From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Aug 8 11:14: 3 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mail.ftf.dk (mail.ftf.net [129.142.64.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7EA7414E3C; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 11:13:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from regnauld@ftf.net) Received: from ns.int.ftf.net (fw2.ftf.dk [192.168.1.2] (may be forged)) by mail.ftf.dk (8.9.3/8.9.3/gw-ftf-1.2) with ESMTP id UAA28671; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 20:09:10 +0200 (CEST) X-Authentication-Warning: mail.ftf.dk: Host fw2.ftf.dk [192.168.1.2] (may be forged) claimed to be ns.int.ftf.net Received: (from regnauld@localhost) by ns.int.ftf.net (8.9.2/8.9.3) id UAA94636; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 20:27:28 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19990808202728.35157@ns.int.ftf.net> Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 20:27:28 +0200 From: Phil Regnauld To: Hal Flynn Cc: Bill Swingle , chat@FreeBSD.ORG, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD at LinuxWorld References: <19990806172432.A12259@dub.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.88e In-Reply-To: ; from Hal Flynn on Fri, Aug 06, 1999 at 10:49:59PM -0400 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386 Organization: FTFnet Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hal Flynn writes: > affect of "FreeBSD, the next level" would draw a little attention. True, > not as much as scantily clad females, but somehow reaching into the > attention span long enough to draw an audience. Jordan in a bikini ? *shudder* -- Divizion by Zero error -- multiplying by zero to recover. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Aug 8 13:55:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from genesis.setjmp.net (genesis.setjmp.net [208.13.245.195]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4534B14EC1 for ; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 13:55:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eric@cfpower.com) Received: from Apophis (eric@[10.0.0.193]) by genesis.setjmp.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA39061; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 16:53:10 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from eric@cfpower.com) Message-ID: <002f01bee1e0$16404ff0$c100000a@cfpower.com> Reply-To: "Eric A. Griff" From: "Eric A. Griff" To: , References: <19990808034218.13104.rocketmail@web1005.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Marketing / Media Strategy Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 16:53:35 -0400 Organization: CFPower MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ----- Original Message ----- From: Brian McGroarty To: Sent: Saturday, August 07, 1999 11:42 PM Subject: Marketing / Media Strategy > Just as jumping into code production without design is the > formula for chaos and later back-tracking, lack of strategy in > media dealings yields very little reward for tremendous amounts > of effort expended. > > 1: We need to decide who we are trying to reach with what > message. PLEASE give me feedback on the following; > > I'll initially propose: > > Technical: > FreeBSD is stable > FreeBSD is secure > Learning FreeBSD means big $$$ A few things that may fall in this area... Drawing Ecommerce, and MiddleWare Environments to FreeBSD. This means getting close with Big Corporations (technical, and executive types). I am nudging for some work that might get me around Boston for a couple of weeks.. I have a few CEO/techies in mind to pay visits (crossing fingers).. You need to make friends before you sell.. Techs, talk code.. Execs, talk unatended Reliability, Cut Costs, increased productivity, and whatever saves/makes money, or covers what they enjoy in there spare time (tidbits). Another question here, is who can do what.. I don't have any problem, if I am somewhere, trying to walk in (suit/Tie), and shake a hand, and take 5 minutes of someones time, and then hand them a CD on the way out (unless they want me to stay longer =) All I want out of the deal, is to phaze NT Server/Linux out of clients systems, and replace it with FreeBSD, so I can be more effective with my time, and less split accross platforms.. While I think at the moment, NT is still the likely platform in these clients systems, the critical stuff isn't good on NT.. Servers, though a large need in that area is eCommerce, Web Middleware that makes fast paced Web Application development possible, and Strong Client Backends. These are where I make my money.. Automation is another issue, though that's just another reason FreeBSD (or any *nix) is my primary choice. My linux experiences have found that to be very disorganized in layout, and too easy to leave w/defaults that make it downright insecure. While I'd love to get a paid trip out to install, it's not often in my budgets.. I need to be able to have a central distribution, and a special floppy sent to the client, that gets there server setup to order.. FreeBSD is the number one platform for this. =) The team has done well to enable this, and continues to improve it. > Education: > FreeBSD represents the forefront in free OS development > FreeBSD is the next big thing It's also well layed out in a developers needs way. I've built scratch up build/designs in a week, just being able to find the library docs, source, and config files, and scripting support. In a similiar situation with RedHat 6, the attempt failed miserably. > Business: > FreeBSD has the lowest TCO > FreeBSD represents countless new opportunities > > Mainstream Press: > Flavor: What Torvalds has been doing for 5 years, this team has > been doing for 20. > Definition: FreeBSD is not Linux. > Hype: FreeBSD 4.0 is coming - Kiss your Windows goodbye How come linus isn't ever around #linux? I catch jkh and some others from the lists on #FreeBSD fairly frequent, and while jkh needs a slight memory upgrade, he is very informed, and has answers off the cuff that aren't necessarily in the handbook/FAQ. > Retail: > FreeBSD 4.0 is going to explode in a shower of confetti whenever > a customer glances its way. People are going to flock to you for > copies for FreeBSD 4.0 Retail version modifiable, and redistributable with minimal requirements.. So is downloaded version =) OR any other version..... You can distribute it with confidence.. > All: > FreeBSD is different. (See previous post) > Layed out well, and consistant. > > 2: We need a smooth, efficient system for press release delivery > and a quick way of deciding who should receive what. Is there an > existing contact database? I'm willing to begin work on this, > but I need to know if I'm extending something we've got or > starting something new. I'll pull the thoughts of an experienced press releaser I know (conventional, and net based). > > 3: We need advance planning from here straight through 4.0's > release. The release of a new major version number is a valuable > marketing asset. We need to be sure we don't get the hype > machine started too soon and lose momentum before release. If we > can have a steady flow two months prior to release, one in > general media, and if we can have media swamped by the time 4.0 > has been available a month, we can all be VERY proud. How can we > make a press timeline available to -advocacy members without > putting something sensitive on the main site? Upcoming list! IE, Future file along with ERRATA. This might help tune users ahead of time too.. > > 4: We need a press site. The existing list of press releases and > pointers to mentions in the press is nice. But we need clip art, > including a large logo, pictures of the Daemon, key developers > and screenshots. We need capsule summaries of FreeBSD and its > best assets. And we need a series of brief outlines which hint > at story ideas. You'd be surprised how few journalists' ideas > are actually their own. They have deadlines like the rest of us, > and feeding and nurturing ideas helps immeasurably. Respond with > pointers to what we've already got and I'll refine the list, > start the above outlines and we'll have a suitable starter > collection. Good man.. Good list... What can I do to help, and where do we start? Eric A. Griff , http://www.setjmp.com setjmp Software Your source for custom 181 Genesee Street Software Solutions. Suite 504 Utica, NY 13501 ICQ# 28146852 Office: (315) 734-1668 Extension 205 Home: (315) 495-2385 (seldom) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Aug 8 16:50:56 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from smtp03.primenet.com (smtp03.primenet.com [206.165.6.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A04C14E50 for ; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 16:50:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert@usr08.primenet.com) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp03.primenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA07545; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 16:47:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from usr08.primenet.com(206.165.6.208) via SMTP by smtp03.primenet.com, id smtpd007524; Sun Aug 8 16:47:38 1999 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA05404; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 16:47:33 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199908082347.QAA05404@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Authors notes for FreeBSD books To: jkh@zippy.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 23:47:33 +0000 (GMT) Cc: BMCGROARTY@high-voltage.com, jooji@webnology.com, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <1080.933972482@localhost> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 6, 99 01:48:02 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've changed the subject to be more accurate. I was going to call it "Jordan's call for FreeBSD books", but I find the current subject line more fitting. Jordan Hubbard writes: > > I think that there are already so many more obvious and clearly > detrimental shortcomings in FreeBSD's advocacy (lack of books, > magazines, trade shows and other press coverage) that anyone looking > at the mascot as an "issue" is a) barking up the wrong tree and > b) focusing their time and energy in the wrong direction. Jordan, I would like to address, in depth, the "books issue" you have raised. I would be more than happy to write a FreeBSD book (or two) *IFF* it would settle down from its moving target status long enough for there to be sufficient sales. For an internals book, this would mean: 1) Define standard interfaces in the kernel. 2) Commit to them for a (relatively) long time (e.g. 1.5 years, otherwise known as 3 full FreeBSD releases). The same goes for a "writing device drivers" book, or even something describing how to do any API-intensive user space work, using FreeBSD as a platform. The people who have never done a technical edit on a book, edited a book, or written a book (in increasing order of difficulty), seem to assume that books "just pop out". They don't. If they did, I have several requests currently outstanding from publishing companies that I would be able to accept, e.g. a book on configuring an IPv6 network (shame that couldn't also be a FreeBSD book, since I would find it more tempting to accept the offer, but FreeBSD is not sufficiently married to a particular IPv6 to allow this). I have done technical editing for Prentice Hall on several books, (you may have seen me specifically credited in the preface of one of them, "UNIX Internals: the new frontiers" by Vahalia) and even that light load was over three weeks (~130 hours) of work. I have eleven books in progress (none FreeBSD), and I have actually completed four books: two fiction (both looking for a non-vanity publisher), one technical about writing applications to use serial ports portably across many UNIX platforms (obsoleted before publication by the SVR4 convergence), and one technical about programming -- "C for Race Car Drivers" -- which was obsoleted while pending publication (it had been scheduled) by compiler technology removing the need to write C in certain ways to get faster and smaller executables (bad timing for the PC compiler war: another reason to hate Microsoft). I'm not willing to take on a book (again) that will be obsolete before its publication, and thus my works in progress are all either fiction (four), or topics which won't be easily obsoleted. Right now, that translates to "nothing with any technical depth for FreeBSD in the near future, unless the ground rules change". What it takes to write a book: ------------------------------ A book, even some of the small O'Reilly books, generally takes approximately 2000 hours of work to complete. This is one man year. [ Contrary to popular opinion, writing a book is not so simple as writing prose to a mailing list ] For it to be worthwhile for an author to engage in a book project, the project has to have an expected pay-out of at least one year's salary (and my salary is much higher than it was when I wrote the previous two), preferrably more, since writing is more draining, at least for me, than other work, and after a year of it, I would need a very long vacation. I think that anyone (who isn't naieve, or isn't writing a puff-piece to "compete" with the litter of Linux puff-pieces) will require some type of warrant that the target won't move, and make the book lose all value for the work invested. Even a typical puff-piece faces a currently uncertain future, e.g. with the threat of "The New Install System, Real Soon Now", and so on. On the plus side, a puff-piece can be done in ~6 man months, but this still makes it one release out of date, unless you hold it and reedit it very quickly following the release. A publisher is unlikely to agree to this without a hard/fast FreeBSD release date, since they need to schedule presses, channel identification, shipping, and any publicity, to coincide with a book held in abeyance for a final edit. The only way I can see where this would not be the case would be for a book that was a collaborative effort, to shorten the time to market to avoid the book getting stale. In general, collaborative efforts can't be too technical, and the overall editing pass to fix the tone of a multi-author book to a single tone (an irritating read will get terrible reviews) still must be done by a single person, and that can't be parallelized away (minimum, 160 hours: ~4 weeks). For a technical collaborative work, you will need ~120 hours of technical editing by at least three different people (more is better), and double the editing pass (a brief one before the technical edits are applied, a longer one, with reference to the authors, afterward, to integrate the various authors fixes). Note: collaborative works generally require the same (or a higher, given editing overhead) expected payout as individual works, and this means that you can only modify the time-to-market requirement, but the shelf-life requirement (time to obsolescence) can not be bypassed. Also, as a heads up: having many Linux distributions is actually a plus, both for the available fodder for puff-pieces, and for packing a CDROM in the plastic envelope in the back of the book. An author can rewrite the same book four (or more) times, under different pen names, choosing a different Linux each time, and reorganising, retitling, and reindexing chapters (I know of at least three Linux books that were produced from a single original manuscript using this formula; I've considered writing a Linux puff-piece to cash in, myself). Sort of the "Harlequin Romance" approach to technical writing... Too, you might consider getting rough translation of the Japanese FreeBSD books, in conjunction with an English editor, as one way to attack this problem. The downside to this is the fee split with the original author takes most of the incentive away for the translators and editor, and the international publication rights licensing issues can be thorny. Jordan is actually in the best position of anyone to exercise on this approach. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Aug 8 17:17:57 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from smtp02.primenet.com (smtp02.primenet.com [206.165.6.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 398BB15061 for ; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 17:17:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert@usr08.primenet.com) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp02.primenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA28564; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 17:16:11 -0700 (MST) Received: from usr08.primenet.com(206.165.6.208) via SMTP by smtp02.primenet.com, id smtpd028550; Sun Aug 8 17:16:06 1999 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA06151; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 17:16:04 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199908090016.RAA06151@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Marketing FreeBSD / FreeBSD as a product To: garbanzo@hooked.net (Alex Zepeda) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 00:16:04 +0000 (GMT) Cc: BMCGROARTY@high-voltage.com, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Alex Zepeda" at Aug 6, 99 06:41:10 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > - An attractive box with heavy contents adds $20 to software's perceived > > value. > > Nah, I really don't think so. Even so, getting a better desgin on the > package, really would not hurt in any way. I don't think as poorly as you > do of the current CD packaging (having never seen it in person); but I do > feel there's always room for improvement. An attractive box with heavy contents adds _immeasurably_ to software's percieved value. Take it from me: Century Software, where I worked and did things like approve PMT ready ad copy, and coauthored the user manual, with Tim O'Reilly, when there were less that 10 of us there and we all had to wear many hats, had the first boxed, shrink-wrapped application for UNIX. The box was designed by the Evan Tweede Agency (now Dahlen, Smith, Tweede) and was attractive. As it should be; the Tweede Agency had more awards (including many CLEO's) than I have seen at almost any other agency (they did the Mel Tillis TelAmerica commercial, for one). It was basically one of those "binder-in-box" things, which were popular with software companies back then (frankly, I miss them; the new soft-boxes simply lack heft, as well as lacking printed documentation). The ability to merely _show_ a shrink-wrapped box in our print advertising decimated our competition (Blast, M-Link, etc.), and basically won us the entire market (that, and we had ported to run on about 120 different UNIX platforms, the Mac, the PC, and VMS). In a UNIX World survey, the product, TERM, beat out UUCP for most used asynchronous communications software on UNIX systems. Several years running. Image is _very_ important. Without a box, we looked like a rinky-dink company, who might not be around in three months; with one, we were suddenly as permanent a structure as a building. Another FYI: if you do advertising, do it consistantly. It is more important to be in the magazine in a 1/3 page ad when the buyer intends to make a purchase decision, than it is to be in a full page ad every other month. Not being there _every time_ is also an indicator of a rinky-dink company who only places ads when they have the money to do it (never mind that most magazines have a 3 month lead time -- readers are ignorant of that). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Aug 8 17:23:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from smtp03.primenet.com (smtp03.primenet.com [206.165.6.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F33B14BFC for ; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 17:23:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert@usr08.primenet.com) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp03.primenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA17540; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 17:18:25 -0700 (MST) Received: from usr08.primenet.com(206.165.6.208) via SMTP by smtp03.primenet.com, id smtpd017476; Sun Aug 8 17:18:15 1999 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA06229; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 17:18:14 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199908090018.RAA06229@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Oracle for FreeBSD To: garbanzo@hooked.net (Alex Zepeda) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 00:18:13 +0000 (GMT) Cc: BMCGROARTY@high-voltage.com, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Alex Zepeda" at Aug 6, 99 06:41:10 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > P.S. A really neat idea might be a boxed Oracle distribution of some sort. > But oh wait, they've got Linux division; not a FreeBSD one. Hell some > sort of distribution including some big comercial package of choice would > really be neat (Oracle 8, Now with FreeBSD). There is already a FreeBSD port of Oracle. It runs on Oracle's (NCI's) FreeBSD based Network Computer server. It also runs on FreeBSD-current, if you tar it up and untar it, as someone who shall remain nameless has done to see if there were OS specific hooks built into the NC server FreeBSD kernel to support the database (there weren't). It's a matter of leveraging a big company that needs it (e.g. Yahoo) to get it released as a supported product on FreeBSD in general, instead of merely as a component of their NC server. It needs a corporate sponsor. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Aug 8 17:25:53 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from smtp03.primenet.com (smtp03.primenet.com [206.165.6.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7918014BFC; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 17:25:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert@usr08.primenet.com) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp03.primenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA19342; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 17:24:13 -0700 (MST) Received: from usr08.primenet.com(206.165.6.208) via SMTP by smtp03.primenet.com, id smtpd019302; Sun Aug 8 17:24:04 1999 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA06342; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 17:24:01 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199908090024.RAA06342@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: FreeBSD at LinuxWorld To: hal@achilles.gibralter.net (Hal Flynn) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 00:24:01 +0000 (GMT) Cc: unfurl@FreeBSD.ORG, chat@FreeBSD.ORG, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Hal Flynn" at Aug 6, 99 10:49:59 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Out of curiousity, how are you "bannerizing" your booth, Bill? I'll admit > that when I started using FreeBSD, I was from a Linux and SysV background, > and therefore not knowing what to expect (other than that fact that a > fellow SA at work swore by it). Label me crazy and write me off (as most > other allegedly sane people have), but I think that something to the > affect of "FreeBSD, the next level" would draw a little attention. True, > not as much as scantily clad females, but somehow reaching into the > attention span long enough to draw an audience. So would a graphic login by default, that doesn't look like a kernel horked up a hairball, and advertises the fact that the machines in the lab are running FreeBSD, not DOS. I know there is a lot of resistance to this idea, but when you see an idle Windows box, you *know* it's running Windows; when you see an idle FreeBSD box, the same is not true. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Aug 8 17:29:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2CFD914BFC for ; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 17:29:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from localhost (jkh@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA11445; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 17:25:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) To: Terry Lambert Cc: jkh@zippy.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard), BMCGROARTY@high-voltage.com, jooji@webnology.com, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Authors notes for FreeBSD books In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 08 Aug 1999 23:47:33 -0000." <199908082347.QAA05404@usr08.primenet.com> Date: Sun, 08 Aug 1999 17:25:53 -0700 Message-ID: <11441.934158353@localhost> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I would be more than happy to write a FreeBSD book (or two) *IFF* it > would settle down from its moving target status long enough for there > to be sufficient sales. For an internals book, this would mean: I doubt that's going to happen no matter what edicts are handed out, nor would enforcing stagnation in the name of documentation likely be a very good idea. I also tend to get far more requests for "beginner's books" from all the publishers I mentioned than for any "internals" books, as nice as that might be to have. In fact, I've yet to have a single publisher express interest in anything with much technical depth - they want "FreeBSD for ISPs" or "doing eCommerce with FreeBSD" or something suitably buzzwordy. As one publisher put it, "we want a Complete FreeBSD of our own to sell", and TCF isn't exactly an internals book by any stretch. - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Aug 8 18:16:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from smtp01.primenet.com (smtp01.primenet.com [206.165.6.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AFD3314BE2 for ; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 18:15:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert@usr08.primenet.com) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp01.primenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA00849; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 18:12:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from usr08.primenet.com(206.165.6.208) via SMTP by smtp01.primenet.com, id smtpd000835; Sun Aug 8 18:12:55 1999 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr08.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA07775; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 18:12:54 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199908090112.SAA07775@usr08.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Authors notes for FreeBSD books To: jkh@zippy.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 01:12:53 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, BMCGROARTY@high-voltage.com, jooji@webnology.com, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <11441.934158353@localhost> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 8, 99 05:25:53 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > I would be more than happy to write a FreeBSD book (or two) *IFF* it > > would settle down from its moving target status long enough for there > > to be sufficient sales. For an internals book, this would mean: > > I doubt that's going to happen no matter what edicts are handed out, > nor would enforcing stagnation in the name of documentation likely be > a very good idea. > > I also tend to get far more requests for "beginner's books" from all > the publishers I mentioned than for any "internals" books, as nice as > that might be to have. In fact, I've yet to have a single publisher > express interest in anything with much technical depth - they want > "FreeBSD for ISPs" or "doing eCommerce with FreeBSD" or something > suitably buzzwordy. As one publisher put it, "we want a Complete > FreeBSD of our own to sell", and TCF isn't exactly an internals book > by any stretch. A "FreeBSD for ISPs" book, I think, would have to have technical depth. It's currently my job at Whistle (an IBM company 8-)) to work on building up some NOC infrastructure, with the potential for technology transfer to clue-starved ISPs (NOC-in-a-box), and I have to say that the technical details are very important. A "FreeBSD for ISPs" book would fall into the category of "heavy API use in user space", from the posting to which you are replying. It requires a commitment to not change out from under the software in user space to make this work (API's are not _that_ fluid, but they are fluid enough to damage the utility/applicability/value of such a book). One of the titles I've been toying with writing for about 6 months now is "how to be a good ISP" (not necessarily FreeBSD specific enough for you, I know). While working on the issues of implementing a _good_ NOC, I've been faced a number of times with the shortcomings of "almost there" software. This is not to single out FreeBSD; the lack of DDNS support in the RADIUS servers out there (ala Microsoft's IAS, which has integrated dynamic updates of DNS records to support ETRN against dynamic IP addresses), and the ability to support more than 300 virtual domains hosted on a single mail server (ala Microsoft Exchange -- I have to send some sendmail multiple-queue support patches off to Eric), supporting split horizon DNS (it's so complex that I have submitted a BCP draft RFC on it to DNSEXT), etc., etc., is all quite challenging. The process definitely magnifies various foibles in the software that is available to run on FreeBSD (or Linux, for that matter), not just those of FreeBSD itself, for trying to build up such systems in the first place. Frankly, the free software community has failed to address productization issues that become obvious when you try to actually build such systems. I'm not (yet) qualified to write such a book based purely on practice and not "practice plus theory", but I will be, soon. I think your best bet for "FreeBSD for " type books would be to contact to get the things written. This is actually probably a good job for the people reading this on the -advocacy list: approach people in the FreeBSD gallery, and see if they will write "how to" books, or if they will let you document their setup in a "how to" book of your own. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Aug 8 18:31:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mail1.its.rpi.edu (mail1.its.rpi.edu [128.113.100.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF24F150A9 for ; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 18:31:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from drosih@rpi.edu) Received: from [128.113.24.47] (gilead.acs.rpi.edu [128.113.24.47]) by mail1.its.rpi.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA84958; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 21:28:17 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: drosih@mail.rpi.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19990806223121.T10541@forty-two.egroups.net> References: <19990807004844.28425.rocketmail@web1001.mail.yahoo.com> <2253.934001491@localhost> <19990806223121.T10541@forty-two.egroups.net> Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 21:28:25 -0400 To: Gregory Sutter From: Garance A Drosihn Subject: Re: Marketing FreeBSD / FreeBSD as a pr Cc: brian@pobox.com, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 10:31 PM -0700 8/6/99, Gregory Sutter wrote: >Jordan, > >You know how you're constantly talking about having huge numbers of >things that need to be done, and nobody actually doing them? Well... So, you start out by saying Jordan has complained about "nobody actually doing things". > > >On Fri, Aug 06, 1999 at 05:48:44PM -0700, Brian McGroarty wrote: > > > If the advocacy team wants to work on turning the FreeBSD > > > 4.0-RELEASE release into a major event, I'll contribute articles > >1. Brian will contribute articles. Which is to say, "Brian has not (as of yet) actually written any articles". > > > > on how it's helped me develop for the Nintendo 64, foot the bill > > > to enlist a couple artists' help in producing a nice cover and > >2. Brian will pay the bill for cover artwork for a CDROM. Which is to say, "Brian has not (as of yet) actually done anything to result in new cover artwork". > > > help strategize a nice PR maneuver to coincide with release. I > >3. Brian will assist with PR, something that is sorely needed. Which is to say, "Brian has done nothing for FreeBSD pr, except bitch about how everyone isn't pleased about all the things he has honestly offered to do". The offer is appreciated, but all *I* have noticed from Brian is the bitching in this thread. (note that I'm not anywhere near the inner circle of the freebsd project, I just like the OS and use it on one or two machines I run) > > > *strongly* believe in FreeBSD, and I'll do what I can to help it > > > along. > >4. He is planning unspecified future help in addition to the three > things above. Which is to say, "In addition to the above things that Brian has not done (as of yet), there are other things he also has not done, which would benefit FreeBSD once he actually does those things". Now, let me see. How is it that Jordan can complain about nobody actually DOING things? Doing. As in "done". As in past tense, as in you can point and say "See, this is DONE". > On Fri, Aug 06, 1999 at 09:51:31PM -0700, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: >> I've also said many times that anyone with better artwork to >> suggest need only step forward with said artwork and I'd be >> more than happy to consider it - where do you think the original >> "daemon walking out of a CD" artwork came from? > > You didn't say it to him. Jordan has said it multiple times in multiple mailing lists to just about anyone who will listen. Anyone waiting for an engraved invitation to them, personally, is expecting a little too much, me thinks. Now, you might thing "But Jordan should be thrilled at all these offers". Well, offers don't always pan out. Not even honest and well-intentioned offers. You might also ask "Why is this Garance character butting in?". Because I am one of those guys Jordan has had to deal with, who has also made honest offers. For the *3.0* CD, Jordan made a call for anyone and everyone to come up with artwork. That was over a year ago. I have a couple of ideas that I kind of like, and a friend of mine who does this kind of art work. It's been more than a year now, and between one thing or another we *still* haven't managed to submit anything. In all that time, Jordan has been quite encouraging. Whenever I send him mail (or comment on a mailing list), he has said "Hey, whenever you have something, send it in! If it won't work for a CD-cover, maybe we could use it for a T-shirt or something!". (and I really do mean to get something sent in soon, Jordan. honest, maybe even next week...). Given that the freebsd project constantly sees guys like me come along, you'll have to pardon people if they don't immediately swoon with ecstasy when you offer to do something "in the future". Also during that time, several others have come up with artwork of one form or another, and just announced it on this freebsd advocacy list. Even if people don't get all excited about the offers, I've never seen anyone anywhere complain about an ACTUAL (ie, "DONE") contribution. People might not want your artwork as a CD-cover either, in which case you'll be in the same boat as Jordan was after the waiter-Daemon... :-) In the words of Nike, "Just Do It". Don't bitch about it, just do it. --- Garance Alistair Drosehn = gad@eclipse.acs.rpi.edu Senior Systems Programmer or drosih@rpi.edu Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Aug 8 18:52: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mail1.its.rpi.edu (mail1.its.rpi.edu [128.113.100.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21F5515114 for ; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 18:51:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from drosih@rpi.edu) Received: from [128.113.24.47] (gilead.acs.rpi.edu [128.113.24.47]) by mail1.its.rpi.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA25946; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 21:50:03 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: drosih@mail.rpi.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <19990807004844.28425.rocketmail@web1001.mail.yahoo.com> <2253.934001491@localhost> <19990806223121.T10541@forty-two.egroups.net> Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 21:50:12 -0400 To: Gregory Sutter From: Garance A Drosihn Subject: Re: Marketing FreeBSD / FreeBSD as a pr Cc: brian@pobox.com, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 9:28 PM -0400 8/8/99, Garance A Drosihn wrote: >At 10:31 PM -0700 8/6/99, Gregory Sutter wrote: >>Jordan, >> >>You know how you're constantly talking about having huge numbers of >>things that need to be done, and nobody actually doing them? Well... > >So, you start out by saying Jordan has complained about "nobody >actually doing things". I then got a little carried away in replying to the many points of the message, and as a result I think my comments may not have come out quite the way I meant them... >Now, you might thing "But Jordan should be thrilled at all these >offers". Well, offers don't always pan out. Not even honest and >well-intentioned offers. You might also ask "Why is this Garance >character butting in?". Because I am one of those guys Jordan has >had to deal with, who has also made honest offers. This was really the main point of my message. Jordan (and others) may sound put-offish when offers are made, precisely because a lot of people do make honest offers, but may not live up to those offers right away. A year ago I would have bet money that my own artwork ideas would have been completed by Dec 1998 at the latest. There was absolutely no question in my mind that would have happened. And yet, well, assorted interruptions have put that off for nearly a year. If core-team people don't already know who you are (preferably via things you've already delivered on), then your offers aren't going to sound all that different from any other (generally) honest offers that they have heard before. --- Garance Alistair Drosehn = gad@eclipse.acs.rpi.edu Senior Systems Programmer or drosih@rpi.edu Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Aug 8 22: 0: 7 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mom.hooked.net (mom.hooked.net [206.80.6.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7A8A14BB8 for ; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 21:59:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garbanzo@hooked.net) Received: from fish.hooked.net (garbanzo@fish.hooked.net [206.80.6.48]) by mom.hooked.net (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA19860; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 21:58:10 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 21:58:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex Zepeda To: Terry Lambert Cc: BMCGROARTY@high-voltage.com, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Oracle for FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <199908090018.RAA06229@usr08.primenet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 9 Aug 1999, Terry Lambert wrote: > > P.S. A really neat idea might be a boxed Oracle distribution of some sort. > > But oh wait, they've got Linux division; not a FreeBSD one. Hell some > > sort of distribution including some big comercial package of choice would > > really be neat (Oracle 8, Now with FreeBSD). > > > There is already a FreeBSD port of Oracle. It runs on Oracle's > (NCI's) FreeBSD based Network Computer server. > > It also runs on FreeBSD-current, if you tar it up and untar it, > as someone who shall remain nameless has done to see if there > were OS specific hooks built into the NC server FreeBSD kernel to > support the database (there weren't). > > > It's a matter of leveraging a big company that needs it (e.g. Yahoo) > to get it released as a supported product on FreeBSD in general, > instead of merely as a component of their NC server. > > It needs a corporate sponsor. Yes, I've heard you mention this *numerous* times before; but that's why I think a boxed version of this would be cool. It wouldn't be hard to actually create, and would create something for VARs to sell that actually includes added value. - alex You better believe that marijuana can cause castration. Just suppose your girlfriend gets the munchies! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Aug 8 23:10:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mail.ftf.dk (mail.ftf.net [129.142.64.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DEE39150A5; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 23:10:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from regnauld@ftf.net) Received: from ns.int.ftf.net (fw2.ftf.dk [192.168.1.2] (may be forged)) by mail.ftf.dk (8.9.3/8.9.3/gw-ftf-1.2) with ESMTP id IAA07002; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 08:07:11 +0200 (CEST) X-Authentication-Warning: mail.ftf.dk: Host fw2.ftf.dk [192.168.1.2] (may be forged) claimed to be ns.int.ftf.net Received: (from regnauld@localhost) by ns.int.ftf.net (8.9.2/8.9.3) id IAA95583; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 08:25:34 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19990809082533.41181@ns.int.ftf.net> Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 08:25:33 +0200 From: Phil Regnauld To: Terry Lambert Cc: Hal Flynn , unfurl@FreeBSD.ORG, chat@FreeBSD.ORG, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD at LinuxWorld References: <199908090024.RAA06342@usr08.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.88e In-Reply-To: <199908090024.RAA06342@usr08.primenet.com>; from Terry Lambert on Mon, Aug 09, 1999 at 12:24:01AM +0000 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386 Organization: FTFnet Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Terry Lambert writes: > > So would a graphic login by default, that doesn't look like a > kernel horked up a hairball, and advertises the fact that the > machines in the lab are running FreeBSD, not DOS. Stimpy as FreeBSD mascot ? -- Divizion by Zero error -- multiplying by zero to recover. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 1:56: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC6C814F89; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 01:55:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.3/8.9.1) id KAA82367; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 10:52:07 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: Terry Lambert Cc: hal@achilles.gibralter.net (Hal Flynn), unfurl@FreeBSD.ORG, chat@FreeBSD.ORG, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD at LinuxWorld References: <199908090024.RAA06342@usr08.primenet.com> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 09 Aug 1999 10:52:06 +0200 In-Reply-To: Terry Lambert's message of "Mon, 9 Aug 1999 00:24:01 +0000 (GMT)" Message-ID: Lines: 10 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Terry Lambert writes: > So would a graphic login by default, that doesn't look like a > kernel horked up a hairball, and advertises the fact that the > machines in the lab are running FreeBSD, not DOS. Hmm, a graphics-aware getty? DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 4: 1:31 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (mail.palmerharvey.co.uk [62.172.109.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6706314D97 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 04:01:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Dom.Mitchell@palmerharvey.co.uk) Received: from ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk (unverified) by mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Mon, 09 Aug 1999 11:57:14 +0100 Received: from voodoo.pandhm.co.uk (VOODOO [10.100.35.12]) by ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) id QHYNLB6F; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 11:57:08 +0100 Received: from dom by voodoo.pandhm.co.uk with local (Exim 2.10 #1) id 11Dn7L-0000Va-00; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 11:57:23 +0100 Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 11:57:23 +0100 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: Bill Fumerola , Alex Zepeda , Mike Hoskins , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: advocacy site Message-Id: <19990809115723.A1888@voodoo.pandhm.co.uk> References: <2472.934002812@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.6i In-Reply-To: <2472.934002812@localhost>; from Jordan K. Hubbard on Fri, Aug 06, 1999 at 10:13:32PM -0700 From: Dominic Mitchell Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Aug 06, 1999 at 10:13:32PM -0700, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > Having to put someone who > only intends on being an occasional (but nonetheless valuable) > journalist though the commiters voting process is just too damn much > overhead for supporting a "slashdot" style site (which I believe is > needed - if it doesn't change at least once every other day, people > stop coming back). Seen squishdot? http://www.squishdot.org/ -- Dom Mitchell -- Palmer & Harvey McLane -- Unix Systems Administrator In Mountain View did Larry Wall Sedately launch a quiet plea: That DOS, the ancient system, shall On boxes pleasureless to all Run Perl though lack they C. -- ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. ********************************************************************** To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 4:35:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (mail.palmerharvey.co.uk [62.172.109.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F5D714E63 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 04:35:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Dom.Mitchell@palmerharvey.co.uk) Received: from ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk (unverified) by mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Mon, 09 Aug 1999 12:32:12 +0100 Received: from voodoo.pandhm.co.uk (VOODOO [10.100.35.12]) by ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) id QHYNLB7M; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 12:32:06 +0100 Received: from dom by voodoo.pandhm.co.uk with local (Exim 2.10 #1) id 11DnfC-0000X7-00; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 12:32:22 +0100 Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 12:32:22 +0100 To: Joel Sutton Cc: brian@pobox.com, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: [ADV] Marketing / Differentiating FreeBSD Message-Id: <19990809123221.B1888@voodoo.pandhm.co.uk> References: <19990808025724.13926.rocketmail@web1001.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.6i In-Reply-To: ; from Joel Sutton on Sun, Aug 08, 1999 at 01:09:04PM +1000 From: Dominic Mitchell Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Aug 08, 1999 at 01:09:04PM +1000, Joel Sutton wrote: > how about: > > o email support responses usually within a couple of hours > > o can run a number of "industry standard" packages such as Samba, Apache, > Bind, Sendmail, Qmail etc.. (drop some names instead of just saying > "the ports collection") Or maybe even: "Open Source[tm] software compatible!" To throw in with buzzword of the day. :-) -- Dom Mitchell -- Palmer & Harvey McLane -- Unix Systems Administrator In Mountain View did Larry Wall Sedately launch a quiet plea: That DOS, the ancient system, shall On boxes pleasureless to all Run Perl though lack they C. -- ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. ********************************************************************** To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 4:36:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mgw01.wxs.nl (mgw01.wxs.nl [195.121.6.48]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64D931502C for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 04:36:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from skywise@wxs.nl) Received: from po03.wxs.nl (po03.wxs.nl [195.121.6.43]) by mgw01.wxs.nl (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id NAA05579 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 13:32:42 +0200 Received: from webmail ([195.121.6.34]) by po03.wxs.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 3.61) with SMTP id AAA11E2 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 13:32:42 +0200 From: Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai To: advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: Windows2000 test X-Posting-Host: 212.136.251.87 [212.136.251.87] X-Posting-UID: skywise X-Mailer: Netscape Messenger Express 3.5 [Mozilla/4.04 [en]C-UUNETBCBV3 (Win95; I)] Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 13:32:42 +0200 Message-ID: <77278DCFCAA.AAA11E2@po03.wxs.nl> Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, well don't be misled by the topic, but I just wanted to inform you all about this dumb betatest. Apparantly the Windows 2000 OS suffered from the DoS attack we all know as the TCP SYN attacks. Also the machine still needs to be rebooted a lot whenever settings are being changed. All in all, judging from this I'll think I'll stick to FreeBSD and it's handy dandy sysctl and TCP/IP stack =) Cheers mates! Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 5: 4:37 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from voyager.bxscience.edu (voyager.bxscience.edu [167.206.32.174]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62C6114DED for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 05:04:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from stuyman@confusion.net) Received: from confusion.net (choates1-bp-57.dartmouth.edu [129.170.46.57]) by voyager.bxscience.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id IAA27708; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 08:00:10 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <37AEC1C8.3663A849@confusion.net> Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 07:55:52 -0400 From: Laurence Berland X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dominic Mitchell Cc: Joel Sutton , brian@pobox.com, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: [ADV] Marketing / Differentiating FreeBSD References: <19990808025724.13926.rocketmail@web1001.mail.yahoo.com> <19990809123221.B1888@voodoo.pandhm.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG don't you mean "Open Source software compatible!" Open Source isn't a trademark, a copyright, or anything else that would prevent me from claiming the windows 2000 is open source, except perhaps a false advertising law suit. Dominic Mitchell wrote: > > > Or maybe even: > > "Open Source[tm] software compatible!" > > To throw in with buzzword of the day. :-) > -- > Dom Mitchell -- Palmer & Harvey McLane -- Unix Systems Administrator > > In Mountain View did Larry Wall > Sedately launch a quiet plea: > That DOS, the ancient system, shall > On boxes pleasureless to all > Run Perl though lack they C. > -- > ********************************************************************** > This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and > intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they > are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify > the system manager. > > This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by > MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. > ********************************************************************** > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 9:56:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from vnode.vmunix.com (vnode.vmunix.com [209.112.4.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5FB6115269 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 09:56:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chrisc@vmunix.com) Received: from localhost (chrisc@localhost) by vnode.vmunix.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA17543; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 12:51:50 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 12:51:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Chris Coleman To: Gregory Sutter Cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , brian@pobox.com, Wes Peters , freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Marketing FreeBSD / FreeBSD as a pr In-Reply-To: <19990806223121.T10541@forty-two.egroups.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG My wife is currently working on a FreeBSD 4.0 CD cover. Her work will not be free, but it should be very good. Chris Coleman Daemon News Editor in Chief http://www.daemonnews.org Bringing BSD together On Fri, 6 Aug 1999, Gregory Sutter wrote: > Jordan, > > You know how you're constantly talking about having huge numbers of > things that need to be done, and nobody actually doing them? Well... > > >On Fri, Aug 06, 1999 at 05:48:44PM -0700, Brian McGroarty wrote: > > > If the advocacy team wants to work on turning the FreeBSD > > > 4.0-RELEASE release into a major event, I'll contribute articles > > 1. Brian will contribute articles. > > > > on how it's helped me develop for the Nintendo 64, foot the bill > > > to enlist a couple artists' help in producing a nice cover and > > 2. Brian will pay the bill for cover artwork for a CDROM. > > > > help strategize a nice PR maneuver to coincide with release. I > > 3. Brian will assist with PR, something that is sorely needed. > > > > *strongly* believe in FreeBSD, and I'll do what I can to help it > > > along. > > 4. He is planning unspecified future help in addition to the three > things above. > > On Fri, Aug 06, 1999 at 09:51:31PM -0700, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > I've also said many times that anyone with better artwork to suggest > > need only step forward with said artwork and I'd be more than happy to > > consider it - where do you think the original "daemon walking out of a > > CD" artwork came from? > > You didn't say it to him. > > > I've also since spent around $1500 commissioning various bits of > > artwork which nobody seems to like, so if people really have a jones > > to see new artwork they're going to have to start drawing it and > > sending it in because I'm tired of throwing money away. > > You won't have to throw money away. Brian has graciously offered > to have it drawn at no charge to FreeBSD or Walnut Creek. > > > > But first TPTB need to accept that marketing and presentation > > > are every bit as important as anything else in realizing broad > > > distribution. Even breaking in media takes something that looks > > > > Of course we realize that, we're not idiots. However, I fail to see > > how your original comments attacking the daemon constitute a "positive > > contribution" to changing this. > > This was a preliminary suggestion, and was quickly withdrawn when the > result of the suggestion became apparent. Not everyone is intimately > familiar with the innards of BSD culture. A lesson was learned, and > the other offers still extended. You are fixating on one point, and > that point was a quickly dropped part of an offer to do service for > the FreeBSD Project. I cannot believe that you are so hostile > toward potential contributions. You should reread and think about > this offer again, if it's not too late. > > Greg > -- > Gregory S. Sutter Computing is a terminal addiction. > mailto:gsutter@pobox.com > http://www.pobox.com/~gsutter/ > PGP DSS public key 0x40AE3052 > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 10:10: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from genesis.setjmp.net (genesis.setjmp.net [208.13.245.195]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5A71150D2 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 10:10:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from eric@setjmp.com) Received: from Apophis ([10.0.0.193]) by genesis.setjmp.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id NAA26060 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 13:04:52 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from eric@setjmp.com) Message-ID: <000901bee289$3b7f54b0$c100000a@cfpower.com> From: "Eric A. Griff" To: Subject: Fw: Intelligence.Com Developer Edition, Monday 8/9/99 Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 13:04:23 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Intelligence.Com Developer Edition, Monday 8/9/99 > --------------------------------------- > Embedded Systems/RTOS > --------------------------------------- > Microsoft to release Windows NT for embedded applications (CNET News) > http://www.intelligence.com/detail.asp?id=zz57562 > > --------------------------------------- > Linux > --------------------------------------- > Red Hat IPO to cap busy Linux trade show (CNET News) > http://www.intelligence.com/detail.asp?id=zz57572 > > LinuxWorld: Product flood (PC Week) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 11:32:36 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from forty-two.egroups.net (teapot.findmail.com [206.16.70.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 715AB14F66 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 11:32:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gsutter@forty-two.egroups.net) Received: (from gsutter@localhost) by forty-two.egroups.net (8.9.3/8.9.2) id LAA60659; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 11:29:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gsutter) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 11:29:36 -0700 From: Gregory Sutter To: Dominic Mitchell Cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , Bill Fumerola , Alex Zepeda , Mike Hoskins , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: advocacy site Message-ID: <19990809112936.O51428@forty-two.egroups.net> References: <2472.934002812@localhost> <19990809115723.A1888@voodoo.pandhm.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <19990809115723.A1888@voodoo.pandhm.co.uk>; from Dominic Mitchell on Mon, Aug 09, 1999 at 11:57:23AM +0100 Organization: Zer0 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Aug 09, 1999 at 11:57:23AM +0100, Dominic Mitchell wrote: > On Fri, Aug 06, 1999 at 10:13:32PM -0700, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > Having to put someone who > > only intends on being an occasional (but nonetheless valuable) > > journalist though the commiters voting process is just too damn much > > overhead for supporting a "slashdot" style site (which I believe is > > needed - if it doesn't change at least once every other day, people > > stop coming back). > > Seen squishdot? http://www.squishdot.org/ Whoa! That's pretty cool, and Zope looks like a really nice system. Of course, I'm partial toward Python- based systems... Greg -- Gregory S. Sutter "How do I read this file?" mailto:gsutter@pobox.com "You uudecode it." http://www.pobox.com/~gsutter/ "I I I decode it?" PGP DSS public key 0x40AE3052 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 11:55:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58DD715641; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 11:54:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id LAA25842; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 11:49:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omni.xylan.com by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id LAA20209; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 11:44:54 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com (dyn5.utah.xylan.com) by omni.xylan.com (4.1/SMI-4.1 (xylan engr [SPOOL])) id AA13162; Mon, 9 Aug 99 11:49:10 PDT Message-Id: <37AF22A5.D2CA6028@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 12:49:09 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Terry Lambert Cc: Hal Flynn , unfurl@FreeBSD.ORG, chat@FreeBSD.ORG, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD at LinuxWorld References: <199908090024.RAA06342@usr08.primenet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Terry Lambert wrote: > > > Out of curiousity, how are you "bannerizing" your booth, Bill? I'll admit > > that when I started using FreeBSD, I was from a Linux and SysV background, > > and therefore not knowing what to expect (other than that fact that a > > fellow SA at work swore by it). Label me crazy and write me off (as most > > other allegedly sane people have), but I think that something to the > > affect of "FreeBSD, the next level" would draw a little attention. True, > > not as much as scantily clad females, but somehow reaching into the > > attention span long enough to draw an audience. > > So would a graphic login by default, that doesn't look like a > kernel horked up a hairball, and advertises the fact that the > machines in the lab are running FreeBSD, not DOS. > > I know there is a lot of resistance to this idea, but when you > see an idle Windows box, you *know* it's running Windows; when > you see an idle FreeBSD box, the same is not true. It is on mine. I use the wdm login manager from WindowMaker, and the "daemon looking over the wasteland" screen background. One of these days I'm going to replace the planet earth in the little login box with a daemon logo also. The next step would be to make a standard "workstation" configuration button that installs all of this with one (or a few) knobs in sysinstall. The image is available as part of the FreeBSD theme available at themes.org; everything else is vanilla WindowMaker straight from port kits. Maybe I should just write a book... -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://softweyr.com/ wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 13:15:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D382314FBE; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 13:15:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id NAA27083; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 13:13:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omni.xylan.com by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id NAA23495; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 13:08:52 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com (dyn5.utah.xylan.com) by omni.xylan.com (4.1/SMI-4.1 (xylan engr [SPOOL])) id AA17607; Mon, 9 Aug 99 13:13:13 PDT Message-Id: <37AF3657.4F6CDBDD@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 14:13:11 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: advocacy@freebsd.org, chat@freebsd.org Subject: AMD Frequently Asked Questions Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Did anyone catch the list of products compatible with the Athlon processor (the CPU formerly known as K7) on the AMD web site? http://www1.amd.com/products/cpg/compatibility/catsearch/result/1,1372,4,00.html?cat=Operating+Systems&hw_sw=sw They specifically mention FreeBSD: Free BSD 2.0 Operating Systems Free BSD 2.0.5 Operating Systems Free BSD 2.1.5 Operating Systems Free BSD 2.2.2 Operating Systems Free BSD 2.2.8 Operating Systems Free BSD 3.0 Operating Systems ;^) -- Wes To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 14:20:21 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from exegrnnts001.seattleu.edu (exegrnnts001.seattleu.edu [206.81.198.91]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7FD914D75; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 14:20:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hodeleri@seattleu.edu) Received: from seattleu.edu (ppp36.pm3a.wport.com [206.129.99.134]) by exegrnnts001.seattleu.edu with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) id QS0G62NT; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 14:18:06 -0700 Message-ID: <37AF45A5.E5A117FC@seattleu.edu> Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 14:18:29 -0700 From: Eric Hodel Organization: Dis X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.2-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Wes Peters Cc: advocacy@freebsd.org, chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: AMD Frequently Asked Questions References: <37AF3657.4F6CDBDD@softweyr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Wes Peters wrote: > > Did anyone catch the list of products compatible with the Athlon processor > (the CPU formerly known as K7) on the AMD web site? What about -current? -- Eric Hodel hodeleri@seattleu.edu "They cook your gonies" -Terry Lambert's uncle on why he doesn't have a microwave To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 14:31:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from lariat.lariat.org (lariat.lariat.org [206.100.185.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 832B414D75; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 14:31:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brett@lariat.org) Received: from mustang (IDENT:ppp0.lariat.org@lariat.lariat.org [206.100.185.2]) by lariat.lariat.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA10401; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 15:29:03 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <4.2.0.58.19990809152315.041da7c0@localhost> X-Sender: brett@localhost X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 15:28:58 -0600 To: Eric Hodel , Wes Peters From: Brett Glass Subject: Re: AMD Frequently Asked Questions Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, chat@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <37AF45A5.E5A117FC@seattleu.edu> References: <37AF3657.4F6CDBDD@softweyr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I don't know about -current, but 3.2-RELEASE works fine. On my test system (nominally 600 MHz, though the BIOS reports 616 MHz) a soup-to-nuts "make world" took 49 minutes. This is with a Quantum Fireball ATAPI drive. --Brett At 02:18 PM 8/9/99 -0700, Eric Hodel wrote: >Wes Peters wrote: > > > > Did anyone catch the list of products compatible with the Athlon processor > > (the CPU formerly known as K7) on the AMD web site? > >What about -current? > >-- >Eric Hodel >hodeleri@seattleu.edu > >"They cook your gonies" > -Terry Lambert's uncle on why he doesn't have a microwave > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 14:32:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from smtp05.primenet.com (smtp05.primenet.com [206.165.6.135]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5757514D75 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 14:32:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert@usr06.primenet.com) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp05.primenet.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) id OAA47792; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 14:30:24 -0700 Received: from usr06.primenet.com(206.165.6.206) via SMTP by smtp05.primenet.com, id smtpdX3ZYya; Mon Aug 9 14:30:19 1999 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr06.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA16268; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 14:30:08 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199908092130.OAA16268@usr06.primenet.com> Subject: Re: Oracle for FreeBSD To: garbanzo@hooked.net (Alex Zepeda) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 21:30:08 +0000 (GMT) Cc: tlambert@primenet.com, BMCGROARTY@high-voltage.com, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Alex Zepeda" at Aug 8, 99 09:58:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > There is already a FreeBSD port of Oracle. It runs on Oracle's > > (NCI's) FreeBSD based Network Computer server. > > > > It also runs on FreeBSD-current, if you tar it up and untar it, > > as someone who shall remain nameless has done to see if there > > were OS specific hooks built into the NC server FreeBSD kernel to > > support the database (there weren't). > > > > > > It's a matter of leveraging a big company that needs it (e.g. Yahoo) > > to get it released as a supported product on FreeBSD in general, > > instead of merely as a component of their NC server. > > > > It needs a corporate sponsor. > > Yes, I've heard you mention this *numerous* times before; but that's why I > think a boxed version of this would be cool. It wouldn't be hard to > actually create, and would create something for VARs to sell that actually > includes added value. The thing is, there isn't going to be the possiblity of boxing both FreeBSD and "Oracle for FreeBSD" together, unless "Oracle for FreeBSD" is made available first. There is a crying need for a large Oracle user, FreeBSD user, or both, to commit to a large enough unit purchase to cause the product to be supported. Since Oracle uses the product internally, this is clearly an issue of amortization of support costs, particularly including the increased supoort costs associated with active platform developement taking place (Oracle can be guaranteed that, on their release of FreeBSD, that the product will remain relatively stable). This is clearly an API mutability and product life cycle issue. The tack to take seems to me to be to ensure that the "big user" that the advocates get to come forward specify a particular FreeBSD -RELEASE on which the software is supported, and guarantee that there is no support that Oracle will have to put up with for any more recent platform releases and/or -STABLE versions which later occur. By far, the largest exposure for a commercial company considering a port to any platform is the risk that the platform will change, and cause the software not to run. I rememebr a concrete example of this, when SCO changed the tty ring buffers from 32 to 24 characters on Xenix 3.1; this change broke a lot of software that was running the buffers at greater than 24 characters per lbolt. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 18:45:19 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from jade.chc-chimes.com (jade.chc-chimes.com [216.28.46.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE09D152EA for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 18:45:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from billf@jade.chc-chimes.com) Received: by jade.chc-chimes.com (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 5772E1C0F; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 20:43:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jade.chc-chimes.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 481EF3816; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 20:43:58 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 20:43:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Bill Fumerola To: Terry Lambert Cc: Alex Zepeda , BMCGROARTY@high-voltage.com, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Oracle for FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <199908092130.OAA16268@usr06.primenet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 9 Aug 1999, Terry Lambert wrote: > There is a crying need for a large Oracle user, FreeBSD user, or > both, to commit to a large enough unit purchase to cause the product > to be supported. 6 CPU x unlimited web license = $120k That is my existing licensing. If I had Oracle/FreeBSD I would have more. I'm not a Yahoo, but I'm sure there are other midsize companies who have equally sizable accounts. -- - bill fumerola - billf@chc-chimes.com - BF1560 - computer horizons corp - - ph:(800) 252-2421 - bfumerol@computerhorizons.com - billf@FreeBSD.org - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 20:35:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mail1.atl.bellsouth.net (mail1.atl.bellsouth.net [205.152.0.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F3EE41533B; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 20:35:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wghicks@bellsouth.net) Received: from wghicks.bellsouth.net (host-216-78-32-223.ath.bellsouth.net [216.78.32.223]) by mail1.atl.bellsouth.net (3.3.0/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA10066; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 23:29:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from wghicks.bellsouth.net (wghicks@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by wghicks.bellsouth.net (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id XAA05443; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 23:35:44 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net) Message-Id: <199908100335.XAA05443@bellsouth.net> To: Wes Peters Cc: Terry Lambert , Hal Flynn , unfurl@FreeBSD.ORG, chat@FreeBSD.ORG, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: FreeBSD at LinuxWorld In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 09 Aug 1999 12:49:09 MDT." <37AF22A5.D2CA6028@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 23:35:44 -0400 From: W Gerald Hicks Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > It is on mine. I use the wdm login manager from WindowMaker, Actually not from Window Maker... It's got quite a few, erm, 'features' too. The person who derived it from xdm told me he wasn't interested in maintaining it so I don't expect the problems to be fixed soon :-( > and the "daemon looking over the wasteland" screen background. Heh... I always interpreted this as the "daemon facing the sun over the wasteland it has created" > One of these days I'm going to replace the planet earth in the > little login box with a daemon logo also. The next step would > be to make a standard "workstation" configuration button that > installs all of this with one (or a few) knobs in sysinstall. I haven't looked at it in a while but 'Login.App' is a nice and lightweight console utility which also doesn't break xdm function- ality like wdm does. It would make a very nice port if dressed up for FreeBSD, but unfortunately I'm too busy right now... Cheers, Jerry Hicks wghicks@bellsouth.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 20:58:46 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from voyager.fisicc-ufm.edu (pm1a-s16.guate.net [200.12.57.94]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A9DE1538F for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 20:58:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obonilla@voyager.fisicc-ufm.edu) Received: (from obonilla@localhost) by voyager.fisicc-ufm.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA02632; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 17:14:17 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from obonilla) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 17:14:17 -0600 From: Oscar Bonilla To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: Bill Fumerola , Alex Zepeda , Mike Hoskins , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: advocacy site Message-ID: <19990809171416.A2604@fisicc-ufm.edu> References: <2680.934004202@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.6i In-Reply-To: <2680.934004202@localhost>; from Jordan K. Hubbard on Fri, Aug 06, 1999 at 10:36:42PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Aug 06, 1999 at 10:36:42PM -0700, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > I think the opposite is true, actually. If people are able to sign up > and submit new content through a couple of very simple, > straight-forward web forms, I think the number of people willing and > able to help will increase logarithmically. > didn't you mean exponentially? :) -Oscar -- For PGP Public Key: finger obonilla@fisicc-ufm.edu To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 21:13:45 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from neptune.psn.net (neptune.psn.net [207.211.58.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BAC0214EB6 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 21:13:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from andrews@technologist.com) Received: from 5042-243.008.popsite.net ([209.224.140.243] helo=shadow.blackdawn.com) by neptune.psn.net with esmtp (PSN Internet Service 2.12 #3) for advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG id 11E3Fq-0003xN-00; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 21:11:20 -0700 Content-Length: 376 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <19990809171416.A2604@fisicc-ufm.edu> Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 00:11:01 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: Will Andrews From: Will Andrews To: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: advocacy site Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 09-Aug-99 Oscar Bonilla wrote: > didn't you mean exponentially? :) Actually, I'm sure he didn't. Logarithmic graphs seem more accurate as the overall clue level of Internet users decreases. };> If the graph is time vs. contributors, it makes sense that after awhile the number of contributors will begin to slow down somewhat. -- Will Andrews To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 22:28:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE39C14DDE; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 22:28:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id WAA03279; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 22:25:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omni.xylan.com by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id WAA19251; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 22:20:44 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com ([204.68.178.39]) by omni.xylan.com (4.1/SMI-4.1 (xylan engr [SPOOL])) id AA14734; Mon, 9 Aug 99 22:25:05 PDT Message-Id: <37AFB7B0.792CE05E@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 23:25:04 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Brett Glass Cc: Eric Hodel , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: AMD Frequently Asked Questions References: <37AF3657.4F6CDBDD@softweyr.com> <4.2.0.58.19990809152315.041da7c0@localhost> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Brett Glass wrote: > > I don't know about -current, but 3.2-RELEASE works fine. On my test > system (nominally 600 MHz, though the BIOS reports 616 MHz) a soup-to-nuts > "make world" took 49 minutes. This is with a Quantum Fireball ATAPI drive. Mmm... compu-lust is *definitely* setting in. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://softweyr.com/ wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 23:49: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from high-voltage.com (voltage.high-voltage.com [205.243.158.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 21CE414D70 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 23:48:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from BMCGROARTY@high-voltage.com) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 1:21 -0600 From: "Brian McGroarty" To: "Chris Coleman" Cc: "freebsd-advocacy" Subject: RE: Re: Marketing FreeBSD / FreeBSD as a pr Message-ID: <8D78D2FFB44AD31186D40008C7333C82@high-voltage.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Chris - I'd appreciate an opportunity to preview where she's going with that if she's amenable. I'm negotiating with a couple of our designers today to get the ball rolling on a flashier box design. I'm wordsmithing some of the feature & strength lists from this week and a peer review list coming soon. I'd also like to get my hands on the sources for the current FreeBSD box. An uncut box or a box would be a big plus too; I want to see the dimensions of the cut sheet. Never know. We might be able to print finger puppets, daemon pogs or something equally silly for trade shows in the discards. -----Original Message----- From: Chris Coleman [mailto:chrisc@vmunix.com] Sent: Monday, August 09, 1999 10:51 AM To: Brian McGroarty; Gregory Sutter Cc: Jordan K. Hubbard; brian; Wes Peters; freebsd-advocacy Subject: Re: Marketing FreeBSD / FreeBSD as a pr My wife is currently working on a FreeBSD 4.0 CD cover. Her work will not be free, but it should be very good. Chris Coleman Daemon News Editor in Chief http://www.daemonnews.org Bringing BSD together On Fri, 6 Aug 1999, Gregory Sutter wrote: > Jordan, > > You know how you're constantly talking about having huge numbers of > things that need to be done, and nobody actually doing them? Well... > > >On Fri, Aug 06, 1999 at 05:48:44PM -0700, Brian McGroarty wrote: > > > If the advocacy team wants to work on turning the FreeBSD > > > 4.0-RELEASE release into a major event, I'll contribute articles > > 1. Brian will contribute articles. > > > > on how it's helped me develop for the Nintendo 64, foot the bill > > > to enlist a couple artists' help in producing a nice cover and > > 2. Brian will pay the bill for cover artwork for a CDROM. > > > > help strategize a nice PR maneuver to coincide with release. I > > 3. Brian will assist with PR, something that is sorely needed. > > > > *strongly* believe in FreeBSD, and I'll do what I can to help it > > > along. > > 4. He is planning unspecified future help in addition to the three > things above. > > On Fri, Aug 06, 1999 at 09:51:31PM -0700, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > I've also said many times that anyone with better artwork to suggest > > need only step forward with said artwork and I'd be more than happy to > > consider it - where do you think the original "daemon walking out of a > > CD" artwork came from? > > You didn't say it to him. > > > I've also since spent around $1500 commissioning various bits of > > artwork which nobody seems to like, so if people really have a jones > > to see new artwork they're going to have to start drawing it and > > sending it in because I'm tired of throwing money away. > > You won't have to throw money away. Brian has graciously offered > to have it drawn at no charge to FreeBSD or Walnut Creek. > > > > But first TPTB need to accept that marketing and presentation > > > are every bit as important as anything else in realizing broad > > > distribution. Even breaking in media takes something that looks > > > > Of course we realize that, we're not idiots. However, I fail to see > > how your original comments attacking the daemon constitute a "positive > > contribution" to changing this. > > This was a preliminary suggestion, and was quickly withdrawn when the > result of the suggestion became apparent. Not everyone is intimately > familiar with the innards of BSD culture. A lesson was learned, and > the other offers still extended. You are fixating on one point, and > that point was a quickly dropped part of an offer to do service for > the FreeBSD Project. I cannot believe that you are so hostile > toward potential contributions. You should reread and think about > this offer again, if it's not too late. > > Greg > -- > Gregory S. Sutter Computing is a terminal addiction. > mailto:gsutter@pobox.com > http://www.pobox.com/~gsutter/ > PGP DSS public key 0x40AE3052 > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Aug 9 23:50:34 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from zabagek.ihf.rwth-aachen.de (zabagek.ihf.RWTH-Aachen.DE [134.130.90.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0007314E1A; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 23:50:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tg@zabagek.ihf.rwth-aachen.de) Received: (from tg@localhost) by zabagek.ihf.rwth-aachen.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA69422; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 08:49:44 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from tg) To: W Gerald Hicks Cc: Wes Peters , Terry Lambert , Hal Flynn , unfurl@FreeBSD.ORG, chat@FreeBSD.ORG, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, wghicks@wghicks.bellsouth.net Subject: Re: FreeBSD at LinuxWorld References: <199908100335.XAA05443@bellsouth.net> From: Thomas Gellekum In-Reply-To: W Gerald Hicks's message of "Mon, 09 Aug 1999 23:35:44 -0400" Date: 10 Aug 1999 08:49:43 +0200 Message-ID: Lines: 14 User-Agent: Gnus/5.070095 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.95) XEmacs/20.4 (Emerald) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG W Gerald Hicks writes: > > It is on mine. I use the wdm login manager from WindowMaker, > > Actually not from Window Maker... It's got quite a few, erm, > 'features' too. The person who derived it from xdm told me > he wasn't interested in maintaining it so I don't expect the > problems to be fixed soon :-( There's a patched version at . Maybe the author is open to suggestions. tg To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Aug 10 2:32:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B665814D04 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 02:32:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA02025; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 11:27:01 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: brian@pobox.com Cc: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Marketing / Alternate packaging References: <19990808022930.19708.rocketmail@web1003.mail.yahoo.com> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 10 Aug 1999 11:27:01 +0200 In-Reply-To: Brian McGroarty's message of "Sat, 7 Aug 1999 19:29:30 -0700 (PDT)" Message-ID: Lines: 11 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Brian McGroarty writes: > For what it's worth, if you -can- get Michelle Pfeiffer to model > a latex daemon suit for the catalog, I strongly suggest you do. > Breasts can sell anything. Shiny red latex body suits start > religions. This belongs in fortunes.dat. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Aug 10 2:37:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 586CF14D04 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 02:37:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA02034; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 11:34:20 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: Laurence Berland Cc: Dominic Mitchell , Joel Sutton , brian@pobox.com, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: [ADV] Marketing / Differentiating FreeBSD References: <19990808025724.13926.rocketmail@web1001.mail.yahoo.com> <19990809123221.B1888@voodoo.pandhm.co.uk> <37AEC1C8.3663A849@confusion.net> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 10 Aug 1999 11:34:19 +0200 In-Reply-To: Laurence Berland's message of "Mon, 09 Aug 1999 07:55:52 -0400" Message-ID: Lines: 11 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Laurence Berland writes: > don't you mean "Open Source software compatible!" > Open Source isn't a trademark, a copyright, or anything else that would > prevent me from claiming the windows 2000 is open source, except perhaps > a false advertising law suit. Open Source is a trademark of the Open Source Initiative. DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Aug 10 9:20:51 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from high-voltage.com (voltage.high-voltage.com [205.243.158.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D302D14DF8 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 09:20:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from BMCGROARTY@high-voltage.com) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 11:08 -0600 From: "Brian McGroarty" To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: KDE Office / FreeBSD alignment Message-ID: <657AD2FFB44AD31186D40008C7333C82@high-voltage.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Is anyone following this list involved with KDE/KOffice/KDevelop in any way? The more I look at KOffice - http://koffice.kde.org - the more I think KDE 2.0 and KOffice are going to make HUGE waves when released. How can we align ourselves with The K Desktop Environment, promoting FreeBSD as the best platform for KDE? It would be HIGHLY beneficial for KDE and FreeBSD both if we were sharing each other's momentum. KDE and FreeBSD. Microsoft still makes the best mouse. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Aug 10 10:48: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from sumatra.americantv.com (sumatra.americantv.com [208.139.222.227]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9722415428; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 10:47:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jlemon@americantv.com) Received: from right.PCS (right.PCS [148.105.10.31]) by sumatra.americantv.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA22595; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 12:47:52 -0500 (CDT) Received: from free.pcs (free.PCS [148.105.10.51]) by right.PCS (8.8.5/8.6.4) with ESMTP id MAA27566; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 12:47:50 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from jlemon@localhost) by free.pcs (8.8.6/8.8.5) id MAA25151; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 12:47:50 -0500 (CDT) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 12:47:50 -0500 (CDT) From: Jonathan Lemon Message-Id: <199908101747.MAA25151@free.pcs> To: mkc@Graphics.Cornell.EDU, questions@freebsd.org, advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Question about the mascot X-Newsgroups: local.mail.freebsd-questions In-Reply-To: References: Organization: Architecture and Operating System Fanatics Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article you write: > >>Inre >>the mascot issue, it was acknowledged in a prior round of this debate that >>some promotional materials sans "devils" would be a good idea, but I've >>never seen any produced. Personally, I know that freebsd is not demonic, >>however I won't display FreeBSD stuff with devils on it for fear of >>confusing people who don't share our level of "sophistication" with >>regards to obscure greek mysticism. > >Traditional as it may be, I feel the "cute little devil" was an >unfortunate mascot choice and I support the idea of producing some >promotional materials without his image on them. Meanwhile, like Doug >I am not displaying the current ones. I'm of the opinion that the daemon looks cute, and there isn't _that_ much resistance in the mainstream as you would think. When was the last time you heard the press making an uproar over the Duke Blue Devils? Arizona Sun Devils? IMHO, their logos are more "demonic" than ours, but it doesn't seem to hurt them in the national news. And they get a lot more press than we do. There's even the New Jersey Devils, although their logo is more stylized. Hmm. Perhaps someone should put the beastie in a blue dress. :-) -- Jonathan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Aug 10 11: 5:30 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from fellspt.charm.net (fellspt.charm.net [199.0.70.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17216154F5; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 11:05:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dutch@charm.net) Received: from charm.net (coretel-116-130.charm.net [209.143.116.130]) by fellspt.charm.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA18773; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 14:04:33 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <37B0698E.8ACE84F5@charm.net> Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 14:03:58 -0400 From: Dutch Collins X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jonathan Lemon Cc: mkc@Graphics.Cornell.EDU, questions@FreeBSD.ORG, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Question about the mascot References: <199908101747.MAA25151@free.pcs> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jonathan Lemon wrote: > > In article you write: > > > >>Inre > >>the mascot issue, it was acknowledged in a prior round of this debate that > >>some promotional materials sans "devils" would be a good idea, but I've > >>never seen any produced. Personally, I know that freebsd is not demonic, > >>however I won't display FreeBSD stuff with devils on it for fear of > >>confusing people who don't share our level of "sophistication" with > >>regards to obscure greek mysticism. > > > >Traditional as it may be, I feel the "cute little devil" was an > >unfortunate mascot choice and I support the idea of producing some > >promotional materials without his image on them. Meanwhile, like Doug > >I am not displaying the current ones. > > I'm of the opinion that the daemon looks cute, and there isn't > _that_ much resistance in the mainstream as you would think. > > When was the last time you heard the press making an uproar over > the Duke Blue Devils? Arizona Sun Devils? IMHO, their logos are > more "demonic" than ours, but it doesn't seem to hurt them in the > national news. And they get a lot more press than we do. There's > even the New Jersey Devils, although their logo is more stylized. > > Hmm. Perhaps someone should put the beastie in a blue dress. :-) > -- > Jonathan > No not that!!!! No ACC basketball team will be able to beat Duke then. Do you really want Duke to have the extra help. [U of Maryland, Terps] -d To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Aug 10 13:41:47 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mail1.panix.com (mail1.panix.com [166.84.0.212]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2B7A14C07; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 13:41:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tomg@nrnet.org) Received: from mailhost.nrnet.org (mailhost.nrnet.org [166.84.192.39]) by mail1.panix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 343E61F940; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 16:41:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (tomg@localhost) by mailhost.nrnet.org (8.8.7/8.8.4) with SMTP id QAA23635; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 16:41:56 -0400 Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 16:41:54 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas Good To: Dutch Collins Cc: questions@FreeBSD.ORG, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Question about the mascot In-Reply-To: <37B0698E.8ACE84F5@charm.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 10 Aug 1999, Dutch Collins wrote: > > When was the last time you heard the press making an uproar over > > the Duke Blue Devils? Arizona Sun Devils? IMHO, their logos are > > more "demonic" than ours, but it doesn't seem to hurt them in the > > national news. And they get a lot more press than we do. There's > > even the New Jersey Devils, although their logo is more stylized. > No not that!!!! No ACC basketball team will be able to beat Duke then. > Do you really want Duke to have the extra help. [U of Maryland, Terps] > -d Dutch - This Form v. Content content thing really seems to cause some rather intelligent and otherwise well intentioned people to vaporlock, eh? Last I checked, it wasn't Mephisto who urged me to use FBSD. In fact, no Faustian bargain was involved at all...unlike M$ Windows! `Why is it what is obvious to the few is Greek to the world?' ^^^^^ - Johann Wolfgang von Goethe (emphasis added by someone who doesn't concern himself with Greek mythology or apologies for form when the content is top shelf.) I'm off to whiteout my FBSD stickers! Have a good evening, guy. Tom ------- North Richmond Community Mental Health Center ------- Thomas Good MIS Coordinator Vital Signs: tomg@ { admin | q8 } .nrnet.org Phone: 718-354-5528 Fax: 718-354-5056 /* Member: Computer Professionals For Social Responsibility */ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Aug 10 14:22:50 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from wenet.net (pm3-20.ppp.wenet.net [206.15.85.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9A6014C4E for ; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 14:22:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garbanzo@hooked.net) Received: from localhost (garbanzo@localhost) by wenet.net (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA01162; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 14:22:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from garbanzo@hooked.net) X-Authentication-Warning: zippy.dyn.ml.org: garbanzo owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 14:22:16 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex Zepeda To: Brian McGroarty Cc: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: KDE Office / FreeBSD alignment In-Reply-To: <657AD2FFB44AD31186D40008C7333C82@high-voltage.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 10 Aug 1999, Brian McGroarty wrote: > KDE and FreeBSD. > Microsoft still makes the best mouse. No, they haven't and they never will, as long as Logitech still produces mice. :^) - alex To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Aug 10 14:25: 8 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from fellspt.charm.net (fellspt.charm.net [199.0.70.29]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C35E714C4E; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 14:24:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dutch@charm.net) Received: from charm.net (coretel-116-252.charm.net [209.143.116.252]) by fellspt.charm.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA18938; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 17:24:23 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <37B09866.5D5BD4E5@charm.net> Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 17:23:50 -0400 From: Dutch Collins X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Thomas Good Cc: questions@FreeBSD.ORG, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Question about the mascot References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Thomas Good wrote: > > On Tue, 10 Aug 1999, Dutch Collins wrote: > > > > When was the last time you heard the press making an uproar over > > > the Duke Blue Devils? Arizona Sun Devils? IMHO, their logos are > > > more "demonic" than ours, but it doesn't seem to hurt them in the > > > national news. And they get a lot more press than we do. There's > > > even the New Jersey Devils, although their logo is more stylized. > > > No not that!!!! No ACC basketball team will be able to beat Duke then. > > Do you really want Duke to have the extra help. [U of Maryland, Terps] > > -d > > Dutch - > > This Form v. Content content thing really seems to cause some rather > intelligent and otherwise well intentioned people to vaporlock, eh? > > Last I checked, it wasn't Mephisto who urged me to use FBSD. In fact, > no Faustian bargain was involved at all...unlike M$ Windows! > > `Why is it what is obvious to the few is Greek to the world?' > ^^^^^ > - Johann Wolfgang von Goethe > (emphasis added by someone who doesn't concern himself with Greek > mythology or apologies for form when the content is top shelf.) > > I'm off to whiteout my FBSD stickers! Have a good evening, guy. > > Tom oh. I did say something about an inverted bell curve and people when the population reaches a certain level. History is full of these ups and downs. No hear this! Corel has, Corel Linux Desktop, this is Linux with an install that allows the average office win98 user install Linux. And WordPerfect, and all the Office Suite stuff for Linux surfs into the machine, for a price. www.corel.com for more info. Red Hat going IPO soon, andover.net buying as may Linux sites that will sell means FreeBSD needs better marketing. As I see it, a better mouse trap is a hard sell without making life easy on the *office people*. The cartoon devil is a perfect marketing tool, if used. You know, right tool for the right job. see ya, going back to break my FBSD again (what happens if I do ...) -d To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Aug 10 15:15: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mail.wolves.k12.mo.us (mail.wolves.k12.mo.us [207.160.214.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD20915486 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 15:14:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cdillon@wolves.k12.mo.us) Received: from mail.wolves.k12.mo.us (cdillon@mail.wolves.k12.mo.us [207.160.214.1]) by mail.wolves.k12.mo.us (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id RAA07646; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 17:14:58 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from cdillon@wolves.k12.mo.us) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 17:14:57 -0500 (CDT) From: Chris Dillon To: Brian McGroarty Cc: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: KDE Office / FreeBSD alignment In-Reply-To: <657AD2FFB44AD31186D40008C7333C82@high-voltage.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 10 Aug 1999, Brian McGroarty wrote: > Microsoft still makes the best mouse. Aaack. Are you kidding? Those pieces of sh!t? Sure, they used to be fairly decent, but like everyone else, they cut corners on good materials to save money, and still charge too much. The rollers are no longer metal and have a decreased diameter. I don't like any mouse I have to clean weekly. The cheap two-button Logitech mice that you can find anywhere with the small black foam ball (NOT the damned rubber-coated steel ball like everyone uses these days) are, IMHO, the easiest to clean. The rollers never get dirty, just the ball. Cleaning the ball with soap/water is much easier than picking oily hairballs off rollers for an hour, especially when you have lots of them to clean. I like my Logitech TrackMan Marble... never needs cleaning, and its comfortable. :-) -- Chris Dillon - cdillon@wolves.k12.mo.us - cdillon@inter-linc.net FreeBSD: The fastest and most stable server OS on the planet. For Intel x86 and Alpha architectures (SPARC under development). ( http://www.freebsd.org ) "One should admire Windows users. It takes a great deal of courage to trust Windows with your data." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Aug 10 16:17:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk [193.237.89.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B67C4154AC for ; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 16:17:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nik@nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk) Received: from kilt.nothing-going-on.org (kilt.nothing-going-on.org [192.168.1.18]) by nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA59226 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 00:14:41 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from nik@catkin.nothing-going-on.org) Received: (from nik@localhost) by kilt.nothing-going-on.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA92269 for advocacy@freebsd.org; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 17:22:21 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from nik@catkin.nothing-going-on.org) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 17:22:21 +0100 From: Nik Clayton To: advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: Code Forge ported to FreeBSD Message-ID: <19990810172221.A90869@kilt.nothing-going-on.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i Organization: FreeBSD Project Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG There's a press release waiting to be written here guys. C-Forge is an IDE for C, C++, Java, SGML, Perl, and many other languages. There's been a Linux version out for a while (which didn't work under FreeBSD's emulation) and now they've ported it to FreeBSD. Yay. There's a free version (limited to C/C++ only) and an evaluation version, which has support for all the languages, but will only run for 30 days. So, what we have here is a Linux software vendor willingly porting their product to FreeBSD. There's got to be some mileage of the "FreeBSD user base growing significantly" kind to be had from this, as well as possibly a "Development on FreeBSD now even easier", and perhaps even a "FreeBSD solves development headaches for C-Forge developers -- much easier to track than Linux" co-release in conjunction with CodeForge. So, who fancies writing a press release? I notice there was a slew of people volunteering to help with advocacy recently, so this should be easy to fill. Your contact at Code Forge is Yuri Mironoff . N -- [intentional self-reference] can be easily accommodated using a blessed, non-self-referential dummy head-node whose own object destructor severs the links. -- Tom Christiansen in <375143b5@cs.colorado.edu> To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Aug 10 19:56:41 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from voyager.bxscience.edu (voyager.bxscience.edu [167.206.32.174]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6190014E2B for ; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 19:56:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from stuyman@confusion.net) Received: from confusion.net (choates1-bp-57.dartmouth.edu [129.170.46.57]) by voyager.bxscience.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id WAA36942; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 22:56:31 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <37B0E554.6410A94@confusion.net> Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 22:52:04 -0400 From: Laurence Berland X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: Dominic Mitchell , Joel Sutton , brian@pobox.com, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: [ADV] Marketing / Differentiating FreeBSD References: <19990808025724.13926.rocketmail@web1001.mail.yahoo.com> <19990809123221.B1888@voodoo.pandhm.co.uk> <37AEC1C8.3663A849@confusion.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I can't find the url right now, but there was an article on ZDnet a little while back that said they'd let the application lapse or something, and that it wans't registered. If you search ZDnet or /. you should find it. Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > > Laurence Berland writes: > > don't you mean "Open Source software compatible!" > > Open Source isn't a trademark, a copyright, or anything else that would > > prevent me from claiming the windows 2000 is open source, except perhaps > > a false advertising law suit. > > Open Source is a trademark of the Open Source Initiative. > > DES > -- > Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Aug 10 20:18: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix, from userid 758) id 828B014EB9; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 20:18:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 743EC1CD7BC; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 20:18:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kris@hub.freebsd.org) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 20:18:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Kris Kennaway To: Laurence Berland Cc: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , Dominic Mitchell , Joel Sutton , brian@pobox.com, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: [ADV] Marketing / Differentiating FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <37B0E554.6410A94@confusion.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 10 Aug 1999, Laurence Berland wrote: > I can't find the url right now, but there was an article on ZDnet a > little while back that said they'd let the application lapse or > something, and that it wans't registered. If you search ZDnet or /. you > should find it. I think this was rebutted. Check the Open Soure Initiative website. Kris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Aug 10 22:49:14 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from pike.cdrom.com (pike.cdrom.com [204.216.28.222]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C3E814E03; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 22:49:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rab@pike.cdrom.com) Received: from pike.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by pike.cdrom.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id WAA20716; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 22:49:43 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199908110549.WAA20716@pike.cdrom.com> To: Kris Kennaway Cc: Laurence Berland , Dag-Erling Smorgrav , Dominic Mitchell , Joel Sutton , brian@pobox.com, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, rab@pike.cdrom.com Subject: Re: [ADV] Marketing / Differentiating FreeBSD In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 10 Aug 1999 20:18:01 PDT." Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 22:49:43 -0700 From: "Robert A. Bruce" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Kris Kennaway said... >On Tue, 10 Aug 1999, Laurence Berland wrote: > >> I can't find the url right now, but there was an article on ZDnet a >> little while back that said they'd let the application lapse or >> something, and that it wans't registered. If you search ZDnet or /. you >> should find it. > >I think this was rebutted. Check the Open Soure Initiative website. You can check if any term is a registered trademark in the US by checking the Patent and Trademark Office's website http://trademarks.uspto.gov/ "Open Source" does not appear to be registered or pending registration. -bob To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Aug 10 23:21: 9 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from lsmls02.we.mediaone.net (lsmls02.we.mediaone.net [24.130.1.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F9C614E03; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 23:20:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gummibear@we.mediaone.net) Received: from winbox (we-24-130-60-28.we.mediaone.net [24.130.60.28]) by lsmls02.we.mediaone.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA00341; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 23:20:47 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19990810231833.007ab510@we.mediaone.net> X-Sender: gummibear@we.mediaone.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 23:18:33 -0700 To: advocacy@freebsd.org, chat@freebsd.org From: Joey Garcia Subject: Tech News Sites Need BSD Education Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hey all! So everyday I go through my routine of reading all the Tech News sites. I have noticed that more and more news sites are getting to be Linux centric. I'm sort of fed up with the Linux-hoopla. All I read is "Linux that, Linux this". I swear, people are going to start to believe that "Linux" is the *only* Open Source operating system project around. They're gonna start to believe that "Linux" is the *only* stable OS around. There is one site (www.osopinion.com) that has promise of being a decent site. It usually has interesting stuff to read, but it's mostly Linux centric because the people that submit their articles are Linux people. I'm hoping that this can be changed. I am not the most articulate person, and I'm not that great at writing Reviews or Tech articles but I can at least try. I'm hoping that you can try too. It will only take a bit of your time to write something for this site mentioning all the merits and stregths in the BSD community and BSD software. I'm thinking of submitting a "Unix History" article emphasizing the birth of BSD and evolution of BSD up to the presetnt open projects such as FreeBSD, OpenBSD, and NetBSD. Through all it's good times and bad times, mentioning all the great software that came about the BSD project and from the CSRG. After I'm done with that, I'm hoping to write software reviews on FreeBSD machines. Reviews on how great the FreeBSD ports collection is, and how easy it is to install and maintain FreeBSD (not to mention how fast and stable it is). But, I need your help. Anyone willing to help me with this project? Anyone willing to send their reviews? Also, it seems that they advertise for free there. I'm wondering if we can put banners on their site. I'll have to look more into that. Now this isn't about anti-Linux, this is about pro-education. This is about pro-BSD!!! We're not here to bash Linux, but to show the stregths of the BSD operating system. We must educate the people about the BSD alternatives. We must let them know that Linux isn't the only game in town. Now are you with me? Joey To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Aug 10 23:33: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from aeolus.conio.net (ci221559-a.grnvle1.sc.home.com [24.4.122.122]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 3FCBF14FE8 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 23:32:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sam@conio.net) Received: (qmail 24375 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 06:39:18 -0000 Received: from ci221559-b.grnvle1.sc.home.com (HELO thanatos) (24.4.122.130) by ci221559-a.grnvle1.sc.home.com with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 06:39:18 -0000 From: "Sam Stephenson" To: "Joey Garcia" , , Subject: Re: Tech News Sites Need BSD Education Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 02:40:04 -0400 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.19990810231833.007ab510@we.mediaone.net> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > But, I need your help. Anyone willing to help me with this project? > Anyone willing to send their reviews? Also, it seems that they advertise > for free there. I'm wondering if we can put banners on their site. I'll > have to look more into that. > I've always wanted a ``Slashdot for BSD'' site, and it seems that the FreeBSD Advocacy site may be transformed into something like this when/if it reopens. I'd be _more_ than willing to contribute articles, and I know masses of other people would be also. I've submitted one too many stories to Slashdot regarding BSD, only to find them not posted. > Now this isn't about anti-Linux, this is about pro-education. This is > about pro-BSD!!! We're not here to bash Linux, but to show the stregths of > the BSD operating system. We must educate the people about the BSD > alternatives. We must let them know that Linux isn't the only > game in town. > > Now are you with me? > Yep. > Joey --Sam Stephenson sam@conio.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 0:13:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D41A14FCB; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 00:13:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA11187; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 09:11:45 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from des) To: Joey Garcia Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Tech News Sites Need BSD Education References: <3.0.6.32.19990810231833.007ab510@we.mediaone.net> From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 11 Aug 1999 09:11:44 +0200 In-Reply-To: Joey Garcia's message of "Tue, 10 Aug 1999 23:18:33 -0700" Message-ID: Lines: 13 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Joey Garcia writes: > So everyday I go through my routine of reading all the Tech News sites. I > have noticed that more and more news sites are getting to be Linux centric. > I'm sort of fed up with the Linux-hoopla. All I read is "Linux that, > Linux this". I swear, people are going to start to believe that "Linux" is > the *only* Open Source operating system project around. They're gonna > start to believe that "Linux" is the *only* stable OS around. "going to"? why the future tense? DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 1: 4: 2 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mail.ftf.dk (mail.ftf.net [129.142.64.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5907614E34; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 01:03:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from regnauld@ftf.net) Received: from ns.int.ftf.net (fw2.ftf.dk [192.168.1.2] (may be forged)) by mail.ftf.dk (8.9.3/8.9.3/gw-ftf-1.2) with ESMTP id KAA17108; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 10:01:42 +0200 (CEST) X-Authentication-Warning: mail.ftf.dk: Host fw2.ftf.dk [192.168.1.2] (may be forged) claimed to be ns.int.ftf.net Received: (from regnauld@localhost) by ns.int.ftf.net (8.9.2/8.9.3) id KAA00558; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 10:20:25 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19990811102025.39090@ns.int.ftf.net> Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 10:20:25 +0200 From: Phil Regnauld To: Joey Garcia Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Tech News Sites Need BSD Education References: <3.0.6.32.19990810231833.007ab510@we.mediaone.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.88e In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.19990810231833.007ab510@we.mediaone.net>; from Joey Garcia on Tue, Aug 10, 1999 at 11:18:33PM -0700 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386 Organization: FTFnet Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Joey Garcia writes: > > I'm thinking of submitting a "Unix History" article emphasizing the birth > of BSD and evolution of BSD up to the presetnt open projects such as > FreeBSD, OpenBSD, and NetBSD. Through all it's good times and bad times, > mentioning all the great software that came about the BSD project and from > the CSRG. Kirk McKusick made an excellent (and entertaining as hell) presentation at the last USENIX conf. Someone here already asked if there has been a transcript of this -- anyone ? This is a very good way to start. > But, I need your help. Anyone willing to help me with this project? > Anyone willing to send their reviews? Also, it seems that they advertise > for free there. I'm wondering if we can put banners on their site. I'll > have to look more into that. See what the Daemonnews.org (C. Coleman) people have done already -- maybe you can work out something with them. -- Divizion by Zero error -- multiplying by zero to recover. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 1: 4:13 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mail.ftf.dk (mail.ftf.net [129.142.64.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EBE015444; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 01:04:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from regnauld@ftf.net) Received: from ns.int.ftf.net (fw2.ftf.dk [192.168.1.2] (may be forged)) by mail.ftf.dk (8.9.3/8.9.3/gw-ftf-1.2) with ESMTP id KAA17178; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 10:02:25 +0200 (CEST) X-Authentication-Warning: mail.ftf.dk: Host fw2.ftf.dk [192.168.1.2] (may be forged) claimed to be ns.int.ftf.net Received: (from regnauld@localhost) by ns.int.ftf.net (8.9.2/8.9.3) id KAA00573; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 10:21:09 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19990811102108.43981@ns.int.ftf.net> Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 10:21:08 +0200 From: Phil Regnauld To: Sam Stephenson Cc: Joey Garcia , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Tech News Sites Need BSD Education References: <3.0.6.32.19990810231833.007ab510@we.mediaone.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.88e In-Reply-To: ; from Sam Stephenson on Wed, Aug 11, 1999 at 02:40:04AM -0400 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386 Organization: FTFnet Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Sam Stephenson writes: > > > I've always wanted a ``Slashdot for BSD'' site, and it seems that the Then call it RotSlash :-) / - \ | PS: isn't it typical BSD ? -- Divizion by Zero error -- multiplying by zero to recover. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 1:48:22 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (mail.palmerharvey.co.uk [62.172.109.58]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E60D14F83; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 01:48:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Dom.Mitchell@palmerharvey.co.uk) Received: from ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk (unverified) by mail.palmerharvey.co.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 09:44:42 +0100 Received: from voodoo.pandhm.co.uk (VOODOO [10.100.35.12]) by ho-nt-01.pandhm.co.uk with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) id Q4XVHVV1; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 09:44:36 +0100 Received: from dom by voodoo.pandhm.co.uk with local (Exim 2.10 #1) id 11EU0E-0000IA-00; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 09:44:54 +0100 Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 09:44:54 +0100 To: Phil Regnauld Cc: Joey Garcia , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Tech News Sites Need BSD Education Message-Id: <19990811094453.A468@voodoo.pandhm.co.uk> References: <3.0.6.32.19990810231833.007ab510@we.mediaone.net> <19990811102025.39090@ns.int.ftf.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.6i In-Reply-To: <19990811102025.39090@ns.int.ftf.net>; from Phil Regnauld on Wed, Aug 11, 1999 at 10:20:25AM +0200 From: Dominic Mitchell Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Aug 11, 1999 at 10:20:25AM +0200, Phil Regnauld wrote: > Kirk McKusick made an excellent (and entertaining as hell) presentation > at the last USENIX conf. Someone here already asked if there has been > a transcript of this -- anyone ? This is a very good way to start. You may want to look at his chapter of the Open Sources book. http://www.ora.com/catalog/opensources/book/kirkmck.html -- Dom Mitchell -- Palmer & Harvey McLane -- Unix Systems Administrator "Finally, when replying to messages only quote the parts of the message your will be discussing or that are relevant. Quoting whole messages and adding two lines at the top is not good etiquette." -- Elias Levy -- ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. ********************************************************************** To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 3:24: 4 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from logatome.micronet.fr (logatome-2.francenet.fr [193.149.96.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A2C8214D60 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 03:23:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Sebastien.Gioria@FranceNet.fr) Received: from gioria.dialup.FranceNet.fr (eku28.francenet.fr [193.149.97.60]) by logatome.micronet.fr (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA21088; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:21:40 +0200 (CEST) Received: by gioria.dialup.FranceNet.fr (Postfix, from userid 42) id 25EB9202E7; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:24:00 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19990811122359.F2809@FranceNet.fr> Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:23:59 +0200 From: Sebastien GIORIA To: Preston Wiley , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: advocacy site Reply-To: Sebastien GIORIA References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: ; from Preston Wiley on Fri, Aug 06, 1999 at 11:40:24PM -0700 Operating-System: Definitely FreeBSD Function: Security Administrator X-Work-Organization: FranceNet X-Work-Postal-Address: 28 Rue Desaix , 75015 Paris, France, Terre X-Home-Organization: French FreeBSD Documentation Project X-Home-Postal-Address: 32 Rue Baron Le Roy, 75012 Paris, France, Terre X-Operating-System: FreeBSD-STABLE + PAO enabled X-URL-Home: http://www.FreeBSD-fr.org X-URL-Work: http://www.FranceNet.fr Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG And one question, Why just an english advocacy site ? We have (in France) some article about FreeBSD on our web-site (http://www.freebsd-fr.org/presse.html). I think japanese/Spanish, .... have article too. S. -- FranceNet Security Administrator Sebastien.Gioria@FranceNet.fr French FreeBSD Documentation Project gioria@FreeBSD.org Tout FreeBSD en Francais http://www.FreeBSD-fr.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 6:27:18 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from vnode.vmunix.com (vnode.vmunix.com [209.112.4.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 09F611512B; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 06:27:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chrisc@vmunix.com) Received: from localhost (chrisc@localhost) by vnode.vmunix.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA01494; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 09:23:07 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 09:23:07 -0400 (EDT) From: Chris Coleman To: Phil Regnauld Cc: Joey Garcia , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Tech News Sites Need BSD Education In-Reply-To: <19990811102025.39090@ns.int.ftf.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 11 Aug 1999, Phil Regnauld wrote: > Joey Garcia writes: > > > > I'm thinking of submitting a "Unix History" article emphasizing the birth > > of BSD and evolution of BSD up to the presetnt open projects such as > > FreeBSD, OpenBSD, and NetBSD. Through all it's good times and bad times, > > mentioning all the great software that came about the BSD project and from > > the CSRG. > > Kirk McKusick made an excellent (and entertaining as hell) presentation > at the last USENIX conf. Someone here already asked if there has been > a transcript of this -- anyone ? This is a very good way to start. Pat Lynch is writing up an article on Kirks talk for Daemon News. I'll have to nudge him to get it finished. > > > But, I need your help. Anyone willing to help me with this project? > > Anyone willing to send their reviews? Also, it seems that they advertise > > for free there. I'm wondering if we can put banners on their site. I'll > > have to look more into that. > > See what the Daemonnews.org (C. Coleman) people have done already -- maybe you can work > out something with them. > I have been trying to put together a daily.daemonnews.org site for some time. I just need to get everything organized... Chris Coleman Daemon News Editor in Chief http://www.daemonnews.org Bringing BSD together To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 12:17:52 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from orthos.cadabra.com (orthos.cadabra.com [216.33.7.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1E2315531 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:17:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pwiley@orthos.cadabra.com) Received: by orthos.cadabra.com (Postfix, from userid 972) id A38591DA009; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:17:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orthos.cadabra.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 98120119027; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:17:10 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:17:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Preston Wiley To: advocacy@freebsd.org, Joey Garcia , Sam Stephenson Subject: Re: Tech News Sites Need BSD Education Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've got a new prototype advococy site up. It now uses a mysql database to store the data and you can add news with an admin script. All of the pages are CGI Perl scripts, except some of the users groups pages because I haven't put all of the groups in the database yet. Check it out and tell me what you think. http://freebsd.tesserae.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Preston Wiley Cadabra, Inc. Systems Administrator 1820 Gateway Drive, Suite 300 pwiley@cadabra.com San Mateo, CA 94404 650/403-2227 http://www.cadabra.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- On Wed, 11 Aug 1999, Sam Stephenson wrote: > > But, I need your help. Anyone willing to help me with this project? > > Anyone willing to send their reviews? Also, it seems that they advertise > > for free there. I'm wondering if we can put banners on their site. I'll > > have to look more into that. > > > I've always wanted a ``Slashdot for BSD'' site, and it seems that the > FreeBSD Advocacy site may be transformed into something like this when/if it > reopens. I'd be _more_ than willing to contribute articles, and I know > masses of other people would be also. I've submitted one too many stories > to Slashdot regarding BSD, only to find them not posted. > > > Now this isn't about anti-Linux, this is about pro-education. This is > > about pro-BSD!!! We're not here to bash Linux, but to show the stregths of > > the BSD operating system. We must educate the people about the BSD > > alternatives. We must let them know that Linux isn't the only > > game in town. > > > > Now are you with me? > > > Yep. > > > Joey > > --Sam Stephenson > sam@conio.net > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 13:20:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from high-voltage.com (voltage.high-voltage.com [205.243.158.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 1D4D114F7B for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 13:20:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from BMCGROARTY@high-voltage.com) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:57 -0600 From: "Brian McGroarty" To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: What we're up against... Message-ID: <4DE9AE32724FD31186D40008C7333C82@high-voltage.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Apple PR is hard at work... http://www.theregister.co.uk/990811-000009.html To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 13:43:10 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from high-voltage.com (voltage.high-voltage.com [205.243.158.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id CAD9214BFE for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 13:43:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from BMCGROARTY@high-voltage.com) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 15:19 -0600 From: "Brian McGroarty" To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org, eric@cfpower.com Subject: RE: Fwd: Re: Marketing / Media Strategy Message-ID: <5EE9AE32724FD31186D40008C7333C82@high-voltage.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --- "Eric A. Griff" wrote: [...] > > Good man.. Good list... What can I do to help, and where do we > start? For now, the major things I'm looking for are: 1) Comments on previous postings. I'd still like to see more key elements which differentiate FreeBSD from the other OS choices. 2) Pointers to media usable for a PR source material site. Again - clip art, outlines and -brief- summary statements about the OS and its history are all excellent inventory. 3) A list of existing PR contacts. This includes Daemon News et al. (Who currently maintains this?) Anything you can offer for the above would be great. I'm currently familiarizing myself with reams of old material and searching for new. This is going to be a -very- dry weekend. > I'll pull the thoughts of an experienced press releaser I know > (conventional, and net based). This would be -highly- useful, Eric. Most of my experience is in providing source material for our publishers' marketing departments, and for entertainment products for that matter. A few good template documents and some practical advice will help me learn to make up for the missing middle men and different product line. > Upcoming list! IE, Future file along with ERRATA. This might > help tune users ahead of time too.. I'd love to see something held internally so we know what we'll be showing off in each coming release. But this should be done without committing incomplete code to dates. No dates, not even estimates. It's almost a given these days that product development is driven by marketing, which is something entirely incompatible with FreeBSD's development model. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 14:10:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from forty-two.egroups.net (teapot.findmail.com [206.16.70.98]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF9FE1557A for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:10:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gsutter@forty-two.egroups.net) Received: (from gsutter@localhost) by forty-two.egroups.net (8.9.3/8.9.2) id OAA86684; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:10:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gsutter) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:10:08 -0700 From: Gregory Sutter To: Brian McGroarty Cc: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: Marketing / Media Strategy Message-ID: <19990811141008.R62723@forty-two.egroups.net> References: <5EE9AE32724FD31186D40008C7333C82@high-voltage.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <5EE9AE32724FD31186D40008C7333C82@high-voltage.com>; from Brian McGroarty on Wed, Aug 11, 1999 at 03:19:00PM -0600 Organization: Zer0 Approved: graham.spanier Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Aug 11, 1999 at 03:19:00PM -0600, Brian McGroarty wrote: > > 2) Pointers to media usable for a PR source material site. Again - clip art, > outlines and -brief- summary statements about the OS and its history are all > excellent inventory. www.freebsdmall.com has a selection of FreeBSD graphics. > 3) A list of existing PR contacts. This includes Daemon News et al. (Who > currently maintains this?) I am one of the editors of Daemon News. Remember, though, that DN is a _BSD_ site, not a _Free_BSD site. We're more than happy to publish material that is specific to a particular BSD, but we also seek a balance of material from all BSD sources. To reach the Daemon News editors as a group, email editors@daemonnews.org. Greg -- Gregory S. Sutter Cole's Law: Thinly sliced cabbage. mailto:gsutter@pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~gsutter/ PGP DSS public key 0x40AE3052 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 15:13:29 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk [193.237.89.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2EDB015628; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 15:10:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nik@nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk) Received: from kilt.nothing-going-on.org (kilt.nothing-going-on.org [192.168.1.18]) by nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA26483; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 23:05:05 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from nik@catkin.nothing-going-on.org) Received: (from nik@localhost) by kilt.nothing-going-on.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA03862; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 08:58:51 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from nik@catkin.nothing-going-on.org) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 08:58:50 +0100 From: Nik Clayton To: Sam Stephenson Cc: Joey Garcia , advocacy@freebsd.org, chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Tech News Sites Need BSD Education Message-ID: <19990811085850.A3620@kilt.nothing-going-on.org> References: <3.0.6.32.19990810231833.007ab510@we.mediaone.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: ; from Sam Stephenson on Wed, Aug 11, 1999 at 02:40:04AM -0400 Organization: FreeBSD Project Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Aug 11, 1999 at 02:40:04AM -0400, Sam Stephenson wrote: > I've always wanted a ``Slashdot for BSD'' site, http://www.freebsdrocks.com/ N -- [intentional self-reference] can be easily accommodated using a blessed, non-self-referential dummy head-node whose own object destructor severs the links. -- Tom Christiansen in <375143b5@cs.colorado.edu> To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 15:34:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from bbcon.com.au (firewall.bbcon.com.au [203.28.19.210]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 54CD8155A8 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 15:34:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jsutton@bbcon.com.au) Received: from office.bbcon.com.au (stargate [10.0.0.1]) by bbcon.com.au (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id IAA05926; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 08:40:35 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jsutton@bbcon.com.au) Received: from localhost (jsutton@localhost) by office.bbcon.com.au (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id IAA06697; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 08:33:16 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jsutton@bbcon.com.au) X-Authentication-Warning: stargate.home: jsutton owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 08:33:15 +1000 (EST) From: Joel Sutton X-Sender: jsutton@stargate.home To: advocacy@freebsd.org Cc: Victorias FreeBSD User Group Subject: Borland Linux Developer Survey Results Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG It's not quite FreeBSD, but I think that it's relevant. http://www.borland.com/linux/survey/ Cheers, Joel... --- Joel Sutton | Busy Bee Consulting Phone: (0409) 426-563 | Melbourne, Australia Email: jsutton@bbcon.com.au | http://www.bbcon.com.au/ VicFUG Webmaster/Acting President | http://www.vicfug.au.freebsd.org/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 17:32: 5 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from orthos.cadabra.com (orthos.cadabra.com [216.33.7.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 45CBA1569B for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 17:32:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pwiley@orthos.cadabra.com) Received: by orthos.cadabra.com (Postfix, from userid 972) id 0133F1DA026; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 17:31:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orthos.cadabra.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F17B2119027 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 17:31:20 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 17:31:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Preston Wiley To: advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: Advocacy Site Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've added a lot of admin pages to the advocacy site I've been working on. They are not password protected yet, but will be in the future. If you would like to add stuff to the site, this is the way to do it. If you do, please try to follow the form of the other things on the site. These aren't the prettiest forms, but they will have to do for now. Later I'll write scripts to delete a change entries. For the Admin stuff, goto: http://freebsd.tesserae.com/admin/ Thanks for everyones help in advance and if you have any problems, please e-mail me. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Preston Wiley Cadabra, Inc. Systems Administrator 1820 Gateway Drive, Suite 300 pwiley@cadabra.com San Mateo, CA 94404 650/403-2227 http://www.cadabra.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 17:54:28 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17506155DE for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 17:54:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id RAA04071; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 17:53:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omni.xylan.com by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id RAA03843; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 17:48:45 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com (dyn5.utah.xylan.com) by omni.xylan.com (4.1/SMI-4.1 (xylan engr [SPOOL])) id AA20651; Wed, 11 Aug 99 17:53:31 PDT Message-Id: <37B21B0B.6420CC8C@softweyr.com> Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 18:53:31 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Joel Sutton Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, Victorias FreeBSD User Group Subject: Re: Borland Linux Developer Survey Results References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Joel Sutton wrote: > > It's not quite FreeBSD, but I think that it's relevant. > > http://www.borland.com/linux/survey/ I don't see how. What we really learn here is that Borland managed to poll Delphi programmers who also use Linux, who mostly want Delphi for Linux. Go figure. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://softweyr.com/ wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 18: 0: 0 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3A1714CC2; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 17:59:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id RAA04158; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 17:59:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omni.xylan.com by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id RAA04021; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 17:55:04 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com (dyn5.utah.xylan.com) by omni.xylan.com (4.1/SMI-4.1 (xylan engr [SPOOL])) id AA20959; Wed, 11 Aug 99 17:59:52 PDT Message-Id: <37B21C88.A8D135A0@softweyr.com> Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 18:59:52 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Nik Clayton Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, Yuri Mironoff Subject: Re: Code Forge ported to FreeBSD References: <19990810172221.A90869@kilt.nothing-going-on.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Nik Clayton wrote: > > There's a press release waiting to be written here guys. > > C-Forge is an IDE for C, C++, Java, SGML, Perl, and many other languages. > There's been a Linux version out for a while (which didn't work under > FreeBSD's emulation) and now they've ported it to FreeBSD. > > Yay. > > There's a free version (limited to C/C++ only) and an evaluation version, > which has support for all the languages, but will only run for 30 days. > > So, what we have here is a Linux software vendor willingly porting their > product to FreeBSD. There's got to be some mileage of the "FreeBSD user > base growing significantly" kind to be had from this, as well as possibly > a "Development on FreeBSD now even easier", and perhaps even a "FreeBSD > solves development headaches for C-Forge developers -- much easier to > track than Linux" co-release in conjunction with CodeForge. > > So, who fancies writing a press release? I notice there was a slew of > people volunteering to help with advocacy recently, so this should be > easy to fill. > > Your contact at Code Forge is Yuri Mironoff . I'll be glad to help, as soon as I can download the damn thing and actually run it. ;^) Maybe Yuri can help here? I have the Reg Code they emailed me, but cannot get the download page to actually get me any code. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://softweyr.com/ wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 18:26:15 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from bbcon.com.au (firewall.bbcon.com.au [203.28.19.210]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DED4214F7B for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 18:26:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jsutton@bbcon.com.au) Received: from office.bbcon.com.au (stargate [10.0.0.1]) by bbcon.com.au (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id LAA05967; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 11:32:04 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jsutton@bbcon.com.au) Received: from localhost (jsutton@localhost) by office.bbcon.com.au (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id LAA06871; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 11:24:39 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jsutton@bbcon.com.au) X-Authentication-Warning: stargate.home: jsutton owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 11:24:38 +1000 (EST) From: Joel Sutton X-Sender: jsutton@stargate.home To: Wes Peters Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, Victorias FreeBSD User Group Subject: Re: Borland Linux Developer Survey Results In-Reply-To: <37B21B0B.6420CC8C@softweyr.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 11 Aug 1999, Wes Peters wrote: > Joel Sutton wrote: > > > > It's not quite FreeBSD, but I think that it's relevant. > > > > http://www.borland.com/linux/survey/ > > I don't see how. What we really learn here is that Borland managed to poll > Delphi programmers who also use Linux, who mostly want Delphi for Linux. Which means they port Delphi to Linux and developers start writing apps which talk to MySQL running on new FreeBSD servers. The fact that Delphi for Linux might run on FreeBSD is an added bonus. That's my twisted vision anyway... :-) Cheers, Joel... --- Joel Sutton | Busy Bee Consulting Phone: (0409) 426-563 | Melbourne, Australia Email: jsutton@bbcon.com.au | http://www.bbcon.com.au/ VicFUG Webmaster/Acting President | http://www.vicfug.au.freebsd.org/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 19:16: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from norn.ca.eu.org (cr965240-b.abtsfd1.bc.wave.home.com [24.113.19.137]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A5AE14CF1; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 19:15:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cpiazza@norn.ca.eu.org) Received: by norn.ca.eu.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 8BDB233; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 19:15:48 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 19:15:48 -0700 From: Chris Piazza To: Wes Peters Cc: Nik Clayton , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, Yuri Mironoff Subject: Re: Code Forge ported to FreeBSD Message-ID: <19990811191548.C3092@norn.ca.eu.org> References: <19990810172221.A90869@kilt.nothing-going-on.org> <37B21C88.A8D135A0@softweyr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.6i In-Reply-To: <37B21C88.A8D135A0@softweyr.com>; from Wes Peters on Wed, Aug 11, 1999 at 06:59:52PM -0600 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, Aug 11, 1999 at 06:59:52PM -0600, Wes Peters wrote: > > I'll be glad to help, as soon as I can download the damn thing and actually > run it. ;^) > > Maybe Yuri can help here? I have the Reg Code they emailed me, but cannot > get the download page to actually get me any code. I had to try three or four times, but it did work eventually. -Chris -- cpiazza@home.net cpiazza@FreeBSD.org "It's better to be quotable than to be honest." --Tom Stoppard To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Aug 11 21:27: 6 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix, from userid 758) id F121D14E45; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 21:27:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1C201CD88D for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 21:27:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kris@hub.freebsd.org) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 21:27:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Kris Kennaway To: advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: Mining myCNN.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG CNN Interactive have just redesigned their custom news site and now allow you to perform keyword searches of their news databases (the "On Target" feature) - well, perhaps it existed before, but it wasn't obvious from my profile page. One of my predefined keywords is "FreeBSD", which turned up an article about a new WAN adapter with FreeBSD driver support (included below). This might be a useful way of keeping track of lower-profile news articles. Perhaps it could even be reverse-engineered to automate the process (the interface uses JavaScript, although it probably requires you to log into your CNN account first) The only issue is whether this would violate any terms of service. Kris Introduces Low Cost T1 Onboard Csu/Dsu and Others SAN JOSE, Calif.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Aug. 10, 1999--LAN Media Corporation (LMC) today announced the availability of a new Wide Area Network (WAN) adapter for PCI that supports both T1 and E1 line interfaces on the same card. The new adapter, priced at $749, includes full CSU/DSU functionality on the adapter card itself, thereby eliminating the requirement for an external device to complete the WAN connection with a service provider. The company made its announcement at the LinuxWorld Expo event in San Jose, California this week to stress its support for Open Source operating systems in general, and for the Linux operating system environment in particular. The company stated that Solaris drivers would also be available with first customer shipments. The new adapter, called the LMC1200P T1+E1 WAN Adapter for PCI, includes several innovative features to enhance its flexibility and performance. For example, selections for T1 or E1 operation, short haul or long haul signaling (CSU/DSU), and 100 ohm or 120 ohm impedance are all made within software to enable the adapter to operate in a wide range of environments. Additional flexibility is reflected by the inclusion of special hardware headers to enable synchronization with other communication devices via transmit-clock-in and receive-clock-out. The adapter's bezel provides a standard RJ-48 connection and four separate LED's for precise status display and telco service alarms. As with all LMC high performance WAN adapters, the LMC1200P utilizes a state-machine architecture with HDLC functionality occurring in hardware. The result is very low latency and a reduced component count that enhances reliability. Along with release of its new T1+E1 Adapter LMC has announced the availability of driver source code for Linux and several other Open Source operating systems including BSD/OS, FreeBSD, and NetBSD. All of LMC's new driver sources will be available at no charge to visitors of the LMC booth at LinuxWorld Expo -- August 10-13. The new drivers, including documentation, will be included with any LMC WAN Adapter shipment where Unix or Linux is specified as the operating system environment and will also be available on the company's FTP site at no charge. "We are very excited about the growing trend toward combining open source operating systems with open hardware systems for networking applications," said Dave De Puy, chief operating officer for LMC. "Thanks to this convergence, users have the opportunity to experience the benefits of very reliable, high performance routers at a fraction of the cost associated with their proprietary counterparts." He went on to say, "For example many of our customers are using standard out-of-the-box PC's, directly connected to the WAN with LMC Adapters, running firewall and routing applications. Not only are they paying much less than the cost of dedicated proprietary routers and CSU/DSU equipment, they are securing their networks at the very point of entry." The LMC1200P T1+E1 WAN Adapter is available this month. Two versions have been released. The LMC1200P-U ships with LMC's full set of Linux and Open Source driver source code. It is also available as the LMC1200P-S, which includes drivers for Solaris operating systems. Both are priced at $749, including software, documentation, and a one-year limited warranty. LAN Media Corporation is a leading developer of high performance WAN technology and products based on industry standard bus architectures for the next generation of WAN solutions. The company is located in Sunnyvale, Calif. Note to Editors: Solaris is a registered trademark of Sun Microsystems, Inc. BSD/OS is a trademark of BSDI. NetBSD is a trademark of the NetBSD Foundation. FreeBSD is a trademark of FreeBSD, Inc. Linux is a trademark of Linus Torvalds. LMC, LMC and LMC1200 are trademarks of LAN Media Corporation. --30--pw/sf* CONTACT: LAN Media Corporation (LMC) Dave De Puy, 408/991-7200 ext. 483 John Marman, 408/991-7200 ext. 486 www.lanmedia.com KEYWORD: CALIFORNIA INDUSTRY KEYWORD: COMPUTERS/ELECTRONICS COMED TELECOMMUNICATIONS INTERACTIVE/MUTLIMEDIA/INTERNET PRODUCT TRADESHOW Today's News On The Net - Business Wire's full file on the Internet with Hyperlinks to your home page. URL: http://www.businesswire.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Thu Aug 12 1:53:12 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mail.primus.com.au (mail.primus.com.au [203.134.0.68]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C430114F30 for ; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 01:53:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jsutton@bbcon.com.au) Received: from mail pickup service by mail.primus.com.au with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 16:05:32 +1000 Received: from iserver.itworks.com.au ([203.32.61.10]) by mail.primus.com.au with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.267.26); Thu, 12 Aug 1999 08:36:54 +1000 Received: (qmail 8518 invoked by uid 1013); 11 Aug 1999 22:33:15 -0000 Mailing-List: contact general-help@vicfug.au.freebsd.org; run by ezmlm Delivered-To: mailing list general@vicfug.au.freebsd.org Received: (qmail 8511 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 22:33:13 -0000 Received: from firewall.bbcon.com.au (HELO bbcon.com.au) (203.28.19.210) by iserver.itworks.com.au with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 22:33:13 -0000 Received: from office.bbcon.com.au (stargate [10.0.0.1]) by bbcon.com.au (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id IAA05926; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 08:40:35 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jsutton@bbcon.com.au) Received: from localhost (jsutton@localhost) by office.bbcon.com.au (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id IAA06697; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 08:33:16 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jsutton@bbcon.com.au) X-Authentication-Warning: stargate.home: jsutton owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 08:33:15 +1000 (EST) From: Joel Sutton X-Sender: jsutton@stargate.home To: advocacy@freebsd.org Cc: Victorias FreeBSD User Group Subject: Borland Linux Developer Survey Results Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG It's not quite FreeBSD, but I think that it's relevant. http://www.borland.com/linux/survey/ Cheers, Joel... --- Joel Sutton | Busy Bee Consulting Phone: (0409) 426-563 | Melbourne, Australia Email: jsutton@bbcon.com.au | http://www.bbcon.com.au/ VicFUG Webmaster/Acting President | http://www.vicfug.au.freebsd.org/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Thu Aug 12 6:33:16 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from high-voltage.com (voltage.high-voltage.com [205.243.158.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D0C0315017 for ; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 06:33:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from BMCGROARTY@high-voltage.com) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 7:26 -0600 From: "Brian McGroarty" To: "Gregory Sutter" Cc: "freebsd-advocacy" Subject: RE: Re: Fwd: Re: Marketing / Media Strategy Message-ID: <56ECAE32724FD31186D40008C7333C82@high-voltage.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG No, not who maintains Daemon News - who maintains the press contact list. =) I assume we've got one? Address noted. Thank you. -----Original Message----- From: Gregory Sutter [mailto:gsutter@pobox.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 1999 3:10 PM To: Brian McGroarty Cc: freebsd-advocacy Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: Marketing / Media Strategy > 3) A list of existing PR contacts. This includes Daemon News et al. (Who > currently maintains this?) I am one of the editors of Daemon News. Remember, though, that DN is a _BSD_ site, not a _Free_BSD site. We're more than happy to publish material that is specific to a particular BSD, but we also seek a balance of material from all BSD sources. To reach the Daemon News editors as a group, email editors@daemonnews.org. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Thu Aug 12 12:28:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D654114D54; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 12:28:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id MAA17876; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 12:28:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omni.xylan.com by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id MAA24555; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 12:23:26 -0700 Received: from softweyr.com (dyn5.utah.xylan.com) by omni.xylan.com (4.1/SMI-4.1 (xylan engr [SPOOL])) id AA13204; Thu, 12 Aug 99 12:28:24 PDT Message-Id: <37B32057.6E950016@softweyr.com> Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 13:28:23 -0600 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.1-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Chris Piazza Cc: Nik Clayton , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, Yuri Mironoff Subject: Re: Code Forge ported to FreeBSD References: <19990810172221.A90869@kilt.nothing-going-on.org> <37B21C88.A8D135A0@softweyr.com> <19990811191548.C3092@norn.ca.eu.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Chris Piazza wrote: > > On Wed, Aug 11, 1999 at 06:59:52PM -0600, Wes Peters wrote: > > > > I'll be glad to help, as soon as I can download the damn thing and actually > > run it. ;^) > > > > Maybe Yuri can help here? I have the Reg Code they emailed me, but cannot > > get the download page to actually get me any code. > > I had to try three or four times, but it did work eventually. Yeah, me too. I've got a program due tomorrow for a client, so I'm finishing it up using CodeForge. When I'm done, I should be ready to write a review, and to help with a press release. Of course, that'll be after I finish my Daemon News column, which is already late as usual, and the program, which my client really really needs NOW. Busier than a one-legged man in a butt kicking contest, -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://softweyr.com/ wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Thu Aug 12 13:27:40 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk [193.237.89.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7660115897; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 13:22:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from nik@nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk) Received: from kilt.nothing-going-on.org (kilt.nothing-going-on.org [192.168.1.18]) by nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA88781; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 21:10:13 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from nik@catkin.nothing-going-on.org) Received: (from nik@localhost) by kilt.nothing-going-on.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA96078; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 17:43:52 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from nik@catkin.nothing-going-on.org) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 17:43:52 +0100 From: Nik Clayton To: Preston Wiley Cc: advocacy@freebsd.org, Joey Garcia , Sam Stephenson , doc@freebsd.org Subject: FreeBSD web site (was Re: Tech News Sites Need BSD Education) Message-ID: <19990812174352.A91428@kilt.nothing-going-on.org> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: ; from Preston Wiley on Wed, Aug 11, 1999 at 12:17:10PM -0700 Organization: FreeBSD Project Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Preston, (and everyone else on -advocacy) [ I've just got about halfway through writing this, and realised it's (a) quite long, (b) also appropriate for -doc, so I've cc'd this there. Reply-to not set, make sure you send responses back to the most appropriate list please ] On Wed, Aug 11, 1999 at 12:17:10PM -0700, Preston Wiley wrote: > I've got a new prototype advococy site up. It now uses a mysql database to > store the data and you can add news with an admin script. All of the pages > are CGI Perl scripts, except some of the users groups pages because I > haven't put all of the groups in the database yet. > > Check it out and tell me what you think. > > http://freebsd.tesserae.com I've had a look at this. It's a good first start, but (and I'm sorry, but I'm going to keep banging on about this), I don't think it solves the real problem. If we stop and think for a second, how much stuff on the FreeBSD site actually needs to be done dynamically? Practically none of it, I think. Look at /., stories submitted there aren't posted immediately, they're forwarded to the editors, who still have to approve them, probably tidy them up, and then post them. /.'s success was that the editors were able to skive off from their college studies and still take advantage of the bandwidth offered. It seems to be endemic in the FreeBSD community that we either have the time to do something, but lack the resources, or have the resources, but lack the time -- there are a few notable exceptions to this, obviously, but that's where we are. I *strongly* approve of the idea of keeping a lot of the content in a backend database of some sort. There's a lot of content on the current site(s) (www. and advocacy.) that's basically just lists of information that should really be stuck in the equivalent of a database table. However, none of this information actually needs to be generated on the fly. It's sufficient for the web pages to be rebuilt once a night (or every 12 hours, or maybe even every 6 hours) if new material is forthcoming. This keeps the complexity of the site down, as the number of tools you need to actually build the site drops. I think for any of these solutions to be adopted by the main FreeBSD site (and I assume that's what we're after here) they need to be simple, easy to mirror, and easy to translate to other languages. It doesn't matter how many Perl, Python, or PHP interfaces we put on it (what is it with languages that begin with a "P" anyway?), those are the big three requirements. With those in mind, I'd love for someone to take a comprehensive look at the information we're currently pumping out on the FreeBSD site, and come up with a better way of managing it. For example, we currently have several different "lists of links" sections on the site; Projects User groups Mailing lists The gallery Commercial vendors (divided into hardware, software, consultants, misc) What's New The consistency of presentation and implementation of these pages is atrocious -- we haven't had a full time webmaster who can concentrate on issues like this for some time (no disrespect to Wolfram intended, I know what his workload's been like) and, quite frankly, I've been running as fast as I can to keep up with other commitments and manage the site as best I can as well (as anyone who's had to wait 2 or 3 months for an acknowledgement of an e-mail from me can attest). What do we need? Assuming *I* had the time to do this, this is what I'd do -- this might not be the best solution, but based on my webmastering experience, this is how I'd tackle it. First, take an inventory of the site as it is now. Work out what content we have on there, go through the logs to find out what's most read, what's ignored, and get a feel for how people are actually using the site. Take a look at the inventory you've made, and try and see how many different ways a site visitor might want to approach the information. For example, they might want to see a list of all the mailing lists grouped together. Or they might to see all the information about using FreeBSD on laptops grouped together. Or everything that might be appropriate to someone who wants to read the -hackers mailing list. Or, heaven forbid, advocacy material. You will quickly find that you can't present all the information in one way so that it suits everyone, as everyone's needs are different. What you can do is: 1. Break apart the information into easily manageable chunks. 2. Tag those chunks with extra information that indicate how they're related. 3. Build an infrastructure that can put chunks together based on their relationships. For example, "advocacy@freebsd.org" is the mailing list "chunk", "www.freebsdrocks.com" is a web site "chunk", and the two are related because both are about advocacy. So, if the site visitor selects the "show me all the mailing lists" link they'll see the advocacy list, if they select the "show me all the links to other sites" they'll see FreeBSDRocks, and if they select "show me everything to do with advocacy" they'll get both. Some of you are probably already thinking that this can all be handled in a big backend database -- yes it can, but you probably don't want to. Databases are not simple, they're not easy to mirror, and the content in them doesn't really lend itself to being translated (it can do, but it's normally more hassle than other methods). There's no reason why the scenario I've sketched out above couldn't be handled by pre-generating all the pages involved, in the same way that the commercial and gallery pages are generated from flat files now. Yes, the disk space required by the site goes up (but this is text we're talking about, so the requirements are minimal) and it's a much simpler system to manage, mirror, and translate. With me so far? That covers 90% of the content on the FreeBSD site. The remaining content breaks down in to (a) Extensive documentation, the FAQ, Handbook, tutorials, and so on. (b) The presentational bumph that surrounds all the hard information. Well, (a) will eventually be getting a web site of it's own, so you don't need to worry about that. Links to this documentation form a core part of the main FreeBSD site, but the actual docs will be separate (it's easier to manage). And (b) can be handled the way we handle it now. So, who's interested? What I think we need are three or four people who are sufficiently interested in doing this and have enough time to give it a reasonable crack. It'll probably need * Site architects, who can take the above, flesh it out some more, and come up with a structure that works. * Programmers, who can build the back end that regenerates the web pages from the information held in the 'database'. * Gatherers and editors, who get and/or write the content that's going to be stored in this backend. As I say, 3 or 4, maybe up to 6 or 7 -- too many more and nothing will get done. If people are prepared to volunteer to do this I'll get the mailing list set up (don't discuss it on -advocacy or -doc, the number of participants means that conversations get dragged of track very quickly) and try and throw the resources your way so you can get started on actually trying to implement something like this. -- [intentional self-reference] can be easily accommodated using a blessed, non-self-referential dummy head-node whose own object destructor severs the links. -- Tom Christiansen in <375143b5@cs.colorado.edu> To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Fri Aug 13 13: 6:48 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from high-voltage.com (voltage.high-voltage.com [205.243.158.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 925DD14F17 for ; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 13:06:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from BMCGROARTY@high-voltage.com) Date: Fri, 13 Aug 1999 14:40 -0600 From: "Brian McGroarty" To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: 4.0-RELEASE - October? Message-ID: <68585390B950D31186D50008C7333C82@high-voltage.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Walnut Creek are saying that 4.0-RELEASE is expected in October. Is this expected? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Fri Aug 13 13:23:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from vnode.vmunix.com (vnode.vmunix.com [209.112.4.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2BAE414F87 for ; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 13:23:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from chrisc@vmunix.com) Received: from localhost (chrisc@localhost) by vnode.vmunix.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA18729; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 16:24:06 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 13 Aug 1999 16:24:06 -0400 (EDT) From: Chris Coleman To: Brian McGroarty Cc: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 4.0-RELEASE - October? In-Reply-To: <68585390B950D31186D50008C7333C82@high-voltage.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jordan said at the USENIX BoF that 4.0 would under no circumstances be out before 2000. I don't think he changed his mind... Chris Coleman Daemon News Editor in Chief http://www.daemonnews.org Bringing BSD together On Fri, 13 Aug 1999, Brian McGroarty wrote: > Walnut Creek are saying that 4.0-RELEASE is expected in October. > > Is this expected? > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Fri Aug 13 14:27:26 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from freebsd.tesserae.com (freebsd.tesserae.com [209.19.206.69]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED2A015003; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 14:27:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pwiley@freebsd.tesserae.com) Received: by freebsd.tesserae.com (Postfix, from userid 0) id 936764F4; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 11:58:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freebsd.tesserae.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 804B61FE; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 11:58:27 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 11:58:27 -0700 (PDT) From: "Preston S. Wiley II" To: Sam Stephenson Cc: Joey Garcia , advocacy@freebsd.org, chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Tech News Sites Need BSD Education In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've got a new prototype advococy site up. It now uses a mysql database to store the data and you can add news with an admin script. All of the pages are CGI Perl scripts, except some of the users groups pages because I haven't put all of the groups in the database yet. Check it out and tell me what you think. http://freebsd.tesserae.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Preston Wiley Cadabra, Inc. Systems Administrator 1820 Gateway Drive, Suite 300 pwiley@cadabra.com San Mateo, CA 94404 650/403-2227 http://www.cadabra.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- On Wed, 11 Aug 1999, Sam Stephenson wrote: > > But, I need your help. Anyone willing to help me with this project? > > Anyone willing to send their reviews? Also, it seems that they advertise > > for free there. I'm wondering if we can put banners on their site. I'll > > have to look more into that. > > > I've always wanted a ``Slashdot for BSD'' site, and it seems that the > FreeBSD Advocacy site may be transformed into something like this when/if it > reopens. I'd be _more_ than willing to contribute articles, and I know > masses of other people would be also. I've submitted one too many stories > to Slashdot regarding BSD, only to find them not posted. > > > Now this isn't about anti-Linux, this is about pro-education. This is > > about pro-BSD!!! We're not here to bash Linux, but to show the stregths of > > the BSD operating system. We must educate the people about the BSD > > alternatives. We must let them know that Linux isn't the only > > game in town. > > > > Now are you with me? > > > Yep. > > > Joey > > --Sam Stephenson > sam@conio.net > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Fri Aug 13 15:52:58 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from magnesium.net (toxic.magnesium.net [204.188.6.238]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 18FD614FEC for ; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 15:52:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from unfurl@magnesium.net) Received: (qmail 78863 invoked by uid 1001); 13 Aug 1999 22:51:17 -0000 Date: Fri, 13 Aug 1999 15:51:17 -0700 From: Bill Swingle To: Brian McGroarty Cc: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 4.0-RELEASE - October? Message-ID: <19990813155116.B78632@dub.net> References: <68585390B950D31186D50008C7333C82@high-voltage.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.6i In-Reply-To: <68585390B950D31186D50008C7333C82@high-voltage.com>; from Brian McGroarty on Fri, Aug 13, 1999 at 02:40:00PM -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Funny, I dont remember anyone ever saying that.... Maybe you confused it with the expected release of 3.3-RELEASE. The expected date for 4.0-RELEASE is early 2000. -Bill On Fri, Aug 13, 1999 at 02:40:00PM -0600, Brian McGroarty wrote: > Walnut Creek are saying that 4.0-RELEASE is expected in October. > > Is this expected? > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message -- -=| Bill Swingle - unfurl@dub.net - unfurl@freebsd.org - bill@cdrom.com -=| "Computers are useless. They can only give you answers" Pablo Picasso To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sat Aug 14 3:36:11 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from magnesium.net (toxic.magnesium.net [204.188.6.238]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id DBEFE14D64 for ; Sat, 14 Aug 1999 03:36:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from unfurl@magnesium.net) Received: (qmail 86015 invoked by uid 1001); 14 Aug 1999 10:36:19 -0000 Date: Sat, 14 Aug 1999 03:36:19 -0700 From: Bill Swingle To: chat@freebsd.org, advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: Pics from LinuxWorld Message-ID: <19990814033619.A85998@dub.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.6i Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG LinuxWorld was a blast. In the midst of the constant business I was able to snap a few pics of the FreeBSD booth. Enjoy. http://www.freebsd.org/~unfurl/linuxworld99/ -Bill -- -=| Bill Swingle - unfurl@dub.net - unfurl@freebsd.org - bill@cdrom.com -=| "Computers are useless. They can only give you answers" Pablo Picasso To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sat Aug 14 11:55:59 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from neptune.psn.net (neptune.psn.net [207.211.58.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A929914C1A; Sat, 14 Aug 1999 11:55:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from will@shadow.blackdawn.com) Received: from 5042-243.008.popsite.net ([209.224.140.243] helo=shadow.blackdawn.com) by neptune.psn.net with esmtp (PSN Internet Service 2.12 #3) id 11Fixz-00033m-00; Sat, 14 Aug 1999 11:55:43 -0700 Received: (from will@localhost) by shadow.blackdawn.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id OAA25481; Sat, 14 Aug 1999 14:55:33 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from will) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <19990814033619.A85998@dub.net> Date: Sat, 14 Aug 1999 14:55:30 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: Will Andrews From: Will Andrews To: Bill Swingle Subject: RE: Pics from LinuxWorld Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 14-Aug-99 Bill Swingle wrote: > LinuxWorld was a blast. In the midst of the constant business I was able > to snap a few pics of the FreeBSD booth. Enjoy. > > http://www.freebsd.org/~unfurl/linuxworld99/ Awesome pictures, very small too! Nice booth, too. I'm glad you decided to use the old-fashioned FreeBSD daemon instead of the newer one. :-) I wonder what Linuxites thought when they saw that swivel standing out in a sea of Linux... Erm, who's the guy behind the booth in mvc-068s.jpg? -- Will Andrews To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sat Aug 14 12:55:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from magnesium.net (toxic.magnesium.net [204.188.6.238]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 92A1B14EDC for ; Sat, 14 Aug 1999 12:55:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from unfurl@magnesium.net) Received: (qmail 88262 invoked by uid 1001); 14 Aug 1999 19:55:33 -0000 Date: Sat, 14 Aug 1999 12:55:33 -0700 From: Bill Swingle To: Will Andrews Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Pics from LinuxWorld Message-ID: <19990814125533.D88115@dub.net> References: <19990814033619.A85998@dub.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.6i In-Reply-To: ; from Will Andrews on Sat, Aug 14, 1999 at 02:55:30PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, Aug 14, 1999 at 02:55:30PM -0400, Will Andrews wrote: > On 14-Aug-99 Bill Swingle wrote: > > LinuxWorld was a blast. In the midst of the constant business I was able > > to snap a few pics of the FreeBSD booth. Enjoy. > > > > http://www.freebsd.org/~unfurl/linuxworld99/ > > Awesome pictures, very small too! Nice booth, too. I'm glad you decided to use > the old-fashioned FreeBSD daemon instead of the newer one. :-) I think the new daemon is on it's way out altogether ... > I wonder what Linuxites thought when they saw that swivel standing > out in a sea of Linux... They were very curious for hte most part. It was a good thing ;) > Erm, who's the guy behind the booth in mvc-068s.jpg? Len Vinci, Walnut Creek CDROM employee. -Bill -- -=| Bill Swingle - unfurl@dub.net - unfurl@freebsd.org - bill@cdrom.com -=| "Computers are useless. They can only give you answers" Pablo Picasso To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sat Aug 14 21:47:44 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mpp.pro-ns.net (mpp.pro-ns.net [208.200.182.72]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3DAA3152AE; Sat, 14 Aug 1999 21:47:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mpp@mpp.pro-ns.net) Received: (from mpp@localhost) by mpp.pro-ns.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA02108; Sat, 14 Aug 1999 23:47:52 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from mpp) From: Mike Pritchard Message-Id: <199908150447.XAA02108@mpp.pro-ns.net> Subject: Re: BSD XFS Port & BSD VFS Rewrite In-Reply-To: from Ben Rosengart at "Aug 14, 1999 09:43:11 pm" To: ben@skunk.org (Ben Rosengart) Date: Sat, 14 Aug 1999 23:47:52 -0500 (CDT) Cc: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Reply-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL54 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > On Sat, 14 Aug 1999, Leif Neland wrote: > > > > > [Regarding GPL] Can we please get this discussion out of -hackers, and into somewhere more apporipate like freebsd-advocacy. -- Mike Pritchard mpp@FreeBSD.ORG or mpp@mpp.pro-ns.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message