From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sun Feb 28 00:47:22 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D40F55A45D for ; Sun, 28 Feb 2021 00:47:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) Received: from kib.kiev.ua (kib.kiev.ua [IPv6:2001:470:d5e7:1::1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4Dp4VK4Rnbz4c82; Sun, 28 Feb 2021 00:47:21 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) Received: from tom.home (kib@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by kib.kiev.ua (8.16.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPS id 11S0l7ZX056297 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Sun, 28 Feb 2021 02:47:10 +0200 (EET) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.10.3 kib.kiev.ua 11S0l7ZX056297 Received: (from kostik@localhost) by tom.home (8.16.1/8.16.1/Submit) id 11S0l7sT056296; Sun, 28 Feb 2021 02:47:07 +0200 (EET) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) X-Authentication-Warning: tom.home: kostik set sender to kostikbel@gmail.com using -f Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2021 02:47:07 +0200 From: Konstantin Belousov To: Gordon Bergling Cc: Ed Maste , FreeBSD Current Subject: Re: HEADS-UP: PIE enabled by default on main Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.0 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,BAYES_00, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED,FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD,FREEMAIL_FROM, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on tom.home X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4Dp4VK4Rnbz4c82 X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="No valid SPF, No valid DKIM" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none); spf=softfail (mx1.freebsd.org: 2001:470:d5e7:1::1 is neither permitted nor denied by domain of kostikbel@gmail.com) smtp.mailfrom=kostikbel@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.00 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; HAS_XAW(0.00)[]; RBL_DBL_DONT_QUERY_IPS(0.00)[2001:470:d5e7:1::1:from]; R_SPF_SOFTFAIL(0.00)[~all:c]; SPAMHAUS_ZRD(0.00)[2001:470:d5e7:1::1:from:127.0.2.255]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-1.000]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:6939, ipnet:2001:470::/32, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; MAILMAN_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-current]; DMARC_POLICY_SOFTFAIL(0.10)[gmail.com : No valid SPF, No valid DKIM,none] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.34 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2021 00:47:22 -0000 On Fri, Feb 26, 2021 at 08:32:26PM +0100, Gordon Bergling wrote: > On Fri, Feb 26, 2021 at 08:57:55PM +0200, Konstantin Belousov wrote: > > On Fri, Feb 26, 2021 at 07:34:03PM +0100, Gordon Bergling wrote: > > > On Thu, Feb 25, 2021 at 03:58:07PM -0500, Ed Maste wrote: > > > > As of 9a227a2fd642 (main-n245052) base system binaries are now built > > > > as position-independent executable (PIE) by default, for 64-bit > > > > architectures. PIE executables are used in conjunction with address > > > > randomization as a mitigation for certain types of security > > > > vulnerabilities. > > > > > > > > If you track -CURRENT and normally build WITHOUT_CLEAN you'll need to > > > > do one initial clean build -- either run `make cleanworld` or set > > > > WITH_CLEAN=yes. > > > > > > > > No significant user-facing changes are expected from this change, but > > > > there are some minor ones. For example, `file` will indicate that > > > > binaries are PIE by reporting something like `ELF 64-bit LSB pie > > > > executable` rather than `ELF 64-bit LSB executable`. Also, for most > > > > workloads no notable performance impact is expected. > > > > > > > > For almost all ports this should result in no change. There are a > > > > small number of ports that use base system /usr/share/mk > > > > infrastructure and thus inherit the base system default, and some of > > > > those initially failed to build. Those found during an exp-run in > > > > PR253275 have been addressed or have patches waiting. > > > > > > > > Please watch out for any new issues after you next update the base > > > > system and/or ports, and report issues via a Bugzilla PR or in reply > > > > here. > > > > > > Thats a huge step forward in terms on security. > > Can you explain why? > > > > Thanks. > > I can try. Enabling PIE for every 64bit architecture is in that matter a step > forward in security as it enables ASLR for further adoption. But isn't it well-known that ASLR/ASR/any-related-buzzwork does not add any security, except imaginary? The only purpose of it is to have a check-list item ticked green. You clearly should mean something useful and much more important than that, when stating that FreeBSD made a huge step forward. So I want to be aware of the advance.