From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Apr 29 7:45:47 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from pasternak.w.lub.pl (pr93.lublin.sdi.tpnet.pl [217.97.36.93]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 8647037B41B for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2002 07:45:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 19747 invoked by uid 1000); 29 Apr 2002 14:44:32 -0000 Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2002 14:44:31 +0000 From: =?iso-8859-2?Q?Micha=B3?= Pasternak To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: 'make world' not so common Message-ID: <20020429144430.GA19741@lublin.t1.pl> Reply-To: Michal Pasternak Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello, what advantages (and disadvantages) does recompilation (so common thing in *BSD world) has over binary packages (deb/rpm, for example) ? -- /* Micha³ Pasternak, http://pasternak.w.lub.pl, +48606570000 */ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Apr 29 8: 8:42 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from pittgoth.com (14.zlnp1.xdsl.nauticom.net [209.195.149.111]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F5A437B41A for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2002 08:08:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (lcl234.zbzoom.net [208.236.36.234]) by pittgoth.com (8.12.3/8.12.3) with SMTP id g3TF8YSW025537; Mon, 29 Apr 2002 11:08:35 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from darklogik@pittgoth.com) Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2002 11:16:28 -0400 From: Tom Rhodes To: Michal Pasternak Cc: doc@lublin.t1.pl, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 'make world' not so common Message-Id: <20020429111628.6ec87db7.darklogik@pittgoth.com> In-Reply-To: <20020429144430.GA19741@lublin.t1.pl> References: <20020429144430.GA19741@lublin.t1.pl> X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.7.4 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-portbld-freebsd4.5) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 29 Apr 2002 14:44:31 +0000 Micha³ Pasternak wrote: > Hello, Hi, > > what advantages (and disadvantages) does recompilation (so common > thing in*BSD world) has over binary packages (deb/rpm, for example) ? For me, personally, I really enjoy the buildworld process as I can be sure that everything is up to date with the release version, all the way down to fdisk ;) For the most part, one of the things I like the most, is that my users always have the most up to date (within 2 weeks) of documentation, source code, and programs. The portupgrade utility helps me to keep the current version of every port installed, which is a significant help also! I hope your question has been answered in my mini ramble of what I like... Though this isn't a full scientific compairison hehe ;) > > -- > /* Micha³ Pasternak, http://pasternak.w.lub.pl, +48606570000 */ > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message > -- Tom (Darklogik) Rhodes www.FreeBSD.org -The Power To Serve www.Pittgoth.com -Pittgoth Discussion Portal trhodes@{Pittgoth.com, FreeBSD.org} PGP key by www: http://www.pittgoth.com/~darklogik/darklogik.key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Apr 29 8:53:10 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from rambo.simx.org (rambo.simx.org [194.17.208.54]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D159137B417 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2002 08:53:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rambo.simx.org (malin.twenty4help.se [195.67.108.195]) by rambo.simx.org (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g3TFr0qn045663; Mon, 29 Apr 2002 17:53:01 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from listsub@rambo.simx.org) Message-ID: <3CCD6C77.3030308@rambo.simx.org> Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2002 17:53:27 +0200 From: "Roger 'Rocky' Vetterberg" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4) Gecko/20011128 Netscape6/6.2.1 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Michal Pasternak Cc: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 'make world' not so common References: <20020429144430.GA19741@lublin.t1.pl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-2; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Micha³ Pasternak wrote: > Hello, > > what advantages (and disadvantages) does recompilation (so common thing in > *BSD world) has over binary packages (deb/rpm, for example) ? > The reason I like to compile from source, is that it gives me a warm, fuzzy feeling knowing the program was built from source on the very same machine it runs on. It also give me the option to compile it with flags suited for me and me alone. Lets say I install a mailserver. I then have the option to compile it with support for SSL, or, if I choose to, withouth SLL. Sure, with a binary you can disable SSL, but the SSL support will still be in the binary, even if its never used. I can specify flags and compile optimization that suits my exact needs. If I run precompiled binaries, I will have to settle with the flags the person compiling the binary found usefull, which may or may not suit my needs. The disadvantages as I see it is only one. It takes time. Installing a package may take seconds, while compiling the same program from source is likely to take atleast minutes. Some horror examples like XFree comes to mind, where installing from package may take something like 10-15 minutes, while compiling from source on a modest machine is likely to take 10-15 hours. -- R To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Apr 29 9:12:38 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from sherline.net (sherline.net [216.203.226.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id C3D7137B405 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2002 09:12:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 34867 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2002 16:12:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO cptnhosedonkey) (68.8.235.4) by sherline.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2002 16:12:30 -0000 Message-ID: <001001c1ef98$e160ced0$a700a8c0@cptnhosedonkey> From: "Jeremiah Gowdy" To: "Michal Pasternak" , References: <20020429144430.GA19741@lublin.t1.pl> Subject: Re: 'make world' not so common Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2002 09:14:02 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > what advantages (and disadvantages) does recompilation (so common thing in > *BSD world) has over binary packages (deb/rpm, for example) ? My real response is, what is the whole point of open source. If you don't have the source code on your disk, ready to be tweaked and compiled again, you will never use the source. People who live in the "binary only" world don't really take part in open source software. It is faster to install the binaries, and for some things, I do that. Of course with X, you don't want to compile it. But if one is running on such legacy hardware that buildworld takes more than 45 minutes, one probably needs to look into the fact that a Duron 1ghz cpu can be had for $35. And really, the recompilation concept used to be just as much a factor in the Linux world if you think about it. tar xvfz mysoftware.tar.gz && ./configure && make && make install These new binary packages are great for people who have such legacy hardware that compiling is a difficult option, and for people who are deploying a large number of machines (although I'd typically compile my own custom packages for such an operation), however there's no real problem with compiling if your hardware is up to date. And keep in mind, BSD has binary OS upgrades and binary packages as well. Any port should be able to make a package. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Apr 29 10:44:14 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from odin.acuson.com (odin.acuson.com [157.226.230.71]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73BFF37B417 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2002 10:44:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mvaexch02.acuson.com ([157.226.230.209]) by odin.acuson.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.54) with ESMTP id AAA6422; Mon, 29 Apr 2002 10:44:07 -0700 Received: by mvaexch02.acuson.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 29 Apr 2002 10:40:32 -0700 Received: from there (dhcp-46-115.acuson.com [157.226.46.115]) by mvaexch01.acuson.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id JXB8P4H0; Mon, 29 Apr 2002 10:41:07 -0700 From: Johnson David To: Michal Pasternak , freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Organization: Acuson Subject: Re: 'make world' not so common Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2002 10:44:02 -0700 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.2] References: <20020429144430.GA19741@lublin.t1.pl> In-Reply-To: <20020429144430.GA19741@lublin.t1.pl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20020429174410.73BFF37B417@hub.freebsd.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Monday 29 April 2002 07:44 am, Micha³ Pasternak wrote: > what advantages (and disadvantages) does recompilation (so common thing in > *BSD world) has over binary packages (deb/rpm, for example) ? I have a fast machine, so it doesn't take that long to rebuild everything. If make buildworld took all night, I probably wouldn't do it. Same for ports. The big advantage for me is that I get to optimize my software for my machine. By default, all of the packages are built for generic i386 computers. But I am running a P4 at work and an Athlon at home. By using optimization in my make.conf, I end up with about a 15% speed improvement. You can't use optimization for the kernel, but you can for the rest of userland. David To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message