'vacation' proggram running on freefall saying he'll be away for a while.. julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 19:15:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA20611 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:15:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tok.qiv.com ([204.214.141.211]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA20603; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:15:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by tok.qiv.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with UUCP id VAA18441; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:15:31 -0500 (CDT) Received: from localhost (jdn@localhost) by acp.qiv.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA00707; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:58:20 -0500 (CDT) X-Authentication-Warning: acp.qiv.com: jdn owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:58:19 -0500 (CDT) From: "Jay D. Nelson" To: Greg Lehey cc: FreeBSD Questions , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: <19970912101014.37786@lemis.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Sorry, I can't offer any help with software bugs. I've used an odd-ball assortment of floppies since 2.0 with less than 5% failure. I rarely bother to reformat. I dd the image to /dev/fd0 and am as happy as a pig in a mud hole. I'm using Mitsumis now, but have used Teacs and Sonys equally well. If there's a bug, I haven't seen it. I would suspect the ability of a MicroS**t product to do anything rational with questionable media. Maybe the dos program (rawrite?) needs to make up for Redmond's short comings? -- Jay On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Greg Lehey wrote: > I've seen a lot of reports recently about problems with floppies under > FreeBSD. Now I can understand a lot of that: floppies must be the > most unreliable data storage medium I can think of, not to mention the > most expensive per byte. But I'm getting the feeling that there is > more to it than that, that possibly there's a bug in the floppy driver > and that we're blaming it on the inherent unreliability of the medium. > > I'm looking for indications which would point towards the driver. One > of these might be: > > 1. Floppy formatted under on the same machine. > 2. FreeBSD runs into hardware problems with the floppy (typically > things like checksum errors). > 3. can read the entire floppy with no trouble. > > If you can give me hard evidence of such occurrences, I'd like to hear > from you. I know that plenty of people can tell me that they've had > occurrences of (2), maybe in conjunction with (1), but unless you can > prove (3) as well, I don't want to hear from you. > > In addition, if you have any other evidence I haven't thought of which > would also point to an error in the floppy driver, please contact me. > > Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 19:42:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA22464 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:42:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA22458 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:42:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA07105; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:42:12 -0600 (MDT) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:42:12 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709120242.UAA07105@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Chuck Robey Cc: FreeBSD-Hackers Subject: Re: network programming. In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I have to do my very first network programming, a UDP client+server, and I > was wondering if anyone knows of how I could go about intercepting > something sent to a UDP socket, so I could use it for troubleshooting? tcpdump is your friend. :) Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 19:43:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA22531 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:43:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA22524 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:43:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA00617; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:11:16 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709120211.MAA00617@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Branson Matheson cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:02:20 -0400." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:11:16 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Hmmm... I for one would not want it to be the standard editor. Vi is > and always has been the standard editor for unix. I think it should > stay that way. We've had this argument already. You are welcome to your perspective, but your position lost last time, and it'd lose again. > One of the first two commands on any new boxen that I > create is: > > rm /usr/bin/ee ; ln -s /usr/bin/vi /usr/bin/ee This is somehow easier than changing the EDITOR setting in root's profile? > Lets keep the unix editor the standard unix editor, vi... or at least > offer a choice ,I think there is/was somthing like that in the > /stand/sysconfig when configuring. At least for vipw. vipw, like all good tools, uses EDITOR if set or vi as a default. This isn't likely to change. All that's at issue is providing a compact DWIE editor, and vi is not this by any stretch of the imagination. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 19:44:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA22670 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:44:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from acromail.ml.org (acroal.vip.best.com [206.86.222.181]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA22665 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:44:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (root@localhost) by acromail.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA16865 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:45:03 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:45:03 -0700 (PDT) From: "J. Weatherbee - Chief Systems Engineer" To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Stupid Routing Situation Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have a ascend pipeline 50 w/o firewall connected by a crossover cable to a freebsd machine the rest of the network is connected to a second ethernet interface. I want to firewall the machines on the second interface. This would be easy if I two networks, but I dont have enough IP's for that. It is kind of like I just want the machine to act as a bridge but I also want that bridge to be firewalled. Any suggestions, something I am missing. I have done this before with two ethernet segments but like I said these aren't 192.168 addresses and I don't have enough for two networks. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 19:47:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA22838 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:47:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whizzo.TransSys.COM (whizzo.TransSys.COM [144.202.42.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA22831 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:47:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost.transsys.com (localhost.transsys.com [127.0.0.1]) by whizzo.TransSys.COM (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA20623; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:47:03 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709120247.WAA20623@whizzo.TransSys.COM> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Branson Matheson cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Louis A. Mamakos" Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release References: In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:02:20 EDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:47:02 -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Hmmm... I for one would not want it to be the standard editor. Vi is > and always has been the standard editor for unix. Uh, you mean ed(1), right? It's about the only thing you can claim as "always" having been the standard editor on UNIX systems. It's the bootstrap tool for emacs :-) louie From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 20:01:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA23621 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:01:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from earth.mat.net (root@earth.mat.net [206.246.122.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA23611 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:01:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Journey2.mat.net (journey2.mat.net [206.246.122.116]) by earth.mat.net (8.8.7/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA26733; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:01:21 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:01:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey X-Sender: chuckr@Journey2.mat.net To: Nate Williams cc: FreeBSD-Hackers Subject: Re: network programming. In-Reply-To: <199709120242.UAA07105@rocky.mt.sri.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Nate Williams wrote: > > I have to do my very first network programming, a UDP client+server, and I > > was wondering if anyone knows of how I could go about intercepting > > something sent to a UDP socket, so I could use it for troubleshooting? > > tcpdump is your friend. :) > > > Nate Thanks Nate. Looks like just the tool. I can't believe I've gotten along all this time and never had to write a line of network code before, but that changes now .... > > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@eng.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run Journey2 and picnic, both FreeBSD (301) 220-2114 | version 3.0 current -- and great FUN! ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 20:15:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA24443 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:15:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA24414; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:15:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA00728; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:43:35 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709120243.MAA00728@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Graham Wheeler cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org, gram@gram.cdsec.com (Graham Wheeler) Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 11 Sep 1997 18:44:22 +0200." <199709111644.SAA18957@cdsec.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:43:35 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > We have a application-level gateway program which is occasionally freezing > up, in what seems to be a busy loop (if we run `top' the gateway process is > the most CPU-intensive, chewing up CPU cycles as fast as it can). We have > collected several core dumps from the gateway program when this happens. If you can simulate the situation locally, attaching to the running process with gdb and stepping through the loop would almost certainly be very instructive. > In each case, while the location in our own code varies, the stack trace > always ends in a call to getservbyname() or getservbyport(). These in turn > are calling either malloc() or free(), which in turn seem to be calling > fstat() (at least according to the stack backtrace). That's fairly odd; malloc()/free() do not call fstat(). Are you using the system malloc() or the GNU version? > Is anyone aware of a problem with the implementation of the /etc/services > lookup routines in FreeBSD 2.2.2? I will go through the library source code > myself tomorrow, and compre it with FreeBSD 2.1.0, but I am hoping that this > problem is already known, and hopefully that a fix is available. Not as far as I am aware; something like this would have been somewhat of a showstopper I would expect. If you have a copy of the CVS repository on hand extracting the changes between 2.1 and 2.2 would be very straightforward. Please keep us informed of your progress, and if there is anything more we can do to help, please ask! mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 20:26:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA25283 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:26:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA25268 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:26:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id MAA00514; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:56:12 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970912125607.49075@lemis.com> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:56:07 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Mike Smith Cc: Branson Matheson , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release References: <199709120211.MAA00617@word.smith.net.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709120211.MAA00617@word.smith.net.au>; from Mike Smith on Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 12:11:16PM +1000 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 12:11:16PM +1000, Mike Smith wrote: >> >> Hmmm... I for one would not want it to be the standard editor. Vi is >> and always has been the standard editor for unix. I think it should >> stay that way. > > We've had this argument already. You are welcome to your perspective, > but your position lost last time, and it'd lose again. And again. And again. But one day, who knows? Maybe it could win. I'm not going to venture much of an opinion in this one, but I do find -hackers a remarkably conservative mob. >> One of the first two commands on any new boxen that I >> create is: >> >> rm /usr/bin/ee ; ln -s /usr/bin/vi /usr/bin/ee > > This is somehow easier than changing the EDITOR setting in root's > profile? No, it's perverse. If you don't want ee, remove it. But don't try to make it vi. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 20:40:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA26657 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:40:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA26643 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:40:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA00861; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:06:54 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709120306.NAA00861@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Jason Thorpe cc: Mike Smith , Luigi Rizzo , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: PnP support In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 04:09:49 MST." <199709111109.EAA19340@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:06:49 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk (Man, and I thought today was going to be quiet. 8) > On Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:02:36 +1000 > Mike Smith wrote: > > > - the ISA startup code says "yup, this machine has an ISA bus", and > > creates an extent called "isa_io" and another called "isa_mem" > > ....on the PC, it makes a bit more sense to just always manage the entire > addressable range of i/o ports and memory-like space, rather than creating > an ISA-specific map, etc. Think about e.g. PCI VGA cards, and their ISA > compatibility range. Fair enough; if you only have one "I/O space", you only want one map. > > - the ESCD or ISA startup code would create an extent called "isa_irq" > > and another called "isa_drq" indicating the resources available > > to the ISA bus. > > Erm ... an extent map is a bit overboard for this, I think - for drqs, a > simple bitmap will suffice, and for irqs, and array of "share types", indexed > by irq. I was shooting for commonality of interface, ie. the extent manager can handle single-unit extents, so why write more code to handle a specific case? > > I don't think that making these extents "private" would be at all > > helpful. Having them public, and referenced by name, will make it > > easier to access them. > > Referenced by name can be problematic - On interesting machines, that > simply doesn't scale. What you really want is to use opaque tags to > reference "bus space". These tags are interpreted by machine-dependent > code (which implements an MI API), and translate into the right thing. On the contrary, names scale perfectly well. They're entirely opaque too. A probe/attach routine is handed a set of names which match the spaces it is working with, and it simply hands them off to the extent manager when it wants to allocate in those spaces. Calling them "names" may have been misleading; the intention was to imply an arbitrary and opaque token constructed in such a fashion that the space may be enumerated or queried by a caller with no connection to the creator or user(s) of the extent. > For those wondering why it's problematic, you should take a look at > an AlphaServer 8400 sometime - it can have multiple primary PCI busses, > each with its own physical address space, and each of these primary > PCI busses can host an EISA/ISA bus. NetBSD runs on this system, but > it wouldn't have been possible if we hadn't paid careful attention to > getting bus space accounting right. This is kinda obvious, really. I can't imagine how you could have got it *wrong* (and it would appear that you didn't), if you thought about it for just a brief moment. > If you could write up a concise description of what the changes are (the > last I got from you was a "well, this is basically what I did"), I'd > be happy to reconsider my position on some of those things. I'd have to reevaluate a lot of it based on this thread; I'll try to do this though. > For example, I don't think you ever mentioned the idea of a "public extent". > (And, really, what does that _mean_?) Last time I looked at the extent manager, there was no facility for tracking created extents; a caller created an extent, and was given back a handle for it. A third party could only work with that extent if the creator had passed it a copy of the handle, or advertised it in some fashion. The concept behind "public" extents was simply that extents should be (optionally) registered by name when they were created, so that they could later be referenced by name as well as by handle. In addition, I was interested in adding some more accounting information to the manager, in order to track the "owner" and "purpose" of an extent. Your beef on these was the cost of moving the fields around; I can see that making them optional would be a win, but such a centralised avertising facility would forestall the abuse of these handles I can forsee. The other major bone of contention was the concept of shareable ranges; I wanted to see if we could use these for managing things like port range ACLs. Your objections and the extra complexity involved prettymuch killed that idea though. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 20:47:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA27287 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:47:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vinyl.quickweb.com (vinyl.quickweb.com [206.222.77.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA27281 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:47:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by vinyl.quickweb.com (8.8.5/8.6.12) id XAA07764; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:47:27 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19970911234726.05622@vinyl.quickweb.com> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:47:26 -0400 From: Charlie & To: Greg Lehey Cc: Joerg Wunsch , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do you have some neat configuration files? References: <19970908153822.27586@lemis.com> <199709082133.OAA09929@usr09.primenet.com> <19970909223106.MK41707@uriah.heep.sax.de> <19970910120052.21535@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <19970910120052.21535@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Wed, Sep 10, 1997 at 12:00:52PM +0930 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, Sep 10, 1997 at 12:00:52PM +0930, Greg Lehey wrote: > On Tue, Sep 09, 1997 at 10:31:06PM +0200, J Wunsch wrote: > > As Terry Lambert wrote: > > > >>> Any other suggestions? > >> > >> fvwm95. > > > > qvwm instead. Less complex, and IMHO less error-prone than fvwm95. > > I've been setting it up for a customer's machine recently. (Looks a > > little green at some edges still.) > > Do you want to contribute a sample config? I wish I'd heard of this > earlier, and I might have had time to use it in the book, but now I'm > going to have to stick with fvwm2. It would be a really good idea to include a sample AfterStep or Window Maker start up script (well, scripts in the case of Window Maker) since they command a very high percentage of the window manager market. I have customized Window Maker scripts that I changed to work under FreeBSD if you're interested. Plus, when Apple goes more and more NeXtSteppy there's bound to be an increase in interest with the nextstep interface clones... -Mark > > Greg -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Mark Mayo mark@quickweb.com RingZero Comp. http://vinyl.quickweb.com/mark finger mark@quickweb.com for my PGP key and GCS code ------------------------------------------------------------------------ "The newest book, The Dilbert Future, took a broader view, describing how idiots will threaten every aspect of business, technology and society in the future." --Scott Adams From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 20:53:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA27850 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:53:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA27837 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:52:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA00944; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:20:57 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709120320.NAA00944@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: John-Mark Gurney cc: Mike Smith , Luigi Rizzo , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PnP support In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 05:04:07 MST." <19970911050407.06011@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:20:55 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > This is why I exhorted you to look at the extent manager in NetBSD. It > > allows you to define "extents" which are just arbitrary ranges of > > "something". I would visualise this being used as follows : ... > hehe... I was just thinking about this.. and writing a spec that was > very similar to this.. but I was also trying to extend the spec to > support the removal of resources (i.e. pccard gets removed)... You *really*really* should look at the NetBSD extent manager. It already allows for creation and deletion of extents, and basically all the minimal stuff you expect. > > I don't think that making these extents "private" would be at all > > helpful. Having them public, and referenced by name, will make it > > easier to access them. > > I agree... I assume your talking about id numbers?? No, I'm talking about some random piece of code being able to say "I want to allocate a range from x-y in the extent 'foo'", without having to be passed a handle for "foo" by the original creator. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 20:54:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA27977 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:54:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA27969 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:54:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA00969; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:22:42 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709120322.NAA00969@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Luigi Rizzo cc: gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu, mike@smith.net.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PnP support In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 13:33:33 +0200." <199709111133.NAA00141@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:22:42 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > This is why I exhorted you to look at the extent manager in NetBSD. It > > > allows you to define "extents" which are just arbitrary ranges of > > > "something". I would visualise this being used as follows : > > ok, sounds like this is what we need. As a matter of fact it should be > pretty simple code with some list manipulation stuff. Since we > already have list management macros should not be a problem... > unless of course we want to make this code memory-efficient, which > we probably should since these maps take space forever whereas > are used only when new devices are loaded/unloaded. Ask Jason just how kick-ass the extent manager is. It's *fast*, which isn't an issue from our POV really, but it also *works*, which is the whole point behind using it rather than reinventing our own wheel. > > > I don't think that making these extents "private" would be at all > > > helpful. Having them public, and referenced by name, will make it > > > easier to access them. > > this is more related to religion :) True. > I feel much more comfortable with opaque objects since there is > less risk that at some point someone exploits some features on the > internals of the data structures thus effectively freezing them. Names are very opaque 8) > As an example of the opposite approach, Voxware exports the structure > of DMA buffers to the application resulting in some restrictions > on the acceptable blocksizes (powers of 2) etc. *bleagh* mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 21:03:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA28566 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:03:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr03.primenet.com (tlambert@usr03.primenet.com [206.165.6.203]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA28554 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:03:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr03.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA13813; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:02:57 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709120402.VAA13813@usr03.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? To: dgy@rtd.com (Don Yuniskis) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 04:02:56 +0000 (GMT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199709120100.SAA16409@seagull.rtd.com> from "Don Yuniskis" at Sep 11, 97 06:00:31 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Perhaps I read more into Peter's comments than he intended *but* I > was under the assumption that his (perhaps too subtle?) statement > that "running something completely orthogonal to the kernel" was > intended to imply that there was *no* resource sharing (hence > magically waving aside the priority inversion issues :>)? If > *not*, then I believe the "processor reserves" approach would need > to be more integrated into the kernel to make those claims... Yes. This was clarified after the posting to which you are responding; you are correct that he meant completely orthoganal scheduling. This will never fly, of course, since it means that the overall system performance will be degraded in the general case. There is also the issue of whether or not "1 quantum every n quanta" is sufficient for most RT tasks. For the original poster's 1000Hz requirement, it's not. I realize that it *is* generally useful in terms of actually being an HRT soloution, but without an application, the degradation of the general system is too high a penalty to pay for something which might never see use because of the clock resoloution. Cranking up the Hz will solve that problem, but add to the issue of overhead by increasing by a factor of 10 the context switch overhead. Not good. 8-(. > > If you had (1) kernel preemption, and (2) a reschedulable interval > > based one-shot timer, you would have the basis of a hard timing > > constraint for when you could begin some act. That leaves issues > > I think the one-shot can be worked around (assuming the system tick > is at a frequency "high enough for the timeliness constraints of the > application") since you could just ensure the events are scheduled > prior to the tick *before* the deadline, etc. (i.e. err on the > earlier side) Maybe if it buzzed to the the actual start time. It is just as bad to grab before the bottle as after, in the bottling plant example. The real bitch with deadlining is that you have to know how long the operation will take to complete, within the hard resoloution, before you start the operation to complete *at* the deadline. It's not just >= for the bounds function, it's a hyperbolic tangent. The max time required to preempt a resource (which resolves the inversion problem -- lending is an SRT soloution, unless you account for the time it takes an inverted request to completion at the lent priority) defines your "hardness" function. > > of priority inversion of shared resources, but that handleable > > through (a) lending, and (b) resource preeemption. The other > > Yikes, Terry... you make it sound like it's *trivial*!! :> > ("I'll expect those changes on my desk before 5PM...") It's not trivial, but it *is* a systems engineering problem that is amenable to a systems engineering soloution. And a large part of the work is going to be "free" in any case, with other necessary work. Maybe it's my view of the other necessary work that's different? Topologically, the issue of SMP kernel reentrancy on an interrupt or a fault (ie: event based entry rather than user requested entry) is identical to the soloution required for the general case of kernel preemption. Topologically, the issues of kernel threading are identical to the issues of kernel reentrancy via user request. The only real difference is whether or not the synchronization primitive needs to operate across multiple CPU's (mutex) or not (semaphore). It remains to be able to tie a kernel thread RT based preferential wakeup to a timer event of subquanta resoloution. The system quantum clock need not change, and in fact the audio and profiling stuff that need the fast clock code could be relaces with the same reschedulable one-shot you would use to do this. In the grand scheme of things, this type of thing is required to be able to permit concurrent device initialization, and to get rid of the buzz loops used to satisfy timing constraints for unfifo'ed devices. Like a floppy tape driver that doesn't need a user space program at a pseudo RT priority in order to not desynchronize the requests, or an LED toggle on the keyboard requiring a delay in keyboard processing to safely turn the channel around without locking the keyboard controller up. Etc.. Ideally, all buzz loops of greater than some tiny value would become one-shots. The trick here is that the one-shot code must have a deterministic cycle count so it can remove its own time from the requested intervals between events. A repeating time of any desired frequency can be had by rescheduling the one-shot in the call-out. For 486's the cycle count is harder. For 586's and above, you can read the cycle counter on the CPU. That's what it's there for: RTOS's. It's all related. It's a systems engineering problem. A good RT implementation falls out of the combination of a good kernel threading implementation and an SMP implementation, and a seperation into preferential scheduling queues (which truly *is* trivial, and itself will fall out of a good CPU affinity mechanism for SMP). The only new thing you do to the kernel is subsystem latency tweaks to decrease the time threshold over which the RT implementation is HRT. After all is said and done, the only really complicated work is figuring back from the deadline for the process itself -- and for RT processes, these are things that have to be done by RT programmers anyway, no matter what the underlying system implementation. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 21:07:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA28828 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:07:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA28810 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:07:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA01011; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:35:30 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709120335.NAA01011@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Luigi Rizzo cc: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith), gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu, perhaps@yes.no, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: PnP support In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:24:55 +0200." <199709111524.RAA00618@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:35:29 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Let me edit this slightly... > > > The most succinct extract I have on the "new" model reads : > > > > ---8<---snip---8<--- > > > > - gather all the information : > > PCI probe > > i.e. trust what the PCI bios says ? Yes. > > PnP probe > > get ISA config (compiled in, datafile, etc.) > > this means probe the isa devices and trust what the config info > say. At this point we have already effectively allocated 'extents' > for legacy ISA devices. No, this means read the compiled in hints for brute-force ISA probes. In the gather phase, we do *nothing* with the hardware that might cause any sort of confusion. PCI probe : get configuration from PCI BIOS. PnP probe : select all PnP devices, read config data, take off the bus. ISA probe : read compiled-in hints table > > get PCI/PnP identifier tables (compiled in, bootloader, etc.) > > this looks like a second-level probe for these devices: those not No. This is "read the tables that map PCI/PnP vendor/device numbers to driver names". Nothing more. > recognised by PCI/PnP drivers will be used as ISA ones ? Wouldn't > it make more sense to merge this step with the PCI and PnP probe, > so that devices recognized as PCI/PnP can be left with some degree > of freedom in reallocating resources, whereas others get fixed > resources ? We haven't touched resource allocation at this point. > Also, while we are on the subject: some legacy ISA device also have > software-configurable resources such as DMA or IRQ channels. methods > are device-specific (pre-PnP). In the case of the 3c509, for example, you have a "pseudo-PnP" probe for it which would run just after the "real" PnP probe. As long as the "smart" probe can provide the basic information required to configure the hardware and select a driver, it qualifies as PnP. > In other words, in this first 'probe' phase we end up with some > resources which are bound to a given value, and other which might > be assigned from a set of alternatives. No. We end up with a list of available resources (produced by the bus code) and a list of potential requirements (established by the gather process). > ALLOCATE: > Before going on with the attach, we have to take a decision among > the available options and then just go on with the attach routines, > marking those devices which could not be allocated the requested > resources ? Allocation occurs in stages, based on presence and preference. For PCI devices, the device is alreay present by virtue of configuration by the PCI BIOS, and so resources are directly allocated. PnP devices have preferences, and thus resources are allocated to them based on the "most preferable" selection. "most preferable" can be computed from the space left after PCI allocation, and by (where possible) avoiding resources requested by other (ISA) probes. Note that the PnP spec allows us to guarantee that we will not be sitting down on top of a non-PnP ISA device's I/O space, so we don't have to worry about avoiding ranges requested by ISA probes. > > - attach PCI devices > > I/O ports and IRQs are assigned by the PCI rules. > > - attach PnP devices > > IRQs are taken from the free pool left after PCI assignment and > > those marked for 'legacy' use. I/O ports are probed as per the > > PnP spec. > > - walk ISA config data, probe possible devices > > We know which IRQ and I/O resources are still available, > > we can hunt for devices that match the gaps. > > here if some attach fails we can free the resources which have been > allocated for them, and possibly go back to ALLOCATE: if any device was > left out ? There should be no need for this; resources would only be considered to have been allocated if the attach succeeded. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 21:13:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA29181 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:13:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cypher.net (black@zen.pratt.edu [205.232.115.155]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA29170 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:13:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from black@localhost) by cypher.net (8.8.7/8.7.1) id AAA21696; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:19:06 -0400 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:19:05 -0400 (EDT) From: Ben Black To: "J. Weatherbee - Chief Systems Engineer" cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Stupid Routing Situation In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk number the link between the pipeline and the firewall using rfc 1918 addresses. as an intermediate hop, they don't need to be advertised. the ascend accepts traffic for your routable network and passes traffic over to the firewall. On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, J. Weatherbee - Chief Systems Engineer wrote: > > > I have a ascend pipeline 50 w/o firewall connected by a crossover cable to > a freebsd machine the rest of the network is connected to a second > ethernet interface. I want to firewall the machines on the second > interface. This would be easy if I two networks, but I dont have enough > IP's for that. It is kind of like I just want the machine to act as a > bridge but I also want that bridge to be firewalled. Any suggestions, > something I am missing. I have done this before with two ethernet segments > but like I said these aren't 192.168 addresses and I don't have enough for > two networks. > > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 21:48:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA01521 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:48:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from austin.polstra.com (austin.polstra.com [206.213.73.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA01450 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:48:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from austin.polstra.com (jdp@localhost) by austin.polstra.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA13515; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:47:52 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709120447.VAA13515@austin.polstra.com> To: julian@whistle.com Subject: Re: AMD broken in 2.2.2? In-Reply-To: <34188660.1CFBAE39@whistle.com> References: <34188660.1CFBAE39@whistle.com> Organization: Polstra & Co., Seattle, WA Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:47:52 -0700 From: John Polstra Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In article <34188660.1CFBAE39@whistle.com>, Julian Elischer wrote: > If I just turn on amd in rc.conf > and use the standard settings, > I get the following: > > # ls /host/phaser3/data > # tail /var/log/messages > [old stuff] > Sep 11 16:54:40 phaser3 amd.hold[4252]: NIS domain name is not set. NIS > ignored > Sep 11 16:55:36 phaser3 amd.hold[4550]: /net/phaser3/data: mount: Bad > address I think it was in fact broken in 2.2.2-RELEASE. I had the same symptoms as you. I replaced the amd executable with one from 2.2-STABLE and the problems went away. John -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-knowledge is always bad news." -- John Barth From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 22:04:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA02803 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:04:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA02792 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:04:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA01173; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:32:30 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709120432.OAA01173@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Terry Lambert cc: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo), mike@smith.net.au, gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu, perhaps@yes.no, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PnP support In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:15:32 GMT." <199709111815.LAA24444@usr07.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:32:28 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Also, while we are on the subject: some legacy ISA device also have > > software-configurable resources such as DMA or IRQ channels. methods > > are device-specific (pre-PnP). > > This is a hard problem. > > The reason that this is a hard problem is that dynamic reconfiguration > of dynamically-reconfigurable-but-not-PnP hardware makes it difficult > for FreeBSD to coexist with other OS's, which would not know about > these devices ability to move around. This is actually such a trivial issue that I don't consider it worth worrying about. If you have a particular OS in mind, and a specific test case to demonstrate your problem, a workaround might be in order. > Another issue is that the static state for allowable configurations > must be kept in the device driver, and it makes the device drivers > just that much less general. For example, the soft configuration > of most NE2000 clone cards varies from vendor to vendor. That's > a lot of data. These configurations are generally read from external EEPROMs on device reset. Rebooting involves such a reset, and it is unlikely that FreeBSD will be rewriting said EEPROMs in the near future. > > > I think it's important to leave the 'legacy' devices until _last_, as > > > this prevents a PnP device being accidentally recognised as a 'legacy' > > > device. > > > > Right. > > > > Comments ? > > You probe up the hierarchy, and attach down. Pretty simple. No. You probe from least intrusive to most intrusive, and use the lesser intrusive probes to eliminate places for sticking your fingers. > Note: You are screwed in this case if you do not have a PnP BIOS > that knows about legacy hardware for which the OS has no drivers; > to be able to deal with this issue, you need a "BIOS config" in your > PnP OS. This is where the ECSD stuff comes into play on modern systems. I am trying to world as we speak so that I can start using Jonathan's vm86 BIOS call support to talk to this. > I *highly* recommend that anyone coding on this obtain a recent > copy of the PnP specification, and consider these issues in their > design. As was pointed out by someone else, if you don't, it will > have to be rewritten later, and the new code, if marginally more > functional, will act as a speed-bump, impeding geting it right. I will simply add : read the spec many times. It's confusing and poorly structured, but you will want to actually have a _feel_ for what is going on, as well as just knowing which page the structure definitions are on. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 22:11:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA03299 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:11:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA03282 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:11:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA01205; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:39:18 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709120439.OAA01205@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Terry Lambert cc: gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, mike@smith.net.au, perhaps@yes.no, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PnP support In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:45:48 GMT." <199709112245.PAA17225@usr03.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:39:15 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I was actually thinking about a "dummy" driver that pretended to be > a device driver for the devices. This would actually allow a boot -c > (if it could edit the irq/io/base) to be used to configure dummy > devices into the conflict space so that nothing gets located on top > of them. See the PnP spec, section 4.3 on the I/O Range Check register for the major solution to this problem. See your BIOS for the IRQ/DRQ allocation configuration options (ISA/PnP toggle). The only losing case now is a system with no ECSD support, ie. "legacy" hardware. A userconfig-level "list of available IRQ/DRQ" option sounds pretty good here. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 22:13:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA03480 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:13:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA03468 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:13:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA01227 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:41:27 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709120441.OAA01227@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PnP support In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:58:38 MST." <19970911215838.24994@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:41:25 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > You *really*really* should look at the NetBSD extent manager. It > > already allows for creation and deletion of extents, and basically all > > the minimal stuff you expect. > > ok.. I'll take a look at it... it's nice that freefall has a copy of > the NetBSD tree... but I noticed that the tree in /f/NetBSD is just > a source copy.. is there another place on freefall (or another location) > that I can browse the cvs repository? mainly for repository logs.. The NetBSD repo is not publically available. Make of that what you will. I actually gave up working on NetBSD due to the difficulty of obtaining a usable copy of the source tree, which was somewhat disappointing. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 22:18:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA03988 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:18:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from misery.sdf.com (misery.sdf.com [204.244.210.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA03974 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:18:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tom by misery.sdf.com with smtp (Exim 1.62 #1) id 0x9O2g-0001UD-00; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:13:18 -0700 Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:13:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom To: "J. Weatherbee - Chief Systems Engineer" cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Stupid Routing Situation In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, J. Weatherbee - Chief Systems Engineer wrote: > I have a ascend pipeline 50 w/o firewall connected by a crossover cable to > a freebsd machine the rest of the network is connected to a second > ethernet interface. I want to firewall the machines on the second > interface. This would be easy if I two networks, but I dont have enough > IP's for that. It is kind of like I just want the machine to act as a > bridge but I also want that bridge to be firewalled. Any suggestions, > something I am missing. I have done this before with two ethernet segments > but like I said these aren't 192.168 addresses and I don't have enough for > two networks. How many addresses do you have? A 255.255.255.252 subnet will do fine for the P50 to server segment, since you only have two devices on it. Whatever you have left can be used on the other side. I've done this quite a few times. Tom From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 22:49:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA05876 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:49:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr08.primenet.com (tlambert@usr08.primenet.com [206.165.6.208]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA05869 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:49:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA09342; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:49:01 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709120549.WAA09342@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: PnP support To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:49:01 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, mike@smith.net.au, gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu, perhaps@yes.no, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709120432.OAA01173@word.smith.net.au> from "Mike Smith" at Sep 12, 97 02:32:28 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > The reason that this is a hard problem is that dynamic reconfiguration > > of dynamically-reconfigurable-but-not-PnP hardware makes it difficult > > for FreeBSD to coexist with other OS's, which would not know about > > these devices ability to move around. > > This is actually such a trivial issue that I don't consider it worth > worrying about. If you have a particular OS in mind, and a specific > test case to demonstrate your problem, a workaround might be in order. He was talking about reating such hardware as an extension within the PnP framework: ie: relocate anything that can be relocated, not just anything that can be relocated via PnP. A specific example might be a AE-3 ethernet card and DOS. Change the IRQ on the card, and when DOS comes up, the driver load in the AUTOEXEC.BAT has the wrong IRQ parameter. > These configurations are generally read from external EEPROMs on device > reset. Rebooting involves such a reset, and it is unlikely that > FreeBSD will be rewriting said EEPROMs in the near future. Actually, that's exactly what were were talking about when we started talking about relocating non-PnP soft configurable devices. > > You probe up the hierarchy, and attach down. Pretty simple. > > No. You probe from least intrusive to most intrusive, and use the > lesser intrusive probes to eliminate places for sticking your fingers. If you look at the hierarchy I denoted in my previous posting (it looked like a directory tree), you'll see that you are saying the exact sam thing I just said. 8-). [ ... ] > This is where the ECSD stuff comes into play on modern systems. I am > trying to world as we speak so that I can start using Jonathan's vm86 > BIOS call support to talk to this. Cool. This is exactly the soloution I think is called for. Let me know how it goes; if you have specific changes you want tested, I can probably help out. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 22:54:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA06376 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:54:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sendero-ppp.i-connect.net (sendero-ppp.i-Connect.Net [206.190.143.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA06370 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:54:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 22531 invoked by uid 1000); 12 Sep 1997 05:54:43 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.2-alpha [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:54:43 -0700 (PDT) Organization: Atlas Telecom From: Simon Shapiro To: Branson Matheson Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi Branson Matheson; On 11-Sep-97 you wrote: ... > Hmmm... I for one would not want it to be the standard editor. Vi is > and always has been the standard editor for unix. I think it should > stay that way. One of the first two commands on any new boxen that I > create is: I agree with your opinion, but sorry to disagree on vi; It is not the standard Unix(tm) editor. I worked on unix for almost a decade before this new fangled vi editor even showed up :-) the standard Unix editor is ed. This may be different in bsd. > rm /usr/bin/ee ; ln -s /usr/bin/vi /usr/bin/ee What for? export EDITOR=vi (setenv editor vi) will do the same without killing things. --- Sincerely Yours, (Sent on 11-Sep-97, 22:37:23 by XF-Mail) Simon Shapiro Atlas Telecom Senior Architect 14355 SW Allen Blvd., Suite 130 Beaverton OR 97005 Shimon@i-Connect.Net Voice: 503.643.5559, Emergency: 503.799.2313 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 22:54:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA06419 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:54:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from murkwood.gaffaneys.com (dialup4.gaffaneys.com [208.155.161.54]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA06410 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:54:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from zach@localhost) by murkwood.gaffaneys.com (8.8.7/8.8.6) id AAA02439; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:54:13 -0500 (CDT) From: Zach Heilig Message-ID: <19970912005412.37502@gaffaneys.com> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:54:12 -0500 To: The Classiest Man Alive Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release References: <8943.874025373@time.cdrom.com> <3.0.3.32.19970911213146.009c5680@cybercom.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81 In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.19970911213146.009c5680@cybercom.net>; from The Classiest Man Alive on Thu, Sep 11, 1997 at 09:31:46PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, Sep 11, 1997 at 09:31:46PM -0400, The Classiest Man Alive wrote: > Perhaps more to the point, no one has actually commented on the new version > of Zile. I know how resistant programmers can be to change something as > sacred as an editor, but I don't think a quick evaluation/test of the new > editor would kill anybody. Ok, I'll bite. Here is what I came up with after a few minutes of checking it out: (mostly surprises, unfortunately; but this is what you wanted, right?)... If you set the Alt- key to set bit 7, zile ignores that, and outputs \37777777770 for Alt-X (for example). This is the most annoying feature at the moment. You should check for the 'km' feature in the termcap (like emacs), and allow an override; see the 'set-input-mode' function for emacs. The mini-help buffer lists C-x C-q as the quit zile command. All that really succeeds in doing is write-protecting the current buffer. :-) There are a few missing key-strokes (M-w, M-~, M-u are the ones I noticed), and SPACE should be mostly (but not quite) equivalent to TAB on the M-x line. -- Zach Heilig From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 23:00:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA06804 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:00:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nemesis.idirect.com (root@nemesis.idirect.com [207.136.80.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA06787; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:00:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from thor.idirect.com (jlixfeld@thor.idirect.com [207.136.80.105]) by nemesis.idirect.com (8.8.5/8.8.4) with SMTP id CAA02337; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:00:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (jlixfeld@localhost) by thor.idirect.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id CAA02908; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:00:04 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: thor.idirect.com: jlixfeld owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:00:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Jason Lixfeld Reply-To: Jason Lixfeld To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Installing a new disk.. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hey! I'm a devoted Linux user (due to an already existing Linux network), but I am discovering very quickly some of Linux' limitations which FreeBSD seems to handle better, or period! I'm playing with a new 4 machine proxy concept which will hopefully (depending on the support I get) consist of one Master Proxy machine, and 3 diskless* proxy slaves (* = diskless except for either 2 x 2.5GB or 1 x 5GB local cache drive(s)). Currently, I am still in the process of setting up the master machine. I have the system installed (It was not the first one I have installed, so that went off without a hitch), however in attempting to add a second drive, I am getting somewhat confused as to the order in which to run certain commands to create & newfs two partitions on the cache drives. After reading much documentation, I decided to take the easy way out, and re-run /stand/sysinstall to try to partition the disk. Here is what I did: 0. /stand/sysinstall 1. Selected option 7 2. Selected option 2 3. Selected wd2 4. (C)reated slice using all space on disk (used 165 partition type) 5. (W)rote changes 6. (N)o boot manager 7. "Wrote FDISK partition information out successfully." 8. (Q)uit back to "Choose Custom Installation Options" 9. Selected option 3 10. (C)reated wd2s1e partition. 11. Selected (F)ile system 12. Selected /mnt2 as mount point 13. Repeated steps 10 - 12 for wd2s1f partition (mounted on /mnt3). 14. (W)rote the changes Received the following error for each partition: Error mounting /dev/wd2s1e on /mnt2 : Invalid argument Error mounting /dev/wd2s1e on /mnt3 : Invalid argument What am I doing wrong?! Thanks in advance, Jason Lixfeld From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 23:03:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA07116 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:03:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA07110 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:03:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA07927; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:03:01 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:03:01 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709120603.AAA07927@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: John-Mark Gurney Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: PnP support In-Reply-To: <19970911215838.24994@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> References: <19970911050407.06011@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> <199709120320.NAA00944@word.smith.net.au> <19970911215838.24994@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > You *really*really* should look at the NetBSD extent manager. It > > already allows for creation and deletion of extents, and basically all > > the minimal stuff you expect. > > ok.. I'll take a look at it... it's nice that freefall has a copy of > the NetBSD tree... but I noticed that the tree in /f/NetBSD is just > a source copy.. is there another place on freefall (or another location) > that I can browse the cvs repository? mainly for repository logs.. The NetBSD folks don't allow access to their repository. Last I heard, it was both politically and legally a problem to do that, given that they're tree is (was?) still based on the old 4.4BSD Lite code, which is arguably 'tainted'. They've since converted their releases to use Lite2, but by making their CVS tree public it could cause problems. I can't speak with any authority though, since I lost access to the NetBSD CVS tree around version 0.8, which was before FreeBSD 1.0 was released. :) :) :) Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 23:05:18 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA07368 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:05:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nemesis.idirect.com (root@nemesis.idirect.com [207.136.80.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA07362; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:05:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from thor.idirect.com (jlixfeld@thor.idirect.com [207.136.80.105]) by nemesis.idirect.com (8.8.5/8.8.4) with SMTP id CAA17243; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:05:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (jlixfeld@localhost) by thor.idirect.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id CAA04455; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:05:10 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: thor.idirect.com: jlixfeld owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:05:10 -0400 (EDT) From: Jason Lixfeld To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: PCI DLink DFE500-TX 10/100MB DEC Tulip 21140AE REV2-C Chipset Ethernet Card Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Is their support for this card? It did not have the drivers for it when I attempted to use this card when doing an FTP install. I used a 3Com 3C509B 10MB ISA. BSD/OS and Linux both had problems or driver incompatibilities when 21140AC REV1-B updated to 21140AE REV2-C. I'm wondering if FreeBSD 2.2.2 has the same incompatibility, and is their a driver that will support the new chipset, and where do I find it to compile it into a new kernel?! Thanks in Advance, Jason Lixfeld From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 23:18:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA08083 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:18:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from thor.i-connect.net (qmailr@thor.i-Connect.Net [206.190.143.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA08073 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:18:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 1688 invoked by uid 4028); 12 Sep 1997 06:18:00 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 0.5-alpha [p0] on Linux Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:03:11 -0700 (PDT) From: ron@cts.com To: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: (former?) Pentium secrets Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have heard the stories about Intel putting special, unpublished instructions into the Pentium for (guess who?) our buddies at MS (here I go again:-) I understand that this information became available to the rest of the software community later (hence the microtime capability). Can anyone tell me where I can obtain this info? Ron McDaniels ---------------------------------- E-Mail: ron@cts.com Date: 09/11/97 Time: 23:03:11 This message was sent by XF-Mail ---------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 23:24:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA08484 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:24:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA08477 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:24:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA00582; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:22:55 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:22:55 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Tom cc: "J. Weatherbee - Chief Systems Engineer" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Stupid Routing Situation In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Can you give me an example by possibly sending out netstat -r and ifconfig -a i have a 255.255.255.192 maybye I want to have like 8 computers on the segment between firewall and router (unprotected) and the others 56 on the second segment (protected), I don't understand why I am so confused as to how to do this, it is kind of nonstandard --- someone mentioned using rfc 1918 addresses for the firewall interface and router but I am pretty sure my router must use a "real" ip. On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Tom wrote: > > On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, J. Weatherbee - Chief Systems Engineer wrote: > > > I have a ascend pipeline 50 w/o firewall connected by a crossover cable to > > a freebsd machine the rest of the network is connected to a second > > ethernet interface. I want to firewall the machines on the second > > interface. This would be easy if I two networks, but I dont have enough > > IP's for that. It is kind of like I just want the machine to act as a > > bridge but I also want that bridge to be firewalled. Any suggestions, > > something I am missing. I have done this before with two ethernet segments > > but like I said these aren't 192.168 addresses and I don't have enough for > > two networks. > > How many addresses do you have? A 255.255.255.252 subnet will do fine > for the P50 to server segment, since you only have two devices on it. > Whatever you have left can be used on the other side. I've done this > quite a few times. > > Tom > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 23:27:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA08639 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:27:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA08634; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:27:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA00589; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:25:55 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:25:55 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: "Jay D. Nelson" cc: Greg Lehey , FreeBSD Questions , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I started my machine up fine with the freebsd boot disk to change a few things it loaded as normal --- but my floppy has never worked from within freebsd, I've reported it a few times but people seem to think it is just me. On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Jay D. Nelson wrote: > Sorry, I can't offer any help with software bugs. I've used an > odd-ball assortment of floppies since 2.0 with less than 5% failure. I > rarely bother to reformat. I dd the image to /dev/fd0 and am as happy > as a pig in a mud hole. I'm using Mitsumis now, but have used Teacs and > Sonys equally well. If there's a bug, I haven't seen it. > > I would suspect the ability of a MicroS**t product to do anything > rational with questionable media. Maybe the dos program (rawrite?) > needs to make up for Redmond's short comings? > > -- Jay > > On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Greg Lehey wrote: > > > I've seen a lot of reports recently about problems with floppies under > > FreeBSD. Now I can understand a lot of that: floppies must be the > > most unreliable data storage medium I can think of, not to mention the > > most expensive per byte. But I'm getting the feeling that there is > > more to it than that, that possibly there's a bug in the floppy driver > > and that we're blaming it on the inherent unreliability of the medium. > > > > I'm looking for indications which would point towards the driver. One > > of these might be: > > > > 1. Floppy formatted under on the same machine. > > 2. FreeBSD runs into hardware problems with the floppy (typically > > things like checksum errors). > > 3. can read the entire floppy with no trouble. > > > > If you can give me hard evidence of such occurrences, I'd like to hear > > from you. I know that plenty of people can tell me that they've had > > occurrences of (2), maybe in conjunction with (1), but unless you can > > prove (3) as well, I don't want to hear from you. > > > > In addition, if you have any other evidence I haven't thought of which > > would also point to an error in the floppy driver, please contact me. > > > > Greg > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 23:32:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA09024 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:32:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from palrel3.hp.com (palrel3.hp.com [156.153.255.219]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA09019 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:32:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from postbox.india.hp.com (postbox.india.hp.com [15.10.45.1]) by palrel3.hp.com (8.8.5/8.8.5tis) with ESMTP id XAA13197; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:32:22 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709120632.XAA13197@palrel3.hp.com> Received: from localhost by postbox.india.hp.com with ESMTP (1.39.111.2/16.2) id AA161665724; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:58:44 +0530 To: grog@lemis.com Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Floppy trouble contd. Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:58:43 +0530 From: A Joseph Koshy Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk gl> most expensive per byte. But I'm getting the feeling that there is gl> more to it than that, that possibly there's a bug in the floppy driver gl> and that we're blaming it on the inherent unreliability of the medium. gl> 1. Floppy formatted under on the same machine. gl> 2. FreeBSD runs into hardware problems with the floppy (typically gl> things like checksum errors). gl> 3. can read the entire floppy with no trouble. I've seen (1), (2), and (3). After a (2), doing a format using the freebsd tools sometimes helps, but see below. I've also seen that formatting 3-4 times under FreeBSD (fdwrite or fdformat) causes the floppy to become unuseable, even under DOS. I've seen these on just too many floppies, new, used, of various brands, to dismiss it as due to the unreliability of the medium. Koshy My Personal Opinions Only. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 23:39:30 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA09413 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:39:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA09390; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:39:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id QAA01783; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:09:11 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970912160911.30658@lemis.com> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:09:11 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" Cc: "Jay D. Nelson" , FreeBSD Questions , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: ; from Jamil J. Weatherbee on Thu, Sep 11, 1997 at 11:25:55PM -0700 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, Sep 11, 1997 at 11:25:55PM -0700, Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > > > I started my machine up fine with the freebsd boot disk to change a few > things it loaded as normal --- but my floppy has never worked from within > freebsd, I've reported it a few times but people seem to think it is just > me. It would help if you could answer: >>> 1. Floppy formatted under on the same >>> machine. Correct? Which OS? >>> 2. FreeBSD runs into hardware problems with the floppy (typically >>> things like checksum errors). What errors did you get? >>> 3. can read the entire floppy with no trouble. How did you read the entire floppy? Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 23:44:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA09787 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:44:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA09689 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:42:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id GAA02186; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:30:16 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199709120430.GAA02186@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: PnP support To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:30:16 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: mike@smith.net.au, gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu, perhaps@yes.no, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709120335.NAA01011@word.smith.net.au> from "Mike Smith" at Sep 12, 97 01:35:10 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Yes. > > > > PnP probe > > > get ISA config (compiled in, datafile, etc.) > > > > this means probe the isa devices and trust what the config info > > say. At this point we have already effectively allocated 'extents' > > for legacy ISA devices. > > No, this means read the compiled in hints for brute-force ISA probes. not sure. take the case of GENERIC, where all sort of hardware is compiled in, possibly at conflicting addresses, and no actual conflicts are present since not all devices are really present. How do you tell without probing ? > In the gather phase, we do *nothing* with the hardware that might cause > any sort of confusion. ... > > Also, while we are on the subject: some legacy ISA device also have > > software-configurable resources such as DMA or IRQ channels. methods > > are device-specific (pre-PnP). > > In the case of the 3c509, for example, you have a "pseudo-PnP" probe > for it which would run just after the "real" PnP probe. As long as the > "smart" probe can provide the basic information required to configure > the hardware and select a driver, it qualifies as PnP. ok, fine. Luigi From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 23:44:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA09858 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:44:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au [129.78.129.109]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA09845 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:44:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dawes@localhost) by rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.2) id QAA06659; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:44:19 +1000 (EST) Message-ID: <19970912164418.24896@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:44:18 +1000 From: David Dawes To: Nate Williams Cc: Terry Lambert , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes References: <199709092221.QAA26290@rocky.mt.sri.com> <199709092247.PAA01710@usr02.primenet.com> <19970910145647.33919@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> <199709101516.JAA29308@rocky.mt.sri.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709101516.JAA29308@rocky.mt.sri.com>; from Nate Williams on Wed, Sep 10, 1997 at 09:16:37AM -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, Sep 10, 1997 at 09:16:37AM -0600, Nate Williams wrote: >> >> > > Warning: Action not found : insert-selection, kill-selection >> > >> It is complaining about unknown actions, which to me means a problem >> with the RHS of a translation, not a problem with unknown keysyms on >> the LHS. > >OK so far. > >> the native FreeBSD 4.02b7 version), and my guess is that there is an >> old Netscape app-defaults installed which refers to actions which don't >> exist (any more) (or something similar in a .Xdefaults file). > >I found some stuff in my .Xdefaults file that I just removed. It came >from my days at school, and I never thought to look there. > >> I've tested this theory by making the following change to Netscape.ad, >> and installing it in my app-defaults directory. I then get the following >> warning message 4 times: > >Netscape.ad already has kill-selection and insert-selection, so you >probably didn't need to make any changes. In any case, I've removed the >lines from my .Xdefaults file, and if I quit getting these errors I'll >be forever in your debt. :) :) ;) The Netscape.ad I have (the one that comes with 4.02b7) doesn't have any references to kill-selection or insert-selection, so perhaps that's your problem (an old Netscape.ad)? The first line of the file I has is: ! Netscape.ad --- app-defaults file for Netscape 4.02b7. David From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 23:47:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA10020 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:47:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA10012 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:47:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA01493; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:14:15 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709120614.QAA01493@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Luigi Rizzo cc: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith), gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu, perhaps@yes.no, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PnP support In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:30:16 +0200." <199709120430.GAA02186@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:14:12 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > PnP probe > > > > get ISA config (compiled in, datafile, etc.) > > > > > > this means probe the isa devices and trust what the config info > > > say. At this point we have already effectively allocated 'extents' > > > for legacy ISA devices. > > > > No, this means read the compiled in hints for brute-force ISA probes. > > not sure. take the case of GENERIC, where all sort of hardware is > compiled in, possibly at conflicting addresses, and no actual conflicts > are present since not all devices are really present. How do you tell > without probing ? OK, I'm not getting across. You *don't*care* in the gather phase. All you are doing is making a list of where things might be. At some point in the boot phase, you will have all of the information, but have done nothing more intrusive than talk to the PCI BIOS and run a PnP scan. Why do this? Because before we plan anything, we want to know as much as possible. This is also the ideal point for user intervention, where the user can be presented with as much information as possible, but before you have closed any doors to them. Your question about "stuff compiled in" in GENERIC is a non-issue in that the config simply specifies a list of drivers to form part of the initial kernel load, and a set of hints to those drivers in the ISA case. An ISA driver probe routine is then called by the ISA bus code once for each hint, and if the probe passes is then attached. By the stage this is invoked, you have already given up resources > > In the gather phase, we do *nothing* with the hardware that might cause > > any sort of confusion. > > .... > > > > Also, while we are on the subject: some legacy ISA device also have > > > software-configurable resources such as DMA or IRQ channels. methods > > > are device-specific (pre-PnP). > > > > In the case of the 3c509, for example, you have a "pseudo-PnP" probe > > for it which would run just after the "real" PnP probe. As long as the > > "smart" probe can provide the basic information required to configure > > the hardware and select a driver, it qualifies as PnP. > > ok, fine. > > Luigi > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 23:51:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA10217 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:51:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA10206; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:50:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA00769; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:49:40 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:49:40 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Greg Lehey cc: "Jay D. Nelson" , FreeBSD Questions , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: <19970912160911.30658@lemis.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Greg Lehey wrote: > On Thu, Sep 11, 1997 at 11:25:55PM -0700, Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > > > > > > I started my machine up fine with the freebsd boot disk to change a few > > things it loaded as normal --- but my floppy has never worked from within > > freebsd, I've reported it a few times but people seem to think it is just > > me. > > It would help if you could answer: > > >>> 1. Floppy formatted under on the same > >>> machine. > linux, dos, > >>> 2. FreeBSD runs into hardware problems with the floppy (typically > >>> things like checksum errors). hard error reading fsbn xx etc. ST0 44 ST1 20 ST2 20 > > What errors did you get? > > >>> 3. can read the entire floppy with no trouble. > the bios, or dos, linux > How did you read the entire floppy? > > Greg > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Sep 11 23:53:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA10427 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:53:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA10419 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:53:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA01532 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:22:00 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709120622.QAA01532@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PnP support In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:49:01 GMT." <199709120549.WAA09342@usr08.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:21:58 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk (cc: trimmed) > > > The reason that this is a hard problem is that dynamic reconfiguration > > > of dynamically-reconfigurable-but-not-PnP hardware makes it difficult > > > for FreeBSD to coexist with other OS's, which would not know about > > > these devices ability to move around. > > > > This is actually such a trivial issue that I don't consider it worth > > worrying about. If you have a particular OS in mind, and a specific > > test case to demonstrate your problem, a workaround might be in order. > > He was talking about reating such hardware as an extension within > the PnP framework: ie: relocate anything that can be relocated, > not just anything that can be relocated via PnP. That's not an issue unless you are making permanent changes. > A specific example might be a AE-3 ethernet card and DOS. Change > the IRQ on the card, and when DOS comes up, the driver load in the > AUTOEXEC.BAT has the wrong IRQ parameter. Really? Who does Artisoft's hardware these days? They shouldn't. Is the AE-3 another 8390x design, like the AE-2? If so, and unless they have their own ISA interface, you can only reconfigure the hardware by munging the onboard EEPROM, not something that's likely to happen with FreeBSD. (Especially as you have to reset the device to force it to reload). Also, if the card can be soft-set on the fly, the driver should be reading the setting out of the card and using that, or coercing the card to match the commandline setting. Allowing irreconcilable redundant configuration is an unforgivable design error. > > These configurations are generally read from external EEPROMs on device > > reset. Rebooting involves such a reset, and it is unlikely that > > FreeBSD will be rewriting said EEPROMs in the near future. > > Actually, that's exactly what were were talking about when we started > talking about relocating non-PnP soft configurable devices. No, I don't believe it is. "relocating" to my mind involves taking a device and moving it _right_here_and_now_. What you are talking about is an out-of-band reconfiguration, ie. you reconfigure the device and then reboot, wherupon it takes up new parameters. > > > You probe up the hierarchy, and attach down. Pretty simple. > > > > No. You probe from least intrusive to most intrusive, and use the > > lesser intrusive probes to eliminate places for sticking your fingers. > > If you look at the hierarchy I denoted in my previous posting > (it looked like a directory tree), you'll see that you are saying > the exact sam thing I just said. 8-). Whoops. I was obviously misremembering the tree in question. MHA. > > This is where the ECSD stuff comes into play on modern systems. I am > > trying to world as we speak so that I can start using Jonathan's vm86 > > BIOS call support to talk to this. > > Cool. This is exactly the soloution I think is called for. Let > me know how it goes; if you have specific changes you want tested, > I can probably help out. Sure. -current builds OK today, so I'm off hunting JL's BIOS call stuff as I write. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 00:04:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA11231 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:04:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lestat.nas.nasa.gov (lestat.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.50.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA11226 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:04:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lestat.nas.nasa.gov (8.8.6/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA29189; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:57:55 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709120657.XAA29189@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> X-Authentication-Warning: lestat.nas.nasa.gov: localhost [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Mike Smith Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: PnP support Reply-To: Jason Thorpe From: Jason Thorpe Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:57:53 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:41:25 +1000 Mike Smith wrote: > The NetBSD repo is not publically available. Make of that what you > will. There are a number of reasons why it's not available publicly. However, none of them are really appropriate for discussion here. > I actually gave up working on NetBSD due to the difficulty of obtaining > a usable copy of the source tree, which was somewhat disappointing. Um, pardon my asking, but what's wrong with sup'ing and importing the result into a private CVS repository? If you had trouble obtaining working source, you should have mentioned it to someone (like me, or core@netbsd.org) so it could be fixed. Jason R. Thorpe thorpej@nas.nasa.gov NASA Ames Research Center Home: +1 408 866 1912 NAS: M/S 258-6 Work: +1 415 604 0935 Moffett Field, CA 94035 Pager: +1 415 428 6939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 00:09:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA11568 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:09:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lestat.nas.nasa.gov (lestat.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.50.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA11563 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:09:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lestat.nas.nasa.gov (8.8.6/8.6.12) with SMTP id AAA29321; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:03:38 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709120703.AAA29321@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> X-Authentication-Warning: lestat.nas.nasa.gov: localhost [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Nate Williams Cc: John-Mark Gurney , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: PnP support Reply-To: Jason Thorpe From: Jason Thorpe Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:03:37 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:03:01 -0600 (MDT) Nate Williams wrote: > The NetBSD folks don't allow access to their repository. Last I heard, > it was both politically and legally a problem to do that, given that > they're tree is (was?) still based on the old 4.4BSD Lite code, which is > arguably 'tainted'. They've since converted their releases to use > Lite2, but by making their CVS tree public it could cause problems. Uhh... 4.4BSD-Lite is perfectly safe in the context you're describing. As I said in a previous mail on the subject, there are a number of reasons why it's not publicly available, none of which are really appropriate for discussion on this list. Jason R. Thorpe thorpej@nas.nasa.gov NASA Ames Research Center Home: +1 408 866 1912 NAS: M/S 258-6 Work: +1 415 604 0935 Moffett Field, CA 94035 Pager: +1 415 428 6939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 00:12:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA11811 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:12:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA11802 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:12:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA12460; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:12:23 -0700 (PDT) To: The Classiest Man Alive cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:31:46 EDT." <3.0.3.32.19970911213146.009c5680@cybercom.net> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:12:23 -0700 Message-ID: <12456.874048343@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Perhaps more to the point, no one has actually commented on the new version > of Zile. I know how resistant programmers can be to change something as > sacred as an editor, but I don't think a quick evaluation/test of the new > editor would kill anybody. Well, OK, I just looked at it and I guess I have some comments: 1. If it wants to go in as a substitute for ee, it'll have to be bmake'd and proven friendly with /usr/obj first. No configure scripts outside the ports collection for us. :-) 2. It should display the keymap in a separate window by default since seeing "M-h M-h for help" is going to confuse the piss out of the truly naive user. I can just see them typing "M-dash-h M-dash-h" as individual keys, or something, and being most confused. The confusing nature of emacs and vi to the complete newbie is why ee was brought in to begin with. 3. It should do the right thing with the real meta key. When I tried using it, I just got "\37777777750" in my buffer when I typed "Alt-D" to get "latest info" information. This will confuse the emacs users who expect an emacs-compatible editor to be, well, compatible! :) 4. Another nice thing about ee is that it requires *no* help files or other existing datafiles. I just link ee into the crunched binary and voila, one stand-alone editor ready to run. If zile is to truly replace ee, it will have to have an option for building it entirely self contained so that I don't have to sweat the contents of /usr/share (which generally doesn't even exist yet when most users invoke ee during the install). All in all, zile looks quite nice but I think it has a ways to go before we can realistically start talking about it as a substitute for ee. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 00:19:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA12200 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:19:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr08.primenet.com (tlambert@usr08.primenet.com [206.165.6.208]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA12191; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:19:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA12728; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:19:36 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709120719.AAA12728@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Installing a new disk.. To: jlixfeld@idirect.com Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:19:35 +0000 (GMT) Cc: freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Jason Lixfeld" at Sep 12, 97 02:00:03 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Received the following error for each partition: > > Error mounting /dev/wd2s1e on /mnt2 : Invalid argument > Error mounting /dev/wd2s1e on /mnt3 : Invalid argument > > What am I doing wrong?! mkdir /mnt2 /mnt3 8-). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 00:20:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA12327 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:20:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA12320 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:20:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA12536; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:20:03 -0700 (PDT) To: John-Mark Gurney cc: Mike Smith , Luigi Rizzo , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PnP support In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:58:38 PDT." <19970911215838.24994@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:20:03 -0700 Message-ID: <12533.874048803@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > ok.. I'll take a look at it... it's nice that freefall has a copy of > the NetBSD tree... but I noticed that the tree in /f/NetBSD is just > a source copy.. is there another place on freefall (or another location) > that I can browse the cvs repository? mainly for repository logs.. Oh god, not *this* topic again. ;-) The NetBSD CVS repository is not available for public access and, AFAIK, no such access is planned in the near future. Desired, yes. Planned, no. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 00:22:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA12420 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:22:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr08.primenet.com (tlambert@usr08.primenet.com [206.165.6.208]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA12415; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:22:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA12785; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:22:37 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709120722.AAA12785@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: (former?) Pentium secrets To: ron@cts.com Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:22:37 +0000 (GMT) Cc: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "ron@cts.com" at Sep 11, 97 11:03:11 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I have heard the stories about Intel putting special, unpublished instructions > into the Pentium for (guess who?) our buddies at MS (here I go again:-) I You can: 1) a) goto Yahoo b) search for "Appendix H" 2) Buy a copy of: The Undocumented PC, Second Edition Frank VanGilluwe ISBN: Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 00:39:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA13248 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:39:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA13240 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:39:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA12770; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:39:30 -0700 (PDT) To: Nate Williams cc: John-Mark Gurney , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PnP support In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:03:01 MDT." <199709120603.AAA07927@rocky.mt.sri.com> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:39:30 -0700 Message-ID: <12766.874049970@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > they're tree is (was?) still based on the old 4.4BSD Lite code, which is ^^^^^^^^^^^ Net/2, actually. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 00:40:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA13432 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:40:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA13426; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:40:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA12792; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:40:51 -0700 (PDT) To: Jason Lixfeld cc: freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Installing a new disk.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:00:03 EDT." Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:40:51 -0700 Message-ID: <12789.874050051@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > 0. /stand/sysinstall > 1. Selected option 7 > 2. Selected option 2 > 3. Selected wd2 4. (C)reated slice using all space on disk (used 165 partition type) > 5. (W)rote changes << -- ELIMINATE THIS STEP > 6. (N)o boot manager > 7. "Wrote FDISK partition information out successfully." > 8. (Q)uit back to "Choose Custom Installation Options" > 9. Selected option 3 > 10. (C)reated wd2s1e partition. > 11. Selected (F)ile system > 12. Selected /mnt2 as mount point > 13. Repeated steps 10 - 12 for wd2s1f partition (mounted on /mnt3). > 14. (W)rote the changes << -- YOU WANT TO DO IT HERE. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 00:50:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA14113 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:50:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA14084; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:49:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA01751; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:16:54 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709120716.RAA01751@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: ron@cts.com cc: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: (former?) Pentium secrets In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:03:11 MST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:16:52 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I have heard the stories about Intel putting special, unpublished instructions > into the Pentium for (guess who?) our buddies at MS (here I go again:-) I > understand that this information became available to the rest of the software > community later (hence the microtime capability). Can anyone tell me where I > can obtain this info? http://www.x86.org/ mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 00:51:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA14269 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:51:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from onyx.atipa.com (user5808@ns.atipa.com [208.128.22.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA14249 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:51:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail-queue invoked by uid 1018); 12 Sep 1997 07:55:14 -0000 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 01:55:14 -0600 (MDT) From: Atipa X-Sender: freebsd@dot.ishiboo.com To: Greg Lehey cc: FreeBSD Questions , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: <19970912101014.37786@lemis.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Greg Lehey wrote: > I've seen a lot of reports recently about problems with floppies under > FreeBSD. Now I can understand a lot of that: floppies must be the > most unreliable data storage medium I can think of, not to mention the > most expensive per byte. But I'm getting the feeling that there is > more to it than that, that possibly there's a bug in the floppy driver > and that we're blaming it on the inherent unreliability of the medium. I very consistently get floppy errors w/ FreeBSD, on systems that I know for certain have good drives, FDCs, and good media. Whenever I need to install XInside products, like Motif or AcceleratedX, I always need to untar the floppies on a Linux box and nfs export them. The confusing thing to me is that floppy support works fine during installation. I just gave up on using them on an active system. We have so much networking junk laying around that I never need floppies, or else I would be highly annoyed. > I'm looking for indications which would point towards the driver. One > of these might be: > > 1. Floppy formatted under on the same machine. Either MS-DOS format or raw TAR format. I haven't played w/ ext2 or ufs formats very much. It does not appear to be format dependent; I think it may be interrupt handling. > 2. FreeBSD runs into hardware problems with the floppy (typically > things like checksum errors). Yes. It is like the media/host tranfers are out of sync with the host/controller transfers. The expected data appears to be late, or perhaps early (doubtful). > 3. can read the entire floppy with no trouble. MS-DOG based and Linux are fully reliable. NetBSD is unrelaible. > If you can give me hard evidence of such occurrences, I'd like to hear > from you. I know that plenty of people can tell me that they've had > occurrences of (2), maybe in conjunction with (1), but unless you can > prove (3) as well, I don't want to hear from you. Case in point: the XInside. The medium is pristine, as is shown by Linux's ability to untar the floppy no problem. The machine itself is fine because DOS reads floppies fine, and sysinstall was fine. > In addition, if you have any other evidence I haven't thought of which > would also point to an error in the floppy driver, please contact me. I certainly think BIOS negotiation needs to be investigated. We use several different types of motherboards from different manufacturers, but they all have the Award BIOS in common. I had a NetBSD client who had fits with Award-based boards, but had no problem at all w/ AMI or Phoenix BIOSes. I know Award is not broken, but it may be _different_ than the BIOS that was used to test the relaibility of floppies under FreeBSD. I am happy to give more specifics if you tell me what you need. Kevin From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 00:53:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA14490 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:53:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from andrsn.stanford.edu (root@andrsn.Stanford.EDU [36.33.0.163]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA14481; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:53:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (andrsn@localhost.stanford.edu [127.0.0.1]) by andrsn.stanford.edu (8.8.7/8.6.12) with SMTP id AAA06653; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:45:02 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 00:45:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Annelise Anderson To: Greg Lehey cc: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" , "Jay D. Nelson" , FreeBSD Questions , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: <19970912160911.30658@lemis.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk FWIW, my experience with floppies is it's best never to reformat them. I buy Maxell floppies "IBM formatted" and use them straight out of the box. Annelise From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 01:01:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA15078 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 01:01:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id BAA15061 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 01:01:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id IAA02519; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:31:12 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199709120631.IAA02519@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: PnP support To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:31:12 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: mike@smith.net.au, gurney_j@resnet.uoregon.edu, perhaps@yes.no, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709120614.QAA01493@word.smith.net.au> from "Mike Smith" at Sep 12, 97 04:13:53 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Ok, also thanks to being in a different timezone I could read all this thread before having a chance to post. Unfortunately the only conclusion I can gather from the discussion is that there is not complete agreement on what should be done. As long as there is a manual override mechanism, which we already have for legacy ISA and PnP (Terry, this is what the pnp code in -current does), I am not concerned about what gets implemented to automate resource allocation. If anything fails, there is a backdoor. So I'll avoid further comments waiting for someone to volunteer for a sample implementation :) What I think is important to have (also to test possible solutions etc.) is the 'extent' manager mentioned earlier in this thread. Cheers Luigi -----------------------------+-------------------------------------- Luigi Rizzo | Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it | Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 | via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 | http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ _____________________________|______________________________________ From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 01:07:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA15316 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 01:07:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA15293; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 01:07:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id RAA02059; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:36:58 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970912173658.08134@lemis.com> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:36:58 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Terry Lambert Cc: ron@cts.com, freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (former?) Pentium secrets References: <199709120722.AAA12785@usr08.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709120722.AAA12785@usr08.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 07:22:37AM +0000 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 07:22:37AM +0000, Terry Lambert wrote: >> I have heard the stories about Intel putting special, unpublished instructions >> into the Pentium for (guess who?) our buddies at MS (here I go again:-) I > > You can: > > 1) a) goto Yahoo > b) search for "Appendix H" Alta Vista Web Pages (1-20 of 2302) (yup, that's what Yahoo says). Gee, thanks. That's almost as good as a URL. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 01:43:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA17420 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 01:43:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA17401; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 01:42:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.8.5/8.6.9) id KAA19821; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:47:03 +0200 (SAT) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 19788; Fri Sep 12 10:46:22 1997 by gram.cdsec.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA19990; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:19:30 +0200 (SAT) From: Graham Wheeler Message-Id: <199709120819.KAA19990@cdsec.com> Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:19:29 +0200 (SAT) Cc: freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199709120243.MAA00728@word.smith.net.au> from "Mike Smith" at Sep 12, 97 12:43:35 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25-h4.1] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > > We have a application-level gateway program which is occasionally freezing > > up, in what seems to be a busy loop (if we run `top' the gateway process is > > the most CPU-intensive, chewing up CPU cycles as fast as it can). We have > > collected several core dumps from the gateway program when this happens. > > If you can simulate the situation locally, attaching to the running > process with gdb and stepping through the loop would almost certainly > be very instructive. Unfortunately the problem has never occurred at our site; I am working with core dumps mailed to me by the client (generated by sending a SIGABRT to the spinning process). > > In each case, while the location in our own code varies, the stack trace > > always ends in a call to getservbyname() or getservbyport(). These in turn > > are calling either malloc() or free(), which in turn seem to be calling > > fstat() (at least according to the stack backtrace). > > That's fairly odd; malloc()/free() do not call fstat(). Are you using > the system malloc() or the GNU version? The system malloc, as far as I know. And I did search the source for fstat, and didn't find it, so I agree this is odd. But that's what gdb is reporting in the stack backtrace... > > Is anyone aware of a problem with the implementation of the /etc/services > > lookup routines in FreeBSD 2.2.2? I will go through the library source code > > myself tomorrow, and compre it with FreeBSD 2.1.0, but I am hoping that this > > problem is already known, and hopefully that a fix is available. > > Not as far as I am aware; something like this would have been somewhat > of a showstopper I would expect. If you have a copy of the CVS > repository on hand extracting the changes between 2.1 and 2.2 would be > very straightforward. Yes and no - our application is doing thousands of calls to these routines every hour, and it never terminates (some sites have been running the same process for nearly a year without a restart or reboot). So if the problem is a memory leak, for example, it may not show up except in situations like ours where there are so many calls. I'm considering prescanning the tables used once at the start and looking up all the services once only; this is a good idea from a performance point of view and may make the problem go away. > Please keep us informed of your progress, and if there is anything more > we can do to help, please ask! Wilco. -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)23-6065/6/7 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Mobile: +27(83)-253-9864 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 01:49:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA17922 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 01:49:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hydrogen.nike.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA17907 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 01:49:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.nike.efn.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA02163; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 01:45:38 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970912014538.17294@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 01:45:38 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: Luigi Rizzo Cc: Mike Smith , perhaps@yes.no, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PnP support References: <199709120614.QAA01493@word.smith.net.au> <199709120631.IAA02519@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709120631.IAA02519@labinfo.iet.unipi.it>; from Luigi Rizzo on Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 08:31:12AM +0200 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Luigi Rizzo scribbled this message on Sep 12: > Ok, also thanks to being in a different timezone I could read all > this thread before having a chance to post. > > Unfortunately the only conclusion I can gather from the discussion > is that there is not complete agreement on what should be done. > > As long as there is a manual override mechanism, which we already > have for legacy ISA and PnP (Terry, this is what the pnp code in > -current does), I am not concerned about what gets implemented to > automate resource allocation. If anything fails, there is a backdoor. > So I'll avoid further comments waiting for someone to volunteer > for a sample implementation :) > > What I think is important to have (also to test possible solutions > etc.) is the 'extent' manager mentioned earlier in this thread. I've started looking at it.. and the header looks promising... if I remeber right... it does more than I thought it would.. and looks like we should adopt it... I'm going to start looking at the code.. and after that, see if I can't get a kernel that will use the extent as a resource checker... ttyl.. -- John-Mark Gurney Modem/FAX: +1 541 683 6954 Cu Networking Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 02:00:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA18842 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:00:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from onizuka.tb.9715.org (LjCZia8OXXH2IMld+c7TeSCf0oE5Z9xJ@onizuka.tb.9715.org [194.97.84.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA18769; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 01:59:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: by onizuka.tb.9715.org via sendmail with stdio id for ports@freebsd.org; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:58:42 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: From: torstenb@onizuka.tb.9715.org (Torsten Blum) Subject: Re: Major bogon in tcp_wrappers port. In-Reply-To: <19970911075604.13003@klemm.gtn.com> from Andreas Klemm at "Sep 11, 97 07:56:04 am" To: andreas@klemm.gtn.com (Andreas Klemm) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:58:42 +0200 (CEST) Cc: mark@grondar.za, ports@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL32 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [Cc to hackers] Andreas Klemm wrote: > > > (Sendmail has such hooks, so does ssh (and I believe cvsupd as well?)) > > > > Uh, I tought this was a joke... > > > > Why should we move tcpwrapper to the base system ? I can't see an > > advantage here. > > So that we can say, FreeBSD is secure automatically. That's bullshit. FreeBSD will not be more secure if we add tcp-wrapper to the base system. You don't get more security just by installing some kind of software, you have to configure the software. Without hosts.{allow,deny} tcpd will only log connections - and that's already supported by our inetd. > I don't know if > you noticed Jordans letter to a WWW online computer magazine to their > review of FreeBSD vs. SCO, NT and others. They for example tested every > system "as is". So I think it's a big win for security and marketing, > if we can say, that our system is secured by default ! Andreas, nothing is secure by default. > > tcpd is an easy "plug in" and one of it's "advantages" is that you just > > have to change inetd.conf - no compile-time changes. > > Yes, agreed. And in addition to that nice feature we discuss, to > strengthen security of the base system with that fine tool ;-) Everybody has different needs for security. There are more than enough users who'll never need tcpwrapper because - they only have a small set of "services" running on these boxes (for example www server, dns, sendmail etc) - we have users who really don't care about security (sad but true). They never care to configure hosts.{allow,deny} or even check their logfiles - Machines without connections "external" connection and many many more > > It's harder to configure hosts.{allow,deny} then changing inetd.conf. > > Hmm, where's the logic here ? If you don't have a hosts.allow and > hosts.deny, then mothing happens ... so no extra work needed ;-) Bloat. We really don't need tcp wrapper in the base system. If you want a default installation including tcpwrapper, convince Jordan to add a "knob" in sysinstall (install the tcpwrapper package, change inetd.conf, configure hosts.{deny,allow} etc). > But if you need it, then you are able to fine tune the system and > the knobs are already _there_ ;-) As I said, the only thing you have to do (beside configuring hosts.allow/deny) is to add the package. > > Aeh, that's why we have the ports tree. If something is really optional > > and you just have to change a config file why should it be moved to > > the base system ? > > Maybe to include some extra functionality per default with respect > to internet security ?! Extra functionality that, without further configuration, gives a false sense of security ? Extra functionality that a lot of our users don't need or don't care about? > > > Negotiable. I kinda like the idea if two files - inetd.conf.dist and > > > inetd.conf.wrap.dist, and some install option to choose one. > > > > We don't need to have tcpwrapper in the base system to provide an > > example config file. > > No, the question was, how to invoke or disable tcp_wrappers with > simple knobs in rc.conf or something else ... Andreas, have you _ever_ configured tcpd ? tcpd is not a standalone daemon. To activate it, you have to modify inetd.conf. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for a "more" secure system, but you don't get this out of the box. You _always_ have to configure something. If a tool highly depends on the system and needs a rebuild of several tools to take advantage of it, I'll probably suggest to add it to the base system. But tcp wrapper has been written to fit into the system without rebuilding system software, heck, for many systems you don't even have the sources to do that. I voted against including pidentd in the base system and I do the same in this case. -tb From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 02:05:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA19414 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:05:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA19395 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:04:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA02046 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:33:16 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709120833.SAA02046@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: IDE Zip drive, challenge! Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:33:13 +1000 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk OK, so we all know that there are IDE Zip drives out there, and moreover that they are pretty cheap. They perform fairly poorly, but media are cheap and the drives themselves are fairly ubiquitous. There's a local ISP building systems using them as boot drives for routers and terminal servers, simply because they can swap the OS on a system by rebooting it and changing disks. However, there are a couple of problems with these drives that need to be addressed by an enterprising IDE hacker with access to one of these drives. 1) The drive is not locked when the disk is mounted. 2) Once a disk has been ejected and another inserted, the disk reports an error condition that the IDE driver can't handle. In the case of 1), we need media lock/unlock support as for SCSI removables. This should be moderately easy. In the case of 2), the error is almost certainly a "media changed" notification. This status needs to be recognised and correctly acknowledged. In both cases, there should be ATAPI standards for dealing with these situations, and we can hope that Iomega have done the right thing and followed them. If you think that this is a job worth taking on, let us know and get to it! mike (ps. should we have a web resource somewhere where things like this can be publicised? I think that if we were to maintain a list of short, discrete tasks suitable for relative newcomers, we could attract a lot more interest in this sort of thing...) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 02:17:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA20062 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:17:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA20052 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:17:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA02086 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:45:45 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709120845.SAA02086@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: hackers@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:45:44 +1000 From: Mike Smith Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by hub.freebsd.org id CAA20058 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk ------- Forwarded Message From: Graham Wheeler Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:40:10 +0200 (SAT) Cc: freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org > > In each case, while the location in our own code varies, the stack trace > > always ends in a call to getservbyname() or getservbyport(). These in turn > > are calling either malloc() or free(), which in turn seem to be calling > > fstat() (at least according to the stack backtrace). > > That's fairly odd; malloc()/free() do not call fstat(). Are you using > the system malloc() or the GNU version? Here are three sample core dumps: #0 0x52220 in fstat () #1 0x95000 in ?? () #2 0x5256e in free () #3 0x46312 in fclose () #4 0x334af in endservent () #5 0x2f84e in getservbyname () #6 0x253e0 in GetPort (protocol=6, service=0xbf510
) at service.cc:34 #7 0x25405 in GetTCPPort (service=0xbf510
) at service.cc:42 #8 0x1d136 in TCPGatewaySet::DestPort (this=0x683d0, n=4) at gateways.cc:39 #9 0x1d08d in GatewaySet::Match (this=0x683d0, n=4, cliaddr=0xefbfd824 "\n}\016\nĻD\211C", cliport=3088, dstaddr=0xefbfd828 "ĻD\211C", dstport=80) at gateways.cc:25 #10 0x1755d in AccessRuleSet::CheckGateways (this=0x68344, gateways=0x683d0, cliaddr=0xefbfd824 "\n}\016\nĻD\211C", cliport=3088, dstaddr=0xefbfd828 "ĻD\211C", dstport=80, user=0xefbfd86c "", group=0xefbfd82c "", identtypes=0xefbfd820) at access.cc:229 #11 0x17648 in AccessRuleSet::CheckTCPGateways (this=0x68344, cliaddr=0xefbfd824 "\n}\016\nĻD\211C", cliport=3088, dstaddr=0xefbfd828 "ĻD\211C", dstport=80, user=0xefbfd86c "", group=0xefbfd82c "", identtypes=0xefbfd820) at access.cc:255 #12 0x4fc4 in SessionGroup::AddOutgoingSession (this=0x67420, pkt=0x86640, queueit=0xefbfdbfc) at session.cc:1267 #13 0x588a in TCPSessionGroup::AddOutgoingSession (this=0x67420, pkt=0x86640, queueit=0xefbfdbfc) at session.cc:1501 #14 0x5e3f in SessionManager::FindInsideSession (this=0x67400, pkt=0x86640, queueit=0xefbfdbfc) at session.cc:1639 #15 0xa43e in Interface::GetSession (this=0x6b000, sm=0x67400, pkt=0x86640, to_inside=0, queueit=0xefbfdbfc) at iface.cc:405 #16 0xa817 in Interface::Gateway (this=0x6b000, other=0x6b100, sm=0x67400, to_inside=0) at iface.cc:468 #17 0x8314 in Gateway::HandleEvents (this=0x86600) at gateway.cc:209 #18 0x85b0 in Gateway::Run (this=0x86600) at gateway.cc:294 #19 0x1701 in main (argc=6, argv=0xefbfdce4) at cdsgw.cc:165 #0 0x51a60 in fstat () #1 0x63f54 in buffer () #2 0x51da2 in fstat () #3 0x524f6 in malloc () #4 0x50ba9 in __smakebuf () #5 0x461c0 in __srefill () #6 0x45b24 in fgets () #7 0x33535 in getservent () #8 0x2f7ed in getservbyname () #9 0x253e0 in GetPort (protocol=6, service=0x69510 "http\t\t70/udp\nrje\t\t77/tcp\t\tnetrjs\nfinger\t\t79/tcp\nhttp\t\t80/tcp\t\thttp\t# WorldWideWeb HTTP\nhttp\t\t80/udp\t\t\t# HyperText Transfer Protocol\nlink\t\t87/tcp\t\tttylink\n#kerberos\t88/tcp\t\tkrb5\t# Kerberos v5\n#kerberos"...) at service.cc:34 #10 0x25405 in GetTCPPort ( service=0x69510 "http\t\t70/udp\nrje\t\t77/tcp\t\tnetrjs\nfinger\t\t79/tcp\nhttp\t\t80/tcp\t\thttp\t# WorldWideWeb HTTP\nhttp\t\t80/udp\t\t\t# HyperText Transfer Protocol\nlink\t\t87/tcp\t\tttylink\n#kerberos\t88/tcp\t\tkrb5\t# Kerberos v5\n#kerberos"...) at service.cc:42 #11 0x1d136 in TCPGatewaySet::DestPort (this=0x683d0, n=4) at gateways.cc:39 #12 0x1d08d in GatewaySet::Match (this=0x683d0, n=4, cliaddr=0xefbfd824 "\n|\002\027Ä\aF\203", cliport=1725, dstaddr=0xefbfd828 "Ä\aF\203", dstport=80) at gateways.cc:25 #13 0x1755d in AccessRuleSet::CheckGateways (this=0x68344, gateways=0x683d0, cliaddr=0xefbfd824 "\n|\002\027Ä\aF\203", cliport=1725, dstaddr=0xefbfd828 "Ä\aF\203", dstport=80, user=0xefbfd86c "", group=0xefbfd82c "", identtypes=0xefbfd820) at access.cc:229 #14 0x17648 in AccessRuleSet::CheckTCPGateways (this=0x68344, cliaddr=0xefbfd824 "\n|\002\027Ä\aF\203", cliport=1725, dstaddr=0xefbfd828 "Ä\aF\203", dstport=80, user=0xefbfd86c "", group=0xefbfd82c "", identtypes=0xefbfd820) at access.cc:255 #15 0x4fc4 in SessionGroup::AddOutgoingSession (this=0x67420, pkt=0x86640, queueit=0xefbfdbfc) at session.cc:1267 #16 0x588a in TCPSessionGroup::AddOutgoingSession (this=0x67420, pkt=0x86640, queueit=0xefbfdbfc) at session.cc:1501 #17 0x5e3f in SessionManager::FindInsideSession (this=0x67400, pkt=0x86640, queueit=0xefbfdbfc) at session.cc:1639 #18 0xa43e in Interface::GetSession (this=0x6b000, sm=0x67400, pkt=0x86640, to_inside=0, queueit=0xefbfdbfc) at iface.cc:405 #19 0xa817 in Interface::Gateway (this=0x6b000, other=0x6b100, sm=0x67400, to_inside=0) at iface.cc:468 #20 0x8314 in Gateway::HandleEvents (this=0x86600) at gateway.cc:209 #21 0x85b0 in Gateway::Run (this=0x86600) at gateway.cc:294 #22 0x1701 in main (argc=6, argv=0xefbfdce4) at cdsgw.cc:165 #0 0x52220 in fstat () #1 0x83000 in ?? () #2 0x5256e in free () #3 0x46312 in fclose () #4 0x334af in endservent () #5 0x2f79a in getservbyport () #6 0x2581b in Service (protocol=17, port=0) at service.cc:257 #7 0x268e in TransportSession::ServiceName (this=0x6b300) at session.cc:360 #8 0x2dfd in UDPSession::ServiceName (this=0x6b300) at session.cc:527 #9 0x284e in TransportSession::Print (this=0x6b300, buf=0xefbfdac4 "\024", verbose=0) at session.cc:388 #10 0x23d7 in IPSession::Terminate (this=0x6b300) at session.cc:299 #11 0x2da7 in TransportSession::Terminate (this=0x6b300) at session.cc:515 #12 0x4c28 in SessionGroup::AgeSessions (this=0x67440) at session.cc:1195 #13 0x5d9c in SessionManager::AgeSessions (this=0x67400) at session.cc:1614 #14 0x83f5 in Gateway::HandleEvents (this=0x86600) at gateway.cc:227 #15 0x85b0 in Gateway::Run (this=0x86600) at gateway.cc:294 #16 0x1701 in main (argc=6, argv=0xefbfdcd4) at cdsgw.cc:165 - -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)23-6065/6/7 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Mobile: +27(83)-253-9864 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ ------- End of Forwarded Message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 02:28:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA20514 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:28:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.116.240]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA20497; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:27:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de (gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de [137.226.30.2]) by Campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE (RBI-Z-5/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA05409; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:29:31 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.8.5/8.6.9) id LAA09456; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:33:26 +0200 (MEST) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:33:26 +0200 (MEST) From: Christoph Kukulies Message-Id: <199709120933.LAA09456@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de> To: jkh@freebsd.org, webmaster@freebsd.org Subject: no mention of linux emulation Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Browsing www.freebsd.org (through the Yahoo pointer - nice, we are getting additional advertising) I clicked 'applications' in "FreeBSD can run a huge varity of applications" Why no mention in there that it can run Linux ELF and a.out binaries as well? -- Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 02:30:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA20832 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:30:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from circe.bonn-online.com (root@circe.bonn-online.com [195.52.214.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA20826 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:30:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bonn-online.com (portC6.bonn-online.com [195.52.214.77]) by circe.bonn-online.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA11759; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:30:16 +0200 Message-ID: <34190B2D.326A3F27@bonn-online.com> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:28:13 +0200 From: Sebastian Lederer X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02b7 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Charlie & CC: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do you have some neat configuration files? References: <19970908153822.27586@lemis.com> <199709082133.OAA09929@usr09.primenet.com> <19970909223106.MK41707@uriah.heep.sax.de> <19970910120052.21535@lemis.com> <19970911234726.05622@vinyl.quickweb.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Charlie & wrote: > It would be a really good idea to include a sample AfterStep or > Window Maker start up script (well, scripts in the case of Window > Maker) since they command a very high percentage of the window > manager market. I have customized Window Maker scripts that I changed to > work under FreeBSD if you're interested. Plus, when Apple goes more > and more NeXtSteppy there's bound to be an increase in interest with the > nextstep interface clones... Not quite. Apple's new Rhapsody (which will hopefully be a complete Mach-based 4.4BSD) will look like the current MacOS 8. So the original NextStep look will soon be "officially" extinct. Well, AfterStep/WindowMaker still looks great, though. A problem with window manager configuration files could be that most of them contain menu definitions for starting applications, and usually 90% of the menu entries will point to applications which are not installed. That would be quite frustrating for newbies if they try out the menus and absolutely nothing happen, not even an error message. So at least from that point of view, the configuration files should be quite minimal, maybe with lots of commented out entries for "common" applications. Well, I'm sure there are people who think quite the opposite... Best regards, Sebastian Lederer -- Sebastian Lederer lederer@bonn-online.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 02:34:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA21054 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:34:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from uk.ns.eu.org ([194.117.157.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id CAA21049 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:34:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from aledm@localhost) by uk.ns.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA12936; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:34:40 +0100 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:34:40 +0100 (BST) From: Aled Morris X-Sender: aledm@uk.ns.eu.org To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release In-Reply-To: <8943.874025373@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > Hmmm... I for one would not want it to be the standard editor. Vi is > > and always has been the standard editor for unix. I think it should > > I think you misunderstand. This doesn't replace vi and never did. > ee is a *different* editor, for a different audience, and the fact > that you symlink it to vi on your own box is completely and utterly > irrelevant to that fact. :) I wish EE's default was Emacs keybindings though - rather than "yet another" set of made-up keystrokes [aside: OK, flame me, they're standard from some popular package with which I am not familiar, right?] Many other apps use Emacs keybindings (X programs for example) so it is useful for newbies to at least get used to the "standard". In the style of this thread: "the first thing I do after installing FreeBSD for a newbie is echo 'emacs noexpand nomargins' >>/usr/share/misc/init.ee " Aled -- tel +44 973 207987 O- aledm@routers.co.uk From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 02:46:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA21551 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:46:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.firehouse.net (brian@shell.firehouse.net [209.42.203.45]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA21546 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 02:46:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (brian@localhost) by shell.firehouse.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id FAA16736; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:46:04 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:46:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Mitchell To: Chuck Robey cc: FreeBSD-Hackers Subject: Re: network programming. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Chuck Robey wrote: > I have to do my very first network programming, a UDP client+server, and I > was wondering if anyone knows of how I could go about intercepting > something sent to a UDP socket, so I could use it for troubleshooting? I > don't want to receive it (else the client would never get it), just to > monitor what's going on. This is my home machine, and I (obviously) have > root here. > > I don't want the application written for me, just a tool I could use to > capture what's going on between my buggy server and my buggy client. > > Thanks for any hints, guys. man 3 pcap, man 4 bpf From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 03:00:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA22140 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 03:00:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA22135 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 03:00:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id TAA06619; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:29:40 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970912192939.23558@lemis.com> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:29:39 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Aled Morris Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release References: <8943.874025373@time.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: ; from Aled Morris on Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 10:34:40AM +0100 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 10:34:40AM +0100, Aled Morris wrote: > On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > >>> Hmmm... I for one would not want it to be the standard editor. Vi is >>> and always has been the standard editor for unix. I think it should >> >> I think you misunderstand. This doesn't replace vi and never did. >> ee is a *different* editor, for a different audience, and the fact >> that you symlink it to vi on your own box is completely and utterly >> irrelevant to that fact. :) > > I wish EE's default was Emacs keybindings though - rather than "yet > another" set of made-up keystrokes [aside: OK, flame me, they're standard > from some popular package with which I am not familiar, right?] > > Many other apps use Emacs keybindings (X programs for example) so it is > useful for newbies to at least get used to the "standard". Agreed. Note that this list includes such popular programs as Netscrape. > In the style of this thread: "the first thing I do after installing > FreeBSD for a newbie is > echo 'emacs noexpand nomargins' >>/usr/share/misc/init.ee > " Hmm. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 03:18:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA22916 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 03:18:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA22910 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 03:18:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA02326; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:46:15 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709120946.TAA02326@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Aled Morris cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:34:40 +0100." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:16:15 +0930 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > I think you misunderstand. This doesn't replace vi and never did. > > ee is a *different* editor, for a different audience, and the fact > > that you symlink it to vi on your own box is completely and utterly > > irrelevant to that fact. :) > > I wish EE's default was Emacs keybindings though - rather than "yet > another" set of made-up keystrokes [aside: OK, flame me, they're standard > from some popular package with which I am not familiar, right?] Probably 8) Actually, I have been meaning to put "dte" forward for some time now. It's comparable in size to ee (external help file, erk.), and has a very lenient license ("please credit the author"). In addition, it uses the Worstar key set and has assorted hoopiness builtin for dealing with slow lines (it dates from HP3000 days originally). The only barf I have with it is that it eats trailing whitespace (stupid!). Thousands of Monash internees will recognise it, as it is the standard editor on campus (and much better than the vile Ludwig that was the flavour around here). If 'ee' is loathed for reasons other than that it is "not vi" and "not emacs", maybe dte would do? mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 03:23:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA23254 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 03:23:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mercury.ukc.ac.uk (mercury.ukc.ac.uk [129.12.21.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id DAA23221; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 03:23:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kestrel.ukc.ac.uk by mercury.ukc.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:22:35 +0100 Received: from localhost by kestrel.ukc.ac.uk (5.x/UKC-2.14) id AA27478; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:22:34 +0100 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:22:34 +0100 (BST) From: "K.J.Koster" To: FreeBSD Hackers Cc: FreeBSD Questions Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Come to think of it... Just a few days ago I made a floppy image from a freshly formatted MS-DOS floppy ("dd if/dev/fd0.1440 of=msdos.flop") Then, when I tried to dump it over an old FreeBSD boot floppy, it just died on me halfway. I'll root through the bin at home, to find it again, but it might be stuck under a teabag or something. I'll play with this again, see if I can reproduce it. I think it may have something to do with long files. I wrote my own bsplit at some point, which made files nearly as large as a floppy, but I kept having trouble with damaged floppies. Now I've changed bsplit to make smaller chunks, and I have no trouble anymore %-) Wild guess: driver needs to recalibrate every once in a while, so if you write a whole floppy at once, it slowly loses calibration. MS-DOS `recalibrates' by writing the FAT every block or so. How does that sound? Groetjes, Kees Jan ---------------------------------------------------------------v-- Kees Jan Koster tel: UK-1227-453157 e-mail: kjk1@ukc.ac.uk 15 St. Michaels Road, Canterbury, Kent, United Kingdom ------------------------------------------------------------------ from trials come errors... from errors come legends... From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 03:42:12 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA24079 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 03:42:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hda.hda.com (hda-bicnet.bicnet.net [208.220.66.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA24074 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 03:42:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.hda.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id FAA26739 for hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:53:54 -0400 (EDT) From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199709120953.FAA26739@hda.hda.com> Subject: Re: Realtime Programming Under FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: <199709120402.VAA13813@usr03.primenet.com> from Terry Lambert at "Sep 12, 97 04:02:56 am" To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:53:54 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL25 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Yes. This was clarified after the posting to which you are responding; > you are correct that he meant completely orthoganal scheduling. > > This will never fly, of course, since it means that the overall > system performance will be degraded in the general case. Yes. But you may be perfectly willing to live with a performance hit in some cases. And the reason you must do this is the orthogonal kernel has work to do - it may be giving time slices to user threads, etc, and without thinking it over more carefully I'm not sure the real time part can give up its piece of the duty cycle when it has nothing to do. Why is this useful? Some reasons include: 1. You're testing something on your 200Mhz Pentium that will later run standalone on your 66Mhz 486; 2. You're moving toward better real time, comparable to the push down of the giant lock in SMP; 3. You're working toward dedicated resource real time using a multiprocessor, and you're essentially simulating the other processors with time multiplexing. Ad-hoc approaches boil down to this, anyway. Peter -- Peter Dufault (dufault@hda.com) Realtime development, Machine control, HD Associates, Inc. Safety critical systems, Agency approval From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 03:54:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA24587 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 03:54:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fly.HiWAAY.net (root@fly.HiWAAY.net [208.147.154.56]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA24560; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 03:53:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nospam.hiwaay.net (tnt1-59.HiWAAY.net [208.147.147.59]) by fly.HiWAAY.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id FAA26483; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:53:37 -0500 (CDT) Received: from nospam.hiwaay.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nospam.hiwaay.net (8.8.7/8.8.4) with ESMTP id FAA14361; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:53:35 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199709121053.FAA14361@nospam.hiwaay.net> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Greg Lehey cc: FreeBSD Questions , FreeBSD Hackers From: dkelly@hiwaay.net Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-reply-to: Message from Greg Lehey of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:10:14 +0930." <19970912101014.37786@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:53:34 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Installed a new MB and realized I had not tested the floppy very much: % fdformat /dev/fd0.1440 Format 1440K floppy `/dev/fd0.1440'? (y/n): y Processing EEEEEEEE------------------------------- I actually let it run to E's all across. And tried it again with the same results. Then tried: % fdformat /dev/rfd0.1440 Format 1440K floppy `/dev/fd0.1440'? (y/n): y Processing VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV done. Interesting. Was it operator error? Should always use rfd0? Lets try fdformat while the serial port is active: % fdformat /dev/rfd0.1440 Format 1440K floppy `/dev/fd0.1440'? (y/n): y Processing VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV done. During the above this was copied from "systat -v" 39 fdc0 irq6 296 sio1 irq3 Then I tried "fdformat /dev/fd0.1440" again and got all V's. By that time the serial port wasn't busy. So this time I kicked off bonnie and got 51 pci irq9 (Adaptec 2940) 21 fdc0 irq6 blks 5245 (sd0, "SEAGATE ST32550N 0021") Processing EVEVEVEEVEVVVVEVVVVVEVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV done. The V's were in the "Reading intelligently..." phase. Ultimately bonnie reported: -------Sequential Output-------- ---Sequential Input-- --Random-- -Per Char- --Block--- -Rewrite-- -Per Char- --Block--- --Seeks--- Machine MB K/sec %CPU K/sec %CPU K/sec %CPU K/sec %CPU K/sec %CPU /sec %CPU 100 4388 44.6 3947 9.3 1418 3.8 2484 28.1 2520 3.7 66.3 1.2 Not sure what is going on. MB is an Asus P6NP5, PPro 166/512k. Floppy is a Mitsumi. % uname -a FreeBSD nospam.hiwaay.net 2.2-STABLE FreeBSD 2.2-STABLE #0: Mon Sep 1 16:00:14 CDT 1997 root@nospam.hiwaay.net:/usr/src/sys/compile/PPRO166 i386 -- David Kelly N4HHE, dkelly@hiwaay.net ===================================================================== The human mind ordinarily operates at only ten percent of its capacity -- the rest is overhead for the operating system. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 04:06:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA25261 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 04:06:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fly.HiWAAY.net (root@fly.HiWAAY.net [208.147.154.56]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA25231; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 04:06:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nospam.hiwaay.net (tnt1-59.HiWAAY.net [208.147.147.59]) by fly.HiWAAY.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id GAA18319; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:06:30 -0500 (CDT) Received: from nospam.hiwaay.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nospam.hiwaay.net (8.8.7/8.8.4) with ESMTP id GAA14435; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:06:28 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199709121106.GAA14435@nospam.hiwaay.net> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Greg Lehey cc: FreeBSD Questions , FreeBSD Hackers From: dkelly@hiwaay.net Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-reply-to: Message from Greg Lehey of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:10:14 +0930." <19970912101014.37786@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:06:27 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Addendum: Just now noticed this filling dmesg from my attempts to fdformat while bonnie was running. The error is always , cyl, hd, and sec vary. fd0c: hard error reading fsbn 1069 of 1068-1071 (ST0 44 ST1 4 ST2 0 cyl 29 hd 1 sec 8) fd0c: hard error reading fsbn 1069 of 1068-1071 (ST0 44 ST1 4 ST2 0 cyl 29 hd 1 sec 8) fd0c: hard error reading fsbn 1069 of 1068-1071 (ST0 44 ST1 4 ST2 0 cyl 29 hd 1 sec 8) fd0c: hard error reading fsbn 1492 of 1492-1495 (ST0 40 ST1 4 ST2 0 cyl 41 hd 0 sec 17) fd0c: hard error reading fsbn 1492 of 1492-1495 (ST0 40 ST1 4 ST2 0 cyl 41 hd 0 sec 17) fd0c: hard error reading fsbn 1492 of 1492-1495 (ST0 40 ST1 4 ST2 0 cyl 41 hd 0 sec 17) fd0c: hard error reading fsbn 1492 of 1492-1495 (ST0 40 ST1 4 ST2 0 cyl 41 hd 0 sec 17) fd0c: hard error reading fsbn 1492 of 1492-1495 (ST0 40 ST1 4 ST2 0 cyl 41 hd 0 sec 17) -- David Kelly N4HHE, dkelly@hiwaay.net ===================================================================== The human mind ordinarily operates at only ten percent of its capacity -- the rest is overhead for the operating system. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 04:28:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26400 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 04:28:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26351; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 04:28:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA02692; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:55:10 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709121055.UAA02692@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Graham Wheeler cc: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith), freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 12 Sep 1997 10:19:29 +0200." <199709120819.KAA19990@cdsec.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:25:08 +0930 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > That's fairly odd; malloc()/free() do not call fstat(). Are you using > > the system malloc() or the GNU version? > > The system malloc, as far as I know. And I did search the source for fstat, > and didn't find it, so I agree this is odd. But that's what gdb is reporting > in the stack backtrace... Just out of curiosity, seeing as it appears to be inside malloc inside the stdio library, a couple of other questions; do you use the funopen() functionality at all? > > Not as far as I am aware; something like this would have been somewhat > > of a showstopper I would expect. If you have a copy of the CVS > > repository on hand extracting the changes between 2.1 and 2.2 would be > > very straightforward. I just went over this; there's been very little at all changed there, most of the differences are the addition of YP support. Each of these stuffups is actually deep inside the stdio library; I suspect that this is just about all your application actually does with stdio? btw. you might want to call setservent(1) before making lookups to avoid the open/close overhead you're incurring with every getserv* call you're currently making. Looking more, do you fiddle with the _bf._base or _nbuf fields in any FILE structures? Particularly after you've closed the file? > process for nearly a year without a restart or reboot). So if the problem > is a memory leak, for example, it may not show up except in situations like > ours where there are so many calls. If it's a memory leak then it sounds like it's inside the stdio library, possibly in fopen()/fclose(). Without more data it's going to be hard to track this one. If you have a forgiving customer, it would be immensely useful to build a copy of libc with debugging symbols and link your binary static, and then have the user run that until it dies. What happens if you install the 2.1 compatability kit and run the 2.1 version of the application? > I'm considering prescanning the tables used once at the start and looking > up all the services once only; this is a good idea from a performance point > of view and may make the problem go away. If you can spare the memory, that's far and away the best approach. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 04:42:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA27111 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 04:42:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id EAA27084; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 04:42:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id LAA03134; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:35:28 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199709120935.LAA03134@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? To: kjk1@ukc.ac.uk (K.J.Koster) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:35:28 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, questions@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "K.J.Koster" at Sep 12, 97 11:22:15 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Wild guess: driver needs to recalibrate every once in a while, so if you > write a whole floppy at once, it slowly loses calibration. MS-DOS > `recalibrates' by writing the FAT every block or so. How does that sound? I doubt it writes the fat so often, performance would be much worse than the 30-40K/s we get now... Luigi From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 04:44:30 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA27251 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 04:44:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zeus.gel.usherb.ca (zeus.gel.usherb.ca [132.210.70.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id EAA27244 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 04:44:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from castor.gel.usherb.ca by zeus.gel.usherb.ca (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA23586; Fri, 12 Sep 97 07:44:23 EDT Received: by castor.gel.usherb.ca (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id HAA29774; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:44:23 -0400 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:44:22 -0400 (EDT) From: "Alex.Boisvert" To: The Classiest Man Alive Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.19970911213146.009c5680@cybercom.net> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by hub.freebsd.org id EAA27246 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I would like to mention that I tried Zile yesterday. For the records, I like Emacs. It's not my favorite editor, but I can't live with vi.. ;-) When I ran Zile under a console, everything was colorfull and the keymaps where mostly ok. Under a XTerm, the mapping for "Backspace" doesn't work out of the box. Also, "Delete" key does what "backspace" should do, insteand of doing delete-backward-char. I think the most important aspect of an editor for newbies is to have the following functions available without thinking: Backspace = Delete character to the left Delete = Delete character to the right Arrow keys = Move cursor through text Loadé/Sae file = Direct key mapping (F2 and F3 respectively [usually]) (but could be any other key) Also, when you press an alphanumeric key, the corresponding character should appear on the screen (default in "insert mode"). This is not what "vi" gives. You have to *know* that pressing "i" or "a" is needed *before* entering text. Other features should be listed in a "menu" at the top of the screen, along with an arbitrary key binding for executing this feature. Seeing Zile, I will probably use it as a "lightweight editor" when Emacs is an overkill. Regards, Alex. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 04:44:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA27292 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 04:44:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au [129.78.129.109]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA27282 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 04:44:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dawes@localhost) by rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.2) id VAA07380; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:44:42 +1000 (EST) Message-ID: <19970912214442.64877@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:44:42 +1000 From: David Dawes To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Floppy trouble contd. References: <199709120632.XAA13197@palrel3.hp.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709120632.XAA13197@palrel3.hp.com>; from A Joseph Koshy on Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 11:58:43AM +0530 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 11:58:43AM +0530, A Joseph Koshy wrote: > >gl> most expensive per byte. But I'm getting the feeling that there is >gl> more to it than that, that possibly there's a bug in the floppy driver >gl> and that we're blaming it on the inherent unreliability of the medium. > >gl> 1. Floppy formatted under on the same machine. >gl> 2. FreeBSD runs into hardware problems with the floppy (typically >gl> things like checksum errors). >gl> 3. can read the entire floppy with no trouble. > > >I've seen (1), (2), and (3). After a (2), doing a format using the freebsd >tools sometimes helps, but see below. > >I've also seen that formatting 3-4 times under FreeBSD (fdwrite or fdformat) >causes the floppy to become unuseable, even under DOS. > >I've seen these on just too many floppies, new, used, of various brands, >to dismiss it as due to the unreliability of the medium. I too have seen behaviour similar to this, particularly a relatively large number of new floppies that have errors on FreeBSD (sometimes formatting with fdformat helps, sometimes not). I've usually assumed that they were bad disks (but that is getting harder to believe). I was beginning to suspect the drive. Next time I run into this problem I'll do some more testing. David From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 05:07:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA28368 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:07:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mercury.ukc.ac.uk (mercury.ukc.ac.uk [129.12.21.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id FAA28334; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:07:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kestrel.ukc.ac.uk by mercury.ukc.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:06:38 +0100 Received: from localhost by kestrel.ukc.ac.uk (5.x/UKC-2.14) id AA29697; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:06:37 +0100 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:06:36 +0100 (BST) From: "K.J.Koster" To: Luigi Rizzo Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: <199709120935.LAA03134@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > Wild guess: driver needs to recalibrate every once in a while, so if you > > write a whole floppy at once, it slowly loses calibration. MS-DOS > > `recalibrates' by writing the FAT every block or so. How does that sound? > > I doubt it writes the fat so often, performance would be much worse > than the 30-40K/s we get now... > 30-40kb/s? I wish. 8kb/s is what dd reports for my floppy drive. Oh, and regarding the fdformat in another post in the same thread: when FreeBSD finds an error on one of my floppies, it's dead. MS-DOS' scandisk reports the same errors and cannot fix them. Reformatting the disk does not help, the sectors trashed. Groetjes, Kees Jan ---------------------------------------------------------------v-- Kees Jan Koster tel: UK-1227-453157 e-mail: kjk1@ukc.ac.uk 15 St. Michaels Road, Canterbury, Kent, United Kingdom ------------------------------------------------------------------ from trials come errors... from errors come legends... From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 05:38:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA29972 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:38:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from elvis.vnet.net (elvis.vnet.net [166.82.1.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA29964 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:38:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ponds.dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by elvis.vnet.net (8.8.5/8.8.4) with ESMTP id IAA06008 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:38:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.dignus.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA12307 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:23:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.8.5/8.6.9) id IAA04931 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:15:58 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:15:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199709121215.IAA04931@lakes.dignus.com> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: I'm back!! Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Well - About two weeks ago; my free UUCP feed went down with a disk crash and hasn't recovered... So, I've, at last; gotten things working better with my ISP and removed that darned non-domainized UUCP address everyone has "enjoyed" these past few years! (The one that looked like ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com) Anyway; as these things often go, we were in the middle of making good progress toward my "daily panic" problem when my e-mail fell apart. If someone kept tract of this, could you bring me up-to-date. - Thanks - - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 05:40:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA00263 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:40:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA00206; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:39:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.8.5/8.6.9) id OAA27186; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:44:05 +0200 (SAT) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 27184; Fri Sep 12 14:44:02 1997 by gram.cdsec.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA20310; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:16:54 +0200 (SAT) From: Graham Wheeler Message-Id: <199709121216.OAA20310@cdsec.com> Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:16:53 +0200 (SAT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199709121055.UAA02692@word.smith.net.au> from "Mike Smith" at Sep 12, 97 08:25:08 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25-h4.1] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > That's fairly odd; malloc()/free() do not call fstat(). Are you using > > > the system malloc() or the GNU version? > > > > The system malloc, as far as I know. And I did search the source for fstat, > > and didn't find it, so I agree this is odd. But that's what gdb is reporting > > in the stack backtrace... > > Just out of curiosity, seeing as it appears to be inside malloc inside > the stdio library, a couple of other questions; do you use the > funopen() functionality at all? Nope. > > > Not as far as I am aware; something like this would have been somewhat > > > of a showstopper I would expect. If you have a copy of the CVS > > > repository on hand extracting the changes between 2.1 and 2.2 would be > > > very straightforward. > > I just went over this; there's been very little at all changed there, > most of the differences are the addition of YP support. Yup - virtually no difference (rats!) > Each of these stuffups is actually deep inside the stdio library; I > suspect that this is just about all your application actually does with > stdio? Yes - all debugging, etc is done with syslog. There is a config file read at the start, and upon receipt of a SIGHUP. It is also possible to open a domain socket to the app and issue some commands, but this is for my use; the client isn't doing this. > btw. you might want to call setservent(1) before making lookups > to avoid the open/close overhead you're incurring with > every getserv* call you're currently making. Good idea. > Looking more, do you fiddle with the _bf._base or _nbuf fields in any > FILE structures? Particularly after you've closed the file? No, don't touch the FILE innards directly at all. > > process for nearly a year without a restart or reboot). So if the problem > > is a memory leak, for example, it may not show up except in situations like > > ours where there are so many calls. > > If it's a memory leak then it sounds like it's inside the stdio > library, possibly in fopen()/fclose(). Without more data it's going to > be hard to track this one. Tell me about it 8-( It does seem like a memory leak, as the memory use reported by top grows over time. I have memory allocation debugging code which confirms that I have no leaks in my code (at least of C++ objects), and the fact that older sites have been running for months seems to confirm this. Its a pity we can't just kill and restart the app every hour or so, but unfortunately that would result in any TCP connections across the firewall being terminated gracelessly; I think they may find that even more irritating than the current problem. > If you have a forgiving customer, it would be immensely useful to build > a copy of libc with debugging symbols and link your binary static, and > then have the user run that until it dies. I may have to do this, and give them a new kernel with kernel trace support compiled in. But this is quite tricky - they're about 1000 miles away, and don't have the skills to do a kernel update themselves, so it will be a last resort. > What happens if you install the 2.1 compatability kit and run the 2.1 > version of the application? Unfortunately this is also tricky - the format of the config file has changed between the two versions, and all the other apps (proxies, MTAs, admin agents, etc) use this. > > I'm considering prescanning the tables used once at the start and looking > > up all the services once only; this is a good idea from a performance point > > of view and may make the problem go away. > > If you can spare the memory, that's far and away the best approach. Well, it could at least give a good indication if it is in fact the calls to getservbyXXX that are the cause of the problem. regards Graham -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)23-6065/6/7 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Mobile: +27(83)-253-9864 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 05:42:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA00396 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:42:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pds-gateway.pdspc.com ([207.7.39.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA00388 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:42:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: by pds-gateway.pdspc.com with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1457.3) id ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:43:06 -0500 Message-ID: <91DD7FDA88E4D011BED00000C0DD87E70BE99E@pds-gateway.pdspc.com> From: Kenny Hanson To: "FreeBSD Hackers (E-mail)" Subject: RE: (former?) Pentium secrets Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:43:05 -0500 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1457.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Allo, Take a look at http://www.x86.org hosted by Robert Collins. Tom's Hardware page(s) may have some of those publications also, I forget the link to it but you can get to it from Roberts' page(s). > -----Original Message----- > From: Terry Lambert [SMTP:tlambert@primenet.com] > Sent: Friday, September 12, 1997 2:23 AM > To: ron@cts.com > Cc: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG; freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG > Subject: Re: (former?) Pentium secrets > > > I have heard the stories about Intel putting special, unpublished > instructions > > into the Pentium for (guess who?) our buddies at MS (here I go > again:-) I > > You can: > > 1) a) goto Yahoo > b) search for "Appendix H" > > 2) Buy a copy of: > > The Undocumented PC, Second Edition > Frank VanGilluwe > ISBN: > > > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org > --- > Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present > or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 05:43:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA00463 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:43:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA00458 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:43:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA14806; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:43:21 -0700 (PDT) To: Mike Smith cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: IDE Zip drive, challenge! In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:33:13 +1000." <199709120833.SAA02046@word.smith.net.au> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:43:21 -0700 Message-ID: <14802.874068201@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > (ps. should we have a web resource somewhere where things like this > can be publicised? I think that if we were to maintain a list of > short, discrete tasks suitable for relative newcomers, we could attract > a lot more interest in this sort of thing...) Not really, though if someone wanted to revamp the appropriate section of the handbook to point to some sort of "FreeBSD project manager" page that did this, well, that'd be pretty cool! :-) Jordan P.S. I suppose one way might be to use GNATS with a new PR category, though that's hardly the most "wieldy" tool in the world either, is it? :) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 05:54:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA01058 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:54:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gatekeeper.itribe.net (gatekeeper.itribe.net [209.49.144.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id FAA01053 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:54:42 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709121249.IAA17231@gatekeeper.itribe.net> Received: forwarded by SMTP 1.5.2. Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:57:07 -0400 (EDT) From: Jamie Bowden To: "Eric A. Davis" cc: Chuck Robey , FreeBSD-Hackers Subject: Re: network programming. In-Reply-To: <199709112327.QAA10762@shark.nas.nasa.gov> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Eric A. Davis wrote: > > You want tcpdump located at /usr/sbin/tcpdump. > > > On Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:06:26 -0400 (EDT) Chuck Robey wrote > >I have to do my very first network programming, a UDP client+server, and I > >was wondering if anyone knows of how I could go about intercepting > >something sent to a UDP socket, so I could use it for troubleshooting? I > >don't want to receive it (else the client would never get it), just to > >monitor what's going on. This is my home machine, and I (obviously) have > >root here. > > > >I don't want the application written for me, just a tool I could use to > >capture what's going on between my buggy server and my buggy client. > > > >Thanks for any hints, guys. > > > >----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- > >Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data > > -- > Eric Allen Davis Network Engineer If tcpdump does all traffic on an interface, shouldn't it be renamed to reflect that capability? Not having used tcpdump, based on the name, I would have thought it was for monitoring tcp traffic, and wouldn't do udp. Jamie Bowden System Administrator, iTRiBE.net Abusenet: The Misinformation Superhighway From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 05:59:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA01245 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:59:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA01232 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:58:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA02951; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:26:47 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709121226.WAA02951@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Graham Wheeler cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 12 Sep 1997 14:16:53 +0200." <199709121216.OAA20310@cdsec.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:56:46 +0930 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > If it's a memory leak then it sounds like it's inside the stdio > > library, possibly in fopen()/fclose(). Without more data it's going to > > be hard to track this one. > > Tell me about it 8-( > > It does seem like a memory leak, as the memory use reported by top grows > over time. I have memory allocation debugging code which confirms that > I have no leaks in my code (at least of C++ objects), and the fact that > older sites have been running for months seems to confirm this. OK. More to the point then it sounds like it's a memory leak due to some change in stdio. That's getting slightly easier to chase I guess. > > If you have a forgiving customer, it would be immensely useful to build > > a copy of libc with debugging symbols and link your binary static, and > > then have the user run that until it dies. > > I may have to do this, and give them a new kernel with kernel trace support > compiled in. But this is quite tricky - they're about 1000 miles away, and > don't have the skills to do a kernel update themselves, so it will be a last > resort. You wouldn't have to do anything more than supply them with a new executable; once you had the app in a the runaway state, get a core from it and bring it back. You would want to be interested in the state of the FILE buffer pool inside the stdio library (obviously you will need to keep your local symbols!) particularly. If you were going to be more adventurous, I would make a point of logging all calls to __smakebuf() in the stdio guts, and doing some tracking on the buffers it allocates; they're supposed to be freed in fclose(). This is going to mean a fairly chunky logfile, but if you help us run this one down we will be _very_ grateful! > Well, it could at least give a good indication if it is in fact the calls > to getservbyXXX that are the cause of the problem. I think you may have found a very subtle bug in the stdio library (unless you are poking it with a bad pointer). mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 06:22:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA02294 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:22:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gatekeeper.itribe.net (gatekeeper.itribe.net [209.49.144.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id GAA02281 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:22:25 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709121317.JAA17362@gatekeeper.itribe.net> Received: forwarded by SMTP 1.5.2. Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:25:06 -0400 (EDT) From: Jamie Bowden To: Ben Black cc: "J. Weatherbee - Chief Systems Engineer" , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Stupid Routing Situation In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Or upgrade your ascend to 5.0b (not beta, just ascend's screwed up numbering scheme). It will do NAT, and this all becomes immaterial. On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Ben Black wrote: > number the link between the pipeline and the firewall using rfc 1918 > addresses. as an intermediate hop, they don't need to be advertised. > the ascend accepts traffic for your routable network and passes traffic > over to the firewall. > > On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, J. Weatherbee - Chief Systems Engineer wrote: > > > > > > > I have a ascend pipeline 50 w/o firewall connected by a crossover cable to > > a freebsd machine the rest of the network is connected to a second > > ethernet interface. I want to firewall the machines on the second > > interface. This would be easy if I two networks, but I dont have enough > > IP's for that. It is kind of like I just want the machine to act as a > > bridge but I also want that bridge to be firewalled. Any suggestions, > > something I am missing. I have done this before with two ethernet segments > > but like I said these aren't 192.168 addresses and I don't have enough for > > two networks. > > > > > > > > > Jamie Bowden System Administrator, iTRiBE.net Abusenet: The Misinformation Superhighway From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 06:26:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA02515 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:26:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA02485; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:25:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.8.5/8.6.9) id PAA28654; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:30:06 +0200 (SAT) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 28618; Fri Sep 12 15:29:42 1997 by gram.cdsec.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA20383; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:02:31 +0200 (SAT) From: Graham Wheeler Message-Id: <199709121302.PAA20383@cdsec.com> Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:02:30 +0200 (SAT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199709121226.WAA02951@word.smith.net.au> from "Mike Smith" at Sep 12, 97 09:56:46 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25-h4.1] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi again If the problem is a memory leak in the stdio stuff, then it seems a reasonable assumption that if I do a setservent(1) at the start, that the problem will be circumvented, do you agree? I'm going to get the client to try this, and see what happens. If the problem does disappear, then it would be reasonable to conclude the hypothesis above; if it makes no difference then I will have to look again (but at least the core dumps should no longer be occuring in endservent then). cheers Graham -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)23-6065/6/7 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Mobile: +27(83)-253-9864 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 06:26:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA02529 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:26:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from citadel.cdsec.com (citadel.cdsec.com [192.96.22.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA02480; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:25:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by citadel.cdsec.com (8.8.5/8.6.9) id PAA28292; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:19:06 +0200 (SAT) Received: by citadel via recvmail id 28290; Fri Sep 12 15:19:03 1997 by gram.cdsec.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA20346; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:51:53 +0200 (SAT) From: Graham Wheeler Message-Id: <199709121251.OAA20346@cdsec.com> Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:51:53 +0200 (SAT) Cc: freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199709121226.WAA02951@word.smith.net.au> from "Mike Smith" at Sep 12, 97 09:56:46 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25-h4.1] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi again > > It does seem like a memory leak, as the memory use reported by top grows > > over time. I have memory allocation debugging code which confirms that > > I have no leaks in my code (at least of C++ objects), and the fact that > > older sites have been running for months seems to confirm this. > > OK. More to the point then it sounds like it's a memory leak due to > some change in stdio. That's getting slightly easier to chase I guess. > > > > If you have a forgiving customer, it would be immensely useful to build > > > a copy of libc with debugging symbols and link your binary static, and > > > then have the user run that until it dies. > > > > I may have to do this, and give them a new kernel with kernel trace support > > compiled in. But this is quite tricky - they're about 1000 miles away, and > > don't have the skills to do a kernel update themselves, so it will be a last > > resort. > > You wouldn't have to do anything more than supply them with a new > executable; once you had the app in a the runaway state, get a core > from it and bring it back. You would want to be interested in the > state of the FILE buffer pool inside the stdio library (obviously you > will need to keep your local symbols!) particularly. The ktrace idea was suggested by someone else - when the app `freezes', the suggested running ktrace at that point to see where it it actually spinning. > If you were going to be more adventurous, I would make a point of > logging all calls to __smakebuf() in the stdio guts, and doing some > tracking on the buffers it allocates; they're supposed to be freed in > fclose(). This is going to mean a fairly chunky logfile, but if you > help us run this one down we will be _very_ grateful! Well, I should be able to do this here - if it is indeed a memory leak, then it should be possible to track it down without going so far as having the app freeze up. What about compiling with one of the malloc debug libraries that comes with the FreeBSD distribution? Would that be able to shed any light? > > Well, it could at least give a good indication if it is in fact the calls > > to getservbyXXX that are the cause of the problem. > > I think you may have found a very subtle bug in the stdio library > (unless you are poking it with a bad pointer). Which is also possible. Perhaps I should also try compile the gateway with optimisation disabled; mayhap it's the GNU compiler that's stuffing things up. -- Dr Graham Wheeler E-mail: gram@cdsec.com Citadel Data Security Phone: +27(21)23-6065/6/7 Internet/Intranet Network Specialists Mobile: +27(83)-253-9864 Firewalls/Virtual Private Networks Fax: +27(21)24-3656 Data Security Products WWW: http://www.cdsec.com/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 06:41:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA03530 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:41:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA03488; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:41:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA03107; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:09:20 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709121309.XAA03107@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Graham Wheeler cc: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith), hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 12 Sep 1997 15:02:30 +0200." <199709121302.PAA20383@cdsec.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:39:19 +0930 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > If the problem is a memory leak in the stdio stuff, then it seems a > reasonable assumption that if I do a setservent(1) at the start, that > the problem will be circumvented, do you agree? Presuming that the bug has to do with the open/close allocation, that sounds pretty reasonable to me. Forgive me my confusion, but the following fragment here (I thought I should try to reproduce your leak) doesn't appear to behave as I would expect : #include #include void main(void) { for (;;) if (getservbyport(23, NULL) == NULL) { fprintf(stderr, "argh!\n"); exit(1); } } ie. it exits immediately. I tried various assortments of parameters (eg. network and native order on the port, NULL, "tcp", "udp", etc for the protocol). 8( mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 06:48:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA04056 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:48:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA04040 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:48:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA03165; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:16:46 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709121316.XAA03165@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Jamie Bowden cc: FreeBSD-Hackers Subject: Re: network programming. In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:57:07 -0400." <199709121249.IAA17231@gatekeeper.itribe.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:46:45 +0930 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > If tcpdump does all traffic on an interface, shouldn't it be renamed to > reflect that capability? Not having used tcpdump, based on the name, I > would have thought it was for monitoring tcp traffic, and wouldn't do udp. How about you send some mail to "tcpdump@ee.lbl.gov" and tell *them* about this? It's not like this is something that was dreamed up last week or anything. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 06:49:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA04091 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:49:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA04075 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:48:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA03137; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:13:00 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709121313.XAA03137@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Graham Wheeler cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 12 Sep 1997 14:51:53 +0200." <199709121251.OAA20346@cdsec.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:42:59 +0930 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Hi again G'day 8) > > You wouldn't have to do anything more than supply them with a new > > executable; once you had the app in a the runaway state, get a core > > from it and bring it back. You would want to be interested in the > > state of the FILE buffer pool inside the stdio library (obviously you > > will need to keep your local symbols!) particularly. > > The ktrace idea was suggested by someone else - when the app `freezes', > the suggested running ktrace at that point to see where it it actually > spinning. It's quite possible that it's not actually making any syscalls at all, so ktrace isn't going to tell you much. Can you talk to the remote machine across the net? If you can login, you can of course attach a gdb to the running process and get all the data you need. > > If you were going to be more adventurous, I would make a point of > > logging all calls to __smakebuf() in the stdio guts, and doing some > > tracking on the buffers it allocates; they're supposed to be freed in > > fclose(). This is going to mean a fairly chunky logfile, but if you > > help us run this one down we will be _very_ grateful! > > Well, I should be able to do this here - if it is indeed a memory leak, > then it should be possible to track it down without going so far as > having the app freeze up. I am just pondering whether there is something particular about the behaviour that getservent() exhibits... still. > What about compiling with one of the malloc debug libraries that comes with > the FreeBSD distribution? Would that be able to shed any light? It's certainly worth trying. You can also try setting some options for the system malloc; I'd recommend 'AJ' (see malloc(3) for details on this.) > Perhaps I should also try compile the gateway with optimisation disabled; > mayhap it's the GNU compiler that's stuffing things up. What optimisation settings are you currently using? Do you custom-build your customers' systems, or are they vanilla installations? If it's something in the library that's broken, it'll be the build options for the system rather than your gateway that're at fault. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 06:51:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA04305 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:51:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id GAA04296 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 06:51:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id PAA05405; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:51:00 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id PAA15022; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:48:15 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970912154815.HN39525@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:48:15 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers) Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: <19970912101014.37786@lemis.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <19970912101014.37786@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Sep 12, 1997 10:10:14 +0930 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Greg Lehey wrote: > I've seen a lot of reports recently about problems with floppies under > FreeBSD. Now I can understand a lot of that: floppies must be the > most unreliable data storage medium I can think of, not to mention the > most expensive per byte. But I'm getting the feeling that there is > more to it than that, that possibly there's a bug in the floppy driver > and that we're blaming it on the inherent unreliability of the medium. Oh, Greg is going to take over maintenance of the FDC driver! Congratulations! :-) > I'm looking for indications which would point towards the driver. One > of these might be: > > 1. Floppy formatted under on the same machine. > 2. FreeBSD runs into hardware problems with the floppy (typically > things like checksum errors). > 3. can read the entire floppy with no trouble. There's exactly one unexplained record open where 1 - 3 does fit, and i have yet to see more user input data for this case (or have to get the drive and floppy controller myself for debugging). Greg, please think a little more about reported problems before starting this kind of postings. What has been triggering this was plainly and clearly something where a user had a problem with *the BIOS* reading the floppy. This should say enough about the media quality... > In addition, if you have any other evidence I haven't thought of which > would also point to an error in the floppy driver, please contact me. Good luck for fixing these errors... And don't forget to verify your changes on at least half a dozen of drives and controllers. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 07:03:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA05172 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:03:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from terra.Sarnoff.COM (terra.sarnoff.com [130.33.11.203]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id HAA05164 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:03:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from rminnich@localhost) by terra.Sarnoff.COM (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA29752; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:03:11 -0400 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:03:05 -0400 (EDT) From: "Ron G. Minnich" X-Sender: rminnich@terra To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: amusing problem with varargs Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk try the following program: #include #include #include int ope9(const char *name, int flags, ...) { mode_t mode; va_list ap; va_start(ap, flags); mode = va_arg(ap, mode_t); va_end(ap); return 1; } main() { int f = ope9("/etc/passwd", 1, 1); } it will on FreeBSD 2.1.0-RELEASE (CLUSTER) #4: Mon Jul 29 11:10:24 EDT 1996 p0 3% ./tv IOT trap (core dumped) p0 4% And on FreeBSD tres.sarnoff.com 2.2.1-RELEASE FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE #0: Tue Apr 1 11:51:00 GMT 1997 jkh@whisker.cdrom.com:/usr/src/sys/compile/GENERIC i386 bash$ ./tv Abort trap (core dumped) bash$ (note different traps ...) It works on: Linux ntan.sarnoff.com 2.1.24 #54 Fri Jun 6 12:54:56 EST 1997 ppc unknown (note: power pc) Linux india.sarnoff.com 2.0.30 #1 Wed Aug 13 14:03:28 EDT 1997 i486 unknown (cyrix) will it fail on other freebsd's, esp. 3.x? The problem is in the following assertion (from stdarg.h) #define va_arg(ap, type) \ ((type *)(ap += sizeof(type) < sizeof(int) ? \ (abort(), 0) : sizeof(type)))[-1] It fails because mode_t is 16 bits. So, I wonder, why did linux work? They appear to use a more sophisticated technique, from gnu cc. from /usr/lib/gcc-lib/powerpc-unknown-linux/2.7.2.1-ppclinux/include/stdarg.h ... /* We cast to void * and then to TYPE * because this avoids a warning about increasing the alignment requirement. */ #if defined (__arm__) || defined (__i386__) || defined (__i860__) || defined (__ns32000__) || defined (__vax__) /* This is for little-endian machines; small args are padded upward. */ #define va_arg(AP, TYPE) \ (AP = (__gnuc_va_list) ((char *) (AP) + __va_rounded_size (TYPE)), \ *((TYPE *) (void *) ((char *) (AP) - __va_rounded_size (TYPE)))) #else /* big-endian */ /* This is for big-endian machines; small args are padded downward. */ #define va_arg(AP, TYPE) \ (AP = (__gnuc_va_list) ((char *) (AP) + __va_rounded_size (TYPE)), \ *((TYPE *) (void *) ((char *) (AP) \ - ((sizeof (TYPE) < __va_rounded_size (char) \ ? sizeof (TYPE) : __va_rounded_size (TYPE)))))) #endif /* big-endian */ #endif /* _STDARG_H */ FYI -- ron From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 07:09:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA05460 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:09:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from earth.mat.net (root@earth.mat.net [206.246.122.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA05453 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:09:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Journey2.mat.net (journey2.mat.net [206.246.122.116]) by earth.mat.net (8.8.7/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA23938; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:09:34 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:09:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey X-Sender: chuckr@Journey2.mat.net To: Brian Mitchell cc: FreeBSD-Hackers Subject: Re: network programming. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Brian Mitchell wrote: > On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Chuck Robey wrote: > > > I have to do my very first network programming, a UDP client+server, and I > > was wondering if anyone knows of how I could go about intercepting > > something sent to a UDP socket, so I could use it for troubleshooting? I > > don't want to receive it (else the client would never get it), just to > > monitor what's going on. This is my home machine, and I (obviously) have > > root here. > > > > I don't want the application written for me, just a tool I could use to > > capture what's going on between my buggy server and my buggy client. > > > > Thanks for any hints, guys. > > man 3 pcap, man 4 bpf > > > > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@eng.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run Journey2 and picnic, both FreeBSD (301) 220-2114 | version 3.0 current -- and great FUN! ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 07:11:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA05587 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:11:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from earth.mat.net (root@earth.mat.net [206.246.122.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA05582 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:11:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Journey2.mat.net (journey2.mat.net [206.246.122.116]) by earth.mat.net (8.8.7/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA23989; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:11:42 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:11:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey X-Sender: chuckr@Journey2.mat.net To: Brian Mitchell cc: FreeBSD-Hackers Subject: Re: network programming. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Brian Mitchell wrote: > On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Chuck Robey wrote: > > > I have to do my very first network programming, a UDP client+server, and I > > was wondering if anyone knows of how I could go about intercepting > > something sent to a UDP socket, so I could use it for troubleshooting? I > > don't want to receive it (else the client would never get it), just to > > monitor what's going on. This is my home machine, and I (obviously) have > > root here. > > > > I don't want the application written for me, just a tool I could use to > > capture what's going on between my buggy server and my buggy client. > > > > Thanks for any hints, guys. > > man 3 pcap, man 4 bpf Sorry for the previous blank post. Using the pcap lib is a little much for someone who's struggling yet to get their first app working, so I'm using tcpdump, as SO many have suggested. Thanks to everyone for the suggestions, which were right on the money. > > > > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@eng.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run Journey2 and picnic, both FreeBSD (301) 220-2114 | version 3.0 current -- and great FUN! ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 07:12:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA05691 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:12:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from thought.calbbs.com (thought.calbbs.com [207.71.213.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA05685 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:12:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by thought.calbbs.com (8.8.7/8.6.12) with SMTP id HAA01998; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:12:34 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:12:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Brian Buchanan X-Sender: brian@thought.calbbs.com To: ron@cts.com cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: (former?) Pentium secrets In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 11 Sep 1997 ron@cts.com wrote: > I have heard the stories about Intel putting special, unpublished instructions > into the Pentium for (guess who?) our buddies at MS (here I go again:-) I > understand that this information became available to the rest of the software > community later (hence the microtime capability). Can anyone tell me where I > can obtain this info? http://www.x86.org has a good ammount of information on the x86 family, including undocumented features of the chips. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Brian Buchanan brian@wasteland.calbbs.com Fight SPAM! Join CAUCE at http://www.cauce.org "Using Windows NT for a server because it's easy to use is like hiring Miss America as your accountant because she's cute." 4.4BSD UNIX for the masses; just say NO to Microsoft! http://www.freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 07:13:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA05802 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:13:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sumatra.americantv.com (sumatra.americantv.com [207.170.17.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA05788 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:13:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from right.PCS (right.PCS [148.105.10.31]) by sumatra.americantv.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA14377; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:12:58 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from jlemon@localhost) by right.PCS (8.6.13/8.6.4) id JAA23785; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:12:26 -0500 Message-ID: <19970912091226.55828@right.PCS> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:12:26 -0500 From: Jonathan Lemon To: Jamie Bowden Cc: "Eric A. Davis" , Chuck Robey , FreeBSD-Hackers Subject: Re: network programming. References: <199709112327.QAA10762@shark.nas.nasa.gov> <199709121249.IAA17231@gatekeeper.itribe.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.61.1 In-Reply-To: <199709121249.IAA17231@gatekeeper.itribe.net>; from Jamie Bowden on Sep 09, 1997 at 08:57:07AM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sep 09, 1997 at 08:57:07AM -0400, Jamie Bowden wrote: > If tcpdump does all traffic on an interface, shouldn't it be renamed to > reflect that capability? Not having used tcpdump, based on the name, I > would have thought it was for monitoring tcp traffic, and wouldn't do udp. Well, it basically dumps any traffic on the interface, whether the traffic is IP, DECNET, ICMP, so it could be called ``etherdump''. However, I believe that name is already in use for different tool, provided by Sun. Also, tcpdump now understands other transport protocols (like FDDI), so that wouldn't be accurate either. Perhaps ``netdump'' would be more accurate name? Regardless, I think that the name is firmly established in the literature, and it would be confusing to change it at this point. -- Jonathan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 07:57:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA08605 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:57:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA08590 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:57:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA03400 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:24:47 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199709121424.AAA03400@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: bug in getservent() ? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:54:45 +0930 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk One of the interesting observations coming out of a recent discussion has been that getservent() behaves a little oddly with regard to port numbers. Notably, we have this fragment : (int)serv.s_port = htons((u_short)atoi(p)); By my reading, that puts a network-order short into serv.s_port. However elsewhere (eg. getservent(3)) port numbers are referenced as integer quantities; getservent(3) even goes so far as to explicitly mention that the port number is a 32-bit quantity. Any suggestions on a "correct" fix, or is this a "known" BSDism? mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 08:00:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA08880 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:00:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kevin.sunshine.net (pme118.sunshine.net [204.191.205.118]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA08869; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:00:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (cagey@localhost) by kevin.sunshine.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id HAA03680; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:59:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: kevin.sunshine.net: cagey owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 07:59:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Kevin Eliuk X-Sender: cagey@kevin.sunshine.net To: Greg Lehey cc: FreeBSD Questions , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: <19970912101014.37786@lemis.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Greg Lehey wrote: > I'm looking for indications which would point towards the driver. One > of these might be: > > 1. Floppy formatted under on the same machine. > 2. FreeBSD runs into hardware problems with the floppy (typically > things like checksum errors). > 3. can read the entire floppy with no trouble. > > If you can give me hard evidence of such occurrences, I'd like to hear > from you. I know that plenty of people can tell me that they've had > occurrences of (2), maybe in conjunction with (1), but unless you can > prove (3) as well, I don't want to hear from you. Here is a problem I had and what I included in a previous question. -=* Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 20:06:28 -0700 (PDT) Heres one I can't find in the archives. I tried to mount a 720Kb DOS Floppy with: /sbin/mount -t msdos /dev/fd0 /mnt today which returned an input/output error, and returned to tcsh prompt. I was interupted and while dealing with that I turned to notice the following. Fatal trap 9: general protection fault while in kernel mode instruction pointer = 0x8: 0xf010fa91 stack pointer = 0z10: 0xefbffee4 frame pointer = 0x10: 0xefbfff0c code segment = base 0x0, Limit 0xfffff, type 0x16 = DPL 0, pres 1, def32 1 ,gran1 processor eflags = interrupt enabled, resume, iopl=0 current process = 192(sh) interrupt mask net tty bio panic: general protection fault syncing disks... 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 giving up (this may not be accurate format but the content should be) This was a freshly formatted disk with no bad sectors report- ed. # /sbin/mount -t msdos /dev/fd0.720 /mnt Jul 11 20:35:27 kevin /kernel: fd0c: hard error reading fsbn 16 of 16-31 (ST0 40 ST1 1 ST2 0 cyl 0 hd 0 sec 17) As you might imagine, after the prior incident, I did a clean shut down immediately as to avoid another panic. Another consideration I had was that it was kernel config. Jul 12 13:54:02 kevin /kernel: fd0: 1.44MB 3.5in Although I can format a 720 without problem. ??? *=- Hope this helps. -- =| Regards, =| FreeBSD ==> http://www.FreeBSD.org =| Kevin G. Eliuk =| "Free at last, free at last, ...." British Columbia *BSD User Directory ==> http://www.cynic.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 08:01:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA09032 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:01:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gatekeeper.itribe.net (gatekeeper.itribe.net [209.49.144.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id IAA09024 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:01:50 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709121456.KAA17804@gatekeeper.itribe.net> Received: forwarded by SMTP 1.5.2. Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:04:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Jamie Bowden To: Aled Morris cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Aled Morris wrote: > On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > > > Hmmm... I for one would not want it to be the standard editor. Vi is > > > and always has been the standard editor for unix. I think it should > > > > I think you misunderstand. This doesn't replace vi and never did. > > ee is a *different* editor, for a different audience, and the fact > > that you symlink it to vi on your own box is completely and utterly > > irrelevant to that fact. :) > > I wish EE's default was Emacs keybindings though - rather than "yet > another" set of made-up keystrokes [aside: OK, flame me, they're standard > from some popular package with which I am not familiar, right?] > > Many other apps use Emacs keybindings (X programs for example) so it is > useful for newbies to at least get used to the "standard". > > In the style of this thread: "the first thing I do after installing > FreeBSD for a newbie is > echo 'emacs noexpand nomargins' >>/usr/share/misc/init.ee Does anyone here actually get the point that a newbie can't use emacs anymore than they can use vi? I hate ee as much as the rest of you, but it's small, and it tells the newbie which keys do what, which vi and emacs don't do. Jamie Bowden System Administrator, iTRiBE.net Abusenet: The Misinformation Superhighway From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 08:18:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA10026 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:18:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from roguetrader.com (brandon@cold.org [206.81.134.103]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA10019; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:18:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (brandon@localhost) by roguetrader.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA17650; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:18:32 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:18:32 -0600 (MDT) From: Brandon Gillespie To: Terry Lambert cc: jlixfeld@idirect.com, freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Installing a new disk.. In-Reply-To: <199709120719.AAA12728@usr08.primenet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Terry Lambert wrote: > > Received the following error for each partition: > > > > Error mounting /dev/wd2s1e on /mnt2 : Invalid argument > > Error mounting /dev/wd2s1e on /mnt3 : Invalid argument > > > > What am I doing wrong?! > > mkdir /mnt2 /mnt3 Uhrm, I thought /stand/sysinstall does this already. Besides, I've also seen this same problem with sysinstall (in that for some reason when trying to add a disk later it gives the above errors)--and I ended up manually adding the disk with diskabel/newfs. -Brandon From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 08:28:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA10502 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:28:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nemesis.idirect.com (root@nemesis.idirect.com [207.136.80.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA10482; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:28:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from thor.idirect.com (jlixfeld@thor.idirect.com [207.136.80.105]) by nemesis.idirect.com (8.8.5/8.8.4) with SMTP id LAA11544; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:28:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (jlixfeld@localhost) by thor.idirect.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA07912; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:28:04 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: thor.idirect.com: jlixfeld owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:28:04 -0400 (EDT) From: Jason Lixfeld To: Terry Lambert cc: freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Installing a new disk.. In-Reply-To: <199709120719.AAA12728@usr08.primenet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Those directories already exist! =( Any other options?! On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Terry Lambert wrote: > > Received the following error for each partition: > > > > Error mounting /dev/wd2s1e on /mnt2 : Invalid argument > > Error mounting /dev/wd2s1e on /mnt3 : Invalid argument > > > > What am I doing wrong?! > > mkdir /mnt2 /mnt3 > > 8-). > > > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org > --- > Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present > or previous employers. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 08:29:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA10615 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:29:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nemesis.idirect.com (root@nemesis.idirect.com [207.136.80.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA10590; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:29:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from thor.idirect.com (jlixfeld@thor.idirect.com [207.136.80.105]) by nemesis.idirect.com (8.8.5/8.8.4) with SMTP id LAA11725; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:29:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (jlixfeld@localhost) by thor.idirect.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA07930; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:29:11 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: thor.idirect.com: jlixfeld owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:29:11 -0400 (EDT) From: Jason Lixfeld To: Dan Cross cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Installing a new disk.. In-Reply-To: <19970912073925.1451.qmail@spitfire.ecsel.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I tried that aswell. I got the error: su-2.00# newfs /dev/rwd2s1e newfs: /dev/rwd2s1e: `e' partition is unavailable su-2.00# WTF?! =) On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Dan Cross wrote: > I think that you forgot to newfs the partitions. That part is > easy to do outside of sysinstall: > > > 10. (C)reated wd2s1e partition. > > # newfs /dev/rwd2s1e > # mount /dev/wd2s1e /mnt2 > > Should work if the fdisk information is correct. Hope this helps! > > - Dan C. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 08:32:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA10967 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:32:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nemesis.idirect.com (root@nemesis.idirect.com [207.136.80.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA10933; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:32:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from thor.idirect.com (jlixfeld@thor.idirect.com [207.136.80.105]) by nemesis.idirect.com (8.8.5/8.8.4) with SMTP id LAA12319; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:32:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (jlixfeld@localhost) by thor.idirect.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA07981; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:32:04 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: thor.idirect.com: jlixfeld owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:32:04 -0400 (EDT) From: Jason Lixfeld To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Installing a new disk.. In-Reply-To: <12789.874050051@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk This appeared to work! Thank you very much! =) Weird though! I would have though it required a write from the Partition area.. wow! Thanks again! :) On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > 0. /stand/sysinstall > > 1. Selected option 7 > > 2. Selected option 2 > > 3. Selected wd2 > 4. (C)reated slice using all space on disk (used 165 partition type) > > 5. (W)rote changes << -- ELIMINATE THIS STEP > > 6. (N)o boot manager > > 7. "Wrote FDISK partition information out successfully." > > 8. (Q)uit back to "Choose Custom Installation Options" > > 9. Selected option 3 > > 10. (C)reated wd2s1e partition. > > 11. Selected (F)ile system > > 12. Selected /mnt2 as mount point > > 13. Repeated steps 10 - 12 for wd2s1f partition (mounted on /mnt3). > > 14. (W)rote the changes << -- YOU WANT TO DO IT HERE. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 08:35:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA11126 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:35:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA11118 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:35:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA09845; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:35:22 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:35:22 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709121535.JAA09845@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: David Dawes Cc: Nate Williams , Terry Lambert , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes In-Reply-To: <19970912164418.24896@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> References: <199709092221.QAA26290@rocky.mt.sri.com> <199709092247.PAA01710@usr02.primenet.com> <19970910145647.33919@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> <199709101516.JAA29308@rocky.mt.sri.com> <19970912164418.24896@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [ Warning: Action not found : insert-selection, kill-selection boxes ] > >> the native FreeBSD 4.02b7 version), and my guess is that there is an > >> old Netscape app-defaults installed which refers to actions which don't > >> exist (any more) (or something similar in a .Xdefaults file). > > > >I found some stuff in my .Xdefaults file that I just removed. It came > >from my days at school, and I never thought to look there. Unfortunately, this wasn't it either. However, I switched back to using Netscape 3 after 4 locked up and due to memory usage, but I'll switch to using the newer version to see if that helps. Did you have these things popping up with netscape 3, since in it's Netscape.ad it does have the definitions. ! Netscape.ad --- app-defaults file for Netscape 3.01. .... *multiLineEditingTranslations: #override \n\ ~Meta ~Alt Ctrlk: kill-to-end-of-line() \n\ ~Meta ~Alt Ctrlw: key-select() kill-selection() \n\ ... > >> I've tested this theory by making the following change to Netscape.ad, > >> and installing it in my app-defaults directory. I then get the following > >> warning message 4 times: Note, I haven't installed the file anywhere. > The Netscape.ad I have (the one that comes with 4.02b7) doesn't have any > references to kill-selection or insert-selection, so perhaps that's your > problem (an old Netscape.ad)? The first line of the file I has is: > > ! Netscape.ad --- app-defaults file for Netscape 4.02b7. I'll try re-installing netscape 4.03b8 (or whatever it's called now), and see if they persist today. Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 08:36:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA11192 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:36:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from uk.ns.eu.org ([194.117.157.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id IAA11187 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:36:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from aledm@localhost) by uk.ns.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA13210; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:35:37 +0100 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:35:36 +0100 (BST) From: Aled Morris X-Sender: aledm@uk.ns.eu.org To: Jamie Bowden cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release In-Reply-To: <199709121456.KAA17804@gatekeeper.itribe.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Jamie Bowden wrote: > Does anyone here actually get the point that a newbie can't use emacs > anymore than they can use vi? I hate ee as much as the rest of you, but > it's small, and it tells the newbie which keys do what, which vi and emacs > don't do. I get the point entirely - my point is that ee is OK for newbies, especially with those features you describe, but it doesn't have to reinvent keymapping! Emacs "C-e" for EOL, "C-a" for BOL are just fine. Ee even supports these mappings, BUT my complaint is that the bogus ones are the default. Aled -- tel +44 973 207987 O- aledm@routers.co.uk From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 08:41:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA11531 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:41:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmb@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA11525; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:41:27 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Message-Id: <199709121541.IAA11525@hub.freebsd.org> Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release To: boia01@castor.GEL.USherb.CA (Alex.Boisvert) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:41:27 -0700 (PDT) Cc: ksmm@cybercom.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Alex.Boisvert" at Sep 12, 97 07:44:22 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Alex.Boisvert wrote: > > > I think the most important aspect of an editor for newbies is to have the > following functions available without thinking: > > Backspace = Delete character to the left > Delete = Delete character to the right > Arrow keys = Move cursor through text > Loadé/Sae file = Direct key mapping (F2 and F3 respectively [usually]) > (but could be any other key) Zile looks good...a nice lightweight editor that does not force me to learn a new collection of keystrokes. (i have not completed the tutorial or the info files yet) let me add to the list above: C-s is very different i cant repeat C-s as i do in emacs. C-s is case sensitive C-S does not remember the last search pattern used i have not been able to find search and replace, yet. jmb From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 08:52:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA12289 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:52:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from access.sfc.wide.ad.jp (/OFXdqjhrOSbSMj3l6m4cxRMvGPgK0yP@bourbon.sfc.wide.ad.jp [203.178.139.171]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA12257; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:52:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bourbon.sfc.wide.ad.jp (t9PX18TnNvP5tpldtpRRn/1BybDkCzVL@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by access.sfc.wide.ad.jp (8.8.7/3.5Wpl107/15/97) with ESMTP id AAA19654; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:51:40 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <199709121551.AAA19654@access.sfc.wide.ad.jp> To: root@uhf.wireless.net Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, ports@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: max@wide.ad.jp From: Masafumi NAKANE/=?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCQ2Y6LDJtSjgbKEI=?= In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:39:16 +0000 (GMT)" References: X-Mailer: Mew version 1.70 on Emacs 19.28.1 / Mule 2.3 X-PGP-Fingerprint: 00 D8 2C CA C7 75 D4 40 5C 34 39 BA A5 46 C0 CC Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:51:39 +0900 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Just tried to compile trafshow from the ports collection, It > seems to me that it is broken. Can someone please mark the 3.0 > trafshow port as broken? I'm not too sure what you mean by 3.0 trafshow, though, trafshow port in ports-current compiles without any problem on my systems, one of which is -current built just yesterday and the other of which is -current built about a week and a halft ago. Cheers, Max From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 09:01:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA13018 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:01:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from news1.gtn.com (news1.gtn.com [194.77.0.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA12978; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:00:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by news1.gtn.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with UUCP id RAA05018; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:45:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from andreas@localhost) by klemm.gtn.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA00353; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:27:44 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19970912172743.64756@klemm.gtn.com> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:27:43 +0200 From: Andreas Klemm To: Torsten Blum Cc: mark@grondar.za, ports@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Major bogon in tcp_wrappers port. References: <19970911075604.13003@klemm.gtn.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79 In-Reply-To: ; from Torsten Blum on Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 10:58:42AM +0200 X-Disclaimer: A free society is one where it is safe to be unpopular X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT SMP Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 10:58:42AM +0200, Torsten Blum wrote: > > Everybody has different needs for security. There are more than enough > users who'll never need tcpwrapper because > - they only have a small set of "services" running on these boxes > (for example www server, dns, sendmail etc) > - we have users who really don't care about security (sad but true). > They never care to configure hosts.{allow,deny} or even check their > logfiles > - Machines without connections "external" connection > and many many more ok, agreed. > Andreas, have you _ever_ configured tcpd ? tcpd is not a standalone daemon. > To activate it, you have to modify inetd.conf. Yes I'm using it in the company for our secured FreeBSD internet gateway ... > Don't get me wrong, I'm all for a "more" secure system, but you don't get > this out of the box. You _always_ have to configure something. Ok, agreed. Peace man ;-) -- Andreas Klemm | klemm.gtn.com - powered by Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/SMP.html http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/benches.html From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 09:01:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA13057 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:01:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from athena.milk.it (ssigala@[195.206.2.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA13025 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:01:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (ssigala@localhost) by athena.milk.it (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id SAA01070 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:01:04 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: athena.milk.it: ssigala owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:01:04 +0200 (MET DST) From: "S. Sigala" X-Sender: ssigala@athena.milk.it To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Some more news about the Zile editor Vs ee Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, first of all, i wish to thank all for the feedback and for the bug reports. I was a bit misunderstand-ed (or i have not expressed the idea clearly): i don't want to replace the VI editor with my text editor, i proposed replacing the editor usually suggested for "newbies": `ee'. This is usually the first editor that the FreeBSD newbies use in the first days, and is called by the sysinstall program for customize some configuration files, if i remember correctly. Someone thinks that 'ee' is good, someone not. What i wanted to know is why 'ee' is good and why is not (and if Zile is ok or no to replace it). - There are still many bugs in the editor, and many of you found some new (like the C-x C-q stupid typo in the Mini Help window; I'm sure that someone "kill -9"ed the editor to quit, because the not so Helping Help :-) ) Obviously i don't want to replace any editor with one that is more bogus, since it is for now alpha quality code (maybe in the future...). - I didn't remember to document the Meta- bug that inserts crap like "\37777777750" in the buffer :) - I don't currently know how to correct the UNIX typical problem of Delete-Backspace difference. Currently the Zile key handling is based upon ncurses calls, and works most the time under the console of FreeBSD (minus the Alt- keys) and Linux. ncurses returns KEY_DC for the delete key and KEY_BACKSPACE for the backspace key. This is a piece of code: case KEY_DC: /* DEL */ return KBD_DEL; case KEY_BACKSPACE: /* BS */ #ifdef __linux__ case 0177: /* BS */ #endif return KBD_BS; Under X-Window (Linux and FreeBSD ones) this doesn't work, and i don't know why. - Converting to bmake should be fairly simple, and so should be adding a few #defines to not depend on the /usr/share stuff. Regards, -sandro P.S. Thanks again for the answers; i know now what to fix and how to improve the editor. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 09:03:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA13221 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:03:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lustig.com (lustig.com [204.97.12.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA13208 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:02:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Lustig.COM (devious.lustig.com [192.168.1.3]) by gate.lustig.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA10665; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:02:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from barry@localhost) by Lustig.COM (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA03060; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:02:45 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709121602.MAA03060@Lustig.COM> Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 4.2mach v148) In-Reply-To: <199709061855.NAA00511@argus.tfs.net> X-Nextstep-Mailer: Mail 4.2mach (Enhance 2.0b6) Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.148.RR) From: Barry Lustig Date: Fri, 12 Sep 97 12:02:42 -0400 To: jbryant@tfs.net Subject: Re: The back-door bill [was Re: Key escrow] cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Reply-To: barry@Lustig.COM References: <199709061855.NAA00511@argus.tfs.net> X-Organizations: Barry Lustig & Associates Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jim, It looks like the text wasn't completely fabricated. As reported by the folks at CDG, the text that I posted was what the FBI was shopping around to different committee members. Before you sound off about "lame pukes" spreading false information, you might want to get *your* facts correct. This is just off of Reuters: http://www.yahoo.com/headlines/970912/tech/stories/encrypt_2.html Friday September 12 10:20 AM EDT US House Intel Panel Approves Encryption Limits WASHINGTON - The House Select Intelligence Committee on Thursday passed a substitute bill that if enacted would for the first time impose sweeping domestic restrictions on use of computer encoding technology. The committee voted in a closed session on the substitute to a bill authored by Rep. Bob Goodlatte, Republican of Virginia, that began as an effort to prevent domestic restrictions and relax export limits on encryption technology. But the legislation faces as uncertain future, as other committees have passed different versions of the bill. Less than two months ago, opponents of strict U.S. export controls on encryption announced that they had the support of a majority of the House for a bill to eliminate most restrictions. But since then, the Clinton administration stepped up its lobbying campaign, sending the heads of the FBI and the National Security Agency to Capitol Hill to brief lawmakers in classified hearings on the dangers posed by free export of encryption. Encryption, which can be included in everything from telephones to electronic mail software, uses mathematical formulas to scramble information and protect it from snoopers, hackers, or criminals. The technology is an increasingly critical means of securing electronic commerce and global communications on the Internet. On Tuesday, the House National Security Committee gutted the bill to relax export controls. An amendment to tighten export controls passed on a 45 to one vote, with more than a dozen backers of the original bill voting for the more- stringent restrictions. On Thursday, lawmakers offered further amendments in the Select Intelligence Committee and the Commerce Committee which would impose domestic controls on the use of encryption, currently unregulated with the United States. The amendments would require all encryption manufacturers to include a feature allowing the government to decode any message covertly. The proposals also would require network operators, Internet providers and phone companies to ensure that any encryption services they provide to customers can be cracked by law enforcement agencies. FBI director Louis Freeh has said such legislation is needed to allow law enforcement agencies to continue to tap conversations of criminals and terrorists as encryption spreads. But the high-tech industry countered that the technology to allow eavesdropping would increase the vulnerability and raise the cost of all electronic messages sent by law-abiding citizens and businesses, while criminals would disable the back doors. And Internet user groups and civil libertarians said such domestic restrictions are likely to lead to Orwellian infringements of citizen's right to privacy. Some argue the restriction are unconstitutional. Copyright, Reuters Ltd. All rights reserved On Sat, 6 Sep 1997, Jim Bryant wrote: > In reply: > [lots of completely fabricated text deleted] > > Of course accrding to the actual bill, the text the above is also a > complete fabrication. Nothing pisses me off more than lame pukes that > go spreading bogus paranoia about pending legislation by completly > fabricating what the legislation is about. > > At least they managed to get the title of the bill correct. > > For more information look up the entire bill text [S.909-IS] at: > > > or use the link to thomas at > > > In the mean time, all of the section headers are directly pasted from > the bill below. > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > S.909 > > Secure Public Networks Act (Introduced in the Senate) > > > S 909 IS > > 105th CONGRESS > > 1st Session > > S. 909 > > To encourage and facilitate the creation of secure public networks for > communication, commerce, education, medicine, and government. > > IN THE SENATE OF THE UNITED STATES > > June 16, 1997 > > Mr. MCCAIN (for himself, Mr. KERREY, and Mr. HOLLINGS) introduced the > following bill; which was read twice and referred to the Committee on > Commerce, Science, and Transportation > > > > A BILL > > To encourage and facilitate the creation of secure public networks for > communication, commerce, education, medicine, and government. > > Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United > States of America in Congress assembled, > > SEC. 1. SHORT TITLE. > > This Act may be cited as the `Secure Public Networks Act' . > > SEC. 2. DECLARATION OF POLICY. > > It is the policy of the United States to encourage and facilitate the > creation of secure public networks for communication, commerce, education, > research, medicine and government. > > TITLE I--DOMESTIC USES OF ENCRYPTION > > SEC. 101. LAWFUL USE OF ENCRYPTION. > > Except as otherwise provided by this Act or otherwise provided by law, it > shall be lawful for any person within any State to use any encryption, > regardless of encryption algorithm selected, encryption key length chosen, > or implementation technique or medium used. > > SEC. 102. PROHIBITION ON MANDATORY THIRD PARTY ESCROW OF KEYS USED FOR > ENCRYPTION OF CERTAIN COMMUNICATIONS. > > Neither the Federal Government nor a State may require the escrow of an > encryption key with a third party in the case of an encryption key used > solely to encrypt communications between private persons within the United > States. > > SEC. 103. VOLUNTARY PRIVATE SECTOR PARTICIPATION IN KEY MANAGEMENT > STRUCTURE. > > The participation of the private persons in the key management > infrastructure enabled by this Act is voluntary. > > SEC. 104. UNLAWFUL USE OF ENCRYPTION. > > Whoever knowingly encrypts data or communications in furtherance of the > commission of a criminal offense for which the person may be prosecuted in > a court of competent jurisdiction and may be sentenced to a term of > imprisonment of more than one year shall, in addition to any penalties for > the underlying criminal offense, be fined under title 18, United States > Code, or imprisoned not more than five years, or both, for a first > conviction or fined under title 18, United States Code, or imprisoned not > more than ten years, or both, for a second or subsequent conviction. The > mere use of encryption shall not constitute probable cause to believe that > a crime is being or has been committed. > > SEC. 105. PRIVACY PROTECTION. > > (a) IN GENERAL- It shall be unlawful for any person to intentionally-- > > (1) obtain or use recovery information without lawful authority for the > purpose of decrypting data or communications; > > (2) exceed lawful authority in decrypting data or communications; > > (3) break the encryption code of another person without lawful authority > for the purpose of violating the privacy, security or property rights of > that person; > > (4) intercept on a public communications network without lawful authority > the intellectual property of another person for the purpose of violating > the intellectual property rights of that person; > > (5) impersonate another person for the purpose of obtaining recovery > information of that person without lawful authority; > > (6) issue a key to another person in furtherance of a crime; > > (7) disclose recovery information in violation of a provision of this Act > ; or > > jim > -- > All opinions expressed are mine, if you | "I will not be pushed, stamped, > think otherwise, then go jump into turbid | briefed, debriefed, indexed, > or radioactive waters and yell WAHOO !!! | numbered!" - #1, "The Prisoner" > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Inet: jbryant@tfs.net AX.25: kc5vdj@wv0t.#neks.ks.usa.noam grid: EM28PW > voice: KC5VDJ - 6 & 2 Meters AM/FM/SSB, 70cm FM. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > HF/6M/2M: IC-706-MkII, 2M: HTX-212, 2M: HTX-202, 70cm: HTX-404, Packet: > KPC-3+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 09:03:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA13241 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:03:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmb@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA13216; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:02:59 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Message-Id: <199709121602.JAA13216@hub.freebsd.org> Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release To: jamie@itribe.net (Jamie Bowden) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:02:58 -0700 (PDT) Cc: aledm@routers.co.uk, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709121456.KAA17804@gatekeeper.itribe.net> from "Jamie Bowden" at Sep 12, 97 11:04:26 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jamie Bowden wrote: > > On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Aled Morris wrote: > > > In the style of this thread: "the first thing I do after installing > > FreeBSD for a newbie is > > echo 'emacs noexpand nomargins' >>/usr/share/misc/init.ee > > Does anyone here actually get the point that a newbie can't use emacs > anymore than they can use vi? I hate ee as much as the rest of you, but > it's small, and it tells the newbie which keys do what, which vi and emacs > don't do. yes, we all get the point. that's why ee as installed as the default editor. it has a help menu across the top of the screen. but why make them learn ee key-bindings, and then when they move on to a better editor force them to learn a new set of key-bindings? that's just torturing the poor unsuspecting newbie. vi key-bindings are not an option--a modal editor will confuse the daylights out of them. so lets make emacs key-bindings the system default for ee. jmb From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 09:05:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA13418 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:05:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gatekeeper.itribe.net (gatekeeper.itribe.net [209.49.144.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA13401 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:04:40 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709121559.LAA18140@gatekeeper.itribe.net> Received: forwarded by SMTP 1.5.2. Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:07:17 -0400 (EDT) From: Jamie Bowden To: Mike Smith cc: FreeBSD-Hackers Subject: Re: network programming. In-Reply-To: <199709121316.XAA03165@word.smith.net.au> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Mike Smith wrote: > > If tcpdump does all traffic on an interface, shouldn't it be renamed to > > reflect that capability? Not having used tcpdump, based on the name, I > > would have thought it was for monitoring tcp traffic, and wouldn't do udp. > > How about you send some mail to "tcpdump@ee.lbl.gov" and tell *them* > about this? It's not like this is something that was dreamed up last > week or anything. > > mike > > I wasn't aware it came from ee. I only commented on it since I used to use tools on SunOS called packetman and etherman. Packetman grabbed anything that looked like a packet of course, and etherman grabbed everything that went across the interface. Jamie Bowden System Administrator, iTRiBE.net Abusenet: The Misinformation Superhighway From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 09:08:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA13592 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:08:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lestat.nas.nasa.gov (lestat.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.50.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA13585 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:08:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lestat.nas.nasa.gov (8.8.6/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA06482; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:01:57 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709121601.JAA06482@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> X-Authentication-Warning: lestat.nas.nasa.gov: localhost [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Mike Smith Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: IDE Zip drive, challenge! Reply-To: Jason Thorpe From: Jason Thorpe Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:01:57 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:33:13 +1000 Mike Smith wrote: > 1) The drive is not locked when the disk is mounted. > > 2) Once a disk has been ejected and another inserted, the disk > reports an error condition that the IDE driver can't handle. > > In the case of 1), we need media lock/unlock support as for SCSI > removables. This should be moderately easy. > > In the case of 2), the error is almost certainly a "media changed" > notification. This status needs to be recognised and correctly > acknowledged. ...This is precicely why NetBSD's ATAPI code uses the SCSI disk and cdrom drivers; in fact, most of the command sending and error recovery code, as well as the cores of the drivers, is shared between SCSI and ATAPI. You may want to take a look at how we did it, to get ideas. > In both cases, there should be ATAPI standards for dealing with these > situations, and we can hope that Iomega have done the right thing and > followed them. My guess is "yes", considering that Iomega went out of their way to convince a NetBSD developer that "SCSI over a different transport" was the right way to do ATAPI. In fact, the ATAPI ZIPs probably natively use SCSI commands, and only present an IDE emulation interface so that you can boot off them. Jason R. Thorpe thorpej@nas.nasa.gov NASA Ames Research Center Home: +1 408 866 1912 NAS: M/S 258-6 Work: +1 415 604 0935 Moffett Field, CA 94035 Pager: +1 415 428 6939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 09:17:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA14163 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:17:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gatekeeper.itribe.net (gatekeeper.itribe.net [209.49.144.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA14150 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:16:55 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709121611.MAA18193@gatekeeper.itribe.net> Received: forwarded by SMTP 1.5.2. Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:19:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Jamie Bowden To: Aled Morris cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Aled Morris wrote: > On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Jamie Bowden wrote: > > > Does anyone here actually get the point that a newbie can't use emacs > > anymore than they can use vi? I hate ee as much as the rest of you, but > > it's small, and it tells the newbie which keys do what, which vi and emacs > > don't do. > > I get the point entirely - my point is that ee is OK for newbies, > especially with those features you describe, but it doesn't have to > reinvent keymapping! Emacs "C-e" for EOL, "C-a" for BOL are just fine. > Ee even supports these mappings, BUT my complaint is that the bogus ones are > the default. > > Aled And my point is: Hoe the hell is a newbie supposed to know emacs key bindings? They are documented internally in emacs, assuming you know that M- means meta, and that meta is , etc. I don't like ee, I use vi almost exclusively, with some emacs for large jobs with multiple files, but I wouldn't expect a new user to know how to use either of them. Jamie Bowden System Administrator, iTRiBE.net Abusenet: The Misinformation Superhighway From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 09:33:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA15296 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:33:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA15289 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:33:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA10047; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:33:31 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:33:31 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709121633.KAA10047@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: HPGL format X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Does anyone know how to convert this to something a bit more standard? Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 09:35:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA15604 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:35:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from onyx.atipa.com (user12438@ns.atipa.com [208.128.22.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA15599 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:35:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail-queue invoked by uid 1018); 12 Sep 1997 16:39:29 -0000 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:39:29 -0600 (MDT) From: Atipa X-Sender: freebsd@dot.ishiboo.com To: Luigi Rizzo cc: "K.J.Koster" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, questions@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: <199709120935.LAA03134@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > Wild guess: driver needs to recalibrate every once in a while, so if you > > write a whole floppy at once, it slowly loses calibration. MS-DOS > > `recalibrates' by writing the FAT every block or so. How does that sound? > > I doubt it writes the fat so often, performance would be much worse > than the 30-40K/s we get now... > > Luigi It IS worse! I know that my floppies run about 14-15 kb/sec sustained. FTP'ing from a Linux floppy to FreeBSD (since my floppy drive doesn't work w/ FreeBSD) always goes about 14-15 kb/sec. dd gives similar results. Kevin From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 09:37:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA15851 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:37:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ns2.harborcom.net (root@ns2.harborcom.net [206.158.4.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA15840 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:37:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (bradley@localhost) by ns2.harborcom.net (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA08180; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:37:16 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:37:16 -0400 (EDT) From: Bradley Dunn X-Sender: bradley@ns2.harborcom.net To: "Ron G. Minnich" cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: amusing problem with varargs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Ron G. Minnich wrote: > will it fail on other freebsd's, esp. 3.x? > > The problem is in the following assertion (from stdarg.h) > #define va_arg(ap, type) \ > ((type *)(ap += sizeof(type) < sizeof(int) ? \ > (abort(), 0) : sizeof(type)))[-1] > > It fails because mode_t is 16 bits. This is fixed in 2.2-STABLE and 3.0-CURRENT. See http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/src/sys/i386/include/stdarg.h pbd -- "Seems she thought of me as some mystic, fatalistic, mystical guru Me, I haven't got a clue." -- Tears for Fears, "Cold" From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 09:41:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA16203 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:41:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from horst.bfd.com (horst.bfd.com [204.160.242.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA16195 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:40:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from harlie.bfd.com (bastion.bfd.com [204.160.242.14]) by horst.bfd.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA22697; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:40:47 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:40:47 -0700 (PDT) From: "Eric J. Schwertfeger" To: Sebastian Lederer cc: Charlie & , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do you have some neat configuration files? In-Reply-To: <34190B2D.326A3F27@bonn-online.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Sebastian Lederer wrote: > A problem with window manager configuration files could be that most of them > contain menu definitions for starting applications, and usually 90% of the > menu entries will point to applications which are not installed. That would > be quite frustrating for newbies if they try out the menus and absolutely > nothing happen, not even an error message. So at least from that point of > view, the configuration files should be quite minimal, maybe with lots of > commented out entries for "common" applications. Well, I'm sure there are > people who think quite the opposite... How about extending the config files to allow for "if this file doesn't exist, ignore this line", or "if this file isn't in the path, ignore this line." Done properly, it would only cause minor code bloat, and a little extra work at start/restart time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 09:53:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA17289 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:53:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from GndRsh.aac.dev.com (GndRsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA17254; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:53:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by GndRsh.aac.dev.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) id JAA20660; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:52:01 -0700 (PDT) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199709121652.JAA20660@GndRsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: PCI DLink DFE500-TX 10/100MB DEC Tulip 21140AE REV2-C Chipset Ethernet Card In-Reply-To: from Jason Lixfeld at "Sep 12, 97 02:05:10 am" To: jlixfeld@idirect.com (Jason Lixfeld) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:51:26 -0700 (PDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL25 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Is their support for this card? It did not have the drivers for it when I > attempted to use this card when doing an FTP install. I used a 3Com > 3C509B 10MB ISA. BSD/OS and Linux both had problems or driver > incompatibilities when 21140AC REV1-B updated to 21140AE REV2-C. I'm > wondering if FreeBSD 2.2.2 has the same incompatibility, and is their a > driver that will support the new chipset, and where do I find it to > compile it into a new kernel?! http://www.3am-software.com, thats Matt Thomas' site who is the author of the BSD drivers. The latest revision of his driver code should support this card. If you do install this driver could you give me an ack or nack on if it worked correctly or not, especially if you can test in both 10MB and 100MB modes. -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation, Inc. Reliable computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 09:56:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA17566 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:56:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA17559 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:56:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA00251; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 02:24:27 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199709121654.CAA00251@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Jason Thorpe cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: IDE Zip drive, challenge! In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 09:01:57 MST." <199709121601.JAA06482@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 02:24:26 +0930 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > ....This is precicely why NetBSD's ATAPI code uses the SCSI disk and cdrom > drivers; in fact, most of the command sending and error recovery code, > as well as the cores of the drivers, is shared between SCSI and ATAPI. > > You may want to take a look at how we did it, to get ideas. Natch. This is really the next level up; ie. a rewrite of the ATA/ ATAPI support, which is Big Hacker material, but definitely the way to go longer term. This is likely to want to wait on Justin's CAM implementation, as otherwise we'll just be duplicating work. > > In both cases, there should be ATAPI standards for dealing with these > > situations, and we can hope that Iomega have done the right thing and > > followed them. > > My guess is "yes", considering that Iomega went out of their way to convince > a NetBSD developer that "SCSI over a different transport" was the right > way to do ATAPI. In fact, the ATAPI ZIPs probably natively use SCSI commands, > and only present an IDE emulation interface so that you can boot off them. That doesn't sound unreasonable. It's nice to know that someone at Iomega wants to talk to *someone*. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 10:11:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA18727 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:11:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA18712 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:11:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA10321; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:11:04 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:11:04 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709121711.LAA10321@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: David Dawes Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes In-Reply-To: <199709121535.JAA09845@rocky.mt.sri.com> References: <199709092221.QAA26290@rocky.mt.sri.com> <199709092247.PAA01710@usr02.primenet.com> <19970910145647.33919@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> <199709101516.JAA29308@rocky.mt.sri.com> <19970912164418.24896@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> <199709121535.JAA09845@rocky.mt.sri.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [ Warning: Action not found : insert-selection, kill-selection boxes ] David wrote: > my guess is that there is an old Netscape app-defaults installed which > refers to actions which don't exist (any more) (or something similar > in a .Xdefaults file). I replied: > I found some stuff in my .Xdefaults file that I just removed. It came > from my days at school, and I never thought to look there. then, I wrote: > Unfortunately, this wasn't it either. However, I switched back to > using Netscape 3 after 4 locked up and due to memory usage, but I'll > switch to using the newer version to see if that helps. No joy. I just installed the new version, and the same errors occur. I noticed that although 'insert-selection' doesn't live in the Netscape.ad file, it does still live in the netscape.bin binary that's installed in /usr/local/lib/netscape. Any other hints? (I've gotten email from others who have the same problems, so I know I'm not alone in this. :) Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 10:20:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA19949 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:20:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nemesis.idirect.com (root@nemesis.idirect.com [207.136.80.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA19924; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:20:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from thor.idirect.com (jlixfeld@thor.idirect.com [207.136.80.105]) by nemesis.idirect.com (8.8.5/8.8.4) with SMTP id NAA10215; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:20:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (jlixfeld@localhost) by thor.idirect.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA09591; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:20:13 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: thor.idirect.com: jlixfeld owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:20:13 -0400 (EDT) From: Jason Lixfeld To: Narvi cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PCI DLink DFE500-TX 10/100MB DEC Tulip 21140AE REV2-C Chipset Ethernet Card In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm going to grab the driver off the site. I need the practise compiling kernels on BSD! :) I'm a linux expert, but due to it's limitations that our organization is quickly discovering, a switch to FreeBSD seems prudent at this point! On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Narvi wrote: > > On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Jason Lixfeld wrote: > > > Is their support for this card? It did not have the drivers for it when I > > attempted to use this card when doing an FTP install. I used a 3Com > > 3C509B 10MB ISA. BSD/OS and Linux both had problems or driver > > incompatibilities when 21140AC REV1-B updated to 21140AE REV2-C. I'm > > wondering if FreeBSD 2.2.2 has the same incompatibility, and is their a > > driver that will support the new chipset, and where do I find it to > > compile it into a new kernel?! > > > > Thanks in Advance, > > > > Jason Lixfeld > > > > > > Such driver exists and is available, look at www.3am-software.com. I can > mail the tar files to you aswell. It is a drop-in replacement. > > Sander > > There is no love, no good, no happiness and no future - > all these are just illusions. > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 10:25:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA20511 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:25:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA20359; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:23:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (haldjas.folklore.ee [172.17.2.1] (may be forged)) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.8.6/8.8.4) with SMTP id UAA03637; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:04:53 +0300 (EEST) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:04:53 +0300 (EEST) From: Narvi To: Jason Lixfeld cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PCI DLink DFE500-TX 10/100MB DEC Tulip 21140AE REV2-C Chipset Ethernet Card In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Jason Lixfeld wrote: > Is their support for this card? It did not have the drivers for it when I > attempted to use this card when doing an FTP install. I used a 3Com > 3C509B 10MB ISA. BSD/OS and Linux both had problems or driver > incompatibilities when 21140AC REV1-B updated to 21140AE REV2-C. I'm > wondering if FreeBSD 2.2.2 has the same incompatibility, and is their a > driver that will support the new chipset, and where do I find it to > compile it into a new kernel?! > > Thanks in Advance, > > Jason Lixfeld > > Such driver exists and is available, look at www.3am-software.com. I can mail the tar files to you aswell. It is a drop-in replacement. Sander There is no love, no good, no happiness and no future - all these are just illusions. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 10:34:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA21553 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:34:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from verdi.nethelp.no (verdi.nethelp.no [195.1.171.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA21547 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:34:24 -0700 (PDT) From: sthaug@nethelp.no Received: (qmail 5981 invoked by uid 1001); 12 Sep 1997 17:00:32 +0000 (GMT) To: jamie@itribe.net Cc: mike@smith.net.au, FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: network programming. In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:07:17 -0400 (EDT)" References: <199709121559.LAA18140@gatekeeper.itribe.net> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.05+ on Emacs 19.28.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:00:31 +0200 Message-ID: <5979.874083631@verdi.nethelp.no> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I wasn't aware it came from ee. I only commented on it since I used to > use tools on SunOS called packetman and etherman. Packetman grabbed > anything that looked like a packet of course, and etherman grabbed > everything that went across the interface. ... but tcpdump predate these tools by quite a bit. Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 10:47:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA22549 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:47:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hps.sso.wdl.lmco.com (hps.sso.wdl.lmco.com [158.186.22.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA22544 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:47:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hps (hps.sso.wdl.lmco.com) by hps.sso.wdl.lmco.com (4.1/SSO-4.01-LMCO) id AA05076; Fri, 12 Sep 97 13:44:44 EDT Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:44:44 -0400 (EDT) From: "Richard P. Toren" X-Sender: rpt@hps To: hackers Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk unsubscribe From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 10:48:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA22678 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:48:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA22668 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:48:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA00497; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:16:37 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199709121746.DAA00497@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Nate Williams cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: HPGL format In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:33:31 CST." <199709121633.KAA10047@rocky.mt.sri.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:16:37 +0930 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Does anyone know how to convert this to something a bit more standard? Like what? MS Word for Windows 2.0 had a reasonable HPGL import module; it wasn't shipped with 6.0 but worked OK there too. You ended up with a WMF embedded in your Word document, but couldn't do much more with it. Canon were flogging an HPGL rasteriser called Print-a-plot with the BJ printers, but I don't think it did bitmap output. Short of that, write your own HPGL parser; it's pretty trivial(*). The biggest problem is that HPGL is designed for vector output, so you have to worry about line thickness and all that jazz. mike (*) 8) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 10:51:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA22926 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:51:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA22914 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:50:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id TAA08419; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:50:56 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id TAA16028; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:38:41 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970912193841.OJ24891@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:38:41 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: durham@w2xo.pgh.pa.us (Jim Durham) Subject: Re: wt driver in 3.0-SNAP 970807 crashes system References: <341760EF.41C67EA6@w2xo.pgh.pa.us> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <341760EF.41C67EA6@w2xo.pgh.pa.us>; from Jim Durham on Sep 10, 1997 23:09:35 -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jim Durham wrote: > I recently installed 3.0_SNAP 970807.. > > Tried to read some tapes made on my Wangtek drive under > 2.1.6, which used to read OK. Can't read them at all. > They are tar gzipped archives and dump tapes. Tar tvzf /dev/rwt0 > returns "not in gzipped format" and restore -if /dev/rwt0 returns > "Not dump tape". Does this only happen for 3.0-current, or also for 2.2-stable? The latter would be more alarming (right before 2.2.5), but my test machine with the wt drives is currently running 2.2., so i could investigate it there. Investigating on 3.0-current is a little harder right now. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 10:51:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA22977 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:51:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA22964 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:51:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA10671; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:51:21 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:51:21 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709121751.LAA10671@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Mike Smith Cc: Nate Williams , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: HPGL format In-Reply-To: <199709121746.DAA00497@word.smith.net.au> References: <199709121633.KAA10047@rocky.mt.sri.com> <199709121746.DAA00497@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Does anyone know how to convert this to something a bit more standard? > > Like what? Gif, or some other image. > MS Word for Windows 2.0 had a reasonable HPGL import > module; it wasn't shipped with 6.0 but worked OK there too. You ended > up with a WMF embedded in your Word document, but couldn't do much more > with it. Hmm, could I cut/paste from it into something like paint-brush, and end up with a GIF/TIF from it? > Short of that, write your own HPGL parser; it's pretty trivial(*). It'd be easier to print the darn thing and scan it, but we'd rather not lose the resolution in the process. Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 10:57:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA23550 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:57:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (word.smith.net.au [202.0.75.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA23540 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:57:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA00551; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:25:37 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199709121755.DAA00551@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Nate Williams cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: HPGL format In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:51:21 CST." <199709121751.LAA10671@rocky.mt.sri.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:25:37 +0930 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > Does anyone know how to convert this to something a bit more standard? > > > > Like what? > > Gif, or some other image. Ok, so you want to rasterise it. > > MS Word for Windows 2.0 had a reasonable HPGL import > > module; it wasn't shipped with 6.0 but worked OK there too. You ended > > up with a WMF embedded in your Word document, but couldn't do much more > > with it. > > Hmm, could I cut/paste from it into something like paint-brush, and end > up with a GIF/TIF from it? You could take a screen grab of it, but not, AFAIR, at any other resolution. ie. the rasteriser generated the image at screen resolution for display, and printer resolution for printing, but not at some arbitrary resolution for cut-n-paste. > > Short of that, write your own HPGL parser; it's pretty trivial(*). > > It'd be easier to print the darn thing and scan it, but we'd rather not > lose the resolution in the process. Understood. How big is the image? Various ugly thoughts come to mind (eg. write a parser in Tcl, render the image onto a canvas and then dump the canvas as Postscript), but many of them are a bit gutless. Someone else here may have written an HPGL rasteriser of course. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 11:01:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA23935 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:01:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA23929 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:01:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA10801; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:01:28 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:01:28 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709121801.MAA10801@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Mike Smith Cc: Nate Williams , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: HPGL format In-Reply-To: <199709121755.DAA00551@word.smith.net.au> References: <199709121751.LAA10671@rocky.mt.sri.com> <199709121755.DAA00551@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Hmm, could I cut/paste from it into something like paint-brush, and end > > up with a GIF/TIF from it? > > You could take a screen grab of it, but not, AFAIR, at any other > resolution. ie. the rasteriser generated the image at screen > resolution for display, and printer resolution for printing, but not at > some arbitrary resolution for cut-n-paste. *argh* > > > Short of that, write your own HPGL parser; it's pretty trivial(*). > > > > It'd be easier to print the darn thing and scan it, but we'd rather not > > lose the resolution in the process. > > Understood. How big is the image? Don't know, someone handed it to me and said 'I need a gif image from this'. If it's alot of work we'll simply print it and scan the image in, but I had hoped one of the ports knew how to convert *from* HPGL into something we can handle. Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 11:02:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA23964 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:02:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bmccane.uit.net (bmccane.uit.net [209.83.205.48]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA23892 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:01:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bmccane.uit.net (localhost.mccane.com [127.0.0.1]) by bmccane.uit.net (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA20154; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:58:17 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199709121758.MAA20154@bmccane.uit.net> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0gamma 1/27/96 To: Tom cc: Kenny Hanson , "'Josef Karthauser'" , "FreeBSD Hackers (E-mail)" Subject: Re: FTP compromise. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 09 Sep 1997 09:58:44 PDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:58:15 -0500 From: Wm Brian McCane Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > On Tue, 9 Sep 1997, Kenny Hanson wrote: > > > I just successfully shot my cpu utilization up to 100% without any hopes > > of seeing it come down. I had to kill the ftp process before the system > > returned to a normal state. This is definitely D.O.S... anybody out > > there > > have any ideas on how to erradicate this? I ran this for 15 minutes > > before > > Don't use wu-ftpd? The stock ftpd has lots of new features now, and can > also have a builtin ls, which gives it a perf boost over wu-ftpd. > > Also, it doesn't say which version of wu-ftpd was used. I know there > are new versions from academ. > > Tom > Actually, there is a simple/logical fix to this. They should not allow '/../' after any `valid' information is placed in a path. ie. they should allow: ../../../../../* but NOT ../*/../../../* brian From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 11:02:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA24038 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:02:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA24025 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:02:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA10873; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:02:19 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:02:19 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709121802.MAA10873@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Jason Thorpe Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: IDE Zip drive, challenge! In-Reply-To: <199709121601.JAA06482@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> References: <199709121601.JAA06482@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > ...This is precicely why NetBSD's ATAPI code uses the SCSI disk and cdrom > drivers; in fact, most of the command sending and error recovery code, > as well as the cores of the drivers, is shared between SCSI and ATAPI. > > You may want to take a look at how we did it, to get ideas. Make the CVS tree available so it's much easier to see how/why it was done in NetBSD. :) :) :) Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 11:10:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA24752 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:10:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr05.primenet.com (tlambert@usr05.primenet.com [206.165.6.205]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA24746 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:10:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr05.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA00404; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:10:34 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709121810.LAA00404@usr05.primenet.com> Subject: Re: PnP support To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:10:34 +0000 (GMT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709120622.QAA01532@word.smith.net.au> from "Mike Smith" at Sep 12, 97 04:21:58 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > A specific example might be a AE-3 ethernet card and DOS. Change > > the IRQ on the card, and when DOS comes up, the driver load in the > > AUTOEXEC.BAT has the wrong IRQ parameter. > > Really? Who does Artisoft's hardware these days? They shouldn't. Eagle, the same people who do Novell's. > Is the AE-3 another 8390x design, like the AE-2? If so, and unless > they have their own ISA interface, you can only reconfigure the > hardware by munging the onboard EEPROM, not something that's likely to > happen with FreeBSD. (Especially as you have to reset the device to > force it to reload). That's precisely what we were talking about doing: relocating it by modifying the contents of the EEPROM. In my opinion, it would be useful to have an interface at the driver to be able to do this (we could write a generic WD configuration type utility), but it would be *absolutely terrible* to do this as part of the PnP framework's normal operation. > Also, if the card can be soft-set on the fly, the driver should be > reading the setting out of the card and using that, or coercing the > card to match the commandline setting. Allowing irreconcilable > redundant configuration is an unforgivable design error. It's not reduant. The (only* configuration the thing has is EEPROM. If you want to relocate the card, you modify the EEPROM contents. It's a non-PnP card which can be relocated. > No, I don't believe it is. "relocating" to my mind involves taking a > device and moving it _right_here_and_now_. What you are talking about > is an out-of-band reconfiguration, ie. you reconfigure the device and > then reboot, wherupon it takes up new parameters. A reboot may be required, if the device is stupid, yes. Another reason why "because it can be done" is not the same as "it should be done". Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 11:13:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA24898 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:13:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA24893; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:13:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA02132; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:10:30 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:10:30 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Kevin Eliuk cc: Greg Lehey , FreeBSD Questions , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It makes me really happy that someone has finally started to take this problem seriously, I first put in a problem-report 3 or 4 months ago then many emails but was either ignored, told my disk must be bad (As if I was stupid enough to not try other disks), or my driver/controller was bad (hmm wonder why it works fine in every other os, hunh?). My guess is that some core team member or "connected" developer finally ran into a machine where the floppy didn't work right, then BOOM now it IS broken --- whoa. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 11:17:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA25252 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:17:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr05.primenet.com (tlambert@usr05.primenet.com [206.165.6.205]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA25247 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:17:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr05.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA00849; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:16:55 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709121816.LAA00849@usr05.primenet.com> Subject: Re: (former?) Pentium secrets To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:16:55 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <19970912173658.08134@lemis.com> from "Greg Lehey" at Sep 12, 97 05:36:58 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > You can: > > > > 1) a) goto Yahoo > > b) search for "Appendix H" > > Alta Vista Web Pages (1-20 of 2302) > > (yup, that's what Yahoo says). > > Gee, thanks. That's almost as good as a URL. So the information is in lots of places. 8-) 8-). Se Mike's posting; the one from the list you want is www.x86.org. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 11:21:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA25565 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:21:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA25555 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:21:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id UAA08671; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:20:46 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id TAA16128; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:59:10 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970912195909.RY17032@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:59:09 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: peter@rhiannon.clari.net.au (Peter Hawkins) Subject: Re: mfs root partition References: <199709111351.XAA06649@rhiannon.clari.net.au> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709111351.XAA06649@rhiannon.clari.net.au>; from Peter Hawkins on Sep 11, 1997 23:51:04 +1000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Peter Hawkins wrote: > I am creating a diskless system with the root partition as an MFS partition. You should use the options `MFS' and `MFS_ROOT'. See the system installation floppy in /usr/src/release/*. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 11:24:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA25941 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:24:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA25929 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:24:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA02182; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:23:39 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:23:39 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Joerg Wunsch cc: Greg Lehey , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Floppy Driver Problem Solved :^> In-Reply-To: <19970912154815.HN39525@uriah.heep.sax.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I think I will develop a floppy drive that uses a scsi interface! From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 11:28:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA26399 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:28:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr05.primenet.com (tlambert@usr05.primenet.com [206.165.6.205]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA26389 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:28:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr05.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA01708; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:28:28 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709121828.LAA01708@usr05.primenet.com> Subject: Re: IDE Zip drive, challenge! To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:28:28 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709120833.SAA02046@word.smith.net.au> from "Mike Smith" at Sep 12, 97 06:33:13 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > OK, so we all know that there are IDE Zip drives out there, and > moreover that they are pretty cheap. They perform fairly poorly, but > media are cheap and the drives themselves are fairly ubiquitous. > > There's a local ISP building systems using them as boot drives for > routers and terminal servers, simply because they can swap the OS on a > system by rebooting it and changing disks. I recommend against using non-fixed disk drives as boot drives on machines that are ever going to run MS OS's, BTW. There is a bug in the removable media miniport driver in Windows 95/NT that will cause cache corruption when you page from the device. I know that this isn't an issue in this particular case, since FreeBSD doesn't have the bug, but in case some of you were thinking of going multiboot yourselves using a ZIP (or JAZ) disk. The exception is that with an AHA2940, you can specify that a SCSI removable media disk be treated as a fixed disk; this causes it to use the fixed disk driver instead. The specific problem is in the IFS in the FS_OpenFile and FS_ReadWrite with the R0_SWAPPER_CALL flag. The NT code seems to follow the same model, from what I can tell running WinICE. > However, there are a couple of problems with these drives that need to > be addressed by an enterprising IDE hacker with access to one of these > drives. > > 1) The drive is not locked when the disk is mounted. Using the "designate as fixed disk" workaround will damage the ability of your OS to do this at all. > 2) Once a disk has been ejected and another inserted, the disk > reports an error condition that the IDE driver can't handle. Using the workaround will damage the ability to eject the disk except at boot phase. In general, as well, IOmega is historically known for volume identifier problems. The soloution in UNIX drivers (which Darren Davis implemented in UNIX-land) is to, as part of format, affix a volume identifier to the disk, and monotonically increase th identifier on each format. To overcome this issue requires reading the identifier, and discarding existing cached data. You can watch for media change notification events to decide when you need to do this. For IDE, the check is unfortunately vendor private. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 11:32:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA26843 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:32:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lestat.nas.nasa.gov (lestat.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.50.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA26838 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:32:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lestat.nas.nasa.gov (8.8.6/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA08839; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:26:37 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709121826.LAA08839@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> X-Authentication-Warning: lestat.nas.nasa.gov: localhost [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Nate Williams Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: IDE Zip drive, challenge! Reply-To: Jason Thorpe From: Jason Thorpe Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:26:37 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:02:19 -0600 (MDT) Nate Williams wrote: > > ...This is precicely why NetBSD's ATAPI code uses the SCSI disk and cdrom > > drivers; in fact, most of the command sending and error recovery code, > > as well as the cores of the drivers, is shared between SCSI and ATAPI. > > > > You may want to take a look at how we did it, to get ideas. > > Make the CVS tree available so it's much easier to see how/why it was > done in NetBSD. :) :) :) Given my previous two comments on this topic (that were posted to this list), I guess that you're just going out of your way to be a jerk. In any case, the commit messages are archived on a public mailing list, and the source is, of course, available on {ftp,sup}.netbsd.org, and their mirrors. Jason R. Thorpe thorpej@nas.nasa.gov NASA Ames Research Center Home: +1 408 866 1912 NAS: M/S 258-6 Work: +1 415 604 0935 Moffett Field, CA 94035 Pager: +1 415 428 6939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 11:36:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA27452 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:36:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from adam.adonai.net (adam.adonai.net [207.8.83.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA27391; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:36:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (leec@localhost) by adam.adonai.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA09977; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:36:21 -0500 (CDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:36:21 -0500 (CDT) From: "Lee Crites (AEI)" To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Check your bovine stats for yourself... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Thanks to some discussion on these lists, I started up processing the rc5 clients on all of my machines and some of my clients machines. I redirected the output to a file so I could keep up with how I was doing for myself. Well, after a few days, I started to notice a real discrepency between *my* count of blocks and the count they were saying I had -- like greater than 50% off. When my counts showed me over 1,600 blocks, their records said just over 700. When I pointed this error out to them, I got a message back that said it was a known problem with their proxy connection but that all of the blocks were being received. I don't understand how a proxy connection can screw up my stats, but that's the explaination I was given. Especially since all of my processes are using the same .ini file (via symlinks and/or mirror). For me this isn't an issue. I'll never be enough of a contributor to make a real difference in the big scheme of things. If I win, of course, that's great, but the chances are veeeerrrrryyyyyyyyyyy small. But some of the discussion I read concerned where you were in the rankings and such. Basically, if what I was told is correct, the stats they have are asu (all screwed up), along with all of the associated rankings, etc. I also asked how I would be notified when someone get's the answer, and was told that no notification would come. Somewhat anticlimatic. Anyway, I'd start checking your output stats against their stats to see how you are *really* doing... Lee From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 11:44:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA28285 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:44:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr05.primenet.com (tlambert@usr05.primenet.com [206.165.6.205]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA28258; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:44:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr05.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA02974; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:43:54 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709121843.LAA02974@usr05.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:43:54 +0000 (GMT) Cc: kjk1@ukc.ac.uk, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, questions@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709120935.LAA03134@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Sep 12, 97 11:35:28 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Wild guess: driver needs to recalibrate every once in a while, so if you > > write a whole floppy at once, it slowly loses calibration. MS-DOS > > `recalibrates' by writing the FAT every block or so. How does that sound? > > I doubt it writes the fat so often, performance would be much worse > than the 30-40K/s we get now... This should be unnecessary. In Technical report CMU-CS-93-196, "An MS-DOS File System for UNIX", Allessandro Forin and Gerald R. Malan hobbled an FFS system, claiming many of its opimizations to be "unfair for comparison", and then loaded the entire FAT into core to improve the FAT performance relative to the FFS. They also neglected the fact that a writeable FAT FS can't be a POSIX FS because of its failure to follow "must be updated" timestamp semantics -- FAT does not supportstorage of all require POSIX tiemstamp fields, so this is impossible for it. In any case, the in-core FAT was written infrequently (it was stored in MACH pageable memory), which means they were not resynchronizing. [a much shorter version of the paper is available in the Proceedings of the 1994 Winter USENIX Conference, January 1994)] Personally, I suspect timing issues with the floppy driver; I assume you are using an unFIFO'ed NEC floppy controller. Floppy timing is a critical factor in hysterisis effects and overall reliability. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 11:48:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA28511 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:48:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hydrogen.nike.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA28502 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:48:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.nike.efn.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA04375; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:46:32 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970912114631.11048@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:46:31 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: Jamie Bowden Cc: Aled Morris , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release References: <199709121456.KAA17804@gatekeeper.itribe.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709121456.KAA17804@gatekeeper.itribe.net>; from Jamie Bowden on Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 11:04:26AM -0400 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jamie Bowden scribbled this message on Sep 12: > On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Aled Morris wrote: > > > On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > > > > > Hmmm... I for one would not want it to be the standard editor. Vi is > > > > and always has been the standard editor for unix. I think it should > > > > > > I think you misunderstand. This doesn't replace vi and never did. > > > ee is a *different* editor, for a different audience, and the fact > > > that you symlink it to vi on your own box is completely and utterly > > > irrelevant to that fact. :) > > > > I wish EE's default was Emacs keybindings though - rather than "yet > > another" set of made-up keystrokes [aside: OK, flame me, they're standard > > from some popular package with which I am not familiar, right?] > > > > Many other apps use Emacs keybindings (X programs for example) so it is > > useful for newbies to at least get used to the "standard". > > > > In the style of this thread: "the first thing I do after installing > > FreeBSD for a newbie is > > echo 'emacs noexpand nomargins' >>/usr/share/misc/init.ee > > Does anyone here actually get the point that a newbie can't use emacs > anymore than they can use vi? I hate ee as much as the rest of you, but > it's small, and it tells the newbie which keys do what, which vi and emacs > don't do. I can't use emacs... I can't remeber if the exit and save is C-x C-c or C-c C-x... I could use vi better the first time I used it than I could emacs... personally my real objection is that it uses ESC to bring up the menu.. with the emulation package.. it waits a bit before (seems like a couple seconds) before it brings up the memu... I think simply remapping the menu key to something else would help... I almost always double hit the esc key because of the delay... hmm.. looking at ee, it lists ESC-Enter: exit ee... shouldn't that be changed to: ^[-Enter: exit ee to be consistant?? -- John-Mark Gurney Modem/FAX: +1 541 683 6954 Cu Networking Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 11:55:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA28978 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:55:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ghost.mep.ruhr-uni-bochum.de (ghost.mep.ruhr-uni-bochum.de [134.147.6.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA28973 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:55:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from roberte@localhost) by ghost.mep.ruhr-uni-bochum.de (8.8.5/8.8.4) id UAA00430; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:55:01 +0200 (MESZ) From: Robert Eckardt Message-Id: <199709121855.UAA00430@ghost.mep.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> Subject: Re: HPGL format In-Reply-To: <199709121633.KAA10047@rocky.mt.sri.com> from Nate Williams at "Sep 12, 97 10:33:31 am" To: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:55:01 +0200 (MESZ) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31H (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It was Nate Williams who wrote: > Does anyone know how to convert this to something a bit more standard? Try http://www.funet.fi/pub/TeX/tex-archive/graphics/hpgl2ps -- Robert Eckardt \\ FreeBSD -- solutions for a large universe.(tm) RobertE@MEP.Ruhr-Uni-Bochum.de \\ What do you want to boot tomorrow ?(tm) http://WWW.MEP.Ruhr-Uni-Bochum.de/~roberte For PGP-key finger roberte@gluon.MEP.Ruhr-Uni-Bochum.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 11:58:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA29277 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:58:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr05.primenet.com (tlambert@usr05.primenet.com [206.165.6.205]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA29271; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:58:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr05.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA04034; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:57:50 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709121857.LAA04034@usr05.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? To: kevin_eliuk@sunshine.net (Kevin Eliuk) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:57:50 +0000 (GMT) Cc: grog@lemis.com, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Kevin Eliuk" at Sep 12, 97 07:59:28 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Here is a problem I had and what I included in a > previous question. > > -=* > Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 20:06:28 -0700 (PDT) > > Heres one I can't find in the archives. > > I tried to mount a 720Kb DOS Floppy with: > > /sbin/mount -t msdos /dev/fd0 /mnt > > today which returned an input/output error, and returned to > tcsh prompt. I was interupted and while dealing with that I > turned to notice the following. > > Fatal trap 9: general protection fault while in kernel mode Anything with an invalid FS format on it that is nevertheless mounted can send the kernel off into the weeds. This is why you must be root to mount things: to prevent this from being a proble, since you only give the root password to people who only mount correct media. The fd problems you are reporting in general are either (1) incorrect media, or (2) correct media that, for whatever reason, looks incorrect to the floppy driver. In other words, it is as if you had mounted bad media, and, as expected, the machine went into the weeds. Note that you can eject floppies on a Sun machine wihout unmounting them; this is commonly used in student labs with the DOSFS, which is known to synchronously write all its data. You can eject the disk, and load another one, and it will operate correctly, without needing to sync before disk changes, etc., unlike the faster-because-it-is-cached FFS. But you can put a non-DOS formatted disk in the drive, access it, and crash the machine very easily. "Fixing" this would be prohibitively high in overhead for normal use. It's a trade-off. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 12:03:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA29643 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:03:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr05.primenet.com (tlambert@usr05.primenet.com [206.165.6.205]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA29633 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:03:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr05.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA04447; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:03:34 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709121903.MAA04447@usr05.primenet.com> Subject: Re: HPGL format To: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:03:34 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709121633.KAA10047@rocky.mt.sri.com> from "Nate Williams" at Sep 12, 97 10:33:31 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Does anyone know how to convert this to something a bit more standard? There used to be an HPGL to PS translation tool on sunsite. I ran across it once some time ago. Sorry I don't have more detail... Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 12:05:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA29781 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:05:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mercury.ukc.ac.uk (mercury.ukc.ac.uk [129.12.21.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA29755; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:04:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kestrel.ukc.ac.uk by mercury.ukc.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:04:44 +0100 Received: from localhost by kestrel.ukc.ac.uk (5.x/UKC-2.14) id AA04038; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:04:42 +0100 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:04:41 +0100 (BST) From: "K.J.Koster" To: questions@freebsd.org Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: <199709121843.LAA02974@usr05.primenet.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Personally, I suspect timing issues with the floppy driver; I assume > you are using an unFIFO'ed NEC floppy controller. Floppy timing is > a critical factor in hysterisis effects and overall reliability. > I do have in fact a NEC floppy controller :) Umm. If timing is so critical, why do MS-DOS and Win311 work flawlessly with it? I mean, they are hardly real-time OS-es? Let me put it like this: if floppy timing _is_ so critical, the FreeBSD floppy driver must be buggy not to adhere to it. On the other hand, I've never ad any trouble when I switched to mtools. How's that? Groetjes, Kees Jan ---------------------------------------------------------------v-- Kees Jan Koster tel: UK-1227-453157 e-mail: kjk1@ukc.ac.uk 15 St. Michaels Road, Canterbury, Kent, United Kingdom ------------------------------------------------------------------ from trials come errors... from errors come legends... From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 12:07:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA29963 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:07:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr05.primenet.com (tlambert@usr05.primenet.com [206.165.6.205]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA29949 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:06:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr05.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA04842; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:06:33 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709121906.MAA04842@usr05.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes To: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:06:33 +0000 (GMT) Cc: dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709121711.LAA10321@rocky.mt.sri.com> from "Nate Williams" at Sep 12, 97 11:11:04 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > [ Warning: Action not found : insert-selection, kill-selection boxes ] [ ... ] > No joy. I just installed the new version, and the same errors occur. I > noticed that although 'insert-selection' doesn't live in the Netscape.ad > file, it does still live in the netscape.bin binary that's installed in > /usr/local/lib/netscape. > > Any other hints? (I've gotten email from others who have the same > problems, so I know I'm not alone in this. :) Ugh. Only: find / -type f -print | xargs grep "insert-selection" /dev/null | more 8-(. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 12:11:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA00441 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:11:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA00167; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:07:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (haldjas.folklore.ee [172.17.2.1] (may be forged)) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.8.6/8.8.4) with SMTP id VAA04215; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:47:01 +0300 (EEST) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:47:01 +0300 (EEST) From: Narvi To: Jason Lixfeld cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PCI DLink DFE500-TX 10/100MB DEC Tulip 21140AE REV2-C Chipset Ethernet Card In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Jason Lixfeld wrote: > I'm going to grab the driver off the site. I need the practise compiling > kernels on BSD! :) I'm a linux expert, but due to it's limitations that > our organization is quickly discovering, a switch to FreeBSD seems prudent > at this point! > You may (I cant confirm this, as I always do it just in case) have to recompile the ifconfig program aswell. Just untar the the tarballs into the right places. Sander There is no love, no good, no happiness and no future - all these are just illusions. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 12:30:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA01580 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:30:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from DNS.Lamb.net (root@DNS.Lamb.net [207.90.181.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA01565 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:30:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by DNS.Lamb.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) id MAA26683; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:34:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gatekeeper.Alameda.net(207.90.181.2) via SMTP by DNS.Lamb.net, id smtpd026679; Fri Sep 12 12:34:14 1997 Received: (from ulf@localhost) by Gatekeeper.Alameda.net (8.8.6/8.7.6) id MAA05941; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:30:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Ulf Zimmermann Message-Id: <199709121930.MAA05941@Gatekeeper.Alameda.net> Subject: Re: Floppy Driver Problem Solved :^> In-Reply-To: from "Jamil J. Weatherbee" at "Sep 12, 97 11:23:39 am" To: jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org (Jamil J. Weatherbee) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:30:05 -0700 (PDT) Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, grog@lemis.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk They already exist. > > I think I will develop a floppy drive that uses a scsi interface! > > > -- Ulf. --------------------------------------------------------------------- Ulf Zimmermann, 1525 Pacific Ave., Alameda, CA-94501, #: 510-769-2936 Alameda Networks, Inc. | http://www.Alameda.net | Fax#: 510-521-5073 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 12:30:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA01587 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:30:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from peedub.muc.de (newpc.muc.ditec.de [194.120.126.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA01560 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:30:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from peedub.muc.de (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by peedub.muc.de (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA03312 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:29:47 GMT Message-Id: <199709122129.VAA03312@peedub.muc.de> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: NetBSD Reply-To: Gary Jennejohn In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:22:33 +0200." <199709121322.NAA07150@mofo.frt.dec.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:29:46 +0000 From: Gary Jennejohn Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Mike Smith writes: >I actually gave up working on NetBSD due to the difficulty of obtaining >a usable copy of the source tree, which was somewhat disappointing. > there's a CTM server for the NetBSD sources in your neck of the woods. Try ftp://melanoma.bf.rmit.EDU.AU/pub/ctm/src-cur-exp. That's how I keep my NetBSD sources up-to-date. --- Gary Jennejohn Home - garyj@muc.de Work - gjennejohn@frt.dec.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 12:45:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA02899 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:45:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA02491; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:40:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (haldjas.folklore.ee [172.17.2.1] (may be forged)) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.8.6/8.8.4) with SMTP id VAA04287; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:56:38 +0300 (EEST) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:56:38 +0300 (EEST) From: Narvi To: "Rodney W. Grimes" cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PCI DLink DFE500-TX 10/100MB DEC Tulip 21140AE REV2-C Chipset Ethernet Card In-Reply-To: <199709121652.JAA20660@GndRsh.aac.dev.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > > Is their support for this card? It did not have the drivers for it when I > > attempted to use this card when doing an FTP install. I used a 3Com > > 3C509B 10MB ISA. BSD/OS and Linux both had problems or driver > > incompatibilities when 21140AC REV1-B updated to 21140AE REV2-C. I'm > > wondering if FreeBSD 2.2.2 has the same incompatibility, and is their a > > driver that will support the new chipset, and where do I find it to > > compile it into a new kernel?! > > http://www.3am-software.com, thats Matt Thomas' site who is the author > of the BSD drivers. The latest revision of his driver code should support > this card. If you do install this driver could you give me an ack or nack > on if it worked correctly or not, especially if you can test in both > 10MB and 100MB modes. > I have used these cards for some time now and have seen zero problems. They do, however, work only in 100Mb mode - I have no way of testing them in 10Mb setting (=no 10Mb hub, 10Mb is thinnet only). Sander There is no love, no good, no happiness and no future - all these are just illusions. > > > -- > Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com > Accurate Automation, Inc. Reliable computers for FreeBSD > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 12:47:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA03065 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:47:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from news.IAEhv.nl (root@news.IAEhv.nl [194.151.64.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA03054 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:47:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from LOCAL (uucp@localhost) by news.IAEhv.nl (8.6.13/1.63) with IAEhv.nl; pid 19471 on Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:47:41 GMT; id TAA19471 efrom: peter@grendel.IAEhv.nl; eto: hackers@freebsd.org Received: (from peter@localhost) by grendel.IAEhv.nl (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA00274; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:45:12 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19970912214512.09032@grendel.IAEhv.nl> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:45:12 +0200 From: Peter Korsten To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Very mysterious bug in 2.2.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.67e Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've found a reproduceable (it happened to me twice) and very mysterious bug in 2.2.2, though I'm afraid I can't give many details on it. If I switch on my modem, while X is starting up, the machine locks up. The mouse hangs, the keyboard is dead, nothing. After a few seconds, the machine reboots. There are no messages in /var/log/messages. I can't say if a panic occurs, because the graphical screen is still there (and it won't go away). I'm running 2.2.2, installed from the CD-ROM, with the 2.2-STABLE package installed. Services I'm running include HylaFax 4.0.1, BISDN 0.91, FVWM95 2.0.43 and some other daemons like Apache, Samba and a load of other packeges. All (except BISDN) are installed either as package or port. I know it isn't much, but does anybody have a clue? - Peter From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 12:55:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA03765 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:55:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA03753 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:55:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA11493; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:55:10 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:55:10 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709121955.NAA11493@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Jason Thorpe Cc: Nate Williams , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: IDE Zip drive, challenge! In-Reply-To: <199709121826.LAA08839@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> References: <199709121826.LAA08839@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > ...This is precicely why NetBSD's ATAPI code uses the SCSI disk and cdrom > > > drivers; in fact, most of the command sending and error recovery code, > > > as well as the cores of the drivers, is shared between SCSI and ATAPI. > > > > > > You may want to take a look at how we did it, to get ideas. > > > > Make the CVS tree available so it's much easier to see how/why it was > > done in NetBSD. :) :) :) > > Given my previous two comments on this topic (that were posted to this > list), I guess that you're just going out of your way to be a jerk. Do smileys mean *anything* to you, or did you just getup on the wrong side of the bed this morning. Besides, you're previous two comments said absolutely nothing. 'I stated that the NetBSD commit tree isn't available, and you're comments stated the *exact* same thing.' The didn't add anything to the discussion. > In any case, the commit messages are archived on a public mailing list, > and the source is, of course, available on {ftp,sup}.netbsd.org, and > their mirrors. The commit messages are meaningless w/out the code diffs. If you truly want to be helpful, then don't bother pointing to the NetBSD source files which are far less useful than the OpenBSD sources files, which for the most part contain the same code, but do contain useful code diffs along with commit messages. Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 13:10:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA04816 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:10:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA04811 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:10:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by alpo.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA07123; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:07:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) via SMTP by alpo.whistle.com, id smtpd007120; Fri Sep 12 20:07:22 1997 Message-ID: <3419A0D8.7DE14518@whistle.com> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:06:48 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Mike Smith CC: Graham Wheeler , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? References: <199709121226.WAA02951@word.smith.net.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Mike Smith wrote: > > > > If it's a memory leak then it sounds like it's inside the stdio > > > library, possibly in fopen()/fclose(). Without more data it's going to > > > be hard to track this one. > > > > Tell me about it 8-( > > > > It does seem like a memory leak, as the memory use reported by top grows > > over time. I have memory allocation debugging code which confirms that > > I have no leaks in my code (at least of C++ objects), and the fact that > > older sites have been running for months seems to confirm this. > > OK. More to the point then it sounds like it's a memory leak due to > some change in stdio. That's getting slightly easier to chase I they aren't using the threaded libc are they? From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 13:11:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA04857 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:11:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA04850; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:11:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by alpo.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA07206; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:10:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) via SMTP by alpo.whistle.com, id smtpd007204; Fri Sep 12 20:10:02 1997 Message-ID: <3419A177.4487EB71@whistle.com> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:09:27 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Graham Wheeler CC: Mike Smith , freebsd-bugs@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? References: <199709121251.OAA20346@cdsec.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Graham Wheeler wrote: > for tracing memeory leaks, check out the mprof port (in devel) it makes this sort of thing a snap. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 13:17:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA05348 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:17:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from beowulf.utmb.edu (beowulf.utmb.edu [129.109.59.83]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA05327; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:17:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bdodson@localhost) by beowulf.utmb.edu (8.8.6/8.8.6) id PAA07866; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:16:31 -0500 (CDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:16:31 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199709122016.PAA07866@beowulf.utmb.edu> From: "M. L. Dodson" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: "K.J.Koster" Cc: questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: References: <199709121843.LAA02974@usr05.primenet.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.22 under 19.15p7 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk K.J.Koster writes: > > > > Personally, I suspect timing issues with the floppy driver; I assume > > you are using an unFIFO'ed NEC floppy controller. Floppy timing is > > a critical factor in hysterisis effects and overall reliability. > > > I do have in fact a NEC floppy controller :) > > Umm. If timing is so critical, why do MS-DOS and Win311 work flawlessly > with it? I mean, they are hardly real-time OS-es? > Actually in this case, they are. You can't do anything else while the floppy disk is being serviced by the driver. > Let me put it like this: if floppy timing _is_ so critical, the FreeBSD > floppy driver must be buggy not to adhere to it. > > On the other hand, I've never ad any trouble when I switched to mtools. > How's that? > > Groetjes, > Kees Jan > > ---------------------------------------------------------------v-- > Kees Jan Koster tel: UK-1227-453157 e-mail: kjk1@ukc.ac.uk > 15 St. Michaels Road, Canterbury, Kent, United Kingdom > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > from trials come errors... from errors come legends... > > -- M. L. Dodson bdodson@scms.utmb.edu 409-772-2178 FAX: 409-772-1790 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 13:21:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA05635 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:21:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from isbalham.ist.co.uk (isbalham.ist.co.uk [192.31.26.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA05614 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:20:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gid.co.uk (uucp@localhost) by isbalham.ist.co.uk (8.8.4/8.8.4) with UUCP id VAA02073; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:11:53 +0100 (BST) Received: from [194.32.164.2] by seagoon.gid.co.uk; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:13:45 +0100 X-Sender: rb@194.32.164.1 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199709121633.KAA10047@rocky.mt.sri.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:08:47 +0100 To: Nate Williams From: Bob Bishop Subject: Re: HPGL format Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, >Does anyone know how to convert this to something a bit more standard? If PostScript will do you, try a search for hpgl2ps; if you have no luck, I think I have it in the archives somewhere... -- Bob Bishop (0118) 977 4017 international code +44 118 rb@gid.co.uk fax (0118) 989 4254 between 0800 and 1800 UK From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 13:32:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA06438 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:32:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA06409 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:32:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA12037; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:31:54 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:31:54 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709122031.OAA12037@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Terry Lambert Cc: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams), dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes In-Reply-To: <199709121906.MAA04842@usr05.primenet.com> References: <199709121711.LAA10321@rocky.mt.sri.com> <199709121906.MAA04842@usr05.primenet.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Ugh. Only: > > find / -type f -print | xargs grep "insert-selection" /dev/null | more OK, I've got cycles to spare, so I did it. For background, I'm running the most recent bits from XFree86 (3.3.1?), and XInside 3.1. Edited contents follows (removed non-X stuff from Emacs/XEmacs, binary output, etc...): -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm: Shift Insert:insert-selection(PRIMARY, CUT_BUFFER0) /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm: ~Ctrl ~Meta :insert-selection(PRIMARY, CUT_BUFFER0) /usr/X11R6/lib/libXaw.so.6.1:CtrlC: insert-selection(CUT_BUFFER0) /usr/X11R6/lib/libXaw.so.6.1:CtrlY: insert-selection(SECONDARY) /usr/X11R6/lib/libXaw.a:CtrlC: insert-selection(CUT_BUFFER0) /usr/X11R6/lib/libXaw.a:CtrlY: insert-selection(SECONDARY) Does this give any hints? Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 13:33:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA06573 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:33:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sag.space.lockheed.com (sag.space.lockheed.com [192.68.162.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA06568 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:33:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost by sag.space.lockheed.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/21Nov95-0423PM) id AA16371; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:33:05 -0700 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:33:05 -0700 (PDT) From: "Brian N. Handy" To: Terry Lambert Cc: Nate Williams , dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes In-Reply-To: <199709121906.MAA04842@usr05.primenet.com> Message-Id: X-Files: The truth is out there Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Terry writes: > [How to fix netscape and the annoying dialog boxes:] >Ugh. Only: > > find / -type f -print | xargs grep "insert-selection" /dev/null | more > >8-(. Hey, I'll be damned! There was some dreck in my .Xdefaults. Cut it out, xrdb, and netscape doesn't seem to complain anymore! Woo hoo! I think Terry can take the rest of the day off. :-) Brian From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 13:35:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA06814 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:35:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA06801 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:35:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA12069; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:35:24 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:35:24 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709122035.OAA12069@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: hackers@freebsd.org Cc: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams) Subject: Resolved (was Re: HPGL format) In-Reply-To: <199709121855.UAA00430@ghost.mep.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> References: <199709121633.KAA10047@rocky.mt.sri.com> <199709121855.UAA00430@ghost.mep.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I wrote: > Does anyone know how to convert this to something a bit more standard? Thanks to everyone who pointed out hpgl2ps, which will do the trick once we get the *real* HPGL file over here. (It apparently got munged, but the converter should get us going.) Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 13:46:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA07637 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:46:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from super-g.inch.com (super-g.com [207.240.140.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA07625 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:45:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (spork@localhost) by super-g.inch.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA03998; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:58:33 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:58:33 -0400 (EDT) From: spork X-Sender: spork@super-g.inch.com To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: www-sql on FreeBSD (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: MULTIPART/MIXED; BOUNDARY="298516987-887655712-874066241=:943" Content-ID: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. Send mail to mime@docserver.cac.washington.edu for more info. --298516987-887655712-874066241=:943 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-ID: Hello -hackers, I'd asked about this before, but I have more information now, so I'll ask again;) Some quick background on the issue first: mySQL is a great database; the licenseing and permormance is much better than mSQL from Hughes. One of the most popular tools (for web use) with msql is w3-msql, which provides an easy way to build a web<->database interface. The problem is that while mySQL works fine on FBSD, the associated w3-msql equivalent, www-sql, was developed on Linux, and doesn't compile under FreeBSD. I mailed the author, and got the reply shown below about problems with a missing(?!) regex lib or somesuch. Not being a C hacker(TM) myself, I'm asking if anyone on this list would be interested in: a) trying to patch it up to work on FBSD and b) sending the author patches so that he can integrate them into www-sql Most likely the mySQL people would like to hear about this as well, as many people are porting their msql dbs to mysql, and are stumbling at the www-sql point. Thanks much, Charles [below is the reply from www-sql's author] If you would like the below-mentioned tarfile, please email me privately and I'll send it to you. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:10:41 +0800 (WST) From: James Henstridge To: Charles Sprickman Subject: Re: www-sql on FreeBSD Hi, I have only had one conversation with someone else who uses FreeBSD, and they had the same problem. The problem seems to be that FreeBSD doesn't have a regex library. Since I don't have a system running FreeBSD, I was only able to give him limited help. I sent him an archive, containing some files that I thought might help. The expression evaluator used in www-sql is simply the GNU version of the shell command expr, with its user interface knocked off. In the hope that it might be of some use, I have included the original `expr.c' as found in the GNU sh-utils package, and a diff against it to get an `expr.c' that will work with www-sql. As the problem is with the regular expression libraries, I have also included the regex headers from my Linux system, in the hope that you may be able to use them. As far as I know, the library may have a different name. As a suggestion, It may be a good idea to get the source for the `expr' used on your computer, and check it against the source I sent you. I hope this helps, James Henstridge. P.S. - Please reply telling me if you have any success or failure. This is the only way I can get www-sql working properly on systems like FreeBSD. The other guy who mailed me never got back to me, so I wasn't able to solve the problem then. -- Email: james@daa.com.au WWW: http://www.daa.com.au/~james/ On Wed, 10 Sep 1997, Charles Sprickman wrote: > Hi, > > I thought I'd ask you before hitting the mysql mailing list, whether > you've had any reports of success on FreeBSD 2.2.2? > > After running configure, I type "make" and get this: > > bash$ make > gcc -g -O2 -I/usr/local/include -I. -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -c cgi.c -o cgi.o > gcc -g -O2 -I/usr/local/include -I. -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -c expr.c -o expr.o > expr.c: In function `docolon': > expr.c:366: storage size of `re_buffer' isn't known > expr.c:367: storage size of `re_regs' isn't known > expr.c:377: warning: assignment makes pointer from integer without a cast > *** Error code 1 > > Stop. > > ??? If you have any suggestions (or diffs:) I'd appreciate it... > > I've also attached the Makefile and config.h generated by configure. > > Thanks for any help you can give, > > Charles > > ~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~ > Charles Sprickman Internet Channel > INCH System Administration Team (212)243-5200 > spork@inch.com access@inch.com > --298516987-887655712-874066241=:943-- From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 13:56:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA08188 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:56:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr08.primenet.com (tlambert@usr08.primenet.com [206.165.6.208]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA08178; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:56:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA24445; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:56:06 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709122056.NAA24445@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? To: kjk1@ukc.ac.uk (K.J.Koster) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:56:01 +0000 (GMT) Cc: questions@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "K.J.Koster" at Sep 12, 97 08:04:41 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Personally, I suspect timing issues with the floppy driver; I assume > > you are using an unFIFO'ed NEC floppy controller. Floppy timing is > > a critical factor in hysterisis effects and overall reliability. > > I do have in fact a NEC floppy controller :) Most everyone does. The point was the "unFIFO'ed" part. > Umm. If timing is so critical, why do MS-DOS and Win311 work flawlessly > with it? I mean, they are hardly real-time OS-es? Because they are non-reentrant real-mode interrupt handlers. While a request to the floppy is in progress, they buzz-loop pending its completion, and so do not have the problem that they give a quantum to someone else, then need to service a condition on the device within a timing window smaller than the remaining quantum supports. Because the condition on the device needs to be serviced within a timing window, if you are running something that does not give back the quantum immediately, then you miss the window. The SCO Xenix floppy drivers (perhaps the best floppy drivers ever written for both speed and reliability and various format support) were all hand crafted x86 assembly, and had the necessary buzz loops to avoid the issue. They are also not very portable to anything but x86 architecture machines, and they consume an inordinate amount of CPU time in system mode to meet the timing constraints. Too much CPU time for modern user space CPU loads relative to anticipated system space loads. > Let me put it like this: if floppy timing _is_ so critical, the FreeBSD > floppy driver must be buggy not to adhere to it. Let me put it like this: the floppy controller design in general, and its interface to PC architecture in particular (which could have included seperate FIFO components) is intrinsically flawed. The correct way to resolve this problem generally is to use components with FIFOs instead of components without. The correct way for a multitasking OS to deal with this is *NOT* to drop into a buzz loop and to cease being a multitasking OS for the duration of the loop, as you are suggesting. The correct way for a multitasking OS to deal with this is to either prohibit the use of the floppy drive when the system is not in single user mode so that there are not timing preterbations caused by user processes (as you yourself noted: the installation floppy access works fine, and it does so for that reason), OR to employ RT extensions in the kernel and treat the floppy timing constraints as RT task constraints, and program the device driver accordingly. For an OS with few RT features, the only course of action is to prohibit the use of the floppy in multiuser mode. So consider yourself prohibited to single user mode until FreeBSD can integrate RT features. > On the other hand, I've never ad any trouble when I switched to mtools. > How's that? You have poor hardware. If you didn't, you would not be seeing the problem, and we wouldn't be having this conversation. I personally do not own poor hardware (I refuse to reward vendors of poor hardware with money by going out and buying it), for example, so I can't personally repeat your problem. Realize that if you are using the DOSFS and you are using mtools, both still use the same underlying driver. The block sizes read from the device by mtools are larger contiguous reads. This is (apparently) sufficient to mask the timing issues causing your problem under the file system, which accesses the device in 512b blocks. As a sidebar, the "ft" program does the same thing for floppy tapes that mtools does for floppy disks. If you are seriously interested in working around this problem in the kernel, I suggest you modify the floppy driver to read a track at a time, and use read-before-write, and also write a track at a time (this, by the way, is an example of a character driver exhibiting block-like behaviour despite the users impression that character devices are acharacter at a time -- see the recent SCSI tape drive block discussion). You should do write gathering in case someone trys to write in non-track incrementes, to reduce the number of actual reads and writes that take place. Together, all this would mask the hysteresis issues that other people are seeing with the floppy driver, as well. Overall, a moderately nice kludge -- but a kludge, nonetheless. For the floppy tape case, reserve two buffers, and switch between them at the timing windows. This will allow you to be able to resynchronize the tape at a write block boundry, and will eliminate the need for the "ft" program (though you will spend much time resynchronizing, and will be hard put to make the drive stream under any moderate system load). Other than that, get a good controller part, or wait for the RT enhancements that were recently discussed on this list. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 14:00:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA08490 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:00:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lestat.nas.nasa.gov (lestat.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.50.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA08483 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:00:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lestat.nas.nasa.gov (8.8.6/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA09694; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:54:15 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709122054.NAA09694@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> X-Authentication-Warning: lestat.nas.nasa.gov: localhost [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Nate Williams Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: IDE Zip drive, challenge! Reply-To: Jason Thorpe From: Jason Thorpe Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:54:14 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:55:10 -0600 (MDT) Nate Williams wrote: > Do smileys mean *anything* to you, or did you just getup on the wrong > side of the bed this morning. Normally, yes. But they certainly mean less if you've explained your position on a certain topic a couple of times already. > Besides, you're previous two comments said absolutely nothing. 'I > stated that the NetBSD commit tree isn't available, and you're comments > stated the *exact* same thing.' The didn't add anything to the > discussion. No, in another thread on this list, I stated that there are a number of reasons why the NetBSD CVS repository is not publicly available, none of which are appropriate for discussion here. I had assumed the tone of my response would keep people from making additional (apparently snide) remarks on the topic. > The commit messages are meaningless w/out the code diffs. Not true. > If you truly want to be helpful, then don't bother pointing to the > NetBSD source files which are far less useful than the OpenBSD sources > files, which for the most part contain the same code, but do contain > useful code diffs along with commit messages. In this case, not only does OpenBSD not have the code in question (neither do they have some of the code I was referring to in the other thread), but it's unlikely that their commit message will be useful... probably just another "sync with netbsd ..." Jason R. Thorpe thorpej@nas.nasa.gov NASA Ames Research Center Home: +1 408 866 1912 NAS: M/S 258-6 Work: +1 415 604 0935 Moffett Field, CA 94035 Pager: +1 415 428 6939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 14:00:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA08531 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:00:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from verdi.nethelp.no (verdi.nethelp.no [195.1.171.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA08522 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:00:43 -0700 (PDT) From: sthaug@nethelp.no Received: (qmail 5981 invoked by uid 1001); 12 Sep 1997 17:00:32 +0000 (GMT) To: jamie@itribe.net Cc: mike@smith.net.au, FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: network programming. In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:07:17 -0400 (EDT)" References: <199709121559.LAA18140@gatekeeper.itribe.net> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.05+ on Emacs 19.28.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:00:31 +0200 Message-ID: <5979.874083631@verdi.nethelp.no> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I wasn't aware it came from ee. I only commented on it since I used to > use tools on SunOS called packetman and etherman. Packetman grabbed > anything that looked like a packet of course, and etherman grabbed > everything that went across the interface. ... but tcpdump predate these tools by quite a bit. Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 14:04:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA08879 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:04:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr08.primenet.com (tlambert@usr08.primenet.com [206.165.6.208]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA08873 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:04:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA24828; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:04:14 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709122104.OAA24828@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes To: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:04:13 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, nate@mt.sri.com, dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199709122031.OAA12037@rocky.mt.sri.com> from "Nate Williams" at Sep 12, 97 02:31:54 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Ugh. Only: > > > > find / -type f -print | xargs grep "insert-selection" /dev/null | more > > OK, I've got cycles to spare, so I did it. For background, I'm running > the most recent bits from XFree86 (3.3.1?), and XInside 3.1. > > Edited contents follows (removed non-X stuff from Emacs/XEmacs, binary > output, etc...): > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > /usr/X11R6/lib/libXaw.so.6.1:CtrlC: insert-selection(CUT_BUFFER0) > /usr/X11R6/lib/libXaw.so.6.1:CtrlY: insert-selection(SECONDARY) Maybe. Try using libXaw.so.6.0 instead. Mine has: CtrlC: insert-selection(CUT_BUFFER0) CtrlY: insert-selection(SECONDARY) MetaY: insert-selection(PRIMARY, CUT_BUFFER0) : insert-selection(PRIMARY, CUT_BUFFER0) More than likely, this is a minor rev that should not have been a minor rev because of an interface change. 8-(. The string does not appear in any other /usr/X11R6/lib/*.so.*, so it's not a mismatch between Xaw and Xt. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 14:10:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA09221 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:10:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA09187 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:10:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA12204; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:09:54 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:09:54 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709122109.PAA12204@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Terry Lambert Cc: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams), dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes In-Reply-To: <199709122104.OAA24828@usr08.primenet.com> References: <199709122031.OAA12037@rocky.mt.sri.com> <199709122104.OAA24828@usr08.primenet.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert writes: > > > Ugh. Only: > > > > > > find / -type f -print | xargs grep "insert-selection" /dev/null | more > > > > OK, I've got cycles to spare, so I did it. For background, I'm running > > the most recent bits from XFree86 (3.3.1?), and XInside 3.1. > > > > Edited contents follows (removed non-X stuff from Emacs/XEmacs, binary > > output, etc...): > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > > /usr/X11R6/lib/libXaw.so.6.1:CtrlC: insert-selection(CUT_BUFFER0) > > /usr/X11R6/lib/libXaw.so.6.1:CtrlY: insert-selection(SECONDARY) > > Maybe. Try using libXaw.so.6.0 instead. Mine has: I don't have libXaw.so.6.0. :( > CtrlC: insert-selection(CUT_BUFFER0) > CtrlY: insert-selection(SECONDARY) > MetaY: insert-selection(PRIMARY, CUT_BUFFER0) > : insert-selection(PRIMARY, CUT_BUFFER0) How is this different than mine? (I removed the latter two definitions from the output since I was trying to show that the key definitions existed in the file, not that I was trying to show *every* instance of them.) Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 14:11:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA09318 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:11:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr08.primenet.com (tlambert@usr08.primenet.com [206.165.6.208]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA09313 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:11:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA25242; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:11:10 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709122111.OAA25242@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: IDE Zip drive, challenge! To: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:11:10 +0000 (GMT) Cc: thorpej@nas.nasa.gov, nate@mt.sri.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709121955.NAA11493@rocky.mt.sri.com> from "Nate Williams" at Sep 12, 97 01:55:10 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > The commit messages are meaningless w/out the code diffs. The ability to "cvs diff" is a serious issue inre: source usability, if one camp is trying to track the changes in nominally common code. That is the one issue where this is most annoying, and I think Jason is well aware of it, and now that annoyance has been expressed, we can all drop public expressions of it. Suffice it to say that there are political issues which are best not poked at with sharp sticks here, unless your intent is to end up not on speaking terms with each other. Is that really worth it? Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 14:16:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA09662 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:16:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr08.primenet.com (tlambert@usr08.primenet.com [206.165.6.208]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA09644 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:15:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA25502; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:15:34 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709122115.OAA25502@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? To: julian@whistle.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:15:34 +0000 (GMT) Cc: mike@smith.net.au, gram@cdsec.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <3419A0D8.7DE14518@whistle.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Sep 12, 97 01:06:48 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > It does seem like a memory leak, as the memory use reported by top grows > > > over time. I have memory allocation debugging code which confirms that > > > I have no leaks in my code (at least of C++ objects), and the fact that > > > older sites have been running for months seems to confirm this. > > > > OK. More to the point then it sounds like it's a memory leak due to > > some change in stdio. That's getting slightly easier to chase I > > they aren't using the threaded libc are they? Exactly my thought as well... To the user: you should note that the threaded libc differs from the standard libc in that, instead of returning pointers to function modified static data areas, most functions which formerly did just that now return allocated buffers which contain the results, and it is now the user's responsibility to free these buffers. The use of static data buffers in libc is a long-standing abomination, blessed by ANSI and codified in stone by POSIX. Assume any man page which states a pointer to a static data area is returned is actually allocating a data area and expecting the caller to free it, whenever you are using a thread-safe library. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 14:20:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA09882 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:20:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr08.primenet.com (tlambert@usr08.primenet.com [206.165.6.208]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA09877 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:20:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA25910; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:19:59 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709122119.OAA25910@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes To: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:19:58 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, nate@mt.sri.com, dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199709122109.PAA12204@rocky.mt.sri.com> from "Nate Williams" at Sep 12, 97 03:09:54 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Maybe. Try using libXaw.so.6.0 instead. Mine has: > > I don't have libXaw.so.6.0. :( I could send you one, or you could get one off of freebsd.org... > > CtrlC: insert-selection(CUT_BUFFER0) > > CtrlY: insert-selection(SECONDARY) > > MetaY: insert-selection(PRIMARY, CUT_BUFFER0) > > : insert-selection(PRIMARY, CUT_BUFFER0) > > How is this different than mine? (I removed the latter two definitions > from the output since I was trying to show that the key definitions > existed in the file, not that I was trying to show *every* instance of > them.) Ugh. The only thing I can suggest is asking Brian exactly what it was in his .Xdefaults, and see if you have the same thing. I can't believe the person who did the FreeBSD port had the problem on his machine; a port done for love always has fewer problems than one done for money. Maybe the find skipped a symlink to your home directory or something. We're into voodoo now... Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 14:20:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA09943 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:20:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA09937 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:20:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA11109 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:20:42 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id XAA16544; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:14:11 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970912231411.VV24990@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:14:11 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers) Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from K.J.Koster on Sep 12, 1997 11:22:34 +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As K.J.Koster wrote: > Just a few days ago I made a floppy image from a freshly formatted MS-DOS > floppy ("dd if/dev/fd0.1440 of=msdos.flop") Oh well. Not that it must be related to your particular problem, but: YOU SHOULD NEVER USE BUFFERED DEVICES UNLESS YOU ARE GOING TO MOUNT(2) A FILESYSTEM OVER IT. Please, people, hammer this sentence into your head. I'm in great sorry that Linux doesn't offer you raw devices, but for all the Unix systems that offer it, NEVER use buffered devices for raw floppy access. I'm sick of repeating the reasons for why not to do this, please re-read the mailing list archives. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 14:21:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA09991 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:21:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA09974 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:20:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA11112 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:20:48 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id XAA16559; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:19:18 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970912231917.EB46720@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:19:17 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: <199709120935.LAA03134@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from K.J.Koster on Sep 12, 1997 13:06:36 +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As K.J.Koster wrote: > 30-40kb/s? I wish. 8kb/s is what dd reports for my floppy drive. No surprise. One of the problems probably resulting out of the abuse of buffered devices. 40 KB/s is exaggerating, but 30 KB/s is the raw sequential throughput the FreeBSD driver does. That's about 67 % of the theoretical maximum (45 KB/s). > Oh, and regarding the fdformat in another post in the same thread: when > FreeBSD finds an error on one of my floppies, it's dead. MS-DOS' scandisk > reports the same errors and cannot fix them. So what? You can try reformatting them over and over again, if you like. I prefer the bit-bucket in these cases. Boys, you should at least learn the very basics of floppies, and the floppy controller used in PeeCees (NE 765 aka. i8272, really a very sick device from the early 80's), before you're starting to speculate what could be done in a driver. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 14:21:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA10015 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:21:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA09988 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:21:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA11119; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:20:59 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id XAA16501; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:05:09 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970912230509.AH32925@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:05:09 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers) Cc: jamil@counterintelligence.ml.org (Jamil J. Weatherbee) Subject: Re: Floppy Driver Problem Solved :^> References: <19970912154815.HN39525@uriah.heep.sax.de> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from Jamil J. Weatherbee on Sep 12, 1997 11:23:39 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > I think I will develop a floppy drive that uses a scsi interface! You love it to re-invent wheels? Almost everything except the PeeCee uses this kind of drives. Besides, what i've seen so far is slower than the plain FDC-based drives we are using. Besides^2, the SCSI interface doesn't prevent you from using bad media. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 14:21:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA10107 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:21:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA10089 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:21:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA11152 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:21:23 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id XAA16535; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:10:03 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970912231003.EE31735@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:10:03 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers) Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from Jamil J. Weatherbee on Sep 11, 1997 23:25:55 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > I started my machine up fine with the freebsd boot disk to change a few > things it loaded as normal --- but my floppy has never worked from within > freebsd, I've reported it a few times but people seem to think it is just > me. People don't ``seem to think'', but they ``notice'' it's just you. Anyway, i offered you sending me the drive & controller, or whatever is required to reproduce the problem. I have yet to hear anything from you since. It's hard for me to debug problems i can't reproduce myself. NB: i don't deny the potential bug that is there. It's just i can't see it myself. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 14:24:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA10335 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:24:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cynic.portal.ca (root@cynic.portal.ca [204.174.36.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA10316; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:24:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost ([[UNIX: localhost]]) by cynic.portal.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA09237; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:20:33 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: cynic.portal.ca: cjs owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:20:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Curt Sampson To: Torsten Blum cc: Andreas Klemm , mark@grondar.za, ports@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Major bogon in tcp_wrappers port. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Torsten Blum wrote: > Andreas, have you _ever_ configured tcpd ? tcpd is not a standalone daemon. > To activate it, you have to modify inetd.conf. It depends on the inetd.conf. NetBSD's inetd uses libwrap directly, so no modification is necessary. > If a tool highly depends on the system and needs a rebuild of several tools > to take advantage of it, I'll probably suggest to add it to the base system. Well, sendmail is one program needs to be recompiled to use libwrap. cjs Curt Sampson cjs@portal.ca Info at http://www.portal.ca/ Internet Portal Services, Inc. Through infinite myst, software reverberates Vancouver, BC (604) 257-9400 In code possess'd of invisible folly. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 14:27:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA10818 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:27:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cynic.portal.ca (root@cynic.portal.ca [204.174.36.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA10805 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:27:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost ([[UNIX: localhost]]) by cynic.portal.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA09454; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:27:21 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: cynic.portal.ca: cjs owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:27:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Curt Sampson To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" cc: Tom , "J. Weatherbee - Chief Systems Engineer" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Stupid Routing Situation In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > Can you give me an example by possibly sending out netstat -r and > ifconfig -a i have a 255.255.255.192 maybye I want to have like 8 > computers on the segment between firewall and router (unprotected) and the > others 56 on the second segment (protected).... Subnets always work in powers of two. Since you have a /26 (62 addresses), the largest subnet you can make of that is a /27 (30 addresses). The traditional way to get the unequal division you want is to put the /26 on the `inside' interface and put, say, a /29 (6 addresses) taken out of that /26 on the `outside' interface. On this host the more specific /29 route will override the less specific /26 for the hosts on the /29. Then you proxy-arp on the /26 interface the hosts that are really on /29, so that the folks on /26 believe that these machines on the /29 are on the same network as they are. cjs Curt Sampson cjs@portal.ca Info at http://www.portal.ca/ Internet Portal Services, Inc. Through infinite myst, software reverberates Vancouver, BC (604) 257-9400 In code possess'd of invisible folly. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 14:33:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA11225 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:33:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mercury.ukc.ac.uk (mercury.ukc.ac.uk [129.12.21.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA11202; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:33:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kestrel.ukc.ac.uk by mercury.ukc.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:33:29 +0100 Received: from localhost by kestrel.ukc.ac.uk (5.x/UKC-2.14) id AA04565; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:33:28 +0100 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:33:27 +0100 (BST) From: "K.J.Koster" Reply-To: "K.J.Koster" To: hackers@freebsd.org Cc: questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: <199709122056.NAA24445@usr08.primenet.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > The correct way for a multitasking OS to deal with this is *NOT* to > drop into a buzz loop and to cease being a multitasking OS for the > duration of the loop, as you are suggesting. > I agree with you that busy-looping on a device is not the correct way to go about I/O, and I understand why FreeBSD does not busy-loop. However, we are not talking about SCSI or IDE drivers, we are talking about a lowly floppy driver. This discussion is about people finding their floppies trashed by their OS. Hardly `the correct way'. If I look at how I use my floppy drive, I'm usually sitting and waiting for it to finish anyway, so if my CPU is clocking idle time or system time makes no difference for me, personally. I have cheap hardware, and for that I am happy to pay the performance penalty, as I do every day. I'm quite happy to pay the performance penalty for a busy-looping floppy driver, if that means I can write floppies without having to worry whether I can read the disk later or not. FreeBSD has special options for people with broken keyboard resets, broken APM and broken PCMCIA cards. Why not add another one for unfifo'd floppy controllers? Groetjes, Kees Jan PS. I just realized I have written my demo code for my job applications using mtools... Oops :) You guys are giving me a headache. ---------------------------------------------------------------v-- Kees Jan Koster tel: UK-1227-453157 e-mail: kjk1@ukc.ac.uk 15 St. Michaels Road, Canterbury, Kent, United Kingdom ------------------------------------------------------------------ from trials come errors... from errors come legends... From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 14:51:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA12059 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:51:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA12053 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:51:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA11687 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:50:53 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id XAA16736; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:25:05 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970912232505.WA27195@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:25:05 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: <199709121843.LAA02974@usr05.primenet.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from K.J.Koster on Sep 12, 1997 20:04:41 +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As K.J.Koster wrote: > I do have in fact a NEC floppy controller :) Are you sure? I highly doubt it. Open the case of your machine, and verify. It's probably a SMC chip. Oh, you mean your FDC is being announced as a NE72065B? That doesn't say anything. This message is (sorry) just junk. > Umm. If timing is so critical, why do MS-DOS and Win311 work flawlessly > with it? Timing isn't so critical. Floppies are probably not Terry's strongest side either. > On the other hand, I've never ad any trouble when I switched to mtools. > How's that? Funny. It excludes the driver totally, since mtools *do* use the floppy driver as well. :-) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 14:51:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA12090 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:51:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA12083 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:51:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA11694 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:51:27 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id XAA16746; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:27:07 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970912232707.EZ11643@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:27:07 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers) Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from Jamil J. Weatherbee on Sep 12, 1997 11:10:30 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > My guess is that > some core team member or "connected" developer finally ran into a machine > where the floppy didn't work right, then BOOM now it IS broken --- whoa. You are totally wrong. Again, there are three options: debug the problem yourself, or send me the failing drive & controller, or shut up. I'm willing to debug it, but i can't debug just hot air. Btw., the core-team is the managerial body, nothing else. It's not the crew of developers (which is *way* larger). -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 14:53:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA12305 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:53:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.fr [193.56.58.253]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA12288; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:52:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.fr [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.8.4/8.8.4) with ESMTP id XAA24245; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:52:56 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.8.6/brasil-1.2) with UUCP id XAA18321; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:52:28 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.7/keltia-uucp-2.10/nospam) id XAA15465; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:37:28 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19970912233728.62622@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:37:28 +0200 From: Ollivier Robert To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-bugs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? References: <199709121302.PAA20383@cdsec.com> <199709121309.XAA03107@word.smith.net.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.76 In-Reply-To: <199709121309.XAA03107@word.smith.net.au>; from Mike Smith on Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 10:39:19PM +0930 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT ctm#3634 AMD-K6 MMX @ 208 MHz Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Mike Smith: > ie. it exits immediately. I tried various assortments of parameters > (eg. network and native order on the port, NULL, "tcp", "udp", etc for > the protocol). 8( getservbyport(3) expects the port to be in network order and using if (getservbyport (htons(23), NULL) == NULL) { leads to a working program. On my CURRENT system, there doesn't seem to be any memory leak. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: There are no limits -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 3.0-CURRENT #31: Sat Sep 6 21:58:17 CEST 1997 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 15:02:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA12924 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:02:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA12913 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:02:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA03307; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:01:58 -0700 (PDT) To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" cc: Joerg Wunsch , Greg Lehey , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Floppy Driver Problem Solved :^> In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:23:39 PDT." Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:01:57 -0700 Message-ID: <3304.874101717@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I think I will develop a floppy drive that uses a scsi interface! They're already available and have been for years. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 15:11:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA13393 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:11:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kalypso.cybercom.net (kalypso.cybercom.net [209.21.136.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA13386 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:11:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from atlanta (mfd-dial1-4.cybercom.net [209.21.137.4]) by kalypso.cybercom.net (8.8.7/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA15320; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:50:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970912173434.009f5510@cybercom.net> X-Sender: ksmm@cybercom.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:34:34 -0400 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: The Classiest Man Alive Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709121611.MAA18193@gatekeeper.itribe.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 12:19 PM 9/12/97 -0400, Jamie Bowden wrote: >Hoe the hell is a newbie supposed to know emacs key bindings? They are >documented internally in emacs, assuming you know that M- means meta, and >that meta is , etc. I don't like ee, I use vi almost exclusively, >with some emacs for large jobs with multiple files, but I wouldn't expect >a new user to know how to use either of them. I don't think it's as important to have a set of bindings that are already well know as it is to be able to get to the relevant help quickly and easily. K.S. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 15:15:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA13601 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:15:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kahless.snake.de (andre@kult.ISAR.de [193.141.69.50] (may be forged)) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA13590 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:15:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from andre@localhost) by kahless.snake.de (8.8.7/8.8.6/kult-3.1) id AAA23828 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:15:07 +0200 (CEST) From: Andre Albsmeier Message-Id: <199709122215.AAA23828@kahless.snake.de> Subject: Need advice from the VM hackers, please To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:15:06 +0200 (CEST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, next week I have to set up a machine with 512MB physical memory and 1 GB swap for antenna simulations. Recently, there was some discussion here how this is done correctly (apart from MAXMEM in the kernel config file). However, I didn't have such a big machine until now so I didn't follow this... Can somebody please briefly explain what to do? Or is there a document describing it? Thanks very much in advance... -Andre From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 15:31:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA14604 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:31:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pluto.plutotech.com (root@mail.plutotech.com [206.168.67.137]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA14598 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:31:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shane.plutotech.com (shane.plutotech.com [206.168.67.149]) by pluto.plutotech.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA00374 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:31:43 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709122231.QAA00374@pluto.plutotech.com> From: "Mike Durian" To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: VFS/NFS client wedging problem Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:31:43 -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've got a VFS problem I'm hoping someone out there can give me some ideas on. I've written a VFS based filesystem that is an interface to our RAID system. The RAID system stores video frames and the filesystem allows access to the data and automatically translates the data to a variety of file formats (TIFF, Targa, YUV, etc.). The frame number and conversion type are defined by the path name. Eg /pfs/frames/tiff/0.tiff or /pfs/HMSF/tga/hour00/minute01/second10//00.01.10.29.tga. The filesystem is implemented partially in the kernel and partially as a user application. The two parts communicate via a socket. The filesystem works well for normal accesses, but I'm having a strange problem with NFS. I've supplied the fhtovp and vptofh hooks and things basically work, but I can get the client side wedged under heavy accesses. If I run four simultaneous processes copying data to my filesystem, after a while I'll see one of the nfsiod go to sleep on "vfsfsy" and not return. Eventually, the other nfsiods will go to sleep on "nfsrcv" and that's that. In both cases, it looks like the clients aren't getting a acks from the server. Strangely, none of the nfsd processes on the server are sleeping and the user mount_pfs process isn't sleeping either. In fact the filesystem is still perfectly usable. It's just the NFS client that is wedged. I'm not sure where the problem lies. Is it an NFS issue or a (more likely) bug in my filesystem? Does anybody have any ideas on why an NFS server might drop an ACK and wedge the client? I haven't been able to find any paths through the NFS code that would lead to this condition, but then to me the NFS code is like a maze of twisty passages, all alike. I did get the same results with both NFSv3 and NFSv2. TCP failed too, though lasted longer with a number of "server not responing"/"server responding again" messages. The messages would appear back to back without the server really going down. Thanks, mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 15:58:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA16132 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:58:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sag.space.lockheed.com (sag.space.lockheed.com [192.68.162.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA16126 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:58:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost by sag.space.lockheed.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/21Nov95-0423PM) id AA31504; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:58:32 -0700 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:58:32 -0700 (PDT) From: "Brian N. Handy" To: Terry Lambert Cc: Nate Williams , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes In-Reply-To: <199709122119.OAA25910@usr08.primenet.com> Message-Id: X-Files: The truth is out there Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Terry Lambert wrote: >Ugh. The only thing I can suggest is asking Brian exactly what it was >in his .Xdefaults, and see if you have the same thing. Here's the bit in my .Xdefaults that seemed to cause the problem: *Text.Translations: #override \n\ L4: insert-selection(CUT_BUFFER1) \n\ L6: extend-start() extend-end(PRIMARY, CLIPBOARD, CUT_BUFFER0)\n\ L8: insert-selection(CLIPBOARD) \n\ L10: extend-start() extend-end(PRIMARY, CLIPBOARD, CUT_BUFFER0)\n\ L10: kill-selection() \n I'm not even sure where I got this junk from, but like Nate, I've been recycling my .Xdefaults since the Pleistocene age. I cut out a lot of cruft that I don't think makes any difference to me at this point. Brian From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 16:08:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA16815 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:08:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 1.Mx.DataSys.NET (ayan@enterprise.datasys.net [204.252.164.17]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA16810 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:08:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (ayan@localhost) by 1.Mx.DataSys.NET (8.8.5/AntiSpam2.c) with SMTP id TAA07525 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:08:41 -0400 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:08:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Ayan George To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: olwm Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk all, I use olwm as my window manager under X. My only problem is that the PREFERENCES item in the my open-windows menu doesn't do anything. I've read the man pages over and over again but nothing mentions how to get it working. Anyone have any ideas? -Ayan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 16:12:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA17086 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:12:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA17068 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:12:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id IAA04680; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:42:14 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970913084213.18186@lemis.com> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:42:13 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Joerg Wunsch Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: <19970912101014.37786@lemis.com> <19970912154815.HN39525@uriah.heep.sax.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <19970912154815.HN39525@uriah.heep.sax.de>; from J Wunsch on Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 03:48:15PM +0200 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 03:48:15PM +0200, J Wunsch wrote: > As Greg Lehey wrote: > >> I've seen a lot of reports recently about problems with floppies under >> FreeBSD. Now I can understand a lot of that: floppies must be the >> most unreliable data storage medium I can think of, not to mention the >> most expensive per byte. But I'm getting the feeling that there is >> more to it than that, that possibly there's a bug in the floppy driver >> and that we're blaming it on the inherent unreliability of the medium. > > Oh, Greg is going to take over maintenance of the FDC driver! > Congratulations! :-) Look carefully. I'm just gathering information: >> I'm looking for indications which would point towards the driver. One >> of these might be: >> >> 1. Floppy formatted under on the same machine. >> 2. FreeBSD runs into hardware problems with the floppy (typically >> things like checksum errors). >> 3. can read the entire floppy with no trouble. > > There's exactly one unexplained record open where 1 - 3 does fit, and > i have yet to see more user input data for this case (or have to get > the drive and floppy controller myself for debugging). There are more now. > Greg, please think a little more about reported problems before > starting this kind of postings. What has been triggering this was > plainly and clearly something where a user had a problem with *the > BIOS* reading the floppy. This should say enough about the media > quality... Now there's the misassumption. I've already mentioned medium quality and the general unreliability. Ignoring that, it still seems that there are a significant number of cases where other systems can read the floppy, and FreeBSD can't. I've had them myself, though not on my current hardware. >> In addition, if you have any other evidence I haven't thought of which >> would also point to an error in the floppy driver, please contact me. > > Good luck for fixing these errors... Does this mean you don't want to maintain the driver any more? > And don't forget to verify your changes on at least half a dozen of > drives and controllers. That's one of the reasons I want to get a larger populace involved. Obviously you (or I) can't test all hardware. We need the people who have reported the problems to help. Unfortunately, so far the evidence isn't as exact as I would have liked. I know that this is a pain. Nobody says it isn't. But it doesn't help to turn a blind eye to possible driver problems and blame them on the medium. Note that I haven't claimed there *is* a problem with the driver yet--I'm just trying to get some evidence before going to look for a problem that doesn't exist. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 16:30:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA18088 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:30:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from misery.sdf.com (misery.sdf.com [204.244.210.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA18057; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:30:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tom by misery.sdf.com with smtp (Exim 1.62 #1) id 0x9f5X-0002Ha-00; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:25:23 -0700 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:25:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom To: Curt Sampson cc: Torsten Blum , Andreas Klemm , mark@grondar.za, ports@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Major bogon in tcp_wrappers port. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Curt Sampson wrote: > On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Torsten Blum wrote: > > > Andreas, have you _ever_ configured tcpd ? tcpd is not a standalone daemon. > > To activate it, you have to modify inetd.conf. > > It depends on the inetd.conf. NetBSD's inetd uses libwrap directly, > so no modification is necessary. Seems rather dubious. The libwrap calls parse the control files for every call. Hopefuly, it is called after the fork() so that DNS lookups don't block inetd. > > If a tool highly depends on the system and needs a rebuild of several tools > > to take advantage of it, I'll probably suggest to add it to the base system. > > Well, sendmail is one program needs to be recompiled to use libwrap. Or you could just use rulesets. You can't get too fine grained, but who needs that? > cjs > > Curt Sampson cjs@portal.ca Info at http://www.portal.ca/ > Internet Portal Services, Inc. Through infinite myst, software reverberates > Vancouver, BC (604) 257-9400 In code possess'd of invisible folly. > > > Tom From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 16:30:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA18138 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:30:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au [129.78.129.109]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA18118 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:30:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dawes@localhost) by rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.2) id JAA12271; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 09:30:35 +1000 (EST) Message-ID: <19970913093035.50156@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 09:30:35 +1000 From: David Dawes To: Terry Lambert Cc: Nate Williams , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes References: <199709122109.PAA12204@rocky.mt.sri.com> <199709122119.OAA25910@usr08.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709122119.OAA25910@usr08.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 09:19:58PM +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 09:19:58PM +0000, Terry Lambert wrote: >> > Maybe. Try using libXaw.so.6.0 instead. Mine has: >> >> I don't have libXaw.so.6.0. :( > >I could send you one, or you could get one off of freebsd.org... > >> > CtrlC: insert-selection(CUT_BUFFER0) >> > CtrlY: insert-selection(SECONDARY) >> > MetaY: insert-selection(PRIMARY, CUT_BUFFER0) >> > : insert-selection(PRIMARY, CUT_BUFFER0) >> >> How is this different than mine? (I removed the latter two definitions >> from the output since I was trying to show that the key definitions >> existed in the file, not that I was trying to show *every* instance of >> them.) Netscape doesn't use libXaw anyway (why would a Motif application use the Athena Widgets?). ldd confirms this. >Ugh. The only thing I can suggest is asking Brian exactly what it was >in his .Xdefaults, and see if you have the same thing. I can't believe >the person who did the FreeBSD port had the problem on his machine; a >port done for love always has fewer problems than one done for money. Did you re-run xrdb after editing your .Xdefaults. If you didn't, that might explain it. Brian said that he did, and it worked for him. To confirm that the change has taken, check the output of 'xrdb -query'. David From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 16:40:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA18648 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:40:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA18638 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:40:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by alpo.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA14687; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:33:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) via SMTP by alpo.whistle.com, id smtpd014684; Fri Sep 12 23:33:42 1997 Message-ID: <3419D133.695678E2@whistle.com> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:33:07 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Joerg Wunsch CC: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: <19970912231003.EE31735@uriah.heep.sax.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk J Wunsch wrote: YO, People! the original problems were with people not being able to get the boot floppy to boot.. This is TOTALLY INDEPENDENT of the kernel that's the BIOS doing that read, under the direction of the boot block. please make sure that we don't get kernel floppy problems mixed up with BIOS problems.. Not that there ar no problems with the kernel driver, bat any probelm reported along the lines of: "I tried to boot the boot floppy but got: READ ERROR D=0 H=0 C=0 S=1" should not be included in the list of FreeBSD problems.. julian > > As Jamil J. Weatherbee wrote: > > > I started my machine up fine with the freebsd boot disk to change a few > > things it loaded as normal --- but my floppy has never worked from within > > freebsd, I've reported it a few times but people seem to think it is just > > me. > > People don't ``seem to think'', but they ``notice'' it's just you. > Anyway, i offered you sending me the drive & controller, or whatever > is required to reproduce the problem. I have yet to hear anything > from you since. It's hard for me to debug problems i can't reproduce > myself. > > NB: i don't deny the potential bug that is there. It's just i can't > see it myself. > > -- > cheers, J"org > > joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE > Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 16:42:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA18755 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:42:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kf0yn.ampr.org ([204.176.110.45]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA18750 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:42:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [44.50.32.7] (kf0yn-mb.ampr.org [44.50.32.7]) by kf0yn.ampr.org (8.8.5/8.6.5) with ESMTP id SAA20671; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:40:44 -0500 (CDT) X-Sender: cmf@44.50.32.6 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:40:53 -0500 To: Terry Lambert From: Carl Fongheiser Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >To the user: you should note that the threaded libc differs from the >standard libc in that, instead of returning pointers to function >modified static data areas, most functions which formerly did just >that now return allocated buffers which contain the results, and it >is now the user's responsibility to free these buffers. > >The use of static data buffers in libc is a long-standing abomination, >blessed by ANSI and codified in stone by POSIX. Assume any man page >which states a pointer to a static data area is returned is actually >allocating a data area and expecting the caller to free it, whenever >you are using a thread-safe library. It may be an abomination, but it's also a fact of life. The pthread interface *does* provide a way to cope -- check out pthread_key_create(), pthread_setspecific() and pthread_getspecific(). You even get to specify a destructor routine, so you can automagically clean up your allocated buffers inside the library! Carl Fongheiser cmf@netins.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 16:43:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA18819 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:43:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr04.primenet.com (tlambert@usr04.primenet.com [206.165.6.204]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA18814 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:43:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr04.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA19479; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:43:45 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709122343.QAA19479@usr04.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:43:44 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970912232505.WA27195@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Sep 12, 97 11:25:05 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Umm. If timing is so critical, why do MS-DOS and Win311 work flawlessly > > with it? > > Timing isn't so critical. Floppies are probably not Terry's strongest > side either. For single sector writes, starting later than you should is a bad thing; the inter-sector gap, which is used to recognize sectors is hysteretically shortened by loose timing. But you're right: they aren't my strong suit in any case. I tend toward timing insensitive hardware and generally leave abominations for those people silly enough to not step one step back when they call for vounteers. 8-). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 16:50:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA19163 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:50:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr04.primenet.com (tlambert@usr04.primenet.com [206.165.6.204]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA19136; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:50:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr04.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA20102; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:50:29 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709122350.QAA20102@usr04.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? To: kjk1@ukc.ac.uk Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:50:29 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, questions@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "K.J.Koster" at Sep 12, 97 10:33:27 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > The correct way for a multitasking OS to deal with this is *NOT* to > > drop into a buzz loop and to cease being a multitasking OS for the > > duration of the loop, as you are suggesting. > > I agree with you that busy-looping on a device is not the correct way to > go about I/O, and I understand why FreeBSD does not busy-loop. However, we > are not talking about SCSI or IDE drivers, we are talking about a lowly > floppy driver. Busy looping is wrong. It doesn't matter if it's self-defense, it's still wrong. It's maybe justifiable, but justifiability and wrongness are completely orthogonal attributes. > This discussion is about people finding their floppies > trashed by their OS. Hardly `the correct way'. You may have a valid complaint, that FreeBSD did not do the wrong thing, and then rationalize it after the fact to justify doing the wrong thing; OR you may have a vlid complaint that FreeBSD allows you to access the drive when you are loading your system above the timing constraints. > If I look at how I use my floppy drive, I'm usually sitting and waiting > for it to finish anyway, so if my CPU is clocking idle time or system time > makes no difference for me, personally. Then run whatever process at a much higher priority. Problem solved. > FreeBSD has special options for people with broken keyboard resets, > broken APM and broken PCMCIA cards. Why not add another one for unfifo'd > floppy controllers? We have one. It's called "-s". Use this option at the boot prompt. The floppy will function as it did during the problem-free install you reported. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 17:03:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA19611 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:03:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr04.primenet.com (tlambert@usr04.primenet.com [206.165.6.204]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA19601 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:03:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr04.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA21620; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:03:17 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709130003.RAA21620@usr04.primenet.com> Subject: Re: VFS/NFS client wedging problem To: durian@plutotech.com (Mike Durian) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:03:16 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709122231.QAA00374@pluto.plutotech.com> from "Mike Durian" at Sep 12, 97 04:31:43 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I've got a VFS problem I'm hoping someone out there can give > me some ideas on. I've written a VFS based filesystem that is > an interface to our RAID system. The RAID system stores video > frames and the filesystem allows access to the data and automatically > translates the data to a variety of file formats (TIFF, Targa, YUV, > etc.). The frame number and conversion type are defined by the > path name. Eg /pfs/frames/tiff/0.tiff or > /pfs/HMSF/tga/hour00/minute01/second10//00.01.10.29.tga. > The filesystem is implemented partially in the kernel and partially > as a user application. The two parts communicate via a socket. How do you serialize upcalls through the socket, such that you don't have overlapped requests? Or do you have seperate request contexts so that this doesn't cause problems? If you don't have seperate contexts, eventually you'll make a request before the previous one completes. The NFS export stuff is a bit problematic. I don't know what to say about it, except that it should be in the common mount code instead of being duplicated per FS. If you can give more architectural data about your FS, and you can give the FS you used as a model of how a VFS should be written, I might be able to give you more detailed help. This is probably something that should be taken off the general -hackers list, and onto fs@freebsd.org > The filesystem works well for normal accesses, but I'm having > a strange problem with NFS. I've supplied the fhtovp and vptofh > hooks and things basically work, but I can get the client side > wedged under heavy accesses. > If I run four simultaneous processes copying data to my filesystem, > after a while I'll see one of the nfsiod go to sleep on "vfsfsy" > and not return. Eventually, the other nfsiods will go to sleep on > "nfsrcv" and that's that. Where is the NFS server sleeping, that's the question. > In both cases, it looks like the clients aren't getting a acks > from the server. Strangely, none of the nfsd processes on the > server are sleeping and the user mount_pfs process isn't sleeping > either. That's not strange. It's a request context that's wedged. When a request context would be slept, the nfsd on the server isn't slept, the context is. The nfsd provides an execution context for a different request context at that point. Try nfsstat instead, and/or iostat, on the server. > I'm not sure where the problem lies. Is it an NFS issue or > a (more likely) bug in my filesystem? Does anybody have any ideas > on why an NFS server might drop an ACK and wedge the client? Because the request context is blocked. It's not dorpped the ACK, it just hasn't sent one yet. > I did get the same results with both NFSv3 and NFSv2. This proves to us that it isn't async requests over the wire that are hosing you. That the server is an NFSv3 capable server argues that the v2 protocol is implemented by a v3 engine, which would explain the blockages. Have you tried bot TCP and UDP based mounts? Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 17:05:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA19796 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:05:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ingenieria ([168.176.15.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA19783 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:05:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by ingenieria (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id TAA01689; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:51:21 -0400 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:51:21 -0400 (EDT) From: Yonny Cardenas To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Links with gated Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have two box how routers with FreeBSD 2.1.5, one run gated (A) and other run routed (B), conected with link ethernet, the router (A) anounnce OK to other neighbor EGP, all its paths. ------ EGP -------9 RIP 1-------- RIP | |----... --------| A |**************| B |-------- ------ ------- -------- 200.20.30 After, I changed the link ethernet for a link serial asyncronus ( RS232 with cable null modem), I am using PPP in this link, the conection is OK, but they aren't interchange routing information on this link. The fowolling mensages present router (A): router_A [66] : krt_recv_route: request route to 200.20.30.1/255.255.255.255 via200.20.30.9 not active - deleting I am not using netmask 255.255.255.255, I am using 255.255.255.0 . Thanks for your help. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- YONNY CARDENAS B. Systems Engineer || || ||| || Universidad Nacional de Colombia || || || | || Email : yonny@ingenieria.ingsala.unal.edu.co ||||||| || ||| From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 17:10:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA20098 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:10:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr04.primenet.com (tlambert@usr04.primenet.com [206.165.6.204]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA20084 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:10:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr04.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA22413; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:10:05 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709130010.RAA22413@usr04.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes To: dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (David Dawes) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:10:05 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, nate@mt.sri.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970913093035.50156@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> from "David Dawes" at Sep 13, 97 09:30:35 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Netscape doesn't use libXaw anyway (why would a Motif application use > the Athena Widgets?). ldd confirms this. Well, then Nate isn't having the error. 8-) 8-). > Did you re-run xrdb after editing your .Xdefaults. If you didn't, > that might explain it. Brian said that he did, and it worked for him. > To confirm that the change has taken, check the output of 'xrdb -query'. If Nate is sane, he doesn't run xrdb; I certainly don't. It's too hard to handle the middle case. IMO, the .Xdefaults and the xrdb are frequently treated as completely seperate namespaces; both must be searched by apps (I *know* Motif searched both). This leads me to a question... if Nate dies run "xrdb -query", and gets back some crap, it may be his XDM that's screwing him up. Is Brian using XDM for login? XDM uses Xaw, right? At this point I'm kind of grasping at straws to try and expain by proxy the differences between Brian and Nate's environments, so it's probably time for them to get together offline and me to quit grasping. 8-(. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 17:19:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA20632 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:19:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr04.primenet.com (tlambert@usr04.primenet.com [206.165.6.204]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA20627 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:19:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr04.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA23474; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:19:45 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709130019.RAA23474@usr04.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? To: cmf@netins.net (Carl Fongheiser) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:19:45 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Carl Fongheiser" at Sep 12, 97 06:40:53 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >The use of static data buffers in libc is a long-standing abomination, > >blessed by ANSI and codified in stone by POSIX. Assume any man page > >which states a pointer to a static data area is returned is actually > >allocating a data area and expecting the caller to free it, whenever > >you are using a thread-safe library. > > It may be an abomination, but it's also a fact of life. The correct fix is to change the standards so that it isn't. I know, I know, not going to happen... only Microsoft ever gets rid of legacy interfaces, it seems. > The pthread > interface *does* provide a way to cope -- check out pthread_key_create(), > pthread_setspecific() and pthread_getspecific(). You even get to specify > a destructor routine, so you can automagically clean up your allocated > buffers inside the library! This is more than somewhat Evil. Specifically, the concept of marshalling objects between threads only starts to get really complicated if you do something stupid (like Microsoft did) and start allocating objects into thread local storage, such that there is no guarantee that the thread address spaces are common. A threads aware C++ object class using a pure virtual interface class (can you say COM?) will have a bitch of a time using objects created by one thread in another thread if the backing objects for the interface class are instanced in a thread other than the one in which they are to be used. This is why CoCreateFreeThreadedMarshaller() exists. I would prefer that FreeBSD not become Windows, at least not at the "terrible API" layer. 8-|. I would much prefer that the standard library routines *NOT* attempt to grandfather badly designed interfaces, the better to keep them hung, as an albatross about our necks, until the end of time. If we wanted to be Ancient Mariners, we would all be programming to the NetWare API set, which grandfathers back to version 1.0 of NetWare. 8-(. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 17:27:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA21046 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:27:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr04.primenet.com (tlambert@usr04.primenet.com [206.165.6.204]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA21041 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:27:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr04.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA24479; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:27:41 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709130027.RAA24479@usr04.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? To: julian@whistle.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:27:41 +0000 (GMT) Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <3419D133.695678E2@whistle.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Sep 12, 97 04:33:07 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > "I tried to boot the boot floppy but got: > READ ERROR D=0 H=0 C=0 S=1" > > should not be included in the list of FreeBSD problems.. Agreed. BTW, that particular error will occur, I believe, if you use RAWRITE.EXE in a DOS window under Windows 95/NT, and do not first "shutdown to a real mode DOS prompt". I believe the problem is the "antivirus" protection from writing the boot sector, and the TSD miniport taking control of the boot sector region on the disk. Typically, it fails to write that area of the disk. Silently. If someone is interested in doing something about this, they should do an install check for Windows 95/NT, and then assert a level 3 volume lock, followed by a level 0 volume lock, after which they should be able to write track 0. If you aren't interested, it's possible that you can use the DOS command line "lock" command to assert volume locks on drive A: (or B:) to get the same effect. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 17:42:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA21703 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:42:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from superior.mooseriver.com (dynamic4.pm02.san-mateo.best.com [206.184.198.164]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA21690 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:42:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgrosch@localhost) by superior.mooseriver.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id RAA00869; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:42:03 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970912174203.24817@mooseriver.com> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:42:03 -0700 From: Josef Grosch To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: NCR 53c710 Reply-To: jgrosch@superior.mooseriver.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have recently been give an HP EISA SCSI card. This card does fast-wide differential. My main chip on this is a NCR 53c710. Can anyone point me to the specs for this? I can't seem to find the specs on NCR's web page. Thanks Josef -- Josef Grosch | Another day closer to a | FreeBSD 2.2.2 jgrosch@MooseRiver.com | Micro$oft free world | UNIX for the masses From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 18:02:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA22656 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:02:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (SRI-56K-FR.mt.net [206.127.65.42]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA22647 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:02:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA16900; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:02:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id TAA13481; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:01:59 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:01:59 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709130101.TAA13481@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: David Dawes Cc: Terry Lambert , Nate Williams , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes In-Reply-To: <19970913093035.50156@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> References: <199709122109.PAA12204@rocky.mt.sri.com> <199709122119.OAA25910@usr08.primenet.com> <19970913093035.50156@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >Ugh. The only thing I can suggest is asking Brian exactly what it was > >in his .Xdefaults, and see if you have the same thing. I can't believe > >the person who did the FreeBSD port had the problem on his machine; a > >port done for love always has fewer problems than one done for money. > > Did you re-run xrdb after editing your .Xdefaults. Actually, I rebooted. But, upon reflection (too many machines, too little time), the machine I rebooted still has netscape 3 on it, and the machine that has netscape 4 on it didn't get rebooted. So, I did an xrdb -query, and sure enough I have some leftovers from my .Xdefaults. I re-ran xrdb, but unfortunately I don't have time to test it since it's Friday night and the box that can run it is at work. My box at home doesn't have the 'umph' to run V4, so it still runs V4. In short, I *suspect* that things should be working fine if: 1) It is Netscape 4 for FreeBSD 2) There is no trace of any kill/insert-selection crud in any application defaults and/or .Xdefaults file. But, if you're running netscape 3, you'll get annoying messages. :( Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 18:08:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA22935 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:08:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from super-g.inch.com (super-g.com [207.240.140.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA22926; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:08:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (spork@localhost) by super-g.inch.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA12604; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:20:31 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:20:31 -0400 (EDT) From: spork X-Sender: spork@super-g.inch.com To: Andreas Klemm cc: Torsten Blum , mark@grondar.za, ports@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Major bogon in tcp_wrappers port. In-Reply-To: <19970912172743.64756@klemm.gtn.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'd just like to avoid the hassle of installing it on every machine... I do think this could be made simple for the "dumb user" with a simple question like "What hosts do you wish to allow to telnet to your machine?" in sysinstall. If incorporating it into the base is not acceptable, then I'll ask for a knob in sysinstall here. Installation time isn't the worst time to allow a newbie to learn a bit about security... Charles On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Andreas Klemm wrote: > On Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 10:58:42AM +0200, Torsten Blum wrote: > > > > Everybody has different needs for security. There are more than enough > > users who'll never need tcpwrapper because > > - they only have a small set of "services" running on these boxes > > (for example www server, dns, sendmail etc) > > - we have users who really don't care about security (sad but true). > > They never care to configure hosts.{allow,deny} or even check their > > logfiles > > - Machines without connections "external" connection > > and many many more > > ok, agreed. > > > Andreas, have you _ever_ configured tcpd ? tcpd is not a standalone daemon. > > To activate it, you have to modify inetd.conf. > > Yes I'm using it in the company for our secured FreeBSD internet > gateway ... > > > Don't get me wrong, I'm all for a "more" secure system, but you don't get > > this out of the box. You _always_ have to configure something. > > Ok, agreed. Peace man ;-) > > -- > Andreas Klemm | klemm.gtn.com - powered by > Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD > http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/SMP.html > http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/benches.html > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 18:15:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA23302 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:15:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pat.idi.ntnu.no (0@pat.idi.ntnu.no [129.241.103.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA23286 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:14:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from idt.unit.no (tegge@ikke.idi.ntnu.no [129.241.111.65]) by pat.idi.ntnu.no (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id DAA01842; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:14:28 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199709130114.DAA01842@pat.idi.ntnu.no> To: dkelly@hiwaay.net Cc: grog@lemis.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 05:53:34 -0500" References: <199709121053.FAA14361@nospam.hiwaay.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mew version 1.70 on Emacs 19.34.1 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:14:28 +0200 From: Tor Egge Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > So this time I kicked off bonnie and got > > 51 pci irq9 (Adaptec 2940) > 21 fdc0 irq6 > blks 5245 (sd0, "SEAGATE ST32550N 0021") > > Processing EVEVEVEEVEVVVVEVVVVVEVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV done. > > The V's were in the "Reading intelligently..." phase. I have similar experiences when iozone is running in the background. MB is ASUS P65UP5. AHA2940 and AHA2940UW scsi controllers. Using fdformat gives the following output: Format 1440K floppy `/dev/rfd0.1440'? (y/n): y Processing VVVVVEVVVVVVEVVVVVVVEEVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV done. with errors as: fd0c: hard error reading fsbn 420 of 414-431 (ST0 44 ST1 4 ST2 0 cyl 11 hd 1 sec 7) Aborting iozone and running fdformat -v (only verify) reproduces the same errors, indicating that bad contents was written to some of the sector headers on the disk during the format operation. with no scsi bus traffic, I was able to run fdformat 10 times in a row without encountering any errors. Disabling interrupts in fd_cmd and fd_read_status did not help. This indicates that `busy waiting' will not help. It looks very much like a DMA conflict or starvation. - Tor Egge From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 18:15:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA23375 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:15:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from DNS.Lamb.net (root@DNS.Lamb.net [207.90.181.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA23362 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:15:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by DNS.Lamb.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) id SAA28074; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:19:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gatekeeper.Alameda.net(207.90.181.2) via SMTP by DNS.Lamb.net, id smtpd028072; Fri Sep 12 18:19:20 1997 Received: (from ulf@localhost) by Gatekeeper.Alameda.net (8.8.6/8.7.6) id SAA12286; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:15:15 -0700 (PDT) From: Ulf Zimmermann Message-Id: <199709130115.SAA12286@Gatekeeper.Alameda.net> Subject: Re: NCR 53c710 In-Reply-To: <19970912174203.24817@mooseriver.com> from Josef Grosch at "Sep 12, 97 05:42:03 pm" To: jgrosch@superior.mooseriver.com Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:15:15 -0700 (PDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I have recently been give an HP EISA SCSI card. This card does fast-wide > differential. My main chip on this is a NCR 53c710. Can anyone point me to > the specs for this? I can't seem to find the specs on NCR's web page. > That part of NCR is now Symbios. http://www.symbios.com/ -- Ulf. --------------------------------------------------------------------- Ulf Zimmermann, 1525 Pacific Ave., Alameda, CA-94501, #: 510-769-2936 Alameda Networks, Inc. | http://www.Alameda.net | Fax#: 510-521-5073 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 18:21:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA23772 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:21:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pluto.plutotech.com (root@mail.plutotech.com [206.168.67.137]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA23749; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:20:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shane.plutotech.com (shane.plutotech.com [206.168.67.149]) by pluto.plutotech.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA03040; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:19:31 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709130119.TAA03040@pluto.plutotech.com> From: "Mike Durian" To: Terry Lambert cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, fs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: VFS/NFS client wedging problem In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:03:16 -0000." Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:19:31 -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:03:16 -0000, Terry Lambert wrote: > >How do you serialize upcalls through the socket, such that you >don't have overlapped requests? Or do you have seperate request >contexts so that this doesn't cause problems? > >If you don't have seperate contexts, eventually you'll make a request >before the previous one completes. I serialize. I used to keep a list of N available sockets and use one socket per request, but since I handle commands atomically in the user process figured it was silly and dropped down to one socket. The user process is one big select loop, and doesn't call select again until it has completed all commands on the readable sockets (which is now just one socket). >The NFS export stuff is a bit problematic. I don't know what to >say about it, except that it should be in the common mount code >instead of being duplicated per FS. > >If you can give more architectural data about your FS, and you can >give the FS you used as a model of how a VFS should be written, I >might be able to give you more detailed help. > >This is probably something that should be taken off the general >-hackers list, and onto fs@freebsd.org It's really a mish-mash of other file systems. I grabbed some from cd9660 and msdosfs for NFS, socket stuff from portal and then nullfs and other miscfs filesystem for general stuff. I'll take all the detailed stuff off this list and move it to freebsd-fs. I didn't know the fs list existed. >That's not strange. It's a request context that's wedged. When a >request context would be slept, the nfsd on the server isn't slept, >the context is. The nfsd provides an execution context for a different >request context at that point. Try nfsstat instead, and/or iostat, >on the server. I didn't realize that. I did use nfsstat, but didn't know what to look for. The only thing that seemed interesting to me was the 190 server faults. But I didn't know if that was normal or not. >This proves to us that it isn't async requests over the wire that are >hosing you. That the server is an NFSv3 capable server argues that >the v2 protocol is implemented by a v3 engine, which would explain >the blockages. > >Have you tried bot TCP and UDP based mounts? Yes. UDP died locked up faster than TCP (though that is a subjective measurement, I didn't actually time things). TCP had the "server not responding"/"responding again" messages. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 18:49:12 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA25176 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:49:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from colonel.42inc.com (colonel.42inc.com [205.217.47.81]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA25169; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:49:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jal@localhost) by colonel.42inc.com (8.8.5/8.6.12) id SAA25594; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:48:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Jamie Lawrence Message-Id: <199709130148.SAA25594@colonel.42inc.com> Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release To: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG (Jonathan M. Bresler), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:48:38 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <199709121602.JAA13216@hub.freebsd.org> from "Jonathan M. Bresler" at "Sep 12, 97 09:02:58 am" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Jamie Bowden wrote: > > > > On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Aled Morris wrote: > > > > Does anyone here actually get the point that a newbie can't use emacs > > anymore than they can use vi? I hate ee as much as the rest of you, but > > it's small, and it tells the newbie which keys do what, which vi and emacs > > don't do. > [..] > but why make them learn ee key-bindings, and then when they > move on to a better editor force them to learn a new set of > key-bindings? that's just torturing the poor unsuspecting > newbie. vi key-bindings are not an option--a modal editor > will confuse the daylights out of them. so lets make > emacs key-bindings the system default for ee. I don't mean to confuse things, but I don't know that that's best. Emacs is superior, hands down. However, vi can run in places where emacs can't. I'm a sysadmin and what's worse, only seem to have enough brainspace for one editor, so I only use vi, even though emacs is fully configured on every system I use. Learning a new editor when your system is hosed is the only thing worse than learning a new editor. My point is simply that consistency is what matters. If someone is installing FreeBSD, they are implicitly committing to a fair amount of learning. The point should be to make it easier to learn the most important points first, and let them focus as they will later. My $.0x02. -j, mainly a lurker. > jmb > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 18:57:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA25606 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:57:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au [129.78.129.109]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA25599 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:57:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dawes@localhost) by rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.2) id LAA12605; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:57:08 +1000 (EST) Message-ID: <19970913115708.17462@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:57:08 +1000 From: David Dawes To: Terry Lambert Cc: nate@mt.sri.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes References: <19970913093035.50156@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> <199709130010.RAA22413@usr04.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709130010.RAA22413@usr04.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Sat, Sep 13, 1997 at 12:10:05AM +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, Sep 13, 1997 at 12:10:05AM +0000, Terry Lambert wrote: >> Netscape doesn't use libXaw anyway (why would a Motif application use >> the Athena Widgets?). ldd confirms this. > >Well, then Nate isn't having the error. 8-) 8-). >> Did you re-run xrdb after editing your .Xdefaults. If you didn't, >> that might explain it. Brian said that he did, and it worked for him. >> To confirm that the change has taken, check the output of 'xrdb -query'. > >If Nate is sane, he doesn't run xrdb; I certainly don't. It's too So I must be insane :-). >hard to handle the middle case. IMO, the .Xdefaults and the xrdb >are frequently treated as completely seperate namespaces; both must >be searched by apps (I *know* Motif searched both). They *are* separate namespaces. xrdb loads them into the Xserver, so they are server-wide, and stored on the server side. Both the .Xdefaults file and app-defaults files are on the client-side. >This leads me to a question... if Nate dies run "xrdb -query", and >gets back some crap, it may be his XDM that's screwing him up. Is >Brian using XDM for login? XDM uses Xaw, right? Xdm has no direct affect on this, and whether or not it uses Xaw is irrelevant. Xdm's Xsession (or ~/.xsession) may be setup to run xrdb, but that isn't something implicit in xdm. I personally use xdm, and have the following in my ~/.xsession file: if [ -f "$HOME/.Xdefaults" ]; then xrdb $HOME/.Xdefaults fi The sample Xsession file does something similar. I don't see this problem with any version of netscape I've ever run on any platform. David From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 19:01:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA25912 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:01:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au [129.78.129.109]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA25904 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:01:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dawes@localhost) by rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (8.8.5/8.8.2) id MAA12628; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:01:37 +1000 (EST) Message-ID: <19970913120136.44849@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:01:36 +1000 From: David Dawes To: Nate Williams Cc: Terry Lambert , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes References: <199709122109.PAA12204@rocky.mt.sri.com> <199709122119.OAA25910@usr08.primenet.com> <19970913093035.50156@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> <199709130101.TAA13481@rocky.mt.sri.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709130101.TAA13481@rocky.mt.sri.com>; from Nate Williams on Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 07:01:59PM -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 07:01:59PM -0600, Nate Williams wrote: >> >Ugh. The only thing I can suggest is asking Brian exactly what it was >> >in his .Xdefaults, and see if you have the same thing. I can't believe >> >the person who did the FreeBSD port had the problem on his machine; a >> >port done for love always has fewer problems than one done for money. >> >> Did you re-run xrdb after editing your .Xdefaults. > >Actually, I rebooted. But, upon reflection (too many machines, too >little time), the machine I rebooted still has netscape 3 on it, and the >machine that has netscape 4 on it didn't get rebooted. So, I did an >xrdb -query, and sure enough I have some leftovers from my .Xdefaults. That most likely explains it. >I re-ran xrdb, but unfortunately I don't have time to test it since it's >Friday night and the box that can run it is at work. My box at home >doesn't have the 'umph' to run V4, so it still runs V4. > >In short, I *suspect* that things should be working fine if: >1) It is Netscape 4 for FreeBSD >2) There is no trace of any kill/insert-selection crud in any > application defaults and/or .Xdefaults file. > >But, if you're running netscape 3, you'll get annoying messages. :( I've never had those messages with netscape 3 (or any version of netscape I've ever used on various platforms). I was using the BSDI netscape 3 binary at home with FreeBSD 2.2.2 until very recently when I switched to 4. David From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 19:25:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA27216 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:25:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from echonyc.com (echonyc.com [198.67.15.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA27209 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:25:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (benedict@localhost) by echonyc.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA05439; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:25:12 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:25:11 -0400 (EDT) From: Snob Art Genre To: spork cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Major bogon in tcp_wrappers port. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Any reason for tcp_wrappers instead of xinetd? Or vice-versa for that matter? On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, spork wrote: > I'd just like to avoid the hassle of installing it on every machine... > > I do think this could be made simple for the "dumb user" with a simple > question like "What hosts do you wish to allow to telnet to your machine?" > in sysinstall. > > If incorporating it into the base is not acceptable, then I'll ask for a > knob in sysinstall here. Installation time isn't the worst time to allow > a newbie to learn a bit about security... > > Charles Ben "You have your mind on computers, it seems." From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 19:29:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA27437 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:29:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (SRI-56K-FR.mt.net [206.127.65.42]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA27428 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:29:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA17402; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:28:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA13767; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:28:55 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:28:55 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709130228.UAA13767@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: David Dawes Cc: Nate Williams , Terry Lambert , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes In-Reply-To: <19970913120136.44849@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> References: <199709122109.PAA12204@rocky.mt.sri.com> <199709122119.OAA25910@usr08.primenet.com> <19970913093035.50156@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> <199709130101.TAA13481@rocky.mt.sri.com> <19970913120136.44849@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >if you're running netscape 3, you'll get annoying messages. :( > > I've never had those messages with netscape 3 (or any version of netscape > I've ever used on various platforms). I was using the BSDI netscape 3 > binary at home with FreeBSD 2.2.2 until very recently when I switched > to 4. Hmm, I don't know why I'm getting them, but I certainly am right now. And, the messages live in netscape's 'Netscape.ad' that's in /usr/local/lib/netscape, although that's not installed anywhere. In any case, I did get to cleanup some old cruft out of my .Xdefaults file. Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 20:26:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA29540 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:26:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr02.primenet.com (tlambert@usr02.primenet.com [206.165.6.202]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA29523; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:26:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr02.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA07078; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:26:25 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709130326.UAA07078@usr02.primenet.com> Subject: Re: VFS/NFS client wedging problem To: durian@plutotech.com (Mike Durian) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:26:24 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, fs@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709130119.TAA03040@pluto.plutotech.com> from "Mike Durian" at Sep 12, 97 07:19:31 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >If you don't have seperate contexts, eventually you'll make a request > >before the previous one completes. > > I serialize. This is what I figured you had to do, or you'd really be in trouble. > I used to keep a list of N available sockets and > use one socket per request, but since I handle commands atomically > in the user process figured it was silly and dropped down to one > socket. If this is a UNIX domain socket, then it's like a pipe. A pipe does not guarantee to keep data together over the pipe block size, so if you are doing larger writes, this gould be your problem. You could write: AAAAABBBBBCCCCC And get the data out of order: AAAABABBBCBCCCC Which would account for the failures. Typically, when I do this, I write data as: aAaAaAaAaAbBbBbBbBbBcCcCcCcCcC where a, b, and c are channel identification tokens. Then you can decode: aAaAaAaAbBaAbBbBbBcCbBcCcCcCcC Back into atomic units. The channel identifiers are per byte. This is only one possibility, and depends on the write buffer size. > The user process is one big select loop, and doesn't > call select again until it has completed all commands on the > readable sockets (which is now just one socket). Did this failure occur when you had seperate sockets? How hard would it be to go back to a socket per channel as a test case? > >The NFS export stuff is a bit problematic. I don't know what to > >say about it, except that it should be in the common mount code > >instead of being duplicated per FS. > > > >If you can give more architectural data about your FS, and you can > >give the FS you used as a model of how a VFS should be written, I > >might be able to give you more detailed help. > > > >This is probably something that should be taken off the general > >-hackers list, and onto fs@freebsd.org > > It's really a mish-mash of other file systems. I grabbed some > from cd9660 and msdosfs for NFS, socket stuff from portal and > then nullfs and other miscfs filesystem for general stuff. This is not going to be a pleasent revelation, I'm afraid. These are the worst places to get NFS and VOP_LOCK examples, unfortunately. The best place is the ffs/ufs two layer stack, but it's very complicated and hard to understand. The directory stuff in the msdosfs, particularly, is bad. There is a race window after unlocking the parent to locking the child of the child. This is pretty much unavoidable (at present) because of the VOP_LOOKUP code structure pushing some things better left up top down into the per FS code (the msdosfs would be able to deal with it if it didn't have the VOP_ABORTOP issues on create and rename to contend with). > I'll take all the detailed stuff off this list and move it to > freebsd-fs. I didn't know the fs list existed. Heh. Most people don't. It doesn't see much action because it requires huge code shifts to modify interfaces. Anything that needs to do that touches every FS at the same time. > >That's not strange. It's a request context that's wedged. When a > >request context would be slept, the nfsd on the server isn't slept, > >the context is. The nfsd provides an execution context for a different > >request context at that point. Try nfsstat instead, and/or iostat, > >on the server. > > I didn't realize that. I did use nfsstat, but didn't know what > to look for. The only thing that seemed interesting to me was > the 190 server faults. But I didn't know if that was normal or not. I have 0 here, but then my stuff is pretty hacked up compared to the standard distribution, so I have no way of kowing if faults are the normal state of affairs or not. Doug Rabson would know. > >This proves to us that it isn't async requests over the wire that are > >hosing you. That the server is an NFSv3 capable server argues that > >the v2 protocol is implemented by a v3 engine, which would explain > >the blockages. > > > >Have you tried bot TCP and UDP based mounts? > > Yes. UDP died locked up faster than TCP (though that is a subjective > measurement, I didn't actually time things). TCP had the "server not > responding"/"responding again" messages. This lets out "source host not equal to mount host" errors. It's a good data point for eliminating an obvious case... even negative data is still data. 8-(. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 20:30:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA29716 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:30:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pobox.com (ras149.microplus.ca [207.81.20.68]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA29705 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:30:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from brianc@localhost) by pobox.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA02961; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:29:12 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19970912232911.50519@pobox.com> Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:29:11 -0400 From: Brian Campbell To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: ccd / newfs error Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Has anyone else had problems newfs'ing ccd filesystems? It works for some interleaves but not others. The newfs error message is less than informative. Is there a guideline for getting the best performance out of a filesytems (newfs/tunefs options) for reads vs writes, large vs small files, etc? Script started on Fri Sep 12 23:19:10 1997 # ccdconfig -v ccd0 64 0 /dev/sd0h /dev/sd1h ccd0: 2 components (sd0h, sd1h), 8369536 blocks interleaved at 64 blocks # newfs ccd0a Warning: 2688 sector(s) in last cylinder unallocated /dev/rccd0a: 8369536 sectors in 2044 cylinders of 1 tracks, 4096 sectors 4086.7MB in 128 cyl groups (16 c/g, 32.00MB/g, 7680 i/g) super-block backups (for fsck -b #) at: 32, 65568, 131104, 196640, 262176, 327712, 393248, 458784, 524320, 589856, 655392, 720928, 786464, 852000, 917536, ... # ccdconfig -u ccd0 # ccdconfig -v ccd0 128 0 /dev/sd0h /dev/sd1h ccd0: 2 components (sd0h, sd1h), 8369408 blocks interleaved at 128 blocks # newfs ccd0a write error: 8369535 wtfs: Invalid argument # ccdconfig -u ccd0 # ccdconfig -v ccd0 256 0 /dev/sd0h /dev/sd1h ccd0: 2 components (sd0h, sd1h), 8369152 blocks interleaved at 256 blocks # newfs ccd0a Warning: 2688 sector(s) in last cylinder unallocated /dev/rccd0a: 8369536 sectors in 2044 cylinders of 1 tracks, 4096 sectors 4086.7MB in 128 cyl groups (16 c/g, 32.00MB/g, 7680 i/g) super-block backups (for fsck -b #) at: 32, 65568, 131104, 196640, 262176, 327712, 393248, 458784, 524320, 589856, 655392, 720928, 786464, 852000, 917536, ... # ccdconfig -u ccd0 # ccdconfig -v ccd0 512 0 /dev/sd0h /dev/sd1h ccd0: 2 components (sd0h, sd1h), 8369152 blocks interleaved at 512 blocks # newfs ccd0a write error: 8369535 wtfs: Invalid argument # ccdconfig -u ccd0 Script done on Fri Sep 12 23:20:34 1997 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 20:34:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA29843 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:34:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from misery.sdf.com (misery.sdf.com [204.244.210.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA29836 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:34:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tom by misery.sdf.com with smtp (Exim 1.62 #1) id 0x9isf-0002PV-00; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:28:21 -0700 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:28:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom To: Yonny Cardenas cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Links with gated In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Yonny Cardenas wrote: > I have two box how routers with FreeBSD 2.1.5, one run gated (A) and other > run routed (B), conected with link ethernet, the router (A) anounnce OK to > other neighbor EGP, all its paths. > > ------ EGP -------9 RIP 1-------- RIP > | |----... --------| A |**************| B |-------- > ------ ------- -------- > 200.20.30 > > After, I changed the link ethernet for a link serial asyncronus > ( RS232 with cable null modem), I am using PPP in this link, the > conection is OK, but they aren't interchange routing information > on this link. > > The fowolling mensages present router (A): > > router_A [66] : krt_recv_route: request route to 200.20.30.1/255.255.255.255 via200.20.30.9 not active - deleting This may be harmless. There are various hidden routes in the routing (mainly cloned routes), and gated tries to clean things up (gated does say route is "inactive"). > I am not using netmask 255.255.255.255, I am using 255.255.255.0 . Are you actually using EGP, or some other exterior routing protocol on the LAN segment marked "EGP"? What does you gated.conf have in it? Since you are using RIP on one side, and some other routing protocol on the other side you have to explicitly instruct routed to redistribute routes from one protocol into another. > Thanks for your help. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > YONNY CARDENAS B. > Systems Engineer || || ||| || > Universidad Nacional de Colombia || || || | || > Email : yonny@ingenieria.ingsala.unal.edu.co ||||||| || ||| > > > Tom From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 20:44:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA00389 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:44:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mother.sneaker.net.au (akm@mother.sneaker.net.au [203.30.3.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA00382; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:44:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from akm@localhost) by mother.sneaker.net.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA17432; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:52:34 GMT From: Andrew Kenneth Milton Message-Id: <199709131352.NAA17432@mother.sneaker.net.au> Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release To: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG (Jonathan M. Bresler) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:52:33 +0000 () Cc: jamie@itribe.net, aledm@routers.co.uk, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709121602.JAA13216@hub.freebsd.org> from "Jonathan M. Bresler" at Sep 12, 97 09:02:58 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Anyone out there use jove? It's a lightweight emacs clone, without the lisp compiler. Comes with an interactive tutorial. I use it when I don't have X access or when I want to make a quick edit. It might be possible to alter jove to suit the FreeBSD requirements (whatever they might be) rather than re-invent several wheels. So far I can see a) Needs a help window displaying the common keybindings b) Needs to be small c) Shouldn't be as modal as vi without starting an editor jihad, we should probably determine what the requirements are for the editor in general terms. -- ,-_|\ SneakerNet | Andrew Milton | GSM: +61(41)6 022 411 / \ P.O. Box 154 | akm@sneaker.net.au | Fax: +61(2) 9746 8233 \_,-._/ N Strathfield +--+----------------------+---+ Ph: +61(2) 9746 8233 v NSW 2137 | Low cost Internet Solutions | From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 20:51:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA00614 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:51:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr02.primenet.com (tlambert@usr02.primenet.com [206.165.6.202]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA00607 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:51:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr02.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA08155; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:51:11 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709130351.UAA08155@usr02.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Netscape annoying dialog boxes To: dawes@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (David Dawes) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:51:11 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, nate@mt.sri.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970913115708.17462@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> from "David Dawes" at Sep 13, 97 11:57:08 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >If Nate is sane, he doesn't run xrdb; I certainly don't. It's too > > So I must be insane :-). If the shoe fits... 8-) 8-). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 21:20:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA02042 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:20:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA02035; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:20:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id NAA00198; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:49:55 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970913134955.25359@lemis.com> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:49:55 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Andrew Kenneth Milton Cc: "Jonathan M. Bresler" , jamie@itribe.net, aledm@routers.co.uk, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release References: <199709121602.JAA13216@hub.freebsd.org> <199709131352.NAA17432@mother.sneaker.net.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709131352.NAA17432@mother.sneaker.net.au>; from Andrew Kenneth Milton on Sat, Sep 13, 1997 at 01:52:33PM +0000 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, Sep 13, 1997 at 01:52:33PM +0000, Andrew Kenneth Milton wrote: > Anyone out there use jove? > > It might be possible to alter jove to suit the FreeBSD requirements > (whatever they might be) rather than re-invent several wheels. I thought we already had one solution in search of a problem. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 21:54:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA03701 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:54:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (ppp20.portal.net.au [202.12.71.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA03684 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:54:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA00501; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 14:20:52 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199709130450.OAA00501@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" cc: Joerg Wunsch , Greg Lehey , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Floppy Driver Problem Solved :^> In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:23:39 MST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 14:20:51 +0930 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I think I will develop a floppy drive that uses a scsi interface! I have a DEC RX23-AA and matching SCSI interface adapter, should you be interested. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 22:03:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA04208 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:03:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (ppp20.portal.net.au [202.12.71.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA04179; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:02:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA00675; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 14:30:52 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199709130500.OAA00675@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Ollivier Robert cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-bugs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:37:28 +0200." <19970912233728.62622@keltia.freenix.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 14:30:50 +0930 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > According to Mike Smith: > > ie. it exits immediately. I tried various assortments of parameters > > (eg. network and native order on the port, NULL, "tcp", "udp", etc for > > the protocol). 8( > > getservbyport(3) expects the port to be in network order and using > > if (getservbyport (htons(23), NULL) == NULL) { This contradicts the documentation, which claims that the (port) argument is an int. It should be htonl(). See my other posting on this. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 22:29:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA05578 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:29:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hfnet.sinai.org (root@hfnet.sinai.org [199.3.182.22]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA05573 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:29:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: by hfnet.sinai.org id m0x9kgY-0000CtC (Debian /\oo/\ Smail3.1.29.1 #29.37); Sat, 13 Sep 97 00:23 CDT Message-Id: From: bdh@hfnet.sinai.org (Brian D. Howard) Subject: Re: Cyrix (fwd) To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:23:58 -0500 (CDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25 PGP2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Forwarded message: > From dwhite@gdi.uoregon.edu Fri Sep 12 23:19:30 1997 > Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:24:28 -0700 (PDT) > From: Doug White > X-Sender: dwhite@localhost > Reply-To: Doug White > To: "Brian D. Howard" > Subject: Re: Cyrix > In-Reply-To: > Message-ID: > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > > On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Brian D. Howard wrote: > > Keeping this baggage... > > > > > Fatal trap 1: privileged instruction fault while in kernel mode. > > > > instruction pointer = 0x8:0xf01b99aa > > > > stack pointer = 0x10:0xefbfff38 > > > > frame pointer = 0x10:0xefbfff50 > > > > code segment = base 0x0, limit 0xfffff, type 0x1b > > > > = DPL 0, pres 1, def32 1, gran 1 > > > > processor eflags = resume, IOPL = 0 > > > > current process = 0 () > > > > interrupt mask = net tty bio > > > > panic: privileged instrction fault > > > > > > Copyright (c) 1992-1996 FreeBSD Inc. > > > Copyright (c) 1982, 1986, 1989, 1991, 1993 > > > The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. > > > > > > FreeBSD 2.2-970215-GAMMA #19: Thu Jul 24 20:01:33 PDT 1997 > > > dwhite@gdi.uoregon.edu:/usr/src/sys/compile/GDI > > >> > > I get the error message right here. This is on a TXpro motherboard. > > I never see anything like this > > | > > | > > \|/ > > >>>> Calibrating clock(s) relative to mc146818A clock ... i586 clock: 133272505 > > > Hz, i > > [..] > > Yeah, what I thought, the CPU probe is probably blowing up. Contact > hackers@freebsd.org and tell them what you've told me. They should be > able to add a probe for your chips. In the meantime, you're out of luck. > > Doug White | University of Oregon > Internet: dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu | Residence Networking Assistant > http://gladstone.uoregon.edu/~dwhite | Computer Science Major > Spam routed to /dev/null by Procmail | Death to Cyberpromo > > -- This is a cyrix 6x86L-PR200+ on a TXpro motherboard with a disk that boots just fine on the original 486dx2-66 that it was originally compiled on from the Wlnut Creek CD of 2.2.2 dated June 1997. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 22:35:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA05892 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:35:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gdi.uoregon.edu (cisco-ts6-line5.uoregon.edu [128.223.150.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA05886 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:35:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (dwhite@localhost) by gdi.uoregon.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA18033; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:35:06 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:35:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Doug White X-Sender: dwhite@localhost Reply-To: Doug White To: Brian Somers cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: nfs startup - perhaps it is a problem In-Reply-To: <199709082235.XAA05402@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Brian Somers wrote: > The problem was that mount couldn't resolve the host names from > fstab. This brings up two things: Oh that doesn't help ;-) > 1. Why is "mount -a -t nfs" redirected to /dev/null ? It seems > happy if there are no nfs filesystems in fstab, so wouldn't it be > better if we see any such errors ? > > 2. Should named be done in pass 1, or is it done this way because > your named config files may be on an nfs drive ;-/ > > The whole thing is worked around nicely by putting a nameserver in > resolv.conf or by reading /etc/hosts first and putting all your "close > friends" in there. I think 1. should be done at least. A good idea. I don't use NFS mounts so I don't know if mount gets noisy about mounting NFS. You'll have to ask hackers@freebsd.org about it. Your /etc/hosts should always be populated with necessary systems as a precaution and a speed improvement. Doug White | University of Oregon Internet: dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu | Residence Networking Assistant http://gladstone.uoregon.edu/~dwhite | Computer Science Major Spam routed to /dev/null by Procmail | Death to Cyberpromo From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 23:16:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA07947 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:16:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA07942 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:16:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id HAA05383; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 07:01:42 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199709130501.HAA05383@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? To: Tor.Egge@idi.ntnu.no (Tor Egge) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 07:01:42 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: dkelly@hiwaay.net, grog@lemis.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709130114.DAA01842@pat.idi.ntnu.no> from "Tor Egge" at Sep 13, 97 03:14:09 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > The V's were in the "Reading intelligently..." phase. > > I have similar experiences when iozone is running in the background. > MB is ASUS P65UP5. AHA2940 and AHA2940UW scsi controllers. Speaking of floppy problems and ASUS boards, I have had a board (for a PPro200) replaced from ASUS because it had a bad floppy controller. The problem appeared also in DOS or from the BIOS, and even when switching cables, floppy drive, or disks, so I really think it was the hardware. The symptom was that some sector started having corrupt data at some point, and till the end of the sector. I couldn't find any significant pattern (e.g. all zero, shifted data, etc.) in the rotten sectors. Perhaps it would help if people experiencing the problem try to 'dd' some file containing random data to a floppy, and check: - whether the problem repeats deterministically (same places etc); - if the problem is during read or write (using a reliable system to write/read the disk. - if the differences between the correct and the wrong data have some significant pattern such as the ones indicated above. This would help to identify the problem better. It takes some time. I spent several hours doing tests before returning my motherboard, to be sure that it was really a problem with the MB and not with anything else. Cheers Luigi From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 23:20:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA08244 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:20:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA08237 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:20:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA17861 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:20:41 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id IAA20144; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:09:39 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970913080939.WU46166@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:09:39 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: <199709122056.NAA24445@usr08.primenet.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from K.J.Koster on Sep 12, 1997 22:33:27 +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As K.J.Koster wrote: > I agree with you that busy-looping on a device is not the correct way to > go about I/O, and I understand why FreeBSD does not busy-loop. You probably don't understand very much about FDCs then, sorry. Look into the docs for the NE765, look into the code. *Then* start to discuss. Don't discuss things you don't understand. There are a lot of busy loops in the FreeBSD fdc driver, and you can send a lovely ``thanks!'' letter to some stupid IBM engineer for dropping the READY line from the floppy bus, apparently for the sake of being able to use this twist-some-wires-for-drive-A hack. So now the FDC always assumes the drive is ready (its READY pin hardwired to + 5 V), and your only chance to detect that there's actually no floppy responding at all is busy-loop in a count-limited loop. Whatever operating system you're using. (FreeBSD 1 had a lot of problems with this, which were manifest in a lousy recovery behaviour when you tried to access a floppy drive with no medium inserted.) Actual data transfer is done using motherboard DMA. Again, this is the same for all operating systems, since it's a hardware decision. (Well, you could in theory use PIO mode as well, but nobody in his right mind does on a PC, not even the BIOS. I did it in my CP/M BIOS, since i didn't get the i8080-biased DMA working with my Z80 DMAC. It doesn't make any difference regarding transfer error handling however.) > I have cheap hardware, and for that I am happy to pay the performance > penalty, as I do every day. I'm quite happy to pay the performance penalty > for a busy-looping floppy driver, if that means I can write floppies > without having to worry whether I can read the disk later or not. Both is entirely unrelated. If your cheap hardware is crap, no driver of the world can do much about it. The only decision of the driver is the strategy how to retry erroneous transmissions. Things that are wrong on the floppy cannot be fixed by any driver. Again, go and read the FDC documentation before making too much assumptions. These beasts are horribly stupid, and all you get is either a success or a failure. There's nothing you could `tune' in this case. FIFOs can fix `DMA overrun' conditions, but that would be transparent to the user. (We are retrying DMA overruns forever, since the AHA154x controllers tend to hog the bus for too long, causing this error frequently. They aren't even logged at all. The AHA154x is the only known bus hog that was causing excessive DMA overruns in the fdc driver. DMA overruns never mean data loss since they can be retried without harm. Only performance drops drastically in this case.) What can be affected by the driver is transfer speed. But that's another matter. The FreeBSD driver is reasonably good at sequential transfers (better than all other Unixes, and at least as good as the average BIOS driver), but probably lousy at random seek IO. > FreeBSD has special options for people with broken keyboard resets, > broken APM and broken PCMCIA cards. Why not add another one for unfifo'd > floppy controllers? The driver currently only knows unfifo'd floppy controllers. I've been using one myself for years. > PS. I just realized I have written my demo code for my job applications > using mtools... Oops :) You guys are giving me a headache. What do you wanna say with this? Whether you stack tar, cpio, dump, a filesystem, or mtools over the floppy driver doesn't matter. If the driver is buggy, it's still all going through the driver. If it isn't, the application doesn't matter. (Ok, the msdosfs code is known to get lousy performance on floppies, but that's the only difference.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 23:21:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA08327 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:21:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA08298 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:21:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA17865 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:20:58 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id IAA20177; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:13:35 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970913081334.AH49772@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:13:34 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers) Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: <19970912101014.37786@lemis.com> <19970912154815.HN39525@uriah.heep.sax.de> <19970913084213.18186@lemis.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <19970913084213.18186@lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Sep 13, 1997 08:42:13 +0930 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Greg Lehey wrote: > > Oh, Greg is going to take over maintenance of the FDC driver! > > Congratulations! :-) > > Look carefully. I'm just gathering information: Pity. Your way of gathering information without even knowing the basics probably won't help much then. (You were gathering information about suspected FreeBSD driver problems, when there was somebody telling you that he did have problems with the BIOS accessing the drive. You didn't even notice the difference.) > > There's exactly one unexplained record open where 1 - 3 does fit, ... > There are more now. I still only have seen one. > > Good luck for fixing these errors... > > Does this mean you don't want to maintain the driver any more? You seemed to know more than me on it. > I know that this is a pain. Nobody says it isn't. But it doesn't > help to turn a blind eye to possible driver problems and blame them on > the medium. An FDC-reported ``CRC error in data field'' is just what the FDC is telling me. I don't see why you're blaming the driver for being blind-eyed if it just believes what the FDC is telling. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 23:22:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA08470 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:22:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fly.HiWAAY.net (root@fly.HiWAAY.net [208.147.154.56]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA08465 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:22:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nospam.hiwaay.net (max4-90.HiWAAY.net [208.147.145.90]) by fly.HiWAAY.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id BAA17435; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 01:22:35 -0500 (CDT) Received: from nospam.hiwaay.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nospam.hiwaay.net (8.8.7/8.8.4) with ESMTP id BAA18777; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 01:22:33 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199709130622.BAA18777@nospam.hiwaay.net> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Tor Egge cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: dkelly@hiwaay.net Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-reply-to: Message from Tor Egge of "Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:14:28 +0200." <199709130114.DAA01842@pat.idi.ntnu.no> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 01:22:32 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Tor Egg writes: > > David Kelly writes: > > So this time I kicked off bonnie and got > > > > 51 pci irq9 (Adaptec 2940) > > 21 fdc0 irq6 > > blks 5245 (sd0, "SEAGATE ST32550N 0021") > > > > Processing EVEVEVEEVEVVVVEVVVVVEVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV done. > > > > The V's were in the "Reading intelligently..." phase. > > I have similar experiences when iozone is running in the background. > MB is ASUS P65UP5. AHA2940 and AHA2940UW scsi controllers. And my MB is an Asus P6NP5, and early 2940. Changed out floppies (disk, not drive) and got essentially the same results. The problem seems to be in the writing. A disk formatted with errors reported verifies mostly the same errors. Keep the SCSI traffic down and there are no errors writing. > Using fdformat gives the following output: > > Format 1440K floppy `/dev/rfd0.1440'? (y/n): y > Processing VVVVVEVVVVVVEVVVVVVVEEVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV done. > > with errors as: > > fd0c: hard error reading fsbn 420 of 414-431 (ST0 44 ST1 4 ST2 0 cyl 11 hd 1 sec 7) > > Aborting iozone and running fdformat -v (only verify) reproduces the > same errors, indicating that bad contents was written to some of the > sector headers on the disk during the format operation. Yup, same here. > with no scsi bus traffic, I was able to run fdformat 10 times in a row > without encountering any errors. Me too. > Disabling interrupts in fd_cmd and fd_read_status did not help. This > indicates that `busy waiting' will not help. > > It looks very much like a DMA conflict or starvation. These are possibly interesting components in my kernel config: options AHC_TAGENABLE options AHC_SCBPAGING_ENABLE options AHC_ALLOW_MEMIO options "AUTO_EOI_1" #options "AUTO_EOI_2" Time to try turning things on and off now that a reliable way to randomly break the floppy has been discovered. A Gateway Pentium 133 at work with a 2940AU (the 7860 model) with lower performance disk drives couldn't be coaxed to fail at all this afternoon. Any suggestions toward identifying FDC's with FIFO's? Preferably without taking something apart? -- David Kelly N4HHE, dkelly@hiwaay.net ===================================================================== The human mind ordinarily operates at only ten percent of its capacity -- the rest is overhead for the operating system. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Sep 12 23:54:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA09868 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:54:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from trinity.radio-do.de (trinity.Radio-do.de [193.101.164.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA09862 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:54:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from fn@localhost) by trinity.radio-do.de (8.8.7/8.8.5/RADIO-1.1) id IAA06467; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:53:24 +0200 (CEST) To: Doug White Cc: Brian Somers , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: nfs startup - perhaps it is a problem References: From: Frank Nobis Date: 13 Sep 1997 08:53:22 +0200 In-Reply-To: Doug White's message of Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:35:05 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Lines: 47 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.4.37/XEmacs 19.15 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Doug White writes: > On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Brian Somers wrote: > > > The problem was that mount couldn't resolve the host names from > > fstab. This brings up two things: > > Oh that doesn't help ;-) > > > 1. Why is "mount -a -t nfs" redirected to /dev/null ? It seems > > happy if there are no nfs filesystems in fstab, so wouldn't it be > > better if we see any such errors ? > > > > 2. Should named be done in pass 1, or is it done this way because > > your named config files may be on an nfs drive ;-/ > > > > The whole thing is worked around nicely by putting a nameserver in > > resolv.conf or by reading /etc/hosts first and putting all your "close > > friends" in there. I think 1. should be done at least. > The order of host.conf should not matter for a client machine, which is not the primary nameserver for a particular domain. I have “bind“ and than “hosts“ in my host.conf. So I will ask the nameserver running on an other machine Whenn that fails, I try the backup in hosts. But all that doesn“t prevent one from a long,long wait nfs-mounting some remote filesystem, when the fileserver is not responding. I have changed the nfs call to that: echo -n 'mounting remote nfs filesystems' mount -a -t nfs -o bg echo "." In my setup there are at least three hosts which share their local partitions to each other. It is not unlikely that one of them is down, when I reboot. With the background option the mount doesn“t hang the system. I know that setups exists, where it makes no sense to continue on nfs mount failure, but that doesn“t count for me. Just my 2p. -- Frank Nobis Email: PGP AVAILABLE Landgrafenstr. 130 dg3dcn http://www.radio-do.de/~fn/ 44139 Dortmund Powered by FreeBSD Fax: +49 231 7213816 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 00:27:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA12915 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:27:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA12900 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:26:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id QAA15282; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 16:56:35 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970913165635.17336@lemis.com> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 16:56:35 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Joerg Wunsch Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: <19970912101014.37786@lemis.com> <19970912154815.HN39525@uriah.heep.sax.de> <19970913084213.18186@lemis.com> <19970913081334.AH49772@uriah.heep.sax.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <19970913081334.AH49772@uriah.heep.sax.de>; from J Wunsch on Sat, Sep 13, 1997 at 08:13:34AM +0200 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, Sep 13, 1997 at 08:13:34AM +0200, J Wunsch wrote: > As Greg Lehey wrote: > >> I know that this is a pain. Nobody says it isn't. But it doesn't >> help to turn a blind eye to possible driver problems and blame them on >> the medium. > > An FDC-reported ``CRC error in data field'' is just what the FDC is > telling me. I don't see why you're blaming the driver for being > blind-eyed if it just believes what the FDC is telling. It looks like it, doesn't it? But how does that explain why people can read some things on one machine when it's running Linux, and not on the same machine when it's running FreeBSD? Remember that floppies contain a lot of analogue electronics (well, a large proportion of the electronics are analogue :-). And we all know that floppy drives are a piece of shit. I think that any driver that believes the drive is being blind-eyed. JOOI, how many times do you retry? Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 00:30:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA13486 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:30:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA13455 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:30:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id QAA15297; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 16:59:33 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970913165932.56962@lemis.com> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 16:59:32 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Luigi Rizzo Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: <199709130114.DAA01842@pat.idi.ntnu.no> <199709130501.HAA05383@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709130501.HAA05383@labinfo.iet.unipi.it>; from Luigi Rizzo on Sat, Sep 13, 1997 at 07:01:42AM +0200 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, Sep 13, 1997 at 07:01:42AM +0200, Luigi Rizzo wrote: >>> The V's were in the "Reading intelligently..." phase. >> >> I have similar experiences when iozone is running in the background. >> MB is ASUS P65UP5. AHA2940 and AHA2940UW scsi controllers. > > Speaking of floppy problems and ASUS boards, I have had a board (for a > PPro200) replaced from ASUS because it had a bad floppy controller. The > problem appeared also in DOS or from the BIOS, and even when switching > cables, floppy drive, or disks, so I really think it was the hardware. Yes, I've also seen a remarkable number of boards where the floppy driver was defective. I don't understand it. You'd think that the electronics were simple enough to be made reliably. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 00:30:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA13603 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:30:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www2.shoppersnet.com (shoppersnet.com [204.156.152.112]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA13592 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:30:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from hlew@localhost) by www2.shoppersnet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA20089; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:30:40 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:30:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Howard Lew To: "Brian D. Howard" cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Cyrix (fwd) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 13 Sep 1997, Brian D. Howard wrote: > Forwarded message: > > From dwhite@gdi.uoregon.edu Fri Sep 12 23:19:30 1997 > > Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:24:28 -0700 (PDT) > > From: Doug White > > X-Sender: dwhite@localhost > > Reply-To: Doug White > > To: "Brian D. Howard" > > Subject: Re: Cyrix > > In-Reply-To: > > Message-ID: > > MIME-Version: 1.0 > > Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > > > > On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Brian D. Howard wrote: > > > > Keeping this baggage... > > > > > > > Fatal trap 1: privileged instruction fault while in kernel mode. > > > > > instruction pointer = 0x8:0xf01b99aa > > > > > stack pointer = 0x10:0xefbfff38 > > > > > frame pointer = 0x10:0xefbfff50 > > > > > code segment = base 0x0, limit 0xfffff, type 0x1b > > > > > = DPL 0, pres 1, def32 1, gran 1 > > > > > processor eflags = resume, IOPL = 0 > > > > > current process = 0 () > > > > > interrupt mask = net tty bio > > > > > panic: privileged instrction fault > > > > > > > > Copyright (c) 1992-1996 FreeBSD Inc. > > > > Copyright (c) 1982, 1986, 1989, 1991, 1993 > > > > The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. > > > > > > > > FreeBSD 2.2-970215-GAMMA #19: Thu Jul 24 20:01:33 PDT 1997 > > > > dwhite@gdi.uoregon.edu:/usr/src/sys/compile/GDI > > > >> > > > I get the error message right here. This is on a TXpro motherboard. > > > I never see anything like this > > > | > > > | > > > \|/ > > > >>>> Calibrating clock(s) relative to mc146818A clock ... i586 clock: 133272505 > > > > Hz, i > > > > [..] > > > > Yeah, what I thought, the CPU probe is probably blowing up. Contact > > hackers@freebsd.org and tell them what you've told me. They should be > > able to add a probe for your chips. In the meantime, you're out of luck. > > > > Doug White | University of Oregon > > Internet: dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu | Residence Networking Assistant > > http://gladstone.uoregon.edu/~dwhite | Computer Science Major > > Spam routed to /dev/null by Procmail | Death to Cyberpromo > > > > > > > -- > > This is a cyrix 6x86L-PR200+ on a TXpro motherboard with a disk that > boots just fine on the original 486dx2-66 that it was originally > compiled on from the Wlnut Creek CD of 2.2.2 dated June 1997. > The TX pro motherboard will turn on the extra control bits so that even a Cyrix 6x86/L will appear as a Pentium... In other words, you need the i586 cpu settings or it will not work. You can verify this by starting up comptest in DOS and instead of saying it is a 486 (as it usually does), it will say Pentium. Solution: Bootup with the generic kernel and recompile with i586 settings or leave the 486, 586, and 686 settings all in the kernel. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 00:35:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA14063 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:35:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA14045; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:35:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <52845(5)>; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:34:40 PDT Received: from localhost by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177486>; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:34:07 -0700 To: Mike Smith cc: Ollivier Robert , hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 97 22:00:50 PDT." <199709130500.OAA00675@word.smith.net.au> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:33:57 PDT From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <97Sep13.003407pdt.177486@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Mike Smith wrote: >This contradicts the documentation, which claims that the (port) >argument is an int. Presumably because of historical argument promotion. Does anyone actually pass shorts as shorts? >It should be htonl(). Nope. Port numbers are 16 bits. Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 01:26:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA22318 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 01:26:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (ppp20.portal.net.au [202.12.71.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA22273; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 01:25:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA01212; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 17:51:56 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199709130821.RAA01212@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Bill Fenner cc: Mike Smith , Ollivier Robert , hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:33:57 PDT." <97Sep13.003407pdt.177486@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 17:51:55 +0930 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Mike Smith wrote: > >This contradicts the documentation, which claims that the (port) > >argument is an int. > > Presumably because of historical argument promotion. Does anyone > actually pass shorts as shorts? Good question. Probably not, but having the argument typed correctly would help in the age of ANSI compilers. > >It should be htonl(). > > Nope. Port numbers are 16 bits. Then this counts as a PR against the manpage? mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 02:17:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA02885 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 02:17:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from awfulhak.demon.co.uk (awfulhak.demon.co.uk [158.152.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA02854 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 02:17:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lan.awfulhak.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by awfulhak.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA04290 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:16:39 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199709130916.KAA04290@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: rc & rc.conf Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:16:39 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk This is a disaster waiting to happen: /etc/rc.conf: [.....] inetd_enable="YES" # Run the network daemon displatcher (or NO). [.....] cron_enable="YES" # Run the periodic job daemon. [.....] /etc/rc: [.....] if [ "X${inetd_enable}" = X"YES" ]; then echo -n ' inetd'; inetd ${inetd_flags} fi if [ "X${cron_enable}" = X"YES" ]; then echo -n ' cron'; cron fi [.....] I suggest the following (and will commit it in the next few hours if nobody objects): Index: rc =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/etc/rc,v retrieving revision 1.135 diff -c -r1.135 rc *** rc 1997/08/17 15:02:34 1.135 --- rc 1997/09/13 09:15:40 *************** *** 218,228 **** # Now start up miscellaneous daemons that don't belong anywhere else # echo -n starting standard daemons: ! if [ "X${inetd_enable}" = X"YES" ]; then echo -n ' inetd'; inetd ${inetd_flags} fi ! if [ "X${cron_enable}" = X"YES" ]; then echo -n ' cron'; cron fi --- 218,228 ---- # Now start up miscellaneous daemons that don't belong anywhere else # echo -n starting standard daemons: ! if [ "X${inetd_enable}" != X"NO" ]; then echo -n ' inetd'; inetd ${inetd_flags} fi ! if [ "X${cron_enable}" != X"NO" ]; then echo -n ' cron'; cron fi -- Brian , Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 02:28:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA05247 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 02:28:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from iafnl.es.iaf.nl (uucp@iafnl.es.iaf.nl [195.108.17.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id CAA05228 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 02:28:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: by iafnl.es.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA03455 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org); Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:29:05 +0200 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.8.5/8.6.12) id LAA00567 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:12:13 +0200 (MET DST) From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199709130912.LAA00567@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: FreeBSD on non-PCI based Alpha machines? To: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers list) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:12:13 +0200 (MET DST) X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem, The Netherlands X-Pgp-Info: PGP public key at 'finger wilko@freefall.freebsd.org' X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [ reposted on -hackers, -platforms gave no response? ] Having just obtained a Jensen Alpha mainboard (the first AlphaPC aka DEC2000/300 aka AXP150) which is EISA based I wonder if the potential port of FreeBSD will support non-PCI AXP boards. There are quite a number of PCI-mixed-with-EISA Alpha machines so there might be some interest. It seems FreeBSD can handle the old 'Bird' machines (Sandpiper, Flamingo) which are all Turbochannel boxes. TC is not too interesting to me of course ;-) The Jensen has the Intel EBC/ISP EISA chipset, on which FreeBSD runs quite happily with a Intel CPU. Standard SCSI controller is a Adaptec 1742A, the video is a Compaq Qvision which at least in text mode works with FreeBSD-Intel. There are some oddities with the Jensen design however, I'll just have to read the 5" stack of docs I got with it. Wilko [ In case you're wondering why I got the Jensen: it was a swap for a laserprinter, a laserprinter that cost me the equivalent of US$ 12 So the price was unbeatable, especially it even came with the odd-ball Compaq Qvision VGA board the Jensen is blessed (ugh) with ] _ ____________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl http://www.tcja.nl/~wilko |/|/ / / /( (_) Arnhem, The Netherlands - Do, or do not. There is no 'try' ----------------------------------------------------------------------Yoda From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 02:58:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA12510 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 02:58:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lestat.nas.nasa.gov (lestat.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.50.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA12499 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 02:58:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lestat.nas.nasa.gov (8.8.6/8.6.12) with SMTP id CAA15655; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 02:51:14 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709130951.CAA15655@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> X-Authentication-Warning: lestat.nas.nasa.gov: localhost [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Wilko Bulte Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers list) Subject: Re: FreeBSD on non-PCI based Alpha machines? Reply-To: Jason Thorpe From: Jason Thorpe Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 02:51:12 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:12:13 +0200 (MET DST) Wilko Bulte wrote: > There are quite a number of PCI-mixed-with-EISA Alpha machines so there > might be some interest. It seems FreeBSD can handle the old 'Bird' > machines (Sandpiper, Flamingo) which are all Turbochannel boxes. TC is > not too interesting to me of course ;-) FreeBSD for Alpha works? When did that happen? (Serious question :-) The last I heard, the FreeBSD-for-Alpha folks were mainly interested in the PCI Alphas. Now, *NetBSD* does support the TurboChannel systems, quite a number of the PCI systems (including ones with EISA), and the TurboLaser systems (e.g. the AlphaServer 8200 and 8400 - the machines that AltaVista runs on...) > The Jensen has the Intel EBC/ISP EISA chipset, on which FreeBSD > runs quite happily with a Intel CPU. Standard SCSI controller is > a Adaptec 1742A, the video is a Compaq Qvision which at least > in text mode works with FreeBSD-Intel. > > There are some oddities with the Jensen design however, I'll > just have to read the 5" stack of docs I got with it. ...The fact that FreeBSD works with PCs that have this EISA chipset doesn't mean it will be easy to make the Jensen work. Bus access on the Alpha works much differently than it does on the PC. Yes, NetBSD does run on the "mixed PCI and EISA systems". One such system is the KN20AA. Here is from my AlphaStation 500 5/500: 2038584+915536 [85+99840+57185] Entering netbsd at 0xfffffc0000300000... Copyright (c) 1982, 1986, 1989, 1991, 1993 The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. NetBSD 1.2G (GENERIC) #12: Sat Sep 13 00:31:33 PDT 1997 thorpej@mother.nas.nasa.gov:/space2/thorpej/src/sys/arch/alpha/compile/GENERIC AlphaStation 500 or 600 (KN20AA), 500MHz 8192 byte page size, 1 processor. real mem = 268435456 (2252800 reserved for PROM, 266182656 used by NetBSD) avail mem = 227098624 using 3249 buffers containing 26615808 bytes of memory mainbus0 (root) cpu0 at mainbus0: ID 0 (primary), 21164A (reserved minor type) cia0 at mainbus0 pci0 at cia0 bus 0 de0 at pci0 dev 6 function 0 at kn20aa irq 13 de0: DEC 21040 [10Mb/s] pass 2.6 de0: address 00:00:f8:25:56:c5 isp0 at pci0 dev 9 function 0 isp0: Board Revision 1020, ROM F/W Revision 5.1 isp0: interrupting at kn20aa irq 12 scsibus0 at isp0: 16 targets sd0 at scsibus0 targ 0 lun 0: SCSI2 0/direct fixed sd0: 4091MB, 3708 cyl, 20 head, 113 sec, 512 bytes/sect x 8380080 sectors cd0 at scsibus0 targ 4 lun 0: SCSI2 5/cdrom removable pceb0 at pci0 dev 10 function 0: Intel 82375EB PCI-EISA Bridge (rev. 0x15) eisa0 at pceb0 isa0 at pceb0 com0 at isa0 port 0x3f8-0x3ff irq 4: ns16550a, working fifo com0: console com1 at isa0 port 0x2f8-0x2ff irq 3: ns16550a, working fifo lpt0 at isa0 port 0x3bc-0x3bf irq 7 pcppi0 at isa0 port 0x60-0x64 pcprobe: reset error 1 pckbd0 at pcppi0 mcclock0 at isa0 port 0x70-0x71: mc146818 or compatible Note the way EISA is set up on this system - it's bridged off the PCI. This is simmilar to a standard PCI-ISA bridge. On the PCI Alphas, all bus access goes through the PCI bus. On the Jensen, however, this is not the case. I forget the details (I'll have to dig out my Jensen documentation), but bus access on these beasts is a trick. Esp. considering that they have 2 logical ISA busses (the ISA bus, and an I/O chip which presents a separate ISA space, which has the serial ports, parallel port, etc. on it... as I recall). Anyhow, if you're interested in getting your Jensen supported by NetBSD, please drop me a private note. Jason R. Thorpe thorpej@nas.nasa.gov NASA Ames Research Center Home: +1 408 866 1912 NAS: M/S 258-6 Work: +1 415 604 0935 Moffett Field, CA 94035 Pager: +1 415 428 6939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 02:58:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA12590 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 02:58:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gateway.senet.com.au (root@gateway.senet.com.au [203.11.90.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA12521 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 02:58:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from holly.rd.net (root@c3-p50.senet.com.au [203.56.237.179]) by gateway.senet.com.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA27598 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 19:28:09 +0930 Received: from holly (darius@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by holly.rd.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA00642 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 19:28:10 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199709130958.TAA00642@holly.rd.net> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Floppy Driver Problem Solved :^> In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:23:39 MST." Reply-to: doconnor@ist.flinders.edu.au Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 19:28:07 +0930 From: "Daniel J. O'Connor" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I think I will develop a floppy drive that uses a scsi interface! Its been done :) A friend of mine has one(Its out of a '030 powered small mainframe type thing... Hmm, excuse my vagueness) But heck, if you want to pay postage I;m sure we could mail it to you =) Seeya Darius ~~~~~~ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 03:18:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA18074 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:18:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from terror.hungry.com (fn@terror.hungry.com [169.131.1.215]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA18047 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:18:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from fn@localhost) by terror.hungry.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA15655; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:18:32 -0700 (PDT) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release In-reply-to: <199709121611.MAA18193@gatekeeper.itribe.net> From: Faried Nawaz Date: 13 Sep 1997 03:18:31 -0700 Message-ID: Lines: 5 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk jamie@itribe.net (Jamie Bowden) writes: Hoe the hell is a newbie supposed to know emacs key bindings? Pico uses some of the same bindings. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 03:23:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA19072 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:23:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA19052 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:22:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id FAA04639; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 05:21:50 -0500 (CDT) Received: from sjx-ca29-22.ix.netcom.com(204.31.235.150) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma004635; Sat Sep 13 05:21:38 1997 Received: (from asami@localhost) by blimp.mimi.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) id DAA11509; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:21:33 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:21:33 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709131021.DAA11509@blimp.mimi.com> To: jamie@itribe.net CC: aledm@routers.co.uk, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: <199709121611.MAA18193@gatekeeper.itribe.net> (message from Jamie Bowden on Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:19:34 -0400 (EDT)) Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release From: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk * From: Jamie Bowden * And my point is: * * Hoe the hell is a newbie supposed to know emacs key bindings? They are That is irrelevant. If we are going to recommend ee, we can at least let them learn something useful, like emacs key bindings (which can be used in emacs, emacs-clones, lots of shells, pretty much anything from GNU that uses readline, netscape, etc...). Satoshi From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 03:35:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA23705 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:35:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pat.idi.ntnu.no (0@pat.idi.ntnu.no [129.241.103.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA23677 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:35:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from idt.unit.no (tegge@presis.idi.ntnu.no [129.241.111.173]) by pat.idi.ntnu.no (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id MAA13634; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:35:28 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199709131035.MAA13634@pat.idi.ntnu.no> To: dkelly@hiwaay.net Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Sat, 13 Sep 1997 01:22:32 -0500" References: <199709130622.BAA18777@nospam.hiwaay.net> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.70 on Emacs 19.34.1 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:35:27 +0000 From: Tor Egge Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > And my MB is an Asus P6NP5, and early 2940. Changed out floppies (disk, > not drive) and got essentially the same results. The problem seems to > be in the writing. A disk formatted with errors reported verifies mostly > the same errors. I've played a little with BIOS configuration: `Load BIOS defaults' ==> no errors `Load setup defaults' ==> errors > These are possibly interesting components in my kernel config: > > options AHC_TAGENABLE > options AHC_SCBPAGING_ENABLE > options AHC_ALLOW_MEMIO I use the same options. - Tor Egge From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 03:54:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA28620 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:54:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id DAA28485 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:54:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id LAA05863; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:39:04 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199709130939.LAA05863@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? To: Tor.Egge@idi.ntnu.no (Tor Egge) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:39:03 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: dkelly@hiwaay.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709131035.MAA13634@pat.idi.ntnu.no> from "Tor Egge" at Sep 13, 97 10:35:08 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > not drive) and got essentially the same results. The problem seems to > > be in the writing. A disk formatted with errors reported verifies mostly > > the same errors. > > I've played a little with BIOS configuration: > > `Load BIOS defaults' ==> no errors > `Load setup defaults' ==> errors so you should see errors independently of the OS ? Luigi From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 03:57:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA29010 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:57:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from awfulhak.demon.co.uk (awfulhak.demon.co.uk [158.152.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA29003 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:57:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lan.awfulhak.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by awfulhak.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA04677; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:06:53 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199709131006.LAA04677@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Thomas David Rivers cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: I'm back!! In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 12 Sep 1997 08:15:58 EDT." <199709121215.IAA04931@lakes.dignus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:06:53 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > So, I've, at last; gotten things working better with my ISP and > removed that darned non-domainized UUCP address everyone has > "enjoyed" these past few years! (The one that looked like > ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com) Horray ! Look, a reply that won't bounce (I hope). > - Thanks - > - Dave Rivers - -- Brian , Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 03:57:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA29034 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:57:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pat.idi.ntnu.no (0@pat.idi.ntnu.no [129.241.103.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA29015 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 03:57:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from idt.unit.no (tegge@presis.idi.ntnu.no [129.241.111.173]) by pat.idi.ntnu.no (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id MAA13974; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:57:07 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199709131057.MAA13974@pat.idi.ntnu.no> To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it Cc: dkelly@hiwaay.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:39:03 +0200 (MET DST)" References: <199709130939.LAA05863@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.70 on Emacs 19.34.1 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:57:06 +0000 From: Tor Egge Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I've played a little with BIOS configuration: > > > > `Load BIOS defaults' ==> no errors > > `Load setup defaults' ==> errors > > so you should see errors independently of the OS ? This was only tested under FreeBSD. - Tor Egge From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 04:06:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA29338 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 04:06:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Octopussy.MI.Uni-Koeln.DE (Octopussy.MI.Uni-Koeln.DE [134.95.166.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id EAA29333 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 04:06:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from x14.mi.uni-koeln.de ([134.95.219.124]) by Octopussy.MI.Uni-Koeln.DE with SMTP id AA03456 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for ); Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:06:08 +0200 Received: (from se@localhost) by x14.mi.uni-koeln.de (8.8.7/8.6.9) id NAA00709; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:05:47 +0200 (CEST) X-Face: " Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:05:46 +0200 From: Stefan Esser To: jgrosch@superior.mooseriver.com Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: NCR 53c710 References: <19970912174203.24817@mooseriver.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.74 In-Reply-To: <19970912174203.24817@mooseriver.com>; from Josef Grosch on Fri, Sep 12, 1997 at 05:42:03PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sep 12, Josef Grosch wrote: > I have recently been give an HP EISA SCSI card. This card does fast-wide > differential. My main chip on this is a NCR 53c710. Can anyone point me to > the specs for this? I can't seem to find the specs on NCR's web page. No, the 53c710 isn't fast *wide* differential, for sure ... That would be the 53c720 ... The 53c7xx series is very similar to the 53c8xx, except for the generic bus interface on the 7xx versus the special PCI interface of the 8xx series. I seem to remember, that the 710 already offered the INTFLY instruction and other commands, that are required to have the SCSI chip autonomously operate on a request queue, as all 8xx chips can. The 53c700 was the last chip that lacked that feature, AFAIK. You could try building a driver for the 53c710/720 (and the new Ultra SCSI chips of the 7xx family) by modifying the NCR PCI SCSI driver. Most of the changes should be confined to the init code ... Some Information about the 710 should be available from the FTP server maintained by Symbios (FTP.Symbios.Com). I had good luck asking for manuals by sending mail to the address mentioned on the Symbios web pages. Regards, STefan From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 04:20:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA29826 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 04:20:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from awfulhak.demon.co.uk (awfulhak.demon.co.uk [158.152.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA29818 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 04:20:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lan.awfulhak.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by awfulhak.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA05699 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:20:39 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199709131120.MAA05699@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: de0: system error: master abort Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:20:38 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I haven't looked into this myself, but it's annoying me enough (dmesg is useless) to ask if anyone else is seeing it. I get literally millions of these *all* the time. I've commented out the error locally, but I thought I might ask if anyone added this feature on purpose. -- Brian , Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 04:25:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA00159 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 04:25:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id EAA00151 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 04:25:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id NAA20401 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:25:46 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id NAA20858; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:06:45 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970913130645.GS12767@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:06:45 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: <199709130622.BAA18777@nospam.hiwaay.net> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709130622.BAA18777@nospam.hiwaay.net>; from dkelly@HiWAAY.net on Sep 13, 1997 01:22:32 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As dkelly@HiWAAY.net wrote: > And my MB is an Asus P6NP5, and early 2940. Changed out floppies (disk, > not drive) and got essentially the same results. The problem seems to > be in the writing. A disk formatted with errors reported verifies mostly > the same errors. > > Keep the SCSI traffic down and there are no errors writing. Perhaps you guys have a lousy power supply (or a broken FDC)? I've just tried it, and apart from some slowdown in the floppy formatting part (an obvious sign that the driver loses floppy revolutions when reading), no errors so far. This is with both of my disks running iozone simultaneously. That's an ASUS P55T2P4 (i think it's using the SMC FDC+serial+ parallel chip) and two NRC 53c810's. I would indeed suspect the power supply, or some ground loop problem. The disk seek operations could easily cause some current jumps on the power lines. Try powering the disk drives from another supply if you can. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 05:18:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA01988 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 05:18:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from korin.warman.org.pl (korin.warman.org.pl [148.81.160.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA01981 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 05:17:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (abial@localhost) by korin.warman.org.pl (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA25550 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 14:19:42 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 14:19:42 +0200 (CEST) From: Andrzej Bialecki To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: SGML authoring tools Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi! What do you guys use to edit our sgml-based documentation? (e.g. FAQ and handbook). I'd like to translate some of them into Polish, but the perspective of remembering all the xrefs I used throughout the editing slightly scares me... :-) Andrzej Bialecki ---------------------+--------------------------------------------------------- abial@warman.org.pl | if(halt_per_mth > 0) { fetch("http://www.freebsd.org") } Research & Academic | "Be open-minded, but don't let your brains to fall out." Network in Poland | All of the above (and more) is just my personal opinion. ---------------------+--------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 06:35:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA04186 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 06:35:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pat.idi.ntnu.no (0@pat.idi.ntnu.no [129.241.103.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA04176 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 06:35:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from idt.unit.no (tegge@presis.idi.ntnu.no [129.241.111.173]) by pat.idi.ntnu.no (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id PAA16374; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 15:35:43 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199709131335.PAA16374@pat.idi.ntnu.no> To: Tor.Egge@idi.ntnu.no Cc: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, dkelly@hiwaay.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:57:06 +0000" References: <199709131057.MAA13974@pat.idi.ntnu.no> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.70 on Emacs 19.34.1 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:35:43 +0000 From: Tor Egge Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > I've played a little with BIOS configuration: > > > > > > `Load BIOS defaults' ==> no errors > > > `Load setup defaults' ==> errors > > > > so you should see errors independently of the OS ? > > This was only tested under FreeBSD. `Load setup defaults', then disabling `Passive Release' under the PNP/PCI menu in the BIOS configuration ==> no errors. - Tor Egge From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 07:00:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA05181 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 07:00:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA05174 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 07:00:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.7/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA14876; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 07:00:10 -0700 (PDT) To: Andrzej Bialecki cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: SGML authoring tools In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 13 Sep 1997 14:19:42 +0200." Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 07:00:10 -0700 Message-ID: <14872.874159210@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > What do you guys use to edit our sgml-based documentation? (e.g. FAQ and I don't know about the others, but I just use emacs. ;) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 07:13:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA05892 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 07:13:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pat.idi.ntnu.no (0@pat.idi.ntnu.no [129.241.103.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA05887 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 07:12:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from idt.unit.no (tegge@presis.idi.ntnu.no [129.241.111.173]) by pat.idi.ntnu.no (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id QAA17101; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 16:12:56 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199709131412.QAA17101@pat.idi.ntnu.no> To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, j@uriah.heep.sax.de Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:06:45 +0200" References: <19970913130645.GS12767@uriah.heep.sax.de> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.70 on Emacs 19.34.1 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 14:12:56 +0000 From: Tor Egge Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > As dkelly@HiWAAY.net wrote: > > > And my MB is an Asus P6NP5, and early 2940. Changed out floppies (disk, > > not drive) and got essentially the same results. The problem seems to > > be in the writing. A disk formatted with errors reported verifies mostly > > the same errors. > > > > Keep the SCSI traffic down and there are no errors writing. > > Perhaps you guys have a lousy power supply (or a broken FDC)? 5.05V and 12.20V during the test. (300W power supply). FDC is a Winbond W83877F, 630AC262126202. > I've just tried it, and apart from some slowdown in the floppy > formatting part (an obvious sign that the driver loses floppy > revolutions when reading), no errors so far. This is with both of my > disks running iozone simultaneously. > > That's an ASUS P55T2P4 (i think it's using the SMC FDC+serial+ > parallel chip) and two NRC 53c810's. Is `Passive release' present as an configuration entry in the PNP/PCI screen in the BIOS configuration ? If yes, is it enabled or disabled ? When I disable `Passive release', the errors during formatting disappears. - Tor Egge From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 08:20:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA08988 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:20:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from isbalham.ist.co.uk (isbalham.ist.co.uk [192.31.26.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA08983 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:20:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gid.co.uk (uucp@localhost) by isbalham.ist.co.uk (8.8.4/8.8.4) with UUCP id PAA16471; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 15:56:50 +0100 (BST) Received: from [194.32.164.2] by seagoon.gid.co.uk; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 15:51:37 +0100 X-Sender: rb@194.32.164.1 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199709131021.DAA11509@blimp.mimi.com> References: <199709121611.MAA18193@gatekeeper.itribe.net> (message from Jamie Bowden on Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:19:34 -0400 (EDT)) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 16:44:51 +0100 To: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) From: Bob Bishop Subject: Re: ATTN Emacs users; new Zile release Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >[...] If we are going to recommend ee, we can at least >let them learn something useful, like emacs key bindings [etc] IMHO the biggest thing in vi's favour is that is uses rogue/hack key bindings. :-) :-) -- Bob Bishop (0118) 977 4017 international code +44 118 rb@gid.co.uk fax (0118) 989 4254 between 0800 and 1800 UK From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 08:22:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA09109 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:22:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (cv-1-1.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.1] (may be forged)) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA09101 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:22:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jfieber@localhost) by fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA27684; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:22:06 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:22:06 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber Reply-To: John Fieber To: Andrzej Bialecki cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: SGML authoring tools In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 13 Sep 1997, Andrzej Bialecki wrote: > What do you guys use to edit our sgml-based documentation? (e.g. FAQ and > handbook). I'd like to translate some of them into Polish, but the > perspective of remembering all the xrefs I used throughout the editing > slightly scares me... :-) The psgml major mode for emacs works nicely, although it won't give you a handy index of cross reference targets. However, for translation of an existing document, I don't see how that would be a problem. Either way, using nsgmls (or sgmls) and grep makes quick work of generating a list of targets. $ nsgmls handbook.sgml | grep '^AID ' | sort | uniq | more -john From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 09:16:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA11805 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 09:16:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from elvis.vnet.net (elvis.vnet.net [166.82.1.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA11797 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 09:16:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ponds.dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by elvis.vnet.net (8.8.5/8.8.4) with ESMTP id MAA07246; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:16:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.dignus.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA24513; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 09:09:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.8.5/8.6.9) id JAA09775; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 09:00:48 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 09:00:48 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199709131300.JAA09775@lakes.dignus.com> To: brian@awfulhak.org, rivers@dignus.com Subject: Re: I'm back!! Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > So, I've, at last; gotten things working better with my ISP and > > removed that darned non-domainized UUCP address everyone has > > "enjoyed" these past few years! (The one that looked like > > ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com) > > Horray ! Look, a reply that won't bounce (I hope). > > > - Thanks - > > - Dave Rivers - > > -- > Brian , > > Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... > > > I take it this didn't bounce... :-) - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 09:20:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA12086 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 09:20:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA12076 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 09:20:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id SAA23457 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 18:20:26 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id SAA01008; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 18:04:16 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970913180416.VX17591@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 18:04:16 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: <19970913130645.GS12767@uriah.heep.sax.de> <199709131412.QAA17101@pat.idi.ntnu.no> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709131412.QAA17101@pat.idi.ntnu.no>; from Tor Egge on Sep 13, 1997 14:12:56 +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Tor Egge wrote: > > Perhaps you guys have a lousy power supply (or a broken FDC)? > > 5.05V and 12.20V during the test. (300W power supply). That doesn't say much. The stability of the 5 V line is probably more important (or the noise on the ground potential while stronger currents are flowing) than the absolute value. > FDC is a Winbond W83877F, 630AC262126202. I think Bruce once mentioned some brokeness about the Winbonds, but i eventually forgot what it has been. > > That's an ASUS P55T2P4 (i think it's using the SMC FDC+serial+ > > parallel chip) and two NRC 53c810's. > > Is `Passive release' present as an configuration entry in the PNP/PCI > screen in the BIOS configuration ? If yes, is it enabled or disabled ? I'm too lazy to reboot right now, but i can't find it in a `strings' running on the BIOS ROM image. Here's what seems to be the PNP/PCI menu on this board: PCI Latency Timer : Slot 1 (RIGHT) IRQ : Slot 2 IRQ : Slot 3 IRQ : Slot 4 (LEFT) IRQ : Auto NA 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 IRQ 3 Used By ISA : IRQ 4 Used By ISA : IRQ 5 Used By ISA : IRQ 9 Used By ISA : IRQ 10 Used By ISA : IRQ 11 Used By ISA : IRQ 15 Used By ISA : IRQ 7 Used By ISA : IRQ 12 Used By ISA : IRQ 14 Used By ISA : DMA 1 Used By ISA : DMA 3 Used By ISA : DMA 5 Used By ISA : No/ICU Yes ISA MEM Block BASE : No/ICU C800 CC00 D000 D400 D800 DC00 ISA MEM Block SIZE : This is for some ISA Add-on cards whose UMB can't be auto-detected. NCR SCSI BIOS : USB Function : Auto Disabled > When I disable `Passive release', the errors during formatting disappears. Whatever this might be... I'm not a PCI expert. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 09:37:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA12875 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 09:37:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA12868 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 09:37:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.71 #1) id 0x9vBt-0007ks-00; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:37:01 -0600 Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.8.7/8.8.3) with ESMTP id KAA05343; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:37:54 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709131637.KAA05343@harmony.village.org> To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:09:39 +0200." <19970913080939.WU46166@uriah.heep.sax.de> References: <19970913080939.WU46166@uriah.heep.sax.de> <199709122056.NAA24445@usr08.primenet.com> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:37:54 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <19970913080939.WU46166@uriah.heep.sax.de> J Wunsch writes: : There are a lot of busy loops in the FreeBSD fdc driver, and you can : send a lovely ``thanks!'' letter to some stupid IBM engineer for : dropping the READY line from the floppy bus, apparently for the sake : of being able to use this twist-some-wires-for-drive-A hack. Actually, the ready line was either 33 or 34, which is at the end of the cable for the SCSI. And it was to allow the drive to signal that the physical disk had changed. Older floppies had this pin being READY, while newer (1.2M and 1.44M and many 720k) ones had it meaning disk change. This is one of the things that Digital got right in the Rainbow. It requires a functional READY line in order to operate properly. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 10:05:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA13997 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:05:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA13989; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:05:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <51926(2)>; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:05:15 PDT Received: from localhost by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177486>; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:05:05 -0700 To: Mike Smith cc: Bill Fenner , Ollivier Robert , hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Memory leak in getservbyXXX? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 13 Sep 97 01:21:55 PDT." <199709130821.RAA01212@word.smith.net.au> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:04:58 PDT From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <97Sep13.100505pdt.177486@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Mike Smith wrote: >Then this counts as a PR against the manpage? Sure - the whole network subsystem requires magic knowledge, might as well start fixing that somewhere... Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 10:25:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA14744 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:25:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA14734 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:25:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.71 #1) id 0x9vwl-000048-00; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:25:27 -0600 Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.8.7/8.8.3) with ESMTP id LAA00476; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:25:11 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709131725.LAA00476@harmony.village.org> Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch), hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:37:54 MDT." <199709131637.KAA05343@harmony.village.org> References: <199709131637.KAA05343@harmony.village.org> <19970913080939.WU46166@uriah.heep.sax.de> <199709122056.NAA24445@usr08.primenet.com> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:25:11 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199709131637.KAA05343@harmony.village.org> Warner Losh writes: : Actually, the ready line was either 33 or 34, which is at the end of : the cable for the SCSI. And it was to allow the drive to signal that ^^^^ floppy disk is what I really wanted to say here. : the physical disk had changed. Older floppies had this pin being : READY, while newer (1.2M and 1.44M and many 720k) ones had it meaning : disk change. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 10:28:18 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA14874 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:28:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from colin.muc.de (root@colin.muc.de [193.174.4.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA14869 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:28:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tavari.muc.de ([193.174.4.22]) by colin.muc.de with SMTP id <86041-1>; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 19:28:01 +0200 Received: from [192.168.42.51] (aleisha [192.168.42.51]) by tavari.muc.de (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA07681 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 18:23:47 +0200 (CEST) X-Sender: lutz@mail Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 18:16:10 +0200 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: Lutz Albers Subject: FYI: Vmount released Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk From: sebesty@cs.elte.hu (Zoltan Sebestyen) Newsgroups: muc.lists.freebsd.questions Subject: Vmount released Date: 12 Sep 1997 12:48:13 +0200 Hi, I've just got ready with port of vmount. As I mentioned before, it enables FreeBSD to mount any filesystem Linux can. For those who are interested it can be downloaded from http://digo.inf.elte.hu/~szoli. The files are: vmount.0.6a-freebsd.diff -- diffs to the original source code vmount.0.6a-freebsd.src.tar.gz -- the sources of the port vmount.0.6a-freebsd.tar.gz -- the binaries of the port vmount.0.6a.s.gnutar.gz -- the original sources vmount.Linux.2.0.25.README vmount.Linux.2.0.25.s.gnutar.gz -- excerpts from the Linux kernel for use with vmount. vmount-ntfs-cs.s.gnutar.gz -- Extends the Linux kernel source with ntfs. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sebestyen Zoltan It all seems so stupid, it makes me want to give up. szoli@caesar.elte.hu But why should I give up, when it all seems so stupid? -- Lutz Albers, lutz@muc.de, pgp key available from Do not take life too seriously, you will never get out of it alive. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 10:57:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA16642 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:57:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pahtoh.cwu.edu (root@pahtoh.cwu.edu [198.104.65.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA16634 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:57:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from opus.cts.cwu.edu (skynyrd@opus.cts.cwu.edu [198.104.92.71]) by pahtoh.cwu.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA18882; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:57:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (skynyrd@localhost) by opus.cts.cwu.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA27918; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:57:01 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:57:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Chris Timmons To: Brian Campbell cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ccd / newfs error In-Reply-To: <19970912232911.50519@pobox.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Over the months there has been some correspondence about newfs and its behavior when presented with the block special rather than the raw special. You'll need to search the archives in -current and -hackers for newfs. IIRC Justin Gibbs and Nate Williams may have been involved in the discussion. Normally I just newfs the raw special file - e.g 'newfs /dev/rccd0c' and have had no trouble. Can you try that and see if your problems go away? -Chris On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Brian Campbell wrote: > Has anyone else had problems newfs'ing ccd filesystems? It works > for some interleaves but not others. The newfs error message is > less than informative. > > Is there a guideline for getting the best performance out of a > filesytems (newfs/tunefs options) for reads vs writes, large vs > small files, etc? From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 11:05:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA17516 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:05:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gatekeeper.itribe.net (gatekeeper.itribe.net [209.49.144.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA17510; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:04:56 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709131704.NAA22096@gatekeeper.itribe.net> Received: forwarded by SMTP 1.5.2. Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:12:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Jamie Bowden To: "M. L. Dodson" cc: "K.J.Koster" , questions@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: <199709122016.PAA07866@beowulf.utmb.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, M. L. Dodson wrote: > K.J.Koster writes: > > > > > > Personally, I suspect timing issues with the floppy driver; I assume > > > you are using an unFIFO'ed NEC floppy controller. Floppy timing is > > > a critical factor in hysterisis effects and overall reliability. > > > > > I do have in fact a NEC floppy controller :) > > > > Umm. If timing is so critical, why do MS-DOS and Win311 work flawlessly > > with it? I mean, they are hardly real-time OS-es? > > > > Actually in this case, they are. You can't do anything else > while the floppy disk is being serviced by the driver. You can get windows to screw this up quite easily actually. Put a floppy in ye ole floppy drive, open a dos window, use command line format, and then go do something else. It invariably screws up the format and produces a disk that probably won't work. Jamie Bowden System Administrator, iTRiBE.net Abusenet: The Misinformation Superhighway From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 11:10:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA17987 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:10:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pluto.cpe.ku.ac.th (pluto.cpe.ku.ac.th [158.108.32.69]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA17977 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:10:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (stt@localhost) by pluto.cpe.ku.ac.th (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id BAA20320 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 01:22:50 +0700 (ICT) Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 01:22:50 +0700 (ICT) From: Sunthiti Patchararungruang To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Need Help about BPF Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Dear Sir, I am a master student. My thesis is in the topic of computer network. I need to know that if I has a complete IP packet, already encapsulated with IP header, and I would like to send it to a specified interface, how can I do that. However, my IP packet does not have any information about Datalink layer address. Do I need to manage the address by myself. Someone in FreeBsd.org told me that I should use BPF. I rarely have the document about it, only have BPF(4) man-page and BPF data in ftp.ee.lbl.gov. If you also recommend BPF, please tell me where I can find the information about it. Best Regards, Sunthiti Patchararungruang From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 11:26:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA18937 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:26:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA18932 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:26:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id TAA06358; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 19:11:25 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199709131711.TAA06358@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? To: Tor.Egge@idi.ntnu.no (Tor Egge) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 19:11:25 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, j@uriah.heep.sax.de, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709131412.QAA17101@pat.idi.ntnu.no> from "Tor Egge" at Sep 13, 97 02:12:37 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Is `Passive release' present as an configuration entry in the PNP/PCI > screen in the BIOS configuration ? If yes, is it enabled or disabled ? > > When I disable `Passive release', the errors during formatting disappears. what is this option supposed to do ? Luigi From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 11:35:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA19566 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:35:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from iafnl.es.iaf.nl (uucp@iafnl.es.iaf.nl [195.108.17.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA19559 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:35:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: by iafnl.es.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA23264 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for FreeBSD-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG); Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:35:41 +0200 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.8.5/8.6.12) id TAA00900; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 19:30:12 +0200 (MET DST) From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199709131730.TAA00900@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: FreeBSD on non-PCI based Alpha machines? To: thorpej@nas.nasa.gov Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 19:30:12 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709130951.CAA15655@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> from "Jason Thorpe" at Sep 13, 97 02:51:12 am X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem, The Netherlands X-Pgp-Info: PGP public key at 'finger wilko@freefall.freebsd.org' X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jason Thorpe wrote... > On Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:12:13 +0200 (MET DST) > Wilko Bulte wrote: > > > There are quite a number of PCI-mixed-with-EISA Alpha machines so there > > might be some interest. It seems FreeBSD can handle the old 'Bird' Argh: I meant to type NetBSD... > > machines (Sandpiper, Flamingo) which are all Turbochannel boxes. TC is > > not too interesting to me of course ;-) > > FreeBSD for Alpha works? When did that happen? (Serious question :-) > > The last I heard, the FreeBSD-for-Alpha folks were mainly interested > in the PCI Alphas. I can imagine that, no problem. > Now, *NetBSD* does support the TurboChannel systems, quite a number > of the PCI systems (including ones with EISA), and the TurboLaser > systems (e.g. the AlphaServer 8200 and 8400 - the machines that > AltaVista runs on...) I know, I work for DEC. There is now NT for TurboLaser (aaaaaaargghh) and people seem to like it.. > > runs quite happily with a Intel CPU. Standard SCSI controller is > > a Adaptec 1742A, the video is a Compaq Qvision which at least > > in text mode works with FreeBSD-Intel. > > > > There are some oddities with the Jensen design however, I'll > > just have to read the 5" stack of docs I got with it. > > ...The fact that FreeBSD works with PCs that have this EISA chipset > doesn't mean it will be easy to make the Jensen work. Bus access > on the Alpha works much differently than it does on the PC. And the Jensen hardware implementation is less than standard it seems. But still, there might be reusable code present (I hope). > Yes, NetBSD does run on the "mixed PCI and EISA systems". One such > system is the KN20AA. Here is from my AlphaStation 500 5/500: > > 2038584+915536 [85+99840+57185] > > Entering netbsd at 0xfffffc0000300000... > Copyright (c) 1982, 1986, 1989, 1991, 1993 > The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. > > NetBSD 1.2G (GENERIC) #12: Sat Sep 13 00:31:33 PDT 1997 > thorpej@mother.nas.nasa.gov:/space2/thorpej/src/sys/arch/alpha/compile/GENERIC > AlphaStation 500 or 600 (KN20AA), 500MHz > 8192 byte page size, 1 processor. > real mem = 268435456 (2252800 reserved for PROM, 266182656 used by NetBSD) > avail mem = 227098624 > using 3249 buffers containing 26615808 bytes of memory > mainbus0 (root) > cpu0 at mainbus0: ID 0 (primary), 21164A (reserved minor type) > > Note the way EISA is set up on this system - it's bridged off the PCI. > This is simmilar to a standard PCI-ISA bridge. > > On the PCI Alphas, all bus access goes through the PCI bus. On the Jensen, > however, this is not the case. I forget the details (I'll have to dig out > my Jensen documentation), but bus access on these beasts is a trick. Esp. I do have the hardware docs, but need time to read them. Have to find a housing for the Jensen first, it is now open on the table :-/ > considering that they have 2 logical ISA busses (the ISA bus, and an I/O > chip which presents a separate ISA space, which has the serial ports, > parallel port, etc. on it... as I recall). Yep, there is a multio chip. > Anyhow, if you're interested in getting your Jensen supported by NetBSD, > please drop me a private note. Will do that. Wilko _ ____________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl http://www.tcja.nl/~wilko |/|/ / / /( (_) Arnhem, The Netherlands - Do, or do not. There is no 'try' ----------------------------------------------------------------------Yoda From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 12:33:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA22034 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:33:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.firehouse.net (brian@shell.firehouse.net [209.42.203.45]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA22029 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:33:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (brian@localhost) by shell.firehouse.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA23569; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 15:30:51 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 15:30:48 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Mitchell To: Sunthiti Patchararungruang cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Need Help about BPF In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 14 Sep 1997, Sunthiti Patchararungruang wrote: > Dear Sir, > > I am a master student. My thesis is in the topic of computer > network. I need to know that if I has a complete IP packet, already > encapsulated with IP header, and I would like to send it to a specified > interface, how can I do that. However, my IP packet does not have any > information about Datalink layer address. Do I need to manage the address > by myself. man ip, I would probably use a raw socket > > Someone in FreeBsd.org told me that I should use BPF. I rarely > have the document about it, only have BPF(4) man-page and BPF data in > ftp.ee.lbl.gov. If you also recommend BPF, please tell me where I can find > the information about it. if you use bpf, just write the segment. You need datalink layer too, in the case of bpf. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 12:37:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA22259 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:37:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mercury.ukc.ac.uk (mercury.ukc.ac.uk [129.12.21.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA22239; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:36:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kestrel.ukc.ac.uk by mercury.ukc.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:36:46 +0100 Received: from localhost by kestrel.ukc.ac.uk (5.x/UKC-2.14) id AA11513; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:36:45 +0100 Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:36:45 +0100 (BST) From: "K.J.Koster" To: hackers@freebsd.org Cc: questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: <199709131704.NAA22096@gatekeeper.itribe.net> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > You can get windows to screw this up quite easily actually. Put a floppy > in ye ole floppy drive, open a dos window, use command line format, and > then go do something else. It invariably screws up the format and > produces a disk that probably won't work. > Oh great, just what FreeBSD needs: a win311 compatible floppy driver :) Groetjes, Kees Jan ---------------------------------------------------------------v-- Kees Jan Koster tel: UK-1227-453157 e-mail: kjk1@ukc.ac.uk 15 St. Michaels Road, Canterbury, Kent, United Kingdom ------------------------------------------------------------------ from trials come errors... from errors come legends... From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 13:15:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA24678 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:15:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA24670 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:15:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA25809; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 22:15:42 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id WAA02269; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 22:13:42 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970913221342.BV60285@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 22:13:42 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: stt@pluto.cpe.ku.ac.th (Sunthiti Patchararungruang) Subject: Re: Need Help about BPF References: X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from Sunthiti Patchararungruang on Sep 14, 1997 01:22:50 +0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Sunthiti Patchararungruang wrote: > Dear Sir, Probably many of them here. :) > Someone in FreeBsd.org told me that I should use BPF. I rarely > have the document about it, only have BPF(4) man-page and BPF data in > ftp.ee.lbl.gov. If you also recommend BPF, please tell me where I can find > the information about it. Well, your problem isn't quite clear to me. Anyway, if you intend to send some arbitrary packets down to the wire, have a look at the implementation of rarpd(8) (in /usr/src/usr.sbin/rarpd/), i think it's doing a similar job. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 14:05:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA29497 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 14:05:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr08.primenet.com (tlambert@usr08.primenet.com [206.165.6.208]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA29492 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 14:05:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA20111; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 14:04:53 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709132104.OAA20111@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? To: dkelly@hiwaay.net Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 21:04:52 +0000 (GMT) Cc: Tor.Egge@idi.ntnu.no, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709130622.BAA18777@nospam.hiwaay.net> from "dkelly@hiwaay.net" at Sep 13, 97 01:22:32 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Any suggestions toward identifying FDC's with FIFO's? Preferably without > taking something apart? Augh. Read the code! The driver already does what little chip detection is possible! It uses the 0x10 command to identify the chip version. Only the Intel 82077AA has FIFO's (the 82078 des to, but I don't know what the heck it returns for a version ID -- anyone have one?). All other FDC chips with FIFO's are unprobeable, unless they return a version ID. When you boot, you will see one of: fdc0: NEC 765 fdc0: Intel 82077 fdc0: NEC 72065B fdc0: unknown IC type ff ...or *whatever* two digit hex value, other than 0x80, 0x81, or 0x90. The current driver code does not enable the FIFO. It would need to have detected as an 82077, and then use the Configure command (0x13) to clear bit 5 of command byte 2. It would set bits 0-3 to enable a 16 byte threshold. Then it would need to use the Lock FIFO command (0x94) to save the FIFO state across software resets. Then there would be additional code changes, as necessary, on top of that. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 15:00:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA02353 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 15:00:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from monk.via.net (monk.via.net [140.174.204.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA02348 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 15:00:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from joe@localhost) by monk.via.net (8.6.11/8.6.12) id OAA02539 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 14:50:55 -0700 Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 14:50:55 -0700 From: Joe McGuckin Message-Id: <199709132150.OAA02539@monk.via.net> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Multiple kernel src trees? X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Can I have multiple kernel src trees on a single machine? Are all the include files using relative paths? Do I need any special links? I'd like to have a stable build area without having to overwrite the normal /sys file that come with the install disk. Thanks! Joe From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 15:04:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA02487 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 15:04:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr03.primenet.com (tlambert@usr03.primenet.com [206.165.6.203]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA02482 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 15:04:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr03.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA29580; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 15:04:34 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709132204.PAA29580@usr03.primenet.com> Subject: Re: nfs startup - perhaps it is a problem To: dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 22:04:33 +0000 (GMT) Cc: brian@awfulhak.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Doug White" at Sep 12, 97 10:35:05 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Your /etc/hosts should always be populated with necessary systems as a > precaution and a speed improvement. Except rlogind ignores the hosts file and does a DNS request anyway when attempting to verify the source host for a user, even if you have hosts first in host.conf. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 15:07:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA02593 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 15:07:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr03.primenet.com (tlambert@usr03.primenet.com [206.165.6.203]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA02588 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 15:07:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr03.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA29890; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 15:07:11 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709132207.PAA29890@usr03.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 22:07:10 +0000 (GMT) Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970913165635.17336@lemis.com> from "Greg Lehey" at Sep 13, 97 04:56:35 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > An FDC-reported ``CRC error in data field'' is just what the FDC is > > telling me. I don't see why you're blaming the driver for being > > blind-eyed if it just believes what the FDC is telling. > > It looks like it, doesn't it? But how does that explain why people > can read some things on one machine when it's running Linux, and not > on the same machine when it's running FreeBSD? Remember that floppies > contain a lot of analogue electronics (well, a large proportion of the > electronics are analogue :-). And we all know that floppy drives are > a piece of shit. I think that any driver that believes the drive is > being blind-eyed. JOOI, how many times do you retry? It is not an issue of retrying forever; typical BIOS implementations will seek and retry. I think the problem lies in the use of sector instead of track based reads and writes, actually. Doing a sector at a time can add a lot of slop-error. To keep multitrack writes streaming would require two track buffers, BTW. The track buffer would act as a cache. Inter-track seeking would be a bit slowed by this, but the MSDOSFS should probably see a good performance improvement, especially since locality dictates that most of the interesting pieces of the FAT will be in one buffer or the other. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 15:49:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA04166 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 15:49:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sendero-ppp.i-connect.net (sendero-ppp.i-Connect.Net [206.190.143.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA04158 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 15:49:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 16544 invoked by uid 1000); 13 Sep 1997 22:49:42 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.2-alpha [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 15:49:42 -0700 (PDT) Organization: Atlas Telecom From: Simon Shapiro To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Subject: Patches on senderp-ppp.i-connect.net Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi Y'all, This is just a bit of formality and a reminder: Any progamming logic (source, object, executable, etc.) that you may find on the computer known as sendero-ppp.i-connect.net (206.190.143.100), which does not clearly display a Copyright notice authorizing free distribution is proprietary, unpublished source code of Simon Shapiro, Atlas Telecom or both. In the interest of cooperation and enhancement of testing and validation, Simon shapiro, and/or Atlas Telecom, may from time to time, at their own discretion, release such sources to the public under restictions known as the ``Berkeley Copyright'', and/or the ``GNU Software License''. Please refrain from downloading software from this site, unles authorized by Simon Shapiro. The above has been triggered by a concern that incomplete, unreviewed and untested software may get distributed, causing confsion, liability exposure and just plain headaches. It is our intent to make the software as available as possible. --- Sincerely Yours, (Sent on 13-Sep-97, 15:40:12 by XF-Mail) Simon Shapiro Atlas Telecom Senior Architect 14355 SW Allen Blvd., Suite 130 Beaverton OR 97005 Shimon@i-Connect.Net Voice: 503.643.5559, Emergency: 503.799.2313 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 16:34:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA06037 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 16:34:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sendero-ppp.i-connect.net (sendero-ppp.i-Connect.Net [206.190.143.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA06030 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 16:34:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 17069 invoked by uid 1000); 13 Sep 1997 23:34:42 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.2-alpha [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 16:34:42 -0700 (PDT) Organization: Atlas Telecom From: Simon Shapiro To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: What is wrong with this snipet? Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Why would the following segfault on 6 of the 10 iterations? int main(int argc, char **argv, char **argp) { int ndx; for ( ndx = 0; ndx < 10; ndx++ ) { switch ( rfork(RFPROC|RFNOWAIT|RFFDG|RFMEM) ) { case -1: (void)fprintf(stderr, "%s ERROR: Failed to fork (%s)\n", argv[0], strerror(errno)); break; case 0: return(0); } } return(0); } --- Sincerely Yours, (Sent on 13-Sep-97, 16:31:40 by XF-Mail) Simon Shapiro Atlas Telecom Senior Architect 14355 SW Allen Blvd., Suite 130 Beaverton OR 97005 Shimon@i-Connect.Net Voice: 503.643.5559, Emergency: 503.799.2313 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 17:35:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA08851 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 17:35:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from awfulhak.demon.co.uk (awfulhak.demon.co.uk [158.152.17.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA08834 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 17:34:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gate.lan.awfulhak.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by awfulhak.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA13254; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 01:14:35 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199709140014.BAA13254@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Terry Lambert cc: dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu, brian@awfulhak.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: nfs startup - perhaps it is a problem In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 13 Sep 1997 22:04:33 -0000." <199709132204.PAA29580@usr03.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 01:14:32 +0100 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Your /etc/hosts should always be populated with necessary systems as a > > precaution and a speed improvement. > > Except rlogind ignores the hosts file and does a DNS request > anyway when attempting to verify the source host for a user, > even if you have hosts first in host.conf. As (it seems) does NFS :-( The only way to have things work is to have a nameserver in /etc/resolv.conf :-( > > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org > --- > Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present > or previous employers. -- Brian , Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 17:43:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA09149 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 17:43:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp.enteract.com (david.enteract.com [206.54.252.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA09144 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 17:43:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 5923 invoked from network); 14 Sep 1997 00:43:24 -0000 Received: from enteract.com (stox@206.54.252.1) by david.enteract.com with SMTP; 14 Sep 1997 00:43:24 -0000 Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 19:43:24 -0500 (CDT) From: Ken Stox To: Joe McGuckin cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Multiple kernel src trees? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 13 Sep 1997, Joe McGuckin wrote: >Can I have multiple kernel src trees on a single machine? >Are all the include files using relative paths? Sure, no problem. Look at /usr/src/release/Makefile. Warning, you'll chew up alot of space with redundant obj's and binaries. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 17:44:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA09217 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 17:44:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA09177 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 17:43:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id KAA25519; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 10:13:50 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970914101350.06261@lemis.com> Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 10:13:50 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Brian Somers Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: rc & rc.conf References: <199709130916.KAA04290@awfulhak.demon.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709130916.KAA04290@awfulhak.demon.co.uk>; from Brian Somers on Sat, Sep 13, 1997 at 10:16:39AM +0100 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, Sep 13, 1997 at 10:16:39AM +0100, Brian Somers wrote: > This is a disaster waiting to happen: > > /etc/rc.conf: > [.....] > inetd_enable="YES" # Run the network daemon displatcher (or NO). > [.....] > cron_enable="YES" # Run the periodic job daemon. > [.....] > > /etc/rc: > [.....] > if [ "X${inetd_enable}" = X"YES" ]; then > echo -n ' inetd'; inetd ${inetd_flags} > fi > > if [ "X${cron_enable}" = X"YES" ]; then > echo -n ' cron'; cron > fi > [.....] I'm sorry, I must be too stupid. What's wrong with that? And how does your fix fix it? Since the flags and the -enable have been separated, it seems that we *should* insist on the exact string YES for the enable flags. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 17:48:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA09508 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 17:48:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from goose.doun.org (doun.org [142.154.6.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA09503 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 17:48:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from josh@localhost) by goose.doun.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA22663; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:47:50 GMT Message-ID: <19970913204749.41765@doun.org> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:47:49 +0000 From: Josh Tiefenbach To: hackers@freebsd.org Cc: josh@doun.org Subject: Problems with NCR810/Micropolis disk. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk (I sent this to -scsi the other day, and didnt get any bites. Trying with larger audience) I've been having some difficulty with my ncr810 / Micropolis 4743 (Stinger) setup under both 2.2.2R and the 9/12 SNAP of 3.0. Relevant sections of dmesg: Copyright (c) 1992-1997 FreeBSD Inc. Copyright (c) 1982, 1986, 1989, 1991, 1993 The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. FreeBSD 3.0-970912-SNAP #0: Sat Sep 13 19:54:53 GMT 1997 root@asherah.doun.org:/usr/src/sys/compile/ASHERAH CPU: Pentium (199.90-MHz 586-class CPU) Origin = "GenuineIntel" Id = 0x544 Stepping=4 Features=0x8001bf real memory = 67108864 (65536K bytes) avail memory = 63455232 (61968K bytes) Probing for devices on PCI bus 0: chip0: rev 0x01 on pci0.0.0 chip1: rev 0x01 on pci0.1.0 chip2: rev 0x01 int d irq 9 on pci0.1.2 chip3: rev 0x01 on pci0.1.3 ncr0: rev 0x12 int a irq 10 on pci0.10.0 scbus0 at ncr0 bus 0 scbus0 target 0 lun 0: type 0 fixed SCSI 2 sd0 at scbus0 target 0 lun 0 sd0: Direct-Access sd0: 10.0 MB/s (100 ns, offset 8) sd0: M_DISCONNECT received, but datapointer not saved: data=799b4 save=7a6b0 goal=7a6d4. 4100MB (8398600 512 byte sectors) sd0: with 6512 cyls, 7 heads, and an average 184 sectors/track While the drive works, it is *extremely* pokey. A dd from rsd0a to /dev/null with no load at all clocked in at about 250k/s. Under Win95, the drive seems to perfom quite well, and the benchmarks I've run there (mostly norton stuff) seems to indicate that the drive motors along at a fast clip (compared to the reference drives). In searching the archives, the I found a post to -scsi circa 12/96 with the exact same dmesg output (M_DISCONNEXT) involving an ncr810 and a 9GB Micropolis drive, but no solution/explanation was offered. Could this concievably be a hardware problem (ie, should I return the drive), or is there something patently obvious that I'm missing? josh -- "Those who learn from history are doomed to have it repeated to them anyways" -- Larry Wall. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 18:38:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA11285 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 18:38:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from GndRsh.aac.dev.com (GndRsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA11266; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 18:38:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by GndRsh.aac.dev.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) id SAA00731; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 18:37:58 -0700 (PDT) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199709140137.SAA00731@GndRsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: Patches on senderp-ppp.i-connect.net In-Reply-To: from Simon Shapiro at "Sep 13, 97 03:49:42 pm" To: Shimon@i-Connect.Net (Simon Shapiro) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 18:37:58 -0700 (PDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL25 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Hi Y'all, > > This is just a bit of formality and a reminder: > > Any progamming logic (source, object, executable, etc.) that you may find > on the computer known as sendero-ppp.i-connect.net (206.190.143.100), which > does not clearly display a Copyright notice authorizing free distribution > is proprietary, unpublished source code of Simon Shapiro, Atlas Telecom or > both. I love the work you are doing, but the above statement is not correct. a) It is not ``proprietary'' unless you take legal and proper actions to keep it as such. In most cases you have done just the opposite, you've given pointers to it in a public forum. b) The action of making it avaliable to anyone other than yourself is `publication'', thierfor the code is not ``unpublished''. c) Your ftp server welcome message desen't even head any warnings what so ever. In all hounesty I am simply amazed that the legal department of Atlas Telecom has approved these actions. I applaud them if they have. > In the interest of cooperation and enhancement of testing and validation, > Simon shapiro, and/or Atlas Telecom, may from time to time, at their own > discretion, release such sources to the public under restictions known as > the ``Berkeley Copyright'', and/or the ``GNU Software License''. > > Please refrain from downloading software from this site, unles authorized > by Simon Shapiro. Please require a password to access it then, your asking for legal problems if you don't make a demonstaitable attempt to protect yourself. Heck, even the XFree86 folks require a password to get to Alpha/Beta code and they are a 501(c)3 that is required by thier articles of incorporation (and hence law) to release there work to the public. > > The above has been triggered by a concern that incomplete, unreviewed and > untested software may get distributed, causing confsion, liability exposure > and just plain headaches. And this mail message is going to stop any of that???? -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation, Inc. Reliable computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 19:20:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA13512 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 19:20:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sendero-ppp.i-connect.net (sendero-ppp.i-Connect.Net [206.190.143.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id TAA13492 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 19:20:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 16533 invoked by uid 1000); 14 Sep 1997 02:20:49 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.2-alpha [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199709140137.SAA00731@GndRsh.aac.dev.com> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 19:20:49 -0700 (PDT) Organization: Atlas Telecom From: Simon Shapiro To: "Rodney W. Grimes" Subject: Re: Patches on senderp-ppp.i-connect.net Cc: freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi "Rodney W. Grimes"; On 14-Sep-97 you wrote: ... Some excellent advise delete ... > And this mail message is going to stop any of that???? Nope. We would like the code to stay available as much as we can, while releasing us from much of the hassle. The steps you are indicating are being implemented, one at a time. I personally would like to see as few as possible, but many forces demands that I take some. --- Sincerely Yours, (Sent on 13-Sep-97, 19:17:05 by XF-Mail) Simon Shapiro Atlas Telecom Senior Architect 14355 SW Allen Blvd., Suite 130 Beaverton OR 97005 Shimon@i-Connect.Net Voice: 503.643.5559, Emergency: 503.799.2313 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 19:23:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA13649 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 19:23:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ns2.harborcom.net (root@ns2.harborcom.net [206.158.4.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA13644 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 19:22:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (bradley@localhost) by ns2.harborcom.net (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA23841; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 22:22:50 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 22:22:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Bradley Dunn X-Sender: bradley@ns2.harborcom.net To: Joerg Wunsch cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: <19970912231411.VV24990@uriah.heep.sax.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, J Wunsch wrote: > YOU SHOULD NEVER USE BUFFERED DEVICES UNLESS YOU ARE GOING > TO MOUNT(2) A FILESYSTEM OVER IT. > > Please, people, hammer this sentence into your head. I'm in great Hmmm...maybe it would help if the FreeBSD documentation didn't suggest using buffered devices? http://www.freebsd.org/handbook/install.html pbd -- "Seems she thought of me as some mystic, fatalistic, mystical guru Me, I haven't got a clue." -- Tears for Fears, "Cold" From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 20:09:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA16339 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:09:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hydrogen.nike.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA16329; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:09:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.nike.efn.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA18024; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:09:06 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <19970913200905.31425@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:09:05 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: "Rodney W. Grimes" Cc: Simon Shapiro , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Patches on senderp-ppp.i-connect.net References: <199709140137.SAA00731@GndRsh.aac.dev.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.69 In-Reply-To: <199709140137.SAA00731@GndRsh.aac.dev.com>; from Rodney W. Grimes on Sat, Sep 13, 1997 at 06:37:58PM -0700 Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney Organization: Cu Networking X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Rodney W. Grimes scribbled this message on Sep 13: > > Hi Y'all, > > > > This is just a bit of formality and a reminder: > > > > Any progamming logic (source, object, executable, etc.) that you may find > > on the computer known as sendero-ppp.i-connect.net (206.190.143.100), which > > does not clearly display a Copyright notice authorizing free distribution > > is proprietary, unpublished source code of Simon Shapiro, Atlas Telecom or > > both. > > I love the work you are doing, but the above statement is not correct. > > a) It is not ``proprietary'' unless you take legal and proper actions > to keep it as such. In most cases you have done just the opposite, > you've given pointers to it in a public forum. > > b) The action of making it avaliable to anyone other than yourself > is `publication'', thierfor the code is not ``unpublished''. if this is true.. and that simply letting people download load it means that the copyright is invalid (i.e. it's publicly avail), then why do we worry about GPL'd code?? it's publicly avail.. but we still have to adhear to the copyright attached... so why does this apply to his code? it also only in theory that published material is free... but case law has proven otherwise.. this is the basis for all intellectual property law... > c) Your ftp server welcome message desen't even head any warnings > what so ever. well. that has been fixed... :) -- John-Mark Gurney Modem/FAX: +1 541 683 6954 Cu Networking Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 20:47:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA18047 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:47:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sendero-ppp.i-connect.net (sendero-ppp.i-Connect.Net [206.190.143.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA18031 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:47:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 18011 invoked by uid 1000); 14 Sep 1997 03:47:52 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.2-alpha [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <19970913200905.31425@hydrogen.nike.efn.org> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:47:52 -0700 (PDT) Organization: Atlas Telecom From: Simon Shapiro To: John-Mark Gurney Subject: Re: Patches on senderp-ppp.i-connect.net Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG, "Rodney W. Grimes" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi John-Mark Gurney; On 14-Sep-97 you wrote: ... > > a) It is not ``proprietary'' unless you take legal and proper actions > > to keep it as such. In most cases you have done just the opposite, > > you've given pointers to it in a public forum. > > > > b) The action of making it avaliable to anyone other than yourself > > is `publication'', thierfor the code is not ``unpublished''. > > if this is true.. and that simply letting people download load it means > that the copyright is invalid (i.e. it's publicly avail), then why do we > worry about GPL'd code?? it's publicly avail.. but we still have to > adhear > to the copyright attached... so why does this apply to his code? > > it also only in theory that published material is free... but case law > has proven otherwise.. this is the basis for all intellectual property > law... It is my limited understanding (our liers are vague about it) is that the fact that a song is broadcast on the radio, a movie in the theater and a book available in the library do not reduce, nor void the original author's copyright. What I am told about proprietary is that it goes with ``.. and unpublished''. This expression makes the work private and if you cannot prove you had permission to have a copy, makes your copy illegally obtained, making it easier for the lawyers to win that huge lawsuit against you. The fact that the ftp login does not require a password and thus makes it OK to freely copy, is akin to the shoplifter claiming innocence as the door was open, the merchandise was freely on the table and the survailence camera off. BTW, the original intent of my posting was to make it clear that we do not want to be responsible for your trying untested code, and that you do not run off with some (or all) of this code, claiming it to be free. Some of it is (DPT), some of it may be, but not yet. Some of it will probably never be ``free''. If you are not sure, ask me. ... --- Sincerely Yours, (Sent on 13-Sep-97, 20:38:30 by XF-Mail) Simon Shapiro Atlas Telecom Senior Architect 14355 SW Allen Blvd., Suite 130 Beaverton OR 97005 Shimon@i-Connect.Net Voice: 503.643.5559, Emergency: 503.799.2313 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 21:41:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA20961 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 21:41:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr08.primenet.com (tlambert@usr08.primenet.com [206.165.6.208]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA20955 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 21:41:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA08696; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 21:41:41 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709140441.VAA08696@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Multiple kernel src trees? To: joe@via.net (Joe McGuckin) Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 04:41:40 +0000 (GMT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199709132150.OAA02539@monk.via.net> from "Joe McGuckin" at Sep 13, 97 02:50:55 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Can I have multiple kernel src trees on a single machine? Yes. > Are all the include files using relative paths? No. > Do I need any special links? I generally do the following: root# cd / root# rm -f sys root# ln -s /usr/src/sys sys root# cd /usr root# mv src src-release root# mkdir src root# cd src root# cat > MKRELEASE < I'd like to have a stable build area without having to overwrite the > normal /sys file that come with the install disk. Me too. It's a pain in the rear. And the libkvm and w and ps build areas use relative references to get related sources; that breaks their compilation as well. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 21:44:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA21077 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 21:44:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr08.primenet.com (tlambert@usr08.primenet.com [206.165.6.208]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA21068 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 21:44:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA08806; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 21:44:04 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709140444.VAA08806@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: What is wrong with this snipet? To: Shimon@i-connect.net (Simon Shapiro) Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 04:44:03 +0000 (GMT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Simon Shapiro" at Sep 13, 97 04:34:42 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Why would the following segfault on 6 of the 10 iterations? Forget that, we want to know how you get 5 more iterations (minimum) out of a program that's already segfaulted. 8-). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 21:44:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA21118 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 21:44:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pobox.com (ras123.microplus.ca [207.81.20.42]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA21106 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 21:44:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from brianc@localhost) by pobox.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA05759; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 00:43:17 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19970914004317.33168@pobox.com> Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 00:43:17 -0400 From: Brian Campbell To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ccd / newfs error References: <19970912232911.50519@pobox.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81 In-Reply-To: ; from Chris Timmons on Sat, Sep 13, 1997 at 10:57:01AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Brian Campbell wrote: > > Has anyone else had problems newfs'ing ccd filesystems? It works > > for some interleaves but not others. The newfs error message is > > less than informative. On Sat, Sep 13, 1997 Chris Timmons wrote: > Over the months there has been some correspondence about newfs and its > behavior when presented with the block special rather than the raw > special. You'll need to search the archives in -current and -hackers for > newfs. IIRC Justin Gibbs and Nate Williams may have been involved in the > discussion. > > Normally I just newfs the raw special file - e.g 'newfs /dev/rccd0c' and > have had no trouble. Can you try that and see if your problems go away? I retried it explicitly specifying /dev/rccd0a, same error. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 21:46:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA21290 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 21:46:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usr08.primenet.com (tlambert@usr08.primenet.com [206.165.6.208]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA21284 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 21:46:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA08907; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 21:46:13 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199709140446.VAA08907@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: rc & rc.conf To: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 04:46:13 +0000 (GMT) Cc: brian@awfulhak.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970914101350.06261@lemis.com> from "Greg Lehey" at Sep 14, 97 10:13:50 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > This is a disaster waiting to happen: > > I'm sorry, I must be too stupid. What's wrong with that? And how > does your fix fix it? Since the flags and the -enable have been > separated, it seems that we *should* insist on the exact string YES > for the enable flags. 1) The logic is inverted from that of all similar code 2) The value "YES" means that flag values, if they should be later desired, can't be put in the string in order to activate the services with the requested flags, like you can for all similar code. At least, that's what I got out of it... Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 21:56:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA21738 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 21:56:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zippy.dyn.ml.org (garbanzo@tokyo-42.ppp.hooked.net [206.169.229.42]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA21733 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 21:56:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (garbanzo@localhost) by zippy.dyn.ml.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA02935 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 21:56:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: zippy.dyn.ml.org: garbanzo owned process doing -bs Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:07:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex To: current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? In-Reply-To: <199709132104.OAA20111@usr08.primenet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII ReSent-Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 21:56:38 -0700 (PDT) ReSent-From: Alex ReSent-To: hackers@freebsd.org ReSent-Message-ID: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 13 Sep 1997, Terry Lambert wrote: > Only the Intel 82077AA has FIFO's (the 82078 des to, but I don't > know what the heck it returns for a version ID -- anyone have one?). A quick web search revealed that Linux will identify four different "breeds" of 82078s (linux/drivers/block/floppy.c). > All other FDC chips with FIFO's are unprobeable, unless they > return a version ID. > > When you boot, you will see one of: > > fdc0: NEC 765 > fdc0: Intel 82077 > fdc0: NEC 72065B > fdc0: unknown IC type ff > > ...or *whatever* two digit hex value, other than 0x80, 0x81, or 0x90. > > The current driver code does not enable the FIFO. It would need to > have detected as an 82077, and then use the Configure command (0x13) > to clear bit 5 of command byte 2. It would set bits 0-3 to enable > a 16 byte threshold. Then it would need to use the Lock FIFO command > (0x94) to save the FIFO state across software resets. > > Then there would be additional code changes, as necessary, on top of > that. - alex From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 22:45:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA23327 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 22:45:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA23318 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 22:45:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id PAA14076; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 15:15:17 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970914151517.24823@lemis.com> Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 15:15:17 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Terry Lambert Cc: brian@awfulhak.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: rc & rc.conf References: <19970914101350.06261@lemis.com> <199709140446.VAA08907@usr08.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709140446.VAA08907@usr08.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Sun, Sep 14, 1997 at 04:46:13AM +0000 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, Sep 14, 1997 at 04:46:13AM +0000, Terry Lambert wrote: >>> This is a disaster waiting to happen: >> >> I'm sorry, I must be too stupid. What's wrong with that? And how >> does your fix fix it? Since the flags and the -enable have been >> separated, it seems that we *should* insist on the exact string YES >> for the enable flags. > > 1) The logic is inverted from that of all similar code > > 2) The value "YES" means that flag values, if they should > be later desired, can't be put in the string in order > to activate the services with the requested flags, like > you can for all similar code. Yes, I'm not quite *that* stupid. We have two variables here: a -flags which is set with the flags, and an -enable which is set to either YES or NO. The original logic says "don't do it unless -enable is YES". Brian's saying "do it unless -enable is NO". I don't see an advantage in doing it this way, and I certainly don't see a disaster waiting to happen in the old way. Another thing that puzzles me is why somebody would want to disable cron. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 23:12:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA24139 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:12:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (ppp20.portal.net.au [202.12.71.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA24129 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:12:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from word.smith.net.au (localhost.smith.net.au [127.0.0.1]) by word.smith.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA00821; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 15:39:53 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199709140609.PAA00821@word.smith.net.au> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: Greg Lehey cc: Terry Lambert , brian@awfulhak.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: rc & rc.conf In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 14 Sep 1997 15:15:17 +0930." <19970914151517.24823@lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 15:39:51 +0930 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Yes, I'm not quite *that* stupid. We have two variables here: a > -flags which is set with the flags, and an -enable which is set to > either YES or NO. The original logic says "don't do it unless -enable > is YES". Brian's saying "do it unless -enable is NO". I don't see an > advantage in doing it this way, and I certainly don't see a disaster > waiting to happen in the old way. The advantages are combined; consistency with all of the other similar options, and by using "not NO", the _enable and _flags variables may subsequently be combined. > Another thing that puzzles me is why somebody would want to disable > cron. Footprint. mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 23:21:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA24442 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:21:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA24437 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:21:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA01037 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:20:55 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id IAA09915; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:07:54 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970914080754.QD64989@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:07:54 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers) Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: <19970912231411.VV24990@uriah.heep.sax.de> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from Bradley Dunn on Sep 13, 1997 22:22:50 -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Bradley Dunn wrote: > > Please, people, hammer this sentence into your head. I'm in great > > Hmmm...maybe it would help if the FreeBSD documentation didn't > suggest using buffered devices? > > http://www.freebsd.org/handbook/install.html Thanks for the pointer, about to fix it. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 23:21:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA24514 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:21:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA24506 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:21:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA01041 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:21:51 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id IAA09965; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:20:45 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970914082044.BG34112@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:20:44 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: <19970913165635.17336@lemis.com> <199709132207.PAA29890@usr03.primenet.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709132207.PAA29890@usr03.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Sep 13, 1997 22:07:10 +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Terry Lambert wrote: > It is not an issue of retrying forever; typical BIOS implementations > will seek and retry. Typical FreeBSD implementations will seek and retry. UTSL. > I think the problem lies in the use of sector instead of track based > reads and writes, actually. Doing a sector at a time can add a lot > of slop-error. Why and how? If a FDC fails to detect the sector ID field reliably, i would call it `broken hardware'. The first sector ID field is not more magic than any other sector ID field, btw. Even full-track reads will have to decode each sector ID field separately (unless you're going to read a raw track, but that's nothing you would do except for debugging purposes). Terry, again, you don't know what you're talking about. Have you ever programmed a NE765/i8272 yourself? I doubt it. You would make more qualified comments if you had. > To keep multitrack writes streaming would require > two track buffers, BTW. Why? The inter-sector gaps of floppies are large enough to give the CPUs that are in use these days time to setup the next transfers. Let alone track-to-track seek times. (Our floppies don't use track skewing, so you always lose about 3/4th of a revolution when seeking. Plenty of time.) > The track buffer would act as a cache. Inter-track seeking would > be a bit slowed by this, but the MSDOSFS should probably see a good > performance improvement, especially since locality dictates that > most of the interesting pieces of the FAT will be in one buffer > or the other. If msdosfs is too stupid to cache the FAT, that's nothing a device driver should fix. There's the entire buffer cache in between. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 23:22:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA24535 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:22:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (gregl1.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA24521 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:21:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id PAA15239; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 15:51:51 +0930 (CST) Message-ID: <19970914155151.53488@lemis.com> Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 15:51:51 +0930 From: Greg Lehey To: Mike Smith Cc: Terry Lambert , brian@awfulhak.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: rc & rc.conf References: <19970914151517.24823@lemis.com> <199709140609.PAA00821@word.smith.net.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199709140609.PAA00821@word.smith.net.au>; from Mike Smith on Sun, Sep 14, 1997 at 03:39:51PM +0930 Organisation: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8250 Fax: +61-8-8388-8250 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Fight-Spam-Now: http://www.cauce.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, Sep 14, 1997 at 03:39:51PM +0930, Mike Smith wrote: >> >> Yes, I'm not quite *that* stupid. We have two variables here: a >> -flags which is set with the flags, and an -enable which is set to >> either YES or NO. The original logic says "don't do it unless -enable >> is YES". Brian's saying "do it unless -enable is NO". I don't see an >> advantage in doing it this way, and I certainly don't see a disaster >> waiting to happen in the old way. > > The advantages are combined; consistency with all of the other similar > options, and by using "not NO", the _enable and _flags variables may > subsequently be combined. Well, sure, but he didn't do that. And that's the way it used to be with other flags, so somebody has deliberately specified an '-enable' and a '-flags' instead of combining them as a predicate. While checking this out, however, I came across the real reason: revision 1.129 date: 1997/06/18 16:01:18; author: pst; state: Exp; lines: +8 -3 Add cron_enable and inetd_enable flags to rc.conf. WARNING: don't update rc and forget to update rc.conf, or you won't be able to telnet back into your box after a reboot. Now I understand. But I don't think I agree. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 23:46:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA25411 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:46:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from GndRsh.aac.dev.com (GndRsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA25404; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:46:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by GndRsh.aac.dev.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) id XAA01160; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:46:34 -0700 (PDT) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199709140646.XAA01160@GndRsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: Patches on senderp-ppp.i-connect.net In-Reply-To: from Simon Shapiro at "Sep 13, 97 07:20:49 pm" To: Shimon@i-Connect.Net (Simon Shapiro) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:46:34 -0700 (PDT) Cc: freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL25 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Hi "Rodney W. Grimes"; On 14-Sep-97 you wrote: > > ... Some excellent advise delete ... > > > And this mail message is going to stop any of that???? > > Nope. We would like the code to stay available as much as we can, while > releasing us from much of the hassle. The steps you are indicating are > being implemented, one at a time. I personally would like to see as few as > possible, but many forces demands that I take some. If I can be of assistance in implementing these steps, ie a virtual ftp server running group passwords with a domain name of something like dpt.aac.dev.com and proper pre and post login banner messages it is not much of a hassle to create and host. Given the nature of what it is hosting there would be no cost to you for its. I could even handle email for it, if you wish a mailling list. It would take me about 5 business days to work it into my schedule and have it up and running on a T-1 connected hosting server within ASN-AAI. -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation, Inc. Reliable computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 23:50:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA25613 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:50:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA25602 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:50:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA01229 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:50:16 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id IAA09997; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:27:15 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970914082715.NY17691@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:27:15 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Do *you* have problems with floppies? References: <199709130622.BAA18777@nospam.hiwaay.net> <199709132104.OAA20111@usr08.primenet.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709132104.OAA20111@usr08.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Sep 13, 1997 21:04:52 +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Terry Lambert wrote: > > Any suggestions toward identifying FDC's with FIFO's? Preferably without > > taking something apart? > > Augh. Read the code! > > The driver already does what little chip detection is possible! But it does it wrong. Van Gilluwe (at least the first version) is wrong. The Linux driver seems more correct. I've never fixed this bug, since detecting the chip version is only important once we start to support 2.88 MB floppies. Starting to support this requires a major overhaul of the driver, since extending the existing one simply sucks. (I've tried it.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 23:50:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA25620 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:50:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA25608 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:50:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA01233; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:50:19 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id IAA10006; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:29:49 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970914082948.KW01034@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:29:48 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: joe@via.net (Joe McGuckin) Subject: Re: Multiple kernel src trees? References: X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: ; from Ken Stox on Sep 13, 1997 19:43:24 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Ken Stox wrote: > >Can I have multiple kernel src trees on a single machine? > >Are all the include files using relative paths? > > Sure, no problem. Look at /usr/src/release/Makefile. Warning, you'll > chew up alot of space with redundant obj's and binaries. Huh? He's talking about *kernel* trees. There's not very much overhead, perhaps 15 MB of .o files. But that's the same if you have multiple kernel compile directories in a single kernel source tree. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 23:50:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA25670 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:50:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA25652 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:50:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA01236 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:50:29 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.8.7/8.8.5) id IAA10019; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:31:49 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <19970914083149.SG24852@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:31:49 +0200 From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: nfs startup - perhaps it is a problem References: <199709132204.PAA29580@usr03.primenet.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.60_p2-3,5,8-9 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199709132204.PAA29580@usr03.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Sep 13, 1997 22:04:33 +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Terry Lambert wrote: > Except rlogind ignores the hosts file and does a DNS request > anyway when attempting to verify the source host for a user, > even if you have hosts first in host.conf. Who told you this? rlogind does a plain gethostbyaddr(), so it will use whatever address resolving gethostby*() is using. People without name servers wouldn't be able to use r services at all otherwise. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Sep 13 23:52:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA25835 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:52:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za (zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za [146.64.24.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA25830 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 23:52:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jhay@localhost) by zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA07487; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:52:21 +0200 (SAT) From: John Hay Message-Id: <199709140652.IAA07487@zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za> Subject: Re: rc & rc.conf In-Reply-To: <199709140609.PAA00821@word.smith.net.au> from Mike Smith at "Sep 14, 97 03:39:51 pm" To: mike@smith.net.au (Mike Smith) Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:52:21 +0200 (SAT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > Yes, I'm not quite *that* stupid. We have two variables here: a > > -flags which is set with the flags, and an -enable which is set to > > either YES or NO. The original logic says "don't do it unless -enable > > is YES". Brian's saying "do it unless -enable is NO". I don't see an > > advantage in doing it this way, and I certainly don't see a disaster > > waiting to happen in the old way. > > The advantages are combined; consistency with all of the other similar > options, and by using "not NO", the _enable and _flags variables may > subsequently be combined. > Hmmm. I'm not sure about the consistency. A "grep NO rc" leaves me with 3 variables that is checked against NO and "grep YES rc" leaves me with 9 variables checked against YES, although if you change this it will be 5 NO's against 7 YES's. BTW. The way I keep rc and rc.conf in sync is to make all my changes in rc.conf.local, so I can always just copy rc and rc.conf into /etc without worry that I'll clobber some of my local setup. John -- John Hay -- John.Hay@mikom.csir.co.za