From nobody Tue May 14 15:42:40 2024 X-Original-To: freebsd-pkg@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4Vf0xB1D67z5KYWf for ; Tue, 14 May 2024 15:42:54 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from erichanskrs@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ej1-x643.google.com (mail-ej1-x643.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::643]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1D4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4Vf0x93WVGz4kRd for ; Tue, 14 May 2024 15:42:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from erichanskrs@gmail.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20230601 header.b=mRm+A7FN; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of erichanskrs@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:4864:20::643 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=erichanskrs@gmail.com Received: by mail-ej1-x643.google.com with SMTP id a640c23a62f3a-a599c55055dso39989866b.0 for ; Tue, 14 May 2024 08:42:53 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1715701372; x=1716306172; darn=freebsd.org; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:mime-version:from:to:cc:subject :date:message-id:reply-to; bh=b1TDPd5ouAzm5WjPiIIa23e2eZBQ23/PoHCuND2bKwY=; b=mRm+A7FNMnE/S9Dp9JcwkhoeheiroviXILHUNJcFQzfVGBc9XX6aaJKC/KLErNRCL4 T9r12LkM9WrQwbD0cz2uE4pgJj6SRaB80yFrhc3+vu5SG+k7sCoZV4ch9FcvtenJehi2 QvOOStwd00Feh39UfuMYsuZFEomQNoMCah+QQH1UBhdOplvDpEheArKOJNxOCrxn/HwM MD6roFn26Qo7hKuTiZPvyT0lbG9pq+hPAnSGOhLxriy0y++Bq5LLhFvqTY/c/E9Oy0Yf mBguhvM9ysatyqJkQjYkErVuec/159lgPCjmpLdu258t1ca2dIDmeSz95aC4q+TOZ38D Rgig== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1715701372; x=1716306172; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:mime-version:x-gm-message-state :from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=b1TDPd5ouAzm5WjPiIIa23e2eZBQ23/PoHCuND2bKwY=; b=V/yQm4I9UhFlp5TXjLRfhrLdgwxHy4PnoV1ZLn0K9rQvNPS+fE8+L36cSW6Arzt8l6 iPHu5/6Xr/MFP6DHcpZihvITvHkwyU3EkfgARVSKucSWMmRj+5yrd6RM+UcvdaNfmAAx /VJuUAB9qmuM4EMFzromwH8ssTnc1mWQ8mYXiz50lTsqrzA1Vsdn9JAuTXGl9uT7lhrh 1ACect0K3Xg4+WtBtoWz1JnivnEIeV/X0/s1J/jEuhjnuq7SZR+FPBDtQNqiumKrXJ2M vguPDLnkLa0SJbHF9NRbR0Byjj4zlF7FG9K9J3GTDDknwIMxRLsq/eLAqcLu+UFq+9ms luDQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YyGIjNrHpj2r32ihlq0SWZ28p8QlWmB7Z8FgqtA5NVVdHnPFnZm S27D8u3N5l0VHzxvmtaX0F4toKj5NLZ+doVEYHTLZ9lnTRjQ5CLSKTWc7aMoreZUHsdQYvRIsbh LS1ZH4SZQhYZrlZDhsBbD97IuXYRbXR3MAHlkPr0P X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IE9S8EcG1OXhn12kS41RHI90UUfty/zaDRNkZrxuxbIib65FrbNR+d2fqnJOnpf586XM8ASMEna9yz5zpqgap4= X-Received: by 2002:a17:907:930b:b0:a59:9a68:7283 with SMTP id a640c23a62f3a-a5a2d53bafbmr1084519366b.12.1715701371598; Tue, 14 May 2024 08:42:51 -0700 (PDT) List-Id: Binary package management and package tools discussion List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkg List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkg@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Erichans Date: Tue, 14 May 2024 17:42:40 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Optional sub-indexing by FreeBSD minor version for packages To: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000cb7fec06186bda15" X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.84 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.84)[-0.840]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20230601]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MISSING_XM_UA(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROMTLD(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org]; RCVD_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2a00:1450:4864:20::643:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4Vf0x93WVGz4kRd --000000000000cb7fec06186bda15 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" During the three months overlap period of two successive minor versions of supported FreeBSD-RELEASE versions, packages for supported architectures are built only for the soon-to-be-EOL minor version until its final EOL date, after which only the highest minor version of the two is supported (and for which packages are then build). This can be a problem for a small number of packages, especially kernel modules. Why can't we have an optional sub-indexing by minor version; something like ${ABI}-minor_version? Or is this problem with incompatible packages during the three month overlap of a new released FreeBSD minor version something that "doesn't need fixing"? As I see it, we have the following issues during an overlap period: - It affects a significant number of (package) users, new and experienced ones alike (seems a recurring topic here on the forums in one form or another). - It is rather antithetical to the general objective of planning and executing updates carefully as it "forces" users to wait for a minor version update just until the old minor version goes EOL (The only resolve is to resort to building the port(s) in question). - IMO it does not help in making FreeBSD more attractive for new users and general use, o.a. desktop oriented users. (especially when (graphics) kernel modules are "chasing" current technological updates, be it adapted from Linux or from elsewhere). - Looking at the FreeBSD handbook this particular package problem during the overlap period and how to work with or around it isn't addressed or explained. - (As far as I know this has nothing to do with the "pkgbase" that is being developed.) For a solution of "package minor-version sub-indexing", I see the following aspects: 1) Software development & implementation of adding optional FreeBSD RELEASE minor version sub-indexing to packages. 2) Identification and tagging of all ports for specific packages that could benefit from this minor version sub-indexing. 3) Additional *temporary* build-time for the overhead of extra packages. 4) Additional *temporary* storage for extra packages. The *temporary* aspect relates to the three months overlap period during the transition period of two successive FreeBSD minor versions. Initially I feared #3 & #4 could be a problem, but based on replies: https://forums.freebsd.org/threads/13-2-13-3-amdgpu-doesnt-work.93433/post-655071 and https://forums.freebsd.org/threads/13-2-13-3-amdgpu-doesnt-work.93433/post-655072 that does not seem an issue. I think the number of packages and storage requirements do double because for each supported minor version you have the quarterly and latest branch. A solution would result in getting/updating a FreeBSD minor version specific package version when there is one available, for example 13.2-RELEASE versions of the port graphics/drm-kmod (plus related ports) and the port emulators/virtualbox-ose-kmod, or 13.3-RELEASE versions. Kind regards, Eric --000000000000cb7fec06186bda15 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
During the three months overlap period of two successive m= inor versions of supported FreeBSD-RELEASE versions, packages for supported= architectures are built only for the soon-to-be-EOL minor version until it= s final EOL date, after which only the highest minor version of the two is = supported (and for which packages are then build). This can be a problem fo= r a small number of packages, especially kernel modules.

Why can'= ;t we have an optional sub-indexing by minor version; something like ${ABI}= -minor_version?
Or is this problem with incompatible packages during the= three month overlap of a new released FreeBSD minor version something that= "doesn't need fixing"?

As I see it, we have the follo= wing issues during an overlap period:

- It affects a significant num= ber of (package) users, new and experienced ones alike
(seems a recurrin= g topic here on the forums in one form or another).
- It is rather antit= hetical to the general objective of planning and executing updates carefull= y as it "forces" users to wait for a minor version update just un= til the old minor version goes EOL
(The only resolve is to resort to bui= lding the port(s) in question).
- IMO it does not help in making FreeBSD= more attractive for new users and general use, o.a. desktop oriented users= .
(especially when (graphics) kernel modules are "chasing" cur= rent technological updates, be it adapted from Linux or from elsewhere).- Looking at the FreeBSD handbook this particular package problem during t= he overlap period and how to work with or around it isn't addressed or = explained.
- (As far as I know this has nothing to do with the "pkg= base" that is being developed.)


For a solution of "pac= kage minor-version sub-indexing", I see the following aspects:
1) S= oftware development & implementation of adding optional FreeBSD RELEASE= minor version sub-indexing to packages.
2) Identification and tagging o= f all ports for specific packages that could benefit from this minor versio= n sub-indexing.
3) Additional *temporary* build-time for the overhead of= extra packages.
4) Additional =C2=A0*temporary* storage for extra packa= ges.

The *temporary* aspect relates to the three months overlap= period during the transition period of two successive FreeBSD minor versio= ns. Initially I feared #3 & #4 could be a problem, but based on replies= :=C2=A0
and=C2=A0that does not seem an issue. I = think the number of packages and storage requirements do double because for= each supported minor version you have the quarterly and latest branch.
=
A solution would result in getting/updating a FreeBSD minor versio= n specific package version when there is one available, for example 13.2-RE= LEASE versions of the port graphics/drm-kmod (plus related ports) and the p= ort emulators/virtualbox-ose-kmod, or 13.3-RELEASE versions.

=
Kind regards,
Eric
--000000000000cb7fec06186bda15-- From nobody Sun May 19 21:00:28 2024 X-Original-To: pkg@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4VjClK45DSz5L8HX for ; Sun, 19 May 2024 21:00:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@FreeBSD.org) Received: from mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org (mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:3]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org", Issuer "R3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4VjClK0LQ8z435h for ; Sun, 19 May 2024 21:00:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@FreeBSD.org) ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1716152429; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=b2z7j5e4jZh85mKai84038eZ49wkgoYZZAxBNQj54sYzopgc5XvVIqdu5aYMoKo4l1ohYc imphQrSjzphdPRglpy6tQZTK1G7usgNQlU3jMZHGeTCwxpJmJlstDBbb98DH7+J1El8VmY Uw7iX47qrMee76bkLRZq5B2aGgEUgXZz+DBovDzp6jvgOJXzyZe8NPVR+FS1j1MtmclpjA mMqlF/AXNuzI5RtZLhdP8bNky+9B49+OHSsg+TYK+rpe/8hqXCFL/ZyRZOZrGKzmfKdUcO 5ZWns2BXbGkqEoOPqrNxc5KhGM+w5PNLNJVrc1sDP2khoBCNsGYUTOYdw2iLng== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1716152429; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding; bh=WShx+L8Og3aH6FInD6domCjPAeYQVFCivsYZrO1XOY0=; b=KKCVNbY7JgeNBO5FP8mbt+t7WfezRQQ4sgvS0g7QZAhvh2FCUmFEj/dZ/DNLm/QAtVpmBG tMWEEUhxYWkmk3/6re1rUpPgHBW3S6rOu3LtXHzF4ORrtDC8ei9mRIwaFyEwb+TKvIlCyN C5piL3cBvOHlKlu6nKdroE0urSYmfO3j1VcH2qklCnQtr5Uvcll38TAYg4jVcisg6r8hNn L/kflTCzRNM2PUNvAP5fwwXc9xNpSlKbNkrJoFqNAjq2oWYSoLN8OhClNrkV/OP/P0KZOq zWYvaEcWEXM89iTaYdXcgi+ADCPY988B0n3dmwXi+wqYRXsbVwRv1HOH1H2A0Q== Received: from kenobi.freebsd.org (kenobi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::50:1d]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4VjClJ74B0z1PYZ for ; Sun, 19 May 2024 21:00:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@FreeBSD.org) Received: from kenobi.freebsd.org ([127.0.1.5]) by kenobi.freebsd.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id 44JL0SYx066882 for ; Sun, 19 May 2024 21:00:28 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@FreeBSD.org) Received: (from bugzilla@localhost) by kenobi.freebsd.org (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id 44JL0S81066877 for pkg@FreeBSD.org; Sun, 19 May 2024 21:00:28 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@FreeBSD.org) Message-Id: <202405192100.44JL0S81066877@kenobi.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: kenobi.freebsd.org: bugzilla set sender to bugzilla-noreply@FreeBSD.org using -f From: bugzilla-noreply@FreeBSD.org To: pkg@FreeBSD.org Subject: Problem reports for pkg@FreeBSD.org that need special attention Date: Sun, 19 May 2024 21:00:28 +0000 List-Id: Binary package management and package tools discussion List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkg List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkg@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="17161524284.2DBe8F.62433" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --17161524284.2DBe8F.62433 Date: Sun, 19 May 2024 21:00:28 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" To view an individual PR, use: https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=(Bug Id). The following is a listing of current problems submitted by FreeBSD users, which need special attention. These represent problem reports covering all versions including experimental development code and obsolete releases. Status | Bug Id | Description ------------+-----------+--------------------------------------------------- Open | 220049 | ports-mgmt/pkg installs unneeded packages Open | 237369 | ports-mgmt/pkg: pkg delete removes required NLS d Open | 219036 | ports-mgmt/pkg: pkg confused, installs older ver Open | 264962 | ports-mgmt/pkg 1.18.2: 'pkg-static: pkg_checksum_ 4 problems total for which you should take action. --17161524284.2DBe8F.62433 Date: Sun, 19 May 2024 21:00:28 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" 
The following is a listing of current problems submitted by FreeBSD users,
which need special attention. These represent problem reports covering
all versions including experimental development code and obsolete releases.

Status      |    Bug Id | Description
------------+-----------+---------------------------------------------------
Open        |    220049 | ports-mgmt/pkg installs unneeded packages
Open        |    237369 | ports-mgmt/pkg: pkg delete removes required NLS d
Open        |    219036 | ports-mgmt/pkg:  pkg confused, installs older ver
Open        |    264962 | ports-mgmt/pkg 1.18.2: 'pkg-static: pkg_checksum_

4 problems total for which you should take action.
--17161524284.2DBe8F.62433--