From owner-freebsd-fcp@freebsd.org Sun Sep 1 17:43:29 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fcp@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6837E029D for ; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 17:43:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hps@selasky.org) Received: from mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (mailman.nyi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::50:13]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46M0tn3dKtz4Zfb for ; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 17:43:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hps@selasky.org) Received: by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) id 7C66EE029A; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 17:43:29 +0000 (UTC) Delivered-To: fcp@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C1A3E0298; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 17:43:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hps@selasky.org) Received: from mail.turbocat.net (turbocat.net [88.99.82.50]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 46M0tm4Nlpz4ZfY; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 17:43:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hps@selasky.org) Received: from hps2016.home.selasky.org (unknown [62.141.129.235]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.turbocat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 24F602602FE; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 19:43:13 +0200 (CEST) Subject: Re: FCP 20190401-ci_policy: CI policy To: Warner Losh , Ed Maste Cc: FreeBSD Hackers , Li-Wen Hsu , fcp@freebsd.org References: <20190829114057.GZ71821@kib.kiev.ua> <20190830065534.GC71821@kib.kiev.ua> <73111.1567263258@kaos.jnpr.net> From: Hans Petter Selasky Message-ID: <44a1a905-9b35-620b-281c-cdbbee538bed@selasky.org> Date: Sun, 1 Sep 2019 19:42:29 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.6.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 46M0tm4Nlpz4ZfY X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of hps@selasky.org designates 88.99.82.50 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=hps@selasky.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.43 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+a:mail.turbocat.net]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[selasky.org]; RCPT_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.95)[-0.948,0]; IP_SCORE(-3.19)[ip: (-9.37), ipnet: 88.99.0.0/16(-4.75), asn: 24940(-1.81), country: DE(-0.01)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:24940, ipnet:88.99.0.0/16, country:DE]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-fcp@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Community Proposals List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 Sep 2019 17:43:29 -0000 Hi, If the fallouts could be better organized through some simple guidelines, that would be more accepted I think: 1) Don't commit stuff before going off work. Even though a change looks innocent, it might break something and you'll need to fix it. 2) Organize big changes going into the kernel, to ease debugging and getting things back on track again. 3) If your patch is risky, commit it on a Monday. Don't wait until Friday. Failure to follow the rules may have consequences like other senior developers kicking in and doing temporary reverts until issues are resolved. --HPS From owner-freebsd-fcp@freebsd.org Sun Sep 1 19:34:04 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fcp@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B49FE2E17 for ; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 19:34:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yaneurabeya@gmail.com) Received: from mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (unknown [127.0.1.3]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46M3LM5VwXz3F7G for ; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 19:34:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yaneurabeya@gmail.com) Received: by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) id BB0E1E2E14; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 19:34:03 +0000 (UTC) Delivered-To: fcp@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BAB73E2E13; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 19:34:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yaneurabeya@gmail.com) Received: from mail-pl1-x632.google.com (mail-pl1-x632.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::632]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 46M3LL4tgLz3F7F; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 19:34:02 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yaneurabeya@gmail.com) Received: by mail-pl1-x632.google.com with SMTP id m9so5600902pls.8; Sun, 01 Sep 2019 12:34:02 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=l63SofxVDdd784Vg8NAJW4Os6jIUWrx1WnY+YevpVQA=; b=qt4p0mMCsPkHG9aMTQ9D1pgWW1dFa/rwZS4ddMl8lg3edjbt7Tw+XRQbNAQ060n7Y7 EnvF2yH//DQkRgNj5jG+egP89tfBQ6HX9bT3fS9HcLiSjN+W5Fz3aVtKemh2XlpWYl+b cdBgcGu6zokTbeOsjT5QfJBwZsFdSRyQ7atxVOZMgRctHCkVj8l1/gtI0oThaazWYpIq 5hoH4FqtNw1WpWDCWNCt4jMbd5O5M7/R8r8PhlJ9oXLMO+R7JUNpV0e7smEvfg/uXyyq q5MTuhWhO37Q+9WqizOzUgG1l0FRsXBF9My9yYHQQQ8Cuw+N0855VaaiGL21OUejc8U/ kQzg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=l63SofxVDdd784Vg8NAJW4Os6jIUWrx1WnY+YevpVQA=; b=n2BG9EKfq1YZdsanc6wlzC8rVG7JJWUJQ80eC0PmwZcMX99It097JkqDxY7TRGBvnm Bm8zg4sKbuDa+AKWy1ElrM74mG8OCt0KsKtNr/3EBJK3ySBatWSjXrJUwsUkWTOdaXdc yHYUc0Ndtudto9OLcWa3Ey9WVLO3oGjPEMtYObrVmyaZxUJ5gAb240fjFyUbG5mRTRKv 5ecc2Qxzdjyj3ioSUtn0xa4M6GS5DLp4fQWCvcwDGtkCzb/DBSKxWhm83/K5QFX7EgFS T+BBW3Di1I8+3YJ4sox9xVvuFqnaaSFVuaDYFU6VCc8IrWT/ghfnfxpOqQlO6R0O4MUf dSww== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXvPuQQvWuXM0+G18vcB9mMwl0LOEDmOXPku5OZnfvcChXUXVkz VFmcu0haST3EfF5ooCtqT5U= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzNdXi1saf7QuDNlXkLTtPiKk5QpC1hIfXhG0YspG4DaiqRLiA+yAqvBL4kVZ5GumeeneLF2Q== X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:b605:: with SMTP id b5mr26706199pls.103.1567366441112; Sun, 01 Sep 2019 12:34:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.20.7] (c-73-19-52-228.hsd1.wa.comcast.net. [73.19.52.228]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ck8sm10242835pjb.25.2019.09.01.12.33.59 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 01 Sep 2019 12:34:00 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.11\)) Subject: Re: FCP 20190401-ci_policy: CI policy From: Enji Cooper In-Reply-To: <44a1a905-9b35-620b-281c-cdbbee538bed@selasky.org> Date: Sun, 1 Sep 2019 12:33:59 -0700 Cc: Warner Losh , Ed Maste , FreeBSD Hackers , Li-Wen Hsu , fcp@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <8350379A-30F8-4BBD-B9AE-A3A176CAE966@gmail.com> References: <20190829114057.GZ71821@kib.kiev.ua> <20190830065534.GC71821@kib.kiev.ua> <73111.1567263258@kaos.jnpr.net> <44a1a905-9b35-620b-281c-cdbbee538bed@selasky.org> To: Hans Petter Selasky X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.11) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 46M3LL4tgLz3F7F X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=qt4p0mMC; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of yaneurabeya@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::632 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=yaneurabeya@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.49 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; RCPT_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[6]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.99)[-0.987,0]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[228.52.19.73.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-9.54), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.83), asn: 15169(-2.31), country: US(-0.05)]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2.3.6.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-fcp@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Community Proposals List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 Sep 2019 19:34:04 -0000 > On Sep 1, 2019, at 10:42 AM, Hans Petter Selasky = wrote: >=20 > Hi, >=20 > If the fallouts could be better organized through some simple = guidelines, that would be more accepted I think: >=20 > 1) Don't commit stuff before going off work. Even though a change = looks innocent, it might break something and you'll need to fix it. >=20 > 2) Organize big changes going into the kernel, to ease debugging and = getting things back on track again. >=20 > 3) If your patch is risky, commit it on a Monday. Don't wait until = Friday. >=20 > Failure to follow the rules may have consequences like other senior = developers kicking in and doing temporary reverts until issues are = resolved. Agreed. There=E2=80=99s a reason why at my most former job (FB) we = generally knew better than to commit code on a Friday. It would cause = the weekend oncalls a lot of grief. Let=E2=80=99s put it this way: think of it like being oncall for code. = If you don=E2=80=99t have someone else to work with who can manage it, = would you like to be paged if something went south with your code = committed on a Friday? Cheers, -Enji= From owner-freebsd-fcp@freebsd.org Sun Sep 1 19:48:44 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fcp@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4419FE343B for ; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 19:48:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (mailman.nyi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::50:13]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46M3gH6sCdz3Fkj for ; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 19:48:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) id EB2AFE3435; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 19:48:43 +0000 (UTC) Delivered-To: fcp@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EADBFE3434; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 19:48:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from smtp-out-so.shaw.ca (smtp-out-so.shaw.ca [64.59.136.138]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "Client", Issuer "CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 46M3gG25tNz3FkW; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 19:48:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from spqr.komquats.com ([70.67.125.17]) by shaw.ca with ESMTPA id 4Vq2iomg5SrVc4Vq3i7K7H; Sun, 01 Sep 2019 13:48:40 -0600 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.3 cv=L5ZjvNb8 c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=VFtTW3WuZNDh6VkGe7fA3g==:117 a=VFtTW3WuZNDh6VkGe7fA3g==:17 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=J70Eh1EUuV4A:10 a=pGLkceISAAAA:8 a=ndaoGXS1AAAA:8 a=YxBL1-UpAAAA:8 a=6I5d2MoRAAAA:8 a=Md3c0C-VMmJUd6EbHGwA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=mFeOnlTyF09QQMGr2mMI:22 a=Ia-lj3WSrqcvXOmTRaiG:22 a=IjZwj45LgO3ly-622nXo:22 a=pHzHmUro8NiASowvMSCR:22 a=nt3jZW36AmriUCFCBwmW:22 Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (slippy [10.1.1.91]) by spqr.komquats.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AC31F52F; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 12:48:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id x81Jmb1F004577; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 12:48:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from slippy (cy@localhost) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) with ESMTP id x81JmbS3004574; Sun, 1 Sep 2019 12:48:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Message-Id: <201909011948.x81JmbS3004574@slippy.cwsent.com> X-Authentication-Warning: slippy.cwsent.com: cy owned process doing -bs X-Mailer: exmh version 2.9.0 11/07/2018 with nmh-1.7.1 Reply-to: Cy Schubert From: Cy Schubert X-os: FreeBSD X-Sender: cy@cwsent.com X-URL: http://www.cschubert.com/ To: Enji Cooper cc: Hans Petter Selasky , FreeBSD Hackers , Ed Maste , Li-Wen Hsu , Warner Losh , fcp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FCP 20190401-ci_policy: CI policy In-reply-to: <8350379A-30F8-4BBD-B9AE-A3A176CAE966@gmail.com> References: <20190829114057.GZ71821@kib.kiev.ua> <20190830065534.GC71821@kib.kiev.ua> <73111.1567263258@kaos.jnpr.net> <44a1a905-9b35-620b-281c-cdbbee538bed@selasky.org> <8350379A-30F8-4BBD-B9AE-A3A176CAE966@gmail.com> Comments: In-reply-to Enji Cooper message dated "Sun, 01 Sep 2019 12:33:59 -0700." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Date: Sun, 01 Sep 2019 12:48:37 -0700 X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfCrMO035lM0dbVhdcElgsSQ9coc6bsGgGX45zxaPIrV21CXLnHDXA1RaxhNPq5QEvRCatJAvady2ql0i0cUPZ+WL+kFhoxmFl3BJ11di9I8PXC2vS379 9OAxUlERUBB1jTedeQQDrTyKXilU2KMLAtRoxMZe4n7PfG/3a8ZoyOmD6AGvLHedXM1wLKjUWvHZQiiFaXXA4VCs467pFJWgVxT4fpt/Eh5+X+fODCUSboka xOuCAHkVB/vUdXeQyVJSGmb32lKKH9L7bak7X6ZgKWwvurQwwa7KLmO5UYxMpuSbKvQn0ImfG+isKPg6JqVXYg== X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 46M3gG25tNz3FkW X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of cy.schubert@cschubert.com has no SPF policy when checking 64.59.136.138) smtp.mailfrom=cy.schubert@cschubert.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.93 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; HAS_XAW(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; REPLYTO_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.96)[-0.958,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[138.136.59.64.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[7]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:6327, ipnet:64.59.128.0/20, country:CA]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-2.37)[ip: (-6.21), ipnet: 64.59.128.0/20(-3.12), asn: 6327(-2.42), country: CA(-0.09)]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[17.125.67.70.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11] X-BeenThere: freebsd-fcp@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Community Proposals List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 Sep 2019 19:48:44 -0000 In message <8350379A-30F8-4BBD-B9AE-A3A176CAE966@gmail.com>, Enji Cooper writes : > > > > On Sep 1, 2019, at 10:42 AM, Hans Petter Selasky wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > If the fallouts could be better organized through some simple guidelines, t > hat would be more accepted I think: > > > > 1) Don't commit stuff before going off work. Even though a change looks inn > ocent, it might break something and you'll need to fix it. > > > > 2) Organize big changes going into the kernel, to ease debugging and gettin > g things back on track again. > > > > 3) If your patch is risky, commit it on a Monday. Don't wait until Friday. > > > > Failure to follow the rules may have consequences like other senior develop > ers kicking in and doing temporary reverts until issues are resolved. > > Agreed. There’s a reason why at my most former job (FB) we generally knew b > etter than to commit code on a Friday. It would cause the weekend oncalls a l > ot of grief. > > Let’s put it this way: think of it like being oncall for code. If you don†> ™t have someone else to work with who can manage it, would you like to be pag > ed if something went south with your code committed on a Friday? This is a good idea. Pinging someone to provide backup support is a good idea. phk@ has asked me in this regard once giving me authority to back out his commit should it cause any grief. It didn't break anything but he made contingency plans just in case. > > Cheers, > -Enji -- Cheers, Cy Schubert FreeBSD UNIX: Web: http://www.FreeBSD.org The need of the many outweighs the greed of the few. From owner-freebsd-fcp@freebsd.org Mon Sep 2 15:12:20 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fcp@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE13CE0A55 for ; Mon, 2 Sep 2019 15:12:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net) Received: from mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (mailman.nyi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::50:13]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46MYTw3mDFz3NrF for ; Mon, 2 Sep 2019 15:12:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net) Received: by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) id 810D2E0A4F; Mon, 2 Sep 2019 15:12:20 +0000 (UTC) Delivered-To: fcp@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80BE5E0A4E; Mon, 2 Sep 2019 15:12:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net) Received: from gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (br1.CN84in.dnsmgr.net [69.59.192.140]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 46MYTv1nHyz3Nr9; Mon, 2 Sep 2019 15:12:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net) Received: from gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id x82FC9cD009674; Mon, 2 Sep 2019 08:12:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net) Received: (from freebsd-rwg@localhost) by gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) id x82FC8ZD009673; Mon, 2 Sep 2019 08:12:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <201909021512.x82FC8ZD009673@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> Subject: Re: FCP 20190401-ci_policy: CI policy In-Reply-To: <201909011948.x81JmbS3004574@slippy.cwsent.com> To: Cy Schubert Date: Mon, 2 Sep 2019 08:12:08 -0700 (PDT) CC: Enji Cooper , Hans Petter Selasky , Ed Maste , FreeBSD Hackers , fcp@freebsd.org, Li-Wen Hsu X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL121h (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 46MYTv1nHyz3Nr9 X-Spamd-Bar: + Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net has no SPF policy when checking 69.59.192.140) smtp.mailfrom=freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [1.62 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.38)[0.377,0]; IP_SCORE(0.04)[ip: (0.15), ipnet: 69.59.192.0/19(0.07), asn: 13868(0.05), country: US(-0.05)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[dnsmgr.net]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.36)[0.364,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.07)[-0.067,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[7]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:13868, ipnet:69.59.192.0/19, country:US]; FREEMAIL_CC(0.00)[gmail.com]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-fcp@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Community Proposals List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Sep 2019 15:12:20 -0000 > In message <8350379A-30F8-4BBD-B9AE-A3A176CAE966@gmail.com>, Enji Cooper > writes > : > > > > > > > On Sep 1, 2019, at 10:42 AM, Hans Petter Selasky wrote: > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > If the fallouts could be better organized through some simple guidelines, t > > hat would be more accepted I think: > > > > > > 1) Don't commit stuff before going off work. Even though a change looks inn > > ocent, it might break something and you'll need to fix it. > > > > > > 2) Organize big changes going into the kernel, to ease debugging and gettin > > g things back on track again. > > > > > > 3) If your patch is risky, commit it on a Monday. Don't wait until Friday. > > > > > > Failure to follow the rules may have consequences like other senior develop > > ers kicking in and doing temporary reverts until issues are resolved. > > > > Agreed. There???s a reason why at my most former job (FB) we generally knew b > > etter than to commit code on a Friday. It would cause the weekend oncalls a l > > ot of grief. > > > > Let???s put it this way: think of it like being oncall for code. If you don?? > > ?t have someone else to work with who can manage it, would you like to be pag > > ed if something went south with your code committed on a Friday? > > This is a good idea. Pinging someone to provide backup support is a good > idea. phk@ has asked me in this regard once giving me authority to back out > his commit should it cause any grief. It didn't break anything but he made > contingency plans just in case. All of these can be codified into "operational suggestions" and added to the committers guide, and does not necessarily need to be rules, policy or procedure, that should help move it forward past the high bar of trying to get changes like this codified some place that everyone can read. -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-fcp@freebsd.org Tue Sep 3 21:16:36 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fcp@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E539D8716 for ; Tue, 3 Sep 2019 21:16:36 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yaneurabeya@gmail.com) Received: from mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (mailman.nyi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::50:13]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46NKWl6mjVz4Nw5 for ; Tue, 3 Sep 2019 21:16:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yaneurabeya@gmail.com) Received: by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) id E524DD8713; Tue, 3 Sep 2019 21:16:35 +0000 (UTC) Delivered-To: fcp@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4CB0D8712; Tue, 3 Sep 2019 21:16:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yaneurabeya@gmail.com) Received: from mail-pl1-x636.google.com (mail-pl1-x636.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::636]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 46NKWk4DsWz4Nw4; Tue, 3 Sep 2019 21:16:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yaneurabeya@gmail.com) Received: by mail-pl1-x636.google.com with SMTP id y10so2587984pll.7; Tue, 03 Sep 2019 14:16:34 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=w8Vx4d3esKc2z/JGyebJiyqldEjepkegxAZK6YCBasY=; b=fLml44ijyN6x6a1UVrybJ1hk5VFpUD8T9iVw1TD/DMaDh1EreulyiLzYrNXT4+eUvd yJxh1lXgJHKsQpma+wj85RWI/3BOPFgR7DPff3YUHrSNzq/82++nPosLz3IUIlut0OaD y7EbRgytKgKMqKrhGh1uu9G6ORXawuHy8OluDZF0b0GnGVjrPHUReCl9D7VsVsAmaMj+ /g2d6OPdmIstHYSrbh6DLmz1x4f9hV6UOZFEZyMYdO1jn7gWGxUh8qpS5GfT/yZcVu90 gLwiksnFPqElhehRncywa0xuQALuf+Mgj7hOLmgXFCvdIXNaqSsyaXMqLM++Ej2DkS5t SfkA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=w8Vx4d3esKc2z/JGyebJiyqldEjepkegxAZK6YCBasY=; b=s5bagUuzMqAZo3oNveQIU5eUVSQrwvN3fjVjCUUxB0ZGVbCvy0u4zkVNgBRKwGxFCN bPgspnQJfkZkCInNyvNRtHUy+UTkmVbR7wmhCtBrsU+hmt6mNV+bChcHcMp4SuacqpIF w6bwwoh4CDFkjtFvsJTpErHjwljv8DbRfOuqQJMmaeqT9Q7VnBh4rC5mxpve0xP65gdT KYAdDr7QeMRBUINd4XwyBzbaIG4MxowandAFl7wYiEU86NrxuFNBQzidT4RtfJnPbSAB Ctjda7hahwIft6YiQuMV04rHA2sPD8fj0JQy7eNDxNW5HIhWfAn8ZrAkoTmZXW03Y6ol Ixxg== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAU9AA8OdBdW+nC+BYaEWRashOfz0i3gl7yV/sRAfpdfuXC3810D 1FgWcwr7rlEPJt8GkaT487v3UN9MXz4= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyN6s5LsHpf6BjkraLhqPrWzWg2OMn86gzi8pMi02qKuKDXC1jnMmpw7bksQoZwP58/ce3NIw== X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:a506:: with SMTP id s6mr9802606plq.232.1567545392268; Tue, 03 Sep 2019 14:16:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?IPv6:2607:fb90:b285:cd60:7950:2070:2ff0:7781? ([2607:fb90:b285:cd60:7950:2070:2ff0:7781]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id d18sm12189880pfr.133.2019.09.03.14.16.31 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 03 Sep 2019 14:16:31 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Subject: Re: FCP 20190401-ci_policy: CI policy From: Enji Cooper X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (16G77) In-Reply-To: <201909021512.x82FC8ZD009673@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2019 14:16:30 -0700 Cc: Cy Schubert , Hans Petter Selasky , Ed Maste , FreeBSD Hackers , fcp@freebsd.org, Li-Wen Hsu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <911BCF8B-CF37-48A5-B3FE-B5959575A996@gmail.com> References: <201909021512.x82FC8ZD009673@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> To: "Rodney W. Grimes" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 46NKWk4DsWz4Nw4 X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=fLml44ij; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of yaneurabeya@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::636 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=yaneurabeya@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.49 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36:c]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[7]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.99)[-0.987,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-9.21), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.77), asn: 15169(-2.28), country: US(-0.05)]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[6.3.6.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-fcp@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Community Proposals List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2019 21:16:36 -0000 On Sep 2, 2019, at 08:12, Rodney W. Grimes w= rote: >> In message <8350379A-30F8-4BBD-B9AE-A3A176CAE966@gmail.com>, Enji Cooper=20= >> writes >> : >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>> On Sep 1, 2019, at 10:42 AM, Hans Petter Selasky wrot= e: >>>>=20 >>>> Hi, >>>>=20 >>>> If the fallouts could be better organized through some simple guideline= s, t >>> hat would be more accepted I think: >>>>=20 >>>> 1) Don't commit stuff before going off work. Even though a change looks= inn >>> ocent, it might break something and you'll need to fix it. >>>>=20 >>>> 2) Organize big changes going into the kernel, to ease debugging and ge= ttin >>> g things back on track again. >>>>=20 >>>> 3) If your patch is risky, commit it on a Monday. Don't wait until Frid= ay. >>>>=20 >>>> Failure to follow the rules may have consequences like other senior dev= elop >>> ers kicking in and doing temporary reverts until issues are resolved. >>>=20 >>> Agreed. There???s a reason why at my most former job (FB) we generally k= new b >>> etter than to commit code on a Friday. It would cause the weekend oncall= s a l >>> ot of grief. >>>=20 >>> Let???s put it this way: think of it like being oncall for code. If you d= on?? >>> ?t have someone else to work with who can manage it, would you like to b= e pag >>> ed if something went south with your code committed on a Friday? >>=20 >> This is a good idea. Pinging someone to provide backup support is a good=20= >> idea. phk@ has asked me in this regard once giving me authority to back o= ut=20 >> his commit should it cause any grief. It didn't break anything but he mad= e=20 >> contingency plans just in case. >=20 > All of these can be codified into "operational suggestions" and added to t= he > committers guide, and does not necessarily need to be rules, policy or=20 > procedure, that should help move it forward past the high bar of trying to= > get changes like this codified some place that everyone can read. I agree with you in spirit. It just makes it easier if it=E2=80=99s implemen= ted in a structured process, so I don=E2=80=99t have to look up the committe= r=E2=80=99s guide to figure out what the rules are, then apply them. -Enji=