From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jan 22 06:16:22 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8130716A401 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 06:16:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Received: from mh1.centtech.com (moat3.centtech.com [64.129.166.50]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57F9513C44C for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 06:16:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Received: from [192.168.42.21] (andersonbox1.centtech.com [192.168.42.21]) by mh1.centtech.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0M6GKsM006579; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 00:16:20 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Message-ID: <45B456B6.6040808@centtech.com> Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 00:16:22 -0600 From: Eric Anderson User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (X11/20070121) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Soeren Straarup References: <20070120073117.GB60202@x12.dk> In-Reply-To: <20070120073117.GB60202@x12.dk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.88.4/2476/Sun Jan 21 10:22:33 2007 on mh1.centtech.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=8.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.1.6 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.6 (2006-10-03) on mh1.centtech.com Cc: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: A beginner project X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 06:16:22 -0000 On 01/20/07 01:31, Soeren Straarup wrote: > What would be a beignner project within geom? > > Something is acutally going to be used by atleat some. > > I have briefly looked at: > http://www.freebsd.org/projects/ideas/#p-psched > > But are there already someone out there that is working on it? > > /Soeren > Make a 'geom taste' function? Other ideas: - geom snapshots (harder!) - gnop additional options (add latency, etc, to mimic real devices) Eric -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Eric Anderson Sr. Systems Administrator Centaur Technology An undefined problem has an infinite number of solutions. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jan 22 07:38:54 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E114316A403 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 07:38:54 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from adamsch1@yahoo.com) Received: from web31814.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web31814.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.206.167]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id AA4B613C428 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 07:38:54 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from adamsch1@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 9974 invoked by uid 60001); 22 Jan 2007 07:12:13 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:Date:From:Subject:To:Cc:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=d5IDtTYH8ecDigUa0OR3QElYl7ol3OVSAphTqn1CmuPLZc8JRdyF/ssu1PNPXyaaRrxDtP8D0GQy7jixKmII1aOzq8yTrUbSqa8Iv9MMVOFeYtu32ujYxhXIAVjvJ5ilfTRzyhR5nEBoH/YUXk7R23Rdpq5g1sy3EUzdM4HxR9E=; X-YMail-OSG: lFiLSAUVM1mcBn_mHhM2GWHkV7gWzkuqMjcfNXnerj0RrIBeLXWvTP8rzTMbn9pP0hPIQdg6cXyr8CUq51yy0G9clLW3EaAO3FVyjBcb3QHWvuWFTdY- Received: from [69.236.88.234] by web31814.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 23:12:13 PST X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/368.3 YahooMailWebService/0.6.132.7 Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2007 23:12:13 -0800 (PST) From: Shane Adams To: Eric Anderson , Soeren Straarup MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-ID: <751291.8910.qm@web31814.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Cc: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: A beginner project X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 07:38:55 -0000 I've thought about geom snapshots, which I take it you would do at a block = layer similarly to how snapshots are implemented in FFS. I couldnt figure = out a way to do it effeciently. I've found the FFS snapshots do not work w= ell with large disk sets, there is a noticable lag and almost a freeze-up o= n my computer. =0A=0ASeems you'd need to do it at the filesystem layer, an= d as a side effect change the format of inodes at cylinder groups in order = to track changes.=0A=0AIs there any publish literature on the subject?=0A= =0AOh - by snapshot I mean something that can be mounted simlultaniously wi= th the original filesystem.=0A=0ACheers,=0A Shane=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A----- Orig= inal Message ----=0AFrom: Eric Anderson =0ATo: Soere= n Straarup =0ACc: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org=0ASent: Sunday, Ja= nuary 21, 2007 10:16:22 PM=0ASubject: Re: A beginner project=0A=0AOn 01/20/= 07 01:31, Soeren Straarup wrote:=0A> What would be a beignner project withi= n geom?=0A> =0A> Something is acutally going to be used by atleat some.=0A>= =0A> I have briefly looked at:=0A> http://www.freebsd.org/projects/ideas/#= p-psched=0A> =0A> But are there already someone out there that is working o= n it?=0A> =0A> /Soeren=0A> =0A=0AMake a 'geom taste' function?=0A=0AOther i= deas:=0A- geom snapshots (harder!)=0A- gnop additional options (add latency= , etc, to mimic real devices)=0A=0A=0AEric=0A=0A=0A=0A-- =0A---------------= ---------------------------------------------------------=0AEric Anderson = Sr. Systems Administrator Centaur Technology=0AAn undefined pr= oblem has an infinite number of solutions.=0A------------------------------= ------------------------------------------=0A______________________________= _________________=0Afreebsd-geom@freebsd.org mailing list=0Ahttp://lists.fr= eebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-geom=0ATo unsubscribe, send any mail to = "freebsd-geom-unsubscribe@freebsd.org"=0A=0A=0A From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jan 22 08:48:56 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF5CF16A402 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 08:48:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from xride@x12.dk) Received: from swip.net (mailfe10.tele2.dk [212.247.155.35]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EE3413C461 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 08:48:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from xride@x12.dk) X-Cloudmark-Score: 0.000000 [] Received: from x12.dk (account mu12272@get2net.dk [83.72.97.231] verified) by mailfe10.swip.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.0.12) with ESMTPA id 221284294; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 09:48:53 +0100 Received: by x12.dk (Postfix, from userid 666) id 8B47350839; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 09:48:52 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 09:48:52 +0100 From: Soeren Straarup To: Eric Anderson Message-ID: <20070122084852.GA18648@x12.dk> References: <20070120073117.GB60202@x12.dk> <45B456B6.6040808@centtech.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <45B456B6.6040808@centtech.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.2i Cc: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: A beginner project X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 08:48:56 -0000 On Mon, Jan 22, 2007 at 12:16:22AM -0600, Eric Anderson wrote: > On 01/20/07 01:31, Soeren Straarup wrote: > >What would be a beignner project within geom? > > > >Something is acutally going to be used by atleat some. > > > >I have briefly looked at: > >http://www.freebsd.org/projects/ideas/#p-psched > > > >But are there already someone out there that is working on it? > > > > Make a 'geom taste' function? Please explain little more about the functionality. > > Other ideas: > - geom snapshots (harder!) There is ports/sysutils/geomgui (which i wrote) > - gnop additional options (add latency, etc, to mimic real devices) > That could be an idea too. /Soeren -- Soeren Straarup | aka OZ2DAK aka Xride FreeBSD committer | FreeBSD since 2.2.6-R If a program is not working right, then send a patch From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jan 22 11:08:29 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0759216A410 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 11:08:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.freebsd.org [69.147.83.40]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E88A913C465 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 11:08:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (linimon@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0MB8SnK036918 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 11:08:28 GMT (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Received: (from linimon@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.13.4/8.13.4/Submit) id l0MB8QiV036914 for freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.org; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 11:08:26 GMT (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 11:08:26 GMT Message-Id: <200701221108.l0MB8QiV036914@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: linimon set sender to owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org using -f From: FreeBSD bugmaster To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.org Cc: Subject: Current problem reports assigned to you X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 11:08:29 -0000 Current FreeBSD problem reports Critical problems Serious problems S Tracker Resp. Description -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- o kern/73177 geom kldload geom_* causes panic due to memory exhaustion o kern/76538 geom [gbde] nfs-write on gbde partition stalls and continue o kern/83464 geom [geom] [patch] Unhandled malloc failures within libgeo o kern/84556 geom [geom] GBDE-encrypted swap causes panic at shutdown o kern/87544 geom [gbde] mmaping large files on a gbde filesystem deadlo o kern/89102 geom [geom_vfs] [panic] panic when forced unmount FS from u o bin/90093 geom fdisk(8) incapable of altering in-core geometry o kern/90582 geom [geom_mirror] [panic] Restore cause panic string (ffs_ o kern/98034 geom [geom] dereference of NULL pointer in acd_geom_detach o kern/104389 geom [geom] [patch] sys/geom/geom_dump.c doesn't encode XML 10 problems total. Non-critical problems S Tracker Resp. Description -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- o bin/78131 geom gbde "destroy" not working. o kern/79251 geom [2TB] newfs fails on 2.6TB gbde device o kern/94632 geom [geom] Kernel output resets input while GELI asks for f kern/105390 geom [geli] filesystem on a md backed by sparse file with s o kern/107707 geom [geom] [patch] add new class geom_xbox360 to slice up 5 problems total. From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jan 22 12:50:46 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B0FD16A403 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 12:50:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Received: from mh1.centtech.com (moat3.centtech.com [64.129.166.50]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F30F513C45A for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 12:50:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Received: from [10.177.171.220] (neutrino.centtech.com [10.177.171.220]) by mh1.centtech.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0MCohaE074387; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 06:50:44 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Message-ID: <45B4B327.7050602@centtech.com> Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 06:50:47 -0600 From: Eric Anderson User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (X11/20070121) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Shane Adams References: <751291.8910.qm@web31814.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <751291.8910.qm@web31814.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.88.4/2476/Sun Jan 21 10:22:33 2007 on mh1.centtech.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=8.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.1.6 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.6 (2006-10-03) on mh1.centtech.com Cc: Soeren Straarup , freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: A beginner project X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 12:50:46 -0000 On 01/22/07 01:12, Shane Adams wrote: > I've thought about geom snapshots, which I take it you would do at a block layer similarly to how snapshots are implemented in FFS. I couldnt figure out a way to do it effeciently. I've found the FFS snapshots do not work well with large disk sets, there is a noticable lag and almost a freeze-up on my computer. > > Seems you'd need to do it at the filesystem layer, and as a side effect change the format of inodes at cylinder groups in order to track changes. > > Is there any publish literature on the subject? > > Oh - by snapshot I mean something that can be mounted simlultaniously with the original filesystem. I don't think this could work at all like UFS snapshots, since those are based on using the cylinder groups to make a virtual vopy of the file system structure. To me, I would think that one would could implement it in a number of ways, not sure which is best. One idea is to supply the device to snapshot, and then also the location of a snapshot file to be created. The snapshot file would be created via COW, and could be a sparse file. One side effect could be the creation of another new geom layer - geom union. So, you can take something like a disk, and overlay an image on top, and the result would be blocks that exist in the overlay are seen, and blocks that are not in the overlay are transparent and the next layer down is visible. Eric > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Eric Anderson > To: Soeren Straarup > Cc: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org > Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 10:16:22 PM > Subject: Re: A beginner project > > On 01/20/07 01:31, Soeren Straarup wrote: >> What would be a beignner project within geom? >> >> Something is acutally going to be used by atleat some. >> >> I have briefly looked at: >> http://www.freebsd.org/projects/ideas/#p-psched >> >> But are there already someone out there that is working on it? >> >> /Soeren >> > > Make a 'geom taste' function? > > Other ideas: > - geom snapshots (harder!) > - gnop additional options (add latency, etc, to mimic real devices) > > > Eric > > > -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Eric Anderson Sr. Systems Administrator Centaur Technology An undefined problem has an infinite number of solutions. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jan 22 12:54:28 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01FC316A401 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 12:54:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Received: from mh1.centtech.com (moat3.centtech.com [64.129.166.50]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CAB4913C43E for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 12:54:27 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Received: from [10.177.171.220] (neutrino.centtech.com [10.177.171.220]) by mh1.centtech.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0MCsQLq075004; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 06:54:26 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Message-ID: <45B4B406.7060906@centtech.com> Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 06:54:30 -0600 From: Eric Anderson User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (X11/20070121) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Soeren Straarup References: <20070120073117.GB60202@x12.dk> <45B456B6.6040808@centtech.com> <20070122084852.GA18648@x12.dk> In-Reply-To: <20070122084852.GA18648@x12.dk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.88.4/2476/Sun Jan 21 10:22:33 2007 on mh1.centtech.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=8.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.1.6 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.6 (2006-10-03) on mh1.centtech.com Cc: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: A beginner project X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 12:54:28 -0000 On 01/22/07 02:48, Soeren Straarup wrote: > On Mon, Jan 22, 2007 at 12:16:22AM -0600, Eric Anderson wrote: >> On 01/20/07 01:31, Soeren Straarup wrote: >>> What would be a beignner project within geom? >>> >>> Something is acutally going to be used by atleat some. >>> >>> I have briefly looked at: >>> http://www.freebsd.org/projects/ideas/#p-psched >>> >>> But are there already someone out there that is working on it? >>> >> Make a 'geom taste' function? > > Please explain little more about the functionality. It forces either a re-tasting of all the geom providers. Also can have an optional path name of a specific device to re-taste, and I think it should also work with the other geom classes, so a gmirror taste would re-taste all the geom mirror providers. >> Other ideas: >> - geom snapshots (harder!) > > There is ports/sysutils/geomgui (which i wrote) Not snapshot like a photo, snapshot like 'point in time copy of storage'. >> - gnop additional options (add latency, etc, to mimic real devices) >> > > That could be an idea too. It would be very nice to be able to simulate a real hard disk. Eric -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Eric Anderson Sr. Systems Administrator Centaur Technology An undefined problem has an infinite number of solutions. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jan 22 13:13:13 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB4BE16A401 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 13:13:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gcubfg-freebsd-geom@m.gmane.org) Received: from ciao.gmane.org (main.gmane.org [80.91.229.2]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9D8013C457 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 13:13:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gcubfg-freebsd-geom@m.gmane.org) Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1H8yyl-00033e-MW for freebsd-geom@freebsd.org; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 14:12:55 +0100 Received: from lara.cc.fer.hr ([161.53.72.113]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 14:12:55 +0100 Received: from ivoras by lara.cc.fer.hr with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 14:12:55 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org From: Ivan Voras Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 14:12:47 +0100 Lines: 8 Message-ID: References: <20070120073117.GB60202@x12.dk> <45B456B6.6040808@centtech.com> <20070122084852.GA18648@x12.dk> <45B4B406.7060906@centtech.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: lara.cc.fer.hr User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.4 (X11/20060625) In-Reply-To: <45B4B406.7060906@centtech.com> Sender: news Subject: Re: A beginner project X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 13:13:14 -0000 Eric Anderson wrote: > > Not snapshot like a photo, snapshot like 'point in time copy of storage'. > I think the "current" problem with geom-based snapshots is how will they interact with gjournal - i.e. do you snapshot the journal or not? From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jan 22 13:15:38 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2FA116A404 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 13:15:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from arne_woerner@yahoo.com) Received: from web30309.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web30309.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.69.71]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 7DB2C13C4C4 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 13:15:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from arne_woerner@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 9640 invoked by uid 60001); 22 Jan 2007 13:15:38 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=j9Lo9h2z7ebX86HpkVVmVQogDiAZrZxs8Bm3zlgJFsrTiZKqP+fcuJscSsITKT92kNfLaxpq/2d2JXo7MmJ4EIvpEnPVCxSOAgz/BtAlwx+ymPf8mwPFAbiifnSqHg3/UKIX4bbXH8ywVkxaEmjW1eIuN3Ttqcmx0uQb+AhZ03A=; X-YMail-OSG: d2NPAw8VM1mnvUQW9IU.VdgOPK.n6nu8_O8DPI5NzGqWUmCFdnCPGIpOmRfbRQecpvvAOhEkU.L8Gh64tZksAwQsQSyMB4UVKOHphq0w69fUeJDKk1E- Received: from [85.212.26.75] by web30309.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 05:15:37 PST Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 05:15:37 -0800 (PST) From: "R. B. Riddick" To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, CyberLeo Kitsana , FreeBSD Geom MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <916065.8298.qm@web30309.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Cc: Subject: Re: geom_raid5 livelock? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 13:15:38 -0000 --- "R. B. Riddick" wrote: > It looks like, always the same consumer returns false data again and again in > this strange situation, although at the same time a dd to the same consumer > at the same offset returns data, that fits to the parity block. > > Does somebody here have an idea, why GEOM does that? > Could it be, that graid5 ruined somehow memory management? > Could it be, that GEOM is disturbed by simultaneous request? > I think, not graid5 ruined memory management, but UFS changes memory areas while a read request, that has to use the same memory area, is not completed. Hints: 1. Since I use for graid5's SAFEOP mode just graid5-private-memory for the parity check, no parity errors show up. 2. It was always -when I checked it- the use-data memory chunk, that had bad data. 3. That happened in a quite simple special case, too (I used just 2 disks, so that graid5 was like gmirror with 2 disks and round-robin balance). Further details see: http://perforce.freebsd.org/chv.cgi?CH=113310 Anyone here, who can validate my theory (it feels so _wrong_!)? :-) -Arne ____________________________________________________________________________________ Never miss an email again! Yahoo! Toolbar alerts you the instant new Mail arrives. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jan 22 13:24:46 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A05516A400 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 13:24:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Received: from mh2.centtech.com (moat3.centtech.com [64.129.166.50]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E17B213C44C for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 13:24:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Received: from [10.177.171.220] (neutrino.centtech.com [10.177.171.220]) by mh2.centtech.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0MDObFB025291; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 07:24:37 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Message-ID: <45B4BB19.4050604@centtech.com> Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 07:24:41 -0600 From: Eric Anderson User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (X11/20070121) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ivan Voras References: <20070120073117.GB60202@x12.dk> <45B456B6.6040808@centtech.com> <20070122084852.GA18648@x12.dk> <45B4B406.7060906@centtech.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.88.4/2476/Sun Jan 21 10:22:33 2007 on mh2.centtech.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.1 required=8.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.1.6 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.6 (2006-10-03) on mh2.centtech.com Cc: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: A beginner project X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 13:24:46 -0000 On 01/22/07 07:12, Ivan Voras wrote: > Eric Anderson wrote: > >> Not snapshot like a photo, snapshot like 'point in time copy of storage'. >> > > I think the "current" problem with geom-based snapshots is how will they > interact with gjournal - i.e. do you snapshot the journal or not? I think it only matters if you use UFS, if you care about a consistent filesystem on the snapshot. You could probably tie a hook into geom snapshot to tell gjournal to flush the journal, take the snapshot, and then continue. A similar hook (like gjournal has) to flush the buffer down to the disk would be good to have in geom snapshot also. I actually think the hard part is keeping track of the snapshotted blocks, and keeping them in an order that doesn't completely destroy performance, while still allowing an 'instant' snapshot. UFS snapshots take a very very long time on large file systems, so a geom snapshot (to be useful) should be snappy (pun intended). Eric -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Eric Anderson Sr. Systems Administrator Centaur Technology An undefined problem has an infinite number of solutions. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jan 22 16:01:26 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5A0016A404 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 16:01:26 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lulf@pvv.ntnu.no) Received: from merke.itea.ntnu.no (merke.itea.ntnu.no [129.241.7.61]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B422F13C506 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 16:01:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lulf@pvv.ntnu.no) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by merke.itea.ntnu.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 234DA13CE7E; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 16:27:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from gaupe.stud.ntnu.no (gaupe.stud.ntnu.no [129.241.56.184]) by merke.itea.ntnu.no (Postfix) with ESMTP; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 16:27:58 +0100 (CET) Received: by gaupe.stud.ntnu.no (Postfix, from userid 2312) id F3946D001B; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 16:29:32 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 16:29:32 +0100 From: Ulf Lilleengen To: Soeren Straarup Message-ID: <20070122152932.GA28024@stud.ntnu.no> References: <20070120073117.GB60202@x12.dk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: <20070120073117.GB60202@x12.dk> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-Content-Scanned: with sophos and spamassassin at mailgw.ntnu.no. Cc: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: A beginner project X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 16:01:26 -0000 On lør, jan 20, 2007 at 08:31:17 +0100, Soeren Straarup wrote: > What would be a beignner project within geom? > > Something is acutally going to be used by atleat some. > > I have briefly looked at: > http://www.freebsd.org/projects/ideas/#p-psched > I advise you to look at this thread which took up some issues about this project. As I said in the post, I've started to do some benchmarking on how efficient the current disksorting is now, and so far on fairly modern hardware, it's not a big difference with or without it. http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-geom/2007-January/001854.html -- Ulf Lilleengen From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jan 23 08:45:49 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC80516A401; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 08:45:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (lurza.secnetix.de [83.120.8.8]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17AD613C43E; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 08:45:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (pahevu@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0N8Jxiu003877; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 09:20:05 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from oliver.fromme@secnetix.de) Received: (from olli@localhost) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.1/Submit) id l0N8Jxrm003876; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 09:19:59 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from olli) Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 09:19:59 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <200701230819.l0N8Jxrm003876@lurza.secnetix.de> From: Oliver Fromme To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG, vd@FreeBSD.ORG, xride@x12.dk, silby@silby.com In-Reply-To: <20070122083727.GA61615@qlovarnika.bg.datamax> X-Newsgroups: list.freebsd-hackers User-Agent: tin/1.8.2-20060425 ("Shillay") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.11-STABLE (i386)) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.1.2 (lurza.secnetix.de [127.0.0.1]); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 09:20:05 +0100 (CET) Cc: Subject: Re: Where to start? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG, vd@FreeBSD.ORG, xride@x12.dk, silby@silby.com List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 08:45:49 -0000 Vasil Dimov wrote: > Mike Silbersack wrote: > > Soeren Straarup wrote: > > [...] > > > I'm looking for a project. > > [...] > > I'd like to see the ability to run gjournal without reformatting. > > If you could create a dummy file inside the filesystem, then use > > that area for the journal, it might be possible. I'm sure that > > would let a lot more people see if journalling is right for them. > > I am not sure about gjournal internals but what if a system crash > occurs in the middle of a transaction and the fs gets corrupted and > the data, necessary to fix it is in the journal, but you cannot > access the journal because the file, which contains the journal, > is on a corrupted fs? I think you should still be able to mount the file system read-only, even if it's not "clean", so there's no problem locating the journal file. Particularly, note that the journal file should probably be located in the root of the file system, and it will have a constant size and should be allocated from the start (i.e. it never grows nor changes allocation), which means there is no way that its meta data could be damaged. On the other hand, _if_ the file system is so seriously busted that the journal file could not be located or used anymore, then it's probably a sign of physical damage, and in that case the journal wouldn't be able help you anyway. Journalling is only able to fix things after "regular" crashes. Disclaimer: I'm not a GEOM code expert. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong. BTW, I've just got an idea. Wouldn't it be possible to set up a "journal file" in a similar manner as you set up a swap file? That is, you create a sufficiently large file with dd(1) from /dev/zero, then run vnconfig(8) to create an md(4) device for it, then -- instead of running swapon(8) -- you enable journalling, using that file for the journal. I'm aware that this doesn't currently work out of the box, and there's a hen-and-egg problem during boot when fsck+mount is to be run. But I think it should be possible to make it work without too much trouble. Best regards Oliver PS: I've set reply-to to the freebsd-geom list. I think it is more appropriate than -hackers. -- Oliver Fromme, secnetix GmbH & Co. KG, Marktplatz 29, 85567 Grafing Dienstleistungen mit Schwerpunkt FreeBSD: http://www.secnetix.de/bsd Any opinions expressed in this message may be personal to the author and may not necessarily reflect the opinions of secnetix in any way. "C++ is the only current language making COBOL look good." -- Bertrand Meyer From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jan 23 09:32:26 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E694416A400; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 09:32:26 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vd@datamax.bg) Received: from jengal.datamax.bg (jengal.datamax.bg [82.103.104.21]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0EBD13C457; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 09:32:26 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vd@datamax.bg) Received: from qlovarnika.bg.datamax (qlovarnika.bg.datamax [192.168.10.2]) by jengal.datamax.bg (Postfix) with SMTP id AAFE7B848; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 11:32:24 +0200 (EET) Received: (nullmailer pid 32169 invoked by uid 1002); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 09:32:24 -0000 Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 11:32:24 +0200 From: Vasil Dimov To: Oliver Fromme Message-ID: <20070123093224.GA26619@qlovarnika.bg.datamax> References: <20070122083727.GA61615@qlovarnika.bg.datamax> <200701230819.l0N8Jxrm003876@lurza.secnetix.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="u3/rZRmxL6MmkK24" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200701230819.l0N8Jxrm003876@lurza.secnetix.de> Cc: silby@silby.com, xride@x12.dk, freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Where to start? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: vd@FreeBSD.org List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 09:32:27 -0000 --u3/rZRmxL6MmkK24 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable [discussion moved from freebsd-hackers@ to freebsd-geom@] On Tue, Jan 23, 2007 at 09:19:59 +0100, Oliver Fromme wrote: > Vasil Dimov wrote: > > Mike Silbersack wrote: > > > Soeren Straarup wrote: > > > [...] > > > > I'm looking for a project. > > > [...] > > > I'd like to see the ability to run gjournal without reformatting. > > > If you could create a dummy file inside the filesystem, then use > > > that area for the journal, it might be possible. I'm sure that > > > would let a lot more people see if journalling is right for them. > >=20 > > I am not sure about gjournal internals but what if a system crash > > occurs in the middle of a transaction and the fs gets corrupted and > > the data, necessary to fix it is in the journal, but you cannot > > access the journal because the file, which contains the journal, > > is on a corrupted fs? >=20 > I think you should still be able to mount the file system > read-only, even if it's not "clean", so there's no problem > locating the journal file. Particularly, note that the > journal file should probably be located in the root of the > file system, and it will have a constant size and should > be allocated from the start (i.e. it never grows nor > changes allocation), which means there is no way that its > meta data could be damaged. [...] With gjournal not only the metadata is journaled but also the actual data (e.g. files' contents). So writes to the journal file (which is a "regular file" on the FS) should bypass the journaling stuff. Otherwise they will get journaled themselves and it will end up in an endless loop. This thing still looks to me like roping your chest to your leg (instead of to an unmovable object) in order to avoid falling, but I might be wrong... --=20 Vasil Dimov gro.DSBeerF@dv % A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that works. --u3/rZRmxL6MmkK24 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iD8DBQFFtdYoFw6SP/bBpCARAkryAJwJgX9uGDrcjgc1WQzECto/vtwdzwCeJkoj Z+Ok9jocapC8IciwUdapjkg= =6dmL -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --u3/rZRmxL6MmkK24-- From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jan 23 10:10:46 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0747A16A405; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 10:10:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (lurza.secnetix.de [83.120.8.8]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 767E313C461; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 10:10:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (ghcxin@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0NAAc8B017305; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 11:10:43 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from oliver.fromme@secnetix.de) Received: (from olli@localhost) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.1/Submit) id l0NAAcp6017303; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 11:10:38 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from olli) From: Oliver Fromme Message-Id: <200701231010.l0NAAcp6017303@lurza.secnetix.de> To: vd@FreeBSD.org Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 11:10:38 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: <20070123093224.GA26619@qlovarnika.bg.datamax> X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.1.2 (lurza.secnetix.de [127.0.0.1]); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 11:10:44 +0100 (CET) Cc: silby@silby.com, xride@x12.dk, freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Where to start? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 10:10:46 -0000 Vasil Dimov wrote: > [discussion moved from freebsd-hackers@ to freebsd-geom@] > Oliver Fromme wrote: > > Vasil Dimov wrote: > > > Mike Silbersack wrote: > > > > Soeren Straarup wrote: > > > > [...] > > > > > I'm looking for a project. > > > > [...] > > > > I'd like to see the ability to run gjournal without reformatting. > > > > If you could create a dummy file inside the filesystem, then use > > > > that area for the journal, it might be possible. I'm sure that > > > > would let a lot more people see if journalling is right for them. > > > > > > I am not sure about gjournal internals but what if a system crash > > > occurs in the middle of a transaction and the fs gets corrupted and > > > the data, necessary to fix it is in the journal, but you cannot > > > access the journal because the file, which contains the journal, > > > is on a corrupted fs? > > > > I think you should still be able to mount the file system > > read-only, even if it's not "clean", so there's no problem > > locating the journal file. Particularly, note that the > > journal file should probably be located in the root of the > > file system, and it will have a constant size and should > > be allocated from the start (i.e. it never grows nor > > changes allocation), which means there is no way that its > > meta data could be damaged. > [...] > > With gjournal not only the metadata is journaled but also the actual > data (e.g. files' contents). So writes to the journal file (which is a > "regular file" on the FS) should bypass the journaling stuff. Otherwise > they will get journaled themselves and it will end up in an endless > loop. Right. That's a point I forgot. The journal file would be required to have its data be exempt from being journaled. That's probably not trivial to implement, I'm afraid (but I could be wrong). > This thing still looks to me like roping your chest to your leg (instead > of to an unmovable object) in order to avoid falling, but I might be > wrong... True, it's certainly not a clean nor efficient solution. But Mike has a valid point that it would enable people to turn on journaling on existing file systems, without the need for repartitioning or adding a disk. It would be a nice way to _quickly_ set up journaling, for testing purposes, or simply for curiosity. BTW, I think in Solaris you can also add journaling to an existing UFS partition on the fly, without the need for newfs or adding space. (Provided that there is enough free space inside the existing file system, of course.) Best regards Oliver -- Oliver Fromme, secnetix GmbH & Co. KG, Marktplatz 29, 85567 Grafing Dienstleistungen mit Schwerpunkt FreeBSD: http://www.secnetix.de/bsd Any opinions expressed in this message may be personal to the author and may not necessarily reflect the opinions of secnetix in any way. "To this day, many C programmers believe that 'strong typing' just means pounding extra hard on the keyboard." -- Peter van der Linden From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jan 23 14:18:24 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B229E16A407; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:18:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@freebsd.org) Received: from mh1.centtech.com (moat3.centtech.com [64.129.166.50]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B58F13C4DB; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:18:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@freebsd.org) Received: from [10.177.171.220] (neutrino.centtech.com [10.177.171.220]) by mh1.centtech.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0NE33PF039427; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 08:03:03 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from anderson@freebsd.org) Message-ID: <45B6159B.8050703@freebsd.org> Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 08:03:07 -0600 From: Eric Anderson User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (X11/20070121) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Oliver Fromme References: <200701231010.l0NAAcp6017303@lurza.secnetix.de> In-Reply-To: <200701231010.l0NAAcp6017303@lurza.secnetix.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.88.4/2480/Tue Jan 23 05:21:51 2007 on mh1.centtech.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=8.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.1.6 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.6 (2006-10-03) on mh1.centtech.com Cc: vd@freebsd.org, silby@silby.com, xride@x12.dk, freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Where to start? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:18:24 -0000 On 01/23/07 04:10, Oliver Fromme wrote: > Vasil Dimov wrote: > > [discussion moved from freebsd-hackers@ to freebsd-geom@] > > Oliver Fromme wrote: > > > Vasil Dimov wrote: > > > > Mike Silbersack wrote: > > > > > Soeren Straarup wrote: > > > > > [...] > > > > > > I'm looking for a project. > > > > > [...] > > > > > I'd like to see the ability to run gjournal without reformatting. > > > > > If you could create a dummy file inside the filesystem, then use > > > > > that area for the journal, it might be possible. I'm sure that > > > > > would let a lot more people see if journalling is right for them. > > > > > > > > I am not sure about gjournal internals but what if a system crash > > > > occurs in the middle of a transaction and the fs gets corrupted and > > > > the data, necessary to fix it is in the journal, but you cannot > > > > access the journal because the file, which contains the journal, > > > > is on a corrupted fs? > > > > > > I think you should still be able to mount the file system > > > read-only, even if it's not "clean", so there's no problem > > > locating the journal file. Particularly, note that the > > > journal file should probably be located in the root of the > > > file system, and it will have a constant size and should > > > be allocated from the start (i.e. it never grows nor > > > changes allocation), which means there is no way that its > > > meta data could be damaged. > > [...] > > > > With gjournal not only the metadata is journaled but also the actual > > data (e.g. files' contents). So writes to the journal file (which is a > > "regular file" on the FS) should bypass the journaling stuff. Otherwise > > they will get journaled themselves and it will end up in an endless > > loop. > > Right. That's a point I forgot. The journal file would > be required to have its data be exempt from being journaled. > That's probably not trivial to implement, I'm afraid (but > I could be wrong). > > > This thing still looks to me like roping your chest to your leg (instead > > of to an unmovable object) in order to avoid falling, but I might be > > wrong... > > True, it's certainly not a clean nor efficient solution. > But Mike has a valid point that it would enable people to > turn on journaling on existing file systems, without the > need for repartitioning or adding a disk. It would be a > nice way to _quickly_ set up journaling, for testing > purposes, or simply for curiosity. Why not disable swap, use the swap partition as the new journaling device, and then enable vn-backed swap for the system? > BTW, I think in Solaris you can also add journaling to an > existing UFS partition on the fly, without the need for > newfs or adding space. (Provided that there is enough > free space inside the existing file system, of course.) Sure - many journaling fs have that ability. There's been several attempts in the past to add journaling to our UFS2, without completion. Eric From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jan 23 14:33:43 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D72E16A402; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:33:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vd@datamax.bg) Received: from jengal.datamax.bg (jengal.datamax.bg [82.103.104.21]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 53F3813C442; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:33:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vd@datamax.bg) Received: from qlovarnika.bg.datamax (qlovarnika.bg.datamax [192.168.10.2]) by jengal.datamax.bg (Postfix) with SMTP id 3BA79B848; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 16:33:42 +0200 (EET) Received: (nullmailer pid 97607 invoked by uid 1002); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:33:42 -0000 Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 16:33:42 +0200 From: Vasil Dimov To: Eric Anderson Message-ID: <20070123143342.GA97570@qlovarnika.bg.datamax> References: <200701231010.l0NAAcp6017303@lurza.secnetix.de> <45B6159B.8050703@freebsd.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="mP3DRpeJDSE+ciuQ" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <45B6159B.8050703@freebsd.org> Cc: xride@x12.dk, silby@silby.com, Oliver Fromme , freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Where to start? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: vd@FreeBSD.org List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:33:43 -0000 --mP3DRpeJDSE+ciuQ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, Jan 23, 2007 at 08:03:07 -0600, Eric Anderson wrote: [...] > Why not disable swap, use the swap partition as the new journaling=20 > device, and then enable vn-backed swap for the system? Great idea, seems to simplify things a lot, thanks! --=20 Vasil Dimov gro.DSBeerF@dv % If two people love each other, there can be no happy end to it. -- Ernest Hemingway --mP3DRpeJDSE+ciuQ Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iD8DBQFFthzGFw6SP/bBpCARAuU8AJwOOMUqupRtRcoDaFlphTcMykGtTACeI/Gx 4SlplbKspJBzB9bsPGWJtS4= =DnYY -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --mP3DRpeJDSE+ciuQ-- From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jan 23 14:35:15 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9793316A40A; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:35:15 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (lurza.secnetix.de [83.120.8.8]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 87B2B13C4E5; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:35:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (naxydi@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0NEZ7kO049332; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:35:13 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from oliver.fromme@secnetix.de) Received: (from olli@localhost) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.1/Submit) id l0NEZ7W4049331; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:35:07 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from olli) From: Oliver Fromme Message-Id: <200701231435.l0NEZ7W4049331@lurza.secnetix.de> To: anderson@freebsd.org (Eric Anderson) Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:35:07 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: <45B6159B.8050703@freebsd.org> X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.1.2 (lurza.secnetix.de [127.0.0.1]); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:35:13 +0100 (CET) Cc: vd@freebsd.org, silby@silby.com, xride@x12.dk, freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Where to start? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:35:15 -0000 Eric Anderson wrote: > Oliver Fromme wrote: > > Vasil Dimov wrote: > > > This thing still looks to me like roping your chest to your leg (instead > > > of to an unmovable object) in order to avoid falling, but I might be > > > wrong... > > > > True, it's certainly not a clean nor efficient solution. > > But Mike has a valid point that it would enable people to > > turn on journaling on existing file systems, without the > > need for repartitioning or adding a disk. It would be a > > nice way to _quickly_ set up journaling, for testing > > purposes, or simply for curiosity. > > Why not disable swap, use the swap partition as the new journaling > device, and then enable vn-backed swap for the system? Nice idea. Indeed, that would probably work, if the swap is large enough to hold the journal. By the way, what happens if you put a swap file on a journaled file system? Will the page-out actions also be journaled? > > BTW, I think in Solaris you can also add journaling to an > > existing UFS partition on the fly, without the need for > > newfs or adding space. (Provided that there is enough > > free space inside the existing file system, of course.) > > Sure - many journaling fs have that ability. There's been several > attempts in the past to add journaling to our UFS2, without completion. Yes, I know. But now there is PJD's gjournal. :-) Best regards Oliver -- Oliver Fromme, secnetix GmbH & Co. KG, Marktplatz 29, 85567 Grafing Dienstleistungen mit Schwerpunkt FreeBSD: http://www.secnetix.de/bsd Any opinions expressed in this message may be personal to the author and may not necessarily reflect the opinions of secnetix in any way. "Python tricks" is a tough one, cuz the language is so clean. E.g., C makes an art of confusing pointers with arrays and strings, which leads to lotsa neat pointer tricks; APL mistakes everything for an array, leading to neat one-liners; and Perl confuses everything period, making each line a joyous adventure . -- Tim Peters From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jan 23 14:58:25 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1B6016A400; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:58:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@freebsd.org) Received: from mh1.centtech.com (moat3.centtech.com [64.129.166.50]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2D1E13C480; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:58:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@freebsd.org) Received: from [10.177.171.220] (neutrino.centtech.com [10.177.171.220]) by mh1.centtech.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0NEwNbl049255; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 08:58:23 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from anderson@freebsd.org) Message-ID: <45B62293.9020907@freebsd.org> Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 08:58:27 -0600 From: Eric Anderson User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (X11/20070121) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Oliver Fromme References: <200701231435.l0NEZ7W4049331@lurza.secnetix.de> In-Reply-To: <200701231435.l0NEZ7W4049331@lurza.secnetix.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.88.4/2480/Tue Jan 23 05:21:51 2007 on mh1.centtech.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=8.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.1.6 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.6 (2006-10-03) on mh1.centtech.com Cc: vd@freebsd.org, silby@silby.com, xride@x12.dk, freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Where to start? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:58:26 -0000 On 01/23/07 08:35, Oliver Fromme wrote: > Eric Anderson wrote: > > Oliver Fromme wrote: > > > Vasil Dimov wrote: > > > > This thing still looks to me like roping your chest to your leg (instead > > > > of to an unmovable object) in order to avoid falling, but I might be > > > > wrong... > > > > > > True, it's certainly not a clean nor efficient solution. > > > But Mike has a valid point that it would enable people to > > > turn on journaling on existing file systems, without the > > > need for repartitioning or adding a disk. It would be a > > > nice way to _quickly_ set up journaling, for testing > > > purposes, or simply for curiosity. > > > > Why not disable swap, use the swap partition as the new journaling > > device, and then enable vn-backed swap for the system? > > Nice idea. Indeed, that would probably work, if the swap > is large enough to hold the journal. > > By the way, what happens if you put a swap file on a > journaled file system? Will the page-out actions also > be journaled? Yep. gjournal has no way to know (right now) that it is journaling a swap file, etc. It's just a block device journal, so anything that hits the disk, goes through the journal. I'm not sure how this impacts performance, if it does at all. > > > BTW, I think in Solaris you can also add journaling to an > > > existing UFS partition on the fly, without the need for > > > newfs or adding space. (Provided that there is enough > > > free space inside the existing file system, of course.) > > > > Sure - many journaling fs have that ability. There's been several > > attempts in the past to add journaling to our UFS2, without completion. > > Yes, I know. But now there is PJD's gjournal. :-) > > Best regards > Oliver > Eric From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jan 23 18:30:34 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ADF4316A47A for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:30:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (lurza.secnetix.de [83.120.8.8]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3968D13C457 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:30:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (varonk@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0NIURjX083279; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:30:33 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from oliver.fromme@secnetix.de) Received: (from olli@localhost) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.1/Submit) id l0NIURmC083278; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:30:27 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from olli) Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:30:27 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <200701231830.l0NIURmC083278@lurza.secnetix.de> From: Oliver Fromme To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG, fernan.aguero@gmail.com In-Reply-To: <520894aa0701081445i43d76098m418ce695d2133e53@mail.gmail.com> X-Newsgroups: list.freebsd-geom User-Agent: tin/1.8.2-20060425 ("Shillay") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.11-STABLE (i386)) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.1.2 (lurza.secnetix.de [127.0.0.1]); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:30:33 +0100 (CET) Cc: Subject: Re: clear metadata using dd? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG, fernan.aguero@gmail.com List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:30:34 -0000 Hi, I just noticed this message today, and there's one thing I don't understand ... Fernan Aguero wrote: > I'm trying to set up two disks to contain both gmirrored and > gstriped slices. > > This is what I'm trying to achieve: > adxs1, swap > adxs2, gmirror > adxs3, gstripe Can someone please explain why such a setup makes sense? As far as I can tell, the purpose of gmirror is to provide redundancy in the case of drive failure. I.e. if one drive fails, the system keeps running happily instead of crashing. But if only part of the disk is mirrored, then the system will still crash if one drive fails. So what is the point of using gmirror, if not on whole disks? Just wondering. Best regards Oliver -- Oliver Fromme, secnetix GmbH & Co. KG, Marktplatz 29, 85567 Grafing Dienstleistungen mit Schwerpunkt FreeBSD: http://www.secnetix.de/bsd Any opinions expressed in this message may be personal to the author and may not necessarily reflect the opinions of secnetix in any way. With Perl you can manipulate text, interact with programs, talk over networks, drive Web pages, perform arbitrary precision arithmetic, and write programs that look like Snoopy swearing. From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jan 23 18:38:09 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4289316A401 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:38:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@freebsd.org) Received: from mh1.centtech.com (moat3.centtech.com [64.129.166.50]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 189C213C4D0 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:38:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@freebsd.org) Received: from [10.177.171.220] (neutrino.centtech.com [10.177.171.220]) by mh1.centtech.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0NIc6Qe088755; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 12:38:07 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from anderson@freebsd.org) Message-ID: <45B6560E.5080302@freebsd.org> Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 12:38:06 -0600 From: Eric Anderson User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (X11/20070121) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org, fernan.aguero@gmail.com References: <200701231830.l0NIURmC083278@lurza.secnetix.de> In-Reply-To: <200701231830.l0NIURmC083278@lurza.secnetix.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.88.4/2480/Tue Jan 23 05:21:51 2007 on mh1.centtech.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=8.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.1.6 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.6 (2006-10-03) on mh1.centtech.com Cc: Subject: Re: clear metadata using dd? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:38:09 -0000 On 01/23/07 12:30, Oliver Fromme wrote: > Hi, > > I just noticed this message today, and there's one thing > I don't understand ... > > Fernan Aguero wrote: > > I'm trying to set up two disks to contain both gmirrored and > > gstriped slices. > > > > This is what I'm trying to achieve: > > adxs1, swap > > adxs2, gmirror > > adxs3, gstripe > > Can someone please explain why such a setup makes sense? > > As far as I can tell, the purpose of gmirror is to provide > redundancy in the case of drive failure. I.e. if one > drive fails, the system keeps running happily instead of > crashing. > > But if only part of the disk is mirrored, then the system > will still crash if one drive fails. So what is the point > of using gmirror, if not on whole disks? You might crash, but the data on the mirror on one of the disks is still there, so you haven't lost all the data. Eric From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jan 23 18:48:58 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D5C8C16A401 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:48:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (lurza.secnetix.de [83.120.8.8]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6101D13C441 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:48:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (qfmhmd@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0NImqgE089655 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:48:57 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from oliver.fromme@secnetix.de) Received: (from olli@localhost) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.1/Submit) id l0NImq37089654; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:48:52 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from olli) Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:48:52 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <200701231848.l0NImq37089654@lurza.secnetix.de> From: Oliver Fromme To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <45B6560E.5080302@freebsd.org> X-Newsgroups: list.freebsd-geom User-Agent: tin/1.8.2-20060425 ("Shillay") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.11-STABLE (i386)) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.1.2 (lurza.secnetix.de [127.0.0.1]); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:48:57 +0100 (CET) Cc: Subject: Re: clear metadata using dd? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:48:58 -0000 Eric Anderson wrote: > Oliver Fromme wrote: > > Fernan Aguero wrote: > > > adxs1, swap > > > adxs2, gmirror > > > adxs3, gstripe > > > > Can someone please explain why such a setup makes sense? > > > > As far as I can tell, the purpose of gmirror is to provide > > redundancy in the case of drive failure. I.e. if one > > drive fails, the system keeps running happily instead of > > crashing. > > > > But if only part of the disk is mirrored, then the system > > will still crash if one drive fails. So what is the point > > of using gmirror, if not on whole disks? > > You might crash, but the data on the mirror on one of the disks is still > there, so you haven't lost all the data. Right, but you have lost all the data in the partitions that are not mirrored. The system is basically unusable and will need to be restored from backup. In this particular case, if I understood Fernan correctly, the mirror contains the root file system, while all other data is on a gstripe (not mirrored). So if a drive fails, the system crashes and all of the actual user data is lost. The fact that you still have a good root file system on one of the disks doesn't help much in that situation. Best regards Oliver -- Oliver Fromme, secnetix GmbH & Co. KG, Marktplatz 29, 85567 Grafing Dienstleistungen mit Schwerpunkt FreeBSD: http://www.secnetix.de/bsd Any opinions expressed in this message may be personal to the author and may not necessarily reflect the opinions of secnetix in any way. "In My Egoistical Opinion, most people's C programs should be indented six feet downward and covered with dirt." -- Blair P. Houghton From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jan 23 19:07:23 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 136AA16A401 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:07:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@freebsd.org) Received: from mh1.centtech.com (moat3.centtech.com [64.129.166.50]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDA2713C461 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:07:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@freebsd.org) Received: from [10.177.171.220] (neutrino.centtech.com [10.177.171.220]) by mh1.centtech.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0NJ7IT6094104 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:07:18 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from anderson@freebsd.org) Message-ID: <45B65CE5.2010600@freebsd.org> Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:07:17 -0600 From: Eric Anderson User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (X11/20070121) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org References: <200701231848.l0NImq37089654@lurza.secnetix.de> In-Reply-To: <200701231848.l0NImq37089654@lurza.secnetix.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.88.4/2480/Tue Jan 23 05:21:51 2007 on mh1.centtech.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=8.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.1.6 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.6 (2006-10-03) on mh1.centtech.com Subject: Re: clear metadata using dd? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:07:23 -0000 On 01/23/07 12:48, Oliver Fromme wrote: > Eric Anderson wrote: > > Oliver Fromme wrote: > > > Fernan Aguero wrote: > > > > adxs1, swap > > > > adxs2, gmirror > > > > adxs3, gstripe > > > > > > Can someone please explain why such a setup makes sense? > > > > > > As far as I can tell, the purpose of gmirror is to provide > > > redundancy in the case of drive failure. I.e. if one > > > drive fails, the system keeps running happily instead of > > > crashing. > > > > > > But if only part of the disk is mirrored, then the system > > > will still crash if one drive fails. So what is the point > > > of using gmirror, if not on whole disks? > > > > You might crash, but the data on the mirror on one of the disks is still > > there, so you haven't lost all the data. > > Right, but you have lost all the data in the partitions that > are not mirrored. The system is basically unusable and will > need to be restored from backup. > > In this particular case, if I understood Fernan correctly, > the mirror contains the root file system, while all other > data is on a gstripe (not mirrored). So if a drive fails, > the system crashes and all of the actual user data is > lost. The fact that you still have a good root file > system on one of the disks doesn't help much in that > situation. Unless you don't care about the data on that partition. For instance, a cvs mirror, or ftp mirror, or ISO storage area, or build directory, etc. Maybe you want the mirror because you'll put home areas on it, or custom configs, or something else. Anyway, the point is that you can do whatever you wish, even if it doesn't make sense to somebody else.. :) Hooray for UNIX! Eric From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jan 23 19:19:42 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B88616A404 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:19:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from reedl@tatteredcover.com) Received: from nell.tatteredcover.com (nell.tatteredcover.com [206.124.11.52]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 141F913C461 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:19:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from reedl@tatteredcover.com) Received: from [199.26.174.18] (spender.tatteredcover.com [199.26.174.18]) by nell.tatteredcover.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A63EDA784; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 11:33:35 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <45B65B68.5040209@tatteredcover.com> Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 12:00:56 -0700 From: Reed Loefgren User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (X11/20061113) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG, fernan.aguero@gmail.com References: <200701231830.l0NIURmC083278@lurza.secnetix.de> In-Reply-To: <200701231830.l0NIURmC083278@lurza.secnetix.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Subject: Re: clear metadata using dd? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:19:42 -0000 Oliver Fromme wrote: > Hi, > > I just noticed this message today, and there's one thing > I don't understand ... > > Fernan Aguero wrote: > > I'm trying to set up two disks to contain both gmirrored and > > gstriped slices. > > > > This is what I'm trying to achieve: > > adxs1, swap > > adxs2, gmirror > > adxs3, gstripe > > Can someone please explain why such a setup makes sense? > > As far as I can tell, the purpose of gmirror is to provide > redundancy in the case of drive failure. I.e. if one > drive fails, the system keeps running happily instead of > crashing. > > But if only part of the disk is mirrored, then the system > will still crash if one drive fails. So what is the point > of using gmirror, if not on whole disks? > > Just wondering. > > Best regards > Oliver > > Oliver, I have gmirror running on my home machine; the entire disk mirrored to a second disk, swap included, because that was the setup I followed on onlamp's BSD section. In retrospect I would not mirror swap since writing to a mirrored swap is a performance hit that might not be compensated by the increased read performance of mirrors. I see swap as both already slow (compared to RAM) but also somewhat disposable. If I were to do it again I would mirror the entire slice (DOS partition) holding the OS but leave two slices with the swap partitions on them independent, mount both of them with identical priorities, and let the OS determine the best usage algorithm. I have a gig of RAM and only rarely even touch swap, plus my career doesn't hang on such decisions so I can afford to play a bit. Your situation might not have that leeway. :) r From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Jan 24 00:11:47 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A91FE16A401 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 00:11:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from T.Nickl@gmx.net) Received: from mail.gmx.net (mail.gmx.net [213.165.64.20]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id F3A9813C4DB for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 00:11:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from T.Nickl@gmx.net) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 23 Jan 2007 23:45:04 -0000 Received: from ppp-82-135-1-14.dynamic.mnet-online.de (EHLO [192.168.2.2]) [82.135.1.14] by mail.gmx.net (mp040) with SMTP; 24 Jan 2007 00:45:04 +0100 X-Authenticated: #20481763 Message-ID: <45B69DE3.1050407@gmx.net> Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 00:44:35 +0100 From: Thomas Nickl User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (X11/20061206) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Subject: GELI: change keyfile to passphrase X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 00:11:47 -0000 Hi, I know a way to destroy your geli partition without knowing ;) : dd if=/dev/random of=/tmp/keyfile count=1 bs=128 geli init -s 4096 -b -P -K /tmp/keyfile /dev/md9 geli attach -p -k /tmp/keyfile /dev/md9 geli setkey -n 0 /dev/md9 > geli detach /dev/md9 geli attach /dev/md9 > Missing -p flag. geli attach -p /dev/md9 > No key components given. geli attach -p -k /tmp/keyfile /dev/md9 > Wrong key for md9. Replacing the setkey line with geli setkey -n 0 -p -k /tmp/keyfile /dev/md9 doesen't help. HOWEVER, geli detach /dev/md9 and then geli setkey -n 0 -p -k /tmp/keyfile /dev/md9 works as designed ("geli attach /dev/md9" now asks for a passphrase) So I can recommend: never set a key with an attached media. I have "FreeBSD washu 6.1-RELEASE FreeBSD 6.1-RELEASE #0: Sun May 7 04:42:56 UTC 2006 root@opus.cse.buffalo.edu:/usr/obj/usr/src/sys/SMP i386". From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Jan 24 02:01:47 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C7D916A502 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 02:01:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fernan.aguero@gmail.com) Received: from omega.iib.unsam.edu.ar (omega.iib.unsam.edu.ar [170.210.49.14]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9FE913C461 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 02:01:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fernan.aguero@gmail.com) Received: from gama.iib.unsam.edu.ar (gama.iib.unsam.edu.ar [192.168.10.72]) by omega.iib.unsam.edu.ar (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NN7YrP039591; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 20:07:34 -0300 (ART) (envelope-from fernan.aguero@gmail.com) Received: (from fernan@localhost) by gama.iib.unsam.edu.ar (8.13.8/8.13.8/Submit) id l0NN809R098670; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 20:08:00 -0300 (ART) (envelope-from fernan.aguero@gmail.com) X-Authentication-Warning: gama.iib.unsam.edu.ar: fernan set sender to fernan.aguero@gmail.com using -f Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 20:08:00 -0300 From: Fernan Aguero To: Oliver Fromme Message-ID: <20070123230800.GA98614@iib.unsam.edu.ar> References: <520894aa0701081445i43d76098m418ce695d2133e53@mail.gmail.com> <200701231830.l0NIURmC083278@lurza.secnetix.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200701231830.l0NIURmC083278@lurza.secnetix.de> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) Cc: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: clear metadata using dd? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 02:01:47 -0000 +----[ Oliver Fromme (23.Jan.2007 15:41): | | Hi, | | I just noticed this message today, and there's one thing | I don't understand ... | | Fernan Aguero wrote: | > I'm trying to set up two disks to contain both gmirrored and | > gstriped slices. | > | > This is what I'm trying to achieve: | > adxs1, swap | > adxs2, gmirror | > adxs3, gstripe | | Can someone please explain why such a setup makes sense? | | As far as I can tell, the purpose of gmirror is to provide | redundancy in the case of drive failure. I.e. if one | drive fails, the system keeps running happily instead of | crashing. Hi, well, I beg to differ, but with this setup I don't see why the system will crash if one disk fails ... I did several tests, removed one disk, and the system booted and worked fine in degraded mode ... Of course I'm not putting essential stuff in the gstriped device. Here's how my setup looks like: ad4s1b, ad6s1b => swap ad4s2, ad6s2 => gmirror (/, /var, /tmp, /usr) (i.e. base OS) ad4s3, ad6s3 => gstripe (/freebsd, /usr/obj, /distfiles, /scratch) So, as you see, in the gstriped device I've put things that I can afford to lose in case of a crash. The FreeBSD sources can be downloaded again, the stuff in /usr/obj can be made again from the sources, the distfile local mirror can also be made fresh again, and the temp scratch space is not to be used for essential stuff. Does it make sense now? Fernan | But if only part of the disk is mirrored, then the system | will still crash if one drive fails. So what is the point | of using gmirror, if not on whole disks? | | Just wondering. | | Best regards | Oliver | | -- | Oliver Fromme, secnetix GmbH & Co. KG, Marktplatz 29, 85567 Grafing | Dienstleistungen mit Schwerpunkt FreeBSD: http://www.secnetix.de/bsd | Any opinions expressed in this message may be personal to the author | and may not necessarily reflect the opinions of secnetix in any way. | | With Perl you can manipulate text, interact with programs, talk over | networks, drive Web pages, perform arbitrary precision arithmetic, | and write programs that look like Snoopy swearing. | | +----] From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Jan 24 19:30:56 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDA7716A401 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 19:30:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from don_oles@able.com.ua) Received: from able.com.ua (able.com.ua [80.91.162.66]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A04CA13C461 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 19:30:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from don_oles@able.com.ua) Received: from able.com.ua (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by able.com.ua (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7E0244C50 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 20:59:29 +0200 (EET) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=selector1; d=able.com.ua; h=Received:Date:From:X-Mailer:Reply-To:X-Priority:Message-ID:To:Subject:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=a833DoNtm/njp9SVwJ7TtgnGPpRvXwfIIDt0jBqc8HCmyJfS+A0xZvE2Q11yYMGTlbP3AgLNPnpGYXvuzBHBCFEij9qk4YRfIRDfxmAaLubWECYqeAcKMADI1MEwwS8f12g/Owwov3cVINrD6jRG0T8rfn9VhArDe6hCNJ+s+9A=; Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by able.com.ua (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7FA9244C4F for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 20:59:29 +0200 (EET) Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 20:59:33 +0200 From: Oles Hnatkevych X-Mailer: The Bat! (v3.71.01) Professional X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1627867361.20070124205933@able.com.ua> To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV using ClamSMTP at ABLE Cc: Subject: gmirror existing installation? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Oles Hnatkevych List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 19:30:57 -0000 Hello, freebsd-geom gurus. There's a simple way of gmirroring existing installation. > sysctl kern.geom.debugflags=16 # allow writing to a live filesystem > gmirror label -v gm0 /dev/ad0 > # edit /etc/fstab, chane to /dev/mirror/gm0... slices > # add "geom_mirror_load=YES" to /boot/loader.conf > # reboot > gmirror insert gm0 /dev/ad1 I just wonder if may cause any problems. I see that "sysinstall" when told "A" to use whole disk reserves for some reason some extra space at the end of the ad0, so there won't be a problem with last-sector metadata. But I see that the ad0/ad1 geometry and the gm0 geometry is quite different in number of cylinders and heads. Since the original system was labeled according to one "mediasize", and now label "lives" on another "mediasize" (that should be less in size) I wonder if the above method of mirroring existing installation is 100% correct? And yet the MBR partition table was created using another "units"... -- Best wishes, Oles From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Jan 25 02:25:58 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F5DA16A402 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 02:25:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mikej@rogers.com) Received: from smtp101.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com (smtp101.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com [206.190.36.79]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id CCDA213C442 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 02:25:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mikej@rogers.com) Received: (qmail 3255 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2007 01:59:16 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=rogers.com; h=Received:X-YMail-OSG:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:CC:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=4CiZ6n/n7nV4qZQ8GTQf4oN2tX/C/3sV1eXO+rEMybV9NgTPO/xTDX3dpiaJeQZMa28RCZPHloxjmHtCtqreIp6TK15r61ZJGLubq4udcbrsK1SzZgaVS5o86xCPWfnJayF/iB21tyCGE5RbmQ6kR9qeq7CNbAQTSXz7nm+x+rg= ; Received: from unknown (HELO ?172.16.0.200?) (mikej@rogers.com@74.111.253.239 with plain) by smtp101.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2007 01:59:16 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: uqabLpsVM1lhe5DzqS3VdG_eNXEPQYkQm_eutSVcdlCIZcOYNSEHzOZ_ly.dDPKAJg-- Message-ID: <45B80EFF.7040505@rogers.com> Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 20:59:27 -0500 From: Mike Jakubik User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Oles Hnatkevych References: <1627867361.20070124205933@able.com.ua> In-Reply-To: <1627867361.20070124205933@able.com.ua> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: gmirror existing installation? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 02:25:58 -0000 Oles Hnatkevych wrote: > Hello, freebsd-geom gurus. > > There's a simple way of gmirroring existing installation. > Yes, have a look at this article. http://www.onlamp.com/pub/a/bsd/2005/11/10/FreeBSD_Basics.html From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Jan 25 08:23:13 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38ABF16A400 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 08:23:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from silby@silby.com) Received: from relay02.pair.com (relay02.pair.com [209.68.5.16]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id C996113C457 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 08:23:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from silby@silby.com) Received: (qmail 84538 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2007 07:56:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO localhost) (unknown) by unknown with SMTP; 25 Jan 2007 07:56:16 -0000 X-pair-Authenticated: 209.68.2.70 Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 01:56:15 -0600 (CST) From: Mike Silbersack To: Eric Anderson In-Reply-To: <45B6159B.8050703@freebsd.org> Message-ID: <20070125015459.V26320@odysseus.silby.com> References: <200701231010.l0NAAcp6017303@lurza.secnetix.de> <45B6159B.8050703@freebsd.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Cc: vd@freebsd.org, Oliver Fromme , xride@x12.dk, freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Where to start? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 08:23:13 -0000 On Tue, 23 Jan 2007, Eric Anderson wrote: > Why not disable swap, use the swap partition as the new journaling device, > and then enable vn-backed swap for the system? I wouldn't want to disable swap, but if I could use some percentage of swap, then it would rock. Maybe I'm trying to make this more difficult than it has to be. :) Mike "Silby" Silbersack From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Jan 25 10:57:56 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C6EB16A400; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 10:57:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (lurza.secnetix.de [83.120.8.8]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A93B13C44B; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 10:57:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (bufwdi@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0PAvn7s092071; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:57:54 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from oliver.fromme@secnetix.de) Received: (from olli@localhost) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.1/Submit) id l0PAvnBR092070; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:57:49 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from olli) From: Oliver Fromme Message-Id: <200701251057.l0PAvnBR092070@lurza.secnetix.de> To: silby@silby.com (Mike Silbersack) Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:57:49 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: <20070125015459.V26320@odysseus.silby.com> X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.1.2 (lurza.secnetix.de [127.0.0.1]); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:57:55 +0100 (CET) Cc: vd@freebsd.org, freebsd-geom@freebsd.org, xride@x12.dk, Eric Anderson Subject: Re: Where to start? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 10:57:56 -0000 Mike Silbersack wrote: > Eric Anderson wrote: > > > Why not disable swap, use the swap partition as the new journaling device, > > and then enable vn-backed swap for the system? > > I wouldn't want to disable swap, Eric didn't say to disable swap permanently. Only disable the existing swap partition (use swapoff(8)) and then use it for the journal. Then create a swap file in an existing file system and use that one for swapping. > but if I could use some percentage of swap, then it would rock. That would be possible, too, of course. Disable swapping temporarily with swapoff(8), then shrink the swap partition with bsdlabel(8) and create a new partition in the free space. Then resume swapping with swapon(8) on the swap partition (which is now smaller), and use the new partition for the journal. If swap is now too small, you can still create an additional swap file in an existing file system, of course. However, note that the journal requires a certain minimum size which depends on the thoughput of data on that file system. I guess that half of the swap partition would be too small in many common cases. Unfortunately, FreeBSD doesn't have shrinkfs(8), which would be extremely useful to add space for a journal to an existing disk (among other things). Maybe this is something that should be added to the ideas web page. Best regards Oliver -- Oliver Fromme, secnetix GmbH & Co. KG, Marktplatz 29, 85567 Grafing Dienstleistungen mit Schwerpunkt FreeBSD: http://www.secnetix.de/bsd Any opinions expressed in this message may be personal to the author and may not necessarily reflect the opinions of secnetix in any way. "What is this talk of 'release'? We do not make software 'releases'. Our software 'escapes', leaving a bloody trail of designers and quality assurance people in its wake." From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Jan 25 11:48:35 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 548AD16A402 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:48:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pjd@garage.freebsd.pl) Received: from mail.garage.freebsd.pl (arm132.internetdsl.tpnet.pl [83.17.198.132]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ACA7A13C441 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:48:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pjd@garage.freebsd.pl) Received: by mail.garage.freebsd.pl (Postfix, from userid 65534) id D8E1E487FD; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 12:48:31 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost (pjd.wheel.pl [10.0.1.1]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.garage.freebsd.pl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74ADD45696; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 12:48:23 +0100 (CET) Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 12:47:42 +0100 From: Pawel Jakub Dawidek To: Thomas Nickl Message-ID: <20070125114742.GA27181@garage.freebsd.pl> References: <45B69DE3.1050407@gmx.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="qMm9M+Fa2AknHoGS" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <45B69DE3.1050407@gmx.net> X-PGP-Key-URL: http://people.freebsd.org/~pjd/pjd.asc X-OS: FreeBSD 7.0-CURRENT i386 User-Agent: mutt-ng/devel-r804 (FreeBSD) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.4 (2005-06-05) on mail.garage.freebsd.pl X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.9 required=3.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.0.4 Cc: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: GELI: change keyfile to passphrase X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:48:35 -0000 --qMm9M+Fa2AknHoGS Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, Jan 24, 2007 at 12:44:35AM +0100, Thomas Nickl wrote: > Hi, >=20 > I know a way to destroy your geli partition without knowing ;) : >=20 > dd if=3D/dev/random of=3D/tmp/keyfile count=3D1 bs=3D128 > geli init -s 4096 -b -P -K /tmp/keyfile /dev/md9 > geli attach -p -k /tmp/keyfile /dev/md9 > geli setkey -n 0 /dev/md9 > > > geli detach /dev/md9 > geli attach /dev/md9 > > Missing -p flag. > geli attach -p /dev/md9 > > No key components given. > geli attach -p -k /tmp/keyfile /dev/md9 > > Wrong key for md9. >=20 > Replacing the setkey line with > geli setkey -n 0 -p -k /tmp/keyfile /dev/md9 > doesen't help. >=20 > HOWEVER, > geli detach /dev/md9 > and then > geli setkey -n 0 -p -k /tmp/keyfile /dev/md9 > works as designed ("geli attach /dev/md9" now asks for a passphrase) >=20 > So I can recommend: never set a key with an attached media. >=20 > I have "FreeBSD washu 6.1-RELEASE FreeBSD 6.1-RELEASE #0: Sun May 7 04:4= 2:56 UTC 2006 root@opus.cse.buffalo.edu:/usr/obj/usr/src/sys/SMP i386". This was a bug, which is fixed in the following revisions: src/sbin/geom/class/eli/geom_eli.c 1.19 src/sbin/geom/misc/subr.c 1.7 src/sbin/geom/misc/subr.h 1.8 The explanation from the commit log: When the following conditions are meet: - First configured key is based only on keyfile (no passphrase). - Device is attached. - User changes first key (setkey) from keyfile to passphrase and doesn't specify number of iterations (with -i option). =2E..geli(8) won't store calculated number of iterations in metadata. This result in device beeing unaccesable after detach. One can recover from this situation by guessing number of iterations generated, storing it in metadata and trying to attach device. Recovery procedure isn't nice, but one's data is not lost. PS. Just to clarify. This bug doesn't affect geli(8) security in any way. It affects only data availability and it is possible to recover data. Thank you for your report! --=20 Pawel Jakub Dawidek http://www.wheel.pl pjd@FreeBSD.org http://www.FreeBSD.org FreeBSD committer Am I Evil? Yes, I Am! --qMm9M+Fa2AknHoGS Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFFuJjdForvXbEpPzQRAufkAJ43fPQhQFReH1ntKun1nRLvq2ixRgCg91OS pivZtDNGImHCCl/AQgBqnLA= =rkkn -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --qMm9M+Fa2AknHoGS-- From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Jan 25 14:25:45 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B588616A403 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:25:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (lurza.secnetix.de [83.120.8.8]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3974813C442 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:25:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (ixgpkd@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0PEOkcd016222; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 15:24:51 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from oliver.fromme@secnetix.de) Received: (from olli@localhost) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.1/Submit) id l0PEOkGh016221; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 15:24:46 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from olli) Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 15:24:46 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <200701251424.l0PEOkGh016221@lurza.secnetix.de> From: Oliver Fromme To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG, Oles Hnatkevych In-Reply-To: <1627867361.20070124205933@able.com.ua> X-Newsgroups: list.freebsd-geom User-Agent: tin/1.8.2-20060425 ("Shillay") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.11-STABLE (i386)) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.1.2 (lurza.secnetix.de [127.0.0.1]); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 15:24:52 +0100 (CET) Cc: Subject: Re: gmirror existing installation? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG, Oles Hnatkevych List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:25:45 -0000 Oles Hnatkevych wrote: > There's a simple way of gmirroring existing installation. > > > sysctl kern.geom.debugflags=16 # allow writing to a live filesystem > > gmirror label -v gm0 /dev/ad0 > > # edit /etc/fstab, chane to /dev/mirror/gm0... slices > > # add "geom_mirror_load=YES" to /boot/loader.conf > > # reboot > > gmirror insert gm0 /dev/ad1 I don't recommend to do it that way. It is better to first create the mirror on the second (unused) disk, label and newfs it, then copy the system from ad0 to gm0, then boot from gm0 on the second disk and insert the first disk into the mirror. That's the approach described in the Handbook, I think. Best regards Oliver -- Oliver Fromme, secnetix GmbH & Co. KG, Marktplatz 29, 85567 Grafing Dienstleistungen mit Schwerpunkt FreeBSD: http://www.secnetix.de/bsd Any opinions expressed in this message may be personal to the author and may not necessarily reflect the opinions of secnetix in any way. "[...] one observation we can make here is that Python makes an excellent pseudocoding language, with the wonderful attribute that it can actually be executed." -- Bruce Eckel From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Jan 25 16:56:04 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD29616A400; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 16:56:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@freebsd.org) Received: from mh1.centtech.com (moat3.centtech.com [64.129.166.50]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7FF7B13C448; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 16:56:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from anderson@freebsd.org) Received: from [10.177.171.220] (neutrino.centtech.com [10.177.171.220]) by mh1.centtech.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0PGu0mQ077235; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 10:56:01 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from anderson@freebsd.org) Message-ID: <45B8E121.2000701@freebsd.org> Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 10:56:01 -0600 From: Eric Anderson User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (X11/20070121) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Oliver Fromme References: <200701251057.l0PAvnBR092070@lurza.secnetix.de> In-Reply-To: <200701251057.l0PAvnBR092070@lurza.secnetix.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.88.4/2489/Thu Jan 25 06:35:24 2007 on mh1.centtech.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=8.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.1.6 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.6 (2006-10-03) on mh1.centtech.com Cc: vd@freebsd.org, Mike Silbersack , xride@x12.dk, freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Where to start? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 16:56:05 -0000 On 01/25/07 04:57, Oliver Fromme wrote: > Mike Silbersack wrote: > > Eric Anderson wrote: > > > > > Why not disable swap, use the swap partition as the new journaling device, > > > and then enable vn-backed swap for the system? > > > > I wouldn't want to disable swap, > > Eric didn't say to disable swap permanently. Only disable > the existing swap partition (use swapoff(8)) and then use > it for the journal. Then create a swap file in an existing > file system and use that one for swapping. > > > but if I could use some percentage of swap, then it would rock. > > That would be possible, too, of course. Disable swapping > temporarily with swapoff(8), then shrink the swap partition > with bsdlabel(8) and create a new partition in the free > space. Then resume swapping with swapon(8) on the swap > partition (which is now smaller), and use the new partition > for the journal. If swap is now too small, you can still > create an additional swap file in an existing file system, > of course. > > However, note that the journal requires a certain minimum > size which depends on the thoughput of data on that file > system. I guess that half of the swap partition would be > too small in many common cases. > > Unfortunately, FreeBSD doesn't have shrinkfs(8), which > would be extremely useful to add space for a journal to > an existing disk (among other things). Maybe this is > something that should be added to the ideas web page. > > Best regards > Oliver > I think you could also reduce the journaling sync time for gjournal to reduce the needed journal size, but pjd@ would be best to answer that one. Eric From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Jan 26 01:17:17 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E1E816A40B for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 01:17:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mikej@rogers.com) Received: from smtp106.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com (smtp106.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com [68.142.225.204]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id ED48713C4CC for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 01:17:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mikej@rogers.com) Received: (qmail 99108 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2007 01:17:10 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=rogers.com; h=Received:X-YMail-OSG:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=JSj/GIwVj3g5Zgeg8RbHUpj7pdn/agsqbqT4pmujPUB/+bxg4VJ0PPeAxW2A6N/1gXMUDgkOaAagnw7F2ogPp+bNkmPitdSccY1QpOXNvHOzIOBZ4lh0RyDcARyFGxsU73rdjMcHcZq6kDu7FhkIsJKkB0XnxPV808hx3ucz5Ic= ; Received: from unknown (HELO ?172.16.0.200?) (mikej@rogers.com@74.111.253.239 with plain) by smtp106.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2007 01:17:10 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: MzttJfoVM1nIjZWgmPuSCbWyzpyozQrwMRMshM3oSSTMYzKOMn_FM2cZZktD9ovVbQ-- Message-ID: <45B956AA.9000803@rogers.com> Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 20:17:30 -0500 From: Mike Jakubik User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG, Oles Hnatkevych References: <200701251424.l0PEOkGh016221@lurza.secnetix.de> In-Reply-To: <200701251424.l0PEOkGh016221@lurza.secnetix.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Subject: Re: gmirror existing installation? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 01:17:17 -0000 Oliver Fromme wrote: > Oles Hnatkevych wrote: > > There's a simple way of gmirroring existing installation. > > > > > sysctl kern.geom.debugflags=16 # allow writing to a live filesystem > > > gmirror label -v gm0 /dev/ad0 > > > # edit /etc/fstab, chane to /dev/mirror/gm0... slices > > > # add "geom_mirror_load=YES" to /boot/loader.conf > > > # reboot > > > gmirror insert gm0 /dev/ad1 > > I don't recommend to do it that way. It is better to first > create the mirror on the second (unused) disk, label and > newfs it, then copy the system from ad0 to gm0, then boot > from gm0 on the second disk and insert the first disk into > the mirror. > Exactly why is this better? It's certainly much more time consuming... From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Jan 26 05:59:34 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2EDDD16A404 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 05:59:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rick@kiwi-computer.com) Received: from kiwi-computer.com (keira.kiwi-computer.com [63.224.10.3]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id C53AB13C487 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 05:59:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rick@kiwi-computer.com) Received: (qmail 56625 invoked by uid 2001); 26 Jan 2007 05:59:30 -0000 Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 23:59:30 -0600 From: "Rick C. Petty" To: Fernan Aguero Message-ID: <20070126055929.GA56183@keira.kiwi-computer.com> References: <520894aa0701081445i43d76098m418ce695d2133e53@mail.gmail.com> <200701231830.l0NIURmC083278@lurza.secnetix.de> <20070123230800.GA98614@iib.unsam.edu.ar> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20070123230800.GA98614@iib.unsam.edu.ar> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i Cc: Oliver Fromme , freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: clear metadata using dd? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: rick-freebsd@kiwi-computer.com List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 05:59:34 -0000 On Tue, Jan 23, 2007 at 08:08:00PM -0300, Fernan Aguero wrote: > +----[ Oliver Fromme (23.Jan.2007 15:41): > | > | As far as I can tell, the purpose of gmirror is to provide > | redundancy in the case of drive failure. I.e. if one > | drive fails, the system keeps running happily instead of > | crashing. Exactly. I don't understand why anyone would use mirror if it didn't cover the whole disk. I *know* the other setups, I just don't "understand why". =) > well, I beg to differ, but with this setup I don't see why > the system will crash if one disk fails ... I did several > tests, removed one disk, and the system booted and worked > fine in degraded mode ... Obviously you've never had a disk go bad. FreeBSD doesn't handle hardware failures well (at all?). If a disk crashes while powered up and running (a highly likely time such a failure would happen), FreeBSD removes the disk device completely, no questions asked. It does this sometimes when the drive is working just fine too. If such a thing happens and you have a filesystem mounted using that disk, you're boned. Prepare to kiss data goodbye, because you probably weren't prepared to be running the kernel in debug mode. And why should you have to, on a production system? Removing the disk while the system is off, that's such a trivial test and certainly doesn't replicate what could happen in a really bad situation. Think: hundreds of Terabytes of disks, using mirrors, RAID cards, whatnot. If a disk "goes bad" (or FreeBSD pretends such), and part of the disk was *not* completely mirrored (or otherwise RAID'd) and had a filesystem mounted on it, kernel panic.. file server down for hours if not days. Thankfully, gmirror (at least) handles this case gracefully, provided the whole disk is mirrored. Those people who aren't full-disk-mirroring their "important data" are taking quite a gamble. They should talk to those of us who have seen lots of drives fail in otherwise perfectly-working systems. Or assume the drive can't fail, I mean because it's still under warranty so why would it fail? And assume that even a slight vibration won't wiggle a SATA cable free, because you've hot-glued it in place. > Of course I'm not putting essential stuff in the gstriped > device. Here's how my setup looks like: > > ad4s1b, ad6s1b => swap > ad4s2, ad6s2 => gmirror (/, /var, /tmp, /usr) (i.e. base OS) > ad4s3, ad6s3 => gstripe (/freebsd, /usr/obj, /distfiles, /scratch) You described the perfect scenario for a nifty kernel panic. Don't believe me? Put the system into an "idle state" (no planned I/O) and pull the data cable out of one of the drives... just for five seconds, then plug it back in. It should survive, right? Now let's just hope the drives always play fair... -- Rick C. Petty From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Jan 26 13:57:24 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E111316A400 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:57:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from arne_woerner@yahoo.com) Received: from web30303.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web30303.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.69.65]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 93B1013C46C for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:57:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from arne_woerner@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 16222 invoked by uid 60001); 26 Jan 2007 13:57:24 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:Cc:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=08mvGP5NyOd+VmpJ83aISRSikvGgTZ/rjZ41TapKK7/frI7jV0Ikq24OM+nnRDOd4CorqPbtyfBHw5QYsc+XEzYPflSzQeoMWvchqL1hWjWLS9bh2TvQ6wu/OULNdRQv88R12hbOdnN5pAu4OEJjMH/FPMaSlNvobrYkhYBttcI=; X-YMail-OSG: 7H4ArcMVM1mMtzN89htQS.f4E.jBftlqCmrMzPVbAC5JUOA8l9UBHtMrvAgkYpKn1bOjqL8oFHuROrOB35hy9A7bgLwpvC79aT2yhRH3GBKK.6Lzk38- Received: from [213.54.167.230] by web30303.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 05:57:23 PST Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 05:57:23 -0800 (PST) From: "R. B. Riddick" To: rick-freebsd@kiwi-computer.com, Fernan Aguero In-Reply-To: <20070126055929.GA56183@keira.kiwi-computer.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <915325.15953.qm@web30303.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Cc: Oliver Fromme , freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: clear metadata using dd? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:57:25 -0000 --- "Rick C. Petty" wrote: > Obviously you've never had a disk go bad. FreeBSD doesn't handle hardware > Obviously u never had a disk go bad, when put under gmirror. I tried that again today. At least with `atacontrol detach/attach` (plus write access with dd to the raw gmirror device; and I waited between attach and detach until the mirror was sync'ed again) I can still produce funny situations in R6.2: The device ad3s1b was still there and ad3 was not... This might be not the fault of gmirror, but it can well lead to a crash, too. In R6.1 it was possible to disable all access to the gmirror device with frequent disk failures simulated by gnop (the requests never returned, although just one disk was "damaged"). Does anyone here have SATA disks? I have heard it is easy to pull their plug and plug it back in... Any real test results here? -Arne ____________________________________________________________________________________ We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love (and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list. http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/265 From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Jan 26 17:12:08 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 097C816A408 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 17:12:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (lurza.secnetix.de [83.120.8.8]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6DC7213C483 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 17:12:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (nspslg@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0QHBvi3077002; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 18:12:03 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from oliver.fromme@secnetix.de) Received: (from olli@localhost) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.1/Submit) id l0QHBvOX077001; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 18:11:57 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from olli) Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 18:11:57 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <200701261711.l0QHBvOX077001@lurza.secnetix.de> From: Oliver Fromme To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG, don_oles@able.com.ua, mikej@rogers.com In-Reply-To: <45B956AA.9000803@rogers.com> X-Newsgroups: list.freebsd-geom User-Agent: tin/1.8.2-20060425 ("Shillay") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.11-STABLE (i386)) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.1.2 (lurza.secnetix.de [127.0.0.1]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 18:12:03 +0100 (CET) Cc: Subject: Re: gmirror existing installation? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG, don_oles@able.com.ua, mikej@rogers.com List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 17:12:08 -0000 Mike Jakubik wrote: > Oliver Fromme wrote: > > Oles Hnatkevych wrote: > > > There's a simple way of gmirroring existing installation. > > > > > > > sysctl kern.geom.debugflags=16 # allow writing to a live filesystem > > > > gmirror label -v gm0 /dev/ad0 > > > > # edit /etc/fstab, chane to /dev/mirror/gm0... slices > > > > # add "geom_mirror_load=YES" to /boot/loader.conf > > > > # reboot > > > > gmirror insert gm0 /dev/ad1 > > > > I don't recommend to do it that way. It is better to first > > create the mirror on the second (unused) disk, label and > > newfs it, then copy the system from ad0 to gm0, then boot > > from gm0 on the second disk and insert the first disk into > > the mirror. > > Exactly why is this better? Because you don't overwrite the last sector of a partition that contains an existing file system. Overwriting that sector might cause trouble depending on the layout of the file system. It's also a nice opportunity to change the layout (sizes) of your partitons if necessary. ;-) > It's certainly much more time consuming... Not really much more. It's true that you have to copy over your files, but the computer does all that work itself. You only have to type one command, then spend your time doing something else. You don't have to watch it during the copying. (You don't have to watch the mirror being synchronized either, which has to be done anyhow and takes much longer, probably.) YMMV, of course. Best regards Oliver -- Oliver Fromme, secnetix GmbH & Co. KG, Marktplatz 29, 85567 Grafing b. M. Handelsregister: Registergericht Muenchen, HRA 74606, USt-Id: DE204219783 Any opinions expressed in this message are personal to the author and may not necessarily reflect the opinions of secnetix GmbH & Co KG in any way. FreeBSD-Dienstleistungen, -Produkte und mehr: http://www.secnetix.de/bsd "IRIX is about as stable as a one-legged drunk with hypothermia in a four-hundred mile per hour wind, balancing on a banana peel on a greased cookie sheet -- when someone throws him an elephant with bad breath and a worse temper." -- Ralf Hildebrandt From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Jan 26 17:49:14 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 803C416A401 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 17:49:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from arne_woerner@yahoo.com) Received: from web30312.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web30312.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.69.74]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 3FD5513C483 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 17:49:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from arne_woerner@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 38389 invoked by uid 60001); 26 Jan 2007 17:49:13 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=Lp1oL7Z7jvaUxjJw5VHXB1DUNwB4BCxGPj/HwvNwyvXBiErOosTT4ThIkoHdWibb8uqdfN9sHwSXiTRdY+maeQ/4q2gcuOBr/EnXPzfRnT0PCbkCxfx/YvvjTXBbsdure6UnLO1RXEfwnQV1noRQINHs+Fm03rj99HZGK2gVJvk=; X-YMail-OSG: PPcLGEQVM1moHSXD0m8F2wMcPqXw4h0eucd1X5ZK80wyh2V9XrhSnh4gpFMyMNYdIA-- Received: from [213.54.12.90] by web30312.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:49:13 PST Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:49:13 -0800 (PST) From: "R. B. Riddick" To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <200701261711.l0QHBvOX077001@lurza.secnetix.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <308587.38343.qm@web30312.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: Re: gmirror existing installation? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 17:49:14 -0000 Oliver Fromme wrote: Mike Jakubik wrote: > > I don't recommend to do it that way. It is better to first > > Exactly why is this better? Because you don't overwrite the last sector of a partition that contains an existing file system. Overwriting that sector might cause trouble depending on the layout of the file system. I think, he planned to re-bsdlabel that partition, which is possible, since sysinstall often leaves some sectors unused, because it believes it knows disk geometry... Furthermore a UFS does not use the last sector, if(? and only(?) if(?) the size of the partition is an integer multiple of 4... bsdlabel requires no service interruption (un-mount or so), if u want to enlarge a partition... > It's certainly much more time consuming... Not really much more. It's true that you have to copy over your files, but the computer does all that work itself. You only have to type one command, then spend your time doing something else. You don't have to watch it during the copying. (You don't have to watch the mirror being synchronized either, which has to be done anyhow and takes much longer, probably.) The service interruption is higher, because copying the system should be done with a read-only root-fs... Both methods need a reboot in order to change the root fs... So the method proposed intially in this thread is only feasible under certain circumstances, and involves nearly zero down time (if and only if the quite high disk load is tolerated by the services). It is always better to design the system before it is installed... :-) -Arne --------------------------------- Finding fabulous fares is fun. Let Yahoo! FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find flight and hotel bargains. From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Jan 26 19:04:47 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CAAD16A407 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:04:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (lurza.secnetix.de [83.120.8.8]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EEA8013C484 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:04:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (vkbczg@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0QJ4dbF094402 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 20:04:45 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from oliver.fromme@secnetix.de) Received: (from olli@localhost) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.1/Submit) id l0QJ4dEJ094401; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 20:04:39 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from olli) Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 20:04:39 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <200701261904.l0QJ4dEJ094401@lurza.secnetix.de> From: Oliver Fromme To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <308587.38343.qm@web30312.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-Newsgroups: list.freebsd-geom User-Agent: tin/1.8.2-20060425 ("Shillay") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.11-STABLE (i386)) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.1.2 (lurza.secnetix.de [127.0.0.1]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 20:04:45 +0100 (CET) Cc: Subject: Re: gmirror existing installation? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:04:47 -0000 R. B. Riddick wrote: > Oliver Fromme wrote: > > Not really much more. It's true that you have to copy over > > your files, but the computer does all that work itself. > > You only have to type one command, then spend your time > > doing something else. You don't have to watch it during > > the copying. (You don't have to watch the mirror being > > synchronized either, which has to be done anyhow and takes > > much longer, probably.) > > The service interruption is higher, because copying the system should > be done with a read-only root-fs... That depends on your services. I have done that procedure several times without shuting down services. You can also copy over your stuff once while services are running, then stop the services (and remount red-only if you think it's necessary) and perform a final sync that will transfer only the files that have changed [*]. That will be pretty quick, and the downtime will be short. > Both methods need a reboot in order to change the root fs... That's true. At some point you'll have to switch your root FS to gm0 ... That's not avoidable. > It is always better to design the system before it is installed... :-) Very true. :-) Best regards Oliver [*] E.g. you can use cpdup for that purposes, from ports/sysutils/cpdup. It's fast and easy to use. -- Oliver Fromme, secnetix GmbH & Co. KG, Marktplatz 29, 85567 Grafing b. M. Handelsregister: Registergericht Muenchen, HRA 74606, USt-Id: DE204219783 Any opinions expressed in this message are personal to the author and may not necessarily reflect the opinions of secnetix GmbH & Co KG in any way. FreeBSD-Dienstleistungen, -Produkte und mehr: http://www.secnetix.de/bsd "And believe me, as a C++ programmer, I don't hesitate to question the decisions of language designers. After a decent amount of C++ exposure, Python's flaws seem ridiculously small." -- Ville Vainio From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Jan 26 19:14:15 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74DEC16A400 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:14:15 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rick@kiwi-computer.com) Received: from kiwi-computer.com (keira.kiwi-computer.com [63.224.10.3]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 0194013C48D for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:14:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rick@kiwi-computer.com) Received: (qmail 70730 invoked by uid 2001); 26 Jan 2007 19:14:14 -0000 Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:14:14 -0600 From: "Rick C. Petty" To: "R. B. Riddick" Message-ID: <20070126191413.GA70473@keira.kiwi-computer.com> References: <20070126055929.GA56183@keira.kiwi-computer.com> <915325.15953.qm@web30303.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <915325.15953.qm@web30303.mail.mud.yahoo.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i Cc: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: clear metadata using dd? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: rick-freebsd@kiwi-computer.com List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:14:15 -0000 On Fri, Jan 26, 2007 at 05:57:23AM -0800, R. B. Riddick wrote: > --- "Rick C. Petty" wrote: > > > Obviously u never had a disk go bad, when put under gmirror. I tried that again Actually I have, and it behaved somewhat well. I was pleasantly surprised. > today. At least with `atacontrol detach/attach` (plus write access with dd to > the raw gmirror device; and I waited between attach and detach until the mirror detach/attach isn't quite the same. > was sync'ed again) I can still produce funny situations in R6.2: The device > ad3s1b was still there and ad3 was not... That doesn't surprise me. There were quite a number of bugs in 6.1 & even still in 6.2. Unfortunately they are difficult to reproduce. > > Does anyone here have SATA disks? I have heard it is easy to pull their plug > and plug it back in... Any real test results here? Yes they sure are. I've had a number of "failures" due to disks dropping off just because their cables came out. In fact on one system, I had the case open and I hit the cable with my foot, the drive dropped, and not realizing this I continued using the system for a few weeks until I noticed that something was missing in systat. Gmirror held up pretty nicely. However, I'm not a big fan of the priority placed on the I/O to sync the disks. Pretty much during a resync, the box is unusable for file/disk I/O for a number of hours. Apps using GNOME/GTK are almost non-responsive, and forget about even using java/eclipse. I haven't found a good way to tune gmirror's sync. I also wish you could pause the sync, restart, and unpause it where it left off. All the GEOM tools are feature lacking, and there's not enough manpower. -- Rick C. Petty From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Jan 26 19:29:36 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 98A5216A404 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:29:36 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (lurza.secnetix.de [83.120.8.8]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10C0113C48D for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:29:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (xstoju@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0QJTTJE095507; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 20:29:34 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from oliver.fromme@secnetix.de) Received: (from olli@localhost) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.1/Submit) id l0QJTSYR095500; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 20:29:28 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from olli) Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 20:29:28 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <200701261929.l0QJTSYR095500@lurza.secnetix.de> From: Oliver Fromme To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG, rick-freebsd@kiwi-computer.com, fernan.aguero@gmail.com, arne_woerner@yahoo.com In-Reply-To: <915325.15953.qm@web30303.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-Newsgroups: list.freebsd-geom User-Agent: tin/1.8.2-20060425 ("Shillay") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.11-STABLE (i386)) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.1.2 (lurza.secnetix.de [127.0.0.1]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 20:29:35 +0100 (CET) Cc: Subject: Re: clear metadata using dd? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG, rick-freebsd@kiwi-computer.com, fernan.aguero@gmail.com, arne_woerner@yahoo.com List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:29:36 -0000 R. B. Riddick wrote: > Rick C. Petty wrote: > > Obviously you've never had a disk go bad. FreeBSD doesn't handle hardware > > Obviously u never had a disk go bad, when put under gmirror. I think he did. Because he's right: If a disk dies, the ata driver detaches it automatically, and gmirror removes the lost component and continues to run happily in degraded mode. No crash. Of course you should have the disks on separate cables. A dying disk sometimes does nasty things and wedges the whole channel, so you should put the disks on separate channels. You can even put them on separate controllers if you're really paranoid. Without gmirror, if a disk dies, there's a good chance that the system will panic or freeze. Especially when you have swap on that disk, like the OP seems to have. > [...] > Does anyone here have SATA disks? I have heard it is easy to pull > their plug and plug it back in... Any real test results here? Here's a real test with a real disk throwing a real error. :-) Jan 18 08:03:37 pluto kernel: ad1: TIMEOUT - WRITE_DMA48 retrying (1 retry left) LBA=312581807 Jan 18 08:03:52 pluto kernel: ad1: FAILURE - device detached Jan 18 08:03:52 pluto kernel: subdisk1: detached Jan 18 08:03:52 pluto kernel: ad1: detached Jan 18 08:03:52 pluto kernel: GEOM_MIRROR: Cannot write metadata on ad1 (device=gm0, error=6). Jan 18 08:03:52 pluto kernel: GEOM_MIRROR: Cannot update metadata on disk ad1 (error=6). Jan 18 08:03:52 pluto kernel: GEOM_MIRROR: Cannot update metadata on disk ad1 (error=6). Jan 18 08:03:52 pluto kernel: GEOM_MIRROR: Device gm0: provider ad1 disconnected. That's from a machine with two SATA drives (ad0 and ad1). After the incident, the system continued running without any problems. gm0 was in degraded mode, using ad0 only. When the problem was resolved, ad1 was inserted into the mirror again, resynced, and the box is still running without any downtime: Jan 19 12:51:41 pluto kernel: GEOM_MIRROR: Device gm0: provider ad1 detected. Jan 19 12:51:41 pluto kernel: GEOM_MIRROR: Device gm0: rebuilding provider ad1. Jan 19 13:45:32 pluto kernel: GEOM_MIRROR: Device gm0: rebuilding provider ad1 finished. Jan 19 13:45:32 pluto kernel: GEOM_MIRROR: Device gm0: provider ad1 activated. That machine is running RELENG_6, by the way. Best regards Oliver -- Oliver Fromme, secnetix GmbH & Co. KG, Marktplatz 29, 85567 Grafing b. M. Handelsregister: Registergericht Muenchen, HRA 74606, USt-Id: DE204219783 Any opinions expressed in this message are personal to the author and may not necessarily reflect the opinions of secnetix GmbH & Co KG in any way. FreeBSD-Dienstleistungen, -Produkte und mehr: http://www.secnetix.de/bsd "I learned Java 3 years before Python. It was my language of choice. It took me two weekends with Python before I was more productive with it than with Java." -- Anthony Roberts From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Jan 26 19:55:20 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E06016A400 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:55:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pjd@garage.freebsd.pl) Received: from mail.garage.freebsd.pl (arm132.internetdsl.tpnet.pl [83.17.198.132]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4E4013C489 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:55:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pjd@garage.freebsd.pl) Received: by mail.garage.freebsd.pl (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 797D7487F4; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 20:55:17 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost (154.81.datacomsa.pl [195.34.81.154]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.garage.freebsd.pl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2EBA245CD9; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 20:55:12 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 20:54:30 +0100 From: Pawel Jakub Dawidek To: "Rick C. Petty" Message-ID: <20070126195429.GA64218@garage.freebsd.pl> References: <20070126055929.GA56183@keira.kiwi-computer.com> <915325.15953.qm@web30303.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20070126191413.GA70473@keira.kiwi-computer.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="LQksG6bCIzRHxTLp" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20070126191413.GA70473@keira.kiwi-computer.com> X-PGP-Key-URL: http://people.freebsd.org/~pjd/pjd.asc X-OS: FreeBSD 7.0-CURRENT i386 User-Agent: mutt-ng/devel-r804 (FreeBSD) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.4 (2005-06-05) on mail.garage.freebsd.pl X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.0.4 Cc: "R. B. Riddick" , freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: clear metadata using dd? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:55:20 -0000 --LQksG6bCIzRHxTLp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Jan 26, 2007 at 01:14:14PM -0600, Rick C. Petty wrote: > On Fri, Jan 26, 2007 at 05:57:23AM -0800, R. B. Riddick wrote: > However, I'm not a big fan of the priority placed on the I/O to sync the > disks. Pretty much during a resync, the box is unusable for file/disk I/O > for a number of hours. Apps using GNOME/GTK are almost non-responsive, a= nd > forget about even using java/eclipse. I haven't found a good way to tune > gmirror's sync. [...] Have you tried setting kern.geom.mirror.sync_requests to 1? > [...] I also wish you could pause the sync, restart, and unpause > it where it left off. [...] It should just work. When you reboot during the sync process it should continue after the reboot from the place it stopped. --=20 Pawel Jakub Dawidek http://www.wheel.pl pjd@FreeBSD.org http://www.FreeBSD.org FreeBSD committer Am I Evil? Yes, I Am! --LQksG6bCIzRHxTLp Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFFulx1ForvXbEpPzQRApvYAJ4yMdtdIKz1ElkkmH9EMKKm2UqwuwCgzbpm 503I8wd/T2IwJ9ZjFBUOEiY= =GFQ0 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --LQksG6bCIzRHxTLp-- From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Jan 26 21:12:48 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55E3616A405 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 21:12:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rick@kiwi-computer.com) Received: from kiwi-computer.com (keira.kiwi-computer.com [63.224.10.3]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D59D013C48D for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 21:12:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rick@kiwi-computer.com) Received: (qmail 73073 invoked by uid 2001); 26 Jan 2007 21:12:46 -0000 Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:12:46 -0600 From: "Rick C. Petty" To: Pawel Jakub Dawidek Message-ID: <20070126211246.GA72967@keira.kiwi-computer.com> References: <20070126055929.GA56183@keira.kiwi-computer.com> <915325.15953.qm@web30303.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20070126191413.GA70473@keira.kiwi-computer.com> <20070126195429.GA64218@garage.freebsd.pl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20070126195429.GA64218@garage.freebsd.pl> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i Cc: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: clear metadata using dd? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: rick-freebsd@kiwi-computer.com List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 21:12:48 -0000 On Fri, Jan 26, 2007 at 08:54:30PM +0100, Pawel Jakub Dawidek wrote: > On Fri, Jan 26, 2007 at 01:14:14PM -0600, Rick C. Petty wrote: > > On Fri, Jan 26, 2007 at 05:57:23AM -0800, R. B. Riddick wrote: > > However, I'm not a big fan of the priority placed on the I/O to sync the > > disks. Pretty much during a resync, the box is unusable for file/disk I/O > > for a number of hours. Apps using GNOME/GTK are almost non-responsive, and > > forget about even using java/eclipse. I haven't found a good way to tune > > gmirror's sync. [...] > > Have you tried setting kern.geom.mirror.sync_requests to 1? I've fiddled with all of kern.geom.mirror.* knobs. I have no idea what these knobs do (although I've made educated guesses), and the man page is quite lacking. > > [...] I also wish you could pause the sync, restart, and unpause > > it where it left off. [...] > > It should just work. When you reboot during the sync process it should > continue after the reboot from the place it stopped. I have *never* seen this behavior, and I have restarted mid-sync a number of times. After each time, "gmirror status" reports 0% complete. I've tried this on 5.4, 5.5, 6.0, 6.1, but not 6.2 yet. -- Rick C. Petty From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Jan 26 23:54:58 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 807AA16A404 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 23:54:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pjd@garage.freebsd.pl) Received: from mail.garage.freebsd.pl (arm132.internetdsl.tpnet.pl [83.17.198.132]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18C1B13C484 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 23:54:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pjd@garage.freebsd.pl) Received: by mail.garage.freebsd.pl (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 225E2487F7; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 00:54:56 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost (154.81.datacomsa.pl [195.34.81.154]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.garage.freebsd.pl (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABED745685; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 00:54:51 +0100 (CET) Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 00:54:09 +0100 From: Pawel Jakub Dawidek To: "Rick C. Petty" Message-ID: <20070126235409.GB64218@garage.freebsd.pl> References: <20070126055929.GA56183@keira.kiwi-computer.com> <915325.15953.qm@web30303.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20070126191413.GA70473@keira.kiwi-computer.com> <20070126195429.GA64218@garage.freebsd.pl> <20070126211246.GA72967@keira.kiwi-computer.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="BwCQnh7xodEAoBMC" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20070126211246.GA72967@keira.kiwi-computer.com> X-PGP-Key-URL: http://people.freebsd.org/~pjd/pjd.asc X-OS: FreeBSD 7.0-CURRENT i386 User-Agent: mutt-ng/devel-r804 (FreeBSD) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.4 (2005-06-05) on mail.garage.freebsd.pl X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.0.4 Cc: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: clear metadata using dd? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 23:54:58 -0000 --BwCQnh7xodEAoBMC Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Jan 26, 2007 at 03:12:46PM -0600, Rick C. Petty wrote: > On Fri, Jan 26, 2007 at 08:54:30PM +0100, Pawel Jakub Dawidek wrote: > > On Fri, Jan 26, 2007 at 01:14:14PM -0600, Rick C. Petty wrote: > > > On Fri, Jan 26, 2007 at 05:57:23AM -0800, R. B. Riddick wrote: > > > However, I'm not a big fan of the priority placed on the I/O to sync = the > > > disks. Pretty much during a resync, the box is unusable for file/dis= k I/O > > > for a number of hours. Apps using GNOME/GTK are almost non-responsiv= e, and > > > forget about even using java/eclipse. I haven't found a good way to = tune > > > gmirror's sync. [...] > >=20 > > Have you tried setting kern.geom.mirror.sync_requests to 1? >=20 > I've fiddled with all of kern.geom.mirror.* knobs. I have no idea what > these knobs do (although I've made educated guesses), and the man page is > quite lacking. Maybe we should also introduce some delay between sync operation when there are other requests in the queue... > > > [...] I also wish you could pause the sync, restart, and unpause > > > it where it left off. [...] > >=20 > > It should just work. When you reboot during the sync process it should > > continue after the reboot from the place it stopped. >=20 > I have *never* seen this behavior, and I have restarted mid-sync a number > of times. After each time, "gmirror status" reports 0% complete. I've > tried this on 5.4, 5.5, 6.0, 6.1, but not 6.2 yet. Works just fine here: # gmirror label foo ad4d # gmirror insert foo ad6d # gmirror status Name Status Components mirror/foo DEGRADED ad4d ad6d (10%) # reboot # gmirror load # gmirror status Name Status Components mirror/foo DEGRADED ad4d ad6d (11%) --=20 Pawel Jakub Dawidek http://www.wheel.pl pjd@FreeBSD.org http://www.FreeBSD.org FreeBSD committer Am I Evil? Yes, I Am! --BwCQnh7xodEAoBMC Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFFupShForvXbEpPzQRAjVjAKDB40K9SEx1WS7EvDGShE5YiLSc/wCeMmA9 D33wOKaMX6cENI8eKZkckGQ= =RMNR -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --BwCQnh7xodEAoBMC-- From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Jan 27 17:08:35 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B88416A401 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 17:08:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from chris.branch@gmx.de) Received: from mail.gmx.net (mail.gmx.net [213.165.64.20]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 6F43913C4AC for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 17:08:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from chris.branch@gmx.de) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 27 Jan 2007 16:41:52 -0000 Received: from ip-115.net-81-220-245.rev.numericable.fr (EHLO [192.168.0.4]) [81.220.245.115] by mail.gmx.net (mp050) with SMTP; 27 Jan 2007 17:41:52 +0100 X-Authenticated: #24323161 Message-ID: <45BB80C8.1090406@gmx.de> Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 17:41:44 +0100 From: Christophe Branchereau User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Subject: Two questions about gconcat X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 17:08:35 -0000 Hello list, I have a very simple question. I installed freebsd on an xSeries 330 with two 73Go scsi disks. I partitionned largely for the system on one disk, and concated the rest with the second disk. That gives me a 125Go /usr/home. First question is, the system is very slow to start. From what I can see on the console, it first stops for a while after an "2nd cpu launched !" message (I know, that doesn't belong to this list) and it halts again for a while launching gconcat, the floppy drive making weird noises. Hmmm, I didn't concat my floppy drive... any thoughts ? Second question is, if one of the two disks fails, will I be able to retreive what is on the other disk ? I mean, is there still a "normal" UFS system on it that I will be able to mount or would be everything lost ? I would then rather mount the second disk in /usr/home/compaq or something... Christophe From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Jan 27 17:21:55 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDCCC16A488 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 17:21:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from arne_woerner@yahoo.com) Received: from web30309.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web30309.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.69.71]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 9F1D013C46B for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 17:21:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from arne_woerner@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 10857 invoked by uid 60001); 27 Jan 2007 17:21:55 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=NpZEeIkt1WU873n3sq1C9U6+CG1uuuc35tvIgKP8MatlZDtIuMQow3YBfAlx0ETRhWMtT09R9iXLsmd9Z24RgYOkoqyo+gXK/6f6vA9QAa674HqUB6d4M+YALb5UBBAQgh4Ia29ZtjeUujPxj1ZArVBIDHfiQYfV8OOibFNNgdQ=; X-YMail-OSG: Ifg24sUVM1mT8tlMVoQUysV_g47Y7f6aPhfXe4G7wYsNGTQjgvGhQTfN0abseDdlhPyAOuXlslb_vFT3X5XfsX9dTNWTlNtip.pNnbytiAvqizsUl9CRzRJyuNr62_BjmaLCq3aNp8Tgx00- Received: from [213.54.8.47] by web30309.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 09:21:54 PST Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 09:21:54 -0800 (PST) From: "R. B. Riddick" To: Christophe Branchereau , freebsd-geom@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <45BB80C8.1090406@gmx.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <29476.3747.qm@web30309.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Cc: Subject: Re: Two questions about gconcat X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 17:21:56 -0000 --- Christophe Branchereau wrote: > First question is, the system is very slow to start. From what I can see > on the console, it first stops for a while after an "2nd cpu launched !" > message (I know, that doesn't belong to this list) and it halts again > for a while launching gconcat, the floppy drive making weird noises. > Hmmm, I didn't concat my floppy drive... any thoughts ? > I built a customized kernel without floppy disk driver, so that the floppy disk drive is not checked by GEOM for any meta data... > Second question is, if one of the two disks fails, will I be able to > retreive what is on the other disk ? I mean, is there still a "normal" > UFS system on it that I will be able to mount or would be everything > lost ? I would then rather mount the second disk in /usr/home/compaq or > something... > Most likely not, because UFS likes to spread big files over its whole area, so that at least party of ur big files will be gone... -Arne ____________________________________________________________________________________ Need Mail bonding? Go to the Yahoo! Mail Q&A for great tips from Yahoo! Answers users. http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396546091 From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Jan 27 22:45:34 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1142416A402 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 22:45:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from c.brocker@logic-q.nl) Received: from amsfep20-int.chello.nl (amsfep20-int.chello.nl [62.179.120.15]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67F0813C48E for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 22:45:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from c.brocker@logic-q.nl) Received: from mail.logic-q.nl ([89.98.181.67]) by amsfep16-int.chello.nl (InterMail vM.6.01.04.04 201-2131-118-104-20050224) with ESMTP id <20070127222842.PJBO11735.amsfep16-int.chello.nl@mail.logic-q.nl> for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:28:42 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost.logic-q.nl [127.0.0.1]) by mail.logic-q.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B01C116DC for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:44:00 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at logic-q.nl Received: from mail.logic-q.nl ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.logic-q.nl [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7TZUW7od0Yuw for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:43:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from kotsbak (kotsbak [192.168.0.149]) by mail.logic-q.nl (Postfix) with SMTP id E74EB11651 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:43:59 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Coen_Br=F6cker?= To: Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:44:03 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal Subject: How do I gmirror slices? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 22:45:34 -0000 Currently ad4 contains 3 partitions: ad4s1 swap, / and /var ad4s2 /usr ad4s3 /home I wan't to mirror ad4s1 and ad4s2. I want to stripe ad4s3. Below is my current slice setup. Offset Size(ST) End Name PType Desc Subtype Flags 0 63 62 - 12 unused 0 63 12578832 12578894 ad4s1 8 freebsd 165 12578895 147814065 160392959 ad4s2 8 freebsd 165 160392960 425706435 586099394 ad4s3 8 freebsd 165 586099395 15309 586114703 - 12 unused 0 Before I continue setting up the mirror I want to make sure I've setup my slices correctly. Reading the gmirror man page it states that the gmirror utility uses on-disk metadata (stored in the provider's last sector) to store all needed information. Since I'm no expert in understanding disk structures I'm not sure what the above means. In my case I think I should create the folowing slice setup: my last partition on ad4s1 must end at 12578893 instead of 12578894. The next partition should begin at 12578895 and end at 160392958 creating the space to store metadata. Can someone please confirm? From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Jan 27 23:02:10 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFFA116A400 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:02:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mythtv@logic-q.nl) Received: from amsfep16-int.chello.nl (amsfep16-int.chello.nl [62.179.120.11]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 29D9813C487 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:02:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mythtv@logic-q.nl) Received: from mail.logic-q.nl ([89.98.181.67]) by amsfep15-int.chello.nl (InterMail vM.6.01.04.04 201-2131-118-104-20050224) with ESMTP id <20070127222841.BDHR1787.amsfep15-int.chello.nl@mail.logic-q.nl> for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:28:41 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost.logic-q.nl [127.0.0.1]) by mail.logic-q.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 164701172B for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:54:08 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at logic-q.nl Received: from mail.logic-q.nl ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.logic-q.nl [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id X5QHROZ+0IYb for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:54:07 +0100 (CET) Received: from kotsbak (kotsbak [192.168.0.149]) by mail.logic-q.nl (Postfix) with SMTP id AAF5611651 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:54:07 +0100 (CET) From: "No Mail" To: Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:54:11 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal Subject: How do I gmirror slices? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:02:11 -0000 Currently ad4 contains 3 partitions: ad4s1 swap, / and /var ad4s2 /usr ad4s3 /home I wan't to mirror ad4s1 and ad4s2. I want to stripe ad4s3. Below is my current slice setup. Offset Size(ST) End Name PType Desc Subtype Flags 0 63 62 - 12 unused 0 63 12578832 12578894 ad4s1 8 freebsd 165 12578895 147814065 160392959 ad4s2 8 freebsd 165 160392960 425706435 586099394 ad4s3 8 freebsd 165 586099395 15309 586114703 - 12 unused 0 Before I continue setting up the mirror I want to make sure I've setup my slices correctly. Reading the gmirror man page it states that the gmirror utility uses on-disk metadata (stored in the provider's last sector) to store all needed information. Since I'm no expert in understanding disk structures I'm not sure what the above means. In my case I think I should create the folowing slice setup: my last partition on ad4s1 must end at 12578893 instead of 12578894. The next partition should begin at 12578895 and end at 160392958 creating the space to store metadata. Can someone please confirm? From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Jan 27 23:03:43 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C58F116A405 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:03:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mythtv@logic-q.nl) Received: from amsfep17-int.chello.nl (amsfep17-int.chello.nl [62.179.120.12]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 115EC13C487 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:03:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mythtv@logic-q.nl) Received: from mail.logic-q.nl ([89.98.181.67]) by amsfep11-int.chello.nl (InterMail vM.6.01.04.04 201-2131-118-104-20050224) with ESMTP id <20070127224521.MSLI1100.amsfep11-int.chello.nl@mail.logic-q.nl> for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:45:21 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost.logic-q.nl [127.0.0.1]) by mail.logic-q.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB126116DE for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 22:52:22 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at logic-q.nl Received: from mail.logic-q.nl ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.logic-q.nl [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0IGgFvu7OfCO for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 22:52:22 +0100 (CET) Received: from kotsbak (kotsbak [192.168.0.149]) by mail.logic-q.nl (Postfix) with SMTP id 63DEC11651 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 22:52:22 +0100 (CET) From: "Hansa" To: "freebsd geom" Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 22:52:28 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal Cc: Subject: How do I gmirror slices? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:03:43 -0000 Currently ad4 contains 3 partitions: ad4s1 swap, / and /var ad4s2 /usr ad4s3 /home I wan't to mirror ad4s1 and ad4s2. I want to stripe ad4s3. Below is my current slice setup. Offset Size(ST) End Name PType Desc Subtype Flags 0 63 62 - 12 unused 0 63 12578832 12578894 ad4s1 8 freebsd 165 12578895 147814065 160392959 ad4s2 8 freebsd 165 160392960 425706435 586099394 ad4s3 8 freebsd 165 586099395 15309 586114703 - 12 unused 0 Before I continue setting up the mirror I want to make sure I've setup my slices correctly. Reading the gmirror man page it states that the gmirror utility uses on-disk metadata (stored in the provider's last sector) to store all needed information. Since I'm no expert in understanding disk structures I'm not sure what the above means. In my case I think I should create the folowing slice setup: my last partition on ad4s1 must end at 12578893 instead of 12578894. The next partition should begin at 12578895 and end at 160392958 creating the space to store metadata. Can someone please confirm? From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Jan 27 23:03:45 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B71116A401 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:03:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mythtv@logic-q.nl) Received: from amsfep17-int.chello.nl (amsfep17-int.chello.nl [62.179.120.12]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D8F213C48A for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:03:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mythtv@logic-q.nl) Received: from mail.logic-q.nl ([89.98.181.67]) by amsfep14-int.chello.nl (InterMail vM.6.01.04.04 201-2131-118-104-20050224) with ESMTP id <20070127223052.HATZ664.amsfep14-int.chello.nl@mail.logic-q.nl> for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:30:52 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost.logic-q.nl [127.0.0.1]) by mail.logic-q.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2347B115C5 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:30:52 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at logic-q.nl Received: from mail.logic-q.nl ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.logic-q.nl [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id X5ebWZMXG4gE for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:30:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from kotsbak (kotsbak [192.168.0.149]) by mail.logic-q.nl (Postfix) with SMTP id B3408114A6 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:30:51 +0100 (CET) From: "Hansa" To: "freebsd geom" Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:30:58 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal Cc: Subject: How to gmirror slices? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:03:45 -0000 Currently ad4 contains 3 slices: ad4s1 swap, / and /var ad4s2 /usr ad4s3 /home I wan't to mirror ad4s1 and ad4s2. I want to stripe ad4s3. Below is my current slice setup. Offset Size(ST) End Name PType Desc Subtype Flags 0 63 62 - 12 unused 0 63 12578832 12578894 ad4s1 8 freebsd 165 12578895 147814065 160392959 ad4s2 8 freebsd 165 160392960 425706435 586099394 ad4s3 8 freebsd 165 586099395 15309 586114703 - 12 unused 0 Before I continue setting up the mirror I want to make sure I've setup my slices correctly. Reading the gmirror man page it states that the gmirror utility uses on-disk metadata (stored in the provider's last sector) to store all needed information. Since I'm no expert in understanding disk structures I'm not sure what the above means. In my case I think I should create the folowing slice setup: ad4s1 must end at 12578893 instead of 12578894. The next slice should begin at 12578895 and end at 160392958 creating the space to store metadata. Can someone please confirm? From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Jan 27 23:03:46 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68FE316A402 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:03:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mythtv@logic-q.nl) Received: from amsfep17-int.chello.nl (amsfep17-int.chello.nl [62.179.120.12]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB7CD13C48D for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:03:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mythtv@logic-q.nl) Received: from mail.logic-q.nl ([89.98.181.67]) by amsfep15-int.chello.nl (InterMail vM.6.01.04.04 201-2131-118-104-20050224) with ESMTP id <20070127224521.BTXC1787.amsfep15-int.chello.nl@mail.logic-q.nl> for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:45:21 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost.logic-q.nl [127.0.0.1]) by mail.logic-q.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F6EE1171B for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:19:29 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at logic-q.nl Received: from mail.logic-q.nl ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.logic-q.nl [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PLtdJAmqO2IK for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:19:28 +0100 (CET) Received: from kotsbak (kotsbak [192.168.0.149]) by mail.logic-q.nl (Postfix) with SMTP id A5499116E3 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:19:28 +0100 (CET) From: "Hansa" To: "freebsd geom" Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:19:35 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal Cc: Subject: gmirror slices? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:03:46 -0000 Currently ad4 contains 3 slices: ad4s1 swap, / and /var ad4s2 /usr ad4s3 /home I wan't to mirror ad4s1 and ad4s2. I want to stripe ad4s3. Below is my current slice setup. Offset Size(ST) End Name PType Desc Subtype Flags 0 63 62 - 12 unused 0 63 12578832 12578894 ad4s1 8 freebsd 165 12578895 147814065 160392959 ad4s2 8 freebsd 165 160392960 425706435 586099394 ad4s3 8 freebsd 165 586099395 15309 586114703 - 12 unused 0 Before I continue setting up the mirror I want to make sure I've setup my slices correctly. Reading the gmirror man page it states that the gmirror utility uses on-disk metadata (stored in the provider's last sector) to store all needed information. Since I'm no expert in understanding disk structures I'm not sure what the above means. In my case I think I should create the folowing slice setup: ad4s1 must end at 12578893 instead of 12578894. The next slice should begin at 12578895 and end at 160392958 creating the space to store metadata. Can someone please confirm? From owner-freebsd-geom@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Jan 27 23:09:31 2007 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8704116A400 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:09:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from arne_woerner@yahoo.com) Received: from web30305.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web30305.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.69.67]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 50DB113C481 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:09:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from arne_woerner@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 96839 invoked by uid 60001); 27 Jan 2007 23:09:30 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=ehAW+bgRyZysasnaEWMRurFeovf9ED1xndeYq+BeY0rPmfexjZNpzepr0q4IXNkSmbty2p45yW7EBqjJOcr7xAaRY5b+fGGYBX4acDJvunm2AJSQCTiqXXbA7SYmYDwynlDQHnjTjkmWQxQKzDX32Tq1YitXcC8Miwty7bGG5Wk= ; Message-ID: <20070127230930.96837.qmail@web30305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-YMail-OSG: TB9b1XgVM1mGYroWi80BYXf65FNJrOwoV.dyqACvZBdqIPMd74LVUnS1dfgCpZZbpCD9D6uvpobbjBdXnB2MIMe7OB9p6J.JhLjnr6GjD4ECuwZafIRWHs_YvsS7db.g2c4Djn7CJE3bEmw- Received: from [213.54.8.47] by web30305.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 15:09:30 PST Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 15:09:30 -0800 (PST) From: "R. B. Riddick" To: Coen "Bröcker" , freebsd-geom@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: Subject: Re: How do I gmirror slices? X-BeenThere: freebsd-geom@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: GEOM-specific discussions and implementations List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:09:31 -0000 --- Coen Bröcker wrote: > Currently ad4 contains 3 partitions: > ad4s1 swap, / and /var > ad4s2 /usr > ad4s3 /home > I wan't to mirror ad4s1 and ad4s2. I want to stripe ad4s3. Below is my > current slice setup. > So u have another disk? Or do u want to mirror ad4s1 to ad4s2? That would be not so wise (performance, safety)... > Offset Size(ST) End Name PType Desc Subtype > Flags > > 0 63 62 - 12 unused 0 > 63 12578832 12578894 ad4s1 8 freebsd 165 > 12578895 147814065 160392959 ad4s2 8 freebsd 165 > 160392960 425706435 586099394 ad4s3 8 freebsd 165 > 586099395 15309 586114703 - 12 unused 0 > > Before I continue setting up the mirror I want to make sure I've setup my > slices correctly. > Reading the gmirror man page it states that the gmirror utility uses on-disk > metadata (stored in the provider's last sector) to store all needed > information. > Since I'm no expert in understanding disk structures I'm not sure what the > above means. > gmirror/gstripe use the last sector of its consumers for meta data, and provide a device that is one sector shorter than the smalles consumer. E. g.: gmirror(name=X, consumers=(ad99s1(size=1GB), ad77(size=2GB)), size=1GB-512B) > In my case I think I should create the folowing slice setup: > my last partition on ad4s1 must end at 12578893 instead of 12578894. The > next partition should begin at 12578895 and end at 160392958 creating the > space to store metadata. > The problem with an existing installation is, that it is possible that the last sector of ad4s1 and ad4s2 and ad4s3 is used by a file system. So we need to know the bsdlabel of ad4s1 and ad4s2 and ad4s3 in order to give useful advice. I just wonder why u want to stripe (without any safety) the home fs, which contains most likely quite important and difficult to restore data, while u want to mirror (with disk failure protection) the root-fs (/), although u can just put a CD into ur box and restore it... R u sure, that u dont want to mirror ur home fs, too (or graid3 (e. g. 2disks (data) +1disk (parity)) or so)? -Arne ____________________________________________________________________________________ Never miss an email again! Yahoo! Toolbar alerts you the instant new Mail arrives. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/