From owner-freebsd-ppc Tue May 30 17: 3:53 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Received: from intel.linux-florida.com (RRCentralFlorida-165.228.90.cfl.rr.com [24.165.228.90]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF49D37BDCC for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 17:03:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cshepher@intel.linux-florida.com) Received: (from cshepher@localhost) by intel.linux-florida.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) id e4V05gM17560 for freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org; Tue, 30 May 2000 20:05:42 -0400 Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 20:05:42 -0400 From: Christopher A Shepherd Message-Id: <200005310005.e4V05gM17560@intel.linux-florida.com> To: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Subject: FreeBSD-ppc ideas Sender: owner-freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hiyas, Haven't seen a lot of traffic on this list, but I'd like to add support to the idea of porting FreeBSD over to the powerpc. To this end, a lot of work has already been done for us (yes I know, we don't just want to recycle code), specifically.. - NetBSD has done the bootstrap, walking up the OF device tree and discovering hardware on it, as has LinuxPPC. I don't think NetBSD has the Uni-North bridge support that LinuxPPC has, however. But I think Grackle and Uni-North are the only ones we're looking to support. - NetBSD and OpenBSD, as far as I know, rely on Open Firmware to do the keyboard and display I/O, which probably isn't what we want. But perhaps it is, and X should be left up to XFree86 servers (which, I believe, now support the ATI chipsets). I use NetBSD as the example here, because (and I'm guessing here) I believe it uses the proper calling interface for functions (passing values in the proper registers, setting up the stack frame properly, etc), whereas I believe OpenBSD has adopted AIX's ABI. So the first step is to import NetBSD's ppc/ directory into the tree and let it run on the Open Firmware drivers until we get it fitting seamlessly with the rest of FreeBSD. Since I really don't know what I'm talking about yet with regard to FreeBSD's console drivers, I wouldn't know if we have to write any USB (probably not?) or ATI drivers. Has anyone started on this? I'm downloading the netbsd and freebsd trees right now to see what's required on this step. My familiarity with the trees is pretty low (I've used LinuxPPC thusfar), so I might be attempting something idiotic. -Chris To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-ppc" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-ppc Wed May 31 0:52:33 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Received: from mail3.iadfw.net (mail3.iadfw.net [209.196.123.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 385E937B6A0 for ; Wed, 31 May 2000 00:52:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jrowell@neosoft.com) Received: from fuzzy.helloworld.org from [206.109.79.186] by mail3.iadfw.net (/\##/\ Smail3.1.30.16 #30.4) with esmtp for sender: id ; Wed, 31 May 2000 02:52:31 -0500 (CDT) Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 02:49:16 -0500 (CDT) From: Jon Rowell X-Sender: jrowell@fuzzy.helloworld.org To: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Subject: subscribe Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-ppc" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-ppc Wed May 31 1:45:58 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Received: from mail-2.sjc.telocity.net (mail-2.sjc.telocity.net [216.227.56.42]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E55537B67B for ; Wed, 31 May 2000 01:45:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jasonzig@telocity.com) Received: from [10.0.1.6] (dsl-216-227-37-229.telocity.com [216.227.37.229]) by mail-2.sjc.telocity.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA18866 for ; Wed, 31 May 2000 01:43:31 -0700 (PDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 03:44:15 -0500 Subject: Re: FreeBSD-ppc ideas From: "jasonzig@telocity.com" To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200005310005.e4V05gM17560@intel.linux-florida.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Where does Apple's OSX fall in this list? Of course, it's already been ported to PPC... > From: Christopher A Shepherd > Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 20:05:42 -0400 > To: freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG > Subject: FreeBSD-ppc ideas > > Hiyas, > > Haven't seen a lot of traffic on this list, but I'd like to add support to > the idea of porting FreeBSD over to the powerpc. To this end, a lot of work > has already been done for us (yes I know, we don't just want to recycle > code), specifically.. > > - NetBSD has done the bootstrap, walking up the OF device tree and > discovering hardware on it, as has LinuxPPC. I don't think NetBSD > has the Uni-North bridge support that LinuxPPC has, however. But I think > Grackle and Uni-North are the only ones we're looking to support. > > - NetBSD and OpenBSD, as far as I know, rely on Open Firmware to do the > keyboard and display I/O, which probably isn't what we want. But perhaps > it is, and X should be left up to XFree86 servers (which, I believe, now > support the ATI chipsets). > > I use NetBSD as the example here, because (and I'm guessing here) I believe > it uses the proper calling interface for functions (passing values in the > proper registers, setting up the stack frame properly, etc), whereas I > believe OpenBSD has adopted AIX's ABI. > > So the first step is to import NetBSD's ppc/ directory into the tree and let > it run on the Open Firmware drivers until we get it fitting seamlessly with > the rest of FreeBSD. Since I really don't know what I'm talking about yet > with regard to FreeBSD's console drivers, I wouldn't know if we have to > write any USB (probably not?) or ATI drivers. > > Has anyone started on this? I'm downloading the netbsd and freebsd trees > right now to see what's required on this step. My familiarity with the trees > is pretty low (I've used LinuxPPC thusfar), so I might be attempting something > idiotic. > > -Chris > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-ppc" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-ppc" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-ppc Wed May 31 3:55:50 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Received: from raven.ravenbrook.com (raven.ravenbrook.com [193.82.131.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86EF637B58D for ; Wed, 31 May 2000 03:55:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Richard.Brooksby@pobox.com) Received: from [193.82.131.28] (skylark.ravenbrook.com [193.82.131.28]) by raven.ravenbrook.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA13967; Wed, 31 May 2000 11:55:38 +0100 (BST) From: Richard.Brooksby@pobox.com Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200005310005.e4V05gM17560@intel.linux-florida.com> References: <200005310005.e4V05gM17560@intel.linux-florida.com> Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 11:55:33 +0100 To: Christopher A Shepherd Subject: Re: FreeBSD-ppc ideas Cc: freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 2000-05-30 20:05 -0400, Christopher A Shepherd wrote: >Haven't seen a lot of traffic on this list, but I'd like to add support to >the idea of porting FreeBSD over to the powerpc. To this end, a lot of work >has already been done for us (yes I know, we don't just want to recycle >code), specifically.. Don't forget Apple Darwin OS . Presumably Apple know a lot about their own hardware and have written good drivers for it. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-ppc" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-ppc Wed May 31 8: 8:44 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Received: from trump.amber.org (trump.amber.org [209.31.146.82]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5D2937B593 for ; Wed, 31 May 2000 08:08:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from petrilli@amber.org) Received: by trump.amber.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 052425DC73; Wed, 31 May 2000 11:18:49 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 11:18:49 -0400 From: Christopher Petrilli To: freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD-ppc ideas Message-ID: <20000531111849.A5766@trump.amber.org> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG References: <200005310005.e4V05gM17560@intel.linux-florida.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0us In-Reply-To: ; from Richard.Brooksby@pobox.com on Wed, May 31, 2000 at 11:55:33AM +0100 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD Sender: owner-freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Richard.Brooksby@pobox.com [Richard.Brooksby@pobox.com] wrote: > At 2000-05-30 20:05 -0400, Christopher A Shepherd wrote: > > >Haven't seen a lot of traffic on this list, but I'd like to add support to > >the idea of porting FreeBSD over to the powerpc. To this end, a lot of work > >has already been done for us (yes I know, we don't just want to recycle > >code), specifically.. > > Don't forget Apple Darwin OS > . Presumably Apple > know a lot about their own hardware and have written good drivers for > it. This brings up a point I haven't seen addressed---or I'm just not looking enough. What platforms are we intending to support. One of the reasons that LinuxPPC was able to get up and running without major Apple information was that they restricted themselves to PCI machines. This is obviously one restriction. The other would be do we want to restrict ourselves to the same set of machines that Darwin is basically restricted to (G3 and above, I believe). As an Apple developer, it's killing some of your market, but... at least initially it should enormously simplify the effort of getting support running. Chris -- | Christopher Petrilli | petrilli@amber.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-ppc" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-ppc Wed May 31 9:36:14 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Received: from relay.nuxi.com (nuxi.cs.ucdavis.edu [169.237.7.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C1DB37B633 for ; Wed, 31 May 2000 09:36:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: from dragon.nuxi.com (nobody@relay.nuxi.com [169.237.7.38]) by relay.nuxi.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA35570; Wed, 31 May 2000 09:35:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien@dragon.nuxi.com) Received: (from obrien@localhost) by dragon.nuxi.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id JAA54542; Wed, 31 May 2000 09:35:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien) Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 09:35:35 -0700 From: "David O'Brien" To: Christopher Petrilli Cc: freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD-ppc ideas Message-ID: <20000531093535.B54453@dragon.nuxi.com> Reply-To: obrien@FreeBSD.ORG References: <200005310005.e4V05gM17560@intel.linux-florida.com> <20000531111849.A5766@trump.amber.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2i In-Reply-To: <20000531111849.A5766@trump.amber.org>; from petrilli@amber.org on Wed, May 31, 2000 at 11:18:49AM -0400 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 5.0-CURRENT Organization: The NUXI BSD group X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Keyid: 34F9F9D5 Sender: owner-freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, May 31, 2000 at 11:18:49AM -0400, Christopher Petrilli wrote: > The other would be do we want to restrict ourselves to the same set of > machines that Darwin is basically restricted to (G3 and above, I > believe). Yes, that is the approach we are taking. At least for a development platform. Targeting embedded boards is also the goal. > As an Apple developer, it's killing some of your market, but... at > least initially it should enormously simplify the effort of getting > support running. FreeBSD's main thrust is not history, that's what NetBSD's thrust is. FreeBSD's thrust is servers and now the embedded market. The means modern hardware, not some 5 year old box (unless it is *so* easy to support along with the modern hardware). -- -- David (obrien@FreeBSD.org) Disclaimer: Not speaking for FreeBSD, just expressing my own opinion. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-ppc" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-ppc Wed May 31 9:37:37 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Received: from camel.ethereal.net (camel.ethereal.net [216.200.22.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C47D37B633 for ; Wed, 31 May 2000 09:37:36 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from spam_man@camel.ethereal.net) Received: from localhost (spam_man@localhost) by camel.ethereal.net (8.10.0.Beta10/8.10.0.Beta10) with ESMTP id e4VGbBJ42417 for ; Wed, 31 May 2000 09:37:11 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 09:37:11 -0700 (PDT) From: James Scott To: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD-ppc ideas Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > This brings up a point I haven't seen addressed---or I'm just not > looking enough. What platforms are we intending to support. One of > the reasons that LinuxPPC was able to get up and running without major > Apple information was that they restricted themselves to PCI > machines. This is obviously one restriction. The other would be do > we want to restrict ourselves to the same set of machines that Darwin > is basically restricted to (G3 and above, I believe). This is the current Darwin Support list: Compatible systems for Darwin include: Power Macintosh 7300, 7600, 8500,8600, 9500, 9600 Power Macintosh G3 PowerBook G3 (Wall Street) Power Macintosh G3 (Blue & White) Power Macintosh G4 PowerBook G3 (bronze keyboard) iBook iMac This list is fairly reasonable for Darwin 1.0, there may be more that are unsupported but will work like the 7500 whitch isnt all that differnt from the 7600 or the 8500 for that matter. As far as i know MacOS X DP4's unsupported list is whats supported in darwin 1.0 but isnt listed as supported in OSX DP4. Supporting all PCI macs can be a milestone for FreeBSD-PPC, tho initial support can be limited to the darwin support list just to get things rolling. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-ppc" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-ppc Wed May 31 10: 0:19 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Received: from trump.amber.org (trump.amber.org [209.31.146.82]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A1FA37B8C7 for ; Wed, 31 May 2000 10:00:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from petrilli@amber.org) Received: by trump.amber.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 65CA05DC04; Wed, 31 May 2000 13:10:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 13:10:27 -0400 From: Christopher Petrilli To: freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD-ppc ideas Message-ID: <20000531131027.D5766@trump.amber.org> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG References: <200005310005.e4V05gM17560@intel.linux-florida.com> <20000531111849.A5766@trump.amber.org> <20000531093535.B54453@dragon.nuxi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0us In-Reply-To: <20000531093535.B54453@dragon.nuxi.com>; from obrien@FreeBSD.ORG on Wed, May 31, 2000 at 09:35:35AM -0700 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD Sender: owner-freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG David O'Brien [obrien@FreeBSD.ORG] wrote: > On Wed, May 31, 2000 at 11:18:49AM -0400, Christopher Petrilli wrote: > > The other would be do we want to restrict ourselves to the same set of > > machines that Darwin is basically restricted to (G3 and above, I > > believe). > > Yes, that is the approach we are taking. At least for a development > platform. Targeting embedded boards is also the goal. Ok, that means targeting the IBM 405 series of chips as well, which are a bit different. > > As an Apple developer, it's killing some of your market, but... at > > least initially it should enormously simplify the effort of getting > > support running. > > FreeBSD's main thrust is not history, that's what NetBSD's thrust is. > FreeBSD's thrust is servers and now the embedded market. The means modern > hardware, not some 5 year old box (unless it is *so* easy to support > along with the modern hardware). Amen ;-) Chris -- | Christopher Petrilli | petrilli@amber.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-ppc" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-ppc Fri Jun 2 11:18:13 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E163E37BAD5 for ; Fri, 2 Jun 2000 11:18:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee) Received: from localhost (narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA27510; Fri, 2 Jun 2000 20:17:47 +0200 (EET) (envelope-from narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee) Date: Fri, 2 Jun 2000 20:17:47 +0200 (EET) From: Narvi To: Christopher Petrilli Cc: freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD-ppc ideas In-Reply-To: <20000531111849.A5766@trump.amber.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 31 May 2000, Christopher Petrilli wrote: > Richard.Brooksby@pobox.com [Richard.Brooksby@pobox.com] wrote: > > At 2000-05-30 20:05 -0400, Christopher A Shepherd wrote: > > > > >Haven't seen a lot of traffic on this list, but I'd like to add support to > > >the idea of porting FreeBSD over to the powerpc. To this end, a lot of work > > >has already been done for us (yes I know, we don't just want to recycle > > >code), specifically.. > > > > Don't forget Apple Darwin OS > > . Presumably Apple > > know a lot about their own hardware and have written good drivers for > > it. > > This brings up a point I haven't seen addressed---or I'm just not > looking enough. What platforms are we intending to support. One of > the reasons that LinuxPPC was able to get up and running without major > Apple information was that they restricted themselves to PCI > machines. This is obviously one restriction. The other would be do > we want to restrict ourselves to the same set of machines that Darwin > is basically restricted to (G3 and above, I believe). > As a matter of fact I think we initally are. > As an Apple developer, it's killing some of your market, but... at > least initially it should enormously simplify the effort of getting > support running. > The thing needs to probably finally (and provided somebody actually does all the work, etc.) run on other things, inc. the 8xx series, etc. But all such things can be left out of consideration for now. > Chris > -- > | Christopher Petrilli > | petrilli@amber.org > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-ppc" in the body of the message