From nobody Mon Mar 30 18:00:04 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fkzYW20sNz6XB17 for ; Mon, 30 Mar 2026 18:00:15 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gperciva@tarsnap.com) Received: from mail.tarsnap.com (mail.tarsnap.com [54.86.246.204]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 4fkzYV273xz3ls3 for ; Mon, 30 Mar 2026 18:00:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gperciva@tarsnap.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=tarsnap.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of gperciva@tarsnap.com designates 54.86.246.204 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=gperciva@tarsnap.com Received: (qmail 30893 invoked from network); 30 Mar 2026 18:00:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO localhost) (127.0.0.1) by mail.tarsnap.com with SMTP; 30 Mar 2026 18:00:13 -0000 Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2026 11:00:04 -0700 From: Graham Percival To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-git-weekly@tarsnap.com Cc: Colin Percival Subject: FreeBSD Git Weekly 2026-03-23 to 2026-03-29 Message-ID: List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.63 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.999]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.93)[-0.930]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[tarsnap.com,none]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:54.86.246.204/32]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:14618, ipnet:54.86.0.0/16, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[54.86.246.204:from]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MISSING_XM_UA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fkzYV273xz3ls3 X-Spamd-Bar: --- Hi all, I'm happy to announce FreeBSD git weekly for 2026-03-23 -- 2026-03-29: https://freebsd-git-weekly.tarsnap.net/2026-03-23.html It's a list of the 144 commits in that week, split into categories. Highlighted commits: - routing: Retire ROUTE_MPATH compile option "Highlighted" commits are selected automatically if a commit modifies UPDATING, or if the commit message contains a "Relnotes:" line. If you think that another commit should be highlighted, let me know and I'm happy to make it so. To see all reports: https://freebsd-git-weekly.tarsnap.net/ This work is funded by cperciva@ and Tarsnap Backup Inc. Cheers, - Graham Percival From nobody Tue Mar 31 00:01:10 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fl7Yz346Kz6WLHV; Tue, 31 Mar 2026 00:01:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from salvadore@freebsd.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:6074::16:84]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "freefall.freebsd.org", Issuer "R13" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fl7Yz0xkCz3V5R; Tue, 31 Mar 2026 00:01:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from salvadore@freebsd.org) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1774915271; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc; bh=Cxk+4NdWUDAIQIsJFd2A1fNhjXTf/Gxm7OoCUBNU8po=; b=vzoKUzmw1/z33sr0nfDxJ+zR9IoLJ9TmxF8ml7rxunpLl2z4yvUj5JTTtnpqbWtp18qopA 3mVlop75sJz5jzKFeR+XS/1uJVT8HMPHpUKIcmiZH1TcHYxthPJ/e2CYpUZutYLmg3NDaK jlQyySdIqLfu4Yc0lsTu6KcRuo0WS3TtZ1C6mTaYr1SG5QpLDlRoCJuXOoqHOoghp0wLeN UOBgrvclMEGmfvQX6Uqmd5TzCD49wpwpqpoNK/MTudYS9FUL5ekl9hPbjXYdyKMnyYR3Pf ipBKit8R+/AgyxSrb7T6V3dKTVjKF8JNCLw1J9YbmTywE3sLi9iLlf0lxi2wkg== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1774915271; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=NbhZFBsZyPHliwt5alIlzOyAB5x4XRjVEztRwfACjFO5ySTq0awyccx8zU7KY0X9e5OqRx /fU12P72rE09beExQmmb8EAQjifqBe3VMhM+Zb5aasmV2a4IatqfL7PZ7PW/9GuSBzK2RR cWLDDSqvcCQV63F/zJTEJEQZiZWFLajhT4fEcyTueuanZeaKjysVuUVDkV7bw7C8GVdA8i VszrKMrLay6YDhmUWoVAlZSOExacc7B3YT79JkOVIyoukgUXWcNCTZ0ItMY592Z7+cPnIp Lu+GmqDUlC7NQkKY+2AOj60lyJ6k41dTiQxx013n5vyUjwrARE+GT0VWWFiAQQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1774915271; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc; bh=Cxk+4NdWUDAIQIsJFd2A1fNhjXTf/Gxm7OoCUBNU8po=; b=y28pG0MGWFR+T8VuJskIVpbd+c4QLjSGjN87fYuWUfeFLMr8qRPixMpK58uxYzLjkrDIyy eiiIgQ67JnQZPm9UZeg/5I3wHQCzhL8EBZor9Rhi2wHcfoEZghhNKpV6NzlJ1ebreTJgzw Rpf1K54SIw1IPFmdfHpH8rjH6ik30kRhxY2OHC1XN5GmUrMpxQJ1ipVr+CXKh0Vo5iH6jN STHTPQxaB+aDrCqliqd9roM/74OEtlElpOvy1tDaZwK0PwWj1OfnBvDwMtXUvWG5nG/kDl IfGOppFcGNF9zIovcEOKM9D1z6WA2j11wZV4hPoUWDgDwNB/F4UCOlsqmjXHvg== Received: by freefall.freebsd.org (Postfix, from userid 1472) id E454611106; Tue, 31 Mar 2026 00:01:10 +0000 (UTC) To: freebsd-status-calls@FreeBSD.org Subject: [LAST OFFICIAL REMINDER] Call for 2026Q1 status reports Cc: freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org,freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org,devsummit@FreeBSD.org,secretary@asiabsdcon.org Message-Id: <20260331000110.E454611106@freefall.freebsd.org> Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2026 00:01:10 +0000 (UTC) From: Lorenzo Salvadore List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org Dear FreeBSD Community, The deadline for the next FreeBSD Status Report update is April, 14th 2026 for work done since the last round of quarterly reports: January 2026 - March 2026. Status report submissions do not need to be very long. They may be about anything happening in the FreeBSD project and community, and they provide a great way to inform FreeBSD users and developers about work that is underway or has been completed. Report submissions are not limited to committers; anyone doing anything interesting and FreeBSD related can -- and should -- write one! The following methods are available to submit your reports: * submit a review on Phabricator and add the group "status" to the reviewers list. You should put your reports in the directory doc/website/content/en/status/report-2026-01-2026-03/ (create it if it is missing); * submit a pull request at . You should put your reports in the directory doc/website/content/en/status/report-2026-01-2026-03/ (create it if it is missing); * send an email to status-submissions@FreeBSD.org including your report. An AsciiDoc template is available at . We look forward to seeing your 2026Q1 reports! 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Tue, 31 Mar 2026 09:25:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Philip Paeps To: Graham Perrin Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 504 gateway time-outs (was: FYI: The elapsed time shown for beefy24 [main-amd64] and beefy23 [150amd64-default] stopped over 2hrs ago) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2026 21:25:44 +0800 X-Mailer: MailMate (2.0r6290) Message-ID: <5739E595-8A9F-4968-BA58-8D32F9E7E1C1@freebsd.org> In-Reply-To: <1895ba62-b069-4e28-a910-6c666703ee8e@gmail.com> References: <1895ba62-b069-4e28-a910-6c666703ee8e@gmail.com> List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 2026-02-28 19:32:35 (+0800), Graham Perrin wrote: > On 28/02/2026 10:32, Mark Millard wrote: >> The following got "504 Gateway Time-out" when I tried them: >> >> >> >> > > Both somewhat slow to load, however they do load for me. I only just noticed this thread, sorry for resurrecting it. I've noticed that beefy23 and beefy24 (2x EPYC 9254, 512G RAM) sometimes = get too busy building to schedule nginx (or sshd). They eventually = manage to plough through. Usually. That causes the 504 timeouts if you're going through pkg-status.f.o. If = you're going directly to beefyX.chi.freebsd.org you'll just get a = timeout. They're running exactly the same poudriere.conf as the other builders. = I wonder if our calc_builders() function that tries to assign about 12G = per builder isn't quite right for this particular configuration of cores = and RAM. I haven't had a chance to look closely. As far as I can tell the builds = do eventually succeed. If the only problem is "I can't obsessively poll = pkg-status in real time", it's not a very high priority. :) This is on my list. It's just a VERY long list. :) Philip From nobody Tue Mar 31 19:37:30 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fldgV3SY6z6Wt2C for ; Tue, 31 Mar 2026 19:37:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) Received: from sonic302-22.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (sonic302-22.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com [98.137.68.148]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fldgT6MPxz3Jh8 for ; Tue, 31 Mar 2026 19:37:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1774985854; bh=QxkSPIcHvIqjyXeTXPbTc65fRG35/LS8MoxGkfIgLEE=; h=Date:Subject:To:Cc:References:From:In-Reply-To:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=p95Zspn+QBpCrSRfdm6fLM2LjQtiosJq3mwcAlOX8WMIB6A4zAoazcAdnQtLvhWR+iEZ3mExzj/0E/vgjKzQlgEMJVO/D1VVbGDiq5Piv+BJY+kTSDO7E6eQVH7TRqSlaoBfD7S8Dvpf85PL6hnBC9ySDwWONbbRza65wH9LYQt9Vzmgmre+Y9UsioZ3xmf4qgc5qQ5kE5lI3nzeJsxD5Enq6vcZfDnNTTCJ1vHbJ8l4Z845MnSYMNpKxMrvvvGeMsszHTTg+miu+pLfof2Z/k5e3yP8TyoeqUDPFPVPL2X6y5N9hU6GlnQy9LsjewPc8Tu9YKh2dYqMAO6MAsVPdw== X-SONIC-DKIM-SIGN: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1774985854; bh=D9SL/b9GujVyb8Sru9/Jit+trwc3zhGHMl2D3V6LAYO=; h=X-Sonic-MF:Date:Subject:To:From:From:Subject; b=Y0H+mrP8tzNkpjrEP2mccv2ZQYnCdU5hP46pSfoV+IONymXpHFCPLUe+N+tdUYqg7zfwV3G2H5gU4gD5h73D1dS3hnAZdjlJmalaqfVAAnsAJe7muFlPnx+spWVBsoKH3jCvRMP+T1Ov13Cnra/uUY7IqbTD/COIKFI5gWcQm5na0CPfrHT+zcmq69AZwPv1Ds4wQhkMS+0hcTdSdnmc0uIQGVnx67+S2/z45ry+LFX0UZh+SwQC4SY2EoBQePuvL5QbN+q49l3qwf8kYiuxdi6+0P2muqr9P1eLugtmX4+Le5qPYFHclBOhg3e4qKFGOILz9bwnoSZUSvFKjn706w== X-YMail-OSG: svlzJ4MVM1nrU_3.pCnb2aWIDQSRqSZ09X.QsD62G.fK903VTo03iDh3XnUl4HU aTLujoxP0P2tpRoDEZHBKrVYQxNk9F0Y51PZ.wEsfsL.TCW_e4Q3.AEqXvhFbwPbjbOksK8hEjF4 7j7VdByRc2Y2sk0S9xZCnD8VIdwt56L_n3LS09nmg_b6hZPS.FJjvPjXC9XWb.lGmyW9LbzxHufv L897NgOCptSrZxoEb9PM0UZKXbFLPzAccmmB51vnmVQhSCzN_dOPE2UxrgSh3brpGr8PTX552tZv zUSwik6aFR1XnXlju4jT2qM0RMUuZajTjDqbx4MYN3393HQT62NejmxGFdvqhWlaMcfVuu.94NZD sLVLUtc8NpOHEzE7FH0LjKKw301aYItzkCEFbly8JeUHspC0h1r9wJao6j5l7y7IiHCR1wNNMNwI EsNUCrz0dSTXO8MFcMQYpJG7sHI7YbFIHL_hG5cbjCnWP1zCxVPGcChxc8mPZIvMSy5IsB59cZxW CNHFL8rJMslGjhxtoWA3nlgyviIpXCLTaDO134KhcudaPETG1yAMxLW7j80j.hOm92_fmzbSAff5 hsOCwQ1ywlgUKrRk1qWcJUHFExXl60WGz3VINZmHz17FUbOA2gBPn6p90HqozhA3_aiPkfE601CI 79dJi_9f9MxOyb2wnc5rYeAGh5wRPumq4y3WOa9Fc1yUXijvqd.0Fcemzgq23AzLImTlJIYI2h1F s4uI3J.5TTRhVJOPXlBePnHXTHPrnkx_A_tvi_IRca52d_lhBmG.QgDcqWOWYzFSnApTygFjKm1d 178D.xuvmmIO.xUUd1aSU8ZlOPIlSM2e15Qiiv3jsPmaLqKTblVImcMLEIiEVIhC6XgAJvBGVdx4 oqhsUifUtwZfinJmfoEQsVDPf3ZQRqp.10o9JvHoZhEY95xZ5USTDFjVYerOElzY_KmSITTX2OG4 KfBJvZNcnsLYA18JLiURKQyqmBv70pJRkO4tjZWUIyyktxDOV1d6vZGFq2sVfUSR.TKRfnBW.c2p 4gJAt7Zg1MLDdgxs4bdNn77MfGZ7P1r0wFm5pcstZXQn2MklFxnsd8PLqyq2mew4IbowkbnHw_pm _sjFMxqCZWlX4s4qgV1_.RMJB_cLbiR3_wgytzQkiq4RURatXyfZis43_gpW48rK0OxVJG5N52Ux MJskiwwkd97gBqUSjQM3E5Eu6xwKwEXuFas15.OjQ8pxNSyaZhyZq.3.UpNFXNPb60oknY012Uz0 B7XDoMPl0Srvu7t6LGkqfSjG1ETiTOd9f5tnoVWaGXh4HkrTk4p0GjtRPO903Aa1EWQmumz9KGew EZdK8dF1LdS4ZCBKvslqD_VKJDRBm_WbT16WRS_3_b3v4iXvz6fu142sr9fIb8NZT9QGEJUJrKIK 7DbZZzM86Rzgm.52ZLjwLJWWs_QOyR0asjI4p2Q.vYI_85jeBtE5CiCmggKBr8yvv58nwl_sL2g0 .clMHY6gcvEgVqK_uN0DeU14yDufddsepm9anMGjVKPCu3rSZVC61zYEknXlGutJlGXJxPjRDfce CvfxFbQK9Ptx3kzoJVDNotuT7zmsCId.W_PV1q0eH4x8f_JSd3FR5aEFQiwWCXzOVDK7i.5MK41N euA_J7PDJfasxXXRJA0YGXykCusyevC9vP.nSdMCRNkhhBRfQ7zEcSIbB1tTUwvXx1gAohC.mBlj TovctqvkbdTpMl56J32_X3GqPxf3dzvqz48_2jK.19OFbg0kgXFDPtGHLG4dBcTMXT_9Meq5nDBi 7TdrmnLjfd4YH.f7AwKspqYHzhfIXaZD4ihx1OZ7vQEjOQQGpwD854yEU4moXGRqqSI0DKDISR3U ak_3ag6ax2xzxg5Wz9bIi5I3UJyJ1shYJsibPAt9ZjnntqyXuzNN7Oo5_034hP7DCXYO1t8CJoxk g2GR4QthMArQiSDnhT2ajGFBLkpUomlmH6ECk2jGK7lQA.5hwHIRh2GgF68RoDoh3n5WaUDWZGi2 M2I4.c6BDKfvwX_mmCHHErb_ORsyC_J5f2O16nmne4hgG1za0QW25AhYtjgCRH0AQsFxj59HacZ9 6nQqel6GjZj3BjbYmW6UvK6z_vH4D5p2kS7d5LQu3VR3WvcWgtJFN2ZLppW5RGMP6xmZnR93V9n5 B738vch_CNy5IzNZ0Ux__mw_kRyeNuDk30qWnioSSnzx1nR41mXMRDVBv5n2adJvVua.RvQoPVuw OtWQN6gj5xLxeL5jVdXXAs4vGCnt2VWTbRRRrX5XT_zd8c_jEpmDMhqRtNsXT1xhpNTApd2PfHtR o5TCi1F_Xul1wJ0oZWO7Pe6lFH5FpsrhBXE.62Kmzq__8WkCPshKD X-Sonic-MF: X-Sonic-ID: 8b293745-acc6-4f41-a2e9-ff92a2c579f7 Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic302.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Tue, 31 Mar 2026 19:37:34 +0000 Received: by hermes--production-gq1-6dfcf9f8b-w5q67 (Yahoo Inc. Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 5ede8c9cfac5746fe6bfe4914734883e; Tue, 31 Mar 2026 19:37:31 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <632811c3-8661-4c07-8267-c9830a0be92b@yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2026 12:37:30 -0700 List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: 504 gateway time-outs To: Philip Paeps , Graham Perrin Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-stable@freebsd.org References: <1895ba62-b069-4e28-a910-6c666703ee8e@gmail.com> <5739E595-8A9F-4968-BA58-8D32F9E7E1C1@freebsd.org> Content-Language: en-US From: Mark Millard In-Reply-To: <5739E595-8A9F-4968-BA58-8D32F9E7E1C1@freebsd.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.25449 mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fldgT6MPxz3Jh8 X-Spamd-Bar: ---- On 3/31/26 06:25, Philip Paeps wrote: > On 2026-02-28 19:32:35 (+0800), Graham Perrin wrote: >> On 28/02/2026 10:32, Mark Millard wrote: >>> The following got "504 Gateway Time-out" when I tried them: >>> >>> >> amd64-default&build=pdf4f957ea181_s178d0b5b8d> >>> >>> >> mastername=150amd64-default&build=df4f957ea181> >> >> Both somewhat slow to load, however they do load for me. > > I only just noticed this thread, sorry for resurrecting it. > > I've noticed that beefy23 and beefy24 (2x EPYC 9254, 512G RAM) sometimes > get too busy building to schedule nginx (or sshd).  They eventually > manage to plough through.  Usually. > > That causes the 504 timeouts if you're going through pkg-status.f.o.  If > you're going directly to beefyX.chi.freebsd.org you'll just get a timeout. > > They're running exactly the same poudriere.conf as the other builders.  > I wonder if our calc_builders() function that tries to assign about 12G > per builder isn't quite right for this particular configuration of cores > and RAM. > > I haven't had a chance to look closely.  As far as I can tell the builds > do eventually succeed.  If the only problem is "I can't obsessively poll > pkg-status in real time", it's not a very high priority. :) It is mostly not having a clue about the distinction between "the overall build failed somehow, such as by the builder system crashing" and "you just can not observe anything now but the system is still". I was explicitly asked to not send in notes about potential failure symptoms so I no longer add to the clusteradm workload in such cases. [I do wonder if those builders are, over significant times, page-thrashing or anything else that might suggest mis-tuning to the point that the overall builds take notably longer. I do expect load averages generally larger than the FreeBSD count of cpus for keeping overall elapsed times smaller: otherwise there is likely unused idle time not put to useful work. But that wording ignores issues like page-thrashing consequences that can be involved for too much RMA+SWAP resource intensive activity in parallel if some mutual exclusion of huge builders is not prevented.] > > This is on my list.  It's just a VERY long list. :) Yep. > > Philip > > Thanks for the notes. -- === Mark Millard marklmi at yahoo.com From nobody Tue Mar 31 20:44:49 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4flg9H20nVz6Y1lW for ; Tue, 31 Mar 2026 20:45:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) Received: from sonic303-25.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (sonic303-25.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com [98.137.64.206]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4flg9G5Hm7z3Wpc for ; 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Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 2298e56d28d490b1fcd2334c165f1a45; Tue, 31 Mar 2026 20:44:50 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <78579d41-41bf-4532-bfce-bf1fa71912d9@yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2026 13:44:49 -0700 List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: 504 gateway time-outs From: Mark Millard To: Philip Paeps , Graham Perrin Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-stable@freebsd.org References: <1895ba62-b069-4e28-a910-6c666703ee8e@gmail.com> <5739E595-8A9F-4968-BA58-8D32F9E7E1C1@freebsd.org> <632811c3-8661-4c07-8267-c9830a0be92b@yahoo.com> Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: <632811c3-8661-4c07-8267-c9830a0be92b@yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.25449 mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-0.996]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[yahoo.com,reject]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[freebsd.org,gmail.com]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com:dkim]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[98.137.64.206:from]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[98.137.64.206:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4flg9G5Hm7z3Wpc X-Spamd-Bar: --- On 3/31/26 12:37, Mark Millard wrote: > On 3/31/26 06:25, Philip Paeps wrote: >> On 2026-02-28 19:32:35 (+0800), Graham Perrin wrote: >>> On 28/02/2026 10:32, Mark Millard wrote: >>>> The following got "504 Gateway Time-out" when I tried them: >>>> >>>> >>> amd64-default&build=pdf4f957ea181_s178d0b5b8d> >>>> >>>> >>> mastername=150amd64-default&build=df4f957ea181> >>> >>> Both somewhat slow to load, however they do load for me. >> >> I only just noticed this thread, sorry for resurrecting it. >> >> I've noticed that beefy23 and beefy24 (2x EPYC 9254, 512G RAM) sometimes >> get too busy building to schedule nginx (or sshd).  They eventually >> manage to plough through.  Usually. >> >> That causes the 504 timeouts if you're going through pkg-status.f.o.  If >> you're going directly to beefyX.chi.freebsd.org you'll just get a timeout. >> >> They're running exactly the same poudriere.conf as the other builders.  >> I wonder if our calc_builders() function that tries to assign about 12G >> per builder isn't quite right for this particular configuration of cores >> and RAM. >> >> I haven't had a chance to look closely.  As far as I can tell the builds >> do eventually succeed.  If the only problem is "I can't obsessively poll >> pkg-status in real time", it's not a very high priority. :) > > It is mostly not having a clue about the distinction between "the > overall build failed somehow, such as by the builder system crashing" > and "you just can not observe anything now but the system is still". > > I was explicitly asked to not send in notes about potential failure > symptoms so I no longer add to the clusteradm workload in such cases. > > [I do wonder if those builders are, over significant times, > page-thrashing or anything else that might suggest mis-tuning to the > point that the overall builds take notably longer. I do expect load > averages generally larger than the FreeBSD count of cpus for keeping > overall elapsed times smaller: otherwise there is likely unused idle > time not put to useful work. But that wording ignores issues like > page-thrashing consequences that can be involved for too much RMA+SWAP > resource intensive activity in parallel if some mutual exclusion of huge > builders is not prevented.] I will say that, for being able to check the build status of specific packages from prior builds that have completed, I'm not a fan that those type of checks are sometimes blocked by "504 timeouts" for unrelated activity. It is more obvious for a bulk run that is in progress. (But that should not establish any significant priority status overall.) [Prompted/reminded by trying to answer a question in a way that involved the status of xfce4-desktop in fairly recently completed builds: I hit the "504" issue and could not check the status of such.] Use of https://portsfallout.com/server related activity does not report on skipped or ignored, only failed. It never indicates that any specific builds actually were completed successfully vs. skipped/ignored. > >> >> This is on my list.  It's just a VERY long list. :) > > Yep. > >> >> Philip >> >> > > Thanks for the notes. > -- === Mark Millard marklmi at yahoo.com From nobody Wed Apr 1 17:13:17 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmBLR4DL9z6Y94H for ; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 17:09:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd@www.zefox.net) Received: from www.zefox.net (www.zefox.net [50.1.20.27]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "pelorus.zefox.org", Issuer "pelorus.zefox.org" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmBLQ0xLJz454j for ; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 17:09:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd@www.zefox.net) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of fbsd@www.zefox.net has no SPF policy when checking 50.1.20.27) smtp.mailfrom=fbsd@www.zefox.net Received: from www.zefox.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by www.zefox.net (8.18.1/8.18.1) with ESMTPS id 631HDI0Q095926 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Wed, 1 Apr 2026 10:13:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fbsd@www.zefox.net) Received: (from fbsd@localhost) by www.zefox.net (8.18.1/8.18.1/Submit) id 631HDI3C095925; Wed, 1 Apr 2026 10:13:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fbsd) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2026 10:13:17 -0700 From: bob prohaska To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Cc: bob prohaska Subject: Etcupdate runtime has more than doubled....Why? Message-ID: List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.07 / 15.00]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.99)[-0.986]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.98)[-0.984]; MID_RHS_WWW(0.50)[]; WWW_DOT_DOMAIN(0.50)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7065, ipnet:50.1.16.0/20, country:US]; MISSING_XM_UA(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[zefox.net]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[no SPF record] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fmBLQ0xLJz454j X-Spamd-Bar: / For some time now I've been using etcupdate on a self-hosting armv7 (RPi2) system. Lately, the runtime for etcupdate after a world/kernel update from source has seemingly more than doubled. It used to take less than one hour, now it's past two hours and not done yet. The last process is a series of c++ processes which take most of the added time. Apart from tracking -current the machine doesn't do much, but I didn install a /usr/ports directory recently though it's only been used to build named. The slowdown in etcupdate seems to have appeared following that change. Might the addition of a ports tree have increased etcupdate's run time, and is there in any case some housecleaning that will speed it up? Thanks for reading, bob prohaska From nobody Wed Apr 1 17:14:54 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmBSJ3F1Hz6Y9R0 for ; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 17:14:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dim@FreeBSD.org) Received: from smtp.freebsd.org (smtp.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::24b:4]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.freebsd.org", Issuer "R13" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmBSJ14BDz46LL; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 17:14:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dim@FreeBSD.org) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1775063696; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=uzpsnN9C1iNTWrmPOS69ZKjVyZjZI7TLXQyUWonWVuY=; b=sWjfL1saVMjmh34lyPka23Zd7Jalk4r8WHaMwbgS/VHgSMcWdBYO8A2KKctlGuwOg19itd PuL/8ls/7jZVEAFjjhoS0XZuXmQM4c6atTXmV83kq/DlXTL4HJpmgjU1Z5nbVCq+RYt+pu Ik5YhZEUxohoszm8gNKuZLqB8+BLTs+PA0QpvvFPVVO+Bl6siBAPMXTSYXg0B0RMfHEznH W6C4B5aw1ncgrE5ZYDkTI1MWRJgFcuaN2RpWP1D1pKY/O+SsLcPsZpuw0pvOB13FA2IUQ5 GWvVgTJCaWCYbF3OKUT6k9jaTaFgs7lQXJacm9R6AmSqmm7h695EQ2OqQDDhfA== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1775063696; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=eBD6vANtws0fVBpR9+1GO/HtQr4latYvQl8eoZb3iwf3BIHX6A/xmMAz5uhJe3zpzG0s+k OCjE1x7Dtvyaqnv+H2DNcqI5ijLs01EVQIy75QA3zsGtDXAtw8ycMB/gFAWdm9l7W3nlqD fIW+Ms0H/kbQUhgJPc+fOeu56/NPWwDtXhsyEWICWC87xMxezasFFIHAp3fexpviSr3epR Yfm5EzruryDjAf7WVANn1UFHQV4I25zlHTsimGXxwYbdd/8aLEz2FVGuYGbaETrGq+ac01 DP0EpCl7wKqxzd8rkOJMIUwgjCKiOGJyjFKFyL5p2/ozMVvOGrvlEUkWAgBy/w== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1775063696; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=uzpsnN9C1iNTWrmPOS69ZKjVyZjZI7TLXQyUWonWVuY=; b=JKyg5egYMEBvqt01WVfHi4nC2bC88XUMDUe3t7plD5BdzE4yrq9o4c/WWfmH3wqCuy/8Li hSFWOWBgMkBh9VusJyn7aXBYgwL4e/f1yk3w6pjU/KMjj1PUdGtbN5ttx0MPUEHo7K7rzn U2FgF64w5p4s5QOUPl0/ReI48NfZqGL5p37KYvMeeZg3yHsfuLDVektp/UFzy4nZZlUSBY rjkpdMv3vrXBcuERWUtbU+KtnE/VRboetFI3sye6RyAg+rTrK8nDFSXf7IManw+5pHe9Em 3lFj+Cqh8gyVGGtCG0H158MCEKJTuEqOWvW6sMj3qPZgIrxFZrnMtMw2jnJtSQ== Received: from tensor.andric.com (tensor.andric.com [87.251.56.140]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature ECDSA (prime256v1) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "tensor.andric.com", Issuer "E7" (not verified)) (Authenticated sender: dim) by smtp.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4fmBSH6wWzzmgm; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 17:14:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dim@FreeBSD.org) Received: from smtpclient.apple (bladnoch.home.andric.com [192.168.0.20]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-ECDSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tensor.andric.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 91165644D4; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 19:14:54 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3826.700.81.1.6\)) Subject: Re: Etcupdate runtime has more than doubled....Why? From: Dimitry Andric In-Reply-To: Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2026 19:14:54 +0200 Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <2A0E2282-8B3A-46BA-85EC-B62F5E5B6891@FreeBSD.org> References: To: bob prohaska X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3826.700.81.1.6) On 1 Apr 2026, at 19:13, bob prohaska wrote: >=20 > For some time now I've been using etcupdate on a self-hosting > armv7 (RPi2) system. Lately, the runtime for etcupdate after > a world/kernel update from source has seemingly more than doubled. It's unfortunately not an April Fools joke, but I think it's due to the = new LLVM_BINUTILS default, which can cause some stuff to get rebuilt = during etcupdate. I am unsure if there is any PR or pending fix. -Dimitry From nobody Wed Apr 1 17:22:33 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmBY064Cmz6Y9cp for ; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 17:19:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd@www.zefox.net) Received: from www.zefox.net (www.zefox.net [50.1.20.27]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "pelorus.zefox.org", Issuer "pelorus.zefox.org" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmBY02hPfz47rt; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 17:19:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd@www.zefox.net) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: from www.zefox.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by www.zefox.net (8.18.1/8.18.1) with ESMTPS id 631HMXp8095971 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Wed, 1 Apr 2026 10:22:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fbsd@www.zefox.net) Received: (from fbsd@localhost) by www.zefox.net (8.18.1/8.18.1/Submit) id 631HMXuJ095970; Wed, 1 Apr 2026 10:22:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fbsd) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2026 10:22:33 -0700 From: bob prohaska To: Dimitry Andric Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Etcupdate runtime has more than doubled....Why? Message-ID: References: <2A0E2282-8B3A-46BA-85EC-B62F5E5B6891@FreeBSD.org> List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <2A0E2282-8B3A-46BA-85EC-B62F5E5B6891@FreeBSD.org> X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7065, ipnet:50.1.16.0/20, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fmBY02hPfz47rt X-Spamd-Bar: ---- On Wed, Apr 01, 2026 at 07:14:54PM +0200, Dimitry Andric wrote: > On 1 Apr 2026, at 19:13, bob prohaska wrote: > > > > For some time now I've been using etcupdate on a self-hosting > > armv7 (RPi2) system. Lately, the runtime for etcupdate after > > a world/kernel update from source has seemingly more than doubled. > > It's unfortunately not an April Fools joke, but I think it's due to the new LLVM_BINUTILS default, which can cause some stuff to get rebuilt during etcupdate. I am unsure if there is any PR or pending fix. > If a workaround emerges is would be very helpful on a Pi2 ! Thanks for writing, bob prohaska From nobody Wed Apr 1 17:26:02 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmBjP6Nkpz6YBLr for ; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 17:26:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vishwin@freebsd.org) Received: from smtp.freebsd.org (smtp.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::24b:4]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.freebsd.org", Issuer "R13" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmBjP5fH2z49vY; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 17:26:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vishwin@freebsd.org) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1775064377; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:autocrypt:autocrypt; bh=5Natv6DYXLnfrD4UpK20nKfhCBEvd5Pra26CZ3eA9bY=; b=SFwyCHZOU/TBY5M6XZ8tS9qkz96Koo5CR/xU0512dFeaqUJ4VU4cTZegx6+v6bGzJ41aAy UPgvuEWYTv7Gu8JxHJICn5akLpCRDdz98YzasgBqWpkvWuULnePNxcDozXFQvbXDIztfam 0MqwfA2FvkLyEcwAyNuJaM9mNQsCi2xbCuFGgnMmuj5K9aj4gQFDy/Iz16+fWthp0m0Bz/ 4fzNNCdu10nXpl7d/IqUBu4JPlO5RGbMgaDn0m9vSzM4D2ipQdNH3MWlfsvH6EG1SSVpre eTJROJSyx/QYWwWJUkLHkLLupwM1nQ+K2nUyI3tzvnpQqzWuxiJSlNUdoiaEnw== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1775064377; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=fHHjDvZOO82inFSzIURsYMfgA2Cml0iGb6uuwF6gwBAr/7ktUkT8Red9TVj4JqviLE5YjT xILs7nbVca/H1xj8Ilc0XX/ncXRVuow6OQVuChbwZqOQGqET331oPMHnhXwZ+b9IyNX/eX xEaFDUDxSDUYDr/wExIRqu4M7EqgcgfSkH+ottynZSpVJ3Xa0JW9aBXk8spn3z5i+beoub RJtc0eJ5dFk4rJAIDBiF3J2YiIPKZHJvnuPAJJWXMzi4HxcDXwbYO4B5RY0J1iUDDpKllj O3ZqoChqxv5aWEUlIGZ1xwa9mZDZewbdtfet/pMPJvnAnU2NK9T74MwFF+tXUw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1775064377; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:autocrypt:autocrypt; bh=5Natv6DYXLnfrD4UpK20nKfhCBEvd5Pra26CZ3eA9bY=; b=UpJJHvliAoOCATZGPc+4yZP4BXdtSALWXcQwFuXH1sxnzPr8SdQGORRPNYhpV3/TuNcY9u TKEQeYGzNS1EbnvlloHt2ss0XuA8MZ0ZmMKASFaiCq47IgAgs9RPYCFP23YzdKki99bAdn R6n1dyy9tHzIQfFw1aUNspxBNyYJovQNswdyh0d8r15AZuqLl7vrkwbUQUlGbs+zmjuJHP UxZCBudiJqQ1mM3lVaBIZGYedJU1NvkO+SLuU2XRTfstVQQVudJnLOdPaxTKU4xZ8TXBUs s9xLUTJARNvKP/nBiyfdv9oIAqnTE8w7GFth6vMRreHv0Hh+tQ/z0eMLb3QGGA== Received: from [IPV6:2601:98a:f01:42f0:b76f:46b2:d87f:7018] (unknown [IPv6:2601:98a:f01:42f0:b76f:46b2:d87f:7018]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) (Authenticated sender: vishwin/mail) by smtp.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4fmBjP3PHhzmcr; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 17:26:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vishwin@freebsd.org) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2026 13:26:02 -0400 List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: Etcupdate runtime has more than doubled....Why? To: bob prohaska , Dimitry Andric Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, emaste@freebsd.org References: <2A0E2282-8B3A-46BA-85EC-B62F5E5B6891@FreeBSD.org> Content-Language: en-GB From: Charlie Li Autocrypt: addr=vishwin@freebsd.org; keydata= xjMEaEicoBYJKwYBBAHaRw8BAQdAZBuydpjFLGem4uRJPWaYMXX2e+BN1jDhbD3tcqbxhdfN MkNoYXJsaWUgTGkgKEZyZWVCU0QgUHJvamVjdCkgPHZpc2h3aW5ARnJlZUJTRC5vcmc+wpkE ExYKAEEWIQTHxcCLnAXo3rFg6k7P+1cn7slqBAUCaEicoAIbAwUJCWYBgAULCQgHAgIiAgYV CgkICwIEFgIDAQIeBwIXgAAKCRDP+1cn7slqBM/bAP9bhA4e0LxJYFYJlftZM5WHrMSPpUe6 G2pVqmQWTQ0EZQEA0PNryfH3qRWWPSI8mFNRnG24hi5/aXFqCnHj1tcJ9Q/OOARoSJygEgor BgEEAZdVAQUBAQdAUT4TzYFmV6ueIGwjX0N+445KZV6ns1Wiw67QMsJZxHkDAQgHwn4EGBYK ACYWIQTHxcCLnAXo3rFg6k7P+1cn7slqBAUCaEicoAIbDAUJCWYBgAAKCRDP+1cn7slqBPO/ AQCPuGiyyfJClICRs/ToG0MsT8YcPdBygzuUIIeGpkjJpgEA7AoFCQ0Y28Y3hIDFn2k9PH3B nGWL3g05W0ds2qoj+gQ= Organization: FreeBSD Project In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------EfIUl0G00YouGkD08Dp0tsJ3" This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --------------EfIUl0G00YouGkD08Dp0tsJ3 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------IpNDtPmbLkjY13ruPrtXrDMi"; protected-headers="v1" Message-ID: Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2026 13:26:02 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: Etcupdate runtime has more than doubled....Why? To: bob prohaska , Dimitry Andric Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, emaste@freebsd.org References: <2A0E2282-8B3A-46BA-85EC-B62F5E5B6891@FreeBSD.org> Content-Language: en-GB From: Charlie Li Autocrypt: addr=vishwin@freebsd.org; keydata= xjMEaEicoBYJKwYBBAHaRw8BAQdAZBuydpjFLGem4uRJPWaYMXX2e+BN1jDhbD3tcqbxhdfN MkNoYXJsaWUgTGkgKEZyZWVCU0QgUHJvamVjdCkgPHZpc2h3aW5ARnJlZUJTRC5vcmc+wpkE ExYKAEEWIQTHxcCLnAXo3rFg6k7P+1cn7slqBAUCaEicoAIbAwUJCWYBgAULCQgHAgIiAgYV CgkICwIEFgIDAQIeBwIXgAAKCRDP+1cn7slqBM/bAP9bhA4e0LxJYFYJlftZM5WHrMSPpUe6 G2pVqmQWTQ0EZQEA0PNryfH3qRWWPSI8mFNRnG24hi5/aXFqCnHj1tcJ9Q/OOARoSJygEgor BgEEAZdVAQUBAQdAUT4TzYFmV6ueIGwjX0N+445KZV6ns1Wiw67QMsJZxHkDAQgHwn4EGBYK ACYWIQTHxcCLnAXo3rFg6k7P+1cn7slqBAUCaEicoAIbDAUJCWYBgAAKCRDP+1cn7slqBPO/ AQCPuGiyyfJClICRs/ToG0MsT8YcPdBygzuUIIeGpkjJpgEA7AoFCQ0Y28Y3hIDFn2k9PH3B nGWL3g05W0ds2qoj+gQ= Organization: FreeBSD Project In-Reply-To: --------------IpNDtPmbLkjY13ruPrtXrDMi Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Ym9iIHByb2hhc2thIHdyb3RlOg0KPiBPbiBXZWQsIEFwciAwMSwgMjAyNiBhdCAwNzoxNDo1 NFBNICswMjAwLCBEaW1pdHJ5IEFuZHJpYyB3cm90ZToNCj4+IE9uIDEgQXByIDIwMjYsIGF0 IDE5OjEzLCBib2IgcHJvaGFza2EgPGZic2RAd3d3LnplZm94Lm5ldD4gd3JvdGU6DQo+Pj4N Cj4+PiBGb3Igc29tZSB0aW1lIG5vdyBJJ3ZlIGJlZW4gdXNpbmcgZXRjdXBkYXRlIG9uIGEg c2VsZi1ob3N0aW5nDQo+Pj4gYXJtdjcgKFJQaTIpIHN5c3RlbS4gTGF0ZWx5LCB0aGUgcnVu dGltZSBmb3IgZXRjdXBkYXRlIGFmdGVyDQo+Pj4gYSB3b3JsZC9rZXJuZWwgdXBkYXRlIGZy b20gc291cmNlIGhhcyBzZWVtaW5nbHkgbW9yZSB0aGFuIGRvdWJsZWQuDQo+Pg0KPj4gSXQn cyB1bmZvcnR1bmF0ZWx5IG5vdCBhbiBBcHJpbCBGb29scyBqb2tlLCBidXQgSSB0aGluayBp dCdzIGR1ZSB0byB0aGUgbmV3IExMVk1fQklOVVRJTFMgZGVmYXVsdCwgd2hpY2ggY2FuIGNh dXNlIHNvbWUgc3R1ZmYgdG8gZ2V0IHJlYnVpbHQgZHVyaW5nIGV0Y3VwZGF0ZS4gSSBhbSB1 bnN1cmUgaWYgdGhlcmUgaXMgYW55IFBSIG9yIHBlbmRpbmcgZml4Lg0KPj4NClRoaXMgaXMg ZXhhY3RseSBpdC4gQWZ0ZXIgZW1hc3RlQCdzIGNvbW1pdCwgTExWTSBiaW51dGlscyBpcyBn ZXR0aW5nIA0KYnVpbHQgZGlyZWN0bHkgaW4gdGhlIGV0Y3VwZGF0ZSB0cmVlIGJlY2F1c2Ug dGhlIGJ1aWx0IGFydGVmYWN0cyBkbyBub3QgDQpleGlzdCB0aGVyZSAoYnV0IHJhdGhlciBp biAvdXNyL29iaikuDQo+IElmIGEgd29ya2Fyb3VuZCBlbWVyZ2VzIGlzIHdvdWxkIGJlIHZl cnkgaGVscGZ1bCBvbiBhIFBpMiAhDQo+IA0KVGhlIHdvcmthcm91bmQgaXMgdG8gcmV2ZXJ0 IGEgZm9sbG93LXVwIHR5cG8gZml4IGFuZCB0aGUgb3JpZ2luYWwgY29tbWl0IA0KaW4gb3Jk ZXI6DQoNCmU4ZGFjMzk0NGRjYSAtIG1haW4gLSBNYWtlZmlsZS5pbmMxOiBSZW1vdmUgZXh0 cmFuZW91cyB9DQoxNzQ5NGM2ZTZiN2QgLSBtYWluIC0gYnVpbGQ6IEJvb3N0cmFwIExMVk1f QklOVVRJTFMgZm9yIGNyb3NzLXRvb2xzDQoNCi0tIA0KQ2hhcmxpZSBMaQ0KLi4ubm9wZSwg c3RpbGwgZG9uJ3QgaGF2ZSBhbiBleGl0IGxpbmUuDQo= --------------IpNDtPmbLkjY13ruPrtXrDMi-- --------------EfIUl0G00YouGkD08Dp0tsJ3 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="OpenPGP_signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="OpenPGP_signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- wnsEABYIACMWIQTHxcCLnAXo3rFg6k7P+1cn7slqBAUCac1VKwUDAAAAAAAKCRDP+1cn7slqBAYS AQC/a7OwUjt0IAe4JK/j/VGGGdKwLuFoAsSHCNMWy/Vr7AEAm6NKYkuttyjZAF5wiNviFxvQp98K GNAsL0XmEC96SgM= =ezvC -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------EfIUl0G00YouGkD08Dp0tsJ3-- From nobody Wed Apr 1 17:54:37 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmCG000MTz6YDVk for ; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 17:51:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd@www.zefox.net) Received: from www.zefox.net (www.zefox.net [50.1.20.27]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "pelorus.zefox.org", Issuer "pelorus.zefox.org" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmCFz3zjWz3Gr2; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 17:51:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd@www.zefox.net) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: from www.zefox.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by www.zefox.net (8.18.1/8.18.1) with ESMTPS id 631HsbUr096078 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Wed, 1 Apr 2026 10:54:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fbsd@www.zefox.net) Received: (from fbsd@localhost) by www.zefox.net (8.18.1/8.18.1/Submit) id 631HsbbU096077; Wed, 1 Apr 2026 10:54:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fbsd) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2026 10:54:37 -0700 From: bob prohaska To: Charlie Li Cc: Dimitry Andric , freebsd-current@freebsd.org, emaste@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Etcupdate runtime has more than doubled....Why? Message-ID: References: <2A0E2282-8B3A-46BA-85EC-B62F5E5B6891@FreeBSD.org> List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7065, ipnet:50.1.16.0/20, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fmCFz3zjWz3Gr2 X-Spamd-Bar: ---- On Wed, Apr 01, 2026 at 01:26:02PM -0400, Charlie Li wrote: > bob prohaska wrote: > > On Wed, Apr 01, 2026 at 07:14:54PM +0200, Dimitry Andric wrote: > > > On 1 Apr 2026, at 19:13, bob prohaska wrote: > > > > > > > > For some time now I've been using etcupdate on a self-hosting > > > > armv7 (RPi2) system. Lately, the runtime for etcupdate after > > > > a world/kernel update from source has seemingly more than doubled. > > > > > > It's unfortunately not an April Fools joke, but I think it's due to the new LLVM_BINUTILS default, which can cause some stuff to get rebuilt during etcupdate. I am unsure if there is any PR or pending fix. > > > > This is exactly it. After emaste@'s commit, LLVM binutils is getting built > directly in the etcupdate tree because the built artefacts do not exist > there (but rather in /usr/obj). > > If a workaround emerges is would be very helpful on a Pi2 ! > > > The workaround is to revert a follow-up typo fix and the original commit in > order: > > e8dac3944dca - main - Makefile.inc1: Remove extraneous } > 17494c6e6b7d - main - build: Boostrap LLVM_BINUTILS for cross-tools > I'm a trifle confused; is the present situation considered a bug to be corrected in a later revision, or a feature to be preserved for general use? If it's going to be preserved I'll attempt the two reversions. 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Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID e0d00b70190b67843ca0f47336bf3759; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 18:00:57 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <626584dc-ea9c-4a63-902c-4de4e10bba00@yahoo.com> Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2026 11:00:56 -0700 List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: Etcupdate runtime has more than doubled....Why? To: bob prohaska , freebsd-current@freebsd.org References: Content-Language: en-US From: Mark Millard In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.25495 mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fmCTV0NPjz3JFC X-Spamd-Bar: ---- On 4/1/26 10:13, bob prohaska wrote: > For some time now I've been using etcupdate on a self-hosting > armv7 (RPi2) system. Lately, the runtime for etcupdate after > a world/kernel update from source has seemingly more than doubled. > It used to take less than one hour, now it's past two hours and > not done yet. The last process is a series of c++ processes which > take most of the added time. > > Apart from tracking -current the machine doesn't do much, but > I didn install a /usr/ports directory recently though it's only > been used to build named. The slowdown in etcupdate seems to > have appeared following that change. > > Might the addition of a ports tree have increased etcupdate's > run time, and is there in any case some housecleaning that will > speed it up? > > Thanks for reading, > > bob prohaska > > > etcupdate has the option: -B Do not build generated files in a private object tree. Instead, reuse the generated files from a previously built object tree that matches the source tree. This can be useful to avoid gratuitous conflicts in sendmail(8) configuration files when bootstrapping. It can also be useful for building a tarball that matches a specific world build. So, if one already has the required context, its use might be relevant. Of course, without the proper context, it should not be used. What was the context-status and use vs. not for -B ? -- === Mark Millard marklmi at yahoo.com From nobody Wed Apr 1 18:34:39 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmD8B2nyzz6YHjJ for ; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 18:31:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd@www.zefox.net) Received: from www.zefox.net (www.zefox.net [50.1.20.27]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "pelorus.zefox.org", Issuer "pelorus.zefox.org" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmD8965JFz3N1V for ; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 18:31:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd@www.zefox.net) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: from www.zefox.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by www.zefox.net (8.18.1/8.18.1) with ESMTPS id 631IYdGQ096227 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Wed, 1 Apr 2026 11:34:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fbsd@www.zefox.net) Received: (from fbsd@localhost) by www.zefox.net (8.18.1/8.18.1/Submit) id 631IYdMl096226; Wed, 1 Apr 2026 11:34:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fbsd) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2026 11:34:39 -0700 From: bob prohaska To: Mark Millard Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Etcupdate runtime has more than doubled....Why? Message-ID: References: <626584dc-ea9c-4a63-902c-4de4e10bba00@yahoo.com> List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <626584dc-ea9c-4a63-902c-4de4e10bba00@yahoo.com> X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7065, ipnet:50.1.16.0/20, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fmD8965JFz3N1V X-Spamd-Bar: ---- On Wed, Apr 01, 2026 at 11:00:56AM -0700, Mark Millard wrote: > > > > etcupdate has the option: > > > -B Do not build generated files in a private object tree. > Instead, reuse the generated files from a previously built > object tree that matches the source tree. This can be > useful to avoid gratuitous conflicts in sendmail(8) > configuration files when bootstrapping. It can also be > useful for building a tarball that matches a specific > world build. > > > So, if one already has the required context, its use might be relevant. > Of course, without the proper context, it should not be used. > > What was the context-status and use vs. not for -B ? There's only one /usr/obj on the system. The buildworld command used was make -j3 KERNCONF=GENERIC TARGET=arm TARGET_ARCH=armv7 buildworld and the etcupdate command following buildworld was etcupdate -p After installing world and kernel, etcupdate runs again as etcupdate Might using etcupdate -B in the second invocation be a remedy? Thanks for writing! bob prohaska From nobody Wed Apr 1 18:38:02 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmDJF1313z6YJ6x for ; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 18:38:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from david@catwhisker.org) Received: from mx.catwhisker.org (mx.catwhisker.org [107.204.234.170]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmDJD54Rkz3PWK for ; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 18:38:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from david@catwhisker.org) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: from albert.catwhisker.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by albert.catwhisker.org (8.18.1/8.18.1) with ESMTP id 631Ic2Si059032; Wed, 1 Apr 2026 18:38:02 GMT (envelope-from david@albert.catwhisker.org) Received: (from david@localhost) by albert.catwhisker.org (8.18.1/8.18.1/Submit) id 631Ic2j9059031; Wed, 1 Apr 2026 11:38:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from david) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2026 11:38:02 -0700 From: David Wolfskill To: bob prohaska Cc: Mark Millard , freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Etcupdate runtime has more than doubled....Why? Message-ID: Reply-To: current@freebsd.org Mail-Followup-To: current@freebsd.org, bob prohaska , Mark Millard , freebsd-current@freebsd.org References: <626584dc-ea9c-4a63-902c-4de4e10bba00@yahoo.com> List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="IRyHQ4Rpbr7M5+bC" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7018, ipnet:107.192.0.0/12, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fmDJD54Rkz3PWK X-Spamd-Bar: ---- --IRyHQ4Rpbr7M5+bC Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, Apr 01, 2026 at 11:34:39AM -0700, bob prohaska wrote: > On Wed, Apr 01, 2026 at 11:00:56AM -0700, Mark Millard wrote: > ... > > etcupdate has the option: > >=20 > >=20 > > -B Do not build generated files in a private object tree. > ... > > What was the context-status and use vs. not for -B ? >=20 > There's only one /usr/obj on the system. >=20 > The buildworld command used was > make -j3 KERNCONF=3DGENERIC TARGET=3Darm TARGET_ARCH=3Darmv7 buildworld > and the etcupdate command following buildworld was > etcupdate -p >=20 > After installing world and kernel, etcupdate runs again as > etcupdate >=20 > Might using etcupdate -B in the second invocation be a remedy? > .... I have used -B with etcupdate since migrating from mergemaster to etcupdate; I am tracking stable (currently, 15) and head daily on a handful of machines, and have not seen the cited slowdown. It would seem to be worth an experiment. Peace, david --=20 David H. Wolfskill david@catwhisker.org See https://www.catwhisker.org/~david/publickey.gpg for my public key. --IRyHQ4Rpbr7M5+bC Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iNUEARYKAH0WIQRCec5RsK7Enudh3yGB9MJ9AwUELQUCac1mCl8UgAAAAAAuAChp c3N1ZXItZnByQG5vdGF0aW9ucy5vcGVucGdwLmZpZnRoaG9yc2VtYW4ubmV0NDI3 OUNFNTFCMEFFQzQ5RUU3NjFERjIxODFGNEMyN0QwMzA1MDQyRAAKCRCB9MJ9AwUE LdZTAQD3MWGcPpqJDuebzrMjfnkRvikI7AOEFBEHrFkFNk9FEQD/Rgncr1N8IGyj kKxfMr8Eo9F2CyTxItXCVXLTXTrDmgU= =h4m2 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --IRyHQ4Rpbr7M5+bC-- From nobody Wed Apr 1 19:10:08 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmF1M5Dvzz6YLpH for ; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 19:10:15 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) Received: from sonic312-24.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (sonic312-24.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com [98.137.69.205]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmF1M1Wf0z3Tm6 for ; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 19:10:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1775070612; bh=OYy40aHuvtrwiasHx9MYBKyvvgGNqSLPAjaddpJGqQE=; h=Date:Subject:To:Cc:References:From:In-Reply-To:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=AcKDzzGrm+2kiOrLme+cuALF3wrG3S3bJpJf3OXnkNskZpdk0f62h0+zZWZMFzeMWzO7LnpXBgCxQ1d2eF2PqaVXycf+lPyBisDx07Ms62GmKVgLJjbcbXwAMHETb+QpqoAe7JDIc9HAh27zw+e1ZAQ3As2ydnwl6jSo6ivN199vjsDaMQbhLb2eP5ibCvbEh1f32FLmgCBRb4KNyv+Xe35pvr7iizRLevgs5VzXv2PF78/AwhjxB8e9O1H/kOvQ1AQqkMWPdmMSHreSCxuo721FmAZ+STgmsYz7ltpEDYkSnH6n8sac2AhrKtUn/kziHao2LJ0kzAhNlOFm1d7Elg== X-SONIC-DKIM-SIGN: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1775070612; bh=Sw+C61WZ6CJAWkVUB0G4xwhYWbIjw2QoSL3fVcY3sYT=; h=X-Sonic-MF:Date:Subject:To:From:From:Subject; b=D0/yf1AB9HV8lKgedfhQzMNGlZXgJPNGkEhPDWXbdtVyFroL4Lv50qiSO86rkLYZ3DSEzc0QFdNtok/k3yDqNfwPp2JDFmKSnnlGfdzBLk45Pn3VTrljm3x2y29ph/5Hxt35xyk1BuhhC7+c+oCAYOGcgvUabGgAGjm/2CfVAhcJK/zooVm5HKa7rE154Iv/INoYjy32wFzcNoJrp0tuE+4gY5rtsUfOguDxcHSaIwO4XScK0Grc9pTmu5YOCY/CSG/OVY1m/5eC87JojIzRyIFP137caMTVPZChcp2SIU954HitWc+jt1HTAtpNRBrD4XCXN6nTFFwKJJmA9xz86w== X-YMail-OSG: LgfdHEgVM1mNjxffP.j9i1Xjh86jNJ4bdDdCfHuRLHyPzpB2ly5geLs2fXLuCVp fd2.uOPr.nzPcXthlOv5kbtQDZXP5.tilZCJLwnPaZRvjLOXdp9tS8oU9_nXbBBQHH7eGbywcK72 Ed8L1jnzTcu.opflZfPB36m1.iAR9FEA1Zyg8zwIdbUcQaP.BaewQQf22Y53jfib8rkk.wCS.N_m NO6YiL_scrYni.IoYssIyJlDPAHpnC0l6LdIH99g_h4ppH7r7Oj5zBpv4AhOBrb78o7KExtZEW7l wCI.v1He60yoSXI1Bh02JpR.Gllx0ee1cnh.XYiIM2dPqG6gyLecI1pj9q2wWjX9kz9kkRN5pn3C yKqX81cwxtmg3msgOCQ.dUFt3FC1PMxQ3JSJUOdyPpv4CSL5NYHVsVLrhqftYIJqZ0OhATWx4maT HiClwyXD3O62q9evV8SEFJsGl.eN3I4j1Wm1WsNtW2.jbErN.o12XtDfUF6g6YuCwp4aYrSNlrCx r0Sjh7seQ_QaOdQUYh6Z1qIKQVMHGMQTVCzkdpUBUe6HXfR8LyzygqKRrwHYmD4FEsPj3FEWfMpw gUEydvVoTDYv5FAqug_4ZsR5MAkbyFykESheRxalRxKVkjHfu7e3ueXnbybGEMjtQAt4XSjZ6laD .E_CeiuT_kidnQdvQe137GxZnSepixsMcnIn3wpfleTW2tVe7tyUM.p.QJ3xUnmnvEVaLkuwGvLN EHICEr6dSw1W.4uMoZ.a.NfxJIlnJVxNwgLrmMAKaIuimN.K2ca1APiQFYXC9wT2WcedLVjhtOKV I3pYRNNhOnFG9d8ziG6B2KrdhHUcq6TpNBQTldloCtYKxozFnVDRREnMhtzQgkh2ulyIoOt1v.eB AI23SSci5KtLdhYoaXkb4JJ42ckR67RBtuF_og9EWd2MbePyJubxStacWFq1qUKiUOUCuvIxHKWG rUEjaPEJlvHbzsityAl2OyWtNzaacUUgt4OmA0QqT79IySw1To3qqSr0GejJ_LraFcnmZyfypUpC nGzeFVSBEJgTDc8AtrteBWJh0SlwARaw9LspvqZngNr2HtJKIpBQ3OdK5Ax.zDikDv6.Q7_gyzXq k2nxhwBsYhKpQ0RmXzSMRl7yKudlAlDAs_OGbLVtuU4hSZuzwubZltdqQTdAY81S61hBS8fdGG4H xVwyqsJGXkVy_MAQ71SSs3H821ifX6tJPyPx2fgk5TwQQ5lhWg6VF.gJPTg_Bu_zmRSGo4JSdH4O bwEX.H8mmk6tND.SsvFQQSaQwwZODjO5SB0dVT4fm8Iu_IpD1hHku4G_g7u0HudQPaz.IQXnaUAS 3IVDvqmXbz7eLjJyo.vaB9zq7burEVpln5eRJhRRzA656AEI05hMOWHKHh.Woxsa8VfmwHT0czmK 6IwxYIeCOnVspqmS.CRwyfEVAXnVcweAf2bImAi0_8meNo_8ctz9qpmcNK2k2k5f5Luc7TUPiYqe z9cuVY7UZRU9swqVzPslLB4FgVibGOVNzp8SCWDg3GID4RytT86UFbLNcdDj95BIYtzi_bkSNQxZ UzzMEvE5j_px8OIFeQ8vIfjV2XJnYIfvg0BzS.GOjoTw9MXdh8YUbBjyADtdGIp2UXIWkkvuf6dT b9q.vCf2d3U.hw5EHyncFG793Mk96jl9hEXKq4_umUnQr85EyMBjV2_.j_GyiIXYvpo15POHbdln IWii0BwREWJRGXo09o7DlJ1tjxPGigCeBioXy612rjrE360BSwpuakwqJrHbijy0pZylnNTt4WGS aUEBq75FlOt2ZWe1vN1WbsjrOaEG8gslMq7E4ojuvN5LEPWfXXsFjOCGX5J7nvrKlAzIsXQli9pL JCnUf4C0xMBftItCOIai2UziblRi0YRxc44yylmEHJAByXZq6t7N2XVwVZKiwNyv.AlmmrV4O_I. 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Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 82d400f787d8fe50e68e959fd804c053; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 19:10:09 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2026 12:10:08 -0700 List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: Etcupdate runtime has more than doubled....Why? Content-Language: en-US To: bob prohaska Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org References: <626584dc-ea9c-4a63-902c-4de4e10bba00@yahoo.com> From: Mark Millard In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.25449 mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fmF1M1Wf0z3Tm6 X-Spamd-Bar: ---- On 4/1/26 11:34, bob prohaska wrote: > On Wed, Apr 01, 2026 at 11:00:56AM -0700, Mark Millard wrote: >>> >> >> etcupdate has the option: >> >> >> -B Do not build generated files in a private object tree. >> Instead, reuse the generated files from a previously built >> object tree that matches the source tree. This can be >> useful to avoid gratuitous conflicts in sendmail(8) >> configuration files when bootstrapping. It can also be >> useful for building a tarball that matches a specific >> world build. >> >> >> So, if one already has the required context, its use might be relevant. >> Of course, without the proper context, it should not be used. >> >> What was the context-status and use vs. not for -B ? > > There's only one /usr/obj on the system. > > The buildworld command used was > make -j3 KERNCONF=GENERIC TARGET=arm TARGET_ARCH=armv7 buildworld > and the etcupdate command following buildworld was > etcupdate -p > > After installing world and kernel, etcupdate runs again as > etcupdate > > Might using etcupdate -B in the second invocation be a remedy? Extracted/simplified from my more overall scripts full of local details: # make WITH_META_MODE=yes buildworld # make WITH_META_MODE=yes buildkernel # etcupdate -p # etcupdate resolve -p # make WITH_META_MODE=yes installkernel # make WITH_META_MODE=yes installworld # etcupdate -B # etcupdate resolve # make delete-old check-old # #AS NEEDED for timing?: make delete-old-libs # etcupdate status > > Thanks for writing! > > bob prohaska > > > -- === Mark Millard marklmi at yahoo.com From nobody Wed Apr 1 19:10:24 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmF2j3NYmz6YLn1; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 19:11:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from junchoon@dec.sakura.ne.jp) Received: from www121.sakura.ne.jp (www121.sakura.ne.jp [153.125.133.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmF2h6MGXz3VZL; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 19:11:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from junchoon@dec.sakura.ne.jp) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: from delta.joker.local (124-18-6-240.area1c.commufa.jp [124.18.6.240]) (authenticated bits=0) by www121.sakura.ne.jp (8.18.1/8.17.1/[SAKURA-WEB]/20201212) with ESMTPA id 631JAOeu089292; Thu, 2 Apr 2026 04:10:25 +0900 (JST) (envelope-from junchoon@dec.sakura.ne.jp) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=dec.sakura.ne.jp; s=s2405; t=1775070627; bh=zhrFOl9imXz+L11A9QHPRdXovr3Gtspryh0n4zMX81o=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References; b=OhHFDqNpKhBH/hAtUL4kHeKyyJbVJc3NAyNEbA+NqpN6+Xy+jmGpTh6o9MXRu0UJh zHRWV2UJ77ykKy/TvGNmcW6jpGBkleft7gNgj3jljGnVi9sxKha+4KNJq9TzzKnwsB T/h/vIHzYTRsr8PKXfY6Jf69FXnbAlyHn+yHoShU= Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2026 04:10:24 +0900 From: Tomoaki AOKI To: current@freebsd.org Cc: David Wolfskill , bob prohaska , Mark Millard , freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Etcupdate runtime has more than doubled....Why? Message-Id: <20260402041024.927d010d2210187f99a4b28f@dec.sakura.ne.jp> In-Reply-To: References: <626584dc-ea9c-4a63-902c-4de4e10bba00@yahoo.com> Organization: Junchoon corps X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.7.0 (GTK+ 2.24.33; amd64-portbld-freebsd15.0) List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7684, ipnet:153.125.128.0/18, country:JP] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fmF2h6MGXz3VZL X-Spamd-Bar: ---- On Wed, 1 Apr 2026 11:38:02 -0700 David Wolfskill wrote: > On Wed, Apr 01, 2026 at 11:34:39AM -0700, bob prohaska wrote: > > On Wed, Apr 01, 2026 at 11:00:56AM -0700, Mark Millard wrote: > > ... > > > etcupdate has the option: > > > > > > > > > -B Do not build generated files in a private object tree. > > ... > > > What was the context-status and use vs. not for -B ? > > > > There's only one /usr/obj on the system. > > > > The buildworld command used was > > make -j3 KERNCONF=GENERIC TARGET=arm TARGET_ARCH=armv7 buildworld > > and the etcupdate command following buildworld was > > etcupdate -p > > > > After installing world and kernel, etcupdate runs again as > > etcupdate > > > > Might using etcupdate -B in the second invocation be a remedy? > > .... > > I have used -B with etcupdate since migrating from mergemaster to > etcupdate; I am tracking stable (currently, 15) and head daily on a > handful of machines, and have not seen the cited slowdown. > > It would seem to be worth an experiment. > > Peace, > david > -- > David H. Wolfskill david@catwhisker.org > > See https://www.catwhisker.org/~david/publickey.gpg for my public key. FYI: (Parts of discussions) https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/dev-commits-src-main/2026-March/040689.html https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/dev-commits-src-main/2026-March/040739.html https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/dev-commits-src-main/2026-March/040814.html https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/dev-commits-src-main/2026-March/040830.html Regards. -- Tomoaki AOKI From nobody Wed Apr 1 19:10:24 2026 X-Original-To: current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmF2j3NYmz6YLn1; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 19:11:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from junchoon@dec.sakura.ne.jp) Received: from www121.sakura.ne.jp (www121.sakura.ne.jp [153.125.133.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmF2h6MGXz3VZL; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 19:11:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from junchoon@dec.sakura.ne.jp) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: from delta.joker.local (124-18-6-240.area1c.commufa.jp [124.18.6.240]) (authenticated bits=0) by www121.sakura.ne.jp (8.18.1/8.17.1/[SAKURA-WEB]/20201212) with ESMTPA id 631JAOeu089292; Thu, 2 Apr 2026 04:10:25 +0900 (JST) (envelope-from junchoon@dec.sakura.ne.jp) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=dec.sakura.ne.jp; s=s2405; t=1775070627; bh=zhrFOl9imXz+L11A9QHPRdXovr3Gtspryh0n4zMX81o=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References; b=OhHFDqNpKhBH/hAtUL4kHeKyyJbVJc3NAyNEbA+NqpN6+Xy+jmGpTh6o9MXRu0UJh zHRWV2UJ77ykKy/TvGNmcW6jpGBkleft7gNgj3jljGnVi9sxKha+4KNJq9TzzKnwsB T/h/vIHzYTRsr8PKXfY6Jf69FXnbAlyHn+yHoShU= Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2026 04:10:24 +0900 From: Tomoaki AOKI To: current@freebsd.org Cc: David Wolfskill , bob prohaska , Mark Millard , freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Etcupdate runtime has more than doubled....Why? Message-Id: <20260402041024.927d010d2210187f99a4b28f@dec.sakura.ne.jp> In-Reply-To: References: <626584dc-ea9c-4a63-902c-4de4e10bba00@yahoo.com> Organization: Junchoon corps X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.7.0 (GTK+ 2.24.33; amd64-portbld-freebsd15.0) List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7684, ipnet:153.125.128.0/18, country:JP] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fmF2h6MGXz3VZL X-Spamd-Bar: ---- On Wed, 1 Apr 2026 11:38:02 -0700 David Wolfskill wrote: > On Wed, Apr 01, 2026 at 11:34:39AM -0700, bob prohaska wrote: > > On Wed, Apr 01, 2026 at 11:00:56AM -0700, Mark Millard wrote: > > ... > > > etcupdate has the option: > > > > > > > > > -B Do not build generated files in a private object tree. > > ... > > > What was the context-status and use vs. not for -B ? > > > > There's only one /usr/obj on the system. > > > > The buildworld command used was > > make -j3 KERNCONF=GENERIC TARGET=arm TARGET_ARCH=armv7 buildworld > > and the etcupdate command following buildworld was > > etcupdate -p > > > > After installing world and kernel, etcupdate runs again as > > etcupdate > > > > Might using etcupdate -B in the second invocation be a remedy? > > .... > > I have used -B with etcupdate since migrating from mergemaster to > etcupdate; I am tracking stable (currently, 15) and head daily on a > handful of machines, and have not seen the cited slowdown. > > It would seem to be worth an experiment. > > Peace, > david > -- > David H. Wolfskill david@catwhisker.org > > See https://www.catwhisker.org/~david/publickey.gpg for my public key. FYI: (Parts of discussions) https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/dev-commits-src-main/2026-March/040689.html https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/dev-commits-src-main/2026-March/040739.html https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/dev-commits-src-main/2026-March/040814.html https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/dev-commits-src-main/2026-March/040830.html Regards. -- Tomoaki AOKI From nobody Wed Apr 1 19:20:11 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmFF167X4z6YMTb for ; Wed, 01 Apr 2026 19:20:21 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) Received: from sonic314-20.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (sonic314-20.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com [98.137.69.83]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmFF036Rzz3Z0h for ; 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From: Mark Millard To: bob prohaska Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org References: <626584dc-ea9c-4a63-902c-4de4e10bba00@yahoo.com> Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.25449 mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.93 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.93)[-0.932]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[yahoo.com,reject]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com:dkim]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[98.137.69.83:from]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[98.137.69.83:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fmFF036Rzz3Z0h X-Spamd-Bar: -- On 4/1/26 12:10, Mark Millard wrote: > On 4/1/26 11:34, bob prohaska wrote: >> On Wed, Apr 01, 2026 at 11:00:56AM -0700, Mark Millard wrote: >>>> >>> >>> etcupdate has the option: >>> >>> >>> -B Do not build generated files in a private object tree. >>> Instead, reuse the generated files from a previously built >>> object tree that matches the source tree. This can be >>> useful to avoid gratuitous conflicts in sendmail(8) >>> configuration files when bootstrapping. It can also be >>> useful for building a tarball that matches a specific >>> world build. >>> >>> >>> So, if one already has the required context, its use might be relevant. >>> Of course, without the proper context, it should not be used. >>> >>> What was the context-status and use vs. not for -B ? >> >> There's only one /usr/obj on the system. >> >> The buildworld command used was >> make -j3 KERNCONF=GENERIC TARGET=arm TARGET_ARCH=armv7 buildworld >> and the etcupdate command following buildworld was >> etcupdate -p >> >> After installing world and kernel, etcupdate runs again as >> etcupdate >> >> Might using etcupdate -B in the second invocation be a remedy? > > Extracted/simplified from my more overall scripts full of local details: > > # make WITH_META_MODE=yes buildworld > # make WITH_META_MODE=yes buildkernel > # etcupdate -p > # etcupdate resolve -p > # make WITH_META_MODE=yes installkernel Note for live updating the booted file system: # # Possibly: vi /boot/loader.conf # shutdown -r now . . . (I have contexts that do not involve that.) > # make WITH_META_MODE=yes installworld > # etcupdate -B > # etcupdate resolve > # make delete-old check-old > # #AS NEEDED for timing?: make delete-old-libs > # etcupdate status Note for live updates the booted file system or just wanting to: # # Possibly: vi /boot/loader.conf # shutdown -r now . . . (I have contexts that do not involve that. For those I may deal with booting at some later time for some other reason.) > >> >> Thanks for writing! >> >> bob prohaska >> >> >> > > -- === Mark Millard marklmi at yahoo.com From nobody Thu Apr 2 12:50:40 2026 X-Original-To: current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmhXz3vrkz6YQGw for ; Thu, 02 Apr 2026 12:50:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from david@catwhisker.org) Received: from mx.catwhisker.org (mx.catwhisker.org [107.204.234.170]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmhXy1DN0z3bg7 for ; Thu, 02 Apr 2026 12:50:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from david@catwhisker.org) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of david@catwhisker.org designates 107.204.234.170 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=david@catwhisker.org Received: from albert.catwhisker.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by albert.catwhisker.org (8.18.1/8.18.1) with ESMTP id 632CoeOb070008 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 2026 12:50:40 GMT (envelope-from david@albert.catwhisker.org) Received: (from david@localhost) by albert.catwhisker.org (8.18.1/8.18.1/Submit) id 632CoeqA070007 for current@freebsd.org; Thu, 2 Apr 2026 05:50:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from david) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2026 05:50:40 -0700 From: David Wolfskill To: current@freebsd.org Subject: Panic: "knote ... was already on knlist..." after main-n284826-d9d7b5948649 Message-ID: Reply-To: current@freebsd.org Mail-Followup-To: current@freebsd.org List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="U+T5Ac6OxCViu+EV" Content-Disposition: inline X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.36 / 15.00]; REPLYTO_EQ_TO_ADDR(5.00)[]; SIGNED_PGP(-2.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.96)[-0.958]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:107.204.234.170]; MIME_GOOD(-0.20)[multipart/signed,text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[catwhisker.org]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MISSING_XM_UA(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_DOM_NEQ_FROM_DOM(0.00)[]; FREEFALL_USER(0.00)[david]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7018, ipnet:107.192.0.0/12, country:US]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[current@freebsd.org]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[current@freebsd.org]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROMTLD(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[current@freebsd.org] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fmhXy1DN0z3bg7 X-Spamd-Bar: / --U+T5Ac6OxCViu+EV Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Build machine (kernel GENERIC) did not experience this. So far, 3 out of 3 laptops have (the 4th one has yet to finish the build). I snapped a photo, which is up at https://www.catwhisker.org/~david/FreeBSD/head/n284826/screen.jpg The panic occurs during the late(r) part of the transition to multi-user mode. I am happy to poke at one of the machines, given suitable clues: I tend to break stuff. The machines had previously built and run main-n284804-f3b59bf28504. All machines are amd64, and I use PORTS_MODULES in /etc/src.conf to ensure that ports-resident kernel modules get rebuilt whenever the kernel does./~david/FreeBSD/head/n284826/screen.jpg The panic occurs during the late(r) part of the transition to multi-user mode. I am happy to poke at one of the machines, given suitable clues: I tend to break stuff. A quick scan down the backtrace shows: db_trace_self_wrapper() vpanic() panic() knlist_remove() kqueue_fork_copy_list() kqueue_fork() fdcopy() do_fork() fork() sys_fork() amd64_syscall() fast_syscall_common() --- syscall KDB: enter: panic [ thread pid 1891 tld 100578 ] Stopped at xffffffffff88c177c3 =3D kdb_enter+0x33: movq $0,0x15f7842(%rip) db>=20 The machines had previously built and run main-n284804-f3b59bf28504. All machines are amd64, and I use PORTS_MODULES in /etc/src.conf to ensure that ports-resident kernel modules get rebuilt whenever the kernel does. Oh -- the 4th laptop also panicked (apparently similarly). The older 3 laptops use custom kernels, but the newest one (which uses ZFS & boot environments; the oolder ones do not) uses a GENERIC kernel (as the build machine does). Peace, david --=20 David H. Wolfskill david@catwhisker.org See https://www.catwhisker.org/~david/publickey.gpg for my public key. --U+T5Ac6OxCViu+EV Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iNUEARYKAH0WIQRCec5RsK7Enudh3yGB9MJ9AwUELQUCac5mIF8UgAAAAAAuAChp c3N1ZXItZnByQG5vdGF0aW9ucy5vcGVucGdwLmZpZnRoaG9yc2VtYW4ubmV0NDI3 OUNFNTFCMEFFQzQ5RUU3NjFERjIxODFGNEMyN0QwMzA1MDQyRAAKCRCB9MJ9AwUE LSE+AP4nXODDVhiGzAwL/jd9fE8jnp2THcVqzP5g8Iv/O4haXgEAqoGrAFw0nKia Ue3g2m6yqWu/kaszQU5wEZZ+q/D05Ao= =R5P2 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --U+T5Ac6OxCViu+EV-- From nobody Thu Apr 2 13:01:42 2026 X-Original-To: current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmhnv67s1z6YRJG for ; Thu, 02 Apr 2026 13:01:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) Received: from kib.kiev.ua (kib.kiev.ua [IPv6:2001:470:d5e7:1::1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmhnv04sPz3fZV for ; Thu, 02 Apr 2026 13:01:54 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: from tom.home (kib@localhost [127.0.0.1] (may be forged)) by kib.kiev.ua (8.18.1/8.18.1) with ESMTP id 632D1gfq094968 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 2026 16:01:45 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.10.3 kib.kiev.ua 632D1gfq094968 Received: (from kostik@localhost) by tom.home (8.18.1/8.18.1/Submit) id 632D1gka094967 for current@freebsd.org; Thu, 2 Apr 2026 16:01:42 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) X-Authentication-Warning: tom.home: kostik set sender to kostikbel@gmail.com using -f Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2026 16:01:42 +0300 From: Konstantin Belousov To: current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Panic: "knote ... was already on knlist..." after main-n284826-d9d7b5948649 Message-ID: References: List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.0 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,BAYES_00, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED,FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD,FREEMAIL_FROM, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=4.0.2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 4.0.2 (2025-08-27) on tom.home X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:6939, ipnet:2001:470::/32, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fmhnv04sPz3fZV X-Spamd-Bar: ---- On Thu, Apr 02, 2026 at 05:50:40AM -0700, David Wolfskill wrote: > Build machine (kernel GENERIC) did not experience this. So far, 3 out > of 3 laptops have (the 4th one has yet to finish the build). > > I snapped a photo, which is up at > https://www.catwhisker.org/~david/FreeBSD/head/n284826/screen.jpg > > The panic occurs during the late(r) part of the transition to multi-user > mode. I am happy to poke at one of the machines, given suitable clues: > I tend to break stuff. > > The machines had previously built and run main-n284804-f3b59bf28504. > All machines are amd64, and I use PORTS_MODULES in /etc/src.conf to > ensure that ports-resident kernel modules get rebuilt whenever the > kernel does./~david/FreeBSD/head/n284826/screen.jpg > > The panic occurs during the late(r) part of the transition to multi-user > mode. I am happy to poke at one of the machines, given suitable clues: > I tend to break stuff. > > A quick scan down the backtrace shows: > db_trace_self_wrapper() > vpanic() > panic() > knlist_remove() > kqueue_fork_copy_list() > kqueue_fork() > fdcopy() > do_fork() > fork() > sys_fork() > amd64_syscall() > fast_syscall_common() > --- syscall > KDB: enter: panic > [ thread pid 1891 tld 100578 ] > Stopped at xffffffffff88c177c3 = kdb_enter+0x33: movq $0,0x15f7842(%rip) > db> Peter Holm already reported this or similar issue. Try this please. commit 5da1dcf8b88ffa3591a84405a8ab29ebd846f2e0 Author: Konstantin Belousov Date: Thu Apr 2 14:02:14 2026 +0300 kqueue_fork_copy_knote(): zero kn_knlist for the copy before calling knlist_add() Reported by: pho Sponsored by: The FreeBSD Foundation MFC after: 1 week diff --git a/sys/kern/kern_event.c b/sys/kern/kern_event.c index dc9e8b71ea13..5b0a3e59b715 100644 --- a/sys/kern/kern_event.c +++ b/sys/kern/kern_event.c @@ -3103,6 +3103,7 @@ kqueue_fork_copy_knote(struct kqueue *kq1, struct knote *kn, struct proc *p1, kn1->kn_status |= KN_DETACHED; kn1->kn_status &= ~KN_QUEUED; kn1->kn_kq = kq1; + kn1->kn_knlist = NULL; error = fop->f_copy(kn1, p1); if (error != 0) { knote_free(kn1); From nobody Thu Apr 2 13:20:27 2026 X-Original-To: current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmjCK0FF5z6Y069 for ; Thu, 02 Apr 2026 13:20:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from david@catwhisker.org) Received: from mx.catwhisker.org (mx.catwhisker.org [107.204.234.170]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmjCJ5pjyz3hf0 for ; Thu, 02 Apr 2026 13:20:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from david@catwhisker.org) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: from albert.catwhisker.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by albert.catwhisker.org (8.18.1/8.18.1) with ESMTP id 632DKRce070273; Thu, 2 Apr 2026 13:20:27 GMT (envelope-from david@albert.catwhisker.org) Received: (from david@localhost) by albert.catwhisker.org (8.18.1/8.18.1/Submit) id 632DKRwB070272; Thu, 2 Apr 2026 06:20:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from david) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2026 06:20:27 -0700 From: David Wolfskill To: Konstantin Belousov Cc: current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Panic: "knote ... was already on knlist..." after main-n284826-d9d7b5948649 Message-ID: Mail-Followup-To: David Wolfskill , Konstantin Belousov , current@freebsd.org References: List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="awRQEZA8SrYd4Tqa" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7018, ipnet:107.192.0.0/12, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fmjCJ5pjyz3hf0 X-Spamd-Bar: ---- --awRQEZA8SrYd4Tqa Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, Apr 02, 2026 at 04:01:42PM +0300, Konstantin Belousov wrote: > ... > Peter Holm already reported this or similar issue. Try this please. Ah. > commit 5da1dcf8b88ffa3591a84405a8ab29ebd846f2e0 > Author: Konstantin Belousov > Date: Thu Apr 2 14:02:14 2026 +0300 >=20 > kqueue_fork_copy_knote(): zero kn_knlist for the copy before calling = knlist_add() > ... Change made; works -- thanks! Peace, david --=20 David H. Wolfskill david@catwhisker.org See https://www.catwhisker.org/~david/publickey.gpg for my public key. --awRQEZA8SrYd4Tqa Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iNUEARYKAH0WIQRCec5RsK7Enudh3yGB9MJ9AwUELQUCac5tG18UgAAAAAAuAChp c3N1ZXItZnByQG5vdGF0aW9ucy5vcGVucGdwLmZpZnRoaG9yc2VtYW4ubmV0NDI3 OUNFNTFCMEFFQzQ5RUU3NjFERjIxODFGNEMyN0QwMzA1MDQyRAAKCRCB9MJ9AwUE LULRAPwOCqN2UvSpau//7u3i3hSXV7B3SAGrrTD60orhRAimQwD+KJowL02JFJCx 5+EV2MWAMlH8MuuAU6QhOoIii5KK4wU= =d36w -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --awRQEZA8SrYd4Tqa-- From nobody Thu Apr 2 14:25:55 2026 X-Original-To: current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmkfr6yWKz6Y5g6 for ; Thu, 02 Apr 2026 14:25:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kevans@FreeBSD.org) Received: from smtp.freebsd.org (smtp.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::24b:4]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.freebsd.org", Issuer "R13" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmkfr5Y9Nz3s72; Thu, 02 Apr 2026 14:25:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kevans@FreeBSD.org) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1775139956; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=b0k31RJIkIUQaZxhrDWyjs7m4lou3ACE6ioTTZDfxvQ=; b=Bp257Fy/GYg5rjXzZT1djtV4DqHN8Ej6ihbjzZ47SGOPi5/Ps0DCyQP+ps2Mmy4gal3U/0 5Uyz4t7LdnVuCeIKtbU0Dk/GlTJlbR5PfBzuH1ZJOOvI0wZbXWjcFh9A1nWyG4FWGnhR4p zb0PZLm9zSxMiCPllNzkL045bxy4jQycrowN+ZuzKfqC5DKdTIWPJ88aBbrj5JSx5B0UZz pkDR6agb6dphU/q6nsThUKrT2TcSJBKjScxB+HSBkSyPaOjYTpZLCdfqPHt3eoiBiGc9mH seNNJLZBDuZz4EdwegKCYLJVjvvdXpePDno4fiqacPkGcsp8fgtk/luKlN0yow== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1775139956; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=XJYPjPZdgBt0UJ3eZrOhLeW2smahccWRETngPDOTXz4j25A3seRGUwyAC+df5u8PFuCws6 nf0oC7CKsDfX+oT44WD9oaCksKYItvhuUWJWnoFxI2uAVM3Ul0IXEq/r2bxRCsRAcH63VY iIDLtXUcad/wPl2SX9FCNUPO2+H9cc8HfbdmLeqrO2KxNx+4nbxZPSB83wbz7MvKY4hyO8 Rx2MD81zqTdL/oVS0v17hEOgNWDGmckwr2TGfvRzrygD6YMrafe2xZkuPP+5kwKDUPya6k 5fu2NIQvIHiBUQ65Di6BdbfqamkNt2VJSyOnRjWTi+PVUHiqbYD2X88+krkoKg== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1775139956; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=b0k31RJIkIUQaZxhrDWyjs7m4lou3ACE6ioTTZDfxvQ=; b=ZZX2lvILNQNuzF6KxfXwGjIhxJ3czOond0K7liNKEbcAKRfHqqjs2QQTPS3chRqL39XyoN rYgBqFBY2HPiEm4FvUuZZm94NcLBOzm7mm+WXCKvOwzNtExF+xtTPDOenyEn9RbCDw+Sjr DJR86SlUp4PFwGFjfZp59XRVeJXrBIzsqPeXnykkS95M0cVx3fPvSl/UZqFscm02sKNODc gkMLSh/E6JmxsDcMkPrdcoE/QdETuNEaE+tXBS3fEevlGhro0eAnzJZMr4U2rxp9IkUbcI k7eVDWZYzmnTiE60SEgo77RswgU4LBhEqjqg35TkMw0fJRi0BESDlTw0uw6NMg== Received: from [10.9.4.95] (unknown [209.182.120.176]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) (Authenticated sender: kevans/mail) by smtp.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4fmkfr2ypCz1Drt; Thu, 02 Apr 2026 14:25:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kevans@FreeBSD.org) Message-ID: <8cc5b585-9b8e-43fe-82a9-4a5848e4b8c5@FreeBSD.org> Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2026 09:25:55 -0500 List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: Panic: "knote ... was already on knlist..." after main-n284826-d9d7b5948649 To: David Wolfskill , Konstantin Belousov , current@freebsd.org References: Content-Language: en-US From: Kyle Evans In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 4/2/26 08:20, David Wolfskill wrote: > On Thu, Apr 02, 2026 at 04:01:42PM +0300, Konstantin Belousov wrote: >> ... >> Peter Holm already reported this or similar issue. Try this please. > > Ah. > >> commit 5da1dcf8b88ffa3591a84405a8ab29ebd846f2e0 >> Author: Konstantin Belousov >> Date: Thu Apr 2 14:02:14 2026 +0300 >> >> kqueue_fork_copy_knote(): zero kn_knlist for the copy before calling knlist_add() >> ... > > Change made; works -- thanks! > I know it's not much consolation *after* I've blown up your machines, but I wrote a regression test that covers this scenario: https://reviews.freebsd.org/D56223 Thanks, Kyle Evan From nobody Thu Apr 2 14:31:01 2026 X-Original-To: current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmkmr2MTdz6Y5yn for ; Thu, 02 Apr 2026 14:31:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from david@catwhisker.org) Received: from mx.catwhisker.org (mx.catwhisker.org [107.204.234.170]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmkmq69Gkz3tXW; Thu, 02 Apr 2026 14:31:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from david@catwhisker.org) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: from albert.catwhisker.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by albert.catwhisker.org (8.18.1/8.18.1) with ESMTP id 632EV123070799; Thu, 2 Apr 2026 14:31:01 GMT (envelope-from david@albert.catwhisker.org) Received: (from david@localhost) by albert.catwhisker.org (8.18.1/8.18.1/Submit) id 632EV1Fl070798; Thu, 2 Apr 2026 07:31:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from david) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2026 07:31:01 -0700 From: David Wolfskill To: Kyle Evans Cc: Konstantin Belousov , current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Panic: "knote ... was already on knlist..." after main-n284826-d9d7b5948649 Message-ID: Mail-Followup-To: David Wolfskill , Kyle Evans , Konstantin Belousov , current@freebsd.org References: <8cc5b585-9b8e-43fe-82a9-4a5848e4b8c5@FreeBSD.org> List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="aGVPLLOi1dRiGJx1" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <8cc5b585-9b8e-43fe-82a9-4a5848e4b8c5@FreeBSD.org> X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7018, ipnet:107.192.0.0/12, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fmkmq69Gkz3tXW X-Spamd-Bar: ---- --aGVPLLOi1dRiGJx1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, Apr 02, 2026 at 09:25:55AM -0500, Kyle Evans wrote: > ... > I know it's not much consolation *after* I've blown up your machines, but= I wrote a regression > test that covers this scenario: >=20 > https://reviews.freebsd.org/D56223 > .... Excellent! And no worries -- I tend to have a few layers of backup. :-} (There are "reasons" the kernel config for most of the laptops is called "CANARY". :-}) Peace, david --=20 David H. Wolfskill david@catwhisker.org See https://www.catwhisker.org/~david/publickey.gpg for my public key. --aGVPLLOi1dRiGJx1 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iNUEARYKAH0WIQRCec5RsK7Enudh3yGB9MJ9AwUELQUCac59pV8UgAAAAAAuAChp c3N1ZXItZnByQG5vdGF0aW9ucy5vcGVucGdwLmZpZnRoaG9yc2VtYW4ubmV0NDI3 OUNFNTFCMEFFQzQ5RUU3NjFERjIxODFGNEMyN0QwMzA1MDQyRAAKCRCB9MJ9AwUE LemRAQDL06QbhTHZQsx01Rl7TZxU4n3Nm2B0OZ3ZhcmWDQNFtgD8DssuuNxJfZrM wz+W+3SrLWXa4pk8qzDqU/z4aF/6Ug4= =fb17 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --aGVPLLOi1dRiGJx1-- From nobody Thu Apr 2 17:55:11 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmqJX2F2qz6YS22 for ; Thu, 02 Apr 2026 17:55:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pouria@FreeBSD.org) Received: from smtp.freebsd.org (smtp.freebsd.org [96.47.72.83]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.freebsd.org", Issuer "R13" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmqJX1bZHz3MnX; 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Thu, 2 Apr 2026 18:36:24 +0000 (UTC) Received: from nv.t4-02.sbone.de (nv.t4-02.sbone.de [IPv6:fde9:577b:c1a9:4902:0:7404:2:22]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by mail.sbone.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 54E3C2D029D8; Thu, 2 Apr 2026 18:36:24 +0000 (UTC) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2026 18:36:24 +0000 (UTC) From: "Bjoern A. Zeeb" To: Pouria Mousavizadeh Tehrani cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, net@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Proposal: remove IPv6-only RA draft bits to adopt DHCP option (RFC 8925) In-Reply-To: <3a6e219f-905b-456f-8135-00e67c3652fb@FreeBSD.org> Message-ID: References: <3a6e219f-905b-456f-8135-00e67c3652fb@FreeBSD.org> X-OpenPGP-Key-Id: 0x14003F198FEFA3E77207EE8D2B58B8F83CCF1842 List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="0-431469178-1775154984=:11296" This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. --0-431469178-1775154984=:11296 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT On Thu, 2 Apr 2026, Pouria Mousavizadeh Tehrani wrote: Hi, Cc: net also > There is an implementation of the DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG draft in the > OS. It is the excellent work of Bjoern (@bz), both the Internet-Draft and its > implementation. > > I'm requesting removal of the draft-specific bits (which is not compiled by > default), but first a short history from an outsider's reading of the IETF > archives. > > The draft's history is unfortunate. @bz had a great idea about making a > network automatically become IPv6-only by advertising it as a RA flag. > However, the idea had a small flaw: RAs can be trivially forged and could be > used to maliciously disable v4 networks, so RA was not a safe transport for > such a flag. > IMHO, the same attack surface could exist for DHCP, but DHCP deployments are > commonly protected by DHCP snooping in practice. > That led to the conclusion that a DHCP option would be a safer place for this > signal. > The draft was eventually abandoned (mailing-list archive: > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ipv6/7nwZ6BUqbSqEC11eTqVqCOZwGI8/). > > Shortly after, someone else (google) submitted the same idea as a DHCP > option, which became RFC 8925. > Although the original idea came from Bjoern, neither his name nor his draft > is acknowledged in that RFC. > I have not discussed this with Bjoern (cc'ed), only observed the sequence of > events. > I appreciated his work, it appears to be his last draft. Most of the above isn't actually historically right but so be it. Just to clarify one fact: it wasn't my idea in first place; I joined the others who had done the first version of the draft and I did the actual implementation to see if it would work and how well. That said, it did and does. People keep forgetting that FreeBSD is (was) (probably still?) the only non-router OS shipping with a working SeND implementation (kernel + net-mgmt/send, which I think got removed unfortunately), which can secure your RAs. Certificates are hard, the world is still not there... > We should move forward and align with RFC 8925. > I use the DHCP option at my company and at home, mobiles and most devices > support it well. > I'd like to make this work on my FreeBSD boxes as well. Please do. The one drawback DHCPv4 has, on a pure IPv6-only machine you cannot run DHCPv4 properly anymore to even handle those "dual-stack clients" not wanting IPv4 anymore but the world will need another decade to get there... The good news is, that should be purely a user space feature. You may have seen the IPv6-only semi-only-April1st Linux one yesterday with the follow-up of thinking it should really happen: https://lore.kernel.org/lkml/2cb91533e22ed6cb11205dbc56b8aeedbbce0cca.camel@infradead.org/ As I pointed out, it's been 15 years since FreeBSD had done so: https://lore.kernel.org/lkml/20260401163500.AE4862D029D8@mail.sbone.de/ So by all means, the more IPv6 stuff works and turns off IPv4 on FreeBSD the better. I do have more WIP changes pending in places a particular project we should be in mind. But let's take that offlist. Related to your request: I have a window open here with the SVN sequence of commits which happened as I wanted to remove this and the EXPERIMENTAL option some time before 16 anyway. I wanted to do so before 15 but it didn't happen anymore. Do you want me to do it myself or do you want to do it and just put me on review? If the latter please try to catch it all in one go, including user space as you have outlined below. > In short, I'm asking for willingness to remove or replace the > EXPERIMENTAL/DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG bits and adopt the > DHCP-option-based approach (RFC 8925). > The current code locations referencing the draft are: > Kernel: > sys/netinet6/nd6_rtr.c: lines 107–115, 251–355, 602–604, 782–784 > sys/netinet6/nd6.h: lines 77–82 > sys/netinet/icmp6.h: #define ND_RA_FLAG_IPV6_ONLY 0x02 > sys/net/if_ethersubr.c: lines ~478–497, 544–560 > > Userland: > grep -r DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./usr.sbin/rtadvd/rtadvd.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./usr.sbin/rtadvd/Makefile:CFLAGS+= -DDRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./usr.sbin/rtadvd/config.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./usr.sbin/rtadvd/config.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./usr.sbin/rtadvd/config.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./usr.sbin/rtadvd/rtadvd.h:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./usr.sbin/ndp/Makefile:CFLAGS+= -DDRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./usr.sbin/ndp/ndp.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./sbin/ifconfig/af_nd6.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./sbin/ifconfig/Makefile:CFLAGS+= -DDRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > > The existing implementation is reusable, but I want to ensure Bjoern and > others are comfortable with reworking/removing the draft-specific code and > moving to RFC 8925. > Please reply if you have concerns, objections, or if you're ok with this > removal of this option. /bz -- Bjoern A. Zeeb r15:7 --0-431469178-1775154984=:11296-- From nobody Thu Apr 2 18:58:37 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fmrjn0z51z6YXq1; Thu, 02 Apr 2026 18:58:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pouria@FreeBSD.org) Received: from smtp.freebsd.org (smtp.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::24b:4]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.freebsd.org", Issuer "R13" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fmrjn06sSz3Zn8; Thu, 02 Apr 2026 18:58:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pouria@FreeBSD.org) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1775156333; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=ix7luyOZlj++2ok0vqY73xXrqhGfxt1IvJ+Lt1yURM4=; b=N7+qpJ2i6e24Y9e91PdmhrY8IjPIzdrTkwDqOawwuqUAo/VpepNdfS7R1vHWyrPXib253A XhCqzgiPvga6lozq9C87A2sWu0avjQa+Jk7YGsNuzsWeg/NEaeI9lsT5HWUZ/ee++d+Rz3 WoJ4GKVsYfX+W29E2+jgrji8m+yh7kbr87hMjElZJSWdxpgyYsQ5P9UIoeC37CdBKyvrnI aoofCCeM3mhUqlEnZf8yLzY9oRVcdcNCBdphkHMe268i/XJzwMvGhbKHl1sQk/lTKAIPes QAVo7xvaMkmI+tTRHWgCy4rTP372W+cuv8VXT3tf5aT1WprEnzPLfqZMzCQPAQ== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1775156333; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=l83a2/NWkBWlUBRF3T5ruKt9TEhaH1cIsW97X+ISSCNXifZbvJPT/Zx2BwlF8JoXGTgfJP s/jbmyLLXkVpBC/etByH94GBwCn0dcx5sg9ecPz28XFb21BOnad3tNN3ZoDWmq4TpcWiTk aHJ1cjhmBf5JXGJZHGeDN562Qtz0qxsmbuawEIFYcadSpd3UaG8Qs4pZha2JRojfLVL+lt q6+PJg55mT34geMJmUi0sPPKOaDPYXPUJede6XDe8pZDxBknVUcyU5H6WZ/x/yWNSy6PYG trhJ7utRTaj0ael5lBK3ClCAO5GHyyJ3SYsg/G9oO/rdLTFvvtmzE2BqINZdtA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1775156333; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=ix7luyOZlj++2ok0vqY73xXrqhGfxt1IvJ+Lt1yURM4=; b=iOEh9/1GY8WqdEbilAcpJLbzrgJQ324cOE4ec8AsXcybneZ7P6fXHFpPAb2KkHpmvTe9Hj +rhB8Zmk3bsKkkcmB7apymEB+q22l/FubTeCyXLRTYqthYDDd2QwzlzlD+HF+jnN+ICvba AbMC03TchxpZ4gBc6TvbOrmTbT093GqfL+l7Ds/jAnljT8KXYBAEi0RVTPUaVZn2A4oK0X 2QPSyhAJe7x2nsVz6OW2p9BjnJ//LTPUKxBwufHvNeBfEZq4cLsHbp3L/gbd0BBUX/Hndm 9Jth83tSuFt3iZUkVsue4AeabKTFYfKQdnTj9tBR8fakEFl2H8OmgrsHKTklDg== Received: from nl.mail.spmzt.net (mail.spmzt.net [193.148.248.214]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) (Authenticated sender: pouria) by smtp.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4fmrjm3YJhz1KYC; Thu, 02 Apr 2026 18:58:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pouria@FreeBSD.org) Received: by nl.mail.spmzt.net (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id f025e079 (TLSv1.3:TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256:NO); Thu, 2 Apr 2026 23:28:42 +0430 (+0430) Message-ID: <9107b29c-f3e2-4c07-bc21-f7f8a9731b19@FreeBSD.org> Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2026 22:28:37 +0330 List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: Proposal: remove IPv6-only RA draft bits to adopt DHCP option (RFC 8925) To: "Bjoern A. Zeeb" Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, net@freebsd.org References: <3a6e219f-905b-456f-8135-00e67c3652fb@FreeBSD.org> Content-Language: en-US, fa-IR From: Pouria Mousavizadeh Tehrani In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------KwXBNlB33V6JepJmgUs04Up2" This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --------------KwXBNlB33V6JepJmgUs04Up2 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------w9jHD7PU781O1cTw3US5aofq"; protected-headers="v1" Message-ID: <9107b29c-f3e2-4c07-bc21-f7f8a9731b19@FreeBSD.org> Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2026 22:28:37 +0330 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: Proposal: remove IPv6-only RA draft bits to adopt DHCP option (RFC 8925) To: "Bjoern A. 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boundary="------------Y0COhTkrAsb5tqGKu6VLTh3k" Message-ID: Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2026 21:57:31 +0200 List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: Proposal: remove IPv6-only RA draft bits to adopt DHCP option (RFC 8925) To: Pouria Mousavizadeh Tehrani , freebsd-current@freebsd.org Cc: bz@freebsd.org References: <3a6e219f-905b-456f-8135-00e67c3652fb@FreeBSD.org> Content-Language: en-US From: Marek Zarychta Autocrypt: addr=zarychtam@plan-b.pwste.edu.pl; keydata= xsBNBFfi3cMBCADLecMTFXad4uDXqv3eRuB4qJJ8G9tzzFezeRnnwxOsPdytW5ES2z1ibSrR IsiImx6+PTqrAmXpTInxAi7yiZGdSiONRI4CCxKY9d1YFiNYT/2WyNXCekm9x29YeIU7x0JB Llbz0f/9HC+styBIu2H+PY/X98Clzm110CS+n/b9l1AtiGxTiVFj7/uavYAKxH6LNWnbkuc5 v8EVNc7NkEcl5h7Z9X5NEtzDxTOiBIFQ/kOT7LAtkYUPo1lqLeOM2DtWSXTXQgXl0zJI4iP1 OAu4qQYm2nXwq4b2AH9peknelvnt1mpfgDCGSKnhc26q6ibTfMwydp+tvUtQIQYpA6b9ABEB AAHNN01hcmVrIFphcnljaHRhIChQbGFuLWIpIDx6YXJ5Y2h0YW1AcGxhbi1iLnB3c3RlLmVk dS5wbD7CwHcEEwEIACEFAlfi4LkCGwMFCwkIBwIGFQgJCgsCBBYCAwECHgECF4AACgkQHZW8 vIFppoJXdgf8D9X3VRFSNaR9lthSx/+uqas17J3FJKBo1xMQsC2a+44vzNvYJSuPGLLJ+LW2 HPVazjP/BWZJbxOYpliY4zxNRU0YCp0BLIVLibc//yax+mE42FND/+NiIZhqJscl6MLPrSwo sIwXec4XYkldkyqW/xBbBYXoIkBqdKB9j5j42Npy1IV/RizOSdmvTWY27ir8e/yGMR1RLr4F 8P5K3OWTdlGy2H2F/3J8bIPBLG6FpaIyLQw4dHSx8V02PYqDxK1cNo2kAOnU8PnZL/AGuMOH iv3MN1VYL8ehcmpBBsrZGebQJxrjY2/5IaTSgp9xHYT70kshuU6Qb97vk1mOjNZxgc7ATQRX 4t3DAQgA10h6RCXuBLMHxq5B8X/ZIlj9sgLoeyfRdDZEc9rT2KUeUJVHDsbvOFf4/7F1ovWY hJbA6GK/LUZeHHTjnbZcH1uDYQeHly4UOLxeEvhGoz4JhS2C7JzN/uRnwbdOAUbJr8rUj/IY a7gk906rktsc/Ldrxrxh7O6WO0JCh2XO/p4pDfEwwB37g4xHprSab28ECYJ9JMbtA8Sy4M55 g3+GQ28FvSlGnx48OoGXU2BZdc1vZKSQmNOlikB+9/hDX8zdYWVfDaX1TLQ8Ib4+xTUmapza mV/bxIsaZRBw+jFjLQHhTbIMfPEU+4mxFDvTdbKPruKPqVf1ydgMnPZWngowdwARAQABwsBf BBgBCAAJBQJX4t3DAhsMAAoJEB2VvLyBaaaC6qkIAJs9sDPqrqW0bYoRfzY6XjDWQ59p9tJi v8aogxacQNCfAu+WkJ8PNVUtC1dlVcG5NnZ80gXzd1rc8ueIvXlvdanUt/jZd8jbb3gaDbK3 wh1yMCGBl/1fOJTyEGYv1CRojv97KK89KP5+r8x1P1iHcSrunlDNqGxTMydNCwBH23QcOM+m u4spKnJ/s0VRBkw3xoKBZfZza6fTQ4gTpAipjyk7ldOGBV+PvkKATdhK2yLwuWXhKbg/GRlD 1r5P0gxzSqfV4My+KJuc2EDcrqp1y0wOpE1m9iZqCcd0fup5f7HDsYlLWshr7NQl28f6+fQb sylq/j672BHXsdeqf/Ip9V4= In-Reply-To: <3a6e219f-905b-456f-8135-00e67c3652fb@FreeBSD.org> X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:206006, ipnet:2001:678:618::/48, country:PL] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fmt1f51Zqz3hxq X-Spamd-Bar: ---- This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------Y0COhTkrAsb5tqGKu6VLTh3k Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On 2.04.2026 at 19:55, Pouria Mousavizadeh Tehrani wrote: > Hi everyone, > > There is an implementation of the DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG draft > in the OS. It is the excellent work of Bjoern (@bz), both the > Internet-Draft and its implementation. > > I'm requesting removal of the draft-specific bits (which is not > compiled by default), but first a short history from an outsider's > reading of the IETF archives. > > The draft's history is unfortunate. @bz had a great idea about making > a network automatically become IPv6-only by advertising it as a RA flag. > However, the idea had a small flaw: RAs can be trivially forged and > could be used to maliciously disable v4 networks, so RA was not a safe > transport for such a flag. > IMHO, the same attack surface could exist for DHCP, but DHCP > deployments are commonly protected by DHCP snooping in practice. > That led to the conclusion that a DHCP option would be a safer place > for this signal. > The draft was eventually abandoned (mailing-list archive: > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ipv6/7nwZ6BUqbSqEC11eTqVqCOZwGI8/). > > Shortly after, someone else (google) submitted the same idea as a DHCP > option, which became RFC 8925. > Although the original idea came from Bjoern, neither his name nor his > draft is acknowledged in that RFC. > I have not discussed this with Bjoern (cc'ed), only observed the > sequence of events. > I appreciated his work, it appears to be his last draft. > > We should move forward and align with RFC 8925. > I use the DHCP option at my company and at home, mobiles and most > devices support it well. > I'd like to make this work on my FreeBSD boxes as well. > > In short, I'm asking for willingness to remove or replace the > EXPERIMENTAL/DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG bits and adopt the > DHCP-option-based approach (RFC 8925). > The current code locations referencing the draft are: > Kernel: > sys/netinet6/nd6_rtr.c: lines 107–115, 251–355, 602–604, 782–784 > sys/netinet6/nd6.h: lines 77–82 > sys/netinet/icmp6.h: #define ND_RA_FLAG_IPV6_ONLY 0x02 > sys/net/if_ethersubr.c: lines ~478–497, 544–560 > > Userland: > grep -r DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./usr.sbin/rtadvd/rtadvd.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./usr.sbin/rtadvd/Makefile:CFLAGS+= -DDRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./usr.sbin/rtadvd/config.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./usr.sbin/rtadvd/config.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./usr.sbin/rtadvd/config.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./usr.sbin/rtadvd/rtadvd.h:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./usr.sbin/ndp/Makefile:CFLAGS+= -DDRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./usr.sbin/ndp/ndp.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./sbin/ifconfig/af_nd6.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > ./sbin/ifconfig/Makefile:CFLAGS+= -DDRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG > > The existing implementation is reusable, but I want to ensure Bjoern > and others are comfortable with reworking/removing the draft-specific > code and moving to RFC 8925. > Please reply if you have concerns, objections, or if you're ok with > this removal of this option. > Hi Pouria, all, adopting the |option v6-only-preferred| would be an excellent step toward modernizing the FreeBSD network stack. I have to admit that for several years now we have been successfully advertising this option across a couple of dual-stack Wi-Fi SSIDs, including for a dual-stack eduroam network. This is not a typical dual-stack deployment. Instead, we provide DNS64 servers via RADNSS and use NAT64 for this network. As a result, some clients - primarily Android phones - gain network connectivity very quickly by transitioning entirely to IPv6. This eliminates a number of issues and reduces the potential attack surface associated with IPv4. I strongly support this kind of modernization of the FreeBSD network stack and am looking forward to the opportunity to test this functionality. Cheers -- Marek Zarychta --------------Y0COhTkrAsb5tqGKu6VLTh3k Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
On 2.04.2026 at 19:55, Pouria Mousavizadeh Tehrani wrote:
Hi everyone,

There is an implementation of the DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG draft in the OS. It is the excellent work of Bjoern (@bz), both the Internet-Draft and its implementation.

I'm requesting removal of the draft-specific bits (which is not compiled by default), but first a short history from an outsider's reading of the IETF archives.

The draft's history is unfortunate. @bz had a great idea about making a network automatically become IPv6-only by advertising it as a RA flag.
However, the idea had a small flaw: RAs can be trivially forged and could be used to maliciously disable v4 networks, so RA was not a safe transport for such a flag.
IMHO, the same attack surface could exist for DHCP, but DHCP deployments are commonly protected by DHCP snooping in practice.
That led to the conclusion that a DHCP option would be a safer place for this signal.
The draft was eventually abandoned (mailing-list archive: https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ipv6/7nwZ6BUqbSqEC11eTqVqCOZwGI8/).

Shortly after, someone else (google) submitted the same idea as a DHCP option, which became RFC 8925.
Although the original idea came from Bjoern, neither his name nor his draft is acknowledged in that RFC.
I have not discussed this with Bjoern (cc'ed), only observed the sequence of events.
I appreciated his work, it appears to be his last draft.

We should move forward and align with RFC 8925.
I use the DHCP option at my company and at home, mobiles and most devices support it well.
I'd like to make this work on my FreeBSD boxes as well.

In short, I'm asking for willingness to remove or replace the EXPERIMENTAL/DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG bits and adopt the DHCP-option-based approach (RFC 8925).
The current code locations referencing the draft are:
Kernel:
sys/netinet6/nd6_rtr.c: lines 107–115, 251–355, 602–604, 782–784
sys/netinet6/nd6.h: lines 77–82
sys/netinet/icmp6.h: #define ND_RA_FLAG_IPV6_ONLY 0x02
sys/net/if_ethersubr.c: lines ~478–497, 544–560

Userland:
grep -r DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG
./usr.sbin/rtadvd/rtadvd.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG
./usr.sbin/rtadvd/Makefile:CFLAGS+=     -DDRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG
./usr.sbin/rtadvd/config.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG
./usr.sbin/rtadvd/config.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG
./usr.sbin/rtadvd/config.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG
./usr.sbin/rtadvd/rtadvd.h:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG
./usr.sbin/ndp/Makefile:CFLAGS+=        -DDRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG
./usr.sbin/ndp/ndp.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG
./sbin/ifconfig/af_nd6.c:#ifdef DRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG
./sbin/ifconfig/Makefile:CFLAGS+= -DDRAFT_IETF_6MAN_IPV6ONLY_FLAG

The existing implementation is reusable, but I want to ensure Bjoern and others are comfortable with reworking/removing the draft-specific code and moving to RFC 8925.
Please reply if you have concerns, objections, or if you're ok with this removal of this option.

Hi Pouria, all,
adopting the option v6-only-preferred would be an excellent step toward modernizing the FreeBSD network stack. I have to admit that for several years now we have been successfully advertising this option across a couple of dual-stack Wi-Fi SSIDs, including for a dual-stack eduroam network.

This is not a typical dual-stack deployment. Instead, we provide DNS64 servers via RADNSS and use NAT64 for this network. As a result, some clients - primarily Android phones - gain network connectivity very quickly by transitioning entirely to IPv6. This eliminates a number of issues and reduces the potential attack surface associated with IPv4.

I strongly support this kind of modernization of the FreeBSD network stack and am looking forward to the opportunity to test this functionality.

Cheers

-- 
Marek Zarychta
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Fri, 03 Apr 2026 18:05:25 -0700 (PDT) List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Rick Macklem Date: Fri, 3 Apr 2026 18:05:13 -0700 X-Gm-Features: AQROBzAUWKcFE2ebjAzS_I_4ffDpBTIEOxK3tcFYe891tuVznw3QraW8LZKq9Ak Message-ID: Subject: Getting boottime early in booting To: FreeBSD CURRENT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.14 / 15.00]; ARC_ALLOW(-1.00)[google.com:s=arc-20240605:i=1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.997]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20251104]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.14)[-0.138]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; MISSING_XM_UA(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROMTLD(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; RCVD_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2a00:1450:4864:20::535:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fncpM2db6z3mR7 X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Hi, I'm fiddling with a NFSv4 diskless root fs setup and I've run into a couple of challenges. 1 - I need a value that will be different each time the machine boots. I would normally use getboottime(), but for the NFS root fs mount, it just returns 0. Any ideas w.r.t. something I can acquire early in booting that will change each time the system is booted? 2 - Does anyone know how to fix "could not determine audit condition" which I get whenever I try and login when it is multiuser? (I can run single user, but since I can't login once it's multiuser??) Thanks for any help with these, rick From nobody Sat Apr 4 01:13:02 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fnczK6Mlcz6Wjks for ; Sat, 04 Apr 2026 01:13:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-pl1-x634.google.com (mail-pl1-x634.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::634]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "WR4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fnczJ6bjdz3nhb for ; Sat, 04 Apr 2026 01:13:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=bsdimp-com.20251104.gappssmtp.com header.s=20251104 header.b=Ngah2sBp; dmarc=none; arc=pass ("google.com:s=arc-20240605:i=1"); 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Fri, 03 Apr 2026 18:13:13 -0700 (PDT) List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Warner Losh Date: Fri, 3 Apr 2026 19:13:02 -0600 X-Gm-Features: AQROBzC2EOpd6VrdoccR0Fpq-FRxHFdTACKpl-dADMR73sy1nQ3Y2HGlCQzwdyg Message-ID: Subject: Re: Getting boottime early in booting To: Rick Macklem Cc: FreeBSD CURRENT Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000041297e064e982383" X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; ARC_ALLOW(-1.00)[google.com:s=arc-20240605:i=1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-1.000]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[bsdimp-com.20251104.gappssmtp.com:s=20251104]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[bsdimp.com]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[no SPF record]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; RCVD_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; MISSING_XM_UA(0.00)[]; TAGGED_RCPT(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2607:f8b0:4864:20::634:from]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[bsdimp-com.20251104.gappssmtp.com:+] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fnczJ6bjdz3nhb X-Spamd-Bar: --- --00000000000041297e064e982383 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Apr 3, 2026, 7:05=E2=80=AFPM Rick Macklem = wrote: > Hi, > > I'm fiddling with a NFSv4 diskless root fs setup and I've run > into a couple of challenges. > > 1 - I need a value that will be different each time the machine boots. > I would normally use getboottime(), but for the NFS root fs mount, > it just returns 0. > Any ideas w.r.t. something I can acquire early in booting that will > change each time the system is booted? > We don't have this today. And we can't have it without hardware assist... though you may be ok enough with a value from the rtc. There's work to pass the vale from the monotonicly increasing counter uefi provides. But not on all platforms. Warner 2 - Does anyone know how to fix "could not determine audit condition" > which I get whenever I try and login when it is multiuser? > (I can run single user, but since I can't login once it's multiuser?= ?) > > Thanks for any help with these, rick > > --00000000000041297e064e982383 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


On Fri, Apr 3, 2026, 7:05=E2=80= =AFPM Rick Macklem <rick.mackl= em@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,

I'm fiddling with a NFSv4 diskless root fs setup and I've run
into a couple of challenges.

1 - I need a value that will be different each time the machine boots.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0I would normally use getboottime(), but for the NFS roo= t fs mount,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0it just returns 0.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Any ideas w.r.t. something I can acquire early in booti= ng that will
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0change each time the system is booted?
=

We don't have= this today. And we can't have it without hardware assist... though you= may be ok enough with a value from the rtc.

There's work to pass the vale from the monotonicly= increasing counter uefi provides. But not on all platforms.

Warner

2 - Does anyone know how to fix "could not determine audit condition&q= uot;
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0which I get whenever I try and login when it is multius= er?
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0(I can run single user, but since I can't login onc= e it's multiuser??)

Thanks for any help with these, rick

--00000000000041297e064e982383-- From nobody Sat Apr 4 03:13:40 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fngfZ71DHz6Ww7G for ; Sat, 04 Apr 2026 03:13:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kib@freebsd.org) Received: from kib.kiev.ua (kib.kiev.ua [IPv6:2001:470:d5e7:1::1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fngfZ1h06z3xjd for ; Sat, 04 Apr 2026 03:13:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kib@freebsd.org) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: from tom.home (kib@localhost [127.0.0.1] (may be forged)) by kib.kiev.ua (8.18.1/8.18.1) with ESMTP id 6343Deua082717; Sat, 4 Apr 2026 06:13:43 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from kib@freebsd.org) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.10.3 kib.kiev.ua 6343Deua082717 Received: (from kostik@localhost) by tom.home (8.18.1/8.18.1/Submit) id 6343De1h082716; Sat, 4 Apr 2026 06:13:40 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from kib@freebsd.org) X-Authentication-Warning: tom.home: kostik set sender to kib@freebsd.org using -f Date: Sat, 4 Apr 2026 06:13:40 +0300 From: Konstantin Belousov To: Warner Losh Cc: Rick Macklem , FreeBSD CURRENT Subject: Re: Getting boottime early in booting Message-ID: References: List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.9 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=4.0.2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 4.0.2 (2025-08-27) on tom.home X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; TAGGED_RCPT(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:6939, ipnet:2001:470::/32, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fngfZ1h06z3xjd X-Spamd-Bar: ---- On Fri, Apr 03, 2026 at 07:13:02PM -0600, Warner Losh wrote: > On Fri, Apr 3, 2026, 7:05 PM Rick Macklem wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > I'm fiddling with a NFSv4 diskless root fs setup and I've run > > into a couple of challenges. > > > > 1 - I need a value that will be different each time the machine boots. > > I would normally use getboottime(), but for the NFS root fs mount, > > it just returns 0. > > Any ideas w.r.t. something I can acquire early in booting that will > > change each time the system is booted? > > > > We don't have this today. And we can't have it without hardware assist... > though you may be ok enough with a value from the rtc. > > There's work to pass the vale from the monotonicly increasing counter uefi > provides. But not on all platforms. We already have mechanisms to ensure that early entropy is provided on boot. Do you care if the value used is indeed boot time, or should it only be unique per boot? With the entropy loading, I believe you would get what you need on any machine with the persistent storage. > > Warner > > 2 - Does anyone know how to fix "could not determine audit condition" > > which I get whenever I try and login when it is multiuser? > > (I can run single user, but since I can't login once it's multiuser??) > > > > Thanks for any help with these, rick > > > > From nobody Sat Apr 4 06:22:16 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fnlr73Z9nz6Y0xF for ; Sat, 04 Apr 2026 06:22:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rick.macklem@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ed1-x529.google.com (mail-ed1-x529.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::529]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "WR4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fnlr70tPJz4G3S for ; 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Fri, 03 Apr 2026 23:22:28 -0700 (PDT) List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Rick Macklem Date: Fri, 3 Apr 2026 23:22:16 -0700 X-Gm-Features: AQROBzCod05gOjjOjS6gNpMzWtReiZo4j9oMInQ77BwxCvnqtFMFuztz8MAb2Sg Message-ID: Subject: Re: Getting boottime early in booting To: Konstantin Belousov Cc: Warner Losh , FreeBSD CURRENT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fnlr70tPJz4G3S X-Spamd-Bar: ---- On Fri, Apr 3, 2026 at 8:15=E2=80=AFPM Konstantin Belousov wrote: > > On Fri, Apr 03, 2026 at 07:13:02PM -0600, Warner Losh wrote: > > On Fri, Apr 3, 2026, 7:05=E2=80=AFPM Rick Macklem wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > I'm fiddling with a NFSv4 diskless root fs setup and I've run > > > into a couple of challenges. > > > > > > 1 - I need a value that will be different each time the machine boots= . > > > I would normally use getboottime(), but for the NFS root fs moun= t, > > > it just returns 0. > > > Any ideas w.r.t. something I can acquire early in booting that w= ill > > > change each time the system is booted? > > > > > > > We don't have this today. And we can't have it without hardware assist.= .. > > though you may be ok enough with a value from the rtc. > > > > There's work to pass the vale from the monotonicly increasing counter u= efi > > provides. But not on all platforms. > > We already have mechanisms to ensure that early entropy is provided on > boot. Do you care if the value used is indeed boot time, or should it > only be unique per boot? Unique per boot should be sufficient. > > With the entropy loading, I believe you would get what you need on any > machine with the persistent storage. > > > > > Warner > > > > 2 - Does anyone know how to fix "could not determine audit condition" > > > which I get whenever I try and login when it is multiuser? > > > (I can run single user, but since I can't login once it's multiu= ser??) > > > > > > Thanks for any help with these, rick > > > > > > > From nobody Sat Apr 4 07:37:52 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fnnWM1dthz6Y7BJ for ; Sat, 04 Apr 2026 07:38:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rick.macklem@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ed1-x534.google.com (mail-ed1-x534.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::534]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "WR4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fnnWL4QJ5z4PBC for ; 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Sat, 04 Apr 2026 00:38:03 -0700 (PDT) List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Rick Macklem Date: Sat, 4 Apr 2026 00:37:52 -0700 X-Gm-Features: AQROBzAMjbiYS_y1UHnH-qsCoFulttRPetM3qGMN5z4VwOZ4Lt6Tkhyn_JKX420 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Getting boottime early in booting To: Konstantin Belousov Cc: Warner Losh , FreeBSD CURRENT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fnnWL4QJ5z4PBC X-Spamd-Bar: ---- On Fri, Apr 3, 2026 at 8:15=E2=80=AFPM Konstantin Belousov wrote: > > On Fri, Apr 03, 2026 at 07:13:02PM -0600, Warner Losh wrote: > > On Fri, Apr 3, 2026, 7:05=E2=80=AFPM Rick Macklem wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > I'm fiddling with a NFSv4 diskless root fs setup and I've run > > > into a couple of challenges. > > > > > > 1 - I need a value that will be different each time the machine boots= . > > > I would normally use getboottime(), but for the NFS root fs moun= t, > > > it just returns 0. > > > Any ideas w.r.t. something I can acquire early in booting that w= ill > > > change each time the system is booted? > > > > > > > We don't have this today. And we can't have it without hardware assist.= .. > > though you may be ok enough with a value from the rtc. > > > > There's work to pass the vale from the monotonicly increasing counter u= efi > > provides. But not on all platforms. > > We already have mechanisms to ensure that early entropy is provided on > boot. Do you care if the value used is indeed boot time, or should it > only be unique per boot? > > With the entropy loading, I believe you would get what you need on any > machine with the persistent storage. Hmm, do you mean the stuff under /var/db/entropy? If so, that doesn't work for this case, since for an NFS root fs, /etc is usually a memory fs. (See https://docs-archive.freebsd.org/doc/8.4-RELEASE/usr/share/doc/freebsd= /handbook/network-pxe-nfs.html) Without a unique per boot value, things work, it's just that it loops once more during the mount attempt, each time it is rebooted. (Without boring you with the details, each time a seq# gets incremented by 1 and it needs to loop until it gets to the next seq#. I can tweak the mount code so that it doesn't spew out printf()s when it loops.) Thanks, rick > > > > > Warner > > > > 2 - Does anyone know how to fix "could not determine audit condition" > > > which I get whenever I try and login when it is multiuser? > > > (I can run single user, but since I can't login once it's multiu= ser??) > > > > > > Thanks for any help with these, rick > > > > > > > From nobody Sat Apr 4 08:17:44 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fnpPP4BY9z6YCLM for ; Sat, 04 Apr 2026 08:18:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kib@freebsd.org) Received: from kib.kiev.ua (kib.kiev.ua [IPv6:2001:470:d5e7:1::1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fnpPN0w8Zz3FHX for ; Sat, 04 Apr 2026 08:18:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kib@freebsd.org) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="No valid SPF, No valid DKIM" header.from=freebsd.org (policy=none); spf=softfail (mx1.freebsd.org: 2001:470:d5e7:1::1 is neither permitted nor denied by domain of kib@freebsd.org) smtp.mailfrom=kib@freebsd.org Received: from tom.home (kib@localhost [127.0.0.1] (may be forged)) by kib.kiev.ua (8.18.1/8.18.1) with ESMTP id 6348HisP095682; Sat, 4 Apr 2026 11:17:47 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from kib@freebsd.org) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.10.3 kib.kiev.ua 6348HisP095682 Received: (from kostik@localhost) by tom.home (8.18.1/8.18.1/Submit) id 6348Hij0095681; Sat, 4 Apr 2026 11:17:44 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from kib@freebsd.org) X-Authentication-Warning: tom.home: kostik set sender to kib@freebsd.org using -f Date: Sat, 4 Apr 2026 11:17:44 +0300 From: Konstantin Belousov To: Rick Macklem Cc: Warner Losh , FreeBSD CURRENT Subject: Re: Getting boottime early in booting Message-ID: References: List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.9 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=4.0.2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 4.0.2 (2025-08-27) on tom.home X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.96 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.99)[-0.993]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.97)[-0.969]; DMARC_POLICY_SOFTFAIL(0.10)[freebsd.org : No valid SPF, No valid DKIM,none]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TAGGED_RCPT(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; HAS_XAW(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:6939, ipnet:2001:470::/32, country:US]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEFALL_USER(0.00)[kib]; MISSING_XM_UA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; R_SPF_SOFTFAIL(0.00)[~all]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fnpPN0w8Zz3FHX X-Spamd-Bar: -- On Sat, Apr 04, 2026 at 12:37:52AM -0700, Rick Macklem wrote: > On Fri, Apr 3, 2026 at 8:15 PM Konstantin Belousov wrote: > > > > On Fri, Apr 03, 2026 at 07:13:02PM -0600, Warner Losh wrote: > > > On Fri, Apr 3, 2026, 7:05 PM Rick Macklem wrote: > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > I'm fiddling with a NFSv4 diskless root fs setup and I've run > > > > into a couple of challenges. > > > > > > > > 1 - I need a value that will be different each time the machine boots. > > > > I would normally use getboottime(), but for the NFS root fs mount, > > > > it just returns 0. > > > > Any ideas w.r.t. something I can acquire early in booting that will > > > > change each time the system is booted? > > > > > > > > > > We don't have this today. And we can't have it without hardware assist... > > > though you may be ok enough with a value from the rtc. > > > > > > There's work to pass the vale from the monotonicly increasing counter uefi > > > provides. But not on all platforms. > > > > We already have mechanisms to ensure that early entropy is provided on > > boot. Do you care if the value used is indeed boot time, or should it > > only be unique per boot? > > > > With the entropy loading, I believe you would get what you need on any > > machine with the persistent storage. > Hmm, do you mean the stuff under /var/db/entropy? It is /boot/entropy I think. Also I see 'entropy_efi_seed' which implies that loader might get some entropy from the UEFI facilities. But this is a speculation based on the documentation. > If so, that doesn't work for this case, since for an NFS root fs, /etc is > usually a memory fs. > (See https://docs-archive.freebsd.org/doc/8.4-RELEASE/usr/share/doc/freebsd/handbook/network-pxe-nfs.html) > > Without a unique per boot value, things work, it's just that it > loops once more during the mount attempt, each time it is > rebooted. (Without boring you with the details, each time > a seq# gets incremented by 1 and it needs to loop until > it gets to the next seq#. I can tweak the mount code so > that it doesn't spew out printf()s when it loops.) If UEFI source works, then the machine should get enough entropy even for shared rootfs. > > Thanks, rick > > > > > > > > > > Warner > > > > > > 2 - Does anyone know how to fix "could not determine audit condition" > > > > which I get whenever I try and login when it is multiuser? > > > > (I can run single user, but since I can't login once it's multiuser??) > > > > > > > > Thanks for any help with these, rick > > > > > > > > > > > From nobody Sat Apr 4 08:52:23 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fnq964xJzz6YG4K for ; Sat, 04 Apr 2026 08:52:26 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from des@freebsd.org) Received: from smtp.freebsd.org (smtp.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::24b:4]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.freebsd.org", Issuer "R13" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fnq960VpXz3JQn; Sat, 04 Apr 2026 08:52:26 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from des@freebsd.org) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1775292746; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=yvIXE9/i/7FHf4PGzElEt6oFVuComQe4dP7sUE6QBNs=; b=rWBHoTbBpvzDY4gvo+4q19O7Y7fT7d5v+T6YXyVZsXP5vufeWgTQu0AcowwQUU1W6jcpEr fNeI7jT+pTszi9hh3xFaAe7AueKfvTYFw3UTQLvefi29ayFiTkwYfSJ/u9HEXjmsgi9Fvt e3QfkN1GmR/5HDPFmGrGjwMAtWZqgD4DiI2a75GpXDNd0PZOmQ3GLmvL7XByPPJuPOy0pN L4hoSXLMJweOTjpD+ILaNZ7thImiZzuskYB6AWamr/hMZahoOy/B5MEChedgmXvZs0c1BW mOuhShXjQHDsETehrs39XAHC3R9D3N8If7a986CqOnMwbbI/CDAr7x40MTqETg== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1775292746; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=KY1VC6lJcH8kqjP+kxJUEeJr3SK/0g3rzwr+QsZiL90bJWxLP+SPo0CYKfwYYtbZltfkcy RV72vxHHAk+O6twI/YB7o928fhxNyM2NjGhqhp5BbsA+O+zFWLypkv5jwka5BbmwMsWdv7 0pdq6ZHQwZ5LUliwvccVVOUGyqHBJ7xv+ud1VhuYyz3Hyi0VQnWYvATa4RYNm9vOhgMIYE KW7JtMj3hNITMl46/OHbKECkxHARSX7KJV0w3WtfnCgaIJ7jb5Gqd/KeCHyHsOaqOY8rEU Gi7t+zq5TycppQNmtfREuCYmZktQIN5EE2/RVO6PKHPt1piDj/sLJq0Nd3vT9Q== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1775292746; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=yvIXE9/i/7FHf4PGzElEt6oFVuComQe4dP7sUE6QBNs=; b=oYuCswRPPpO/Befr/+d+F1j9oqdCaxkUTuqxrlthpv3GJ6ykKoNxwS+F7/3UmjQRK6bDYO ZQGkVgVkoCOcDF57z+SsY9KM+o59O21dMJ+/OBwYYV7UXecVvKMPajfDH4IEfuY4TjVRdL hUbxHcd2JgM8DWp9hwChWRgzplkTLHR/UyCQExenFVKGpIVHvd/ywEmwOq9mVjeourtWAO Nn4fHZJUD3+A1Z/grDtaU6PvCozE0adibKYCh0ADNNLzrOTak/87/LOczgX47V9SBuBDSX z9NPy+d4fc9Ig1QgSQkY+GrAE1BqGNJSZIznd6VV/DbssQcK0Pvns4Z8cpO5PQ== Received: from ltc.des.dev (lfbn-nan-1-698-103.w86-236.abo.wanadoo.fr [86.236.35.103]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) (Authenticated sender: des) by smtp.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4fnq9561l9zws1; Sat, 04 Apr 2026 08:52:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from des@freebsd.org) Received: by ltc.des.dev (Postfix, from userid 1001) id F1C515C3B9; Sat, 04 Apr 2026 10:52:23 +0200 (CEST) From: =?utf-8?Q?Dag-Erling_Sm=C3=B8rgrav?= To: Rick Macklem Cc: FreeBSD CURRENT Subject: Re: Getting boottime early in booting In-Reply-To: (Rick Macklem's message of "Fri, 3 Apr 2026 18:05:13 -0700") References: User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Date: Sat, 04 Apr 2026 10:52:23 +0200 Message-ID: <86mrzjumyg.fsf@ltc.des.dev> List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Rick Macklem writes: > 1 - I need a value that will be different each time the machine boots. > I would normally use getboottime(), but for the NFS root fs mount, > it just returns 0. > Any ideas w.r.t. something I can acquire early in booting that will > change each time the system is booted? Just use arc4random(9). DES --=20 Dag-Erling Sm=C3=B8rgrav - des@FreeBSD.org From nobody Sat Apr 4 14:50:00 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fnz5k4j8Gz6Yr95 for ; Sat, 04 Apr 2026 14:50:02 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd@www.zefox.net) Received: from www.zefox.net (www.zefox.net [50.1.20.27]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "pelorus.zefox.org", Issuer "pelorus.zefox.org" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fnz5j1Q70z416s for ; Sat, 04 Apr 2026 14:50:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd@www.zefox.net) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of fbsd@www.zefox.net has no SPF policy when checking 50.1.20.27) smtp.mailfrom=fbsd@www.zefox.net Received: from www.zefox.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by www.zefox.net (8.18.1/8.18.1) with ESMTPS id 634Eo0kB013096 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Sat, 4 Apr 2026 07:50:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fbsd@www.zefox.net) Received: (from fbsd@localhost) by www.zefox.net (8.18.1/8.18.1/Submit) id 634Eo0B3013093; Sat, 4 Apr 2026 07:50:00 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fbsd) Date: Sat, 4 Apr 2026 07:50:00 -0700 From: bob prohaska To: Mark Millard Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Etcupdate runtime has more than doubled....Why? Message-ID: References: <626584dc-ea9c-4a63-902c-4de4e10bba00@yahoo.com> <3580ce8f-3500-4386-a35a-f1b49dbc7d44@yahoo.com> List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <3580ce8f-3500-4386-a35a-f1b49dbc7d44@yahoo.com> X-Spamd-Result: default: False [1.87 / 15.00]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.996]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.98)[-0.979]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.95)[0.946]; MID_RHS_WWW(0.50)[]; WWW_DOT_DOMAIN(0.50)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7065, ipnet:50.1.16.0/20, country:US]; MISSING_XM_UA(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[yahoo.com]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[zefox.net]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[no SPF record] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fnz5j1Q70z416s X-Spamd-Bar: + On Wed, Apr 01, 2026 at 12:20:11PM -0700, Mark Millard wrote: > On 4/1/26 12:10, Mark Millard wrote: > > On 4/1/26 11:34, bob prohaska wrote: > >> On Wed, Apr 01, 2026 at 11:00:56AM -0700, Mark Millard wrote: > >>>> > >>> > >>> etcupdate has the option: > >>> > >>> > >>> -B Do not build generated files in a private object tree. > >>> Instead, reuse the generated files from a previously built > >>> object tree that matches the source tree. This can be > >>> useful to avoid gratuitous conflicts in sendmail(8) > >>> configuration files when bootstrapping. It can also be > >>> useful for building a tarball that matches a specific > >>> world build. > >>> I misunderstood the gist of the description, thinking -B was intended only for special cases of multiple source and object trees. In fact -B seems to solve my problem entirely, etcupdate finishes in minutes now, not hours. Thanks to all who responded! bob prohaska > >>> > >>> So, if one already has the required context, its use might be relevant. > >>> Of course, without the proper context, it should not be used. > >>> > >>> What was the context-status and use vs. not for -B ? > >> > >> There's only one /usr/obj on the system. > >> > >> The buildworld command used was > >> make -j3 KERNCONF=GENERIC TARGET=arm TARGET_ARCH=armv7 buildworld > >> and the etcupdate command following buildworld was > >> etcupdate -p > >> > >> After installing world and kernel, etcupdate runs again as > >> etcupdate > >> > >> Might using etcupdate -B in the second invocation be a remedy? > > > > Extracted/simplified from my more overall scripts full of local details: > > > > # make WITH_META_MODE=yes buildworld > > # make WITH_META_MODE=yes buildkernel > > # etcupdate -p > > # etcupdate resolve -p > > # make WITH_META_MODE=yes installkernel > > Note for live updating the booted file system: > > # # Possibly: vi /boot/loader.conf > # shutdown -r now > . . . > > (I have contexts that do not involve that.) > > > > # make WITH_META_MODE=yes installworld > > # etcupdate -B > > # etcupdate resolve > > # make delete-old check-old > > # #AS NEEDED for timing?: make delete-old-libs > > # etcupdate status > > Note for live updates the booted file system or just wanting to: > > # # Possibly: vi /boot/loader.conf > # shutdown -r now > . . . > > (I have contexts that do not involve that. For those I may deal with > booting at some later time for some other reason.) > > > > >> > >> Thanks for writing! > >> > >> bob prohaska > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > -- > === > Mark Millard > marklmi at yahoo.com From nobody Sat Apr 4 15:34:48 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fp05l2BH9z6YwMr for ; Sat, 04 Apr 2026 15:35:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rick.macklem@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ed1-x52e.google.com (mail-ed1-x52e.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::52e]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "WR4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fp05k54PYz45xg for ; Sat, 04 Apr 2026 15:35:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rick.macklem@gmail.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; 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Sat, 04 Apr 2026 08:34:59 -0700 (PDT) List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <86mrzjumyg.fsf@ltc.des.dev> In-Reply-To: <86mrzjumyg.fsf@ltc.des.dev> From: Rick Macklem Date: Sat, 4 Apr 2026 08:34:48 -0700 X-Gm-Features: AQROBzDhqyDDudwjUkZT-0HeBhmzBsh5224tC392dyP5pHsrN5dKJq-1CcmMSww Message-ID: Subject: Re: Getting boottime early in booting To: =?UTF-8?Q?Dag=2DErling_Sm=C3=B8rgrav?= Cc: FreeBSD CURRENT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fp05k54PYz45xg X-Spamd-Bar: ---- On Sat, Apr 4, 2026 at 1:52=E2=80=AFAM Dag-Erling Sm=C3=B8rgrav wrote: > > Rick Macklem writes: > > 1 - I need a value that will be different each time the machine boots. > > I would normally use getboottime(), but for the NFS root fs mount, > > it just returns 0. > > Any ideas w.r.t. something I can acquire early in booting that wil= l > > change each time the system is booted? > > Just use arc4random(9). Yes, that does seem to work now. (It didn't seem to be working when I tried before posting? For the very old i386 system I am testing on, arc4random() works for me, if I wait until I really need the value, which is when the RPC is being done to the NFS server. Before testing, I was trying arc4random() much earlier in the boot.) For a UEFI laptop, it looks like arc4random() works quite early in the boot. (It has the entropy_efi_seed=3DYES in it's boot variables.) Anyhow, thanks everyone, for the useful hints, rick > > DES > -- > Dag-Erling Sm=C3=B8rgrav - des@FreeBSD.org From nobody Sun Apr 5 00:53:24 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fpDVJ4k7Kz6Y2gM for ; Sun, 05 Apr 2026 00:53:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rick.macklem@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ed1-x532.google.com (mail-ed1-x532.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::532]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "WR4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fpDVH3dNPz46l9 for ; Sun, 05 Apr 2026 00:53:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rick.macklem@gmail.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20251104 header.b="VX30Fd/8"; 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Sat, 04 Apr 2026 17:53:36 -0700 (PDT) List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Rick Macklem Date: Sat, 4 Apr 2026 17:53:24 -0700 X-Gm-Features: AQROBzAOaisF0RUni45NJJljWH6-CwrdLQmwjZrxG41DKY1g7yJPZ5oooXYiD7M Message-ID: Subject: Re: Getting boottime early in booting To: FreeBSD CURRENT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.99 / 15.00]; ARC_ALLOW(-1.00)[google.com:s=arc-20240605:i=1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.99)[-0.993]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20251104]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36:c]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; MISSING_XM_UA(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROMTLD(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; RCVD_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2a00:1450:4864:20::532:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fpDVH3dNPz46l9 X-Spamd-Bar: ---- On Fri, Apr 3, 2026 at 6:05=E2=80=AFPM Rick Macklem wrote: > > Hi, > > I'm fiddling with a NFSv4 diskless root fs setup and I've run > into a couple of challenges. > > 1 - I need a value that will be different each time the machine boots. > I would normally use getboottime(), but for the NFS root fs mount, > it just returns 0. > Any ideas w.r.t. something I can acquire early in booting that will > change each time the system is booted? > > 2 - Does anyone know how to fix "could not determine audit condition" > which I get whenever I try and login when it is multiuser? > (I can run single user, but since I can't login once it's multiuser?= ?) Btw, in case anyone is interested, #2 was caused by the conf/base/var.cpio.= gz file (used to create the md fs for /var) was too big for a 5Mbyte md. (Getting rid of some stuff in it fixed the problem.) I now have a NFSv4.2 root fs working ok, thanks to some help here w.r.t. getting a new value upon each boot. https://docs-archive.freebsd.org/doc/8.4-RELEASE/usr/share/doc/freebsd/hand= book/network-pxe-nfs.html is pretty good, but does miss a couple of things. There's making sure the files for the md file systems aren't too big (or configuring the md's to be larger) and there's /tmp, which isn't mentioned. --> There is also dealing with setting up hostuuid when there are multiple clients using the read-only root fs. I'm not quite sure what is appropriate here? - Maybe making /etc/hostid a symlink to a file in /var and then having /etc/rc.d/hostid create the file when it doesn't exist, or something like that. (For systems that don't have smbios.system.uui= d this would result in a different setting each boot, but the only alternative I can think of would be a site local DHCPD option to specify it. (This isn't a NFSv4 problem, but a shared read-only root fs problem= .) Anyhow, if someone on the doc side feels like improving the above a little, that would be nice, rick > > Thanks for any help with these, rick From nobody Sun Apr 5 02:31:21 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fpGgM1W5Fz6Xy3f for ; Sun, 05 Apr 2026 02:31:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rick.macklem@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ed1-x535.google.com (mail-ed1-x535.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::535]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "WR4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fpGgK2SZmz3Jjf for ; Sun, 05 Apr 2026 02:31:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rick.macklem@gmail.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20251104 header.b=LQblcHoJ; 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Sat, 04 Apr 2026 19:31:33 -0700 (PDT) List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Rick Macklem Date: Sat, 4 Apr 2026 19:31:21 -0700 X-Gm-Features: AQROBzBDzryjpCAXJL4RGiNjrwC4XTp9r7CCDCHgi5MnFtz3yO2qN33OWvgHDE8 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Getting boottime early in booting To: FreeBSD CURRENT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.00 / 15.00]; ARC_ALLOW(-1.00)[google.com:s=arc-20240605:i=1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-0.999]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20251104]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; MISSING_XM_UA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROMTLD(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; RCVD_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2a00:1450:4864:20::535:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fpGgK2SZmz3Jjf X-Spamd-Bar: ---- On Sat, Apr 4, 2026 at 5:53=E2=80=AFPM Rick Macklem wrote: > > On Fri, Apr 3, 2026 at 6:05=E2=80=AFPM Rick Macklem wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > I'm fiddling with a NFSv4 diskless root fs setup and I've run > > into a couple of challenges. > > > > 1 - I need a value that will be different each time the machine boots. > > I would normally use getboottime(), but for the NFS root fs mount, > > it just returns 0. > > Any ideas w.r.t. something I can acquire early in booting that wil= l > > change each time the system is booted? > > > > 2 - Does anyone know how to fix "could not determine audit condition" > > which I get whenever I try and login when it is multiuser? > > (I can run single user, but since I can't login once it's multiuse= r??) > Btw, in case anyone is interested, #2 was caused by the conf/base/var.cpi= o.gz > file (used to create the md fs for /var) was too big for a 5Mbyte md. > (Getting rid of some stuff in it fixed the problem.) > > I now have a NFSv4.2 root fs working ok, thanks to some help here > w.r.t. getting a new value upon each boot. > > https://docs-archive.freebsd.org/doc/8.4-RELEASE/usr/share/doc/freebsd/ha= ndbook/network-pxe-nfs.html > is pretty good, but does miss a couple of things. There's making sure the > files for the md file systems aren't too big (or configuring the md's > to be larger) > and there's /tmp, which isn't mentioned. > --> There is also dealing with setting up hostuuid when there are multipl= e > clients using the read-only root fs. > I'm not quite sure what is appropriate here? > - Maybe making /etc/hostid a symlink to a file in /var and then > having /etc/rc.d/hostid create the file when it doesn't exist, or > something like that. (For systems that don't have smbios.system.u= uid > this would result in a different setting each boot, but the > only alternative > I can think of would be a site local DHCPD option to specify it. > (This isn't a NFSv4 problem, but a shared read-only root fs probl= em.) Actually, unless the file is needed, just deleting /etc/hostid from the read-only root fs works (the kernel sysctls get set). Oh, and the current version of the Handbook section (I just noticed that the google ai found an old version) does mention the 5Mbyte limit for /etc and /var. I did find that the recommended setings for the dhcpd.conf aren't that great. I think it is better to specify fixed addresses based on the MACs. A good example is in this wiki. https://wiki.freebsd.org/MateuszPiotrowski/BootFreebsdFromNfs rick > > Anyhow, if someone on the doc side feels like improving the above a littl= e, > that would be nice, rick > > > > > Thanks for any help with these, rick From nobody Sun Apr 5 13:20:32 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fpY4m4gRRz6Z8Fn for ; Sun, 05 Apr 2026 13:21:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@walstatt-de.de) Received: from smtp6.goneo.de (smtp6.goneo.de [85.220.129.31]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fpY4k5WGyz3R0v for ; Sun, 05 Apr 2026 13:21:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@walstatt-de.de) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=walstatt-de.de header.s=DKIM001 header.b="VrboXf/r"; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of freebsd@walstatt-de.de designates 85.220.129.31 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=freebsd@walstatt-de.de Received: from hub2.goneo.de (hub2.goneo.de [IPv6:2001:1640:5::8:53]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp6.goneo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4B4FB240E90 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 2026 15:21:08 +0200 (CEST) Received: from hub2.goneo.de (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by hub2.goneo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id ABD1C24023F for ; Sun, 5 Apr 2026 15:21:06 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=walstatt-de.de; s=DKIM001; t=1775395266; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type; bh=DmfYnK0jKWbm4dzBSQ+BgYQhYeXuRgpywBjrb4MvOkw=; b=VrboXf/ruy6QyNw8N+8ZfD7/EnxotNBd/iZssLlnGgNs7HbfRPGABFfivNhhza1j3IOaU/ aw4k1nQiirM5KC7RZ8QV98M5vhNLZrINCitZKjZN2/bFLyNJzoRFwy1Lz5RgvW8TUgmg72 qoMMwm3YjtfCzkVVkKhAzB0Va7y4lckKdFvsyp040f9bIzA5W3BQHsRssamS0OEKpfYi26 HBF3FjWidA7AiX88wauhDO4JMaTCZLjeKn9Vzhr8b2FptsKnWKJu+UDqpi5jkZOqmG0EIp f2XnCNcEW4wZS4MPxIga+CU7HFblRFghpAYlJ34PUdlSWCHAj2LvswVx9B1dmg== Received: from thor.sb211.local (dynamic-2a02-3100-2f00-3502-7249-e94a-5bad-c3b8.310.pool.telefonica.de [IPv6:2a02:3100:2f00:3502:7249:e94a:5bad:c3b8]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (prime256v1) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by hub2.goneo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 850942400EE for ; Sun, 5 Apr 2026 15:21:06 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sun, 5 Apr 2026 15:20:32 +0200 From: A FreeBSD User To: FreeBSD CURRENT Subject: make RELEASE (here: kernel): template.ucl: line: 33, column: 0 - 'key must begin with a letter', character: '.' 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RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[walstatt-de.de:+] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fpY4k5WGyz3R0v X-Spamd-Bar: ----- --Sig_/Daa.whgn=O.9Fj02cnfJ0p_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Building the OS for jails via the RELEASE infrastructure, this doesn't work anymore since a couple of days for now with 15-STABLE as = well as with recent CURRENT; [...] --- create-packages-kernel --- /pool/sources/CURRENT/src/release/packages/generate-ucl.lua: fail to parse(/pool/sources/CURRENT/src/release/packages/template.ucl): error while= parsing /pool/sources/CURRENT/src/release/packages/template.ucl: line: 33, column: = 0 - 'key must begin with a letter', character: '.' *** [create-kernel-packages-extra-flavor-def= ault-GENERIC] Error code 1 --=20 A FreeBSD user --Sig_/Daa.whgn=O.9Fj02cnfJ0p_ Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iHUEARYKAB0WIQRQheDybVktG5eW/1Kxzvs8OqokrwUCadJhuwAKCRCxzvs8Oqok ry25AQD2M5RtyvXMO43CDIyCucGMR/39fgZc9TLQ9gLHhrQ7RgD+NnWTglU47vfj WwSndXRwoZ/OOWOen8A8gZfNTsoAuAw= =+mxo -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_/Daa.whgn=O.9Fj02cnfJ0p_-- From nobody Sun Apr 5 15:26:19 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fpbsm55PQz6WQSy for ; 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Sun, 5 Apr 2026 17:26:47 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sun, 5 Apr 2026 17:26:19 +0200 From: A FreeBSD User To: FreeBSD CURRENT Subject: Re: make RELEASE (here: kernel): template.ucl: line: 33, column: 0 - 'key must begin with a letter', character: '.' Message-ID: <20260405172406.0505c1d0@thor.sb211.local> In-Reply-To: <20260405152059.6fa98991@thor.sb211.local> References: <20260405152059.6fa98991@thor.sb211.local> X-Mailer: Claws Mail 4.4.0 (GTK 3.24.52; amd64-portbld-freebsd16.0) List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Sig_/hDnNxy0BXRkFTJsisuIpCK8"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512 X-Rspamd-UID: 9477a4 X-Rspamd-UID: 3e6714 X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.70 / 15.00]; SIGNED_PGP(-2.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-0.997]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:85.220.129.0/25]; MIME_GOOD(-0.20)[multipart/signed,text/plain]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[walstatt-de.de:s=DKIM001]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[85.220.129.60:from]; ASN(0.00)[asn:25394, ipnet:85.220.128.0/17, country:DE]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[walstatt-de.de]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[walstatt-de.de:+] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fpbsl2r7lz3fWK X-Spamd-Bar: ----- --Sig_/hDnNxy0BXRkFTJsisuIpCK8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Am Tage des Herren Sun, 5 Apr 2026 15:20:32 +0200 A FreeBSD User schrieb: > Building the OS for jails via the RELEASE infrastructure, > this doesn't work anymore since a couple of days for now with 15-STABLE a= s well as with > recent CURRENT; >=20 >=20 > [...] >=20 > --- create-packages-kernel --- > /pool/sources/CURRENT/src/release/packages/generate-ucl.lua: fail to > parse(/pool/sources/CURRENT/src/release/packages/template.ucl): error whi= le parsing > /pool/sources/CURRENT/src/release/packages/template.ucl: line: 33, column= : 0 - 'key must > begin with a letter', character: '.' *** > [create-kernel-packages-extra-flavor-default-GENERIC] Error code 1 >=20 Sorry, forgot the following: Build within a jail (poudriere jail, host is=20 FreeBSD 16.0-CURRENT #16 main-n284846-2d843b7c9758: Fri Apr 3 18:46:25 CES= T 2026 amd64, so is the jail's base).=20 Sources for CURRENT and 15-STABLE are git pulled. Nothing fancy. --=20 A FreeBSD user --Sig_/hDnNxy0BXRkFTJsisuIpCK8 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iHUEARYKAB0WIQRQheDybVktG5eW/1Kxzvs8OqokrwUCadJ/NgAKCRCxzvs8Oqok r5ciAQDJc11JtQCPv88fPXxE3TpIs8EzSUZCPfP99jUOuFfJdgEAp3WnOL2KH0VB lIwywjW4sksas/kzVORjBl5UreMblwM= =JAVG -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_/hDnNxy0BXRkFTJsisuIpCK8-- From nobody Sun Apr 5 18:40:25 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fph9M4LYLz6Wrxy for ; Sun, 05 Apr 2026 18:40:39 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from julian@freebsd.org) Received: from vps1.elischer.org (vps1.elischer.org [204.109.63.16]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "vps1.elischer.org", Issuer "R12" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fph9L2lrqz3mlZ for ; Sun, 05 Apr 2026 18:40:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from julian@freebsd.org) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="No valid SPF, No valid DKIM" header.from=freebsd.org (policy=none); spf=softfail (mx1.freebsd.org: 204.109.63.16 is neither permitted nor denied by domain of julian@freebsd.org) smtp.mailfrom=julian@freebsd.org Received: from [10.0.0.12] (c-67-189-70-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net [67.189.70.178]) (authenticated bits=0) by vps1.elischer.org (8.17.2/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 635IeUHM076710 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Sun, 5 Apr 2026 11:40:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from julian@freebsd.org) X-Authentication-Warning: vps1.elischer.org: Host c-67-189-70-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net [67.189.70.178] claimed to be [10.0.0.12] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------awzGuh0oQxp6WdPfJfBIM9KJ" Message-ID: Date: Sun, 5 Apr 2026 11:40:25 -0700 List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: Getting boottime early in booting To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org References: Content-Language: en-US From: julian@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.34 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.98)[-0.980]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.56)[-0.557]; ONCE_RECEIVED(0.20)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; DMARC_POLICY_SOFTFAIL(0.10)[freebsd.org : No valid SPF, No valid DKIM,none]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36236, ipnet:204.109.60.0/22, country:US]; FREEFALL_USER(0.00)[julian]; FROM_NO_DN(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; TO_DOM_EQ_FROM_DOM(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; R_SPF_SOFTFAIL(0.00)[~all]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; HAS_XAW(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4fph9L2lrqz3mlZ X-Spamd-Bar: -- This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------awzGuh0oQxp6WdPfJfBIM9KJ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit > On Sat, Apr 04, 2026 at 12:37:52AM -0700, Rick Macklem wrote: For this the RTC chip was invented and connected to a battery. I'm also guessing that you don't need "universally unique in time" but  "different from the last boot". I once used the information available in a system as to whether this was a warn or cold boot (not all systems have that but we did) along with low bits from the microseconds from the counter timer..  as soon as reality strikes that tends to become pseudorandom pretty quickly. you'll need a different one for each architecture to I like the suggestion to use the entropy collection where you can piggyback on other people's work. julian --------------awzGuh0oQxp6WdPfJfBIM9KJ Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit 



On Sat, Apr 04, 2026 at 12:37:52AM -0700, Rick Macklem wrote:

For this the RTC chip was invented and connected to a battery.

I'm also guessing that you don't need "universally unique in time" but  "different from the last boot".
I once used the information available in a system as to whether this was a warn or cold boot (not all systems have that but we did) along with low bits from the microseconds from the counter timer..  as soon as reality strikes that tends to become pseudorandom pretty quickly. you'll need a different one for each architecture to I like the suggestion to use the entropy collection where you can piggyback on other people's work.

julian

--------------awzGuh0oQxp6WdPfJfBIM9KJ-- From nobody Sun Apr 5 22:48:08 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4fpng10ShGz6Y4KC for ; Sun, 05 Apr 2026 22:48:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ivy@freebsd.org) Received: from smtp.freebsd.org (smtp.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::24b:4]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.freebsd.org", Issuer "R13" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4fpng06w9Dz3JBR; Sun, 05 Apr 2026 22:48:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ivy@freebsd.org) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1775429293; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=Atv+Q384I76jFjSrOHIeqAhl4x4L7YvFE4fn81xOteE=; b=CXC0lYPzZf9rUxvQxqhz6jlh5W7VnmenuTFq8fA6GYLR2ieW6BEzpPbjG7tr7fJ8VXMaGD wn+EdWn1CHotwFxS0s7GollkgAGfBsIBS7y6v0OPc1YhXfCmwFC+LSsAf0t09FHxkeCqDi GatD2sQlYah+Jb4hVdjf3/1zJqcEwLE2iXrVzfx80M7H5QmcmAGn0YRzeDBi4UdpW/8Rlk Q+8o+gnQ3FPTimsPMPE0AaCyjv51cZKfc0EQZhxWham13PYBryyoJX2/kpZZg0KBU6rUCU VIazHA3/GN87aLW9Q4ghd6vgxpTfqn5hYoUdpLSAth7RQ0vALu5sM/VamCcGmQ== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1775429293; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=SudCHeCyinOZUicPa2Zlx9XYPGTRX/jfddjqhUZ1APK5LpD8oiy3oJWun/3Ww+Sj3mIQNT fFYRq93jRFOVDo51WboTZu1bIzr2jfCSYedMq7pMl2IuLlNiTCgtVxdIqLDVJZ0ZtTAGYx cbNafQSKGYGg7HmKZqBlzN/XjIFbdrSVFji6IDp/q3VWhrFSH4tKKta2MDwPUzh0XS/ZWb 8gnnb82G9D/J3Ayc/GheIZJ21d9NkmlYz/kmS2twPwEQZ0eZcU+6EAjurHYe1ikgAbb8Bh 9zJw2gDj0aJhUMpk6kkJsAs6W2JgNStROUKtX2EDzKAGj6CMx5DB4fsQKlYcaw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1775429293; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=Atv+Q384I76jFjSrOHIeqAhl4x4L7YvFE4fn81xOteE=; b=MoWDFkZJWEmGaX00ws9QoTE5+sNczZjY8U5KI7sWdw+0XAwoU0yFZxWMb1th4+9OxBz+XE Fo+ZxtfS5FogN4lK9O8+y09LdY2OKOvcOKckDJ9sMIt0Q4k/CfkNaT2AExhsaGiApuK6az m7gLXkDBFtj85FYSLcWFLVWiKcmE1672ajmXQihJW1+Sy7IJTtjqKsH02NjlOehSVyKSGi oiP/hyEsAYJ1wqlXwPXT5QfUQgLTFAHQCfMhy1UY9sOYI7TfxQ4Ho0MqlWaooZOsplVF18 BSzqjhwXtZUXN1KCPVo+bbEQekD3GAhkhK9cCbU6XNPqxOLzYUNla6Q8PAHLNg== Received: from amaryllis.le-fay.org (amaryllis.le-fay.org [IPv6:2a00:1098:6b:400::9]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) (Authenticated sender: ivy/mail) by smtp.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4fpng03Sg8zp0H; Sun, 05 Apr 2026 22:48:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ivy@freebsd.org) Date: Sun, 5 Apr 2026 23:48:08 +0100 From: Lexi Winter To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Cc: bofh@freebsd.org Subject: Re: make RELEASE (here: kernel): template.ucl: line: 33, column: 0 - 'key must begin with a letter', character: '.' Message-ID: Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, bofh@freebsd.org References: <20260405152059.6fa98991@thor.sb211.local> List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="xSZEnYR4i3corqr7" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20260405152059.6fa98991@thor.sb211.local> --xSZEnYR4i3corqr7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline A FreeBSD User wrote in <20260405152059.6fa98991@thor.sb211.local>: > --- create-packages-kernel --- > /pool/sources/CURRENT/src/release/packages/generate-ucl.lua: fail to > parse(/pool/sources/CURRENT/src/release/packages/template.ucl): error while parsing > /pool/sources/CURRENT/src/release/packages/template.ucl: line: 33, column: 0 - 'key must begin > with a letter', character: '.' *** [create-kernel-packages-extra-flavor-default-GENERIC] Error > code 1 this was broken by the libucl update (abda442d92fd) which disables macros in the Lua UCL parser by default. please try this patch: diff --git a/release/packages/generate-set-ucl.lua b/release/packages/generate-set-ucl.lua index 9ba7026b75df..7a1cddda7be1 100755 --- a/release/packages/generate-set-ucl.lua +++ b/release/packages/generate-set-ucl.lua @@ -16,7 +16,7 @@ substituted as UCL variables. local ucl = require("ucl") -- This parser is the output UCL we want to build. -local parser = ucl.parser() +local parser = ucl.parser(0) if #arg < 1 then io.stderr:write(arg[0] .. ": missing template filename\n") diff --git a/release/packages/generate-ucl.lua b/release/packages/generate-ucl.lua index 19a9a95d5d38..aaaa4375dd4d 100755 --- a/release/packages/generate-ucl.lua +++ b/release/packages/generate-ucl.lua @@ -124,7 +124,7 @@ local pkgprefix = nil local pkgversion = nil -- This parser is the output UCL we want to build. -local parser = ucl.parser() +local parser = ucl.parser(0) -- Set any $VARIABLES from the command line in the parser. This causes ucl to -- automatically replace them when we load the source ucl. --xSZEnYR4i3corqr7 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iHUEABYKAB0WIQSyjTg96lp3RifySyn1nT63mIK/YAUCadLmpAAKCRD1nT63mIK/ YCGbAQDMJVxqo7grqzLYF9GRq3GQMCMYi2+AWR8fkMGeeQ/N7AD/ZRh98UWbF++d Z330PTaU2W5pVRTFvCM1xFMeTtvgWQI= =xktA -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --xSZEnYR4i3corqr7--