From owner-freebsd-jobs@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Jul 4 01:08:16 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AAE4516A4CE for ; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 01:08:16 +0000 (GMT) Received: from smtp.omnis.com (smtp.omnis.com [216.239.128.26]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2ADB343D55 for ; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 01:08:16 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <40E758D9.9060609@softweyr.com> Date: Sat, 03 Jul 2004 18:09:45 -0700 From: Wes Peters User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.7.1 (Windows/20040626) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Mike Tibor References: <20040702183604.A41037-100000@xena.mikey.net> In-Reply-To: <20040702183604.A41037-100000@xena.mikey.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit cc: Dru cc: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: training (was Resourceful BSD/Linux Network Administrator) X-BeenThere: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org List-Id: Jobs offered and sought List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 04 Jul 2004 01:08:16 -0000 Mike Tibor wrote: > On Fri, 2 Jul 2004, Dru wrote: > > >>I'd love to see a forum established to discuss how to bring quality BSD >>training to the masses. To create a curriculum that is practical, >>thought provoking, and available. However, freebsd-jobs isn't the place to >>hash it out. Anyone care to suggest a better place to continue on this >>thread? > > > In the absence of better suggestions, I'd be willing to setup and manage a > list for that, depending on interest. Naturally those interested should > reply to me off-list. This has been discussed a few times in the past on the -advocacy list. Nothing much happened, except Chris Coleman inherited some teaching materials from BSDi and put together some courseware from that, and has taught FreeBSD system administration courses in various parts of the USA a half-dozen or so times. I'm sure the advocacy list wouldn't mind a discussion of training, it's been mostly dead for quite a while. If somebody wants something more directed, that's good too. I think a training program with some accreditation would be great, but I don't know how to go about getting such accreditation*. I now of several Linux training programs that are widely accepted in Linux circles but mean nothing to the average "HR Professional" in the USA because they're not certified or accreditated or anything like that. The Red Hat courses get some acceptance because they're at least "vendor" coursework. I've directed replies to advocacy@ just in case this takes on a life of it's own. If someone has an alternate, please reply to this thread and the advocacy list, OK? The level of non-jobs mail in here has gotten quite bad lately... (*I'm not even sure accreditation is a real word, but it's the one that US education companies and school systems have adopted. When I was looking for a university back when dinosaurs roamed the earth it was "accredation" and "accredited.") -- Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket? Wes Peters wes@softweyr.com From owner-freebsd-jobs@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Jul 4 01:52:45 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4902816A4CE; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 01:52:45 +0000 (GMT) Received: from pilchuck.reedmedia.net (pilchuck.reedmedia.net [209.166.74.74]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD9CF43D3F; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 01:52:44 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from reed@reedmedia.net) Received: from reed by pilchuck.reedmedia.net with local-esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 1BgwBN-0005Fx-00; Sat, 03 Jul 2004 18:52:41 -0700 Date: Sat, 3 Jul 2004 18:52:40 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jeremy C. Reed" To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <40E758D9.9060609@softweyr.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII cc: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: training (was Resourceful BSD/Linux Network Administrator) X-BeenThere: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Jobs offered and sought List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 04 Jul 2004 01:52:45 -0000 On Sat, 3 Jul 2004, Wes Peters wrote: > such accreditation*. I now of several Linux training programs that are > widely accepted in Linux circles but mean nothing to the average "HR > Professional" in the USA because they're not certified or accreditated > or anything like that. The Red Hat courses get some acceptance because > they're at least "vendor" coursework. I am meeting with LPI at the end of this month. LPI has "Linux" in their name, but they hope to focus not specifically on Linux, but more on certification for open source software, like Apache, LAMP, Perl, etc. I will be talking with them about Apache mainly, but also be discussing *BSD certifications. And discussion working with them to run a job task analysis. By the way, I'm teaching a FreeBSD class in Seattle in a couple weeks. http://www.pugetsoundtechnology.com/ Jeremy C. Reed BSD News, BSD tutorials, BSD links http://www.bsdnewsletter.com/ From owner-freebsd-jobs@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Jul 4 02:25:40 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D832A16A4CE for ; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 02:25:40 +0000 (GMT) Received: from jive.SoftHome.net (jive.SoftHome.net [66.54.152.27]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 85BB743D1F for ; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 02:25:40 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from carnaily@softhome.net) Received: (qmail 21199 invoked by uid 417); 4 Jul 2004 02:18:47 -0000 Received: from charleston-.softhome.net (HELO softhome.net) (172.16.2.12) by shunt-smtp-out-0 with SMTP; 4 Jul 2004 02:18:47 -0000 Received: from Smartster ([81.1.195.2]) (AUTH: LOGIN carnaily@softhome.net) by softhome.net with esmtp; Sat, 03 Jul 2004 20:18:46 -0600 To: "Jeremy C. Reed" , freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org References: Message-ID: From: Andreas Carnaily Organization: Stanbury Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Sun, 04 Jul 2004 03:19:08 -0000 In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Opera7.23/FreeBSD M2 build 518 X-Mime-Autoconverted: from 8bit to 7bit by courier 0.38 cc: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: training (was Resourceful BSD/Linux Network Administrator) X-BeenThere: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Jobs offered and sought List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 04 Jul 2004 02:25:41 -0000 On Sat, 3 Jul 2004 18:52:40 -0700 (PDT), Jeremy C. Reed wrote: > I am meeting with LPI at the end of this month. LPI has "Linux" in their > name, but they hope to focus not specifically on Linux, but more on > certification for open source software, like Apache, LAMP, Perl, etc. > > I will be talking with them about Apache mainly, but also be discussing > *BSD certifications. And discussion working with them to run a job task > analysis. I could not find any BSD certifications exam at brainbench.com... What should we do to place our exam on brainbench? Could I help this somehow? I think it's great miss... And if there somewhere any certification' site allow me to get ANY BSD certificate? Andreas Carnaily Monster is not alone in the world. It has a friends. From owner-freebsd-jobs@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Jul 4 04:12:13 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 521E816A4CF for ; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 04:12:13 +0000 (GMT) Received: from north-zone.net (wh1.north-zone.net [65.110.60.200]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id CCE9D43D3F for ; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 04:12:08 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from nicobn@quebecbsd.org) Received: (qmail 89061 invoked by uid 80); 4 Jul 2004 04:13:23 -0000 Received: from 69.70.228.175 (SquirrelMail authenticated user nicobn@quebecbsd.org) by webmail.north-zone.net with HTTP; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 04:13:23 -0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <3197.69.70.228.175.1088914403.squirrel@webmail.north-zone.net> In-Reply-To: <20040703201952.GH43549@iconoplex.co.uk> References: <20040702091205.GB20016@iconoplex.co.uk> <20040703201952.GH43549@iconoplex.co.uk> Date: Sun, 4 Jul 2004 04:13:23 -0000 (GMT) From: Nicolas =?iso-8859-1?Q?B=E9rard_Nault?= To: "Paul Robinson" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal cc: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Resourceful BSD/Linux Network Administrator X-BeenThere: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: nicobn@quebecbsd.org List-Id: Jobs offered and sought List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 04 Jul 2004 04:12:13 -0000 Actually I think it might be because in FreeBSD, you actually have to read to understand what you're doing. Linux howtos spoonfeed you. I've met a lot of very capable Linux admistrators but most are stuck with their web interfaces (*cough* webmin *cough*) and seem to rely on forums and mailing lists when there's a problem, not on documentation that already exists. Paul Robinson said: > On Fri, Jul 02, 2004 at 07:30:16PM -0400, Tom Limoncelli wrote: > >> The advert was, IMHO, perfect. I've always wanted to say a lot of >> those things in an advert. All power to him! > > Well, some see it that way, some think it's offensive. I know I wouldn't > apply, and after my ranting, I doubt he'd want me - I'm obviously not > subserviant enough to handle his god-complex. > >> And don't pick on New Jersey, Paul. > > Actually, that was a very, very subtle joke picked out of an episode of > Futurama. I've never been, so can't really comment on it. > >> What part of the kernel magically makes FreeBSD people smarter, less >> lazy, or better looking? > > It's not the kernel. It's the attitude. > > I've worked with slashdotters and MCSEs who've never seen the inside of a > PC, never mind know what a rack server is. My own experience, I say > FreeBSD > guys just tend to be better admins for some reason. There must be > something > about the attitude of the project as a whole that rubs off or appeals to > the > better admins. I don't know. Yes, I'm being subjective and offensive to > MCSEs and Linux guys, but no more so than the original poster was to us. > >> I was impressed that he was concerned with people-skills. It's easy > > Yeah, he's really shown how many he has himself hasn't he? :-) > >> >We're FreeBSD admins. Not MCSEs or Linux admins. >> >> Don't brag. They're paid more. > > Speak for yourself. > > -- > Paul Robinson > http://www.iconoplex.co.uk/ > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-jobs > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-jobs-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > -- Nicolas Bérard Nault (nicobn@quebecbsd.org) http://www.quebecbsd.org http://www.xeatech.net http://staff.xeatech.net/nicobn "Je ne sais pas avec quelles armes se combattra la troisième guerre mondiale mais je peux vous assurer que la quatrième se combattra avec des pierres et des bâtons." -- Albert Einstein. From owner-freebsd-jobs@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Jul 4 12:10:26 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13CC616A4CE; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 12:10:26 +0000 (GMT) Received: from faceman.servitor.co.uk (faceman.servitor.co.uk [80.71.15.146]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D555943D41; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 12:10:25 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from wiggy@servitor.co.uk) Received: from wiggy by faceman.servitor.co.uk with local (Exim 4.30) id 1Bh5pw-0002ax-KD; Sun, 04 Jul 2004 13:11:12 +0100 Date: Sun, 4 Jul 2004 13:11:12 +0100 From: Paul Robinson To: "Jeremy C. Reed" Message-ID: <20040704121112.GK43549@iconoplex.co.uk> References: <40E758D9.9060609@softweyr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: Sender: Paul Robinson cc: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org cc: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: training (was Resourceful BSD/Linux Network Administrator) X-BeenThere: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Jobs offered and sought List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 04 Jul 2004 12:10:26 -0000 On Sat, Jul 03, 2004 at 06:52:40PM -0700, Jeremy C. Reed wrote: > I am meeting with LPI at the end of this month. LPI has "Linux" in their > name, but they hope to focus not specifically on Linux, but more on > certification for open source software, like Apache, LAMP, Perl, etc. I wouldn't touch them with a barge pole. Seriously, go look at the quality of their content and accreditations. The traditional accreditation model does not hold up when it comes to open source. LPI are trying to position themselves as the "Vendor" in a vendor-certification, whereas it should be those involved in the project who is doing that. > I will be talking with them about Apache mainly, but also be discussing > *BSD certifications. And discussion working with them to run a job task > analysis. I strongly suspect that a user could get just as much learning out of reading the Handbook and a few other resources as they would with any of these courses, yet they would pay a huge amount of money for it, just to get some letters after their name that most employers don't recognise. Dangerous game in my opinion. I've posted this three times now, but nobody at all seems to realise this is a wiki and they can add to it or edit it, but I think you might find some interesting reading in: http://vagueware.com/Open_Training -- Paul Robinson http://www.iconoplex.co.uk/ From owner-freebsd-jobs@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Jul 4 12:17:19 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A52D216A4CE; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 12:17:19 +0000 (GMT) Received: from faceman.servitor.co.uk (faceman.servitor.co.uk [80.71.15.146]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7511443D2F; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 12:17:19 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from wiggy@servitor.co.uk) Received: from wiggy by faceman.servitor.co.uk with local (Exim 4.30) id 1Bh5wa-0002iy-UW; Sun, 04 Jul 2004 13:18:04 +0100 Date: Sun, 4 Jul 2004 13:18:04 +0100 From: Paul Robinson To: Andreas Carnaily Message-ID: <20040704121804.GL43549@iconoplex.co.uk> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: Sender: Paul Robinson cc: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org cc: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Subject: Re: training (was Resourceful BSD/Linux Network Administrator) X-BeenThere: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Jobs offered and sought List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 04 Jul 2004 12:17:19 -0000 On Sun, Jul 04, 2004 at 03:19:08AM -0000, Andreas Carnaily wrote: > I could not find any BSD certifications exam at brainbench.com... Good. They are the kind of training site your mother should have warned you about. No proper certification or accreditation, just a way for them to make cash. Quite a lot of their material is inaccurate or concentrates on the wrong areas anyway, IMHO. > And if there somewhere any certification' site > allow me to get ANY BSD certificate? Pay me $500, I'll give you a piece of paper that declares you an First Class graduate at the Mancunian School of BSD Unix Expertise. Will that do? :-) -- Paul Robinson http://www.iconoplex.co.uk/ From owner-freebsd-jobs@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Jul 4 17:50:15 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF97C16A4CE for ; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 17:50:15 +0000 (GMT) Received: from dax.pksnet.com (150-178.35-65.tampabay.rr.com [65.35.178.150]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1DAE343D46 for ; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 17:50:15 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from freebsd@pksnet.com) Received: from seska (seska.pksnet.com [192.168.1.7]) by dax.pksnet.com (MTA v6.66) with SMTP id i64HoGgh002009 for ; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 13:50:17 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from freebsd@pksnet.com) Message-Id: <200407041750.i64HoGgh002009@dax.pksnet.com> Date: Sun, 4 Jul 2004 13:50:13 -0400 From: "Paul" To: "freebsd-jobs" X-mailer: Foxmail 5.0 [en] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: Re: training (was Resourceful BSD/Linux Network Administrator) X-BeenThere: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Jobs offered and sought List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 04 Jul 2004 17:50:15 -0000 >Pay me $500, I'll give you a piece of paper that declares you an First Class >graduate at the Mancunian School of BSD Unix Expertise. Will that do? :-) Wow !That's expensive. Since it's 4th of July I hereby, el gratis, certify All experienced FreeBSD'ers as FSP. (FreeBSD Solutions Provider) Of course a paper cert will cost $9.95 + shipping. But included is a logo for your website. :-) From owner-freebsd-jobs@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Jul 4 18:01:50 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3235716A4CE for ; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 18:01:50 +0000 (GMT) Received: from gandolf.magehandbook.net (dpvc-68-163-72-180.res.east.verizon.net [68.163.72.180]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7EAD743D2D for ; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 18:01:49 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from DStaal@usa.net) Received: from [192.168.1.50] (unknown [192.168.1.50]) by gandolf.magehandbook.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C21A926D; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 14:00:47 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 04 Jul 2004 14:01:21 -0400 From: Daniel Staal To: Paul , freebsd-jobs Message-ID: <031D3BE4982631E3DB8BA47E@[192.168.1.50]> In-Reply-To: <200407041750.i64HoGgh002009@dax.pksnet.com> References: <200407041750.i64HoGgh002009@dax.pksnet.com> X-Mailer: Mulberry/3.1.5 (Mac OS X) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Subject: Re: Re: training (was Resourceful BSD/Linux Network Administrator) X-BeenThere: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Jobs offered and sought List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 04 Jul 2004 18:01:50 -0000 --As of Sunday, July 4, 2004 1:50 PM -0400, Paul is alleged to have said: > Wow !That's expensive. Since it's 4th of July I hereby, el gratis, > certify All experienced FreeBSD'ers as FSP. (FreeBSD Solutions Provider) > Of course a paper cert will cost $9.95 + shipping. But included is a logo > for your website. :-) --As for the rest, it is mine. Define 'experienced' so I can put it on my resumes. (I'm not sure if I'm kidding...) Daniel T. Staal --------------------------------------------------------------- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-jobs@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Jul 4 21:21:15 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3441316A541 for ; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 21:21:15 +0000 (GMT) Received: from jive.SoftHome.net (jive.SoftHome.net [66.54.152.27]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id BA8E343D2D for ; Sun, 4 Jul 2004 21:21:14 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from carnaily@softhome.net) Received: (qmail 11500 invoked by uid 417); 4 Jul 2004 21:18:23 -0000 Received: from charleston-.softhome.net (HELO softhome.net) (172.16.2.12) by shunt-smtp-out-0 with SMTP; 4 Jul 2004 21:18:23 -0000 Received: from Smartster ([81.1.195.2]) (AUTH: LOGIN carnaily@softhome.net) by softhome.net with esmtp; Sun, 04 Jul 2004 15:18:22 -0600 In-Reply-To: <20040704121804.GL43549@iconoplex.co.uk> References: <20040704121804.GL43549@iconoplex.co.uk> To: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org Message-ID: From: Andreas Carnaily Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Sun, 04 Jul 2004 22:18:49 -0000 User-Agent: Opera7.23/FreeBSD M2 build 518 X-Mime-Autoconverted: from 8bit to 7bit by courier 0.38 Subject: Re: training (was Resourceful BSD/Linux Network Administrator) X-BeenThere: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Jobs offered and sought List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 04 Jul 2004 21:21:15 -0000 On Sun, 4 Jul 2004 13:18:04 +0100, Paul Robinson wrote: > On Sun, Jul 04, 2004 at 03:19:08AM -0000, Andreas Carnaily wrote: > >> I could not find any BSD certifications exam at brainbench.com... > > Good. They are the kind of training site your mother should have warned > you > about. No proper certification or accreditation, just a way for them to > make > cash. Quite a lot of their material is inaccurate or concentrates on the > wrong areas anyway, IMHO. > >> And if there somewhere any certification' site >> allow me to get ANY BSD certificate? > > Pay me $500, I'll give you a piece of paper that declares you an First > Class > graduate at the Mancunian School of BSD Unix Expertise. Will that do? :-) Your words a little sarcasmic I feel... 500$... ***(grins)*** Great! I can pay this, only if paper is golden. But what about "US Search Verification"? I need my sertificate to be verificated. From owner-freebsd-jobs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jul 5 14:02:00 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 35B3C16A4CE; Mon, 5 Jul 2004 14:02:00 +0000 (GMT) Received: from pilchuck.reedmedia.net (pilchuck.reedmedia.net [209.166.74.74]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B38C743D64; Mon, 5 Jul 2004 14:01:59 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from reed@reedmedia.net) Received: from reed by pilchuck.reedmedia.net with local-esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 1BhU2X-0008H1-00; Mon, 05 Jul 2004 07:01:49 -0700 Date: Mon, 5 Jul 2004 07:01:49 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jeremy C. Reed" To: Paul Robinson In-Reply-To: <20040704121112.GK43549@iconoplex.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII cc: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org cc: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: training (was Resourceful BSD/Linux Network Administrator) X-BeenThere: freebsd-jobs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Jobs offered and sought List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 05 Jul 2004 14:02:00 -0000 On Sun, 4 Jul 2004, Paul Robinson wrote: > > I am meeting with LPI at the end of this month. LPI has "Linux" in their > > name, but they hope to focus not specifically on Linux, but more on > > certification for open source software, like Apache, LAMP, Perl, etc. > > I wouldn't touch them with a barge pole. Seriously, go look at the quality > of their content and accreditations. The traditional accreditation model > does not hold up when it comes to open source. LPI are trying to position > themselves as the "Vendor" in a vendor-certification, whereas it should be > those involved in the project who is doing that. > > > I will be talking with them about Apache mainly, but also be discussing > > *BSD certifications. And discussion working with them to run a job task > > analysis. > > I strongly suspect that a user could get just as much learning out of > reading the Handbook and a few other resources as they would with any of > these courses, yet they would pay a huge amount of money for it, just to get > some letters after their name that most employers don't recognise. Dangerous > game in my opinion. I have not idea what you are talking about. LPI does not offer any courses. LPI purposely distances itself from any books, courseware, and courses. Also, LPI does not expect anyone to pay a huge a mount of money. In fact, LPI is concerned with the amount paid now ($100 per cert) because of the extreme expense in many countries. They hope to drastically reduce the monetary price. As for learning via reading: that is fine for many -- including myself. But many students need the extra push by actually attending a structured, hands-on class. Also classes, even running at a slow pace, can cover a lot more than a student trying to self-teach themselves. Jeremy C. Reed BSD News, BSD tutorials, BSD links http://www.bsdnewsletter.com/