From owner-freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Thu Aug 10 14:06:19 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10615DD3BBA for ; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 14:06:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gjb@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:6074::16:84]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "freefall.freebsd.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E116F23DF; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 14:06:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gjb@FreeBSD.org) Received: from FreeBSD.org (freefall.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:6074::16:84]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by freefall.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DF84EF78; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 14:06:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gjb@FreeBSD.org) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2017 14:06:15 +0000 From: Glen Barber To: freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Subject: pkgbase update and progress Message-ID: <20170810140615.GD63224@FreeBSD.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="vni90+aGYgRvsTuO" Content-Disposition: inline X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 11.0-STABLE amd64 X-SCUD-Definition: Sudden Completely Unexpected Dataloss X-SULE-Definition: Sudden Unexpected Learning Event X-PEKBAC-Definition: Problem Exists, Keyboard Between Admin/Computer X-Spidey-Sense: Uh oh, Peter logged in User-Agent: Mutt/1.8.2 (2017-04-18) X-BeenThere: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Packaging the FreeBSD base system." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2017 14:06:19 -0000 --vni90+aGYgRvsTuO Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Hi, For those not following svn-src-head (or an equivalent list), there have been a few pkgbase-related commits recently. Of particular interest: 1) The runtime package now depends on the kernel package. This was done to force the kernel package to be installed before the userland so upgrades can be done in a manner following the recommended upgrade path for source-based upgrades in UPDATING. (Meaning, install the kernel, reboot, install the userland, reboot.) Which brings me to... 2) A message is now printed, recommending the kernel package be upgraded with 'pkg install FreeBSD-kernel-${KERNCONF}', allowing the user to cancel the operation. Note, the message is not printed if TERM is not set or ASSUME_ALWAYS_YES is true. In order to get this to work correctly when multiple kernels are built, the runtime package depends on the first, and only the first, kernel built (i.e., the first kernel listed in KERNCONF on the command line or in make.conf(5)). I am only mentioning these in this email as they're user-facing, and although I have tested things work as expected, I am sure someone will run into something I have not considered. That brings me to the update on packaging base. There was a pkgbase session held at BSDCam early this month, with a few notes taken. I have put the notes at the bottom of the pkgbase Wiki page: https://wiki.freebsd.org/PkgBase In addition, I updated the page yesterday to reflect a few "things we need" items that occurred to me over the past week or so. There are a few notes from the pkgbase session that do not provide enough information or are unclear to me what is intended. (Not to point out anyone specific, but can whoever added "Userland packages sets" to the list please clarify?) Anyway, now that 11.1-RELEASE is done, I'm back to getting my hands dirty with pkgbase, which I am sure some of you have guessed, right now is targeted for 12.0-RELEASE. (On a side note, who outside of bapt@ knows the gory internals of pkg(8) and has commit access to the upstream repository?) Thanks, Glen --vni90+aGYgRvsTuO Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCAAdFiEEjRJAPC5sqwhs9k2jAxRYpUeP4pMFAlmMaFcACgkQAxRYpUeP 4pOW6g/+KPqEqtb7rSe5PpWhJ06KzmQpUwTMkqoLNXu1Rs3jq+wHTwKRX0sIJxka lXOsRrgT202A/edqBFW1ff0E4fO5SzlYHRCLuA1vePFqcqdh4Patxp3CI5nobA7g 1hNg6WxalYdBkY9axcy2JsNAXFsLyIAtpEQZJDyiPqY3H2feh+EsfKoyGUlmX6YW QRvfsyJozpwMRZ7UooDpTbqTi4BggRM6lwe59sDEUuElxywoyzi0OgKpzIsjfCi+ g/4grvdPg54XE/bHURTb471zPzpvYUCSnq0qD6qqboMcEskpH0POWUCPy5b1EqhB Z6R2S2fIDE/SKzUxCeZmuIoWYmYIuqUMaWQRUKOgOslbGWYei0xq7gW9hZHlHHWn qq5IKF7BxNavgzBAD9i3PgqTSVtDEYp3BEXjIQ4g1oP53t9ULbyth6Dv2MDXPiOs MrKV7sPea2oAqJmf+8OOW+eCJdRPUNYi8rOGOD8AsNhNUxMA6Yq5ktx+ZRkvst3F Z1uvSiCIm8580+WLz4+NDTMaGXnI+j+F2DaUIY3JAzbiwnCFU5P9nc/1WO0qCLFb TonJ4hkzI6ETVJDkFgxy+9ZWoQcioSJXLuSmgiTv11rdepWb9eIZDVgrYks7Mhgx 9qpUYe/s6aZXITbH8Q9K3/nQSAY9k4nC+wGgs37cOpfkwAm8+hs= =D5Fb -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --vni90+aGYgRvsTuO-- From owner-freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Thu Aug 10 15:18:38 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F3DBDD5600 for ; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 15:18:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jmaloney@ixsystems.com) Received: from mx.ixsystems.com (mx.ixsystems.com [12.229.62.28]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN ".", Issuer "." (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EEF1B64366; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 15:18:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jmaloney@ixsystems.com) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mx.ixsystems.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3xSsGc5fGMzCsTs; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 08:18:32 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ixsystems.com; h=x-mailer:content-transfer-encoding:content-type:content-type :mime-version:subject:subject:references:in-reply-to:message-id :from:from:date:date:received:received:received:received :received:received:received; s=dkim; t=1502378301; x=1504192702; bh=ftLWsayEa/yEaV53RweCx6uF/ip/T9MR917Ver2I0RI=; b=qzUV7QJIm/Ih 2GIxwbaQG7KzkluVftDcs9gGSyX0Lnf8FE0yarWPDpnXZ5dSaYNmkLek2RnyboE6 Atqp1csk7amQ9oVqeHgpSrsDkHlUP8DV2DUlTcsgIsZdQjSoOR+EFdomgxwdmgwV oo9wSyJlG9hVZMJ3/DNES8vzUUjWzBxO0SqQuVAgiHLMfhdXHhFQScXjnOqjW76W 2g5Xa5jDhBpdY1zvjNqIr0WG+Gmg8WGAgi4ldA+K8r9zpoxmaJf/BJOO29vgSQ4y wSJ44IJhEwJnScMHbse1Ck2YXvkvQY9ixp40TCA+Chk2+OKGRUqUk0ISKEC3/V78 N/bcl7AiRg== X-Amavis-Modified: Mail body modified (using disclaimer) - mx.ixsystems.com X-Virus-Scanned: Scrollout F1 at ixsystems.com Received: from mx.ixsystems.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mx.ixsystems.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id wQcMqns29sOg; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 08:18:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zimbra.ixsystems.com (mail.ixsystems.com [10.246.0.20]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx.ixsystems.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3xSsGP2CDSzCsTn; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 08:18:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.ixsystems.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 465BC4600EE; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 08:18:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zimbra.ixsystems.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.ixsystems.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10032) with ESMTP id OMF57TSo9Plv; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 08:18:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.ixsystems.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4645D4600FA; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 08:18:20 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at ixsystems.com Received: from zimbra.ixsystems.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.ixsystems.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id r1OR25O17C3u; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 08:18:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zimbra.ixsystems.com (zimbra.ixsystems.com [10.246.0.20]) by zimbra.ixsystems.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 199744600EE; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 08:18:20 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2017 08:18:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Joe Maloney To: Glen Barber Cc: freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Message-ID: <1218488026.1377609.1502378299872.JavaMail.zimbra@ixsystems.com> In-Reply-To: <20170810140615.GD63224@FreeBSD.org> References: <20170810140615.GD63224@FreeBSD.org> Subject: Re: pkgbase update and progress MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Originating-IP: [10.246.0.20] X-Mailer: Zimbra 8.7.7_GA_1787 (ZimbraWebClient - FF54 ([unknown])/8.7.7_GA_1787) Thread-Topic: pkgbase update and progress Thread-Index: Btn+lkD+lkWzsJ/M5y9tyqucEK3JNA== X-BeenThere: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Packaging the FreeBSD base system." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2017 15:18:38 -0000 Thanks for the update Glen. For TrueOS we are running into a few interesting scenarios with pkg base which I think may be worth mentioning. * Due to the fact pc-sysinstall installs FreeBSD-* some users have packages such as FreeBSD-atm which are never cleaned up during upgrades. * Since we have no mechanism of properly merging changes to /etc we simply copy files as needed with pc-updatemanager, and it is difficult to maintain what should be updated, merged, or removed. We know that the meta pkg for base, and etc upgrading are on the list of todos. Just wanted to share the current status of pkg base in TrueOS. If you are looking for feedback on particular things we can probably get that for you in short order. -- Joe Maloney QA Manager / iXsystems Enterprise Storage & Servers Driven By Open Source ----- Original Message ----- From: "Glen Barber" To: freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2017 10:06:15 AM Subject: pkgbase update and progress Hi, For those not following svn-src-head (or an equivalent list), there have been a few pkgbase-related commits recently. Of particular interest: 1) The runtime package now depends on the kernel package. This was done to force the kernel package to be installed before the userland so upgrades can be done in a manner following the recommended upgrade path for source-based upgrades in UPDATING. (Meaning, install the kernel, reboot, install the userland, reboot.) Which brings me to... 2) A message is now printed, recommending the kernel package be upgraded with 'pkg install FreeBSD-kernel-${KERNCONF}', allowing the user to cancel the operation. Note, the message is not printed if TERM is not set or ASSUME_ALWAYS_YES is true. In order to get this to work correctly when multiple kernels are built, the runtime package depends on the first, and only the first, kernel built (i.e., the first kernel listed in KERNCONF on the command line or in make.conf(5)). I am only mentioning these in this email as they're user-facing, and although I have tested things work as expected, I am sure someone will run into something I have not considered. That brings me to the update on packaging base. There was a pkgbase session held at BSDCam early this month, with a few notes taken. I have put the notes at the bottom of the pkgbase Wiki page: https://wiki.freebsd.org/PkgBase In addition, I updated the page yesterday to reflect a few "things we need" items that occurred to me over the past week or so. There are a few notes from the pkgbase session that do not provide enough information or are unclear to me what is intended. (Not to point out anyone specific, but can whoever added "Userland packages sets" to the list please clarify?) Anyway, now that 11.1-RELEASE is done, I'm back to getting my hands dirty with pkgbase, which I am sure some of you have guessed, right now is targeted for 12.0-RELEASE. (On a side note, who outside of bapt@ knows the gory internals of pkg(8) and has commit access to the upstream repository?) Thanks, Glen From owner-freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Thu Aug 10 15:21:54 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E4ABDD570C for ; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 15:21:54 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gjb@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:6074::16:84]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "freefall.freebsd.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1A1B3647E3; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 15:21:54 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gjb@FreeBSD.org) Received: from FreeBSD.org (freefall.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:6074::16:84]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by freefall.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 14033290D; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 15:21:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gjb@FreeBSD.org) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2017 15:21:51 +0000 From: Glen Barber To: Joe Maloney Cc: freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: pkgbase update and progress Message-ID: <20170810152151.GB82820@FreeBSD.org> References: <20170810140615.GD63224@FreeBSD.org> <1218488026.1377609.1502378299872.JavaMail.zimbra@ixsystems.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="K8nIJk4ghYZn606h" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <1218488026.1377609.1502378299872.JavaMail.zimbra@ixsystems.com> X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 11.0-STABLE amd64 X-SCUD-Definition: Sudden Completely Unexpected Dataloss X-SULE-Definition: Sudden Unexpected Learning Event X-PEKBAC-Definition: Problem Exists, Keyboard Between Admin/Computer X-Spidey-Sense: Uh oh, Peter logged in User-Agent: Mutt/1.8.2 (2017-04-18) X-BeenThere: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Packaging the FreeBSD base system." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2017 15:21:54 -0000 --K8nIJk4ghYZn606h Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Joe, On Thu, Aug 10, 2017 at 08:18:19AM -0700, Joe Maloney wrote: > Thanks for the update Glen. For TrueOS we are running into a few > interesting scenarios with pkg base which I think may be worth > mentioning. >=20 > * Due to the fact pc-sysinstall installs FreeBSD-* some users > have packages such as FreeBSD-atm which are never cleaned up during > upgrades. Yes, this is one issue that has been outstanding for some time. I thought it was already in the Wiki, but added it yesterday. > * Since we have no mechanism of properly merging changes to /etc > we simply copy files as needed with pc-updatemanager, and it is > difficult to maintain what should be updated, merged, or removed. >=20 This is another long-standing item in the list of things to fix, indeed. > We know that the meta pkg for base, and etc upgrading are on the > list of todos. Just wanted to share the current status of pkg base > in TrueOS. If you are looking for feedback on particular things > we can probably get that for you in short order. >=20 Nothing specific that I can think of, but thank you for this feedback, and of course for experimenting with this. Glen --K8nIJk4ghYZn606h Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCAAdFiEEjRJAPC5sqwhs9k2jAxRYpUeP4pMFAlmMeg8ACgkQAxRYpUeP 4pOqtA//SQUKBPZGMiGrwqkgCiTwvYN1Fg7E9YDspb7Q/EafL+l1XF4u2NC/IXKd +z3eIMaXUB2VuZqsEvWWRRjU5cUu2OSTPXh7nke6s+0Jm9dWqLORe1ljYpuZiNmB 3SL/wyiE4KMTJm8VK8PHQg9iogllODUxOlFfayHDFgJj68TpGX5r+9SUxxtU8UFG n38azWSJ1Sv2xtBHAJKyVxeURA8NP3ec1zqCuooj9TuXvY8tNHL40PvhKfSynjMi tTVz0+joCkPIHGEEhb+GBvPctA+jGtsNpxAdBXWsBoT0LB8xVjc23sxDF1Ev+NLe HeMDbPVPYL9thKX+sD5inH5fFuFjBVsgBG1Wj82DJy9u//8NRV4tU+gwAVMYS/3Y 4SPWuC1RKGBkiv0Y4mmKCeQL0+lD2HyDzSEbYDTeORxh3FAgg6DLbgxB3lDe2rvn HSNynp+4gtMqEUBmRheLdrRLuWCKBLw6q61ma7f2Wk8tIwjR9q7VHI20qhLUg9Va 7OU9RAKVC0pi77jAezq8fF2Xw7KuOl5ofsl81zKOSsug91EZhb1bRZt4t77/3s0p 94T2ONthM5CPp8a6/quN1F/sccLZDWDs3vmR8hpdQRxL6P/A9pyZAq+Q1FN2vXMb nl6LTNJvcEtXCSJbSheEpbzC0XMCMKWs8IC3ChjB2zqqHVXyOOo= =NNQI -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --K8nIJk4ghYZn606h-- From owner-freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Thu Aug 10 15:35:01 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DBC99DD5EB3 for ; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 15:35:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from matthew@FreeBSD.org) Received: from smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk (smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk [81.2.117.100]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk", Issuer "infracaninophile.co.uk" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8907F65590 for ; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 15:35:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from matthew@FreeBSD.org) Received: from liminal.local (unknown [IPv6:2001:8b0:151:1:1c1d:86a1:a200:b700]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: m.seaman@infracaninophile.co.uk) by smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 041AF90A2 for ; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 15:34:59 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk; dmarc=none header.from=FreeBSD.org Authentication-Results: smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk/041AF90A2; dkim=none; dkim-atps=neutral Subject: Re: pkgbase update and progress To: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org References: <20170810140615.GD63224@FreeBSD.org> <1218488026.1377609.1502378299872.JavaMail.zimbra@ixsystems.com> <20170810152151.GB82820@FreeBSD.org> From: Matthew Seaman Message-ID: Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2017 16:34:58 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.12; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.2.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20170810152151.GB82820@FreeBSD.org> Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="ARNcXD8gnPam9p9lRMXgP6aApHm3n3hdw" X-BeenThere: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Packaging the FreeBSD base system." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2017 15:35:02 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --ARNcXD8gnPam9p9lRMXgP6aApHm3n3hdw Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="W27EaNpUVXie6kwbDX06knivpn8IbnEcB"; protected-headers="v1" From: Matthew Seaman To: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Message-ID: Subject: Re: pkgbase update and progress References: <20170810140615.GD63224@FreeBSD.org> <1218488026.1377609.1502378299872.JavaMail.zimbra@ixsystems.com> <20170810152151.GB82820@FreeBSD.org> In-Reply-To: <20170810152151.GB82820@FreeBSD.org> --W27EaNpUVXie6kwbDX06knivpn8IbnEcB Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Language: en-GB Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 10/08/2017 16:21, Glen Barber wrote: >> * Since we have no mechanism of properly merging changes to /etc >> we simply copy files as needed with pc-updatemanager, and it is >> difficult to maintain what should be updated, merged, or removed. >> > This is another long-standing item in the list of things to fix, indeed= =2E The idea floated at BSDCam was to have a package that would install a pristine copy of the /etc files under /var/db/etcupdate and prompt the user to then use that tool to update or install their configs. That should provide a nice compromise between having the files available from pkgs and not enforcing a specific mechanism (tools, not policy) to update /etc. Cheers, Matthew --W27EaNpUVXie6kwbDX06knivpn8IbnEcB-- --ARNcXD8gnPam9p9lRMXgP6aApHm3n3hdw Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQJ8BAEBCgBmBQJZjH0iXxSAAAAAAC4AKGlzc3Vlci1mcHJAbm90YXRpb25zLm9w ZW5wZ3AuZmlmdGhob3JzZW1hbi5uZXQ2NTNBNjhCOTEzQTRFNkNGM0UxRTEzMjZC QjIzQUY1MThFMUE0MDEzAAoJELsjr1GOGkATB3oQAI5vTET+XrhBsEVjf9MkN254 nCG2hZh61Xb2V3lXoGtlEi1WirHVnZUqp4rt+t9KoCnVXFu1oQifnmmz2SWsdsdD 97TFJUAyKpfF/aB8nu5Nd62i/bsw5OeSAR5UEzZJx55QutB61fGMxISeyBmgWpoQ amvNkn7nwJ4tdJ3I09V0mqmjPk9/3gUProoRI7xyOmjxrvYZtOdVHKfLeAG493rg EGh/9de6N70f8DzhBP7OOJIzmAaPouDwvwP0IBHr8N3KBmDQRn96dZtuSEDiS1aD RCc1njnXZF+c698OyXmdGTs7wkOVIRAKCsevKpcCe/c7C6VVQbYN8pXJfutVmF46 lTwamRMLpAN85ccGmb3TsEO4+0vjPYvilqB+l+9vAauGVC9MBVXwlUh+r9v0t0fz o6iFASEPs/niOnnfFEXVDgrIP2DcD02a3Xh3L5wwAguZB533dYjz9heMl1L5ZfU6 sn+A5QItPLINwkqyH6QKtl3LeCspLoQPBineTu4gabQEoLSY8dev/wxjklo759P3 /ANcvlnZ5fCDtCGEj66cswFw1araZnLNQ4zq2SuAtjQA8CwAjnFzW2BmcQdNi+4n zTG8p5STzMykg8Slmwa36EOhng4rT1FjvVo5RmOBl2RSI7GWffI/N4dU3Zhsedb1 aknPejHKZLyRbSjHnT4A =y23F -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --ARNcXD8gnPam9p9lRMXgP6aApHm3n3hdw-- From owner-freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Thu Aug 10 15:38:43 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C749DD60C9 for ; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 15:38:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gjb@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:6074::16:84]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "freefall.freebsd.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 478CA65A49; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 15:38:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gjb@FreeBSD.org) Received: from FreeBSD.org (freefall.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:6074::16:84]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by freefall.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 722E135D9; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 15:38:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gjb@FreeBSD.org) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2017 15:38:40 +0000 From: Glen Barber To: Matthew Seaman Cc: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Subject: Re: pkgbase update and progress Message-ID: <20170810153840.GC82820@FreeBSD.org> References: <20170810140615.GD63224@FreeBSD.org> <1218488026.1377609.1502378299872.JavaMail.zimbra@ixsystems.com> <20170810152151.GB82820@FreeBSD.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="CblX+4bnyfN0pR09" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 11.0-STABLE amd64 X-SCUD-Definition: Sudden Completely Unexpected Dataloss X-SULE-Definition: Sudden Unexpected Learning Event X-PEKBAC-Definition: Problem Exists, Keyboard Between Admin/Computer X-Spidey-Sense: Uh oh, Peter logged in User-Agent: Mutt/1.8.2 (2017-04-18) X-BeenThere: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Packaging the FreeBSD base system." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2017 15:38:43 -0000 --CblX+4bnyfN0pR09 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, Aug 10, 2017 at 04:34:58PM +0100, Matthew Seaman wrote: > On 10/08/2017 16:21, Glen Barber wrote: > >> * Since we have no mechanism of properly merging changes to /etc > >> we simply copy files as needed with pc-updatemanager, and it is > >> difficult to maintain what should be updated, merged, or removed. > >> > > This is another long-standing item in the list of things to fix, indeed. >=20 > The idea floated at BSDCam was to have a package that would install a > pristine copy of the /etc files under /var/db/etcupdate and prompt the > user to then use that tool to update or install their configs. That > should provide a nice compromise between having the files available from > pkgs and not enforcing a specific mechanism (tools, not policy) to > update /etc. >=20 Yeah, this came up at BSDCan last year, I think. I think this is the right approach. Glen --CblX+4bnyfN0pR09 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCAAdFiEEjRJAPC5sqwhs9k2jAxRYpUeP4pMFAlmMfgAACgkQAxRYpUeP 4pOxGg/+M2JnrtEqX325Rz2NRRqOqkdSRtfFq9l/CQKxGhq+hm3xsfgatgLIFDmn nH6zULhUJ5ei95TI/95D8Zb2bBvj/338tfHiV/efmZOciEvZLCFgfaGrQoJzhij5 dr/1oa+cQZ4BrAljWXbpPVlhf5R+ll+nFoCfG0mAaL3zDdhlVFxUhKnIg4oPSFkS zmPBeNkumRL4CF/JcgMz993Uv3aWGVy3oVGxeQDO5roO9ZeMYHOjdn8gALtH+i3R KUFVvUN3ZljeoZ19Fwz4WA3+KelUbkNX8E1tB58MQJtZjceDYBzqc2WRA8EqUB8F eHAoBK7SEYWmKZ8YmBT4tos0WOzLr6bspczURjdo3Am9TrvuYVU1SZq3LqyZcB8t FFzMybmwWpg07DLBezDgqS1nrBkJIjAJd3RT13r6sgHwHAeE4dP7LCsCTLp7DuBd jzJYCpiPzo/cQh57kl4p6q/QejkiVQY8e1qhI9d1bHkjDlZRMsNZZ8fNrqOzwj1O PMVHzAFfO/dvRkco3PkYMP17ZCf0scGpYknZWPOzJ7rDzwOiEH9N05T0yqZxZc+q tAaX5Ft+2E9ryVdgYqPG4dCuc1lj9Ey83WzMjnWDpMBSbOB1xv6pvmwNm+A9MWP8 7/oRC/SPPm6n5Crs4qamAeZEdc25HWI62I/T4TNODEufUoLAHCQ= =77mU -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --CblX+4bnyfN0pR09-- From owner-freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Thu Aug 10 23:05:18 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96AAAC08FD5 for ; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 23:05:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from woodsb02@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ua0-x22d.google.com (mail-ua0-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400c:c08::22d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5037E74E90; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 23:05:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from woodsb02@gmail.com) Received: by mail-ua0-x22d.google.com with SMTP id f9so9199457uaf.4; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 16:05:18 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=DYzNklmwGbSfI1AT7a3giQIqvnJBAHQ76fl3aUxz+HQ=; b=LWba0gqalhmOzSmPIbWyssXRAJotqb1RgasV+2kpCbeoOSSV90R0mOnym/fHCyqOqf +/sTkX1UDKW1d+zizsNs7fITC8IATZi+hRrIrVYtMEKRdQpogFYuqFvWt1GnVQfPbs+z 0vvMDQtasSdmG6Qw/JWYFUY8rO+DuFmWe/MTHI7T0U2fJ7RhPkmxZrTc0ESGgU8QJN4m GuGKi/oJk4OB7OTGC2SZhPV3a1cpFLUsR+VOabzX8T0mLDzEbO4Af06VQlh93ww2LgxQ oY4PA++0M/Cpdm/YwmZSzvOhmI+hshQkJWNxEf3r78khHHdoYfM5YGtX1bcsq7oFlwki 5Jxg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=DYzNklmwGbSfI1AT7a3giQIqvnJBAHQ76fl3aUxz+HQ=; b=NMPBJFNBBM8cbDSbGUNX9U4EgHIfUTqE9LCkRNWL7Q85mzuoXlnhX+ZHNzUg9TqJjP zD3dLwODTmUojjgZRYVD7iVuuc1EanjCvuWH/Le5iSQ7gmDmmMwdz3TIcr7QKs4qqQqH sH8gYHW9Z82Z8HElm3WikeZStDC9jqnM9qTARAq97LASkxw6Sk7NuNNd3NP51d+M9MvE iLEpqDLprvwjf0b6eIGhmupDJx/sK9YofFFD9CLkFhAr+zmeeN+M0f4mUa43ZGVC4gHS I5DPuUXebJOsNVKcu/G9yrY/z8o+7+T1gw8IlLFjlPjvip5mnqmLmefJSoKTaOYYXYWi zSpw== X-Gm-Message-State: AHYfb5iiJtQ4MYv8IDjHIPKnIJ/yDyo+kb0d1iDalPZkShL5Ew6Y2iKE tOm+8JS8pzqR/xqXP/8WXiKXCfo7OfjZ X-Received: by 10.176.84.153 with SMTP id p25mr10153008uaa.174.1502406317183; Thu, 10 Aug 2017 16:05:17 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20170810140615.GD63224@FreeBSD.org> <1218488026.1377609.1502378299872.JavaMail.zimbra@ixsystems.com> <20170810152151.GB82820@FreeBSD.org> In-Reply-To: From: Ben Woods Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2017 23:05:06 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: pkgbase update and progress To: Matthew Seaman , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.23 X-BeenThere: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Packaging the FreeBSD base system." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2017 23:05:18 -0000 On Thu, 10 Aug 2017 at 11:35 pm, Matthew Seaman wrote: > On 10/08/2017 16:21, Glen Barber wrote: > >> * Since we have no mechanism of properly merging changes to /etc > >> we simply copy files as needed with pc-updatemanager, and it is > >> difficult to maintain what should be updated, merged, or removed. > >> > > This is another long-standing item in the list of things to fix, indeed. > > The idea floated at BSDCam was to have a package that would install a > pristine copy of the /etc files under /var/db/etcupdate and prompt the > user to then use that tool to update or install their configs. That > should provide a nice compromise between having the files available from > pkgs and not enforcing a specific mechanism (tools, not policy) to > update /etc. > I haven't attended either of the conferences, and I'm sure this would have been discussed, but for those of us who weren't there: Pkgng has 3-way merge capability (copied from fossil-scm in pkg 1.4.0). Why are we considering using it? Not having ever seen this functionality used, I would have thought the only things to do would be agree on where the pristine old copy would be stored (.sample files in /etc?) and perhaps improve pkgng if the user experience isn't satisfactory. Regards, Ben -- -- From: Benjamin Woods woodsb02@gmail.com From owner-freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Fri Aug 11 07:57:45 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96F79DC97C2 for ; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 07:57:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from matthew@FreeBSD.org) Received: from smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk (smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk [IPv6:2001:8b0:151:1:c4ea:bd49:619b:6cb3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk", Issuer "infracaninophile.co.uk" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 41A59655CD for ; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 07:57:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from matthew@FreeBSD.org) Received: from liminal.local (unknown [IPv6:2001:8b0:151:1:1c1d:86a1:a200:b700]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: m.seaman@infracaninophile.co.uk) by smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 620B210A4 for ; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 07:57:42 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk; dmarc=none header.from=FreeBSD.org Authentication-Results: smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk/620B210A4; dkim=none; dkim-atps=neutral Subject: Re: pkgbase update and progress To: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org References: <20170810140615.GD63224@FreeBSD.org> <1218488026.1377609.1502378299872.JavaMail.zimbra@ixsystems.com> <20170810152151.GB82820@FreeBSD.org> From: Matthew Seaman Message-ID: <8eb2fbb1-b9e2-e343-b2ba-fcdaa425c18b@FreeBSD.org> Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 08:57:35 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.12; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.2.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="THqqH3cbVMIJ6kuLTxrgTVaWACh8k50PC" X-BeenThere: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Packaging the FreeBSD base system." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 07:57:45 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --THqqH3cbVMIJ6kuLTxrgTVaWACh8k50PC Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="nIkr1io5DSurveM0X2Gr8PUFdf7nNP8lc"; protected-headers="v1" From: Matthew Seaman To: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Message-ID: <8eb2fbb1-b9e2-e343-b2ba-fcdaa425c18b@FreeBSD.org> Subject: Re: pkgbase update and progress References: <20170810140615.GD63224@FreeBSD.org> <1218488026.1377609.1502378299872.JavaMail.zimbra@ixsystems.com> <20170810152151.GB82820@FreeBSD.org> In-Reply-To: --nIkr1io5DSurveM0X2Gr8PUFdf7nNP8lc Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-GB Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 11/08/2017 00:05, Ben Woods wrote: > On Thu, 10 Aug 2017 at 11:35 pm, Matthew Seaman w= rote: >=20 >> On 10/08/2017 16:21, Glen Barber wrote: >>>> * Since we have no mechanism of properly merging changes to /etc >>>> we simply copy files as needed with pc-updatemanager, and it is >>>> difficult to maintain what should be updated, merged, or removed. >>>> >>> This is another long-standing item in the list of things to fix, inde= ed. >> >> The idea floated at BSDCam was to have a package that would install a >> pristine copy of the /etc files under /var/db/etcupdate and prompt the= >> user to then use that tool to update or install their configs. That >> should provide a nice compromise between having the files available fr= om >> pkgs and not enforcing a specific mechanism (tools, not policy) to >> update /etc. >> > I haven't attended either of the conferences, and I'm sure this would h= ave > been discussed, but for those of us who weren't there: >=20 > Pkgng has 3-way merge capability (copied from fossil-scm in pkg 1.4.0).= Why > are we considering using it? Not having ever seen this functionality us= ed, > I would have thought the only things to do would be agree on where the > pristine old copy would be stored (.sample files in /etc?) and perhaps > improve pkgng if the user experience isn't satisfactory. Yes, that is another alternative. At the moment we're all theorising about this it's going to work, but until we can get empirical and start testing some actual code, we aren't going to be drawing any firm conclusions. I think etcupdate(8) has a longer history and people are more familiar with it whereas the 3-way merge code in pkg(8) has been exercised relatively rarely. There's also considerations about how this would fit into various different workflows -- everything from people that only ever download the standard pre-compiled packages for a release, to developers trying to cross-build highly customized embedded systems. Having a 'merge' step that is separated from the 'install' step seems advantageous in that it allows a point where people can substitute in their own alternatives for managing /etc files. Cheers, Matthew --nIkr1io5DSurveM0X2Gr8PUFdf7nNP8lc-- --THqqH3cbVMIJ6kuLTxrgTVaWACh8k50PC Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQJ8BAEBCgBmBQJZjWN2XxSAAAAAAC4AKGlzc3Vlci1mcHJAbm90YXRpb25zLm9w ZW5wZ3AuZmlmdGhob3JzZW1hbi5uZXQ2NTNBNjhCOTEzQTRFNkNGM0UxRTEzMjZC QjIzQUY1MThFMUE0MDEzAAoJELsjr1GOGkATFIQQAJs4SdkwwZsZ+pDyo/SxIc3N TEAOnMKCIEEtSojNcKy6Jf6NtdM4zXvJ0srhsAHPRCnStaunrJ78YWvXeyOnbHjF Nrm864G5tikHMn9OWX441eTisIgHm9KCW8+R3wr47jgZP4bC4C4tewOX8h1dsCvi 731PTdMYPMbUKyMCRD1Q6ANhxPFfGecRjwkgtu8i4qCccmtuTDWQIxlVIQktNk/D dOMxsK9I6jFsi6b7DpLd6ID/0rwGVD7+fjn54kY0Son8fKz0ogx5R9lYdqEOZW2q wBlbeXHlwfZT1QsL1VysqPMOEaI3Ba79qJQgyH+f88v0nvcMVGg+xD52i7PPykF2 G7SybDd0wIs7XhQ5yOGgUH2tXZMg1se89VkbPmHshD0bD0zkUyRu/yfA6Ko7VM20 ctbe0az4yzt4RNL6RkHFh7mo+FYgF6ZWiLYP/eiRoecFUpsV0973K6BJZGfkVuVX CpKZaJZKxvZug+cc+Q/8QlqdaNyj3hamsVXCKUMu+ckCI5nmLfMsJ/6jmoJ7LFeA d1kBG+HmetuVxlqCUYUIae86svVxvU0tlxm4VsEyt1/osvvA81rLhX9SBSWrrt9F 9xQu1tX8dyaJ7SiSmqjIEUbXsBkZSG2+UhFSkrtYc11X7j0DndL2YxnENxJ+HmHO wuEVfmuwHXsV81bLPE8w =imKQ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --THqqH3cbVMIJ6kuLTxrgTVaWACh8k50PC-- From owner-freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Fri Aug 11 10:00:36 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DAD72DC20E6 for ; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 10:00:36 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wollman@csail.mit.edu) Received: from outgoing-stata.csail.mit.edu (outgoing-stata.csail.mit.edu [128.30.2.210]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B87366A55C for ; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 10:00:36 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wollman@csail.mit.edu) Received: from [193.185.120.22] (helo=[10.100.96.32]) by outgoing-stata.csail.mit.edu with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1dg6F4-000LI4-Aj; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 05:28:30 -0400 Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 12:28:23 +0300 User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android In-Reply-To: <8eb2fbb1-b9e2-e343-b2ba-fcdaa425c18b@FreeBSD.org> (sfid-20170811_03575_2566223D) References: <20170810140615.GD63224@FreeBSD.org> <1218488026.1377609.1502378299872.JavaMail.zimbra@ixsystems.com> <20170810152151.GB82820@FreeBSD.org> <8eb2fbb1-b9e2-e343-b2ba-fcdaa425c18b@FreeBSD.org> (sfid-20170811_03575_2566223D) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: pkgbase update and progress To: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org From: Garrett Wollman Message-ID: X-BeenThere: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Packaging the FreeBSD base system." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 10:00:37 -0000 On August 11, 2017 10:57:35 AM GMT+03:00, Matthew Seaman wrote: >I think etcupdate(8) has a longer history and people are more familiar >with it whereas the 3-way merge code in pkg(8) has been exercised >relatively rarely=2E There's also considerations about how this would >fit >into various different workflows -- everything from people that only >ever download the standard pre-compiled packages for a release, to >developers trying to cross-build highly customized embedded systems=2E >Having a 'merge' step that is separated from the 'install' step seems >advantageous in that it allows a point where people can substitute in >their own alternatives for managing /etc files=2E Maybe it should be called a "configure" phase for consistency with other p= ackage managers=2E From owner-freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Fri Aug 11 13:54:22 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AEF2DDD04A7 for ; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 13:54:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gjb@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.freebsd.org [96.47.72.132]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "freefall.freebsd.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 88A4672E3E; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 13:54:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gjb@FreeBSD.org) Received: from FreeBSD.org (freefall.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:6074::16:84]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by freefall.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9E20213457; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 13:54:21 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gjb@FreeBSD.org) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 13:54:19 +0000 From: Glen Barber To: Ben Woods Cc: Matthew Seaman , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Subject: Re: pkgbase update and progress Message-ID: <20170811135419.GD82820@FreeBSD.org> References: <20170810140615.GD63224@FreeBSD.org> <1218488026.1377609.1502378299872.JavaMail.zimbra@ixsystems.com> <20170810152151.GB82820@FreeBSD.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="ieNMXl1Fr3cevapt" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 11.0-STABLE amd64 X-SCUD-Definition: Sudden Completely Unexpected Dataloss X-SULE-Definition: Sudden Unexpected Learning Event X-PEKBAC-Definition: Problem Exists, Keyboard Between Admin/Computer X-Spidey-Sense: Uh oh, Peter logged in User-Agent: Mutt/1.8.2 (2017-04-18) X-BeenThere: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Packaging the FreeBSD base system." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 13:54:22 -0000 --ieNMXl1Fr3cevapt Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, Aug 10, 2017 at 11:05:06PM +0000, Ben Woods wrote: > On Thu, 10 Aug 2017 at 11:35 pm, Matthew Seaman wro= te: >=20 > > On 10/08/2017 16:21, Glen Barber wrote: > > >> * Since we have no mechanism of properly merging changes to /etc > > >> we simply copy files as needed with pc-updatemanager, and it is > > >> difficult to maintain what should be updated, merged, or removed. > > >> > > > This is another long-standing item in the list of things to fix, inde= ed. > > > > The idea floated at BSDCam was to have a package that would install a > > pristine copy of the /etc files under /var/db/etcupdate and prompt the > > user to then use that tool to update or install their configs. That > > should provide a nice compromise between having the files available from > > pkgs and not enforcing a specific mechanism (tools, not policy) to > > update /etc. > > > I haven't attended either of the conferences, and I'm sure this would have > been discussed, but for those of us who weren't there: >=20 > Pkgng has 3-way merge capability (copied from fossil-scm in pkg 1.4.0). W= hy > are we considering using it? Not having ever seen this functionality used, > I would have thought the only things to do would be agree on where the > pristine old copy would be stored (.sample files in /etc?) and perhaps > improve pkgng if the user experience isn't satisfactory. >=20 The problem isn't with pkg(8) ability to do a 3-way merge, but the way the relevant files are handled and installed by the installworld and distribute targets. Last I messed with etc/Makefile, for example, everyone using a packaged base that upgraded during a 12-hour timeframe (give or take) ended up with their /etc/master.passwd being overridden. This is the kind of fallout I do not want to experience again. I have been wanting to refactor etc/Makefile for some time, but I am not confident that rewriting it to meet packaged base needs is sufficient. I think we should instead use the tools that exist to do what they are written to do, regardless of an etc/Makefile rewrite. Hopefully this clarifies it a bit more. Glen --ieNMXl1Fr3cevapt Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCAAdFiEEjRJAPC5sqwhs9k2jAxRYpUeP4pMFAlmNtwYACgkQAxRYpUeP 4pO5gA//U6UKGz80Q9n/SfPJBPyu60mx1nP6GYTRyrPi4+V9Ca8O1jMk6UC4jaE+ +0hiA4DFhnzFHWwKptlujv6fN1JacCX9LwlQY4CGl9lteALNURZXgRTlvdtAdxIK KL0+CJeOPyYfno1rxIi1tcuNvktzk1LtdstKq7q7lwhd4lyFxPH77CAL0hcIbdAI 7oIMfR1H4gES2PJ0M3Crh1UCcdsiVOEAGqx5ITW9a5GGbb0QKZV1XMJty+rnfwSQ w45E2yDosO5SmfwdlAn0s4lIBjaKhZceNJOREj0zZso+WBKWdRW1d0lEVQ2m1hbY 8zlDL4WBdRLXK+3P3nvc8UbFaxYNCjd2hSX/nfQJnx9J3oFYnJQ+ed+e9pzJpuwo cEoc6Lt3/E9OvtdSP7ncHrDfYPtmpLb0ascImTCfNd1mgDaU+jUXUgYDdipyKVBu P0wwak+07QcCAddczYNPTOpPHffTjGUn8gqzgamzgctvHo/LUXRIM0LrSV3eZsLQ szPHyZXvAV/aWvMA8Tmfu6BxzYqWoTepVhmtcULE6ywcirKUFDEDzxrc6VCIfCn3 Vvu6F5ZSjrpMiUW8an2pq944XKEWmULXcvbK46IGi6kegCglN4iP4JaiiokmpvSm S4R3k7ylbB5c1cT9MOodO/0JWQw3XAmY+S/9H8fie0Bar0H2OM4= =ldUY -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --ieNMXl1Fr3cevapt-- From owner-freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Fri Aug 11 14:00:24 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 87F1CDD0978 for ; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 14:00:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bapt@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:6074::16:84]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "freefall.freebsd.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 66E0E730FA; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 14:00:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bapt@FreeBSD.org) Received: by freefall.freebsd.org (Postfix, from userid 1235) id 54DDD1366C; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 14:00:20 +0000 (UTC) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 16:00:20 +0200 From: Baptiste Daroussin To: Matthew Seaman Cc: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Subject: Re: pkgbase update and progress Message-ID: <20170811140019.h2elquhljvhuwopo@ivaldir.net> References: <20170810140615.GD63224@FreeBSD.org> <1218488026.1377609.1502378299872.JavaMail.zimbra@ixsystems.com> <20170810152151.GB82820@FreeBSD.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="jdhecmaoichglwar" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: NeoMutt/20170714 (1.8.3) X-BeenThere: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Packaging the FreeBSD base system." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 14:00:24 -0000 --jdhecmaoichglwar Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, Aug 10, 2017 at 04:34:58PM +0100, Matthew Seaman wrote: > On 10/08/2017 16:21, Glen Barber wrote: > >> * Since we have no mechanism of properly merging changes to /etc > >> we simply copy files as needed with pc-updatemanager, and it is > >> difficult to maintain what should be updated, merged, or removed. > >> > > This is another long-standing item in the list of things to fix, indeed. >=20 > The idea floated at BSDCam was to have a package that would install a > pristine copy of the /etc files under /var/db/etcupdate and prompt the > user to then use that tool to update or install their configs. That > should provide a nice compromise between having the files available from > pkgs and not enforcing a specific mechanism (tools, not policy) to > update /etc. >=20 Why we do not stick with what was discussed before? pkg know how to do 3 way merge and is configurable not to break anything. The only thing that is needed is to prepend the plist entry with an @config That's all. Why do we need something else? Bapt --jdhecmaoichglwar Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAABCAAdFiEEgOTj3suS2urGXVU3Y4mL3PG3PloFAlmNuHEACgkQY4mL3PG3 PlqVzA/+ICrorbLmXAn82tW0iV7ugW137f9nRYUh1V7CuXKk51Qhpp2Ev9kY/UXB ErDrXRm89gkDxrt49FFUwuvNqSq2wnq4YBTwKvcSSrj5y6ioCYH3+iOcJJ1vphbb 4ZnL0gvsr9aumi63WfVXvAnCiDST+N3Q7jYQXdGN+XGoVNRN/TE1d1E6wvaQjmAt jnomqKuTlAnTUbDLRUUcmBotV/9nMcJhWbAAoDZjmb5bpz3yW6Wf4UophW3aiEOl hp0DtrNFcQKEqHWiWeA3iI18OyRAgSrgEd+jYKbwVRdCW2BAm1pUiM5xCfOsBmil B9MX2d1FwDKFj1qTIsHDkdd9hqQrmSRxjinsr1icISuHhp3dLk4vjMm42fa0+9wj 5FetyC8oAmbchOmjx+3iECJtzimuTEzlpgVnthuBAUFjoArxq6Wk5s+0gpbb+k8Y /pXBSOP+jE35ns3C8whmm8g0oBBymdqxi7MyMRjoruI3c2L+YGu3V6nAor3g90u7 x/2LpFGlRhiaDJ88JQegINMQAhCd9YcJrEoZF4s5vSm3D+OO6AISk1dq30YaOG9Y B9nM5QzLBpT9ujH9h5yErej5irF4SEctnBoHQGlJzPQXoLVWlSnvlOV0HdyIdEWL LKa4MMIK2Ew1mFZAsHorqu2d84QpCkZCnH+hh4nG9ohzNtGJ4es= =C0f1 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --jdhecmaoichglwar-- From owner-freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Fri Aug 11 14:02:35 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 35536DD0BEF for ; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 14:02:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bapt@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:6074::16:84]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "freefall.freebsd.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1287773401; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 14:02:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bapt@FreeBSD.org) Received: by freefall.freebsd.org (Postfix, from userid 1235) id D8A281370B; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 14:02:29 +0000 (UTC) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 16:02:29 +0200 From: Baptiste Daroussin To: Matthew Seaman Cc: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Subject: Re: pkgbase update and progress Message-ID: <20170811140229.xmxupgjbrcfpoztd@ivaldir.net> References: <20170810140615.GD63224@FreeBSD.org> <1218488026.1377609.1502378299872.JavaMail.zimbra@ixsystems.com> <20170810152151.GB82820@FreeBSD.org> <20170811140019.h2elquhljvhuwopo@ivaldir.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="s3xwxwjkyigldzi3" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20170811140019.h2elquhljvhuwopo@ivaldir.net> User-Agent: NeoMutt/20170714 (1.8.3) X-BeenThere: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Packaging the FreeBSD base system." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 14:02:35 -0000 --s3xwxwjkyigldzi3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 04:00:20PM +0200, Baptiste Daroussin wrote: > On Thu, Aug 10, 2017 at 04:34:58PM +0100, Matthew Seaman wrote: > > On 10/08/2017 16:21, Glen Barber wrote: > > >> * Since we have no mechanism of properly merging changes to /etc > > >> we simply copy files as needed with pc-updatemanager, and it is > > >> difficult to maintain what should be updated, merged, or removed. > > >> > > > This is another long-standing item in the list of things to fix, inde= ed. > >=20 > > The idea floated at BSDCam was to have a package that would install a > > pristine copy of the /etc files under /var/db/etcupdate and prompt the > > user to then use that tool to update or install their configs. That > > should provide a nice compromise between having the files available from > > pkgs and not enforcing a specific mechanism (tools, not policy) to > > update /etc. > >=20 > Why we do not stick with what was discussed before? >=20 > pkg know how to do 3 way merge and is configurable not to break anything. > The only thing that is needed is to prepend the plist entry with an @conf= ig > That's all. >=20 > Why do we need something else? Should have read the entire thread before replying. If you decide to go that direction tell me I will rip out the 3way merge co= de =66rom pkg... Best regards, Bapt --s3xwxwjkyigldzi3 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAABCAAdFiEEgOTj3suS2urGXVU3Y4mL3PG3PloFAlmNuPUACgkQY4mL3PG3 PlpyjBAAsi829bGS0xB8D9EgMnyDWqKo4ULUR/ahRNEcfs2Wu0pcmILr2jVPg6vN 25V2pqcY7WxtT6FZrwXU92h5dPMI76jQ55jrKHLuTJN/JtPzk23Lal3CB2Uz9SY8 cDbbsxej7ZhI3Eg21ImcSxjCRWJNkwMH7qVgOnZ5CrX+xduQAL7QnK+qhlQP9eci yM029cVPsne/R/SfGmOVoKzL4vTLt7jS4rwZv+72diUQCwpNJSw9VCHTA5pPpbJ5 NFDgzZOHOo4LEHtGEY8wMS28cTKwiw6b6HVOFHE0O22doBDTQJRsgv+MjS+6RV3V P7uWklyiSDA25bTKH1jg1LjxyRdLuci/mtdnSgPPkvIJCW+dQhPXyS9h80krZYEr I9MDiYCR1pOcA0Nt0cCqAC1jbFzP/PIYDRhNzYA5571yZATBwf08yydmerOFJD+s 5KMc9sNoDeNbDlSqSAXFV5aVjzTVlf0rEy+tL3wHG7ZDGmJE/RmQh/R624vVf1Eb pIgWZJo9lH2pZdTdMBJztjzTcO08NKokfJtUAqYYdjCVBB6BDi55jPM2RwhyQdDa 8njOWcP2guhtxgsv6tsykHT250wJimY+DcjCEsVU4PKbg231ymHLLqX0ugwoeaNU cBLGMVi3gruyRzxxBa0VmLBLk80drbVQob4v86CMJGK2YE8HyEg= =SIA3 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --s3xwxwjkyigldzi3-- From owner-freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Fri Aug 11 14:09:41 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 783BCDD1131 for ; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 14:09:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gjb@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.freebsd.org [96.47.72.132]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "freefall.freebsd.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5139D735AA; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 14:09:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gjb@FreeBSD.org) Received: from FreeBSD.org (freefall.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:6074::16:84]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by freefall.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 657DD137FE; Fri, 11 Aug 2017 14:09:40 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gjb@FreeBSD.org) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 14:09:38 +0000 From: Glen Barber To: Baptiste Daroussin Cc: Matthew Seaman , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Subject: Re: pkgbase update and progress Message-ID: <20170811140938.GE82820@FreeBSD.org> References: <20170810140615.GD63224@FreeBSD.org> <1218488026.1377609.1502378299872.JavaMail.zimbra@ixsystems.com> <20170810152151.GB82820@FreeBSD.org> <20170811140019.h2elquhljvhuwopo@ivaldir.net> <20170811140229.xmxupgjbrcfpoztd@ivaldir.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="RpqchZ26BWispMcB" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20170811140229.xmxupgjbrcfpoztd@ivaldir.net> X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 11.0-STABLE amd64 X-SCUD-Definition: Sudden Completely Unexpected Dataloss X-SULE-Definition: Sudden Unexpected Learning Event X-PEKBAC-Definition: Problem Exists, Keyboard Between Admin/Computer X-Spidey-Sense: Uh oh, Peter logged in User-Agent: Mutt/1.8.2 (2017-04-18) X-BeenThere: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Packaging the FreeBSD base system." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 14:09:41 -0000 --RpqchZ26BWispMcB Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 04:02:29PM +0200, Baptiste Daroussin wrote: > On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 04:00:20PM +0200, Baptiste Daroussin wrote: > > On Thu, Aug 10, 2017 at 04:34:58PM +0100, Matthew Seaman wrote: > > > On 10/08/2017 16:21, Glen Barber wrote: > > > >> * Since we have no mechanism of properly merging changes to /etc > > > >> we simply copy files as needed with pc-updatemanager, and it is > > > >> difficult to maintain what should be updated, merged, or removed. > > > >> > > > > This is another long-standing item in the list of things to fix, in= deed. > > >=20 > > > The idea floated at BSDCam was to have a package that would install a > > > pristine copy of the /etc files under /var/db/etcupdate and prompt the > > > user to then use that tool to update or install their configs. That > > > should provide a nice compromise between having the files available f= rom > > > pkgs and not enforcing a specific mechanism (tools, not policy) to > > > update /etc. > > >=20 > > Why we do not stick with what was discussed before? > >=20 > > pkg know how to do 3 way merge and is configurable not to break anythin= g. > > The only thing that is needed is to prepend the plist entry with an @co= nfig > > That's all. > >=20 > > Why do we need something else? >=20 > Should have read the entire thread before replying. >=20 > If you decide to go that direction tell me I will rip out the 3way merge = code > from pkg... >=20 I do not think it is necessary to rip out the code. It may be needed at some point. Just my $0.02 USD. Glen --RpqchZ26BWispMcB Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCAAdFiEEjRJAPC5sqwhs9k2jAxRYpUeP4pMFAlmNuqIACgkQAxRYpUeP 4pNJ/RAAncDLnZsbZZKuUH3ZqzZM2M9o3qFfebUxOVQSivnHJNIbJrZnfDYjcTKO PvklA7y7Dx39S6Kik7PJOwjSrxi3/WxmvIKA4ulV+glswV3A4ntrJSwDKvXcnofa g1QNsiqvd6zCL4tF6EWPeaH2y0sZ4glVQ6WbDyn3pK7BnosyCwKTzma6M8K8GXb4 hdfwMmkgaQyT4ciicfxyLac6yHqvDOIZ31zLugzQaDBsKsLg6NNDrD3Kh0QmiMS9 DoTo5nSVOwLYK5n3D/Ufw//PYUovXUCuwGioylImC+6Ty0zC5HAd8HKFXZjJC3X6 HsYWBn5wlbJ4H5KEhpU5uYucvBvQafF28DK6Y2CZceAdqMUAE78lzZGglVt3Edmh 9Sj8NnAZzRlHb7u7E+WeOuEt4EMcWCLJCMY/wlYKB2+H5xqk9YNj0AbGQ0h596BN 9kZ7pfvEdsAYD2iwkZFTeEDgQgDECR6dqVTxsmY4Wz62p4GEILyMyfGIKgrOLVqY ACLVWTzOkgNql65nVo9owWjl3Cvff6k7Y5EDIVON++ApHj1NG+1Lk6H+rgIK43+o 52kCkS4VTCSDTnOTUtzZScBjo+gCgZ+0nBxL3YoTPQwzYWACUm2FTxwW8EX8LYXo BkBJ7A5kDssYBwtTgKqTZgjvAZUCFt+whoDzd58wA3Oyq+BEgZU= =tsnD -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --RpqchZ26BWispMcB--