From nobody Mon May 13 13:28:25 2024 X-Original-To: net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4VdL0T27Z5z5KFS6 for ; Mon, 13 May 2024 13:28:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: from mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org (mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:3]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org", Issuer "R3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4VdL0T14wyz47Gd for ; Mon, 13 May 2024 13:28:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1715606905; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=UQdWJViaArcWWmSglSl96FAPKweuvCy33uATcvgSlipZ+prc0CYrfI95L7LHY3RQwbWcfZ IR9eA+1oFS6x/qrupQ07pzEIE7BrAJr47DoCLZmi908FUO1ux/VRSsv7RJGXyngCpu7OcN VPmMcY0lGxbek/AqRHNifNVPhs64sTebOxf6YgYV0CY+uAvcmBAoejb7zcGWHJPjJJk+wY 8WOJCrz02ZC5yB/ZoBBErS4Sbx9d2MVWWgskErYmHYXnHDOo2WU8wim/hvnD+qCIgV0K+6 sVXfFXTsYwfUppPzKTjfoR1JhZMgDZ6TtQlAeP/wGWhPXZfkCUhHVWl0ZifkEA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1715606905; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=HwJ1KrvmHf76oS4t5K0jRTYSuRsNLOG7A8Rbi45i/ss=; b=AuYAjByR9dskzOWIJFwCU4ayT1jNUYRr4pHcqOZ7xRtlc3zq1mUYSzXeWp1NJpgjgjJQlr Kvn/+oKd4zVELi5Krxu4Wmt1+JdGl+E54cz+lBkzcO3eFrDG51TaMqEES1LWBMW9y94xma K5ccsTjMlLTpCpztXeTiJMApctEX8H8r1d06mJqyG4r/POrmfWt/AtQCA3ysYbMSGS+Zlh +1px3dPDjZ0I0XYNjzKVF6alanvOfGYCsimy76XVazLAJHDu3hHZZLGgSfKyDJcVZqU9pN +3VtSrqjEtPyNRxScMHIXf7coiMXxt/6C8WZqOEtCAVo0OMHOrFSXIseqEgWHQ== Received: from kenobi.freebsd.org (kenobi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::50:1d]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4VdL0T0Zh1zpwy for ; Mon, 13 May 2024 13:28:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: from kenobi.freebsd.org ([127.0.1.5]) by kenobi.freebsd.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id 44DDSPLK038001 for ; Mon, 13 May 2024 13:28:25 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: (from www@localhost) by kenobi.freebsd.org (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id 44DDSPj6037993 for net@FreeBSD.org; Mon, 13 May 2024 13:28:25 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) X-Authentication-Warning: kenobi.freebsd.org: www set sender to bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org using -f From: bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org To: net@FreeBSD.org Subject: [Bug 277396] CARP packet not processed Date: Mon, 13 May 2024 13:28:25 +0000 X-Bugzilla-Reason: AssignedTo X-Bugzilla-Type: changed X-Bugzilla-Watch-Reason: None X-Bugzilla-Product: Base System X-Bugzilla-Component: kern X-Bugzilla-Version: 14.0-RELEASE X-Bugzilla-Keywords: X-Bugzilla-Severity: Affects Only Me X-Bugzilla-Who: tburns@hrsd.com X-Bugzilla-Status: New X-Bugzilla-Resolution: X-Bugzilla-Priority: --- X-Bugzilla-Assigned-To: net@FreeBSD.org X-Bugzilla-Flags: X-Bugzilla-Changed-Fields: cc Message-ID: In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Bugzilla-URL: https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/ Auto-Submitted: auto-generated List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=3D277396 tburns@hrsd.com changed: What |Removed |Added ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- CC| |tburns@hrsd.com --- Comment #1 from tburns@hrsd.com --- I'm having a similar issue with a much simpler setup. It worked fine on Fre= eBSD 13.2. Everything is the same except upgrading from 13.2-RELEASE to 14.0-RELEASE. Do you mind updating the importance since it just just you no= w? https://forums.freebsd.org/threads/carp-stopped-working-after-upgrade-from-= freebsd-13-2-to-freebsd-14.93404/#post-654545 --=20 You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug.= From nobody Tue May 14 04:21:09 2024 X-Original-To: net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4Vdjpb178vz5KKxS for ; Tue, 14 May 2024 04:21:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: from mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org (mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:3]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org", Issuer "R3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4VdjpZ4NJDz4ZJQ for ; Tue, 14 May 2024 04:21:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1715660470; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=kXTz1TRJOtrPLXAYglreNsyUzNW0tQuJVFCVScuY06e6QE2HNgN3qi1q7a/n1/wgnQv+Q6 E2C3GA0zbGS6SH+9XnTEdgugX6iyuZmCzJ4pWEynZZ+s2FEo+ZSSTh+ixehA8FdwQFr/7b GvhTqlei9WZuKqWIhLiRsLuBtF/AHs9KYlUCov8jKXE7/LxqecJkzUwJel4JuzKFlSw9Go Pw62HpGiIXjFG3END1e1xjuBsdOe7Ub2iAeTJ5Q/UO12mJnfSiOERW+JA2Y/uRM1d1ndqA R+85hwsg7+M1DKY5aAhLqcLiuKxRa7w453rvLxPZ3XwpfKVBpuuh0SeE0PsPmQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1715660470; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=JFhy5RRweRGuJViQRWxb57RHpvxzqW4PNsA17SMEMuE=; b=RpRru70MWzA3LJgQaTgvcATufcDNIgu0s/Mll0h55QpH4KIbQdI4eg/zZgT3Wve14+kWd4 XVL1OJO3dC+q/g03Xe249VbWvy4wY9HhTZhLyyulafgU6S+GetJL6cHTW6AfWEj6AelOTS YAGJaC1PGnHxWluyziqirlJCkDRvC23xsTEzftwfy4YW9ZlJifDtLl1+ucgA8hFtKJd64O gOjc+3GGw4PIuzsIuOMVpkljNDarU1Ig78lX2jdERYqwqgnCgRqcoVLxnwa8O0JrAst/kn z42cm7tzUKotNx0er8Iyr59kJ5miiHSVKxaLk6Mg3Do7drG7wNIjh7QEsgKugw== Received: from kenobi.freebsd.org (kenobi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::50:1d]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4VdjpZ3yrjzGdK for ; Tue, 14 May 2024 04:21:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: from kenobi.freebsd.org ([127.0.1.5]) by kenobi.freebsd.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id 44E4LAsC093528 for ; Tue, 14 May 2024 04:21:10 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: (from www@localhost) by kenobi.freebsd.org (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id 44E4LAX2093527 for net@FreeBSD.org; Tue, 14 May 2024 04:21:10 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) X-Authentication-Warning: kenobi.freebsd.org: www set sender to bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org using -f From: bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org To: net@FreeBSD.org Subject: [Bug 278394] Reproducible kernel panic related to IPv4 routes populated by bird2 (BGP) Date: Tue, 14 May 2024 04:21:09 +0000 X-Bugzilla-Reason: CC AssignedTo X-Bugzilla-Type: changed X-Bugzilla-Watch-Reason: None X-Bugzilla-Product: Base System X-Bugzilla-Component: kern X-Bugzilla-Version: 14.0-RELEASE X-Bugzilla-Keywords: crash X-Bugzilla-Severity: Affects Only Me X-Bugzilla-Who: gshapiro@FreeBSD.org X-Bugzilla-Status: Open X-Bugzilla-Resolution: X-Bugzilla-Priority: --- X-Bugzilla-Assigned-To: net@FreeBSD.org X-Bugzilla-Flags: X-Bugzilla-Changed-Fields: cc Message-ID: In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Bugzilla-URL: https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/ Auto-Submitted: auto-generated List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=3D278394 Gregory Neil Shapiro changed: What |Removed |Added ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- CC| |bryanv@FreeBSD.org --- Comment #23 from Gregory Neil Shapiro --- (In reply to Mark Johnston from comment #16) Who is best to commit the change Mark suggested? vxlan isn't listed in src/MAINTAINERS but if_vxlan.c lists a Copyright belonging to @bryanv. --=20 You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug.= From nobody Tue May 14 07:38:00 2024 X-Original-To: net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4Vdp9j2SH9z5Kbhn for ; Tue, 14 May 2024 07:38:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: from mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org (mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:3]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org", Issuer "R3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4Vdp9j0mD0z4x7d for ; Tue, 14 May 2024 07:38:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1715672281; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=SvEMOgSK2MzEi7gHbAJ+gY3JJ6qiv2u821lvNOD3Yktm86ME9awjKJfZc02vldOvT1s/cx 3u5Uluk4yYbbzzyPLZK3Os4EPCoA9gFFhC2McwVZtLq6iEIjVpBNoggvC+c4UDkNzjwWV3 L0JhV+zVjpSTLAsaFiQKuws3pxskIog0aCZP4JEWQ00oHT6PJ1jBf6dpF2yMc2JHNlW7jv duvmHKfsiRnQKmLF6q6VOSUqXzd3KOIgUADX/qD5Elsu7nzEfWmUojLl+i6CE0BoIA36+B US2iD+xhcP0VDx96knLCH+j2y30ROTBMWbfQShJl/HoOungYJ7o7QzbN7wKXcA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1715672281; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=CRcP6ooE0+0KGrta6fLEWUN9q9jnhDKojkS/wCitFz8=; b=e5FFbXqqPRwUMVlfpwHHWzWuG3EZGZ2yV6XHAvljjHigLKjXxtMpNYQf7KBRBLjFwsU8hb 3s/WLIkTSneczX2DJAQ8Kod72Gd1FtpRLs8ih7KX/vjF1YQDvib1QOMHdP3S4t2eNg5Fzx BmD2Gd2NR73WcouuDUqm1bvnbnY1xqwmOHbaWwZg/oEgYPKJ4MuO+yuBCKp3NVs4+gtDdC zUPaczTvjFzG3ytHL+n2zaJ7zIs5LbquBec4HhZU1osYuIxSVe81TnOrC1g+m2ogYQFXtA hd/xQeGOcOHGJfNiMs4kbw8eh/s8oGgr780LGoHaDfcNYe342/MTgliQD2fVGg== Received: from kenobi.freebsd.org (kenobi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::50:1d]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4Vdp9h5dGkzNMn for ; Tue, 14 May 2024 07:38:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: from kenobi.freebsd.org ([127.0.1.5]) by kenobi.freebsd.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id 44E7c08m030900 for ; Tue, 14 May 2024 07:38:00 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: (from www@localhost) by kenobi.freebsd.org (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id 44E7c02d030899 for net@FreeBSD.org; Tue, 14 May 2024 07:38:00 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) X-Authentication-Warning: kenobi.freebsd.org: www set sender to bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org using -f From: bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org To: net@FreeBSD.org Subject: [Bug 278394] Reproducible kernel panic related to IPv4 routes populated by bird2 (BGP) Date: Tue, 14 May 2024 07:38:00 +0000 X-Bugzilla-Reason: AssignedTo CC X-Bugzilla-Type: changed X-Bugzilla-Watch-Reason: None X-Bugzilla-Product: Base System X-Bugzilla-Component: kern X-Bugzilla-Version: 14.0-RELEASE X-Bugzilla-Keywords: crash X-Bugzilla-Severity: Affects Only Me X-Bugzilla-Who: zlei@FreeBSD.org X-Bugzilla-Status: Open X-Bugzilla-Resolution: X-Bugzilla-Priority: --- X-Bugzilla-Assigned-To: net@FreeBSD.org X-Bugzilla-Flags: X-Bugzilla-Changed-Fields: attachments.created Message-ID: In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Bugzilla-URL: https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/ Auto-Submitted: auto-generated List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=3D278394 --- Comment #24 from Zhenlei Huang --- Created attachment 250637 --> https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/attachment.cgi?id=3D250637&action= =3Dedit patch (In reply to Gregory Neil Shapiro from comment #23) > Who is best to commit the change Mark suggested? vxlan isn't listed in > src/MAINTAINERS but if_vxlan.c lists a Copyright belonging to @bryanv. Busy days. I have a simple WIP draft patch but forgot to upload it. May you please have a try ? --=20 You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug.= From nobody Tue May 14 10:21:48 2024 X-Original-To: net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4Vdspj2sJxz5KqXw for ; Tue, 14 May 2024 10:21:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: from mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org (mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:3]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org", Issuer "R3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4Vdspj01Njz41SZ for ; Tue, 14 May 2024 10:21:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1715682109; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=beuHdruD9grqApd9sY0cOEYnnLA3VIjrF90e98TLT1NbbYJJQw6i0hAvzWrqxCj+546sR8 kfKoNDYV1r3I5bNWZIwLsNxyywUASHgHwGKzzo/F6QOF4J/E8GcshFpjN9SKZCmJrZ/5Vm QC26dlu1bllPN8T1cK4+y82q5LvVz/Zc8Re71l4NZ81rXDgYpXJwqb2CEkmf5tIBf4+Mb/ QidYt/jJx1d38CuAzxF6iyJifLYROu0XW2+LwsNqUP65+tcJEq17QRiJEUOQNQKMbRYCFf dEkfG3e5Xr8k5RgX8RI/3pT12R9+o6ajQgS3HFeg6tXIXatLkz1BgvmzH6SAyA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1715682109; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=YhiBU32h/20ANNLouQ3ayLGbfpXBN5xamBech14Jolw=; b=wRyUN7jmVpdWQ0aGTCMN9oLGSbmXlP/I1FhrgB/qCh3d/I/dw1cNcANPGZaSNR9CyDPCFO k4gw5lmiz6evVF/WpEItG9mJFGqSUZmwtN5RqdJLN2rABGVIsRNnIlQXO3h8JEVNzZQ7pO pB8PNdlpW5qkycrVn70A+1Rj+PbqrHy0JHKihdYoAd/Q72rsxIjT7fojujgugJoshYmlsy JKBK0OCAg5nGm1tbEimcHN6QYt5IIzFk2/84EunNwbk227eLR3gQpIrZd7yjJo9F9EsnsK o6gm+1vyIVDlfotHHDWfzfzkW15/M4RR9CAArCIv4ze+AomjILS1qD5g7MbvVg== Received: from kenobi.freebsd.org (kenobi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::50:1d]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4Vdsph6jxXzSGY for ; Tue, 14 May 2024 10:21:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: from kenobi.freebsd.org ([127.0.1.5]) by kenobi.freebsd.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id 44EALmI8027044 for ; Tue, 14 May 2024 10:21:48 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: (from www@localhost) by kenobi.freebsd.org (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id 44EALmTn027043 for net@FreeBSD.org; Tue, 14 May 2024 10:21:48 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) X-Authentication-Warning: kenobi.freebsd.org: www set sender to bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org using -f From: bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org To: net@FreeBSD.org Subject: [Bug 278394] Reproducible kernel panic related to IPv4 routes populated by bird2 (BGP) Date: Tue, 14 May 2024 10:21:48 +0000 X-Bugzilla-Reason: AssignedTo CC X-Bugzilla-Type: changed X-Bugzilla-Watch-Reason: None X-Bugzilla-Product: Base System X-Bugzilla-Component: kern X-Bugzilla-Version: 14.0-RELEASE X-Bugzilla-Keywords: crash X-Bugzilla-Severity: Affects Only Me X-Bugzilla-Who: zlei@FreeBSD.org X-Bugzilla-Status: Open X-Bugzilla-Resolution: X-Bugzilla-Priority: --- X-Bugzilla-Assigned-To: net@FreeBSD.org X-Bugzilla-Flags: X-Bugzilla-Changed-Fields: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Bugzilla-URL: https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/ Auto-Submitted: auto-generated List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=3D278394 --- Comment #25 from Zhenlei Huang --- @Gregory Please note, the patch prevents the kernel panic but those packets to be encapsulated which is in the route loop will be dropped. So a more precise route entry for the tunnel end or dedicated FIB is still needed. --=20 You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug.= From nobody Wed May 15 14:20:20 2024 X-Original-To: net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4Vfb3p3jXsz5Kxm8 for ; Wed, 15 May 2024 14:20:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from uatka3z4zagp@thismonkey.com) Received: from mail-01.thismonkey.com (mail-01.thismonkey.com [IPv6:2406:3400:35e:6602::a01:232]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "thismonkey.com", Issuer "R3" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4Vfb3m52cqz47hG for ; Wed, 15 May 2024 14:20:36 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from uatka3z4zagp@thismonkey.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=thismonkey.com header.s=mail-01 header.b=kxsU+rVM; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=thismonkey.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of uatka3z4zagp@thismonkey.com designates 2406:3400:35e:6602::a01:232 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=uatka3z4zagp@thismonkey.com DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=thismonkey.com; s=mail-01; t=1715782822; bh=4YJ3JRMSMOpJZfd/beAL0cEr5qLI9294g+D9Gyhe+ZQ=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:References:In-Reply-To; b=kxsU+rVMi2gBGFqB+edBbGs2a2lP4tVgUgtPpJLUmmMx+1qavb8iNqoTIrbvlDo4g OAzHPUPoj+gh46ZysollG2A1B1z9v9lrM/PdTy1+7vG2rgxFRZokzVjfhScmDlzJyd 6EoO+Rbr5Wlsb3lSd3VF0mGiAzzLguV+dvZMmzcA= Received: from mailhub-01.thismonkey.com (mailhub-01.thismonkey.com [IPv6:2406:3400:35e:6601:0:0:a01:11e]) by mail-01.thismonkey.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id 44FEKLQ4093701; Thu, 16 May 2024 00:20:21 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from uatka3z4zagp@thismonkey.com) X-TM-Via-MX: mailhub-01.thismonkey.com Received: from utility-01.thismonkey.com (utility-01.thismonkey.com [IPv6:2406:3400:35e:6601:0:0:a01:120]) by mailhub-01.thismonkey.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id 44FEKLVY094065 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Thu, 16 May 2024 00:20:21 +1000 (AEST) (envelope-from uatka3z4zagp@thismonkey.com) Received: from utility-01.thismonkey.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by utility-01.thismonkey.com (8.16.1/8.16.1) with ESMTP id 44FEKLvo063813; Thu, 16 May 2024 00:20:21 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from uatka3z4zagp@thismonkey.com) Received: (from root@localhost) by utility-01.thismonkey.com (8.16.1/8.16.1/Submit) id 44FEKKgx063805; Thu, 16 May 2024 00:20:20 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from uatka3z4zagp@thismonkey.com) Date: Thu, 16 May 2024 00:20:20 +1000 From: Scott To: Lexi Winter Cc: net@freebsd.org Subject: Re: removing RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d) Message-ID: References: List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-0.999]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[thismonkey.com,none]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[thismonkey.com:s=mail-01]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; MISSING_XM_UA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:10143, ipnet:2406:3400:340::/42, country:AU]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[net@freebsd.org]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[thismonkey.com:+] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4Vfb3m52cqz47hG On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 09:49:27PM +0100, Lexi Winter wrote: > [note: this is a copy of a mail i sent this to arch@, but someone > suggested also asking net@ about this.] > > hello, > > currently FreeBSD ships routed(8) and route6d(8) which implement the RIP > resp. RIPng routing protocols. > > many years ago, it was fairly common for hosts to run these protocols to > get their routing table and it made sense to ship an implementation with > the operating systems. > > nowadays, these are fairly niche protocols and have been replaced in > most networks by either static routing tables (mostly just a default > route) or more modern routing protocols like IBGP/EBGP, OSPF or IS-IS. > as such, i'm not convinced there's any value continuing to ship these > with the OS. > > for people who do want to continue running RIP/RIPng, there are several > implementations available in ports, such as net/bird2 and net/quagga. > > i'd like to submit a patch to remove both of these daemons from src. if > there's some concern that people still want to use the BSD > implementation of routed/route6d, i'm also willing to submit a port such > as net/freebsd-routed containing the old code, in a similar way to how > the removal of things like window(1) and telnetd(8) were handled. > > does anyone have an opinion on this? Hi, I use RIPv2 for it's simplicity and small memory and CPU requirements. It has its place and shouldn't be considered "legacy" despite its shortcomings. It's not uncommon for vendors like Cisco to produce "basic" feature sets of IOS that do not include any link-state protocols. Anyway, I'm a user, albeit a small user, of RIP and wouldn't object to its removal from FreeBSD if there were a small footprint alternative. I've used FRR and VyOS a bit and they are overkill as replacements. Your email doesn't justify its removal other than to say you are unconvinced of the value of shipping it. As a user I definitely see the value. I understand that there is always a cost to providing code, but that wasn't suggested as a reason. All APIs, modules, utilities, etc. need to regularly justify their presence in the OS. If it must be removed, is there any way to fork the FreeBSD routed and route6d to a port? Or would that defeat the purpose of removing it in the first place? Scott From nobody Wed May 15 14:40:25 2024 X-Original-To: net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4VfbVt5vSpz5L041 for ; Wed, 15 May 2024 14:40:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: from mail-yw1-x112f.google.com (mail-yw1-x112f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::112f]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1D4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4VfbVt4rvtz4Drq for ; Wed, 15 May 2024 14:40:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: by mail-yw1-x112f.google.com with SMTP id 00721157ae682-62050e00cfdso61457537b3.3 for ; Wed, 15 May 2024 07:40:38 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cedro.info; s=google; t=1715784037; x=1716388837; darn=freebsd.org; h=content-transfer-encoding:cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from :in-reply-to:references:mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date :message-id:reply-to; bh=nbL8Mwr7d+40fVaCK7XL5Mmxn2Y7prONnjYWKJoOMks=; b=GUdXAqHlRqv5nCTf234LNIId415PC/OJythVbdzfsxseVr8AF9spqVKX481m/GQVBF lFo2PLq35OwN0ratbObh+FYq8+k0BiyotOm6mE0HeNS11Aj99r9HHAeCVSeSHknjzzya BDcU3+m72DcQAHfx5iFoHcaZs0K1N7rxOSh61h6H0wP6JrIIU83wMt9pHHIoF4r+E5jC KcAmJcqM8QKISX441GC2BqC3yqsxCZBcIbt1cND2pfGd+mMAA/5C5041IXZVBNPrnteQ JDd2/L2hyLM/d3Q+zXF8AtRG9qp+PHqpLDg+iOdVoIZUj5ZSzJDgqHgqcs3+r8R4gufq 4unw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1715784037; x=1716388837; h=content-transfer-encoding:cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from :in-reply-to:references:mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=nbL8Mwr7d+40fVaCK7XL5Mmxn2Y7prONnjYWKJoOMks=; b=SLGHnXsK6ya76LE6ja7TXSsYOaWVrWPVhb5VIWXAXQ4KxFO45HG3YubSLy4uUgUDgx dsa9JBTWGV1nnPnliul7RJUk1di85hBpROl6oxviXksrIabzWZWlw/X6OxoXVVrijMDT H7JVB+osE9DjvYIbSCGc0wab8bSJlV9zGfGodmwoP0sdL2U5QX3oYZxViFBqZvroDpqw uUwa2rqR34xotUDWR/I0OxiW2+R/5JilB4qqb4WcMMDp10eZn5uxnqfL5JQC08SdoKXF ykDTLWR7zsKGsVws9GuoQ9LQ6Zf3vXwooSxMNGnBL97k/FFKiYeFQdwXKQD0rSonqZcj CpnQ== X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCXEBFrhto1JKS727v5q5+/IUTpEfNjWRvBMOiJWaynHKqf8KgFSnA/ED+S/NExxLSU7qZSxW/q6/MxqRxAcu04= X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YziPE4rPBE5L4yQN0h5lojmKlyZPx88u5SgxXAvDTSPNXTs7XEK w1EZJ8uezxogU732RUWSrhwfX6OlyYxseOFRnJ0oNFgHO/jRs9LiZNjv15ABrhi8XGE6cliU6pw = X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IFI/OAngCBPhrKUBjeJ+lVD+TYzSXUiaYStERJ/uwqXNkNdK02/gCAlMuPd8YMmdfC6mNRypQ== X-Received: by 2002:a05:690c:6c87:b0:615:9a1:602b with SMTP id 00721157ae682-622b00134e3mr160871857b3.44.1715784037429; Wed, 15 May 2024 07:40:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-yw1-f171.google.com (mail-yw1-f171.google.com. [209.85.128.171]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 00721157ae682-622c4f25d78sm21305197b3.13.2024.05.15.07.40.36 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 15 May 2024 07:40:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-yw1-f171.google.com with SMTP id 00721157ae682-61804067da0so68874427b3.0 for ; Wed, 15 May 2024 07:40:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCWuGeLtuH9wmMMkvU9XCohv856STl6IF800Lz1vfP2VfLXn5bvbkdXhzveSxWXMe1S8mb1eePAUdKaYoH5fRNc= X-Received: by 2002:a0d:d407:0:b0:61b:bd65:1538 with SMTP id 00721157ae682-622aff75895mr161447667b3.3.1715784036426; Wed, 15 May 2024 07:40:36 -0700 (PDT) List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Tomek CEDRO Date: Wed, 15 May 2024 16:40:25 +0200 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: removing RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d) To: Scott , net@freebsd.org Cc: Lexi Winter Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4VfbVt4rvtz4Drq On Wed, May 15, 2024 at 4:20=E2=80=AFPM Scott = wrote: > On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 09:49:27PM +0100, Lexi Winter wrote: > > (..) > > i'd like to submit a patch to remove both of these daemons from src. i= f > > there's some concern that people still want to use the BSD > > implementation of routed/route6d, i'm also willing to submit a port suc= h > > as net/freebsd-routed containing the old code, in a similar way to how > > the removal of things like window(1) and telnetd(8) were handled. > > I use RIPv2 for it's simplicity and small memory and CPU requirements. I= t > has its place and shouldn't be considered "legacy" despite its shortcomin= gs. > It's not uncommon for vendors like Cisco to produce "basic" feature sets = of > IOS that do not include any link-state protocols. > > Anyway, I'm a user, albeit a small user, of RIP and wouldn't object to it= s > removal from FreeBSD if there were a small footprint alternative. I've u= sed > FRR and VyOS a bit and they are overkill as replacements. > > Your email doesn't justify its removal other than to say you are unconvin= ced > of the value of shipping it. As a user I definitely see the value. I > understand that there is always a cost to providing code, but that wasn't > suggested as a reason. All APIs, modules, utilities, etc. need to regula= rly > justify their presence in the OS. > > If it must be removed, is there any way to fork the FreeBSD routed and > route6d to a port? Or would that defeat the purpose of removing it in th= e > first place? Yeah, where did that recent trend came to FreeBSD to remove perfectly working code?? There are more and more ideas in recent times like this. Architectures removal, drivers removal, backward compatibility removal. While basic functions become unstable and unreliable. Looks more like diversion and sabotage than progress. If anything is about to be moved out from SRC for a really good reason it should be available in ports and not in /dev/null. From nobody Wed May 15 17:01:20 2024 X-Original-To: net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4Vffdb58Pkz5L9lM for ; Wed, 15 May 2024 17:01:39 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from john@thehowies.com) Received: from NAM12-MW2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-mw2nam12olkn20800.outbound.protection.outlook.com [IPv6:2a01:111:f403:2805::800]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mail.protection.outlook.com", Issuer "DigiCert Cloud Services CA-1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4Vffdb0pW8z4c88 for ; Wed, 15 May 2024 17:01:39 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from john@thehowies.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=UOuggDTYKNNEJbHCgzlEfdnMwNiJKTiAXgnkQ/gxyK9ymRmtFgl60jUE6EDcV7FTtiVM71eDZRZaWz09qAs30iTsM5dUL/WwoUnxiM87v7P9au7c0aa3snmWDsMkNOFAWW3LKH+/wTZT7WeUUQtd4TOZ4YYxetKf8bmJ1JbDejMq65U9mbehaOzQBtHPiqPzOQTpT4hxBZTA/BOOiojqnZQqeZnPxNCHTclypBYiGy5ODNdan4NNiCijxiKi4IT2xW7wsKUVhzydrk7Vnmgj1VhSuPrq2rpHE9/pLGLmY1oZM5ZWgBdSWf+bBlhSTWFmTmVoOxQ2AwhdX2wtyV0ePQ== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; 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Wed, 15 May 2024 17:01:33 +0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: John Howie Subject: Re: removing RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d) Date: Wed, 15 May 2024 10:01:20 -0700 Message-ID: References: Cc: Scott , net@freebsd.org, Lexi Winter In-Reply-To: To: Tomek CEDRO X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (21E236) X-TMN: [MUe62NoFm4R63UQv1asbb3fgsITa1pl1] X-ClientProxiedBy: MW4P222CA0019.NAMP222.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (2603:10b6:303:114::24) To MN0PR84MB3024.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (2603:10b6:208:3cc::21) X-Microsoft-Original-Message-ID: List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-Exchange-MessageSentRepresentingType: 1 X-MS-PublicTrafficType: Email X-MS-TrafficTypeDiagnostic: MN0PR84MB3024:EE_|SA1PR84MB3929:EE_ X-MS-Office365-Filtering-Correlation-Id: 92a078de-3587-40bb-de9b-08dc7500ac15 X-Microsoft-Antispam: BCL:0;ARA:14566002|461199019|3412199016|440099019; 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module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:8075, ipnet:2a01:111:f000::/36, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4Vffdb0pW8z4c88 I use RIP all the time. Removing it would be a pain. What is the justificat= ion? Moving it to ports is an option, but now we have to compile, distribut= e, and install it. Sent from my iPhone > On May 15, 2024, at 07:40, Tomek CEDRO wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BFOn Wed, May 15, 2024 at 4:20=E2=80=AFPM Scott wrote: >>> On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 09:49:27PM +0100, Lexi Winter wrote: >>> (..) >>> i'd like to submit a patch to remove both of these daemons from src. i= f >>> there's some concern that people still want to use the BSD >>> implementation of routed/route6d, i'm also willing to submit a port suc= h >>> as net/freebsd-routed containing the old code, in a similar way to how >>> the removal of things like window(1) and telnetd(8) were handled. >>=20 >> I use RIPv2 for it's simplicity and small memory and CPU requirements. = It >> has its place and shouldn't be considered "legacy" despite its shortcomi= ngs. >> It's not uncommon for vendors like Cisco to produce "basic" feature sets= of >> IOS that do not include any link-state protocols. >>=20 >> Anyway, I'm a user, albeit a small user, of RIP and wouldn't object to i= ts >> removal from FreeBSD if there were a small footprint alternative. I've = used >> FRR and VyOS a bit and they are overkill as replacements. >>=20 >> Your email doesn't justify its removal other than to say you are unconvi= nced >> of the value of shipping it. As a user I definitely see the value. I >> understand that there is always a cost to providing code, but that wasn'= t >> suggested as a reason. All APIs, modules, utilities, etc. need to regul= arly >> justify their presence in the OS. >>=20 >> If it must be removed, is there any way to fork the FreeBSD routed and >> route6d to a port? Or would that defeat the purpose of removing it in t= he >> first place? >=20 > Yeah, where did that recent trend came to FreeBSD to remove perfectly > working code?? >=20 > There are more and more ideas in recent times like this. >=20 > Architectures removal, drivers removal, backward compatibility > removal. While basic functions become unstable and unreliable. Looks > more like diversion and sabotage than progress. >=20 > If anything is about to be moved out from SRC for a really good reason > it should be available in ports and not in /dev/null. >=20 From nobody Wed May 15 17:22:58 2024 X-Original-To: net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4Vfg6x166yz49vwj for ; Wed, 15 May 2024 17:23:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kudzu@tenebras.com) Received: from mail-pf1-x431.google.com (mail-pf1-x431.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::431]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1D4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4Vfg6w6DpBz4g2D for ; Wed, 15 May 2024 17:23:36 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kudzu@tenebras.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: by mail-pf1-x431.google.com with SMTP id d2e1a72fcca58-6f45f1179c3so6653003b3a.3 for ; Wed, 15 May 2024 10:23:36 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=tenebras-com.20230601.gappssmtp.com; s=20230601; t=1715793815; x=1716398615; darn=freebsd.org; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=CRQ6tg7pEWA/WpFee8ZXHMDLiWmupIfhgHygCWPRfEo=; b=HBdvZz2yq9BUFIzLX8kkEjP3fWkrlJPMP06NvJ2ar3RMB+9/isVKui+mYnN+8/z6Dw PEaJw8g4x18AnQ5FxpiC97B99YQpWMrtwJ/aZU6JxFJ6q9mX+WswC7CzexkOjA1W3kU3 VcHrDJ8QPYEFnPE/BMGaxleS/Sx4y1v/q9PQO6eZWtGUebBP2xTaXg62tTB14jabFQ95 mQKAKDUEHw+r843waxtWEj/FSU25FKXQXtcNMWkZr8xBhz2yMQIcH8RI7vDCvUo+jH/R NwWjxSLTq8oa+qSwQbW222OArQ0ssH+9HWNLD9elg9c4kGarRv1kKr6fjWP4wBQ39cSR Sz5w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1715793815; x=1716398615; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=CRQ6tg7pEWA/WpFee8ZXHMDLiWmupIfhgHygCWPRfEo=; b=q2rfSqjSVXSAazbERg9hZd0/0nFrctWhWWEzJpkdlmaRc3MBFW13K1KEpVp7GNLhGb MT9fJS0xPbIjPWBg0abU8IpulF/Wnr3X3Nx6ug3/wNVa4NuV0+vNJSZUxwAwyMQd0JX3 Nz1QIxbDGur1EXWZ5bAERRNVevBZDku0Fd6u6TbvgYBH4c0+uMt89KJBcqzL+qag97uj QbdCWDzla/8KLXN7FovhuxlU69j+FunmDXbjEju+O5E+Mv1Ee32HbkfHWV7/DIhdBq5c WVScc2jZeSvbAVgAQYEXXB8re/c0WfazxLPxKhL0eAs/9dseQ4DmDyxLVILFH2H/bnm4 5rhw== X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCUnbqT4AXSGLYUhDTflffGwEbdL90GDkGWiCN/hbU+qxPiu8U4z6yYNo9dnD3F50YyPhLbWjKY716VsahtyyIo= X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YxOPZi4IYdeW34YVwbmWqbH/ERTiLrr71MZumQ4ChMNhWIZlzX6 P/LO0oXzgn9Mq0eT33mQ2q0g1hXo/O1f4P6AmCa2aWwsv5SaX6bxe7NsUHtKLF7rti+pu4awy1g cj7510K10+OhBvIrT1SnFL94ArS1uw18vA7AVrRfWvPS8Az4H X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IEb4qfwkNaZNBtVnBNnDImLsgo1x5C5zocQN0J5igVOC/hfFTKTBJY/gyalX4J03QONisFQf6RN8obNPdJrt9c= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6a20:f397:b0:1af:d0bc:d149 with SMTP id adf61e73a8af0-1afde0a8d01mr16321309637.6.1715793814890; Wed, 15 May 2024 10:23:34 -0700 (PDT) List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Michael Sierchio Date: Wed, 15 May 2024 13:22:58 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: removing RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d) To: John Howie Cc: Tomek CEDRO , Scott , net@freebsd.org, Lexi Winter Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000d8495206188160b7" X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4Vfg6w6DpBz4g2D --000000000000d8495206188160b7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable There is an argument to be made that all such components of the "base" system should be packages, and managed that way. That would facilitate removal or addition of things like MTAs, Route daemons for various protocols, etc. and permit them to be updated independent of the base system. Too much is included by default in Base. On Wed, May 15, 2024 at 1:01=E2=80=AFPM John Howie wro= te: > I use RIP all the time. Removing it would be a pain. What is the > justification? Moving it to ports is an option, but now we have to compil= e, > distribute, and install it. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On May 15, 2024, at 07:40, Tomek CEDRO wrote: > > > > =EF=BB=BFOn Wed, May 15, 2024 at 4:20=E2=80=AFPM Scott > wrote: > >>> On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 09:49:27PM +0100, Lexi Winter wrote: > >>> (..) > >>> i'd like to submit a patch to remove both of these daemons from src. > if > >>> there's some concern that people still want to use the BSD > >>> implementation of routed/route6d, i'm also willing to submit a port > such > >>> as net/freebsd-routed containing the old code, in a similar way to ho= w > >>> the removal of things like window(1) and telnetd(8) were handled. > >> > >> I use RIPv2 for it's simplicity and small memory and CPU requirements. > It > >> has its place and shouldn't be considered "legacy" despite its > shortcomings. > >> It's not uncommon for vendors like Cisco to produce "basic" feature > sets of > >> IOS that do not include any link-state protocols. > >> > >> Anyway, I'm a user, albeit a small user, of RIP and wouldn't object to > its > >> removal from FreeBSD if there were a small footprint alternative. I'v= e > used > >> FRR and VyOS a bit and they are overkill as replacements. > >> > >> Your email doesn't justify its removal other than to say you are > unconvinced > >> of the value of shipping it. As a user I definitely see the value. I > >> understand that there is always a cost to providing code, but that > wasn't > >> suggested as a reason. All APIs, modules, utilities, etc. need to > regularly > >> justify their presence in the OS. > >> > >> If it must be removed, is there any way to fork the FreeBSD routed and > >> route6d to a port? Or would that defeat the purpose of removing it in > the > >> first place? > > > > Yeah, where did that recent trend came to FreeBSD to remove perfectly > > working code?? > > > > There are more and more ideas in recent times like this. > > > > Architectures removal, drivers removal, backward compatibility > > removal. While basic functions become unstable and unreliable. Looks > > more like diversion and sabotage than progress. > > > > If anything is about to be moved out from SRC for a really good reason > > it should be available in ports and not in /dev/null. > > > > --000000000000d8495206188160b7 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
There is an argument to be made that all such components o= f the "base" system should be packages, and managed that way.=C2= =A0 That would facilitate removal or addition of things like MTAs, Route da= emons for various protocols, etc.=C2=A0 and permit them to be updated indep= endent of the base system.=C2=A0 Too much is included by default in Base.

On Wed, May 15, 2024 at 1:01=E2=80=AFPM John Howie <john@thehowies.com> wrote:
<= blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-l= eft:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">I use RIP all the time. Re= moving it would be a pain. What is the justification? Moving it to ports is= an option, but now we have to compile, distribute, and install it.

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 15, 2024, at 07:40, Tomek CEDRO <tomek@cedro.info> wrote:
>
> =EF=BB=BFOn Wed, May 15, 2024 at 4:20=E2=80=AFPM Scott <uatka3z4zagp@thismonk= ey.com> wrote:
>>> On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 09:49:27PM +0100, Lexi Winter wrote: >>> (..)
>>> i'd like to submit a patch to remove both of these daemons= from src.=C2=A0 if
>>> there's some concern that people still want to use the BSD=
>>> implementation of routed/route6d, i'm also willing to subm= it a port such
>>> as net/freebsd-routed containing the old code, in a similar wa= y to how
>>> the removal of things like window(1) and telnetd(8) were handl= ed.
>>
>> I use RIPv2 for it's simplicity and small memory and CPU requi= rements.=C2=A0 It
>> has its place and shouldn't be considered "legacy" d= espite its shortcomings.
>> It's not uncommon for vendors like Cisco to produce "basi= c" feature sets of
>> IOS that do not include any link-state protocols.
>>
>> Anyway, I'm a user, albeit a small user, of RIP and wouldn'= ;t object to its
>> removal from FreeBSD if there were a small footprint alternative.= =C2=A0 I've used
>> FRR and VyOS a bit and they are overkill as replacements.
>>
>> Your email doesn't justify its removal other than to say you a= re unconvinced
>> of the value of shipping it.=C2=A0 As a user I definitely see the = value.=C2=A0 I
>> understand that there is always a cost to providing code, but that= wasn't
>> suggested as a reason.=C2=A0 All APIs, modules, utilities, etc. ne= ed to regularly
>> justify their presence in the OS.
>>
>> If it must be removed, is there any way to fork the FreeBSD routed= and
>> route6d to a port?=C2=A0 Or would that defeat the purpose of remov= ing it in the
>> first place?
>
> Yeah, where did that recent trend came to FreeBSD to remove perfectly<= br> > working code??
>
> There are more and more ideas in recent times like this.
>
> Architectures removal, drivers removal, backward compatibility
> removal. While basic functions become unstable and unreliable. Looks > more like diversion and sabotage than progress.
>
> If anything is about to be moved out from SRC for a really good reason=
> it should be available in ports and not in /dev/null.
>

--000000000000d8495206188160b7-- From nobody Wed May 15 18:18:54 2024 X-Original-To: freebsd-net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4VfhM05XdDz4B1Kr for ; Wed, 15 May 2024 18:19:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from zarychtam@plan-b.pwste.edu.pl) Received: from plan-b.pwste.edu.pl (plan-b.pwste.edu.pl [IPv6:2001:678:618::40]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "plan-b.pwste.edu.pl", Issuer "GEANT OV RSA CA 4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4VfhLz3ZHGz4nBY for ; Wed, 15 May 2024 18:19:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from zarychtam@plan-b.pwste.edu.pl) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=plan-b.pwste.edu.pl header.s=plan-b-mailer header.b=v9WGC+TQ; dmarc=pass (policy=quarantine) header.from=plan-b.pwste.edu.pl; 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boundary="------------0iQnbKUC48Wd0AISOHCc1jVr" Message-ID: <1613e4c8-c102-45a8-9f8e-3b5e7fd09e25@plan-b.pwste.edu.pl> Date: Wed, 15 May 2024 20:18:54 +0200 List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: removing RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d) To: freebsd-net@freebsd.org References: Content-Language: en-US From: Marek Zarychta Autocrypt: addr=zarychtam@plan-b.pwste.edu.pl; keydata= xsBNBFfi3cMBCADLecMTFXad4uDXqv3eRuB4qJJ8G9tzzFezeRnnwxOsPdytW5ES2z1ibSrR IsiImx6+PTqrAmXpTInxAi7yiZGdSiONRI4CCxKY9d1YFiNYT/2WyNXCekm9x29YeIU7x0JB Llbz0f/9HC+styBIu2H+PY/X98Clzm110CS+n/b9l1AtiGxTiVFj7/uavYAKxH6LNWnbkuc5 v8EVNc7NkEcl5h7Z9X5NEtzDxTOiBIFQ/kOT7LAtkYUPo1lqLeOM2DtWSXTXQgXl0zJI4iP1 OAu4qQYm2nXwq4b2AH9peknelvnt1mpfgDCGSKnhc26q6ibTfMwydp+tvUtQIQYpA6b9ABEB AAHNN01hcmVrIFphcnljaHRhIChQbGFuLWIpIDx6YXJ5Y2h0YW1AcGxhbi1iLnB3c3RlLmVk dS5wbD7CwHcEEwEIACEFAlfi4LkCGwMFCwkIBwIGFQgJCgsCBBYCAwECHgECF4AACgkQHZW8 vIFppoJXdgf8D9X3VRFSNaR9lthSx/+uqas17J3FJKBo1xMQsC2a+44vzNvYJSuPGLLJ+LW2 HPVazjP/BWZJbxOYpliY4zxNRU0YCp0BLIVLibc//yax+mE42FND/+NiIZhqJscl6MLPrSwo sIwXec4XYkldkyqW/xBbBYXoIkBqdKB9j5j42Npy1IV/RizOSdmvTWY27ir8e/yGMR1RLr4F 8P5K3OWTdlGy2H2F/3J8bIPBLG6FpaIyLQw4dHSx8V02PYqDxK1cNo2kAOnU8PnZL/AGuMOH iv3MN1VYL8ehcmpBBsrZGebQJxrjY2/5IaTSgp9xHYT70kshuU6Qb97vk1mOjNZxgc7ATQRX 4t3DAQgA10h6RCXuBLMHxq5B8X/ZIlj9sgLoeyfRdDZEc9rT2KUeUJVHDsbvOFf4/7F1ovWY hJbA6GK/LUZeHHTjnbZcH1uDYQeHly4UOLxeEvhGoz4JhS2C7JzN/uRnwbdOAUbJr8rUj/IY a7gk906rktsc/Ldrxrxh7O6WO0JCh2XO/p4pDfEwwB37g4xHprSab28ECYJ9JMbtA8Sy4M55 g3+GQ28FvSlGnx48OoGXU2BZdc1vZKSQmNOlikB+9/hDX8zdYWVfDaX1TLQ8Ib4+xTUmapza mV/bxIsaZRBw+jFjLQHhTbIMfPEU+4mxFDvTdbKPruKPqVf1ydgMnPZWngowdwARAQABwsBf BBgBCAAJBQJX4t3DAhsMAAoJEB2VvLyBaaaC6qkIAJs9sDPqrqW0bYoRfzY6XjDWQ59p9tJi v8aogxacQNCfAu+WkJ8PNVUtC1dlVcG5NnZ80gXzd1rc8ueIvXlvdanUt/jZd8jbb3gaDbK3 wh1yMCGBl/1fOJTyEGYv1CRojv97KK89KP5+r8x1P1iHcSrunlDNqGxTMydNCwBH23QcOM+m u4spKnJ/s0VRBkw3xoKBZfZza6fTQ4gTpAipjyk7ldOGBV+PvkKATdhK2yLwuWXhKbg/GRlD 1r5P0gxzSqfV4My+KJuc2EDcrqp1y0wOpE1m9iZqCcd0fup5f7HDsYlLWshr7NQl28f6+fQb sylq/j672BHXsdeqf/Ip9V4= In-Reply-To: X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.89 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-0.999]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[plan-b.pwste.edu.pl,quarantine]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[plan-b.pwste.edu.pl:s=plan-b-mailer]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; ONCE_RECEIVED(0.10)[]; XM_UA_NO_VERSION(0.01)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; ASN(0.00)[asn:206006, ipnet:2001:678:618::/48, country:PL]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-net@freebsd.org]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; HAS_XAW(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-net@freebsd.org]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[plan-b.pwste.edu.pl:+] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4VfhLz3ZHGz4nBY This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------0iQnbKUC48Wd0AISOHCc1jVr Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Today Michael Sierchio wrote: > There is an argument to be made that all such components of the "base" > system should be packages, and managed that way.  That would > facilitate removal or addition of things like MTAs, Route daemons for > various protocols, etc.  and permit them to be updated independent of > the base system.  Too much is included by default in Base. > FreeBSD is a comprehensive OS, and most users still do appreciate this feature. I remember that we had also RCS tools in the base system, they got purged (moved to the ports tree really), most users are fine with it, but for managing single config files RCS is still the best-suited versioning system. We still have ftpd(8), but it was almost removed, there was a strong battle on the mailing list to preserve it. FTP protocol is as old as BSD, but it's still valid and, so far not deprecated. A similar story was with smbfs(5). The same probably applies to RIP/RIPng. What if we would better remove LLVM from the base if the system is bloated ? LLVM needs frequent updates and keeping it in base is far more risky in terms of system security than keeping RIP daemons. Why do we still have odd tools like biff(1) in the base ? On the other hand, for a significant share of the user base, the more tiny the OS is, the better. The transition to PkgBase should fulfill user needs, especially those, who want a minimalist OS. So please, go ahead and switch to PgkBase if your FreeBSD system contains undesired software. Cheers Marek > > On Wed, May 15, 2024 at 1:01 PM John Howie wrote: > > I use RIP all the time. Removing it would be a pain. What is the > justification? Moving it to ports is an option, but now we have to > compile, distribute, and install it. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On May 15, 2024, at 07:40, Tomek CEDRO wrote: > > > > On Wed, May 15, 2024 at 4:20 PM Scott > wrote: > >>> On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 09:49:27PM +0100, Lexi Winter wrote: > >>> (..) > >>> i'd like to submit a patch to remove both of these daemons > from src.  if > >>> there's some concern that people still want to use the BSD > >>> implementation of routed/route6d, i'm also willing to submit a > port such > >>> as net/freebsd-routed containing the old code, in a similar > way to how > >>> the removal of things like window(1) and telnetd(8) were handled. > >> > >> I use RIPv2 for it's simplicity and small memory and CPU > requirements.  It > >> has its place and shouldn't be considered "legacy" despite its > shortcomings. > >> It's not uncommon for vendors like Cisco to produce "basic" > feature sets of > >> IOS that do not include any link-state protocols. > >> > >> Anyway, I'm a user, albeit a small user, of RIP and wouldn't > object to its > >> removal from FreeBSD if there were a small footprint > alternative.  I've used > >> FRR and VyOS a bit and they are overkill as replacements. > >> > >> Your email doesn't justify its removal other than to say you > are unconvinced > >> of the value of shipping it.  As a user I definitely see the > value.  I > >> understand that there is always a cost to providing code, but > that wasn't > >> suggested as a reason.  All APIs, modules, utilities, etc. need > to regularly > >> justify their presence in the OS. > >> > >> If it must be removed, is there any way to fork the FreeBSD > routed and > >> route6d to a port?  Or would that defeat the purpose of > removing it in the > >> first place? > > > > Yeah, where did that recent trend came to FreeBSD to remove > perfectly > > working code?? > > > > There are more and more ideas in recent times like this. > > > > Architectures removal, drivers removal, backward compatibility > > removal. While basic functions become unstable and unreliable. Looks > > more like diversion and sabotage than progress. > > > > If anything is about to be moved out from SRC for a really good > reason > > it should be available in ports and not in /dev/null. > > > --------------0iQnbKUC48Wd0AISOHCc1jVr Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Today Michael Sierchio wrote:
There is an argument to be made that all such components of the "base" system should be packages, and managed that way.  That would facilitate removal or addition of things like MTAs, Route daemons for various protocols, etc.  and permit them to be updated independent of the base system.  Too much is included by default in Base.

FreeBSD is a comprehensive OS, and most users still do appreciate this feature.

I remember that we had also RCS tools in the base system, they got purged (moved to the ports tree really), most users are fine with it, but for managing single config files RCS is still the best-suited versioning system. We still have ftpd(8), but it was almost removed, there was a strong battle on the mailing list to preserve it. FTP protocol is as old as BSD, but it's still valid and, so far not deprecated. A similar story was with smbfs(5). The same probably applies to RIP/RIPng.  
What if we would better remove LLVM from the base if the system is bloated ? LLVM needs frequent updates and keeping it in base is far more risky in terms of system security than keeping RIP daemons. Why do we still have odd tools like biff(1) in the base ?


On the other hand, for a significant share of the user base, the more tiny the OS is, the better. The transition to PkgBase should fulfill user needs, especially those, who want a minimalist OS. So please, go ahead and switch to PgkBase if your FreeBSD system contains undesired software.

Cheers

Marek


On Wed, May 15, 2024 at 1:01 PM John Howie <john@thehowies.com> wrote:
I use RIP all the time. Removing it would be a pain. What is the justification? Moving it to ports is an option, but now we have to compile, distribute, and install it.

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 15, 2024, at 07:40, Tomek CEDRO <tomek@cedro.info> wrote:
>
> On Wed, May 15, 2024 at 4:20 PM Scott <uatka3z4zagp@thismonkey.com> wrote:
>>> On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 09:49:27PM +0100, Lexi Winter wrote:
>>> (..)
>>> i'd like to submit a patch to remove both of these daemons from src.  if
>>> there's some concern that people still want to use the BSD
>>> implementation of routed/route6d, i'm also willing to submit a port such
>>> as net/freebsd-routed containing the old code, in a similar way to how
>>> the removal of things like window(1) and telnetd(8) were handled.
>>
>> I use RIPv2 for it's simplicity and small memory and CPU requirements.  It
>> has its place and shouldn't be considered "legacy" despite its shortcomings.
>> It's not uncommon for vendors like Cisco to produce "basic" feature sets of
>> IOS that do not include any link-state protocols.
>>
>> Anyway, I'm a user, albeit a small user, of RIP and wouldn't object to its
>> removal from FreeBSD if there were a small footprint alternative.  I've used
>> FRR and VyOS a bit and they are overkill as replacements.
>>
>> Your email doesn't justify its removal other than to say you are unconvinced
>> of the value of shipping it.  As a user I definitely see the value.  I
>> understand that there is always a cost to providing code, but that wasn't
>> suggested as a reason.  All APIs, modules, utilities, etc. need to regularly
>> justify their presence in the OS.
>>
>> If it must be removed, is there any way to fork the FreeBSD routed and
>> route6d to a port?  Or would that defeat the purpose of removing it in the
>> first place?
>
> Yeah, where did that recent trend came to FreeBSD to remove perfectly
> working code??
>
> There are more and more ideas in recent times like this.
>
> Architectures removal, drivers removal, backward compatibility
> removal. While basic functions become unstable and unreliable. Looks
> more like diversion and sabotage than progress.
>
> If anything is about to be moved out from SRC for a really good reason
> it should be available in ports and not in /dev/null.
>
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"freebsd-net@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: removing RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d) Thread-Topic: removing RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d) Thread-Index: AQHaptMX20aCEjsiuEiKqhXMxcNYVbGYXf6AgAAnXwCAAAYMAIAAD6AAgACAAVI= Date: Thu, 16 May 2024 02:04:23 +0000 Message-ID: References: <1613e4c8-c102-45a8-9f8e-3b5e7fd09e25@plan-b.pwste.edu.pl> In-Reply-To: <1613e4c8-c102-45a8-9f8e-3b5e7fd09e25@plan-b.pwste.edu.pl> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-tmn: [eEyXzyqPFjYA6r1q1yApq8wmKFFJy4po] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: MN0PR84MB3024:EE_|MW4PR84MB1658:EE_ x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: cc9c3f57-a6ab-4f77-e3d0-08dc754c81d5 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0;ARA:14566002|461199019|3412199016|440099019|102099023; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: 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biAvZGV2L251bGwuPGJyPg0KJmd0OyA8bzpwPjwvbzpwPjwvcD4NCjwvYmxvY2txdW90ZT4NCjwv ZGl2Pg0KPC9ibG9ja3F1b3RlPg0KPC9kaXY+DQo8L2Rpdj4NCjwvZGl2Pg0KPC9ib2R5Pg0KPC9o dG1sPg0K --_000_MN0PR84MB30249D0A4A4854B8175C9A1DD3ED2MN0PR84MB3024NAMP_-- From nobody Thu May 16 02:15:07 2024 X-Original-To: freebsd-net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4Vftwk3KVWz5KHhm for ; Thu, 16 May 2024 02:15:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from paul@redbarn.org) Received: from util.redbarn.org (util.redbarn.org [24.104.150.222]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "*.redbarn.org", Issuer "RapidSSL TLS RSA CA G1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4Vftwk0rx3z4c3S for ; Thu, 16 May 2024 02:15:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from paul@redbarn.org) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: from family.redbarn.org (family.redbarn.org [IPv6:2001:559:8000:cd::5]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "*.redbarn.org", Issuer "RapidSSL TLS RSA CA G1" (not verified)) by util.redbarn.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5FEC319CCAE; Thu, 16 May 2024 02:15:26 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=redbarn.org; s=util; t=1715825726; bh=CoA1T2cNNDgtx1BvLQNhIuIo0XpjQztki29tpuqYZto=; h=Subject:To:Cc:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=LgTgotfj7MypCRUN1hiBO1noc1UGLld2Qv1oTaoQXDax60zE2RcxR8h39pDWj21r3 7TwXmqzc1ORXemoAl9jqRNMz8xis9nRDXjTl0YYW+1U4VhWHliM0NcneXwGFN01KaB v6LVZT0hIp3CQMEov4qnElG5G2soIGVBkqJxjcJY= Received: from [172.20.11.2] (unknown [63.70.1.35]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by family.redbarn.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id C5228C3F21; Thu, 16 May 2024 02:15:25 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: removing RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d) To: John Howie Cc: Marek Zarychta , "freebsd-net@freebsd.org" References: <1613e4c8-c102-45a8-9f8e-3b5e7fd09e25@plan-b.pwste.edu.pl> From: Paul Vixie Message-ID: <1d1a86d9-c08b-9699-732a-999032e61035@redbarn.org> Date: Wed, 15 May 2024 19:15:07 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 PostboxApp/7.0.60 List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:33651, ipnet:24.104.150.0/24, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4Vftwk0rx3z4c3S i think it's not too soon for the bsd community to become less reactionary. (yes, i know that's ironic coming from me.) https://nomadbsd.org/ i'd like freebsd to be fit for a lot of purposes. a complete OS is one of those that i will use the most. but not the only one for me, and not the only one for the community. take deep breaths. re: John Howie wrote on 2024-05-15 19:04: > FreeBSD (and BSD Unix in general) has a rich history of being a > “complete” OS – kernel and userland. If there was really a demand for a > minimalist version of FreeBSD, why have people not forked FreeBSD and > created it by now? There is also nanobsd, as an option, for those that > want minimalist installs (yes, I know it is meant for embedded systems, > but it works). > > I think we need to stop trying to find solutions for non-existent problems. > > *From: *owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org on > behalf of Marek Zarychta > *Date: *Wednesday, May 15, 2024 at 11:19 AM > *To: *freebsd-net@freebsd.org > *Subject: *Re: removing RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d) > > Today Michael Sierchio wrote: > > There is an argument to be made that all such components of the > "base" system should be packages, and managed that way.  That would > facilitate removal or addition of things like MTAs, Route daemons > for various protocols, etc.  and permit them to be updated > independent of the base system.  Too much is included by default in > Base. > > FreeBSD is a comprehensive OS, and most users still do appreciate this > feature. > > I remember that we had also RCS tools in the base system, they got > purged (moved to the ports tree really), most users are fine with it, > but for managing single config files RCS is still the best-suited > versioning system. We still have ftpd(8), but it was almost removed, > there was a strong battle on the mailing list to preserve it. FTP > protocol is as old as BSD, but it's still valid and, so far not > deprecated. A similar story was with smbfs(5). The same probably applies > to RIP/RIPng. > What if we would better remove LLVM from the base if the system is > bloated ? LLVM needs frequent updates and keeping it in base is far more > risky in terms of system security than keeping RIP daemons. Why do we > still have odd tools like biff(1) in the base ? > > On the other hand, for a significant share of the user base, the more > tiny the OS is, the better. The transition to PkgBase should fulfill > user needs, especially those, who want a minimalist OS. So please, go > ahead and switch to PgkBase if your FreeBSD system contains undesired > software. > > Cheers > > Marek > > On Wed, May 15, 2024 at 1:01 PM John Howie > wrote: > > I use RIP all the time. Removing it would be a pain. What is the > justification? Moving it to ports is an option, but now we have > to compile, distribute, and install it. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On May 15, 2024, at 07:40, Tomek CEDRO > wrote: > > > > On Wed, May 15, 2024 at 4:20 PM Scott > > wrote: > >>> On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 09:49:27PM +0100, Lexi Winter wrote: > >>> (..) > >>> i'd like to submit a patch to remove both of these daemons > from src.  if > >>> there's some concern that people still want to use the BSD > >>> implementation of routed/route6d, i'm also willing to > submit a port such > >>> as net/freebsd-routed containing the old code, in a similar > way to how > >>> the removal of things like window(1) and telnetd(8) were > handled. > >> > >> I use RIPv2 for it's simplicity and small memory and CPU > requirements.  It > >> has its place and shouldn't be considered "legacy" despite > its shortcomings. > >> It's not uncommon for vendors like Cisco to produce "basic" > feature sets of > >> IOS that do not include any link-state protocols. > >> > >> Anyway, I'm a user, albeit a small user, of RIP and wouldn't > object to its > >> removal from FreeBSD if there were a small footprint > alternative.  I've used > >> FRR and VyOS a bit and they are overkill as replacements. > >> > >> Your email doesn't justify its removal other than to say you > are unconvinced > >> of the value of shipping it.  As a user I definitely see the > value.  I > >> understand that there is always a cost to providing code, > but that wasn't > >> suggested as a reason.  All APIs, modules, utilities, etc. > need to regularly > >> justify their presence in the OS. > >> > >> If it must be removed, is there any way to fork the FreeBSD > routed and > >> route6d to a port?  Or would that defeat the purpose of > removing it in the > >> first place? > > > > Yeah, where did that recent trend came to FreeBSD to remove > perfectly > > working code?? > > > > There are more and more ideas in recent times like this. > > > > Architectures removal, drivers removal, backward compatibility > > removal. While basic functions become unstable and > unreliable. Looks > > more like diversion and sabotage than progress. > > > > If anything is about to be moved out from SRC for a really > good reason > > it should be available in ports and not in /dev/null. > > > -- P Vixie From nobody Thu May 16 13:02:52 2024 X-Original-To: net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4Vg9Hr3068z5LDtq for ; Thu, 16 May 2024 13:03:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lexi@le-fay.org) Received: from fuchsia.eden.le-Fay.ORG (fuchsia.eden.le-fay.org [81.187.47.195]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4Vg9Hq55nsz4sC3 for ; Thu, 16 May 2024 13:03:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lexi@le-fay.org) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: from iris.eden.le-Fay.ORG (iris.eden.le-fay.org [IPv6:2001:8b0:aab5:106:3::6]) by fuchsia.eden.le-Fay.ORG (Postfix) with ESMTP id 994B728E8D; Thu, 16 May 2024 13:02:53 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=le-fay.org; s=fuchsia; t=1715864573; bh=nnv93NR+Gk4WzE9vba+yPxLZ5jTgwivR6Eb74Q11MtE=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:References:In-Reply-To; b=eBRVVW+Enb4KIOMPnP88UgzpvQfcvAdovTcehBm9qQmkFuChfxaltm3+h8JVMbgvR Uwrb4WB5K926SG7yZdDaB/VEzxbCG2y0M+cizoqZOTrUxLIfRHFrmzkiFlzpc0fBRt CNH0ZE0AFmcPIfE3W7hD5jRaO2497ijg2uesmpD4= Received: from ilythia.eden.le-fay.org (ilythia.eden.le-fay.org [IPv6:2001:8b0:aab5:106:3::10]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature ECDSA (secp384r1) server-digest SHA384) (No client certificate requested) by iris.eden.le-Fay.ORG (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 8B3CA2C04D7; Thu, 16 May 2024 14:02:53 +0100 (BST) Date: Thu, 16 May 2024 14:02:52 +0100 From: Lexi Winter To: Scott Cc: net@freebsd.org Subject: Re: removing RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d) Message-ID: Mail-Followup-To: Scott , net@freebsd.org References: List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="dhq8335QEg/pPl2I" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:20712, ipnet:81.187.0.0/16, country:GB] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4Vg9Hq55nsz4sC3 --dhq8335QEg/pPl2I Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Scott: > I use RIPv2 for it's simplicity and small memory and CPU requirements. I= t=20 > has its place and shouldn't be considered "legacy" despite its shortcomin= gs. =20 > It's not uncommon for vendors like Cisco to produce "basic" feature sets = of=20 > IOS that do not include any link-state protocols. =20 i imagined there are still people using RIP, so i only proposed removing it since there are several alternatives available. > Anyway, I'm a user, albeit a small user, of RIP and wouldn't object to it= s=20 > removal from FreeBSD if there were a small footprint alternative. I've u= sed=20 > FRR and VyOS a bit and they are overkill as replacements. Cy has already created ports for these (although i haven't tested them yet): https://cgit.freebsd.org/ports/tree/net/freebsd-routed https://cgit.freebsd.org/ports/tree/net/freebsd-route6d so if you like routed/route6d, you can continue using them even after their removal. that said, i'd also suggest considering net/bird2; it's smaller than FRR and (imo) nicer to manage, not to mention much more maintained than routed is. > Your email doesn't justify its removal other than to say you are unconvin= ced=20 > of the value of shipping it. As a user I definitely see the value. I=20 > understand that there is always a cost to providing code, but that wasn't= =20 > suggested as a reason. All APIs, modules, utilities, etc. need to regula= rly=20 > justify their presence in the OS. =20 let me turn this around and ask the opposite question: if FreeBSD didn't currently ship RIP/RIPng in the base operating system, would a request to add an implementation of it be considered? almost anything would be useful for someone, somewhere. for example, i'd quite like to see a basic Wayland compositor (such as hikari) and a terminal emulator in the base system, because that's a bit nicer to use than vt(4) if you just need to occasionally manage a system via the framebuffer console. i feel fairly confident to say that this would be useful to a greater number of people than an implementation of RIP. =20 but i wouldn't propose actually doing this in base, because i can fairly easily install this from ports, and the cost of maintaining the code in base would outweight the advantage of not having to type 'pkg install hikari'. similarly for RIP/RIPng, if routed were currently in ports and not in base, there would be very little justification for integrating it into base when someone can just install it from the port. this was different back in the days when routed was first created, because there was no ports system and RIP was common enough that it was useful to users -- along with the fact that 4BSD was effectively the reference implementation of IP and sockets, so shipping RIP was reasonable in that context. so the question for me is not whether it should be in base at all (it clearly shouldn't be, by today's standards), but does the inconvenience to users of removing it outweigh the cost of maintaining the code forever? i don't claim to have any particular expertise here, so people might reasonably disagree, but in my opinion, given the small number of users, the advanced notice period (15.0-RELEASE) and the ease of addressing the problem (pkg install freebsd-routed) the answer is yes. someone elsethread mentioned that they expect FreeBSD to be a "complete operating system". what does this mean in practice? many people expect a complete operating system to include a GUI, yet FreeBSD hasn't shipped X in the base system for quite a while. should we put X back into base? the most sensible way to address this, to me, seems to be that the base OS should include things which are a) widely used, b) not available elsewhere, and c) worth the maintenance cost. for example, the kernel is in base, because there's no FreeBSD without the kernel. /bin/sh is in base because the OS would be unusable without it, even though you can install other shells from ports. /etc/rc is in base because an rc-system is required and /etc/rc is the only one that exists for FreeBSD. fetch(1) is in base even though you can install equivalent software (e.g., cURL) from ports, so you could make an argument that it should be moved to ports. however, fetch is useful for both bsdinstall and for many custom post-installation tasks that need an HTTP client, and attempting to remove it would be very disruptive. cron(8) is in base even though there are other cron implementations, because widely-used parts of the the base system (e.g., periodic(8)) depend on cron for basic functionality; removing cron would also require removing this functionality, and that would be a significant loss to users with no obvious replacement. but routed is not widely used in general, either by users or by the OS itself; there are many implementations of RIP available elsewhere; and the code is both old, barely maintained, and a network server, making it a potential security risk among other maintenance costs. i think a good example here, similar to routed, would be window(1). 30 years ago, i used window(1) all the time; it was very useful and an obvious candidate for a base utility considering how (relatively) common text terminals were. but since then, the world changed: text consoles are less common (in favour of GUIs) and people nowadays are more likely to use screen(1) or tmux(1), modern utilities which do the same thing better. so while window(1) had enough remaining users to justify moving it to a port, it failed to meet the requirements a) and c) above. would people objecting to the removal of routed also advocate for putting window(1) back into base? (this is not a rhetorical question, 'yes' is a perfectly reasonable answer.) --- a couple of people also mentioned pkgbase and i think this is likely to have an effect on this sort of discussion, especially because it makes the current hard divide between src and ports more permeable: there's not much difference between typing 'pkg install FreeBSD-routed' (pkgbase) or 'pkg install freebsd-routed' (ports), for example. i like pkgbase and use it on all my systems, so i'm very interested to see where this leads. in fact, i originally intended to submit a patch to move routed into a new pkgbase package, as i've recently done with some other base utilities. in the ended i decided, based on the reasoning above, that it made more sense to simply remove it. my guess is that if/when pkgbase does become the default, it will make it easier to justify removals like these, because if you already have to install routed (or whatever) from a pkgbase package, it's not much of a change to install it from a ports package instead. --dhq8335QEg/pPl2I Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQGzBAABCAAdFiEEuwt6MaPcv/+Mo+ftDHqbqZ41x5kFAmZGA/oACgkQDHqbqZ41 x5nOlwwAnemsSVz9kGVzYC2hC2uU7lurapV5Ng5CAXvb8FQ+dtOvP6QvpYUVp0ar I1LLylQhTMCczOBS+PNNVkgPEiWJv+PU3V9YXsGk+hAe1IujEzdox8eE6sDPd9pn qoyPiMEYIQ1tbY1zQfPpg47JY3vepgFCImr22lk1yjkfgUuwCyuPMIMpL8YONvvK MRA+Y0iEonyzTcX6eLJZrQUAIcLCBr+3fBCrApHFd0K37Npq4RCn2HvUSr5MU+ou 3mZj/BUed8kIo0BhplwgmIRMiPFly2FhkKjKlTdYnHuBXxbAJz7zWd+8yw3dkvcK Pii/7DPUulMx4hmjO+jLn/L+SLbu8bEEaQySvUcDt9At/jAOpfwUYBYHW2kCciD3 0rK43TtL/3eG+7XcJSb6L0WtYo9NHk0HIgi7CBoy8tjSaYZU+/ERsS973K2iuboc 1b/iG/jL876+PWeplHQ3/PSQi1Cmw6GnRdTnIRfZ+UmIu1ZIHGJCFW+2PGe+1wP/ vns8i5CV =vXWD -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --dhq8335QEg/pPl2I-- From nobody Thu May 16 13:13:30 2024 X-Original-To: net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4Vg9X91rKLz5LF7f for ; Thu, 16 May 2024 13:13:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: from mail-yw1-x1130.google.com (mail-yw1-x1130.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::1130]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1D4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4Vg9X83VVjz4tcf for ; Thu, 16 May 2024 13:13:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=cedro.info header.s=google header.b=iAhZTjXw; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tomek@cedro.info has no SPF policy when checking 2607:f8b0:4864:20::1130) smtp.mailfrom=tomek@cedro.info Received: by mail-yw1-x1130.google.com with SMTP id 00721157ae682-61816fc256dso82598977b3.0 for ; Thu, 16 May 2024 06:13:44 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cedro.info; s=google; t=1715865223; x=1716470023; darn=freebsd.org; h=content-transfer-encoding:to:subject:message-id:date:from :in-reply-to:references:mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date :message-id:reply-to; bh=dCXC4tFNZnzAF98dqa1hQmriQXoKVbrUBASozNBuF7s=; b=iAhZTjXw06nI8K63bJWBME89lWgfhPJbSvVZ184zl4jJR126ISCzP9z52giIaoss2h 5SIG/moiUCYFPnVj8QzgzSOrq+hRq4v90xXE75RO9JNG4/AGnOjkee9iaXQyg7bCSHV7 A9NJXbx1U7ncIaZfwBL0D5zQqSDQM2qziF1Rtfu+nepFE18UYrnuwHbuzINOctZJ7yai P1DOneEJzZc23GlJ1E4WQJJ++bAzFfkp9cba8QtAqg6QpAaKjsc01OToEs9n3wc6JEBR /BUnjGnL21sgf9DBjlnFaup96c3/q8CoRNxYUShogY4oVC2SomwjTSXveds2CwszwuQs tfwA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1715865223; x=1716470023; h=content-transfer-encoding:to:subject:message-id:date:from :in-reply-to:references:mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=dCXC4tFNZnzAF98dqa1hQmriQXoKVbrUBASozNBuF7s=; b=iSc8rDpBUExVvscsiCRja1Pw2eSbo7ZZ3rWIvya0yJtXqzw4zDbV7/mgUKcjuMIP0l cyWcUi34V/IBYx68jMjvT+icH7nhQLEE8qT3Ngz0hR/KMM4TNrRDGn2UUrK5md+9BFPh RDnnR55Pgcy6NHkqR34IdlvRFpybJmxJcTUQFf6qhhYuVygd+NQzLaXys97GWXaVd4u+ TXoyZr5QYNH+fit6IsaF34r8BrBvG47G1SlNaCQiPjnf5EPM7u1UILLzB1C2dPZnGz15 pWJy9eZh8o2AOAA2Ul0Gm8v6esGvTINCxDGbSkd5+ddqLvnOVcPqj2AZTMThXBU3bZKg 0xvA== X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCVC8JGWy0q/0Bl5vyoknoyzJDW+b6Wko40pP3ue6WPXrhja34VAnU2cw0laagWfDoN7H+qxZxYly9Fl94D7bIg= X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0Ywft6e4CuB4cBzEgIihxcvOYE8q+/niSiRa2oa8b72WCtM8PKOD /HQ/SwdwEn4yWEblaKqRNAglR858tp7VPW+NwLe5c+dma3wc8eMk+MLNZukpFVyCjIyz9WNmyeE = X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IFjuJk41uQD2OdnON0yEiDSNZPFFm+NLlsUEce/CClqE50IIDwCmYoVY5RETvJ9lTC9OyyJLg== X-Received: by 2002:a81:4ed0:0:b0:615:7899:65cb with SMTP id 00721157ae682-622b0147eacmr161606967b3.36.1715865222835; Thu, 16 May 2024 06:13:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-yb1-f177.google.com (mail-yb1-f177.google.com. [209.85.219.177]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 00721157ae682-6209e346ef3sm34671887b3.102.2024.05.16.06.13.41 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 16 May 2024 06:13:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-yb1-f177.google.com with SMTP id 3f1490d57ef6-dee9943a293so4380918276.0 for ; Thu, 16 May 2024 06:13:41 -0700 (PDT) X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCX/X5SPbuUYRHuBrQqK05fZWWPi7P3T00XmopM6I8xiZdj0qNgupkHALj6NCzru6DZiBJdpLz2ehXMjGQ0dBPc= X-Received: by 2002:a25:2b45:0:b0:de0:d515:259b with SMTP id 3f1490d57ef6-dee4f335262mr15847947276.59.1715865221578; Thu, 16 May 2024 06:13:41 -0700 (PDT) List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Tomek CEDRO Date: Thu, 16 May 2024 15:13:30 +0200 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: removing RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d) To: Scott , net@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.29 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.99)[-0.989]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[cedro.info:s=google]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[no SPF record]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; MISSING_XM_UA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[cedro.info]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[net@freebsd.org]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2607:f8b0:4864:20::1130:from,209.85.219.177:received]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[net@freebsd.org]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[cedro.info:+] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4Vg9X83VVjz4tcf On Thu, May 16, 2024 at 3:03=E2=80=AFPM Lexi Winter wrote= : > (..) > almost anything would be useful for someone, somewhere. for example, > i'd quite like to see a basic Wayland compositor (such as hikari) and a > terminal emulator in the base system, because that's a bit nicer to use > than vt(4) if you just need to occasionally manage a system via the > framebuffer console. i feel fairly confident to say that this would be > useful to a greater number of people than an implementation of RIP. If that takes around 10MB its worth considering.. may be helpful for visual oci management :-) > would people objecting to the removal of routed also advocate for > putting window(1) back into base? (this is not a rhetorical question, > 'yes' is a perfectly reasonable answer.) The subtle difference between "removing RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d)" and "[base->ports] moving RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d) to ports" :-) Have a good day folks :-) --=20 CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info From nobody Thu May 16 14:42:23 2024 X-Original-To: net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4VgCVn4xQcz5LMMl for ; Thu, 16 May 2024 14:42:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from uatka3z4zagp@thismonkey.com) Received: from mail-01.thismonkey.com (mail-01.thismonkey.com [IPv6:2406:3400:35e:6602::a01:232]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "thismonkey.com", Issuer "R3" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4VgCVm6Lcwz44gn for ; Thu, 16 May 2024 14:42:40 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from uatka3z4zagp@thismonkey.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=thismonkey.com; s=mail-01; t=1715870547; bh=QPlzuykNgtELM1tDVL/94ELwBeAwbaCufL2HsN2Dz/I=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:References:In-Reply-To; b=hglq5ycCj4AMUySdEcQS5rviqjzyPgXhZmYl5DuLyfoHk6wpFDvkD1dxcI8fX8vgl tVHt32VNZpSDojWpdWG+wI8iwCljCuHWYi/HTjjrtR4YE2qvZz+bW1sLpT1RVDd/RG hIQYXldom3jzp032ud/aBwe+l93QbPtpdsLn3lpQ= Received: from mailhub-01.thismonkey.com (mailhub-01.thismonkey.com [IPv6:2406:3400:35e:6601:0:0:a01:11e]) by mail-01.thismonkey.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id 44GEgROp091834; Fri, 17 May 2024 00:42:27 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from uatka3z4zagp@thismonkey.com) X-TM-Via-MX: mailhub-01.thismonkey.com Received: from utility-01.thismonkey.com (utility-01.thismonkey.com [IPv6:2406:3400:35e:6601:0:0:a01:120]) by mailhub-01.thismonkey.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id 44GEgRkF013419 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Fri, 17 May 2024 00:42:27 +1000 (AEST) (envelope-from uatka3z4zagp@thismonkey.com) Received: from utility-01.thismonkey.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by utility-01.thismonkey.com (8.16.1/8.16.1) with ESMTP id 44GEgRFf009364; Fri, 17 May 2024 00:42:27 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from uatka3z4zagp@thismonkey.com) Received: (from root@localhost) by utility-01.thismonkey.com (8.16.1/8.16.1/Submit) id 44GEgNEX009303; Fri, 17 May 2024 00:42:23 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from uatka3z4zagp@thismonkey.com) Date: Fri, 17 May 2024 00:42:23 +1000 From: Scott To: Lexi Winter Cc: net@freebsd.org Subject: Re: removing RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d) Message-ID: References: List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:10143, ipnet:2406:3400:340::/42, country:AU] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4VgCVm6Lcwz44gn On Thu, May 16, 2024 at 02:02:52PM +0100, Lexi Winter wrote: > Scott: > > I use RIPv2 for it's simplicity and small memory and CPU requirements. It > > has its place and shouldn't be considered "legacy" despite its shortcomings. > > It's not uncommon for vendors like Cisco to produce "basic" feature sets of > > IOS that do not include any link-state protocols. > > i imagined there are still people using RIP, so i only proposed removing > it since there are several alternatives available. > > > Anyway, I'm a user, albeit a small user, of RIP and wouldn't object to its > > removal from FreeBSD if there were a small footprint alternative. I've used > > FRR and VyOS a bit and they are overkill as replacements. > > Cy has already created ports for these (although i haven't tested them > yet): > > https://cgit.freebsd.org/ports/tree/net/freebsd-routed > https://cgit.freebsd.org/ports/tree/net/freebsd-route6d > > so if you like routed/route6d, you can continue using them even after > their removal. that said, i'd also suggest considering net/bird2; it's > smaller than FRR and (imo) nicer to manage, not to mention much more > maintained than routed is. > > > Your email doesn't justify its removal other than to say you are unconvinced > > of the value of shipping it. As a user I definitely see the value. I > > understand that there is always a cost to providing code, but that wasn't > > suggested as a reason. All APIs, modules, utilities, etc. need to regularly > > justify their presence in the OS. > > let me turn this around and ask the opposite question: if FreeBSD didn't > currently ship RIP/RIPng in the base operating system, would a request > to add an implementation of it be considered? > > almost anything would be useful for someone, somewhere. for example, > i'd quite like to see a basic Wayland compositor (such as hikari) and a > terminal emulator in the base system, because that's a bit nicer to use > than vt(4) if you just need to occasionally manage a system via the > framebuffer console. i feel fairly confident to say that this would be > useful to a greater number of people than an implementation of RIP. > > but i wouldn't propose actually doing this in base, because i can fairly > easily install this from ports, and the cost of maintaining the code in > base would outweight the advantage of not having to type 'pkg install > hikari'. > > similarly for RIP/RIPng, if routed were currently in ports and not in > base, there would be very little justification for integrating it into > base when someone can just install it from the port. > > this was different back in the days when routed was first created, > because there was no ports system and RIP was common enough that it was > useful to users -- along with the fact that 4BSD was effectively the > reference implementation of IP and sockets, so shipping RIP was > reasonable in that context. > > so the question for me is not whether it should be in base at all (it > clearly shouldn't be, by today's standards), but does the inconvenience > to users of removing it outweigh the cost of maintaining the code > forever? i don't claim to have any particular expertise here, so people > might reasonably disagree, but in my opinion, given the small number of > users, the advanced notice period (15.0-RELEASE) and the ease of > addressing the problem (pkg install freebsd-routed) the answer is yes. > > someone elsethread mentioned that they expect FreeBSD to be a "complete > operating system". what does this mean in practice? many people expect > a complete operating system to include a GUI, yet FreeBSD hasn't shipped > X in the base system for quite a while. should we put X back into base? > > the most sensible way to address this, to me, seems to be that the base > OS should include things which are a) widely used, b) not available > elsewhere, and c) worth the maintenance cost. for example, the kernel > is in base, because there's no FreeBSD without the kernel. /bin/sh is > in base because the OS would be unusable without it, even though you > can install other shells from ports. /etc/rc is in base because an > rc-system is required and /etc/rc is the only one that exists for > FreeBSD. > > fetch(1) is in base even though you can install equivalent software > (e.g., cURL) from ports, so you could make an argument that it should be > moved to ports. however, fetch is useful for both bsdinstall and for > many custom post-installation tasks that need an HTTP client, and > attempting to remove it would be very disruptive. > > cron(8) is in base even though there are other cron implementations, > because widely-used parts of the the base system (e.g., periodic(8)) > depend on cron for basic functionality; removing cron would also require > removing this functionality, and that would be a significant loss to > users with no obvious replacement. > > but routed is not widely used in general, either by users or by the OS > itself; there are many implementations of RIP available elsewhere; and > the code is both old, barely maintained, and a network server, making it > a potential security risk among other maintenance costs. > > i think a good example here, similar to routed, would be window(1). 30 > years ago, i used window(1) all the time; it was very useful and an > obvious candidate for a base utility considering how (relatively) common > text terminals were. but since then, the world changed: text consoles > are less common (in favour of GUIs) and people nowadays are more likely > to use screen(1) or tmux(1), modern utilities which do the same thing > better. so while window(1) had enough remaining users to justify moving > it to a port, it failed to meet the requirements a) and c) above. > > would people objecting to the removal of routed also advocate for > putting window(1) back into base? (this is not a rhetorical question, > 'yes' is a perfectly reasonable answer.) > > --- > > a couple of people also mentioned pkgbase and i think this is likely to > have an effect on this sort of discussion, especially because it makes > the current hard divide between src and ports more permeable: there's > not much difference between typing 'pkg install FreeBSD-routed' > (pkgbase) or 'pkg install freebsd-routed' (ports), for example. > > i like pkgbase and use it on all my systems, so i'm very interested to > see where this leads. in fact, i originally intended to submit a patch > to move routed into a new pkgbase package, as i've recently done with > some other base utilities. in the ended i decided, based on the > reasoning above, that it made more sense to simply remove it. > > my guess is that if/when pkgbase does become the default, it will make > it easier to justify removals like these, because if you already have to > install routed (or whatever) from a pkgbase package, it's not much of a > change to install it from a ports package instead. Thanks Lexi, most of my concerns are addressed, especially that of routed/route6d being moved into ports. If you'd known of this when you wrote your first post and communicated it I may be been less likely to respond. That said if the purpose of socialising the idea of removal was to solicit constructive feedback I'd have responded regardless, if only to champion routed as a useful (and still used) piece of software. I'm never sure whether to respond to sophistry and rhetoric, but why not, let's play: > let me turn this around and ask the opposite question: if FreeBSD didn't > currently ship RIP/RIPng in the base operating system, would a request > to add an implementation of it be considered? Maybe, but I'm the wrong person to ask. The answer depends on the criteria for the novel or continued inclusion of any FreeBSD feature. And I have no idea what such criteria are. > so the question for me is not whether it should be in base at all Well, it was originally. > (it clearly shouldn't be, by today's standards), but does the inconvenience > to users of removing it outweigh the cost of maintaining the code forever? Again, I've no idea what "today's standards" are, and so the "clearly" modifier is lost on me. If I were aware of these standards I'd be open to agreeing, however. The "forever" adverb is addressing a assertion waiting to be claimed and I don't think anyone has done so yet. It doesn't take a lot of imagination to see a time when it should be unarguably removed. > someone elsethread mentioned that they expect FreeBSD to be a "complete > operating system". what does this mean in practice? many people expect > a complete operating system to include a GUI, yet FreeBSD hasn't shipped > X in the base system for quite a while. should we put X back into base? What's going on here? We're not talking about X. We are having this conversation in the absence of clear criteria about the specific question of how a distinct function that FreeBSD currently ships qualifies for removal. Your OP merely suggested that you saw no value in routed's continued existence in base and what I thought was an entreaty for alternate views. > would people objecting to the removal of routed also advocate for > putting window(1) back into base? (this is not a rhetorical question, > 'yes' is a perfectly reasonable answer.) The better question is "should"? If we knew the rules the answer would be obvious. Anyway, fun's over. Perhaps this is a greater lesson that the Foundation provide the rules under which code is added or removed from base and then we'd all be the wiser. As I stated earlier - my main concern was a loss in functionality, and should routed/route6d be moved to ports (and maintained) then this is a non-issue (for me). It could be argued that FreeBSD must contain at least "bootstrap" functionality and that routed qualifies as such, although I'm not sure I could build a great case here. Regards, Scott From nobody Thu May 16 14:56:33 2024 X-Original-To: net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4VgCpz00nsz5LNXX for ; Thu, 16 May 2024 14:56:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lexi@le-fay.org) Received: from fuchsia.eden.le-Fay.ORG (fuchsia.eden.le-fay.org [IPv6:2001:8b0:aab5:107::11]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4VgCpy4ljxz46vw for ; Thu, 16 May 2024 14:56:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lexi@le-fay.org) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: from iris.eden.le-Fay.ORG (iris.eden.le-fay.org [IPv6:2001:8b0:aab5:106:3::6]) by fuchsia.eden.le-Fay.ORG (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0784528E52; Thu, 16 May 2024 14:56:33 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=le-fay.org; s=fuchsia; t=1715871394; bh=672cEGZX3qgsf8Pu872M/3H/xZH7WVf98e3Na+9bozw=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:References:In-Reply-To; b=p7iZiSxWwkhuHFHX1fkKMvKlJBatkNE/lG5L2Icss3G4YmLIBa7vzSvgBmA43Fmip E2AxdqeohLR2AGxVrEqKh8T0cQf+8RQqTv6xj8UGpEh66Dhx5sTK48dJ+mYuGqI2zj TnqilNvLdiSas/E3DChCayci5ASF8xyyuBNUGB0k= Received: from daphne.eden.le-fay.org (daphne.eden.le-fay.org [IPv6:2001:8b0:aab5:106:3::17]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature ECDSA (secp384r1) server-digest SHA384) (No client certificate requested) by iris.eden.le-Fay.ORG (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 21EF52C04D7; Thu, 16 May 2024 15:56:34 +0100 (BST) Date: Thu, 16 May 2024 15:56:33 +0100 From: Lexi Winter To: Scott Cc: net@freebsd.org Subject: Re: removing RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d) Message-ID: Mail-Followup-To: Scott , net@freebsd.org References: List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable In-Reply-To: X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:20712, ipnet:2001:8b0::/32, country:GB] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4VgCpy4ljxz46vw Scott: > I'm never sure whether to respond to sophistry and rhetoric, but why not,= =20 > let's play: my intention with this post was not to engage in sophistry, but to explain (or justify) the reasoning behind my proposal to remove RIP/RIPng, since you seemed to be asking for more details on that. i apologise if it came across as unnecessarily rhetorical, but i often find the easiest way to explain my reasoning behind something is by example. perhaps this is a personal flaw :-) in any case it sounds like you're content with routed being moved to a port rather than banished entirely. my assumption in the original mail was that this would happen anyway (assuming it at least 1 remaining user) but perhaps i wasn't clear enough about that. From nobody Thu May 16 20:29:46 2024 X-Original-To: net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4VgMCJ43mJz5K7L6 for ; Thu, 16 May 2024 20:29:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from des@freebsd.org) Received: from smtp.freebsd.org (smtp.freebsd.org [96.47.72.83]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.freebsd.org", Issuer "R3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4VgMCJ3FJ4z4tNv; Thu, 16 May 2024 20:29:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from des@freebsd.org) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1715891388; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=i+8z/8Cuf3Eh1Fjy4pc+hJoly6WxXYIeMRGF1YF94m0=; b=yolSP2ycFZKF8rxaEbDwQU0audVUpHkgTpvX1KV8gUr0lVeZmFeqZK480ZY462VpwVdbD+ b6SDIWwidJTGGz47LYMIR0ouky5qkCtEytabp14+BmZRsfnsizX6SVJFRHWfCD5H0T+u8z OsmVYvhsMXpi1rTmEDWyIqhTcimBqA4+j2k12QBKV5XLtLbIRYf2twUv3MUlcKTqeuiOmQ WKhSbGBy1hCYrcFsnCLi9kvVUj/astRzsVat7+uwTRfXIw6Md3gUmWEss6cEuwZEXXG7ln bK/RTHAHDwdHYkzCR8pALxgO4ahYIX0k4P/GR6Hqe8joFORTP5P5LhJS4P5xGQ== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1715891388; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=Ffx9kqZcaLjKBrKfhm6Xb415P7kFCPMzWIXvW/UM+N3emzTWuHrwL0azd+t1qOU7eny/y8 CHS6GEGTyNJKPpvLu3ou94R1bnp6IG7lmRb9W92Y/+O6D/kyxFKMJvUBRHUXe9CRDYrsQ9 couB93pDYdnqvtFQTCpTy000IlTmWGMBbe8AP7OiDeataicr0/H5JE3GKTT7jn1VOZcmpS IXZ24TO0L4zP1QufJOmyrMj7y646jMbeDVEcmVv2VzyAxFB3WPyLtxXlF3RzGAyQNZVBXF 54KrZLM66HcZBBVi8LblpqJofTP8fKIJItBV45iiSImfdvE68EhZYW1aGF3l1w== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1715891388; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=i+8z/8Cuf3Eh1Fjy4pc+hJoly6WxXYIeMRGF1YF94m0=; b=IhGhHeaBB6nwzyX0WaiHAh3QRoNrcVUguVZXD6BB7pvCjxkZdXEfZCn8pVe5Tsl1UBZtN1 GBm8/GLkf0mxryXN1IY/jXufcN5mH9PdxwlRYAcTTZ4cPtsOdficEYqCSSlvMgV3xd70JS axwNmCVAOSzTFMZuVhbfPI2Q4faJQM/Iv5Zt+4fzRYuPGo1eIWiJGhT0vX2k2qQIcZ/RCx 1zeCkT0D4p9oG3iAvvknZttwOSf0dc71QdIZGqsK3RLbJV/C8TeXVHxc9/qIW3oI/bfOBj 3C0eNSBorv3srH5rMS04MB8AmBZdHBbbwrSpRStTOdqo/25Xf4R5uDSlfryQ1Q== Received: from ltc.des.dev (2a02-8428-0993-f001-922e-16ff-fef1-acef.rev.sfr.net [IPv6:2a02:8428:993:f001:922e:16ff:fef1:acef]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) (Authenticated sender: des) by smtp.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4VgMCJ27cRz178c; Thu, 16 May 2024 20:29:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from des@freebsd.org) Received: by ltc.des.dev (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 6EDD9104FE; Thu, 16 May 2024 22:29:46 +0200 (CEST) From: =?utf-8?Q?Dag-Erling_Sm=C3=B8rgrav?= To: Scott Cc: Lexi Winter , net@freebsd.org Subject: Re: removing RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d) In-Reply-To: (Scott's message of "Fri, 17 May 2024 00:42:23 +1000") References: User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Date: Thu, 16 May 2024 22:29:46 +0200 Message-ID: <861q61xzyd.fsf@ltc.des.dev> List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Scott writes: > Anyway, fun's over. Perhaps this is a greater lesson that the Foundation= =20 > provide the rules under which code is added or removed from base and then= =20 > we'd all be the wiser. The FreeBSD Foundation does not set project policy, the FreeBSD Core Team does. DES --=20 Dag-Erling Sm=C3=B8rgrav - des@FreeBSD.org From nobody Fri May 17 17:25:45 2024 X-Original-To: net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4Vgv4V3CHdz5LVhF for ; Fri, 17 May 2024 17:25:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: from mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org (mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:3]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org", Issuer "R3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4Vgv4V2CCmz4crZ for ; Fri, 17 May 2024 17:25:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1715966746; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=Eob0sTCigLc21MVNoj7scQKnPOcAhZ0BM+RDZrEEmLC5wL52cPAG9+KlIwhgEYHbDTMcit aKMd/6Ra83qcccnWOD5V1ow6yI4VOkzkfJ1HT9JoVWqyzBOMu/P8G7UZo7vtgRSQT2j+Oz dk0WOxyBtZgAjMmfg3O3E0yxXWvqZx/uL1H16Irgw9NMlWi/+GKyFsDUEwRZt7RpeErtms LUtFJEsBHFy3gnbdlPfUb4ldo3S9Hq8Ki59wLU19n4+8hTxzRH2Srvb6MhH74wAwOZs950 x1bwtmIVmFQIpnPdEEZgmbRD1TN9qSwBT2AY2n6AqB5IBDUcj1Ij/ysAT5jK7g== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1715966746; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=R6kzSRQnQsZoFSlQHeHqDh/raTBkSDzDBlR6hw+v0Gs=; b=dGkmjztOHjBUm/YIYRSi2L7yYo017Be6hsQzqalLol1pWjNhF4Dtz+uif1e2qo10wO3AuB X7T4h3+zfJ3Cz2s/m0OBBtLdVwsqAVdZaQQ1A81XF+hqy6lwUdF4UbWx2Wi3msvDy/dqML iFyplfLFElw4VZicri9h4rOeq4C6x7lg9ANIx8aQRe5SNHDj8++X+ebehQKl9DfLJ5jb1g c2U1BEaPMoXTaFk56jHyj7j4afAKh01JvhW8HFTyNv2WOCE0+WhN8kPnzpd7fwyFrbyreW PQ1oG9zelVJXEC90jYeBSx4qfqqJVdC++vV5PSL2y8RUrBGlVdR6UOBMmdTk/w== Received: from kenobi.freebsd.org (kenobi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::50:1d]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4Vgv4V1nX3zrnW for ; Fri, 17 May 2024 17:25:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: from kenobi.freebsd.org ([127.0.1.5]) by kenobi.freebsd.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id 44HHPkKX068337 for ; Fri, 17 May 2024 17:25:46 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: (from www@localhost) by kenobi.freebsd.org (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id 44HHPklc068336 for net@FreeBSD.org; Fri, 17 May 2024 17:25:46 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) X-Authentication-Warning: kenobi.freebsd.org: www set sender to bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org using -f From: bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org To: net@FreeBSD.org Subject: [Bug 275920] Kernel crash in sys/netlink/route/iface.c:124 Date: Fri, 17 May 2024 17:25:45 +0000 X-Bugzilla-Reason: AssignedTo X-Bugzilla-Type: changed X-Bugzilla-Watch-Reason: None X-Bugzilla-Product: Base System X-Bugzilla-Component: kern X-Bugzilla-Version: 14.0-RELEASE X-Bugzilla-Keywords: crash X-Bugzilla-Severity: Affects Some People X-Bugzilla-Who: cuicui@gmail.com X-Bugzilla-Status: New X-Bugzilla-Resolution: X-Bugzilla-Priority: --- X-Bugzilla-Assigned-To: net@FreeBSD.org X-Bugzilla-Flags: X-Bugzilla-Changed-Fields: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Bugzilla-URL: https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/ Auto-Submitted: auto-generated List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=3D275920 --- Comment #8 from Mike Cui --- Gentle reminder: can this be cherry-picked to releng/14.1? --=20 You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug.= From nobody Fri May 17 19:30:41 2024 X-Original-To: net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4Vgxs203wLz5Lg3r for ; Fri, 17 May 2024 19:31:02 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net) Received: from gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net [65.75.216.6]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4Vgxs04RsZz4vD0; Fri, 17 May 2024 19:31:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: from gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id 44HJUg4C044908; Fri, 17 May 2024 12:30:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net) Received: (from freebsd-rwg@localhost) by gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) id 44HJUfL9044907; Fri, 17 May 2024 12:30:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <202405171930.44HJUfL9044907@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> Subject: Re: removing RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d) In-Reply-To: <861q61xzyd.fsf@ltc.des.dev> To: =?UTF-8?Q?Dag-Erling_Sm=C3=B8rgrav?= Date: Fri, 17 May 2024 12:30:41 -0700 (PDT) CC: Scott , Lexi Winter , net@FreeBSD.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL121h (25)] List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:10494, ipnet:65.75.216.0/23, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4Vgxs04RsZz4vD0 > Scott writes: > > Anyway, fun's over. Perhaps this is a greater lesson that the Foundation > > provide the rules under which code is added or removed from base and then > > we'd all be the wiser. > > The FreeBSD Foundation does not set project policy, the FreeBSD Core > Team does. Sadly that was never my intent when I created the original "Core", the core team was to help the developers in setting project policy based on there inputs and interactions, not to just elect some group of people and then bow down to them for all decisions. The DEVELOPERS as a whole is who should be setting all project policies. -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@freebsd.org From nobody Fri May 17 20:27:53 2024 X-Original-To: net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4Vgz7J4LF7z5K2mV for ; Fri, 17 May 2024 20:28:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from paul@redbarn.org) Received: from util.redbarn.org (util.redbarn.org [IPv6:2001:559:8000:cd::222]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "*.redbarn.org", Issuer "RapidSSL TLS RSA CA G1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4Vgz7J1dlCz4Dcf; Fri, 17 May 2024 20:28:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from paul@redbarn.org) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: from family.redbarn.org (family.redbarn.org [24.104.150.213]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "*.redbarn.org", Issuer "RapidSSL TLS RSA CA G1" (not verified)) by util.redbarn.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 517BA19CCAE; Fri, 17 May 2024 20:28:18 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=redbarn.org; s=util; t=1715977698; bh=iNQLVzZ6+Qs8aguBdAdWgyLW/78BUszOky++LXXQ9kY=; h=Date:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:From:To:Cc; b=ZBURhq4o2zzjGheh3odX1neBiv0o/cvGlsF1AEXbIGB38N5xjRhyI1MX84JU7wjyV e5BGRJnpAYfb9j2LagvvFqnccA7g934EGGwEtOEBmm9Mn3b4ziYTwjGMJn8pTlNke+ MF24jf+lLxH5ifINgY/t2pY1Zh/zKNX/lAjW8nWA= Received: from [100.109.81.77] (unknown [37.96.11.248]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by family.redbarn.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id AF02BC3F21; Fri, 17 May 2024 20:28:16 +0000 (UTC) Date: Fri, 17 May 2024 22:27:53 +0200 Subject: Re: removing RIP/RIPng (routed/route6d) Message-ID: <3e795f27-c5a6-44fc-b97d-ee57133a4447@redbarn.org> In-Reply-To: <202405171930.44HJUfL9044907@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> References: <861q61xzyd.fsf@ltc.des.dev> <202405171930.44HJUfL9044907@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> From: Paul Vixie To: "Rodney W. Grimes" , =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Dag-Erling_Sm=F8rgrav?= Cc: Lexi Winter , Scott , net@FreeBSD.org List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="--_com.boxer.email_157195000740796" X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:33651, ipnet:2001:559:8000::/48, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4Vgz7J1dlCz4Dcf ----_com.boxer.email_157195000740796 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 PDxUaGUgREVWRUxPUEVSUyBhcyBhIHdob2xlIGlzIHdobyBzaG91bGQgYmUgc2V0dGluZyBhbGwg cHJvamVjdCBwb2xpY2llcy4+PiAKCgpUaGF0J3MgYmVlbiBhIHZlcnkgd29ya2FibGUgc3lzdGVt LiAKCgpwIHZpeGllIAoKCk9uIE1heSAxNywgMjAyNCAyMTozMiwgIlJvZG5leSBXLiBHcmltZXMi IDxmcmVlYnNkLXJ3Z0BnbmRyc2guZG5zbWdyLm5ldD4gd3JvdGU6Cgo+IFNjb3R0IDx1YXRrYTN6 NHphZ3BAdGhpc21vbmtleS5jb20+IHdyaXRlczogCj4gPiBBbnl3YXksIGZ1bidzIG92ZXIuICBQ ZXJoYXBzIHRoaXMgaXMgYSBncmVhdGVyIGxlc3NvbiB0aGF0IHRoZSBGb3VuZGF0aW9uIAo+ID4g cHJvdmlkZSB0aGUgcnVsZXMgdW5kZXIgd2hpY2ggY29kZSBpcyBhZGRlZCBvciByZW1vdmVkIGZy b20gYmFzZSBhbmQgdGhlbiAKPiA+IHdlJ2QgYWxsIGJlIHRoZSB3aXNlci4gCj4gCj4gVGhlIEZy ZWVCU0QgRm91bmRhdGlvbiBkb2VzIG5vdCBzZXQgcHJvamVjdCBwb2xpY3ksIHRoZSBGcmVlQlNE IENvcmUgCj4gVGVhbSBkb2VzLiAKClNhZGx5IHRoYXQgd2FzIG5ldmVyIG15IGludGVudCB3aGVu IEkgY3JlYXRlZCB0aGUgb3JpZ2luYWwgIkNvcmUiLCAKdGhlIGNvcmUgdGVhbSB3YXMgdG8gaGVs cCB0aGUgZGV2ZWxvcGVycyBpbiBzZXR0aW5nIHByb2plY3QgcG9saWN5IApiYXNlZCBvbiB0aGVy ZSBpbnB1dHMgYW5kIGludGVyYWN0aW9ucywgbm90IHRvIGp1c3QgZWxlY3Qgc29tZSAKZ3JvdXAg b2YgcGVvcGxlIGFuZCB0aGVuIGJvdyBkb3duIHRvIHRoZW0gZm9yIGFsbCBkZWNpc2lvbnMuIAoK VGhlIERFVkVMT1BFUlMgYXMgYSB3aG9sZSBpcyB3aG8gc2hvdWxkIGJlIHNldHRpbmcgYWxsIHBy b2plY3QgcG9saWNpZXMuIAoKLS0gClJvZCBHcmltZXMgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAg ICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgcmdyaW1lc0BmcmVlYnNkLm9yZyAKCg== ----_com.boxer.email_157195000740796 Content-Type: text/html; 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Sat, 18 May 2024 14:49:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mike@karels.net) Received: from mail2.karels.net (mail2.karels.net [3.19.118.201]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "freebsd", Issuer "freebsd" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4VhRYz5hGZz3y9y for ; Sat, 18 May 2024 14:49:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mike@karels.net) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=karels.net header.s=mail2 header.b=MIfDnQw2; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of mike@karels.net designates 3.19.118.201 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=mike@karels.net Received: from mail2.karels.net (localhost [IPv6:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:1]) by mail2.karels.net (8.18.1/8.18.1) with ESMTP id 44IEngnZ025251 for ; Sat, 18 May 2024 09:49:42 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from mike@karels.net) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=karels.net; s=mail2; t=1716043783; bh=LphGfXJE/JPPVCEO4kc9t0G7BE/htLaAHJ79Tc3jfok=; h=From:To:Subject:Date; b=MIfDnQw21QZ5f9w+AMw6zEn1Q5LBzrI8V79EG2OFEB3sYuZDTtrpOxG+WieIqrRDe RA87dbRDHPCuuW41dy+huJA4CZXQ0WWV26kWIDhC2Zxpr5c24F+edDoCPHQ2Gnw61L aBPfPP3p7+OlOmLhG8oifh1gseTPPGKjfZ4+448tt1or4gDJuyeKIX2ZCUdkA8q8eW AsDYF76XkNQDDhkPBkxF32q2QNYw7GQiFH3EXoxbkddzYWTYgs2WKzHUKNEDTavAIq YNDpNFhMNk0H8JzPXOfZYPcVNM9GbUUO+cW65NVaDVOmZ7P/JKIf/3J2S1z3IqTHgm To5gBLQ+blTSg== Received: from [10.0.2.130] ([73.62.165.147]) by mail2.karels.net with ESMTPSA id KaHRMwbASGahYgAAs/W3XQ (envelope-from ) for ; Sat, 18 May 2024 09:49:42 -0500 From: Mike Karels To: FreeBSD Net Subject: networking in 14.1 release notes Date: Sat, 18 May 2024 09:49:42 -0500 X-Mailer: MailMate (1.14r6028) Message-ID: <7C2C0681-C1D1-404F-8B09-E65C29E366D3@karels.net> List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.50 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-1.000]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[karels.net:s=mail2]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:3.19.118.201:c]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FREEFALL_USER(0.00)[mike]; ASN(0.00)[asn:16509, ipnet:3.16.0.0/14, country:US]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[karels.net]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-net@freebsd.org]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-net@freebsd.org]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[karels.net:+] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4VhRYz5hGZz3y9y I have no networking changes at all in the 14.1 release notes. Is there anything that should be mentioned? Feel free to reply to me individually. Thanks, Mike From nobody Sun May 19 21:01:00 2024 X-Original-To: net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4VjClx0K3Lz5L8XD for ; Sun, 19 May 2024 21:01:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@FreeBSD.org) Received: from mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org (mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:3]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org", Issuer "R3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4VjClw2y93z44FG for ; Sun, 19 May 2024 21:01:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@FreeBSD.org) ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1716152460; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=qc68tmIP4qgKMFdGbocORMz+pJOwv2kl5inNs+cKLbLLapitHotT7Un81Cx0W0P9xJRXfH sO0eRBbSEp7TP7aeFBI9bZLm+PcxShc4D0rLXgW2SA9cfchjMq6cW/n4f6Pof8t3+lKxHZ JHD6zvEBdZ0p/VRwIlN5X3EiT2kvCIeRczVDfqrcA0PN0G4cddJYBL6I6jjGU5pDtWblV4 Gc9989TACwFJWge40sDQVQLGLgCJswLoYXlx+hW9CSAJJWI2g74e1vJL2TvOtk8UsusGIj 7zBK0by2GX4/aM7eQmPiOulyxEGS3rGTO5DydO89x49+KnD6TzEgEaF6FG4Iig== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1716152460; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding; bh=TrpmwIL6u75Mwg3Ue0+JxX7JT79wBP9ENj4mdDZPd3o=; b=p2d6ATUPdm7k9m4h1U6kGW1ML8JJALEqJt0yolYy9gkD/BZzovY+jpLTAxUjhhgnVdrNAH xOW+CAzi8osL92amp5Mp50yAc8kja+HC580VNNDILXvwZxJF6UGg688kkouU3sOLCHTIlz 8NeckRRMJfbG/PC9isZGA675rEUI3mLD2EXg86ppufJYiuY/B2VkPKoMt3TMukrUClSyvR GM5/zZiUJL+eTpJw+XzfSTojgmFobWUbnEkcXJyehb5uxGEDAxAItyKe9h6038dUX7a1bN rj8tbGKHPXmHttPjsrYriE0nlPsPeg0dKcu8Jdz6+U73Gakx6PgAzpwa/cm3+A== Received: from kenobi.freebsd.org (kenobi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::50:1d]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4VjClw2LCRz1Pbb for ; Sun, 19 May 2024 21:01:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@FreeBSD.org) Received: from kenobi.freebsd.org ([127.0.1.5]) by kenobi.freebsd.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id 44JL103Y076698 for ; Sun, 19 May 2024 21:01:00 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@FreeBSD.org) Received: (from bugzilla@localhost) by kenobi.freebsd.org (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id 44JL10UU076696 for net@FreeBSD.org; Sun, 19 May 2024 21:01:00 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@FreeBSD.org) Message-Id: <202405192101.44JL10UU076696@kenobi.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: kenobi.freebsd.org: bugzilla set sender to bugzilla-noreply@FreeBSD.org using -f From: bugzilla-noreply@FreeBSD.org To: net@FreeBSD.org Subject: Problem reports for net@FreeBSD.org that need special attention Date: Sun, 19 May 2024 21:01:00 +0000 List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="17161524602.c06BE6613.62433" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --17161524602.c06BE6613.62433 Date: Sun, 19 May 2024 21:01:00 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" To view an individual PR, use: https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=(Bug Id). The following is a listing of current problems submitted by FreeBSD users, which need special attention. These represent problem reports covering all versions including experimental development code and obsolete releases. Status | Bug Id | Description ------------+-----------+--------------------------------------------------- New | 254445 | cloned_interfaces="bridge0" does not respect net. Open | 166724 | if_re(4): watchdog timeout Open | 200836 | iovctl(8): Return descriptions in the returned sc Open | 223824 | Panic in ng_base.c (netgraph) Open | 230807 | if_alc(4): Driver not working for Killer Networki Open | 232472 | ixgbe(4): SR-IOV passthru not working on Hyper-V Open | 234073 | ixl(4): Host X710-DA2 drops connect starting bhyv Open | 241106 | tun/ppp: panic: vm_fault: fault on nofault entry Open | 257038 | em(4): Panic on HTTP traffic to or from jail thro Open | 257286 | gateway with `ping -6 -e` is ignored Open | 258623 | cxgbe(4): Slow routing performance: 2 numa domain Open | 258850 | lagg(4): interface vanishes when both member inte Open | 261866 | ixgbe(4): Resets media type -> autoselect after s Open | 262024 | em(4): iflib handles bad packets incorrectly Open | 262093 | ixl(4): RX packet errors on Intel X710 after 12.2 Open | 263568 | ix(4): SR-IOV connection lost after loading VM wi In Progress | 118111 | rc: network.subr Add MAC address based interface 17 problems total for which you should take action. --17161524602.c06BE6613.62433 Date: Sun, 19 May 2024 21:01:00 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" 
The following is a listing of current problems submitted by FreeBSD users,
which need special attention. These represent problem reports covering
all versions including experimental development code and obsolete releases.

Status      |    Bug Id | Description
------------+-----------+---------------------------------------------------
New         |    254445 | cloned_interfaces="bridge0" does not respect net.
Open        |    166724 | if_re(4): watchdog timeout
Open        |    200836 | iovctl(8): Return descriptions in the returned sc
Open        |    223824 | Panic in ng_base.c (netgraph)
Open        |    230807 | if_alc(4): Driver not working for Killer Networki
Open        |    232472 | ixgbe(4): SR-IOV passthru not working on Hyper-V 
Open        |    234073 | ixl(4): Host X710-DA2 drops connect starting bhyv
Open        |    241106 | tun/ppp: panic: vm_fault: fault on nofault entry 
Open        |    257038 | em(4): Panic on HTTP traffic to or from jail thro
Open        |    257286 | gateway with `ping -6 -e` is ignored
Open        |    258623 | cxgbe(4): Slow routing performance: 2 numa domain
Open        |    258850 | lagg(4): interface vanishes when both member inte
Open        |    261866 | ixgbe(4): Resets media type -> autoselect after s
Open        |    262024 | em(4): iflib handles bad packets incorrectly
Open        |    262093 | ixl(4): RX packet errors on Intel X710 after 12.2
Open        |    263568 | ix(4): SR-IOV connection lost after loading VM wi
In Progress |    118111 | rc: network.subr Add MAC address based interface 

17 problems total for which you should take action.
--17161524602.c06BE6613.62433-- From nobody Sun May 19 23:29:52 2024 X-Original-To: freebsd-net@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4VjH3z1m85z5LD0d for ; Sun, 19 May 2024 23:30:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mike@sentex.net) Received: from smarthost1.sentex.ca (smarthost1.sentex.ca [IPv6:2607:f3e0:0:1::12]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smarthost1.sentex.ca", Issuer "R3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4VjH3y38gJz4hYk for ; Sun, 19 May 2024 23:30:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mike@sentex.net) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of mike@sentex.net designates 2607:f3e0:0:1::12 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=mike@sentex.net Received: from pyroxene2a.sentex.ca (pyroxene19.sentex.ca [199.212.134.19]) by smarthost1.sentex.ca (8.17.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPS id 44JNTusm001913 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 19 May 2024 19:29:56 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from mike@sentex.net) Received: from [IPV6:2607:f3e0:0:4:d421:79fe:3e0e:8915] ([IPv6:2607:f3e0:0:4:d421:79fe:3e0e:8915]) by pyroxene2a.sentex.ca (8.18.1/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id 44JNTpQj088465 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128 verify=NO); Sun, 19 May 2024 19:29:55 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from mike@sentex.net) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 19 May 2024 19:29:52 -0400 List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-net List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-net@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: networking in 14.1 release notes To: Mike Karels , FreeBSD Net References: <7C2C0681-C1D1-404F-8B09-E65C29E366D3@karels.net> Content-Language: en-US From: mike tancsa Autocrypt: addr=mike@sentex.net; keydata= xsBNBFywzOMBCACoNFpwi5MeyEREiCeHtbm6pZJI/HnO+wXdCAWtZkS49weOoVyUj5BEXRZP xflV2ib2hflX4nXqhenaNiia4iaZ9ft3I1ebd7GEbGnsWCvAnob5MvDZyStDAuRxPJK1ya/s +6rOvr+eQiXYNVvfBhrCfrtR/esSkitBGxhUkBjOti8QwzD71JVF5YaOjBAs7jZUKyLGj0kW yDg4jUndudWU7G2yc9GwpHJ9aRSUN8e/mWdIogK0v+QBHfv/dsI6zVB7YuxCC9Fx8WPwfhDH VZC4kdYCQWKXrm7yb4TiVdBh5kgvlO9q3js1yYdfR1x8mjK2bH2RSv4bV3zkNmsDCIxjABEB AAHNHW1pa2UgdGFuY3NhIDxtaWtlQHNlbnRleC5uZXQ+wsCOBBMBCAA4FiEEmuvCXT0aY6hs 4SbWeVOEFl5WrMgFAl+pQfkCGwMFCwkIBwIGFQoJCAsCBBYCAwECHgECF4AACgkQeVOEFl5W rMiN6ggAk3H5vk8QnbvGbb4sinxZt/wDetgk0AOR9NRmtTnPaW+sIJEfGBOz47Xih+f7uWJS j+uvc9Ewn2Z7n8z3ZHJlLAByLVLtcNXGoRIGJ27tevfOaNqgJHBPbFOcXCBBFTx4MYMM4iAZ cDT5vsBTSaM36JZFtHZBKkuFEItbA/N8ZQSHKdTYMIA7A3OCLGbJBqloQ8SlW4MkTzKX4u7R yefAYQ0h20x9IqC5Ju8IsYRFacVZconT16KS81IBceO42vXTN0VexbVF2rZIx3v/NT75r6Vw 0FlXVB1lXOHKydRA2NeleS4NEG2vWqy/9Boj0itMfNDlOhkrA/0DcCurMpnpbM7ATQRcsMzk AQgA1Dpo/xWS66MaOJLwA28sKNMwkEk1Yjs+okOXDOu1F+0qvgE8sVmrOOPvvWr4axtKRSG1 t2QUiZ/ZkW/x/+t0nrM39EANV1VncuQZ1ceIiwTJFqGZQ8kb0+BNkwuNVFHRgXm1qzAJweEt RdsCMohB+H7BL5LGCVG5JaU0lqFU9pFP40HxEbyzxjsZgSE8LwkI6wcu0BLv6K6cLm0EiHPO l5G8kgRi38PS7/6s3R8QDsEtbGsYy6O82k3zSLIjuDBwA9GRaeigGppTxzAHVjf5o9KKu4O7 gC2KKVHPegbXS+GK7DU0fjzX57H5bZ6komE5eY4p3oWT/CwVPSGfPs8jOwARAQABwsB2BBgB CAAgFiEEmuvCXT0aY6hs4SbWeVOEFl5WrMgFAl+pQfkCGwwACgkQeVOEFl5WrMiVqwf9GwU8 c6cylknZX8QwlsVudTC8xr/L17JA84wf03k3d4wxP7bqy5AYy7jboZMbgWXngAE/HPQU95NM aukysSnknzoIpC96XZJ0okLBXVS6Y0ylZQ+HrbIhMpuQPoDweoF5F9wKrsHRoDaUK1VR706X rwm4HUzh7Jk+auuMYfuCh0FVlFBEuiJWMLhg/5WCmcRfiuB6F59ZcUQrwLEZeNhF2XJV4KwB Tlg7HCWO/sy1foE5noaMyACjAtAQE9p5kGYaj+DuRhPdWUTsHNuqrhikzIZd2rrcMid+ktb0 NvtvswzMO059z1YGMtGSqQ4srCArju+XHIdTFdiIYbd7+jeehg== In-Reply-To: <7C2C0681-C1D1-404F-8B09-E65C29E366D3@karels.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.86 X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.36 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.97)[-0.972]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f3e0::/32]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[199.212.134.19:received]; XM_UA_NO_VERSION(0.01)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:11647, ipnet:2607:f3e0::/32, country:CA]; FREEFALL_USER(0.00)[mike]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[sentex.net]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-net@freebsd.org]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4VjH3y38gJz4hYk On 5/18/2024 10:49 AM, Mike Karels wrote: > I have no networking changes at all in the 14.1 release notes. Is there > anything that should be mentioned? Feel free to reply to me individually. > Not sure if appropriate or not, but when going to 13.x to 14.x, not all vlan configs work now in rc.conf Both ifconfig_vlan2="192.168.1.51/24 vlandev igb1 vlan 2" ifconfig_vlan2="192.168.1.51/24 vlan 2 vlandev igb1" used to work on RELENG_13 now only ifconfig_vlan2="192.168.1.51/24  vlan 2 vlandev igb1" is allowed.  Maybe a heads up in UPDATING ?     ---Mike