From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sun Nov 19 10:34:33 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08D21DF1626 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 2017 10:34:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from andre@fbsd.e4m.org) Received: from mail.g66.org (mail.g66.org [85.10.206.112]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9076B73397 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 2017 10:34:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from andre@fbsd.e4m.org) Received: from x55b535d2.dyn.telefonica.de (x55b535d2.dyn.telefonica.de [85.181.53.210]) (authenticated bits=128) by mail.g66.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPA id vAJAWfCx073117 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 2017 11:32:42 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from andre@fbsd.e4m.org) Received: from stationary.client ([192.168.128.2]) by gate.local (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id vAJAWfTu003358; Sun, 19 Nov 2017 11:32:41 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from andre@fbsd.e4m.org) Received: from submit.client ([127.0.0.1]) by voyager.local (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id vAJAWfbN025399; Sun, 19 Nov 2017 11:32:41 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from andre@fbsd.e4m.org) Received: (from user@localhost) by voyager.local (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id vAJAWf9S025398; Sun, 19 Nov 2017 11:32:41 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from andre@fbsd.e4m.org) Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2017 11:32:41 +0100 From: Andre Albsmeier To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: andre@fbsd.e4m.org Subject: gmirror synchronising is very slow due to frequent metadata updates Message-ID: <20171119103241.GA20588@voyager> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.7.2 (2016-11-26) X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.99.2 at colo X-Virus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2017 10:34:33 -0000 I am running a 2 TB gmirror with two disks. I replaced one disk and the mirror started to synchronise. I noticed that the sync rate was about 50 MB/s which is a lot lower than the more than 120 MB/s which are possible with this hardware. The reason for this are the very frequently happening metadata updates done in sys/geom/mirror/g_mirror.c: if (sync->ds_offset_done + (MAXPHYS * 100) < offset) { /* Update offset_done on every 100 blocks. */ sync->ds_offset_done = offset; g_mirror_update_metadata(disk); With MAXPHYS being 128kB this would mean that metadata is updated every 12 MB -- or 4 times a second @ 50 MB/s. Out of curiosity I changed this to MAXPHYS * 2000 which means that the updating is done every 240 MB. Now the disks are synchronising with approx. 105 MB/s... Is there any reason why these metadata updates are done so often and what are the risks having them more infrequently (as I do now)? -Andre From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Nov 20 02:38:27 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D166DDE434 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 2017 02:38:27 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markjdb@gmail.com) Received: from mail-pg0-x230.google.com (mail-pg0-x230.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c05::230]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2C0006C7C2 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 2017 02:38:27 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markjdb@gmail.com) Received: by mail-pg0-x230.google.com with SMTP id 70so6178648pgf.6 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 2017 18:38:27 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=sender:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:references:mime-version :content-disposition:in-reply-to:user-agent; bh=PtQwXmz7BFM1ZNyZb9oikPRn6SnUuujkla1dML1t4+I=; b=gWnrtpNMoVgjDsP1E+87aiKA0wZL2RSVhXYibprIlVqjDHp/fWZUcbMlwRV2hla67m rpL5p0gOkhRKMAqJcD8Dxsj0O1/XEGFv5EDoEK26NMXM9D0deUzCCUHaWPAdNMuqtk/F I2v2Z9hwse3zd7znMCPnJV1w1Qmw7e6OLXY/r2H6uA2NKQBYHLw/9BDojVZejVy9ONP4 86eMK8np9DpNtaQkM8oG8XLPi/l2O1fDHag5sjoCWJBlzDDkIqQBKsVneKz3vLWOB6OJ Cc/Fo0hA80DebxZMxz1SNxbhaLEnUkVDTSmPB5pDI8v7cpfEWhZdIrpVCtIWIAxyxNjF /HkA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id :references:mime-version:content-disposition:in-reply-to:user-agent; bh=PtQwXmz7BFM1ZNyZb9oikPRn6SnUuujkla1dML1t4+I=; b=Padm8uK0hxCV9qUKh4aXNQp/Ff+DfU1MYkNvNzqWsBkHH3rOJni0UR11GErQ9xrnsj ZWDhtfWtksd4K1Ytx5sL/ozlPCTfcNh9vIxgxXtl2/upA5aj7LwBRz3NaHZOVPgTYHi4 U4QLhlO/vN91/77eKsX8G5RJT1ZySzKlnQJ5EW9Q919RdYeIivpC21E+2uIO187AGzDy TvrnnKUNQKUG1lcysqPmm0tl++9KgFLPUjXa3xJZfujz8hxL0EreUIEx21thGBIMquN2 eiGb+i8CHcundMotNsyHaj7x4zLil1vsPxxRmX0mNjf5Mwr5ZE3Jz+duAW+3NkTwkrMC zlDA== X-Gm-Message-State: AJaThX6DjgqZXKtg8ti15py/PgR12scPGgMCBTUXKuqh1IJ1JjL+upH2 T1OFAW+MvcD0zJ6uUznoyBkRlg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGs4zMaeLYQn4i/RMeMC8xT7yvDGjuuVcfFjujDJ1dzHjf010e0AFpWYme0KOAigVEhaEOC8PE+eeg== X-Received: by 10.101.90.193 with SMTP id d1mr11980280pgt.423.1511145506532; Sun, 19 Nov 2017 18:38:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from bish ([204.239.253.216]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id k12sm14546077pgo.5.2017.11.19.18.38.24 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 19 Nov 2017 18:38:25 -0800 (PST) Sender: Mark Johnston Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2017 22:38:28 -0500 From: Mark Johnston To: Andre Albsmeier Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: gmirror synchronising is very slow due to frequent metadata updates Message-ID: <20171120033828.GA1959@bish> References: <20171119103241.GA20588@voyager> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20171119103241.GA20588@voyager> User-Agent: Mutt/1.8.3 (2017-05-23) X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2017 02:38:27 -0000 On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 11:32:41AM +0100, Andre Albsmeier wrote: > I am running a 2 TB gmirror with two disks. I replaced one disk and the > mirror started to synchronise. I noticed that the sync rate was about > 50 MB/s which is a lot lower than the more than 120 MB/s which are > possible with this hardware. > > The reason for this are the very frequently happening metadata updates > done in sys/geom/mirror/g_mirror.c: > > if (sync->ds_offset_done + (MAXPHYS * 100) < offset) { > /* Update offset_done on every 100 blocks. */ > sync->ds_offset_done = offset; > g_mirror_update_metadata(disk); > > With MAXPHYS being 128kB this would mean that metadata is updated every > 12 MB -- or 4 times a second @ 50 MB/s. > > Out of curiosity I changed this to MAXPHYS * 2000 which means that the > updating is done every 240 MB. Now the disks are synchronising with > approx. 105 MB/s... > > Is there any reason why these metadata updates are done so often and > what are the risks having them more infrequently (as I do now)? I believe that the metadata updates are done only so that it's possible to resume a synchronization after a crash. In particular, ds_offset_done is translated into the sync_offset field in the metadata block of a synchronizing disk. Therefore, there is no real risk in making the updates less frequent; it'll just take marginally more time to complete an interrupted rebuild of a mirror (which would hopefully be a rare event anyway). We should probably decrease the update interval based on the size of a mirror. For mirrors larger than say, 1GB, we might just update the metadata block once per 1% of the synchronization operation's progress. From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Nov 20 05:34:12 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD032DE22AF for ; Mon, 20 Nov 2017 05:34:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from andre@fbsd.e4m.org) Received: from mail.g66.org (mail.g66.org [85.10.206.112]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62CCA71690; Mon, 20 Nov 2017 05:34:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from andre@fbsd.e4m.org) Received: from x4e35ecc2.dyn.telefonica.de (x4e35ecc2.dyn.telefonica.de [78.53.236.194]) (authenticated bits=128) by mail.g66.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPA id vAK5YAQM013383; Mon, 20 Nov 2017 06:34:10 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from andre@fbsd.e4m.org) Received: from submit.client ([127.0.0.1]) by gate.local (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id vAK5Y9Ps000616; Mon, 20 Nov 2017 06:34:10 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from andre@fbsd.e4m.org) Received: (from user@localhost) by gate.local (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id vAK5Y9xv000614; Mon, 20 Nov 2017 06:34:09 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from andre@fbsd.e4m.org) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2017 06:34:09 +0100 From: Andre Albsmeier To: Mark Johnston Cc: Andre Albsmeier , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: gmirror synchronising is very slow due to frequent metadata updates Message-ID: <20171120053409.GA57536@gate> References: <20171119103241.GA20588@voyager> <20171120033828.GA1959@bish> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20171120033828.GA1959@bish> User-Agent: Mutt/1.7.2 (2016-11-26) X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.99.2 at colo X-Virus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2017 05:34:13 -0000 On Sun, 19-Nov-2017 at 22:38:28 -0500, Mark Johnston wrote: > On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 11:32:41AM +0100, Andre Albsmeier wrote: > > I am running a 2 TB gmirror with two disks. I replaced one disk and the > > mirror started to synchronise. I noticed that the sync rate was about > > 50 MB/s which is a lot lower than the more than 120 MB/s which are > > possible with this hardware. > > > > The reason for this are the very frequently happening metadata updates > > done in sys/geom/mirror/g_mirror.c: > > > > if (sync->ds_offset_done + (MAXPHYS * 100) < offset) { > > /* Update offset_done on every 100 blocks. */ > > sync->ds_offset_done = offset; > > g_mirror_update_metadata(disk); > > > > With MAXPHYS being 128kB this would mean that metadata is updated every > > 12 MB -- or 4 times a second @ 50 MB/s. > > > > Out of curiosity I changed this to MAXPHYS * 2000 which means that the > > updating is done every 240 MB. Now the disks are synchronising with > > approx. 105 MB/s... > > > > Is there any reason why these metadata updates are done so often and > > what are the risks having them more infrequently (as I do now)? > > I believe that the metadata updates are done only so that it's possible > to resume a synchronization after a crash. In particular, ds_offset_done That's what I thought I had figured out as well when looking at the code. > is translated into the sync_offset field in the metadata block of a > synchronizing disk. Therefore, there is no real risk in making the > updates less frequent; it'll just take marginally more time to complete > an interrupted rebuild of a mirror (which would hopefully be a rare > event anyway). > > We should probably decrease the update interval based on the size of a > mirror. For mirrors larger than say, 1GB, we might just update the > metadata block once per 1% of the synchronization operation's progress. I think best would be to have it updated every seconds. I think of very fast or very slow drives, or drives which are used heavily during rebuild (where the effective rebuild speed is quite low)... From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Nov 20 09:22:17 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 44DD3DE63C0 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 2017 09:22:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markmi@dsl-only.net) Received: from asp.reflexion.net (outbound-mail-210-151.reflexion.net [208.70.210.151]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0A95676BED for ; Mon, 20 Nov 2017 09:22:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markmi@dsl-only.net) Received: (qmail 12364 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2017 09:15:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rtc-sm-01.app.dca.reflexion.local) (10.81.150.1) by 0 (rfx-qmail) with SMTP; 20 Nov 2017 09:15:30 -0000 Received: by rtc-sm-01.app.dca.reflexion.local (Reflexion email security v8.40.3) with SMTP; Mon, 20 Nov 2017 04:15:30 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 17707 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2017 09:15:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO iron2.pdx.net) (69.64.224.71) by 0 (rfx-qmail) with (AES256-SHA encrypted) SMTP; 20 Nov 2017 09:15:30 -0000 Received: from [192.168.1.25] (c-76-115-7-162.hsd1.or.comcast.net [76.115.7.162]) by iron2.pdx.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 04B11EC8F85; Mon, 20 Nov 2017 01:15:29 -0800 (PST) From: Mark Millard Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\)) Subject: Re: head -r325997: Fatal trap 12: page fault while in kernel mode (during a buildworld, virtualbox guest context) [2nd example] Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2017 01:15:29 -0800 References: <2A312919-EF66-4FC3-85E4-A796315DB978@dsl-only.net> <3C5C0D1B-4990-426A-B622-6EC4CC6A1F3F@dsl-only.net> To: FreeBSD Current , freebsd-amd64@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers In-Reply-To: <3C5C0D1B-4990-426A-B622-6EC4CC6A1F3F@dsl-only.net> Message-Id: <2E7497BD-06C6-4C86-AA83-1150C735315B@dsl-only.net> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273) X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2017 09:22:17 -0000 [Adding some analysis of where the 2 failures were in source code terms.] On 2017-Nov-19, at 9:07 PM, Mark Millard wrote: > [I got another of these. By the way: amd64 context. > Again: buildworld was running.] >=20 > On 2017-Nov-19, at 5:52 PM, Mark Millard = wrote: >=20 >> Attempting a dump failed. I'm afraid all for >> information is the below. The kernel was a >> non-debug kernel (with debug information). >>=20 >> The following is hand typed from a screen shot: >>=20 >> Fatal trap 12: page fault while in kernel mode >> cpuid =3D 0; apic id =3D 00 >> fault virtual address =3D 0xffffff53f000e2b0 >=20 > New one: 0x806b49010 >=20 >> fault code =3D supervisor read data, page not present >=20 > New one: supervisor write data, page not present >=20 >> instruction pointer =3D 0x20:0xffffffff80f2b11e >=20 > New one: 0x20:0xffffffff80f2b21b >=20 >> stack pointer =3D 0x0:0xfffffe01aeb28970 >=20 > New one: 0x28:0xfffffe01aeb28970 >=20 >> frame pointer =3D 0x0:0xfffffe01aeb289f0 >=20 > New one: 0x28:0xfffffe01aeb289f0 >=20 >> code segment =3D base 0x0, limit 0xfffff, type 0x1b >> =3D DPL 0, pres 1, long 1, def32 0, gran 1 >> processor eflags =3D interrupt enabled, resume, IOPL =3D 0 >> current process =3D 20 (pagedaemon) >> [ thread pid 20 tid 100089 ] >> Stopped at pmap_ts_referenced+0x72e: movq (%rcx,rdi,8),%rbx >=20 > New one: pmap_ts_referenced+0x82b: movq %rcx,0x10(%rax) >=20 >> bd > bt >> Tracing pid 20 tid 100089 td 0xfffff80003eb3560 >=20 > New one: td 0xfffff80003df6000 >=20 >> pmap_ts_referenced() at pmap_ts_referenced_0x72e/frame = 0xfffffe01aeb289f0 > New one: > pmap_ts_referenced() at pmap_ts_referenced_0x82b/frame = 0xfffffe01aeb289f0 >=20 >> vm_pageout() at vm_pageout+0xdeb/frame 0xfffffe01aeb28ab0 >=20 > Correction to original: frame 0xfffffe01aeb28a70 > (new is the same) >=20 >> fork_exit() at fork_exit+0x82/frame 0xfffffe01aeb28ab0 >> fork_trampoline() at fork_trampoline+0xe/frame 0xfffffe01aeb28ab0 >> --- trap 0, rip =3D 0, rsp =3D 0, rpb =3D 0 --- >> db> >>=20 >> The prior (cross) buildworld buildkernel had completed fine. >>=20 >> Until yesterday, I'd been running -r325700 or before and had not >> seen such an issue ever before. I'd been using the virtualbox >> version for a while before this as well. Taking the case of: Stopped at pmap_ts_referenced+0x72e: movq (%rcx,rdi,8),%rbx: ffffffff80f2b0fc mov %rax,%rsi ffffffff80f2b0ff shr $0x1b,%rsi ffffffff80f2b103 and $0xff8,%esi ffffffff80f2b109 mov (%rcx,%rsi,1),%rcx ffffffff80f2b10d and %r10,%rcx ffffffff80f2b110 or %r9,%rcx ffffffff80f2b113 mov %eax,%edi ffffffff80f2b115 shr $0x15,%edi ffffffff80f2b118 and $0x1ff,%edi ffffffff80f2b11e mov (%rcx,%rdi,8),%rbx = <<<<<<=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D ffffffff80f2b122 and %r10,%rbx ffffffff80f2b125 or %r9,%rbx ffffffff80f2b128 shr $0x9,%rax ffffffff80f2b12c and $0xff8,%eax ffffffff80f2b131 lea (%rbx,%rax,1),%rsi ffffffff80f2b135 mov (%rbx,%rax,1),%rbx ffffffff80f2b139 mov %rbx,%rax ffffffff80f2b13c and %rdx,%rax ffffffff80f2b13f cmp %rdx,%rax ffffffff80f2b142 jne ffffffff80f2b14f = Which, if I understand right, is in the "small_mappings:" code: PG_A =3D pmap_accessed_bit(pmap); PG_M =3D pmap_modified_bit(pmap); PG_RW =3D pmap_rw_bit(pmap); pde =3D pmap_pde(pmap, pv->pv_va); KASSERT((*pde & PG_PS) =3D=3D 0, ("pmap_ts_referenced: found a 2mpage in page %p's pv = list", m)); pte =3D pmap_pde_to_pte(pde, pv->pv_va); if ((*pte & (PG_M | PG_RW)) =3D=3D (PG_M | PG_RW)) vm_page_dirty(m); if ((*pte & PG_A) !=3D 0) { with the failure being during *pde in: /* Return a pointer to the PT slot that corresponds to a VA */ static __inline pt_entry_t * pmap_pde_to_pte(pd_entry_t *pde, vm_offset_t va) { pt_entry_t *pte; pte =3D (pt_entry_t *)PHYS_TO_DMAP(*pde & PG_FRAME); return (&pte[pmap_pte_index(va)]); } Taking the case of: New one: pmap_ts_referenced+0x82b: movq %rcx,0x10(%rax) ffffffff80f2b1fb lock cmpxchg %rcx,(%rdx) ffffffff80f2b200 sete %cl ffffffff80f2b203 test %cl,%cl ffffffff80f2b205 je ffffffff80f2b27d = ffffffff80f2b207 test %r12,%r12 ffffffff80f2b20a je ffffffff80f2b255 = ffffffff80f2b20c mov 0x8(%r12),%rax ffffffff80f2b211 test %rax,%rax ffffffff80f2b214 je ffffffff80f2b255 = ffffffff80f2b216 mov 0x10(%r12),%rcx ffffffff80f2b21b mov %rcx,0x10(%rax) = <<<<<<<<<=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D ffffffff80f2b21f mov 0x8(%r12),%rax ffffffff80f2b224 mov 0x10(%r12),%rcx ffffffff80f2b229 mov %rax,(%rcx) Which, if I understand right, appears to be during the TAILQ_REMOVE of: PMAP_UNLOCK(pmap); /* Rotate the PV list if it has more than one entry. */ if (pv !=3D NULL && TAILQ_NEXT(pv, pv_next) !=3D NULL) { TAILQ_REMOVE(&m->md.pv_list, pv, pv_next); . . . #define TAILQ_REMOVE(head, elm, field) do { = \ QMD_SAVELINK(oldnext, (elm)->field.tqe_next); = \ QMD_SAVELINK(oldprev, (elm)->field.tqe_prev); = \ QMD_TAILQ_CHECK_NEXT(elm, field); = \ QMD_TAILQ_CHECK_PREV(elm, field); = \ if ((TAILQ_NEXT((elm), field)) !=3D NULL) = \ TAILQ_NEXT((elm), field)->field.tqe_prev =3D = \ (elm)->field.tqe_prev; = \ else { = \ (head)->tqh_last =3D (elm)->field.tqe_prev; = \ QMD_TRACE_HEAD(head); = \ } = \ *(elm)->field.tqe_prev =3D TAILQ_NEXT((elm), field); = \ TRASHIT(*oldnext); = \ TRASHIT(*oldprev); = \ QMD_TRACE_ELEM(&(elm)->field); = \ } while (0) where the kernel was a non-debug kernel (with debug symbols). =3D=3D=3D Mark Millard markmi at dsl-only.net From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Tue Nov 21 05:59:31 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B291DE306C for ; Tue, 21 Nov 2017 05:59:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markmi@dsl-only.net) Received: from asp.reflexion.net (outbound-mail-210-129.reflexion.net [208.70.210.129]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F3FEE80C43 for ; Tue, 21 Nov 2017 05:59:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markmi@dsl-only.net) Received: (qmail 16282 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2017 05:59:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail-cs-02.app.dca.reflexion.local) (10.81.19.2) by 0 (rfx-qmail) with SMTP; 21 Nov 2017 05:59:24 -0000 Received: by mail-cs-02.app.dca.reflexion.local (Reflexion email security v8.40.3) with SMTP; Tue, 21 Nov 2017 00:59:24 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 10699 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2017 05:59:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO iron2.pdx.net) (69.64.224.71) by 0 (rfx-qmail) with (AES256-SHA encrypted) SMTP; 21 Nov 2017 05:59:24 -0000 Received: from [192.168.1.25] (c-76-115-7-162.hsd1.or.comcast.net [76.115.7.162]) by iron2.pdx.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 9B764EC92AD; Mon, 20 Nov 2017 21:59:23 -0800 (PST) From: Mark Millard Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\)) Subject: head -r325700 to -r325997: problem locking/unlocking/ for (at least) amd64? Message-Id: Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2017 21:59:23 -0800 Cc: mjg@freebsd.org To: freebsd-amd64@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current , freebsd-hackers X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273) X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2017 05:59:31 -0000 Ever since I updated from -r325700 to -r325997 I've been having odd, non-repeatable, fairly rare problems on amd64. (I've yet to see if I get similar issues on other platforms.) I've reported a couple of panic for page faults in kernel mode in other list messages. But I'm also getting things like clang failing assertions that do not repeat when the compile is simply retried with the same input files. I only mention locking because of recent head/sys/kern activity between -r325700 and -r325997, the intermittent nature of the observed failures, and the wide variety of contexts (kernel, world). I do not have specific evidence of a specific cause. (I do not see how I'm ever going to get any such evidence.) The following error did not repeat on a simple retry of the compile: --- Sema/SemaDeclAttr.o --- Assertion failed: (I->second && I->first =3D=3D I->second->getValPtr() = && "List invariant broken!"), function AddToUseList, file = /usr/src/contrib/llvm/lib/IR/Value.cpp, line 793. c++: error: unable to execute command: Abort trap (core dumped) c++: error: clang frontend command failed due to signal (use -v to see = invocation) FreeBSD clang version 5.0.0 (tags/RELEASE_500/final 312559) (based on = LLVM 5.0.0svn) Target: powerpc-unknown-freebsd12.0 Thread model: posix InstalledDir: = /usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/tmp/usr= /bin c++: note: diagnostic msg: PLEASE submit a bug report to = https://bugs.freebsd.org/submit/ and include the crash backtrace, = preprocessed source, and associated run script. Building = /usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/lib/cla= ng/libclang/Sema/SemaExceptionSpec.o c++: note: diagnostic msg:=20 ******************** PLEASE ATTACH THE FOLLOWING FILES TO THE BUG REPORT: Preprocessed source(s) and associated run script(s) are located at: c++: note: diagnostic msg: /tmp/SemaDeclAttr-6b7ba8.cpp c++: note: diagnostic msg: /tmp/SemaDeclAttr-6b7ba8.sh c++: note: diagnostic msg:=20 ******************** *** [Sema/SemaDeclAttr.o] Error code 254 make[6]: stopped in /usr/src/lib/clang/libclang .ERROR_TARGET=3D'Sema/SemaDeclAttr.o' = .ERROR_META_FILE=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/pow= erpc.powerpc/lib/clang/libclang/Sema_SemaDeclAttr.o.meta' .MAKE.LEVEL=3D'6' MAKEFILE=3D'' .MAKE.MODE=3D'meta missing-filemon=3Dyes missing-meta=3Dyes silent=3Dyes = verbose' _ERROR_CMD=3D'c++ -target powerpc-unknown-freebsd12.0 = --sysroot=3D/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.pow= erpc/tmp = -B/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/tmp/u= sr/bin -O2 -pipe = -I/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/lib/c= lang/libclang = -I/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/lib/c= lang/libllvm -I/usr/src/contrib/llvm/tools/clang/lib/Driver = -I/usr/src/contrib/llvm/tools/clang/include -DCLANG_ENABLE_ARCMT = -DCLANG_ENABLE_STATIC_ANALYZER -I/usr/src/lib/clang/include = -I/usr/src/contrib/llvm/include -DLLVM_BUILD_GLOBAL_ISEL = -D__STDC_LIMIT_MACROS -D__STDC_CONSTANT_MACROS = -DLLVM_DEFAULT_TARGET_TRIPLE=3D\"powerpc-unknown-freebsd12.0\" = -DLLVM_HOST_TRIPLE=3D\"powerpc-unknown-freebsd12.0\" = -DDEFAULT_SYSROOT=3D\"\" -ffunction-sections -fdata-sections = -gline-tables-only -fstack-protector-strong -Qunused-arguments = -std=3Dc++11 -fno-exceptions -fno-rtti -gline-tables-only -stdlib=3Dlibc++= -Wno-c++11-extensions -c = /usr/src/contrib/llvm/tools/clang/lib/Sema/SemaDeclAttr.cpp -o = Sema/SemaDeclAttr.o;' .CURDIR=3D'/usr/src/lib/clang/libclang' .MAKE=3D'make' = .OBJDIR=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powe= rpc/lib/clang/libclang' .TARGETS=3D'all' = DESTDIR=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powe= rpc/tmp' LD_LIBRARY_PATH=3D'' MACHINE=3D'powerpc' MACHINE_ARCH=3D'powerpc' MAKEOBJDIRPREFIX=3D'' MAKESYSPATH=3D'/usr/src/share/mk' MAKE_VERSION=3D'20171028' = PATH=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc= /tmp/legacy/usr/sbin:/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/po= werpc.powerpc/tmp/legacy/usr/bin:/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerp= c/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/tmp/legacy/bin:/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerp= c.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/tmp/usr/sbin:/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/= powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/tmp/usr/bin:/sbin:/bin:/usr/sbin:/= usr/bin' SRCTOP=3D'/usr/src' = OBJTOP=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.power= pc' .MAKE.MAKEFILES=3D'/usr/src/share/mk/sys.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/local.sys.env.mk /usr/src/share/mk/src.sys.env.mk = /root/src.configs/src.conf.powerpc-clang-bootstrap.amd64-host = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.mkopt.mk /usr/src/share/mk/src.sys.obj.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/auto.obj.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.suffixes.mk = /root/src.configs/make.conf /usr/src/share/mk/local.sys.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/src.sys.mk /dev/null = /usr/src/lib/clang/libclang/Makefile /usr/src/share/mk/src.opts.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.own.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.opts.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.cpu.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.compiler.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.linker.mk /usr/src/lib/clang/clang.pre.mk = /usr/src/lib/clang/llvm.pre.mk /usr/src/lib/clang/clang.build.mk = /usr/src/lib/clang/llvm.build.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.lib.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.init.mk /usr/src/share/mk/local.init.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/src.init.mk = /usr/src/lib/clang/libclang/../Makefile.inc = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.libnames.mk /usr/src/share/mk/src.libnames.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.symver.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.nls.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.files.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.incs.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.confs.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.links.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.dep.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.clang-analyze.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.obj.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.subdir.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.sys.mk' .PATH=3D'. /usr/src/lib/clang/libclang = /usr/src/contrib/llvm/tools/clang/lib' 1 error make[6]: stopped in /usr/src/lib/clang/libclang .ERROR_TARGET=3D'Sema/SemaDeclAttr.o' = .ERROR_META_FILE=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/pow= erpc.powerpc/lib/clang/libclang/Sema_SemaDeclAttr.o.meta' .MAKE.LEVEL=3D'6' MAKEFILE=3D'' .MAKE.MODE=3D'meta missing-filemon=3Dyes missing-meta=3Dyes silent=3Dyes = verbose' _ERROR_CMD=3D'c++ -target powerpc-unknown-freebsd12.0 = --sysroot=3D/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.pow= erpc/tmp = -B/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/tmp/u= sr/bin -O2 -pipe = -I/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/lib/c= lang/libclang = -I/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/lib/c= lang/libllvm -I/usr/src/contrib/llvm/tools/clang/lib/Driver = -I/usr/src/contrib/llvm/tools/clang/include -DCLANG_ENABLE_ARCMT = -DCLANG_ENABLE_STATIC_ANALYZER -I/usr/src/lib/clang/include = -I/usr/src/contrib/llvm/include -DLLVM_BUILD_GLOBAL_ISEL = -D__STDC_LIMIT_MACROS -D__STDC_CONSTANT_MACROS = -DLLVM_DEFAULT_TARGET_TRIPLE=3D\"powerpc-unknown-freebsd12.0\" = -DLLVM_HOST_TRIPLE=3D\"powerpc-unknown-freebsd12.0\" = -DDEFAULT_SYSROOT=3D\"\" -ffunction-sections -fdata-sections = -gline-tables-only -fstack-protector-strong -Qunused-arguments = -std=3Dc++11 -fno-exceptions -fno-rtti -gline-tables-only -stdlib=3Dlibc++= -Wno-c++11-extensions -c = /usr/src/contrib/llvm/tools/clang/lib/Sema/SemaDeclAttr.cpp -o = Sema/SemaDeclAttr.o;' .CURDIR=3D'/usr/src/lib/clang/libclang' .MAKE=3D'make' = .OBJDIR=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powe= rpc/lib/clang/libclang' .TARGETS=3D'all' = DESTDIR=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powe= rpc/tmp' LD_LIBRARY_PATH=3D'' MACHINE=3D'powerpc' MACHINE_ARCH=3D'powerpc' MAKEOBJDIRPREFIX=3D'' MAKESYSPATH=3D'/usr/src/share/mk' MAKE_VERSION=3D'20171028' = PATH=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc= /tmp/legacy/usr/sbin:/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/po= werpc.powerpc/tmp/legacy/usr/bin:/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerp= c/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/tmp/legacy/bin:/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerp= c.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/tmp/usr/sbin:/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/= powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/tmp/usr/bin:/sbin:/bin:/usr/sbin:/= usr/bin' SRCTOP=3D'/usr/src' = OBJTOP=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.power= pc' .MAKE.MAKEFILES=3D'/usr/src/share/mk/sys.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/local.sys.env.mk /usr/src/share/mk/src.sys.env.mk = /root/src.configs/src.conf.powerpc-clang-bootstrap.amd64-host = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.mkopt.mk /usr/src/share/mk/src.sys.obj.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/auto.obj.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.suffixes.mk = /root/src.configs/make.conf /usr/src/share/mk/local.sys.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/src.sys.mk /dev/null = /usr/src/lib/clang/libclang/Makefile /usr/src/share/mk/src.opts.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.own.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.opts.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.cpu.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.compiler.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.linker.mk /usr/src/lib/clang/clang.pre.mk = /usr/src/lib/clang/llvm.pre.mk /usr/src/lib/clang/clang.build.mk = /usr/src/lib/clang/llvm.build.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.lib.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.init.mk /usr/src/share/mk/local.init.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/src.init.mk = /usr/src/lib/clang/libclang/../Makefile.inc = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.libnames.mk /usr/src/share/mk/src.libnames.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.symver.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.nls.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.files.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.incs.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.confs.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.links.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.dep.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.clang-analyze.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.obj.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.subdir.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.sys.mk' .PATH=3D'. /usr/src/lib/clang/libclang = /usr/src/contrib/llvm/tools/clang/lib' *** [all_subdir_lib/clang/libclang] Error code 2 make[5]: stopped in /usr/src/lib/clang .ERROR_TARGET=3D'all_subdir_lib/clang/libclang' .ERROR_META_FILE=3D'' .MAKE.LEVEL=3D'5' MAKEFILE=3D'' .MAKE.MODE=3D'meta missing-filemon=3Dyes missing-meta=3Dyes silent=3Dyes = verbose' _ERROR_CMD=3D'.PHONY' .CURDIR=3D'/usr/src/lib/clang' .MAKE=3D'make' = .OBJDIR=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powe= rpc/lib/clang' .TARGETS=3D'all' = DESTDIR=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powe= rpc/tmp' LD_LIBRARY_PATH=3D'' MACHINE=3D'powerpc' MACHINE_ARCH=3D'powerpc' MAKEOBJDIRPREFIX=3D'' MAKESYSPATH=3D'/usr/src/share/mk' MAKE_VERSION=3D'20171028' = PATH=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc= /tmp/legacy/usr/sbin:/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/po= werpc.powerpc/tmp/legacy/usr/bin:/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerp= c/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/tmp/legacy/bin:/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerp= c.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/tmp/usr/sbin:/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/= powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/tmp/usr/bin:/sbin:/bin:/usr/sbin:/= usr/bin' SRCTOP=3D'/usr/src' = OBJTOP=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.power= pc' .MAKE.MAKEFILES=3D'/usr/src/share/mk/sys.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/local.sys.env.mk /usr/src/share/mk/src.sys.env.mk = /root/src.configs/src.conf.powerpc-clang-bootstrap.amd64-host = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.mkopt.mk /usr/src/share/mk/src.sys.obj.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/auto.obj.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.suffixes.mk = /root/src.configs/make.conf /usr/src/share/mk/local.sys.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/src.sys.mk /dev/null /usr/src/lib/clang/Makefile = /usr/src/share/mk/src.opts.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.own.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.opts.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.cpu.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.compiler.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.linker.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.subdir.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.init.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/local.init.mk /usr/src/share/mk/src.init.mk = /usr/src/lib/clang/../Makefile.inc' .PATH=3D'. /usr/src/lib/clang' 1 error make[5]: stopped in /usr/src/lib/clang .ERROR_TARGET=3D'all_subdir_lib/clang/libclang' .ERROR_META_FILE=3D'' .MAKE.LEVEL=3D'5' MAKEFILE=3D'' .MAKE.MODE=3D'meta missing-filemon=3Dyes missing-meta=3Dyes silent=3Dyes = verbose' _ERROR_CMD=3D'.PHONY' .CURDIR=3D'/usr/src/lib/clang' .MAKE=3D'make' = .OBJDIR=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powe= rpc/lib/clang' .TARGETS=3D'all' = DESTDIR=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powe= rpc/tmp' LD_LIBRARY_PATH=3D'' MACHINE=3D'powerpc' MACHINE_ARCH=3D'powerpc' MAKEOBJDIRPREFIX=3D'' MAKESYSPATH=3D'/usr/src/share/mk' MAKE_VERSION=3D'20171028' = PATH=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc= /tmp/legacy/usr/sbin:/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/po= werpc.powerpc/tmp/legacy/usr/bin:/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerp= c/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/tmp/legacy/bin:/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerp= c.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/tmp/usr/sbin:/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/= powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.powerpc/tmp/usr/bin:/sbin:/bin:/usr/sbin:/= usr/bin' SRCTOP=3D'/usr/src' = OBJTOP=3D'/usr/obj/powerpcvtsc_clang/powerpc.powerpc/usr/src/powerpc.power= pc' .MAKE.MAKEFILES=3D'/usr/src/share/mk/sys.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/local.sys.env.mk /usr/src/share/mk/src.sys.env.mk = /root/src.configs/src.conf.powerpc-clang-bootstrap.amd64-host = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.mkopt.mk /usr/src/share/mk/src.sys.obj.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/auto.obj.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.suffixes.mk = /root/src.configs/make.conf /usr/src/share/mk/local.sys.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/src.sys.mk /dev/null /usr/src/lib/clang/Makefile = /usr/src/share/mk/src.opts.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.own.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.opts.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.cpu.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.compiler.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.linker.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.subdir.mk /usr/src/share/mk/bsd.init.mk = /usr/src/share/mk/local.init.mk /usr/src/share/mk/src.init.mk = /usr/src/lib/clang/../Makefile.inc' .PATH=3D'. /usr/src/lib/clang' *** [all_subdir_lib/clang] Error code 2 =3D=3D=3D Mark Millard markmi at dsl-only.net From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Tue Nov 21 06:18:24 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01D6ADE3F27 for ; Tue, 21 Nov 2017 06:18:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markmi@dsl-only.net) Received: from asp.reflexion.net (outbound-mail-210-168.reflexion.net [208.70.210.168]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8ECCB19A1 for ; Tue, 21 Nov 2017 06:18:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markmi@dsl-only.net) Received: (qmail 13951 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2017 06:18:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail-cs-01.app.dca.reflexion.local) (10.81.19.1) by 0 (rfx-qmail) with SMTP; 21 Nov 2017 06:18:16 -0000 Received: by mail-cs-01.app.dca.reflexion.local (Reflexion email security v8.40.3) with SMTP; Tue, 21 Nov 2017 01:18:16 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 9115 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2017 06:18:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO iron2.pdx.net) (69.64.224.71) by 0 (rfx-qmail) with (AES256-SHA encrypted) SMTP; 21 Nov 2017 06:18:16 -0000 Received: from [192.168.1.25] (c-76-115-7-162.hsd1.or.comcast.net [76.115.7.162]) by iron2.pdx.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id D1508EC7E18; Mon, 20 Nov 2017 22:18:15 -0800 (PST) From: Mark Millard Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\)) Subject: Alternative to using system binutils for cross builds targeting 32-bit powerpc? Message-Id: Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2017 22:18:15 -0800 To: FreeBSD PowerPC ML , FreeBSD Toolchain , freebsd-hackers X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273) X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2017 06:18:24 -0000 [I tend to experiment with using clang to target powerpc64 and powerpc, reporting things that I find.] [clang 5 generates R_PPC_PLTREL24 in the .o files for global symbols in places gcc 4.2.1 generates R_PPC_ADDR16_HA / R_PPC_ADDR16_LO pairs.] Trying to cross build the 32-bit powerpc kernel with the system clang 5 gets failures like: --- aha.ko.full --- ld: aha.kld(.text+0x2b8c): R_PPC_PLTREL24 reloc against local symbol aha.kld: could not read symbols: Bad value *** [aha.ko.full] Error code 1 Would an alternate binutils handle it? There is no devel/powerpc-binutils (but there is devel/powerpc64-binutils ). Does someone known a way to use an alternate binutils to target 32-bit powerpc? As stands it looks like I can only experiment with self-hosted builds and an alternate binutils ( devel/binutils ) as far as pre-existing things go. === Mark Millard markmi at dsl-only.net From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Tue Nov 21 17:38:17 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA9ABDF4F1F for ; Tue, 21 Nov 2017 17:38:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markjdb@gmail.com) Received: from mail-qk0-x229.google.com (mail-qk0-x229.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c09::229]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8199A775EF for ; Tue, 21 Nov 2017 17:38:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markjdb@gmail.com) Received: by mail-qk0-x229.google.com with SMTP id j202so13146289qke.10 for ; Tue, 21 Nov 2017 09:38:17 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=sender:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:references:mime-version :content-disposition:in-reply-to:user-agent; bh=58f8TuzYc7OMHgUl7xnYpQXODdCK8zmGK6v6aUBGcN8=; b=a65KJnvCpXQt1BFxOSWyhmXuWijjLu+enRNoLcGm8+E6O/8ibrLpFB+xL4AUT/ITys 5zazmR47AEN6zEoqbilmyOrWRmDq+2dvyNUCCG9yd8rCQeFEMq1k7S9NLhctEyGXdczD SMp7EdlrfNZYhddX8yqUsj5Qjp+JkdN+lBQK+xQfRlhxAMEL5p5Y1IyFO6GLL7Gv1ojW neUKBCkBc0pCA0gKa3ERwAilwbPFp87zaXlrSv4BZmng82FX7Zs91I//KKY/d9V+qFbh denB+PHPT2qzS/K5jradjTN8x6QjVB6w/l/BTzlOxsXuDdgNO7s8X7PYuFzms/+zWPCc xI+Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id :references:mime-version:content-disposition:in-reply-to:user-agent; bh=58f8TuzYc7OMHgUl7xnYpQXODdCK8zmGK6v6aUBGcN8=; b=UXY6gufDF3a6FLAhBnhp4rxYHYJh13SXeZunWlqLzv6drwUONmZIRco815ioFTA7k9 OlrRyPj811I4WcgILGvV7CEXCHuA3TLEZCVyj7vjyALf7xdYczvoXybeVPDK4Q3dFVbR /5N9wFfnm2O1zP7pUDL8w0YRId9xOKUECWxZI5Fssdh1DKCCHyO/4LAvOGbeMVKQtuDP 1/d0IE/2EAejTuAKce06hGnO3VD3biwVfg7amxZ2daWlFXVI28EdO9lsPpzRzCwS+dal Q9TPtk+txPTeB7Om8JOyY70KpxDP2GSbYdPrVLlDVKrPMxTZb7uqFTfg7PUcgwxMMj6N mBdw== X-Gm-Message-State: AJaThX5VDrsQGU742uHSJShaP8zTpSjLfMQl9eFyxBrMPJxQa6TK1zaj O04qBZCxN3MOPhYH/WzCCkfGvg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGs4zMbi9AeoagYmhapcLTmIQxkWW7ULKD7igVVIm6hiVblNnF2F8D31RCwgJ9d8IO3l5aD/+dy87A== X-Received: by 10.55.34.135 with SMTP id i129mr25841236qki.86.1511285896398; Tue, 21 Nov 2017 09:38:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from raichu (toroon0560w-lp140-01-69-159-38-22.dsl.bell.ca. [69.159.38.22]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id h21sm1144178qte.44.2017.11.21.09.38.15 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 21 Nov 2017 09:38:15 -0800 (PST) Sender: Mark Johnston Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2017 12:38:13 -0500 From: Mark Johnston To: Andre Albsmeier Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: gmirror synchronising is very slow due to frequent metadata updates Message-ID: <20171121173813.GB4126@raichu> References: <20171119103241.GA20588@voyager> <20171120033828.GA1959@bish> <20171120053409.GA57536@gate> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20171120053409.GA57536@gate> User-Agent: Mutt/1.9.1 (2017-09-22) X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2017 17:38:17 -0000 On Mon, Nov 20, 2017 at 06:34:09AM +0100, Andre Albsmeier wrote: > On Sun, 19-Nov-2017 at 22:38:28 -0500, Mark Johnston wrote: > > We should probably decrease the update interval based on the size of a > > mirror. For mirrors larger than say, 1GB, we might just update the > > metadata block once per 1% of the synchronization operation's progress. > > I think best would be to have it updated every seconds. > I think of very fast or very slow drives, or drives which are used > heavily during rebuild (where the effective rebuild speed is quite > low)... I think that's reasonable. Could you give the patch below a try? It adds a sysctl which configures the frequency of metadata updates during synchronization. It'd be nice to be able to specify this parameter (as well as idletime) on a per-gmirror basis, with the default value still being taken from the sysctl, but that can be implemented separately. diff --git a/sys/geom/mirror/g_mirror.c b/sys/geom/mirror/g_mirror.c index 4a5f542c1de5..47d11f3ce465 100644 --- a/sys/geom/mirror/g_mirror.c +++ b/sys/geom/mirror/g_mirror.c @@ -69,6 +69,10 @@ SYSCTL_UINT(_kern_geom_mirror, OID_AUTO, disconnect_on_failure, CTLFLAG_RWTUN, static u_int g_mirror_syncreqs = 2; SYSCTL_UINT(_kern_geom_mirror, OID_AUTO, sync_requests, CTLFLAG_RDTUN, &g_mirror_syncreqs, 0, "Parallel synchronization I/O requests."); +static u_int g_mirror_sync_period = 5; +SYSCTL_UINT(_kern_geom_mirror, OID_AUTO, sync_update_period, CTLFLAG_RWTUN, + &g_mirror_sync_period, 0, + "Metadata update period during synchroniztion, in seconds"); #define MSLEEP(ident, mtx, priority, wmesg, timeout) do { \ G_MIRROR_DEBUG(4, "%s: Sleeping %p.", __func__, (ident)); \ @@ -463,6 +467,7 @@ g_mirror_init_disk(struct g_mirror_softc *sc, struct g_provider *pp, disk->d_sync.ds_consumer = NULL; disk->d_sync.ds_offset = md->md_sync_offset; disk->d_sync.ds_offset_done = md->md_sync_offset; + disk->d_sync.ds_update_ts = time_uptime; disk->d_genid = md->md_genid; disk->d_sync.ds_syncid = md->md_syncid; if (errorp != NULL) @@ -1457,10 +1462,11 @@ g_mirror_sync_request(struct bio *bp) if (bp != NULL && bp->bio_offset < offset) offset = bp->bio_offset; } - if (sync->ds_offset_done + (MAXPHYS * 100) < offset) { - /* Update offset_done on every 100 blocks. */ + if (g_mirror_sync_period > 0 && + time_uptime - sync->ds_update_ts > g_mirror_sync_period) { sync->ds_offset_done = offset; g_mirror_update_metadata(disk); + sync->ds_update_ts = time_uptime; } return; } diff --git a/sys/geom/mirror/g_mirror.h b/sys/geom/mirror/g_mirror.h index 3b9664035c98..be46f7b43e4c 100644 --- a/sys/geom/mirror/g_mirror.h +++ b/sys/geom/mirror/g_mirror.h @@ -108,6 +108,7 @@ struct g_mirror_disk_sync { off_t ds_offset; /* Offset of next request to send. */ off_t ds_offset_done; /* Offset of already synchronized region. */ + time_t ds_update_ts; /* Time of last metadata update. */ u_int ds_syncid; /* Disk's synchronization ID. */ u_int ds_inflight; /* Number of in-flight sync requests. */ struct bio **ds_bios; /* BIOs for synchronization I/O. */ From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Tue Nov 21 22:11:01 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D306FDB9504; Tue, 21 Nov 2017 22:11:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from agapon@gmail.com) Received: from mail-lf0-f44.google.com (mail-lf0-f44.google.com [209.85.215.44]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5E69A163A; Tue, 21 Nov 2017 22:11:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from agapon@gmail.com) Received: by mail-lf0-f44.google.com with SMTP id x76so11293381lfb.6; Tue, 21 Nov 2017 14:11:00 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:subject:to:references:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=uNM8oUs1OA13Bqqb8fBPzLEPlU6iyGrsvKhxHpbf3LU=; b=Y2/zlvB3VTZZjutomaQIdiz5gcW8FeHk+An217XT35HXpiyFi4ihrq1QRpLLGkH83B ccrXVQxRgBB6LWU+g8sHugOZhnL40E3EF4bNzedBi6/6X5p1nSIDu0iOOezueit9aIE8 BQm55NUaPNvKaYqm6n54pwA30um7OFQKenU2UDLSp8g3AFvK6T2xH9wvIKOr4ZFClsus z5zC7Q9MH6KvyOo12s1/s6+5Gjt47nLcHTEWqpLkiwryz2JB47UvX2YspyMgOibhMnRp ifHpSNFpmGTY55vwTVbbmAm+3GkdkBErFVVTxmuM8klJxhQi7aQrSBKq6xBkmHTM4oFp CrRQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AJaThX4pxXfSoliGqrzuGAqMf7Ph8+xp6dl5ItK+tXiw+e5rtWr7Tpqz D/yvquaQZqppCRCvPcVdo3mK0dQtWOk= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGs4zMZCtke1igqN6cH4KdxD8lgWsciLSm1Ckxlj/EQLXW4p/PO55jTkxeqDr08rH5akNe7FWYqfRg== X-Received: by 10.46.65.203 with SMTP id d72mr6263533ljf.136.1511301894145; Tue, 21 Nov 2017 14:04:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.0.88] (east.meadow.volia.net. [93.72.151.96]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id j28sm3325544ljb.50.2017.11.21.14.04.53 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 21 Nov 2017 14:04:53 -0800 (PST) From: Andriy Gapon Subject: various fixes and improvements for AMD-Vi To: "freebsd-virtualization@freebsd.org" , FreeBSD Hackers References: Message-ID: <033007f1-55d4-76e3-03d0-57e5f1b83302@FreeBSD.org> Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 00:04:52 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2017 22:11:01 -0000 I have created a fake GitHub pull request to try to get some review for a few AMD-specific changes to vmm. I would like to ask for a wider review of two of those changes. They require a bit of knowledge of the acpi and pci bus code (msi setup, etc): https://github.com/avg-I/freebsd/pull/1/commits/b4ce26a221fe2ab1e3ab1d373575131545b76aa6 https://github.com/avg-I/freebsd/pull/1/commits/eecf82121fc4fedc577af4b3c3b4de455ae6dad8 Thank you! -- Andriy Gapon From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 07:08:16 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2C11DE2DD8 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 07:08:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from khanzf@gmail.com) Received: from mail-qt0-x236.google.com (mail-qt0-x236.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c0d::236]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9A1FB6FF3F for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 07:08:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from khanzf@gmail.com) Received: by mail-qt0-x236.google.com with SMTP id p44so22514014qtj.6 for ; Tue, 21 Nov 2017 23:08:16 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=to:from:subject:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=7dODCZNJL9Z0LeEKGJ9Ymvvb4X39NDJBb2GRL5FRQP4=; b=l140mJ5ISVt+OTKjcHt55tWhLynGDCohSq5ql62H8u0m4hBvbVk6aRYVr2paZMsK+n EsnnNUuud+HxXcqyRZW+pofE8eYwdzxlHyzFSvSJAZosAN8kXQojX+dJYOFm9JNOiaq7 z8p46KHSS0nSKoR9+JH9GICgFD4EP9hIia/9tMd+mIhjNPKi9I0x0v9GUNRr1b88UMmK C6hCl6ComY65Z+f4mvoEaV80saCytyeTGWL0iCIBdK1N162Vc2cyJdXa1whv7K8oHzWk FvTK6VYPlYDfjaiIEEHnCe2GNzS8A8L8tyZq7PfePef961Y7EwD1EdOMbhzfCkNJ6thw FQ9g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:to:from:subject:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=7dODCZNJL9Z0LeEKGJ9Ymvvb4X39NDJBb2GRL5FRQP4=; b=SCAyxsH2sQY90djdtV66BBx8K5yWUQfAEAlQqDJD81Sqwx8Gc5F9EMwqfSuXVBKOiK omK1KGcq9sckZPRKvPS0fdP28+za8bFzp2SqiTIF6MZOrqMSXRN5dO6MdYyURG0cWnxz 3qrabvv/mJgyjryPyqgYFnknWa1F2jXJTS5PpZpPL8p/1qDlpX1/BfqJLfQRqDjJTqx0 CIrco2pX8DhmPTmZDECNEk1zblsFRkyQtIQfny6lQjvWFy32TlvUwtdfZguR2bQl0kMC 41KutYUx37U4LvkRPE4z5wwaEyPnK1X3uYK7M3ycPL6p/PIGqeW0G0PmOYGwZn6vbuF3 b2Gg== X-Gm-Message-State: AJaThX7EhJgztD+hNJ4G+8x9vO7EkU0IO28K9EKTWRYA+KIAzzJK5Tt0 Hdnbke/XdC9JKxTq/Y+Ao4KsPLxD X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGs4zMZS3sNDtKPZ/+GCcMeM3hwhhPnFstL3+xVidsQ2/pQk/OubGzD1O9DM6KfUGba5tCDCMvJoTg== X-Received: by 10.200.42.14 with SMTP id k14mr30495809qtk.20.1511334495634; Tue, 21 Nov 2017 23:08:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from pc.farhan.codes ([2001:470:8:209::dead:c0de]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id t12sm10345763qkl.41.2017.11.21.23.08.15 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 21 Nov 2017 23:08:15 -0800 (PST) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org From: Farhan Khan Subject: Is ddb(4) over a USB-to-Serial port possible? Message-ID: <11ce9826-f768-3ea0-547d-2d182d1552f0@gmail.com> Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 02:08:14 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 07:08:17 -0000 Hi all I am reading here in section "10.5, On-Line Kernel Debugging User Remote GDB" that you can run ddb(4) over a serial cable. I am interested in setting this up. My development box does not have a serial port (however, I do see a uart0 device in the kernel messages), so I attached a USB serial port attached to a machine with a serial port. The device uses the uslcom(4) driver and is listed as "Silicon Labs CP2102 USB to UART Bridge Controller". When I enter ddb and enter "gdb" I receive the error "The remote GDB backend could not be selected." The hint.uart.0.port in /boot/device.hints is still set to 0x3F8, which corresponds to the aforementioned kernel messages. I am not certain if this is the same port as the USB-based serial port. Does this feature work over USB? Thanks, Farhan Khan From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 07:40:17 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5229BDE35FB for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 07:40:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from julian@freebsd.org) Received: from vps1.elischer.org (vps1.elischer.org [204.109.63.16]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "vps1.elischer.org", Issuer "CA Cert Signing Authority" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2E9A970AA4 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 07:40:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from julian@freebsd.org) Received: from Julian-MBP3.local (125-209-148-40.dyn.iinet.net.au [125.209.148.40]) (authenticated bits=0) by vps1.elischer.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPSA id vAM7e6nE028141 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Tue, 21 Nov 2017 23:40:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from julian@freebsd.org) Subject: Re: Is ddb(4) over a USB-to-Serial port possible? To: Farhan Khan , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <11ce9826-f768-3ea0-547d-2d182d1552f0@gmail.com> From: Julian Elischer Message-ID: <36165883-5cb7-aabc-c81e-cb5458029803@freebsd.org> Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 15:40:00 +0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.12; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <11ce9826-f768-3ea0-547d-2d182d1552f0@gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Language: en-US X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 07:40:17 -0000 On 22/11/17 3:08 pm, Farhan Khan wrote: > Hi all > > I am reading here in section "10.5, On-Line Kernel Debugging User > Remote GDB" that you can run ddb(4) over a serial cable. I am > interested in setting this up. > > My development box does not have a serial port (however, I do see a > uart0 device in the kernel messages), so I attached a USB serial > port attached to a machine with a serial port. The device uses the > uslcom(4) driver and is listed as "Silicon Labs CP2102 USB to UART > Bridge Controller". When I enter ddb and enter "gdb" I receive the > error "The remote GDB backend could not be selected." > > The hint.uart.0.port in /boot/device.hints is still set to 0x3F8, > which corresponds to the aforementioned kernel messages. I am not > certain if this is the same port as the USB-based serial port. Does > this feature work over USB? > > Thanks, > Farhan Khan > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > To unsubscribe, send any mail to > "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > generally speaking the answer is no, unless the device is emulated using SMI or some other mechanism that is independent of FreeBSD. uart0 is not the device on the USB but a hardware device at 3F8, regardless of whether it actually exists. Since the USB stack is not really functional when in the debugger, it can not be used to communicate with the debugger. I find a better answer is to fire up the test machine under bhyve, in which case its console is accessible through any stream session. (e.g. ssh).. From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 08:36:12 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E63DDE4D8E for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 08:36:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hps@selasky.org) Received: from mail.turbocat.net (turbocat.net [IPv6:2a01:4f8:c17:6c4b::2]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 281647235C; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 08:36:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hps@selasky.org) Received: from hps2016.home.selasky.org (unknown [62.141.128.70]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.turbocat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 498512602ED; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 09:36:04 +0100 (CET) Subject: Re: Is ddb(4) over a USB-to-Serial port possible? To: Julian Elischer , Farhan Khan , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <11ce9826-f768-3ea0-547d-2d182d1552f0@gmail.com> <36165883-5cb7-aabc-c81e-cb5458029803@freebsd.org> From: Hans Petter Selasky Message-ID: <5c6da274-102c-33c6-50f0-20597cf8e7ef@selasky.org> Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 09:33:22 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <36165883-5cb7-aabc-c81e-cb5458029803@freebsd.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 08:36:12 -0000 On 11/22/17 08:40, Julian Elischer wrote: > On 22/11/17 3:08 pm, Farhan Khan wrote: >> Hi all >> >> I am reading here in section "10.5, On-Line Kernel Debugging User >> Remote GDB" that you can run ddb(4) over a serial cable. I am >> interested in setting this up. >> >> My development box does not have a serial port (however, I do see a >> uart0 device in the kernel messages), so I attached a USB serial port >> attached to a machine with a serial port. The device uses the >> uslcom(4) driver and is listed as "Silicon Labs CP2102 USB to UART >> Bridge Controller". When I enter ddb and enter "gdb" I receive the >> error "The remote GDB backend could not be selected." >> >> The hint.uart.0.port in /boot/device.hints is still set to 0x3F8, >> which corresponds to the aforementioned kernel messages. I am not >> certain if this is the same port as the USB-based serial port. Does >> this feature work over USB? >> >> Thanks, >> Farhan Khan >> _______________________________________________ >> freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list >> https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers >> To unsubscribe, send any mail to >> "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" >> > generally speaking the answer is no, unless the device is emulated using > SMI or some other mechanism that is independent of FreeBSD. > > uart0 is not the device on the USB but a hardware device at 3F8, > regardless of whether it actually exists. Since the USB stack is not > really functional when in the debugger, it can not be used to > communicate with the debugger. > > I find a better answer is to fire up the test machine under bhyve, in > which case its console is accessible through any stream session. (e.g. > ssh).. > Hi, There is another setting for this: Try setting cons_baud and cons_unit below. USB serial supports polling from the debugger after panic. hw.usb.ucom.cons_baud: 9600 hw.usb.ucom.cons_subunit: 0 hw.usb.ucom.cons_unit: -1 hw.usb.ucom.debug: 0 hw.usb.ucom.pps_mode: 0 --HPS From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 16:29:56 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52D66DEF4E1; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 16:29:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from benno@FreeBSD.org) Received: from out4-smtp.messagingengine.com (out4-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.28]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2C815801CA; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 16:29:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from benno@FreeBSD.org) Received: from compute1.internal (compute1.nyi.internal [10.202.2.41]) by mailout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E55C20A9C; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 11:29:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from frontend1 ([10.202.2.160]) by compute1.internal (MEProxy); Wed, 22 Nov 2017 11:29:49 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=content-transfer-encoding:content-type :date:from:message-id:mime-version:subject:to:x-me-sender :x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm1; bh=hshJJs+oYp9H0v9KGFPPQmTULlrfL GcTxfco7Y2O3F0=; b=NFc2N9Iv1RXGQxbIdag5hoIPKy4YUjpEvjnUBkBOXsMcg qlzCbcZKpzJsVS3E7f4dljuV1WHXuGCFYVWuI7Q5CLEfsRpwvLEG07SuOjlFasLN w/NzLy3S9ukN2PwB+tBe6IHEBKMERKsHMOR2/tXPjt3WL9jhQPUV6m7JzdHNM3XF I+u4N4nQjyITJ5Dnby/x15JNVSq8rgQgtAA71VgzlY4LEBrMLQID4EJsefD2Y2Hn WomzRhHXShhaqu+2xWq7T2UMQ1tp6I4n7FSVsgTgK19MJJgS7l3zo6jyrYSIYhpu siDPk85GmtGyKafm7tdptFhUBux5Pw5ifv/oQMX6g== X-ME-Sender: Received: from usxxscottdm1.corp.emc.com (c-71-231-121-16.hsd1.wa.comcast.net [71.231.121.16]) by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id CBEF17FACA; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 11:29:48 -0500 (EST) From: Benno Rice Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.1 \(3445.4.7\)) Subject: The future of fortune(6) Message-Id: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 08:29:46 -0800 To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.4.7) X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 16:29:56 -0000 Hello, all! With the removal of the fortune datfiles I think it=E2=80=99s time to = have a discussion about fortune(6). fortune now defaults to using a fortune file that no longer exists: $ fortune No fortunes found in = /usr/share/games/fortune:/usr/local/share/games/fortune. fortune is still used in the default .login/.profile to show entries = from the still existing freebsd-tips: $ grep fortune /usr/share/skel/* /usr/share/skel/dot.login:if ( -x /usr/bin/fortune ) /usr/bin/fortune = freebsd-tips /usr/share/skel/dot.profile:if [ -x /usr/bin/fortune ] ; then = /usr/bin/fortune freebsd-tips ; fi $ fortune freebsd-tips If you need a reminder to leave your terminal, type "leave +hhmm" where "hhmm" represents in how many hours and minutes you need to leave. -- Dru fortune also still has flags for showing offensive entries and the like. I would like people=E2=80=99s opinion on which of the following two = paths we should take: 1) Complete removal of fortune and freebsd-tips, remove its usage from = the default .login/.profile files. 2) Reworking fortune(6) to remove the offensive fortune flag and make = freebsd-tips the default, possibly by symlinking it as = /usr/share/games/fortune/fortunes. Personally I lean towards the first option. Thanks, Benno.= From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 16:36:05 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E91B5DEF877 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 16:36:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-it0-x22f.google.com (mail-it0-x22f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::22f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B1AA3806B2 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 16:36:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: by mail-it0-x22f.google.com with SMTP id n134so7037339itg.3 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 08:36:05 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc; bh=jJUiJSCg9sh46zXnpeeLssaGjTH8gVHaxEipw/qxyoA=; b=b/ToG7IQ1xKc6kNXIACO2RBkzHBmqdSS7imybxadUouBGFUjbPzA4EhXZo7dcqXMxE 5rMt24APg7n6q1leoaYpf8k3y9XqBYCgCsUunDP8Yey5sbhODrdB02BN9DDAKj5kehvf EU5D2IawtKixK5z6jDhMSLrgQPB+XoCZ6psjPhmBRhFExfBUvePXra+sz1yrCxRsCvQ8 Iev5a24wAZO+m7F2tKouy5gKTT4KTSjwuXTtIRQTIOHpqMS3alLIpb9YuQeGFeHO4EFG 1ir3XLpBjnQrRkNR3jZJiDWhZxVI44kRMrOqcO5pybuS3kHkSBZn+ocIN0LnCnAh07wW tuZg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from :date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=jJUiJSCg9sh46zXnpeeLssaGjTH8gVHaxEipw/qxyoA=; b=i1ecX3Q1PCHz4oH1C4i8+fTtBe/deLjpuBFqsO1y4NihxYJQUFjAaw9Z8yKKIYH1oe ZPlbYyxR+ydVYqBUJ0ExNL+tXdVT4TfBp0pJUK8n2FdlaReBIRFuG6Yy2UcCaUmZMbp2 FghEzqaaU676iuPjzoIthil+YEoVdBf/cMFHwFEAT7y14FXnriIUtL9KNbbEvefMlIei W76tAgVeDCO+rzIwOXAvzgxzVTqbDpxsmU6SnIACOdSscg+hD68l04q0e2hOtpNHooNM mhtnjvn2zT9V9L7a4dVt/TJrYWVRwtPoPwpw+/ZV62AH/4C3lIkSic1fn4iCRhFNPAd0 jEkw== X-Gm-Message-State: AJaThX6k4zRprUfeZzBCOAvZnPRhuiaQ922QmJIa10mRTYI3v3j5TPq/ PACGz0wzTFlmQacT6l061M1nriCNXEYci7fSvp+4rw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGs4zMY2Vrx30JauNFgoQYVs829zDCCr9dFmVIFKrM0qXYeqqd62ZOedosZDfMbAzmRQ3be4HKeowMu9CjPXLbLnhFY= X-Received: by 10.36.133.135 with SMTP id r129mr8105749itd.69.1511368564730; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 08:36:04 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: wlosh@bsdimp.com Received: by 10.79.108.204 with HTTP; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 08:36:04 -0800 (PST) X-Originating-IP: [2603:300b:6:5100:6561:a5e8:a74:eef3] In-Reply-To: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> References: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> From: Warner Losh Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 09:36:04 -0700 X-Google-Sender-Auth: PrsRsVc_RV4qjtXqnQDiAC-50Y8 Message-ID: Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) To: Benno Rice Cc: "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.25 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 16:36:06 -0000 On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 9:29 AM, Benno Rice wrote: > Hello, all! > > With the removal of the fortune datfiles I think it=E2=80=99s time to hav= e a > discussion about fortune(6). > > fortune now defaults to using a fortune file that no longer exists: > > $ fortune > No fortunes found in /usr/share/games/fortune:/usr/ > local/share/games/fortune. > > fortune is still used in the default .login/.profile to show entries from > the still existing freebsd-tips: > > $ grep fortune /usr/share/skel/* > /usr/share/skel/dot.login:if ( -x /usr/bin/fortune ) /usr/bin/fortune > freebsd-tips > /usr/share/skel/dot.profile:if [ -x /usr/bin/fortune ] ; then > /usr/bin/fortune freebsd-tips ; fi > $ fortune freebsd-tips > If you need a reminder to leave your terminal, type "leave +hhmm" where > "hhmm" represents in how many hours and minutes you need to leave. > -- Dru > > fortune also still has flags for showing offensive entries and the like. > > I would like people=E2=80=99s opinion on which of the following two paths= we > should take: > > 1) Complete removal of fortune and freebsd-tips, remove its usage from th= e > default .login/.profile files. > > 2) Reworking fortune(6) to remove the offensive fortune flag and make > freebsd-tips the default, possibly by symlinking it as > /usr/share/games/fortune/fortunes. > > Personally I lean towards the first option. > (3) Do #1 except replace fortune with a single line shell script: #!/bin/sh to not break everybody's login scripts. Possibly with an optional echo "please remove fortune from .profile/.cshrc" I personally lean towards #2 though. I think the freebsd-tips are useful. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 16:51:27 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BA35DEFEB3; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 16:51:27 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jarmstrong@wi.rr.com) Received: from dnvrco-cmomta01.email.rr.com (dnvrco-outbound-snat.email.rr.com [107.14.73.225]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "Client", Issuer "CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7311612C4; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 16:51:26 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jarmstrong@wi.rr.com) Received: from PC91484 ([156.76.147.55]) by cmsmtp with ESMTPA id HYCYesPr6goKNHYCaetXCk; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 16:48:45 +0000 From: "Joshua Armstrong" To: , References: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> In-Reply-To: Subject: RE: The future of fortune(6) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 10:48:42 -0600 Message-ID: <003c01d363b1$c31ee760$495cb620$@wi.rr.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Content-Language: en-us Thread-Index: AQIiOTMoHYmzayQiy9HS1UDJyYWdbwGuI7qSonV/gnA= x-ms-exchange-organization-originalclientipaddress: 10.1.40.70 x-ms-exchange-organization-originalserveripaddress: fe80::e045:5fd4:4ac4:be2f%18 X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfLcWzE1wGJiaYTcf89+JKRIueEIkaV3fFZSFW4ACa7+YrA0Ckim/W7W+Cx4xcHiiNEm45fBLSoMRK/51GNRJRBeeduMF13YL3phCL2iJktlTBphBSVg0 /OKo81uAFCOV+uw3YW8oajw+J++tAyWBTUfqJBKfzhVUMT8cXaaFehm0nSBUiDWGn3fRGjYU2HfhMQ9FDqn/cuQQ/KfsxhCRyHU= X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 16:51:27 -0000 I also think the tips on login are helpful. I would be in favor of = making freebsd-tips the default cookie file (with the possibility of = supplying other files as well) and removing the offensive option. -----Original Message----- From: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org = [mailto:owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org] On Behalf Of Warner Losh Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 10:36 AM To: Benno Rice Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 9:29 AM, Benno Rice wrote: > Hello, all! > > With the removal of the fortune datfiles I think it=E2=80=99s time to = have a=20 > discussion about fortune(6). > > fortune now defaults to using a fortune file that no longer exists: > > $ fortune > No fortunes found in /usr/share/games/fortune:/usr/=20 > local/share/games/fortune. > > fortune is still used in the default .login/.profile to show entries=20 > from the still existing freebsd-tips: > > $ grep fortune /usr/share/skel/* > /usr/share/skel/dot.login:if ( -x /usr/bin/fortune ) /usr/bin/fortune=20 > freebsd-tips /usr/share/skel/dot.profile:if [ -x /usr/bin/fortune ] ;=20 > then /usr/bin/fortune freebsd-tips ; fi $ fortune freebsd-tips If you=20 > need a reminder to leave your terminal, type "leave +hhmm" where=20 > "hhmm" represents in how many hours and minutes you need to leave. > -- Dru > > fortune also still has flags for showing offensive entries and the = like. > > I would like people=E2=80=99s opinion on which of the following two = paths we=20 > should take: > > 1) Complete removal of fortune and freebsd-tips, remove its usage from = > the default .login/.profile files. > > 2) Reworking fortune(6) to remove the offensive fortune flag and make=20 > freebsd-tips the default, possibly by symlinking it as=20 > /usr/share/games/fortune/fortunes. > > Personally I lean towards the first option. > (3) Do #1 except replace fortune with a single line shell script: #!/bin/sh to not break everybody's login scripts. Possibly with an optional echo = "please remove fortune from .profile/.cshrc" I personally lean towards #2 though. I think the freebsd-tips are = useful. Warner _______________________________________________ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list = https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to = "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 17:19:12 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6573DF0629; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 17:19:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jarmstrong@wi.rr.com) Received: from dnvrco-cmomta01.email.rr.com (dnvrco-outbound-snat.email.rr.com [107.14.73.225]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "Client", Issuer "CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9BE182077; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 17:19:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jarmstrong@wi.rr.com) Received: from PC91484 ([156.76.147.55]) by cmsmtp with ESMTPA id HYg1ety3ygoKNHYg3etsAo; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 17:19:11 +0000 From: "Joshua Armstrong" To: , References: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> <003c01d363b1$c31ee760$495cb620$@wi.rr.com> In-Reply-To: <003c01d363b1$c31ee760$495cb620$@wi.rr.com> Subject: RE: The future of fortune(6) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 11:19:08 -0600 Message-ID: <004d01d363b6$031b12e0$095138a0$@wi.rr.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Content-Language: en-us Thread-Index: AQIiOTMoHYmzayQiy9HS1UDJyYWdbwGuI7qSAk9kafKiYwz9AA== x-ms-exchange-organization-originalclientipaddress: 10.1.40.70 x-ms-exchange-organization-originalserveripaddress: fe80::e045:5fd4:4ac4:be2f%18 X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfLIq5iMLRd75Kh/H4WM3ErR1TwxvseXgLLNmgo7dOFDRpEgmoilZjbLiNquCTmuBup10ug2I4nXKGxy4KHRV41xRlHEVv3r2EiDPogdSQgaF7i4Zi0cF NMIe9rMFqWDsewVz9sxPYP0/DNRqFKjS2DXYycm2/aWJ9uL/KXsX2dR3i0ce/AtNEdv/aFP5NR5A3c8+d8Jk3dg0dpnPlME8ju8= X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 17:19:12 -0000 -----Original Message----- From: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org = [mailto:owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org] On Behalf Of Warner Losh Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 10:36 AM To: Benno Rice Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 9:29 AM, Benno Rice wrote: > Hello, all! > > With the removal of the fortune datfiles I think it=E2=80=99s time to = have a=20 > discussion about fortune(6). > > fortune now defaults to using a fortune file that no longer exists: > > $ fortune > No fortunes found in /usr/share/games/fortune:/usr/=20 > local/share/games/fortune. > > fortune is still used in the default .login/.profile to show entries=20 > from the still existing freebsd-tips: > > $ grep fortune /usr/share/skel/* > /usr/share/skel/dot.login:if ( -x /usr/bin/fortune ) /usr/bin/fortune=20 > freebsd-tips /usr/share/skel/dot.profile:if [ -x /usr/bin/fortune ] ;=20 > then /usr/bin/fortune freebsd-tips ; fi $ fortune freebsd-tips If you=20 > need a reminder to leave your terminal, type "leave +hhmm" where=20 > "hhmm" represents in how many hours and minutes you need to leave. > -- Dru > > fortune also still has flags for showing offensive entries and the = like. > > I would like people=E2=80=99s opinion on which of the following two = paths we=20 > should take: > > 1) Complete removal of fortune and freebsd-tips, remove its usage from = > the default .login/.profile files. > > 2) Reworking fortune(6) to remove the offensive fortune flag and make=20 > freebsd-tips the default, possibly by symlinking it as=20 > /usr/share/games/fortune/fortunes. > > Personally I lean towards the first option. > >(3) Do #1 except replace fortune with a single line shell script: > >#!/bin/sh > >to not break everybody's login scripts. Possibly with an optional echo = "please remove fortune from .profile/.cshrc" > >I personally lean towards #2 though. I think the freebsd-tips are = useful. > >Warner I also think the tips on login are helpful. I would be in favor of = making freebsd-tips the default cookie file (with the possibility of = supplying other files as well) and removing the offensive option. Sorry for top-posting before. I had no idea that MS Outlook was so = terrible. :( -Joshua From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 17:35:44 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86172DF0B5E; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 17:35:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.21]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "troutmask", Issuer "troutmask" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4FE572B8D; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 17:35:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id vAMHZbHW054584 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Wed, 22 Nov 2017 09:35:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id vAMHZbkC054583; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 09:35:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 09:35:37 -0800 From: Steve Kargl To: Benno Rice Cc: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) Message-ID: <20171122173537.GA54395@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Reply-To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu References: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.7.2 (2016-11-26) X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 17:35:44 -0000 On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 08:29:46AM -0800, Benno Rice wrote: > > With the removal of the fortune datfiles I think it’s time to > have a discussion about fortune(6). There should have been a discussion before the removal, but your method prevented an inevitable bikeshed. > fortune now defaults to using a fortune file that no longer exists: When functionality is removed from src, a port is usually created. The datfiles should be available from ports/games/bsd-fortune. > $ fortune > No fortunes found in /usr/share/games/fortune:/usr/local/share/games/fortune. > > fortune is still used in the default .login/.profile to show entries > from the still existing freebsd-tips: > > $ grep fortune /usr/share/skel/* > /usr/share/skel/dot.login:if ( -x /usr/bin/fortune ) /usr/bin/fortune freebsd-tips > /usr/share/skel/dot.profile:if [ -x /usr/bin/fortune ] ; then /usr/bin/fortune freebsd-tips ; fi > $ fortune freebsd-tips > If you need a reminder to leave your terminal, type "leave +hhmm" where > "hhmm" represents in how many hours and minutes you need to leave. > -- Dru > > fortune also still has flags for showing offensive entries and the like. > What is offensive to one person may not offend another person. What if someone objects to quotes by Dru (sorry Dru looks like you got picked at random above). The above looks like an attack on people with memory loss issues (age discrimination?). Will you remove Dru's quotes? > I would like people’s opinion on which of the following two paths we > should take: > > 1) Complete removal of fortune and freebsd-tips, remove its usage from > the default .login/.profile files. Create ports/games/bsd-fortune. > 2) Reworking fortune(6) to remove the offensive fortune flag and > make freebsd-tips the default, possibly by symlinking it as > /usr/share/games/fortune/fortunes. 3) Restore the datfiles. Add a WITHOUT_FORTUNE knob and set it as the default. This allows an individual to tailor her system to meet her needs without having others force a politically correct revisionist history on them. This will be my one and only post in this bikeshed. Given the sudden removal of the datfiles without discussion. This appears to be a perfunctory discussion prior to you pursuing your own choice. -- Steve From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 17:44:07 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75569DF0FE0; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 17:44:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@komquats.com) Received: from smtp-out-so.shaw.ca (smtp-out-so.shaw.ca [64.59.136.138]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "Client", Issuer "CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 40C8333D8; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 17:44:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@komquats.com) Received: from spqr.komquats.com ([96.50.22.10]) by shaw.ca with SMTP id HZ40ep0Yxss4THZ41e6ADq; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 10:43:59 -0700 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.2 cv=JuuBlIwC c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=jvE2nwUzI0ECrNeyr98KWA==:117 a=jvE2nwUzI0ECrNeyr98KWA==:17 a=sC3jslCIGhcA:10 a=YxBL1-UpAAAA:8 a=6I5d2MoRAAAA:8 a=xN093wJcAAAA:8 a=kFUlH0OSliqkK97SE7sA:9 a=1D2nN8w8AgeiPhfc:21 a=YQSnSVPCnt1GEjgK:21 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=Hx19P-nHnUl7eOIfkkUA:9 a=qvPCYTaMt0conGjw:21 a=sLkkW3aE0IGMRdq0:21 a=K-7mZ4aJO_TMiZrF:21 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=Ia-lj3WSrqcvXOmTRaiG:22 a=IjZwj45LgO3ly-622nXo:22 a=gKyNpQLTuqoPBOiBd-sG:22 Received: from [10.168.3.117] (S0106d4ca6d8943b0.gv.shawcable.net [24.68.134.59]) by spqr.komquats.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 093811B3; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 09:43:55 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Cy Schubert Subject: RE: The future of fortune(6) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 09:43:04 -0800 To: Joshua Armstrong , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" Message-Id: <20171122174355.093811B3@spqr.komquats.com> X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfFJFUu3CoKjelzYzY7nOXH0j/MLcodO43g7m52eYzUw1uCk93FxJ9d24nzpWsfDK9inO11c6erBBv2tTp0q92wpKwGGNtBWjNAe1+jlXQS0e9FDEwGBk v74XG5JWXXmIsklqWReCO0JS+IeHZKjc3k5rRlxMVsvh3vnlwkmDFq1i9qsKdoaHDCSnS1RpKblvsvAqcDeW+SVP2NO0rhBFcT6FUQmDh6lLPEIWW+Mi/tVV 7tAoQCtpDnpCuYIW9DDc4A== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.25 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 17:44:07 -0000 I'm in favour of removing fortune entirely and replacing it with a shell sc= ript. IIRC there's at least one port that uses fortune. Making whatever cur= rently remains of fortune a new port to address any resulting fallout and P= OLA from its removal from base. --- Sent using a tiny phone keyboard. Apologies for any typos and autocorrect. Cy Schubert or --- -----Original Message----- From: Joshua Armstrong Sent: 22/11/2017 08:51 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: RE: The future of fortune(6) I also think the tips on login are helpful. I would be in favor of making f= reebsd-tips the default cookie file (with the possibility of supplying othe= r files as well) and removing the offensive option.=0A= =0A= -----Original Message-----=0A= From: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org [mailto:owner-freebsd-hackers@freeb= sd.org] On Behalf Of Warner Losh=0A= Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 10:36 AM=0A= To: Benno Rice=0A= Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; freebsd-arch@freebsd.org=0A= Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6)=0A= =0A= On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 9:29 AM, Benno Rice wrote:=0A= =0A= > Hello, all!=0A= >=0A= > With the removal of the fortune datfiles I think it=E2=80=99s time to hav= e a =0A= > discussion about fortune(6).=0A= >=0A= > fortune now defaults to using a fortune file that no longer exists:=0A= >=0A= > $ fortune=0A= > No fortunes found in /usr/share/games/fortune:/usr/ =0A= > local/share/games/fortune.=0A= >=0A= > fortune is still used in the default .login/.profile to show entries =0A= > from the still existing freebsd-tips:=0A= >=0A= > $ grep fortune /usr/share/skel/*=0A= > /usr/share/skel/dot.login:if ( -x /usr/bin/fortune ) /usr/bin/fortune =0A= > freebsd-tips /usr/share/skel/dot.profile:if [ -x /usr/bin/fortune ] ; =0A= > then /usr/bin/fortune freebsd-tips ; fi $ fortune freebsd-tips If you =0A= > need a reminder to leave your terminal, type "leave +hhmm" where =0A= > "hhmm" represents in how many hours and minutes you need to leave.=0A= > -- Dru =0A= >=0A= > fortune also still has flags for showing offensive entries and the like.= =0A= >=0A= > I would like people=E2=80=99s opinion on which of the following two paths= we =0A= > should take:=0A= >=0A= > 1) Complete removal of fortune and freebsd-tips, remove its usage from = =0A= > the default .login/.profile files.=0A= >=0A= > 2) Reworking fortune(6) to remove the offensive fortune flag and make =0A= > freebsd-tips the default, possibly by symlinking it as =0A= > /usr/share/games/fortune/fortunes.=0A= >=0A= > Personally I lean towards the first option.=0A= >=0A= =0A= (3) Do #1 except replace fortune with a single line shell script:=0A= =0A= #!/bin/sh=0A= =0A= to not break everybody's login scripts. Possibly with an optional echo "ple= ase remove fortune from .profile/.cshrc"=0A= =0A= I personally lean towards #2 though. I think the freebsd-tips are useful.= =0A= =0A= Warner=0A= _______________________________________________=0A= freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/= listinfo/freebsd-hackers=0A= To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org"= =0A= =0A= _______________________________________________=0A= freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list=0A= https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers=0A= To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org"= =0A= From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 18:51:00 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1B39DF29C6; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 18:51:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from eugen@grosbein.net) Received: from hz.grosbein.net (hz.grosbein.net [78.47.246.247]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "hz.grosbein.net", Issuer "hz.grosbein.net" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 87E5964BBD; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 18:51:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from eugen@grosbein.net) Received: from eg.sd.rdtc.ru (root@eg.sd.rdtc.ru [62.231.161.221] (may be forged)) by hz.grosbein.net (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id vAMIot6B017125 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:50:55 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from eugen@grosbein.net) X-Envelope-From: eugen@grosbein.net X-Envelope-To: benno@FreeBSD.org Received: from [10.58.0.4] ([10.58.0.4]) by eg.sd.rdtc.ru (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id vAMIop6N099756 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT); Thu, 23 Nov 2017 01:50:51 +0700 (+07) (envelope-from eugen@grosbein.net) Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) To: Benno Rice , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> From: Eugene Grosbein Message-ID: <5A15C706.5020909@grosbein.net> Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 01:50:46 +0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.7.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, score=2.2 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00, LOCAL_FROM, RDNS_NONE autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.1 X-Spam-Report: * -2.3 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% * [score: 0.0000] * 1.9 RDNS_NONE Delivered to internal network by a host with no rDNS * 2.6 LOCAL_FROM From my domains X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.1 (2015-04-28) on hz.grosbein.net X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 18:51:01 -0000 22.11.2017 23:29, Benno Rice wrote: > 1) Complete removal of fortune and freebsd-tips, remove its usage from the default .login/.profile files. > > 2) Reworking fortune(6) to remove the offensive fortune flag and make freebsd-tips the default, possibly by symlinking it as /usr/share/games/fortune/fortunes. > > Personally I lean towards the first option. Please leave fortune(6) alone and stop ruining useful enviforment removing utilities being here long time for no reason. You forgot that fortune(6) is not limited to files installed with base system but is very useful with custom local set of fortunes, too. And leave strfile(8) etc. intact for the same reason, please. Eugene Grosbein From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 19:22:46 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 31233DF3555; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:22:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from benno@FreeBSD.org) Received: from out4-smtp.messagingengine.com (out4-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.28]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 080B065F0A; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:22:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from benno@FreeBSD.org) Received: from compute1.internal (compute1.nyi.internal [10.202.2.41]) by mailout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3DB1B20CDF; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:22:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from frontend2 ([10.202.2.161]) by compute1.internal (MEProxy); Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:22:44 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:content-transfer-encoding:content-type :date:from:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references :subject:to:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm1; bh=HuuC+v wvY2jloAApGavsrMdnPzWqW6ybjD04CNua000=; b=Qoeabe/e7+hh7pWQgePDSp 4/ShbUfZVsPK5gzY9o+F9b8qHqbrCB3xdpeKdwykIKhqmBA6aTS0GElhaGP35+MU /eM8GJxxlyasWQO2unDkstv7DT0MofEEZve5kCqoGv9KaMQoxKMMdAgri7xz8AGJ eDdLaherg4mA1s2U7rFz/SqOEv969ouHC6XXOXdaWuMb2pY2u8UFhnZ9VYChLrzs iLqU2uN9YQNtNtVRK/ITQCRBmF6QkUE7Zu5BYMkgw0g8xcG3I/s5PrDZoKnHPxE+ qjV45TsnCMQfrn7hY2wkJXaKG785TrIy+zE3IeMVGNGsF2JdmVyiPeo4FUJefkVQ == X-ME-Sender: Received: from usxxscottdm1.corp.emc.com (c-71-231-121-16.hsd1.wa.comcast.net [71.231.121.16]) by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 9EEA124810; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:22:43 -0500 (EST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.1 \(3445.4.7\)) Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) From: Benno Rice In-Reply-To: <20171122173537.GA54395@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 11:22:41 -0800 Cc: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <64AB4D76-B239-4E49-8D30-CF6D5D5D88A4@FreeBSD.org> References: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> <20171122173537.GA54395@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.4.7) X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:22:46 -0000 > On Nov 22, 2017, at 09:35, Steve Kargl = wrote: >=20 > On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 08:29:46AM -0800, Benno Rice wrote: >>=20 >> With the removal of the fortune datfiles I think it=E2=80=99s time to >> have a discussion about fortune(6). >=20 > There should have been a discussion before the removal, but > your method prevented an inevitable bikeshed. You=E2=80=99re correct in that my intent was to avoid pointless = discussion. We=E2=80=99ve got bigger and more fun things to work on than = coming up with an editorial policy as to what is or isn=E2=80=99t = appropriate in the fortune datfiles. >> fortune now defaults to using a fortune file that no longer exists: >=20 > When functionality is removed from src, a port is usually created. > The datfiles should be available from ports/games/bsd-fortune. Feel free to create it. If someone else wants to take editorial = responsibility for those files I=E2=80=99m all for it. FreeBSD should = not be taking responsibility for them and I don=E2=80=99t wish to take = that responsibility either. >> $ fortune >> No fortunes found in = /usr/share/games/fortune:/usr/local/share/games/fortune. >>=20 >> fortune is still used in the default .login/.profile to show entries >> from the still existing freebsd-tips: >>=20 >> $ grep fortune /usr/share/skel/* >> /usr/share/skel/dot.login:if ( -x /usr/bin/fortune ) /usr/bin/fortune = freebsd-tips >> /usr/share/skel/dot.profile:if [ -x /usr/bin/fortune ] ; then = /usr/bin/fortune freebsd-tips ; fi >> $ fortune freebsd-tips >> If you need a reminder to leave your terminal, type "leave +hhmm" = where >> "hhmm" represents in how many hours and minutes you need to leave. >> -- Dru >>=20 >> fortune also still has flags for showing offensive entries and the = like. >>=20 >=20 > What is offensive to one person may not offend another person. What > if someone objects to quotes by Dru (sorry Dru looks like you got=20 > picked at random above). The above looks like an attack on people > with memory loss issues (age discrimination?). Will you remove Dru's > quotes? Nice try. The freebsd-tips collection has some useful stuff which is why = I put forward the idea of keeping it. Comments like this are exactly why = I got rid of everything else. >> I would like people=E2=80=99s opinion on which of the following two = paths we >> should take: >>=20 >> 1) Complete removal of fortune and freebsd-tips, remove its usage = from >> the default .login/.profile files. >=20 > Create ports/games/bsd-fortune. Be my guest. >> 2) Reworking fortune(6) to remove the offensive fortune flag and >> make freebsd-tips the default, possibly by symlinking it as >> /usr/share/games/fortune/fortunes. >=20 > 3) Restore the datfiles. Add a WITHOUT_FORTUNE knob and set it > as the default. This allows an individual to tailor her system > to meet her needs without having others force a politically=20 > correct revisionist history on them. Oh please. If you want the datfiles they=E2=80=99re there in history. If = you want to be the one distributing them, go ahead. I=E2=80=99m fairly = sure that the availability of quotes regarding, or by, Hitler or anyone = else has been diminished by a rounding error or less by us no longer = distributing the datfiles. FreeBSD is an operating system, not an = encyclopedia. > This will be my one and only post in this bikeshed. Given the=20 > sudden removal of the datfiles without discussion. This appears > to be a perfunctory discussion prior to you pursuing your own > choice. Think of me whatever you want, I=E2=80=99m not fussed. I=E2=80=99m = asking with 100% honest intentions what the community wants to do with = this tool. If the consensus is for retaining fortune for use with the = freebsd-tips datfile then I=E2=80=99m absolutely cool with that. I made a unilateral decision to remove a potential source of pointless = distraction. I could=E2=80=99ve unilaterally removed fortune entirely at = that point but I didn=E2=80=99t as the freebsd-tips aspect appears to = have actual utility and is something we can easily manage. The other = files weren=E2=80=99t. If they=E2=80=99re important to you, please feel = free to check out either r325781 (if you want the files) or r325095 (if = you want the files with the Hitler quotes) and maintain them yourself. Cheers, Benno.= From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 19:47:14 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7319BDF3CDF for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:47:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhb@freebsd.org) Received: from mail.baldwin.cx (bigwig.baldwin.cx [IPv6:2001:470:1f11:75::1]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-CAMELLIA256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4B74266B77 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:47:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhb@freebsd.org) Received: from ralph.baldwin.cx (c-73-231-226-104.hsd1.ca.comcast.net [73.231.226.104]) by mail.baldwin.cx (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id DE50C10A8BA; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:47:12 -0500 (EST) From: John Baldwin To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: Harald =?ISO-8859-1?Q?B=F6hm?= Subject: Re: ACPICA missing support for device I/O port ranges Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2017 15:38:30 -0800 Message-ID: <2497671.hb7Q7Esj6H@ralph.baldwin.cx> User-Agent: KMail/4.14.10 (FreeBSD/11.1-STABLE; KDE/4.14.30; amd64; ; ) In-Reply-To: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Greylist: Sender succeeded SMTP AUTH, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.4.3 (mail.baldwin.cx); Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:47:13 -0500 (EST) X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.99.2 at mail.baldwin.cx X-Virus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:47:14 -0000 On Saturday, November 18, 2017 06:52:54 PM Harald B=F6hm wrote: > Hi all, >=20 > I've been working on a device driver lately and was having trouble > allocating its resources using bus_alloc_resource_any(), although its= > I/O ports can be read from its _CRS. >=20 > This is the output of acpidump -td: >=20 > Device (GMUX) > { > ... > Name (_CRS, ResourceTemplate () // _CRS: Current Resource Settin= gs > { > IO (Decode16, > 0x0700, // Range Minimum > 0x07FF, // Range Maximum > 0x01, // Alignment > 0xFF, // Length > ) > }) > ... > } >=20 > After digging into the code in /sys/dev/acpica/acpi_resources.c I was= > able to find the problem. The function acpi_res_set_iorange(), which > seems to be responsible for calling bus_set_resource() is just a > function stub that prints a message that I/O ranges are not supported= . >=20 > static void > acpi_res_set_iorange(device_t dev, void *context, uint64_t low, > =09=09 uint64_t high, uint64_t length, uint64_t align) > { > struct acpi_res_context=09*cp =3D (struct acpi_res_context *)cont= ext; >=20 > if (cp =3D=3D NULL) > =09return; > device_printf(dev, "I/O range not supported\n"); > } >=20 > After adding a call to bus_set_resource() to that function, I was abl= e > to allocate the device's resources. >=20 > Does anyone know, why the function has not been implemented or why I/= O > ranges are not supported? IO ranges are not supposed to be in _CRS. An IO range is used for relo= catable resources and would be in _PRS to say "you can use I/O ports at address= es, A, B, or C". Specifically, the "Range" of an I/O port is the range of the= starting addresses. Normal I/O addresses in _CRS are set to a fixed ra= nge with the same values for Range Min and Range Max. For example: IO (Decode16, 0x0CF8, // Range Minimum 0x0CF8, // Range Maximum 0x01, // Alignment 0x08, // Length ) This says it uses the '8' (Length) I/O ports starting at 0xcf8 and that= they are fixed at 0xcf8 because the starting address has to be >=3D 0xcf8 (r= ange min) and <=3D 0xcf8 (range max). The _CRS blob from your dump says that it = wants to allocate 255 I/O ports with a starting address of 0x700, 0x701, 0x702, = 0x703, .... , 0x7fd, 0x7fe, or 0x7ff, but it doesn't tell us _which_ of those = ranges it is actually using (e.g. is it using 0x700 -> 0x7ff or is it using 0x= 780 -> 0x88f, etc.). Probably it's just a bug in your BIOS and it means to us= e 0x700 -> 0x7ff and the BIOS author doesn't understand what Range Maximu= m means. It is not the end address of the full I/O port addresses reserved, but = the maximum starting address (I agree this is a bit odd, but this is what t= he spec says). Assuming the BIOS is buggy, we can add a hack for iorange that adds the= resource if max =3D=3D min + length and emit a warning under bootverbos= e about the BIOS being buggy. --=20 John Baldwin From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 19:47:15 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A300DF3CE2 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:47:15 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhb@freebsd.org) Received: from mail.baldwin.cx (bigwig.baldwin.cx [IPv6:2001:470:1f11:75::1]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-CAMELLIA256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2772566B78 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:47:15 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhb@freebsd.org) Received: from ralph.baldwin.cx (c-73-231-226-104.hsd1.ca.comcast.net [73.231.226.104]) by mail.baldwin.cx (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3774110A8BC; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:47:14 -0500 (EST) From: John Baldwin To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: hw.pci.realloc_bars Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2017 15:14:57 -0800 Message-ID: <1942153.DdtJSvPgjR@ralph.baldwin.cx> User-Agent: KMail/4.14.10 (FreeBSD/11.1-STABLE; KDE/4.14.30; amd64; ; ) In-Reply-To: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" X-Greylist: Sender succeeded SMTP AUTH, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.4.3 (mail.baldwin.cx); Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:47:14 -0500 (EST) X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.99.2 at mail.baldwin.cx X-Virus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:47:15 -0000 On Thursday, October 26, 2017 02:20:23 PM Bob Bishop wrote: > Hi, >=20 > hw.pci.realloc_bars controls a mechanism that repositions a PCI memor= y resource if it can=E2=80=99t be successfully allocated at the default= place. >=20 > It=E2=80=99s disabled by default - anyone know why? >=20 > Seems to me that because it only comes into play in an error case it = would be harmless to have it enabled by default. That would have avoide= d a recent case where installation on the HPE Gen 10 microserver is tri= cky because its VGA suffers from this problem. >=20 > Thoughts? It is disabled by default because it is risky. A correct implementatio= n would first pre-reserve as many firmware/BIOS-assigned ranges as possib= le and only then fallback to allocating resources from scratch. Right now= it tries to realloc as soon as it fails which is before we've reserved firmware-assigned resources of other devices in the system. --=20 John Baldwin From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 20:01:26 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA64EDF4228 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 20:01:26 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lidl@FreeBSD.org) Received: from hydra.pix.net (hydra.pix.net [IPv6:2001:470:e254::4]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mail.pix.net", Issuer "Pix.Com Technologies LLC CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B9ADF67675 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 20:01:26 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lidl@FreeBSD.org) Received: from torb.pix.net ([IPv6:2001:470:e254:11:adf5:d620:5be7:cf13]) (authenticated bits=0) by hydra.pix.net (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPA id vAMK1H7A054743; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 15:01:25 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lidl@FreeBSD.org) X-Authentication-Warning: hydra.pix.net: Host [IPv6:2001:470:e254:11:adf5:d620:5be7:cf13] claimed to be torb.pix.net Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> From: Kurt Lidl Reply-To: lidl@FreeBSD.org Message-ID: <6ba033f3-82ce-da58-1720-623fed180479@FreeBSD.org> Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 15:01:17 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.12; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 20:01:27 -0000 On 11/22/17 11:29 AM, Benno Rice wrote: > I would like people’s opinion on which of the following two paths we should take: > > 1) Complete removal of fortune and freebsd-tips, remove its usage from the default .login/.profile files. > > 2) Reworking fortune(6) to remove the offensive fortune flag and make freebsd-tips the default, possibly by symlinking it as /usr/share/games/fortune/fortunes. Of these options, only #2 is approximately correct. I think just leaving the code as-is, and symlinking the freebsd-tips to be the default fortune datafile is the correct course of action. Removing the offensive flag handling dictates policy towards users of the program. If someone wants to add their own offensive datafile to their system, the code ought to allow them to select it. -Kurt From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 20:30:34 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D04BDF4CE4 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 20:30:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from eugen@grosbein.net) Received: from hz.grosbein.net (hz.grosbein.net [78.47.246.247]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "hz.grosbein.net", Issuer "hz.grosbein.net" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C8CE7689AF; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 20:30:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from eugen@grosbein.net) Received: from eg.sd.rdtc.ru (root@eg.sd.rdtc.ru [62.231.161.221] (may be forged)) by hz.grosbein.net (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id vAMKUSZm017755 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Wed, 22 Nov 2017 21:30:29 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from eugen@grosbein.net) X-Envelope-From: eugen@grosbein.net X-Envelope-To: lidl@FreeBSD.org Received: from [10.58.0.4] ([10.58.0.4]) by eg.sd.rdtc.ru (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id vAMKUP5B028741 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT); Thu, 23 Nov 2017 03:30:25 +0700 (+07) (envelope-from eugen@grosbein.net) Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) To: lidl@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> <6ba033f3-82ce-da58-1720-623fed180479@FreeBSD.org> From: Eugene Grosbein Message-ID: <5A15DE5C.1010206@grosbein.net> Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 03:30:20 +0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.7.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <6ba033f3-82ce-da58-1720-623fed180479@FreeBSD.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, score=2.2 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00, LOCAL_FROM, RDNS_NONE autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.1 X-Spam-Report: * -2.3 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% * [score: 0.0000] * 1.9 RDNS_NONE Delivered to internal network by a host with no rDNS * 2.6 LOCAL_FROM From my domains X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.1 (2015-04-28) on hz.grosbein.net X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 20:30:34 -0000 23.11.2017 3:01, Kurt Lidl wrote: > I think just leaving the code as-is, and symlinking the freebsd-tips to > be the default fortune datafile is the correct course of action. > > Removing the offensive flag handling dictates policy towards users > of the program. If someone wants to add their own offensive datafile > to their system, the code ought to allow them to select it. +1 Don't fix what ain't broken. From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 20:34:18 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD4EBDF51C2; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 20:34:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from peter@wemm.org) Received: from smtp2.wemm.org (smtp2.wemm.org [IPv6:2001:470:67:39d::78]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "smtp2.wemm.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 96DD968E27; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 20:34:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from peter@wemm.org) Received: from overcee.wemm.org (canning.wemm.org [192.203.228.65]) by smtp2.wemm.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D724C4EE; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 12:34:12 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=wemm.org; s=m20140428; t=1511382852; bh=3gYGk9dcYlI0zfWWdRmVQe7/cmVER4ymWGTSDlG3/Jw=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:In-Reply-To:References; b=MyXFbb52zCiJ/4SRtZv8UeqVU75qkUufA1/+kJbdmYJarefJVrfX/EqJPUh3K7+fa Y+zNdNrZBpJwpe/dbcojBApD06/6Lys4O76HQREM3+aaQ1DLojESkc+R9dvdCyL46h a92qkHFaRHnqvnycUGGkMxOdfpYIe9IXo5f6oAkU= From: Peter Wemm To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Cc: Benno Rice , sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 12:34:07 -0800 Message-ID: <12703055.AoRsRdyBz0@overcee.wemm.org> User-Agent: KMail/4.14.10 (FreeBSD/12.0-CURRENT; KDE/4.14.30; amd64; ; ) In-Reply-To: <64AB4D76-B239-4E49-8D30-CF6D5D5D88A4@FreeBSD.org> References: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> <20171122173537.GA54395@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <64AB4D76-B239-4E49-8D30-CF6D5D5D88A4@FreeBSD.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="nextPart1886876.OTk7jl52Bl"; micalg="pgp-sha256"; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 20:36:01 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 20:34:18 -0000 --nextPart1886876.OTk7jl52Bl Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" On Wednesday, November 22, 2017 11:22:41 AM Benno Rice wrote: > > On Nov 22, 2017, at 09:35, Steve Kargl > > wrote:>=20 > > When functionality is removed from src, a port is usually created. > > The datfiles should be available from ports/games/bsd-fortune. >=20 > Feel free to create it. If someone else wants to take editorial > responsibility for those files I=E2=80=99m all for it. FreeBSD should= not be taking > responsibility for them and I don=E2=80=99t wish to take that respons= ibility > either. If I add up the person-hours expended on fortune related drama over the= 22=20 years I've been involved in the project then I quickly come to the conc= lusion=20 that it should go. For as long as I can remember, it has been *the* dr= ama=20 lightning rod for the project. With regret, I'm in the 'move to ports' camp on this. The whole thing,= =20 including tips. However, I'd be in favor of something like having freebsd-tips be offer= ed as a=20 default post-install package in the installer. =2D-=20 Peter Wemm - peter@wemm.org; peter@FreeBSD.org; peter@yahoo-inc.com; KI= 6FJV UTF-8: for when a ' or ... just won\342\200\231t do\342\200\246 --nextPart1886876.OTk7jl52Bl Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part. Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAABCAAdFiEEBgrA0Vr/vfNVuPoUNdaXCeyAngQFAloV3z8ACgkQNdaXCeyA ngRUdAf/dTYKS/gwPptZUm41+yH9UVr+hXO76geAfy6Zw5jpeYv6PTXMYobVgr0Z 15q1z/C9vG4dA3vv9tuaaHN8/B2FKHBYO1I3mC0GYP6FZZXJYQsR/UvCS9vuYOWQ vBr/Py+sVDBVFYgArKQ8BaMAkq7OtnLnxzowP/2XbkZSpNB5D9iSKlPBFixyDgYF YX2AXjsY+jBtGAesBPogoaIcB4lUzJOquOaArGnx/nFMg6CRUxplAD4wM1L9mjgL wbxKY/xH55YptsK2p+clIawyNRNWXaUxgJR0a41P7KhUKGfXwRmuhii/7NtTHTcj aN3yZMwq+ztVbvQUDv5Wxq/8odB6EA== =foVv -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --nextPart1886876.OTk7jl52Bl-- From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 21:34:21 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 028FFDF65C0; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 21:34:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from linimon@lonesome.com) Received: from mail.soaustin.net (mail.soaustin.net [192.108.105.60]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mail.soaustin.net", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D008E6B2FB; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 21:34:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from linimon@lonesome.com) Received: from lonesome.com (bones.soaustin.net [192.108.105.22]) by mail.soaustin.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 81F571212; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 15:34:13 -0600 (CST) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 15:34:12 -0600 From: Mark Linimon To: Benno Rice Cc: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) Message-ID: <20171122213411.GA32396@lonesome.com> References: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.23 (2014-03-12) X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 22:00:17 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 21:34:21 -0000 Blue. mcl From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed Nov 22 23:31:04 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93530DF8279 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 23:31:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jim@netgate.com) Received: from mail-oi0-x22f.google.com (mail-oi0-x22f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4003:c06::22f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 64A7F6E7CA for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 23:31:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jim@netgate.com) Received: by mail-oi0-x22f.google.com with SMTP id h81so12076471oib.8 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 15:31:04 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=netgate.com; s=google; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=fum0wY7gcT+YBAVO0VJKmTHarx3Ha+k/uguX02njkP4=; b=CucYwutT5JDv9vF0z4UJtIS1tT9SCqzDk7MYGK3qFc80bqB7BFzFhJgmIXTOAMTTLa t68UPjRGp3sHQvxQezZggbsoUm8ffmJToTSVIUvtApTu7aFQK+LtQGMCEJIhTI7qtFZ/ xjcP+TvA5l3tPNU/+PZcqWzAYk+lT0D6D4FoQ= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=fum0wY7gcT+YBAVO0VJKmTHarx3Ha+k/uguX02njkP4=; b=Cmgj70vaeKMke82EjZgmnSJHvn/1w2I9KTn+igyKiBo4MYB6Gf26x8DYPGqBztMXIw w60u1LQFORftym2rq5pQcrzPoUeJuU0fjC071iom+s12MeK2V8KO/r2qjX3+izC7Lefd M5tLORkBrCrui6eX1JktZp10PJK9s+1Iw2w2ywMA65gO+dGpR0QRkUiVUDjg4M5EAC7e maXSxWwHe7xgXkfY5+B8m1sajSVpAxKH7qNyb5uU6zEC40tTEhKbyltmwa0pEsTyj9DK EJin/xcycYXI/7NMIi0gx4ac34v6HBaP2/o3bU48EGJjmRyfa67BcI4i/OOcejEQiwJi bZog== X-Gm-Message-State: AJaThX4AL7qqaHAiThjF3jwgAfVBxrFWh/qSGRR9d41aTUxev+BfxsJO Q1wqRXRwKLAEMggIvsp7FdrKfg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGs4zMZDjLCwEtjmWciIvEGvDeKEqx9Extd1r3nT5+jffb5jLxiwUgwRq0vcP9HJlQj3McPAuz1XZw== X-Received: by 10.202.117.198 with SMTP id q189mr4865331oic.90.1511393463614; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 15:31:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from [172.27.33.51] ([208.123.73.28]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id p8sm7007713oif.22.2017.11.22.15.31.02 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 22 Nov 2017 15:31:03 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.1 \(3445.4.7\)) Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) From: Jim Thompson In-Reply-To: <20171122213411.GA32396@lonesome.com> Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 17:31:02 -0600 Cc: Benno Rice , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <26410955-6888-42AE-BF95-678B46E4B49C@netgate.com> References: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> <20171122213411.GA32396@lonesome.com> To: Mark Linimon X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.4.7) X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 23:31:04 -0000 Yes, but=E2=80=A6 which blue? > On Nov 22, 2017, at 3:34 PM, Mark Linimon = wrote: >=20 > Blue. >=20 > mcl > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > To unsubscribe, send any mail to = "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 01:26:57 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F4B5DFB42B; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 01:26:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from araujobsdport@gmail.com) Received: from mail-lf0-x242.google.com (mail-lf0-x242.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4010:c07::242]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E4FD773CFA; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 01:26:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from araujobsdport@gmail.com) Received: by mail-lf0-x242.google.com with SMTP id k66so20285730lfg.3; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 17:26:56 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:reply-to:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc; bh=WDXSeDIBzYwZ+IBsD1hA564B92mCf59LTtDAAmJsfT8=; b=WWR5LB3NJcHGbPN3keoUX4NgWTh4OhKknFOTLWZs68uHrlS6ZH3JIFEsLn0ycm7xHm UK28LrrXPo7j6bHobxk3yFH/Tu6wfh6taQwZV9LWLq+X1xwFjla154ylpKxhEwW+xbT/ ZUmC1T96rJgxkOA2MTLrXnTTc6fuqe1+3//KnALntYUM3iWJGiVx8+YFmXECxqRkbGK2 xQmJbPjkFkJhzJhDjoMPyvqritk2Jb0Zc+lgSkQckogDtotTkvpm76183VJjfrIrl2rf joouhKZxmW8LhrEYI9J7JxIlh4IhgQr/qv62az2Cnc0lZmyOmgA201SrH1ZNzv2oMv+1 3HAw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:reply-to:in-reply-to:references :from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=WDXSeDIBzYwZ+IBsD1hA564B92mCf59LTtDAAmJsfT8=; b=bX/sv5baB/ZFHBuvMgNcLgzd0qqSL0d89CZHRMKFRqfWuFkEaXF/UhKzbPSpa03dfl wf4Cd/BGFpwdUHCtlpdlSpcOl2ArHbi3pgUcH4329ZMk2U5aWfbV6DS63G2oToDGDD/w J8P3IpHwswqTNNZoLeCe1+1HyOabTqNnohcTvCkwI/7+4YriBsPIdsyuW62YmXipjqS4 3mEKA8RDe7dwu7GSy5Jq8rT73yjPLiKzufCqVEc8lPOigEKs2yJsoqWLDQ3IKRTT9Tgm F6MeQvbBUfZ+bUId8SS52V5QyKs6SK3IPMB7wvxTWUWqyMHdttc27qBV4gnnnZH5n6Ng uAEw== X-Gm-Message-State: AJaThX7qD3u308h9ZTgcJ1MwCF2DK4dma0QuKV6CETbq4zBhNMBxqZMI amJa9ZzqnR1zEtMNGi+Wu3yvJQxxKgO6NpuUpTLMjQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGs4zMZxD1d8nzSb7UsW1JHSMArOq7g/6I3QjBOTQAxVqLY7mshMvfycvSoYOrJ4NiMdr0zZ5GK5jyCeQglHvEcIRCY= X-Received: by 10.46.64.194 with SMTP id r63mr7791471lje.112.1511400413629; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 17:26:53 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.25.168.197 with HTTP; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 17:26:52 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: araujo@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <26410955-6888-42AE-BF95-678B46E4B49C@netgate.com> References: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> <20171122213411.GA32396@lonesome.com> <26410955-6888-42AE-BF95-678B46E4B49C@netgate.com> From: Marcelo Araujo Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 09:26:52 +0800 Message-ID: Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) To: Jim Thompson Cc: Mark Linimon , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, Benno Rice , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.25 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 01:26:57 -0000 2017-11-23 7:31 GMT+08:00 Jim Thompson : > Yes, but=E2=80=A6 which blue? > > > On Nov 22, 2017, at 3:34 PM, Mark Linimon wrote: > > > > Blue. > +1 for Yellow! Everyday FreeBSD and its community manages to go to a new level. Impressive= ! Anyway, Yellow is the true color. > > > > mcl > > _______________________________________________ > > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@ > freebsd.org" > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org= " > --=20 --=20 Marcelo Araujo (__)araujo@FreeBSD.org \\\'',)http://www.FreeBSD.org \/ \ ^ Power To Server. .\. /_) From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 02:23:35 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10C77DB89DF; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 02:23:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bsd-lists@BSDforge.com) Received: from udns.ultimatedns.net (static-24-113-41-81.wavecable.com [24.113.41.81]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C160975F6A; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 02:23:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bsd-lists@BSDforge.com) Received: from udns.ultimatedns.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by udns.ultimatedns.net (8.14.9/8.14.9) with ESMTP id vAN2NaMP099249; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 18:23:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bsd-lists@BSDforge.com) X-Mailer: Cypht MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: , In-Reply-To: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> From: "Chris H" Reply-To: bsd-lists@BSDforge.com To: "Benno Rice" Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 18:23:42 -0800 Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 02:23:35 -0000 On Wed, 22 Nov 2017 08:29:46 -0800 "Benno Rice" said > Hello, all! >=20 > With the removal of the fortune datfiles I think it=E2=80=99s time to hav= e a > discussion about fortune(6)=2E >=20 > fortune now defaults to using a fortune file that no longer exists: >=20 > $ fortune > No fortunes found in > /usr/share/games/fortune:/usr/local/share/games/fortune=2E >=20 > fortune is still used in the default =2Elogin/=2Eprofile to show entries from= the > still existing freebsd-tips: >=20 > $ grep fortune /usr/share/skel/* > /usr/share/skel/dot=2Elogin:if ( -x /usr/bin/fortune ) /usr/bin/fortune > freebsd-tips > /usr/share/skel/dot=2Eprofile:if [ -x /usr/bin/fortune ] ; then > /usr/bin/fortune freebsd-tips ; fi > $ fortune freebsd-tips > If you need a reminder to leave your terminal, type "leave +hhmm" where > "hhmm" represents in how many hours and minutes you need to leave=2E > =09=09-- Dru >=20 > fortune also still has flags for showing offensive entries and the like=2E >=20 > I would like people=E2=80=99s opinion on which of the following two paths= we should > take: >=20 > 1) Complete removal of fortune and freebsd-tips, remove its usage from th= e > default =2Elogin/=2Eprofile files=2E >=20 > 2) Reworking fortune(6) to remove the offensive fortune flag and make > freebsd-tips the default, possibly by symlinking it as > /usr/share/games/fortune/fortunes=2E >=20 > Personally I lean towards the first option=2E HooWee! Here we go again=2E=2E=2E :) IMHO There is no reason to have removed the original fortune(6)=2E Yes=2E There *were* some (potentially) offensive fortunes=2E *But* you had to make a conscious decision to 1) turn that option on=2E 2) accepting the knowledge that they *may* be offensive=2E Why was there *ever* an issue?! I pick up a hammer, and place my hand on the kitchen counter=2E I then raise the hammer=2E Taking careful aim, to ensure that when I bring the hammer down swiftly=2E It will strike my hand=2E I've done so *knowing* the outcome=2E See any similarities? If it's to (hopefully) return, and given the proposed option(s)=2E I'd like to suggest that fortune be re-instated, using FreeBSD tips as the default=2E *But* with the option to re-instate the "traditional/classic" fort= une(s)=2E Doesn't that make for a win-win situation? :) Thanks for listening=2E :) --Chris >=20 > Thanks, > =09Benno=2E > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-hackers@freebsd=2Eorg mailing list > https://lists=2Efreebsd=2Eorg/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd=2Eorg= " From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 02:53:17 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C62ADBA57B; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 02:53:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bsd-lists@BSDforge.com) Received: from udns.ultimatedns.net (static-24-113-41-81.wavecable.com [24.113.41.81]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1BB5977367; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 02:53:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bsd-lists@BSDforge.com) Received: from udns.ultimatedns.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by udns.ultimatedns.net (8.14.9/8.14.9) with ESMTP id vAN2rIxs005424; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 18:53:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bsd-lists@BSDforge.com) X-Mailer: Cypht MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: , , In-Reply-To: <64AB4D76-B239-4E49-8D30-CF6D5D5D88A4@FreeBSD.org> From: "Chris H" Reply-To: bsd-lists@BSDforge.com To: "Benno Rice" Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 18:53:24 -0800 Message-Id: <5f4a62166aeb423a406a902bdc7078bc@udns.ultimatedns.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 02:53:17 -0000 On Wed, 22 Nov 2017 11:22:41 -0800 "Benno Rice" said > > On Nov 22, 2017, at 09:35, Steve Kargl > > wrote: > >=20 > > On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 08:29:46AM -0800, Benno Rice wrote: > >>=20 > >> With the removal of the fortune datfiles I think it=E2=80=99s time to > >> have a discussion about fortune(6)=2E > >=20 > > There should have been a discussion before the removal, but > > your method prevented an inevitable bikeshed=2E >=20 > You=E2=80=99re correct in that my intent was to avoid pointless discussio= n=2E We=E2=80=99ve > got bigger and more fun things to work on than coming up with an editoria= l > policy as to what is or isn=E2=80=99t appropriate in the fortune datfiles= =2E >=20 > >> fortune now defaults to using a fortune file that no longer exists: > >=20 > > When functionality is removed from src, a port is usually created=2E > > The datfiles should be available from ports/games/bsd-fortune=2E >=20 > Feel free to create it=2E If someone else wants to take editorial > responsibility for those files I=E2=80=99m all for it=2E FreeBSD should not= be taking > responsibility for them and I don=E2=80=99t wish to take that responsibil= ity > either=2E >=20 > >> $ fortune > >> No fortunes found in > > /usr/share/games/fortune:/usr/local/share/games/fortune=2E > >>=20 > >> fortune is still used in the default =2Elogin/=2Eprofile to show entries > >> from the still existing freebsd-tips: > >>=20 > >> $ grep fortune /usr/share/skel/* > >> /usr/share/skel/dot=2Elogin:if ( -x /usr/bin/fortune ) /usr/bin/fortune > > freebsd-tips > >> /usr/share/skel/dot=2Eprofile:if [ -x /usr/bin/fortune ] ; then > > /usr/bin/fortune freebsd-tips ; fi > >> $ fortune freebsd-tips > >> If you need a reminder to leave your terminal, type "leave +hhmm" wher= e > >> "hhmm" represents in how many hours and minutes you need to leave=2E > >> =09=09-- Dru > >>=20 > >> fortune also still has flags for showing offensive entries and the lik= e=2E > >>=20 > >=20 > > What is offensive to one person may not offend another person=2E What > > if someone objects to quotes by Dru (sorry Dru looks like you got=20 > > picked at random above)=2E The above looks like an attack on people > > with memory loss issues (age discrimination?)=2E Will you remove Dru's > > quotes? >=20 > Nice try=2E The freebsd-tips collection has some useful stuff which is why = I > put forward the idea of keeping it=2E Comments like this are exactly why I = got > rid of everything else=2E >=20 > >> I would like people=E2=80=99s opinion on which of the following two pa= ths we > >> should take: > >>=20 > >> 1) Complete removal of fortune and freebsd-tips, remove its usage from > >> the default =2Elogin/=2Eprofile files=2E > >=20 > > Create ports/games/bsd-fortune=2E >=20 > Be my guest=2E >=20 > >> 2) Reworking fortune(6) to remove the offensive fortune flag and > >> make freebsd-tips the default, possibly by symlinking it as > >> /usr/share/games/fortune/fortunes=2E > >=20 > > 3) Restore the datfiles=2E Add a WITHOUT_FORTUNE knob and set it > > as the default=2E This allows an individual to tailor her system > > to meet her needs without having others force a politically=20 > > correct revisionist history on them=2E >=20 > Oh please=2E If you want the datfiles they=E2=80=99re there in history=2E If = you want > to be the one distributing them, go ahead=2E I=E2=80=99m fairly sure that t= he > availability of quotes regarding, or by, Hitler or anyone else has been > diminished by a rounding error or less by us no longer distributing the > datfiles=2E FreeBSD is an operating system, not an encyclopedia=2E >=20 > > This will be my one and only post in this bikeshed=2E Given the=20 > > sudden removal of the datfiles without discussion=2E This appears > > to be a perfunctory discussion prior to you pursuing your own > > choice=2E >=20 > Think of me whatever you want, I=E2=80=99m not fussed=2E I=E2=80=99m asking= with 100% > honest intentions what the community wants to do with this tool=2E If the > consensus is for retaining fortune for use with the freebsd-tips datfile = then > I=E2=80=99m absolutely cool with that=2E >=20 > I made a unilateral decision to remove a potential source of pointless > distraction=2E I could=E2=80=99ve unilaterally removed fortune entirely at = that point > but I didn=E2=80=99t as the freebsd-tips aspect appears to have actual ut= ility and > is something we can easily manage=2E The other files weren=E2=80=99t=2E If this is about removing things from FreeBSD that don't offer/provide "uti= lity"=2E Than you *should* have removed /usr/games entirely=2E Let's *actually* be "completely honest" about all this=2E I think I'm done here=2E Sorry=2E :( > If they=E2=80=99re > important to you, please feel free to check out either r325781 (if you wa= nt > the files) or r325095 (if you want the files with the Hitler quotes) and > maintain them yourself=2E >=20 > Cheers, > =09Benno=2E --Chris From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 02:57:42 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07B9DDBA8D9 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 02:57:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@johnea.net) Received: from mail.johnea.net (johnea.net [70.167.123.7]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-CAMELLIA256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E450E77634 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 02:57:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@johnea.net) Received: from [192.168.100.192] (w520.johnea.net [192.168.100.192]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.johnea.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 267565F23845 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 18:48:49 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: From: freebsd@johnea.net Message-ID: Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 18:48:48 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.7.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 02:57:42 -0000 On 2017-11-22 18:23, Chris H wrote: > On Wed, 22 Nov 2017 08:29:46 -0800 "Benno Rice" said >> With the removal of the fortune datfiles I think it’s time to have a >> discussion about fortune(6). > I'd like to suggest that fortune be re-instated, using FreeBSD tips as the > default. I also think "traditional/classic" fortune(s) should be left in base, with the .login/.profile default set to freebsd-tips. Every day the logwatch email provides me with output from fortune. Over the years I've learned of many interesting people, quotes and events this way. I've never been presented output that is even marginally offensive. (actually, I've seen much more offensive content on this mailing list 8-) If fortune is eliminated from base, IMHO this will be a loss for FreeBSD. john From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 03:04:07 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75464DBB149 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 03:04:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from db@db.net) Received: from diana.db.net (unknown [IPv6:2620:64:0:1:223:7dff:fea2:c8f2]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64379780C0 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 03:04:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from db@db.net) Received: from night.db.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by diana.db.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16BAB2AA368; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:57:29 -0700 (MST) Received: by night.db.net (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 0622439813; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 22:04:03 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 22:04:02 -0500 From: Diane Bruce To: freebsd@johnea.net Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) Message-ID: <20171123030402.GA79380@night.db.net> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.9.1 (2017-09-22) X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 03:04:07 -0000 On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 06:48:48PM -0800, freebsd@johnea.net wrote: > On 2017-11-22 18:23, Chris H wrote: > > On Wed, 22 Nov 2017 08:29:46 -0800 "Benno Rice" said > > >> With the removal of the fortune datfiles I think it’s time to have a > >> discussion about fortune(6). > > > I'd like to suggest that fortune be re-instated, using FreeBSD tips as the > > default. Please no. No no and no. This is the first irritation I remove when I get a new system up. Next thing I know you'all will give me CLIPPY flashbacks. And pink polka dots with blue background. Ooooooo la-la!! - Diane -- - db@FreeBSD.org db@db.net http://www.db.net/~db From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 06:12:15 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5CD7DDE3DF for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 06:12:15 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markmi@dsl-only.net) Received: from asp.reflexion.net (outbound-mail-210-132.reflexion.net [208.70.210.132]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 49EF97DE21 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 06:12:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markmi@dsl-only.net) Received: (qmail 26309 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2017 06:12:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail-cs-01.app.dca.reflexion.local) (10.81.19.1) by 0 (rfx-qmail) with SMTP; 23 Nov 2017 06:12:08 -0000 Received: by mail-cs-01.app.dca.reflexion.local (Reflexion email security v8.40.3) with SMTP; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 01:12:08 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 3826 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2017 06:12:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO iron2.pdx.net) (69.64.224.71) by 0 (rfx-qmail) with (AES256-SHA encrypted) SMTP; 23 Nov 2017 06:12:07 -0000 Received: from [192.168.1.25] (c-76-115-7-162.hsd1.or.comcast.net [76.115.7.162]) by iron2.pdx.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 41554EC814E; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 22:12:07 -0800 (PST) From: Mark Millard Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\)) Subject: Does https://www.freebsd.org/doc/handbook/disks-growing.html need updates because of cylinder checksums (ufs cotnext)? Message-Id: <1EC3F4AE-C263-4713-B142-412A902C9EC3@dsl-only.net> Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 22:12:06 -0800 To: FreeBSD Current , freebsd-hackers X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273) X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 06:12:15 -0000 After following the procedure in: https://www.freebsd.org/doc/handbook/disks-growing.html to shrink a swap partition and grow a ufs file system I'm now getting cylinder checksum failure notices. Should the directions be updated in some way? Or should growfs be updating something that is is not now updating? === Mark Millard markmi at dsl-only.net From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 06:30:53 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF8C6DDEDF9 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 06:30:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-it0-x231.google.com (mail-it0-x231.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::231]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 761117E5C5 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 06:30:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: by mail-it0-x231.google.com with SMTP id x13so8940067iti.4 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 22:30:53 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc; bh=ufiMhObHPGfLR+S+m7x/sCB+itGUX0Rk1OIUUkkW77E=; b=xpYqsOD9JzhU53bofvgk+FvB0YPQL8l3ktTJoZFQVLfyvinC/OMRBurCdU0w19aIgG xipVhyYJjFd/q9WShX1BrGj4tsVYBZ90C/0cjiT4nZdivB3DRxwZWb8t572BcBy53IRa Rk85fn9xc2k0OtnH79ei39WIVJwXJq4BNpYtlNX3wXl9s2fc9j/JAucgipy8ooLXsAOf iiDKd8WZp7NobSXOZCtkLbBDmZINUWTjND5CcTTeC9oIsMEBwDezBbOgpvjnorg4ttpO moxyBckclxIvk59Sc/5OBpR1UrFEcgUJEWfpgBHPTJvjBwqoR/L/001mWawvxRhnzYOL F/cw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from :date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=ufiMhObHPGfLR+S+m7x/sCB+itGUX0Rk1OIUUkkW77E=; b=OgmLfncFv8CiRRxOZ98qTdTXKLzewgzXj8O2XMP3KkZGCMAiPlJxjL8zbWHLGpcl6B Z+Gmwp3YddT7kZA/dKH2BvevOZiCgrOu/HPw2r5U+45TECwhYHiJt3UkEKAqrEHSC7kB JKbe00uUlKtEEeKDNLtWVtkxhV33VkEW2zBbOAnkH6RmKijbpZAaC20uTQVzU6olwAVD ZGxLEPl8ky/kRfRPvaiGent0DJVAt7T+1mzJn0Xl4UPnhBCoA/VEByKNDCQB7xBqZ8Yn kuxCFNgNkZ1wtZUmEE3JhasKpaLnxqLyXFdd90ucmYgBU3MFYnPyKd4jLP+xKfFsIMhy YeQA== X-Gm-Message-State: AJaThX606HIr1XerCaTvIOva/fJ+zfYknq5ilS8YCLOFuYH0qCOPRTJZ UZaYmhkPG5tpZul8Pk+/JfHgq/K5k36LdMI2alnkvg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGs4zMY3ajRpvsS52iE5GQj29mUUNWhuVxHAhGn3G75MVwR2r7YYpxeG24C4WJ7bYrx+pKvCZ4v2VSsN7B0v/3MUxSs= X-Received: by 10.36.164.13 with SMTP id z13mr10522083ite.115.1511418652430; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 22:30:52 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: wlosh@bsdimp.com Received: by 10.79.108.204 with HTTP; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 22:30:51 -0800 (PST) X-Originating-IP: [2603:300b:6:5100:6561:a5e8:a74:eef3] In-Reply-To: <1EC3F4AE-C263-4713-B142-412A902C9EC3@dsl-only.net> References: <1EC3F4AE-C263-4713-B142-412A902C9EC3@dsl-only.net> From: Warner Losh Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 23:30:51 -0700 X-Google-Sender-Auth: ytknkl-QAg5z46BpBVpdL1q5WzM Message-ID: Subject: Re: Does https://www.freebsd.org/doc/handbook/disks-growing.html need updates because of cylinder checksums (ufs cotnext)? To: Mark Millard Cc: FreeBSD Current , freebsd-hackers Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.25 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 06:30:53 -0000 There was a window when growfs didn't work with checksums. Maybe you have a growfs from before 324499? Warner On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 11:12 PM, Mark Millard wrote: > After following the procedure in: > > https://www.freebsd.org/doc/handbook/disks-growing.html > > to shrink a swap partition and grow a ufs file system > I'm now getting cylinder checksum failure notices. > > Should the directions be updated in some way? > > Or should growfs be updating something that is > is not now updating? > > === > Mark Millard > markmi at dsl-only.net > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 07:26:39 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3BE85DE1FAA for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 07:26:39 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markmi@dsl-only.net) Received: from asp.reflexion.net (outbound-mail-210-149.reflexion.net [208.70.210.149]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E286E804D9 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 07:26:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markmi@dsl-only.net) Received: (qmail 22696 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2017 07:26:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail-cs-01.app.dca.reflexion.local) (10.81.19.1) by 0 (rfx-qmail) with SMTP; 23 Nov 2017 07:26:31 -0000 Received: by mail-cs-01.app.dca.reflexion.local (Reflexion email security v8.40.3) with SMTP; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 02:26:31 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 18743 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2017 07:26:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO iron2.pdx.net) (69.64.224.71) by 0 (rfx-qmail) with (AES256-SHA encrypted) SMTP; 23 Nov 2017 07:26:31 -0000 Received: from [192.168.1.25] (c-76-115-7-162.hsd1.or.comcast.net [76.115.7.162]) by iron2.pdx.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 9DE2CEC8611; Wed, 22 Nov 2017 23:26:30 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\)) Subject: Re: Does https://www.freebsd.org/doc/handbook/disks-growing.html need updates because of cylinder checksums (ufs cotnext)? From: Mark Millard In-Reply-To: Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 23:26:29 -0800 Cc: FreeBSD Current , freebsd-hackers Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <1EC3F4AE-C263-4713-B142-412A902C9EC3@dsl-only.net> To: Warner Losh X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273) X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 07:26:39 -0000 On 2017-Nov-22, at 10:30 PM, Warner Losh wrote: > There was a window when growfs didn't work with checksums. Maybe you = have a growfs from before 324499? >=20 > Warner This was today in a head -r325997 context that has been a -r325997 from its first creation: the creating environment was also -325997 (but had been -r325700 some time back and has history going back to 11 and 10). No such console notices prior to following those instructions. But I was not in sight of the console during the sequence or later for a while. > On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 11:12 PM, Mark Millard = wrote: > After following the procedure in: >=20 > https://www.freebsd.org/doc/handbook/disks-growing.html >=20 > to shrink a swap partition and grow a ufs file system > I'm now getting cylinder checksum failure notices. >=20 > Should the directions be updated in some way? >=20 > Or should growfs be updating something that is > is not now updating? More context: amd64 guest under a Windows 10 Pro Hyper-V but the filesytem is "directly" on a PCIExpress 3 Optane (no NTFS or such on that device). (The kernel and initial /etc/fstab are from a .vhd file on NTFS. The fstab points to / being on the Optane. The root file system is not split across multiple mount points.) =3D=3D=3D Mark Millard markmi at dsl-only.net From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 08:49:17 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17D1ADE450C for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 08:49:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from khanzf@gmail.com) Received: from mail-qt0-x243.google.com (mail-qt0-x243.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c0d::243]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C2F383030 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 08:49:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from khanzf@gmail.com) Received: by mail-qt0-x243.google.com with SMTP id w10so15082726qtb.10 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 00:49:16 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=UuSIifT9AO5NwfwtPDpATP+HC4kjXBHk4dPGbaz5NOk=; b=FIsz2xkcUTAic2xtiZCMrLM0fUwl27nPiUVchKeCsjRH6mHQIVnONieGoa6uLavaTz y/yA1fj4MKByXtE7W6eu4JE2icLdmXfS8XHRT0v0NGcjX88vip6+Ar9UAcUTPmQd0xut s/zMD6Cp20CiPoVkTbIqHqxKmEztobmEvcq9gwDawrTO05qRx9hDtahdfQJpwFJQdPyG v9AtXE2FZu+KNRSsavl18aqUCtTpwrVKKOWRMcqqBT7bJ8joX3VSblYaMIvLqzP+XVBT l5qJVfsi5jSx0Sv6p18VUdVP4qmke4Lts31WAnWIkzDbEx/7br5B0zRSoTGdO2dJ6i8Y 4l6w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=UuSIifT9AO5NwfwtPDpATP+HC4kjXBHk4dPGbaz5NOk=; b=fCCKFIcy0YbGw42jqoEWC9dXqhaFEJEHArBO4FgHCHpGhFQLbgFbnmJqpfKxhh4fo/ DRb0qJzkZBH0xp5uDjS9Gkl9vcOut6gyoUVkWCM31dpot97HG8LmjYd1TqeGf9Ts5iSY 75+UX7w8J3h/CjcH0XL5YrfO2GbwufzqKF1zjkOQC1B8VQt392Tr+tFSA4nxqZYzaJ4E Adz7T8XN9W6NzsJxUjZV03lG2laPzmS+kjzpHQsb6v2QW/1ZvCGYAzI1thpgedr/HQEU LwgXFuHWPTHsIwTxDsLQhe0ZrAqbUmmz8uuuOuSpkXjf086+YmjqgE6K4FsXpfHj6AbA mtxg== X-Gm-Message-State: AJaThX49/5jRjOtYOQWJtqeTmGFkUXM7aTbH+7WavQmGs03EQqxaIuNT mjii7RIDqkYXBhEkfxI4E2ymLD5p X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGs4zMYBKDgIZT8wyKruRwxcWK+QXyqct5YK+HpvotgE7aSnuX4n1jsG9VvOiq5J2fb18k4BiRrerg== X-Received: by 10.200.8.11 with SMTP id u11mr39367349qth.315.1511426955663; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 00:49:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from pc.farhan.codes ([2001:470:8:209::dead:c0de]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id o57sm12482668qtf.53.2017.11.23.00.49.13 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 23 Nov 2017 00:49:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <20171123030402.GA79380@night.db.net> From: Farhan Khan Message-ID: <26834e84-cd88-cafb-ea0a-3d03572bf252@gmail.com> Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 03:49:13 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20171123030402.GA79380@night.db.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 08:49:17 -0000 Hi all, I suggest removing fortune(6) from base. It is essentially a tweak and best left for FreeBSD derivatives (GhostBSD, TrueOS, etc), not something for base. It seems inappropriate for servers. In the mean time, I would suggest having it be a symlink to /bin/true or display a message telling users to remove it. Then remove it entirely in 13-STABLE. If people want it, have it live on as a port/pkg. The same with games in general. On 11/22/2017 10:04 PM, Diane Bruce wrote: > On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 06:48:48PM -0800, freebsd@johnea.net wrote: >> On 2017-11-22 18:23, Chris H wrote: >>> On Wed, 22 Nov 2017 08:29:46 -0800 "Benno Rice" said >> >>>> With the removal of the fortune datfiles I think it’s time to have a >>>> discussion about fortune(6). >> >>> I'd like to suggest that fortune be re-instated, using FreeBSD tips as the >>> default. > > Please no. No no and no. This is the first irritation I remove when > I get a new system up. Next thing I know you'all will give me CLIPPY > flashbacks. > > And pink polka dots with blue background. Ooooooo la-la!! > > - Diane > From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 09:17:42 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03950DE5451; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 09:17:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from johalun0@gmail.com) Received: from mail-wm0-x235.google.com (mail-wm0-x235.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::235]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 90E886330D; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 09:17:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from johalun0@gmail.com) Received: by mail-wm0-x235.google.com with SMTP id y80so15050704wmd.0; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 01:17:41 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=4p3RH8Z3Wd/euk4ee+d+Qlt0zQ8uGj8C6IqgXe6IaTI=; b=V4iRehHXvVeVCr7+kwLxundq17E04nNcJbmk1Qh+TsgsmgHcl/Hibxrm4Hehl2dgY8 eg0LShNciI2G6sVR6/vi84bn2x2YouufuMxLxujsAATNOyMbunNk3IrVnfJ2DopBdBhS I5LEoAp1+7t5mz9kWHCzh2d9D7SrPMHkA7F5DOHVanRG5Jh0+qMyMYDC81WRVvqGESee a760VMOiRFZi2N8MV0JWVFqdm6RTp9MkJyTftpFkhcBlqFPumPeL9hCWekqGEAaiYLHT mczAE5TmOmNVj3uCL15XRm3KZVHKCtZEU0WznBOzKc1xK33pNnBQNarcZ+4JI0A9fzU7 pa1g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=4p3RH8Z3Wd/euk4ee+d+Qlt0zQ8uGj8C6IqgXe6IaTI=; b=S+NDpznzWK+7EdNPmbCVnfvoBBqRommvnptZH0MGLi4QD5tzrSY9xnTp5dzXstyynJ WZ8w0l38s2EC1FJkKr0XzpaOiiqqfm4ELwANFMTHPdZhcZtm0d8jpJaVzHIQHXiEoS2O JCarFim7thtCswZGAW8XP3RONtmUHgKOsdtIbufUn75tjyNYFguJmm3k7Oecmd9Agipg tTVB3lmXxE5F2IXiPgc+mTUMptcC0XIt05I6suXH+W11OCp14sq8ZHBh98pZDOq2LTNO ugYKngEDPFohfU0FiTfnAXzWCK8LESgTP2rY68Mp3Vjcxn8HOlC7UFw3YHdO+y5jZBRU 19fw== X-Gm-Message-State: AJaThX5MKiEcZWaSMRYRRqUZKT2feIIY2sBRriT6hvjR7E6Vusj9qCWm 8QHV0mgp9D4OKuM9zAgh4qSl/gmzrbOxv0pO/vq9ng== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGs4zMYl4N7NCjJL00k7IjoBAqUYI4hgA1bQYISi33o9nDv3bQCrVC+iIikwVTJkDS9i6zB8oLHp97jfpbRBy8a8a5s= X-Received: by 10.28.174.140 with SMTP id x134mr6220657wme.103.1511428659888; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 01:17:39 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.132.133 with HTTP; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 01:16:59 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <12703055.AoRsRdyBz0@overcee.wemm.org> References: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> <20171122173537.GA54395@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <64AB4D76-B239-4E49-8D30-CF6D5D5D88A4@FreeBSD.org> <12703055.AoRsRdyBz0@overcee.wemm.org> From: Johannes Lundberg Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 10:16:59 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) To: Peter Wemm Cc: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu, Benno Rice Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 09:17:42 -0000 > > However, I'd be in favor of something like having freebsd-tips be offered as a > default post-install package in the installer. I agree with this for freebsd-tips. It should be easier to install than installing a port and manually add entry to shell config files. > > -- > Peter Wemm - peter@wemm.org; peter@FreeBSD.org; peter@yahoo-inc.com; KI6FJV > UTF-8: for when a ' or ... just won\342\200\231t do\342\200\246 From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 09:47:18 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 812BCDE6036; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 09:47:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from araujobsdport@gmail.com) Received: from mail-lf0-x22d.google.com (mail-lf0-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4010:c07::22d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 03514642F9; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 09:47:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from araujobsdport@gmail.com) Received: by mail-lf0-x22d.google.com with SMTP id f134so21302200lfg.8; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 01:47:17 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:reply-to:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc; bh=PJd/HPD9C1KL8SpgY4ud0PRyvzOYAgresQZRMAQuKhE=; b=j+ENoRCwi/MdhwAzS1Wvo0H4WM8hcyEYBlVGLCDiJCAbT/O7aMRQg6dFzyG846903P TVb6QOWRfj2Hg0xdkEznKla10VUAYFHfQMCFu+/T7V/iQkjgcu8CB0AqqxWKmQQTC0F3 3Kk+cdbv0LZtdnJwTu2WA4XadhXjqlQoORwFh1ZVOehIxxFYJ9NEbijxW/lCij3KsF8/ NO4sIDi6so14HyNcLGgv6G57gJCiuMYYT4FLV9i9zWx0ASiOftTzi845ktAgAvWZ6uBe tRL/7KD+sR4FQU4zNw2Gk1PhQHfwI2SvTQljU+SzKAx67qFwUCr9T2haweVxSLERy7/U Z4BQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:reply-to:in-reply-to:references :from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=PJd/HPD9C1KL8SpgY4ud0PRyvzOYAgresQZRMAQuKhE=; b=DQAyQlZ8dFZll844l/upfd92T0sAj7GPaouVnf2ZxB+jUePqHB21LeGcyDjmJHQG8p xtO3Ch8JQS63mC9FSqnd7vHA6zBTrsUYX3iIwJcfAuJFedDscKRF5N2H3Z2KZ0hHlklL LpWzg8ExQPY2vG9xQuNumUbMrhbZUSxpjpBv3fZeSegj0uG1UCJUNT0ke+Hk41OeV4Xx 9GB4XevT8ogRAHO1pv+ddF1gDRFkvcomkGGgd+OxuAiaBu983WKdD4a3Ogg1diXITIsq TjCPC2qrCOz0GmP1qBrxHl8f1uH88uYhWISs1FEQluoC6p5ASCM/TeuJfnjDrCtHBBRC lvKw== X-Gm-Message-State: AJaThX5PQd8i22OrJvNhUN/TaT2BNgZ0ErxcDIzzIZJBs+leqVebvsxA ZhvgA+kTbA2pB1ooCSnskWUCuEzdltOBu349rYU= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGs4zMZsZNsgp7gsaejF9nnMIlnyhkB+JXFMY7QluOZ/jBws7ors4iG2R6FcBdJAzLYsPjV7WGK36iU+09t+nH/8rrw= X-Received: by 10.46.64.194 with SMTP id r63mr8186198lje.112.1511430435470; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 01:47:15 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.25.168.197 with HTTP; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 01:47:14 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: araujo@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: References: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> <20171122213411.GA32396@lonesome.com> <26410955-6888-42AE-BF95-678B46E4B49C@netgate.com> From: Marcelo Araujo Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 17:47:14 +0800 Message-ID: Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) To: Devin Teske Cc: Jim Thompson , Mark Linimon , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org, Benno Rice , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.25 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 09:47:18 -0000 2017-11-23 17:38 GMT+08:00 Devin Teske : > > > > -- > Devin > > On Nov 22, 2017, at 5:26 PM, Marcelo Araujo > wrote: > > > > 2017-11-23 7:31 GMT+08:00 Jim Thompson : > > > >> Yes, but=E2=80=A6 which blue? > >> > >>> On Nov 22, 2017, at 3:34 PM, Mark Linimon > wrote: > >>> > >>> Blue. > > > > +1 for Yellow! > > > > Everyday FreeBSD and its community manages to go to a new level. > Impressive! > > > > Anyway, Yellow is the true color. > > Interior decorators will quickly tell you that yellow makes people > nervous. Yellow is certainly not the color :) > Ouch, you are definitely right, +1 for blue. :) --=20 --=20 Marcelo Araujo (__)araujo@FreeBSD.org \\\'',)http://www.FreeBSD.org \/ \ ^ Power To Server. .\. /_) From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 10:11:32 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95C73DE69D3 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 10:11:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: from mx0.gid.co.uk (mx0.gid.co.uk [194.32.164.250]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 07EA764FCF for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 10:11:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Received: from [194.32.164.27] ([194.32.164.27]) by mx0.gid.co.uk (8.14.2/8.14.2) with ESMTP id vANA1dIh067239; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 10:01:40 GMT (envelope-from rb@gid.co.uk) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\)) Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) From: Bob Bishop In-Reply-To: <20171123030402.GA79380@night.db.net> Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 10:01:36 +0000 Cc: freebsd@johnea.net, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <8F74E9DC-8E34-450F-A658-BAB6403D6026@gid.co.uk> References: <20171123030402.GA79380@night.db.net> To: Diane Bruce X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273) X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 10:11:32 -0000 Hi, > On 23 Nov 2017, at 03:04, Diane Bruce wrote: >=20 > On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 06:48:48PM -0800, freebsd@johnea.net wrote: >> On 2017-11-22 18:23, Chris H wrote: >>> On Wed, 22 Nov 2017 08:29:46 -0800 "Benno Rice" = said >>=20 >>>> With the removal of the fortune datfiles I think it=E2=80=99s time = to have a >>>> discussion about fortune(6). >>=20 >>> I'd like to suggest that fortune be re-instated, using FreeBSD tips = as the >>> default.=20 >=20 > Please no. No no and no. This is the first irritation I remove when > I get a new system up. Next thing I know you'all will give me CLIPPY > flashbacks. +1 and let=E2=80=99s move on to something that matters. > And pink polka dots with blue background. Ooooooo la-la!! Polka dots? Are you out of your mind? > - Diane > --=20 > - db@FreeBSD.org db@db.net http://www.db.net/~db > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > To unsubscribe, send any mail to = "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" -- Bob Bishop rb@gid.co.uk From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 08:49:40 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F03ADE456E for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 08:49:40 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-lists@dyslexicfish.net) Received: from donotpassgo.dylsexicfish.net (donotpassgo.dyslexicfish.net [IPv6:2001:19f0:300:2185:a:dead:bad:faff]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 5BD203054 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 08:49:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-lists@dyslexicfish.net) X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 11:43:07 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 08:49:40 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 08:49:40 -0000 CPT TO: DATA Received: from donotpassgo.dyslexicfish.net (donotpassgo.dyslexicfish.net [104.207.135.49]) by donotpassgo.dyslexicfish.net (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id vAKGdAdt099456; Mon, 20 Nov 2017 16:39:11 GMT (envelope-from jamie@donotpassgo.dyslexicfish.net) Received: (from jamie@localhost) by donotpassgo.dyslexicfish.net (8.14.5/8.14.5/Submit) id vAKGdA0m099455; Mon, 20 Nov 2017 16:39:10 GMT (envelope-from jamie) From: Jamie Landeg-Jones Message-Id: <201711201639.vAKGdA0m099455@donotpassgo.dyslexicfish.net> Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2017 16:39:10 +0000 Organization: Dyslexic Fish To: trasz@freebsd.org, freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: jamie@catflap.org Subject: getfsstat / nullsfs / automount bug? User-Agent: Heirloom mailx 12.4 7/29/08 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit There appears to be a bug in the system call related to getmntinfo(3) / getfsstat(2) , when if the "automount" flag is set on "nullfs" mounts, it is not returned on a getfsstat "WAIT" call. The non-refreshed, non-blocking "MNT_NOWAIT" produces the correct result. I first noticed this when debugging why my nullfs autofs partitions weren't being automatically unmounted. (FreeBSD current and release) The somewhat hacked snippet from automount.c in the example below demonstrates this - When called with no parameters, it performs a MNT_WAIT request, otherwise a MNT_NOWAIT request is performed: Cheers, Jamie | #include | #include | #include | | int main(int argc, char **argv) | { | struct statfs *mntbuf; | int i, nitems; | | nitems = getmntinfo(&mntbuf, (argc == 1) ? MNT_WAIT : MNT_NOWAIT); | if (nitems <= 0) | printf ("getmntinfo fail\n"); | | for (i = 0; i < nitems; i++) { | if (strcmp(mntbuf[i].f_fstypename, "autofs") == 0) { | printf("skipping %s, filesystem type is autofs\n", | mntbuf[i].f_mntonname); | continue; | } | | if ((mntbuf[i].f_flags & MNT_AUTOMOUNTED) == 0) { | printf("skipping %s, not automounted\n", | mntbuf[i].f_mntonname); | continue; | } | | printf("%s IS automounted!!!!!!!!!\n", | mntbuf[i].f_mntonname); | } | } | 14:24 [2] (1) "autofs" root@thompson# df | Filesystem 1K-blocks Used Avail Capacity Mounted on | /dev/ada1p2 5061628 707264 3949436 15% / | devfs 1 1 0 100% /dev | /dev/ada1p4 5061628 535004 4121696 11% /var | /dev/ada1p5 978973296 21689416 878966020 2% /usr | | 14:24 [2] (2) "autofs" root@thompson# mount | /dev/ada1p2 on / (ufs, local) | devfs on /dev (devfs, local, multilabel) | /dev/ada1p4 on /var (ufs, local, soft-updates) | /dev/ada1p5 on /usr (ufs, local, soft-updates) | | 14:25 [2] (3) "autofs" root@thompson# mkdir /tmp/automounted /tmp/manual | | 14:25 [2] (4) "autofs" root@thompson# mount -t nullfs -o ro /usr/src /tmp/manual | | 14:25 [2] (5) "autofs" root@thompson# mount -t nullfs -o ro,automounted /usr/src /tmp/automounted/ | | 14:26 [2] (6) "autofs" root@thompson# df | Filesystem 1K-blocks Used Avail Capacity Mounted on | /dev/ada1p2 5061628 707264 3949436 15% / | devfs 1 1 0 100% /dev | /dev/ada1p4 5061628 535004 4121696 11% /var | /dev/ada1p5 978973296 21689420 878966016 2% /usr | /usr/src 978973296 21689420 878966016 2% /tmp/manual | /usr/src 978973296 21689420 878966016 2% /tmp/automounted | | 14:26 [2] (7) "autofs" root@thompson# mount | /dev/ada1p2 on / (ufs, local) | devfs on /dev (devfs, local, multilabel) | /dev/ada1p4 on /var (ufs, local, soft-updates) | /dev/ada1p5 on /usr (ufs, local, soft-updates) | /usr/src on /tmp/manual (nullfs, local, read-only) | /usr/src on /tmp/automounted (nullfs, local, read-only, automounted) | | 14:26 [2] (8) "autofs" root@thompson# ./a.out | skipping /, not automounted | skipping /dev, not automounted | skipping /var, not automounted | skipping /usr, not automounted | skipping /tmp/manual, not automounted | skipping /tmp/automounted, not automounted | | 14:26 [2] (9) "autofs" root@thompson# ./a.out x | skipping /, not automounted | skipping /dev, not automounted | skipping /var, not automounted | skipping /usr, not automounted | skipping /tmp/manual, not automounted | /tmp/automounted IS automounted!!!!!!!!! . From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 09:38:35 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0FAEADE5D83; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 09:38:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from devin@shxd.cx) Received: from shxd.cx (mail.shxd.cx [64.201.244.140]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F37D663F28; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 09:38:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from devin@shxd.cx) Received: from [64.201.244.132] (port=60740 helo=[10.0.0.101]) by shxd.cx with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.77 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1eHlDM-0002rK-8y; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 06:42:24 +0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) From: Devin Teske X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (13G36) In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 01:38:32 -0800 Cc: Jim Thompson , Mark Linimon , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org, Benno Rice , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <66D39828-ADBA-4973-BEB8-B2F6657E9996@FreeBSD.org> <20171122213411.GA32396@lonesome.com> <26410955-6888-42AE-BF95-678B46E4B49C@netgate.com> To: araujo@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 11:49:12 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 09:38:35 -0000 --=20 Devin > On Nov 22, 2017, at 5:26 PM, Marcelo Araujo wrot= e: >=20 > 2017-11-23 7:31 GMT+08:00 Jim Thompson : >=20 >> Yes, but=E2=80=A6 which blue? >>=20 >>> On Nov 22, 2017, at 3:34 PM, Mark Linimon wrote: >>>=20 >>> Blue. >=20 > +1 for Yellow! >=20 > Everyday FreeBSD and its community manages to go to a new level. Impressiv= e! >=20 > Anyway, Yellow is the true color. Interior decorators will quickly tell you that yellow makes people nervous. Y= ellow is certainly not the color :)= From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 12:23:09 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51340DEB6AA for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 12:23:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jan@digitaldaemon.com) Received: from digitaldaemon.com (digitaldaemon.com [162.217.114.50]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id E9A63692F7 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 12:23:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jan@digitaldaemon.com) Received: (qmail 51161 invoked by uid 89); 23 Nov 2017 12:16:25 -0000 Received: from c-24-0-179-87.hsd1.nj.comcast.net (HELO iMac.local) (jan@digitaldaemon.com@24.0.179.87) by digitaldaemon.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2017 12:16:25 -0000 Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) To: bsd-lists@BSDforge.com Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-arch@freebsd.org References: <5f4a62166aeb423a406a902bdc7078bc@udns.ultimatedns.net> From: Jan Knepper Message-ID: <3a3393b4-a092-e619-e28d-ce099330bf42@digitaldaemon.com> Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 07:16:25 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.12; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <5f4a62166aeb423a406a902bdc7078bc@udns.ultimatedns.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Language: en-US X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 12:23:09 -0000 On 11/22/2017 21:53, Chris H wrote: > If this is about removing things from FreeBSD that don't offer/provide > "utility". > Than you *should* have removed /usr/games entirely. Let's *actually* be > "completely honest" about all this. > > I think I'm done here. Sorry. :( Having used, hosted, patched FreeBSD for ~25 years, I personally like 'fortune', or something alike with 'hits' about the system, shell, etc... However, I doubt there is a 'system requirement' to have it as part of base. I have *never* used 'games', ever that I recall... :-) I am personally less (really not) concerned about 'offensive' entries. People throughout history have said and written things that will offend someone somewhere. In the USA I would think this effectively falls under the First Amendment. We can say what we want, when we want, as long as we understand that we are (still!) *responsible* for what we say. As long as such potential entries are properly accredited to the origin, even if the entry is potentially offensive we could learn something from it. (IMHO it is not wrong or bad to be reminded of evil done in history). Just my 2 cents. Not an invite to discussion... Jan From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 12:15:38 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF9C6DEB3D6 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 12:15:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jamie@dyslexicfish.net) Received: from donotpassgo.dyslexicfish.net (donotpassgo.dyslexicfish.net [IPv6:2001:19f0:300:2185:a:dead:bad:faff]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 80C5368F52 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 12:15:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jamie@dyslexicfish.net) Received: from donotpassgo.dyslexicfish.net (donotpassgo.dyslexicfish.net [104.207.135.49]) by donotpassgo.dyslexicfish.net (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id vANCFbG8035919; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 12:15:37 GMT (envelope-from jamie@donotpassgo.dyslexicfish.net) Received: (from jamie@localhost) by donotpassgo.dyslexicfish.net (8.14.5/8.14.5/Submit) id vANCFbtd035898; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 12:15:37 GMT (envelope-from jamie) From: Jamie Landeg-Jones Message-Id: <201711231215.vANCFbtd035898@donotpassgo.dyslexicfish.net> Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 12:15:36 +0000 Organization: Dyslexic Fish To: khanzf@gmail.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) References: <20171123030402.GA79380@night.db.net> <26834e84-cd88-cafb-ea0a-3d03572bf252@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <26834e84-cd88-cafb-ea0a-3d03572bf252@gmail.com> User-Agent: Heirloom mailx 12.4 7/29/08 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.7 (donotpassgo.dyslexicfish.net [104.207.135.49]); Thu, 23 Nov 2017 12:15:37 +0000 (GMT) X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 13:41:50 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 12:15:38 -0000 Farhan Khan wrote: > I suggest removing fortune(6) from base. It is essentially a tweak and > best left for FreeBSD derivatives (GhostBSD, TrueOS, etc), not something > for base. It seems inappropriate for servers. And whilst you're at it, the name "Free"BSD should be changed to something more professional too, and the silly logos and mascots made more formal - I'm sure the freebsd foundation can part with lots of generously donated cash for that. I'm sure daemon imagery offends many. I assume all the things that used to be under /usr/games should go too? And don't get me started on the sources! Especially those nasty GNU people with their rude language in the comments. F'words and everything! Truely shocking. Purge purge purge! (In case the obvious is missed, sarcasm...) Fortune and others are 'historical' and tiny - and has already been pointed out, some people use it already with their own data sets. I see no purpose in removing it. If you're than concerned submit a KNOB patch, and then those who want to can disable it in src.conf - how about WITHOUT_STUFF_I_THINK_IS_INAPPROPRIATE=yes ------------------------------------------------------------------------ http://svn.freebsd.org/base/head/usr.bin/fortune/ : r2491 | jkh | 1994-09-04 05:03:31 +0100 (Sun, 04 Sep 1994) | 3 lines ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 15:26:35 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 683FEDEFDF0 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 15:26:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from eugen@eg.sd.rdtc.ru) Received: from hz.grosbein.net (hz.grosbein.net [78.47.246.247]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "hz.grosbein.net", Issuer "hz.grosbein.net" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F2C2F6F9B3 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 15:26:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from eugen@eg.sd.rdtc.ru) Received: from eg.sd.rdtc.ru (root@eg.sd.rdtc.ru [62.231.161.221] (may be forged)) by hz.grosbein.net (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id vANFQNjA025950 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Thu, 23 Nov 2017 16:26:23 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from eugen@eg.sd.rdtc.ru) X-Envelope-From: eugen@eg.sd.rdtc.ru X-Envelope-To: khanzf@gmail.com Received: from eg.sd.rdtc.ru (eugen@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by eg.sd.rdtc.ru (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id vANFQFEk037783 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Thu, 23 Nov 2017 22:26:15 +0700 (+07) (envelope-from eugen@eg.sd.rdtc.ru) Received: (from eugen@localhost) by eg.sd.rdtc.ru (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id vANFQF2o037782; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 22:26:15 +0700 (+07) (envelope-from eugen) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 22:26:15 +0700 From: Eugene Grosbein To: Farhan Khan Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) Message-ID: <20171123152615.GA35498@rdtc.ru> References: <20171123030402.GA79380@night.db.net> <26834e84-cd88-cafb-ea0a-3d03572bf252@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <26834e84-cd88-cafb-ea0a-3d03572bf252@gmail.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.7.2 (2016-11-26) X-Spam-Status: No, score=2.2 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,LOCAL_FROM,RDNS_NONE autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.1 X-Spam-Report: * 0.0 HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS From and EnvelopeFrom 2nd level mail * domains are different * -2.3 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% * [score: 0.0000] * 2.6 LOCAL_FROM From my domains * 1.9 RDNS_NONE Delivered to internal network by a host with no rDNS X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.1 (2015-04-28) on hz.grosbein.net X-Spam-Level: ** X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 15:26:35 -0000 On Thu, Nov 23, 2017 at 03:49:13AM -0500, Farhan Khan wrote: > Hi all, > > I suggest removing fortune(6) from base. It is essentially a tweak and > best left for FreeBSD derivatives (GhostBSD, TrueOS, etc), not something > for base. It seems inappropriate for servers. fortune(6) is very useful for workstations. And FreeBSD does very well as workstation. Please do not dictate how one should use FreeBSD. Eugene Grosbein From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 15:31:28 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C07BDF01CA for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 15:31:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@johnea.net) Received: from mail.johnea.net (johnea.net [70.167.123.7]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-CAMELLIA256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 123A26FECE for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 15:31:27 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@johnea.net) Received: from [192.168.100.192] (w520.johnea.net [192.168.100.192]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.johnea.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 7A9C35F23845 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 07:31:25 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: From: freebsd@johnea.net Message-ID: <23de3fb9-8dba-4387-5d25-03b560d59bf2@johnea.net> Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 07:31:24 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.7.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 15:31:28 -0000 On 2017-11-22 18:48, freebsd@johnea.net wrote: > > Every day the logwatch email provides me with output from fortune. Over the years I've learned of many interesting people, quotes and events this way. I've never been presented output that is even marginally offensive. (actually, I've seen much more offensive content on this mailing list 8-) > --------------------- Fortune Begin ------------------------ While anyone can admit to themselves they were wrong, the true test is admission to someone else. ---------------------- Fortune End ------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 16:00:09 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4388FDF07F9 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 16:00:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from julian@freebsd.org) Received: from vps1.elischer.org (vps1.elischer.org [204.109.63.16]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "vps1.elischer.org", Issuer "CA Cert Signing Authority" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0756270894 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 16:00:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from julian@freebsd.org) Received: from Julian-MBP3.local (106-69-237-225.dyn.iinet.net.au [106.69.237.225]) (authenticated bits=0) by vps1.elischer.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPSA id vANG00KV035908 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Thu, 23 Nov 2017 08:00:05 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from julian@freebsd.org) Subject: Re: Is ddb(4) over a USB-to-Serial port possible? To: Hans Petter Selasky , Farhan Khan , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <11ce9826-f768-3ea0-547d-2d182d1552f0@gmail.com> <36165883-5cb7-aabc-c81e-cb5458029803@freebsd.org> <5c6da274-102c-33c6-50f0-20597cf8e7ef@selasky.org> From: Julian Elischer Message-ID: Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 23:59:54 +0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.12; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <5c6da274-102c-33c6-50f0-20597cf8e7ef@selasky.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Language: en-US X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 16:00:09 -0000 On 22/11/17 4:33 pm, Hans Petter Selasky wrote: > On 11/22/17 08:40, Julian Elischer wrote: >> On 22/11/17 3:08 pm, Farhan Khan wrote: >>> Hi all >>> >>> I am reading here in section "10.5, On-Line Kernel Debugging User >>> Remote GDB" that you can run ddb(4) over a serial cable. I am >>> interested in setting this up. >>> >>> My development box does not have a serial port (however, I do see >>> a uart0 device in the kernel messages), so I attached a USB serial >>> port attached to a machine with a serial port. The device uses the >>> uslcom(4) driver and is listed as "Silicon Labs CP2102 USB to UART >>> Bridge Controller". When I enter ddb and enter "gdb" I receive the >>> error "The remote GDB backend could not be selected." >>> >>> The hint.uart.0.port in /boot/device.hints is still set to 0x3F8, >>> which corresponds to the aforementioned kernel messages. I am not >>> certain if this is the same port as the USB-based serial port. >>> Does this feature work over USB? >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Farhan Khan >>> _______________________________________________ >>> freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list >>> https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers >>> To unsubscribe, send any mail to >>> "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" >>> >> generally speaking the answer is no, unless the device is emulated >> using SMI or some other mechanism that is independent of FreeBSD. >> >> uart0 is not the device on the USB but a hardware device at 3F8, >> regardless of whether it actually exists. Since the USB stack is >> not really functional when in the debugger, it can not be used to >> communicate with the debugger. >> >> I find a better answer is to fire up the test machine under bhyve, >> in which case its console is accessible through any stream session. >> (e.g. ssh).. >> > > Hi, > > There is another setting for this: > > Try setting cons_baud and cons_unit below. USB serial supports > polling from the debugger after panic. > > hw.usb.ucom.cons_baud: 9600 > hw.usb.ucom.cons_subunit: 0 > hw.usb.ucom.cons_unit: -1 > hw.usb.ucom.debug: 0 > hw.usb.ucom.pps_mode: 0 > wow.. I will need to try this when I have the appropriate setup. is this in the kenv? is it in loader.conf  or sysctl.conf? > > > --HPS > From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 22:19:09 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 624E8DF6E26 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 22:19:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hps@selasky.org) Received: from mail.turbocat.net (turbocat.net [IPv6:2a01:4f8:c17:6c4b::2]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2D5197CF49; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 22:19:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hps@selasky.org) Received: from hps2016.home.selasky.org (unknown [62.141.128.70]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.turbocat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3BD1126014D; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 23:19:05 +0100 (CET) Subject: Re: Is ddb(4) over a USB-to-Serial port possible? To: Julian Elischer , Farhan Khan , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <11ce9826-f768-3ea0-547d-2d182d1552f0@gmail.com> <36165883-5cb7-aabc-c81e-cb5458029803@freebsd.org> <5c6da274-102c-33c6-50f0-20597cf8e7ef@selasky.org> From: Hans Petter Selasky Message-ID: Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 23:16:16 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 22:19:09 -0000 On 11/23/17 16:59, Julian Elischer wrote: > On 22/11/17 4:33 pm, Hans Petter Selasky wrote: >> On 11/22/17 08:40, Julian Elischer wrote: >>> On 22/11/17 3:08 pm, Farhan Khan wrote: >>>> Hi all >>>> >>>> I am reading here in section "10.5, On-Line Kernel Debugging User >>>> Remote GDB" that you can run ddb(4) over a serial cable. I am >>>> interested in setting this up. >>>> >>>> My development box does not have a serial port (however, I do see a >>>> uart0 device in the kernel messages), so I attached a USB serial >>>> port attached to a machine with a serial port. The device uses the >>>> uslcom(4) driver and is listed as "Silicon Labs CP2102 USB to UART >>>> Bridge Controller". When I enter ddb and enter "gdb" I receive the >>>> error "The remote GDB backend could not be selected." >>>> >>>> The hint.uart.0.port in /boot/device.hints is still set to 0x3F8, >>>> which corresponds to the aforementioned kernel messages. I am not >>>> certain if this is the same port as the USB-based serial port. Does >>>> this feature work over USB? >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> Farhan Khan >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list >>>> https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers >>>> To unsubscribe, send any mail to >>>> "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" >>>> >>> generally speaking the answer is no, unless the device is emulated >>> using SMI or some other mechanism that is independent of FreeBSD. >>> >>> uart0 is not the device on the USB but a hardware device at 3F8, >>> regardless of whether it actually exists. Since the USB stack is not >>> really functional when in the debugger, it can not be used to >>> communicate with the debugger. >>> >>> I find a better answer is to fire up the test machine under bhyve, in >>> which case its console is accessible through any stream session. >>> (e.g. ssh).. >>> >> >> Hi, >> >> There is another setting for this: >> >> Try setting cons_baud and cons_unit below. USB serial supports polling >> from the debugger after panic. >> >> hw.usb.ucom.cons_baud: 9600 >> hw.usb.ucom.cons_subunit: 0 >> hw.usb.ucom.cons_unit: -1 >> hw.usb.ucom.debug: 0 >> hw.usb.ucom.pps_mode: 0 >> > wow.. I will need to try this when I have the appropriate setup. > is this in the kenv? is it in loader.conf  or sysctl.conf? > Hi, /boot/loader.conf or kenv or sysctl Before attaching the device. --HPS From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu Nov 23 22:34:42 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 253BADF7202 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 22:34:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from oliver.pinter@hardenedbsd.org) Received: from mail-wm0-x22b.google.com (mail-wm0-x22b.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::22b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AB8AC7D719 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 22:34:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from oliver.pinter@hardenedbsd.org) Received: by mail-wm0-x22b.google.com with SMTP id y80so19196389wmd.0 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 14:34:41 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hardenedbsd-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=a7ypo0no3x0gjdOi2vQ0MEOPKWLEo3sLv7ZpzL0Uhzo=; b=PRVkpbk4vSlDZobPqQ+sZtDj9JZ+j3C6H/REM3oai7FjKXIdXTTrEXuDuqAjinSllF C/aJL5tQdOoKiy3aZJMemPFU0RhmGr0F+oU4sRUmErO/0wClceVu6WoKx1QUQ1AgS+5Q iBnit1mJO1dqTYq+N1J2JlZIV5NVq5zplqvwFvENipCkaiDh5rNfREDBZFN5cMRh11as XTVZwmmo0glYvWh/WZvb3Z7Msh0AFKJEIouaSQSKdPQ64KB6YIjnUoTiXco0ibi3WM8W K3/r5owTtoFmNZveMIot7UzsJDQSQvMIRsaLDWVTP5kid1PqnGoopVI360cq0kim8Svn pRdw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=a7ypo0no3x0gjdOi2vQ0MEOPKWLEo3sLv7ZpzL0Uhzo=; b=iUYoqwVId/PE7r1ZzSb4N55psMga9tWkUcHf0WlxGzonphuCJKPxdtadCvhe7BwRlc 8OgDCEgiMw8puoKW+aE+sCVSc7qmjk2182ZOExnO+Fd6cEn9gMZ1ufYEE+8ZyHg+shyP K2/u/KZNEmvPG+T9PUQchcDKOLWRxLccSzvZR9l3W98ISsQDSq3HFkvFmYyTzRF5B93M 3+mZxltpVaCimaWb40TdUxfcx0KGb0MNrRqW93wRjRNu4B4McatLTxj0ndHAv9S+9Eoo hrgNAGfKddB5tFf6Lpq4vD/NA/2MgjEB0EE6HFEpfhqQ5AZHlqy+lSjL9Z1JcoZcu+9Q 8xzA== X-Gm-Message-State: AJaThX7uYi2LUbLKhSfjPvHBHYq4teXhlXKtJP37/t+ggSNlLSwhQ2S9 jfP++0oaqenvEmdep54W3JgoonjpUnmXD6uceZu0Nw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGs4zMaL/+aRmUz6uurHglqnA7P4TeeZcs2Os6b7hJjTJZ0A9AwhPIV53NQEtKA8oUVmZ/FpTkiautHV5HisEpeyrmc= X-Received: by 10.80.145.195 with SMTP id h3mr37846934eda.240.1511476480055; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 14:34:40 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.80.149.174 with HTTP; Thu, 23 Nov 2017 14:34:39 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <11ce9826-f768-3ea0-547d-2d182d1552f0@gmail.com> <36165883-5cb7-aabc-c81e-cb5458029803@freebsd.org> <5c6da274-102c-33c6-50f0-20597cf8e7ef@selasky.org> From: Oliver Pinter Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 23:34:39 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Is ddb(4) over a USB-to-Serial port possible? To: Hans Petter Selasky Cc: Julian Elischer , Farhan Khan , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.25 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 22:34:42 -0000 On Thursday, November 23, 2017, Hans Petter Selasky wrote: > On 11/23/17 16:59, Julian Elischer wrote: > >> On 22/11/17 4:33 pm, Hans Petter Selasky wrote: >> >>> On 11/22/17 08:40, Julian Elischer wrote: >>> >>>> On 22/11/17 3:08 pm, Farhan Khan wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi all >>>>> >>>>> I am reading here in section "10.5, On-Line Kernel Debugging User >>>>> Remote GDB" that you can run ddb(4) over a serial cable. I am interested in >>>>> setting this up. >>>>> >>>>> My development box does not have a serial port (however, I do see a >>>>> uart0 device in the kernel messages), so I attached a USB serial port >>>>> attached to a machine with a serial port. The device uses the uslcom(4) >>>>> driver and is listed as "Silicon Labs CP2102 USB to UART Bridge >>>>> Controller". When I enter ddb and enter "gdb" I receive the error "The >>>>> remote GDB backend could not be selected." >>>>> >>>>> The hint.uart.0.port in /boot/device.hints is still set to 0x3F8, >>>>> which corresponds to the aforementioned kernel messages. I am not certain >>>>> if this is the same port as the USB-based serial port. Does this feature >>>>> work over USB? >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> Farhan Khan >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list >>>>> https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers >>>>> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@ >>>>> freebsd.org" >>>>> >>>>> generally speaking the answer is no, unless the device is emulated >>>> using SMI or some other mechanism that is independent of FreeBSD. >>>> >>>> uart0 is not the device on the USB but a hardware device at 3F8, >>>> regardless of whether it actually exists. Since the USB stack is not really >>>> functional when in the debugger, it can not be used to communicate with the >>>> debugger. >>>> >>>> I find a better answer is to fire up the test machine under bhyve, in >>>> which case its console is accessible through any stream session. (e.g. >>>> ssh).. >>>> >>>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> There is another setting for this: >>> >>> Try setting cons_baud and cons_unit below. USB serial supports polling >>> from the debugger after panic. >>> >>> hw.usb.ucom.cons_baud: 9600 >>> hw.usb.ucom.cons_subunit: 0 >>> hw.usb.ucom.cons_unit: -1 >>> hw.usb.ucom.debug: 0 >>> hw.usb.ucom.pps_mode: 0 >>> >>> wow.. I will need to try this when I have the appropriate setup. >> is this in the kenv? is it in loader.conf or sysctl.conf? >> >> > Hi, > > /boot/loader.conf > > or > > kenv > > or > > sysctl > > Before attaching the device. Could we somehow change these after attached device? Ergo could we setup two USB context, one for normal operation and one for the debugger? > > --HPS > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Fri Nov 24 08:14:34 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5C0EDBDE85 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 08:14:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hps@selasky.org) Received: from mail.turbocat.net (turbocat.net [88.99.82.50]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7B2EB6A224 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 08:14:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hps@selasky.org) Received: from hps2016.home.selasky.org (unknown [62.141.128.70]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.turbocat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id E37292602CA; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 09:14:30 +0100 (CET) Subject: Re: Is ddb(4) over a USB-to-Serial port possible? To: Oliver Pinter Cc: "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Farhan Khan References: <11ce9826-f768-3ea0-547d-2d182d1552f0@gmail.com> <36165883-5cb7-aabc-c81e-cb5458029803@freebsd.org> <5c6da274-102c-33c6-50f0-20597cf8e7ef@selasky.org> From: Hans Petter Selasky Message-ID: <953998da-5e3a-1f3c-b56b-41ddda020b68@selasky.org> Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2017 09:11:46 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2017 08:14:34 -0000 On 11/23/17 23:34, Oliver Pinter wrote: > Could we somehow change these after attached device? Ergo could we setup > two USB context, one for normal operation and one for the debugger? What you can do is to set the values, then re-enumerate the USB device like this: usbconfig -d X.Y reset --HPS From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Fri Nov 24 09:01:29 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81EC0DC1228 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 09:01:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markmi@dsl-only.net) Received: from asp.reflexion.net (outbound-mail-210-128.reflexion.net [208.70.210.128]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 468F96B794 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 09:01:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markmi@dsl-only.net) Received: (qmail 12203 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2017 08:54:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rtc-sm-01.app.dca.reflexion.local) (10.81.150.1) by 0 (rfx-qmail) with SMTP; 24 Nov 2017 08:54:42 -0000 Received: by rtc-sm-01.app.dca.reflexion.local (Reflexion email security v8.40.3) with SMTP; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 03:54:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 23244 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2017 08:54:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO iron2.pdx.net) (69.64.224.71) by 0 (rfx-qmail) with (AES256-SHA encrypted) SMTP; 24 Nov 2017 08:54:42 -0000 Received: from [192.168.1.25] (c-76-115-7-162.hsd1.or.comcast.net [76.115.7.162]) by iron2.pdx.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id CF87BEC814E; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 00:54:41 -0800 (PST) From: Mark Millard Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\)) Subject: head -r325997 panics: dump/restore: restore got ufs_dirbad ino . . .: mangled entry; cp -ax got: ffs_valloc: dup alloc (after some cylinder checksum failures) Message-Id: Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2017 00:54:41 -0800 To: FreeBSD Current , freebsd-hackers X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273) X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2017 09:01:29 -0000 head -r323997 context, non-debug kernel (with debug symbols). This turned out to be for a USB SSD that was dying (Retired Block Count had grown rather large, other things looking okay). I do not know if panics are an intended result for the messed up data or not. The panic information follows. The USB ssd with /dev/gpt/FBSDUSSDroot on it had just been freshly constructed via bsdconfig, UFS with softupdate enabled but journaling disabled. # mount -o noatime /dev/gpt/FBSDUSSDroot /mnt # dump -C16 -b64 -0aL -f - / | (cd /mnt && restore -rf -) DUMP: Date of this level 0 dump: Thu Nov 23 16:26:00 2017 DUMP: Date of last level 0 dump: the epoch DUMP: Dumping snapshot of /dev/gpt/FBSDFSSDroot (/) to standard output DUMP: mapping (Pass I) [regular files] DUMP: Cache 16 MB, blocksize =3D 65536 DUMP: mapping (Pass II) [directories] DUMP: estimated 140989948 tape blocks. DUMP: dumping (Pass III) [directories] DUMP: dumping (Pass IV) [regular files] warning: ./.snap: File exists expected next file 9, got 8 Manually transcribed from the console screen for the crash: panic: ufs_dirbad ino 308183317 at offset 0: mangled entry. cpuid =3D 21 time =3D 1511483271 KDB: stack backtrace: db_trace_self_wrapper() at db_trace_self_wrapper+0x2b/frame = 0xfffffe1c3449a2b0 vpanic() at panic+0x19c/frame 0xfffffe1c3449a330 panic() at panic+0x43/frame 0xfffffe1c3449a390 ufs_lokup_ino at ufs_lookup_ino+0xe7f/frame 0xfffffe1c3449a4a0 VOP_CACHEDLOOKUP_APV() at VOP_CACHEDLOOKUP_APV+0x77c/frame = 0xffffe1c3449a4d0 vfs_cache_lookup() at vfs_cache_lookup+0xd6/frame 0xfffffe1c3449a530 VOP_LOOKUP_APV() at VOP_LOOKUP_APV+0x7c/frame 0xfffffe1c3449a560 lookup() at lookup+0x6c1/frame 0xfffffe1c3449a600 namei() at namei+0x48c/frame 0xfffffe1c3449a6d0 vn_open_cred() at vn_open_cred+0xd8/frame 0xfffffe1c3449a810 kern_openat at kern_openat+0x212/frame 0xfffffe1c3449a980 amd64_syscall() at amd64_syscall+0x9f7/frame 0xfffffe1c3499aab0 Xfast_syscall() at XFast_syscall+0xfb/frame 0xfffffe1c3499aab0 --- syscall (449, FreEBSD ELF64, sys_openat), rip =3D 0x80093be2a, rsp =3D= 0x7fffffffd518, rpb=3D0x7fffffffd600 --- KDB: enter: panic [ thread pid 915 tid 100328 ] Stopped at kdb_enter_0x3b: movq $0,kbd_why db> A retry via (newfs copied from a dumpfs -m output): # newfs -O 2 -U -a 4 -b 32768 -d 32768 -e 4096 -f 4096 -g 16384 -h 64 -i = 8192 -k 6408 -m 8 -o time -s 905969664 /dev/gpt/FBSDUSSDroot=20 /dev/gpt/FBSDUSSDroot: 442368.0MB (905969664 sectors) block size 32768, = fragment size 4096 using 707 cylinder groups of 626.09MB, 20035 blks, 80256 inodes. with soft updates super-block backups (for fsck_ffs -b #) at: . . . # mount -o noatime /dev/gpt/FBSDUSSDroot /mnt FBSDFSSD# dump -C16 -b64 -0aL -f - / | (cd /mnt && restore -rf -) DUMP: Date of this level 0 dump: Thu Nov 23 17:02:18 2017 DUMP: Date of last level 0 dump: the epoch DUMP: Dumping snapshot of /dev/gpt/FBSDFSSDroot (/) to standard output DUMP: mapping (Pass I) [regular files] DUMP: Cache 16 MB, blocksize =3D 65536 DUMP: mapping (Pass II) [directories] DUMP: estimated 141064070 tape blocks. DUMP: dumping (Pass III) [directories] DUMP: dumping (Pass IV) [regular files] warning: ./.snap: File exists expected next file 5, got 4 DUMP: 33.57% done, finished in 0:09 at Thu Nov 23 17:17:12 2017 did it again: bad dir ino 11316224 . (I'm not transcribing this screen but it is very similar to the earlier one.) Then, trying a cp -ax instead lead to a different panic (crash info transcribed from screenshot of console). . . # newfs -O 2 -U -a 4 -b 32768 -d 32768 -e 4096 -f 4096 -g 16384 -h 64 -i = 8192 -k 6408 -m 8 -o time -s 905969664 /dev/gpt/FBSDUSSDroot /dev/gpt/FBSDUSSDroot: 442368.0MB (905969664 sectors) block size 32768, = fragment size 4096 using 707 cylinder groups of 626.09MB, 20035 blks, 80256 inodes. with soft updates super-block backups (for fsck_ffs -b #) at: . . . # mount -o noatime /dev/gpt/FBSDUSSDroot /mnt # cp -ax / /mnt Eventually on the console got: . . . UFS /dev/gpt/FBSDUSSDroot (/mnt) cylinder checksum failed: cg 475, = cgp:0x782bac7c !=3D bp: 0x3c6d091f UFS /dev/gpt/FBSDUSSDroot (/mnt) cylinder checksum failed: cg 477, = cgp:0x782bac7c !=3D bp: 0xcbfd1084 mode =3D 0116600, inum =3D 38603264, fs =3D /mnt panic: ffs_valloc: dup alloc cpuid =3D 27 time =3D 1511490715 KDB: stack backtrace: db_trace_self_wrapper() at db_trace_self_wrapper+0x2b/frame = 0xfffffe1c344fe400 vpanic() at vpanic+0x19c/frame 0xfffffe1c344fe480 panic() at panic+0x43/frame 0xfffffe1c344fe4e0 ffs_valloc() at ffs_valloc+0x85c/frame 0xffffe1c344fe570 ufs_mkdir() at ufs_mkdir+0xcc/frame 0xfffffe1c344fe730 VOP_MKDIR_APV() at VOP_MKDIR_APV+0x82/frame 0xfffffe1c344fe760 kern_mkdirat() at kern_mkdirat+0x1e2/frame 0xfffffe1c344fe980 amd64_syscall() at amd64_syscall+0x9f7/frame 0xfffffe1c344feab0 Xfast_syscall() at Xfast_syscall+0xfb/frame 0xfffffe1c344feab0 --- syscall (136, FreBSD ELF64, sys_mkdir), rip =3D 0x80099a78a, rsp =3D = 0x7fffffffd838, rbp =3D 0x7fffffffdb30 --- KDB: enter: panic [ thread pid 966 tid 100348 ] Stopped at kdb_enter+0x3b: movq $0,kdb_why db> =3D=3D=3D Mark Millard markmi at dsl-only.net From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Fri Nov 24 15:09:28 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7CF79DE89B5 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 15:09:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: from pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (br1.CN84in.dnsmgr.net [69.59.192.140]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 56DFC784D4 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 15:09:27 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: from pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id vAOF9KZZ095979; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 07:09:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: (from freebsd-rwg@localhost) by pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) id vAOF9K43095978; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 07:09:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <201711241509.vAOF9K43095978@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> Subject: Re: Is ddb(4) over a USB-to-Serial port possible? In-Reply-To: <953998da-5e3a-1f3c-b56b-41ddda020b68@selasky.org> To: Hans Petter Selasky Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2017 07:09:20 -0800 (PST) CC: Oliver Pinter , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Farhan Khan X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL121h (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 24 Nov 2017 16:10:53 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2017 15:09:28 -0000 > On 11/23/17 23:34, Oliver Pinter wrote: > > Could we somehow change these after attached device? Ergo could we setup > > two USB context, one for normal operation and one for the debugger? > > What you can do is to set the values, then re-enumerate the USB device > like this: > > usbconfig -d X.Y reset It would be absolutely wonderful if someone would add a page to the handbook near the current page on ddb on how to do ddb over serial, both uart and usb based. There is also some very minor discussion of ddb over serial in the HINTS section of ddb(4) that could include these nice little tid bits about how to get it working over a usb device. Since uarts have all but disappeared for modern PC designs this is becoming more important. Thanks, -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Fri Nov 24 16:48:07 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5F9EDEBAB9; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 16:48:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Received: from land.berklix.org (land.berklix.org [144.76.10.75]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "land.berklix.org", Issuer "land.berklix.org" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 44F3C7B5BB; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 16:48:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Received: from mart.js.berklix.net (pD9FA9D37.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [217.250.157.55]) (authenticated bits=0) by land.berklix.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPSA id vAOGksIp088290 (version=TLSv1 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Fri, 24 Nov 2017 16:46:58 GMT (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Received: from fire.js.berklix.net (fire.js.berklix.net [192.168.91.41]) by mart.js.berklix.net (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id vAOGlskH067596; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 17:47:54 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Received: from fire.js.berklix.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by fire.js.berklix.net (8.14.7/8.14.7) with ESMTP id vAOGlgxu071487; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 17:47:54 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Message-Id: <201711241647.vAOGlgxu071487@fire.js.berklix.net> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) From: "Julian H. Stacey" Organization: http://berklix.eu BSD Unix Linux Consultants, Munich Germany User-agent: EXMH on FreeBSD http://berklix.eu/free/ X-From: http://www.berklix.eu/~jhs/ In-reply-to: Your message "Thu, 23 Nov 2017 22:26:15 +0700." <20171123152615.GA35498@rdtc.ru> Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2017 17:47:42 +0100 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2017 16:48:07 -0000 fortune(6) is listed in ring bound 4.3BSD System Index. Butchering on personal whim without prior agreement seems abuse. BSD should be [temporarily] reverted & the commit bit suspended, pending commiters' peer review of an un-authorised deletion. Then decide what what to do with fortune. Cheers, Julian -- Julian H. Stacey, Computer Consultant, BSD Linux Unix Systems Engineer, Munich Reply below, Prefix '> '. Plain text, No .doc, base64, HTML, quoted-printable. http://berklix.eu/brexit/ UK stole 3,500,000 votes; 700,000 from Brits in EU. From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Fri Nov 24 19:19:48 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4477EDEEFBA; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 19:19:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@komquats.com) Received: from smtp-out-no.shaw.ca (smtp-out-no.shaw.ca [64.59.134.13]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "Client", Issuer "CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0F51B80EE5; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 19:19:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@komquats.com) Received: from spqr.komquats.com ([96.50.22.10]) by shaw.ca with SMTP id IJHCetO6ezNiNIJHDeDRWC; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 12:04:41 -0700 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.2 cv=I+4VfJog c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=jvE2nwUzI0ECrNeyr98KWA==:117 a=jvE2nwUzI0ECrNeyr98KWA==:17 a=sC3jslCIGhcA:10 a=YxBL1-UpAAAA:8 a=6I5d2MoRAAAA:8 a=nRw0MP0jAAAA:8 a=lFOwTp68Te5M9NCx4GIA:9 a=ft-257npRRAj0M0O:21 a=6i5dXDlVVCQrcAwr:21 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=-FEs8UIgK8oA:10 a=NWVoK91CQyQA:10 a=tjHp5ZDjkLr4e_90VGQA:9 a=KCyRVsZS2V32ZiCm:21 a=DCNDS8XNJBdHQqql:21 a=uGvhrstjUjLn1TWB:21 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=Ia-lj3WSrqcvXOmTRaiG:22 a=IjZwj45LgO3ly-622nXo:22 a=TqOS20DUQF7LHOIXzZmQ:22 Received: from [10.168.3.117] (S0106d4ca6d8943b0.gv.shawcable.net [24.68.134.59]) by spqr.komquats.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 543CE252; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 11:04:37 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Cy Schubert Subject: RE: The future of fortune(6) Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2017 11:04:41 -0800 To: "Julian H. Stacey" , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" Message-Id: <20171124190437.543CE252@spqr.komquats.com> X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfFnjsV4PLL6VbDGjMU4GdTeyRMANobC+CAF0t9B1Qiy+MNEJyhJdNvFti3bwUw9ex6YbiuDS0kXhoFXdMdwAGg1ecsic5rDuj5SSAGC3DgDpFD5R7hS0 DC+pDwYfH/LNS/r8yR0N+T20QpSfgb42xtRC5R3k8Eru3xlUsbCCMylvnota4Gi3QopzgOFNIVIc2vvzqrbmF/S7nYzv0tT5C6Jh45Oq9mZsk6ch6HNcAS9O FIHwDHLuF7E/QpGjYBNQ5Q== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.25 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2017 19:19:48 -0000 Yes, the BSD manuals. I should check my 4.4BSD vol 6 when I get home tonigh= t. I recall playing the pre-BSD adventur game on the IBM mainframe (IIRC MVT, = prior to MVS). adventur was written in Fortran at the time. The BSD version= was in C. --- Sent using a tiny phone keyboard. Apologies for any typos and autocorrect. This old phone only supports top post. Apologies. Cy Schubert or --- -----Original Message----- From: Julian H. Stacey Sent: 24/11/2017 08:48 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) fortune(6) is listed in ring bound 4.3BSD System Index. Butchering on personal whim without prior agreement seems abuse. BSD should be [temporarily] reverted & the commit bit suspended, pending commiters' peer review of an un-authorised deletion. Then decide what what to do with fortune. Cheers, Julian --=20 Julian H. Stacey, Computer Consultant, BSD Linux Unix Systems Engineer, Mun= ich Reply below, Prefix '> '. Plain text, No .doc, base64, HTML, quoted-printa= ble. http://berklix.eu/brexit/ UK stole 3,500,000 votes; 700,000 from Brits in = EU. _______________________________________________ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Fri Nov 24 19:19:45 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 154D6DEEF95; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 19:19:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from adrian.chadd@gmail.com) Received: from mail-wr0-x22d.google.com (mail-wr0-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c0c::22d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A93DA80EE4; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 19:19:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from adrian.chadd@gmail.com) Received: by mail-wr0-x22d.google.com with SMTP id a63so21150947wrc.12; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 11:19:44 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=OMyhfd3t9QGsHj1qCjV796KMcwpFDrVW11O2BdUuHT4=; b=oF7YDHqC9YmpupIHhulSGx/d1JKfAzhbNJygpwiafinvDEBK28qSKbsAdLNy2CIVxx 7qXztdatcjY7HOCvf7coEfY7b9lgQhhnpEH8LLTjhNgDK7s95YRWa95EZs8T5pFTMG7X f/DZdHnY0jAYX9ySbkDQdrIHmA9IGNTmIGnsKWSmqN+wZROJIg8z/vPcVDxOC/gN5bhe vz+wCm/V/j/wuXuMPFe6SHk0Vfdu+ZaCkG/I+xYz4A47cG1BbYtJPaCbdKVEoxT7dR5Y oINJH3pjP73D+voKscgP96FnLZ/Hu9S5rgrOD150PLbGBrp5P/12jLUJ9NSYqr1ikq6X m5AA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=OMyhfd3t9QGsHj1qCjV796KMcwpFDrVW11O2BdUuHT4=; b=hIyxAXM2MvOriIJN5wgGHbKXXXmL9MAWIyLa9sLw0JiBdHCl4lAnm8xRukKmwGicS6 ouB6vgyi4hMUKL3T0o177ctMNI6iTcEEj8C6fEUupUwAgNUnb5OtR663n61yvj7eiJg7 9rt0GmL8HGf0NFgivm09ZV3dm2FEAPndmSJ5pU/Ja4X4dVj6V5l+JBypUbkYoscX4aZK ozplFrDshB0PKiOOXLnKtEDYcNdWrEfjjMxhrI7WJ5ghK+Ihp5uXY/WEFikofYRBhOBm jtU+kDlJr/12cXUO8YMiXvS2WXlAEG0hY5Lb9skQtaVAqbFdScGtvPH3SV5vAJ3yLjFG ttuA== X-Gm-Message-State: AJaThX4iOwl+14ZmrecZ2YBfejnMqhPnTOVChfBFSKbrRUEIBk86ShIj ttrc+WWP57VsJsUcBmpTKNtMPinsMHzmnDOnyckACg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGs4zMZuPCDEvsexzH9Oku+2NiTNo1q8C2DRM46t+AaATI1qfi1iydCh9xBMHPJ1L7QVl6X7joYNj5U9NZa4HP2rDGo= X-Received: by 10.223.128.196 with SMTP id 62mr2747617wrl.266.1511551182403; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 11:19:42 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.28.213.131 with HTTP; Fri, 24 Nov 2017 11:19:40 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <201711241647.vAOGlgxu071487@fire.js.berklix.net> References: <20171123152615.GA35498@rdtc.ru> <201711241647.vAOGlgxu071487@fire.js.berklix.net> From: Adrian Chadd Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2017 11:19:40 -0800 Message-ID: Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) To: "Julian H. Stacey" Cc: "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 24 Nov 2017 22:50:25 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2017 19:19:45 -0000 hi, Pardon me, but it's 2017 and the 4.3BSD system index isn't an immutable bible. As a general push to packaging things in general, turning fortune into a package seems like some low hanging fruit. -adrian On 24 November 2017 at 08:47, Julian H. Stacey wrote: > fortune(6) is listed in ring bound 4.3BSD System Index. > Butchering on personal whim without prior agreement seems abuse. > BSD should be [temporarily] reverted & the commit bit suspended, > pending commiters' peer review of an un-authorised deletion. > Then decide what what to do with fortune. > > Cheers, > Julian > -- > Julian H. Stacey, Computer Consultant, BSD Linux Unix Systems Engineer, Munich > Reply below, Prefix '> '. Plain text, No .doc, base64, HTML, quoted-printable. > http://berklix.eu/brexit/ UK stole 3,500,000 votes; 700,000 from Brits in EU. > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sat Nov 25 08:09:38 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A4D1DBB79D for ; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 08:09:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from agapon@gmail.com) Received: from mail-lf0-f41.google.com (mail-lf0-f41.google.com [209.85.215.41]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F165D79199; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 08:09:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from agapon@gmail.com) Received: by mail-lf0-f41.google.com with SMTP id d10so16519856lfj.7; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 00:09:37 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:to:from:subject:cc:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=8peSx+WTYyugxC3T1GPqh5sTJnf+PdgCUWw+L/snWk4=; b=mbFyYZYCnBniD/1dClhBkw8zeQWBQ2i5XdHBMKH6pBZuCefLD18qtN3CmqMT1VlHwN y9hqChExnDBhRLezjuV9W5woObqH34vlby55XU84lQ/aUPdieAPRSNZJ/2XfOhtYYlZO VcrDijefJlWna/lN/HdpxQ6jF4Ofa4bWj03O1Gi2rD5JFnpR3YbzGJsz3NjshJSGcOVI Rd38o7tRLPjpsVrqgybgU2crXk9qtnXfa8eGuSWufGe9MYzKS/z1lv4E5NxkKJJrbFqQ 9wVWPj9Zwk2ufWJYp2h4AUbqndgXs22dl05eCV4BOiD0DtdMqB1SaYcOSpiZsw+Nq3IY BKmg== X-Gm-Message-State: AJaThX58i+SLECnFRus38UvrKUyBHDm5ABzo30UJ693kI951q4QO7EPA L8m5++E6JiB7mDezxvrOgc2c9ZQVueY= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGs4zMYUA6GOzpFJi4HI9yWe5G8v3jWqKuIyPVZeRhVpG34Lb4w+Tj1YEaNhXs8tml8igbo90mmW2A== X-Received: by 10.46.34.196 with SMTP id i187mr10241097lji.106.1511597369491; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 00:09:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.0.88] (east.meadow.volia.net. [93.72.151.96]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id x188sm3210689lfa.90.2017.11.25.00.09.27 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 25 Nov 2017 00:09:28 -0800 (PST) To: sunpoet@FreeBSD.org From: Andriy Gapon Subject: libpci-3.5.6: something is wrong Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Message-ID: <1691ad41-40a0-9f49-fd46-6b0b65738d75@FreeBSD.org> Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 10:09:27 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.5.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 08:09:38 -0000 I have seen a report on IRC that libpci-3.5.6 upgrade caused troubles for someone. Now I also see a problem: # flashrom --programmer internal flashrom v0.9.9-r1955 on FreeBSD 12.0-CURRENT (amd64) flashrom is free software, get the source code at https://flashrom.org Calibrating delay loop... OK. Found chipset "AMD SB7x0/SB8x0/SB9x0". Enabling flash write... OK. No EEPROM/flash device found. Note: flashrom can never write if the flash chip isn't found automatically. With libpci-3.5.5: # LD_PRELOAD=/usr/local/poudriere/ports/default/devel/libpci/work/pciutils-3.5.5/lib/libpci.so.3 flashrom --programmer internal flashrom v0.9.9-r1955 on FreeBSD 12.0-CURRENT (amd64) flashrom is free software, get the source code at https://flashrom.org Calibrating delay loop... OK. Found chipset "AMD SB7x0/SB8x0/SB9x0". Enabling flash write... OK. Found Winbond flash chip "W25Q32.V" (4096 kB, SPI) mapped at physical address 0x00000000ffc00000. No operations were specified. I am on amd64 head. I wonder if only head is affected. I also wonder what kind of change in this minor release could have caused the problem and if the upstream has any fix for it already. Thank you! -- Andriy Gapon From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sat Nov 25 11:54:59 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4DFD2DDFA48; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 11:54:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Received: from land.berklix.org (land.berklix.org [144.76.10.75]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "land.berklix.org", Issuer "land.berklix.org" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DB48E7EAC5; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 11:54:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Received: from mart.js.berklix.net (pD9FA9D37.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [217.250.157.55]) (authenticated bits=0) by land.berklix.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPSA id vAPBrp02029447 (version=TLSv1 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Sat, 25 Nov 2017 11:53:55 GMT (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Received: from fire.js.berklix.net (fire.js.berklix.net [192.168.91.41]) by mart.js.berklix.net (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id vAPBspvl072671; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 12:54:51 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Received: from fire.js.berklix.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by fire.js.berklix.net (8.14.7/8.14.7) with ESMTP id vAPBsXMX085057; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 12:54:45 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Message-Id: <201711251154.vAPBsXMX085057@fire.js.berklix.net> To: Adrian Chadd cc: "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) From: "Julian H. Stacey" Organization: http://berklix.eu BSD Unix Linux Consultants, Munich Germany User-agent: EXMH on FreeBSD http://berklix.eu/free/ X-From: http://www.berklix.eu/~jhs/ In-reply-to: Your message "Fri, 24 Nov 2017 11:19:40 -0800." Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 12:54:33 +0100 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 11:54:59 -0000 Adrian Chadd wrote: (top posting corrected here) > On 24 November 2017 at 08:47, Julian H. Stacey wrote: > > fortune(6) is listed in ring bound 4.3BSD System Index. > > Butchering on personal whim without prior agreement seems abuse. > > BSD should be [temporarily] reverted & the commit bit suspended, > > pending commiters' peer review of an un-authorised deletion. > > Then decide what what to do with fortune. > hi, > Pardon me, but it's 2017 and the 4.3BSD system index isn't an immutable bible. > As a general push to packaging things in general, turning fortune into > a package seems like some low hanging fruit. > -adrian I avoided expressing opinion on where fortune might best be, to avoid distraction from the point: Commit bits are a privilege. Contentious commits forced through before discussion, should by policy be automaticaly reverted, & committers bit suspended, pending committer peer review - Not with reference to the desirability or otherwise of a commit, but for imposing on FreeBSD without prior discussion. Commiter conduct reviews should be seperate from discussion of desirability of a contentious commit. Cheers, Julian -- Julian H. Stacey, Computer Consultant, BSD Linux Unix Systems Engineer, Munich Reply below, Prefix '> '. Plain text, No .doc, base64, HTML, quoted-printable. http://berklix.eu/brexit/ UK stole 3,500,000 votes; 700,000 from Brits in EU. From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sat Nov 25 16:28:23 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8ADAADEA477; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 16:28:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from linimon@lonesome.com) Received: from mail.soaustin.net (mail.soaustin.net [192.108.105.60]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mail.soaustin.net", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 70FBD6525E; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 16:28:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from linimon@lonesome.com) Received: from lonesome.com (bones.soaustin.net [192.108.105.22]) by mail.soaustin.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 00412D37; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 10:28:15 -0600 (CST) Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 10:28:14 -0600 From: Mark Linimon To: "Julian H. Stacey" Cc: Adrian Chadd , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) Message-ID: <20171125162814.GA9954@lonesome.com> References: <201711251154.vAPBsXMX085057@fire.js.berklix.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <201711251154.vAPBsXMX085057@fire.js.berklix.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.23 (2014-03-12) X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 16:42:15 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 16:28:23 -0000 On Sat, Nov 25, 2017 at 12:54:33PM +0100, Julian H. Stacey wrote: > Contentious commits forced through before discussion, should by > policy be automatically reverted, committers bit suspended That is not FreeBSD's policy. AFAIK that has never been FreeBSD's policy. If it ever does become FreeBSD's policy, I will be (one of many, I assume) out the door. Look: AFAICT the only project that is ever going to suit you is one you run yourself. Then you can make all the rules. There are other BSDs that run on that model. I remain here, despite frustrations, *because* FreeBSD doesn't run on that model. Does it run well? No: there are human beings involved, so QED. But it runs better than what it would run by your demands. tl:dr; if you want to work with people (on this project or any other), work with them, don't attack. It's self-defeating. mcl From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sat Nov 25 18:19:37 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A35EFDEC97F for ; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 18:19:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from harald.boehm@fau.de) Received: from mx-rz-3.rrze.uni-erlangen.de (mx-rz-3.rrze.uni-erlangen.de [IPv6:2001:638:a000:1025::16]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 555E468C79 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 18:19:36 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from harald.boehm@fau.de) Received: from mx-rz-3.rrze.uni-erlangen.de (mx-rz-3.rrze.uni-erlangen.de [IPv6:2001:638:a000:1025::16]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx-rz-3.rrze.uni-erlangen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3ykhCx4QvRz24K7 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 19:19:25 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=fau.de; s=fau-2013; t=1511633965; bh=eb90e/q3eqxUc0x9ROEkCQhyumoIEtP7DivyYmrvgaY=; h=Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To:From:To:CC:Subject; b=OnCoKiZUR0Y+rj1u99ErsWlxrE/APSYmknPszn+TPZtbemL4Y4Orm2D+epiS+96PO hxSDP/S2atG4jbT2UfzbwBG+xR068wR+jWgbQBj6p0ZCF8oMV0d+AbSQshJXFo0tiY vH8MH4e32QW64xWwQQdjnbo9RKjosZ2dFwCF4bg156gJTevlmRpPRmewG5OqNfUJwj AOtg8QWz0M/wLPZ8hNPRqTI5huuyQcopd3N2VhH9nlommaKayQbAGaRPOH/toTOhki HGuxmJsfGY3qmFm4hyo9+aF1x4HBlicQvRNbYflqxUxxUTgnfY3norLclUKKMmX8xd DaK7tRVt/DkAQ== X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at boeck4.rrze.uni-erlangen.de (RRZE) X-RRZE-Flag: Not-Spam X-RRZE-Submit-IP: 2.205.196.29 Received: from [192.168.2.100] (ip-2-205-196-29.web.vodafone.de [2.205.196.29]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: U2FsdGVkX19O7f68OC7FLm3VSJjlIYZa9wNbnBPoSeE=) by smtp-auth.uni-erlangen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3ykhCr5gLdz24JL for ; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 19:19:20 +0100 (CET) Subject: Re: ACPICA missing support for device I/O port ranges To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <2497671.hb7Q7Esj6H@ralph.baldwin.cx> From: =?UTF-8?Q?Harald_B=c3=b6hm?= Message-ID: Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 19:19:19 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.13; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <2497671.hb7Q7Esj6H@ralph.baldwin.cx> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 18:19:37 -0000 > IO ranges are not supposed to be in _CRS. An IO range is used for relocatable > resources and would be in _PRS to say "you can use I/O ports at addresses, A, > B, or C". Specifically, the "Range" of an I/O port is the range of the > starting addresses. Normal I/O addresses in _CRS are set to a fixed range > with the same values for Range Min and Range Max. For example: > > IO (Decode16, > 0x0CF8, // Range Minimum > 0x0CF8, // Range Maximum > 0x01, // Alignment > 0x08, // Length > ) > > This says it uses the '8' (Length) I/O ports starting at 0xcf8 and that they > are fixed at 0xcf8 because the starting address has to be >= 0xcf8 (range min) > and <= 0xcf8 (range max). The _CRS blob from your dump says that it wants to > allocate 255 I/O ports with a starting address of 0x700, 0x701, 0x702, 0x703, > .... , 0x7fd, 0x7fe, or 0x7ff, but it doesn't tell us _which_ of those ranges > it is actually using (e.g. is it using 0x700 -> 0x7ff or is it using 0x780 -> > 0x88f, etc.). Thanks for the explanation, after reading it and having a look at the ACPI spec everyhing makes much more sense now. :) > Probably it's just a bug in your BIOS and it means to use > 0x700 -> 0x7ff and the BIOS author doesn't understand what Range Maximum means. > It is not the end address of the full I/O port addresses reserved, but the > maximum starting address (I agree this is a bit odd, but this is what the > spec says). >From what I know about the device so far, this seems to be true. The device only uses I/O ports in the range between 0x700 and 0x7FF, that's why I was confused in the first place. It also seems to be the only device that has this buggy port description in my BIOS, all other device entries look like the example you gave. The affected Laptop is a MacBook Pro 11,3. The device should be present in Apple computers with two graphics cards, it is used to switch between GPUs. So, if anyone else is using a Mac with two graphics cards, it would be interesting to see, whether this bug is also present in other machines (acpidump -td and search for GMUX). > Assuming the BIOS is buggy, we can add a hack for iorange that adds the > resource if max == min + length and emit a warning under bootverbose about > the BIOS being buggy. > That would be great. Alternatively, I could read the _CRS in the driver's code directly. I already wrote a patch, adapting your idea, below is the output of diff -u, does this look reasonable? --- acpi_resource.c 2017-11-25 17:17:02.083043000 +0100 +++ acpi_resource.c.patch 2017-11-25 17:20:57.223232000 +0100 @@ -35,6 +35,7 @@ #include #include #include +#include #include #include @@ -525,7 +526,26 @@ if (cp == NULL) return; - device_printf(dev, "I/O range not supported\n"); + + /* + * The CRS is not supposed to contain io ranges for relocatable + * resources. If the resource's length is equal to the address + * range between low and high, it indicates that the BIOS author + * probably meant that the device uses I/O ports from low to + * high. Therefore, we set the resources here, so drivers are + * able allocate them correctly. + */ + if (high == (low+length)) { + if (boothowto & RB_VERBOSE) { + device_printf(dev, + "warning: Device's _CRS contains an invalid I/O port range\n"); + } + + bus_set_resource(dev, SYS_RES_IOPORT, cp->ar_nio++, low, + length); + } else { + device_printf(dev, "I/O range not supported\n"); + } } static void From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sat Nov 25 18:22:59 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5531DECC97 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 18:22:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ian@freebsd.org) Received: from outbound1a.eu.mailhop.org (outbound1a.eu.mailhop.org [52.58.109.202]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7EFF969186 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 18:22:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ian@freebsd.org) X-MHO-User: a6a95701-d20d-11e7-b805-f37e907b5733 X-Report-Abuse-To: https://support.duocircle.com/support/solutions/articles/5000540958-duocircle-standard-smtp-abuse-information X-Originating-IP: 73.78.92.27 X-Mail-Handler: DuoCircle Outbound SMTP Received: from ilsoft.org (unknown [73.78.92.27]) by outbound1.eu.mailhop.org (Halon) with ESMTPSA id a6a95701-d20d-11e7-b805-f37e907b5733; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 18:22:54 +0000 (UTC) Received: from rev (rev [172.22.42.240]) by ilsoft.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id vAPIMoA5001179; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 11:22:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ian@freebsd.org) Message-ID: <1511634170.23588.4.camel@freebsd.org> Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) From: Ian Lepore To: "Julian H. Stacey" , Adrian Chadd Cc: "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 11:22:50 -0700 In-Reply-To: <201711251154.vAPBsXMX085057@fire.js.berklix.net> References: <201711251154.vAPBsXMX085057@fire.js.berklix.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.18.5.1 FreeBSD GNOME Team Port Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 18:23:00 -0000 On Sat, 2017-11-25 at 12:54 +0100, Julian H. Stacey wrote: > Adrian Chadd wrote: > (top posting corrected here) > > > > > On 24 November 2017 at 08:47, Julian H. Stacey wrote: > > > > > > fortune(6) is listed in ring bound 4.3BSD System Index. > > > Butchering on personal whim without prior agreement seems abuse. > > > BSD should be [temporarily] reverted & the commit bit suspended, > > > pending commiters' peer review of an un-authorised deletion. > > > Then decide what what to do with fortune. > > > > hi, > > Pardon me, but it's 2017 and the 4.3BSD system index isn't an immutable bible. > > As a general push to packaging things in general, turning fortune into > > a package seems like some low hanging fruit. > > -adrian > I avoided expressing opinion on where fortune might best be, to > avoid distraction from the point: > > Commit bits are a privilege.  Contentious commits forced through > before discussion, should by policy be automaticaly reverted, > & committers bit suspended, pending committer peer review - Not with > reference to the desirability or otherwise of a commit, but for > imposing on FreeBSD without prior discussion. > > Commiter conduct reviews should be seperate from  > discussion of desirability of a contentious commit. > I'm not sure why you think you're qualified to comment on what policy is, but let me assure you that virtually everything you've ever said on the subject on the freebsd mailing lists is wrong.  People reading this thread should not make the mistake of thinking that you are associated with the project in any way or speak authoratatively about the project and its policies. -- Ian From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sat Nov 25 19:33:13 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D7FEDEE282; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 19:33:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@komquats.com) Received: from smtp-out-no.shaw.ca (smtp-out-no.shaw.ca [64.59.134.9]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "Client", Issuer "CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 236706B67B; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 19:33:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@komquats.com) Received: from spqr.komquats.com ([96.50.22.10]) by shaw.ca with SMTP id IfxjeNTgVRDG7IfxkeK48I; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 12:18:05 -0700 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.2 cv=b+PC2pOx c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=jvE2nwUzI0ECrNeyr98KWA==:117 a=jvE2nwUzI0ECrNeyr98KWA==:17 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=sC3jslCIGhcA:10 a=YxBL1-UpAAAA:8 a=6I5d2MoRAAAA:8 a=NRF7K_vUAAAA:8 a=nRw0MP0jAAAA:8 a=Qv2LTWs3tmBQeHP3dDIA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=-FEs8UIgK8oA:10 a=NWVoK91CQyQA:10 a=Ia-lj3WSrqcvXOmTRaiG:22 a=IjZwj45LgO3ly-622nXo:22 a=-TUkS2ffhQBfG7ohTqvO:22 a=TqOS20DUQF7LHOIXzZmQ:22 Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (slippy [10.1.1.91]) by spqr.komquats.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3CB59538; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 11:18:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id vAPJI2nJ072757; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 11:18:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from slippy (cy@localhost) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) with ESMTP id vAPJI2IB072754; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 11:18:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Message-Id: <201711251918.vAPJI2IB072754@slippy.cwsent.com> X-Authentication-Warning: slippy.cwsent.com: cy owned process doing -bs X-Mailer: exmh version 2.8.0 04/21/2012 with nmh-1.7 Reply-to: Cy Schubert From: Cy Schubert X-os: FreeBSD X-Sender: cy@cwsent.com X-URL: http://www.cschubert.com/ To: Adrian Chadd cc: "Julian H. Stacey" , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) In-Reply-To: Message from Adrian Chadd of "Fri, 24 Nov 2017 11:19:40 -0800." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 11:18:02 -0800 X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfHXNOmwV2uKNGkrKEO5JDkHoFR2mzLEmkornFSZ7DsVfJlcPCgoQQwchdqapnM9p0HA9T/gVGqV7X/T8PPpKV1ncDTllsMH3fO7KlIHasNULuJbppXdB FClvpdROAPwWUXMxRfoyAlXdqfOfguEWtUlj86LG1sX3bo/HIeKz9pezkKDTFlGXRbHjCTHhr25SeOqRNZEx1sJs8Xl42gx04BRc/6Y854zXI+SoVo2nTb3N c24tvNPK3Vw5XzH90wJi2iDB0z+hmlYxFtAkPsgj1JtfnStsC+Ae+zUm85WfP183 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 19:33:13 -0000 In message , Adrian Chadd writes: > hi, > > Pardon me, but it's 2017 and the 4.3BSD system index isn't an immutable bible > . > > As a general push to packaging things in general, turning fortune into > a package seems like some low hanging fruit. > > > > -adrian I see no reason why fortune(6) cannot be a port. Much of /usr/games (IIRC that's where it was) has been gutted anyway and not only that but other more functional parts of 4.4BSD have been culled and are simply gone. I think the way forward is: 1. Make fortune a port. 2. Whatever was in games and is in ports could be installed through a bsd-games meta-port. People should realize that ports are just as valid as base. Not everything should be in base. This will become truer once base is fully distributed as packages. A monolithic base is so 1960s. Even the IBM mainframe I worked on in the 1970s used packages (IBM called them FMIDs). Let's get on with the 1970s and move it to ports/packages. -- Cheers, Cy Schubert FreeBSD UNIX: Web: http://www.FreeBSD.org The need of the many outweighs the greed of the few. > > > On 24 November 2017 at 08:47, Julian H. Stacey wrote: > > fortune(6) is listed in ring bound 4.3BSD System Index. > > Butchering on personal whim without prior agreement seems abuse. > > BSD should be [temporarily] reverted & the commit bit suspended, > > pending commiters' peer review of an un-authorised deletion. > > Then decide what what to do with fortune. > > > > Cheers, > > Julian > > -- > > Julian H. Stacey, Computer Consultant, BSD Linux Unix Systems Engineer, Mun > ich > > Reply below, Prefix '> '. Plain text, No .doc, base64, HTML, quoted-printa > ble. > > http://berklix.eu/brexit/ UK stole 3,500,000 votes; 700,000 from Brits in > EU. > > _______________________________________________ > > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sat Nov 25 22:06:43 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7481FDF1897; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 22:06:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@komquats.com) Received: from smtp-out-so.shaw.ca (smtp-out-so.shaw.ca [64.59.136.138]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "Client", Issuer "CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 313A870D96; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 22:06:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@komquats.com) Received: from spqr.komquats.com ([96.50.22.10]) by shaw.ca with SMTP id Iiase6OEsss4TIiateHnuQ; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 15:06:41 -0700 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.2 cv=JuuBlIwC c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=jvE2nwUzI0ECrNeyr98KWA==:117 a=jvE2nwUzI0ECrNeyr98KWA==:17 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=sC3jslCIGhcA:10 a=-FGs326eAAAA:8 a=YxBL1-UpAAAA:8 a=6I5d2MoRAAAA:8 a=CAy2Vs5pzIfcedsNyIUA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=7Nw9HX5Nqxt2AnyyOhBr:22 a=Ia-lj3WSrqcvXOmTRaiG:22 a=IjZwj45LgO3ly-622nXo:22 Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (slippy [10.1.1.91]) by spqr.komquats.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 28F8B65E; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 14:06:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id vAPM6b6H060211; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 14:06:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from slippy (cy@localhost) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) with ESMTP id vAPM6a0A060208; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 14:06:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Message-Id: <201711252206.vAPM6a0A060208@slippy.cwsent.com> X-Authentication-Warning: slippy.cwsent.com: cy owned process doing -bs X-Mailer: exmh version 2.8.0 04/21/2012 with nmh-1.7 Reply-to: Cy Schubert From: Cy Schubert X-os: FreeBSD X-Sender: cy@cwsent.com X-URL: http://www.cschubert.com/ To: Mark Linimon cc: Cy Schubert , Adrian Chadd , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , "Julian H. Stacey" , "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) In-Reply-To: Message from Mark Linimon of "Sat, 25 Nov 2017 15:34:54 -0600." <20171125213454.GA10490@lonesome.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 14:06:36 -0800 X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfAelVBnp6OjMhx+rSWoBBdftpEuh9uoTh2L3BCn73CYagmF8lI/jqcJN4yia1xytZXWsuYiQX0N9FVCm763U1VrD7lP+GDgJlSrUzy5sxGhQD92Qw4hs +lHyZylR09SS127wad+18cgpz6fuIESySEQ7UFqAuwxyEtTtkFWg2Pu0vVPN8NZwkGvNwcCybq3XnNf9KVlFwKyI4vWOVkiiLXiRJAbPxVTL7LeenJMjkasl smbfu7yBRuKMD4I3fBGrBqAbYu6zkeUI8mV9fuVdd+paw9chlQu9WyFQV5yAvwLBwPZQt67vIsH+NB/eNCiE0Q== X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 22:06:43 -0000 In message <20171125213454.GA10490@lonesome.com>, Mark Linimon writes: > On Sat, Nov 25, 2017 at 11:18:02AM -0800, Cy Schubert wrote: > > 1. Make fortune a port. > > A port for the "classical" fortunes file has already been added. Indeed, in bsdgames. Like really?! What's all the fuss about? Just nuke from base then. I have half a mind to just blow it away now and be done with all this nonsense. -- Cheers, Cy Schubert FreeBSD UNIX: Web: http://www.FreeBSD.org The need of the many outweighs the greed of the few. From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sat Nov 25 22:16:59 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7AF12DF1F2A; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 22:16:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@komquats.com) Received: from smtp-out-so.shaw.ca (smtp-out-so.shaw.ca [64.59.136.137]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "Client", Issuer "CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3B98C71B04; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 22:16:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@komquats.com) Received: from spqr.komquats.com ([96.50.22.10]) by shaw.ca with SMTP id Iikle6QZTss4TIikmeHpA5; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 15:16:52 -0700 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.2 cv=JuuBlIwC c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=jvE2nwUzI0ECrNeyr98KWA==:117 a=jvE2nwUzI0ECrNeyr98KWA==:17 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=sC3jslCIGhcA:10 a=VxmjJ2MpAAAA:8 a=-FGs326eAAAA:8 a=YxBL1-UpAAAA:8 a=6I5d2MoRAAAA:8 a=ifCAk0EqbGYcMWA5R-8A:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=CtDkzlP1Ic4A:10 a=7gXAzLPJhVmCkEl4_tsf:22 a=7Nw9HX5Nqxt2AnyyOhBr:22 a=Ia-lj3WSrqcvXOmTRaiG:22 a=IjZwj45LgO3ly-622nXo:22 Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (slippy [10.1.1.91]) by spqr.komquats.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DAAE6696; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 14:16:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id vAPMGoTX075133; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 14:16:50 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from slippy (cy@localhost) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) with ESMTP id vAPMGoM7075129; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 14:16:50 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Message-Id: <201711252216.vAPMGoM7075129@slippy.cwsent.com> X-Authentication-Warning: slippy.cwsent.com: cy owned process doing -bs X-Mailer: exmh version 2.8.0 04/21/2012 with nmh-1.7 Reply-to: Cy Schubert From: Cy Schubert X-os: FreeBSD X-Sender: cy@cwsent.com X-URL: http://www.cschubert.com/ To: Cy Schubert cc: Mark Linimon , Cy Schubert , Adrian Chadd , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , "Julian H. Stacey" , "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) In-Reply-To: Message from Cy Schubert of "Sat, 25 Nov 2017 14:06:36 -0800." <201711252206.vAPM6a0A060208@slippy.cwsent.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 14:16:49 -0800 X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfHy6WKXTZbBqPmT8B2xqPhhhSXFk0JSQn3RqjwWtxI0VljMqR3UbfNPBXe858y42HCi4UgBnodV6ivqLVyRL3J9Wu4h51G5SzsqW8skFpXvpwqJXDU6j XZC5t+Z8Pv9hSARTda/AUvjDzodSAkxOuVYwgS9ztnUE17LAyvWluVQLFIdjv028xp167wYNnMktfZeJATSEVtSMC5rYBzojYjtFSuntxYFijqwpmmRaOICP aS/vdTkROiP6l39ZXiMAwYpwZeZO8hS8qjwBCFwBl1Trdth2db6NF3NsgRKehthg/zJX5Vc3vt3YK2ioYL7eVg== X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 22:16:59 -0000 In message <201711252206.vAPM6a0A060208@slippy.cwsent.com>, Cy Schubert writes: > In message <20171125213454.GA10490@lonesome.com>, Mark Linimon writes: > > On Sat, Nov 25, 2017 at 11:18:02AM -0800, Cy Schubert wrote: > > > 1. Make fortune a port. > > > > A port for the "classical" fortunes file has already been added. > > Indeed, in bsdgames. Like really?! What's all the fuss about? Just nuke > from base then. I have half a mind to just blow it away now and be done > with all this nonsense. Apologies for the frustration. While taking breaks from putting in new electrical in this 104 year old house, my extreme frustration at the plumbing and joists in my way to completing what should be a simple job is spilling over on list. -- Cheers, Cy Schubert FreeBSD UNIX: Web: http://www.FreeBSD.org The need of the many outweighs the greed of the few. From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sat Nov 25 23:21:56 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC4B7DF334B; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 23:21:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@komquats.com) Received: from smtp-out-so.shaw.ca (smtp-out-so.shaw.ca [64.59.136.138]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "Client", Issuer "CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6ED0073897; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 23:21:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@komquats.com) Received: from spqr.komquats.com ([96.50.22.10]) by shaw.ca with SMTP id IjlfeXZTPGvLHIjlheBusN; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 16:21:54 -0700 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.2 cv=a9pAzQaF c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=jvE2nwUzI0ECrNeyr98KWA==:117 a=jvE2nwUzI0ECrNeyr98KWA==:17 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=sC3jslCIGhcA:10 a=BWvPGDcYAAAA:8 a=VxmjJ2MpAAAA:8 a=-FGs326eAAAA:8 a=YxBL1-UpAAAA:8 a=6I5d2MoRAAAA:8 a=4WzT7Xe7Adav9QqyOycA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=oappaISLdyUA:10 a=CtDkzlP1Ic4A:10 a=pxhY87DP9d2VeQe4joPk:22 a=7gXAzLPJhVmCkEl4_tsf:22 a=7Nw9HX5Nqxt2AnyyOhBr:22 a=Ia-lj3WSrqcvXOmTRaiG:22 a=IjZwj45LgO3ly-622nXo:22 Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (slippy [10.1.1.91]) by spqr.komquats.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 821BF714; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 15:21:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id vAPNLpXo025197; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 15:21:51 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from slippy (cy@localhost) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) with ESMTP id vAPNLnhc025188; Sat, 25 Nov 2017 15:21:49 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Message-Id: <201711252321.vAPNLnhc025188@slippy.cwsent.com> X-Authentication-Warning: slippy.cwsent.com: cy owned process doing -bs X-Mailer: exmh version 2.8.0 04/21/2012 with nmh-1.7 Reply-to: Cy Schubert From: Cy Schubert X-os: FreeBSD X-Sender: cy@cwsent.com X-URL: http://www.cschubert.com/ To: Adrian Chadd cc: Cy Schubert , Cy Schubert , Mark Linimon , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , "Julian H. Stacey" , "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) In-Reply-To: Message from Adrian Chadd of "Sat, 25 Nov 2017 15:03:51 -0800." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 15:21:49 -0800 X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfE0IkM379XwsK0hpE0mApPEupcL8Wwm3M64Avszm/GU+2/GrTc3Ft2d/9GT4/PaQvu/HH6hs+SiNLeA/w0NEwaRDfZ3di6BEZhxccKmhypqkj3PwA7vp hKjkAkLV2dy8NKmbJkhFCxLl2DnjMW6qx0oQljNCxK1QQgYWGsvLscrRFw86duodfIfHvPi2B9kzEtECMz9j1E1HAMwwSQlPp8hzoUlOE63iJDM9akzG8XlD ZdTylIaMHUqt22a6Xj36JJTxFDWHmRAb7Pe49oj+QTFkRGeRc4cArxGm7aMjEPhu8TmCwcZCmL6I8JTCydiWCw== X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 23:21:56 -0000 In message , Adrian Chadd writes: > On 25 November 2017 at 14:16, Cy Schubert wrote: > > In message <201711252206.vAPM6a0A060208@slippy.cwsent.com>, Cy Schubert > > writes: > >> In message <20171125213454.GA10490@lonesome.com>, Mark Linimon writes: > >> > On Sat, Nov 25, 2017 at 11:18:02AM -0800, Cy Schubert wrote: > >> > > 1. Make fortune a port. > >> > > >> > A port for the "classical" fortunes file has already been added. > >> > >> Indeed, in bsdgames. Like really?! What's all the fuss about? Just nuke > >> from base then. I have half a mind to just blow it away now and be done > >> with all this nonsense. > > > > > > Apologies for the frustration. While taking breaks from putting in new > > electrical in this 104 year old house, my extreme frustration at the > > plumbing and joists in my way to completing what should be a simple job is > > spilling over on list. > > You and me both. > > Mmm lead paint, asbestos and knob/tube wiring tapped infinitely... Yuck. That is not fun. I should stop complaining and feeling miserable. :\ -- Cheers, Cy Schubert FreeBSD UNIX: Web: http://www.FreeBSD.org The need of the many outweighs the greed of the few.