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Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID aba060bbd76adbbc1827d40a304b0e00; Mon, 01 Sep 2025 00:04:04 +0000 (UTC) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3826.700.81\)) Subject: Re: pkg upgrade, vfs.zfs.arc.free_target, vfs.zfs.arc.sys_free, vm.pageout_oom_seq From: Mark Millard In-Reply-To: <6d1606ac-8ad0-4f15-96c7-30c6f50ca9b9@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 31 Aug 2025 17:03:53 -0700 Cc: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <0dbf8c95-7697-4887-a890-335c3ccd80f1@gmail.com> <29ff7f7e-12ef-4d10-8ca4-15ae35ce6bae@gmail.com> <19251E67-BC92-4D71-9E71-6C7546A46D8C@yahoo.com> <9300201D-9D53-449B-9F0A-DFF6194B2830@yahoo.com> <6d1606ac-8ad0-4f15-96c7-30c6f50ca9b9@gmail.com> To: Graham Perrin X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3826.700.81) X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US] X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cFTcn2xwQz4Jk5 On Aug 31, 2025, at 12:01, Graham Perrin wrote: > On 31/08/2025 09:38, Mark Millard wrote: >=20 >> =E2=80=A6 >>=20 >> So 4 GiBytyes of RAM is insufficient, even with use of: = vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D120 >>=20 >> Note: In this context increases is not going to help: it is way too = little RAM >> for pkg. (I was observing via top at the time.) >>=20 >> If pkg continues to require such RAM+SWAP usage, FreeBSD is going to = end up >> requiring more than, say, 5 GiBytes of RAM+SWAP, even for UFS = contexts. >>=20 >>> =E2=80=A6 >>=20 >> For reference, see: >>=20 >> = https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase/2025-August/000804.html= >>=20 >> with details of my test context (where swap was in use). >=20 >=20 > Interesting. >=20 > Here, with faster storage for a new guest, 1,024 MB base memory was = enough =E2=80=93 for both UFS and ZFS =E2=80=93 as outlined below. >=20 > ---- >=20 >=20 > VirtualBox > bidirectional shared clipboard > 1 GB memory > EFI > four processors > PAE/NX > VBoxSVGA > FreeBSD-14.3-RELEASE-amd64-dvd1.iso > disable host I/O cache > vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D120 > UFS > 3 G swap So you are specifying (RAM+SWAP) being 4 GiBytes, not a 1 GiByte = context, given the memory pattern is that dirty pages are making it to the = laundry instead of staying active. What sort of (Maximum) Swap Used figures were being reported by the likes of top? > install all components > pkbasify conversion before first boot (519 packages) > first boot > vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D120 > pkg install -Fy firefox gitup htop hw-probe kde lsblk lynx nano = pciutils plasma6-sddm-kcm roxterm sddm stressdisk uclcmd usbutils = virtualbox-ose-additions xfce xorg > pkg install -Uy firefox gitup htop hw-probe kde lsblk lynx nano = pciutils plasma6-sddm-kcm roxterm sddm stressdisk uclcmd usbutils = virtualbox-ose-additions xfce xorg > pkg upgrade -fFqy > pkg upgrade -fUy > 1353 packages > 2601 steps > success > vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D12 > pkg upgrade -fUy > success >=20 > ---- >=20 >=20 > The same with ZFS. 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[89.241.205.78]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 5b1f17b1804b1-45b7e7d2393sm133921715e9.3.2025.08.31.18.34.00 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 31 Aug 2025 18:34:00 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 1 Sep 2025 02:34:00 +0100 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: I just made a typo in a glob pattern for a pkg delete -g (no -a and no force) and mistakenly then selected Y, leading to partial partial system destruction before I stopped it To: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org References: <543E0A7A-8C65-43B7-8CC3-13D0D86F4085.ref@yahoo.com> <543E0A7A-8C65-43B7-8CC3-13D0D86F4085@yahoo.com> From: Graham Perrin Content-Language: en-GB Autocrypt: addr=grahamperrin@gmail.com; keydata= xsFNBGKYt7ABEAClu83dJ3ZKfVgPOk9YKRv0Z+dl2b88+k9R4vwAmElgguYdKE7yhnQNhhWM v9vi6AFrBMc2oJdVHJ2OrXfwpELBFIgiSMEWNsC4e+Z3HtSajcl+pFZsP7ciiSoycj/w3wIV kAZoVGbhyIbNG7fbCEJ8q81TbfsGypV3bRmbZVvGNecBguYiooBtz2Qht1p3itXMkIA6P9pS YDl+6QddZLyUUAjAnFv2QDoYSHLnaDUWw4oONZsB0SKVu8jMIBh4uJZoYEOvdvc9jQQdOpA2 CAgA6ulfm42Ikr9lKBUUCtjqiWAhJ7iXOTyHAIdR4Mf8alCE6tdTq6dHdIt+GktTY7oYNyL2 3aD3C7I5waU0SFXvJcOMG10QLfwYQMOQoYQ9XJ0U5A28WYiDcylDdUWT7SappP1e1ZMeJWWO y14mxxNzHaJSI4rK8P/p5tp3Q7SSC4k5gMh9zKba3K2ApCWNbVLGvXsJeQkZZNvu70tE81ey AHI5iZcB6D7WaHysBUmsKaEpbcmm1ZThTnGL0SHEl5to5Jab5Fg6O+Cnly5sVz5lX/v8Aosx kKNei7SCVqXOVtteQeGxWbXWbhPgbMyc0Gi3DuxBI/yvJ43k/rJysQlLGLWfJx/UXprwLluC PDK9EvKEB+fD1Z349uzp1sKr3ihpySbyKI8fpudftnAz4EsoCwARAQABzSZHcmFoYW0gUGVy cmluIDxncmFoYW1wZXJyaW5AZ21haWwuY29tPsLBlAQTAQoAPhYhBFk/5bLDBwftvJcvCrdn SG9KGNQLBQJoRALAAhsDBQkPEg5ABQsJCAcDBRUKCQgLBRYDAgEAAh4FAheAAAoJELdnSG9K GNQL8YkP/2V1z6XQDyG1QlKAu8TuE8zDWy9QQKjC/G44hlu5zk+2kWSNk4zeExs9ZXOBmVhF EW1d+1J8wDiYIeKYj/rqMoP+gb8o0Au0lSRitvTdLxkZBFGMn0CEzlDOzv+wmiy0ggAV/s+Y EbiHk12fI0LoTy5/ywdmG/uGS7M6p3XOrM0YO1qmLXy1cUyYDsYIpq5/rT0QzpGowsJLoEA3 zz1vfKVY+RTorsL4W8ljXLmcs4c3b3HZG9Xmgtt+Ni/eb9CjzM7kCXOcSMnVzvfscCowPAwB 0ZHlNxNV0MTa61xgvOCk4Zf278ArRgbTm4oOz9Z4ciPMnVue+9P/VdxIxgUuYkAryM0+agGz L9bd8ljn+efNtgZ5dlDLrNnTE+vWnMVlMXgl7BNnhwHg7UYFLrC2xklsICub0qpnNheTGeqo 0N4UongJTQJ6H6LEpgd+KMkCncAHghED/G0/BUdO90VEOoqnIKwKa+F9NqVMvHWc8D58mwCP FghsmxK9FM9pnsjLmG7u+s51Y7++GSRnU4NkI4tHiVk7hcAcvZuc0QbUDwVMTurDUgIqRo6W 80j1tFjEspkrwtMoeVFEkDHktjoc3AoEymXIncZfqIqi3nVseyDVyNByvkV0mutX9hXqac0/ RXMuyK9KniAUZ9+gsWs4rPs/DOdsw4K8/RnjduBrfCYQzsFNBGKYt7ABEADRb1tZuh7DPYET 0wK6fe7owbYgM+RfKhmcrGgR2HI9M2q6+0WKF/ITnggWdIW2Ecc4z2boLz/cwvPGCS7/YxZM 61KklGCwuS7q1s04XnHDWHuFxfXQPzAdVmNO3bYoMZbJjHXs6sB2u5ksiwPwaMAWWaGkviSj c5pwvHCiTmX5vH5CBj/Vi+5ESyX38vK4JM5S/m4ouI/6M9biyFgimV+v3vVyCxJCT1gI9g4o GIh1qq5S433b1fihn4yHPf8XOKyBpA/QcwLONViBqJL5nnOxpsh344rNxn2R7CcRzzicOV+e 2IbMem4lwNWQlZKoRotKXZi9LqN5mynSBYqAUdoZum0QinWT9F22B0Qex5PH1zAt9i2W91Vd kcPB3LwkRXj07ycRtsSzpgPA6fLc6AsoWFslHl8kVOO5eJIA4xhjlPa+W8lguQHZ0iX+5uAv 2eAgXR2swADuHPuENNFStmsgAMl8OOOgtq75yA5TpyIzxMuXV9Nmp0VfIaUM/IdLdmxhc1pC c320l5fYMHVLFAReWEbSj2QH8YzWfpXHIegutWWYEbH9SiDXgS9KoKmCJV/Qa+x6/b8y3pOZ vnIbCDaynC2Yr50s8gRa9kb54JE8Z+p8r16U3SEsK3PtUi0RF0e51danCVHrrE6/Hat2XUO/ 6nnYgVgFOrLao6Gh/VMs8wARAQABwsF8BBgBCgAmFiEEWT/lssMHB+28ly8Kt2dIb0oY1AsF AmhEAsACGwwFCQ8SDkAACgkQt2dIb0oY1AvQxw//REWYFK2m4yS/QP5kzfhkWcNqDI/akGT5 /LXmdmbc1s78+mOMXnA4vBY/+X1QatgxWUECkPDOiIwXJMxoBuyY8e7spLRXeyhtfh5aYaJc MO5bARX0c49v+KfZ80u9tG2rkKQvAt/ySo7OXsbDADFFRhlc8RLbb8e7bSctGbYZk9CYa0ya dW5+n3znDNJ6yW1skx9wTH+Y8VlSazRLk3XgXscNqBA2h56v3WS/R5dI++7AQxZxSQacQvfj 9eahq7ATdB4zMQ9MBHEwOvGD3DLlc55FYSDZvNX+mhnK7S0t1Nt2EtGUOmXb5ysMFGnbsce0 woKQ0sLPF1HWDAAf7tBCF8mpPIzU/ViAkupsJ6NYCD0tLFD8pvl0NYU2TjvyWh6ie3e5B/b3 8Daiyme+M92ivfoRQOFKmkPfeT14AI6OW1k7qFbmoIwMWWQdFWAl1CP9hNdF9gRN4rFB0Jy1 90BajZW2zOdVfqdurJZegCzAowZalLm4JEK2MklpPzipibnJqhLOmvJy587pF52KDdM/4rLy BBREIm7uRivnO5k/BY5qS+H/aqv97LC0PVaTsLXbDmTxTnJplUpdlYT9NGidM+x/ioS0iztO Cht7cT8V8jvvKZYvNpst8iqxuIaoV9V7aZ0wAQpkgDGXHmSzwtz6U8xNf/4e4sLn9KPlldSd kvo= In-Reply-To: <543E0A7A-8C65-43B7-8CC3-13D0D86F4085@yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.30 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.30)[-0.298]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20230601]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; FREEFALL_USER(0.00)[grahamperrin]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2a00:1450:4864:20::435:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cFWcc5Mpjz3FKr On 31/08/2025 20:59, Mark Millard wrote: > (The glob pattern was expected to match a lot of port-packages, more > than shows in a window in the context.) > > I really wish that the likes of: > > # pkg delete -r FreeBSD-ports -g . . . > > was supported … Is it not supported? I see 'pkg-name ...' at the tail of the third of the four synopsis lines, . 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Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID deb93fe750c14d381aa56f69741a8cdb; Mon, 01 Sep 2025 02:57:46 +0000 (UTC) From: Mark Millard Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3826.700.81\)) Subject: Re: I just made a typo in a glob pattern for a pkg delete -g (no -a and no force) and mistakenly then selected Y, leading to partial partial system destruction before I stopped it Message-Id: <2D0ADC7D-3D12-46E3-905B-7B6CA56FEB36@yahoo.com> Date: Sun, 31 Aug 2025 19:57:35 -0700 To: Graham Perrin , FreeBSD-pkg@freebsd.org, FreeBSD-pkgbase@freebsd.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3826.700.81) References: <2D0ADC7D-3D12-46E3-905B-7B6CA56FEB36.ref@yahoo.com> X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-1.000]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[yahoo.com,reject]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com:dkim]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com,freebsd.org]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[FreeBSD-pkgbase@freebsd.org]; APPLE_MAILER_COMMON(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[98.137.66.147:from]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[98.137.66.147:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cFYT957ZXz3PfL Graham Perrin wrote on Date: Mon, 01 Sep 2025 01:34:00 UTC : > On 31/08/2025 20:59, Mark Millard wrote: >=20 > > (The glob pattern was expected to match a lot of port-packages, more > > than shows in a window in the context.) > > > > I really wish that the likes of: > > > > # pkg delete -r FreeBSD-ports -g . . . > > > > was supported =E2=80=A6 >=20 >=20 > Is it not supported? The not supported "it" here is: -r FreeBSD-ports SYNOPSIS pkg delete [-DfnqRy] [-Cgix] pkg-name ... pkg delete [-Dnqy] -a pkg delete [--{no-scripts,force,dry-run,quiet,recursive,yes}] [--{case-sensitive,glob,case-insensitive,regex}] pkg-name ... pkg delete [--{no-scripts,dry-run,quiet,yes}] --all There is no such notation defined for "pkg delete". (Sorry for not making it clear which part of the text was at issue.) In other words, the ability to directly limit the activity to a specific repository. With that it would not matter if a pattern happens to also match names in FreeBSD-base, for example. It is harder to generate sufficiently unique patterns when names from all enabled repositories have to be considered. Also, some typos could match names from repositories that were not intended. > I see 'pkg-name ...' at the tail of the third of the four synopsis=20 > lines,=20 > = . (Yep, but that is not the part of the command text that is not supported.) =3D=3D=3D Mark Millard marklmi at yahoo.com From nobody Mon Sep 1 05:23:38 2025 X-Original-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4cFcjj5CrLz66BKb for ; Mon, 01 Sep 2025 05:23:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from quentin.thebault@defenso.fr) Received: from MRZP264CU002.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-francesouthazlp170100001.outbound.protection.outlook.com [IPv6:2a01:111:f403:c207::1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (secp384r1) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "mail.protection.outlook.com", Issuer "DigiCert Cloud Services CA-1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4cFcjh6Hz7z3cRb for ; Mon, 01 Sep 2025 05:23:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from quentin.thebault@defenso.fr) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; 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boundary="_002_PR1P264MB22791FDE5DFE97E1F532D5DCF507APR1P264MB2279FRAP_" List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: defenso.fr X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: PR1P264MB2279.FRAP264.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: b237cb09-cd72-4259-a4a2-08dde917b534 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 01 Sep 2025 05:23:38.9988 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 79487698-007c-4d2f-a091-9871a87877d6 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: fKKmEhnQngnrcOXdB6+qLwKqn2or5NveGWBa3N9FCrnWXv+XD/Zsu7MApq+RGHV6DgZ006sHMLpxSbE/s2G7fQpafG+OgdCD0U0TDMMvQXg= X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: PARP264MB4839 X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.34 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; ARC_ALLOW(-1.00)[microsoft.com:s=arcselector10001:i=1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; MIME_BASE64_TEXT_BOGUS(1.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-0.996]; R_MIXED_CHARSET(0.56)[subject]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[defenso.fr,reject]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[defenso.fr:s=selector1]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a01:111:f403:c000::/51:c]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/mixed,text/plain]; MIME_BASE64_TEXT(0.10)[]; MISSING_XM_UA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:8075, ipnet:2a01:111:f000::/36, country:US]; HAS_ATTACHMENT(0.00)[]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[defenso.fr:+] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cFcjh6Hz7z3cRb --_002_PR1P264MB22791FDE5DFE97E1F532D5DCF507APR1P264MB2279FRAP_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello,=0A= =0A= I am experimenting with pkgbase as a way to provision minimal jails, on 14.= 3-RELEASE, installing only the necessary packages for what I want to run in= side, and I discovered some weird behaviour:=0A= - when I install, for instance, FreeBSD-bhyve, it pulls a few more packages= as dependencies, such as FreeBSD-lib9p or FreeBSD-libcasper=0A= - if I then run autoremove, it tries to delete some of them (9 out of 19 in= stalled). FreeBSD-libcasper is one of them, but not FreeBSD-lib9p, for inst= ance.=0A= =0A= Is this a know issue?=0A= =0A= I am attaching a tmux transcript for the details on how to reproduce.=0A= =0A= Kind regards,=0A= --=0A= Quentin TH=C9BAULT= --_002_PR1P264MB22791FDE5DFE97E1F532D5DCF507APR1P264MB2279FRAP_ Content-Type: text/plain; name="pkgbug.txt" Content-Description: pkgbug.txt Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="pkgbug.txt"; size=6313; creation-date="Mon, 01 Sep 2025 05:22:58 GMT"; modification-date="Mon, 01 Sep 2025 05:22:58 GMT" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 cm9vdEBjb21wdXRlcjp+ICMgaW9jYWdlIGNyZWF0ZSAtZSAtbiBwa2didWcKcGtnYnVnIHN1Y2Nl c3NmdWxseSBjcmVhdGVkIQpyb290QGNvbXB1dGVyOn4gIyBta2RpciAtcCAvaW9jYWdlL2phaWxz L3BrZ2J1Zy9yb290L3Vzci9sb2NhbC9ldGMvcGtnL3JlcG9zCnJvb3RAY29tcHV0ZXI6fiAjIG1r ZGlyIC1wIC9pb2NhZ2UvamFpbHMvcGtnYnVnL3Jvb3QvdXNyL3NoYXJlL2tleXMvcGtnCnJvb3RA Y29tcHV0ZXI6fiAjIGNwIC1yIC91c3Ivc2hhcmUva2V5cy9wa2cvKiAvaW9jYWdlL2phaWxzL3Br 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[89.241.205.78]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 5b1f17b1804b1-45b6f0d32a2sm281883335e9.9.2025.09.01.20.55.46 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 01 Sep 2025 20:55:46 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <61d6d0ef-f3c7-485a-be81-c0aa1c8871af@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2025 04:55:46 +0100 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird From: Graham Perrin Content-Language: en-GB To: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-doc@freebsd.org Subject: pkgbase: FreeBSD Handbook: corrections and other changes Autocrypt: addr=grahamperrin@gmail.com; keydata= xsFNBGKYt7ABEAClu83dJ3ZKfVgPOk9YKRv0Z+dl2b88+k9R4vwAmElgguYdKE7yhnQNhhWM v9vi6AFrBMc2oJdVHJ2OrXfwpELBFIgiSMEWNsC4e+Z3HtSajcl+pFZsP7ciiSoycj/w3wIV kAZoVGbhyIbNG7fbCEJ8q81TbfsGypV3bRmbZVvGNecBguYiooBtz2Qht1p3itXMkIA6P9pS YDl+6QddZLyUUAjAnFv2QDoYSHLnaDUWw4oONZsB0SKVu8jMIBh4uJZoYEOvdvc9jQQdOpA2 CAgA6ulfm42Ikr9lKBUUCtjqiWAhJ7iXOTyHAIdR4Mf8alCE6tdTq6dHdIt+GktTY7oYNyL2 3aD3C7I5waU0SFXvJcOMG10QLfwYQMOQoYQ9XJ0U5A28WYiDcylDdUWT7SappP1e1ZMeJWWO y14mxxNzHaJSI4rK8P/p5tp3Q7SSC4k5gMh9zKba3K2ApCWNbVLGvXsJeQkZZNvu70tE81ey AHI5iZcB6D7WaHysBUmsKaEpbcmm1ZThTnGL0SHEl5to5Jab5Fg6O+Cnly5sVz5lX/v8Aosx kKNei7SCVqXOVtteQeGxWbXWbhPgbMyc0Gi3DuxBI/yvJ43k/rJysQlLGLWfJx/UXprwLluC PDK9EvKEB+fD1Z349uzp1sKr3ihpySbyKI8fpudftnAz4EsoCwARAQABzSZHcmFoYW0gUGVy cmluIDxncmFoYW1wZXJyaW5AZ21haWwuY29tPsLBlAQTAQoAPhYhBFk/5bLDBwftvJcvCrdn SG9KGNQLBQJoRALAAhsDBQkPEg5ABQsJCAcDBRUKCQgLBRYDAgEAAh4FAheAAAoJELdnSG9K GNQL8YkP/2V1z6XQDyG1QlKAu8TuE8zDWy9QQKjC/G44hlu5zk+2kWSNk4zeExs9ZXOBmVhF EW1d+1J8wDiYIeKYj/rqMoP+gb8o0Au0lSRitvTdLxkZBFGMn0CEzlDOzv+wmiy0ggAV/s+Y EbiHk12fI0LoTy5/ywdmG/uGS7M6p3XOrM0YO1qmLXy1cUyYDsYIpq5/rT0QzpGowsJLoEA3 zz1vfKVY+RTorsL4W8ljXLmcs4c3b3HZG9Xmgtt+Ni/eb9CjzM7kCXOcSMnVzvfscCowPAwB 0ZHlNxNV0MTa61xgvOCk4Zf278ArRgbTm4oOz9Z4ciPMnVue+9P/VdxIxgUuYkAryM0+agGz L9bd8ljn+efNtgZ5dlDLrNnTE+vWnMVlMXgl7BNnhwHg7UYFLrC2xklsICub0qpnNheTGeqo 0N4UongJTQJ6H6LEpgd+KMkCncAHghED/G0/BUdO90VEOoqnIKwKa+F9NqVMvHWc8D58mwCP FghsmxK9FM9pnsjLmG7u+s51Y7++GSRnU4NkI4tHiVk7hcAcvZuc0QbUDwVMTurDUgIqRo6W 80j1tFjEspkrwtMoeVFEkDHktjoc3AoEymXIncZfqIqi3nVseyDVyNByvkV0mutX9hXqac0/ RXMuyK9KniAUZ9+gsWs4rPs/DOdsw4K8/RnjduBrfCYQzsFNBGKYt7ABEADRb1tZuh7DPYET 0wK6fe7owbYgM+RfKhmcrGgR2HI9M2q6+0WKF/ITnggWdIW2Ecc4z2boLz/cwvPGCS7/YxZM 61KklGCwuS7q1s04XnHDWHuFxfXQPzAdVmNO3bYoMZbJjHXs6sB2u5ksiwPwaMAWWaGkviSj c5pwvHCiTmX5vH5CBj/Vi+5ESyX38vK4JM5S/m4ouI/6M9biyFgimV+v3vVyCxJCT1gI9g4o GIh1qq5S433b1fihn4yHPf8XOKyBpA/QcwLONViBqJL5nnOxpsh344rNxn2R7CcRzzicOV+e 2IbMem4lwNWQlZKoRotKXZi9LqN5mynSBYqAUdoZum0QinWT9F22B0Qex5PH1zAt9i2W91Vd kcPB3LwkRXj07ycRtsSzpgPA6fLc6AsoWFslHl8kVOO5eJIA4xhjlPa+W8lguQHZ0iX+5uAv 2eAgXR2swADuHPuENNFStmsgAMl8OOOgtq75yA5TpyIzxMuXV9Nmp0VfIaUM/IdLdmxhc1pC c320l5fYMHVLFAReWEbSj2QH8YzWfpXHIegutWWYEbH9SiDXgS9KoKmCJV/Qa+x6/b8y3pOZ vnIbCDaynC2Yr50s8gRa9kb54JE8Z+p8r16U3SEsK3PtUi0RF0e51danCVHrrE6/Hat2XUO/ 6nnYgVgFOrLao6Gh/VMs8wARAQABwsF8BBgBCgAmFiEEWT/lssMHB+28ly8Kt2dIb0oY1AsF AmhEAsACGwwFCQ8SDkAACgkQt2dIb0oY1AvQxw//REWYFK2m4yS/QP5kzfhkWcNqDI/akGT5 /LXmdmbc1s78+mOMXnA4vBY/+X1QatgxWUECkPDOiIwXJMxoBuyY8e7spLRXeyhtfh5aYaJc MO5bARX0c49v+KfZ80u9tG2rkKQvAt/ySo7OXsbDADFFRhlc8RLbb8e7bSctGbYZk9CYa0ya dW5+n3znDNJ6yW1skx9wTH+Y8VlSazRLk3XgXscNqBA2h56v3WS/R5dI++7AQxZxSQacQvfj 9eahq7ATdB4zMQ9MBHEwOvGD3DLlc55FYSDZvNX+mhnK7S0t1Nt2EtGUOmXb5ysMFGnbsce0 woKQ0sLPF1HWDAAf7tBCF8mpPIzU/ViAkupsJ6NYCD0tLFD8pvl0NYU2TjvyWh6ie3e5B/b3 8Daiyme+M92ivfoRQOFKmkPfeT14AI6OW1k7qFbmoIwMWWQdFWAl1CP9hNdF9gRN4rFB0Jy1 90BajZW2zOdVfqdurJZegCzAowZalLm4JEK2MklpPzipibnJqhLOmvJy587pF52KDdM/4rLy BBREIm7uRivnO5k/BY5qS+H/aqv97LC0PVaTsLXbDmTxTnJplUpdlYT9NGidM+x/ioS0iztO Cht7cT8V8jvvKZYvNpst8iqxuIaoV9V7aZ0wAQpkgDGXHmSzwtz6U8xNf/4e4sLn9KPlldSd kvo= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.98 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.98)[-0.979]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20230601]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; FREEFALL_USER(0.00)[grahamperrin]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org,freebsd-doc@freebsd.org]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2a00:1450:4864:20::32b:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cGBjl0C9mz3TCY awaits review. A commit to main on or before Thursday 4th September will be ideal. Expect builds of FreeBSD 15.0-ALPHA1 to begin on Friday. 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Tue, 2 Sep 2025 08:32:01 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: (from bugzilla@localhost) by kenobi.freebsd.org (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id 5828W1QA031926 for pkgbase@FreeBSD.org; Tue, 2 Sep 2025 08:32:01 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) X-Authentication-Warning: kenobi.freebsd.org: bugzilla set sender to bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org using -f From: bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org To: pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Subject: [Bug 289097] Base upgrades must not lose user customisations in dot files such as /root/.cshrc and /root/.profile Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2025 08:32:02 +0000 X-Bugzilla-Reason: CC X-Bugzilla-Type: changed X-Bugzilla-Watch-Reason: None X-Bugzilla-Product: Base System X-Bugzilla-Component: conf X-Bugzilla-Version: 14.3-RELEASE X-Bugzilla-Keywords: pkgbase X-Bugzilla-Severity: Affects Many People X-Bugzilla-Who: commit-hook@FreeBSD.org X-Bugzilla-Status: In Progress X-Bugzilla-Resolution: X-Bugzilla-Priority: --- X-Bugzilla-Assigned-To: ivy@FreeBSD.org X-Bugzilla-Flags: X-Bugzilla-Changed-Fields: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: References: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Bugzilla-URL: https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/ Auto-Submitted: auto-generated List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=3D289097 --- Comment #5 from commit-hook@FreeBSD.org --- A commit in branch main references this bug: URL: https://cgit.FreeBSD.org/src/commit/?id=3Daa730a66bc74696df85b21ec2719c75d8= eab8c9f commit aa730a66bc74696df85b21ec2719c75d8eab8c9f Author: Lexi Winter AuthorDate: 2025-09-02 08:22:56 +0000 Commit: Lexi Winter CommitDate: 2025-09-02 08:22:56 +0000 sh: Add config tag to /.profile The file /.profile is installed as a hard link to /root/.profile. The file in /root has the config tag, but the file in / does not, which causes it to be overwritten by pkg upgrade. Since they're linked, this also overwrites the file in /root. Add the config tag to the file in / as well, so pkg treates both links as config files and won't overwrite them. PR: 289097 MFC after: 3 days Reviewed by: bapt, emaste Differential Revision: https://reviews.freebsd.org/D52162 bin/sh/Makefile | 2 +- 1 file changed, 1 insertion(+), 1 deletion(-) --=20 You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug.= From nobody Tue Sep 2 18:19:41 2025 X-Original-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4cGYtp66qvz677mB for ; Tue, 02 Sep 2025 18:20:02 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) Received: from sonic309-21.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (sonic309-21.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com [98.137.65.147]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4cGYtp2TSkz3T55 for ; Tue, 02 Sep 2025 18:20:02 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; 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Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 7aaba6312d010ce98f8334c59f039369; Tue, 02 Sep 2025 18:19:52 +0000 (UTC) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3826.700.81\)) Subject: Re: pkg upgrade, vfs.zfs.arc.free_target, vfs.zfs.arc.sys_free, vm.pageout_oom_seq [Notes about error messages during and RAM+SWAP requirements, UFS context] From: Mark Millard In-Reply-To: <6d1606ac-8ad0-4f15-96c7-30c6f50ca9b9@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2025 11:19:41 -0700 Cc: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <73877048-A3B4-4920-AC92-A8C7A4FF83B5@yahoo.com> References: <0dbf8c95-7697-4887-a890-335c3ccd80f1@gmail.com> <29ff7f7e-12ef-4d10-8ca4-15ae35ce6bae@gmail.com> <19251E67-BC92-4D71-9E71-6C7546A46D8C@yahoo.com> <9300201D-9D53-449B-9F0A-DFF6194B2830@yahoo.com> <6d1606ac-8ad0-4f15-96c7-30c6f50ca9b9@gmail.com> To: Graham Perrin X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3826.700.81) X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-0.999]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[yahoo.com,reject]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com:dkim]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org]; APPLE_MAILER_COMMON(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[98.137.65.147:from]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[98.137.65.147:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cGYtp2TSkz3T55 On Aug 31, 2025, at 12:01, Graham Perrin wrote: > On 31/08/2025 09:38, Mark Millard wrote: >=20 >> =E2=80=A6 >>=20 >> So 4 GiBytyes of RAM is insufficient, even with use of: = vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D120 >>=20 >> Note: In this context increases is not going to help: it is way too = little RAM >> for pkg. (I was observing via top at the time.) >>=20 >> If pkg continues to require such RAM+SWAP usage, FreeBSD is going to = end up >> requiring more than, say, 5 GiBytes of RAM+SWAP, even for UFS = contexts. >>=20 >>> =E2=80=A6 >>=20 >> For reference, see: >>=20 >> = https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase/2025-August/000804.html= >>=20 >> with details of my test context (where swap was in use). >=20 >=20 > Interesting. >=20 > Here, with faster storage for a new guest, 1,024 MB base memory was = enough =E2=80=93 for both UFS and ZFS =E2=80=93 as outlined below. >=20 > ---- >=20 >=20 > VirtualBox > bidirectional shared clipboard > 1 GB memory > EFI > four processors > PAE/NX > VBoxSVGA > FreeBSD-14.3-RELEASE-amd64-dvd1.iso > disable host I/O cache > vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D120 > UFS > 3 G swap > install all components > pkbasify conversion before first boot (519 packages) > first boot > vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D120 The notes here are about the following sequence of 4 commands: > pkg install -Fy firefox gitup htop hw-probe kde lsblk lynx nano = pciutils plasma6-sddm-kcm roxterm sddm stressdisk uclcmd usbutils = virtualbox-ose-additions xfce xorg > pkg install -Uy firefox gitup htop hw-probe kde lsblk lynx nano = pciutils plasma6-sddm-kcm roxterm sddm stressdisk uclcmd usbutils = virtualbox-ose-additions xfce xorg > pkg upgrade -fFqy > pkg upgrade -fUy In a 14.3-Stable amd64 UFS context the above command sequence: 1) Will probably OOM on a system with 1 GiByte of RAM but no swap space, even for the first install command. 2) The sequence of 4 commands used (RAM+SWAP): 1024 MiBytes + 2312 MiBytes (observed maximum) (So between 3 and 4 GiBytes of RAM+SWAP overall.) 3) So will OOM on a system with 2 GiByte of RAM but no swap space, overall. 4) generates the error messages shown by: # grep -e ^pkg: -e ^ELF = ~/mmjnk-pkg-1GiByteRAM-3p5GiByteSWAPspace-test.txt | sort -u ELF interpreter /libexec/ld-elf.so.1 not found, error 2 pkg: Cannot runscript DEINSTALL:No such file or directory pkg: Cannot runscript POST-DEINSTALL:No such file or directory pkg: Cannot runscript POST-INSTALL:No such file or directory pkg: Cannot runscript PRE-INSTALL:No such file or directory pkg: POST-INSTALL script failed # grep -e ^pkg: -e ^ELF = ~/mmjnk-pkg-1GiByteRAM-3p5GiByteSWAPspace-test.txt | wc -l 501 All these happen during the "pkg upgrade -fUy". I give more details later below. > 1353 packages > 2601 steps > success > vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D12 > pkg upgrade -fUy > success >=20 > ---- >=20 >=20 > The same with ZFS. Success with, then without, the increased = vm.pageout_oom_seq Other information for the text context: RAM: 1024 MiByte RAM+SWAP: 3584 MiByte vm.pageout_oom_seq: 120 # uname -apKU FreeBSD FBSDamd64S 14.3-STABLE FreeBSD 14.3-STABLE = stable/14-n272276-b06973a2f2a8 GENERIC amd64 amd64 1403506 1403506 # pkg -v 2.2.2 pkg was the only port-package already installed at the start of the command sequence. The counts of instances of the 6 individual error message types were: # grep -e ^ELF ~/mmjnk-pkg-1GiByteRAM-3p5GiByteSWAPspace-test.txt | wc = -l 44 # grep -e "^pkg:.* DEINSTALL" = ~/mmjnk-pkg-1GiByteRAM-3p5GiByteSWAPspace-test.txt | wc -l 21 # grep -e "^pkg:.*POST-DEINSTALL" = ~/mmjnk-pkg-1GiByteRAM-3p5GiByteSWAPspace-test.txt | wc -l 378 # grep -e "^pkg: .* POST-INSTALL" = ~/mmjnk-pkg-1GiByteRAM-3p5GiByteSWAPspace-test.txt | wc -l 50 # grep -e "^pkg: .* PRE-INSTALL" = ~/mmjnk-pkg-1GiByteRAM-3p5GiByteSWAPspace-test.txt | wc -l 2 # grep -e "^pkg: POST-INSTALL script failed" = ~/mmjnk-pkg-1GiByteRAM-3p5GiByteSWAPspace-test.txt | wc -l 6 The RAM+SWAP usage for the sequence progressed as below, where a top variant monitored system Maximum Observed Used figures: # pkg install -Fy firefox gitup htop hw-probe kde lsblk lynx nano = pciutils plasma6-sddm-kcm roxterm sddm stressdisk uclcmd usbutils = virtualbox-ose-additions xfce xorg . . . Number of packages to be installed: 834 . . . Swap: 121500Ki MaxObsUsed, and 1085Mi MaxObs(Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed) with max 1085Mi (Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed+InAct) at the time # pkg install -Uy firefox gitup htop hw-probe kde lsblk lynx nano = pciutils plasma6-sddm-kcm roxterm sddm stressdisk uclcmd usbutils = virtualbox-ose-additions xfce xorg . . . Number of packages to be installed: 834 . . . Swap: 585012Ki MaxObsUsed, and 1489Mi MaxObs(Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed) with max 1521Mi (Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed+InAct) at the time # pkg upgrade -fFqy Swap: 1760Mi MaxObsUsed, and 2726Mi MaxObs(Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed) with max 2726Mi (Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed+InAct) at the time NOTE: The upgrade command below also involved all the FreeBSD-* base packages as well. In my context that was all of them: # pkg info -g "FreeBSD-*" | wc -l 534 # pkg upgrade -fUy Checking for upgrades (1369 candidates): 100% Processing candidates (1369 candidates): 100% Checking integrity... . . . Number of packages to be upgraded: 534 Number of packages to be reinstalled: 835 [1/2628] Deinstalling FreeBSD-acct-dbg-14.snap20250831004235... . . . Swap: 2312Mi MaxObsUsed, and 3192Mi MaxObsMaxObs(Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed) with max 3225Mi (Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed+InAct) at the time So, absent SWAP being enabled, it takes a 4 GiByte system to avoid OOM activity for the whole sequence in my context. Otherwise RAM+SWAP needs to be about that big. Other experiments with a different set of port-packages had an example of needing a 6 GiByte system if SWAP was not enabled. Otherwise RAM+SWAP needs to be about that big. I've no clue what combination of port-packages would need the most RAM+SWAP for "pkg upgrade -fUy". 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Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID ea1260b28265b58f4cd1045903a01e29; Tue, 02 Sep 2025 20:49:46 +0000 (UTC) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3826.700.81\)) Subject: Re: pkg upgrade, vfs.zfs.arc.free_target, vfs.zfs.arc.sys_free, vm.pageout_oom_seq [Notes about error messages during and RAM+SWAP requirements, UFS context] From: Mark Millard In-Reply-To: <73877048-A3B4-4920-AC92-A8C7A4FF83B5@yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2025 13:49:35 -0700 Cc: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <4FAA1DFB-0AEB-42E3-A135-F9A8A94AFC44@yahoo.com> References: <0dbf8c95-7697-4887-a890-335c3ccd80f1@gmail.com> <29ff7f7e-12ef-4d10-8ca4-15ae35ce6bae@gmail.com> <19251E67-BC92-4D71-9E71-6C7546A46D8C@yahoo.com> <9300201D-9D53-449B-9F0A-DFF6194B2830@yahoo.com> <6d1606ac-8ad0-4f15-96c7-30c6f50ca9b9@gmail.com> <73877048-A3B4-4920-AC92-A8C7A4FF83B5@yahoo.com> To: Graham Perrin X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3826.700.81) X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-1.000]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[yahoo.com,reject]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com:dkim]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org]; APPLE_MAILER_COMMON(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[98.137.65.205:from]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[98.137.65.205:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cGdCl5mscz40Yb On Sep 2, 2025, at 11:19, Mark Millard wrote: > On Aug 31, 2025, at 12:01, Graham Perrin = wrote: >=20 >> On 31/08/2025 09:38, Mark Millard wrote: >>=20 >>> =E2=80=A6 >>>=20 >>> So 4 GiBytyes of RAM is insufficient, even with use of: = vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D120 >>>=20 >>> Note: In this context increases is not going to help: it is way too = little RAM >>> for pkg. (I was observing via top at the time.) >>>=20 >>> If pkg continues to require such RAM+SWAP usage, FreeBSD is going to = end up >>> requiring more than, say, 5 GiBytes of RAM+SWAP, even for UFS = contexts. >>>=20 >>>> =E2=80=A6 >>>=20 >>> For reference, see: >>>=20 >>> = https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase/2025-August/000804.html= >>>=20 >>> with details of my test context (where swap was in use). >>=20 >>=20 >> Interesting. >>=20 >> Here, with faster storage for a new guest, 1,024 MB base memory was = enough =E2=80=93 for both UFS and ZFS =E2=80=93 as outlined below. >>=20 >> ---- >>=20 >>=20 >> VirtualBox >> bidirectional shared clipboard >> 1 GB memory >> EFI >> four processors >> PAE/NX >> VBoxSVGA >> FreeBSD-14.3-RELEASE-amd64-dvd1.iso >> disable host I/O cache >> vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D120 >> UFS >> 3 G swap >> install all components >> pkbasify conversion before first boot (519 packages) >> first boot >> vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D120 >=20 > The notes here are about the following sequence of 4 commands: >=20 >> pkg install -Fy firefox gitup htop hw-probe kde lsblk lynx nano = pciutils plasma6-sddm-kcm roxterm sddm stressdisk uclcmd usbutils = virtualbox-ose-additions xfce xorg >> pkg install -Uy firefox gitup htop hw-probe kde lsblk lynx nano = pciutils plasma6-sddm-kcm roxterm sddm stressdisk uclcmd usbutils = virtualbox-ose-additions xfce xorg >> pkg upgrade -fFqy >> pkg upgrade -fUy >=20 > In a 14.3-Stable amd64 UFS context the above command sequence: >=20 > 1) Will probably OOM on a system with 1 GiByte of RAM but no swap = space, > even for the first install command. >=20 > 2) The sequence of 4 commands used (RAM+SWAP): > 1024 MiBytes + 2312 MiBytes (observed maximum) > (So between 3 and 4 GiBytes of RAM+SWAP overall.) >=20 > 3) So will OOM on a system with 2 GiByte of RAM but no swap space, > overall. >=20 > 4) generates the error messages shown by: >=20 > # grep -e ^pkg: -e ^ELF = ~/mmjnk-pkg-1GiByteRAM-3p5GiByteSWAPspace-test.txt | sort -u > ELF interpreter /libexec/ld-elf.so.1 not found, error 2 > pkg: Cannot runscript DEINSTALL:No such file or directory > pkg: Cannot runscript POST-DEINSTALL:No such file or directory > pkg: Cannot runscript POST-INSTALL:No such file or directory > pkg: Cannot runscript PRE-INSTALL:No such file or directory > pkg: POST-INSTALL script failed >=20 > # grep -e ^pkg: -e ^ELF = ~/mmjnk-pkg-1GiByteRAM-3p5GiByteSWAPspace-test.txt | wc -l > 501 >=20 > All these happen during the "pkg upgrade -fUy". >=20 > I give more details later below. >=20 >> 1353 packages >> 2601 steps >> success >> vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D12 >> pkg upgrade -fUy >> success >>=20 >> ---- >>=20 >>=20 >> The same with ZFS. Success with, then without, the increased = vm.pageout_oom_seq >=20 >=20 > Other information for the text context: >=20 > RAM: 1024 MiByte > RAM+SWAP: 3584 MiByte > vm.pageout_oom_seq: 120 >=20 > # uname -apKU > FreeBSD FBSDamd64S 14.3-STABLE FreeBSD 14.3-STABLE = stable/14-n272276-b06973a2f2a8 GENERIC amd64 amd64 1403506 1403506 >=20 > # pkg -v > 2.2.2 >=20 > pkg was the only port-package already installed at the start of > the command sequence. >=20 >=20 > The counts of instances of the 6 individual error message types > were: >=20 > # grep -e ^ELF ~/mmjnk-pkg-1GiByteRAM-3p5GiByteSWAPspace-test.txt | wc = -l > 44 >=20 > # grep -e "^pkg:.* DEINSTALL" = ~/mmjnk-pkg-1GiByteRAM-3p5GiByteSWAPspace-test.txt | wc -l > 21 >=20 > # grep -e "^pkg:.*POST-DEINSTALL" = ~/mmjnk-pkg-1GiByteRAM-3p5GiByteSWAPspace-test.txt | wc -l > 378 >=20 > # grep -e "^pkg: .* POST-INSTALL" = ~/mmjnk-pkg-1GiByteRAM-3p5GiByteSWAPspace-test.txt | wc -l > 50 >=20 > # grep -e "^pkg: .* PRE-INSTALL" = ~/mmjnk-pkg-1GiByteRAM-3p5GiByteSWAPspace-test.txt | wc -l > 2 >=20 > # grep -e "^pkg: POST-INSTALL script failed" = ~/mmjnk-pkg-1GiByteRAM-3p5GiByteSWAPspace-test.txt | wc -l > 6 >=20 >=20 > The RAM+SWAP usage for the sequence progressed as below, > where a top variant monitored system Maximum Observed > Used figures: >=20 >=20 > # pkg install -Fy firefox gitup htop hw-probe kde lsblk lynx nano = pciutils plasma6-sddm-kcm roxterm sddm stressdisk uclcmd usbutils = virtualbox-ose-additions xfce xorg > . . . > Number of packages to be installed: 834 > . . . >=20 > Swap: 121500Ki MaxObsUsed, > and 1085Mi MaxObs(Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed) > with max 1085Mi (Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed+InAct) at the time >=20 >=20 > # pkg install -Uy firefox gitup htop hw-probe kde lsblk lynx nano = pciutils plasma6-sddm-kcm roxterm sddm stressdisk uclcmd usbutils = virtualbox-ose-additions xfce xorg > . . . > Number of packages to be installed: 834 > . . . >=20 > Swap: 585012Ki MaxObsUsed, > and 1489Mi MaxObs(Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed) > with max 1521Mi (Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed+InAct) at the time >=20 >=20 > # pkg upgrade -fFqy >=20 > Swap: 1760Mi MaxObsUsed, > and 2726Mi MaxObs(Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed) > with max 2726Mi (Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed+InAct) at the time >=20 >=20 > NOTE: The upgrade command below also involved all the FreeBSD-* base > packages as well. In my context that was all of them: > # pkg info -g "FreeBSD-*" | wc -l > 534 >=20 > # pkg upgrade -fUy > Checking for upgrades (1369 candidates): 100% > Processing candidates (1369 candidates): 100% > Checking integrity... > . . . > Number of packages to be upgraded: 534 > Number of packages to be reinstalled: 835 > [1/2628] Deinstalling FreeBSD-acct-dbg-14.snap20250831004235... > . . . >=20 > Swap: 2312Mi MaxObsUsed, > and 3192Mi MaxObsMaxObs(Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed) > with max 3225Mi (Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed+InAct) at the time >=20 >=20 > So, absent SWAP being enabled, it takes a 4 GiByte system > to avoid OOM activity for the whole sequence in my context. > Otherwise RAM+SWAP needs to be about that big. >=20 >=20 > Other experiments with a different set of port-packages had > an example of needing a 6 GiByte system if SWAP was not > enabled. Otherwise RAM+SWAP needs to be about that big. >=20 > I've no clue what combination of port-packages would > need the most RAM+SWAP for "pkg upgrade -fUy". >=20 >=20 > As stands, various pkg commands may need to have documented > warnings about RAM+SWAP requirements. >=20 Some extra information for excluding FreeBSD-base via "pkg upgrade -r FreeBSD-ports -fUy" . . . Note: the below produced just the 4 error messages: pkg: unlinkat(usr/local/share/mime/x-scheme-handler/): No such file or = directory pkg: unlinkat(usr/local/share/mime/uri/): No such file or directory pkg: unlinkat(usr/local/share/mime/print/): No such file or directory pkg: unlinkat(usr/local/share/mime/all/): No such file or directory # pkg upgrade -r FreeBSD-ports -fUy Checking for upgrades (1369 candidates): 100% Processing candidates (1369 candidates): 100% Checking integrity... done (0 conflicting) The following 835 package(s) will be affected (of 0 checked): . . . Number of packages to be reinstalled: 835 [1/1607] Deinstalling firefox-142.0.1_1,2... . . . Swap: 1456Mi MaxObsUsed, and 2314Mi MaxObs(Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed) with max 2416Mi (Active+Wir+Lndry+SwapUsed+InAct) at the time So: max RAM+SwapUsed =3D 1024 Mi + 1456 Mi =3D=3D 2480 MiBytes vs. max RAM+SwapUsed =3D 1024 Mi + 2312 Mi =3D=3D 3366 MiBytes with FreeBSD-base also involved. =3D=3D=3D Mark Millard marklmi at yahoo.com From nobody Wed Sep 3 10:08:33 2025 X-Original-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4cGyxK0pqWz65rmN for ; Wed, 03 Sep 2025 10:08:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from francisco.de-luca@orange.fr) Received: from smtp.smtpout.orange.fr (smtp-28.smtpout.orange.fr [80.12.242.28]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "*.smtpout.orange.fr", Issuer "DigiCert Global G2 TLS RSA SHA256 2020 CA1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4cGyxJ071Mz3LGq for ; 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[89.241.205.78]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ffacd0b85a97d-3d2250115fdsm19912165f8f.40.2025.09.03.17.14.24 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 03 Sep 2025 17:14:24 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <2f455675-609b-40b5-9dab-5f006156bac6@gmail.com> Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2025 01:14:24 +0100 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: pkg upgrade, vm.pageout_oom_seq: swap off: UFS, ZFS To: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org References: <0dbf8c95-7697-4887-a890-335c3ccd80f1@gmail.com> <29ff7f7e-12ef-4d10-8ca4-15ae35ce6bae@gmail.com> <19251E67-BC92-4D71-9E71-6C7546A46D8C@yahoo.com> <9300201D-9D53-449B-9F0A-DFF6194B2830@yahoo.com> <6d1606ac-8ad0-4f15-96c7-30c6f50ca9b9@gmail.com> <73877048-A3B4-4920-AC92-A8C7A4FF83B5@yahoo.com> From: Graham Perrin Content-Language: en-GB Autocrypt: addr=grahamperrin@gmail.com; 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charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.95 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.996]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.95)[-0.954]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20230601]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; FREEFALL_USER(0.00)[grahamperrin]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2a00:1450:4864:20::42a:from]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org,freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cHKjP1ddNz42pQ On 02/09/2025 19:19, Mark Millard wrote: > On Aug 31, 2025, at 12:01, Graham Perrin wrote: > >> … > The notes here are about the following sequence of 4 commands: > >> pkg install -Fy firefox gitup htop hw-probe kde lsblk lynx nano pciutils plasma6-sddm-kcm roxterm sddm stressdisk uclcmd usbutils virtualbox-ose-additions xfce xorg >> pkg install -Uy firefox gitup htop hw-probe kde lsblk lynx nano pciutils plasma6-sddm-kcm roxterm sddm stressdisk uclcmd usbutils virtualbox-ose-additions xfce xorg >> pkg upgrade -fFqy >> pkg upgrade -fUy > In a 14.3-Stable amd64 UFS context the above command sequence: > > 1) Will probably OOM on a system with 1 GiByte of RAM but no swap space, > even for the first install command. > > 2) The sequence of 4 commands used (RAM+SWAP): > 1024 MiBytes + 2312 MiBytes (observed maximum) > (So between 3 and 4 GiBytes of RAM+SWAP overall.) > > 3) So will OOM on a system with 2 GiByte of RAM but no swap space, > overall. > > … Here, with 3 G, fast storage, and swap off: UFS and ZFS seemed much the same. RELEASE, quarterly. UFS (dmesg: 2928 MB avail memory) ================================= Fourth command (pkg upgrade -fUy). First run failed. vm.pageout_oom_seq=120 Second and third runs (not consecutive to the first): success. For the third run, I reduced vm.pageout_oom_seq to its default (12). ZFS (dmesg: 2920 MB avail memory) ================================= Four consecutive runs of the fourth command. Two runs with vm.pageout_oom_seq=120: success. Third and fourth runs with vm.pageout_oom_seq=12: - the third run failed almost immediately, before step 1 of 2601 - the fourth run succeeded. 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Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID c4b0b073a72e3a2536b07ce00f64a2b8; Thu, 04 Sep 2025 00:53:42 +0000 (UTC) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3826.700.81\)) Subject: Re: pkg upgrade, vm.pageout_oom_seq: swap off: UFS, ZFS From: Mark Millard In-Reply-To: <2f455675-609b-40b5-9dab-5f006156bac6@gmail.com> Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2025 17:53:31 -0700 Cc: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <36F5A8E1-7F72-48C0-A8D7-428E91488B70@yahoo.com> References: <0dbf8c95-7697-4887-a890-335c3ccd80f1@gmail.com> <29ff7f7e-12ef-4d10-8ca4-15ae35ce6bae@gmail.com> <19251E67-BC92-4D71-9E71-6C7546A46D8C@yahoo.com> <9300201D-9D53-449B-9F0A-DFF6194B2830@yahoo.com> <6d1606ac-8ad0-4f15-96c7-30c6f50ca9b9@gmail.com> <73877048-A3B4-4920-AC92-A8C7A4FF83B5@yahoo.com> <2f455675-609b-40b5-9dab-5f006156bac6@gmail.com> To: Graham Perrin X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3826.700.81) X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US] X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cHLZg68zLz46p4 On Sep 3, 2025, at 17:14, Graham Perrin wrote: > On 02/09/2025 19:19, Mark Millard wrote: >=20 >> On Aug 31, 2025, at 12:01, Graham Perrin = wrote: >>=20 >>> =E2=80=A6 >> The notes here are about the following sequence of 4 commands: >>=20 >>> pkg install -Fy firefox gitup htop hw-probe kde lsblk lynx nano = pciutils plasma6-sddm-kcm roxterm sddm stressdisk uclcmd usbutils = virtualbox-ose-additions xfce xorg >>> pkg install -Uy firefox gitup htop hw-probe kde lsblk lynx nano = pciutils plasma6-sddm-kcm roxterm sddm stressdisk uclcmd usbutils = virtualbox-ose-additions xfce xorg >>> pkg upgrade -fFqy >>> pkg upgrade -fUy >> In a 14.3-Stable amd64 UFS context the above command sequence: >>=20 >> 1) Will probably OOM on a system with 1 GiByte of RAM but no swap = space, >> even for the first install command. >>=20 >> 2) The sequence of 4 commands used (RAM+SWAP): >> 1024 MiBytes + 2312 MiBytes (observed maximum) >> (So between 3 and 4 GiBytes of RAM+SWAP overall.) >>=20 >> 3) So will OOM on a system with 2 GiByte of RAM but no swap space, >> overall. >>=20 >> =E2=80=A6 First I'll note: ports-mgmt/pkg-devel now has a commit that includes: "add: backout support for provides/requires" that is described with: "Performance penalty is still to big, a new approach with no performance penalty will be tested later" on the upstream githib. This may make current testing irrelevant relative to the future. > Here, with 3 G, fast storage, and swap off: UFS and ZFS seemed much = the same. >=20 > RELEASE, quarterly. >=20 >=20 > UFS (dmesg: 2928 MB avail memory) > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >=20 > Fourth command (pkg upgrade -fUy). >=20 > First run failed. vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D120 Not good news for folks with small arm boards or the like: unreliable. > Second and third runs (not consecutive to the first): success. For the = third run, I reduced vm.pageout_oom_seq to its default (12). You do not report observations of how large the Swap Used got to be for any of your runs, failed or working ones. >=20 > ZFS (dmesg: 2920 MB avail memory) > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >=20 > Four consecutive runs of the fourth command. >=20 > Two runs with vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D120: success. Third and fourth runs = with vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D12: >=20 > - the third run failed almost immediately, before step 1 of 2601 >=20 > - the fourth run succeeded. Also unreliable. No Swap Used figures for this either. It is not clear what runs might be "barely fit" vs. what runs might be "lots of margin". Nor is there a scale to the variability that you are reporting. One possible (likely?) difference in your tests and mine is what I reported about which base packages were installed for my test context: all of them (534 or so if I remember right), even the debug information. That contributes to what the "pkg upgrade -fUy" activity is. Another is that the test was based on booting and using a USB3 memory stick SSD, not large U.2 or PCIe Optane media or something else comparatively fast. =3D=3D=3D Mark Millard marklmi at yahoo.com From nobody Thu Sep 4 01:50:22 2025 X-Original-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4cHMrN6YXMz66YZV for ; Thu, 04 Sep 2025 01:50:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) Received: from sonic303-25.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (sonic303-25.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com [98.137.64.206]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4cHMrN3XTVz3DcD for ; Thu, 04 Sep 2025 01:50:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=yahoo.com header.s=s2048 header.b=VwJ9njml; dmarc=pass (policy=reject) header.from=yahoo.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of marklmi@yahoo.com designates 98.137.64.206 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=marklmi@yahoo.com DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1756950638; bh=8w8M+t7q8Zv8jhtEep7sREkvT3zGBd0A814XAPdLWwM=; h=Subject:From:In-Reply-To:Date:Cc:References:To:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=VwJ9njmlKzHTs5kZG0ShbyEUNHzXfdm1DsQkcb9entLvj0SdurFHuvuk0Z0GKSD3i9JlnfWR9A1dJBgQDJKzxw06gYV3hWczxa1IEYDz61NKVFNgoMyTnPjHmRgIb4gJ7bSTZqRbMwGAEEsX2pXUyyXAiVu/4bNhbe4zX7b2otiY0lT1pcOt0eGz/4RNBr5gZ3FbHrrTX+lvft4YQZn5ZF6r0rGDPu2PbRbXL4vtFeLlTPMeTe28pT8Yt6PcZiFXA1ZNKeq2lkCkJL1QB+/i6eoReQt455dSEgdL+AnCZVfqnjV7z2asRNGquGuEqvYa1G6L1UaDGOhdSKYRjvVpCQ== X-SONIC-DKIM-SIGN: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1756950638; bh=8qzl0cmQFV5/E3WuMzeyN/IOcU39RHK2UahYPXGHdCN=; h=X-Sonic-MF:Subject:From:Date:To:From:Subject; b=KTC+HWMgvc3nWU7F/lAStihgr7ahJRg/PPoHJhC2Qx5kauDUNEsnyysaGJrONclwsHLKf7nSDH882gslKz3rL8FXu1P45dQnKm3mgL9+ZgpB+zefaDE+GUu/PeMXThvoiOCX79Cx22i9aRTiNQRK2Tjnp/rD7WMK1ilg/EEaIlSOSPaOPmmqSffdlXpnL6BwnN9OBqpbVmiCyvQXnA2Y3CeGNjbEo1MkGsytIkVYwLGPl9WRr/r0g6/KG/7NyKhnJOzSjposwDlbP+FkKzwpP3J3kZh3cFGXzTqs4JgQBC9BifdNvCeLuDp9u9e6nz1y5AdeKT1Rof+Nb22oGE3A5g== X-YMail-OSG: ukEnHcIVM1mrUh3anot8oJc.u0_ZCl9DvBCdRTQYRjxa3IEk0xPHmkAfZFqgaUL vS_dmfND4YzyU2Ul6oTUA1Gfj7.CgZedYXRuSmGYuUlR5tubwFPHXjbMCP4sQEWDqMskV1po03H0 u_Jj6CZ.pRl284Qxn8XALMKpuUx28fWCWepLQg7Gz1iO2F8Z3ZZD8L6ZWXprc8oK3F3OtACsxATf D13emCu1q.nJqZHluLGEAN11hvi4UCDiLYRmyLEL7oO_ih.hmFaoDEl9i6LT9CWGySx3zii8jsss fP5HEJYpJPC5pmv9i_eeHN2efIW14o_Th6_SHqXpPDykGS25FK4iLRCb8R7oNJl3.bn6HS.Bs.np O3evHw7c0yIG9xKKR7dIQ1TE58GJD1PzYrx8petJxx87OJpUW14i38FyOZB674_msPw4H3BJicX8 Ie942Mz6qDfe8aPSgI9vyyEsOoKTuM69FdRtvfIEe5.hkgvnqg7E.RizN_QwSbjJi6Zce6yM.f_K kgjkT3VqIHUPe5bDba1bgjFFb1LlGLUv26.MmYk91X.1BgC.N94teQEi25lCYuB529H1US4LXgIx DwuvzWBY.b20Jn2t42Z7sbuORrjw_7qeOoUU4B6Otar_gHKc11nm.Ew55XDcmxck9drGKuKqy3_6 aR5BqB_KekRCfw_iPe6QZfuV7QCeKc7axMwuh2PIik7uNFYj6x4Vsvf_2Q2Axn5SG94TDe4PZ6Ng 0uHTaWBmQgIdCh5u4nEjXxEXCZIjTq5UlNJQJb3R2UtDIERY0DeHeC_IX5hPyy4JWRZLTDyipd9J uKAOOaEgUGQJiy7LCHDS9llZN7fOjcV9g60XnmzrwRZvWTh4nsfyRWveFPO5HrVUW_XMt620nHJT HOLWRPuUTYhfmBr2WdK7OpRFcWgKrG3M.qFHZNsN.2q5kbEWpwd0TgI.gQPal9hvZuFTcxy4B9Mm DxBiT2LQhTCnjocKlQ5gPQ6JdZBmfkYKIGdGZHFNCT8RCiMZKhLtrPMiToIM3.HAwAvyxhXfZXrr t3zA8kLx9.kFi93e_YISNH4MIY1LGob9mq9TNLeqDfoimecmq8BYPLJwz6bj4zEV69x1GbatDpdQ Ryogj47pRu1ehN4VXqK1JJnU2u6CERXWy7UI1WcAhVDw_22niMmgTD9q2CVTFCTMQl_Gt_Uyo2MH v9PIzSv8tRa2qhVe5vv3ikpWHXEkwj7.J5B9Ingp5QNlxAF60X_FKaKshJPi0.hVxLnElPh8eT1F ufb0rM94iW8PepHOzLQCd5y5X6uNKseijKkVdSJQz3z9McUNLJnX.chqGUEQQX3NhjmHoyShosnp l81hkX2yhvteGgv3VVielW2ZkXXm5N9ZXXcTe5EqVx_HN_ICi30Huw2IuSHZV.aU87qHjmk56Qwj 6_S6wmPmHK7U7c77K02VlFfQuQzOoUM2YJ.qkszi93Hio9n5Fdl6bgKcrP.OKSS8mYWtgDuhb2PM dShjbjebmjzB0VRxYEfsWMDlFC7pY2YlGuv0ZFq1iZQgPDJOZzs4.nmQn3_ntl1N_b.3iS31_DWx ocnE68QNNFLFtjaQ87bZa_TjXYYKO9Yv7ouO_AfbDw.7ngJ6xS52n1igZl73K1zA7VgBQpUCB8DP z4HwD3Qz9R20kgtQmhOSJL_tAC63g_F0E2KIIOJOfRfqxblybqibhyT8kAwtDhyBY9HFM6E0xL00 K5NLEE7Ke2ZKtj0xYYQH0TtG8tMnqa29nYHeoUrti.kdWEVsNOUNXAo7caMl5MpOGmThuV93BsJs 7Zzf.cStDHuOg7Gs6pxJEAiEHAx9SJIhGFPnxcO0ikAfoUFoTGgX2WPqAzga_UPgzUyxzvhV29Kx 0vaywt2BJIq0utd20XE7cAj_DhOtJeXjddF1vv0.IenvFmjUW37X.O4klsCa2yENI3EIriuFZKKx 6lbv2gltwe2JCaRVN6JRdpsC8Q_BVv8oxeUqu0z1VDnrihl5CfVxDEcrX49.4NApfvRmmt9IYmh5 Mz62YAs8E9WBqCrnoys5Z3VOxyhp.ETr6ORNJgCh0yo0HVCIz3Gz_7KT71ejIZFV.vRDAWA_RnJH QWEayhQOPmyJuYMxs6HrKI2VfDBRkRz_ekkEKDv99sWlpGrVcsghywhKy_Mwh9VfVtLJ7CUyVVEv 9Pqt8CLeMZedLyfqvqCjl1mTATU9z.sca1LjSSRHpg0G5YBRQK7bqo3DIN7Wrtt8dc9FgbJUH4U3 mVtakFhVbDmV9ODw.r.xJ19boa9V.Go7DdP21cBkPabtOebKT7smXvo.i4jFbLnCjBZ3CZ.TyK4F J6A-- X-Sonic-MF: X-Sonic-ID: 0c024f69-c8a0-4876-aa04-4ddd40f6317d Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic303.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Thu, 4 Sep 2025 01:50:38 +0000 Received: by hermes--production-gq1-7bfc77444d-5w8hd (Yahoo Inc. Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID c316c7751dcabb938ea05c28bd1aea1b; Thu, 04 Sep 2025 01:50:33 +0000 (UTC) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3826.700.81\)) Subject: Re: pkg upgrade, vm.pageout_oom_seq: swap off: UFS, ZFS From: Mark Millard In-Reply-To: <36F5A8E1-7F72-48C0-A8D7-428E91488B70@yahoo.com> Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2025 18:50:22 -0700 Cc: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <0dbf8c95-7697-4887-a890-335c3ccd80f1@gmail.com> <29ff7f7e-12ef-4d10-8ca4-15ae35ce6bae@gmail.com> <19251E67-BC92-4D71-9E71-6C7546A46D8C@yahoo.com> <9300201D-9D53-449B-9F0A-DFF6194B2830@yahoo.com> <6d1606ac-8ad0-4f15-96c7-30c6f50ca9b9@gmail.com> <73877048-A3B4-4920-AC92-A8C7A4FF83B5@yahoo.com> <2f455675-609b-40b5-9dab-5f006156bac6@gmail.com> <36F5A8E1-7F72-48C0-A8D7-428E91488B70@yahoo.com> To: Graham Perrin X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3826.700.81) X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.99 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.99)[-0.995]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[yahoo.com,reject]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com:dkim]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org]; APPLE_MAILER_COMMON(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[98.137.64.206:from]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[98.137.64.206:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cHMrN3XTVz3DcD On Sep 3, 2025, at 17:53, Mark Millard wrote: >=20 > On Sep 3, 2025, at 17:14, Graham Perrin = wrote: >=20 >> On 02/09/2025 19:19, Mark Millard wrote: >>=20 >>> On Aug 31, 2025, at 12:01, Graham Perrin = wrote: >>>=20 >>>> =E2=80=A6 >>> The notes here are about the following sequence of 4 commands: >>>=20 >>>> pkg install -Fy firefox gitup htop hw-probe kde lsblk lynx nano = pciutils plasma6-sddm-kcm roxterm sddm stressdisk uclcmd usbutils = virtualbox-ose-additions xfce xorg >>>> pkg install -Uy firefox gitup htop hw-probe kde lsblk lynx nano = pciutils plasma6-sddm-kcm roxterm sddm stressdisk uclcmd usbutils = virtualbox-ose-additions xfce xorg >>>> pkg upgrade -fFqy >>>> pkg upgrade -fUy >>> In a 14.3-Stable amd64 UFS context the above command sequence: >>>=20 >>> 1) Will probably OOM on a system with 1 GiByte of RAM but no swap = space, >>> even for the first install command. >>>=20 >>> 2) The sequence of 4 commands used (RAM+SWAP): >>> 1024 MiBytes + 2312 MiBytes (observed maximum) >>> (So between 3 and 4 GiBytes of RAM+SWAP overall.) >>>=20 >>> 3) So will OOM on a system with 2 GiByte of RAM but no swap space, >>> overall. >>>=20 >>> =E2=80=A6 >=20 > First I'll note: >=20 > ports-mgmt/pkg-devel now has a commit that includes: "add: backout > support for provides/requires" that is described with: "Performance > penalty is still to big, a new approach with no performance penalty > will be tested later" on the upstream githib. >=20 > This may make current testing irrelevant relative to the future. >=20 >> Here, with 3 G, fast storage, and swap off: UFS and ZFS seemed much = the same. >>=20 >> RELEASE, quarterly. >>=20 >>=20 >> UFS (dmesg: 2928 MB avail memory) >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>=20 >> Fourth command (pkg upgrade -fUy). >>=20 >> First run failed. vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D120 >=20 > Not good news for folks with small arm boards > or the like: unreliable. >=20 >> Second and third runs (not consecutive to the first): success. For = the third run, I reduced vm.pageout_oom_seq to its default (12). >=20 > You do not report observations of how large the > Swap Used got to be for any of your runs, failed > or working ones. Sorry for basing the Swap Used notes on an incompletely expressed thought --vastly unexpressed in fact. Having RAM+SWAP at a given figure, say 3072 MiBytes, leads to seeing what memory pressure does based on how much RAM+MaxObserveredSwapUsed ends up being (if RAM is small enough that SWAP ends up used to some non-trivial degree such that InAct ends up fairly small and likely dirty pages). This is tied to largely eliminating Clean InAct pages before using SWAP fairly generally. (SWAP gets dirty pages.) It is difficult to get roughly similar information absent the SWAP being involved and the system trying to avoid most unnecessary use of it. >> ZFS (dmesg: 2920 MB avail memory) >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>=20 >> Four consecutive runs of the fourth command. >>=20 >> Two runs with vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D120: success. Third and fourth = runs with vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D12: >>=20 >> - the third run failed almost immediately, before step 1 of 2601 >>=20 >> - the fourth run succeeded. >=20 > Also unreliable. No Swap Used figures for this either. Again: Sorry for basing the Swap Used notes on an incompletely expressed thought. > It is not clear what runs might be "barely fit" vs. > what runs might be "lots of margin". Nor is there a > scale to the variability that you are reporting. >=20 > One possible (likely?) difference in your tests and mine > is what I reported about which base packages were installed > for my test context: all of them (534 or so if I remember > right), even the debug information. That contributes to what > the "pkg upgrade -fUy" activity is. >=20 > Another is that the test was based on booting and using > a USB3 memory stick SSD, not large U.2 or PCIe Optane > media or something else comparatively fast. =3D=3D=3D Mark Millard marklmi at yahoo.com From nobody Thu Sep 4 07:17:05 2025 X-Original-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4cHW540R4Sz6700p; Thu, 04 Sep 2025 07:17:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from grahamperrin@gmail.com) Received: from mail-wm1-x330.google.com (mail-wm1-x330.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::330]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "WR4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4cHW531GQPz3n8Z; 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Thu, 04 Sep 2025 00:17:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.0.11.58] ([192.173.128.42]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 5b1f17b1804b1-45b9a6ecfafsm108253055e9.21.2025.09.04.00.17.07 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 04 Sep 2025 00:17:07 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <08b3521f-d29d-4f9b-affe-68a0fc35ed59@gmail.com> Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2025 08:17:05 +0100 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: pkg upgrade, vm.pageout_oom_seq: swap off: UFS, ZFS To: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org References: <0dbf8c95-7697-4887-a890-335c3ccd80f1@gmail.com> <29ff7f7e-12ef-4d10-8ca4-15ae35ce6bae@gmail.com> <19251E67-BC92-4D71-9E71-6C7546A46D8C@yahoo.com> <9300201D-9D53-449B-9F0A-DFF6194B2830@yahoo.com> <6d1606ac-8ad0-4f15-96c7-30c6f50ca9b9@gmail.com> <73877048-A3B4-4920-AC92-A8C7A4FF83B5@yahoo.com> <2f455675-609b-40b5-9dab-5f006156bac6@gmail.com> <36F5A8E1-7F72-48C0-A8D7-428E91488B70@yahoo.com> From: Graham Perrin Content-Language: en-GB X-Priority: 4 (Low) Autocrypt: addr=grahamperrin@gmail.com; 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charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.90 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.997]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.90)[-0.899]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36:c]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20230601]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; HAS_X_PRIO_THREE(0.00)[4]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org,freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; FREEFALL_USER(0.00)[grahamperrin]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2a00:1450:4864:20::330:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cHW531GQPz3n8Z On 04/09/2025 01:53, Mark Millard wrote: > On Sep 3, 2025, at 17:14, Graham Perrin wrote: > >> … >> >> Here, with 3 G, fast storage, and swap off: UFS and ZFS seemed much the same. >> >> RELEASE, quarterly. >> >> … > You do not report observations of how large the > Swap Used got to be … "swap off" in the subject line, and above ;-) I began focusing on fast storage after realising that with slow storage, there seems to be a massive risk reduction with vm.pageout_oom_seq=120 From nobody Thu Sep 4 08:44:34 2025 X-Original-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4cHY294SJ8z6752c for ; 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Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 9653511541e76151b566fa42d8fb2f1d; Thu, 04 Sep 2025 08:44:45 +0000 (UTC) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3826.700.81\)) Subject: Re: pkg upgrade, vm.pageout_oom_seq: swap off: UFS, ZFS From: Mark Millard X-Priority: 4 (Low) In-Reply-To: <08b3521f-d29d-4f9b-affe-68a0fc35ed59@gmail.com> Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2025 01:44:34 -0700 Cc: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <5E925F70-5B0C-4204-8EA4-8AD70F99794F@yahoo.com> References: <0dbf8c95-7697-4887-a890-335c3ccd80f1@gmail.com> <29ff7f7e-12ef-4d10-8ca4-15ae35ce6bae@gmail.com> <19251E67-BC92-4D71-9E71-6C7546A46D8C@yahoo.com> <9300201D-9D53-449B-9F0A-DFF6194B2830@yahoo.com> <6d1606ac-8ad0-4f15-96c7-30c6f50ca9b9@gmail.com> <73877048-A3B4-4920-AC92-A8C7A4FF83B5@yahoo.com> <2f455675-609b-40b5-9dab-5f006156bac6@gmail.com> <36F5A8E1-7F72-48C0-A8D7-428E91488B70@yahoo.com> <08b3521f-d29d-4f9b-affe-68a0fc35ed59@gmail.com> To: Graham Perrin X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3826.700.81) X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US] X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cHY291tXKz3wQf On Sep 4, 2025, at 00:17, Graham Perrin wrote: > On 04/09/2025 01:53, Mark Millard wrote: >=20 >> On Sep 3, 2025, at 17:14, Graham Perrin = wrote: >>=20 >>> =E2=80=A6 >>>=20 >>> Here, with 3 G, fast storage, and swap off: UFS and ZFS seemed much = the same. >>>=20 >>> RELEASE, quarterly. >>>=20 >>> =E2=80=A6 >> You do not report observations of how large the >> Swap Used got to be =E2=80=A6 >=20 >=20 > "swap off" in the subject line, and above ;-) Which is what limits the information about how close your were to having problems when it did not OOM: Ifr it was just barely working, little Swap Space left, that is rather different than if SWAP was nearly unused, for example. That "swap off" choice is what I was referencing. But I did not write enough for my reference to make any sense. Thus my later note that did try to indicate why for what would be an example of monitoring "swap on" behavior (Swap Used sampling). > I began focusing on fast storage after realising that with slow = storage, there seems to be a massive risk reduction with > vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D120 Yep. =3D=3D=3D Mark Millard marklmi at yahoo.com From nobody Thu Sep 4 13:29:54 2025 X-Original-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4cHgMJ1C68z662Cw; Thu, 04 Sep 2025 13:30:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from grahamperrin@gmail.com) Received: from mail-wr1-x432.google.com (mail-wr1-x432.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::432]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "WR4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4cHgMH2XxPz3SLF; 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Thu, 04 Sep 2025 06:29:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.0.11.58] ([192.173.128.42]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ffacd0b85a97d-3dbead0b247sm8463905f8f.6.2025.09.04.06.29.55 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 04 Sep 2025 06:29:55 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------BOdtLhVdK40bKU0jbNwI7unn" Message-ID: Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2025 14:29:54 +0100 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: pkg upgrade, vm.pageout_oom_seq: swap off: UFS, ZFS To: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org References: <0dbf8c95-7697-4887-a890-335c3ccd80f1@gmail.com> <29ff7f7e-12ef-4d10-8ca4-15ae35ce6bae@gmail.com> <19251E67-BC92-4D71-9E71-6C7546A46D8C@yahoo.com> <9300201D-9D53-449B-9F0A-DFF6194B2830@yahoo.com> <6d1606ac-8ad0-4f15-96c7-30c6f50ca9b9@gmail.com> <73877048-A3B4-4920-AC92-A8C7A4FF83B5@yahoo.com> <2f455675-609b-40b5-9dab-5f006156bac6@gmail.com> <36F5A8E1-7F72-48C0-A8D7-428E91488B70@yahoo.com> From: Graham Perrin Content-Language: en-GB Autocrypt: addr=grahamperrin@gmail.com; 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NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.993]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.61)[-0.613]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20230601]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; FREEFALL_USER(0.00)[grahamperrin]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org,freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2a00:1450:4864:20::432:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cHgMH2XxPz3SLF This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------BOdtLhVdK40bKU0jbNwI7unn Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On 04/09/2025 01:53, Mark Millard wrote: >>> … > First I'll note: > > ports-mgmt/pkg-devel now has a commit that includes: "add: backout > support for provides/requires" … That might be for pkg-add(8), not for pkg-upgrade(8). changed two files (libpkg/pkg_add.c and tests/frontend/add.sh), but not src/upgrade.c --------------BOdtLhVdK40bKU0jbNwI7unn Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
On 04/09/2025 01:53, Mark Millard wrote:
…

First I'll note:

ports-mgmt/pkg-devel now has a commit that includes: "add: backout
support for provides/requires" …


That might be for pkg-add(8), not for pkg-upgrade(8). 

<https://github.com/freebsd/pkg/commit/647fd0b0809e5995e5f5f15c5b17d4efc9f1e40b> changed two files (libpkg/pkg_add.c and tests/frontend/add.sh), but not src/upgrade.c

<https://github.com/freebsd/pkg/blob/main/src/upgrade.c>

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Thu, 04 Sep 2025 07:18:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.0.11.58] ([192.173.128.42]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ffacd0b85a97d-3d1007c0dc8sm26251223f8f.53.2025.09.04.07.18.21 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 04 Sep 2025 07:18:21 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2025 15:18:21 +0100 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: pkg upgrade, vm.pageout_oom_seq: swap off: UFS, ZFS To: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org References: <0dbf8c95-7697-4887-a890-335c3ccd80f1@gmail.com> <29ff7f7e-12ef-4d10-8ca4-15ae35ce6bae@gmail.com> <19251E67-BC92-4D71-9E71-6C7546A46D8C@yahoo.com> <9300201D-9D53-449B-9F0A-DFF6194B2830@yahoo.com> <6d1606ac-8ad0-4f15-96c7-30c6f50ca9b9@gmail.com> <73877048-A3B4-4920-AC92-A8C7A4FF83B5@yahoo.com> <2f455675-609b-40b5-9dab-5f006156bac6@gmail.com> <36F5A8E1-7F72-48C0-A8D7-428E91488B70@yahoo.com> From: Graham Perrin Content-Language: en-GB Autocrypt: addr=grahamperrin@gmail.com; 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charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-0.997]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20230601]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36:c]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; FREEFALL_USER(0.00)[grahamperrin]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org,freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2a00:1450:4864:20::42d:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cHhRC2YnXz3dC1 On 04/09/2025 01:53, Mark Millard wrote: > … >>>> … >>> … > … > > One possible (likely?) difference in your tests and mine > is what I reported about which base packages were installed > for my test context: all of them (534 or so if I remember > right), even the debug information. That contributes to what > the "pkg upgrade -fUy" activity is. > > … In : > install all components > pkbasify conversion before first boot (519 packages) From nobody Thu Sep 4 15:38:53 2025 X-Original-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4cHkDC3nqWz66D3D for ; Thu, 04 Sep 2025 15:39:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) Received: from sonic303-24.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (sonic303-24.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com [98.137.64.205]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4cHkDC1CmKz3nYS for ; Thu, 04 Sep 2025 15:39:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1757000345; bh=uk78Ob0LxRxt0c7mHexxtezyxdtfWnha+tiO6vXcTO0=; h=Subject:From:In-Reply-To:Date:Cc:References:To:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=cxuTVmkzVvdymXIRv/BPi268e2VrX5icC4qRGD6QbE8VBiGL1TG6oE8Y3j/CVAAzD6yJi70rgBOevp5G2bWRSDM/GYPuNSeuCmWtgXo4V6dzdqvD85R5WJUQagU66vO12IK5v3XJp+FYbzjfxSDg/X07O8uqCMeVt89qSCs2T9xUVyNTkOSGh8TkYoAt/NbHbRZKzlwp5N0XrWjxnzVC317QS9JdQXJgDLqtnIMZ4pZqqqJTWqalBa0mf6XoQbWAFStlaK5Xy967awXF/gc+OK485ga6U/WdK3DZghl16YE7l9rxKsgzl/nGDaAVP2dlSz+w91FgaHT9kbnLyEeKaw== X-SONIC-DKIM-SIGN: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1757000345; bh=+qnJT7ynrvPbfpDmwsDCVVur4XKgVvt2WRb8ypynZVP=; h=X-Sonic-MF:Subject:From:Date:To:From:Subject; b=nT28DVibnjCY/+I0rruqRxvTyr8adZvaqB/bH7qySeiwCj5byC3V0StF99tcGHmkvkcmamwb8kuUxKQFlX3kw0VxbyDVJtX0oT1eId9VEdZCGtXF8+756GHTaQKZi8TbYukpCGgzMQMmmy7sQSY/frJFpiIX9GkuGG4Akvp1DFsCBsaPfTYMh+XP+SWf0Wh2m+ui+eSob4RAkcP4sIwXC2WyxIUW2iESluGqofTNG/q5BKFn1RTM844JclaIklY+9zgG0Ozq/bNJcF4pm6e/5TzhdJZiXrtRWVqQr8OLdfvclu624JuXokqJXBVP3enVAU4xzGkhHMKjiCaLtC+hLQ== X-YMail-OSG: 56bmEy4VM1lWzPHQ.tphSK8lxRVT0XetOqjQtbpJTvhhCf3CAEUSwj7TFHc9Z4h dbwtfjdHTCvxC16jJRPREtC5ZcGROkfMWxlNQULckKAsGRczFd6bAgmhpfKMGZ0ix6nptIgnsMhx msl4qQUCoFMFaw4JK3vW1x__WbwaWUguwHQLsO4nTHhM_7BcDrkd8vQpaxY2PrMIaVk3tu5f0bbi MP9JQIEUczGgwgH1Yx5a4D2e69S4QB.uPax5VOVr8_p0yjEd3j0WEVHxk9HAN9oT66ItvlAyXuJF 6irOwpcQqs1afSAIrCyfrU44RnGB3Rfvkb523HehOEY2hi5lgq5vrdbQBbTA93jrVGrkyF_DiRDZ i9dzqine0mDyIh74j26PoGyrIukCmVjKqScsTUBMqijj5dvw0WLs7XdyieJ7BQvZLZgFd0IKwVFC r2JOBmUzoajSpF2WebBa8ViNyDIFkXSjXMXz7Halj7Gz92Ano2N9M.PdnpkqS2zapRTpsTed6X3M xDTGgCO6fGgdYVW2Ye04rR940T3kGi2_0Tfzlg9TbMHKQME1em9WJpqnth2pS0imXKwLREafLUXr V.6KkiD0v1ji_3YpFTREThtOaat3sTKqi.A_eeF8nDhs6a7J9GN5hInvigd09iNQTyEtXC442Ka4 5RVll2myB4U8kKxl88UxU.tztJPOvmTyBluZYDa6c_r47FF0kBy2VP0lPSQ6wDX3iiZ_hMJb_wfl s07DZLAPFpwN_biIrsIIwC76MLi6lmcim00Us3aLhWMCgI0ZE5pSb1wj8ESeqITTOiEfcP462xi_ ioEEYj68En.eAH6BqjszKSuhRt0.1ev.CmaWEk0T6H_NHHg.9wUJ7dBIa6SGwRivNcxRLSM_UwNh YZ84Au.BzvlUjM5enaDKOLNvKDv56F84HiLt5q4rkZz2V44ORM27Hf02T2aFgK4j.RM5sKjIrI1m ZwZThZ5ztoV9ChHXFXStbGKGvuuA7XjUD55N_GMRaLcOIWdCghzMPVnoDg1y8iwTTfI1M94Z77XA G4LBVAlcNs8xYsOz3oG8hHUnxWp0d79MV1VCk_HeSY8B.fPhgfl9W_pZc9etmJqlP_FkC2WLWNOR B0mFM2vEmWESNsY8PbUTCnRmbq33.piD6HEkRQdcHGC5z8Aw1IznxSUsRTYmiwl.KN5Q.HzO_52j 32AKllP2JfkQrYBdik5YvrR5X83CXbLV_r5mNVh2AHam13BL98n_UwU7p5KvlUpBL98sjEhciKKq ZqWOPA6RQ9c2nC9jAI_OuIOvYBNWpJw6zW0PKHMoJJLu0gLg0ktupO1BB0UEI1NB_LCG_sFkynmW 0zWwqjWP9E0PY7jm0fBy29ZYFfvj5fEOI8BOltYRJgndp4.iF576Q_IbNm5Vw6UbMrlTdxD74ccN tJb78YVX7HfyZuPNciQYaxD4w68XErOv1lL.gV.wSNKdhQ5aCOyuAP2A5MrRSt70d44ExFB2ZHsI 9..mWIKaPOefqz9B8JcqbPFGd_G8ZrYIwh5m9_gMiv9EhaOOEUPASnD1H6orMYumQiIKyPJaYnna jHWPhBVLZ5oETsL0kedv1M4eoglOoowoVoMqUCGn5d5HXvgKyeme8Xf4BYQWlFPSMJl_tawGbEAf r.naOv5nV86Z9cVKkkYJYhah6twrN8NRjPO2B4zLABG94DwPmtmpjKO64V_sT_5lXzC0nEm2gqNY QJvxLaoeP6yygappyXkLNqWKVhMFnM8ngAJ6mvzlIMt_LGfoyMi987GY1nzE7ObCafcQ8KjorKGb H3j7ITPGJGPsCgZoh5Rsg3kAWPNDMYaBmaP67RwNxPvzyKVrkLk3aS6XUDCoC6YoMly0PE2jt..j 0dH7AKRmi4qDm5Q4qAUBixBBI1n.oY7dAX6HoDSoQCZW0ymPnACzpoIw3HevZO_.V_pQo_JzrhUd 0iAtRO2e3qSmLr8.7G7j.tG43x33oD0Hxv0B5Rvue7BdPvwpPy39M2aQwpim3iLB83qxbPh7spAp DLsnamo_TT3X8OSb0vmZ2xEXWEkz_832E2UUIXPKMQv3.X3px5uOLylLxCQDwqg5pGRkX3iE85Jr v8s1PV4AzIe8rMcGmHh7jUfDq8jR24yOtbT.k4ATc9zx9tl_aN24_tvttNFjzFPPiMA1gw8ktE9u V0x6iQxgV32Nm0HoSstWEfVQeSBXwamcxhheO5IXV7igZMfIv6WJ6aOSeu6FX3Plap4OtqrfDPut Vd_rut4H4mz8_j9sz5En7Qd.MQNjBmDFj8qDXBCgBdqEzr8saYFmr2Ij4LrGXBbAhXF_i7MraNeH G X-Sonic-MF: X-Sonic-ID: dd54fd2f-50cc-47d3-a7c9-eb27ee52259b Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic303.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Thu, 4 Sep 2025 15:39:05 +0000 Received: by hermes--production-gq1-7bfc77444d-tgvbr (Yahoo Inc. Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID f1076975b6e61fe375317e80e016b150; Thu, 04 Sep 2025 15:39:04 +0000 (UTC) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3826.700.81\)) Subject: Re: pkg upgrade, vm.pageout_oom_seq: swap off: UFS, ZFS From: Mark Millard In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2025 08:38:53 -0700 Cc: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <7295AB04-0D83-40E3-ACF8-10B7C1C86D63@yahoo.com> References: <0dbf8c95-7697-4887-a890-335c3ccd80f1@gmail.com> <29ff7f7e-12ef-4d10-8ca4-15ae35ce6bae@gmail.com> <19251E67-BC92-4D71-9E71-6C7546A46D8C@yahoo.com> <9300201D-9D53-449B-9F0A-DFF6194B2830@yahoo.com> <6d1606ac-8ad0-4f15-96c7-30c6f50ca9b9@gmail.com> <73877048-A3B4-4920-AC92-A8C7A4FF83B5@yahoo.com> <2f455675-609b-40b5-9dab-5f006156bac6@gmail.com> <36F5A8E1-7F72-48C0-A8D7-428E91488B70@yahoo.com> To: Graham Perrin X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3826.700.81) X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US] X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cHkDC1CmKz3nYS On Sep 4, 2025, at 06:29, Graham Perrin wrote: > On 04/09/2025 01:53, Mark Millard wrote: >>>> =E2=80=A6 >>>>=20 >> First I'll note: >>=20 >> ports-mgmt/pkg-devel now has a commit that includes: "add: backout >> support for provides/requires" =E2=80=A6 >=20 > That might be for pkg-add(8), not for pkg-upgrade(8).=20 > = changed two files (libpkg/pkg_add.c and tests/frontend/add.sh), = but not src/upgrade.c > True that I do not known if eliminating the extra information being involved in "pkg add" hasany consequences outside "pkg add" vs. not. =3D=3D=3D Mark Millard marklmi at yahoo.com From nobody Sat Sep 6 21:17:57 2025 X-Original-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4cK5fQ1xMVz677rX for ; 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[89.241.205.78]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 5b1f17b1804b1-45dd296ed51sm123580535e9.3.2025.09.06.14.17.58 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 06 Sep 2025 14:17:58 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------a17HP7ijhtlcDI6Wvklrv9Xr" Message-ID: Date: Sat, 6 Sep 2025 22:17:57 +0100 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: after updating to latest, pkg base segfaults and leaves me unbootable To: Dan Mahoney References: From: Graham Perrin Content-Language: en-GB Cc: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Autocrypt: addr=grahamperrin@gmail.com; keydata= xsFNBGKYt7ABEAClu83dJ3ZKfVgPOk9YKRv0Z+dl2b88+k9R4vwAmElgguYdKE7yhnQNhhWM v9vi6AFrBMc2oJdVHJ2OrXfwpELBFIgiSMEWNsC4e+Z3HtSajcl+pFZsP7ciiSoycj/w3wIV kAZoVGbhyIbNG7fbCEJ8q81TbfsGypV3bRmbZVvGNecBguYiooBtz2Qht1p3itXMkIA6P9pS YDl+6QddZLyUUAjAnFv2QDoYSHLnaDUWw4oONZsB0SKVu8jMIBh4uJZoYEOvdvc9jQQdOpA2 CAgA6ulfm42Ikr9lKBUUCtjqiWAhJ7iXOTyHAIdR4Mf8alCE6tdTq6dHdIt+GktTY7oYNyL2 3aD3C7I5waU0SFXvJcOMG10QLfwYQMOQoYQ9XJ0U5A28WYiDcylDdUWT7SappP1e1ZMeJWWO y14mxxNzHaJSI4rK8P/p5tp3Q7SSC4k5gMh9zKba3K2ApCWNbVLGvXsJeQkZZNvu70tE81ey AHI5iZcB6D7WaHysBUmsKaEpbcmm1ZThTnGL0SHEl5to5Jab5Fg6O+Cnly5sVz5lX/v8Aosx kKNei7SCVqXOVtteQeGxWbXWbhPgbMyc0Gi3DuxBI/yvJ43k/rJysQlLGLWfJx/UXprwLluC PDK9EvKEB+fD1Z349uzp1sKr3ihpySbyKI8fpudftnAz4EsoCwARAQABzSZHcmFoYW0gUGVy cmluIDxncmFoYW1wZXJyaW5AZ21haWwuY29tPsLBlAQTAQoAPhYhBFk/5bLDBwftvJcvCrdn SG9KGNQLBQJoRALAAhsDBQkPEg5ABQsJCAcDBRUKCQgLBRYDAgEAAh4FAheAAAoJELdnSG9K GNQL8YkP/2V1z6XQDyG1QlKAu8TuE8zDWy9QQKjC/G44hlu5zk+2kWSNk4zeExs9ZXOBmVhF EW1d+1J8wDiYIeKYj/rqMoP+gb8o0Au0lSRitvTdLxkZBFGMn0CEzlDOzv+wmiy0ggAV/s+Y EbiHk12fI0LoTy5/ywdmG/uGS7M6p3XOrM0YO1qmLXy1cUyYDsYIpq5/rT0QzpGowsJLoEA3 zz1vfKVY+RTorsL4W8ljXLmcs4c3b3HZG9Xmgtt+Ni/eb9CjzM7kCXOcSMnVzvfscCowPAwB 0ZHlNxNV0MTa61xgvOCk4Zf278ArRgbTm4oOz9Z4ciPMnVue+9P/VdxIxgUuYkAryM0+agGz L9bd8ljn+efNtgZ5dlDLrNnTE+vWnMVlMXgl7BNnhwHg7UYFLrC2xklsICub0qpnNheTGeqo 0N4UongJTQJ6H6LEpgd+KMkCncAHghED/G0/BUdO90VEOoqnIKwKa+F9NqVMvHWc8D58mwCP FghsmxK9FM9pnsjLmG7u+s51Y7++GSRnU4NkI4tHiVk7hcAcvZuc0QbUDwVMTurDUgIqRo6W 80j1tFjEspkrwtMoeVFEkDHktjoc3AoEymXIncZfqIqi3nVseyDVyNByvkV0mutX9hXqac0/ RXMuyK9KniAUZ9+gsWs4rPs/DOdsw4K8/RnjduBrfCYQzsFNBGKYt7ABEADRb1tZuh7DPYET 0wK6fe7owbYgM+RfKhmcrGgR2HI9M2q6+0WKF/ITnggWdIW2Ecc4z2boLz/cwvPGCS7/YxZM 61KklGCwuS7q1s04XnHDWHuFxfXQPzAdVmNO3bYoMZbJjHXs6sB2u5ksiwPwaMAWWaGkviSj c5pwvHCiTmX5vH5CBj/Vi+5ESyX38vK4JM5S/m4ouI/6M9biyFgimV+v3vVyCxJCT1gI9g4o GIh1qq5S433b1fihn4yHPf8XOKyBpA/QcwLONViBqJL5nnOxpsh344rNxn2R7CcRzzicOV+e 2IbMem4lwNWQlZKoRotKXZi9LqN5mynSBYqAUdoZum0QinWT9F22B0Qex5PH1zAt9i2W91Vd kcPB3LwkRXj07ycRtsSzpgPA6fLc6AsoWFslHl8kVOO5eJIA4xhjlPa+W8lguQHZ0iX+5uAv 2eAgXR2swADuHPuENNFStmsgAMl8OOOgtq75yA5TpyIzxMuXV9Nmp0VfIaUM/IdLdmxhc1pC c320l5fYMHVLFAReWEbSj2QH8YzWfpXHIegutWWYEbH9SiDXgS9KoKmCJV/Qa+x6/b8y3pOZ vnIbCDaynC2Yr50s8gRa9kb54JE8Z+p8r16U3SEsK3PtUi0RF0e51danCVHrrE6/Hat2XUO/ 6nnYgVgFOrLao6Gh/VMs8wARAQABwsF8BBgBCgAmFiEEWT/lssMHB+28ly8Kt2dIb0oY1AsF AmhEAsACGwwFCQ8SDkAACgkQt2dIb0oY1AvQxw//REWYFK2m4yS/QP5kzfhkWcNqDI/akGT5 /LXmdmbc1s78+mOMXnA4vBY/+X1QatgxWUECkPDOiIwXJMxoBuyY8e7spLRXeyhtfh5aYaJc MO5bARX0c49v+KfZ80u9tG2rkKQvAt/ySo7OXsbDADFFRhlc8RLbb8e7bSctGbYZk9CYa0ya dW5+n3znDNJ6yW1skx9wTH+Y8VlSazRLk3XgXscNqBA2h56v3WS/R5dI++7AQxZxSQacQvfj 9eahq7ATdB4zMQ9MBHEwOvGD3DLlc55FYSDZvNX+mhnK7S0t1Nt2EtGUOmXb5ysMFGnbsce0 woKQ0sLPF1HWDAAf7tBCF8mpPIzU/ViAkupsJ6NYCD0tLFD8pvl0NYU2TjvyWh6ie3e5B/b3 8Daiyme+M92ivfoRQOFKmkPfeT14AI6OW1k7qFbmoIwMWWQdFWAl1CP9hNdF9gRN4rFB0Jy1 90BajZW2zOdVfqdurJZegCzAowZalLm4JEK2MklpPzipibnJqhLOmvJy587pF52KDdM/4rLy BBREIm7uRivnO5k/BY5qS+H/aqv97LC0PVaTsLXbDmTxTnJplUpdlYT9NGidM+x/ioS0iztO Cht7cT8V8jvvKZYvNpst8iqxuIaoV9V7aZ0wAQpkgDGXHmSzwtz6U8xNf/4e4sLn9KPlldSd kvo= In-Reply-To: X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; 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charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On 09/08/2025 00:38, Dan Mahoney wrote: > … > > [598/1127] Deleting files for p5-MIME-Base32-1.303: 100% > [599/1127] Deinstalling p5-MIME-Base64-3.16... > [599/1127] Deleting files for p5-MIME-Base64-3.16: 100% > Child process pid=21537 terminated abnormally: Segmentation fault > > … Is that reproducible with 15.0-PRERELEASE and yesterday's set of packages for FreeBSD-ports? I can perform a major upgrade from 14.2-RELEASE-p5  with pkg-static: – then restart the OS, install 771 packages from FreeBSD-ports (kde, plasma6-sddm-kcm, sddm, xorg), shut down, boot, and finally, quietly force an upgrade of all packages: /usr/bin/time -h pkg upgrade -fqUy – *without a segfault* 👍 AMD64, root-on-ZFS, 4 GB memory (3904 MB avail at startup). OT: - I see other issues, but not a potentially show-stopping segfault - the shut down was necessary only because (a typo) I previously gave only 204 MB base memory to the VirtualBox guest. --------------a17HP7ijhtlcDI6Wvklrv9Xr Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
On 09/08/2025 00:38, Dan Mahoney wrote: 
…

[598/1127] Deleting files for p5-MIME-Base32-1.303: 100%
[599/1127] Deinstalling p5-MIME-Base64-3.16...
[599/1127] Deleting files for p5-MIME-Base64-3.16: 100%
Child process pid=21537 terminated abnormally: Segmentation fault

…


Is that reproducible with 15.0-PRERELEASE and yesterday's set of packages for FreeBSD-ports?

I can perform a major upgrade from 14.2-RELEASE-p5  with pkg-static:

<https://github.com/freebsd/pkg/issues/2475#issuecomment-3263035996>

– then restart the OS, install 771 packages from FreeBSD-ports (kde, plasma6-sddm-kcm, sddm, xorg), shut down, boot, and finally, quietly force an upgrade of all packages: 

/usr/bin/time -h pkg upgrade -fqUy

– without a segfault 👍

<https://i.imgur.com/HZeVsA0.png>

AMD64, root-on-ZFS, 4 GB memory (3904 MB avail at startup).

OT: 

- I see other issues, but not a potentially show-stopping segfault

- the shut down was necessary only because (a typo) I previously gave only 204 MB base memory to the VirtualBox guest.

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[89.241.205.78]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ffacd0b85a97d-3cf34491a65sm35296317f8f.56.2025.09.06.14.33.06 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 06 Sep 2025 14:33:06 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <8aa5efb0-52a9-4b1e-8a12-a9da1188444d@gmail.com> Date: Sat, 6 Sep 2025 22:33:05 +0100 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: after updating to latest, pkg base segfaults and leaves me unbootable From: Graham Perrin To: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org References: Content-Language: en-GB X-Priority: 5 (Lowest) Autocrypt: addr=grahamperrin@gmail.com; keydata= xsFNBGKYt7ABEAClu83dJ3ZKfVgPOk9YKRv0Z+dl2b88+k9R4vwAmElgguYdKE7yhnQNhhWM v9vi6AFrBMc2oJdVHJ2OrXfwpELBFIgiSMEWNsC4e+Z3HtSajcl+pFZsP7ciiSoycj/w3wIV kAZoVGbhyIbNG7fbCEJ8q81TbfsGypV3bRmbZVvGNecBguYiooBtz2Qht1p3itXMkIA6P9pS YDl+6QddZLyUUAjAnFv2QDoYSHLnaDUWw4oONZsB0SKVu8jMIBh4uJZoYEOvdvc9jQQdOpA2 CAgA6ulfm42Ikr9lKBUUCtjqiWAhJ7iXOTyHAIdR4Mf8alCE6tdTq6dHdIt+GktTY7oYNyL2 3aD3C7I5waU0SFXvJcOMG10QLfwYQMOQoYQ9XJ0U5A28WYiDcylDdUWT7SappP1e1ZMeJWWO y14mxxNzHaJSI4rK8P/p5tp3Q7SSC4k5gMh9zKba3K2ApCWNbVLGvXsJeQkZZNvu70tE81ey AHI5iZcB6D7WaHysBUmsKaEpbcmm1ZThTnGL0SHEl5to5Jab5Fg6O+Cnly5sVz5lX/v8Aosx kKNei7SCVqXOVtteQeGxWbXWbhPgbMyc0Gi3DuxBI/yvJ43k/rJysQlLGLWfJx/UXprwLluC PDK9EvKEB+fD1Z349uzp1sKr3ihpySbyKI8fpudftnAz4EsoCwARAQABzSZHcmFoYW0gUGVy cmluIDxncmFoYW1wZXJyaW5AZ21haWwuY29tPsLBlAQTAQoAPhYhBFk/5bLDBwftvJcvCrdn SG9KGNQLBQJoRALAAhsDBQkPEg5ABQsJCAcDBRUKCQgLBRYDAgEAAh4FAheAAAoJELdnSG9K GNQL8YkP/2V1z6XQDyG1QlKAu8TuE8zDWy9QQKjC/G44hlu5zk+2kWSNk4zeExs9ZXOBmVhF EW1d+1J8wDiYIeKYj/rqMoP+gb8o0Au0lSRitvTdLxkZBFGMn0CEzlDOzv+wmiy0ggAV/s+Y EbiHk12fI0LoTy5/ywdmG/uGS7M6p3XOrM0YO1qmLXy1cUyYDsYIpq5/rT0QzpGowsJLoEA3 zz1vfKVY+RTorsL4W8ljXLmcs4c3b3HZG9Xmgtt+Ni/eb9CjzM7kCXOcSMnVzvfscCowPAwB 0ZHlNxNV0MTa61xgvOCk4Zf278ArRgbTm4oOz9Z4ciPMnVue+9P/VdxIxgUuYkAryM0+agGz L9bd8ljn+efNtgZ5dlDLrNnTE+vWnMVlMXgl7BNnhwHg7UYFLrC2xklsICub0qpnNheTGeqo 0N4UongJTQJ6H6LEpgd+KMkCncAHghED/G0/BUdO90VEOoqnIKwKa+F9NqVMvHWc8D58mwCP FghsmxK9FM9pnsjLmG7u+s51Y7++GSRnU4NkI4tHiVk7hcAcvZuc0QbUDwVMTurDUgIqRo6W 80j1tFjEspkrwtMoeVFEkDHktjoc3AoEymXIncZfqIqi3nVseyDVyNByvkV0mutX9hXqac0/ RXMuyK9KniAUZ9+gsWs4rPs/DOdsw4K8/RnjduBrfCYQzsFNBGKYt7ABEADRb1tZuh7DPYET 0wK6fe7owbYgM+RfKhmcrGgR2HI9M2q6+0WKF/ITnggWdIW2Ecc4z2boLz/cwvPGCS7/YxZM 61KklGCwuS7q1s04XnHDWHuFxfXQPzAdVmNO3bYoMZbJjHXs6sB2u5ksiwPwaMAWWaGkviSj c5pwvHCiTmX5vH5CBj/Vi+5ESyX38vK4JM5S/m4ouI/6M9biyFgimV+v3vVyCxJCT1gI9g4o GIh1qq5S433b1fihn4yHPf8XOKyBpA/QcwLONViBqJL5nnOxpsh344rNxn2R7CcRzzicOV+e 2IbMem4lwNWQlZKoRotKXZi9LqN5mynSBYqAUdoZum0QinWT9F22B0Qex5PH1zAt9i2W91Vd kcPB3LwkRXj07ycRtsSzpgPA6fLc6AsoWFslHl8kVOO5eJIA4xhjlPa+W8lguQHZ0iX+5uAv 2eAgXR2swADuHPuENNFStmsgAMl8OOOgtq75yA5TpyIzxMuXV9Nmp0VfIaUM/IdLdmxhc1pC c320l5fYMHVLFAReWEbSj2QH8YzWfpXHIegutWWYEbH9SiDXgS9KoKmCJV/Qa+x6/b8y3pOZ vnIbCDaynC2Yr50s8gRa9kb54JE8Z+p8r16U3SEsK3PtUi0RF0e51danCVHrrE6/Hat2XUO/ 6nnYgVgFOrLao6Gh/VMs8wARAQABwsF8BBgBCgAmFiEEWT/lssMHB+28ly8Kt2dIb0oY1AsF AmhEAsACGwwFCQ8SDkAACgkQt2dIb0oY1AvQxw//REWYFK2m4yS/QP5kzfhkWcNqDI/akGT5 /LXmdmbc1s78+mOMXnA4vBY/+X1QatgxWUECkPDOiIwXJMxoBuyY8e7spLRXeyhtfh5aYaJc MO5bARX0c49v+KfZ80u9tG2rkKQvAt/ySo7OXsbDADFFRhlc8RLbb8e7bSctGbYZk9CYa0ya dW5+n3znDNJ6yW1skx9wTH+Y8VlSazRLk3XgXscNqBA2h56v3WS/R5dI++7AQxZxSQacQvfj 9eahq7ATdB4zMQ9MBHEwOvGD3DLlc55FYSDZvNX+mhnK7S0t1Nt2EtGUOmXb5ysMFGnbsce0 woKQ0sLPF1HWDAAf7tBCF8mpPIzU/ViAkupsJ6NYCD0tLFD8pvl0NYU2TjvyWh6ie3e5B/b3 8Daiyme+M92ivfoRQOFKmkPfeT14AI6OW1k7qFbmoIwMWWQdFWAl1CP9hNdF9gRN4rFB0Jy1 90BajZW2zOdVfqdurJZegCzAowZalLm4JEK2MklpPzipibnJqhLOmvJy587pF52KDdM/4rLy BBREIm7uRivnO5k/BY5qS+H/aqv97LC0PVaTsLXbDmTxTnJplUpdlYT9NGidM+x/ioS0iztO Cht7cT8V8jvvKZYvNpst8iqxuIaoV9V7aZ0wAQpkgDGXHmSzwtz6U8xNf/4e4sLn9KPlldSd kvo= In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; 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RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2a00:1450:4864:20::42a:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cK5zt3T1sz3DhG On 06/09/2025 22:17, Graham Perrin wrote: > On 09/08/2025 00:38, Dan Mahoney wrote: >> … >> >> [598/1127] Deleting files for p5-MIME-Base32-1.303: 100% >> [599/1127] Deinstalling p5-MIME-Base64-3.16... >> [599/1127] Deleting files for p5-MIME-Base64-3.16: 100% >> Child process pid=21537 terminated abnormally: Segmentation fault >> >> … > > > Is that reproducible with 15.0-PRERELEASE and yesterday's set of > packages for FreeBSD-ports? … > Sorry, ignore that question. I found (copied to freebsd-pkgbase but not to ), which gave the libutil.so.9 context to Dan Mahoney's thread. 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Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 4885f9e11473cdf233b2683ebcc42f2a; Sun, 07 Sep 2025 00:17:30 +0000 (UTC) From: Mark Millard Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3826.700.81\)) Subject: pkgbase FreeBSD:15:* are currently as of 2025-Sep-03/04 (mostly) as far as the most recent file date and time goes, none are yet more recent Message-Id: Date: Sat, 6 Sep 2025 17:17:19 -0700 To: FreeBSD-pkgbase@freebsd.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3826.700.81) References: X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-0.999]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[yahoo.com,reject]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com:dkim]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[FreeBSD-pkgbase@freebsd.org]; APPLE_MAILER_COMMON(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[98.137.68.84:from]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[98.137.68.84:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cK9dW1VkDz3S6n Not that a transition time would be unexpected, but just to be explicit about the current status for FreeBSD:15:* : For FreeBSD:15:* for now : 2025-Jul-14 15:21 ( powerpc, 32-bit not to be supported by 15.0-R ) Date for: = https://pkg.freebsd.org/FreeBSD:15:powerpc/base_latest/packagesite.pkg Note: https://pkg.freebsd.org/ still references: FreeBSD:15:powerpc 2025-Sep-03 10:53 (armv7) Date for: = https://pkg.freebsd.org/FreeBSD:15:armv7/base_latest/packagesite.pkg 2025-Sep-04 20:54 (amd64) Date for: = https://pkg.freebsd.org/FreeBSD:15:amd64/base_latest/packagesite.tzst 2025-Sep-04 21:20 (aarch64) Date for: = https://pkg.freebsd.org/FreeBSD:15:aarch64/base_latest/data.pkg 2025-Sep-04 21:33 ( i386, 32-bit not to be supported by 15.0-R ) Date for: = https://pkg.freebsd.org/FreeBSD:15:i386/base_latest/packagesite.pkg Note: https://pkg.freebsd.org/ does not reference: FreeBSD:15:i386 ( but https://pkg.freebsd.org/FreeBSD:15:i386/ is still populated ). = =20 2025-Sep-04 21:45 (powerpc64) Date for: = https://pkg.freebsd.org/FreeBSD:15:powerpc64/base_latest/data.tzst 2025-Sep-04 21:55 (powerpc64le) Date for: = https://pkg.freebsd.org/FreeBSD:15:powerpc64le/base_latest/data.tzst FreeBSD:16:* is not covered yet. (Again: no surprise, just being = explicit.) Also, possibly delete https://pkg.freebsd.org/FreeBSD:15:armv6 at some = point? : ????-???-?? ??:?? 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Slow physical storage for the virtual drive: a mobile HDD on USB. bsdinstall, ZFS, 8 G swap, pkgbase, all components, then: |pkg install --glob 'FreeBSD-kernel-generic-nodebug*'| = 568 base packages. vm.pageout_oom_seq=120 After base installation: 1 G memory given to the guest, GENERIC-NODEBUG, dmesg showed 932  MB avail. Fetch then install some FreeBSD-ports packages. From : |drm-kmodfirefoxgitupgothtophw-probekdelsblklynxnanopciutilsplasma6-sddm-kcmroxtermsddmuclcmdusbutilsvirtualbox-ose-additionsxfcexorg| = 965 non-base packages installed in 4 minutes, 33 seconds. Then, at ttyv3: htop at ttyv2: tail -f -n 0 /var/log/messages at ttyv1: |/usr/bin/time -h pkg upgrade -fqUy| = a quiet forced upgrade of all packages, complete in 17 minutes, 2.62 seconds. With htop, I observed swap usage sometimes above 2 G. Never 3 or more, although I did not watch constantly. 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Three of the lines were good when I clicked Send, but broken when sent. 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Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 81bde7bea8ae79f608ccbc5d16db584e; Sun, 07 Sep 2025 04:12:05 +0000 (UTC) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3826.700.81\)) Subject: Re: pkg upgrade, ZFS, swap on, vm.pageout_oom_seq From: Mark Millard In-Reply-To: <4e12afdc-7bcf-4a25-94b3-fe1562469ed9@gmail.com> Date: Sat, 6 Sep 2025 21:11:54 -0700 Cc: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <05351AB0-7BA7-4130-BBEE-CFB793ACFAB4@yahoo.com> References: <0dbf8c95-7697-4887-a890-335c3ccd80f1@gmail.com> <4e12afdc-7bcf-4a25-94b3-fe1562469ed9@gmail.com> To: Graham Perrin X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3826.700.81) X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US] X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cKGrG6thvz3qPD On Sep 6, 2025, at 19:10, Graham Perrin wrote: > Kubuntu host, VirtualBox guest, pkg 2.2.2, 15.0-PRERELEASE. >=20 > Slow physical storage for the virtual drive: a mobile HDD on USB. >=20 > bsdinstall, ZFS, 8 G swap, pkgbase, all components, then: >=20 > |pkg install --glob 'FreeBSD-kernel-generic-nodebug*'| SIDE NOTE Side notes on future naming for stable/15 and later for 15 for FreeBSD-kernel-* . . . pkgbase is not updating FreeBSD:15:* at this point, not yet tracking changes from the transition to stable/15 . So the below is about futures at this point. I'll note 15.0-ALPHA* and later will use other kernel naming conventions than when it was main, vs. the type of content anyway. It may not provide all the variations that main provided. Under main's kernel package naming (left side) the base names might become like (right side): main =3D=3D=3D>>> stable/15 and later ---- ------------------- kernel-generic could become kernel-generic-debug (might not be = generated) kernel-generic-nodebug will(?) become kernel-generic kernel-minimal will stay unchanged(? debug vs. nodebug content?) kernel-generic-mmccam will stay unchanged(? debug vs. nodebug content?) The actual names in /boot/ also include some renamging vs. the type of content: kernel -> kernel.GENERIC-DEBUG/ (? if it is included) kernel.GENERIC-NODEBUG/ -> kernel/ kernel.MINIMAL/ will stay unchanged (? debug vs. nodebug = content?) kernel.GENERIC-MMCCAM/ will stay unchanged (? debug vs. nodebug = content?) Another potential difference visible via aarch64 (but not via amd64) is conflicts between kernel packages that supply the same file names under the same paths. main had a separate package for the *.dtb files involved for aarch64 (and armv7). stable/15 and later might bundle the *.dtb files in with the kernels. (stable/14 and later are this way --so it does not allow, say, both kernel-generic and kernel-generic-mmccam to be installed at the same time for aarch64.) So, 15 as main allowed aarch64 to have all the kernel's installed at the same time, but stable/14 does not. stable/15 might not. END SIDE NOTE > =3D 568 base packages. >=20 > vm.pageout_oom_seq=3D120 >=20 > After base installation: 1 G memory given to the guest, = GENERIC-NODEBUG, dmesg showed 932 MB avail. So you are saying at this point that the combination for RAM+SWAP inside the VM is: 1 GiByte RAM in VM and 8 GiByte SWAP in that VM as well? If yes, that should have produced a warning about potential mistuning when the Swap Space was enabled during the boot sequnce. The lines would look like: warning: total configured swap ( . . . pages) exceeds maximum = recommended amount ( . . . pages). warning: increase kern.maxswzone or reduce amount of swap. The warning is not explicit about any tradeoffs involved for increasing kern.maxswzone . (Personally, I avoid using combinations that produce the warnings, since I do not have an understanding of the tradeoffs, including for leaving things as the messages report.) For 64-bit systems, having SWAP=3D3.6*RAM normally does not complain. SWAP=3D4*RAM complains. =46rom build to build the point for getting warnings moves some in that range. (This is based on experience, not calculations from what the kernel code does.) 3.6 was picked to have some margin. For 32-bit systems, the factor is notably smaller. > Fetch then install some FreeBSD-ports packages. =46rom = : >=20 > = |drm-kmodfirefoxgitupgothtophw-probekdelsblklynxnanopciutilsplasma6-sddm-k= cmroxtermsddmuclcmdusbutilsvirtualbox-ose-additionsxfcexorg| >=20 > =3D 965 non-base packages installed in 4 minutes, 33 seconds. >=20 > Then, at ttyv3: >=20 > htop >=20 > at ttyv2: >=20 > tail -f -n 0 /var/log/messages >=20 > at ttyv1: >=20 > |/usr/bin/time -h pkg upgrade -fqUy| >=20 > =3D a quiet forced upgrade of all packages, complete in 17 minutes, = 2.62 seconds. >=20 > >=20 > With htop, I observed swap usage sometimes above 2 G. Never 3 or more, = although I did not watch constantly. So, likely: (1+2) GiByte < RAM+MaxSwapUsed < (1+3) GiByte for the context presented. 4 GiByte --or more for allowing for variability or some growth. Note: a draft of pkg 2.3.0 had an Experimental Run and passed. It should avoid contributing to long build times on the official port-package builders. 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[89.241.205.78]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ffacd0b85a97d-3e18537589dsm11363115f8f.54.2025.09.06.23.13.10 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 06 Sep 2025 23:13:10 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2025 07:13:10 +0100 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: pkg upgrade, ZFS, swap on, vm.pageout_oom_seq To: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org References: <0dbf8c95-7697-4887-a890-335c3ccd80f1@gmail.com> <4e12afdc-7bcf-4a25-94b3-fe1562469ed9@gmail.com> <05351AB0-7BA7-4130-BBEE-CFB793ACFAB4@yahoo.com> From: Graham Perrin Content-Language: en-GB Autocrypt: addr=grahamperrin@gmail.com; keydata= xsFNBGKYt7ABEAClu83dJ3ZKfVgPOk9YKRv0Z+dl2b88+k9R4vwAmElgguYdKE7yhnQNhhWM v9vi6AFrBMc2oJdVHJ2OrXfwpELBFIgiSMEWNsC4e+Z3HtSajcl+pFZsP7ciiSoycj/w3wIV kAZoVGbhyIbNG7fbCEJ8q81TbfsGypV3bRmbZVvGNecBguYiooBtz2Qht1p3itXMkIA6P9pS YDl+6QddZLyUUAjAnFv2QDoYSHLnaDUWw4oONZsB0SKVu8jMIBh4uJZoYEOvdvc9jQQdOpA2 CAgA6ulfm42Ikr9lKBUUCtjqiWAhJ7iXOTyHAIdR4Mf8alCE6tdTq6dHdIt+GktTY7oYNyL2 3aD3C7I5waU0SFXvJcOMG10QLfwYQMOQoYQ9XJ0U5A28WYiDcylDdUWT7SappP1e1ZMeJWWO y14mxxNzHaJSI4rK8P/p5tp3Q7SSC4k5gMh9zKba3K2ApCWNbVLGvXsJeQkZZNvu70tE81ey AHI5iZcB6D7WaHysBUmsKaEpbcmm1ZThTnGL0SHEl5to5Jab5Fg6O+Cnly5sVz5lX/v8Aosx kKNei7SCVqXOVtteQeGxWbXWbhPgbMyc0Gi3DuxBI/yvJ43k/rJysQlLGLWfJx/UXprwLluC PDK9EvKEB+fD1Z349uzp1sKr3ihpySbyKI8fpudftnAz4EsoCwARAQABzSZHcmFoYW0gUGVy cmluIDxncmFoYW1wZXJyaW5AZ21haWwuY29tPsLBlAQTAQoAPhYhBFk/5bLDBwftvJcvCrdn SG9KGNQLBQJoRALAAhsDBQkPEg5ABQsJCAcDBRUKCQgLBRYDAgEAAh4FAheAAAoJELdnSG9K GNQL8YkP/2V1z6XQDyG1QlKAu8TuE8zDWy9QQKjC/G44hlu5zk+2kWSNk4zeExs9ZXOBmVhF EW1d+1J8wDiYIeKYj/rqMoP+gb8o0Au0lSRitvTdLxkZBFGMn0CEzlDOzv+wmiy0ggAV/s+Y EbiHk12fI0LoTy5/ywdmG/uGS7M6p3XOrM0YO1qmLXy1cUyYDsYIpq5/rT0QzpGowsJLoEA3 zz1vfKVY+RTorsL4W8ljXLmcs4c3b3HZG9Xmgtt+Ni/eb9CjzM7kCXOcSMnVzvfscCowPAwB 0ZHlNxNV0MTa61xgvOCk4Zf278ArRgbTm4oOz9Z4ciPMnVue+9P/VdxIxgUuYkAryM0+agGz L9bd8ljn+efNtgZ5dlDLrNnTE+vWnMVlMXgl7BNnhwHg7UYFLrC2xklsICub0qpnNheTGeqo 0N4UongJTQJ6H6LEpgd+KMkCncAHghED/G0/BUdO90VEOoqnIKwKa+F9NqVMvHWc8D58mwCP FghsmxK9FM9pnsjLmG7u+s51Y7++GSRnU4NkI4tHiVk7hcAcvZuc0QbUDwVMTurDUgIqRo6W 80j1tFjEspkrwtMoeVFEkDHktjoc3AoEymXIncZfqIqi3nVseyDVyNByvkV0mutX9hXqac0/ RXMuyK9KniAUZ9+gsWs4rPs/DOdsw4K8/RnjduBrfCYQzsFNBGKYt7ABEADRb1tZuh7DPYET 0wK6fe7owbYgM+RfKhmcrGgR2HI9M2q6+0WKF/ITnggWdIW2Ecc4z2boLz/cwvPGCS7/YxZM 61KklGCwuS7q1s04XnHDWHuFxfXQPzAdVmNO3bYoMZbJjHXs6sB2u5ksiwPwaMAWWaGkviSj c5pwvHCiTmX5vH5CBj/Vi+5ESyX38vK4JM5S/m4ouI/6M9biyFgimV+v3vVyCxJCT1gI9g4o GIh1qq5S433b1fihn4yHPf8XOKyBpA/QcwLONViBqJL5nnOxpsh344rNxn2R7CcRzzicOV+e 2IbMem4lwNWQlZKoRotKXZi9LqN5mynSBYqAUdoZum0QinWT9F22B0Qex5PH1zAt9i2W91Vd kcPB3LwkRXj07ycRtsSzpgPA6fLc6AsoWFslHl8kVOO5eJIA4xhjlPa+W8lguQHZ0iX+5uAv 2eAgXR2swADuHPuENNFStmsgAMl8OOOgtq75yA5TpyIzxMuXV9Nmp0VfIaUM/IdLdmxhc1pC c320l5fYMHVLFAReWEbSj2QH8YzWfpXHIegutWWYEbH9SiDXgS9KoKmCJV/Qa+x6/b8y3pOZ vnIbCDaynC2Yr50s8gRa9kb54JE8Z+p8r16U3SEsK3PtUi0RF0e51danCVHrrE6/Hat2XUO/ 6nnYgVgFOrLao6Gh/VMs8wARAQABwsF8BBgBCgAmFiEEWT/lssMHB+28ly8Kt2dIb0oY1AsF AmhEAsACGwwFCQ8SDkAACgkQt2dIb0oY1AvQxw//REWYFK2m4yS/QP5kzfhkWcNqDI/akGT5 /LXmdmbc1s78+mOMXnA4vBY/+X1QatgxWUECkPDOiIwXJMxoBuyY8e7spLRXeyhtfh5aYaJc MO5bARX0c49v+KfZ80u9tG2rkKQvAt/ySo7OXsbDADFFRhlc8RLbb8e7bSctGbYZk9CYa0ya dW5+n3znDNJ6yW1skx9wTH+Y8VlSazRLk3XgXscNqBA2h56v3WS/R5dI++7AQxZxSQacQvfj 9eahq7ATdB4zMQ9MBHEwOvGD3DLlc55FYSDZvNX+mhnK7S0t1Nt2EtGUOmXb5ysMFGnbsce0 woKQ0sLPF1HWDAAf7tBCF8mpPIzU/ViAkupsJ6NYCD0tLFD8pvl0NYU2TjvyWh6ie3e5B/b3 8Daiyme+M92ivfoRQOFKmkPfeT14AI6OW1k7qFbmoIwMWWQdFWAl1CP9hNdF9gRN4rFB0Jy1 90BajZW2zOdVfqdurJZegCzAowZalLm4JEK2MklpPzipibnJqhLOmvJy587pF52KDdM/4rLy BBREIm7uRivnO5k/BY5qS+H/aqv97LC0PVaTsLXbDmTxTnJplUpdlYT9NGidM+x/ioS0iztO Cht7cT8V8jvvKZYvNpst8iqxuIaoV9V7aZ0wAQpkgDGXHmSzwtz6U8xNf/4e4sLn9KPlldSd kvo= In-Reply-To: <05351AB0-7BA7-4130-BBEE-CFB793ACFAB4@yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-1.000]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20230601]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; FREEFALL_USER(0.00)[grahamperrin]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org,freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2a00:1450:4864:20::32d:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cKKWy20SRz3whW On 07/09/2025 05:11, Mark Millard wrote: > On Sep 6, 2025, at 19:10, Graham Perrin wrote: > >> … > … > > So you are saying at this point that the combination for > RAM+SWAP inside the VM is: > > 1 GiByte RAM in VM and 8 GiByte SWAP in that VM as well? Yes. > If yes, that should have produced a warning about potential > mistuning … True. I spent years ignoring the kern.maxswzone warning, partly because I never noticed any adverse effect from ignorance. When set to 16 G on hardware with 32 G RAM, the amount of swap used was sometimes close to the amount available. Today I found the variable in loader_simp(8) under , > … If no value is provided, the system allocates enough memory to > handle an amount of swap that corresponds to eight times the amount of > physical memory present in the system. > > Note that swap metadata can be fragmented, which means that the system > can run out of space before it reaches the theoretical limit.  > Therefore, care should be taken to not configure more swap than > approximately half of the theoretical maximum. > > Running out of space for swap metadata can leave the system in an > unrecoverable state.  Therefore, you should only change this parameter > if you need to greatly extend the KVM reservation for other resources > such as … Without me attempting to perform any calculation: I reckon, I always did well (no unexpected run-out) by _not_ providing a value. 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charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-0.999]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20230601]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; HAS_X_PRIO_FIVE(0.00)[5]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org,freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; FREEFALL_USER(0.00)[grahamperrin]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2a00:1450:4864:20::329:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cKKk70PWWz3xhf > … kern.maxswzone … When set to 16 G … Correction: I mean swap (not kern.maxswzone) set to 16 G. -- I love email. I hate email. I should love it. I should hate it. 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[89.241.205.78]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ffacd0b85a97d-3d978ab6fc7sm22033473f8f.45.2025.09.06.23.35.43 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 06 Sep 2025 23:35:43 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3d91158f-9e4e-4343-ac00-8d3475dbcd26@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2025 07:35:42 +0100 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: pkg upgrade with pkg-devel pkg-2.2.99.2 To: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org References: <0dbf8c95-7697-4887-a890-335c3ccd80f1@gmail.com> <4e12afdc-7bcf-4a25-94b3-fe1562469ed9@gmail.com> <05351AB0-7BA7-4130-BBEE-CFB793ACFAB4@yahoo.com> From: Graham Perrin Content-Language: en-GB X-Priority: 5 (Lowest) Autocrypt: addr=grahamperrin@gmail.com; keydata= xsFNBGKYt7ABEAClu83dJ3ZKfVgPOk9YKRv0Z+dl2b88+k9R4vwAmElgguYdKE7yhnQNhhWM v9vi6AFrBMc2oJdVHJ2OrXfwpELBFIgiSMEWNsC4e+Z3HtSajcl+pFZsP7ciiSoycj/w3wIV kAZoVGbhyIbNG7fbCEJ8q81TbfsGypV3bRmbZVvGNecBguYiooBtz2Qht1p3itXMkIA6P9pS YDl+6QddZLyUUAjAnFv2QDoYSHLnaDUWw4oONZsB0SKVu8jMIBh4uJZoYEOvdvc9jQQdOpA2 CAgA6ulfm42Ikr9lKBUUCtjqiWAhJ7iXOTyHAIdR4Mf8alCE6tdTq6dHdIt+GktTY7oYNyL2 3aD3C7I5waU0SFXvJcOMG10QLfwYQMOQoYQ9XJ0U5A28WYiDcylDdUWT7SappP1e1ZMeJWWO y14mxxNzHaJSI4rK8P/p5tp3Q7SSC4k5gMh9zKba3K2ApCWNbVLGvXsJeQkZZNvu70tE81ey AHI5iZcB6D7WaHysBUmsKaEpbcmm1ZThTnGL0SHEl5to5Jab5Fg6O+Cnly5sVz5lX/v8Aosx kKNei7SCVqXOVtteQeGxWbXWbhPgbMyc0Gi3DuxBI/yvJ43k/rJysQlLGLWfJx/UXprwLluC PDK9EvKEB+fD1Z349uzp1sKr3ihpySbyKI8fpudftnAz4EsoCwARAQABzSZHcmFoYW0gUGVy cmluIDxncmFoYW1wZXJyaW5AZ21haWwuY29tPsLBlAQTAQoAPhYhBFk/5bLDBwftvJcvCrdn SG9KGNQLBQJoRALAAhsDBQkPEg5ABQsJCAcDBRUKCQgLBRYDAgEAAh4FAheAAAoJELdnSG9K GNQL8YkP/2V1z6XQDyG1QlKAu8TuE8zDWy9QQKjC/G44hlu5zk+2kWSNk4zeExs9ZXOBmVhF EW1d+1J8wDiYIeKYj/rqMoP+gb8o0Au0lSRitvTdLxkZBFGMn0CEzlDOzv+wmiy0ggAV/s+Y EbiHk12fI0LoTy5/ywdmG/uGS7M6p3XOrM0YO1qmLXy1cUyYDsYIpq5/rT0QzpGowsJLoEA3 zz1vfKVY+RTorsL4W8ljXLmcs4c3b3HZG9Xmgtt+Ni/eb9CjzM7kCXOcSMnVzvfscCowPAwB 0ZHlNxNV0MTa61xgvOCk4Zf278ArRgbTm4oOz9Z4ciPMnVue+9P/VdxIxgUuYkAryM0+agGz L9bd8ljn+efNtgZ5dlDLrNnTE+vWnMVlMXgl7BNnhwHg7UYFLrC2xklsICub0qpnNheTGeqo 0N4UongJTQJ6H6LEpgd+KMkCncAHghED/G0/BUdO90VEOoqnIKwKa+F9NqVMvHWc8D58mwCP FghsmxK9FM9pnsjLmG7u+s51Y7++GSRnU4NkI4tHiVk7hcAcvZuc0QbUDwVMTurDUgIqRo6W 80j1tFjEspkrwtMoeVFEkDHktjoc3AoEymXIncZfqIqi3nVseyDVyNByvkV0mutX9hXqac0/ RXMuyK9KniAUZ9+gsWs4rPs/DOdsw4K8/RnjduBrfCYQzsFNBGKYt7ABEADRb1tZuh7DPYET 0wK6fe7owbYgM+RfKhmcrGgR2HI9M2q6+0WKF/ITnggWdIW2Ecc4z2boLz/cwvPGCS7/YxZM 61KklGCwuS7q1s04XnHDWHuFxfXQPzAdVmNO3bYoMZbJjHXs6sB2u5ksiwPwaMAWWaGkviSj c5pwvHCiTmX5vH5CBj/Vi+5ESyX38vK4JM5S/m4ouI/6M9biyFgimV+v3vVyCxJCT1gI9g4o GIh1qq5S433b1fihn4yHPf8XOKyBpA/QcwLONViBqJL5nnOxpsh344rNxn2R7CcRzzicOV+e 2IbMem4lwNWQlZKoRotKXZi9LqN5mynSBYqAUdoZum0QinWT9F22B0Qex5PH1zAt9i2W91Vd kcPB3LwkRXj07ycRtsSzpgPA6fLc6AsoWFslHl8kVOO5eJIA4xhjlPa+W8lguQHZ0iX+5uAv 2eAgXR2swADuHPuENNFStmsgAMl8OOOgtq75yA5TpyIzxMuXV9Nmp0VfIaUM/IdLdmxhc1pC c320l5fYMHVLFAReWEbSj2QH8YzWfpXHIegutWWYEbH9SiDXgS9KoKmCJV/Qa+x6/b8y3pOZ vnIbCDaynC2Yr50s8gRa9kb54JE8Z+p8r16U3SEsK3PtUi0RF0e51danCVHrrE6/Hat2XUO/ 6nnYgVgFOrLao6Gh/VMs8wARAQABwsF8BBgBCgAmFiEEWT/lssMHB+28ly8Kt2dIb0oY1AsF AmhEAsACGwwFCQ8SDkAACgkQt2dIb0oY1AvQxw//REWYFK2m4yS/QP5kzfhkWcNqDI/akGT5 /LXmdmbc1s78+mOMXnA4vBY/+X1QatgxWUECkPDOiIwXJMxoBuyY8e7spLRXeyhtfh5aYaJc MO5bARX0c49v+KfZ80u9tG2rkKQvAt/ySo7OXsbDADFFRhlc8RLbb8e7bSctGbYZk9CYa0ya dW5+n3znDNJ6yW1skx9wTH+Y8VlSazRLk3XgXscNqBA2h56v3WS/R5dI++7AQxZxSQacQvfj 9eahq7ATdB4zMQ9MBHEwOvGD3DLlc55FYSDZvNX+mhnK7S0t1Nt2EtGUOmXb5ysMFGnbsce0 woKQ0sLPF1HWDAAf7tBCF8mpPIzU/ViAkupsJ6NYCD0tLFD8pvl0NYU2TjvyWh6ie3e5B/b3 8Daiyme+M92ivfoRQOFKmkPfeT14AI6OW1k7qFbmoIwMWWQdFWAl1CP9hNdF9gRN4rFB0Jy1 90BajZW2zOdVfqdurJZegCzAowZalLm4JEK2MklpPzipibnJqhLOmvJy587pF52KDdM/4rLy BBREIm7uRivnO5k/BY5qS+H/aqv97LC0PVaTsLXbDmTxTnJplUpdlYT9NGidM+x/ioS0iztO Cht7cT8V8jvvKZYvNpst8iqxuIaoV9V7aZ0wAQpkgDGXHmSzwtz6U8xNf/4e4sLn9KPlldSd kvo= In-Reply-To: <05351AB0-7BA7-4130-BBEE-CFB793ACFAB4@yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-1.000]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20230601]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; HAS_X_PRIO_FIVE(0.00)[5]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org,freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; FREEFALL_USER(0.00)[grahamperrin]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2a00:1450:4864:20::334:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cKL1v1FxVz40qZ On 07/09/2025 05:11, Mark Millard wrote: > … a draft of pkg 2.3.0 had an Experimental Run and passed. … I built and installed pkg-devel, marked pkg as vital, then tested: pkg upgrade -fqUy Success, however it's not a particularly meaningful result. As expected: regardless of the mark, --force results in a downgrade from 2.2.99.2 to pkg-2.2.2 from FreeBSD-ports. 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Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID aa45fce0094606119840a6110476b431; Sun, 07 Sep 2025 12:37:57 +0000 (UTC) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3826.700.81\)) Subject: Re: pkg upgrade, ZFS, swap on, vm.pageout_oom_seq From: Mark Millard In-Reply-To: Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2025 05:37:47 -0700 Cc: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <0A68B611-F412-48FB-964B-64C3AB0B4117@yahoo.com> References: <0dbf8c95-7697-4887-a890-335c3ccd80f1@gmail.com> <4e12afdc-7bcf-4a25-94b3-fe1562469ed9@gmail.com> <05351AB0-7BA7-4130-BBEE-CFB793ACFAB4@yahoo.com> To: Graham Perrin X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3826.700.81) X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US] X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cKV3x0cl9z3Qwb On Sep 6, 2025, at 23:13, Graham Perrin wrote: > On 07/09/2025 05:11, Mark Millard wrote: >=20 >> On Sep 6, 2025, at 19:10, Graham Perrin = wrote: >>=20 >>> =E2=80=A6 >=20 >=20 >> =E2=80=A6 >>=20 >> So you are saying at this point that the combination for >> RAM+SWAP inside the VM is: >>=20 >> 1 GiByte RAM in VM and 8 GiByte SWAP in that VM as well? >=20 >=20 > Yes. >=20 >=20 >> If yes, that should have produced a warning about potential >> mistuning =E2=80=A6 >=20 >=20 > True. >=20 > I spent years ignoring the kern.maxswzone warning, partly because I = never noticed any adverse effect from ignorance. When set to 16 G on = hardware with 32 G RAM, the amount of swap used was sometimes close to = the amount available. >=20 > Today I found the variable in loader_simp(8) under = , I'll be more explicit relative to this for how I've taken that text historically. QUOTE kern.maxswzone Limits the amount of KVM to be used to hold swap meta- data, which directly governs the maximum amount of swap the system can support, at the rate of approximately 200 MB of swap space per 1 MB of metadata. This value is specified in bytes of KVA space. If no value is pro- vided, the system allocates enough memory to handle an amount of swap that corresponds to eight times the amount of physical memory present in the system. END QUOTE The TheoreticalMaxSWAP=3D8*PHYSMEM figure is specific to 64-bit contexts, if I understand right. It is smaller for 32-bit contexts as far as I can tell. Certainly the warnings for 32-bit suggest so. QUOTE Note that swap metadata can be fragmented, which means that the system can run out of space before it reaches the theoretical limit. Therefore, care should be taken to not configure more swap than approximately half of the theoretical maximum. END QUOTE So, for 64-bit systems, closer to MaxSWAP=3D4*PHYSMEM. The warning show up at somewhat less than that. I'd guess that the kernel's calculations are the more accurate vs. the above wording. QUOTE Running out of space for swap metadata can leave the sys- tem in an unrecoverable state. Therefore, you should only change this parameter if you need to greatly extend the KVM reservation for other resources such as the buffer cache or kern.ipc.nmbclusters. Modifies kernel option VM_SWZONE_SIZE_MAX. END QUOTE I wonder if "only change the" should be "only increase the", as only that direction would seem to limit the space for buffer cache or kern.ipc.nmbclusters or other such. Either way, I'd take that wording as contradicting the: "increase kern.maxswzone" part of: "warning: increase kern.maxswzone or reduce amount of swap." wording unless one knows that the buffer cache and kern.ipc.nmbclusters and such tradeoffs would be reasonable for the context. I do not have that kind of knowledge about the tradeoffs. Someone once told me that the tradeoff was probability of the kernel deadlocking when trying to manage the resources. I assume that is accurate but do not know it for sure. So, historically I've taken the warning seriously but always via the "reduce amount of swap" part of it. >> =E2=80=A6 If no value is provided, the system allocates enough memory = to handle an amount of swap that corresponds to eight times the amount = of physical memory present in the system. >>=20 >> Note that swap metadata can be fragmented, which means that the = system can run out of space before it reaches the theoretical limit. = Therefore, care should be taken to not configure more swap than = approximately half of the theoretical maximum. >>=20 >> Running out of space for swap metadata can leave the system in an = unrecoverable state. Therefore, you should only change this parameter = if you need to greatly extend the KVM reservation for other resources = such as =E2=80=A6 >=20 >=20 > Without me attempting to perform any calculation: I reckon, I always = did well (no unexpected run-out) by _not_ providing a value. =3D=3D=3D Mark Millard marklmi at yahoo.com From nobody Sun Sep 7 12:59:30 2025 X-Original-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4cKVXx19WRz66xCr for ; Sun, 07 Sep 2025 12:59:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) Received: from sonic310-20.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (sonic310-20.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com [98.137.69.146]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4cKVXw5ghQz3RXY for ; Sun, 07 Sep 2025 12:59:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1757249982; bh=3HW5fmCLVPnr12uMT4PgnpPpZBcUqTBNlJ75/yC06Vk=; h=Subject:From:In-Reply-To:Date:Cc:References:To:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=ZIfQX1GoiCRSTlp7KBEm/pNUl0ekBvA2V5Pv/RqYbqg2m4RCXYEkgjfHCYH2WC3pWTn3MjS9fYByCQELvF246gx0WnWCP/pqK5z6AOZykZqSPIEhkNzwRZM5iMIIOC5hNoPKQM9b8r67WVsNdVIIpIYUP6GuIFH/Ts1HGzU9VH+yHD4k18fh4AOLk/ssJZBAQ6ypZ+duOV8HL3HmEOgY9F88z9YcYEXtBjmsbFPvkunqSCKXh3XQigGmA7nwsDu96y0qFjOm9zCeu5hB4VRYuEdHr5Gm+fTUlOPuvgcaUFTBlsKq10OhZOcloabw+y4sTl57hco9UoHqJo78GviOsw== X-SONIC-DKIM-SIGN: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1757249982; bh=bID5AJig+PzwzefKsfr9eMJ7mve3Z18z480luLPCS8I=; h=X-Sonic-MF:Subject:From:Date:To:From:Subject; b=UkOOjcAdEBv+k3zLCmsT+mlJQ30lPBSWwFa5mnj4g/Jv6ORys0FzfuUZaBxprjqm4bajuu2ifIB+mbKH3KAtx4wrsqm4XI+pykOoKAcGzE666skyQoYLxGYqfretIEjhFh4Dh5OJAgmSgUPilCsUu/4IEWZ5NPOoSiqyzeWKFdn1DHyE/vnAD7m2EEko/+Prz/xN0FcA+w+vQmW7J+WdvfV+CQMZSr5OErB7NpX9FtChhmQeVtL0x/X9qQ0wqsnkkh9nMgid7FUChrMsXwGGWt8wbxfNEr1A7433ZGGKUxn7K0mZJgd/4J7MpAuwziQ7an7UsivwMJz71Zr85mJ7Vg== X-YMail-OSG: nRV3dMkVM1kM751NpXZqHjCHepdS6jyEHwidDK.ss1F_LNV0fP7Etrz4vTIWAXC 45wg3S_MIkYH.mkTQrnlp4AsAa3DeBjqqVdMM5xA0V5QC_lj4q76JwfsgfZg_SQAAhd3jFn9ohjL GsZ.Wm_7t7XBUFmp4OMEZB9fZ2MB3CfhWK.8VrHcz3JPpsWAKOqQlV_Q2KmXkJhCeanHRVNxGxv3 47QenIgeX1UvFZjgJoPXJv4EL81umEMm3GsqWemTjmj637r721_VIBKNt1zIIgRIHVppKy.nxzfE X6rhDs.IXQo5Bfyj88N4kfS6m9Fqa8zAz6ugzCIjHYZOYyTBIl.HKGGOWdduzkgzGMa3chItwRvl 2om3aam.IsAN6V8P.TErzPOVejtAEw90UQBeH.TlhlpqDd7VlRmYUzkhtRt2XnNyaJoZcDMUcppQ IXO1tnGCC1MczDQwGwjYNa_J1SCn_LlrFP.kPguZMKBUzoro55OmpPUZyqdyBQJN6H5LH_qvy8vX TdCO6tWb0Bva1BPxdJ8w1PTEWbk_GmdJBB1YzFcl0n_5qYw5xAwJUG0qF6yfbrBabUMa_H1XknoC dthyQ45WtGsuGaO1YOshTA1txDi9QfmxddG1xR.g__mVA1UpRFDOFh6nOO9nv9TrH0ynWBuCveEV 6XFT0mLhN1As.GJB9G3EEmAEAWcLA8kC5HFTLMvbG0DF.RKYAn9QzAcgLOb6hkQ2uLalEtgVOqer DgmEEMZgSgqcc1AnekZqJ7oDZDCRBbqMc8hI9CfPY_IzUcUQf7Do9FG5oP_gAqyaMDPx21AuWogF dOaP9jTCZZ7AC4tQ_06Pum5qIqvRZagZT31Sknpiwa8nZgEatVpRw5a9E.a8mRtw.SK8br6bGWUY gQnPUDpjwY0yU09CoASpN79RRr.G1T6YWTXg6NXdSjzJJPY3ZDY41gkuDFKoGfdce5msgIy8BfZn JT947EjPZu0lkrzjv.rQ7oirKkMIILsCvow1pw1hvs8flgaSw0Fb0YFnsCGprs.NR8oK7X43sFua Lx_V.bzEbnBoOo0KxhbyE7qa59N.RxjTQhy0NojMfP9lz0.USpu2OA3aKHsonTJxPTk64kmC3efm YXZoVk0u.ay52aWRD.Tajpr5TvI3hJk1zqKRDYV3yN4u8gL3FXBbL6XDtOf9K6bKeoZWmU64mLfx x7aqNwNULxHdwpEAC4DYdGx7GAlIhm5h9Pi0KHKwlSkK.elloepnEMtoFPkjNN3rnJ5wLzqGfKfw 43WxFgFqGGm0QLfemHhkcwyRXe1qH68Be65u5PL3CelG1ySudhrJWR7PFUB.1sugTPGxFkgwNuad tSExp96sXWlKB1CrPKqegMxUFqdHd1hhxOegV538ZcRmmF7XD0QvEO.ducK4nVY3rc4lV1kloNGA YBYTufzMBSFgtZ1g7wjAe2L5c_c_4tpc0EQTA.Rj4hfwXD5MK2uckBz98XN_tUqB_aMxZLQAS_x6 XiZ5frh4DiSdNlQw4hjpUTmeB32sXvom4I5TcdOHMAvP9pW4A7DKlsuDPDnPz7Qmu1HmXtGIfXyF 2mlUxzQhVrw2e5aWMsAAj_rVq0yoAUcaoIi.RimqKMNXCSkQvMI7hQ5cLPVLhNYEQ0mfEkgcjU1c 6VKIoo9URm7eoQQP.7t6R63zIgrHBvEh3rB1I7tGL.JcDKprVOOU4TKtznQbj1ohmU2zzRhuXNTc tc.lo3zOufIJWSOT7balXuv.TrmSNSotWhJDPctJEn5SRkkplusLaaMjbXnCz9klHLNdAb6o36eU FKbqQH42e.V.WgP4268iIKq8xfLbfJQPakeWDXDhzOU4enWRDwdA9He9GFnYo67y06P6hkXMwTZY nHRuCjGwW0mPR2rae.X2GW.vqbKgfBb.ZBDTmdvLQuptmelkEIYAo2nVGXt8V.U50zW4Y_7W19U1 WsLT3h4ojoYBJAxLxphSe8N3B..XbHZNlkxGMPrWLTm_kjyrjcnJ9akZuQ.MpjElV1eOqBkRtXmZ mjIsLmKsQQ9DiULim.5iJGmpYMFvvmrDdpJHX1Y.QxjvCshn2yb8L1cTzTyyLI.j82bRJEtwSbJC 0TGzS9yrxm7mtpBT4EjCNk9uGw2j5Adn1eRc7BHnKMd_VPs_bRCx8.BqY1B4oa1fvzWrWMMlA2xj _r9vWGO4VwaNsINbUVvP9EkOzOooHj8INn2o9wMyqsYLtCj5Lt1AdYF_70r8raDD98wwBcbGizm6 HIzx5tboa6JEIlsK7K6ysvMafvAk- X-Sonic-MF: X-Sonic-ID: fb1e78a3-f5e6-421d-979a-32f0d8ef394a Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic310.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sun, 7 Sep 2025 12:59:42 +0000 Received: by hermes--production-gq1-7bfc77444d-tgvbr (Yahoo Inc. Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 6590b708e9fc8541593de277d2d6f534; Sun, 07 Sep 2025 12:59:41 +0000 (UTC) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3826.700.81\)) Subject: Re: pkg upgrade with pkg-devel pkg-2.2.99.2 From: Mark Millard X-Priority: 5 (Lowest) In-Reply-To: <3d91158f-9e4e-4343-ac00-8d3475dbcd26@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2025 05:59:30 -0700 Cc: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <8804F237-19F6-41F7-B345-39A03D2B1280@yahoo.com> References: <0dbf8c95-7697-4887-a890-335c3ccd80f1@gmail.com> <4e12afdc-7bcf-4a25-94b3-fe1562469ed9@gmail.com> <05351AB0-7BA7-4130-BBEE-CFB793ACFAB4@yahoo.com> <3d91158f-9e4e-4343-ac00-8d3475dbcd26@gmail.com> To: Graham Perrin X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3826.700.81) X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US] X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cKVXw5ghQz3RXY On Sep 6, 2025, at 23:35, Graham Perrin wrote: > On 07/09/2025 05:11, Mark Millard wrote: >> =E2=80=A6 a draft of pkg 2.3.0 had an Experimental Run and passed. = =E2=80=A6 >=20 > I built and installed pkg-devel, marked pkg as vital, then tested: >=20 > pkg upgrade -fqUy >=20 > Success, however it's not a particularly meaningful result. >=20 > As expected: regardless of the mark, --force results in a downgrade = from 2.2.99.2 to pkg-2.2.2 from FreeBSD-ports. Were you using the make variable WITH_PKG=3Ddevel that Mk/bsd.port.mk has: . if ${WITH_PKG} =3D=3D devel PKG_ORIGIN=3D ports-mgmt/pkg-devel . endif For reference: # grep -r "WITH_PKG\>" /usr/ports/ | less /usr/ports/Mk/bsd.port.mk:WITH_PKG?=3D ${WITH_PKGNG} /usr/ports/Mk/bsd.port.mk:. if ${WITH_PKG} =3D=3D devel /usr/ports/Mk/bsd.port.subdir.mk:WITH_PKG=3D yes /usr/ports/ports-mgmt/pkg-devel/Makefile:.if defined(WITH_PKG) /usr/ports/ports-mgmt/pkg-devel/Makefile:.if ${WITH_PKG} !=3D devel /usr/ports/ports-mgmt/pkg-devel/Makefile:IGNORE=3D WITH_PKG is = not defined to 'devel', this version is the devel one /usr/ports/ports-mgmt/pkg/Makefile:.if defined(WITH_PKG) /usr/ports/ports-mgmt/pkg/Makefile:.if ${WITH_PKG} =3D=3D devel /usr/ports/ports-mgmt/pkg/Makefile:IGNORE=3D WITH_PKG is defined to = 'devel', this version is the stable one /usr/ports/CHANGES: Note that WITH_PKGNG is now called WITH_PKG (still = used to define 'devel') Showing disabled but were an example of enablement can be placed: # cat /usr/local/etc/poudriere.d/make.conf #WITH_PKG=3Ddevel =3D=3D=3D Mark Millard marklmi at yahoo.com From nobody Sun Sep 7 13:40:35 2025 X-Original-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4cKWSF1r5Qz66Fsv; Sun, 07 Sep 2025 13:40:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from grahamperrin@gmail.com) Received: from mail-wm1-x32f.google.com (mail-wm1-x32f.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::32f]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "WR4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4cKWSD4MMmz3TYN; Sun, 07 Sep 2025 13:40:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from grahamperrin@gmail.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20230601 header.b="MS/tNwCB"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of grahamperrin@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:4864:20::32f as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=grahamperrin@gmail.com Received: by mail-wm1-x32f.google.com with SMTP id 5b1f17b1804b1-45de64f89a9so797915e9.1; Sun, 07 Sep 2025 06:40:44 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1757252436; x=1757857236; darn=freebsd.org; h=content-transfer-encoding:in-reply-to:autocrypt:content-language :from:references:cc:to:subject:user-agent:mime-version:date :message-id:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=RGjnHe+m1X8lE9Dem9snXnb5DUzgdptTzT3dD9awsB0=; b=MS/tNwCBX5sjODRKQJaSVTCv5QYGTtz3K+QaEB93U5L/mO+e6FrOttaWCosu8uqmKc +tvWmFTlGbdx+gMNaFhSyEv8EXyVt3ZlaOkMtjGrZDKt5RFM8HK3jDydw1kmnR+ViGKM CV3xPEZpO5BtI1owcOHlrsuOkuX0hEkmaM4Lsvig4Q6XaLvGX7H8PuIH8eEEXl0/F0SK iBbe/hGmVk/N/FgudPJ3FbaHmRHRdwn55qroh9S0HJMdN1qfFmCJiNkSEIgPAVO61dT4 7XLq/ChkgfY3M8fngCLGx5vV4YMcq/DacMH3Iyci12GiIC7TscRHX3O73V0LuwQQ7lNt UO5g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1757252436; x=1757857236; h=content-transfer-encoding:in-reply-to:autocrypt:content-language :from:references:cc:to:subject:user-agent:mime-version:date :message-id:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=RGjnHe+m1X8lE9Dem9snXnb5DUzgdptTzT3dD9awsB0=; b=W7WII2cjZptIx9Rw0XvrI4STWYU5eUTNYt7/1tYj1NuHP7KLVXCr6yfr7Fc27lVd+3 L4a2kYUWRFu9nlZx5r6/GENEBvb/rSqm55eAtzPwcW2cA7bYYJ4beCumbzEnuNgMUCzd 8ane4Ql2m29f1Hw6fcCPLEdqaiROjqTKxqzGALKE/xzyRFZW9MWsfpTQhWxpWv/3qtzq xdr3C+D4HWp+tXJfPg+JCCwcN2VcGeEYf2otyBYsKvVcnuE1adMG+5Fi2piUaEklxm5X l7UUzF43a/2Fnz29aTmfKJxcyFVAmWs/AIQ+/7xpFo2TZTR7cc/XxeysQhQSpAfeOrFv h7IA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YzTdfmitr+VCXsU2QD14ASzEtbsapI3O7NdjaunELb3Wk01+Iss PpcRiKiDxb10KgFDntKgQ4es73KDSnueSbHRW4l8BowwnLU9GZFmbeeZZpzfgw== X-Gm-Gg: ASbGnct94Pr1/3boHdDE/DnOpUK5l1XEKgUtz6idtbZY0AIMd5kgOFfmp1gUcI78vFp VTPd/4BSAnkV8U1S1feXoHXQq4uUTxULGnvXVJEhubgfyAIhyijCdR7SrsGrilPQHcekjzAoOUX X1raUF22hMZZjS4zXkTa0wcYgEIVR2aNi3Zk+DkAIni2wk5S1Z0MRoV1D3aWSk9b/3Wvb4IWS/I bM5XAXfcu+J+Pn0Mp1QPuLBZSq9MqPv6j+0gryqv485zBQQFl4Qq9lXO7PLcoC6mUwyCM3tETu/ COb9L3BKJBOOs7r2lM12c/rCbMX1Eds7i90RDH/PsiEvFeSZgOUe+W56NpqUfg/qLP9UCwfbTPN B/uAsXzDcL11cp6R27gVMPcNlKkgTSEJMosXI3fjEqvepSCYhZ+L2khHhO/uW5SkSacCSfA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IGA5vKBJ0rS3vdP7bnT2DVXWmJmuuXQM5CWuju1vPDHhf9GNwrJsNX7WsCexGIC7Yl7qudxhA== X-Received: by 2002:a05:600c:8597:b0:45d:e201:1603 with SMTP id 5b1f17b1804b1-45de20117bdmr17066895e9.15.1757252436084; Sun, 07 Sep 2025 06:40:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.1.4] (host-89-241-205-78.as13285.net. [89.241.205.78]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ffacd0b85a97d-3e1a31c69e4sm12235500f8f.44.2025.09.07.06.40.35 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 07 Sep 2025 06:40:35 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <6689ef6e-d2d8-4771-8c56-b446e3de0f4a@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2025 14:40:35 +0100 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: pkg upgrade with pkg-devel pkg-2.2.99.2 To: freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org References: <0dbf8c95-7697-4887-a890-335c3ccd80f1@gmail.com> <4e12afdc-7bcf-4a25-94b3-fe1562469ed9@gmail.com> <05351AB0-7BA7-4130-BBEE-CFB793ACFAB4@yahoo.com> <3d91158f-9e4e-4343-ac00-8d3475dbcd26@gmail.com> <8804F237-19F6-41F7-B345-39A03D2B1280@yahoo.com> From: Graham Perrin Content-Language: en-GB X-Priority: 5 (Lowest) Autocrypt: addr=grahamperrin@gmail.com; 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charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.96 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.96)[-0.964]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36:c]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20230601]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; HAS_X_PRIO_FIVE(0.00)[5]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org,freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; FREEFALL_USER(0.00)[grahamperrin]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2a00:1450:4864:20::32f:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4cKWSD4MMmz3TYN On 07/09/2025 13:59, Mark Millard wrote: > On Sep 6, 2025, at 23:35, Graham Perrin wrote: > >> On 07/09/2025 05:11, Mark Millard wrote: >>> … a draft of pkg 2.3.0 had an Experimental Run and passed. … >> I built and installed pkg-devel, marked pkg as vital, then tested: >> >> pkg upgrade -fqUy >> >> Success, however it's not a particularly meaningful result. >> >> As expected: regardless of the mark, --force results in a downgrade from 2.2.99.2 to pkg-2.2.2 from FreeBSD-ports. > Were you using the make variable WITH_PKG=devel … Yes. Without it, make stops. From nobody Sun Sep 7 16:36:12 2025 X-Original-To: pkgbase@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4cKbLj3mCYz66S37 for ; Sun, 07 Sep 2025 16:36:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: from mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org (mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:3]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org", Issuer "R12" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4cKbLj2xbLz3mB5 for ; Sun, 07 Sep 2025 16:36:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1757262973; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=jFCBnAILTq6jWYHFYHQ9POHLG0v1CtXCw4sp7DEwdd0=; b=MuAH2pOamok+ZVBby0PysSLpnTF00GxIf05G+tsBZc2u7Eop6vE/cQsC5j5GZf1IkdYMa9 W9WNowWC8pdlxw2tg7NNB/HFFEHjgJ6zws7YYibpz1Cy5pkCDPZALaFWVK+g23H25iWTzu 00j8VWsfBAZmUThsZ9R3k30TMFpCufuxJUyoDri1flHiMJElV94X0paZig6LbC48bFtsTC r+dZ380yMqbkTkMVkaLiYtoqoKT1QAobpEzb8xAeqAHiv0Hr2m2ud8YG1tyRsZSqNn/uHA zWJhLy5rc0kn9KONNpo0oAHqx9/6V6NK19u6VEbXJTEfC2NKMGUrJQhuA4Rctw== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1757262973; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=jFCBnAILTq6jWYHFYHQ9POHLG0v1CtXCw4sp7DEwdd0=; b=JqdhDW5KKtplFaUPg7Arh7KXTDxyFoLhycGflJFz4IMHZ3girmRV4vwvSt1QW6gzSPqCpL mIS5ZJwQwGogkXgvJGeRvvkFFyl4kr320IB4cVjGxmO+EEYGSrcFlNPZQMmEA2Xz93KlAL 7uLU/0GdjoA1v3VJb9eivgiSAgQptWVrKgKZZOc+BujkePbAI0t8W9TMRNTPGR7N4cfbs8 hzv14pnpGDjjq3udCSoHErm90+GjMEEMWq4nHP0aJc8bkctmS7AN3Jtts7lFW3eLqfk0ML PEmVWJsjlBYp1jXEJSlgYANmjimZFCodfav21sRPudp1fntTNClyWOqGzULzeQ== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1757262973; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=kqIFoxRpeIfHJAeu6VZ2nVG9nW73GWdCOiv62ZsIKJewjwaw1Ql2VH4vb5lTILau3N/6g8 KLbd2rnxU1skai43nWET3OcbwNrY9Y4cenhEbN3LqeKV7Z5WUwpP0RuKpVZpg5TL/seFE6 FzAh5gGhRJ2ly8/ytru0jYaQK5WvZM3pFF/MwZOS/udaqyNS/Q7DqfYYa75FzLSOl6w3n+ vq30TdeVdfwJRwOje5KShQA9QZZiYrDUkidYprF55laMzUBtBJkmCqm5+/Zv9JiBJat1VF V5U+aVxaalUt49ufPJlPL/NjApTfkMKwe5vF7TsQpOiOy87Py+pccyZO4PWqag== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: from kenobi.freebsd.org (kenobi.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::50:1d]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mxrelay.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4cKbLj2HRvzCDZ for ; Sun, 07 Sep 2025 16:36:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: from kenobi.freebsd.org ([127.0.1.5]) by kenobi.freebsd.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id 587GaDXw075107 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 2025 16:36:13 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) Received: (from www@localhost) by kenobi.freebsd.org (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id 587GaD3q075106 for pkgbase@FreeBSD.org; Sun, 7 Sep 2025 16:36:13 GMT (envelope-from bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org) X-Authentication-Warning: kenobi.freebsd.org: www set sender to bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org using -f From: bugzilla-noreply@freebsd.org To: pkgbase@FreeBSD.org Subject: [Bug 281889] add pkgbase meta-packages for easier usage Date: Sun, 07 Sep 2025 16:36:12 +0000 X-Bugzilla-Reason: AssignedTo X-Bugzilla-Type: changed X-Bugzilla-Watch-Reason: None X-Bugzilla-Product: Base System X-Bugzilla-Component: misc X-Bugzilla-Version: 14.1-RELEASE X-Bugzilla-Keywords: pkgbase X-Bugzilla-Severity: Affects Some People X-Bugzilla-Who: grahamperrin@gmail.com X-Bugzilla-Status: New X-Bugzilla-Resolution: X-Bugzilla-Priority: --- X-Bugzilla-Assigned-To: pkgbase@FreeBSD.org X-Bugzilla-Flags: X-Bugzilla-Changed-Fields: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: References: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Bugzilla-URL: https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/ Auto-Submitted: auto-generated List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=3D281889 --- Comment #2 from Graham Perrin --- =E2=9A=99 D52412 packages: Add meta-package sets > Add several metapackages =E2=80=93 --=20 You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug.=