From owner-freebsd-fs Sun Jan 23 1:17:45 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mail4.aracnet.com (mail4.aracnet.com [216.99.193.36]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77DB814D2A for ; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 01:17:43 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from beattie@aracnet.com) Received: from shell1.aracnet.com (IDENT:root@shell1.aracnet.com [216.99.193.21]) by mail4.aracnet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA15725; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 01:17:49 -0800 Received: from localhost by shell1.aracnet.com (8.9.3) id BAA05112; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 01:19:25 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: shell1.aracnet.com: beattie owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 01:19:25 -0800 (PST) From: Brian Beattie To: Assar Westerlund Cc: Greg Lehey , Robert Watson , fs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: UDF, userfs In-Reply-To: <5liu0l1ay3.fsf@assaris.sics.se> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On 23 Jan 2000, Assar Westerlund wrote: > Greg Lehey writes: > > Hmm. A kld runs in kernel context, not user context. Sure, it's > > easier to load than rebuilding a kernel, and I believe klds are the > > correct approach to added kernel functionality, but it doesn't offer > > one of the prime advantages of userland development: if your program > > crashes, your program crashes, not the system. If you're developing a > > kld, a bug can crash the system. > > Yes, but both the Coda and the Arla kld are very simple and all the I would disagree that they are very simple. > real work (and thus, the devlopment) takes part in the user space > daemon. The kld is mostly there as a way of communicating with the > kernel. > > /assar > Brian Beattie | The only problem with beattie@aracnet.com | winning the rat race ... www.aracnet.com/~beattie | in the end you're still a rat To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-fs" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-fs Sun Jan 23 2:21:14 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from assaris.sics.se (assaris.sics.se [193.10.66.234]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED7FD14C1D for ; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 02:21:03 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from assar@assaris.sics.se) Received: (from assar@localhost) by assaris.sics.se (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA89006; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 11:21:11 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from assar) To: Brian Beattie Cc: Greg Lehey , Robert Watson , fs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: UDF, userfs References: From: Assar Westerlund Date: 23 Jan 2000 11:21:09 +0100 In-Reply-To: Brian Beattie's message of "Sun, 23 Jan 2000 01:19:25 -0800 (PST)" Message-ID: <5l1z79um0a.fsf@assaris.sics.se> Lines: 11 User-Agent: Gnus/5.070098 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.98) Emacs/20.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Brian Beattie writes: > > Yes, but both the Coda and the Arla kld are very simple and all the > > I would disagree that they are very simple. Well, make that `simple and much simpler than the corresponding code inside the kernel would be' then? The point is that you're keeping most of the complexity and the code that changes outside of the kernel. /assar To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-fs" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-fs Sun Jan 23 7:38:39 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [204.156.12.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2293157C6 for ; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 07:38:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from robert@cyrus.watson.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (robert@fledge.pr.watson.org [192.0.2.3]) by fledge.watson.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA05268; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 10:38:25 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from robert@cyrus.watson.org) Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 10:38:25 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Watson X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org Reply-To: Robert Watson To: Brian Beattie Cc: Assar Westerlund , Greg Lehey , fs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: UDF, userfs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sun, 23 Jan 2000, Brian Beattie wrote: > On 23 Jan 2000, Assar Westerlund wrote: > > > Yes, but both the Coda and the Arla kld are very simple and all the > > I would disagree that they are very simple. XFS provides the necessary behavior to support a userland process backing a file system visible through the kernel. That's not going to be simple to do, and XFS does a great job at being about as simple as it can get and do the job right :-). If it doesn't appear simple, it's because file systems aren't simple :-). Seriously, though, the expectation that a userfs module be easy to use may be asking a lot. What XFS might benefit from is a userland library that provides a "pretty" interface to /dev/xfs0, so that the user process doesn't have to interact directly with the LPCs, instead it sees a function interface. Last I checked, that already existed to some extent, but that piece of the code wasn't seperable from Arla. Assar--do you guys support multiple /dev/xfsX's running at the same time? Last I checked, I was under the impression that you didn't, but that was a while ago and could also have been a false impression :-). Robert N M Watson robert@fledge.watson.org http://www.watson.org/~robert/ PGP key fingerprint: AF B5 5F FF A6 4A 79 37 ED 5F 55 E9 58 04 6A B1 TIS Labs at Network Associates, Safeport Network Services To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-fs" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-fs Sun Jan 23 8:55:44 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from assaris.sics.se (assaris.sics.se [193.10.66.234]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 34B2414C98 for ; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 08:55:39 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from assar@assaris.sics.se) Received: (from assar@localhost) by assaris.sics.se (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA06787; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 17:55:39 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from assar) To: Robert Watson Cc: Brian Beattie , Greg Lehey , fs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: UDF, userfs References: From: Assar Westerlund Date: 23 Jan 2000 17:55:37 +0100 In-Reply-To: Robert Watson's message of "Sun, 23 Jan 2000 10:38:25 -0500 (EST)" Message-ID: <5lk8l0afsm.fsf@assaris.sics.se> Lines: 19 User-Agent: Gnus/5.070098 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.98) Emacs/20.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Robert Watson writes: > be asking a lot. What XFS might benefit from is a userland library that > provides a "pretty" interface to /dev/xfs0, so that the user process > doesn't have to interact directly with the LPCs, instead it sees a > function interface. Last I checked, that already existed to some extent, > but that piece of the code wasn't seperable from Arla. Yeah - `rip out the pieces you need from arlad is a particular pretty interface' but we're working on moving those parts out out and making a library of them. > Assar--do you guys support multiple /dev/xfsX's running at the same time? > Last I checked, I was under the impression that you didn't, but that was a > while ago and could also have been a false impression :-). Yes, we do. Currently it's hard-coded at two minor devices but that should be more dynamic. /assar To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-fs" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-fs Sun Jan 23 13:25:41 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from cs.columbia.edu (cs.columbia.edu [128.59.16.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A024E14EE0 for ; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 13:25:39 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ezk@shekel.mcl.cs.columbia.edu) Received: from shekel.mcl.cs.columbia.edu (shekel.mcl.cs.columbia.edu [128.59.18.15]) by cs.columbia.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA17725; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 16:25:38 -0500 (EST) Received: (from ezk@localhost) by shekel.mcl.cs.columbia.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) id QAA28218; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 16:25:37 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 16:25:37 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200001232125.QAA28218@shekel.mcl.cs.columbia.edu> X-Authentication-Warning: shekel.mcl.cs.columbia.edu: ezk set sender to ezk@shekel.mcl.cs.columbia.edu using -f From: Erez Zadok To: Brian Beattie Cc: fs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: UDF, userfs In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 21 Jan 2000 10:19:36 PST." Sender: owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org There's another option: wrapfs---a kernel-level stackable f/s template that you can use, modify, and get whatever functionality you want. In-kernel means better performance which may be very important for a dvd application. Wrapfs works around the old nullfs deficiencies (which are being addressed nowadays by fixing the VFS). You can get a paper (Usenix '99) and s/w from http://www.cs.columbia.edu/~ezk/research/ Erez. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-fs" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-fs Sun Jan 23 13:34:39 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from cs.columbia.edu (cs.columbia.edu [128.59.16.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 276A414D25 for ; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 13:34:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ezk@shekel.mcl.cs.columbia.edu) Received: from shekel.mcl.cs.columbia.edu (shekel.mcl.cs.columbia.edu [128.59.18.15]) by cs.columbia.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA18296; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 16:34:32 -0500 (EST) Received: (from ezk@localhost) by shekel.mcl.cs.columbia.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) id QAA28564; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 16:34:32 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 16:34:32 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200001232134.QAA28564@shekel.mcl.cs.columbia.edu> X-Authentication-Warning: shekel.mcl.cs.columbia.edu: ezk set sender to ezk@shekel.mcl.cs.columbia.edu using -f From: Erez Zadok To: Chuck McCrobie Cc: fs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Userfs Daemon Dies, What Happens? & Caching Questions In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 22 Jan 2000 14:32:58 EST." <388A05EA.E8CE2EBA@apl.jhu.edu> Sender: owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org In message <388A05EA.E8CE2EBA@apl.jhu.edu>, Chuck McCrobie writes: > I've been following the discussion about the userfs. I'm wondering > what happens if, while the pseudo-device is mounted, the daemon dies. > Doesn't that tend to "fudge" up the pseudo-device? I've only just > started into file system implementations for FreeBSD, so sorry if the > answer is obvious... As the maintainer of am-utils (amd), I can tell you with confidence: you're SOL. :-) Seriously, user-level f/s servers should be considered system (read: kernel) services. What happens if a kernel module dies? Your machine must reboot, right? When amd or something like it dies, it may leave an active struct vfs mounted in the kernel, and several processes hung and un-killable (not even -9) b/c the daemon was mounted with the "hard" option. > It would seem that some type of recovery would be necessary for the > new daemon when its started. If you want to mount the new daemon on the same mnt pt, using the same resources (such port address, etc.) then you must first umount the old hung mnt pt. That's usually requires a reboot. What's needed is a forced-unmount that will remove the in-kernel struct vfs no-questions-asked, *and* release any resources associated with that VFS (such as hung processes). Some OSs have a fumount() syscall, but it doesn't do all of that. (A while back I've written a kmem program for sunos4 which did just that.) All of the problems of user-level NFS servers are fixed with autofs (at least the latest version of it as of Solaris 2.6). > Does the userfs handle caching of disk blocks? Does it handle caching > of inodes? Does it handle caching of directory data? If so, the userfs > would then not benefit from the caching algorithms in the kernel? > > Chuck McCrobie (** MAD VAX **) > mccrobi@apl.jhu.edu > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-fs" in the body of the message Erez. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-fs" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-fs Sun Jan 23 19:11:23 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from yana.lemis.com (yana.lemis.com [192.109.197.140]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75AE914DF1 for ; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 19:11:06 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@mojave.worldwide.lemis.com) Received: from mojave.worldwide.lemis.com (j37.ktb6.jaring.my [161.142.234.51]) by yana.lemis.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA12742; Mon, 24 Jan 2000 13:39:31 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from grog@mojave.worldwide.lemis.com) Received: (from grog@localhost) by mojave.worldwide.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA01332; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 15:51:59 +0800 (MYT) (envelope-from grog) Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 15:51:59 +0800 From: Greg Lehey To: Robert Watson Cc: Brian Beattie , fs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Passing information from kernel to user (was: UDF, userfs) Message-ID: <20000123155159.B1272@mojave.worldwide.lemis.com> Reply-To: Greg Lehey References: <20000122131942.D391@mojave.worldwide.lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0i In-Reply-To: <20000122131942.D391@mojave.worldwide.lemis.com>; from grog@lemis.com on Sat, Jan 22, 2000 at 01:19:42PM +0800 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Saturday, 22 January 2000 at 13:19:42 +0800, Greg Lehey wrote: > On Friday, 21 January 2000 at 18:54:15 -0500, Robert Watson wrote: >> Both the Arla and Coda file systems are distributed file systems >> managed from userland processes. They do this by providing loadable >> kernel modules (or static compiled in code) to allow userland >> processes to listen on a device file (/dev/xfsX for Arla, /dev/codaX >> for Coda) and receive "upcalls" from the kernel. > > This is an interesting concept. One of the ideas I have on a back > burner (well, at least I haven't forgotten about it :-) is a Samba > issue. The way the SMB protocol works, it's possible that a remote > workstation will send a message to the owner of Oops, sorry, don't know how this one escaped. I'll describe the issue in more detail later when I have time. Greg -- Finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key See complete headers for address and phone numbers To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-fs" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-fs Sun Jan 23 19:12:10 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from macalpine.cornfed.com (macalpine.cornfed.com [208.58.42.162]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8DAFB14FC7 for ; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 19:12:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from fwmiller@macalpine.cornfed.com) Received: (from fwmiller@localhost) by macalpine.cornfed.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) id WAA12877; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 22:10:58 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from fwmiller) From: "Frank W. Miller" Message-Id: <200001240310.WAA12877@macalpine.cornfed.com> Subject: File system tests To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 22:10:58 -0500 (EST) Cc: fwmiller@macalpine.cornfed.com (Frank W. Miller) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL43 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Greetings, First, let me apologize for using this list for this. I'm writing a new file system for another operating system. The only real tie to FreeBSD is that I am cross developing the system using 3.1. The main reason I'm using this list is that I know there's lots o savvy file system folks here from following the list for several years. So, I hope I dont get people too mad about this. What I'm looking for is a test suite that can be used to exercise a POSIX file system interface. I'm looking for two kinds of tests: 1) Tests of individual routines to make sure they work correctly, i.e. return the right values when various error conditions are thrown at them. 2) A test or set of tests that will exercise the file system over a long period of time, perhaps throwing random operations at it or perhaps using distributions to throw various operations at it. Anyone know of such a test suite? What sort of code is used to test the FreeBSD file systems for things like regression testing? Thanks, FM -- Frank W. Miller Cornfed Systems Inc www.cornfed.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-fs" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-fs Sun Jan 23 20:49:46 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from yana.lemis.com (yana.lemis.com [192.109.197.140]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C79AD150A2 for ; Sun, 23 Jan 2000 20:49:40 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@mojave.worldwide.lemis.com) Received: from mojave.worldwide.lemis.com (j13.ktb6.jaring.my [161.142.234.27]) by yana.lemis.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA12821; Mon, 24 Jan 2000 15:19:12 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from grog@mojave.worldwide.lemis.com) Received: (from grog@localhost) by mojave.worldwide.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA02881; Mon, 24 Jan 2000 12:44:53 +0800 (MYT) (envelope-from grog) Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 12:44:53 +0800 From: Greg Lehey To: Assar Westerlund , Brian Beattie Cc: Robert Watson , fs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: UDF, userfs Message-ID: <20000124124453.G2643@mojave.worldwide.lemis.com> Reply-To: Greg Lehey References: <5l1z79um0a.fsf@assaris.sics.se> <5liu0l1ay3.fsf@assaris.sics.se> <20000122131656.C391@mojave.worldwide.lemis.com> <5liu0l1ay3.fsf@assaris.sics.se> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0i In-Reply-To: <5liu0l1ay3.fsf@assaris.sics.se>; from assar@sics.se on Sun, Jan 23, 2000 at 08:52:52AM +0100 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sunday, 23 January 2000 at 8:52:52 +0100, Assar Westerlund wrote: > Greg Lehey writes: >> Hmm. A kld runs in kernel context, not user context. Sure, it's >> easier to load than rebuilding a kernel, and I believe klds are the >> correct approach to added kernel functionality, but it doesn't offer >> one of the prime advantages of userland development: if your program >> crashes, your program crashes, not the system. If you're developing a >> kld, a bug can crash the system. > > Yes, but both the Coda and the Arla kld are very simple and all the > real work (and thus, the devlopment) takes part in the user space > daemon. The kld is mostly there as a way of communicating with the > kernel. They work now. How long did it take to debug them? On Sunday, 23 January 2000 at 11:21:09 +0100, Assar Westerlund wrote: > Brian Beattie writes: >>> Yes, but both the Coda and the Arla kld are very simple and all the >> >> I would disagree that they are very simple. > > Well, make that `simple and much simpler than the corresponding code > inside the kernel would be' then? The point is that you're keeping > most of the complexity and the code that changes outside of the > kernel. It sounds like what you're saying is that the kld is an interface to userland code which does work which would normally be in the kernel. That's different from most klds, which contain code identical to that in the kernel. That might be an option, but in fact the old block device interface was exactly such an option. My suggestion to have it as a kld appears to be pretty much the same concept as what you're talking about, though I suspect the interface would be at a lower level. Greg -- Finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key See complete headers for address and phone numbers To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-fs" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-fs Mon Jan 24 3:51:34 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from relay3.mail.uk.psi.net (relay3.mail.uk.psi.net [154.32.109.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9290014DFF for ; Mon, 24 Jan 2000 03:51:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from smcintyr@allstor-sw.co.uk) Received: from mail.plasmon.co.uk ([193.115.5.217]) by relay3.mail.uk.psi.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 12Ci0v-0004uc-00; Mon, 24 Jan 2000 11:50:34 +0000 Received: from virgo.software.plasmon ([193.115.4.42]) by mail.plasmon.co.uk (Lotus SMTP MTA v4.6.4 (830.2 3-23-1999)) with SMTP id 80256870.00410A72; Mon, 24 Jan 2000 11:50:25 +0000 Received: from mail by virgo.software.plasmon with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12ChzB-000810-00 (FreeBSD); Mon, 24 Jan 2000 11:48:45 +0000 Received: from steve by leo.software.plasmon with local (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12ChzA-0001T9-00 (Debian); Mon, 24 Jan 2000 11:48:44 +0000 To: mccrobi@aplcenMP.apl.jhu.edu Subject: Re: UDF, userfs In-Reply-To: Cc: fs@freebsd.org Message-Id: From: Steve McIntyre Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 11:48:44 +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org you write: > >There are some file systems in the commerical world that "uplink" to >a user mode daemon that does the actual on-disk work. Without naming >names, I can think of at least two that actually do this... > >They present a pseudo-device which the end-user mounts. This >pseudo-device catches all the file system requests and "up calls" the >user mode daemon. The user mode daemon than talks to the real device to >perform the i/o. I may be able to provide details of the process from >another Unix system, but not actual code. > >This approach seems to handle many o/s'es in that the daemon can be made >somewhat portable. The pseudo-device, however, is of necessity o/s >specific. You're spot on with the description above - we have jukebox management software that does exactly this. Our method is portable to AIX, Solaris, FreeBSD and NT right now, Linux and HP-UX support is coming soon. -- Steve McIntyre Allstor Software www.allstor-sw.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-fs" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-fs Mon Jan 24 16:31:55 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from smtp04.primenet.com (smtp04.primenet.com [206.165.6.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17E4C15285 for ; Mon, 24 Jan 2000 16:31:47 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tlambert@usr06.primenet.com) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp04.primenet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA00734; Mon, 24 Jan 2000 17:10:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from usr06.primenet.com(206.165.6.206) via SMTP by smtp04.primenet.com, id smtpdAAAgHaWxb; Mon Jan 24 17:10:42 2000 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr06.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA13267; Mon, 24 Jan 2000 17:11:00 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <200001250011.RAA13267@usr06.primenet.com> Subject: Re: File system tests To: fwmiller@macalpine.cornfed.com (Frank W. Miller) Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2000 00:10:59 +0000 (GMT) Cc: freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG, fwmiller@macalpine.cornfed.com (Frank W. Miller) In-Reply-To: <200001240310.WAA12877@macalpine.cornfed.com> from "Frank W. Miller" at Jan 23, 2000 10:10:58 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > What I'm looking for is a test suite that can be used to exercise a POSIX > file system interface. I'm looking for two kinds of tests: > > 1) Tests of individual routines to make sure they work correctly, i.e. > return the right values when various error conditions are thrown at them. > > 2) A test or set of tests that will exercise the file system over a long > period of time, perhaps throwing random operations at it or perhaps > using distributions to throw various operations at it. > > Anyone know of such a test suite? What sort of code is used to test the > FreeBSD file systems for things like regression testing? To answer the last question first, "release". For POSIX conformance testing, you will probably want to grab a copy of NIST/PCTS -- "National Institute of Standards and Technology POSIX Conformance Test Suite". It is available for download from the NIST FTP server. Historically, I've also used the SVID III validation suite, at least for SVR4 based systems. If your "other OS" is a UNIX OS, then you will probably be able to wrangle a copy of this under that license. You will also meed TET -- "Test Environment Toolkit"; it is a framework for running validation suites. If you are going to write your own branch-path validations, or unit tests, you may also want to grab ETET -- "Extended" TET. For unit validation under FreeBSD, you might want to check out my kernel memory leak detection code; it is a validation suite that combines the ability to do unit tests with the ability to see any resulting kernel memory leaks. It's not very up to date at present, but it comes with a validation set for path name buffer leak detection on FreeBSD, so it is probably a good example of a branch path validation tool for system call interfaces. You can find it at: http://www.freebsd.org/~terry/testset.txt http://www.freebsd.org/~terry/testset.tar.gz.uu Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-fs" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-fs Tue Jan 25 6:17:57 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from abc.aaa-mainstreet.nl (abc.aaa-mainstreet.nl [195.64.77.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id A101F15205 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2000 06:17:49 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gary@hotlava.com) Received: (qmail 8689 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2000 14:19:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotlava.com) (212.186.169.239) by abc.aaa-mainstreet.nl with SMTP; 25 Jan 2000 14:19:51 -0000 Message-ID: <388DB05A.153913B7@hotlava.com> Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2000 15:16:58 +0100 From: Gary Howland Reply-To: gary@hotlava.com Organization: Hotlava Consulting X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.4-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: UDF, userfs References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Steve McIntyre wrote: > > you write: > > > >There are some file systems in the commerical world that "uplink" to > >a user mode daemon that does the actual on-disk work. Without naming > >names, I can think of at least two that actually do this... > > > >They present a pseudo-device which the end-user mounts. This > >pseudo-device catches all the file system requests and "up calls" the > >user mode daemon. The user mode daemon than talks to the real device to > >perform the i/o. I may be able to provide details of the process from > >another Unix system, but not actual code. > > > >This approach seems to handle many o/s'es in that the daemon can be made > >somewhat portable. The pseudo-device, however, is of necessity o/s > >specific. > > You're spot on with the description above - we have jukebox management > software that does exactly this. Our method is portable to AIX, Solaris, > FreeBSD and NT right now, Linux and HP-UX support is coming soon. FYI, CFS (encrypted file system) achieves similar things using a custom NFS daemon, rather than a pseudo device. Gary To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-fs" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-fs Tue Jan 25 13:12:23 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from assaris.sics.se (assaris.sics.se [193.10.66.234]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7EC6515548 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2000 13:12:10 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from assar@assaris.sics.se) Received: (from assar@localhost) by assaris.sics.se (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA28076; Tue, 25 Jan 2000 22:12:25 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from assar) To: fs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: kern/15117 seeking comitter? From: Assar Westerlund Date: 25 Jan 2000 22:12:25 +0100 Message-ID: <5lln5detza.fsf@assaris.sics.se> Lines: 4 User-Agent: Gnus/5.070098 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.98) Emacs/20.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Hi, since we're approaching all kinds of freezing, could anyone look at the PR kern/15117 and commit and/or comment? Thanks. /assar To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-fs" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-fs Fri Jan 28 11:42:46 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [204.156.12.50]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0268C15DCB for ; Fri, 28 Jan 2000 11:42:39 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from robert@cyrus.watson.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (robert@fledge.pr.watson.org [192.0.2.3]) by fledge.watson.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id OAA33938; Fri, 28 Jan 2000 14:43:03 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from robert@cyrus.watson.org) Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 14:43:03 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Watson X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org Reply-To: Robert Watson To: Assar Westerlund Cc: fs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: kern/15117 seeking comitter? In-Reply-To: <5lln5detza.fsf@assaris.sics.se> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On 25 Jan 2000, Assar Westerlund wrote: > Hi, since we're approaching all kinds of freezing, could anyone look > at the PR kern/15117 and commit and/or comment? Thanks. Assar, I'd be glad to commit it, but don't feel confident in my reviewing skills as I haven't really delved into VFS locking issues. Is this something you have a chance to exhaustively test/use in a production environment? Robert N M Watson robert@fledge.watson.org http://www.watson.org/~robert/ PGP key fingerprint: AF B5 5F FF A6 4A 79 37 ED 5F 55 E9 58 04 6A B1 TIS Labs at Network Associates, Safeport Network Services To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-fs" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-fs Fri Jan 28 14:57:41 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from assaris.sics.se (dyna225-095.nada.kth.se [130.237.225.95]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C25D14C98 for ; Fri, 28 Jan 2000 14:57:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from assar@assaris.sics.se) Received: (from assar@localhost) by assaris.sics.se (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA82828; Fri, 28 Jan 2000 23:57:49 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from assar) To: Robert Watson Cc: fs@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: kern/15117 seeking comitter? References: From: Assar Westerlund Date: 28 Jan 2000 23:57:48 +0100 In-Reply-To: Robert Watson's message of "Fri, 28 Jan 2000 14:43:03 -0500 (EST)" Message-ID: <5laelpdcsz.fsf@assaris.sics.se> Lines: 15 User-Agent: Gnus/5.070098 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.98) Emacs/20.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Robert Watson writes: Hi Robert, > I'd be glad to commit it, but don't feel confident in my reviewing skills > as I haven't really delved into VFS locking issues. Is this something you > have a chance to exhaustively test/use in a production environment? Yes, as far as I can. I've been running with this patch on both my -stable and my -current machine. And I do think it's fairly clear that the current code can lead to dead-lock. /assar To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-fs" in the body of the message