From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Feb 9 03:39:07 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3EC8016A4CE for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 03:39:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from f22.mail.ru (f22.mail.ru [194.67.57.55]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0715E43D1D for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 03:39:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from alcaralimo@mail.ru) Received: from mail by f22.mail.ru with local id 1Aq9kn-000Lh5-00 for freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 14:39:05 +0300 Received: from [212.22.71.26] by msg.mail.ru with HTTP; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 14:39:05 +0300 From: =?koi8-r?Q?=22?=Robert Fakhrtdinov=?koi8-r?Q?=22=20?= To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: mPOP Web-Mail 2.19 X-Originating-IP: unknown via proxy [212.22.71.26] Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 14:39:05 +0300 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 05:45:05 -0800 Subject: Haw to find Distribution? X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: =?koi8-r?Q?=22?=Robert Fakhrtdinov=?koi8-r?Q?=22=20?= List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 11:39:07 -0000 Hello All, Anybody, tell me please, where can I find Free BSD Cluster Disribution? From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Feb 9 22:08:50 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 39DAC16A4CE for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 22:08:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from mika.hanulec.com (mika.hanulec.com [216.40.244.65]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id E404043D1F for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 22:08:49 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hanulec@hanulec.com) Received: (qmail 31022 invoked by uid 101); 10 Feb 2004 06:08:48 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 10 Feb 2004 06:08:48 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 01:08:48 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Hanulec To: =?koi8-r?Q?=22?=Robert Fakhrtdinov=?koi8-r?Q?=22=20?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII cc: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Haw to find Distribution? X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 06:08:50 -0000 Robert.. I haven't heard of a *BSD Cluster Distribution. I think most BSD folks build up a cluster the way Linux users used to, by installing various packages themselves as needed. If your looking for a BSD equivalent to something like Oscar I've haven't ever seen one. The good news, a lot of the parts from Oscar, minus the System Installation Suite, could be used after downloading, installing and configuring them yourself. They also might be in ports, but I haven't looked. -Mike -- hanulec@hanulec.com cell: 858.518.2647 && 516.410.4478 https://secure.hanulec.com EFnet irc && aol im: hanulec On Mon, 9 Feb 2004, [koi8-r] "Robert Fakhrtdinov[koi8-r] " wrote: > Hello All, > Anybody, tell me please, where can I find Free BSD Cluster Disribution? > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-cluster > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-cluster-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > > > From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Feb 9 22:35:34 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 729C916A4CE for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 22:35:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from tomoyo.MyBSD.org.my (duke.void.net.my [202.157.183.130]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2978843D2F for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 22:35:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from www@tomoyo.MyBSD.org.my) Received: by tomoyo.MyBSD.org.my (Postfix, from userid 80) id 9D6C06CC21; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:39:07 +0800 (MYT) Received: from phpmailer ([202.157.183.139]) by 202.157.183.139 with HTTP (VOiD); Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:39:07 +0800 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:39:07 +0800 To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org From: zam4ever Message-ID: <187a6c3bb6bd5002259b39e485140752@202.157.183.139> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: VOiDMAIL [PHPMailer version 1.70] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: Re: Haw to find Distribution? X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: zam4ever List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 06:35:34 -0000 > Message: 1 > Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 14:39:05 +0300 > From: "Robert Fakhrtdinov" <alcaralimo@mail.ru> > Subject: Haw to find Distribution? > To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org > Message-ID: <E1Aq9kn-000Lh5-00.alcaralimo-mail-ru@f22.mail.ru> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r > > Hello All, > Anybody, tell me please, where can I find Free BSD Cluster Disribution? BSD Clustering ============== http://www.emulab.net/index.php3 http://eurobsdcon.org/papers/#souvatzis http://guinness.cs.stevens-tech.edu/~jschauma/hpcf/ http://bsd.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/10/20/1523252&mode=thread&tid=122&tid=185&tid=190 http://bsd.slashdot.org/bsd/03/11/05/1536226.shtml?tid=122&tid=185&tid=190 "Building a High-performance Computing Cluster Using FreeBSD" http://people.freebsd.org/~brooks/papers/bsdcon2003/ -- If something looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, what is it? From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 10 01:37:46 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C015816A4CE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 01:37:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.177]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E03843D1D for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 01:37:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sporner@nentec.de) Received: from [212.227.126.155] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1AqUKp-0006d6-00; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:37:39 +0100 Received: from [194.25.215.66] (helo=gate.nentec.de) (TLSv1:EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1AqUKl-0005vo-00; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:37:39 +0100 Received: from nenny.nentec.de (nenny.nentec.de [153.92.64.1]) by gate.nentec.de (8.11.3/) with ESMTP id i1A9avd04350; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:36:57 +0100 Received: from nentec.de (andromeda.nentec.de [153.92.64.34]) by nenny.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id i1A9aKn19991; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:36:31 +0100 Message-ID: <4028A614.8030103@nentec.de> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:36:20 +0100 From: Andy Sporner User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.2a) Gecko/20020910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: zam4ever References: <187a6c3bb6bd5002259b39e485140752@202.157.183.139> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS-perl11-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:56ea142331898a06f3703ddc80e12bc5 cc: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Haw to find Distribution? X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:37:47 -0000 Hi, I don't know what to think this way because you have left out my offering, which has been here for some time. Look at some of the old posts. More specifically go to Google and put in "freebsd clustering" here is the outcome: *freebsd*.*cluster* - news.gw.com *...* (none). Mike Koning. 08.01. Re: *FreeBSD* *Cluster* software/FREP. Andy Sporner. 01.01. *...* confirm. Robert. 23.12. Andy Sporner's *FreeBSD* *cluster* software. dingo. 01.12. *...* news.gw.com/freebsd.cluster/ - 9k - 8 Feb 2004 - Cached - Similar pages I get about 2-5 downloads a week on my server. I am content to provide the software as there seems to be a need for this--not withstanding that this has been a project (originally in NetBSD--And still there) since 1995. I would *again* ask for assistance in testing. If the answer is like this one I would seriously consider removing the work from the public domain and make money off it. :-) Cheers Andy zam4ever wrote: >>Message: 1 >>Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 14:39:05 +0300 >>From: "Robert Fakhrtdinov" <alcaralimo@mail.ru> >>Subject: Haw to find Distribution? >>To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org >>Message-ID: <E1Aq9kn-000Lh5-00.alcaralimo-mail-ru@f22.mail.ru> >>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r >> >> Hello All, >>Anybody, tell me please, where can I find Free BSD Cluster Disribution? >> >> > >BSD Clustering >============== >http://www.emulab.net/index.php3 >http://eurobsdcon.org/papers/#souvatzis >http://guinness.cs.stevens-tech.edu/~jschauma/hpcf/ >http://bsd.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/10/20/1523252&mode=thread&tid=122&tid=185&tid=190 > >http://bsd.slashdot.org/bsd/03/11/05/1536226.shtml?tid=122&tid=185&tid=190 > >"Building a High-performance Computing Cluster Using FreeBSD" >http://people.freebsd.org/~brooks/papers/bsdcon2003/ > >-- >If something looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, >what is it? >_______________________________________________ >freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org mailing list >http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-cluster >To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-cluster-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > > > > From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 10 02:03:14 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3607716A4CE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 02:03:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from knight.ixsystems.net (afg.ixsystems.net [206.40.55.73]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB13C43D1F for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 02:03:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from matto@knight.ixsystems.net) Received: from knight.ixsystems.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by knight.ixsystems.net (8.12.10/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1A9pGjL018154; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 01:51:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from matto@knight.ixsystems.net) Received: (from matto@localhost) by knight.ixsystems.net (8.12.10/8.12.9/Submit) id i1A9pFF9018153; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 01:51:15 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from matto) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 01:51:15 -0800 From: Matt Olander To: Andy Sporner Message-ID: <20040210015115.C17961@knight.ixsystems.net> References: <187a6c3bb6bd5002259b39e485140752@202.157.183.139> <4028A614.8030103@nentec.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5.1i In-Reply-To: <4028A614.8030103@nentec.de>; from sporner@nentec.de on Tue, Feb 10, 2004 at 10:36:20AM +0100 cc: zam4ever cc: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Haw to find Distribution? X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:03:14 -0000 On Tue, Feb 10, 2004 at 10:36:20AM +0100, Andy Sporner wrote: > I get about 2-5 downloads a week on my server. > > I am content to provide the software as there seems to be a need > for this--not withstanding that this has been a project (originally > in NetBSD--And still there) since 1995. > > > I would *again* ask for assistance in testing. If the answer is > like this one I would seriously consider removing the work from > the public domain and make money off it. > hi Andy, we'd love to help test! I'll get it going sometime next week, after I make it through a new product release ;) also, Brooks and I did a brief segment on clustering on TechTV a little while ago. I know Brooks mentioned doing a 'how to', but I don't believe he's had the time. http://www.offmyserver.com/cgi-bin/store/cluster.html cheers, -matt -- Matt Olander (408)943-4100 Phone (408)943-4101 Fax www.offmyserver.com -- "Those who don't read have no advantage over those who can't" -Mark Twain From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 10 02:51:39 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7D8F16A4CE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 02:51:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.uk.psi.com (mail.uk.psi.com [154.8.2.142]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0C0243D1D for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 02:51:39 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from alan.barrow@psineteurope.com) Received: from ip16.ops.uk.psi.com ([154.8.22.16]) by mail.uk.psi.com with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AqVTc-00061G-00; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:50:48 +0000 From: alan barrow To: Matt Olander In-Reply-To: <20040210015115.C17961@knight.ixsystems.net> References: <187a6c3bb6bd5002259b39e485140752@202.157.183.139> <20040210015115.C17961@knight.ixsystems.net> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.8 (1.0.8-9.7x.1) Date: 10 Feb 2004 10:50:47 +0000 Message-Id: <1076410247.1150.28.camel@ip16.ops.uk.psi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 cc: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Haw to find Distribution? X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:51:40 -0000 Andy :) The old adage holds true "ask and you shall receive" I have been working towards generating a TOR - functional specification for a PVFS and dual head end scenario. The system will be dealing with Neflow traffic coming off of 2 gigabyte links. I will be keeping my log book well and truly up to date and will have time to generate some form of HowTo. Out of interest would it be worthwhile establishing a channel on freenode so as we can all correspond .. live as it where ? #bsd-cluster ??? or otherwise yours a.r.b. On Tue, 2004-02-10 at 09:51, Matt Olander wrote: > On Tue, Feb 10, 2004 at 10:36:20AM +0100, Andy Sporner wrote: > > I get about 2-5 downloads a week on my server. > > > > I am content to provide the software as there seems to be a need > > for this--not withstanding that this has been a project (originally > > in NetBSD--And still there) since 1995. > > > > > > I would *again* ask for assistance in testing. If the answer is > > like this one I would seriously consider removing the work from > > the public domain and make money off it. > > > > hi Andy, > > we'd love to help test! I'll get it going sometime next week, after I > make it through a new product release ;) > > also, Brooks and I did a brief segment on clustering on TechTV a little > while ago. I know Brooks mentioned doing a 'how to', but I don't believe > he's had the time. > > http://www.offmyserver.com/cgi-bin/store/cluster.html > > cheers, > -matt > > > -- > Matt Olander > (408)943-4100 Phone > (408)943-4101 Fax > www.offmyserver.com > -- > "Those who don't read have no advantage over those who can't" > -Mark Twain > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-cluster > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-cluster-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > -- ############################################### yours Alan R. Barrow European OSS Development Manager. Psinet Europe. Brookmount Court Kirkwood Road UK-Cambridge CB4 2QH Tel: +44 1223 577 337 Fax: +44 1223 577 600 Mob: +44 7771 597 509 From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 10 04:20:09 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04B4916A4CE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 04:20:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.189]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4FC143D1F for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 04:20:08 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sporner@nentec.de) Received: from [212.227.126.179] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1AqWs3-0003p4-00 for freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:20:07 +0100 Received: from [194.25.215.66] (helo=gate.nentec.de) (TLSv1:EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1AqWs3-0004cT-00 for freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:20:07 +0100 Received: from nenny.nentec.de (nenny.nentec.de [153.92.64.1]) by gate.nentec.de (8.11.3/) with ESMTP id i1ACK5d16279 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:20:05 +0100 Received: from nentec.de (andromeda.nentec.de [153.92.64.34]) by nenny.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id i1ACJon05459 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:19:51 +0100 Message-ID: <4028CC66.80300@nentec.de> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:19:50 +0100 From: Andy Sporner User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.2a) Gecko/20020910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-cluster References: <187a6c3bb6bd5002259b39e485140752@202.157.183.139> <4028A614.8030103@nentec.de> <20040210015115.C17961@knight.ixsystems.net> <1076410247.1150.28.camel@ip16.ops.uk.psi.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS-perl11-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:56ea142331898a06f3703ddc80e12bc5 Subject: Clustering with FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 12:20:09 -0000 Hi, It is a different subject and I sort of hate threads that are misleading. So far it hasn't happened yet, but before it can. :-) The clustering that I am offering is *NOT* Beowulf-like. It is more geared towards Internet Application HA. In other words--server X dies, what should server Y and Z do to make sure that the stuff on server X does not have to wait for server X to recover. Somewhere else on my site I have a utility called FREP. In my test area in my lab I have the two things integrated. There is in Linux-Land a thing called sometime like "Remote raw disk" (can't remember specifically what it is called) but it gives a local device node for a remote device on another machine. What FREP does (at the moment only in the lab) is to syncronize access to directories and replicate the changes done by the nodes. The idea is to be able to have a 2-3 nodes running mail servers with the spool directories replicated (locking is on the file basis). A load balancer goes on the front and with this you have a scalabale Mail server that is fault resiliant. A lot of people in the academic community are worried about Beowulf and for correct reason, but there is an often neglected area which is where Micro$oft is winning in the moment and that is in the business end of the house. Cheers. From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 10 05:45:19 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F8F516A4CE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 05:45:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from otter3.centtech.com (moat3.centtech.com [207.200.51.50]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA9C843D1F for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 05:45:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Received: from centtech.com (neutrino.centtech.com [10.177.171.220]) by otter3.centtech.com (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id i1ADjIE8060295; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 07:45:18 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Message-ID: <4028E051.2010507@centtech.com> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 07:44:49 -0600 From: Eric Anderson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040205 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Andy Sporner References: <187a6c3bb6bd5002259b39e485140752@202.157.183.139> <4028A614.8030103@nentec.de> <20040210015115.C17961@knight.ixsystems.net> <1076410247.1150.28.camel@ip16.ops.uk.psi.com> <4028CC66.80300@nentec.de> In-Reply-To: <4028CC66.80300@nentec.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit cc: freebsd-cluster Subject: Re: Clustering with FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:45:19 -0000 Andy Sporner wrote: > Hi, > > It is a different subject and I sort of hate threads that are misleading. > > So far it hasn't happened yet, but before it can. :-) The clustering that > I am offering is *NOT* Beowulf-like. It is more geared towards > Internet Application HA. In other words--server X dies, what should > server Y and Z do to make sure that the stuff on server X does not have > to wait for server X to recover. > > Somewhere else on my site I have a utility called FREP. In my test > area in my lab I have the two things integrated. > There is in Linux-Land a thing called sometime like "Remote raw > disk" (can't remember specifically what it is called) but it gives a > local device node for a remote device on another machine. > > What FREP does (at the moment only in the lab) is to syncronize > access to directories and replicate the changes done by the nodes. > The idea is to be able to have a 2-3 nodes running mail servers with > the spool directories replicated (locking is on the file basis). A > load balancer goes on the front and with this you have a scalabale > Mail server that is fault resiliant. > > A lot of people in the academic community are worried about > Beowulf and for correct reason, but there is an often neglected area > which is where Micro$oft is winning in the moment and that is > in the business end of the house. Andy - this sounds really cool. I've been looking for a solution like this for some time. I can't explain what a cool feature this would be for FreeBSD. This allows all kinds of incredible fault tolerant systems, and for me, is essential. Is this code ready for people to play with? Are you putting is under the BSDL or GPL? More info!! :) Eric -- ------------------------------------------------------------------ Eric Anderson Sr. Systems Administrator Centaur Technology Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday. ------------------------------------------------------------------ From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 10 07:01:24 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4ACB116A4CE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 07:01:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from out1.smtp.messagingengine.com (out1.smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.25]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20C7B43D39 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 07:01:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from estrabd@yahoo.com) Received: from server3.messagingengine.com (server3.internal [10.202.2.134]) by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E6F54E167D; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:01:10 -0500 (EST) Received: by server3.messagingengine.com (Postfix, from userid 99) id 4F73715A017; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:01:11 -0500 (EST) Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME::Lite 1.2 (F2.71; T1.001; A1.60; B2.21; Q2.21) From: "Brett D. Estrade" To: "Andy Sporner" , "freebsd-cluster" Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 07:01:11 -0800 X-Sasl-Enc: 9NppT1NIqrFqk31y0lyNXw 1076425271 Message-Id: <1076425271.16867.180799810@webmail.messagingengine.com> References: <187a6c3bb6bd5002259b39e485140752@202.157.183.139> <20040210015115.C17961@knight.ixsystems.net> <4028CC66.80300@nentec.de> In-Reply-To: <4028CC66.80300@nentec.de> Subject: Re: Clustering with FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 15:01:24 -0000 What are the thoughts of DragonFlyBSD's goal of being able to create a single virtual machine (1 cpu, presumably) out of many individual boxes? Brett On Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:19:50 +0100, "Andy Sporner" said: > Hi, > > It is a different subject and I sort of hate threads that are misleading. > > So far it hasn't happened yet, but before it can. :-) The clustering > that > I am offering is *NOT* Beowulf-like. It is more geared towards > Internet Application HA. In other words--server X dies, what should > server Y and Z do to make sure that the stuff on server X does not have > to wait for server X to recover. > > Somewhere else on my site I have a utility called FREP. In my test > area in my lab I have the two things integrated. > > There is in Linux-Land a thing called sometime like "Remote raw > disk" (can't remember specifically what it is called) but it gives a > local device node for a remote device on another machine. > > What FREP does (at the moment only in the lab) is to syncronize > access to directories and replicate the changes done by the nodes. > The idea is to be able to have a 2-3 nodes running mail servers with > the spool directories replicated (locking is on the file basis). A > load balancer goes on the front and with this you have a scalabale > Mail server that is fault resiliant. > > A lot of people in the academic community are worried about > Beowulf and for correct reason, but there is an often neglected area > which is where Micro$oft is winning in the moment and that is > in the business end of the house. > > Cheers. > > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-cluster > To unsubscribe, send any mail to > "freebsd-cluster-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" ===== http://www.brettsbsd.net/~estrabd __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 10 07:03:24 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CF0516A4CE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 07:03:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from otter3.centtech.com (moat3.centtech.com [207.200.51.50]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A3BD43D1D for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 07:03:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Received: from centtech.com (neutrino.centtech.com [10.177.171.220]) by otter3.centtech.com (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id i1AF3NE8070381; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:03:23 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Message-ID: <4028F29E.2010302@centtech.com> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:02:54 -0600 From: Eric Anderson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040205 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Brett D. Estrade" References: <187a6c3bb6bd5002259b39e485140752@202.157.183.139> <20040210015115.C17961@knight.ixsystems.net> <4028CC66.80300@nentec.de> <1076425271.16867.180799810@webmail.messagingengine.com> In-Reply-To: <1076425271.16867.180799810@webmail.messagingengine.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit cc: freebsd-cluster Subject: Re: Clustering with FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 15:03:24 -0000 Brett D. Estrade wrote: > What are the thoughts of DragonFlyBSD's goal of being able to create a > single virtual machine (1 cpu, presumably) out of many individual boxes? I didn't know that was a goal for dragonfly - but if it really is, I'm excited about that too.. is that vaporware, or has code writing begun for that? -- ------------------------------------------------------------------ Eric Anderson Sr. Systems Administrator Centaur Technology Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday. ------------------------------------------------------------------ From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 10 08:04:47 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6333A16A4CE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:04:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.uk.psi.com (mail.uk.psi.com [154.8.2.142]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B58C43D1F for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:04:47 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from alan.barrow@psineteurope.com) Received: from ip16.ops.uk.psi.com ([154.8.22.16]) by mail.uk.psi.com with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AqaNN-0002xH-00; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:04:41 +0000 From: alan barrow To: Eric Anderson In-Reply-To: <4028F29E.2010302@centtech.com> References: <187a6c3bb6bd5002259b39e485140752@202.157.183.139> <4028CC66.80300@nentec.de> <1076425271.16867.180799810@webmail.messagingengine.com> <4028F29E.2010302@centtech.com> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.8 (1.0.8-9.7x.1) Date: 10 Feb 2004 16:04:40 +0000 Message-Id: <1076429081.1351.53.camel@ip16.ops.uk.psi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 cc: freebsd-cluster Subject: Re: Clustering with FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:04:47 -0000 really is.. is the question.. if so it's a dream come true. On Tue, 2004-02-10 at 15:02, Eric Anderson wrote: > Brett D. Estrade wrote: > > What are the thoughts of DragonFlyBSD's goal of being able to create a > > single virtual machine (1 cpu, presumably) out of many individual boxes? > > > I didn't know that was a goal for dragonfly - but if it really is, I'm > excited about that too.. is that vaporware, or has code writing begun > for that? > > > > -- > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > Eric Anderson Sr. Systems Administrator Centaur Technology > Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday. > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-cluster > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-cluster-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > -- ############################################### yours Alan R. Barrow European OSS Development Manager. Psinet Europe. Brookmount Court Kirkwood Road UK-Cambridge CB4 2QH Tel: +44 1223 577 337 Fax: +44 1223 577 600 Mob: +44 7771 597 509 From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 10 08:08:07 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDAF216A4CE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:08:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from iota.root-servers.ch (iota.root-servers.ch [193.41.193.195]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id ECF0D43D2F for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:08:06 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gabriel_ambuehl@buz.ch) Received: (qmail 49434 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2004 16:08:05 -0000 Received: from 217-162-134-28.dclient.hispeed.ch (HELO ga) (217.162.134.28) by 0 with SMTP; 10 Feb 2004 16:08:05 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:10:04 +0100 From: Gabriel Ambuehl Organization: BUZ Internet Services X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <349799726.20040210171004@buz.ch> To: Andy Sporner In-Reply-To: <4028CC66.80300@nentec.de> References: <187a6c3bb6bd5002259b39e485140752@202.157.183.139> <4028A614.8030103@nentec.de> <20040210015115.C17961@knight.ixsystems.net> <1076410247.1150.28.camel@ip16.ops.uk.psi.com> <4028CC66.80300@nentec.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit cc: freebsd-cluster Subject: Re: Clustering with FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: gabriel_ambuehl@buz.ch List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:08:08 -0000 Hello Andy, Tuesday, February 10, 2004, 1:19:50 PM, you wrote: > What FREP does (at the moment only in the lab) is to syncronize > access to directories and replicate the changes done by the nodes. > The idea is to be able to have a 2-3 nodes running mail servers with > the spool directories replicated (locking is on the file basis). A > load balancer goes on the front and with this you have a scalabale > Mail server that is fault resiliant. Is FREP avalaible somewhere? I'd love to bang on it. Remote Raw Devices would be cool, but if there's an easy way to sync individual files, that would do a good job too. How does FREP figure out what files need to be synced (walking the tree isn't exactly fast for big servers...)? Best regards, Gabriel From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 10 08:38:22 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F3CA16A4CE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:38:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from out1.smtp.messagingengine.com (out1.smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.25]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 35DEA43D1F for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:38:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from estrabd@yahoo.com) Received: from server3.messagingengine.com (server3.internal [10.202.2.134]) by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1AE464E2730; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:37:12 -0500 (EST) Received: by server3.messagingengine.com (Postfix, from userid 99) id 098D0159D14; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:37:13 -0500 (EST) Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME::Lite 1.2 (F2.71; T1.001; A1.60; B2.21; Q2.21) From: "Brett D. Estrade" To: "alan barrow" , "Eric Anderson" Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:37:12 -0800 X-Sasl-Enc: R5HmqAkmOZrFfMk5cDLJVg 1076431032 Message-Id: <1076431032.2175.180806263@webmail.messagingengine.com> References: <187a6c3bb6bd5002259b39e485140752@202.157.183.139> <4028CC66.80300@nentec.de> <1076425271.16867.180799810@webmail.messagingengine.com> <1076429081.1351.53.camel@ip16.ops.uk.psi.com> In-Reply-To: <1076429081.1351.53.camel@ip16.ops.uk.psi.com> cc: freebsd-cluster Subject: Re: Clustering with FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:38:22 -0000 Check it out: http://groups.google.com/groups?q=dragonflybsd+virtual+eventually&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&safe=off&selm=000000%24c0e%40smth.org&rnum=2 "[22:21:16] Floid asks: As an armchair usability nut, it's easy for me to see how increased modularity and decreased maintenance headaches should free users and developers to Get Real Work Done. However, not everyone "gets it," to the point of blank stares and "That's not a usability project." Mind taking a stab at why Slashdotters should (or shouldn't) think about DragonFly on the desktop in the next five years? [22:23:49] People migrate to operating systems for a vast array of reasons. I expect that our feature set will be the primary attractor. For example, the variant symlinks that will be going in in the next few weeks. There is also a lot of interest in a kernel-supported checkmark/restore function for general userland programs and some preliminary work on that has already done. My goal is to eventually have an SSI model that works across a network and a c [22:23:49] luster capability that can arbitrarily migrate processes between hosts (SSI == single system image, which means full cache coherency across a cluster). [22:24:12] It will depend heavily on what we are able to accomplish in the next year. " On 10 Feb 2004 16:04:40 +0000, "alan barrow" said: > really is.. is the question.. if so it's a dream come true. > > On Tue, 2004-02-10 at 15:02, Eric Anderson wrote: > > Brett D. Estrade wrote: > > > What are the thoughts of DragonFlyBSD's goal of being able to create a > > > single virtual machine (1 cpu, presumably) out of many individual boxes? > > > > > > I didn't know that was a goal for dragonfly - but if it really is, I'm > > excited about that too.. is that vaporware, or has code writing begun > > for that? > > > > > > > > -- > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Eric Anderson Sr. Systems Administrator Centaur Technology > > Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > > freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org mailing list > > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-cluster > > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-cluster-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > > > -- > ############################################### > yours Alan R. Barrow > > European OSS Development Manager. > Psinet Europe. > Brookmount Court > Kirkwood Road > UK-Cambridge CB4 2QH > > Tel: +44 1223 577 337 > Fax: +44 1223 577 600 > Mob: +44 7771 597 509 ===== http://www.brettsbsd.net/~estrabd __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 10 10:17:43 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3BB0B16A4CF for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:17:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from web41503.mail.yahoo.com (web41503.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.86]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 327D043D2F for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:17:43 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from asporner@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040210181742.55466.qmail@web41503.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.131.162.30] by web41503.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:17:42 PST Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:17:42 -0800 (PST) From: Andy Sporner To: gabriel_ambuehl@buz.ch, Andy Sporner In-Reply-To: <349799726.20040210171004@buz.ch> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii cc: freebsd-cluster Subject: Re: Clustering with FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:17:43 -0000 Hi, > Is FREP avalaible somewhere? I'd love to bang on it. > Remote Raw > Devices would be cool, but if there's an easy way to > sync individual > files, that would do a good job too. The "Proof of concept" which is weak compare to the current version is available on my site at http://sporner.dyndns.org/bsdclusters/frep > > How does FREP figure out what files need to be > synced (walking the tree isn't exactly fast for big) > servers...)? That is clear. It is kind of a "throwback" to my Commodore Vic-20 days (no floppys! Tape! and 3K!) where you made a "wedge" when you wanted some kind of special behaviour. In this case I patched a couple of files (kern/vfs_syscalls, kern/vfs_vnops) whereby I watch for activities on files living in directories. Before each write operation I check to see if it is a "controlled" file and if so I secure a lock against it from the cluster monitor, meanwhile writer blocks until the grant (or it times out with a failure). When the write completes, it goes to the other node(s) and the lock is released. SO far I have been testing the concept without the locking and it is not too bad, but there are MANY opportunities for improvement (more assync for the UDP datagrams that are carrying the traffic). I really need to find out the performance of the locking, That is where I am really concerned. The Network Traffic be scaled with multiple links sending data (a feature from the clustering software) I feel that this is the right place to put the intercepts in the kernel. Otherwise with just a remote raw device you don't get over the filesystem cache problems. In this way it is handling the problem through the front door, rather than the back door. It has it's costs--that's clear, but I think the benefits are also clear. There are probably optimizations for the user-space code to delay certain activities and to "lease" locks for periods of time (that is already there but only rundimentarily). The available version the above links lack many things and is "NOT to be taken seriously" for high-end applications. There were some early testers and I got some very positive feedback (as with this time) and I have taken many of the suggestions in this version. In the next days I will put the "independant" version of the new FREP on my server. Same place (As the Germans say, "Same procedure this year--same procedure ever year" (a reference to "Dinner for One"). Look for this on Friday. The complete version I will put up some time later (as I have time to get it more or less working). Cheers Andy "S __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 10 10:20:03 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A784B16A4CE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:20:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from iota.root-servers.ch (iota.root-servers.ch [193.41.193.195]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D471C43D1D for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:20:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gabriel_ambuehl@buz.ch) Received: (qmail 64133 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2004 18:20:00 -0000 Received: from 217-162-134-28.dclient.hispeed.ch (HELO ga) (217.162.134.28) by 0 with SMTP; 10 Feb 2004 18:20:00 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:22:00 +0100 From: Gabriel Ambuehl Organization: BUZ Internet Services X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <555997119.20040210192200@buz.ch> To: freebsd-cluster In-Reply-To: <1076431032.2175.180806263@webmail.messagingengine.com> References: <187a6c3bb6bd5002259b39e485140752@202.157.183.139> <4028CC66.80300@nentec.de> <1076425271.16867.180799810@webmail.messagingengine.com> <1076429081.1351.53.camel@ip16.ops.uk.psi.com> <1076431032.2175.180806263@webmail.messagingengine.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re[2]: Clustering with FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: gabriel_ambuehl@buz.ch List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:20:03 -0000 Hello Brett, Tuesday, February 10, 2004, 5:37:12 PM, you wrote: > Check it out: > http://groups.google.com/groups?q=dragonflybsd+virtual+eventually&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&safe=off&selm=000000%24c0e%40smth.org&rnum=2 > "[22:21:16] Floid asks: As an armchair usability nut, it's > easy for me to see how increased modularity and decreased maintenance > headaches should free users and developers to Get Real Work Done. > However, not everyone "gets it," to the point of blank stares and "That's > not a usability project." Mind taking a stab at why Slashdotters should > (or shouldn't) think about DragonFly on the desktop in the next five > years? > [22:23:49] People migrate to operating systems for a vast array > of reasons. I expect that our feature set will be the primary attractor. > For example, the variant symlinks that will be going in in the next few > weeks. There is also a lot of interest in a kernel-supported > checkmark/restore function for general userland programs and some > preliminary work on that has already done. My goal is to eventually have > an SSI model that works across a network and a c > [22:23:49] luster capability that can arbitrarily migrate > processes between hosts (SSI == single system image, which means full > cache coherency across a cluster). > [22:24:12] It will depend heavily on what we are able to > accomplish in the next year. > " Very cool, but too bad their kernel is based on the 4.X codebase, so none of the neat stuff like ACLs, MAC, KSE and ULE is in there. Well if we're lucky, FreeBSD will incorporate some of their stuff. Reminds me very much of MOSIX which I've always found to be cool stuff but regrettably there's no FreeBSD version of it (and I surely can't be bothered to use Linux on a server, again). Best regards, Gabriel From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 10 10:32:26 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E570616A4CE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:32:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from iota.root-servers.ch (iota.root-servers.ch [193.41.193.195]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 159BB43D1D for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:32:26 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gabriel_ambuehl@buz.ch) Received: (qmail 65554 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2004 18:32:23 -0000 Received: from 217-162-134-28.dclient.hispeed.ch (HELO ga) (217.162.134.28) by 0 with SMTP; 10 Feb 2004 18:32:23 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:33:15 +0100 From: Gabriel Ambuehl Organization: BUZ Internet Services X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <444282470.20040210193315@buz.ch> To: Andy Sporner In-Reply-To: <20040210181742.55466.qmail@web41503.mail.yahoo.com> References: <349799726.20040210171004@buz.ch> <20040210181742.55466.qmail@web41503.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit cc: freebsd-cluster Subject: Re[2]: Clustering with FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: gabriel_ambuehl@buz.ch List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:32:27 -0000 Hello Andy, Tuesday, February 10, 2004, 7:17:42 PM, you wrote: > The "Proof of concept" which is weak compare to the > That is clear. It is kind of a "throwback" to my > Commodore Vic-20 days (no floppys! Tape! and 3K!) > where you made a "wedge" when you wanted some kind > of special behaviour. In this case I patched a > couple of files (kern/vfs_syscalls, kern/vfs_vnops) > whereby I watch for activities on files living in > directories. Before each write operation I check > to see if it is a "controlled" file and if so I > secure a lock against it from the cluster monitor, > meanwhile writer blocks until the grant (or it times > out with a failure). When the write completes, it > goes to the other node(s) and the lock is released. Maybe one could go use the audit framework of TrustedBSD for this kind of work? I know I wanted to do something like that once (mostly some sort of daemon that provides a devices which lists changed files) but I failed (not much of a wonder tho, as I can't really stand C very much and avoid it whenever possible. What can I say, I like my flashy tools for Java ;-) > a remote raw device you don't get over the filesystem > cache problems. In this way it is handling the > problem through the front door, rather than the > back door. It has it's costs--that's clear, but > I think the benefits are also clear. There are > probably optimizations for the user-space code to > delay certain activities and to "lease" locks for > periods of time (that is already there but only > rundimentarily). One of the big advantages is that you effectively have two "independent" file systems: if one FS gets corrupted, you still have the chance that the other one is intact (which is one of the things I never liked about network block devices). And of course you're free to mix and match whatever disks you have on hand. On a quick guess, I'd even venture to say that you could have something like delayed replication, where the changed data is immediately sent to the peer to be stored in a journal but commited only after some time span, thus effectively allowing to guard against admins deleting the wrong stuff (rm -rf /, anyone ;-) and even against hackers. > In the next days I will put the "independant" version > of the new FREP on my server. Same place (As the > Germans say, "Same procedure this year--same procedure > ever year" (a reference to "Dinner for One"). Zze Germans speak English? Then why for christs sake do you keep dubbing all those movies (one of the reasons I quit watching TV...). Then again, most would feel sympathethic with the piss drunk butler, of course ;-) Best regards, Gabriel From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 10 10:36:28 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9DFE16A4CE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:36:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from web41507.mail.yahoo.com (web41507.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.90]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id BA1AD43D1D for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:36:28 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from asporner@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040210183628.58032.qmail@web41507.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.131.162.30] by web41507.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:36:28 PST Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:36:28 -0800 (PST) From: Andy Sporner To: gabriel_ambuehl@buz.ch, freebsd-cluster In-Reply-To: <555997119.20040210192200@buz.ch> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: Re: Re[2]: Clustering with FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:36:29 -0000 Hi > Very cool, but too bad their kernel is based on the > 4.X codebase, > so none of the neat stuff like ACLs, MAC, KSE and > ULE is in there. Well > if we're lucky, FreeBSD will incorporate some of > their stuff. I agree to the first point. I have been doing my stuff on 5.0, but I will also support the other BSD's too. To the second point, I think there is still far too much politics between these groups from what I have reading between the lines. This is always unfortunate. In defense of the Dragonfly project I can somehow understand their situation--as I am sure time is a rare commodity there as well. I have been promising a lot of the same stuff for some time. I have been throwing "small pieces of meat" out so that hopefully the impression of vaporware does not fall to me as well. > > Reminds me very much of MOSIX which I've always > found to be cool stuff > but regrettably there's no FreeBSD version of it > (and I surely can't > be bothered to use Linux on a server, again). Funny as originally I am told that it began as a patch for BSDI! (which is the cousin of FreeBSD). When I was still somehow on communications terms with Frank from NetBSD (owner i386 port) I was told that he even still had the patches somewhere. It would be nice to get some of the European users that are close to me together to really get some momentum here. I live in Southwest Germany, near the French border (5 KM from here). I would also entertain the idea of a visit to the UK. Cheers Andy __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 10 10:47:16 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 443AA16A4CE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:47:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from web41508.mail.yahoo.com (web41508.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.91]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 3B72143D31 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:47:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from asporner@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040210184716.79927.qmail@web41508.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.131.162.30] by web41508.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:47:16 PST Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:47:16 -0800 (PST) From: Andy Sporner To: gabriel_ambuehl@buz.ch, Andy Sporner In-Reply-To: <444282470.20040210193315@buz.ch> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii cc: freebsd-cluster Subject: Re: Re[2]: Clustering with FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:47:16 -0000 Hi, > One of the big advantages is that you effectively > have two > "independent" file systems: if one FS gets > corrupted, you still have > the chance that the other one is intact (which is > one of the things I > never liked about network block devices). And of > course you're free to > mix and match whatever disks you have on hand. I didn't really think about this advantage, but you are correct. You also can mix/match filesystems on the nodes. > > On a quick guess, I'd even venture to say that you > could have > something like delayed replication, where the > changed data is > immediately sent to the peer to be stored in a > journal but commited > only after some time span, thus effectively allowing > to guard against > admins deleting the wrong stuff (rm -rf /, anyone > ;-) and even against > hackers. Sorry there, it is in real-time. It is an attempt to create a real "clustered filesystem". If I am running a large POP3 server, one connection can go to one machine, while the other goes to a neighbour and for this reason, the update has to be immediate. > Germans say, "Same procedure this year--same > procedure > > ever year" (a reference to "Dinner for One"). > > Zze Germans speak English? Then why for christs sake > do you keep dubbing all those movies (one of the > reasons I quit watching TV...). More than people realize. :-) Though I am really trying to learn their language. I was really very shocked that this thing was something that I would say 60-70% make a tradition of watching--even if they don't understand English! I live in a small village and English is NOT very well spoken but I hear everybody telling me how they watch this. It is a rather elementary story and the pictures tell most of the story--which might account of it's success. > Then again, most would feel sympathethic with the > piss drunk butler, of course ;-) I don't know, I would like to drink as much as does every year for free ;-) Cheers Andy > > Best regards, > Gabriel > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-cluster > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-cluster-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 10 13:29:49 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4993F16A4CE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:29:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from tomoyo.MyBSD.org.my (duke.void.net.my [202.157.183.130]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F20DE43D1D for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:29:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from www@tomoyo.MyBSD.org.my) Received: by tomoyo.MyBSD.org.my (Postfix, from userid 80) id 057756CC21; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 05:33:24 +0800 (MYT) Received: from phpmailer ([202.157.183.139]) by 202.157.183.139 with HTTP (VOiD); Wed, 11 Feb 2004 05:33:24 +0800 Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 05:33:24 +0800 To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org From: zam4ever Message-ID: <8da7139ab6b227efd01007a6de928225@202.157.183.139> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: VOiDMAIL [PHPMailer version 1.70] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: Re: Haw to find Distribution? X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: zam4ever List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 21:29:49 -0000 Andy, sorry about that since I totally forgot about your flame ;). Currently, downloading your recommended software and wanna be one of the testers ;). So, don't remove it from the public yet. cheers -zam4ever- If something looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, what is it? Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:36:20 +0100 From: Andy Sporner Subject: Re: Haw to find Distribution? To: zam4ever Cc: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Message-ID: <4028A614.8030103@nentec.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed I would *again* ask for assistance in testing. If the answer is like this one I would seriously consider removing the work from the public domain and make money off it. From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 10 20:58:37 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41B5416A4CE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:58:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail010.syd.optusnet.com.au (mail010.syd.optusnet.com.au [211.29.132.56]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C01B43D1D for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:58:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Peter.Ross@alumni.tu-berlin.de) Received: from guckloch.zuhause (winax24-194.dialup.optusnet.com.au [211.29.117.194])i1B4wMl05828; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 15:58:23 +1100 Received: from guckloch.zuhause (localhost.zuhause [127.0.0.1]) by guckloch.zuhause (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B51WpK007557; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:01:32 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from Peter.Ross@alumni.tu-berlin.de) Received: from localhost (petros@localhost)i1B51QVp007554; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:01:27 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: guckloch.zuhause: petros owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:01:25 +1100 (EST) From: Peter Ross X-X-Sender: petros@guckloch.zuhause To: Andy Sporner In-Reply-To: <20040210181742.55466.qmail@web41503.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20040211152818.C7241@guckloch.zuhause> References: <20040210181742.55466.qmail@web41503.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII cc: freebsd-cluster Subject: Re: Clustering with FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 04:58:37 -0000 Hi Andy, your project looks promissing! On Tue, 10 Feb 2004, Andy Sporner wrote: > The "Proof of concept" which is weak compare to the > current version is available on my site at > http://sporner.dyndns.org/bsdclusters/frep I am curious what you improved. At the moment you allow 16 directories because of the static declaration. If you change that against a structure allocated dynamically: When do you think you will reach a limit? How does the initialisation work if you want to replicate a bigger directory tree? If you add a new directory you "walk" through the whole directory tree and mark all the vnodes you want to watch? AFAIK there is no generic pointer in the FreeBSD implementation to add functions triggered by actions like open, write etc. Howe does it work on systems which have triggered actions implementd in their filesystems? Did you start any work related to a "resync" if the server fails (if I am right you send the modification to the server but the writing doesn't fail if the server is down?) I don't want to discourage you;-) These are only curious questions. I am German (we are famous for perfectionism;-) BTW: An Australian friend is tempted to move to Germany because he has some relatives there. But he doesn't speak German yet. What do you think: will it work? I hesitate to give him advice. I am living downunder for 18 month now and am able to make myself understandable and to understand other people. Besides of some smaller problems if it's very noisy. A native speaker has an advantage to fill a gap if there is a word missing - it's easier for him to guess it. And some words I don't know or forget. And I make some smaller mistakes and "think German" (other phrases, other sentence order etc.) So from time to time I feel a little bit disabled. What happened to you when you moved to Germany? Curious Peter From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Feb 11 00:30:30 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07E3916A4CE for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 00:30:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from iota.root-servers.ch (iota.root-servers.ch [193.41.193.195]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 2F70543D1D for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 00:30:29 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gabriel_ambuehl@buz.ch) Received: (qmail 34452 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2004 08:30:25 -0000 Received: from 217-162-134-28.dclient.hispeed.ch (HELO ga) (217.162.134.28) by 0 with SMTP; 11 Feb 2004 08:30:25 -0000 Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:30:57 +0100 From: Gabriel Ambuehl Organization: BUZ Internet Services X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <8310222595.20040211093057@buz.ch> In-Reply-To: <20040210184716.79927.qmail@web41508.mail.yahoo.com> References: <444282470.20040210193315@buz.ch> <20040210184716.79927.qmail@web41508.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit cc: freebsd-cluster Subject: Re[4]: Clustering with FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: gabriel_ambuehl@buz.ch List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:30:30 -0000 Hello Andy, Tuesday, February 10, 2004, 7:47:16 PM, you wrote: > Sorry there, it is in real-time. It is an attempt > to create a real "clustered filesystem". If I am > running a large POP3 server, one connection can go > to one machine, while the other goes to a neighbour > and for this reason, the update has to be immediate. That's clear to me. However, I don't fear hacking your code to support journaling ;-). > More than people realize. :-) Though I am really > trying to learn their language. I was under the impression you were German (Sporner at least indicates German roots), but ACK, it's a hard language if you aren't native speaker. Best regards, Gabriel From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Feb 11 01:50:17 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B805C16A4CE for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 01:50:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from iota.root-servers.ch (iota.root-servers.ch [193.41.193.195]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id E440843D1F for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 01:50:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gabriel_ambuehl@buz.ch) Received: (qmail 44192 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2004 09:50:13 -0000 Received: from 217-162-134-28.dclient.hispeed.ch (HELO ga) (217.162.134.28) by 0 with SMTP; 11 Feb 2004 09:50:13 -0000 Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:52:24 +0100 From: Gabriel Ambuehl Organization: BUZ Internet Services X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <108549117.20040211105224@buz.ch> To: Andy Sporner In-Reply-To: <20040210183628.58032.qmail@web41507.mail.yahoo.com> References: <555997119.20040210192200@buz.ch> <20040210183628.58032.qmail@web41507.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit cc: freebsd-cluster Subject: Re[4]: Clustering with FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: gabriel_ambuehl@buz.ch List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:50:17 -0000 Hello Andy, Tuesday, February 10, 2004, 7:36:28 PM, you wrote: > It would be nice to get some of the European users > that are close to me together to really get some > momentum here. I live in Southwest Germany, near > the French border (5 KM from here). I would also > entertain the idea of a visit to the UK. I'm in Zurich which is reasonably close I'd say. However, I just dropped my holiday budget on a 20" LCD so maybe I shouldn't go to far in the near future ;-) Best regards, Gabriel From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Feb 11 08:50:28 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE3AE16A4CE for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:50:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailout09.sul.t-online.com (mailout09.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.84]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE99C43D1D for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:50:28 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Alexander@Leidinger.net) Received: from fwd03.aul.t-online.de by mailout09.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 1AqxZC-0006yS-00; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 17:50:26 +0100 Received: from Andro-Beta.Leidinger.net (r4+I+sZroehdXXofR6JXTfWwMPEZOZtHXjTTLzCfe9hdopBBN2mH6Y@[217.83.17.196]) by fmrl03.sul.t-online.com with esmtp id 1AqxYF-1Pj9O40; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 17:49:27 +0100 Received: from Magellan.Leidinger.net (Magellan.Leidinger.net [192.168.1.1]) i1BGnQOU015747; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 17:49:26 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from Alexander@Leidinger.net) Received: from Magellan.Leidinger.net (netchild@localhost [127.0.0.1]) i1BGnPwe054414; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 17:49:25 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from Alexander@Leidinger.net) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 17:49:25 +0100 From: Alexander Leidinger To: Andy Sporner Message-Id: <20040211174925.48f86a12@Magellan.Leidinger.net> In-Reply-To: <20040210183628.58032.qmail@web41507.mail.yahoo.com> References: <555997119.20040210192200@buz.ch> <20040210183628.58032.qmail@web41507.mail.yahoo.com> X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.9.9claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-portbld-freebsd5.2) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Seen: false X-ID: r4+I+sZroehdXXofR6JXTfWwMPEZOZtHXjTTLzCfe9hdopBBN2mH6Y@t-dialin.net cc: freebsd-cluster Subject: Re: Clustering with FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:50:29 -0000 On Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:36:28 -0800 (PST) Andy Sporner wrote: > It would be nice to get some of the European users > that are close to me together to really get some > momentum here. I live in Southwest Germany, near > the French border (5 KM from here). I would also > entertain the idea of a visit to the UK. If you are talking about "Saarland", you've found a hard place to learn german. The native dialect sounds like english, but it isn't. It is supposed to be german, but it isn't (get some people from Cologne or Berlin there and they won't understand anything). The first foreign language you learn in school here is "Hochdeutsch" (= official German language)... at least it feels this way. When you talk with "old" (>50) people, you may also hear some parts of the french language. Bye, Alexander. -- I will be available to get hired in April 2004. http://www.Leidinger.net Alexander @ Leidinger.net GPG fingerprint = C518 BC70 E67F 143F BE91 3365 79E2 9C60 B006 3FE7 From owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Feb 11 08:52:08 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 508A316A4CE for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:52:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailout03.sul.t-online.com (mailout03.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.81]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20C4743D1D for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:52:08 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Alexander@Leidinger.net) Received: from fwd10.aul.t-online.de by mailout03.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 1Aqxak-0003ED-03; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 17:52:02 +0100 Received: from Andro-Beta.Leidinger.net (ThtpqYZvreX4s6BN3NBQAVJP+qRzK-4CaMD+aPXVwkaaHV1zFH2GZx@[217.83.17.196]) by fmrl10.sul.t-online.com with esmtp id 1AqxaV-1FuL6e0; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 17:51:47 +0100 Received: from Magellan.Leidinger.net (Magellan.Leidinger.net [192.168.1.1]) i1BGpgOU016103; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 17:51:42 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from Alexander@Leidinger.net) Received: from Magellan.Leidinger.net (netchild@localhost [127.0.0.1]) i1BGpgwe054739; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 17:51:42 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from Alexander@Leidinger.net) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 17:51:42 +0100 From: Alexander Leidinger To: Andy Sporner Message-Id: <20040211175142.18062c5b@Magellan.Leidinger.net> In-Reply-To: <20040210183628.58032.qmail@web41507.mail.yahoo.com> References: <555997119.20040210192200@buz.ch> <20040210183628.58032.qmail@web41507.mail.yahoo.com> X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.9.9claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-portbld-freebsd5.2) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Seen: false X-ID: ThtpqYZvreX4s6BN3NBQAVJP+qRzK-4CaMD+aPXVwkaaHV1zFH2GZx@t-dialin.net cc: freebsd-cluster Subject: Re: Clustering with FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Clustering FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:52:08 -0000 On Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:36:28 -0800 (PST) Andy Sporner wrote: > too. To the second point, I think there is still > far too much politics between these groups from what > I have reading between the lines. This is always > unfortunate. As always: it's not everyone of those groups. Just those people with the loudest voices. There are people which just come along very good and respect each other. Bye, Alexander. -- I will be available to get hired in April 2004. http://www.Leidinger.net Alexander @ Leidinger.net GPG fingerprint = C518 BC70 E67F 143F BE91 3365 79E2 9C60 B006 3FE7